# Why do wives freak out if they catch their H's masturbating and try to shame their H's about it?



## Ragnar Ragnasson

If the couple has a good M, H is ready for sex anytime, couple sex is great and frequent, yet if W causes a drought...if W catches H masturbaing after she turns him down again...

What does the W expect to gain by saying I caught you! That's bad, your selfish, for shame...on and on!

She has her sexual agency. So does H. Simple.

What does a W expect to gain when she catches and tries to shame the H for masturbating?


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## Tabbygirl23

Sexual repression is still alive and well.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson

Tabbygirl23 said:


> Sexual repression is still alive and well.


That's what I'm saying. Yet there should no two people more comfortable talking sex, especially about after many years of M to boot.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> If the couple has a good M, H is ready for sex anytime, couple sex is great and frequent, yet if W causes a drought...if W catches H masturbaing after she turns him down again...
> 
> What does the W expect to gain by saying I caught you! That's bad, your selfish, for shame...on and on!
> 
> She has her sexual agency. So does H. Simple.
> 
> What does a W expect to gain when she catches and tries to shame the H for masturbating?


It would really be great to hear from W *what are they trying to accomplish* with this.

As in cut the crap, what's the real deal??


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## Diana7

Is that with or without porn?


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## Tabbygirl23

Because marriage is still this ball and chain dynamic when it’s suppose to set you free from all the fake stuff. It’s suppose to be the realest thing you have. If my husband tells me a deep dark thought that shocks me, my first reaction is to be happy he trusted me with that. Whether we doing it that night idk, I gotta research. Lol. 
but seriously, if you can’t be yourself and happy with your own thoughts around your partner then that’s really crappy.


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## Mr.Married

She freaks out because one of her control mechanisms is being bypassed and your masturbation is an outright display of a perceived failed part of marriage which raises her guard and self reflection. The only option becomes to shame you for it. 

Your statement puts all women in the same bucket. I’m going to assume you meant to say “SOME women “


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## Ragnar Ragnasson

Diana7 said:


> Is that with or without porn?


Good question. Can you answer from both perspectives? Thanks, that's a help.


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## snowbum

First off what’s a drought?


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## Ragnar Ragnasson

Mr.Married said:


> She freaks out because one of her control mechanisms is being bypassed.


Seems that's common. So let her freak. Don't get hostile in your response but don't act like it's anything unexpected, agree she has her sexual agency and you have yours, stressing you want sex with her and she has the right to say no and equally you have the right to say to say yes, I'll take care of my own desire for sex.


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## *Deidre*

Maybe if it’s affecting their sex life but if the sex life is good, I have no idea.


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## Tabbygirl23

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> If the couple has a good M, H is ready for sex anytime, couple sex is great and frequent, yet if W causes a drought...if W catches H masturbaing after she turns him down again...
> 
> What does the W expect to gain by saying I caught you! That's bad, your selfish, for shame...on and on!
> 
> She has her sexual agency. So does H. Simple.
> 
> What does a W expect to gain when she catches and tries to shame the H for masturbating?


Honestly I can’t even help but laugh thinking about being caught masterbating and my husband trying to shame me. I feel badly people go through that but I really think I would throw the covers back and finish right there in front of their eyes. Ugly O face and scrunched up toes and all. Zero shame in masterbation. It is healthy for you. Feels good. Goodness


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## She'sStillGotIt

LOL...some women are so damned pathetic.

Whether they caused 'the draught' or not, I'm always amazed at how women think they can *control *what a man looks at, what or who he fantasizes about, what stimuli he uses for his 'alone' time material if he's even "allowed" to use anything or look at porn, and whether he's "allowed" to masturbate.

I honestly can't believe any woman thinks this is a good or healthy idea to force on a man. And worse, how can any woman actually _BELIEVE_ that nonsense when her man claims he's done exactly as she's demanded and thought ONLY of her? Yeah, I'm *sure* these guys are *only* fantasizing about their demanding wives/girlfriends and not the blonde in accounting or the hot brunette in that science fiction movie, and they never go out to PornHub when they have an extra 15 or 20 minutes alone. 🤣🤣🤣 

The whole thing is preposterous.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson

*Deidre* said:


> Maybe if it’s affecting their sex life but if the sex life is good, I have no idea.


The premise is it's not affecting their sexual couple frequency and he's ready for sex with her anytime.

Yet W most commonly still try to shame H.

You've got some sort of answer in mind. I know you do. Can you share, even hypothetically? Say responding for a friend?


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## bobert

Not an issue in my marriage but from what I've heard from others: 

She's a control freak, the "I don't want you but I don't want anyone else to have you either, even your hand", she thinks he should only feel pleasure while having sex with her, she's jealous of a hand, she doesn't like porn, if he doesn't use porn she doesn't trust that he's thinking about her, she thinks masturbation is wrong thanks to a religious nutjob upbringing, feeling inadequate (can't match his sex drive, can't compare to him doing his own thing, etc) and freaking out on him rather than doing something about it.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson

She'sStillGotIt said:


> LOL...some women are so damned pathetic.
> 
> Whether they caused 'the draught' or not, I'm always amazed at how women think they can *control *what a man looks at, what or who he fantasizes about, what stimuli he uses for his 'alone' time material if he's even "allowed" to use anything or look at porn, and whether he's "allowed" to masturbate.
> 
> I honestly can't believe any woman thinks this is a good or healthy idea to force on a man. And worse, how can any woman actually _BELIEVE_ that nonsense when her man claims he's done exactly as she's demanded and thought ONLY of her? Yeah, I'm *sure* these guys are *only* fantasizing about their demanding wives/girlfriends and not the blonde in accounting or the hot brunette in that science fiction movie, and they never go out to PornHub when they have an extra 15 or 20 minutes alone. 🤣🤣🤣
> 
> The whole thing is preposterous.


My goodness, you must be my long lost sister from another mother.
An exact great response that if lived removes just so much stress.


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## Mr.Married

She'sStillGotIt said:


> LOL...some women are so damned pathetic.
> 
> Whether they caused 'the draught' or not, I'm always amazed at how women think they can *control *what a man looks at, what or who he fantasizes about, what stimuli he uses for his 'alone' time material if he's even "allowed" to use anything or look at porn, and whether he's "allowed" to masturbate.
> 
> I honestly can't believe any woman thinks this is a good or healthy idea to force on a man. And worse, how can any woman actually _BELIEVE_ that nonsense when her man claims he's done exactly as she's demanded and thought ONLY of her? Yeah, I'm *sure* these guys are *only* fantasizing about their demanding wives/girlfriends and not the blonde in accounting or the hot brunette in that science fiction movie, and they never go out to PornHub when they have an extra 15 or 20 minutes alone. 🤣🤣🤣
> 
> The whole thing is preposterous.


yeah but your azz is planted in the reality flower pot ….. many others both men and women not so much.


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## Tabbygirl23

She'sStillGotIt said:


> LOL...some women are so damned pathetic.
> 
> Whether they caused 'the draught' or not, I'm always amazed at how women think they can *control *what a man looks at, what or who he fantasizes about, what stimuli he uses for his 'alone' time material if he's even "allowed" to use anything or look at porn, and whether he's "allowed" to masturbate.
> 
> I honestly can't believe any woman thinks this is a good or healthy idea to force on a man. And worse, how can any woman actually _BELIEVE_ that nonsense when her man claims he's done exactly as she's demanded and thought ONLY of her? Yeah, I'm *sure* these guys are *only* fantasizing about their demanding wives/girlfriends and not the blonde in accounting or the hot brunette in that science fiction movie, and they never go out to PornHub when they have an extra 15 or 20 minutes alone. 🤣🤣🤣
> 
> The whole thing is preposterous.


It’s like they want a personal robot to just beeboopbeeboop what do you want me to do today sweetheart?
Of course they lie to you 🙄 psychos


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## *Deidre*

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> The premise is it's not affecting their sexual couple frequency and he's ready for sex with her anytime.
> 
> Yet W most commonly still try to shame H.
> 
> You've got some sort of answer in mind. I know you do. Can you share, even hypothetically? Say responding for a friend?


For me, I don’t care if he does. I don’t ask and honestly, if he does…it’s healthy in moderation. So the idea of a spouse shaming their partner - the only thing I can think of is, it’s not the only time that partner is shaming their spouse. No one suddenly becomes controlling over one aspect of a relationship - usually, in threads on here anyway, the spouse who is being shamed is made to feel small in other aspects of the marriage. So, that’s my take, they probably have this controlling dynamic in other areas.

And in this case, those wives may feel that they’re not good enough or their husband prefers that over intimacy. It’s undoubtedly rooted in insecurity if the marriage is otherwise healthy. But anyone knows, masturbation for either men or women, can often be a way to quickly relieve stress.

So that’s my best guess. Also in reading threads on here where this is an issue, 9 times out of 10 - the spouse who is freaking out, is controlling other aspects of the marriage.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson

bobert said:


> Not an issue in my marriage but from what I've heard from others:
> 
> She's a control freak, the "I don't want you but I don't want anyone else to have you either, even your hand", she thinks he should only feel pleasure while having sex with her, she's jealous of a hand, she doesn't like porn, if he doesn't use porn she doesn't trust that he's thinking about her, she thinks masturbation is wrong thanks to a religious nutjob upbringing, feeling inadequate (can't match his sex drive, can't compare to him doing his own thing, etc) and freaking out on him rather than doing something about it.


And how harmful to a M. That W is creating avoidable problems in the M that takes up space in both partners mind every day. Like maintaining an on ramp to let's make our whole M harder.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson

I'm hoping some good will come from this for some present or future couple that will realize that if they have a great sex life...

and if either spouse masturbates here and there.....if you freak out it becomes a problem multiplied a thousand fold but if addressed as normal the imagined grief slips away without creating a multitude of problems that are unnecessary.


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## Young at Heart

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> .....What does the W expect to gain by saying I caught you! That's bad, your selfish, for shame...on and on!
> 
> ......What does a W expect to gain when she catches and tries to shame the H for masturbating?


Two thoughts. First, you can only be shamed, if you allow yourself to be shamed. That means you must want to hide what you are doing and not acknowledge it as normal and healthy.

Second, if she doesn't like it, you need to ask her why not guess. Does she take it as a sign of her own sexual failure? Does she view it being not faithful to her and your being able to find pleasure without her? It could be frightening to know she doesn't have a monopoly on you sexual happiness.

I would say that the best thing to do, if "being caught," is to ask her if she would like to join you or lend a hand!


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## Ragnar Ragnasson

Young at Heart said:


> Two thoughts. First, you can only be shamed, if you allow yourself to be shamed. That means you must want to hide what you are doing and not acknowledge it as normal and healthy.
> 
> Second, if she doesn't like it, you need to ask her why not guess. Does she take it as a sign of her own sexual failure? Does she view it being not faithful to her and your being able to find pleasure without her? It could be frightening to know she doesn't have a monopoly on you sexual happiness.
> 
> I would say that the best thing to do, if "being caught," is to ask her if she would like to join you or lend a hand!


Well put. Me too.
To comment on..
1. The H has no reason to be shamed yes, and he ALSO has to not let his W try and make him feel shame or the accept from her the common ( oohh gross how could you..). 

2. The H being chill about it is a necessity. Her expressing her hang ups is her.

3. She'll need to address her realizations she doesn't have sexual control over H when she's saying no to sex. H being chill helps that.


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## minimalME

I'm the pervert who'd just want to watch. 😬


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## Ragnar Ragnasson

minimalME said:


> I'm the pervert who'd just want to watch. 😬


You and me both. Not just watch everytime but yep!!!


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## Ragnar Ragnasson

Diana7 said:


> Is that with or without porn?


Diana, this may be somewhat uncomfortable for you but if you would elaborate a bit that would be helpful I believe. If you're ok with responding I mean.


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## In Absentia

My wife was happy about it... so I didn't bother her...


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## aine

I’d let him get on with it, wouldn’t ask about it either. In addition, sometimes people prefer this form of release rather than have sex with their partner. It works both ways, women and men included. Guys would your wife masturbating by herself bother you?


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## Mybabysgotit

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> If the couple has a good M, H is ready for sex anytime, couple sex is great and frequent, yet if W causes a drought...if W catches H masturbaing after she turns him down again...
> 
> What does the W expect to gain by saying I caught you! That's bad, your selfish, for shame...on and on!
> 
> She has her sexual agency. So does H. Simple.
> 
> What does a W expect to gain when she catches and tries to shame the H for masturbating?


That's nothing short of a control tactic. That's reserved for the guy's who have no agency in their relationship. My would would never bust my balls over something like that, nor would I if I caught her.


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## bobert

aine said:


> Guys would your wife masturbating by herself bother you?


Not in the slightest. I wish I'd walk in on that.


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## CharlieParker

I wouldn't use the term getting caught, rather interrupted. If I want some me time I'll announce it. She is always welcome to join from the start to watch or to assist, passively for eye candy or more actively. If I don't explicitly request her company it's her choice and whatever is fine, just don't interrupt.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson

aine said:


> I’d let him get on with it, wouldn’t ask about it either. In addition, sometimes people prefer this form of release rather than have sex with their partner. It works both ways, women and men included. Guys would your wife masturbating by herself bother you?


Me, no. I encourage it. We have frequent and great couples sex, it's part of the overall big picture. 
Do you think in the same situations husbands have an issue with it?


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## Ragnar Ragnasson

aine said:


> I’d let him get on with it, wouldn’t ask about it either. In addition, sometimes people prefer this form of release rather than have sex with their partner. It works both ways, women and men included. Guys would your wife masturbating by herself bother you?


Me, no. I encourage it. Our couples sex life is great and high frequency. 

Do you think in the same situation Hs do? I'm seeing mostly no, here.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson

Mybabysgotit said:


> That's nothing short of a control tactic. That's reserved for the guy's who have no agency in their relationship. My would would never bust my balls over something like that, nor would I if I caught her.


If guys accept a Ws grief and attempts to tell H stop you pervert you over it.....that's where the problems grow, from reading through TAM.


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## UpsideDownWorld11

It depends how long. A week, I can fight through it. Any longer and I need an outlet. Like hey you gave birth to our child, great, but 2 months is a loooong time!


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## theloveofmylife

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> Yet W most commonly still try to shame H.


Really? Because the current popular thread on the topic seems to be an "H" upset that his "W" is going solo. 

In that case, it's having an impact on the relationship. If it's instead of sex with the spouse, I can see why the sex starved spouse thinks it's selfish.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson

theloveofmylife said:


> Really? Because the current popular thread on the topic seems to be an "H" upset that his "W" is going solo.
> 
> In that case, it's having an impact on the relationship. If it's instead of sex with the spouse, I can see why the sex starved spouse thinks it's selfish.


You've missed the previous thousand posts on I caught H masturbating. Yes, I've found reasons to avoid sex with him for 6 months or 3 yrs but why does he do this?

The recent posts you are seeing are unicorns being copied and recycled for effect, some are likely a few inauthentic posters.


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## UpsideDownWorld11

If you lock the door and go incognito mode, they can never prove it  - just say you were taking a giant dump.


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## theloveofmylife

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> The recent posts you are seeing are unicorns being copied and recycled for effect, some are likely a few inauthentic posters.


Or, it actually happens both ways. 🤷‍♀️

My point was that if it is instead of sex with partner, then that partner (man OR woman) has a right to be upset. Otherwise, not so much. 

But, hey, I'll bow out. Carry on.


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## Diana7

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> Good question. Can you answer from both perspectives? Thanks, that's a help.


If there was a reason why I couldn't have sex for a period of time say though illness then I would be ok with the masturbation but never the porn. I would also hope that any husband would be respectful enough to choose a quiet place and time where someone isn't going to walk in on them.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson

UpsideDownWorld11 said:


> If you lock the door and go incognito mode, they can never prove it  - just say you were taking a giant dump.


I get you but consider this.
My rules, if I feel the need, never in the shower or bathroom and never with door closed in my office or wherever. It's my (our) house I'm not a teenager anymore.

Everything in the open eliminates breeding concerns of any texting, chats, sexting, on and on.
What many folks may not realize is that the idea of going behind closed doors is the thing that builds fear of unknowns to a spouse. Either spouse.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson

theloveofmylife said:


> Or, it actually happens both ways. 🤷‍♀️
> 
> My point was that if it is instead of sex with partner, then that partner (man OR woman) has a right to be upset. Otherwise, not so much.
> 
> But, hey, I'll bow out. Carry on.


Both do of course. I've highlighted that throughout threads.
All good questions.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson

Diana7 said:


> If there was a reason why I couldn't have sex for a period of time say though illness then I would be ok with the masturbation but never the porn. I would also hope that any husband would be respectful enough to choose a quiet place and time where someone isn't going to walk in on them.


Thanks for sharing 🙂.


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## snowbum

I guess I’m the only person who doesn’t need to witness this. I think I have a healthy libido (4-5) times a week but I do t need to see dh jerking in the open


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## DownByTheRiver

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> Good question. Can you answer from both perspectives? Thanks, that's a help.


I only have a problem with porn for all the reasons I've mentioned over and over on this forum, and no problem with masturbation without porn.

I didn't care at all when I was young and a guy was getting himself off. I've done the same and it's usually happening because the other person is sleeping or otherwise closed for business.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson

Double post


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## Ragnar Ragnasson

snowbum said:


> I guess I’m the only person who doesn’t need to witness this. I think I have a healthy libido (4-5) times a week but I do t need to see dh jerking in the open


And I'm thinking you're confident enough with your own sexuality when you know when H is doing it in another room you're not freaking out over it.
Hopefully H doesn't feel you are making him hide it in a bathroom like a child.


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## TexasMom1216

It gets to a point where you have to recognize that you are no longer what he wants and he's going to go outside the marriage. If he's using porn then that means he's at least not always going outside the marriage with a live woman, so he has the character to at least not sleep around in an obvious way. For this, he deserves gratitude because as we've seen that is NOT what is expected of him.

The proper thing to do is NOT shame him, NOT say anything, pretend you don't know and detach yourself emotionally from him. The "please pick me" dance after you find out how he really feels is only going to make you less attractive. He doesn't need or want you any more, so just shift your relationship away from sexuality. The next step is offering an open marriage. If you can't do that, then offer divorce. He'll be relieved either way.


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## UpsideDownWorld11

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> I get you but consider this.
> My rules, if I feel the need, never in the shower or bathroom and never with door closed in my office or wherever. It's my (our) house I'm not a teenager anymore.
> 
> Everything in the open eliminates breeding concerns of any texting, chats, sexting, on and on.
> What many folks may not realize is that the idea of going behind closed doors is the thing that builds fear of unknowns to a spouse. Either spouse.


Have you met my wife?


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## DownByTheRiver

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> And I'm thinking you're confident enough with your own sexuality when you know when H is doing it in another room you're not freaking out over it.
> Hopefully H doesn't feel you are making him hide it in a bathroom like a child.


I wouldn't want to be going about my business and walking to the living room and find a guy jacking off on the sofa for various reasons. You also have to take into consideration that a lot of married people have children. I can't just be jacking off in every room of the house. That's how the bathroom thing got started because typically it's the only place in the house you can lock yourself in and not having an intruder especially if there's little kids.

I would be putting a lock on the bedroom door if it was me with kids in the house. Everyone needs a little privacy.


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## UpsideDownWorld11

DownByTheRiver said:


> I wouldn't want to be going about my business and walking to the living room and find a guy jacking off on the sofa for various reasons. You also have to take into consideration that a lot of married people have children. I can't just be jacking off in every room of the house. That's how the bathroom thing got started because typically it's the only place in the house you can lock yourself in and not having an intruder especially if there's little kids.
> 
> I would be putting a lock on the bedroom door if it was me with kids in the house. Everyone needs a little privacy.


Yea some of us want a little privacy.


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## UpsideDownWorld11

Diana7 said:


> If there was a reason why I couldn't have sex for a period of time say though illness then I would be ok with the masturbation but never the porn. I would also hope that any husband would be respectful enough to choose a quiet place and time where someone isn't going to walk in on them.


Yes, its OK to masturbate to mental images of women just not actual images.


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## DownByTheRiver

*Deidre* said:


> Maybe if it’s affecting their sex life but if the sex life is good, I have no idea.


I suppose you do have to say it depends on the person because there can be a mess factor, so I would just say assuming the guy is carrying a paper towel with him and being sure not to make a mess someone else has to clean up, leave him alone. But I mean I know there are guys who don't even bother and that would make anybody mad who was having to
share in the housekeeping.

An old college friend of mine said the guy living with her would jizz all over the walls and ceilings and not do a thing to clean it up. He was like a sperm power washer. Of course he is the rare exception. But especially young guys used to living with other guys may just leave stuff laying around, and that stuff may not just be dirty socks. So I would say anyone doing that deserves a good reaming and being thrown out.


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## DownByTheRiver

minimalME said:


> I'm the pervert who'd just want to watch. 😬


Don't worry. All you have to do is date regular eventually come across someone who will put on a show for you.

Sometimes I'd pretend they're juggling. But then that would put sex out of the question because I hate clowns.


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## DownByTheRiver

CharlieParker said:


> I wouldn't use the term getting caught, rather interrupted. If I want some me time I'll announce it. She is always welcome to join from the start to watch or to assist, passively for eye candy or more actively. If I don't explicitly request her company it's her choice and whatever is fine, just don't interrupt.


I wouldn't want somebody to walk in on me and just be hovering over me watching because to me that's an interruption.


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## DownByTheRiver

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> Me, no. I encourage it. We have frequent and great couples sex, it's part of the overall big picture.
> Do you think in the same situations husbands have an issue with it?


We certainly have had someone here who do mind it. Who are threatened by it or sex toys.


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## DownByTheRiver

UpsideDownWorld11 said:


> If you lock the door and go incognito mode, they can never prove it  - just say you were taking a giant dump.


Yes, and that is really the polite thing to do.


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## DownByTheRiver

theloveofmylife said:


> Or, it actually happens both ways. 🤷‍♀️
> 
> My point was that if it is instead of sex with partner, then that partner (man OR woman) has a right to be upset. Otherwise, not so much.
> 
> But, hey, I'll bow out. Carry on.


Although I would say it depends on why the person has stopped having sex with them, like that they are not getting along or one of them is cheating or they are on their way to divorce.


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## DownByTheRiver

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> I get you but consider this.
> My rules, if I feel the need, never in the shower or bathroom and never with door closed in my office or wherever. It's my (our) house I'm not a teenager anymore.
> 
> Everything in the open eliminates breeding concerns of any texting, chats, sexting, on and on.
> What many folks may not realize is that the idea of going behind closed doors is the thing that builds fear of unknowns to a spouse. Either spouse.


A whole lot of people have security cameras these days.


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## DownByTheRiver

snowbum said:


> I guess I’m the only person who doesn’t need to witness this. I think I have a healthy libido (4-5) times a week but I do t need to see dh jerking in the open


Yeah, I certainly don't need to or want to, but it's not going to bother me if they are somewhat discreet.


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## DownByTheRiver

UpsideDownWorld11 said:


> Yes, its OK to masturbate to mental images of women just not actual images.


Because that doesn't exploit women who may have already been exploited.


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## UpsideDownWorld11

DownByTheRiver said:


> I suppose you do have to say it depends on the person because there can be a mess factor, so I would just say assuming the guy is carrying a paper towel with him and being sure not to make a mess someone else has to clean up, leave him alone. But I mean I know there are guys who don't even bother and that would make anybody mad who was having to
> share in the housekeeping.
> 
> An old college friend of mine said the guy living with her with jizz all over the walls and ceilings and not do a thing to clean it up. He was like a sperm power washer. Of course he is the rare exception. But especially young guys used to living my calls with other guys may just leave stuff laying around, and that stuff may not just be dirty socks. So I would say anyone doing that deserves a good reading and being thrown out.


Lol @ sperm power washer


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## DownByTheRiver

UpsideDownWorld11 said:


> Lol @ sperm power washer


I was thinking maybe it was a low-ceilinged small room, but she said she had to stand on the bed to clean it, so guess not.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson

Tabbygirl23 said:


> It’s like they want a personal robot to just beeboopbeeboop what do you want me to do today sweetheart?
> Of course they lie to you 🙄 psychos


I'm thinking @Tabbygirl23 gets it perfectly. I about choked on my tea laughing.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson

TexasMom1216 said:


> It gets to a point where you have to recognize that you are no longer what he wants and he's going to go outside the marriage. If he's using porn then that means he's at least not always going outside the marriage with a live woman, so he has the character to at least not sleep around in an obvious way. For this, he deserves gratitude because as we've seen that is NOT what is expected of him.
> 
> The proper thing to do is NOT shame him, NOT say anything, pretend you don't know and detach yourself emotionally from him. The "please pick me" dance after you find out how he really feels is only going to make you less attractive. He doesn't need or want you any more, so just shift your relationship away from sexuality. The next step is offering an open marriage. If you can't do that, then offer divorce. He'll be relieved either way.


Do you mean to say if he masturbates he doesn't want you anymore? That's not the gist or the reasons for masturbating I'm talking about, just in case that clarification is helpful. 

The focus is there's a good sexual relationship ie plenty of good couples sex going on, he never turns down a romp with his W, that's first, but does masturbate time to time if W isn't in the mood and he is. And vice versa of course.


----------



## UpsideDownWorld11

DownByTheRiver said:


> I was thinking maybe it was a low-ceilinged small room, but she said she had to stand on the bed to clean it, so guess not.


The projectile was powerful with that one.


----------



## Ragnar Ragnasson

DownByTheRiver said:


> I wouldn't want to be going about my business and walking to the living room and find a guy jacking off on the sofa for various reasons. You also have to take into consideration that a lot of married people have children. I can't just be jacking off in every room of the house. That's how the bathroom thing got started because typically it's the only place in the house you can lock yourself in and not having an intruder especially if there's little kids.
> 
> I would be putting a lock on the bedroom door if it was me with kids in the house. Everyone needs a little privacy.


Of course that's a given! 🤣🤣🤣


----------



## snowbum

How often do you expect sexual activity? I mean honestly, if It’s good 3-5 times a week +, I guess I can see where a woman might feel a bit put off. If we’re talking more than a week with nothing, that would be different and how old the person is. Not all couples want to be exposed to alone time. My opinion is most people probably aren’t thinking of their spouse when going solo so I’d rather not be part of yhat


----------



## DownByTheRiver

snowbum said:


> How often do you expect sexual activity? I mean honestly, if It’s good 3-5 times a week +, I guess I can see where a woman might feel a bit put off. If we’re talking more than a week with nothing, that would be different and how old the person is. Not all couples want to be exposed to alone time. My opinion is most people probably aren’t thinking of their spouse when going solo so I’d rather not be part of yhat


Yes, but on the other hand, they also may not be thinking about any man or woman. They may just have an urgent urge. The woman may only be thinking about the vibrator, for instance. Not everyone fantasizes about people every time they get off.


----------



## hamadryad

For the same reasons they fall apart when he finally cracks and decides to get sex elsewhere when she's been rejecting him for decades...

Its a matter of control...Many women feel like as long as they have that asset, she can control him in some way....She has some sense of "power"......Once she sees that he doesn't need her for that aspect of his life, she then feels marginalized and subsequently has then lost her perceived power...I mean, if she doesn't want sex(or wants it very infrequently) why would she care all that much if he gets himself off?

I won't say this is true for all women, but many are this way....There really is no other reasonable or logical explanation...I would say that if two people have a hearty sex life it may draw a side eye or some level of disappointment, maybe, I dunno...Ill also admit that if one that if one is masturbating and not paying any sexual energy to the wife that is willing, then of course, its not going to go over well...but thats another story...

I dunno...No matter what the conditions, there is always a little shame involved with masturbation.. It may not be totally fair, but it is what it is..


----------



## TexasMom1216

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> Do you mean to say if he masturbates he doesn't want you anymore? That's not the gist or the reasons for masturbating I'm talking about, just in case that clarification is helpful.
> 
> The focus is there's a good sexual relationship ie plenty of good couples sex going on, he never turns down a romp with his W, that's first, but does masturbate time to time if W isn't in the mood and he is. And vice versa of course.


She can’t compete with porn stars. She’s better off stepping away.


----------



## Ragnar Ragnasson

snowbum said:


> How often do you expect sexual activity? I mean honestly, if It’s good 3-5 times a week +, I guess I can see where a woman might feel a bit put off. If we’re talking more than a week with nothing, that would be different and how old the person is. Not all couples want to be exposed to alone time. My opinion is most people probably aren’t thinking of their spouse when going solo so I’d rather not be part of yhat


For example I'm almost 60. We have great sex 4 to 7 times a week. Twice on Saturday if schedules permit.
Yet I still have alone time now and then. Say during a couples sex three times only week.

And being open about it prevents any fears being generated in the mind of the other spouse about what's he or she doing behind closed locked doors  !

Different rooms but not hiding out. W can join any time. And vice versa of course.

We're adults. It's our house. No need to hide in the bathroom or basement like awkward or embarrassed teenagers.


----------



## Ragnar Ragnasson

TexasMom1216 said:


> She can’t compete with porn stars. She’s better off stepping away.


She doesn't have to or feels the need to compete with pornstars. I don't have to compete with Jason Mamoa or she with Gal Gardot.

The belief that all wives feel or believe their Hs want them to compete with pornstars is a myth perpetuated as fact when it isn't as common as constantly harped on. Just isn't.

Hell, neither of us can compete with our 22 year old selves when we first got married!

Edited to add but, you should've seen my W rockin those bikinis and skin tight evening dresses! And yes, me in those cut off jeans and pooka shell necklace!


----------



## TexasMom1216

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> She doesn't have to or feels the need to compete with pornstars. I don't have to compete with Jason Mamoa or she with Gal Gardot.
> 
> The belief that all wives feel or believe their Hs want them to compete with pornstars is a myth perpetuated as fact when it isn't as common as constantly harped on. Just isn't.
> 
> Hell, neither of us can compete with our 22 year old selves when we first got married!


Is she on this board?


----------



## Ragnar Ragnasson

TexasMom1216 said:


> Is she on this board?


No she's not, that I know of. If you find someone rolling their eyes emoji a lot at me I could be wrong!


----------



## Ragnar Ragnasson

TexasMom1216 said:


> She can’t compete with porn stars. She’s better off stepping away.


So, you think DW and I should separate? Really? Because we don't conduct our marriage in fear and anxiety or meet your concept of marriage? How on God's green earth did you get there?

Or am I misreading the context. My apologies if so.


----------



## TexasMom1216

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> So, you think DW and I should separate? Really? Because we don't conduct our marriage in fear and anxiety or meet your concept of marriage? How on God's green earth did you get there?
> 
> Or am I misreading the context. My apologies if so.


Ah, I see where you’re getting this. In post #71 I referred to “she,” you’re interpreting that to mean your wife. That is understandable, I should have said “no woman,” or better yet “I.” I don’t know your wife, perhaps she does look like a porn star. Or at least is slim and defined with no cellulite. Good for her.


----------



## Ragnar Ragnasson

TexasMom1216 said:


> Ah, I see where you’re getting this. In post #71 I referred to “she,” you’re interpreting that to mean your wife. That is understandable, I should have said “no woman,” or better yet “I.” I don’t know your wife, perhaps she does look like a porn star. Or at least is slim and defined with no cellulite. Good for her.


My apologies.

And no, she doesn't have a perfect to the world body, neither do I, she's perfect to me in most every way though.
Me, I do look good for almost 60. I tell myself every day! Unless I forget. Which has happened. You know, being older and all that! 🤣🤣🤣🤣


----------



## TexasMom1216

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> My apologies.
> 
> And no, she doesn't have a perfect to the world body, neither do I, she's perfect to me in most every way though.
> Me, I do look good for almost 60. I tell myself every day! Unless I forget. Which has happened. You know, being older and all that! 🤣🤣🤣🤣


Well good for her. It’s hard after a certain age to stay slim and cellulite free. I admire her discipline.


----------



## Ragnar Ragnasson

TexasMom1216 said:


> Well good for her. It’s hard after a certain age to stay slim and cellulite free. I admire her discipline.


No, she's not perfectly slim and cellulite free, I didn't explain it right I guess. She's beautiful and wonderful for a 60yo woman, and is also perfect to me in most every way as she is. 🙂🙂🙂


----------



## TexasMom1216

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> No, she's not perfectly slim and cellulite free, I didn't explain it right I guess. She's beautiful and wonderful for a 60yo woman, and is also perfect to me in most every way as she is. 🙂🙂🙂


Be sure you tell her you appreciate all her hard work to stay that way. Has she had surgery? Because I would love to hear about it.


----------



## bobert

Good ****ing lord. Some women  Must be quite the shock that men can actually think their wives are beautiful with cellulite, stretch marks, natural aging, etc. and without plastic surgery or fillers. But nah, we're all just lying about it.

My advice: Less money on fillers, more money on therapy.


----------



## Ragnar Ragnasson

TexasMom1216 said:


> Be sure you tell her you appreciate all her hard work to stay that way. Has she had surgery? Because I would love to hear about it.


She's only had breast cancer surgery.


----------



## TexasMom1216

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> She's only had breast cancer surgery.


I think I saw that on another thread, I hope she’s feeling better.


----------



## Sfort

It’s amazing which topics get the most responses on this forum!


----------



## Ragnar Ragnasson

TexasMom1216 said:


> I think I saw that on another thread, I hope she’s feeling better.


Yep, no worries now, thanks!


----------



## TexasMom1216

Back to topic, is it really common to masturbate in front of your spouse? Not like mid-session, but randomly during the day.

I’m not judging, just wondering if that’s something a lot of couples to do.


----------



## aine

bobert said:


> Not in the slightest. I wish I'd walk in on that.


If you walked in you would probably want to participate, if she didn't want you to, would that bother you?


----------



## PieceOfSky

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> If the couple has a good M, H is ready for sex anytime, couple sex is great and frequent, yet if W causes a drought...if W catches H masturbaing after she turns him down again...
> 
> What does the W expect to gain by saying I caught you! That's bad, your selfish, for shame...on and on!
> 
> She has her sexual agency. So does H. Simple.
> 
> What does a W expect to gain when she catches and tries to shame the H for masturbating?


That’s never happened here in 30 years, where 15+ would qualify as she’s-no-desire-for-me or very close to it, but some years early on were good.

She once in anger made a crude comment about, well, let’s just say it would correlate with someone being careless with clean up, but it was ridiculous and not true. But it suggested resentment with me in general and/or of me taking care of myself, in line with other allegations that tend to get thrown at intimacy-starved partners such as “all you ever think about is sex”.

She wouldn’t be tempted to shame me for masturbating at this point; at least, conflict over our sexless marriage has waned, and in the silence about it that follows maybe it is easier for her to realize someone wanting sex and intimacy isn’t such a deviant after all; plus, she’s aware I may decide to leave. But, who knows.

She masturbates herself, afaik; always did, and in the good years wasn’t shy about limited discussions about that. For awhile, at least, she was open to watching porn as a possible way of getting her mojo back after feeling flat towards sex and having difficulties a few years postpartum. That’s to say, I don’t think she has had hangups about sex or masturbation generally.

From my experience, Im left thinking the only thing that could explain such protests and shaming as described in the OP is that the one protesting is immature, maybe not comfortable with sexuality, maybe genuinely feels shame herself about masturbation. I suppose it could also be a shallow attempt at controlling or hurting the other…. an expression of resentment, fresh anger, or maybe a desire to achieve victim status.

To answer another question posed, I’d be happy if she masturbates (and, I’m pretty sure she does). Even though we’ve had sex, maybe, 2.5 times this year. Life is short, and people deserve to grab whatever pleasure they can, that doesn’t come at someone else’s expense. And, as odd as it may sound, I don’t think her pleasuring her self is costing me anything. The problem is something else.


----------



## In Absentia

hamadryad said:


> Its a matter of control...Many women feel like as long as they have that asset, she can control him in some way....She has some sense of "power"....


Some wives think that nobody is entitled to sex and, if you have a different level of desire, it's up to the person with the higher desire to deal with it and cope with the low level sex activity. It has nothing to do with power... probably selfishness. Of course, you could get out of the marriage if you didn't like it. But that doesn't happen as often as you might think...


----------



## hamadryad

In Absentia said:


> Some wives think that nobody is entitled to sex and, if you have a different level of desire, it's up to the person with the higher desire to deal with it and cope with the low level sex activity. It has nothing to do with power... probably selfishness. Of course, you could get out of the marriage if you didn't like it. But that doesn't happen as often as you might think...


I dunno if I agree. 

IMO it absolutely IS about power. Otherwise she wouldn't care what/who you did or didn't do to get off. Sounds like she does. My apologies in advance if I am misinterpreting. 

She's then left you in a position of " like it or lump it" that's a tactic that speaks of manipulation or control. 

I know a lot of people may disagree, but if one partner abandons sex with the other, they have that right I suppose, but then by doing so, they lose the ability to be able to call any of the shots to decide what the other person does to fulfill that natural urge. Anything else would be really unfair and cruel .....02.


----------



## In Absentia

hamadryad said:


> I dunno if I agree.
> 
> IMO it absolutely IS about power. Otherwise she wouldn't care what/who you did or didn't do to get off. Sounds like she does. My apologies in advance if I am misinterpreting.
> 
> She's then left you in a position of " like it or lump it" that's a tactic that speaks of manipulation or control.
> 
> I know a lot of people may disagree, but if one partner abandons sex with the other, they have that right I suppose, but then by doing so, they lose the ability to be able to call any of the shots to decide what the other person does to fulfill that natural urge. Anything else would be really unfair and cruel .....02.


Sorry, I had to edit my post not to make it all about my wife and my relationship, because I have seen this in many other marriages. My comment was general, not about masturbation, so totally OT and I guess we should leave it at that.


----------



## LisaDiane

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> If the couple has a good M, H is ready for sex anytime, couple sex is great and frequent, yet if W causes a drought...if W catches H masturbaing after she turns him down again...
> 
> What does the W expect to gain by saying I caught you! That's bad, your selfish, for shame...on and on!
> 
> She has her sexual agency. So does H. Simple.
> 
> What does a W expect to gain when she catches and tries to shame the H for masturbating?


This is kind of a vague, convoluted question...if their sex life is so great, why would the wife cause a "drought"? And why would she shame him? I would think women with that attitude wouldn't want great and frequent couple sex...?

I think some women find strong male sexual desire gross and ridiculous. So when they see men needing to meet that physical urge, they view it as a weakness that he needs physical gratification. They think the way men need sexual release is pathetic and childish...they don't value male sexuality at all.


----------



## Ragnar Ragnasson

LisaDiane said:


> This is kind of a vague, convoluted question...if their sex life is so great, why would the wife cause a "drought"? And why would she shame him? I would think women with that attitude wouldn't want great and frequent couple sex...?
> 
> I think some women find strong male sexual desire gross and ridiculous. So when they see men needing to meet that physical urge, they view it as a weakness that he needs physical gratification. They think the way men need sexual release is pathetic and childish...they don't value male sexuality at all.


I agree with everything you're saying!


----------



## bobert

aine said:


> If you walked in you would probably want to participate, if she didn't want you to, would that bother you?


I would want to help her out or keep her company but if she didn't want me to, I might feel slightly disappointed at losing the opportunity but it wouldn't be a big deal. By losing the opportunity I mean it's never happened before and I know she wouldn't be up for anything later (if I even was, I'm normally not very HD). I know it's a lot easier for her alone than partnered and I get alone time, why shouldn't she. And who knows, maybe I'd just enjoy knowing it was happening. 

And that's with us not having a "great and frequent sex life" or whatever was mentioned in the original post.


----------



## BigDaddyNY

My wife doesn't freak out, although if she just walked in on me I suspect there would be some shock and embarrassment. For some reason that seems to be the natural reaction. This is probably TMI, but my wife doesn't walk in on me because I typically masturbate in bed next to her. Usually late at night after she is just too tired for anything. She has no problem with it if it isn't effecting her sexual needs. Lucky for me masturbation isn't needed very often since we have that kind of intimacy on almost a daily basis.

For the record I would love to walk in on my wife masturbating and she would NOT be shamed for it, lol.


----------



## Chaotic

I'm not married but in long-term live-in situation. I know he masturbates, he knows I do. We both joke about it, especially if one of us has to travel and we're away from each other--then we'll tease each other, like "how many times did you have to masturbate, not having me around?" Neither of us think it's that big of a deal. We also have a healthy sex life together. If I walked in on him masturbating I think the initial response would be surprise, but not disgust or anything like that. I'd just be surprised because walking in on a masturbating person is not a routine thing for me. When the surprise wore off I might offer to help.


----------



## DudeInProgress

Why do wives freak out if they catch their H's masturbating and try to shame their H's about it?

I wasn’t aware wives commonly did that…


----------



## Longtime Hubby

My wife walked in on me a few saturday mornings ago. It just happened. Which is rare at age 61 for me to get hard like that. She said nothing. Not even joking about it. No "need a hand." Later, she said she actually thought I was pressuring her to have sex by jerking off. Like I planned it. Unreal. I explained that guys sometimes have no control over it. LOL, and I had to take care of things. Never expected sex with her at that moment. 28 years. Weird-o-rama ... PS I'd love to walk in on her using a vibe or her fingers one day. Any day. Any year. Told her that. No reply.


----------



## damo7

That's abuse and you should get a divorce. My wife is sane and normal - she doesn't care if I jack off.


----------



## DTO

Tabbygirl23 said:


> Sexual repression is still alive and well.


This. My ex expected us to progess beyond not being bothered for sex, to my acceptance of the situation leading to sex becoming a non-issue.

Masturbating was a clear sign that wasn't happening, which pissed her off since the lack of sex impacted how I viewed her.


----------



## UpsideDownWorld11

TexasMom1216 said:


> Back to topic, is it really common to masturbate in front of your spouse? Not like mid-session, but randomly during the day.
> 
> I’m not judging, just wondering if that’s something a lot of couples to do.


I think it's weird tbh.


----------



## Longtime Hubby

UpsideDownWorld11 said:


> I think it's weird tbh.


maybe during foreplay? Who knows. Everyone is different. What works for one couple won't for another.


----------



## EleGirl

Not all women do this. I'm not even sure that most women do. 

Some men do shame their wife if they catch her masturbating. We've had men post here very upset about catching their wife masturbating.

To me the issue is if it's interfering with your sex life, then it's a problem. Otherwise, I don't get it.


----------



## Philip P.

I’ve been lucky I guess. Masturbation has never been much of an issue as we got older. We still have a great sex life and my wife was even willing to incorporate some sex toys. My interest in masturbation really diminished as our marriage went on. Probably has to do with having an empty nest and still being on the young side, since we have more alone time now. I won’t do it in front of her if I had the urge but you know, if she asked me to never do it I might take her up in it since we still do have pretty active intimacy. Everyone is different.


----------



## Longtime Hubby

EleGirl said:


> Not all women do this. I'm not even sure that most women do.
> 
> Some men do shame their wife if they catch her masturbating. We've had men post here very upset about catching their wife masturbating.
> 
> To me the issue is if it's interfering with your sex life, then it's a problem. Otherwise, I don't get it.


I’d love to be awakened by the soft whirring noise of a vibrator being enjoyed.


----------



## Longtime Hubby

Philip P. said:


> I’ve been lucky I guess. Masturbation has never been much of an issue as we got older. We still have a great sex life and my wife was even willing to incorporate some sex toys. My interest in masturbation really diminished as our marriage went on. Probably has to do with having an empty nest and still being on the young side, since we have more alone time now. I won’t do it in front of her if I had the urge but you know, if she asked me to never do it I might take her up in it since we still do have pretty active intimacy. Everyone is different.


Much less at 61 than at 16. There are moments when someone is “too tired” or ”just not feeling it” when i take matters into my own hand, lol


----------



## Philip P.

Longtime Hubby said:


> Much less at 61 than at 16. There are moments when someone is “too tired” or ”just not feeling it” when i take matters into my own hand, lol


Sometimes that’s where the sex toys are really useful. Im serious. I’m not going to reveal details except to say that I was tired just recently after a long day of installing drywall. It was the weekend and my wife decided to use a sex toy on me! It was wonderful and unexpected. We might not be into them at all but when my wife was single and in college she learned a little about toys from a roommate, who enjoyed using them (using them on herself, at least she says so lol). I suggested trying a couple of toys years later do my wife had some familiarity with them. As I’m getting older (now in my 50s), I think I’d prefer being intimate with my wife since I don’t have a lot of energy for masturbation.


----------



## Longtime Hubby

Philip P. said:


> Sometimes that’s where the sex toys are really useful. Im serious. I’m not going to reveal details except to say that I was tired just recently after a long day of installing drywall. It was the weekend and my wife decided to use a sex toy on me! It was wonderful and unexpected. We might not be into them at all but when my wife was single and in college she learned a little about toys from a roommate, who enjoyed using them (using them on herself, at least she says so lol). I suggested trying a couple of toys years later do my wife had some familiarity with them. As I’m getting older (now in my 50s), I think I’d prefer being intimate with my wife since I don’t have a lot of energy for masturbation.


That’s great. She used one on my balls During a BJ. Wow … College roomie used toys just on herself, eh? I am not buying that! No worries. My wife also denies FF fun in her past although videos featuring that drive her wild.


----------



## Bulfrog1987

Tabbygirl23 said:


> Because marriage is still this ball and chain dynamic when it’s suppose to set you free from all the fake stuff. It’s suppose to be the realest thing you have. If my husband tells me a deep dark thought that shocks me, my first reaction is to be happy he trusted me with that. Whether we doing it that night idk, I gotta research. Lol.
> but seriously, if you can’t be yourself and happy with your own thoughts around your partner then that’s really crappy.


This right here. When I was married, my husband swore he never masterbated. I'm not dumb, but I did believe him for a long long time. The amount of tail he caught nightly from me was more than he probably had combined in his whole lifetime, in our 15 years together. There was never drought for him so to speak. But he did travel a lot, and I noticed our data going WAY up, sure enough, insert mega porn watching.

Well yeah "I watch porn, but I don't do anything." HA! Now that I would never buy, he sure did stick to his guns though. Lied and lied and lied. The saddest part of it all, I was just hurt, because for years I'd attempted to get him to do it in front of me, he never would said he didn't like it, ect. I wasn't mad he was doing it, I was upset I wasn't a safe space for him. 

If I'd ever caught him... WOOOOWEEE I would have lost my mind! Not in a yelling screaming fit of rage but excitement lol. Anyway, that was never meant to be a thing. Hopefully a future partner will not deny me that part of him, but who knows?


----------



## workfromhomedad

My wife HATES it if I masturbate so I don't. SHe considers it the same as cheating.


----------



## Longtime Hubby

gwytherjames said:


> My wife HATES it if I masturbate so I don't. SHe considers it the same as cheating.


That is her controlling you. it’s not the same as cheating. You are not with another person. Find her reaction odd. Ever catch her playing with herself?


----------



## Ragnar Ragnasson

gwytherjames said:


> My wife HATES it if I masturbate so I don't. SHe considers it the same as cheating.


She would, especially if she's controlling the sexual frequency in your M.
Her reasoning is she sees her control slipping away.


----------



## BigDaddyNY

gwytherjames said:


> My wife HATES it if I masturbate so I don't. SHe considers it the same as cheating.


If she wants to have sex with you each and every time you have the desire to masturbate then no problem, otherwise she should mind her own business.


----------



## workfromhomedad

Longtime Hubby said:


> That is her controlling you. it’s not the same as cheating. You are not with another person. Find her reaction odd. Ever catch her playing with herself?


No. She is not into doing it for herself.


----------



## workfromhomedad

BigDaddyNY said:


> If she wants to have sex with you each and every time you have the desire to masturbate then no problem, otherwise she should mind her own business.


tbf we do have a lot of sex. I can't moan there. But I do have a much higher sex drive.


----------



## Ragnar Ragnasson

gwytherjames said:


> No. She is not into doing it for herself.


Why not, is she sexually repressed in some way?


----------



## workfromhomedad

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> Why not, is she sexually repressed in some way?


No she is just not into that.


----------



## Ragnar Ragnasson

gwytherjames said:


> tbf we do have a lot of sex. I can't moan there. But I do have a much higher sex drive.


See this response:
BigDaddyNY said:
If she wants to have sex with you each and every time you have the desire to masturbate then no problem, otherwise she should mind her own business.

So is she repressed enough to say you better not masturbate because i don't want to have sex?
THAT is the question you're avoiding.


----------



## uwe.blab

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> If the couple has a good M, H is ready for sex anytime, couple sex is great and frequent, yet if W causes a drought...if W catches H masturbaing after she turns him down again...
> 
> What does the W expect to gain by saying I caught you! That's bad, your selfish, for shame...on and on!
> 
> She has her sexual agency. So does H. Simple.
> 
> What does a W expect to gain when she catches and tries to shame the H for masturbating?


This happened to you?


----------



## Ragnar Ragnasson

uwe.blab said:


> This happened to you?


No, the idea came from seeing so many posters sharing how guys live in fear, in their own home to masturbate. ... even in empty nest or no children many guys seem to be talking about how W caught them masturbating at some point and said they were bad, bad men. 

Along with some posters saying they had to sneak into a bathroom with doors closed, or only in the shower, or sneak one late at night and afraid to get caught, on and on.....in their own house when their Ws continuously reject sexual contact.

Even ltr Ms, guys saying they've been M 20yrs, get turned down for sex from W, and because of comments from W believe they, in their own house, have to sneak into the bathroom because all the negative comments from W that has taken control of their sex life.

That so many grown ass men in their own house still feel they have to sneak around like teenage boys if they're horn and W has turned down sexual encounter. The intent is to highlight how stupid that is.

The real fears a W has comes in a M when one goes behind closed doors and the spouse wonders what's going on.

The answer is leave the door open, do everything in the light. No secrets. As in your not horny, I am, and that's ok.

Eliminates a lot of stress in the M. No closed doors. 

Be open, and grown fn man doesn't grow resentment feeling he is relegated to the bathroom like a teen boy for a quick release in his own house because his W turns down sex, wants to control his sex life too, it keeps things open. And it goes both ways of course.


----------



## TexasMom1216

Have we reversed this? We know some men get really angry if their wives masturbate, we saw that in a recent thread.


----------



## Bulfrog1987

TexasMom1216 said:


> Have we reversed this? We know some men get really angry if their wives masturbate, we saw that in a recent thread.


I'd like to see that thread. My husband would have been super mad. I mean, he wasn't sexually deprived, I never turned him down. I'd have to have literally been sick puking, so very very rare to reject him. BUT, that didn't mean the sex was pleasurable or satisfying me. It definitely wasn't, totally one sided. My O's were usually sleep induced, from not having one in months. If he'd had found out about that, I don't even want to imagine the hell he'd have put me through. He was that kind of jealous. 

I don't understand W shaming their husbands. I don't get it.


----------



## TexasMom1216

Bulfrog1987 said:


> I'd like to see that thread. My husband would have been super mad. I mean, he wasn't sexually deprived, I never turned him down. I'd have to have literally been sick puking, so very very rare to reject him. BUT, that didn't mean the sex was pleasurable or satisfying me. It definitely wasn't, totally one sided. My O's were usually sleep induced, from not having one in months. If he'd had found out about that, I don't even want to imagine the hell he'd have put me through. He was that kind of jealous.
> 
> I don't understand W shaming their husbands. I don't get it.


Start a thread. I’d be fascinated to see the responses.


----------



## Beach123

Why do you assume with such a broad brush stroke that women freak out over men masturbating?

some women don’t! Some view it as ‘normal, healthy behavior’ if it is in moderation - and not roadblocking a healthy relationship.


----------



## Longtime Hubby

TexasMom1216 said:


> Have we reversed this? We know some men get really angry if their wives masturbate, we saw that in a recent thread.


would not anger me.


----------



## TexasMom1216

Longtime Hubby said:


> would not anger me.


Start a thread.


----------



## No Longer Lonely Husband

Longtime Hubby said:


> I’d love to be awakened by the soft whirring noise of a vibrator being enjoyed.


I have been here of late. I was extremely tired the other evening and fell asleep about 10 which is early for me and awoke to my wife using her “womanizer’…..needless to say I was nude in a few seconds and we had a nice impromptu encounter….never would have thought this six years ago.


----------



## Longtime Hubby

No Longer Lonely Husband said:


> I have been here of late. I was extremely tired the other evening and fell asleep about 10 which is early for me and awoke to my wife using her “womanizer’…..needless to say I was nude in a few seconds and we had a nice impromptu encounter….never would have thought this six years ago.


That is fantastic!


----------



## DudeInProgress

TexasMom1216 said:


> Have we reversed this? We know some men get really angry if their wives masturbate, we saw that in a recent thread.


I must have missed that one, I’ve never heard of men getting angry at all about their wife masturbating. Ever. - unless she’s masturbating white denying him sex (which is a completely different situation).


----------



## Ragnar Ragnasson

TexasMom1216 said:


> Have we reversed this? We know some men get really angry if their wives masturbate, we saw that in a recent thread.


My last sentence was and it goes both ways. That's absolutely fine.


----------



## No Longer Lonely Husband

Longtime Hubby said:


> That is fantastic!


Indeed it was LOL


----------



## Kitcat30

Porn would be my only issue. I'm sure we all know how bad that crap can be for you and poison it can be in your relationship. Masterbation however I have no issue if I caught my partner doing this.


----------



## hamadryad

Kitcat30 said:


> Porn would be my only issue. I'm sure we all know how bad that crap can be for you and poison it can be in your relationship. Masterbation however I have no issue if I caught my partner doing this.


So let me see if I have this straight.....

If he was j/o to porn that would be bad, but if he's j/o to porn like images in his head, or has the TV on and dreaming about the 5 pm news anchors huge breasts, then it's ok? 

I mean, he's probably not thinking of a nice Cheeseburger or a 69 Camaro during his j/o session. ..lol.


----------



## Kitcat30

hamadryad said:


> So let me see if I have this straight.....
> 
> If he was j/o to porn that would be bad, but if he's j/o to porn like images in his head, or has the TV on and dreaming about the 5 pm news anchors huge breasts, then it's ok?
> 
> I mean, he's probably not thinking of a nice Cheeseburger or a 69 Camaro during his j/o session. ..lol.


Lol I know what you mean. But this is just based on my own research. Realistically our brains are not designed for the level of stimulation that we get from watching porn. Using our imagination is actually pretty normal and isn't as overly stimulating compared to the images you get from watching porn. For example if you see someone you are attracted to you might fantasise about them, its quite harmless and a natural bodily response. Porn is also a reason why sexual dysfunction is becoming more common in younger men. Younger men are also learning how they think sex should be by watching porn which is unrealistic and unhealthy. Imagine having sex with a guy who actually thinks it's normal to have sex for hours non stop...nobody has time for that.


----------



## Longtime Hubby

It’s call


Kitcat30 said:


> Porn would be my only issue. I'm sure we all know how bad that crap can be for you and poison it can be in your relationship. Masterbation however I have no issue if I caught my partner doing this.


its called being human. Sometimes, we just need self stimulation!


----------



## Kitcat30

Longtime Hubby said:


> It’s call
> 
> its called being human. Sometimes, we just need self stimulation!


I know I don't think anything is wrong with that...


----------



## BoSlander

Because men control the marriage, but women control the sex. If they feel they cannot control your sex habits, then they feel the marriage is in trouble and will do whatever they can to stop you from engaging in the act.


----------



## oldshirt

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> If the couple has a good M, H is ready for sex anytime, couple sex is great and frequent, yet if W causes a drought...if W catches H masturbaing after she turns him down again...
> 
> What does the W expect to gain by saying I caught you! That's bad, your selfish, for shame...on and on!
> 
> She has her sexual agency. So does H. Simple.
> 
> What does a W expect to gain when she catches and tries to shame the H for masturbating?


I'm arriving a little late to the party and have not read all 7 pages. I am just going off the title and the opening post. 

I think this issue goes way deeper than what we even realise most of the time. 

I kind of discussed this in another thread but I think at it's core, women lose respect for a man when he is spanking alone in the shadows. 

Juvenile males spank their little pee-pees before they are developed and mature enough to mate with a developed female. 

They see it as an activity that undeveloped boys do that can't get women yet. At the root of it, it is a respect thing. They can't respect a boy that can't get a woman yet and so if an adult male is doing it, he isn't mature and developed enough to mate with a woman. ....... Even if she is supposedly his mate, she loses respect that he has to take matters into his own hands because he doesn't have the giblets to mate with her. 

So in other words, even if she is the one that is rejecting and stiff-arming him,, she loses respect for him that he can't get her to mate with him. Pretty messed up stuff huh? This is why we have shrinks and therapists and such that charge an arm and leg per hour to unravel. 

Even though women may ***** about men's sexual drives and motivations.... they respect and admire men that do have sex with women. And where women's respect and admiration go, their desire follows. 

Let me shift gears a bit and give an example. A while back we were out of town with my daughter and were staying in fairly nice hotel with a nice lounge. We were hanging in the lounge and there was a guy at the bar schmoozing up two ladies. We couldn't hear much of what was actually being said but we could tell there was a good degree of flirting and banter going on. 

The guy was fairly decent looking but not male model material looking the two ladies were nice looking but again, not swedish bikini models or anything. And they were all engaged in some friendly interaction and banter. 

... and my wife was very intrigued by this whole thing and I could tell that her attention was focused on them. My teenage daughter and her friend was with us so my wife couldn't just come out and say what she was thinking but I could tell she thought this guy was all that and was getting her riled up. 

Whenever my daughter and her friend would momentarily leave the table, my wife would point out that this guy was trying to get these two chicks into bed and she would point out which chick was down and which one was still needing a little more seduction etc. 

She was completely enthralled with this and I'm sure her jay-jay was getting a bit wet over. She was even talking about him on the way home when daughter and friend were asleep in the car. 

But here's where I'm going with this - the reason this guy had her attention so much and the reason he was making good headway with these two other chicks is not because he was all that great looking. And he wasn't flashing wads of cash around or talking about Bently or his villa in Palm Beach etc,, it is BECAUSE he was engaging and initiating with these two chicks. That's what turned her own about him. 

If he had been sitting at the bar alone having a drink, he would have been invisible to her and she wouldn't have even known or cared he was there. If for some reason she would have known he was alone spanking to porn, she would have been repulsed by him and thought he was a creepy creeper creeping. 

But because he was engaging a couple chicks (who seemed to be receptive) she thought he was a hot hunk of a stud. 

Women dig men who engage with and score with actual women. But are turned off by men that can't get with women and have to resort to spanking themselves. 

Lemme also put it this way - to women, getting sex is one of the easiest things in the world. So if they see a guy spanking on his own, they think it's because he CAN'T get with any women for real sex and since it is so easier for them to get it, they see him as a creepy loser. 

If he was sitting there alone minding his own business and having a drink, he would have been


----------



## oldshirt

JBLH said:


> Because men control the marriage, but women control the sex. If they feel they cannot control your sex habits, then they feel the marriage is in trouble and will do whatever they can to stop you from engaging in the act.


If he is having sex with other women, then she looses her control over his sex habits. 

If he is spanking, then she just sees him as a loser that can't get a real woman or put in the effort to get with her.


----------



## hamadryad

oldshirt said:


> If he is spanking, then she just sees him as a loser that can't get a real woman or put in the effort to get with her.



I dunno bout this....

Most women report being hurt, marginalized, and replaced sexually when they know this is going on. 

The way you are portraying it, they should feel empowered. If that were the case most would not likely even care about porn, which is far from the reality...

We have all heard the stories of crying women complaining how they are so shocked that he would choose images on a screen over a live body. That really doesn't fall in line with disdain or mockery.


----------



## Kitcat30

oldshirt said:


> I'm arriving a little late to the party and have not read all 7 pages. I am just going off the title and the opening post.
> 
> I think this issue goes way deeper than what we even realise most of the time.
> 
> I kind of discussed this in another thread but I think at it's core, women lose respect for a man when he is spanking alone in the shadows.
> 
> Juvenile males spank their little pee-pees before they are developed and mature enough to mate with a developed female.
> 
> They see it as an activity that undeveloped boys do that can't get women yet. At the root of it, it is a respect thing. They can't respect a boy that can't get a woman yet and so if an adult male is doing it, he isn't mature and developed enough to mate with a woman. ....... Even if she is supposedly his mate, she loses respect that he has to take matters into his own hands because he doesn't have the giblets to mate with her.
> 
> So in other words, even if she is the one that is rejecting and stiff-arming him,, she loses respect for him that he can't get her to mate with him. Pretty messed up stuff huh? This is why we have shrinks and therapists and such that charge an arm and leg per hour to unravel.
> 
> Even though women may *** about men's sexual drives and motivations.... they respect and admire men that do have sex with women. And where women's respect and admiration go, their desire follows.
> 
> Let me shift gears a bit and give an example. A while back we were out of town with my daughter and were staying in fairly nice hotel with a nice lounge. We were hanging in the lounge and there was a guy at the bar schmoozing up two ladies. We couldn't hear much of what was actually being said but we could tell there was a good degree of flirting and banter going on.
> 
> The guy was fairly decent looking but not male model material looking the two ladies were nice looking but again, not swedish bikini models or anything. And they were all engaged in some friendly interaction and banter.
> 
> ... and my wife was very intrigued by this whole thing and I could tell that her attention was focused on them. My teenage daughter and her friend was with us so my wife couldn't just come out and say what she was thinking but I could tell she thought this guy was all that and was getting her riled up.
> 
> Whenever my daughter and her friend would momentarily leave the table, my wife would point out that this guy was trying to get these two chicks into bed and she would point out which chick was down and which one was still needing a little more seduction etc.
> 
> She was completely enthralled with this and I'm sure her jay-jay was getting a bit wet over. She was even talking about him on the way home when daughter and friend were asleep in the car.
> 
> But here's where I'm going with this - the reason this guy had her attention so much and the reason he was making good headway with these two other chicks is not because he was all that great looking. And he wasn't flashing wads of cash around or talking about Bently or his villa in Palm Beach etc,, it is BECAUSE he was engaging and initiating with these two chicks. That's what turned her own about him.
> 
> If he had been sitting at the bar alone having a drink, he would have been invisible to her and she wouldn't have even known or cared he was there. If for some reason she would have known he was alone spanking to porn, she would have been repulsed by him and thought he was a creepy creeper creeping.
> 
> But because he was engaging a couple chicks (who seemed to be receptive) she thought he was a hot hunk of a stud.
> 
> Women dig men who engage with and score with actual women. But are turned off by men that can't get with women and have to resort to spanking themselves.
> 
> Lemme also put it this way - to women, getting sex is one of the easiest things in the world. So if they see a guy spanking on his own, they think it's because he CAN'T get with any women for real sex and since it is so easier for them to get it, they see him as a creepy loser.
> 
> If he was sitting there alone minding his own business and having a drink, he would have been


Wow what an interesting way of putting it. I guess that applies to some women not all, but it definitely makes sense looking at it from a biological mating point. But I think if a guy is regularly sorting himself out more than needed we women probably can pick up on that to. So I mean the whole obsessively masterbating thing, or doing it when not needed. For instance I see myself as having a healthy sex drive, but if I dont get sex for one night I won't resort to masterbation just like that...it's good to practice self control aswell. And a man who is regularly spanking it as you put it lol, probably seems like he has no self control which, again, would be a turn off for a women. If he is doing it because he has a genuine urge or hasn't released in a while then I get it, but in a lot of cases some men just spank it out of habit and not a genuine need.


----------



## oldshirt

hamadryad said:


> I dunno bout this....
> 
> Most women report being hurt, marginalized, and replaced sexually when they know this is going on.
> 
> The way you are portraying it, they should feel empowered. If that were the case most would not likely even care about porn, which is far from the reality...
> 
> We have all heard the stories of crying women complaining how they are so shocked that he would choose images on a screen over a live body. That really doesn't fall in line with disdain or mockery.


I think that is how they describe it when they are on the Oprah Winfrey show telling it to other women. Then they get the hugs and cuddles and someone wipes the tear from their eye and they're told how great they are. 

I think the real root feeling they get in the pit of their soul is disdain and loss of respect for the guy. He appears as a looser and inept as a man to them. 

There is no empowerment in that. 

Now I can see where if they themselves are not getting the loving and sexuality that they want in the relationship and then find out he is spanking to porn all the time,, their own underlying insecurities and self esteem issues and such can turn some of that inward and get insecure that they don't have perfect bodies and such. 

But I think the foundation of it all is loss of respect and a disdain towards the guy. If she sees him as weak and inept and ineffectual, that can trigger a wide range of insecurities and anxieties for her. In her primal instincts, she wonders if he doesn't have the strength and initiative to mate with a real female, how is he going to be able to fight a saber tooth tiger or a marauding tribe or bring home meat during the drought or enough firewood during the next ice age.

Spanking alone in the dark is seen as a weakness and ineptness and lack of maturity and development. It's what adolescent boys do when their genitalia develops before the rest of their secondary sex characteristics that make them desirable to females fully develop. 

This is getting a little Freudian here but on a deep level it is seen as immaturity and lack of development.


----------



## Longtime Hubby

So you never h


oldshirt said:


> I'm arriving a little late to the party and have not read all 7 pages. I am just going off the title and the opening post.
> 
> I think this issue goes way deeper than what we even realise most of the time.
> 
> I kind of discussed this in another thread but I think at it's core, women lose respect for a man when he is spanking alone in the shadows.
> 
> Juvenile males spank their little pee-pees before they are developed and mature enough to mate with a developed female.
> 
> They see it as an activity that undeveloped boys do that can't get women yet. At the root of it, it is a respect thing. They can't respect a boy that can't get a woman yet and so if an adult male is doing it, he isn't mature and developed enough to mate with a woman. ....... Even if she is supposedly his mate, she loses respect that he has to take matters into his own hands because he doesn't have the giblets to mate with her.
> 
> So in other words, even if she is the one that is rejecting and stiff-arming him,, she loses respect for him that he can't get her to mate with him. Pretty messed up stuff huh? This is why we have shrinks and therapists and such that charge an arm and leg per hour to unravel.
> 
> Even though women may *** about men's sexual drives and motivations.... they respect and admire men that do have sex with women. And where women's respect and admiration go, their desire follows.
> 
> Let me shift gears a bit and give an example. A while back we were out of town with my daughter and were staying in fairly nice hotel with a nice lounge. We were hanging in the lounge and there was a guy at the bar schmoozing up two ladies. We couldn't hear much of what was actually being said but we could tell there was a good degree of flirting and banter going on.
> 
> The guy was fairly decent looking but not male model material looking the two ladies were nice looking but again, not swedish bikini models or anything. And they were all engaged in some friendly interaction and banter.
> 
> ... and my wife was very intrigued by this whole thing and I could tell that her attention was focused on them. My teenage daughter and her friend was with us so my wife couldn't just come out and say what she was thinking but I could tell she thought this guy was all that and was getting her riled up.
> 
> Whenever my daughter and her friend would momentarily leave the table, my wife would point out that this guy was trying to get these two chicks into bed and she would point out which chick was down and which one was still needing a little more seduction etc.
> 
> She was completely enthralled with this and I'm sure her jay-jay was getting a bit wet over. She was even talking about him on the way home when daughter and friend were asleep in the car.
> 
> But here's where I'm going with this - the reason this guy had her attention so much and the reason he was making good headway with these two other chicks is not because he was all that great looking. And he wasn't flashing wads of cash around or talking about Bently or his villa in Palm Beach etc,, it is BECAUSE he was engaging and initiating with these two chicks. That's what turned her own about him.
> 
> If he had been sitting at the bar alone having a drink, he would have been invisible to her and she wouldn't have even known or cared he was there. If for some reason she would have known he was alone spanking to porn, she would have been repulsed by him and thought he was a creepy creeper creeping.
> 
> But because he was engaging a couple chicks (who seemed to be receptive) she thought he was a hot hunk of a stud.
> 
> Women dig men who engage with and score with actual women. But are turned off by men that can't get with women and have to resort to spanking themselves.
> 
> Lemme also put it this way - to women, getting sex is one of the easiest things in the world. So if they see a guy spanking on his own, they think it's because he CAN'T get with any women for real sex and since it is so easier for them to get it, they see him as a creepy loser.
> 
> If he was sitting there alone minding his own business and having a drink, he would have been


so you never took care of yourself when wife said “no” and you really needed relief?


----------



## hamadryad

Kitcat30 said:


> Wow what an interesting way of putting it. I guess that applies to some women not all, but it definitely makes sense looking at it from a biological mating point. But I think if a guy is regularly sorting himself out more than needed we women probably can pick up on that to. So I mean the whole obsessively masterbating thing, or doing it when not needed. For instance I see myself as having a healthy sex drive, but if I dont get sex for one night I won't resort to masterbation just like that...it's good to practice self control aswell. And a man who is regularly spanking it as you put it lol, probably seems like *he has no self control* which, again, would be a turn off for a women. If he is doing it because he has a genuine urge or hasn't released in a while then I get it, but in a lot of cases some men just spank it out of habit and not a genuine need.



One thing many women will never truly understand is the "feeling" a guy gets when that urge is in place....In a lot of cases, it can be as bad as a genuine feeling of hunger or thirst..NO one would criticize someone for needing a drink on a hot day, right?. I know you are probably thinking I am nuts or a perv or something, but I am telling you that until you have experienced it, its hard to criticize....It would be like me telling you that PMS is a joke and you should never complain about it and stop being a whiner.....

Back in my mid late teens it was off the charts, but still very high...I do a lot of strength training, which is known to have a profound effect on testosterone levels.. so just something like exercise can make this an issue that has little to do with self control...Some scientists believe its even genetic..

This is powerful stuff we are talking about here....It can ruin lives ,topple major leaders, cause people to commit murder...etc...It has to be, for the sake of continuation of the species..


----------



## oldshirt

Longtime Hubby said:


> So you never h
> 
> so you never took care of yourself when wife said “no” and you really needed relief?


Never look to me as example of someone who has ever done anything the "right" way! LOL  

I've spanked. She's spanked. You've spanked. We've all spanked. 

I'm talking in generalities and concepts here. The world is not going to implode and no puppies will be harmed if someone has a spank. If that were the case there would be no world and no puppies. 

The question was asked why wives get testy and can even shame men for spanking. I presented my thoughts on the matter. 

I think in general, on a deep instinctive level, women lose respect for men when men slink off to spank on their own. 

Now if a guy were to spank himself while she is laying nekkid with him and he is gazing upon HER yearningly and caressing her all over lovingly and telling her how beautiful and sexy she is and how much she turns him on and he takes care of himself with his own hand,,,,, that may be a different story, assuming he takes care of her needs too. 

But IMHO in the big picture, women tend to disdain and lose respect for men that slink off and bop their balony in the dark like naughty 12 year old boys. Especially to porn.


----------



## Kitcat30

hamadryad said:


> One thing many women will never truly understand is the "feeling" a guy gets when that urge is in place....In a lot of cases, it can be as bad as a genuine feeling of hunger or thirst..NO one would criticize someone for needing a drink on a hot day, right?. I know you are probably thinking I am nuts or a perv or something, but I am telling you that until you have experienced it, its hard to criticize....It would be like me telling you that PMS is a joke and you should never complain about it and stop being a whiner.....
> 
> Back in my mid late teens it was off the charts, but still very high...I do a lot of strength training, which is known to have a profound effect on testosterone levels.. so just something like exercise can make this an issue that has little to do with self control...Some scientists believe its even genetic..
> 
> This is powerful stuff we are talking about here....It can ruin lives ,topple major leaders, cause people to commit murder...etc...It has to be, for the sake of continuation of the species..


Yes that's why I said the exception if there was a genuine need. But this would have to be a while without release. A man who doesn't ejaculate his body can take a little while before it expels it naturally for him (wet dream). What I'm saying is men can go longer than they think without releasing it just takes some self control and not triggering yourself by watching porn ect...truthfully women have very strong urges to, it's happened to me when my body was going tru serious hormonal changes. All I wanted was sex, orgasm, sex, orgasm...women can actually orgasm multiple times with ease so yes we to have very strong urges and need to relieve ourselves to, we are just less vocal about it 🙂


----------



## Rus47

Kitcat30 said:


> Yes that's why I said the exception if there was a genuine need. *But this would have to be a while without release.*
> 
> * What I'm saying is men can go longer than they think without releasing it just takes some self control.*
> 
> truthfully women have very strong urges to, it's happened to me when my body was going tru serious hormonal changes. *All I wanted was sex, orgasm, sex, orgasm..*.women can actually orgasm multiple times with ease so yes we to have very strong urges and need to relieve ourselves to, we are just less vocal about it 🙂


Wouldn't "a while" depend on the man and the circumstances? What would a "genuine need" be? A wife knows there is a "genuine need" so unless she isn't well she can help him out. Either way, I am surprised she would be surprised. I mean, a man is going to enthusiastically go with a willing live wife before taking care of himself. So her "freaking out" seems rather strange.. Why does he need to "take some self control"? Seems similar to addressing any other bodily need. We don't usually skip meals because the wife didn't cook. 

The "all I wanted" is pretty much the life of a male, especially in their breeding years. If he is stuck with a wife who throttles his innate nature and thinks he ought to exercise some self control, she can just think whatever she wants. If she wants to "freak out" that is her right too.


----------



## joannacroc

OK here's my 2 cents. Thaf hasn't been my experience. When I was married sex dried up quickly and no matter how much I leveled with then husband he didn't care enough for frequency to be compromised at all. He would try for a few days and things went back to normal. What frustrated me the most was that he watched porn and masturbated but didn't care enough about me or our marriage to see if cutting back helped our sex life. So I would say in such a circumstance it did cause a lot of conflict when I caught him because he didn't care enough about me to try and see if it would make a difference. I was angry about that for a while but years later it is just sort of a fact that happened. I don't think I could really go through that again.


----------



## Personal

joannacroc said:


> When I was married sex dried up quickly and no matter how much I leveled with then husband he didn't care enough for frequency to be compromised at all.


If anyone faces that, from the very beginning of it, the best thing they should do is to replace their withholder for their withholding very early on. Since it really isn't worth it, being in a nominally sexual relationship, with someone who by their actions prove they don't want to share much sex or any sex at all together.


----------



## Kitcat30

Rus47 said:


> Wouldn't "a while" depend on the man and the circumstances? What would a "genuine need" be? A wife knows there is a "genuine need" so unless she isn't well she can help him out. Either way, I am surprised she would be surprised. I mean, a man is going to enthusiastically go with a willing live wife before taking care of himself. So her "freaking out" seems rather strange.. Why does he need to "take some self control"? Seems similar to addressing any other bodily need. We don't usually skip meals because the wife didn't cook.
> 
> The "all I wanted" is pretty much the life of a male, especially in their breeding years. If he is stuck with a wife who throttles his innate nature and thinks he ought to exercise some self control, she can just think whatever she wants. If she wants to "freak out" that is her right too.


Of course every man is different and sex drive will always differ from person to person. I'm really just responding to the previous post. And I don't see what's wrong with practising self control. You should look at websites such as nofap where men practice seed retention and there is nothing wrong with them infact they find many health benefits from it. All I'm saying is if he's masterbating because of habit rather than need then you can see why his partner may find him less appealing. However if a women withholds sex from their partner than its understandable. But if that's the case there's probably a way bigger problem in their relationship. 

*The "all I wanted" is pretty much the life of a male, especially in their breeding years*

Just because a man is in his breeding years doesn't mean he wants or needs to have sex 24/7, like animals we don't need to mate all the time. You kinda make it sound like as humans don't have the intelligence or mental capability to control their sexual urges when we do. Anyways as i was saying previously it all differs from person to person. Some men are happy having sex once or twice a week, then their are those who want it daily. It can be the same for women also. And I don't know how to describe a "genuine need" I feel like it's pretty self explanatory. Perhaps after some time of abstinence when you start feel a intense struggle physically and mentally. For my partner this was around the 7-10 day mark. It's about the same for me.


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## Rus47

Kitcat30 said:


> For my partner this was around the 7-10 day mark. It's about the same for me.


Sorry. Would be climbing walls at 5 day mark. Can’t do it. Thankfully not wife n my circus.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson

4 times a week is a minimum. Health and atypical mutual too busy schedules not withstanding. 

A lot of what guys put up with, and women too, depends on the ages, present season within your life phases, and common sense all rolled up. 

For example.
A young couple, going bed and the guy reaches out for hugs, passion, sex, and the W says quit, go to sleep, a young guy will become grumpy but suck it up and say ok. 
He'll be disgruntled, maybe a day or two, won't try again for a couple nights, yes it affects their daily life interaction, no sex and not surprisingly H is grumpy.
If the W is avoiding sex, and she guaranteed sees herself as the gatekeeper of sex, so she gets what she wants.

An older guy, a grown man in a longer M, recognizes the pattern, it's getting old, and after too much of finally gets no she is not the gatekeeper, doesn't have final say, and will openly get up and if he wants handle things however he wants. 

Her choice. His choice. In the ever present today's mantra of equality of both parties, W finds herself having lost what control she thought she had and it starts to freak her out.

Then the posts by W of he wants too much sex what's wrong with H start to fly. W wants to rationalize H is bad, and she's the perfect W.

Conversely H posts fly that W isn't sexual enough, frequency is way low 

Now REVERSE THE ROLES yes this goes BOTH ways. Remember it's all about equality and both Spouses can be in either role. 

Now women are always saying they should be treated equal and imo should. Some women however want it only to be the Hs fault, the W want to maintain that gatekeeper control but in can't logically support that position because she insists equality. Yet equality comes with responsibility. 

And before someone says that's misogynist speak, it's not. Both spouses can be in either role and that's equality. 

The problems lie in most posts here about sexual frequency and solutions is we hear only one side of every trouble in a sex based topic.

Best for all couples to address head on, and early.


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## Longtime Hubby

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> 4 times a week is a minimum. Health and atypical mutual too busy schedules not withstanding.
> 
> A lot of what guys put up with, and women too, depends on the ages, present season within your life phases, and common sense all rolled up.
> 
> For example.
> A young couple, going bed and the guy reaches out for hugs, passion, sex, and the W says quit, go to sleep, a young guy will become grumpy but suck it up and say ok.
> He'll be disgruntled, maybe a day or two, won't try again for a couple nights, yes it affects their daily life interaction, no sex and not surprisingly H is grumpy.
> If the W is avoiding sex, and she guaranteed sees herself as the gatekeeper of sex, so she gets what she wants.
> 
> An older guy, a grown man in a longer M, recognizes the pattern, it's getting old, and after too much of finally gets no she is not the gatekeeper, doesn't have final say, and will openly get up and if he wants handle things however he wants.
> 
> Her choice. His choice. In the ever present today's mantra of equality of both parties, W finds herself having lost what control she thought she had and it starts to freak her out.
> 
> Then the posts by W of he wants too much sex what's wrong with H start to fly. W wants to rationalize H is bad, and she's the perfect W.
> 
> Conversely H posts fly that W isn't sexual enough, frequency is way low
> 
> Now REVERSE THE ROLES yes this goes BOTH ways. Remember it's all about equality and both Spouses can be in either role.
> 
> Now women are always saying they should be treated equal and imo should. Some women however want it only to be the Hs fault, the W want to maintain that gatekeeper control but in can't logically support that position because she insists equality. Yet equality comes with responsibility.
> 
> And before someone says that's misogynist speak, it's not. Both spouses can be in either role and that's equality.
> 
> The problems lie in most posts here about sexual frequency and solutions is we hear only one side of every trouble in a sex based topic.
> 
> Best for all couples to address head on, and early.


It’s all about control. Wives will deny that, but it is true.


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## BigDaddyNY

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> *Best for all couples to address head on, and early.*


This is so important IMO. The longer something is left to fester the worse it gets and the harder it is to come back from. I hate to see it when someone comes on here and their issues have been going on for years and they think there will be a quick and easy fix. If you go too long it becomes unfixable.


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## BigDaddyNY

Longtime Hubby said:


> It’s all about control. Wives will deny that, but it is true.


Thankfully I've never experienced that with my wife. If she is physically capable and isn't just totally exhausted she will likely be ready to get intimate. If not she doesn't care if I masturbate. Doesn't even care if I do it in bed right next to her, so long as I don't wake her up, lol. She doesn't seem to have any interest in controlling my body.


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## Longtime Hubby

BigDaddyNY said:


> Thankfully I've never experienced that with my wife. If she is physically capable and isn't just totally exhausted she will likely be ready to get intimate. If not she doesn't care if I masturbate. Doesn't even care if I do it in bed right next to her, so long as I don't wake her up, lol. She doesn't seem to have any interest in controlling my body.


Can’t say the same here.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson

Longtime Hubby said:


> It’s all about control. Wives will deny that, but it is true.


Very, very true. And at times when Ws sense they've lost that control, they come face to face with reality and it unnerves them. 

Now again, this isn't misogynistic, both spouses can play either role. Remember this is all about equality. NOT selective equality.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson

BigDaddyNY said:


> Thankfully I've never experienced that with my wife. If she is physically capable and isn't just totally exhausted she will likely be ready to get intimate. If not she doesn't care if I masturbate. Doesn't even care if I do it in bed right next to her, so long as I don't wake her up, lol. She doesn't seem to have any interest in controlling my body.


A damn great approach and solution. In fact the only solution without going outside the M, and one SHOULDN'T do that.

You and I are very similar in our solutions.


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## BigDaddyNY

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> A damn great approach and solution. In fact the only solution without going outside the M, and one SHOULDN'T do that.
> 
> You and I are very similar in our solutions.


Yes, I should add, that she controls my body from the standpoint that it is only for her, of course. In fact she has joked with me by grabbing my junk and saying, "that's my toy, but I'll let you play with it." I love that woman, lol.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson

BigDaddyNY said:


> Yes, I should add, that she controls my body from the standpoint that it is only for her, of course. In fact she has joked with me by grabbing my junk and saying, "that's my toy, but I'll let you play with it." I love that woman, lol.


Man, you do gotta love that woman. You have a success story that is a good example to all. I mean that. I don't think many couples have reached that stage of mutual appreciation of each other yet that's a great goal to shoot for.

I'm not just blowing smoke here either. 

W and I have reached the same. What some may not realize is that all this isn't automatic zen but takes steady concern and respect for each other over time to achieve.


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## Divinely Favored

LisaDiane said:


> This is kind of a vague, convoluted question...if their sex life is so great, why would the wife cause a "drought"? And why would she shame him? I would think women with that attitude wouldn't want great and frequent couple sex...?
> 
> I think some women find strong male sexual desire gross and ridiculous. So when they see men needing to meet that physical urge, they view it as a weakness that he needs physical gratification. They think the way men need sexual release is pathetic and childish...they don't value male sexuality at all.


Most women think it is just a physical thing. To men like myself, it is not about the physical release. It is about the deep emotional bond reinforcement the physical act makes. The physical release is just a bonus if it happens, but it is not what I am after. My wife wants it to occur for me, just like I am happy giving her a ride on the multiple orgasm rollercoaster.

so for some guys with withholding wives, the masturbating kind of short circuits the urge and subsequent feelings of rejection by the wife. If for a day you don't think about sex with wife, you will not again be rejected by the one you love.


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## Divinely Favored

bobert said:


> Good ****ing lord. Some women  Must be quite the shock that men can actually think their wives are beautiful with cellulite, stretch marks, natural aging, etc. and without plastic surgery or fillers. But nah, we're all just lying about it.
> 
> My advice: Less money on fillers, more money on therapy.


EXACTLY! I thought my wife was gorgeous when she was pregnant and looked like she was having triplets. Couldn't keep my hands off her.

Same now, belly pooch and C-sec scar, stretch marks on breasts from past milk engorgement. Reminds me of her carrying our children and that she wanted to carry my child and all pregnancy hardship it entails. Makes me love her all the more


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## Divinely Favored

Philip P. said:


> Sometimes that’s where the sex toys are really useful. Im serious. I’m not going to reveal details except to say that I was tired just recently after a long day of installing drywall. It was the weekend and my wife decided to use a sex toy on me! It was wonderful and unexpected. We might not be into them at all but when my wife was single and in college she learned a little about toys from a roommate, who enjoyed using them (using them on herself, at least she says so lol). I suggested trying a couple of toys years later do my wife had some familiarity with them. As I’m getting older (now in my 50s), I think I’d prefer being intimate with my wife since I don’t have a lot of energy for masturbation.


Funny. Had an ex, F34, me m23 at the time, she had a toy box. I grabbed a vibrator and went to town on her. When I had blown her mind and she was laying there in a heap panting and saying "Where did you learn that!"
🤔😏No where, this is 1st time I have ever touched a vibe.


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## GoodDad5

Divinely Favored said:


> EXACTLY! I thought my wife was gorgeous when she was pregnant and looked like she was having triplets. Couldn't keep my hands off her.
> 
> Same now, belly pooch and C-sec scar, stretch marks on breasts from past milk engorgement. Reminds me of her carrying our children and that she wanted to carry my child and all pregnancy hardship it entails. Makes me love her all the more


I feel the same way about my wife and tell her often. She still has issues with her body image and I feel that’s part of the problem.


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## AVR1962

I feel if two people are open about the fact that they masturbate and they can actually let their partner know that this is somethin that takes the edge off or relieves tension until they can be together, each should be understanding. I think for women what is upsetting is that porn is involved and porn is seeking another woman to have a sexual experience with.


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## Bulfrog1987

oldshirt said:


> If he is having sex with other women, then she looses her control over his sex habits.
> 
> If he is spanking, then she just sees him as a loser that can't get a real woman or put in the effort to get with her.


I'm a different breed of woman then I guess. Well, I both agree and disagree. If a man is CHOOSING porn and masterbating over his wife when she is actually ready and willing, then yeah, losing my respect. Now on the flip side... My broken brain, likes the thought of my partner masterbating, OR maybe it's rather, getting to see him do it. Though I was never given that opportunity. I hope in the future, my next male suitor isn't so guarded.

But I don't necessarily see that act as making a man a loser.


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## Bulfrog1987

GoodDad5 said:


> I feel the same way about my wife and tell her often. She still has issues with her body image and I feel that’s part of the problem.


Be still my freaking heart dudes. I could only have wished this from mine. Whatever the case don't stop telling her and showing your affection over it all!


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## CharlieParker

Bulfrog1987 said:


> I hope in the future, my next male suitor isn't so guarded.


Letting your own guard down (at the same, perhaps on the opposite end of a couch) would be very helpful, if you get my drift 😉 

We did that very early on, because it was fun at time, but it was only later we realized it was also very beneficial to the relationship.


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## Longtime Hubby

We enjoy watching each other self-pleasure. Leads to mutual fun!


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## rainystorm

Before I tell you about my situation with my husband masturbating, I want to tell you how far he went. He got the Covid, I gave him our bedroom and helped him through this and after he got better, my daughter and I got sick with the covid, and he got very angry and started yelling at me when I wanted the bedroom, and I had to sleep on the sofa instead and wait till he left the room in the mornings so I could sleep on the bed. He had a secret. 

I never saw my husband masturbate, but I did find videos of him video taping himself masturbating while naked on the floor and then I found a website where he was uploading them to porn women, paying for their videos, and paying per minute to talk and see them in action. This is why he didn't want me in our bedroom. I didn't get angry about his masturbation although I thought it was disgusting seeing a man do that, but I got extremely freaked out and angry to know he was video taping himself doing that, uploading them on the internet, and giving them our money. Then I realized that my daughter borrows his phone sometimes and that made me wonder if he wanted her to see that. All hell broke loose in my home, and I slapped the yell out of him and was ready to either use a hammer or a bat loaded with nails on his ass. For a moment, I felt like I failed to protect my daughter because I don't know how long he's been doing this and if she actually saw something. We have been married for 30 years, and I never thought not once that this crap could be going on in my home, especially with a very young teen. He was getting up very early in the mornings to interact with these porn women, then used the days my daughter and I were out to masturbate and spend our money.

What did I do, first I made him pay me back the monies I know for sure he spent on those women and the videos, then I went to the bank and changed my account to one he doesn't have access to and transferred the rest of my money. He now has to pay all the bills on his own with his pension, so we are now on a strict budget because I refuse to take out any money from my account. He claims that we can't pay off the credit card quickly, so I suggested he finds a part time job or send the bank less money. I also took his computer, laptop, chromebook, locked my and my daughter's computers, and changed all the passwords of everything I took from him and put a key lock on the computer room. I now monitor what he's doing on any of these devices when he needs to use them. I don't want my daughter to accidentally see him masturbating in any of the rooms and interacting with porn people or anything of that nature. His excuse is that he was lonely, so I advised him to file for a divorce if he's that unhappy; he doesn't want that because we will have to split what we worked so hard to achieve in those 30 years of marriage. 

Although I lost respect for him years ago for cheating on me with his military co-worker and almost losing his job because of it, I never cheated on him because marriage is a commitment and that's serious to me. I recently removed my wedding ring because it has no meaning anymore. I'm happy with our nonrelation-ship because I'm very busy homeschooling my daughter, doing my art work that I get paid for and not to brag but I'm doing what I love doing. What does my husband do, well, he does chores real early in the mornings, then sits on the sofa eating and watching tv all day long until it's bed time. He never wants to do anything with my daughter and me but he wants us to sit with him all day long, I don't think so, not happening. He likes cooking and politics so I tried to encourage him to do a podcast or go online and find something productive, decent and fun to do, but he's not interested - I guess he just wants to masturbate and talk to porn women. Well, as long as he does the chores and pays the bills, I don't care what dirty crap he wants, as long as it's not in our home.


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## DownByTheRiver

I can only understand a woman caring about that if the man is watching porn. But I'm kind of know where it's coming from just because I'm an older generation. It never bothered me. Some religions think masturbation is immoral so I think it sort of stemmed from that and then got passed down.


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## DownByTheRiver

I would just add that if there are children in the house, certainly the men should not be sitting around in public with their hand down their pants.

And they should also not be a slob about it and, for example, jizz on the sofa.


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## Giroux

AVR1962 said:


> I think for women what is upsetting is that porn is involved and porn is seeking another woman to have a sexual experience with.


My wife knows I have a very high sex drive. I usually need it daily. She is busy with work and such. Plus, when I teenage son is with me (1 month with me, and 1 month with my ex), my wife is not comfortable having sex in our small place...

She has no problem with me watching porn for a few minutes ever day for that. I would much rather do something with her, personally - as I find porn rather boring. But, it is what it is.

I also do it for a physical reason - I have seen the urologist for my problem. If I don't ejaculate at least every couple of days, I get physical pain. I do have an internal cyst in the scrotum, and some other issues. It's been years since I talked to him about it - but if I remember right, he stated it sounds like the sperm is getting backed up. If I do that everyday, I don't get the pain. 

Thankfully, there is an easy solution for this 

I also need the release for stress as well. Thankfully, not all women flip out about porn (when it concerns their husband). I think that as long as it does not interfere with the relationship, what's the harm. I find it too difficult to do without something visual.


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## Bulfrog1987

rainystorm said:


> Before I tell you about my situation with my husband masturbating, I want to tell you how far he went. He got the Covid, I gave him our bedroom and helped him through this and after he got better, my daughter and I got sick with the covid, and he got very angry and started yelling at me when I wanted the bedroom, and I had to sleep on the sofa instead and wait till he left the room in the mornings so I could sleep on the bed. He had a secret.
> 
> I never saw my husband masturbate, but I did find videos of him video taping himself masturbating while naked on the floor and then I found a website where he was uploading them to porn women, paying for their videos, and paying per minute to talk and see them in action. This is why he didn't want me in our bedroom. I didn't get angry about his masturbation although I thought it was disgusting seeing a man do that, but I got extremely freaked out and angry to know he was video taping himself doing that, uploading them on the internet, and giving them our money. Then I realized that my daughter borrows his phone sometimes and that made me wonder if he wanted her to see that. All hell broke loose in my home, and I slapped the yell out of him and was ready to either use a hammer or a bat loaded with nails on his ass. For a moment, I felt like I failed to protect my daughter because I don't know how long he's been doing this and if she actually saw something. We have been married for 30 years, and I never thought not once that this crap could be going on in my home, especially with a very young teen. He was getting up very early in the mornings to interact with these porn women, then used the days my daughter and I were out to masturbate and spend our money.
> 
> What did I do, first I made him pay me back the monies I know for sure he spent on those women and the videos, then I went to the bank and changed my account to one he doesn't have access to and transferred the rest of my money. He now has to pay all the bills on his own with his pension, so we are now on a strict budget because I refuse to take out any money from my account. He claims that we can't pay off the credit card quickly, so I suggested he finds a part time job or send the bank less money. I also took his computer, laptop, chromebook, locked my and my daughter's computers, and changed all the passwords of everything I took from him and put a key lock on the computer room. I now monitor what he's doing on any of these devices when he needs to use them. I don't want my daughter to accidentally see him masturbating in any of the rooms and interacting with porn people or anything of that nature. His excuse is that he was lonely, so I advised him to file for a divorce if he's that unhappy; he doesn't want that because we will have to split what we worked so hard to achieve in those 30 years of marriage.
> 
> Although I lost respect for him years ago for cheating on me with his military co-worker and almost losing his job because of it, I never cheated on him because marriage is a commitment and that's serious to me. I recently removed my wedding ring because it has no meaning anymore. I'm happy with our nonrelation-ship because I'm very busy homeschooling my daughter, doing my art work that I get paid for and not to brag but I'm doing what I love doing. What does my husband do, well, he does chores real early in the mornings, then sits on the sofa eating and watching tv all day long until it's bed time. He never wants to do anything with my daughter and me but he wants us to sit with him all day long, I don't think so, not happening. He likes cooking and politics so I tried to encourage him to do a podcast or go online and find something productive, decent and fun to do, but he's not interested - I guess he just wants to masturbate and talk to porn women. Well, as long as he does the chores and pays the bills, I don't care what dirty crap he wants, as long as it's not in our home.


If you think he’s not doing what you think is dirty crap in your home, you’re delusional. 🤦🏼‍♀️ 

Sounds like he’s probably addicted to it. You’re dynamic is unhealthy. I’m all for staying married, all for it. Yet.. why don’t you confront him? Like really confront him versus hold him in contempt to see if there is anyway to make things better?


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## bakerlaurie48

Masturbation should be a way to relieve stress


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## BigDaddyNY

rainystorm said:


> Before I tell you about my situation with my husband masturbating, I want to tell you how far he went. He got the Covid, I gave him our bedroom and helped him through this and after he got better, my daughter and I got sick with the covid, and he got very angry and started yelling at me when I wanted the bedroom, and I had to sleep on the sofa instead and wait till he left the room in the mornings so I could sleep on the bed. He had a secret.
> 
> I never saw my husband masturbate, but I did find videos of him video taping himself masturbating while naked on the floor and then I found a website where he was uploading them to porn women, paying for their videos, and paying per minute to talk and see them in action. This is why he didn't want me in our bedroom. I didn't get angry about his masturbation although I thought it was disgusting seeing a man do that, but I got extremely freaked out and angry to know he was video taping himself doing that, uploading them on the internet, and giving them our money. Then I realized that my daughter borrows his phone sometimes and that made me wonder if he wanted her to see that. All hell broke loose in my home, and I slapped the yell out of him and was ready to either use a hammer or a bat loaded with nails on his ass. For a moment, I felt like I failed to protect my daughter because I don't know how long he's been doing this and if she actually saw something. We have been married for 30 years, and I never thought not once that this crap could be going on in my home, especially with a very young teen. He was getting up very early in the mornings to interact with these porn women, then used the days my daughter and I were out to masturbate and spend our money.
> 
> What did I do, first I made him pay me back the monies I know for sure he spent on those women and the videos, then I went to the bank and changed my account to one he doesn't have access to and transferred the rest of my money. He now has to pay all the bills on his own with his pension, so we are now on a strict budget because I refuse to take out any money from my account. He claims that we can't pay off the credit card quickly, so I suggested he finds a part time job or send the bank less money. I also took his computer, laptop, chromebook, locked my and my daughter's computers, and changed all the passwords of everything I took from him and put a key lock on the computer room. I now monitor what he's doing on any of these devices when he needs to use them. I don't want my daughter to accidentally see him masturbating in any of the rooms and interacting with porn people or anything of that nature. His excuse is that he was lonely, so I advised him to file for a divorce if he's that unhappy; he doesn't want that because we will have to split what we worked so hard to achieve in those 30 years of marriage.
> 
> Although I lost respect for him years ago for cheating on me with his military co-worker and almost losing his job because of it, I never cheated on him because marriage is a commitment and that's serious to me. I recently removed my wedding ring because it has no meaning anymore. I'm happy with our nonrelation-ship because I'm very busy homeschooling my daughter, doing my art work that I get paid for and not to brag but I'm doing what I love doing. What does my husband do, well, he does chores real early in the mornings, then sits on the sofa eating and watching tv all day long until it's bed time. He never wants to do anything with my daughter and me but he wants us to sit with him all day long, I don't think so, not happening. He likes cooking and politics so I tried to encourage him to do a podcast or go online and find something productive, decent and fun to do, but he's not interested - I guess he just wants to masturbate and talk to porn women. Well, as long as he does the chores and pays the bills, I don't care what dirty crap he wants, as long as it's not in our home.


You sound like his mommy not his wife. You took away his allowance and locked up his toys. Why not kick him to the curb if he is such a piece of degenerate crap in your eyes? How old is your daughter, BTW?


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