# Fire is gone but I'm conflicted about where we're going



## ewazomed (Apr 20, 2018)

My wife and I have known each other for 15 years: Friends for 3 years, dated for 6, and married for 6 years. We have an four year old boy. We've been intimate for only a few times this year, and nearly none in the previous years.

When we first met, we tried to jump on each other every chance we could get. The fires of Ragnarok exploded around us daily. By the time honeymoon was over, however, we were down to twice a month during ovulation. After she got pregnant, we would not have sex for 3 more years. Our marriage was otherwise typical, with the occasional problems, but never violence or drug abuse.

We have been seeing a therapist for the past half-year and our relationship had greatly improved. We don't yell or scream at each other anymore, we pay more attention to each other's feelings, we are more supportive of each other. We go out dates and have more private time. We tried being intimate again. While I feel closer to her than ever, as a friend, I still feel no physical attraction to her. Even with cialis, its difficult to get erect and it rarely stays erect long enough for anything to happen. Our intimacy is thus limited to lots of foreplay and attempted penetration like a wet noodle.

We've had long talks about this, and she said she's content to be to have intimacy in foreplay without penetration. That my low libido is not a problem for her. 

But I feel deeply empty. I still get spontaneous erections. If I bump into a cute friend or colleague, the mountains down under spring back to the high school days. But as soon as my spouse comes in, I feel a drab of grey pull over me.

My spouse is warm, caring, compassionate, loving, and selfless person and anyone would be lucky to have her as a wife. These days, however, I feel more and more certain that all the therapists, exercises, and habit changes aren't going to bring back the sexual energy I crave. I feel like divorce is the only answer. 

A few close friends have commented that it seemed like I was already living the life of a divorced dad. A few colleagues even asked me privately if I had divorced already. I feel like my unhappiness is seeping into everything I do. 

During our therapy sessions, I found out that my wife felt the same way a few years ago. Lately, she told me how glad she was that she stuck by me and how great our relationship had become. 

I feel like I'm living the cliche of a man in his mid-life crisis trading in his caring wife for a "younger model" but that's where I think my heart wants to go. I feel guilty and selfish for feeling this way, and I'm sure I'll be shunned by our mutual friends for doing so, but I also feel like continuing to live this life and have will drive me insane. What am I to do?


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Have you had your testosterone levels checked? You might want to do that before you throw away your marriage. 

Also, you say that you have been in therapy. Have you two seen a sex therapist?


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## BluesPower (Mar 27, 2018)

ewazomed said:


> My wife and I have known each other for 15 years: Friends for 3 years, dated for 6, and married for 6 years. We have an four year old boy. We've been intimate for only a few times this year, and nearly none in the previous years.
> 
> When we first met, we tried to jump on each other every chance we could get. The fires of Ragnarok exploded around us daily. By the time honeymoon was over, however, we were down to twice a month during ovulation. After she got pregnant, we would not have sex for 3 more years. Our marriage was otherwise typical, with the occasional problems, but never violence or drug abuse.
> 
> ...


Wow, I am not even sure what I should say. I am sorry that you feel this way, and I totally understand how you got here. 

While I have never Not had a sex drive with any woman, there have been those few that I was not really attracted to, I don't even know why I had sex with them, and I felt horrible afterwards. 

I generally don't say try in these situations, but is there just no way to get any attraction to your wife back? I seems like you have tried everything. 

I guess sometimes that so much damage has been done in a relationship that there really is no way to get the fire back. You can be friends I guess, but in the long run it may be a little cruel to her. I she sexual at all, and you just can't get there again? 

If all of that is true, it would actually be a kindness to her and yourself to just rip the band aid off and file for divorce. 

It will suck, but think of it like this, you don't hate her, you are just not sexually attracted to her. So would it not be better for both of you to split and both find someone that you can have a healthy sexual and a healthy romantic relationship with? 

Having said that, be careful with the young ones though. My experience is that if they are too young they are just more trouble than they are worth. I am 53 and my GF is 60. She is beautiful, sexy, loving and all of the other good attributes, but above all, she is not crazy. 

Just beware that there is a lot of crazy out there, esp if they are too young...


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## SentHereForAReason (Oct 25, 2017)

ewazomed said:


> My wife and I have known each other for 15 years: Friends for 3 years, dated for 6, and married for 6 years. We have an four year old boy. We've been intimate for only a few times this year, and nearly none in the previous years.
> 
> When we first met, we tried to jump on each other every chance we could get. The fires of Ragnarok exploded around us daily. By the time honeymoon was over, however, we were down to twice a month during ovulation. After she got pregnant, we would not have sex for 3 more years. Our marriage was otherwise typical, with the occasional problems, but never violence or drug abuse.
> 
> ...


What you are feeling (in bold) is honestly what I see here. I could be wrong. With some of these statements it reminds me of someone that is looking for an excuse to have an out or an affair and trying to justify it but on that note, I give you great credit for pointing out the good in her outweighs the bad but it seems what's bad in this situation is carrying more weight than the rest.

I could also be wrong but I get the feeling there is actually a silver bullet here. This is not really a grey area if you have trouble getting it up with her. Seems like most guys I know that would like to commence with other women still could easily get it up for their wife as well out of their pure selfish enjoyment. There's got to be a deep rooted psychological issue here that we are all missing, that's just my guess.

It's just me but if my wife were all of those things you say she is and the issue was just me not being able to pitch a tent with her, I would move heaven and earth to get that one thing fixed to fill in the hole of an otherwise happy marriage with kids involved. Trust me, getting that resolved or at least making one Hell of an effort to do so, see a sex therapist, give it more time and figure out why the Hell you can't get hard with her is going to be a lot less painful than what ifs down the road. Unless I'm missing something it seems like you have a good wife aside from one thing and the major difference between this and so many other stories on here, it doesn't seem like she is denying you, rather, she is ready and willing but something else is amiss.


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## Elizabeth001 (May 18, 2015)

Cialis doesn’t work for some people and some situations. Try Viagra. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Steve2.0 (Dec 11, 2017)

Do you masturbate alot?
I am going to assume the answer is "yes, with porn" and suggest you try to go 1 week without release or porn and see if your wife can get your hard


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## ewazomed (Apr 20, 2018)

EleGirl said:


> Have you had your testosterone levels checked? You might want to do that before you throw away your marriage.
> 
> Also, you say that you have been in therapy. Have you two seen a sex therapist?


Fortunately, my testosterone and thyroid tests both came back normal, so it is not these issues.



Elizabeth001 said:


> Cialis doesn’t work for some people and some situations. Try Viagra.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Thank you for the suggestion. I will give that try. Hopefully the headaches are better with Viagra.



Steve2.0 said:


> Do you masturbate alot?
> I am going to assume the answer is "yes, with porn" and suggest you try to go 1 week without release or porn and see if your wife can get your hard


 Yes, that was one of the problems the therapist identified. And stopping masturbation was far harder than I expected. Maybe I'm weak willed. I gradually cut down over the last year and now do it maybe once a month or so. I definitely had the "death-grip" syndrome but that seems to go away fairly quickly. Touching myself doesn't even feel that good anymore. Since the change, I'm getting far more random erections, on a daily basis, even in inappropriate times. Just not with my spouse...

If anything, I think stopping masturbation had made our marriage worse. I used to be okay with our asexual relationship. Now, every now and then, I feel this pressure, drive, sexual urge. It comes and goes from time to time, but it comes directed towards my spouse. I feel uncomfortable and uneasy whenever we are physically close.


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## ewazomed (Apr 20, 2018)

BluesPower said:


> Wow, I am not even sure what I should say. I am sorry that you feel this way, and I totally understand how you got here.
> 
> While I have never Not had a sex drive with any woman, there have been those few that I was not really attracted to, I don't even know why I had sex with them, and I felt horrible afterwards.
> 
> ...


Thank you for your understanding and reply. I'm having a lot of trouble working out whether we will come out better on one side of the fence or the other. I feel that I'm not wise enough to work this out on my own. I'm glad to hear you're doing great.


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## ewazomed (Apr 20, 2018)

stillfightingforus said:


> What you are feeling (in bold) is honestly what I see here. I could be wrong. With some of these statements it reminds me of someone that is looking for an excuse to have an out or an affair and trying to justify it but on that note, I give you great credit for pointing out the good in her outweighs the bad but it seems what's bad in this situation is carrying more weight than the rest.
> 
> I could also be wrong but I get the feeling there is actually a silver bullet here. This is not really a grey area if you have trouble getting it up with her. Seems like most guys I know that would like to commence with other women still could easily get it up for their wife as well out of their pure selfish enjoyment. There's got to be a deep rooted psychological issue here that we are all missing, that's just my guess.
> 
> It's just me but if my wife were all of those things you say she is and the issue was just me not being able to pitch a tent with her, I would move heaven and earth to get that one thing fixed to fill in the hole of an otherwise happy marriage with kids involved. Trust me, getting that resolved or at least making one Hell of an effort to do so, see a sex therapist, give it more time and figure out why the Hell you can't get hard with her is going to be a lot less painful than what ifs down the road. Unless I'm missing something it seems like you have a good wife aside from one thing and the major difference between this and so many other stories on here, it doesn't seem like she is denying you, rather, she is ready and willing but something else is amiss.


I fee; that you're essentially right here. We've had dozens of sessions, and from what I can piece together, our therapist feels our relationship probably be difficult because I'm immature and selfish. He's probably right too. Our sessions have helped me to be a better person, be more nurturing, and be more loving. My wife commented at far I've come since last year and how much happier she feels compared to a few years ago. And I feel the opposite.

We haven't tried a sex therapist yet, but we are reading through some books on the topic recommended by our therapist. It hasn't seemed to make any difference yet. Maybe I'm weird in this area, but I feel like I can't enjoy sex without feeling that spark. The "fake it until you make it" is making me feel uncomfortable each time.


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## BioFury (Jul 9, 2015)

ewazomed said:


> My wife and I have known each other for 15 years: Friends for 3 years, dated for 6, and married for 6 years. We have an four year old boy. We've been intimate for only a few times this year, and nearly none in the previous years.
> 
> When we first met, we tried to jump on each other every chance we could get. The fires of Ragnarok exploded around us daily. By the time honeymoon was over, however, we were down to twice a month during ovulation. After she got pregnant, we would not have sex for 3 more years. Our marriage was otherwise typical, with the occasional problems, but never violence or drug abuse.
> 
> ...


Is your wife in shape? Or has she let herself go?


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## ewazomed (Apr 20, 2018)

BioFury said:


> Is your wife in shape? Or has she let herself go?


She's aged more gracefully than most, but her priority is on our child. She essentially has not exercised or wore makeup since we got married, and haven't lost the baby weight yet. She's gone from 120lb to 150lb and kept around the same bodyfat %. I've kept the same weight but lost lost the 6-pack a lot of muscle (8% to 16% BF). I consider that an equal wash I guess.

I still regularly go on runs, but now by myself, as she she refuses to run, bike, rollerblade, or swim as we used to. 

On a side note, we don't watch TV, or movies, or do anything else together anymore as we have very different interests. Our only mutual connection is a deep respect for each other and our love of our child. We've tried new hobbies like dancing, painting, karaoke, hiking, but nothing seems to stick.


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## BioFury (Jul 9, 2015)

ewazomed said:


> She's aged more gracefully than most, but her priority is on our child. She essentially has not exercised or wore makeup since we got married, and haven't lost the baby weight yet. She's gone from 120lb to 150lb and kept around the same bodyfat %. I've kept the same weight but lost lost the 6-pack a lot of muscle (8% to 16% BF). I consider that an equal wash I guess.
> 
> I still regularly go on runs, but now by myself, as she she refuses to run, bike, rollerblade, or swim as we used to.
> 
> On a side note, we don't watch TV, or movies, or do anything else together anymore as we have very different interests. Our only mutual connection is a deep respect for each other and our love of our child. We've tried new hobbies like dancing, painting, karaoke, hiking, but nothing seems to stick.


So do you not find her physically attractive? Or do you?


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)




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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

The fire went out....

The thrill is gone.

You, she need a new thrill. Let this sham of a marriage go. Most of the blame is in your lap.

In your lap, not hers. 

She is willing, your willy is not.


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## Handy (Jul 23, 2017)

When my W was exercising her body seemed different to me sexually. I can feel different about sexual interest just based on touch if a woman wants to share a friendly hug.

When I was a teenager a girl was trying to get her boyfriend jealous so she put my arm around her waist/hip. I got an instant boner and I had no sexual interest in this friend until then.

I will suggest your erections might improve if you could feel some muscle tone in your wife's body when you touch her. Some men are visually turned on, not me so much but touch, BOING!

Sample size of one (what does it for me) so maybe it is possible for you. I read that this is true for women too. Looking at a toned guy gets some women's engines started but the touch gets their motor racing.

Another thing, do you feel like your W is excited to have sex with you? If you sense she isn't all that excited about having sex with you, that too can kill a boner. With your history of being rejected for many years the former rejections are still a deep issue even if you and her say lets put the past behind us. Feeling anxiety around sexual issues isn't all that different than some betrayed spouse might feel once the affair ends. It is difficult for some people to get over the betrayal and in cases like yours, the past rejections.

Even if you were not rejected sexually, feeling guilty about imposing anything sexual on your W will have lasting affects on future sexual encounters. My W wouldn't totally reject me sexually but I had a deep feeling she would go for the attention and skip the physical part. She even said it was too bad the attention I gave her lead to sex. I tried to do the attention part without the sex part but even then a guy can only go into the candy store with buying something once in a while. Now, me knowing she wants the attention but dislikes the sex has me avoiding her as much as I feel it won't impact me beyond a certain point. Now i don't see any sexual feelings coming back. I read this happens with men and women. It is called "too little, too late."


But first try to get your W to tone up her body. Sexual attraction is biological, visual, emotional, and touch and maybe has some more components, so try a few more things. It might get your juices flowing enough to be sexually satisfied again. Evaluate why a new woman (age-beauty-attraction-physically toned-etc) would or might bring back erections and try some of those things with your W.


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## Townes (Jan 31, 2018)

In all this therapy have you told her clearly you're not physically attracted to her, or have you just danced around the issue? The decision is partly hers too once she really knows how you feel. If you haven't been honest with her though, you've denied her the opportunity to make an informed decision.


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

How much porn do you watch?

Never mind I saw your answer. 

Lack of effort can be a big turn off. Seems like your wife doesn't care if you are attracted to her or not. That's not good as well. I mean she shouldn't have to be a super model but she should at least try to give you some common signals that come with courtship and matting. That shouldn't stop because you are married. 

In the same respect do you give her signals? Take her out, do fun things. Your life can't all be about the kids. 

Also if she is reasonably overwhelmed, you need to step up and help her, if you can't then get her some help. A lot of times Mom's are just exhausted.


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## ewazomed (Apr 20, 2018)

BioFury said:


> So do you not find her physically attractive? Or do you?


I do not, but others do.


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## BioFury (Jul 9, 2015)

ewazomed said:


> I do not, but others do.


Meaning, she's in shape and conventionally attractive?


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## Laurentium (May 21, 2017)

Both of you getting in better shape certainly couldn't hurt. 

It sounds a bit like your wife doesn't want this problem fixed? That would explain a lot.

*Does she know you're contemplating ending the marriage?*



ewazomed said:


> Now, every now and then, I feel this pressure, drive, sexual urge. It comes and goes from time to time, but it comes directed towards my spouse. I feel uncomfortable and uneasy whenever we are physically close.


I'm not surprised. I'm wondering if there is also a factor, with one or both of you, of sexuality being incompatible with parenthood. That sometimes happens.



> We've had dozens of sessions, and from what I can piece together, our therapist feels our relationship probably be difficult because I'm immature and selfish. He's probably right too. Our sessions have helped me to be a better person, be more nurturing, and be more loving. My wife commented at far I've come since last year and how much happier she feels compared to a few years ago. And I feel the opposite.


It sounds as if the therapy has made you "nicer", and may have contributed to the "friend-zoning" of the relationship. Are you continuing with the therapy, and have you discussed the goals of it, and this problem, with the therapist?


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## ewazomed (Apr 20, 2018)

Handy said:


> When my W was exercising her body seemed different to me sexually. I can feel different about sexual interest just based on touch if a woman wants to share a friendly hug.
> 
> When I was a teenager a girl was trying to get her boyfriend jealous so she put my arm around her waist/hip. I got an instant boner and I had no sexual interest in this friend until then.
> 
> ...


I think you are right about the smell difference. Raising our boy is especially tiring for her and I understand why she isn't interested in any exercise. It's just not a priority for her. 

Thank you for bringing up the excitement. We talked to the therapist talked this and I had thought about it until now. There were time when I would chase her, years ago, and things would look like it would get intimate. Just when we got close to the sheets, we would get into an argument over trivial things. Things that we never argue about any other time. There were times when we got naked, were about to get intimate, and she would say "I don't feel you're romantic enough" and leaves. We talked about this in counseling and she isn't like that anymore. 

But the fact that she made no attempt to repair our sexual chemistry until she wanted to have another child, and she only tries during ovulation makes me feel undesirable to her. In the few times we've been intimate since, she would reject positions I enjoyed and dictated which positions she liked. Even thought it's better than before, I think maybe we can still improve. I think I'll bring this up in our next session as it might be another stumbling block we need to get over. Maybe each of us are feeling undesired and its feeding back in a loop of resentment.


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## ewazomed (Apr 20, 2018)

Townes said:


> In all this therapy have you told her clearly you're not physically attracted to her, or have you just danced around the issue? The decision is partly hers too once she really knows how you feel. If you haven't been honest with her though, you've denied her the opportunity to make an informed decision.


I feel like there's some things you cannot take back once it's out there, so I've never said it, ever. I have talked about how great it will be if we spend time together, being active like we used to. I talked about how much more energy and sexier we would get if we were to hit the gym. 

I feel that making demands... "go to the gym or else" would be too cruel. Maybe I'm being too shortsighted. I'm worried it'll just cause resentment and shift problems to other areas.


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## ewazomed (Apr 20, 2018)

sokillme said:


> How much porn do you watch?
> 
> Never mind I saw your answer.
> 
> ...


Thank you for your comments. I think that's great advice.... If I were to spend more time with kids, she would have more time to gym or doll up. She is exhausted. 

We've been in a cycle of wanting to avoid each other, so we work harder, and we're too tired from work, and we want to see each other less, and it feeds back into loop.

In the rare times where I took care of the kid for the day, she typically goes to the spa or out drinking/dinning with her friends. She doesn't seem to show any interest in wanting to be sexy. She never had, and it's just not her style. Maybe I need to gently push her harder here. (She has a spa session once a week, but never gym sessions.)


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## ewazomed (Apr 20, 2018)

BioFury said:


> Meaning, she's in shape and conventionally attractive?


Many of our friends are incredibly attractive. She was attractive even in our group, but more average now. I remember when we went on our first vacation many years ago and the whole room turned as soon as we walked in. I felt so proud that she was on my arms, and she only wanted me. Now, we just blend into the background. She is still conventionally attractive compared to a typical person our age.


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## ewazomed (Apr 20, 2018)

Laurentium said:


> Both of you getting in better shape certainly couldn't hurt.
> 
> It sounds a bit like your wife doesn't want this problem fixed? That would explain a lot.
> 
> ...


She seems content with how things are and doesn't have the energy to do anything else.

The fact that we are still seeing our therapist shows she knows our marriage is at stake, but at no point did any of us ever mention the "D" word. We are still seeing the therapist.

I'm not sure I understand the "friend-zoning"?


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## Laurentium (May 21, 2017)

ewazomed said:


> I'm not sure I understand the "friend-zoning"?


I mean the change in the marriage from sexual excitement to "friends". 

Have you made it clear, in any way, in the therapy, how unhappy you are? If not, you're kind of wasting your time and money?


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

ewazomed said:


> Many of our friends are incredibly attractive. She was attractive even in our group, but more average now. I remember when we went on our first vacation many years ago and the whole room turned as soon as we walked in. I felt so proud that she was on my arms, and she only wanted me. Now, we just blend into the background. She is still conventionally attractive compared to a typical person our age.


Some of this is on you though. You need to build her up. She probably is down on herself. It's your job as her man to make her feel sexy. Women generally respond to being pursued and desired. 

I think you guys need a reset. You should tell her this in a nice way. How hot you think she is when she is trying, but ask her why she isn't trying. But you should also admit your roll in not helping. Apologize but ask her to try for you again cause you miss that side of her. But then you have to step up so she is not tired.

Besides that what are you doing man? Your wife should never be exhausted if you are not. This is your marriage man, you need to manage that ****. Take charge, lead. Get **** done for her and she will be attracted to you.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

ewazomed said:


> My wife and I have known each other for 15 years: Friends for 3 years, dated for 6, and married for 6 years. We have an four year old boy. We've been intimate for only a few times this year, and nearly none in the previous years.
> 
> When we first met, we tried to jump on each other every chance we could get. The fires of Ragnarok exploded around us daily. By the time honeymoon was over, however, we were down to twice a month during ovulation. After she got pregnant, we would not have sex for 3 more years. Our marriage was otherwise typical, with the occasional problems, but never violence or drug abuse.
> 
> ...


So what will happen when you get bored with the next one and cant get an erection again? Leave her for another lady? Get divorced again? Mess you childs life up again? Hurt more people??

Good grief man. You have a wife and small child. You have responsibilities. You made lifelong promises. 

If you are a porn user then stop now. Porn can make men dissatisfied with their wives/partners because they are always comparing them. It can cause what you have now, when a man can no longer get an erection or have sex in a normal relationship. After a few months you will notice the difference. 

Get medical advise. Its you who is causing this not her.


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## BioFury (Jul 9, 2015)

ewazomed said:


> Many of our friends are incredibly attractive. She was attractive even in our group, but more average now. I remember when we went on our first vacation many years ago and the whole room turned as soon as we walked in. I felt so proud that she was on my arms, and she only wanted me. Now, we just blend into the background. She is still conventionally attractive compared to a typical person our age.


I don't know what "conventionally attractive compared to a typical person our age" means. What I'm asking, is whether you would be attracted to her if you passed her on the street, or not. Otherwise said, if her physical appearance is the problem, or whether she's fine, and it's an emotional problem.


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## Townes (Jan 31, 2018)

ewazomed said:


> I feel like there's some things you cannot take back once it's out there, so I've never said it, ever. I have talked about how great it will be if we spend time together, being active like we used to. I talked about how much more energy and sexier we would get if we were to hit the gym.
> 
> I feel that making demands... "go to the gym or else" would be too cruel. Maybe I'm being too shortsighted. I'm worried it'll just cause resentment and shift problems to other areas.


Would you want to know if your wife felt that way and was thinking about leaving you over it? Do you feel like you would have a right to know?


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## ewazomed (Apr 20, 2018)

Laurentium said:


> I mean the change in the marriage from sexual excitement to "friends".
> 
> Have you made it clear, in any way, in the therapy, how unhappy you are? If not, you're kind of wasting your time and money?


Yes, we both talked about our lack of intimacy with the therapist. I've expressed to her how much happier I would be if our desire for each other was still there, but not explicitly stated that D is on the line.


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## ewazomed (Apr 20, 2018)

sokillme said:


> Some of this is on you though. You need to build her up. She probably is down on herself. It's your job as her man to make her feel sexy. Women generally respond to being pursued and desired.
> 
> I think you guys need a reset. You should tell her this in a nice way. How hot you think she is when she is trying, but ask her why she isn't trying. But you should also admit your roll in not helping. Apologize but ask her to try for you again cause you miss that side of her. But then you have to step up so she is not tired.
> 
> Besides that what are you doing man? Your wife should never be exhausted if you are not. This is your marriage man, you need to manage that ****. Take charge, lead. Get **** done for her and she will be attracted to you.


Making her feel sexy is probably not a strength of mine. While encouraging her to be active with me was not yet successful, maybe telling her how sexy she is when she tries will help. Getting that side to come out might be difficult as was never the type to actively try to be sexy. She was always a sweatshirt and no-makeup kind of gal.

As for being tired... we're both fairly exhausted. She works 40hrs/week and looks after our kid more. I work 80hrs/wk and look after him less. She sleeps 8 hours a day. I sleep 4 hours a day. I dont think I can increase the quantity, but we have tried to increase the quality with help from our parents.


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## ewazomed (Apr 20, 2018)

Diana7 said:


> So what will happen when you get bored with the next one and cant get an erection again? Leave her for another lady? Get divorced again? Mess you childs life up again? Hurt more people??
> 
> Good grief man. You have a wife and small child. You have responsibilities. You made lifelong promises.
> 
> ...


Both of our parents talked about how important marrying someone you are emotionally compatible with. Someone who shares the same financial views with, who are caring and respectful. Sexual attraction was not something to be considered. Both of our parents are in sexless marriages themselves and see it as the norm. They are all unhappy in their marriages but does not think that is a problem. That's why our weaning desire before marriage didn't trigger any warning flags. We both came from a culture of arranged marriages.

To answer your question, If I were to get married again, I would make sure sexual compatibility and romantic desire is there as well. And if it's the case that I'm this way with everyone, then perhaps I'll never get married again.


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## ewazomed (Apr 20, 2018)

BioFury said:


> I don't know what "conventionally attractive compared to a typical person our age" means. What I'm asking, is whether you would be attracted to her if you passed her on the street, or not. Otherwise said, if her physical appearance is the problem, or whether she's fine, and it's an emotional problem.


No, I would not be attracted to her if I passed her on the street. 

This question is so simple, and the written answer is so straight forward, but sat in front of the computer screen thinking for what felt like an eternity. If I were single, in a dry spell, drunk in a bar, and her doppelganger cornered me, I probably wouldn't say no. If I saw the same person on tinder, I would swipe no.


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## ewazomed (Apr 20, 2018)

Townes said:


> Would you want to know if your wife felt that way and was thinking about leaving you over it? Do you feel like you would have a right to know?


Of course, but she does not feel that way. If she says "you stink," I will take a shower and scrub with scented body scrub. I would spray some cologne and change into a fresh outfit. It would not make it to her threatening me with divorce. It I say the same to her, she ignores me.


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

ewazomed said:


> As for being tired... we're both fairly exhausted. She works 40hrs/week and looks after our kid more. I work 80hrs/wk and look after him less. She sleeps 8 hours a day. I sleep 4 hours a day. I dont think I can increase the quantity, but we have tried to increase the quality with help from our parents.


Maybe this is your problem. Any way you can change that, downsize, move somewhere cheaper?

Honestly not sure with that schedule even if you do leave her where are you going to find the time to find anyone else at this point. All your money is going to go to the kids too.


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

ewazomed said:


> Both of our parents talked about how important marrying someone you are emotionally compatible with. Someone who shares the same financial views with, who are caring and respectful. Sexual attraction was not something to be considered. Both of our parents are in sexless marriages themselves and see it as the norm. They are all unhappy in their marriages but does not think that is a problem. That's why our weaning desire before marriage didn't trigger any warning flags. We both came from a culture of arranged marriages.
> 
> To answer your question, If I were to get married again, I would make sure sexual compatibility and romantic desire is there as well. And if it's the case that I'm this way with everyone, then perhaps I'll never get married again.


I think you guys need to go see a sex therapist at least as a last ditch effort.


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

ewazomed said:


> No, I would not be attracted to her if I passed her on the street.
> 
> This question is so simple, and the written answer is so straight forward, but sat in front of the computer screen thinking for what felt like an eternity. If I were single, in a dry spell, drunk in a bar, and her doppelganger cornered me, I probably wouldn't say no. If I saw the same person on tinder, I would swipe no.


Ouch that's sad. Would you say it was always that way?


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## ewazomed (Apr 20, 2018)

sokillme said:


> Maybe this is your problem. Any way you can change that, downsize, move somewhere cheaper?
> 
> Honestly not sure with that schedule even if you do leave her where are you going to find the time to find anyone else at this point. All your money is going to go to the kids too.


I think that's a great suggestion, and it's part of the reason I'm here. I have to commit to my schedule a year in advance. Spousal support in our area is calculated based upon the average income during previous years, and any drop in income is deemed to be intentional under-employment to avoid spousal support. This effectively means if I cut back on hours, I cannot get a divorce in at least 3 years. My after tax income would literally not be enough to pay for spousal support and child support.


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## ewazomed (Apr 20, 2018)

sokillme said:


> I think you guys need to go see a sex therapist at least as a last ditch effort.


Thank you for your suggestions. I will look into sex therapy.



sokillme said:


> Ouch that's sad. Would you say it was always that way?


I think it's been that way since we've gotten married.


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## PreRaph (Jun 13, 2017)

OP, I understand your problem. Watching as much porn and masturbating to it, and then zeroing in on women that get your little man up and atom, you have gotten used to looking at your wife the same old way, day after day after day, and it doesn't arouse you anymore. And you're looking for arousal.

Your fantasizing has trapped you and now you can't get out of it. And I'm 100% sure your wife feels it. You have got to find ways to change the way you fantasize if you want to save your marriage. Because the fantasies you have now can be satisfied by an affair or two or three, but unless you are extremely lucky and find a woman that you are emotionally and intellectually compatible with, it won't last. 

Your wife is accepting the situation, perhaps because she's resigned herself to it, but have you ever thought of how she might respond if she were to experience you one day taking her somewhere, lusting over her and wanting to f--- the daylights out of her? You may find her a very different woman, one that you have ignored all this time.

PS What I'm saying OP, is that you do not know your wife as well as you may think, and strictly from a sexual viewpoint, you need to become open again to exploring her sexuality, her body, her pleasures, because those pleasures may turn you on, rather than focusing on your own. Every woman is a still a mystery no matter how long many times you have had her. There can be no greater pleasure than in rediscovering that mystery or discovering it for the first time if you've never felt it before. But a lot of that is up to you.


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## BioFury (Jul 9, 2015)

ewazomed said:


> No, I would not be attracted to her if I passed her on the street.
> 
> This question is so simple, and the written answer is so straight forward, but sat in front of the computer screen thinking for what felt like an eternity. If I were single, in a dry spell, drunk in a bar, and her doppelganger cornered me, I probably wouldn't say no. If I saw the same person on tinder, I would swipe no.


Well, then that's one of your problems. Perhaps some of the women here can give you advice on how to broach the subject of her losing weight.


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## ewazomed (Apr 20, 2018)

PreRaph said:


> OP, I understand your problem. Watching as much porn and masturbating to it, and then zeroing in on women that get your little man up and atom, you have gotten used to looking at your wife the same old way, day after day after day, and it doesn't arouse you anymore. And you're looking for arousal.
> 
> Your fantasizing has trapped you and now you can't get out of it. And I'm 100% sure your wife feels it. You have got to find ways to change the way you fantasize if you want to save your marriage. Because the fantasies you have now can be satisfied by an affair or two or three, but unless you are extremely lucky and find a woman that you are emotionally and intellectually compatible with, it won't last.
> 
> ...


Thank you for helping look at this from another perspective. The lusting after each other self-strengthening cycle certainly will be effective and goes along with our therapist's recommendation of "fake it until you make it" by each of us acting that way.


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## ewazomed (Apr 20, 2018)

BioFury said:


> Well, then that's one of your problems. Perhaps some of the women here can give you advice on how to broach the subject of her losing weight.


Delicately bringing it up is not my strength and I may have botched this part already. I mentioned how great it'll be if we were to set personal goals and motivate each other to achieve them. We talked about the possible things we could do again, and specific goals we could set. She said "you think I'm fat" and pretty much stopped talking to me. She's been spending the rest of the evening complaining to her (our) friends about me while I look after our kid.

I had a lot of time to think about the future, and imagining a world where we did lust after each other all the time. I couldn't shake the feeling that our marriage would still feel empty.

We are highly compatible in religion, spirituality, ambition, and finances. We are both strong type A driven personalities. We like to hang out with the same kind of people. But we have no shared hobbies or interests. The genres we each like bores the other. We cannot watch TV or movies without getting into fights or falling asleep, or both. We don't like the same books. We don't like the same activities on vacation. If we were not married, we would never spend time with each other. We are committed more to the idea of a lifelong monogamous marriage than to each other as a person. 

But then again, maybe the problem is the notion of what a marriage is supposed to look like that causes so much dissatisfaction. Maybe getting to "good-enough" is all one can reasonably hope for.


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