# My husband doesn't care when I cry.



## MrsFarris

My husband is verbally abusive and often makes me cry. When/if I do cry, he ignores me and sometimes even becomes angry. He says he loves me but how could he really care if seeing me in pain like that doesn't matter to him? He doesn't console me, try to make it better, or even acknowledge what is going on. It makes me feel so unimportant and invisible. Its to the point where if I feel like crying, I will leave or go somewhere where he cannot see or hear me because I cannot stand the way he acts towards it. I'm not emotionally unstable and rarely cried in other relationships or in life in general before him, but he just cuts at me so deep and has a special way of bringing me down. When we argue and I cry he sometimes tells me I am pathetic and suggests that I "go somewhere else" or get over it... sometimes going as far as to say things like "god are you on your period or something?" even though it is obvious that his words or actions are what upset me. He treats me so horrible but then after the fact he denies it and says he loves me and treats me good and all of that. Its a vicious cycle, it seems like the only time he is good to me is when I threaten to leave, then he is right back to his old ways. After dealing with this for over a year now I am hurting inside all the time and feel like I can't explain it to anyone... We are so far from family and friends, and he acts totally different when we around other people so no one notices it. I'm beginning to feel like I am not worth loving and its killing me inside. Does anyone else's husband do this to them?


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## Nekko

> After dealing with this for over a year now I am hurting inside all the time and feel like I can't explain it to anyone... We are so far from family and friends, and he acts totally different when we around other people so no one notices it. I'm beginning to feel like I am not worth loving and its killing me inside. Does anyone else's husband do this to them?


Yup. Me. My husband is angry...that's just the way he is. Once he gets angry at...basically anything...he feels the need to manifest that anger. I'm the closest thing around. Since he knows me, he knows what pushes my buttons. I've known this since I married him and I accept it (since I chose to be with him). It's just the way he is. 

He loved me so much exactly because i could understand how his anger came from somewhere else, how words he said when he was angry were just words and had nothing to do with what he really thought about me....hence everytime he started with 'insults' i'd just be bratty and laugh it off. He'd snap out of anger in 10 minutes and love me even more. He'd love me so much because I was the ONE woman who accepted him as he was and was strong enough to cope with him.

Obviously, in time, that and other problems in life made me feel weak. I started responding how you are now, by crying, feeling abandoned, thinking that if he loved me he should care and console me. But that went in contradiction with his beliefs (that people should take care of their own selves and be strong enough to NOT need that help). 

He too found me pathetic when i reacted like that. The more he said that the more I'd thought i'd loose him and he'd leave (ironic isn't it? ) ). So...at one point i figured, ok, but if he does leave, how will i take care of my own self if i feel so weak? And why do i have to rely on someone to feel confident? So...slowly but surely i started toughing up, smiling at his anger again, being bratty again. Slowly but surely he started being affectionate and loving again, and the arguements almost disapeared. He even went as far as to say that 'You really deserve being treated like a princess for how nice and supportive you've been of me lately and what you put up with from me'. 

This from the guy that would look at me crying and start yelling at me and being angry.  Why? Because I gained his respect back ...as a strong woman that can handle him. Back in the day when i'd let his behaviour so much i was weak and not what he fell in love with. What he was angry and dissapointed with was that i let myself be so affected by what he did and said. Get it? He kept doing it in an attempt to toughen me up. I was yelling for a hug and he was thinking that if he gives it to me he'd encourage me to feel week and helpless. 

Marriage is balance. The balance in yours went to hell. Figure out how you were when you were happy with him and go back to that attitude. In the end, we all need to be strong and take care of our own selves. It doesn't justify *his behaviour* but it's a choice you have to make and it will make YOU happy. And you, at the moment, are being way too affected by what he does or sais. I bet somewhere deep down you know that. This is if you think you can deal with his hard to handle nature and still want to be married. Otherwise, if you want a more docile and nice man, just bail out. Good luck.



recent_cloud said:


> one last point: when he acts differently, that is, politely, considerate, etc, when in company he's demonstrating he knows how to act politely and considerate, he just refuses to act that way with you


And that's because you don't have his respect...because you're being weak. Yes, it sounds sad to you maybe that you have to go through this alone, but once you understand that it's just feelings and words...why do you let feelings and words hurt you so much?


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## jessi

Hi, 
I think you have to decide that isn't how you want to live out your life, you could ask him if the 2 of you could go to counseling so you can work out why he needs to treat you so badly and what that behaviour does to you, maybe a little understanding through a 3rd person can show him what he is doing....make it clear that things have to change in order for it to work
good luck


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## Sven

It seems the 'threat' to move out gets a reaction from him. Maybe you should try that for a week or so.

I think we all hurt the ones we love the most. Don't know why...but I see it all of the time.

From a husband's point of view, I know it is very frustrating when my wife's reaction is to just break down and cry. I have stress too, but it seems when my wife is upset my role is to sit there and take her venting, but I shouldn't do that to her. During our marriage I've been very careful not to hurt her this way.


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## Nekko

> I think we all hurt the ones we love the most. Don't know why...but I see it all of the time.


Cause they are the closest to us, we know all their vulnerable points, so when we 'go insane' due to stress in life we say words that hit in all the right places and that we regret later.


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## Sven

True, Nekko. It sucks, but it's true.


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## AlexNY

MrsFarris said:


> My husband is verbally abusive and often makes me cry ... rarely cried in other relationships or in life in general before him, but he just cuts at me so deep and has a special way of bringing me down ... he treats me so horrible but then after the fact he denies it and says he loves me and treats me good and all of that ... Does anyone else's husband do this to them?


It is significant that you have not been in this kind of relationship before.

I have found two reasons why people brutalize others:

Intentionally, to accomplish something specific
Uncontrollably, because they are a mess

The yo-yo (Jekyll and Hyde) partner is a pretty common way to control other people. Is he trying to break you down, so that you will be like a piece of property? If you find that his behaviour has made you compliant, docile, and loving in a misguided attempt to prevent him from switching into "bad" mode, this may be what is happening.

The other option is that he simply cannot help himself, that he has a dysfunction disorder or mental illness. If this is the case, you must leave him, for your good and for his. He cannot begin to address his problem until he recognizes it, and he will not recognize it as long as he has you to cover for his dysfunction.

Honestly, the fact that he is capable of controlling himself with others tells me he is likely a cold and calculating SOB who wants to turn you into an obedient slave. There is no cure for this kind of person.

Good luck.


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## MrsFarris

Thank you all so much for your advice. 

I know that I need to be stronger and wish that it didn't affect me so much. I was just reading a forum about a woman who left her husband for not treating her right and though, wow, I wish I could just walk away and not look back! I'm not saying I would just yet, but knowing that I could would be really empowering... 

He is going to deploy for a year in January. I am hoping for two things: 

1. Being alone for a year will help me get used to life without him so that if he doesn't change, it will be easier for me to be strong and walk away. 

2. Him being gone will help him see how much he appreciates me and that will aid in him changing his behavior. 

I know I could be tough and not let him bother me, laugh it off, but I also know I could just be with someone who treated me better and not have to worry about shrugging off abusive behavior... and that sounds like a lot nicer of an option. 

I would never treat him the way he is treating me and that is the most painful part, its hard to understand someone and their actions when they do things that you would never do.


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## Terra

I'm sorry you are feeling so hurt and conflicted. I imagine you are right, the experience of being apart from your husband for this upcoming year might bring clarity for you. You might consider individual counseling. I'd imagine if your husband is in the military there ae resources you can tap into. 

My tends to be not all that sympathetic when I'm feeling upset about something. In his case, he's not trying to be mean towards me, he simply does not understand how to respond. He did not receive good modeling growing up to know how to reach out to me. This is an area we are currently putting some work into to help our marriage. Its going to take some effort on my husbands part to acknowledge my feelings. His willingness to make an effort towards acknowledging my feelings (as well as his own) is key for both our marriages.


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## Nekko

> I know that I need to be stronger and wish that it didn't affect me so much. I was just reading a forum about a woman who left her husband for not treating her right and though, wow, I wish I could just walk away and not look back! I'm not saying I would just yet, but knowing that I could would be really empowering...


Well, I've never really shared most people's views on this. They usually have a couple of options. One is sitting there being vulnerable and in pain, complaining that they are being hurt. The second is ignoring and saying 'if you don't fix yourself i'll leave'. Third is 'I'm leaving and giving up on this marriage'. 

I personally also see a fourth (though most people don't), which is be strong and WORK on the marriage...you...not your spouse..see how this is different from the first few? Why does this never happen? Because people say...if my spouse is being mean, he doesn't deserve me being nice...

However, you are right in saying you should have the strength to leave. Not to actually leave. But because that means you'd be strong enough on your two feet to be objective to the situation and not get so hurt by what he sais. 



> 1. Being alone for a year will help me get used to life without him so that if he doesn't change, it will be easier for me to be strong and walk away.


True, but, why not start now? 


> 2. Him being gone will help him see how much he appreciates me and that will aid in him changing his behavior.


He will appreciate you, for the first couple of months when he comes back. After that it's all on you, whether you've changed to earn his respect or not will influence how he behaves too. 


> I know I could be tough and not let him bother me, laugh it off, but I also know I could just be with someone who treated me better and not have to worry about shrugging off abusive behavior... and that sounds like a lot nicer of an option.


Look, how to say this. If he's nice to you when other people are around..that means he was raised to be respectful for his spouse. Why he's not nice when you're alone is because he doesn't really respect you. If you can get him to respect you...he'll behave nice when he's alone with you too. This would be someone who treated you better...in the same marriage. 



> I would never treat him the way he is treating me and that is the most painful part, its hard to understand someone and their actions when they do things that you would never do.


We're all different. He's probably feeling very weird about you breaking down and crying as well. It probably exasperates him. Why? Because he doesn't do that...and would probably never do that. See what i mean?

Just make a decission in your own mind...'from this day on i'm not taking this crap from you anymore'...and be indiferent to it for a while. Don't yell, cry..whatever, don't let it affect you. See how he reacts to that. Throw him a smile once in a while in an arguement. This will make you slowly become detached to his bullying. This sets you in a spot where you will be confident enough to stand up to him or just walk away. Sure...you may end up leaving him etc...but that's a decission a bit further in the future. Think about what you can do NOW about it. Who knows, it may just work. If it doesn't you always have the other options. Just like, when you loose weight, you don't just jump to not eating at all, you slowly build up a plan and stick to it little by little, for it to work.  Good luck.


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## Terra

Nekko said:


> Yup. Me. My husband is angry...that's just the way he is. Once he gets angry at...basically anything...he feels the need to manifest that anger. I'm the closest thing around. Since he knows me, he knows what pushes my buttons. I've known this since I married him and I accept it (since I chose to be with him). It's just the way he is.
> 
> He loved me so much exactly because i could understand how his anger came from somewhere else, how words he said when he was angry were just words and had nothing to do with what he really thought about me....hence everytime he started with 'insults' i'd just be bratty and laugh it off. He'd snap out of anger in 10 minutes and love me even more. He'd love me so much because I was the ONE woman who accepted him as he was and was strong enough to cope with him.
> 
> Obviously, in time, that and other problems in life made me feel weak. I started responding how you are now, by crying, feeling abandoned, thinking that if he loved me he should care and console me. But that went in contradiction with his beliefs (that people should take care of their own selves and be strong enough to NOT need that help).
> 
> He too found me pathetic when i reacted like that. The more he said that the more I'd thought i'd loose him and he'd leave (ironic isn't it? ) ). So...at one point i figured, ok, but if he does leave, how will i take care of my own self if i feel so weak? And why do i have to rely on someone to feel confident? So...slowly but surely i started toughing up, smiling at his anger again, being bratty again. Slowly but surely he started being affectionate and loving again, and the arguements almost disapeared. He even went as far as to say that 'You really deserve being treated like a princess for how nice and supportive you've been of me lately and what you put up with from me'.
> 
> This from the guy that would look at me crying and start yelling at me and being angry.  Why? Because I gained his respect back ...as a strong woman that can handle him. Back in the day when i'd let his behaviour so much i was weak and not what he fell in love with. What he was angry and dissapointed with was that i let myself be so affected by what he did and said. Get it? He kept doing it in an attempt to toughen me up. I was yelling for a hug and he was thinking that if he gives it to me he'd encourage me to feel week and helpless.
> 
> Marriage is balance. The balance in yours went to hell. Figure out how you were when you were happy with him and go back to that attitude. In the end, we all need to be strong and take care of our own selves. It doesn't justify *his behaviour* but it's a choice you have to make and it will make YOU happy. And you, at the moment, are being way too affected by what he does or sais. I bet somewhere deep down you know that. This is if you think you can deal with his hard to handle nature and still want to be married. Otherwise, if you want a more docile and nice man, just bail out. Good luck.
> 
> 
> 
> And that's because you don't have his respect...because you're being weak. Yes, it sounds sad to you maybe that you have to go through this alone, but once you understand that it's just feelings and words...why do you let feelings and words hurt you so much?



Nikko,
I'm curious. It seems your efforts to behave or at least appear indifferent to your husbands bad bahaviour takes a lot of energy. In the event you became seriously ill and really needed immediate support from him, then what? Do you continue to act like you don't need him or don't necessarily need him to prove something? Kind of a mind game to compete with his coldness or whatever. I believe you are taking a cognitive (thinking) approach to how you are dealing with your husband lack of emotional connection to you. I like this approach to a certain degree, but sometimes it seems so sterile and not always realistic in its purist form--- at least to me, IMHO. 

Terra


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## Nekko

Terra said:


> Nikko,
> I'm curious. It seems your efforts to behave or at least appear indifferent to your husbands bad bahaviour takes a lot of energy. In the event you became seriously ill and really needed immediate support from him, then what? Do you continue to act like you don't need him or don't necessarily need him to prove something? Kind of a mind game to compete with his coldness or whatever. I believe you are taking a cognitive (thinking) approach to how you are dealing with your husband lack of emotional connection to you. I like this approach to a certain degree, but sometimes it seems so sterile and not always realistic in its purist form--- at least to me, IMHO.
> 
> Terra


You don't understand how people like that work. When it comes to feelings, men like him have been taught from an early age (specially when growing in homes with parents who left the appearance of tough and in control) that they should keep them inside and solve their own problems! When you're going through problems (money, family breaking apart, etc), you need to keep your cool and solve them. 

Breaking down emotionally won't solve anything. Imagine a guy in the middle of the war stoping to cry a bit because he can't take any more of that pressure. Even men who weren't brought up to be so tough have a problem with their wives starting to cry and feel miserable because they just plain don't understand it, and generally it's annoying and rather childish behaviour. If your husband were to suddenly break down into tears every two three days, you'd find it weird, and at a point exasperating, regardless of how much you love him. In time you'd start to think he's childish and be angry at him. Now, because we're women we have this silly impression that we can just remain childish and start crying out of anything, stomp our feet and demand someone takes care of us, like mommy and daddy used to. 

You talk about illness...whenever that happened to me, my husband was there, made me soup, ran to the pharmacy in the middle of the night, gave me a massage, did everything he could to make me feel better. This is the same person who gets angry and ignores me if I cry (why? he won't encourage what he thinks is childish behaviour).

Most men usually marry a woman who seems strong, fun to be around, independent and mature. Whenever that woman breaks down into tears, she indirectly tells her man she's not that strong woman he married. The man naturally gets angry and confused. He might even continue his bullying because on some subconscious level he thinks thats what she needs to go back to her strong self. (If you study the behaviour of men many are like that with their children...in an attempt to 'prepare them for life' and toughen them up.)

I'm not pretending that I don't need my husband. In all due reality I don't really *need* him. I can take care of my OWN self and i find it normal for every adult to be able to do so. Don't understand by this that I don't get or accept any help from him. I do want him around for the rest of my life, and do love him. 

I'm just at a possition where, although i love him being around and being nice to me, I know that if I were to be alone tomorrow (for one reason or another) I could take care of myself without any problem. If I ever get amazingly pissed about something and find myself teary (only time i can't control this is when i'm PMS-ing) I go make myself a tea, take a warm bath, listen to some music and then go on with life. Why? Because I can take care of myself and don't need to husband to say 'there there it's all going to be ok' when i cry. I'm not twelve anymore. 

Because I am in this state of mind, I get respect from him. Because i can handle him and accept him for what he is, i am loved by him. As soon as i gained that respect and love back, he, on his own, without me saying anything, started acting respectful, loving and so on. Sure, he still won't be there if i break down and cry but why would i need to do that?


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## Terra

I happen to be more of a 'thinking' type personality. It would be a rare occurence for me to show an outward display of emotions that included tears. I'm not sure we're on the same page with this. I believe I understand what you are attempting to explain in regards to basically having command of ones own feelings etc. Indeed, I get annoyed when for example, I have to deal w/female and sometimes male employees that operate in this immature fashion. And I'm not necessarily simply discussing pitching in and assisting when, say you have a cold/flu, stressed out and that sort of thing. Still that's part of it. I'm talking about being connected on a deeper level as a couple, being interdependent, having concern for the "us" rather then two independent individual going around disconnected from one another perhaps emotionally, physically, spiritually. 
Personally I had a rough experience where because I have/we've been pretty independent I ended up having trouble getting help I needed because others around me were used to it going the other way! In otherwords, me helping others etc. I've had some very isolating an scary moments, that yes, I've gotten through, still it would have helped me to have had an easier time at getting help at that point. In a sense I'm discussing the extreme opposite of the initial writer of this thread. I'm also wondering if you have yet to see this angle to what you are expressing.


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## sisters359

Geez, if a man thought it was his job to "toughen me up," he'd be in for a huge surprise. And it wouldn't be one he'd been hoping for, I'm sure.

By the way, SIBLINGS are for toughening us up and teaching us we are not the center of the universe. They do a darn good job of it, usually! 

OP, I noticed you said he is verbally abusive to the point where he "makes me cry." First, remember that NO ONE can make you do anything (unless they point a gun to your head). It seems to me that the whole "he won't sympathize with me when I'm crying" issue is secondary--why should he sympathize when he knows he has been trying to get you to cry (by being verbally abusive)? Truthfully, a lot of people get verbally abused and don't cry--they refuse to accept it and either leave or work with their spouse to get the counseling needed for the verbal abuse to end. I hope you use the year alone to get some help and figure out what you want to do--he could come back to a changed woman, and he *might* respond in a positive way. Or, he might not change, but you will know what to do then. Best of luck, and stay in touch.


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## angryandfrustrated

Mrs Farris

My husband sounds a lot like yours. I see a physical difference in him when he is being kind and when he is being horrible. He lives by double standards and (although I hate to admit it to the other posters) I cry out of frustration. I am more prone to crying than you. I dont cry all of the time by any means though. I understand where you are coming from when he doesnt care that he has ranted until you cry. I dont do that to my husband and if I did I sure in the hell would want to resolve it rather than yell about that too. I just want to be treated the same way I treat him.

I think I cry sometimes bc there is no solution that will make us happy. He isnt about to be kinder or softer to me and I am not going to harden myself for him. My emotional softness is part of what makes me special and I will not give up a large part of me for him. Is that how you feel too? Also there is no middle ground anymore. I have compromised and revised compromises until we are as close to his side as we can get. I cannot and will not go further on some of these issues. So anymore I am not what he fell in love with most of the time. I am too guarded to be that free, gentle woman. At this moment I am not sure if he cares to give me the security with him so that I could feel like I can be. So I made him leave. If he had chosen to give me what I am demanding then we could have continued living together. He refuses so I tell him that what he chooses is fine for him, but that I am not going to settle for less than I deserve and if what I need is not something that he is willing to give it doesnt make sense for us to be married to one another.

At this point in my life if you are not helping me enhance myself then you are hindering my advancement. Therefore he must be removed. I love him. I am in love with him. I feel a passionate love for him, but if he is going to continue to make me feel like I am less spectacular than I should feel that I am then I guess I will have to just get over him. It is time for me to love, honor, and respect myself and letting him run over me constantly is not how that is going to happen. I am in my late 20's and my life has been standing still. What I want is not falling into my lap I need to take some initiative and go get it. He isnt helping that so he is gone. 

It may not be right for you but you have to get yourself in this same mind set. This might seem silly, but if your life were a movie would you be cheering on this relationship or begging the heroine to treat herself better?


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## Nekko

> Geez, if a man thought it was his job to "toughen me up," he'd be in for a huge surprise. And it wouldn't be one he'd been hoping for, I'm sure.


I didn't mean it like they think it's their job. It's just the only way they know how to react when it comes to crying and desperation i guess. 


> OP, I noticed you said he is verbally abusive to the point where he "makes me cry." First, remember that NO ONE can make you do anything (unless they point a gun to your head). It seems to me that the whole "he won't sympathize with me when I'm crying" issue is secondary--why should he sympathize when he knows he has been trying to get you to cry (by being verbally abusive)?


This was my point. You said it much better than me. Thank you 



> I'm talking about being connected on a deeper level as a couple, being interdependent, having concern for the "us" rather then two independent individual going around disconnected from one another perhaps emotionally, physically, spiritually.


That interdependence and connection are great, in my opinion, when both partners deep down feel like they have respect for their SO and that their SO is strong enough to care for themselves. Sure, one or two times of weekness is normal. But when your spouse is constantly feeling vulnerable, that person suddenly becomes someone you are basically forced to take care of. Know what i mean? When that happens the whole interdependence thing jumps from being pleasant as in 'we're taking care of eachother' to one sided 'i constantly have to take care of you'. 

This usually translates to a lot of anger. The result is simple, every time that immature behaviour screaming 'take care of me' arises, the response is anger...as in 'no, i don't want this responsability of making you feel better yet again'. Except for people that love to take care of other people, ofc. Again this is just my opinion and i'm having a hard time explaining exactly what i mean. I also know that for thinking types it's even more annoying to deal with someone who is highly emotional. Thinking types also tend to chose a low emotional person as a lifemate...and they are exasperated if that person suddenly becomes mushy and sensitive. Does this make sense? Yes, just like anything else in life, balance is the answer...as in not to be completely alone, by yourself and never ask for or accept help, but don't fall into the needy clingy side.

Yes, i know what it's like to be the helper. That's exactly what i was trying to state higher. Maybe her husband is so used and exhasperated by her being emotional that he said no to still trying to help her. Maybe he even has issues of his own and didn't get support because she was busy dealing with her own emotions. There's no way to tell for sure, there are always two sides of the story and almost always both spouses to blame for the situation they are in. I was simply suggesting all that because usually when one spouse changes behaviour the other does too. Usually going back to what one used to be as attitude will make the other person remember why they fell in love and re-asses their behaviour.


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## Terra

Nekko,
I appreciate your expanding your ideas. I'm enjoying the topic. Its making me reflect on a situation I was in not long ago where I was 'needy' although doing the best I could to take care of myself while my husband had to do what he had to do (work) plus take on additional responsibilities I could no longer perform AND help me. Esencially we had to take on new roles and responsibilities to each other. Quite often folks whom become significantly ill/chronically ill are/ become allienated from others and one another through no fault of thier own. My husband DID have to jump to constantly taking care of me! Even under the best of circumstances (two mature strong individuals) a situation like this can be difficult and spell trouble. This IS the "for better or worse, thru sickness and health" part not all are truely prepared for even if you 'think' or 'feel' you are. Just my thoughts as the human condition IS frail. Maybe I'm hoping to get across just how important it is to have developed a strong mature relationship hopefully before something like this comes along in order to be better prepared for illness,aging, etc. It is like you are saying about balance and in the case of the possibility you might have to constantly take care of your SO, one has to factor in how to continue to care for oneself along the way. Your right, neither emotional outbursts and the SO's use of abusive behaviour surrounding emotional outbursts are paths to getting help when its really truely needed. Also even if a couple doesn't struggle with these particular behavioral difficulties... I'd say any and all ****** in the 'us' armour will indeed become more pronounced under tragic circumstances. I'm assuming there are no perfect marriages out there, so we're all likely vulnerable to added stress under difficult circumstances. (illness, husband going off to war, etc.) And maybe here I'm trying to expand the notion of what we perceive as 'weakness' for I feel I've had to display a great deal of courage and strength to be where I've landed today.


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## Nekko

> I appreciate your expanding your ideas. I'm enjoying the topic. Its making me reflect on a situation I was in not long ago where I was 'needy' although doing the best I could to take care of myself while my husband had to do what he had to do (work) plus take on additional responsibilities I could no longer perform AND help me. Esencially we had to take on new roles and responsibilities to each other.


Yes, these situations arise and what you describe is normal...You have to be there for your spouse. But let me show you a different perspective. There's your husband who saw you needed help and were going through a rough period and obviously supported you all he could. Then there's the OP's husband, who might be thinking 'i'm taking care of her and our family, have a ton of work and responsibility, i come home and am pretty annoyed because of my hard day and i meet my wife who bursts into tears, seems unsatisfied and complains about me not being nice enough'. I'm not saying this is necesarily the case, but in such a scenario could you understand how it would be normal for a man to react in that way and how the woman shouldn't really expect for him to take care of making her feel better aside from other things he has to do?



> Quite often folks whom become significantly ill/chronically ill are/ become allienated from others and one another through no fault of thier own. My husband DID have to jump to constantly taking care of me! Even under the best of circumstances (two mature strong individuals) a situation like this can be difficult and spell trouble. This IS the "for better or worse, thru sickness and health" part not all are truely prepared for even if you 'think' or 'feel' you are. Just my thoughts as the human condition IS frail.


Again, I agree with you. If we're talking about something our spouses find serious. Such as illness, too much work, financial problems, babies dieing, inability to concieve, big family troubles etc. This doesn't apply so well for the 'you're a bully and treating me bad and i go cry and yell at you for being mean' scenario. In that situation, if you wish, because of the reaction of his wife, the husband may think that she's actually against him. Just a thought.


> Maybe I'm hoping to get across just how important it is to have developed a strong mature relationship hopefully before something like this comes along in order to be better prepared for illness,aging, etc. It is like you are saying about balance and in the case of the possibility you might have to constantly take care of your SO, one has to factor in how to continue to care for oneself along the way. Your right, neither emotional outbursts and the SO's use of abusive behaviour surrounding emotional outbursts are paths to getting help when its really truely needed.


Yes, I agree with you again. You need to know the 'us' is strong too. You need to know your spouse will be there and comitted to you even when you're old, your jokes aren't funny anymore and you take two hours to get to the front door. There was this joke about this old pair sitting on the porch and the wife asks the husband 'what's your name?' husband answers'i don't remember', then the wife sais 'doesn't matter, i love you anyway'.
But in order to keep that together you need to make sure to not push your spouse away. You don't appreciate people that don't appreciate you.


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## Terra

Hi Nekko,
You are making many good points. You are discussing this couple reacting and not being pro-active and getting to the bottom of why they are habitually behaving in a manner that is undermining to their relationship and their ability to connect in a meaningful way-- especially sad prior to this guy leaving for a full year as he is going off to war. Its the elephant in the room. These immature behaviours are getting in the way. 

There are communication breakdowns, the bad habit of independent behaviours getting in the way of forming or maintaining the 'us' in a marriage relationship, failure to stay connected to one another, and perhaps not having a basic level of respect towards one another, and maybe even coming into a marriage under prepared and not fully developed as an individual and maybe having misguided expectations formed in the first place. For example, the wife perhaps has low self-esteem and has the habit left over from childhood of using emotional outbursts to attempt to get something out of her husband as he's generally not too responsive. Unfortunately emotional outbursts further allienate in this case and cause anger and resentment rather then empathy and understanding. Its a kind of dance they are each doing and probably are pretty good at it. Is this where you are going Kekko?

At any rate, I guess I was looking at your comments and making what I perceived (based on my own experience such as it is) and seeing a possible progression or lack of. I see the marriage relationship as a relationship that evolves and progresses in some fashion over time. So if a couple or if one or each of the individuals works on their weaknesses within their marriage (act in a pro-active rather than reactive manner) likely the marriage will evolve in a healthier fashion. Thus when 'stuff happens' that is part of life (in my example --an illness) the more pro-active couple will 
be able to weather the storm more readily. But if the couple are plagued with immaturity, low self esteem issues, poor communication skills--whatever, these things will make the situation more difficult--- most likely. 

In all fairness, it can be very hard to see our own self defeating behaviors and what's holding us back and causing us to make the same mistakes with our behaviours over and over. Concerning the crying: crying in some contexts could be a natural emotional release to a loss or it could be rooted in a past trauma the person is unaware of ---kind of like post traumatic stress syndrome. Until the person confronts the real cause to their trauma its doubtful anyone including a spouse can help. Perhaps this is why the spouse has given up in some ways and simply reacts with anger, distancing and other passive agressive behaviours. The spouse intuitively understands they are helpless to unlock the mystery. Just a thought. What do you think of this notion?


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## Nekko

Hey Terra,

Love to talk with you .


> There are communication breakdowns, the bad habit of independent behaviours getting in the way of forming or maintaining the 'us' in a marriage relationship, failure to stay connected to one another, and perhaps not having a basic level of respect towards one another, and maybe even coming into a marriage under prepared and not fully developed as an individual and maybe having misguided expectations formed in the first place.


Exactly. For an 'us' to happen, there have to be two rather strong people that go into that 'us'. Sure, weak moments can and will happen, and it is normal for the other partner to jump in and help. Those two people like eachother based on some qualities (this is the way life is). Those qualities can't completely disapear for ever else the marriage fails.

Respect, if you wish, is in my opinion the most important thing in a relationship between two people, followed by trust. If respect is missing the behaviour of the people involved will change greatly. Lack of respect means you think your spouse doesn't deserve good behaviour, support or love from you. Obviously this is bad. For short you need to see your spouse as an equal. Yes, with different personality and different needs, but as an equal in rights and as deserving to receive love and support and your opinion etc.



> For example, the wife perhaps has low self-esteem and has the habit left over from childhood of using emotional outbursts to attempt to get something out of her husband as he's generally not too responsive. Unfortunately emotional outbursts further allienate in this case and cause anger and resentment rather then empathy and understanding. Its a kind of dance they are each doing and probably are pretty good at it. Is this where you are going Kekko?


Exactly. 

-Say the husband, as a child, always got anger and dis-aproval from his parents when he cried after candy...because his parents told him to 'toughen up'. He matured, realized crying to get something never works, and accepted it. As his parents, he will treat this kind of behaviour in the same way because he was taught it was bad and immature. 

-The wife, on the other hand, would get what she wants because her daddy couldn't stand to see her cry and wanted to please her. Hence she was encouraged indirectly to behave that way in order to get something (most of the times emotional support). Since she was never discouraged from it, she keeps doing that. So, her and her husband have conflicting opinions on the matter. 

When he sees her act that way he gets annoyed, offended and feels like he has to put an end to this kind of behaviour (like his parents did to him), eventually even teasing her once in a while as a test, in order to 'toughen her up' thinking that she'll eventually reach the point where she understands. She on the other hand jumps to the conclusion that he doesn't love her or care (because daddy, who did love her, always tried to please her, and tolerated her behaviour). If he hadn't loved her, he wouldn't have married her. He wouldn't bother to tease her. People aren't mean to other people when they don't care about those people (this is a fact of life). They just plain don't care. 



> At any rate, I guess I was looking at your comments and making what I perceived (based on my own experience such as it is) and seeing a possible progression or lack of. I see the marriage relationship as a relationship that evolves and progresses in some fashion over time. So if a couple or if one or each of the individuals works on their weaknesses within their marriage (act in a pro-active rather than reactive manner) likely the marriage will evolve in a healthier fashion. Thus when 'stuff happens' that is part of life (in my example --an illness) the more pro-active couple will
> be able to weather the storm more readily. But if the couple are plagued with immaturity, low self esteem issues, poor communication skills--whatever, these things will make the situation more difficult--- most likely.


Yup. From the point of view of the husband....him knowing that whenever his wife encounters difficulties she'll burst in tears and do nothing, how hopeful do you think he is that if he goes to war and something bad happens, when he comes back his wife will be strong and mature enough to take care of him? How would you, or any of us for that matter feel, if we knew that should trouble arrise, our spouse is not strong or mature enough to handle the situation. Doesn't matter if the spouse really can given the situation. It's all about how we perceive our spouse. 

People should first of all work on theirselves before working on a marriage. If you know you have low self esteem, don't wait for your spouse to pull you out. It's not his/her duty to fix that problem, that's generally yours and only you can fix anyway (for it to last). 



> Concerning the crying: crying in some contexts could be a natural emotional release to a loss or it could be rooted in a past trauma the person is unaware of ---kind of like post traumatic stress syndrome.


Crying is a normal behaviour and it's actually beneficial for releasing stress and frustration. It's more common for women because they weren't bugged all childhood like men were with 'crying is for sissies and it makes you look weak'. Men do exactly the same thing with manifesting anger. It's the same emotions, just a different way of expressing it. When they couldn't cry, they found an alternate mode of manifesting frustration. A crying woman and a very angry man are most of the times the exact same thing. But constant anger and constant crying are both frustrating at hell and at some point you wonder what the hell you are doing so wrong to cause your spouse so much unhappiness. Obviously this makes you unhappy (either to the point of tears or anger) as well.


> Until the person confronts the real cause to their trauma its doubtful anyone including a spouse can help. Perhaps this is why the spouse has given up in some ways and simply reacts with anger, distancing and other passive agressive behaviours. The spouse intuitively understands they are helpless to unlock the mystery. Just a thought. What do you think of this notion?


A spouse can't help with your personal internal conflicts. I know, i've been there. My husband jumped from being supportive, to being funny, to being angry, to being basically anything he could think of. It did not help. I had to pull my own self out because the problem was in my head! And yes, i agree with your notion. Specially if niceness didn't work, you'll be stuck with an exasperated spouse that knows he/she can't help, wants their happy strong spouse back and feels powerless. 
:smthumbup:


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## Terra

Nekko & Mrs Farris~
Tough spot for both of you. Your self awareness and ernestness is great. Do your husbands have any interest in counseling or are you working on this alone? I'm not saying this is a good or bad thing. I've got someone whom works for me who would sulk and pout when she didn't like something or a situation etc. She would claim to not be aware she was pouting but I can't believe she couldn't be. She even discusses her adolescent daughter doing the samething. I even had to counce her thatif she continue to behave thhis way I'd have to suspend her or fire her. Sad but couldn't have her behaving in this fashion w/clients.


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## Nekko

Terra said:


> Nekko & Mrs Farris~
> Tough spot for both of you. Your self awareness and ernestness is great. Do your husbands have any interest in counseling or are you working on this alone? I'm not saying this is a good or bad thing. I've got someone whom works for me who would sulk and pout when she didn't like something or a situation etc. She would claim to not be aware she was pouting but I can't believe she couldn't be. She even discusses her adolescent daughter doing the samething. I even had to counce her thatif she continue to behave thhis way I'd have to suspend her or fire her. Sad but couldn't have her behaving in this fashion w/clients.


Working on this alone since i can't make him go to a counselor. I haven't really asked but i don't want to because i know he finds it stupid. Ever since i discovered what the problem is (and i somehow knew because that weaker behaviour wasn't me...my own mind was telling me how i needed to get out of that situation if you know what i mean...) i've slowly started fixing it. I'm more than half way back to normal, and i can see how my husband is more than half way back to his old behaviour as well, as a reaction. Some things, if you can and want to, you just have to do for yourself.  And btw, therapists are there to teach you how to help yourself, not solve your problems. So if you are willing to do some introspection, understand the situation objectively (without pride and not only from your point of view) it has pretty much the same result as therapy...in my opinion anyway.


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## MsLady

Crying because one's spouse is saying nasty mean things to you is NOT childish or weak. Your husband perceiving it as that and then adding insult to injury by becoming nasty about the tears themselves. Well, that's ****ed.

Why would someone do their best to break you down and then try to "tough you up". What are you, his science toy? It's absurd. Yes, you DO have to toughen up, but not so that he can respect you again and love you again and be nice to you again - but so that you can get the heck out of there! No one should trample on you and then get angry at you because you are hurt. Sure, if you were just a whiny cry-baby all the time for no reason at all - I could see how that would get annoying. And if that's what you're doing, then fess up to yourself and stop it. But it doesn't sound like that's the situation at all.

Threatening to leave just to get him to back off is also a bad strategy. He'll learn soon enough you don't mean it. Make sure the next time the words come out of your mouth, you will follow through 100% and permanently.


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## MsLady

> From the point of view of the husband....him knowing that whenever his wife encounters difficulties she'll burst in tears and do nothing


You're talking about a very different scenario and situation than described by the OP. Your analysis is correct in the context of the scenario you visualize ... but please read what she said again. HE is VERBALLY ABUSING her and then getting pissed when she becomes hurt. In a spousal relationship, we share our most intimate vulnerabilities to one another. When one partner uses that as a weapon to come at the other, to break them down, that is the ultimate betrayal and why verbal abuse is such a nasty matter in a marriage. So, for her to cry when he does this is NOT weak or childish - it is the normal reaction of a normal person.

If she were just crying every time she burnt the bacon or the doorknob got jammed, yes, she'd be the most annoying person in the world. That's not the situation here. HE'S being nasty to her, using everything he knows about her to rip at her soul and then he's like "why the **** are you crying?" That makes him the bad guy here. 

Does she need to find the strength to stand up to him, maybe to leave him or give him a (real) ultimatum, yes. But the way this is being presented is like "well, of course, he can't respect you if you start crying all the time and if you get tough and don't let his verbal abuse bother you, then he'll respect you for being strong and just don't show your weakness" .... why should someone have to be that darn guarded and unaffected in a relationship? to keep a relationship? She shouldn't have to be. Yes, she should be her strong assertive self but that can only happen in the context of a loving, supportive accepting relationship when it's the relationship that's causing the "character weakness."


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## Terra

Nekko~
Sure introspection can be very good and helpful but also you can get lost too. This is what I'm getting when I'm reading your posts. And no doubt this the reason Ms Lady is responding in this fashion. I kind of didn't have the heart to say so in so many words myself, but now the cat is out of the bag! This is why I mentioned when I initially posted here that you seem to be using a pure cognitive outlook which again is pretty sterile. Anyway, it can be helpful to have a professional to discuss your introspections. I'd read your post to the woman who has been married 23 years. Your insights are a bit off base and not realistic. Sounds liek you are being verbally abused yourself and your self analysis is not helping you deal with it appropriately. It sounds like you are putting a great deal of energy into figuring how you can manipulative your husband to stop the abuse. This is not a love and marriage relationship. Its an act(s) of desperation.


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## Nekko

MsLady said:


> HE'S being nasty to her, using everything he knows about her to rip at her soul and then he's like "why the **** are you crying?" That makes him the bad guy here.
> 
> Does she need to find the strength to stand up to him, maybe to leave him or give him a (real) ultimatum, yes. But the way this is being presented is like "well, of course, he can't respect you if you start crying all the time and if you get tough and don't let his verbal abuse bother you, then he'll respect you for being strong and just don't show your weakness" .... why should someone have to be that darn guarded and unaffected in a relationship? to keep a relationship? She shouldn't have to be. Yes, she should be her strong assertive self but that can only happen in the context of a loving, supportive accepting relationship when it's the relationship that's causing the "character weakness."


Aside from talking from my own experiences in life....i was explaining various possible scenarios as well as giving my opinion on what the OP could do to pull herself out of that situation. Many of the things i said start with 'if' or 'say this were the case...then the consequence would be this'....last 2-3 posts were mostly a discussion with Terra on variations of behaviour in this type of marriage. They are general ideas of what can happen in a marriage, how some people think, how they are raised and how they react. If MrsFarris finds any similarities between her situation and that, good, maybe it'll be helpful. But it wasn't meant to completely define her marriage, i can't tell that from her 2 posts. 

If you were to read my first post you'd understand I didn't say her husband's behaviour is OK. But she chose him . I was just trying to explain it to an extent. When you understand why someone behaves in a certain way, it's easier to do something about it or just take it as it is and decide to leave.

I've always answered posts on this forum with how i see the situation, what I think could work to try FIX the marriage. I don't just go ahead and say 'oh i feel for you, your husband is crap' because that never solves anything, does it?  Ok, maybe 2-3 minutes of the OP feeling better but not long term anyway. I also know that when it gets to this point, of two people not getting along, neither of them will usually give up. Since the poster bothers to ask about it, i think about what they could do to change the situation into better...at least a bit better, then go from there.

I'm sure that however much of a bully her husband is 'why are you doing this' with a decently friendly tone would have at least a slightly better result to fixing things than turning around and crying. 

Again, her husband being abusive is not 'excused' so to say. It's still bad. But her options are 2. 
1. Walk away, or 
2. do something to not allow him to be abusive. She could just keep crying and yell back. And he'll keep behaving the same way. Or she could pull herself together (what she'd have to do if she were to leave as well!) while still in the marriage and see how that works out. 
There is no other option of her husband just out of the blue realizing what a jerk he is and stoping his behaviour. Things never really happen this way.



> Your insights are a bit off base and not realistic


Perhaps so . But I try to understand people and why they do the things they do. Things always look different from the outside when posted here by their spouses. To understand a situation completely you have to understand why the other spouse is behaving the way he/she is to some extent too. On this side there's a set of complaints. Be sure that on the other spouse's side there's also a set of complaints. 



> It sounds like you are putting a great deal of energy into figuring how you can manipulative your husband to stop the abuse.


While this post isn't really about me, the only problem i still have with my husband is the low frequency of sex. Other than that, at the moment (as angry as he is with pretty much anyone), he's stoped being that with me. He's actually nice, considerate and affectionate..this after he was what MrsFarris describes. Why? Because i took the time to actually understand why he was behaving that way. Does it matte how i did it? I didn't bully him into anything or leave him. I didn't really manipulate him either. It was a matter of 'what do you need to be happy?' Figured that out, did it...he reacted and became nice. 

This is exactly why i go ahead and state my opinion. Because i managed to do that in my own marriage. Now, what i advice may sound weird or unrealistic but it worked, so i'm telling people. If it works for them and they wanna take that advice, good, if not, it's just a bunch of words on a forum that people can ignore.


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## Terra

Nekko~
Glad to hear you are having success. I'd had a bad feeling you were identifying and justifying your own situation and getting yourself into analysis paralysis mode or waxing about philosophically by dashing around this site trying to help others in similar fashion as you are helping yourself. I was picking up a vibe that raised a little red flag in me. Maybe its just me and how I see the world or see and act towards helping others. You may be caught up in your own methods and not catching on which has pushed me to write you and attempt to give you other perspectives, ie the idea of a couple facing real tradgedy. I'm not sure, but I got stirred up with feelings of annoyance for some reason. I did not mean to highjack this from Mrs Farris nor not see her situation for what it is--- I'd gotten caught up in Nekko's meanderings. Now I need to go to work and let this go.


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## heatherlindsay

My partner is also verbally abusive at times, only when he is really mad. When I cry he tells me it means nothing to him and that its worthless. As a husband I expect him to be emotionally supportive. I can easily tell if he was the one crying I would be the one to cheer him up and I would never say the things he says to me. Its really hard to say wether or not he acts like this because of me or if it is because he just doesnt love me anymore.
I have tried to be more confident and the only thing it did was make him more enthusiastic sexually, but thats not what i want. I want him to be more supportive and caring when I am upset and apologize when he does something wrong. How can you get a man to not be so stubborn and make more of an effort???


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## IIWT

I feel the same way. I am relatively newlywed and sometimes I feel like I made a mistake getting married. You're right when you say it's like a vicious cycle because when everything is resolved, I feel bad for thinking those things. I don't know what it is, but maybe he's like a fair weather husband. I feel like when times are good, and nothing is stressful or wrong, our relationship is good. If I bring up something that's concerning me, something that's not even related to our relationship, he tells me that I'm ruining his day. I'm not trying to ruin anyone's day, I'm just looking for a friend that will listen, understand, empathize, be there with me. I mean, didn't we get into this relationship to share both the joys and the sorrows of life together?? To be there for each other when we need it? When he comes to me with something he's struggling with, I listen. I try to help. I nurture because I know that's what he needs to get through the hard time and move on. When I go to him, I get yelled at. He is so hurtful that I cry and he doesn't give a rats. He yells at me for crying. And I've expressed all of this to him. I've told him how he makes me feel sometimes and he basically tells me I'm full of it. Somehow, it always comes back on me. None of my other relationships have ever been like this, so I can't truly believe that everything is my fault but he makes me feel so low. And the hiding your tears thing...I know exactly what you mean. It will take every ounce of strength to hold it together long enough to get away so that I can cry without being yelled at. He makes me feel like such a failure, and I am categorically not a failure. I don't want to give up but I don't know what to do because he won't listen. I can't share anything I'm feeling with him if it's not a beam of sunshine because he will get mad that I'm ruining his day. I don't know what to do...


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## moogvo

Sounds like it's time to locate the nearest exit. Spousal abuse rarely gets "fixed". As an EMT, I see abusive spouses that have been beaten to the brink of death who have become combative with law enforcement who are going to remove the abuser from the home.

Sadly, there are several addresses that we have been to enough times to know the people who live there by name, and what the nature of the call will be.

We get to the scene. Wife looks like she has been dropped off the roof. Husband does all the talking to the first responders. It's amazing that he thinks we actually believe that mess about her running into walls, being clumsy, falling down the stairs, etc.

I have first hand experience of 2 women who have died from injuries inflicted by their Husbands. These women were people that we had responded to on many other occasions. The husband says he's sorry and it is all better.

Get out while the gettin's good. If he hasn't become physical yet, all the better.


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## credamdóchasgra

To the OP:
I think there's a difference between being insensitive and angry in the middle of a heated argument that's already out of control, and the kind of coldness, criticism, and unhealthy dynamic that gets people into a fight like that in the first place. In other words, just like you don't typically cry at the drop of a hat, is your husband mean if you're not (both) already fighting and upset? If the case is the latter, then it's a vicious, frustrating cycle--my husband and I have this problem, which is why this thread caught my eye.
Your husband probably does have his own reasons, inside, for his insensitivity and his inability (or unwillingness) to show compassion when you react by crying. I know how painful that can be--like someone else said, I definitely cry out of frustration when we argue. We've said 2 things to each other that I hope can help us:
1. He says, "Don't ask or demand me to show you that compassion, and maybe you'll get it. If you're crying, give me the space to cool down myself and to do it naturally on my own." 
2. I said, "Just DONT SAY ANYTHING AT ALL if you cannot keep yourself from being mean when we fight, or when you see that I'm so frustrated I'm in tears." 
We're working on not letting the fights get to that point.


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## credamdóchasgra

Just want to add: It cuts me to the core when he says it's "childish" for me to cry RIGHT WHEN IM FEELING THAT VULNERABLE ALREADY, IN TEARS. Or when I say "Show me some compassion" and he replies with "I'm not your mom!"
So if I don't want to hear that, I'm going to walk away from the fight if I feel like crying so I don't have to hear that from him, and hope and have faith that he can find his heart again even when he's angry.


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## AliceA

heatherlindsay said:


> My partner is also verbally abusive at times, only when he is really mad. When I cry he tells me it means nothing to him and that its worthless. As a husband I expect him to be emotionally supportive. I can easily tell if he was the one crying I would be the one to cheer him up and I would never say the things he says to me. Its really hard to say wether or not he acts like this because of me or if it is because he just doesnt love me anymore.
> I have tried to be more confident and the only thing it did was make him more enthusiastic sexually, but thats not what i want. I want him to be more supportive and caring when I am upset and apologize when he does something wrong. How can you get a man to not be so stubborn and make more of an effort???


I agree that many of us probably think that we would be much more supportive if our spouse was the one who felt hurt and was crying, but I really just tried to imagine this, on a continuous basis, and I have to think, maybe not.

If everytime I got angry and stressed my husband burst into tears, I have to admit, I'd probably start thinking he was a wuss. It's terrible I know, but just imagine it!

When tears are a frequent response to an argument, they really do mean nothing much at all. The spouse watching those all too common tears will probably think they are just being used to manipulate him into backing down and admitting that he was terrible and to start being more loving. Yes, this is what we want him to do, but is THAT realistic.

I saw someone question whether Nekko was being realistic, but to be honest, her response to her situation seems to be the one that makes the most sense. If you want to remain in the marriage, assuming your partner will change is unrealistic, but changing your own reactions to things is perfectly realistic.

Note: I'm not talking about a situation where a person is actually abusing their partner. In that situation, where they are deliberately trying to hurt their partner, instead of lacking empathy to deal with their partners hurt, I don't think staying in the situation is an option at all.


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## TheFamilyMan

I remember when I was growing up XXX years ago my father was a very angry man, atleast in my early years but my mom somehow managed to snap him out of it. My dad wasn't "military" type of aggressive and tough, but he could be a real jerk to her. What she did was she began sticking up for herself and stopped doing certain things for him (cooking, etc. My parent's are very old school), and that grabbed his attention. The most important thing, in my opinion is that you as a woman, manage to value yourself for who you are and start building up that self-esteem and sense of self worth and start realizing certain things. Good luck!


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## Therealbrighteyes

This post is from 2009!!!! Move on.


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## boxer

I don't respond to women crying, because women commonly use it to manipulate men. When I see a woman crying, I instantly wonder what she wants, and who she's trying to get it from.


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## klo13

MrsFarris said:


> My husband is verbally abusive and often makes me cry. When/if I do cry, he ignores me and sometimes even becomes angry. He says he loves me but how could he really care if seeing me in pain like that doesn't matter to him? He doesn't console me, try to make it better, or even acknowledge what is going on. It makes me feel so unimportant and invisible. Its to the point where if I feel like crying, I will leave or go somewhere where he cannot see or hear me because I cannot stand the way he acts towards it. I'm not emotionally unstable and rarely cried in other relationships or in life in general before him, but he just cuts at me so deep and has a special way of bringing me down. When we argue and I cry he sometimes tells me I am pathetic and suggests that I "go somewhere else" or get over it... sometimes going as far as to say things like "god are you on your period or something?" even though it is obvious that his words or actions are what upset me. He treats me so horrible but then after the fact he denies it and says he loves me and treats me good and all of that. Its a vicious cycle, it seems like the only time he is good to me is when I threaten to leave, then he is right back to his old ways. After dealing with this for over a year now I am hurting inside all the time and feel like I can't explain it to anyone... We are so far from family and friends, and he acts totally different when we around other people so no one notices it. I'm beginning to feel like I am not worth loving and its killing me inside. Does anyone else's husband do this to them?


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## klo13

MrsFarris said:


> My husband is verbally abusive and often makes me cry. When/if I do cry, he ignores me and sometimes even becomes angry. He says he loves me but how could he really care if seeing me in pain like that doesn't matter to him? He doesn't console me, try to make it better, or even acknowledge what is going on. It makes me feel so unimportant and invisible. Its to the point where if I feel like crying, I will leave or go somewhere where he cannot see or hear me because I cannot stand the way he acts towards it. I'm not emotionally unstable and rarely cried in other relationships or in life in general before him, but he just cuts at me so deep and has a special way of bringing me down. When we argue and I cry he sometimes tells me I am pathetic and suggests that I "go somewhere else" or get over it... sometimes going as far as to say things like "god are you on your period or something?" even though it is obvious that his words or actions are what upset me. He treats me so horrible but then after the fact he denies it and says he loves me and treats me good and all of that. Its a vicious cycle, it seems like the only time he is good to me is when I threaten to leave, then he is right back to his old ways. After dealing with this for over a year now I am hurting inside all the time and feel like I can't explain it to anyone... We are so far from family and friends, and he acts totally different when we around other people so no one notices it. I'm beginning to feel like I am not worth loving and its killing me inside. Does anyone else's husband do this to them?


I am going through the same thing I dont know how to cope with it


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## green icecream

I have been going through this for at least 10 years and sometimes it's bearable and sometimes not. Our youngest graduates from high school this year and my goal now is to stay until she leaves in August, but leave then if nothing gets better by then. My husband can be a great guy and is supportive of me if someone else hurts me, but if he is the one who hurt me he can't deal with it. Either I ignore it to keep the peace, in which case I bury it deep inside with rest of the past hurts we haven't dealt with, or I say something to him and he immediately defends himself and explains to me how he didn't do anything to justify my feelings and therefore he has nothing to talk about or apologize for, which just leaves me feeling worse than if I had said nothing at all. I could understand if he felt sort of defensive at the time and then came back later to talk about it and make sure I was OK, but that never happens. The worst is when something happens at night and he just goes to sleep like a baby, knowing I'm downstairs crying and then just gets up the next day and says, "Good morning!" - like nothing ever happened. I have so many years of unresolved hurts inside me I feel like I don't know where to start to try to heal. I know it takes less and less to hurt me now because all those things are still there inside me - in fact, it's like an automatic response as soon as he says something that hits me the wrong way. My stomach tightens, my body stiffens and then the tears start. I feel like I've lost all my self esteem and motivation for living because I've allowed this to go on for so long and I really just don't know what to do, which makes me feel even worse because I'm an intelligent woman - BS, MBA. I cry myself to sleep most nights and break down a few times each day when I allow myself to think about it. I have two daughters and I worry so much about the example I'm setting by not standing up for myself, because I always tell them that they should not base their lives around pleasing men, but should set their own path and then hopefully find a man who wants to share it with them. Why can't I do that for myself?

God - I feel so hopeless......... It does help a little to know that I'm not the only one in this situation, but I still need to find a way out and in spite of all this, I don't want to leave the marriage. Aaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhhh......


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## Peachy Cat

He is an abuser and he will (most likely) continue to abuse you. 

You can choose to a) learn not to be upset by him (aka pretend to not hurt, numb yourself and disconnect from real feelings) OR
b) leave his @$$ find a real man that won't feel the need to condemn you in order to make himself feel good.

I wish you luck.


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## trey69

This post is from 2009 and I don't think the OP has been back.


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## Krept

Hello forum @ old post

After almost 30 mins of reading through the posts here, while spinning in my chair in disagreement with much of the introspection that has taken place-- there comes you MsLady! 

Thanks MsLady, I decided to register on this forum to thank you for your posts. I couldn't have said it better myself.  




MsLady said:


> Crying because one's spouse is saying nasty mean things to you is NOT childish or weak. Your husband perceiving it as that and then adding insult to injury by becoming nasty about the tears themselves. Well, that's ****ed.
> 
> Why would someone do their best to break you down and then try to "tough you up". What are you, his science toy? It's absurd. Yes, you DO have to toughen up, but not so that he can respect you again and love you again and be nice to you again - but so that you can get the heck out of there! No one should trample on you and then get angry at you because you are hurt. Sure, if you were just a whiny cry-baby all the time for no reason at all - I could see how that would get annoying. And if that's what you're doing, then fess up to yourself and stop it. But it doesn't sound like that's the situation at all.
> 
> Threatening to leave just to get him to back off is also a bad strategy. He'll learn soon enough you don't mean it. Make sure the next time the words come out of your mouth, you will follow through 100% and permanently.


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## moxy

Your husband is being emotionally abusive. This is not okay. It usually gets worse, if it isn't addressed. 

Have you tried counseling? Go for yourself if not marriage counseling for you both. Read "Why Does He Do That?: Inside the Minds of Angry Controlling Men" by Lundy Bancroft. 

Recognize that making you cry is not an acceptable thing and that you can't change how he treats you, but you can change what you are willing to accept and what you will not accept. You need to strengthen your boundaries, a little. 

Do you have friends and family nearby? If not, start trying to make some friends by joining a club or meetup or something. The more isolated you feel, the harder it will be for you to get in control of yourself, and the more likely that the power balance in your relationship will continue to become one-sided. Hang in there.


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## sara gusai

same here...he doesnt give two hoots if i cry..., this despite he claimed to have fallen in love with me and had propsed me to marriage..his condition was such that if i do not marry him..he'll finish himself. Look now, i feel so unwanted and undesired cheap woman. now he compares me with other girls..once even compared me with my house keeper and asked me to be smart and thin like her. he doesnt go outside anywhere with me..prefers everyone else above me...forgot my birthday although remembered his cousin's marriage.when i reminded him in the evening he said sorry and then went out, left me, returned drunk after midnight..if i'm upset and hurt and crying, he simply smokes or drinks and sleeps with his back towards me..its extremely disappointing because a person who loves u or claims to be loving and caring can never see u in pain and can never hurt u. He doesnt know how to caress or make me feel secure. has asked me angrily to not to discuss my problems with him becaz he doesnt want any tension..so my duty is to only comfort him and if i have any problem i have to face it all alone..after some days when he feels like having sex he comes to me and tries to be nice. when he is satisfied he again starts ignoring me..this cycle is repeated everytime. he doesnt like my touching him or kissing him. he excuses himself by saying that its too hot, or that he is tired or that he's feeling sleepy. doesnt allow me to kiss his lips by saying that his lips crack easily..if i try to get intimate he becomes sarcastic and tells me that im sex maniac..im allowed to touch him only when he desires.. im extremely lonely and hurt. but very soon i'll tide over everything. i'll definitely divert my mind to my own self and my baby. i'll learn to forget him. i swear very soon i'll stop crying for him and will be more successful......


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## EleGirl

Nekko said:


> Yup. Me. My husband is angry...that's just the way he is. Once he gets angry at...basically anything...he feels the need to manifest that anger. I'm the closest thing around. Since he knows me, he knows what pushes my buttons. I've known this since I married him and I accept it (since I chose to be with him). It's just the way he is.
> ....


Your way of handling your husband does not work for handling all abusive people. 

Some would get more enragged if their partne laughed at their anger and do what you do. I'm glad you feel that you have found a way to deal with your husband that you feel ok with. It's worth a try for the OP, but she will need to be careful with this approach. Many people who are abusive do it to gain control over their partner. If he feels he's losing control he could escalate to physical violence.


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## EleGirl

MrsFarris,

What you describe is the cycle of abuse. Things are ok for a while, then the pressure builds for the abuser, they then go on a abusive rampage. Then then get remorseful and start act nice for a few days/weeks and the cycle has started over.

The reason for the abusive rampage is twofold: 1) to maintain control over their partner. Keeping the partner emotionally off balance helps to control them. 2) The abusive rampage makes the abuser’s brain produce feel good brain chemicals. They get a high off of the abusive attack. So they get a high payoff for abusing you. He’s self-medicating by attacking you.

He does not make you cry. You choose to cry. Humans have the ability to control how we react to things. Sure we might have an initial emotional response for about a second. But then we can stop and think about what is going on and respond in the manner we choose to react.

My son’s father was much like your husband. I learned some techniques that really changed things.

One is that I came to realize that his abusive rants were about him not about me. He had a bad day or was in a bad place mentally. That’s why he was abusing me. It was not because there was anything wrong with me. It was not because I cleaned the kitchen instead of the bedroom, or because our child and his friends had toys around the family room. It was purely about what was going on in my husband’s head. You have to come to the point where you realize that this is about your husband’s internal problems, not about you.

SO STOP CRYING and stop internalizing it. Yes you can do both. Practice this… stand in front of a mirror and imagine him yelling at you. Say the word “STOP” and put your hand up in a stop signal. If he continues to yell, repeat the “STOP”/hand-signal 2 more times. Say the stop firmly but do not yell. Then tell him that you are going to leave him alone for a while so he can clam himself down.. “I’m leaving now. Take time to calm yourself down.” 

Practice this over and over in front of the mirror until it’s an automatic response.

Get a VAR (voice activated recorder) and either carry it on you or put it in the room where he is most likely to yell at you. Get some recordings of him yelling at you? Make sure that it’s more than one incident so that he cannot say that you recorded the one and only time he did this. Make a copy of them so that he cannot completely destroy them. DO not use this recording except for the last resort.. but have it.

Have a talk with him and tell him that each of you is responsible for managing your own mental state. That from now on you will NOT tolerate him yelling at you. Tell him that when he starts to yell at you, you will leave him alone to calm himself down. So you will say “STOP”, that’s your safe word. And you will put your hand up in a stop sign. Then you will either go to a quiet room to be by yourself or you will go out to go for a walk, a ride, anything to be away from him until he calms down. The break will be for about 1 hour as that should be enough time for him to get control of himself.

Suggest to him that he start a physical exercise plan for handling his anger. A regular routine of jogging, walking or bike riding can go a long way to stop the abuse cycle. And when he feels himself ready to explode engaging in one of those activities will help him calm himself down.

If during this talk he refuses to cooperate because he says that he never yells at you or abuses you ask him if he wants to hear what he sounds like when he is being abusive. He’ll most likely remember suddenly what he does sound like. If he does not remember, play the recording. 

Then after this discussion always use the “STOP”/Sign when he starts and leave. AT first it’s best to leave the house for an hour. If he tries to stop you physically call the police. He has to know that you are dead serious about not dealing with this anymore.

This is what I did with my son’s father. It stopped his verbal abuse. It did not save our marriage because he was also a serial cheater. But at least it stopped his abuse.


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## Cee Paul

My wife and I have some very nasty arguements where a lot of terrible things are said back and forth, but whenever it gets to a point where she starts crying that has always been like _kryptonite_ to me and pretty much ends the whole thing right there(and then I feel like an azz).


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## Stone

green icecream said:


> I have been going through this for at least 10 years and sometimes it's bearable and sometimes not. Our youngest graduates from high school this year and my goal now is to stay until she leaves in August, but leave then if nothing gets better by then. My husband can be a great guy and is supportive of me if someone else hurts me, but if he is the one who hurt me he can't deal with it. Either I ignore it to keep the peace, in which case I bury it deep inside with rest of the past hurts we haven't dealt with, or I say something to him and he immediately defends himself and explains to me how he didn't do anything to justify my feelings and therefore he has nothing to talk about or apologize for, which just leaves me feeling worse than if I had said nothing at all. I could understand if he felt sort of defensive at the time and then came back later to talk about it and make sure I was OK, but that never happens. The worst is when something happens at night and he just goes to sleep like a baby, knowing I'm downstairs crying and then just gets up the next day and says, "Good morning!" - like nothing ever happened. I have so many years of unresolved hurts inside me I feel like I don't know where to start to try to heal. I know it takes less and less to hurt me now because all those things are still there inside me - in fact, it's like an automatic response as soon as he says something that hits me the wrong way. My stomach tightens, my body stiffens and then the tears start. I feel like I've lost all my self esteem and motivation for living because I've allowed this to go on for so long and I really just don't know what to do, which makes me feel even worse because I'm an intelligent woman - BS, MBA. I cry myself to sleep most nights and break down a few times each day when I allow myself to think about it. I have two daughters and I worry so much about the example I'm setting by not standing up for myself, because I always tell them that they should not base their lives around pleasing men, but should set their own path and then hopefully find a man who wants to share it with them. Why can't I do that for myself?
> 
> God - I feel so hopeless......... It does help a little to know that I'm not the only one in this situation, but I still need to find a way out and in spite of all this, I don't want to leave the marriage. Aaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhhh......



Hi green icecream, yours is similar to mine:iagree:. We are abit different because I have only one daughter. She is still a toddler. I just lost a boy/miscariage this year. I am a PhD holder. My husband does not care when I cry... even when I was pregnant. He just simply goes to sleep like nothing has happend...We are from two different continents... Many years have passed...pains have been accumulating though many have been faded away as I really want to forget them - difficult to forget when it happend during my pregnancies It is easier to be with him when he is happy with his research/work. However, to have a happy family maybe a wife have to be very strong. I do not want to leave the marriage-not good for my girl. I think good for your daughter too that you do not want to divorce. I think your husband, my husband still have many good points to be a partner. For all the women physical abuse is not tolerated. Just think that we are still lucky than many other women in this world. So what we should do at the moment is to cheer our marriage life.


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## Skyye

Terra said:


> Nikko,
> I'm curious. It seems your efforts to behave or at least appear indifferent to your husbands bad bahaviour takes a lot of energy. In the event you became seriously ill and really needed immediate support from him, then what? Do you continue to act like you don't need him or don't necessarily need him to prove something? Kind of a mind game to compete with his coldness or whatever. I believe you are taking a cognitive (thinking) approach to how you are dealing with your husband lack of emotional connection to you. I like this approach to a certain degree, but sometimes it seems so sterile and not always realistic in its purist form--- at least to me, IMHO.
> 
> Terra


I could not have said it better, I have been cringing while reading Nikko's post, yes be stronger, yes work on your marriage. This seems more like denial and putting on a brave face and being proud of "look what this man has done to me and how I am taking it with a smile on my face" sorry, I just re-read it a couple of times and see someone enabling her husbands nasty behavior. I am going thru something similar and have been acting "bratty" etc... to deal with it, looks like my husband actually has depression, possibly bi-polar. Everyone sees me happy, he is happy when I put up with his crap and make a joke out of it, however, I have lost a lot of myself, I have taken some severe damage from this behavior, I should have left when it started and hoped that he got help.

Not trying to start a debate, just my two cents.


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## ferndog

Stone said:


> Hi green icecream, yours is similar to mine:iagree:. We are abit different because I have only one daughter. She is still a toddler. I just lost a boy/miscariage this year. I am a PhD holder. My husband does not care when I cry... even when I was pregnant. He just simply goes to sleep like nothing has happend...We are from two different continents... Many years have passed...pains have been accumulating though many have been faded away as I really want to forget them - difficult to forget when it happend during my pregnancies It is easier to be with him when he is happy with his research/work. However, to have a happy family maybe a wife have to be very strong. I do not want to leave the marriage-not good for my girl. I think good for your daughter too that you do not want to divorce. I think your husband, my husband still have many good points to be a partner. For all the women physical abuse is not tolerated. Just think that we are still lucky than many other women in this world. So what we should do at the moment is to cheer our marriage life.


I believe (as I am divorced and not happy about it) that communication is the most important element in a relationship. Without it love, respect, partnership etc can fade through time. 
My ex would try to talk but I couldn't (I later found out I was depressed). I admit that I neglected her for a long time and in no way am I using my depression as an excuse. So her love faded and she filed for divorce and had a new man within 6 months. (maybe even before then , not sure and not important anymore)

So as a loving man that continues to work through my issues (and doing great btw) I would like you to talk to your husband. 
I did a lot of research and I found a great video that explained my situation.
So if you go to YouTube type walk away wife. Video runs about 5:30 min. If that doesn't apply to you check other videos from her. She is great (I just forgot her name)

Never stop talking to your partner, that's why they ate there. 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Ellie5

MrsFarris

You are not alone! Am so sorry you have all this pain. I've been in that uncontrollable blubbering state right in front of H, and previously he would even continue with the verbal abuse, in the midst of tears - making it worse! - and you're desperately trying to understand how could anyone be so utterly cruel.

As soon as you feel tears coming on, or he starts, or whatever, tell him you're not going to talk to him whilst he's being so disrespectful, and remove yourself from the situation - even if that means going to another room.

You are in charge of your response. 

It's taken me some time to really get this, but get your dignity back, for yourself, not him - even when it cuts you to the core. Calmly tell him his behaviour is not acceptable, and walk away. Take time to calm down.

See if you can gain emotional support from family and friends. Crying in front of my H is like speaking Japanese to him, he doesn't get it, never will, he's not me - your H is not you. Take the reigns and watch your response - try to respond rather than react.

Bless you - I do feel for you and you are not the only person who's put up with behaviour like this - cruel words often spoken without apology too - let his words wash over you and know that you are better than this - It's controlling and belittling - with practice though it will show him he has little effect on you.

Stay strong.


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## Openminded

I think the majority of men see crying as manipulative or weak or both. However they see it, they don't usually respond well to it so it's better to keep it out of arguments. 

You may never completely get rid of it but it can be controlled.


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## silentghost

I use to cry when I would get upset....then I was told I did it just to manipulate him. After that....I absolutely refuse to cry in front of him for any reason. 
If I'm emotionally upset....I'm in another room and I'm talking to God about it. 
My marriage has made me emotionally independent... I will not subject myself to any emotional hurts whatsoever.

Like openminded says...it can be controlled.
If you're strugglinng with it... maybe it's best to see a counselor.


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## victoria123

i am so sorry for all of the hurt woman i can understand all of you and actually this is all my story before marriage i was saying that he is the one and only he was as cute as possible and caring and lovely he could never make me cry and he was saying that he will make me the happiest he is 14years older than me but because some old family problems i had to live without my dAd so he was as a dad to me i was feeling that my sad days are over and a new happy life is beginning with him we got married and i went with him to his country (Romania) far away from my family or friends then thing started to change slowly slowly he started caring less he is thinking that happiness is depending on money but no i needed somebody who will stay with me and have a speech together but no he was enjoying his time only with his friends and that hurts me the most because i didn't know their language so i was like a living doll , i started to realise that he wanted me fir my beauty and appearance no more i was 17 when we met and i couldn't finish my school i have no work experience and he finds me like a stupid girl not even a woman and it really hurtsss cause me too i can be better but he doesn't give me the opportunity i started my depression life and suicide ideas fights and anger i always been an angry person but it got worse with him cause he is weird he is saying he loves me and he gives me everything i want he is helping my family but this is not what u want !!! i want the man i met in the first day the one who respects me and care about my feelings and its not this one no more when i tell him that he says with no shame : but i was not me in the beginning that was just a man who's trying to catch a chick and make her get in love with him !!!!!! and when i cry he doesn't even feel sorry .. My god ii really don't know what to do anymore cause i don't know how to start a new life alone i have no experience i don't know how to get a job i want to be a model this was my dream from when i was a child but i need him to help me to start he said he will and I'm still waiting i feel like i have to bag my husband for a help and that hurts also but the complains !! non stop for very stupid things and i learned it from him , now he's says that me is the who complains true but its from him cause I'm tired really tired I'm praying every night to become a better person for him to stop his bad behaviour and disrespect but nothing changes its just getting worse i feel that everything is broken ! today morning he said the more i complain and fight the colder he's getting toward me but he didn't see that I'm already completely cold toward him ... i didn't love him at the beginning for beauty or sexiness cause he's not i loved him cause he appreciated me for who i am but now that everything changed i have nothing else to love him for


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## White Oleander

Hello there,
I 've read your replies and i am very interested in your approach. My spouse was raised in a very dysfunctional family. I dont want to get into many details, but my estimate is that he was never loved or taught how to love. His parents only taught him one thing: to be held accountable for everything and that he should do everything for his family. No boundaries whatsoever. He is very soft on the inside, very considerate, so i didnt notice his reaction to my crying until after our first year of living together as a couple. I was raised by a workaholic mom, so i was taught that no one is ever there for me. So, my reaction was to bottle it all up for a little more than a year and for that amount of time i did not complain or cry in front of him. When i cried for the first time he got angry. The thing is that from that point on the crying began to occur very often. I dont cry because of everyday problems. I cry because he is verbally abusive. I mean....seriously verbally abusive. But as you described, he is taking care of me when i 'm sick, cooks for me when i get too tired and the last year he 's been alienating his family up to some point for my sake. And i know this doesnt sound like much, but considering that ever since i walked in to his life they've been trying to break us up so he can go back with them, this is actually progress. He also thinks crying is weakness and doesnt act any different when his mother or sister are exhibiting such signs. I'm afraid he has managed to form the impression that i am trying to manipulate him through my tears....which is not true. Ever since he accused me of that i cry silently on my own while doing housework or watching tv wishing i could hold back the tears. I work very long hours and i always assume responsibility for everything, which makes me exhausted for more than 50% of the time. I am confused because half the time i see how much he loves me and that he would do nearly anything for me, but when i am in pain he just gets angry, or irritated and almost always leaves me alone and excuses himself to watch tv or play a videogame. The result is that i constantly feel unworthy of anyone's love and lonely. But everytime i try to discuss a problem with him, (like how he refused to help me so i would not miss a very important deadline at work because he had to spend three afternoons fixing a problem at his father's restaurant so he wont pay a technician), he gets all defensive and says i am worthless and i depend on him for everything and offends me in every possible way. I cry, both because i missed a deadline and because of his words and he leaves, because i am weak or manipulative. How should i handle that? I can try not to react to his words when he is angry or overwhelmed by stress. But should i not react to his actions and choices either? Should i just pretend that i'm not hurt by anything?


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## MattMatt

@White Oleander This is a very old thread.

Many people here will be able to help you, but it would be best for you to repost your post in a new thread in General Relationships.


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## MattMatt

Zombie thread... closing...


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