# Do I have a **right** to a hot sex life?



## oubliette (Jun 24, 2012)

This is my first post, but I'll be reading other threads as soon as I click Post, try to be a community member 

Now for my issues. 

I'm not physically attracted to my husband. I sort of knew it even when we were engaged, but there was still the novelty factor going on, and he looked like someone I _should_ be attracted to. My type, if you will. 

I've already worked out that I should not have gone through with the marriage- I did him a disservice. The whole thing felt like an unstoppable freight train at the time, but I know that was rationalization and I should have left him then.

Now we've got two kids and a mortgage together.

The sex itself is mechanical for me. I don't want him going down anymore, because I don't want someone that I'm not turned on by on me so intimately. If I have a drink or two, I mind sex less, but that is even more depressing when I think about it. He isn't great in bed, anyway, but that is almost irrelevant since I don't even care if he gets any better, because being naked with him is vaguely distasteful.

I've told him I don't have chemistry with him, but never said "I'm not attracted to you" in exactly those words. I feel like when I do say that, it is the end, because who could hear that and want to keep climbing on top of someone who doesn't want it?

He is crazy about me. I love him but am not in love with him.

I fantasize about others- have to to get even slightly aroused. And now I've got someone else pursuing me for a sexual relationship, and while I don't intend on going down that road, it is surely on my mind.

That was a lot. Please share any thoughts.


----------



## lamaga (May 8, 2012)

No, you do not have a right to a "hot" sex life. But you do have a right to an honest marriage, as does your husband. I think you should address this disconnect openly with him, as the feelings you are having are not going to lead to anywhere good.


----------



## diwali123 (Feb 17, 2012)

I'm just curious why you married him if you weren't attracted? What else did he have to offer that you liked? 
I don't think you have the right to cheat. I don't really know what to say to help because I don't get it when people marry someone they aren't in love with, so I can't really relate. Do you think he has any idea of how you feel?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## tacoma (May 1, 2011)

lamaga said:


> No, you do not have a right to a "hot" sex life.


Dammit Lamaga you`re bursting my bubble again!

OP`s in a tricky situation.

There`s really no good way to fix it other than becoming attracted to her H.

Edit:

Cool screen name OP.


----------



## anonim (Apr 24, 2012)

you are depriving your H of the opportunity to have a W that loves him.

Let. Him. Go.

Stop. Being. Selfish.


----------



## oubliette (Jun 24, 2012)

You all are fast. Thanks.



lamaga said:


> No, you do not have a right to a "hot" sex life. But you do have a right to an honest marriage, as does your husband. I think you should address this disconnect openly with him, as the feelings you are having are not going to lead to anywhere good.


So, say "I don't like having sex with you, and you don't turn me on?" I was trying to paint the picture for him with telling him that I was not like this in the past, and I don't feel a spark. Maybe that isn't blunt enough.



diwali123 said:


> I'm just curious why you married him if you weren't attracted? What else did he have to offer that you liked?
> I don't think you have the right to cheat. I don't really know what to say to help because I don't get it when people marry someone they aren't in love with, so I can't really relate. Do you think he has any idea of how you feel?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


He knows that he is more into me than I am him. And the original problem- marrying him when I wasn't head over heels for him- was a mistake. I believe I went for him because he was very safe, and I had had back to back boyfriends that I was on fire for that broke me heart.

I know I don't have the right to cheat. I haven't, and haven't looked for it.



tacoma said:


> Dammit Lamaga you`re bursting my bubble again!
> 
> OP`s in a tricky situation.
> 
> ...


Yeah... if anyone has any Love Potion that can make me aroused by the next man I set eyes on after drinking, I'm down.


----------



## tacoma (May 1, 2011)

Can you point to what qualities he has or lacks that keep you from being into him?

Is he too clingy, or not attentive enough?

What is it?


----------



## oubliette (Jun 24, 2012)

anonim said:


> you are depriving your H of the opportunity to have a W that loves him.
> 
> Let. Him. Go.
> 
> Stop. Being. Selfish.


I have used those very words a couple of years ago when I did try to leave.

I said "you deserve someone who is crazy about you."

He said (and says every time the subject starts to come up) "I don't care I'll do anything to keep from losing you."

I think I'd like to leave, but I'm having a hard time imagining just how badly he'd be hurt.


----------



## oubliette (Jun 24, 2012)

tacoma said:


> Can you point to what qualities he has or lacks that keep you from being into him?
> 
> Is he too clingy, or not attentive enough?
> 
> What is it?


Well, he is a wimp and a whiner. He isn't very good with our 3 year old... sounds like a 12 year old girl, petulant and snotty, which is a MASSIVE turn off.

He wants to sit on the couch and play video games. His father and uncle do not leave their recliners, so I can see the future and it isn't a pleasant prospect.

These things I really only understood maybe 20% prior to marriage. So while I can absolutely be faulted for marrying someone that I was uncertain about sexually, I don't so much blame myself for this last bit.


----------



## Gaia (Apr 27, 2012)

How long did you date this guy before marrying him? And the kid.. is his and yours? To be honest... I feel that marrying because "he's safe" is the worst possible thing you could do.. it usually always results in your situation...


----------



## tacoma (May 1, 2011)

oubliette said:


> Well, he is a wimp and a whiner. He isn't very good with our 3 year old... sounds like a 12 year old girl, petulant and snotty, which is a MASSIVE turn off.
> 
> He wants to sit on the couch and play video games. His father and uncle do not leave their recliners, so I can see the future and it isn't a pleasant prospect.
> 
> These things I really only understood maybe 20% prior to marriage. So while I can absolutely be faulted for marrying someone that I was uncertain about sexually, I don't so much blame myself for this last bit.


I really wish he were here instead of you OP.

Nothing personal but I think I could help him figure out how to change into a man you could respect.

If you feel it`s worth a shot send him here....

Married Man Sex Life | How to have the marriage you thought you were going to have. By which I mean doing it like rabbits.


----------



## Maricha75 (May 8, 2012)

oubliette said:


> Well, he is a wimp and a whiner. He isn't very good with our 3 year old... sounds like a 12 year old girl, petulant and snotty, which is a MASSIVE turn off.
> 
> He wants to sit on the couch and play video games. His father and uncle do not leave their recliners, so I can see the future and it isn't a pleasant prospect.
> 
> These things I really only understood maybe 20% prior to marriage. So while I can absolutely be faulted for marrying someone that I was uncertain about sexually, *I don't so much blame myself for this last bit.*


Actually, you CAN be blamed for it...you ALLOW the behavior. You don't like that he is whiny and wimpy... you want a "real man". Have you tried MC to address this behavior?


----------



## Maricha75 (May 8, 2012)

tacoma said:


> I really wish he were here instead of you OP.
> 
> Nothing personal but I think I could help him figure out how to change into a man you could respect.
> 
> ...


OOOOH OOOOH!! I was thinking MMSL as well!


----------



## Gaia (Apr 27, 2012)

I think you really need to sit down and talk with him, tell him exactly what you desire in a man, how he makes you feel, ect. MC is also a great idea and like tacoma suggested.. send him here to check out that link.


----------



## oubliette (Jun 24, 2012)

I'll refer him to the link.

It seems bizarre to even contemplate that part of the solution could be him making changes. Feels too good to be true.


----------



## Gaia (Apr 27, 2012)

Well I don't think it should be JUST him making changes... Perhaps you should try and find some positives about him that you find attractive as well...?


----------



## DTO (Dec 18, 2011)

oubliette said:


> So, say "I don't like having sex with you, and you don't turn me on?" I was trying to paint the picture for him with telling him that I was not like this in the past, and I don't feel a spark. Maybe that isn't blunt enough.
> 
> He knows that he is more into me than I am him. And the original problem- marrying him when I wasn't head over heels for him- was a mistake. I believe I went for him because he was very safe, and I had had back to back boyfriends that I was on fire for that broke me heart.
> 
> I know I don't have the right to cheat. I haven't, and haven't looked for it.


Don't say the above. You admit here and in an earlier post you screwed up by marrying someone to whom you knew you were insufficiently attracted. But telling him you don't want him in that manner has a big dose of implied blameshift.

You should bite the bullet and admit you never were that attracted to him. Own up that you were going for the safe guy who made you feel good by wanting you and checked off the boxes that you wanted (stable, good provider, etc.) but have discovered that was not enough.

Now, he will feel bad and, as you noted, there are practical difficulties to a divorce at this point. So, if (unsurprisingly) he is offended or angry at your deception, ask him what else you can do to make this marriage more palatable for him. Then do it.


----------



## oubliette (Jun 24, 2012)

DTO said:


> So, is (unsurprisingly) he is offended or angry at your deception, ask him what else you can do to make this marriage more palatable for him. Then do it.


And what could that possibly be? 

I asked him if we could open up the marriage. I thought that there must be a seed-sowing 'typical' guy in there that would emerge and say YES!

Instead, he says he doesn't want to share me.


----------



## DTO (Dec 18, 2011)

oubliette said:


> I have used those very words a couple of years ago when I did try to leave.
> 
> I said "you deserve someone who is crazy about you."
> 
> ...


From personal experience:

My personal drive to fight more the marriage was rooted in a belief that I had done something to impact my ex's desire for me. Once I knew that my ex never really did like me that much in that way, my drive to serve her really diminished, and the prospect of being single became much more palatable (and, in fact preferable).

If you tell him the real, honest truth, you might find that he takes it better than you expect. The flip side, of course, is that you liked him so much because he is so into you. Once the truth comes out, you can expect him to do less for you (and devote that energy to other things, like the kids) and you will have to do more for yourself.

Nonetheless, if you respect him you should tell him anyways. If you continue to let him believe in any manner that your lack of attraction to him is his fault, you are both living a lie and you are benefitting from his false hope. I know you mentioned that you are turned off by his video gaming and parenting style. But, I suspect the deeper truth is that you would not lust for him even if those negative attributes were not present.

My experience was that it was bad enough my ex lied about her attraction to me when she asked me to marry her. My feelings about her were made much worse because she lied throughout our marriage by saying that her lack of attraction to me was because of something I did or did not do. I would rather have been told the truth early on, so that I could make an informed decision about how I wanted to spend the rest of my life.

Lastly, I think you might be giving yourself too much credit here. The truth is that if he is really as good a guy as you say, then someone will detect and appreciate those qualities and actually _want_ him besides, and sooner than you might expect (or want to admit).


----------



## DTO (Dec 18, 2011)

tacoma said:


> I really wish he were here instead of you OP.
> 
> Nothing personal but I think I could help him figure out how to change into a man you could respect.
> 
> If you feel it`s worth a shot send him here....


I don't think respect is the problem here. She admitted that she was unattracted to him before marriage and before she got even more turned off by his video games and parenting (which by her own admission she did not know).

She could respect him to death as a father and provider. That is not going to make her on fire for him. At best, it might make sex a little more palatable for her.

The OP's husband needs to know the whole truth and then figure out if making those changes and having the OP's view of sex go from "minimize" to "tolerate" is where he wants to spend his time / energy / life.


----------



## oubliette (Jun 24, 2012)

DTO said:


> Lastly, I think you might be giving yourself too much credit here. The truth is that if he is really as good a guy as you say, then someone will detect and appreciate those qualities and actually _want_ him besides, and sooner than you might expect (or want to admit).


OF COURSE someone else would discern his good qualities and want him! I've spent time assuring him of this, as messed up as that sounds.

While I do appreciate the perspective of someone who had a wife with similar feelings to mine, you are missing the mark slightly by assuming I undervalue him, or overvalue myself.

ETA: I believe part of the reason he is so terrified of my leaving is that he lacks confidence, and does not see that he is a catch. It isn't because I'm So Great, clearly.


----------



## DTO (Dec 18, 2011)

Gaia said:


> Well I don't think it should be JUST him making changes... Perhaps you should try and find some positives about him that you find attractive as well...?


I agree wholeheartedly.

To the OP: I would suggest you take a "love is an action, not a feeling" approach. Do not bemoan that you are not hot for him (which probably happens in the best relationships at times). Instead, be with him, enthusiastically, as a sign of appreciation for the relationship and the faithfulness during which he has served you and the children.

To be clear, I am not talking about duty sex. I am talking about sex for him coming from a generous. selfless you - something entirely within your power to make happen.


----------



## oubliette (Jun 24, 2012)

I want to reiterate my thanks for the rapid and honest responses.

I should have worded my OP "is it acceptable to live sexually unfulfilled." Because while I do have some hopes for the stuff by Athol Kay that an earlier poster provided, if it doesn't work, I am facing a very long time without being sexuall aroused and sated.

I'm 29 years old.


----------



## DTO (Dec 18, 2011)

oubliette said:


> And what could that possibly be?
> 
> I asked him if we could open up the marriage. I thought that there must be a seed-sowing 'typical' guy in there that would emerge and say YES!
> 
> Instead, he says he doesn't want to share me.


That's not what I mean.

First of all, you don't understand male sexuality. The seed-sowing "stereotype" is really not the typical guy at all. Unless you are talking about a horny teenager / young adult, guys want to be with someone who wants them back. Why do you think that pity sex is so frequently rejected?

Then, how is opening up the marriage offering him anything? I could be wrong - but it seems you are not offering or sacrificing anything, because you don't want him in the first place. In fact, you stand to benefit from this by making it more sure that he will stick around to support the household in which you reside.

See the part I just wrote about sacrificing to cheerfully meet his sexual need. If you cannot stomach that, you will just have to ask him to see what else you can do to make him feel better.


----------



## DTO (Dec 18, 2011)

oubliette said:


> I want to reiterate my thanks for the rapid and honest responses.
> 
> I should have worded my OP "is it acceptable to live sexually unfulfilled." Because while I do have some hopes for the stuff by Athol Kay that an earlier poster provided, if it doesn't work, I am facing a very long time without being sexuall aroused and sated.
> 
> I'm 29 years old.


That is ultimately a personal choice. You are going to work that out for yourself. I understand that your choice is made harder by (1) you created this issue and (2) there are other parties (including kids) at stake.

BTW, I think it's a good sign that you are at aware of a potential impact to others and seem to care. Other people in this situation might not have the same level of empathy (if they have any at all).

Best of luck to you.


----------



## Maricha75 (May 8, 2012)

oubliette said:


> And what could that possibly be?
> 
> *I asked him if we could open up the marriage. I thought that there must be a seed-sowing 'typical' guy in there that would emerge and say YES!*
> 
> *Instead, he says he doesn't want to share me.*


You thought he would be open to sharing you, because he doesn't want to lose you? Most men, from my experience, do not have that "seed-sowing 'typical' guy" inside once they have married. MOST men choose to marry because they want that ONE woman. Again, based on my experience. And now, the fact that you suggested open marriage, he likely is wondering if you are already seeing someone. You said already that someone is pursuing you. And, that the idea is looking good. The fact is, if he said yes, you would have already jumped this other guy and you know it. 

Now, if you want to actually TRY to make the marriage work... tell this other guy to take a hike. Yes, I know, you aren't pursuing him. Doesn't matter. If you are not telling him that you want nothing to do with him, he will continue to pursue. If you want to try to fix your marriage, get into counseling.


----------



## SoWhat (Jan 7, 2012)

oubliette said:


> I want to reiterate my thanks for the rapid and honest responses.
> 
> I should have worded my OP "is it acceptable to live sexually unfulfilled." Because while I do have some hopes for the stuff by Athol Kay that an earlier poster provided, if it doesn't work, I am facing a very long time without being sexuall aroused and sated.
> 
> I'm 29 years old.



Acceptable to whom?
Arguably, it's pretty unacceptable to marry someone you're not attracted to and rob them of a chance to find someone to have a mutual relationship with. 

People who "benignly" grant their presence in a relationship to someone else are generally doing so for some more selfish reason than their moral code or sense of pity. 

I'm not trying to sit here and throw dirt on you, but I'm saying: be aware of your own motivations for things and don't try to blameshift the relationship by invoking the old "oh, but I'd hurt him _so much _if I left." 

That's pretty transparent to me ------ because that was me in a past relationship. I was just 'too nice' to dump her. But I wasn't being nice - I liked the ease of the relationship and some of the things she brought to it, and just had no qualms robbing her of someone who actually was attracted to her.


----------



## Catherine602 (Oct 14, 2010)

You have not said why you expect him to pull the plug? Why can't you take responsibility to do the right thing. You hurt him a 1000 times by telling him you don't want him. You say he is a good guy, why would you hurt a man who has done nothing but love you. 

You said you were were hurt by previous BF but you do the same thing to him. 

I don't think he will tolerate this for much longer. Many people in this situation, experience an off switch. Suddenly it is over. So you won't have him forever. Hopefully he will divorce and not cheat bu either may happen. 

There are two good choices, commit to working with him and on yourself to solve your marital problems. Use a good MC. Ask him if he is willing to work hard with you to make changes. give it a timeline maybe 6 months. If it does not work then divorce. The option is to let him go. 

There is a chance that you can have a loving relationship if you work on your immaturity, self - centeredness and lack of compassion. The things that turn you off are fixable. 

I am almost certain that if you divorce him you will regret it. You probably will not find anyone like him.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Interlocutor (Dec 29, 2011)

I wish I could speak to the OP's husband. He needs advice too... Particularly, in my humble opinion, I'd tell him to get off the couch, reduce his time playing video games, and get himself a divorce. Then I'd tell him to find someone who wants him.


----------



## Gaia (Apr 27, 2012)

Refer him to the NMMNG thread perhaps?


----------



## jaharthur (May 25, 2012)

I have read in a number of posts here the line "I love him but am not in love with him."

What the heck does that mean?


----------



## oubliette (Jun 24, 2012)

Catherine602 said:


> You have not said why you expect him to pull the plug? Why can't you take responsibility to do the right thing. You hurt him a 1000 times by telling him you don't want him. You say he is a good guy, why would you hurt a man who has done nothing but love you.
> 
> You said you were were hurt by previous BF but you do the same thing to him.
> 
> ...


What has triggered you about my situation?

And what information did I give that portrays him as so amazing that I would never find another like him?

Your post is the first that suprised me.


----------



## anchorwatch (Mar 5, 2012)

jaharthur said:


> I have read in a number of posts here the line "I love him but am not in love with him."
> 
> What the heck does that mean?


It means 'I don't want to hurt you, but i want to Fvck someone else".


----------



## Drover (Jun 11, 2012)

oubliette said:


> I'll refer him to the link.
> 
> It seems bizarre to even contemplate that part of the solution could be him making changes. Feels too good to be true.


MMSL is the right answer. Don't refer him to the link. Go out and buy him the book! And tell him you NEED him to read it and do it.


----------



## moxy (Apr 2, 2012)

Don't look for justification to cheat. Either find a way to make your sex life and attraction to your husband greater or let him go so that he can be with someone who does appreciate him.

I'm sorry to be harsh but you sound deeply immature and selfish because your posts sound like you are more concerned with your own sense of self-entitlement than any real interpersonal connection. Have you thought about what your words would sound like if they were coming from someone else? You sound like a kid who is tired of a great toy because the novelty has worn off. If you don't take care of these issues of boredom and self-entitlement, even your next partner won't be enough for you and you'll just continue replacing partners until you realize that the problem is within you.


----------



## Lon (Jun 6, 2011)

No offense to the OP, i very likely could have gotten this wrong, but it sounds an awful lot like a cheating spouse who has already made a choice, perhaps even acted innapropriately, and is coming here seeking advice on how to rewrite history in order to overcome the cognitive dissonance.

If your H is devoted and good to you why would you not try to spice up your own sex life with him... he seems like the kind that has you on a pedestal and would never consider cheating on you... yes he makes himself appear of lower value which you find revolting, but this is your H and he would likely do anything you told him to do, but he needs some specific instructions because he is paralyzed with fear of losing you and probably feels like he's painted himself into the corner of his own self-worth. Give him some specific instructions, and stroke his ego a little, and you will be able to nurture a really great, confident and attractive man.

Or if he is as lousy a guy as you think and you feel stuck just let him go before you cheat on him and break his heart to a million pieces instead of just half.

I think for women married to nice guys, its the thought of having to be the one to nurture a man's ego back to health is a big turn off that they are unwilling to do because they've convinced themselves it defeats the purpose - which is unfortunate because so many potentially great marriages could be saved is some women were a little less selfless and more committed to the marriage they signed on for life to.


----------



## Gaia (Apr 27, 2012)

Lon said:


> a little less self*ish*


Fixed that for ya lon.  (At least i think that's what you meant?)


----------



## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

Let me guess:
Your H is constantly telling you how much he loves you
He is too emotional in general
He talks about his feelings too much

Whatever "edge" he had is gone. When you are a bit bltchy with him, he apologizes even though you should be apologizing.

Give him a book to read: married man sex life by Athol Kay.

If you want, go to athol's website first. He exaggerates for effect but understands female sexuality frighteningly well.






oubliette said:


> This is my first post, but I'll be reading other threads as soon as I click Post, try to be a community member
> 
> Now for my issues.
> 
> ...


_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Lyris (Mar 29, 2012)

I don't think you deserve anything other than what you've got, frankly. I do think your husband deserves to be married to someone who is attracted to him.

You did a ****ty thing when you agreed to marry someone you weren't in love with. So yeah, do the right thing and leave.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## oubliette (Jun 24, 2012)

I bought the Athol Kay book and sent it to my husband's Kindle. There is no doubt that if he can fully incorporate the concepts there, it will be dramatically different. And while I strongly disagree with my characterization as selfish and immature, the fact that two used those terms means I'll try to watch myself for it.

I have to remind myself that everyone sees things from the perspective of their own experience. So the few insightful people who sent me a helpful tool for working on things, rather than going straight to "you're crap and you should do 'the right thing' and leave him" are much appreciated.

I do love this man, and have never thought about cheating. We have a good day to day life 90% of the time. The guy who is trying to get in my pants is relevant really only because it puts my lackluster married sex life in the forefront of my mind.


----------



## deejov (Sep 24, 2011)

Good for you for buying the book. I would also suggest that you read it as well. It can be helpful.

I'm a woman, with a somewhat similar attitude towards my stxh. I don't see him as manly, he doesn't view sex the same way I do, etc there isn't the "hot on fire" aspect.

And I can say that I am partly to blame for that. 

You married someone who, in the end, transformed to someone that doesn't light your fire. You can help that. You can help to bring it out. LIttle things like appreciating that being a father is different. There is a sexiness in that, if you are open to seeing it. Its a stage of life. 

Things like getting away for a weekend, going out on dates without the kids, getting him interested in a hobby, or dragging him out for exercise. Some people need a push, especially if their family dynamic and role models were "couch sitting". If that doesn't turn you on, then get up and go do something together. 

Someone has to make a change. Since you are not happy with it, why not try? You might find it makes a positive change.


----------



## hookares (Dec 7, 2011)

jaharthur said:


> I have read in a number of posts here the line "I love him but am not in love with him."
> 
> What the heck does that mean?


It means : "I love the fact that you provide for me financially and try to see to it that I live a comfortable life". but " I find having sex with you repulsive and you just don't have what it takes for me to be in love with you".

These relationships make it patently clear that nobody should ever consider matrimony if either potential spouse is a virgin. Once you've been around the block a few times, you should be able to know which way to head when taking the walk.


----------



## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

Oubliette,
Dont give up on this site. I realize it is inherently hostile to people in your situation but:
- you can get help here
- you can learn how to help your H 

The posters on this site all lament the lack of LD participants, and then stone them when they appear.



UOTE=oubliette;852587]I bought the Athol Kay book and sent it to my husband's Kindle. There is no doubt that if he can fully incorporate the concepts there, it will be dramatically different. And while I strongly disagree with my characterization as selfish and immature, the fact that two used those terms means I'll try to watch myself for it.

I have to remind myself that everyone sees things from the perspective of their own experience. So the few insightful people who sent me a helpful tool for working on things, rather than going straight to "you're crap and you should do 'the right thing' and leave him" are much appreciated.

I do love this man, and have never thought about cheating. We have a good day to day life 90% of the time. The guy who is trying to get in my pants is relevant really only because it puts my lackluster married sex life in the forefront of my mind.[/QUOTE]
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

Nope.

The foundation for anything to change is for him to demonstrate that he can be happy without her. She doesn't respect him - he has no boundaries. 
As for the video games - my guess is he should insist on a schedule that gives them both a similar amount of free time.


UOTE=deejov;852598]Good for you for buying the book. I would also suggest that you read it as well. It can be helpful.

I'm a woman, with a somewhat similar attitude towards my stxh. I don't see him as manly, he doesn't view sex the same way I do, etc there isn't the "hot on fire" aspect.

And I can say that I am partly to blame for that. 

You married someone who, in the end, transformed to someone that doesn't light your fire. You can help that. You can help to bring it out. LIttle things like appreciating that being a father is different. There is a sexiness in that, if you are open to seeing it. Its a stage of life. 

Things like getting away for a weekend, going out on dates without the kids, getting him interested in a hobby, or dragging him out for exercise. Some people need a push, especially if their family dynamic and role models were "couch sitting". If that doesn't turn you on, then get up and go do something together. 

Someone has to make a change. Since you are not happy with it, why not try? You might find it makes a positive change.[/QUOTE]
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Maricha75 (May 8, 2012)

MEM11363 said:


> Nope.
> 
> The foundation for anything to change is for him to demonstrate that he can be happy without her. She doesn't respect him - he has no boundaries.
> *As for the video games - my guess is he should insist on a schedule that gives them both a similar amount of free time.*
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I do agree with this, however I would add that while trying to get things on track/back on track in the relationship, the games should be set aside for awhile so they can reconnect. My husband and I had to do that. We were both so engrossed in our gaming that we knew next to nothing about each other. In setting aside the games, as well as getting rid of other distractions (read: "friends" who were toxic to the marriage), things are getting back on track.

OP, it is a tough road, for sure. But as long as you are willing to put in work (and as long as HE doesn't slack off), you should be ok. Good luck to you!


----------



## oubliette (Jun 24, 2012)

MEM11363 said:


> Oubliette,
> Dont give up on this site. I realize it is inherently hostile to people in your situation but:
> - you can get help here
> - you can learn how to help your H
> ...


Thank you.

I'm still kind of nonplussed that I try reaching out and the majority of the responses go straight to divorce. 

Also... the threads are chock full of sympathy and support for spouses who aren't getting any because they are turned down. I'd like to know why it is so shameful and selfish to ask for help to not _want_ to turn it down?!

Actually, I'm just trying to make sure I'm discounting some posts for the right reasons- that they are actually working from incorrect assumptions, not just that they are telling me what I don't want to hear.


----------



## oubliette (Jun 24, 2012)

jaharthur said:


> I have read in a number of posts here the line "I love him but am not in love with him."
> 
> What the heck does that mean?


Well, to me it means that I care deeply for my husband. I want to make our marriage work, and I will do a lot not to hurt him. But he doesn't quicken my pulse, and I can imagine how I'd live without him.

It does not mean that I'm looking at other perspective sexual partners. 

Others are more cynical.


----------



## seeking sanity (Oct 20, 2009)

oubliette - I doesn't surprise me he shot down the "open marriage" idea. Realistically, it'd be way easier for you to find a lover than for him, just the nature of male and female priorities. 

Obviously you can't control him, you can state your honest feelings and monitor to see if he makes positive changes. You can also encourage the behaviour you want by rewarding it. If he makes an effort you'd be better off responding to it, otherwise if he feels shot down, he'll just retreat into what he knows.


----------



## Tall Average Guy (Jul 26, 2011)

oubliette said:


> Well, to me it means that I care deeply for my husband. I want to make our marriage work, and I will do a lot not to hurt him. But he doesn't quicken my pulse, and I can imagine how I'd live without him.


One problem you have is that he has never quickened your pulse. What can he do to change that? It is not like he can loose weight, or change back to the guy you dated. There may be nothing he can do. If so, what are you left with?

Also, you need to recognize that part of the hostility stems from your dishonesty with your husband. You married him becasue he gave you the life you wanted, not because you loved him like a woman loves her man. You stole that from him, so you need to own that. 



> It does not mean that I'm looking at other perspective sexual partners.
> 
> Others are more cynical.


No, but you are admittedly open to it. You have a guy approaching you and you admit to considering it. This is a huge problem, because it means just one weak moment can cause you huge problems. You need to shut him down straight away and focus on your husband if you want to have any chance. Consider that you (to date unacted upon) feelings for this other man may be clouding your current preception of your husband.


----------



## Lon (Jun 6, 2011)

oubliette said:


> Well, to me it means that I care deeply for my husband. I want to make our marriage work, and I will do a lot not to hurt him. But he doesn't quicken my pulse, and I can imagine how I'd live without him.
> 
> It does not mean that I'm looking at other perspective sexual partners.
> 
> Others are more cynical.


I think a lot of people can relate to what ILYBINILWY means, most have been in relationships where there is a common love and respect, but realize it is not going anywhere - a responsible person tests and verifies this before committing to marriage, which is why it is wise to never marry too young or base the marriage on emotion.

From what I am understanding of it, when one spouse vocalizes it to the other it is pretty much a guarantee that it is too late, have completely lost faith in their spouse to ever be a person they can ever be sexually attracted to again, and will never look back. It's unfortunate, often tragic and quite usually unecessary IMHO.


----------



## Trickster (Nov 19, 2011)

Before I met my wife, I was hurt by a past relationship. I had my short lived wild and crazy days and my wife had a rated “G” personality, which is what I wanted at the time. Now, 20 years later and she is still rated “G”. There is nothing hot and wild about it at all. 

I think I liked her because I told her all about my garbage and she actuall stayed. The woman before her that I opened up to bolted. I was a little hurt. 

For the last year or so, things are a little better… Well…Lots better compare to what it was before. She is trying. I hoping that with enough sex, it will bring love in our relationship. 

Like you, The spark that started all this was a few women being flirtatious with me. Being in my mid-life crises (excuse), I started to work out, get healthy, shave my head… In doing that, I became a more confident man. I do think about them OW a lot more that I should. I have read so many book on marriage it drives me nuts. I am working on my part. My wife has to work on her stuff too. 

My wife doesn’t light my fire now or really ever before. We have just been best friends for so long and I am not about to do something to hurt her or lose that friendship. As of now, I can’t imagine what my life would be like with one of these single women. It may be fun for a while, but in 5 years? 10 years? 20 years? Sometimes I think the grass is greener somewhere else, but that is just my mind playing games with me. 

For now, I am working on acceptance and to realize my wife will not change.


----------



## oubliette (Jun 24, 2012)

Tall Average Guy said:


> You have a guy approaching you and you admit to considering it. This is a huge problem, because it means just one weak moment can cause you huge problems. You need to shut him down straight away and focus on your husband if you want to have any chance. Consider that you (to date unacted upon) feelings for this other man may be clouding your current preception of your husband.


I'm not, and I haven't, considered it. I've thought about what he is after, but that isn't the same as actually entertaining the tought of doing something about it. What I'm trying to say is that I'm not tempted.

But I'm aware that I could be, if the person behind the proposition lit my fire. And THAT is why I know we need a satisfying sex life. That and my husband deserves it.


----------



## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

Oubliette,
Give this 3 months. If it isn't really on the way to good at that point, you should tell him that:
- I mainly found you attractive in terms of stability and provider skills
- As for raw desire/lust - that was on the low end
- I am starting to think that what I am asking you to do - is unfair to you. You love me too much and it takes the challenge and excitement out of sex and intimacy. I know it seems unfair - but you don't appear able to manage your emotions in a way that works for us - sexually. It is not fair to you, because in the beginning I liked you chasing me, but you never made the transition. And now it is more like smothering me. And I have tried to tell you that but you don't seem to get it. We need to part ways for both our sanity. 

In the meantime: 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Athol writes about women - you need to give him a short list about you - the woman he loves. It is also true, that emotional self control can be learned and is like a muscle that can become very strong through use. He needs that the most. As for the turn offs, you can address them as they are - negatives that kill desire. AND for each one you should say "It would be great if you would do X, when Y happens". He may ask if that will be a turn "on". Be brutally honest here. The answer is no. These things kill desire - so fixing them makes desire possible - but doesn't really trigger it. 

You cannot allow him to connect "exerting self control so he stops yelling at a 3 year old with getting rewarded with sex."

You can/should say that desire is impossible without respect. Oh - BTW - the reason he doesn't know that is men generally aren't wired that way. Most of us can have sex, even if at some level we don't respect our partners - that is not a good thing. Just a true thing. 

Behavioral:
Turn offs:
- Behavior with your 3 year old (give examples of what you dislike, if he denies them, smile and offer to leave a voice activated recorder in the main room where they interact). Let him listen to himself. 
- Clingy behavior with you
- Frequently saying "ILY" when he really means: "Do you love me?"
- Angry behavior with you
- Letting you push him around:
It is completely natural for you to do this - to test his strength. Do NOT force yourself to stop doing this. Because that will be admitting he is not only weak today, but that he lacks the potential to become strong. 
- Being willing to trade his self respect for sex (for example, you do something that is not respectful just before bed. Instead of being direct with you, he hopes to avoid the situation so he still has a shot at getting laid - BAD move)

Turn ons:
You have some. And you don't have to share them with us. AND you should NOT share them with him now. You should simply tell him that there are things which sometimes can turn you on, however, until the turn "off" list is addressed, there is no point in addressing them. 

Perhaps with one exception. It is usually a turn on for a woman to play a physical sport with her mate if:
- she likes the sport
- he excels at it and is fun to play with (he is a good sport, doesn't boast, is willing to help you improve)
- he demonstrates some level of sportsmanship via play
- he is FIT 

For us this is always a racquet sport. Currently it is tennis. You don't have to tell him that this activity is a turn on for you. Simply use it as a means of positive reinforcement. 






oubliette said:


> Thank you.
> 
> I'm still kind of nonplussed that I try reaching out and the majority of the responses go straight to divorce.
> 
> ...


----------



## DTO (Dec 18, 2011)

MEM11363 said:


> Oubliette,
> Dont give up on this site. I realize it is inherently hostile to people in your situation but:
> - you can get help here
> - you can learn how to help your H
> ...


1) We at TAM do not stone anyone, especially not the LD who are seeking to improve their relationships. We have issue with LD people who say or imply that their sexual views are inviolate.

2) The OP is not LD. She says that she has a sex drive but is frustrated because she cannot bear to do it with someone she does not want. Her subject line itself says she is seeking sexual satisfaction.

The reason we are getting on her case is because she kinda put herself in this situation by marrying someone more into her than she was into him. She put herself in this situation, which is now hurting her husband (and probably at some level her kids), and (initially) did not have a great deal of remorse coming through.

I still maintain that she needs to come completely clean and tell him that her lack of passion is not his fault in any way, because it was never there to begin with. I have not seen her willingness to do this, but I could be wrong.


----------



## Mavash. (Jan 26, 2012)

Hate to be a downer but sexual chemistry cannot be manufactured. It's either there or it's not. He could do everything right according to MMSL and it will only be a bandaid to the core problem.


----------



## DTO (Dec 18, 2011)

oubliette said:


> Thank you.
> 
> I'm still kind of nonplussed that I try reaching out and the majority of the responses go straight to divorce.
> 
> ...


Yeah, the divorce pleas might seem strong. But, then again, your posts can be interpreted to mean that you wish at some level that he would leave you, or condone an open marriage, so that you could seek your sexual satisfaction without you having to do the "dirty work" of ending the marriage. That's a pretty obvious situation of having your cake and eating it too - allowing a bad marriage because it's convenient for you and then getting out of it without looking bad when it's convenient for you - and that's going to rub most folks the wrong way. 

I think most here did get the facts right. Also, there are few facts but lots of feelings. The few facts are you married him without really wanting him, he is way into you, and you could get all the sex you want right now but are turning that down because of the lack of attraction that you brought with you.

I know you love him and said you have a generally good marriage (odd, because some would say that if the sex is bad the marriage is bad). But, you never disputed that none of that makes a difference in your attraction, and even admitted that the lack of attraction was a constant throughout the marriage.

My recommendation stands: meet your husband's sexual needs. Get rid of the mechanical sex and really engage him. Tell him the truth about the lack of attraction on your part from the beginning and (if genuine) express a desire to overcome that and find a way to make this work for both of you.

He may indeed lack confidence, and that might have stemmed (at least in part) from the implied rejection that comes along with the "duty sex" you have been providing. Yeah, guys can tell, and yeah it can mess with our self esteem. But, if he gains the confidence you want him to have, that increases the chance he will get fed up with the situation and leave.

So, that brings us full circle. You need to answer the question of "what do you want". Clearly this is not working for you. So the acceptable alternatives over the long term are (1) end the marriage, or (2) attempt to save the marriage, which means that you come clean, rebuild his confidence by admitting that your lack of lust for him is not because of anything he did or failed to do, and treat him the way the deserves to be treated because of what he does for you and the family, not the way you feel like treating him because you are not hot for him.


----------

