# I bet you have heard this before! Help!



## badaa05 (Nov 30, 2012)

So , my wife has always looked great. She is now addicted to the gym .. 4+ hours a day. She has made an entire host of new girlfriends that have crazy lives ... cheating, divorce, on and on. I have been enabling her to get out of the house a lot more. She is/was a very Godly woman and an outstanding mother. She is a stay at home mom and been selfless for years. She started letting go of a few things which I thought was good. Little did I know she was letting go of me. I thought we were very happy. We were having sex every night ..... out of her guilt. Long story short, I caught her in a major emotional affair with my BEST friend in the entire world. UNREAL! As soon as I found the evidence she said I have been unhappy for a long time , we are getting a divorce. I am crushed so I do the worst thing and go in to panic mode. I am telling her I am sorry ... yes I AM SORRY! Anyway I tried taking her to counseling. She is done and has seen an attorney. We are 32 and have been together since we were 15. We have 3 children that are incredible. The kids do not know. Her plan has been to "Make it through the holidays" all along. She pretends like I do not even exist to her. I am having conversations about how things are going to play out and going along with this. I have made a lot of mistakes along the way. She is saying I can't blame this emotional affair because she gave up on me a long time ago. I know she has been satisfied with us in the recent past. When I was suspecting her, I was snooping, tracking, lying, and whatever else to get the evidence. Those are now my key qualities plus controlling! So anyway .. she stays at home by choice. I am a professional with an above average income. Of course we are stuck in our house with this economy. I have a hope that Christmas with the kids will turn things around. I want this to work, but I can't be with her like this. I really love the girl. She is cold as ice right now. There are a lot of consequences to what she is doing .. I just don't think she sees that. She is getting bad advice from the wrong people. Everyone around us that knows is wrecked. I have had trouble with anxiety which exposes my weaknesses. I am trying to stay strong as best as possible. I am talking with my therapist more right now. I am actually surprised how well I am coping! If we get in to a conversation where she starts to feel guilt, she removes herself. We went to see our pastor and she felt like she was attacked .. someone told her the truth. I would not keep the kids from her in a divorce, well we would share them. I have told her she needs to come with me to a parenting class for potential divorce parents , and read a book about look term effects of divorce. I am trying to be nice but strong through all of this. I do have 2 attorneys on retainer, but I really want us to work. We have both taken each other for granted and deserve better. I think we can do this and come out stronger. ANY ADVICE? Thanks!


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## remorseful strayer (Nov 13, 2012)

badaa05 said:


> So , my wife has always looked great. She is now addicted to the gym .. 4+ hours a day. She has made an entire host of new girlfriends that have crazy lives ... cheating, divorce, on and on. I have been enabling her to get out of the house a lot more. She is/was a very Godly woman and an outstanding mother. She is a stay at home mom and been selfless for years. She started letting go of a few things which I thought was good. Little did I know she was letting go of me. I thought we were very happy. We were having sex every night ..... out of her guilt. Long story short, I caught her in a major emotional affair with my BEST friend in the entire world. UNREAL! As soon as I found the evidence she said I have been unhappy for a long time , we are getting a divorce. I am crushed so I do the worst thing and go in to panic mode. I am telling her I am sorry ... yes I AM SORRY! Anyway I tried taking her to counseling. She is done and has seen an attorney. We are 32 and have been together since we were 15. We have 3 children that are incredible. The kids do not know. Her plan has been to "Make it through the holidays" all along. She pretends like I do not even exist to her. I am having conversations about how things are going to play out and going along with this. I have made a lot of mistakes along the way. She is saying I can't blame this emotional affair because she gave up on me a long time ago. I know she has been satisfied with us in the recent past. When I was suspecting her, I was snooping, tracking, lying, and whatever else to get the evidence. Those are now my key qualities plus controlling! So anyway .. she stays at home by choice. I am a professional with an above average income. Of course we are stuck in our house with this economy. I have a hope that Christmas with the kids will turn things around. I want this to work, but I can't be with her like this. I really love the girl. She is cold as ice right now. There are a lot of consequences to what she is doing .. I just don't think she sees that. She is getting bad advice from the wrong people. Everyone around us that knows is wrecked. I have had trouble with anxiety which exposes my weaknesses. I am trying to stay strong as best as possible. I am talking with my therapist more right now. I am actually surprised how well I am coping! If we get in to a conversation where she starts to feel guilt, she removes herself. We went to see our pastor and she felt like she was attacked .. someone told her the truth. I would not keep the kids from her in a divorce, well we would share them. I have told her she needs to come with me to a parenting class for potential divorce parents , and read a book about look term effects of divorce. I am trying to be nice but strong through all of this. I do have 2 attorneys on retainer, but I really want us to work. We have both taken each other for granted and deserve better. I think we can do this and come out stronger. ANY ADVICE? Thanks!


The other man will likely run like heck when she tries to push for something more serious. 

She may or may not be back, but this relationship won't last long.


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## CH (May 18, 2010)

Your ex-best friend has to go.


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## didntcitcoming (Oct 15, 2012)

180.....start like yesterday! :smthumbup:


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## badaa05 (Nov 30, 2012)

Ex best friend is married with children as well. He has all the advantages. That is the one guy that knows our relationship. We shared that with each other, which is odd ... being men and all.


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## badaa05 (Nov 30, 2012)

didntcitcoming said:


> 180.....start like yesterday! :smthumbup:


Please explain?


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## badaa05 (Nov 30, 2012)

What's ironic is my wife says she knows this relationship would never work long term. I am taking it she "has seen the light" and is high from it.


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## didntcitcoming (Oct 15, 2012)

badaa05 said:


> Ex best friend is married with children as well. He has all the advantages. That is the one guy that knows our relationship. We shared that with each other, which is odd ... being men and all.


Yeah he is an a$$hole!! did you tell his wife yet??


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## The Middleman (Apr 30, 2012)

badaa05 said:


> Ex best friend is married with children as well. He has all the advantages. That is the one guy that knows our relationship. We shared that with each other, which is odd ... being men and all.


Immediately, call your best friend's wife and tell her about what is going on. Give her what ever evidence you have and let her take care of him. That should end the emotional affair.


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## thunderstruck (May 9, 2012)

-Tell his wife.
-Do the 180.
-File on her cheating azz, and maybe the fog will clear from her mind.
-You say you apologized. If you gave a sincere one for things you could have done better, good, now don't repeat it, and stop saying you're sorry.


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## didntcitcoming (Oct 15, 2012)

badaa05 said:


> Please explain?


Google it....marriage builders 180....you MUST start NOW!!!

I don't have the link but i'm sure one of the senior members will show up with it.


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## Machiavelli (Feb 25, 2012)

First, you're going about this all wrong. You've gone about your marriage all wrong, although the problems are not what you think they are. Other than the adultery of course. Answer the following questions:

When did your wife start training?

When did the affair start?

Is your wife a SAHM?

Is your friend the OM a so-called "Christian?"

What happened with OMW on Dday?

What kind of shape are you in?

Do women hit on you a lot? ever? at all?

I must say, I'm getting tired of reading this same book over and over.


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## Machiavelli (Feb 25, 2012)

Forget marriage builders. Plan A is a counter productive.


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## Ikaika (Apr 23, 2012)

badaa05

I am pro-marriage, and would love to see this work out for the best, but the way you describe it, yes she is gone (maybe not physically, but she is gone). I really don't know what you can do to win her back... Sure you can read the threads (which I am sure someone will post) on the 180 strategy, but that would have been more affective years back. I think your description of her (and remember we only get one side of the story - yours) would mean that you would be wise to at least talk with your legal counsel to discuss your options on what a settlement would look like. 

You certainly want to at least remain on ,as much as you can muster, congenial relations with her for the sake of the children. I would suggest that you at least let her know that you are uncomfortable with the current living arrangement as long as she is treating you this cold manner. And, that she needs to seek other living arrangement soon. It will help you to move forward much quicker and help her to find her way. I agree, you both need to find a way (the classes you mentioned) to parent under what will likely be new circumstances. She at minimum needs to recognize the importance as well.


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## Machiavelli (Feb 25, 2012)

How long ago did you find out?

How did you find out? I see you had to do some investigating.

What are you doing right now to monitor?

I guess you want her back right?


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## walkonmars (Aug 21, 2012)

All your begging and pleading has done is to reinforce in her mind what her friends have said about you. That you are not worthy of a 'real woman', that you are a pathetic excuse for a man. As long as she has this mindset you aren't going to budge her. Not one bit.

And if you think the holidays are going to make her nostalgic for the old days - forget it. She's going to be going to more holiday parties this year than she's ever gone to before. 

So, what do you do? You can't rationalize her back. She's made up her mind. Your ONE chance is to LET HER GO. Yes. Stop chasing. Stop pleading. Talk only about parenting. Secure your finances. Consult your lawyer about how much money should be made available to her. Don't try to buy her anything for christmas. 

It's over. Detach from her. Ask her to move out of the marital bedroom she has no right to be in that room.


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## TBT (Dec 20, 2011)

You also might try cutting back on some of the things being paid for....like the gym etc.If she wants divorce,she may as well get used to doing with less now.


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## Broken at 20 (Sep 25, 2012)

Well to start:

You pull a 180. Which is where you treat your wife like she is treating you: a non-existent person. A ghost. Someone that isn't even there. 
You tell her parents. You tell your parents. The reason? Because these people tend to tell us what we _need_ to hear, and not what we _want_ to hear. And hopefully her parents can show her how stupid she is acting. 
You tell the OM's wife. Because she needs to know her husband has been cheating, so she can make the same choices. 
You visit a lawyer, and start getting everything ready. You can file after Christmas. The reason behind this is because sometimes the 'shock' of seeing yourself get served is enough to get the WS to get their head out of their ass. And if it doesn't, then you married a loser. 
And your wife loses all the privileges of being your wife. That means: cancelling/closing out all joint accounts and credit cards. You don't do ANYTHING for her. She has to sleep in a different bedroom. Personally, I would say kick her out, because that tends to wake up most wayward spouses, but she may just run off with the OM. 

And while all this sounds like a horrible idea because it will give her what she wants, understand something:
Women are different. They want what they can't have. And they want what other people want. If she finds out she can't have you and finds other women want you, it will burn her up inside. Might get her out of the affair fog. 
Plus, cheaters are stupid. They react differently than you would think. 

So while this may all sound like a bad idea, this stuff tends to work. Want to know why? Because I've read how many posters follow what the pro's at this say, and they tend to get what they want. 
Then I see the people that try to do the opposite of what the pro's here say. And they wonder why their WS won't come back to them, then divorces, and leaves them. And they come here crying. And I just want to rip into them for being ignorant. 

Most WS follow a textbook approach when these steps are applied. 
Apply them, and watch your wife run to your arms in no time.


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

they are having sex..


Is you best friend married ? Tell his wife and his parents .

Expose your wife and friend to your social circle..

Stop begging her..


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

badaa05 said:


> Ex best friend is married with children as well. He has all the advantages. That is the one guy that knows our relationship. We shared that with each other, which is odd ... being men and all.


Have you confronted him about this ?


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## Broken at 20 (Sep 25, 2012)

warlock07 said:


> Have you confronted him about this ?


Better question:
Have you confronted his wife?


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## TCSRedhead (Oct 17, 2012)

Your wife sounds a lot like I was when my EA was discovered by my husband, almost word for word (except it was a colleague, not his friend).

I told BH I didn't love him anymore, that I wanted out, that the marriage had been over for years for me. My daughters were 17 and 19 years old and I was moving to another state and done.

The news knocked him to his butt. He was hurt, betrayed, shocked, angry. He exposed to our daughters, confronted the OM via phone (he was 3k miles away). 

The truth was that I never stopped loving him, that I was equally responsible for the problems in our marriage and that if I was really done with the marriage, divorce would have been a kinder path. 

Follow the advice you're getting here - they are dead on accurate.


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## badaa05 (Nov 30, 2012)

didntcitcoming said:


> Yeah he is an a$$hole!! did you tell his wife yet??


she knows.


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## LetDownNTX (Oct 4, 2012)

Did you confront the best friend?


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

badaa05 said:


> she knows.


Is she divorcing him?


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## Ikaika (Apr 23, 2012)

_Her plan has been to "Make it through the holidays" all along_

You need to move her off of her game plan... like I said change the game. You need to let her know it is your plan that she move out of the current living situation sooner.


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## Saki (Dec 7, 2011)

I'm posting the 180 for you, I happen to have it on my clipboard just now.

I would argue this move is the proper way to approach life, regardless of your cheating wife. It's about emotionally empowering yourself to be a strong and happy person. 

Q: What is 180 and how does it work? Submitted by Making It 

A: 180 is a list of behaviors from Michelle Wiener Davis, the author of Divorce Busting, that will help your spouse to see you moving forward as a healthy person. I would highly suggest that any new BS begin these behaviors as soon as possible. I am convinced that if I had implemented them, I would still be married. In retrospect, I did everything besides 180. I looked pathetic. No one wants to be perceived as pathetic. 180 makes you look strong. Strong is attractive. (Making it) 

So here's the list: 

Don't pursue reason, chase, beg, plead or implore. 
No frequent phone calls. 
Don't point out "good points" in marriage. 
Don't follow her/him around the house. 
Don't encourage or initiate discussion about the future. 
Don't ask for help from the family members of your WS. 
Don't ask for reassurances. 
Don't buy or give gifts. 
Don't schedule dates together. 
Don't keep saying, "I Love You!" Because if you have a brain in your head, he/she is at this particular moment, not very loveable. 

Do more then act as if you are moving on with your life; begin moving on with your life! 

Be cheerful, strong, outgoing and independent. 

Don't sit around waiting on your spouse - get busy, do things, go out with friends, enjoy old hobbies, find new ones! But stay busy! 

When home with your spouse, (if you usually start the conversation) be scarce or short on words. Don't push any issue? No matter how much you want to! 

If you're in the habit of asking your spouse his/her whereabouts, ASK NOTHING. Seem totally uninterested. 
Your partner needs to believe that you have awakened to the fact that "they (the WS)" are serious concerning their assertions as to the future (or lack thee of) of your marriage. Thus, you are you are moving on with your life? with out them! 

Don't be nasty, angry or even cold - Just pull yourself back. 

Don't always be so available? for anything! Your spouse will notice. More important, he/she will notice that you're missing. 

No matter what you are feeling TODAY, only show your spouse happiness and contentment? Make yourself be someone they would want to be around. Not a moody, needy, pathetic individual but a self assured individual secure in the knowledge that they have value. 

All questions about the marriage should be put on hold, until your spouse wants to talk about it (which may not be for quite a while). Initiate no such conversation! 

Do not allow yourself to lose your temper. No yelling, screaming or name calling EVER. No show of temper! Be cool, act cool; be in control of the only thing you can control? YOURSELF! 

Don't be overly enthusiastic. 

Do not argue when they tell you how they feel (it only makes their feelings stronger). In fact, refuse to argue at all! 

Be patient and learn to not only listen carefully to what your spouse is really saying to you? HEAR what it is that they are saying! Listen and then listen some more! 

Learn to back off, keep your mouth shut and walk away when you want to speak out, no matter what the provocation. No one ever got themselves into trouble by just not saying anything. 

Take care of you. Exercise, sleep, laugh & focus on all the other parts of your life that are not in turmoil. 

Be strong, confident and learn to speak softly. 

Know that if you can do this 180, your smallest CONSISTENT action will be noticed far more than any words you can say or write. 

Do not be openly desperate or needy even when you are hurting more than ever and are feeling totally desperate and needy. 

Do not focus on yourself when communicating with your spouse. It's not always about you! More to the point, at present they just don't care! 

Do not believe any of what you hear them say and less than 50% of what you see. Your spouse will speak in absolute negatives and do so in the most strident tones imaginable. Try to remember that they are also hurting and afraid. Try to remember that they know what they are doing is wrong and so they will say anything they can to justify their behavior. 

Do not give up no matter how dark it is or how bad you feel. It "ain't over till it's over!" 

Do not backslide from your hard earned changes. Remain consistent! It is the consistency of action and attitude that delivers the message. 

When expressing your dissatisfaction with the actions of the wayward party, never be judgmental, critical or express moral outrage. Always explain that your dissatisfaction is due to the pain that the acts being committed are causing you as a person. 

This is the kind of behavior that will cause you to be a much more attractive and mysterious individual. Further it SHOWS that you are NOT afraid to move on with your life. Still more important, it will burst their positive little bubble; the one in which they believe that they can always come back to you in case things don't work out with the OM/OW."


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## Hope Springs Eternal (Oct 6, 2012)

badaa05 said:


> Please explain?


Go here: The Healing Heart: The 180


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## PHTlump (Jun 2, 2010)

As others have said, run a hard 180 on her. Stop talking to her about your relationship, or the future. If she wants to talk about the kids, or your divorce, or something trivial like the weather, then engage her. Otherwise, tell her you're busy and go do something else.

As long as the sees you willing to be her Plan B, you will never be her Plan A. So remove yourself as an option for her. It's possible that she will come around when the divorce is farther along. But she might not.

And don't worry too much about her saying she hasn't loved you for months or years. That may, or may not, be true. You can't know. It's the standard script for cheaters. They pull that one out in most cases. Usually, the "haven't been happy for years" starts as soon as the affair starts. They're just rationalizing their selfishness. Only bad people have frivolous affairs that destroy their families. And your wife isn't bad. So, obviously, she had a great reason for her affair.

Also, go to Married Man Sex Life | How to have the marriage you thought you were going to have. By which I mean doing it like rabbits. and run the MAP. It might attract your wife again. But if not, it will attract other women in the future.

Also, remove yourself from this toxic social circle. Find a new social setting ASAP that is yours and not hers.

Good luck.


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## DavidWYoung (Feb 3, 2012)

I so wish that I could have come here before I got married to that Wh ....woman, that being said,. You are in a FOG! Your wife did not just have an EA, not even. Look, your marriage is dead and she killed it. She did not just kill it, she IED'd it HARD! You need to get your head in this game because she is comming for your head. STOP looking at the past, it means NOTHING TO HER! Stop looking backwards, and look at what is comming at you! She and her lawyer (that she wants you to pay for) are comming to bend you over. The rest of your life is not going to be pretty if you keep this up. Man up, Lawyer up and git rid of this SPOS! Write me off line for some ideas Much Luck David


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## donny64 (Apr 21, 2012)

> And don't worry too much about her saying she hasn't loved you for months or years. That may, or may not, be true. You can't know. It's the standard script for cheaters. They pull that one out in most cases. Usually, the "haven't been happy for years" starts as soon as the affair starts.


Yup. I'd like to have a buck for every time I've seen or heard that from someone who was being cheated on. That and the "ILYBINILWY" bomb. Nine out of ten times it's not because they've fallen *out* of love with you, but rather because they've fallen *in* love with someone else. Someone you can't compete with on the excitement level because there are no every day life stresses with "Mr. Perfect". Because he doesn't know what a pain in the azz she can be yet (or even if he does, he's bs'ing her to get to her goodies). Because she thinks his crap doesn't stink. Because they're "perfect" and have a "connection". :rofl:


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## badaa05 (Nov 30, 2012)

So I am doing some 180 things. I just don't want to file. Because of our financial situation, she is screwed either way. I am thinking about just kicking back. Any advice on house work. I routinely pick up the house, put dishes away, fold laundry, and other chores. I can never do enough chores. I feel like it is my duty as a man / father to help do this to accomodate the household and the children. It's a real fine line between not caring and pissing her off further. Any advice on this? I still try to accomodate her going out ... but lets just say I know where he and she are at all times  . I did finally call his wife .. we shared stories and they matched. I already control all the money and all the bills are being sent to my work PO Box now. She can only get so far on her credit card which she has had since before our mariage. I guess I don't want her to resent me more, but on the other hand, can it be any worse ? This is just craziness!


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## walkonmars (Aug 21, 2012)

Do things only for yourself and your kids. Cook for yourself. Do only your laundry. Don't rely on her for anything. Be self-reliant. Focus on YOU. Get out a few evenings - you don't need an excuse or explanation. Be hard but not obnoxious - no screaming matches. 

Silence is a winner.


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

FOUR HOURS AT THE GYM?

Man I work out pretty hardcore and I only do 1.5 hours.
You seriously need to open your eyes man
Find out what's been happening.


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## badaa05 (Nov 30, 2012)

I should say she does 2 a days ... and yes she is at the gym 4 hours a day. She teaches two classes every morning (spin, and some other crap) and then she does more cardio and weight training in the evenings. I am there in the evenings with the family ... she is really there.


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## TDSC60 (Dec 8, 2011)

Quit thinking about what she may do or what she may think. Do not make decisions based on that. She has made her choice as far as you are concerned - divorce. 

You are starting off well. But like others have said ignore her now. Do things for yourself and the kids. You can do things around the house for the kids but not for her. Do not try to accommodate her schedule. Let her feel the pressure of being a full time single mom. She has checked out of the family.


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

badaa05 said:


> I should say she does 2 a days ... and yes she is at the gym 4 hours a day. She teaches two classes every morning (spin, and some other crap) and then she does more cardio and weight training in the evenings. I am there in the evenings with the family ... she is really there.


If she wants to be a roommate, be one. Share the house dutis. Acting like a maid won't win her back..

And 4 hrs, she is not probably working out for 4 hours ..

And cut her out financially. She depends on you for the money, right ? Give her bare minimum


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## donny64 (Apr 21, 2012)

badaa05 said:


> So I am doing some 180 things. I just don't want to file. Because of our financial situation, she is screwed either way. I am thinking about just kicking back. Any advice on house work. I routinely pick up the house, put dishes away, fold laundry, and other chores. I can never do enough chores. I feel like it is my duty as a man / father to help do this to accomodate the household and the children. It's a real fine line between not caring and pissing her off further. Any advice on this? I still try to accomodate her going out ... but lets just say I know where he and she are at all times  . I did finally call his wife .. we shared stories and they matched. I already control all the money and all the bills are being sent to my work PO Box now. She can only get so far on her credit card which she has had since before our mariage. I guess I don't want her to resent me more, but on the other hand, can it be any worse ? This is just craziness!


If you are "routinely" picking up house, dishes, laundry, etc, and she's a SAHM, just what exactly is she doing during her day?

"Pissing her off furhter"?!!! Sorry man, listen to yourself. *You're* worried about pissing *her* off? *You* don't want *her* to resent you more? While she's smack dab in the middle of an affair.

You say you want this to work. If that's really true, then you'd better start putting in the effort. Show her (don't _tell_ her, *show* her) that you will not tolerate this. Not from her, or anyone else. Pack her things up and toss them out.

You shouldn't be "accomodating" her going out! What you should be doing is NOT CARING what she does. You need to exude this indifference to anything she does now, and she needs to feel it. Hard. Don't "do some 180 things". Do ALL of them. Pull back. Put her out. Refuse to talk to her unless it's about the kids or divorce. You need to turn her world upside down if you are to have any hope of righting this ship she's trying to sink. 

Man oh man. If some guys would just not be afraid to let go of someone they want! THE BEST WAY to hold onto someone who is "feeling their oats" and considering leaving for "greener pastures" is to not only just "let them go", but give them a good solid kick in the azz to hasten them out the door! And then watch them sit there with a "what the phuck just happened" look on their puss while they try to figure out how the guy that an hour ago was not good enough for them has suddenly decided she's not worth HIS time. 

Oh, she may storm off all confident, because she's been through this before. The "breaking up", the threatening with divorce. And all the guys (or you) acted the same way every single time...you caved. Quickly. She'd shed a few tears, promise to change, or worse yet tried to blame shift it on you, and you caved. Oh, you tried to play it off (not you, men in general) that you were "standing your ground" and setting conditions or boundaries, but she knows...KNOWS where the boundaries were already. And then she crossed them. And you took her back after re-explaining the boundaries she knew full damn well existed in the first place.

You don't do "some of the 180". You do all that apply to you. Go cold...completely cold and indifferent to her. File for divorce. Make her believe it is now YOUR choice, NOT HERS, and that YOU ARE GONE!!!! IF....IF there is a chance to save things, this will snap her head around like nothing else you can do. If you don't believe that, ask ANY WOMAN HERE just how much they like being ignored, and what it does to them. It shakes them up. Big time. 

Make no mistake. She's getting ready to leave you. And you're making it EASIER on her by supporting her in that. You're still "there", in her comfort zone. You're around. You're her fallback position. You're her security blanket and safety net while she takes her uncertain steps into the outside world...the one that exists in her head without you in it. But, she's not sure yet. Still needs the safety net. And you're giving it to her.


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## Machiavelli (Feb 25, 2012)

badaa05 said:


> So I am doing some 180 things. I just don't want to file. Because of our financial situation, she is screwed either way.


Why do you say that? Usually, it's the BH that gets screwed.



badaa05 said:


> I am thinking about just kicking back. Any advice on house work. I routinely pick up the house, put dishes away, fold laundry, and other chores. I can never do enough chores. I feel like it is my duty as a man / father to help do this to accomodate the household and the children.


Bad move. How long have you been the maid? It's hard to believe with all the propaganda, but too much maid work is an attraction killer.



badaa05 said:


> It's a real fine line between not caring and pissing her off further. Any advice on this? I still try to accomodate her going out ... but lets just say I know where he and she are at all times  .


You pissing her off is not the problem here. Why do you let her go out? So were does she go when she's out? Who is she with? VARs in place in her car? Does she ever leave it parked in a lot, like the mall, for a few hours? She acts like somebody in an active affair.


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## Machiavelli (Feb 25, 2012)

badaa05 said:


> I should say she does 2 a days ... and yes she is at the gym 4 hours a day. She teaches two classes every morning (spin, and some other crap) and then she does more cardio and weight training in the evenings. I am there in the evenings with the family ... she is really there.


You go to the gym everyday yourself? Are you guys on the juice by any chance?

What does she do after her two classes, who is she with?


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## Acabado (May 13, 2012)

What NOT to do
Just Let Them Go


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## Machiavelli (Feb 25, 2012)

Well, here are my wild shots of far out speculation in the dark since details are not forthcoming:



badaa05 said:


> So , my wife has always looked great. She is now addicted to the gym .. 4+ hours a day.


How long has she been a hard core gym rat? Is she using? Deeper voice, growing clitoris, etc? Has she got implants, yet? Generally, women start shaping up when they start interacting with a guy they want or they have already decided to get out of the existing relationship. Sometimes it's a conscious decision, sometimes not. YMMV. How do I know? I'm in the fitness biz. Monkeys don't let go of one vine until they think they have a firm grasp on another one.



badaa05 said:


> She has made an entire host of new girlfriends that have crazy lives ... cheating, divorce, on and on.


These are the toxic gym rat friends who engage in affairs, hotel sex parties during the day, drugs, you name it, and encourage the newbies to the gym scene down the path. If your wife has gotten in with that crowd, her "affair" with your friend is most likely the tip of the iceberg. Sorry, dude. 



badaa05 said:


> I have been enabling her to get out of the house a lot more. She is/*was* a very Godly woman and an outstanding mother.


Those days are gone. Probably for a long time. She's much more interested in her new playmates than her kids. You're not on the radar so much, either.



badaa05 said:


> She is a stay at home mom and been selfless for years. *She started letting go of a few things which I thought was good*.


Like church, for instance?



badaa05 said:


> Little did I know she was letting go of me. I thought we were very happy. We were having sex every night ..... out of her guilt.


Guilt? I doubt it. Probably just elevated T levels from the daytime parties upping her libido around the clock. You were just the temporary beneficiary of her afternoon delight memories.



badaa05 said:


> Long story short, I caught her in a *major emotional affair* with my BEST friend in the entire world. UNREAL!


Emotional affair? Really? Well, if your evidence indicates it really was just an EA with your friend, then she was having some sex with some other guys her toxic friends intro'd her to or just random male gym rats, 'cause your wife was banging _somebody._ And your next statement is why I know she was:



badaa05 said:


> As soon as I found the evidence she said I have been unhappy for a long time , *we are getting a divorce.*


A woman doesn't go straight to demanding divorce over an EA when no sex is involved, they usually try to reconcile. Even women involved in PAs featuring the kinkiest imaginable sex (affair sex is usually pretty kinky) will try to pass it off as an EA to try to stay together with the BH. 

There are a couple of exceptions who go straight for divorce when exposure is near: the woman who knows adultery is a deal breaker for the husband; and, the Godly Christian Woman. The first goes straight for divorce, because she knows she's getting a divorce even if she comes clean, so why not coverup as much as possible. The second type, Godly Christian Woman, usually has a properly programmed evangelical Christian BH who is way more willing to forgive and even forget than he should be, but she still goes straight for divorce. She does this because she does not want to be exposed as an adulteress under any circumstances. The wilder the sex she was involved in she was behaving, the more she will be intractable on this, because she knows she can't stand the shame she's going to bring on herself. This is called "toxic shame" when the need to avoid facing the music trumps the woman's entire previous life of family and church. Your wife probably has a lot to be ashamed of and she wants out now before you discover the whole story and tell her parents and former friends. I can tell you stories about church women.

Let's backtrack a bit and deal with this part:



badaa05 said:


> As soon as I found the evidence she said *I have been unhappy for a long time *,


This is a load of bravo sierra. Women have a rational brain, sort of like men, but in sexual matters it's the limbic that gets in the driver's seat with them if they allow things to get to far and the cortex gets overridden. The cortex can shut it down up to a point, but when the decision is made to go with the feeling? Well, after that it's all limbic body chemistry. Later, after the sex frenzy is over, the woman comes down from the crack-like high she gets from having sex with a new guy. Incidentally, the chemicals PEA, norepinephrine, dopamine, serotonin, test, etc. all make sex totally addictive and she wants more. She'll settle for the BH if she has too, but she's really thinking about what she did today and what she's going to do tomorrow with the new guys. She's totally addicted to the "crack" of wild sex with strange men and maybe more.

So, when she finally comes down from that last multiple orgasm, she asks herself "why oh why, did I let that happen?" And what she comes up with is the idea that if you were really her "soul mate", the ONE she was really meant to be with, this would not have happened. She would not have done all these forbidden sexual things with others if you were really the ONE. Her doubts about you, which were created by her own actions in the first place (they never existed before she adultered) get rationalized into justification for her adultery. This is how they justify their easy betrayals of their loved ones with their alleged value system. It's not so jokingly referred to as "the rationalization hamster." Any behavior in an affair, no matter how heinous, can be dealt with handily by a woman's rationalization hamster.



badaa05 said:


> I am crushed so I do the worst thing and go in to panic mode. I am telling her I am sorry ... yes I AM SORRY!


A lot of guys make that mistake, especially the "Average Married Chump" in church who has been brainwashed into the unbiblical idea that women are more "spiritual" or more "moral" than themselves. You had your wife on a pedestal.



badaa05 said:


> Anyway I tried taking her to counseling. She is done and has seen an attorney.


If she flat out refused counseling or just went once, she doesn't want to take a chance on the big reveal of just how bad her wicked antics were. It's toxic shame.



badaa05 said:


> We are 32 and have been together since we were 15.


 Well, if you were the first to slide into home plate, you're not the only one anymore. The question is, what is the total score?

Also, at age 32, even if she's not, er, "supplementing" with anavar and other AS, her libido is at lifetime max (naturally). That's peak sex drive.



badaa05 said:


> We have 3 children that are incredible. The kids do not know. Her plan has been to "Make it through the holidays" all along. She pretends like I do not even exist to her.


She's delinking and distancing. What does her day look like? Does she go out? GPS?



badaa05 said:


> I am having conversations about how things are going to play out and going along with this. I have made a lot of mistakes along the way.


Having relationship conversations is very Omega for a man, especially when he's having the with a cheating wife. It actually increases your unattractiveness to your adulteress. Stop talking relationship. Don't even speak to her unless spoken to. Then address the issue pleasantly, but minimally. No deep engagement. Deal pleasantly with the topic at hand briefly and shut up.



badaa05 said:


> She is saying I can't blame this emotional affair because *she gave up on me a long time ago*. I know she has been satisfied with us in the recent past.


That's a lie from her rationalization hamster. She never gave up anything until it was necessary to save her reputation. She's got to get out now because she cannot run the risk of you and your families and associates finding out the full extent of her sexual activities. It's toxic shame.



badaa05 said:


> When I was suspecting her, I was snooping, tracking, lying, and whatever else to get the evidence. Those are now my key qualities plus controlling! So anyway .. she stays at home by choice.


GPS? VAR? Cell phone bug? keylogger? What have you got in place now?



badaa05 said:


> I am a professional with an above average income. Of course we are stuck in our house with this economy. I have a hope that Christmas with the kids will turn things around.


That kind of stuff is exactly why she has to blow it all up, and now. She has to get out before everyone knows the full extent and ruins every Christmas forever. That's the way she sees it. Once the facts are out, her outer and maybe even her self image is gone. Finito. Everybody will know how far she has fallen and the real her. Can't have that. Everybody and everything is expendable if it means a chance to continue preserving their facade. Toxic shame.



badaa05 said:


> I want this to work, but I can't be with her like this. I really love the girl. She is cold as ice right now.


How do you like that stare where she looks right at you, but focuses about ten feet past your head like you don't even exist? Makes you feel good, doesn't it?



badaa05 said:


> There are a lot of consequences to what she is doing .. I just don't think she sees that. She is getting bad advice from the wrong people. Everyone around us that knows is wrecked.


Who knows about it? Wait till you get proof of the physical sex stuff. I know her advisers are her toxic gym ratpack, right? The same ones who have encouraged the activities you have yet to discover.



badaa05 said:


> I have had trouble with anxiety which exposes my weaknesses.


It really make you look repulsive to your WW, which is just what you don't want if you want R. Which you may not want, once you get the full truth.



badaa05 said:


> I am trying to stay strong as best as possible. I am talking with my therapist more right now.


Well, I guess that's good. But you really need to change your M.O. now. What have you done to demonstrate higher value to your WW?



badaa05 said:


> I am actually surprised how well I am coping! If we get in to a conversation where she starts to feel guilt, she removes herself.


Toxic shame. She's probably fighting the urge to confess all and reconcile. That's why she exits when she's feeling under conviction. Once you know it all, she can't face you.



badaa05 said:


> We went to see our pastor and she felt like she was attacked .. someone told her the truth.


Good for your pastor. They usually try to blame the BH.



badaa05 said:


> I would not keep the kids from her in a divorce, well we would share them.


Doesn't matter. It's most all cut and dried these days, depending on where you live. Most places 50-50 seems to rule.



badaa05 said:


> I am trying to be nice but strong through all of this. I do have 2 attorneys on retainer, but I really want us to work. We have both taken each other for granted and deserve better. I think we can do this and come out stronger. ANY ADVICE? Thanks!


First, it's not an EA it's PA, and most likely PAs, plural, with her gymrats as wingmen or participants. When the WW's response on discovery is _"Go directly to Divorce, Do not pass Go, Do not collect $200"_ it always means copulation has occurred repeatedly, and it was unusually kinky. Does your state law have conditions for "cause" to influence custody, maintenance, and child support? You've still got some PI work to do.

As for what you can do while the investigations are ongoing, stop talking relationship with her. It just lowers your value in her eyes. She's had some Alpha bad boys now and she doesn't think you measure up. Quit confirming it. Quit violating The Sixteen Commandments. She knows a "real man" would kick her to the curb. See, her whole outlook on the world has changed from the youth group days. The old her is gone, gone, gone. She craves the badboy vibe.

Because of the above, she's been devaluing you as a worthy mate as long as she's been getting in with her gym crowd. You're in a deep hole. Your wife is not attracted to godly men and really, she never was. You had to have something going on back then that has somehow been lost. Women are attracted to the men that their friends are attracted to; that's why they always have to run off to the powder room to discuss which boy is the hottest. Their judgement is strangely dependent on the judgement of other women. I don't get it, but it's a fact of life. Right now, your wife doesn't think you could get a woman if your life depended on it. Is she right?

The best way to start upping your male sex rank and getting that something back, is the following:

1 quit discussing the relationship

2 upgrade your wardrobe. If you don't usually wear suits, start. Hugo Boss or Tom Ford. think D. Craig as James Bond. Don't discuss with her, just do.

3.upgrade your body. 32" waist, measured right under the bottom rib and a chest of greater than 42". That's the 1.4 ratio that has been scientifically shown to turn women's heads. Take up serious bodybuilding and cut out all carbs other than vegetables and beans. Don't discuss with her, just do.

4.trade in your car for a single man's ride. A hot rod, sports car, or a chopper is what is needed. Don't discuss with her, just do.

5.Change your haircut to something completely unlike your present one. It doesn't matter if you or anyone else likes it, really. It's a statement of a new day moving on.

6.Always have a light, sunny disposition with your WW. Never get heavy and for heaven's sake don't let her see any tears.

7.Start going out after the kids go down. Dressed to the nines in your Tom Ford suit and cuff-linked shirt. Get cleaned up and dressed and head out the door. Announce, "I'm going out for a while." if she ignores you fine. If she asks where you're going, just say, "Out. Don't wait up." Let her hear the throaty rumble of your new ride as you depart, but don't peel out or anything stupid like that. Be very mysterious about the whos and the wheres. It doesn't matter if you go to Chuck E Cheese and play video games, just let her imagination run wild. 

All the above is about letting your wife know that you do have your own options and they don't include you feeding her narcissism by sitting at home pining for her. BHs with options (other women plural) are attractive to WWs. Sometimes. 

Because of her toxic shame, she has to keep the full extent of her activities secret forever. You need to blow that secret up somehow.

Well, this post may be a load of total BS, but this is pretty much the way this script plays. Seen it repeatedly with the church ladies. Good luck.


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## badaa05 (Nov 30, 2012)

Is it typical for a cheater to not blame the current situation on their actions? As in they say this was over long before they did that? That is what she is saying. Machiavelli .. wow man that's alot of stuff. She is at the gym. I know 100%. She does not juice or anything like that. She is toned, not in it for the body building aspect. There are no day parties or anything like that. It's bad, but not that bad. There is one guy .. my best friend .. that's it. 

The only thing that makes this hard are the children. I am wanting to protect them as much as possible. She says she is thinking about them, but she is still in the cloud.

She has separated her cell phone from the family plan so I have no access to call logs. She has an iphone 5 that she virtually keeps in her pants and sleeps on.

The OM is sending things to her like. "The sacrifice will be worth it in the end" , "when the dust settles my heart tells me you will be by my side" , "we are real, we are very real"

I am pretty sure she has the restraint to stay non sexual with him.

Should I even concern myself with spying? If so what things should I consider? I really don't think this is going to help my mariage.

The only thing that gets her going is the fact that she could have less time with the kids. I am thinking that is my power play. She is an outstanding mother, I can not say anything otherwise.

She is starting to realize I am being cold. I told her this morning we could sign papers saying we will not go after the other for adultery during the separation. I told her I had found an apartment. Of course she is excited for my apartment , and says that signing the paper does not matter because it is not about the OM.

Craziness


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

First you didn't think you wife was going to betray and leave you for you "best friend". So please stop lying to yourself it's PA. Your wife thinks he is her soul mate - your wife has a healthy sex drive - your wife is having sex with her soul mate. There is no way she'd be leaving like she is for some guy she wasnt test driving.

So top being naive and realize this for what it fully is.

--

now as for your wife, if she has not money how is she paying the credit card and the iPhone bill? 

--

Have you exposed both the OM and your wife to church - friends - family? I mean truly let the world know about their affair?

--

STOP - do not move out of the house. Why would you leave? Why?

why would you leave your kids? don't give the, well she's the primary care giver logic. You are their father, that is your home. You didn't chose like she did to cheat and leave the marriage. You stay. If the OM is so great let him pay for your wife's apartment.

btw - if you contribute to a 401K at work stop it now. The money you have in there will be part of the D settlement - so a she's going to be going after a big part of any money you put in there. So stop it, and take the money and buy yourself some new clothes and things. got it?


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## Machiavelli (Feb 25, 2012)

badaa05 said:


> Is it typical for a cheater to not blame the current situation on their actions?


100% of the time. Rationalization hamster, man. Where do you think that goofy term came from? It came from the post-adultery actions of every sweet "moral" mother that ever cheated. You might find one exception in 500, but the exception proves the rule.



badaa05 said:


> As in they say this was over long before they did that? That is what she is saying.


Sure she is saying that. Standard cheaters script BS. If it was over long ago, why didn't she mention it long ago. This is part of the female coping mechanism after she commits adultery. I say adultery, not an EA. She has to make it all okay in her mind. A woman is not like a man, she has to somehow square the circle between her Christian beliefs and her slvtty deeds to be able to make it all okay. Basic female requirement to allow themselves to commit adultery: if the marriage was "over already" (funny you never saw the final decree on that) then it's okay to fvck any and all.



badaa05 said:


> Machiavelli .. wow man that's alot of stuff. She is at the gym. I know 100%. She does not juice or anything like that. She is toned, not in it for the body building aspect. There are no day parties or anything like that. It's bad, but not that bad. There is one guy .. my best friend .. that's it.


Okay, fair enough. You're the man on the ground. I just wanted to make sure you weren't glossing over the possibilities. Incidentally, none of that stuff I brought up is in any way far out. It's pretty standard for women who get too deep into the gym scene, and even just regular people. I will say that your wife's rationalizations and divorce demand point to sex with somebody else at some point after your marriage. Because of her actions and reactions it all points to sex. If you're right about OM being the only guy on the radar, then it was sex with the OM.

What is the OM doing? Is he in or out at home? D or R for him?



badaa05 said:


> The only thing that makes this hard are the children. I am wanting to protect them as much as possible. She says she is thinking about them, but she is still in the cloud.


It's the sex chemistry. If the OM is out of the picture, who is she banging now? As for protecting the kids, you do that by being the only sane parent they have. Spend a lot of time with them. Become superdad while they're awake. Leave the house once they're down.



badaa05 said:


> She has separated her cell phone from the family plan so I have no access to call logs. She has an iphone 5 that she virtually keeps in her pants and sleeps on.


Cut off all her dough. Not one red cent.



badaa05 said:


> The OM is sending things to her like. "The sacrifice will be worth it in the end" , "when the dust settles my heart tells me you will be by my side" , "we are real, we are very real"


Well, that answers my previous questions. It's the OM she's banging and it's ongoing. That's the source of the "fog" chemistry in her mind. You say his wife knows, so what's his status? Are they divorcing? Is he out of the house?



badaa05 said:


> I am pretty sure she has the restraint to stay non sexual with him.












You've got to be kidding me. If you can get his d!ck out of her @ss for about 4 weeks straight, her fog might start to clear up some. This is a PHYSICAL AFFAIR. She's doing stuff with him she never did with you! Wake up and smell the pork.



badaa05 said:


> Should I even concern myself with spying? If so what things should I consider? I really don't think this is going to help my mariage.


If you want to help the marriage, you have to do intel and you have to grow some huevos. No ifs ands or buts. You're coming across as very passive and foggy. A large minority of guys go straight to divorce and kick the b!tch to the curb, even if she's on her knees. The majority of the guys try to save the marriage and fail. Put a PI on her and get some proof, then expose her to family and friends, with pictures and audio. Does your wife have her own car?

What have you got in place? GPS, VAR? What?



badaa05 said:


> The only thing that gets her going is the fact that she could have less time with the kids. I am thinking that is my power play. She is an outstanding mother, I can not say anything otherwise.


You're delusional. Outstanding mothers don't blow up their family for a little strange c0ck. Why don't you start reading up on the negative effects of divorce on children's mental health, academic success, and emotional well being. One trait your kids will get out of it (that you incidentally seem to be lacking) is a lot more general aggression.



badaa05 said:


> She is starting to realize I am being cold. I told her this morning we could sign papers saying we will not go after the other for adultery during the separation. *I told her I had found an apartment.* Of course she is excited for my apartment , and says *that signing the paper does not matter because it is not about the OM.*
> 
> Craziness


Yes, and you're the one who is crazy. Are you for real, or are you just yanking our chains? Either way, you really are the OM's best friend since they can now stay all night together in your bedroom in your bed (don't worry they've fvcked in there plenty already, but getting to sleep together all night is even better). 

Do not leave the house. Period. Is legal separation required in your state, prior to divorce?

It's all about the OM as those messages you quoted prove. Get real, dude. Answer the questions this time.


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## badaa05 (Nov 30, 2012)

I will answer when I have more tim. The OM is married with children. Now to "proove" to me that this was over before the affair, she is "ending" it with the OM today. This will prove to me that the problem is me .. not him ... rigggght .. heard this before?


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## Labcoat (Aug 12, 2012)

Broken at 20 said:


> Women are different. They want what they can't have. And they want what other people want.


OT but, women ARE different but not in this way. I believe the 180 would work for betrayed women as well.


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## Machiavelli (Feb 25, 2012)

badaa05 said:


> I will answer when I have more tim. The OM is married with children. Now to "proove" to me that this was over before the affair, she is "ending" it with the OM today. This will prove to me that the problem is me .. not him ... rigggght .. heard this before?


Standard stuff. It really is a script. Where do they learn it? Got no clue, unless toxic friends feed each other the same crap.

If you can really enforce NC, and you'll have to run intel ops like mad to do it since they're saying they want to be together after the dust settles, you have a very slim margin to save things. But, you've got to get them apart and keep them apart for a few months before the sex chemistry can clear out. That's why killing the OM was historically the best option. Unfortunately, that is now illegal, making it absolutely imperative to know what is going on in OM's marriage. Are you in constant contact and intel sharing with OMW?

Simultaneously, you have to be getting into the shape of your life and pulling some serious glances from women in front of your wife. She doesn't want you, so she thinks no woman would want you. Once she knows woman want you, it changes her perceptions. Nutty, but true. Sometimes.


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## Phenix70 (May 6, 2012)

You've got to grow a pair & stop letting your wife walk all over you.
It's NOT an EA, repeat, it's NOT an EA, she's fu*king him, probably multiple times a day.
You've got to let go of the image you have in your head of your wife, that woman doesn't exist.
You have got to increase your Alpha-ness, if you're coming across this Omega on a message board, I can only imagine what you're like in real life.
Follow the great advice given to you in this thread, sure this maybe your marrige, but these men have given you very valuable advice that is 100% spot on, take it, use it & get control over your life.
Unless you want to just continue the status quo & let your best friend continue to fu*k your wife, while she's living in your house.
Get mad & use that energy to gain the upper hand, stop letting her dictate when/how/what is going on in your marriage.


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## Machiavelli (Feb 25, 2012)

Badaa,

Man, what is your gym program you're on that you're at the gym every evening? Just spying on the WW or are you actually trying to accomplish something?


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## Hope Springs Eternal (Oct 6, 2012)

Machiavelli said:


> Simultaneously, you have to be getting into the shape of your life and pulling some serious glances from women in front of your wife. She doesn't want you, so she thinks no woman would want you. Once she knows woman want you, it changes her perceptions. Nutty, but true. Sometimes.


Not to be combative here, Mach, 'cause I value your participation, but why are you so focused on getting other women to pay attention? Why is this so important? These two fell in love on their own, she fell for the him that was _him_, and he's still him. 

Maybe my situation is different; I pulled the 180, worked on myself spiritually and personally, lost weight and am feeling good about myself, but being attractive to others - is attraction the big thing here? I know it is for her and her other "men" (I put this in quotes because we really don't know if there's just one man or multiples) right now, but is his "lack of attraction" what led her to cheat? Or is it a slate of much-varied issues that existed in their marriage before this all happened?

I just think it's kind of immature to be thinking looks when so much of this is matters of the heart, not the eyes. Maybe it's a guy thing, and I'm not Alpha enough to "get it."


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## didntcitcoming (Oct 15, 2012)

bobka said:


> Not to be combative here, Mach, 'cause I value your participation, but why are you so focused on getting other women to pay attention? Why is this so important? These two fell in love on their own, she fell for the him that was _him_, and he's still him.
> 
> Maybe my situation is different; I pulled the 180, worked on myself spiritually and personally, lost weight and am feeling good about myself, but being attractive to others - is attraction the big thing here? I know it is for her and her other "men" (I put this in quotes because we really don't know if there's just one man or multiples) right now, but is his "lack of attraction" what led her to cheat? Or is it a slate of much-varied issues that existed in their marriage before this all happened?I just think it's kind of immature to be thinking looks when so much of this is matters of the heart, not the eyes. Maybe it's a guy thing, and I'm not Alpha enough to "get it."




You are right...you don't get it! Physical attraction is HUGE. If he gets into the best shape of his life and starts to attract other women....well you get the idea.

Here is just one example. Go onto any dating website (like match.com). When you are looking to date you scroll through thousands of pictures....get it....PICTURES...and based on those pictures you decide which profiles to open up and learn more about. If there is a picture of some fat slob sitting on the couch eating a bag of potato chips most women would probably never open his profile to find out that he is a nuclear engineer that makes $1,000,000 a year and has an awesome personality!!

Anyway, keep it coming Mach....lots of good info for all of us.


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## Hope Springs Eternal (Oct 6, 2012)

didntcitcoming said:


> You are right...you don't get it! Physical attraction is HUGE. If he gets into the best shape of his life and starts to attract other women....well you get the idea.
> 
> No, I don't get the idea.
> 
> ...


Yes, keep it coming.


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## Machiavelli (Feb 25, 2012)

bobka said:


> Not to be combative here, Mach, 'cause I value your participation, but why are you so focused on getting other women to pay attention? Why is this so important? These two fell in love on their own, she fell for the him that was _him_, and he's still him.


It doesn't have anything to do with love. The cortex, and her higher thoughts and belief system, contained therein and her sense of "family love" have been overridden by the reproductive drive (limbic). She's 32, which is Libido Maximum for perhaps a majority of women. Eros is in the driver's seat. 

In this case, OP has indicated that a lot of the problem is the WW's group of gym rat TFs, putting down OP's physique and/or studliness. It would be interesting to see how the OM stacks up in this regard, but it really doesn't matter, because the WW's gang has degraded BH in WW's eyes. Is that clear enough?

When a woman makes that decision to go after or to spread for someone, it's after some period of devaluing her man, first subconsciously (limbic) and then finally consciously. It's known that a large part of the subconscious attraction triggers are physical, like the golden ratio and BF%, so it makes sense to trigger those in other females, if WW is not being responsive.



bobka said:


> Maybe my situation is different; I pulled the 180, worked on myself spiritually and personally, *lost weight and am feeling good about myself,* but being attractive to others - is attraction the big thing here?


It sure is. You moved your body closer to the golden ratio. Since female attraction for LTR, as opposed to STR/ONS, is about more than just physical, don't fall prey to the fallacy that the physical doesn't matter. The primary factors with women losing attraction to their husbands are probably physical, but YMMV because bad finances and sloth are also huge DLVs. Notice it's not spiritual, since OP is a churchgoer, and it's not sloth and $$, since WW is a SAHM. It's all about LTR game (or the lack thereof) which is all about attraction, including the physique.



bobka said:


> I know it is for her and her other "men" (I put this in quotes because we really don't know if there's just one man or multiples) right now, but is his "lack of attraction" what led her to cheat? Or is it a slate of much-varied issues that existed in their marriage before this all happened?


Other issues are a cause for divorce, not adultery. Adultery is sex. Women say otherwise, but that's just the Hamster talkin'.



bobka said:


> I just think it's kind of immature to be thinking looks when so much of this is matters of the heart, not the eyes. Maybe it's a guy thing, and I'm not Alpha enough to "get it."


It ain't the heart. Not even close. ILYBINILWY means the heart is still directed at the BH, but her crotch is directed at the OM.


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## Woodchuck (Nov 1, 2012)

badaa05 said:


> Ex best friend is married with children as well. He has all the advantages. That is the one guy that knows our relationship. We shared that with each other, which is odd ... being men and all.


Expose him immediately....His wife, family, community
, then expose the wife, her family, your family, her community...Make her see the consequences she has wrought with her infidelity...

The POSOM will drop her like a hot rock, and she will be totally alone......As she deserves...


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