# Do you believe in asexuality? Is it real?



## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

Over the years there have been posts by people claiming their SO is asexual. 

They say their SO is asexual and has no sexual feelings or desires or sexual motivations or wishes at all.

Sometimes the SO themselves even tell them that they are asexual and to leave them be or even give them a hall pass to seek it elsewhere. 

Now I realize that people get sick or get medical conditions that impact their hormonal levels or their genitalia and there there are dudes that get their balls blown off by IEDs etc. 

I’m not talking about that.

My question is do you believe there are people that are perfectly healthy and functional physically and mentally that simply have no sexual drive or desire at all regardless of relationship status and regardless of who they may have an opportunity to get with?

In other words are there men (assuming heterosexual) who would pass up Heidi Klume or Mila Kunis if they offered?

Are there women that would not bat an eye if Ashton Kutcher or George Clooney were hot for them?

Are there young, healthy, fertile women that if Adam Levine offered to fly them to Italy and then get on his yacht in the Mediterranean for a weekend of some fun in the sun, that they would say no thank you I am asexual and not into sex at all?

Do you think those people actually exist or do you think these cases of “asexuality “ are actually “not-sexual-with-you”? 

Barring a medical,mental, physical or hormonal condition, are people actually asexual or just haven’t got with the right person or had the right switches flipped yet?


----------



## Mr.Married (Feb 21, 2018)

Yes I believe they exist but are VERY rare.

It is my personal opinion that 99% of the people who come here claiming asexually is the issue ..... are being fed bullsh!t

Keep in mind I am not pointing a blasphemy finger at the “asexual” person..... a lot of sexless people are responsible for the situation they are in ..... they just can’t admit it too themselves or just outright do not understand how attraction works.

I find men especially can’t get it registered in their head for some reason that their wife has no physical attraction for them ..... the long list of “reasons” is always soon to follow


----------



## Elizabeth001 (May 18, 2015)

I’m sure rare but yes...they exist. I divorced one. Perhaps I will elaborate as the thread develops. Pooped. Long day  


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


----------



## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

Maybe I should have put this in a poll using mountain lions, snow leopards and Bigfoot as the examples.

Do you think asexuals are like mountain lions - you don’t often see them but they are for sure out there and probably more than what you’d think.

Or snow leopards - known to exist but very rare and hardly ever encountered in the wild and when people say they saw one, it was probably something else. 

Or Bigfoot - lots of people claim to have encountered or seen/heard/smelled one or found a bike pile of droppings but no one has actually proven they exist.

Are asexuals mountain lions, snow leopards or Bigfoot?


----------



## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

Snow leopards.


----------



## Mr.Married (Feb 21, 2018)

Snow Leopard that is Big Foots cousin


----------



## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

About 1% of the population is asexual.

US Population is about 334,000,000
1% of that is 3,340,000 asexual people in the US

*Asexuality: the Invisible Orientation?*


----------



## Hiner112 (Nov 17, 2019)

I'm relatively certain that I was at school with one when I was learning my specialty in the military. As he explained it, he could recognize that certain people were more beautiful or handsome just like he could identify a beautiful sunset but it didn't inspire him to want to do anything about it. I basically lived with him for 3 months and he never did anything to make me doubt what he said and it was something that I brought up several times because it was so hard for me to wrap my head around.

I also know of a teenager at my daughter's school that has identified as asexual as well. Unless she's a late bloomer or whatever, I have no reason to believe that she's anything other than what she says.

Its not something you "become" any more than someone "becoming" gay. Whether the reason is wiring in the brain or hormones or whatever is largely irrelevant just like it is for the reasons for people's individual sexual orientation. 

I also firmly believe that there are "temporary asexuals" where the "for you" is silent. You can be in a relationship that does not in any way inspire you to want to have sex (with them). In a monogamous relationship the difference between "I don't have any sexual desire" and "I don't have any sexual desire *for you*" can be hard to tease apart not only for the SO but for the person themselves. 

If you have been sexually abused, being repulsed by the associated experiences would also make it hard to tell the difference between something innate and something that is more of a result of the trauma. The person might not be "naturally" asexual but no less permanently so.

I recently came across a somewhat related quote:



> Before you diagnose yourself with depression or low self esteem, first make sure you are not, in fact, just surrounded by assholes.


Before someone is diagnosed as asexual, they would need to be in a position / situation where a sexual response would be "normal".


----------



## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

Hiner112 said:


> Before someone is diagnosed as asexual, they would need to be in a position / situation where a sexual response would be "normal".


I agree with this. 

How many people would change their tune if someone very nice and good looking and engaging were to make a valid offer.


----------



## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

EleGirl said:


> About 1% of the population is asexual.
> 
> US Population is about 334,000,000
> 1% of that is 3,340,000 asexual people in the US
> ...


I wonder how many people in that 1% would have a definable ‘cause’ such as a medical, hormonal, medication issue or a previous trauma such as CSA or something. 

I don’t mean to imply that asexuality is necessarily a result of some kind of pathology but just curious as to how many young, healthy and otherwise normal people are completely lacking in sexual desire.


----------



## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

oldshirt said:


> My question is do you believe there are people that are perfectly healthy and functional physically and mentally that simply have no sexual drive or desire at all regardless of relationship status and regardless of who they may have an opportunity to get with?


I don't know if they're healthy, yet asexuality certainly is a thing albeit it quite a rare thing.

I only know one person who I think is asexual and that is one of my wife's friends who is in her late 40s. Who I have now known for 24+ years, and according to my wife she is still a virgin, that doesn't ever desire or want sex. Now she's been engaged twice, and has kissed some men before, yet she related that she doesn't like it and doesn't get excited by it on and on etc. The thing is though she also has a parade of mental and significant physical health problems that she can't help, so at least in her case I would hardly call her healthy.

It is also worth noting that asexuality is a noted thing with some people who are autistic as well. Of which the woman I mention above is autistic, also my reference to her having mental problems are not about her autism at all.



> In other words are there men (assuming heterosexual) who would pass up Heidi Klume or Mila Kunis if they offered?


Well I am not asexual being highly sexed, yet I would have absolutely no hesitation turning down Heidi Klume or Mila Kunis since I don't think they're very attractive to me. And this isn't hyperbole since I have turned down offers of sex or dates, from lots of women especially in my twenties and thirties who I didn't find attractive.


----------



## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

Personal said:


> .
> 
> It is also worth noting that asexuality is a noted thing with some people who are autistic as well. Of which the woman I mention above is autistic, of which my reference to her having mental problems are not about her autism at all.
> 
> ...


I personally would not classify someone with autism as asexual. I would classify that as autistic. I'm not trying to be sarcastic but all bets are off with anything dealing with personal interaction when dealing with autism. 

Also my use of the celebrities was not meant to be literal but rather just a figurative example of someone that is generally considered high status and very good looking etc.


----------



## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

oldshirt said:


> I personally would not classify someone with autism as asexual.


I wasn't saying that being autistic is to also be asexual, I was just relating the fact that asexuality comes up as a thing more often in autistic people than the general population.

*Brief Report: Asexuality and Young Women on the Autism Spectrum* - 13 June 2020 Springer Link
Journal of Autism and Developmental Disorders

Abstract

Existing research suggests that people with Autism Spectrum Disorder (ASD) are more likely than those without ASD to self-identify as asexual, or as being on the asexual spectrum. This study contributes to the literature by exploring aspects of sexuality and well-being in a large, community-based sample of young women (18–30 years old) with ASD (N = 247) and comparing the experiences of those with asexual spectrum identities and those with other sexual orientations (e.g., gay, bisexual, heterosexual). In the present sample, asexual participants reported less sexual desire and fewer sexual behaviors than those with other sexual orientations, but greater sexual satisfaction. Being on the asexual spectrum also was associated with lower generalized anxiety symptoms. Clinical and research implications are discussed.

*Asexuality Is a Sexual Orientation, Not a Sexual Dysfunction* - Psychology Today
A new review suggests that asexuality is a sexual orientation, not a disorder.

...

*Why Asexuality Is Not a Mental Disorder: The Evidence*

In some studies, asexuals report higher rates of distress and symptoms such as anxiety. The available evidence seems to suggest that those feelings are a result of prejudice and discrimination against asexuals (which has been documented in research) and not an indication of any underlying psychological disturbance.


The available research does not support other negative accounts of asexuality, either. For example, asexuality does not seem to be linked to trauma. Also, asexuals do not typically respond with extreme aversion or disgust when viewing genitals.

*There are some indications that asexual women are somewhat more likely to meet the criteria for an autism spectrum disorder (17 percent, compared to 14.7 percent in the general population) so any anxiety or distress could also be linked to that condition rather than to asexuality. However, that research was based on a cross-sectional design, so the connection between asexuality and the autism spectrum is only suggestive.*


----------



## minimalME (Jan 3, 2012)

Would you expand on this?



oldshirt said:


> I'm not trying to be sarcastic but all bets are off with anything dealing with personal interaction when dealing with autism.


----------



## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

No. With a caveat that belongs in another thread.

Barring that extraordinarily rare situation, no, never.

Perfectly healthy humans want sex. I have never seen otherwise.


----------



## maquiscat (Aug 20, 2019)

oldshirt said:


> I wonder how many people in that 1% would have a definable ‘cause’ such as a medical, hormonal, medication issue or a previous trauma such as CSA or something.
> 
> I don’t mean to imply that asexuality is necessarily a result of some kind of pathology but just curious as to how many young, healthy and otherwise normal people are completely lacking in sexual desire.


Instead of replying to the OP (post, not poster), I am going to start here.

One of the things that I have held as most likely true about sexual orientation and gender identity (transgenderism) is that there is most likely no one "cause". In some people it can be caused by epigenetics, or various combination of genes (since no one gene has been discovered yet.), or maybe by trauma. The thing is, that regardless of the cause, is it a persistent state or not. I would not count medical/hormonal problems as the "condition" for lack of a better word. Or would call it, in this case, effective asexuality, as opposed to being asexual.

From my experience, those who lost their sex drive through illness, or medication or some similar means, usually still have sexual attractions, just no real drive or desire to act upon them. And unless you end up conversing with them, it usually stay internalized. But for the few that I have managed to talk to, it's like in their minds they are "I'd tap that if I had the drive to", but they never really talk about it, because there is not drive and it's a fleeting thought. By no means, am I claiming that this is most or any given proportion, just part of the few that I have had experience with.

From what I have seen there are two types of asexuals, with and without sex drive. The former are sometimes mistaken, even by themselves, as bisexual, because they still have bodily sexual needs, but they are not turned on by any given person per se, just the thought/need for sex itself. The key thing to remember is that while either type might not have any sexual attractions, they can still have romantic attractions. They can fall in love, but they just don't desire to have sex.

I'm pretty sure that my brother is asexual. I have never seen anything that indicates he has ever had an attraction for anyone, sexual or romantic.


----------



## maquiscat (Aug 20, 2019)

Personal said:


> It is also worth noting that asexuality is a noted thing with some people who are autistic as well. Of which the woman I mention above is autistic, also my reference to her having mental problems are not about her autism at all.


I've noticed that too.But I have also seen, and personally know one, autistic people who are highly sexed. So it may be a higher probability, but I'm willing to bet that both are results of something else, and not one the cause of the other. IOW, what causes the one, may or may not cause the other, but is more likely to.



> Well I am not asexual being highly sexed, yet I would have absolutely no hesitation turning down Heidi Klume or Mila Kunis since I don't think they're very attractive to me. And this isn't hyperbole since I have turned down offers of sex or dates, from lots of women especially in my twenties and thirties who I didn't find attractive.


Same here. I might take them up on the offer to say I bedded a famous person, but that would be as far as it goes. Felicia Day on the other hand......


----------



## bkyln309 (Feb 1, 2015)

Yes, my ex was truly asexual. He hid it before marriage in religion (no sex before marriage) and then dodged sex from the honeymoon on. After 15 years of trying to have a life minus sex, I gave up. There were other issues as well but he had no desire for intercourse ever.


----------



## maquiscat (Aug 20, 2019)

Personal said:


> I wasn't saying that being autistic is to also be asexual, I was just relating the fact that asexuality comes up as a thing more often in autistic people than the general population.


I think too many people want to view the world in terms of if X then Y, instead of if X then more likely Y. Another example is that homosexuality more often shows up in large families. Certainly, homosexuals show up in single child families, and not at all in large families, but in looking at the probability, more come from larger families than smaller one. Probability is great for looking at an overall populations, but never for an individual.


----------



## maquiscat (Aug 20, 2019)

bkyln309 said:


> Yes, my ex was truly asexual. He hid it before marriage in religion (no sex before marriage) and then dodged sex from the honeymoon on. After 15 years of trying to have a life minus sex, I gave up. There were other issues as well but he had no desire for intercourse ever.


Did he truly love you? Or was he just going through the motions because of societal expectations?


----------



## Cletus (Apr 27, 2012)

oldshirt said:


> I wonder how many people in that 1% would have a definable ‘cause’ such as a medical, hormonal, medication issue or a previous trauma such as CSA or something.
> 
> I don’t mean to imply that asexuality is necessarily a result of some kind of pathology but just curious as to how many young, healthy and otherwise normal people are completely lacking in sexual desire.


Asexuals are just the tail of the sexuality distribution. Just like everything else - for every guy that masturbates 6 times a day, there is someone who never thinks about sex under any circumstances. 6 sigma from the mean, but not non-existent.

I only personally know one, the daughter of a close family friend.


----------



## Married_in_michigan (Apr 9, 2014)

i understand people claim that "asexual" exists, and numerous people commented above about this, but I have a hard time believing it to be true. I assume that there is a "cause" always related, which then factors into the Op "Barring a medical,mental, physical or hormonal condition " clause to the question. If there are no medical, mental, physical, or hormonal factors at play, I would argue there is no such thing as asexual. 

At least from what I have read, all evidence points to those that claim to be asexual, that there is a factor which influences it. At least in my personal reality, I only agree asexual exists if it is related to a cause, even if that is diagnosed or society does not want to label it a "cause".


----------



## Cletus (Apr 27, 2012)

Married_in_michigan said:


> i understand people claim that "asexual" exists, and numerous people commented above about this, but I have a hard time believing it to be true.


Much the same thing was said of homosexuals for centuries.

Your inability to grok a thing is hardly evidence against its existence. I have a hard time believing that someone could kill another human, chop him up, and store him in his freezer, but Jeffrey Dahmer existed and did all those things.

The animal kingdom is replete with examples of species with members who do not mate. It is not normal for humans in the scientific sense of the word, but that is a long way from saying that it is unnatural or impossible.


----------



## Married_in_michigan (Apr 9, 2014)

Cletus said:


> Much the same thing was said of homosexuals for centuries.
> 
> Your inability to grok a thing is hardly evidence against its existence. I have a hard time believing that someone could kill another human, chop him up, and store him in his freezer, but Jeffrey Dahmer existed and did all those things.
> 
> The animal kingdom is replete with examples of species with members who do not mate. It is not normal for humans in the scientific sense of the word, but that is a long way from saying that it is unnatural or impossible.


If we use your example of Jeffrey Dahmer, he was diagnosed with metal illness, so therefore a "reason" existing to his behavior. I agree there are asexual people, I just think it is due to some type of cause (low hormones, mental imprinting, shame, other mental influencing factor). It seems that when I have read articles about asexual people, they are often fine with themselves being asexual, so often do not seek out any answers. They do not see it as something that needs to be "fixed" (which is fine, that is their business), so they never dig into why they are asexual. 

I honestly dont have a vested interest either way, its not anything I directly deal with in my life, so I am not passionate about my take on this matter, I just have a hard time believing that someone would be asexual without an underlying contributing factor. Could I be wrong....for sure.


----------



## SpinyNorman (Jan 24, 2018)

If everyone who posted in this thread provided their definition of asexual, how many mutually incompatible definitions do you think we would get? How many would post one consistent w/ that used by a mainstream psychological organization?


----------



## maquiscat (Aug 20, 2019)

Married_in_michigan said:


> It seems that when I have read articles about asexual people, they are often fine with themselves being asexual, so often do not seek out any answers. They do not see it as something that needs to be "fixed" (which is fine, that is their business), so they never dig into why they are asexual.


Let's read this again slightly differently:



> It seems that when I have read articles about homosexual people, they are often fine with themselves being homosexual, so often do not seek out any answers. They do not see it as something that needs to be "fixed" (which is fine, that is their business), so they never dig into why they are homosexual.


And the sad thing is, that there really are people who do think that way. Yeah, ultimately there is a reason why people fall outside the statistical norm, but that doesn't mean it's any different that being left handed or naturally ambidextrous.


----------



## Married_in_michigan (Apr 9, 2014)

maquiscat said:


> Let's read this again slightly differently:
> 
> 
> 
> And the sad thing is, that there really are people who do think that way. Yeah, ultimately there is a reason why people fall outside the statistical norm, but that doesn't mean it's any different that being left handed or naturally ambidextrous.


that is a fair assessment....gave me some pause to rethink my stance.


----------



## BruceBanner (May 6, 2018)

Yes one day I will experiment to see if I am truly asexual. I've had suspicious for close to a decade now that I am asexual. I'll need to see what the obsession is about before truly giving up. I've masturbated before and so far I'm not seeing what the hype is which is why I will need to do the real thing one day to get the full experience. I've gotten my T levels checked before and I apparently have average Testosterone but perhaps I should get it checked again... I'm honestly hoping there is something wrong with me and I can get it fixed but it's really not looking that way.


----------



## maquiscat (Aug 20, 2019)

BruceBanner said:


> *Yes one day I will experiment to see if I am truly asexual.* I've had suspicious for close to a decade now that I am asexual. I'll need to see what the obsession is about before truly giving up. I've masturbated before and so far I'm not seeing what the hype is which is why I will need to do the real thing one day to get the full experience. I've gotten my T levels checked before and I apparently have average Testosterone but perhaps I should get it checked again... I'm honestly hoping there is something wrong with me and I can get it fixed but it's really not looking that way.


And how would you do that?


----------



## Mr. Nail (Apr 26, 2011)

There really aren't very many. They aren't very much like each other. Some of them have a surprising amount of sex. It is not the same thing as a sex aversion. I have 2 daughters who claim asexuality, I believe one of them. If the other wants to do something about her aversion, it's up to her, she has health coverage. My other 2 children provide a pretty good contrast.


----------



## BruceBanner (May 6, 2018)

maquiscat said:


> And how would you do that?


By actually having intercourse and seeing if it does anything for me.


----------



## maquiscat (Aug 20, 2019)

BruceBanner said:


> By actually having intercourse and seeing if it does anything for me.


This would seem to indicate that you are a virgin (with no intended negativity) at this time. However do not forget that there are those under the asexual label who have a sexual drive, without a sexual attraction to either gender. I sometimes wonder if the demi/sapio sexuals are actually that kind of asexual.

The first question you need to ask though is do you look at people and feel a desire to have sex with them. If so then you have a sexual attraction, even if you do not have the energy or urgency to do so.

Sent from my cp3705A using Tapatalk


----------



## BruceBanner (May 6, 2018)

maquiscat said:


> If so then you have a sexual attraction, even if you do not have the energy or urgency to do so.


I can get an erection.


----------



## maquiscat (Aug 20, 2019)

BruceBanner said:


> I can get an erection.


That means nothing as it occurs without external stimulus, including fantasizing.

Sent from my cp3705A using Tapatalk


----------



## maquiscat (Aug 20, 2019)

Mr. Nail said:


> There really aren't very many. They aren't very much like each other. Some of them have a surprising amount of sex. * It is not the same thing as a sex aversion.* I have 2 daughters who claim asexuality, I believe one of them. If the other wants to do something about her aversion, it's up to her, she has health coverage. My other 2 children provide a pretty good contrast.


This is a key point and a major misunderstanding that most people have. Having an sexual attraction to one gender does not automatically mean an aversion to sex with the other gender. Not being sexually attracted to anything doesn't mean an automatic aversion to sex.

Sent from my cp3705A using Tapatalk


----------



## BruceBanner (May 6, 2018)

maquiscat said:


> That means nothing as it occurs without external stimulus, including fantasizing.
> 
> Sent from my cp3705A using Tapatalk


Porn isn't an external stimulus?


----------



## maquiscat (Aug 20, 2019)

BruceBanner said:


> Porn isn't an external stimulus?


It is, and an erection can occur even without an external stimulus.

Sent from my cp3705A using Tapatalk


----------



## BruceBanner (May 6, 2018)

Honestly I don't like being Asexual and feel like an outcast. I hope none of the children have ever end up being Asexual. I didn't ask for this ****sandwich. Asexuality has led to isolation and shame.


----------



## ExPost (Aug 15, 2020)

Hey, so I'll not entirely sure how I found this conversation, but I found some things that were fairly concerning regarding asexuality that I hope to clear up, the first being the types of attraction.

There are three primary types of attraction. The first, and the one you're most likely understanding of is sexual attraction, where you wish to perform intimate acts with another person.

The next type is aesthetic attraction, where you like the way a person looks. This can be as simple as appreciation of a way a person looks, to finding the way they look as erotically stimulating.

The third type of attraction is romantic attraction, where you wish to form a romantic bond with the other person and do other relationship type things like being together and cuddling, etc.

Of these three, people can experience various levels of each, and that's okay. I personally identify as asexual grey romantic, meaning I very rarely feel romantic attraction compared to most other allosexuals, but don't really feel the need to engage in sexual acts.

On top of this there is another qualifier of sex positive or sex adverse, where a sex adverse person would find the act of sex itself repulsive. I myself am not, and am happy to please a romantic partner sexually, as I have formed a romantic bond with them.

The last thing that is often misconstrued is that of asexuality with chastity or lack of libido, where this simply isn't the case. Simply put, asexuality is not a choice like chastity, and I don't have a low libido, which means I fairly frequently pleasure myself or have another person satisfy those urges.

Last thing I should mention is that I'm fairly well socially adjusted and don't fall upon the autism spectrum. While I do occasionally feel like an outcast because of my asexuality, with help of many close friends and a therapist, I have determined this to be the fault of society's social expectations rather than asexuality itself. If there are other questions, I don't claim to be an arbiter of asexuality, but am willing to perhaps help find answers.


----------



## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

oldshirt said:


> Over the years there have been posts by people claiming their SO is asexual.
> 
> They say their SO is asexual and has no sexual feelings or desires or sexual motivations or wishes at all.
> 
> ...


Must admit that for me the men you mentioned (and any other famous good looking men) hold absolutely no interest for me sexually or otherwise. I wouldnt look twice at them. So maybe by your criteria you may assume I was asexual?
I have no interest in sex unless its with a man who I love, who loves me and who I am fully 100% committed to.Then I like sex, which is very much an expression of love and committment for me.
So maybe some just havent met the right man or woman yet or been in the right sort of committed relationship. Not everyone wants casual sex and not everyone is interested having sex with a person just because they are famous and good looking.


----------



## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

Diana7 said:


> Must admit that for me the men you mentioned (and any other famous good looking men) hold absolutely no interest for me sexually or otherwise. I wouldnt look twice at them. So maybe by your criteria you may assume I was asexual?
> I have no interest in sex unless its with a man who I love, who loves me and who I am fully 100% committed to.Then I like sex, which is very much an expression of love and committment for me.
> So maybe some just havent met the right man or woman yet or been in the right sort of committed relationship. Not everyone wants casual sex and not everyone is interested having sex with a person just because they are famous and good looking.


I was just using those as examples of popular, good looking, high-status people. Not everyone is into any given celebrity.


----------



## GC1234 (Apr 15, 2020)

oldshirt said:


> Over the years there have been posts by people claiming their SO is asexual.
> 
> They say their SO is asexual and has no sexual feelings or desires or sexual motivations or wishes at all.
> 
> ...


I think asexuality exists, but, if they're asexual, they wouldn't need a hall pass to go seeking it elsewhere...


----------



## Galabar01 (Mar 20, 2019)

I found this video to be very informative:


----------



## maquiscat (Aug 20, 2019)

GC1234 said:


> I think asexuality exists, but, if they're asexual, they wouldn't need a hall pass to go seeking it elsewhere...


That was oddly tangent-al

Sent from my cp3705A using Tapatalk


----------



## GC1234 (Apr 15, 2020)

maquiscat said:


> That was oddly tangent-al
> 
> Sent from my cp3705A using Tapatalk


Sorry, what do you mean?


----------



## maquiscat (Aug 20, 2019)

GC1234 said:


> Sorry, what do you mean?


When the topic was asexuality, what was the point in discussing going elsewhere for sex, with the implication that the asexual is the one seeking elsewhere. That simply hasn't been talked about yet, unless I missed something. As close as it has gotten is if the asexual's partner is in an open relationship with the asexual, and seeks sex outside the relationship.

Sent from my cp3705A using Tapatalk


----------



## GC1234 (Apr 15, 2020)

maquiscat said:


> When the topic was asexuality, what was the point in discussing going elsewhere for sex, with the implication that the asexual is the one seeking elsewhere. That simply hasn't been talked about yet, unless I missed something. As close as it has gotten is if the asexual's partner is in an open relationship with the asexual, and seeks sex outside the relationship.
> 
> Sent from my cp3705A using Tapatalk


Oh lol. The OP mentioned it somewhere in the paragraph, so I was addressing that. My apologies, I probably should have quoted the sentence to be clearer.


----------



## maquiscat (Aug 20, 2019)

GC1234 said:


> Oh lol. The OP mentioned it somewhere in the paragraph, so I was addressing that. My apologies, I probably should have quoted the sentence to be clearer.


Making it bold would have worked too.

Are you talking about the "asexual with you" comment?

Sent from my cp3705A using Tapatalk


----------



## GC1234 (Apr 15, 2020)

This: Sometimes the SO themselves even tell them that they are asexual and to leave them be or even give them a hall pass to seek it elsewhere... 

But I think I misread it.


----------



## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

maquiscat said:


> That was oddly tangent-al


A bit OT, yet your avatar reminds me of one of the hosts on the YouTube show, Secular Sexuality as produced by the Atheist Community of Austin.


----------



## maquiscat (Aug 20, 2019)

Personal said:


> A bit OT, yet your avatar reminds me of one of the hosts on the YouTube show, Secular Sexuality as produced by the Atheist Community of Austin.


NOt sure why. If I am correct in assuming Austin TX, then I am on the other side of the country on Delmarva (peninsula of DE, MD and VA). The avatar was made for me by a previous co-worker just because she wanted to do it.


----------



## downfall69 (Sep 23, 2012)

I have experienced this twice.had girlfriends that had lots of sex at the beginning of the relationship and apparently loved it then slowly over time it slowly died down to almost nonexistent as the years passed.

Completely lost interest and had no urge to have sex had one even tell me that she was asexual and sex had little to no importance and sex was just forcing herself at the beginning of the relationship to have sex.

After we broke up and they found new boyfriends all of a sudden the urge was back and they had normal sex life's again. 

I've came to the conclusion the problem was me and they used the term asexual as a scapegoat to justify their actions.


----------



## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

oldshirt said:


> I was just using those as examples of popular, good looking, high-status people. Not everyone is into any given celebrity.


or any celebrity.


----------



## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

Diana7 said:


> not everyone is interested having sex with a person just because they are famous and good looking.


Sure, yet there are plenty who of us who do appreciate aesthetic pleasures.

When I first saw my wife I thought I'd like to have sex with her because she was good looking. Likewise my wife is also fond of reminding me that if I wasn't good looking in the first place, she wouldn't have asked me out on our first date.


----------



## maquiscat (Aug 20, 2019)

downfall69 said:


> I have experienced this twice.had girlfriends that had lots of sex at the beginning of the relationship and apparently loved it then slowly over time it slowly died down to almost nonexistent as the years passed.
> 
> Completely lost interest and had no urge to have sex had one even tell me that she was asexual and sex had little to no importance and sex was just forcing herself at the beginning of the relationship to have sex.
> 
> ...


My sympathies to you.

Experiences like these, however, should not be used to dismiss the reality of asexuals. NOt saying that @downfall69 is specifically trying to say that, but there are those out there who do.


----------



## MaiChi (Jun 20, 2018)

oldshirt said:


> Over the years there have been posts by people claiming their SO is asexual.


I think there are hundreds of orientations. The problem is that nobody has gathered all of them and defined each one in a comprehensive manner and we get only a minority of poorly defined orientations. 

I really do not mind anyone being whatever they think they are but I strongly think that nobody should marry outside their narrowly defined orientation as it causes huge issues unnecessarily. There government, churches, marriage advisers, parents, interested parties, etc, help people assess themselves and categorise before they marry. Nobody should ever have to find themselves married to someone who belongs to another orientation. for example, a 15 times per week orientation should be married to another 15 times per week orientation or within one point variance like 14 or 16. 

The big orientation boundaries we currently use, such as, hetero, bi, gay, asexual, are hopelessly inaccurate so that nobody can use them to determine anything long term. The orientations need to be more specific and the advice to marry only your orientation should be easier to understand.


----------



## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

MaiChi said:


> I think there are hundreds of orientations. The problem is that nobody has gathered all of them and defined each one in a comprehensive manner and we get only a minority of poorly defined orientations.
> 
> I really do not mind anyone being whatever they think they are but I strongly think that nobody should marry outside their narrowly defined orientation as it causes huge issues unnecessarily. There government, churches, marriage advisers, parents, interested parties, etc, help people assess themselves and categorise before they marry. Nobody should ever have to find themselves married to someone who belongs to another orientation. for example, a 15 times per week orientation should be married to another 15 times per week orientation or within one point variance like 14 or 16.
> 
> The big orientation boundaries we currently use, such as, hetero, bi, gay, asexual, are hopelessly inaccurate so that nobody can use them to determine anything long term. The orientations need to be more specific and the advice to marry only your orientation should be easier to understand.


Sounds great in principle but the problem there is we are all more fluid and relationships are all more dynamic than that. 

People change. Relationships change. 

The absolute horniest and most sexually oriented person I have ever been with and who craved and desired me the most is now married to a woman. She had never even been with a woman until her 50s when she got with her now wife. 

Millions of couples couldn’t keep their hands off each other in the opening acts of the relationship but a couple years down the road, one or both now have very little interest in sex. 

And let’s not forget that for most Average Joes and Janes, that the world really isn’t a sexual buffet for them. 

George Clooney and Jenifer Anniston May get to pick whoever they want at that particular moment, but the rest of tend to be with who we are able to get and hope that they can check off most boxes.


----------



## MaiChi (Jun 20, 2018)

oldshirt said:


> Sounds great in principle but the problem there is we are all more fluid and relationships are all more dynamic than that.
> 
> People change. Relationships change.
> 
> ...


I hear you loud and clear. What if, (its just a "what if" ) we had a government funded RELATIONSHIP WORTHINESS ASSESSMENT ever five years. Just like cars have a road worthiness test each year. The los in divorce revenue might be got from the new income from advisory entities that would mushroom to corner that market. The government would save a lot of money from people saying longer together and children not needing any support. Many assumptions here as no research has yet been made hence What if "


----------



## BruceBanner (May 6, 2018)

downfall69 said:


> I have experienced this twice.had girlfriends that had lots of sex at the beginning of the relationship and apparently loved it then slowly over time it slowly died down to almost nonexistent as the years passed.
> 
> Completely lost interest and had no urge to have sex had one even tell me that she was asexual and sex had little to no importance and sex was just forcing herself at the beginning of the relationship to have sex.
> 
> ...


No the problem wasn't you. Odds are they will pull the same **** with their new boyfriend.


----------



## maquiscat (Aug 20, 2019)

MaiChi said:


> I hear you loud and clear. What if, (its just a "what if" ) we had a government funded RELATIONSHIP WORTHINESS ASSESSMENT ever five years. Just like cars have a road worthiness test each year. The los in divorce revenue might be got from the new income from advisory entities that would mushroom to corner that market. The government would save a lot of money from people saying longer together and children not needing any support. Many assumptions here as no research has yet been made hence What if "


This is a very bad idea. Worthiness is a subjective value, especially in humans, and highly subject to change. With mechanical things, we can make objective measurements, even if we have to use subjective criteria (i.e. is 40 psi int the tires road worthy or does it need to be 50). With humans, what each of us feels and does will change over the years. There could never be such a test. For that matter, even things which we collectively felt were disorders yesteryear, are good today and things that were normal (ex: senility) we now see as a disorder. There can be no easily defining line.

Sent from my cp3705A using Tapatalk


----------



## 2020hindsight (Nov 3, 2015)

oldshirt said:


> I wonder how many people in that 1% would have a definable ‘cause’ such as a medical, hormonal, medication issue or a previous trauma such as CSA or something.
> 
> I don’t mean to imply that asexuality is necessarily a result of some kind of pathology but just curious as to how many young, healthy and otherwise normal people are completely lacking in sexual desire.


I believe asexuals exist because I am one, and that has been my authentic orientation for my entire life. I was young, healthy, and otherwise normal apart from having no sexual desire/no sexual attraction toward anyone, ever. When I was young, I wasn't even aware that such a thing as asexuality existed. I did realize that I was different from others my age. However, I just thought I must be a late bloomer, and that surely one day I'd feel those feelings, too. But it never happened.

I did fall in love with boys starting at age 19 and had boyfriends (one at a time), and finally, a husband. Love had nothing to do with sex, for me, and I got nothing out of sex, which made me feel a bit cheated by life. I did understand that the boys/men seemed to need sex, so I provided that for them whenever they wanted. Love, to me, meant adoring that person and wanting to be with him all the time.

When I got older (30s), I felt panic that sex was still not working for me, so I sought a great deal of help from therapists, doctors, endocrinologists, counselors, but nothing made a difference. My hormones and other bloodwork were perfectly normal.

I believe current research indicates that 1% of the population is asexual; i.e., does not feel sexual attraction. An unfortunate subset of the asexual population not only does not feel sexual attraction toward people, but also does not experiences sexual urges or pleasure at all. Sadly, I fall into the latter group. But at least now I finally understand myself. I marvel that I forced myself to go against my true nature for so long, just to be in romantic relationships.


----------



## 2020hindsight (Nov 3, 2015)

Married_in_michigan said:


> If we use your example of Jeffrey Dahmer, he was diagnosed with metal illness, so therefore a "reason" existing to his behavior. I agree there are asexual people, I just think it is due to some type of cause (low hormones, mental imprinting, shame, other mental influencing factor). It seems that when I have read articles about asexual people, they are often fine with themselves being asexual, so often do not seek out any answers. They do not see it as something that needs to be "fixed" (which is fine, that is their business), so they never dig into why they are asexual.
> 
> I honestly dont have a vested interest either way, its not anything I directly deal with in my life, so I am not passionate about my take on this matter, I just have a hard time believing that someone would be asexual without an underlying contributing factor. Could I be wrong....for sure.


If there was an underlying contributing factor in my case, then a lifetime of searching for the answer was never able to discover it. I think the 1% of people born without sexual attraction are just on the extreme end of the desire spectrum, just as people who enjoy sexual activity very frequently are on the other end of the spectrum.


----------



## 2020hindsight (Nov 3, 2015)

SpinyNorman said:


> If everyone who posted in this thread provided their definition of asexual, how many mutually incompatible definitions do you think we would get? How many would post one consistent w/ that used by a mainstream psychological organization?


Current scientific thinking is that the 1% of the population who do not experience sexual attraction comprise a sexual orientation. A sexual orientation cannot be cured or wished away.

Heterosexual orientation = sexual attraction to the opposite sex
Homosexual orientation = sexual attraction to the same sex
Bisexual orientation = sexual attraction to both sexes
Asexual orientation = sexual attraction to neither sex


----------



## maquiscat (Aug 20, 2019)

2020hindsight said:


> I marvel that I forced myself to go against my true nature for so long, just to be in romantic relationships.


You aren't necessarily going against your true nature though. Not understanding it, yes, but also not going against it. One of the things I have to keep pointing out about orientation is it indicates who/what sexually attracts you, not who/what you are willing to have sex with. Orientation doesn't automatically mean repulsion of sex outside that attraction. Sounds like you still had sex willingly and wanted to, not for your own pleasure, but that of your partner whom you loved. Romantic attraction is separate from sexual attraction, and also runs along the same lines. So having sex when not sexually attracted, but romantically attracted is not going against one's nature.



2020hindsight said:


> Current scientific thinking is that the 1% of the population who do not experience sexual attraction comprise a sexual orientation. A sexual orientation cannot be cured or wished away.
> 
> Heterosexual orientation = sexual attraction to the opposite sex
> Homosexual orientation = sexual attraction to the same sex
> ...


To muddy the waters further, this does seem to break down to a sex/gender split. And in this case, for gender, it is the gender that the one who is attracted perceives, not the gender that the person attracted to claims. To expand, while yes, we make our impressions long before we ever see genitals, that factor can be the deciding factor in our attractions for some, maybe even the majority, despite initial attraction. Others however, see the person more, and what's between the legs does not cut it. I am one of those types. I identify as straight, but as long as the person seems a woman to me, I am alright. Now others have said that I am bisexual, but since no type of man sexually attracts me (with the possible exception of John Barrowman, but that's understandable), be they a cis-male or a trans male, I don't think the label applies.

One thing is for certain. The more free we are to express ourselves, and not be repressed into predetermined narrow views, the more complex we become as a race/species. Wonderfully so, IMHO.


----------



## SpinyNorman (Jan 24, 2018)

2020hindsight said:


> Current scientific thinking is that the 1% of the population who do not experience sexual attraction comprise a sexual orientation. A sexual orientation cannot be cured or wished away.
> 
> Heterosexual orientation = sexual attraction to the opposite sex
> Homosexual orientation = sexual attraction to the same sex
> ...


Thanks, and if this had appeared early on and everyone had used it, I might've participated in the thread. But I find it futile to discuss something w/ someone whose definition doesn't match mine, and getting everyone on the same page is like trying to herd flies.


----------



## maquiscat (Aug 20, 2019)

One Eighty said:


> Yes, I am sure of it. My two children, in their LATE teens, are both solidly "Ace" and proud of it. Neither one has ever been on a date with a member of the opposite sex or same sex. A lot of their friends are Ace as well. They wear T-shirts, hats, buy stickers, that declare their status. Did you know there is even a flag, like the Gay Pride flag, for this? One of them has this flag on the wall in the bedroom.
> 
> I don't understand it. I have always been high drive. Their mother is not as high drive as me but I'd say higher than average. Maybe our children were affected in a negative way by the open and frequent displays of physical affection between us?
> 
> *I know that, sadly, I will never be a grandparent.*


Not necessarily true. First a lack of sexual attraction does not automatically mean a lack of romantic attraction, or sexual drive. It also doesn't mean a lack of desire to be a parent. Ace people get married and have children. Not all, of course. Aside from the natural process, there is also adoption. There are possibilities for asexual people out there. They can be no more pigeonholed that any other orientation. Love them and encourage them, and hope for the best.


----------



## Elizabeth001 (May 18, 2015)

maquiscat said:


> Not necessarily true. First a lack of sexual attraction does not automatically mean a lack of romantic attraction, or sexual drive. It also doesn't mean a lack of desire to be a parent. Ace people get married and have children. Not all, of course. Aside from the natural process, there is also adoption. There are possibilities for asexual people out there. They can be no more pigeonholed that any other orientation. Love them and encourage them, and hope for the best.


Love this post. Sexual orientation has no direct bearing on the want/will to be a parent.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


----------



## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

One Eighty said:


> Yes, I am sure of it. My two children, in their LATE teens, are both solidly "Ace" and proud of it. Neither one has ever been on a date with a member of the opposite sex or same sex. A lot of their friends are Ace as well. They wear T-shirts, hats, buy stickers, that declare their status. Did you know there is even a flag, like the Gay Pride flag, for this? One of them has this flag on the wall in the bedroom.
> 
> I don't understand it. I have always been high drive. Their mother is not as high drive as me but I'd say higher than average. Maybe our children were affected in a negative way by the open and frequent displays of physical affection between us?
> 
> I know that, sadly, I will never be a grandparent.


Oh they are simply full of it. 

Teens are usually full of crap at any given moment. One day they say they are going to be a brain surgeon and they next day they want to be an anarchist. They can’t seem be in their own skin and can’t think beyond the moment. That’s why people aren’t legally considered adults until 18 and don’t have full adult rights and priveledges until 21.

Anything a teen says is only as good as their mood at that particular moment.

Furthermore, wearing t-shirts and waxing flags and calling themselves cutesy names etc is making a political and social statement and meant to garner attention for themselves. 

An actual asexual just goes on about his/her business and doesn’t make an issue of it and many don’t even think of themselves in any particular sexual manner.

In other words, they are just being goofy teens at this moment. 

In time they will meet someone that makes their heart skip a beat, they will fall in love, marry and have kids just like everyone else at some point.

And even many if not most true asexuals marry and have homes and families. 

Having a sex driving and wanting kids and families are two completely different wavelengths and different concepts.

I was hornier than a 3-balled billy goat in my younger days but I was never a kid person and never had any innate desire or yearning for children. 

Sexual desire and desire for children and family have nothing to do with each other.


----------



## Talker67 (Apr 7, 2016)

i am pretty sure asexuality is a real thing.
but it probably is not what we think it is. For instance, some asexuals masturbate often. Some date, get married. 

there are some forums online, like this one,






Asexual Relationships


A place for all discussions about relationships, be they romantic, friendly, familial, or anything else.




www.asexuality.org






i also wonder how many "asexuals" really are just people with hormonal imbalance, who with the right therapy or cues could be as horny as anyone else?


----------



## maquiscat (Aug 20, 2019)

Talker67 said:


> i am pretty sure asexuality is a real thing.
> but it probably is not what we think it is. For instance, some asexuals masturbate often. Some date, get married.
> 
> there are some forums online, like this one,
> ...


You seem to be conflating a few things. Sex drive is separate from sexual attraction. Asexuals can still have normal to high sex drive without being sexually attracted to anyone. Sexual attraction also has nothing to do with desire to have children nor romantic attraction. Asexuals can still fall in love, even while not attracted to have sex with that person (doesn't mean they won't). 

Granted many of these aspects do naturally coexist together. What we have to realize is that they are actually independent of each other, and can occur in various combinations.

Sent from my cp3705A using Tapatalk


----------



## badsanta (Oct 13, 2014)

Talker67 said:


> i also wonder how many "asexuals" really are just people with hormonal imbalance, who with the right therapy or cues could be as horny as anyone else?


This would be true if a spouse looking for something to blame incorrectly labeled a spouse as asexual and that person incorrectly believed it. 

Often on this forum when a man looses interest in his wife, many immediately accuse him of being gay. Meanwhile research indicates that early in a relationship that the honeymoon phase (NRE) of a relationship has additional hormones that mask/overcome underlying issues that are normal and healthy (Like someone that enjoys erotic role play with a spouse that is only into partner-based desire).


----------



## Talker67 (Apr 7, 2016)

yeah, i did not say i "understood" the term....only that i believed it was an actual thing.

Perhaps a lot of couples in a sexless marriage are actually married to an asexual?


----------



## Talker67 (Apr 7, 2016)

i just noticed there are three groups on Fet Life related to this.
Asexual and Kinky, Asexual and Poly, and Asexual

Sign up is free for fet life. and they have a TON of kinks to explore


----------



## Ella-Bee (Apr 18, 2020)

I'm going to vote 'not real' outside of medical issues. I don't think most people (women especially) actually understand their own sexuality. We just go along with what we are told we should like and if that doesn't work for us then we just put it down to low libido, age or whatever else, file it away as 'unfixable' and don't think much more on it. Then we expect our partners to just suffer in silence, since other areas of the marriage are okay.

Someone tried to convince me I was asexual a few years back. I'd had several relationships where we had sex but it wasn't great and I could take it or leave it. I liked sex in theory and constantly fantasised about random things, but RL sex just didn't match up for me. I also had no issue with porn as a concept, but didn't personally enjoy any of the porn I found. And I was never turned on by the 'hot' celebrities and other types that most of my female friends liked and would share with me. I once admitted this to a couple of friends and they suggested I was asexual.

I gave up dating for a while after a bad break up and was single for a few years. While stuck by myself a lot of the time I ended up discovering two important things:

Firstly, I changed careers and met a couple of guys at work that I actually found really hot. Seriously hot! Like, I couldn't sit near them and concentrate at the same time, hot! I'd never had that before. I realised I have a 'type' that isn't what most women are into and that's fine. I need to be with a man like that rather than the men I get introduced to by friends or that I'm told I should be into. I like tall, awkward, nerdy, Elon Musk types with terrible social skills and a huge brain. Preferrably with glasses. Most women like Elon because he's incredibly wealthy but gives off an 'easy to catch' vibe. He's a gold-digger's fantasy! Yet he could be broke and I'd still date him. I can't stand big muscles or stereotypically 'good looking' men you get in GQ magazines that 99% of women fawn over. I thought I should like those guys, since everyone else I knew rated them, and I dated that type for a long time. The first time I hooked up with a guy that was my 'type' the sex was incredible and I suddenly had a crazy libido 24/7. 

Secondly, I realised I have zero interest in most porn because the women tend to act submissive. I'm 100% dominant in the bedroom. I get completely turned off seeing a women in missionary, getting spanked, tied up, etc. But switch the roles and my brain lights up like a pinball machine! In fact, the more dominant the better, to the point that there are certain things I'm into in porn that I would never want to try in RL and will just remain embarrassing fantasies. I had to 'research' (as I consider it) a ton of gay porn, since so much of the vanilla stuff is always submissive women and not kinky/extreme enough. If anything, I prefer to remove the woman from it entirely and just watch men. I'm basically a gay man in a female body!

My point is, before I learned what I was into, I would have gone along with the 'asexual' label too. And I likely would have given up on ever dating or having a functioning libido ever again. I came very close to doing exactly that. I'm now in my mid 30s and feel like I've just started out. My only problem now is that everyone I meet is already taken! 😆


----------



## maquiscat (Aug 20, 2019)

Ella-Bee said:


> I'm going to vote 'not real' outside of medical issues. I don't think most people (women especially) actually understand their own sexuality. We just go along with what we are told we should like and if that doesn't work for us then we just put it down to low libido, age or whatever else, file it away as 'unfixable' and don't think much more on it. Then we expect our partners to just suffer in silence, since other areas of the marriage are okay.


So two issues here. First in a way you defeat your own argument. We are more often told that we should have a sex drive or have sexual attractions. That if we find the right type, as you finally found, that it will work. But such is not always the case. And the worse part is people like you do exist who can mistake not finding their type for asexuality. The trap is to assume that such is the case for all suspected asexuals. My other issue is an assumption that a partner is going to suffer. On one hand, figuring out that you are asexual after you have been in a relationship does indeed put a partner at risk of problems. On the other hand, if they discover they are asexual when they are not partnered, or have lost a partner because of the discovery, then outside of the unethical method of not disclosing such to new potential partners, no one suffers because they know what they are getting into.



> Someone tried to convince me I was asexual a few years back. I'd had several relationships where we had sex but it wasn't great and I could take it or leave it. I liked sex in theory and constantly fantasised about random things, but RL sex just didn't match up for me. I also had no issue with porn as a concept, but didn't personally enjoy any of the porn I found. And I was never turned on by the 'hot' celebrities and other types that most of my female friends liked and would share with me. I once admitted this to a couple of friends and they suggested I was asexual.
> 
> I gave up dating for a while after a bad break up and was single for a few years. While stuck by myself a lot of the time I ended up discovering two important things:
> 
> Firstly, I changed careers and met a couple of guys at work that I actually found really hot. Seriously hot! Like, I couldn't sit near them and concentrate at the same time, hot! I'd never had that before. I realised I have a 'type' that isn't what most women are into and that's fine. I need to be with a man like that rather than the men I get introduced to by friends or that I'm told I should be into. I like tall, awkward, nerdy, Elon Musk types with terrible social skills and a huge brain. Preferrably with glasses. Most women like Elon because he's incredibly wealthy but gives off an 'easy to catch' vibe. He's a gold-digger's fantasy! Yet he could be broke and I'd still date him. I can't stand big muscles or stereotypically 'good looking' men you get in GQ magazines that 99% of women fawn over. I thought I should like those guys, since everyone else I knew rated them, and I dated that type for a long time. The first time I hooked up with a guy that was my 'type' the sex was incredible and I suddenly had a crazy libido 24/7.


I get this. And it's sadly not uncommon, although it does seem to be shrinking as more people connect (not necessarily sexually or romantically) on line and declare how they are outside the statistical norm. And it's rather like the problem homosexuals faced just a few short decades ago. They were told that they had to be attracted to the opposite sex, and when that didn't do it for them (if they didn't figure out they were gay), chalked it up to a lack of libido, or other issues. If asexuality had been a discussed things, they might have thought they were asexual instead of homosexual. While our sexuality may be a set innate part of us, us understanding it isn't necessarily automatic.



> Secondly, I realised I have zero interest in most porn because the women tend to act submissive. I'm 100% dominant in the bedroom. I get completely turned off seeing a women in missionary, getting spanked, tied up, etc. But switch the roles and my brain lights up like a pinball machine! In fact, the more dominant the better, to the point that there are certain things I'm into in porn that I would never want to try in RL and will just remain embarrassing fantasies. I had to 'research' (as I consider it) a ton of gay porn, since so much of the vanilla stuff is always submissive women and not kinky/extreme enough.


Kind of makes me wonder how long ago this was that you were not finding the Femdom porn



> If anything, I prefer to remove the woman from it entirely and just watch men. I'm basically a gay man in a female body!


Sounds like you need to look into Yaoi (I think I spelled that right)



> My point is, before I learned what I was into, I would have gone along with the 'asexual' label too. And I likely would have given up on ever dating or having a functioning libido ever again. I came very close to doing exactly that. I'm now in my mid 30s and feel like I've just started out. My only problem now is that everyone I meet is already taken! 😆


I very much agree with you that due to various circumstances we can misread our own sexuality. But I do not think that due to the existence of that possibility, it dismisses the existence of asexuality as a sexual orientation. I don't know if you read any of my earlier posts, but keep in mind that asexuals can have normal or even high sex drives. Asexuality is about sexual attraction, not sex drive. Just like a heterosexual or homosexual can still be sexually attracted to someone, even if they have no desire to have the sex itself, so too can an asexual have a desire for sex without being attracted to any given person in a sexual manner.


----------



## 347233 (Nov 25, 2020)

My husband is asexual. He can live without and he is healthy. All he wants to do is watching TV (sports, movies, comedy), play video games, and read. He is about to be 50. We never have sex for 6.5 years and he stopped kissing me 8-9 years.

His C never gets hard, he never has a high sex drive at the beginning of marriage or dating. 

I am thinking about divorce. I can't live my precious life like this for the rest of my life. We have kids (I got pregnant because I start to sex and make him orgasm).

I wanted to live with someone who has passion and affection with who I can connect and be myself. 





old shirt said:


> Over the years there have been posts by people claiming their SO is asexual.
> 
> They say their SO is asexual and has no sexual feelings or desires or sexual motivations or wishes at all.
> 
> ...


----------



## happyhusband0005 (May 4, 2018)

oldshirt said:


> I agree with this.
> 
> How many people would change their tune if someone very nice and good looking and engaging were to make a valid offer.


This is kind of like saying a lesbian just hasn't met the right guy yet.


----------



## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

happyhusband0005 said:


> This is kind of like saying a lesbian just hasn't met the right guy yet.


That is something for a separate thread, but I believe that statement is largely true. 

I do believe most people currently in the lesbian lifestyle would go with a man if the right one for them came along. 

I accept there are a certain number of women that truly prefer being with women. 

But I think the majority would go with a tall, successful, good looking man that was kind and treated them decently came along. 

I hate to promote stereotypes, but almost every single lesbian I have ever known personally either had serious daddy issues or were treated badly by previous boyfriends or were simply women that most good looking, successful men would not be interested in and were basically left behind by men. 

Sorry if that upsetting to some, but that has been my experience.


----------



## Imperfections (Nov 26, 2020)

oldshirt said:


> Over the years there have been posts by people claiming their SO is asexual.
> 
> They say their SO is asexual and has no sexual feelings or desires or sexual motivations or wishes at all.
> 
> ...


I believe those cases exist but are very rare. There are many reasons why people won’t or can’t have sex with their partner, asexuality is rarely one of them.


----------



## maquiscat (Aug 20, 2019)

Imperfections said:


> I believe those cases exist but are very rare. There are many reasons why people won’t or can’t have sex with their partner, asexuality is rarely one of them.


I agree, but something to keep in mind is that even as a rare occurrence, say 1%, we're still looking at over 33 million asexuals in the US alone, and over 780 million world wide. Those are not insignificant numbers


----------



## maquiscat (Aug 20, 2019)

oldshirt said:


> That is something for a separate thread, but I believe that statement is largely true.
> 
> I do believe most people currently in the lesbian lifestyle would go with a man if the right one for them came along.
> 
> ...


I will counter that with my own experience of that rarely happening. Now, just to throw chaos into the mix, I have also seen both homosexuals and heterosexuals who have made "exceptions". In almost all the times I've seen it (about a dozen so very small sample size) there has only been one person that they end up with that goes against their orientation. Mostly happens within poly units, but not always, as my sister is an example of. Again, as with you, this has been my experience. YMMV.


----------



## maquiscat (Aug 20, 2019)

Itiyou34 said:


> My husband is asexual. He can live without and he is healthy. All he wants to do is watching TV (sports, movies, comedy), play video games, and read. He is about to be 50. We never have sex for 6.5 years and he stopped kissing me 8-9 years.
> 
> His C never gets hard, he never has a high sex drive at the beginning of marriage or dating.
> 
> ...


In the context of this thread (I have made my recommendations to you in the one you started), that's valid, but there are also people who can happily live with asexuals, in either a closed or open marriage. Remember that romantic attraction is separate from sexual attraction. While both usually occur together, either can exist without the other.


----------



## Imperfections (Nov 26, 2020)

maquiscat said:


> I agree, but something to keep in mind is that even as a rare occurrence, say 1%, we're still looking at over 33 million asexuals in the US alone, and over 780 million world wide. Those are not insignificant numbers


I think “rare” would be less than 1%...Although it’s difficult to define what asexual really means if nobody has a complete picture of how sexuality even works.
Somebody might be uncomfortable with some aspects of their sexuality for a variety of reasons and decide they are asexual. Does it mean they really are or does it mean they haven’t found a way to express it or accept it?
It’s complicated...I still think true asexuality (where really nothing ever turns a person on) is either extremely rare or almost non-existent.


----------



## maquiscat (Aug 20, 2019)

Imperfections said:


> I think “rare” would be less than 1%...Although it’s difficult to define what asexual really means if nobody has a complete picture of how sexuality even works.


We then need to come up with a common meaning, at least for the context of this discussion, as to what "rare" means. At .1% we're still at over 3 million in the US and 78 million world wide. Again not insignificant numbers. So what is it that you are considering rare?

Although I agree with you that we are discovering a great deal more about human sexuality now that we are not being restricted by what generations have asserted upon us, and don't know the full extent of sexuality/sexual orientation. Through my interactions, for example, I have encountered people who are attracted to those whom they see has either male or female, and not what is between their legs. IOW, the person can have a penis, but because they otherwise present as a woman, the person is attracted. Same for a man with a vagina between their legs. And note that in some cases, it is more how the one being attracted sees them, and not how the one attracting views themselves.



> Somebody might be uncomfortable with some aspects of their sexuality for a variety of reasons and decide they are asexual. Does it mean they really are or does it mean they haven’t found a way to express it or accept it?


We could say that about all the other sexualities as well. Somebody might be uncomfortable with some aspects of their sexuality for a variety of reasons and decide they are heterosexual. Does it mean they really are or does it mean they haven’t found a way to express it or accept it? By your logic, all sexuality is now in question. If we accept that at least some people are actually heterosexual or homosexual or even bisexual and have correctly identified themselves as such, then the same would extend to asexuality.



> It’s complicated...I still think true asexuality (where really nothing ever turns a person on) is either extremely rare or almost non-existent.


You're conflating sexual attraction (sexuality) with sex drive. Asexual people can be sexually active and even have a high sex drive. What makes them asexuals is that they are not _sexually_ attracted to anyone. No _person _turns them on. Sex in and of itself might do that, or certain activities. And they certainly can develop romantic attractions. But asexuals don't have that moment of looking at Sean Connery or Marilyn Monroe (to use common "sexy" people from my earlier days) and saying "I'd tap that".

Here is something I found that might make the concept of the difference between sexual orientation/attraction and sexual drive a bit more clear:


https://www.glaad.org/amp/proud-asexuality-awareness-week-2019 said:


> An asexual person experiences a lack of sexual attraction, and the asexuality spectrum refers to the full range of individuals under the asexual umbrella, including but not limited to, identities such as greysexual and demisexual, who may experience little to no sexual attraction. Well, that’s all fine and dandy, but what even is sexual attraction?
> 
> Sexual attraction is a form of attraction in which someone finds another person sexually appealing, becomes “turned on” by that person’s physical appearance or qualities, and wants to engage in sexual activities with them due to their “erotic appeal.”
> 
> That’s great, now what about sex drive? I have a high sex drive, and that factor stopped me from learning more and accepting my asexuality for many years. Sex drive (libido) is the physical state of wanting or not wanting sex in general. Just because someone has a high sex drive and wants to engage in sex often (in theory), doesn’t mean they are willing to have sex with anyone and everyone they see. Likewise, someone could be sexually attracted to their partner, but have a low sex drive, and not want to have sex often, even though the attraction does not diminish.


----------



## Imperfections (Nov 26, 2020)

maquiscat said:


> We then need to come up with a common meaning, at least for the context of this discussion, as to what "rare" means. At .1% we're still at over 3 million in the US and 78 million world wide. Again not insignificant numbers. So what is it that you are considering rare?


I am more interested in the meaning of ‘asexuality’. Is it to do with how you feel or how you act? (Life-style choice). Like I said, one may be turned on by a thing or a person or whatever but decide never to act on it. Would this make one asexual? Or is it not just another word for sexually repressed?

I took it to mean it’s to do with how one feels. Or was I mistaken?



maquiscat said:


> Although I agree with you that we are discovering a great deal more about human sexuality now that we are not being restricted by what generations have asserted upon us, and don't know the full extent of sexuality/sexual orientation. Through my interactions, for example, I have encountered people who are attracted to those whom they see has either male or female, and not what is between their legs. IOW, the person can have a penis, but because they otherwise present as a woman, the person is attracted. Same for a man with a vagina between their legs. And note that in some cases, it is more how the one being attracted sees them, and not how the one attracting views themselves.


Yes, I read that some people can have a penis but feel or present themselves sexually as a penguin (nothing wrong with that, more fish to them, I say). Does it mean the woman, upon meeting the penis/penguin, is attracted to penguins or to penises? Are you saying that if the woman is asexual, then she will be attracted to penguins but if she was heterosexual, she will disregard the penguin and go for the penis? 
This is all very confusing...




maquiscat said:


> We could say that about all the other sexualities as well. Somebody might be uncomfortable with some aspects of their sexuality for a variety of reasons and decide they are heterosexual. Does it mean they really are or does it mean they haven’t found a way to express it or accept it? By your logic, all sexuality is now in question. If we accept that at least some people are actually heterosexual or homosexual or even bisexual and have correctly identified themselves as such, then the same would extend to asexuality.


I think we are saying the same thing: I was going by how one feels, not by how one acts. I don’t think a heterosexual man doing homosexual acts (against their own desire) makes one a homosexual...(Maybe Mr Garrison was onto something with “I’m not gay, I just act that way” meme...



maquiscat said:


> You're conflating sexual attraction (sexuality) with sex drive. Asexual people can be sexually active and even have a high sex drive. What makes them asexuals is that they are not _sexually_ attracted to anyone. No _person _turns them on. Sex in and of itself might do that, or certain activities. And they certainly can develop romantic attractions. But asexuals don't have that moment of looking at Sean Connery or Marilyn Monroe (to use common "sexy" people from my earlier days) and saying "I'd tap that".
> 
> Here is something I found that might make the concept of the difference between sexual orientation/attraction and sexual drive a bit more clear:


Now in all seriousness, I find the explanations below VERY difficult to follow. Perhaps it is the way the words are used. Everything seems to contradict one another and everything is too subjective to have any (practical) meaning. There HAS to be some form of objectivity when it comes to sexuality otherwise nothing makes sense anymore or it just doesn’t matter and maybe it would be easier to dispense with labels?


----------



## Thumos (Jul 21, 2020)

I believe both women and men can experience times of low libido. I also believe this is almost always caused by something. Health problems, depression, medications with side effects. And any loving husband or wife experiencing low libido is going to want to address the underlying causes for the sake of their marriage, because a marriage is a sexually intimate relationship. That's the glue that binds everything else together. 

There was a recent thread here where a healthy woman was being deprived of sex in her marriage and finally confronted her husband about it. 

Conversely, If a woman isn't sexually attracted to her husband, I think she'd damn well better be honest about it instead of rugsweeping it or stepping outside the marriage (which is what so often happens instead).


----------



## Erysimum (Jun 20, 2020)

To the question, if asexuality exists- yes it very much does. I'm friends with an asexual couple who have been asexual their whole life, have been together for 12 years, tried sex, and found it didn't please them. They're happy together both emotionally and physically they just don't have sex.

Now, is asexuality a major point in sexless marriages,n probably not. However, there's a difference between being asexual and having a low sex drive further hampered by stress, anxiety, distress, and general unhappiness- especially if the person who wants to have sex with you is causing the above. I think many women experience a lack of want for sex simply as they get older if it becomes a chore and less of a pleasant experience.


----------



## maquiscat (Aug 20, 2019)

Imperfections said:


> I am more interested in the meaning of ‘asexuality’. Is it to do with how you feel or how you act? (Life-style choice). Like I said, one may be turned on by a thing or a person or whatever but decide never to act on it. Would this make one asexual? Or is it not just another word for sexually repressed?
> 
> I took it to mean it’s to do with how one feels. Or was I mistaken?


You are correct, it is about what you feel, what attracts you. There are plenty of heterosexual and homosexual people who choose not to have sex, to be celibate. Sexuality is not a choice. Acting upon that attraction is. Furthermore, for some reason, there is this common misconception that if you are attracted to one, then you must be repulsed by the opposite. IOW, if a person who is sexually attracted to men (regardless of whatever their own gender/sex is) then they must be repulsed by the idea of sex with women. This is false. Yes there are those so repulsed, but it is not a requirement of a given orientation. So so just as a heterosexual can engage in homosexual sex, likewise, an asexual can still engage in sex with someone, they just aren't sexually attracted to them.



> Yes, I read that some people can have a penis but feel or present themselves sexually as a penguin (nothing wrong with that, more fish to them, I say). Does it mean the woman, upon meeting the penis/penguin, is attracted to penguins or to penises? Are you saying that if the woman is asexual, then she will be attracted to penguins but if she was heterosexual, she will disregard the penguin and go for the penis?
> This is all very confusing...


I agree it can be confusing, and it threw me at first as well. Even more so because I have find this to be true within me as well as having observed it in others. I have found myself sexually attracted to a number of MtF transgenders because they struck me in every way as a woman, even the ones that were pre op. But if the person struck me as male, even if they were a post-op MtF, there would be no sexual attraction. Mind you I treat people as they tell me they are, especially since some cis people can look opposite of what they are, or androgynous. Asexual people however do not feel any sexual _attraction_. Male/female, man/woman, penis or vagina. None of that causes a sexual _attraction _within them. The asexual may still have a sex drive, and it would be more likely they would choose a partner by whom they trust more than who turned them on sexually.




> I think we are saying the same thing: I was going by how one feels, not by how one acts. I don’t think a heterosexual man doing homosexual acts (against their own desire) makes one a homosexual...(I always disagreed with Mr Garrison’s “I’m not gay, I just act that way” philosophy...


I have to question what you mean by "against their own desire". There is a couple of ways to take that. One is what I suspect you mean, but I'm not sure, and that is that they engage in the (in your example) homosexual act even though there is no sexual attraction. The other way to possibly take it is that they are being forced to engage in the homosexual act against their will and consent.

But overall, yes, we agree that orientation is about the attraction not the act. Which is why an asexual person can engage in sex without having a sexual attraction. And yes, all of the orientations have has people who were of that orientation, but for one reason or another were in denial or had reason to believe they were of a different orientation.



> Now in all seriousness, I find the explanations below VERY difficult to follow. Perhaps it is the way the words are used. Everything seems to contradict one another and everything is too subjective to have any (practical) meaning. There HAS to be some form of objectivity when it comes to sexuality otherwise nothing makes sense anymore or it just doesn’t matter and maybe it would be easier to dispense with labels?


Good luck with dispensing with labels. We humans love them. But in the end, what sexually attracts us _is _very subjective. Heterosexual, homosexual, bisexual, asexual, etc, they are all in the end generalities. None of us are sexually attracted to all women or all men or everyone if bisexual. Race can play a factor. I think we all know of someone, if not someone directly, who exclusively dates one particular race not their own. Or hair color. Or any other number of things. And it is all subjective. Very little is actually objective when it comes to sexual attraction. We can objectively say whether a person has a penis or a vagina (most of the time). We can objectively say whether a person has an XX pair or an XY pair, or one of the variations. We can objectively say whether a person has an SRY gene or not, regardless if it's on the Y chromosome as usual, or on the X chromosome, as occasionally happens. We can even objectively show that all three of these happen in various combinations. But none of these can objectively determine what any given individual will be sexually attracted to, or any other number of things. So the best we can do is generalized labels.


----------



## Imperfections (Nov 26, 2020)

maquiscat said:


> The asexual may still have a sex drive, and it would be more likely they would choose a partner by whom they trust more than who turned them on sexually.


I think, if people internalised this aspect better, maybe they wouldn’t get as offended if they were sexually ‘rejected’ by their partner?

OTOH, I am still not sure how sex drive and sexual attraction can exist completely independently of each other, in your description above. Surely one drives the other, to some extent? If you have a high sex drive, it is usually ignited or directed towards something. Are you saying that it just is? Is it maybe because that person doesn’t know (or isn’t saying) what is driving it? I mean, you can’t experience hunger, but not for food, but then still eat to ‘satisfy’ the hunger? Something isn’t quite adding up. To me, being asexual also meant that one doesn’t really have a drive either. It is counterintuitive to read that it is not the case and I find it hard to get my head around that.



maquiscat said:


> I have to question what you mean by "against their own desire". There is a couple of ways to take that. One is what I suspect you mean, but I'm not sure, and that is that they engage in the (in your example) homosexual act even though there is no sexual attraction. The other way to possibly take it is that they are being forced to engage in the homosexual act against their will and consent.


I meant what you wrote earlier: if a heterosexual engaged in a homosexual act (out of boredom or curiosity, not out of sexual desire), I wouldn’t have thought it would make one a homosexual (although most people would probably disagree...).



maquiscat said:


> Good luck with dispensing with labels. We humans love them. But in the end, what sexually attracts us _is _very subjective. Heterosexual, homosexual, bisexual, asexual, etc, they are all in the end generalities. None of us are sexually attracted to all women or all men or everyone if bisexual. Race can play a factor. I think we all know of someone, if not someone directly, who exclusively dates one particular race not their own. Or hair color. Or any other number of things. And it is all subjective. Very little is actually objective when it comes to sexual attraction. We can objectively say whether a person has a penis or a vagina (most of the time). We can objectively say whether a person has an XX pair or an XY pair, or one of the variations. We can objectively say whether a person has an SRY gene or not, regardless if it's on the Y chromosome as usual, or on the X chromosome, as occasionally happens. We can even objectively show that all three of these happen in various combinations. But none of these can objectively determine what any given individual will be sexually attracted to, or any other number of things. So the best we can do is generalized labels.


The issue I have with labels is that how I label myself, should have no bearing on how the other person should feel about me. Or vice versa.
Say a mislabelled myself as a female to male transgender, but instead you still perceived me as female and were attracted to me, then who will have dibs on the label of what I’m supposed to be or what orientation you yourself are? (If you previously thought you were only attracted to male to female transgenders for example).

People often mislabel themselves and, as you say, there is a whole spectrum of grey of what one might be attracted to. Whereas labels are purely black and white.


----------



## maquiscat (Aug 20, 2019)

Imperfections said:


> I think, if people internalised this aspect better, maybe they wouldn’t get as offended if they were sexually ‘rejected’ by their partner?


I agree with you here.



> OTOH, I am still not sure how sex drive and sexual attraction can exist completely independently of each other, in your description above. Surely one drives the other, to some extent? If you have a high sex drive, it is usually ignited or directed towards something. Are you saying that it just is? Is it maybe because that person doesn’t know (or isn’t saying) what is driving it? I mean, you can’t experience hunger, but not for food, but then still eat to ‘satisfy’ the hunger? Something isn’t quite adding up. To me, being asexual also meant that one doesn’t really have a drive either. It is counterintuitive to read that it is not the case and I find it hard to get my head around that.


I agree with you, but that drive might not be a person or individual, or in another sense a physical quality of a person. For example, I get sexually turned on by Shibari and other rope work, regardless of the sex of the rope bunny, even though I am straight. Might come from being a switch. Regardless, in that case it is the play that is sexually turning me on, not the people themselves. Even with no kink present, the person might be sexually excited by the idea of the sex itself instead of any individual partner.



> I meant what you wrote earlier: if a heterosexual engaged in a homosexual act (out of boredom or curiosity, not out of sexual desire), I wouldn’t have thought it would make one a homosexual (although most people would probably disagree...).


Yeah, I'd say we're on the same page here then.



> The issue I have with labels is that how I label myself, should have no bearing on how the other person should feel about me. Or vice versa.
> Say a mislabelled myself as a female to male transgender, but instead you still perceived me as female and were attracted to me, then who will have dibs on the label of what I’m supposed to be or what orientation you yourself are? (If you previously thought you were only attracted to male to female transgenders for example).
> 
> People often mislabel themselves and, as you say, there is a whole spectrum of grey of what one might be attracted to. Whereas labels are purely black and white.


The fact that I perceived you as female, has no bearing on your personal identity, and conversely your identity has no bearing on my perception of you, especially as far as my sexual attraction, nor on the labels we respectively use. Even if we started dating, I would use your male identity for pronouns and such. I would make sure that you knew why it seemed that I was outside my stated norm with you, because that honesty would be a better foundation for our relationship than hiding the fact that I still perceive you as female. Sadly some people are hung up on what these labels mean to them with no respect to what they mean to others. As a society, setting labels to be an overall "somewhere in this area" thing is not bad. We just have to remember to keep it general and then set the details to each individual. Even as a cis-male, I would not find it offensive if someone was sexually attracted to me if they perceived me as female. As long as they are honest about it, as well as respected my personal pronouns.


----------



## happyhusband0005 (May 4, 2018)

maquiscat said:


> We then need to come up with a common meaning, at least for the context of this discussion, as to what "rare" means. At .1% we're still at over 3 million in the US and 78 million world wide. Again not insignificant numbers. So what is it that you are considering rare?


330,000,000x.1%=330,000 not 3 million in the US. Still a large number of asexual individuals though.


----------



## maquiscat (Aug 20, 2019)

happyhusband0005 said:


> 330,000,000x.1%=330,000 not 3 million in the US. Still a large number of asexual individuals though.


Bloody head math. For my second post it's error carried forward though. I made the mistake when I said 33 million for 1%. I then based my 3 million on the previous figure of 33 million. Thank you for catching that.


----------



## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

I've seen asexuality written up in psychiatric journals for many decades. I do think it's very rare, but I think it's genuine. 

But I think you're right in that nearly everything is on a scale, so there are going to be people who are nearly completely asexual but not quite. 

I don't understand it and haven't studied it, but I think for it to happen it would have to be one of those perfect storm kinds of things involving heredity and hormones, socialization, and probably other factors that are variable per person such as anxiety or chemical imbalance, OCD.


----------

