# my two cents on trust in Marriage and affairs



## blackclover3 (Apr 23, 2021)

Unfortunately I had to work with a scum bag who can seduce any married woman to have an affair with him. he targets married women, preferably, with kids. he is considered handsome, mid 30s and has personality that charms both men and women.

one of his victims (not sure if I should call them victims) seducing/sleeping with a female married doctor and recording it. he met her in a bar with her girl friends after work then got to know her and pretended to be interested in her religion and would like to convert and needed help, within two months it became physical.

her husband found out and his wife convinced him it was only a kiss and nothing more so they both started reconciliation then the scum bag sent that video to him few months later.

this is only one case of many cases.

I'm shocked to see men/Women are ok with their spouses to go clubbing or visit bars (girls/boys night out) without being with them. and even some feels guilty to check their spouses phone.

Call me backward - I will never let my spouse do any of the above, or even have text, calls, meet up after work. I don't mind my wife checking my phone and go through my messages.


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## jonty30 (Oct 23, 2021)

blackclover3 said:


> Unfortunately I had to work with a scum bag who can seduce any married woman to have an affair with him. he targets married women, preferably, with kids. he is considered handsome, mid 30s and has personality that charms both men and women.
> 
> one of his victims (not sure if I should call them victims) seducing/sleeping with a female married doctor and recording it. he met her in a bar with her girl friends after work then got to know her and pretended to be interested in her religion and would like to convert and needed help, within two months it became physical.
> 
> ...


Attention is like a drug to a woman. If their husbands paid them more attention, more women would probably resist affairs more. 
One of the number one complaints from women on TAM are husbands that ignore their wives. Too many husbands think the wedding band seals the deal. 
I'm not relieving the women of any responsibility, but men are told to care for the wives.


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## blackclover3 (Apr 23, 2021)

jonty30 said:


> Attention is like a drug to a woman. If their husbands paid them more attention, more women would probably resist affairs more.
> One of the number one complaints from women on TAM are husbands that ignore their wives. Too many husbands think the wedding band seals the deal.
> I'm not relieving the women of any responsibility, but men are told to care for the wives.


I call that B.S, the women who cheated on their husbands with the guy I mentioned above are in a happy secure relationship and I know two of them who I'm friend with their husbands - they get all the attention they need from their spouses. 

I know many of the women who cheated on their husbands with that guy and have enough attention. in fact, the Dr lady complained because her husband pays too much attention. her husband said they have sex 4-5 times a week.


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## jonty30 (Oct 23, 2021)

blackclover3 said:


> I call that B.S, the women who cheated on their husbands with the guy I mentioned above are in a happy secure relationship and I know two of them who I'm friend with their husbands - they get all the attention they need from their spouses.
> 
> I know many of the women who cheated on their husbands with that guy and have enough attention. in fact, the Dr lady complained because her husband pays too much attention. her husband said they have sex 4-5 times a week.


That's on them, if they want to lose their marriage. They can't complain if their husband walks after being betrayed.


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## Andy1001 (Jun 29, 2016)

A lot of people cheat because they have the opportunity and they think they will get away with it. They have no intention of leaving their spouse but they love the excitement of a new person in their lives. 
It’s really just a sense of entitlement, they “deserve” to have a little fun and what their husband/wife doesn’t know won’t hurt them. Until their caught and then the excuses and rewriting of their relationship history begins.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

blackclover3 said:


> Call me backward - I will never let my spouse do any of the above, or even have text, calls, meet up after work. I don't mind my wife checking my phone and go through my messages.


My husband and I are both adults. We don't "let" the other do things, because adults don't order other adults around like children. I would never go through his phone, and he would never go through mine. There have been plenty of times when I had signal and he didn't (or vice versa) and we unlock the phone and hand it over because we don't care. Because neither of us would stay in a relationship where we didn't trust the other person.

My husband doesn't become a different man when he goes to different places. Neither do I, I am the same person at home that I am anywhere. Drinking alcohol lowers your inhibitions and damages your judgement but it does not change who you are.

If I ever got to a point where I felt I needed to check my husband's phone or was uncomfortable with him going to a bar, we would talk about the trust issue, because its not the bar or the phone that's the problem, it's the trust. If you don't trust your spouse, you shouldn't be married to them.

Besides, how exhausting, to constantly be sleuthing about checking up on someone. I'm kinda busy and that seems like a lot of work.


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

This man, the one that seduced the lady doctor, is a vile Cad.
She denied it, yet, he sent the video to humiliate her.

Such a disloyal lady.
Worse, such an ungrateful man.

The lady deserves a divorce from her husband.
The man deserves a divorce from life on Earth.


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## TJW (Mar 20, 2012)

blackclover3 said:


> scum bag who can seduce any married woman to have an affair with him


Not. Only the ones who are scum bags like him.



Andy1001 said:


> It’s really just a sense of entitlement, they “deserve” to have a little fun and what their husband/wife doesn’t know won’t hurt them.


Exactly. Amoral scum bag.



blackclover3 said:


> I don't mind my wife checking my phone and go through my messages.


Exactly again. Both partners, open books. No lies. No deceptions, no games.
Honor, respect, integrity. Like the Book says, avoid even the appearance of evil.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

Assuming he did not roofie them, you need to keep in mind that they went to bed with him because they were attracted to him, desired him and made the conscious choice to go to bed with him. 

Virtually every female on the face of the earth has opportunity to cheat whenever and however she so chooses. That choice resides in her heart and in her character. 

All a husband can really do is to do his best to be loving and supportive and do his due diligence to be a good husband, lover and companion. Beyond that, her sexuality and fidelity are on her. 

Throughout the history of mankind, people have tried to lock up their wives, apply chastity belts and deny them education and employment in effort to keep them out of other men’s beds. 

Even today there are cultures that keep them virtual prisoners in the own homes, cover them from head to toe in bedsheets and can even set them on fire or kill them with impunity if they stray..... and yet adultery still persists. 

This is because infidelity is not an issue of lack of proper supervision like a child. BIt rather an issue of the heart and character of the individual.


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## jonty30 (Oct 23, 2021)

oldshirt said:


> Assuming he did not roofie them, you need to keep in mind that they went to bed with him because they were attracted to him, desired him and made the conscious choice to go to bed with him.
> 
> Virtually every female on the face of the earth has opportunity to cheat whenever and however she so chooses. That choice resides in her heart and in her character.
> 
> ...


Men can end the relationship immediately, if they even suspect infidelity.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

jonty30 said:


> Men can end the relationship immediately, if they even suspect infidelity.


Yes. 

Men can only control what they do. 

They have tried for millennia to control women’s sexualities but that simply does not work.

Men can only control under what circumstances they will remain in a relationship/marriage.


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## TJW (Mar 20, 2012)

"Attention", "helping out around the house", "never home", "doesn't meet my needs", is not a "spiritual leader" (whatever that means to the one using the term), et cetera ad nauseum ... are all ways of self-justifying behavior, which in reality, is borne of plainly sinful lust, and in truth and in reality, has NOTHING WHATSOEVER to do with the actions of the betrayed spouse.

The behavior comes from constant mind-rehearsal, pornographic books such as romance novels, tv shows and movies which glorify the behavior, and a sheer lack of respect in which "I am the most important person. What I want, what I lust after, is perfectly permissible for me regardless of how it hurts others. I don't care if my husband/wife is hurt, I want it, and I am going to have it. I don't care how it hurts my children, I don't even care what God says. My genitals are burning and itching, and I'm getting them scratched, to hell with the ramifications of it."


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## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

blackclover3 said:


> I call that B.S, the women who cheated on their husbands with the guy I mentioned above are in a happy secure relationship and I know two of them who I'm friend with their husbands - they get all the attention they need from their spouses.
> 
> I know many of the women who cheated on their husbands with that guy and have enough attention. in fact, the Dr lady complained because her husband pays too much attention. her husband said they have sex 4-5 times a week.


Sex does not equal attention!

My husband has been 'neglectful' for the majority of our marriage and I never strayed once, and not for lack of opportunity. It is all about character and boundaries.


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## manowar (Oct 3, 2020)

blackclover3 said:


> I call that B.S, the women who cheated on their husbands with the guy I mentioned above are in a happy secure relationship and I know two of them who I'm friend with their husbands - they *get all the attention* they need from their spouses.


Don Juan understands the nature of arousal. There's a difference. A big difference. Husbands are safe family members. Tamed and predictable. DJ is handsome, mysterious and untamed. Just because they have a ring on their finger doesn't mean they are locked down. That is man's mistake in believing such myths as told to them by Father O'Malley.

These ladies you mention are willing to take the risk because they don't want to miss out. It's not every day that DJ comes along. Another may never come along. There's your answer. 

The man you mention has countless rejections as well.


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## manowar (Oct 3, 2020)

blackclover3 said:


> he* targets* married women, preferably, with kids.


Because they are not seeking commitment. They have that with the guy at home who is mowing the lawn. "It's only sex. He meant nothing to me" is a likely response from milady if apprehended. Easy targets for someone with the looks, charm, motives, and skill to pull it off. 

There's a book called The Art Of Seduction by ? Greene I think (can't remember). The man you speak of sounds like "The Rake" -- a highly desired male archetype.


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## jonty30 (Oct 23, 2021)

manowar said:


> Because they are not seeking commitment. They have that with the guy at home who is mowing the lawn. "It's only sex. He meant nothing to me" is a likely response from milady if apprehended. Easy targets for someone with the looks, charm, motives, and skill to pull it off.
> 
> There's a book called The Art Of Seduction by ? Greene I think (can't remember). The man you speak of sounds like "The Rake" -- a highly desired male archetype.


It sounds like a good book to read, just out of principle

*Christmas is coming.


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## Landofblue (May 28, 2019)

While I might go to a restaurant with guy friends and my wife might do the same with gal friends, I do agree with you, I’d not go to a bar without my wife nor she without me. 

And that is especially true about a dance club. I don’t understand married men or women going to a dance club without their spouse.


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## MarmiteC (Jun 28, 2021)

blackclover3 said:


> I'm shocked to see men/Women are ok with their spouses to go clubbing or visit bars (girls/boys night out) without being with them. and even some feels guilty to check their spouses phone.
> 
> Call me backward - I will never let my spouse do any of the above, or even have text, calls, meet up after work. I don't mind my wife checking my phone and go through my messages.


I would struggle with this. I can, on occasion, take enjoyment from a night out with the girls. I don't go to dance clubs anyway, not my thing, but if I wanted to visit a bar with girl friends and any partner was unhappy with this, I'd say we're incompatible. I would also encourage my partner to have friends outside the marriage also. I think you need both for a healthy relationship. 

However, these times should be less frequent than enjoying the same things with my partner. 

I have zero issues with my phone being open to being read and expect the same from a partner.


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## TJW (Mar 20, 2012)

manowar said:


> Because they are not seeking commitment. They have that with the guy at home who is mowing the lawn.


Exactly. They are USERS. They use "DJ" for a cheap thrill. They use husband for a pack mule to carry them through life financially and be a built-in babysitter. The world is their enchilada.

And, our wonderful "laws" will never hold "DJ" to accountability, nor will they ever release husband from commitment. "DJ" will continue, and Mrs. **** will continue.




aine said:


> It is all about character and boundaries.


Correct. Exactly. Cheaters have low character and no boundaries. They are "entitled" to "have fun", "have what they want". To hell with others.


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## jonty30 (Oct 23, 2021)

TJW said:


> Exactly. They are USERS. They use "DJ" for a cheap thrill. They use husband for a pack mule to carry them through life financially and be a built-in babysitter. The world is their enchilada.
> 
> And, our wonderful "laws" will never hold "DJ" to accountability, nor will they ever release husband from commitment. "DJ" will continue, and Mrs. **** will continue.


Wait until she has cancer or aids. Then we'd see the beta husband not be there for her.


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## BigDaddyNY (May 19, 2021)

I somewhat agree with @blackclover3 , maybe not quite as hardline. 

I don't go randomly snooping through my wife's phone because I think she is up to something. Because I don't think she is up to something. However, we both have open access to each other's phone and we often use each other's phone. What you should be concerned with is when your spouse is protective of their phone. There should be nothing to hide. 

Going out "clubbing" has never been something my wife has done, probably because we have been married since before we were really old enough to go clubbing. To me clubbing is for 20 something singles, not married men and women. My wife does occasionally go out for a drink or diner with girlfriends/female coworkers. I wouldn't care if there were male coworkers if it was a group setting. Now, going out and getting drunk on the regular, even with just the "girls" is not acceptable. 

I do agree that married people should not be having regular personal conversations with people of the opposite sex via text, phone, messaging, etc. unless it has to do with something involving the married couple. As in making plans for diner or some other get together. Honestly I think it is a good idea to limit personal conversation with both sex after work hours. It is taking time away from each other. I'm not talking about a quick text or two, but when one spouse is spending hours talking to a friend on their phone while the other spouse is present you are eating into "us" time. 

I don't do/believe these things because I don't trust my wife. I actually trust that she would immediately rebuke any advance made on here. I just think these actions are not appropriate behavior for someone that is married. I don't want her/us to have to deal with what can happen in these high risk scenarios. I also don't think a happily married person wants to do these things.


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## Lostinthought61 (Nov 5, 2013)

blackclover3 said:


> I call that B.S, the women who cheated on their husbands with the guy I mentioned above are in a happy secure relationship and I know two of them who I'm friend with their husbands - they get all the attention they need from their spouses.
> 
> I know many of the women who cheated on their husbands with that guy and have enough attention. in fact, the Dr lady complained because her husband pays too much attention. her husband said they have sex 4-5 times a week.


curious are they still together ? and if so how did he get over it ?


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## blackclover3 (Apr 23, 2021)

Lostinthought61 said:


> curious are they still together ? and if so how did he get over it ?


no they are not - the husband kicked her out and sent the video to her family, mutual and none mutual friends. like with any other story you read here, she portraited her husband as insecure husband, she made him look like he needs mental help. keep in mind, they both come originally from the same country, religion and culture that are very conservative. her dad kicked her out and asked his wife not to talk to his daughter or he will leave the marriage as well. her dad kept apologizing to her husband.


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

aine said:


> I never strayed once, and not for lack of opportunity.


The difference between stray too and stay true, is that "r".

"R" your loyal or "R" you a cheat?


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## BruceBanner (May 6, 2018)

jonty30 said:


> Attention is like a drug to a woman. If their husbands paid them more attention, more women would probably resist affairs more.


This bull. "Honey I was lonely." No one wants to hear that **** about how lonely you think you were.



SunCMars said:


> She denied it, yet, he sent the video to humiliate her.


Haha. No he sent the video to humiliate the husband and stroke his own ego.


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## moon7 (May 5, 2013)

blackclover3 said:


> Unfortunately I had to work with a scum bag who can seduce any married woman to have an affair with him. he targets married women, preferably, with kids. he is considered handsome, mid 30s and has personality that charms both men and women.
> 
> one of his victims (not sure if I should call them victims) seducing/sleeping with a female married doctor and recording it. he met her in a bar with her girl friends after work then got to know her and pretended to be interested in her religion and would like to convert and needed help, within two months it became physical.
> 
> ...


True


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## UpsideDownWorld11 (Feb 14, 2018)

blackclover3 said:


> Unfortunately I had to work with a scum bag who can seduce any married woman to have an affair with him. he targets married women, preferably, with kids. he is considered handsome, mid 30s and has personality that charms both men and women.
> 
> one of his victims (not sure if I should call them victims) seducing/sleeping with a female married doctor and recording it. he met her in a bar with her girl friends after work then got to know her and pretended to be interested in her religion and would like to convert and needed help, within two months it became physical.
> 
> ...


To me the real scumbags are the wives in this case not the seducer. I know what you are saying about checking on your spouse or forbidding certain types of activities, but honestly if your wife wants to do those things, you are always going to be a step behind. The best you can do is choose wisely. If my wife wanted to go to a nightclub without me, I'd pack her bag. Been through that **** once, not gonna happen again.


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## DLC (Sep 19, 2021)

I am not a fan of “why would a spouse let or be ok with the other spouse <doing certain things>”.

To me, marriage is not a prison, and we are all adult. Anybody is free to do whatever you want. Just be prepared for the consequence.

I am married (happily or not is besides the point here 🤣), and I have no desire to head to single bar with my other male friends. That’s the end of that. My wife never told me not to go. I just choose not to go to single bar anymore.And I choose not to hang out with the guys who enjoy going to single bar. Simple as that.

I don’t buy the idea of for example “the husband let the wife do certain, that’s why she cheated.” (Husband wife interchangeable) the cheating party choose to cheat, that’s why she (or he) cheat.


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## Willnotbill (May 13, 2021)

For me trust is like a pane of glass. It's very fragile and if its broken it shatters. It can be put back together but it will still have a lot of cracks in it and it will never be as good as new.


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## JWakk (Sep 14, 2020)

jonty30 said:


> Attention is like a drug to a woman. If their husbands paid them more attention, more women would probably resist affairs more.
> One of the number one complaints from women on TAM are husbands that ignore their wives. Too many husbands think the wedding band seals the deal.
> I'm not relieving the women of any responsibility, but men are told to care for the wives.


Yes but one of the reasons for ignoring them is long hours working and then tired after that, Scumbags like him don't have any responsibilities usually or don't bother if they have so can spend the time seducing these women which in my book is all on the women for being out drinking and clubbing without the spouse.
If I met a woman those are things I would first find out without being to obvious and if she was the type who like clubbing being out with friends all the time then I would give her a pass, Not against it but it's not for me too many Red Flags there.
Once your married and especially have children your first and foremost responsibility is to family not friends, anyone who doesn't agree should stay single as they will save the rest of us a lot of heartache.


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## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

blackclover3 said:


> no they are not - the husband kicked her out and sent the video to her family, mutual and none mutual friends. like with any other story you read here, she portraited her husband as insecure husband, she made him look like he needs mental help. keep in mind, they both come originally from the same country, religion and culture that are very conservative. her dad kicked her out and asked his wife not to talk to his daughter or he will leave the marriage as well. her dad kept apologizing to her husband.


Why did he send that video to her husband? Why did he want to destroy her life like that? Just for the fun of it??


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## pastasauce79 (Mar 21, 2018)

oldshirt said:


> Even today there are cultures that keep them virtual prisoners in the own homes, cover them from head to toe in bedsheets and can even set them on fire or kill them with impunity if they stray..... and yet adultery still persists.


You have to remember in those cultures women have no voice, no power and most of them have been forced to marry someone their family chose.

If infidelity happened, it's because they chose to cheat with someone they like or fell in love with; something they are forbidden to do. 

I don't think we can compare what they go through to what we live in our western society.


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## pastasauce79 (Mar 21, 2018)

blackclover3 said:


> I'm shocked to see men/Women are ok with their spouses to go clubbing or visit bars (girls/boys night out) without being with them. and even some feels guilty to check their spouses phone.
> 
> Call me backward - I will never let my spouse do any of the above, or even have text, calls, meet up after work. I don't mind my wife checking my phone and go through my messages.


That's your preference and that's fine, but I can't be married to someone with that mentality. I can't be on a leash. 

My husband and I met at a live music venue. We both enjoyed going clubbing and bar hopping at one point, even after getting married. 

He doesn't like to dance latin music, so I always have had my group of female friends to go out with and enjoy a salsa night once in a while. 

I don't like heavy metal but my husband likes it. He has his group of friends to go to heavy metal concerts and music festivals with. 

We both have our individual lives. I want him to have a life outside our marriage. I want him to enjoy things and places he likes. I can use his phone, he can use mine. We share everything. He tells me about the people he meets at those festivals, of course there's temptation all around them, and in reality, if he wanted to cheat, he can do it anytime, anywhere! 

I'm really not threatened by him going out. 

At the beginning of our marriage, my husband showed up unannounced to this Latin dance club I was at. He blended in with the crowd to check on me. I was doing my usual thing, dancing mostly with my female friends and dancing with a male partner if I had the chance. I was having a good time but for some reason I felt someone was watching me. After a while he walked towards me and I saw him. He was just smiling and started dancing with me. He was obviously making sure I wasn't cheating on him. He never did that again, I guess he needed proof I was doing what I told him I was going to do. I understand he needed to confirm I was loyal to him, and this is why he encourages me to go out. He knows he has nothing to worry about. And I feel the same towards him. 

Every marriage is different. It depends how committed you are to the marriage. It depends how compatible you are. I can't be married to someone who is going to tell me I can't go out with my friends. This is why I'm married to my husband, someone who has the same interests and opinions. We are happy giving each other space to be individual. It's not for everyone. It works for us.


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## plastow (Jan 4, 2022)

TexasMom1216 said:


> My husband and I are both adults. We don't "let" the other do things, because adults don't order other adults around like children. I would never go through his phone, and he would never go through mine. There have been plenty of times when I had signal and he didn't (or vice versa) and we unlock the phone and hand it over because we don't care. Because neither of us would stay in a relationship where we didn't trust the other person.
> 
> My husband doesn't become a different man when he goes to different places. Neither do I, I am the same person at home that I am anywhere. Drinking alcohol lowers your inhibitions and damages your judgement but it does not change who you are.
> 
> ...


thats very clear and your very happy with that but its not like that for cheaters families .just remember cheaters partners think as you do until its different.


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## ccpowerslave (Nov 21, 2020)

pastasauce79 said:


> He doesn't like to dance latin music, so I always have had my group of female friends to go out with and enjoy a salsa night once in a while.
> 
> I don't like heavy metal but my husband likes it. He has his group of friends to go to heavy metal concerts and music festivals with.


My wife and I are similar but we do have some crossover. My wife won’t go to all thrash or death metal shows so I will go with buddies.

I will not go to boy bands or “singer songwriter” stuff so she goes out with friends.

It’s a win-win as we don’t have to see shows we don’t like, or in her case get slammed around by fat sweaty guys.


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## JWakk (Sep 14, 2020)

BigDaddyNY said:


> I somewhat agree with @blackclover3 , maybe not quite as hardline.
> 
> I don't go randomly snooping through my wife's phone because I think she is up to something. Because I don't think she is up to something. However, we both have open access to each other's phone and we often use each other's phone. What you should be concerned with is when your spouse is protective of their phone. There should be nothing to hide.
> 
> ...


What you have always to be aware of though is men who are friends with married women mostly always have more in mind, They are just waiting to catch her at a low emotional moment say after a disagreement at home and they swoop in like the predators they are.
Once an affair starts it is very hard to stop it because the excitement, Thrill and belief that the guy gets them better than the husband does also the sex is different and sends the dopamine levels sky high so they think they are suddenly in love.
They don't think that maybe this other person may not be so nice if he has to see them at their worst when they are sick and struggling. Where the husband has seen all this and has decided he still wants to be with this woman.
Women are far to prone to act on emotions of the moment without rationalisation of the consequences. 
As the saying goes The Grass Always Looks Greener on The Other Side Of The Fence, Until you cross over and realise their is actually very little grass there.


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