# How To Fix My Marriage



## Viper1728

Hi Everyone,

First time poster, been reading for quite some time. So first some background. My wife and I have been together for 16 years, married almost 9 years. We were together as teenagers and have stayed together for quite some time. We have two boys, 2 and 8 together who we both love dearly. Our relationship has always been somewhat rocky and we’ve never communicated the best. I struggled with addiction for our entire time together, but kept it a secret for the first 4 years of our relationship. She found out, I decided to work on it, but still struggled with drinking until about a year ago when I stopped completely. As you can imagine, she heard the promises to stop many times over the years. This time is truly different. I’ve been completely sober for over a year and honestly feel great. I have no desire to use again and am completely enjoying the new me. Besides the obvious changes with the drinking, I’ve found a new love for my wife that I never truly experienced before. It’s difficult to describe, but it feels selfless, like all I want in the world is for her to truly be happy and content. I can go on and on about my feelings, but that’s not really the issue. 

My wife is obviously ecstatic about stopping the drinking and it’s taken her a long time to believe the change is real. She says she now believe that and trusts me, but she is still completely shut off emotionally. She’s built so many walls due to me not being the best husband and truly being there for her that she’s unable to break them down. She says she loves me and wants this to work, but it’s difficult when she doesn’t seem to be trying. She never tells me she loves me or how she feels, she doesn’t ever want to talk about the relationship, and she is just not at all affectionate towards me. We go through phases where she allows me to be affectionate when I instigate, but it is never something she starts. Even something as simple as a hug or a kiss always has to be initiated by me. I’ve spoken to her about how this bothers me and how I just want to build a better relationship with her, but she’s unreceptive. I’ve asked to go to marriage counseling so we can learn to communicate better, but she isn’t willing to do this. I help around the house all the time, help with the kids, am a great provider, and I’m very loving. She’s even stated it may be too much at times. She has said that what I’m doing isn’t wrong, she just isn’t at the same place I am and doesn’t feel the same way. She also doesn’t have the same belief as I do that we can build a relationship stronger than we’ve ever had before. I’m 110% commutes to this relationship and I want more than anything to make it better than ever. I just need her to open up and work towards it with me. Her response is always that she dealt with this for a decade and a year isn’t enough to change anything. Do you have any advice on what I can try other than try to continue to be patient and give this relationship everything I can? It’s honestly killing me feeling like this relationship is one sided and I’m the only one working to make it better. 

Thank you for any advice anyone has. I’ve owned my mistakes and am willing to live with them, but I want her to truly be happy and in the right kind of relationship for her. She’s an amazing woman and mother and deserves all the happiness in the world.


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## Laurentium

Congratulations on a year sober!



Viper1728 said:


> I help around the house all the time, help with the kids, am a great provider, and I’m very loving.* She’s even stated it may be too much at times.*


Listen when she says this. You may need to back off.


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## EleGirl

I have some questions that will help to help you. Once you post the answers, I'll post more.

How many hours a week do the two of you spend doing date-like things (quality time), just the two of you with no one else?

What sort of things do you two do in this quality time.


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## wilson

I think two issues are being combined:

1. She doesn't like being affectionate with you
2. You used to be an addict

I think these are independent issues. Lack of affection happens in many marriages and there are an endless list of reasons from the low desire partner. In many cases, it seems that the LD partner is just pulling excuses out of a hat.

I'm tired/Overworked/Too stressed/Kids wore me out/I don't feel special/I don't feel attractive/etc/etc/

Often the higher drive person works to fix whatever that problem was, only to find a new problem is standing in the way. I get the sense that you could be clean and the perfect husband for 50 years and she still won't want to be affectionate with you. 

I think you have a standard HD-LD situation, but with this perfect excuse for her that she has walls from when you were an addict. But like with most LD spouses, there will always be a reason why those walls won't come down. I think you should work to fix the situation, but don't let her hang all the problems on your prior addiction issues. If she says she can't change because of that, then you need to realize what that means for the future of your relationship.


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## cc48kel

That's great that you got it together and are turning it around towards a better relationship. Being patient, helping with the house and kids. Talking with her. Continue doing this in a loving way. One of these days, she might surprise you! 

My marriage isn't all that great but we manage. So if he all of sudden took a turn for the better, I'm not sure how I would handle it. I would be guarded as well thinking it won't last, etc... I even have some resentment from all those years. I remember so many nights wanting him to come to bed and he wouldn't so how could I flip the switch and become the initiator... Yes, I would need counseling to heal from all that. I guess everyone is different.


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## Viper1728

wilson said:


> I think two issues are being combined:
> 
> 
> 
> 1. She doesn't like being affectionate with you
> 
> 2. You used to be an addict
> 
> 
> 
> I think these are independent issues. Lack of affection happens in many marriages and there are an endless list of reasons from the low desire partner. In many cases, it seems that the LD partner is just pulling excuses out of a hat.
> 
> 
> 
> I'm tired/Overworked/Too stressed/Kids wore me out/I don't feel special/I don't feel attractive/etc/etc/
> 
> 
> 
> Often the higher drive person works to fix whatever that problem was, only to find a new problem is standing in the way. I get the sense that you could be clean and the perfect husband for 50 years and she still won't want to be affectionate with you.
> 
> 
> 
> I think you have a standard HD-LD situation, but with this perfect excuse for her that she has walls from when you were an addict. But like with most LD spouses, there will always be a reason why those walls won't come down. I think you should work to fix the situation, but don't let her hang all the problems on your prior addiction issues. If she says she can't change because of that, then you need to realize what that means for the future of your relationship.




Thank you for responding. Honestly, your response scares me. Is there nothing I can do in that situation? Why would someone want to be married and not want a close/loving relationship?


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## Viper1728

EleGirl said:


> I have some questions that will help to help you. Once you post the answers, I'll post more.
> 
> 
> 
> How many hours a week do the two of you spend doing date-like things (quality time), just the two of you with no one else?
> 
> 
> 
> What sort of things do you two do in this quality time.




Thank you for responding. We go on a date weekly, typically to dinner and some kind of store. We talk but she never wants to talk about our relationship issues. She doesn’t see it as a big deal like I do. We also spend an hour or two together every night after the kids go to bed. Typically we sit/lay together. I try to be affectionate if she allows it, or it’s watching a show of some kind after talking for a bit. Again, no talk of the relationship and it bothers her when I bring it up.


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## m00nman

Viper1728 said:


> Hi Everyone,
> 
> First time poster, been reading for quite some time. So first some background. My wife and I have been together for 16 years, married almost 9 years. We were together as teenagers and have stayed together for quite some time. We have two boys, 2 and 8 together who we both love dearly. Our relationship has always been somewhat rocky and we’ve never communicated the best. I struggled with addiction for our entire time together, but kept it a secret for the first 4 years of our relationship. She found out, I decided to work on it, but still struggled with drinking until about a year ago when I stopped completely. As you can imagine, she heard the promises to stop many times over the years. This time is truly different. I’ve been completely sober for over a year and honestly feel great. I have no desire to use again and am completely enjoying the new me. Besides the obvious changes with the drinking, I’ve found a new love for my wife that I never truly experienced before. It’s difficult to describe, but it feels selfless, like all I want in the world is for her to truly be happy and content. I can go on and on about my feelings, but that’s not really the issue.
> 
> My wife is obviously ecstatic about stopping the drinking and it’s taken her a long time to believe the change is real. She says she now believe that and trusts me, but she is still completely shut off emotionally. *She’s built so many walls due to me not being the best husband and truly being there for her that she’s unable to break them down.* She says she loves me and wants this to work, but it’s difficult when she doesn’t seem to be trying. She never tells me she loves me or how she feels, she doesn’t ever want to talk about the relationship, and she is just not at all affectionate towards me. We go through phases where she allows me to be affectionate when I instigate, but it is never something she starts. Even something as simple as a hug or a kiss always has to be initiated by me. I’ve spoken to her about how this bothers me and how I just want to build a better relationship with her, but she’s unreceptive. *I’ve asked to go to marriage counseling so we can learn to communicate better, but she isn’t willing to do this. *I help around the house all the time, help with the kids, am a great provider, and I’m very loving. She’s even stated it may be too much at times. She has said that what I’m doing isn’t wrong, she just isn’t at the same place I am and doesn’t feel the same way. *She also doesn’t have the same belief as I do that we can build a relationship stronger than we’ve ever had before.* I’m 110% commutes to this relationship and I want more than anything to make it better than ever. I just need her to open up and work towards it with me. Her response is always that she dealt with this for a decade and a year isn’t enough to change anything. Do you have any advice on what I can try other than try to continue to be patient and give this relationship everything I can? It’s honestly killing me feeling like this relationship is one sided and I’m the only one working to make it better.
> 
> Thank you for any advice anyone has. I’ve owned my mistakes and am willing to live with them, but I want her to truly be happy and in the right kind of relationship for her. She’s an amazing woman and mother and deserves all the happiness in the world.


The bolded concerns me that she might be harboring feelings that she is not sharing with you. Granted, maybe a year is not enough time after a decade of dealing with your addiction but why hold her feelings in - or keep them away from you? Is she confiding in somebody else? If so, I hope it's a therapist or a family member because otherwise what I see is somebody who has quit but lacks the resolve to walk out. 

As for what you can do, continue working on yourself. If you cannot get your wife to come around and are feeling increasingly frustrated I'm concerned that by becoming frustrated you might be driven back to some other addiction since you are getting absolutely NOTHING positive from your wife. I'd suggest going to either a marriage counselor or at least go to IC on your own, but be honest with her that you're doing this with or without her.


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## Viper1728

cc48kel said:


> That's great that you got it together and are turning it around towards a better relationship. Being patient, helping with the house and kids. Talking with her. Continue doing this in a loving way. One of these days, she might surprise you!
> 
> 
> 
> My marriage isn't all that great but we manage. So if he all of sudden took a turn for the better, I'm not sure how I would handle it. I would be guarded as well thinking it won't last, etc... I even have some resentment from all those years. I remember so many nights wanting him to come to bed and he wouldn't so how could I flip the switch and become the initiator... Yes, I would need counseling to heal from all that. I guess everyone is different.




Thank you for responding, I hope you’re right. I’d love to go to counseling to work through this with her, or even her on her own. I wish she was willing. I went on my own to work through my issues so I could try to be better.


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## wilson

Viper1728 said:


> Thank you for responding. Honestly, your response scares me. Is there nothing I can do in that situation? Why would someone want to be married and not want a close/loving relationship?


Good question! Take a look at the thousands of threads dealing with sex issues and see that it's a very common issue. Quite often, the LD spouse is fine with just living in a platonic marriage and will push back quite hard when asked for more intimacy. 

A low intimacy marriage is not hopeless, but it does need for the LD spouse to be open and willing to change. It also needs the HD spouse to be understanding of how much change is possible. Quite often the HD spouse sabotages things because they demand sex 8 times a week and lots of other stuff in-between. But often it also fails because the LD spouse thinks a few times a year is more than enough.

For your case, it would likely be very helpful to go to some marriage counseling sessions. Likely your wife has a *lot* of pain from the prior years. Go to counseling to work through that pain first without focusing on sex at all. Tell her you want her to be able to get that burden off her chest. Once she feels safe and loved, she will be much more open to working on being more affectionate.

In summary, first go to counseling so she can deal with the prior issues and can be open to love again.


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## Viper1728

wilson said:


> Good question! Take a look at the thousands of threads dealing with sex issues and see that it's a very common issue. Quite often, the LD spouse is fine with just living in a platonic marriage and will push back quite hard when asked for more intimacy.
> 
> 
> 
> A low intimacy marriage is not hopeless, but it does need for the LD spouse to be open and willing to change. It also needs the HD spouse to be understanding of how much change is possible. Quite often the HD spouse sabotages things because they demand sex 8 times a week and lots of other stuff in-between. But often it also fails because the LD spouse thinks a few times a year is more than enough.
> 
> 
> 
> For your case, it would likely be very helpful to go to some marriage counseling sessions. Likely your wife has a *lot* of pain from the prior years. Go to counseling to work through that pain first without focusing on sex at all. Tell her you want her to be able to get that burden off her chest. Once she feels safe and loved, she will be much more open to working on being more affectionate.
> 
> 
> 
> In summary, first go to counseling so she can deal with the prior issues and can be open to love again.




I wish she would. I’ve asked her multiple times to go to no avail. I went on my own to show how serious I was, but that didn’t help either


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## Viper1728

m00nman said:


> The bolded concerns me that she might be harboring feelings that she is not sharing with you. Granted, maybe a year is not enough time after a decade of dealing with your addiction but why hold her feelings in - or keep them away from you? Is she confiding in somebody else? If so, I hope it's a therapist or a family member because otherwise what I see is somebody who has quit but lacks the resolve to walk out.
> 
> 
> 
> As for what you can do, continue working on yourself. If you cannot get your wife to come around and are feeling increasingly frustrated I'm concerned that by becoming frustrated you might be driven back to some other addiction since you are getting absolutely NOTHING positive from your wife. I'd suggest going to either a marriage counselor or at least go to IC on your own, but be honest with her that you're doing this with or without her.




Thank you for responding. I tell her and try to show her that I’m here for her, I wish she would open up. She’s a stay at home mom and is with her mother all the time, so I don’t believe she is confiding in anyone. Honestly that has crossed my mind multiple times, but I don’t think she would do that nor had the opportunity. I hope I’m right, that would destroy me


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## EleGirl

Viper1728 said:


> Thank you for responding. We go on a date weekly, typically to dinner and some kind of store. We talk but she never wants to talk about our relationship issues. She doesn’t see it as a big deal like I do. We also spend an hour or two together every night after the kids go to bed. Typically we sit/lay together. I try to be affectionate if she allows it, or it’s watching a show of some kind after talking for a bit. Again, no talk of the relationship and it bothers her when I bring it up.


You need to stop trying to talk about the relationship. Find other things to talk about. She's clearly not ready to trust you enough to talk about fixing your relationship. She does not really trust that you have changed yet. So talk about anything but your relationship. But spend as much time with her as you can talking and doing things that you both enjoy.

Get the books "Love Busters" and "His Needs, Her Needs". Read them and do the work that they suggest. Usually it's good for a couple to read the books and do the work together. But she's not there yet, so you are going to have to be the one who makes changes right now and does most of the work. 

The book explains why this is.... pay attention to what it calls the "love bank".


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## Viper1728

EleGirl said:


> You need to stop trying to talk about the relationship. Find other things to talk about. She's clearly not ready to trust you enough to talk about fixing your relationship. She does not really trust that you have changed yet. So talk about anything but your relationship. But spend as much time with her as you can talking and doing things that you both enjoy.
> 
> 
> 
> Get the books "Love Busters" and "His Needs, Her Needs". Read them and do the work that they suggest. Usually it's good for a couple to read the books and do the work together. But she's not there yet, so you are going to have to be the one who makes changes right now and does most of the work.
> 
> 
> 
> The book explains why this is.... pay attention to what it calls the "love bank".




Thank you for the advice. I rarely bring up the relationship, I just feel like discussing it might help us figure out how to move things forward. She says she trusts me with the drinking, I just don’t think she trusts me enough to open up yet. That being said, I understand that she may not be ready and need to accept that. I’ll read the books and see what help that may give. 


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## chillymorn69

Congrats on your sobriety! 

Your super man now and she might feel she can't compete.

She was codependent. Now the whole dynamics changed. Her head is spinning.


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## Viper1728

chillymorn69 said:


> Congrats on your sobriety!
> 
> 
> 
> Your super man now and she might feel she can't compete.
> 
> 
> 
> She was codependent. Now the whole dynamics changed. Her head is spinning.




Thank you for the reply. I feel like I’ve got a lot of mistakes to make up for and I honestly just feel like I want to be the best husband I can be. I’ve got a long way to go in my opinion. 

I agree this is very new for her and she’s scared to believe it. Just not sure where to go from here.


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## chillymorn69

Viper1728 said:


> Thank you for the reply. I feel like I’ve got a lot of mistakes to make up for and I honestly just feel like I want to be the best husband I can be. I’ve got a long way to go in my opinion.
> 
> I agree this is very new for her and she’s scared to believe it. Just not sure where to go from here.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Keep walking the walk and have some patience. Give it another year then have the talk! The I'm not happy talk and if you don't want to work on our marriage then I want out.

But only if you mean it. Its not a threat it has to be the reality of the situation.


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## SarcasticRed

First-congratulations! Over a year sober is something to be proud of!

The family dynamic has changed with your sobriety (I'm assuming here) for the better. But change is still change and takes some getting used to. You were teens when you got together and you were an addict from a young age-you are a different person now. Not just from the normal growing up, but by taking control of your life and sobriety. That is something that many people are unable to do. In that success, there is still change and takes an adjustment for everyone involved. 

Depending on how things were before, she might be feeling mad about the past and how that was compared to now. When I got help for some mental illness, my husband and I both had to work through the regret of "what if" and moving on from the past hurt. It took some time and some therapy to adjust, even though the changes were all positive and for the better. A lot of old hurts came up. 

What were things like before the past year? How severe was the situation (For example, any financial or legal trouble? Yelling/fighting in the house? A different split of responsibilities?) What sparked this change in you? 

Give it time. Do counseling for you. Keep an open invitation for her to join in on your session or to see a counselor together. Back off a bit and give her space if she says it is too much. It sounds like you are very committed to making this work.


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## SunnyT

Maybe you don't know....

how hard it is to live with an alcoholic, or an addict, or even someone who doesn't seem to care much about you.


Understandable. But she probably "has no faith in you".


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## Viper1728

SarcasticRed said:


> First-congratulations! Over a year sober is something to be proud of!
> 
> 
> 
> The family dynamic has changed with your sobriety (I'm assuming here) for the better. But change is still change and takes some getting used to. You were teens when you got together and you were an addict from a young age-you are a different person now. Not just from the normal growing up, but by taking control of your life and sobriety. That is something that many people are unable to do. In that success, there is still change and takes an adjustment for everyone involved.
> 
> 
> 
> Depending on how things were before, she might be feeling mad about the past and how that was compared to now. When I got help for some mental illness, my husband and I both had to work through the regret of "what if" and moving on from the past hurt. It took some time and some therapy to adjust, even though the changes were all positive and for the better. A lot of old hurts came up.
> 
> 
> 
> What were things like before the past year? How severe was the situation (For example, any financial or legal trouble? Yelling/fighting in the house? A different split of responsibilities?) What sparked this change in you?
> 
> 
> 
> Give it time. Do counseling for you. Keep an open invitation for her to join in on your session or to see a counselor together. Back off a bit and give her space if she says it is too much. It sounds like you are very committed to making this work.




Thank you for responding. I never had financial or legal issues from the drinking, always been a very good provider. I always helped around the house so, so the spit of responsibilities has stayed the same. The biggest different in dynamics is how I am with her. She says it wasn’t as bad as I make it out to be, but I feel I was always pretty disconnected, selfish, etc before I quit using. I feel like I had an extremely selfish outlook on things before and wasn’t as supportive as I should have been . Difference in dynamics is all positive I would think, but it is different. 

I am definitely very committed, I just wish I felt the same commitment from her and the willingness to get help working through it.

Thank you again for your advice and thoughts.



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## Married but Happy

Viper1728 said:


> I am definitely very committed, I just wish I felt the same commitment from her and the willingness to get help working through it.


Keep working at it, and try to get her to discuss your relationship calmly, and find what she wants for the future.

Give it a year to improve things. She may be wary, and need time to fully accept the positive changes. Or, she may just like the security of marriage, but you - not so much. She may not be a person who likes emotional and physical closeness, in contrast to you. If you can understand each other's wants and needs, and compromise, that could work. If not, then realize that you are incompatible, and that you will never get what you want and need from her or this relationship. If that's the case after a year of trying, it will probably be time to end it and move on.


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## MJJEAN

Viper1728 said:


> My wife and I have been together for 16 years, married almost 9 years. We were together as teenagers and have stayed together for quite some time. We have two boys, 2 and 8 together who we both love dearly.





Viper1728 said:


> She’s a stay at home mom





Viper1728 said:


> Thank you for responding. I never had financial or legal issues from the drinking, always been a very good provider. I always helped around the house so, so the spit of responsibilities has stayed the same.





Viper1728 said:


> Why would someone want to be married and not want a close/loving relationship?


You've answered your own question.

You've been together since you were teenagers. You're all she's known as an adult. It's very difficult to walk away from that. Terrifying, really. 

You have kids. Many people really believe that staying in a cold marriage for the kids is a good thing. They think all that is required is both parents in the home. They don't realize the damage they do their kids by modeling a poor adult romantic relationship for them.

Having kids and running a household is a lot of work and some expense. With you there, she has help. Without you, she'd have to work full time and juggle the kids, the chores, and the finances including her share of any marital debt. If she doesn't have a degree or vocational-technical certificate and some experience, she's unlikely to be able to make the income she'd need as a divorced mother even factoring in alimony and child support.

You're familiar, you relieve some of her burdens with the house and kids, and you have entirely relieved her of financial burdens by supporting the family and allowing her to stay home. A luxury in this day and age.

I highly suspect she's staying married for the same reason so many stay married long after they should have left. Kids and money. 




Viper1728 said:


> She says she now believe that and trusts me, but she is still completely shut off emotionally.
> 
> She never tells me she loves me or how she feels, she doesn’t ever want to talk about the relationship, and she is just not at all affectionate towards me. We go through phases where she allows me to be affectionate when I instigate, but it is never something she starts. Even something as simple as a hug or a kiss always has to be initiated by me.
> 
> I’ve spoken to her about how this bothers me and how I just want to build a better relationship with her, but she’s unreceptive.
> 
> I’ve asked to go to marriage counseling so we can learn to communicate better, but she isn’t willing to do this.
> 
> I help around the house all the time, help with the kids, am a great provider, and I’m very loving. She’s even stated it may be too much at times.
> 
> She has said that what I’m doing isn’t wrong, she just isn’t at the same place I am and doesn’t feel the same way. She also doesn’t have the same belief as I do that we can build a relationship stronger than we’ve ever had before.


She might as well just come out and give you the "I love you, but I'm not in love with you." speech.

She has shown you she basically tolerates you. She allows you to be affectionate...sometimes...but does not initiate affection. She has no interest in talking about The Relationship. She has no interest in counseling. She has flat out stated she doesn't feel the same way you do and is in a different place. 

I'm getting the impression she isn't nearly as interested in a personal relationship with you so much as she is interested in practical partnership that preserves the status quo.


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## Viper1728

MJJEAN said:


> You've answered your own question.
> 
> You've been together since you were teenagers. You're all she's known as an adult. It's very difficult to walk away from that. Terrifying, really.
> 
> You have kids. Many people really believe that staying in a cold marriage for the kids is a good thing. They think all that is required is both parents in the home. They don't realize the damage they do their kids by modeling a poor adult romantic relationship for them.
> 
> Having kids and running a household is a lot of work and some expense. With you there, she has help. Without you, she'd have to work full time and juggle the kids, the chores, and the finances including her share of any marital debt. If she doesn't have a degree or vocational-technical certificate and some experience, she's unlikely to be able to make the income she'd need as a divorced mother even factoring in alimony and child support.
> 
> You're familiar, you relieve some of her burdens with the house and kids, and you have entirely relieved her of financial burdens by supporting the family and allowing her to stay home. A luxury in this day and age.
> 
> I highly suspect she's staying married for the same reason so many stay married long after they should have left. Kids and money.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> She might as well just come out and give you the "I love you, but I'm not in love with you." speech.
> 
> She has shown you she basically tolerates you. She allows you to be affectionate...sometimes...but does not initiate affection. She has no interest in talking about The Relationship. She has no interest in counseling. She has flat out stated she doesn't feel the same way you do and is in a different place.
> 
> I'm getting the impression she isn't nearly as interested in a personal relationship with you so much as she is interested in practical partnership that preserves the status quo.




I’m not going to lie and pretend that my mind hasn’t gone down that road many time. I guess I just hope that there’s more to her staying than just using me for financial reasons and because it is comfortable. Maybe I’m in denial, but I like to think our history means something.


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## Wrongpath

this is almost a replica of my situation at the moment I am feeling for you my friend


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## MJJEAN

Viper1728 said:


> I’m not going to lie and pretend that my mind hasn’t gone down that road many time. I guess I just hope that there’s more to her staying than just using me for financial reasons and because it is comfortable. Maybe I’m in denial, but I like to think our history means something.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I tend to break things down to their simplest form. I wouldn't necessarily say she's consciously using you. It's more like she knows her life and, more importantly, the kids lives would change drastically if she did leave and she has prioritized romantic love below the financial and social stability of the family unit unless/until her priorities change. The current status quo works for her.

If you want my from the gut advice, I'd say you need to seriously shake her up to get her to be willing to try. If you were to tell her her options are speak to a counselor and do the work to fix the marriage or speak to a divorce lawyer and do the work of ending the marriage I have a feeling she'd be motivated to do something. But you'd have to mean it or you'd lose credibility.


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## Viper1728

SunnyT said:


> Maybe you don't know....
> 
> 
> 
> how hard it is to live with an alcoholic, or an addict, or even someone who doesn't seem to care much about you.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Understandable. But she probably "has no faith in you".




No I have no idea what it’s like, I agree completely. I honestly don’t blame her in the least for not having faith in me. I just hope I can have the opportunity to change that.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson

Can I ask a question? As an experiment to yourself. If you had a baby sitter, and you and she went to, let's say an outdoor arts/craft show, with rows of booths/trinkets etc for sale, etc, with some booths to get lunch. Go a couple hours before lunch, walk around together, get some lunch, maybe spend an hour, go home, take a nap together (to sleep/rest. Maybe Alexa or Pandora playing real low while you both lay down together maybe 45 minutes, get up, ask her to pick up the kids or go together, then regular supper, bed. Doing this (insert some options as you see fit but don't stray from outside at some similar event, nap, etc).

Would she: hold hands with you as you walk around, share a few kisses, have a smooth day, not make a big deal about holding hands, being normal type affectionate, and not fuss at you?

*Not saying you are to be needy; it's not considered needy to have this type of day. Don't say anything to her about how you want to act or how you want her to act, just do this type of day. I'm reading that she's not rejecting you but rebuilding. It shouldn't take a year to get non-verbal feedback from the situation. Notice I didn't say "her". 
If she likes pet based events, go to that, you get t he idea. But remain affectionate with walking around holding hands and what comes natural. At this point trying to explain things away or keep saying I want to do better etc, just do (without extraneous talk) these things like it's fun and normal, and observe to yourself how it's going. You two know each other pretty well so she wants to see how you are in the present tense nowadays. Do these outdoor walking around together things without the kids the first 3/4/5 times, just be normal with her. Keep working quietly on yourself, you don't have to dwell on "see it's going good, etc" which can foster the concept you're still struggling and keeps that in the forefront. 
Each time you go out and about it's important to hold hands, be touching (appropriately in public) as you spend time in a crowd with others at these events, just having a good day, not expecting sex at the end of day, but if it happens ok, but touching whenever you can. Even if you initiate all that for now. 
It sounds like the pots still on the stove, the fire may be low for now, but it may return to a good simmer or boil, with the right ingredients added.
It's not about who initiates anything for now, just do these things without making it a big deal.

Every marriage has challenges, ebbs and flows. This doesn't have to be a deal breaker by any means. 

Will she have these good days with you? That's my question. Good luck!


----------



## Ynot

Viper1728 said:


> Thank you for responding. I never had financial or legal issues from the drinking, always been a very good provider. I always helped around the house so, so the spit of responsibilities has stayed the same. *The biggest different in dynamics is how I am with her. She says it wasn’t as bad as I make it out to be, but I feel I was always pretty disconnected, selfish, etc before I quit using. I feel like I had an extremely selfish outlook on things before and wasn’t as supportive as I should have been *. Difference in dynamics is all positive I would think, but it is different.
> 
> I am definitely very committed, I just wish I felt the same commitment from her and the willingness to get help working through it.
> 
> Thank you again for your advice and thoughts.
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Maybe the bolded part is the issue. She might have been perfectly happy with the old you. I am not suggesting you go back to being that guy, just that she may not like this new responsible sober you. It might be that she feels inadequate, it might be she was lazy, it might be that enjoyed that lifestyle. If she won't talk about the relationship though I don't know what you can do other than to just keep focusing on improving yourself. At some point you might just get fed up with living half of a life and decide to move on yourself.


----------



## Viper1728

gowithuhtred said:


> Can I ask a question? As an experiment to yourself. If you had a baby sitter, and you and she went to, let's say an outdoor arts/craft show, with rows of booths/trinkets etc for sale, etc, with some booths to get lunch. Go a couple hours before lunch, walk around together, get some lunch, maybe spend an hour, go home, take a nap together (to sleep/rest. Maybe Alexa or Pandora playing real low while you both lay down together maybe 45 minutes, get up, ask her to pick up the kids or go together, then regular supper, bed. Doing this (insert some options as you see fit but don't stray from outside at some similar event, nap, etc).
> 
> Would she: hold hands with you as you walk around, share a few kisses, have a smooth day, not make a big deal about holding hands, being normal type affectionate, and not fuss at you?
> 
> *Not saying you are to be needy; it's not considered needy to have this type of day. Don't say anything to her about how you want to act or how you want her to act, just do this type of day. I'm reading that she's not rejecting you but rebuilding. It shouldn't take a year to get non-verbal feedback from the situation. Notice I didn't say "her".
> If she likes pet based events, go to that, you get t he idea. But remain affectionate with walking around holding hands and what comes natural. At this point trying to explain things away or keep saying I want to do better etc, just do (without extraneous talk) these things like it's fun and normal, and observe to yourself how it's going. You two know each other pretty well so she wants to see how you are in the present tense nowadays. Do these outdoor walking around together things without the kids the first 3/4/5 times, just be normal with her. Keep working quietly on yourself, you don't have to dwell on "see it's going good, etc" which can foster the concept you're still struggling and keeps that in the forefront.
> Each time you go out and about it's important to hold hands, be touching (appropriately in public) as you spend time in a crowd with others at these events, just having a good day, not expecting sex at the end of day, but if it happens ok, but touching whenever you can. Even if you initiate all that for now.
> It sounds like the pots still on the stove, the fire may be low for now, but it may return to a good simmer or boil, with the right ingredients added.
> It's not about who initiates anything for now, just do these things without making it a big deal.
> 
> Every marriage has challenges, ebbs and flows. This doesn't have to be a deal breaker by any means.
> 
> Will she have these good days with you? That's my question. Good luck!




Thank you for responding. I think the answer is yes she would do that at this stage without any issues. That being said, there’s still a distinct feeling of disconnection. Not entirely sure how to describe it, she’s just not affectionate in return. I know her way pretty well after all these years and it just feels one sided. Not sure if that makes any sense or not


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## Viper1728

Ynot said:


> Maybe the bolded part is the issue. She might have been perfectly happy with the old you. I am not suggesting you go back to being that guy, just that she may not like this new responsible sober you. It might be that she feels inadequate, it might be she was lazy, it might be that enjoyed that lifestyle. If she won't talk about the relationship though I don't know what you can do other than to just keep focusing on improving yourself. At some point you might just get fed up with living half of a life and decide to move on yourself.




She’s stated she wasn’t happy before, she just saw the drinking as the main problem. Any other issues were just extra in comparison to the big one. 


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## Ragnar Ragnasson

PS, full disclosure regarding my (couple) above post, I've been happily married almost 35 years.
An add; if you want it to work, try letting yourself move forward. As you move forward don't dwell daily on flogging yourself. That gets old for both of you. Forgive yourself. It doesn't mean forget it, or not to have learned from it, but it does mean not to let it define you forever, get mired down, letting it stop your forward progress as a couple.


----------



## Ragnar Ragnasson

You're doing the right things.
The important thing is, even if she feels disconnected now, with the 3/4/5 or so normal days, there can be a positive change. Unless she does other negative things to sabotage healing (showing you a deeper problem) keep having "good" days. Don't mention the problem again unless she asks something and even then keep the answers very short. But obviously pleasant, like it's just another topic. She'll appreciate short answers. 

Let it go. The problem is in the past. There are plenty of other things to talk about, (good things) in a marriage. Keep having good days. 
Good luck.


----------



## SarcasticRed

Viper1728 said:


> She’s stated she wasn’t happy before, she just saw the drinking as the main problem. Any other issues were just extra in comparison to the big one.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


It is triage. Once the biggest issue is taken care of, the smaller issues become the bigger ones. As time goes on, she might be able to express the smaller issues and those can be dealt with as necessary. Counseling is seeming more and more important for the two of you.


----------



## Ynot

Viper1728 said:


> She’s stated she wasn’t happy before, she just saw the drinking as the main problem. Any other issues were just extra in comparison to the big one.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Ok. It was just a suggestion. But the rest of my post stands. Focus continue to focus on yourself. Either she comes along for the ride, or you need to make a decision.


----------



## StarFires

You have been an extremely selfish man. 16 years is an awful long time for your whole marriage to be so totally centered on and all about you. Even though you kept your addiction a secret the first 4 years, she still had to deal with the results and consequences of your actions.

Congratulations on your sobriety, but now that you are sober and not addicted, you are still being very selfish. Your whole marriage is still all about what you want. What you want from her. What you want her to do. How you want her to feel. How she should act for you. 

You. You. You. 

If I were her, I would be pretty sick of you by now. And totally fed up.

So maybe this isn't about your new found sobriety. Maybe selfish is just the way you are. You're sober now and all of sudden want the perfect marriage and for her to again acquiesce to your will. All about you. What you want. You. You. You.

Think about her for a change. And leave her alone. If you truly love her and truly mean what you say, then leave her alone and for once BE the husband that she needs to you to be. Be that so she can see the husband you have become without constantly trying to force her to reward you for who you think you are.

Stop trying to get her to talk about making the marriage better. It's not her responsibility to recover or renew what you spent 16 years trying so hard to destroy.

Stop trying to get her to be affectionate with you. She probably can't stand the thought of you touching her. That's the way a woman can begin to feel after he shows his true self to her and after she spent so much time trying to make it work but to no avail.

Stop trying to get her to initiate intimacy. If she wanted to she would. You can't MAKE a person want to. You're just getting on her nerves trying, as usual, to get her to do what you want her to do....what you want her to do for you, unsurprisingly, because you are selfish.

Stop talking about what bothers YOU. At this point, she shouldn't even be expected to care what bothers you.

Stop thinking you should be rewarded for your efforts. You don't deserve any reward. Working on yourself and making yourself a better person is not something people expect acknowledgment and reward for. The onus of improving your marriage that you completely neglected for 16 years is entirely on you, not her.

Stop trying to get her to do anything. Just leave her alone. She doesn't need or want any more pressure from you.



Viper1728 said:


> It’s honestly killing me feeling like this relationship is one sided and I’m the only one working to make it better.
> 
> . . . but I want her to truly be happy and in the right kind of relationship for her. She’s an amazing woman and mother and deserves all the happiness in the world.


What a contradiction those statements make. Everything you do and try to do are for you and what you want her to do for you, but you claim it's for her to be in the right kind of relationship for her, and you're tired of doing all the work by yourself. Okay.

Again, if you are serious, then read the book that was suggested and do the work on your own. Yes, it's you working on the marriage by yourself, but that is what selfless instead of selfish means. That's what actually doing it for her looks like, instead of it being for you while claiming it's for her. She spent 16 years of being in this marriage by herself and doing the work by herself while you did your own thing and caused problems. Instead of expecting her to do cartwheels as you crook your finger, it is your turn to show her you mean it. It's your time to live up to your own words and give her "the right kind of relationship for her." The past year has only been more of your selfishness and constantly expecting something from her. Start today to for real be the man that she needs.

Love is selfless and unconditional. Unconditional means you don't expect her to reciprocate. Unconditional love means you do what is required and show your love to her without expecting anything in return. If you mean what you say, you will love her unconditionally for as long as it takes for her to fall back in love with you, for her to want you, and for her to want to initiate affection and intimacy with you.

If you leave her alone, she will miss you. If you do what you need to do to win her love back, she will see you.

If she doesn't, then all is lost and you succeeded at destroying her love and the marriage, and that just might come out in counseling.


----------



## Viper1728

StarFires said:


> You have been an extremely selfish man. 16 years is an awful long time for your whole marriage to be so totally centered on and all about you. Even though you kept your addiction a secret the first 4 years, she still had to deal with the results and consequences of your actions.
> 
> 
> 
> Congratulations on your sobriety, but now that you are sober and not addicted, you are still being very selfish. Your whole marriage is still all about what you want. What you want from her. What you want her to do. How you want her to feel. How she should act for you.
> 
> 
> 
> You. You. You.
> 
> 
> 
> If I were her, I would be pretty sick of you by now. And totally fed up.
> 
> 
> 
> So maybe this isn't about your new found sobriety. Maybe selfish is just the way you are. You're sober now and all of sudden want the perfect marriage and for her to again acquiesce to your will. All about you. What you want. You. You. You.
> 
> 
> 
> Think about her for a change. And leave her alone. If you truly love her and truly mean what you say, then leave her alone and for once BE the husband that she needs to you to be. Be that so she can see the husband you have become without constantly trying to force her to reward you for who you think you are.
> 
> 
> 
> Stop trying to get her to talk about making the marriage better. It's not her responsibility to recover or renew what you spent 16 years trying so hard to destroy.
> 
> 
> 
> Stop trying to get her to be affectionate with you. She probably can't stand the thought of you touching her. That's the way a woman can begin to feel after he shows his true self to her and after she spent so much time trying to make it work but to no avail.
> 
> 
> 
> Stop trying to get her to initiate intimacy. If she wanted to she would. You can't MAKE a person want to. You're just getting on her nerves trying, as usual, to get her to do what you want her to do....what you want her to do for you, unsurprisingly, because you are selfish.
> 
> 
> 
> Stop talking about what bothers YOU. At this point, she shouldn't even be expected to care what bothers you.
> 
> 
> 
> Stop thinking you should be rewarded for your efforts. You don't deserve any reward. Working on yourself and making yourself a better person is not something people expect acknowledgment and reward for. The onus of improving your marriage that you completely neglected for 16 years is entirely on you, not her.
> 
> 
> 
> Stop trying to get her to do anything. Just leave her alone. She doesn't need or want any more pressure from you.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What a contradiction those statements make. Everything you do and try to do are for you and what you want her to do for you, but you claim it's for her to be in the right kind of relationship for her, and you're tired of doing all the work by yourself. Okay.
> 
> 
> 
> Again, if you are serious, then read the book that was suggested and do the work on your own. Yes, it's you working on the marriage by yourself, but that is what selfless instead of selfish means. That's what actually doing it for her looks like, instead of it being for you while claiming it's for her. She spent 16 years of being in this marriage by herself and doing the work by herself while you did your own thing and caused problems. Instead of expecting her to do cartwheels as you crook your finger, it is your turn to show her you mean it. It's your time to live up to your own words and give her "the right kind of relationship for her." The past year has only been more of your selfishness and constantly expecting something from her. Start today to for real be the man that she needs.
> 
> 
> 
> Love is selfless and unconditional. Unconditional means you don't expect her to reciprocate. Unconditional love means you do what is required and show your love to her without expecting anything in return. If you mean what you say, you will love her unconditionally for as long as it takes for her to fall back in love with you, for her to want you, and for her to want to initiate affection and intimacy with you.
> 
> 
> 
> If you leave her alone, she will miss you. If you do what you need to do to win her love back, she will see you.
> 
> 
> 
> If she doesn't, then all is lost and you succeeded at destroying her love and the marriage, and that just might come out in counseling.




Thank you for responding, I sincerely do appreciate the honesty. I couldn’t agree more how selfish I’ve been for a long time. I’m being harder on myself about all this then I even think she is. Perhaps you’re right that after everything I don’t have a right to be upset about the situation. I know regardless of her response I have been continuing to do everything I can do to be the best I can be and will continue to do so. I have no intention of stopping. And I do truly want her to be happy, despite what that means for me and my feelings. And if the ultimate result is that I destroyed the best part of my life, then that’s on me and I own that completely. Again, appreciate your honest view of the situation.


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----------



## StarFires

I'm so glad you were receptive of my comments. I wasn't merciful on purpose. I'm also happy you plan to continue even if she doesn't respond the way you hope. That's what she needs because it will take her more time than it took you.

Something else for you to do is the 40-day love dare. You don't really have to do it for 40 consecutive days so she won't feel like it's too much, but do the dares about 2-3 days week.

http://www.shenzhoufellowship.org/main2/files/old/SpecialTopics/TheLoveDare.pdf

I wish you the best.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson

OP, don't "leave her alone" unless you want to confuse her more.


----------



## MJJEAN

Viper1728 said:


> She’s stated she wasn’t happy before, she just saw the drinking as the main problem. Any other issues were just extra in comparison to the big one.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Maybe, as @Ynot said, she was happier with the old you. Not with the drinking, obviously, but with the distance. Maybe she just isn't naturally affectionate and enjoys a relationship with a low level of personal emotional and physical interdependence. When you were drinking you weren't connected and were distant, you said. Maybe the drinking was an issue for her, but the lack of connection and distance were not.


----------



## Viper1728

gowithuhtred said:


> OP, don't "leave her alone" unless you want to confuse her more.




I don’t plan to and will continue to do what I can to try and make things better. I’m nowhere near ready to give up, just wish I had some feedback on how things were going instead of guessing.

Thanks 


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## Viper1728

MJJEAN said:


> Maybe, as @Ynot said, she was happier with the old you. Not with the drinking, obviously, but with the distance. Maybe she just isn't naturally affectionate and enjoys a relationship with a low level of personal emotional and physical interdependence. When you were drinking you weren't connected and were distant, you said. Maybe the drinking was an issue for her, but the lack of connection and distance were not.




You may be right, but I’m not sure that’s the case. She used to really want that connection so unless she’s completely changed I would think she still would. Honestly she’s always been afraid to open up and trust and my crap has only made that more difficult for her. I hope one day she is comfortable enough to truly just allow herself to be comfortable and unguarded.


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## MJJEAN

Viper1728 said:


> You may be right, but I’m not sure that’s the case. She used to really want that connection so unless she’s completely changed I would think she still would. Honestly she’s always been afraid to open up and trust and my crap has only made that more difficult for her. I hope one day she is comfortable enough to truly just allow herself to be comfortable and unguarded.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


How she used to be is irrelevant. You started dating as teenagers. At that age, the human brain is literally not developed. In our younger years, we use the amagdala, the emotional center of the brain, to process information and make decisions. By about age 25, our brains have finished developing and we process information and make decisions using the prefrontal cortex, the brains rational part that recognizes long term consequences. In other words, as a fully matured adult, she _has_ changed from when you two began and may no longer place so much stock in emotions, connection, etc.


----------



## Viper1728

MJJEAN said:


> How she used to be is irrelevant. You started dating as teenagers. At that age, the human brain is literally not developed. In our younger years, we use the amagdala, the emotional center of the brain, to process information and make decisions. By about age 25, our brains have finished developing and we process information and make decisions using the prefrontal cortex, the brains rational part that recognizes long term consequences. In other words, as a fully matured adult, she _has_ changed from when you two began and may no longer place so much stock in emotions, connection, etc.




You may be right. I sincerely hope that’s not the case, I suppose time will tell. I guess I personally struggle with the purpose of being married without that connection. Everyone is different and I get that.


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## Viper1728

StarFires said:


> I'm so glad you were receptive of my comments. I wasn't merciful on purpose. I'm also happy you plan to continue even if she doesn't respond the way you hope. That's what she needs because it will take her more time than it took you.
> 
> Something else for you to do is the 40-day love dare. You don't really have to do it for 40 consecutive days so she won't feel like it's too much, but do the dares about 2-3 days week.
> 
> http://www.shenzhoufellowship.org/main2/files/old/SpecialTopics/TheLoveDare.pdf
> 
> I wish you the best.




Thank you, I’ve read the recommended books and thankfully am already doing much of it since getting sober. So at least based on the books I’m moving in the right direction. I’ll look at this as well.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson

Viper1728 said:


> I don’t plan to and will continue to do what I can to try and make things better. I’m nowhere near ready to give up, just wish I had some feedback on how things were going instead of guessing.
> 
> Thanks


Excellent. And don't think "your just a selfish person".
Strength and goodwill to you.


----------



## jferg0212

Viper1728 said:


> Hi Everyone,
> 
> 
> 
> First time poster, been reading for quite some time. So first some background. My wife and I have been together for 16 years, married almost 9 years. We were together as teenagers and have stayed together for quite some time. We have two boys, 2 and 8 together who we both love dearly. Our relationship has always been somewhat rocky and we’ve never communicated the best. I struggled with addiction for our entire time together, but kept it a secret for the first 4 years of our relationship. She found out, I decided to work on it, but still struggled with drinking until about a year ago when I stopped completely. As you can imagine, she heard the promises to stop many times over the years. This time is truly different. I’ve been completely sober for over a year and honestly feel great. I have no desire to use again and am completely enjoying the new me. Besides the obvious changes with the drinking, I’ve found a new love for my wife that I never truly experienced before. It’s difficult to describe, but it feels selfless, like all I want in the world is for her to truly be happy and content. I can go on and on about my feelings, but that’s not really the issue.
> 
> 
> 
> My wife is obviously ecstatic about stopping the drinking and it’s taken her a long time to believe the change is real. She says she now believe that and trusts me, but she is still completely shut off emotionally. She’s built so many walls due to me not being the best husband and truly being there for her that she’s unable to break them down. She says she loves me and wants this to work, but it’s difficult when she doesn’t seem to be trying. She never tells me she loves me or how she feels, she doesn’t ever want to talk about the relationship, and she is just not at all affectionate towards me. We go through phases where she allows me to be affectionate when I instigate, but it is never something she starts. Even something as simple as a hug or a kiss always has to be initiated by me. I’ve spoken to her about how this bothers me and how I just want to build a better relationship with her, but she’s unreceptive. I’ve asked to go to marriage counseling so we can learn to communicate better, but she isn’t willing to do this. I help around the house all the time, help with the kids, am a great provider, and I’m very loving. She’s even stated it may be too much at times. She has said that what I’m doing isn’t wrong, she just isn’t at the same place I am and doesn’t feel the same way. She also doesn’t have the same belief as I do that we can build a relationship stronger than we’ve ever had before. I’m 110% commutes to this relationship and I want more than anything to make it better than ever. I just need her to open up and work towards it with me. Her response is always that she dealt with this for a decade and a year isn’t enough to change anything. Do you have any advice on what I can try other than try to continue to be patient and give this relationship everything I can? It’s honestly killing me feeling like this relationship is one sided and I’m the only one working to make it better.
> 
> 
> 
> Thank you for any advice anyone has. I’ve owned my mistakes and am willing to live with them, but I want her to truly be happy and in the right kind of relationship for her. She’s an amazing woman and mother and deserves all the happiness in the world.




I my self is currently going through a divorce. And like you, I’ve tried everything that I can possibly think of to make my wife happy and salvage what’s left of this marriage. In reading your post I’ve noticed that you didn’t mention THE LORD at all. If I was you I would leave it in GODS hands and most importantly PRAY FOR YOUR WIFE. Pray for happiness, fulfillment and anything else she may express to you that she desires. Let her know that you are praying for her as well. Maybe see if she’s interested in going to church with you. I think through prayer it will come together. I wish you good luck. 


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----------



## AKA Broken Arrow

StarFires said:


> You have been an extremely selfish man. 16 years is an awful long time for your whole marriage to be so totally centered on and all about you. Even though you kept your addiction a secret the first 4 years, she still had to deal with the results and consequences of your actions.
> 
> Congratulations on your sobriety, but now that you are sober and not addicted, you are still being very selfish. Your whole marriage is still all about what you want. What you want from her. What you want her to do. How you want her to feel. How she should act for you.
> 
> You. You. You.
> 
> If I were her, I would be pretty sick of you by now. And totally fed up.
> 
> So maybe this isn't about your new found sobriety. Maybe selfish is just the way you are. You're sober now and all of sudden want the perfect marriage and for her to again acquiesce to your will. All about you. What you want. You. You. You.
> 
> Think about her for a change. And leave her alone. If you truly love her and truly mean what you say, then leave her alone and for once BE the husband that she needs to you to be. Be that so she can see the husband you have become without constantly trying to force her to reward you for who you think you are.
> 
> Stop trying to get her to talk about making the marriage better. It's not her responsibility to recover or renew what you spent 16 years trying so hard to destroy.
> 
> Stop trying to get her to be affectionate with you. She probably can't stand the thought of you touching her. That's the way a woman can begin to feel after he shows his true self to her and after she spent so much time trying to make it work but to no avail.
> 
> Stop trying to get her to initiate intimacy. If she wanted to she would. You can't MAKE a person want to. You're just getting on her nerves trying, as usual, to get her to do what you want her to do....what you want her to do for you, unsurprisingly, because you are selfish.
> 
> Stop talking about what bothers YOU. At this point, she shouldn't even be expected to care what bothers you.
> 
> Stop thinking you should be rewarded for your efforts. You don't deserve any reward. Working on yourself and making yourself a better person is not something people expect acknowledgment and reward for. The onus of improving your marriage that you completely neglected for 16 years is entirely on you, not her.
> 
> Stop trying to get her to do anything. Just leave her alone. She doesn't need or want any more pressure from you.
> 
> 
> 
> What a contradiction those statements make. Everything you do and try to do are for you and what you want her to do for you, but you claim it's for her to be in the right kind of relationship for her, and you're tired of doing all the work by yourself. Okay.
> 
> Again, if you are serious, then read the book that was suggested and do the work on your own. Yes, it's you working on the marriage by yourself, but that is what selfless instead of selfish means. That's what actually doing it for her looks like, instead of it being for you while claiming it's for her. She spent 16 years of being in this marriage by herself and doing the work by herself while you did your own thing and caused problems. Instead of expecting her to do cartwheels as you crook your finger, it is your turn to show her you mean it. It's your time to live up to your own words and give her "the right kind of relationship for her." The past year has only been more of your selfishness and constantly expecting something from her. Start today to for real be the man that she needs.
> 
> Love is selfless and unconditional. Unconditional means you don't expect her to reciprocate. Unconditional love means you do what is required and show your love to her without expecting anything in return. If you mean what you say, you will love her unconditionally for as long as it takes for her to fall back in love with you, for her to want you, and for her to want to initiate affection and intimacy with you.
> 
> If you leave her alone, she will miss you. If you do what you need to do to win her love back, she will see you.
> 
> If she doesn't, then all is lost and you succeeded at destroying her love and the marriage, and that just might come out in counseling.


I needed this today, thank you.


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