# Affairproofing - Is it REALLY possible?



## Shadow_Nirvana (Jan 1, 2013)

We always see the aftermath of infidelity in the CWI forums. And there is generally a consensus to what the man should do after his wife has an affair. If it works, good. If it doesn't work, then tough luck, at least he'll have his self-esteem and confidence back.

Now after the affair when building the relationship back, I've seen that "Married Man Sex Life Primer" is highly recommended. Yes, it is effective. Yes, it is highly correct in the way that you need balanced alpha-beta traits and good self-boundaries to make an LTR work beatifully. 

But what I have to ask you is this - doesn't the initial attraction(although it can be prolonged by this approach) wear off eventually? And won't the cheater become restless and cheat anyway? I mean if somebody just isn't mature enough to not frigging cheat, are our actions supposed to make them grow up?

Note: I'm not talking about swingers, serial cheaters, sociopaths etc. Just a good nice cake eating girl (lol)

Note 2:I'm specifically talking about female infidelity here. I don't know what can be done in the event of male infidelity, why it happens, simply because I cannot cheat(as a male) and thus have no perspective of a male cheater.


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## Shadow_Nirvana (Jan 1, 2013)

So no thoughts whatsoever?


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

My answer is, no. I can only control my own actions. I can better prepare myself for the hurt/harm of a break up, but I cannot prevent her from wanting and pursuing an affair. It is her decision and all I can do is the best I can to be a good partner/husband.


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## Shadow_Nirvana (Jan 1, 2013)

That sucks muchly. With higher than %50 divorce and infidelity rates, marriage in USA doesn't feel very tempting, somehow.

Damn I wish I was less paranoid and more trusting


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

Paranoia is not good. You probably have learned, "Trust but verify".


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## Shadow_Nirvana (Jan 1, 2013)

Let's not call it paranoia, let's call it "there are government satellites watching me."

But on a more serious note, I got cheated on in a country where the divorce rate is %3 and cheating isn't all that common(although I think in the younger generation I am in it's a bit more than rare.) So basically, I know I'm gonna say "oh, she seems like marriage material" about a crackheaded methusing heroine addict.


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## FalconKing (Aug 8, 2012)

I see where you are coming from. Also though, it scares me that some who cheat don't really consciously decide to do so. It just starts by the eroding of boundaries. And then someone trying to prove to themselves that they can be platonic friends with someone despite an obvious sexual attraction and interest. Why do you have to do that? What does that do for you? Also, I think some people take communication and trust for granted. What I mean is, find someone who doesn't have any "off limits" subject matter. Someone who communicates effectively and just doesn't shut down or rug sweep issues. Someone who will truly be vulnerable to you. If they have deep psychological issues, I think they should take the time to face their demons and get help rather then expecting their spouse to just love those issues away. Not needy but someone who truly makes a conscious effort to consider how certain things would effect their spouse that they do. And if they are unhappy, they are self aware enough to tell you why and what it is they need. 

I think affairs happen because of unrealistic expectations, selfishness, too much independence, and people not being open and honest enough in marriages. And I think that some people are so hurt by their spouses that they learn not to give or care so much.


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## FalconKing (Aug 8, 2012)

Shadow_Nirvana said:


> Let's not call it paranoia, let's call it "there are government satellites watching me."
> 
> But on a more serious note, I got cheated on in a country where the divorce rate is %3 and cheating isn't all that common(although I think in the younger generation I am in it's a bit more than rare.) So basically, I know I'm gonna say "oh, she seems like marriage material" about a crackheaded methusing heroine addict.


If you don't mind me asking, what country were you in?


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

> But what I have to ask you is this - doesn't the initial attraction(although it can be prolonged by this approach) wear off eventually? And won't the cheater become restless and cheat anyway? I mean if somebody just isn't mature enough to not frigging cheat, are our actions supposed to make them grow up?


If a woman or man lacks this thing called "*Integrity*" to their own word or vow to another...and has not grown from their past hurts inflicted on another...now giving & espousing a willing Transparency ...so TRUST can be rebuilt brick by brick..... I don't know that what you ask is assured... it's a leap of Faith... a Risk....after all....







is always a Risk. 

I think Mature people cheat as well. It's more about Integrity to ones word and Honesty in all things. Like the words of Billy Joel's "Honesty"

At least if one is falling out of love... they will alert their lover - so it can be worked upon together.... this is honorable/ respectful even... even if it may hurt .... it doesn't crush, maime & destroy the way cheating would... betrayal is far worse.


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## FalconKing (Aug 8, 2012)

SA you should get your own radio show.


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## gbrad (Jul 20, 2010)

I have never felt the idea of affair proofing necessary. Somethings in life happen.


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

SimplyAmorous said:


> If a woman or man lacks this thing called "*Integrity*" to their own word or vow to another...and has not grown from their past hurts inflicted on another...now giving & espousing a willing Transparency ...so TRUST can be rebuilt brick by brick..... I don't know that what you ask is assured... it's a leap of Faith... a Risk....after all....
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I think this is a great response. You have addressed the fact that both parties are at fault and each of them is lacking something which is required to have a good relationship.

I just don't think any of these things "Affair-Proof" a marriage and I think I read it here in your response.

There is no person nor one relationship that is perfect and there never will be. There will always be the possibility of divorce in any marriage.


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## Shadow_Nirvana (Jan 1, 2013)

FalconKing said:


> If you don't mind me asking, what country were you in?


Turkey. Although I'm a last year med student, after this comes board exams and specialty training, while I am training to become a psychiatrist, I plan to take the USMLE and travel to USA. So, yeah I'm a bit worried about what will happen in a country where divorce and affairs run amok


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## Shadow_Nirvana (Jan 1, 2013)

gbrad said:


> I have never felt the idea of affair proofing necessary. Somethings in life happen.


Yeah, okay but there is the fact that when it happens later on in life, there goes your whole life with everything you believed in out the window.


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## Shadow_Nirvana (Jan 1, 2013)

2ntnuf said:


> There will always be the possibility of divorce in any marriage.


A legitimate divorce where there just is too much effed uppedness to deal with is one thing. Being lied to and getting cheated on then getting dumped is another


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

FalconKing said:


> SA you should get your own radio show.


I would likely be as obnoxious as a Dr Laura at times.. Some people can't stomach her... I love her.....

I think I'll keep the keyboard -it tones down my feistiness in the heat of irritation......I could see my sticking my ever opinionated mouth (meaning my foot) into my mouth on a daily basis if I had that platform.

But thank you Mr Falcon, the King.



> *2ntnuf said*: There is no person nor one relationship that is perfect and there never will be. There will always be the possibility of divorce in any marriage.


 I do believe this to be so...then there are those on the other side... who could be so hell bent on upholding vows (even when the emotional has died a tragic death)... but still trudge through in sacrificial misery to uphold them... this is no healthy answer either.


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

Shadow_Nirvana said:


> *A legitimate divorce where there just is too much effed uppedness to deal with is one thing.* Being lied to and getting cheated on then getting dumped is another


I don't understand this, but that's okay.


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## Shadow_Nirvana (Jan 1, 2013)

2ntnuf said:


> I just don't think any of these things "Affair-Proof" a marriage and I think I read it here in your response.
> 
> There is no person nor one relationship that is perfect and there never will be. There will always be the possibility of divorce in any marriage.


I just read somewhere that a marriage's length and health isn't much related to how compatible the couple is, but related to how well they deal with incompatibilities. Basically the relationship doesn't need to be perfect, I guess.



2ntnuf said:


> I don't understand this, but that's okay.


 I meant that a legitimate divorce where there is just too much crap to deal with is okay.


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

2ntnuf said:


> I think this is a great response. You have addressed the fact that both parties are at fault and each of them is lacking something which is required to have a good relationship.
> 
> I just don't think any of these things "Affair-Proof" a marriage and I think I read it here in your response.
> 
> ...


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## FalconKing (Aug 8, 2012)

SimplyAmorous said:


> I would likely be as obnoxious as a Dr Laura at times.. Some people can't stomach her... I love her.....
> 
> I think I'll keep the keyboard -it tones down my feistiness in the heat of irritation......I could see my sticking my ever opinionated mouth (meaning my foot) into my mouth on a daily basis if I had that platform.
> 
> ...


SA don't you ever insult yourself again by comparing yourself to Dr. Laura. You have 10x the integrity that woman has. Did you know she was married when she was in college but she cheated on her husband with some guy she was working for at a radio station(who was also married)? He even had nude photos of her and posted them on the internet. Also, she always attacks the women, especially when they want to divorce their husbands. She preaches to them to be more selfless and worshiping to their husbands. As a man, that does sound pretty cool....BUT I think she is projecting her guilt onto them for the mistakes she has made in her life and what she did in her first marriage. And she is somewhat of a racist. That woman is nowhere near you in integrity. 

Thread jack over.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

Shadow_Nirvana said:


> I just read somewhere that a marriage's length and health isn't much related to how compatible the couple is, *but related to how well they deal with incompatibilities.* Basically the relationship doesn't need to be perfect, I guess.


I agree with this.... but to know yourself and your own Deal breakers BEFORE going in is very very important (cause we ALL have them)... I can say for my own self, I NEED a man who is compatible with those things very important in MY book of living and loving...

If he was too far off, if our Love Languages were backwards and I felt he was just "DOING" to please me , that is wasn't in his heart...I would grow annoyed with him... and the situation and feel something over the fence could be sweeter. Just keeping it honest. 

Never discount Compatibility. If you are Mr & Mrs Easygoing in many aspects in life...Maybe... 

IF NOT.... you better be very careful who you marry... knowing just how your dynamics work in conflict -especially. Communication & resolving issues is everything. 

Me & mine dated 8 long yrs before we married, so we pretty much knew each other like the back of our hands. He has flaws and I have flaws but for who we are.. his flaws hardly bother me, and amazingly...mine don't seem to ruffle too many feathers on him either (except some of my finer PMS moments in the past).


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

Shadow_Nirvana said:


> I just read somewhere that a marriage's length and health isn't much related to how compatible the couple is, but related to how well they deal with incompatibilities. Basically the relationship doesn't need to be perfect, I guess.
> 
> Yes and I agree. It's still not affair proof. There is always a chance albeit much less the better the couple is able to handle incompatiblities. You are still not accounting for misinformation, chemical changes in the brain due to hormones and such. These can be overwhelming and distort rational thinking. There are examples everywhere on TAM.
> 
> ...


They are all legitimate divorces, every one of them. Your reasons for a legitimate divorce are your opinion. My reasons are my opinion. Opinions are neither right nor wrong. Everyone has different levels of what is tolerable or workable/fixable. These examples may also be found here on TAM.


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

SimplyAmorous said:


> I agree with this.... but to know yourself and your own Deal breakers BEFORE going in is very very important (cause we ALL have them)... I can say for my own self, I NEED a man who is compatible with those things very important in MY book of living and loving...
> 
> *If he was too far off, if our Love Languages were backwards and I felt he was just "DOING" to please me , that is wasn't in his heart...I would grow annoyed with him... and the situation and feel something over the fence could be sweeter. * Just keeping it honest.
> 
> ...


I agree with this, but what you are not considering is that there is always a reason to look across the fence. In reality, we all do it every day. Think about it. Be hones with yourself. Is there not an area where you haven't looked at something and said, even for a moment, that looks nice(I wish...) and then thought, "No, I'm not going there"?


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## Thundarr (Jul 4, 2012)

Of course it's possible to minimize risk. Life is a game of odds after all. We drive safe and pay attention yet we are not safe. We are just more safe than otherwise. In marriage I think knowledge is power and respect of dangers is power.

These are some things the minimize risk.
- compatibility matters (including sexual).
- human nature matters.
- assessing character matters.
- history matters.
- self respect matters.
- boundaries matter.


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## Cosmos (May 4, 2012)

I believe fidelity is borne of loyalty, honesty and integrity. If a person is lacking in these areas, given the opportunity, cheating is always going to be a risk.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

FalconKing said:


> SA don't you ever insult yourself again by comparing yourself to Dr. Laura. You have 10x the integrity that woman has. Did you know she was married when she was in college but she cheated on her husband with some guy she was working for at a radio station(who was also married)? He even had nude photos of her and posted them on the internet. Also, she always attacks the women, especially when they want to divorce their husbands. She preaches to them to be more selfless and worshiping to their husbands. As a man, that does sound pretty cool....BUT I think she is projecting her guilt onto them for the mistakes she has made in her life and what she did in her first marriage. And she is somewhat of a racist. That woman is nowhere near you in integrity.


 Can't say I ever read anything about her personal life...Wow, you opened my eyes ! 

I just used to dig her show (but I thrive on controversy)....to me , that is almost a form of humor....I didn't always agree with her - my mouth did hang open -with some of her answers to some callers, I must admit. 

Though I do wish I had her book on the "Care & feeding of Husbands" at the beginning of our marriage.

You know I would be advocating for more wives to be "worshipping" their husbands... if they are Good genuine men treating her right - of course.


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

Thundarr said:


> Of course it's possible to minimize risk. Life is a game of odds after all. We drive safe and pay attention yet we are not safe. We are just more safe than otherwise. In marriage I think knowledge is power and respect of dangers is power.


This is what they have been disagreeing with me on. This is what I stated in my own words.

No marreage is "Affair Proof".


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

FalconKing said:


> SA don't you ever insult yourself again by comparing yourself to Dr. Laura. You have 10x the integrity that woman has. Did you know she was married when she was in college but she cheated on her husband with some guy she was working for at a radio station(who was also married)? He even had nude photos of her and posted them on the internet. Also, she always attacks the women, especially when they want to divorce their husbands. She preaches to them to be more selfless and worshiping to their husbands. As a man, that does sound pretty cool....BUT I think she is projecting her guilt onto them for the mistakes she has made in her life and what she did in her first marriage. And she is somewhat of a racist. That woman is nowhere near you in integrity.
> 
> Thread jack over.


I have to agree with this, FalconKing. At one time, I also thought she was the real deal, but I was always concerned with her attitude about how much a woman should cowtow. It is not the way to treat your wife.


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## Thundarr (Jul 4, 2012)

Cosmos said:


> I believe fidelity is borne of loyalty, honesty and integrity. If a person is lacking in these areas, given the opportunity, cheating is always going to be a risk.


I'd like to add naivity, lack of respect, arogance, entitlement to your list of character traits to get people into trouble.


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

What I see many times in myself is a desire to "believe beyond logical reason". I see that in many other posts here as well. That, in my opinion is based upon the chemicals in the brain. It is part of or a kind of "fog" akin to "the grass is greener on the other side of the fence". I think it is dangerous thinking.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Yes there is a way to affair proof a marriage. I honestly believe this. It take two strong, emotionally intelligent people.

If I ever get married again I would insist that before marriage we work through the Marriage Builder material for building a passionate and affair proofed marriage. I’d also insist on the going to one of the MB weekends for engrain the lessons into hour pea brains.

In the USA today people have few good models to follow on how to have a healthy, lasting marriage. The dynamics of marriage have changed from the old days when divorce was not acceptable and people stayed together despite abuse, the husband’s infidelities, etc. The wife is no longer ruled by her husband. Today the married couple are equal partners. This change in society and marriage has only been around for a few decades. And people just do not know how to live within this model of marriage. So we have huge divorce and infidelity rates.

I have links in my signature block to the Marriage Builder’s material. There is more on their website and of course their books are all for sale on Amazon where you can buy used ones for very little so it’s not expensive. (No I do not work for MB I just really like their approach.)

ETA: 2ntnuf is right, the above does not 100% affair proof a marriage. But I do believe that they seriously reduce the possibility of an affair.

Some people are so broken that they will cheat no matter what. It's just part of who they are.


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## Thundarr (Jul 4, 2012)

Shadow_Nirvana said:


> Let's not call it paranoia, let's call it "there are government satellites watching me."
> 
> But on a more serious note, I got cheated on in a country where the divorce rate is %3 and cheating isn't all that common(although I think in the younger generation I am in it's a bit more than rare.) So basically, I know I'm gonna say "oh, she seems like marriage material" about a crackheaded methusing heroine addict.


Yup. My first marriage crashed and burned which left me scratching me head trying to figure out WTH happened. You better believe I had a list of red flags that would send me running from some pretty good women and I did. It was more of an indictment of my own judgement than anything else and it served me well. Once bitten twice shy is common.


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

EleGirl said:


> Yes there is a way to affair proof a marriage. I honestly believe this. It take two strong, emotionally intelligent people.
> 
> If I ever get married again I would insist that before marriage we work through the Marriage Builder material for building a passionate and affair proofed marriage. I’d also insist on the going to one of the MB weekends for engrain the lessons into hour pea brains.
> 
> ...


These are some of the best examples of things you can do to reduce the possibility of an affair. They are excellent suggestions from an intelligent woman whose opinions I respect, whether she knows it or not.

The do not "Affair Proof" a marriage.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

2ntnuf said:


> I agree with this, but what you are not considering is that there is always a reason to look across the fence. In reality, we all do it every day. Think about it. Be honest with yourself. *Is there not an area where you haven't looked at something and said, even for a moment, that looks nice(I wish...) and then thought, "No, I'm not going there"?*


Yes, there has been... men who are more aggressive in Bed.. .and by coming to TAM and reading countless stories...opinions, and learning of these types..... I got an earful to what the majority of those are like - in some other areas... generally less Romantic, they want "subtle" in their women cause they get off on the "CHASE" ...both of these things would conflict with who I am & what does it for me. Gaining knowledge is very powerful...

So yeah... we may entertain a little fantasy over the fence at times....but at the end of the day... we will do our part to BRING, in any way possible, to grab the bull by the horns, and bring what we lust for in on our own marriages...to the table.... I became the aggressor... and he loved it ! Life is good. ...It's what we've been missing for too many years... When we know what we have at home is "enough" to fulfill..and we actively keep the fire burning ....this is a beautiful thing.


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

2ntnuf said:


> *I agree with this, but what you are not considering is that there is always a reason to look across the fence. * In reality, we all do it every day. Think about it. Be hones with yourself. Is there not an area where you haven't looked at something and said, even for a moment, that looks nice(I wish...) and then thought, "No, I'm not going there"?





SimplyAmorous said:


> *Yes, there has been*... men who are more aggressive in Bed.. .and by coming to TAM and reading countless stories...opinions, and learning of these types..... I got an earful to what the majority of those are like - in some other areas... generally less Romantic, they want "subtle" in their women cause they get off on the "CHASE" ...both of these things would conflict with who I am & what does it for me. Gaining knowledge is very powerful...
> 
> So yeah... we may entertain a little fantasy over the fence at times....but at the end of the day... we will do our part to BRING, in any way possible, to grab the bull by the horns, and bring what we lust for in on our own marriages...to the table.... I became the aggressor... and he loved it ! Life is good. ...It's what we've been missing for too many years... When we know what we have at home is "enough" to fulfill..and we actively keep the fire burning ....this is a beautiful thing.


Then you agree with this which I stated previously and emboldened?


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

2ntnuf said:


> These are some of the best examples of things you can do to reduce the possibility of an affair. They are excellent suggestions from an intelligent woman whose opinions I respect, whether she knows it or not.
> 
> The do not "Affair Proof" a marriage.


That last sentence, I think you meant to use "They" and not "The"

You are right that they do not 100% affair proof a marriage. But I do believe that they seriously reduce the possibility of an affair.

Some people are so broken that they will cheat no matter what. It's just part of who they are.

(And thanks for the kind words  )


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

EleGirl said:


> That last sentence, I think you meant to use "They" and not "The"
> 
> You are right that they do not 100% affair proof a marriage. But I do believe that they seriously reduce the possibility of an affair.
> 
> ...


You have helped make my point. Thank you. I don't like to label them as broken. They may find who they are looking for or what. Almost anything is possible. Most things are not probable.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

2ntnuf said:


> Then you agree with this which I stated previously and emboldened?


You said >>


> but what you are not considering is that *there is always a reason to look across the fence*


Yes, I believe many look over the fence, we entertain thoughts in a moment...some will escalate *due to what is lacking at home*.... we may admire something in a friends marriage- wish we had that ..or think her husband is so much better than mine ... My husband has told me he has never looked over the fence ....even when things were DRY, he said he was happy "We had the kids". He joked one time about the fertilizer being overloaded on this side. Ha ha 

That doesn't make one a bad person... I would also say it is foolish to say ...."Oh that could NEVER happen to me"... because many come to eat those words....when the "perfect storm" comes upon them... Even I wouldn't say it.

What I would say about myself is this...If I am going to go astray, he would know ....I am not someone who can hide how I feel, when I am with you, I am there in heart soul & lively spirt, there is no room for another....if that was slipping... I'd make an issue out of it... like a clanging gong....we'll be talking.....I am Open, I am honest, and I don't even care if I look bad.... I'll put it out there....but in the same way, I'll do whatever I can to work towards a compromise to fulfill us both, because I want that "loving feeling back" flowing between us, that is something I NEED. 

IF it became a deal breaker situation for me, I'd have to get out...I would have enough respect for a man I shared children with to not go behind his back in any way. We both agree, we wouldn't want to be anyone's "burden"... IF the love was lost...and not able to be found again...we'd have to let go.


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## Thundarr (Jul 4, 2012)

2ntnuf said:


> What I see many times in myself is a desire to "believe beyond logical reason". I see that in many other posts here as well. That, in my opinion is based upon the chemicals in the brain. It is part of or a kind of "fog" akin to "the grass is greener on the other side of the fence". I think it is dangerous thinking.


This is where I think knowing human nature and avoiding PC views is needed. For example, one way to avoid falling in love with someone outside of the marriage is to not allow the interaction to become even slightly inappropriate. We know (I think) that many women who have lost respect for their husbands are resentful. It reiterates that having boundaries, being respectable, and being respectful, also create a fog. A good fog so to speak where those chemicals tell your spouse they want to be with you.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

Here is an excellent thread on this phenomenon ...explaining this "FOG"...these hormonal chemicals that can overtake..... 










.


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

Thundarr said:


> This is where I think knowing human nature and avoiding PC views is needed. We know one way to avoid falling in love with a co-worker is to not allow the interaction to become even slightly inappropriate. We know (I think) that many women who have lost respect for their husbands can't really control the innate feelings and are resentful. It reiterates that having boundaries, being respectable, and being respectful, also create a fog. A good fog so to speak where those chemicals tell your spouse they want to be with you.


But we are not "Affair Proofing" our marriage. We are making it less likely that an affair will happen. Also, that "good fog" must clear to allow us to make the best decisions possible about whether or not to marry someone. It has been stated on here many times by much respected, knowledgeable folks.

I am agreeing with you in part as I have done with others in this thread. I am not disputing that we need the tools or that the tools are good or that they help to make a marriage less prone to affairs. What I am saying is this, no marriage is "affair proof", not even with the best of tools and the smartest folks.


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

SimplyAmorous said:


> Here is an excellent thread on this phenomenon ...explaining this "FOG"...these hormonal chemicals that can overtake.....
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Never and always are absolutes which are inherently lies. I am not calling you a liar. I believe you are one of the most honorable women on this forum and absolutely love your posts. Especially since I have tested myself with one of your tests and found myself to be a romantic like yourself with similar love languages. I do my very best to avoid those words and if I have used one of them in this thread, I am not aware of it and I hereby apologize.


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## Thundarr (Jul 4, 2012)

2ntnuf said:


> I am not disputing that we need the tools or that the tools are good or that they help to make a marriage less prone to affairs. What I am saying is this, no marriage is "affair proof", not even with the best of tools and the smartest folks.


:iagree:
You are correct that affair proof is not absolute. There's no recipe to eliminate the possibility. Just things to minimize.


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

Affairproofing - Is it REALLY possible?

My answer is, NO. The fog will lift and you will see my answer as true.


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## Shadow_Nirvana (Jan 1, 2013)

2ntnuf said:


> NO.


Hmmm, okay yeah I guess, that is true.:smthumbup:

So what about the MMSL and such to make a passionate marriage? Do the effects of passion wear off after a while?


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

2ntnuf said:


> Affairproofing - Is it REALLY possible?
> 
> My answer is, NO. The fog will lift and you will see my answer as true.





Shadow_Nirvana said:


> Hmmm, okay yeah I guess, that is true.:smthumbup:
> 
> So what about the MMSL and such to make a passionate marriage? Do the effects of passion wear off after a while?


Sorry, Shadow I can't speak about that book. Passions change. I just examine my own life to know this. Seems like about every seven to ten years my passions change. I wish you the best with your quest.


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

SimplyAmorous said:


> I guess we have a lot in common then - being the way I am, I think being single would be pure torture. I know you are divorced right now. I hope you will find someone who will be honorable and true to compliment your gifts & be compatible with your desires in life.
> 
> I am not sure what "words" you are talking about. I agree that we can only "minimize an affair" by choosing very wisely who we attach ourselves too.
> 
> ...


I certainly do not know what you are referring to here, SA. I am sure you are trying to make a point. So, rather than derailing this thread, if you want to discuss anything further, just pm me or start another thread about whatever point you are trying to make. I am more than willing to discuss your thoughts, but not here. I am leaving this thread now since I am not able to help with anything about MMSL.


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## gbrad (Jul 20, 2010)

Shadow_Nirvana said:


> Yeah, okay but there is the fact that when it happens later on in life, there goes your whole life with everything you believed in out the window.


Changes happen in life all of the time. Things in life happen for a reason. If someone has an affair, there is usually a reason. maybe afterwards the marriage can survive and get better, maybe it ends.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

2ntnuf said:


> I certainly do not know what you are referring to here, SA. I am sure you are trying to make a point. So, rather than derailing this thread, if you want to discuss anything further, just pm me or start another thread about whatever point you are trying to make. I am more than willing to discuss your thoughts, but not here. I am leaving this thread now since I am not able to help with anything about MMSL.


No important anything....just giving an example of an affair ....not that there isn't enough examples here. I know for my parents, they weren't compatible...like...at all. It didn't play out well. 

I didn't mention anything about MMSL. No important point -other than - it happens and I think it can happen to "good people" even. Others may not agree with that... but that's ok. 

I deleted my post.


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## gbrad (Jul 20, 2010)

EleGirl said:


> Yes there is a way to affair proof a marriage. I honestly believe this. It take two strong, emotionally intelligent people.
> 
> If I ever get married again I would insist that before marriage we work through the Marriage Builder material for building a passionate and affair proofed marriage. I’d also insist on the going to one of the MB weekends for engrain the lessons into hour pea brains.
> 
> ...


And if I ever get married again (still married) it will be to someone who I am with that the relationship is not that much work. That being together and enjoying one another is just easy and natural. The compatability will just work. I have seen relationships like this and that is what I hope for.


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## Thundarr (Jul 4, 2012)

gbrad said:


> Changes happen in life all of the time. Things in life happen for a reason. If someone has an affair, there is usually a reason. maybe afterwards the marriage can survive and get better, maybe it ends.


You'll likely find people in this thread who would like to have a strong healthy marriage and who think they can actually make a difference in that regard. The woe is me whatever happens happens dribble gets people nowhere.


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## gbrad (Jul 20, 2010)

Thundarr said:


> You'll likely find people in this thread who would like to have a strong healthy marriage and who think they can actually make a difference in that regard. The woe is me whatever happens happens dribble gets people nowhere.


I never said woe is me what happens happens. I am all for creating a strong and healthy marriage for those who can do that. When I said things happen in life, I didn't mean woe is me. 
Things happen in life, that doesn't mean woe, that just means you deal with it.


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## Shadow_Nirvana (Jan 1, 2013)

gbrad said:


> I never said woe is me what happens happens. I am all for creating a strong and healthy marriage for those who can do that. When I said things happen in life, I didn't mean woe is me.
> Things happen in life, that doesn't mean woe, that just means you deal with it.


Okay, yeah but we already get that, so basically you are just saying the basics of what should be and frankly it's not really helpful.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

You can't affair proof a marriage but you can try divorce-proofing which is something I neglected when I got married 

Now I stand to either lose my business or my house. And I just hope my wife doesn't fight me for my business if we ever do decide that divorce is the best option for us.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

My H and I use our version of the Marriage Builders program, and we do feel we are specifically affair proofing our marriage as much as is possible. It feels great, actually!

Their plan is simple but very complex to execute. It was so worth it to us, however.

They start by teaching you the basic premise that to have a lasting monogamous happy marriage, you need to stay romantically in love. So they give you a bunch of new ideas to work on, where you learn how and why a couple become (and stay) romantically in love. You also learn why couples fall OUT of romantic love. Then you learn what behaviors you both should do (and not do) that helps keep you romantically in love with your spouse. Mostly this has to do with fulfilling each other's emotional needs, but there is a lot more to it. I found the reading material somewhat hard to get through, but once I understood the concepts I started really flashing through it all easily.

Then you surround your marriage with strong boundaries that basically say "no other may fulfill my emotional needs".

Some of the behaviors of enforcing these boundaries are things like:

No friends of OS.

No GNO/BNO.

No hidden emails, phone numbers, other accounts.

No same sex friendships with toxic friends.

No telling anyone of the OS about marriage problems.

Those are just some examples of tight boundary enforcement. My husband and I are not 100% tight on the OS friendships and GNO/BNO. We both do have some totally safe OS friends, and we have totally safe same sex friends for GNO/BNO. But other than that, we are pretty strict in these areas.

We do not pick up "new" friends of either sex, here and there. We have a pretty tight grip on outside influence of any kind. We each have several long term friends and some acquaintances, but we aren't looking to add more friends. We do not go out and drink in bars with our friends of either sex (without each other), as it is simply not a good healthy marriage activity, we feel.

We remain deliberately focused on each other, and refuse to even acknolwedge advances of others. We treat each other with the highest regard and respect.

Because we learned the Marriage Builders concepts and plans together, we still talk about how we are deliberately protecting our boundaries, so there are no questions about it. We even "check in" once in awhile with each other by one of us looking sternly into the others' eyes and saying "you know I'm gonna check up on you if I feel I need to, right?" and the other will reply "of course, and the same for you, but I invite you to check out anything I do or say at all because I am all about you and have literally nothing to hide". Then we smooch and remark about how good it feels to know we are each doing our part to keep those boundaries shut tight.

It makes me swoon, actually...the individual acts of self-discipline involved in keeping these tight boundaries that we both have to execute really do keep the romance burning.


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## gbrad (Jul 20, 2010)

Shadow_Nirvana said:


> Okay, yeah but we already get that, so basically you are just saying the basics of what should be and frankly it's not really helpful.


Not exactly sure what you meant there. I'm saying that people shouldn't go to extra lengths to try and prevent affairs. The work and choices to affair proof shouldn't happen. If an affair is meant to happen, then it is meant to happen. Maybe its not. But you shouldn't go to lengths to prevent something that you don't even know if will happen or not. And even it does, maybe it was meant to. 
That is all I am trying to say.


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## gbrad (Jul 20, 2010)

Faithfulwife.....those are some of the reasons why those people over at MB are crazy.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

Faithful Wife said:


> They start by teaching you the basic premise that to have a lasting monogamous happy marriage,* you need to stay romantically in love.* So they give you a bunch of new ideas to work on, where you learn how and why a couple become (and stay) romantically in love. *You also learn why couples fall OUT of romantic love. * *Then you learn what behaviors you both should do (and not do) that helps keep you romantically in love with your spouse.* *Mostly this has to do with fulfilling each other's emotional needs*


I sure agree with all of this :smthumbup: Gotta keep the Romance Aflame.









Thought I'd throw some articles on this here >>








Keeping the Fire Alive in Your Marriage
















14 Ways to Keep Romance Alive 
















Little Things to Keep the Romance Alive after Marriage and Kids
















How to Keep Love Alive: 12 Principles for Nurturing Love in Your Marriage 









Before I landed on TAM, I can't recall us ever having 1 discussion on "boundaries" with the opposite sex...it's just been something written on our hearts... We've always been very close/ Best friends who jump & share all with each other.....generally where he is.... I am... .where I am, there he is ! We do near everything together...that's what makes us happy. We've joked we Enjoy "the ball & chain."









I never even cared for Girls Night Out, not my thing. He never cared to hang with the guys. So these things never needed any limit or boundary talk. Though we've done it on occasion...if we could, we'd probably bring each other! 

All of our Opposite sex friends are equally BOTH our friends, none has ever disrespected that -though we've always been careful who we befriend or allow to our house... He has never cared if I talk to them on the phone, or whatnot. We have opposite sex friends on Facebook, it's never been an issue. 

Some may feel that is too much freedom...and maybe it IS for their marriage... but it hasn't been for ours. Where I feel we shine is in a willing giving  Transparency  with each other.....it is just something that has always BEEN... it is like breathing to us... can I say this is a large part of our "Affair Proofing"... 

No matter who I talk too, or what about (If it is interesting, a little "juicy").... he gets an earful ....and it goes that way on his end as well. But yet.. we do have freedom here. He doesn't have to worry if he runs into some woman Out & about & starts a conversation with her (even if an old GF)... he can easily tell me all about it, I am not going to take his head off & think "OMG, why did you do that, are you interested in her?". This would never even enter my mind. 

So our craving for "togetherness".... Keeping the Romance Alive...lots of emotionally bonding







...& our steadfast belief in sharing ALL with each other... is what works for us. We do not believe in any secrets in Marriage.


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## Enchanted (Jan 2, 2013)

Affair proofing begins with the self. First, think about everything you love about your spouse and spend time everyday appreciating all that they are and everything they've done for you. If you do that everyday then you won't have too much need to look elsewhere. 

"If I ever go looking for my heart's desire again, I won't look any further than my own back yard. Because if it isn't there, I never really lost it to begin with." - Dorothy Gale


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