# Stay To Make This Work or Cut My Losses Now?



## alliant (Mar 3, 2014)

Hello all,

I posted here sometime ago as my wife was threating she would walk out and would do so weekly. She is constantly angry and tries her best to control everything I do. 

We eloped roughly 6 months ago and because of the ongoing threats / problems we have been having, I elected to postpone the celebrations that were due in April. The reason being she has constantly threatened to cancel it or leave or that she is separating and I finally decided that now isn't the time or place to celebrate until our problems have been resolved.

Last Sunday, before mentioning the idea to her, she already mentioned how unhappy she has been and that she wanted the celebrations cancelled / time away to sort out her feelings of which I mentioned that under the circumstances it was a great idea because I thought it was best to fix our house first before putting on an act in front of people. More so, there were limited arrangements that were prepared for this celebration.

Upon issuing an e-mail to our families that night, she had a change of heart Monday morning saying she is over being angry and that we should celebrate it. Ofcourse I had reservations wondering how can someone be so angry for so many months and then do a 180 within 12 hours . 

I stupidly agreed as the next few days were great but then elected to postpone it anyways because nobody changes just overnight. Surely enough, I sent out a similar e-mail mentioning that I need to see stability from her to ensure that her behaviour isn't temporary as she is very hot / cold on practically everything including me and that I would continue to use my positive efforts to make sure we are happy couple and that the celebrations can take place later in the year. Never once did I mention I need time / space or that this isn't working out.

As of Friday, she claimed the marriage was over and because she constantly changes her mind as to how she feels about me (at times in one day), I just said "ok". She comes into our condo about an hour later, gets ready as if she ready to go out with her friends, packs her clothes into bags, yet just stays all night in the second bedroom and finally crawls into bed with me that night going to sleep. The following morning, she claims again that we are done and that we need to figure out how to spilt up everything, etc and asked me what my plan was. I mentioned to her that I sent you my plan (detailed e-mail of which she has igored to date) as to what we need to do in order for this work but if you don't like it and want out of it, then come up with your own plan and lets figure it out. 

As usual with her hot / cold behavior, I come back a few hours later and she acts as if nothing has happened, we had a great evening and yesterday, it was a calm day. She claims that we were just "fighting" and that she is happy.

So here is my issue - I know she is playing too many games trying to get me to chase her / tell her stay, so that she has control over me and then when I give in, her attitude becomes even more negative each time and that when I have a gripe, she cant discuss a problem (or at least it appears that way) and does her best to distract me and after enough time goes by, she is up to her usual tricks. 

While I want this problem to be solved, I know for a fact she is unable to discuss problems but only talk in circles / use distractions when things are hard. So the question I have for all of you is:

1. Have you encountered a spouse with similar traits and what you did / didn't do to ensure the games stopped?

2. Did you elect to stick around to make it work or did you just decide to say enough is enough and lets move on?

Like I do with all things, I just come on straight and deal with matters but I don't believe my spouse knows how do it. She refuses counselling and is literally appears to have bi-polar type qualities when it comes to our marriage / how we deal with problems.

Your thoughts would be much appreciated.


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## Nikita2270 (Mar 22, 2014)

Let me premise what I'm about to say by first saying that I happen to be female but an extremely logical and low-drama one. In fact, over-emotional, up & down, complicated people get on my last nerve. I find them both exhausting and extremely annoying.

People take advantage of others...particularly emotional-advantage...because they can. Because she knows that if she acts like a silly, confusing, high-strung chick one minute and then simply calms down and acts normal the next, you'll let her get away with it.

The question you need to ask yourself is, is this what you want for you life. You've been married for 6 months...it will get worse and worse. You'll tie your finances, your family, your health, potentially children to this unstable, irrational woman. Is that what you want to do?

I'm in my 40s...and I like peace and quiet. I have a busy career, kids to take care of, a house to pay for...and the last thing I need is my life partner to sabotage my mental well-being. Partnership is about just that...having a person that cares about what YOU need and who you can count on when you're at your worst.

In my opinion, she sounds manipulative, self-absorbed, silly and short-sighted. If I were you, I wouldn't be able to get rid of her fast enough. I think you'd be doing yourself a favor to simply learn your lesson from Ms. Psycho and find yourself a nice, normal girl.

I guarantee you that the relationship probably won't last anyway...and if it does, you're in for years of very unstable, bizarre behavior because she's a drama-queen who gets attention from you when she acts up this way. 

She's damaged goods...let her be someone else's problem.


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## nickgtg (Jan 11, 2013)

I simply would leave and move on with my life. Do you want a lifetime of this?


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## vpwhite2770 (Jul 26, 2013)

Its only going to get worst, cut your loses and get out as fast as you can!!


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## jerry123 (Apr 9, 2012)

Drama queen and she craves it. 

Borderline personality disorder:

Borderline personality disorder (BPD) is a mental health condition in which a person has long‑term patterns of unstable or turbulent emotions. These inner experiences often result in impulsive actions and *chaotic *relationships with other people.


Your life will be a living hell unless she gets help.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## alliant (Mar 3, 2014)

To all of you,

Many thanks for your comments and advise. It is has been very helpful.

Nikita - like you, I am all about keeping things quiet / peaceful even when problems exist. I suppose that in anything I do, I want to be successful and if I tend to make the best out of any situation. More so I have been thinking that if I can break this up / down attitude if I can make her secure enough. I never really saw it as much when we were dating but it has come out with a vengeance.

I also believe that the marriage will not last because I know I can't deal with this for the rest of my life. 

Borderline personality disorder - she def has it and the funny thing is, she is a doctor yet can't realize it.

Thanks again for everyone.


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## howdidthishappentome? (Mar 25, 2014)

I think Jerry has the right idea, this woman has a mental illness. However, it can be impossible for an ill person to see how irrational their actions are, as far as the person is concerned they are just reacting to external pressure like anyone would. The good news is, mental illness is treatable.

Your first question is whether you really want to be with her. If the answer is that you would, if she got her act together, then I'd lay out her behavior and your conditions. "This is an account of what you have been doing. (this morning you said you loved me but four hours later you tell me you want a divorce, when as far as I know nothing has changed in our life.) I cannot cope with this behavior, I don't understand it and I feel a great deal of pain and stress in my life over this. I can't stay in this relationship unless you/we get professional help." 

... of course if you've already moved on, emotionally, then there is no reason to stay and fight, walk away with kindness to yourself.


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## Sandfly (Dec 8, 2013)

Agreed with all the previous posters.

If this had been a temporary challenge in the middle of a ten year romance, it'd be worth carrying on for a bit.

But as you're just starting out, you should drop it before she 'falls' pregnant. In the meantime, only use condoms which you personally keep in a locked safe, and use two at a time


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## alliant (Mar 3, 2014)

Because her attitude changes so often and that each time I have attempted to discuss these changes in erratic behavior, she just gets angry and negative each time so to certain extent I have withdrawn emotionally to certain degree.

I think it would be hard for anyone to take a person seriously when someone says they are ready to leave or that I love you, blah blah blah in the same day or constantly threatens to leave.

Would I like to be with her, the answer the yes but only if she shows consistency and gets rid of the erratic / temporary behavior patterns.

Yesterday, she tried pulling the same old song & dance with trying to make me feel guilty for cancelling our "celebrations" and went off via text message while I was working. I just sent her this by e-mail. She went off the handle more so but when I got home from work, I got nothing but niceness (which I'm not surprised when I call her out on her stuff)

10 Signs Your Girlfriend or Wife is an Emotional Bully | A Shrink for Men


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## Rottdad42 (Nov 26, 2012)

Wow, just, wow. This is insane behavior, how do you ever know if you are on solid ground. Like myself and others that have commented, when you reach a certain age and then factor in a "crazy" life partner, you have to ask yourself, do I deserve better. That answer is yes, we all do. The heck with this hot/cold crap. You don't know if you are coming or going. My opinion would be going. Tell yourself or her for that matter, I didn't sign up for this manipulative, childish, flat out crazy behavior. You can't ever build a long term healthy relationship with a person like this. Doctor! So much for "I will do no harm." This is a very strange person in her personal life, how is she able to care for other people, when she is falling apart. 
Please at this point, you should abstain from being intimate. Her becoming pregnant, along with her instability, could make matters unbearable. She def needs to have an eval done to see if she is chemically out of whack. This might explain her extremely odd behavior, for an M.D. Good luck


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## alliant (Mar 3, 2014)

Good question Rottdad. The only solid ground that I have presently is that if she really wanted to leave, she would have done so by now as its been a tough ride. She has threatened enough times to do so and until 3 weeks ago, I have fallen for it each time along with taking other things she has mentioned at face value. 

Its all about her trying to get control which she did have at one point and because she is unable to get it now, she tries and uses these tactics which at one point had a very negative effect on me but after awhile when someone cries wolf enough, I just realized it is me who has the ability to keep this going or end it.

I don't believe she is going anywhere even with the erratic behavior because I have said to her that no one is holding a gun to your head to stay and if you want to leave, then leave if it what is best for you. Yet each time I mention this or something similar, it's like clockwork to where she'll turn all nice that sameday or the following day.


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## howdidthishappentome? (Mar 25, 2014)

I keep hearing you redirect the discussion to talk about what she is going to do. That is not a question you have control over (It appears she doesn't have much control over it either). It's pretty clear that she is not going to stabilize unless she gets therapy/medication, so whether or not this marriage could be tolerable really comes down to that. The question you do have control over is what _you_ are going to do. You have the power to stay with conditions, or the power to leave. I say take the power that is rightfully yours and make a decision.


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## alliant (Mar 3, 2014)

Like you mentioned before howdidthishappentome - pretty much issue an ultimatium as you said "I can't stay in this relationship unless you/we get professional help" and if she says no, then I really have no choice but walk as actions need to follow the words.


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## howdidthishappentome? (Mar 25, 2014)

alliant said:


> Like you mentioned before howdidthishappentome - pretty much issue an ultimatium as you said "I can't stay in this relationship unless you/we get professional help" and if she says no, then I really have no choice but walk as actions need to follow the words.


... I want this to come out gently but it probably won't: You can't ultimately change anyone else, but you do have the right to issue an ultimatum about how someone else is treating you, that's not wrong. if you don't want to follow your action with words, then you're basically saying you're ok with staying in a volatile and emotionally abusive relationship, if that's what _she_ wants. Which doesn't sound very healthy but it's certainly your prerogative. But if you're ok with staying if things don't change, what is it you're actually asking here?


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## U.E. McGill (Nov 27, 2013)

alliant said:


> ....like you, I am all about keeping things quiet / peaceful even when problems exist. I suppose that in anything I do, I want to be successful and if I tend to make the best out of any situation.
> 
> ....



First, disconnect the emotional hose. Her feelings are hers and hers to manage. This statement here is quite telling. 

She knows she can at you like a piano. 

Read the book "when I say no I feel guilty". 

Personally I don't care one way or the other if you work it out. But I will tell you that YOU ARE JUST AS MUCH AT FAULT as her. Not for making her comfortable or stable, but for allowing the crazy to go on! It takes two people to be in a dysfunctional relationship. 

Straighten your stuff out. Learn how to deal with her with integrity. Set your boundaries, and enforce them. Quit sending emails. Quit telling her what she needs to do. Tell her "I need XYZ. Either you want to meet it or not." Throw her out if she doesn't. Never tolerate bad behavior. You can throw her out, if she behaves for a set period, maybe let her back in, but don't ever let her call your bluff. 

You may get rid of her, but your still broken. Who's to say your next wife won't be too?


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

Yikes. Get out. Now.


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## Uptown (Mar 27, 2010)

alliant said:


> Borderline personality disorder - she def has it.


Alliant, I agree with Jerry and you that the unstable and drama-seeking behaviors you describe are classic warning signs for BPD. Of course, only a professional can determine whether her BPD traits are so severe as to constitute the full-blown disorder. I lived with my BPDer exW for 15 years. If you would like to read about my experiences, I suggest you take a look at my posts in Maybe's Thread. Take care, Alliant.


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## alliant (Mar 3, 2014)

"... But if you're ok with staying if things don't change, what is it you're actually asking here?"

I am very much aware that I no one can change who they are but to a degree, everyone will have some consistency to them. The only that I told her last night was that either we get professional help or I don't want to do this anymore. 

Surprisingly enough, she brought it up before I could and we have our first appointment starting next week.


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## alliant (Mar 3, 2014)

U.E. - you are correct that its also my fault for letting things get out of hand. However, I have been in a good place over these past 3 weeks to where boundaries have been set. The silliness does come about but I walk out each time it does mentioning "I'll be back when you grow" up or there have been times when I say "leave if you are going to act like a child". 

And if things go south where I do end up calling this quits, I will be broken for a bit but that's part of life and if I have made a mistake, then I'll lick my wounds and start over again.


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## howdidthishappentome? (Mar 25, 2014)

Excellent! Good luck to both of you.


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## alliant (Mar 3, 2014)

Uptown - Many thanks for the link as it's has been extremely useful.

I called her out on her BPD and she almost went off but I got up and left the room before she had the chance.

We have our first couples session next week so I hope that will give me some further clarity as to whether I should stick around or leave.


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## Uptown (Mar 27, 2010)

alliant said:


> I called her out on her BPD....


Alliant, generally, it is counterproductive to tell a high functioning BPDer she has strong BPD traits. A BPDer's subconscious protects her fragile ego from seeing too much of reality. It mainly accomplishes this by projecting hurtful thoughts and feelings onto the spouse. Because this projection occurs entirely at the subconscious level, she will be absolutely convinced -- at the conscious level -- that the problem is originating with YOU. 

This is one reason that psychologists usually are loath to tell a HF BPDer the name of her disorder. There are several other reasons, which I discuss at Loath to Diagnose. The result is that, when BPD is a strong possibility, your best chance of obtaining a candid professional opinion on what you're dealing with is to see a psychologist who has never treated or seen her. He therefore will be ethically bound to protect YOUR best interests, not hers.


> We have our first couples session next week so I hope that will give me some further clarity....


Don't count on it. My experience is that couples counseling -- at best -- is a total waste of time and money until a BPDer has had several years of IC to address her far more serious issues. At worst, the couples counseling can be destructive, giving the BPDer a stage on which to berate you and play her role as "The Victim," always "The Victim." It is a cakewalk for a BPDer to hide her dark side in a 50 minute session held once a week. Moreover, to the extent she learns better communication skills, she may simply become better at manipulating you if she has not first addressed her underlying problems.


> I know she is playing too many games.... she is up to her usual tricks.


If you are being cleverly manipulated by a W who is "playing too many games" and is "up to her usual tricks," you are describing narcissistic or sociopathic behavior. In contrast, although BPDers try to be very controlling (due to the abandonment fear), they are not very good at manipulation because they are too reactive to whatever intense feeling they are experiencing at the moment. To be successful, manipulation usually requires careful planning and flawless execution -- which BPDers are not good at because they are so reactive and impulsive.

Hence, if your W has strong BPD traits as you suspect, you likely are seeing mostly the results of her distorted perception of you -- not deliberate attempts to deceive. That is, BPDers usually BELIEVE the outrageous things coming out of their mouths. And, a week later when she is claiming the exact opposite, a BPDer will believe that just as firmly. The beauty of these projections is that, because they occur entirely in the subconscious, the BPDer never has to deal with any guilt (which is very painful for a person filled with great shame). This is why a BPDer relies far more heavily on projection than lying as an ego defense mechanism. My exW, for example, would occasionally tell deliberate lies but generally would do so only when she was cornered and had no other face-saving way out of the predicament.


> I had reservations wondering how can someone be so angry for so many months and then do a 180 within 12 hours .


You've come a long way since making this statement a week ago. As you now must know, a BPDer (person with strong traits) can "do a 180" within ten seconds. This is called "splitting," aka "black-white thinking." And, a week later, she can flip back again just as quickly -- being triggered by some minor thing you say or do.


> I need to see stability from her to ensure that her behaviour isn't temporary as she is very hot / cold on practically everything including me


If she is a BPDer, it likely will be several years at least before seeing a substantial change in her stability -- and this is based on the very unlikely assumption that she will stay in therapy long enough to make a real difference. During that multi-year period, you would have the very difficult task of trying to determine whether she is making any real progress or, instead, is simply playing mind games with the therapist (as my exW did in weekly therapy for 15 years). Like a smoker who is always "quitting" every month, a BPDer typically exhibits enormous improvement every three or four weeks -- when switching from splitting you black to splitting you white again. It therefore is extremely difficult to distinguish real progress from one more upswing on the BPDer roller coaster ride.


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## alliant (Mar 3, 2014)

Uptown - she clearly believes (at least I think) that the entire problem lies with me when something triggers in her mind (i.e. watching something on tv, something I might say in passing). 

I have informed this psychologist of her possible BPD and he has never treated her before so I thank you for the advise. Luckily we may get somewhere but we'll see what happens. In anycase, the professional has confirmed that he will have my interests first.

The more I have continued to come head on and control situations / erratic behavior I see, she seems to back off in the sense to where "her bag of tricks" appear to be limited. Having said that and from your analysis of the BPDer, this is most likely temporary.

However, if a BPDer is controlling as you say due to the abandonment fear, wouldn't it make sense to use this fear to my "advantage" to where if I just outright "dismiss" anything she is feeling or mention that "its all your head, stop acting like a crazy woman" etc or act as if its my way or the highway? 

In your opinion from what you have experienced, would a BPDer then get worse with the ups / downs or because of the their fear of abandonment, would these symptons disappear if she realizes that she no control? I am only asking this because the minute I turn on my "throw down the law switch" or if I just ignore / don't pay any attention to her, the controlling / anger / sadness side goes away. The following day or the day of, she becomes her usual "nice" self again and always asks "are we going to be ok", etc.


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## Uptown (Mar 27, 2010)

alliant said:


> I have informed this psychologist of her possible BPD and he has never treated her before ...the professional has confirmed that he will have my interests first.


Alliant, does he understand that he will not be treating or seeing your W? I ask because, if he thinks he may be treating both of you, he may have an incentive to withhold a BPD (or other PD) diagnosis from you to protect her. When BPD is a strong possibility, you each should be seeing your own psychologists. Relying on her psychologist for advice during the marriage would be as foolish as relying on her attorney for advice during the divorce.


> Having said that and from your analysis of the BPDer, this is most likely temporary.


Yes. With unstable people, nearly every behavior you see is temporary.


> However, if a BPDer is controlling as you say due to the abandonment fear, wouldn't it make sense to use this fear to my "advantage" to where if I just outright "dismiss" anything she is feeling or mention that "its all your head, stop acting like a crazy woman" etc or act as if its my way or the highway?


No, you cannot use the abandonment fear to your advantage. One reason is that, if she is a BPDer, she is incapable of trusting you for any extended period. This means she simply will not believe your explanations or claims much of the time. Another reason is that her abandonment fear lies at the opposite end of the very same spectrum containing her engulfment fear. This means that, as you back away from one fear to avoid triggering it, you necessarily are drawing closer to triggering the other fear. With untreated BPDers, you therefore are always in a lose-lose situation. And so are they.

Further, if you really are married to a BPDer who is unaware of her own issue (and thus will not work hard to fix it), what "makes sense" is to divorce her -- not try to control her behavior. If she is an untreated BPDer, you are married to a woman who has the emotional development of a four year old -- never mind that she has the intelligence, education, cunning, and body strength of a fully grown adult. It is common for high functioning BPDers to do well in demanding professions, such as medicine, because the only people who trigger their two fears are family members or other people they are very close to emotionally.


> In your opinion from what you have experienced, would a BPDer then get worse with the ups/downs or because of the their fear of abandonment.


IME, things are going to get much worse no matter WHAT you do -- if she has strong BPD traits. With my exW, I found that her abandonment fear grew worse with each passing year as she saw her body aging. Also, her resentment -- of my inability to make her happy -- grew stronger each year. Finally, I scared the devil out of her when -- as you propose above -- I started establishing stronger personal boundaries and enforcing them. It scared her because she misperceived my actions as evidence that I intended to leave her.


> Would these symptons disappear if she realizes that she no control?


If she is a BPDer, she has been painfully aware her entire life that she has little control over loved ones and she greatly fears a loss of that small control she does have. Hence, making her feel even more out-of-control is not going to improve things.


> The minute I turn on my "throw down the law switch" or if I just ignore / don't pay any attention to her, the controlling / anger / sadness side goes away.


I fully agree with you that you should establish strong personal boundaries and enforce them. Yet, if she is a BPDer unwilling to stay in therapy, establishing strong boundaries only means that you are behaving like a wise parent in a parent/child relationship. What you should be seeking, instead, is a husband/wife relationship with a mature woman.

Moreover, if she has strong BPD traits, establishing strong personal boundaries almost certainly will motivate her to abandon you. Generally, a BPDer will only tolerate your presence as long as you continually support her false self image of being "The Victim." That means you must either play the role of "Savior" or "Perpetrator" (depending on whether she's splitting you white or black) because both of those roles imply she is "The Victim." Significantly, neither of those roles allow you to have strong personal boundaries.


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## alliant (Mar 3, 2014)

Uptown - based on your advise, we will be seeing separate psychologists.

I actually read a few books on BPD this weekend (I hate you, don't leave me and walking on eggshells). She seems to have the symptoms but lacks the eccentric side as she never goes anywhere without me. Yet she drinks a lot and has substance abuse issues (sleeping pills taken almost every night).

She has always been a "runner" type even when we were dating but I had to reassure that relax, we're good. What I am realizing now is that when we dated and spend the entire weekends together, life pretty much stopped and we were in our own bubble to where we just needed our world and nothing else. There were rarely any problems. Now that we are married and dealing with the day to day issues, here is where I am seeing some of these BPD traits b/c I am unable to do everything she is requested or its a matter of how I do it that bothers her.

She is also unable to face real life problems when it comes to family members / health issues, etc. Signs of BPD as per the book but she constantly changes her attitude towards me.

As of Friday, we were watching a movie and something triggered in her head. We have two condos in the same building and she decided to sleep at the other condo (unfurnished as we are in the process of renting it) and came up again in the morning. Surely enough, she stayed at our residence throughout the entire weekend. 

But I see your point in the Savior / Perpetrator roles.

I did a little test Saturday morning when I left our condo to further determine whether additional BPD traits and indicated to her that I was in the hospital b/c I collapsed at the office. The entire time I played this out this test - all of her comments were about her (i.e. I'm no good for you, I did this to you b/c of stress, you deserve someone better, I'm a selfish and bad person, what do you need from me, if anything happened to you I'd be done, etc.) yet when I got home later, she acted somewhat distanced / she didn't seem she was able to discuss whether or not I was ok and pretty much started an argument again.

Its a very confusing situation unfortunately.


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## struggle (May 13, 2013)

Seeing as I'm currently learning about this now in my own IC from my relationship with my STBXH...

Her threatening to leave you and moving her "stuff" into the spare bedroom is emotional abuse.
Her belitteling your emotions and feelings is emotional abuse
Her emotionally pulling away from you and/or giving you the silent treatment because you don't say/do what she wants you to is emotional abuse

To name a few.

If she doesn't want help, she will never ever ever change. Ever. Period. Being married doesn't fix it, or make things better. Neither does giving it more time. It just makes you more confused, more entangled into the web of confusion as you watch your self esteem get trampled into oblivion.

Unless you like the way she's treating you, get out now. And get into IC because you need to learn about boundaries (and co-dependency) and emotional abuse for future relationships.


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## 6301 (May 11, 2013)

What you did by cancelling the celebration was the smartest thing you could have done.

You were right to do so because one doesn't go from always mad and then overnight, all is forgiven. Her idea was to be the center of attention for the day, then go back to being the spoiled little kid who doesn't get her way.

Next time she says she wants to leave, then point to the door and tell her that's where the starting line is and help her by moving her bags of clothes to the door, then let her know that the next step is contacting a lawyer.

She comes across as a spoiled child who refuses to take any blame for her faults and would rather make you out as the bad guy.

All in all friend. I think you made a big mistake. She refuses to see a MC and that should tell you that she has no intentions of changing and your the one that will have to shoulder all the blame for the rest of this potential train wreck of a marriage. My advice? End it and don't look back.


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## alliant (Mar 3, 2014)

Struggle - I certainly agree with you that it is emotional abuse. It bothered me once upon a time but because she has done it so often, I am no longer phased by it. The plan now is to separate counsellors b/c if she has BPD, then anyone we see together will side with her as per Uptown.


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## alliant (Mar 3, 2014)

6301,

I also believe it is the smartest thing I did and she still goes on about it today b/c "I made an executive decision without discussing it first" and she claims she would have agreed with me to cancel. Yet I highly doubt she would have. 

I even mentioned in my e-mail it was a postponement and not a cancellation. Yet everyday, she constantly brings it up and mentions that it was disrespectful, that her parents believe we are done, that they believe she is being brainwashed and its far from the truth. I mean we're already married so cares whether it takes place now or later (if it even happens).

She admits to being spoiled which she certainly is. And you are correct that she is unable to admit her own faults unless ofcourse she is one of her moods that she is able to.

But you are right - its probably best that I end this b/c everything in my life has suffered and I have taken too much time to focus on one area of my life where everything has suffered.


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## Uptown (Mar 27, 2010)

alliant said:


> She seems to have the [BPD] symptoms but lacks the eccentric side as she never goes anywhere without me.


Alliant, what is the "eccentric side" that BPDers usually have but that your W is lacking? I assume you read about it in one of the two BPD books.


> The plan now is to separate counsellors b/c if she has BPD, then anyone we see together will side with her as per Uptown.


Yes, if she is the psychologist's client, he is ethically bound to protect her best interests even if you occasionally join a session to ask questions. Further, assuming you BOTH are his clients and are seeing him once a week, it likely would be inaccurate to say that he will "side with her." The danger, in this case, is not his taking sides but, rather, his incentive to withhold BPD information from BOTH of you (assuming she does have strong BPD traits). As I discussed earlier, therapists generally are loath to tell a high functioning BPDer -- much less tell her H -- the name of her disorder.


> Now that we are married and dealing with the day to day issues, here is where I am seeing some of these BPD traits b/c I am unable to do everything she is requested or its a matter of how I do it that bothers her.


You also were unable to do all those things during the courtship period but your failures simply bounded off her. With a BPDer, what changes is the evaporation of her infatuation. By convincing her that you are her perfect savior, that infatuation had held her two fears at bay. As soon as the infatuation faded, however, her fears of abandonment and engulfment returned. 

This likely is why -- if she is a BPDer -- that you started triggering her two fears after the wedding but not before. Moreover, because she no longer perceived of you as "The Savior," she had to start perceiving of you as "The Perpetrator" so as to validate her false self image of always being "The Victim."


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