# Sex life is gone



## tryingtoenjoylife (Mar 30, 2012)

I have been married to my wife for almost 15 years. Since the birth of our 3rd child our sex life has diminished to almost nothing. 

First, I want to say that early on, very early on, she was insatiable. Waking up at 3 am to have sex. BJs just for the fun of it. Experimented with porn, toys, the works. We'd even done strip clubs a few times - at her request.

Now it is non existent. She never initiates sex. Anytime I initiate any sexual play she says, "really?" 

In some ways I don't blame her at all. Where she used to orgasm and even be multi-orgasmic, now she can't. Not by herself, not orally, nothing. It is a build-up to frustration.

The problem is, it is majorly sabataging how I feel about her. Making me more upset about things that were minor things become major. I think to myself, "Why is it worth it to put up with this." I get angrier quicker. I'm resentful because of this.

I have tried every thing in the book, but I can't get her to share anything with me. I try to get her to tell me her fantasies an she claims to never have them. I try to tell her mine and she may go along, but then she tells me she doesn't like dirty talk at all.

I tried to give her time away from the kids. Dropping by at work with flowers and giving her a surprise weekend to herself - encouraging her to self stimulate. All hoping that by dropping the pressure of her life and getting a little to drink that she would be reinvigorated. Nothing, nada.

I've offered alternate things - even hoped that she would have an affair. I've made her the offer of getting another man in for a three way just because I miss that look of sexual enjoyment on her face. She claims to have not interest in that - doesn't even want to fantasize about it.

Occasionally she will give me a bj, but it is with all of the enthusiasm of a prostitute, saying things like "get yourself started" rather than kissing me. 

I love her and don't want to leave, but I am in my early 40s and figure I have only 10 - 20 years left of a really active sex drive before pills and other things are required. I don't want to miss out and frankly I need the relief once in awhile. I'm not talking daily, but once or twice a week would be great.

I would really love some suggestions....something to try that I am not to maybe get her to open up again. I stumbled across this site looking for just these answers.

Thanks you.


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

How old is she? Is menopause or perimenopause possible?

Is she on medications? Birth control? Antidepression pills?

Has she seen her doctor? Had hormone levels checked? pregnancy can poop out your hormones.

Sorry you're going through this, ....it really sucks.


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## tryingtoenjoylife (Mar 30, 2012)

Very good questions:

Following the birth of our third she had her tubes tied (her choice since c-sections were necessary). Had some complications after that and she ended up having a uterine ablation. 

Have read on line that it basically shoots your body into menopause. 

Saw her regular OB who jokingly told her to fake it. This was maybe 2 -3 years ago. He also gave her a prescription for a basic female viagra which she refused to take saying that it wasn't a matter of getting in the mood it was a matter of the orgasm.

She has tried some other herbal stuff with no luck whatsoever. Yes, it bothers me that she wouldn't try what the doctor prescribed especially since basically she has not drive at all. 

What is worse is that her attitude has changed and she won't give an effort at all. I love lingerie - she wont wear it and considers it a chore. Even when she does she talks about looking like a fat cow and stuff like that. Neither of us have ever been slender in the time we've dated, so it is not like I'm wanting to see a 100 lb hard body. Still, I like lingerie.

I don't think she realizes the attitude has the affect on me. Last night I literally got out bed and said, "It is obvious you don't want to do this." No objection from her whatsoever. 

I haven't had an affair (a lot of self gratification), but I am to the point that if it presented itself I would not turn it down. Sad as that seems.


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## kittykat09 (Mar 26, 2012)

I might be misinterpreting, but it seems like you are trying to fix the problem by addressing the lack of sex instead of the cause of the lack of sex. 

The weekend getaway you planned sounds like it was 100% sexually motivated instead of being an affectionate gesture or an attempt to reduce her stress. _Instead, it was to try to get her to masturbate? Seriously?_

You suggest a threesome because you hope you will excite her with it? You *hope* she has an affair? 

If it isn't a physical problem with her, she probably feels like you only view her as a sexual object. That is certainly the impression I have gotten from you. I hear no love whatsoever, just resentment that she isn't giving you access to her holes like a sexual NPC. Most women require being treated like a human being to feel interest in sex.

Yes, she *should* be having a healthy sexual relationship with you since you are her husband and you *do* have sexual needs, but it sounds like you are not giving her the affection she needs, either.


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## Browncoat (Mar 25, 2012)

Has she had her testosterone and/or estrogen levels tested? It's just that with any major change in drive, while it could be psychological... it might just as well be physiological (or both).

You may also want to consider going to a sex therapist as well. This isn't a problem that will likely resolve itself.


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## tryingtoenjoylife (Mar 30, 2012)

In answer to the hormone levels tests, she has basically indicated no desires to undergo any hormone therapy. 

In answer to the other questions there is a lot that is hard to sum up in a few paragraphs on a website. Since this is the sexual part of the website I limited it to the sexual topics. That said, it is not like we had a terrible sex life before - we had a great one. Since the 3rd kid and presumably some medical issues, it is gone away.

I consider her a great partner in life, but the partnership has been completely lost in the bedroom. 

Maybe I am being selfish for focusing on this aspect, but what was once great has been gone from my life the last 3 or 4 years. It builds on you, wears you down. Prior to the marriage and for the first 12 years of our relationship sex was never a reward. It was part of our relationship. It was never a matter of me only viewing her as a sexual object. A morning cuddle often lead to sex. Now it leads to "I don't want to have to get all worked up." We are talking just kissing here. 

We still go out, we still go on dates, but she can find many reasons for not doing it - number one being that she is frustrated that she can no longer reach orgasm. 

So when do we have it? At night, no, because she gets worked up and then her brain is wired and she can't sleep. During the day, no, we have kids. 

Why did I suggest the masturbation? Because she used to do that all the time. She got relief, felt good. Shame on me for figuring that if she got some time to herself that maybe she could get over the edge. How selfish of me for wanting a partner who is as interested in being intimate as I do. 

I work hard. I help clean the house. I bathe the kids, do the dishes and other assorted things around the house. So, yeah, if night after night rolls around and I have an uninterested partner and I am getting frustrated with that well, call it selfish.


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## Browncoat (Mar 25, 2012)

I would pose a hypothetical to her (I would not recommend doing this, just an analogy).

What if you only spoke to her in dispassionate 1 word responses or grunts. After a while she would naturally feel a disconnect from you and would want to you change your ways. If you refused with an embittered 1 word answer/grunt, didn't see a doctor or do anything about it and it continued for years. She wouldn't feel loved at all.

In a way that's what she's doing to you. There could be any number of reasons for what's going on, but in the end she needs to get some professional help (doctor and/or therapist). I would ask her to seek help again if for no other reason than because she loves you. If not I'd insist that something has to change... she has to give you some hope that the situation will improve.


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## Hicks (Jan 14, 2011)

tryingtoenjoylife said:


> I consider her a great partner in life, but the partnership has been completely lost in the bedroom.
> 
> Maybe I am being selfish for focusing on this aspect, but what was once great has been gone from my life the last 3 or 4 years. It builds on you, wears you down. Prior to the marriage and for the first 12 years of our relationship sex was never a reward. It was part of our relationship. It was never a matter of me only viewing her as a sexual object. A morning cuddle often lead to sex. Now it leads to "I don't want to have to get all worked up." We are talking just kissing here.


You are not being selfish. You have a need for sexual fulfillment. Embrace it. Love this about yourself. Be proud of yourself.

It's not your job to be doctor or psychologoist. It is your job to be husband. This means you meet her emotional needs to the best of your ability. If you know you are doing this, then you have to point out to her that sexual fulfillment is an emotional need of yours and that you expect her to meet it. The problem is hers to solve, but the choice you want her to make is will she be a wife that meets her husband's emotional needs or not. And by the way, if you meet her needs and she refuses to meet your needs it is your wife that is selfish, not you.


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## Enchantment (May 11, 2011)

tryingtoenjoylife said:


> Very good questions:
> 
> Following the birth of our third she had her tubes tied (her choice since c-sections were necessary). Had some complications after that and she ended up having a uterine ablation.
> 
> ...


Hi trying ~

I've had endometrial (uterine) ablation - it does not cause a woman to go in to menopause. It doesn't mess with a woman's hormones at all, because her ovaries are still in-tact - it merely reduces or removes the endometrial lining of the uterus (which is not a maker of hormones) to help control uncontrollable bleeding.

It is possible that she has gone through menopause, and with an ablation you don't know for sure because you don't have a cessation of bleeding to gauge by. But her doctor can run a hormonal panel and be able to tell - certain levels of hormone would be low (estrogen/progesterone) and certain levels of hormone would be high (FSH). It's usually the FSH (follicle stimulating hormone) being elevated that indicates a woman is post-menopausal.

Do you feel that she is putting too much emphasis on trying to achieve an orgasm - kind of psyching herself out and setting herself up to fail in a heap of performance anxiety? Women get it too.

Does she not enjoy any of the other aspects of sex - the closeness that it gives you? Does she have other physical discomfort with it - pain or dryness?

She sounds a bit joyless and bitter. Has she been evaluated for depression?

Does she work outside the home? You mentioned that you do a lot of things around the house. Is she doing her share too?

Best wishes.


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## tryingtoenjoylife (Mar 30, 2012)

Thank you for your response.

I was going off of information she had given me. Can't recall if it was when she got her tubes tied or the UA, but she read somewhere on line about it affecting the sex drive.

Obviously not sure about the menopause thing. Coincidentally, she claims to be today going through some of the typical symptoms of when she would have her period (minus being horny). 

We have not had the hormone level blood work done up so I will gently suggest that if we can get into a discussion on the topic. 

That said, she has not had discomfort at all. 

The psyching herself out is a good theory and she has made indications that being with me adds a layer of pressure on that issue. I can say that she has had 1 maybe 2 orgasms in the last 18 mo to 2 years. We have had no issues with dryness or anything of the like. I will say this odd thing that I haven't shared with her is that when I go down on her, I don't feel her clit with my tongue the way I used to, nor do I feel it like I used to when I would stimulate it with a finger. There were a lot of times in the past that I would be inside her and she would stimulate her clit, but she doesn't seem to have much success now. Just and observation and it may or may not be related, but I know that there is much more blood flow to it when there is a level of arousal so maybe that isn't happening.

Back to the psyching herself out, this is one of the reasons I had suggested the trip and the masterbation. Perhaps if she were relaxed, comforted and had no external pressure she would release easier. This is in stark contrast to before when she would get off on me watching her.

She wasn't always joyless and bitter and I have deeply considered the depression thing. She has been treated recently for an anxiety issue (her heart rate would raise up a lot), but that manifested itself well after the orgasm issue.

She did start back to work 2 years ago at a job way below her level of skill and education. She hates her job, so that doesn't help. She does try to do her share of housework though lately it seems like bare minimum. For instance, I do a lot of the laundry but lately it seems that if I am not doing it, nothing gets done.

She is very good and happy with the kids.

I will use these things you mentioned and see if I can get her to see a doctor. Thanks.

She says she does feel the closeness to me when we are making love, but eventually I get the feeling that she has given up and that she wants me to get it over with.


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## Enchantment (May 11, 2011)

Hoping for the best for you. 

One other observation based upon your last post is that when women start to get closer to menopause (called peri-menopause) and after they go through menopause, their lowered hormonal levels can result in some amount of atrophy to their lady bits and they will diminish in size and sensitivity.

It seems like something that she should bring up with her ob-gyn, as there may be some options for her to consider to help her if there are physical issues going on. Even an OTC progesterone cream (I use this and get it at an organic health food market) could be something that she could try on her own to see if it provides any benefit to her...I'm not a doctor, just a lady who is going through peri-menopause now and trying to cope with the symptoms - I have diminished orgasm too - it takes a lot more stimulation now to get me there.

Best wishes.


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## isla~mama (Feb 1, 2012)

Some people just are or turn sexless & asexual. I've been in a sexless marriage for 16 years and counting. If I don't initiate, it's pity sex for me 0-3 times a year. 

She really should step up to the plate and go along with it for your pleasure. It wouldn't kill her to put on lingerie and try to get into it a bit while you have some satisfaction. Have you made it painfully clear how difficult this has been for you? She might just not "get it."

I can't imagine turning my husband down unless I had a very good reason.


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

Sounds like she was thrown into surgical menopause and it took her desire.

Without hormones or treatment, this is how she'll be.

She probably feels like crap herself...menopause is NOT fun. holy...


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## Blue Moon (Sep 7, 2009)

Hey, sorry you're going through this. I've been through something sort of similar and have a few thoughts to share. I'm going to talk to you like a man though, because I don't believe in sugarcoating these types of issues. Especially since "manning up" is at the core of these problems. I'm not going to do you an injustice by giving you a flowery answer to such a problem.

My first thought has to do with your screename, which is how I believe you're living life at the moment. "Trying to Enjoy Life."

That's the first issue. You need to put your happiness first and start enjoying life, not TRYING to enjoy life. You can't base your happiness on her or any other person. You need to become happy within first and the rest will trickle down. If you're happy being the man you want to be, she'll want to be apart of that, because women are drawn to confident winners. Do it for yourself and she'll fall in line.

Get in the gym, go out with friends, to the bar, bowling, out to watch the game, ANYTHING that you like to do that is for you. Show some interest in yourself and instead of sniffing behind her like a puppy. She wants security, and she won't follow a man that's not secure in who he is and what he wants.


*First, I want to say that early on, very early on, she was insatiable. Waking up at 3 am to have sex. BJs just for the fun of it. Experimented with porn, toys, the works. We'd even done strip clubs a few times - at her request.*

She was this way because there was an environment that fosters sexual feelings, thoughts and activity. Are you still creating this environment or are you waiting for her to create it?

*Now it is non existent. She never initiates sex. Anytime I initiate any sexual play she says, "really?"*

Are you initiating it like she's your woman and you WILL have her, or like a puppy afraid of rejection or playing it safe?

*In some ways I don't blame her at all. Where she used to orgasm and even be multi-orgasmic, now she can't. Not by herself, not orally, nothing. It is a build-up to frustration.

The problem is, it is majorly sabataging how I feel about her. Making me more upset about things that were minor things become major. I think to myself, "Why is it worth it to put up with this." I get angrier quicker. I'm resentful because of this.*

Channel that anger and focus it on yourself. Hit the gym and bang some weights. Do other women find you sexy? If so, don't shun that attention. If other women want you then your wife will see that and realize you're not just some chump. If she's not giving you the time or attention you want, focus that energy elsewhere instead of waiting on her to grant you the gift of happiness.

*I have tried every thing in the book, but I can't get her to share anything with me. I try to get her to tell me her fantasies an she claims to never have them. I try to tell her mine and she may go along, but then she tells me she doesn't like dirty talk at all.*

Don't follow behind her pestering her to be dirty, but at the same time don't hide your true thoughts. If you had a crazy sex dream or if a thought pops in your head about sex or things you intend to do sexually, speak on it. Basically, don't be afraid to validate your own thoughts and feelings and have her deal with it as opposed to the other way around.

Right now, you're letting her lead in this arena and trying to see what she likes. Instead of that, tell her what you like and have her deal with it. And if it comes from a righteous place instead of a pestering for sex place, then you're fine. If she gets upset tell her you feel what you feel and go about your business. Don't censor or self-edit what you are and how you feel. A lot of times, men slowly begin to curb their raw masculinity in the sake of hopefully not offending their wives and getting p*ssy at the end of the night. She smells that on you, and it comes off as a creepy, scared nice guy, which is phony. Be you and let her deal with it.

You want to get her out of the current mindframe and follow your lead, instead of you being a good boy and following her lead. Doing nice things for sex doesn't get panties wet. She wants you to give her another way to think and feel and let her know it's OK to join your world and go on the adventure.

*I tried to give her time away from the kids. Dropping by at work with flowers and giving her a surprise weekend to herself - encouraging her to self stimulate. All hoping that by dropping the pressure of her life and getting a little to drink that she would be reinvigorated. Nothing, nada.*

OK. Women read a lot of steamy novels right? Crack one of those open. Do you EVER read any stories about the guy getting into her pants by doing any of this sh*t? No mysterious fantasy man drops in with a boquet of flowers and then ravishes her until she can't take it anymore and cooks him eggs in the morning.

Now don't get me wrong, those things are great to do for your wife, but don't do it with the expectation of sex. That's where the creepy nice guy vibe comes in. It's phony! You can't do nice things and go to your secret room of resentment like "See, I did all of those nice things and she still didn't give me any p*ssy..."

That's where the honesty thing I spoke about above comes in. It's OK and natural for you to want to have sex with your wife, so it's better to be honest about it than try underhanded nice guy tactics and then get mad about it later. That's friend zone 101.

One the NORM is to cut through the bullsh*t and show her your true self, she'll be attracted to you. She's attracted to a man that's sure of himself and what he wants and demands, not a phony nice guy who doesn't make his intentions clear and tries to con her into bed by being sweet.

*I've offered alternate things - even hoped that she would have an affair. I've made her the offer of getting another man in for a three way just because I miss that look of sexual enjoyment on her face. She claims to have not interest in that - doesn't even want to fantasize about it.*

Stop with the self defeating attitude. And stop coming at her from an emotion point of view. She wants sex and you want sex, telling her what you miss isn't going to turn her on.

*Occasionally she will give me a bj, but it is with all of the enthusiasm of a prostitute, saying things like "get yourself started" rather than kissing me.*

Don't accept sexual scraps. That reeks of weakness and puts her in the mommy role to do just enough for you to give you what you need. Make no mistake about it, sex is not just for you, it's for BOTH of you. Stop talking and thinking about what she can GIVE you. You need to have the state of mind that your d*ck is as valuable, or even MORE valuable than her p*ssy. If you're treating her as this almighty being that comes down whenever she feels the need and makes you happy with her magic aura, what is in it for her?

That's an obligation, not a turnon. You need to be a challenge for her in the same respect. Make no mistake about it, women choose to be with men that they "look up to" in some ways. They want winners. If you elevate her so high that she can only do for you and she doesn't have to work for your approval, the fun, thrill and challenge is gone.

*I love her and don't want to leave, but I am in my early 40s and figure I have only 10 - 20 years left of a really active sex drive before pills and other things are required. I don't want to miss out and frankly I need the relief once in awhile. I'm not talking daily, but once or twice a week would be great.*

TELL HER THAT. Not in a begging "Please fix this for me" kind of way. But don't hide your manliness from her. Don't hide the fact that other women want you and that sex is apart of your life. You need to have the attitude that you will be a sexual being with or without her. I'm not telling you to go out and cheat. But don't let her get the impression that your sexyness and sexual life hinges upon what she can grant you. The attitude needs to change before the action.

Don't sell her the "I only want your vagina because there's love attached to it" line. You see other women in real life and in multimedia that you want to have sex with, right? Don't nice guy it up and let her own your sexuality. Don't hide this part of yourself from her, be honest. She'll respect that more than the nice guy routine.

Like I said, don't cheat, but let her know that if it's not her it'd be someone else. Not through words and ultimatums, but through fulfilling your sexual needs with or without her. If that means porn, have at it. If that means going out to a bar (not cheating, like I said) and enjoying the environment and being around women because it feels good, have at it. If it means hitting a strip club, have at it. Basically, if she's not apart of your sex life, don't deprive yourself from having one, if that makes sense. She'll realize that you are a sexual being and will act accordingly.

Now some of this advice might sound out of the box because it's not what you typically find in a book or in counseling, so if you have any questions please ask. I'm not of the belief that talking things to death and offering nice flowery solutions is the way to go. Strength and security is sexy, so if nothing else drill that into your head. That's what she wants from you so you have to live it, and the rest will take care of itself.


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## Bluemoon1 (Mar 29, 2012)

I share the OP's pain, (along with millions of men around the world I guess) and I am just starting to reclaim my life back after what I now realise was a virtual castration! 

There is something in all this man up stuff and the more you read the more it makes sense, the problem is many of us (men that is) have been conditioned to beleive that doing all kinds of romantic gestures and being ever so helpful and attentive and loving is the way to win a woman and get her in the sack (crude I know) take it from me it does not work, neither does trying to talk about it, 

I have now realised that to my wife there was no problem, she got all the sex she needed although she never said that. the best advice to start with was from Athol Kay, and that was you can't change their minds for them, there is no reasoning or tears and tantrums, start with changing yourself and hopefully she will follow


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## DTO (Dec 18, 2011)

Lots of good advice, particularly about manning up and no letting your sexuality seem like a burden or a source of shame.

The only other thing I see is that your wife does not seem to have been entirely okay with being sterilized. You note that she chose a tubal ligation after three c-sections, and the endometrial ablation would have rendered her unable to conceive regardless. But, that does not mean she would have had the tubal done if she was otherwise healthy.

In reasearching my own vasectomy, I've read where both men and women experience emotional issues following the loss of fertility, particularly when the loss was not entirely voluntary. This only reinforces the need to have your wife be evaluated both physically and mentally.


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## tryingtoenjoylife (Mar 30, 2012)

Thanks for the input. I especially appreciate that it was not the "you are selfish" input that came for a lady who has never been married and whose only long term relationship needed "a break." Thought this section was about sex and marriage, not about an episode of Friends.

Anyway, in response to Blue Moon's comments/questions...funny you should ask some. I recently acquired a business where I have several younger women working under me so I have some of what you are talking about because I am the top dog to these young ladies. I don't think it is a matter of my wife trying to control anything, in fact, I think she kind of hopes I have an affair.

I have in a sense "moved on" and some animosity she has with me are in those things. Her social life is more limited because she was a "stay at home mom" for about 10 years. Meanwhile, I go to Vegas once a year, ball games with friends (games she used to go with me to), joined an athletic league, etc. She has no problem with me going to strip joints once in awhile though it used to be "less work for me" when I got home horny to "Don't wake me." As we have aged she has let herself go substantially more than me. She actually has said that one of the reasons she no longer likes to have sex after I've been to a strip club is that she feels less attractive. I've heard other women with similar lines about their significant others and strip clubs.

Understand there is a fine line between looking out for oneself and being a selfish prick. I like to be with my kids and I of course run 2 small companies. Those are all my choices. 

Porn...I didn't know until looking through this site that there were men out there that DIDN'T look at porn. Aren't 99.99% of the websites out there about porn? I am sure there are some women out there that think it is wrong for a married man to look at porn, but men like the visual. 

As for the take her thing, my wife will have sex with me more frequently, but it doesn't mean much if she is not into it. 

I will say that I am guilty of the self censoring thing. She already knows I am a perv, so I don't know why I am doing it. 

To DTO - The whole tubes tied thing was her idea. She made the decision when she became pregnant with the third. Some women suggested she do otherwise in case one of the kids died of an accident or something, but my wife clearly was of the mindset of "I don't want any more."


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## tryingtoenjoylife (Mar 30, 2012)

DTO said:


> The only other thing I see is that your wife does not seem to have been entirely okay with being sterilized. You note that she chose a tubal ligation after three c-sections, and the endometrial ablation would have rendered her unable to conceive regardless. But, that does not mean she would have had the tubal done if she was otherwise healthy.


It was 100% her decision to have the tubal. She even had it done right after the delivery since she was already opened up. The endometrial ablation was done later on after she had minor complications from the tubal.


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## Blue Moon (Sep 7, 2009)

tryingtoenjoylife said:


> Thanks for the input. I especially appreciate that it was not the "you are selfish" input that came for a lady who has never been married and whose only long term relationship needed "a break." Thought this section was about sex and marriage, not about an episode of Friends.
> 
> Anyway, in response to Blue Moon's comments/questions...funny you should ask some. I recently acquired a business where I have several younger women working under me so I have some of what you are talking about because I am the top dog to these young ladies. I don't think it is a matter of my wife trying to control anything, in fact, I think she kind of hopes I have an affair.
> 
> ...



Say no more man, you have a lot going for you. Sometimes it's a woman's inclination to bring you down to her level, especially when she feels inadequate or let herself go like you said. You have to find ways to continuously boost your level and make her want to climb, instead of letting her bring you down to hers.

The only way to make that happen is to cut off some of the behaviors you're doing that benefit her. Others on this board call it "lowering the theromstat/temperature." And it doesn't mean to be a prick or an *******, it's more cutting off the lovey dovey stuff when she isn't meeting your needs. Don't say I love you first, text all the time, do cute things, cuddle, etc. Well, at least don't initiate it. Be a cool, in control dude but make her come to you for what she wants.


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## Mavash. (Jan 26, 2012)

My vote is it's hormonal. I used to be insatiable then last May (I had just turned 45) my libido just died. Literally overnight....poof it was gone. 

Other perimenopause symptoms surfaced which made me seek help in the form of biodentical hormones. Turns out my testosterone was nonexistant and that controls the sex drive for women the same as it does for men. 

Within 2-4 weeks of getting testosterone sex became fun again. Hotter than ever actually. I love to touch my husband and having an orgasm is much much easier now than it was. It had gotten to the point last year where I viewed sex as 'work' because my husband wanted me to enjoy it and I just didn't anymore.


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## tryingtoenjoylife (Mar 30, 2012)

Just curious, but did you have any negative affects from the testosterone?


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

self improvement, turning down the thermostat, mmsl.....this stuff all works. But an underlying requirement is she needs to believe that you'll walk if there is no change. You've made it clear you're not leaving no matter how bad it gets, which means she's got your balls in her purse. Sorry.


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## tryingtoenjoylife (Mar 30, 2012)

Blue Moon said:


> Say no more man, you have a lot going for you. Sometimes it's a woman's inclination to bring you down to her level, especially when she feels inadequate or let herself go like you said. You have to find ways to continuously boost your level and make her want to climb, instead of letting her bring you down to hers.
> 
> The only way to make that happen is to cut off some of the behaviors you're doing that benefit her. Others on this board call it "lowering the theromstat/temperature." And it doesn't mean to be a prick or an *******, it's more cutting off the lovey dovey stuff when she isn't meeting your needs. Don't say I love you first, text all the time, do cute things, cuddle, etc. Well, at least don't initiate it. Be a cool, in control dude but make her come to you for what she wants.


I just wanted to follow up with everyone since I started posting. For good or bad I took the advice of the person I just quoted. Why? Long story. In short, my father became ill shortly after my last post and passed away. I spent many nights in the hospital with him. After his death, I realized that I wasn't getting much emotional support. Yes, she had no problem with me being gone and no problem with arrangements and things. In that respect, she was "the good wife." 

Then it hit me. When her father passed away 10 years ago she was insatiable. Constantly wanted sex and affection. When my father died - nada. I did a quick calculation and realized that we went a period of 4 months with NOTHING. We had an argument later on and I confronted her on this - something she denied. I then decided to start keeping track and as previously posted, I decided to withhold the affection. No goodbye kisses, hugs in the night, nothing. I think she could care less and in one of the arguments more or less told me to have at it (when I talked about someone else meeting my needs). 

So, I started running again, got involved in team sports again. Yep, we had fights about me taking time away to do those things, but I basically told her that I didn't give crap. I gave up a lot of that me time when I married her and I was taking it back. So what has happened? I have met a lot of women in their 20s, 30s and 40s who think a lot of a half-way decent guy who doesn't beat the crap out of them. 

Without going out and looking I had ladies hitting on me, knowing full well that I am married. The first time a lady started rubbing her hand up my thigh was exhilarating to say the least. At first I hesitated on acting, but then within the week I was like "screw it." Here is the best part - it has been 100% guilt free. Not sure why. Maybe the wife is encouraging it more than she knows. 

Could it end bad - yep, but I don't care. As far as I am concerned, she pushed me to this level. Why am I still married? The kids. I hate to see that I have become that stereotypical husband who has affairs but stays married because of the kids, but that is the case. 

Would I stop the affairs? In a heartbeat if the affection came back. For now, I am happier.


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## tryingtoenjoylife (Mar 30, 2012)

Oh, in another sort of related comment. My wife read 50 shades of Grey last summer.....well sort of. All across the country I have heard how men have loved women reading this book. Not my wife. She got 1/3 of the way into it and said it was stupid and did nothing for her. I guess if there is something that has turned on millions of women in this country and it can't turn on my wife, it can't all be me.....


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## john_lord_b3 (Jan 11, 2013)

Enchantment said:


> Hi trying ~
> 
> I've had endometrial (uterine) ablation - it does not cause a woman to go in to menopause. It doesn't mess with a woman's hormones at all, because her ovaries are still in-tact - it merely reduces or removes the endometrial lining of the uterus (which is not a maker of hormones) to help control uncontrollable bleeding.
> 
> It is possible that she has gone through menopause, and with an ablation you don't know for sure because you don't have a cessation of bleeding to gauge by. But her doctor can run a hormonal panel and be able to tell - certain levels of hormone would be low (estrogen/progesterone) and certain levels of hormone would be high (FSH). It's usually the FSH (follicle stimulating hormone) being elevated that indicates a woman is post-menopausal.


Thank you for sharing your thoughts and experiences. We can read all medical literature there is, but nothing compares to the testimony of those who've "been there, done that"..
:smthumbup:


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## Jeradsjunk (Sep 15, 2012)

You say your staying for the kids. What are you saying to them by having affairs? I don't know how old your kids are, but eventually they will know what's going on. That's not something I would want to reach my kids.


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## tryingtoenjoylife (Mar 30, 2012)

In a perfect world it doesn't, but in a perfect world I have love and affection from someone I call my "partner." I saw myself with 3 choices:

a) Live in a sexless marriage
b) Get divorced
c) Stay married but run around. 

Since the wife has not given an alternative to A that actually involves the old sex life and has shown an unwillingness to get medical and or psychological counseling, these were my options.


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## Jeradsjunk (Sep 15, 2012)

The world is far from perfect, but you still can make the right decisions. If you feel like you done everything you can to be happy in your marriage, divorce is the only option.


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## alphabravo (Feb 4, 2013)

Right on! Damn this post just made my day.

Exact same story on my end. Exact. 

Living with a depressed, moody, overweight, sexless, under employed wife who you still love is not easy. Counselors will tell you to just focus on the good old days and remember what she "was" rather than what she "is"

Two things to consider: Was she sexually abused in her youth? If not then what about your lifestyle? Is she upset that she thought the two of you would be living a much more lavish lifestyle than what you have? This may be a source of the bitterness that is keeping her legs closed. 

The death of your Dad? That was the trigger. You sir are in a full blown mid-life crisis. Wait until you find out your Dad suffered as well in a sexless marriage and never had the chance to make it right.

But here is the best advice I have. Be careful with the affair, do not fall in love and really end it as soon as you can. If you don't and get caught, its the worse possible scenario. 

EVERYONE will out you as the idiot cheater and she will walk scott free. Everyone will give her sympathy, yet it were the actions of BOTH of you that led to the affair. Getting caught doesn't give you this out.

I say stop the affair, and then hang out. Wait it out. And then one day in 3-5 years, walk out of the marriage. Divorce 100% when the kids are older and while everyone is looking for the "affair" they will find none. What they will see is a wife who refused to change and was not there for "better or worse" and you sir will have the rest of your life to look forward too. 

You can still love her as a friend, but she no longer has the right to hold your sexuality hostage. It is, in my opinion, sexual abuse to deny a partner sex when that partner is willing to deliver communication, support, income, fatherhood and who knows what else.


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

I wouldn't consider it cheating as long as you are upfront about it with your wife. Cheating = lying. It's not the sex that makes it cheating, it's the hiding and lying.


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## john_lord_b3 (Jan 11, 2013)

tryingtoenjoylife said:


> In a perfect world it doesn't, but in a perfect world I have love and affection from someone I call my "partner." I saw myself with 3 choices:
> 
> a) Live in a sexless marriage
> b) Get divorced
> ...


"B" is a good choice. "A" is not fair to you. "C" is totally not recommended. 

Nobody deserves to be in a sexless marriage. There are no such thing as "but our marriage is perfect except for no sex", anybody who says that to you are not being honest. No sex=not perfect, especially if your sexual equipment and hers are intact and working. 

Your divorce does not have to be hostile. You could still be good friends, you could give her a good alimony deal, you could still be civil to her family, you could still be good coparents for your children. 

A little Jon Anderson lyric for you "Owner of a Lonely Heart/Much Better Than/Owner of a Broken Heart" 

And who knows, maybe you won't be an "Owner of a Lonely Heart" for too long


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