# where to begin?



## mk50 (Jan 24, 2014)

I have been married for 17 years. At about 5-6 years in I found she was talking to someone else. She was confronted and it wound up being a fiance of a coworker/friend of hers. She went to counseling diagnosed w depression. A few years later I had an affair with her best friend(ex). Couples counseling for a year or so. Thing over the past few years seemed pretty good. Our sex life was never that great, maybe once every month or two. I happened upon our phone bill the other day and noticed a lot of texts to a number I didn't recognize. I confronted her and she admitted she had been sleeping w someone, just sex for a couple months. I'm at a loss, I told her I am willing to fight for our marriage because I just know we are right together. She says she loves me and I tell her she rarely shows it. I need a hug, a touch every now and then and not just in reciprocation for a hug I give. I want to really put work into us, I feel we have both half pass our efforts and want to give it my all. She says she is just not sure if she wants to right now but to give her time to sort things out. She did tell me she will not see him again and I gave her the phone bill app and told her to change the password so I stop drivingbmyself crazy checking every hour to see if there are more texts. I truly love this woman, my affair was three quick romps and a mistake and I know her tryst was the same. She told me she has never really forgiven me because of who it was with. I have always tried to treat her good and she says I am a great husband and father.( yes we have 2 kids and I think sometimes she stays because of them. I told her I will be here for her when she figures it out and I can fake it for five more years until.or youngest is 18. Sorry for the rambling. Is it wrong to wait it out? I have a feeling it's probably going to be over but I said I would wait it out as long as she can try to show.me some emotional connection. I think I'm just venting but I need to vent- she is my best friend and the only one I can talk to about this and I realize I can't expect her to be able to make sense of things if she has to be my counselor as well. I will end here for now but will probably be back to ramble some more. Thanks


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## mk50 (Jan 24, 2014)

I know it was ramblings but any words of wisdom would be welcome. I told her I wanted to start mixing things up right away like surprising her for a lunch date- getting a babysitter for a night out, she says these things right now would.probably feel smothering to her and would not help. How is this possible. I told her I don't think she can accept love and she somewhat agrees


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

You just told our old lady it was ok .... Not in so many words but she ain't going to stop, she just told you what you wanted to hear.

You have not given her any consequences.... She knows you ain't going any were so don't be surprised if this sh!t continues with her.

I guess you can call this a warning.

My I suggest that you figure out a way to get your old lady to start second guessing her choice... Once she start to think twice about she is about to lose she might come around. Let's face it you, me and especially her all know you ain't going any were so why change.

She will continue to tell you what you want to hear and the marriage will continue to suffer with a third person it it but in time you will get tired of the disrespect and bail.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

Your trying to compete bro

She needs to be more concerned with what she will lose rather then rewarding her with thT kind of crap
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## harrybrown (May 22, 2013)

File for divorce. 

She does not respect you. Respect yourself.

She is probably seeing him this week. She will find a different way to contact him. You are her backup plan. Sorry, but she thinks she can have her fun and you will be there. (if she still wants you)

Start the 180 and see if the divorce papers wake her up.


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

You can't and won't nice your way out of this.

Until you can confirm no contact with OM then your old lady is infected by someone other then Her marriage.

See ....the OM has to be out of the picture completely for her to focus on the marriage.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## mk50 (Jan 24, 2014)

I do believe her when she says she won't see him, she knows I will expose her and him to the her family-friendly he's a family friend. The last guy I exposed him to his fiance and basically forced the end to that. I used my being a cop to inconvenience him etc... so she knows if I find out I will ruin him and her this time. I just want her to really figure out if she wants this marriage or not. I do agree she needs to see consequences, I may just tell her I'm staying at the house for the kids but she will not be getting my usual loving treatment. And maybe a little disrespect by just going out when I want to etc... I just don't want to leave on the chance she is really willing to fight for it I don't want to mess the kids up by leaving then coming back


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

You're not messing the kids up , your old lady took care Of that already with her choices.

BTW your enabling the secret, exciting, and taboo thrill to continue by helping your wayward wife and the OM keep their secret.

Sorry my man but bad behavior continue without consequences.

But go ahead and rug sweep this crap .....until you old Lady owns this crap she is yet to learn how to affair proof her marriage.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

So with that said what motivates your wife to affair proof the marriage now?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

You will
Find out if she really wants this marriage if she can do the heavy lifting and except the consequences.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

The funny thing about addicts is they will continue to get their fix until they hit rock
Bottom and face real consequences.

And make no mistake your chicks adulatory is an addiction... Hell bro this ain't some one night stand crap.... She went back for more.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## BobSimmons (Mar 2, 2013)

It will be remiss not to point out OP also had an affair with his wife's best friend. Probably the ultimate betrayal. These are mad hatters so it's probably best if the MC is not working to just call it off. The respect is gone from both sides.


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## jack.c (Sep 7, 2013)

mk50 said:


> she knows I will expose her and him to the her family-friendly he's a family friend. I used my being a cop to inconvenience him etc... so she knows if I find out I will ruin him and her this time.


You gave yourself an answer right here!
And she is trying to rugsweep, telling you what you NEED to hear...

First step is to go 180, second step is to separate finance, third step is to start filing D. papers and make her understand that this is wher it's going....... Wait and see, and while you do it EXPOSE


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## WyshIknew (Aug 18, 2012)

Well you've both committed adultery.

Are you sure marriage is what you both want?


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## rrrbbbttt (Apr 6, 2011)

So what did you do to heal your disrespect to your wife when you had the affair? Was it just rugswept? "Three quick romps" So since it was only three that makes it okay? What is the number that is acceptable for romps? My understanding it has always been "0".

Also, it was her Best Friend. Double attack to her.

If you did not heal her you probably left a lot of animosity in her.

This may have given her the idea that you gave her as others have said the right to do the same to you. Not a Good Choice on her part as it throws away her morals and her integrity.

She violated the vows she took to you and there is not valid reason for this

She made the choice to have the current affair and has to help you to heal.

You both need to find a GOOD MC and deal with all your issues.

Also you both need to be tested for STDs.

She needs to write a NC letter, you to read it and then send it.
She has to have NC with the other person
Give you all the Passwords.
Expose the Affair(s) 

Did you ever write a NC letter?
Have you had contact with the OW since the affair? and does your wife know about this?

There are a lot of issues you need to work out if both of you are interested in saving your marriage.


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## LongWalk (Apr 4, 2013)

You should keep spying on her telephone texting. VAR her car.


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## mk50 (Jan 24, 2014)

When I had the affair it came out after I had already broken it off with the OW. Neither me or her have had contact with the OW since. What I did to try and gain her trust respect back was to give her all my passwords, made sure she knew where I was all the time, stopped going out with friends and treated her like a queen. This was 5 years or so ago and she now says she still hasnt ever forgiven me. I want to do the 180 and part of that is not spying so as much as I want to see if there are texts still between them I am not going to drive myself crazy over it, Have members done the 180 while still living in the same house. Im going to be committed to me and dont plan on initiating any hugs kisses( except for the morning goodbye). Im going to start worrying more about me than worrying about us for awhile. I know its not going to be easy because instinct tells me to keep doing the same things( fawning over her, telling her How much I love her etc..?) but reason tells me it hasnt worked before. I dont want to look into D right now, its just too hard for me to think of that now. What is a reasonable amount of time to let her get things straight before I demand MC? She is in therapy right now and hopefully that will straighten a few things out but I know we should go to an MC together at some point.


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## rrrbbbttt (Apr 6, 2011)

Couples counseling for about a year ( who determined that you no longer needed to go to counseling and decided it was not necessary), treated her like a queen, States now that she never did forgive you. Did you have remorse, or was it I had needs I really shouldn't have done it but I made up for it by going to counseling and treating you like a queen. (The statement of treating your spouse special at a time such as this always perplexes me, shouldn't you always treat your spouse like the love of your life?)

Are you assuming that she forgave you for the affair with her best friend because of the above or did she actually tell you she forgave you? If you read these threads 5 years is a drop in the bucket for some, the mind movies that your wife may have had of you and her best friend could have been part of the reason that she never really connected with you.

She owns her affair but your marriage seems to have been on life support for sometime and this is another straw on the camels back.

Does she want to save the marriage, do you?

Unless you have true Remorse for your affair and unless she has true remorse it isn't going to work.


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## mk50 (Jan 24, 2014)

I do have true remorse. I know it was the worst betrayal I could have done to her. I look at it as Im a failure to her and want to do everything in my power to prove to her that I love her above all others. I just dont know how To prove to her my true remorse. Is there any ways that can help me express true remorse? At this point she says she has to think about whether she wants to work at it. she asked why does it have to be so hard and my answer to her was we let it get this way and if we want it to be good again its going to be REAL hard, but I believe in my heart of hearts that it will be worth it.


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## sammy3 (Jun 5, 2011)

Mk, 

It takes 2 to R. And the bottom line is, this marriage has 2 infidelities in it. There is probably a lot of hurt, mistrust, and down right, "I dont care, anymore, really" coming from her. 

This is may be one of those major bump that couples get through that go on then to happy marriages of 50 years. 

I think what really is needed for a successful R, if is what you are looking for, both people have to be willing to show up for the rawness that it takes to get to the other side, but sometimes, that can break you too. 

If you keep pushing you may win her over, if you are relentless in your efforts, and prove sincere only time will show. 

~sammy


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## NovellaBiers (Dec 11, 2013)

You had an affair with her best friend. The ultimate betrayal and disrespect. I'm sorry man there's no coming back from that.


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## Squeakr (May 1, 2013)

Lots can give you ideas of how to show her true remorse, but what will work only she knows, and for that reason I say ask her what you can do to show her that you are truly sorry. Listen to the clues she drops, as she may have asked for something from you for ages, yet you have never given it to her and she regrets this.

Also this is now a two way road, and if she isn't willing to be married any more there is nothing you can do to change things. I would recommend exposure, as it may stop the A and is definitely not going to make things worse. Giving her the green light to continue the A is going to help nothing. 

Sounds as if you both need IC and MC and "expecting her IC to correct some things" is the wrong way to look at it, as this is putting it all on her. Yes her A is 100% her, but then again yours is 100R% you and it sounds like you both have rug swept it (which by her statements I can bet happened.)


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

NovellaBiers said:


> You had an affair with her best friend. The ultimate betrayal and disrespect. I'm sorry man there's no coming back from that.


I do not agree with this.

Will it be hard to come back from this? Hell yes. But not impossible.

What MK50 needs to get through his wifes head is that two wrongs do not make it right.....

Infidelity only makes it worse.

They both have to agree on where the marriage goes from here.

Do not let her sit on the fence MK50.

Watch her like a hawk.

And expose the OM.

HM


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## NovellaBiers (Dec 11, 2013)

happyman64 said:


> I do not agree with this.
> 
> Will it be hard to come back from this? Hell yes. But not impossible.
> 
> ...


Everyone is different but this is her second affair and MK50 mentioned that she has yet not forgiven his affair with her best friend. It's understandable because the double betrayal is way worse than having an affair with a stranger. Frankly speaking I think it cut her too deep and she will never forgive him. Deep down she is probably just thinking about revenge.


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

You are right NB.

But that is why he has to get her to stop her hurtful behavior, make her be accountable now.

And if she wont he has 2 choices.

End the marriage.

Or keep letting her further damage the marriage.


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## FormerSelf (Apr 21, 2013)

Woo boy, the marriage has majorly taken some TNT...KaBOOM! MC is highly recommended, but it is going to be a process of where you each need to take full responsibility and not blame each other for each other's actions. At the same time, lots of festering hurts and wounds...each partner needs to be able to safely communicate how badly they have been hurt and betrayed without being cut off or those feelings being invalidated. It all needs to come out. Forgiveness is a one day at a time process...where you have to choose to forgive each time a memory comes up...but that can only really start once you two square off with being honest 100% of where you are at in wanting to work on things, 100% honest in fully disclosing everything to each other, and then committed to rebuilding the marriage which means no more shenanigans.


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## mineforever (Jan 31, 2013)

Mk50 ...honestly I think you two are both searching for something that you are missing in your marriage. It sounds like your not meeting each others emotional or physical needs for one thing. I would highly recommend reading the 5 Love Languages book and Married Mans Sex Life book. I agree marriage counseling would be good but you might also consider a counselor with some background in sex therapy. If the sex is great...it is the glue that helps you weather through a lot of storms.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Rottdad42 (Nov 26, 2012)

Ouch, double whammy on both sides. Not much to save. Trust is broken on both sides. That would take a lifetime to heal. MC, def, long term marriage, not likely. Too much damage to fix. IMHO, I'm not in your shoes so I don't know the atmosphere. Resentment also comes into play, which makes any "R" of any kind that much harder. Good luck.


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## mk50 (Jan 24, 2014)

Well thanks, its been a crazy few weeks , ALOT of ups and downs, but we have gotten to the point where we have decided we need to seperate. We are still in the same house and I still find myself telling her I love her but I told her we will get a sitter this weekend, sit down for a few hours and come up with a seperation agreement. she will be moving in with her mom, probably in march or april. I am asking that we seperate for 6 months and then come back to the table and see where we see things and go from there. As fot the OM I spy on her facebook messages without her knowledge and saw where she finally wrote him a message stating that she is not going to contact him and for him not to contact her. and for at least a week since that there has been no contact, FB or text. I know that once she moves out she may contact him but thats on her, if she wants to do that then at leAST I will know she wants out. So we shall see, Im not giving up hope for our marriage but Im also not being blind to the idea that it may be over. We will both continue IC and may do MC as we see fit. thanks for all the input. Its good to be able to ramble about things.


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## manticore (Sep 3, 2013)

even if you are not vendictive, you should expose OM (to his wife/GF), you may feel remorse for what you did, but that does not make right for another person to mess in someone else marriage and for you to accept it.

seems that separation is the best option for now, but again OM is not the forcé of karma punching at you, he is a b*stard without morals that is consciously messing with someone else marriage.


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## illwill (Feb 21, 2013)

Many marriages dont truly recover from one affair. There are two here, including sex with a friend.

Couple that with her having no remorse, and he being co dependant, odds aint good.

Not all marriages should be saved. I know its a unpopular view for the hardcore pro R's, but its true. 

Some couples here clearly should have never got married.

They were both too immature.

And they both need IC before they start again, or this will no doubt be repeated. There is clear pattern here.

Op, work on yourself, and maybe she will take notice.


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