# A little about why I'm here



## 55Z (May 16, 2018)

I'm 64(M) and my wife is 53(F) been married almost 26 years and together for almost 27.

In early 2016 shortly after I had a major surgery my wife confessed to keeping a secret from me for the past 4-5 years. I am not sure why but this lie we had been living sent me back to our beginning.

In the Beginning:
A few months after she moved in with me (before marriage) she went on a mini vacation. She told me she was going away for a few day when I asked why she was packing a bag the morning she was leaving - she had no intention of telling me. I got out of her where she was going, a city about a 7 hour drive away. With some inquiries I was able to figure out where she was. She had made arrangements to stay at a Hotel where an old co-worker was now a manager so she got a comp'd room (suite actually complete with Jacuzzi tub).

So I call her there on the room phone and a male voice answers the phone I hesitate for a few seconds and then ask for her. I hear them talking in the background for several seconds and she finally answers the phone. I ask her who answered the phone and she told me it was XXX (the guy she was seeing before me). I compose myself and hold back the urge to hangup on her and ask why he is there. She says that she promised him before we were together that if she went on this trip she would take him. I asked her if we are done, she said we will talk when she gets back. There was along silence and we both said goodbye and hung-up. I contemplated calling her back and telling her that her stuff will be at her parents and not to return to my home - I didn't do that.

When she returned we sat down and she told me that when I called they were in the Jacuzzi tub and that she was giving him a HJ and that after I called she locked herself in the bathroom for a hour and sat on the floor crying because she thought I would call it quits. We talked and we agreed nothing like this could happen again.

Now:
So after her confession in 2016 all that came flooding back to me and I told her several times over the next 2 years that I don't believe her story and that I am 100% certain it was an all out sex weekend. I should point out that back then and now she has shown no remorse or regret that she did this. She only recently admitted it was a poor choice to take XXX with her. She told me after the last time this came up that if I ever bring this up again we are done. She has softened a bit on that stance after I showed her a similar thread on one of these forums. After she was done reading it I could tell by the look in her eyes that she just realized at least a little bit how much she hurt me and our relationship.

And that is what made me go looking for help on line and find this forum. Not really looking for any help now - would have been nice if this place was available 27 years ago.


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## Cynthia (Jan 31, 2014)

55Z said:


> In early 2016 shortly after I had a major surgery my wife confessed to keeping a secret from me for the past 4-5 years. I am not sure why but this lie we had been living sent me back to our beginning.


What was the lie that she confessed to recently?

You don't believe your wife's story about what happened before you were married, but you haven't started divorce proceedings, so apparently you are willing to stay married to her when you know she did far more than what she initially told you. What would you like to happen now?


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## jlg07 (Feb 24, 2017)

Yeah, I agree with you that she did WAY more with her ex, and unfortunately you made a poor decision to take her back. 
You should have just told her to stay there with him, because you were not going to forgive that.

What secret did she tell you that happened in the last 5 years?

BTW:
"I should point out that back then and now she has shown no remorse or regret that she did this. She only recently admitted it was a poor choice to take XXX with her. She told me after the last time this came up that if I ever bring this up again we are done."

This is BULL****E -- she has NO right to tell you that you are done -- you should say FINE, we are done because your story is crap. She admitted to giving him a HJ -- that IS cheating, and as you guessed, I'm sure it didn't stop at that.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

@55Z I just moved you thread to CWI. As you are coping with her infidelity.

And she gives *you* an ultimatum? She's got chutzpah, hasn't she?

Was this the only time she cheated on you? You need to do some digging, perhaps set up a lie detector session for her.


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

That pre-marriage affair was just a goodbye kiss.
Kisses, HJ, BJ, intercourse, of course.

Then again, she may be telling the truth. 

Your phone call let the air out of her resolve, her Last Tango with her EXBF.
She ended any and all further love making with this guy, she went into the bathroom and bawled her eyes out and did not do more.

I doubt this. She went there with the intent of performing the Full Monty with this guy. 
Oh, as a goodbye gesture, mind you. 

She likely laid on the floor because, the EXBF disappointed her again. He would not commit, again. That is why she cried.

I suspect your 'then fiancee' (at that time) was not sure what she wanted and was going to test drive him one more time. 

He failed the test (again) and she came back to you.

It could have gone the other way, mind you. 
It was a close decision. 
That is why she was never remorseful. 

She thinks herself the prize, two men wanted her, and you got her, be grateful.
Yes.

She loved him more that you, that is why she took such a chance, left you in the lurch and took advantage of your feeling.

In the end, she re-realized that you were a better pick for a husband, so she so kindly 'took' you back.
It was a very hard decision for her. 

I suspect, the EXBF, had done little more to shine in her eyes. But, she was a-hopin'.

Oh, my! 



She certainly had feelings for him and made no apologies for this.
Her saying that if you bring it up again, (means) that she still regrets making that original decision. She regrets losing him. 
Nice.

She still has insufficient feelings for you. 
And you better not forget it, or your are gone!

The best medicine for her at this point is just to file for divorce.

If she asks why, tell her that she has lost her 'luster', and that she has few if any redeeming qualities.


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

What can you do? It is what it is. It's hard to be married to a remorseless POS who lied to you for 27 years though. She doesn't sound too concerned. Then again you weren't married, maybe she wasn't that in to you then. One question is why didn't you just dump her when the guy answered the phone? 

At the very least I would consider asking her to take a poly. People who lie for 27 years usually lie about a whole **** ton of stuff. It's not a one off thing. Character is character. This is who you married, she doesn't care if it bothers you. In her mind it's none of your business, and that is not going to change. You need to do what you refused to do all those years ago and still to this day. Accept that this is who she is, she doesn't give a damn if it bothers you, then decided if that is who you want to be married to.


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## moulinyx (May 30, 2019)

Why is this a discussion 27 years into marriage? I guess I don't understand how the physical details outweigh the fact that she planned a weekend with this old flame, went through with it, and then came back to you. This should have been put to rest the second you decided to continue with the relationship. What did she confess to 7 years ago? I am confused by the original post since she already had a talk with you 27 years ago after the original deed. 

I normally have unpopular opinions on here, but you can't keep punishing someone after putting it to rest nearly 30 years ago. What she did was wrong, but marrying her should have been a fresh slate. You chose this person to be your life partner knowing she did this. She shouldn't be so cold about this issue though. Id suggest changing your approach or look for ways to release the resentment. Maybe try to spice up the romance? It seems like you may be feeling insecure so its triggering those memories.


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## [email protected] (Dec 23, 2017)

55z, something triggered this. Can you find out what it is? Anyhow, she chose you because her paramour dumped her, and I guess, somehow, she's feeling it now. What I surmise, though, is that there has been some kind of contact. Call her bluff: Bring it up again full force!


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## MJJEAN (Jun 26, 2015)

I don't get it. She packed up and planned to spend a weekend with her ex in a hotel with no plans to tell you, except you caught her before she could leave. Then she blatantly lied to you, went to the hotel, and had sex with her ex. You proceeded to sit around waiting for her to get home and then you married her. You married her knowing she planned and executed an affair. You married her knowing exactly what kind of person she is. So why, 26+ years later, is this even a thing? You long ago accepted being married to a remorseless cheater, so why are you having trouble now? 

And, yes, she is remorseless. You know how I can tell? Because she saw and spoke to you while packing up to go **** him. If she actually felt guilty or a shred of remorse, she'd have stopped there. She didn't. She wasn't worried about losing you when she packed up, traveled to the hotel, took off her clothes, jumped in a jacuzzi, and started stroking his penis. She wasn't worried about losing you after you called her, her lover answered the phone, and she told you she'd talk about it when she got back. If she gave a real damn, she'd have immediately left and come home to work it out or end it. What did she do? She went back to screwing her lover and wandered home when he was finished with her.

I have to agree with your wife. You stayed. You chose to stay 26+ years ago. You married her knowing who and what you married. It's time to either file papers or let it go.


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## oldtruck (Feb 15, 2018)

moulinyx said:


> Why is this a discussion 27 years into marriage? I guess I don't understand how the physical details outweigh the fact that she planned a weekend with this old flame, went through with it, and then came back to you. This should have been put to rest the second you decided to continue with the relationship. What did she confess to 7 years ago? I am confused by the original post since she already had a talk with you 27 years ago after the original deed.
> 
> I normally have unpopular opinions on here, but you can't keep punishing someone after putting it to rest nearly 30 years ago. What she did was wrong, but marrying her should have been a fresh slate. You chose this person to be your life partner knowing she did this. She shouldn't be so cold about this issue though. Id suggest changing your approach or look for ways to release the resentment. Maybe try to spice up the romance? It seems like you may be feeling insecure so its triggering those memories.


it would be punishing his WW if he got the full truth from his WW. he never got that.
all he got was 27 years of trickle truth, and the threat to leave him if he mentioned, ask
about her cheating again.

this WW is bluffing, tell her she is taking a polygraph because her lying to him is keeping
him from healing and leaving her cheating in the past.


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## Mr The Other (Feb 1, 2014)

MJJEAN said:


> I don't get it. She packed up and planned to spend a weekend with her ex in a hotel with no plans to tell you, except you caught her before she could leave. Then she blatantly lied to you, went to the hotel, and had sex with her ex. You proceeded to sit around waiting for her to get home and then you married her. You married her knowing she planned and executed an affair. You married her knowing exactly what kind of person she is. So why, 26+ years later, is this even a thing? You long ago accepted being married to a remorseless cheater, so why are you having trouble now?
> 
> And, yes, she is remorseless. You know how I can tell? Because she saw and spoke to you while packing up to go **** him. If she actually felt guilty or a shred of remorse, she'd have stopped there. She didn't. She wasn't worried about losing you when she packed up, traveled to the hotel, took off her clothes, jumped in a jacuzzi, and started stroking his penis. She wasn't worried about losing you after you called her, her lover answered the phone, and she told you she'd talk about it when she got back. If she gave a real damn, she'd have immediately left and come home to work it out or end it. What did she do? She went back to screwing her lover and wandered home when he was finished with her.
> 
> I have to agree with your wife. You stayed. You chose to stay 26+ years ago. You married her knowing who and what you married. It's time to either file papers or let it go.


The key is in the title.

When he saw he had been cheated on, he took it as something that he was responsible rather than her. He decided it was his fault, 

It is actually clear why he is here, she cheated. He is wondering what he did wrong rather than accepting he is not responsible for her actions.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

What did she confess to in 2016?

As to the beginning of your relationship and how she talks to you concerning her behavior....

You are exhibiting signs of extreme low self-worth no self-confidence and placing her on a pedestal.

She is showing entitlement, taking you for granted and absolutely no respect or real love for you.

I still have a hard time believing stuff like this exists?

Regardless of marital status, girlfriend, live in or otherwise, some bimbo takes off for a weekend with another man and she would find anything of hers that I possessed, deposited at her parents or at the guy's house she ran off with.

I wish you thought you were worth the attention and affection of a human woman instead of the lizard you are with.


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## TDSC60 (Dec 8, 2011)

What is the big secret she confessed? Another affair?

What she did 27 years ago gave you the perfect opportunity to get out of the relationship. Why did you take her back after she showed you her true character?

It is very confusing for you to start with a big secret that showed you to be living a lie for the past 4-5 years then jump to 27 years ago before marriage without telling us the current problem. You can do nothing about what happened back then but regret the path you took.


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## TDSC60 (Dec 8, 2011)

ConanHub said:


> What did she confess to in 2016?
> 
> As to the beginning of your relationship and how she talks to you concerning her behavior....
> 
> ...


Yes!

Or in the nearest dumpster!


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

I'm guessing you meant that the pre-marriage incident was dormant in your mind until about 2016, when the incident came back to a place in the forefront of your mind.

Then for about two years after 2016, you brought it up with her repetitively until she advised just stop bringing it up, or we're done.

If this isn't the case, pls advise.

Soooo, this said.

It seems you accepted her "last fling", or whatever it was, after her return 26 years ago.

For whatever reason this trouble passed, and it has been not a frequent thought for you, and not a trouble, for about 24 yrs.

Soooo, that said, why after bringing up in 2016, did you keep bringing it up and harping on it. Was there other cheating?

Because without other bad actions on her part, such as EAs, or PAs, poor boundaries, etc. that ship has ling sailed my friend. 

If my above facts are correct I'm taking a different tact here. There are two choices. 

1. Barring unless other troubles with her, the "statute of limitations" has run out for typical reasonable troubles with her on the original problem.

Now if you harp on it, it puts you in a bad light.

Or

2. If you are having an atypical response, it's now become a real issue you can't let go of for whatever reason, then you have to go all the way and divorce. 

Sooo, 

You reopening, keeping it open for whatever reason to flog her with it until you tire, then expect to go back to the good M you've had for 24 yrs, only after you get tired of bringing it up; yes, would and should be tedious and anger generating to her. And should be.

So if all has been well between you two, and this was forgotten for so long, consider she may have a point. 

It sounds like for two years you've hounded her with it after 23 great years.

That's a problem my friend. But yours.


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## oldtruck (Feb 15, 2018)

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> I'm guessing you meant that the pre-marriage incident was dormant in your mind until about 2016, when the incident came back to a place in the forefront of your mind.
> 
> Then for about two years after 2016, you brought it up with her repetitively until she advised just stop bringing it up, or we're done.
> 
> ...


This no different than any other BH that believed the trickle truth where all she did
was sit in a hot tub and giving the OM an unfinished hand job. Then whether ten, twenty
or thirty years passed and now the BH realizes his WW greatly minimized the truth.

also known as a WW lied to her BH.

FACT

1. The need for the truth never goes away.
2. The WW had no problem banging her OM, so she should have no problem answering
her BH's questions.


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## Andy1001 (Jun 29, 2016)

ConanHub said:


> What did she confess to in 2016?
> 
> As to the beginning of your relationship and how she talks to you concerning her behavior....
> 
> ...


Yeah, I agree completely. 
I find it so difficult to believe that any man would put up with this crap.
If you don’t respect yourself and understand and value what you bring to a relationship then you’re open to be walked on.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

Agreed. In a New York second. Right then, there.


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

You should have dumped her ass right then and there. Not too late to do so now...


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

moulinyx said:


> Why is this a discussion 27 years into marriage? I guess I don't understand how the physical details outweigh the fact that she planned a weekend with this old flame, went through with it, and then came back to you. This should have been put to rest the second you decided to continue with the relationship. What did she confess to 7 years ago? I am confused by the original post since she already had a talk with you 27 years ago after the original deed.
> 
> I normally have unpopular opinions on here, but you can't keep punishing someone after putting it to rest nearly 30 years ago. What she did was wrong, but marrying her should have been a fresh slate. You chose this person to be your life partner knowing she did this. She shouldn't be so cold about this issue though. Id suggest changing your approach or look for ways to release the resentment. Maybe try to spice up the romance? It seems like you may be feeling insecure so its triggering those memories.


Wow, good advice, the likes not often seen here from most, we, ourselves included!

As we see it, he has now fallen out from under her spell. 
Now, he has fallen out of love with this woman, his wife.

That old forgotten truth stands out because: good, warm fresh memories have ceased to cover up that old pain.
The old smell of betrayal fills again his nostrils, his nostrums.
Old age often brings those aching old memories freshly to mind.

He needs an excuse to bail out those old tears, to bail out the unwell water of her betrayal.

While men sleep, Karma keeps, timely.....score.
Some rusty kiss-met chain is jerking him to act.

I would put this happening to, some another, cycle repeating. 

Ach! 

This, I see no sense in repeating.
On this, I have no supporting fans blowing warm air, my way.

Memories, harshly etched in mind's bone, erode never to gone..

OH! It now hurts again. :crying:


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

Forgiving is a special act.

It requires rewriting one's moral code. And burying that hurt for forever and a pray.

When young and busy, reflection is a rare thing, in old age it can be that curse.

I believe when one is in pain and doubt, one feeds this beast with factual pain dust, this lifted from old memories.


THRD-


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

We own not our own memories, nor our own fate, and our later actions will be pushed to meet this older unraveling fate.

Some score, this score, needs to be settled.


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

Some people cannot forgive....just cannot.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

3Xnocharm said:


> You should have dumped her ass right then and there. Not too late to do so now...


Should have dumped her then, absolutely. 

Not too late to leave her now, for any good reason yes, but pick a new reason. Either a new reason, or you've been lying to her about being over something 26 yrs ago, in this case that lie is not inconsequential. 

The ship has sailed on the old original reason. Just my thoughts.


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## Adelais (Oct 23, 2013)

@55Z what was the secret that she recently confessed?

You took her back after her cheating with the exBF, and went on to get married and have been for over 2 decades.

Her recently divulged secret is key to understanding why it triggred memories from before you were married.

Was her secret that she cheated 5 years ago?


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## Mr The Other (Feb 1, 2014)

ConanHub said:


> What did she confess to in 2016?
> 
> As to the beginning of your relationship and how she talks to you concerning her behavior....
> 
> ...


It is sexism.

It is treating the woman in the relationship like a vulnerable child and the man as the grown up. If there is dysfunction in the relationship, of course you blame the grown up. In reality, women are just as responsible and grown up as men, i.e. not very.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

So there's a brand new lie in 2016? I missed that.
Similar? (maybe?)

Whoops. That's a diff can of worms..


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## jsmart (Mar 14, 2015)

She wasn't even going to tell you she was gone for the weekend? That is ice cold, which tells us that she was all in on attempting to monkey
branch back to this guy but he just took the free desert and let her return to you leaking between her legs. 

That you duped yourself to believe her lie for all of these years is hard to understand. You probably suffer from very low self esteem from having such a 
cold hearted beotch for a wife. 

There's no statue of limitations on implementing consequences for what she's done. You can D her right now if you're tired of living with an ice queen. 
D will take a few months. In that time you can prepare yourself for being on your own. I think you will be blown away at what the dating market is like 
for a man of your age vs what it was for you 30 years ago.


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## Andy1001 (Jun 29, 2016)

55Z said:


> I'm 64(M) and my wife is 53(F) been married almost 26 years and together for almost 27.
> 
> In early 2016 shortly after I had a major surgery my wife confessed to keeping a secret from me for the past 4-5 years. I am not sure why but this lie we had been living sent me back to our beginning.
> 
> ...


In the “wife vacationing with girlfriend” thread, on post #98 you said that you have a really good relationship and marriage. This was September last year. 
What suddenly changed since then?


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## Adelais (Oct 23, 2013)

jsmart said:


> There's no statue of limitations on implementing consequences for what she's done.


I would disagree, based on the circumstances. He knew what she did, and he married her anyway and has been married for 26 years. He does need to deal with his feelings, if he hasn't already, but to punish her for something he led her to believe he had forgiven her for is wrong.

If she has done something new, like cheat, then he can make decisions based on that.


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## 55Z (May 16, 2018)

My God can't believe all the responses. I'll be back in a day or two to answer some of the questions and give a more clear picture. Need to say Adelsis' last reply is the most close to reality.


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## Tatsuhiko (Jun 21, 2016)

Screw her and her ultimatum. Tell her yes, the two of you are indeed done and it's her decision as to whether she wants to win you back.

This will require honesty, true confessions, and culminate in a polygraph. Present divorce papers if she gives any pushback.

Don't EVER accept bull**** ultimatums from a lying cheater. Double down instead.


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## moulinyx (May 30, 2019)

oldtruck said:


> it would be punishing his WW if he got the full truth from his WW. he never got that.
> all he got was 27 years of trickle truth, and the threat to leave him if he mentioned, ask
> about her cheating again.
> 
> ...


What I meant is why would it matter 27 years later? He knew in his heart what happened and still married her. I know everyone has different philosophies around marriage, but I see it as a totally clean slate. He took her as his wife knowing her flaws and sins against him. Who cares if she screwed him? She planned a whole love fest weekend....the intent was there.


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## moulinyx (May 30, 2019)

55Z said:


> My God can't believe all the responses. I'll be back in a day or two to answer some of the questions and give a more clear picture. Need to say Adelsis' last reply is the most close to reality.


Not meaning to sound harsh! We may be confused. Still, looking forward to more information. Just trying to give neutral advice!


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## Lostinthought61 (Nov 5, 2013)

I say bs to just accepting her crap and I would tell you plan on taking hall passes and she can suck it up.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

Yes the whole key here is what she has recently confessed to, not what she did 27 years ago. Without knowing whether it was something serious or minor we cant possibly know how to advise.


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## manwithnoname (Feb 3, 2017)

Adelais said:


> I would disagree, based on the circumstances. He knew what she did, and he married her anyway and has been married for 26 years. He does need to deal with his feelings, if he hasn't already, but to punish her for something he led her to believe he had forgiven her for is wrong.
> 
> If she has done something new, like cheat, then he can make decisions based on that.


So what? Doesn't matter if she hasn't cheated since then. If he was on the fence back then, certainly over time he could change his mind. It wouldn't be punishing her, it would be righting a wrong...his decision to stay.


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## MJJEAN (Jun 26, 2015)

55Z said:


> My God can't believe all the responses. I'll be back in a day or two to answer some of the questions and give a more clear picture. Need to say Adelsis' last reply is the most close to reality.


Well, if she cheated again I have to ask 

A) Why are you still with her? 

and

B) What the hell you thought would happen when you married her after she had her weekend of debauchery with her ex? You took her back after she cheated on you so she has had absolutely no reason not to cheat on you. She knows you'll just sit there wringing your hands, so why not have a good time?


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## TAMAT (Jun 20, 2015)

55Z,

Yea telling you to never bring up the topic really puts the issue to bed, it highlights that she is still omitting, minimizing and denying you the tools to recover. Even more so perhaps that she never really recovered if she felt guilty about for this long.

My Wife once told me "she never wants to talk about it again" too yea douse a fire with gasoline.

Give the OM a call if he is still alive tell him you want to hear his story he may be willing to spill his guts in return for non-retaliation. If he fights rat him out to his wife.

Really two adults in a hotel room and they did the bare minimum?


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## oldtruck (Feb 15, 2018)

Adelais said:


> I would disagree, based on the circumstances. He knew what she did, and he married her anyway and has been married for 26 years. He does need to deal with his feelings, if he hasn't already, but to punish her for something he led her to believe he had forgiven her for is wrong.
> 
> If she has done something new, like cheat, then he can make decisions based on that.


there are no statue of limitations when trickle truth is involved.

new truths is a new D day and resets the recovery clock back to zero.


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## Adelais (Oct 23, 2013)

oldtruck said:


> there are no statue of limitations when trickle truth is involved.
> 
> new truths is a new D day and resets the recovery clock back to zero.


In his original post OP didn't say anything about trickle truth. He said she told him everything when she got back from the trip (and he believed her) then they married.

He is upset about something new she has told him about something that happened 5 years ago. This is a new D day that is triggering the old one.


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## Nucking Futs (Apr 8, 2013)

Weird we're over 40 posts in and we still don't know what brings the OP here.


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## Lila (May 30, 2014)

Nucking Futs said:


> Weird we're over 40 posts in and we still don't know what brings the OP here.


I agree. I am closing this thread. 
@55Z, pm me and I'll reopen it when you decide to come back and provide more information.


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## 55Z (May 16, 2018)

Some answers for you all. As far as I know there has been no other infidelity. Andy, we have had probably a typical marriage where there is some issues, but for the most part we have supported each other and LOVED each other.

Most of you are correct that I thought I had dealt with this and was satisfied both through actions and words that she was worth having as my life partner. 

Between late 2009 and early 2014 I had a devastating round with depression which the doc's gave me many different medications to counter act (none really worked). Side effect was E.D. so medication for that too, that didn't work all that well either. So in my crazed state I figured wife isn't getting enough and I don't want to loose her so I asked her if she wanted to try swinging, so in my simple mind here is a simple Yes/No question - if any of you men reading this think the same DON'T - BIG MISTAKE. See before this I would have bet the farm that both of us thing in the same way mostly Black & White with very little gray area. I was very wrong but I didn't find out for several years. 

Then we had a rather large falling out around February 2016. We had not had a very good sex life for a while and she was frustrated as I had a bad hip which was replaced 2 months prior. I was in a lot of pain for 2 years prior and she had decided it was too much for us to have sex as often as we were used to. Anyway I instigated one day and she at first resisted, I asked why and she said you are still in too much pain. To which I said I will be the person that decides that not you. We proceeded to have the best time we ever had! She then made a pillow talk confession that when I asked her the Stupid question she couldn't handle it and had to see a therapist to work though it. I was crushed that she had to go through that and felt like she could not talk to me about it. At this point I should mention that her not talking through things with me has been the most frustrating part of our marriage/relationship. Hiding this from me is what brought back the feelings of betrayal from the beginning of our relationship. And for those of you that are saying I bring it up all the time that is not the case I brought it up 3 time since and she once.

My wife is a good woman that made a bad decision 27 years ago and I cannot figure out why now this bugs me - it's frustrating as Hell.
I hope this helps you all understand and sorry my OP was not more clear. As for the ultimatum I'm sure it was made out of anger and frustration because the next time it was brought up it was her that did so.

I am not alone very often so that is why such a long time between posts - I do read your posts and appreciate everyone's input.


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## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

55Z said:


> So in my crazed state I figured wife isn't getting enough and I don't want to loose her so I asked her if she wanted to try swinging, so in my simple mind here is a simple Yes/No question - if any of you men reading this think the same DON'T - BIG MISTAKE. See before this I would have bet the farm that both of us thing in the same way mostly Black & White with very little gray area. I was very wrong but I didn't find out for several years.
> ...
> My wife is a good woman that made a bad decision 27 years ago and I cannot figure out why now this bugs me - it's frustrating as Hell.


Why is it that I find your suggestion (and apparent implementation) of "swinging" to be a pretty huge deal in all this? The effect that might have had, and knowing that it came from you, not her... is it possible you're so wracked with guilt yourself that you're trying to put those feelings off to the side by smothering them with her past mistake?


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## Cynthia (Jan 31, 2014)

You're upset that your wife hid going to therapy from you? She must not have trusted you after you asked her if you should bring other people into the marriage. Personally, if my husband did that, I would consider divorcing him. 

Have you considered having some individual counseling (IC) yourself, but telling your wife? It might help you work through all this.


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

...


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

55Z said:


> Some answers for you all. As far as I know there has been no other infidelity. Andy, we have had probably a typical marriage where there is some issues, but for the most part we have supported each other and LOVED each other.
> 
> Most of you are correct that I thought I had dealt with this and was satisfied both through actions and words that she was worth having as my life partner.
> 
> ...


Thanks for the illumination.

Your problem about 27 years ago is that it was rug swept and not fully worked out.

You have been sitting on unresolved wounds the whole relationship and she has probably been trying to bury things as well.

I would suggest you both open the can of rotten worms you should have so long ago and clean this festering wound.

It won't be easy and I guarantee it will be ugly because she behaved in a truly vile manner back then and treated you with utter contempt.

She shot you with a poison arrow many years ago and told you to snap the shaft off, leave the infected head in and cover it with a band aid. You foolishly did it and it has festered this whole time, never healing because it hasn't been dug out and your wound cleaned.

Time doesn't heal all wounds. It can sometimes make you use to the pain.

I suggest MC for both of you to address her behavior 27 years ago and how it infected and harmed you both and how to work through it.

Yes, you both still need to work through it because leaving a mess on the living room floor doesn't clean it up no matter how long you leave it there.


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## Taxman (Dec 21, 2016)

I had a client in a similar position, he had allowed her to have an indiscretion before they married. Truth be told, he wanted to end the engagement but was talked out of it by her, her mother, and his mother. It basicallly said that there was too much money to be lost on a wedding if you pull out now. So, for years he bit his tongue. He expected full and complete truth from his wife, he would not take even the suggestion that she was breaking boundaries. About ten years in, she got too close to another employee. He caught several flirting texts. He gave her adequate warning, but the texts continued. There was one in particular where the EAP remarked that he wanted to go to the next level. My client, in short, freaked. He caught the text shortly after dinner. The noise of dishes breaking could be heard for miles. His screams at her were even more disturbing. All of the resentment came out. His bottom line, "I got talked out of leaving a **** before I was stuck with her, but NO MORE. He went absolutely ballistic. He had her and the other guy fired. He threatened a lawsuit against their company, the company had no alternative. He outed her affair from before they were married. People were approaching him asking why he went through with it in the first place. He placed blame on her and her mom. By the time he was done, his STBXW's family were made outcast. He painted them as having bullied him into marriage with a woman of questionable morals. It totally wrecked her. People she had known all of her life turned their backs. At the end, her and her family settled quietly. The second affair was not much of a much, but it brought forth the resentments of a decade ago.


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## moulinyx (May 30, 2019)

You sound like you are suffering from not feeling like you are enough for her. The infidelity at the start of your relationship set the tone for this, and I agree with other posters that this problem was not fully worked out. Out of fear for your wive's sexual fulfillment, you soiled your marital vows. I would be pissed if my husband wanted another man to fulfill his place in our bedroom. She probably felt a similar feeling after you seemingly were okay with another man "having her". I am sure some couples out there think swinging is great, but the majority would view this as damaging. Of course that hurt! And then you again felt fear after your hip surgery. It seems like you two really do love each other, but fear is causing horrible disconnects in your marriage. 

I have no idea how to help you through the crappy feeling you have, but IC is probably a good move. I could be wrong, but this scenario seems more like something you have to figure out how to work through and let go of. I bet your wife would be more receptive if you talked about going to IC to make your marriage stronger again. I respond better to my husband telling me he is struggling with a certain thing (I am a fixer) rather than using attacking words. Maybe try that out and see how she responds?


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## [email protected] (Dec 23, 2017)

I am sorry, 55z. But I think you know that you were ( or are) Plan B. In the back of your mind you know that she settled for you. You deserve better, even at this late date.


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## 55Z (May 16, 2018)

Thanks again everyone. Moulinyx you are the one that has the closest idea as to our relationship. Most of you have endured much worse in your marriages than what I went through, so I get your responses. However 27 to 26 years ago we worked on our relationship, made sure there was no one else in the picture for either of us and decided to marry. We were seeing a therapist this past summer trying to figure a way to deal with a child issue, at the end of the sessions we were getting to our own relationship issues but had to put those on hold for other priorities. I think I will see the therapist myself first then back to both of us. I appreciate everyone's insight.


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## StillSearching (Feb 8, 2013)

"I asked her if we are done"...well that's a bad precedent you set there.


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## moulinyx (May 30, 2019)

55Z said:


> Thanks again everyone. Moulinyx you are the one that has the closest idea as to our relationship. Most of you have endured much worse in your marriages than what I went through, so I get your responses. However 27 to 26 years ago we worked on our relationship, made sure there was no one else in the picture for either of us and decided to marry. We were seeing a therapist this past summer trying to figure a way to deal with a child issue, at the end of the sessions we were getting to our own relationship issues but had to put those on hold for other priorities. I think I will see the therapist myself first then back to both of us. I appreciate everyone's insight.


Happy to provide some insight/help! Again, I hope I didn't come off too scrutinizing. I get why you made the choices you did (I also make choices out of fear), but I believe you two can come together and heal this wound. This may be the best thing ever for your marriage! You are right to start with IC and sprinkle in some MC after you unpack some of your burdens/resentments. 

Marriage is hard but very rewarding. Best of luck!


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## [email protected] (Dec 23, 2017)

55z, she hid the IC from you. Not surprising. When she's in session, I'd bet she's focusing on what to do about her lost love. And that isn't you, of course.


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## moulinyx (May 30, 2019)

[email protected] said:


> 55z, she hid the IC from you. Not surprising. When she's in session, I'd bet she's focusing on what to do about her lost love. And that isn't you, of course.


Did you even read his post? She went to IC after he suggested swinging after their sex life hit a slump. That is probably the dumbest response I have read on the forum. She went to IC to figure out how to react and process the proposition.


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## Plan 9 from OS (Jul 13, 2012)

55Z said:


> Thanks again everyone. Moulinyx you are the one that has the closest idea as to our relationship. Most of you have endured much worse in your marriages than what I went through, so I get your responses. However 27 to 26 years ago we worked on our relationship, made sure there was no one else in the picture for either of us and decided to marry. We were seeing a therapist this past summer trying to figure a way to deal with a child issue, at the end of the sessions we were getting to our own relationship issues but had to put those on hold for other priorities. I think I will see the therapist myself first then back to both of us. I appreciate everyone's insight.


I assume you realize that fairy tales are bull****. There is no such thing as that "one true love", "soulmates" or other such tripe. You may have had a pretty good run of 27 years, but it also could have been just as good of a run if not better with someone else who did not cheat on you. She must have been a knockout back then for you to have rugswept it and married her despite the cheating. If that's true, then it's truly a shame that you would allow superficial things to crowd out the more important things in life. Apologies, but this is my best guess at what happened. 

Look in the mirror. That's who you truly resent in all of this.


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## jsmart (Mar 14, 2015)

You've done MC that seems to have helped with issues in the marriage but when it 
comes to dealing with what's bugging you, the counseling gets shelved? You say things 
are well but you started this thread because something in your gut was not right. 

It seems like a lot of the consensus opinions have rattled you and you're now painting
a better picture of the marriage to help you feel better about fearfully rug sweeping.
Even though you decided to marry her after she had a sexcation with her ex, it doesn't mean 
you can't work on the deep emotional scar she inflicted on you. 

Being there for each other should go both ways but I get a sense that you have to suppress 
your hurt because you fear looking at the real truth of what actually happened on that weekend 
will anger her and that she doesn't have the patience or desire to help heal the wound. 
That is not love. After 3 decades together, she should be eager willing to be honest of what
she actually did and help heal you.


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## Cynthia (Jan 31, 2014)

[email protected] said:


> 55z, she hid the IC from you. Not surprising. When she's in session, I'd bet she's focusing on what to do about her lost love. And that isn't you, of course.


Ih brother! She was probably trying to deal with her husband suggesting they have sex with other people. That's the most obvious. Trying to make her into the devil helps no one. 

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk


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## Marduk (Jul 16, 2010)

I'm having a devil of a time trying to sort through and track the timeline of events. They don't really jive with your first post, and I'm confused.

So let me play back what I think I've pieced together:

1992: You get together. She cheats on you with her ex, and you catch her. You move in with her anyway.

1993: You get married.

2009: You have depression.

2009-2011???: Somewhere between 2009 and 2011 you get erectile dysfunction, and offer an open marriage/swinging to your wife to compensate for this. 

2011: She does something. Starts therapy on her own without telling you maybe? She goes looking for help after you suggest swinging, or were there other reasons, perhaps your depression?

2014: You sort out your depression. You get your hip replaced.

2016: She confesses to seeing a therapist without telling you.

Now: you're feeling betrayed and feelings from her cheating in 1992 resurface for you.

Do I have this timeline right? Can you fill in any gaps?


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## jsmart (Mar 14, 2015)

I'm confused on the suggestion to swing. Did his wife secretly go to therapy 
because OP asked if she wanted to swing or because they or she on her own 
actually did go through with it and she had issues dealing with her feelings? 

Her secretly going to therapy to deal with the swinging doesn't really make
sense if she was not into OP. Could the real reason be to deal with guilt for
another affair or her dealing withdrawal from an affair partner? Her coldly 
telling you not to bring up her sexcation or else doesn't match someone being 
bent out of shape by a husband asking about swinging.

You really need to do more digging because what's clear to most here is that you
posted on an infidelity board because your gut is not a peace with your marriage
and hasn't been for a long time. I would not be the least surprise if there have
been a few affairs during your marriage.


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## 55Z (May 16, 2018)

She went to therapy because I asked if that was what she wanted and she took it the same way one of the other posters here took it (I think it was Cynthia?). It was during a conversation about my lowered drive and ED combined. Remember this when I being treated for moderate + depression with meds that took away my drive and gave me ED. She thought I didn't care about her anymore, but it was just the opposite that drove me to that question. Anyway she went to the therapist she said 4 times @ an hour each. What I got after 4 hours of therapy was just a No. We left it at that and tried to find other things that worked better for us. It helped that I recovered but at the end of my depression she was going through menopause which took away her drive at times (not consistently). So as it became evident that menopause was over we started dates at least once per week and I do my best to get her to talk with me about any issues. Compared to many of you here I have it great. And just for the record I did not start this in the Infidelity forum a MOD moved it here.


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

There are some Threads that stitch up their own marital tears sufficiently.

Based on what he has written, I forgive 55Z's wife, and applaud him, on his 'final' decision.
He loves his gal, more than she deserves.

She did a rotten deed at the beginning, but repeated it not, again. To anyone's knowledge.

She did that counseling to keep herself in the marriage.

He offered her another 'stand in' man to keep her happy and to keep her home. 
He did it out of fear and out of the goodness and love of his heart.
It was a terribly foolish thing to say, naturally.

Forgive and prosper.


Lilith-


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## Tdbo (Sep 8, 2019)

3Xnocharm said:


> You should have dumped her ass right then and there. Not too late to do so now...



This, one thousand X's over!


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