# Question for females



## Bodhitree (Dec 29, 2011)

I got such good feedback last time I'm posting here again. If you remember, I've been with same woman 20 years never married. Lots of hard feelings over the years between us, but we are in MC and are making strides. We are reconciling after EA last fall. A few weeks ago had a huge fight. She has been acting weird lately and says that she is getting the same feelings that she had before about the relationship that led her to almost leaving (the entire relationship) last fall. She says any time we fight like that , warning signs go off that things are just like they always were. This in turn has made me feel like our entire relationship hinges on her feelings after a fight or when we have an argument. She is fighting these feelings she says and says she understands they are telling her we have an awful relationship etc. not worth keeping. She says she knows they are her own issues about commitment and fights them. My question to you females is this: does this sound realistic? Should she have to work that hard to want to stay in it or can raw feelings cause this conflict inside? She says she loves me dearly and wants to be with me. It feels like every time we fight, she wants to run away from the relationship- she pretty much admits her feelings get ultra sensitive when it happens. But then after things calm down she wants to pursue the relationship, finally get married etc., seems happy and loving. So, we are both really confused. Any input is very welcome.


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## Chelle D (Nov 30, 2011)

I'm almost wondering if hormones are an issue. (Is she premenopausal age?) I don't mean to sound like some men I know & jump on the "its that time of the month" wagon. 

I am speaking from experience. When I fight with hubby now... I get very unsure of myself & emotions run rampant & I can go way overboard with "do I want this relationship" thoughts... At least right then at that moment after a disagreement.

I never used to be like that. Sure, I liked & wanted hugs & re-assurance from him before... But Now.... geessh,, It's like I NEED those hugs & telling me everything will be alright. I NEED to know that he still wants me. I might have been somewhat insecure before, but the hormones have blown it out of proportion sometimes. Especially if I pick a fight & then he doesn't react the way I wanted. (sad, but beginning to see it's true)

If that is part of her problem, a talk with a doctor & some meds could make all the difference in the world.


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## norajane (Feb 7, 2012)

> She says she knows they are her own issues about commitment and fights them.
> 
> She says she loves me dearly and wants to be with me. It feels like every time we fight, she wants to run away from the relationship- she pretty much admits her feelings get ultra sensitive when it happens. But then after things calm down she wants to pursue the relationship, finally get married etc., seems happy and loving


I understand this. I don't have commitment issues, but I do have intimacy issues (not sex, intimacy). So when it became clear that our relationship was serious and we became closer, I started to feel nervous and antsy about it. 

The closer we became and the more time we spent together and the more emotionally intimate we became, the more anxious it made me feel. I used to have what I called "epic battles" in my head where I would feel like pulling away and would have to talk myself back into relaxing and enjoying our relationship. I would have to fight against pulling away.

It helped me to know that my epic battles weren't because I didn't love him or didn't want him or didn't want "us". I knew that I was struggling due to my intimacy issues - I was self-sabotaging. I knew that if I could work my way through the intimacy fears, I would stop having those panicked feelings of needing to run away.

In the end, that is exactly what made things better. I worked though my fears with my bf's help, we talked about a lot of the things that were holding me back, and I kept fighting those epic battles in my head until they became smaller and disappeared.

Don't be discouraged! You can work through this, especially since your wife is so self-aware that her feelings of wanting to run away are due to her commitment issues. Be patient, don't push. When she feels like running away, back off a little so she doesn't feel pressured. As you have already seen, she comes back again when she's relaxed a little about it.

Progress will be two steps forward, one step back. 

If she isn't making progress through her commitment issues, a therapist might be able to help. Those fears stem from something in her past, so they may need to come out and be addressed. I was able to work through my fears with my bf, but I knew where my fears came from.


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## Mavash. (Jan 26, 2012)

I have ptsd, abandonment issues, intimacy issues, and I'm perimenopausal....in short I'm a mess. LOL

3 rounds of therapy, hormones and I still have to fight negative feelings towards my husband sometimes. I'm a 1,000% better than I was but it took some serious work on my part.

So for me...it's normal.


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## Bodhitree (Dec 29, 2011)

Awesome feedback ladies. I realize that in my 40's I am very ignorant. My biggest issue is that I try to "fix" the situation. When she doesn't feel "right" I want to make it right and giving her space is the last thing I want to do. This makes it worse she says. Anyway, thank you all SOOOO MUCCHH for this, you describe EXACTLY what is happening and what she says is happening. God Bless each of you!!!!


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

If you want the relationship so bad, why can't you control yourself and STOP the fight before it happens?


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## Mavash. (Jan 26, 2012)

turnera said:


> If you want the relationship so bad, why can't you control yourself and STOP the fight before it happens?


I was thinking the same thing. My husband doesn't fight with me so I don't have that anxiety on top of everything else I'm dealing with. We have calm discussions yes but no fighting. And if one of us gets too emotional (usually me) I end the conversation until I calm down.


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## norajane (Feb 7, 2012)

Mavash. said:


> I was thinking the same thing. My husband doesn't fight with me so I don't have that anxiety on top of everything else I'm dealing with. We have calm discussions yes but no fighting. And if one of us gets too emotional (usually me) I end the conversation until I calm down.


I second and third this. My bf has major patience and does not escalate things when I'm emotional. He recognizes it and speaks very calmly with me. That helps me to recognize what's going on, and to either calm down myself so we can discuss or so I can table it until I'm more "myself".


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

My STBXW always had a beef with me in that I refused to openly escalate a verbal fight with her, saying to me that I did not want/like confrontation with/from her. Is that a bad trait, or does she have any validity to her argument?


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Smart people don't NEED to argue - they discuss until they reach mutually beneficial agreement.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

turnera said:


> Smart people don't NEED to argue - they discuss until they reach mutually beneficial agreement.


Thanks, turnera! You don't know how much that I needed to hear that!


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## Mavash. (Jan 26, 2012)

To me all arguments and fighting accomplish is creating more stress and raising your blood pressure. Pointless. I prefer a calm discussion.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

So there are calm people out there other than myself? Guess I'll just need to look a little harder the next time that I choose to get romantically involved!


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## SlowlyGettingWiser (Apr 7, 2012)

Bodhitree:

Just a bit of advice on men's vs. women's perspective. Men want to 'fix' things. Women want to 'vent'. 

Example:
When I would come home from work and start b!tching about it, my BF would start giving me advice on how to fix the situation. I told him, "I don't want advice. I KNOW how to fix it." He asked, "Then what do you want?" I told him, "I want you to tell me I'm right. I want you to tell me that they're a bunch of assh*les who don't appreciate me and don't deserve my hard work." He said, "Then you don't want any advice?" I said, nope and he said okay.

This is a basic difference I've observed between men and women. If I had talked to a girlfriend about work, she would have AUTOMATICALLY known that I wanted support and righteous indignation on my behalf, not advice UNLESS I specifically asked for her advice on how to handle the situation.

Not sure this will help you in YOUR particular situation, but just a little nugget to tuck away in the back of your mind for future use. And if you could pass the info on to other men, we women would appreciate it!!! We don't always want you to fix things. We want you to listen, validate us, and DON'T offer an opinion unless we say, "What do you think I should do?"


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

Slowly:

What you said makes perfectly good sense to me! Please carry on, m'dear!


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## norajane (Feb 7, 2012)

arbitrator said:


> My STBXW always had a beef with me in that I refused to openly escalate a verbal fight with her, saying to me that I did not want/like confrontation with/from her. Is that a bad trait, or does she have any validity to her argument?


It depends on the circumstances. 

Do you avoid all discussion of any conflict between you? She might be getting upset that you two never end up addressing the problems in your marriage. 

She may be verbally aggressive to get a reaction, any reaction, out of you because she is at the end of her rope, and nothing else is working to get your attention, or she might feel frustrated that you aren't taking her concerns seriously.

Do you try to address issues otherwise, or avoid them completely?


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## Browncoat (Mar 25, 2012)

turnera said:


> Smart people don't NEED to argue - they discuss until they reach mutually beneficial agreement.


I disagree violently ... arrrrggggg. Let's argue needlessly about this. 

Seriously though, I agree.

Bodhitree, sounds like you need a lot more peace in your house. Part of it is that you may put up with more verbal abuse than you really need to. At times it's ok to just go out for a walk if she's being unreasonable and you might loose your own cool.

At times when my wife gets upset and if I'm not sure why I just try and hug her and ask her what's really on her mind. If it doesn't make sense, then I just keep trying to explore and see if we can get to the bottom of it. Mostly I just try and prompt her to talk and I listen, and try and take things in stride even if sometimes you don't like what you hear.

As they say: A gentle answer turns away wrath.


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## Bodhitree (Dec 29, 2011)

I'll say it again- Ladies Lounge rocks! I've always been such a black and white person that the subtleties of what a woman is really asking for have escaped me. My SO has done a 180 since her affair and I'm just trying to adjust and learn. I have to admit I'm caught in my old patterns with her- she had always been so accommodating (not saying that was good) and now she isn't any more. I have looked inward to try to separate the wheat from the chaff so to speak i.e. what is legit on her part and what isn't. She acts like she wants the relationship but then like I say has times when I think she says "screw it". That puts me in a very uncomfortable spot. I feel like she should either be 100% in or we should look at separating. The feedback here is telling me it is very likely a fear based thing about commitment that is causing some of her volatility. Any way- thank you all again. Very good forum.


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## Mrs. T (Aug 5, 2011)

Whose EA was it? I have a response but it will only make sense depending on your answer.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Have you two read His Needs Her Needs?


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

norajane said:


> It depends on the circumstances.
> 
> Do you avoid all discussion of any conflict between you? She might be getting upset that you two never end up addressing the problems in your marriage.
> 
> ...


Norajane:

STBXW and I always had a standing agreement to try to discuss anything that came up between us. On the subject of finances, she was incomplete, at best, on providing answers on her part, but would attempt to pick me apart like a Thanksgiving turkey, if I even spent $5. She didn't like me querrying about the lavish worldwide trips she took and would intentionally say that that was none of my business. But any miniscule expense that I made was torn apart better than a seasoned auditor could do. Because I couldn't remember certain details about it, she then tore into me with a rage of a banshee. I'll be the first to say that I'm a non-confrontational guy, always having believed in the mantra of "being able to to draw more flies with honey than vinegar." I've always been able to get through differences in any facet of my life with constructive discussion rather than with blatant screaming and criticism.

Conversely, if I ever found fault with her no-account kids, albeit their drugs and alcohol that they kept stashed around the house, their blatant laziness, and their many run-ins with the legal authorities and told her about it, she would fly into an absolute rage saying that they were none of my business and to butt-out. I contended that it was my business since my own kids were living in the house as well. She then started screaming and blaming me as a major part of her kids problems. Sorry, but I can't help but feel that that's just a tad delusional on her part!

My whole take on this thing was that she acted that way primarily because she was clandestinely active into the process of detaching from me while giving long-range planning to our separation/divorce process, plain and simple!


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## Bodhitree (Dec 29, 2011)

I have not- is it a book or is it a link or where can I find it?


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## Bodhitree (Dec 29, 2011)

Mrs. T said:


> Whose EA was it? I have a response but it will only make sense depending on your answer.


It was her EA fyi


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## AFEH (May 18, 2010)

Bodhitree said:


> I'll say it again- Ladies Lounge rocks! I've always been such a black and white person that the subtleties of what a woman is really asking for have escaped me. My SO has done a 180 since her affair and I'm just trying to adjust and learn. I have to admit I'm caught in my old patterns with her- she had always been so accommodating (not saying that was good) and now she isn't any more. I have looked inward to try to separate the wheat from the chaff so to speak i.e. what is legit on her part and what isn't. She acts like she wants the relationship but then like I say has times when I think she says "screw it". That puts me in a very uncomfortable spot. I feel like she should either be 100% in or we should look at separating. The feedback here is telling me it is very likely a fear based thing about commitment that is causing some of her volatility. Any way- thank you all again. Very good forum.


Ask her to retake your vows. If she says no, end it. Your marriage will not work if there’s not 100% commitment from both of you, till death you do part and you will forever feel insecure. That’s no way to live your life.


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## AFEH (May 18, 2010)

airplane888 said:


> refusing to fight all the time is the same as the silent treatment - It's called being passive aggressive and it sucks being on the end of it and it is just as bad as giving your spouse the finger
> 
> learning to fight fair is what is required in a marriage
> 
> airplane


Yes, it’s constructive confrontation.

Passive aggression sucks. It’s a total mismanagement of anger, such that the anger is always there, it never goes away because it’s never confronted and resolved.

What’s left is seething resentment which longer term becomes pathological embitterment, which day by day just kills any love that’s left.

Resentment and pathological embitterment are used to justify all sorts of abusive behaviour.


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## Mavash. (Jan 26, 2012)

airplane888 said:


> refusing to fight all the time is the same as the silent treatment - It's called being passive aggressive and it sucks being on the end of it and it is just as bad as giving your spouse the finger
> 
> learning to fight fair is what is required in a marriage
> 
> airplane


My husband used to be PA and silent but now that we DISCUSS problems he doesn't do this anymore. But fight? Oh no he won't fight with me. Absolutely not. He's a conflict avoidant so I have to approach him with niceness and a calm voice if I want him to open up to me.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Refusing to fight is just fine, in fact better...as long as you replace it with safe discussion.


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## AFEH (May 18, 2010)

Mavash. said:


> My husband used to be PA and silent but now that we DISCUSS problems he doesn't do this anymore. But fight? Oh no he won't fight with me. Absolutely not. He's a conflict avoidant so I have to approach him with niceness and a calm voice if I want him to open up to me.


One of the problems with conflict avoidant’s is not knowing they have a problem! And if you don’t know a problem exists there’s no way it can be resolved. And so the problem exists forever, it’s always there. That’s what resentment is all about! It’s unresolved, dreadfully managed anger.

If it goes on for more than 6 months then the person is considered to pathologically embittered. In that the anger is totally unreasonable most especially when the person is still living with and taking from the person who caused the anger in the first place.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Bodhitree said:


> I have not- is it a book or is it a link or where can I find it?


 You can get HNHN at most bookstores or probably order it online. It's by Harley. It shows you how to have a healthy marriage that both people will enjoy.


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