# Not Sure if My Wife is Having an Emotional Affair - Need Opinions



## HopingImWrong (Jun 22, 2012)

OK - so here is my story.

My wife and I have been married for 12 years now, and up until now everything has been great. We've always had a great relationship, don't argue much (and when we do we never hold a grudge, we say what's on our mind and within hours are back to normal) and there have never have been any issues with infidelity or mistrust whatsoever. Lately, however, I am not so sure.

5 weeks ago, we had our son's 7th birthday party at a Lazer Tag place, and the owner of the place was really nice. He let my youngest son, who is 3 and shouldn't have been in there at all, go in for free because he was upset and generally went out of his way to make our party great. Well he and my wife get to talking and we find out he is a cyclist who has gone so far as to try out for the Olympics. The reason this matters is because my wife is a triathlete. So they start talking about riding together and setup a time to do so. He even asked me if I would mind and I told him no - harmless enough I thought.

Fast forward a few weeks and now he is training her full time. Not only do they see each other almost every day for several hours but the thing that really made we wonder is that last weekend, I saw her phone going off almost all day. I checked the logs in our wireless account and come to find out that they've exchanged over 1000 texts in the 5 weeks now that they've known each other. On top of that, they've had numerous lengthy conversations.

I did confont her about it and she said that she has nothing to hide and that most of their conversations are about training but that they do talk about other stuff i.e. his business, kids, etc. She is adamant that nothing inappropriate has ever been exchanged. When I did confront her, she was not defensive at all, she told me she felt bad for making my feel this way at all but that she was learning a lot from him. We talked about her previous trainer whom she just ditched for this guy, and I do know that her previous trainer doesn't help her at all as much as this guy has in the past 5 weeks. The last one (female) would also do the same triathalons with my wife and is very competitive and my wife felt like she didn't give her all to training her because she didn't want her to beat her and that's why she is so relieved to find someone that is actually training her - stuff like monitoring heart rate, nutrition, etc. - the old trainer didn't guide her on so I can see that for sure.

We've made love several times since I confronted her, she's cried and told me how much she loves me but she did also say she wishes I would just trust her and that she absolutely has no connection or feelings for this guy at all.

Now the other caviat to this is she is signed up for an Iron Man in July and she is pretty scared about it. It's long and it will be a really big challenge for her. Her last trainer was not doing much to prepare and I can see that this new guy has helped her tremendously. But he did also travel 2 hours to the race course on a Saturday to scope it out for her and help adjust her training. That was kinda wierd to me. It just seems like they are spending a lot of energy with each other and have only known each other for 5 weeks.


So here are the red flags:

1. The texts continue and in the same large numbers. Now she knows I can see how many texts take place by looking at our account online, but yet I would think that if she knows how I feel she would stop. 
2. She only has phone conversations with him when I am not around....i.e. when she is out running errands or something.
3. I've checked her phone and all of her text conversations from him were always deleted.
4. She seems very careful to guard her phone.

Now some of the reasons I feel like maybe I am going overboard:

1. Since I've confronted her, she has been more open about him. She talks to me about their conversations, and I don't ask she just freely talks about them.
2. They both want all of us to have dinner (he is married) - so my wife and I and his wife and him.
3. Our relationship is still great. She doesn't act any different towards me, we still talk, etc.

I am so confused right now. She has given me both reasons to trust her and reasons to be concerned.

So I am asking for feedback from this community, based on your past experiences, what your opinions are.

Thank you in advance for any advice you can give me.


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## t_hopper_2012 (Apr 17, 2012)

If you read other threads on this forum, you'll see that the deleted texts and "phone guarding" are a massive red flag.

Has she ever guarded her phone before? If not, this makes this red flag that much bigger.

It seems that you've got two ways to go. One: be direct and open with her about your concerns. Tell her that you don't feel that you're getting the full story and that she needs to be completely open with you. Ask her why she is guarding her phone and why she feels the need to delete the texts. If nothing is going on, then there should be no need to delete them.

Two (which many on this site would recommend): install spyware on her phone ASAP. Don't confront until you have more solid evidence. Unfortunately, this may be the way to go. She knows that she has something to hide (100's of deleted texts) and she denies it. Approach number one (open and honest) has not worked so far.

You need to get on this as soon as you can - before the EA goes PA.

Good luck. Be strong.


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## Alyosha (Feb 27, 2012)

1000s of text messages deleted?

That's a lot of effort if those communications are all strictly about training. What would be the point? Does she delete all her other texts as well? If not, this is very suspect behavior.

However, the fact that she doesn't act any differently towards you is a major indication that nothing untoward is happening there, imo.

I went through this exact thing. Discovered thousands of text messages and long calls at odd hours to the same number but this was definitely accompanied by my wife distancing herself from me, starting fights over nothing etc. etc. The change in behavior is what tipped me off to look at the phone records.

Could be just training. My advice: Be cool but candid. I'd ask her straight up not to delete anymore texts so that you can read them and see how she reacts. Put little stock in what she says. Watch what she does.


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## Amplexor (Feb 13, 2008)

HopingImWrong said:


> 1. Since I've confronted her, she has been more open about him. She talks to me about their conversations, and I don't ask she just freely talks about them.


This is not necessarily a positive. She is validating to herself that the relationship is OK because you are *OK* with it. She may very well be in denial as to what this relationship is. She has stated that nothing inappropriate has happened and that is possible. Have you discussed the concept of an EA with her?


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## HopingImWrong (Jun 22, 2012)

Amplexor said:


> Have you discussed the concept of an EA with her?


I have not discussed this concept with her.

Part of me does wonder if she does need him on an emotional level because of the support he is giving her and the help he is giving her (that her old trainer didn't) as this will help her get through her Iron Man race in a few weeks. 

Just not sure what my next move is.

Like t_hopper_2012 says I have two ways I can go.

Have another conversation with her or take the high road, don't let her see me concerned and start to collect evidence.


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

hell, I would be worried it's gone PA by now

what kind of phone? if it's an iphone, does she sync it thru a computer for backups?


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## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

HopingImWrong said:


> 2. She only has phone conversations with him when I am not around....i.e. *when she is out running errands or something*.
> 3. I've checked her phone and all of her text conversations from him were always deleted.
> 4. She seems very careful to guard her phone.


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

What phone? You can retrieve them if it is an iphone

Also, 1000's of texts is inappropriate number even if the relationship is platonic..The calls and deleted texts are even bigger red flags.

If you aren't f*cked already, you are about to be. Act fast.


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## Sara8 (May 2, 2012)

The crying after sex is a red flag of guilt.. 

The massive texting is a red flag.

The affirmations of love could be a mask. 

The dinners for all of you together could be a mask to deceive both spouses. 

This is an out of control emotional affair. 

Stop it now before it becomes physical, if it hasn't already.


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## HopingImWrong (Jun 22, 2012)

warlock07 said:


> What phone? You can retrieve them if it is an iphone
> 
> Also, 1000's of texts is inappropriate number even if the relationship is platonic..The calls and deleted texts are even bigger red flags.
> 
> If you aren't f*cked already, you are about to be. Act fast.


It is an iphone. And I can retreive all of the deleted texts?

How do I do this?


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## LookingForTheSun (Dec 28, 2011)

If they are already spending 3 hours a day with each other training, why can't they discuss what they have to then - why additional calls and texts - and crying during/after sex is bad, bad, bad. I pray for you that nothing physical has happened yet, but you need to stop it now. Never give your spouse permission to spend time with someone of the opposite sex.


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## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

HopingImWrong said:


> It is an iphone. And I can retreive all of the deleted texts?
> 
> How do I do this?


*Decipher TextMessage*

How to save / export SMS messages to your computer. Windows or Mac. Decipher TextMessage.










*iPhone Backup Extractor*

iPhone Backup Extractor for Windows and Mac










*MobileSyncBrowser
for Mac + PC*

MobileSyncBrowser | View and Recover your iPhone data


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Tell her that if she deletes one more text from him, you will help her move out.


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## Amplexor (Feb 13, 2008)

Your wife and marriage are in a dangerous position. The biggest flag to me just as in a work related EA is the amount of communication outside of their "required" time together and the deletion of the texts and calls. That is deception so she knows what is going on isn't proper. At this point I would plan out a very straight forward discussion with her. Express your concerns with this relationship. Discuss the deleted texts and how that looks. Discuss how his wife might feel about this. Determine your boundaries in relationship to this man and state those clearly. If that is no contact (And I think is should be) then be clear about it and the consequences. If she accepts your boundaries then be sure you follow up in monitoring her actions. If she doesn't then you know you have a serious problem.


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

Don't tell her that yet. She will cover her tracks. Get the backup first.


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## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

She knows exactly what she's doing is wrong, otherwise she wouldn't be deleting all her conversations with him. Yes, get the back ups before confronting her or run the risk of her taking it underground with a secret cell phone.


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## HopingImWrong (Jun 22, 2012)

The big problem is trying to get the backups without her knowing as she is near her phone all the time.

And if I ask her to pull the deleted texts, and by chance there really is nothing inappropriate, then that would be very bad.


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## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

HopingImWrong said:


> The big problem is trying to get the backups without her knowing as she is near her phone all the time.
> 
> And if I ask her to pull the deleted texts, and by chance there really is nothing inappropriate, then that would be very bad.


If she syncs her phone on a regular basis, then the back ups are on the computer. Of course, the latest backup is on the phone. How about when she goes in the shower or when she sleeps?


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## Halien (Feb 20, 2011)

HopingImWrong said:


> And if I ask her to pull the deleted texts, and by chance there really is nothing inappropriate, then that would be very bad.


Why would it be bad? The content of the texts might not be inappropriate, but thousands of deleted texts to another man IS inappropriate. Period. She does not get to write the rules of your personal boundaries. She only gets to decide if she is willing to live within normal boundaries.

When someone crosses the boundaries that make a normal, healthy husband or wife feel that the security of the marriage is now in jeopardy, playing the game of arguing about the content of texts, missing time, and possible deceptions only establishes their new relationship with the other man as a credible, acceptable relationship. Make this discussion about what types of relationships are acceptable for a healthy marriage, and keep this as a baseline. Sure, you need to try to monitor those discussions for further evidence, but even if they are spotless, the relationship iteself is inappropriate. She knows you are watching. If she has half a brain, her relationship with this man is being built when they are together, like when they first hit it off. 

Normal, professional groundrules are common for trainers and instructors. This is not a professional relationship.


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## Amplexor (Feb 13, 2008)

I'm generally in the minority here but that's fine. You know your wife, we don't. I would confront her directly and read her reactions. Be clear in your objectives. You obviously have a problem with this relationship so she needs to be accountable for her actions. There are too many red flags for either of you to ignore. If she refuses to honor your boundaries or share the required information then you go stealth. Put all your concerns and requirements on the table and see how she reacts. You should be be able to get some kind of read off of her.


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## aug (Aug 21, 2011)

HopingImWrong said:


> The big problem is trying to get the backups without her knowing as she is near her phone all the time.
> 
> *And if I ask her to pull the deleted texts, and by chance there really is nothing inappropriate, then that would be very bad*.



No, not correct. She already knows that you are suspicious. Ask her to pull the deleted texts. She should be helping you relieve your concerns. If she has nothing to hide, she will. If she wont, then you know she gone too far.


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## t_hopper_2012 (Apr 17, 2012)

Does she synch her iPhone with a Mac or PC? If so, you can follow the steps outlined here:

Way to retrieve deleted text messages from iphone - Truth About Deception


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## aug (Aug 21, 2011)

I dont see why you dont just grab her phone anyways. She's already knows your concern. If she has nothing to hide, why doesnt she let you have a good look.


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

HopingImWrong said:


> The big problem is trying to get the backups without her knowing as she is near her phone all the time.
> 
> And if I ask her to pull the deleted texts, and by chance there really is nothing inappropriate, then that would be very bad.


Oh boy, one more red flag. Does she have a passcode too? 

Get it when she is asleep or something


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

HopingImWrong said:


> The big problem is trying to get the backups without her knowing as she is near her phone all the time.


I can't remember if it was on this forum, but there is a guy who posted yesterday that he literally took his wife's phone and RAN out of the house and RAN to a few blocks away, and downloaded all the stuff. Then he came home and set the phone down and let her have it back. Boy, did that work! Got all the proof he needed.

What's she gonna do, call the cops on you? 

Remember, your marriage can survive her anger. It can't survive another man. Man up and accept her anger. Plan ahead on how to transfer the files, grab her phone, and get what you need.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

HopingImWrong said:


> And if I ask her to pull the deleted texts, and by chance there really is nothing inappropriate, then that would be very bad.


 Translation: My wife has turned me into a doormat and I can't handle her being mad at me. If I try to see if she's cheating and don't get the proof, she'll yell at me.


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## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

turnera said:


> Translation: My wife has turned me into a doormat and I can't handle her being mad at me. If I try to see if she's cheating and don't get the proof, she'll yell at me.


:iagree:

She's already deleting all texts and hiding conversations with him, that's *ALREADY* very bad. She's obviously not worried about making him mad...yet he's still worried about her feelings. Its the usual betrayed spouse smog alright.


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

I'll have to respectfully disagree with amp

you already approached her and essentially got gaslighted

time to get those texts, if she's done a recent back up then you dont even need her phone. 



btw-read the newbie link in my signature


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## anonymouskitty (Jun 5, 2012)

Don't tell her to do anything mate especially as someone said "Tell her that if she deletes one more text, you will help her move out". You need to dig deep here and go dark. VAR's, Keyloggers, cellphone spy software...... do all this without giving a trace of suspicion. 

Trust me, if you voice your concerns now, she is going to become extra careful and extra secretive .

My guess is that this has already turned into a full blown PA.I could be wrong but always expect for the best and prepare for the worst.


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## mina (Jun 14, 2012)

If my DH had a suspicion and he asked me for my phone I would give it to him. If I was innocent I'd have nothing to hide. If I was guilty I would expect to be caught. If I was doing something "on the fence" I'd expect him to remind me about boundaries, esp if I was doing something that he considered inappropriate or disrespectful to him. 

Personally I do work with trainers and other male professionals (my horses) and I do not have unnecessary communication with them other than what date and time do we have our next appt/lesson and what do we need to work on next? We DO NOT get into personal discussions about business, kids, family, etc. etc. 

They are business relationships, not personal relationships. The client is responsible for making sure that line is draw clearly.


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## Amplexor (Feb 13, 2008)

Almostrecovered said:


> I'll have to respectfully disagree with amp
> 
> you already approached her and essentially got gaslighted
> 
> ...


You all do not need to qualify your disagreements with me on this just because I'm a mod. Nobody's going to get banned for disagreeing with me. 

My point is that he has not confronted his wife with this. He has broached it, not taken it to the level he needs to. Until he determines his boundaries and clearly states them he has not given her the opportunity to comply, deny or lie. They are a fairly long term married couple and the tough conversation needs to take place. My stance has always been that you confront the issue directly with your spouse before you move on to harsher tactics. IMHO he has not done that yet.


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## Hicks (Jan 14, 2011)

If you don't want this in your marriage, you have every right to offer her the choice between this and her marriage.

It's already something that does not belong in your marriage, what is the point of proving one thing or another.

Wives should not have a male recreation partner that they spend this much time with. It's incompatible with the concept of marriage.


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## anonymouskitty (Jun 5, 2012)

I'll have to respectfully disagree with amp too 

Confrontations without evidence to back it up makes it that much more harder to rein in your emotions. At the very least any evidence or the lack thereof will help HIWrong to plan the next course of action.


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## Aristotle (Apr 4, 2012)

I can't believe you are so worried about her being upset about asking her NOT to delete text messages. Let her know she is spending too much time with another man, 1000s of text messages, hours on the phone when you are not around, and if she has a problem with you asking her to NOT delete her text messages, then there is a huge problem. I know you want to be the nice guy, the understanding husband, but the text messages should NOT be deleted. That is absolutely ridiculous. 

At the very least, deleting text messages almost ALWAYS means its a EA. There is no reason for her to delete his text messages unless she was hiding something or embarrassed by what's being said. If anything, motivational text messages, advice, txts from your coach would be things you would SAVE. WTF? 

Get a VAR for the car just in case she buys a burner phone to talk to him after you insist she shares the text messages.


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## Machiavelli (Feb 25, 2012)

Amplexor said:


> This is not necessarily a positive. She is validating to herself that the relationship is OK because you are *OK* with it. She may very well be in denial as to what this relationship is. She has stated that nothing inappropriate has happened and that is possible. Have you discussed the concept of an EA with her?


Correct. In WW's mind BH has been successfully moved from the "cuckold zone" to the "wittol zone."


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## Machiavelli (Feb 25, 2012)

Sara8 said:


> The crying after sex is a red flag of guilt..
> 
> The massive texting is a red flag.


Naw, red flags are a dime a dozen. That one's the black flag.


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## Aristotle (Apr 4, 2012)

Sometimes I agree with the gather evidence plan, but if this was my wife, no way. Not in this case. He knows him, he knows how they met, he knows the relationship, and he knows she is talking to him way too much when he is not around and has deleted 1000s of text messages.

This is not a matter of gathering evidence in my opinion, this is a matter of making a stand as her husband. What she is doing is absolutely wrong. Who cares if her 1000 text messages were about her family and her life, the type of husband you are, and her plans for the future -- innocent gibber gabber. That's a 1000 text messages she could have spent with you. Who cares if her hour long phone calls when you are not around are purely talk of how nice the weather is. This relationship is already NOT healthy. Red flags are everywhere, he is posting on a marriage forum, and she is crying after sex asking him to please trust her. If she wants you to trust her, hand over the phone and stop deleting messages. 

I honestly wouldn't care what was being said at this point. I would rather setup my marriage boundaries for all her future coaches that happen to be men, and let her know right now, no after hour talks, no 1000 text messages, and definitely no deleting these text messages. 

Is she trying to be an Olympic athlete? Is this her hobby or her career move? I mean, I guess if she wanted to be an Olympic athlete and she was going to put all of her life on hold to try out for the Olympics, a coach should be hands on (pun?). Otherwise, no way, no way.


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## Machiavelli (Feb 25, 2012)

LookingForTheSun said:


> If they are already spending 3 hours a day with each other training, why can't they discuss what they have to then - why additional calls and texts - and crying during/after sex is bad, bad, bad. I pray for you that nothing physical has happened yet, but you need to stop it now. Never give your spouse permission to spend time with someone of the opposite sex.


Well, there's the training business and then there's the TRAINING BUSINESS. I train a lot of women. Roughly half are married or shacked up and I'm married myself. However, I only take payment in U.S. funds (cash, checks, money orders). How much is WW paying her trainer for all this work? Plenty I'm sure, just in another form of currency, either attention, titillation, or outright poon.

Another thing, trainers can and do impart knowledge in the session, but sometimes they need to provide more detailed info, particularly on diet issues, to clients. This ain't done with texts, it's either in email or printed material. I have long term (and very hot looking) clients that I may have sent 20 emails max in the last 2 years. Sessions are 2-3 times a week for a half hour. Also, in endurance sports a non-professional competitor might see their coach for 2 or 3 sessions a week for 1 or 2 hours (one of my strength clients is a highly regarded running coach) @ approx $75 per hour and it won't be one on one.


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## mina (Jun 14, 2012)

"I honestly wouldn't care what was being said at this point. I would rather setup my marriage boundaries for all her future coaches that happen to be men, and let her know right now, no after hour talks, no 1000 text messages, and definitely no deleting these text messages."

Yep. Excessive no matter how you frame it. I don't even talk to or text my best GF who is at my house every day because she keeps her horse here. And my DH loves her. I think he'd get a little creeped out if I was talking to HER that much, much less some guy I was biking, running, swimming with.


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## mina (Jun 14, 2012)

"Well, there's the training business and then there's the TRAINING BUSINESS."

IMO the fact that this man is spending so much time corresponding with his trainee signifies that he is not a professional.


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## Unsure in Seattle (Sep 6, 2011)

I'll just say that, if he's seeing her several hours a day (!), then the extracurricular contact needs to stop. If it's cutting into your time together (the weekend, for instance), it needs to stop. They need to have a professional realtionship and nothing else. To say nothing of the ethics involved... you can be friendly without being friends.

I think Amp is spot on. Tell her why you're concerned.Talk about the deleted texts and how that looks to you and, if need be, how they would look to HIS wife. Tell her what the boundaries are. 

I dunno about meeting up for dinner. That seems to be a favorite tactic of some cake eater types. "See? Now we're all friends and nothing's wrong!"


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## Unsure in Seattle (Sep 6, 2011)

Aristotle said:


> Who cares if her 1000 text messages were about her family and her life, the type of husband you are, and her plans for the future -- innocent gibber gabber. That's a 1000 text messages she could have spent with you.


This this this.


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## anonymouskitty (Jun 5, 2012)

Aristotle said:


> Sometimes I agree with the gather evidence plan, but if this was my wife, no way. Not in this case. He knows him, he knows how they met, he knows the relationship, and he knows she is talking to him way too much when he is not around and has deleted 1000s of text messages.


yes yes yes, its not really about the evidence but imagine the scenario like so -> OP files of divorce on the grounds of adultery ( not sure how it works in america), he needs sufficient evidence to prove that in court, 1000 deleted messages aren't going to convince the judge about the illicit nature of WW's relationship

In order to save the marriage you need to be prepared to walk away from it, If i'm walking away I'd rather walk away on my terms.


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## Machiavelli (Feb 25, 2012)

Unsure in Seattle said:


> I dunno about meeting up for dinner. That seems to be a favorite tactic of some cake eater types. "See? Now we're all friends and nothing's wrong!"


This is a ticket they always want to punch. Introduce everybody to AP over dinner, while they play footsie under the table.


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## Unsure in Seattle (Sep 6, 2011)

I don't want to say that this is at that level, but of course, it's certainly possible.

I hate being on the "This is definitely an EA and possibly a PA" bandwagon. It's just that we see this sort of thing SO MANY TIMES, that it's hard not t feel like that.


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## jh52 (Apr 29, 2012)

"5 weeks ago, we had our son's 7th birthday party at a Lazer Tag place, and the owner of the place was really nice. He let my youngest son, who is 3 and shouldn't have been in there at all, go in for free because he was upset and generally went out of his way to make our party great. Well he and my wife get to talking and we find out he is a cyclist who has gone so far as to try out for the Olympics. The reason this matters is because my wife is a triathlete. So they start talking about riding together and setup a time to do so. He even asked me if I would mind and I told him no - harmless enough I thought."

Just wondering who picked the Lazer Tag place for the party ??


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## Machiavelli (Feb 25, 2012)

HopingImWrong said:


> The big problem is trying to get the backups without her knowing as she is near her phone all the time.
> 
> And if I ask her to pull the deleted texts, and by chance there really is nothing inappropriate, then that would be very bad.


Yes, it would be bad, but that's not what's going to happen. It's probably gone physical already. The easiest way to blow this up is a VAR under her car seat. Use heavy duty upholstery type velcro like you find on exercise machine pads to strap it to the underside (not to the floor). Meanwhile, get up in the middle of the night and get the deleted texts off her phone. If she's really putting in roadwork with this guy 3 hours a day, she'll be sleeping like a log. If she's sleeping light, she's not putting in the roadwork. Simple as that. The ultimate solution is to put a PI on it.

Don't blow this off.


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## Amplexor (Feb 13, 2008)

Unsure in Seattle said:


> I don't want to say that this is at that level, but of course, it's certainly possible.
> 
> I hate being on the "This is definitely an EA and possibly a PA" bandwagon. It's just that we see this sort of thing SO MANY TIMES, that it's hard not t feel like that.


We do and that is part of my motivation for jumping in on this thread. It is very possible that HIW's wife is in complete denial as to what the relationship is. I look at that angle because that was exactly were my wife was in hers. And she continued to be for months after D-Day. That is why he needs to set his boundaries.


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## anonymouskitty (Jun 5, 2012)

Oh and ah one more thing, Don't ever trust another man( best friends included and even her gay friend), at least when it comes to your wife.


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

Thousands? Really? Most phones are set to prune SMS FIFO around 200 messages or so. You have to go in and change that to keep them all, forever. And why would anyone want 'thousands'?


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## Maricha75 (May 8, 2012)

Runs like Dog said:


> Thousands? Really? Most phones are set to prune SMS FIFO around 200 messages or so. You have to go in and change that to keep them all, forever. And why would anyone want 'thousands'?


The OP said he looked at the online bill and it showed there were over 1000 text JUST between the two of them, over the 5 week period. My android saves all but they "drop off" at a certain point. You have to physically delete the messages (or the thread) and then start over. And, I didn't change the original setup. I have no reason to delete any, save for possibly making room... even then, I have no reason to delete. 

When someone purposely deletes an entire thread of texts, they are hiding something. If HIW's wife truly is worried that her husband doesn't trust her, she shouldn't delete the texts. None of them. If she has nothing to hide, she should be ok with him seeing her phone. If she balks, then you know something is up. I know this from experience, on both sides of the equation. Also, the fact that she ONLY has conversations with him when HIW is not around/ Uh uh, no way. If he is only her trainer, then all (certainly most, at least) conversations (aside from actual sessions) should have been when HIW was around. There really is no reason to have so many conversations away from the spouse.


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## skip76 (Aug 30, 2011)

I think you can have a talk with her and get more evidence at the same time. Figure out where she would talk on the phone and plant a VAR beforehand. Have your discussion about looking at the texts, no more deleted texts ever etc. Make sure she knows how serious you are and time it so one of you is leaving and get her calling him on that VAR. Use multiple VARS if needed, house car etc. Get creative and you will get your answers.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## badbane (Jun 9, 2012)

I could spend a long time analyzing details and all that but, why, this is an EA that is progressing rapidly. Unless your wife is going for the Olympics why is he training her full time. Plus unless he swims and runs what else could be be training her in. Stop it now start being stealthy , gather evidence , damning evidence, and expose. If the OM has a W then contact her if he is single. WTF are you letting your wife run around with a single attractive guy that has similar interests to your wife. I suggest you learn how to ride a bike.


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## Amplexor (Feb 13, 2008)

badbane said:


> I could spend a long time analyzing details and all that but......... If the OM has a W then contact her if he is single. WTF are you letting your wife run around
> with a single attractive guy that has similar interests to your wife. I suggest you learn how to ride a bike.


Or even reading the thread. OM is married.


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## badbane (Jun 9, 2012)

so cut out the single guy part. the rest is still relevant.


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## Amplexor (Feb 13, 2008)

badbane said:


> so cut out the single guy part. the rest is still relevant.


So read the thread before you advise.


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## betamale (Apr 25, 2012)

Your wife is having an EA, but she hasn't realized yet. I'm sure the OM knows what's going on though. 

Be ready to grow a pair because a PA is coming. 

Besides the keylogger and the VAR, I'd suggest to get in shape and be a challenge to your lady. Make her miss you! 

How Long Can You Stay A Challenge? - AskMen


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

When you do find evidence, don't confront your wife with it first. You've already been there and blown off. Instead take it straight to the OMW. He sounds like a predator who is putting the full court press onto your wife.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## crossbar (Aug 25, 2011)

I agree with the other posters. If you confront without evidence, all you've accomplished in exposing is teaching her how to hide the affair better and what steps she needs to take in throwing you off the scent.

Act normal. Don't ask questions and don't accuse her of anything. The more she thinks that you are clueless, the more sloppy she's going to get and the more mistakes she's going to make.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

OP, you need to get the book Not Just Friends, by Shirley Glass, like yesterday. The book was written by a nationally recognized infidelity researcher and explains how emotional affairs start like no other.

No one wakes up and says today I'll start an emotional affair. They are insidious. Infatuation only takes about 2 weeks to develop, and once you're at that stage you're in the land of a powerful compulsive fantasy. Underestimate the power of the fantasy at your peril.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## kingsfan (Jun 4, 2012)

HopingImWrong said:


> Now some of the reasons I feel like maybe I am going overboard:
> 
> 1. Since I've confronted her, she has been more open about him. She talks to me about their conversations, and I don't ask she just freely talks about them.
> 2. They both want all of us to have dinner (he is married) - so my wife and I and his wife and him.
> ...


Didn't read through the whole thread, so this might be explained already, but but none of these reasons are legitimate for why you think you might be going overboard.

My ex-wife committed numerous affairs. I mean numerous, especially EA's. I won't dare embarrass myself admitting how many. If there is one consolation to it all, I can say I have had to try and decifier through a lot of explaining over the years as well.

Looking at these three reasons, this is what I feel you should be mindful of (not saying she is doing this, but my ex-wife did).

1. My ex-wife used to speak about the first few guys she had EA's with. I think she did it for two reasons; firstly because it was a means of setting me at ease. Why would she talk about someone if she was having an affair right? It's called the hiding in plain sight tactic and works well for a while. The second reason though i think my ex, and likely other cheaters, talk about someone they are having an affair with is due to an emotional attachment. Think about how you felt when you and your wife first started to date and see each other. You likely loved to mention her name, just because it was exciting and mentioning her name helps bring back memories and feelings you expereinced with her. The same applies for a cheater and his/her other person.

2. Essentially a recap of reason number one. Also, some cheaters get a sense of excitement being able to be around their EA/lover in plain sight without getting caught. Double dating is a means to that end. Once again, not saying this is what your wife is doing, just going from my own past experience.

3. I think if a cheater knows what he/she is doing, then the first lesson in cheating 101 is to never act diffferently around their spouse as best they can. Nothing sets off red flags more than different behaviour. That said, I think if you reread your own post you'll see that you imply there is significant change that maybe you're not giving enough credence too.

She is training a lot more and harder than before, she is being guarded about her cell phone, she is deleting messages, she is crying when saying she loves you, she texts this guy 1000 times in five weeks (or 29 times a day, which is really a lot, I'd wager she doesn't text you that often or almost anyone else). I'm not sure if all of that is a change, but from the sounds of your post some of it is, and it's all a change for this guy. The fact he also drove up to the race area and scouted it for her is also something that really red flagged for me. Is he in the same race, or just did so out of courtesy, because that's a lot of courtesy to show someone who you are helping on a volunteer basis and have known only for a few weeks.

I agree with the idea of a keylogger/VAR and tell her you want her to stop deleting her texts. pay attention, especially to the keylogger/VAR for a month and if nothing is found, odds are you were wrong (not wrong to question it, just wrong in what your gut told you in this situation). 

And God willing, you are wrong. My prayers are for you if you are right because that's a disgusting feeling to have when you're right on this issue.


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## jnj express (Mar 28, 2011)

You do not need anymore evid.---go thru the collective info/reasoning of those who have posted here---with that info in hand you do the following

You tell your wife to stop her association with this guy immediately---she goes NC, in all ways, shapes, and forms

Believe me she knows how to train herself at this point, and she does not need anymore of his help

I am willing to bet they have already been physical---they are 2 athletes, training together, doing physical things together, for many hours each and every day, and I promise you the juices have been flowing

Put a stop to this now---you can do so, based on --it is an inapropos relationship, and she knows how to train/compete on her own---she does not need anymore of his so called help/expertese!!!!!


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## anonymouskitty (Jun 5, 2012)

oh yes by all means confront her but be ready for the "Just Friends" tag line that comes along with any statement she makes and let her throw you into even more confusion, listen mate, I strongly believe you should gather some concrete proof and then corner her.

Trust me, if you cut off her escape routes she'll buckle under the pressure otherwise be prepared for some major TT


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## Sara8 (May 2, 2012)

lordmayhem said:


> *Decipher TextMessage*
> 
> How to save / export SMS messages to your computer. Windows or Mac. Decipher TextMessage.
> 
> ...


thank you much


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

Hmm, let me see...

Wife, mother of two, dedicated triathlete/Iron Man competitor, sender and receiver of 1,000s of text messages to another man that are deleted and hidden from her husband and, presumably, the trainer's wife, too.

You know, two of those do not fit properly in your relationship.

I know which two, and so do you.

Even if she is not cheating on you she is, in my opinion, spending way too much time on her fun hobby.

Does she have enough quality time for her children and for you?

_*If not, she should stop this single person's lifestyle straight away!*_

As soon as you have children, your life changes. Or it should.

There's something seriously wrong here, even if she is NOT having an affair.

Counselling should be looked at and very quickly.


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## Will_Kane (Feb 26, 2012)

Out here in cyberspace, we have seen the situation you've described many times and it always ends up with the same result. I understand you still are in the wishful thinking phase of maybe, just maybe, it is not the case with your wife. If someone came to you and told you the same story you told here, you know what you would think.

Thousands of texts = affair.

Thousands of texts plus see each other almost every day = physical affair.

Investigate. Voice-activated recorder. Spyware.

You will find out it is a physical affair.

Prepare yourself mentally for this now.

After you find out, do not move out of your house. She cheated, let her move out. Insist on no contact with the other man, writing a no contact letter, giving you access to all communication devices and accounts, and telling you the truth about the affair. Expose the affair to the other man's wife.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

Will_Kane said:


> Out here in cyberspace, we have seen the situation you've described many times and it always ends up with the same result. I understand you still are in the wishful thinking phase of maybe, just maybe, it is not the case with your wife. If someone came to you and told you the same story you told here, you know what you would think.
> 
> Thousands of texts = affair.
> 
> ...


:iagree:


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

This will make you paranoid. read this thread

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/47382-trapped-bad-marriage-help.html


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

warlock07 said:


> This will make you paranoid. read this thread
> 
> http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/47382-trapped-bad-marriage-help.html


You read my mind.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

Bills tally totals for SMS not details, don't they? Your carrier details each SMS? Both directions? That must be one hell of a phone bill. Mine is 28 pages and I don't get that detail. I know for example, one line averages about 4600 SMS/month, another about 1400 another 350 and so on. But I can't imagine receiving a phone book in the mail each month with the details of several thousand SMS. Maybe your carrier does that. Seems crazy to me.


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## Rawrdonstein (Jun 14, 2012)

Whatever you decide to do don't do as I did and blow any of those red flags off by thinking she could never do that to you. If you do you'll be checking your mailbox for divorce papers like me. Nip that **** in the bud now.


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## Maricha75 (May 8, 2012)

Runs like Dog said:


> Bills tally totals for SMS not details, don't they? Your carrier details each SMS? Both directions? That must be one hell of a phone bill. Mine is 28 pages and I don't get that detail. I know for example, one line averages about 4600 SMS/month, another about 1400 another 350 and so on. But I can't imagine receiving a phone book in the mail each month with the details of several thousand SMS. Maybe your carrier does that. Seems crazy to me.


We don't get detailed bill in the mail, but we can print out the text info from online. Online, it shows the number, date, time, etc. Obviously, no text detail itself, otherwise I'd have that info myself! But I was able to determine how many texts per month were sent between hubby's EA partner and him... and, it was over 1000 between them, so....


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

And "Let's all get together and have a nice, civilised dinner with our spouses" could mean:

"Let's all get together and have a nice, civilised dinner with our spouses." 

or

"Quick! They are getting suspicious! Oh, _*I*_ know! Let's lull them into a false sense of security!"


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## keko (Mar 21, 2012)

HopingImWrong said:


> It just seems like they are spending a lot of energy with each other and have only known each other for 5 weeks.


Ya think?

Just 5 mins would be enough for me to spend some energy with a woman.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

keko said:


> Ya think?
> 
> Just 5 mins would be enough for me to spend some energy with a woman.


Maybe he is cautious? After all, he has his own wife, a worried husband and two little boys to be careful and wary of as he tries to get into the panties of his OW.

Oh! Sorry! Did I say that? What I meant to say was: "Get her into the triathlon! Sorry! Easy mistake to make!"


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## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

warlock07 said:


> This will make you paranoid. read this thread
> 
> http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/47382-trapped-bad-marriage-help.html


You know, I never actually read that mega thread until I clicked on it. I thought it was the usual WS in a fog and complaining about their spouse and wanting validation for their cheating type thread. 

Instead, its the usual BS believes its an EA despite the thousands of texts, WS being distant, and the BS initially wanting to desperately save the marriage type thread.

You *really* do see the same WS cheater script/behavior over and over again in the different threads that its so predictable. Same sometimes with the BS, with all the denial and shock, and the initial needy/clingy behavior.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

lordmayhem said:


> You know, I never actually read that mega thread until I clicked on it. I thought it was the usual WS in a fog and complaining about their spouse and wanting validation for their cheating type thread.
> 
> Instead, its the usual BS believes its an EA despite the thousands of texts, WS being distant, and the BS initially wanting to desperately save the marriage type thread.
> 
> You *really* do see the same WS cheater script/behavior over and over again in the different threads that its so predictable. Same sometimes with the BS, with all the denial and shock, and the initial needy/clingy behavior.


Yes, but wrsteele1, to his credit, verified what was going on and discovered the truth. They were in MC and R but things seemed off. He saved himself months, or if my situation is any guide, years of being in the dark. They had the 1000s of texts and supposedly had ended it after admitting to an EA. But they worked together, the kiss of death as vets know.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## keko (Mar 21, 2012)

iheartlife said:


> Yes, but wrsteele1, to his credit, verified what was going on and discovered the truth. They were in MC and R but things seemed off. He saved himself months, or if my situation is any guide, years of being in the dark. They had the 1000s of texts and supposedly had ended it after admitting to an EA. But they worked together, the kiss of death as vets know.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


But I do give credit to user.name for not wanting to know. wrsteele1 now has a recording of his wife giving a blowjob to another man, that stuff will be in his head for a looooong time.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

HIW, this is what I think you should do:-

1) work out how much time your wife spends on her training and exercising over a month
2) work out how much time she spends with you and her children

Now you have those two figure in mind, you need to ask yourself these questions:

A) Is the amount of time she is spending doing 2) outweighed by the amount of time she is spending doing 1?

B) Do you believe that she might be cheating on you?

C) If the answer to A) is that she is spending an inordinate amount of time doing 1, then here is another question for you: Does it matter if she is cheating on you sexually, or not?

The reason I ask that third question is because there are equally devastating ways of ruining a marriage other than cheating.

For example, someone who spends 18 hours a day on computer or console game playing will be as bad a husband or father (Or worse) than someone with a string of lovers.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

keko said:


> But I do give credit to user.name for not wanting to know. wrsteele1 now has a recording of his wife giving a blowjob to another man, that stuff will be in his head for a looooong time.


so are you off your James Bond kick as a result?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## keko (Mar 21, 2012)

iheartlife said:


> so are you off your James Bond kick as a result?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


It seems we're talking to an empty space, why bother?


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## OldWolf57 (Mar 20, 2012)

what, another that asked and didn't like the answers ??


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## Jibril (May 23, 2012)

C'mon guys. It's only been a little more than half a day. Maybe he hasn't been to a computer to update.

Or maybe the poopie hit the fan tonight.

I'm sure we'll hear from Hoping eventually.


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## keko (Mar 21, 2012)

Just to add I wasn't referring to OP, another user in similar situation but ignoring our advice.


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## Jibril (May 23, 2012)

keko said:


> Just to add I wasn't referring to OP, another user in similar situation but ignoring our advice.


Oh. Well, now I feel silly. 

Y'mean wrsteele1? 'Cuz I've been wondering what happened to him.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

Jibril said:


> Oh. Well, now I feel silly.
> 
> Y'mean wrsteele1? 'Cuz I've been wondering what happened to him.


He is waiting for his wife to move out which can't happen until July 8.

It's also the weekend so harder for some to get alone computer time.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

lordmayhem said:


> You know, I never actually read that mega thread until I clicked on it. I thought it was the usual WS in a fog and complaining about their spouse and wanting validation for their cheating type thread.
> 
> Instead, its the usual BS believes its an EA despite the thousands of texts, WS being distant, and the BS initially wanting to desperately save the marriage type thread.
> 
> You *really* do see the same WS cheater script/behavior over and over again in the different threads that its so predictable. Same sometimes with the BS, with all the denial and shock, and the initial needy/clingy behavior.


We need a way to catologue threads by the types of affairs or something. It would be a help if we could say go look at these ten threads, for example, so each new poster could see a similar situation. So much time is spent convincing posters what is probably going on. Many times, the time it takes to prod them along could have been used to save their marriage. You see it coming and the poster is wandering around in left field. EAs seem to be the hardest to get someone to move on and the ones that could be busted.


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

HopingImWrong said:


> The big problem is trying to get the backups without her knowing as she is near her phone all the time.
> 
> And if I ask her to pull the deleted texts, and by chance there *really is nothing inappropriate, then that would be very bad.*


Wow, we keep seeing this. All sorts of inappropriate stuff and a BS feeling guilty. Also fearful to take action because things might be ... innocent.

Again I have trouble seeing how what is right in front of ones face is innocent. Three hours a day with another man? 1000s of texts about anything!?

I have lost count of this same theme though over the past month. Men training wives and spending long hours with them. Personal trainers and men volunteering to invest in these guys wives for the love of the sport ....

Must be a trend.


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

Hicks said:


> If you don't want this in your marriage, you have every right to offer her the choice between this and her marriage.
> 
> It's already something that does not belong in your marriage, what is the point of proving one thing or another.
> 
> Wives should not have a male recreation partner that they spend this much time with. It's incompatible with the concept of marriage.


:iagree::iagree::iagree::iagree:


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

Aristotle said:


> Sometimes I agree with the gather evidence plan, but if this was my wife, no way. Not in this case. He knows him, he knows how they met, he knows the relationship, and he knows she is talking to him way too much when he is not around and has deleted 1000s of text messages.
> 
> This is not a matter of gathering evidence in my opinion, this is a matter of making a stand as her husband. What she is doing is absolutely wrong. Who cares if her 1000 text messages were about her family and her life, the type of husband you are, and her plans for the future -- innocent gibber gabber. That's a 1000 text messages she could have spent with you. Who cares if her hour long phone calls when you are not around are purely talk of how nice the weather is. This relationship is already NOT healthy. Red flags are everywhere, he is posting on a marriage forum, and she is crying after sex asking him to please trust her. If she wants you to trust her, hand over the phone and stop deleting messages.
> 
> ...


Right. He has enough information to kill this inappropriate relationship now.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

Entropy3000 said:


> Wow, we keep seeing this. All sorts of inappropriate stuff and a BS feeling guilty. Also fearful to take action because things might be ... innocent.
> 
> Again I have trouble seeing how what is right in front of ones face is innocent. Three hours a day with another man? 1000s of texts about anything!?
> 
> ...


If it's a trend, has this been promoted on cheater site as a way to hook wives, then baffle and ultimately cuckold husbands?


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

MattMatt said:


> If it's a trend, has this been promoted on cheater site as a way to hook wives, then baffle and ultimately cuckold husbands?


Not what I was thinking. This stategy is old school. Like yeah personal trainers are trendy enough at GYMs but there have been golf instructors and tennis instructors, dance instuctors, personal masseuses, gigilos, painters, sculpters, doctors and pool boys and so on for a very long time.

Some of this is also on the same theme where the husband specifies a somewhat obvious risky scenario and then says at the outset, I had no problem with this. A face palm moment to start with. Then they usually start investigating and appologize for doing so as they "know it is wrong" to snoop. That rattles more cages. Often they protest that they do not want to be called jealous, insecure or controlling. More hot buttons. Then we generally see some very extreme behavior as it relates to "just friends" and that it might be innocent when it is clear what they already know is beyond reasonable marital bounds with the opposite sex.

Out of this can come discussion in the TAM community about her activities being disrespectful and risky. Some will inevitably argue that she is a gown adult, he is not her father and that she has the freedom to have her friends. That there is no evidence of cheating like that matters anyway. Like what is being done is not damaging enough and worth dealing wit.

Then there is the gather more evidence strategy before tipping your hand versus you better cut this EA off quickly discussion. 

By no means are the individual situations identical but they deal with recurring patterns and themes.

Yet again however I can look back to the very beginning. Why oh why was the husband ok with the start of all of this? Then why oh why would they be ok with the escalating behaviors? Truly this is out of hand now. Yes this can escalate quickly. Sliding boundaries enable this. No I am not blaming the BS for his WS obviously poor boundaries. But his actions have enabled this. He can only change his behavior which may influence hers is he actually tells her that what she is doing is unacceptable to him and that she must cut this predator out of her life.

Yet again the fate of the Nice Guy. Who is still struggling with being nice.

What ever happened with the poster whose wife was running with a guy from her work seven days a week?


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## Machiavelli (Feb 25, 2012)

Entropy3000 said:


> Right. He has enough information to kill this inappropriate relationship now.


True, but he's not yet of the mindset to actually do it. He's still trying to rationalize it as potentially innocent. Been there, done that. In his present state, he needs to see and hear the action for himself as much as to blow up the gaslighting.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

What a way to hook a woman. Here is a woman who desparately wants to improve her performance. Along comes a nice guy offering a lot of help for a little of nothing. Throw out the bait. She swallows it hook line and sinker and now there is no telling how far over the top it has gone. If it hasn't gone physical it will soon. He is the now the answerr for problems she did not even know she had. 
And the last to know how she has been taken is her.

Thousands of texts aren't a red flag, its a guaranteed road map to diaster. 

A friend of mine did the ironman thing last year and was very successful. He cut back and is now only cycling and running because between work and training there was no time for family. OPneeds to discuss boundaries and real life with his wife assuming its not to late. I think he needs to ask OM's wife about the texts and see if she knows what they are doing.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

chapparal said:


> What a way to hook a woman. Here is a woman who desparately wants to improve her performance. Along comes a nice guy offering a lot of help for a little of nothing. Throw out the bait. She swallows it hook line and sinker and now there is no telling how far over the top it has gone. If it hasn't gone physical it will soon. He is the now the answerr for problems she did not even know she had.
> And the last to know how she has been taken is her.
> 
> Thousands of texts aren't a red flag, its a guaranteed road map to diaster.


:iagree:


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

HopingImWrong said:


> I did confont her about it and she said that she has nothing to hide and that most of their conversations are about training but that they do talk about other stuff i.e. his business, kids, etc. She is adamant that nothing inappropriate has ever been exchanged. When I did confront her, she was not defensive at all, she told me she felt bad for making my feel this way at all but that she was learning a lot from him. We talked about her previous trainer whom she just ditched for this guy, and I do know that her previous trainer doesn't help her at all as much as this guy has in the past 5 weeks. The last one (female) would also do the same triathalons with my wife and is very competitive and my wife felt like she didn't give her all to training her because she didn't want her to beat her and that's why she is so relieved to find someone that is actually training her - stuff like monitoring heart rate, nutrition, etc. - the old trainer didn't guide her on so I can see that for sure.
> 
> *We've made love several times since I confronted her, she's cried and told me how much she loves me but she did also say she wishes I would just trust her and that she absolutely has no connection or feelings for this guy at all.*
> 
> Now the other caviat to this is she is signed up for an Iron Man in July and she is pretty scared about it. It's long and it will be a really big challenge for her.


I haven't read all the responses but ,
You have already made a
Big mistake......
She tagged you.
That move was designed to throw you off. It was meant by her to " keep you in check."
The thing is that women know is its hard for a loving husband to fight them while they are crying, and men always give in to sex. The sex and the tears were meant to confuse you.
She is motivated by her ambition to achieve her goals. The Other man is motivated by pu$$y .
Its a basic "conman move." A conman always finds out what a person wants badly,then he pretends to offer them it , while at the same time taking everything they have.


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

What a mess, you can't control her so don't try.You can however stop tolorating her crap by asking her to leave. I mean if nothing is going on so be it, but the bottom line is it pisses you off and you don;t have to take it b/c you diserve good things in your life.

Your chick can to what she wants and if she wants you around then she needs to do the things that make you happy. Again you diserve to be happy and I'm sure your investigation will validate the stance you need to make to show her that what disicions you make are valid.

So do your your research and get the confidence you need to make the tough choices you have to make...it will be up to your wife to turn the corner and keep you around.

I have a feeling shes playing you as if she is keeping you around b/c her stance is "you aren't going any were" !!!!!!

The great thing about eveidence, you don't even have to tell them you have it, but the confidence that the betrayed starts to show in the disicion and additude they start to have, makes the wayward think twice about what they are about to loss if they continue.

Proof is painful ....big time painful but it brings the betrayed to the next level and shifts the power over in having no more doubt in what needs to be done and how to approach the next step with confidence and certianty.


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

the guy said:


> The great thing about eveidence, you don't even have to tell them you have it, but the confidence that the betrayed starts to show in the disicion and additude they start to have, makes the wayward think twice about what they are about to loss if they continue.
> 
> *Proof is painful ....big time painful but it brings the betrayed to the next level and shifts the power over in having no more doubt in what needs to be done and how to approach the next step with confidence and certianty.*




Well said!
That " power shift " is important. There seem to be a power differential in the relationship right now that she is hell bent on abusing. Simply because she wants to achieve HER goal of participating in the competition.
He does NOT KNOW the other man,[ other man is *NOT A FAMILY FRIEND* ]and he needs to approach him and tell him to back off. His wife will be initially upset,and resentful. But it might force her to evaluate her actions and consider what is really valuable to her.
In a situation like this,a man ought *NEVER to back down.*
She is on a high,because victory in the triathlon is within her reach and the so called " Olympic coach" is validating her.


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## TRy (Sep 14, 2011)

Caribbean Man said:


> He does NOT KNOW the other man,[ other man is *NOT A FAMILY FRIEND* ]and he needs to approach him and tell him to back off. His wife will be initially upset,and resentful. But it might force her to evaluate her actions and consider what is really valuable to her.


 Nothing is more pitiful than admitting to the other man (OM) that your wife has picked him over listening to you, and then asking him out of the goodness of his heart to cut it off with your wife since your wife will not. Other than boosting his ego by having you acknowledge his Alpha male status over you, what do you think this will accomplish? Do you really think that this will make him all of a sudden respect you and your marriage when he has already shown that he does not?

The OP should do the exact opposite and man up with his wife. At the end of the day, if your marraige is dependent on the OM respecting your marraige because your wife will not, then you do not have a marraige worth saving.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

Perhaps after the weekend the OP will be able to give us an update with some -hopefully- good, positive news.


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

TRy said:


> Nothing is more pitiful than admitting to the other man (OM) that your wife has picked him over listening to you, and then asking him out of the goodness of his heart to cut it off with your wife since your wife will not. Other than boosting his ego by having you acknowledge his Alpha male status over you, what do you think this will accomplish? Do you really think that this will make him all of a sudden respect you and your marriage when he has already shown that he does not?
> 
> The OP should do the exact opposite and man up with his wife. At the end of the day, if your marraige is dependent on the OM respecting your marraige because your wife will not, then you do not have a marraige worth saving.


Maybe you misunderstood what I meant when I said he should tell the OM to " BACK OFF." [ Probably because we are from different cultural backgrounds!]
In my country the word we use is " OPPOSE." He is suppose to oppose this man in a CONFRONTATIONAL way. Not making a phone call or anything. He must go face to face and tell him to fcuk off,or else.
OM then tell his wife. Wife gets upset and comes back to him resentful. He then lays it out to her in black & white.
Either OM or him. Choose NOW.
Its her move. She will try to ask for " space to think, "blah,blah,blah.
Either way,he offsets her balance and she is to forced to change her focus.
Right now she has him [ husband] in in check,and she expects him to act a certain way. That is what is giving her the upper hand. Husband is Mr. " nice guy."


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## aug (Aug 21, 2011)

Or, he can tell the OM to come pick up his wife and her belongings.

Or, he can help his wife pack and drive her to OM's house.

He needs to be NOT afraid of moving on.


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## anonymouskitty (Jun 5, 2012)

I agree with aug, He Bangs my wife once, well he's welcome to take her away baggage and all


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## RClawson (Sep 19, 2011)

I think HopingI'mwrong is having a difficult time signing in because after reading these posts he thinks his handle is Iknowyourright.


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## Machiavelli (Feb 25, 2012)

Elvis has left the building.


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## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

Machiavelli said:


> Elvis has left the building.


Three days ago, unless he's lurking. Oh well.


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## costa200 (Jun 27, 2012)

Just found out about this site and snooping around i found this thread. I must say i'm rather appalled by most of the answers this guy got. Maybe it's a cultural thing but if the OP is in this situation then all he needs/has to do is to simply tell his wife that he doesn't want her to see, talk, communicate or whatever the hell with this guy anymore. He doesn't need "proof". He doesn't have to debase himself playing the cop in search of robbers.

You go to your wife and you act like a freaking ALPHA MALE. You tell her to cut ties with this guy or you cut your ties to her... That's it. You, at this point, have nothing to fear. If she is a faithful true wife she will do as you say. If she isn't? Well, what of it? It's not like you've lost anything is it?

Have some shred of pride in yourself and stop rationalizing this crap. Do you think that other guy is spending hours with your wife out of friendship? Sorry, but i ROFL at that notion... And so, if he is after your wife, even if she isn't responding to him are you going to wait until she does?

Grow a pair already...


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## anonymouskitty (Jun 5, 2012)

costa200 you the man , rush in headlong yep you sir are the winner
.........................
..........................
................................

Wife takes A underground

costa200: you hangin out with this SOB still b*tch?

Wife : NO

costa200: ok
............................
...........................
........................


Wife(to OM): He's got no clue


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## Count of Monte Cristo (Mar 21, 2012)

Costa200, is your wife cheating on you?


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## Count of Monte Cristo (Mar 21, 2012)

The reason that I ask is that I have no idea if she is -- and you most certainly wouldn't know if you used the tactics that you described.


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## RClawson (Sep 19, 2011)

costa200 said:


> Just found out about this site and snooping around i found this thread. I must say i'm rather appalled by most of the answers this guy got. Maybe it's a cultural thing but if the OP is in this situation then all he needs/has to do is to simply tell his wife that he doesn't want her to see, talk, communicate or whatever the hell with this guy anymore. He doesn't need "proof". He doesn't have to debase himself playing the cop in search of robbers.
> 
> You go to your wife and you act like a freaking ALPHA MALE. You tell her to cut ties with this guy or you cut your ties to her... That's it. You, at this point, have nothing to fear. If she is a faithful true wife she will do as you say. If she isn't? Well, what of it? It's not like you've lost anything is it?
> 
> ...


Thank God you found this site Costa. I am a bit annoyed that I have wasted all my time reading everyone else's posts and feedback because it is obvious you have all the answers.


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