# Sexually starved leading to EA / PA



## MissBrandy (May 29, 2012)

Before i get bashed on, I am in no way justifying affairs, whether it be EA or PA and I am definitely not going to generalize however I want to find out from man (woman are also welcome to comment) that if you give your HD partner sex once or twice a month, then how do you expect them to be able to resist other man/woman out there if they are being starved at home? :scratchhead:
Sex talks don't always change much, the person will give it up for the first few days then go back to their ways of starving their partner. 
Marriage values are not only about "no cheating", ensuring that your partner is always satisfied also counts as marriage values or am i wrong?

(I just want to hear other people's views)


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## russell28 (Apr 17, 2013)

I could still have sex four or five times a day right now at age 50ish... I would be willing and able, and my wife and I would have sex two or three times a week while she was cheating on me. Cheating isn't always about quantity of sex, or quality of sex, it's about one of the partners checking out emotionally and giving love to another person without the spouse knowing. Woman often want to feel desired by another man, they flirt and let it go too far.. then they crave the attention and affection, so they trade sex for pretend love. Some guys want to feel the power of controlling another mans woman.. as creepy as that is, they are all over the place.. millions of them, they'll trade kind words for a free playmate.. (aka wh0r..)


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## MissBrandy (May 29, 2012)

My circle of friends is only married woman and 50% of them are cheating on their husbands (some EA and some PA). Not that i am condoning affairs but the cheating ones are all doing so because the husband have shut them out sexually, this then makes me wonder if are the husbands who's wives are cheating on them sexually satisfying their woman?


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## russell28 (Apr 17, 2013)

MissBrandy said:


> My circle of friends is only married woman and 50% of them are cheating on their husbands (some EA and some PA). Not that i am condoning affairs but the cheating ones are all doing so because the husband have shut them out sexually, this then makes me wonder if are the husbands who's wives are cheating on them sexually satisfying their woman?


They say the husbands are shutting them out sexually, but then they cheat so they are liars.. ask the husband, and I bet you get a different story. He'll tell you his wife is a cold b word, and you know why? She's cheating on him, and treating him like crap... why would he want to have sex with her if she's abusing him and treating him in a cruel way? So is the lack of sex (passion etc..), a byproduct of them being loose and wanting some change/strange, or is it really the fault of the husband? It sounds like they've checked out of the marriage.. Have you asked what they've done to get the husbands attention sexually? It seems that sleeping with other men isn't working....


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## anchorwatch (Mar 5, 2012)

MissBrandy said:


> My circle of friends is only married woman and 50% of them are cheating on their husbands (some EA and some PA). Not that i am condoning affairs but the cheating ones are all doing so because the husband have shut them out sexually, this then makes me wonder if are the husbands who's wives are cheating on them sexually satisfying their woman?


Is that fact? How do you know they haven't alienated their husbands and are now justifying the cheating? Are you in their bedrooms? 

There are many sides to every marriage, even those who live in them may not realize what they've done. *Cheating will never solve a relationship problem.* That's my view, and I do believe any spouse who denies the other sex is cheating their partner out of a satisfying marriage. Man or woman. 

There are many methods available to solve relationship problems. They involve work and introspect. The cheater is too selfish and full of self deserving thoughts to do that. Of course it takes two to work on a relationship. If the other party isn't willing to do the work, then don't use deceit, move to dissolve the marriage. 


You've been here quite some time Brandy, you know what you have to do. 



BTW, 50%? I'd advice you to ask yourself, why you consider so many women who can deceive the person they chose to cherish, as friends.


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## Rugs (Apr 12, 2013)

Why wouldn't you seek counseling or divorce before cheating?

Why don't spouses communicate their feelings?

No, a sexless marriage should not justify cheating. It does justify communication, counseling, or divorce. 

This is the problem with cheaters who run to infidelity and wrecking lives to satisfy their own needs without considering their spouse.

It's a dumb, immature, and cowardly excuse.


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## russell28 (Apr 17, 2013)

Rugs said:


> Why wouldn't you seek counseling or divorce before cheating?
> 
> Why don't spouses communicate their feelings?
> 
> ...


What came first, the sexless marriage or the cheating?

It's funny how the cheating always causes all the 'reasons' for cheating... the justifications are many, and the lack-of-sex one is an instant classic. Right up there 'too controlling'... aka wanting the wife to act like a wife.

Cheaters cheat because it feels good at the time, and then they come up with stuff like 'my husband doesn't give me sex...' I bet she never once mentioned her displeasure to her husband, and I don't mean 'honey, why don't you want to cuddle more'... I mean, 'honey, there's this guy at work that makes me feel all tingly inside, and you aren't doing it for me anymore because I really want this new guy... so I've been working on all these reasons why it's justified to neglect you and be with him, this sex thing is a good one...'


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## mineforever (Jan 31, 2013)

MissBrandy....spouses in general don't withhold sex just for the neck of it. There is something wring in their marriages they are not telling you about. There are couples with mismatched sex drives, but thats not an excuse for cheating either. If a spouse is so unhappy and refuses to try to communicate or work on the marriage than they should divorse the spouse first be for starting another relationship.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Harken Banks (Jun 12, 2012)

I never saw it as an option. Before I met my wife and then while we were dating and first married, I was happy with my sex life. Then things turned really bad. Sometimes 6 month stretches without affection of any sort. Excruciating. For years on end. It seemed like we had sex only when she wanted to make a baby or the odd and infrequent wave of desire came over her. I looked at other people and was fascinated by the idea that they had warm and healthy sex lives. I tried to communicate to my wife that I was miserable in our affectionless state. But I never saw extramarital sex as an option.


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## Thorburn (Nov 23, 2011)

MissBrandy said:


> My circle of friends is only married woman and 50% of them are cheating on their husbands (some EA and some PA). Not that i am condoning affairs but the cheating ones are all doing so because the husband have shut them out sexually, this then makes me wonder if are the husbands who's wives are cheating on them sexually satisfying their woman?


My cirlce of friends would be cut by 50% if I was in your shoes. 

If you seriously read the research as to why (in your case you are talking about women) women cheat. You will not find that it is primarily about sex starvation.

I suspect this 50% crowd are liars, as cheaters lie to just about everyone.

And if I found out my wife was hanging out with cheating friends and 50% of her friends were cheating, I would have to say something to her.

I will add this. My wife made it known to many folks on line that she was cheating and lying to me and others about it. Guess what it caused. Guys started hitting on her online. They were virtually lining up. Why? Because they figured it would be easy to get into her pants. And if I had not busted her A wide open, that is exactly where she was headed.


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## PhillyGuy13 (Nov 29, 2013)

MissBrandy said:


> My circle of friends is only married woman and 50% of them are cheating on their husbands (some EA and some PA). Not that i am condoning affairs but the cheating ones are all doing so because the husband have shut them out sexually, this then makes me wonder if are the husbands who's wives are cheating on them sexually satisfying their woman?


Wow- half of all your friends are having affairs, because alllll of their husbands have checked out sexually. What town are you in? Let us know so if we are passing through we won't drink the water. It makes husbands impotent and turns wives into wh0res.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## thummper (Dec 19, 2013)

PhillyGuy13 said:


> Wow- half of all your friends are having affairs, because alllll of their husbands have checked out sexually. What town are you in? *Let us know so if we are passing through we won't drink the water. It makes husbands impotent and turns wives into wh0res.*_Posted via Mobile Device_


Ooooooooooooo.....good one, Philly! :smthumbup:


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## weightlifter (Dec 14, 2012)

Just divorce the husband.

In MANY states. No sex constitutes marital abandonment. It may not get you any more money but gets you the shorter time.


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## Philat (Sep 12, 2013)

MissBrandy said:


> Before i get bashed on, I am in no way justifying affairs, whether it be EA or PA and I am definitely not going to generalize however I want to find out from man (woman are also welcome to comment) that if you give your HD partner sex once or twice a month, then how do you expect them to be able to resist other man/woman out there if they are being starved at home? :scratchhead:
> Sex talks don't always change much, the person will give it up for the first few days then go back to their ways of starving their partner.
> *Marriage values are not only about "no cheating", ensuring that your partner is always satisfied also counts as marriage values or am i wrong?*
> 
> (I just want to hear other people's views)


MissB, you've seen the tenor of the responses. But I hope you also see that the respondents agree with your position that marriage values include providing your partner with satisfaction. But if this is lacking there are ways to address it other than cheating, which trashes *all *of the values in a marriage. Sorry, but your cheating friends have no justification, even if their stories are true.


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## CaptainLOTO (Nov 6, 2013)

MissBrandy said:


> I want to find out from man (woman are also welcome to comment) how do you expect them to be able to resist other man/woman out there if they are being starved at home? :scratchhead:
> Marriage values are not only about "no cheating", ensuring that your partner is always satisfied also counts as marriage values or am i wrong?
> 
> (I just want to hear other people's views)



It's interesting because my wife & I had a discussion along these lines. In our case, we had a neighbor with a debilitating disease. She caught her husband cheating and divorced him. Bottom line, it instigated a discussion between my wife & I about what we might do in this situation. One partner CAN'T, WON'T or doesn't WANT to fulfill the sexual desires of the other partner...

We concluded that you can't make a blanket statement and that there is not an easy answer. This happens often in life and personally, I think that good marriages can exist in which both partners acknowledge that they can't meet all of each others needs and then bless the other partner getting their needs met elsewhere. In principle, this is my belief but in practice giving that blessing would be very difficult. 

BTW, I don't just think this is about sex. In an ideal relationship both partners do a great job at fulfilling the other partners needs. Unfortunately, many relationships simply require some fulfillment from the outside.

I agree that marriage vows aren't just about "no cheating". I think the idea is that each partner is joyfully sacrificing for the benefit of the other partner. But when the joyfulness leaves, or the sacrifice is one-sided that's when relationships start to head downhill.


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## Visionknower (Oct 14, 2013)

Good book regarding this topic.
Intimacy Anorexia by Douglas Weiss Ph. D -


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## brokeneric (Jan 27, 2014)

What is the point in staying married if you aren't satisfied and have to look elsewhere? Get divorced and do whatever you want. That's what a decent human being would do.


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## Chris989 (Jul 3, 2012)

Around a year before she cheated, my (now ex) wife told me to go and get sex elsewhere as our sex life had dropped to maybe once a month. 

At one point we went three months without having sex and she told me again to get it elsewhere.

At the time I was incredibly hurt. I even considered going to a prostitute, but couldn't bring myself to break my vow - even though she had told me, several times, to have sex with someone else.

Ironically, things seemed to get better the 12 months leading to her cheating.

Low or no sex is no excuse for cheating. If it is that much of a problem, seek help or end the marriage.


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## russell28 (Apr 17, 2013)

So to summarize.. what leads to an EA/PA, is lack of honesty with your spouse. Being a liar, and a cheater and justifying your actions by blaming people that weren't involved in your choice to cheat.

Sexual starvation leads to being lonely, horny, angry etc.. 

Bad choices, ability to compartmentalize and lie to yourself and lack of boundaries lead to having an affair...


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## brokeneric (Jan 27, 2014)

One thing I never understood was why couldn't our WS just talk to us? it wasn't like we tattooed on our forehead "I don't want to hear what you have to say."


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## russell28 (Apr 17, 2013)

Chris989 said:


> Around a year before she cheated, my (now ex) wife told me to go and get sex elsewhere as our sex life had dropped to maybe once a month.
> 
> At one point we went three months without having sex and she told me again to get it elsewhere.
> 
> ...


If she was telling you to go have sex elsewhere, she was probably already cheating... or thinking about it, that's why she wanted you to, so she could have less guilt. Give it some thought... telling you to go get sex from someone else is basically the "ILYBINILWY" speech with a twist... 

Sorry to break it to you.. I'd revisit that timeline.


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## Mortie (Dec 19, 2013)

Ms Brandy, Please be careful who you are hanging around with. In your group of friends that are cheating, are they "Friends of your Marriage" meaning will they incourage you to cheat or even cross the line? If you are happliy married, you need to think about this. My belief is that if you are not happy in your marriage, do the right thing and divorce before you cross the line. If they are sex starved, why would they stay? Apparently their lives are really not as bad as they are telling you. It appears that they could possibly be looking for an excuse to do whatever they want. Just saying.


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## russell28 (Apr 17, 2013)

brokeneric said:


> One thing I never understood was why couldn't our WS just talk to us? it wasn't like we tattooed on our forehead "I don't want to hear what you have to say."


The answer is a very simple one, you probably don't want to hear..

If they talked to you, and told you the truth.. you would have said 'no, don't do it'. They didn't want to hear that, so they told you some half baked bull story, and when you got confused, they took that as good enough reason to go through with what they were planning.. getting closer to that new person.


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## Chris989 (Jul 3, 2012)

russell28 said:


> If she was telling you to go have sex elsewhere, she was probably already cheating... or thinking about it, that's why she wanted you to, so she could have less guilt. Give it some thought... telling you to go get sex from someone else is basically the "ILYBINILWY" speech with a twist...
> 
> Sorry to break it to you.. I'd revisit that timeline.


I think it was because she had checked out but had no idea how to express the feelings. I've already posted in my "story" about how she had become obsessed by the OM by this point but I had no idea how to handle that either.

Like a lot of relationships, neither of us knew what an EA was or even had the conception that such a thing exists. 

Sure, I would "dig" at her for talking about him, but being ok with her having close male friends is part of how men are told "modern men" should be.

Either way, everything from phone records to medical records and her own patterns of going out 100% reinforce the timeline I have of October 2009 to April 2012.


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## alte Dame (Aug 7, 2012)

It is your choice to surround yourself with friends who cheat on their husbands.

I have been surprised over the years to hear from female and family members about their sexless or low-sex marriages. None of these women has cheated. These are the friends in my circle.


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## Philat (Sep 12, 2013)

Chris989 said:


> Sure, I would "dig" at her for talking about him, but *being ok with her having close male friends is part of how men are told "modern men" should be.*


Yep. And how much misery has this attitude caused?


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## treyvion (Apr 29, 2013)

MissBrandy said:


> My circle of friends is only married woman and 50% of them are cheating on their husbands (some EA and some PA). Not that i am condoning affairs but the cheating ones are all doing so because the husband have shut them out sexually, this then makes me wonder if are the husbands who's wives are cheating on them sexually satisfying their woman?


Some of the husbands shut the wives out sexually because they are getting it elsewhere.


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## MrK (Sep 2, 2010)

brokeneric said:


> What is the point in staying married if you aren't satisfied and have to look elsewhere? Get divorced and do whatever you want. That's what a decent human being would do.


Because I'm not going to break up my home and my family just because my wife fell out of love with me 15 years ago and never told me. She changed the rules. I didn't. And then she never told me. I never would have even found out had it not been for me trying to reconnect when it was WAY too late. I since spent the good part of 3 years trying to fix it a and she would have NONE OF IT.

Hey, I, like millions of other men, lost the marriage lottery. I'll fix that the way that suits me best. And as long as she continues to break her vows to me by not trying, I'll break mine searching for someone who will want me. That's all I want. To be desired again.


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## treyvion (Apr 29, 2013)

MrK said:


> Because I'm not going to break up my home and my family just because my wife fell out of love with me 15 years ago and never told me. She changed the rules. I didn't. And then she never told me. I never would have even found out had it not been for me trying to reconnect when it was WAY too late. I since spent the good part of 3 years trying to fix it a and she would have NONE OF IT.
> 
> Hey, I, like millions of other men, lost the marriage lottery. I'll fix that the way that suits me best. And as long as she continues to break her vows to me by not trying, I'll break mine searching for someone who will want me. That's all I want. To be desired again.


If you were going to try to do it, how would you do it right this time?


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## verpin zal (Feb 23, 2013)

Meanwhile, why is divorce not an option again?


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## Chris989 (Jul 3, 2012)

MrK said:


> Because I'm not going to break up my home and my family just because my wife fell out of love with me 15 years ago and never told me. She changed the rules. I didn't. And then she never told me. I never would have even found out had it not been for me trying to reconnect when it was WAY too late. I since spent the good part of 3 years trying to fix it a and she would have NONE OF IT.
> 
> Hey, I, like millions of other men, lost the marriage lottery. I'll fix that the way that suits me best. And as long as she continues to break her vows to me by not trying, I'll break mine searching for someone who will want me. That's all I want. To be desired again.


Providing you have told her, then that is between the two of you.

If you haven't told her then I believe your actions are shameful.


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## Harken Banks (Jun 12, 2012)

Visionknower said:


> Good book regarding this topic.
> Intimacy Anorexia by Douglas Weiss Ph. D -


Yep to all of this.


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## Harken Banks (Jun 12, 2012)

verpin zal said:


> Meanwhile, why is divorce not an option again?


Divorce is an option. Always. Hers as well as mine. Funny thing, it takes only one for a divorce, two for a marriage. For me, I love my wife and I love my family. My wife and I have worked hard and sacrificed much for our children to have what they have and what we hope for them. And I also hold onto this ridiculous hope that things between my wife and me, my wife and our children by extension, can get better. It gets tricky when divorce is not simply a handshake and goodbye. When it means selling the family home, the children parting with everything that is familiar, sorting out where you and they will live and how many days of the week. And why? Because mom and dad can't get along. When your children are already suffering from the strife between their parents and just want them to get along. It should be so easy as a handshake and goodbye. Often it is not.


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## P51Geo1980 (Sep 25, 2013)

MissBrandy said:


> Before i get bashed on, I am in no way justifying affairs, whether it be EA or PA and I am definitely not going to generalize however I want to find out from man (woman are also welcome to comment) that if you give your HD partner sex once or twice a month, then how do you expect them to be able to resist other man/woman out there if they are being starved at home? :scratchhead:
> Sex talks don't always change much, the person will give it up for the first few days then go back to their ways of starving their partner.
> Marriage values are not only about "no cheating", ensuring that your partner is always satisfied also counts as marriage values or am i wrong?
> 
> (I just want to hear other people's views)


I am sex starved - haven't had sex in quite a while (early summer) and on the fast track to divorce because of it. Being sex starved is in no way and excuse or justification to cheat. PERIOD. The opportunity for me to cheat is abundant (I'm a nursing student in a class with 34 females and 6 males) and sure my eye wanders but I'd still never cheat on my STBXW. It comes down to basic respect - both for your spouse AND for yourself. I can easily go down the cheating path because sex is so important to me but I refuse to because I have integrity.

If sex is important to you and you're not getting it from a spouse at least have the integrity to seek help (I my situation I've tried by she doesn't think anything needs to be fixed) or divorce.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Harken Banks (Jun 12, 2012)

Every time this thought has crossed my mind I have asked myself "Who are you?" Not in the sense that I did not recognize myself, but in the sense that character is defined in the really big decisions we make and the really big decisions we make reflect our character. I would have so much more to deal with if I looked in the mirror and saw a guy who cheated on his wife and family. Betrayed them. My hands are full already.


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## Twistedheart (May 17, 2010)

So, MissBrandy, why is your husband witholding sex from you?


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## MrK (Sep 2, 2010)

treyvion said:


> If you were going to try to do it, how would you do it right this time?


With the hindsight I have right now, with what I've read on these forums, I would have not gotten married. And that is in now way meant to be a joke, unfortunately.


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## Squeakr (May 1, 2013)

I think a twist on this and a good question is, Why would you hang around with known cheaters?

Are you trying to fulfill a need to cheat so bad you are living it vicariously through your friends (this is not just a question for you but for anyone in this situation)?

My wife had toxic friends like this and I know some were cheating, so I think they all surrounded themselves with other cheaters and mutually encourage them by being their friends, so as to justify to themselves that it was normal and they weren't doing anything that bad by cheating as everyone else was doing it?? Those without the actual "nerve" to cheat were then living vicariously through the ones that were cheating.


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## Squeakr (May 1, 2013)

MrK said:


> With the hindsight I have right now, with what I've read on these forums, I would have not gotten married. And that is in now way meant to be a joke, unfortunately.


I don't think that you are the only one that thinks that way on this site lots of the time.


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## tulsy (Nov 30, 2012)

MissBrandy said:


> *My circle of friends is only married woman and 50% of them are cheating on their husbands* (some EA and some PA). *Not that i am condoning affairs but* the cheating ones are all doing so because the husband have shut them out sexually, this then makes me wonder if are the husbands who's wives are cheating on them sexually satisfying their woman?


What a toxic group of friends you have. So none of you have any feelings for the husbands? No one would think to give the husbands a "heads-up" about their adulterous wives?

Shame on you and your friends. And ya, I think you ARE condoning affairs...you completely blame the husbands.


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## phillybeffandswiss (Jan 20, 2013)

MissBrandy said:


> My circle of friends is only married woman and 50% of them are cheating on their husbands (some EA and some PA).


50% would be delegated to acquaintances, they wouldn't be in my "circle of friends."


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## MrK (Sep 2, 2010)

Chris989 said:


> Providing you have told her, then that is between the two of you.
> 
> If you haven't told her then I believe your actions are shameful.


Let's just say I floated the idea. It was nixed with the same "we need to keep up the facade" indifference that all of my attempts at serious communication have been met by her. I'm not going to make a decision on this based on whether she wants to pretend we have a normal marriage or not. 

As a disclaimer, this is not coming from a serial philanderer. Quite the opposite, I have yet to cheat on my wife in any form. I was never good with women and now being 50+ with a bit of a gut isn't going to make it easier. I do have a lot more life experience, and I have put myself out there a little, but no bites yet. We'll see what happens when the time comes.

I'm not leaving the safety, security and love of my family just because she gave up on us. Is it perfect? No. But that doesn't mean I have to tear it to pieces to fix it. I'll tweak it the way I have to. You get ONE SHOT at life. One. This is it for me, and "it" right now consists of going to bed EVERY NIGHT with a woman who turns her back to me with contempt. Every night. 

When this happens to your life, ping me again and we'll talk. In the mean time, I'm going to try to limit the size of that growing regrets pile of mine. I'm not going to die not knowing what it's like to be wanted by a woman again. To kiss a woman that desires me. Not if I can help it anyhow.


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## DarkHoly (Dec 18, 2012)

MissBrandy said:


> My circle of friends is only married woman and 50% of them are cheating on their husbands (some EA and some PA). Not that i am condoning affairs but the cheating ones are all doing so because the husband have shut them out sexually, this then makes me wonder if are the husbands who's wives are cheating on them sexually satisfying their woman?


As others have already pointed out, consider the source. No credibility.


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## treyvion (Apr 29, 2013)

Squeakr said:


> I think a twist on this and a good question is, Why would you hang around with known cheaters?
> 
> Are you trying to fulfill a need to cheat so bad you are living it vicariously through your friends (this is not just a question for you but for anyone in this situation)?
> 
> My wife had toxic friends like this and I know some were cheating, so I think they all surrounded themselves with other cheaters and mutually encourage them by being their friends, so as to justify to themselves that it was normal and they weren't doing anything that bad by cheating as everyone else was doing it?? Those without the actual "nerve" to cheat were then living vicariously through the ones that were cheating.


And that's how it really goes down.

In some groups the non-cheaters are not the norm.


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## Squeakr (May 1, 2013)

treyvion said:


> And that's how it really goes down.
> 
> In some groups the non-cheaters are not the norm.


:iagree: x 1000. It just seems that when cheating becomes the norm, no one second guesses it or someone's ability to participate in it. Notice how many times on here we see the old, "well everyone in his/her office was doing it, so no one thought it odd or out of the ordinary to be surprised by it" and the other "everybody in that office was screwing around" statements. No one thinks twice when that is the accepted operating standard. In my company it is acceptable to "drink to excess and get drunk" at company meetings/ gatherings, so when we hire someone that doesn't drink at all, they feel out of place and everyone feels odd around them (as if they now have nothing in common to talk about).


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## russell28 (Apr 17, 2013)

Squeakr said:


> :iagree: x 1000. It just seems that when cheating becomes the norm, no one second guesses it or someone's ability to participate in it. Notice how many times on here we see the old, "well everyone in his/her office was doing it, so no one thought it odd or out of the ordinary to be surprised by it" and the other "everybody in that office was screwing around" statements. No one thinks twice when that is the accepted operating standard. In my company it is acceptable to "drink to excess and get drunk" at company meetings/ gatherings, so when we hire someone that doesn't drink at all, they feel out of place and everyone feels odd around them (as if they now have nothing in common to talk about).


If new guy was smart, he'd always hold a beer... just not drink it, the drunk people never notice... 

I was one that got a list of people that were doing it.. and the list of justifications for each affair.

When she said 'my aunts boyfriend was married, but his wife had that disease where she couldn't leave the house.. ' I just reminded her that his wife probably needed him to help her with that, and not go out and make your aunt into his ho.. and where is he now? Oh, when she wanted a commitment he vanished? This is the guy her aunt brought to the wedding, her mom marrying her OM... I got video of him, he looked nervous, wonder why... Fools....

Her mother cheated because the father was never there, too many jobs and school and stuff... what a prick. Think she now realizes what her mother did to her father.

She convinced herself that her sister or brother-in-law cheated and were sleeping in different rooms, or she just made that one up...

Everyone in work was doing it, she was jealous.. Her sister had just got cheated on by some player, and she was jealous that now her sister had a cool new apartment and could date (her sister would have killed for a husband and kids like my wife had.. ), so she loaned her the apartment on weekends to 'feed the cat'... Even though she was cheated on, and supposedly going to therapy, she lets my wife use her house to screw around on me. Obviously still a sore spot, I have yet to talk to her again after telling her she's no longer welcome in my home and that she's toxic... something to that effect... anyway, I digress...


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## CaptainLOTO (Nov 6, 2013)

If you're sex starved but in an otherwise healthy relationship you should be able to talk to your partner. If you can't talk about this and find a path forward then probably divorce is best.

There can be healthy relationships where one party just doesn't meet the others needs in this area. As long as its in the open, its not cheating.

Same thing if one partner is depressed and never wants to socialize - the non-depressed partner can be loving and supportive but occasionally you need to hang out with healthy people or it'll drag you down too.

As far as the group of friends and 1/2 of the cheat - I'd be looking for people that are more aligned with who I want to be. If I don't want to be a cheater, I don't hang with cheaters. If I don't want to be a drug user, I don't hang with drug users. Who you hang out with says as much about you as it says about your friends..


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## Squeakr (May 1, 2013)

russell28 said:


> If new guy was smart, he'd always hold a beer... just not drink it, the drunk people never notice...


 IT would have been too late, as everyone already knew they didn't drink before the events (as it was a big topic of discussion in our work environment, when no one would really think much of it).



> so she loaned her the apartment on weekends to 'feed the cat'... Even though she was cheated on, and supposedly going to therapy, she lets my wife use her house to screw around on me. Obviously still a sore spot, I have yet to talk to her again after telling her she's no longer welcome in my home and that she's toxic... something to that effect... anyway, I digress...


Sorry for your pain. Did she even have a cat or was it feeding another 'cat'?


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## Plan 9 from OS (Jul 13, 2012)

So, why indeed would a spouse who is not getting his/her needs for intimacy met by a recalcitrant spouse who has no interest in changing his/her ways? Probably the same reasons why a BS chooses to R with his/her WS even if the cheater is not remorseful. 

Despite the fact that infidelity only makes matters worse in the long run, I can think of several reasons why a WS chooses to cheat instead of divorce and why a BS chooses to reconcile instead of divorce. Here is my list as to why BOTH WS's and BS's rationalize in order to keep the marriage:

Children - who wants to be the person who destroys the family thru divorce? Also, who wants to become a part time parent?
Image - Everyone thinks your marriage is great. If I divorce, I let everyone down plus it puts a black mark on me. I need to keep the marriage no matter what.
Living standard - Divorce is expensive. If I divorce, I lose half my salary, retirement and assets OR I can't live on half of what we bring in together.

Really, we know the answers are Children and Money by far. People feel stuck. I'm sure most couples have tried to talk thru things before one of them makes the decision to cheat. I know a number of people have stated "If I only knew how bad it was, I would have done things differently". I would wager in many cases, the "spouse in the dark" WAS told about the issues, it's just that he/she probably didn't take it seriously or didn't pay attention.


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## Squeakr (May 1, 2013)

Plan 9 from OS said:


> Really, we know the answers are Children and Money by far. People feel stuck. I'm sure most couples have tried to talk thru things before one of them makes the decision to cheat. I know a number of people have stated "If I only knew how bad it was, I would have done things differently". I would wager in many cases, the "spouse in the dark" WAS told about the issues, it's just that he/she probably didn't take it seriously or didn't pay attention.



I agree on those are the main reasons that people stay, but I would take that bet on the spouse in the dark being told. Just because the other spouse says that they were clear and defined in their "informing" the in the dark spouse of their unhappiness, I bet it was done as MrK says, by "floating it by them". 

The two perceptions are not always the same and not always the truth. Just as one side always says that it "was a rotten and awful marriage and had been for many years", when the other would say "I knew things weren't the greatest, but just thought we were in the marriage lull that comes after many years of marriage and kids." Plenty out there think that is just the way that marriage gets, while the spouse is out there complaining to everyone but the other half. I BET that is more the truth (just as no one wants to be responsible for breaking up the family, no cheater wants to be responsible for thinking that they had not tried everything before their A evolves).


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## Plan 9 from OS (Jul 13, 2012)

Squeakr said:


> I agree on those are the main reasons that people stay, but I would take that bet on the spouse in the dark being told. Just because the other spouse says that they were clear and defined in their "informing" the in the dark spouse of their unhappiness, I bet it was done as MrK says, by "floating it by them".
> 
> The two perceptions are not always the same and not always the truth. Just as one side always says that it "was a rotten and awful marriage and had been for many years", when the other would say "I knew things weren't the greatest, but just thought we were in the marriage lull that comes after many years of marriage and kids." Plenty out there think that is just the way that marriage gets, while the spouse is out there complaining to everyone but the other half. I BET that is more the truth (just as no one wants to be responsible for breaking up the family, no cheater wants to be responsible for thinking that they had not tried everything before their A evolves).


In the situations I've seen in the real world, it seems like the majority of the cases involve one or both spouses trying to talk thru problems first before ever making allowing themselves to be weak enough to cheat. And I agree that two people can perceive things differently - hence why communication is a simple thing to work on to improve a marriage but surprisingly doesn't get done. 

The route to cheating seems to travel this trajectory in most cases: Bliss - Complacency - Resentment (or Ignorance) - Seeking substitutes for spouse to meet emotional needs - full on EA/PA

It seems like the root cause begins with a combination of complacency and a lack of effective communication. While you come from the viewpoint that the WS probably did not try too hard to communicate prior to withdrawing from his/her spouse, it can ALSO turn out that the the BS minimized the message that his/her spouse was trying to communicate prior to the infidelity. Each case is different and you'll never know for sure the truth in the matter. But in the end, these two factors are the gateway to infidelity entering a marriage. No doubt there are others, but from what I've seen in the real world, most of them occur as a reaction to what they perceive is a crappy situation.


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## vellocet (Oct 18, 2013)

MissBrandy said:


> Marriage values are not only about "no cheating", ensuring that your partner is always satisfied also counts as marriage values or am i wrong?
> 
> (I just want to hear other people's views)


Ensure that your partner is ALWAYS satisfied? So a spouse has to put out on demand if the other spouse says so if that is to ensure they are ALWAYS satisfied?

Let me give you my own personal experience. My last relationship, I have to get in bed fairly early, work a lot of hours. I'm always up for sex, but I'd rather not have to wake up at 1am on a work night. I always suggested getting busy around 8pm. Well, that was too early for her for some reason. She always wanted to wait until late at night when I'm dog tired.

So even though I was more than willing earlier on in the evening, she saw it as her not getting enough sex because she wanted to pick the time. Now if I had said I wasn't getting enough sex because she didn't give it to me when she needed to be asleep, I'd be labeled a pig.

It is unrealistic that the other partner is ALWAYS satisfied. Life gets in the way, schedules don't always mesh. You make as much time as you can. But to suggest that one spouse/partner would start looking elsewhere if they don't put out on demand? (not saying you are suggesting that, just thinking in general)


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## Healer (Jun 5, 2013)

russell28 said:


> I could still have sex four or five times a day right now at age 50ish... I would be willing and able, and my wife and I would have sex two or three times a week while she was cheating on me. Cheating isn't always about quantity of sex, or quality of sex, it's about one of the partners checking out emotionally and giving love to another person without the spouse knowing. Woman often want to feel desired by another man, they flirt and let it go too far.. then they crave the attention and affection, so they trade sex for pretend love. Some guys want to feel the power of controlling another mans woman.. as creepy as that is, they are all over the place.. millions of them, they'll trade kind words for a free playmate.. (aka wh0r..)


This. My stbxww and I had good, more often than not great sex...I wanted more of it. That wasn't the issue.

Now if it is, and you're married to someone who isn't fulfilling your sexual needs, it's up to you to discuss it and try to solve it, and if it can't be solved, then you divorce and find someone with whom you are sexually compatible. You don't categorically destroy the other person's life and the lives of your children (if you have them).


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## treyvion (Apr 29, 2013)

CaptainLOTO said:


> If you're sex starved but in an otherwise healthy relationship you should be able to talk to your partner. If you can't talk about this and find a path forward then probably divorce is best.
> 
> There can be healthy relationships where one party just doesn't meet the others needs in this area. As long as its in the open, its not cheating.
> 
> ...


It's just how groups work. There is bleedover.

Like if you wanted to be an olympic level weightlifter or sprinter, you'd hang with them.

You can be the only moral guy in a group of cheaters, and they would over time just hide alot of the conversation from you and go on ahead with their cheating.


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## vellocet (Oct 18, 2013)

MissBrandy said:


> My circle of friends is only married woman and 50% of them are cheating on their husbands (some EA and some PA). Not that i am condoning affairs but the cheating ones are all doing so because the husband have shut them out sexually, this then makes me wonder if are the husbands who's wives are cheating on them sexually satisfying their woman?


Then your friends need to file for divorce and find someone else.


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## JustSomeGuyWho (Dec 16, 2012)

MissBrandy said:


> My circle of friends is only married woman and 50% of them are cheating on their husbands (some EA and some PA). Not that i am condoning affairs but the cheating ones are all doing so because the husband have shut them out sexually, this then makes me wonder if are the husbands who's wives are cheating on them sexually satisfying their woman?


I would really question who you choose to surround yourself with.


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## vellocet (Oct 18, 2013)

MissBrandy said:


> My circle of friends is only married woman and 50% of them are cheating on their husbands (some EA and some PA). Not that i am condoning affairs but the cheating ones are all doing so because the husband have shut them out sexually, *this then makes me wonder if are the husbands who's wives are cheating on them sexually satisfying their woman?*


Or it could be no one man will satisfy them and their need to have sex with someone who isn't the same person they had sex with for years. Could be they just want something "new".


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## treyvion (Apr 29, 2013)

vellocet said:


> Or it could be no one man will satisfy them and their need to have sex with someone who isn't the same person they had sex with for years. Could be they just want something "new".


Is the "new" viewpoint a correct viewpoint or incorrect?

That means the cycle will never end.


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## Squeakr (May 1, 2013)

Plan, in my real world experience, I have found that when 3rd parties (namely best friends) were asked about the infidelity, they always seemed to comment that the spouses always seemed fine and not really unhappy to merit infidelity. I would agree they both were complacent. I find it hard to believe that if one party was trying soo hard to get across their unhappiness, the they would not be open about it to their best friend. If they were so open Tallinn about it and voicing their unhappiness then how come no one else knew?? I think it is creative history rewrites, but I will agree that some do give it their all and still get shut down by the spouse, I just think that is more the exception than the norm. 

Again these are my real world experiences.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Vega (Jan 8, 2013)

Squeakr said:


> Plan, in my real world experience, I have found that when 3rd parties (namely best friends) were asked about the infidelity, they always seemed to comment that the spouses always seemed fine and not really unhappy to merit infidelity. I would agree they both were complacent. I find it hard to believe that if one party was trying soo hard to get across their unhappiness, the they would not be open about it to their best friend. If they were so open Tallinn about it and voicing their unhappiness then how come no one else knew?? I think it is creative history rewrites, but I will agree that some do give it their all and still get shut down by the spouse, I just think that is more the exception than the norm.
> 
> Again these are my real world experiences.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


There have been studies done that demonstrate that over 55% of male cheaters have cheated while being 'happy' or even 'very happy' in their marriages/LTR's. I accept this as truth because MOST cheaters don't wake up one morning and say to themselves, "My, my, what a beautiful day! Guess I'll do some yard work, bring my child to get some ice cream, meet someone, and 6 minutes later, have sex with them in the back of my car!" 

Most of the time, the process of cheating is just that: A _process_. Cheating occurs in a series of small steps. Even a ONS has a series of steps to it. But in a ONS, the steps happen more quickly. 

The fact that most cheating kind of 'sneaks up' on the cheater may explain why the cheater doesn't really voice his or her complaints much _or at all _before the cheating begins. The cheater wasn't really THAT 'unhappy' to begin with.

Food for thought...

Vega


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## Chris989 (Jul 3, 2012)

Vega said:


> There have been studies done that demonstrate that over 55% of male cheaters have cheated while being 'happy' or even 'very happy' in their marriages/LTR's. I accept this as truth because MOST cheaters don't wake up one morning and say to themselves, "My, my, what a beautiful day! Guess I'll do some yard work, bring my child to get some ice cream, meet someone, and 6 minutes later, have sex with them in the back of my car!"
> 
> Most of the time, the process of cheating is just that: A _process_. Cheating occurs in a series of small steps. Even a ONS has a series of steps to it. But in a ONS, the steps happen more quickly.
> 
> ...


Cheating is a series of choices.

Crime is a series of choices.

Goldman Sachs helped Greece obfuscate the size and extent of their national debt. This caused untold chaos for millions of people.

"They" were asked about this. Their response?

It may have been immoral, but it wasn't illegal.

You can say what you want about betrayal, but the perpetrators know it is wrong. They know there are consequences but choose to ignore them for what is, in their mind, a short term gain.

Cheating may be the result of a "process", but there is a binary moment here. Before a penis enters a vagina and after. Without doubt, when the former enters the latter then cheating has occurred by any definition.

Whatever the process leading up to this moment, one simple word could have stopped it all: "No".


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## workindad (May 7, 2011)

MissBrandy said:


> My circle of friends is only married woman and 50% of them are cheating on their husbands (some EA and some PA). Not that i am condoning affairs but the cheating ones are all doing so because the husband have shut them out sexually, this then makes me wonder if are the husbands who's wives are cheating on them sexually satisfying their woman?




OP, read what you wrote here. What does this tell you about your circle of friends?


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## amanda23 (Jan 24, 2013)

I am in a marriage with no sex and intimacy. My husband was my best friend and lover until his prostatectomy, a year ago. He had his prostate removed due to prostate cancer (he is fine). Since his surgery, he has ED and has lost his libido. I have spoken about my unmet need for intimacy with him a number of times, but it only changes things for a very short time. 

I have not cheated and do not plan to, but I can understand why a person in a similar circumstance to me would. I am not even a high libido person, but having my lover become my roommate has been a very difficult transition.


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## MissBrandy (May 29, 2012)

Thanks for all the replies.

These are not friends i met a few months ago, there's 6 of us and yes 3 of them are cheating. We all met over 10years ago, we went through life changes together, same tertiary, got married around the same time and some of us have children around the same age, so to answer the question about why i choose to hang with these people, well they're very good friends of mine. I still hang out with them because I don't believe in "bad influence" because a grown person is fully capable to differentiate between wrong and right.

"Mary" is having a revenge affair (PA/EA) and the husband who also had an EA/PA doesn't know about this, he broke up with his mistress when he realized the grass wasn't greener on the other side and came back to her. Divorce is apparently not an option because she doesn't want to get out of her comfortable lifestyle based of her husband's actions, and also doesn't want her kids to suffer should they divorce.

"Jen"'s husband comes home from work and spends all his nights on his gaming consoles, the guy has an xbox, ps3 and recently bought a ps4. There has been no physical contact between them for almost a year, she got tired of whinning and initiating "the talk" and just shut down. She's currently in an EA/PA.

"Cassy" gained a lot of weight after having their 3 kids, the husband has told her she should loose a bit of weight because "this is not the body i fell in love with". She's been trying to loose the weight for months but its on and off. Obviously the husband pretends like she doesn't exist, no physical contact between them either for the past year or so. She's also in a EA/PA

All of us have high paying 8-5 jobs and definitely not dependent on the husbands financially.

The rest of us have normal marriage ups/downs but are not cheating, we're not judging the 3 that are, they have their own reasons for doing what they're doing


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## P51Geo1980 (Sep 25, 2013)

MissBrandy said:


> Thanks for all the replies.
> 
> These are not friends i met a few months ago, there's 6 of us and yes 3 of them are cheating. We all met over 10years ago, we went through life changes together, same tertiary, got married around the same time and some of us have children around the same age, so to answer the question about why i choose to hang with these people, well they're very good friends of mine. I still hang out with them because I don't believe in "bad influence" because a grown person is fully capable to differentiate between wrong and right.
> 
> ...


These are all excuses. People with integrity do not cheat - they either work to fix the problems or they divorce.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## FormerSelf (Apr 21, 2013)

1 Corinthians 7: 3-6

3 A man should fulfill his duty as a husband, and a woman should fulfill her duty as a wife, and each should satisfy the other's needs. 4 A wife is not the master of her own body, but her husband is; in the same way a husband is not the master of his own body, but his wife is. 5 Do not deny yourselves to each other, unless you first agree to do so for a while in order to spend your time in prayer; but then resume normal marital relations. In this way you will be kept from giving in to Satan's temptation because of your lack of self-control. 6 I tell you this not as an order, but simply as a permission.

Not overtly being a Bible thumper here, but even St. Paul says that we open ourselves up to temptation, acknowledging that even the most stalwart of "happily married" are open to the loss of self-control when we aren't maintain physical intimacy.

I know many of us (like myself) have been hurt by infidelity...and have little sympathy for the woes of those who have initiated in an extra-marital affair (sounds like extra-curricular activity doesn't it?)...but I think there has to be some acceptance of common wisdom that says that long sexless periods can erode some people's resolve.

There were long periods of no sex in my own marriage...my wife just avoided it and avoided it...and I have to admit some of my co-workers started to look good. 

I recall this one evening That I worked with a client during the day...and I think there was definitely in instant attraction between us...I said or did nothing mind you, but I was helping out at the understaffed bar that night...and she was being served there. At closing, the bar tender mentioned to me that he asked for any last requests and she said, "A martini...and THAT guy." Referring to me. 

The bartender said he wouldn't say a word, but he said he GUARANTEED that I could get some action going. I left, but boy it felt like I was tearing myself in two...while in the meantime, I was so angry about the crappy marriage I had...so i went home and started getting proactive about fixing our marriage...and for a season it was probably the best time of our marriage we ever had, 'cos I used that situation for the better. 

But I must say, it was so razor's edge...I could have easily gone with a ONS with the beautiful black haired, dark eyed woman. I never cheated on my wife, but I was very close that night. So, in spite of how deeply hurt I was by my wife's infidelity, I am not exempt from making a stupid choice one day. It's just that every day, I make the right choice...and hope that I will continue to make that daily, right choice.


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## MissBrandy (May 29, 2012)

@P51Geo1980
It takes 2 to work on a marriage, so if you leave your spouse sexually deprived for over a year, then who do you think is doing your job? (i'm not saying you)

I know sex is not everything in marriage, but it sure as hell plays a very big part


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## See_Listen_Love (Jun 28, 2012)

PhillyGuy13 said:


> Wow- half of all your friends are having affairs, because alllll of their husbands have checked out sexually. What town are you in? Let us know so if we are passing through we won't drink the water. It makes husbands impotent and turns wives into wh0res.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_



Half may be a very good score.

The divorce rate gets higher, while the number of marriages goes down. Cheating is a factor in many divorces.

People in non-marital relations may have a lot more separations going on in their lives than married people have divorces.


So yes, I believe that in certain social groups the cheating rate can be very high. (In others groups it will be very low I understand from people here on TAM.)

The coupling with sexless marriages I see in the 
obesity epidemy, the sugar kills everything, the female hormones in men become more prominent.


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## cpacan (Jan 2, 2012)

MissBrandy said:


> My circle of friends is only married woman and 50% of them are cheating on their husbands (some EA and some PA). Not that i am condoning affairs but the cheating ones are all doing so because the husband have shut them out sexually, this then makes me wonder if are the husbands who's wives are cheating on them sexually satisfying their woman?


What's wrong with your premise? Try to see it from a few other perspectives.

_"My circle of friends is only married woman and 50% of them are having honest open realtionships. Not that i like open marriages but those who have them are all doing so because the husband have shut them out sexually, this then makes me wonder if are the husbands in these open relationships sexually satisfying their woman?"_

or...

_"My circle of friends is only married men and 50% of them are beating their wives (some mildly and some very badly). Not that i am condoning wife beating, but the wife beaters are all doing so because the wife has shut them out sexually, this then makes me wonder if are the wives who's husbands are beating them sexually satisfying their husband?"_

Dishonesty and lack of consent - major problems.


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## user_zero (Aug 30, 2013)

cpacan said:


> _"My circle of friends is only married woman and 50% of them are having *honest open realtionships*. Not that i like *open marriages* but those who have them are all doing so because the husband have shut them out sexually, this then makes me wonder if are the husbands in these open relationships sexually satisfying their woman?"_


OP used the words 'cheating' and 'having an affair' not 'open honest relatioships' or 'open marriages'. while I agree with your main point, I'm just saying these are very different statements and it's not right that you replaced them. just saying ...


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## cpacan (Jan 2, 2012)

user_zero said:


> OP used the words 'cheating' and 'having an affair' not 'open honest relatioships' or 'open marriages'. while I agree with your main point, I'm just saying these are very different statements and it's not right that you replaced them. just saying ...


Oh, sorry. That was exactly my main point. You can react in different ways to sexual starvation.

The honest way is talking about other arrangements to solve the problem - not many would lift an eyebrow to the above quoted arrangement, while the abusive way in my second example is non-acceptable to most. 

Where in this spectrum you tend to place OP's justification, says something about you and your character, wouldn't you say?


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## P51Geo1980 (Sep 25, 2013)

MissBrandy said:


> @P51Geo1980
> It takes 2 to work on a marriage, so if you leave your spouse sexually deprived for over a year, then who do you think is doing your job? (i'm not saying you)
> 
> I know sex is not everything in marriage, but it sure as hell plays a very big part


That's still no excuse to cheat. As I said in my original response, I am sex starved as well but I have enough integrity not to cheat on my STBXW. It doesn't sound like your friends have much integrity at all, especially Mary who is staying in her marriage to maintain her comfortable lifestyle. Women like that make me sick.

I'm beginning to think something went down with one of the husbands and your looking for justification for one of those friends of yours. 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## anchorwatch (Mar 5, 2012)

Is your husband still obsessively gaming, Brandy?


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## MissBrandy (May 29, 2012)

@anchorwatch

Thankfully not, he sold his console and we've been working through our marriage issues and still attend MC/IC, so far R has been successful.

However this thread is not about me (my threads are scattered all over TAM if you wanna read about them), I'm just curious about spouses that deny their partners intimacy and seem surprised when the spouse has an EA/PA


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## russell28 (Apr 17, 2013)

MissBrandy said:


> Thanks for all the replies.
> 
> These are not friends i met a few months ago, there's 6 of us and yes 3 of them are cheating. We all met over 10years ago, we went through life changes together, same tertiary, got married around the same time and some of us have children around the same age, so to answer the question about why i choose to hang with these people, well they're very good friends of mine. I still hang out with them because I don't believe in "bad influence" because a grown person is fully capable to differentiate between wrong and right.
> 
> ...


Instead of divorcing, Mary decided to lower herself to the level of her husband. Something she claimed was wrong for him, is now right for her. Her excuses are no different than his excuses. He lied and cheated, now she's a liar and a cheat. Did he make her that way? No, she did. 

Jens husband probably immerses himself in video games, because his wife is cold and distant and he needs to feel powerful and in control. Since his wife isn't making him feel special, she's making some other guy feel special.. he's finding an outlet to help him feel needed. She's using his gaming and comfort in the relationship as an excuse to sleep with another man and go outside of her marriage to get her needs met. Her husband is unaware that she's using his video gaming as her excuse. I bet money her 'talk' never mentioned the other guy at work that's been getting all her time and attention... She's deep in what they call the 'fog', aka 'fooling herself'.

Cassy's husband is probably cheating on her, she should look into it. She should also stand up for herself, and not let him abuse her. By turning herself into a cheater and a liar, she's not fixing any problems, she's just creating new and more complex problems. The right thing to do would be to let her husband know that she's not taking his abuse any longer, if he continues she's leaving. The solution to being abused isn't to abuse yourself or let others abuse you (AP) and abusing your spouse...

So they have 'reasons'.. here we call them 'excuses' or 'justification for bad behavior'.....


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## russell28 (Apr 17, 2013)

MissBrandy said:


> @P51Geo1980
> It takes 2 to work on a marriage, so if you leave your spouse sexually deprived for over a year, then who do you think is doing your job? (i'm not saying you)
> 
> I know sex is not everything in marriage, but it sure as hell plays a very big part


If your partner doesn't have sex with you for over a year, you might get a bit concerned and have more than a talk.. I would think that's a good reason to split, even divorce... I don't think it's a good reason to lie and cheat.. Even if he beats you, drinks, has no sex with you and says your cooking sucks... still not a reason to cheat, reason to leave the relationship? Yea.. reason to sink to low levels of lying and sneaking... No... 

If my partner doesn't give me money, can I sneak and rob them because they're not giving me money, rob a bank?, and it's okay to be a thief now? Because hey, my spouse is withholding cash...


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## anchorwatch (Mar 5, 2012)

MissBrandy said:


> @anchorwatch
> 
> Thankfully not, he sold his console and we've been working through our marriage issues and still attend MC/IC, so far R has been successful.


I'm glad your marriage is becoming more satisfying, from the work that you're both putting in. 

Best wishes.


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## Squeakr (May 1, 2013)

MissBrandy said:


> Thanks for all the replies.
> 
> These are not friends i met a few months ago, there's 6 of us and yes 3 of them are cheating. We all met over 10years ago, we went through life changes together, same tertiary, got married around the same time and some of us have children around the same age, so to answer the question about why i choose to hang with these people, well they're very good friends of mine. I still hang out with them because I don't believe in "bad influence" because a grown person is fully capable to differentiate between wrong and right.
> 
> ...


I agree nothing but justifications and excuses. I see a reoccurring theme here, which is blame the H and then it is alright?? From your descriptions I don't really see the women trying either (have they taken interest in their H and the H's hobby's? Looks like No to me), but it is okay for them not to be meeting the man's needs either and to cheat on them.

Why is it expected that the man needs to be meeting their needs, but the reverse doesn't need to be. 

I am not in agreement with this assessment, but it seems that if "Casey" would lose weight then her H would have more interest in her. You said she is not losing the weight (which I know and understand is a hard thing to do) but rather than work harder at it, she has just decided to live as she is and then cheat, yet blame her H for not meeting her needs. Is she not meeting his needs either by working on her image (yes, I think this imagery idealism is wrong, but to him it means something, and she seems to want something in return for giving him nothing. If the woman is not getting her emotional needs met, she thinks it is okay to not meet a man's physical needs, yet we all seem to think that is fair, so why not the reverse)?

Does "Jen" try to be involved in the games, or does she just let him be? Maybe if her H felt that she was truly interested and cared about his interests more spark and passion would be there? Instead she complains about it and takes a AP? Doesn't seem fair to complain about the H when she is giving nothing, just like he is?

And Mary is having and RA and being a cake eater. No where in this do I see it said (doesn't mean it isn;t the case) that her H is depriving her of her sexual needs. He may have been at one point, but it sounds like she started the A after he came back to her, so it is nothing more than a RA and she is the one that is with holding from the H. 

Sorry but in all of theses cases, I don't see where the H (and I say this as you specified it was men that were the issue and the question was aimed at men specifically) is solely the fault of the cheating the women are doing! You have chosen to justify it as such and view it in that way, so that you can continue to be friends with these toxic people. Just because you have been friends a long time doesn't excuse toxic, immoral, and wrong behavior? You yourself said that people have their open choice in deciding right and wrong, yet you are justifying so that their "wrong" isn't as bad as it appears. This is my honest opinion and I only know what little you tell us, but then again you only know the stories they tell you as well (and they are justifying their A's to you, so only one side is truly getting to you).


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## vellocet (Oct 18, 2013)

MissBrandy said:


> The rest of us have normal marriage ups/downs but are not cheating, we're not judging the 3 that are, they have their own reasons for doing what they're doing


Then I guess the 3 that are cheating couldn't ask for better friends


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## vellocet (Oct 18, 2013)

MissBrandy said:


> @P51Geo1980
> It takes 2 to work on a marriage, so if you leave your spouse sexually deprived for over a year, then who do you think is doing your job? (i'm not saying you)
> 
> I know sex is not everything in marriage, but it sure as hell plays a very big part


Hmm, lemme tell you my own story here.

After becoming a mother, my wife denied me sex all the time. Being the man I am, I figured this is just life getting in the way. So I simply stopped trying to initiate sex because it was a futile endeavor. 

I figured when she is ready or wants to, she will come to me.

Well wouldn't ya know it. Because she turned me down and I stopped asking, she then started feeling neglected. She didn't try to initiate sex ever. So basically in my situation it was HER sexual neglect of me that gave her some warped sense of entitlement to cheat.

So her you have a husband that was neglected. Did I cheat? No. 

So the difference between those that don't cheat, and your 3 dandies of friends is, they have lousy character.


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## Squeakr (May 1, 2013)

vellocet said:


> Hmm, lemme tell you my own story here.
> 
> After becoming a mother, my wife denied me sex all the time. Being the man I am, I figured this is just life getting in the way. So I simply stopped trying to initiate sex because it was a futile endeavor.
> 
> ...


Wow that could have been exactly my story as well. Did I cheat? NO, but the WW did, as she said that I was neglecting her. Funny how she rewrote that history to work in her favor isn't it?


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## vellocet (Oct 18, 2013)

Squeakr said:


> Wow that could have been exactly my story as well. Did I cheat? NO, but the WW did, as she said that I was neglecting her. Funny how she rewrote that history to work in her favor isn't it?


True that. And of course these 3 friends of hers are going to put the blame on their husbands. Nobody says, "Ya, I'm cheating on my husband because I simply want to f**k other men" They wouldn't get much sympathy from others if they were truly honest.


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## Lefacade (Jan 10, 2014)

MissBrandy said:


> My circle of friends is only married woman and 50% of them are cheating on their husbands (some EA and some PA). Not that i am condoning affairs but the cheating ones are all doing so because the husband have shut them out sexually, this then makes me wonder if are the husbands who's wives are cheating on them sexually satisfying their woman?


50% of your friends are deceitful, lying cheaters and you still call them friends? If they are willing to screw over the person who they agreed to spend their lives with, What will they do to you if given the chance? Or am I just the only idiot left who thinks marriage should be a stronger bond than a friendship?

To answer your original question though, I would hope they would come talk to me about the issue. When my wife cheated on me and (all the **** that came with it), the biggest thing I couldn't understand was, breaking her vows and letting another guy **** her was apparently easier than having an uncomfortable conversation with me saying she was unhappy. That is ****ed up.


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## Squeakr (May 1, 2013)

Lefacade said:


> 50% of your friends are deceitful, lying cheaters and you still call them friends? If they are willing to screw over the person who they agreed to spend their lives with, What will they do to you if given the chance? Or am I just the only idiot left who thinks marriage should be a stronger bond than a friendship?
> 
> To answer your original question though, I would hope they would come talk to me about the issue. When my wife cheated on me and (all the **** that came with it), the biggest thing I couldn't understand was, breaking her vows and letting another guy **** her was apparently easier than having an uncomfortable conversation with me saying she was unhappy. That is ****ed up.


QFT!!!!


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## Chris989 (Jul 3, 2012)

MissBrandy said:


> Thanks for all the replies.
> 
> These are not friends i met a few months ago, there's 6 of us and yes 3 of them are cheating. We all met over 10years ago, we went through life changes together, same tertiary, got married around the same time and some of us have children around the same age, so to answer the question about why i choose to hang with these people, well they're very good friends of mine. I still hang out with them because I don't believe in "bad influence" because a grown person is fully capable to differentiate between wrong and right.
> 
> ...


They say you can tell a man by the company he keeps. Perhaps that goes for women too?


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## phillybeffandswiss (Jan 20, 2013)

MissBrandy said:


> Thanks for all the replies.
> 
> These are not friends i met a few months ago, there's 6 of us and yes 3 of them are cheating. We all met over 10years ago, we went through life changes together, same tertiary, got married around the same time and some of us have children around the same age, so to answer the question about why i choose to hang with these people, well they're very good friends of mine. I still hang out with them because I don't believe in "bad influence" because a grown person is fully capable to differentiate between wrong and right.
> 
> ...


Justification, the panacea of all social ills.


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## vellocet (Oct 18, 2013)

MissBrandy said:


> @anchorwatch
> 
> Thankfully not, he sold his console and we've been working through our marriage issues and still attend MC/IC, so far R has been successful.
> 
> However this thread is not about me (my threads are scattered all over TAM if you wanna read about them), I'm just curious about spouses that deny their partners intimacy and seem surprised when the spouse has an EA/PA


Your stories are about being sexually neglected. So when you are curious about some justification to cheat because of sexual neglect, it is about you. You wonder if you'd be justified if you did. Not that you would, but just curious if you would be justified.


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## treyvion (Apr 29, 2013)

vellocet said:


> Your stories are about being sexually neglected. So when you are curious about some justification to cheat because of sexual neglect, it is about you. You wonder if you'd be justified if you did. Not that you would, but just curious if you would be justified.


I think after all I've been through and all the views I've had on this subject that after some amount of sexual and affectionate NEGLECT you have to take matters into your own hands.

You cannot allow your partner to determine or diminish your sexual identity.


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## Squeakr (May 1, 2013)

treyvion said:


> I think after all I've been through and all the views I've had on this subject that after some amount of sexual and affectionate NEGLECT *you have to take matters into your own hands.*


:iagree::rofl:


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## treyvion (Apr 29, 2013)

Squeakr said:


> :iagree::rofl:


We only have one life...

"Hell, I really didn't want to be forced to cheat. But I cannot go another day in a sexless marriage. So the deal is pretty simple. I'll offload this need to someone else. If I find your cheating on me, it's over on the spot. I didn't want to be forced into this position. I'm not taking care of someone else's woman, so if you want to be with someone else, just leave and go be with them."


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## JustSomeGuyWho (Dec 16, 2012)

treyvion said:


> vellocet said:
> 
> 
> > Your stories are about being sexually neglected. So when you are curious about some justification to cheat because of sexual neglect, it is about you. You wonder if you'd be justified if you did. Not that you would, but just curious if you would be justified.
> ...


Right. So if I told a judge 'I was forced to rob that bank because they wouldn't give me the loan I needed', what do you think would happen?

Nobody is forced to cheat. It is a choice you make to sacrifice your dignity for gratification. You own your choices. If you've made the effort and can't get the results you want then leave the relationship. Cheating is a cowardly act. If it is that important to you then have the balls to change your circumstances.

_Posted via *Topify* on Android_


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