# Cheated with my friend



## Confusednhrt (Sep 15, 2014)

I recently found out that my wife of 5 years cheated on me with my best friend on 2 different occasions. Both times we were at a campground where everyone was drinking heavily and I was sleeping in our tent while she was kissing/groping with him. The only reason I know this is that his wife caught them. She swears that it meant nothing and that she was just drunk but I feel like this had to have happened with him or other people in the past. 

I'm a wreck because we have 2 children that are ages 4 and 2 and while I want the life I had I don't think I can stick around and feel selfish for not being around my children. Any advice would be appreciated. They were caught 2 weeks ago and the "first" time happened about 5 months ago.


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

Confusednhrt said:


> I recently found out that my wife of 5 years cheated on me with my best friend on 2 different occasions. Both times we were at a campground where everyone was drinking heavily and I was sleeping in our tent while she was kissing/groping with him. The only reason I know this is that his wife caught them. She swears that it meant nothing and that she was just drunk but I feel like this had to have happened with him or other people in the past.
> 
> I'm a wreck because we have 2 children that are ages 4 and 2 and while I want the life I had I don't think I can stick around and feel selfish for not being around my children. Any advice would be appreciated. They were caught 2 weeks ago and the "first" time happened about 5 months ago.


If it "didn't mean anything", then why did it happen more than once?

What's that I smell...?

Yep, thought so... BULLSH*T.

Prepare yourself for the notion that this has been going on for far, far longer than just the past 5 months. And you know what...? I'll just go ahead and say it...

DNA your kids.


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## richardsharpe (Jul 8, 2014)

Good evening confusedandhurt
You need to decide how you want to react. You certainly have a right to leave - but don't feel that you *must* leave if you don't want to.

If it were me, I wouldn't leave, but I would insist on no more drinking (for either of us). Anyone who can't control themselves when drunk shouldn't drink. 

BTW, one of the reasons I don't drink is that I know I do not have the best self control. I suspect I would have cheated long ago if I were a drinker. Knowing that, I don't drink.


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

I'm not following. So they had sex five months ago, and just got caught it the tent two weeks ago? Nothing between?


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

richardsharpe said:


> Good evening confusedandhurt
> You need to decide how you want to react. You certainly have a right to leave - but don't feel that you *must* leave if you don't want to.
> 
> If it were me, I wouldn't leave, but I would insist on no more drinking (for either of us). Anyone who can't control themselves when drunk shouldn't drink.
> ...


Um....no. She leaves. Not him.


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

bandit.45 said:


> I'm not following. So they had sex five months ago, and just got caught it the tent two weeks ago? Nothing between?


Doesn't quite add up, does it?


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## PhillyGuy13 (Nov 29, 2013)

Once is an accident... Twice is a pattern.

So the other guys wife caught her husband with your wife two weeks ago. You were asleep in the tent.

It also happened five months ago? Did your wife admit to this how did you find out about that time? Because I assume you would not have gone camping again if you knew they kissed five months ago. And you CEETAINLY wouldn't have turned in early second time around I assume.

How far apart do you live from your best friend? Because methinks they could have or have been meeting up. 

Mr. Gus is right. She's lying to you and full of baloney. You know how to tell she is lying to you? Her mouth is moving.


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## Confusednhrt (Sep 15, 2014)

Should have clarified. Don't know what happened 5 months ago but they were caught fully clothed 2 weeks ago. Got the story from both separately and it lined up but still don't believe either of them


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## PhillyGuy13 (Nov 29, 2013)

bandit.45 said:


> I'm not following. So they had sex five months ago, and just got caught it the tent two weeks ago? Nothing between?


Me confused too.

Please elaborate on the timeframe re: when everyone found out.

EDIT: I'm more confused. Did something happen five months ago or not? And if so how did you find out?


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## 6301 (May 11, 2013)

I don't know where you heard the idea that if you divorce your wife, your divorcing your children because it ain't so.

You can still be a great dad and be single but I have to tell you that sticking around with her and her cheating and lies will not make life better for your kids. Sooner or later they'll know that Mom and Dad don't get along and it plays on the kids because they might be young but they have ears so the pick up on what you don't want them to her and they also can see too.

My advice is this. if you will not be able to trust her any longer and so far her track record speaks for it's self then have her served and move on. If the kids want to know why, look at your wife and say to he, "You tell them, you caused this" and let her deal with her own problems. 

Get yourself a good lawyer, get your finances in order and move on.


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## Confusednhrt (Sep 15, 2014)

When they were caught 2 weeks ago I began questioning my wife and she admitted that they made out 5 months ago but claims it went no further then that. I had no idea until the OM wife caught them that anything happened prior.


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

We had a very similar story to this one here on TAM a couple of years ago. Group camping weekend. WW sneaks out of husbands tent. A while later husband wakes up and hears moaning. Finds his wife grinding acorns with some other fella in his tent.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Graywolf2 (Nov 10, 2013)

Confusednhrt said:


> She swears that it meant nothing and that she was just drunk but I feel like this had to have happened with him or other people in the past. I'm a wreck because we have 2 children that are ages 4 and 2.


It might be early in the discussion but for your piece of mind I would DNA your kids. At their age you can do it without them understanding what you're doing. You don't have to tell anyone. 

Buy a kit at WalMart, Amazon or about any drug store for about $30. Swab the inside of your cheek and the kids with a Q-tip. Mail the kit to a lab with an additional $130.


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## PhillyGuy13 (Nov 29, 2013)

As I said earlier I would now question anything that comes out of her mouth. 

Where does your friend live in relation to you guys?

This is something that could have began at camp five months ago; or this is something that has been going on for significant time prior to that. At this point you have no way of knowing. 

I doubt the plan is to kiss and grope every few months at camp when you pass out in the tent. I would not be shocked if more happens, away from camp.

Do you have acces to your wife's phone, her phone records, her text history, email accounts, social media, online games and chat apps?


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## PhillyGuy13 (Nov 29, 2013)

Re the DNA test.

It is a good idea, you are testing your wife, not the kids. You can still be a dad on the slim chance they aren't yours.

But what the DNA test does is it opens up your wife's eyes to the f--kin sh!t storm her actions have created within her marriage and family.


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## honcho (Oct 5, 2013)

Confusednhrt said:


> Should have clarified. Don't know what happened 5 months ago but they were caught fully clothed 2 weeks ago. Got the story from both separately and it lined up but still don't believe either of them


Well they both did have time to get there story straight so they wouldnt contradict each other. They are going to protect themselves and each other right now. 

You will now start to experience the world of trickle truth as they try and downplay it. Using the drunk excuse, only happened once or twice. They wont admit to more than you or the OM wife already know.

Have you done any investigate work yet? Checked phone records or excessing texting or facebook yet? Unfortunately to get the truth you usually need to learn it yourself first. I suggest start doing some investigation and also tell the OM wife to do the same.


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## lovelyblue (Oct 25, 2013)

Drinking or not drinking.

How can your wife make out with your friends while you and his wife are in the same area???

The friend and your wife have to respect for you his wife or for friendship.


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## lovelyblue (Oct 25, 2013)

Confused you say that you know this guy for 2yrs and how old is your youngest??

DNA test.


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

lovelyblue said:


> Drinking or not drinking.
> 
> *How can your wife make out with your friends while you and his wife are in the same area???*
> 
> The friend and your wife have to respect for you his wife or for friendship.


Or, you know... even *at all*.


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

lovelyblue said:


> Confused you say that you know this guy for 2yrs and how old is your youngest??
> 
> DNA test.


It's not necessarily just about whether or not THIS OM could possibly be the biological father of either of OP's kids. After all, per OP's own words, she could have very well been doing stuff like this -- w/ multiple OMs -- for some time now.


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

GusPolinski said:


> Or, you know... even *at all*.


Obviously this is now an ex friend right?
Zero contact with him the pos.


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

honcho said:


> Well they both did have time to get there story straight so they wouldnt contradict each other. They are going to protect themselves and each other right now.
> 
> You will now start to experience the world of trickle truth as they try and downplay it. Using the drunk excuse, only happened once or twice. They wont admit to more than you or the OM wife already know.
> 
> Have you done any investigate work yet? Checked phone records or excessing texting or facebook yet? Unfortunately to get the truth you usually need to learn it yourself first. *I suggest start doing some investigation and also tell the OM wife to do the same.*


Yep and yep.

OP, your "friend's" wife should be your new best friend. Talk w/ her often, and compare notes. Just don't let anything inappropriate develop between the two of you, as that would do little more than invite even more trouble that you don't need into your life.


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## lovelyblue (Oct 25, 2013)

_It's not necessarily just about whether or not THIS OM could possibly be the biological father of either of OP's kids. After all, per OP's own words, she could have very well been doing stuff like this -- w/ multiple OMs -- for some time now._

My thing is if a person is willing to cheat when their spouse is inches away from them with a friend.

The who knows what she has done when her BH wasn't in her presences.


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## LongWalk (Apr 4, 2013)

Did OMW catch them 5 months ago and not inform you?

What is her read on the situation?

Does your wife often drink and then act irresponsibly?

Does she work?

Can you manage physical custody of your children if you divorce?

Has your wife been remorseful? Sounds like you are not healing.

How old were you when you met?

Have you read about the 180?

By the way, OM is not your friend. Hope you are not socializing with him anymore. He should be an ex friend.


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## TRy (Sep 14, 2011)

Confusednhrt said:


> Both times we were at a campground where everyone was drinking heavily and I was sleeping in our tent while she was kissing/groping with him.


 Since this happened more than once over a number of months, it means that this is part of how they interact with each other and not a one time drunken thing that they later regretted. The fact that they would do this while you and the other man's wife were there in the very same camp, means that they have a hard time keeping their hands off of each other, and does not bode well for what they were doing back home where they have better control of cheating without being caught. You now have to ask was she really out with the girls the other night? Has she been seeing this other man (OM) when you are at work? When she dropped something off at the other man's home, was his wife there? There are many other such questions you need to be asking.


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## Confusednhrt (Sep 15, 2014)

My wife admitted to the first time while he refused to admit it to his wife. We had no idea. He is no longer a friend. Both kids look exactly like me so I'd be surprised if not mine but can't hurt to get DNA test. My job requires travel so full custody would be difficult, if not impossible. I don't know what the 180 is. 

The OM wife has decided to make it work and after we got the stories compared we haven't spoken to each other.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

Get together with his wife to compare notes.


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## lovelyblue (Oct 25, 2013)

Confusednhrt

I'm sorry for you having to be here.

I would tell you wife that you want her to stop drinking.

And you want all accesses to her accounts.-(E-mail FB twitter ect.)


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## Calibre1212 (Aug 11, 2014)

Please read the Newbie thread here (below in my signature). Adultery is very difficult to navigate and is worsened by layers and layers of lies/deceit after DD. Please don't blame yourself and be kind to yourself more than anything else. Remember too that alcohol makes us LOSE our inhibitions so since she was caught doing that with your best friend she always wanted to. That has no bearing on you, your character nor your future. It has everything to do with hers, and his. Affected marriages cannot recover from adultery in the cesspool of a false reconciliation. Read the thread to know what a false R looks like. You have had a double dose of betrayal, you have to recover from your best friend too. 

Be aware of your needs most of all and never doubt yourself again. The silver lining on this horrific cloud is your journey towards a new self-awareness...A new you, within 6 months to a year, whether you leave her "train-station" or not. N.B. If anyone is going to change, it will be her. No need to rescue a marriage or family she is destroying with her selfish foolishness. You keep your dignity at all costs. It was never given to you by her nor anyone else. You love yourself like never before, it can only get better from here...There is only one way up from rock-bottom.


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## honcho (Oct 5, 2013)

Confusednhrt said:


> My wife admitted to the first time while he refused to admit it to his wife. We had no idea. He is no longer a friend. Both kids look exactly like me so I'd be surprised if not mine but can't hurt to get DNA test. My job requires travel so full custody would be difficult, if not impossible. I don't know what the 180 is.
> 
> The OM wife has decided to make it work and after we got the stories compared we haven't spoken to each other.


Whether the OM wife decides to make it work or you decide to make it work in your relationship you do need to know what really happened/is happening. The two already have conflicting stories about 5 months ago. 

The more the two of them get let off the hook now the greater chance its gonna happen again especially considering that you have to travel for your job. If it gets rugswept now, most times they just learn to get sneakier. 

No matter how you want to proceed you need to understand the true scope of what is going on so you know what your up against.


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## workindad (May 7, 2011)

Sorry you are here.

A few thoughts- your friend, is not your friend. Not at all. If you haven't already, cut him out of your life like the cancer he is.

This is not a free pass or a minimization attempt for your wife. She needs to own her sh!t as well.

Do not assume that you have the whole story now. I highly doubt you do. Story setting is not uncommon. That's where both of the waywards spout the same rehearsed lie. Just because two liars tell a story- that does not make it true and both are confirmed liars.

Your wife has no issue cheating on you and hiding it- lying about it- then rubbing your nose in it by doing it again. You still wouldn't know if it weren't for them getting caught.

Get tested for STDs- no telling what souvenir she may have picked up.

Insist on a polygraph and judge her reaction- you may be surprised that way, be prepared with places in your area that actually do them.

DNA the kids- get a kit at a drug store near you, most of the chains sell them. You can also google paternity testing online and get some options that way. This is cheap, easy, pain free and private- I used this myself.

Drop a var in her car and or keylog the PC. You will likely find out quickly if there is more you don't know.

Read up on the 180 and get in that mind set now.


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

It's time for OP to get his hands on his WW's phone in order to recover deleted texts and calls records, methinks. And if it happens to be an iPhone...



GusPolinski said:


> Wondershare Dr. Fone
> 
> The above link is for the Mac version of Wondershare's Dr. Fone app. There is a Windows version available as well.
> 
> ...


Geez I hate quoting that.


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## ThePheonix (Jan 3, 2013)

Confusednhrt my man, these two were attempting a little "rencontre sexuelle" right under your and his old lady's noses while the two of you slept blissfully in your tents. And their history of this behavior goes back at least five months that you know about? 
I'd hate to see what these two would be doing if ya'll went camping every week. But you did say you travel a lot, meaning you leave this example of loyalty and integrity by herself with your good old best friend lurking about. Kids or no kids, you need to cut this broad loose Dawg.


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## commonsenseisn't (Aug 13, 2014)

Can you recollect how many other times your wife, ex friend, and drunk parties coincide? If there are other events you may have only scratched the surface.


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

commonsenseisn't said:


> Can you recollect how many other times your wife, ex friend, and drunk parties coincide? If there are other events you may have only scratched the surface.


Since Mach hasn't posted it yet...










Here's another...










And another...


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## PhillyGuy13 (Nov 29, 2013)

PhillyGuy13 said:


> As I said earlier I would now question anything that comes out of her mouth.
> 
> *Where does your friend live in relation to you guys?*
> 
> ...


With you frequently away for work, these questions are even more relevant.


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## notmyrealname4 (Apr 9, 2014)

OP,

This man was never your "friend". Fwiw, I wouldn't consider anyone a "friend" until you have known them 2 years; during that time, they have been there for you through good times and bad --as you have for them.

Your story just adds more support for my belief that drinking is a bad idea. I'll allow that some folks can be light drinkers without ill effect. But if people get together and drink heavily, it's just a matter of time until something goes awry.

IF it turns out your wife and this "friend" restricted themselves to kissing and other above-the-navel activities; I would be for counseling and an attempt to reconcile. If it was genital sex/orgasms, then I would tend to think your marriage is over.

If your kids test as not yours, they're still your kids emotionally. They haven't done anything wrong. I guess it helps to know for legal reasons.

I hope you learn the truth and take the path that will work out the best for you and the children.


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## bryanp (Aug 25, 2011)

I would suggest:
1. Demand a polygraph. If she is lying then:
2. DNA the kids...It can't hurt
3. Get tested for STD's.

I think people are missing also a key point here. What does it say for the wife who claims at least twice to go camping with the husband and when his back is turned or sleeping she engages in physical activity with his best friend? I think both the wife and other husband were getting off feeling that they had engaged in this type of physical behavior right under your noses. They enjoyed playing off their spouses as complete fools and symbolically mocking them. It clearly was a thrill for them. This really has to be almost the ultimate in disrespect to you.

IF YOU DO NOT RESPECT YOURSELF THEN WHO WILL? It certainly cannot be your wife.


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## TRy (Sep 14, 2011)

Confusednhrt said:


> My job requires travel


 Your wife seeing the other man (OM) when you are out of town is a whole lot easier and safer for them than the two times (that you know of) that they fooled around in camp, when both you and the other man's wife were there. If they could not keep their hands off of each other when you were around, what are the odds that they kept their hands off of each other when you were out of town?

According to the MSNBC.com/iVillage Lust, Love & Loyalty survey, “Ironically, while we tend to overestimate cheating in society, we are often blind to it in our own lives. If your partner is cheating, chances are, you have no idea." "Six in 10 cheaters believe they totally got away with their affair and another one in 10 felt their partner was suspicious, but never found out for sure.” Six in 10 plus one in 10 means 70% never discovered the cheating. The study goes on to state “Few cheaters — only 2 percent — were busted in the act. And even when confronted with a partner's suspicions, only 6 percent of both men and women confessed to having an affair.” 

Bottom line, you know more about your wife's cheating than most as only 2% are ever "busted in the act" in the act of cheating like your wife and the other man were, and there is little chance that your wife will confess to the full extent of her cheating. You should assume that the odds are that the cheating was more extensive than you will ever know, and make your decisions going forward accordingly.


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## thatbpguy (Dec 24, 2012)

As usual, coming in late...

Your first step is to decide if you want to possibly try and reconcile. If so, she is going to have to be honest enough for you believe her. Then, aside from counseling, I would suggest quit drinking totally as it seems to be the basis for your woes. Next, get new friends. Then I think you need to learn how to monitor her. Learn how to use a VAR, monitor her texts...

If there is simply no way to work this out, try and amiably work out joint custody for the kids.


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## manfromlamancha (Jul 4, 2013)

You have been married for only 5 years and have two very young kids (4 & 2) so I'm guessing that you both are fairly young.

Your wife does not appear to be acting like a wife or even a mature adult - she thinks that it is OK to make out with other guys when you are out camping or any such opportunity presents itself. This immaturity would suggest that she is also open to do this at other times even at home when the opportunity, again, presents itself. And I am sure there are men who would be more than happy to present her with such opportunities.

You need to check back over the five years to look at all the times she was alone, you guys went camping/drinking and you fell asleep and start thinking about what men were around each time (including OM). Chances are high that she has done this before.

Was your wife like this before you married her (drinking and flirting/kissing every guy in sight) ?

Does she generally drink a lot and get drunk a lot ?

What is she like at home ? As a mother ?

She obviously has no respect for her marriage, you or the kids.

A poly would be a good idea even if it just scares her into answering your questions in the parking lot. The important thing with a poly is to get the questions right and this is why others are saying not to assume that she has only done this with this guy.

And what is your limit/boundary/line-in-the-sand ?

I dont understand why she came clean about her doing this 5 months ago when all she had to confess to was the time she was caught (by OMW) 2 weeks ago. Especially since she had a chance to get her story straight with the OM. Maybe it was to throw you off digging deeper and finding out that they have been having sex for a long time and giving you the two instances as a way of making you think that you now had all the info necessary.

Be very careful here and first and foremost decide if you want to (or even could bring yourself to) live with this woman after what she has done.


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## italianjob (May 7, 2014)

A little bit more detail and background would help...

Told the way you did your story makes your wife sounds like she has no boundaries and very little common sense.

How were they caught? how did they explain their behaviour? It doesn't sound like something like this between the two of them only happened once (or twice, for that matter...)

How was your marriage and your family life? How does your life behave in everyday life? Does she have a history for this kind of things? 
In other words, beside having kids together, is there a reason to want to stay with a woman who will make out with the first man she finds after a little drinking? (I'm not saying that's her standard behaviour, but if you don't provide context, that's what it looks like from your story)


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

GusPolinski said:


> Since Mach hasn't posted it yet...
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Am I the only one ??? 


:rofl::lol:


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## italianjob (May 7, 2014)

thatbpguy said:


> As usual, coming in late...
> 
> *Your first step is to decide if you want to possibly try and reconcile*. If so, she is going to have to be honest enough for you believe her. Then, aside from counseling, I would suggest quit drinking totally as it seems to be the basis for your woes. Next, get new friends. Then I think you need to learn how to monitor her. Learn how to use a VAR, monitor her texts...
> 
> If there is simply no way to work this out, try and amiably work out joint custody for the kids.


Not at all! 
To take a decision like that at this stage would be foolish.

His first step is to try and know what is really been happening and what lies behind his wife's behaviour, and the eventual true extent of the betrayal.
Only then he might make up his mind about wanting to stay with her or D, IMO.


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## See_Listen_Love (Jun 28, 2012)

I think talking about divorce is way out of line with the facts so far.

It may have happened like it looks now, they got the hots for each other and besides the mentioned making out under certain circumstances, nothing else happened.

So while looking out for more data, as advised above, go into counseling together to find out if you can repair the relation.


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## awake1 (Jan 29, 2013)

Confusednhrt said:


> When they were caught 2 weeks ago I began questioning my wife and she admitted that they made out 5 months ago but claims it went no further then that. I had no idea until the OM wife caught them that anything happened prior.


I've seen dozens or hundreds of threads here. In those, making out has been code for "we've had sex" 100% of the time. 


This is called trickle truth. This was not the only time it happened. There has been sex. 

If she deleted the txts to this other man, then you can safely assume it's a hell of a lot deeper than a campfire makeout session. 

Do not fall for the lies.

Think back, if you're like most wayward spouses that somehow knew something wasn't right. Think back to any suspicious moments. Your spidey sense was probably working properly.

Get the phone records, and you'll have all the information you need. That along with facebook is where cheaters usually screw up.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

Are you saying the incident 5 months ago was lso on a camping trip? His wife happened to wake up, went out and caught them?

You have to go into full investigation mode unless this is your dealbreaker. Very well could be all there is to it. It just doesn't sound like you and his wife weren't set up so they could have some alone time.

Put a var, sony brand with lithium batteries, velcroed under the seat of her car. Leave another one in your house.

Does she work?

Not the kind of woman you can leave behind while you're out of town.

How is she reacting to divorce?


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## Gabriel (May 10, 2011)

bandit.45 said:


> We had a very similar story to this one here on TAM a couple of years ago. Group camping weekend. WW sneaks out of husbands tent. A while later husband wakes up and hears moaning. Finds his wife grinding acorns with some other fella in his tent.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Yes, I remember that story. Did it end up being true?


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

Gabriel said:


> Yes, I remember that story. Did it end up being true?


I don't recall. I think the OP bailed and never came back. Might have been a troll.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

Why would they have a tent to themselves? Putting up tents is hard work--hence pop up trailers. Why would there be an empty extra tent for them to fondle each other in? Unless this happened during the day when other campers were out doing something else. 

We need details.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

bandit.45 said:


> We had a very similar story to this one here on TAM a couple of years ago. Group camping weekend. WW sneaks out of husbands tent. A while later husband wakes up and hears moaning. Finds his wife grinding acorns with some other fella in his tent.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I remember that one and I immediately thought of it when I read this thread.


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## GROUNDPOUNDER (Mar 8, 2013)

I agree that if they were comfortable enough to both sneak off and start heavy kissing, groping and most likely sliding their hands down the front of each others pants - They probably have a history. The "last time" you said they did this, were you camping also, or were you away from home for work?

If they don't have a history, then your wife seems to get pretty "easy" when she's drinking. I would imagine that if the OM's wife would have caught them about 15/20 minutes later then she did, they would have been having sex by then.

If you've been away from home on a regular basis and she's ever gotten a baby sitter, so she could go out... The likelihood of her having "stepped out" on your marriage is good, IMO.

I would tell here that you're bringing her to take a polygraph Tomorrow. Watch how she reacts. I'll bet she looks scared at first, then a little while later she'll act like she's p!ssed off. Then she'll tell you that she won't take one. Then, you'll know she's done more than kissing/groping behind your back.


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## badmemory (Jul 31, 2012)

GROUNDPOUNDER said:


> I agree that if they were comfortable enough to both sneak off and start heavy kissing, groping and most likely sliding their hands down the front of each others pants - *They probably have a history.*


Yep, I agree with this. She didn't accidentally fall into that tent. It took familiarity and forethought - alcohol or not. 

OP, you need to make yourself an expert on monitoring her. If you do, there's a good chance you can unearth her past communications and/or catch her talking/texting/e-mailing this guy again.

VAR in her car, keylogger on her PC, spyware on her cell.


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## chillymorn (Aug 11, 2010)

did you kick your "friends" a$$ yet?

then file for divorce!

JMHO


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## lovelyblue (Oct 25, 2013)

_She didn't accidentally fall into that tent. _

And she did it twice.


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## PhillyGuy13 (Nov 29, 2013)

bandit.45 said:


> Why would they have a tent to themselves? Putting up tents is hard work--hence pop up trailers. Why would there be an empty extra tent for them to fondle each other in? Unless this happened during the day when other campers were out doing something else.
> 
> We need details.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I'm great at pitching a tent 

In my mind he was passed out in one tent, the OM wife was in another tent, and his wife and his friend were roasting chestnuts by the open fire. 

But who knows.


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## Confusednhrt (Sep 15, 2014)

I was sleeping in one tent and the OM's wife wasn't supposed to be there that night because she was out at a bachelorrette party. I have checked the phone records and nothing shows up for phone calls or texting. I told her that I felt that a polygraph test would bring me peace of mind and she got angry with me and told me that I need to stop attacking her and that she felt uncomfortable taking one. After arguing for a while she said that if it made me feel better then she would take it but wasn't comfortable doing so. I am actually less concerned about the OM that I know about at this point and whether or not there have been other incidents in the past that she doesn't want me to find out about. He was a "friend" for 15 years and I asked him to just tell me everything so that I could have a chance to move forward and I almost believe that he did.

I feel like her response to the polygraph request tells me everything that I need to know. She commented that "she feels like she is being questioned on everything in our entire relationship" and I explained that she is because she destroyed the relationship that we had and if she isn't willing to do whatever I need to find peace of mind that we are wasting our time.

Sorry about the long rants I have just been working all day and just had time to respond and want to try and clarify the questions that have been asked.


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

The cell phone records are not definitive. If they both have iPhones, iMessages don't show up. And there's a bunch of other apps available on all platforms that bypass itemized billing (WhatsApp, TextPlus, even Words With Friends). 

C
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## PhillyGuy13 (Nov 29, 2013)

Well, tell her you are uncomfortable with another dude's tongue down her throat, so now she knows discomfort too.

Does he live close by??


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## convert (Oct 4, 2013)

^^^^ oh yes. I like that (what he said)

Well thank her for wanting to take the poly to help you heal. 
Now go ahead and schedule the test. you might still get a confession before the test.

she does not "get it", that it has shaken the whole marriage and trust


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## Confusednhrt (Sep 15, 2014)

He lives about 10 minutes away. I really feel my best course of action is to schedule a meeting with a lawyer and try to figure out how much time I would get with my kids after a divorce. 

I have always felt she was a little selfish in the marriage and now that she has destroyed the life that we had I still feel like she is making it all about her. She is complaining that I am giving her the cold shoulder at times and that I'm not trying to do anything to fix the situation.


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## Hicks (Jan 14, 2011)

All cheaterspeak.


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

Confusednhrt said:


> He lives about 10 minutes away. I really feel my best course of action is to schedule a meeting with a lawyer and try to figure out how much time I would get with my kids after a divorce.
> 
> I have always felt she was a little selfish in the marriage and now that she has destroyed the life that we had I still feel like she is making it all about her. She is complaining that I am giving her the cold shoulder at times and that I'm not trying to do anything to fix the situation.


She is the one that has to fix things not you.


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## badmemory (Jul 31, 2012)

Confusednhrt said:


> She is complaining that I am giving her the cold shoulder at times and that I'm not trying to do anything to fix the situation.


If you're talking about the "situation" being her cheating, then you are on the right track. 

Cold shoulder? What does she expect? She should be grateful that you haven't filed yet - and be bending over backwards to demonstrate remorse. 

You're not doing anything to fix this? Wow. You're not supposed to. That's her job.


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

Confusednhrt said:


> I was sleeping in one tent and the OM's wife wasn't supposed to be there that night because she was out at a bachelorrette party. *I have checked the phone records and nothing shows up for phone calls or texting.* I told her that I felt that a polygraph test would bring me peace of mind and she got angry with me and told me that I need to stop attacking her and that she felt uncomfortable taking one. After arguing for a while she said that if it made me feel better then she would take it but wasn't comfortable doing so. I am actually less concerned about the OM that I know about at this point and whether or not there have been other incidents in the past that she doesn't want me to find out about. He was a "friend" for 15 years and I asked him to just tell me everything so that I could have a chance to move forward and I almost believe that he did.
> 
> I feel like her response to the polygraph request tells me everything that I need to know. She commented that "she feels like she is being questioned on everything in our entire relationship" and I explained that she is because she destroyed the relationship that we had and if she isn't willing to do whatever I need to find peace of mind that we are wasting our time.
> 
> Sorry about the long rants I have just been working all day and just had time to respond and want to try and clarify the questions that have been asked.


Just want to point this out... 

The lack of phone calls and texts on the phone bill isn't necessarily definitive. She could've been/could be using something like iMessage (iPhone) or even an ephemeral messaging app like Snapchat to communicate w/ OM or whoever else. Get the phone and dump it.

And by the way, now that you've mentioned a poly (and given her reaction to it), you should either (a) schedule one ASAP or (b) go ahead and file for divorce. If you schedule one, you'll need to come up w/ a list of 10 or so questions for her to answer during the test. And this is very important... DO. NOT. LET. HER. SEE. THE. QUESTIONS. BEFOREHAND.

You should also start checking her computer, phone, tablet, or whatever for Google searches along the lines of "how to beat a polygraph". A keylogger would help w/ this.

I tend to agree w/ your assessment re: her reaction to the poly, by the way... it says a LOT.


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## LongWalk (Apr 4, 2013)

You don't have to divorce, but you can file and tell your WW that you are open to the idea of reconciliation. She cannot reconcile by herself. You must forgive her at some point, but you are not there yet.

She should be hugging you and saying the right stuff often. If she cannot make the effort, then end it.


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## badmemory (Jul 31, 2012)

In regards to the poly, since she only "begrudgingly" agreed, I'd make her go through with it. If she had responded positively - like "Okay, I'll be glad to if that what you need to heal. I've told you everything so I'm not worried". Then I might feel differently. But that's why you ask - to judge her reaction.

Make sure you find a reputable poly guy. Check with law enforcement for a recommendation.

And as important - decide what you're going to do now, when one of the following happens:

- She backs out of the test (most likely)

- She fails the test

- She passes the test

- She confesses ahead of the test. 

Even if she does confess, it likely won't be the full truth. Don't let her bargain with you to avoid taking it. Insist that she carry through with it.


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## PhillyGuy13 (Nov 29, 2013)

Guilty or innocent, nobody is going to click their heels in glee at the thought of a poly. A her reaction is inconclusive. That said, schedule it.

10 minutes apart? And you travel a lot for work? I don't have a good feeling about any of it.

The fact that she doesn't seem to think its a big deal is the biggest sign for me. She should be oh the ground crying at your feet. Instead she wants it all to go away, lest you find out more details.


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## lovelyblue (Oct 25, 2013)

Originally Posted by Confusednhrt View Post
She is complaining that I am giving her the cold shoulder at times and that I'm not trying to do anything to fix the situation
_________

What does she expect you to do? after she twice made out with your so called friend?


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

lovelyblue said:


> Originally Posted by Confusednhrt View Post
> She is complaining that I am giving her the cold shoulder at times and that I'm not trying to do anything to fix the situation
> _________
> 
> What does she expect you to do? after she twice made out with your so called friend?


Ask her if this was the other way around how she would feel?
Yeah we know the answer.


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## badmemory (Jul 31, 2012)

PhillyGuy13 said:


> Guilty or innocent, nobody is going to click their heels in glee at the thought of a poly.


That's true PhillyGuy. But I'd try to put myself in the place of a spouse who has told the truth and sees this as an opportunity to prove it; and to save their marriage. That's not quite what I see here.


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

badmemory said:


> That's true PhillyGuy. But I'd try to put myself in the place of a spouse who has told the truth and sees this as an opportunity to prove it; and to save their marriage. That's not quite what I see here.


What I see is an unremorseful selfish entitled princess.


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## GROUNDPOUNDER (Mar 8, 2013)

Confusednhrt said:


> I told her that I felt that a polygraph test would bring me peace of mind and she got angry with me and told me that I need to stop attacking her and that she felt uncomfortable taking one. After arguing for a while *she said that if it made me feel better then she would take it but wasn't comfortable doing so.* I am actually less concerned about the OM that I know about at this point and whether or not there have been other incidents in the past that she doesn't want me to find out about. He was a "friend" for 15 years and I asked him to just tell me everything so that I could have a chance to move forward and I almost believe that he did.
> 
> I feel like her response to the polygraph request tells me everything that I need to know.


Then it worked! She reluctantly agrees and now you say "_I am actually less concerned about the OM that I know about at this point and whether or not there have been other incidents in the past that she doesn't want me to find out about."_

Boy she sure knows how to read you and get you to do(or not do) what she wants.

Look, we don't know that your WS has had any out right sex with other men since you've been together. But from what you written here, it sure looks to be a distinct possibility.

If I were in you're shoes, Id tell her "Great! You passing a poly test will go a LOOONG way for me to forgive you and try to put what you've done to me behind us."

I'd give her a date about a week, or two out of when you'll be bringing here to take the test. DO NOT give her any more info on it. Then, I'd watch how she behaved and acted as the date approached.

If she's hiding anything really bad, she'll be effected by it. I'd have a VAR running incase she called someone about it. If she is lying, it may be the only way to here the truth.

Me, personnaly, may not have schedule the poly. Only told her that it was scheduled. Then, on the "test date" I'd drive at least a half hour to where she thinks the test is suppose to be. If she hasn't cracked by then, she's either telling the truth, or a REALLY all in kind of lyer.

I'd then pull into a nice resterant's parking lot and tell her. "I've decided that I'm going to trust you and take your word that nothing more had ever happened. I'd better not regret it...

Let's eat.


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## badmemory (Jul 31, 2012)

GROUNDPOUNDER said:


> Then it worked! She reluctantly agrees and now you say "_I am actually less concerned about the OM that I know about at this point and whether or not there have been other incidents in the past that she doesn't want me to find out about."_
> 
> Boy she sure knows how to read you and get you to do(or not do) what she wants.
> 
> ...


I could see doing that. But I'd be an "all in" kind of bluffer. I'd take her all the way to the polygraph office door before I turned around and went to dinner - lol.


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## awake1 (Jan 29, 2013)

Did you get the phone records from the company and not from her phone? Those can be easily deleted. I assume your friend has a cell phone? 

He's 10 minutes away and you're out of town a lot? Heck if she's willing to make out with your friend, (WITH YOU THERE) i'd over turn the wagon and look through everything.

Pretty blatant something is going on.

I'd say go through with the poly all the way.


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## italianjob (May 7, 2014)

By what you're telling us, her attitude shows clearly:
- That she doesn't think cheating is a big deal. I think if you dig a little you're going to find a lot of bad stuff.
- That she is not remorseful at all.
At this point you can't really R, you would be just rug sweeping.

I would ask you again to provide some back story on your marriage, because, beside her being the mother of your children (but I would DNA test them...), I can't really see a single reason why you would want to stay with someone like this, from what you've told us.

Maybe the only way to shake her up would be to file directly for Divorce (without telling her you're open for R, this is bulls**t, this could work only if she thinks you really mean it)


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## treyvion (Apr 29, 2013)

PhillyGuy13 said:


> Guilty or innocent, nobody is going to click their heels in glee at the thought of a poly. A her reaction is inconclusive. That said, schedule it.
> 
> 10 minutes apart? And you travel a lot for work? I don't have a good feeling about any of it.
> 
> The fact that she doesn't seem to think its a big deal is the biggest sign for me. She should be oh the ground crying at your feet. Instead she wants it all to go away, lest you find out more details.


When your buddy robs you and lets someone else in on it, you let them go. Maybe later in life after many years they may come to the error of their ways. In the short term, this is someone who has steeled themself in order to betray you, ththis is what they wanted to do.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

GusPolinski said:


> Just want to point this out...
> 
> The lack of phone calls and texts on the phone bill isn't necessarily definitive. She could've been/could be using something like iMessage (iPhone) or even an ephemeral messaging app like Snapchat to communicate w/ OM or whoever else. Get the phone and dump it.
> 
> ...


A keylogger is a must because if she is computer savy or been clued in by someone, she just has to use "in private browsing" to hide anything she does on a computer or tablet. The she can email, browse or anything eles on the internet with no record.

When you are talking about the poly, do not even think of telling her you are going to ask her any questions beyond the current situation.


Her response looks very guilty already. If you get a parking lot confession do not cancel the poly no matter what. They confess a little bit to avoid the whole story.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

The second time, at least, they intentionally stayed up after you went to bed. Very odd his wife showed up without warning. Did you ask her if she suspected something?

If either of them are experienced cheaters or checked the internet for info on hiding an affair, they would leave very little evidence of an affair.

You need to dig very deep including find my phone, vars, keyloggers, spyware on phones, gps etc.

Otoh, it could just be two stupid drunks copping a feel. I've seen that happen.

In any event your wife needs to believe she's on the brink of divorce no matter what you decide on reconcilliation.

One thing you can do, is leave windows open on your computer like dadsdivorce.com(you need to check this site out anyway), search divorce packets for your state, divorce attorney etc.

Do not tell her you have decided to reconcile even if you do. The more she sweats the more likely she will behave.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

How far has she admitted the groping went? 

Was the other occasion a camping trip too? Did they stay up after everyone else ws in bed?


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## Confusednhrt (Sep 15, 2014)

I know that if no children were involved I wouldn't stay. I hate the thought that she cheated on me and now I won't get to see my kids everyday and pay her $1,500 a month as a thank you for cheating on me. 

If you asked me prior to this to explain my marriage I would have said we had a good marriage and both of us were very happy. I agree with the poster that said she doesn't think it's a big deal that she did this. She texted me that she is sorry and needs to be more understanding of how I feel but it seems like she doesn't really mean it. 

I appreciate everyone taking time out of their day to communicate with me. This has been helpful for making me think more clearly since I have not really been in contact with anyone else because of the shame that I feel like this is my fault.


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## ThePheonix (Jan 3, 2013)

Confusednhrt said:


> I have not really been in contact with anyone else because of the shame that I feel like this is my fault.


If it happens again and you continue to hang around waiting for the next shoe to drop, it will be your fault.


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## Gabriel (May 10, 2011)

Confusednhrt said:


> I know that if no children were involved I wouldn't stay. I hate the thought that she cheated on me and now I won't get to see my kids everyday and pay her $1,500 a month as a thank you for cheating on me.
> 
> If you asked me prior to this to explain my marriage I would have said we had a good marriage and both of us were very happy. I agree with the poster that said she doesn't think it's a big deal that she did this. She texted me that she is sorry and needs to be more understanding of how I feel but it seems like she doesn't really mean it.
> 
> I appreciate everyone taking time out of their day to communicate with me. This has been helpful for making me think more clearly since I have not really been in contact with anyone else because of the shame that I feel like this is my fault.


You are in the early stages. Take a minute to slow down your brain. Go through with the poly though. Folks here are right - she may confess in the parking lot. Or, she might just hate the idea of having to do one.

No big decisions can be made right now. Just plod through your steps. Keep us posted and we can help you along the way.


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

Confusednhrt said:


> I know that if no children were involved I wouldn't stay. I hate the thought that she cheated on me and now I won't get to see my kids everyday and pay her $1,500 a month as a thank you for cheating on me.
> 
> If you asked me prior to this to explain my marriage I would have said we had a good marriage and both of us were very happy. I agree with the poster that said she doesn't think it's a big deal that she did this. She texted me that she is sorry and needs to be more understanding of how I feel but it seems like she doesn't really mean it.
> 
> I appreciate everyone taking time out of their day to communicate with me. This has been helpful for making me think more clearly since *I have not really been in contact with anyone else because of the shame that I feel like this is my fault.*


Dude... it's not your fault. I know that doesn't necessarily help to wash away the shame, but it's not your fault.

And you know that. Now you just need to *BELIEVE* it.


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## thummper (Dec 19, 2013)

*How is it your fault *that your wife and this other putz-supposed-to-be friend of yours were panting and probably dry-humping in a tent on this camping trip????  If your wife can't understand why you're so upset and feels it's no big deal, she's really pretty clueless. I'd be absolutely *livid* myself. :banghead:


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## bfree (Sep 30, 2012)

Schedule the poly. Before you re-hitch up your wagon you need to know if this mule is lame. While I hope she is telling the truth and eventually comes around to repairing the damage she's caused remember that she's not the only woman out there. You can still have a wonderful family life and your kids can still see you as part of a loving couple but it doesn't necessarily have to be with her.


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## Dyokemm (Apr 24, 2013)

I'm sensing a 'parking lot' confession in the near future based on her reaction to the poly demand.

She obviously REALLY doesn't want to take one, but knows that outright refusing after all that she has been caught doing will be a dead giveaway that there is indeed something more and OP needs to keep digging.

She is truly in a 'catch 22' situation.

I'll bet she spends sometime searching for ways to beat a poly....watch her internet searches and you might catch the evidence of this.

But in the end, when you get her to the parking lot OP, she will probably BEGIN to crack.....she will likely come clean with a highly cleansed and minimized 'truth' hoping you will not follow through.

Listen and then tell her OK, but you are still going to have her go through with the test to put the issue forever to rest....remind her that she better have everything out, cause failure will lead to you filing.

She will crack.


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## 2yearsago (Jun 28, 2013)

She isn't remorseful at this point. If she was you would feel it. It sounds like she's ready to move forward with a hint on anger over the fact you are giving her the cold shoulder......aka rug sweeping.

Hate to add to your situation but there's clearly more that you don't know about yet.

Move forward with your life. She might come clean, she might not but always remember you have the power to control your life!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## TRy (Sep 14, 2011)

Confusednhrt said:


> I agree with the poster that said she doesn't think it's a big deal that she did this. She texted me that she is sorry and needs to be more understanding of how I feel but it seems like she doesn't really mean it.


 The standard cheater's script has them rug sweep the cheating by trying to say that you are making too big a deal about it. The cheater's script also calls for them to give you false apologies, where instead of saying that they are sorry for what they did, they say that they are sorry that what they did hurt you, as if what they did is not the problem, just your over reaction to it. What is scary is that by trying to minimize the seriousness of their cheating, they are in effect letting you know that they could cheat again with ease as they feel little guilt for their cheating.


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## chillymorn (Aug 11, 2010)

go see a lawyer! see what your rights are for your state.

then weigh your options.


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## ArmyofJuan (Dec 29, 2010)

Confusednhrt said:


> I know that if no children were involved I wouldn't stay. I hate the thought that she cheated on me and now I won't get to see my kids everyday and pay her $1,500 a month as a thank you for cheating on me.
> 
> If you asked me prior to this to explain my marriage I would have said we had a good marriage and both of us were very happy. I agree with the poster that said she doesn't think it's a big deal that she did this. She texted me that she is sorry and needs to be more understanding of how I feel but it seems like she doesn't really mean it.
> 
> I appreciate everyone taking time out of their day to communicate with me. This has been helpful for making me think more clearly since I have not really been in contact with anyone else because of the shame that I feel like this is my fault.


Even you if want to R as your end game for whatever reason, for the time being you need to still file and push for a divorce. You can cancel it at the last minute but she needs to experience the consequences (even if its for a couple of months) of her actions to let her know how serious what she did was. 

She doesn't sound like a keeper though, it may cost you but it may be worth it.


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

Confused

I think you should take things slowly.

Think if your wife had any valid issues with you in the marriage?

I am not justifying her cheating. But does she have any honest gripes or is she only being a selfish woman???

You need to show her consequences.

I would do the poly before going to see a lawyer.

Verify if she had intercourse with the BF or any other man.

If that comes back positive/negative then you have to show another consequence.

Positive: Talk to an attorney
Negative: Serious individual counseling for your wife.

If she has valid gripes within the marriage then a MC session is in order but she needs to come to grips why she felt it was ok to make outwith your ExBF.

Get tough. Don't walk away from your marriage so quickly. 

Time is on your side.

Use it wisely.

HM


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## Nucking Futs (Apr 8, 2013)

happyman64 said:


> Confused
> 
> I think you should take things slowly.
> 
> ...


I disagree with this. If divorce lawyers in your area offer free consultations then consult with the 5 best lawyers and find out what your rights and obligations are under the law. It's not going to hurt your marriage at all to get these consultations out of the way, and having a better understanding of the process can only help you to make an informed decision. 

If you do the polygraph and find out she's been cheating and lying to you then you can go straight to one of those lawyers, pay the retainer and get the process started. If the poly results are more positive you don't have to do anything else with the lawyers.

Have you DNA'd the kids yet?


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## GTdad (Aug 15, 2011)

Nucking Futs said:


> If divorce lawyers in your area offer free consultations then consult with the 5 best lawyers and find out what your rights and obligations are under the law. It's not going to hurt your marriage at all to get these consultations out of the way, and having a better understanding of the process can only help you to make an informed decision.


Or maybe the ten best. Another great benefit is that all of them would be conflicted out of potentially representing your wife.


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## bartendersfriend (Oct 14, 2013)

Sorry OP that you are here.

Man, this hits close to home. My story is very similar, except I discovered by email that my wife and former best friend (25 years) were having an emotional affair. We have young kids as well.

Later, some trickle truth revealed it was physical as well while I was sleeping in the other room. She confessed (all that she has to this day) within about two weeks. We established no contact and then I found this site (thank goodness).

I hope your wife realizes what she has done, comes clean, and starts understanding that you are willing to walk away from this marriage. It is up to YOU to decide if you want to stay, but only after she does all of that. It is hard to completely change how you view your wife, marriage, and "best friend" all at once. It is traumatic and changes your whole outlook on life & people. You need to start thinking about YOU, let this all sink in to some degree, find a good support structure, and in time, seek counseling. It is all difficult when the two people you counted on in this world the most are the two people that have hurt you. It is a long road...

I don't know you, but I'm pulling for you.


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## Confusednhrt (Sep 15, 2014)

We got into another fight last night where she kept saying that she is tired of feeling ****ty about herself and was yelling at me that I need to move forward or this isn't going to work. 
I keep telling her that my feelings aren't causing her to feel bad that her actions caused this and she just doesn't seem to understand. I have had enough of trying to communicate at this point and don't feel that a true R is a possibility. There seems to be an unwillingness on her part to give any effort other then telling me to get over it. (She did start counseling on her own but I don't even know what to think about that)

I have meetings scheduled and will see what I hear once I get there.


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

Have her served divorce papers. See what kind of tune she sings then.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## bfree (Sep 30, 2012)

Tell her there are two ways to get over it. The first way is to reconcile. That takes a long time, takes a lot of effort and she'd better find a lot more empathy and patience then she's demonstrating. The second way to get over it is a lot faster and simpler. Since she's in such a hurry for you to get over it you'll utilize the second way and file for divorce.


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## murphy5 (May 1, 2014)

Chaparral said:


> Are you saying the incident 5 months ago was lso on a camping trip? His wife happened to wake up, went out and caught them?
> 
> You have to go into full investigation mode unless this is your dealbreaker. Very well could be all there is to it. It just doesn't sound like you and his wife weren't set up so they could have some alone time.
> 
> ...


Dude, you need to VAR the TENT!


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

Confusednhrt said:


> We got into another fight last night where she kept saying that she is tired of feeling ****ty about herself and was yelling at me that I need to move forward or this isn't going to work.
> I keep telling her that my feelings aren't causing her to feel bad that her actions caused this and she just doesn't seem to understand. I have had enough of trying to communicate at this point and don't feel that a true R is a possibility. There seems to be an unwillingness on her part to give any effort other then telling me to get over it. (She did start counseling on her own but I don't even know what to think about that)
> 
> I have meetings scheduled and will see what I hear once I get there.


There's more to the story, and she's terrified that you'll uncover it. She's going out of her mind w/ panic and anxiety, and is using every tool at her disposal to keep you distracted and off-balance. Don't fall for it. Keep digging. 

And don't forgot to DNA those young children of yours. Geez I hate saying that.


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## jim123 (Sep 29, 2012)

Confusednhrt said:


> We got into another fight last night where she kept saying that she is tired of feeling ****ty about herself and was yelling at me that I need to move forward or this isn't going to work.
> I keep telling her that my feelings aren't causing her to feel bad that her actions caused this and she just doesn't seem to understand. I have had enough of trying to communicate at this point and don't feel that a true R is a possibility. There seems to be an unwillingness on her part to give any effort other then telling me to get over it. (She did start counseling on her own but I don't even know what to think about that)
> 
> I have meetings scheduled and will see what I hear once I get there.


Her reaction to everything is very bad. There is more somewhere. If not with him then with others or both.


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## WyshIknew (Aug 18, 2012)

GusPolinski said:


> And this is very important... DO. NOT. LET. HER. SEE. THE. QUESTIONS. BEFOREHAND.




Or, let her see 'the' questions, perhaps one or two, but on the day ask her a completely different full set of questions.


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## OldWolf57 (Mar 20, 2012)

C, it to her is never going to be about what she did. To her, she did what she did, said sorry and you just need to let her be. 
I caught the line about how selfish you think she has been in the marriage. Real entitled princess.

Like the rest, I think she has more she is hiding.
That's the anger to get you to back off the poly.
She's gotten so comfortable cheating, she will do it with you close by, and that shows a level of contempt no marriage should have to recover from. 
Hell, I wouldn't even want to try.


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## GROUNDPOUNDER (Mar 8, 2013)

I agree with others about her needing to take and pass a poly now.

I don't believe that she will ever take one though. Hence her attitude about you just getting over it.

I'd VAR her car and the most likely place that she would be in to talk on the phone at home.

Then, when you get in an argument again about it again(and you will), tell her that you are heading over to the OM/ex-friend's house to ask him some questions. Leave and head in the direction of where he lives.

Don't actually go there. Just kill a half hour some where and head back home.

When she asks you what he said, tell her you cooled off on the way there and turned around and came back home.

If she called anyone about her kissing/groping him the last time... the first time, or anytime, you'll probably get some answers when you listen to the VAR.

She's far too standoffish about what you know she's done and adamant that you should just get over it. The feeling that I get of she might have done more(a lot more?...) than what you already know is getting stronger.


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## 6301 (May 11, 2013)

Confusednhrt said:


> He lives about 10 minutes away. I really feel my best course of action is to schedule a meeting with a lawyer and try to figure out how much time I would get with my kids after a divorce.
> 
> I have always felt she was a little selfish in the marriage and now that she has destroyed the life that we had I still feel like she is making it all about her. She is complaining that I am giving her the cold shoulder at times and that I'm not trying to do anything to fix the situation.


 Maybe you should ask her if she would prefer a cold shoulder or a warm foot to the ass while you throw her out?

Basically she refuses to accept her bad behavior and thinks that just pushing this thing she did with the OM to the side will make things better.

IMO, until she realizes how much trouble she caused and what the out come could be, she'll continue.

If it was me, I would file, have her served and then she'll see that your serious and she's in big trouble and she'll wake up. You can always call it off but the idea of the divorce should shake her back to reality.


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## sidney2718 (Nov 2, 2013)

warlock07 said:


> Am I the only one ???
> 
> 
> :rofl::lol:


We gave it an icy response.


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## sidney2718 (Nov 2, 2013)

bandit.45 said:


> Why would they have a tent to themselves? Putting up tents is hard work--hence pop up trailers. Why would there be an empty extra tent for them to fondle each other in? Unless this happened during the day when other campers were out doing something else.
> 
> We need details.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Agreed. The logistics of all this don't quite work out.

And neither does the psychology. You don't walk up to another man's wife and say: "Hey chick, lets go screw tonight after they are all asleep!" So I gather that there were other times and other places where they got to know each other BEFORE the camping parties.

More: affairs can't really go on with contact once every five years or so. So there is a lot more to this story.

[Posted before reading the entire thread. Some of this may be explained later, in which case I apologize for posting this.]


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## phillybeffandswiss (Jan 20, 2013)

sidney2718 said:


> More: affairs can't really go on with contact once every five years or so. So there is a lot more to this story.


They can, have and do. We have a few stories here on this board. I know of one in my circle.


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## sidney2718 (Nov 2, 2013)

WyshIknew said:


> Or, let her see 'the' questions, perhaps one or two, but on the day ask her a completely different full set of questions.


Don't play games. This isn't a game. What happens here will change lives.


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## sidney2718 (Nov 2, 2013)

phillybeffandswiss said:


> They can, have and do. We have a few stories here on this board. I know of one in my circle.


Where the cheaters live close to each other and arranging contact is easy? Of course, anything is possible but I doubt that one sexy meeting every five years is the way to bet. :scratchhead:


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## LostAndContent (Feb 22, 2013)

Damn it husband! It's been whole weeks since you found out I made out with your best friend! Why are you taking so long to get the F over it? God it's like you don't even love me!"

I'm sorry dude. It really don't seem like she gets that you're allowed to have feelings too. She's only concerned with how this effects HER. 

I'd say you need to explain to her you'll be feeling this way for months if not years, but it doesn't sound like explaining will do any good with her. Also I doubt she'll actually go through with the polygraph. Also it's pretty probable you don't have the whole story. 

Good luck.


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## Roselyn (Sep 19, 2010)

Your wife tells you to "get over it" and move on. She isn't worth your pain. I believe that she sees you as a doormat. She cheats because she can. Someone else deserves your love and loyalty. Walk away from this toxic relationship as I believe that your situation will get worse.


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## phillybeffandswiss (Jan 20, 2013)

sidney2718 said:


> Where the cheaters live close to each other and arranging contact is easy?


 Nope, this caveat isn't what I am talking about at all.


> Of course, anything is possible but I doubt that one sexy meeting every five years is the way to bet. :scratchhead:


Like I said it has happened on this board and one happened in my circle. Go ahead, eventually you'll create a scenario where you are correct.

I'll end the derail with my post.


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

Per OP 5 months (not 5 years) elapsed between the two camping trips, though not necessarily between trysts... though that's what OP's WW has said.

Either way, w/ OP working out of town on a regular basis, he'd be naive to think that there isn't more to the story than what his WW has confessed, especially in light of her overall sh*tty attitude.


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## See_Listen_Love (Jun 28, 2012)

I think it is too early to draw heavy conclusions, OP needs to do his homework and monitor etc.

It is possible it's only a drunk meeting issue, caught before anything else could grow.


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## 2yearsago (Jun 28, 2013)

Confusednhrt said:


> We got into another fight last night where she kept saying that she is tired of feeling ****ty about herself and was yelling at me that I need to move forward or this isn't going to work.
> I keep telling her that my feelings aren't causing her to feel bad that her actions caused this and she just doesn't seem to understand. I have had enough of trying to communicate at this point and don't feel that a true R is a possibility. There seems to be an unwillingness on her part to give any effort other then telling me to get over it.


Boy does this sound familiar. Like exactly brother. All I can tell you this is EXACTLY what I heard and it never changed. She never saw how her actions caused any of it. It's totally lack of accountability. Personally I think it's a character flaw.

I hate to say this but I could write the next act in this play.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Squeakr (May 1, 2013)

2yearsago said:


> I hate to say this but I could write the next act in this play.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


:iagree: But it isn't a play. It is a reality show, just a new season and a different location and players, but the same exact end goal!! Welcome to the new house for Big Brother, season 14!! LOL
:smthumbup::smthumbup::smthumbup:


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

> This has been helpful for making me think more clearly since I have not really been in contact with anyone else because of the shame that I feel like this is my fault.


CNFSD

Stop feeling shame over her actions. You have nothing to be ashamed about.

It is good that your wife is getting counseling.

Now all you need is for her to do a poly and a test for STD's to really she d some light as well as show her consequences.

Get tough. Be tough.

And when she is telling you to get over it or just being a biotch just walk away.

But not before walking her in front of a mirror. Making her look in the mirror and let her see who has caused these issues by making bad decisions.

HM


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## Graywolf2 (Nov 10, 2013)

Confusednhrt said:


> We got into another fight last night where she kept saying that she is tired of feeling ****ty about herself and was yelling at me that I need to move forward or this isn't going to work.
> 
> I keep telling her that my feelings aren't causing her to feel bad that her actions caused this and she just doesn't seem to understand.


I hate to agree with a WS but your wife is correct. Her actions didn’t cause her to feel ****ty. Her actions felt great and she did them again. 

Everything was just fine and would have remained fine but you found out. Then your negative feelings caused her to feel ****ty and she's tired of it..


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## missthelove2013 (Sep 23, 2013)

tom67 said:


> She is the one that has to fix things not you.


No
its all his fault...he wasnt emotional enough, he didnt spend enough time with her, he took her for granted...blah blah blah

After she fails the polygraph, or after your friend truly spills the beans, she will tell you all the reasons why YOU pushed her into the arms of another...phiissshhhh...

5 years and shes doing this?? I would run and never look back...she is lying to you, there was much more than just kissing...dont just threaten the polygraph, MAKE her take it


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## vellocet (Oct 18, 2013)

Confusednhrt said:


> I'm a wreck because we have 2 children that are ages 4 and 2 and while I want the life I had I don't think I can stick around and feel selfish for not being around my children. Any advice would be appreciated. They were caught 2 weeks ago and the "first" time happened about 5 months ago.


Well what is it YOU want to do? I fully understand about not being with my kids on a daily basis. But you know what? SHE did that to them, not me leaving her because she is a POS cheater.

The responsibility lies with your wife if you leave, not you.

Otherwise the only alternative if you really can't stand to look at her cheater face is to stay for the kids, suck it up, and be miserable. And being miserable is no way for a father to be.

I'm now an every other weekend dad. And although it sickens me that she cheats, gets custody to add insult to injury, and I have to be the one to sacrifice further, the important part is, I'm no longer with her and can be a happier father for my kids.

If I had stayed, I'd want to vomit every time I looked at her. Not sure if its that extreme for you, but again, question is, what do you really want to do? The way you describe it, if you stick around for the kids, you'll end up going crazy and feel trapped and empty inside.


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## vellocet (Oct 18, 2013)

bandit.45 said:


> I'm not following. So they had sex five months ago, and just got caught it the tent two weeks ago? Nothing between?


Cheaters can be very devious, sneaky f****ers


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## vellocet (Oct 18, 2013)

Confusednhrt said:


> He lives about 10 minutes away. I really feel my best course of action is to schedule a meeting with a lawyer and try to figure out how much time I would get with my kids after a divorce.


I can tell you what the bare minimum fathers usually get.

Every other weekend, one night during the week, and anywhere from 2 to 4 weeks during the summer break.

You could get more with joint custody, but your POS wife would likely still get it that you pay child support.

Oh, and you can forget about getting custody. You are the father, it isn't going to happen unless you can prove your wife committed a felony or something.
She could stand up in court and say, "I cheated on him every year we were together" and it wouldn't make a difference. She's the mom. If she wants custody and child support, she'll get it.



> I have always felt she was a little selfish in the marriage and now that she has destroyed the life that we had I still feel like she is making it all about her. She is complaining that I am giving her the cold shoulder at times and that I'm not trying to do anything to fix the situation.


Blah blah blah blah. Typical cheater speak. Blame the BS.


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## vellocet (Oct 18, 2013)

Confusednhrt said:


> We got into another fight last night where she kept saying that she is tired of feeling ****ty about herself and was yelling at me that I need to move forward or this isn't going to work.


Translation: "I cheated, I'm not going to feel bad about it any longer, get over it or the marriage won't survive because of your feelings, not my wh0rish ways."

I think it is time to move on......to divorce. And if you do and serve her papers tell her, "I am taking your advice to move on...therefore, I'm divorcing you."


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## GROUNDPOUNDER (Mar 8, 2013)

I'm starting to get the the feeling that the OP has found out that there was more than just his WS's tramping while camping...


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## WyshIknew (Aug 18, 2012)

WyshIknew said:


> Or, let her see 'the' questions, perhaps one or two, but on the day ask her a completely different full set of questions.





sidney2718 said:


> Don't play games. This isn't a game. What happens here will change lives.


:scratchhead:


Why is it a game?

It is a perfectly valid tactic which I have heard of working on here before.

You supply them with a few innocuous questions which they feel they can easily beat, when they are all relaxed you hit them with the real questions. Less time for them to prepare themselves to answer in a manner that might disguise the outcome.


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## Confusednhrt (Sep 15, 2014)

I haven't heard about any other events at this point but I stopped asking. I feel like if she isn't willing to try or do what I'm asking of her to make me feel better then it just isn't worth it. I have a meeting with a lawyer Monday morning and a counselor Monday afternoon. 

Her level of selfishness over the past few weeks is truly amazing and has made my decision relatively easy. I would have been quick to forgive had I just been shown some remorse and support.


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## bfree (Sep 30, 2012)

Confusednhrt said:


> I haven't heard about any other events at this point but I stopped asking. I feel like if she isn't willing to try or do what I'm asking of her to make me feel better then it just isn't worth it. I have a meeting with a lawyer Monday morning and a counselor Monday afternoon.
> 
> Her level of selfishness over the past few weeks is truly amazing and has made my decision relatively easy. *I would have been quick to forgive had I just been shown some remorse and support.*


I think this is the case with most men. We love our women, even when they hurt us, even when they hurt us worse than we could ever have imagined. But when they are like your wife is now there is no reconciling. In order to reconcile and make the marriage work there needs to be some demonstrable remorse. If a BS forgives without atonement and consequences then there is no respect and the marriage is doomed anyway. I'm sorry your wife doesn't care about you or your feelings but you're right it does make the decision simpler.


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## NoChoice (Feb 12, 2012)

I've read all of the OP's posts but not all of the responses so if I am redundant I apologize.

First off, the guy never was your friend so you haven't lost much there. If he were, he would have never been involved in this fiasco. In fact, if your wife was the initiator, he would have gone into a lengthy diatribe about her behavior, your value as a husband and then immediately given you a heads up about your wife's actions.

In any event, I would calmly and rationally sit your wife down and tell her that this incident, although nothing in her eyes, is significant to you and ask her if your feelings matter to her. If she says yes then ask her if they matter enough for her to do whatever is necessary to fix this and that means actions not just words. If she says yes then ask her when you can expect this to happen. You can try and play the "what if you were in my shoes" card but no one really knows how shoes will fit until they actually have them on. If she says yes to everything then inform her of your meeting with the attorney and your sincerity to press ahead for D and that the ball is in her court. In other words, this WILL happen unless SHE puts forth sufficient effort to stop it. Then go about as if your headed for D. Let her see your resolve and if that doesn't prompt a response from her then you can know it's over.

Of course, this presumes that YOU want to save the M.


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## leon1 (Sep 3, 2014)

Its looking like she is not giving you any options ,since she is not showing much remorse , you need to push a head with the divorce .


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

Calm and rational conversation does not work with unrepentant cheaters. She has given you her answer through her attitude and actions. 

Do the 180 and see your lawyer Monday.


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## Graywolf2 (Nov 10, 2013)

Confusednhrt said:


> Her level of selfishness over the past few weeks is truly amazing and has made my decision relatively easy. I would have been quick to forgive had I just been shown some remorse and support.


She never thought she would get caught. She wants it all to quietly go away like it never happened. You won’t allow that so you’re the bad guy. 

At the very least your wife and the OM have been making out whenever the opportunity arose at social events. Why wouldn’t they? 

It must be particularly delicious for the WS and AP to be together in front of their spouses acting totally innocent. They are so much more entitled and smarter than everyone else around them.


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## missthelove2013 (Sep 23, 2013)

Graywolf2 said:


> She never thought she would get caught. She wants it all too quietly go away like it never happened. You won’t allow that so you’re the bad guy.
> 
> At the very least your wife and the OM have been making out whenever the opportunity arose at social events. Why wouldn’t they?
> 
> It must be particularly delicious for the WS and AP to be together in front of their spouses acting totally innocent. They are so much more entitled and smarter than everyone else around them.


if she is making out with another married friend, while camping, while everyone is close by....she doesnt CARE if she gets caught or she is a complete idiot...you can only blame SO much on alcohol...she didnt give two brown shats whether or not she got caught, probably felt she could justify it and excuse it away...phhhtttt


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

When you tell her you are going to see a lawyer, BE SURE you have a var in the house and car. Then leave and give her time to make some calls. No doubt she will be on the phone as soon as you leave. You will find out then what you need to go on one way or the other.


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## Graywolf2 (Nov 10, 2013)

missthelove2013 said:


> if she is making out with another married friend, while camping, while everyone is close by....she doesnt CARE if she gets caught or she is a complete idiot...you can only blame SO much on alcohol...she didnt give two brown shats whether or not she got caught, probably felt she could justify it and excuse it away...phhhtttt


You might be correct about OP’s wife. However drunk drivers care if they get caught or not. They drive drunk because they think they can get away with it.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Confusednhrt said:


> I haven't heard about any other events at this point but I stopped asking. I feel like if she isn't willing to try or do what I'm asking of her to make me feel better then it just isn't worth it. I have a meeting with a lawyer Monday morning and a counselor Monday afternoon.
> 
> Her level of selfishness over the past few weeks is truly amazing and has made my decision relatively easy. I would have been quick to forgive had I just been shown some remorse and support.


Have you exposed this to her parents and siblings and best friend and pastor?

Your marriage isn't dead in the water. BUT, you have to take some steps, not just ignoring her. She's ashamed and she's backed into a corner. Explain to her that you're willing to give the marriage another chance, but only if she's willing to show some humility. Tell her that that's not too much to ask, considering that she's cheated on you. Tell her that, if she's willing to write out a timeline, write OM a No Contact letter (it shows humility) that YOU will approve and send yourself, attend counseling with you to figure out how you two got to this point, AND give you 100% transparency (her passwords are GONE and you can check her phone and computer at will), you're willing to 'move forward' as she says. 

Tell her that and see what she says. I think she's scared and is bluffing and is trying to figure out where you stand. Just tell her. And if she then refuses, THEN go right to the phone and call her parents, her siblings, her best friend, and her pastor that you will now be filing for divorce because your wife did this and refuses to face it head on and is instead blaming you. Step back and see what happens. If she's willing to lose her marriage and family AND her people's good wishes, all so she can pretend she's done nothing wrong, well, it's better to know now than later because she'll just cheat again. But if she's willing to do what you ask, you have a chance that this was an eye opener and she learned her lesson.


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