# theory



## mike82 (Oct 24, 2011)

i have a theory. it seems like so often when a man treats a woman poorly they never leave that person or cheat. im not talking about physical abuse. although it seems to hold true with that as well. many years ago i drank heavily and would argue with my ex wife alot. about 4 years ago i made drastic changes and became everything my wife always wanted me to be. i was very young when i married(22) and until i was 25-26 i had alot of growing to do as a person. i became very family oriented, attended church regularly with family, cut down to an occasional beer here and there. it seems as though once i became the person she always wanted me to be she left me. i see this play out with others that i know as well. its almost like marry poppins, lmao. once they make you how they want you, they become bored. the funny thing is i doubt my ex wife would have ever left if i was still a challenge. i kept her on her toes in those early years and didnt kiss her ass. i see stories from many woman on here where they want to leave their husbands even though the husband treats them great. on the flip side of that i see when neglectful husbands leave their wives,and cheat the woman are beside themselves. i see many woman post on this site sympothising with broken hearted men whose wives have left them saying " i wish my husband was loving and caring like the men on this site. i often think to myself if the husband was loving and caring like the men on here would the woman bolt on him, and fall out of love with him. i think deep down, woman like constant drama, and when all is calm for too long they fall into boredom, and need a new challenge. i absolutely worshiped the ground my ex wife walked on and treated her great the last few years, yet i know it was in the early years through all my b.s that i really felt the love from her and she would constantly tell me how much she loved me, and how happy she was to have me. once i became the man she wanted i sensed not as strong as a love,and heard it even less. im sure this sounds weird to many, and im sure will ruffle feathers with the woman on here, but just a thought. comments and thoughts please....


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## Cogo123 (Jan 5, 2012)

I cannot speak for all women but why would you want a man who drank too much and argues with you all the time? Not many women's idea of their fantasy man.
For me its that physical attraction between you at the start and as your relationship grows and changes its about being there for each other physically and emotionally. Relationships are work. Sometimes you give in and do something he likes but next time its her turn. There may be things you like doing together.
Long talks, holdin hands and being for each other is what its all about.
Your looks will fade over the years but the person you are inside is what connects you. That deep love and commitment. It should not be about treating someone badly to keep them constantly trying to please you. Who wants to live like that? I do believe that a balance of power in a relationship is important. We learn and grow together throughout our lives. That support and love is what gets you through a lifetime together.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## mike82 (Oct 24, 2011)

i completely agree with you on why any woman would want to be with someone who argues and drinks too much. i see it happen alot thou. for me i was young and immature and had alot of growing to do.i was a young twentysomething hittin the bars with the fellas and having a good time. luckily for me i made many changes years ago and became the man i should have always been. im thankful for that.yet i know many woman right now who are with alcoholics, and drug addicts who verbally and physically abuse them and they are madely in love with these people and would never leave. yet i personally know at least 4 of my guy friends who busted their asses to build a nice life for their wifes and familys,sacrificed their dreams and put family first, and the woman are bored, or just not in love with them anymore. they need something new and fun.lol. these are all really good guys who stepped up to the plate and provided for their families since day 1, never cheated, never abused their wives, and did their best to provide a nice life for their loved ones, only for these woman to say this isnt what i want. its like an epidemic these days


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## Nsweet (Mar 3, 2012)

You've got part of it right women do like a challenge, though it's much more than the nice guys vs. jerks argument. In short nice guys give unconditional rewards of affection despite the situation. They throw themselves at women thinking that they will get validation for this every time. Those known as jerks keep women working for their affection. This could be by ignoring her little games or teasing her to keep her ego down and under control. Once you turned into a man she could respect as a husband she lost respect because you lost a few traits women desire.... let me explain.

First thing is codependence, odds are very likely that you spent much more time with her when you stopped drinking and fighting with her. In an effort to make up for everything you probably did everything her way and spent more than 12hrs together every day you could. I don't know why but 12hrs seems to be the magic number for two people who love each other to fight like cats and dogs. Then times you would normally fight and work through some things you avoided argument. These are just educated guesses here. 

Another thing I've noticed every woman in a new relationship will do is eliminate the competition as fast as possible. She will give you a neck full of hickeys after your first nite together to try to push away every woman who could possible want you. Sex acts are more extreme to try to influence you to pick her over others, they even try to nest more around your work and wash your laundry with sented fabric softeners to leave their mark. 

But then you accept that you are theirs and stop hanging around single women. I know I had a close call one night and never looked at another woman like that again. If anything I think married men need more female friends to keep then appreciating what they have. Single girls make great friends to talk to but they won't do the same things your wife will do. They may have a few interesting things to say and flirt a bit but they won't hold you when you're feeling bad or take care of your kids the way a loving wife would. 

So how do you get some of this attraction back when she is pulling away from you?
The answer is short but complex. You have to use what like to call active disinterest which involves not needing her when she isn't interested in you but still actively showing small demonstrations of wanting her. In the pick up artist's world it's what known as push/pull (or more complex the bait-hook-reel-release philosophy) that states in the earliest attraction phase in order to raise a woman's interest you have to pull her in closer to you and push her away to raise attraction for you. On the contrary many men will do the opposite and pull and pull even harder when a woman running away because they think maybe a bigger show of affection will get her to like them. 

It's not hard to do or malicious at all, bait-hook-reel-release could be done by anyone at anytime to keep you reeled in a conversation for just a few seconds longer if it's done right. I ask you a question, you answer it, we talk for a moment, and right when the conversation hits it's highest level I pull away or say goodbye. That's just one example of push/pull, but the push/pull we are talking about has more to do with teasing a woman and then showing interest in her. I know I used to tease my wife all the time before I grew too comfortable. I remember every once in while I would pick up the phone and say hey, and then a different girl's name just to mess with her. And I made a great effort to end the call as fast as possible when the time between conversations was longer than 20 seconds, always ending with her laughing.

Hope this helped. Sorry for droning on.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

mike82 said:


> i see stories from many woman on here where they want to leave their husbands even though the husband treats them great. ..


Hmmm... hardly any women post here with this. 

You marriage and your wife is not every woman. Your post is.. well an insulting generalization of women. If this is what you think about women... maybe it tells us something about why your wife left. 

Or maybe you changed and she did not. You no longer needed a co-dependent woman... and she still need to be in a co-dependent relationship. For a co-dependent person with low selfesteem , they need someone who is dependent on them. IT is the only way they can feel loved.. if someone needs them like that.


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## YinPrincess (Jul 31, 2011)

Here's my "theory" - only two "sick" people can be together, or two "healthy" people can be together. A healthy person and a sick person do not go together well, because they'd be unable or intolerant of the conflicting roles that need to be played out.

When you got better, your wife was unable to remain "sick" with you and thus left. Just putting it simply here.

Co-dependency is probably something she needs help with - it took me a long time to figure out why exactly I was doing the same thing for so many years. I kept attracting "sick" men so I could be "sick" with them. Unfortunately, this also includes my husband - but I am bound and determined to play out a different role this time - one of growth, strength and health for the both of us.

Edit: Should have read the replies first - obviously I agree with Ele about the co-dependency...
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## mike82 (Oct 24, 2011)

Thank you all for your input. Two things. First i did not intend to bash woman or be an *******. My point being is that almost daily i see more and more woman leaving men, then men leaving woman. like i previously stated i know many people whose wives up and leave. Second, i want to clear this up. I was never sick, or an alcoholic. I was a 22 year old kid who hung out with his friends and went out like most young twenty somethings do. My ex wife did her share of going out as well. I was faithful to my wife from day one.. When my first son came home from the hospital he had a new home to go to. Ive held it down from day one. If anything my problem was i wasnt family oriented enough in the early years. I would work my ass off all week, and when the weekend came around i would go out with friends instead of spending enough quality time with my family. I saw the error in my ways long ago and corrected them. I was wrong for doing that. I cried to her a couple years ago telling her how much i regretted how i was in the early years. I told her long ago if i could ever change anything it would be those early years. Even her family all think i am a fantastic dad, and have grown so much. Even she says so to this day. I grew up without a father, i didnt know anything about being one. When i was young i thought to myself im around the kids everyday and in their life, im a great dad. I thought just cause i was there it was enough, hell my dad left when i was 5 never saw him again. Once again i just want to state i did not intend to bash woman on this topic. I was raised by 3 woman and have the upmost respect for them, always have. Im just going by what i see, id be willing to bet that 70% or better of the people on this site are men whose woman stepped off. And even in daily life from aquaintences to good friends i see it more and more.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## angelpixie (Mar 2, 2012)

Nsweet said:


> Another thing I've noticed every woman in a new relationship will do is eliminate the competition as fast as possible. She will give you a neck full of hickeys after your first nite together to try to push away every woman who could possible want you. Sex acts are more extreme to try to influence you to pick her over others, they even try to nest more around your work and wash your laundry with sented fabric softeners to leave their mark.
> 
> But then you accept that you are theirs and stop hanging around single women. I know I had a close call one night and never looked at another woman like that again. If anything I think married men need more female friends to keep then appreciating what they have. Single girls make great friends to talk to but they won't do the same things your wife will do. They may have a few interesting things to say and flirt a bit but they won't hold you when you're feeling bad or take care of your kids the way a loving wife would.
> 
> ...


Oh, boy, Nsweet, I've read quite a few posts from you, and this surprises me! It doesn't do anyone any good to generalize 'women' like this. I have not ever given any guy a neck full of hickeys or a basket of fabric-softener scented clean clothes to leave my mark -- that sounds very Wild Kingdom. 

And single girls who are great to talk to, but won't do what a wife will do? Depends on what the guy wants from her -- eventually, if they share enough about their lives, she will first take on the wife's emotional role, then the sexual role in the relationship. They *will* hold you when you're feeling bad if they have enough emotion invested in you (even if your wife wants to, too). I've not seen too many that will take care of a guy's kids like their mom, though, unless the mom is a WS. The tricky thing about single girl friends is that they haven't seen both sides of the man -- they tend to see the best behavior, the best dressed, etc., side. The wife sees the worst, and in a comfortable relationship, she will confront the husband. The girl friend will not see it, and not confront. Automatic points for the girl friend. 

And the whole push/pull thing? Yikes, if a guy treated me like that, I would not be attracted at all. Not all women like bad boys and players. If a guy 'slips' and calls me someone else's name, he's history. A sense of humor, kindness, and integrity - those are my definite turn-ons right now. Spent too much time cleaning up after an immature guy.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

mike82 said:


> Thank you all for your input. Two things. First i did not intend to bash woman or be an *******. My point being is that almost daily i see more and more woman leaving men, then men leaving woman. like i previously stated i know many people whose wives up and leave. Second, i want to clear this up. I was never sick, or an alcoholic. I was a 22 year old kid who hung out with his friends and went out like most young twenty somethings do. My ex wife did her share of going out as well. I was faithful to my wife from day one.. When my first son came home from the hospital he had a new home to go to. Ive held it down from day one. If anything my problem was i wasnt family oriented enough in the early years. I would work my ass off all week, and when the weekend came around i would go out with friends instead of spending enough quality time with my family. I saw the error in my ways long ago and corrected them. I was wrong for doing that. I cried to her a couple years ago telling her how much i regretted how i was in the early years. I told her long ago if i could ever change anything it would be those early years. Even her family all think i am a fantastic dad, and have grown so much. Even she says so to this day. I grew up without a father, i didnt know anything about being one. When i was young i thought to myself im around the kids everyday and in their life, im a great dad. I thought just cause i was there it was enough, hell my dad left when i was 5 never saw him again. Once again i just want to state i did not intend to bash woman on this topic. I was raised by 3 woman and have the upmost respect for them, always have. Im just going by what i see, *id be willing to bet that 70% or better of the people on this site are men whose woman stepped off.* And even in daily life from aquaintences to good friends i see it more and more.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


You are wrong... from a poll here it looks like it's about 50/50 men and women here.


I am a woman. I have divorced two husbands. So I'm one of those evil women you are going on about.

I left my first husband because he was a serial cheater and because he was emotionally and physcially abusive. My son and I are the only ones who witnessed this abuse. It always happened when no one else was around. A lot of people thought I was crazy for leaving him. He's an upstanding member of the community, a doctor, yada yada yada. Do not assume that you know what is going on behind closed doors.

My divorce to my now husband will be final on Friday of this week. He has never lifted a hand against me. In public he is all lovey dovey towards me. IN our home he ignores me and spends all of his time on his computer playing games, surfing the web, with porn and cyber sex. Again, very few people know what goes on in our home.... again.... Do not assume that you know what is going on behind closed doors.

Most women who file for divorce do not do it for frivolous reasons. It's hard to give up a marriage, this is why people stay in bad marriages for years and years.


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## mike82 (Oct 24, 2011)

lmao. i never even remotely called anyone evil. smh. and i never assumed anything. cheatings cheating. men do it alot too, and have for generations, and always will. all i did was state that from what i see in the part of the world im from (nj), i see wowan leaving their husbands alot more frequently. i never stated i knew it all. the people i know and have talked to have had their wifes partake in EAs, and PAs and then leave. usually starting in my friends cases with the infamous ILUBNILWY line. the reason for the initial post was to get peoples opinions. ive been a member in several divorce care groups and most of the people there are men. ive been to two different ones, usually the same type of im not in love with you line sparked it all. theres two sides to every story, i know that. many woman have a right to leave and get divorced.bad situations. most of the people ive talked to where cheated on. it wasnt just oh, im not happy lets get divorced. it was going behind their backs being cheaters. my initial thought in the post was I see alot of it going on, its nice to get opinions from others as to what they see as well. im glad some ladies chimmed in on the subject


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

mike82 said:


> lmao. i never even remotely called anyone evil.


I used the word ‘evil’ for emphasis. You describe women in general who leave their husband as being pretty superficial, just needing “something new and fun”. Really? YOu really think that is is what is generally going on with women who get divorces? Really?


mike82 said:


> yet i personally know at least 4 of my guy friends who busted their asses to build a nice life for their wifes and familys,sacrificed their dreams and put family first, and the woman are bored, or just not in love with them anymore. they need something new and fun.lol. these are all really good guys who stepped up to the plate and provided for their families since day 1, never cheated, never abused their wives, and did their best to provide a nice life for their loved ones, only for these woman to say this isnt what i want. its like an epidemic these days


You are making a lot of assumptions about these women. You really do not know what happened behind the closed doors of their house.



mike82 said:


> smh. and i never assumed anything. cheatings cheating. men do it alot too, and have for generations, and always will. all i did was state that from what i see in the part of the world im from (nj), i see wowan leaving their husbands alot more frequently. i never stated i knew it all. the people i know and have talked to have had their wifes partake in EAs, and PAs and then leave.


My family is from NJ/NY area. I’ve lived there on and off all my life. There are as many men in EAs, PAs etc as there are men. Studies that provide statistics show that men each at a slightly higher rate than women.. it’s about a 5% difference between the sexes.


mike82 said:


> usually starting in my friends cases with the infamous ILUBNILWY line. the reason for the initial post was to get peoples opinions. ive been a member in several divorce care groups and most of the people there are men. ive been to two different ones, usually the same type of im not in love with you line sparked it all. theres two sides to every story, i know that. many woman have a right to leave and get divorced.bad situations. most of the people ive talked to where cheated on. it wasnt just oh, im not happy lets get divorced. it was going behind their backs being cheaters. my initial thought in the post was I see alot of it going on, its nice to get opinions from others as to what they see as well. im glad some ladies chimmed in on the subject


Remember that there are exactly as many divorced men as there are divorced women. So the groups you are going to are skewed towards the story men have to tell. If you went to groups that were mostly women (those groups do exist) you will find the same thing… a lot of them divorced over cheating husbands.

Any time someone talks about their divorce you only get their side of the story. When my exh tells people about our divorce he tells them every real and imagined thing that I did. He never mentions his own infidelity, nor his constant verbal abuse, yelling, pushing me around, etc etc. 

I often get nervous here giving people advice because I am aware that we are only getting one side to the story.

There was on guy who came here complaining about his wife not wanting sex. He had everyone’s sympathy… until his wife came on and she told her side of the story. Her husband did not deny what she said. After she had her word we all told him that she can had point. I would not have sex with a man who was going things like he was … like not bathing, not brushing his teeth and more.


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## mike82 (Oct 24, 2011)

i went to 4 differnt 7 week sessions, two at two different churches. these groups are not the mens country club. its sponsered thru a church and woman are welcome to attend, and they do! but far more many men are there, at least where ive been. IM GOING BY WHAT I HAVE SEEN, AND PEOPLE I HAVE TALKED TO. NOT SAYING IM RIGHT OR WRONG, NEVER CLAIMED TO. WAS TRYING TO SEE IF OTHERS SEE THIS IN THE SAME FREQUENCY THAT I DO. never said men didnt have just as many affairs. or cheated less. that was never an arguement, or brought up by me. again im going by what i have seen, never once said that because this is what ive seen, that its the national norm, and woman cheat more. im talking about what i see around ME, not YOU. Im sure you have alot of girlfriends who have been wronged by men. it goes both ways trust me i know that.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

mike82 said:


> i went to 4 differnt 7 week sessions, two at two different churches. these groups are not the mens country club. its sponsered thru a church and woman are welcome to attend, and they do! but far more many men are there, at least where ive been. IM GOING BY WHAT I HAVE SEEN, AND PEOPLE I HAVE TALKED TO. NOT SAYING IM RIGHT OR WRONG, NEVER CLAIMED TO. WAS TRYING TO SEE IF OTHERS SEE THIS IN THE SAME FREQUENCY THAT I DO. never said men didnt have just as many affairs. or cheated less. that was never an arguement, or brought up by me. again im going by what i have seen, never once said that because this is what ive seen, that its the national norm, and woman cheat more. im talking about what i see around ME, not YOU. Im sure you have alot of girlfriends who have been wronged by men. it goes both ways trust me i know that.


People are telling you what they see. I told you what I see. I see both males and felmales leaving their marriages some times. I see males and females cheating about about the same rate.


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## cantmove (Feb 20, 2012)

I am a 44yr old female. I am currently going through a divorce instigated by my husband. He has been cheating on me for 9 of the past 13 years. Not that I'm an innocent party to our shakey marriage but He cheated not me. I still don't want a divorce. 

I am very social and have many couple friends. Of all of the divorces I know of currently going on (5 including mine) all are being instigated by the husbands and all cheated on their wives.


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## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

Lets phrase it another way. I'm also making a sweeping generalization... that happens to be true.

Women are equally flawed in how they manage, maintain, nurture, or dissolve their relationships.

All thats really going on is the last gasp of false premises. Used to be presumed that the man was the source of relationship problems and infidelify. In some ways still very much is that perception. Even when its the wife that cheats, often the presumption is that she must have done so because her husband wasnt treating her well.
On the flipside, women were seen as steadfast, faithful, and nurturing.
That is a false premise as well.

Bottom line? Both sexes feel equally entitled to ditch a partner that they are no longer happy with. And that news is no less painful for the partner that was steadfast, faithful and nurturing, regardless of their gender.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Nsweet said:


> Another thing I've noticed every woman in a new relationship will do is eliminate the competition as fast as possible. *She will give you a neck full of hickeys after your first nite together to try to push away every woman who could possible want you.* Sex acts are more extreme to try to influence you to pick her over others, they even try to nest more around your work and wash your laundry with sented fabric softeners to leave their mark.


:rofl:

What women are you hanging out with? 

You both have a strange view of women.

Mike, if you want a lose a woman fast, do the hot and cold thing you are describing. No woman would put up with that, unless she has really low self-esteem. That is a turn off and a speedy way to lose the woman you are with.

Games are for children and do not a healthy relationship make.


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