# I need to "man" up.



## Cgreene21

Hey guys-

Apparently I'm overly emotional and a bit of a wuss. How do I go about "manning" up? Growing up I was mostly raised by my mother, and the most influencial male figure, my grandfather, passed away when I was 12. Although my father is a good man, I've never had a very close relationship with him. What can I do to be the man I want to be and that my W deserves?


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## Deejo

Plenty of threads around. There is 'dominant male' thread in the Ladies Lounge as well.

Link to help out: http://talkaboutmarriage.com/mens-clubhouse/10676-man-up-books.html

Now go drink some whiskey, swear, belch, and get a tatoo.


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## MEM2020

there is a physical piece and a mental piece

are you in good shape - not just cardio - strength? if not, start working out - cardio AND strength training 

get some books on what women REALLY like, they don't like clingy emo guys. Learn to deal with the minor day to day stuff yourself. Let HER come to you for emotional support not the other way around. If something terrible happens to you - of course you can/should show that you are upset and ask her for support - but day to day YOU need to be stable and self reliant and NOT clingy.





Cgreene21 said:


> Hey guys-
> 
> Apparently I'm overly emotional and a bit of a wuss. How do I go about "manning" up? Growing up I was mostly raised by my mother, and the most influencial male figure, my grandfather, passed away when I was 12. Although my father is a good man, I've never had a very close relationship with him. What can I do to be the man I want to be and that my W deserves?


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## turnera

And start spending more time with other guys.


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## Star

Cgreene21 said:


> Hey guys-
> 
> Apparently I'm overly emotional and a bit of a wuss. How do I go about "manning" up? Growing up I was mostly raised by my mother, and the most influencial male figure, my grandfather, passed away when I was 12. Although my father is a good man, I've never had a very close relationship with him. What can I do to be the man I want to be and that my W deserves?


I think it takes* more *of a man to be in touch with his emotional/sensitive side than one than doesn't, you are who you are and she married you for that, so should accept that rather than change it.


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## 63Vino

I wholeheartedly agree with star. Just make sure you are confident and accept who you are first. 
If you dont feel confident and sure of yourself, that may be where the wuss is coming from NOT that you're connected or aware of the emotional.

Would you mind stating what was the information behind this diagnosis?


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## sadbear26

damm my wife gave me the same line.. yeah im emotional but that dont make me a man. i work and when i get home i do whatever has to be done. even though she wants divorce i still come home and clean up wash dishes laundry shopping fix whatever etc and so on but its just aint good enough damm i hate that line man up...... no matter what we do it isnt good enough


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## sadbear26

buster? haha them sounds like fighting words haha just kidding. you as a woman id love to know myself what is to you or women in general? i mean if were emotional were wussys if were to manly then thats too much for some women to handle. i try so hard every day to do what i can and what she asks me to do even though she wants divorce because as a man i fell im i still have the responsibilities to the things i normally would. am i missing something here? and yes sometimes i do cry but doesnt everybody or shouldnt everybody? any ideas from you would be helpful (buster) hahah thanks star


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## sadbear26

umm yeah star? i just read my original post and realized i screwed up i m eant to say i dont think it makes me less of a man that i get emotional i totally messed that part up.


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## 63Vino

sadbear26 said:


> umm yeah star? i just read my original post and realized i screwed up i m eant to say i dont think it makes me less of a man that i get emotional i totally messed that part up.


ahh better... you dont wanna get on HER bad side... hahaha.
but the dishes and laundry thing? that TOTALLY makes you a girl!!!


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## Star

sadbear26 said:


> buster? haha them sounds like fighting words haha just kidding. you as a woman id love to know myself what is to you or women in general? i mean if were emotional were wussys if were to manly then thats too much for some women to handle. i try so hard every day to do what i can and what she asks me to do even though she wants divorce because as a man i fell im i still have the responsibilities to the things i normally would. am i missing something here? and yes sometimes i do cry but doesnt everybody or shouldnt everybody? any ideas from you would be helpful (buster) hahah thanks star




All women want/need different things from a man but it's my personal view that a man who is in touch with his sensitive/emotional side is more of a man at the end of the day than a man who hides from this. again nothing wrong in my eyes in crying afterall that's an emotion it's shows your human and if a woman is not intelligent enough to realise these things then maybe she is doing you a favour in the long run.


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## 63Vino

Star said:


> All women want/need different things from a man but it's my personal view that a man who is in touch with his sensitive/emotional side is more of a man at the end of the day than a man who hides from this. again nothing wrong in my eyes in crying afterall that's an emotion it's shows your human and if a woman is not intelligent enough to realise these things then maybe she is doing you a favour in the long run.


I welled up reading that. Seriously I AGREE!!!!:iagree:


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## sadbear26

haha to vino on the laundry makin me a girl hey if it does than so be it at least i have clean clothes hahah and star thanks for the advice. it means alot oh and for letting me off this one time i dont wanna get on ur bad side its a real awful situation all around ya know? and it helps to have people to talk to thank you very mcuh


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## Deejo

It isn't about changing who you are. It's about modifying how you behave.

Being 'selfless' we are taught is a virtue and a very positive quality. However, if you are a Nice Guy, you use 'selflessness' as a means of winning approval from others. You tie it in to your own sense of self-worth - and that's bad, it's deeply flawed. 

Invariably, doing everything, fixing everything, and trying to be all things to all people, means that you set yourself up to be taken advantage of. Out of the gate, it wins you admiration and respect. But over time, it makes you a doormat, and diminishes people's respect for you.

Setting boundaries, saying 'no', and staking a claim to behavior and activities that are solely your own, helps you reestablish balance - and will assist you in choking the sh!t out of your inner wuss.

MEM is right on. As a Nice Guy, you likely are very expressive, open, and emotional. Again, these are not bad traits, but how and when you choose to express or share them can have bad results. You _expect_ that they will be appreciated and rewarded. When they aren't, you try harder, give more - and this is exactly the wrong thing to do. You heighten resentment, you do not diminish it.

Hope this makes things a little clearer, that manning up isn't about becoming a neanderthal. It's about discovering and nurturing the behaviors and traits that ground your sense of self, and make you more attractive, not less - although initially you probably won't see it that way.


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## Cgreene21

It was my W that gave me the original diagnosis. We first had a falling out back in August, and she literally blasted me with insults, saying she is sick of being the man, that I am an emotional trainwreck, that I am too nice, etc...Now she has come at me with the classic "I love you but am not in love with you" line. I won't go into all the details of the situation, but we have been seperated for a month now, but living together still. I don't fully believe that she doesn't still love me, otherwise she wouldn't still be here, I would have had seperation papers in front of me, and she still wouldn't be texting, calling, cooking for me, or generally just being nice...right? The weddings ring are off, but it happened before during our first break as well, so I'm not sure if I'm that concerned yet.

I do go to the gym, but I am far from being where I want to be apperance wise. I'm not overweight. I have tattoos. I don't drink often. I am losing my hair  I work in IT, which is pretty geeky I know, but the pay and benefits are good.

I guess my main issues are self-confidence and self-esteem. I'm pretty down on myself a lot of the time, and I see how this can be a turn off. I've never been a big sports person, and I have a bit of social anxiety.

I met my W while I was in college, and I was a much more confident, ****y little [email protected]@rd than I am today. But I have always been in touch with my emotions, and am not afraid or ashamed to cry. I always thougt that it made me a bit more empathic to others.

But now I need to find and get in touch with that guy I was that made my W crazy about me, and perhaps improve on him without completly losing myself. SHe used to not be able to keep her hands off me, and now its like I had to strugle for any intamacy what-so-ever. I'm not happy with who I am today, and I am sure the younger me would have kicked my @$$ by now.

So I guess what my situation boils down to is basically that I am unhappy with myself, which has caused my W to fall out of love with me, and want a divorce. I love my W, and feel that our time isn't over yet. I take my vows very seriously, and there isn't much I wouldn't do for her. Since I can't get her to talk to me about what is wrong with the relationship, and she has emotionally seperated herself from me, I'm pretty much trying to rebuild and restart on my own. Since I cannot change her, I have to change myself. And I'm banking on the idea that actions speak louder then words, and that us living together still (lease is up in June, not a lot of time) that actions will speak louder than words.

Ladies, please help a guy out here! If any of you can shine a little light on this situation, or have done/ said the the things that my W has said, is it too late to try? Or is she lost to me for good?

One last question! During a recent conversation, I told the W that since she really had no intentions on working on us, that I didn't see a reason for me to stay any longer in the apartment with her. She began to give me reasons why I shouldn't leave, such as I need to let the landlord know a month in advance if I plan on breaking lease, and that its more convinenant to stay until the lease is up. I have been tring to get her to go to counseling with me for a few months now, and I reall don't want to be here if she won't at least tr to salvage our relationship. So I said that the only way I was going to stay is if she agreed to attend counseling sessions with me, once every two weeks. She agreed, although a bit reluctantly. Before she said she would only o "if it made the divorce easier on me." Did I do the riht thing, or am I just setting myself up for a bigger fall?


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## Deejo

Asking the ladies for guidance and validation is the primary symptom of your condition.

Stop asking your wife for permission. You want to move out? Move out. Go to counseling yourself. Don't tell her you are going. Don't invite her. Not now.
The sooner you stop acting like the you she despises, the better your odds are of recovery. But the real key in your ability to make progress - is to get to the place where reconciliation isn't your goal. It simply becomes a possible by-product of you doing the right things.

You aren't happy with yourself, because there is no definition of yourself. Here's a thought that would indicate you are on the right track. She wants a divorce? Insist she moves out, firmly. And if she laughs in your face - you should be prepared to walk out the door immediately.

It's about prioritizing your needs and boundaries. Not defining them according to someone else.


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## nice777guy

Not sure if you need to move out, but establish some space and distance. Google "detachment."

I'm also a "nice, emotional" guy - halfway through a 6 month trial separation.

It scares my wife when I stop showing interest in her and show that I'd be just fine without her. The more I pull back, the more she leans back in. I think she expected the nice guy in me to beg her to come home and tell her I'd do whatever it takes to make things better, so it scares her that I haven't acted how she thought I would.

Right now - to me - "Manning up" means getting control of my emotions more than anything else. It also means maintaining that space until I figure out how I want things to be.


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## nice777guy

Deejo said:


> Here's a thought that would indicate you are on the right track. She wants a divorce? Insist she moves out, firmly. And if she laughs in your face - you should be prepared to walk out the door immediately.


Deejo - I'm probably not too far ahead of this guy on this "track." To me, he shouldn't try to be this bold unless he's sure about what he wants and is ready to act on it. This sounds more like someone who has actually "arrived" than it does a test of progress.

I wouldn't try Deejo's test unless you are 100% ready to walk out or back up your words some other way. You'll look weak if you can't follow through. I'm guessing that if you just posted this yesterday, then you aren't at that point yet. If I'm right, the less said, the better.

The last time I tried to "man up" and let my wife know who was boss, she simply hung up on me. And I realize now that I was angry and out of control - and I believe emotional control is a big key.

[/QUOTE]It's about prioritizing your needs and boundaries. Not defining them according to someone else.[/QUOTE]

Totally agree. Are there some smaller boundaries you could set first? I don't think that you can "Man up" totally in one day, no matter how many posts you read here.

Small example - I don't know how many times I've argued with my wife through e-mails while at work. I no longer do it. If she sends me something I don't appreciate, I simply reply "this isn't the time - I'm at work", instead of getting upset and emotional and getting pulled in.

No one is confusing me with Tarzan (or Deejo) just yet, but I'm learning.


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## Deejo

NG, you are absolutely right. I was responding to Cgreenes comment about his thinking about moving out. My recommendation isn't meant to be "You should do this now..."

I meant it as a gut-check, one that I don't expect that he is prepared for. It took me a very long time to do it myself. Had I not, I would have been party to an affair going on right under my nose while we still lived in the same space. My statement was a bit over-zealous. It's not hard to remember the pain and confusion of going through this.

I also want to be clear, just because I am now preaching this stuff is not because I followed the play-book. I didn't. In fact, I'm still not. If I were, I would be divorced, instead of remaining over-invested in her safety and well-being. Kids have a lot to do with that. I can't shake that harming her, means harming them, and I simply cannot bring myself to do that.





nice777guy said:


> Deejo - I'm probably not too far ahead of this guy on this "track." To me, he shouldn't try to be this bold unless he's sure about what he wants and is ready to act on it. This sounds more like someone who has actually "arrived" than it does a test of progress.
> 
> I wouldn't try Deejo's test unless you are 100% ready to walk out or back up your words some other way. You'll look weak if you can't follow through. I'm guessing that if you just posted this yesterday, then you aren't at that point yet. If I'm right, the less said, the better.
> 
> The last time I tried to "man up" and let my wife know who was boss, she simply hung up on me. And I realize now that I was angry and out of control - and I believe emotional control is a big key.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's about prioritizing your needs and boundaries. Not defining them according to someone else.
> 
> 
> 
> Totally agree. Are there some smaller boundaries you could set first? I don't think that you can "Man up" totally in one day, no matter how many posts you read here.
> 
> Small example - I don't know how many times I've argued with my wife through e-mails while at work. I no longer do it. If she sends me something I don't appreciate, I simply reply "this isn't the time - I'm at work", instead of getting upset and emotional and getting pulled in.
> 
> No one is confusing me with Tarzan (or Deejo) just yet, but I'm learning.
Click to expand...

*Beats chest, coughs, hacks, sits down quietly*


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## turnera

> the classic "I love you but am not in love with you" line.


 You do realize, right, that in 9 out of 10 times this phrase is used, it's because she's having an affair? And in at least half of the affairs women have, it's because the man is too nice, too NOT manly enough for her, so she seeks out a guy who WILL take what he wants, like a 'real' man?

Hire a PI and get the real truth.


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## anybody

'Why don't you man up' is a woman's way of saying 'I have the emotional maturity of a 2 year old and I enjoy hurting you just because I can; since I am 2 years old, I want you to look and act like Brad Pitt in Thelma & Louise but still do everything I tell you to do because you love me.' 

When a man says "why don't you man-up", what he is really saying is "I have the IQ of a 2 year old but if I keep using cool sounding catch phrases like man-up, maybe no one will figure out that I am completely clueless about everything important in life".

I once had a female acquaintance who remarked how 'manly' a guy was (as she flashed a little 'he's sexy grrrr!' expression) because he was driving a shiny new off-road truck. To me, he looked like a pimped-out city boy who bought a fancy new chick magnet car which had never seen a speck of off-road dust in its life. At a different time, the same female acquaintance remarked derogatorily about how 'dirty' my little sub-compact car was; it was covered with mud from my weekend exploring dirt roads in the high-country forest during a rain/snow storm. I had taken my little car down logging roads that most 'men' would have been scared of. 

The moral of the story is that 'manly' usually refers to a fake, plastic coating that gives a man an outward veneer of manliness. True manliness bears its strength in obscurity, content to quietly function for its purpose: to protect and provide for that which it loves- and cares very little about looking/acting like a Brad Pitt bad boy clone. If a man doesn't feel deep emotion and sometimes pain, he probably doesn't know how to love very well.

If your wife tells you to 'man up', ask her if she wants you to club her over the head, drag her to the bedroom and take her in a selfish fashion, then 2 minutes later make her fetch you a six pack of beer while you watch sports and talk on the phone to one of your girl friends.

I don't think the problem in your relationship is manliness at all. I know from experience that women don't like a 'manly man' any more than 'nice guy' after the newness wears off. Your marriage has entered a new phase where the initial rush of infatuation and novelty is over.

Have you two tried counseling? You both might find it helpful to get the input of an impartial third party.


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## Deejo

Input is great and all ... but it's late to the party.

Within 72 hours of posting, CG discovered his wife had been having an affair. He insisted that she leave. And she did.

Brad Pitt, 2 year olds, and shiny cars were never part of the equation.


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## lastinline

My thoughts are that a man can accomplish more with the strength of his character than he ever could with the strength of his arm. So if you're looking to "man up", first fix the former it's essential to your true manhood. When that's in place you can begin to address the latter.

LIL


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## Cgreene21

Deejo's right, and it was actually from this thread that I really got thinking about the situation. 2 hours later I discovered the evidance I needed.

Turns out her idea of a "man" is a guy who is living entirely off gov't aid, has a kid that the state pays for, and has tattoos on his neck. But he does play guitar!:scratchhead:

So, I'm thinking that if "manning" up to her means I become trash, I think I'll pass.

Thanks for the help, its much appreciated.


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## beentheredonthat

I had a gut check last year, a good friend from HS in apparently good health, with a great wife and 3 kids dropped dead at age 47. He was in great shape, loved life and just all around good guy. I looked inside and realized I was very happy with every aspect of my life but was unhappy with my marriage and had been for many years. It was core values that I was unhappy with and would never change. It was then I decided to move on, took 8 months. Man Up! If you are unhappy change it! Not just in your marriage in every aspect of life, life is very short make the most of it, you owe to yourself, your kids and your wife. If you are unhappy so is everyone you come in contact with.


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## alphaomega

anybody,

It's obvious you just don't get it. After you man up, you are no longer scared if her infatuation with you wears off. If she wants to bail, so be it. She doesn't define 'you', or 'your' happiness. You are your own person, confident, and have strength of character. You also won't put of with any sh$t, like a wife having an EA or PA, expecting you to wait around until she figures out what she wants.

This is what manning up really means. Otherwise, we'd say, Doormat up already!






anybody said:


> 'Why don't you man up' is a woman's way of saying 'I have the emotional maturity of a 2 year old and I enjoy hurting you just because I can; since I am 2 years old, I want you to look and act like Brad Pitt in Thelma & Louise but still do everything I tell you to do because you love me.'
> 
> When a man says "why don't you man-up", what he is really saying is "I have the IQ of a 2 year old but if I keep using cool sounding catch phrases like man-up, maybe no one will figure out that I am completely clueless about everything important in life".
> 
> I once had a female acquaintance who remarked how 'manly' a guy was (as she flashed a little 'he's sexy grrrr!' expression) because he was driving a shiny new off-road truck. To me, he looked like a pimped-out city boy who bought a fancy new chick magnet car which had never seen a speck of off-road dust in its life. At a different time, the same female acquaintance remarked derogatorily about how 'dirty' my little sub-compact car was; it was covered with mud from my weekend exploring dirt roads in the high-country forest during a rain/snow storm. I had taken my little car down logging roads that most 'men' would have been scared of.
> 
> The moral of the story is that 'manly' usually refers to a fake, plastic coating that gives a man an outward veneer of manliness. True manliness bears its strength in obscurity, content to quietly function for its purpose: to protect and provide for that which it loves- and cares very little about looking/acting like a Brad Pitt bad boy clone. If a man doesn't feel deep emotion and sometimes pain, he probably doesn't know how to love very well.
> 
> If your wife tells you to 'man up', ask her if she wants you to club her over the head, drag her to the bedroom and take her in a selfish fashion, then 2 minutes later make her fetch you a six pack of beer while you watch sports and talk on the phone to one of your girl friends.
> 
> I don't think the problem in your relationship is manliness at all. I know from experience that women don't like a 'manly man' any more than 'nice guy' after the newness wears off. Your marriage has entered a new phase where the initial rush of infatuation and novelty is over.
> 
> Have you two tried counseling? You both might find it helpful to get the input of an impartial third party.


_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## MEM2020

anybody,
You should actually read the man up stickies. They have absolutely nothing to do with your post.

Why don't you man up' is a woman's way of saying 'I have the emotional maturity of a 2 year old and I enjoy hurting you just because I can; since I am 2 years old, I want you to look and act like Brad Pitt in Thelma & Louise but still do everything I tell you to do because you love me.' 

When a man says "why don't you man-up", what he is really saying is "I have the IQ of a 2 year old but if I keep using cool sounding catch phrases like man-up, maybe no one will figure out that I am completely clueless about everything important in life".

I once had a female acquaintance who remarked how 'manly' a guy was (as she flashed a little 'he's sexy grrrr!' expression) because he was driving a shiny new off-road truck. To me, he looked like a pimped-out city boy who bought a fancy new chick magnet car which had never seen a speck of off-road dust in its life. At a different time, the same female acquaintance remarked derogatorily about how 'dirty' my little sub-compact car was; it was covered with mud from my weekend exploring dirt roads in the high-country forest during a rain/snow storm. I had taken my little car down logging roads that most 'men' would have been scared of. 

The moral of the story is that 'manly' usually refers to a fake, plastic coating that gives a man an outward veneer of manliness. True manliness bears its strength in obscurity, content to quietly function for its purpose: to protect and provide for that which it loves- and cares very little about looking/acting like a Brad Pitt bad boy clone. If a man doesn't feel deep emotion and sometimes pain, he probably doesn't know how to love very well.

If your wife tells you to 'man up', ask her if she wants you to club her over the head, drag her to the bedroom and take her in a selfish fashion, then 2 minutes later make her fetch you a six pack of beer while you watch sports and talk on the phone to one of your girl friends.

I don't think the problem in your relationship is manliness at all. I know from experience that women don't like a 'manly man' any more than 'nice guy' after the newness wears off. Your marriage has entered a new phase where the initial rush of infatuation and novelty is over.

Have you two tried counseling? You both might find it helpful to get the input of an impartial third party.[/QUOTE]
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## ManDup

"anybody" made 4 posts a year ago and hasn't been heard from since, it looks like. But the sentiment is prevalent, so I guess carry on.


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## Wannamakeitbetter

So if my W is having an EA in our home I should tell her how it upsets me and set boundaries such as, "When you are talking to the other guy it is disrespectful to me, our child and our marriage?" or, "As long as you are talking to him you cannot live with me?" You know I love her and don't want her to leave but I am at the end of a rope here.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Hoosier

> [but living together still. I don't fully believe that she doesn't still love me, otherwise she wouldn't still be here, /QUOTE]
> 
> LOL! my wife has cheaper than rent sex...figures that sex with me is easier than paying rent. Your W doesnt even have to do that much!


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## ManDup

Wannamakeitbetter said:


> So if my W is having an EA in our home I should tell her how it upsets me and set boundaries such as, "When you are talking to the other guy it is disrespectful to me, our child and our marriage?" or, "As long as you are talking to him you cannot live with me?" You know I love her and don't want her to leave but I am at the end of a rope here.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


In what world is that acceptable? Of course it's not. Why do you want to keep such a woman? That's the real question you should be asking. Why do you respect yourself so little that you don't kick her out? There is a continuum of boundary-setting behavior that stretches from leaving, to saying she "can't" do something, to breaking the computer or cutting off the internet access, etc. Some of this behavior is controlling. You want to land on the side of setting a boundary and leaving it up to her to cross it or not, knowing the consequences of crossing it. Then you follow through on those consequences. This leaves her no passive-aggressive "outs" and makes it clear that she is violating the boundaries on purpose with no care for the consequences. The follow-through is the most important part, where you actually do what you say you will do.

For example, "I won't stay in a marriage where you have a better rapport with a man other than me. If you need emotional support or a male friend to talk to, that's what I'm here for. If you ever talk to him again, I'm out of here." This makes it her choice to do, but leaves you in control of what is acceptable to you.


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