# really don't know what to title this



## so-confused (May 26, 2014)

*think it's ending, but confused (long)*

Sorry for the vague title, I know that the title usually is supposed to draw people in to read your thread, but I just don't even know what I'm doing right now.

First time poster, glad to have found this site. Seems like some really great stuff here. I've searched a few threads but can't seem to find one just like mine. Close, but with some definite differences.

Here goes: I'm a 47 year old man, been married for going on 15 years (in Aug) to a wonderful woman, we've got 4 kids (one was hers from a previous relationship that I adopted right after the wedding) ranging in age from 21 to 5 (the other two are 12 and 9). But I feel as if my marriage is over and just don't know what to do.

As far as I know we've been going down hill for about 6 years now. I judge that time from when I first went to counseling for a work matter, but remember talking about marriage problems at home too. (I'm back in counseling with that same counselor, but more about that later.) Very little conversation other than the daily stuff of life. We're more like roommates than a married man and woman. Passionless, sexless, no communication. 

Over the years I have asked, begged, pleaded, even tried to force her to go to couples counseling with me, and each time I try to talk to her about it, she always agrees that we need it. But when it comes time to actually make the appointment (that was the time I tried to force her, just made the appointment and put it on the calendar) she always has excuses about how it's not a good time, she can't make it, she's busy, whatever. One time after I asked her, she agreed, as usual, and then put herself in individual counseling without letting me know. I was floored, had to find out about it from the bill. But then I thought it was a good idea, and went into counseling again myself, thinking when she was ready she and I could transition to couples counseling. I talked to her about it, and boom, she stopped going to counseling, again without even bothering to tell me. This was a couple years ago.

We don't fight, so there's that. But even when we did fight, we never really made up. No make up sex, no apologies from her, just go to sleep and the next day ignore everything and move back into life. So now it's just much easier to just walk away from her or her from I when we get even the least bit snippy with each other. Which happens often.

Now we do have some good times together, like when we watch Walking Dead, or Game of Thrones, or whatever. But that isn't the kind of happiness that makes a marriage. I believe we both feel as if we have to walk on eggshells around each other and that's no way to live. Of course, I have to assume all this or go with old fights, because she won't talk with me about anything anymore, and I don't feel like I can address anything deeper than how are the kids today?

Don't get me wrong, I'm no saint in this. I know I do stuff that upsets her, and I've admitted it to her. But I can't begin to fix whatever it is if we don't talk, and she won't tell me. But I AM the only one that has repeatedly asked to try and fix the marriage, and tried as well, whereas she seems to do everything against it such as ignoring going or stopping when it looks like it might take place. 

She is the only one so far to even mention splitting. Probably a year or so ago we fought about money (which is strange because that's been doing okay - she wanted to go to Dave Ramsey Financial Peace University and we did TWICE, and I've been getting into it, but she won't sit down and do a budget with me - again, a story for another time). She ended the argument by saying maybe we should get our finances in order so we could split them up. I told her I didn't want to split, wanted to get back to the way we were, and again, she agreed. Wouldn't be nailed down to an appointment tho, so I told her to let me know when she's ready - same thing I've said to her the last who knows how many times.

We haven't had sex in probably 5+ years. Last time was when she was pregnant with our 5 yr old to try and get her to go into labor. Last time we had GOOD sex was probably when we conceived the 5 year old. Since then, I've tried to get her in the mood, got the whole thing arranged a couple years ago to spend a night on the beach in a hotel, no kids, after a great dinner, and no work the next day for her birthday. She allows me to seduce her, and give her pleasure. But since I've been getting older, I need a little help in this department and she won't do a thing. Won't touch me, won't kiss me back, will just lay there after I've given her pleasure. Tried this again at the end of Feb this year and same result. I've decided 'm done trying to have sex with her. I probably could if I didn't mind her just laying there, but that's not what I want. I want a PARTNER. Someone to make love WITH, not someone just to you-know.

So, now I'm back in counseling with the counselor I saw a few years back. This counselor also counsels our son due to anxiety issues. Last time I was there she informed me of her opinion of my wife saying she is "very negative" when it comes to me. BOOM, hit me like a ton of bricks, basically a confirmation of how I felt anyway, but can't know due to lack of communication. My counselor feels I should probably end it because it's definitely got me stressed out. Although, on the plus side, my counseling has definitely made my relationship with my son a bit better! (Oh, and my wife doesn't know I'm back in counseling.)

But I'm scared. Don't know what to do. Don't want to lose my kids. I keep feeling that she wants to split as much as I do now, but she's doing stuff to get me to ask for it so I can be the bad guy (that's her MO). If that happens, I can almost guarantee she'll become a witch about everything, including the kids most likely. But I'm to the point where I just want a minimum amount to live on, and she can have the house and everything. I want to go but I also want hers and my kids' lives to stay basically the same except for me not being there.

In the interest of full disclosure, no, I don't believe she's seeing anyone else. She has many girl friends and they do a lot together, but they always talk about it, so I feel she's telling the truth when she's out with them. As for me, there is someone else I have feelings for, but nothing has happened physically, just talking and texting. She lives far away from me so we don't have the ability to get together. I believe the feelings are reciprocated, and should I decide to leave my wife, I will most definitely be trying to develop a relationship with her, but I don't want to leave my wife BECAUSE of her. 

As for where I stand: If my wife truly wants to try and communicate again and make this work, I would probably be amenable to trying to do that. I want to see her happy again. But then part of me says it would be too little too late, and whose to say that a couple years down the road we're not right back here again.

Okay, sorry my first post is SOOOOOOO long. Hope some read it and can give me some of their opinions.


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## NotLikeYou (Aug 30, 2011)

so-confused

Here's my opinion. Your wife may or may not love herself. Your wife definitely does not love you. You suffer from being a Nice Guy. You should go read No More Mr. Nice Guy. You should also go read the Married Man Sex Life website, to gain some insight on relationship dynamics. 

You should not have an affair. In fact, you should stop talking to the other person until you have a clear path forward for yourself. It will be impossible for you to make a genuine effort to save your marriage if you are thinking "what if" about someone else.

And, by the way, you should figure out a clear path forward for yourself. Either make a decision to divorce your wife and start a new life without her, or decide what you need to have in the marriage that is missing, and whether or not you can get those things with your wife.

These opinions provided free of charge.

Other comments-

There are lots of threads in the Sex in Marriage section of TAM about sexless marriages, like the one you are in. I have never understood how someone could endure a lack of sex in their marriage, especially for years, much less months.

Such a situation screams to me that the relationship is co-dependent and abusive. One partner is selfish, the other is frustrated and has low self-esteem. TAM posters offer all kinds of encouragement and suggestions on how to increase the frequency of sexual contact. Actual success seems to happen about as often as hen's teeth are discovered.

You have posted in Considering Divorce, which suggests to me that you are really unhappy with the state of things, and that you are edging towards making some hard decisions about your future. I think you are on the right track, but it will be a difficult track.

Then again, your wife doesn't love you, so pretty much any path forward is going to be hard.


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## WolverineFan (Nov 26, 2013)

*Re: think it's ending, but confused (long)*



so-confused said:


> As for where I stand: If my wife truly wants to try and communicate again and make this work, I would probably be amenable to trying to do that. I want to see her happy again. But then part of me says it would be too little too late, and whose to say that a couple years down the road we're not right back here again.


I want you to know that I understand exactly where you are and how you feel. Let me interject, I also know what it's like to go through a divorce and it isn't any fun at all. I have been separated from my wife for 5 years and divorced for 4. You cannot make your wife do anything - you already know that. You can, however, do everything within your power to let her know that your relationship has got to change.

I recommend that you find the book _Love Must Be Tough: New Hope for Marriage in Crisis_ by Dr. James Dobson. It will provide you very specific steps that you can take to try and convince your wife to join you in fixing this marriage. If I would have invested more energy when my marriage had hope I would not be in the position I am in now. 

My heart goes out to you - it really does. I know of a ministry that does intensive counseling which could be very beneficial. Send me a private message for more information. In the meantime, know that my thoughts and prayers are with you. Things can change...keep the hope.


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