# Filed in NY. Feel horrible.



## Almost-Done (Mar 5, 2016)

I just couldn't take it anymore so I filed. Wife says she's going to be a crazy cat lady for the rest of her life. I feel horrible about the situation. I just cannot take the reconstruction of what goes in her mind. Something happens one way, and then she turns it around completely. 

Why do I feel so bad? I feel like a failure. As crazy at it sounds, I still love the woman.


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## tech-novelist (May 15, 2014)

Obviously you won't get less sex because you weren't getting any sex anyway (according to your other thread), so at least that won't be a bigger problem.

Being a crazy cat lady is up to her; it's not your problem anymore.

You'll get over it eventually, and then you'll wonder why you waited so long.


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## Almost-Done (Mar 5, 2016)

tech-novelist said:


> Obviously you won't get less sex because you weren't getting any sex anyway (according to your other thread), so at least that won't be a bigger problem.
> 
> Being a crazy cat lady is up to her; it's not your problem anymore.
> 
> You'll get over it eventually, and then you'll wonder why you waited so long.


I know you're right, I just hate being painted to everyone that I'm the bad guy and the reason why the marriage failed; when it's not entirely true.


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## GuyInColorado (Dec 26, 2015)

You'll be fine. It will be worth it once you start dating and getting laid. Took me a month after separating... Life is good again!!

Just remember, those that give you crap are most likely in miserable marriages too. Just feel sorry for them!


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## honcho (Oct 5, 2013)

Almost-Done said:


> I know you're right, I just hate being painted to everyone that I'm the bad guy and the reason why the marriage failed; when it's not entirely true.


By the time divorce gets done nobody remembers or cares about the how's and whys leading to the end of the marriage. You won't be the bad guy and she won't be the innocent victim.


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## Almost-Done (Mar 5, 2016)

All make a lot of sense with the replies. Just stating, in my case, it was a hard decision.


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## WhyMe66 (Mar 25, 2016)

Almost-Done said:


> I just couldn't take it anymore so I filed. Wife says she's going to be a crazy cat lady for the rest of her life. I feel horrible about the situation. I just cannot take the reconstruction of what goes in her mind. Something happens one way, and then she turns it around completely.
> 
> Why do I feel so bad? I feel like a failure. As crazy at it sounds, I still love the woman.


Of course you feel bad, this is something that you need to grieve over. This is a loss not unlike a death in the family. You spent all this time married to her and now that has come to an end. You love this woman and shared a life with her, it will take time to heal. Much as I wish these feelings do not go away the instant you decide on the Big D. As for what she is going to do with her life that is on her. She has to make those decisions for herself.


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## JohnA (Jun 24, 2015)

Have you cheated on her? Arebyour hands clean? Then no, do not apologies. There are a 101 valid reapns to divorce non to cheat.


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## Almost-Done (Mar 5, 2016)

WhyMe66 said:


> Of course you feel bad, this is something that you need to grieve over. This is a loss not unlike a death in the family. You spent all this time married to her and now that has come to an end. You love this woman and shared a life with her, it will take time to heal. Much as I wish these feelings do not go away the instant you decide on the Big D. As for what she is going to do with her life that is on her. She has to make those decisions for herself.


No doubt. Feels like a piece of me is dying/leaving. I know I tried everything to fix us. However, as I told her, I cannot make you happy, you need to make yourself happy. Just like you cannot make me happy, I need to make myself happy. It's just a shame, as the issues could had been fixed if she just worked at it with me. I told her, a relationship is hard work, both people need to work at it. She then replied, so when do you plan to start working on it? :surprise:



JohnA said:


> Have you cheated on her? Arebyour hands clean? Then no, do not apologies. There are a 101 valid reapns to divorce non to cheat.


Never cheated. I think my hands are pretty clean. Though, because I didn't buy her chips at the food mart the other day, I am evil and do not think about what she wants. Yes, that is what she said. Yes, it's quite immature. Oh, and yes, she told me not to pick up those chips previously because she'll get fat. I just cannot/could not win. No, you cannot make these arguments up. That was one of her recent complaints.


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## WhyMe66 (Mar 25, 2016)

Almost-Done said:


> No doubt. Feels like a piece of me is dying/leaving. I know I tried everything to fix us. However, as I told her, I cannot make you happy, you need to make yourself happy. Just like you cannot make me happy, I need to make myself happy. It's just a shame, as the issues could had been fixed if she just worked at it with me. I told her, a relationship is hard work, both people need to work at it. She then replied, so when do you plan to start working on it? :surprise:
> 
> 
> 
> Never cheated. I think my hands are pretty clean. Though, because I didn't buy her chips at the food mart the other day, I am evil and do not think about what she wants. Yes, that is what she said. Yes, it's quite immature. Oh, and yes, she told me not to pick up those chips previously because she'll get fat. I just cannot/could not win. No, you cannot make these arguments up. That was one of her recent complaints.


That was one major failing we had-we didn't sync our efforts to work on things and now it may be too late. I gave up and put it in God's hands...


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## JohnA (Jun 24, 2015)

She is using DARVO on you. I am going to tell you something 99% of people don't understand when I first stated it and only about 15% of people ever really get. "empathy can be use as a deadly weapon to use and manipulate a person". In that case their is no other deadly weapon. She is using your desire to be a good spouse to control you. The only response is to state "your right are realities are just to different and go 180. This is DARVO, when you get that let's talk about the 180. 

Davo

What is DARVO?

Jennifer J. Freyd, University of Oregon

Short Definition

DARVO refers to a reaction perpetrators of wrong doing, particularly sexual offenders, may display in response to being held accountable for their behavior. DARVO stands for "Deny, Attack, and Reverse Victim and Offender." The perpetrator or offender may Deny the behavior, Attack the individual doing the confronting, and Reverse the roles of Victim and Offender such that the perpetrator assumes the victim role and turns the true victim -- or the whistle blower -- into an alleged offender. This occurs, for instance, when an actually guilty perpetrator assumes the role of "falsely accused" and attacks the accuser's credibility or even blames the accuser of being the perpetrator of a false accusation.


Disclaimers

DARVO as a concept is based on observation and analysis. The author has not yet published systematic empirical research testing the coherence or frequency of DARVO. However, the first empirical research specifically testing the concept of DARVO is completed and the manuscript report is in preparation (Harsey, Zurbriggen, & Freyd, in prep).
Other observers have likely noted the same phenomena and related phenomena using different terms; the author has been informed that some people have found the term DARVO a helpful mnemonic and organizing concept.
Also the presense of DARVO is not necessarily evidence in support of the accusation of guilt; a truly innocent person may deny an accusation, attack the person making the accusation, or claim the victim role. Future research may be able to determine the probability of a DARVO response as a function of guilt or innocence. The author hypothesized that some sorts of denials and reactions such as DARVO are more likely when the perpetrator is guilty than innocent (Freyd, 1997); however this hypothesis has not yet been tested. Furthermore, even if research indicates that a DARVO reaction is more likely when there is actual guilt, it would be an error to use a DARVO reaction as proof of guilt.
For now the concept of DARVO is offered as potentially memorable and useful term for anticipating the behavior of perpetrators when held accountable, and for making sense of responses that may otherwise be confusing (particularly when victim and offender get reversed).*
History of Terminology & Writings about DARVO

Jennifer Freyd introduced the term "DARVO" near the end of a 1997 publication about her primary research focus, "betrayal trauma theory." (For more on betrayal trauma theory, see Definition of Betrayal Trauma Theory.)

The reference for the 1997 article introducing the term is:

Freyd, J.J. (1997) Violations of power, adaptive blindness, and betrayal trauma theory. Feminism & Psychology, 7, 22-32.

In that paper Freyd explained that DARVO responses may be effective for perpetrators. "...I have observed that actual abusers threaten, bully and make a nightmare for anyone who holds them accountable or asks them to change their abusive behavior. This attack, intended to chill and terrify, typically includes threats of law suits, overt and covert attacks on the whistle-blower's credicility, and so on..... [T]he offender rapidly creates the impression that the abuser is the wronged one, while the victim or concerned observer is the offender. Figure and ground are completely reversed... The offender is on the offense and the person attempting to hold the offender accountable is put on the defense." (Freyd, 1997, p 29-30)

"By denying, attacking and reversing perpetrators into victims, reality gets even more confusing and unspeakable for the real victim. .... These perpetrator reactions increase the need for betrayal blindness. If the victim does speak out and gets this level of attack, she quickly gets the idea that silence is safer." (Veldhuis & Freyd, 1999. p 274).

It didn't happen (an instance) or It rarely happens (a type of event)
It wasn't harmful
Put together they can take the form: "It didn't happen, but if it did, it wasn't that bad" or "It rarely happens, but when it does it isn't harmful." The two claims both serve to deny, but they depend upon different sorts of evidence. They may both be true, but they are sometimes somewhat suspicious when claimed simultaneously (or by the same person at different times), as for instance can occur in response to allegations of rape or child sexual abuse.

Here is the link*What is DARVO?
Hat tip to @marduk*


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## JohnA (Jun 24, 2015)

A classic example is a no doubt about it rapist who will go to their grave claiming she wanted it, she asked for it and I spend years in prison and she gets cuddled for the rest of her life. 

Old Hollywood response. You light a cig, take a deep drag and exhale in her face. Say "piss off mate, no sake today" and walk away. You need to learn to accept that sometimes it is just that fing simple. Get a clue, get a grip, get a life.


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## Almost-Done (Mar 5, 2016)

Yea, I get it, it's just hard to swallow. We've been together for 7 years. Due to my job, self employed, I work by myself. Friendless too. Most people my age are married, in a relationship and have a family. Now in my early 30s and nothing to show for it in my personal life. No wife. No relationship. No friends. Pathetic. Lots of bad decisions in my life. Never really focused on friends, as I had my wife or a gf. In your early to mid 20s, it seems to be okay. Early to mid 30s, not so much. Makes me look like something is wrong with me. What person in their 30s has no friends? Just pathetic. Oh if I had a time machine... And the loss of friends is my fault. I focused on building my business. Business took off, but my social life paid the price. I think I've paid too high of a price in life.


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## Voltaire2013 (Sep 22, 2013)

JohnA,

Key-rist you loves you some DARVO, you do know that it came from observing Pedophiles back in the late 90s right? I don't doubt that it happens in other realationships but when used too often it loses it meaning. Maybe some people are just bad at relationships. 

Just my 02,
Cheers,
V(13)



JohnA said:


> She is using DARVO on you. I am going to tell you something 99% of people don't understand when I first stated it and only about 15% of people ever really get. "empathy can be use as a deadly weapon to use and manipulate a person". In that case their is no other deadly weapon. She is using your desire to be a good spouse to control you. The only response is to state "your right are realities are just to different and go 180. This is DARVO, when you get that let's talk about the 180.
> 
> Davo
> 
> ...


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## Almost-Done (Mar 5, 2016)

I guess I could be bad at relationships. However, I believe I tried everything to make it right. I tried a retreat as someone suggested as well as a family intervention (she and her family laughed at it behind my back). Not sure what else I could had done. Heck, for the last year, we've been sleeping in separate beds, no sex, no kissing, nothing. Now, she's living with her parents. I'm the bad guy of course. Their daughter can do no wrong. I even said God only knows what you told them about our issues. She said she hasn't. I've heard some of those convos, she's a liar. Says she can't stand me, can't live with me, etc. Yet, it took me a month to get her to move out. If I am so horrible and she cannot stand me, why did it take so long for her to move out? Also, this is fun... Earlier in the week, before she left, she said she's moving out because we cannot get along. I just smiled and walked into the next room. Then, she starts cussing and calling me names. Like Big D!ck, Stupid SOB, etc. She never cussed before a few months ago, this has gotten very bad and very disrespectful. It was like the straw that broke th camels back. Before she walked out the door the other day, she said, you'll see how much you are going to miss me and how awesome and great a wife I was to you. I just smiled and said nothing. This is NOT the woman I married. I may of had some bad days, but nothing like this. This is 2 years plus of name calling, telling me one thing to my face, then another to the family, trust issues, no intimacy, no affection, and little to no communication. 

I will bet anyone here a dinner at Peter Luger Steak House that she expects me to be calling her and wanting her to move back in. There's going to be silence from me to her. Then, of course, she be yapping about it to her parents. Let them clean up after her. List. To her hours upon hours of useless talk about other people. Since they live in a small apt, enjoy her snoring too. It should be a fun experience for her and her parents. Maybe now they will know what I had to experience for the last few years. They've not lived with Thor daughter for 15 years I believe. Oh, I wish I could be a fly on the wall.


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## tech-novelist (May 15, 2014)

Almost-Done said:


> I guess I could be bad at relationships. However, I believe I tried everything to make it right. I tried a retreat as someone suggested as well as a family intervention (she and her family laughed at it behind my back). Not sure what else I could had done. Heck, for the last year, we've been sleeping in separate beds, no sex, no kissing, nothing. Now, she's living with her parents. I'm the bad guy of course. Their daughter can do no wrong. I even said God only knows what you told them about our issues. She said she hasn't. I've heard some of those convos, she's a liar. Says she can't stand me, can't live with me, etc. Yet, it took me a month to get her to move out. If I am so horrible and she cannot stand me, why did it take so long for her to move out? Also, this is fun... Earlier in the week, before she left, she said she's moving out because we cannot get along. I just smiled and walked into the next room. Then, she starts cussing and calling me names. Like Big D!ck, Stupid SOB, etc. She never cussed before a few months ago, this has gotten very bad and very disrespectful. It was like the straw that broke th camels back. Before she walked out the door the other day, she said, you'll see how much you are going to miss me and how awesome and great a wife I was to you. I just smiled and said nothing. This is NOT the woman I married. I may of had some bad days, but nothing like this. This is 2 years plus of name calling, telling me one thing to my face, then another to the family, trust issues, no intimacy, no affection, and little to no communication.
> 
> I will bet anyone here a dinner at Peter Luger Steak House that she expects me to be calling her and wanting her to move back in. There's going to be silence from me to her. Then, of course, she be yapping about it to her parents. Let them clean up after her. List. To her hours upon hours of useless talk about other people. Since they live in a small apt, enjoy her snoring too. It should be a fun experience for her and her parents. Maybe now they will know what I had to experience for the last few years. They've not lived with Thor daughter for 15 years I believe. Oh, I wish I could be a fly on the wall.


The faster you get rid of her, the happier you will be.

Soon you will find out that you are in the catbird seat when it comes to dating. Women will be coming out of the woodwork to try to snare you, but take your time and see what life has to offer.

Your best days are ahead!


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## TheTruthHurts (Oct 1, 2015)

I get that this sucks and your STBXW has sucked the life out of you, but get a grip, man!

After you've calmed down, go back and reread your posts. It's all "woe is me. I don't have any friends. Everyone is talking about me behind my back. I care what everyone thinks and everyone thinks I'm a loser and a bad guy."

So it's normal to be distraught by this, but you'd be better off getting a little bit pissed off at HER and her PARENTS. Instead you're beating yourself up.

Truth is you shouldn't give a crap what anyone else thinks of you - including me. A man stands on his own two feet. If a woman stands with him, that's awesome. If not - use those feet and walk away with no regrets.

I'm pointing out that you seem to want to get your sense of self worth from all the toxic people around you. Not going to happen, bud. And regarding your pity party about being 30 and friendless - well I think that's actually pretty normal and far from pathetic. Most people are building a life and career in their 20s and 30s and the friendships tend to be work related and superficial. As in - lets get a cup of coffee and b1txh about a coworker for a few minutes.

You're not behind in life - a lot of women would think you've been locked in a sh1tty relationship but are finally available. But only once you dump the beta sad face and put on a confident exterior.

Sorry for the 2x4 but I only know your story from this posting, and it sounds like early release from prison for good behavior and nothing to be sad about. The W threw in the towel and will blame it all in you. So what. Water off your back. You don't need to impress the MIL or FIL.

Check out the singles life. In the states there's a good organization that advertises all the time with 30-40 monthly events - all filled with single guys and girls. Go to the gym and meet guys. Go to the grocery store, stand around sort of helpless looking at veggies and some woman will help you - chicks dig a slightly helpless guy trying to stretch and buy food and they love the ego boost that they can help. H3ll I've got an amazing W and am not trying to pick up anyone and attractive women talk to me all the time - when I initiate conversation in situations like this.

So take a step back and you'll thank STBXW for giving you back your life.


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## Almost-Done (Mar 5, 2016)

TheTruthHurts said:


> I get that this sucks and your STBXW has sucked the life out of you, but get a grip, man!
> 
> After you've calmed down, go back and reread your posts. It's all "woe is me. I don't have any friends. Everyone is talking about me behind my back. I care what everyone thinks and everyone thinks I'm a loser and a bad guy."
> 
> ...


It just sucks, that is all. She moved out today, and I feel like ****. I feel like I could had done something different to make us work. It's not that I am throwing a pitty-party, I am just feeling very bad and feel I could had done something different. It is just that the wife was a DIFFERENT woman than she is now. I just do not know what happened. I just wish I knew and it would be a heck of a lot easier. What happened to make her change? 

How does one of the most supportive women (initially) just check out and turn into an unkind cold person? I just do not get it. I know I am trying to find a logical reason for an illogical/emotional situation, but, these emotions are hard to control. I know I should be angry at her, and sometimes I am, but I just feel very guilty and that it is all my fault. I do not know how, but I do. I can ask her, and she usually tells me nothing, so I am just completely dumbfounded by the situation.


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## unbe (Dec 20, 2013)

Almost-Done said:


> It just sucks, that is all. She moved out today, and I feel like ****. I feel like I could had done something different to make us work. It's not that I am throwing a pitty-party, I am just feeling very bad and feel I could had done something different. It is just that the wife was a DIFFERENT woman than she is now. I just do not know what happened. I just wish I knew and it would be a heck of a lot easier. What happened to make her change?
> 
> How does one of the most supportive women (initially) just check out and turn into an unkind cold person? I just do not get it. I know I am trying to find a logical reason for an illogical/emotional situation, but, these emotions are hard to control. I know I should be angry at her, and sometimes I am, but I just feel very guilty and that it is all my fault. I do not know how, but I do. I can ask her, and she usually tells me nothing, so I am just completely dumbfounded by the situation.


its not for you to understand...none of that matters.

What matters is what you are going to do NEXT. 

Anything decision you make from here on needs to be with your best interests on the forefront. Thats your first and most important steps going forward.


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## ReturntoZero (Aug 31, 2015)

Almost-Done said:


> I guess I could be bad at relationships.


Are you familiar with the word codependent?


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## ReturntoZero (Aug 31, 2015)

tech-novelist said:


> The faster you get rid of her, the happier you will be.
> 
> Soon you will find out that you are in the catbird seat when it comes to dating. Women will be coming out of the woodwork to try to snare you, but take your time and see what life has to offer.
> 
> Your best days are ahead!


Actually, that's not true.

There's an interim step.

He has to fix himself first.


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## Almost-Done (Mar 5, 2016)

unbe said:


> its not for you to understand...none of that matters.
> 
> What matters is what you are going to do NEXT.
> 
> Anything decision you make from here on needs to be with your best interests on the forefront. Thats your first and most important steps going forward.


Without a doubt, you are right, and I agree.



ReturntoZero said:


> Are you familiar with the word codependent?


Yes, but we were never co-dependent. We lived separate lives and did things separately 99% of the time. There is no co-dependency here. I just do not like failure. I try my hardest in everything I do not to fail. The question as to why is what I am seeking. Obviously, I may not ever figure the answer out.



ReturntoZero said:


> Actually, that's not true.
> 
> There's an interim step.
> 
> He has to fix himself first.


Yes, it will take time to work on myself. I can tell you it took a lot to file and have her move out. She never thought I'd do it. She's still a bit in shock. I bet you she's waiting for me to call her back. After an hour or so, it's started to get a bit more easier. I can do what I want. I can cook what I want. I guess, the strain of having to listen and put up with her illogical banter is gone, and I am feeling better. Made a great healthy meal last night. Tonight, a nice New York Strip Steak I will make. I was always able to make them before, I would just have to make two separate dinners, thus making the act a bit redundant (she didn't like meat, and veggies upset her stomach).

The first hour or two were hard. I am sure I will have ups and downs, but moving forward I am.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

Almost-Done said:


> I just couldn't take it anymore so I filed. Wife says she's going to be a crazy cat lady for the rest of her life. I feel horrible about the situation. I just cannot take the reconstruction of what goes in her mind. Something happens one way, and then she turns it around completely.
> 
> Why do I feel so bad? I feel like a failure. As crazy at it sounds, I still love the woman.


*Like you, I loved my RSXW for the woman that she represented herself to be at the inception of our marriage! But over the due course of time, things changed with her, which sadly did not include me!

Either I was just too naïve and trusting going in, or she was little more than a conniving liar!

Probably, and in all reality, a little bit of both!*
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## ReturntoZero (Aug 31, 2015)

Almost-Done said:


> Yes, but we were never co-dependent.


Good luck to you.


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## helolover (Aug 24, 2012)

honcho said:


> By the time divorce gets done nobody remembers or cares about the how's and whys leading to the end of the marriage. You won't be the bad guy and she won't be the innocent victim.



I bet other people don't really care now.


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## ReturntoZero (Aug 31, 2015)

helolover said:


> I bet other people don't really care now.


They care about - gasp - themselves.

Imagine that.


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