# I want to work it out, but I think he cheated



## 5ftnuttin (May 2, 2012)

My husband and I have only been married 11 months, and have been living 2 hours apart the whole time. He was supposed to be trying to find a job in my area since we were dating, but it doesn't appear that he has been looking for a very long time, although he says he has. He is a retail manager and his company told him they would be opening a big new store in his area next year, so I think he might be wanting to stay there for that, although he doesn't say that. 

Since September there have been a lot of trust issues because I have felt like he hides texts and things from me. I also feel like he has an inappropriate relationship with one of his female employees and has mislead me about their relationship (is she just an employee, are they friends, are they good friends?). I get a lot of different answers from him when I ask about this stuff, which I know in my heart means he is hiding stuff and not being honest and just can't keep the lies straight. I guess I just want to think it's not because he's cheating; it's for any other reason. We went to one session of counseling together and the counselor suggested that based on his background he is probably just avoiding conflict at any cost.

Our relationship deteriorated more and more as I nagged him more and more about inconsistencies I found with everything (deleting texts when he agreed to leave them for me to see, allowing a female coworker to come over to his home for over an hour one evening, not looking for a job in my area), and he began to threaten divorce every time I would bring up a topic he didn't want to talk about. I started us in counseling a few weeks ago, and the night before the second session he got upset with me and said he was done with the relationship and left. He took my key to his place and said he would bring all my stuff to me. I'm torn between trying to convince him to come back to counseling and telling him to go to hell. Even if we do divorce, I feel very strongly that there was at the least an EA if not an PA, and I feel like I need to know about it to move on. Will he ever admit that, though?


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## Numb-badger (May 18, 2011)

Do you have any proof?


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## 5ftnuttin (May 2, 2012)

no proof, just strong suspicion. mainly with one particular employee. He tells her stuff in texts he doesn't even tell me. When she needed a place to come with her baby for a few hours when her car broke down right after we started dating (they had just set off bug bombs in the house) she called him and asked if she could bring the baby over. I wanted to play with the baby, but he said it wasn't appropriate for us to stay at the house with her because she was his employee, so we went out somewhere. But a few months ago she had another baby and came by his house with the baby for over an hour, just her and him. What's up with that? She asked him in a text if he was moving and he told her he wouldn't go far and would always be there for her. This is a person he had always told me was just an employee up till then. And that came at a time that he and I had been discussing trying to find a position with his company out of state, so I felt betrayed that he would tell her he wasn't actually considering that when he and I had discussed it.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

He is almost surely in an emotional affair with her.

I would get the book Not Just Friends by Shirley Glass ASAP. It's a long, thorough, detailed book that takes you from where you are now to where you are trying to go step by step by step.

Do you have any ability to see his cell phone bills? This will give you an idea at least of the level of texting and phone calls between them.

But I think you already have more than enough to be extremely suspicious.

Your biggest problem is dealing with this long-distance. Do you have any relatives or friends in the area?


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## Numb-badger (May 18, 2011)

At the very least it's a totally unacceptable breach of boundaries.
For now, don't kick up too much dust (they hide things when threatened) but keep an eye out and log any evidence you can. If he is up to something, you will need it.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

As far as your ambivalence: you should listen to those feelings. Your marriage is young, it sounds like you have no kids. You might be able to get an annulment but I think it has to happen within 12 mos. I would go to a lawyer and just talk about your options. This doesn't mean you are getting divorced or that the marriage can never be saved. But you need to know all of your alternatives to make the best choices.


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## 5ftnuttin (May 2, 2012)

iheartlife said:


> He is almost surely in an emotional affair with her.
> 
> I would get the book Not Just Friends by Shirley Glass ASAP. It's a long, thorough, detailed book that takes you from where you are now to where you are trying to go step by step by step.
> 
> ...


No, I can't see his cell bill. We are on separate plans. Right now we are not seeing each other at all and I don't have any fam/friends there. In te past week since he walked out and refused to go to the second counseling session I was originally going wit the divorce/separation idea, thinking it might knock some sense into him to see that he can't run off and cry divorce every time I try to talk about something he doesn't like with him, but when I called him Tues night about getting my things he said he wanted to somehow get them to me without seeing me. He said he never wanted to see me again and not for me to ever call him again, as though he has something to be mad at me about. He has quite a temper, but it usually blows over pretty fast. I don't know where this is coming from. 

I left him a voicemail today and told him he needs to be sure this is what he wants, because I'm not going to stay legally married to someone who doesn't even want to look at or speak to me, so I'm going to start moving forward legally if that's how he really feels. I also said I think I deserve an explanation as to where this has all come from, because I put a lot of time and effort into a relationship that he clearly wasn't really committed to if he can just drop it after one counseling session. I told him I think he owes me some answers so that I can have some closure. He sent me a text and said he will call me tonight.


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## 5ftnuttin (May 2, 2012)

I checked into an annulment but it is incredibly expensive, unless I could get him to pay for it, which I seriously doubt. And I don't really see the point. I mean, all my family and friends were at the wedding. They all know I was married. To get a judgement now saying it never happened seems strange to me. I was just rummaging for a pen in my purse yesterday and found the one we used to sign the guest book at the wedding. 

I'm not going to get much more evidence of what they are doing unless we get back together, in which case I will be making it very clear that their relationship is to become strictly work. If we do go forward with a divorce I will be contacting his HR department about them, as it is an inappropriate relationship in HR's view.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

There are some standard verification techniques that you can use.

You can hire a private investigator to follow him and to get precise information about this employee, i.e., is she married and who she's married to, criminal background, other details like that.

You can get a voice activated recorder and put it in his vehicle--to listen in and see if he's talking to her on the phone, or to hear what they say to each other if he drives her around.

When he says he never wants to see you again--it sounds like you are unclear on whether he said this because he has a nasty temper and is an extremely poor communicator, or whether he really means it.

I agree, that type of immature behavior shouldn't be tolerated.

So what is stopping you from moving back to where he is and putting the kibosh on his "friendship" with a woman with TWO babies?


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## 5ftnuttin (May 2, 2012)

iheartlife said:


> There are some standard verification techniques that you can use.
> 
> You can hire a private investigator to follow him and to get precise information about this employee, i.e., is she married and who she's married to, criminal background, other details like that.
> 
> ...


I have checked her out myself already. She is married, and although her husband has a misdemeanor criminal background, she does not. 

I never lived in his area, we have always apart with the intention of him moving to my area. I have a very good state job with very necessary insurance benefits and own my home in my area. I am not on his lease and under Florida law I don't believe I have any legal rights to his rental home if quitting my job and just showing up there was an option. I do not have access to his vehicle to put a VAR in it.


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## Pit-of-my-stomach (Nov 2, 2010)

5ftnuttin said:


> I'm torn between trying to convince him to come back to counseling and telling him to go to hell.


11 months married? 

Hell. and it's not close.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

*Please try to find the book Not Just Friends before you talk to your husband tonight.* Can you download it to your phone? Barnes & Noble also lets you put a book on reserve via computer so you can go and get it ASAP.

Go straight to Chapter 3, Reaching the Moment of Revelation. I'd read that whole chapter before talking. You need to especially concentrate on pages 78-80 but you should also read pp. 70-77 because you may see some additional evidence of an emotional affair that didn't strike you that way before.

Because you have so little evidence, it's generally not recommended to confront, because what happens is that they will bury it deeper. But you've already let the cat out of the bag with your suspicions, so this shouldn't matter so much.

What I'm having a hard time sorting out is, what part of his behavior is just "him" and what part is the irrationality of what is known as "the fog." The initial stages of infatuation are very powerful, it is intense and it's quite hard to break up an affair at that stage short of actually filing for divorce. The filing shocks some affair partners out long enough to work to reconcile. But they still have intense difficulty breaking off contact with their partners.

However, your husband has jumped the gun and it sounds like he might want a divorce (if it isn't just another temper tantrum). In that case, your filing could have some effect but likely not much.

The other thing that shocks affair partners out of the fog is exposure. Exposure to the people he loves and respects the most. This is probably something you will have to use because he is so far gone. Having his parents or siblings or best friends call and say, what the heck happened???? ***with knowledge about the affair with married woman with two babies, if she is his AP*** is the key.

The other thing is exposing the affair to her husband. Obviously this will infuriate your husband, but if he is in an affair it is entirely justified that a married woman's husband should know how she spends her time.

The last thing--well--is exposure to the store. If he's in an affair, it is a sure violation of their policy. Yes, it's almost surely going to get him fired if you have proof. This is a "nuke" but IF he's in an affair he is going to have to go "no contact"--i.e., he is going to have to leave that town and the store with it to work elsewhere, anyhow. This may be something to keep in the back pocket.

You would want to do both exposures (his family and hers) at the same time if you go down that path.

Your biggest difficulty is proof; if you want to reconcile, I would hire a private investigator; find her parents and siblings, I'm sure they're around. If you don't want to spend that money--maybe because you need if it in the event you choose divorce--that is probably a big way to examine your feelings of ambivalence.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

What's the poin tof being married if you don't live together, he hosts women at his house, he hides messages from you, he lies about his relationship with other women, and he threatens divorce everytime you bring up a concern?

Get an annullment. This isn't a marriage. It's a joke.


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## 5ftnuttin (May 2, 2012)

iheartlife said:


> *Please try to find the book Not Just Friends before you talk to your husband tonight.* Can you download it to your phone? Barnes & Noble also lets you put a book on reserve via computer so you can go and get it ASAP.
> 
> Go straight to Chapter 3, Reaching the Moment of Revelation. I'd read that whole chapter before talking. You need to especially concentrate on pages 78-80 but you should also read pp. 70-77 because you may see some additional evidence of an emotional affair that didn't strike you that way before.
> 
> ...


yes, I'm getting the book today. The only way I have to contact his friends and family is via facebook or snail mail. I don't have any of their phone numbers. He only has a few close friends, and none in the area where he lives, which I think has a lot to do with this. I can find her husband and a lot of her family via facebook as well. Her parents shouldn't be hard to find since they live in a very small town. Her husband's parents are very religious and would probably freak if I had any kind of proof at all. He recently promoted her at work, causing some major animosity with another employee, so I'm pretty sure they would both be fired if there was proof of anything.

Here is all I can come up with. I know something has happened, I just don't know how much. If he wants to work on things I am going to insist on full disclosure on everything and start taking steps to monitor what is happening from now on. If he doesn't want to work on things I am going to do everything I can to get proof of what has happened to expose them both to the company and expose her to her husband and family.


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## 5ftnuttin (May 2, 2012)

Jellybeans said:


> What's the poin tof being married if you don't live together, he hosts women at his house, he hides messages from you, he lies about his relationship with other women, and he threatens divorce everytime you bring up a concern?
> 
> Get an annullment. This isn't a marriage. It's a joke.


I understand that everyone is entitled to their opinion, but whether my husband and I reconcile or divorce, to call my marriage a joke is quite hurtful. I waited almost 30 years to get married, and I married intending on staying married forever. All of my friends and family were there and it was an extremely happy day for me. I truly don't believe my husband married me intending any of this to happen, and I certainly didn't intend for it to happen. No one intends to find themselves in the circumstances of infidelity or possible infidelity, but it doesn't make their marriage a joke, and neither do the other circumstances. My marriage was a lot more than those things, or I wouldn't care if it was over.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

5ftnuttin said:


> I understand that everyone is entitled to their opinion, but whether my husband and I reconcile or divorce, to call my marriage a joke is quite hurtful. I waited almost 30 years to get married, and I married intending on staying married forever. All of my friends and family were there and it was an extremely happy day for me. I truly don't believe my husband married me intending any of this to happen, and I certainly didn't intend for it to happen. No one intends to find themselves in the circumstances of infidelity or possible infidelity, but it doesn't make their marriage a joke, and neither do the other circumstances. My marriage was a lot more than those things, or I wouldn't care if it was over.


My apologies if I have offended you. That wasn't my intention at all. 

I understand why you are hurt--anyone would be in that sort of situation. It's clear you took your marriage vows very seriously. It's my opinion though, that your husband didn't. He seems to have a totally different outlook on marriage and what is appropriate vs. inappropriate.

To constantly be secretive and hide things from you and not even live with you on top of threatening divorce at when you bring up something that is hurting you--is really selfish and mean on his part. It's dismissive of your feelings and it creates an "unsafe" environment for your marriage. The fact he can throw the "divorce" word around so freely, as a "trump card" to win every disagreement with you speaks volumes. Someone who truly cares about you wouldn't do that. 

My 2 cents.

I do wish you luck and the best outcome.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

5ftnuttin said:


> yes, I'm getting the book today. The only way I have to contact his friends and family is via facebook or snail mail. I don't have any of their phone numbers. He only has a few close friends, and none in the area where he lives, which I think has a lot to do with this. I can find her husband and a lot of her family via facebook as well. Her parents shouldn't be hard to find since they live in a very small town. Her husband's parents are very religious and would probably freak if I had any kind of proof at all. He recently promoted her at work, causing some major animosity with another employee, so I'm pretty sure they would both be fired if there was proof of anything.
> 
> Here is all I can come up with. I know something has happened, I just don't know how much. If he wants to work on things I am going to insist on full disclosure on everything and start taking steps to monitor what is happening from now on. If he doesn't want to work on things I am going to do everything I can to get proof of what has happened to expose them both to the company and expose her to her husband and family.


Just so you know my opinion, if I were you I would also be looking at throwing in the towel. He is showing many signs of disrespect in ways that are beyond just having an affair, that should not be tolerated. However, it's also possible that those were distancing mechanisms typical of cheaters, i.e., making you the bad guy so he could justify his cheating.

-----------------------------------

Assuming you are trying to reconcile because you think he's worth it--i.e, he was never like this before (?):

First--confronting and having a tell me everything now or we're getting divorced conversation by telephone is a very bad idea. I would try everything in my power to have this call be about meeting face to face, and not about his lies. Sweet talk him into it if you have to. He is avoiding you for a reason--perhaps seeing you will make it harder to lie, or he will break down and admit something, or it will wilt his resolve to leave you.

Do NOT use the threat of exposure to try to get him to confess. Don't mention it AT ALL. It won't work. All that will accomplish is to get his ducks in a row, have the 2 of them get their stories straight, delete / get rid of evidence, and have it go even deeper underground (i.e., maybe stay out of contact for a while to fool you). I wouldn't breathe a word about exposure in your telephone conversation.

Here is my gut advice: do not bring up the subject of divorce unless he does. If he does, keep bringing it back to needing to meet in person. Your goal out of this conversation is to meet in person.

If you can't persuade him to give you a face-to-face meeting, do NOT threaten divorce. You need the full force of the reality of divorce to hit him simultaneously with exposure and that is for another day. If he says he wants a divorce, you just say, well, I don't want one. If he absolutely refuses to agree to a face to face meeting, just tell him you are devastated and don't understand how this could be happening. You want to give him the impression you're caving and not going to fight.

So, I would NOT set up tonight's call as "the call to end all calls." Do not confront him (despite my earlier post) and don't use it to try to get any more evidence. 

--------------------------

You've had plenty of face to face meetings in the past. But you need to prep for one more. You need to have the PI evidence--if you won't spend the money then I wouldn't bother trying to reconcile, because you truly need more proof for everyone (besides your husband, from whom you need NO more proof) is simply going to call you crazy.

You'll need to have the attorney meeting behind you for that face-to-face talk. You will need the divorce papers drawn up to lay out before him.

I know it sounds so over the top, but you have to be willing to lose your marriage to save it.



Then:
PI
atty mtg
prep divorce papers

Then:
--drive to his town 
--at your hotel (on a day when he's working at the store) with no advance warning, immediate full exposure using PI info to EVERYONE--perhaps short of the store, that's something to talk about later
--immediately get in the car and drive to the store where he can't avoid you for fear of a scene and get that face-to-face meeting with the divorce papers.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

I should have added:

in the unlikely event that he agrees to a face-to-face meeting, agree to a day when you have your ducks in a row: PI evidence, ready to expose immediately, divorce papers lined up.

So don't ask to see him face to face tomorrow.


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

Jellybean's post may have been a little harsh, but I have to say it sure doesn't look like an actual marriage to me. You're not even on the same cell phone plan! You don't live together and never have. Neither of you seems to be taking steps so that you will live together. Do you even share the same bank account? Isn't marriage a combining of two lives? It just doesn't sound like you've done that.


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

How long did the two of you date before you got married? And was it a distance relationship as well?

C
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## 5ftnuttin (May 2, 2012)

We were together for 2 1/2 years before we got married. We lived apart then, too. It's not like we never saw each other. We usually spent 2 or 3 days a week together, sometimes more when I worked nights. We kept separate cell phone plans because I maxed out my family plan some time ago by putting my mom, dad, grandma, and aunt on it, and he likes his carrier better anyway. No, we didn't share finances. We were supporting completely separate houses and I was fine with keeping our money separate while we lived apart, although we did argue about how to combine it when we moved in together. Some of the things that you guys see as a sign of "no marriage" I see as a sign of healthy independence within a marriage, so I guess that's just a matter of opinion. It's starting to sound like I'm justifying, so I'm going to stop now.

I think a PI would be a great idea, but it's not something I can afford to spend money on right now. I realize that means I may not get any proof of anything and that sucks, but I would rather have money for a retainer for an attorney than pay a PI right now, even if that means I end up having to walk away without exposing him. Florida is a no-fault state and we were only married 11 months, so it's not like proof of an affair gets me anything legally.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

5ftnuttin said:


> I think a PI would be a great idea, but it's not something I can afford to spend money on right now. I realize that means I may not get any proof of anything and that sucks, but I would rather have money for a retainer for an attorney than pay a PI right now, even if that means I end up having to walk away without exposing him. Florida is a no-fault state and we were only married 11 months, so it's not like proof of an affair gets me anything legally.


You don't have to have the PI evidence to expose. But if all they have is texting back and forth that you can't even prove to anyone at all, you would likely have egg on your face with all these people. You have no proof either, that I've heard, that she visited his home (although I completely believe you).

The fact that she has two babies, between us TAM members, means nothing about her faithfulness. But it is something that a lot of people will pity and turn around on you.

Exposure is going to make your husband furious, and it will have him working overtime to tell all of the people you expose to that you are (to quote someone I heard recently :rofl bat-sh*t crazy.

You have tons of evidence that your husband is having an emotional affair. I don't have any doubts about it. But it isn't going to look that way to others. The store isn't going to fire him just because he suspiciously promoted her (although that will look bad when combined with a spousal accusation of infidelity).

But as I've said several times, and as other members have chimed in to say, it is time to take stock in whether it's worth saving your marriage. Only you can know whether it's better right now to spend money on a PI, or a lawyer.

Hope you had a chance to read my suggestions for the call tonight. Do you have a plan for that? Have you written down what you want to say?


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

Wait, he invited another person to your home and told you it was inappropriate for you both to be there? WTF. No one is in my home alone, ever especially a stranger.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Count of Monte Cristo (Mar 21, 2012)

5ftnuttin said:


> I understand that everyone is entitled to their opinion, but whether my husband and I reconcile or divorce, to call my marriage a joke is quite hurtful.* I waited almost 30 years to get married, and I married intending on staying married forever.* *All of my friends and family were there and it was an extremely happy day for me.* I truly don't believe my husband married me intending any of this to happen, and I certainly didn't intend for it to happen. No one intends to find themselves in the circumstances of infidelity or possible infidelity, but it doesn't make their marriage a joke, and neither do the other circumstances. My marriage was a lot more than those things, or I wouldn't care if it was over.


5ftnuttin, it takes two people to make a marriage. I intended to grow old with my ex but she had other plans. Please realize that there are other men out there in this great big world who would love to take care of you and show you the respect that you deserve as a wife.

Your husband might have a totally different concept of what marriage is. Also, don't stay married just because you don't want to look bad to your friends and family. It's your life.


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## 5ftnuttin (May 2, 2012)

Shaggy said:


> Wait, he invited another person to your home and told you it was inappropriate for you both to be there? WTF. No one is in my home alone, ever especially a stranger.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


This was when we had been dating 6 months or less. It was his home, not mine. She had been in the house before to take care of his dog when went out of town and I didn't think anything of it at the time. I wanted to play with the baby, but he said we couldn't hang out with her, so we left. I thought it was a little weird, because the lines aren't so clear cut at my work, but at the time I took his word for it. I've never really worked in the private sector, so I don't know sometimes if he is just making it up as he goes along or what.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

5ftnuttin said:


> This was when we had been dating 6 months or less. It was his home, not mine. She had been in the house before to take care of his dog when went out of town and I didn't think anything of it at the time. I wanted to play with the baby, but he said we couldn't hang out with her, so we left. I thought it was a little weird, because the lines aren't so clear cut at my work, but at the time I took his word for it. I've never really worked in the private sector, so I don't know sometimes if he is just making it up as he goes along or what.


Let me understand this. He has known this woman since at least 6 mos to 1 year before you married??? How long has he known her?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## 5ftnuttin (May 2, 2012)

iheartlife said:


> You don't have to have the PI evidence to expose. But if all they have is texting back and forth that you can't even prove to anyone at all, you would likely have egg on your face with all these people. You have no proof either, that I've heard, that she visited his home (although I completely believe you).
> 
> The fact that she has two babies, between us TAM members, means nothing about her faithfulness. But it is something that a lot of people will pity and turn around on you.
> 
> ...


I have no idea what I want to say. I don't think our conversation tonight is going to dictate everything unless his answer is that this is all my fault and he is ready for the divorce. I want to see how receptive he is to talking to me in person at all, and what he wants to do. If he still just wants a divorce and doesn't want to see me, then trying to get him to tell me on the phone what the real reason for the sudden change in his attitude about things is probably the best I can to. At least it will give me some closure. 

I'm trying to read Not Just Friends but work keeps getting in the way. Horrible stuff, work!


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## 5ftnuttin (May 2, 2012)

iheartlife said:


> Let me understand this. He has known this woman since at least 6 mos to 1 year before you married??? How long has he known her?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


He has known her a year or two longer than he has known me. So that would be 3 1/2 to 4 1/2 years longer than we have been married.


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## 5ftnuttin (May 2, 2012)

Count of Monte Cristo said:


> 5ftnuttin, it takes two people to make a marriage. I intended to grow old with my ex but she had other plans. Please realize that there are other men out there in this great big world who would love to take care of you and show you the respect that you deserve as a wife.
> 
> Your husband might have a totally different concept of what marriage is. Also, don't stay married just because you don't want to look bad to your friends and family. It's your life.


Thank you for that, Count. When he first told me he wanted a divorce, I wasn't telling anyone. A few days ago I made the decision to remove my husband from my facebook, show myself as separated there, and begin telling friends and family, starting with my dad, mom, and close co-workers and friends. I decided it isn't something for me to be ashamed of because I didn't do anything wrong, so if after doing all that we reconcile, my husband is the one who should feel embarrassed, not me.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

5ftnuttin said:


> He has known her a year or two longer than he has known me. So that would be 3 1/2 to 4 1/2 years longer than we have been married.


That's what I feared.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

One other thing, just to be clear, is that exposure isn't about revenge. It's a way to pop the fantasy of the affair. If you had proof, I can't imagine her husband allowing her to work with or contact your husband again.

It can also put the people in your lives on notice that GF isn't someone he met after you separated.

But I would bet these two have had something going on, an EA at least, that predates your marriage.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

Is he completely self-financed? Do you give him any $ at all?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## 5ftnuttin (May 2, 2012)

iheartlife said:


> Is he completely self-financed? Do you give him any $ at all?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


yes, the only thing we have together is my dental insurance, and he would have to drive 2 hours to my area to use it.


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## 5ftnuttin (May 2, 2012)

iheartlife said:


> One other thing, just to be clear, is that exposure isn't about revenge. It's a way to pop the fantasy of the affair. If you had proof, I can't imagine her husband allowing her to work with or contact your husband again.
> 
> It can also put the people in your lives on notice that GF isn't someone he met after you separated.
> 
> ...


They were both single for quite a while before she met her husband and then, much later, he met me, and for whatever reason they never got together. 

I can pinpoint when his behavior changed; it was September of last year. That's when I noticed him being more discreet about texting and asked to see his phone. Right after that I broke my ankle and couldn't go to his house for about 3 months; he always had to come see me. I was also working days in the office at work instead of my normal schedule with lots of days off, so we got less time together. I think he started to resent it. It's been downhill from there. His dad was diagnosed with pancreatic cancer a month ago and given about 6 months, so I know that's not helping, but he should be leaning on me right now, not running from me. His dad's cancer isn't what caused him to act like this, so I'm not going to let him use it as a cop out for it.


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## Pit-of-my-stomach (Nov 2, 2010)

5ftnuttin said:


> Florida is a no-fault state and we were only married 11 months, so it's not like proof of an affair gets me anything legally.


I live in Florida, I just went through a divorce a few months ago. If you've only been married for 11 months, dont share a residence, have no children and no joint finances you would be wasting your money getting a lawyer. This is cut and dry, you won't need a lawyer.


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## 5ftnuttin (May 2, 2012)

Pit-of-my-stomach said:


> I live in Florida, I just went through a divorce a few months ago. If you've only been married for 11 months, dont share a residence, have no children and no joint finances you would be wasting your money getting a lawyer. This is cut and dry, you won't need a lawyer.


If that's what happens I'm hoping to make him pay all the divorce fees at a minimum, and I'm wondering if there is any chance of getting any of my dad's money back for the wedding (I'm thinking that's a separate civil case, but not positive). My dad and I paid for almost everything, which was quite a hardship on my dad because my stepmom had just died very unexpectedly and my dad doesn't work.


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## 5ftnuttin (May 2, 2012)

So if anyone is curious, we talked for over an hour. He said he had just hit his breaking point with all of the fighting. He said he still loved me but didn't want to keep fighting with me any more. I told him I didn't understand how he could throw away 3 1/2 years together and 11 months of marriage without even going to the second counseling session. He said he doesn't think he needs counseling, I do. He said he knows he loses it and shouldn't yell and say the things he does to me when he gets upset with me, but he wouldn't do that if I wouldn't "nag and interrogate" him. I told him I nagged and interrogated him because he didn't tell me anything. I told him the issues with the texts and the coworker issues had made it very hard for me to trust him (brought up a few of the ones I had already confronted him on in the past, didn't bring up anything else).

Anyway, I'm going to continue IC even though he doesn't want to do MC. We agreed to talk in 2 weeks and see if he feels any differently about trying to work things out. I will continue trying to work through my feelings until then. As far as his coworker, there isn't a lot I can do right now. I'm still not willing to pay for a PI, so for now I'm going to have to just leave it alone.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

I think that was the wise way to play it for now. You weren't ready to go in full guns blazing, better to get organized first. 

Only you know how long you can take being in limbo, where he doesn't fully recommit to the marriage but doesn't see the point in going to the trouble to divorce.

I know you're disappointed that he won't go to MC. But as I think I said before, MC doesn't work when there are 3 people in the marriage. If he didn't admit to an EA, and kept her on the side as the backup option (or kept you at MC as the backup option), there is no way you could have the type of soul-baring conversations and true attempts at change that would turn your marriage around.

This is classic advice on this forum, but I should know--I went to at least 6 mos. of MC with my husband fully back in his EA--all unbeknownst to me.

I'm glad you aren't the least bit fooled by his blame-shifting. By husband was VERY irritable during his EA, picked fights almost constantly. I really thought I was losing it as a communicator and couldn't penetrate his mind. Of course now I realize why!

The only way to crack through the shell that's hardening around him is to break up the affair that he almost surely is in. EAs (or PAs; we should probably assume it's the latter, they have plenty of opportunity), are the purest of fantasy fluff. They don't want to face the music by breaking up FIRST with one partner before taking up with another one. They are off in a dream world with sparkly fairies who sprinkle pixie dust all over them.

Reality has to break through. But there are lots of problems that you have, that make your situation worse than average
--you don't live in the same town
--neither one of you has family or friends in that town
--you can't pay for a PI
--you don't have access to his apartment, car, computer, or cell phone
--if I understand correctly, he doesn't rely on you financially.

So all you have left in your toolbox are exposure and divorce. These are still the main tools everyone else has, but your ability to expose is muted because of lack of hard evidence. It doesn't take much--just one cellphone bill with calls at 3 a.m. or first thing Sunday morning, days they aren't working together, 100's of texts, etc., is all it would take.

But at some point, you have nothing at all to lose. You will never see that woman and her family ever again, anyhow. If I were you, I'd get my ducks in a row. You can print Fla. divorce papers off the Internet I imagine, and they look plenty official. Gather your contact points for his and her family and if he doesn't come around, the plan I outlined before with exposure from the town hotel followed immediately by presenting divorce papers at the store, with a "it's me or her" speech is how I'd handle it if I were in your shoes.


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## 5ftnuttin (May 2, 2012)

iheartlife said:


> I think that was the wise way to play it for now. You weren't ready to go in full guns blazing, better to get organized first.
> 
> Only you know how long you can take being in limbo, where he doesn't fully recommit to the marriage but doesn't see the point in going to the trouble to divorce.
> 
> ...


I think for now I am just going to wait to see what happens in two weeks. It sucks, but if I push him for more he will freak. He did say he is going to spend a week with his dad during the two weeks, which I think might help things. I think it will really depend on how things go in two weeks how to proceed. I don't think I'm going to get anywhere with getting him to admit to anything with his coworker until I can get into his house or car. I am going to have to actually have indisputable evidence in order for him to admit it.


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