# How do I keep going to save this marriage?



## Saffy (Mar 19, 2013)

I'll try to keep this short and to the point:

Together 10 years, married 5. No kids. Things haven't felt right for a while, especially when she started having breakdowns at work, even though any time I wanted to talk she'd tell me everything is fine. She was just tired/stressed/etc. I finally got it out of her, after she went to a counselling session, that she still loves me but doesn't have any feelings for me, and that it just feels like we're friends.

I've been working away from shortly after we met until now. Our agreement was always once we reached a financial goal, or she'd had enough of being apart, I'd quit and work at home. Instead of telling me she was done, she kept telling me everything was fine to be the "good wife".

We're in marriage counselling now, but I don't know if it's helping. A month after the first session, I felt like we were beginning to connect a little and enjoy each other but just before the second session she told me she was just going through the motions to make me feel better and she still didn't feel anything.

I quit my advancing management career to be at home, even though there is basically no work for me here. I've lost all of my friends because they all work in the same field, and it's hard to keep connections with people who don't live the same lifestyle.

When something is broken, I can't stop until it's fixed. When I want something, I work my ass off until it's mine. I've done everything the MC and she suggested, x2, but when she told me after a month that she still felt nothing, something just died inside of me. Some days I can barely get out of bed. Some days I get up, but I can't concentrate enough to do the dishes or make a grocery list. Some days I can function, but the emptiness and frustration and desperation are always in my mind.

She's been under a LOT of stress lately (mother went through multiple surgeries to save her life, we have 2 of her teenage godchildren we're "raising" because their parents are trash, her career is advancing quickly just like mine was) so she's just closed off and cold. We don't say "I love you" anymore, her hugs are cold but, even though I hate myself for it, I still want them.

I feel somewhere inside her she still loves me, but she's just overburdened and numb and can't feel anything for anyone (which she's admitted). How the hell am I suppose to keep showing her that I love her and keep going the extra mile for our marriage while waiting for her to get through this rough spot? I just feel tired, empty... her love, the times we shared, my career, and my friends are all gone, and my hobbies don't feel enjoyable anymore.


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## Toffer (Jan 31, 2012)

Distance apart is a real relationship killer. It can lead folks to form inappropriate friendships with others at times.

I'm not sure if this is the case here (and for some reason I don't get that vibe based on what you've posted so far) but have you done any investigation to rule out someone else? 

Has she done/is doing any of the following:

Working out more
Keeps her phone by her side constantly
PW on phone
New clothes, hairstyle or more make-up
Constant texting
Late hours

get copies of your cell phone bill (providers will give you online access) and look for a lot of texts/calls to 1 or 2 numbers you don't know.

If you find any evidence like this, don't confront yet or ask her if she's cheating. Get a keylogger on the PC and a VAR in her car.

Hang on because this could be a rough ride


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## nevergveup (Feb 18, 2013)

If you have lots of patience and enegry and she is 100% 
willing to fix the marriage you might be able to.

She already has told you she has no feelings, like a spouse should.
Sorry, you have no children with her so you would probably
both would be better of divorcing.You would have a
easy divorce as there's no kids involved.

Be thankful this is happened now and not 10 yrs or longer.
Marriage usually gets to be more work and stressful
as the years go by,not in the early years.


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## Saffy (Mar 19, 2013)

I originally thought someone else at the beginning, as some signs were there. The constant texting was there, but I discreetly checked and it was all friends and family (who are all extremely needy, which doesn't help things). Honestly, I think an affair might've been easier to handle because at least there would be some solid concrete reason.

Her physical appearance has actually degraded, and while I'm working on getting back into shape (since working away for so long meant lots of late hours, greasy food, stress, alcohol, and no exercise) she will barely leave the house, except to goto work and come right back. Pretty classic signs of depression and avoidance....

I've thought a lot about divorce lately... the MC said we counsel for 6 months, and if there's still nothing we separate for 6 months to see if we even miss each other. I don't know if I can last another 4-5 months. She said she wants to fix the marriage b/c she feels guilty for drifting away while I was totally devoted to her and b/c she doesn't want to feel like a failure (lots of failed relationships and long family history of broken homes and abuse in her family)... not exactly comforting reasons.

This feels childish, but the big reason why I haven't left yet (other than loving her) is the fact that I know she'd feel fufilled without me, spending all her time with her friends and family and banging everything she met. I'd go back to my lucrative job and have everything I ever wanted, but I'd have to go back to wading through the ranks of brainless, messed up people out there to try and find someone I actually feel a connection with... if I could even find another one.


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## Toffer (Jan 31, 2012)

Just be sure that the names in her phone match up!

Often times cheaters will put an affair partners phone # under someone else's name!

Not to be cold or cruel but she's already told you she's done and just going through the motions. Why would you want to waste more money and time on a counselor? Pushing out what seems to be inevitable seems foolish to me. 

I would file as soon as possible. In the meantime if the 2 of you work something out, you can always call of the D


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## pb76no (Nov 1, 2012)

How often are your MC sessions? When was the last time you 2 went off on a vacation somewhere?


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## Saffy (Mar 19, 2013)

They're once a month... which I don't know if that's a normal thing or not enough. She wants (and I think she needs) IC as well, which this was originally supposed to be but the counsellor decided MC was more important. I think he's starting to realize after the last session that she needs both.

At the MC's advice we went away for a weekend together, and tried to do some fun things together. She said she enjoyed the one day with me. Other than small outings it's been 2 years since we had a real vacation.

We have a "vacation" booked this weekend, 3 days in NYC but it's with my sister and her fiancee... and I doubt 3 days is going to make much difference. A REAL vacation, a week or two, has been mentioned by the MC and others, but she won't entertain the idea at all b/c of work (she used up her sick/personal days with her mom and her breakdowns) and her godchildren. I've heard her say we have to wait until the kids are gone for the summer (July) and then we can spend some real time together. I guess that means I'm supposed to live in hell until then, and even so how much time can you really spend together when you both work all day.

The MC mentioned she needs to learn to prioritize because she's becoming overwhelmed with obligations, but I think the fact is she has. Everybody else, her job, then me and her marriage.


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## EnjoliWoman (Jul 2, 2012)

Something else that is missing from her list of priorities is HER.

Some people don't know how to say NO and make themselves a priority. Because before she can give you anything (hope, affection, time, attention) she has to have something left to give.

I don't know if she's using work as an avoidance technique or really just has that much work to do. But if it's the latter, she needs to learn the 80/20 rule and feel confident in her work product to go to her boss and say the work is more than a reasonable person can do in 40 hours.

You say she's letting herself go - I think she needs some time do take long walks, take relaxing baths, have a leisurely lunch with a friend... between her Mom, her Godchildren, her job - she has nothing left. If she took a little of her life back, and put herself in the list of priorities she might feel better over all.

I would suggest you work with her (and the MC/IC) to make those down-time moments that recharge our batteries - AND our relationships. Maybe a few hours each weekend - a picnic, a couples massage, a slow 5-course fine dining experience. Or something that revs the heart and brings back playfulness like lazer tag, go-karting, roller skating...

Just some ideas.

ETA - a vacation is NOT with others. she'll spend all of her time talking with the other woman and crash in the hotel room. How about a hotel in town and leave the cell phones at home and order room service and lounge around all day. Try to just talk, cuddle, connect. Maybe a B&B where there is no TV.


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## Saffy (Mar 19, 2013)

Enjoliwoman: thanks for the reply. I didn't give the full story in the initial post as I didn't want it to be so long that noone would read it.

I do realize she is basically burned out. I've done my absolute best to take every possible thing I can handle off her plate (which is why I haven't looked for a new job yet, to be here to support her). She continually resists though, which is very frustrating. For eg she was going to take 2 hours off work to take one of the kids to an appointment, when I'm sitting at home with a very open schedule, on a day when she was exceptionally busy. I stepped in and took care of it.... Another eg is she's taking time off work to basically inspect the luggage to make sure I didn't forget anything before we leave... we're going for 3 days - I doubt there is anything we could possibly forget that we couldn't live without.

Her work is stressful, but the workload is pretty steady and rarely required bringing work home or extra time outside of the workday. I know she feels she isn't giving her best effort though because she's burned out and is just going through the motions there too.

We've tried dates together, a weekend alone together, we went to a couples steam at a spa the other night (all MC recommendations), but she never seems to just relax and enjoy herself. I try my best to be upbeat and flirty, to help her relax and try to cut some of the tension between us. 

On our weekend together, she was texting her friends and the kids almost nonstop, as she does every day. If we goto a movie, she's texting right up until the movie starts, and right after it ends. All the way there, all the way home. If I try to have a quiet night for us at home watching TV, we're on the couch together and she's texting or facebooking again. She refuses to leave her cellphone because the kids need her attention and advice constantly, or so she claims. Apparently she must think you need to reply to every single text message any random acquaintance sends you too.

I've temporarily given up trying to set up time together, because I feel worthless when I'm with her. I can't stand putting in hours of planning to do something special for her just so she can sit there and ignore me the entire time and text back and forth with her friends. The only good thing about our trip this weekend is she won't have her cellphone with her.

I'm determined to just play through until after the trip so it doesn't turn into a battle, and our next MC session is Apr 1. I'm going to remind her, after we get back, that she wanted IC too and to book a session. It's just really frustrating when all I want is for her to relax and open up, and to let me help her.... Some days I feel like maybe she won't open up because she really doesn't love me anymore and I'm just wasting my time.

To fill in the picture a little more, she was abused for half her life (emotionally, physically, sexually, verbally, everything), and I'm beginning to suspect her overbearing with the kids is less to do with them being messed up from their parents, and more to do with her fear of being a bad mother because her whole extended family is a matriarchy of bad mothers.


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## thelovetrip (Mar 19, 2013)

*Together 10 years, married 5*

Is there another side to this story? People do not grow apart overnight. Usually there is a breakdown of affection and communication before it get's to the point where you're at today. You seem to be doing everything in your power to make this work but are you really? Has it crossed your mind to just stop the madness, to just stop trying to please her the way you think works, and just ask her what she truly wants? I diagree with trying to track her every movement and tweet, text, call etc. Doing that only heightens your suspicion warranted or not. Bottom line is, what will you do if she is cheating on you? Become a vegetable? Give up? Stay in bed for the rest of your life? All I hear is negativity from a man who claims *"When I want something, I work my ass off until it's mine"* Last I heard she is still your wife! Go to her man...ask her what if anything you can do to make your love trip work, or at the minimum begin to heal. Be prepared, she may tell you to go pound sand, but at least you can hold your head high and know you did whatever you could to save your love trip!:smthumbup:


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## EnjoliWoman (Jul 2, 2012)

Sounds like she's a perfectionist and control freak. (Not professional diagnosis of course! LOL)

Check the luggage to make sure you did it right? Really? You are a grown man perfectly capable of packing a weekend bag. Besides, even if you did forget something, buy it there. Not like toothpaste or undies can't be purchased in NYC.

I know a woman like this - has to do it all herself to make sure it's done right. She DID learn to let it go, though - I advised her that one of the attributes of a good manager is being able to delegate and that seemed to ring true with her (work situation) so I hope she is able to learn from that.

Definitely sounds like NMMNG (i.e. don't let her walk over you - maintain respect) can help as well as the IC and MC. 

Hang in there. But you will have to eventually take a hard line and let her know you aren't second fiddle and that MUST change. Not every moment of every day but it should.


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## Saffy (Mar 19, 2013)

So an update, before our MC session tonight.

Our trip to NYC was alright but there was still a huge divide between us. I was trying to be a little cold and distant, which I'm usually not, and instead of drawing her closer it pushed her away further as she thought I was doing it to hurt her. We talked about it, and I suggested we try our best just to relax and enjoy the trip and each other's company. I thought we did, at times....

It was a long trip back, with airline issues and a late flight, so we didn't get home until 5am. I drove so I was exhausted and slept for a good chunk of the day. I was feeling kinda crappy when I woke up, so I went to the kitchen where she was running around going "I have to clean this, and this, and this, and do this". I just kinda stood there, in the way, hoping she would clue in (I'm a physical touch person) that I just wanted to be acknowledged but she walked past me several times and didn't so much as brush against me.

I finally sighed and left, and she called after me saying "Well if you have something to say to me, say it". I told her I just wanted some sign of love, anything, but it felt like all our interactions were just about house chores and daily errands. She said she was hurt and angry, but agreed that I did all of the reaching out (during the trip and otherwise) and that she couldn't stand living like this anymore, with us hurting each other and me walking around visibly hurt and just wanting love. She said she would leave for 3 days, but I said it's your house I'll leave. We cried apart for a bit, then I went to see if she was okay and when she saw me she just snapped at me with a "WHAT!?" so I packed. Before I left, I wanted to talk but she refused to even see me and left the house so I'd "have the space I needed to pack my things".

I left her a note saying I love her and I always have and will, and every day of the 7 GOOD years were the best of my life, and how I just want some love and every time she avoids me or denies me is like dying over and over again, and how I hoped we could find some resolution to this whole thing and get back to just loving each other.

I made it about a day and a half before I essentially begged to come back home. She said I could stay in the house because she was spending the weekend with her mom, and we'd go to the MC session Monday together, but that she thinks we need separation. I told her statistically separation rarely ever works and we'll just move on with our lives and never grow back together. Especially, since a big catalyst for our problems is the fact I worked away from home for long periods for the last 10 years.

I picked up the 5 Love Languages yesterday and finished it this morning. I see a lot of case studies similar to our problems, but I've been feeding her love whenever I can in her language and I just get absolutely nothing back. I'm about as empty as I can be without being dead.

I know she's going to push for a separation tonight in counselling, and I don't necessarily trust our MC completely - I think he's in way over his head right now. I don't think I can do separation - it's either we're together and working on this, or we're going our separate ways... I don't want to leave at all but I don't think I can keep on living like this, empty and lonely as hell.


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## Saffy (Mar 19, 2013)

Guess it wasn't enough. She doesn't want to try anymore. It's over..........


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## Thound (Jan 20, 2013)

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Saffy said:


> So an update, before our MC session tonight.
> 
> Our trip to NYC was alright but there was still a huge divide between us. I was trying to be a little cold and distant, which I'm usually not, and instead of drawing her closer it pushed her away further as she thought I was doing it to hurt her. We talked about it, and I suggested we try our best just to relax and enjoy the trip and each other's company. I thought we did, at times....
> 
> ...


I 

I read the 5 love languages. It's a good book. After I read it I gave to my wife to read. She threw it away without even opening it. It only works if both people read it and apply it.


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## Saffy (Mar 19, 2013)

She read it, and told me she didn't think it was that simple and that people can't really change and just fall back into their old habits after a little while.

But she says she doesn't love me anymore so......


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## betrayed2013 (Feb 5, 2013)

i went thru the same stuff dude. 9.5 years together were great, then nov 2011, she complains about being down and out. A month later, she sz she is questioning the marriage and feelings towards me. We go thru the next year of me trying to fix the marriage and her on antidepressants. Then in the midst of that she has an affair. So that made things 100X worse. Then after i forgive her we take a vacation, come back and things seemed much better. Of course after a little snooping I find out she has an ****** madision profile online. I was and still am devastated. We have been sep. over a month, and just sold the house and r headed for divorce. I know exactly how you feel with being empty inside and my wife too was traumatized as a child. Sexual, emotional, physical, neglect. etc. I blame that as the reason for her sabatoging the once great marriage. She never dealt with her child trauma properly and it all came back to bite her in the u know what....i got it all-----i dont deserve you, i dont deserve the house, etc. When she looks back a couple years from now shes going to realize as will ur wife that she made a huge mistake. and by then its gonna be too late. Im sorry for wat ur dealing with. Its pure agony. nervous feeling in ur gut all day, cant sleep well, never hungry. Everything u think about relates to ur wife and what the hell just happened. I guarentee you feel all of those.


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