# Am I Being Unreasonable? Is My Wife A Butthead?



## tcnh45 (Nov 17, 2013)

My wife and I have been married for 15 years. Last couple of years have been rough. 

I feel she does not do anything for me in our marriage..as lovers as well as companions.. 

I wash all my own clothes-she has never washed or ironed my clothes since we have been married, I clean much of the house, have always cleaned the bathrooms-she has never cleaned the bathrooms ever and I mean ever, I help her around her horse barn-cutting the fields, weed wacking, helping her get hay and load it etc..She has never thanked me for those task until i started calling her out on it..let her spend approx $250,000 on her horses since we have been married..basically let her do what she wants. 

Was down her mom's house several months back and cut the grass and came in and asked her if she would iron my shirt..she just went off but did do it. If my clothes are in the drier at home she calls me to take them out..won't even remove them..


Get sex from her 1 per month if lucky twice if I really push it-have to push it and she is never in the mood..and she does not get into it when we do have it. and until the last several years it was once every 4-6 weeks but some of that was me..I had gained weight and was self conscious.. I have since lost weight and got fit. Tried to spice things up..she won't take showers with me, won't wear any sexy panties or bra_ I don't need to have her dress like a **** just some satin type stuff..she wears granny panties. ..

We was out of town in a nice suite with a huge shower and I tried to start something asked her to take a shower with me and all she did was pull out a book and start reading it. No oral sex ever from her she thinks it is demeaning ..on and on..she thinks french kissing is groce but does french kiss if I push it.

Never has time for sex but reads every night for an hour or more and watches NCIS every night..never misses

Her appearance: Does not wear makeup but I accepted that when we got married. She is now 53 and her hair is getting very gray and TBH I want her to look attractive..she won't dye it..it really detracts form her appearance.

When I told her it bothered me she said in these exact words "I don't care"..

She had a very unflattering haircut until recently and she did get it styled after I really pushed her on it...one of the few things she did for me.

She does not even shave her legs never ever except for a funeral when she wears a dress..NEVER wears shorts even though she has a nice body.. Went on 2 cruises and she wears long jeans on the beach. She has never worn shorts in the 15 years we have been married. 100 degree day..wears long jeans.

I don't ask for much in our marriage..I just want some basic feminity from my wife and romantic love via good sex.. I have to be honest I'm very envious of other guys..their wives take care of their appearance and try to make themselves attractive and stylish for their husbands. Guys I work out with in the gym talk about how their wives initiate sex and want it..not in details but generalities and I know these guys well enough they are not bs'ing. I asked her to talk to her doctor about hr low libio and she went off on me. 

My wife thinks I am trying to change her and say's I have changed since we have been married..Maybe I have..she thinks I have become shallow over her appearance..


I'm not asking for her to get rid of her hobby, drop friends, change career etc..I just want what 99% of guys are getting from their wives without even asking (dying hair etc)..she thinks what I'm asking is the worst thing in the world.

Am I asking too much? We have not been on speaking terms the last 4-5 months and no sex since then..and tbh I don't want sex from her at this point..I have lost interest in doing it with her.

I just feel like I'm giving but get nothing in return.


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## KathyBatesel (Apr 26, 2012)

I'd say you need to look at the core issue: why she doesn't want to please you. 

I'm in agreement with her that you are trying to change her. If her appearance has never been her priority and you now want it to be, then pushing her to change those things is NOT going to get her to be what you want, because it's just criticism of her and she knows it. 

Instead of pushing her to change, focus on what's good right now. Stop measuring your internal "success" by the external standards of the guys at the gym, who have great reason to make themselves look successful. I assure you, they're NOT telling the whole truth!

You say she has a good body. Instead of wishing that she'd wear shorts, remind yourself that you're the only person who gets a private screening of what she has to offer. Treasure it. Find out how to please her more and criticize her less. Figure out what means a great deal to her and "reward" those few steps she takes to please you with the kinds of things that mean a lot to her. She finally changed her hairstyle? Wonderful - let's go show it off to her mom if spending time with her mom means a lot to her, even if it means planning a weekend vacation. That "over the top" response that's unexpected but deeply gratifying for her will do more to get you what you want than all the constructive criticism in the world. If she's inclined to appreciate what others DO for her, then instead of a visit to Mom's, take time to vacuum the house "so it looks as nice as you do, honey."


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## totallywarped (Jan 26, 2013)

Time to leave in my opinion. You are nothing but a room mate to her. She doesn't care if you are attracted to her or happy with your life together. I'll just never understand why men put up with this... (with the exception of having small children, which based on her age you obviously don't have).


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## Catherine602 (Oct 14, 2010)

What are you getting out of the relationship. Don't say nothing, you would be there if you were not getting something. It could be negative. 

It may help to start here - Why do you think you do not deserve to be loved?


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## tcnh45 (Nov 17, 2013)

Katheybatesel

It's not just her appearance but everything combined..lack of real sexual attraction from her..always felt she never did desire me sexually..Sex life has always been dysfunctional for the most part. 

Never doing anything out of love for me.. her doing something kind in return..the example of cutting her moms grass for 45 minutes then coming in and asked if she could do something as simple as iron my shirt she just went off and yelled she was busy. She has ironed maybe 5-6 shirts for me since marriage and each time I asked felt like I was on egg shells. 

Yes, I know guys brag about sex with their wives..but they were not doing it in this case.

I do things for my wife all the time but I feel she is very selfish-one sided relationship.

What is she doing for me??


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## tcnh45 (Nov 17, 2013)

Catherine602 said:


> What are you getting out of the relationship. Don't say nothing, you would be there if you were not getting something. It could be negative.
> 
> It may help to start here - Why do you think you do not deserve to be loved?



My wife is very honest, great character and we have some interest together like to visit museums, go for walks on occasion etc but our relationship as real lovers??? Not much..

Again I just don't know why she won't do such simple things for me as caring about her appearance. She knows it bothers me.

Other guys don't have to worry about their wives not wanting to get their hair done..such simple basic things my wife does not do for me that is just a given in other marriages..almost like putting your shoes on in the morning.


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## tcnh45 (Nov 17, 2013)

Need serious advice to save my marriage..am I asking too much from my wife?


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

I don't think you have a marriage in the true meaning of the word, hence I don't know that it could be " saved."
Married people love , care and respect each other, yes, that too was part of the marriage vows.
They don't consistently treat their partner like crap, and there's absolutely no reason for you to accept it.
Under no condition should you continue accepting her behaviour.

Your wife doesn't even wash your clothes, you help around with the household chores and maintain the yard. You even took an interest in her hobbies , the horses.
You've got to go on your knees and beg her for sex, which she 
" gives " you once every month.

I say that she sounds like a very selfish wife to me, who has absolutely no respect for her husband and does not know how to appreciate a good man.

If your kids are old enough or if you don't have any , don't waste your life on this woman. If after all of these years she doesn't get it , she'll never get it , because she isn't interested in " getting it."
People like that hardly ever change, because they see no need to. They are too self absorbed to accept that something might be wrong with their actions or that their actions are hurting their partner.

Tell her you want a divorce and if she does not budge then divorce her, and look for someone who at minimum respects you or who at maximum,will adore the very ground you walk on.

Life is too short to accept constant disrespect from your wife.
By staying , you are only enabling her to treat you worse.


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## Prodigal (Feb 5, 2011)

tcnh45 said:


> ... we have some interest together like to visit museums, go for walks on occasion etc ...


I have friends I can go with to museums, shopping, dining out, going for walks. This doesn't sound like much of a reason to stay with your wife. Plenty of other people can share your interests.



tcnh45 said:


> Again I just don't know why she won't do such simple things for me as caring about her appearance. She knows it bothers me.


The thing is, she doesn't care that it bothers you. And don't keep trying to figure out why SHE does what she does. Figure out why you are willing to settle for this.


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

Prodigal said:


> The thing is, she doesn't care that it bothers you. And don't keep trying to figure out why SHE does what she does. Figure out why you are willing to settle for this.


Yes to this,^^^exactly.


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## totallywarped (Jan 26, 2013)

tcnh45 said:


> Need serious advice to save my marriage..am I asking too much from my wife?


Why do u have this desperate need to save this "marriage?" It's not a marriage you are room mates. That might sound harsh but I believe everyone has a right to feel loved, desired and cared for! You aren't not asking to much. A real marriage is a give and take. I enjoy taking care of my husband. Do I wait on him a hand and foot.. no. I'm his wife not his slave, but I would never bite his head off if he asked me to iron something. I might say I'm busy right now but as soon as I'm done I will. Ask her to go to a marriage counselor, if she refuses then she doesn't care about you or saving this marriage.


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## tcnh45 (Nov 17, 2013)

My wife feels I have been "verbally abusive" to her lately regarding her hair, amount of sex etc. Yes, I have been getting upset about it and have been arguing about it with her quite a bit...just all the factors I mentioned that we argue more-my frustration level is off the charts. Has been building up for the last few years..my wife and I hardly argued for years. 

She feels I should accept her as she is-appearance/sex...that is the person I married. She always say's I'm trying to change her

Regarding the sex she said that's how she is (she is not a sexual person-shy sexually)and in a nutshell I should not try to change her sexuality (to be more more open/aggressive)..what get's me upset is she won't even try to be more open, won't seek self help books, put forth an effort etc..I asked her to talk to her doc about her libidio but she won't. 

Lately she tells me I don't "have her back" would not stick with her if she got ill etc.. which is her resentment with me. I loved my wife when we got married and did for years but it's like the chicken and egg what came first? I told her my love for her has gone away due to how I am treated in our marriage...just feel she does not give anything back. I keep on asking her "what is in it for me??

BTW, never cheated on my wife, never hit her etc.. I don't drink, don't do drugs, don't go to bars, few speeding tickets that's it..sort of a homebody. I am not perfect by any means..


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## Theseus (Feb 22, 2013)

KathyBatesel said:


> I'd say you need to look at the core issue: why she doesn't want to please you.
> 
> I'm in agreement with her that you are trying to change her. If her appearance has never been her priority and you now want it to be, then pushing her to change those things is NOT going to get her to be what you want,



Agree completely. 



> Instead of pushing her to change, focus on what's good right now. Stop measuring your internal "success" by the external standards of the guys at the gym,


I'm pretty confident that the OP would want more sex and femininity from his wife even without those guys at the gym.



> You say she has a good body. Instead of wishing that she'd wear shorts, remind yourself that you're the only person who gets a private screening of what she has to offer.


He only gets that "private screening" once a month! It's possible her physician has seen her naked more often than her husband has.


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## Theseus (Feb 22, 2013)

tcnh45 said:


> She feels I should accept her as she is-appearance/sex...that is the person I married. She always say's I'm trying to change her


The best response is to tell her that you enjoy sex and you enjoy women who take care of themselves, and that is the person she married. She is also trying to "change you" by trying to make you happy with something that you are not happy with. 



> Regarding the sex she said that's how she is (she is not a sexual person-shy sexually)and in a nutshell I should not try to change her sexuality


Same response. Tell her that in a nutshell, you should also not have to change your sexuality. 

At this stage, I wouldn't yet be initiating divorce but I would insist on marriage counseling. If she refuses to go, then it's time to pull out the "nuclear option". Ask her for an open marriage so you both can be happy. If she refuses both, then it's time to go. At that point you have run this problem into the ground.


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## tcnh45 (Nov 17, 2013)

I told her I want to see a marriage counselor-it was my idea..I gave her the phone book last night to the MC section and even told her she can pick out who she wanted.. of course she came back and said I was throwing her the responsibility.. 

We'll see if she actually goes when it comes down to it. I will go by myself just to get it off my chest.

I would never do the open marriage..just not my style.


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## totallywarped (Jan 26, 2013)

You have allowed this behavior for a long time. She feels attacked because you've started putting your foot down (probably too late for any real change). She's going to test you and may even make things worse "well if he hates my hair let's see if he likes it when I don't wash it" or "well if he's not happy with once a month then there's no point in doing that either".


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## totallywarped (Jan 26, 2013)

She needs a reality check, ask her how fair it is that you do xyz and she's doesn't even do your laundry. Ask her how fair is it that you aren't getting your sexual needs met and she's the only one who can give you that. Be honest with her, she needs to know you feel like she doesn't love you or desire you. If you feel lonely or lack basic affection tell her!! Remind her of how things used to be, tell her you aren't changing her you just want the spark that you all used to share back.


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## tcnh45 (Nov 17, 2013)

totallywarped said:


> You have allowed this behavior for a long time. She feels attacked because you've started putting your foot down (probably too late for any real change). She's going to test you and may even make things worse "well if he hates my hair let's see if he likes it when I don't wash it" or "well if he's not happy with once a month then there's no point in doing that either".


She had her hair styled very well-it looked nice and 4 days ago she cut it very short..looked manly, was not very flattering-does not fit her face. The hair dresser even told her it was too short-that tells you something. Of course I mentioned it was too short and unflattering she got real abusive but she has told me many times my hair was cut too short or did not look good and I never wet off on her because it was cut too short..I took her advice I have since changed hair cutters and keep my hair longer.

I do sometimes not have tact when discussing things with my wife..could word it differently.

As fro sex I have no interest in having it with her at this point..I hate having sex with her and know she is not into it..which has happened many times in the past..I want to be desired. major turn off when your partner is not into it..


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## Laurel (Oct 14, 2013)

tcnh45 said:


> *I feel she does not do anything for me in our marriage..as lovers as well as companions.. *
> 
> *She has never thanked me *for those task
> 
> ...


No, you are not being unreasonable. Frankly, she sounds very unpleasant. It sounds like she is just keeping you around to pay the bills. You are not on her priority list at all and she clearly has no respect for you. 

Going 4-5 months without speaking to your spouse is not a marriage. And more than once you describe her as being abusive and "going off on you." It sounds like you have tried to address your concerns with her and she reacts by attacking you. What exactly is it that you are getting out of this relationship? Do you have kids? Are you worried a divorce will cost you too much money? 

Unless you take a major stand, things will only get worse and and all of the sudden you will wake up one day and you will realize you wasted another 10 years in this misery. 

Make the counseling appointment yourself. Do not rely on her to pick a counselor - she clearly doesn't care about it and is hoping you just drop it. Tell her you are going with or without her. And follow through with it.


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## Theseus (Feb 22, 2013)

tcnh45 said:


> I would never do the open marriage..just not my style.


You don't have to. But you bring up the option when all else has failed because it might make her realize how serious these problems really are.


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## tcnh45 (Nov 17, 2013)

Laurel said:


> No, you are not being unreasonable. Frankly, she sounds very unpleasant. It sounds like she is just keeping you around to pay the bills.


We both work and the $250k she spent on horses was her own money. She does not need me to pay the bills. She actually makes more than me at this point..my business had a downturn.





> Going 4-5 months without speaking to your spouse is not a marriage.


We talk every day..about certain stuff..not marriage related stuff. Some days we talk more than others. At this point I'm just tired of talking about our problems with her because it goes into fighting..





> And more than once you describe her as being abusive and "going off on you." It sounds like you have tried to address your concerns with her and she reacts by attacking you. What exactly is it that you are getting out of this relationship?


My wife has always had a mean temper- off and on again..some days she is ok..somedays I literally feel like walking on eggshells...I knew this going in the marriage..I was in love. 



> Do you have kids? Are you worried a divorce will cost you too much money?


Neither of us wanted kids..was concerned about money at first but getting to the point now I don't care. Somedays I love her and somedays I just want it to be over..hard to explain.




> Unless you take a major stand, things will only get worse and and all of the sudden you will wake up one day and you will realize you wasted another 10 years in this misery.


I wake up with night sweats about this. One of my concerns is bringing it up to family...feel embarrassed about it. Feel like a failure. 



> Make the counseling appointment yourself. Do not rely on her to pick a counselor - she clearly doesn't care about it and is hoping you just drop it. Tell her you are going with or without her. And follow through with it.


I do plan on making the mc appt. with or w.o her.


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## Noble1 (Oct 25, 2013)

Sorry to hear about your situation.

Sounds like it has gone downhill the past while and you are not going to stand for it anymore....which is entirely your right.

Unfortunately, your wife also has the right to not change either.

You can only change yourself and what you are willing to put up with by staying in your 'marriage'.

To be honest, it does sound like you have put yourself 2nd after your wife for many years and sad to say, but you have almost trained her to treat you that way.

Now is the time to think about what you want out of marriage and do what you can to get there. 

At this point, you wife can decide to work with you on it ....or not.


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## frusdil (Sep 5, 2013)

You are not being unreasonable to want sex and true intimacy with your wife, and to want it more than once a month. It is unreasonable - and very arrogant if you think about it - for one spouse to take sex off the table, and expect the other spouse to stay faithful.

There's always 2 sides to every story though, but since you're the only one writing here, we can only advise on what you tell us.

Marriage is all about compromise. If she has always been the way she is now re her appearance, and you married her knowing that - then you're unreasonable to ask her to change it now.

However, the compromise needs to come from both sides. Perhaps she could bend a little and put on some mascara and lipstick? Or perfume?

My favourite perfume is not my hubby's favourite, so I buy and wear the one my hubby likes, just because he likes it  

Marriage counselling is a great idea, even if you go alone it will still be beneficial for you. It will give you some validation and clarity and help you decide what the next step should be.

At the end of the day, if your wife refuses to budge in the slightest, you'll have to make a hard decision. But always be open with her that you're going to counselling. Give her a chance to at least try to make things right, she's your wife, she deserves that at the very least. If she won't though, there's not much you can do.


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## 6301 (May 11, 2013)

What you have here friend is a very selfish, self centered wife who is extremely lazy to boot. 

Now, let me ask you this. How did this get so out of control? You let it get this way. You've been married for 15 years and the woman does nothing according to you. No cleaning, cooking, and I'm going on the assumption that she's a SAHW so whose fault is it? 

You created this monster by letting her sit around on her ass gathering dust and never once opened your mouth with enough force to let her know about it and now when you say something she's calling you out for trying to change her.

If it was me, first of all it wouldn't have gone this far but I would let her know that if she wants to live like a pig and sit on her ass all day and do nothing, then she either starts acting like a wife and change her ways or she is more than welcome to pack up and move on as fast as her hairy legs can move. also if she looks un kept, tell her to do something to make herself look better because your tired of it and you want a wife you can be a little more proud of and put the ball in her corner. 

Why the hell did you have to wait 15 years for you to finally open your mouth. Your the only one that can move her butt in gear. Maybe if you stop playing the nice guy for once and let her know in a voice that she knows your serious that your not happy she might do something. If not divorce her and move on


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## 6301 (May 11, 2013)

KathyBatesel said:


> You say she has a good body. Instead of wishing that she'd wear shorts, remind yourself that you're the only person who gets a private screening of what she has to offer. Treasure it. Find out how to please her more and criticize her less. Figure QUOTE]
> 
> Maybe she does have a good body but fat lot of good it does when he barely gets sex and when he does she's not in to it. So what good is it that he's the only one that sees it which is far and few.
> 
> The last thing she needs is a compliment. That's the problem. He let her walk over him and now he's getting tired of it. maybe she should compliment him once in a while and get off her butt and iron his shirt. She's spoiled and lazy.


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## wise (Sep 1, 2013)

Wake up! You are not unreasonable and your wife is not a 'butthead.' She's a self centered, lazy, spoiled woman that has NO business being in a marriage. 

I would say just cut your losses and leave already [but that's just me], but I know you somewhat love her. She obviously does not care about you at all and her cutting her hair how she wants/being mean to you about yours and you change it just shows who wears the pants in the relationship. You two have switched roles and that affects sex whether you believe it or not. How did it get to this and why would you allow it? 

There are tons of women who would kill for a man like you. 'You never know what you have until it's gone' and honestly, that is about the only thing that would make this woman realize what she's got. 

If you are not going to leave, then stop slaving. Stop cutting her mom's grass, stop taking on all the house chores.. just stop doing it all already. She will not change. Everything is a big joke to her, including you.


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## dontbeused (Nov 15, 2013)

I can't listen to you any more. i read the posts and I can't take it any longer. You are thick man. Wake the he** up already.
If she is not interested in pleasing you, I think you have all the information you need right there.


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

tcnh45 said:


> My wife has always had a mean temper- off and on again..some days she is ok..somedays I literally feel like walking on eggshells...I knew this going in the marriage..I was in love.


Do you think she might be suffering from a
[ cluster B type ] personality disorder?


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## Starstarfish (Apr 19, 2012)

> She needs a reality check, ask her how fair it is that you do xyz and she's doesn't even do your laundry.


The OP clearly says that they both work and at this point, the wife is the main wage earner, so, I think before we need to start all these posts about how she's lazy and does nothing, and how grievous it is she doesn't do the laundry, I'm curious - does her earning more mean she works more hours? 

I mean what's with all the "doesn't even wash your clothes" comments - is it just a given it's always a wife's duty to do the laundry, and if so - why? 



> Does not wear makeup but I accepted that when we got married.


You knew your wife wasn't the make-up wearing, high-appearance kind when you married her, OP. You now want her to be the kind who dyes her hair (which, she's 53, I think her being grey is reasonable at that age, really) and generally, care more about her "feminine" appearance than I think is innate in her personality. Which, yes, means you are trying to change her from who she clearly showed you she was from the beginning. 

(PS, how old are you? Do you use Just for Men, or is grey hair only unattractive on women? At what age is okay for a woman to "go grey"?)

Also, I think you assume most women go and get their hair done as an act for their husbands, I'm guessing most don't - they get it done -for themselves- and the fact their husband enjoys it is a side benefit. You have to have an internal drive to want to do certain things for yourself in order to not feel like they are forced on you. She doesn't, nor ever has that internal drive.


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## Jamison (Feb 10, 2011)

So you do everything and she does nothing? Not sure what you get out of the marriage but somewhere theres a pay off for you or you wouldn't be staying. If she does nothing for you, and her not so good qualities outweigh the good, then you need to end it. If she was once the opposite of what you say she is now, then something changed in her. My guess is she probably gave you hints all along what was missing that you didn't pick up on or refused to see.


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## tcnh45 (Nov 17, 2013)

6301 said:


> What you have here friend is a very selfish, self centered wife who is extremely lazy to boot.


She is not lazy..works hard at her job..she does cook for me most nights and she does wash the dishes, and keeps the kitchen fairly clean..she does all the food shopping.. She helps me outside at times working in the yard.





> Why the hell did you have to wait 15 years for you to finally open your mouth. Your the only one that can move her butt in gear. Maybe if you stop playing the nice guy for once and let her know in a voice that she knows your serious that your not happy she might do something. If not divorce her and move on



I'm hoping marriage counseling will make a change..

I don't know why I waited 15 years either..been unhappy for many years.. I am 52 now and my wife knows I am unhappy.


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## tcnh45 (Nov 17, 2013)

Caribbean Man said:


> Do you think she might be suffering from a
> [ cluster B type ] personality disorder?



No, hot tempered Italian. Her brother is the same way


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## tcnh45 (Nov 17, 2013)

> (PS, how old are you? Do you use Just for Men, or is grey hair only unattractive on women? At what age is okay for a woman to "go grey"?)


I am 52 and have very little gray hair almost none-a little on my side burn area...


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

tcnh45 said:


> No, hot tempered Italian. Her brother is the same way


Well then I guess that it up to you to decide is you want your life to continue like this.
she doesn't seem to want to change.


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## CallaLily (Jan 13, 2011)

I would suggest MC. Make sure though if you do MC you don't say your wife is being a butthead, its not nice and unproductive. Also make sure you tell the story correctly, so the counselor will know how to better help you, because on the first page you said your wife does nothing for the marriage then on this page you list some things she does do, so its one or the other.


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## RoseAglow (Apr 11, 2013)

OP, it sounds to me like you are still in love with your wife, but your wife is not in love with you. She'd show much more interest in you if she was in love with you.

It is mentioned so often here that it is almost trite, a cliche at this point, but go download or hit up the library for His Needs, Her Needs by Willard Harley. The Five Love Languages is also good, but HNHN has more of a plan/strategy. 

The basic idea in HNHN and the 5 Love Languages is that we all have a "love bank",and when spouses fill up the "love bank" by meeting each other's emotional needs, they fall in love. Both books will help you identify each other's emotional needs, so you can focus on filling up each other's love banks. 

What usually happens, though, is that there is a reluctant spouse (in this case, your wife). So at first you will probably end up doing most of the work. But, usually the reluctant spouse enthusiastically gets on-board once they are back in love.

Good luck!


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## alte Dame (Aug 7, 2012)

It sounds like your W takes you for granted, does what she wants for herself, then stands on principle if her behavior affects you negatively. She's so busy being self-righteous about it all that she has no energy to have any empathy for you.

Some people think just letting everything go as you age is 'growing old gracefully.' and people who 'fight' the process are superficial. The idea that she should do things to make herself more attractive to you isn't for her a sign of love. Rather, it's an unreasonable concession that violates who she is naturally as a person.

I would suggest that she read 'His Needs/Her Needs,' but somehow I doubt she will.


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

alte Dame said:


> I would suggest that she read 'His Needs/Her Needs,' but somehow I doubt she will.


I don't think she would and he would have to do all the heavy lifting.
If only she displayed at least some sort of affection or at least admit that she needs help, then I think there would be a chance.
However, that is not the case.


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## Prodigal (Feb 5, 2011)

tcnh45 said:


> I'm hoping marriage counseling will make a change..


Y'know what I hear in this statement: "I'm hoping marriage counseling will make my wife see the light and change."

Granted, she may change. Then again, maybe she won't.

If you are pinning your hopes on her changing, you are barking up the wrong tree.

Just like you are trying to figure out her motivations and thinking processes.

Best of luck with marriage counseling. However, I hope you consider going into it with the idea that you can only change yourself.

What she decides to do - or not do - is solely her domain.


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## Cletus (Apr 27, 2012)

No offense to OP, but...

Whenever I read one of these monumentally one-sided posts about how much I do and how little I get in return, all of my alarms go off shrieking at once. 

I'd guess that we would hear a very, very different story from your wife. Do you know what that story would be? And I don't mean guess. If you can't answer that question, maybe that is precisely at the root of your problems.


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## soccermom2three (Jan 4, 2013)

Cletus said:


> No offense to OP, but...
> 
> Whenever I read one of these monumentally one-sided posts about how much I do and how little I get in return, all of my alarms go off shrieking at once.
> 
> I'd guess that we would hear a very, very different story from your wife. Do you know what that story would be? And I don't mean guess. If you can't answer that question, maybe that is precisely at the root of your problems.


I have to agree, especially after he posted this:



> She is not lazy..works hard at her job..she does cook for me most nights and she does wash the dishes, and keeps the kitchen fairly clean..she does all the food shopping.. She helps me outside at times working in the yard.


after someone posted that she's lazy.


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## julianne (Sep 18, 2013)

Does she even want to be married? Does she care about you? What would her answers be if you asked her these questions? From what you describe it sounds like her answers would be no.

I can't imagine treating my h like this unless I truly did not care about him. When she does something for you, do you show her your appreciation? Example: this morning I made breakfast for my husband, something I do maybe a couple of times a week. He thanked me twice for making him breakfast. Then later he texted me thanks. I always think of little things I can do for him, like bringing him tea and a plate of cookies. Just because I know it makes him happy. I know he appreciates these gestures and tells me this, quite often.

So what would your wife's response be if you asked her why she is not considerate towards you? Would she really just say "I don't care"?


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## KathyBatesel (Apr 26, 2012)

tcnh45 said:


> Katheybatesel
> 
> It's not just her appearance but everything combined..lack of real sexual attraction from her..always felt she never did desire me sexually..Sex life has always been dysfunctional for the most part.
> 
> ...


I understand. Yet I also realize that words like "never" and "always" are baloney. She DID do things at some point or you wouldn't have married her. You went on in your later posts to say she does all the shopping, cooking, and helps you in the yard at times. This is not someone who "never" does anything out of love. 

It sounds like you don't speak the same language, perhaps, but you may be re-writing your history with her to focus on the negatives. 

If YOU are done with the relationship, then be done. But if you are posting because you want to save your marriage, then start looking at your own role in its demise.


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## AVR1962 (May 30, 2012)

You mentioned "älways" here a few times. My question to you would be why were you able to accept these things before and not now? That is something for you to think about. It sounds to me like you may have possibly lost some love for your wife over the years and by the sounds of what she is doing I would say the feelings are mutual. 

It is no surprise that she is not interested in sex for often, after 15 years of marriage I think 1-2 times a week is good. I think generally women do not have as high a drive as men and I think as long as this is your focus you can expect more of the same type of treatment from your wife. She probably wants you to show that you are interested in her and not just for sex or what she can do for you. A genuine interest in her, her life, her interests and what is going on in her day.

As far as the attraction.....I get it.....my husband is 53 and balding and all his dark hair is now white. He has gained 45 pound since we married and has a gut that makes him look 7 month pg. Am I attracted to that? No! 

I think only you can decide where you are with all this. It doesn't sound like you are happy yet you are not going to change her. I get the feeling you are hurt and angry but this is not just a one-sided deal. 

Good for you for cleaning the bathrooms!! I do not think my husband has cleaned a toilet in 22 years!!! But if you don't like doing it, stop! If you want ironed shirts, take to the dry cleaners. There's ways to work issues without expecting more from your wife.


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## CallaLily (Jan 13, 2011)

Cletus said:


> No offense to OP, but...
> 
> Whenever I read one of these monumentally one-sided posts about how much I do and how little I get in return, all of my alarms go off shrieking at once.


:iagree: Totally! I see this in other threads too, and my radar always goes off.


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## tcnh45 (Nov 17, 2013)

julianne said:


> Does she even want to be married?


Yes


> Does she care about you?


Yes, but not sure if she loves me right now and I do love her but it tends to be fluid.. somedays not at all and other days I feel love towards her..I think it is the same with her to a degree.

.



> I can't imagine treating my h like this unless I truly did not care about him.


 I think it's just my wifes personality..I knew this going in but I was in love..my wifes own mom called her a "weird bird" one time..Met my wife when we was mid 30's..she had never had a bf before and was a virgin.. I had several gf's in HS and college and a few right out of college then basically was single until i was 34 though I dated in those years. She had a "rough " personality I knew this when I married her..thought it would change. She had a reputation among her fellow employees for being mean though while dating she was nice to me..but did go off the handle every so often



> When she does something for you, do you show her your appreciation?


 I always try to thank her..


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## tcnh45 (Nov 17, 2013)

AVR1962 said:


> You mentioned "älways" here a few times. My question to you would be why were you able to accept these things before and not now?


TBH I think I settled..I was 34 when I met my wife. I had at least two people tell me I should date around while I was dating my wife..I think it was there kind way of saying I should reconsider. 



> It sounds to me like you may have possibly lost some love for your wife over the years and by the sounds of what she is doing I would say the feelings are mutual.


Yes, both of us have lost some love



> It is no surprise that she is not interested in sex for often, after 15 years of marriage I think 1-2 times a week is good.


We are at 1-2 times PER month..and that is me pushing it. One time when it was at once every 6-7 weeks my wife told me in these exact words "she is happy with that arrangement" My wife was a virgin at age 34 when I met her..sex was never a priority or interest to her..she admitted to it..she has never orgasmed through sex unless I masturbate her..she get';s nothing out of oral, hates her nipples licked..thinks oral sex is demeaning..thinks fench kissing is gross...won't take a shower with me.I have tried everything trust me..and It's not me..I had great sex with old gf's..I knew my wife had hangup's about sex before I married her..
Again I was in love and thought she would change once married.I was dumb..made a mistake.



> She probably wants you to show that you are interested in her and not just for sex or what she can do for you. A genuine interest in her, her life, her interests and what is going on in her day.


 I try to do that..help her with her horses..


> As far as the attraction.....I get it.....my husband is 53 and balding and all his dark hair is now white. He has gained 45 pound since we married and has a gut that makes him look 7 month pg. Am I attracted to that? No!


I am 6-1 and work out every single day 32" waist, have ll my hair..I do more hair grooming than my wife..use conditioner etc.. she just uses Prell. No makeup whasoever never.., ears never pierced..



> I think only you can decide where you are with all this. It doesn't sound like you are happy yet you are not going to change her.


 I'm pretty much coming to that conclusion..she won't change.. 


> I get the feeling you are hurt and angry but this is not just a one-sided deal.


 she is upset as well..told me I'm not the guy she married..yeah back then I accepted her ways but tbh have just changed and no longer want to have a relationship like we have..


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## tcnh45 (Nov 17, 2013)

Cletus said:


> No offense to OP, but...
> 
> Whenever I read one of these monumentally one-sided posts about how much I do and how little I get in return, all of my alarms go off shrieking at once.
> 
> .


I wrote down exactly what is going on..did not leave anything out..


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## Cletus (Apr 27, 2012)

tcnh45 said:


> I wrote down exactly what is going on..did not leave anything out..


You wrote down your version of events. There are always three sides to every story - your side, her side, and the truth.

Maybe your side is close to the truth. I'll repeat my question - do you know her side? Do you have a good grasp on exactly what she would write here were she the one telling it?


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## Prodigal (Feb 5, 2011)

tcnh45 said:


> She had a "rough " personality I knew this when I married her..thought it would change.


So you were indulging in WHAT-IF thinking, as I call it. Or, in other words, "magical" thinking. 

People don't change because we hope they will or believe they will. They only change because they want to. You knew that going into the marriage.

Maybe you were in love with her potential. The problem is, her potential was what you wanted her to become.

So it boils down to your expectations being flamed. You hoped she would change. She didn't. You are unhappy.

I doubt you can see it, but this is your problem, not hers. She is satisfied the way she is. So it's up to you to adapt, change your reactions, or ask her outright to change. It's up to you.


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## KathyBatesel (Apr 26, 2012)

TCNH, a few things are jumping out at me as I read your recent updates: 

1. Your wife sounds like she may have been sexually victimized as a child. Her being a virgin as long as she was, not liking the sexual things you described, and her "rough" personality all point to this. This is a MAJOR influence if so, and can be true even if she has no memory of abuse. (Some people repress memories like this.)

2. You *are* looking to change her. She knows it, and it reinforces the kind of shame that goes along with sexual abuse. 

I have mixed thoughts on what to do about your situation. On one hand, it's easy and convenient to say, "Get into counseling." However, in my experience as both a former counselor and a sex abuse survivor, I can tell you that it may not be worth it because in the process of healing, it means opening old wounds and creating a lot of painful circumstances that MANY couples would not survive. 

On the other hand, there aren't any good guides that I'm aware of for how to be a good partner that can help her feel safe enough to open up those channels that are blocked right now.


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