# Is it my fault???



## bigtone128 (May 1, 2012)

My wife left me 6 weeks ago and never came back. On the way out the door she mentioned all the things I never did and things I did do that bothered her....I keep going over and over these things in my mind and thinking I should have paid more attention to her etc. BUT I complimented her daily, treated her well, etc. then I ask myself "I put up with alot of things from her and ask myself if there was anything she ever did to me that would make me go out and take off my clothes and sleep with another woman?" the answer is ALWAYS no. But it drives me crazy thinking I was responsible for the affair....is this freaking normal?


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## ParachuteOn (Apr 20, 2012)

bigtone128 said:


> My wife left me 6 weeks ago and never came back. On the way out the door she mentioned all the things I never did and things I did do that bothered her....I keep going over and over these things in my mind and thinking I should have paid more attention to her etc. BUT I complimented her daily, treated her well, etc. then I ask myself "I put up with alot of things from her and ask myself if there was anything she ever did to me that would make me go out and take off my clothes and sleep with another woman?" the answer is ALWAYS no. But it drives me crazy thinking I was responsible for the affair....is this freaking normal?


She is just trying to justify what she did by listing your "faults". Everyone has things they wish they would have done differently. Even maybe some regrets. Both spouses contribute to the marriage problems, but the decision to break the marital vow of fidelity was hers alone. 

If she was so miserable, she could have simply filed for divorce and walked away, as countless others (with honor) have done.

Don't let her fool you. You are not responsible for her affair.


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## Ingalls (Mar 7, 2012)

Definately NOT your fault. She can make a grown up choice to leave if she is that miserable or lay down with another guy...she is at fault and knows she is!!!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LeighRichwood (Mar 31, 2012)

This is typical of people in affairs. They always blame their spouse for their own choices. They will do anything to not take responsibility.

Your marriage was probably not perfect (whose marriage is perfect?) and you are responsible for your part of that. You are not responsible for her decisions.


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## missinglife (May 1, 2012)

bigtone128 said:


> My wife left me 6 weeks ago and never came back. On the way out the door she mentioned all the things I never did and things I did do that bothered her....I keep going over and over these things in my mind and thinking I should have paid more attention to her etc. BUT I complimented her daily, treated her well, etc. then I ask myself "I put up with alot of things from her and ask myself if there was anything she ever did to me that would make me go out and take off my clothes and sleep with another woman?" the answer is ALWAYS no. But it drives me crazy thinking I was responsible for the affair....is this freaking normal?


Nope. As the betrayer, I can definitively tell you it's NOT your fault. 

That doesn't mean you had a great marriage, though. Obviously something was wrong...you just were never given the chance to know it and address it.

But you weren't responsible for the affair. Take that burden off your shoulders now, lay it down and walk far, far away from it.


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

Not your fault. She's dumping her selfish choice to break her vows and cheat on you because it's easier than honestly admitting she's the piece of trash.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## BigLiam (May 2, 2012)

This is very standard, as others have mentioned.

And, a betrayed person is , often, so downtrodden and traumatized, that he or she ,often, believes the self serving justifications from the cheater.
You have already started to realize that she had imperfections as well, yet you remained true to your vows.
There was a study i read about where inquiry(somehow) was made into which partner was less invested in the marriage to begin with and which partner caused most of the pre-affair problems in the marriage. Overwhelmingly, it was the cheater that was responsible for the poor conditions in the marriage.
Think about it. It makes sense. Your wife has demonstrated beyond any doubt that she lacks integrity, is a poor communicator, and that she has poor problem solving skills. She demonstrates a lack of forethought and a lack of empathy.All this is shown by her cheating.
So, with that in mind, knowing her deficiencies, do you really beleive she was the better spouse in the relationship? Is it likely that someone so cruel, depraved and dishonest, not to mention deficient in communication etc. was anything but the main source of the pre-affair marital problems?
The whole "50/50" cliche re responsibility for pre-affair problems lacks analysis. Clearly, one spouse can be way more responsible for a marriages decline than the other. And, as I mentioned, it is much more likely that the cheater had the yeoman's share of that responsibility.
Read up on this. It is fairly well established and documented re this cheater being more at fault for the decline in the marriage.


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## LoveMouse (Apr 22, 2012)

I like the word "projection". In many cases the cheater will project all their problems or faults onto the faithful spouse. Some truly believe they were pushed into the affair and never take responcibility for their actions. I keep hearing how I have to take responcibility for my marriage winding up in divorce but I did everything possible to keep it going....including my own therapy, MC, admitting my wrong doings...nothing worked. As far as I will ever be concerned she did all this herself, I even forgave her time and time again....36 weeks of MC and she was still content in keeping her BF....it was a lost cause.
Don't ever take blame you don't deserve!!
Mouse


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## Numb-badger (May 18, 2011)

She's just justifying things to herself. Accept none of it, you truly know what parts of you could do with a little improvement - we all do, but she's just making excuses. I mean, she was the 'perfect' partner wasn't she?
At this question they (both men and women) usually say, 'No'
Contradictory statement - end of argument.


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## bigtone128 (May 1, 2012)

Bad night last night - heard from friends that saw my former spouse out with her boyfriend at a concert - she is so flagrantly shameless about her behaviour and she was driving our family car. Its like she doesnt care a lick what i think...its amazing how devastated one can get over this stuff....i mean i know she slept with the guy numerous times....so why would her going public bother me so much? Then I also found out there was stuff I left behind when I moved out and she didnt call me about it she coldly went to a mutual friend and dropped it off with them....after I knew her for 30 years...it makes no sense at all.


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## Numb-badger (May 18, 2011)

It's detatchment - people use it to seperate emotion from situations. She's making you out to be some villain in her head to keep herself feeling comfortable with what she's doing.

This is why you have to take care of you - no one else is going to do it.


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## snap (Oct 3, 2011)

You mention the family car. Did you file yet?

You can't control her actions, but you can keep your dignity by not sponsoring their affair.


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## bigtone128 (May 1, 2012)

yea i know but its complicated - we have an 18 year old son at home and I left the car for him to drive and him only - but it appears she is manipulating him to get it and I'm angry at him but he's been through enough due to her breaking up the family and want to be close to him. So I feel stuck.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

You let her kick you out? Big mistake, she cheated, you should go home and ask her to leave. Just because you are a man doesn't mean you have to leave your home and be replaced.


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## bigtone128 (May 1, 2012)

I knew it was a mistake BUT I was devastated when she told me of the affair. I couldnt live with her and wasnt well enough to take care of our son - so I thought the most prudent thing to do was to let her take care of our son and me get myself together. However, its been 6 weeks and I've got myself together a bit but I see she is not taking care of our son....she's out every night her boyfriend. So, yea was it a mistake....yeah but I had to get myself together first. Understand?


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

Move back in the house. Don't ask. And grow a pair while you are at it.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Why Not Be Happy? (Apr 16, 2010)

Listen to Bandit----it may sound harsh but he is wise and will give you some good ideas.


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

Your son is not a child. He's old enough to take a bullet for the flag. He can be an ally to you in pressure on the wife to cool her sh*t until the divorce is final.

You have filed haven't you?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Homemaker_Numero_Uno (Jan 18, 2011)

She dropped the ball in getting her needs attended to by you. If the first you heard of it was on her way out the door, that's irresponsible on her part. Every adult should understand themselves and what they need in terms of connection to others, then they should be the #1 person to advocate for themselves, whether this is through actions or verbal communication it doesn't matter. It seems she is just switching up people to get an immediate need met, chances are when her needs change, she will have to switch up again, due to her lack of self-awareness, self-advocacy and initiative, also perseverance. You can't kick yourself for not being a mind-reader. On the other hand, it's good to check in with a spouse every now and then to see how they are doing...and hope that they will be honest if something isn't working well.

Even though my boyfriend had a brain hemorrhage, we still check in with each other to see how we are doing...and to re-assess our relationship to make sure we are on the same page and our needs are being met, and which ones aren't, and what our plan is for now and for future. It's just a normal, expected part of any relationship, to pay attention to it. Not just discard it when it's the wrong thing for your immediate need. It's sad what she's doing but chances are you are not going to be able to have any control over it.


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## river rat (Jan 20, 2012)

BigT, blaming yourself is perfectly normal. Just listen to the folks here. It was not your fault! I'm the kinda guy for whom failure is not an option, lived my whole life with that credo. But when I found out about my wife, I felt like the most colossal failure in the universe. Took a long time to recover from that one, but it was a growth experience. Start working on yourself; every one of us has the potential to grow and improve; that's part of the challenge and a lot of the fun.


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## calvin (Jan 7, 2012)

I blamed myself for everything wrong in our marriage also,at first.My WW loved that,she told me I could come over take care of any work around the house and pay the bills and leave,when I tried to explain to her that she did some damage too she refused to take any blame,she tried to get me out of the house so she could "date" her prince charming.When our MC asked us to list our faults we did,I had quite a list going,her paper was blank,MC asked if she had any faults she looked around the room for a while and shook her head no.It was all my fault,by then I knew better.I came near having a nervious break down and pleaded for some help,again she said why should I help you its all your fault.She did everything in her mind to justify she was in the right.After I kicked her out she had a break down but I was there for her,i wanted revenge but what good would that do,she wasnt in her right frame of mind.She finally saw where all this was headed and it wasnt going to be like she thought it was.Thank God she stoped her EA and slowly came around and we are improving,I Will never take the blame or go through all that pain again,I know better now,she now admits her blame in our marriage and has been totally out of the fog now for about a month.Dont ever let someone lay it all on you
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Machiavelli (Feb 25, 2012)

bandit.45 said:


> Move back in the house. Don't ask. And grow a pair while you are at it.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Move back in today. What did your attorney say about you moving out?


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## Honeystly (Mar 1, 2012)

The truth is if she was unhappy in a marriage she could have said something, initiated therapy. She didn't want to. She just used you as an excuse to do to you precisely what she should not. She blamed the victim. What a b*tch. She wanted to leave you, break your heart and not feel any guilt for it. What better way to do it than to blame you? Look up the humorous link " our love is real" another poster put up few days ago... it sums it up in a nutshell. Good luck


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

Move back in today. Remove any funding you are providing her. And take those keys away.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## bigtone128 (May 1, 2012)

I keep wondering what would a guy say to a woman to convince her to leave her husband of 26 years and 17 year old son?? It boggles my mind...Now and as for lawyers - I live in Canada and I do not have money for an attorney - I'd love to file separation and divorce papers ASAP but have no money. Finally, I am concerned about the whole tough love thing because I'm afraid she will use it as a way to say "See he never was supportive of me.." I do not want her back but having a hard time letting go as well..its sorta messed up.


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

often those in an affair will vilify their spouse to justify the affair


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

bigtone128 said:


> I keep wondering what would a guy say to a woman to convince her to leave her husband of 26 years and 17 year old son?? It boggles my mind...Now and as for lawyers - I live in Canada and I do not have money for an attorney - I'd love to file separation and divorce papers ASAP but have no money. Finally, I am concerned about the whole tough love thing because I'm afraid she will use it as a way to say "See he never was supportive of me.." I do not want her back but having a hard time letting go as well..its sorta messed up.



many attorneys will have a free initial consultation, you could also look for one to do pro bono


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## LeighRichwood (Mar 31, 2012)

bigtone128 said:


> I keep wondering what would a guy say to a woman to convince her to leave her husband of 26 years and 17 year old son?? It boggles my mind...Now and as for lawyers - I live in Canada and I do not have money for an attorney - I'd love to file separation and divorce papers ASAP but have no money. Finally, I am concerned about the whole tough love thing because I'm afraid she will use it as a way to say "See he never was supportive of me.." I do not want her back but having a hard time letting go as well..its sorta messed up.


You are where you are. You can't go back and change what you did by moving out. You can, however, make good decisions going forward. It doesn't matter if it's sorta messed up. Move back into your home. Don't ask for permission. It's your right to live in your home. If she doesn't want to live with you, then she can move out.

If you don't have money for an attorney, moving back home will hopefully help you save money by not having to pay for double housing.


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## Count of Monte Cristo (Mar 21, 2012)

bigtone128 said:


> Bad night last night - heard from friends that saw my former spouse out with her boyfriend at a concert - she is so flagrantly shameless about her behaviour and she was driving our family car. Its like she doesnt care a lick what i think...its amazing how devastated one can get over this stuff....i mean i know she slept with the guy numerous times....so why would her going public bother me so much? Then I also found out there was stuff I left behind when I moved out and she didnt call me about it she coldly went to a mutual friend and dropped it off with them....after I knew her for 30 years...it makes no sense at all.


Bigtone, I'm so sorry that you are here.

I feel your pain. My ex and I have known each other since we were fourteen (35 years) and I don't recognize the person that she has become. Never in my wildest dreams would I have imagined that she would abandon me and the kids.

My wife is currently flushed with $150k from the divorce settlement and is 'happily' living life as a single cougar wannabe.

The person that you knew is dead. Remember the happy times and mourn the loss of your marriage. Believe it or not, it does get better. One day at a time.


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## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

bandit.45 said:


> Move back in the house. Don't ask. And grow a pair while you are at it.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


:iagree:

First off, get your ass back in the house. This is the marital home, she CANNOT legally make you leave. If anyone leaves, its her. The longer you stay gone, the greater case she has against you and it will be seen as abandonment by the court. Guaranteed. Make her ass sleep on the couch, why should you suffer for her cheating?

I've read your previous threads and saw how she demonized you to everyone by telling lies about you. She has re-written the history of your marriage. This is standard, they will blameshift so they can justify the affair to themselves. You mentioned that she was even reprimanded by her union for inappropriate public display of affection for a coworker.

And now you have your 18 yr old son enabling her affair because he lets her driver YOUR vehicle that was meant for him. You're basically still financing her affair and her now partygirl lifestyle. Stop it already. Stop taking the blame for her affair.


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## bigtone128 (May 1, 2012)

Thank you for everyone's help. It is uplifting..well as uplifting as this situation can be. 6 weeks ago I was crushed - I am a little better now. Thank you for the whole rewriting of history - I have been telling people thats what shes doing - cripes two weeks before she had affair she had pictures of a family trip to florida all over facebook under the folder - family fun in florida - then two weeks later it was all negative...talk about mind messing. The one thing that drives me crazy is that people tell me that I must have done something to make her unhappy - then my mind starts spinning again. I am not going to accept responsibiity for her affair. Oh, yea, for those discussions about seeing a doctor - I was having great pain down below and went to doctor who believes I might have contracted an STD which I think led her to such levels of anger because she cannot deny the affair....extremely pissed that she would put me at risk with unprotected sex and then not tell me...to me a higher level of betrayal.


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

O brother, I'm so sorry. 
When are the blood test due back?


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## bigtone128 (May 1, 2012)

i will hear back from doctors on tuesday but on heavy dose of antibiotics until then....


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

BT

If your std tests comes back positive do the following.

Go home during the day when she is not there.

Pack up all her crap and throw it on the lawn of her BF's house

with a big sign, "My wife is a cheater. She is now your problem.

By the way thank you both for the STD you gave me. BT"

Then change the locks.

Hit her facebook and post your test results. That will put her in her place.

Do not let her beat you down. Show her your balls my man!

I guarantee you will feel better about yourself.

Take care of your son.

HM64


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## bigtone128 (May 1, 2012)

Yea, I am worried about my son - I am pissed that I even had to go get tests done - I mean everyone was looking at me like I was the one messing around (the staff know what your being tested for). I mean, I never had an STD in my life and now I get it from my wife??? As I said to the doctor - I dont mind paying for my mistakes but having to pay for the mistakes of others - I get angry....

Here's something I am a bit confused about - if I dont speak to her, never talk to her and she sent me an email saying never contact her again.....how does anything ever get resolved (not even for a future relationship but a working relationship with our kids??


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

bigtone128 said:


> Yea, I am worried about my son - I am pissed that I even had to go get tests done - I mean everyone was looking at me like I was the one messing around (the staff know what your being tested for). I mean, I never had an STD in my life and now I get it from my wife??? As I said to the doctor - I dont mind paying for my mistakes but having to pay for the mistakes of others - I get angry....
> 
> Here's something I am a bit confused about - if I dont speak to her, never talk to her and she sent me an email saying never contact her again.....how does anything ever get resolved (not even for a future relationship but a working relationship with our kids??


Thats its own resolution. I would make her contact me through a third party. If you never have to see her lying, diseased skank face again you are the lucky one. File for divorce/separation quickly and find a new woman. One that doesn't hang out with disease ridden creeps.

Put them both on cheaterville.com and warn everyone they are carrying if the test come back positive.


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## BigLiam (May 2, 2012)

Why are you out of your own house? It is like admitting to folks that you are the bad guy.

As for others telling you that you must have caused her unhappiness, that is a common reaction, born of ignorance and fear.

Yes, fear. see ,if others can convince themselves that you were at fault and that you were deficient, they feel safer. Thye feel it caannot happen to them , as they are doing all the right things.
Thye need to beleive this, so they can feel safe.
I saw this a ot, when my first sone was born with a disability. Some ignorant people felt that we had done something wrong and were being punixhed.
You'll see this in many situations. Unless someone has exprienced this infidelity crap firsthand, you get little sympathy. people wonder why it still affects you nd say insensitve things all the time about "getting over it", in addition to the blaming deal.
Stick with folks who have been through it if you want advice and understanding.


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## bigtone128 (May 1, 2012)

I will tell you why I am out of the house - because she initially left and walked out and I was so devastated that I did not know what to do PLUS she went out and moved in with buddy and was telling my son she was not fooling around and staying at a "friend's" place and she left due to me. My son kept saying to me that nothing was going on between my former spouse and anyone else. So I spoke with my mother who said "shes lying to your son because she can keep it hidden" let her move back in and she will have to show her true colors.. So I did and true to form she started spending every night out over night and it did not take a week before I asked my son about it and he said "I see what's going on, I am not stupid!". It was important enough to me to win the PR war with my son. I wasnt going to let her ruin my reputation with my son because she chose to sleep with someone else. Screw (pardon the pun) that! The house is being sold and I am told she is moving elsewhere.....probably boyfriends place.....


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## bryanp (Aug 25, 2011)

Why are you not divorcing?


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## bigtone128 (May 1, 2012)

I am seeing one on Monday...........its really messed up because Id like to know why this whole thing happened how it happened and most importantly i'd like an apology....I mean there's just a common decency in how you treat people..especially someone you've known for 30 years..


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## Honeystly (Mar 1, 2012)

Oh, it's been four months for me and no apology in sight.... I wouldn't count on that one. To apologise is to admit that they did something wrong. That in turn 'causes' guilty conscience and she will fight that like crazy. Honestly, she probably made you into a villain and rewrote history. Don't hold your breath


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## kindi (Apr 28, 2012)

bigtone128 said:


> My son kept saying to me that nothing was going on between my former spouse and anyone else. .. it did not take a week before I asked my son about it and he said "I see what's going on, I am not stupid!". It was important enough to me to win the PR war with my son


Your son is not your messager or spy, it's not his fight, leave the kids out of it. To involve them to the extent you have, to encourage them to pick sides is reckless, irresponsible and damaging to them. His mom cheated on YOU, not on him.


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## bigtone128 (May 1, 2012)

Well. I didnt involve him she did by slandering me and then HE was the one who brought up the fact that she was never at home....I just mentioned to him if he saw what was going on....I felt it was important the he see the truth...no discussions since.....dont take the moral high road before you know the details...kinda reminds me of my soon-to-be ex wife.....


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## kindi (Apr 28, 2012)

bigtone128 said:


> Well. I didnt involve him she did by slandering me and then HE was the one who brought up the fact that she was never at home....I just mentioned to him if he saw what was going on....I felt it was important the he see the truth...no discussions since.....dont take the moral high road before you know the details...kinda reminds me of my soon-to-be ex wife.....


Morality has nothing to do with it.

Even though your son might point out she's never home, it's inappropriate to start asking him questions and putting him in a position where he has to choose which parent is right and which one is wrong and pick one to align with.

If my posts remind you of your stbxwife because I am giving you this good advice to spare your children further trauma and agony from the fallout of your divorce, then you just might want to listen to what she has to say when it comes to the children, she sounds like she's got the right idea.


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

Dude there are kinds of reason they cheat. Often there are validation issues and need to be valaidate constanly, and new guys are a perfect fit.

Sometimes its intitlement were waywars believe they diserve a lover other then there husband.

But in its most simplest term waywards have a void they can not fill on there own and go else were to fill it. Many waywards claim its a bandaid for there own personal issues. Blaming there betrayed spouse for the lack of boundries and poor judgement a wayward has is easier for them to sleep at night.

When its all said and done the percentage of a relationship lasting from an affair are very very low. See the wayward may have a new partner but still have the same behaviors that will break down their new relationship.

At the end of the day its all a fantasy the wayward is thinking the grass is greener on the otherside, and instead of facing there own unhealthy issues waywards continue to go through relationship after relationship looking for someone instead of looking with in them selves.


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## bigtone128 (May 1, 2012)

Thanks fpr your advice - in my own case, my wife was loyal (so I thought) for 26 years but now I am even starting to question that. Its just confusing and I am frustrated because now I have to pick up the pieces of something I had no choice over and never saw coming.


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

Who said life was fair


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

BT
That is how you show her and everyone else how good a person you are.

You pick up the pieces, you keep loving your son and you move on.

Do not feel bad for what your wife did to you and your family. Feel angry.

Use that anger to end the marriage and move on to a better life. Show everyone how strong you are.

When her life crumbles around her there you will be so far ahead of her.

Your mom sounds wise. Your boy sounds smart.surround yourself with them.

HM64
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## AFEH (May 18, 2010)

kindi said:


> Your son is not your messager or spy, it's not his fight, leave the kids out of it. To involve them to the extent you have, to encourage them to pick sides is reckless, irresponsible and damaging to them. His mom cheated on YOU, not on him.


His wife betrayed both him and their son!


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## kindi (Apr 28, 2012)

AFEH said:


> His wife betrayed both him and their son!


She plays with her son's friends and stole them away from him?


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## bigtone128 (May 1, 2012)

Thank you for your support everyone....Sometimes I just get emotionally messed up and panicky when I think of her and I want to call her and want everything to go back to where it was...before all this happened. We talk alot about separation and divorce but not the emotional effects of being cheated on, and abandoned by spouse....I feel totally at a loss at times.


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

Have you exposed the cheating to friends and her family, including how she gave you an STD?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## BigLiam (May 2, 2012)

kindi said:


> She plays with her son's friends and stole them away from him?


IMO, kids, absolutely, need to know about the cheating. There are several good reasons: So they see bad behavior has consequences; so they do not feel responsible for the breakup: and so they can be vigilant arounf the OM, who , obviously, has limited, if any, morals.
And, yes, cheating on one's spouse is cheating on the family. When you brought kids into the world, there is an implicit responsibility to give them as safe and stable an environmet as possible. Saying a parent's cheating has no impact on the kids and is none of their businees is no different than keeping kids in the dark about a parents drug or alcohol addiction.
I can tell you, once we kids knew our dad was a drunk, things made much more sense we were not so confused.


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## kindi (Apr 28, 2012)

BigLiam said:


> Saying a parent's cheating has no impact on the kids and is none of their businees is no different than keeping kids in the dark about a parents drug or alcohol addiction.


That's not at all what I said.

The kids need to know about mom's cheating.

They do not need:

- to be questioned about mom's whereabouts and activities
- to be coerced to pick sides
- to be manipulated into seeing their mom as a bad person because she made one or more "inappropriate decisions".

Thanks for the opportunity to clarify my ambiguous post.


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## BigLiam (May 2, 2012)

kindi said:


> That's not at all what I said.
> 
> The kids need to know about mom's cheating.
> 
> ...


No problem But, I disagree that making a simple inquiry re whereabouts and his wife's associations etc constitutes recklessly putting kids in the middle.
Obviously, he is going to have limited access to his wife's activities and association with her affair partner, and he has a responsiblity to shield his son fron this man. Who knows what a man who would have sex with a married woman is capable of with his kid.
I faced this problem, trying to keep tabs on my kids contact with a predator ike the OM who was brought into their lives by their mom.
I , occassionally, would make inquire re whether he was in the house at ngith with my three young daughters. I never editorialized on their mom's character, but, whenever they would have a wrong piece of infornmations(like that mom, post seperation, was now seeing a man who she had not seen in years), I corrected their ideas. 
Again, I never bad mouthed my XW, simply told themn the facts in an age approprite way.


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## kindi (Apr 28, 2012)

BigLiam said:


> No problem But, I disagree that making a simple inquiry re whereabouts and his wife's associations etc constitutes recklessly putting kids in the middle.


That's fair. But simple tactful queries are not quite the same as what I took from his post which was that he was trying to drag the kids into the conflict and over to his side of the battle.



bigtone128 said:


> It was important enough to me to win the PR war with my son. I wasnt going to let her ruin my reputation with my son because she chose to sleep with someone else.


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## bigtone128 (May 1, 2012)

For clarification sake, I was not prying into my wife's whereabouts or anything of the sort - she was secretly meeting my son and spinning her story telling him nothing was going on WHEN in fact I knew there was but I couldnt prove it (so Im not going to tell him then) BUT when she moved back in with him and HE saw her staying out night after night - then I felt it important to point out the lies she told him earlier (to which he replied "Im not blind"). Thats all I wanted him to see. we had an open and honest home before this happened and I wanted it to remain so despite her dishonesty.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

kindi said:


> That's fair. But simple tactful queries are not quite the same as what I took from his post which was that he was trying to drag the kids into the conflict and over to his side of the battle.


Your not going to get any sympathy for your position on an infidelity forum. You literally suggested she didn't betray her family, only her husband, who coincidentally is her son's father.

Your pompus reply even made OP think of his wife.


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## kindi (Apr 28, 2012)

chapparal said:


> Your not going to get any sympathy for your position on an infidelity forum. You literally suggested she didn't betray her family, only her husband, who coincidentally is her son's father.
> 
> Your pompus reply even made OP think of his wife.


She didn't betray her children by having sex with another man no matter how much the whole situation "triggers you".

Now if she's neglecting the kids to be with the other guy, that's another matter entirely - it's a big problem, and it may give him some ammo for the impending custody battle- but it still isn't "betrayal".

Regardless, it's best for the kids to keep them out of the fight, they're going to take a big enough hit the way it is without the parents painting one another out to be horrible people.


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## moxy (Apr 2, 2012)

bigtone128 said:


> My wife left me 6 weeks ago and never came back. On the way out the door she mentioned all the things I never did and things I did do that bothered her....I keep going over and over these things in my mind and thinking I should have paid more attention to her etc. BUT I complimented her daily, treated her well, etc. then I ask myself "I put up with alot of things from her and ask myself if there was anything she ever did to me that would make me go out and take off my clothes and sleep with another woman?" the answer is ALWAYS no. But it drives me crazy thinking I was responsible for the affair....is this freaking normal?


It is not your fault. She chose to behave that way. She's in an affair fog and re-writing marital history. Maybe your actions contributed to marriage problems, but she chose to go outside of the marriage to meet her needs, to abandon the marriage instead of trying to work it out with you. You are better off without her. It will take time, but you will feel better after a while.


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## BigLiam (May 2, 2012)

I can see how you would get that imprsession.

But, with acheating spouse there often is, in fact, a PR war due to the smear campaign that the cheater conducts to justify the affair. And, IMO, there is nothing wrong with defending oneself via disclosing accurate information.
Again, badmouthing is out(and , it is ineffective as it , often, plays right inot the cheater's hands as they try to cast you as abusive or a mean person).I handled it with my kids by doing a Joe Friday("just the facts, mam").
With outsiders. friends , family etc, I took a different tack , whic seemed effective.
I was very aware that my wife would conduct the smear campaign. So, I did two things. I capitalized on my close relationship with her parents and brothers(and uncles, too, I guess) going on vacations with them going to their houses for dinner etc, and accepting all their invitations(often I would be sitting with them at my kids school functions, while myXW was ostracized).
This let the public see that I was supported by her family, this making folks question any badmouthing form her(my kids loved me and showed it , too).
Second, when a family acquaintance who had heard of the impending divorce would meet me ,say, in the grocery store and inquire how things were going, I would say something along the lines of "much better, now. That affair businesswas tough on all of us , but we are healing".
Now, many of these folks did not know about the cheating. And, I did not want tpo make it look like I was conducting a mear campaign of my own. But, OTOH, I wanted these folks to know what she had done.
Using this approach, I would get responses like "affait? Youmean xxx was having an affair"? 
My response : "Oh, I thoughtth you knew. Soory."
Then, it appeared as if the disclosure was not intended to damage her(it was) and , additionally, the non-chalance lended credibility to the assertion,(it appeared as if it was common knowledge, accepted by all).
yes, thereis a PR batle many times and ond must defend against it if one values his or her reputation.


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## kindi (Apr 28, 2012)

BigLiam said:


> Then, it appeared as if the disclosure was not intended to damage her(it was) and , additionally, the non-chalance lended credibility to the assertion,(it appeared as if it was common knowledge, accepted by all).
> yes, thereis a PR batle many times and ond must defend against it if one values his or her reputation.


That works.

But again, you're being tactful, non emotional, subtle, providing facts- not badmouthing which as you said is counter productive and you're not involving the kids, other than to occasionally do a bit of tactful "fact finding" here and there.

I don't think I'm really saying anything different than you are.

I'm just watching out for the children.


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## Posse (Jan 30, 2012)

kindi said:


> She didn't betray her children by having sex with another man no matter how much the whole situation "triggers you".


Bull****.

You don't think the son is affected by his mother's behavior? What planet are you living on?


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## bigtone128 (May 1, 2012)

and Im saying my children (who are 19 and 17 both boys) should know the truth about the situation and not allow her to spin her "I've been unhappy for many years - bulls..." and thats why shes leaving....she's leaving because she met someone else - plain and simple. We had a family trip to Florida 2 weeks before she left and everyone had a good time and she posted "family fun in Florida" on facebook. Then she leaves 2 weeks later??? Im sure the kids on some level see through the crap - but its important to me that they see the truth so they themselves are not manipulated like this in the future (and if they are the can recognize it).


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## bigtone128 (May 1, 2012)

I agree with posse - if you see how this has affected my 17 year old son who was bawling like a baby on the stairs after he found out - you'd know the betrayal she did to all the family - I dont know where kindi is coming from???


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## Posse (Jan 30, 2012)

The planet Klingon, apparently.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

kindi said:


> She didn't betray her children by having sex with another man no matter how much the whole situation "triggers you".
> 
> Now if she's neglecting the kids to be with the other guy, that's another matter entirely - it's a big problem, and it may give him some ammo for the impending custody battle- but it still isn't "betrayal".
> 
> Regardless, it's best for the kids to keep them out of the fight, they're going to take a big enough hit the way it is without the parents painting one another out to be horrible people.


But his wife is horrible. Now you're suggesing withholding the truth from the kids of horrible people. She has hurt the sons father more than anyone else in the world could have ever done except for doing something to his son. You hurt his dad, she hurts his son. She's gone every night=neglect. She broke up at least one family and maybe two. That certainly qualifeis her to be incompetent.

No, I'm not triggering either, I'm rothflmao at your naivete.


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## Posse (Jan 30, 2012)

I'm not triggering either, btw. That the kids aren't hurt was just one of the most ludicrous assertions I have ever seen or heard before.


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## BigLiam (May 2, 2012)

An affair is considered, by some therapists(based on what I have read), the most sever form of emotional abuse one spouse can lay on the other.
If someone abuses the parent of a child(in this case the cheating wife abusing her husband) in this manner, it almost surely impacts the victimized parent's ability to care for the children.
Infidelity, many times, can lead to PTSD, job loss, physical health decline, mental problems, and, even suicide n a betrayed spouse.
And, these are long term effects, a lot of the time, with the victim struggling for years to regain confidence, self esteem, and some sense of safety and normalcy.
So, cheating on one's spouse impacts the children negatively, whether the victimized pouse discloses the cheating or not.
Just because the wife in this case has not been sexually unfaithful to her kids, as she was to their dad, does not mean she has not betrayed them in some fashion. 
Her duty to her kids was to set an example for them, to keep them safe and stable, to care about their other parent's welfars, so he would be in good enough shape to help them, too.
Yes, IMO, she betrayed her whole family. She damaged her children in order to pursue her own pleasure.
One wonders, do these cheating spouse think they are so damn hot that they are the only ones resisting overtures from outsiders? I think many times they think that we BSs are so less desirable that we are not subject to the same temptations and have fewere ooptions.
Thye seem to elevate not only their own desires over our, but their opinions of their marketability vs the BSs are inflated,
I bet each and every one of us BSs had the option to look for upgrades over our spouses.


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## sharkeey (Apr 27, 2012)

Posse said:


> I'm not triggering either, btw. That the kids aren't hurt was just one of the most ludicrous assertions I have ever seen or heard before.





Posse said:


> Bull****.
> 
> You don't think the son is affected by his mother's behavior? What planet are you living on?


I don't see where kindi said the kids aren't hurt or affected.

All he or she said was don't involve the son in the conflict, use him as a spy, or force him to take sides against his mother.

Sure what she did basically sucks but that doesn't mean her son has to hate her for it.

It's called "damage control". Kids need their parents, even those who show bad judgement or do s***ty things. Unless it gets to the point where they are being abused or neglected.


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## bigtone128 (May 1, 2012)

That last point is true - I had many opportunities - but thought about what it would do to my kids, my marriage, my extended family and mostly my spouse....here's the thing..I understand that one can fall in love with someone else okay but even then you sit down with family and negotiate things out whether the marriage can be salvaged, how this will affect kids, etc. you take care of each other - you DONT march out the door not say anything and leave the family to pick up the pieces of your selfish acts. Oh yeah, and then further victimize them by scapegoating the innocent spouse for your actions....classless


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

Big,
come on dude she is in an affair and with that you can throw out any logic you think she may have.

She's in a fantasy right now and thats all that matter, and what ever she needs to do to justiy that fantasy.

So if you think your WW believes the ski is blue your are dead wrong she believes it pink. Get it?

She is not the same women you married, I'm sorry for the loss of your wife, but if she was thinking logicly you wounld be on the site.


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## bigtone128 (May 1, 2012)

Okay when do they fall out of this affair fog everyone is talking about? Weeks, months, years?? Ny wife was posting lovey dovey stuff on facebook to her AP and has since taken this down - does this mean the "fog" is lifting??


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## BigLiam (May 2, 2012)

sharkeey said:


> I don't see where kindi said the kids aren't hurt or affected.
> 
> All he or she said was don't involve the son in the conflict, use him as a spy, or force him to take sides against his mother.
> 
> ...


Well, when she facetiously said something along the lines of ,"she did not steal the sons friends and have sex with them" or something like that, the impication is clear: She feels that cheating is not only no big deal(again, it is considered by some therapist to be the most sever form of abuse causing massive trauma), but that it does not damage the kids.
Kids do need their parents. But, it also benefits them to see that when a person, even a parent, behaves like an abusive, selfish, monstous person who shows no regard for others, that person does deserve our oprobium.
If I lay a severe beating on my kids' mom, I have abused them. No difference when a mom abuses a dad in a manner that causes as least as much damage as a physical beating.


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

No she most likely got sh!t for it by someone, or its all damage control on her end. 

The quicker you give her consequences the quicker she might I mean might come out of the fog. Impliment the 180, cut her off and seperate all accounts the both of you share, and have her served with divorce papers.

Again you can always withdraw the filing before its finalized when you can confirm there is NC with her boytoy.


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## BigLiam (May 2, 2012)

bigtone128 said:


> That last point is true - I had many opportunities - but thought about what it would do to my kids, my marriage, my extended family and mostly my spouse....here's the thing..I understand that one can fall in love with someone else okay but even then you sit down with family and negotiate things out whether the marriage can be salvaged, how this will affect kids, etc. you take care of each other - you DONT march out the door not say anything and leave the family to pick up the pieces of your selfish acts. Oh yeah, and then further victimize them by scapegoating the innocent spouse for your actions....classless


I've met and interacted with many cheaters. Most are classless and severely lacking in integrity in almost all other areas of their lives.


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## bigtone128 (May 1, 2012)

I am starting to understand I think the 180 - it seemed counterintuitive at first but I get it now - at first, I thought cutting off the WS only would drive them closer to the AP but now I understand that what it does is forces the WS to make a choice AND by doing so takes them out of the fog they are experiencing by the affair fog.....very effective. Not that I want her back - just itd be nice to talk to a normal perso again...


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## Posse (Jan 30, 2012)

When you have kids old enough to comprehend behavior, cheating on your spouse is cheating on your whole family. Kids experience the trauma directly, and the delayed second and third order effects hit them as well.

The betrayal hits everyone. I have seen enough of the effects in others to feel comfortable stating that as fact. Maybe somewhere there are kids who aren't affected, but in 42 years, I haven't seen the kids who aren't traumatized directly by the experience yet.

Betrayal of the spouse is betrayal of the entire family.


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## BigLiam (May 2, 2012)

Exactly,Posse. There is a ton of material on the net re the effects of infidelity on the children.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

Posse said:


> When you have kids old enough to comprehend behavior, cheating on your spouse is cheating on your whole family. Kids experience the trauma directly, and the delayed second and third order effects hit them as well.
> 
> The betrayal hits everyone. I have seen enough of the effects in others to feel comfortable stating that as fact. Maybe somewhere there are kids who aren't affected, but in 42 years, I haven't seen the kids who aren't traumatized directly by the experience yet.
> 
> Betrayal of the spouse is betrayal of the entire family.


And just to add, the divorce will be so traumatic for the kids it wil be something that adversely affects their lives and even their childrens lives.


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## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

bigtone128 said:


> I am starting to understand I think the 180 - it seemed counterintuitive at first but I get it now - at first, I thought cutting off the WS only would drive them closer to the AP but now I understand that what it does is forces the WS to make a choice AND by doing so takes them out of the fog they are experiencing by the affair fog.....very effective. Not that I want her back - just itd be nice to talk to a normal perso again...


You misunderstand the use of the 180. The *180 is a self empowerment tool* for the betrayed spouse. It helps the BS to regain independence and strength and reduce any codependency behaviors. It helps the BS detach from the WS so that the BS will have the strength to move on, with or without the WS.

It often has the side effect of showing the WS that their BS will move on without them, but that's not the purpose. *The 180 is NOT a tool to manipulate the WS *or to get them out of the fog. Only the WS can do that, and that's usually the result of consequences, usually from exposure, or divorce, or both.


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

bigtone128 said:


> I am starting to understand I think the 180 - it seemed counterintuitive at first but I get it now - at first, I thought cutting off the WS only would drive them closer to the AP but now I understand that what it does is forces the WS to make a choice AND by doing so takes them out of the fog they are experiencing by the affair fog.....very effective. Not that I want her back - just itd be nice to talk to a normal perso again...


BT,

180 is for you. It alllows you to detach from your wayward wife. It allows you to build up your inner strength so you can walk away from the marriage and be on your own.

It allows you to deal with what your wayward wife has done, come to grips with her affair, get your emotions under control and realize you will be fine on your own without her.

Since your boys are older I suggest you sever all ties to her an forms of communication. She has abandoned the marriage and your family. She can have as many secret meetings with the boys as she wants. They see her behavior as "strange".

Go see the attorney. File for Divorce. Separate your assets if she is entitled to anything. Let her be her boyfriend's problem.

You will be fine! I know you are sad and you want an explanation of why she left you. You will never get a good explanation because there isn't one. Her behavior shows this too be true.

*And in all truth, why would you believe someone who is lying, cheating and acting in this manner. Stop waiting on her, take control of the situation on your terms and move forward with your life.*

That sends the clearest message than anything you could say to her face.

HM64


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## bigtone128 (May 1, 2012)

You are right - I went to church today and there was a first communion and it made me sad because it reminded me of my two boys' first communions and how happy as a family we were then...but that was then and this is now...then I thought I didnt pull the plug she did and it is her responsibility to deal with. I can hold my head up and say I did what I could and thats what I could. Got a nice text from my oldest stating that you did what you could Dad but you cant control everything....touching to say the least..made me see the truth.


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## bigtone128 (May 1, 2012)

here are the effects of marital infidelity.....
More than 800 adult children whose parents were unfaithful responded to our online Parents Who
Cheat Survey. 75.7% of respondents reported that they felt betrayed by the parent who cheated.
88.4% felt angry toward their cheating parent. 62.5% felt ashamed or embarrassed to talk about their
parent’s infidelity with friends or other people. 80.2% felt that their attitudes toward love and
relationships was influenced by their parent having cheated, and 70.5% said their ability to trust others
had been affected. 83% stated that they feel people regularly lie.
One of the most striking findings in the survey is that while 86.7 % of respondents said they believe in
monogamy, and 96 % said they don’t believe that cheating is okay even if one’s partner doesn’t find
out, nearly half—44.1%—have been unfaithful themselves. I did not interview every respondent;
however, based on the interviews I did conduct, as well as the explanatory section at the end of the
survey, most of those who were unfaithful were unfaithful during the first stages of their relationship,
after which time they realized that infidelity did not resolve their problems nor did it fulfill their
emotional needs.
Being exposed to parental infidelity provokes intense insecurity in children and adult children and thus
may create the need to resolve unfinished emotional business by engaging in the same pattern of
behavior. Many adult children whose parents had been unfaithful repeat the same behavior as a way
to act out, understand, and/or overcome what took place between their parents. So, although these
particular statistics tend to indicate a contradiction between respondents’ attitudes and their behavior,
it is my belief that their own unfaithfulness was an attempt to work through their feelings concerning
their parents’ infidelity.


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

bigtone128 said:


> You are right - I went to church today and there was a first communion and it made me sad because it reminded me of my two boys' first communions and how happy as a family we were then...but that was then and this is now...then I thought I didnt pull the plug she did and it is her responsibility to deal with. I can hold my head up and say I did what I could and thats what I could. Got a nice text from my oldest stating that you did what you could Dad but you cant control everything....touching to say the least..made me see the truth.


*Got a nice text from my oldest stating that you did what you could Dad but you cant control everything....touching to say the least..made me see the truth*

Hey BT,

Your oldest summed it up nicely. You cannot control her. Only your wife is responsible for her actions. You have nothing to be ashamed about.

But more importantly your child has told you that he sees her actions ( lying, cheating ) for what it is. That is all you really need to know.

Time to move on for you and your kids.

Enjoy what is left of your weekend.

HM64
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## bigtone128 (May 1, 2012)

Thanks Happyman - still a bit in shock but the support of those on this website has been extremely helpful. Especially when it comes to emotional support - it is nice to know when one is at their lowest - they are not alone. I am grateful this website is here....


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

BT,

I know you are still in shock.

Your wife not only blindsided you and deserted you but she also never gave you a reason.

Please remember, she does not have a good answer for you. No answer will excuse her actions. 

I always remind BS's that when a woman moves on and abandons her children at home there is seriously something wrong with her. Woman have built in maternal instincts to protect their children, to nurture them. It is totally contrary to her actions. Her secret meetings are so she does not have to face you or to try to keep her children from thinking that she abandoned them. 

Guess what, your oldest knows the truth and sees through her nonsense.

I hope you get over the shock in time and will find the strength to move on. 

You have your children so take comfort in them. You are still young and will find someone that does not have a screw loose.

Time is on your side!

HM64


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## bigtone128 (May 1, 2012)

Thanks for your support HM64 - it is appreciated. You'll never guess what happened tonight - she knows I am going to see a lawyer tomorrow AM for an uncontested divorce on the grounds of adultery. Out of the blue tonight I was told she is looking for one of the people who told me she was seeing someone and who saw her out on two occasions with the AP. Sounds like shes going to try to contest it on the grounds of adultery....I thought it was because she didnt want a divorce but my friend seems to think it is only because she does want it on record that she committed adultery...doesnt matter but I want it on record anyway....


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

No thankyou necessary. Stick to your guns.

Pretty weird that news coming out of the blue like that.

Make sure she is not spying on you. It has happened before. Just ask Kando.

Stay the course. You deserve better.

And she knows it!!!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## sharkeey (Apr 27, 2012)

bigtone128 said:


> Sounds like shes going to try to contest it on the grounds of adultery....I thought it was because she didnt want a divorce but my friend seems to think it is only because she does want it on record that she committed adultery...doesnt matter but I want it on record anyway....


That might be an expensive luxury that you don't need, or more aptly, you cannot afford to have.

You see, here's how it works in most states. 

If its a noncontested divorce, no reason is given for the divorce, and no "grounds" trial is needed, you skip right ahead to the rest of the issues.. custody, asset distribution, support, that sort of thing.

BUT, if one party is going to accuse the other of fault, in this case adultery, and the other is going to deny it, then it has to be proven, with evidence including testimony at a grounds trial which can cost 10s of thousands of dollars, span many months and in the end, short of good solid evidence and the costs to obtain it such as a PI, you are no closer to getting divorced than if you simply agreed there was no fault and just moved ahead with splitting all the stuff up.

It rarely pays to fight about anything in a divorce, especially just to "get it on record".

A good attorney will explain that to you during an initial consultation.


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## BigLiam (May 2, 2012)

Yes, check with your attoreny. As was said, no fault is the prevailing law in the majority of states.
But not in all ,and it can make a differnce in asset division etc in the states that consider fault.


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## bigtone128 (May 1, 2012)

Yeah, I found it weird coming out like that. I am from Canada and in Canada in most provinces there is a 1 year waiting separation period before a divorce can be granted. However, if there is adultery, this time period is waived and you can apply for immediate divorce - which is what I am going to do and she knows it. So I think she's either going to try to prevent me from doing that OR she's trying to get dirt on me and that's why shes trying to get a hold of this guy - to get dirt on me so that she can save face officially (i.e., he did that and that's why I slept around). But that would make no sense because in Canada there are no fault divorces and all post marital assets are split 50/50. So she has nothing to gain other than saving face (which she'll try to get information on me) or delaying the divorce or trying to salvage the marriage by trying to get this dude to say she never messed around. I know the truth though and she as much as said it and was seen dating this guy and spent night after night out overnight. In Canada, I don't have to prove actual infidelity and with whom - just the reasonable probability that an affair occurred.....


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

Sounds like a plan BT.

Move forward with it. Who cares what she is going to do to contest it.

The fact is she left. And has never looked back. I am surprised if she will really care since she has been gone for a while.

Move your life forward for you and your kids.

Just remember BT, your wife is a coward. You and your kids are seeing the actions of a coward.

Treat her like one.

Stand tall Buddy.

HM64
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## bigtone128 (May 1, 2012)

Thanks Happy - I was just out thinking about that - the fact that she never called me up and is still maneouvering behind the scenes speaks volumes about her character as a person.....a person I no longer wish to associate myself with....


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## Ben Connedfussed (May 4, 2012)

You are the one who is left to pick up the pieces. Adultery is a decision and if I ask you, you would more than likely say you preferred it not to happen. You are the innocent one. You did not make the choice, she did. She is the guilty party. All involved in the affair attempt to make the innocent spouse a target for 'their reason to have the affair' and place blame where blame (and shame) should not be. One does not refer to the definition 'innocent spouse' for nothing. I feel your hurt and pain. However, your feelings of guilt, they are unfounded. They, the cheaters are the guilty ones!!!


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## bigtone128 (May 1, 2012)

Thank you Ben for your message - it really helps me. I don't feel the guilt as much anymore because I see the decision to cheat as hers and hers alone...what I have difficulty believing in is karma...i'd like to think there is justice in the world and all I see is her and her boyfriend walsing around having a good time while I at home hurting..theres gotta be some form of justice for this


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

I don't understand it but there have been several threads in the last several months about long term marriages ending and the formerly loving wife turning Wicked Witch of the West. All without any indeication something was wrong but all of a suuden everything has been wrong for years. I really think it is some kind of mental illness.

As far as karma is concerned,wait a few months, you are going to be shocked more than ever how she looks and acts. I'll bet on it. It won't be pretty.


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## BigLiam (May 2, 2012)

chapparal said:


> I don't understand it but there have been several threads in the last several months about long term marriages ending and the formerly loving wife turning Wicked Witch of the West. All without any indeication something was wrong but all of a suuden everything has been wrong for years. I really think it is some kind of mental illness.
> 
> As far as karma is concerned,wait a few months, you are going to be shocked more than ever how she looks and acts. I'll bet on it. It won't be pretty.


Yes. there is a lot of this going on. I wonder how many look back years later and regret their behavior. 
My first XW, still, 18 years after she was busted, has never expressed remorse. What is it like to live with this?


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## bigtone128 (May 1, 2012)

Just heard an interesting take on my ex and how she is explaining her situation to her and our (some of my former friends since they totally sided with her) friends - she is saying that seeing she didnt start sleeping with the guy until the night she stormed out the door - she never actually cheated on me as we were separated after she walked out the door. She is saying she did the "noble" thing - told me she was leaving and then moving right in with the guy..........what a crock but once again got my head rolling into thinking maybe she's right...when does infidelity actually begin and if you are separated at the time you start sleeping with the AP is that an affair? I'm confused...In my mind, she is splitting hairs and set up the affair and was ready to go all she had to do was get rid of me...but where's her fidelity before this? I think she still did commit adultery.


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## snap (Oct 3, 2011)

Look, if she wasn't in affair, they wouldn't have slept the same night. They were obviously intimate and comfortable with each other already.


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## Davi (Apr 20, 2012)

ParachuteOn said:


> She is just trying to justify what she did by listing your "faults". Everyone has things they wish they would have done differently. Even maybe some regrets. Both spouses contribute to the marriage problems, but the decision to break the marital vow of fidelity was hers alone.
> 
> If she was so miserable, she could have simply filed for divorce and walked away, as countless others (with honor) have done.
> 
> Don't let her fool you. You are not responsible for her affair.


:iagree::iagree:


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## BigLiam (May 2, 2012)

bigtone128 said:


> Just heard an interesting take on my ex and how she is explaining her situation to her and our (some of my former friends since they totally sided with her) friends - she is saying that seeing she didnt start sleeping with the guy until the night she stormed out the door - she never actually cheated on me as we were separated after she walked out the door. She is saying she did the "noble" thing - told me she was leaving and then moving right in with the guy..........what a crock but once again got my head rolling into thinking maybe she's right...when does infidelity actually begin and if you are separated at the time you start sleeping with the AP is that an affair? I'm confused...In my mind, she is splitting hairs and set up the affair and was ready to go all she had to do was get rid of me...but where's her fidelity before this? I think she still did commit adultery.


I seriously doubt folks will beleive her(unless they are very low functioning). 
Even if it were true, she is still married and folks do not have the right to cheat just because of a fight. All couples fight.


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## bigtone128 (May 1, 2012)

Good news on the STD front - just got tests back from doctor and they are all negative...thank God...


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

BigLiam said:


> Yes. there is a lot of this going on. I wonder how many look back years later and regret their behavior.
> My first XW, still, 18 years after she was busted, has never expressed remorse. What is it like to live with this?


He will never get an apology. Remember, cheaters re-write the history of the marriage. That is their coping method for dealing with the guilt of what they did. In her mind, everything she is doing is his fault.

Then, to make it worse, the wayward will often go out and trash the BS to their friends and family to make sure this rewritten history is stamped in the BS's social arena. Pure cowardice.


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

bigtone128 said:


> Just heard an interesting take on my ex and how she is explaining her situation to her and our (some of my former friends since they totally sided with her) friends - she is saying that seeing she didnt start sleeping with the guy until the night she stormed out the door - she never actually cheated on me as we were separated after she walked out the door. She is saying she did the "noble" thing - told me she was leaving and then moving right in with the guy..........what a crock but once again got my head rolling into thinking maybe she's right...when does infidelity actually begin and if you are separated at the time you start sleeping with the AP is that an affair? I'm confused...In my mind, she is splitting hairs and set up the affair and was ready to go all she had to do was get rid of me...but where's her fidelity before this? I think she still did commit adultery.


You're married until the day that divorce decree is signed by a judge.

She cheated. Plain and simple. If your friends don't agree, tell them they are no longer your friends and to go to hell.


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## bigtone128 (May 1, 2012)

but somewhere within them is the truth do they ever reconcile their actions and their words to what actually happened?


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

bigtone128 said:


> but somewhere within them is the truth do they ever reconcile their actions and their words to what actually happened?


Sometimes... rarely. OutOfTheBlue's wife recently contacted him and expressed her remorse for destroying their marriage. Problem is, he had already moved on and no longer wants her back.

I think in your wife's case, somewhere down the line she will need someone she is in love with to cheat on her or betray her. Maybe then some trickle of empathy might make its way into her heart and she will look back on what she did to you with remorse. 

But don't hold out hope.

IMHO I think your wife checked out on you long ago brother... long before you ever knew anything was wrong. She was just waiting for an opportunity to bail, and the OM gave her that opportunity. Its called an exit affair. She's using the affair as an excuse to make everyone think you neglected her and drove her into another man's arms... a real pity circus where she has made you the clown.

This is the essential cowardice of the walkaway spouse... they never grant you the courtesy of proving to them that you can be the spouse they want you to be. Why? Because they do not know what they want, only that they no longer want you.


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## bigtone128 (May 1, 2012)

Thanks Bandit - I guess so - if my ex-wife contacted me I wouldnt take her back - but would like to talk to her at least to have a working relationship with our kids - problem is she feels so guilty for affair (I believe) she can't face me. SHe gave me cards saying she loved me two weeks before she left?? confusing. I believe she did check out on me a long time ago too - three years ago she had an emotional affair with one of my best friends, before that when i used talk about getting old with her - she'd say she's not getting old with me?? We seemed to be getting along fine i thought it was a phase that passed.


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

bigtone128 said:


> Thanks Bandit - I guess so - if my ex-wife contacted me I wouldnt take her back - but would like to talk to her at least to have a working relationship with our kids - problem is she feels so guilty for affair (I believe) she can't face me. SHe gave me cards saying she loved me two weeks before she left?? confusing. I believe she did check out on me a long time ago too - three years ago she had an emotional affair with one of my best friends, before that when i used talk about getting old with her - she'd say she's not getting old with me?? We seemed to be getting along fine i thought it was a phase that passed.


No she doesn't feel guilty about the affair. She's just pissed that you aren't going along with her very stupid lie she's trying to thriw around about her not being a cheat.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Ben Connedfussed (May 4, 2012)

bigtone128 said:


> Thank you Ben for your message - it really helps me. I don't feel the guilt as much anymore because I see the decision to cheat as hers and hers alone...what I have difficulty believing in is karma...i'd like to think there is justice in the world and all I see is her and her boyfriend walsing around having a good time while I at home hurting..theres gotta be some form of justice for this


Most often, the innocent party does feel the burden of guilt and shame, along with the hurt. I am glad you know different. But as far as karma... it is a given thing. Look at online statistics about cheaters and the odds of being in a successful relation on a long term basis. The OM or OW if not married will not see themselves as cheaters. Some do not even admit that they are committing adultery... only the married party is. That is wrong. Single one may be, but sleeping with a married person is committing adultery as well. In most of these relationships, prehaps a good 3 % go on to what develops into a long term relationship. When the starburst wears off, and things get into routine, it is a different story. They will be paranoid of each other. Suspicions will arise with the very question..."Can I trust this person I am with?" When the realization settles in that 'if they cheated with me, they can cheat on me' and along with guilt and the other emotions involved, these relationship fizzle. Starburst now, fizzle later. Patients, my friend. The old saying, "What comes around goes around!" Karma, if you will! I hope your pain can ease. Love has a way of finding those that truely love. Good luck.


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## bigtone128 (May 1, 2012)

Ben, I find your comments extremely helpful and kind - especially in these moments of extreme pain. For some reason, I needed to know that about karma....I need to know that everything is going to be alright with me and that the pain I feel (for nothing I've done) will be transferred back to its rightful owner....her.


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## Ben Connedfussed (May 4, 2012)

bigtone128 said:


> Ben, I find your comments extremely helpful and kind - especially in these moments of extreme pain. For some reason, I needed to know that about karma....I need to know that everything is going to be alright with me and that the pain I feel (for nothing I've done) will be transferred back to its rightful owner....her.


Some proverbs and quotes to live by...

Justice is delivered with a swift hand, so quickly that the receiver is unawares it is already in motion!

Karma ! What comes around goes around. The good shall be rewarded, while the evil shall have theirs returned, only to be stacked more so upon them with heavier burden!


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