# At the end of my rope.



## babyz (Feb 2, 2012)

A little under 2 years ago I got caught in a PA that I thought would have cost me my marriage. 

For 2 years I have paid every price known to man to get back as much trust as possible and to rebuild our relationship. 

The price I paid included having a completely open book to serve as proof I was not cheating. Everything was wide open and I stayed true to my word. No cheating.

What started as a daily endless stream of crying and hate turned (slowly over time) into a weekly taunting Q&A over the most simple and innocent things (like the fact that I misstated how much money I had in my wallet - or why one pair or underwear and socks were in the laundry room). 

Finally I had enough. I have been in therapy for 2 years and even my therapist thinks I have to put my foot down and stop her insanity. 

I believe I am now enabling her suspicious behavior by allowing her to continue to question me like a criminal suspect.

We have 2 kids in elementary school. She has a good job. I have a solid job too. We have all the middle class stuff (cars, house, dogs, etc...). 

I have reached a point where I believe the marriage is over. I just don't feel it any more. I blew up over the last few inquisitions and told her that I was considering a separation. She boo-hooed me into staying but I am soooo unhappy now because 1) I feel I will never improve on the level of trust we have today, and 2) I am constantly plagued by fear that when she is calling or when she says "can I ask you something", it's going to be another blatant accusation.

I can't live like this. I want a separation to see if forced independence will help her put a little more trust in me. But if she can't, I must move on, No?


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## CandieGirl (Apr 27, 2011)

You just don't feel it anymore...why prolong this? Maybe a separation would help, but honestly, if you're already checked out of the marriage, end it already.


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## 2sick (Nov 5, 2010)

babyz said:


> A little under 2 years ago I got caught in a PA that I thought would have cost me my marriage.
> 
> For 2 years I have paid every price known to man to get back as much trust as possible and to rebuild our relationship.
> 
> ...


Fascinating..You NOW feel like you don't have it any more? You didn't have it anymore when you decided to cheat on your wife two years ago!!! When you can stick your D!ck in another woman, kiss her and probably say you "love her" ...You no longer have ANYTHING for your wife. Why would she trust you? I would wonder too why underwear is a place is shouldn't be. You broke every bond of trust and you expect her to accept what you say...too late for that...especially if what you say is questionable.


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

At some point though, there has to be progress in healing. Otherwise it's best for both of them to face the reality that it's not going to work, and just end it. It's not her fault if she can't move past it, but it's not doing her any good either to stay in that toxic environment.

C
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## TRy (Sep 14, 2011)

PBear said:


> At some point though, there has to be progress in healing. Otherwise it's best for both of them to face the reality that it's not going to work, and just end it. It's not her fault if she can't move past it, but it's not doing her any good either to stay in that toxic environment.


 Yes but less than 2 years is not too long for her to still have serious issues with it. The fact that the cheater is already wanting to end the marraige tells me that this has been building up over time; thus the cheater stopped showing remorse (if they ever really did show remorse) a long time ago. Without remorse, the healing process ended and the healing of the DS was delayed.

Sounds like the cheater is a delayed rub sweeper to me.


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## FrankKissel (Nov 14, 2011)

TRy said:


> Yes but less than 2 years is not too long for her to still have serious issues with it. The fact that the cheater is already wanting to end the marraige tells me that this has been building up over time; thus the cheater stopped showing remorse (if they ever really did show remorse) a long time ago. Without remorse, the healing process ended and the healing of the DS was delayed.
> 
> Sounds like the cheater is a delayed rub sweeper to me.


Disagree.
I take no issue with her still having trust issues. She owes him nothing in that regard.
But at the same token, he has no obligation to live in an intolerable environment, even if it's of his own creation. He owes her sincere remorse and an apology. That's all.

If she can't get past his infidelity - and, again, she's under no obligation to do so - then it's best they part ways than suffer in a mutually unpleasant situation.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

TRy said:


> Yes but less than 2 years is not too long for her to still have serious issues with it. The fact that the cheater is already wanting to end the marraige tells me that this has been building up over time; thus the cheater stopped showing remorse (if they ever really did show remorse) a long time ago. Without remorse, the healing process ended and the healing of the DS was delayed.
> 
> Sounds like the cheater is a delayed rub sweeper to me.


Well, I haven't been in this situation, and don't know what the OP's situation truly is. But I would have expected that by the time two years has elapsed, there should be relatively significant progress to rebuilding the marriage. If there isn't signs that things are recovering by then, then I'd say that it's time to consider letting go.

C


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## TRy (Sep 14, 2011)

PBear said:


> Well, I haven't been in this situation, and don't know what the OP's situation truly is. But I would have expected that by the time two years has elapsed, there should be relatively significant progress to rebuilding the marriage. If there isn't signs that things are recovering by then, then I'd say that it's time to consider letting go.


 I agree. The issue is has the OP really shown remorse? It does not sound like it to me. That being said, if it is not meant to be so be it, but do not try to blame the BS if the OP has not really given the BS a chance to heal.

@PBear: Much progress has in fact been made over the less than 2 years. In the OP's own words "What started as a daily endless stream of crying and hate turned (slowly over time) into a weekly taunting Q&A". It went from daily to weekly, which in my book is progress but in the rub sweepers eyes it is not fast enough. The cheater cannot take it being brought up even once a week? Really? Is once a week too much this shortly after the affair? Should the betrayed spouse be asked to completely trust him and shut up about it this early in the healing process. Is that really reasonable?

All of you should also remember we are only hearing the cheaters side of things as it relates to their betrayed spouse. You should all know better than to trust that as being fair and accurate. He is back to the blame shifting that he used to justify his cheating in the first place.



babyz said:


> For 2 years I have paid every price known to man to get back as much trust as possible and to rebuild our relationship.
> 
> The price I paid included having a completely open book to serve as proof I was not cheating. Everything was wide open and I stayed true to my word. No cheating.


 Transparency and almost 2 years of not cheating on your wife is not paying "every price known to man". No applause is due you for what many people practice every day in their marriages. There has been no cheating in my marraige yet we both practice complete transparency and do not think twice about it. Openness and transparency is not really that big a deal unless you are a cheater.


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## appleye (Feb 3, 2012)

Babyz, I am going to look at this without judgment. It is a tough time for you and your wife. Why don't you both just sit down and have a serious talk. Weigh things. If you both decide to stay married and work on the relationship, then there needs to be understanding of what to expect on both sides. Minus any nastiness. If you both just can't work it out, then you would both in the long run be happier by divorcing. This is all easier said than done. But it can be done. Best wishes to you and your family.


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## DanF (Sep 27, 2010)

appleye said:


> Babyz, I am going to look at this without judgment. It is a tough time for you and your wife. Why don't you both just sit down and have a serious talk. Weigh things. If you both decide to stay married and work on the relationship, then there needs to be understanding of what to expect on both sides. Minus any nastiness. If you both just can't work it out, then you would both in the long run be happier by divorcing. This is all easier said than done. But it can be done. Best wishes to you and your family.


Nailed it.
Sometimes it's not repairable.
See my stories. It isn't easy.


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## babyz (Feb 2, 2012)

Thank you all for the replies. I must discount the responses that assume facts that don't exist and there remain a lot of good thoughts here. I'm not justifying my actions and yes, I did check out emotionally (to some degree) before I cheated. I was unhappy about a lot of what was going on in the marriage. Of course there is a lot more to the story that I can surer arise here. A few highlights... We spent the first few years very happy together. We then dealt with the premature death of her father and then about 6years of infertility treatments before we had our kids. Those periods were very difficult emotionally for the both of us. None of you know me so it's hard to see how much love and support I gave to my wife during those periods. Nor does anyone here know me well enough to understand that I am and have been a totally devoted husband with the exception of the affair. I put up with a lot of lying (hers) and blame shifting and attacks on my inability to do what she wants when she wants it. Believe me, I was not looking for an affair and the roots of it are a combination of lack of feeling loved at home (and resulting feelings of self worthlessness) and some one who came along and put me on a pedestal. But that's not my excuse for not divorcing first. That contemplation was there for a few years before I cheated. I'm weak. I was looking to ease the transition out of the marriage with this distraction. I wanted motivation to get out of a place that made me unhappy. I felt mistreated every day. The affair served as that motivation. Throughout the affair I swung from wanting to end it to wanting to somehow save the marriage. I tried in vain before the affair to get her into couples therapy. Her opinion was that no one could ever understand what she was going through. After the affair we did about 4 sessions with a therapist and she hated it. We left every session with no results or improvement. 

In thinking about another of the comments here, I agree the has been improvement. But just not enough. Having a pair of underpants and socks in the laundry room or a pair of jeans in the garage is not "not where they are supposed to be". That's exactly where they are supposed to be. No. It's the long string on innocent events that are construed as suspicious that hurts the most. Just imagine for a moment that you committed a crime and you had to serve time in jail... And the whole time you are in jail, all people tell you is that you will probably go back to a life of crime at some point... Or if you are a young adult, a "c" student, and you start getting "a's" for the last 2 years, and your parents keep telling you that you will amount to nothing. that you were a failure and their opinion has not changed. Imaging this goes on week after week for two years and you are still made to feel like a loser. 

There has to be a point where the offended person decides to let it go. I could deal with an occasional question about something that looks suspicious. An order for flowers, a receipt for a necklace that was not given to her..l. But last week she said, did you get something from your mom for Christmas? I said no, I don't think so. She said You're a liar! So I called my mom right there and asked her and put the answer on speaker phone. Truth, I had extra money in my wallet because i went to the bank and forgot to tell my wife by accident. And it was in my wallet, and not squirreled away in a pocket of my briefcase or in the glove box of my car. It was less than suspicious. It was obviously innocent. Another time she said I want to know why you keep random changes of clothes in your car. I had no idea what she was talking about. She said you "had" jeans, a t short, black socks and underwear in your car. I checked and there was nothing in my car.. She said, no not now, it's in the laundry room now. I said what made you thing I had that stuff in my car? She said, it was only one pair of black socks, black underwear and jeans. It dawned on me that those items were in the light clothes and I sorted them out before washing them. It's a long line of false accusations that have me at the end of my rope... For what it's worth.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## babyz (Feb 2, 2012)

TRy said:


> I agree. The issue is has the OP really shown remorse? It does not sound like it to me. That being said, if it is not meant to be so be it, but do not try to blame the BS if the OP has not really given the BS a chance to heal.
> 
> @PBear: Much progress has in fact been made over the less than 2 years. In the OP's own words "What started as a daily endless stream of crying and hate turned (slowly over time) into a weekly taunting Q&A". It went from daily to weekly, which in my book is progress but in the rub sweepers eyes it is not fast enough. The cheater cannot take it being brought up even once a week? Really? Is once a week too much this shortly after the affair? Should the betrayed spouse be asked to completely trust him and shut up about it this early in the healing process. Is that really reasonable?
> 
> ...


Yes, I overstated the price I paid. But if you have not experienced infidelity, you really won't understand the whole picture. Your is better than mine and I am admittedly flawed.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## babyz (Feb 2, 2012)

Maybe I'm running on at this point and maybe it's pointless to try to get help here, but I re-read this stuff and I see where the whole story can never be fully told and so the right answer probably does not exist.

My wife does not want to end it. We have had several serious discussions and they all end the same way... she cries about me wanting to leave and begs me not to. In the recent months she has made promises not to question me as much. My therapist told me to tell her to "stop it" when she gets to uaunting me and indirectly questioning me. Like last night. I had planned to go out with some people from work and she called and told me they found a lump in her breast and that she was freaking out. SO I stayed out for a few minutes (just long enough to explain that I needed to head out because I had something to take care of) then I went home. She embarked on a long line of questions - basically saying, I don't understand why you came home early. I told her I did that because I knew she was freakling out and I wanted to be there for her. She alluded to the fact that maybe in fact my plans were cancelled and I was not telling her. I asked her if she was referring to another woman or something and she said I dont know, it just does not make sense. 
So as I said before, it's the little innocent and sometimes irrelevant things that are getting called out. 
Listen, a BIG part of me wants to stay. I love my wife. But I question if I am passionately in love with her. The passion is impossible to achieve when I'm getting hammered weekly about this or that. The passion is hard to achieve in the face of accusations. Meanwhile she is making an effort to get herself back on track emotionally and physically. Losing weight, daily exercise, eating right. She still has self esteem issues that I believe I caused by way of the affair. But I am giving her time. She made a commitment to stop bringing it up all the time and although she has not done a great job keeping her word, I know she is trying. 
And like I said earlier, I have become conditioned to resent her accusations as failures and reminders that I have failed her in this marriage. When she accuses me of having random clothes in my car, it hurts. When she shows that she still does not trust me I feel like I continue to fail to achieve having built any trust.
And it's not the frequency of her accusations at this point. It's my failure to accept that this may be the way it goes on forever more if we stay married. And that's why I am at the end of my rope. It's because I do not know if I can go on branded as a cheater for life.
On the flip side is divorce. And with that there is a whole new world of pain and suffering and damage to the kids and financial upheval and families get involved and bitterness grown and more accusations fly, and explainations are insufficient... no wonder some people choose to eat a bullet to escape the mental pain they go through after an affair. That's not my solution - but I get it.


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## tacoma (May 1, 2011)

2sick said:


> Fascinating..You NOW feel like you don't have it any more? You didn't have it anymore when you decided to cheat on your wife two years ago!!! When you can stick your D!ck in another woman, kiss her and probably say you "love her" ...You no longer have ANYTHING for your wife. Why would she trust you? I would wonder too why underwear is a place is shouldn't be. You broke every bond of trust and you expect her to accept what you say...too late for that...especially if what you say is questionable.


Actually his wife should have left him at the time if she couldn`t forgive him.

Sure he ****ed up bad but sooner or later the BS has to move on as it`s not healthy for anyone.

Do you think living in this kind of relationship is healthy for anyone in his family?
At this point she has the problem and it`s understandable if she can`t get over it BUT she`s the one who chose to reconcile and she isn`t reconciling.

OP, I`d leave, 2 years is long enough.


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## TRy (Sep 14, 2011)

tacoma said:


> At this point she has the problem and it`s understandable if she can`t get over it BUT she`s the one who chose to reconcile and she isn`t reconciling.


 She will never get over it completely. No betrayed spouse ever does. The goal of reconciliation is not for her to get over it but for them to learn to live with it. Which she is clearly making progress at. Her bringing it up only once a week and still having trust issues after only two years is reasonable. His desire for her to rug sweep it and not bring it up again is not. Also, she was not the only one that chose reconciliation. He chose it too. Since it is normal for reconciliation to take as long as 5 years, he has no right to try to blame her for not healing fast enough. But since the OP is an expert at blame shifting, he will continue to use this as yet another excuse to make his wife into the bad guy and himself as the victim. 

The OP’s clear blame shifting on the affair and lack of remorse makes reconciliation difficult for the betrayed spouse. Reading what the OP said to us about the cause of the affair and you can see how his wife would have issues with reconciliation if he is saying the same things to her. For example, in rationalizing and making excuses for his affair he stated “I was not looking for an affair and the roots of it are a combination of lack of feeling loved at home (and resulting feelings of self worthlessness) and some one who came along and put me on a pedestal. But that's not my excuse for not divorcing first. That contemplation was there for a few years before I cheated. I'm weak. I was looking to ease the transition out of the marriage with this distraction. I wanted motivation to get out of a place that made me unhappy. I felt mistreated every day. The affair served as that motivation. Throughout the affair I swung from wanting to end it to wanting to somehow save the marriage. I tried in vain before the affair to get her into couples therapy.” As you can see, according to the OP he was not looking for an affair it was his wife’s fault for not making him feel loved while this other women put him on a pedestal, and for not going to MC when he asked. According to the OP the affair was only a “distraction” that would serve as a “motivation” to divorce his unloving wife. Talk about no remorse. Also lacking in any of his posts is any compassion toward his wife for the hurt that he has caused her with the affair.

If the OP wants to speed up reconciliation, he should try showing real and unconditional remorse for his affair, and compassion for his wife’s feelings. Any delay of her healing is all on the OP and not on his wife.


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## MsStressed (Feb 5, 2012)

I have been in your wife's situation and it's not nice. I went from being a very trusting person, to someone who was plagued and tormented about my first husbands affairs and the worry he would do it again. And I was right to worry - he did.

If you think your wife is over anyway - it would be kinder to your wife to split up - less mental torture and pain over the long term that way. And if there is the slightest chance that you may have another affair, split up with her before you do. Trying to get over one affair is bad enough - once there is more it is impossible, and she doesn't deserve to have to go through that pain.

If you want your marriage to improve, you really need to be honest and open with your wife all the time, then she won't feel the need to question your every move. It is your affair and her willingness to give you a second chance that has caused her behaviour.


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## I'mInLoveWithMyHubby (Nov 7, 2011)

If your wife doesn't want to end it, you at least owe it to her to keep trying a little longer for her to heal. You both will have to sit down and set rules. After all, you did cheat on her. I'm assuming it's taking longer then 2 years to heal. 

My husband and I do have 100% transparency. If he cheated, I'd leave. I wouldn't give a second chance and he is well aware of it. My ex husband cheated and I left immediately. I would not have the power to trust. I'm not one to harp on others either about anything, especially the past. I like a peaceful life and that is what we have. 

Good luck!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## babyzee (Feb 20, 2012)

I'm not in agreement with TRy for a couple of reasons and most are due to "my" lack of clarity in expressing the circumstances. Perhaps I should have told more stories about how I bought a new plant every month for the house. About how I stopped all but the most critical business travel. About how I provided passwords and access to 100% of my communications methods. About how I freely and honestly answered every question, every time, and without reservation or hesitation. ABout all the one on one time I set aside. About all the great vacations and trips we went on afterward. Look. I can sit here and rattle off for hours all the unconditional love notes, poems, and all the things I did to show my wife that I am sorry for what I did.
I am not perfect and I have proven how imperfect I have been in this relationship. I did not use her EA 7 years ago as an excuse. I told the story the way it happened. My wife made me feel worthless for a long time and when the opportunity arose I stupidly allowed myself to have a PA. Worse, I cannot unring the bell. But now, 2 years later, we still have weekly bouts of evidence-less ongoing infidelity. Granted, the stress of discovering the affair is huge. I get that. But that stress has developed into some sort of delusional paranoia. Delusional - there is no hard evidence of an affair and yet she insists there must be one going on. And despite absolute proof to the contrary, she contuinues to believe that there is or will be an affair, now, sooner, or later. Yes, there was an affair. No, there is not one now. 
And before the hitmen show up to shoot me down (blame me for triggering these delusions in the first place) - I give up! You are correct. I caused the delusions. And I have tried hard to fix this without success.

For those who want to simply hop on and bash me for doing what I did, or who want to read into what I am saying and tell me what they believe am feeling or thinking - allow me to be a little preemptive. You are right. I screwed up big time and I am paying the price. It's the price of experience. It's not bought for a song. It's bought with all that I have. And I continue to pay that price.

Each time I make another effort to show my wife how much I love her and want this to get better, those actions are met with (first) acceptance, then (later) skepticism. Rightfully I might add. I understand fully the lack of trust, the hurt and anger she feels. 

What I don't get is when she conjures up these fantasies where I am doing it now and the proof is the fact that I have money in my wallet or clothes in the laundry room. 

Yes, I cheated. Yes, I'm an ass for doing so. Yes, I promised not to do it again.


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

I think you're starting to understand the emotional hell she is living through. 

It's not that she is wanting to make this so hard - she is emotionally broken and can't escape the ongoing emotional torment she is living with in her own head day.


Has she tried personal therapy to help find the skills in herself to start rebuilding herself?

Have you tried therapy as well to help you find the strength to be there for her ?


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## CruxAve (Dec 30, 2011)

You have no idea the mind f**k you have given your wife. Where would you be if the roles were reversed?


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## CH (May 18, 2010)

2 years, pshhhh, that's nothing. My wife didn't stop being the prison warden until about 4 years later.

And even now she will innocently need to look at my phone or need to use my computer when I'm logged on my e-mail. But I humor her because I have nothing to hide so she can look at she wants and question me all she wants.

Yes it can get annoying and set you on edge but guess what, she didn't spread her legs for another man. How would you feel if she did?


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