# an act of rebellion



## boxed in (Mar 3, 2015)

I just did something really dumb and I wish I could take it back. My little boy was invited to a birthday party for a classmate, but my wife was dead set against it. Rather then just telling the mother we couldn't attend, I told the mother the truth as to why my son could not attend the party; I explained that due to jealousy and paranoia, my wife doesn't want my son to attend the party. I begged the mother to understand and to please not say a word to anyone about what I just explained to her. She was nice enough to seemingly understand the predicament I was in. I felt guilty, and let my guard down, and now I realize I just should have kept my mouth shut. My son was being denied an opportunity to attend his friend's party because my wife's pettiness. I know if she found out what I said, I would be in big trouble. Our relationship is already rocky, but I was angry that she couldn't get over her personal enmity and paranoia. I know that I did this because my wife is also a control freak who tries to control my feelings and what I say, and as a result it was my way of trying to free myself of the lunacy I have to deal with. There are other major issues that I have to contend with in my marriage, so I am thinking I did this as an act of rebellion against her. What do you think?


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## norajane (Feb 7, 2012)

If that's the case, you were being passive-aggressive. Instead of dealing with the issue directly, you did something deliberately to hurt her behind her back.

What is your wife "jealous and paranoid" about that would cause her to keep her son from attending a kid's party? Does she have issues with you and the mom of the kid who is throwing the party?


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## Chris Taylor (Jul 22, 2010)

Rebellion? Probably not. Should you have told the other mother? No. That stuff should stay in the family (or with a marriage counselor).


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## boxed in (Mar 3, 2015)

yes, in her mind she believes I am cheating on her with this woman and it isn't true.


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## samyeagar (May 14, 2012)

boxed in said:


> yes, in her mind she believes I am cheating on her with this woman and it isn't true.


...aaaaaaaand here we go.........

Soooo...where on earth would she get that idea? I'm assuming your behaviour with this other woman has been completely above reproach?


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## boxed in (Mar 3, 2015)

It is completely beyond reproach. We both have sons in the same classroom and it is completely plutonic. Unfortunately, my wife thinks I have affairs with every woman who has ever talked to me. She is always impugning my integrity. i am gregarious whereas my wife is suspicious of most people.


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## Catherine602 (Oct 14, 2010)

It's a betrayal. You realize the effect this has on how people in your community will look at you? A disloyal, blabbering husband who can't hold it together enough to protect his family from exposure and possible hostility. This woman has no reason to be loyal to you and even less to your wife now that you revealed her private feelings. 

You gave a stranger ammunition to damage your son and your wife and any other of your children in the community. If other parents get wind of this, their children will too. What effect will that have on your son and his social relationships in school. You gave a stranger permission to hurt your wife by spreading tales about her mental state. In essence, you are the enemy of your wife and family and they don't know it. 

You are not thinking strait and you and your family need help. Think about the state of mind of a father and husband who would share such a thing about his personal life and about people that he should protect. This relationship has gotten you into a state that is making you do unreasonable things. You must get help now.


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## boxed in (Mar 3, 2015)

You are so right, that was passive aggressive. I don't like confronting people and that is one of my flaws.


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

I think people engage in PA behavior because they do not feel safe being direct. Why do you not feel safe with her, OP?


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## boxed in (Mar 3, 2015)

what is OP?


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

boxed in said:


> what is OP?


You.


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## boxed in (Mar 3, 2015)

well, that really helps


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## LongWalk (Apr 4, 2013)

Wrong to expose your wife.

Do you feel that marrying her was a mistake?


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## norajane (Feb 7, 2012)

boxed in said:


> You are so right, that was passive aggressive. I don't like confronting people and that is one of my flaws.


You're going to have to do something about that if you ever want to find peace, with or without your wife. Have you ever gone to counseling to figure out why you have trouble confronting people? Figuring that out might go some way to helping you stand up for yourself.

Bottom line - if your wife is controlling, paranoid, and is making your life miserable, you have to stand up for yourself and your son and let her know when she is out of line and that you won't accept it. Your other option is to try to get her in marriage counseling so you can speak up in a "safe" environment with a counselor who can help you both communicate and try to resolve some of your issues. If that fails, then you can divorce. Or you can do nothing and nothing will change.

If you can't bring yourself to do anything, keep in mind that the dynamic you and your wife have is the marriage dynamic your son will learn is "normal," which means he might end up in the same situation you are in one day.


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## norajane (Feb 7, 2012)

boxed in said:


> well, that really helps


OP means Original Poster, the person who started the thread.


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## boxed in (Mar 3, 2015)

We have created an unbelievably beautiful son, so I cannot say it was a mistake. Beyond that, we do not fulfill each other's emotional and spiritual needs.


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## Chris Taylor (Jul 22, 2010)

So why are you still married?????


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## boxed in (Mar 3, 2015)

You know, our son is stronger than both of us combined. My wife and I are deeply flawed. She suffers from a personality disorder, and I suffered abuse of my own as a child, and I think that is part of the reason why I am passive aggressive


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

boxed in said:


> You know, our son is stronger than both of us combined. My wife and I are deeply flawed. She suffers from a personality disorder, and I suffered abuse of my own as a child, and I think that is part of the reason why I am passive aggressive


I am sure that is true. It feels too scary to confront her directly.

And yet that is what you need to do.


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## boxed in (Mar 3, 2015)

Chris, you are right to ask that question. It is difficult to leave a child that I love more then anything else in the world.


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## boxed in (Mar 3, 2015)

I have confronted her many times, but when a person has a personality disorder, they cannot accept when they are wrong, and people with PO will never go to counselling, and even if they do, it is near impossible to cure


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## John Lee (Mar 16, 2013)

boxed in said:


> yes, in her mind she believes I am cheating on her with this woman and it isn't true.


Haha, well a good way to prove your wife is wrong is to GO BEHIND YOUR WIFE'S BACK TO THE WOMAN AND SAY SHE'S CRAZY AND PARANOID. You're already being disloyal to your wife, so cheating is just a stop or two away on the same train. Well done sir, bravo.


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

boxed in said:


> I have confronted her many times, but when a person has a personality disorder, they cannot accept when they are wrong, and people with PO will never go to counselling, and even if they do, it is near impossible to cure


You can tell her No, and maintain that No. I think she would back down if you did that.

You need some confidence in yourself. You also need to make sure your boundaries are reasonable.

What you cannot do is look for approval from her.


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## Cletus (Apr 27, 2012)

You should have told your wife that your son was going to the party and that she could pound sand if she didn't like it. 

Try that next time. You'll live through it, I promise.


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## Cletus (Apr 27, 2012)

CincyBluesFan said:


> Dude, you F'd up big time. Your wife always comes first. You're always on her side even when you disagree with her. Her enemies are your enemies and vice versa. I hope for your sake she doesn't find out about this betrayal.


That advice doesn't work when you're dealing with someone's mental illness. Down that road lies madness. You don't have to broadcast to the neighborhood the problem, but you can't reasonably support unrealistic paranoia either.


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## SamuraiJack (May 30, 2014)

Man, you cant write this stuff...


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

CincyBluesFan said:


> Dude, you F'd up big time. Your wife always comes first. You're always on her side even when you disagree with her. Her enemies are your enemies and vice versa. I hope for your sake she doesn't find out about this betrayal.


But if her enemies are everyone?

He needs to say No when necessary and stick to it. He does not have to be mean or use bad language. He just has to remain firm.


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## CincyBluesFan (Feb 27, 2015)

Cletus said:


> That advice doesn't work when you're dealing with someone's mental illness. Down that road lies madness. You don't have to broadcast to the neighborhood the problem, but you can't reasonably support unrealistic paranoia either.


I guess if we're talking about diagnosed mental illness. Is that the case or is this the hubby's diagnosis?


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## Cletus (Apr 27, 2012)

CincyBluesFan said:


> I guess if we're talking about diagnosed mental illness. Is that the case or is this the hubby's diagnosis?


Doesn't matter. If the husband is well and truly not having an affair with this woman, and is not acting as if he is to a reasonable observer, then she's paranoid and wrong, diagnosed or not. It doesn't have to rise to the level of a diagnosed mental illness.

A lot of ifs there, of course.


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## Mr. Nail (Apr 26, 2011)

boxed in said:


> I am thinking I did this as an act of rebellion against her. What do you think?


This is what I think: You have been a Turtle too long. You have some pretty good armor and it's keeping you going no matter how much you get kicked around. But just like a turtle you got backed into a corner. the tormentor went too far. Probably because your son was hurt this time. So you stuck your neck out there and bit the first handy finger. Was this rebellion or self protection or something else?

I think it was very much like me telling a waiter that my wife want's no bell peppers in her food. Just passing on important information to smooth out the situation. Sure you could have used nicer words. But for a turtle you didn't do too bad.

The trouble is this: Being a turtle isn't working for you. Most of the advice you have been getting is to stop being passive (turtle) and start communicating effectively.

Let me put it another way. Much of your pain is because she believes you are unfaithful. Her belief in something that isn't real is a problem to the relationship. Here's the kicker, you also believe in something that isn't true. You believe you can't stand up to her. You have a dozen horrific scenarios of what she is going to do if you just send the kid to the party with another dad, all cooked up in your mind. Now sit down and think about how likely it really is that she will actually do any of them. And, ten x 10% does not equal 100%. It's actually most likely that she will be upset and sulk a bit. You can handle that. 

So sorry to burst your bubble you are not yet a rebel. But the turtle learned to use his snapper so you are more dangerous than you were. Better get in control* of yourself*. 
MN


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## boxed in (Mar 3, 2015)

I was dead wrong to do this, and the more I think about it, the more guilty I feel. It was an act of retaliation, not rebellion, and it was passive aggressive. I did it without thinking either, I felt an impulse to do it without thinking of the consequences.


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## boxed in (Mar 3, 2015)

You are wrong. There is a distinction between being disloyal and being unfaithful.


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## Happilymarried25 (Mar 19, 2014)

Your wife is wrong (and a little crazy too) you were wrong, but as long as the women keeps what you said to her to herself I don't see how your wife is going find out and go ballistic. I wouldn't worry about it.


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## CincyBluesFan (Feb 27, 2015)

boxed in said:


> I was dead wrong to do this, and the more I think about it, the more guilty I feel. It was an act of retaliation, not rebellion, and it was passive aggressive. I did it without thinking either, I felt an impulse to do it without thinking of the consequences.


Your admission of this is a great testament of your character. Too many people let pride get in the way and end up destroying their relationships.

Your wife always comes first. Her enemies are your enemies. If she has emotional problems you're there for her to help her work through. In my best Don Vito Corleone voice I'll say "never go against the family."


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## John Lee (Mar 16, 2013)

boxed in said:


> You are wrong. There is a distinction between being disloyal and being unfaithful.


Many affairs begin with complaining about a wife to another woman. I don't actually know anything else about your relationship with this other mom, but the fact that you chose to do this, to confide in her at the expense of your wife, makes me wonder if your wife is being a little less paranoid than you say -- maybe there are some vibes between you and the other woman and your wife is picking up on it.


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## John Lee (Mar 16, 2013)

boxed in said:


> It is completely beyond reproach. We both have sons in the same classroom and it is completely plutonic. Unfortunately, my wife thinks I have affairs with every woman who has ever talked to me. She is always impugning my integrity. i am gregarious whereas my wife is suspicious of most people.


Do you ever socialize the woman outside of running into her at school? Where is it that you're being "gregarious" with her?


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## yeah_right (Oct 23, 2013)

boxed in said:


> It is completely beyond reproach. We both have sons in the same classroom and it is completely plutonic. Unfortunately, my wife thinks I have affairs with every woman who has ever talked to me. She is always impugning my integrity. *i am gregarious *whereas my wife is suspicious of most people.


What is your definition of gregarious? With the mom in question, do you phone, text, email, etc. beyond school issues? Do you confide in each other on things beyond the classroom, such as your marriages? Well, yes you do since you confided the problem to this woman. Do you flirt with this mom, call her hot, sexy, etc? Do you touch or hug her?

Many an EA/PA have started from platonic...

But let's just say you have been a paragon of fidelity. Telling the other mom that was bad form. You need to tell your wife so the next time that woman looks at her funny, she doesn't think it's because she's sleeping with you.


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## boxed in (Mar 3, 2015)

CincyBluesFan said:


> Your admission of this is a great testament of your character. Too many people let pride get in the way and end up destroying their relationships.
> 
> Your wife always comes first. Her enemies are your enemies. If she has emotional problems you're there for her to help her work through. In my best Don Vito Corleone voice I'll say "never go against the family."



I must bear that in mind and learn to think before I speak.


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## boxed in (Mar 3, 2015)

John Lee said:


> Many affairs begin with complaining about a wife to another woman. I don't actually know anything else about your relationship with this other mom, but the fact that you chose to do this, to confide in her at the expense of your wife, makes me wonder if your wife is being a little less paranoid than you say -- maybe there are some vibes between you and the other woman and your wife is picking up on it.


I can tell you with complete candor that I have no interest in ever cheating on her. My wife does suffer from PD, and part of that is the belief that I cheat on her with every woman I have come in contact with. I waited a long time to get married and have children, so cheating was never a part of the equation.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Boxed in, can you tell us more about your interactions with this other woman? Do you just say short brief hello goodbye to her? Have you shared anything else personal with her? Or socialize outside of seeing her briefly when you pickup or drop off you
r son?


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## boxed in (Mar 3, 2015)

yeah_right said:


> What is your definition of gregarious? With the mom in question, do you phone, text, email, etc. beyond school issues? Do you confide in each other on things beyond the classroom, such as your marriages? Well, yes you do since you confided the problem to this woman. Do you flirt with this mom, call her hot, sexy, etc? Do you touch or hug her?
> 
> Many an EA/PA have started from platonic...
> 
> But let's just say you have been a paragon of fidelity. Telling the other mom that was bad form. You need to tell your wife so the next time that woman looks at her funny, she doesn't think it's because she's sleeping with you.


No, none of that. My son and her son play at the park and we talk, but nothing personal. I have no interest in ever cheating.
I am a pretty decent guy, and just like anyone else, I do have my shortcomings. Blurting out the truth to people I don't know very well is one of those shortcomings.


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## boxed in (Mar 3, 2015)

EleGirl said:


> Boxed in, can you tell us more about your interactions with this other woman? Do you just say short brief hello goodbye to her? Have you shared anything else personal with her? Or socialize outside of seeing her briefly when you pickup or drop off you
> r son?


Her son and my son played together in school, and then at the park after school. I call her or she has called me to make play dates, nothing else. And just small talk when we are at the park. There is nothing to infer, there is no attraction, I just want my son to play with children his own age. I have done this with other parents as well.


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## cons (Aug 13, 2013)

Wow- I hope you realize, given what you've told us of your wife and her disorder, how cruel your actions were in confiding with this other woman.

It is disrespectful even for a woman that doesn't have to deal with a personality disorder. But then, knowing that in this area, extra care should be taken, you are careless about her feelings and instead of wanting to take care of the union you act in a way to "get back at her". Talk about kicking someone where it hurts...


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## Flying_Dutchman (Oct 29, 2014)

I'm not condoning what the OP did but there's something far worse being missed/ignored here.


If thd TRUTH is that the OP's kid can't go to the party for the reasons given by the OP (his paranoid wife suspecting an affair) what is the OP's kid being told is the reason? Presumably, not the truth since the truth would embarass his (paranoid) mom. Then, he'd likely tell the party kid and party kid's mom would hear it from him rather than from the OP.


No,, OP's kid has been told a LIE as to why he can't go,, and probably told to tell this (or another) LIE to party kid when the kid asks him why he didn't come to the party,, as a kid typically would.


I'm less alarmed by the OP blabbing to the OW about his 'crazy' wife than I am by the fact that, by pandering to her 'paranoia',, the kid misses out on a party,, is lied to about why and is put in the awkward position of telling that lie to his friend.

Pandering to the whims of a paranoid partner is one thing,, but when those whims interfere with a kid's harmless leisure and peer-bonding and involve him (probably) hearing and propogating lies,, it's time for the 'sane' parent to reign the 'crazy' parent in.

Little empathy for parents when their warped dynamic is negatively affecting their offspring.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## boxed in (Mar 3, 2015)

cons said:


> Wow- I hope you realize, given what you've told us of your wife and her disorder, how cruel your actions were in confiding with this other woman.
> 
> It is disrespectful even for a woman that doesn't have to deal with a personality disorder. But then, knowing that in this area, extra care should be taken, you are careless about her feelings and instead of wanting to take care of the union you act in a way to "get back at her". Talk about kicking someone where it hurts...


Yes, I was careless and it was disrespectful. There is no other way to express it. I didn't say anything about her disorder, but I did say that she doesn't like to be associated with other parents of the school my son attends. That's damage enough. I don't know why, but when I do something wrong or if I am associated with something I consider wrong, for the most part, I tell people the truth about events. With that said, I know what I did was wrong, but it is not something I want to admit to my wife. Our relationship is not built on love and understanding.


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## boxed in (Mar 3, 2015)

Flying_Dutchman said:


> I'm not condoning what the OP did but there's something far worse being missed/ignored here.
> 
> 
> If thd TRUTH is that the OP's kid can't go to the party for the reasons given by the OP (his paranoid wife suspecting an affair) what is the OP's kid being told is the reason? Presumably, not the truth since the truth would embarass his (paranoid) mom. Then, he'd likely tell the party kid and party kid's mom would hear it from him rather than from the OP.
> ...


Let me set this narrative straight, we didn't lie to him about why he couldn't go, actually we are going somewhere. I just felt really guilty because my wife is so distrustful of me, and I stupidly explained it to the woman. Part of PD is control, and my wife wants to control who he can see, what he can say, etc. 
The reason I stay with her is partially because I do not her controlling his thoughts and telling him what he is allowed to do, whom he can visit, who his friends can be, etc.

thank goodness my son has a great set of values. I try to inculcate that in him. i am not perfect by any means, but I can be a lot more honest with him then I can be with her.


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## cons (Aug 13, 2013)

Boxedin-

Love is a choice....do you choose to love your wife...or are you going to wait until she changes first? 

I'm not trying to beat you up...but you are the one who is here...if your goal is to strengthen your marriage, than a paradigm shift needs to occur. Why can't that shift start with you? 

Instead of holding onto your wife's issue about others in the form of resentment...is there a way to shift this to an approach of empathy...working with your wife...choosing to love her where she's at?

Cheating is rarely a part of someone's intention when they're married. But if your not nurturing your marriage, it sure can open that door wider and wider as a possibility, and then the rationalizations begin....It may not be probable, but it sure can make it possible.


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## Thundarr (Jul 4, 2012)

boxed in said:


> Yes, I was careless and it was disrespectful. There is no other way to express it. I didn't say anything about her disorder, but I did say that she doesn't like to be associated with other parents of the school my son attends. That's damage enough. I don't know why, but when I do something wrong or if I am associated with something I consider wrong, for the most part, I tell people the truth about events. With that said, I know what I did was wrong, but it is not something I want to admit to my wife. Our relationship is not built on love and understanding.


So what do you want BI? I mean what do you want out of life and marriage and family. Is being marriage but not really trusting or loving each other good enough? I don't know if your wife can change or not but If you work on yourself then at least you'll be giving her reason to change. Personally I believe downing your wife to others and especially to someone she considers competition is a humongous no no. At least it sounds like you're feeling guilty about it so maybe you agree. The bottom line is that you should be a guy who your wife would be crazy not to want to be with and trust. And then you can hold her to either treating you like someone she loves and trusts or not being with you at all. The situation you've found yourself in is somewhere between hell and purgatory. For me that wouldn't be enough. I'd have to see some light at the end of the tunnel.


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## boxed in (Mar 3, 2015)

cons said:


> Boxedin-
> 
> Love is a choice....do you choose to love your wife...or are you going to wait until she changes first?
> 
> ...


Cons, maybe I'm crazy, but I have no thoughts at all of cheating. Also, 99.9% of the guys would have left her a long time ago. There were many times I have left, only to come back because I truly care for her. It takes to two, but her actions are the main reason I don't love her. There are other dynamics at play here that I have not mentioned, and you can use your imagination to infer what else is happening in our relationship.

She won't change, part of having a PD is the inability to change or admit being wrong. I have made adjustments, and there are many more I have to make. Really, there is a mutual lack of respect between us. Part of her PD is manifested in distrust and disrespect. As i mentioned before, I won't leave because of my son, and also despite all of this I do care for her. It may seem weird, but you would have to be in my shoes to understand the entire situation.


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## cons (Aug 13, 2013)

I believe you don't have thoughts of cheating...that wasn't what I was trying to get at...my bad, I thought perhaps you were here to try to make your marriage better...however, you're here to vent and demonstrate what a martyr you are for being the 0.1% of men that stay with a woman they don't love (under the ruse of "for the sake of the kid")


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## yeah_right (Oct 23, 2013)

During your chats in the park with the other mom, are you sharing any of these frustrations with her? Do you look at that mom and wish your wife could be more like her? Not necessarily in a sexual way, but comparing the presentation that woman puts out to the world.


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## Flying_Dutchman (Oct 29, 2014)

boxed in said:


> we didn't lie to him about why he couldn't go, actually we are going somewhere. I just felt really guilty because my wife is so distrustful of me, and I stupidly explained it to the woman.


"actually we are going somewhere" is a significant change from the original, which states that you told the OW "the truth".




boxed in said:


> My little boy was invited to a birthday party for a classmate, but my wife was dead set against it. Rather then just telling the mother we couldn't attend, I told the mother the truth as to why my son could not attend the party; I explained that due to jealousy and paranoia, my wife doesn't want my son to attend the party.


So, if the kid couldn't attend the party cuz you had other plans,, YOU LIED to the OW about his non-attendance being due to your wife's paranoia.

That's two contrasting tales. First you told the truth about your paranoid wife,, now the truth is your son couldn't go anyway,, so you lied to the OW about you wife.

Ratting her out wasn't impressive,,, now it transpires you made it all up,, dissing her to the OW when you already had other plans.

Oh, dear.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## CincyBluesFan (Feb 27, 2015)

boxed in said:


> Yes, I was careless and it was disrespectful. There is no other way to express it. I didn't say anything about her disorder, but I did say that she doesn't like to be associated with other parents of the school my son attends. That's damage enough. I don't know why, but when I do something wrong or if I am associated with something I consider wrong, for the most part, I tell people the truth about events. With that said, I know what I did was wrong, but it is not something I want to admit to my wife. Our relationship is not built on love and understanding.


You seem like a good guy. You just need to do some tweaking. Haven't we all from time to time. Your wife does too. First, never confide marriage issues to a member of the opposite sex. Never disparage your wife to anyone outside the home. Maybe to a therapist but that's it. The bottom sentence about your relationship not being built on love and understanding, you need to work on that. You can even work on it with her without her even being conscious that you're working on it if you're clever. It does sound like she has some emotional issues to work through. Emotions can be powerful stuff (especially in women, shhh I didn't say that). We hubbies have to work with them on getting their emotions under control without telling them that we're working on them getting their emotions under control. 

Don't beat yourself up too much. You committed a marriage misdemeanor, nothing more. The most important thing is that you recognized it.


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

I really think if you would say No to her, and stick to it, you would not even feel the need to vent to other parents.


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## boxed in (Mar 3, 2015)

Flying_Dutchman said:


> "actually we are going somewhere" is a significant change from the original, which states that you told the OW "the truth".
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yes, I don't know what I was thinking, but it surely wasn't well planned. Let make the sequence of events more clear. The fact was that we had somewhere else to go. My wife wouldn't of let him go if he did have the chance. No stories were made to him about not being able to attend.


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## boxed in (Mar 3, 2015)

yeah_right said:


> During your chats in the park with the other mom, are you sharing any of these frustrations with her? Do you look at that mom and wish your wife could be more like her? Not necessarily in a sexual way, but comparing the presentation that woman puts out to the world.


No, not at all, as I mentioned, nothing personal was discussed.


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## boxed in (Mar 3, 2015)

Flying_Dutchman said:


> "actually we are going somewhere" is a significant change from the original, which states that you told the OW "the truth".
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I did mention to the ow about our trip


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## John Lee (Mar 16, 2013)

Here's the real issue, I think, as opposed to what you did or didn't do "wrong" and what you should "feel guilty" about:

You are putting yourself in a position that is not really sustainable or healthy. You are trying to simultaneously be some kind of hero or savior in your marriage, caring for what you see as your poor unfortunate PD wife, while at the same resenting her furiously to the degree that you went and complained about her to another woman. You just can't keep going like that -- you either have to find a way to be more fully *in* your marriage, which you are not, or you should probably leave. I don't know what PD your wife has, but I'll bet she picks up on your underlying resentment of her more than you think and would not really like the idea that you are somehow "helping" her by staying in the marriage.

If you really think your wife is an unfit mother, you can try to get full custody in divorce. So don't make that the barrier.


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## yeah_right (Oct 23, 2013)

boxed in said:


> I did mention to the ow about our trip


I'm confused at this point. Did you give this woman the reason of a trip or your wife for not attending the party?

"Hi Jane. Sorry little Billy will not be able to attend the party but we already had something else planned that day. By the way, even if we were free my wife wouldn't let me send Billy because she's jealous of you and thinks we're having an affair. See you at the park!"

Frankly, if I was the other mom and the dad of one of my kid's friends called to say his wife was jealous of me....I'd start avoiding both of them like the plague. No need for that drama in my life!


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## Catherine602 (Oct 14, 2010)

Self-flagellation for more than a week or two is counterproductive. You will have to handle the fallout so what's the plan? 

BI, why are you punishing yourself? I feel that this situation with the woman was completely avoidable for you. Yet you put yourself in harms way. Another poster said that you avoid confronting your wife. This is an indirect way of telling her how you feel. 

What is the plan? Clearly you cannot keep this relationship up without major changes or a complete mental breakdown for you.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

boxed in said:


> Her son and my son played together in school, and then at the park after school. I call her or she has called me to make play dates, nothing else. And just small talk when we are at the park. There is nothing to infer, there is no attraction, I just want my son to play with children his own age. I have done this with other parents as well.


How often do you call her to make play dates for the two boy at the park?

When you say you have done this with other parents, is the always the mothers who you call? Or do you call fathers as well? 

A lot of people would not be comfortable with their spouse calling opposite sex people to set up play dates like this, especially not on a regular basis.


.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

boxed in,

How long have you been married? 
How old is your son?

You say that your wife as a PD. When was she diagnosed with this PD? Did you know about it when you married her?


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## John Lee (Mar 16, 2013)

EleGirl said:


> How often do you call her to make play dates for the two boy at the park?
> 
> When you say you have done this with other parents, is the always the mothers who you call? Or do you call fathers as well?
> 
> ...


This is what I was getting at too. It's not necessary that the OP has the "intention" to cheat for the wife to sense that something might be a little over the line. Maybe OP has a lot of friendships with women and the wife is not as comfortable with that as OP.


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## alphaomega (Nov 7, 2010)

Hey friend,

How passive aggressive are you?

There's a lot of spectrum to that disorder. And how far you take your Kung fu crazy. 

Go read the thread in this section called "to those dealing with passive aggressive husbands", started by AVR. 

My posts start on about page 9 or ten. 

Too much to repeat here.


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## tripad (Apr 18, 2014)

Didn't read whole thread 

But the fact that you can freely tell the other mum that your son couldn't attend the party because of your wife's jealousy, makes me think that 
1) you are eithere very close to that mum, 
2) you r hoping that the mum will reciprocate n confirm she has feelings for u 
3) you r just blabber mouth which is really uncool for a man 

Also agreed with other posters that you have not spare a thought for your son n wife, if words leak out, how would it affect your son n wife. Really selfish. 

Based on that, I figured you may be doing other acts to give rise to your wife's insecurity. Gregarious is your description but it may be more likely called flirtatious


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## Pooh Bear (Dec 28, 2014)

boxed in said:


> I have confronted her many times, but when a person has a personality disorder, they cannot accept when they are wrong, and people with PO will never go to counselling, and even if they do, it is near impossible to cure


I was just on a thread with people who have BPD and they were working through it and acknowledged the disease. So it's not true that people who have it never get help. Have you talked with her about her disease and asked that she get help? You guys should not have to live in prison because of her illness. She is responsible for treatment.


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## AVR1962 (May 30, 2012)

This does not sound passive-aggressive to me. This sounds like someone who was confiding in a mother who he may have a possible interest in. I think expressing what you felt was petty to another woman was something you felt could give you sympathy from the other mother and a possible way into her life. Kind of like the play dates you are arranging with the moms....this is not about the kids, it's not about your wife, this is about you and you trying to please your desire to be in the company of other women.


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## scatty (Mar 15, 2013)

Why would you air your wife's insecurities (whether founded or unfounded) to that mom? I would be really mad.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Boxed In,

You need to concentrate on yourself and your family. See if you can get your wife into therapy so that she can better handle her own issues. Be active in her therapy. Also get yourself into therapy/counseling because you are not in a good place.

To be honest, your wife is not pushing you around. You are passive and passive aggressive. She is not responsibility for your inability to stand your ground in a positive manner.

And stop calling other women to meet you in the park for play dates with your son. If this is what you have been doing, I can understand why your wife is concerned that you are up to no good.

Call other fathers and ask them to bring their kids to the park. Or go to the park and let your son play with the other kids who are already there.


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## tripad (Apr 18, 2014)

EleGirl said:


> And stop calying other woman to meet you in the park for play dates with you if this is what you have been doing, I can understand why your wife is concerned that you are up to no good.
> 
> Call other fathers and ask them to bring their kids to the park. Or go to the park and let your son play with the other kids who are already there.


YES YES YES YES YES 

I won't call other dads for play dates as well


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## John Lee (Mar 16, 2013)

In sympathy to the OP, this is a bigger problem for dads. When I'm home with the kids and my wife's not home, it's like 20x easier to find a mom than a dad available. I still try to avoid it though.


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## CincyBluesFan (Feb 27, 2015)

EleGirl said:


> And stop calling other women to meet you in the park for play dates with your son. If this is what you have been doing, I can understand why your wife is concerned that you are up to no good.
> 
> Call other fathers and ask them to bring their kids to the park. Or go to the park and let your son play with the other kids who are already there.



I was concerned about this too. What is he doing with the other mom while the kids are playing? Chit chat? Being there for her? Talking about his wife? You know, ALL the things that relationship experts will tell you to never do while you're married.

Maybe his wife has seen the movie Little Children.


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## John Lee (Mar 16, 2013)

CincyBluesFan said:


> I was concerned about this too. What is he doing with the other mom while the kids are playing? Chit chat? Being there for her? Talking about his wife? You know, ALL the things that relationship experts will tell you to never do while you're married.
> 
> Maybe his wife has seen the movie Little Children.


Haha, there was another thread recently where someone was like "Oh, we just hang out with the kids, definitely nothing inappropriate going on." I immediately thought of that movie.


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## yeah_right (Oct 23, 2013)

CincyBluesFan said:


> Maybe his wife has seen the movie Little Children.


I almost posted that last night but wasn't sure how many have seen it. Uber icky.

BTW, in this case, do you think the OP's wife would be warranted to do a little snooping?


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## CincyBluesFan (Feb 27, 2015)

yeah_right said:


> BTW, in this case, do you think the OP's wife would be warranted to do a little snooping?


Due to the admission of confiding marriage issues with this other mom I'd say there's definitely probable cause to look into this play date relationship a little closer.


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## John Lee (Mar 16, 2013)

Total aside, but while I don't think that was a GREAT movie, it is one of the best portrayals I've ever seen about how embarrassing most affairs actually are from an outsider's POV, as opposed to how destined and romantic they must feel.


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## CincyBluesFan (Feb 27, 2015)

John Lee said:


> Total aside, but while I don't think that was a GREAT movie, it is one of the best portrayals I've ever seen about how embarrassing most affairs actually are from an outsider's POV, as opposed to how destined and romantic they must feel.


For me, the God's honest truth is I initially watched that movie because a buddy told me Kate Winslett does full nude sex scenes. When I watched it, however, I couldn't even enjoy those scenes because the content was so disturbing. I don't like sex scenes with cheaters. I have a pretty low opinion of cheaters. Years ago before I was married I was cheated on and it hurts. In marriage it has to be far worse. Worse than I can imagine. Movies like Little Children and Unfaithful are very disturbing to me. There was another movie where Diane Lane cheated on her husband with Vigo Mortenson. I can't remember the name of that one. Anyway, she did such a good job in both movies that I actually associate her with filthy cheaters. I have to watch My Dog Skip to undo the damage.


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## yeah_right (Oct 23, 2013)

CincyBluesFan said:


> *Movies like Little Children and Unfaithful are very disturbing to me. *


Since I have the anonymity of the internet, I'd like to admit that I cheered the death by snowglobe in Unfaithful.


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## CincyBluesFan (Feb 27, 2015)

yeah_right said:


> Since I have the anonymity of the internet, I'd like to admit that I cheered the death by snowglobe in Unfaithful.


I did too. I thought Richard Gere was fully justified in his actions. That OM was a total creep. The world became a slightly better place by removing him from the population.


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## Pooh Bear (Dec 28, 2014)

John Lee said:


> In sympathy to the OP, this is a bigger problem for dads. When I'm home with the kids and my wife's not home, it's like 20x easier to find a mom than a dad available. I still try to avoid it though.


Yeah. I suppose it is easier for moms in some ways because a lot of us are staying home or working part time. Is there another reason dads don't connect the way moms do? You guys need a support system too.


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## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

So, while you're making play dates & meeting other moms at the park, is your wife out supporting the family?


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## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

boxed in said:


> It is completely beyond reproach. We both have sons in the same classroom and it is completely plutonic. Unfortunately, my wife thinks I have affairs with every woman who has ever talked to me. She is always impugning my integrity. i am gregarious whereas my wife is suspicious of most people.


Your W should have taken your son then.


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## Anonymous07 (Aug 4, 2012)

EleGirl said:


> Call other fathers and ask them to bring their kids to the park. Or go to the park and let your son play with the other kids who are already there.


:iagree:

I know quite a few dads who meet up every Saturday morning at the park, as well as another group of dads who meet up on Tuesday and Thursday evenings at the park with their kids. There is another SAHD who goes to the park regularly almost every morning and just has his daughter play with who ever is there. He's nice and will say hello, but the focus is on the kids(interacting with them) and no boundaries are crossed. I would be very uncomfortable if my husband was chatting up another woman.


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