# Is It Just Me



## Ynot

I know the topic has been discussed before but I am looking for some additional perspective here:
I came to TAM on the heels of my ex-wife walking away from what I thought was a solid 25 year relationship.
When I first came here I was looking for answers, First to her decision to lea, then to her decision to divorce, then to all the issues that arose from the divorce and finally to trying to make sense of it all after everything was final. 
Early on the advice given never really made sense because I was still seeing things thru the eyes of a shattered man.
Later some of the early advice started to sink in and I was able to begin my recovery.
I used to have what I thought was a very condescending view of people who were divorced. I did so from the perspective of a happily married man. I considered them broken people.
Now I find myself amongst the divorced. But I am having trouble shaking my previous views. Mainly because I feel broken and I see so many broken people as I journey forth into my new life.
I no longer have the unshakable faith in love that I once had. I no longer have the faith that I will ever trust again. As I said I feel broken
These feelings are reinforced by the people I am meeting along the way. Men and women who remain bitter and angry years after their divorces. Damaged people. I feel as though I am in the land of misfit toys.
I don't know if it is just my perception of this as an issue based on my past feelings or if I am perceiving reality clearly but am unable to accept it.
If it is the former what suggestions can anyone make to help me change my perception. If it is the latter what suggestions could one make to help me accept it


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## Shooboomafoo

I guess you gotta attempt to "not" become like those bitter folks you meet along the way. I always heard the horror stories as a young man in my 20s from older men, about marriage and the pitfalls.. I naively told myself that "it would never happen to me", and that I would choose someone that wouldn't be a cheater.... 

Now, as a single man again, my problem is that I am not running into any women that appear to have much in the way of "Strong, ethical viewpoints" towards marriage, and its disappointing. Divorce is merely a tool to use to get out of a displeasing situation anymore, or marriage itself is viewed as a personal disservice. 

That broken feeling is more likely an unwarranted shame for being naïve to the ways of the world these days. Maybe there is still someone out there with strong sensibilities, and a real worthwhile person to share a life with, but it seems hard to find nowadays.. I wouldn't give up though. Wade through the weeds, until you find your rose.


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## Ynot

Shooboomafoo said:


> I guess you gotta attempt to "not" become like those bitter folks you meet along the way. I always heard the horror stories as a young man in my 20s from older men, about marriage and the pitfalls.. I naively told myself that "it would never happen to me", and that I would choose someone that wouldn't be a cheater....
> 
> Now, as a single man again, my problem is that I am not running into any women that appear to have much in the way of "Strong, ethical viewpoints" towards marriage, and its disappointing. Divorce is merely a tool to use to get out of a displeasing situation anymore, or marriage itself is viewed as a personal disservice.
> 
> That broken feeling is more likely an unwarranted shame for being naïve to the ways of the world these days. Maybe there is still someone out there with strong sensibilities, and a real worthwhile person to share a life with, but it seems hard to find nowadays.. I wouldn't give up though. Wade through the weeds, until you find your rose.


Believe me I am trying very hard not to be like those bitter angry people I have met.
However, I have to admit my enthusiasm is somewhat diminished the more of these people I meet.
While I somewhat agree with you, I would say that divorce has become a convenient tool to get out of a less than optimal (mostly fantasy based) situation.
The women I meet have either been dumped themselves or have done the dumping. The first class has some real reservations about getting close to anyone. The second class can recite any number of "good" reasons why they had to do it.


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## sargon

Meeting the right person helps.

Keep putting yourself out there, keep dating, keep your eyes open and spend time with your fellow planetary inhabitants and you just might find a woman who will restore your faith in the human race.

But don't get married again. At the very least, learn from your past mistakes.


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## Ynot

sargon said:


> Meeting the right person helps.
> 
> Keep putting yourself out there, keep dating, keep your eyes open and spend time with your fellow planetary inhabitants and you just might find a woman who will restore your faith in the human race.
> 
> But don't get married again. At the very least, learn from your past mistakes.


I am sure you are right about meeting the right person, putting yourself out there, dating, keeping you eyes open and spending time with my fellow inhabitants.
It is just that recently the more I do this the more disenchanted I become. I never realized it before just how many of us (divorcees) there actually are. And every single one of them seems damaged in some way.
I guess I disagree with the last part. IF my faith is ever restored I would absolutely want to marry the person who helps restore it. The fact that my ex walked away is not a reflection on me. It is a reflection on her. The only thing I was guilty of was trying to be the best husband I knew how to be.


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## Dread Pirate Roberts

I'm an anti-marriage guy, for me personally. And yes, I make snarky remarks about it, but I certainly don't bash those who choose to do it. When solicited, I give them my opinion, but that's it. I can see myself being with my gf for a long, long time, but I don't see us getting married. Neither does she. I don't need it as a validation or anything like that. 

Not sure what to tell you that you haven't already heard. There are good women out there, just have to keep looking. Good luck!


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## BoyScout

YNOT, you are several months ahead of me on this journey and I've followed your story with great interest. I have to say your's has helped me in many ways. I completely understand your comment. Where I am, I continually shake my head and ask how I ever wound up here. Intellectually, I know it was not me, but like you, it is so hard to accept. 

I kept my house, partly because I love my neighbors. Within a block I have two neighbors whose wives left them (different circumstances, but hurtful to both). One is bitter and has been for all the years since she left. The other was a wreck for a year, picked himself up, dusted himself off and has a great relationship that is still developing. I sometimes wonder which path I will choose.

I responded to your post, not with an answer, but to say that I feel the same way you do. I am way new to this, but have had a luxury that the only relationship I've gotten into (it's a big stretch to call it that) is with someone who was recommended by someone close to both of us. They've been a great buffer and facilitator for us. Very helpful to someone coming out of a 20+ year marriage. 

I work close to the Ikea you mentioned in on of your posts. We need to get together for a drink and share stories. They are eerily similar. Cheers.


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## MarriedDude

Ynot said:


> I know the topic has been discussed before but I am looking for some additional perspective here:
> I came to TAM on the heels of my ex-wife walking away from what I thought was a solid 25 year relationship.
> When I first came here I was looking for answers, First to her decision to lea, then to her decision to divorce, then to all the issues that arose from the divorce and finally to trying to make sense of it all after everything was final.
> Early on the advice given never really made sense because I was still seeing things thru the eyes of a shattered man.
> Later some of the early advice started to sink in and I was able to begin my recovery.
> I used to have what I thought was a very condescending view of people who were divorced. I did so from the perspective of a happily married man. I considered them broken people.
> Now I find myself amongst the divorced. But I am having trouble shaking my previous views. Mainly because I feel broken and I see so many broken people as I journey forth into my new life.
> I no longer have the unshakable faith in love that I once had. I no longer have the faith that I will ever trust again. As I said I feel broken
> These feelings are reinforced by the people I am meeting along the way. Men and women who remain bitter and angry years after their divorces. Damaged people. I feel as though I am in the land of misfit toys.
> I don't know if it is just my perception of this as an issue based on my past feelings or if I am perceiving reality clearly but am unable to accept it.
> *If it is the former what suggestions can anyone make to help me change my perception.* If it is the latter what suggestions could one make to help me accept it


Could be that you still have expectations of what a marriage or other relationship should look/feel/be. 

Your expectations could be driving the perceptions you have. Try having a date without any expectation. The people that tend towards bitterness and anger have high expectations for themselves and for others. When others don't meet the expectation -people will tend to blame themselves first then the other. Creating the anger and bitterness that consumes them, becomes them. 

All we can hope to do is control ourselves and to remember, always, that our reality and our perceptions are merely our point of view. Our point of view is ours alone -and we control it. As you have learned -your point of view changes. You change it. 

Everyday you have walking this earth is another chance to turn it all around. We are all broken in some way. We can all be repaired. The repairs make us who we are. 

*Kintsukuroi* — More Beautiful for Having Been Broken


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## Nomorebeans

Shooboomafoo said:


> I guess you gotta attempt to "not" become like those bitter folks you meet along the way. I always heard the horror stories as a young man in my 20s from older men, about marriage and the pitfalls.. I naively told myself that "it would never happen to me", and that I would choose someone that wouldn't be a cheater....
> 
> Now, as a single man again, my problem is that I am not running into any women that appear to have much in the way of "Strong, ethical viewpoints" towards marriage, and its disappointing. Divorce is merely a tool to use to get out of a displeasing situation anymore, or marriage itself is viewed as a personal disservice.
> 
> That broken feeling is more likely an unwarranted shame for being naïve to the ways of the world these days. Maybe there is still someone out there with strong sensibilities, and a real worthwhile person to share a life with, but it seems hard to find nowadays.. I wouldn't give up though. Wade through the weeds, until you find your rose.


There are still women out here with strong, ethical viewpoints. There are several other of us here at TAM, so there must be more of us everywhere. Even before I was cheated on myself, one thing I knew for certain was that I would never cheat. Now that I have been, I know without a doubt that other than physical assault, it is the worst thing a person could ever do to another.

And I know men who feel the same way must be out there, because there you are, as are many other men like you here at TAM.

I often wonder whether my STBXH will forever gravitate, now, to women with cheating hearts. Because he must know that every other woman like me is going to judge him if they ever find out what he's done.

I hear you, OP, on feeling like you're on the Island of Misfit Toys. I feel like I'm there already, myself - my married friends aren't going to want to hang out with The Third Wheel on a regular basis. Who do I have things in common with, now, other than other divorced and STBD people? Maybe the key is to lead by example with our divorced friends. Find ways to do things with them that aren't all about b!tching about our exes and how much they ruined our lives. I know - easier said than done.


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## Ynot

Thanks for all the responses so far. I truly do not want to be a bitter angry man the rest of my life. But at the same time I do not wish to be apathetic. I want to enjoy my life. I want to be happy. I want to find contentment again. 
I say "again" , but wonder if I was really content or just imagined myself to be.
I want to love and to be loved. I just wonder.


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## Holland

IMHO the key to moving on post divorce is to take responsibility for your part in it all. There are quite a few bitter people on TAM and when you look closely at their posts they are the ones that tell you they had zero fault in the marriage ending. They are the ones that sound like women/men haters, all of the opposite gender is to blame.

Stand up and take ownership of your actions, it will help you heal and move on to a better, more balanced life.


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## Rowan

Ynot said:


> Thanks for all the responses so far.* I truly do not want to be a bitter angry man the rest of my life.* But at the same time I do not wish to be apathetic. I want to enjoy my life. I want to be happy. I want to find contentment again.
> I say "again" , but wonder if I was really content or just imagined myself to be.
> I want to love and to be loved. I just wonder.


The first step to avoiding being a bitter angry man, in my opinion, is to realize that winding up that way is a choice. 

I'm a woman. I was married for almost 16 years to a man I discovered was a serial cheater. I chose to divorce him as rapidly and as _amicably_ as possible as soon as I found out. Then I spent a year learning to be myself alone, rather than myself as a part of "us". I had all the reason in the world to be angry and bitter, to blame all men for my ex-husband's failings, to slide into cold isolation and hostile self-protection. But I chose not to do that. I chose to believe that there are good men out there, ones who share my values, and actually want the honest, faithful, devoted woman they say they want. There are plenty of damaged people, but I decided I didn't want to be one of them. 

And you know what? Those good men actually are out there. They're hidden among heaps and heaps of the broken, damaged, bitter, angry ones. The ones who are still railing - sometimes years later - about the unfairness of it all, about evil women, about their crummy ex-wives. 

Honestly, though, I'm not really all that sure that most people's damage stems entirely from whatever happened with their ex-spouses. I think a lot of times, their issues were already there, perhaps just not so clearly defined as now, even before their marriages failed. I also think that being angry and bitter and damaged is sometimes a convenient way to avoid looking within themselves. It's just easier to say you're emotionally unavailable, or conflict avoidant, or passive-aggressive because your ex-spouse did you so wrong, than it is to admit that you've always been that way and do the work to fix yourself. 

But, when you find someone who has faced themselves, done the work, given up the pointless anger and bitterness, and learned to be a fully functional adult human...that's absolute gold. It may be rare, but those people are out there. You just have to be emotionally healthy and ready yourself, so you can recognize and appreciate them when they come into your life. Everyone will have some baggage. As you date, you'll meet a lot of people with a lot of big baggage. You just need to recognize that and move along without anger. The trick is to ensure that your own baggage is carry-on sized, rather than a huge steamer trunk. Approach dating as if it's an opportunity to meet interesting people, try new bars/restaurants/activities, and get out of your house for a couple hours - rather than with huge expectations. And move along from incompatible people without negative emotions. They weren't right for you, so just let them go. Eventually, you'll find someone who is right for you.


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## bkyln309

We are out here. I am not angry or bitter no matter how the X would love me to be. I left the marriage and while I was not perfect, the breakup of the marriage lays squarely on his shoulders. I did everything I could to fix it but the truth is, my partner was not vested in making it work so it failed. Its not on me!! My conscious is clear. Even our counselors told us, you have nothing to be ashamed or disappointed about. You tried and tried. 

With that said, I have learned a ton about myself. I learned how I can improve as a partner for my next relationship. And I know what my dealbreakers are in terms of relationship and character. I know how to love better. While I am not seeking out another marriage, never say never. 

I am currently dating two men (one more regularly than the other). I will say one of the two men is a great example of one who is not broken. The other its too early to tell but he "seems" healthy enough.

Whomever said, bitterness and brokenness is a choice is correct. I will not let my past relationship dictate my next one.


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## zillard

Happy people attract happy people. 

If you sit at a bar sulking, you'll naturally find yourself surrounded by bitter sulkers. 

Holland is spot on. Once we own our own faults and POS behavior, we can more easily let other things go and heal/progress. When we do, we can feel good about ourselves. When we feel that way we walk with head held high and enjoy the beauty around us. When we do, we smile, seemingly at nothing. When people see this, they want to know why, vs wanting to find company for their misery.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Ynot

I understand the laws of attraction. So my question becomes what suggestions do you have to help me stop seeing myself as broken. As I said, I no longer have the unshakable faith in love that I once had. I no longer have the faith that I will ever trust again.
Are these feeling a result of me actually being broken or are they a result of my perception of being broken.
IOW am I really broken and need to heel or do I just feel I am broken and need to stop thinking that way.


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## WasDecimated

Holland said:


> IMHO the key to moving on post divorce is to take responsibility for your part in it all. There are quite a few bitter people on TAM and when you look closely at their posts they are the ones that tell you they had zero fault in the marriage ending. They are the ones that sound like women/men haters, all of the opposite gender is to blame.
> 
> Stand up and take ownership of your actions, it will help you heal and move on to a better, more balanced life.


I’m sorry but I get so sick of reading lines like this. 

Maybe some of them are bitter because they were the ones who were blindsided and Fvcked over by a cheating, lying, suddenly emotionally messed up spouse? Ya, it does happen. Some of us were actually good spouses in good marriages, or were lead to believe they were good marriages, and then betrayed without warning or reason other than they had the hots for some strange. Of course, there is no way anyone could prove that the marriage was actually a good marriage with anything they could possibly write in a forum.

If I stood up and took ownership of my actions and part in my X marriage, what would I say? I was an honest, devoted, loving, emotionally and physically available and supportive, great income earner but always home by 6:00, lived in nice home, bought his wife new cars every year, kept himself in great physical shape, always open to talk, discuss, compromise, went on so many weekend and vacations trips every year together, loved my family and children…etc…you get the picture.

Of course all women are not to blame…but XWW sure as hell is. Am I bitter towards her? Yes, I am.


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## Ynot

Decimated said:


> I’m sorry but I get so sick of reading lines like this.
> 
> Maybe some of them are bitter because they were the ones who were blindsided and Fvcked over by a cheating, lying, suddenly emotionally messed up spouse? Ya, it does happen. Some of us were actually good spouses in good marriages, or were lead to believe they were good marriages, and then betrayed without warning or reason other than they had the hots for some strange. Of course, there is no way anyone could prove that the marriage was actually a good marriage with anything they could possibly write in a forum.
> 
> If I stood up and took ownership of my actions and part in my X marriage, what would I say? I was an honest, devoted, loving, emotionally and physically available and supportive, great income earner but always home by 6:00, lived in nice home, bought his wife new cars every year, kept himself in great physical shape, always open to talk, discuss, compromise, went on so many weekend and vacations trips every year together, loved my family and children…etc…you get the picture.
> 
> Of course all women are not to blame…but XWW sure as hell is. Am I bitter towards her? Yes, I am.


I have to say I agree with this sentiment. I was blindsided. My guilt consisted of me being the best husband I knew how to be. We married for better or worse. When some of the worse came it was she who decided to bail, not me. 
My ex was diagnosed with Graves disease a few years back. Think Marty Feldman. I made a decision that I had married this woman for who she was, not what she looked like. I decided that I would support her and stay her no matter what. 
It turned out the diagnosis was wrong, but regardless, I had made that decision.
When I needed her support the most, she simply decided not to give it. Her lack of support resulted in some real resentment on my part. Is that part of "my responsibility"? Should I have forgiven and forgot? I tried to talk to her about but she never listened.
When she told me she "doesn't even think about" having sex with me because she is just to busy, was that part of my responsibility?
I am still trying to figure out exactly what I am to own up to if I am to heal. I keep coming up with questions about why I need to own up to anything other than trying the best I knew how. 
I guess all I can say is that I wasn't perfect. I didn't know everything, that is just accepting that you are human. I can do that. I can do that all day, everyday and twice on Sunday for good measure. But that doesn't change the fact that I was betrayed and blindsided and hurt by a person I loved with all my heart.


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## zillard

Ynot said:


> I understand the laws of attraction. So my question becomes what suggestions do you have to help me stop seeing myself as broken. As I said, I no longer have the unshakable faith in love that I once had. I no longer have the faith that I will ever trust again.
> *Are these feeling a result of me actually being broken or are they a result of my perception of being broken.*
> IOW am I really broken and need to heel or do I just feel I am broken and need to stop thinking that way.


Is there really a difference? 

Both will leave you feeling like sh!t. 

Are you sick of it yet?


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## zillard

@Decimated @Ynot, 

It seems that you both think when others talk about owning your own sh!t, they are trying to minimize your hurt and minimize the actions of those who wronged you. 

This is not so. 

My Responsibility

I am responsible for my relationship to you
I am responsible for the way I see you
I am responsible for letting you know the inner me
I am responsible for correcting false images of me that I give to you
I am responsible for my judgments of you
I am responsible for my understanding of what you say and do
I am responsible for any hurts I allow myself to feel about you
I am responsible for any desires of needs I feel toward you
I am responsible for frustrations of my desires or needs towards you
I am responsible for any hostility I allow myself to feel toward you
I am responsible because I choose to be responsible
I am responsible because it gives me pleasure
I am responsible because it gives me control
I am responsible because it gives me freedom
I am responsible because it gives me relaxation
I choose not to be responsible for your relationship to me
I choose not to be responsible for your communications to me
I choose not to be responsible for such impossibilities
For if I should choose to feel responsible for your happiness
Then I would feel guilty about your unhappiness
And if I should try to make you responsible for my unhappiness
Then I would feel responsible for your misery about my unhappiness
When I am responsible and know it, I am free
When I am responsible and don’t know, I’m still responsible
And therefore, since I am responsible anyway,
I choose to be aware of the blessing of being responsible
What a pleasure it is to know the freedom and power of my responsibility


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## Rowan

Decimated said:


> I’m sorry but I get so sick of reading lines like this.
> 
> Maybe some of them are bitter because they were the ones who were blindsided and Fvcked over by a cheating, lying, suddenly emotionally messed up spouse? Ya, it does happen. Some of us were actually good spouses in good marriages, or were lead to believe they were good marriages, and then betrayed without warning or reason other than they had the hots for some strange. Of course, there is no way anyone could prove that the marriage was actually a good marriage with anything they could possibly write in a forum.
> 
> If I stood up and took ownership of my actions and part in my X marriage, what would I say? I was an honest, devoted, loving, emotionally and physically available and supportive, great income earner but always home by 6:00, lived in nice home, bought his wife new cars every year, kept himself in great physical shape, always open to talk, discuss, compromise, went on so many weekend and vacations trips every year together, loved my family and children…etc…you get the picture.
> 
> Of course all women are not to blame…but XWW sure as hell is. Am I bitter towards her? Yes, I am.


Understand, though, that you are in fact choosing to be bitter. You can choose to let it go. You can decide that she's not worth the hate or the emotional energy that being bitter takes. You can decide that there probably were things in the marital dynamic that you should take ownership of. Did you make her cheat? No. That's on her. But are there some things you may need to work on to make yourself emotionally healthy enough for a new relationship? The fact that you're still hot about your ex-wife's betrayal leads me to conclude that the answer to that is "yes". 

Maybe you did everything right. Maybe, though, you're human and did the best you knew how and might possibly be able to learn to do some things better. Even if that thing you could do better is to work on communication skills, work on trusting your instincts more, work on boundaries and enforcement of them. I, too, was a good spouse. But I needed to work on my self-esteem and on being proactive about boundary enforcement. Those issues are mine to own, regardless of anything he did or did not do. I don't think anyone comes out of a LTR without at least a little something they could stand to work on in themselves. 



Ynot said:


> I have to say I agree with this sentiment. I was blindsided. My guilt consisted of me being the best husband I knew how to be. We married for better or worse. When some of the worse came it was she who decided to bail, not me.
> My ex was diagnosed with Graves disease a few years back. Think Marty Feldman. I made a decision that I had married this woman for who she was, not what she looked like. I decided that I would support her and stay her no matter what.
> It turned out the diagnosis was wrong, but regardless, I had made that decision.
> When I needed her support the most, she simply decided not to give it. Her lack of support resulted in some real resentment on my part. Is that part of "my responsibility"? Should I have forgiven and forgot? I tried to talk to her about but she never listened.
> When she told me she "doesn't even think about" having sex with me because she is just to busy, was that part of my responsibility?
> I am still trying to figure out exactly what I am to own up to if I am to heal. I keep coming up with questions about why I need to own up to anything other than trying the best I knew how.
> I guess all I can say is that I wasn't perfect. I didn't know everything, that is just accepting that you are human. I can do that. I can do that all day, everyday and twice on Sunday for good measure. But that doesn't change the fact that I was betrayed and blindsided and hurt by a person I loved with all my heart.


No, nothing changes the fact that you were betrayed and hurt. But holding on to that betrayal probably doesn't benefit you in the long-run. It is possible to reach a state of apathy about the one who betrayed you. You don't have to like her, or allow her in your life, but it might be a good idea to come to grips with the "can't do anything about it" nature of the thing. Acceptance, apathy, acknowledgement of her as a flawed person you don't want in your life but also don't wish ill - that should be your goal. Let go. As long as you're holding on to the "but it's not fair!!!!", you're unlikely to really be emotionally healed enough for another relationship. No, it's not fair. Life often isn't. But continuing to resent the unfairness of it all gives her too much power over you and your future.


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## bandit.45

I know where your coming from. 

Alot of these feelings will subside with time. Right now your divorce is fresh and raw. You are still healing for goodness sake! 

First of all...give yourself a break man. You have enough pressure on you coming from others without you beating yourself up to boot. Quit thinking that everything has to be fixed and dealt with tomorrow. You had your world pulled out from under you. It is okay to feel what you are feeling. Take each day as it is. Set some reasonable, attainable goals for yourself and a realistic deadline to try to achieve them. Once those are knocked out, set some more. 

Are you exercising, eating right, staying away from sugar, fried foods and junk? Are you eating lots of fruits, vegetables and lean proteins? Are you getting plenty of sleep? Are you keeping your drinking to a minimum? 

Taking care of your health will go a long way in stabilizing your mood. 

Are you doing plenty of good things for yourself? Are you getting back into old hobbies and interests? Are you dressing and grooming yourself well? Doing these things will improve your self-image, and if your self-image is good, your outlook on life and your place in the world will start to improve.


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## Holland

Of course in some marriages the major share of the blame can go to one side. I am not saying take responsibility for someone else's actions but for your own. 

I was a great wife, wanted a fulfilling sex life, great parent, average at housework though but even so there was always a meal and a tidy home. I moved country for him, left my career to raise our family, never cheated blah blah blah.

After it all ended I really had to put some thought into what my part was and once it hit me that I had chosen to be with a non compatible person then it all started to fall into place and I could then see what other mistakes I had made. We are each responsible for where we are at in life.


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## bandit.45

Ynot said:


> When I needed her support the most, she simply decided not to give it. Her lack of support resulted in some real resentment on my part. Is that part of "my responsibility"? Should I have forgiven and forgot? I tried to talk to her about but she never listened.
> When she told me she "doesn't even think about" having sex with me because she is just to busy, was that part of my responsibility?
> I am still trying to figure out exactly what I am to own up to if I am to heal. I keep coming up with questions about why I need to own up to anything other than trying the best I knew how.
> I guess all I can say is that I wasn't perfect. I didn't know everything, that is just accepting that you are human. I can do that. I can do that all day, everyday and twice on Sunday for good measure. But that doesn't change the fact that I was betrayed and blindsided and hurt by a person I loved with all my heart.


You married a selfish assh0le. They come in both sexes and the only thing you can partially blame yourself for is being too naive and infatuated with her to see who she really was before you married her. 

Here is the deal: your X is an assh0le, and she will continue being and assh0le to everyone in her life, even with you out of the picture. Her crap behavior, lack of integrity and loyalty will haunt her and cause her future problems until she realizes what a selfish ass she is and deals with it. 

This isn't your problem. She is no longer your problem. Do what Morituri says: "let her go". I guarantee you, twenty years from now you and her will be somewhere at the same time together and she will let slip that throwing her marriage away was one of her life's great regrets. If not, see me in twenty years and I'll buy you a steak dinner. 

Are you in any kind of grief counseling? If not your should be. It will help a lot.


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## WasDecimated

Rowan said:


> *Understand, though, that you are in fact choosing to be bitter*. * You can choose to let it go.* You can decide that she's not worth the hate or the emotional energy that being bitter takes. You can decide that there probably were things in the marital dynamic that you should take ownership of. Did you make her cheat? No. That's on her. *But are there some things you may need to work on to make yourself emotionally healthy enough for a new relationship? The fact that you're still hot about your ex-wife's betrayal leads me to conclude that the answer to that is "yes*.


I think it's obvious that I'm deciding to be bitter right now. I will continue to be bitter until I decide I'm done being bitter. At this stage, for me, the energy I get from the resentment I feel, has given me strength in some areas of my life. I don't believe that because I feel bitter towards her right now, that I am not emotionally healthy. I am great in all other aspects of my life...except things XWW. I think it is natural to feel resentment after a betrayal of this magnitude. I think telling someone not to feel this emotion...would be unhealthy and not to feel resentment...inhuman. If it were to consume my life or last for 10 years, than yes, that would be a problem. As far as working on being emotionally healthy for a new relationship, that is at the bottom of my list right now. I have plenty of friendships in my life that don't require a risk in dividing my assets or emotions again.


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## zillard

Decimated said:


> I think it is natural to feel resentment after a betrayal of this magnitude. I think telling someone not to feel this emotion...would be unhealthy and not to feel resentment...inhuman.


Easy tiger. 

The posts here are responses - solicited suggestions of how to change or accept things. 

I agree - it's best to feel those feelings until you're sick of them. If you're not... no pressure.


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## Holland

I agree that there can be some peace and a feeling of safety wallowing in feelings of resentment/bitterness. As long as you put a time line on it as in if you are not past it by xxxx date then take some positive action, therapy etc.

All the best to all.


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## Satya

I had a perfect reason to become one of the many, bitter people out there post-divorce.

But what actually helped me to avoid it was researching into why my ex and I didn't work out, and what my own bad patterns were. I committed to myself that I would never let bitterness or resentment enter my heart, so every single time I feel that twinge of something negative creeping in, I talk about my feelings and boundaries, openly and honestly, and through that action (for me personally) it stops things from festering. 

My mother wanted me to be angry and unforgiving. I'm glad I didn't listen. 

I knew that if I'd been bitter, I'd never find a great man. Eventually, he found me.


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## Ynot

My initial post was not really about bitterness and anger. But about love and trust. 
My former life was totally destroyed when my ex walked away. Everything I had I lost - , the day to day life I had lived, the feeling of being a part of something, my family, my home, my job, my roles - all gone.
All of those things had been built on a base of love and trust. When she left me that feeling of love and trust was shattered. 
The feelings of anger and bitterness stem from my inability to resolve my issues with love and trust. 
Did I have unrealistic expectations of love and trust when I was married? Or was it just that my ex with just couldn't live up to those expectations? Or she wouldn't try live up to my expectations.
I realize I have no control over whether she couldn't or wouldn't try, so it is not about her, but about me.
If my expectations were unrealistic, then I need to determine what they should be.
If my expectations were realistic, then I can move towards accepting that she just wasn't capable of living up to them (she was flawed)
The same holds true if she wouldn't live up to them. If she wouldn't, I also need to just accept it. She was still flawed although in a different way. Instead of lacking the capacity she lacked the commitment.
I truly realize that it really doesn't matter whether she couldn't or wouldn't. The end result was that she didn't. There is no changing that. So my quandary is not really about these two finer points, but about whether my expectations were real or not.
I feel that anger and bitterness stem from not being able to resolve the question of our expectations about love and trust. 
As I move forward through life I see many many people who never stop to resolve the issue.
I just feel that resolving the issue is the key to eliminating the anger and bitterness.
As some have said owning up to our end of the situation is key to moving forward and letting go. And the key to owning up is understanding what you need to own up to. 
So is it just me? Am I the only one struggling to answer the question?


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## zillard

Ynot said:


> The feelings of anger and bitterness stem from my inability to resolve my issues with love and trust.
> Did I have unrealistic expectations of love and trust when I was married? Or was it just that my ex with just couldn't live up to those expectations?...
> 
> As some have said owning up to our end of the situation is key to moving forward and letting go. And the key to owning up is understanding what you need to own up to.
> So is it just me? Am I the only one struggling to answer the question?


Well, I don't know exactly what expectations you had so I'll use my experience. 

I had absolute trust in my spouse. Blind trust. This was due to my views on love. I knew she loved me and I knew she was committed to me. Therefore, all was good and we just live in that love and grow old together, right!? That love would keep us both from hurting each other - we were a team now, and the best I'd ever seen. 

3 years, 5 years, 7 years and look, babe, see all those other couples around us with problems and divorces. That will never be us, because we're so great for each other and we have REAL love. We're there. We've found it. We made it. 

Trouble is, marriage and love are not destinations. We were both completely naive to how much work it takes to cultivate, maintain, and grow that love. We grew complacent. We didn't really look at any of our issues (individual and couple related) or work on them, because we had already found our mate for life. There was trust that we would never be left, so the issues were easy to brush aside. 

She's not going anywhere, she loves me *just the way I am*, right!?

So yeah, for me that trust and that view of love, and the expectations that came with them, were a delusion. They were unrealistic. That crumbling was certainly partly due to ME.

However, I also expect respect, kindness, compassion, faithfulness, and honesty. Those are not unrealistic and never will be. At the end, she failed there.


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## 2ntnuf

> *So my quandary is not really about these two finer points, but about whether my expectations were real or not.*
> I feel that anger and bitterness stem from not being able to resolve the question of our expectations about love and trust.
> As I move forward through life I see many many people who never stop to resolve the issue.
> I just feel that resolving the issue is the key to eliminating the anger and bitterness.
> As some have said owning up to our end of the situation is key to moving forward and letting go. And *the key to owning up is understanding what you need to own up to.*
> *So is it just me? Am I the only one struggling to answer the question?*


Did you expect an accountant and video game expert to do high wire circus tricks? No. What did you expect? Only you can answer that.

I'm guessing you did not expect things that were out of line or the ordinary when I answer. You'll have to correct me otherwise.

Sometimes, we expect normal average things out of folks who just cannot give those normal things. That's not your fault. It might be partly your fault for who you picked to ask to marry you. 



Absolutely, if you don't know what you did incorrectly or where you asked for too much, you can't fix anything. All you can do is go over all the things that most psychologists believe are what is best in a marriage. From there, you have to reflect and see if you did those things and how. It just isn't easy when you don't have specific answers. If you can't trust her and/or talk with her, you can't get them. 



Yes, many folks, including me struggle with this. There are also many who just don't care any more and have decided to fix things they know and the rest while they live and learn about their mistakes. Some made less. Some don't know yet every mistake they made. Many things we think are mistakes are just preferences that didn't jibe with our exes. They were neither right nor wrong just not her/his.


I want to add that what zillard and bandit told you is what you need to be doing if you can. I think it was on this page or the last. Good advice, don't overlook it. 

Eventually, you just won't care about her or that marriage any more and you will decide to live and to hell with what they think. You have to live your life. They have to live theirs. Piss on them. I think that's what some are telling you in a much more eloquent way. There is no time limit. Each of us is on a different schedule. We can't help it. We are all different and our circumstances and spouses were all different. All you can do is work toward some goal and then another, and another. Just don't forget to live some along the way. 

You are not alone.


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## Hopeful Cynic

Ynot said:


> My initial post was not really about bitterness and anger. But about love and trust.
> My former life was totally destroyed when my ex walked away. Everything I had I lost - , the day to day life I had lived, the feeling of being a part of something, my family, my home, my job, my roles - all gone.
> All of those things had been built on a base of love and trust. When she left me that feeling of love and trust was shattered.
> The feelings of anger and bitterness stem from my inability to resolve my issues with love and trust.
> Did I have unrealistic expectations of love and trust when I was married? Or was it just that my ex with just couldn't live up to those expectations? Or she wouldn't try live up to my expectations.
> I realize I have no control over whether she couldn't or wouldn't try, so it is not about her, but about me.
> If my expectations were unrealistic, then I need to determine what they should be.
> If my expectations were realistic, then I can move towards accepting that she just wasn't capable of living up to them (she was flawed)
> The same holds true if she wouldn't live up to them. If she wouldn't, I also need to just accept it. She was still flawed although in a different way. Instead of lacking the capacity she lacked the commitment.
> I truly realize that it really doesn't matter whether she couldn't or wouldn't. The end result was that she didn't. There is no changing that. So my quandary is not really about these two finer points, but about whether my expectations were real or not.
> I feel that anger and bitterness stem from not being able to resolve the question of our expectations about love and trust.
> As I move forward through life I see many many people who never stop to resolve the issue.
> I just feel that resolving the issue is the key to eliminating the anger and bitterness.
> As some have said owning up to our end of the situation is key to moving forward and letting go. And the key to owning up is understanding what you need to own up to.
> So is it just me? Am I the only one struggling to answer the question?


I think we often start out expecting other people to have the same values as we do. If we are honest and respectful, we expect that to be reciprocated back at us. When we are slapped in the face with alternative behaviour, the fault lies in the other person, not us. But learning to adapt to this newfound knowledge that other people are NOT honest and respectful is not being broken, that's learning from experience. Are you broken, or are you simply wiser?

What if you trusted in your safe neighbourhood and didn't lock your doors, but were the victim of a break-in and all your valuable stuff was taken? Are you broken if you start locking the doors afterwards? If you keep them locked even when you are at home? If you get an alarm system? If you proselytize to your neighbours to protect their own homes better? If you pack up and move to a gated neighbourhood? It's a sliding scale of how you want to react to your newfound experience that some people are NOT like you, not a binary choice between broken and not-broken.

However, there ARE still people out there who do share your values, and will not betray you or rob your house. You've simply come to the realization that you have to take more precautions to weed out the others while you look for them.


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## Ynot

Some reflections a week or so later....
Stating that I am in the land of the misfit toys and so many people are broken is based on the assumption that there really is a place where "normal" people live and that people in general are not broken.
The fact is that even in most marriages, my own included, what may in fact look healthy and happy is often hiding a somewhat different reality. I know of several marriages where the participants are simply living lives of quiet desperation.
In fact a life of quiet desperation is in fact something that I had resigned myself to towards the end of my marriage.
It was not something I desired, but I really had no idea how to improve it.
I am guilty of ignorance in that regard. The same is true of her.
Another reality is that none of us are unbroken in some way. It is the ways we are broken and our reactions to having been broken that make us the individuals we each are.
It is up to me to find what breaks and fixes I am willing to accept and allow into my life. 
The breaks and reactions my ex had were familiar to me. I had accepted them, but in the end whatever her breaks were and whatever her reactions to them were, are hers and not mine.
Such is life.


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## EnjoliWoman

Ynot said:


> I understand the laws of attraction. So my question becomes what suggestions do you have to help me stop seeing myself as broken. As I said, I no longer have the unshakable faith in love that I once had. I no longer have the faith that I will ever trust again.
> Are these feeling a result of me actually being broken or are they a result of my perception of being broken.
> IOW am I really broken and need to heel or do I just feel I am broken and need to stop thinking that way.


I didn't read all of the responses so forgive me if redundant.

As to your still struggling with your view of divorced people, I think that also has quite a lot of impact as to your view of yourself as broken.

First, as you well know, it takes TWO people to make a marriage work. You can be a "perfect" husband, but if your wife doesn't want to be married anymore, there is no saving it or stopping divorce.

So keep reaffirming to yourself - it takes two to make a marriage work, but only one to ruin it. 50% of those other divorced people are in the same boat. 

I think this generally negative perception of divorced people is impacting your view of yourself, now divorced. Positive affirmations are key, even if it sounds hokey. Whenever you catch yourself talking about or with a divorced person, remind yourself that it takes two to make it work and their marriage just didn't have two working toward the same goal, JUST LIKE YOU.

Sure, you'll discover the 50% who didn't try, but that will come out in general conversation and that speaks to their character. So assess people on CHARACTER, not marital status. 

Taking this more positive approach and no longer seeing yourself as broken will go a long way toward healing. Even "broken" is pretty negative. You might be bruised and battered, but you are NOT broken. This may be an internal trigger of mine but I refused to be the victim or 'broken'. He couldn't break me. He doesn't have the power and I refused to give him that power. Believe me, he TRIED. You are not broken. You are only bruised and you will heal.


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## Ynot

EW, I agree in large part with your analysis. The way I view myself does effect how I view others.
When I was married, I felt hopeless. I dug myself in deeper with negative reinforcement - I am just here to pay the bills, my work is thankless, nobody cares etc, etc. Not only did I get no support from my ex, I also got no support from myself.
The thing is that when I was married I couldn't see that while I felt like I was only there to pay the bills, the fact was that I was ABLE to pay all the bills. I made plenty of money. My work was thankless, but so what, I had a thriving business in which I could more or less command a fee. I was happily (I didn't realize it) turning away work I did not want and only taking jobs that either paid what I felt they were worth or those that I could still profit from.
Currently, I am still getting over the "embarrassment" of being divorced. I still feel as though I some how failed in the game of life. And once again I am reinforcing those thoughts by looking for and finding validation for them.
Now when I go out I see the sheer numbers of people who are divorced. I think it is called abundance/scarcity thinking. We seek to validate what we feel and look for signs our thoughts are true.
If I feel broken, I see other broken people. If I am lonely, I see a scarcity of friends. 
I need to start seeking abundance and stop seeking scarcity.


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## poida

You mention the word broken a lot.

The feeling of "broken" after divorce is generally a feeling of loss, despair, emptiness and a feeling of being incomplete.

In time you will learn that "fulfilment", "hope", "strength" and "completeness" (the things that you so closely associated with your marriage) were actually within YOURSELF. You created them.

When we are married for a long time we learn to link all the positives in our life to our partner. Some of us become overly reliant on their partner as a result of this association (as I did).

When we lose that partner, it feels like all the good things in your life left with that person.

We forget that we created these positives and they remain inside us. We can learn, grow, achieve and feel love and fulfilment all by ourselves.

Understand that you can let the past be the past and that you still have all the good things about your marriage inside you.

Start to share those good things with the world and you will heal and grow.

In regard to the reasons for divorce, you will learn that everyone carries their own set of personal issues. The difference is that not everyone is capable of opening up completely to their partner or are able to deal with their own demons by themselves. This is what makes us human, but it also makes us flawed. I don't see it being possible for all marriages to last forever as a result. It's just human nature. It's not anyone's fault. You can't blame yourself or your wife for what happened. It's just unfortunate and sit with the comfort that at the end of the day, your ex-wife also wishes it could have been different. In that respect we are all the same and nobody should think otherwise. Those who are in a relationship should feel blessed and never take a moment of it for granted.

Good luck.


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