# My Wife wants to date other men and sleep with them



## rodrigoramirez1209 (7 mo ago)

So i got off work at 2am caught my wife texting a guy on Instagram they were both saying"I love you" and "baby" "babe" stuff like that and And so I broke down and I left and stayed in a hotel. She later found me where I was staying after attempting to call me multiple times and we talked about it while at the hotel. She Confessed to me that she loves me and wants to stay with me but she wants to date and sleep around with other people and for me to do the same pretty much having an open relationship. The reason for this is because we were together since she was 15 years old We are 29 now. we got pregnant so we got married at 18. She confessed to me that she didn't get to date other people or sleep with other people and she Wants to know how it feels like to date someone else and to sleep with someone else sense I'm the only person she's been with Physically and she's the only person I've ever been with too. After talking about it I told her if she wants to sleep Around with other people then we can't be together but if you want to try and save our marriage you have to delete your Instagram, She broke down of course because she loves the guy she was talking with on Instagram, So I decided that she can continue to have that long distance relationship on Instagram. If she promised me not to date or have sex with anyone else, I figured a long distance relationship is better than having her date other guys because I know she's going to get emotionally attached to that person and continue to have sex with them behind my back. I know anyone else would have left divorced but I love my wife, We've been together since 15 years old and I want to continue to be with my wife so I want to fight for our marriage. So my question to you guys is my wife continues to have the urges to date And sleep around with other guys, And it makes me sad that she feels this way and it's hurting our relationship. Any advice would be helpful.


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## OrdinaryDude (Jun 10, 2019)

The only way to fight for your marriage is to be ready and willing to walk away, and let her know this.
She is bullying you for an open relationship that you don’t want because she knows that you don’t want to lose her.
Change that game, walk away and let her have what she wants but make her understand there is no coming back.
Basically if she doesn’t stop her wayward behavior immediately then it’s time to start the divorce process.


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## rodrigoramirez1209 (7 mo ago)

At the moment it's not possible because we both don't have anyware to go, we have 3 kids and we can't afford to make rent payments on our own due to the fact that we are both eyes deep in credit card debt.


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## Andy1001 (Jun 29, 2016)

You’ve just given your wife permission to cheat.


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## Dictum Veritas (Oct 22, 2020)

Your marriage is toast. She wants to date other people, let her do it as a single person, without your help and support.

She loves another man (internet). This is an emotional affair. Since you have caught her and not shut it down, she has lost the little respect for you she had while openly disrespecting you in this emotional affair.

Your strategy to let her have this emotional affair WILL cost you any possibility of a relationship with her.

As for wanting an open relationship, if my wife were to ever speak those words to me, I would respect myself enough to serve her with divorce papers on the spot, no matter what sob-story she gives as an excuse.

Go see a lawyer and find out what your life would look like after divorce. I'd go as far as to serve her with papers, perhaps that would be the wakeup call she needs when she realizes what her life would look like without you.

Don't assume that she has not slept with anyone else already, when a woman asks for an open marriage, chances are she is doing so retro-actively. See a doctor and get an STD test. Don't touch her again before you can definitely verify that she is not already sleeping around.

If she wants to stay with you, she has lost her privacy. She either gives you all her social media, dating site and other account details and passwords and access to all her devices or she can go to the streets for which she now has a longing.

One thing is for sure. Keep on doing what you are doing and you are going to loose her definitely. You will wave her good-bey as she rides off into the sunset to go sweat under a man who she actually respects. No woman is attracted to a man who shows the weakness you have shown thus far.

You cannot nice them back. PERIOD.

The only way to prevail is to show a spine, give her consequences for what she has already done and set firm boundaries with clear consequences going forward. You either stop this and possibly loose her, but she will at least walk away respecting you or you WILL loose her and she will see you as a weakling and a chump she could walk all over.

First things first. If she wants to stay with you, she needs to write a no-contact message to this online-POS and send it to him in your presence. If she contacts him again, she can find the door and use it.

Then you go into detective mode and find out everything that she has hidden, you cannot forgive what you do not know.

One last Time. If you want to be sure to loose her and be seen as a weak chump, keep on doing what you are doing now.


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## Dictum Veritas (Oct 22, 2020)

rodrigoramirez1209 said:


> At the moment it's not possible because we both don't have anyware to go, we have 3 kids and we can't afford to make rent payments on our own due to the fact that we are both eyes deep in credit card debt.


At the moment it is difficult, what she wants you to live with and do, that is impossible. This hurts, but now is the time to be strong, make plans and act or live forever knowing you lost your family in weakness and cowering.

Tell her you will make sure you have a place for yourself and your kids, she can sort out a place for herself as she is no longer your problem, since she doesn't want to be in the marriage anymore.

She can have as many boyfriends as she wants, but as a single woman, never as your wife.

Yes, you will have to downscale for a while, but ultimately it's worth it for your dignity and self-respect. She doesn't love you anymore (not like a wife should) at least love yourself enough to be a good father to your kids. Remember, she's destroying the family. She's doing this to the kids too.


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## TriX (May 10, 2021)

rodrigoramirez1209 said:


> I want to continue to be with my wife so I want to fight for our marriage.


Errr, okay. What about your wife? She does not seem to want to fight for the marriage, and if the couple in the marriage are not fighting together against a common cause, then there is no marriage.

You will find out that you will be losing, as your 'wife' will be fighting you and her boyfriend will be fighting next to your 'wife' against you if you let her have her one-sided 'open' relationship.


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## DudeInProgress (Jun 10, 2019)

Dictum Veritas said:


> Your marriage is toast. She wants to date other people, let her do it as a single person, without your help and support.
> 
> She loves another man (internet). This is an emotional affair. Since you have caught her and not shut it down, she has lost the little respect for you she had while openly disrespecting you in this emotional affair.
> 
> ...


This is 100% correct.

OP, you were correct to say hell no to an open marriage, but you ****ed up by agreeing to let her continue to betray and disrespect you with her online boyfriend.
You need to end that now. She’s either 100% your wife, or she’s 100% not.


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## Enigma32 (Jul 6, 2020)

I know a guy who let his wife talk him into an open relationship. He fumbles with other women trying to get laid but no one wants him. Meanwhile, his wife is getting pounded out by other guys on the regular while he sits home alone.

Unless you get off on the idea of being a cuckold, your marriage is already toast. If you don't walk away from her, then your self respect will die along with your marriage. It's up to you.


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## Dictum Veritas (Oct 22, 2020)

Enigma32 said:


> I know a guy who let his wife talk him into an open relationship. He fumbles with other women trying to get laid but no one wants him. Meanwhile, his wife is getting pounded out by other guys on the regular while he sits home alone.
> 
> Unless you get off on the idea of being a cuckold, your marriage is already toast. If you don't walk away from her, then your self respect will die along with your marriage. It's up to you.


Just to elaborate. Men and women are not the same and the rules of attraction is not the same.

Let's say an open relationship is purely sexual:

For a man to be attractive to a woman, he has to be in the top 20% of men genetically else he is invisible to them as a stud. Failing this, he has to have resources, and "game". He has to essentially buy their affection with wit, attention and money (dinners, flowers, jewelry etc.).

A woman has to be passably attractive, show up and be willing. PERIOD.

There is virtually no way for a man to be anything but the baby-sitter, watching his wife dress up, go out and come back well-used in an open relationship.


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## Marc878 (Aug 26, 2015)

If you have to fight for a marriage you don’t have one.


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## Andy1001 (Jun 29, 2016)

Woman in nightclub approached by a man she finds attractive. Her “I’m in an open marriage shall we go back to your place”. Him “Great let’s go”.

Man in nightclub approaches attractive woman. Him “I’m in an open marriage shall we go back to your place”. Her “Go home to your wife”.
This is your future op.


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## Rus47 (Apr 1, 2021)

rodrigoramirez1209 said:


> I know anyone else would have left divorced but I love my wife, We've been together since 15 years old and I want to continue to be with my wife so *I want to fight for our marriage*. So my question to you guys is my wife continues to have the urges to date And sleep around with other guys, And it makes me sad that she feels this way and *it's hurting our relationship.* Any advice would be helpful.


Firstly, there is NOTHING to fight for. You don't have a marriage, at least in the typical meaning of the term. You wanting to continue to be with her just means you will put up with anything. She wants to "open" the marriage, but she didn't ask first she just did it. You don't actually have any relationship.. Your wishing you did and feeling sad makes no difference.

You have been together for 14 years and she has no loyalty to you at all. She wants to return to her teenage self and eff as many men as possible. While you work your a$$ supporting her and your kid(s). You might as well work your a$$ off without thinking of her getting railed by anyone and everyone all of the time. My advice is to divorce her like yesterday. 

BTW, get tested for STDs and don't have sex with her without protection if you value your health. Not sure how you could manage to be within ten feet of her after this level of disrespect. Betting she has been living her new life for awhile already, maybe in your bed while you are working nights.


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## Rus47 (Apr 1, 2021)

rodrigoramirez1209 said:


> At the moment it's not possible because we both don't have anyware to go, we have 3 kids and we can't afford to make rent payments on our own due to the fact that we are both eyes deep in credit card debt.


So she will need to get a *JOB* and start paying bills herself. She wants the single life. Single people work a job. She wont find anyone to take her full time with three kids and no money.

Cut the credit cards up, close the accounts, what you don't have cash for don't buy.


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## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

rodrigoramirez1209 said:


> So i got off work at 2am caught my wife texting a guy on Instagram they were both saying"I love you" and "baby" "babe" stuff like that and And so I broke down and I left and stayed in a hotel. She later found me where I was staying after attempting to call me multiple times and we talked about it while at the hotel. She Confessed to me that she loves me and wants to stay with me but she wants to date and sleep around with other people and for me to do the same pretty much having an open relationship. The reason for this is because we were together since she was 15 years old We are 29 now. we got pregnant so we got married at 18. She confessed to me that she didn't get to date other people or sleep with other people and she Wants to know how it feels like to date someone else and to sleep with someone else sense I'm the only person she's been with Physically and she's the only person I've ever been with too. After talking about it I told her if she wants to sleep Around with other people then we can't be together but if you want to try and save our marriage you have to delete your Instagram, She broke down of course because she loves the guy she was talking with on Instagram, So I decided that she can continue to have that long distance relationship on Instagram. If she promised me not to date or have sex with anyone else, I figured a long distance relationship is better than having her date other guys because I know she's going to get emotionally attached to that person and continue to have sex with them behind my back. I know anyone else would have left divorced but I love my wife, We've been together since 15 years old and I want to continue to be with my wife so I want to fight for our marriage. So my question to you guys is my wife continues to have the urges to date And sleep around with other guys, And it makes me sad that she feels this way and it's hurting our relationship. Any advice would be helpful.


You allow this long distance relationship, she will just start looking closer to home and you will end up losing her anyhow.
If you want to fight for your marriage, you need to be willing to lose it (although that doesnt sound intuitive).

Start doing the 180 on her immediately.
Get yourself tested for STDs and let her know.
See a lawyer to see what your options are
How many kids do you have?
Tell all family and friends what she is doing and proposing, this is not your burden to bear
If the OM has a gf or spouse, let them know also
Ask her to move out of your home or at least the bedroom you share
Ask a lawyer about finances, etc
Seriously, you are very yound. I know you love your wife but there are plenty of decent young women who would love to have a faithful and committed partner. Consider a divorce and move on as your wife is a **** and will not change.
Ask your family to help you. If you stay with her it will be soul destroying.


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## Dictum Veritas (Oct 22, 2020)

aine said:


> You allow this long distance relationship, she will just start looking closer to home and you will end up losing her anyhow.
> If you want to fight for your marriage, you need to be willing to lose it (although that doesnt sound intuitive).
> 
> Start doing the 180 on her immediately.
> ...


I just want to add:

Expose the online affair and her request for the open marriage to family and friends, both yours and hers. Yours because you need the support and hers because she needs the people around her to give her a reality check.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

@rodrigoramirez1209 sorry your wife has unilaterally decided to end your family. See a lawyer ASAP.


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## BigDaddyNY (May 19, 2021)

rodrigoramirez1209 said:


> So i got off work at 2am caught my wife texting a guy on Instagram they were both saying"I love you" and "baby" "babe" stuff like that and And so I broke down and I left and stayed in a hotel. She later found me where I was staying after attempting to call me multiple times and we talked about it while at the hotel. She Confessed to me that she loves me and wants to stay with me but she wants to date and sleep around with other people and for me to do the same pretty much having an open relationship. The reason for this is because we were together since she was 15 years old We are 29 now. we got pregnant so we got married at 18. She confessed to me that she didn't get to date other people or sleep with other people and she Wants to know how it feels like to date someone else and to sleep with someone else sense I'm the only person she's been with Physically and she's the only person I've ever been with too. After talking about it I told her if she wants to sleep Around with other people then we can't be together but if you want to try and save our marriage you have to delete your Instagram, She broke down of course because she loves the guy she was talking with on Instagram, So I decided that she can continue to have that long distance relationship on Instagram. If she promised me not to date or have sex with anyone else, I figured a long distance relationship is better than having her date other guys because I know she's going to get emotionally attached to that person and continue to have sex with them behind my back. I know anyone else would have left divorced but I love my wife, We've been together since 15 years old and I want to continue to be with my wife so I want to fight for our marriage. So my question to you guys is my wife continues to have the urges to date And sleep around with other guys, And it makes me sad that she feels this way and it's hurting our relationship. Any advice would be helpful.


You totally screwed the pooch and have set up the demise of your marriage. You have allowed your wife to force you into an open marriage. You are sad and pathetic. She knows you have no balls and will be able to do whatever she wants. She will keep pushing the boundaries and you will keep going along because you are afraid. My advice is man up. Tell her it is you and no one else, or she can be free to date whomever she wants as a single woman.


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## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

rodrigoramirez1209 said:


> So I decided that she can continue to have that long distance relationship on Instagram. *If she promised me not to date or have sex with anyone else*, I figured a long distance relationship is better than having her date other guys because I know she's going to get emotionally attached to that person and continue to have sex with them behind my back.


She already promised you not to date or have sex with other men, it's called MARRIAGE VOWS.

Her reasoning is a LIE. Very few women want to date around and have sex with lots of random guys...she is tricking you with that, because she only has ONE person she wants to date and have sex with and that's her online boyfriend, and it's NOT because she missed out on dating around when she was younger, it's because she is emotionally attached to him and feels like she is in love with him, and wants HIM more than she wants YOU. 

I have a sister who did something very similar to what your wife is doing, she talked her husband of 20 years into opening their marriage so she could chase a guy she was really attracted to. He didn't want to do it because he loved her, but he gave in to make her happy and so she wouldn't leave.

Less than a year later she turned around and said that he obviously didn't love her if he was willing to let her screw other men, and used that as a reason to dump him anyway and shack up with a new guy. It was disgusting and manipulative and hateful...but SHE DIDN'T CARE. She took advantage of the man who loved her so she could get anything she wanted, and dumped him as soon as she didn't need him anymore.

THAT is what your wife is doing, and it's possible that it might already be too late...but she definitely WILL be gone at the end of this when she doesn't need you anymore. If you have any chance of winning her back, you need to follow the advice the men on here have given you. DO NOT allow her to use and take advantage of your love for her, because it has NO value to her at all the way it does to you.


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## Annonymous Joe (9 mo ago)

Enigma32 said:


> I know a guy who let his wife talk him into an open relationship. He fumbles with other women trying to get laid but no one wants him. Meanwhile, his wife is getting pounded out by other guys on the regular while he sits home alone.
> 
> Unless you get off on the idea of being a cuckold, your marriage is already toast. If you don't walk away from her, then your self respect will die along with your marriage. It's up to you.


Funny you said something like this. My wife (STBXW) has a friend who has an "open" relationship, but it sounds just like the wife wanted to get pounded elsewhere and dragged him into it. I actually had a one-on-one with the guy, mind you, I rarely see them, and he wasn't saying it directly, but in guy code basically saying that he had to accept the way his wife was, meanwhile at parties, I've heard the wife openly make fun of him for getting "soft" when the opportunity with other women presented itself. These people have 2 kids and the husband makes good $ so he is screwed.


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## Annonymous Joe (9 mo ago)

Andy1001 said:


> Woman in nightclub approached by a man she finds attractive. Her “I’m in an open marriage shall we go back to your place”. Him “Great let’s go”.
> 
> Man in nightclub approaches attractive woman. Him “I’m in an open marriage shall we go back to your place”. Her “Go home to your wife”.
> This is your future op.


Don't be Will Smith.


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## jsmart (Mar 14, 2015)

I want to co-sign both @Rob_1 and @LisaDiane Excellent post. Your wife wants to bang THIS guy. How sure are you that he’s distant? Even if he is, a guy will pay for flights and hotel for a sure thing and your wife is a sure thing for him.

It was a huge mistake for you to allow her to manipulate you with the “I never had another guy BS.” The fact that you were both each other’s first is a beautiful thing that should be cherished but your wife and mother of your 3 kids instead wants to blow up the family so she can have a fantasy with a guy she doesn’t even know. Or maybe she just wants to whor. herself out on the carousel.

Just as rob’s post condemns today’s weak men, we have another equally damaging phenomenon of women wanting to be whor… Today’s no accountability and no consequences life that the West provides for women with lopsided family courts and no fault divorce that incentivize family breakup and reward even adulterous women with cash and prizes are a major culprit. Throw in abortion at any stage of pregnancy, birth control, and education that encourages girls to be like men and boys to be feminine and a culture that glamorizes single life as well as single motherhood and you get what we have today. With the destruction of the nuclear Family being the goal, both sexes are falling in place to allow the implementation of a new order that is completely controlled by unelected bureaucrats. But hey, at least we’ll have “free” healthcare and college “education “.


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## blackclover3 (Apr 23, 2021)

she already cheated - and slapped you on the face by saying she wants to F other people
what she really means, I want to find another person and move on and you are a plan B so I need your support to find a better husband and father for my kids and you need to pay it, and even pay for the condoms she will be using. 

now you need to wake up and smell the flowers

the fact that she didnt feel remersful for her cheating and saying "Love you" to another guy is enough to proceed with a divorce. dude, how will you feel when she says I love you and Babe back to you. you will always think she is saying to another guy. 

reminds me when you go to vegas and strip clubs and Ho Ho go around and tell everyone babe and sweety


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## Captain Obvious (Mar 14, 2021)

She doesn’t love you. She tolerates you right now bc you coparent with her, she’s comfortable with you, and you gave her permission to cheat. When she finds somebody else to her liking you’re history. I’m sure she’ll thank you for your time, so at least you’ll have that right?


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

rodrigoramirez1209 said:


> At the moment it's not possible because we both don't have anyware to go, we have 3 kids and we can't afford to make rent payments on our own due to the fact that we are both eyes deep in credit card debt.


In that case you must set clear boundaries for the marriage to continue. So what if she cries, this is your marriage and children we are talking about. She is cheating on you and you let her???? If she wants to save the marriage she has to be faithful. If she won't be then you have to tell her there will be no marriage.
Be a man and stand up to her.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

rodrigoramirez1209 said:


> At the moment it's not possible because we both don't have anyware to go, we have 3 kids and we can't afford to make rent payments on our own due to the fact that we are both eyes deep in credit card debt.


Surely one of you has family you can go to? Why are you deep in debt?


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## Taxman (Dec 21, 2016)

You give her the following speech: Fine, go off and be irresponsible and whatever low creature you want to be. BUT be aware that neither the children nor myself will be there for you when this madness passes. I will not wait, and as you may or may not know, you being intimate with another person is a deal breaker for me. YOU will be removed from my life and our children's lives. I will not mince words with our children, our parents and our friends. I will tell them the reason for your departure. I will put it in the gravest terms possible. You will be ostracized and you will bear the blame of the dissolution of our marriage. You have 48 hours within which to give me ONE GOOD REASON TO EVEN WANT YOU BACK AFTER STATING THIS HEINOUS PROPOSAL.

I had one woman who called her husband mean. Two hours later, she was explaining to her mother that she really was not serious, but her husband took this completely out of context. Her mother called her an idiot, and told her to get kneepads so that she could beg her husband to take her back.


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## Rus47 (Apr 1, 2021)

rodrigoramirez1209 said:


> we can't afford to make rent payments on our own due to the fact that we are both eyes deep in credit card debt.


This actually needs to be fixed no matter what else happens whether you divorce or not. Get some debt counseling from a no-fee volunteer debt organization. Most communities have them. NOT any of these debt consolidation services. They just put you in debt to them besides all of the rest. Focus on paying off the smallest debt first and then move on to the next.

She MUST get a job to help bail the water out of the sinkimg boat

Early in our marriage we were too broke to pay attention. It put a lot of stress on the family. Cut up the cards and pay cash for everything. You can be debt free sooner than you think


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## drencrom (Jul 1, 2021)

rodrigoramirez1209 said:


> We've been together since 15 years old and I want to continue to be with my wife so I want to fight for our marriage.


Your wife sounds exactly like my X. You have no marriage. You are married to a trollop. I'm guessing you want to fight for your marriage simply because of the pain of divorce. I get it, and it is painful.

But once you hit the light at the end of the tunnel, you'll feel silly for wanting to fight for a "marriage" with someone that wants to bone other men.

Advice, get rid of her. If you don't you WILL regret it, I promise you that. Unless you make the decision to cuckold yourself. If that works for you, then you won't regret it.

So what do you want? To cuckold yourself and be content that you didn't get a divorce? Or free yourself from a lifetime of pain being married to someone you'll never be able to trust, because the feelings she has won't go away until she gets too old where all of her options are gone.


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## drencrom (Jul 1, 2021)

rodrigoramirez1209 said:


> At the moment it's not possible because we both don't have anyware to go, we have 3 kids and we can't afford to make rent payments on our own due to the fact that we are both eyes deep in credit card debt.


Then I don't know what to tell you. If it's finances that are the problem, then you are going to just have to be miserable. Or, you could get a divorce and declare bankruptcy. Oh, and document that she wants to sleep around. In a divorce it makes no difference, but if you can prove she is a skank that just might bring too many men around your children, you could get custody.

But again, I'm going to guess you don't want to do all of that. Not sure what advice you can be given other than divorce. Because she isn't going to change. Even if she decides to not sleep around and save her family, she will always have those itches and thoughts in her mind of the desire to, and sorry but I have to put it harshly so you get the idea, spreading her legs for other men.


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## Numb26 (Sep 11, 2019)

This story has been told so many times. What happened that turned men into so many doormat simps?


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## Rus47 (Apr 1, 2021)

Numb26 said:


> This story has been told so many times. What happened that turned men into so many doormat simps?


Modern western culture


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## Numb26 (Sep 11, 2019)

Rus47 said:


> Modern western culture


It's sad. Effeminate, weak men with no self-respect are overrunning the world.


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## Dictum Veritas (Oct 22, 2020)

I'm giving OP the benefit of the doubt. He has been caught off-guard, has not expected this and has Disney as a reference to what a woman wants and Tic-Toc guys as an example of how guys has to handle girls. I'm not going to assume anything else.

@Annonymous Joe , your next actions will either establish you as a man she has to reckon with or a boy she can walk all over. I would like to think that you are gathering wisdom here and you have this.


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

OP is allowing her to continue talking to a guy that he heard her tell I love you’s to.
Pretty weak. No doubt she knows his weakness and has already been banging other dudes. File bankruptcy and divorce at the same time and ditch her. No way I’d stay married to a woman that not only loves another guy, but says she wants to be a slore and keep me for a wallet. I think I’d give a hard pass on that.

OP, divorce your wretched wife.


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## jparistotle (Jul 10, 2018)

rodrigoramirez1209 said:


> At the moment it's not possible because we both don't have anyware to go, we have 3 kids and we can't afford to make rent payments on our own due to the fact that we are both eyes deep in credit card debt.


Time to move on. Do you have family you can move in with. She goes with hers and you go with yours. Shared custody of the kids and no more contact with your wayward wife. Anyone who thinks it is a good idea to meet someone on Instagram is not committed to your relationship and you should end it. Protect your kids there are a lot of unstable people predictors out there and your ex wife has fallen for one. Tell her good luck and goodbye. Hope she is happy.


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## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

Dictum Veritas said:


> I'm giving OP the benefit of the doubt. He has been caught off-guard, has not expected this and has Disney as a reference to what a woman wants and Tic-Toc guys as an example of how guys has to handle girls. I'm not going to assume anything else.
> 
> @Annonymous Joe , your next actions will either establish you as a man she has to reckon with or a boy she can walk all over. I would like to think that you are gathering wisdom here and you have this.


I don't think Annonymous Joe is the OP...


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## TheHappyGuy (Aug 27, 2012)

Dictum Veritas said:


> Just to elaborate. Men and women are not the same and the rules of attraction is not the same.
> 
> Let's say an open relationship is purely sexual:
> 
> ...


Wow, I geel sorry for you for being stuck in such ancient stereotypes. Or maybe this reflects your social circle? 

A mate of mine used to have an open relationship and didn't have money nor was he a stud. He found plenty of willing partners to have sex with him.

I agree that is a type of woman out there that have Sex in return for material goods. There are plenty of others, too.


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## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

Dictum Veritas said:


> I'm giving OP the benefit of the doubt. He has been caught off-guard, has not expected this and has Disney as a reference to what a woman wants and Tic-Toc guys as an example of how guys has to handle girls. I'm not going to assume anything else.


I agree with this. Up until he saw her phone and those texts, he was working until 2am for his family that he is devoted to, and he believed that his life partner felt the same way.

We are all giving him advice that is right and true, but I'm sure this is the last thing he thought he would have to deal with and he must be devastated. I know I certainly agreed to give up things that I never thought I would, in the hopes of saving my marriage and keeping the love I thought we had. I remember my brother-in-law looking like he had been spun on a speeding merry-go-round, and like he was trying not to puke and pass out, and it was brutal.

It's going to take him some time to process and ACCEPT his new reality, and I totally understand.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

Set her free.


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

A man should fight for the things he values, but a cheating wife should never be among them.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

Captain Obvious said:


> She doesn’t love you. She tolerates you right now bc you coparent with her, she’s comfortable with you, and you gave her permission to cheat. When she finds somebody else to her liking you’re history. I’m sure she’ll thank you for your time, so at least you’ll have that right?


But what if she does love him, very much? But still wants to have sex with other men?

That means her love for him is not strong enough so if she can't reign in her desire to have sex with other men, the marriage should end.


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## Dictum Veritas (Oct 22, 2020)

LisaDiane said:


> I don't think Annonymous Joe is the OP...


My Bad, My Apologies, @Annonymous Joe , I meant @rodrigoramirez1209 , but I scrolled to the top of the wrong page. Hey, I'm old enough to say I didn't have my glasses, but actually I F'd up.


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## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

Dictum Veritas said:


> My Bad, My Apologies, @Annonymous Joe , I meant @rodrigoramirez1209 , but I scrolled to the top of the wrong page. Hey, I'm old enough to say I didn't have my glasses, but actually I F'd up.


Lol!! Well, I had to double-check when I read your post, because for a second I thought you were right...so I'm old enough to have my memory fail me!!!


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## Dictum Veritas (Oct 22, 2020)

TheHappyGuy said:


> Wow, I geel sorry for you for being stuck in such ancient stereotypes. Or maybe this reflects your social circle?
> 
> A mate of mine used to have an open relationship and didn't have money nor was he a stud. He found plenty of willing partners to have sex with him.
> 
> I agree that is a type of woman out there that have Sex in return for material goods. There are plenty of others, too.


Yeah, you do you, I do me and I won't tell you what I think of your social circles etc. when you keep your opinion about my friends to yourself.

Stereotypes are stereotypes for a reason... Because they are true. The "ancient" ones can be called so because they have stood the test of time and people who think they know better... Chronos is just biding it's time to teach them the hard lessons the hard way.

Your friend might not be a stud to you, but I'd put it this way, you simply don't have the hormones to judge.

Now feel sorry for someone else. If this comment seems unkind, it is because it is a response to a personal attack from someone I don't know and in who's words and advice I won't place any stock in going forward.

Had it been A comment started with a measured "I disagree", then we could have had a conversation, now it's simply just ON.


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## Numb26 (Sep 11, 2019)

Dictum Veritas said:


> Yeah, you do you, I do me and I won't tell you what I think of your social circles etc. when you keep your mouth opinion about my friends to yourself.
> 
> Stereotypes are stereotypes for a reason... Because they are true. The "ancient" ones can be called so because they have stood the test of time and people who think they know better... Chronos is just biding it's time to teach them the hard lessons the hard way.
> 
> ...


Funny how beta simps slap at you, isn't it?


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## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

MattMatt said:


> But what if she does love him, very much? But still wants to have sex with other men?
> 
> That means her love for him is not strong enough so if she can't reign in her desire to have sex with other men, the marriage should end.


From the text messages that he saw and her heartbroken response to having to give up the guy she is talking to, it sounds like she is more in love with her internet boyfriend. I don't think she wants "other men" for sex at all I think she wants sex and LOVE from this one guy she is talking to on Instagram.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

You married too young. That can make for some fun first years, but you know a person's brain doesn't even fully develop and mature until they're in their mid twenties, and when it does there is sometimes a whole new perspective. Sounds like neither one of you ever got to really explore or maybe even ever be on your own. That's important to your development.

I imagine she just never got to explore and think it's time but I sure wouldn't do it while married to her. I would get a divorce and share custody of any children 50/50 so that any children aren't around the new men she'll be dating.


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## Numb26 (Sep 11, 2019)

LisaDiane said:


> From the text messages that he saw and her heartbroken response to having to give up the guy she is talking to, it sounds like she is more in love with her internet boyfriend. I don't think she wants "other men" for sex at all I think she wants sex and LOVE from this one guy she is talking to on Instagram.


And he will probably let it continue


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## Dictum Veritas (Oct 22, 2020)

MattMatt said:


> But what if she does love him, very much? But still wants to have sex with other men?
> 
> That means her love for him is not strong enough so if she can't reign in her desire to have sex with other men, the marriage should end.


Yeah, that's the kind of love a wife can keep and shove somewhere that has never seen ultra-violet light.


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## Dictum Veritas (Oct 22, 2020)

DownByTheRiver said:


> You married too young. That can make for some fun first years, but you know a person's brain doesn't even fully develop and mature until they're in their mid twenties, and when it does there is sometimes a whole new perspective. Sounds like neither one of you ever got to really explore or maybe even ever be on your own. That's important to your development.
> 
> My magic she just never got to explore and think it's time but I sure wouldn't do it while married to her. I would get a divorce and share custody of any children 50/50 so that any children aren't around the new men she'll be dating.


People marry when they marry. Next thing will be people under 38 is too young. No, studies actually show that virgin marriages in young people that succeed are empirically proven to be the happiest marriages, producing the most stable families.

Guess what Grampa and Grandma actually got it right when they married at 18 and we are the idiots who are screwing it all up because we let go of our principles and loyalties while chasing money, promiscuity, freedom and brands.


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## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

Numb26 said:


> And he will probably let it continue


I really hope you are wrong...


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

Dictum Veritas said:


> People marry when they marry. Next thing will be people under 38 is too young. No, studies actually show that virgin marriages in young people that succeed are empirically proven to be the happiest marriages, producing the most stable families.
> 
> Guess what Grampa and Grandma actually got it right when they married at 18 and we are the idiots who are screwing it all up because we let go of our principles and loyalties while chasing money, promiscuity, freedom and brands.


I agree, they marry when they marry. The prerequisite in my mind is H has to be living on his own and financially heading in right direction. He needs that adult time. Same for her although that can vary but I'm for the woman to have been on her own.

I can tell you as a parent, that was my thing with the boys, and a little older. In some ways


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## Dictum Veritas (Oct 22, 2020)

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> I agree, they marry when they marry. The prerequisite in my mind is H has to be living on his own and financially heading in right direction. He needs that adult time. Same for her although that can vary but I'm for the woman to have been on her own.
> 
> I can tell you as a parent, that was my thing with the boys, and a little older. In some ways


I just take exception with people who suggest that a person has to screw half the civilized world and a smidgen of something else before they marry or else they are too young. I'm also against the concept that 18 year old's are too young to marry because they're still totally neuroplastic. That's actually natural, to grow a little with your kids in the beginning. Nature intended this. If I had my life over, my focus would have been totally different and my first kid would have been born in 1989 and not in 2011.


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## BigDaddyNY (May 19, 2021)

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> I agree, they marry when they marry. The prerequisite in my mind is H has to be living on his own and financially heading in right direction. He needs that adult time. Same for her although that can vary but I'm for the woman to have been on her own.
> 
> I can tell you as a parent, that was my thing with the boys, and a little older. In some ways


I think it is a highly individualized thing. My wife had some "adult time", but I was living with my parents until we got married. My wife had lived in an apartment with he BF, they broke up and she moved back home for a few months, then moved in with a female roommate. All prior to turning 19. I met her right before she moved in with her roommate. They got burglarized about 8 month after moving in together. Her roommate got freaked out by that and moved back home. My wife, then GF, moved in with me. Kind of crazy that my parents let my GF move in when I was barely 17 and still in high school. Somehow my mom knew she was the one. In fact we broke up a short while and I think my mom would have kicked me out before her. Now I don't know if that counts as adult time, but I did have a plan. Enlisted in the army, asked her to marry me, married 6 months later. We have never looked back with regret or longing for something else.

I don't think the OP's wife wanting other men has anything to do with getting married young. To me that is a copout and a lame excuse for her bad behavior. Apparently she is polyamorous since she says she loves her husband, but is also proclaiming love for her AP. I say that tongue in cheek since I really think she is just a cake eater. She doesn't want an open marriage. She wants and has fallen in love with another person, but wants that safe and secure home life to continue. The OP's initial response was in the right direction. It fell apart when he said, oh you're in love with him, I don't want to hurt you, so you can keep it going so long as you don't sleep with him. What utter nonsense.


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## BigDaddyNY (May 19, 2021)

BigDaddyNY said:


> The OP's initial response was in the right direction. *It fell apart when he said, oh you're in love with him, I don't want to hurt you, so you can keep it going so long as you don't sleep with him.* What utter nonsense.


This baffles and angers me the more I think about it. How in the hell does a husband come to the conclusion that a good course of action is to tell his wife he is okay with her being in love with another man? That is exactly what his words and actions say. I don't think I could ever come back from reading a message where my wife told another man she loves him. And if I did, I certainly wouldn't go along with allowing it to continue. There would be a drop everything to do with him and stay with me or we're done. I would give all of 5 seconds to answer, because if it took longer than that for MY wife to choose ME, I don't want her as my wife. Actually she isn't my wife at that point anymore.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

Isn’t this what is called “monkey branching”? She wants to see if it will work out with new guy (a guy knowingly dating a married woman, btw, stellar character there) before she dumps you. You deserve better than this.


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## Dictum Veritas (Oct 22, 2020)

BigDaddyNY said:


> This baffles and angers me the more I think about it. How in the hell does a husband come to the conclusion that a good course of action is to tell his wife he is okay with her being in love with another man? That is exactly what his words and actions say. I don't think I could ever come back from reading a message where my wife told another man she loves him. And if I did, I certainly wouldn't go along with allowing it to continue. There would be a drop everything to do with him and stay with me or we're done. I would give all of 5 seconds to answer, because if it took longer than that for MY wife to choose ME, I don't want her as my wife. Actually she isn't my wife at that point anymore.


That's you and me both, but we're no-nonsense kind of guys. The newer generation of men has been so downtrodden, a majority of them don't know which way to turn to anymore. Just say one thing wrong and you are cancelled.

The art of constructive anger is lost and everything masculine is taught to be toxic. Many have fallen for that BS.


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## re16 (Oct 9, 2012)

There is a 99% probability that her request is retroactive, because she already opened the marriage and her legs to the OM.

OP, you have to move forward with the idea that she has already cheated until she proves otherwise. Step 1, go to a parking lot and tell her she is going to take a polygraph in 30 mins about whether or not she has already cheated.... you don't even need a real appointment, she what trickle truth you get...parking lot confession.... there will be more she admits.... when she does, tell her you have to change the poly questions now and reschedule.

Sorry to say, but this marriage is toast... in the 1% chance that she hasn't had a physical affair yet, your only chance to save this would be tell her you are divorcing her and she might get slapped back into reality.... I'm not sure you want that though.

If you are trying to stop the affair (and thats what it is) Go nuclear on everyone, call the dude, call his mom, his boss... whatever it takes. Make your presence known.

ETA: If it were me, if my wife said she loved someone else... I would just end the marriage, without discussion....


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

Dictum Veritas said:


> People marry when they marry. Next thing will be people under 38 is too young. No, studies actually show that virgin marriages in young people that succeed are empirically proven to be the happiest marriages, producing the most stable families.
> 
> Guess what Grampa and Grandma actually got it right when they married at 18 and we are the idiots who are screwing it all up because we let go of our principles and loyalties while chasing money, promiscuity, freedom and brands.


That's not at all what I've seen firsthand in my lifetime. Nearly everyone I know married young because of the generation they came from and then divorced late 20s. Fortunately, a lot of them didn't have kids yet since ours was the generation that embraced birth control. Lots of miserable trapped people out there who married and got pregnant young and never had a chance to do anything else.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

DownByTheRiver said:


> That's not at all what I've seen firsthand in my lifetime. Nearly everyone I know married young because of the generation they came from and then divorced late 20s. Fortunately, a lot of them didn't have kids yet since ours was the generation that embraced birth control. Lots of miserable trapped people out there who married and got pregnant young and never had a chance to do anything else.


People often assume all long marriages are happy ones.


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## Dictum Veritas (Oct 22, 2020)

DownByTheRiver said:


> That's not at all what I've seen firsthand in my lifetime. Nearly everyone I know married young because of the generation they came from and then divorced late 20s. Fortunately, a lot of them didn't have kids yet since ours was the generation that embraced birth control. Lots of miserable trapped people out there who married and got pregnant young and never had a chance to do anything else.


Every time someone married young, you say the same thing. I know the modern way of thinking is destroying the nuclear family. @TexasMom1216 , there is no presumptions in empirical studies and I have a family of people who married young and stayed together for a lifetime. I'm the odd one out, because I picked "modern" women with degrees and a view of life that would lead to statements like "you married too young". I can say some (of my family) were happier than others, but they all were adult about their choices and didn't cut and run because the butterflies faded at some stage.


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## jsmart (Mar 14, 2015)

TexasMom1216 said:


> Isn’t this what is called “monkey branching”? She wants to see if it will work out with new guy (a guy knowingly dating a married woman, btw, stellar character there) before she dumps you. You deserve better than this.


Tex, you are right. She may think that this guy she’s talking to is a better catch and is wanting to jump ship. The issue is, what kind of man truly loves a married mother of 3 that he supposedly has never seen in person? This guy is probably a complete loser and his wife is buying his schtick. I wonder if there’s someone else closer to her that she is also involved with. I can’t rap my head around the idea that a young mother of 3 would risk her family for a guy she’s never met. I think there’s more to this than OP knows.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

DownByTheRiver said:


> That's not at all what I've seen firsthand in my lifetime. Nearly everyone I know married young because of the generation they came from and then divorced late 20s. Fortunately, a lot of them didn't have kids yet since ours was the generation that embraced birth control. Lots of miserable trapped people out there who married and got pregnant young and never had a chance to do anything else.


So you're saying there are plenty of happy and plenty of unhappy folks in long marriages. 

Welcome to the human condition. Where have you been.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

Dictum Veritas said:


> Every time someone married young, you say the same thing. I know the modern way of thinking is destroying the nuclear family. @TexasMom1216 , there is no presumptions in empirical studies and I have a family of people who married young and stayed together for a lifetime. I'm the odd one out, because I picked "modern" women with degrees and a view of life that would lead to statements like "you married too young". I can say some were happier than others, but they all were adult about their choices and didn't cut and run because the butterflies faded at some stage.


Just because they stayed together doesn’t mean they were happy. Is happiness important? Opinions vary. It’s unrealistic to assume all of life will be one deliriously happy all the time. Butterflies do fade and adults make it work. I know people who married young who are fine. For myself, that would have been a bad idea. People are different and everyone should make the choice that works for them. I would never encourage my son to marry that young, and I would discourage him from marrying a woman who had never lived on her own. If that happens, I will hope it works out and be supportive. We all do the best we can with the information we have and hope for the best. “Modern” is not a pejorative, and women having the right to a say in their lives is not “ruining the nuclear family.”


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> So you're saying there are plenty of happy and plenty of unhappy folks in long marriages.
> 
> Welcome to the human condition. Where have you been.


I'm not even saying about long marriages. You added that. I'm talking about people who meet someone at 15 with a teenage brain and that's who they stay with often run into maturity down the line.

Once they are old enough to get their bearings and mature, they discover they wish they were on a different path. A lot of times, it's too late.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

DownByTheRiver said:


> I'm not even saying about long marriages. You added that. I'm talking about people who meet someone at 15 with a teenage brain and that's who they stay with often run into maturity down the line.
> 
> Once they are old enough to get their bearings and mature, they discover they wish they were on a different path. A lot of times, it's too late.


I was an idiot at 15. Hell, I was an idiot at 22. With disastrous taste in men. I almost fell for a liar at 30. Maybe it’s me though. 😂😉😂😉😂🤪


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

DownByTheRiver said:


> I'm not even saying about long marriages. You added that. I'm talking about people who meet someone at 15 with a teenage brain and that's who they stay with often run into maturity down the line.
> 
> Once they are old enough to get their bearings and mature, they discover they wish they were on a different path. A lot of times, it's too late.


You stated married young and never had a chance to do anything else. Aren't you referring to those in a long M?


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## DudeInProgress (Jun 10, 2019)

BigDaddyNY said:


> This baffles and angers me the more I think about it. How in the hell does a husband come to the conclusion that a good course of action is to tell his wife he is okay with her being in love with another man? That is exactly what his words and actions say. I don't think I could ever come back from reading a message where my wife told another man she loves him. And if I did, I certainly wouldn't go along with allowing it to continue. There would be a drop everything to do with him and stay with me or we're done. I would give all of 5 seconds to answer, because if it took longer than that for MY wife to choose ME, I don't want her as my wife. Actually she isn't my wife at that point anymore.


Weakness, fear of loss, not placing a high enough value on his own dignity/self respect, not recognizing his value in the relationship (or not bringing enough value to the relationship), lack of experience with women / relationships, lack of options


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## Dictum Veritas (Oct 22, 2020)

TexasMom1216 said:


> I was an idiot at 15. Hell, I was an idiot at 22. With disastrous taste in men. I almost fell for a liar at 30. Maybe it’s me though. 😂😉😂😉😂🤪


First world problems, real life or death adversity causes people to get their heads out of their backsides very early. Not everyone has the luxury of being an idiot at 15 and expect to survive.


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## BigDaddyNY (May 19, 2021)

DownByTheRiver said:


> I'm not even saying about long marriages. You added that. I'm talking about people who meet someone at 15 with a teenage brain and that's who they stay with often run into maturity down the line.
> 
> Once they are old enough to get their bearings and mature, they discover they wish they were on a different path. A lot of times, it's too late.


Isn't a 14 year marriage a long marriage? 

You are right that maturity matters, but I think people will make bad choices and regret the path not taken at any age. In my life I have plenty of examples of people that married young and are apparently happily married decades later. I also know people that couldn't make a relationship last at any age. In the end I think it comes down to compatibility. If two 16 year olds are compatible it will work out in the long run. Likewise, if two 27 year olds aren't compatible it won't work out.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

Dictum Veritas said:


> First world problems, real life or death adversity causes people to get their heads out of their backsides very early. Not everyone has the luxury of being an idiot at 15 and expect to survive.


Very true. I couldn’t put gas in my own car until I was 20. I’ve led a very “first world” life.


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## rodrigoramirez1209 (7 mo ago)

Dictum Veritas said:


> I just want to add:
> 
> Expose the online affair and her request for the open marriage to family and friends, both yours and hers. Yours because you need the support and hers because she needs the people around her to give her a reality check.





Enigma32 said:


> I know a guy who let his wife talk him into an open relationship. He fumbles with other women trying to get laid but no one wants him. Meanwhile, his wife is getting pounded out by other guys on the regular while he sits home alone.
> 
> Unless you get off on the idea of being a cuckold, your marriage is already toast. If you don't walk away from her, then your self respect will die along with your marriage. It's up to you.


Yea that's what I'm afraid of. I've been looking and trying to talk with other women but it's not going so well, I've had girls tell me and my friends tell me that im not ugly that I won't have any problems finding someone but I'm trying and no girl seems to be interested in me, mean while my wife tells me that she has been getting asked out left and right but she has been telling them no that shes married out of respect for me but the temptation of guys Constantly asking her out is getting to her, which is why she wants permission to date them. I already told her NO to fight the temptations and to be strong so as far as I know she hasn't done anything yet other than flirt with that guy on Instagram


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## Cletus (Apr 27, 2012)

BigDaddyNY said:


> You are right that maturity matters, but I think people will make bad choices and regret the path not taken at any age.


Ok, but what are the relative risks of making choices that you later regret at 16 compared to 30? The human brain isn't even fully formed at 16. You will probably change more in the 10 years after your 16th birthday than at any other similar span later in life. It is for most of us physically impossible to be fully mature at 16.


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## BigDaddyNY (May 19, 2021)

rodrigoramirez1209 said:


> Yea that's what I'm afraid of. I've been looking and trying to talk with other women but it's not going so well, I've had girls tell me and my friends tell me that im not ugly that I won't have any problems finding someone but I'm trying and no girl seems to be interested in me, mean while my wife tells me that she has been getting asked out left and right but she has been telling them no that shes married out of respect for me but the temptation of guys Constantly asking her out is getting to her, which is why she wants permission to date them. I already told her NO to fight the temptations and to be strong so as far as I know she hasn't done anything yet other than flirt with that guy on Instagram


Dude, come on, get real. She isn't just flirting, she told him she loves him. You are okay with you wife loving another man? Let me guess, she told you she just said that and didn't mean it. 

So let me get this straight. You've told girls and friends about this? And their response wasn't dump her, instead it was to tell you there won't be any problem with a married guys finding women? Please tell me this is a joke. 

Where is she when guys are "constantly" asking her out? Even great looking women don't get asked out constantly unless they are in that kind of environment (like club, bar etc.) and putting out the vibe they are interested. Your wife is a POS if guys asking her out is all it takes for her to get the itch to sleep around after being married 14 years and having 3 kids. She doesn't need your permission. She will do whatever she wants, that is pretty clear.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

BigDaddyNY said:


> Isn't a 14 year marriage a long marriage?
> 
> You are right that maturity matters, but I think people will make bad choices and regret the path not taken at any age. In my life I have plenty of examples of people that married young and are apparently happily married decades later. I also know people that couldn't make a relationship last at any age. In the end I think it comes down to compatibility. If two 16 year olds are compatible it will work out in the long run. Likewise, if two 27 year olds aren't compatible it won't work out.


Their brains aren't even mature until their mid 20s. The part of their brain that can even predict consequences. That's why a lot of them wake up in their mid-20s and start having regrets and start having a different life plan.


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## 86857 (Sep 5, 2013)

...


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## Dictum Veritas (Oct 22, 2020)

Cletus said:


> Ok, but what are the relative risks of making choices that you later regret at 16 compared to 30? The human brain isn't even fully formed at 16. You will probably change more in the 10 years after your 16th birthday than at any other similar span later in life. It is for most of us physically impossible to be fully mature at 16.


Okay, let's postpone adulthood to, let's call it 25. No signing contracts, voting, no accountability, not even moving out of the parental home before 25. As a matter of fact. Let's just keep people in a padded cell until they are 25, oh and to appease the feminists, we only let the girls out to go have rampant sex. The only other exception is deciding on gender (yep I went there), that should be done at 5 so we can get them on hormone blockers soon enough and have them get their gender affirming surgery.

If someone marries while they are still fertile, they have married too soon, let's not add to the climate change problem shall we.

As you can tell, I'm really annoyed with the infantilization of Western people (unless it suites the agenda). A highly neuro-plastic brain (which 18 year old's have) needs to be given the full weight of responsibility to adapt to the reality of a life of responsibility. No wonder we have become a society of grown infants.

Why don't we just say screw it, we never grow up and let everything go to pot, because who wants responsibility in any case? Let's just declare people adult when they drop and die. The civilization is stuffed in any case, let's just make more excuses to extend infancy and childhood.

Yep, if no one starts to be an adult at any stage, there will be none of this pesky adult problems and we can get rid of all problems with tantrums. That's the way to go!

Or we can stop finding lame excuses for everything stop infantilizing young adults and grow the hell up ourselves.


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## Captain Obvious (Mar 14, 2021)

rodrigoramirez1209 said:


> Yea that's what I'm afraid of. I've been looking and trying to talk with other women but it's not going so well, I've had girls tell me and my friends tell me that im not ugly that I won't have any problems finding someone but I'm trying and no girl seems to be interested in me, mean while my wife tells me that she has been getting asked out left and right but she has been telling them no that shes married out of respect for me but the temptation of guys Constantly asking her out is getting to her, which is why she wants permission to date them. I already told her NO to fight the temptations and to be strong so as far as I know she hasn't done anything yet other than flirt with that guy on Instagram


The demand for horny women looking for no strings attached sex will always be far greater than the supply of those women. The demand for horny men looking for no strings attached sex will always be far less than that supply. I don’t think your wife is looking for tons of dudes to screw, she wants to test drive internet guy with you waiting in the bull pen if it doesn’t work out.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

Dictum Veritas said:


> First world problems, real life or death adversity causes people to get their heads out of their backsides very early. Not everyone has the luxury of being an idiot at 15 and expect to survive.


I'd already lost a parent to unexpected sudden death by then. If fact 6 yrs prior. Already seen/experienced two divorces firsthand by 15 yrs old.

Edited to add: those were eye opening well hello world times. Not fun. But I chose not to dwell on those things and grew up looking forward to good times. Still had a reasonable time with normal friends but my pov has always had a certain tilt. Like many others.

Life goes on, life is good. That was/is my mantra from early on.


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## Dictum Veritas (Oct 22, 2020)

rodrigoramirez1209 said:


> Yea that's what I'm afraid of. I've been looking and trying to talk with other women but it's not going so well, I've had girls tell me and my friends tell me that im not ugly that I won't have any problems finding someone but I'm trying and no girl seems to be interested in me, mean while my wife tells me that she has been getting asked out left and right but she has been telling them no that shes married out of respect for me but the temptation of guys Constantly asking her out is getting to her, which is why she wants permission to date them. I already told her NO to fight the temptations and to be strong so as far as I know she hasn't done anything yet other than flirt with that guy on Instagram


You're telling us you are actually considering an open marriage as opposed to kicking your cheating wife out of your life or at the very least taking the reigns and halting her despicable behavior?

I'm afraid that unless you have a severe attitude adjustment, the end of THIS particular marriage and the shattered family your kids would experience is only the first of the life altering problems you'd face for the rest of your life.

I hope your response is because you are still in shock or else no amount of advice here will be of any help.


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## rodrigoramirez1209 (7 mo ago)

BigDaddyNY said:


> Isn't a 14 year marriage a long marriage?
> 
> You are right that maturity matters, but I think people will make bad choices and regret the path not taken at any age. In my life I have plenty of examples of people that married young and are apparently happily married decades later. I also know people that couldn't make a relationship last at any age. In the end I think it comes down to compatibility. If two 16 year olds are compatible it will work out in the long run. Likewise, if two 27 year olds aren't compatible it won't work out.


We actually are very different and we've been total opposites since the day we met. We were happy for the first 5 years of our life but when our second baby was born I just didn't feel connected with her anymore like I wanted some one els and she knew that I didn't find her attractive anymore but she was still in love with me, I never cheated though even though I didn't truly love my wife anymore and the next 5 years was hell for her cus I guess I was an asswhole but just last year she quit her job and she changed she found a new job told herself she wasn't going to let anyone bring her down anymore, she started dressing more revealing and she just looked beautiful to me agian and I fell in love with her again and i change to the man she always wanted me to be but she no longer felt the same anymore so it's like we switched places


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## Dictum Veritas (Oct 22, 2020)

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> I'd already lost a parent to unexpected sudden death by then. If fact 6 yrs prior. Already seen/experienced two divorces firsthand by 15 yrs old.
> 
> Edited to add: those were eye opening well hello world times. Not fun. But I chose not to dwell on those things and grew up looking forward to good times. Still had a reasonable time with normal friends but my pov has always had a certain tilt. Like many others.
> 
> Life goes on, life is good. That was/is my mantra from early on.


It's sad, but it forms a person and makes you tougher. I am sorry for what you have had to face so early though when so many others cruise without having to grow up ever.


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## syhoybenden (Feb 21, 2013)

rodrigoramirez1209 said:


> but when our second baby was born I just didn't feel connected with her anymore like I wanted some one else and she knew that I didn't find her attractive anymore but she was still in love with me, I never cheated though even though I didn't truly love my wife anymore and the next 5 years was hell for her because I guess I was an asshole



And there it is. Right there.

"As ye sew, so shall ye reap".


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## *Deidre* (Feb 7, 2016)

If you’re concerned about your debt, there are companies out there where you can consolidate and you’ll make one payment per month, which can help. I’d recommend getting some legal advice, as well. But, it’ll take some time to work out a plan.

Your wife sounds checked out, to be honest. You can fight to win her back but she wants to keep you around and be single. You don’t sound like you want that so to stay married to someone who doesn’t treat you with respect, regardless of all the reasons why, will be a tough life to endure.

Not to mention, she sleeps with other men and brings a disease home to you? Gross. Open marriages seem to have a lot of risks. It’s very sad that you’re here in your marriage but you don’t have to accept this as your life.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

Are you considering allowing her to have her open marriage because you feel guilty about having been unkind to her in the past? If you found someone else or were having more success with women would you feel any differently about opening the marriage?


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## Rob_1 (Sep 8, 2017)

rodrigoramirez1209 said:


> Yea that's what I'm afraid of.


In other words, you don't mind your wife ****ing other dudes, what you're afraid of is that you won't get to **** other women. That tells a lot about what type of a man you are. Dude did you grow up with no males around you? I guess that you have not an inkling of what is to have self respect and dignity as a man.


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## marko polo (Jan 26, 2021)

rodrigoramirez1209 said:


> So i got off work at 2am caught my wife texting a guy on Instagram they were both saying"I love you" and "baby" "babe" stuff like that and And so I broke down and I left and stayed in a hotel. She later found me where I was staying after attempting to call me multiple times and we talked about it while at the hotel. She Confessed to me that she loves me and wants to stay with me but she wants to date and sleep around with other people and for me to do the same pretty much having an open relationship. The reason for this is because we were together since she was 15 years old We are 29 now. we got pregnant so we got married at 18. She confessed to me that she didn't get to date other people or sleep with other people and she Wants to know how it feels like to date someone else and to sleep with someone else sense I'm the only person she's been with Physically and she's the only person I've ever been with too. After talking about it I told her if she wants to sleep Around with other people then we can't be together but if you want to try and save our marriage you have to delete your Instagram, She broke down of course because she loves the guy she was talking with on Instagram, So I decided that she can continue to have that long distance relationship on Instagram. If she promised me not to date or have sex with anyone else, I figured a long distance relationship is better than having her date other guys because I know she's going to get emotionally attached to that person and continue to have sex with them behind my back. I know anyone else would have left divorced but I love my wife, We've been together since 15 years old and I want to continue to be with my wife so I want to fight for our marriage. So my question to you guys is my wife continues to have the urges to date And sleep around with other guys, And it makes me sad that she feels this way and it's hurting our relationship. Any advice would be helpful.


You can fight for your wife all you like but your marriage is over because she will not fight for the marriage. 

She wants to sleep around with other people. You should assume she will not use protection so that means you will also be at risk of catching whatever STDs she brings home. Assuming of course she doesn't neglect your sexual and emotional needs altogether. On this note what is your plan if she gets pregnant by one of her playmates? Do you plan to raise the child as your own?

You love your wife more than she loves you. This will not change. You are her safety net and provider, nothing more.

Helpful advice. Divorce and find a woman that wants to be only with you.


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## rodrigoramirez1209 (7 mo ago)

BigDaddyNY said:


> Dude, come on, get real. She isn't just flirting, she told him she loves him. You are okay with you wife loving another man? Let me guess, she told you she just said that and didn't mean it.
> 
> So let me get this straight. You've told girls and friends about this? And their response wasn't dump her, instead it was to tell you there won't be any problem with a married guys finding women? Please tell me this is a joke.
> 
> Where is she when guys are "constantly" asking her out? Even great looking women don't get asked out constantly unless they are in that kind of environment (like club, bar etc.) and putting out the vibe they are interested. Your wife is a POS if guys asking her out is all it takes for her to get the itch to sleep around after being married 14 years and having 3 kids. She doesn't need your permission. She will do whatever she wants, that is pretty clear.


She is a hairstyles so she cuts guys hair all the time and does waxes on them, so the same guys come in every week or 2 for haircuts so one place ware they feel a connection with her and ask her out, the other places are the grocery store she always goes to and the Gas station she always goes to its the same guys flirting with her making her feel special and asking her out. My wife is a very talkative person good to talk to that's why guys get a fats flirty connection with her


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## Rob_1 (Sep 8, 2017)

rodrigoramirez1209 said:


> My wife is a very talkative person good to talk to that's why guys get a fats flirty connection with her


That is neither here nor there. Most women get chat chat up by dudes whether the woman encourages it or not. You seem to nonchalantly be skirting the real issue: your wife wanting another man/men and her being in love with another dude. And you? worrying that you won't be able to land some women to ****? That's pathetic. Why don't you just say what are you going to do after being so disrespected and considered as a second option? do you have a plan already, or what? are you willing to be a cuckold, is that it?


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## 346745 (Oct 7, 2020)

Find the prettiest woman you can and pound her at home when your wife is there.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

Now, the Bad News on Teenage Marriage (Published 2008)


Bristol Palin’s impending nuptials to Levi Johnston has stirred up a discussion about the evolution of teenage marriage.




www.nytimes.com




.






Teenage marriages: Too fragile to survive for long


Why are the teenage marriages so fragile? Why do they fail to survive for long?




notesmatic.com


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## Dictum Veritas (Oct 22, 2020)

DownByTheRiver said:


> Now, the Bad News on Teenage Marriage (Published 2008)
> 
> 
> Bristol Palin’s impending nuptials to Levi Johnston has stirred up a discussion about the evolution of teenage marriage.
> ...


Finding BS pushed by the main stream, agenda driven, media is not an art, I'm sorry. If it were a pier reviewed scientific study, I'd still question who funded it these days. Appeal to authority simply doesn't impress me anymore. I have come to a stage where I believe my own eyes and first hand experience of people I trust.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

Dictum Veritas said:


> Finding BS pushed by the main stream, agenda driven, media is not an art, I'm sorry. If it were a pier reviewed scientific study, I'd still question who funded it these days. Appeal to authority simply doesn't impress me anymore. I have come to a stage where I believe my own eyes and first hand experience of people I trust.


Well I already gave you my personal observations so I thought I'd back it up with some thoughts I found on the internet, one of which it said was the most comprehensive study. I believe my own eyes too. I personally don't know any teen marriages that survived. Certainly there are some as those statistics state. Surviving and thriving are two different things however. There was one report I didn't publish that was on the statistics showing people who married as teens were more likely to end up in poverty.


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## bygone (11 mo ago)

What you wrote here is inconsistent.

You haven't found your wife attractive for years.

Your wife is flirting with more than one man. (you want to believe you're not sleeping)

You opened your relationship.

Divorce is not on the table, you cannot leave the house, you are looking for a woman to sleep with.

Even if you are not happy, life goes on.


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## Dictum Veritas (Oct 22, 2020)

DownByTheRiver said:


> Well I already gave you my personal observations so I thought I'd back it up with some thoughts I found on the internet, one of which it said was the most comprehensive study. I believe my own eyes too. I personally don't know any teen marriages that survived. Certainly there are some as those statistics state. Surviving and thriving are two different things however. There was one report I didn't publish that was on the statistics showing people who married as teens were more likely to end up in poverty.


And I know a ton, but I deal with people not ideologues.


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## 346745 (Oct 7, 2020)

bygone said:


> What you wrote here is inconsistent.
> 
> You haven't found your wife attractive for years.
> 
> ...


Ob-la-DI, Ob-la-da


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

Dictum Veritas said:


> And I know a ton, but I deal with people not ideologues.


I deal with people too but I'm not afraid of data. It mystifies me why I'm getting hostile reaction to that, but I guess today shouldn't be any different than any other day.


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## Dictum Veritas (Oct 22, 2020)

DownByTheRiver said:


> I deal with people too but I'm not afraid of data. It mystifies me why I'm getting hostile reaction to that, but I guess today shouldn't be any different than any other day.


I'm sorry I have to admit my mood is influencing my tone and I am harsh. I've spent my whole life writing programs to process data and in that have developed the knack to quickly analyze gathered data myself.

Let's just say we have incompatible datasets.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

DownByTheRiver said:


> I deal with people too but I'm not afraid of data. It mystifies me why I'm getting hostile reaction to that, but I guess today shouldn't be any different than any other day.


Aw c'mon now. I agree with you mostly. Course I'm one out of thousands. 

Just kidding. No hostility, just conversation.


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## Rob_1 (Sep 8, 2017)

DownByTheRiver said:


> I personally don't know any teen marriages that survived


In my group of friends, I'm the odd man out. Most of the whole group is comprised of people that we grew up together. a lot of them married in their teens to another of my friend and they are still together. We all are from the same two neighborhoods that were separated by a name only, but basically the same neighborhood. So, I can attest that teen love can and do survive till death do parts them, (I'm 69, so most of these friends are in my same age bracket).


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

Dictum Veritas said:


> I'm sorry I have to admit my mood is influencing my tone and I am a harsh. I've spent my whole life writing programs to process data and in that have developed the knack to quickly analyze gathered data myself.
> 
> Let's just say we have incompatible datasets.


Let's see yours.


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## BigDaddyNY (May 19, 2021)

There is no doubt that teens are more likely to make rash decisions. That doesn't mean every decision is wrong, and I don't think age at time of marriage is ever an excuse for bad behavior later in life. OP's wife using the fact that she has only experienced him as an excuse for wanting to sleep around is appalling. Especially since she is 14 years and 3 kids into the marriage. 

This data does support that marrying in your teens poses a higher risk of failure. Doesn't mean they all end that way, or even that a majority end that way.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

Dictum Veritas said:


> I'm sorry I have to admit my mood is influencing my tone and I am a harsh. I've spent my whole life writing programs to process data and in that have developed the knack to quickly analyze gathered data myself.
> 
> Let's just say we have incompatible datasets.


Just because the younger you are, stats show the higher your divorce rate is doesn't mean there aren't some successful ones and I never said that.

But the subject of this thread is an OP he's been with his girlfriend since teens whose marriage is failing.


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## Dictum Veritas (Oct 22, 2020)

DownByTheRiver said:


> Let's see yours.


NO, I'm Shy! 😨

Oh, data... 52 years of observation, but a quick google search yields:









15 Perks of Getting Married in Your Early 20s (or Even Younger)


Remember when getting married in your early 20s was the norm? Now it seems like tying the knot young is a social faux pas that everyone is shying away from.




www.popsugar.com













5 Women Share Why They're Happy They Got Married Young


There are several factors to consider when deciding whether or not you're ready to get married. For many people, it's age. Here, women who got married younger than their family members and friends share why they're happy they tied the knot when they did.




www.marthastewart.com





More likely for young people:








Fewer Sex Partners Means a Happier Marriage


People who have had sex with fewer people seem to be more satisfied after they tie the knot. Is there hope for promiscuous romantics?




www.theatlantic.com







Bible Gateway 1 Corinthians 7 :: NIV


(Yep, I go there)

It's not hard to find data these days. If you have a belief, someone will affirm it.


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## Rus47 (Apr 1, 2021)

LisaDiane said:


> From the text messages that he saw and her heartbroken response to having to give up the guy she is talking to, it sounds like she is more in love with her internet boyfriend. I don't think she wants "other men" for sex at all I think she wants sex and LOVE from this one guy she is talking to on Instagram.


What is humorous is her internet BF might be a 80 year-old toothless guy or a 20 year-old female or...


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

Dictum Veritas said:


> NO, I'm Shy! 😨
> 
> Oh, data... 52 years of observation, but a quick google search yields:
> 
> ...


So except for the last one those are not data. The first two are just opinion pieces. The last one has a little research attached about the fewer partners.


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## BigDaddyNY (May 19, 2021)

Dictum Veritas said:


> NO, I'm Shy! 😨
> 
> Oh, data... 52 years of observation, but a quick google search yields:
> 
> ...


Wow, I can check off every one of those 15 items in the pop sugar list. I'm not kidding, every one except babies, which we waited 10 years to have, are all reason I've told others why I am so happy we got married young and why I think it worked for us. 

So again, marrying young is a lame excuse for poor behavior and breaking your vows later in life.


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## DudeInProgress (Jun 10, 2019)

rodrigoramirez1209 said:


> Yea that's what I'm afraid of. I've been looking and trying to talk with other women but it's not going so well, I've had girls tell me and my friends tell me that im not ugly that I won't have any problems finding someone but I'm trying and no girl seems to be interested in me, mean while my wife tells me that she has been getting asked out left and right but she has been telling them no that shes married out of respect for me but the temptation of guys Constantly asking her out is getting to her, which is why she wants permission to date them. I already told her NO to fight the temptations and to be strong so as far as I know she hasn't done anything yet other than flirt with that guy on Instagram


1. You’re either fully on board with an open marriage, or you’re not. Clearly you’re not, so it is beyond idiotic to give even 1 inch in that direction. 
The answer is “no, I will not share my wife with other men. Period. It’s not negotiable.” She’s either 100% your wife or she’s 100% not. 
And if she’s not sure or if she’s struggling with that - she’s not. And that includes online flirting.

2. If she’s getting approached constantly, she is either in places she shouldn’t be, or she’s putting out an approachable vibe, or both.

3. She’s not committed to you. Her heart and mind are not committed to you, and it’s only a matter of time for her body.

4. She doesn’t respect you. If she respected you as a man and a husband, she would not be behaving this way. 

5.You need to get strong, fast. You have been approaching this situation from a position of weakness and your wife knows it. Women despise and disrespect weak men by the way.

You need to be strong enough to tell your wife that you will not tolerate any of this, and if she’s not 100% committed to you and your marriage, then you There is no middle ground.
You need to be strong enough to tell your wife that you will not tolerate your wife seeking or engaging in sexual/romantic attention from/with other men. If she can’t or won’t willingly abide by that basic boundary, then she can’t be your wife.
And you need to mean it and be strong enough to follow through.


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## Dictum Veritas (Oct 22, 2020)

DownByTheRiver said:


> So except for the last one those are not data. The first two are just opinion pieces. The last one has a little research attached about the fewer partners.


Actually quite on par with the NYPOST article you held up, wouldn't you agree?


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## Rob_1 (Sep 8, 2017)

BigDaddyNY said:


> This data does support that marrying in your teens poses a higher risk of failure. Doesn't mean they all end that way, or even that a majority end that way.


This is directed to the OP: I'm divulging info that I normally don't like to give about my life, but my wife was a virgin when we met, so let me assure you that had she ever come to me and tell crap about how she wanted to make up for not doing it when single, that would had been the last time she would had talked to me as my wife. I can't, and I will never tolerate such slap in the face like you seem to tolerate. You need to find out what makes you to be missing basic self respect to endure such slap in the face as your wife so blatantly is doing to you. I mean, what is it dude? because something has to be missing within you in order to put up with that crap.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

Dictum Veritas said:


> Actually quite on par with the NYPOST article you held up, wouldn't you agree?


No because those stats are widely published. I picked the one that had them not buried after having to scroll down a lot.

You should know there's a difference between an opinion and a study.


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## Dictum Veritas (Oct 22, 2020)

DownByTheRiver said:


> No because those stats are widely published. I picked the one that had them not buried after having to scroll down a lot.
> 
> You should know there's a difference between an opinion and a study.


I considered the source and stand by my statement.


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## TXTrini (Oct 2, 2013)

rodrigoramirez1209 said:


> So i got off work at 2am caught my wife texting a guy on Instagram they were both saying"I love you" and "baby" "babe" stuff like that and And so I broke down and I left and stayed in a hotel. She later found me where I was staying after attempting to call me multiple times and we talked about it while at the hotel. She Confessed to me that she loves me and wants to stay with me but she wants to date and sleep around with other people and for me to do the same pretty much having an open relationship. The reason for this is because we were together since she was 15 years old We are 29 now. we got pregnant so we got married at 18. She confessed to me that she didn't get to date other people or sleep with other people and she Wants to know how it feels like to date someone else and to sleep with someone else sense I'm the only person she's been with Physically and she's the only person I've ever been with too. After talking about it I told her if she wants to sleep Around with other people then we can't be together but if you want to try and save our marriage you have to delete your Instagram, She broke down of course because she loves the guy she was talking with on Instagram, So I decided that she can continue to have that long distance relationship on Instagram. If she promised me not to date or have sex with anyone else, I figured a long distance relationship is better than having her date other guys because I know she's going to get emotionally attached to that person and continue to have sex with them behind my back. I know anyone else would have left divorced but I love my wife, We've been together since 15 years old and I want to continue to be with my wife so I want to fight for our marriage. So my question to you guys is my wife continues to have the urges to date And sleep around with other guys, And it makes me sad that she feels this way and it's hurting our relationship. Any advice would be helpful.


She's shown you who she is now... selfish, disloyal and entitled, my advice is cut and run. This "woman" isn't good enough for you, and a really ****ty mother to not even think of them. 

So you were both young when you married, I don't see you decided you didn't ho it up before settling down. You maned up and took care of your responsibilities instead of leaving her as a single mother and being a child support only dad. 

Clean up your finances, take your kids and leave her to her fantasy life, you deserve so much better than a weak, morally bankrupt female.


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## Rus47 (Apr 1, 2021)

rodrigoramirez1209 said:


> I was an asswhole but just last year she quit her job and she changed she found a new job told herself she wasn't going to let anyone bring her down anymore, she started dressing more revealing and she just looked beautiful to me agian and I fell in love with her again and i change to the man she always wanted me to be but she no longer felt the same anymore so it's like we switched places


This puts a whole different spin on your situation. You put your wife through enough to hurt her self esteem badly. She decided to fix that and succeeded. How can anyone blame her? So now the has found herself, isn't going to let anyone (including you) bring her down anymore. Can you blame her? Your change is a day late and dollar short. Men are hitting on her and she knows she could have her pick of any of them. You have become irrelevant. 



marko polo said:


> You can fight for your wife all you like but *your marriage is over because she will not fight for the marriage.*


Read what is in bold.


marko polo said:


> *You love your wife more than she loves you. This will not change*. You are her safety net and provider, nothing more.


@rodrigoramirez1209, you should have loved and cherished her when she *needed* you. You say you were chasing skirts after she gave birth to YOUR child. Do you have any idea how hurtful that would be? She needs you no more. Sorry but that is how karma sometimes works. Wish BOTH of you well. IMO you are both now on separate life paths.


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## DudeInProgress (Jun 10, 2019)

aine said:


> You allow this long distance relationship, she will just start looking closer to home and you will end up losing her anyhow.
> If you want to fight for your marriage, you need to be willing to lose it (although that doesnt sound intuitive).
> 
> Start doing the 180 on her immediately.
> ...


^^^ OP, abide.


----------



## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

LisaDiane said:


> She already promised you not to date or have sex with other men, it's called MARRIAGE VOWS.
> 
> Her reasoning is a LIE. Very few women want to date around and have sex with lots of random guys...she is tricking you with that, because she only has ONE person she wants to date and have sex with and that's her online boyfriend, and it's NOT because she missed out on dating around when she was younger, it's because she is emotionally attached to him and feels like she is in love with him, and wants HIM more than she wants YOU.
> 
> ...





GusPolinski said:


> A man should fight for the things he values, but a cheating wife should never be among them.


Yes!

My feelings, exactly.

Why bother?

Value yourself, completely write off a spouse like this.


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## Rob_1 (Sep 8, 2017)

Rus47 said:


> T*his puts a whole different spin on your situation. * You put your wife through enough to hurt her self esteem badly. She decided to fix that and succeeded. How can anyone blame her? So now the has found herself, isn't going to let anyone (including you) bring her down anymore. Can you blame her? Your change is a day late and dollar short. Men are hitting on her and she knows she could have her pick of any of them. You have become irrelevant.
> 
> 
> Read what is in bold.
> ...


Yes indeed. I missed that post from him. No wonder why she's not longer interested romantically with him; nonetheless, it doesn't change the fact that she wants to **** around while married. Now the chickened OP can't find a way to stop the the break at the levee. She's now with him due to economics, as soon as she gets what she wants that will provide, it will be Sayonara Mr. @rodrigoramirez1209 .


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

DownByTheRiver said:


> Well I already gave you my personal observations so I thought I'd back it up with some thoughts I found on the internet, one of which it said was the most comprehensive study. I believe my own eyes too. I personally don't know any teen marriages that survived. Certainly there are some as those statistics state. Surviving and thriving are two different things however. There was one report I didn't publish that was on the statistics showing people who married as teens were more likely to end up in poverty.


Don't you? I know quite a few. Most now in their 60's.


----------



## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

Rob_1 said:


> In my group of friends, I'm the odd man out. Most of the whole group is comprised of people that we grew up together. a lot of them married in their teens to another of my friend and they are still together. We all are from the same two neighborhoods that were separated by a name only, but basically the same neighborhood. So, I can attest that teen love can and do survive till death do parts them, (I'm 69, so most of these friends are in my same age bracket).





Diana7 said:


> Don't you? I know quite a few. Most now in their 60's.


I don't know any. Obviously, there are some out there. Doesn't mean they're all happy, but some are.


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## colingrant (Nov 6, 2017)

Captain Obvious said:


> The demand for horny women looking for no strings attached sex will always be far greater than the supply of those women. The demand for horny men looking for no strings attached sex will always be far less than that supply. I don’t think your wife is looking for tons of dudes to screw, *she wants to test drive internet guy with you waiting in the bull pen if it doesn’t work out.*


The disrespect the wife has for her husband is beyond what words can describe. The only explanation I can think of is she feels so dominant and confident in her position, she actually expects OP to be there after she's test driven her AP. I actually have a hard time believing this is real or even possible.


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## DudeInProgress (Jun 10, 2019)

Rob_1 said:


> Yes indeed. I missed that post from him. No wonder why she's not longer interested romantically with him; nonetheless, it doesn't change the fact that she wants to **** around while married. Now the chickened OP can't find a way to stop the the break at the levee. She's now with him due to economics, as soon as she gets what she wants that will provide, it will be Sayonara Mr. @rodrigoramirez1209 .


Informative, but still completely irrelevant with regard to the correct path forward. The situation is untenable, regardless of how it got there, and his only effective path forward is pretty clear.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

DownByTheRiver said:


> I don't know any. Obviously, there are some out there. Doesn't mean they're all happy, but some are.


The ones I know are happy.


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## ABiolarWife (8 mo ago)

OP?

Your marriage is officially done for. FWIW I am a former wayward wife who almost destroyed MY marriage with infidelity. Let her know she can date and sleep with whoever she likes after the divorce is final. And I would wager that she has already had sex with someone else - perhaps a ONS and wants more.

Not to mention she is in full on limerence with IG dude. And merely wants you as a backup plan and to finance her affair(s). Grow a pair and either _really _fight for your marriage and put and end to this supporting her affair nonsense. Or get a divorce and find someone who will love and _respect_ you as well.

Sorry to be so harsh - but you need a severe wake up call from a place called 'reality'. 

Bonn chance - you're gonna need it.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

Diana7 said:


> The ones I know are happy.


The OP isn't.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

oops wrong thread


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## DudeInProgress (Jun 10, 2019)

DownByTheRiver said:


> The OP isn't.


The OP‘s problem goes WAY beyond marrying too young…


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## jonty30 (Oct 23, 2021)

rodrigoramirez1209 said:


> So i got off work at 2am caught my wife texting a guy on Instagram they were both saying"I love you" and "baby" "babe" stuff like that and And so I broke down and I left and stayed in a hotel. She later found me where I was staying after attempting to call me multiple times and we talked about it while at the hotel. She Confessed to me that she loves me and wants to stay with me but she wants to date and sleep around with other people and for me to do the same pretty much having an open relationship. The reason for this is because we were together since she was 15 years old We are 29 now. we got pregnant so we got married at 18. She confessed to me that she didn't get to date other people or sleep with other people and she Wants to know how it feels like to date someone else and to sleep with someone else sense I'm the only person she's been with Physically and she's the only person I've ever been with too. After talking about it I told her if she wants to sleep Around with other people then we can't be together but if you want to try and save our marriage you have to delete your Instagram, She broke down of course because she loves the guy she was talking with on Instagram, So I decided that she can continue to have that long distance relationship on Instagram. If she promised me not to date or have sex with anyone else, I figured a long distance relationship is better than having her date other guys because I know she's going to get emotionally attached to that person and continue to have sex with them behind my back. I know anyone else would have left divorced but I love my wife, We've been together since 15 years old and I want to continue to be with my wife so I want to fight for our marriage. So my question to you guys is my wife continues to have the urges to date And sleep around with other guys, And it makes me sad that she feels this way and it's hurting our relationship. Any advice would be helpful.


She wants you for security, not for you.
She is trying to monkey branch to find a more prefereable guy, while having the security of home, for the time being, until she is able to find that guy.
She is telling you that the marriage is over, but you are trying to hold onto her in hopes that she will recommit to the marriage.
I do not know what has led up to her wanting out of the marriage, because women typically only want out of a marriage when they think there are no more chances to give to it.
The best advice I can give you is respect her desire to end the marriage and end it and let her go find that preferable guy without the security of somebody paying the bills while she is doing that.

Even if she could be convinced to come back into the marriage, she will never be fully committed to it so you are going to live with a woman who will go through the motions of marriage without really liking you.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

rodrigoramirez1209 said:


> The reason for this is because we were together since she was 15 years old We are 29 now.


This is crap. The reason for "this" is because she's a cheatin ho.

She's a selfish, entitled, cheating, faithless, backstabbing wife.

It's really important to use correct language and terms when defining situations like "this" and the reason for "this" 

Tell her to get her crotch monster under control and end her emotional affair with the Instagram idiot.

She needs to get her head in the game to have a chance at keeping her family.

Counseling is advisable and therapy should be a must for her because she's behaving like a lunatic.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

rodrigoramirez1209 said:


> We actually are very different and we've been total opposites since the day we met. We were happy for the first 5 years of our life but when our second baby was born I just didn't feel connected with her anymore like I wanted some one els and she knew that I didn't find her attractive anymore but she was still in love with me, I never cheated though even though I didn't truly love my wife anymore and the next 5 years was hell for her cus I guess I was an asswhole but just last year she quit her job and she changed she found a new job told herself she wasn't going to let anyone bring her down anymore, she started dressing more revealing and she just looked beautiful to me agian and I fell in love with her again and i change to the man she always wanted me to be but she no longer felt the same anymore so it's like we switched places


Hold old was she when she had her first baby?


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

That is why she asked, she has guys lined up that are DTF and she wants to climb on the 🎠. If she is not already, she will cheat. Mark my word. I would start an exit plan and send this one back to the streets where she belongs. You can find a faithful woman.

Don't allow this unless you are ok with your wife getting ran though by numerous guys and you getting seconds. You need to realize you are worth more than a female of this low caliber. She was fun while she lasted but it is time to go on down the road and find a woman that is in it for keeps, because this one ain't it.


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

Rus47 said:


> What is humorous is her internet BF might be a 80 year-old toothless guy or a 20 year-old female or...


Or he may live 2 blocks over and she is upset she has to continue to sneak around.


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## Rus47 (Apr 1, 2021)

Divinely Favored said:


> You can find a faithful woman


The one he has WAS faithful. Read his post on how things went down:
"We actually are very different and we've been total opposites since the day we met. We were happy for the first 5 years of our life* but when our second baby was born I just didn't feel connected with her anymore like I wanted some one els and she knew that I didn't find her attractive anymore but she was still in love with me*, I never cheated though even though *I didn't truly love my wife anymore and the next 5 years was hell for her* cus I guess I was an asswhole"

OP is the one who "fell out of love" with her after she gave birth to their second child. He was out chasing skirts and said he had lost all attraction for her. So, recently she got a new job, started dressing for "success" and HE said she wasn't going to let anyone treat her badly again. She is getting attention IRL everywhere she goes. Now, he is attracted to her again because she has her stuff together, and she is no longer interested in him. Notice he is now "looking" but yet to get any "takers".

OP in his own words said " I was an a$$hole". He is reaping what he sowed.

If he treats the next one like he treated the first ( who gave him 3 children ), he will get the same or worse results. Wouldn't surprise me if he finds another woman who will cheat on him. Sometimes we receive the treatment like what we give.

Yes his wife is wrong to go about it in this way. But she has no money and no way out of the travesty that is their marriage. She has decided she isn't going to be miserable at his hands anymore, no matter what. If she were posting on here we would be telling her to divorce HIM ASAP.

So, for both of them the right answer is to divorce and start over.


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## Enigma32 (Jul 6, 2020)

rodrigoramirez1209 said:


> Yea that's what I'm afraid of. I've been looking and trying to talk with other women but it's not going so well, I've had girls tell me and my friends tell me that im not ugly that I won't have any problems finding someone but I'm trying and no girl seems to be interested in me, mean while my wife tells me that she has been getting asked out left and right but she has been telling them no that shes married out of respect for me but the temptation of guys Constantly asking her out is getting to her, which is why she wants permission to date them. I already told her NO to fight the temptations and to be strong so as far as I know she hasn't done anything yet other than flirt with that guy on Instagram


What you are describing is precisely how it goes for most men. Your marriage is already done since your wife wants other men. You gotta leave. No other choice.


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## jonty30 (Oct 23, 2021)

rodrigoramirez1209 said:


> Yea that's what I'm afraid of. I've been looking and trying to talk with other women but it's not going so well, I've had girls tell me and my friends tell me that im not ugly that I won't have any problems finding someone but I'm trying and no girl seems to be interested in me, mean while my wife tells me that she has been getting asked out left and right but she has been telling them no that shes married out of respect for me but the temptation of guys Constantly asking her out is getting to her, which is why she wants permission to date them. I already told her NO to fight the temptations and to be strong so as far as I know she hasn't done anything yet other than flirt with that guy on Instagram


The only men who have the same chance of getting sex, like an average woman, are the top 20%.
That's just reality.
However, it's better to work on yourself and become a better person than to worry about that. 
It's a good opportunity to become a better man and that will pay off down the road to your benefit.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Rus47 said:


> The one he has WAS faithful. Read his post on how things went down:
> "We actually are very different and we've been total opposites since the day we met. We were happy for the first 5 years of our life* but when our second baby was born I just didn't feel connected with her anymore like I wanted some one els and she knew that I didn't find her attractive anymore but she was still in love with me*, I never cheated though even though *I didn't truly love my wife anymore and the next 5 years was hell for her* cus I guess I was an asswhole"
> 
> OP is the one who "fell out of love" with her after she gave birth to their second child. He was out chasing skirts and said he had lost all attraction for her. So, recently she got a new job, started dressing for "success" and HE said she wasn't going to let anyone treat her badly again. She is getting attention IRL everywhere she goes. Now, he is attracted to her again because she has her stuff together, and she is no longer interested in him. Notice he is now "looking" but yet to get any "takers".
> ...


He never chased skirts.

He went through pretty normal phases of long term relationships and obviously didn't have good mentors.

Long term isn't a bed of roses and they endured what a lot of folks do but without good mentoring and advice apparently.

She needs to pull her head out of her derriere and cut off the Instagram idiot.

They both could use counseling and with both committed to working, they will be ok.

If they divorce, odds aren't great they will find better and they do apparently love each other though they are somewhat messed up.


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## Hurthusband77 (May 9, 2021)

Bud, she likely already physically cheating on you. She is certainly in an emotional affair. It sounds like she’s moving along with some other guy and doesn’t want to have to hide it from you anymore. 

Seriously, you can’t be a doormat and allowing her to continue to talk to this other guy is letting her walk all over you. 

I get it, financially and for the kids, divorce is terrible, but not at terrible as things will get for you and your family if you allow this to continue. As others have said, don’t be a beta male, it will do so much damage to you and women are not attracted to men they can walk all over.


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## Captainjacksparrow84 (10 mo ago)

I know how painful this must be for you, but no amount of letting her do whatever she wants is going to bring the woman you fell in love with back. If you'd like go read my story it's not pretty, and I come from a place of hurt as well. As hard as it is, go NC and get out of there. I only found out 6ish months ago, and it's been hell going through it, but its the right thing to do. She doesn't respect you, and honestly can you look at yourself in the mirror as a man, and be proud of what you see, knowing that she is more interested in another dude than you?


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

Did no one else see his post where he said he treated her badly and told her he didn’t love her? For 5 years? I’m not condoning cheating but this isn’t a one-sided problem. It also seems that his real issue is she’ll get laid more than him, not that he “loves” her.

This whole situation is jacked up. Unless she drops fantasy guy (who will lose interest once she is single, guaranteed, if he’s even a real person) and they BOTH commit to reconciliation and treating each other with respect, divorce is the way to go.


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## Rooster Cogburn (9 mo ago)

I don't know what's worse... zombie for the avatar or the Irish guy with Sir Francis Bacon in a top hat and talking quaint 19th-century English jibberish.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Both parties are always responsible for the breakdown of a relationship.

However with cheating, responsibility lies with the cheater. She's already cheating on him.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

TexasMom1216 said:


> Did no one else see his post where he said he treated her badly and told her he didn’t love her? For 5 years? I’m not condoning cheating but this isn’t a one-sided problem. It also seems that his real issue is she’ll get laid more than him, not that he “loves” her.
> 
> This whole situation is jacked up. Unless she drops fantasy guy (who will lose interest once she is single, guaranteed, if he’s even a real person) and they BOTH commit to reconciliation and treating each other with respect, divorce is the way to go.


I didn't miss it and agree.

There does appear to still be love between them and they have children to consider so they should give it a real try to make it work.

They are both in for a world of hurt if they are crazy enough to "open" it up.


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## ABHale (Jan 3, 2016)

You are so responsible for your relationship woes.

That doesn’t give your wife any reason to cheat. She is cheating on you emotionally and more then likely physically.

Give her what she wants and divorce her. Serve her with papers and watch her change her turn.


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## Rus47 (Apr 1, 2021)

How will they manage to divorce since they are insolvent? Attorneys are expensive


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## ABHale (Jan 3, 2016)

Rus47 said:


> How will they manage to divorce since they are insolvent? Attorneys are expensive


It depends on the state and laws regarding custody. You can print the papers off and fill them out. Then you go and have them notarized and take them to the court house. Set a court date and the judge signs off.


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## ABHale (Jan 3, 2016)

I can’t see why age has anything to do with marriage.

My marriage is failing!!!

Well, it is obvious you got married to young.

********.

Stop blaming marriages ending because the couple didn’t **** everything with a heart beat before they said the I do’s.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

I do not understand why waiting to marry until you’re in your mid-20s automatically means you’re F-ing “everything with a heart beat.” Are you guys saying that if a woman doesn’t marry in her teens she’s, as Conan so eloquently put it, a “ho”? 😂


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## ABHale (Jan 3, 2016)

My kids and their friends called the guys manhoes and the girls hoes.

To answer your question, because that has been used with the argument about waiting to get married, to explore life and your sexuality.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

ABHale said:


> My kids and their friends called the guys manhoes and the girls hoes.
> 
> To answer your question, because that has been used with the argument about waiting to get married, to explore life and your sexuality.


That’s a really limited view of life. All of life is not about sex. Most of that time (for me) was spent working and learning how to adult independently. Figuring out who I am and what I wanted from life. How can you pick or be a good partner if you aren’t even sure what you want out of life? It’s just not true that women who don’t marry at 17 are spending their lives sleeping around. Not everything women do is about men, just like not everything men do is about women.


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## ABHale (Jan 3, 2016)

TexasMom1216 said:


> That’s a really limited view of life. All of life is not about sex. Most of that time (for me) was spent working and learning how to adult independently. Figuring out who I am and what I wanted from life. How can you pick or be a good partner if you aren’t even sure what you want out of life? It’s just not true that women who don’t marry at 17 are spending their lives sleeping around. Not everything women do is about men, just like not everything men do is about women.


I never said that is the way it is with all women or men. I have had many women say that girls should sleep around a lot when arguing with me on this and different forums.


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## Enigma32 (Jul 6, 2020)

TexasMom1216 said:


> That’s a really limited view of life. All of life is not about sex. Most of that time (for me) was spent working and learning how to adult independently. Figuring out who I am and what I wanted from life. How can you pick or be a good partner if you aren’t even sure what you want out of life? It’s just not true that women who don’t marry at 17 are spending their lives sleeping around. Not everything women do is about men, just like not everything men do is about women.


I'd say you are the exception. Many younger single ladies these days brag about their "hot girl summer" where they basically go around and bang every decent looking guy they meet. I work here at the beach and they're out all night dressed more provocatively than any street walker I've ever seen.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

ABHale said:


> I never said that is the way it is with all women or men. I have had many women say that girls should sleep around a lot when arguing with me on this and different forums.


Ah. I haven’t seen that but am not doubting it’s been said. I personally think it’s very healthy for young women to be on their own and single for a few years to learn how to take care of themselves and be ok being alone. That way they’re confident they can stand on their own and not afraid of being alone, so they won’t tolerate a guy treating them badly. It’s not something historically women were allowed to do and it’s good for them to know they’re not helpless. I would not concur with those that say that sleeping around is great. I think it will leave them feeling hollow and sad, I don’t think it’s empowering at all.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

Enigma32 said:


> I'd say you are the exception. Many younger single ladies these days brag about their "hot girl summer" where they basically go around and bang every decent looking guy they meet. I work here at the beach and they're out all night dressed more provocatively than any street walker I've ever seen.


I think if you work at the beach you’re going to see a lot of that kind of thing and so it seems like it’s the norm. I also think a “hot girl summer” is different than 10 years of banging all the dudes. Most guys have a “hot guy summer” and no one is condemning them for life because of it.


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## Enigma32 (Jul 6, 2020)

TexasMom1216 said:


> I think if you work at the beach you’re going to see a lot of that kind of thing and so it seems like it’s the norm. I also think a “hot girl summer” is different than 10 years of banging all the dudes. *Most guys have a “hot guy summer” and no one is condemning them for life because of it.*


Yup. Just one of those double standards in dating that likely will never go away. Just like if a guy doesn't pay for a date he's a cheapskate and no woman should date him. Meanwhile, she can expect guys to pay for her and it's just normal and OK. Just how things work.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

Enigma32 said:


> Yup. Just one of those double standards in dating that likely will never go away. Just like if a guy doesn't pay for a date he's a cheapskate and no woman should date him. Meanwhile, she can expect guys to pay for her and it's just normal and OK. Just how things work.


You and I live in different worlds. I’m glad, yours doesn’t sound like a good place to be a woman.


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## Thatredhead (9 mo ago)

rodrigoramirez1209 said:


> So i got off work at 2am caught my wife texting a guy on Instagram they were both saying"I love you" and "baby" "babe" stuff like that and And so I broke down and I left and stayed in a hotel. She later found me where I was staying after attempting to call me multiple times and we talked about it while at the hotel. She Confessed to me that she loves me and wants to stay with me but she wants to date and sleep around with other people and for me to do the same pretty much having an open relationship. The reason for this is because we were together since she was 15 years old We are 29 now. we got pregnant so we got married at 18. She confessed to me that she didn't get to date other people or sleep with other people and she Wants to know how it feels like to date someone else and to sleep with someone else sense I'm the only person she's been with Physically and she's the only person I've ever been with too. After talking about it I told her if she wants to sleep Around with other people then we can't be together but if you want to try and save our marriage you have to delete your Instagram, She broke down of course because she loves the guy she was talking with on Instagram, So I decided that she can continue to have that long distance relationship on Instagram. If she promised me not to date or have sex with anyone else, I figured a long distance relationship is better than having her date other guys because I know she's going to get emotionally attached to that person and continue to have sex with them behind my back. I know anyone else would have left divorced but I love my wife, We've been together since 15 years old and I want to continue to be with my wife so I want to fight for our marriage. So my question to you guys is my wife continues to have the urges to date And sleep around with other guys, And it makes me sad that she feels this way and it's hurting our relationship. Any advice would be helpful.


I don't have any advice really, just that I'm the wife in your scenario in my marriage and I want an open marriage for the exact same reasons as your wife. Married too young, only been with one man, want to explore and find out what I've missed out on by being married all these years. But my husband won't agree and I can't leave the marriage for the same reasons you can't. I will never forgive him.for trapping me like this and I will resent him forever. All these guys in here talking about respect. They have no idea. I could respect my husband if he could put his foolish pride and ego aside and understand where I am coming from and be willing to see me have my needs met, but he is only focused and concerned about his own feelings of inadequacy and male ego. It's disappointing and disgusting and I lost all respect for him. 

Your wife's online lover will help scratch the itch but she won't stop wanting to know what she missed out in by getting with you so young. And she is perfectly right in wondering. 15 is far too young to start a lifelong relationship. She HAS missed out on a lot, so have you. 

I don't know what the solution is to your situation but open marriages are a thing now and I am 100% in favour of them. Don't shut down the idea out of hand. Think about the benefits for your wife. If you love her as you say you do, you can do this for her.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Wow, now that's a different perspective 🧐


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## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

rodrigoramirez1209 said:


> We actually are very different and we've been total opposites since the day we met. We were happy for the first 5 years of our life but when our second baby was born I just didn't feel connected with her anymore like I wanted some one els and she knew that I didn't find her attractive anymore but she was still in love with me, I never cheated though even though I didn't truly love my wife anymore and the next 5 years was hell for her cus I guess I was an asswhole but just last year she quit her job and she changed she found a new job told herself she wasn't going to let anyone bring her down anymore, she started dressing more revealing and she just looked beautiful to me agian and I fell in love with her again and i change to the man she always wanted me to be but she no longer felt the same anymore so it's like we switched places


This changes the dynamic as you now say you were an asshole for five years, I guess you emotionally withdrew from her and that is heartbreaking for any woman. Looks like she has lots of resentment and is now teaching you a lesson. How very very sad for you, her and your children.


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## DudeInProgress (Jun 10, 2019)

Thatredhead said:


> I don't have any advice really, just that I'm the wife in your scenario in my marriage and I want an open marriage for the exact same reasons as your wife. Married too young, only been with one man, want to explore and find out what I've missed out on by being married all these years. But my husband won't agree and I can't leave the marriage for the same reasons you can't. I will never forgive him.for trapping me like this and I will resent him forever. All these guys in here talking about respect. They have no idea. I could respect my husband if he could put his foolish pride and ego aside and understand where I am coming from and be willing to see me have my needs met, but he is only focused and concerned about his own feelings of inadequacy and male ego. It's disappointing and disgusting and I lost all respect for him.
> 
> Your wife's online lover will help scratch the itch but she won't stop wanting to know what she missed out in by getting with you so young. And she is perfectly right in wondering. 15 is far too young to start a lifelong relationship. She HAS missed out on a lot, so have you.
> 
> I don't know what the solution is to your situation but open marriages are a thing now and I am 100% in favour of them. Don't shut down the idea out of hand. Think about the benefits for your wife. If you love her as you say you do, you can do this for her.


This has got to be about the most disgusting, despicably narcissistic thing I have ever heard on here. To actually expect your husband to stand by and allow you to **** other men is despicable. And then to be resentful that he won’t let you do it…

I pray that you have been this direct with your husband, because the only proper response to what you just said would be to hand you divorce papers and send you on your way. I can’t imagine your husband would want to remain married to you. You have no business being a wife with that attitude.

Financial challenges or not, you should divorce, then you can enjoy all the men you want, but not as a wife.


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## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

colingrant said:


> The disrespect the wife has for her husband is beyond what words can describe. The only explanation I can think of is she feels so dominant and confident in her position, she actually expects OP to be there after she's test driven her AP. I actually have a hard time believing this is real or even possible.


read what he wrote later about treating his wife like **** for 5 years cause he loved her no more, he destroyed her and now she is bouncing back, what goes around always comes around


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## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

DudeInProgress said:


> This has got to be about the most disgusting, despicably narcissistic thing I have ever heard on here. To actually expect your husband to stand by and allow you to **** other men is despicable. And then to be resentful that he won’t let you do it…
> 
> I pray that you have been this direct with your husband, because the only proper response to what you just said would be to hand you divorce papers and send you on your way. I can’t imagine your husband would want to remain married to you. You have no business being a wife with that attitude.
> 
> Financial challenges or not, you should divorce, then you can enjoy all the men you want, but not as a wife.


Oh please get over yourself! Did you actually read what the OP subsequently wrote about how he treated his wife really badly for 5 years, told her he no longer was attracted to her after their second kid and no longer loved her. That would have destroyed her. He put a bomb in their marriage. Now she has gone and done the same thing. There is no excuse for cheating but she is done with him and its all his own doing. She is now getting her self esteem back and knows she is valuable. She had no worth in his eyes, it is a matter of the selfish prick now suddenly wanting her cause other men do. She was not a toy to begin with. I hope OP learns from this, that his wife was precious and should have been cherished and not taken for granted. She put up with 5 years of his emotional abuse, good for her. The only thing is she should go ahead and get a divorce first. Maybe next time OP will treat the next one with more love, kindness and compassion. What goes around always and I mean always comes around. Ye reap what ye sow.


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## BruceBanner (May 6, 2018)

rodrigoramirez1209 said:


> So i got off work at 2am caught my wife texting a guy on Instagram they were both saying"I love you" and "baby" "babe" stuff like that and And so I broke down and I left and stayed in a hotel. She later found me where I was staying after attempting to call me multiple times and we talked about it while at the hotel. She Confessed to me that she loves me and wants to stay with me but she wants to date and sleep around with other people and for me to do the same pretty much having an open relationship. The reason for this is because we were together since she was 15 years old We are 29 now. we got pregnant so we got married at 18. She confessed to me that she didn't get to date other people or sleep with other people and she Wants to know how it feels like to date someone else and to sleep with someone else sense I'm the only person she's been with Physically and she's the only person I've ever been with too. After talking about it I told her if she wants to sleep Around with other people then we can't be together but if you want to try and save our marriage you have to delete your Instagram, She broke down of course because she loves the guy she was talking with on Instagram, So I decided that she can continue to have that long distance relationship on Instagram. If she promised me not to date or have sex with anyone else, I figured a long distance relationship is better than having her date other guys because I know she's going to get emotionally attached to that person and continue to have sex with them behind my back. I know anyone else would have left divorced but I love my wife, We've been together since 15 years old and I want to continue to be with my wife so I want to fight for our marriage. So my question to you guys is my wife continues to have the urges to date And sleep around with other guys, And it makes me sad that she feels this way and it's hurting our relationship. Any advice would be helpful.


Your wife wants to be single maybe you should help her with that.


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## bricks (Aug 14, 2017)

Your wife is beyond testing the waters for an affair. She is telling another man she loves him and cried when you said she needed to cut it off to make your marriage work. The force of what she wants and thinks she feels for this man can not be overcome with rules about Instagram and promises. She has been lying to you for a long time to develop this relationship behind your back, and it would still be going on if you had not caught her. 

Sadly, what you have created with your permissions is the perfect storm for a miserable few years until the whole thing ultimately blows up. The trust is severely shaken, but imagine a few years of wondering every time she picks of her phone or seems in a good mood. Imagine her not being able to keep a promise to you because she knows you won't hold a line. In a while, you will be tortured, she will have continued pursuing men secretly, and your home life will become tense.

The ONLY hope you have for sanity and self respect is to do what you initially intended. Ask her to leave. She will date and she will return when things don't work out. At that point, you have a decision to make. Good luck.


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

TexasMom1216 said:


> I do not understand why waiting to marry until you’re in your mid-20s automatically means you’re F-ing “everything with a heart beat.” Are you guys saying that if a woman doesn’t marry in her teens she’s, as Conan so eloquently put it, a “ho”? 😂


In today's time many have already been riding the carousel by 20. I was a guy that remained chaste looking for THE ONE that had remained pure. Needless to say I was sadly disappointed she was not to be found. 

HS GF had lied and had already been having sex. 2nd one got knocked up by my cousin right after I took her to prom. 3rd GF I took to SR prom, she was from another school and friend from that district waived me off as he knew she had reputation there. Broke up with her and she went to party and had a train pulled on her by 5-6 guys.

So at 23 I got pissed off at one female and said F it and had sex with a girl that was chasing me. After that I was just used, the girls were not serious. I was just a 🎠 on their carousel. 

I was sick of women, they just wanted sex. Disheartening for a guy that wanted the fairy tail. Prayed and told the Lord I was done looking. Put me with the one he wants me with. 

2 weeks later I met my wife. She was 27. She was 4 months out from filing divorce on a serial cheating ex hubby of 10 yrs. She had married at 17 to her HS BF. She has same ideas of family and marriage as I did.


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

aine said:


> Oh please get over yourself! Did you actually read what the OP subsequently wrote about how he treated his wife really badly for 5 years, told her he no longer was attracted to her after their second kid and no longer loved her. That would have destroyed her. He put a bomb in their marriage. Now she has gone and done the same thing. There is no excuse for cheating but she is done with him and its all his own doing. She is now getting her self esteem back and knows she is valuable. She had no worth in his eyes, it is a matter of the selfish prick now suddenly wanting her cause other men do. She was not a toy to begin with. I hope OP learns from this, that his wife was precious and should have been cherished and not taken for granted. She put up with 5 years of his emotional abuse, good for her. The only thing is she should go ahead and get a divorce first. Maybe next time OP will treat the next one with more love, kindness and compassion. What goes around always and I mean always comes around. Ye reap what ye sow.


He told her he did not love her? Or just acted that way. I wonder if she let herself go after the kids was why he was not attracted to her any more, but when she started dressing more provocative again, his attention was renewed.


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## ABHale (Jan 3, 2016)

TexasMom1216 said:


> Ah. I haven’t seen that but am not doubting it’s been said. I personally think it’s very healthy for young women to be on their own and single for a few years to learn how to take care of themselves and be ok being alone. That way they’re confident they can stand on their own and not afraid of being alone, so they won’t tolerate a guy treating them badly. It’s not something historically women were allowed to do and it’s good for them to know they’re not helpless. I would not concur with those that say that sleeping around is great. I think it will leave them feeling hollow and sad, I don’t think it’s empowering at all.


I agree 1000% about a young woman being able to take care of herself. I had my daughter in self defense classes at a young age. She has used what she learned. She is also a really good shot with her weapon. At 25 she is the HR coordinator at her facility.


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## Rus47 (Apr 1, 2021)

TexasMom1216 said:


> That’s a really limited view of life. All of life is not about sex. Most of that time (for me) was spent working and learning how to adult independently. Figuring out who I am and what I wanted from life. How can you pick or be a good partner if you aren’t even sure what you want out of life? It’s just not true that women who don’t marry at 17 are spending their lives sleeping around. Not everything women do is about men, just like not everything men do is about women.


Wife and I met when I was 16. Married two years later. We had no other partners before one another. Waiting would have been far wiser for *financial *reasons. The people I knew at work who married in late 20s or early 30s already had established their lives solo and accordingly were much better positioned financially. Most of my generation married in their teens. But that was then, and irrelevant these days. I have encouraged my descendants to establish themselves as a single person financially and emotionally. And to never be dependent on another person for their financial support.. 

I can't comment on the sexual aspect of waiting until late 20s but would think that someone gaining experience with the opposite sex would be a positive not a negative. Wife and I "learned" with one another and we no doubt lack some of the expertise those with a more varied background have, even after so many years married. We please one another which is all that really matters. We had been married for awhile, with two kids, when Joy of Sex was published. We bought and read the book together and were astounded at some of what we hadn't tried.


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## BigDaddyNY (May 19, 2021)

Thatredhead said:


> I don't have any advice really, just that I'm the wife in your scenario in my marriage and I want an open marriage for the exact same reasons as your wife. Married too young, only been with one man, want to explore and find out what I've missed out on by being married all these years. But my husband won't agree and I can't leave the marriage for the same reasons you can't. I will never forgive him.for trapping me like this and I will resent him forever. All these guys in here talking about respect. They have no idea. I could respect my husband if he could put his foolish pride and ego aside and understand where I am coming from and be willing to see me have my needs met, but he is only focused and concerned about his own feelings of inadequacy and male ego. It's disappointing and disgusting and I lost all respect for him.
> 
> Your wife's online lover will help scratch the itch but she won't stop wanting to know what she missed out in by getting with you so young. And she is perfectly right in wondering. 15 is far too young to start a lifelong relationship. She HAS missed out on a lot, so have you.
> 
> I don't know what the solution is to your situation but open marriages are a thing now and I am 100% in favour of them. Don't shut down the idea out of hand. Think about the benefits for your wife. If you love her as you say you do, you can do this for her.


You are nothing but a coward afraid to leave and blame shifting to your husband, who God forbid, wants his wife to be sexually exclusive to him. If you are really so unhappy and resentful, then put your big girl pants on and leave him.

What is it that she, and you, have missed out on. Spreading you legs for any guy you feel like is missing out? I married my wife and she is my only sexual partner and I have missed out on nothing of any importance. Life does not improve simply by having multiple sexual partners. You, like OPs wife, have deluded themselves into thinking they've missed out on some giant and necessary life experience.

ETA: You say you husband "trapped" you, yet as I recall you USED him to get out of a bad home life, so please save your sob story for someone gullible enough to fall for it.


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## olk (Aug 17, 2021)

rodrigoramirez1209 said:


> So i got off work at 2am caught my wife texting a guy on Instagram they were both saying"I love you" and "baby" "babe" stuff like that and And so I broke down and I left and stayed in a hotel. She later found me where I was staying after attempting to call me multiple times and we talked about it while at the hotel. She Confessed to me that she loves me and wants to stay with me but she wants to date and sleep around with other people and for me to do the same pretty much having an open relationship. The reason for this is because we were together since she was 15 years old We are 29 now. we got pregnant so we got married at 18. She confessed to me that she didn't get to date other people or sleep with other people and she Wants to know how it feels like to date someone else and to sleep with someone else sense I'm the only person she's been with Physically and she's the only person I've ever been with too. After talking about it I told her if she wants to sleep Around with other people then we can't be together but if you want to try and save our marriage you have to delete your Instagram, She broke down of course because she loves the guy she was talking with on Instagram, So I decided that she can continue to have that long distance relationship on Instagram. If she promised me not to date or have sex with anyone else, I figured a long distance relationship is better than having her date other guys because I know she's going to get emotionally attached to that person and continue to have sex with them behind my back. I know anyone else would have left divorced but I love my wife, We've been together since 15 years old and I want to continue to be with my wife so I want to fight for our marriage. So my question to you guys is my wife continues to have the urges to date And sleep around with other guys, And it makes me sad that she feels this way and it's hurting our relationship. Any advice would be helpful.


You have only two alternatives to choose from: become part of her reversed harem or get divorced. There are no other solutions, because her twisted morality will still allow her to sleep with whoever she wants, not caring about you and family.


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## BigDaddyNY (May 19, 2021)

aine said:


> Oh please get over yourself! Did you actually read what the OP subsequently wrote about how he treated his wife really badly for 5 years, told her he no longer was attracted to her after their second kid and no longer loved her. That would have destroyed her. He put a bomb in their marriage. Now she has gone and done the same thing. There is no excuse for cheating but she is done with him and its all his own doing. She is now getting her self esteem back and knows she is valuable. She had no worth in his eyes, it is a matter of the selfish prick now suddenly wanting her cause other men do. She was not a toy to begin with. I hope OP learns from this, that his wife was precious and should have been cherished and not taken for granted. She put up with 5 years of his emotional abuse, good for her. The only thing is she should go ahead and get a divorce first. Maybe next time OP will treat the next one with more love, kindness and compassion. What goes around always and I mean always comes around. Ye reap what ye sow.


Yes, OP screwed up and was a terrible husband, but cheating or forcing him to accept an open marriage is not the solution. She should have left if he was so terrible. But she didn't, instead they had a 3rd kid together! Doesn't sound like she was completely unhappy if she had another baby with him. Now, with 3 kids in tow she wants to date and sleep with other men. Basically she wants to be single and she is using getting married at a young age as an excuse. If you ask me, both OP and wife are just terrible people.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

aine said:


> read what he wrote later about treating his wife like **** for 5 years cause he loved her no more, he destroyed her and now she is bouncing back, what goes around always comes around


And here they are today. So?

Is everything in your mind transactional?


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> And here they are today. So?
> 
> Is everything in your mind transactional?


In life it often is.


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## plastow (Jan 4, 2022)

rodrigoramirez1209 said:


> So i got off work at 2am caught my wife texting a guy on Instagram they were both saying"I love you" and "baby" "babe" stuff like that and And so I broke down and I left and stayed in a hotel. She later found me where I was staying after attempting to call me multiple times and we talked about it while at the hotel. She Confessed to me that she loves me and wants to stay with me but she wants to date and sleep around with other people and for me to do the same pretty much having an open relationship. The reason for this is because we were together since she was 15 years old We are 29 now. we got pregnant so we got married at 18. She confessed to me that she didn't get to date other people or sleep with other people and she Wants to know how it feels like to date someone else and to sleep with someone else sense I'm the only person she's been with Physically and she's the only person I've ever been with too. After talking about it I told her if she wants to sleep Around with other people then we can't be together but if you want to try and save our marriage you have to delete your Instagram, She broke down of course because she loves the guy she was talking with on Instagram, So I decided that she can continue to have that long distance relationship on Instagram. If she promised me not to date or have sex with anyone else, I figured a long distance relationship is better than having her date other guys because I know she's going to get emotionally attached to that person and continue to have sex with them behind my back. I know anyone else would have left divorced but I love my wife, We've been together since 15 years old and I want to continue to be with my wife so I want to fight for our marriage. So my question to you guys is my wife continues to have the urges to date And sleep around with other guys, And it makes me sad that she feels this way and it's hurting our relationship. Any advice would be helpful.


your a fool if you think you can live with this she will keep hurting you time and time again if thats what you want from love then your a fool.she will now do as she pleases regardless of what you say you already know this it would be better for you to cut out now while you have some self esteem left.let her go its what she is really wanting.


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

They don't seem the brightest of couples.


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## Thatredhead (9 mo ago)

> are nothing but a coward afraid to leave and blame shifting to your husband, who God forbid, wants his wife to be sexually exclusive to him. If you are really so unhappy and resentful, then put your big girl pants on and leave him.
> 
> What is it that she, and you, have missed out on. Spreading you legs for any guy you feel like is missing out? I married my wife and she is my only sexual partner and I have missed out on nothing of any importance. Life does not improve simply by having multiple sexual partners. You, like OPs wife, have deluded themselves into thinking they've missed out on some giant and necessary life experience.
> 
> ETA: You say you husband "trapped" you, yet as I recall you USED him to get out of a bad home life, so please save your sob story for someone gullible enough to fall for it.


There's nothing cowardly about deciding to bite the bullet and keep a family intact. It's by far and away the hardest thing I've ever done. I'm not blame shifting either. We are both at fault for getting married so young, but it was my family's (and their religion) for pushing such an early marriage. I accept that I ****ed up hugely, and that I should never have gotten married. But life sucks that way, you gotta deal with your stupid mistakes for the rest of your life sometimes.

Op, op's wife, my husband , and myself, we all missed out on a HUGE part of life. We never got to develop and grow as individuals before becoming couples. We missed freedom, learning about sexuality, experimenting with our own, we missed on just plain fun and joy. When I should have been drowning in **** at college, I was making a home and raising babies. It makes me feel physically ill and soo regretful that those precious years of my 20s were completely wasted. OPs wife is probably feeling similar, only she spent even longer being a baby maker and started earlier, poor girl. No wonder she is looking back in regret and wants fun now. Especially if OP was a **** to her.

I say my husband trapped me because I am trapped now. I'm stuck here and he knows it. He knows, and he knew then, that I married him to get away from home. He was the only escape I had. But now that I want more from life, he is being incredibly stubborn. So if wants to play that card, he gets what's coming to him.


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## Dictum Veritas (Oct 22, 2020)

Thatredhead said:


> There's nothing cowardly about deciding to bite the bullet and keep a family intact. It's by far and away the hardest thing I've ever done. I'm not blame shifting either. We are both at fault for getting married so young, but it was my family's (and their religion) for pushing such an early marriage. I accept that I ****ed up hugely, and that I should never have gotten married. But life sucks that way, you gotta deal with your stupid mistakes for the rest of your life sometimes.
> 
> Op, op's wife, my husband , and myself, we all missed out on a HUGE part of life. We never got to develop and grow as individuals before becoming couples. We missed freedom, learning about sexuality, experimenting with our own, we missed on just plain fun and joy. When I should have been drowning in *** at college, I was making a home and raising babies. It makes me feel physically ill and soo regretful that those precious years of my 20s were completely wasted. OPs wife is probably feeling similar, only she spent even longer being a baby maker and started earlier, poor girl. No wonder she is looking back in regret and wants fun now. Especially if OP was a *** to her.
> 
> I say my husband trapped me because I am trapped now. I'm stuck here and he knows it. He knows, and he knew then, that I married him to get away from home. He was the only escape I had. But now that I want more from life, he is being incredibly stubborn. So if wants to play that card, he gets what's coming to him.


You feel trapped because you are not the kind of person who should ever have gotten married. You would have done your husband a favor if you had said no the day he proposed. That man is in for a world of pain because you want what you want when you want it never-mind the pain it would eventually cause others.

Blaming phantoms like "patriarchy" and calling a marriage that makes normal people happy an institution etc. doesn't fix the fact that you are broken at the core and that those are just excuses used by broken people to lament that intact people won't enable them and glorify their brokenness amongst themselves.

There is certainly something wrong with advising that someone who would not have considered an open marriage as a viable option now consider it and "bite the bullet" to save a marriage blown up by the craven lusts of yet another fundamentally broken person, just because you are both broken across the same moral seam.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

aine said:


> Oh please get over yourself! Did you actually read what the OP subsequently wrote about how he treated his wife really badly for 5 years, told her he no longer was attracted to her after their second kid and no longer loved her. That would have destroyed her. He put a bomb in their marriage. Now she has gone and done the same thing. There is no excuse for cheating but she is done with him and its all his own doing. She is now getting her self esteem back and knows she is valuable. She had no worth in his eyes, it is a matter of the selfish prick now suddenly wanting her cause other men do. She was not a toy to begin with. I hope OP learns from this, that his wife was precious and should have been cherished and not taken for granted. She put up with 5 years of his emotional abuse, good for her. The only thing is she should go ahead and get a divorce first. Maybe next time OP will treat the next one with more love, kindness and compassion. What goes around always and I mean always comes around. Ye reap what ye sow.


Falling out of the feeling of love is one thing, wanting penis on the side and being able to keep a husband is quite another.

You are equating far different things.

I'm not trying to portray OP as husband of the year and I believe he needs to grow but his behavior hardly equates to this lunatic stunt she's trying to pull.

I would advise him to pull his head out too because he is being too wishy washy over her belligerent idiocy.


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## BigDaddyNY (May 19, 2021)

Thatredhead said:


> There's nothing cowardly about deciding to bite the bullet and keep a family intact. It's by far and away the hardest thing I've ever done. I'm not blame shifting either. We are both at fault for getting married so young, but it was my family's (and their religion) for pushing such an early marriage. I accept that I ****ed up hugely, and that I should never have gotten married. But life sucks that way, you gotta deal with your stupid mistakes for the rest of your life sometimes.
> 
> Op, op's wife, my husband , and myself, we all missed out on a HUGE part of life. We never got to develop and grow as individuals before becoming couples. We missed freedom, learning about sexuality, experimenting with our own, we missed on just plain fun and joy. When I should have been drowning in *** at college, I was making a home and raising babies. It makes me feel physically ill and soo regretful that those precious years of my 20s were completely wasted. OPs wife is probably feeling similar, only she spent even longer being a baby maker and started earlier, poor girl. No wonder she is looking back in regret and wants fun now. Especially if OP was a *** to her.
> 
> I say my husband trapped me because I am trapped now. I'm stuck here and he knows it. He knows, and he knew then, that I married him to get away from home. He was the only escape I had. But now that I want more from life, he is being incredibly stubborn. So if wants to play that card, he gets what's coming to him.


You only THINK you've missed out on a huge part of life. I didn't know drowning in d1ck at college was a huge part of life that we all needed to experience.

Freedom, learning about sexuality, experimenting with our own, just plain fun and joy are ALL things you can and should experience with your spouse. You don't need to be single for any of that. I think you really need some therapy to work on your issues. You think your 20's were wasted because of some foolish notion that had you not been married everything would have been so grand. The reality is your life could have been much worse if you didn't marry. You have no way of knowing and thinking an open marriage is going to fix that hole inside you is very delusional.

LOL, stubborn for not letting you sleep with other men. Again, delusional, just like OP's wife.

ETA: BTW, I had the time of my life marrying my wife at 18 and heading out into the world as a team, becoming mature adults together, embarking on the adventures of life and being each other best friend and lovers. I wouldn't trade it for anything in this world.


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## drencrom (Jul 1, 2021)

Thatredhead said:


> There's nothing cowardly about deciding to bite the bullet and keep a family intact. It's by far and away the hardest thing I've ever done. I'm not blame shifting either. We are both at fault for getting married so young, but it was my family's (and their religion) for pushing such an early marriage. I accept that I ****ed up hugely, and that I should never have gotten married. But life sucks that way, you gotta deal with your stupid mistakes for the rest of your life sometimes.
> 
> Op, op's wife, my husband , and myself, we all missed out on a HUGE part of life. We never got to develop and grow as individuals before becoming couples. We missed freedom, learning about sexuality, experimenting with our own, we missed on just plain fun and joy. When I should have been drowning in *** at college, I was making a home and raising babies. It makes me feel physically ill and soo regretful that those precious years of my 20s were completely wasted. OPs wife is probably feeling similar, only she spent even longer being a baby maker and started earlier, poor girl. No wonder she is looking back in regret and wants fun now. Especially if OP was a *** to her.
> 
> I say my husband trapped me because I am trapped now. I'm stuck here and he knows it. He knows, and he knew then, that I married him to get away from home. He was the only escape I had. But now that I want more from life, he is being incredibly stubborn. So if wants to play that card, he gets what's coming to him.


Set him free and divorce him already so he can find someone decent.


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## drencrom (Jul 1, 2021)

aine said:


> Oh please get over yourself! Did you actually read what the OP subsequently wrote about how he treated his wife really badly for 5 years


OP? Or Thatredhead? Because he was referring to Thatredhead who simply wants to f*** other men using the excuse of marrying young. His reply wasn't about the OP.

Talk about backing the wrong horse.


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## Numb26 (Sep 11, 2019)

drencrom said:


> OP? Or Thatredhead? Because he was referring to Thatredhead who simply wants to f*** other men using the excuse of marrying young. His reply wasn't about the OP.
> 
> Talk about backing the wrong horse.


Got to defend the hos, you know. 🤣🤣🤣🤣


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## drencrom (Jul 1, 2021)

Numb26 said:


> Got to defend the hos, you know. 🤣🤣🤣🤣


Yes, I'm getting that sense here of women giving other women a pass and making excuses for their desire to cheat.


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## Thatredhead (9 mo ago)

BigDaddyNY said:


> You only THINK you've missed out on a huge part of life. I didn't know drowning in d1ck at college was a huge part of life that we all needed to experience.
> 
> Freedom, learning about sexuality, experimenting with our own, just plain fun and joy are ALL things you can and should experience with your spouse. You don't need to be single for any of that. I think you really need some therapy to work on your issues. You think your 20's were wasted because of some foolish notion that had you not been married everything would have been so grand. The reality is your life could have been much worse if you didn't marry. You have no way of knowing and thinking an open marriage is going to fix that hole inside you is very delusional.
> 
> ...


Perhaps you lack imagination as to how much better it could have been if you were single? Getting married at 18 is basically child marriage. What an awful thing to do yourself and your spouse. I saw it time and again in the cult I grew up in. Kids rushing to get married the minute they turned 18 so they could have sex, only to find out marriage is hard and sucks the joy out of life. So many of those marriages were disasters. I married at 21 and that was still far too young to know what I was doing. 

In my case, I was caught between a hard place and a very hard rock. I either got married or faced shunning and eventually homelessness. So I stepped up and got married. So my 20s were f*&^ed up either way. Which is why my heart is so set on a do over now. 

I am in therapy, to deal with depression and anger. That hasn't changed anything in regards to me wanting an open marriage. In fact it has clarified a few things and made me identify my values. I value freedom and independence very highly. Marriage is the antithesis to both of those values, which makes marriage additionally uncomfortable for me. 

Stubborn is there perfect word to describe my husband's response to my request for an open marriage. He can easily comply, he doesn't have to do anything, it costs him absolutely nothing, he literally doesn't have to lift a finger. Just shut up and look the other way. But he won't and now we have this huge issue. That is pure stubbornness. He has no reason whatsoever beyond stupid male pride and ego and I simply won't tolerate either excuse. This open marriage WILL happen, one way or another. I can be far more persistent and cunning than he is stubborn but it makes me angry that I have to go to these lengths when him simply agreeing would just set the matter right. But I digress. 

You got married at 18 and I feel terrible for you. You aren't even aware of what you've missed out on. 😪


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

This shows you what happens when you mistreat your wife for 5 years because she is pregnant and then you change your mind when she starts wearing mini-skirts. Typical man.


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## drencrom (Jul 1, 2021)

Thatredhead said:


> Stubborn is there perfect word to describe my husband's response to my request for an open marriage. He can easily comply, he doesn't have to do anything, it costs him absolutely nothing


It costs him his self respect, dignity, and emotional well being.

But you wouldn't understand that because you have no soul. Again, get a divorce, set him free from you. No man wants a woman like you as a life partner unless he wants to cuckold himself.

Tell you what, have him create an account here so we can give him some advice. He can DM me.



> This open marriage WILL happen, one way or another.


This is disgusting, if I knew reporting this would go against the rules. IMO it does because this is just a cruel thing to say with all the people here that have been hurt and betrayed. People who came here hurting shouldn't have to read this s***. Especially in a thread of a man hurting about what his wife is doing.

@MattMatt? @EleGirl? @lifeistooshort? Anything that can be done here?


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## Numb26 (Sep 11, 2019)

drencrom said:


> It costs him his self respect, dignity, and emotional well being.
> 
> But you wouldn't understand that because you have no soul. Again, get a divorce, set him free from you. No man wants a woman like you as a life partner unless he wants to cuckold himself.
> 
> ...


It's good actually. Reminds us that there are these kind of people out there and we always need to keep our defenses up.


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## drencrom (Jul 1, 2021)

Numb26 said:


> It's good actually. Reminds us that there are these kind of people out there and we always need to keep our defenses up.


If it wasn't against the rules, a little well deserved name calling would be in order here with that kind of person.


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## Numb26 (Sep 11, 2019)

drencrom said:


> If it wasn't against the rules, a little well deserved name calling would be in order here with that kind of person.


You would just be wasting your time


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## Thatredhead (9 mo ago)

drencrom said:


> It costs him his self respect, dignity, and emotional well being.
> 
> But you wouldn't understand that because you have no soul. Again, get a divorce, set him free from you. No man wants a woman like you as a life partner unless he wants to cuckold himself.
> 
> ...


His self respect, dignity, and emotional well being aren't tied up in what I do with my body. If they are that's on him. I couldn't give a flying rat's a$$ if he pounded every girl in town. He ought to feel the same about me, and if he doesn't, if he's some sort of twisted up inside, that's on him. He can deal with it. Would he be whining and crying if I got a tattoo or a piercing? Dyed my hair green? Shaved it all off? The choices I make in regards to what I do with my body, including my sexuality, are MINE. His emotions are a moot point. 

I will have my way in this. I'm just as determined as you red pill guys and your NMNG, and all that alpha male nonsense that gets spewed in here. I will 'have my cake and eat it too' otherwise what is the point in having the stupid cake?


----------



## BigDaddyNY (May 19, 2021)

Thatredhead said:


> Perhaps you lack imagination as to how much better it could have been if you were single? Getting married at 18 is basically child marriage. What an awful thing to do yourself and your spouse. I saw it time and again in the cult I grew up in. Kids rushing to get married the minute they turned 18 so they could have sex, only to find out marriage is hard and sucks the joy out of life. So many of those marriages were disasters. I married at 21 and that was still far too young to know what I was doing.
> 
> In my case, I was caught between a hard place and a very hard rock. I either got married or faced shunning and eventually homelessness. So I stepped up and got married. So my 20s were f*&^ed up either way. Which is why my heart is so set on a do over now.
> 
> ...


You are not aware of what you missed out on either. Could have missed out on all those pump and dumps in college. Maybe a little date rape here and there. Or it could have been a glorious time. You have no idea.

Me, I am completely happy with my choices with zero regrets. I've even from time to time thought about what it would be like if I had done things differently. In every instance I end up confident I made the right choices.

You really come off as a horrible person. A selfish and entitled person that will get what she wants regardless of what harm it does. I don't believe you can truly love your husband the way you talk, so why stay married?

You realize you are miserable because he won't let you wh0re around? I know you will say that isn't what you want, but it is. You want another man inside you. And you want as many as you want. That is the "joy" you missed out on. Do you really believe that having another man inside you is going to fill the hole inside you?


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## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

Thatredhead said:


> I don't have any advice really, just that I'm the wife in your scenario in my marriage and I want an open marriage for the exact same reasons as your wife. Married too young, only been with one man, want to explore and find out what I've missed out on by being married all these years. But my husband won't agree and I can't leave the marriage for the same reasons you can't. I will never forgive him.for trapping me like this and I will resent him forever. All these guys in here talking about respect. They have no idea. I could respect my husband if he could put his foolish pride and ego aside and understand where I am coming from and be willing to see me have my needs met, but he is only focused and concerned about his own feelings of inadequacy and male ego. It's disappointing and disgusting and I lost all respect for him.
> 
> Your wife's online lover will help scratch the itch but she won't stop wanting to know what she missed out in by getting with you so young. And she is perfectly right in wondering. 15 is far too young to start a lifelong relationship. She HAS missed out on a lot, so have you.
> 
> I don't know what the solution is to your situation but open marriages are a thing now and I am 100% in favour of them. Don't shut down the idea out of hand. Think about the benefits for your wife. If you love her as you say you do, you can do this for her.


You won't forgive your husband for TRAPPING YOU??? YOU TOOK THOSE VOWS to be monogamous in your marriage. Don't come here playing the poor little victim card because your HUSBAND doesn't want to change the vows of your marriage. 

THAT'S NOT HOW MARRIAGE WORKS. You sound like a selfish, cold-hearted partner. You need to divorce so your husband can find a woman who wants to love him the way you obviously don't.


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## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

Thatredhead said:


> His self respect, dignity, and emotional well being aren't tied up in what I do with my body. If they are that's on him. I couldn't give a flying rat's a$$ if he pounded every girl in town. He ought to feel the same about me, and if he doesn't, if he's some sort of twisted up inside, that's on him. He can deal with it. Would he be whining and crying if I got a tattoo or a piercing? Dyed my hair green? Shaved it all off? The choices I make in regards to what I do with my body, including my sexuality, are MINE. His emotions are a moot point.
> 
> I will have my way in this. I'm just as determined as you red pill guys and your NMNG, and all that alpha male nonsense that gets spewed in here. I will 'have my cake and eat it too' otherwise what is the point in having the stupid cake?


You make me want to PUKE.


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## BigDaddyNY (May 19, 2021)

Thatredhead said:


> His self respect, dignity, and emotional well being aren't tied up in what I do with my body. If they are that's on him. I couldn't give a flying rat's a$$ if he pounded every girl in town. He ought to feel the same about me, and if he doesn't, if he's some sort of twisted up inside, that's on him. He can deal with it. Would he be whining and crying if I got a tattoo or a piercing? Dyed my hair green? Shaved it all off? The choices I make in regards to what I do with my body, *including my sexuality, are MINE.* His emotions are a moot point.
> 
> I will have my way in this. I'm just as determined as you red pill guys and your NMNG, and all that alpha male nonsense that gets spewed in here. I will 'have my cake and eat it too' otherwise what is the point in having the stupid cake?


That isn't what you agreed to when you got married. It is fine if you don't want to be sexually exclusive. Be a single woman and you can do what you want. Anything else makes you into a POS who doesn't give a rat's ass about anyone other than themselves.


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## drencrom (Jul 1, 2021)

LisaDiane said:


> You make me want to PUKE.


You and every decent member of this site.


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## Dictum Veritas (Oct 22, 2020)

Thatredhead said:


> His self respect, dignity, and emotional well being aren't tied up in what I do with my body. If they are that's on him. I couldn't give a flying rat's a$$ if he pounded every girl in town. He ought to feel the same about me, and if he doesn't, if he's some sort of twisted up inside, that's on him. He can deal with it. Would he be whining and crying if I got a tattoo or a piercing? Dyed my hair green? Shaved it all off? The choices I make in regards to what I do with my body, including my sexuality, are MINE. His emotions are a moot point.
> 
> I will have my way in this. I'm just as determined as you red pill guys and your NMNG, and all that alpha male nonsense that gets spewed in here. I will 'have my cake and eat it too' otherwise what is the point in having the stupid cake?


I have no words for how lowly I regard you. I wish I can have a word with your husband. Things will take a terrible turn for you immediately after since you would be on the streets for which you long, of that I'm sure.


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## Numb26 (Sep 11, 2019)

LisaDiane said:


> You make me want to PUKE.


If it makes you feel any better I think my device got Herpes from her posts.


----------



## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

Dictum Veritas said:


> I have no words for how lowly I regard you. I wish I can have a word with your husband. Things will take a terrible turn for you immediately after since you would be on the streets for which you long, of that I'm sure.


Maybe you should read her only post to get an idea of where she is coming from.


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## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

Numb26 said:


> If it makes you feel any better I think my device got Herpes from her posts.


Omg...LOLOLOL!!!!!!!!


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## Dictum Veritas (Oct 22, 2020)

In Absentia said:


> Maybe you should read her only post to get an idea of where she is coming from.


I have read all her posts and her thread. I'll get banned for sure if I really spoke my mind.


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## Thatredhead (9 mo ago)

BigDaddyNY said:


> You are not aware of what you missed out on either. Could have missed out of all those pump and dumps in college. Maybe a little date rape here and there. Or it could have been a glorious time. You have no idea.
> 
> Me, I am completely happy with my choices with zero regrets. I've even from time to time thought about what it would be like if I had done things differently. In every instance I end up confident I made the right choices.
> 
> ...


To answer your question, yes. Yes! YES! AND THEN MORE YESSES! 

Now I'm not delusional, I know most men are crap in bed and the sex would likely suck but goddammit I WANT the option. I want to be wanted like that. I'm conventionally attractive so I get attention from men. I like it. I want to progress the attention and see where it goes. I want to see what different men are capable of. Pump and dump is perfect. Random hookups are exactly what I want. Relationships? Ugh. NO. 
I DO want to wh0re around! That's exactly what I want. That's true freedom, imo. 

I don't have a hole inside that needs filling, I have empty chapters that need writing. Critical parts of my development as a normal human were skipped over when I got married and I want the chance to fill in what I missed. 

Perhaps you are still quite young and haven't reached the misery stage of marriage yet. Though marrying at 18 is pretty gauche nowadays, so maybe you're older and just don't have the imagination to see what you've missed.


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## drencrom (Jul 1, 2021)

In Absentia said:


> Maybe you should read her only post to get an idea of where she is coming from.


I did, and it makes not one iota of difference how I regard her.


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## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

Thatredhead said:


> To answer your question, yes. Yes! YES! AND THEN MORE YESSES!
> 
> Now I'm not delusional, I know most men are crap in bed and the sex would likely suck but goddammit I WANT the option. I want to be wanted like that. I'm conventionally attractive so I get attention from men. I like it. I want to progress the attention and see where it goes. I want to see what different men are capable of. Pump and dump is perfect. Random hookups are exactly what I want. Relationships? Ugh. NO.
> I DO want to wh0re around! That's exactly what I want. That's true freedom, imo.
> ...


Snore....


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

drencrom said:


> I did, and it makes not one iota of difference how I regard her.


ok, fair enough.


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

Dictum Veritas said:


> I have read all her posts and her thread. I'll get banned for sure if I really spoke my mind.


Then, don't...


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## drencrom (Jul 1, 2021)

LisaDiane said:


> Snore....


I was tempted to do a rhyme here.

Ok, so to get back to the OP, @rodrigoramirez1209, please if you are still reading, ignore the woman on this thread that is cut from the same mold as your wife and we can get back to helping give the best advice to you that we can.


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

Thatredhead said:


> To answer your question, yes. Yes! YES! AND THEN MORE YESSES!
> 
> Now I'm not delusional, I know most men are crap in bed and the sex would likely suck but goddammit I WANT the option. I want to be wanted like that. I'm conventionally attractive so I get attention from men. I like it. I want to progress the attention and see where it goes. I want to see what different men are capable of. Pump and dump is perfect. Random hookups are exactly what I want. Relationships? Ugh. NO.
> I DO want to wh0re around! That's exactly what I want. That's true freedom, imo.
> ...


I know you say you don't want to divorce your husband because you love him - although crap in bed  - but I don't really see any other options if he doesn't want an open marriage. All this talk is a bit pointless, really.


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## DudeInProgress (Jun 10, 2019)

aine said:


> read what he wrote later about treating his wife like **** for 5 years cause he loved her no more, he destroyed her and now she is bouncing back, what goes around always comes around


Which means she has every right to leave him if she wants to. 
It does not mean he should give her permission to **** other men or have an open marriage. That’s ridiculous.


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## Dictum Veritas (Oct 22, 2020)

drencrom said:


> I was tempted to do a rhyme here.


Nah, they have the sense to get paid and the good ones don't latch to good guys and screw up their lives. I have far more respect for them (the rhymed) and considering how little respect I have for them, that says a lot.


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## BigDaddyNY (May 19, 2021)

Thatredhead said:


> To answer your question, yes. Yes! YES! AND THEN MORE YESSES!
> 
> Now I'm not delusional, I know most men are crap in bed and the sex would likely suck but goddammit I WANT the option. I want to be wanted like that. I'm conventionally attractive so I get attention from men. I like it. I want to progress the attention and see where it goes. I want to see what different men are capable of. Pump and dump is perfect. Random hookups are exactly what I want. Relationships? Ugh. NO.
> I DO want to wh0re around! That's exactly what I want. That's true freedom, imo.
> ...


LOL, I've been with my wife for 35 years and my imagination is very fertile. I know that all the things I may have missed out on pale in comparison to what I have with my wife. 

So all of your empty chapters are about getting screwed?


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

drencrom said:


> Yes, I'm getting that sense here of women giving other women a pass and making excuses for their desire to cheat.


Let's not go labeling women in a group with a few wild cards.

There are a couple of nuts but plenty of solid women are just as appalled by "this" behavior.😉


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## Thatredhead (9 mo ago)

LisaDiane said:


> You won't forgive your husband for TRAPPING YOU??? YOU TOOK THOSE VOWS to be monogamous in your marriage. Don't come here playing the poor little victim card because your HUSBAND doesn't want to change the vows of your marriage


I took the vows when I was TOO YOUNG and unworldly to know what I was doing. So yeah, I want more options now that I'm older and wiser. Not a big deal, same with OPs wife. The only problem is the husband getting in the way!


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

Thatredhead said:


> Perhaps you lack imagination as to how much better it could have been if you were single? Getting married at 18 is basically child marriage. What an awful thing to do yourself and your spouse. I saw it time and again in the cult I grew up in. Kids rushing to get married the minute they turned 18 so they could have sex, only to find out marriage is hard and sucks the joy out of life. So many of those marriages were disasters. I married at 21 and that was still far too young to know what I was doing.
> 
> In my case, I was caught between a hard place and a very hard rock. I either got married or faced shunning and eventually homelessness. So I stepped up and got married. So my 20s were f*&^ed up either way. Which is why my heart is so set on a do over now.
> 
> ...


You’re awesome. I truly love reading your thoughts. You are straightforward with your thoughts, which are probably similar to lots of people but they don’t say them.
Bravo!


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

Thatredhead said:


> I took the vows when I was TOO YOUNG and unworldly to know what I was doing. So yeah, I want more options now that I'm older and wiser. Not a big deal, same with OPs wife. The only problem is the husband getting in the way!


Why not divorce him? Seriously? Why not?


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## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

I will no longer acknowledge that that creature exists.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Thatredhead said:


> I know most men are crap in bed and the sex would likely suck


LoL! I'm really curious about how you know this?😋


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## Dictum Veritas (Oct 22, 2020)

Thatredhead said:


> I took the vows when I was TOO YOUNG and unworldly to know what I was doing. So yeah, I want more options now that I'm older and wiser. Not a big deal, same with OPs wife. The only problem is the husband getting in the way!


The truth is that you are the type of person who should never have taken marriage vows. You are too broken for a husband and a stable family. It's not at what age you got married, that's just your rationalization hamster spinning, I've known people like you, you're unsafe at any age.


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## Thatredhead (9 mo ago)

In Absentia said:


> I know you say you don't want to divorce your husband because you love him - although crap in bed  - but I don't really see any other options if he doesn't want an open marriage. All this talk is a bit pointless, really.


My only other option is a side piece. A long term affair or some such arrangement. I don't like this idea but it is what it is. If husband won't see good common sense, I'll have to do something to force the issue. 

But I agree, we are talking in circles here. There is no resolution for my case. My marriage is a case study for why no one should get married young. And definitely never ever as a virgin. I sympathize with OP's wife and wish she would hop on here. I bet her side of the story would be fascinating.


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## Thatredhead (9 mo ago)

ConanHub said:


> LoL! I'm really curious about how you know this?😋


Hanging around forums like this lol! 

Girls talk. You guys leave a lot to be desired. I just wish I had more stories to tell 😔


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## Dictum Veritas (Oct 22, 2020)

Thatredhead said:


> My only other option is a side piece. A long term affair or some such arrangement. I don't like this idea but it is what it is. If husband won't see good common sense, I'll have to do something to force the issue.
> 
> But I agree, we are talking in circles here. There is no resolution for my case. My marriage is a case study for why no one should get married young. And definitely never ever as a virgin. I sympathize with OP's wife and wish she would hop on here. I bet her side of the story would be fascinating.


Your marriage is a case study for why you divorce a woman the moment she asks for an open marriage. That's the only case study the whole mess is good for.


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## DudeInProgress (Jun 10, 2019)

aine said:


> Oh please get over yourself! Did you actually read what the OP subsequently wrote about how he treated his wife really badly for 5 years, told her he no longer was attracted to her after their second kid and no longer loved her. That would have destroyed her. He put a bomb in their marriage. Now she has gone and done the same thing. There is no excuse for cheating but she is done with him and its all his own doing. She is now getting her self esteem back and knows she is valuable. She had no worth in his eyes, it is a matter of the selfish prick now suddenly wanting her cause other men do. She was not a toy to begin with. I hope OP learns from this, that his wife was precious and should have been cherished and not taken for granted. She put up with 5 years of his emotional abuse, good for her. The only thing is she should go ahead and get a divorce first. Maybe next time OP will treat the next one with more love, kindness and compassion. What goes around always and I mean always comes around. Ye reap what ye sow.


Yes, you reap what you sow. And it sounds like OP created a lot of resentment, and his wife may be justified in being done with him.

But none of that has any bearing on the fact that, rather than leaving him, his wife wants him to let her have intimate relationships with other men.

And the vast majority of the guidance here is that he should not allow himself to be a pathetic cuckold, regardless of how much of a jerk he was the past. The answer is that if his wife is done with him then they should divorce. She does not get to **** other men while remaining his wife.


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## DudeInProgress (Jun 10, 2019)

Thatredhead said:


> There's nothing cowardly about deciding to bite the bullet and keep a family intact. It's by far and away the hardest thing I've ever done. I'm not blame shifting either. We are both at fault for getting married so young, but it was my family's (and their religion) for pushing such an early marriage. I accept that I ****ed up hugely, and that I should never have gotten married. But life sucks that way, you gotta deal with your stupid mistakes for the rest of your life sometimes.
> 
> Op, op's wife, my husband , and myself, we all missed out on a HUGE part of life. We never got to develop and grow as individuals before becoming couples. We missed freedom, learning about sexuality, experimenting with our own, we missed on just plain fun and joy. When I should have been drowning in *** at college, I was making a home and raising babies. It makes me feel physically ill and soo regretful that those precious years of my 20s were completely wasted. OPs wife is probably feeling similar, only she spent even longer being a baby maker and started earlier, poor girl. No wonder she is looking back in regret and wants fun now. Especially if OP was a *** to her.
> 
> I say my husband trapped me because I am trapped now. I'm stuck here and he knows it. He knows, and he knew then, that I married him to get away from home. He was the only escape I had. But now that I want more from life, he is being incredibly stubborn. So if wants to play that card, he gets what's coming to him.


It must be really hard going through life that angry, bitter and miserable. Good luck with that


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Thatredhead said:


> Hanging around forums like this lol!
> 
> Girls talk. You guys leave a lot to be desired. I just wish I had more stories to tell 😔


I'm convinced you don't actually have good data on this one.

I'll believe you about your husband, of course, but I've talked to a lot of women over the years and most have enjoyed the sex with the men they had available.

You do have my sympathies about having a lazy and obese partner.

You quite frankly are delusional however to believe that it's common sense for women to f around on their husbands.

There are other paths that take work and commitment but you are kind of showing a laziness in your approach to life as well.

You do not want to do the hard work it would take to improve your situation to the point you could be independent and then divorce and date honestly.


----------



## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

Thatredhead said:


> Hanging around forums like this lol!
> 
> Girls talk. You guys leave a lot to be desired. I just wish I had more stories to tell 😔


You like it, you love it, you want some more of it……😂. Very few men are bad in bed—— if you love them. That makes all the difference.

if you don’t love them, no matter how great they are in bed, it won’t leave you feeling fulfilled. You’ve said you want all these pump and dumps. Be careful what you wish for. That’s all you might get the rest of your life.


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## Numb26 (Sep 11, 2019)

Evinrude58 said:


> You like it, you love it, you want some more of it……😂. Very few men are bad in bed—— if you love them. That makes all the difference.
> 
> if you don’t love them, no matter how great they are in bed, it won’t leave you feeling fulfilled. You’ve said you want all these pump and dumps. Be careful what you wish for. That’s all you might get the rest of your life.


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## Thatredhead (9 mo ago)

ConanHub said:


> You quite frankly are delusional however to believe that it's common sense for women to f around on their husbands.


Look around where you are. Unless it's only common sense for men to cheat? We are all on this board because some aspect of marriage sucks. Of course cheating makes sense, that's why so many people do it. Fidelity is over rated. It's some goal that people talk about but hardly live up to. It's pie in the sky. I'm surprised anyone even expects it anymore lol. 😅 

.


> There are other paths that take work and commitment but you are kind of showing a laziness in your approach to life as well.
> 
> You do not want to do the hard work it would take to improve your situation to the point you could be independent and then divorce and date honestly.


I was raised to be a SAHM, never had any post secondary schooling (I'm in school now) and only worked sporadically over the years. I'm old now and unemployable except for grunt jobs. I run a small business from home but not one that will ever grant me independence. So my husband will have to take care of me for the foreseeable future. I sacrificed my body, my looks, my youth, and my sanity being married to him, and he reaped all the benefits. Now that I want something more, he could divorce me but it's going to cost more than he's willing to pay. Nothing comes between that man and his money so we are stuck together. It sucks but there it is. That is the cost of having a SAHM. When **** hits the fan....what do you do?


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## Thatredhead (9 mo ago)

Evinrude58 said:


> You like it, you love it, you want some more of it……😂. You’ve said you want all these pump and dumps. Be careful what you wish for. That’s all you might get the rest of your life.


If only wishes came true!


----------



## Rob_1 (Sep 8, 2017)

Like @MattMatt would say, no more threadjacking, specially with stupid line of thoughts that thousand upon thousands of human evolution have prove that the above topic is not a desirable evolutionary trait for humans (although present).


----------



## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

ABHale said:


> I agree 1000% about a young woman being able to take care of herself. I had my daughter in self defense classes at a young age. She has used what she learned. She is also a really good shot with her weapon. At 25 she is the HR coordinator at her facility.


Well and based on these replies I feel like I should also point out that a woman not remaining a virgin until she marries ALSO does not mean she is a "ho." Women are not livestock and we as a society don't believe that women must remain "unsullied" while men can sleep around at will. If a woman doesn't marry until she is in her mid-twenties chances are she will have a few serious boyfriends. There is a HUGE difference between dating and having sex with men with whom one is in an exclusive relationship and "staying pure" to keep her "value" on the marriage market. Sadly there are clearly men on here who believe that women must be "untouched" and do not hold the same standards for themselves. 🙄 That's ridiculous and I'm certainly not saying that. (I'm not saying you're saying it either, but there are a few that predictably are saying that.

Honestly, the OP treated his wife like garbage, and while there are OF COURSE men on here who believe that is ALL HER FAULT because she didn't stay the same weight as when she was 17 after three children because ALL marriage problems are of course ALWAYS all the woman's fault 🙄🙄, there's no excuse for what she's doing now. But I do think the marriage problems are because of both of them. They both sound like they're selfish and immature. Hers may come from resentment and hurt, and his from his unfailing arrogance and selfishness, but neither are behaving well. The whole thing is a trainwreck.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

drencrom said:


> OP? Or Thatredhead? Because he was referring to Thatredhead who simply wants to f*** other men using the excuse of marrying young. His reply wasn't about the OP.
> 
> Talk about backing the wrong horse.


The OP reluctantly admitted he told her he didn't love her any more and was a jerk to her for 5 years. He SAYS he wasn't unfaithful, but who knows, we've seen men on here with a very flexible definition of fidelity. The OP has rediscovered his "love" for her after treating her like garbage and 5 years and now he's struggling to get any on the side so he's wanting to fix the marriage so she doesn't get more strange than he is. This whole thing is a mess.

I'm not even going to comment on the one who wants her husband to pay her bills while she sleeps around with other men. We've been down that road and it's a nasty place.


----------



## Rus47 (Apr 1, 2021)

BigDaddyNY said:


> Freedom, learning about sexuality, experimenting with our own, just plain fun and joy are ALL things you can and should experience with your spouse. You don't need to be single for any of that. I think you really need some therapy to work on your issues. You think your 20's were wasted because of some foolish notion that had you not been married everything would have been so grand. The reality is your life could have been much worse if you didn't marry. You have no way of knowing and thinking an open marriage is going to fix that hole inside you is very delusional.


Aren't these thoughts of OP's wife and @Thatredhead promoted by NetFlix, Cosmopolitan, Social Media, "modern society"? Immersing people in a constant barrage of messages that if a person hasn't been promiscuous then they have missed out on life.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

Rus47 said:


> Wife and I met when I was 16. Married two years later. We had no other partners before one another. Waiting would have been far wiser for *financial *reasons. The people I knew at work who married in late 20s or early 30s already had established their lives solo and accordingly were much better positioned financially. Most of my generation married in their teens. But that was then, and irrelevant these days. I have encouraged my descendants to establish themselves as a single person financially and emotionally. And to never be dependent on another person for their financial support..


A lot of people did this. Honestly, lots of people I knew growing up in a small town married right after high school to whoever they were dating at the time. But I completely agree with your statement here, it is very important that everyone survive on their own before they pair up, so they know they can. It's important for guys too, but self-reliance is something men are traditionally taught. Too many women are taught to just go from one Daddy to another and they end up with a man who treats them like a child and has no respect for them. I cannot imagine the horror of being spoken to and treated like a house servant and mindless idiot and then being forced to have sex with that person. Gives me the heebie-jeebies BIG time. Most women are NOT turned on by having sex with their "Daddy," and I have SERIOUS concerns about men who are. Blech.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

drencrom said:


> Yes, I'm getting that sense here of women giving other women a pass and making excuses for their desire to cheat.


I hope you're not getting that from me, because that is WAY not my intent. There is NO excuse for cheating, and what the OP's wife is doing, physical or not, is cheating.


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

Thatredhead said:


> To answer your question, yes. Yes! YES! AND THEN MORE YESSES!
> 
> Now I'm not delusional, I know most men are crap in bed and the sex would likely suck but goddammit I WANT the option. I want to be wanted like that. I'm conventionally attractive so I get attention from men. I like it. I want to progress the attention and see where it goes. I want to see what different men are capable of. Pump and dump is perfect. Random hookups are exactly what I want. Relationships? Ugh. NO.
> I DO want to wh0re around! That's exactly what I want. That's true freedom, imo.
> ...


Miserable stage🤨 lol. Only because you take it there. I've been married 25 yrs. Wished I could erase the memories of prior women I was with. My wife was and is far superior to the garden tools I was with prior. We both wished we had met each other when we were both still virgins. She married HS BF at 17 and we met after she filed divorce at 27. She is 3.5 yrs older than I. Some people just want to sleep around and then there are those that want to be part of a team together.


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

Ho


Thatredhead said:


> Look around where you are. Unless it's only common sense for men to cheat? We are all on this board because some aspect of marriage sucks. Of course cheating makes sense, that's why so many people do it. Fidelity is over rated. It's some goal that people talk about but hardly live up to. It's pie in the sky. I'm surprised anyone even expects it anymore lol. 😅
> 
> .
> 
> I was raised to be a SAHM, never had any post secondary schooling (I'm in school now) and only worked sporadically over the years. I'm old now and unemployable except for grunt jobs. I run a small business from home but not one that will ever grant me independence. So my husband will have to take care of me for the foreseeable future. I sacrificed my body, my looks, my youth, and my sanity being married to him, and he reaped all the benefits. Now that I want something more, he could divorce me but it's going to cost more than he's willing to pay. Nothing comes between that man and his money so we are stuck together. It sucks but there it is. That is the cost of having a SAHM. When **** hits the fan....what do you do?


How is age keeping you from working? Are you a senior citizen?


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## Numb26 (Sep 11, 2019)

Divinely Favored said:


> Ho
> 
> 
> How is age keeping you from working? Are you a senior citizen?


I'm thinking it's more laziness then age


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## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

Numb26 said:


> I'm thinking it's more laziness then age


Entitlement.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

Thatredhead said:


> To answer your question, yes. Yes! YES! AND THEN MORE YESSES!
> 
> Now I'm not delusional, I know most men are crap in bed and the sex would likely suck but goddammit I WANT the option. I want to be wanted like that. I'm conventionally attractive so I get attention from men. I like it. I want to progress the attention and see where it goes. I want to see what different men are capable of. Pump and dump is perfect. Random hookups are exactly what I want. Relationships? Ugh. NO.
> I DO want to wh0re around! That's exactly what I want. That's true freedom, imo.
> ...


A lot of what you're spouting is known to not all be based in reality solely because most responses are from posters with many years of marriage.
They've experienced the good times and bad times.
Part two is you aren't committed to getting out and getting what you're espousing because you aren't taking any action towards those goals.

It just seems you want to make H miserable but still live off him. Sorry for the seemingly harsh brief summary but either act or don't.


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## Rus47 (Apr 1, 2021)

OP's wife, @Thatredhead, and others pining for "freedom" don't have the courage to just end the marriage and live their best dream life. Because of finances I suppose. That must be all that is holding them back? What else could it be? Do they just want to have fun on someone else's dime? What is wrong with just splitting the assets and custody as appropriate and then screw any and all they can. They could likely build a following on one of the porn sites to fund their fun, make way more money than their old man is making. Or start hanging our at truckstops, bars, strip joints. Play for pay. Pure freedom.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

Numb26 said:


> I'm thinking it's more laziness then age


Entitlement. She believes she deserves someone to take care of her while she does whatever she wants. She wants the privileges of adulthood and the responsibility (or lack thereof) of childhood.

4th wave feminists think that’s what “feminism” is. It’s NOT. You can’t have it both ways.


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## DudeInProgress (Jun 10, 2019)

LisaDiane said:


> Entitlement.


Exactly


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## Numb26 (Sep 11, 2019)

TexasMom1216 said:


> Entitlement. She believes she deserves someone to take care of her while she does whatever she wants. She wants the privileges of adulthood and the responsibility (or lack thereof) of childhood.
> 
> 4th wave feminists think that’s what “feminism” is. It’s NOT. You can’t have it both ways.


Bet you she is a Biden voter!


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## DudeInProgress (Jun 10, 2019)

Numb26 said:


> Bet you she is a Biden voter!


Likely, but not really helpful to OP or the conversation. Let’s keep the partisan politics to the politics section.


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## Thatredhead (9 mo ago)

Divinely Favored said:


> How is age keeping you from working? Are you a senior citizen?



I'm 41. Well past the expiration date in the field I'm interested and experienced in, where government funding for new hires ends at 30. 
I have a sporadic work record due to being a SAHM for so many years. I'm not interested in working a minimum wage grunt job that doesn't pay enough to bother getting out of bed for. I'm in school now, hopefully I can eventually get a job in the mining field when I'm done, but again I'm probably too old.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

Numb26 said:


> Bet you she is a Biden voter!


Anything for free stuff!!


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

@Thatredhead Coming to a website called Talk About Marriage and preaching the joys of sexual incontinence. That's a bit like going to a website for people who are the victims of crime and trying to sell lockpick and burglary kits. 

Just divorce your husband. That's the decent, honourable thing to do.


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## Dictum Veritas (Oct 22, 2020)

Thatredhead said:


> I'm 41. Well past the expiration date in the field I'm interested and experienced in, where government funding for new hires ends at 30.
> I have a sporadic work record due to being a SAHM for so many years. I'm not interested in working a minimum wage grunt job that doesn't pay enough to bother getting out of bed for. I'm in school now, hopefully I can eventually get a job in the mining field when I'm done, but again I'm probably too old.


Yep, entitled!


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

Dictum Veritas said:


> Yep, entitled!


All I heard was "I don't want to work."


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## Tested_by_stress (Apr 1, 2021)

Thatredhead said:


> There's nothing cowardly about deciding to bite the bullet and keep a family intact. It's by far and away the hardest thing I've ever done. I'm not blame shifting either. We are both at fault for getting married so young, but it was my family's (and their religion) for pushing such an early marriage. I accept that I ****ed up hugely, and that I should never have gotten married. But life sucks that way, you gotta deal with your stupid mistakes for the rest of your life sometimes.
> 
> Op, op's wife, my husband , and myself, we all missed out on a HUGE part of life. We never got to develop and grow as individuals before becoming couples. We missed freedom, learning about sexuality, experimenting with our own, we missed on just plain fun and joy. When I should have been drowning in *** at college, I was making a home and raising babies. It makes me feel physically ill and soo regretful that those precious years of my 20s were completely wasted. OPs wife is probably feeling similar, only she spent even longer being a baby maker and started earlier, poor girl. No wonder she is looking back in regret and wants fun now. Especially if OP was a *** to her.
> 
> I say my husband trapped me because I am trapped now. I'm stuck here and he knows it. He knows, and he knew then, that I married him to get away from home. He was the only escape I had. But now that I want more from life, he is being incredibly stubborn. So if wants to play that card, he gets what's coming to him.


You're seriously misinformed if you think the norm is (or was) to spend your teens and 20's ****ing everything that moves. The overwhelming majority were governed by their morals and integrity. There are some not so flattering adjectives to describe those who checked their morals at the door.


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## Thatredhead (9 mo ago)

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> Part two is you aren't committed to getting out and getting what you're espousing because you aren't taking any action towards those goals.
> 
> It just seems you want to make H miserable but still live off him. Sorry for the seemingly harsh brief summary but either act or don't.


I will make H miserable until he gives in. Then everything will be roses. I have no choice but to live off him currently, although we both own the business and I do work at it. The business is in my name as well as his, he just does most of the work. So that's another reason we don't divorce. The businesses and tax schemes he has set up are extremely complicated. The way he funnels money around, he needs me as much as I need him. It would take a forensic accountant to untangle the warren of accounts and schemes he has. 

When I say I'm trapped, I mean it quite literally. There is no way out of this mess.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Thatredhead said:


> I'm 41. Well past the expiration date in the field I'm interested and experienced in, where government funding for new hires ends at 30.
> I have a sporadic work record due to being a SAHM for so many years. I'm not interested in working a minimum wage grunt job that doesn't pay enough to bother getting out of bed for. I'm in school now, hopefully I can eventually get a job in the mining field when I'm done, but again I'm probably too old.


There is a shortage of truck drivers and there are grants in many states to get your schooling for it.

There are also a lot of high paying computer jobs that only require a certification and neither field I just mentioned care about your age and both are paying prime wages right now.


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## DudeInProgress (Jun 10, 2019)

Thatredhead said:


> I'm 41. Well past the expiration date in the field I'm interested and experienced in, where government funding for new hires ends at 30.
> I have a sporadic work record due to being a SAHM for so many years. I'm not interested in working a minimum wage grunt job that doesn't pay enough to bother getting out of bed for. I'm in school now, hopefully I can eventually get a job in the mining field when I'm done, but again I'm probably too old.


Yes, you’re quite the victim. So oppressed by your husband, the institution of marriage, the job market, the government and the enslaving patriarchy.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

Thatredhead said:


> I will make H miserable until he gives in. Then everything will be roses. I have no choice but to live off him currently, although we both own the business and I do work at it. The business is in my name as well as his, he just does most of the work. So that's another reason we don't divorce. The businesses and tax schemes he has set up are extremely complicated. The way he funnels money around, he needs me as much as I need him. It would take a forensic accountant to untangle the warren of accounts and schemes he has.
> 
> When I say I'm trapped, I mean it quite literally. There is no way out of this mess.


Ahh, but there is. You just don't want to take that journey. 
You want him to do the work to split or him be responsible as the one that gave in.


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## Thatredhead (9 mo ago)

Numb26 said:


> View attachment 87575


Way to tell on yourself for having no idea how female anatomy works. Par for the course around here.


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## DudeInProgress (Jun 10, 2019)

ConanHub said:


> There is a shortage of truck drivers and there are grants in many states to get your schooling for it.
> 
> There are also a lot of high paying computer jobs that only require a certification and neither field I just mentioned care about your age and both are paying prime wages right now.


You know perfectly well she’s not interested in any of that.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

Thatredhead said:


> I will make H miserable until he gives in. Then everything will be roses. I have no choice but to live off him currently, although we both own the business and I do work at it. The business is in my name as well as his, he just does most of the work. So that's another reason we don't divorce. The businesses and tax schemes he has set up are extremely complicated. The way he funnels money around, he needs me as much as I need him. It would take a forensic accountant to untangle the warren of accounts and schemes he has.
> 
> When I say I'm trapped, I mean it quite literally. There is no way out of this mess.


You are probably a nice, decent person, capable of great love and fidelity and hardworking. *But that sure as heck isn't how you are presenting yourself through your posts. *

Incidentally there IS a forensic business and tax accountant with experience dealing with cheating wives/husbands, who is a member of TAM. Perhaps your husband should reach out to him?


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## DudeInProgress (Jun 10, 2019)

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> Ahh, but there is. You just don't want to take that journey.
> You want him to do the work to split or him be responsible as the one that gave in.


Um, that was pretty clear from about her first post.


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## Rob_1 (Sep 8, 2017)

Thatredhead said:


> I will make H miserable until he gives in.


I don't know if your husband knows of your desires, but in the eventuality that he knows, then it seems that you know that you have a weak, pathetic, beta dude as a husband. A man that has no self respect to be able to accept your demands. I as a man that has self respect and dignity, the moment you come to me with that crap that would be the last moment you would talk to me as as a wife/partner. I would immediately kick you out of my life, so that you can go get gang banged if that's what you desire, but not as my woman. Probably in the environment where you are there are too many beta dudes that give you the idea that you just can do that with a man. I tell you as a matter of fact not as condoning it, but in a lot parts of the world your demand would be met with violence towards you.


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## Thatredhead (9 mo ago)

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> Ahh, but there is. You just don't want to take that journey.
> You want him to do the work to split or him be responsible as the one that gave in.


I don't want him to split. I want him to come to his senses and realize this is going to happen, one way or another. I'm tired of living my life according to his need for fidelity. When is it his turn to make sacrifices?

I started an account on AM and am actively looking for a hookup. I have some acquaintances in mind that I think would be amenable to my suggestion of becoming a side piece. I don't like this route, and initially wanted something much more open and above board, with H involved and consenting. He's chosen to not be involved. He will have to give in. There's no two ways about it.


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## Rus47 (Apr 1, 2021)

TexasMom1216 said:


> All I heard was "I don't want to work."


Heck she could get a job as waitress at topless bar, make plenty in tips and have all the c*cktails she can handle besides. Only thing she would need to work is "it". If she attracts attention, she might even get to strut her stuff on the stage, or in the backroom. Make plenty of money and maybe even meet a sugar daddy like Anna Nicole did.

Seriously, this isn't @Thatredhead's thread, so my apologies. The thread OP was about what to do about his wife who is of the same mind as @Thatredhead, just maybe not so far down the road. In both cases, their husbands have disappointed them greatly, they no longer respect or even like them, but don't believe they can divorce for financial reasons.

I think the OP should do all possible to split the debt/assets/custody. Contact local bar association and find out what discounted/assisted services are available to dissolve the marriage ASAP. If nothing else fill out the paperwork and file himself at the courthouse. He will be happier and his wife will be happier in the long run. There isn't anything to save. The wife has transferred her affection to another ( an internet denizen).


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## Thatredhead (9 mo ago)

MattMatt said:


> You are probably a nice, decent person, capable of great love and fidelity and hardworking. *But that sure as heck isn't how you are presenting yourself through your posts. *
> 
> Incidentally there IS a forensic business and tax accountant with experience dealing with cheating wives/husbands, who is a member of TAM. Perhaps your husband should reach out to him?


I'm being purposely blunt and harsh here, perhaps overplaying it a bit. But I know I'm going to get dog piled for wanting what I want, so I am trying to be articulate and very detailed. I'm not trying to spare any feelings.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

Rus47 said:


> Seriously, this isn't @Thatredhead's thread, so my apologies. The thread OP was about what to do about his wife who is of the same mind as @Thatredhead, just maybe not so far down the road. In both cases, their husbands have disappointed them greatly, they no longer respect or even like them, but don't believe they can divorce for financial reasons.


You're correct, anything to her is a threadjack and I apologize for my participation in that. I honestly think it's unfair to say the OP's wife is as bad as @Thatredhead. The OP's wife sounds selfish, immature and dissatisfied in her marriage, and honestly a little dumb because she's falling for this online guy. She has had marriage trouble that the OP himself has taken responsibility for, he's aware he hasn't been a good husband. She doesn't sound like a selfish person who wants her H to support her while she sleeps around.


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## DudeInProgress (Jun 10, 2019)

Thatredhead said:


> I don't want him to split. I want him to come to his senses and realize this is going to happen, one way or another. I'm tired of living my life according to his need for fidelity. When is it his turn to make sacrifices?
> 
> I started an account on AM and am actively looking for a hookup. I have some acquaintances in mind that I think would be amenable to my suggestion of becoming a side piece. I don't like this route, and initially wanted something much more open and above board, with H involved and consenting. He's chosen to not be involved. He will have to give in. There's no two ways about it.


Have you told him this, or are you choosing to be a filthy liar? 
Tell him what you’re doing. Show him your posts here. Or are you too weak/cowardly for that?


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## Rus47 (Apr 1, 2021)

TexasMom1216 said:


> You're correct, anything to her is a threadjack and I apologize for my participation in that. I honestly think it's unfair to say the OP's wife is as bad as @Thatredhead. The OP's wife sounds selfish, immature and dissatisfied in her marriage, and honestly a little dumb because she's falling for this online guy. She has had marriage trouble that the OP himself has taken responsibility for, he's aware he hasn't been a good husband. She doesn't sound like a selfish person who wants her H to support her while she sleeps around.


It is a progression. If OP resists what his wife has in mind, she could eventually arrive at the same spot as you-know-who. The thing is, OP has to realize that since his wife is crying over him telling her to stop contacting the internet guy who she thinks she loves, there is no longer any hope of rebuilding the marriage. It has been gone for awhile.

The three kids haven't been mentioned yet AFAIK. Guessing they would be 6-11, so at a tough time for them. Hopefully their grandparents can bridge the gap for awhile, maybe give OP and his kids a place to live for awhile. Their mom evidently has no interest and if she is banging every guy who shows an interest, she wont have any time to care about them anyway. Maybe after spending a month or two on her back with a different dud every nite she will come to her senses. Yes, I meant dud lol


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## Thatredhead (9 mo ago)

Rob_1 said:


> I don't know if your husband knows of your desires, but in the eventuality that he knows, then it seems that you know that you have a weak, pathetic, beta dude as a husband. A man that has no self respect to be able to accept your demands. I as a man that has self respect and dignity, the moment you come to me with that crap that would be the last moment you would talk to me as as a wife/partner. I would immediately kick you out of my life, so that you can go get gang banged if that's what you desire, but not as my woman. Probably in the environment where you are there are too many beta dudes that give you the idea that you just can do that with a man. I tell you as a matter of fact not as condoning it, but in a lot parts of the world your demand would be met with violence towards you.


Thats why women aren't into alpha guys lol. You're all an insecure bunch with easy triggers. Too easy. Watch some tiktoks aboit how women really feel about 'alpha' men. Youll be enlightened. Your type is what women warn each other against. 
You feel physically violent towards a woman who wants more than one man? Lol....that's pathetic. You've been raised to think that you're THE man, the leader, the one in control. The woman needs to bow to your authority and submit to YOUR desires, all while losing all shreds of herself in you.

You sound like a nightmare for any woman.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

Thatredhead said:


> Thats why women aren't into alpha guys lol. You're all an insecure bunch with easy triggers. Too easy. Watch some tiktoks aboit how women really feel about 'alpha' men. Youll be enlightened. Your type is what women warn each other against.
> You feel physically violent towards a woman who wants more than one man? Lol....that's pathetic. You've been raised to think that you're THE man, the leader, the one in control. The woman needs to bow to your authority and submit to YOUR desires, all while losing all shreds of herself in you.
> 
> You sound like a nightmare for any woman.


You don't know what an "alpha" man is any more than most of the men on this board.


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## Thatredhead (9 mo ago)

DudeInProgress said:


> Have you told him this, or are you choosing to be a filthy liar?
> Tell him what you’re doing. Show him your posts here. Or are you too weak/cowardly for that?


I've told him everything I've said here, just nicer. I don't try to hurt him. I'm much gentler with him than I am here. He knows our marriage is a mistake, that I view him as the source of all our problems, and that if he'd just get his head on straight this would all be fixed. He knows I intend to have my way, and that I'm just waiting for him to get on board. He also knows I'm damned tired of waiting.


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## Rus47 (Apr 1, 2021)

@rodrigoramirez1209, you last posted 9 pages ago. What if anything have you taken from the posts since then? Have you investigated credit advisory services or discounted legal services. I know it is tough when you are working long hours to deal with other crap. How are your kids being cared for by their mom? And do you have close relatives like grandparents who can help the two of you through these tough times? Have you told your wife that she needs to get a job to help with finances and make divorce feasible? Jobs are plentiful these days, all businesses are crying for help. She should be able to get one before the week is out.

A benefit for her is with a job, she could get her own place soon and live the single life she seeks and you wont have to be involved with it at all.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

Thatredhead said:


> I've told him everything I've said here, just nicer. I don't try to hurt him. I'm much gentler with him than I am here. He knows our marriage is a mistake, that I view him as the source of all our problems, and that if he'd just get his head on straight this would all be fixed. He knows I intend to have my way, and that I'm just waiting for him to get on board. He also knows I'm damned tired of waiting.


Start your own thread. You're distracting from the OP's issues with yours. It's called a threadjack.


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## DudeInProgress (Jun 10, 2019)

Thatredhead said:


> Thats why women aren't into alpha guys lol. You're all an insecure bunch with easy triggers. Too easy. Watch some tiktoks aboit how women really feel about 'alpha' men. Youll be enlightened. Your type is what women warn each other against.
> You feel physically violent towards a woman who wants more than one man? Lol....that's pathetic. You've been raised to think that you're THE man, the leader, the one in control. The woman needs to bow to your authority and submit to YOUR desires, all while losing all shreds of herself in you.
> 
> You sound like a nightmare for any woman.


I’m starting to wonder if perhaps there may be some MGTOW black-pill type false-flagging us, straw-manning his vision of those evil women to convince everyone how pointless relationships are and how bad women are…


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

DudeInProgress said:


> I’m starting to wonder if perhaps there may be some MGTOW black-pill type false-flagging us, straw-manning his vision of those evil women to convince everyone how pointless relationships are and how bad women are…


I'm thinking you called it correctly.


----------



## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

Thatredhead said:


> Thats why women aren't into alpha guys lol. You're all an insecure bunch with easy triggers. Too easy. Watch some tiktoks aboit how women really feel about 'alpha' men. Youll be enlightened. Your type is what women warn each other against.
> You feel physically violent towards a woman who wants more than one man? Lol....that's pathetic. You've been raised to think that you're THE man, the leader, the one in control. The woman needs to bow to your authority and submit to YOUR desires, all while losing all shreds of herself in you.
> 
> You sound like a nightmare for any woman.


Yep. You caught us all. Booby prize is yours.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

DudeInProgress said:


> I’m starting to wonder if perhaps there may be some MGTOW black-pill type false-flagging us, straw-manning his vision of those evil women to convince everyone how pointless relationships are and how bad women are…


Hardly seems necessary with the huge MGTOW, NNMNG, incel, Proverbs wife presence on here. But it would be better to think a woman that heartless, selfish and immoral doesn't exist.


----------



## rodrigoramirez1209 (7 mo ago)

Rus47 said:


> @rodrigoramirez1209, you last posted 9 pages ago. What if anything have you taken from the posts since then? Have you investigated credit advisory services or discounted legal services. I know it is tough when you are working long hours to deal with other crap. How are your kids being cared for by their mom? And do you have close relatives like grandparents who can help the two of you through these tough times? Have you told your wife that she needs to get a job to help with finances and make divorce feasible? Jobs are plentiful these days, all businesses are crying for help. She should be able to get one before the week is out.
> 
> A benefit for her is with a job, she could get her own place soon and live the single life she seeks and you wont have to be involved with it at all.


She has a job 2 of them, she is a hairstyles so she works at a Salon and just started a new job as administrator for her bosses school of Cosmetology so she will pretty soon start making good money. She takes care of the kids while I'm at work and Vice versa. We don't have any family that can take care of them


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## Numb26 (Sep 11, 2019)

TexasMom1216 said:


> Hardly seems necessary with the huge MGTOW, NNMNG, incel, Proverbs wife presence on here. But it would be better to think a woman that heartless, selfish and immoral doesn't exist.


Apparently you have never met my XW


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## Rob_1 (Sep 8, 2017)

Thatredhead said:


> You sound like a nightmare for any woman.


yes, for a woman like you. By the way. Happily married to my then virgin wife for almost 30 years. Still she has only eyes for me, and I for her. You, in the other hand once that you get passed around by a bunch of dudes. will be nothing to talk about.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

Numb26 said:


> Apparently you have never met my XW


She is awful. Just awful. Maybe she knows these two women, perhaps they run in packs. Like hyena.


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## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

DudeInProgress said:


> I’m starting to wonder if perhaps there may be some MGTOW black-pill type false-flagging us, straw-manning his vision of those evil women to convince everyone how pointless relationships are and how bad women are…


OH!!!! What a very clever point!!! Do you think that's what is being posted...?? I never thought of that!!


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## DudeInProgress (Jun 10, 2019)

TexasMom1216 said:


> Hardly seems necessary with the huge MGTOW, NNMNG, incel, Proverbs wife presence on here. But it would be better to think a woman that heartless, selfish and immoral doesn't exist.


Oh, we were so close… but now we have to diverge again. 
If you’re seeing a huge MGTOW, incel presence here on TAM, you’re seriously not seeing reality.
Oh well, I liked being on the same team for 5 minutes anyway.


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## Rus47 (Apr 1, 2021)

rodrigoramirez1209 said:


> She has a job 2 of them, she is a hairstyles so she works at a Salon and just started a new job as administrator for her bosses school of Cosmetology so she will pretty soon start making good money. She takes care of the kids while I'm at work and Vice versa. We don't have any family that can take care of them


Ok that is great! The more money she brings in the better for both of you. Dont use the increase to go into debt further! Get some help and focus on paying down debt. Cut up the credit cards!

Make a budget, find out where the money is going. Credit cards are enormously expensive if you carry a balance. They will eat you alive. Stop using them, go cash only. IMO and begin separating your finances, you will need to do that eventually anyway.

I realize this doesnt directly address your issue, but lack of money is limiting both of your options.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

*MODERATOR NOTICE *

Please stop responding to @Thatredhead in this thread. She has been asked to stop threadjacking here and to start her own thread.


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## jonty30 (Oct 23, 2021)

DudeInProgress said:


> Oh, we were so close… but now we have to diverge again.
> If you’re seeing a huge MGTOW, incel presence here on TAM, you’re seriously not seeing reality.
> Oh well, I liked being on the same team for 5 minutes anyway.


As near as I can figure out, unless you're running the gamut from base to the top of Mount Everest, praising women, you're an incel, MGTOW according to @TexasMom1216 
You can't be critical, or else.


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## Rus47 (Apr 1, 2021)

@rodrigoramirez1209 where you are now the only direction is up.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

jonty30 said:


> As near as I can figure out, unless you're running the gamut from base to the top of Mount Everest, praising women, you're an incel, MGTOW according to @TexasMom1216
> You can't be critical, or else.


Yes, clearly I'm praising the OP's wife to the mountaintops. 🙄


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## DudeInProgress (Jun 10, 2019)

rodrigoramirez1209 said:


> She has a job 2 of them, she is a hairstyles so she works at a Salon and just started a new job as administrator for her bosses school of Cosmetology so she will pretty soon start making good money. She takes care of the kids while I'm at work and Vice versa. We don't have any family that can take care of them


Wait, so with all the posts and all the questions and all the guidance over the last 10 pages, this is what you respond to?
Are you even serious about taking control of your situation and DOING something to improve your bad situation?


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## BigDaddyNY (May 19, 2021)

edit: Sorry, no more post to you know who


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

Lots of bitterness and aggression in this thread. Not helpful.


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## ABHale (Jan 3, 2016)

TexasMom1216 said:


> Well and based on these replies I feel like I should also point out that a woman not remaining a virgin until she marries ALSO does not mean she is a "ho." Women are not livestock and we as a society don't believe that women must remain "unsullied" while men can sleep around at will. If a woman doesn't marry until she is in her mid-twenties chances are she will have a few serious boyfriends. There is a HUGE difference between dating and having sex with men with whom one is in an exclusive relationship and "staying pure" to keep her "value" on the marriage market. Sadly there are clearly men on here who believe that women must be "untouched" and do not hold the same standards for themselves. 🙄 That's ridiculous and I'm certainly not saying that. (I'm not saying you're saying it either, but there are a few that predictably are saying that.
> 
> Honestly, the OP treated his wife like garbage, and while there are OF COURSE men on here who believe that is ALL HER FAULT because she didn't stay the same weight as when she was 17 after three children because ALL marriage problems are of course ALWAYS all the woman's fault 🙄🙄, there's no excuse for what she's doing now. But I do think the marriage problems are because of both of them. They both sound like they're selfish and immature. Hers may come from resentment and hurt, and his from his unfailing arrogance and selfishness, but neither are behaving well. The whole thing is a trainwreck.


My wife is the one that said she was waiting until her wedding night when we first started dating. I respected her wish and waited with her. My wife is her own person and a grown woman. She can do whatever she wants. I don’t own her and I am not her father. It is my choice to leave if any of her choices are a deal breaker for me. If not, we work through it. We are getting better at that.


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## ABHale (Jan 3, 2016)

Thatredhead said:


> Thats why women aren't into alpha guys lol. You're all an insecure bunch with easy triggers. Too easy. Watch some tiktoks aboit how women really feel about 'alpha' men. Youll be enlightened. Your type is what women warn each other against.
> You feel physically violent towards a woman who wants more than one man? Lol....that's pathetic. You've been raised to think that you're THE man, the leader, the one in control. The woman needs to bow to your authority and submit to YOUR desires, all while losing all shreds of herself in you.
> 
> You sound like a nightmare for any woman.


Are you serious?????

TikTok for life lessons. I understand you completely now. 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

ABHale said:


> My wife is the one that said she was waiting until her wedding night when we first started dating. I respected her wish and waited with her. My wife is her own person and a grown woman. She can do whatever she wants. I don’t own her and I am not her father. It is my choice to leave if any of her choices are a deal breaker for me. If not, we work through it. We are getting better at that.


We all make our choices. Some are clearly empirically better than others. Mostly we do what we think is best.


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## ABHale (Jan 3, 2016)

Op basically drove a dagger in his marriage, then pounded it in making sure it was dead. He treat her like **** after she gave birth to their kids. He did this for years. I’m just surprised she stayed being treated like that.

He then says no to an open marriage because HE can’t get any dates. He tried and failed while his wife, who he didn’t want, is being asked out left and right.

OP is being a hypocrite.


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## David60525 (Oct 5, 2021)

rodrigoramirez1209 said:


> So i got off work at 2am caught my wife texting a guy on Instagram they were both saying"I love you" and "baby" "babe" stuff like that and And so I broke down and I left and stayed in a hotel. She later found me where I was staying after attempting to call me multiple times and we talked about it while at the hotel. She Confessed to me that she loves me and wants to stay with me but she wants to date and sleep around with other people and for me to do the same pretty much having an open relationship. The reason for this is because we were together since she was 15 years old We are 29 now. we got pregnant so we got married at 18. She confessed to me that she didn't get to date other people or sleep with other people and she Wants to know how it feels like to date someone else and to sleep with someone else sense I'm the only person she's been with Physically and she's the only person I've ever been with too. After talking about it I told her if she wants to sleep Around with other people then we can't be together but if you want to try and save our marriage you have to delete your Instagram, She broke down of course because she loves the guy she was talking with on Instagram, So I decided that she can continue to have that long distance relationship on Instagram. If she promised me not to date or have sex with anyone else, I figured a long distance relationship is better than having her date other guys because I know she's going to get emotionally attached to that person and continue to have sex with them behind my back. I know anyone else would have left divorced but I love my wife, We've been together since 15 years old and I want to continue to be with my wife so I want to fight for our marriage. So my question to you guys is my wife continues to have the urges to date And sleep around with other guys, And it makes me sad that she feels this way and it's hurting our relationship. Any advice would be helpful.


Divorce her chump


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

rodrigoramirez1209 said:


> Yea that's what I'm afraid of. I've been looking and trying to talk with other women but it's not going so well, I've had girls tell me and my friends tell me that im not ugly that I won't have any problems finding someone but I'm trying and no girl seems to be interested in me, mean while my wife tells me that she has been getting asked out left and right but she has been telling them no that shes married out of respect for me but the temptation of guys Constantly asking her out is getting to her, which is why she wants permission to date them. I already told her NO to fight the temptations and to be strong so as far as I know she hasn't done anything yet other than flirt with that guy on Instagram


Ok, let me get this straight. Are you actually trying to date other women?


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## Annonymous Joe (9 mo ago)

Longtime Hubby said:


> Find the prettiest woman you can and pound her at home when your wife is there.


I see what you did there. I'll allow it.


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## Rob_1 (Sep 8, 2017)

ConanHub said:


> Ok, let me get this straight. Are you actually trying to date other women?


Actually, he tried, and failed miserably, cause he didn't get any takers.


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## Rus47 (Apr 1, 2021)

ConanHub said:


> Ok, let me get this straight. Are you actually trying to date other women?


I understood if he thought he could get action from other women he would be fine with fully open “marriage”. Since the women he approached wouldn’t bite, he realized he would be home watching the kids while his “wife” gets railed by a parade of other men.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Rus47 said:


> I understood if he thought he could get action from other women he would be fine with fully open “marriage”. Since the women he approached wouldn’t bite, he realized he would be home watching the kids while his “wife” gets railed by a parade of other men.


I'm definitely wanting him to clarify his position.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

@rodrigoramirez1209 , did you actually try and date during the open marriage discussion?


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

rodrigoramirez1209 said:


> Yea that's what I'm afraid of. *I've been looking and trying to talk with other women but it's not going so well, *I've had girls tell me and my friends tell me that im not ugly that I won't have any problems finding someone but *I'm trying and no girl seems to be interested in me, *mean while my wife tells me that she has been getting asked out left and right but she has been telling them no that shes married out of respect for me but the temptation of guys Constantly asking her out is getting to her, which is why she wants permission to date them. I already told her NO to fight the temptations and to be strong so as far as I know she hasn't done anything yet other than flirt with that guy on Instagram


Here’s where he said he was trying to date and it wasn’t going well.


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## jonty30 (Oct 23, 2021)

TexasMom1216 said:


> Here’s where he said he was trying to date and it wasn’t going well.


The fact that she's flirting means that she is slowly giving way to her temptations. 
It's going to happen, if it hasn't happened already.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

TexasMom1216 said:


> Here’s where he said he was trying to date and it wasn’t going well.


Yeah. I want him to come straight out and clarify his position.

He has hardly posted or responded and it definitely changes my take on his situation.

I still think her idea is a lunatic stunt but I understand where she is coming from.

OP might have a hell of a lot more work to do.

He's not looking to good right now.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

jonty30 said:


> The fact that she's flirting means that she is slowly giving way to her temptations.
> It's going to happen, if it hasn't happened already.


He’s doing the same thing. He’s only upset because she’s having more luck than him.


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## Married but Happy (Aug 13, 2013)

Women who are at least moderately attractive will always find someone who wants them. Men have to be exceptional to find women who want them, and the supply of willing men is almost infinite! Men are commodities and easy to to obtain, whereas women can be choosy. OP has few options unless he is exceptional, and he may only become attractive to someone if he is single (i.e., divorced).


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## jonty30 (Oct 23, 2021)

TexasMom1216 said:


> He’s doing the same thing. He’s only upset because she’s having more luck than him.


I agree with you that's the real bone of contention here.


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## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

ConanHub said:


> Ok, let me get this straight. Are you actually trying to date other women?


yes, he is, so he has lost all moral high ground so he and his wife are of the same mettle. Sounds like he is annoyed cause his wife is more successful than he is. Appears to me that he is more concerned with his ego that saving his relationship with his wife. Go figure.


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## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

ConanHub said:


> Falling out of the feeling of love is one thing, wanting penis on the side and being able to keep a husband is quite another.
> 
> You are equating far different things.
> 
> ...


Cheating is unacceptable on any level, agreed. However, I note that many of the men on here minimize emotional abuse. Treating a spouse badly, emotionally withdrawing, etc. may have no physical signs but it is as soul destroying as cheating. Emotional abuse and abandonment doesn't get the same condemnation on this site at all and that needs to change. Women are more emotional creatures than men. To withhold sex is a big big issue on here in the forums yet withholding emotional affection, support etc. is not. Seems to me like major double standards.


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## jlg07 (Feb 24, 2017)

Removed -- threadjack. Sorry -- just got caught up...


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

aine said:


> yes, he is, so he has lost all moral high ground so he and his wife are of the same mettle. Sounds like he is annoyed cause his wife is more successful than he is. Appears to me that he is more concerned with his ego that saving his relationship with his wife. Go figure.


Yeah. The situation is still in the category of lunatic corner but he just got right in there with his wife.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

aine said:


> Cheating is unacceptable on any level, agreed. However, I note that many of the men on here minimize emotional abuse. Treating a spouse badly, emotionally withdrawing, etc. may have no physical signs but it is as soul destroying as cheating. Emotional abuse and abandonment doesn't get the same condemnation on this site at all and that needs to change. Women are more emotional creatures than men. To withhold sex is a big big issue on here in the forums yet withholding emotional affection, support etc. is not. Seems to me like major double standards.


You could hear it in the self-congratulatory way the OP bragged about not cheating on her while he was “out of love” with her. Like she deserved to be cheated on but he was such a stand up guy that even though he told her she was ugly and he didn’t love her and was, in his own words, an “asshole” to her, he didn’t cheat on her. She’s so desperate for love and attention, and so resentful and closed off from him, that she fell for some grifter on social media, and he was fine with an open marriage until he figured out he wasn’t as desirable as he thought. The wife should have left the day he said he didn’t love her instead of sticking around for years of abuse, and clearly she is monkey branching with this other man. The husband is ok with an open marriage as long as he gets laid more than she does. Neither of them love or care about each other any more at all. The real victims here are the children, who are trapped between two miserable, angry, resentful people. They need to divorce for the sake of the children, they clearly never should have married at all. In this case it truly has nothing to do with age, he’d make a lousy husband at any age unless he somehow completely changed his ways. 

I suspect the reason the OP has disappeared is he doesn’t like the mirror that’s been held up here.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

jlg07 said:


> Why in God's name do you want to be married then? Divorce your poor H and go do what you want when you want it?
> You've yet to defend why you have to stay married and still go out and have sex with other men.


She doesn’t want to have to get a job.


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## Rob_1 (Sep 8, 2017)

ConanHub said:


> Yeah. The situation is still in the category of lunatic corner but he just got right in there with his wife.


The way I see it OP weakly and pathetically half heartily tried to oppose the wife's requests, and being such a wuss, reluctantly sort of agreed to her online lover. Then he pathetically tried to get someone, to his abysmal dismay upon the realization that he wasn't getting any fish to hook.


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

Na


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

Na


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

aine said:


> Cheating is unacceptable on any level, agreed. However, I note that many of the men on here minimize emotional abuse. Treating a spouse badly, emotionally withdrawing, etc. may have no physical signs but it is as soul destroying as cheating. Emotional abuse and abandonment doesn't get the same condemnation on this site at all and that needs to change. Women are more emotional creatures than men. To withhold sex is a big big issue on here in the forums yet withholding emotional affection, support etc. is not. Seems to me like major double standards.


I agree about emotional neglect being very destructive but I thought that was the extent of his failure. Looks like he can add belligerent lunacy as well.


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## No Longer Lonely Husband (Nov 3, 2015)

ConanHub said:


> Yeah. The situation is still in the category of lunatic corner but he just got right in there with his wife.


I find myself reciting the lyrics from one of my favorite songs “God is great, beer is good, and people are crazy 😜


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## karmagoround (Aug 27, 2021)

MattMatt said:


> You are probably a nice, decent person, capable of great love and fidelity and hardworking. *But that sure as heck isn't how you are presenting yourself through your posts. *
> 
> Incidentally there IS a forensic business and tax accountant with experience dealing with cheating wives/husbands, who is a member of TAM. Perhaps your husband should reach out to him?


Censorship through bullying? Too bad.


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

deleted


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## karmagoround (Aug 27, 2021)

Thatredhead said:


> Thats why women aren't into alpha guys lol. You're all an insecure bunch with easy triggers. Too easy. Watch some tiktoks aboit how women really feel about 'alpha' men. Youll be enlightened. Your type is what women warn each other against.
> You feel physically violent towards a woman who wants more than one man? Lol....that's pathetic. You've been raised to think that you're THE man, the leader, the one in control. The woman needs to bow to your authority and submit to YOUR desires, all while losing all shreds of herself in you.
> 
> You sound like a nightmare for any woman.


For years I paid my ex hundreds of dollars a month to go live with other men. At first it bothered me, but later I came to realize it was worth every nickel.


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## Rus47 (Apr 1, 2021)

TexasMom1216 said:


> *She’s so desperate for love and attention,* and so resentful and closed off from him, that she fell for some grifter on social media, and he was fine with an open marriage until he figured out he wasn’t as desirable as he thought. *The wife should have left the day he said he didn’t love her instead of sticking around for years of abuse*, and clearly she is monkey branching with this other man.


My wife was VERY emotionally vulnerable during every one of her pregnancies and while lactating. Hormones all over the map is probably the root cause, but the excessive concern about how they think their body looks is also a factor. A man must express his love and assure her at every moment he is attracted to her, bonded to her through those times, comfort her, cherish her. She is the one going through a lot of stuff to provide progeny. To do what OP did to his wife was devastating to her, and I believe at that time she unbonded from him. How could she leave at that moment? She had two children at that point and no money because her man isn't managing the family's finances. Her second child is just a baby. And she has become convinced that she is ugly and unlovable. 

IMO they aren't bonded to a couple and both should work toward independence financially so they can separate and live their own lives. Cheating isn't the way, but people often make matters worse in responding to problems.

What is sad to me is precious little mention of three young children. Both parents evidently more concerned about themselves.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

ABHale said:


> Op basically drove a dagger in his marriage, then pounded it in making sure it was dead. He treat her like **** after she gave birth to their kids. He did this for years. I’m just surprised she stayed being treated like that.
> 
> He then says no to an open marriage because HE can’t get any dates. He tried and failed while his wife, who he didn’t want, is being asked out left and right.
> 
> OP is being a hypocrite.


If she hadn't stayed there wouldn't be this problem now. Just trying a different perspective.


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

aine said:


> Cheating is unacceptable on any level, agreed. However, I note that many of the men on here minimize emotional abuse. Treating a spouse badly, emotionally withdrawing, etc. may have no physical signs but it is as soul destroying as cheating. Emotional abuse and abandonment doesn't get the same condemnation on this site at all and that needs to change. Women are more emotional creatures than men. To withhold sex is a big big issue on here in the forums yet withholding emotional affection, support etc. is not. Seems to me like major double standards.


The double standard is apparent from the other direction also. To many guys you can replace what you said above with sexually withdrawing. It is the same effect. It feels like emotional abuse and withdrawing. But most women are fine with that if they "don't feel like it". But it is no different. 

Alot of times the men react to the sexual abandonment by withdrawing emotionally to protect their own emotions. The women don't believe they are withdrawing because they are allowing sex when they are in the mood, but hubby feels abandoned. Some women do not keep track of when last time is, because it is not important to them and do not realize the hubby feels neglected, abandoned and unloved.


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## bricks (Aug 14, 2017)

Thatredhead said:


> I don't have any advice really, just that I'm the wife in your scenario in my marriage and I want an open marriage for the exact same reasons as your wife. Married too young, only been with one man, want to explore and find out what I've missed out on by being married all these years. But my husband won't agree and I can't leave the marriage for the same reasons you can't. I will never forgive him.for trapping me like this and I will resent him forever. All these guys in here talking about respect. They have no idea. I could respect my husband if he could put his foolish pride and ego aside and understand where I am coming from and be willing to see me have my needs met, but he is only focused and concerned about his own feelings of inadequacy and male ego. It's disappointing and disgusting and I lost all respect for him.
> 
> Your wife's online lover will help scratch the itch but she won't stop wanting to know what she missed out in by getting with you so young. And she is perfectly right in wondering. 15 is far too young to start a lifelong relationship. She HAS missed out on a lot, so have you.


I've felt the way you feel, but I have a wake up call for you. You are not missing anything. The only thing waiting for you is men who will deceive you and probably their pissed off wives or men with so many hang up, problems, and unresolved issues they will make your head spin. Yeah, it will be exciting at first, but then you will look back at the mess of a life you created and realize you were a brat. By then, your husband will have found peace and won't want you back. 

Your husband did not trap you. You married each other. Do yourself, him, your families a favor and find a way to leave. Eventually, your husband will anyway when he realizes what a fright you have become. Your attitude is ridiculous. Imagine if he said he would respect you if you let him sleep around and that the only reason you wont is that you are selfish and full of ego. I have news for you: keep it up and he will be looking around as well. What a mess.

I know plenty of people who married their childhood sweetheart and have been married over 30 years. The key to it all is they allowed the other to grow, they talked about it, they grew with the other sexually and emotionally. Also know plenty that went your (and OP) route.


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## Dictum Veritas (Oct 22, 2020)

bricks said:


> Also know plenty that went your (and OP) route.


How did that work out for them? I just can't see a stable family or even any form of real love between spouses in such a morally plastic mess.


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## Thatredhead (9 mo ago)

Dictum Veritas said:


> How did that work out for them? I just can't see a stable family or even any form of real love between spouses in such a morally plastic mess.


 Just because you can't imagine it doesn't mean it's not entirely doable. Not everyone is bound by the same moral code.


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## Rus47 (Apr 1, 2021)

Divinely Favored said:


> The double standard is apparent from the other direction also. To many guys you can replace what you said above with sexually withdrawing. It is the same effect. It feels like emotional abuse and withdrawing. But most women are fine with that if they "don't feel like it". But it is no different.


Neither gender has a monopoly on treating their spouse badly, they just do so in different ways. For either gender, the abused is very vulnerable to another paying them some attention and making them feel wanted and not rejected. Either gender emotionally abusing spouse is just inviting big problems down the road when someone else begins tending the garden.


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

Married but Happy said:


> Women who are at least moderately attractive *will always find someone who wants them*. Men have to be exceptional to find women who want them, and the supply of willing men is almost infinite! Men are commodities and easy to to obtain, *whereas women can be choosy. * OP has few options unless he is exceptional, and he may only become attractive to someone if he is single (i.e., divorced).


All true.

Yes, with that butt.
Her butt will win plenty of intimacy from men.

_But_, when it comes to marriage, that lifelong commitment from a man; ah, it must be a good man.
This is where she is in the same boat as any man seeking a mate.

Her butt will not necessarily win her a good man.

Rather, it will be her personality, those_ mutual compatibilities_, her general appearance and her loyalties, those will be the things sought by a man, long term.

I realize that you are talking about scoring with the opposite sex.
That behavior will get old, sooner or later.

Sex is fun, and is fungible, whereas, one's feelings cannot be carelessly tossed about, long term.
It takes a toll.

The exception might be with those sociopaths.


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## Dictum Veritas (Oct 22, 2020)

Thatredhead said:


> Just because you can't imagine it doesn't mean it's not entirely doable. Not everyone is bound by the same moral code.


Those would be the people I would not want to know and would avoid like the plague.


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

Bound by "A moral code" There fixed it for her.😁


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## GG1061 (Apr 20, 2021)

Thatredhead said:


> Perhaps you lack imagination as to how much better it could have been if you were single? Getting married at 18 is basically child marriage. What an awful thing to do yourself and your spouse. I saw it time and again in the cult I grew up in. Kids rushing to get married the minute they turned 18 so they could have sex, only to find out marriage is hard and sucks the joy out of life. So many of those marriages were disasters. I married at 21 and that was still far too young to know what I was doing.
> 
> In my case, I was caught between a hard place and a very hard rock. I either got married or faced shunning and eventually homelessness. So I stepped up and got married. So my 20s were f*&^ed up either way. Which is why my heart is so set on a do over now.
> 
> ...


Very well, then. Do what everyone here is telling you. Divorce him and screw as much as you want.


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## GG1061 (Apr 20, 2021)

Thatredhead said:


> I took the vows when I was TOO YOUNG and unworldly to know what I was doing. So yeah, I want more options now that I'm older and wiser. Not a big deal, same with OPs wife. The only problem is the husband getting in the way!


Why are you too cowardly to divorce your oppressive husband?


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## BrightWolf (7 mo ago)

rodrigoramirez1209 said:


> So i got off work at 2am caught my wife texting a guy on Instagram they were both saying"I love you" and "baby" "babe" stuff like that and And so I broke down and I left and stayed in a hotel. She later found me where I was staying after attempting to call me multiple times and we talked about it while at the hotel. She Confessed to me that she loves me and wants to stay with me but she wants to date and sleep around with other people and for me to do the same pretty much having an open relationship. The reason for this is because we were together since she was 15 years old We are 29 now. we got pregnant so we got married at 18. She confessed to me that she didn't get to date other people or sleep with other people and she Wants to know how it feels like to date someone else and to sleep with someone else sense I'm the only person she's been with Physically and she's the only person I've ever been with too. After talking about it I told her if she wants to sleep Around with other people then we can't be together but if you want to try and save our marriage you have to delete your Instagram, She broke down of course because she loves the guy she was talking with on Instagram, So I decided that she can continue to have that long distance relationship on Instagram. If she promised me not to date or have sex with anyone else, I figured a long distance relationship is better than having her date other guys because I know she's going to get emotionally attached to that person and continue to have sex with them behind my back. I know anyone else would have left divorced but I love my wife, We've been together since 15 years old and I want to continue to be with my wife so I want to fight for our marriage. So my question to you guys is my wife continues to have the urges to date And sleep around with other guys, And it makes me sad that she feels this way and it's hurting our relationship. Any advice would be helpful.


Hi,

I went through and am probably still going through similar things as you. My husband has never asked for an open relationship though. You should not stand for her doing those things. This is a form of cheating in my opinion. I kept making excuses saying oh it isnt physical and he deleted the apps but later on it is likely those same apps or similar ones will appear. She does not care about your feelings and is essentially getting everything she wants while disrespecting you. I would recommend maybe counseling and if she does not make changes then divorce. Think about your child. Is this the life you want your child to see and model their life after?


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## GG1061 (Apr 20, 2021)

Thatredhead said:


> Just because you can't imagine it doesn't mean it's not entirely doable. Not everyone is bound by the same moral code.


You stated you wanted freedom and independence but your dependent on your husband which is why you say you can't divorce. If you really want freedom get some big girl pants on and become financially independent then yo can divorce your husband. Until then you're just a whining @$$.


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

Are you Thatredhead’s husband?


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## GG1061 (Apr 20, 2021)

Evinrude58 said:


> Are you Thatredhead’s husband?


Sorry, mine wasn't a redhead!


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

DownByTheRiver said:


> The OP isn't.


No.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

ABHale said:


> I can’t see why age has anything to do with marriage.
> 
> My marriage is failing!!!
> 
> ...


I know people who are the opposite. They regret their sexual past.


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## manwithnoname (Feb 3, 2017)

Thatredhead said:


> Just because you can't imagine it doesn't mean it's not entirely doable. Not everyone is bound by the same moral code.


And some people have no morals.


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## bricks (Aug 14, 2017)

Dictum Veritas said:


> How did that work out for them? I just can't see a stable family or even any form of real love between spouses in such a morally plastic mess.


It didn't work out for them. That's my point. In all cases, everyone became miserable and made sad, desperate choices. Divorces were nasty, kids screwed up.


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## bricks (Aug 14, 2017)

Thatredhead said:


> Just because you can't imagine it doesn't mean it's not entirely doable. Not everyone is bound by the same moral code.


I made that comment in this context:

I know many couples who were childhood sweethearts who have been married happily for over 30 years. (one couple met in first grade and were inseparable since then, died after 62 years of marriage.)

I also know couples who married childhood sweethearts who came to resent their lack of "experiences. In some cases, it led to affairs, anger and divorce. In others, it led to an miserable home life and ultimately angry divorces. 

I do not know of any couples (and I have been married 35 years and have moved many times, so I've met a lot of people), who took your attitude and it worked out for them. They all became bitter and selfish and not reasonable. You are getting so much blowback on here because you fall into that description. Your husband did not do this to you. He is not keeping you. If you want out, there are ways. Separate and go live with family if all you want is out. You are on here talking like you expect your husband owes you a solution. Wake up. This is NOT something you two are going to agree on.

I knew a woman in a truly abusive (physically and emotionally) relationship. Husband controlled every penny. She had to produce receipts. She had NO money of her own, he would not let her work outside the home. Do you know what she did? She would go to the grocery store and buy a few more apples than she needed so apples would be on the receipt. Then she would go straight to customer service and return the extra apples. Husband would go through the receipt to see that she had everything she spent money on, but would not notice that she paid for 5 pounds of apples but only brought home 4. She would pocket the cash. She was LITERALLY saving a dollar or two a week so she could have a stash to escape. 

So NO, you are not stuck with your husband. You have a selfish and immature attitude that you need to change. Otherwise, the misery you think you feel now because the orgasms are not strong enough or long enough or even existent will be nothing in compared to dealing with a spouse who hates you. Not trying to be mean, just letting you know you are waaaaaayyyy out of line.


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## Enigma32 (Jul 6, 2020)

Dictum Veritas said:


> How did that work out for them? I just can't see a stable family or even any form of real love between spouses in such a morally plastic mess.


I know of a few of them. One couple was similar to OP, they had been together forever and inexperienced. They did swinging and partner swaps and everything else. One day the husband decided to leave his wife for one of the girls he slept with. He left, got stuck paying child support, and things didn't work out with the new girl. His ex wife is now remarried.

I know another married couple who were into 3somes and being swingers. They eventually moved some other girl into their house who tried her level best to destroy the marriage from the inside. The wife tried to off herself and was in the mental ward for a while. Somehow, they managed to work through it and kicked the other girl out of their life. It was a close thing though. They're still together. I knew the wife pretty well. I think she is a really nice girl who is just doing whatever her husband wants. She almost didn't survive it. Literally.

I know a stay at home husband married to a bread winner wife. He stays home with the kids while she's out banging other dudes when she has free time off work. He tries and fails to get the attention of other women but he's such a **** simp that none of them will touch him. This poor guy has no respect for himself anymore. His wife took it from him when she suggested the open marriage and stuck him at home alone.

I know another guy who pays the bills at home while his wife keeps a boyfriend on the side. They're open about it. Everyone who knows them knows that the wife and broke boyfriend only keep dude around for his wallet. She even posts on FB pics with her kid and the kid's "other dad."

Most of the ones I've seen crash and burn eventually. People just wanna be able to get permission to sleep around until they find a better deal, then they move on for real.


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## drencrom (Jul 1, 2021)

ConanHub said:


> Let's not go labeling women in a group with a few wild cards.
> 
> There are a couple of nuts but plenty of solid women are just as appalled by "this" behavior.😉


You are correct, and I get this. I will rephrase, "a few women here".


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## David60525 (Oct 5, 2021)

bricks said:


> I've felt the way you feel, but I have a wake up call for you. You are not missing anything. The only thing waiting for you is men who will deceive you and probably their pissed off wives or men with so many hang up, problems, and unresolved issues they will make your head spin. Yeah, it will be exciting at first, but then you will look back at the mess of a life you created and realize you were a brat. By then, your husband will have found peace and won't want you back.
> 
> Your husband did not trap you. You married each other. Do yourself, him, your families a favor and find a way to leave. Eventually, your husband will anyway when he realizes what a fright you have become. Your attitude is ridiculous. Imagine if he said he would respect you if you let him sleep around and that the only reason you wont is that you are selfish and full of ego. I have news for you: keep it up and he will be looking around as well. What a mess.
> 
> I know plenty of people who married their childhood sweetheart and have been married over 30 years. The key to it all is they allowed the other to grow, they talked about it, they grew with the other sexually and emotionally. Also know plenty that went your (and OP) route.


Noway let her choose monogamy, or the highway. She's monkey jumping preparing and getting your permission. Fix your Mariage, get interesting. And game your wife, give her a reason not to leave. It's my way or the highway.women live to the man's game, not hers.


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## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> And here they are today. So?
> 
> Is everything in your mind transactional?


Not transactional but there are always consequences to our actions sooner or later, right?


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## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

Numb26 said:


> Got to defend the hos, you know. 🤣🤣🤣🤣


The language you use says an awful lot about you. It is disrespectful and immature.


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## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

Thatredhead said:


> To answer your question, yes. Yes! YES! AND THEN MORE YESSES!
> 
> Now I'm not delusional, I know most men are crap in bed and the sex would likely suck but goddammit I WANT the option. I want to be wanted like that. I'm conventionally attractive so I get attention from men. I like it. I want to progress the attention and see where it goes. I want to see what different men are capable of. Pump and dump is perfect. Random hookups are exactly what I want. Relationships? Ugh. NO.
> I DO want to wh0re around! That's exactly what I want. That's true freedom, imo.
> ...


Why be married then? Let your husband go and be able to meet someone who will love and respect him. Meanwhile you can hump your way around the city, county and country and be FREE.


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## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

Thatredhead said:


> I took the vows when I was TOO YOUNG and unworldly to know what I was doing. So yeah, I want more options now that I'm older and wiser. Not a big deal, same with OPs wife. The only problem is the husband getting in the way!


You were too young, so who's fault is that? Your own right? Then do the right thing and divorce.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

aine said:


> You were too young, so who's fault is that? Your own right? Then do the right thing and divorce.


Redhead has been banned as a troll.


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## Taxman (Dec 21, 2016)

I do have one story of a WW who went on an odyssey of new experiences. Did not end well. She was unprepared for multiple aggressive partners. Her BH split after she was crippled by a group of men she hooked up with thru CL. Her voyage into sexuality now has her in a wheelchair, a stoma bag and a catheter. She may eventually be able to live independently. Several of her attackers have been arrested, but damage is done. Her exhusband hardly acknowledges there was a relationship.


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## Dictum Veritas (Oct 22, 2020)

Taxman said:


> I do have one story of a WW who went on an odyssey of new experiences. Did not end well. She was unprepared for multiple aggressive partners. Her BH split after she was crippled by a group of men she hooked up with thru CL. Her voyage into sexuality now has her in a wheelchair, a stoma bag and a catheter. She may eventually be able to live independently. Several of her attackers have been arrested, but damage is done. Her exhusband hardly acknowledges there was a relationship.


I know of a woman who also wanted an open relationship. She went on one of her dates (a guy she met online). This story ended in her murder.

Men aren't safe either, I have heard horror stories of men meeting online dates just to be set upon, robbed of all their possessions and beaten up.

Granted, these stories came to me as anecdotes, but there were details that make me believe that it's at least rooted in real events.


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## Married but Happy (Aug 13, 2013)

Dictum Veritas said:


> I know of a woman who also wanted an open relationship. She went on one of her dates (a guy she met online). This story ended in her murder.
> 
> Men aren't safe either, I have heard horror stories of men meeting online dates just to be set upon, robbed of all their possessions and beaten up.
> 
> Granted, these stories came to me as anecdotes, but there were details that make me believe that it's at least rooted in real events.


Yes, this can and does happen. Of course, if you extend that concept, NO ONE would ever date because you _might _be that 0.0001% who gets killed. Life is risk, so everyone chooses what risks they'll incur to get what they want, and most people are awful at evaluating risk.


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

aine said:


> The language you use says an awful lot about you. It is disrespectful and immature.


Cheater mindset sticking together is itself disrespectful, and should be treated with disrespect by others.


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## Dictum Veritas (Oct 22, 2020)

Married but Happy said:


> Yes, this can and does happen. Of course, if you extend that concept, NO ONE would ever date because you _might _be that 0.0001% who gets killed. Life is risk, so everyone chooses what risks they'll incur to get what they want, and most people are awful at evaluating risk.


Dating is fine, hookups with strangers not so much and much more dangerous. A lifestyle of of endless hookups, well, the math leans to not favor you so much anymore.


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## Married but Happy (Aug 13, 2013)

Dictum Veritas said:


> Dating is fine, hookups with strangers not so much and much more dangerous. I lifestyle of of endless hookups, well, the math leans to not favor you so much anymore.


Very true. Someone into endless hookups is at much higher risk. But most people engaging in ethical non-monogamy are occasionally dating, NOT doing a bunch of hookups, or if they are, they're doing so in a safe environment such as a swingers club.


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## red oak (Oct 26, 2018)

Numb26 said:


> This story has been told so many times. What happened that turned men into so many doormat simps?


Assuming it’s serious instead of rhetorical.

Part of it: Laws, placing woman above the man rather than on equal footing.

My dads first wife cheated on him.
Despite it all the court still gave joint custody which really messed the kids from that marriage up. 
If they got mad at one parent they would go to other parent in another state. Back and forth.

She used that to tell kids they shouldn’t put up with stuff. 

She wanted to work it out. 
He had no intention of ever going back to her but she got idea in their head if he never married my mother a few years later they might could have been a family again. She re-married herself soon after. 
Made for some really rough times.


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## drencrom (Jul 1, 2021)

aine said:


> The language you use says an awful lot about you. It is disrespectful and immature.


He's not wrong though.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

Dictum Veritas said:


> I have read all her posts and her thread. I'll get banned for sure if I really spoke my mind.


She'll be back with a different Username. I'd almost bet a 10 spot on it.


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## drencrom (Jul 1, 2021)

MattMatt said:


> @Thatredhead Coming to a website called Talk About Marriage and preaching the joys of sexual incontinence. That's a bit like going to a website for people who are the victims of crime and trying to sell lockpick and burglary kits.
> 
> Just divorce your husband. *That's the decent, honourable thing to do*.


Consider the source and you'll know that isn't going to happen. Decency and honor aren't in her vocabulary.


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

oldshirt said:


> Redhead has been banned as a troll.


It was obvious.

The words were those of a male.
A male who watches too much porn.


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## Rus47 (Apr 1, 2021)

rodrigoramirez1209 said:


> She has a job 2 of them, she is a hairstyles so she works at a Salon and just started a new job as administrator for her bosses school of Cosmetology so she will pretty soon start making good money. She takes care of the kids while I'm at work and Vice versa. We don't have any family that can take care of them


So back to the thread owner. What is going on with your problem. It has been nearly 2 weeks since we detoured to dialogue with a troll. Apologies to you for that.


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## karmagoround (Aug 27, 2021)

Dictum Veritas said:


> I know of a woman who also wanted an open relationship. She went on one of her dates (a guy she met online). This story ended in her murder.
> 
> Men aren't safe either, I have heard horror stories of men meeting online dates just to be set upon, robbed of all their possessions and beaten up.
> 
> Granted, these stories came to me as anecdotes, but there were details that make me believe that it's at least rooted in real events.


All those things could happen to single people as well.


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## Imnobodynew (Feb 11, 2016)

Happened recently with that lady in New York. Her handyman stabbed her like 60 times. Son was questioned until they had a video of the dude dragging her body down the street in a trash bag.


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## drencrom (Jul 1, 2021)

oldshirt said:


> Redhead has been banned as a troll.


The mods rock!!!


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## David60525 (Oct 5, 2021)

aine said:


> The language you use says an awful lot about you. It is disrespectful and immature.


Yeah. You cheat and run around, your woked, hurt a vow, is no vow, truth 
We should sugar coat things. NO. TOO many free rides are given. Please, we need standards
The guy below me said there are consequences


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## Honey Badger (28 d ago)

rodrigoramirez1209 said:


> So i got off work at 2am caught my wife texting a guy on Instagram they were both saying"I love you" and "baby" "babe" stuff like that and And so I broke down and I left and stayed in a hotel. She later found me where I was staying after attempting to call me multiple times and we talked about it while at the hotel. She Confessed to me that she loves me and wants to stay with me but she wants to date and sleep around with other people and for me to do the same pretty much having an open relationship. The reason for this is because we were together since she was 15 years old We are 29 now. we got pregnant so we got married at 18. She confessed to me that she didn't get to date other people or sleep with other people and she Wants to know how it feels like to date someone else and to sleep with someone else sense I'm the only person she's been with Physically and she's the only person I've ever been with too. After talking about it I told her if she wants to sleep Around with other people then we can't be together but if you want to try and save our marriage you have to delete your Instagram, She broke down of course because she loves the guy she was talking with on Instagram, So I decided that she can continue to have that long distance relationship on Instagram. If she promised me not to date or have sex with anyone else, I figured a long distance relationship is better than having her date other guys because I know she's going to get emotionally attached to that person and continue to have sex with them behind my back. I know anyone else would have left divorced but I love my wife, We've been together since 15 years old and I want to continue to be with my wife so I want to fight for our marriage. So my question to you guys is my wife continues to have the urges to date And sleep around with other guys, And it makes me sad that she feels this way and it's hurting our relationship. Any advice would be helpful.


If you don’t have any self-respect for yourself, and your wife will never have soft respect for you. She’s asking you to have an open relationship so that she can meet this other guy. But she has already cheated on you while she was being deceitful and dishonest. Emotional cheating is just as bad as physical cheating. There is no way that you should open up your relationship which she has already shown that she is willing to place a bomb on the foundation of your marriage with her. Do you really think that even if you say it will be a long distance relationship over Instagram that it will not officially become physical. That distance will close the more they fall in love with each other. Do you think she’s gonna tell you if this guy comes to town to see her? Absolutely not she is not going to tell you that he came to see her and now we will have to worry about this guy coming into your home while you were at work. You are setting yourself up for some major pain.

Your relationship is a lot like mine. I met my husband at the age of 14. We both started dating at the age of 50. We get married at the age of 18 and we have been married for 38 years. I’ve been sleeping and having sex with the same man for 42 years. And I have never ever thought about getting on the Internet and falling in love with someone else. Now you have to think about it, the way a woman will think about it. I’m gonna give you my woman’s perspective. How much time does she spend talking to this guy through Instagram and on the phone and text messages and FaceTime where they were Sexting and telling each other intimate secrets, and her, sending him photos and videos of herself to keep him interested? She hasn’t told you about all that. Do you know how much time it takes to fall in love with somebody? Of course you do. It takes time and you have to nourish and feed those feelings before you fall in love. She’s telling you that she loves another man so you have to think about the amount of time that she has spent talking to the other guy while you were at work or while you were outside cutting the grass or while you were sleeping or even while you were sick in bed and she was giving you medicine and then going back downstairs and talking to this other guy on the Internet. think about how many months she was speaking with him, but she chose not to tell you that she had met a friend.

No woman is going to have respect for you unless you respect yourself. You should divorce her immediately but you say that you love her but you will it to be OK with the fact that she loves you 50% as much as you love her. She’s saying that she wants to split her love for you the guy who is the father of your children with Aiden no name guy that’s on Instagram that has probably been talking to several women at the same time without her knowledge, but she’s willing to give him the benefit of the doubt that he loves her.

Don’t be a fool. I have had several of my girlfriends/sorority sisters, who get married, and then thought open relationship would be the best thing for them because they felt like they just needed that extra attention. And like most of these women, they started talking to other guys and flirting with other guys and meeting other guys before they ever went to their husbands and said I want to be in an open relationship. They were already cheating without their husbands knowledge. You are in the same situation, she was cheating on you emotionally without you even knowing about it, and you only found out about it out of luck of being able to see her talking to another guy.

I am telling you you need to stand up for yourself because obviously she’s trying to cut your knees to shorten your respect for yourself. She damn sure wouldn’t have wanted you to do the same thing to her. But like I said, before, do you think she’s going to tell you if this guy closes the distance to see her? Do you think that she’s gonna tell you if he comes into town to see her? Do you think she’s gonna stop yourself from having sex with this other guy when you have no idea that he is in town. Because initially is going to happen. Your wife doesn’t respect you. So you need to respect yourself more at this point in time


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