# How can i just do it ?!!!



## LVS (Apr 5, 2010)

Divorce was final on February 17th and my ex still doing attempts to change my mind and go back to him now he is trying to force me to meet with him to talk to me and convince me against my will to go back to him. For more details i have another long thread http://talkaboutmarriage.com/consid...ion/12611-28-years-marriage-what-ca-i-do.html

Today after calling me three times and i wasn't answering he left me this voice message

"I respected you enough and gave you enough chances if you don't answer me by tonight to tell me when and where we are going to meet the meeting is going to happen whether you agreed or not. I won't wait for you anymore to decide as you want and whenever you want because your big head won't stay big. I won't tell you how, when or where but it is going to happen and against your will because it is a matter of life or death your big stubborn head won't help you, I don't want say bigger words. But your big stubborn head, the head that you got from your family doesn't work until it is broken.
Forget about your therapist forget about Obama and America because even if they all are going to support you what i want to do i am going to do it. For your sake you need to reply. No matter what you decide we are going to meet and after this meeting either we live in peace or we live in war and we destroy one another, you have time till this evening to answer me or it is going to happen against your will even if you want to bring Obama in person he won't be able to do anything for you."

Tomorrow is going to be a tough day. I know what i suppose to do especially after his voice message and i am still not wanting to do it 
I know i should call the police or get a restraining order but something in me still refusing to do it unless i am pushed till the edges. 

My friends I am an analytical person (I know sometimes we should not analyse so much we should just act) But i just need to do this analysis. Will you please help me to analyse my situation?!

In my mind lots of questions and hesitation. Why this hesitation is there when i know what is right to be done?

MY BOUNDARIES are invaded what am I waiting for???

What am I AFRAID OF????

Let's say i am pushed till the edges, would i care and would i still be worried about anything else? My answer is NO!!!! So why wouldn't I just do it now???????

Is it all about culture??? Or there is another reason?

I know if someone else is in my situation what i would advice them. I know if one of my beloved is hurt with this i won't wait to act?

But my beloved are hurt in indirect way in emotional way would calling the police or getting a restraining order hurt them more???

What are the negative sides of getting a restraining order?


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## Avalon (Jul 5, 2011)

If your divorce was final, there should be NO reason for communication between you unless there are children involved and you need to discuss things like school, schedules, etc. If you don't want to communicate with him, and you are legally divorced at this point, then you have every right in the world to not respond to him. 

I see his words as threatening, the whole "we'll meet against your will" thing... that scares me, and I would be hightailing it to the police to get a restraining order as soon as possible. The divorce is final, it's over with, yet he is still trying to manipulate and intimidate you... you need to put a stop to it once and for all.


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## COGypsy (Aug 12, 2010)

Analysis! I love analysis! Black and white...makes things so much clearer, yes?

Let's go through your questions:


> MY BOUNDARIES are invaded what am I waiting for???


This is not about your boundaries. Calling three times might be, but the words that he said are an absolute, direct physical threat. He said "if you don't answer me by tonight to tell me when and where we are going to meet *the meeting is going to happen whether you agreed or not*. I won't wait for you anymore to decide as you want and whenever you want because *your big head won't stay big*. *I won't tell you how, when or where but it is going to happen and against your will *because it is a matter of life or death your big stubborn head won't help you, I don't want say bigger words. *But your big stubborn head, the head that you got from your family doesn't work until it is broken.*

He won't tell you when or where? Your head has to be broken to work? THREAT. Not boundary.



> What am I AFRAID OF????


Confrontation and all the "might happens". But those "might happens" could happen either way, you might as well be strong and take action to protect yourself instead of withering in the dark!



> Let's say i am pushed till the edges, would i care and would i still be worried about anything else?


What exactly are your "edges"? When he actually does jump out of nowhere and hurt you? If a voicemail like this isn't enough of a reason to do something, what actually will be? When you're in the hospital? A coffin?



> Is it all about culture??? Or there is another reason?


It may be culture. But more than likely he's made you used to giving in to his demands over the years...you're having to break out of the old pattern even more.



> I know if one of my beloved is hurt with this i won't wait to act?


Why are you less important than they are? Why wait until anyone is hurt--you or them?



> But my beloved are hurt in indirect way in emotional way would calling the police or getting a restraining order hurt them more???


Do you mean would he turn and harass them if he couldn't get to you? If that's likely, they can be named in the restraining order as well and be protected just like you.



> What are the negative sides of getting a restraining order?


Realistically--there are a few things to be aware of. I only know generally, not specifically for every place, but here are some general things. They don't take effect until he's served. They aren't a magic dome that protects you, they just give police something to enforce before anyone gets hurt. You still have to be proactive about your own safety. They go both ways, so if there are still reasons that you would be in contact, you contacting him could cancel out the order. 

On the positive side though, they send a powerful message to most people that there will be serious consequences for harassment and will most likely intensify any consequences if he's prosecuted for violating the order. It makes it illegal, not just annoying, for him to be around the places that you frequent. It's a great tool and in most cases, very effective.

I would caution you, either way you go to be very aware of your safety in the next few days. Do NOT meet him. If you can, stay somewhere else, take different routes to work, or see if you can trade cars with a friend for a few days even. Take advantage of the security guys at the places you go for escorts to your car and try not to be alone. No matter what, don't make it _easy_ for him to do something to you.

There's a great book, The Gift of Fear by Gavin DeBecker that talks a lot about trusting your instincts and staying safe in circumstances like this....you might want to check it out when you have a chance. If you Google him, he has some good resources on his website as well.

I personally see no downside to making a police report AND getting a protection order, I hope you'll see it that way too. Either way, please stay safe!


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

What does Obama have to do with it?


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## LVS (Apr 5, 2010)

Yesterday at 10:30 am i was coming back home when i saw him coming my way i ran and locked my door he rang the bell and stayed around 10 minutes then he called me to leave a voice message and he left while cursing me loudly and saying bad words about me

In his loud voice message he said:
Listen you whxxe hxxker you are going to see me against your creature will you are going to talk to me against your creature will and your life is going to turn hell believe me because i am not going to leave alone or have mercy for you. All the past time where i was merciful i am going to take them back and turn your life to hell. And all what i promised to do i am going to do it. I won't be ME if i don't put your parents head in the mud and let your dad die of suffering as you are doing to me and my mom and you know me when i threaten (few years ago a rumor spread about my mom with another guy but i spoke to my mom and i know it wasn't true and my dad knows all the details from AtoZ my mom said to me "keep your head up and don't worry let him try whatever he wants").

My ex is threatening to tell my dad about the rumor which is a fact for him and to destroy my dad as i am destroying him this is a kind of pressure on me to submit to his will and go back to him he doesn't know yet that i know the truth about the rumor and i am not willing to tell him.

Also yesterday he called my D19 and asked her to tell me that if i don't find a way to talk to him he is going to be stalking me to let me talk to him against my will and when he talk to me if i don't agree to find a solution to our situation and go back to him everyone is going to pay so he is going to stop supporting my kids financially like getting my daughter's books for her college and give her gas money and pocket money also he won't take my son school or bring him back when i have work which will add more pressure on me. I told my daughter to not worry i will get her books God won't leave me alone and i told her when your dad contacted you back just tell him that i didn't let her talk and i refused to listen to what he wants to tell me. Just to keep her away of his manipulation


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## LVS (Apr 5, 2010)

*Avalon* yes we have kids and i told him that our contact should be limited to talk only about our kids but he is not admitting that nor admitting that i am not his wife anymore since we are catholic and i still didn't get the annulment from my church....

*that_girl* well just to tell me that no one can support me or help me with what he is willing to do which is seeing me and talk to me

*CoGypsy* I really appreciate all the time you took to reply and to analyse my post that was very helpful. Also by me posting it this way it helped me to decide and to better analyse with clearer mind.

Yesterday i went to the legal aid at YMCA ( they give free legal advice) and i asked to file for restraining order i gave her all the facts but she said you will need to go for two hearing to see if your case worth giving you a restraining order and in all what you told me they might consider it as a husband worried and wanting his wife back he didn't have any physical contact with you...

I told her lets build the case and he is going to do something very soon so when this happens we will be having everything ready to file....

I don't see him physically threatening me at least not in the near future because he wants to pressure me financially. But when he will try to contact me physically i will be calling 911 or/and filing for restraining order


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## COGypsy (Aug 12, 2010)

LVS said:


> Yesterday i went to the legal aid at YMCA ( they give free legal advice) and i asked to file for restraining order i gave her all the facts but she said you will need to go for two hearing to see if your case worth giving you a restraining order and in all what you told me they might consider it as a husband worried and wanting his wife back he didn't have any physical contact with you...
> 
> I told her lets build the case and he is going to do something very soon so when this happens we will be having everything ready to file....
> 
> I don't see him physically threatening me at least not in the near future because he wants to pressure me financially. But when he will try to contact me physically i will be calling 911 or/and filing for restraining order


To be perfectly honest, I'm not sure how good the advice that you received was. I worked at a domestic violence agency for 5 years and let me tell you, everything that you're saying here is a gigantic red flag for serious violence.

I know that it can sometimes be embarrassing or that you feel like you're sounding dramatic or "hard on him" when you're talking to someone face to face. It's hard to admit that these things can happen to us when we feel so smart and competent in every other area of our lives. If what you wrote here is what you said to the people you spoke to yesterday, if you told them that he was banging on your door yelling threats against you and your family and their response was that it could sound like he was only worried about you.....I'd be speaking to someone else. Those are not the actions of a concerned person. 

He's making criminal and violent threats against you and your family and that in and of itself is illegal, regardless of whether he follows through. He's telling you that you're head is only good broken, he'll find you sometime that you won't expect, that he's going to stalk you, put your parents' head in the mud so they die suffering, not leave you alone and show you no mercy. Those aren't physical threats? Really? You're running and hiding from him behind locked doors and you're not physically threatened? Very smart to do, but doesn't it indicate some level of threat?

Whether you choose to file an order right now or not, I would so, so strongly encourage you to at least do these other things:

1. Get another opinion on filing an RO, from a domestic violence agency, family court advocate, or the police department.

2. When you do, find out what evidence is required to get the order granted. When I used to help people write their RO's, our courts wanted three concrete examples of a reason to fear one's partner....

3. Document everything that has happened to date, the two incidents here and any that have happened before. Include exact language as close as you can manage, the time and date and the names of anyone else who may have been present.

4. Make a police report, call it "nuisance activity" or harassment or whatever, but get an official record of this started before it becomes a 911 call.

5. Let everyone around you know that he's harassing you. Friends, co-workers, family, kids schools.... This behavior thrives in shadows and if people know about what's going on, when he does assault you or your parents or take one of your kids, hopefully there will be help close by or at least there will be more information to help your case at that point.

Good luck, I hope very much that his only intent really is to pressure you financially and that you and your family are able to stay safe and well through this!


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

For God's sake, LVS, take these recordings and play them at the police station. 

Do you seriously want your children to lose their mother? That's what will happen if you don't step up and do the adult thing, and get past your need to be nice.


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## HelloooNurse (Apr 12, 2010)

Those recordings are proof enough!! Please get down there get the restraining order in place.. I have read in the newspaper many times throughout my life about this sort of thing happening and eventually the husband snaps and does something crazy. May not happen with your exhusband but it is a possibility and it is better to be safe than sorry right?


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## COGypsy (Aug 12, 2010)

LVS--I hope everything is well today and that you're just too busy to post!

I skimmed your other thread last night...it looks like over a year and half ago your ex was making threats that were enough to make your brother tell you to call the police?

I just keep thinking of all the murders where so many friends and family go back and say, "oh well, there was that time when he left those messages" or "I remember they had that fight one time" but it never gets put all together....I hope that you're safe and well today!


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## LVS (Apr 5, 2010)

I am fine thank you CoGypsy for your worries and for taking time to go through my other thread. 
I've read all the posts and I really appreciate them I am not ignoring or demeaning the danger but I am little bit overwhelmed trying to relax my mind to be able to think in clearer way. I always follow my instinct now I feel confused, I know he might turn dangerous at any time but I also know he is still hopping. As long as he doesn't know about the other man in my life he will keep pressuring.
I believe he is going first to scare me and pressure me financially before he turns to be physically.
At the same time I am going to stay cautious I am waiting my days off of work to go to the court 

But one concern if I got restraining order he might turn physical and I won't feel safe I am kind of scared of challenging him and I don't know if there is a way in this world that may solve the situation without involving the law!!!!

Turnera I tried to call his brother he didn't pick up the phone and he didn't call later
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LVS (Apr 5, 2010)

Ok now what does this mean?

My ex took my D19 yesterday to the mall and bought for her all kind of clothes also he gave her money to get her books and never asked her if she transferred his message to me or what was my answer?

My analysis is he found that what he did didn't affect me or scare me or make me change my mind so he decided to switch back to the nice side and try to show me that he is nice and that what he said was out of anger and because he loves me he won't do anything to hurt me!!!!!

What do you think????


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## COGypsy (Aug 12, 2010)

LVS said:


> I am fine thank you CoGypsy for your worries and for taking time to go through my other thread.
> I've read all the posts and I really appreciate them I am not ignoring or demeaning the danger but I am little bit overwhelmed trying to relax my mind to be able to think in clearer way. I always follow my instinct now I feel confused, I know he might turn dangerous at any time but I also know he is still hopping. As long as he doesn't know about the other man in my life he will keep pressuring.
> I believe he is going first to scare me and pressure me financially before he turns to be physically.
> At the same time I am going to stay cautious I am waiting my days off of work to go to the court
> ...


So if he finds out there's someone else in your life now, what then? Will he just slink away or do you expect another explosion?

You ask a good question about whether a restraining order can push someone over the edge and make a situation worse. In some cases, it certainly can. I think however, it depends on the basic personality, the fundamental character of the person. If they by and large respect authority, follow most rules, etc., then a restraining order can be a really good thing. If they believe that no one is the "boss" of them, rules don't apply to them, etc. then it can escalate a situation. I think that far more people are the first way though. 

For the life of me, I don't understand why you are looking so desperately for a solution that doesn't involve the law, when the fundamental problem here is that he is breaking the law. Threatening someone's safety is against the law. Stalking is against the law. Phone harassment is against the law. The law is there to protect you from these things.

If however you don't want to involve the people who are there to protect you in these situations, the solution is simple. Do whatever he wants, whenever he wants. Give in and he'll be satisfied....at least until something else sets him off.


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## COGypsy (Aug 12, 2010)

LVS said:


> Ok now what does this mean?
> 
> My ex took my D19 yesterday to the mall and bought for her all kind of clothes also he gave her money to get her books and never asked her if she transferred his message to me or what was my answer?
> 
> ...


I think it's the "honeymoon" phase. In abusive relationships, there's a very distinct cycle of behavior that runs over and over through the relationship. It goes like this:

1. *Incident:* The cycle of episodic abuse begins with a major abusive behavior such as loud verbal abuse, screaming and/or verbal harassment and even a threat of physical assault. 

2. *Honeymoon/ Remorse:* A period of remorse follows. The abusive individual will go to great lengths to seek forgiveness and offer assurances that the abusive behavior will never occur again. An abusive spouse may bring flowers or expensive gifts. Characterized by affection, apology, or, alternatively, ignoring the incident. This phase marks an apparent end of violence, with assurances that it will never happen again, or that the abuser will do his or her best to change. During this stage the abuser feels overwhelming feelings of remorse and sadness, or at least pretends to. Some abusers walk away from the situation with little comment, but most will eventually shower their victims with love and affection. The abuser may use self-harm or threats of suicide to gain sympathy and/or prevent the victim from leaving the relationship. Abusers are frequently so convincing, and victims so eager for the relationship to improve, that victims who are often worn down and confused by longstanding abuse, stay in the relationship

3. *Calm:* The third portion of the cycle is characterized by a period of "normalcy." During this time frame the abusive spouse may appear to be truly living out his or her repentance. Great effort will be expended to please and lull the victim of abuse into believing that the worst is now over. 

4. *Tension Building/ Walking on Eggshells:* Over time, tension will begin to replace the easy atmosphere in the home. Irritability will increase, followed by veiled accusations by the abuser, blaming the other spouse for his or her frustration and unhappiness. Eventually, this escalating behavior will give way to another episode of full-blown verbal and/or physical abuse.

My guess is that he knows that he can't get to you to "make up", and knows that your daughter is aware of what's going on, so in this case, after his latest blow-up of rants and threats, he's doing his "making up" to her since she's the best path to you. He absolutely knows that he has to start looking like the nice guy or he'll have no chance of speaking to you. One, because you (wisely!) won't deal with violent, threatening people and two, because your daughter won't either.


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## LVS (Apr 5, 2010)

COGypsy said:


> So if he finds out there's someone else in your life now, what then? Will he just slink away or do you expect another explosion?


Another explosion lol i will be the hxxxer in reality then he has a prove of me cheating on him and a prove that i left him for someone else (of course i am talking from his perspective).



COGypsy said:


> You ask a good question about whether a restraining order can push someone over the edge and make a situation worse. In some cases, it certainly can. I think however, it depends on the basic personality, the fundamental character of the person. If they by and large respect authority, follow most rules, etc., then a restraining order can be a really good thing. If they believe that no one is the "boss" of them, rules don't apply to them, etc. then it can escalate a situation. I think that far more people are the first way though.


As being from different culture he still not admitting that i am not his wife anymore which in an indirect way not admitting the law
In my opinion by forcing him to admit things it is going to be bad 
1- knowing from his desire to control part that definitely he can't do anything about it anymore.
2- knowing that i am using authorities to stop him.
3- Losing every hope of me going back to him

Will make him so desperate and with his ill mind i am not sure about his reaction toward that because he is not a type of person who can admit to lose.



COGypsy said:


> For the life of me, I don't understand why you are looking so desperately for a solution that doesn't involve the law, when the fundamental problem here is that he is breaking the law. Threatening someone's safety is against the law. Stalking is against the law. Phone harassment is against the law. The law is there to protect you from these things


In addition to what i mentioned i am not ready yet to move with the man whom i love before i get the annulment from my church



COGypsy said:


> If however you don't want to involve the people who are there to protect you in these situations, the solution is simple. Do whatever he wants, whenever he wants. Give in and he'll be satisfied....at least until something else sets him off.


He will never be satisfied NEVER!!!!
CoGypsy i am trying to find the wiser situation especially we have kids together and a S13 for whom we still need to be in contact with each other... 

With all what i said will it be good for now to get restraining order?


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## LVS (Apr 5, 2010)

And you are right CoGypsy about the honey moon phase I agree it is where he is right now.

My question remains the same, should i file for the restraining order now or stretch it little more if possible until i got the annulment.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

LVS, tell me this: If you DO get an annulment, do you see your XH then 'accepting' that you are gone for good?


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## LVS (Apr 5, 2010)

Yes turnera I do accept that i don't want him in my life anymore even if i spent the rest of my life alone. I just need to move on with my life... I am tired....

I am just scared to take this action and get restraining order!!! i need to make sure i am doing the right and safest thing because i can't handle failure and i have no one to be with me, even the man i am talking to i am still building my relationship with him. It is still not mature enough to be able to commit my life to him even if i have the annulment right now.

That's why my hesitation!


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## COGypsy (Aug 12, 2010)

LVS, I think I've getting a little bit confused about all the other things that seem to be factoring into your decision as well. So let me just ask a few questions to get things clear in my mind.

So you are legally divorced, but have not gotten the church annulment that you believe will convince him that things are over between you, correct?

You don't want the church annulment until you decide whether you and this new man are going to get married? Basically staying church-married to your children's father until you have a replacement? Or are you not allowed to get an annulment in church unless you want to re-marry?

I guess what confuses me is how the new guy, the annulment and the possible restraining order are all winding together as you try to make a decision.

Regardless, here are my thoughts:

You need to continue to make every possible separation from your ex-husband--communication, legally, and (if possible) religiously. And to be consistent with that distance. 

While you're making the decision whether to file, make reports etc., continue to DOCUMENT in absolute detail everything that happens so that you have the evidence trail you'll need later. Worse case, you don't use it, right?

Ultimately, no one here can tell you the best thing to do for yourself. You have to assess the risks and the benefits. I feel very, very strongly, that at the very least, you should file police reports about the threats and the harassment. They may not even contact him about them, but you've started an official record of his behavior and the police can't refuse to take your report. 

Should you file a restraining order, there are many, many resources to advise you on how to stay safe. Also, I'd guess that the majority of people with RO's have children and manage to handle needed communications through third parties. Since your son is 13, that makes it even easier since he's old enough to be perfectly capable of telling one or the other of you what his schedule is and where he needs to be.

You have to do what you feel is best for you and your family, of course. What I would emphasize is that this is ultimately something you're going to have to handle on your own whether you have a new boyfriend or not. This is your issue, not his and even if things were farther along between you, he couldn't be with you every minute.

The second thing I'd stress is that in the vast, vast majority of cases, RO's if properly enforced, are a great tool for stopping abuse and harassment by creating real consequences. In a very few cases, they do make things worse, and those are the ones that make the news. The tens of thousands that have helped and even saved people are the ones that never get mentioned.


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## LVS (Apr 5, 2010)

I am legally divorced since February 17th.
I started since i got the divorce papers working with my church to process the annulment
It is a long process, they promised me within couple weeks from now the papers will be submitted to the spiritual court in my church.
After submitting the papers the process will take a year more or less.

I need to wait the annulment in order to be with this man. But even if i am not waiting my church my relationship with this man is not mature enough yet to make me decide to move with him.

So if i made the restraining order my fear is about my ex's reaction is he going to be taking revenge? How his desperate revenge will look like? I know he can pressure me financially (now he is still using emotional pressure) the law can't support me with that.

If i am free to remarry i would get the restraining order and i won't feel this pressure because i would have my man with me supporting me emotionally and financially. Or even without a man, a year from now my financial situation would become better then i won't have this fear.


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## LVS (Apr 5, 2010)

Thank you for all your advice they are needed and well appreciated.

I am making all the documentation needed. I have a meeting today at the church office i already gave them the documents about all what happened before i moved out, i am going to give them as well a copy of the recent incidents (the knocking my door with the two important voice messages, his message to me through my daughter and about him taking my daughter shopping after all what he said which shows how unstable his mind is). I am going to give another copy also to the legal adviser at YMCA to build my file so when i need this restraining order it will be ready to be filed.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

LVS, my question, I meant will HE finally move on if you get an annulment? Will HE say 'ok, the church dissolved our marriage so now I'll leave her alone'?


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## COGypsy (Aug 12, 2010)

Is your ex-husband providing support beyond what is required in the divorce decree? Is that the financial pressure? Because any support required by the courts can be enforced by the courts... If there was no spousal or child support in the divorce decree, you might look at going back for a modification of the decree to make sure he's accountable for supporting his children, at least.


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## LVS (Apr 5, 2010)

turnera said:


> LVS, my question, I meant will HE finally move on if you get an annulment? Will HE say 'ok, the church dissolved our marriage so now I'll leave her alone'?


sorry for misunderstanding your earlier post. No i don't think he will admit it but at least i will be more powerful in front of my family and kids also i can be with another man and stop him from disturbing my life.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Then you're doing the right thing by having this all ready to be presented to the authorities. If he's not going to back off, you may have to let them MAKE him back off. Maybe you could ask the Legal Aid if they can submit it, and just not activate it until he does something. But at least the paperwork would already be turned in and started. You may need more immediate help.


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## LVS (Apr 5, 2010)

COGypsy said:


> Is your ex-husband providing support beyond what is required in the divorce decree? Is that the financial pressure? Because any support required by the courts can be enforced by the courts... If there was no spousal or child support in the divorce decree, you might look at going back for a modification of the decree to make sure he's accountable for supporting his children, at least.


No child support is provided because i have only one child under 18 and the legal adviser told me with what he makes i will be able to get around $50 so it doesn't worth trying for. He is paying more than that he got a car for my D19 he is giving her pocket money and paying her expanses He is also getting my son all what he needs from clothes to transportation to and from school and to the soccer practice which i can't do for him because of my work schedule


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## LVS (Apr 5, 2010)

A restraining order as i see it is a challenge for him. 

What if he broke the law and went to jail who can guaranty me after coming out of jail he won't be more mad and commit a crime....
The law won't be this fast to prevent it form happening....

What i need to know is if there is anyway can work to help him to accept the divorce and move on with his life


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

The best thing I could think of would be to get his family members to tell him so.


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## COGypsy (Aug 12, 2010)

The only way that you can help him move on with his life is by not convincing him to accept the divorce and move on with his life. The more you engage, the more he's rewarded for keeping after you. That means conversations have to stay only about the kids and only about truly necessary things about the kids. Let him know he's welcome to leave a message about the children if he doesn't reach you and you'll get back to him if a response is needed. Limit all conversations and communications, because every time he gets a response from you, it means progress to him. Let your kids know that you're happy for them to have time with their dad, but that they aren't to talk about you when they're with him or his family, even if they're asked.

Make a wall between you and him and the kids only a tiny peephole in that wall....

The book I recommended before talks about this really well-- The Gift of Fear by Gavin deBecker. It's an amazing book, and I think could really help you in your situation.


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## LVS (Apr 5, 2010)

Thank you for the good advice CoGypsy.

turnera i spoke to his brother today and he is totally disappointed. He spent around half hour telling me what happened between him and his brother and he said he doesn't care about anything anymore. He also said that he never saw my ex the way he saw him lately he always heard about him yelling and screaming but never saw him in person doing that until last incident. He said i don't know my brother anymore. If you are asking me advice i don't know what to say because the person you are talking about is someone completely different, i can't predict his behavior. So do what you want to do if you want to talk to him do it otherwise protect yourself with the law this is all i can say.


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## LVS (Apr 5, 2010)

I spoke to the person who is helping me with the annulment process and i asked her if she agree to be a third partie in a meeting with my ex to try to convince him to move on with his life. She asked me if i believe he would listen to what we tell him and i said no i know he won't. She said how many times in all your life with him you tried to convince him about things in your marriage, did you ever succeed with anything i said no she said and now you won't also. And i agree with her and with you CoGypsy. Hmmmm
She said he won't accept it until the annulment is final but some people even way after the annulment won't be able to accept it.

About the restraining order she agreed with my fears about doing it now and she suggested to do it only if i fear for my life.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

I'm sorry you're in this position. I hope it gets better for you.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

How are things, LVS? I'm worried.


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## LVS (Apr 5, 2010)

I just saw your post Turnera everything is ok he is still quiet taking care of kids but yesterday my ex sister in law sent me a text message asking me to meet with her for urgent matter and she needs a quick answer I told her to sent me a letter and I will reply.

These are her words
"Dear lvs, I went to my brother's house 2 days before and he told me that he has something very important to discuss with you about the children fate but you did'nt accept to talk to him. Be sure that in this country the children rights are more important than their parents and their problems. When there would be any harm in their behavour toward their children they both will go to jail. Therefore, you should reply to my brother and discuss the matter with him. otherwise, we the relatives , the watchers, right now, will not shut our months and report it accordingly. I am very sorry to tell you frankly about this but the children are the innocent third who are harmed by your problems. Please , releive your conscience and react accordingly. With God blessings"

I didn't reply to her BS letter.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LVS (Apr 5, 2010)

Today she sent text msg saying "Dear lvs, I was very upset yesterday because u did'nt accept 2 meet me n I sent 2 u such email . Am ur friend n not ur ennemy n if am not sure ur gonna face the worse in future I wont intrude myself in the matter . Am gonna send u another email explaining everything pls read it n reply ."

This is her second email

Dear lbs, My brother situation is worsenking in every issue. He has very good reasons for not to help you with the children. You are gonna be alone with no help from anyone. My brother is gonna live somewhere else and not to tell any of us where. You and the children are not gonna be helped by any of us because my brother did'nt ask us to do it. He is trying to talk to you about the situation and reach an agreement with you to return back to him. I am sure this wont happen and you wont accept and I don't want you to return to him against your free will and because you're forced to do it. Therefore , I suggest that you tell him that your doctor advised you not to do it because it will worsen your case and your health. In such case , and because he loves you he will accept that you don't return to him and will find another solution to help you with the children. I am sure that when convinced about not to return to him, he will progress and leave you to your free will and at least ask us and ask his brothers to help him with the children. I wish from all my heart that he leaves you to your free will, and not to insist in the matter. Hes gonna still love you all his life but with time he will accept the matter like any normal person and live his life without it. Please try to call him and discuss the matter with him and reach a good solution for you all. I am praying to God to help you. With Gods blessings"

I still didn't reply but I am going to tonight
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

So...she doesn't even want you to go back to him but he apparently pressures the whole family, and they all feel obligated to cowtow to him. Interesting.

Also interesting is that she has found what she thinks is a 'way' to get him off your case - saying that your doctor says you can't go back to him for your health's sake.

I say, why not? To me, it's the truth - your health CAN'T survive going back to him. If that's what he needs to save face and pride, so be it.

That said, if you do contact her, be sure and let her know that you don't appreciate her THREATENING to report you to authorities.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Are you ok?


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

LVS, please let us know if you're ok.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

LVS, I'm getting worried. Please let us know you're ok.


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## COGypsy (Aug 12, 2010)

Me too LVS--everything ok??


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## LVS (Apr 5, 2010)

I apologize my friends I am ok but wasn't checking in. Nothing has being changed. I didn't reply to my ex sister in law or spoke to my ex and he is so quuet. 

I have an update about something else I will post it when I got a chance

Thank you for your concerns and for checking on me I really appreciate it
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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