# How do I break the "Nice Guy" syndrome



## pegmale (Apr 27, 2017)

Hello, 

I am at a loss. I have been married to a wonderful woman for 17 years and am very happy in all aspects of our marriage with the exception of, you guessed it, the physical side. My wife and I are best friends, have two amazing children and could not be happier. We rarely argue and are on the same page with almost everything. Here is my dilemma, until just recently (maybe 6 months ago) I couldn't comprehend why our sex life was so out of synch. She is happy with once a month, I would be happy with once a week and absolutely thrilled with twice a week. I must admit I have drank the kool-aide, I am the perfect husband (as she is always telling me). I do 90% of the cooking, 100% of the cleanup after dinner (dishes, etc). When she goes away for a couple of days for work I go out of my way to hide letters and gifts in her suitcase to tell her how much I appreciate her and miss her while she is away. I make a point to hug her when I first get home from work. I turn the TV off so we can just sit and talk about our days. I actually enjoy giving her a foot massage while we watch a movie. 
Anyway, I believe now what I have done for the past 17 years is just become the perfect husband, but not an attractive lover. Sure there are times (maybe a couple a year) where she will literally beg me for sex, but the norm is her just saying if you can be quick, we can have sex tonight. She has actually told me in the past I am too nice to her and she is starting to feel like she is obligated to have sex in return. (bad sign) It has gotten to the point where she will say no to a simple back rub or foot massage.
So I am looking for some suggestions as how to become more attractive. 
I realize I cannot try to create situations to show my masculinity, but I am wanting to start to react in a way that a strong confident male would.

Example 1: I tell her my plan is to go for a quick run before dinner and ask, would you like to come along? (background: we are both trying to get in better shape for summer) She says: "I've been out all day and just want to relax)

I simply say: "OK, I'll see you when I get back."

As I was running, I was thinking this was an opportunity to say something playful, such as “afraid you can’t keep up?” 
when I got back, my wife asked how the run went I responded with great, but I think I’ll need a massage a little later. Her: “well you should make an appointment to get one” Me: “no from you” her: slightly annoyed “um no” (she has always told me she doesn't like giving back rubs) I would love it, if she would, but not going to push at this point.

sorry for the long winded rant, to sum up what I am looking for is advice on how to start getting her to see me as the confident guy without stepping over the line and annoying her? or is she really not annoyed and I should continue to push the envelop? so confused.


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

You've trained her to know you're not going anywhere. There's no challenge to you. 
Once they know you love them and aren't going anywhere, you're doomed, LOL.

Seriously, she knows you love her and aren't going anywhere. Why should she make the effort?

I would:

Start expecting a little help around the house and NOT treating her like a spoiled princess.
Going on my own to do things and getting a life that doesn't revolve around her.
Start dressing and acting differently--- basically make yourself the person you've always wanted to be.

In truth, there's not going to be a change in her. As I said, she has been trained by you for years to expect you to be a doormat and someone that she doesn't have to make any effort to make her love you. She's gotten so damn lazy she won't even give you a back rub?

You need to ask yourself: Could I live without this woman? Could I be happier with a woman that gives ME attention, gives ME a back rub without me having to ask, cooks for ME some, treats ME like a king? 

You have a one-sided relationship, my friend.

Stop doing things that make her happy and start doing things to make you happy once in a while.


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## GuyInColorado (Dec 26, 2015)

Stop running, unless you are overweight. If you are overweight, diet and exercise are key. You should be lifting weights. Heavy weights. Get strong and built. Join a gym and go 5-6 days a week for a few hours. Don't invite her. Get some nice bluetooth headphones and stream music from Spotify. This is your personal time to unwind and think about life. Your diet has to be 95% perfect, or you are wasting time. Tons of protein and drink only water. No soda and very limited booze.

Once you start getting defined shoulders, arms, and pecks, go buy some new slim clothes. If you can't get rid of some fat (which is common for older men), go get laser lipo. Again, don't ask her, just tell her you have an appointment and get it done. This is going to give you confidence.

Also, stop helping around the house. Go to the gym when it's dinner time some days. Tell her you don't want to clean up after dinner anymore, so quick meals and paper plates/cups, plastic forks, etc. Go to the gym early in the morning. Make her wonder what you're up to and who is checking you out. 

Have a nice car? If not, maybe go get one. Again, don't ask her for permission. A nice American heavy duty truck will go good with your new appearance. Women dig trucks! 

Time to make you the best you can be. If she doesn't notice and want some of it, then her lost and you can start detaching and ready for her replacement. Yes, all of us are replaceable. There is no such thing as a soul mate.


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## Marc878 (Aug 26, 2015)

Read up
https://www.google.com/search?q=no+more+mr+nice+guy+pdf&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&hl=en-us&client=safari

Marriage/relationships should be balanced @ 50/50. If you do too much you can get taken for granted and advantage of. Perhaps lose respect 

Sounds like you are her wife. Way overboard. Do your 50% and expect her to do her end.


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## uhtred (Jun 22, 2016)

I'll take a different view.

You are what you are, don't change yourself in order to get more sex. It might not work anyway - she may simply not want that much sex.


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## Bananapeel (May 4, 2015)

Good books to read:
Mating in Captivity
The Married Man Sex Life Primer

One more tip: Probably should be posting in the Men's forum since it seems that you're getting responses from men. Just sayin'


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

How many hours a week do you work?

How many hours a week does your wife work?

You say that you do that you do 100% of the after dinner cleanup?

What percentage of housework, cooking, shopping and other household chores does you wife do?

Do you have children?


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## Celtic (Apr 7, 2017)

Marc878 said:


> Read up
> https://www.google.com/search?q=no+more+mr+nice+guy+pdf&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&hl=en-us&client=safari


I second this.* No More Mr Nice Guy* by Robert Glover is a fantastic book and helped me a lot in the past. I really can not recommend it enough. Be warned though; in reading the book I was introduced to the 'Red Pill' mindset and that really needs to be taken with caution. There is some great advice in that area, a lot of it relating to appearing more attractive to women, but it can come across as childish 'locker room' talk with constant pissing contents between men trying to be pick-up artists. Maybe it works for others but I found some of it to be rather desperate, both to be liked by all women and admired by all men. I just don't feel the need for that popularity at my age. 

Anyway, there are lots of small changes that can be made from your attitude and responses to your health and appearance. Just don't expect these all to happen overnight or for your wife to notice them so soon. This can feel disheartening at first but stick with it and the results are worth it. I started my 'transformation' in January and it was only last week (April) that my GF told me I was like a god to her. It was an amazingly big compliment but it took a lot of work on my end before it arrived. 

Just a quick question too but are you injected fun into your marriage? Going for a run together is fine on a lazy Sunday morning but what about dates and new experiences to take her out of her comfort zone?


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## Fozzy (Jul 20, 2013)

I'm not convinced that you're necessarily a "Nice Guy". Part and parcel to that is the idea of the covert contract. Are you doing all of the housework because you think that you are owed sex for it? Or are you just doing the housework because you just want to be nice to your wife? Or are you doing the housework because your wife won't do it?

If it's the first answer, you're probably a "Nice Guy". If its' #2 or #3 (or something else), you're probably just being too nice--lower case "n". Too nice basically means boring.

If you're a Nice Guy (capitalized) get NMMNG and implement it. If you're too nice I'd recommend what some of the other posters here have--stop being so nice and predictable. Read "Mating in Captivity" by Esther Perel.


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## Vinnydee (Jan 4, 2016)

I used to be a nice guy. So nice that I never questioned my fiance about where she was for so long. Never got jealous and gave her freedom to do what she wanted. What she wanted was to have sex with my friend while I was overseas in combat. You would think I learned but no. I survived the war and came back to the States. I met a girl at work and invited her over for dinner. I cooked her the only meal I knew how to make. We had lots of wine and started making out on the couch. When I tried to take it a step forward, she said no. Being the nice guy that I am, I stopped, showed her the guest room because neither of us were in shape to drive. I wished her a good night and went into my bedroom. When I came out of my bathroom she was standing there naked and asked me if I always gave up so easily. I learned that some women want to be chased or feel like they are not easy. I am not talking about forcing yourself on a lady but rather to be a little more persistent in seducing her.

I was still Mr. Nice guy though. She was having sex with other guys and I was so naive that I did not recognize the taste in her when we had oral sex. She ended up having sex with my roommate. That was it for me. After that I started dating married, single, divorced, young and old women. I did not care. Turns out that if you are persistent that many women will give in. They have defended their honor enough and would tell me that they never do something like that on the first date, etc.. I had 30 sex partners in a few years. I will me immodest for awhile and say that I was good looking and girls were always attracted to me. Ex Football player and recent combat vet who was in the best shape of his life and very alpha. Many women are attracted to alpha men as is my wife of 44 years.

Since then, I am still respectful but not "nice". I act like an alpha male. I show jealousy which some women need. I dominate them in bed and take their orgasms from them, rather then have them work to get them. This new me enabled me to succeed in business to a level I never dreamed of. I was no longer willing to accept any raise I got or step aside to let someone pass over me for a new position. I climbed over the backs of many people to get where I am. I did not do anything dishonest or shameful. I just got very competitive and put in a lot of hard work to get ahead. I had to win and I started to manipulate the world around me to suite my needs. My wife is my equal so I am not some tyrant. In fact, I am very easy going. It is just that I am not that nice guy that girls take advantage of.

Short story. An old neighbor asked me and my wife to accompany him on a double date. He was complaining that after months of dating women, they all said that they only loved him as a friend or brother. It did not take long to see the problem. We were at a dance club, having drinks. People were making out and dancing dirty all around us. He did not even make a move to hold her hand or ask her to dance during a slow dance song. He even had a girl live with him in a separate bedroom and never had sex with her. Never asked her or tried to seduce her. The girl was taking advantage of him to get free rent without having to do anything other than date him a few times a week. 

Nice guys may finish first but they do not finish at all in the bedroom. Many women want a man. Someone to consume them. To make them feel that they are the sexiest woman in the world. As my wife says, she wanted me because I made her feel safe and protected. I dominated her in bed and she liked it. Not master/slave stuff but just me taking charge. You can change if I did. Not only changed my love life but also the rest of my life.


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## Young at Heart (Jan 6, 2015)

pegmale said:


> Hello,
> 
> I am at a loss. I have been married to a wonderful woman for 17 years and am very happy in all aspects of our marriage with the exception of, you guessed it, the physical side.
> 
> ...


As others have said you are a Nice Guy. I recommend 3 books that helped me resign from the Nice Guy club.

MW Davis, the Sex Starved Marriage
Glovers, No More Mr. Nice Guy
Chapman's 5 Languages of Love.

Davis and Glover will tell you much the same thing from much different perspectives. If you can understand and integrate what they teach you will solve most of your Nice Guy issues.

According to Glover, a Nice Guy is a man raised typically by women, who in school reported to female authority figures and sought and found a strong wife that he is codependent upon and whose validation he needs. He is clingy and needy, which are not attractive traits for a woman. 

A Nice Guy also practices something called Covert Contracts. That is he get's in his crazy codependent mind, that if he just does the laundry, gives his wife a massage, or puts love notes in her suitcase, that she will find it romantic and have sex with him. His wife will see through this obvious manipulative attempt at getting sex and ignore him and it. Then he will double down on his silly covert contract that she is not part of and do even more to get the sex and/or validation he is looking for.

I real man is not a jerk. A real man according to Glover and Davis "Get's a Life." That is he breaks the codependent cycle. He takes responsibility for his happiness. He doesn't do covert contracts. Usually this involves improving himself so that he takes pride in some accomplishments. He gets validation through his GAL activities (running half marathons, biking 100 mile rides, climbing mountains, or what ever it is.) He does his GAL activities with friends, but not his wife. He is not codependent upon his wife's participation. He can do training with his children to he has quality time with them. He can invite his wife to participate, but she doesn't need to.

For me to heal, I had to first drop all anger I had toward my wife. Then I had to heal my inner self. The hardest part was to stop doing covert contracts. Ultimately, it came down to discovering unconditional love, like I have for my children, but for my wife. If I could do something for my wife, because I expected nothing in return, then I could be certain it wasn't a covert contract. I started to do things to make my wife feel loved, with no expectation they would be returned. I told myself that I would do this as an experiment for a little over a year. It if worked in changing her view of me great, if not I would probably contemplate divorcing her as I was healed.

Good luck. Chapman's, Book is for when you have changed yourself and are ready to reconnect as a man with your wife.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

Is there a meaning behind your user name, @pegmale ?

That kind of has me stumped on how to answer your post.


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