# wife had affair... divorce or hope?



## alias (Jul 21, 2012)

Before 3 days ago I never thought I would be doing anything like this. I thought affairs were for people on Jerry Springer, etc... I discovered that my wife was having an affair through a letter that she was writing to an advice column. I confronted her immediately and she has admitted it and is entirely remorseful and we are both pretty devastated. Our one year anniversary was this month - I know, shockingly soon, not that it is ever OK. 

The details involve a coworker who I thought was just a good friend, even to the point of me hanging out with him on occasion. It dates back to November-ish (4 1/2 months after the wedding!) and she claims it was off an on and ended in March, but it is hard to believe. I first knew something was up when I found suspicious and suggestive text messages (mid June), which I confronted both of them on and they both gave me the same story that it was a weird and admittedly inappropriate flirting scenario. I believed, she stopped hanging out with him (though they still work together) but a month later and further digging I found the whole truth. 

A little background - we've been together for about 5 years, married 1 like I said. I think in any other case I would leave immediately, although I am trying to justify this situation - who knows why. Several years ago my wife who is otherwise a great and wonderful person told me that she had been struggling with an eating disorder for most of her life since age 14 (we're both 29). It's been something we've struggled with and she's gone through good phases and bad phases, and all I tried to do was help. At times she told me she didn't want help and that I was trying too hard or trying to "parent" her. I tried to back off when I was told, usually only to find the problem to be getting worse as I eased up. Anyway, without getting too much into the eating disorder it's left her pretty unstable, depressed, drinking too much (not otherwise a typical alcoholic), distant and sometimes resentful of me, and spending more and more time with other people (friends, coworkers, just going out) when I am not home, which was a lot the past two years as I just finished grad school this spring. I keep searching for reasons or faults of my own, and while I'm not perfect, even she has since admitted that it was nothing I had done, or dissatisfaction or lack of love or anything other than her own self-destructiveness and insecurities. I don't know whether to try to reconcile (unimaginable to live the rest of my life like this) or leave as soon as I can (also a guarantee of infinite sadness). 

She has of course now stated that she is ready to face the eating disorder and any surrounding issues and do anything that it takes. We've talked about leaving and going far away, starting over, reconnecting. At this point a new life is very tempting, but I can't quite shake the fact that it won't change the underlying issue which is that I don't know if I can take the risk of being with someone who is so damaged and could do that to me. On the one hand it's a no-brainer to leave, but I would be throwing away the rest of my life with someone who I love dearly and who loves me too. 

Advice? Any stories from other guys who have forgiven their wives and gone on to have a strong lasting marriage? Am I crazy for even considering? Please help. Thanks.


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## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

Cheating this early in the marriage is NEVER a good sign. You've been given a preview of what's to come. So what are you going to do 10, 15, 20 or more years from now if she cheats again and you've got children with her?

And please stop this "woe is me if I leave" victim hood pity party. If you leave, you will be sad temporarily, but you will find love again. Guarantee of infinite sadness? Hardly. *You're ONLY 29!*


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## SomedayDig (Jul 17, 2012)

I don't want to minimize ANY of your pain, man cuz it sucks being in your position. If you want to feel a bit better, feel free to read my thread.

That said, the eating disorder is a big deal, but it doesn't give her an excuse. Period. She needs to see someone and get to the bottom, deep issues she has.

Do you have a gut feeling as to what YOU want?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

Your decision of course as to reconsiling or not. BUT don't minimize that you have only been married one year and she is cheating.

Children? If not you may want to move on and find someone who can be faithful to you.

If you do decide to R, she will have to go full NC with the co-worker forever. If she still works with him she needs to change jobs.

I suggest that you do His Needs Her Needs together and set some boundaries.

Do not rug sweep this. Why did she think this was ok?


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## alias (Jul 21, 2012)

It's tough. I realize I am grasping at straws, basically just trying to poll to see if anyone else has succeeded in this type of situation. The earlyness yes is frightening - the positive spin perhaps being that it is the rock bottom she needed to hit in order to finally deal with the ED issue and finally become a fully functional adult and equal partner in the relationship (she admits to relying on me for stability, yet sometimes can treat me disrespectfully or take it for granted). I'm envisioning her finally developing into her full potential and being a more confident person, and weighing the risk of falling flat and having this happen again... Curious to see other replies - thanks for responding and nice to have someone to talk to!


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## alias (Jul 21, 2012)

No kids for the record...


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## anonymouskitty (Jun 5, 2012)

People reconcile when they've built a life together and more often than not the only motivation is the kids. You've married her for less than a year and as LM wisely says its a bad precedent, I'd consider divorce if I were you.


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## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

If there is one rule that's universal when it comes to workplace affairs, it's that as long as they work together, the affair is still on. That's almost guaranteed. And as long as the affair is still on, there will never be NC. And without NC, you can never have a true R. Take that to the bank.


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## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

anonymouskitty said:


> People reconcile *when they've built a life together and more often than not the only motivation is the kids*. You've married her for less than a year and as LM wisely says its a bad precedent, I'd consider divorce if I were you.


:iagree: :iagree: :iagree:

If we didn't have kids and I didn't invest 23 years of my life with my fWW....she would be SO kicked to the curb.


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## alias (Jul 21, 2012)

I know this makes us both sound crazy and like I said I never thought I'd be in this situation. We are otherwise good, down-to-earth people, even creative and up to this point we've had a very loving relationship and happy time together. That's why it's just so shocking and senseless to me. I guess I am trying to justify it (not that ANY excuse is valid) due to her existing psychological / emotional problems (eating disorder). It may be worth it to reconcile if she is finally ready to save herself and us from that. On the other hand I may have to cut my losses and her life, sad as it will be, would be out of my hands... I have no doubt she would fall apart completely.


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## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

From what you described, you tried to fix her. All that did was push her away. You need to accept you cannot fix her. She has to do that herself. And she only now wants to try and fix herself after she's already hurt you and damaged her marriage.


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## alias (Jul 21, 2012)

what's NC, no contact? and LordMayhem, I appreciate your frank advice, any advice is good advice, but why are you so sure? Sounds like you had a bad experience too and are bitter. Care to enlighten me? Not all cheaters are bad people, my wife included, she is just in a very very bad place. Still leaning towards leaving, just not sure yet - we have a marriage counseling session scheduled for Tues. Waiting to see how that goes. I am here at least til the end of the month regardless. Just found out Wednesday so it's fresh - I asked her to leave her job and she is looking into options - we don't have a ton of money so quitting on the spot is a little risky...


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## wolfloverb (Jul 21, 2012)

If someone isn't who you think they are, they reall never were. It is another thing to continue after marraige...(which i believe they did)... That shows a detached to the relationship kinda of mentality. I have been married for 24 years, (25 in Dec.), and I can tell you if forgiveness is truely asked for by her, give it to her.


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## alias (Jul 21, 2012)

i know - was it wrong to try to fix her? what else was i supposed to do? like i said we were happy, but these eating disorder (ED - not erectile dysfunction!) issues kept coming up. mainly she had no confidence, bad self image (she is gorgeous, trust me) both body and mind, and she avoided talking deeply about it which made her resent me when i tried to help... she did get therapy early on in our relationship and that's when things were best. it's been the past year or so that it's come up and i think eventually led to this in a round-about way. again - no excuse. just part of the equation.


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## alias (Jul 21, 2012)

"I can tell you if forgiveness is truely asked for by her, give it to her. "
this is why it's so hard to leave. i did leave immediately, the day of, just for the day, and i came back late that night. she begged and begged. i know the intentions and love are real and good. it's just i can never be sure if she's just so afraid to be alone that's the real reason she wants me to stay...


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## DavidWYoung (Feb 3, 2012)

This is my first post. I know exactly what you are going thru. I had the same problem in the first year of marriage. Please do not made the same mistake I made. Listen to these people. I did not have this info when I got married and I have been in alot of PAIN for twenty five years! The women that you married does NOT exist anymore, you are looking at a ghost image, she is not real. She will say ANYTHING to keep you as you were but she is NOT the woman you married. RUN! Run as fast as you can! There are so many good,loving, honest,happy,sexy,crazy,funny women if you will just accept that you made a mistake and run! My pain is from the moment I wake up till I go to sleep, please do not make the same mistake.


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## CleanJerkSnatch (Jul 18, 2012)

With only one year of marriage, wow, such gall.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## alias (Jul 21, 2012)

David, what happened? Did you stay with her and it burned you in the end? What was your relationship like before? I know no one will be able to truly see this but my wife is / was a beautiful person inside and out and sadly has been withered to a shell of her former self due to her instability... i agree that the person i knew may be gone.


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## zsu234 (Oct 25, 2010)

You need to leave her ASAP!


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## Complexity (Dec 31, 2011)

alias, are you staying because you want to "rescue" her from her demons/don't want to abandon her or because you genuinely love this woman?


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## alias (Jul 21, 2012)

i want all of those things. for the record i haven't "decided" to stay or go. after initially freaking out and leaving for a day i am trying to keep my work status ok and bide my time with things until we see a marriage counselor and at least talk about it. i do genuinely love her, deeply, she is the love of my life and despite the pain, throwing that away is just as painful even if i know it is the right decision. i also think it's an opportunity for a new beginning, and if i leave she will surely be doomed. she could be suicidal if i left, and although it would be out of my hands, i don't know how i could deal with it if she committed suicide on account of this... even if i am in the right.


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

First was it a physical affair or emotional?

Second, if it really ended back in March - why is she writing letters to advice columns now? What did the letter say?

You need to understand that cheaters do what's called trickle truth when caught - even when caught red handed. She is likely still holding back key facts, how much they met, what exactly they did, and how long it has lasted.

there is no room for negotiation in co-worker situations: She must immediately leave the job. Sure money is tight - but by having her continue to go to the job and see him every day you are selling any hope of recovery for $. Every time she sees him, she gets a nice dopamine hit in her brain which reaffirms the rush she got from the affair and makes you a non-desirable mate.

You know how she has been treating you for months? Pushing you away? Calling you controlling? Wanting space? - that is her brain reacting to the dopamine she gets from the OM. Her brain wants more dopamine hits - she realizes you and being married to you is a big thing keeping her from him and more hits. So she turns on you emotionally and pushes you away. 

I recommend you stop trying to justify the situation. It's time to change the game here: She needs to be working very very hard right now to give you reasons to stay with her after her betrayal.

she needs to show you that you can trust her some day again. Let her earn that trust, don't just blindly give it to her.

Before you do anything else - verify the affair it truly over. 

1. You need to have full open access to all her email, fb, phone.
2. If the OM contacts here in any way - she not to respond and to inform you immediately.
3. She has to leave her job immediately and begin looking for a new job.
4. See an attorney and learn your rights here. You may be able to get an annulment.
5. You both need to go get tested for STDs.
6. She doesn't get to say good bye to him. From this day forward her last contact can be no contact letter sent to him. After that nothing - not even a glance from the across the room.
7. Have her write down in reverse time order, everytime he and she met up, where they went etc. The you need to compare this against the story she's told you - you need to find the truth here before you can begin to heal.


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

alias said:


> i want all of those things. for the record i haven't "decided" to stay or go. after initially freaking out and leaving for a day i am trying to keep my work status ok and bide my time with things until we see a marriage counselor and at least talk about it. i do genuinely love her, deeply, she is the love of my life and despite the pain, throwing that away is just as painful even if i know it is the right decision. i also think it's an opportunity for a new beginning, and if i leave she will surely be doomed. she could be suicidal if i left, and although it would be out of my hands, i don't know how i could deal with it if she committed suicide on account of this... even if i am in the right.


You need to know that MC won't work while she still in the affair. MC is about building your marriage, it's not about convincing her not to cheat.


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## Jibril (May 23, 2012)

It is a complicated matter, Alias. There are a lot of factors that come into play in making your decision. The choice, ultimately, is yours to make. We can only give you advice based on out own experience. Fortunately, there is a lot of wisdom on these forums. Unfortunately, that won't make your decision, or the pain you feel, any easier.

As others have stated, reconcile helps when you've built-up a strong relationship with your spouse. In your case, you've been together for five years. Six months into your marriage, she strayed, and got involved with someone from work. That... doesn't bode well for your marriage at all. She willingly and easily tossed her marital vows to the wayside to pursue her affair. And she did this only _months_ after making that vow with you.

Does she still work with this fellow? If yes, then forget reconcile. It will _not_ work if she is still seeing him regularly. _Period_.

You seem like a "nice guy" in the negative sense of the word. Your actions and dramatic expressiveness gives me that impression.

You put a lot of effort into making _her_ happy, and "fixing" her issues. But the bottom line is, these are not _your_ problems. They are hers. Your "fathering" sounds a lot like subconscious controlling on your part.

You also seem to put your happiness on _her_ shoulders - this talk of "guaranteed infinite sadness" if you leave is, honestly, ridiculous, needy and overdramatic.

There is one thing, and only one thing, you can control in any relationship: yourself. How you act and when your boundaries are violated, determining what makes you happy, satisfying your needs and wants; these are things you can (and must) be in control of. Only _you_ can make yourself happy, much like only your wife can make herself happy. Only _you_ can dictate what you will/will not tolerate from others. Only _you_ can take care of your needs. 

So. Read No More Mr. Nice Guy, and work on bettering yourself. You are in very difficult spot, and your strong emotional attachment to your wife will make any choice you make _much_ harder than it needs to be.

As for your marriage: 

You're young. Your wife has poor boundaries, and an unhealthy lack of respect for you and the marriage. That she can betray her vows only half a year into the marriage says it all, really.

Divorce her. And work on strengthening yourself emotionally. That is my advice.


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## Complexity (Dec 31, 2011)

alias said:


> i want all of those things. for the record i haven't "decided" to stay or go. after initially freaking out and leaving for a day i am trying to keep my work status ok and bide my time with things until we see a marriage counselor and at least talk about it. i do genuinely love her, deeply, she is the love of my life and despite the pain, throwing that away is just as painful even if i know it is the right decision. i also think it's an opportunity for a new beginning, and if i leave she will surely be doomed. she could be suicidal if i left, and although it would be out of my hands, i don't know how i could deal with it if she committed suicide on account of this... even if i am in the right.


That's perfectly understandable and there's no need to rush to a decision. I suggest deciding after she deals with her ED. It's paramount she deals with this problem to completion. It's unfair that she takes it out on you and her confession doesn't mean this might not re-occur, especially given the extenuating circumstances.

Can you sense that she's genuinely remorseful?


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## alias (Jul 21, 2012)

i am fairly certain the affair is over, i am not so certain that i believe her as to when it ended, as the text messages i found were from only a couple months ago, which i confronted her about, and she says it ended in march. the guy in question is also married, for the record. and also f*cked up in the head. PSTD from afghanistan, cheating issues before his marriage (i know him, he talked to me about it) etc. so i think it was a validation effort for both parties. they both wanted to save their marriages though so i do believe that it is over. like i said though, hard to know the full truth.


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## alias (Jul 21, 2012)

i appreciate that jibril, and i'm not trying to be overdramatic, sorry. just deeply hurt, what can i say. that's the way things look now. 

and to Complexity,

"Can you sense that she's genuinely remorseful? "

yes, she was balling and screaming and it was terrible. she is not a bad person or out to get me, she just majorly f*cked up while in a bad mental / emotional state and the reality of what she did is finally coming to the surface.


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

I left something out - she must write a letter to the OMW coming clean about the affair. She needs to give it to you and you need to give it to the OMW.

This isn't revenge - this is her admitting her choice and coming clean. It's also informing the OMW about what her husband choose to do, and giving to her the power to make an informed decision knowing the truth. It's about respect for her as person.


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

alias said:


> "Can you sense that she's genuinely remorseful? "
> 
> yes, she was balling and screaming and it was terrible. she is not a bad person or out to get me, she just majorly f*cked up while in a bad mental / emotional state and the reality of what she did is finally coming to the surface.


Balling and screaming isn't remorse. They are emotional and dramatic - but they are not remorse.

Remorse is a deep feeling that sticks with you forever and it's something which truly drives you to fix things and do better. 

Be very careful of confusing "I'm really upset at getting caught, and upset at a bunch of stuff" AND remorse.

You get over upset - you never really get over remorse.


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## alias (Jul 21, 2012)

Shaggy said:


> I left something out - she must write a letter to the OMW coming clean about the affair. She needs to give it to you and you need to give it to the OMW.
> 
> This isn't revenge - this is her admitting her choice and coming clean. It's also informing the OMW about what her husband choose to do, and giving to her the power to make an informed decision knowing the truth. It's about respect for her as person.


i've thought about this too. it's better if she contacts her? i was thinking of doing it myself, as i know the woman. she knows already about the texts, which both my wife and the guy played off to us as "inappropriate flirting", but i assume she does not know the extent. he does also not know that i know the whole (or as much as i know) truth. i am thinking of waiting til i make a final decision to tell her / have my wife tell her though...


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

It's possible she cheated because she was, in her mind, somewhere, back where all bad thoughts go to fester, doing something to spite her dad, i.e., you.

I wish you both well.


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## alias (Jul 21, 2012)

Shaggy - how do you suggest I tell for certain then? She says she is willing to do anything, has contacted a bunch of counselors, started searching for other work options (though hasn't pulled the trigger on quitting current job). We're even contemplating a big move to get away from it all. This is all new - just starting to weigh my options. Counseling on Tues, we go from there...


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## costa200 (Jun 27, 2012)

> or leave as soon as I can (also a guarantee of infinite sadness).


Say what? Pretty romanticized idea of this you have. There is no way leaving this woman would mean "infinite sadness". You would morn and get over it, like everyone does. Believe it or not it's all about brain chemistry. 

You say she has an eating disorder. Is she overweight? If she is and you get her to normal weight, with this track record i'm going out in a limb and say she will probably cheat on you or outright trade you for another man. This woman is damaged and will always seek validation. Unless you're willing to have one of those open relationships you're in hot water.

But hey, it's your life. There are some people that say that they have strong marriages after an episode like this. So, it's on you!


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## TDSC60 (Dec 8, 2011)

alias said:


> I know this makes us both sound crazy and like I said I never thought I'd be in this situation. We are otherwise good, down-to-earth people, even creative and up to this point we've had a very loving relationship and happy time together. That's why it's just so shocking and senseless to me. I guess I am trying to justify it (not that ANY excuse is valid) due to her existing psychological / emotional problems (eating disorder). It may be worth it to reconcile if she is finally ready to save herself and us from that. On the other hand I may have to cut my losses and her life, sad as it will be, would be out of my hands... I have no doubt she would fall apart completely.


Forget the eating disorder. Lots of people have eating disorders and they do not cheat on their spouse. You are trying to justify/blame what she did as due to the disorder and associated mental health problems. That is not why she cheated. It goes deeper, much deeper.

Married only 4-5 months when she started the affair should be an automatic divorce. The thing about infidelity is that does not go away, cannot be removed by surgery, it is now a part of your life with or without her. You may someday forgive, but you will never forget. This will always be apart of your marriage if you decide to stay. She will always be the one who was screwing another man after only 4-5 months.

You also seem to be feeling guilty about what SHE might go through if you divorce. Really? She did this, she made a choice to do it, she lied to you, she betrayed you knowing it would probably mean divorce if you found out. Now you are considering it YOUR fault that she may have to reap what she has sown.

It is your life and your choice, but given the circumstances, I say run and don't look back.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

The 6 months in thing is a red herring, IMO. You were together for years, so the affair happened in year five of your relationship. 

You love her. If you leave her, she crumble, you think.

Could you cope with any guilty feelings if she does? 

It's not any easy ask of you, either way.


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## ShootMePlz! (Oct 5, 2008)

Has she told you all then when and where's?

Also the OM's wife needs to know and the best way to make sure its over is to ensure the betrayed wife monitors her husband also.


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## alias (Jul 21, 2012)

TDSC60 i pretty much agree with you, i am just now starting to talk this out (albeit online) rather than in my head... helps me make sense of a senseless situation.

costa200 - my take is that if i leave, i will be extremely sad and broken, guaranteed. sure, life goes on, i will grow and maybe again be happy. but i would never know the alternative, if i try to stay. i feel like if some people say that there is hope after infidelity that i may want to at least see if it's possible. still not sure. to answer your question - no she is not overweight at all. she is thin (not anorexic scrawny), fit, and very sexy. it's a control thing more than a "i need to be skinnier" thing. her mom had an eating disorder as well, if that plays into it. EDs are very very complex, i have realized in the last few years, and not so cut and dry as people think, much like i used to think before i lived with a woman who had one. 

i'm not trying to "justify" anything for any end result, just trying to figure out the origins of this. i don't think it's quite so simple as "she wasn't happy in the marriage, she cheated", or at least i hope not...


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## keko (Mar 21, 2012)

Short marriage, no kids and she's already cheating? RUN!


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## TDSC60 (Dec 8, 2011)

MattMatt said:


> The 6 months in thing is a red herring, IMO. You were together for years, so the affair happened in year five of your relationship.
> 
> You love her. If you leave her, she crumble, you think.
> 
> ...


I have to disagree. A relationship does not equate to a marriage. If it did, then why marry at all.

If you want to dissolve a relationship you can just walk away.

I see the logic in what you are saying, but to me it just isn't the same.


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## alias (Jul 21, 2012)

OK folks, sincere thanks for all the replies, frank or unsettling as some may be. I am going out for a while but I will tune back in later. Thank you!


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## 67flh (Sep 26, 2011)

alias, my first wife cheated 8 months into our marriage,i know you love her,hell she probable loves you(sorta), but whats she gonna do when the years roll by, kids driving you wacko, house payments,etc. my bet it to pack you things and move on,just thank god you saw her true self now.


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## workindad (May 7, 2011)

Alias, I feel for you, you are in a tough spot because of some bad decisions your new wife made.

Understand that feedback you've been given is sound. If she cheated this early in a marriage, how will things be in the future after you've been together for many years and additional life pressures (kids, aging parents, etc.) are added to the mix.

Keep in mind, if you do file for divorce... you can stop before it is finalized should reconciliation be the route you wish to go.

My D happened in my 40s. There is life after D and, in my case anyway, it is a better one. 

All the best
WD


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

TDSC60 said:


> I have to disagree. A relationship does not equate to a marriage. If it did, then why marry at all.
> 
> If you want to dissolve a relationship you can just walk away.
> 
> I see the logic in what you are saying, but to me it just isn't the same.


Well, yes... but it depends if a couple is living together beforehand. 

Sometimes people take each other for granted, overlaid with the mental health issues and you have a recipe for an explosive situation. Which happened here.

I think she was acting like a naughty little girl to spite her daddy. But this might have been hidden so deep that not even she realised this motivation to cheat.

IF this is the case, the problem started before they got married.


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## TDSC60 (Dec 8, 2011)

alias said:


> i'm not trying to "justify" anything for any end result, just trying to figure out the origins of this. i don't think it's quite so simple as "she wasn't happy in the marriage, she cheated", or at least i hope not...


If you want to go the mental route - she did it to fulfill a "need" or "needs" that were not being met by you. 

Like you said, mental disorders are not something that is cut and dried and can take years or even a lifetime to sort out and recover.

Say she does go into intensive counseling, can you stay married and wait for years knowing that there are absolutely no guarantee that she will recover? That there is every possibility (even likely) that she could do the same thing again given the same circumstances (working with a male who shows her attention)?

Are you up for that?

There are successful R stories about, but most of them do involve children or at least several years of marriage.


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## TDSC60 (Dec 8, 2011)

MattMatt said:


> Well, yes... but it depends if a couple is living together beforehand.
> 
> Sometimes people take each other for granted, overlaid with the mental health issues and you have a recipe for an explosive situation. Which happened here.
> 
> ...


I do agree that the problem goes deeper. To her core in fact.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

TDSC60 said:


> I do agree that the problem goes deeper. To her core in fact.


Oh. Very deep counselling is advisable, I think.

The Eating disorder coupled with cheating (but only after marriage) might point to something in the past that needs to be addressed.


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

Wow..This guy is in so much denial that it scares me. And he has the white knight syndrome and wants to fix her. This will end bad, real bad!!

OP, find out how long this has been going on. Get all the details. Get access to her email and Facebook. It is likely that she did stuff with him that she always denied you. The truth of the affair will come over a period of time and each time a new truth comes out, it will break your hear again and again.

Inform the OM's wife immediately. Most affairs stop and start many times. Just like an addict who relapses, an affair is an addiction your wife can relapse into. 

1 year is too short in to the marriage. Get an annulment and start dating again(with her) if you want to. Get a post-nup. Don't have kids anytime in the next few years until the trust is re-established.


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## jnj express (Mar 28, 2011)

1st---don't get into the mindset, that this counselor, is gonna just wave a wand, and have all the answers, and everything will work out---there are counselors, and there are counselors

This boils down to what one person, and one person only wants/needs to decide---YOU

You are the one that has to live the rest of your life with this woman, you are the one that has to look at/touch/talk to---her the rest of your life---It boils down to will these things happen in a life of misery, or can you truly live with her, and enjoy some sort of a decent happy life----No counselor, can decide that for you---only YOU can decide that for you.

What we do know is that, your wife had some problems in the mge., but instead of truly trying to work them out with the man she has lived with for 6 yrs, the man she married, the man that said he had her back---she said screw you H., I am gonna handle my problems by taking a lover, and relieving my situation that way

OK, so she took her lover, and what did you get out of it---you now have lack of trust, gone is your carefree lifestyle, gone is your peace of mind, you will now become a parole officer, from now on for the rest of the time you stay with her, if anything out of the ordinary occurs, or something you don't like happens, your antennea will rise, and then you are gonna go thru this whole process all over again---IS THAT REALLY WHAT YOU WANT

You definitely know one thing, your wife knows how to lie/connive/manipulate/ decieve----can you truthfully tell me, she hasn't already cheated on you prior to your wedding, while you were together---NO YOU CAN'T, cuz you didn't even know this present A. existed---till she slipped up

Question was put to you before---when, timewise, after the A., was, possibly, over, did the request to the advise column go out.

You will do what you want, we are only those who give you our take on things---you seem to want to throw out excuse after excuse, on every point given you, about what to do

You need to stop throwing out the excuses, take it all in, take plenty of time, and figure it out for yourself

But know this---if you decide to R., her job dissapears as of yesterday, money or no money

You need to also make her sign a post--nup, she needs to learn to communicate, and not push away your attempts to help---and the biggest factor at this point, why IS SHE CLINGING to you

Is it cuz she doesn't wanna face the world on her own, or does she really want this to work out----Please do not tell me how she loves you---one who loves another, does not knowingly do what she did to you----at your point in this mge. 5 months in, when this all probably started---no matter what problems the 2 of you had---there should have been no one else---early part of a mge, the spouses, are starry-eyed lovers, and no one else in the worl even exists to the two newly marrieds---your wife, what does she do, she decided due to some problems in the mge, that she would justify happily/willingly taking another man inside of her, AT A TIME IN THE MGE. WHEN NO OTHER MAN SHOULD HAVE EVEN EXISTED TO HER

You got a long hard row to hoe---good luck to you, you are gonna need it.


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## Will_Kane (Feb 26, 2012)

alias, we have seen many people like you come and post in this forum just like you are. Your situation is not unique.

There are some bitter people on this website, but so far, none of those have posted on this thread.

The people posting on this thread have seen people like you come and go and come back to these forums. They are speaking not only from their own experience, but from the experiences of others that have posted here.

That experience is available to you anytime you want to look. Take a look at the other threads here, now and in the past, and you will see what works and what doesn't work when it comes to dealing with infidelity. I don't think there's a single thread on here where the betrayed spouse got the full truth right away. Many times, the real truth turned out to be quite a bit worse than the original story.

If you do look at the other threads here, you will realize that cheaters act remarkably similar to each other. Betrayed spouses also act remarkably similar to each other.

The cheaters always minimize what happened, shorten the time frames, downplay how physical the affair became, downplay the feelings expressed to each other, and just generally lie. People here refer to it as trickle truth. As good of liars that the cheaters are while they are hiding the affair from you, they are almost as bad liars after you have found out. They tell stories that don't make a bit of sense. 

*We out here in cyberspace, who have no preconceived assumptions of how honest and good your spouse is, usually can quite easily see how the story does not make sense and poke a lot of holes in it.*

Cheaters lie. A good place to start after discovering an affair is to *assume the cheater is lying unless the cheater's actions matches the cheater's words*. At the very least, be skeptical and do not automatically assume your cheater is telling you the truth.

The problem is, the betrayed spouse usually has the cheater on a pedestal and is blinded by both the cheater's sterling past reputation and the betrayed spouse's own wishful thinking, not wanting to believe that their wonderful spouse could do such a thing. To listen to many betrayed spouses post here, even after they know their spouse is a liar and a cheater, you would think that they were about to build a statue of the cheater in front of the Museum of Honesty the way the betrayed spouses tell it.

Many betrayed spouses don't seem to be able to see how their cheater's story is full of holes until later on, when they find out more and more omitted or lied about details, a little at a time. That is called trickle truth.

If you want to see if your wife's story makes sense, get all the key details. Find out the history of the affair, from the first thought in your wife's head that she was attracted to the other man, to the first inappropriate comment from either of them, to the first time she knew she was going to have sex with him, to what she was thinking about you while all of this was going on. Then, put yourself in her shoes. Sit down, spend about an hour or two, and become her. Make believe you are her, go through her actions in your head, and see if they make sense.


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## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

alias said:


> what's NC, no contact? and LordMayhem, I appreciate your frank advice, any advice is good advice, but why are you so sure? Sounds like you had a bad experience too and are bitter. Care to enlighten me?


Yes, NC means No Contact. Read the link for newbies in my signature. There's a wealth of information in that thread, including all the common acronyms used on the board that have to deal with infidelity.

I've been betrayed too, but I'm not bitter, just experienced. In fact, everyone here has been involved infidelity, either as a BS, a WS, or both (mad hatter). 



alias said:


> Not all cheaters are bad people, my wife included, she is just in a very very bad place.


Agreed. Not all cheaters are bad people, and not all BSs are good people either. She's in a bad place because she chose to be, in spite of you trying to help her. It was not a mistake either. She willingly and willfully took each step towards banging another man. Think about it. All the lies that she said, all the actions that she took, all culminating in her spreading her legs for her coworker and then hiding it from you and lying about it.



alias said:


> Still leaning towards leaving, just not sure yet - we have a marriage counseling session scheduled for Tues. Waiting to see how that goes.





alias said:


> I am here at least til the end of the month regardless. Just found out Wednesday so it's fresh -


Indeed. Look up the stages of grief. You're in the initial shock and denial stage. Your first instinct right now is to save your marriage at all costs. Eventually this will fade and you will become angry once the reality finally hits you.



alias said:


> I asked her to leave her job and she is looking into options - we don't have a ton of money so quitting on the spot is a little risky...


There is only one option - and that is to leave her job. At the very minimum, she should be looking for another job, which she should be doing at this moment. The job market is ONLINE, so she should be on the computer right now searching for a job, not on facebook or any other program talking to another man.


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

alias said:


> i've thought about this too. it's better if she contacts her? i was thinking of doing it myself, as i know the woman. she knows already about the texts, which both my wife and the guy played off to us as "inappropriate flirting", but i assume she does not know the extent. he does also not know that i know the whole (or as much as i know) truth. i am thinking of waiting til i make a final decision to tell her / have my wife tell her though...


I suggest she write the letter and you read it and deliver it. that means your wife had to throw her lover under the bus (good!) and it means you know it got to the OMW.


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

alias said:


> Shaggy - how do you suggest I tell for certain then? She says she is willing to do anything, has contacted a bunch of counselors, started searching for other work options (though hasn't pulled the trigger on quitting current job). We're even contemplating a big move to get away from it all. This is all new - just starting to weigh my options. Counseling on Tues, we go from there...


Her leaving her job is both an act of faith in the marriage, but also her showing she ending the affair.

Will you be bankrupt if she quits monday or just broke? Broke you can live with, it's cheaper than D.


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## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

alias said:


> i am fairly certain the affair is over...


Hey folks, how many times have we heard this line? 


Too many times.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

fuseleer's wife had 3 miscarriages in one year, plus her grandfather died. So some 6 months later, she reconnected with an old school friend and lied up and down to her husband and said he was just a friend. That she was depressed, etc. Then he found some emails detailing the sexual nature of the affair, after she had lied and said she'd cut ties to the OM. He was none the wiser up to that point. (The OM is a criminal under house arrest at his parents'!)

The point is, bad things happen to people. And they happen to everyone. If they explained affairs, we'd all be having 'em. But we don't. Plenty of women have eating disorders and low self-esteem, and they don't cheat. It gives those disorders a reputation they don't deserve, they're bad enough as it is.

Events like these help us understand the WS, but as I hope you see now, they never justify affairs. You might as well say, our house burned down, or our daughter has cancer, or I was bored. The reasons only matter insofar as they get the damaged person understanding that they ARE loveable and stop trying to prove otherwise. That takes the work of an excellent counselor; each human being has to learn self-love and self-respect for themselves.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

I'm very suspicious that the affair didn't fully end since she claims it was in March - 4 months ago and actually longer than the claimed time line for the affair, yet she's writing advice columns?

You still haven't mentioned what the letter was about.


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## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

Shaggy said:


> I'm very suspicious that the affair didn't fully end since she claims it was in March - 4 months ago and actually longer than the claimed time line for the affair, yet she's writing advice columns?
> 
> You still haven't mentioned what the letter was about.


Heck, he still hasn't explained how he found out about her writing to the advice column, if it was and EA or PA, etc. He's more interested in explaining her ED. 

But yes, I agree. The affair allegedly ended in March, yet he only found out a few days ago that she's sending a letter to an advice column. There is a 4 month discrepancy here. This does not make sense....unless the affair is still on, which wouldn't be surprising.

It's part of the cheater script that when confronted on DDay, the WS will claim the affair was already over, and this is just the beginning of the trickle truth. The reality is usually the affair is underground.


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## Acabado (May 13, 2012)

> she claims it was off an on and ended in March, but it is hard to believe. I first knew something was up when I found suspicious and suggestive text messages (mid June)


Asuming March date is true a milestone (they always lie, and minimize the whole thing) it means last time they f0cked. Obviously the EA was still full force by Jun when you busted it, at the very least. If you keep diggin (not asking her, but on your own, PC/phone/Bank) you will get a better picture. It also means the date Nov she gave it was also just the start of the PA; she doesn't count the flirty -innapropiate behavior-EA previous to the full blown PA, nor likely making out sessions, etc. Who knows if this was going on around your wedding date, or even before. Keep digging. She needs to come clean, to pull a calendar and start writing a timeline.


Another thing. She not only has to come clean about this affair, I suspect she has no boundaires and behave innppropiately at a dayly basis. Educate your self about EAs, read Not just friends (she should too) nad ask her to come clean. I also suspect she has a story of cheating before you. She needs to face it as a whole thing.

Tell BW, asap.

Your wife is dealing with those issues since early adolescence. How much time are you willing to wait to believe she's "fixed". Is it possible for her to stop being a cheater with those deep rooted issues? her tendency to get afirmed by males using sex is something huge to overcome.

Sorry man


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## Will_Kane (Feb 26, 2012)

*Timeline:*

*2 years ago*: _"spending more and more time with other people (friends, coworkers, just going out) when I am not home, which was a lot the past two years" _ Did the affair start this far back, when the first red flags appeared? That is what many looking at this thread are going to suspect.

*1 year ago*: Got married. Perhaps not recognizing red flag of spending more time with other people, or rationalizing it.

*8 months ago*: Started affair. _"It dates back to November-ish (4 1/2 months after the wedding!)"_ November-ish? She can't remember when? Sounds like she may be minimizing here. What is November-ish? October? September? December of the previous year? You've known for sure about this since Wednesday, your cheater should at least have been able to tell you when it started by now. Sounds like she may be trying to leave this vague, like she may not want to be pinned down on the starting date. I don't think it's a good sign. Why did she start the affair?

*4 months ago (March):* Affair ended (so she says). _"she claims it was off an on and ended in March, but it is hard to believe."_ I have to agree with you, it is hard to believe. 

Who ended the affair and why? 

If the affair did end in March, why did you find inappropriate communications in June, and why was she writing a letter to an advice column three days ago?

If you didn't catch the affair on your own, was she ever going to tell you about it? Would she continue to work with the other man and let you and him hang out together, and act all friendly with each other when you saw each other? Has she let you hang out with other man since the affair started, so you are there being very friendly with him while he is smiling back at you, laughing and joking with you, all the while smirking to himself that he is banging your wife? If so, how disrespectful to you!

*One month ago (mid-June):* You found suggestive texts, she and he both lied and denied an affair, both gave the same lie (did they plan on how to lie if they got caught?) (which, incidentally, is the same lie every cheater tells when their spouse finds a "suggestive" text - they always lie and say it was just flirting). You believed them. She stopped hanging out with him.

_"I first knew something was up when I found suspicious and suggestive text messages (mid June), which I confronted both of them on and they both gave me the same story that it was a weird and admittedly inappropriate flirting scenario. I believed, she stopped hanging out with him (though they still work together)"_

So, the affair was over in March, but she still was hanging out with him in mid-June? You know what we're going to say, right? Yeah, affair probably was still going on if they still were hanging out outside of work. Heck, it could still be going on to this day if they see each other at work. There's another thread right now where the cheating wife claimed she ended all contact but still worked with the other man and the husband (by placing a voice-activated recorder in her car) found out that his cheating wife was still giving the other man blowjobs in the parking lot where they work.

*3 days ago (Wednesday July 18):* You didn't really believe that your wife had told you the truth, because you "kept digging" and you found out your wife was writing a letter to an advice columnist about her affair.

She admitted the affair, but probably is minimizing. Do you want to know when the affair really started and when it really ended? Can your wife show you any proof of when it first started or when it ended? If you do want the truth, and your wife can't or won't show you proof (such as emails, texts, etc.), then the only way you may get the truth is through polygraph. Maybe what your wife has told you already is bad enough, and you don't care all that much if she is minimizing. You have to live with it, not us.

_"I discovered that my wife was having an affair through a letter that she was writing to an advice column. I confronted her immediately and she has admitted it and is entirely remorseful and we are both pretty devastated. Our one year anniversary was this month - I know, shockingly soon, not that it is ever OK. "_

*Some typical betrayed spouse and cheating spouse quotes:* (Read these things you posted, then put yourself in our shoes - what advice would you give if someone came to you with this story?)

_"I am trying to justify this situation - who knows why."_ 

*"my wife who is otherwise a great and wonderful person"*

_"it's left her pretty *unstable, depressed, drinking too much *(not otherwise a typical alcoholic), *distant and sometimes resentful of me, and spending more and more time with other people* (friends, coworkers, just going out) when I am not home,"_

_"I don't know if I can take the risk of being with *someone who is so damaged*"_

_"it is the rock bottom she needed to hit in order to finally deal"_

_"... and *finally become a fully functional adult and equal partner* in the relationship"_

_"(she admits to relying on me for stability, yet sometimes *can treat me disrespectfully or take it for granted*)."_

_I know this makes us both sound crazy _

_We are otherwise good, down-to-earth people_, 

_"up to this point we've had a very loving relationship and happy time together."

"it's just so shocking and senseless to me." 

"I guess I am trying to justify it"

"(not that ANY excuse is valid) due to her existing psychological / emotional problems"

"I may have to cut my losses and her life, sad as it will be, would be out of my hands... *I have no doubt she would fall apart completely*."

"I asked her to leave her job and *she is looking into options*"

"she begged and begged. i know the intentions and love are real and good."

"it's just i *can never be sure if she's just so afraid to be alone *that's the real reason she wants me to stay... "

"I know no one will be able to truly see this but my wife is / was a beautiful person inside and out and sadly has been withered to a shell of her former self due to her instability... "

"i agree that the person i knew may be gone"I]_


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## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

That was very well put together Will_Kane. :smthumbup:


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

He's received a ton of great advice on this thread. Leaving the job. Nc letter to om. Throwing him under the bus by writing to omw. Not getting to say goodbye to om. These are the types of consequences she has to face to show true remorse. But op is actively ignoring this advice. He's a rug sweeper. He'll figure it out soon enough after her guilt at getting caught wears off and he gets the ilybinilwy speech.


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## alias (Jul 21, 2012)

guys, give me a break here. i admit to being totally in shock. i am not "actively ignoring advice". i stumbled upon this forum less than 24 hrs ago to compile advice and try to find people who have had experiences similar to mine. i was naively hoping to find some success stories, but i expected they would be rare. i am dealing with the reality of the situation but there are still plenty of questions. i haven't talked to my wife today due to schedule conflicts but tomorrow will be moving forward with some of the advice i've received in this thread. i.e. asking for complete transparency, complete disclosure of details / timeline (how can i ever prove any of this based on her word alone?), and demanding that she at least give notice of leaving her job and ceasing all contact with the guy, and maybe even telling his wife. i am hesitant on that because i know her and she will flip out, and i want to stay calm cool and collected as long as possible while i plan my approach. just give me a little slack here fellas, i am trying to make an educated decision on what to do. 

also, what is this: "the ilybinilwy speech"?

to clear up a couple points that people are vague on... 

i discovered the texts mid june. that was its own debacle. after an unrelated random argument i dug deeper and i discovered the letter to the advice column actually as part of an unsent email in her "drafts" folder. the weird part is, is that it was copied / pasted from a word document, which she says was written long ago (no exact date) and she hid it in the email because she knew i was snooping her computer (which was obviously justified and we both know it, she's not guilting me about it). i would post the details of the letter (it was unfinished) but i copied it to a sticky note on my computer and then dragged it off the screen and lost it - no lie. anyone know how to get it back? here's a couple lines i remember:

"I'm a 29 yr old female bla bla bla... my husband is my best friend, my soulmate, does more than his share of the housework, and puts up with a lot from me... [here's a part i haven't mentioned yet:]...i am finding myself no longer attracted to him though i still love him dearly. to make matters worse i am having an affair with a co-worker who i am very physically attracted to. the man is not half the man my husband is nor do i love him [the one redeeming line that i remember]..."

my memory trails of around there and it was unfinished and unsent. 

also whoever is reading too much into the "daddy issue" thing, it's not that. her dad is a great guy and had nothing to do with it. i think the issue was me (formerly pretty together and with it) trying to help her with all these issues which to her felt like i was trying to "parent" her, which isn't the same thing. it's not like there's some underlying dad issue or something, just she thought she was beneath me or something because i was trying to help her with these problems... 

enough for now. tomorrow will be progress, one way or another, and i will check back. THANK YOU. and please don't judge!


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## martyc47 (Oct 20, 2011)

Maybe you aren't finding the success stories you want to find, but they are out there. Plus you might define a success only as reconciliation, but there are other ways to success, including avoiding a FALSE reconciliation- which it what will DEFINITELY happen if you decide to try a one-sided reconciliation. It takes two people, and often the BS seems to look at this as "Should I forgive him/her and take them back?" when in reality there is no taking someone back while they are still in an affair. 

People here are telling you the MINIMUM required things you MUST do if you want to reconcile. It may seem like a lot and overwhelming, but believe me if you don't you are just going to be back here talking about the next affair or the divorce a year from now. People here speak of experience and seeing the same things over and over.

I know what it's like. I thought I was living in some soap opera I never expected and that my wife would never do that thing, it would never happen to me, etc. And at first I was too nice because of my own wife's mental issues, death in family, etc. But all that did was allow the unacceptable behavior to continue. I have 2 young children, if there were no children I would have been gone-1000 miles away the next day- and my wife "only" had EAs.

You have to at minimum:
1. EXPOSE- if the guy has a wife, there is no reason she hasn't been informed at this point. You've already received plenty of advice here. The usual objections to this are all BS and they usually include: not wanting to hurt the OMW ( you didn't , the cheaters did) or hurting the cheating spouse ( she might get mad at you for awhile and you might not want to risk that, but it's better than condoning her affair. If you make everything easy for her she will continue).

2. Work with OM must stop. If that means wife has to quit her job so be it. If she chooses the job over the marriage she is really choosing the affair. It's pretty simple.

3. Transparency. You can't reconcile with the trickle truth- that stuff is going to get out eventually and/or you are going to torture your mind over it.

There are some more, but I think it's been well covered with advice here. One thing though- even though you've been cheated on and it sucks, you are in a Good position here. You have no kids, you have nothing really complicating this relationship and holding you in it. If you really want to reconcile, you have the right to make demands of your wife and what she needs to do if she wants the marriage. So make them. No need to grovel to her. She's the one who messed up and she has work to do. If she doesn't-walk. What's she going to do? She already cheated and broke the marriage.


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

Heaven forbid you upset your wife and make the affair inconvienent and more uncomfortable then it needs to be. As long as you stop protecting your marriage you won't be labled controlling and as long as you tolorate sharing your wife she will be happy.

I hope this doesn't sound to judgemental and we all know that if we work hard enough we can change poeple even if they don't want to change. As long as we tolorate the bad things it will all go away.

I know this sounds crazy b/c it is!

Sorry for the sarcasim, but please reread your thread, I have no emotional connection and the only thing I base my perceptions on is what you wrote and my experience. 

I know a guy that had the same mind set as you and it lead him to 13 yrs of hell while his wife found it easier and easier to sleep with different men. So sure your chcick will be straight for a few years after her 1st affair and then the next one will get easier and then the one after that will be a piece of cake. Hell it will be a life style for her.

Years will go by and with a few kids it won't matter any more, you will do your thing and she will do her thing. Resentment will build and the behaviors that generated the 1st affair so many years ago will be engrained and as long as you stay focused on your career, her GNO (girls night out) wont matter....hell after all the resentment you have for each other... it will be a good thing that you don't have to spend time together. 

Its not worth it brother, face this crap head on and deal with this women now, b/c years from now is this the person you can trust to be around to empty your bed pan or help you off the toliet when you 100yrs old?

It not about keeping her happy while she walks all over your emotions, its about commanding respect and facing the consequences for screwing around on you.

You diserve good things , don't let anyone tell you different!


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## aug (Aug 21, 2011)

Consider this: she just married you. A few months go by, she's already having an affair.

Shouldn't there be a period of honeymoon and euphoria of being a newlywed? Shouldn't the honeymoon phase of a marriage last more than mere months? I would think this lost of respect and value for the marriage this early is a great big giant red flag.

No matter how you look at it, I cant see a positive in her having another lover so quickly.

No kids, so get out now. Get out before kids and commitment tie you to her. You are still young. Dont lock yourself in to this type of person. She can lock you into becoming a bitter broken old man.

Your marriage is so short, you should look into getting it annulled.

Oh, get STD tested. And do not ever lock yourself into a joint financial account or loan, assets, etc. with her.


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

aug said:


> Consider this: she just married you. A few months go by, she's already having an affair.
> 
> *Shouldn't there be a period of honeymoon and euphoria of being a newlywed? Shouldn't the honeymoon phase of a marriage last more than mere months? I would think this lost of respect and value for the marriage this early is a great big giant red flag.*
> 
> ...



:iagree:

That is what I'm thinking.
Something is wrong with her head .,because just only after a few months of marriage,she admitted to have lost attraction for him,whilst at the same time admitting that the fellow she is attracted to is cannot match up to her husband.

She is living in a fantasy world.
On one hand she is saying that her husband is her knight in shining armour,whilst at the same time cavorting with the villain.

She knows she has her husband under her thumb.
She gives the term " eating cake " a new meaning.


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## foberm2010 (Jul 22, 2012)

.. my husband is my best friend, my soulmate, does more than his share of the housework, and puts up with a lot from me... [here's a part i haven't mentioned yet:]...i am finding myself no longer attracted to him though i still love him dearly. to make matters worse i am having an affair with a co-worker who i am very physically attracted to. the man is not half the man my husband is nor do i love him 


I dont remember where but i have read this text somewhere on the net , i think it was in a affair support forum dr.cool or something or it was in an online advice column i can not be sure, but it was sent. I remember it because i had a major triger because of it .


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

lordmayhem said:


> Heck, he still hasn't explained how he found out about her writing to the advice column, if it was and EA or PA, etc. He's more interested in explaining her ED.
> 
> But yes, I agree. The affair allegedly ended in March, yet he only found out a few days ago that she's sending a letter to an advice column. There is a 4 month discrepancy here. This does not make sense....unless the affair is still on, which wouldn't be surprising.
> 
> It's part of the cheater script that when confronted on DDay, the WS will claim the affair was already over, and this is just the beginning of the trickle truth. The reality is usually the affair is underground.


Unless the letter is along the lines of: "


> Dear Marge Proops, xx months ago, I had an affair only yy months after marrying. Every time I seem my kind, loving, sweet husband I want to die. What can I do? Yours, former cheater"


Or not. Damn.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

alias said:


> guys, give me a break here. i admit to being totally in shock. i am not "actively ignoring advice". i stumbled upon this forum less than 24 hrs ago to compile advice and try to find people who have had experiences similar to mine. i was naively hoping to find some success stories, but i expected they would be rare. i am dealing with the reality of the situation but there are still plenty of questions. i haven't talked to my wife today due to schedule conflicts but tomorrow will be moving forward with some of the advice i've received in this thread. i.e. asking for complete transparency, complete disclosure of details / timeline (how can i ever prove any of this based on her word alone?), and demanding that she at least give notice of leaving her job and ceasing all contact with the guy, and maybe even telling his wife. i am hesitant on that because i know her and she will flip out, and i want to stay calm cool and collected as long as possible while i plan my approach. just give me a little slack here fellas, i am trying to make an educated decision on what to do.
> 
> also, what is this: "the ilybinilwy speech"?
> 
> ...


*Do a general search on drive C using a key word you can remember.*

A daddy issue -for want of a better term- is one of the things a counsellor looks for. If only to dismiss it.

My wife has similar problems with me. She is an aspie and resents it when I have to act like a dad, rather than a husband when she slips into acting in a child like way.


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

Alias,

You have gotten a lot of advice from good people.

You also feel some of us are judging you and your wife. You will realize in time that we are not. Battered Spouse's go into a fog of their own when they find out that the person they love is or has been in an Affair. 

This is part of the shock you are in from confirming that your wife cheated on you. This is normal.

You have to make a decision regarding the future of your marriage but I suggest you leave that decision aside for now until your emotions have calmed down.

And your wife crying hysterically is not remorse. It is from being found out and feeling guilty. She has hurt you and she knows it. 

You are going to realize that the A has nothing to do with you. It is your wife that has the ED and most likely very low self esteem/horrible personal boundaries.

You know you need to deal with the A first and everyone before me has laid out the ground rules for you. You need to take control now, not your wife.

What I recommend you do is read some of the threads on TAM so you can learn what to do and more importantly what not to do!

Three posters that have given you good advice are Lord Mayhem, The Count and The Guy. Read their threads. It will be enlightening for you. Because it can show you what your future might be like good or bad.

But most importantly, end her A. Expose it to the OMW and yes, your families. Because I think no matter what you do you are going to need your families support for your wife whether your decide to R or D.

Good Luck,

HM64


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## Will_Kane (Feb 26, 2012)

*also, what is this: "the ilybinilwy speech"?*

I LOVE YOU BUT I'M NOT IN LOVE WITH YOU (ILYBINILWY)

Sometimes, it sounds like this:

*...i am finding myself no longer attracted to him though i still love him dearly.*


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## Will_Kane (Feb 26, 2012)

*asking for complete transparency, complete disclosure of details / timeline (how can i ever prove any of this based on her word alone?), *

You can't ever prove it based on her word alone. But you should be able to tell whether it makes sense or not. 

If it does not make sense, it probably is not true.

You should be able to verify some of the details of the story independently - places, times, etc.

The cheaters usually cannot spin a good lie full of details that will hold up to reasonable scrutiny and questioning.


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## TDSC60 (Dec 8, 2011)

Will_Kane said:


> *also, what is this: "the ilybinilwy speech"?*
> 
> I LOVE YOU BUT I'M NOT IN LOVE WITH YOU (ILYBINILWY)
> 
> ...


Another way to say it is "I love my husband like a really close friend - but not in love with him as a lover or sexual partner that I have the "hots" for."

Sorry dude.

She is not "In love with you" and given the timeline of what you have written, she probably was not in love with you when you married. 

Lawyer. Annulment if possible. Divorce if not. Your marriage has a boat load of visible problems and most likely, more problems that have not even surfaced yet. Way too much to deal with this early in the marriage.


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

From that note she wrote she is very attracted to the OM and deeply in the affair with him, and not attracted to you at all. 

So then why does she claim the affair ended in March? 

Since she was already suspicious that you were watching her it is very likely that the affair didn't end when the trail goes cold - it went underground. 

They may be: 
1. Using company phones/email to communicate
2. Using a burner phone (pay as you go, or a second phone) they buy specifically for the affair. This would be hidden in her car or someplace in the house.

You might want to put a VAR in her car under her seat or in the console and secured by heavy duty velcro immediately so you can pick up if she's talk to him in the car. This is a very common thing cheaters will do as soon as she pulls out to go to work - she'll call him and they'll talk. Or she'll be going out to the store on the weekend and use the time to call him.

You absolutely need to expose to the OMW. She has a right to know her husband is cheating on her. 

If the OM knows that your wife has been caught, your wife has likely warned him that you might tell his wife. It might be better for you to just call her up personally since you know her and tell her. Don't warn your wife as she will warn the OM who will tell his wife you're either crazy or he will try to keep you from contacting her. 

There are two goals here: 1) Get him to throw your wife under the bus to protect himself; 2) Let his wife know she's been living in an open marriage.

---

From the letter she wrote she herself says she's no longer attracted to you etc. So you need to ask her why she's still there with you?

----

My guy says the affair isn't quite as dead as she's told you. It's either gone underground and is still active - OR - it's slowed down at the moment for some reason. 

Affairs don't just end like that once they've gone physical, and where they work together daily. There would need to be a real reason why they would end it - and it isn't that they feel guilt. the guilt would have stopped it either before it when PA or after the first time. In this case is was many months and many hookups for sex. So by that time the guilt had been dealt with.

So why does she claim it ended?


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

One more question - Could she have been meeting up with him yesterday? You say you couldn't talk due to schedule conflicts - does that mean she's been away from home on Sat without you for an extended time?

You may want to turn on GPS tracking on her phone without telling her, or drop a GPS tracker on her car so you can see where she is going.


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## anonymouskitty (Jun 5, 2012)

> .. my husband is my best friend, my soulmate, does more than his share of the housework, and puts up with a lot from me... [here's a part i haven't mentioned yet:]...i am finding myself no longer attracted to him though i still love him dearly. to make matters worse i am having an affair with a co-worker who i am very physically attracted to. the man is not half the man my husband is nor do i love him


Soulmate and bestfriend aside, your wife needs to wake up to the reality of things so 1) Stop doing more than your share of the work, you see the beer in the cooler, grab it and lay your arse on a couch and let her do the house work

2) You're putting up with her antics -even she knows this, well put your bleeding foot down and stop putting up with her antics

3) Tell her to quit her bloody job or she can take a walk.


You see your wife not only suffers from a multitude of other disorders but she also suffers from one major disorder - The Entitled Princess Disorder(EPD) and you are doing nothing more than feeding her fires. She has no respect for you and the only way she's going to gain even a little quanta of respect is if her highness understands just what she's about to lose.

See the 180 link in my signature, read it and follow whatever advice that's in there to the word. Do you know that a little divorce scare goes a long way in snapping the said princess from her delusional state of mind? Think about it


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## TDSC60 (Dec 8, 2011)

Your wife is a Huntress. She is addicted to the thrill of the chase. The plotting and the planning to get a guy in bed with her.

She chased you. Baited you. Finally bagged you when you married her. Your head was on the trophy wall. Hunt over. She sits back and admires her trophy - the results of what she did for the past several years. Then soon - very soon looking at that trophy is not enough. It is time for another hunt.

Then it was time to search for a new quarry and begin the hunt again. Baiting him with some mild sexual comments at work. Bending over just a little too far in front of him then looking back with a smile on her face. He fell into her trap and she set the hook - got confirmation that she has still "got it". She doesn't love this new trophy and can't put him on the wall. She feels a little guilty over what she has done - but not enough to tell you about it.

Bottom line is that she is addicted to the feeling of the hunt, chasing a new man just to feel the excitement and finally the "kill", she feels a sense of purpose during the chase and a feeling of accomplishment at the culmination. This feeling lasts for a while, then she gets restless. Then she starts looking for new targets. Then on to the next victim and the next and the next and the next.

Some women are like this. They get bored and simply HAVE to get validation that they can attract a male, and it cannot come from a male she already has had.


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## morituri (Apr 1, 2011)

You may love her but love is not enough to make a happy and healthy marriage. It takes respect and trust as well. Your wife, despite her talk about you being her best friend and soul mate, does not know what love is because if she did, she would never have betrayed you - No true friend does that. Furthermore, she doesn't respect or trust you either because if she did, she would have opened up to you and expressed what she was experiencing and she never would have allowed herself to be seduced by another man.

No all cheaters are the same. There are many who cheated but did so years after they got married, not 4.5 months after they made their vows to each other. Like it or not, your marriage was DOA (dead on arrival) and exists only on paper. The odds are great that she is going to cheat on you again in the future like so many have, and by that time it may be harder for you to leave her if there are children around. You now have a golden opportunity to start a new life in which you can find a truly good, loving kind, and faithful woman who does not have issues and is mature enough to know the difference between right and wrong and acts accordingly who would love to share her life with you. Whether or not your seize on this opportunity is entirely up to you.


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## Acabado (May 13, 2012)

> my husband is my best friend, my soulmate, does more than his share of the housework, and puts up with a lot from me... [here's a part i haven't mentioned yet:]...*i am finding myself no longer attracted to him* though i still love him dearly. *to make matters worse i am having an affair with a co-worker who i am very physically attracted to*. the man is not half the man my husband is nor do i love him.


I have to laugh at this foggie speach. How people which otherwise is inteligent and articulate can enter in this alternate - suspended - reality in wich can't see the link between the two bolded statements above, basicaly in the same paragraph... In her mind the "atracttion" to this POSOM in completely unrelated to the loss of "attraction" to OP. Of course, it has to be this way. She completely dismiss it isn't just physical attraction, so she believes that compartimentalizing works just fine with her. The obvious shift of focus of her energies is something that simply doesn't exist in her mind.


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## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

Acabado said:


> I have to laugh at this foggie speach. How people which otherwise is inteligent and articulate can enter in this alternate - suspended - reality in wich can't see the link between the two bolded statements above, basicaly in the same paragraph... In her mind the "atracttion" to this POSOM in completely unrelated to the loss of "attraction" to OP. Of course, it has to be this way. She completely dismiss it isn't just physical attraction, so she believes that compartimentalizing works just fine with her. The obvious shift of focus of her energies is something that simply doesn't exist in her mind.


:iagree:

IKR? It's so much a part of the typical cheater script (behavior), that's it not even funny. It makes the behavior very predictable.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

"I love him dearly, but as I focus my energy on a different man, I find myself unable to maintain the level of romantic attraction to my husband that he deserves." Funny how that works.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## morituri (Apr 1, 2011)

It wouldn't surprise me one bit if the affair started before the marriage as an EA but resumed right after it and turning into a PA. It has happened to others, case in point is beenbetrayed. His ex started her PA more than a year before the marriage and continued right after it. He woke up and filed for an annulment. His ex continued with the OM after he finally kicked her out and she probably is still with the OM. He is now single and has begun a new and better life.


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## alias (Jul 21, 2012)

hi everyone, thanks for the continued advice. it really has helped in some way, just talking to strangers. 

some updates. we did end up talking a little bit last night. to make matters worse, her sister and brand new husband (we just went to their wedding in CO july 6th) are in town, so all we accomplished was whispers. from the perspective i've gained here i told her i want to take some actions on some things (her quitting work, telling the OM's wife, and full transparency). she is basically willing to do whatever i want, which is a good sign, regardless of if i decide to stay or not. she gave me the password that she changed all her sites to: it is "fmylife" plus some numbers, so i feel like she is genuinely torn up about this. she is willing to quit the job, but wants to look for something else first. the other sticking point is that he is leaving the job at the end of august anyway to go back to school, so she's advocating for staying until then. i told her it was more of an act of faith towards me, and we'd get by somehow. We didn't get too far on this anyway like I mentioned. 

She also asked if we should wait til counseling (Tues AM) to tell OM's wife. I am kind of agreeing with her here, against all your advice. Partially due to the fact that we have family guests and the last thing I want is for his wife to go ape**** and have our whole group of friends know. I'm not quite ready to have this blow up before I am a collected decision. At the same time I am paranoid about her scheming with him to minimize the damage... What to do? I'm friends w/ her on Facebook, do I just send her a message and hope she doesn't explode?

Other thing, is I pressed her on the issues that didn't make sense - the fact that the timeline was all messed up (see earlier in thread). She now is fessing up and saying that yes the affair was continuing until right before I found the text messages (June) but now is changing her story and saying it didn't start (physically) until later now. She said the first "mistake drunken makeout" happened around Nov when we had that fight, but that nothing more sexual happened until after February. I don't know why she would first say that it actually started earlier than it did?!? Again, we didn't get too far and we just need to sit down and talk.

Just updating folks who seem to have some interest and insight into what's going on with us. We have tomorrow together to talk and then Tues counseling, and I think by then I will make a solid decision or be heavily leaning at least. The other kicker is that I need to keep it together until at least next weekend - my dad (who is 65 and going through a divorce with my mom, UGH), is coming to town for the weekend and we're going to a wedding, then he visiting friends in the area for another couple days and crashing with us again on his way out, so the earliest I could possibly leave would be early Aug. This is why I am taking my time making decisions - because I have to - and maybe that's a good thing.

My gut still just tells me to go far far away, but my heart is having a hard time believing...


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## Jonesey (Jul 11, 2011)

All I'm going to say. Is good luck man.

You are s going to need it


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## Complexity (Dec 31, 2011)

alias said:


> "I'm a 29 yr old female bla bla bla... my husband is my best friend, my soulmate, does more than his share of the housework, and puts up with a lot from me... [here's a part i haven't mentioned yet:]...i am finding myself no longer attracted to him though i still love him dearly. to make matters worse i am having an affair with a co-worker who i am very physically attracted to. the man is not half the man my husband is nor do i love him [the one redeeming line that i remember]..."


Wow, talk about crushing a guy's self esteem


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

I personally wouldn't give them time to collude. Omw doesn't deserve to be in the dark another day. Call her and tell her. Tell your wife after the fact. Pay close attention to her reaction.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

iheartlife said:


> "I love him dearly, but as I focus my energy on a different man, I find myself unable to maintain the level of romantic attraction to my husband that he deserves." Funny how that works.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Hang on... there's something lacking, here. Oh, yes... here it is
:slap:


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## jnj express (Mar 28, 2011)

Your tossing out excuse after excuse, for delaying what needs to be done

OMW, needs to know NOW---who cares how she reacts, more than likely, her reaction will be with her H.---she may never even bother you---and if she wants further contact with you about info---you give it to her

Your wife doesn't get to decide about the job---but if her lover is leaving in aug., and she wants to keep the job, and not have to look for another one---you/she can go to her boss---explain what has happened, and ask for vacation time, or a leave of absensce till her lover has left---then she can keep her job

Your wife has gone physical on you, she willingly/wantonly/happily gave herself to another man---months after taking vows, that has to be accounted for---it is accounted for, by you telling, she doing what is necessary for her to help you get thru the horrible pain she has brought down upon you---her remorse/repentance/contriteness, MUST be REAL, not phony, and just a show to keep her nice cushy lifestyle----all the crap that she used for justification is just that, CRAP, she could have come to you at any time, and forced you into discussing, and straightening out the marital problems/concerns---instead what does she do---she goes out and hooks up with a lover, and gives herself to him---literally months after taking vows

Before you even think about an R---in all actuality, she needs to fix the reasons for her replacing you, or I am willing to bet you, she will cheat again.


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## Will_Kane (Feb 26, 2012)

Big mistake to tell your wife that you were going to expose to the other man's wife. Now your wife is going to tell the other man about it so he can be prepared. He will tell his wife before you get to tak to her that his co-worker's extremely jealous husband somehow got the wrong idea about a few flirtatious texts and there was nothing physical.


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## aug (Aug 21, 2011)

drkensington said:


> Speaking as a couples counselor, what you're reporting is not uncommon. Her low self-esteem is the root cause of all the behavioral manifestations you mentioned: eating disorder, depression, drinking, etc.
> 
> It's clear that you still want things to work, despite the ways things are going. I give you credit for that.
> 
> ...



How much time will she need to resolve her issues? What is the timeframe? Weeks, months, years or decades?

What is the personal costs to OP while she's resolving her issues? Can these be listed?

I think there are quite a lot of unknowns involved here for even a rough prognosis.


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## TDSC60 (Dec 8, 2011)

Make sure this counselor has experience with dealing and recovering from infidelity. If they start the "you were not providing for her needs and that is why she cheated (blaming her bad behavior on you), fire that one and look for another one.

You have not made a decision but that does not mean you can not research your options. Talk to a lawyer about annulment. A consultation should not cost much if anything.

Good luck whatever you decide.


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## aug (Aug 21, 2011)

alias needs to take that time to make this major decision. Maybe a few weeks at the most?


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## I'm The Prize (May 22, 2012)

Tell the OMW NOW! She deserves to know. What she does after that is her business. Offer to send her the proof. If he is doing this with your wife there is no telling how many others there are. Her health could be at stake. Tell her!


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

Like others have said - tell the OMW now - send her a message today and do not warn your wife.

she is buying time. Notice she affair has now changed to be from Nov - June? Want to think back to valentines day and think where she was during the day? was she home in the evening?

Look, we've seen this game before - the minimizing the tickle truth. My gut and I think others says this is not an affair that is over. You are in false R, and your wife is buying time for her and her OM to figure out what to do to cover themselves. 

The worst thing you can do is to give them this time. If you want to save your marriage you need to KILL the affair and the #1 way to do that is exposure. Tell the OMW today. If your wife comes to you angry - then you'll have the truth about the affair still being on, and the OM still being in contact with her.


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## ShootMePlz! (Oct 5, 2008)

Be ready for the counselor trying to tell you not to tell the OMW! That seems to be universal with them.:scratchhead: The decision to tell is not open for debate so don't even discuss it there.

Also seeing how there is now a change in timeline on how long the affair lasted....bring up a polygraph to ensure the truth.


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## Acabado (May 13, 2012)

Have you already displayed your snooping tools?
Tell MOM's BW ASAP, don't wait for the damage control (Among themselves and using MC as proxy).
Tell her to send the NC letter.
Tell her to get a calendar and write down the timeline. She can use zillinos of things to jab her memory (work schedules, pictures, milstones, journal, clothes, ED spisodes...). Tell her to write the full story.

Other things: Although I don't think you have been "parenting" her about her issues she's behaving like a entitled child so you automaticaly adopted a little the role of father. Read about marriage with parent/child dynamics, happens many many times. It also happens with people who has do deal with alcoholic or addict spouses, automaticaly you become a little codep, even if you are not naturaly a codependent. It's almost unavoidable. Back off completely about her stuff, she's respinsable for her IC, her ED, her emotional inmaturity, her cheating...
You learn about how to set healthy boundaires, you detach. Make her feel you are pulling away a little. Taylor the 180.

Also, start reading this now:
No More Mr Nice Guy
Married Man's Sex Life (It's not about sex)


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## martyc47 (Oct 20, 2011)

WorkingOnMe said:


> I personally wouldn't give them time to collude. Omw doesn't deserve to be in the dark another day. Call her and tell her. Tell your wife after the fact. Pay close attention to her reaction.


I agree. I think the wife is just using the upcoming counseling and the relatives in town as an excuse to delay and possibly get stories together with the OM. If OP lets his wife control this, there is always going to be some excuse for him not to find his balls so as to appease someone or to avoid some manufactured embarrassment from the blame shifting of the cheaters.

Personally, I wouldn't have involved my cheating wife at all. I would have notified OMW myself with no warning to cheaters, but that's me. I know others believe the wife should write a letter and all that.


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## Will_Kane (Feb 26, 2012)

Assume all of your wife's words are lies, except if they are supported by actions. So far, no actions, just words, probably lies.

*her sister and brand new husband (we just went to their wedding in CO july 6th) are in town, so all we accomplished was whispers. from the perspective i've gained here i told her i want to take some actions on some things (her quitting work, telling the OM's wife, and full transparency). she is basically willing to do whatever i want, which is a good sign, regardless of if i decide to stay or not.* JUST WORDS

*she gave me the password that she changed all her sites to: it is "fmylife" plus some numbers, so i feel like she is genuinely torn up about this. * JUST WORDS. She gave you her passwords, therefore, you feel she is genuinely torn up about this? My wife has all my passwords, always has, so do you think my wife thinks I am genuinely torn up about something? Your wife probably deleted all incriminating evidence first and set up secret accounts you don't know about, that's why it was no big deal to give up your passwords.

*she is willing to quit the job, but wants to look for something else first.* JUST WORDS. She wants you to take her back, but not bad enough that she would be willing to leave the job immediately.

*the other sticking point is that he is leaving the job at the end of august anyway to go back to school, so she's advocating for staying until then.* JUST WORDS. Do you even know if other man is leaving. Your wife is an addict, she will say or do anything to stay in touch with other man, even if it's just until end of August. She'll cross that bridge when she gets to it. 

*i told her it was more of an act of faith towards me, and we'd get by somehow. We didn't get too far on this anyway like I mentioned.* 

*She also asked if we should wait til counseling (Tues AM) to tell OM's wife.* MORE DELAYING ANY TYPE OF ACTION. Just stringing you along with words. She will warn other man tomorrow morning at work, he will be prepared to block your calls to his wife or warn her that you have turned into a jealous nut case.

*I am kind of agreeing with her here, against all your advice. Partially due to the fact that we have family guests and the last thing I want is for his wife to go ape**** and have our whole group of friends know. I'm not quite ready to have this blow up before I am a collected decision. At the same time I am paranoid about her scheming with him to minimize the damage... What to do? I'm friends w/ her on Facebook, do I just send her a message and hope she doesn't explode?*

Other man's wife is not going to explode and set fire to your house. She will take it out on her husband, she may call to talk to you or your wife, she may yell at your wife on the phone. What do you mean by "ape****"? What did you do when you found out about the affair? Expect about the same of the other man's wife.

*Other thing, is I pressed her on the issues that didn't make sense - the fact that the timeline was all messed up (see earlier in thread). She now is fessing up and saying that yes the affair was continuing until right before I found the text messages (June) but now is changing her story and saying it didn't start (physically) until later now. She said the first "mistake drunken makeout" happened around Nov when we had that fight, but that nothing more sexual happened until after February. I don't know why she would first say that it actually started earlier than it did?!? Again, we didn't get too far and we just need to sit down and talk.*

Expect the story to keep changing. She's still lying. The story still doesn't make much sense.

*You say she's willing to do whatever you want, but she basically has done nothing you want. I think your wife still is in contact with the other man and may now be in love with him (her feelings may have changed since her earlier letter to the contrary), thus why she is dragging her feet. *

Here are some things your wife can do, even if her sister has her ear to the wall in the next room:

1. Handwrite a timeline for you on a piece of paper with all key dates.

2. Handwrite a no contact letter to the other man. The no contact letter should state how horribly ashamed she is of her behavior, how terrible she feels for risking losing her husband, who she loves more than anything in the world, and that if other man ever contacts her again, she will file harassment charges against him both with the police and human resources.

3. You can expose to the other man's wife. Call her on the phone. Do not do this by facebook message. Give her what info you know and what you have been told by your wife, tell her you are not trying to hurt her, but that you thought she would want to know the truth. Ask her to help you kill the affair.

4. Ask your wife to quit her job now. How are you going to decide whether or not to reconcile, if you don't know that your wife will quit her job to end contact with the other man? Do you know other man is leaving the job end of August independently of your wife telling you? You're playing against some very heavy odds if you want to save your marriage and your wife still works with the other man.

5. Keylogger on the computer, voice-activated recorder in the car stuck under the seat with heavy duty velcro, gps on the car. This is if you want to save the marriage, even if you're undecided. The keylogger or voice-activated recorder could help make your decision a lot easier if you find out she still is involved with the other man.


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

She think it's no big deal to keep working with him for another month? Ask her to leave. She can move back in once she no longer works with her boyfriend.


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## alias (Jul 21, 2012)

why is the telling of OMW such a sticking point? i just feel like i want to talk to a counselor before crossing that line. i am nearly sure now that i want to leave, but i feel like that is solidified once the OMW knows, and if people start finding out, she quits her job, things change, etc etc... 

i admit to dragging my feet (for my own reasons, AND family visiting), but this isn't easy...


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## cpacan (Jan 2, 2012)

alias said:


> why is the telling of OMW such a sticking point? i just feel like i want to talk to a counselor before crossing that line. i am nearly sure now that i want to leave, but i feel like that is solidified once the OMW knows, and if people start finding out, she quits her job, things change, etc etc...
> 
> i admit to dragging my feet (for my own reasons, AND family visiting), but this isn't easy...


Of course it isn't easy, but why would you reward your wife with a continuing affair and punish OM's wife by not telling??

You will regret it big time down the line if you don't. Feeling bad for his wife who lives a lie and knowing that the OM didn't face any other consequence than a small disturbance in the affair environment.

TELL HER! (I normally don't shout, and I am a calm and peacefull person, but this is a no-brainer to me)


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

I think most of the advice assumes you want to save your marriage. Reconciliation is not possible without exposure and NC. But if you do not want to reconcile then it's not as important. Actually if you're going to file then it would be better for her to have a good job.


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## cpacan (Jan 2, 2012)

WorkingOnMe said:


> I think most of the advice assumes you want to save your marriage. Reconciliation is not possible without exposure and NC. But if you do not want to reconcile then it's not as important. Actually if you're going to file then it would be better for her to have a good job.


Disagree. It is maybe not _just_ as important going for D, but to avoid future regrets and resentment, I find it important to tell at least OMw.


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## Kallan Pavithran (Jan 17, 2012)

OMW have the right to know the truth as a human being. Dont you think that she should inform you the truth if she caught this first?

Then do it fast, else your wife and OM will gaslight her or minimize it.

Its an ongoing A, so no hope for MC.MC is only a place for openiing up freely without lies, but i dont believe that she will tell the whole truth in MC. She is in TT, she will only continue the same in MC. So dont hope for any miracle in MC.

She is in TT and hope that you will get over this in few weeks, so she is insisting on continuing the job until she find one. They may be lying low for you to get over this.

But i have a question for you, You know that she cheated on you within a year of your marriage, she lied, disrespected you by having OM with you for partying when they were banging on your back (They may have been thinking what an ignorant fool you are), she is still in A as they work together, you dont have any kids with her, then why you want to be with a person like this for rest of your life?


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## alias (Jul 21, 2012)

is considering a quick and drastic move just totally insane? my family has a cottage that we could go to and live rent free. obviously it would uproot our lives, but it would give us a new life instantly. the same issues would be there, i know, but we would be isolated and working on them together. i don't know - i am grasping at straws here and just trying to brainstorm. she is willing to do this she has said.


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## Complexity (Dec 31, 2011)

You're rugsweeping


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## anonymouskitty (Jun 5, 2012)

I'm all for taking the first road I see once I encounter a fork, but what are you really doing here? Rugsweeping as Complexity puts it in Simple terms. Your wife isn't going to change just because you move her from the city to the country. 

My advice, expose the A to the OMW or partner fast and then give her a little divorce scare, couldn't really harm anyone now could it? 
Trust me, once they see that you're no longer an option to fall back on they will move heaven and earth(which could start with revealing each and every detail about the affair that you wish to know about)
to set things right


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## Kallan Pavithran (Jan 17, 2012)

Complexity said:


> You're rugsweeping




:iagree::iagree::iagree:



We cant change his fate..........


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## Acabado (May 13, 2012)

> i am nearly sure now that i want to leave, but i feel like that is solidified once the OMW knows, and if people start finding out, she quits her job, things change, etc etc...


Why? You didn't do anythink to be ashamed of. F0ck people. It's your marriage, your family, your life. You are clearly a conflict avoider. You need to deal with it, whatever path you chose.


> is considering a quick and drastic move just totally insane? my family has a cottage that we could go to and live rent free. obviously it would uproot our lives, but it would give us a new life instantly


I will resolve nothing itself. Problems follow us everywhere. Your wife will have the same root issues there. Moving out of triggers may sound nice but I don't think is a good idea to make life altering decision in a rush.
IMHO the right steps are:
Kill the affair, forever.
Protect yourself financialy, physically, emotionaly.
Lay the new rules of the marriage.
Wait to see actions matching up her words. Consistently.
Healing, taking care of yourself.
Let her take her of her issues.
Evaluate in a while.

A though popped in. I you expose to MOM'sBW, if it's true OM is moving soon maybe BW will force him quitting earlier. You need BW as an ally, a second set of eyes.


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

alias said:


> is considering a quick and drastic move just totally insane? my family has a cottage that we could go to and live rent free. obviously it would uproot our lives, but it would give us a new life instantly. the same issues would be there, i know, but we would be isolated and working on them together. i don't know - i am grasping at straws here and just trying to brainstorm. she is willing to do this she has said.


It's not insane, but it is escapism and will not solve anything and it will not help you with all the emotional turmoil.

Time and taking control of the situation is often the strategy that works for many people.

Telling the OMW is entirely about her right to know the truth about her relationship.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## slater (Feb 3, 2012)

OP please understand the advice given here is ENTIRELY from people who walked in your shoes. Myself included. We are here only to try to bring something good from our horrible experiences. That good is to try to help others going through the same thing. You will learn how similar all of our stories are. Cheaters follow a very particular pattern. It is basic human psychology. The folks on this site can predict with reasonable certainty what your wife will do even before she knows it. 

In time you will look back and be very glad you found this site. You will also be glad your wife did this so early in your marriage to allow you a clean getaway. Most of us don't have that luxury. Good luck. Remember the sun will rise tomorrow. You will build a new and BETTER life with someone that would never do this to you.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Chris989 (Jul 3, 2012)

alias, I am 8 weeks in after a second Dday. Please, listen to the guys (and girls) here. They know what they are talking about. Your wife is pulling all of the tricks.

You have to play hard ball otherwise she will continue to lie and the hurt will be worse for you both in the long run. March 8th my ww told me about an EA. I forgave her. She couldn't believe I stayed. Couldn't believe what a good man I was. It was so over with the OM. She had seen what a fool she had been. March 9th she was in his bed again. For another 3 weeks she was texting me to tell me we had a new start and she was so lucky. For another 3 weeks she was in his bed quite a few times more. Lucky for me, 4 weeks later I turned up at the guys house and he bottled it.

May 18th I got the *beginning* of the full story. I don't think I'll ever get the whole thing, but know this: she has lied about everything until caught and confronted.

My WW's lies have killed any chance of R for us. Your WW has to understand that this is IT. You are doing her a dis-service if you don't tell her that or set a boundary NOW.

Actions speak louder than words - especially when the only thing she has proved to you is that she lies when it suits her.

Good luck my friend, I wish I had found this site on March 8th and maybe I would still have a marriage.


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## alias (Jul 21, 2012)

just to play devil's advocate, what if i decide to reconcile? what do i really have to loose? if i divorce it's over for sure. if i try for a while and it clearly doesn't work, i'm not really any worse off than i am now. i know everyone thinks i'm a fool for not running now, but it's hard to know without knowing us. still just talking it out. 

please don't judge me! gimme a break here. 

we talked about taking action today. quitting job - she is going to look for other jobs today, and make sure that she has no remaining shifts with OM. we've been talking about how / when to tell OMW. i am ok with waiting to find out if they are moving or whatever at the end of august before blowing the whole thing up. regardless, i will tell her sooner or later. 

i do WANT to reconcile. i don't want a divorce. but the verdict is still out on what is possible... i think the next few weeks will be telling. 

we have counseling tomorrow morning. more updates later.


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## keko (Mar 21, 2012)

alias said:


> is considering a quick and drastic move just totally insane? my family has a cottage that we could go to and live rent free. obviously it would uproot our lives, but it would give us a new life instantly. the same issues would be there, i know, but we would be isolated and working on them together. i don't know - i am grasping at straws here and just trying to brainstorm. she is willing to do this she has said.


The problem is not her job or the surroundings, it's your wife's lack of moral values and self-control. Unless she magically fixes herself, you'll be visiting this site regularly on how to stop your wife's affair.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Chris989 (Jul 3, 2012)

alias said:


> just to play devil's advocate, what if i decide to reconcile? what do i really have to loose? if i divorce it's over for sure. if i try for a while and it clearly doesn't work, i'm not really any worse off than i am now. i know everyone thinks i'm a fool for not running now, but it's hard to know without knowing us. still just talking it out.
> 
> please don't judge me! gimme a break here.
> 
> ...


You have a LOT of pain to look forward to. Let yourself be taken in and you risk yourself. Your pride. Your dignity. Your life.

This is pretty high stakes. The evidence is against your WW. 

Get kids on the scene and you open up a whole new ball game. In the meantime, she will be cheating on you. 

It's harsh but it's true. 

Perhaps you risk her life to; perhaps you will enable her abusive behaviour (and an affair is abuse). 

Seriously, good luck at MC but don't be taken in - please by cynical. Don't trust her as the only thing she has proved is that she cannot be trusted. 

I hope it works for you - I really do - but just be careful.


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

alias said:


> is considering a quick and drastic move just totally insane? my family has a cottage that we could go to and live rent free. obviously it would uproot our lives, but it would give us a new life instantly. the same issues would be there, i know, but we would be isolated and working on them together. i don't know - i am grasping at straws here and just trying to brainstorm. she is willing to do this she has said.


If the only way you could keep your wife is by isolating her, the marriage is doomed anyway.

Did you find the complete truth about her affair?


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## cpacan (Jan 2, 2012)

alias said:


> just to play devil's advocate, what if i decide to reconcile? what do i really have to loose? if i divorce it's over for sure. if i try for a while and it clearly doesn't work, i'm not really any worse off than i am now. i know everyone thinks i'm a fool for not running now, but it's hard to know without knowing us. still just talking it out.
> 
> please don't judge me! gimme a break here.
> 
> ...


I am going to bite you a bit here, just to save you some months that I wasted. Read your post again. Talk, talk, talk... Talk means absolutely nothing... you must take that in, make it sink: Talk means nothing. 

Your wife has crossed a line that you won't like me to point out, she can now be labelled "a liar". 
It means nothing to her if she must lie to you, you know that now.

Therefore: words mean absolutely nothing - *unless you can verify them by her actions!*. Get this one right and you may save yourself a lot of wasted anger, tears and time. The same goes for MC - it will probably just be talk, which means....? Nothing unless you can verify by her actions.

MC is IMO a waste of time before her intentions are clear and have been verified (there it was again).


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

I agree with cpacan. I'll be very curious to hear if there is ever any action on her part to signify remorse. So far it sounds like a lot of talk on her part and a lot of rug sweeping on your part. And no action on either part. Talk is just talk. It counts for exactly nothing. You can't believe anything that you hear, you can only believe the actions that you see.


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## Chris989 (Jul 3, 2012)

WorkingOnMe said:


> I agree with cpacan. I'll be very curious to hear if there is ever any action on her part to signify remorse. So far it sounds like a lot of talk on her part and a lot of rug sweeping on your part. And no action on either part. Talk is just talk. It counts for exactly nothing. You can't believe anything that you hear, you can only believe the actions that you see.


alias, to be fair to your wife she is quite possibly more or less helpless in this situation too. This is why it is called the "fog".

She will be justifying her actions to herself as a way of saving you pain. She will honestly believe she is doing what is for the best.

This could cover a whole range of actions from simply lying to you to continuing the affair.

It doesn't mean she is bad - or even wishes you ill. It just means she is in a bad place.

Please, for your sake and hers don't believe her. Just ask for proof. After what she has done it's hardly a big ask is it?

Not doing could cost a *lot* of pain, but if she proves things to you it doesn't cost either of you anything and in fact can help heal too.


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## martyc47 (Oct 20, 2011)

alias said:


> just to play devil's advocate, what if i decide to reconcile? what do i really have to loose? if i divorce it's over for sure. if i try for a while and it clearly doesn't work, i'm not really any worse off than i am now. i know everyone thinks i'm a fool for not running now, but it's hard to know without knowing us. still just talking it out.
> 
> please don't judge me! gimme a break here.
> 
> ...


You are really confusing things here, but all the advice has been really straightforward. I really don't know what your point is. You are either being manipulated by the cheating spouse or you are trying to convince yourself to be a doormat.

Doing all the "blowing up" stuff- If you are referring to what I think- is exactly what you must do if you DO want to reconcile. Not sure if you are just not getting that or what. You can't reconcile with your wife while she is in an affair or while the affair has gone underground, while she still wants to be in the affair, so on. As long as she is working with the OM and his wife is ignorant of the affair and you are refusing to make it difficult for the affair to carry on, YOU are enabling your wife's affair and condoning it. And now you are just doing what your wife wants, and not putting any real consequences on her. 

No one's judging you, just telling you very basic things that must be done if you really want what you say. If you don't then you don't seem real interested in R. You seem more interested in a false-R and looking the other way while letting your wife do whatever she wants basically. Even the whole thing about running away- that is just for your wife's benefit, so that she can run away from the shame of being a cheater. YOU don't need to feel ashamed about anything. You didn't cheat on anyone. Sure your wife will do whatever it takes- if it takes practically NOTHING on her end. So you are supposed to move far away to save her embarrassment- to shelter your cheating spouse? Seriously?

And. No, I don't see what counseling is supposed to do as far as deciding whether to Expose or not. Sounds like you are almost hoping to get some counselor who is going to blame you and not require your wife to do anything, because for some reason you don't seem willing to stick up for yourself. You just want to run away and forget about everything- but you won't.


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## cpacan (Jan 2, 2012)

OP, look, you may find that I and some other posters are being a bit too straight forward to you. I can understand that, I was there, and so were the other posters. 

We are desperately trying to make you learn from our experiences and costly mistakes. I just realized that you are only 6 days past DD. Your brain and emotions can't comprehend or consume all these well meaning opinions and advice just yet. Understandable.

I understand that you are very much in your wife. You may ask yourself the same questions as I did 14 months past DD:

Do you love the woman you *thought *you have, the woman you *now know* you have or is it the one you *hope* she will become?

These are probably three different persons - get used to it, and I know it is very very hard. To quote a famous master: "un-learn what you have learned, you must" - your marriage was not what it seemed to you.

Answering those questions did wonders for me in terms of clarifying the situation.

And I will just repeat myself and others one more time... MC will not do you any good as long as your wife and AP has not been effectively seperated. It's definitely not some kind of magic wand that will make it all go away, unfortunately.

I wish you the best, hang in there and do come back for more practical advice.


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## Sara8 (May 2, 2012)

alias said:


> just to play devil's advocate, what if i decide to reconcile? what do i really have to loose? if i divorce it's over for sure. if i try for a while and it clearly doesn't work, i'm not really any worse off than i am now. i know everyone thinks i'm a fool for not running now, but it's hard to know without knowing us. still just talking it out.
> 
> please don't judge me! gimme a break here.
> 
> ...


I agree. Take your time about Divorcing. No rush, IMO. 

Just keep your eyes open to protect your assets.

If you are prime bread winner, take her name off any shared accounts or credit cards. 

If she also contributes to lifestyle, than, separate everything, until she proves herself trustworthy again. 

Also, run a DNA test on any kids you have. It costs about $200 on line.

You need to ensure she is not a serial cheater and if the kids don't share your DNA, you got proof that she is. 

That will help in court if you D.


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## mrbiggz (Dec 21, 2011)

So you and wifey are going to be happily married for the next 50 years without any more affairs? Probably not, she cheated within the first months of the marriage. Like someone else said, she still should have been in euphoria but instead she was screwing another man. The person that you thought she was does not exist. 

This may sound harsh but you have been "friend zoned" by your wife. Although she may like to talk to you about her problems and for you to pay her bills and such, the POSOM is the one that gets to bang her and is the one she thinks about in your bed at night. Think about that for a second.


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## alias (Jul 21, 2012)

some of you people are a little over zealous - that's ok, i understand, it's just the internet. for those of you who care and have been helping...

in-laws left today. we went to MC yesterday. she is having a talk with her manager today about work - no more shifts with OM (who leaves work end of august), and she has leads on other jobs already. i still want the OMW to know, and she will eventually, regardless, but we have not told her yet. i am half waiting to see if he tells her (he knows i know now), and half waiting to see what happens with this work situation. part of me wants OMW on my side to control him and force him to quit or maybe even move away or whatever, but the other part of me wonders what will happen if she makes a huge scene and leaves him and this becomes public knowledge - i think that would be too much to work through IF my wife and i decide to keep working on things.

it's going to be a hard month but hopefully i will have more perspective. i'm finding that that helps.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

Why would you want him to tell her first? Just what do you think a cheater will tell their spouse if they get the first bite of that apple?

You may find when you decide to expose to her that she wants none of it, that she believes your wife is a sl*t and the aggressor, or else a horrible liar who made it all up. Or that you are a terrible person and he was trying to "help" your wife because of her awful marriage / husband. This is why you don't leave it up to the foxes to guard the henhouse.


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## aug (Aug 21, 2011)

I would suggest it's because the internet has less emotional attachment to your situation and can see things you cant or wont right now.


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## cpacan (Jan 2, 2012)

alias said:


> some of you people are a little over zealous - that's ok, i understand, it's just the internet. for *those of you who care and have been helping..*.
> 
> in-laws left today. we went to MC yesterday. she is having a talk with her manager today about work - no more shifts with OM (who leaves work end of august), and she has leads on other jobs already. i still want the OMW to know, and she will eventually, regardless, but we have not told her yet. i am half waiting to see if he tells her (he knows i know now), and half waiting to see what happens with this work situation. part of me wants OMW on my side to control him and force him to quit or maybe even move away or whatever, but the other part of me wonders what will happen if she makes a huge scene and leaves him and this becomes public knowledge - i think that would be too much to work through IF my wife and i decide to keep working on things.
> 
> it's going to be a hard month but hopefully i will have more perspective. i'm finding that that helps.


We are actually trying to help you, it's just as if you are not listening. Somehow you have reason to believe your wife is different from all the other waywards presented here, and that her affair differs from all other affairs. 

That's perfectly OK - I thought so too about my wife in the beginning, and it usually takes a couple of months to realize the opposite... if it's the case that is.

Just one question though... how do you feel about holding these two lovers' secret from OMW? What has she ever done to you to deserve your silence?

And how did MC go?


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

We have urged you to expose because:

1. it gives you an ally in checking up on no more contact
2. it keeps the OM busy saving his own hide


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

Shaggy said:


> We have urged you to expose because:
> 
> 1. it gives you an ally in checking up on no more contact
> 2. it keeps the OM busy saving his own hide


And it prevents the OM from lying to his wife, telling his wife that you and your wife are crazy people. Do not listen to them.

And in this day age of our sexual revolution, if it becomes public knowledge most people will not even talk about it for too long.


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## Jibril (May 23, 2012)

alias said:


> some of you people are a little over zealous - that's ok, i understand, it's just the internet. for those of you who care and have been helping...
> 
> in-laws left today. we went to MC yesterday. she is having a talk with her manager today about work - no more shifts with OM (who leaves work end of august), and she has leads on other jobs already. i still want the OMW to know, and she will eventually, regardless, but we have not told her yet. i am half waiting to see if he tells her (he knows i know now), and half waiting to see what happens with this work situation. part of me wants OMW on my side to control him and force him to quit or maybe even move away or whatever, but the other part of me wonders what will happen if she makes a huge scene and leaves him and this becomes public knowledge - i think that would be too much to work through IF my wife and i decide to keep working on things.
> 
> it's going to be a hard month but hopefully i will have more perspective. i'm finding that that helps.


Over-zealous? _No_, mate. If anything, you're much too indifferent/lethargic. This is your _marriage_ we're talking about. *You must be decisive*. I cannot, _cannot_ stress this enough. It is _so_ much safer and more effective to over-react and smash this affair to pieces than to take things "one step at a time." By taking things slowly, you give your wandering spouse a chance to recover and re-engage her affair partner.

You _need_ to expose this affair and put pressure on them to not see one another. Stigmatizing them (especially the OM) is a very effective way to get him to drop your wife. He will be too busy dealing with his own wife and the fallout of her discovery to engage your wife again. He will throw your wife under the bus to keep his marriage intact. His wife may even force him to quit or find another job. And, _it's the right thing to do_, you cold-hearted do-nothing.

Stop being so indecisive. I see, post after post, that you wane steadily into "rugsweeping" mode. You're too afraid to lose your wife to stand up for yourself and do what's right. You're too afraid to lose your wife to destroy this affair once and for all. 

Do what you're doing now, and I _guarantee_ that you will be back here within a year's time, bemoaning your wife's new affair. Don't believe me? Look at this very forum - you'll find many rug-sweeping spouses who find themselves dealing with a second, or even third, D-Day.


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## Will_Kane (Feb 26, 2012)

* (he knows i know now), *

How does he know that you know? Did your wife tell him or did you?


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## martyc47 (Oct 20, 2011)

Hopeless...


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## sandc (Dec 15, 2011)

Alias, read everything that everyone has written to you. Print it out and save it. You'll need it for next time. She started cheating on you after 4 whole months of wedded bliss. It won't be long before you need all this insight and information again.

I know you don't believe it, but it will happen. She will do this again and will seem just as remorseful the next time.


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