# Need help processing



## Helpunderstand (Aug 2, 2020)

Since having children, my wife and I have gone from intimacy multiple times a week to less than a month. I’ve bought her surprise gifts and taken her out in nice diners, but she complains I’m just wasting money. When I try kissing her she doesn’t want to kiss back most the time because she says I’m just trying to have sex when I only want to 10% of the time. When we do have sex, she acts like she is completely going out of her way to do it for me so I should be grateful for her time. I try giving her oral or massaging her to get her more relaxed and in the mood but she tells me it isn’t needed and to get it over with. 
I get depressed thinking she never wants me around causing me to be lethargic which just gets her madder. When I notice her getting overwhelmed, I do more around the house to try to put her in better mood but that only seems to aggravate her because “why haven’t I been doing it more?”
When it comes to my needs, my wife never listens to them so she always complain I never meet hers. Because she thinks I’m not helping enough, she always says she is one doing all the work. I feel no matter what I do, she has to complain about something. She is very hypocritical of how I do things vs. her as she thinks I don’t try at all. For example, if I can’t find something I misplaced around the house, she complains I never look and gets an attitude. Yet when she can’t find something, she blames me for purposely hiding in a spot I know where it is. I tell her I’m not in a good place in our relationship and all she tells me to do is “man up”. This has been going on the last 2.5 years and I’m not sure where to go from here as I’m growing more upset and careless the longer she keeps this up.


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## bobert (Nov 22, 2018)

You shouldn't only be helping your wife when she seems overwhelmed. You say she feels she is the one doing all of the work, is she? How often do you help out on a daily basis with the kids and house? Do you both work? How old are your kids?

After the kids came, did you stop spending time together, going on dates, etc? Generally couples should spend 20 hours a week together.


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## Helpunderstand (Aug 2, 2020)

She does more of the house work. We both work though she has been off work a year of the last 2.5 years. I help with bathing the kids, feeding, garbage, laundry, diapers, reading to the kids and taking care of the cats. I realize at times I can help more with cooking, dishes, laundry, and other cleaning around the house. I do get more unresponsive when she yells at me doing it one way and then turn around doing it the way I do it. When I bring it up that I don’t like how she is being hypocritical, she just yells back at me. 
we don’t go out as much as we used to. When I bring up we should go out more, she says she is too tired. She was worse when we just had one kid instead of two as she wouldn’t leave her with someone else until she was over 1.5 old. We used to watch tv shows together but now when I try, she is on her phone over half of the time and no longer cuddles with me.


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

seems to me she is resenting you and/or has lost her respect for you, whatever the reason...


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## bobert (Nov 22, 2018)

Is she off work right now, and you're working? If that's the case then her job never ends and her days are probably hectic with two young children.

If you realize that you can help more, THEN HELP MORE! If you notice something has to be done, do it right then and there. If she gets up to do something and you have time, offer her a break and you do it instead. This isn't all on you, there is plenty of stuff she's doing wrong as well but you're the one that's here. After years of issues it's going to take a lot more than doing chores a few times, when she's overwhelmed, to make a difference. You need to be very consistent and put in the work for a few months at least (I've heard 6 months from marriage therapists).

You said she yells at you when you do a task and it's not done to her standards. Try to learn how she wants things done and WHY (something not coming clean, etc), but your wife also has to realize that as long as it gets done it doesn't really matter how. If there are tasks that your wife hates how you do them, then those should be hers and you have ones that she can relax on more or that you're better at.

You might want to come up with designated chores. You both make a list of chores you hate doing, chores you don't mind doing, and chores you don't like doing but you hate the way your spouse does them more. Alternatively, you can use something like ChoreBuster and have the chores delegated in a fair way.

Not leaving your daughter with someone else until she was over 18 months old, that's normal for some women - especially with the first baby. Did your wife have post-partum depression? That (and breastfeeding, if she did) can really impact things.

You need to get on the same page as your wife. Can you have a CALM discussion with your wife and say that you're not happy with the way things are, including your side of things, and you want to work on improving things starting right now? Have a list of things you're going to do differently, then be consistent. Use "I feel" statements. "I feel... when you... because..." rather than "YOU always..." or "YOU never..." which makes anyone defensive.

You're either going to work on improving the marriage or you're not, and in that case it's time to part ways. Have you considered seeing a marriage therapist? They can help a lot with getting issues out in the open and working on them.

Two good books you could read, and I highly suggest you do, are "His Needs, Her Needs" by Willard Harley and "The 5 Love Languages" by Gary Chapman.


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## Helpunderstand (Aug 2, 2020)

She started back in the last two weeks. Usually she would go out for 2-3 ever other day shopping or talking outside with her mom so I would have to watch the kids while working so I then have to work more that night to get caught up since I had to help with the kids for those hours and periodically need to help her when she needed to cool off from arguing with the kids. I tried a chore list with her about everything that needs to be done in a week. It lasted about 6-7 months and the ratio of chore work was about even with her around 45% and mine around 43% with the rest being shared. She would complain about the different chores so we switched 4 months into but she didn’t like how the chore chart was still showing us about even so we stopped keeping track as she claimed I’m only doing it to show people I do stuff even though I never did. 
I’ve tried having calm discussion with her but she just throws everything back on me. After awhile I give up as I’m always the one to blame. When I do take initiative and do stuff, she also complains that she already did it without me knowing but to me it didn’t look done so that’s why I did it. 
it seems the more I help, the madder she gets at me so I feel depressed as I feel it doesn’t matter what I do that she will always be mad at me for something.
I think she did have post-partum but she denied it and wouldn’t talk to anyone else even when I asked her to talk to her doctor. 
She hasn’t wanted to see mariage therapist as she feels I am the only one that needs to change since I’m childish and take naps on the weekend.


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## Helpunderstand (Aug 2, 2020)

I’m not perfect or close to it. I am wanting other ways to help get through to my wife that I am here to help but I’m not able to do everything or know what she wants when she doesn’t communicate with me. Like I take more naps in the afternoon on some days so I can be awake to bottle feed our baby At night so she doesn’t have to get up as I’m a snorer and don’t wake up easily so she hears the baby cry first but doesn’t wake me up because I should hear and wake up as quick as she does. I tell her to mug me or shake me awake but she doesn’t want to do that. Since what I’m doing to try to communicate with her doesn’t work, I am wanting to know of ways I can do better on that from my end that is different than what I’ve attempted in the past.


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## bobert (Nov 22, 2018)

Helpunderstand said:


> I’m a snorer and don’t wake up easily so she hears the baby cry first but doesn’t wake me up because I should hear and wake up as quick as she does.


So she'd rather let the baby cry longer than wake up her husband? There's a problem there. If you think she had PPD, then she likely still has it (or has it again) if you have a young baby. You cannot fix that, only she can.

I assume the baby sleeps in his/her own room? If not, put baby on your side of the bed. If the baby is in his/her own room, can you keep a baby monitor on your side of the bed and turn it up loudly so that you hear it? Alternatively, there are baby monitors made for people who are deaf or hard of hearing. You put it under your pillow and it vibrates.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

Helpunderstand said:


> I’m not perfect or close to it. I am wanting other ways to help get through to my wife that I am here to help but I’m not able to do everything or know what she wants when she doesn’t communicate with me. Like I take more naps in the afternoon on some days so I can be awake to bottle feed our baby At night so she doesn’t have to get up as I’m a snorer and don’t wake up easily so she hears the baby cry first but doesn’t wake me up because I should hear and wake up as quick as she does. I tell her to mug me or shake me awake but she doesn’t want to do that. Since what I’m doing to try to communicate with her doesn’t work, I am wanting to know of ways I can do better on that from my end that is different than what I’ve attempted in the past.


The only way you can do better on your end is to transform into a mother yourself so you have all the maternal instincts and drives and maternal priorities that she does. 

As a man with normal male priorities and instincts etc, you will fail at being a female mother at every corner. 

You can be the worlds greatest husband and father but you will still suck at being a mother. 

Unless some guy is completely born and bred and trained to be a primary child giver, I don't think any man will be able to take off the "pressure" and the overwhelming workload and stress that a mother feels. 

In our evolutionary history there were probably two types of mothers - Those that devoted all of their attentions and energies towards the care and well being of their offspring.

- and those that craps out a baby but continued with their normal, pre-offspring life including partying and having a high octane sex life. 

Which offspring do you think survived long enough to pass on their genes to future generations?

Women and babies both need to come with warning labels and Instruction sheets that explain that once Baby arrives on scene, the mother becomes an entirely different person and her priorities, attentions, energies and focus completely changes and everything shifts towards taking care of the well being of the child. 

Her sense of sexuality and her own pleasure and sexual needs and desires become priority # 2,471, right behind plucking the blades of grass out of the cracks in the sidewalk in front of the house. 

cont......


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## CatholicDad (Oct 30, 2017)

You’re in a tough stage in marriage... sort of like the Pyrenees of the Tour de France. If your wife is excessively tired or depressed definitely take strong action and take a couple hours off work and make her go to the doctor- drive her there if you need to. If she isn’t herself you need to rule out everything medically speaking. My wife had a cancerous thyroid that had to come out years ago. She had become extremely tired and unresponsive. Men need to be proactive at caring for their wives- trust your instincts... take action.

You might want to accept that your sex life will be lackluster if you’re both overworked and up at night with a baby. Take the quickie when offered but remain a gentleman. My baby jogging stroller helped me through the baby years. I’d load baby and dog and take a walk/jog which would give my wife a break and some exercise for myself.

Keep your sense of humor... sometimes women need to vent about our poor homemaker skills... but hey we’re men! If she wants another woman around tell her to invite her mom to come down and help with the grandkids.

I wouldn’t start assuming you’ve lost her affection just because of a temporary rough patch. Stay strong young man... these periods of life is what makes a marriage even stronger- if you hold your marriage together and continue to work as a team.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

cont....

There are also some physical issues with the arrival of baby that do not get anywhere near the publicity and airtime that they should. 

The standard medical narative is that sexual activity can resume after the 6 week check up. 

FOR MILLIONS OF NEW MOTHERS THIS IS COMPLETE BULLSHYTE THAT BORDERS ON ACTUAL MALPRACTICE. 

This narative has come from the male, medical doctor perspective that from a medical/physiological standpoint, a woman should not be physically damaged or encounter any actual physical danger if a penis in introduced to her vagina. 

The reality is that for the vast majority of new mothers, their physiology, hormonal balance and actual vaginal structure is no where near ready for a mutually pleasurable and mutually desired sex life. 

Their hormonal balance is geared towards feeding and nurturing and ensuring the survival and well being of the offspring they have and not towards making a new one. That horny sex kitten that was waking you up in the middle of the night getting you hard so she could climb on and that hot, sexy chick that was also game and was DTF to bang out a quicky in the dressing room of Von Maur's is dead and buried. The woman in front of you now is a mother who can hear a whimper or sniffle on the other side of the house in a thunder storm and any thought she may have had the micro-second before is out the window and she will break through the defensive line of the Pittsburg Steelers to get to the baby and no 300lb defensive tackle in his right mind is going to try to stop her. 

That hormonal shift not only changes her libido and desire for sex but it also effects her vagina physically. She does not get the same blood flow and elasticity and natural lubrication that she did pre-pregnancy. Artificial lube from the store can help but it isn't the same and not a substitute because the vaginal walls do not get the same engorment and elasticity from pre-birth so even with a bucket of commercial lube, it can still be painful. 

And speaking of vaginas and pain, here is another thing that is not being educated properly in birthing classes and in baby books -- the vagina often suffers actual trauma in birth. There is a whole lot of stretching and distorting taking place and some times even tears and lacerations during birth. Not all are visible or result in actual cuts and bleeding but there is dissections of tissues and muscle walls taking place that may not visible to the naked eye. 

The episiotomy is still a controversial topic but that is a true trauma that some believe causes more harm than good. Yes, episiotomies are stitched back up but that scarring and regrowth can cause some trauma and changes to the vaginal structures that take way longer than the recommended six weeks to recover to full functioning. 

The point here is there is actual trauma taking place that can take a lot longer than the standard recommendation of six weeks. And by longer I mean many months and sometime even a year or longer and during that time any kind of penetration or even external manipulation can cause pain and even extreme pain. 

Cont....


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

oldshirt said:


> The reality is that for the vast majority of new mothers, their physiology, hormonal balance and actual vaginal structure is no where near ready for a mutually pleasurable and mutually desired sex life. And sex during this time can result in not only lack of pleasure or discomfort but actual pain and in some causes extreme pain.
> 
> 
> The point here is there is actual trauma taking place that can take a lot longer than the standard recommendation of six weeks. And by longer I mean many months and sometime even a year or longer and during that time any kind of penetration or even external manipulation can cause pain and even extreme pain.
> ...


cont....

Now lets talk about this a little more closely because this is very important and should be in pamphlets hanging on every OB/GYN's wall. 

So now you have a situation where the mother's attentions and focus has shifted completely away from her own pleasure and enjoyment to that of the child. Her hormones and physiology have shifted to nurturing the existing offspring and away from a desirous sex drive. 

And her vagina has experienced actual trauma and injury that can take many months longer than the standard medical recommendation of 6 weeks. 

Read the following carefull because this can not only set your sex life back years but can actually destroy it and ruin the whole relationship - 

Trying to jump start the return of the passionate sex life during this time and having pressure and resentment and bitterness during this time can cause a whole host of problems including resentment, anger, disgust and not only that but actual physical PAIN.

If you try to plow through that, even if she is verbally consenting and willing to give it a college try, the pain and discomfort and irritation of having to also satisfy her partner's sex drive can cause an actual sexual aversion. 

I urge everyone to look up that term and really strive to understand it and understand how it can develop because it is not only deal breaker in the bedroom but it can be a marriage killer. 

In a nutshell a sex aversion is where the whole idea of sex because a problem and something that is actively avoided and unwanted. It can quickly turn into resentment and anger and disgust and actually disliking somebody and no longer wanting to be around them. 

It can change from a hot and passionate relationship lots of love and desire to one of disdain and resentment and anger. 

It is so easy for this to occur in the months following the arrival of Baby that it is surprising that it doesn't happen more often.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

Now the good news is the human body and the vagina etc were designed to have multiple offspring throughout a lifetime via natural, vaginal childbirth. 

It will heal and recover. Hormonal balances will shift over time to shift back towards preparing for and conceiving another offspring. A level of libido may return to one degree or another (but may not ever return to pre-conception levels. Mother Nature doesn't want you to die without at least replacing yourself, but may not care as much about producing more than that) 

People can and do get their sexy back. But this whole thing about getting the green flag for sex to resume is a dangerous farce. 

It's setting people up for failure. I'm an actual health care professional and I fell for it and it almost cost me my marriage. I thought by 7 weeks we should be flying our freak flag but in reality it was almost a couple years before she was functioning at a level of actual desire and full pleasure.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

So the bottom line to my essay and thesis here is the horny sex kitten you knew the night before she got pregnant is at least in a state of hibernation for awhile and by 'awhile' I mean many months and possibly a year or two before an honest, legit desire and libido comes back. 

That doesn't mean you have to spank to porn every night for the next two years. It means her body and her psyche have undergone some significant changes and her sexuality does not function the way it did before baby. 

You will need to learn to adapt and shift your sexuality to match and adjust with hers. 

I'm not saying she will be an asexual ice queen. She still wants and needs love and comfort and affection and contact. 
But where you may have been swinging from the chandeliers and she may have been riding you like a stolen horse and swatting your azz with a riding crop, she now needs cuddle time and foot rubs and back rubs and maybe offer you a handjob instead of throwing her legs over your shoulder and having you plow her like a post driver. 

Your world and your existence are over now and your pre-children days are gone forever. You now have to adapt and learn to work together and adjust to your new normal. ....... and that new normal will shift and change in a number of months or a year and so too will that new normal. Life is about change and development and evolution. Yesterday is gone. You have to work with what y'got today and prepare for tomorrow.


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## Helpunderstand (Aug 2, 2020)

After the first child, she was more willing to start after 6 weeks so we did but she had discomfort due to her walls tightening after c-section. We would ease back into it more and she was little more responsive to me but sex started to go from once every couple of weeks to a month. Then we started to try for second and since she got pregnant off of the first time trying for our second child, she maybe had sex with me twice in her first trimester than stopped until about 5 months after birth of second child. Since it was about a year since last time we had sex, it was more painful than last time we started after c-section. Then over las 6 months, it has been 5-6 times as pain isn’t an issue for last 4 times but she complains about her mood and tiredness even when I try to start with her in the afternoon. I feel she has more anger torward me how I was before kids that has built up in her mind of how I only want sex as she doesn’t like to snuggle or kiss me at all unless I start or complain that she isn’t responding to me.


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## Helpunderstand (Aug 2, 2020)

bobert said:


> So she'd rather let the baby cry longer than wake up her husband? There's a problem there. If you think she had PPD, then she likely still has it (or has it again) if you have a young baby. You cannot fix that, only she can.
> 
> I assume the baby sleeps in his/her own room? If not, put baby on your side of the bed. If the baby is in his/her own room, can you keep a baby monitor on your side of the bed and turn it up loudly so that you hear it? Alternatively, there are baby monitors made for people who are deaf or hard of hearing. You put it under your pillow and it vibrates.


She rather deal with kids than wake me up. Kids are in same room at the bottom of our beds. We try on my side before but she would still wake up after small noise where I didn’t.


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## ah_sorandy (Jul 19, 2018)

Helpunderstand said:


> Since having children, my wife and I have gone from intimacy multiple times a week to less than a month. I’ve bought her surprise gifts and taken her out in nice diners, but she complains I’m just wasting money. When I try kissing her she doesn’t want to kiss back most the time because she says I’m just trying to have sex when I only want to 10% of the time. When we do have sex, she acts like she is completely going out of her way to do it for me so I should be grateful for her time. I try giving her oral or massaging her to get her more relaxed and in the mood but she tells me it isn’t needed and to get it over with.
> I get depressed thinking she never wants me around causing me to be lethargic which just gets her madder. When I notice her getting overwhelmed, I do more around the house to try to put her in better mood but that only seems to aggravate her because “why haven’t I been doing it more?”
> When it comes to my needs, my wife never listens to them so she always complain I never meet hers. Because she thinks I’m not helping enough, she always says she is one doing all the work. I feel no matter what I do, she has to complain about something. She is very hypocritical of how I do things vs. her as she thinks I don’t try at all. For example, if I can’t find something I misplaced around the house, she complains I never look and gets an attitude. Yet when she can’t find something, she blames me for purposely hiding in a spot I know where it is. I tell her I’m not in a good place in our relationship and all she tells me to do is “man up”. This has been going on the last 2.5 years and I’m not sure where to go from here as I’m growing more upset and careless the longer she keeps this up.


This sounds so familiar to me! Unfortunately, in my case, nothing has changed for the better, and I'm now in a sexless marriage. So frustrating.

I do all of the housework and share the kitchen duties with food prep. I load and unload the diswasher and do all of the regular man chores. Sex is nowhere to be found! LOL


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## StarFires (Feb 27, 2018)

@oldshirt
So, so, so, so right you are. Some of what you wrote I had forgotten all about, but most of it I didn't think about or even know. 

The only thing you left out I hope you will consider editing to add is nerve endings. In the case of any separation of the nerves - cuts, lacerations, tears, etc. of the skin, including childbirth, episiotomy and so on - it's understood that it takes 2 or more years for them to grow back together. So along with everything you mentioned that can and does cause pain or discomfort, there is also the matter of there being no feeling at all until those nerve endings come back together. I noticed that in the area of my episiotomy and also on my back wall, where the doctor nipped my wall at the time of doing the episiotomy. What resulted was a tear in my vaginal back wall exposing my rectum. I saw a couple GYNs but neither knew anything about it. One of them told me it was just my imagination (stupid arse), and the other said he could see it but that it wasn't causing any problems (stupid arse). In other words, I must have been lying about the problems I said I was having (jeez!). I saw a female GYN who told me what it was (a rectal-vaginal fistula), described (without me having to say a word) exactly the problems I'd been having, and also scheduled surgery. I already noticed numbness in that area, but It was after surgery that I noticed feeling didn't come back for a very long time, almost 2 years. The same with other cuts and surgeries, so I know it wasn't just my imagination like that other doctor had told me.

If you decided to add that part, you really don't have to be as extensive about it as I was. I just wanted to explain what it was about so you will know that the separated nerve endings play a part for a woman after childbirth as well.


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## Mr.Married (Feb 21, 2018)

At least her mouth still works ....🤣🤣🤣🤣

Anyways... this part of marriage and children sucks balls. I can remember wishing death would come quickly but all I got was medical bills..... and PLENTY of them. The only thing related to getting pu$$y was if you visited a pet store.
This is not a nice thing to say about women but I’m going to say it: Many women will use this point in marriage to swing the power balance to them and also make unending demands. “In the name of child” will be the indefensible clause of destruction. 
I love my 2 daughters. They are 2 years apart. I spent 5 years hoping to get hit by a bus

The End


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## CatholicDad (Oct 30, 2017)

The good news I think is that the body heals. My wife and have three times the number of children of most marriages and sex is better than ever (baby stage is over).

Be careful though young man, the resentment and anger you put your wife through when going through a rocky patch may never be forgotten... hence why you should always try to be a gentleman- even when suffering. Stay away from the porn though at all costs.


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## bobert (Nov 22, 2018)

CatholicDad said:


> Be careful though young man, the resentment and anger you put your wife through when going through a rocky patch may never be forgotten...


That goes both ways, though. The wife could be doing a ton of irreparable damage as well. A guy can only take so much rejection and *****iness.

After my first child was born my wife wanted nothing to do with me and hated my existence. I wasn't allowed to touch her (hug, cuddle, etc) let alone have sex. So we were sexless for two years. 11½ years later I still have resentment towards her and there are still lingering issues on my end. She regrets ever acting like that and frequently tells other women in whatever online mom groups she's in to knock it off. That doesn't fix the resentment though. The damage is done.


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

CatholicDad said:


> Be careful though young man, the resentment and anger you put your wife through when going through a rocky patch may never be forgotten...


Absolutely... it's happened to me... I still love my wife and I wish we could patch it up, but it's too late.


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## TJW (Mar 20, 2012)

bobert said:


> A guy can only take so much rejection and *****iness.
> 
> The damage is done.


It creeps up slowly. Suddenly, you recognize that you feel nothing but contempt and animus toward her, and you resent EVERYTHING. Kids, dogs, white-picket-fence, cars, bills..... you would just do anything to get out and never come back. You are nothing more than an appliance who must remain plugged-in.


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

StarFires said:


> @oldshirt
> So, so, so, so right you are. Some of what you wrote I had forgotten all about, but most of it I didn't think about or even know.
> 
> The only thing you left out I hope you will consider editing to add is nerve endings. In the case of any separation of the nerves - cuts, lacerations, tears, etc. of the skin, including childbirth, episiotomy and so on - it's understood that it takes 2 or more years for them to grow back together. So along with everything you mentioned that can and does cause pain or discomfort, there is also the matter of there being no feeling at all until those nerve endings come back together. I noticed that in the area of my episiotomy and also on my back wall, where the doctor nipped my wall at the time of doing the episiotomy. What resulted was a tear in my vaginal back wall exposing my rectum. I saw a couple GYNs but neither knew anything about it. One of them told me it was just my imagination (stupid arse), and the other said he could see it but that it wasn't causing any problems (stupid arse). In other words, I must have been lying about the problems I said I was having (jeez!). I saw a female GYN who told me what it was (a rectal-vaginal fistula), described (without me having to say a word) exactly the problems I'd been having, and also scheduled surgery. I already noticed numbness in that area, but It was after surgery that I noticed feeling didn't come back for a very long time, almost 2 years. The same with other cuts and surgeries, so I know it wasn't just my imagination like that other doctor had told me.
> ...


He said she had C section.


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

Many women(some men also) put everything into kids and neglect the spouse. Then when the kids are gone they find they no longer have a marriage either due to neglecting their spouse.

My brother in law was about to divorce his wife as son was about to graduate, then one of the rare times he was allowed sex she became pregnant with twins. Now he is stuck for another 18-20 yrs.


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## Anastasia6 (May 28, 2017)

It seems obvious she is harboring resentment. While you have explained how wonderful you are, you need to dig deep and figure out what is going on. Do you know her love language. Gifts are only good if her love language is gifts. Try reading the 5 love languages (google it).
In addition you should try to get some marriage counseling. If you don't figure out the resentment it will build until she just doesn't love you or want to be married anymore.

Can't express enough how correct the issues of sex after childbirth can be. 
How is the sex if you go away without the kids?


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

Divinely Favored said:


> He said she had C section.


They can come with their own set of issues.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

Divinely Favored said:


> My brother in law was about to divorce his wife as son was about to graduate, then one of the rare times he was allowed sex she became pregnant with twins. Now he is stuck for another 18-20 yrs.



That may not have been an ‘accident.’


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

oldshirt said:


> That may not have been an ‘accident.’


..... and I’m not necessarily pointing the finger at her. 

Some guys will knock up chicks to keep them on a leash as well.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

Helpunderstand said:


> I’m not perfect or close to it. I am wanting other ways to help get through to my wife that I am here to help but I’m not able to do everything or know what she wants when she doesn’t communicate with me. Like I take more naps in the afternoon on some days so I can be awake to bottle feed our baby At night so she doesn’t have to get up as I’m a snorer and don’t wake up easily so she hears the baby cry first but doesn’t wake me up because I should hear and wake up as quick as she does. I tell her to mug me or shake me awake but she doesn’t want to do that. Since what I’m doing to try to communicate with her doesn’t work, I am wanting to know of ways I can do better on that from my end that is different than what I’ve attempted in the past.


If you work, and she's taking care of the kids, a SAHM, why are you worried that you don't wake up easily in the middle of the night if a kid makes a noise?

Same, why do you believe you should do 1/2 of the household work and be the one working outside the home? 

Different "jobs" can be equally important, that's for sure, so her primary job is house care and child care. Yours right now is trying to earn money for the family. 

Leave her job to her. I'm not saying either role takes a back seat to the other but it works both ways.


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## badsanta (Oct 13, 2014)

Helpunderstand said:


> When we do have sex, she acts like she is completely going out of her way to do it for me so I should be grateful for her time. I try giving her oral or massaging her to get her more relaxed and in the mood but she tells me it isn’t needed and to get it over with.


Let's call the above experience "assisted masturbation" with a spouse that is based on a give-&-take relationship economics. She will help you get off even if she is not interested herself, but she likely wants you to help her out in other ways (most likely nonsexual efforts to help her out in other areas of the relationship). 

You on the other hand are likely wanting to please her and help make a stronger emotional connection by using mutual sexual pleasure. But that is NOT what she wants and you struggle with how to reconcile her doing you a sexual favor and just wanting to get it over with. You perhaps ask yourself what happened to her desire for the sexual relationship and if something is wrong. 

There is nothing wrong. Everything is completely normal. Almost all relationship face this dynamic at some point. The honeymoon phase of your relationship is now over. The next phase of your relationship involves working on self confidence, self development, and making yourself into a happy person without holding your spouse responsible for that. You then share that confidence and happiness with your spouse in a way that creates the connection you desire with your spouse and sexual intimacy will improve. 

So work on improving your own wellbeing and help your wife improve hers as you are able to inspire her. Right now your relationship is about not tolerating low self confidence or self doubt. When one of the two of you display behaviors that are problematic in that fashion all you will give each other is tough love. That tough love is to help you grow and man up! 

Cheers, 
Badsanta


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## Anastasia6 (May 28, 2017)

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> If you work, and she's taking care of the kids, a SAHM, why are you worried that you don't wake up easily in the middle of the night if a kid makes a noise?
> 
> Same, why do you believe you should do 1/2 of the household work and be the one working outside the home?
> 
> ...


And there's the worst advice men pass out all the time. How many hours does your job involve. For most it's 40 and then you get to take a break in the evening and the weekend. If you view that a SAHM job is the kids and you have no responsibilities because she stays home then she is working 24/7 which will burn anyone out. Build resentment and I sure as hell wouldn't have sex with you. If both parents work somehow everyone understands that in the evening or at night and weekends it's a group effort. Sure if the young ones aren't too little or sick then she would be picking up more of the housework but just like any human with a job she needs a break as well.

Also you won't build much of a relationship with your kids if you don't father them.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

Anastasia6 said:


> And there's the worst advice men pass out all the time. How many hours does your job involve. For most it's 40 and then you get to take a break in the evening and the weekend. If you view that a SAHM job is the kids and you have no responsibilities because she stays home then she is working 24/7 which will burn anyone out. Build resentment and I sure as hell wouldn't have sex with you. If both parents work somehow everyone understands that in the evening or at night and weekends it's a group effort. Sure if the young ones aren't too little or sick then she would be picking up more of the housework but just like any human with a job she needs a break as well.
> 
> Also you won't build much of a relationship with your kids if you don't father them.


Kindly, you didn't read my post too thoroughly and are adding your own tilt to it.

Notice:

I didn't say to not be a helpful husband. 

I didn't say to don't be a shirking father or family man.

I did say both her "job" and his "job" are equally important. 

I didn't say drop in an armchair as soon as you get home.

I didn't say don't be a loving and thoughtful partner to your W.

I mean really.


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## Anastasia6 (May 28, 2017)

You really did say her job is childcare and his is earning money and to leave her to her job. What exactly did you mean?


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## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

@Helpunderstand this is a tough time in a married couples life with two young kids and two working adults. It seems you are helping her out substantially but it would be interesting to see what she would say about this. Sometimes spouses of the male gender think they are doing half of the chores when in reality it is only about 20% (some also want gold stars for what they do). Ok, ok I am being facetious. You have made a very strong case on here and communication is lacking. I suggest you sit down and write her a nice letter, you love her, your family, you are not her enemy, you are her life partner, you miss her and intimacy and want to be able to move forward together. Ask her to open up to you about why she feels the way she does. Sometimes letter writing helps as it removes the angst and defensiveness.
is it possible to get her mum to take care of the kids and take her away for a weekend?

_When it comes to my needs, my wife never listens to them so she always complain I never meet hers. _
Go away for the weekend together and read His Needs Her Needs. I sense you only bother with her if she is getting mad or you want sex, not really an engaged partner.


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## jsmart (Mar 14, 2015)

It sounds like you’re trying to do your share of the chores and childcare. I would add to do them without a face or attitude. Our wives can pick up on that. If she gets on you for not doing it her way, tell her in a jokingly way to stop being so controlling. 

Now I have to ask, have you let yourself go physically? if so, get to work on getting physically fit. Since we can’t even go to the gym during these times, a vigorous home workout routine is imperative. Also, make sure you are taking care of the rest of your appearance ( hygiene, hair, beard, clothes, etc).
Everyone here is thinking it’s some issue with vaginal discomfort but then why did she also change to also not want to snuggle and watch Tv together? Instead is on the phone and takes her conversations outside? Who is she talking to? Are you sure about that?


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

It sounds like you’re trying to do your share of the chores and childcare. I would add to do them without a face or attitude. Our wives can pick up on that. If she gets on you for not doing it her way, tell her in a jokingly way to stop being so controlling.

That really pissed me off. Wife *****ing that she had to do everything! I kept up the mowing, trimming and hedges in the yard, as well as maintenance on the vehicles. Inside i helped with laundry, dishes, vaccumed, cooked many of the meals, changing kids, feedings at night when she would wake me up. On one of her rants about how she does everything i reminded her of some of the things i do also. She gave me a snide look and said "What! Do you want me to give you a cookie?!" At that point is when my switch flipped and i dropped 50# in under 2 months and hit the weights hard. I was mentally preparing for either she gets on board or gets left behind. It scared the crap out of her as her prior marriage was to a serial cheater. I do not hold my tongue any more. If something is wrong she knows it. If what she is wearing is not appropriate, she knows it. If she asks, she is told what i think. I will not be brooding about something and let her think all is well.


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## Electric Prune (Aug 11, 2020)

Helpunderstand said:


> Since having children, my wife and I have gone from intimacy multiple times a week to less than a month. I’ve bought her surprise gifts and taken her out in nice diners, but she complains I’m just wasting money. When I try kissing her she doesn’t want to kiss back most the time because she says I’m just trying to have sex when I only want to 10% of the time. When we do have sex, she acts like she is completely going out of her way to do it for me so I should be grateful for her time. I try giving her oral or massaging her to get her more relaxed and in the mood but she tells me it isn’t needed and to get it over with.
> I get depressed thinking she never wants me around causing me to be lethargic which just gets her madder. When I notice her getting overwhelmed, I do more around the house to try to put her in better mood but that only seems to aggravate her because “why haven’t I been doing it more?”
> When it comes to my needs, my wife never listens to them so she always complain I never meet hers. Because she thinks I’m not helping enough, she always says she is one doing all the work. I feel no matter what I do, she has to complain about something. She is very hypocritical of how I do things vs. her as she thinks I don’t try at all. For example, if I can’t find something I misplaced around the house, she complains I never look and gets an attitude. Yet when she can’t find something, she blames me for purposely hiding in a spot I know where it is. I tell her I’m not in a good place in our relationship and all she tells me to do is “man up”. This has been going on the last 2.5 years and I’m not sure where to go from here as I’m growing more upset and careless the longer she keeps this up.


Have you tried cuddling her rather than kissing? I’ve heard many women really value this and that it can lead to them being more open to more physical intimacy...


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## jsmart (Mar 14, 2015)

Divinely Favored said:


> She gave me a snide look and said "What! Do you want me to give you a cookie?!" At that point is when my switch flipped and i dropped 50# in under 2 months and hit the weights hard. I was mentally preparing for either she gets on board or gets left behind. It scared the crap out of her as her prior marriage was to a serial cheater. I do not hold my tongue any more. If something is wrong she knows it. If what she is wearing is not appropriate, she knows it. If she asks, she is told what i think. I will not be brooding about something and let her think all is well.


Love this. Dread works. If she doesn’t wake up, you’re ready to hit the market running.


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## re16 (Oct 9, 2012)

So, your story sounds very much like mine. Although now my kids are 10 and 9. I think it is safe to say that some women change permanently when they have kids. I held out hope that mine would revert back to some semblance of her former self, but that hasn't happened. I was the one pushing for improving the marriage when this all started to crumble, initiating multiple rounds of individual and couples counseling. Counselors generally fully agreed with my view and wanted to work on her which was enraging to her.

Your wife is in the mode of it is her versus the world. You, husband are part of the world. Contrary to what you may believe, you two are not a team, and it is not the two of you together versus the world as it should be. She only perceives how all these "demands" on her effect her, not you. She actually doesn't care about what you are going through at all right now. She likely talks a bunch of crap about you to her friends. The best part is that her isolating you like she is actually works as a disincentive for you to help her.

My advice for you is this, it is time to man up and kick ass at life regardless of your wife's negativity. This is really your only chance. You can't change her. You can only manage yourself, so do that well. 

Hold yourself to a high standard for yourself and your kids.
Take care of your body like never before. This is is very important for you get through this so why it is first.
Dial in the house on the regular, as if you were living in it with just you and the kids and had no one to count on...(also this isn't much work at all and can be done quickly).
Don't ask her to do anything for you.
Enjoy your kids, just because they are a burden to her, don't let that effect how you parent. Everytime she makes a negative comment about how hard kids are blah blah blah, talk about how great they are.
Be positive.
Forget about pushing sex for now, this may cause her to start paying attention, plus it is weak to beg for sex.
Don't let her inability to be a mother and a wife at the same time drag you down... life is short, why waste even a month in her negative vortex, decide to have a positive mindset now.
If she makes rude or negative comments, call her on the comment in a calm way....do not let it slide. Being a pushover is not attractive.

It is a significant possibility that she won't change, you need to realize this. If you do the above, you will be well prepared in a year or so to end the situation if needed. You will have the confidence that you can deal with it alone. There is a chance she may see how much you kick butt in life and change her tune, but don't count on it. When you threaten to take away her financial stability (and you mean it - not an idle threat), she may re-evaluate her behavior.... but you have to be ready to lose the marriage / walk away for this to be real and work.

If you can satisfy yourself and truly believe that you are a good husband and father, yet she doesn't treat you that way, it will be easier to make the decision to end if it you choose to.

She will either get on board with being a team with you or not. Move forward based on her actions, not what she tells you, and don't look back.

I'm sorry this is happening to you.


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## WandaJ (Aug 5, 2014)

Mr.Married said:


> At least her mouth still works ....🤣🤣🤣🤣
> 
> Anyways... this part of marriage and children sucks balls. I can remember wishing death would come quickly but all I got was medical bills..... and PLENTY of them. The only thing related to getting pu$$y was if you visited a pet store.
> This is not a nice thing to say about women but I’m going to say it: Many women will use this point in marriage to swing the power balance to them and also make unending demands. “In the name of child” will be the indefensible clause of destruction.
> ...


if it was that hard on you, imagine how hard it was on your wife.

For me the years when kids were small were very depressive. I loved them, and they were many cute and sweet, but in general babies and diapers are not my idea of fun. I am enjoying them much more now, in teenage years. When I see family on the beach running after toddlers, I have PTSD.....


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

This is why a man has to have a boat and like to fish.

As long as things are covered and squared away re home and bills these are good fishing years.

There, I said it out loud. But balance in all things, so is good.


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## WandaJ (Aug 5, 2014)

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> This is why a man has to have a boat and like to fish.
> 
> As long as things are covered and squared away re home and bills these are good fishing years.
> 
> There, I said it out loud. But balance in all things, so is good.


And who squares those things at home when man is on the boat?.....


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## examp (Aug 6, 2020)

My wife is not that different to yours if you read my story and I havent found the solution. I havent read everything but have you had counselling. It sounds like that whatever you do is wrong. Doing more wont make it right. Doing less might. Whatever anyone says on here, doing a paid job is harder than looking after kids and needs more leisure time. I think you said only two and that isnt the end of the earth. There is no reason why two kids have to have two people to mother them. You can make as many lists as you like that is not going to help. That means a partnership not a marriage. Maybe a separation would be a good idea. See how she manages without you. Absence can make the heart grow fonder.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

WandaJ said:


> And who squares those things at home when man is on the boat?.....



As long as H is keeping things ie bills, home maintenance, cars, big picture, (and small picture, as he and W agreeably team up on setting preferences) etc, then when the W says she's too tired for lovin', it benefits both for a H to say ok and head out.

Not neglecting her, kids, spelling her, etc, but also not overly concerned if she wants to ride the I'm too tired pony too much. 
Just give her the benefit of the doubt fir a while, make sure you as a H are there for her, but don't be afraid to do your own thing if she chooses to spend a bit more time on kids.

For a while, don't let that get too out of hand either.

Balance.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

I am speaking more of the traditional style marriages, and that's ok.

It's not that either his or her responsibilities are more important than the other, but it's prudent to recognize in advance these will be stressful years, and many a Hs sanity is saved by spending a few hours in the water here and there.

Then, when the kids are about 4 to 5yrs old, start taking them with you. That spells the W.

And you'll already have a boat!


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