# Interesting problem, with a twist



## altawa (Jan 4, 2015)

I am reposting here from another site. I was referred here, and think that advice I see given is sound (I have been lurking for a bit).



> This is a fairly long story, but I am going to try to keep it as short as I can. About 11 years ago, I met the woman that would become my wife. She had just gotten out of a three month relationship with a guy. They would meet at a hotel and screw, she would pay. Then she would go to work, and he would go wherever. Eventually, they broke up. I got with her in the winter. Admitedly, we got married quickly (as in a few months later). While we were dating, I was going through the process to join the Navy. I went to boot camp, and spent 2.5 months in Chicago.
> 
> During that time, her a$shole ex boyfriend started messaging her on AIM. He convinced her over the time I was gone to go see him. She agreed, and they set a time and date. She was supposed to go down after my graduation from boot camp, that evening, before she had to leave the state again to go back to California. I was locked down in Chicago, as I was leaving the next day. I had no idea this was going on at all. We spent my graduation day together, then parted ways. She was supposed to go back to California after visiting 'family' in Illinois (we both have family there), then follow me to my next location for school.
> 
> ...


That is my story. Here is some amplifying information: Since then, I basically swept it under the rug. I never dealt with it the way I should have. I was young, dumb, and did not have the resources available to me then as I do now (including this site). We have stayed together, and up until the last few months, I didn't needle her about it. As far as she was concerned, we were past it and it was all but forgotten. Over this time, it has truly eaten me. Deployments are murder on me, with me always worrying.

Last September, we have this argument over facebook chat (we are in a LDR right now due to military orders) and she starts mentioning that she is lonely. Then she loves me but isn't in love with me. Then she says she doesn't want to stay with me just because it is comfortable and safe. After this argument, a few days later, she says she was just upset and lonely, and didn't mean any of it. Then in October, she starts facebook researching one of her other ex's (and doesn't tell me about it). This goes on for about a week, and she doesn't find anything (he didn't have a profile at the time). In November, we were back home (funeral) and we are alone in the car. I don't even remember what we were talking about, but she mentions that she was looking him up. She knows that I hate her ex's after the first incident, and after that we agreed that she would never ever attempt to make contact or have anything to do with them ever again because of it. I get pissed. I was gripping the steering wheel so tight that I am surprised it still doesn't have finger indentions in it. I blow up on her, and she says she was only doing it to see how far he had fallen, that she had heard he had turned to meth and been arrested and she wanted to see how he turned out. My mind sees me being away (just like boot camp) and her searching out ex's on the computer (just like boot camp), all after we had that argument in September. At this point I snooped her history and saw what she was searching. I also found that she had tried to get his address a few times, once a couple of years ago and once this past spring. She said it was to send sympathy cards when he had relatives die (we are from a pretty small area and she knows his family too). She never told me about any of it.

Here is the twist: This basically broke me mentally and opened up everything that I have bottled up the last decade. I am realizing that I never dealt with it before. When we have fought about it, she has told me to just 'get over it', that she never went to his house and she doesn't see it as cheating.

So, I want to do the therapy bit (MC), and she does too, but we are 1000 miles apart with separate careers, and wont be living together again for about 2 more years. I am leaning towards us doing separate counseling until we can be together.


Am I wrong....to me this is cheating, as much as if she went and screwed this guy. I ask for details now, that I should have done then, and she says she doesn't remember. To me, something as big as going to some other guys house to screw around on your husband should be something that kind of sticks in your mind.....I am not asking for a minute by minute breakdown, but more like 'who initiated contact', 'was it by phone or computer only', etc. 

I just really wonder if I will ever get over it. I am to the point of not sleeping well (havent since September, really), not trusting her, eating like crap and just generally being miserable. I am basically alone (no family, no real friends that I can talk to about this) here, and won't talk to family about it because I don't want anybody to know.

Sorry if this seems like rambling. I will be here to answer what questions I can. I get busy from time to time, but I will keep checking this thread. Just talking about it helps some, but I need to get this figured out.


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## vms (Dec 17, 2014)

altawa said:


> I am reposting here from another site. I was referred here, and think that advice I see given is sound (I have been lurking for a bit).
> 
> 
> 
> ...


She may not remember it. It's been a long time, after all, and this is something that is a much bigger deal to you than her. You've kept that memory alive, tended to it, fed the resentment it brought along, and have made it your pet.

As an example, yesterday my husband brought up an incident from over two years ago, something seriously minor if you ask me (not changing the battery in a smoke alarm so it was still beeping when he came home from work), and he remembered every detail from it. Me? I cannot for the life of me recall any bit of it. It wasn't an issue to me. I had no reason to store that memory on the front shelf. He did though, because it bothered him.

I do understand the LDR thing - my husband is military and just got back from two years overseas. It is the hardest kind of relationship to have. It is incredibly hard to keep trust alive that way. 

Your wife may be telling the truth. She may be lying. Only she knows.

As for her accusing you of cheating - I've done that, even though I had no proof of it, because I had seen so many military spouses I knew from where I'm from cheat while the husband was away, or heard tales of the husbands doing the same. I had been told by numerous people that "Men stationed in Korea always cheat. It's too easy not to." 

So then you see "signs" of it - from BOTH sides. Delayed response to an email? Must be busy with someone else. Doesnt' answer the phone (we used an app called Kakao to talk for free)? Must be busy with someone else. Doesn't seem as affectionate this week? Well clearly someone else is getting that affection.

The truth is that affection is hard to maintain without being together in person more than once or twice a year. Incredibly hard. The bonds that are formed, and kept, in a marriage rely on that physical proximity. There are only so many ways to make up for that in an LDR, especially when dealing with huge time zone differences (he was 16 hours ahead of me).

In your counseling, you need to learn how to trust her again IF you want to trust her again. You need to learn what you could be doing that is pushing her away (and accusing you of cheating does not always mean that she herself has a guilty conscious, it could just mean she sees you pulling away, has people telling her that "it's just what men do when deployed, etc.). 

On the other hand, you two married very quickly. There is absolutely no way you two were ready for it. You are not the same people you were 10 years ago. You have both changed. You may not have changed in a manner that is conducive to being a married couple. It sucks, but it happens. I am damn sure not the woman that my husband started dating in 2011, and he is not that man. There's a lot that is the same, but we've both changed a lot. We have new hobbies, new interests, new outlooks.

What she did was cheating, yes. I doubt anyone here will tell you otherwise. But it was a long time ago. 

I don't know if she was honest about why she looked up her ex. I can tell you that if someone told me about an ex that had become a methhead, I'd be nosy and look too. It wouldn't be anything but nosiness. The sympathy card thing could be her telling the truth as well. I come from a small town and yeah, I am still in touch with many of my ex's families because they were good people. If they had a death in the family, expressing my condolences would not be out of line (not for myself, and not for the culture of this area - I'm sure other areas would view it differently).

She probably feels like it's been so long that you do need to let it go. If you want to keep your marriage, then yes, you DO need to let it go. You need to talk to your wife the same way you did when you two were dating. You need to give her a reason to fall in love with you again. She can't do that while you are still seething with fear and resentment. If this is how you were when she met you, she wouldn't have dated you in the first place, so you will have to let it go if you want to move on.

She also needs to acknowledge the hurt that it caused you. However, she does not need to offer herself up on a platter for you to berate and abuse her for it, either. If she apologizes, YOU ACCEPT IT.

"she starts mentioning that she is lonely. Then she loves me but isn't in love with me. Then she says she doesn't want to stay with me just because it is comfortable and safe"

I can honestly say I felt this way about my husband many times while he was gone. I WAS lonely. After all, friends and family can't take the place of my partner. Her friends and family cant' take the place of you. I sometimes wondered if I was with him out of familiarity. You know what? He wondered the same thing, too.

What do you two do together? Do you have scheduled phone calls? Do you Skype? Do you read books together? Do you get on Skype or the phone and watch a movie or TV show at the same time? Do you write love notes? Do you show your appreciation for her sticking with you while you're away? What do you two do that keeps the love fires stoked? It's hard in an LDR, but not impossible.

Are there other things she does that contributes to your worries that she's cheating?


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## PhillyGuy13 (Nov 29, 2013)

Do you guys have kids together?

You don't trust her. With good reason. She messed up big time 11 years ago. No way after what happened would you ever have 100 percent trust in her. 

You have and continue to live apart. Are there positives to continuing this relationship vs cutting ties?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## altawa (Jan 4, 2015)

vms said:


> She may not remember it. It's been a long time, after all, and this is something that is a much bigger deal to you than her. You've kept that memory alive, tended to it, fed the resentment it brought along, and have made it your pet.
> 
> As an example, yesterday my husband brought up an incident from over two years ago, something seriously minor if you ask me (not changing the battery in a smoke alarm so it was still beeping when he came home from work), and he remembered every detail from it. Me? I cannot for the life of me recall any bit of it. It wasn't an issue to me. I had no reason to store that memory on the front shelf. He did though, because it bothered him.


If this was about a smoke detector, I wouldn't be upset about her memory lapses. I forget things too. This decision, however, was made by her to step outside of our marriage, set up a sex date with an ex, lie to me about it while visiting me when she knew I couldn't leave the base, then..... I don't buy that she doesn't remember basic parts of that such as 'who initiated contact' or 'was it on the phone or just on the computer'. I think this is sufficiently a big enough deal on both sides to not forget things like that.


vms said:


> I do understand the LDR thing - my husband is military and just got back from two years overseas. It is the hardest kind of relationship to have. It is incredibly hard to keep trust alive that way.


Yes it is.


vms said:


> Your wife may be telling the truth. She may be lying. Only she knows.
> 
> As for her accusing you of cheating - I've done that, even though I had no proof of it, because I had seen so many military spouses I knew from where I'm from cheat while the husband was away, or heard tales of the husbands doing the same. I had been told by numerous people that "Men stationed in Korea always cheat. It's too easy not to."
> 
> So then you see "signs" of it - from BOTH sides. Delayed response to an email? Must be busy with someone else. Doesnt' answer the phone (we used an app called Kakao to talk for free)? Must be busy with someone else. Doesn't seem as affectionate this week? Well clearly someone else is getting that affection.


That is the number one reason I have been nothing but transparent about our lives with her. Her problem with me is that she feels like I have lied to her all these years about it being alright. I guess I did. Instead of her helping me work through it, I get from her "get over it" and "I don't remember". I swear it is almost like she is just ignoring it all hoping it will go away again and she doesn't have to deal with it. If I try to bring anything up or ask any questions at this point, I just get arguments and attitude from her like I shouldn't even be questioning her about it.


vms said:


> The truth is that affection is hard to maintain without being together in person more than once or twice a year. Incredibly hard. The bonds that are formed, and kept, in a marriage rely on that physical proximity. There are only so many ways to make up for that in an LDR, especially when dealing with huge time zone differences (he was 16 hours ahead of me).


I agree. I do little things for her from time to time just to show her I am thinking of her: I send her edible arrangements/flowers to work, send her little e-cards, etc. She loves it and posts on facebook about it, but it doesn't make up for not being there.


vms said:


> In your counseling, you need to learn how to trust her again IF you want to trust her again. You need to learn what you could be doing that is pushing her away (and accusing you of cheating does not always mean that she herself has a guilty conscious, it could just mean she sees you pulling away, has people telling her that "it's just what men do when deployed, etc.).


I want to trust her again. I just don't know if I can....that is the problem. In me trying to work through this, I just get attitude and snark from her about it. She still doesn't see it as cheating, but just goes with it when I have told her she is wrong in the same manner that somebody agrees with somebody else just to get the argument over: They agree in the argument, but in her mind she still thinks it is not cheating and thinks as long as she never actually went it is ok. She admits that it was wrong, but puts it on a completely different level than I do, as is obvious.


vms said:


> On the other hand, you two married very quickly. There is absolutely no way you two were ready for it. You are not the same people you were 10 years ago. You have both changed. You may not have changed in a manner that is conducive to being a married couple. It sucks, but it happens. I am damn sure not the woman that my husband started dating in 2011, and he is not that man. There's a lot that is the same, but we've both changed a lot. We have new hobbies, new interests, new outlooks.


We did marry quickly. We were not unknown to each other. Small areas like that make it so that you tend to run around in the same circles and get to know some of the same people. Not saying that made us ready to get married, but she wasn't a total stranger off the street either.


vms said:


> What she did was cheating, yes. I doubt anyone here will tell you otherwise. But it was a long time ago.


My problem is that I never dealt with it initially....so now I am basically dealing with it like it just happened because that is how it feels to me. Between that and her deciding in her mind that she didn't cheat is making this unbearable.


vms said:


> I don't know if she was honest about why she looked up her ex. I can tell you that if someone told me about an ex that had become a methhead, I'd be nosy and look too. It wouldn't be anything but nosiness. The sympathy card thing could be her telling the truth as well. I come from a small town and yeah, I am still in touch with many of my ex's families because they were good people. If they had a death in the family, expressing my condolences would not be out of line (not for myself, and not for the culture of this area - I'm sure other areas would view it differently).


If it weren't for the stuff at the beginning of our marriage, it probably would have been nothing of this proportion. Basically, her doing this is triggering me to relive the first event. What is worse is that she knew about our agreement to never have anything to do with any of her ex's ever again, and that is something else she has conveniently forgotten.


vms said:


> She probably feels like it's been so long that you do need to let it go. If you want to keep your marriage, then yes, you DO need to let it go. You need to talk to your wife the same way you did when you two were dating. You need to give her a reason to fall in love with you again. She can't do that while you are still seething with fear and resentment. If this is how you were when she met you, she wouldn't have dated you in the first place, so you will have to let it go if you want to move on.


I can't just turn it off. If it were that simple, I wouldn't be where I am today.


vms said:


> She also needs to acknowledge the hurt that it caused you. However, she does not need to offer herself up on a platter for you to berate and abuse her for it, either. If she apologizes, YOU ACCEPT IT.


She acknowledges that she did something bad. However, she plays it down to a level and tries to make me feel like I am being ridiculous because she says it is not cheating. With that being the case, why would I accept a hollow apology from her, that feels as if it is nothing more than trying to shut down an argument/my feelings so she can go on with her perfect life (what she tells me she has).


vms said:


> "she starts mentioning that she is lonely. Then she loves me but isn't in love with me. Then she says she doesn't want to stay with me just because it is comfortable and safe"
> 
> I can honestly say I felt this way about my husband many times while he was gone. I WAS lonely. After all, friends and family can't take the place of my partner. Her friends and family cant' take the place of you. I sometimes wondered if I was with him out of familiarity. You know what? He wondered the same thing, too.


I understand her being lonely. I am too. I am not looking up ex's....I never cheated on her with an ex (or anybody else). I never explicitly broke an agreement to leave ex's in the past and not dig/search/contact them.


vms said:


> What do you two do together? Do you have scheduled phone calls? Do you Skype? Do you read books together? Do you get on Skype or the phone and watch a movie or TV show at the same time? Do you write love notes? Do you show your appreciation for her sticking with you while you're away? What do you two do that keeps the love fires stoked? It's hard in an LDR, but not impossible.


I call her on my way home every night. I text her throughout the day both on facebook chat and her phone. We skype (mostly with the kids). I send her things and cards and whatnot. I have burned my leave balance to zero going back and forth between here and home.


vms said:


> Are there other things she does that contributes to your worries that she's cheating?


Adding everything up from September to early December, it just doesn't make any sense. And, September is when I found out about the first one, 10 years ago. With me not being there, it wouldnt take anything for her to have another FB/burner phone/email that I have zero idea of.


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## altawa (Jan 4, 2015)

PhillyGuy13 said:


> Do you guys have kids together?
> 
> You don't trust her. With good reason. She messed up big time 11 years ago. No way after what happened would you ever have 100 percent trust in her.
> 
> ...


Yes, we have children. 2 boys. I do love her, and we seem to do well together, but I fear/worry that she is only with me because she doesn't want to be compared to her mother (who is a serial cheater), she is comfortable, and it is easier.


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## lovesmanis (Oct 9, 2014)

Is there a way that she can come closer to you while you are deployed?


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## altawa (Jan 4, 2015)

lovesmanis said:


> Is there a way that she can come closer to you while you are deployed?


No, not feasibly. We can't get out of our house, she would lose her retirement time, kids are screwed up enough from moving around my whole career. I deploy often and go to the desert, so they couldn't come if they wanted to.


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## altawa (Jan 4, 2015)

Oh, and to top it off: Apparently ex2 (the recent research project) created a facebook page on Dec 1. Now, he pops up in my 'people you may know' because it is a small area and we know some of the same people. I am just waiting until he tries to add her now. Nothing like a daily reminder of this crap, as if I didn't have enough of a reminder as it is.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

altawa said:


> Her problem with me is that she feels like I have lied to her all these years about it being alright.


Says the cheater.

Of course she does. That way SHE isn't up for inspection. 'YOUR sin is worse than MY sin.'


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## altawa (Jan 4, 2015)

turnera said:


> Says the cheater.
> 
> Of course she does. That way SHE isn't up for inspection. 'YOUR sin is worse than MY sin.'


Yeah. Tell me about it. Almost word for word what she has said a couple of times. "I screwed up 10 years ago......you have lied this whole time"...


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Read LifeScript's page. Your wife is his wife. She rules by guilting. 

Stop letting her.


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## wmn1 (Aug 27, 2014)

altawa said:


> I am reposting here from another site. I was referred here, and think that advice I see given is sound (I have been lurking for a bit).
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Not rambling and that's why we're here


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## altawa (Jan 4, 2015)

I know she remembers. It is infuriating to me that she wont answer me. As far as a mechanism to ensure she doesn't cheat at this point, all I can do is hope really.

My biggest problem isnt that I think she is cheating right now, or necessarily looking, although that does pop in my mind. My biggest problem is that I don't know the whole truth about the situation from years ago, and I am one of those guys that needs the details. Somebody else mentioned it in another thread, I need the details to know exactly what I am forgiving, and if I was lied to all these years.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

You could always tell her you need them and will be scheduling a polygraph; else you just can't stay.


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## G.J. (Nov 4, 2014)

I really don't see how this can work with you being away so much and the way you described her mind set.

She sounds as if any chance of a workable marriage with her would need some one around the house a lot more

I do hope the best for you


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## NoChoice (Feb 12, 2012)

OP,
You're going to have this problem until such time as she realizes how serious this breach of trust is to you and sees how deeply it affects you. She has no reason to fix a problem that to her isn't a problem. Your struggle is going to be making her understand and see that it is a significant problem. Unless of course she is attempting to cheat in which case she will deny everything and play it all down as cover. Talk with her and try to convey the gravity of the situation and gauge her response. There isn't a lot you can do from so far away. Good luck and thank you for your service.


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## tulsy (Nov 30, 2012)

vms said:


> ...
> What she did was cheating, yes. I doubt anyone here will tell you otherwise. *But it was a long time ago.*
> ...


Of course it was cheating. It was rug-swept and the whole truth was never revealed, so it's not going to go away under those circumstances.

I disagree that it was a long time ago. The original incident, fine, that may have been a long time ago, but the lies are still fresh and perpetuated, and she continues to search for other men *to this day*. It's not like she altered her bad behavior years ago and became a faithful wife.

Of course you would have trust issues with this woman. Is this relationship even worth saving?


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## altawa (Jan 4, 2015)

Yes, I feel it is worth saving. Over the last weeks, she has shown what I believe to be true remorse.

As we have talked about things, and she has seen my side of it, she has basically broken down and realized how bad she really hurt me. Also, all the forgetting went away and I finally got a bunch of the answers I was looking for.

I don't believe she has done anything since (no evidence of anything, and I semi bluffed her and she never even waivered). I think the recent events were as she stated.

I am still trying to work through it though.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Good time for MC.


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## G.J. (Nov 4, 2014)

altawa said:


> Yes, I feel it is worth saving. Over the last weeks, she has shown what I believe to be true remorse.
> 
> As we have talked about things, and she has seen my side of it, she has basically broken down and realized how bad she really hurt me. Also, all the forgetting went away and I finally got a bunch of the answers I was looking for.
> 
> ...


Go to Thounds thread and tell him the results that can do..only kidding

Glad things are a bit more positive for you
Fingers crossed for you


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## altawa (Jan 4, 2015)

So, I guess we can call this an update. I put a lot of this in a PM earlier, thought I might as well word vomit it out here too.

Since my last post, we have continued to talk. We had a rather heated conversation on night that carried on to the next morning over facebook that was basically her getting pissed at me and saying she never cheated. She sent me the google definition of adultery, which specifically mentioned sexual contact outside marriage, and said "see, even the dictionary says I didn't cheat". (she was using the link for dictionary.com). Well, I got pissed and ignored her the rest of the day. I told her that until she could figure out what she had done and how it affected me, I was done talking to her. She tried to get me to talk to her all day while I was at work, but I kept ignoring her. That night, I was back home, and she was goading me to talk. I was giving up very little. Well, she pressed a button and we were fighting again over facebook. I had sent her 'rules for the wayward spouse' and something else that illustrated what I was going through (that was damn accurate). At one point, at almost midnight, she must have been doing google searches. She stopped responding for a few minutes, then came back with a blurb from a web page talking about how emotional affairs are as bad as physical ones, but that the waywards convince themselves that they didnt do anything wrong since there was not physical contact (which I still don't 100% believe. No way to ever know though). She said she was sorry, read some more, and said that I was right, completely. She never viewed it as cheating, but that she was completely wrong. At this point, I had given up trying to convince her. She found all this on her own and came to this revelation on her own. She said that what she was reading was a real slap in the face to her, and she found it on her own.

Since then we have talked more. She answers my questions as much as she can, and if I want to talk about something she always says ask away. I guess that is the 'good'.

The 'bad' is that she is getting impatient, at least that is what she tells me. She feels like when I bring up the past and ask questions, that it is keeping us stuck in the past. She wants to focus on us now and our happy life, and having a fun and happy future. I asked her what happens when she runs out of patience and she says she will probably start being a ***** and start ignoring the questions. I told her that was bullsh!+, that she is the one that caused this, and if I have questions I think I should get the answers without a bunch of snark, *****iness, or having her ignore them. She has said the impatient bit a couple of times, and always within the conversation she says she wont ignore me and she understands, but that every time I ask a question it hurts her and takes her back to a past that she doesn't want to relive. She seems to have finally coupled what she did what what it has done to me, and now she is getting eaten up with guilt over it. Knowing her as well as I do, I can say this is genuine guilt she is feeling, and when I do ask questions it triggers her guilt even more. I want to take this as a positive sign, but the defesiveness is why I list it as a 'bad'.

She has started remembering things that she previously told me she forgot. On her trip back to our actual house from here, when we had the big fight about her not remembering problem, she said she racked her brain trying to remember everything she could. Truthfully, when I was asking her questions, she was word vomiting everything she could think of. I got answers that were much more in depth than I was expecting, but still didn't get all my questions answered. There is still some 'I dont remember', and I dont know if those are truthful, or to keep from hurting me.

Where do I go from here? I don't know. I don't think I can divorce her. I have found no evidence that she has tried anything, done anything, or even thought about it since then, and she is adamant that she hasn't. If I had it to do again, way back when, I don't know what I would have done, but I think I would have divorced. That is almost my default answer to infidelity now....deal with it head on and it is probably, 99% of the time, not worth saving. I have two kids now and it has been a long time. Sunk cost fallacy, but the best I can say is don't make my mistakes. She does know, however, that if anything like this ever happens again, I am gone. And, I am not kidding about it. I wish I had found this site way back when, but I don't even know if it was around or near as developed as it is.

I am sure I am leaving some stuff out. If you have questions, fire away. I will try to answer as best I can. 

Again, sorry for the wall of text.


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## Decorum (Sep 7, 2012)

altwa, I am sorry, its quite a blow and all still very fresh.

I just now read your story above and don't know if you have posted more, but she sounds like she has a moral compass, some don't.

Give it some time and acknowledge her pain as well, you both have to recover from this and she will probably be hard on herself as well. If she is truly remorseful then when you can affirm her for her good qualities.

She needs to keep helping you heal too, just don't blow things up to early if you feel that you will stay together as you say.

Tell her you are going to work hard to process this and deal with the pain and uncertainty, and that you will have to do it together.

"Whatever it takes"

I wish you well, take care!


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## altawa (Jan 4, 2015)

Decorum said:


> altwa, I am sorry, its quite a blow and all still very fresh.
> 
> I just now read your story above and don't know if you have posted more, but she sounds like she has a moral compass, some don't.
> 
> ...


I havent really posted more about the incident itself. In reality, I will never truly know how far it went.....I will never know if she actually went and is just not telling me. I can't even think of a way to prove it one way or the other.

Moral compass....I hope so. I think so. 

Something I left out of the update is that I am still on the rollercoaster so to speak. Some days I am fine, some days I trigger and am not. Some days I don't trigger and I'm not ok. 

Today is one of the 'didn't trigger, but still not ok' days. Can't sleep, didnt particularly eat much today.

One of the hardest parts of this particular situation (at least in my eyes) is that I now question my whole marriage. Has it been a lie all these years? Did she stay with me after the incident because she felt bad, did she really want to be with me and screwed up, does she feel trapped in the marriage (moreso now that we have children), etc. And I can ask her all that, and she can answer......but the sad truth is that I still don't trust her answers. I don't know if I will ever trust her all the way again. Its been 14 years.

It just sucks.


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## Decorum (Sep 7, 2012)

Well if it helps to know (and if you have read other posts it will confirm it), what you are going through is completely normal for a man in your situation.

I have no doubt I would feel the same.

What we typically recommend is that you begin to work on yourself, make sure you are investing in yourself.

We usually do this before we get into a relationship and this is often part of what attracts our partner.

I don't know what your life is like, but if you can start hitting the gym, lifting is a must, and it will help you concentrate on something else, even sleep better.

Start working toward believing that you have a life and you will be ok without her, that confidence and independence will be attractive to her, not saying to be a jerk, just be your own person.

Let her seek you some.

Small steps, you need to rebuild your self esteem and your relationship with her, it is hard to fake a real connection for long, and connecting with her is what will help your confidence. But let her seek you don't chase her, and when you can then "connect" with her see what she offers, what she brings to the relationship now!

Have you read a married mans sex life? Its not a sex manual it about recovering or maintaining what attracted our partner in the first place and not losing it as we become more domesticated, give it a read. There is a good website for it to.

Take care.


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## altawa (Jan 4, 2015)

Decorum said:


> Well if it helps to know (and if you have read other posts it will confirm it), what you are going through is completely normal for a man in your situation.
> 
> I have no doubt I would feel the same.
> 
> ...


I have read other posts here. I understand that this is a normal reaction. I lurked a bit before I joined, and have been reading ever since.

Working on myself....yeah, I do that. 


Reading MMSLP, I have not gone cover to cover, but yes, I am familiar with it.

Another part of me wonders if I am blowing this out of proportion. Reading some of the stories on here (and there are some that could equally drive me to tears and rage at the same time), I have no proof it went physical, and from her telling she stopped herself from going. At this point, that is all I can go on because it has been so long, I have no way to prove or disprove it.

I just know it hurts. The not knowing is very hard.


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

She sounds like she is ready to rug sweep with her wanting to "worry about the now". Don't allow it. Work through things at your pace. If is too much for her, or too long for her, show her where the door is.


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## sammy3 (Jun 5, 2011)

OP, 
The affair happened 10 years ago? You have been living like this for the past 10 years? Am I correct? 

~sammy


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## river rat (Jan 20, 2012)

altawa said:


> I have read other posts here. I understand that this is a normal reaction. I lurked a bit before I joined, and have been reading ever since.
> 
> Working on myself....yeah, I do that.
> 
> ...


 No, you are not blowing this out of proportion. Like many here, the ill effects you have experienced from the betrayal may linger for years. You may not be able to put this aside, ever. You have stayed, as have many of us, out of love for your spouse, consideration for your family, financial concerns, lifestyle concerns.... the list goes on. However, you can learn to live with your life as it is, in the present moment. You cannot control what your wife's behavior will be in the future. You cannot change what may have happened in the past. You can only evaluate what your life is like today, right now, in this moment. If you find that to be good, then accept it; be grateful for it. If you should discover that it is not good, then deal with it from the position of your hard won wisdom.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

altawa said:


> The 'bad' is that she is getting impatient, at least that is what she tells me. She feels like when I bring up the past and ask questions, that it is keeping us stuck in the past. She wants to focus on us now and our happy life, and having a fun and happy future.


Says every cheater ever.

Trust me, it's part of the cheater's script - they all say this.

Now you've seen that when you stand up for yourself and stop fishing, she responds with respect. It's no different with this. The only way to move forward in a healthy way is to make it clear to her that she GETS to stay married to you after what she did, but only on YOUR good graces, and only by accepting that you need to heal at your own speed and only if SHE shows real remorse. So far, she's considering having remorse, but not really getting there. 

She has to understand that you WILL walk away, that you are OK with walking away if she can't be what you need now. As we always say, you have to be willing to lose the marriage to keep it.

Tell her if she becomes a ***** and stops answering your questions (and btw, that WAS a threat), then you'll consider that her answer that you are not her priority, and you will move on.


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## altawa (Jan 4, 2015)

tdwal said:


> If you really want to know what she did tell her you want a polygraph, she will probably confess but her reaction to your demanding it should tell you something. Go through with it though and see how it comes out. It would drive me crazy just like you.


She has offered to take one. She brought it up.

She did say she was nervous about it because she doesn't handle stress that well and is afraid of the machine saying she is lying even if she is telling the truth.


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## altawa (Jan 4, 2015)

sammy3 said:


> OP,
> The affair happened 10 years ago? You have been living like this for the past 10 years? Am I correct?
> 
> ~sammy


Yes and no. I originally reposted here from another site. I changed the length of the relationship and a some ages to keep from being identified on the other site. 

We have been married 14 years coming up this month. DDay was fall of 2001.


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## altawa (Jan 4, 2015)

turnera said:


> Says every cheater ever.
> 
> Trust me, it's part of the cheater's script - they all say this.
> 
> ...


We had an argument last night (oddly enough, after I posted my update) over something semi related to this, but also kind of tangential. Anyway, I basically quit responding. Well, this morning she has done nothing but beg me to not leave her. She is terrified that I am setting her up to hurt her like she hurt me, then leave her.

I'm not. I could never do that. But it tells me she knows I will walk. I never mentioned leaving, that was all her.


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

alt, you're in the Navy, right? And the two of you are currently living apart due to orders?

When are you due back home?


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## altawa (Jan 4, 2015)

GusPolinski said:


> alt, you're in the Navy, right? And the two of you are currently living apart due to orders?
> 
> When are you due back home?


Yes Navy. Yes, living apart due to orders. Transfer in two years, possibly another deployment this fall.


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

altawa said:


> Yes Navy. Yes, living apart due to orders. Transfer in two years, possibly another deployment this fall.


How often are you able to see each other? And for how long each time?


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

You're still stuck with this because she didn't help resolve it when it happened. Until it's all out there you can't heal. If she is really scared you'll leave her then she needs to do absolutely everything possible to help you deal with this. Because it won't go away on its own.


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## altawa (Jan 4, 2015)

GusPolinski said:


> How often are you able to see each other? And for how long each time?


We talk daily. I either go there, or she comes here monthly. I have run my leave balance down to zero, so it is more her coming here, and me scooting down there for long weekends. 

We are going to fly to Illinois this weekend (meet up in Dallas) because we have to see my mother. She has stage IV lung cancer and her chemo isn't even close to working. Get to see the wife again in a couple weeks for a long weekend. They will all be here in April. She will be up for the summer.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

I'm so sorry, I hope your mom pulls through.


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## altawa (Jan 4, 2015)

turnera said:


> I'm so sorry, I hope your mom pulls through.


Thanks. Just some more stress to throw on me. I can deal with that part. Seeing her this way, that is the part that is hard.


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## G.J. (Nov 4, 2014)

altawa said:


> She has offered to take one. She brought it up.
> 
> She did say she was nervous about it because she doesn't handle stress that well and is afraid of the machine saying she is lying even if she is telling the truth.


Tell her this to her nervous question



> There appears to be universal concern over nervousness affecting the polygraph test. Guilty people tend to play this theme up in hopes that when they fail, they will be able to cast doubt on the test by saying they were too nervous to focus, etc. Innocent people ask this question genuinely. Being nervous will NOT not affect the test, in fact, nervousness is expected. The simplest explanation is this; However nervous you are, you are nervous continually throughout the test. When you are telling the truth or lying to an individual question, your internal bodily reaction is specific to that question and that moment in time. The two things look very different on the polygraph charts


She can not use that as an excuse and is paving the way as she knows maybe she will fail

The best result though is a confession just prior to going into the session (car park confession) where you tell her to come clean on anything before she goes in as you can live with anything* IF SHE TELLS YOU BEFORE ITS FORCED OUT OF HER*
IF not and it shows she lied then its over (as you wont be leaving her its a lie, but so what)


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## altawa (Jan 4, 2015)

G.J. said:


> Tell her this to her nervous question
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Even with the nervousness she still said she would take it. I have been poly'd before, and I had the same concerns. Even knowing in advance that I was telling the truth, I worried. All I had hanging in the balance was a job. She has a marriage. I can understand the apprehensiveness. I also know how it works and that the machine takes the nervousness as part of the baseline.

Also, it's not a lie. That she never went has always been the corner stone of me being able to stay with her. If I found out she lied about it, I would leave, even to this day. Details, depending on them, we would have to weigh that out. If I found out she lied and went, I am gone. She knows that too.


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## LongWalk (Apr 4, 2013)

The military lifestyle sucks. You must know many men and women in the navy whose spouses cheated on them.

You should put a key logger on her computer so that you can see if she is chatting with other men, well not only see but read what she writes.

Does your sex life go up and down?

Your wife paid for the hotel room so that a bad boy could have sexual intercourse with her. She though it was passionate fvcking that would lead to love. He thought that it was just carnal entertainment that boosted his ego. This means your wife has low self esteem. Unless she repaired that in the intervening years, she is still attracted to bad boys to whom she'll be available.


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## altawa (Jan 4, 2015)

LongWalk said:


> The military lifestyle sucks. You must know many men and women in the navy whose spouses cheated on them.
> 
> You should put a key logger on her computer so that you can see if she is chatting with other men, well not only see but read what she writes.
> 
> ...


I don't know that it was thought to be passionate (even to her). In talking to her recently, I don't get that impression.

Anyway, regarding the rest:

I have had about seven different 1-2 punches the last couple of months hit me, and I just can't process all of it right now. I will still watch this thread and respond, but I am not actively doing anything on this right now. She swears she has told me everything, that she never went to his house. I have zero way to prove or disprove that. It will always eat at me. With our separation, the amount of time that has passed and whatnot, I just cannot devote my mind to this right now.


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