# Sexual Relationships 2017 Style



## EllisRedding (Apr 10, 2015)

Thought this might make for an interesting discussion. I will post a link to the article at the bottom but here is the main gist:

Recently, jewelry manufacturer Forktip conducted a survey, asking 5,000 respondents questions about sex, their love lives, cheating and some offbeat questions about how they use tech in their sex lives. Calling it the “Kinky Couples & Modern Relationships” Survey, they wanted to see how tech and 2017 have influenced how we have sex, who we have sex with, and how easy it is to find someone else who’ll have sex with us.


















*
Have You Cheated On Your Current Partner? Assuming the answer is yes:*




























*Would You Participate In An Orgy With Your Current Partner?*












> According to the survey, 1 in 3 women (27.7%) would be open to a bisexual ‘event’ which included another woman. The survey doesn’t clarify what ‘event’ means, so it could be a make-out sesh, some girl on girl action, or some true threesome shenanigans.






























*Miscellaneous*

Things Women Like Their Partners To Say To Them During Sex

Both sexes liked being talked to during sex. When they asked women what they liked to hear, the top three answers were:
– “Makes me call him daddy.”
– “Tells me how tight it is.”
– “Tells me how much he’s enjoying it.”

Couples admitted that they enjoy:
– Using sex toys
– Anal sex
– Talk Dirty
– Location Sex
– BDSM

The Top 3 Things Couples Like To Do Before Sex
– Drink Alcohol
– Drink Coffee
– Do Drugs

The Naughty Things Partners Do Behind Your Back
– Using Tinder and other dating apps
– Watching porn
– Thinking about ex’s during sex
– Secretly snap chatting with ex’s

Things Women Don’t Like About Their Male Partners
– Weird noises.
– Penis too small.
– Ejaculates too quick.
– Changes position too frequently.

Things Men Don’t Like About Their Female Partners
According to the survey, they are:
– Too loose
– Makes too much noise
– Breasts are too small
– Lack of a booty

Would You Consider Replacing Your Partner With A Sex Robot If The Experience Was Better?
According to the survey, 71.3% of men admitted to replacing their partners, while 49.6% of women agreed to the same.

Some super fresh stats about sex, relationships and vices (21 Photos) : theCHIVE


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## Apexmale (Jul 31, 2015)

I wonder when "religion folk" will start chiming in about "modern" versus "traditional"...


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## badsanta (Oct 13, 2014)

99% of the time during sex, my mind is thinking stuff like this:

I'm lovin' it!
I'm having it my way!
It is better here!
So fresh!

...but I swear to god I've been hypnotized or something because I then all the sudden start thinking about food and stuff to eat!

Badsanta


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## EllisRedding (Apr 10, 2015)

badsanta said:


> 99% of the time during sex, my mind is thinking stuff like this:
> 
> I'm lovin' it!
> I'm having it my way!
> ...


When I need to "calm myself down" my thoughts will typically go towards sports (mostly baseball lol).


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## badsanta (Oct 13, 2014)

EllisRedding said:


> When I need to "calm myself down" my thoughts will typically go towards sports (mostly baseball lol).


...and then you devise a plan on how to steal home base because you are so worked up from just touching?


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Well.

Interesting if accurate.

I doubt some?


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## EunuchMonk (Jan 3, 2016)

ConanHub said:


> Well.
> 
> Interesting if accurate.
> 
> I doubt some?


Go on...


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## EllisRedding (Apr 10, 2015)

ConanHub said:


> Well.
> 
> Interesting if accurate.
> 
> I doubt some?


I think it is just based purely on the 5,000 respondents. I guess the question would be, how accurately do those who participated in the survey actually represent the average or majority of people. 

All I know, it gets weird when my W wants me to call her Daddy :surprise:


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## jb02157 (Apr 16, 2014)

ConanHub said:


> Well.
> 
> Interesting if accurate.
> 
> I doubt some?


I think there's some fibbing going on.


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## EunuchMonk (Jan 3, 2016)

EllisRedding said:


>


So much for size doesn't matter.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

EunuchMonk said:


> Go on...


There were too many hot button, cliche answers as far as insecurities go for both genders.

My antenna 📡 is perked.


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## Fozzy (Jul 20, 2013)

ConanHub said:


> There were too many hot button, cliche answers as far as insecurities go for both genders.
> 
> My antenna 📡 is perked.


Could be legit for a carefully selected group of participants. Like 5000 people all under the age of 23.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

EllisRedding said:


> I think it is just based purely on the 5,000 respondents. I guess the question would be, how accurately do those who participated in the survey actually represent the average or majority of people.
> 
> All I know, it gets weird when my W wants me to call her Daddy :surprise:


Better than her wanting to call you mommy?


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

EunuchMonk said:


> So much for size doesn't matter.


Of course size matters.

Men said: 
healthy body figure (size)
big booty (size)
firm breasts (ok not size but also not something that we can do anything about unless via surgery) 

.....meanwhile, men want women to say "size doesn't matter".

Phhhhbbtttt.

It does matter.

Women said:
large penis (size)
athletic and fit (size)
tall (size)


Super sorry that you don't get to be a man and think that size matters, but then via double standard voodoo, you expect it doesn't matter to women. Maybe women will still say size doesn't matter when you are around so as not to hurt your ego.

But it does matter. Just like it matters to men. When women can answer honestly and without their own man knowing....they say it matters. Just like men say it matters. Welcome to reality, you can check your fantasy coat at the door.


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## MrsAldi (Apr 15, 2016)

LOL! 

I wonder the ages of the individuals who did this survey. 
Nothing about emotions or feelings, it just reads shallow and like impossible standards to achieve. 

I better go work on my pirate routine so I can achieve more booty and some peg leg to make my husband taller! Arr matey this blows!  💀 



Sent from my B1-730HD using Tapatalk


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## EllisRedding (Apr 10, 2015)

Faithful Wife said:


> Better than her wanting to call you mommy?


Either way, it gets weird lol



MrsAldi said:


> LOL!
> 
> I wonder the ages of the individuals who did this survey.
> Nothing about emotions or feelings, it just reads shallow and like impossible standards to achieve.
> ...


See, I am not quite sure about the age thing, and instead could very well be how the questions were asked. If you look at the question, note that is said preferential "Sexual Assets", so if you are answering the question per verbatim then emotions or feelings have nothing to do with the question.

I actually think the responses could be fairly accurate if you ask a group of people to solely mention "ideal" physical attributes.

Definitely interested to see pics of you and your pirate H once you guys make the transition :grin2:


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## alexm (Nov 29, 2008)

Faithful Wife said:


> Of course size matters.
> 
> Men said:
> healthy body figure (size)
> ...


I think based on the multitudes of penis size threads on TAM, the general consensus is that size matters, but not that much. When women answer that question here, I doubt very much they're concerned about hurting anyone's ego. The general consensus always seems to be average+, with the rare occurrence of a woman who actually prefers small (due to their own size and compatibility).

Women, just like men, will always prefer a tighter fit than a looser one, therefore a woman will almost always go with a penis that is (according to her) bigger than average. Just as we men will always lean towards slightly tighter/smaller.

My guess is that these survey respondents are young, not in committed relationships (or at least married) and that the questions themselves are likely rather vague anyway. If the options are 'small, medium or large', then almost all of the respondents will select 'medium' or 'large'.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

EunuchMonk said:


> So much for size doesn't matter.


I have been thinking about this and the question was purely physical characteristics and nothing else.

On the thread about what makes a good or bad lover to a woman, penis size wasn't mentioned.

Confidence was probably the biggest and most agreed upon trait of a good lover for a woman.

I think honesty helps us all and that includes the whole picture.

It appears that maybe most woman prefer a penis on the large side of average or just over.

It would seem that, preferences aside, if it isn't unusually small and works good that most women are quite happy with it.

There are umpteen variables that are not taken into account when simply asking about size preferences and women are simply too complex, intelligent and varied to boil all sexual satisfaction and desire down to penis size.

I would imagine a lot of sadness in women for being judged and viewed so shallowly as well as a lot of frustration over not being able to honestly communicate with men.

When women feel safe and empowered, they will give you the keys to their garden and enthusiastically help.you explore every corner.

This isn't a post about you, Eunuch, just my thoughts on this subject.


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## EllisRedding (Apr 10, 2015)

One question in particular I am not sure I completely believe how indicative the survey is (aside from the fact that 27.7% would be closer to 1 in 4 women versus 1 in 3 women):



> According to the survey, 1 in 3 women (27.7%) would be open to a bisexual ‘event’ which included another woman. The survey doesn’t clarify what ‘event’ means, so it could be a make-out sesh, some girl on girl action, or some true threesome shenanigans.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

EllisRedding said:


> One question in particular I am not sure I completely believe how indicative the survey is (aside from the fact that 27.7% would be closer to 1 in 4 women versus 1 in 3 women):


Those crazy college kids. :laugh:


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

EllisRedding said:


> One question in particular I am not sure I completely believe how indicative the survey is (aside from the fact that 27.7% would be closer to 1 in 4 women versus 1 in 3 women):


If it is the younger crowd, I would believe it.

Women are, in general, a little more fluid in sexuality and the younger women haven't fully developed their take on bi experiences which could be as simple as a kiss.

Many women have no desire for a same sex partner but would have some girl play when young and single.

Mrs. Conan and I are exploring that topic together at the moment.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

ConanHub said:


> Mrs. Conan and I are exploring that topic together at the moment.


:surprise:

WTF, no!!!!


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Faithful Wife said:


> :surprise:
> 
> WTF, no!!!!


LOL! Research!!! Just a lot of talking!

We are always going to be monogamous!

Sorry that came out funny!

We are entering into a new level of honest communication between each other and absolutely every subject is on the table to talk about even as far as we are concerned.

We aren't afraid to ask each other about everything and how we think, feel, react, etc. to any situation or circumstances.

We are foundational monogamists though and that isn't changing though we will honestly discuss everything.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

ConanHub said:


> LOL! Research!!! Just a lot of talking!
> 
> We are always going to be monogamous!
> 
> ...


Fantasy talk and honesty = awesome. 

Actually doing it = not awesome.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

alexm said:


> I think based on the multitudes of penis size threads on TAM, the general consensus is that size matters, *but not that much*.


I think there is a very high and strong desire by men to HEAR "not that much" after they hear it DOES matter. If they also hear "but not that much" then they can get rid of the fear that theirs isn't good enough (until the next time they hear size matters....)

I've read all the same threads you have, and I've not come away with the idea that it doesn't matter "that much"....on the contrary, I've read that it does matter "that much".

I've read plenty of women honestly saying it doesn't matter or that it doesn't matter that much to them....but they were not the majority of the responses.


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## MJJEAN (Jun 26, 2015)

ConanHub said:


> I have been thinking about this and the question was purely physical characteristics and nothing else.
> 
> On the thread about what makes a good or bad lover to a woman, penis size wasn't mentioned.
> 
> Confidence was probably the biggest and most agreed upon trait of a good lover for a woman.


I haven't responded to the good lover thread, but I took that thread to be asking about things like skill and attitude, not physical characteristics.

I don't give a damn how confident and skilled a man is if his package is not the within my preferred size and shape range. The reverse is also true for me. I don't care how perfectly sized and shaped the package is if the man doesn't have confidence and skill.

That said, I orgasm from PIV alone. Maybe women who can't orgasm from PIV alone feel size and shape matter a bit less.



Faithful Wife said:


> I think there is a very high and strong desire by men to HEAR "not that much" after they hear it DOES matter. If they also hear "but not that much" then they can get rid of the fear that theirs isn't good enough (until the next time they hear size matters....)
> 
> I've read all the same threads you have, and I've not come away with the idea that it doesn't matter "that much"....on the contrary, I've read that it does matter "that much".
> 
> I've read plenty of women honestly saying it doesn't matter or that it doesn't matter that much to them....but they were not the majority of the responses.


Women have known and accepted size matters. Millions or even tens of millions of us do kegels specifically so we don't become too loose. Yet it seems men hear size matters and become upset in some way.

I've never talked to another woman about the subject and heard size doesn't matter. I have, however, heard a LOT of women say they are willing to live with the size if A) they really have a thing for the guy and B) he has some skill.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

MJJEAN said:


> I haven't responded to the good lover thread, but I took that thread to be asking about things like skill and attitude, not physical characteristics.
> 
> I don't give a damn how confident and skilled a man is if his package is not the within my preferred size and shape range. The reverse is also true for me. I don't care how perfectly sized and shaped the package is if the man doesn't have confidence and skill.
> 
> ...


So you can't have a PIV O without a minimum size and shape?

That is interesting. I've been working on getting Mrs. Conan to be able to O during PIV. She is getting pretty damn close but she actually did O from one of my smaller fingers penetrating her hardly at all.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

MJJEAN said:


> Women have known and accepted size matters. Millions or even tens of millions of us do kegels specifically so we don't become too loose. Yet it seems men hear size matters and become upset in some way.


I know and accept that not only does size matter in that way to men, but size also matters in the rest of our bodies. Men desire a healthy woman of a certain size (a large variation here but in each man's eye he has his own size limit). Men desire breasts of a certain size (each has his own preference, his preference may be for smaller but that is still a size). Men desire a waist of a certain size, a booty of a certain size, a height of a certain size.

After typing it nine times in one paragraph, it just struck me that the word size is kind of an odd word!

Anyway....long ago as a teenager, I fully accepted that ALL MEN feel size matters....size of every part of our bodies. I knew this didn't mean that all women had to be swim suit models because lots of men prefer "meat on bones" or "cushion for pushin". Yet they still have a size limit in this regard. 

It made perfect sense to me and never bothered me because size matters to me, too. The size of his penis yes, but also the size of his hands and fingers, how tall he is, the size of his shoulders and biceps, his ass, how thick his legs are, the size of his belly....it all matters to me.

I think this is natural and normal. Animals, including humans, have the innate ability to detect good health in a potential partner. For us this is mostly coming from the visual (but there are other cues we are not always aware of). Nature makes us strongly attracted to people we sense are healthy, and then chemistry comes in (also from nature) to tell us if we are a good match or not, beyond just being healthy.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Faithful Wife said:


> I know and accept that not only does size matter in that way to men, but size also matters in the rest of our bodies. Men desire a healthy woman of a certain size (a large variation here but in each man's eye he has his own size limit). Men desire breasts of a certain size (each has his own preference, his preference may be for smaller but that is still a size). Men desire a waist of a certain size, a booty of a certain size, a height of a certain size.
> 
> After typing it nine times in one paragraph, it just struck me that the word size is kind of an odd word!
> 
> ...


Math, or proportions, seems to be the determining factor, except where actual PIV, stretch it out, sex is concerned.

We all probably know someone with an outstanding asset that has trouble attracting a mate because their proportions aren't mathematically pleasing.

Tom Cruise is not even close to tall but physically very desirable.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

ConanHub said:


> Tom Cruise is not even close to tall but physically very desirable.


I thought he was cute until the first time I saw him standing next to a leading lady and they were the same height. Instant change in my attraction, high to zero.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

@MJJEAN
@Faithful Wife

It is evident that many women and men have been hurt by attitudes towards pretty much everything about our bodies, emotions, vulnerabilities, etc.

Anyway someone could be attacked I'm sure they have been and defenses get built up.

It shuts down communication and understanding.

I am in some agreement now with FW's "sex positive" attitude.

I don't want anyone shut down and it isn't because I'm insecure at all.

I feel empathy for people who have less than apparently desirable traits and want to open up communication between all of us for everyone's benefit.

I do believe in total honesty but never for hurting purposes. Only with the intent to help.

The reason I ask questions is because I'm genuinely curious and want to use the information to help others and sometimes myself.

There is too much of an us and them mentality when it should just be all "us".


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Faithful Wife said:


> I thought he was cute until the first time I saw him standing next to a leading lady and they were the same height. Instant change in my attraction, high to zero.


WOW! You and Mrs. Conan are very similar in likes.

She is very turned off by a man being shorter than his lady.

She even gave me a funny face when I pointed out my youngest son's coworker and thought she might be a good match.

She is a very lovely young lady with a great personality who happens to be 6'3" while my son is 5'11"

I dated several taller women while single.

Two of them fell in love with me.

I think it seriously lowers a tall woman's options to have only taller men to choose from though.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

ConanHub said:


> I think it seriously lowers a tall woman's options to have only taller men to choose from though.


Indeed. There are benefits to being pint sized.

However I will say, I have been rejected by tall men before. Some of them want a tall woman and are going to go for what they want and not detour from it, which is fine and how it should be for anyone with a strong preference.


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## gr8ful1 (Dec 3, 2016)

Still don't understand the "big booty" thang


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## EllisRedding (Apr 10, 2015)

gr8ful1 said:


> Still don't understand the "big booty" thang


I think the question, what exactly constitutes a "big booty"? Are we talking about a rear that requires two seats on an airplane???


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

It would be fun and eye opening to discuss exactly why we chose our mates with this survey in mind.

Mrs. Conan initially went for me for many surface or shallow reasons while I had an immediate love at first sight reaction to her.

She did not love me even after a week in my bed.

She was extremely attracted to me, loved getting her ashes hauled by me and, yes, was enamored with my penis.

It probably took her a month to start falling for me and a few years to agree to marry me.

The opposite was true concerning me.

I instantly loved her, knew she was the one from first sight but she was short, I preferred tall, was a bit awkward in the bedroom, I was far more experienced and was use to very confident and capable women, and she was cute but not , strictly speaking, beautiful while I was use to dating models on occasion.

I was drawn to her by whatever instantly but absolutely loved her humor and spunk.

It was all non physical for me and purely physical for her to start.

She was on vacation and only thought of me as a nice part of it.

I convinced her to extend her "vacation" indefinitely.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

gr8ful1 said:


> Still don't understand the "big booty" thang


Brazilian butts truly drive me nuts!


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## EunuchMonk (Jan 3, 2016)

Faithful Wife said:


> Of course size matters.
> 
> Men said:
> healthy body figure (size)
> ...



OOO, touched a nerve, didn't I? Check your assumptions about me at the door too while you are at it. Maybe if so many women weren't double-talkers I wouldn't have said that. Men I know are upfront about boobs and all. Women I know say, "Oh, it doesn't matter. It's the love." lol On the other thread, like @ConanHub mentions, penis size wasn't touched upon much (or at all). I wonder why they can't be upfront and just say it. False modesty?

♪ What a girl wants, what a girl needs, even she doesn't know ♪


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

EunuchMonk said:


> OOO, touched a nerve, didn't I? Check your assumptions about me at the door too while you are at it. Maybe if so many women weren't double-talkers I wouldn't have said that. Men I know are upfront about boobs and all. Women I know say, "Oh, it doesn't matter. It's the love." lol On the other thread, like @ConanHub mentions, penis size wasn't touched upon much (or at all). I wonder why they can't be upfront and just say it. False modesty?
> 
> ♪ What a girl wants, what a girl needs, even she doesn't know ♪



Well, 1) I think getting women to open up is often difficult depending on how much they have been hurt and 2) What makes a good lover to the women that were posting wasn't a big penis while 3) Just asking for size preferences with nothing else will get answers that average from on the large side of average to just above for most women 4) Most women will absolutely work with what they have with a man they love and skill definitely helps. 5) It is very similar to what men think as well.

A lot of women have been browbeaten and hurt. They have developed defensiveness and offensive behaviors as a result.

Some women are just mean bltches, just like some men.

I believe FW has seen her fair share of harsh treatment towards herself and other women and sometimes dishes some of it back towards the male gender.

She is very tit for tat, good for the goose and gander type of woman and I really appreciate it as well as her female insight and sense of humor.

I absolutely feel the pain of her barbs but try to understand because I have dealt plenty of pain in my life and appreciate patience with myself so I will give it as well.

By all standards I'm not close to wanting in the tool department and I still have knee jerk (male) reactions to remarks that could generally make men feel inadequate or inferior.

I know a lot of men that were burned by heartless women as well.

I hope we can have extremely honest and open conversations with each other without any inclination to hurt or make anyone feel inferior.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

EunuchMonk said:


> OOO, touched a nerve, didn't I? Check your assumptions about me at the door too while you are at it. Maybe if so many women weren't double-talkers I wouldn't have said that. Men I know are upfront about boobs and all. Women I know say, "Oh, it doesn't matter. It's the love." lol On the other thread, like @ConanHub mentions, penis size wasn't touched upon much (or at all). I wonder why they can't be upfront and just say it. False modesty?
> 
> ♪ What a girl wants, what a girl needs, even she doesn't know ♪


Fair enough...I have no idea what your preferences or beliefs or opinions on the matter are.

However, I'm perfectly upfront with men I'm considering for a partner that it does matter to me. I've never in my life said size doesn't matter, to anyone, a partner, a friend, a man, a woman...no one. Because it does matter.


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## EllisRedding (Apr 10, 2015)

Faithful Wife said:


> Fair enough...I have no idea what your preferences or beliefs or opinions on the matter are.
> 
> However, I'm perfectly upfront with men I'm considering for a partner that it does matter to me. I've never in my life said size doesn't matter, to anyone, a partner, a friend, a man, a woman...no one. Because it does matter.


Sorry FW, I am cracking up here thinking about you walking around with a tape measure >


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

ConanHub said:


> I believe FW has seen her fair share of harsh treatment towards herself and other women and sometimes dishes some of it back towards the male gender.


It's really not harsh treatment I've received, it is about the bulls*t double standards that some men have (many who don't even realize it). Most women have been groomed to never ever step on a man's fragile sexual ego. Which is a double standard too because men typically don't bother to try to tip toe around our egos (when speaking generally). Most men will explain loud and clear to anyone who will listen that they have this or that (female body part or type) preference and how good it is, but that this or that (too fat, too skinny, no ass, too much ass, no boobs, waist too big, fat legs, skinny legs, ugly face, etc on and on) is horrible, hideous, unf*ckable, etc.

I've just never adopted the attitude that I should protect men's egos since I don't see men going out of their way to protect mine. I don't mean in a romantic relationship, I mean just bantering with who ever. Men just can't wait to tell you how much SIZE MATTERS in every part of a woman's body. 

But some of the same men crumble to the ground when we say penis size matters....and height matters....and biceps size matters....and tight asses matter....on and on. Whatever we say matters, some man somewhere freaks the f*ck out about how they don't have whatever we said matters.

Get over it. It all matters. 

(not you, Conan)


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

EllisRedding said:


> Sorry FW, I am cracking up here thinking about you walking around with a tape measure >


Sometimes need a yard stick.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

EunuchMonk said:


> On the other thread, like @ConanHub mentions, penis size wasn't touched upon much (or at all). I wonder why they can't be upfront and just say it. False modesty?


Also for the record...on that thread, in my own answer, I started off by saying that if strong mutual physical attraction wasn't present, there is no possible way a man can be a good lover for me.

Physical attraction for me includes his penis. If I need to go and add that in so that it is more clear, I'd be happy to do so. Most people who know me around here probably assumed that was part of it but hey! Far be it from me to leave out important details for others who don't know me so well.


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## CharlieParker (Aug 15, 2012)

Faithful Wife said:


> Fair enough...I have no idea what your preferences or beliefs or opinions on the matter are.
> 
> However, I'm perfectly upfront with men I'm considering for a partner that it does matter to me. I've never in my life said size doesn't matter, to anyone, a partner, a friend, a man, a woman...no one. Because it does matter.


Sorry if you already mentioned it, I haven't been following these threads closely, but did you ever not see some again because of it? My wife, who was rather experienced, says she only broke up with one guy because his penis was too "small" (no definition given, but she is a girth matters, more than length girl).


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

CharlieParker said:


> Sorry if you already mentioned it, I haven't been following these threads closely, but did you ever not see some again because of it? My wife, who was rather experienced, says she only broke up with one guy because his penis was too "small" (no definition given, but she is a girth matters, more than length girl).


No, not technically. One guy and I broke up for other reasons (amicable) but I was secretly happy because he was small. We were not dating with the idea of an LTR but if we had been, I probably would not have continued dating him at all. Since it was just casual dating (we didn't actually have intercourse but played around other ways) I was ok with it, he was really fun and imaginative. I was relieved we broke up without having sex because I knew it wasn't going to do anything for me.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

I definitely have observed aforementioned double standard.

Never understood it myself. LOL!


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

*Men*: We are visual creatures! Therefore you must be hot, thin, young, and horny in a way we can see it with our eyes!

*Women*: We are visual too and it matters to us what you look like.

*Men*: No you aren't! Only men are visual! Women care about money and personality and other things far more than how a man looks!

*Women*: Well no, that isn't true...we do care about the physical.

*Men*: NO YOU DON'T!!! ONLY WE DO!!! Therefore we can look like anything as long as we have enough money, we are still owed a hot woman! BECAUSE MEN ARE VISUAL!!!!!!!!!!

*Women*: Um, well I don't know what to tell you, it matters to me.

*Men*: You are an anomaly then and your opinion doesn't count.

*Women*: But there are 50 other women on this thread saying the same thing.

*Men*: ONLY MEN ARE VISUAL!!!!!! WOMEN ONLY CARE ABOUT THEIR OWN SECURITY!!!!!

*Women*: Sigh....whatever dude, have fun with your delusion...........oh hey, check out Mr. Hottie with the night stick in his pants....where you goin' honey?


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

CharlieParker said:


> Sorry if you already mentioned it, I haven't been following these threads closely, but did you ever not see some again because of it? My wife, who was rather experienced, says she only broke up with one guy because his penis was too "small" (no definition given, but she is a girth matters, more than length girl).


I have a young female friend who decided to take a guy home and when she saw what he had, flat out told him he was too small.

He apparently wasn't put off so she had sex with him anyway.

It was a one off but thought it a funny story.

His confidence allowed him to still seal the deal and her brutal honesty made me laugh!


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## EunuchMonk (Jan 3, 2016)

Faithful Wife said:


> It's really not harsh treatment I've received, it is about the bulls*t double standards that some men have (many who don't even realize it). Most women have been groomed to never ever step on a man's fragile sexual ego. Which is a double standard too because men typically don't bother to try to tip toe around our egos (when speaking generally). Most men will explain loud and clear to anyone who will listen that they have this or that (female body part or type) preference and how good it is, but that this or that (too fat, too skinny, no ass, too much ass, no boobs, waist too big, fat legs, skinny legs, ugly face, etc on and on) is horrible, hideous, unf*ckable, etc.
> 
> I've just never adopted the attitude that I should protect men's egos since I don't see men going out of their way to protect mine. I don't mean in a romantic relationship, I mean just bantering with who ever. Men just can't wait to tell you how much SIZE MATTERS in every part of a woman's body.
> 
> ...


Men are not as skilled in the art of bull****, that's why. We are upfront. So having grown up with the Virgin-Mary persona that most women go out of their way to portray the "other side" is surprising. Not bad, just surprising.



> Remember the goal of feminism: Making sure only alphas get laid!


But then again maybe a beta like myself need to get over it, right? Wish I could measure up to your awesome lovers.


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## EllisRedding (Apr 10, 2015)

Looks like my goal to secretly create a "Penis Size" thread has been successful :grin2:


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

EunuchMonk said:


> But then again maybe a beta like myself need to get over it, right? Wish I could measure up to your awesome lovers.


The signature line in my posts is a joke that came about from a banter @tech-novelist and I had.

I'm not the one who follows the alpha/beta red pill cult. I was making fun of it.

But think whatever you want to about me! Peace.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

EllisRedding said:


> Looks like my goal to secretly create a "Penis Size" thread has been successful :grin2:


Every thread is a penis size thread just waiting to happen.


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## anonmd (Oct 23, 2014)

CharlieParker said:


> Sorry if you already mentioned it, I haven't been following these threads closely, but did you ever not see some again because of it? My wife, who was rather experienced, says she only broke up with one guy because his penis was too "small" (no definition given, but she is a girth matters, more than length girl).


There is "small" and then there is SMALL <g>. 

I am told my wife came across one that was pinky size which is what, 2.5" or so? She only saw that one once. I can't imagine that is exactly common, most women will not come across that extreme end of the size spectrum in a lifetime.


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## anonmd (Oct 23, 2014)

Faithful Wife said:


> Every thread is a penis size thread just waiting to happen.


I've never turned anyone away because their boobs were too big, or small :smile2:


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## Keke24 (Sep 2, 2016)

I agree women often say size doesn't matter and I'm not certain but I may have said it myself at some point. In my mind, the majority of men seem to be average size and should not be concerned about their size.

I have refused to go back to a guy I was seeing who had a very small penis but the thing was outrageously small. I'm not exaggerating that it was not much longer than my little finger, he couldn't use his hand to handle it, only his fingertips! Perhaps the worst part about it and what convinced me not to go back was the initial boasting on his part, about how much he would make me cum and what he was going to do to me. Ugh, why set yourself up for failure? This guy did have children from a previous marriage though so perhaps size didnt matter to his ex-wife?...

However, I did have an amazing experience with a guy I was seeing who was definitely below average, maybe 1-2 inches longer than mr. man up top. There was no boasting, I'd say he was the very definition of a good lover. No complaints about size there at all. 

So it is true that size does matter but I think when most women say that it really doesn't, they're not taking into account that some men really do have tiny penises.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

I know women appreciate confidence with honesty.

There was a friend I had that was flirting with me a little and we were talking about everything because I talk about everything when she pulls out her phone and shows me a couple pictures of two of her FWB's.

Couldn't tell with one but the other either had a large summer sausage in his shorts or was packing a monster!

I laughed and told her he is part horse and I didn't have near that much.

She looked at me with heat and said I had enough.

She could have been in my arms quite rapidly.

I have told other women that were hitting on me that I was really small and they didn't care and wanted find out for themselves.

They either didn't believe me or truly didn't care just for a night of fun.

They never did find out.&#55357;&#56841;

Sex is fun and funny! I wonder if people didn't get so bent out of shape that life would be more enjoyable!


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## EunuchMonk (Jan 3, 2016)

Faithful Wife said:


> The signature line in my posts is a joke that came about from a banter @tech-novelist and I had.
> 
> I'm not the one who follows the alpha/beta red pill cult. I was making fun of it.
> 
> But think whatever you want to about me! Peace.






Faithful Wife said:


> Maybe women will still say size doesn't matter when you are around so as not to hurt your ego.




Indeed. Piece.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

EunuchMonk said:


> Men are not as skilled in the art of bull****, that's why. We are upfront. So having grown up with the Virgin-Mary persona that most women go out of their way to portray the "other side" is surprising. Not bad, just surprising.
> 
> 
> 
> But then again maybe a beta like myself need to get over it, right? Wish I could measure up to your awesome lovers.


Do you view yourself as beta or being tongue in cheek here?

Made me laugh hard BTW!


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## EunuchMonk (Jan 3, 2016)

ConanHub said:


> Do you view yourself as beta or being tongue in cheek here?
> 
> Made me laugh hard BTW!



Like all men, I'm a little bit of both. Alpha at times, and beta as hell at other times.


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## TheTruthHurts (Oct 1, 2015)

Ok women if you're going to go on and on about this then please help me out.

Reading the other penis threads here and looking at the links, I was very surprised by the statistics.

The average length is something like 5-1/4 or 5-1/2 inches, and the standard deviation isn't really that great. That means most men are pretty close to that size.

So when you say size matters what do you actually mean? Are you saying Mr Average +- some preferred range? Are you saying it matters all the time or it matters only when someone falls outside the normal range by a little? ... or a lot?

I'm a data analyst and this sh*t drives me nuts because it is completely unclear what you're saying @faithfulwife even though you've said it MANY times 

Second: and this vexes the SH*T out of me... what about girth? The statistics indicate a 6" girth penis is in the 93rd percentile which shocked me. I was shocked because the average is about 4" plus change I think (sorry I don't recall). Again - can you really feel that difference? Is it that big a deal? I ask because I'm aware you guys telescope that vajayjay out the more aroused you get so I'm wondering how you gauge those d1cks over time? I mean it seems the more aroused the smaller he seems. If he totally turns you off he'd feel HUGE because you'd be closed up like a nun!

Ok that's something to work with  school me 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## FeministInPink (Sep 13, 2012)

TheTruthHurts said:


> Ok women if you're going to go on and on about this then please help me out.
> 
> Reading the other penis threads here and looking at the links, I was very surprised by the statistics.
> 
> ...


It depends on the woman. The more girth a man has, the tighter the fit. Nerve endings extend only about 1" into the vagina, so you can't feel the difference in length in that respect, unless he's long enough to bump the cervix, which some women like, but many find uncomfortable. However, a longer penis will result in longer strokes, and vice versa.

And you're not totally correct in the telescope of the vag--the folds loosen to allow for penetration, but they also become engorged with blood to make it feel good. And the strength of her pelvic muscles will make a difference as well.


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## Vega (Jan 8, 2013)

Faithful Wife said:


> It's really not harsh treatment I've received, it is about the bulls*t double standards that some men have (many who don't even realize it). Most women have been groomed to never ever step on a man's fragile sexual ego. Which is a double standard too because men typically don't bother to try to tip toe around our egos (when speaking generally). Most men will explain loud and clear to anyone who will listen that they have this or that (female body part or type) preference and how good it is, but that this or that (too fat, too skinny, no ass, too much ass, no boobs, waist too big, fat legs, skinny legs, ugly face, etc on and on) is horrible, hideous, unf*ckable, etc.
> 
> I've just never adopted the attitude that I should protect men's egos since I don't see men going out of their way to protect mine. I don't mean in a romantic relationship, I mean just bantering with who ever. Men just can't wait to tell you how much SIZE MATTERS in every part of a woman's body.
> 
> ...


:allhail:

I sooooo wish you were whispering this in m ear while I was growing up! Can't tell you how many boys/men would be just CRUEL when it came to my flatchestedness. When I was 17, I ask my mother when I would get boobs. She told me, "Don't worry. They'll come." I'm 59 years old and _*I'm still waiting*_, lol! 

And the attitude you described didn't end at teenage years. I'm still meeting men who will be standing next to me and say something like, "Nice rack!" about another woman. 

But that wasn't the worst...

I had a live-in b/f for a few years, when I was in my late 20's. At one point I realized that he was heavily into big boobs. Now, it's not like I wore clothing that would hide my smallish size. So he knew what he was getting BEFORE asking me out. Later on I found out how 'disappointed' he was that he didn't have a girlfriend (me) who sported a couple of 36DD's. Jeez dude. If that's what you want, what the hell are doing with ME?!?? 

Turned out that I was "available" (sexually). Pretty much better than nothing. Better than using his own hand while he looked for the 'woman of his dreams'. (as if he's really going to find 'her' in the porn magazine "Jugs"). In his mind, _at least _he was getting laid. 

I can't tell you how LOW I felt at that moment. :frown2:

Thank you, FW, for being my 'voice'. :smthumbup:


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## tech-novelist (May 15, 2014)

EllisRedding said:


> One question in particular I am not sure I completely believe how indicative the survey is (aside from the fact that 27.7% would be closer to 1 in 4 women versus 1 in 3 women):


Math is hard! >


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## TheTruthHurts (Oct 1, 2015)

FeministInPink said:


> It depends on the woman. The more girth a man has, the tighter the fit. Nerve endings extend only about 1" into the vagina, so you can't feel the difference in length in that respect, unless he's long enough to bump the cervix, which some women like, but many find uncomfortable. However, a longer penis will result in longer strokes, and vice versa.
> 
> 
> 
> And you're not totally correct in the telescope of the vag--the folds loosen to allow for penetration, but they also become engorged with blood to make it feel good. And the strength of her pelvic muscles will make a difference as well.




Ahhhhh! Finally something that makes sense. I always assumed the long dong thing was a guy fantasy - with the ridiculous porn out there - and because I was aware of the problem and discomfort of a cervix being pounded. Also I was aware of the limited length of the (typical) woman's nerve endings, implying that "size doesn't matter". BUT you've connected the dots a bit with the "stroke length" factor. Ha that should be part of the d1ck measurement bruhaha. That actually makes sense. Add "average stroke length" to the stats!

The telescoping comment came from a sex therapist I saw - I may have misunderstood - but I believe the cervix and uterus ascend during arousal to lengthen the vagina to accommodate the length of the penis. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

Vega said:


> Thank you, FW, for being my 'voice'. :smthumbup:


My pleasure, sister! :x


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

TheTruthHurts said:


> So when you say size matters what do you actually mean? Are you saying Mr Average +- some preferred range? *Are you saying it matters all the time or it matters only when someone falls outside the normal range by a little? ... or a lot?*
> .....
> 
> Second: and this vexes the SH*T out of me... what about girth? The statistics indicate a 6" girth penis is in the 93rd percentile which shocked me. I was shocked because the average is about 4" plus change I think (sorry I don't recall). *Again - can you really feel that difference? Is it that big a deal?*


To the first bolded....it is more than just about length. There is also the overall look, color, shape, contour, circumcised or not, etc. I think some penises are beautiful, others just ok, others not so much. I will not bother to describe it down much further because it is kind of irrelevant since every woman (for whom this matters) will have their different preferences, but when my girls and I are locker room talkin', we talk about more than length and girth. The look of the thing matters to us, but we don't always agree on what it should be lookin' like. 

To the second bolded....I can absolutely feel the difference in girth. It makes a huge difference (he he). 

When I was young and first sexually active, I did not feel much inside of me. The thrusting was nice, but even that would get boring pretty quick. I was still into sex for the whole experience, the passion, the lust, the intimacy, the fun. But the actual feeling of the P inside my V....wasn't that much on my radar (though my body always responded appropriately with wetness).

Then after I had a baby and had to do my kegels before and after birth....after about, oh maybe a year of doing them regularly....I all of a sudden (I remember the very first time it happened) could feel EVERYTHING in there. Not at the bottom out point, like FIP said, unless he's bumping my cervix or something. But at the entry point and that one inch or so in that FIP was talking about....OMG....I can feel EVERYTHING. It feels like much more than one inch, but that's probably just because the feeling is so intense.

Think of putting your finger in your mouth. Inside your cheeks, your tongue, even the roof of your mouth. If you close your mouth down and suck on your finger, you can feel your finger with your mouth and tongue, right? If your finger was hot, or if it had a blister, or if it was cold, or if the skin was rough and worn like a piece of dried fruit...you would be able to determine all of this with the inside of your mouth. The tiniest movement your finger made, not even in and out just any slight movement at all, you would feel with the inside of your mouth.

That's the only way I can describe what it feels like to have a beautiful penis inside of me....only much more vivid and intense. I could just lay completely still with it inside of me with no movement and no thrusting, and could just focus on those feelings inside and be in heaven just from that alone. When I'm in that zone, there is nothing in the world better. This is why I love sex so much! I can feel EVERYTHING, every movement, every ridge, every vein....the blood pumping.......goddamn, YUMM! It feels like the penis has electricity running through it! I can feel it pulse and pump and twitch when he ejaculates. This always makes me start twitching inside too in response.

The more girth the better for this feeling, too (not including Red Bull cans). The length, as pointed out already, means there is a longer thrust....just more wonderful feelings for me. 

Now if we move on to getting pounded....that is a whole different feeling. I can't focus down on the feelings at the opening as much, because I'm getting this whole other amazing type of feeling from it. Length is more important than girth for pounding, for me, because to REALLY pound me, you're going to have to be back from me more than just a few inches to really slam back into me. 

I have had this discussion with girlfriends, and a lot of them say they don't really feel much inside of them, not even at the opening. I have had to assume it is because they aren't doing their kegels but I don't really know.

Keep in mind, I do not O from PIV alone. It isn't about O's to me. I love intercourse. I love f*cking. I love making love. I love having a lovely P inside of me in anyway. (A lovely P meaning, one that I have already picked and know and love very well  )

I also love touching my man's penis, I love giving oral, I love just hanging out with it. I love watching the various stages it goes through. I love taking a bath with a man and watch what appears to be a sea creature come alive between his legs and go wandering around in the water of its own accord (only as far as it can go, of course). I love fondling it when it is soft, kissing it, petting it, and the testicles too. I love having my face slapped with a beautiful erection, not necessarily roughly. Just a nice smack, smack, smack against my cheek, and I can hear it inside my mouth and head as it slaps my cheeks against my teeth. I love feeling the weight of it while doing this.

I have O's but they come from other means. I would love to have O's from PIV, but I actually feel no loss since it is something I've never had or worried about. I have too much fun having sex to even wish for an O. When I need O's, I get them and they rock. Not as much as sex rocks, though.....which is tough to explain, there's some other technical stuff going on for me with that.

Now to get realistic...and possibly shatter the idea that I'm a size queen. I'm really not. I'd do just fine with a 5 or 6 incher, as long as there is at least adequate girth and the man it is attached to is a good lover (for me) in all other respects. Since I love everything from just having it inside me without even moving to getting pounded into the wall, I'm a pretty happy woman when I'm in love with a man and his penis and we are rocking the house down regularly. But the look of it, again, super important....not just size but how it looks.

If I am considering a long term relationship with someone, and I get to the goods and discover it just isn't going to something I can fall in love with....I would end it, yes. I doubt I would ever say this is why, but if I was forced to or if it really mattered to the man that he knew the actual truth, I would say it. I am glad I've never been in this position, it would be a tough call, but I would still make it. Sex is so important to me that I just wouldn't allow myself to end up in a place that I didn't love his penis. He would deserve a woman who does love it, so setting him free would be best for both of us.

As I already answered in another thread, about 7.5 inches long and 5.5 or so inches thick would be ideal if I could design my own perfect penis. But honestly....that's just an ideal and I've never stopped and thought "gee I wish he was 7.5 inches and a little thicker" when I've been getting my brains f*cked silly. I'm just loving every minute of it and that's all I'm focused on.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

TAM ladies rock!

Best source for female insight I have ever encountered outside of my wife!

Thank you all!


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## alexm (Nov 29, 2008)

Faithful Wife said:


> I think there is a very high and strong desire by men to HEAR "not that much" after they hear it DOES matter. If they also hear "but not that much" then they can get rid of the fear that theirs isn't good enough (until the next time they hear size matters....)
> 
> I've read all the same threads you have, and I've not come away with the idea that it doesn't matter "that much"....on the contrary, I've read that it does matter "that much".
> 
> I've read plenty of women honestly saying it doesn't matter or that it doesn't matter that much to them....but they were not the majority of the responses.


I don't think we're on the same page, FW!

It DOES matter, and honestly, for good reason. What I meant was, for the sake of men everywhere who think a 9inch dong is necessary to be a good lover - it ain't. Average size is fine, even ideal, and some women would prefer a little bigger than average, so the fit is nice and snug. So from that perspective, yes, size matters.

My point, as usual in these silly discussions that I always seem to a part of (penis size threads... ugh!) is that the vast majority of men are just fine for the vast majority of women, and there's very little to worry about on either side, and that worrying about it is futile anyway. There's a match for just about everyone. I was too big for my ex wife, and way too big for a former gf, and I'm not packing anything monstrous down there.

But when presented with a choice, most women would go with average+. Just as we men would prefer tight+ vajayjays. If the person you love happens to fall within that ideal range, bonus! If they don't, there's not a lot of women (or men) who are ending their relationship because of it. However, if you're in the casual relationship stage of your life (like I imagine most of the survey respondents are), then you're unlikely for a repeat encounter with 'Mr Smaller than Average'.

In short, size matters, but not the same way for men as it does for women. We men seem to think we need a 9inch dong. You women simply want something that, for lack of a better term, fills you up. For many, that could very well be done by an every day normal average willy. For some, something _slightly_ larger/thicker. For a rare few, the monster dong is required.


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## alexm (Nov 29, 2008)

Faithful Wife said:


> I know and accept that not only does size matter in that way to men, but size also matters in the rest of our bodies. Men desire a healthy woman of a certain size (a large variation here but in each man's eye he has his own size limit). Men desire breasts of a certain size (each has his own preference, his preference may be for smaller but that is still a size). Men desire a waist of a certain size, a booty of a certain size, a height of a certain size.
> 
> After typing it nine times in one paragraph, it just struck me that the word size is kind of an odd word!
> 
> ...


I'm not disagreeing with you at all with this, but I do think penis size doesn't compare to any of the above mentioned items.

I think everything you've listed above is the same, regardless of gender, primarily because none of those items actually have much, if anything, to do with actual sexual pleasure - they're all purely visual, and therefore stimulate our minds, and our ability to become turned on or attracted to the person - initially. Important, of course, but not absolutely necessary for the ultimate goal of physical pleasure. Some of the best sexual encounters I've had have been with women who I wasn't attracted to right away.

When it comes right down to it, penis size can make or break your ability to enjoy sex with someone, FAR more than anything you, as a woman, can do, or have, in terms of a man achieving orgasm, or some sort of sexual satisfaction. Even a small penis in a large vagina will get enough stimulation for him to orgasm. The reverse is much less likely.


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## Married but Happy (Aug 13, 2013)

Faithful Wife said:


> To the first bolded....
> 
> To the second bolded....
> 
> I also love....


After reading your entire post, I could almost believe my wife had joined TAM and written it. These are the very things she tells me.


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## FeministInPink (Sep 13, 2012)

TheTruthHurts said:


> !
> The telescoping comment came from a sex therapist I saw - I may have misunderstood - but I believe the cervix and uterus ascend during arousal to lengthen the vagina to accommodate the length of the penis.


I see now what you mean by telescoping. Yes, this is completely accurate. The unaroused vagina is only a few inches in length, but when fully aroused is much longer. 

Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk


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## MJJEAN (Jun 26, 2015)

CharlieParker said:


> Sorry if you already mentioned it, I haven't been following these threads closely, but did you ever not see some again because of it?


I have stopped seeing men based on penis size. I have also stopped seeing men based on lack of skill. I don't fault the guy. He can't do anything about his size, it's just what God gave him to work with. I also don't fault a guy if he is an engaged lover, but his sexual style or skill doesn't match my preferences. That's just his way and nothing to be held against him. 



anonmd said:


> There is "small" and then there is SMALL <g>.
> 
> I am told my wife came across one that was pinky size which is what, 2.5" or so? She only saw that one once. I can't imagine that is exactly common, most women will not come across that extreme end of the size spectrum in a lifetime.


I have had the misfortune to encounter 4 "rinky dinky ****ies" in my time. However, I read somewhere that the average woman has something like 8 or 9 sex partners in her lifetime and I was somewhere around 31 or 32 when I met DH, so maybe I just have a bigger sample size.





EunuchMonk said:


> Men are not as skilled in the art of bull****, that's why. We are upfront. So having grown up with the Virgin-Mary persona that most women go out of their way to portray the "other side" is surprising. Not bad, just surprising.


I don't think it's bullsh*tting. It's more like a combination of sensitivity and societal programming.

First, women tend to be nurturers. We're sensitive the to feelings of others. From that POV, there is no reason to tell men that size matters because there isn't anything a man can do about his size, so why hurt his feelings unnecessarily. I never told the rinky dinky ****ie guys I was not going back for 2nds because of their size for just that reason.

Second, allegedly something like 75% of women DO NOT orgasm from vaginal stimulation alone. For those women, size really may not matter as much.

Third, we're still told that chemical sexual attraction and sexual satisfaction aren't _that_ important when selecting a mate. It's largely considered shallow by many to end a relationship based on lack of sex or lack of sexual enjoyment. We're not supposed to notice or comment on penis size because...love...or some sh*t.




TheTruthHurts said:


> Ok women if you're going to go on and on about this then please help me out.
> 
> Reading the other penis threads here and looking at the links, I was very surprised by the statistics.
> 
> ...


I read that the majority of internal vaginal nerves extend 3-4 inches inside. So, yeah, theoretically, a 3-4 inch penis is sufficient to stimulate. However, girth matters. I can absolutely feel the difference in both length and width.



TheTruthHurts said:


> Ahhhhh! Finally something that makes sense. I always assumed the long dong thing was a guy fantasy - with the ridiculous porn out there - and because I was aware of the problem and discomfort of a cervix being pounded. Also I was aware of the limited length of the (typical) woman's nerve endings, implying that "size doesn't matter". BUT you've connected the dots a bit with the "stroke length" factor. Ha that should be part of the d1ck measurement bruhaha. That actually makes sense. Add "average stroke length" to the stats!
> 
> 
> The telescoping comment came from a sex therapist I saw - I may have misunderstood - but I believe the cervix and uterus ascend during arousal to lengthen the vagina to accommodate the length of the penis.
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


The unaroused vagina is shallow enough that a woman can insert her finger or fingers and probe her cervix. A lot of women who use Natural Family Planning check their cervical mucous and positioning daily to track signs of ovulation. Many others do it routinely to check birth control devices like IUD's or diaphragms or even menstrual cups. Obviously, the canal must extend to accommodate an erect penis. That's the "telescoping" your therapist was talking about. 

The girth thing is more about clitoral stimulation. First, the clitoris is much larger than most people realize. The vast majority of the thing is unseen. During penile thrusting, the minor labia is pulled back and forth, tugging on the clitoris. If the girth of the penis isn't a good fit for the vagina, the tugging is going to be weak or non-existent. Then add in the stimulation of the vaginal walls, the internal G-spot, etc. and you can see how length and girth make a difference.

Also, not all women find cervical bumping uncomfortable or painful. I, personally, love it! I have had some seriously intense orgasms from cervical bumping.


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## MJJEAN (Jun 26, 2015)

ConanHub said:


> So you can't have a PIV O without a minimum size and shape?
> 
> That is interesting. I've been working on getting Mrs. Conan to be able to O during PIV. She is getting pretty damn close but she actually did O from one of my smaller fingers penetrating her hardly at all.


How small is small? If we're talking 2-4 inches, no. If we're talking 4.5 to 6 inches, I can. It just takes a lot of effort playing with angles and it isn't nearly as intense. A lot of work for little reward.

If you want my guess, your finger found her internal G-spot. Maybe try to figure out a way to stroke that same spot with your penis and see if that works?
@Faithful Wife

You've never had a PIV orgasm, if I read your post right? And your vaginal walls are very sensitive?

If so, there goes my theory. 

PIV orgasms are the most intense and satisfying for me by a long shot. I also have very sensitive vaginal walls. I, too, can easily feel the length, girth, texture, and temperature of a penis. That's one of the reasons I generally only use dildos or vibrators as part of kink or to put on a show for DH. The feeling of plastic or rubber or whatever they make those things out of just feels so...off and unnatural. Same with condoms. I HATED having to use condoms back in my catting around days because they always felt so...fake.

Anyways, I figured that maybe women who couldn't orgasm from PIV alone were just wired with less sensitivity and that explained it. If you're sensitive and can't get there from PIV alone, my theory is probably incorrect.


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## CharlieParker (Aug 15, 2012)

MJJEAN said:


> I have had the misfortune to encounter 4 "rinky dinky ****ies" in my time. However, I read somewhere that the average woman has something like 8 or 9 sex partners in her lifetime and I was somewhere around 31 or 32 when I met DH, so maybe I just have a bigger sample size.


Thanks, that's kind of what I was getting at. Not that I really care, but I always figured with her sample size (great term) she must have hit more than one. 

Funny story about the one. Around 7 years into marriage we run into him getting off a plane in Frankfurt. They briefly greet each other. She could sense I, not usually jealous, wasn't thrilled. She whispered, that's the guy with the small dîck (she had mentioned it sometime before). I was just not happy because he was coming out of first class to our mere business.


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## MJJEAN (Jun 26, 2015)

CharlieParker said:


> Thanks, that's kind of what I was getting at. Not that I really care, but I always figured with her sample size (great term) she must have hit more than one.
> 
> Funny story about the one. Around 7 years into marriage we run into him getting off a plane in Frankfurt. They briefly greet each other. She could sense I, not usually jealous, wasn't thrilled. She whispered, that's the guy with the small dîck (she had mentioned it sometime before). I was just not happy because he was coming out of first class to our mere business.


I'd much rather be in economy on every plane I board for the rest of my life than live with a small tool. Just sayin' >



I learned my lesson in HS. The guy was hot, had a delightful accent, a great personality, and was fun to hang out with. A lot of the other girls were into him. So, since we were friends and all, we eventually got around to fooling around. I, at great personal risk, sneaked him into the house late one night while my parents and sibs were sleeping. If I'd been caught, my parents would have lost their minds and consequences would have been severe and long lasting. We did the deed and, about 35 seconds in, all I could think was "I'm risking getting in serious trouble for _this_!?!?!"


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## Hellomynameis (Dec 16, 2016)

anonmd said:


> There is "small" and then there is SMALL <g>.
> 
> I am told my wife came across one that was pinky size which is what, 2.5" or so? She only saw that one once. I can't imagine that is exactly common, most women will not come across that extreme end of the size spectrum in a lifetime.


There is also large and LARGE. My STBXH is hung like a horse as they say. It didn't make sex better, it made it painful. He literally could not get his entire penis inside me but his attempts to try were NOT enjoyable. And at 5'5 I'm not exactly a small woman. Strangely enough the woman he left me for was only 4'10. I don't know how they even managed.


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## Hellomynameis (Dec 16, 2016)

I do wonder about the study demographics. I'm guessing younger.

I remember about 10-12 years ago Cosmo did a similar study on American college campuses among undergraduate students. The thing that really stood out to me was that 60%!!! of the male respondents said they would commit rape if they knew they could get away with it. Made me sick. The majority of them also said they would rather have an unattractive woman who liked frequent sex than an attractive woman who didnt. But how can they know if the unattractive women like sex when they won't ask them out?

The other thing I remember standing out was that the majority of the guys said they preferred to get their sex through hookups and ONS but the women said they preferred their sex in LTRS. From what I saw in my college campus, it was the women who were compromising.


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## TheTruthHurts (Oct 1, 2015)

@Faithful Wife @FeministInPink @MJJEAN thanks for the more detailed answers!

Details matter. These silly p size studies and threads really don't even scratch the surface on what people like, and yet young men everywhere cling to the numbers as if they mean something.

I get the whole look, touch, feel of it and I suspect those aspects are much more important than size alone. In my day I've seen quite a variety of these things, particularly in porn, and I've got to say it's obvious to me that those women are paid because some of them are downright nasty. And there is such variety - in the shaft, head, surface, testicles... there are probably a bunch of combinations of aspects that would make many different guys appealing to any individual woman. Just like breast size is a ridiculous standard - you have so many women ruining beautiful small breasts to get big, hard fake boobs - they're chasing as silly a measure as guys who take out the tape measure. 

I work with data and this is so silly because everyone looks at one or two numbers and thinks they tell a story. They don't - they just add color.

Anyway this is very helpful. I've got a single notch on my belt as does my W, so neither of us have anything to compare to and we don't know anyone who talks about this stuff. Then again everyone's experience is different so an individual's preferences are just another data point to enrich the story.

Bjs are my W's favorite thing - even after decades - so I know 100% of my women are completely satisfied with the packaging . And I have to admit she floats my boat and I've never been tempted really in all these decades.




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## Holdingontoit (Mar 7, 2012)

Very much appreciate this thread and the candor expressed by the ladies posting here. Reinforces my conclusion that staying with H2 and retaining access to 100% of my income is my best available alternative.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

CharlieParker said:


> Thanks, that's kind of what I was getting at. Not that I really care, but I always figured with her sample size (great term) she must have hit more than one.
> 
> Funny story about the one. Around 7 years into marriage we run into him getting off a plane in Frankfurt. They briefly greet each other. She could sense I, not usually jealous, wasn't thrilled. She whispered, that's the guy with the small dîck (she had mentioned it sometime before). I was just not happy because he was coming out of first class to our mere business.


Ahh but he was possibly unhappy because he was not keeping company with your travel companion.:wink2:

I'm not usually jealous either but extremely territorial.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Holdingontoit said:


> Very much appreciate this thread and the candor expressed by the ladies posting here. Reinforces my conclusion that staying with H2 and retaining access to 100% of my income is my best available alternative.


Still don't believe it is a good reason to stay in a loveless marriage.

A size preference is not going to determine things for a lot of women.

Not sure about your age group but I know a lot of women that just want to be treated with love and be cared for, who, being honest, might have a size preference but it isn't a deal maker or breaker.

There is a lot of fun to be had in the bedroom besides straight up PIV. Toys and other activities are enjoyed by a lot of fun ladies.


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## TheTruthHurts (Oct 1, 2015)

Ya know I ran into a hilarious Tumblr account where guys submit dikpiks and the women tell them how small and useless they are. It's a riot. Guys post photos alongside chapstick to show their pathetic manhood (and presumably go in the corner and pleasure themselves after they are publicly shamed and ridiculed). I guess the toilet paper tube is a big test - guys show the don't have the length or girth to fill the tube he he

"To each his own"

There are "show-ers" and there are "grow-ers". I think a lot of the latter group are actually cheating a bit.

Human nature - whatever is socially unacceptable becomes a sexual fetish. A small dik I guess qualifies.

I recall (way back in the early '90's for you young'nes) when smoking started to become socially unacceptable. I knew right there and then - NEW FETISH! recently I google "hot girl smoking" and OMG a billion hits - mostly porn sites. Go figure!


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## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

MJJEAN said:


> PIV orgasms are the most intense and satisfying for me by a long shot. I also have very sensitive vaginal walls. I, too, can easily feel the length, girth, texture, and temperature of a penis. That's one of the reasons I generally only use dildos or vibrators as part of kink or to put on a show for DH. The feeling of plastic or rubber or whatever they make those things out of just feels so...off and unnatural. Same with condoms. I HATED having to use condoms back in my catting around days because they always felt so...fake.


Talking about temperature, my wife loved having me inside her when I had a fever.

She really liked the fact that my penis felt really hot. Personally I felt pretty numb and crappy at the time, but she thought it was great and still sometimes mentions it.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

TheTruthHurts said:


> Ya know I ran into a hilarious Tumblr account where guys submit dikpiks and the women tell them how small and useless they are. It's a riot. Guys post photos alongside chapstick to show their pathetic manhood (and presumably go in the corner and pleasure themselves after they are publicly shamed and ridiculed). I guess the toilet paper tube is a big test - guys show the don't have the length or girth to fill the tube he he
> 
> "To each his own"
> 
> ...


Please explain the bolded part? How can a man be cheating by growing? This is not something under his control.

As for smoking....

I once read something that said that women who smoke get more hits on dating sites than those who don't (can't find the article so not sure if it was accurate, but at the time I believed it). I thought that was so odd, since most men and women both say they do not want to date a smoker.

I asked my ex-h at the time I read the article, "hey honey, this is weird, why would guys want to date a woman who smokes, especially if he doesn't?"

He said "it's totally obvious babe...women who smoke are already used to putting nasty, dirty things in their mouths, so guys think hey this chick will put ANYTHING in her mouth."

Makes sense to a random guy, I guess.


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## TheTruthHurts (Oct 1, 2015)

@Faithful Wife What I meant is that guys send photos in their smallest and most flaccid state to get ridiculed. So they're not hard and are showing how pathetic they are. But I (personally) know that there can be a huge  difference for some people and I suspect they are trying to minimize their package because of their humiliation fetish.

What's funny is how seriously many guys take the whole size thing. I read (on a TAM penis thread I think) about a dollar bill test - I guess you compare yourself to a dollar bill. ??? I assumed that meant girth and tried it for fun. It fit perfectly so I assumed I was whatever. Turns out it was a length measure - I guess a dollar bill is 6". Anyway none of that matters - it's just stupid obsessive self doubt.

Or in the case of the Tumblr site, a weird penis size fetish.

But I guess there are tons of girls that post photos and try to get rated - there's a "gone wild" Reddit full of them.

It's like a giant interconnected mess of insecurity. It concerns me because each new generation has less and less personal contact, and this fake digital world undermines self esteem.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

MJJEAN said:


> @Faithful Wife
> 
> You've never had a PIV orgasm, if I read your post right? And your vaginal walls are very sensitive?
> 
> ...


Here's how it is for me...and I've read stories of and known other women who reflect my experience....however I've also read lots of stories like yours of women who experience O's through PIV....

For me: There are clitoral O's and there are vaginal O's. No doubt that the clitoral system is involved in both. But they are both very different in the way they feel to me.

With clitoral O's, my clit feels like a tiny penis. It gets hard, it gets engorged with blood when I'm aroused, and it responds to direct stimulation, like a penis. At random times, I feel a jolt in my clit (seeing a graphic sexual image, or just being turned on by something/anything), that seems similar to how some men describe the zing in the tip of their penis at a similar turned on moment. To have a clitoral O, I need that thing stroked just right. Yes my mind gets involved and if I am distracted or otherwise not into it, I just can't get there. If I am into, open, and relaxed, I can get into it and get off great (from oral, digital or a vibrator).

My clit seems to respond mostly to the more raw of my sexual feelings. It doesn't respond at all to romantic feelings or thoughts (at least not in that I can feel that zing in it or feel it get engorged with blood, though I do think the whole clitoral system gets involved even though I don't feel those obvious signals). 

Then there are my vaginal O's, some that squirt insane amounts of fluid, some that don't.

It sucks that when a woman "comes", this can mean a whole lot of different things. When a man "comes", everyone understands what this means. It means he has an orgasm and he ejaculates. 

But orgasm and ejaculating are actually two different things. For both men and women.

Men typically experience the peak of orgasm, and then ejaculate. This is typical and normal (and beautiful, IMO).

But men *can* learn to orgasm but NOT ejaculate.

We are capable of so much more sexually than most people realize. There are so many benefits for men to learn to orgasm without ejaculating...natural birth control at the top, but also it increases a man's ability to be in the control center of his sexual energy. It increases his ability to enjoy orgasm for itself, minus ejaculating. (Like Sting, I'm tantric).

When I have a clitoral O, my body does what I feel a man's body does when he _ejaculates_.

When I have a vaginal O, my body does what I feel a man's body does when he is in the height of _orgasm_ BEFORE he ejaculates.

Just to throw a side ways wrench into this however....I ejaculate/squirt when I am at the height of a vaginal orgasm. Never at the height of a clitoral orgasm.

For me to reach a vaginal orgasm, none of the raw sexual components nor the direct clitoral stimulation is required. I do not feel the throb or zing in my clit at all when I'm reaching for a vaginal orgasm. Instead I am reaching into a mental place within myself. There is also a physical place that must be stimulated (my g-spot), but my head space is 100% required for me to get there. I also need a huge amount of raw lust in the room. Felt by both of us for a substantial period of time. I have often wondered if mutual lust in a room between myself and a lover set forth a chemical reaction that allows my body to have vaginal O's. It feels like a shift comes over the entire area that surrounds me and when that shift occurs, I know I can go for it.

A partner could not just stimulate my g-spot over and over without my mental participation and get a vaginal orgasm out of me. But they could possibly stimulate my clit over and over without my mental participation and get a clitoral orgasm out of me. They feel completely different to me.

I can give myself clitoral O's (digital or vibe), but I cannot give myself vaginal O's. I possibly could get to that with a g-spot toy, but only if a partner was there to provide the mutual lust. I cannot generate the type of lust required to get to a vaginal O by myself. I *can* do that for a clitoral O, however. That actually doesn't take lust, it just takes stimulation (and maybe some imagination or porn or dirty talk, etc). Lust can add to the experience, but it isn't required for a clitoral O.

Vaginal O's require that mutual lust. For me, the process to get to a vaginal O is usually this:

*Lots of touching and kissing throughout the day, in a lusty way

*We declare our intention to have sex later that night

*Time available to actually have sex occurs....Yay, finally time to have sex!

*Making out...mashing....loving on each other...moving on from foreplay to sex....have sex over a period of time while I'm totally getting into the feelings of it all.....lust grows and grows...we change positions...we talk to each other...I get high off the whole experience....this takes an hour or so in total (including foreplay)...

*He gets off. I love it. I encourage it. When the moment comes, I'm ready for it completely and sort of go to a differently plane within myself as I feel or see him getting off. It is incredible.

*We relax for a moment. I soar on angel's wings due to the high I'm on.

*He says "ready to come on me baby?" I say "oh yes please".

*We set up a bunch of towels that I sit on, and he fingers me (in the "come here" position) with his arm flat on the bed and me on top of it. I slide down on his finger, and we do our thing. We know exactly what is necessary as far as pressure and movement to get to my g-spot. By this time, it is already flaming and ready to go. 

*I go into myself, to a place that unlocks this type of O. He is included in that place with me entirely. We are both present. The mutual lust we've just experienced and my intense feelings surrounding his O have put us here together. It is a *mental* space. I cannot emphasize this enough. I don't even know how to describe it. It is nothing like the raw physical feelings of a clitoral O for me. (Though again, no doubt that the whole system is involved even if I don't feel the zing).

*I have a lot of control over when I tip over the edge the for the first O, but after that first time....I am basically at his mercy. He can make me come over and over and over and....I've never found out how long this could last because I've always passed out first.

*After I've had however many I can handle, we collapse on each other for a time....maybe take a sex nap.....then I have to scurry around and grab up all the wet towels and sometimes pull the sheets off (dammit, I soaked through them all again) and put it all in the laundry. Stupid huge amounts of sex towel laundry are a side effect of me getting regular vaginal O's.

....

In rare circumstances with the right angle, I can have vaginal O's from PIV. When I have done this, it has been the most incredible experiences of my life.

Clitorals O's? Never and not even close during PIV....unless adding a small vibe to the clit. This has been fun a few times but I find I don't want to bother with the stupid vibrating inanimate thing when I'm having so much fun without it. 

I have had a handful of blended clitoral and vaginal O's. I can only guess that those are what you are experiencing, and yes I am envious. I can understand how this is totally possibly within some women's anatomy. 

I just don't seem to have that type of anatomy.

I do not enjoy at ALL any inanimate object inside of me, to include condoms and any type of insertible toy. There's just something "dead" about it. I need blood pumping through it in order for me to react to something inside of me. Only a penis or a finger will give me the incredible sensations I described in that other post. And that feeling I described....will not give me an O.

However, it will be part of what generates the lust that causes me to have endless vaginal O's shortly afterward.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

TheTruthHurts said:


> @Faithful Wife What I meant is that guys send photos in their smallest and most flaccid state to get ridiculed. So they're not hard and are showing how pathetic they are. But I (personally) know that there can be a huge  difference for some people and I suspect they are trying to minimize their package because of their humiliation fetish.
> 
> .....
> 
> It's like a giant interconnected mess of insecurity. It concerns me because each new generation has less and less personal contact, and this fake digital world undermines self esteem.


Oh! Ok, I get what you meant by cheating a little now.

As for insecurity fetishes....meh. You know, why not? I mean, really all the tiny penis fetish thing is about is being degraded.

Lots of people feel sexual arousal when being degraded. Its just....a thing. You know?

I don't really feel arousal surrounding being degraded necessarily, but I can also understand it.

"You like that, don't you, you dirty sl*t?"

I mean, this is pretty common dirty talk that many women love. Lots of men love it, too. It may be even harder for them to admit that they love it than it is for women.

Degradation can expand so far....to the very core of a person...."you worthless piece of ****"....."you stupid f*cking idiot"........and for their own reasons, some people hear these things and get turned on.

"Your sickening tiny penis makes me want to puke". It is really just the same thing. 

If people are into it, it is all good. I don't think it even necessarily means they are insecure.


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## alexm (Nov 29, 2008)

Hellomynameis said:


> There is also large and LARGE. My STBXH is hung like a horse as they say. It didn't make sex better, it made it painful. He literally could not get his entire penis inside me but his attempts to try were NOT enjoyable. And at 5'5 I'm not exactly a small woman. Strangely enough the woman he left me for was only 4'10. I don't know how they even managed.


Maybe worth mentioning that one's over all body size doesn't always indicate small/large this-or-that, regardless of gender. My ex wife was 4'11 and was smaller down there, yes. A woman I was with briefly was ~5'5", did not have a petite frame, and was insanely small and tight, to the point where it simply didn't work with me. Another woman I was with was average height and frame (if not on the slim side) and had perhaps the loosest vagina I've encountered.

Same goes with men. I'm 5'7", and I'm no horse, but I'm fairly far above average, approaching 'large' in both length and girth. A guy I've known since I was 8 or 9 and grew up with, he's 6'4", well-built, and he says he's in the 5" range. Good friends of my wife and I - she's 5'9", he's 5'3" (!!!!). She's curvy and very leggy, he's stocky and fit. She's hinted over the years that he's not lacking in that dept.

Appendages (ears, nose, breasts, and yes, penises) don't grow in proportion to one's body or skeletal frame, they're separate. I'd venture to say those things are purely genetic. A family with big noses, for example, will pass that trait on through generations more often than not. Depends on which side of the family the child gets those genes from. Mom has a flat chest, it's a safe bet that her daughters will, too. The women in my wife's family are all relatively the same size, shape and height.

There are very tall women who have flat chests, and very small women who have huge breasts. There are big men with small penises, and small men with huge penises.


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## alexm (Nov 29, 2008)

The post below (FW's) should be the be-all, end-all of these penis size threads (and hijacks). Somebody should copy/paste it into every subsequent penis size thread, and lock it immediately after. Honestly.

That's not to say that other women's opinions should be discounted, but this post is definitive, and comes from a self-styled penis expert :grin2: who is honest and blunt and doesn't give a damn about our poor man-feelings.

As far as size goes, FW sums it up perfectly - average is fine, good even. Above average is more desirable. I don't think this is surprising news to men. Length matters for stroke depth/length. Thickness matters for exactly the reasons you think it would. Being average in both of those regards is perfectly fine. Perfectly fine - not just "it'll do".

And above all - everything is relative. FW's 'ideal' (7.5" x 5.5") may be too big for some. It may even be too small for some.

Where we men (including myself) get hung up on things is this - the alleged average penis is 5.1-5.6" in length, and 4.8" in girth. As this is an anonymous place and you don't know me, I don't care about disclosing my general stats - I am almost 2" longer and more than 2" thicker than these so-called averages, which would be significantly higher than the average in both regards. Here's the thing - not one woman has ever commented on the size of my junk, ever.

My sample size is probably smaller than most, however (~12 women have seen it). Regardless, this leads me to believe that all of those women have seen/had bigger, thus making what I have not exactly stand out. _Which is fine_, and is the law of averages. I doubt there's a woman reading this who hasn't seen or had bigger. Something that did make them say "wow" or "no way". My ex wife once told me she had one those "no way" penises. So mine, in comparison, did not generate that feeling, obviously. My current wife has never said anything about her past experiences in that regard, nor have I asked, but as she's never commented on my size, it stands to reason that she's had bigger. So what?

And this is why we guys with ~average penises get hung up on it all too often - only the truly monstrous ones generate any kind of comment. This is why guys with average (or even bigger) penises walk around thinking they're inferior. They require this acknowledgement or confirmation that they're not small. Or worse, they assume because their partner doesn't say anything at all, that they're lacking in that dept. I know I'm not, yet not one woman has said anything to me. Luckily, I don't require that kind of validation. Yes, in part because I know I'm not lacking, but also because I don't attach any feeling of self-worth to my penis. If I were smaller than average, I'd simply seek out a partner to whom my penis was a good fit. As I've mentioned before in these threads, two of the women I've been with would have absolutely preferred an average or smaller penis size. It's not like they don't exist.

(I'm never taking part in penis size threads again)



Faithful Wife said:


> To the first bolded....it is more than just about length. There is also the overall look, color, shape, contour, circumcised or not, etc. I think some penises are beautiful, others just ok, others not so much. I will not bother to describe it down much further because it is kind of irrelevant since every woman (for whom this matters) will have their different preferences, but when my girls and I are locker room talkin', we talk about more than length and girth. The look of the thing matters to us, but we don't always agree on what it should be lookin' like.
> 
> To the second bolded....I can absolutely feel the difference in girth. It makes a huge difference (he he).
> 
> ...


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## EllisRedding (Apr 10, 2015)

Alright, since this is the official unofficial penis size thread, the timing of this was interesting. This morning I was listening to the "Blown Off" segment on the radio on my drive to work. Female called in (For ease, lets call her FemiPink), went on a date, really liked the dude (for ease, lets called him Conan  ), he went ghost afterwards. She commented how she is very upfront in talking about herself, past relationships, what she is looking for, etc...

So radio station gets Conan on the phone. He said he wasn't interested in pursuing anything with FemiPink. His main issue, she was very upfront/aggressive about herself, and in particular FemiPink felt the need to talk in detail about how large her ex's trouser monster was, how at times it was difficult for her to "handle it" etc... FemiPink didn't see what was wrong with this, and if Conan wasn't strong enough to handle this then they didn't have a future together lol.

So, with that being said, does anyone feel that this is way too much info to share (whether it be on a first date as in this case or really at any point in a relationship)? I guess I don't see the value in disclosing this at any point. I can't imagine talking to a SO about how cavernous or tight an Ex's vagina was. I understand some people like to be as open as possible talking about their sexual past, but like I said I don't see the value in this specific information. At a minimum, doesn't really strike me as first date conversation lol.


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## FeministInPink (Sep 13, 2012)

@alexm I've been with my fair share of above and very above average guys. But I've only directly commented on size, unsolicited, in one instance. They man in question was 5'11" incredibly lean (think Jack Sprat, but with tight, wiry muscles--he was incredibly strong), and he was hung like a horse. The size of his package in juxtaposition with his overall physique was so surprising that I made a (positive) comment in exclamation before I could stop myself. I believe I said, "Holy ****, you're hung like a horse!"

Luckily, he was very good at foreplay.

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## FeministInPink (Sep 13, 2012)

EllisRedding said:


> Alright, since this is the official unofficial penis size thread, the timing of this was interesting. This morning I was listening to the "Blown Off" segment on the radio on my drive to work. Female called in (For ease, lets call her FemiPink), went on a date, really liked the dude (for ease, lets called him Conan  ), he went ghost afterwards. She commented how she is very upfront in talking about herself, past relationships, what she is looking for, etc...
> 
> So radio station gets Conan on the phone. He said he wasn't interested in pursuing anything with FemiPink. His main issue, she was very upfront/aggressive about herself, and in particular FemiPink felt the need to talk in detail about how large her ex's trouser monster was, how at times it was difficult for her to "handle it" etc... FemiPink didn't see what was wrong with this, and if Conan wasn't strong enough to handle this then they didn't have a future together lol.
> 
> So, with that being said, does anyone feel that this is way too much info to share (whether it be on a first date as in this case or really at any point in a relationship)? I guess I don't see the value in disclosing this at any point. I can't imagine talking to a SO about how cavernous or tight an Ex's vagina was. I understand some people like to be as open as possible talking about their sexual past, but like I said I don't see the value in this specific information. At a minimum, doesn't really strike me as first date conversation lol.


Hmm... that moniker is a little too similar to my own for comfort!

I will tell you guys about my previous partners in that respect, but I wouldn't do that with a partner, especially not on a first date! My guy and I have told each other some stories about our past sexual escapades, but we are also very happy in our sexual dynamic and never compare each other to previous partners... but then again, we both agree that there's really no comparison!

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## EllisRedding (Apr 10, 2015)

FeministInPink said:


> Hmm... that moniker is a little too similar to my own for comfort!
> 
> I will tell you guys about my previous partners in that respect, but I wouldn't do that with a partner, especially not on a first date! My guy and I have told each other some stories about our past sexual escapades, but we are also very happy in our sexual dynamic and never compare each other to previous partners... but then again, we both agree that there's really no comparison!
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk


You know, I think in your case though both you and your guy are both at a point (and on the same page) in terms of the information being shared (i.e. sharing some stories). The problem with FemiPink is that without knowing Conan, she took it upon herself to disclose this information under the pretense that "she is putting it all out there on the table". I almost got the impression from the call that she is actually very insecure, but tries to hide it by taking the exact opposite approach (could be wrong, just how I read the few minutes she was on the radio).

In my case, unless there is something specific that my SO had experienced in her past that may in some way impact us, I am content just knowing the minimum information as I rather just focus on us then run the risk of feeling like we need to compete with past relationships.


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## MJJEAN (Jun 26, 2015)

TheTruthHurts said:


> I recall (way back in the early '90's for you young'nes) when smoking started to become socially unacceptable. I knew right there and then - NEW FETISH! recently I google "hot girl smoking" and OMG a billion hits - mostly porn sites. Go figure!
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Naughty is hot. Smoking became naughty.



Personal said:


> Talking about temperature, my wife loved having me inside her when I had a fever.
> 
> She really liked the fact that my penis felt really hot. Personally I felt pretty numb and crappy at the time, but she thought it was great and still sometimes mentions it.


I don't know if it's available in the land of Oz, but KY brand has a lubricant that also warms if you haven't tried it. Your Mrs. might like it very much. I've never used it because DH is a walking furnace, but friends have reported liking it.



Faithful Wife said:


> I asked my ex-h at the time I read the article, "hey honey, this is weird, why would guys want to date a woman who smokes, especially if he doesn't?"
> 
> He said "it's totally obvious babe...women who smoke are already used to putting nasty, dirty things in their mouths, so guys think hey this chick will put ANYTHING in her mouth."
> 
> Makes sense to a random guy, I guess.


Ya know, there might be something to that. I don't know about your neck of the woods, but I've watched smoking go from something almost everyone does to something almost no one does. It's almost become a rebellious act. To some men, a smoker might seem like a "bad girl" who'd be more likely to get down and dirty.



Faithful Wife said:


> Here's how it is for me...and I've read stories of and known other women who reflect my experience....however I've also read lots of stories like yours of women who experience O's through PIV....
> 
> 
> ....
> ...


I have vaginal O's, clitoral O's, and combination O's. The most intense for me are the vaginal and combination with clitoral usually being less intense, but there are have been exceptions to the rule. 

Combination O's usually happen when having sex and my clitoris bumps up against something in either the woman on top position or face down position. Sometimes with the right man on top angle. With woman on top or man on top, my clit rubs against his pubic "pooch". When on bottom and face down, it happens because I may be bumping against a towel or the blanket with each thrust.

"Something dead about it.." Great description! I'm stealing that one next time I have to try to explain my feelings on toys and condoms. 


On the radio this morning I heard about a new product. 

"The Lovely, a “smart” sex toy, fits around the penis and tracks sexual activity — from calories burned, to number of thrusts, to the intensity of intercourse. A smartphone app measures these and other data sets before recommending new sex positions “to help you have even better sex next time,” the Indiegogo page reads.

Made of silicone, the one-size-fits-all toy vibrates to help provide stimulation during sex. It syncs to your smartphone via bluetooth, and its battery lasts for seven hours without vibration, or two hours with. When Lovely’s battery gets low, just place it in its wireless charging cradle to power it up."

A FitBit for the penis with an App that gives you suggestions to improve your sex. Totally a Relationships 2017 Style thing!


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## EllisRedding (Apr 10, 2015)

MJJEAN said:


> Ya know, there might be something to that. I don't know about your neck of the woods, but I've watched smoking go from something almost everyone does to something almost no one does. It's almost become a rebellious act. To some men, a smoker might seem like a "bad girl" who'd be more likely to get down and dirty.


Hmmm ... that is an interesting perspective. I know for me, if I see a female who, let's say, is a "9". If a moment later I see her light up a cig, she pretty instantaneously drops down to a "1-2". I never really associated it with "Oh wow she smokes, I can only imagine what she would be willing to do in bed" lol.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

FeministInPink said:


> @alexm I've been with my fair share of above and very above average guys. *But I've only directly commented on size, unsolicited, in one instance.* They man in question was 5'11" incredibly lean (think Jack Sprat, but with tight, wiry muscles--he was incredibly strong), and he was hung like a horse. The size of his package in juxtaposition with his overall physique was so surprising that I made a (positive) comment in exclamation before I could stop myself. I believe I said, "Holy ****, you're hung like a horse!"
> 
> Luckily, he was very good at foreplay.


Do you comment on things other than size?

Every man I've been with who I've had wonderful sex with, I always commented on _everything_ I liked about his c*ck. This is not that many men (I have a low number and not all of them were wonderful at sex), but I made sure each one of them knew exactly how much I loved their package and what I loved about it. I always told them their size and shape was beautiful to me, the color of it, the way it bends (or didn't), or whatever else was actually true about my feelings for his lovely unit.

The men I've had great sex with were always the type to compliment and really make me feel beautiful. I always give as good as I get. I know the men I've had great sex with in the past still hear my words of affirmation about their manhood ringing in their ears. And it was all true, every word of it.

A couple of them can't quite get over me because of this.

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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

Semi-related amusing story.....

Having been dating for the past year now (and several months of this I had a boyfriend so that subtracts some of the time)....I now have a gallery of penis pictures.

Not of men I've had sex with, but of men I only TEXTED with.

I never asked for one of the pictures, not one. Every one was sent unsolicited. I'm not saying it was unwelcomed, I'm just saying it was nothing I ever asked for or encouraged. 

It seems that if you put a penis and a camera in the same room, sooner or later there will be penis pictures in some woman's texts (or lots of women's). I couldn't believe this at first and wondered what the heck has happened in the world that every man I meet is willing to show me his junk before I've even met him!

But I got used to it pretty quick.  So at some point I just enjoyed the free penis pictures and started a gallery of them. Again most of these guys, I never even met in person. And they didn't send pictures of porn star looking stuff, so I really think it was their own and not a stolen internet picture (plus some of them left their face in the picture too!)

I learned to admire the nudist attitude of these guys. They honestly didn't care if I was secretly thinking "wow, that's all you've got?" I think they just enjoyed being naked and showing me their goods. 

I did not go on and on about how beautiful their penis was, unless it truly was. If it wasn't or didn't do much for me, I was still polite and would at least send a smiley face.

One guy I was considering for a make out buddy turned flakey on me really quick, but the exchange we had was simply hysterical....we had texted for a few days and met and made out once. By then he had sent me at least 3 penis pics and even a short video! He asked me if he could send them before he did, and I said "sure but you need to know, I literally have a gallery of penis pictures and if you send one, you will be in it". He was like "wow a gallery?", I'm like "yep, every man sends them". He said "even if he's not packing?", I said "yep, they all send them. You basically can't stop them from sending them". He said "ha ha" and then promptly sent them (the video came later).

When he started getting flakey in a way I didn't like, I ended it by text. He got irritated at my reasons for ending it and started getting snarky at me. Then he said in a huff "delete my pictures please". I said "will do" and immediately deleted our entire text string with all pictures and the video. That was it, I had not transferred any of his pictures to my photo gallery yet. Deleting the text deleted them all. 

A few moments later he texted "wait, I'm in your gallery though aren't I?". I said "nope, just deleted them all because you asked me to". Then he tried to talk me out of dropping him again for a bit but I just remained sure it was over and told him we'd both need to move along now. 

His next text said "a parting gift" with a penis picture. :rofl:

Like I said to him, you literally can't stop them from sending pictures.

(In this guy's case, he actually was packing a beautiful one! Nice addition to my gallery).

They always ask for naked pictures in return. I might send something provocative and sexy, but not naked. Some of them whine and want naked, and sometimes will say "but it isn't fair, I sent you penis pics!" to which I will always laugh and say "I never asked you to", because I didn't.


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## rockon (May 18, 2016)

Faithful Wife said:


> But men *can* learn to orgasm but NOT ejaculate.



Um............what? How? I'm really curious.


----------



## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

rockon said:


> Um............what? How? I'm really curious.


How to Have Multiple Non-Ejaculatory Orgasms: Step-by-Step

That's just one....there are hundreds of others.


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## FeministInPink (Sep 13, 2012)

EllisRedding said:


> You know, I think in your case though both you and your guy are both at a point (and on the same page) in terms of the information being shared (i.e. sharing some stories). The problem with FemiPink is that without knowing Conan, she took it upon herself to disclose this information under the pretense that "she is putting it all out there on the table". I almost got the impression from the call that she is actually very insecure, but tries to hide it by taking the exact opposite approach (could be wrong, just how I read the few minutes she was on the radio).
> 
> In my case, unless there is something specific that my SO had experienced in her past that may in some way impact us, I am content just knowing the minimum information as I rather just focus on us then run the risk of feeling like we need to compete with past relationships.


I know, I said I wouldn't tell someone that type of stuff on a first date! LOL

I think your read on the insecurity is spot-on. Someone, in the past, made her feel bad about not disclosing this stuff early on, and so she decided that moving forward, she's going to tell every guy on the first date, so she knows up front if they're going to judge her, rather than waste time on them only to have them judge her later.

It's like this... I have a friend who, like two years ago, contracted genital warts (these are caused by HPV) from some guy she slept with. So she went to the doctor and got them frozen off or burned off or whatever, and has had no recurrence since. And she was talking about when she should disclose this, and she was saying that she thinks it's best to disclose on the first date... and I'm thinking, NO! Why would you DO THAT? You don't even know if you're going to sleep at him at that point, and if you don't have any actual warts at that point in time you're not contagious and you're not going to give him anything, you may never have a recurrence ever in your life, and HPV is so stupid common that it's very possible that he already has HPV. It's like 1 in 3 adults, it's so common that they don't even test for it anymore, and a lot of people never develop symptoms. It's not a big deal, really. You're acting like it's AIDS or terminal cancer, and it's not even close. But her logic was, if he's going to judge me, I'd rather have him do it now than later. And she refused to budge on it.

I think she felt a deep sense of shame about it, and felt that she needed to be punished in some way... and the shame of telling a virtual stranger about it on the first date, on every first date, was her way of punishing herself.


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## FeministInPink (Sep 13, 2012)

Faithful Wife said:


> Do you comment on things other than size?
> 
> Every man I've been with who I've had wonderful sex with, I always commented on _everything_ I liked about his c*ck. This is not that many men (I have a low number and not all of them were wonderful at sex), but I made sure each one of them knew exactly how much I loved their package and what I loved about it. I always told them their size and shape was beautiful to me, the color of it, the way it bends (or didn't), or whatever else was actually true about my feelings for his lovely unit.
> 
> ...


Well, Real Estate and I have had extended conversations about his, because he's kind of obsessed with it. He'll be going to town solo, and then he'll have me take a turn and ask, "Can you feel XYZ?" of whatever. There are certain things that he likes me to say, especially during sex, and I'll say them (and mean them), but I'm not one to typically wax poetic about someone's c0ck. It's just not my style.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

EllisRedding said:


> Alright, since this is the official unofficial penis size thread, the timing of this was interesting. This morning I was listening to the "Blown Off" segment on the radio on my drive to work. Female called in (For ease, lets call her FemiPink), went on a date, really liked the dude (for ease, lets called him Conan  ), he went ghost afterwards. She commented how she is very upfront in talking about herself, past relationships, what she is looking for, etc...
> 
> So radio station gets Conan on the phone. He said he wasn't interested in pursuing anything with FemiPink. His main issue, she was very upfront/aggressive about herself, and in particular FemiPink felt the need to talk in detail about how large her ex's trouser monster was, how at times it was difficult for her to "handle it" etc... FemiPink didn't see what was wrong with this, and if Conan wasn't strong enough to handle this then they didn't have a future together lol.
> 
> So, with that being said, does anyone feel that this is way too much info to share (whether it be on a first date as in this case or really at any point in a relationship)? I guess I don't see the value in disclosing this at any point. I can't imagine talking to a SO about how cavernous or tight an Ex's vagina was. I understand some people like to be as open as possible talking about their sexual past, but like I said I don't see the value in this specific information. At a minimum, doesn't really strike me as first date conversation lol.


LOL! You are a troublemaker!

Ok. Going on a first date and talking about having a hard time accommodating a previous partners junk would be kind of weird.

Now, not to say I would have been put off if other things about her were desirable.

I have had women talk about history in the process of hitting on me and the only reason I can imagine for that is they were trying to let me know they would be up for sex with me.

Mrs. Conan and I had a general talk about mostly our future when we knew we were serious but didn't discuss our histories until way into our relationship and I didn't discuss mine seriously until 18 years into marriage.

In a passing conversation about sex, Mrs. Conan confessed her first husband was part mammoth. Her words were "he had a log down there".

Funny radio show topic!:laugh:


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## Holdingontoit (Mar 7, 2012)

EllisRedding said:


> So radio station gets Conan on the phone. He said he wasn't interested in pursuing anything with FemiPink. His main issue, she was very upfront/aggressive about herself, and in particular FemiPink felt the need to talk in detail about how large her ex's trouser monster was, how at times it was difficult for her to "handle it" etc... FemiPink didn't see what was wrong with this, and if Conan wasn't strong enough to handle this then they didn't have a future together lol.
> 
> So, with that being said, does anyone feel that this is way too much info to share (whether it be on a first date as in this case or really at any point in a relationship)? I guess I don't see the value in disclosing this at any point.


Actually, I think quite the opposite. I think FemiPink was correct to share the information. And I think Conan was correct to ghost her.

The point of dating is to determine compatibility. Discovering you are not compatible is not failure, it is success. Failure is continuing to date again and again with both desperately refusing to admit their underlying incompatibility.

The FemiPink you described is comfortable with her sexuality. She needs to be with a man who is also comfortable with his. If her being sexually open is uncomfortable for Conan, then they are incompatible and the sooner they discover that, the better. Doesn't matter whether the source of his discomfort is his size, his shyness, his view that discussing sex is something that should be reserved for after people are deeply romantically involved, or something else. They aren't compatible and her statement that identified that incompatibility was helpful in uncovering that reality.


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## Mr.Fisty (Nov 4, 2014)

FeministInPink said:


> I know, I said I wouldn't tell someone that type of stuff on a first date! LOL
> 
> I think your read on the insecurity is spot-on. Someone, in the past, made her feel bad about not disclosing this stuff early on, and so she decided that moving forward, she's going to tell every guy on the first date, so she knows up front if they're going to judge her, rather than waste time on them only to have them judge her later.
> 
> ...


 Tbh, if a female were to tell me about her warts on a first date, I would pass as well. If I knew her better and liked her, I could over-look it due to that bond.

If a female were to tell me how her last partner was a horse, I would pass on the first date but once a relationship is established and we both enjoy the sex, then I would be fine with it. As long as we both are happy with what each other gives physically, mentally, and emotionally, I am cool with whatever. When I am in a relationship, the thing I care most about is my needs met, do I meet her's. I left someone that I could not meet her needs to before. She wanted someone to play stepfather to her child, I was 23 and did not want kids.

Oh, I would also leave a relationship if she brings up her ex on a constant basis as she is not over him or has not worked through her issues.

My advice to your friend would be to hold off on sex if she must and let the other person get to know her better first. I would totally sleep with her on a second date if things were clicking.:wink2:


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## alexm (Nov 29, 2008)

EllisRedding said:


> You know, I think in your case though both you and your guy are both at a point (and on the same page) in terms of the information being shared (i.e. sharing some stories). The problem with FemiPink is that without knowing Conan, she took it upon herself to disclose this information under the pretense that "she is putting it all out there on the table". *I almost got the impression from the call that she is actually very insecure, but tries to hide it by taking the exact opposite approach *(could be wrong, just how I read the few minutes she was on the radio).
> 
> In my case, unless there is something specific that my SO had experienced in her past that may in some way impact us, I am content just knowing the minimum information as I rather just focus on us then run the risk of feeling like we need to compete with past relationships.


That's generally how I view people who over-share things early in relationships (including friendships).

For me, it would be far less about being part of some comparison, and more about 'why are you talking about somebody else's **** while on a date with me?' (why are you THINKING about somebody else's **** while on a date with me?)

My ex wife told me a story once, maybe a few months into our courtship in our late teens, about how this guy she was seeing was leaving her house one day, and was a little... excited. It was so large (or at least long, I guess) that it was protruding out of his jeans pocket, skyward. When she went to hug him goodbye, she basically ended up grabbing it, which shocked her. The reason she told me this story was innocent - her mother was right there, which, I imagine, would be horrifying for any teenage girl. (why I actually remember this story, I genuinely don't know. I thought it was funny at the time, and it didn't make me insecure in any way). But in my teenage wisdom, it's highly likely I went home, popped a boner, and tried to see how far my junk stuck out of MY pocket!  (whether I did that or not, I can't remember. But yeah, probably!)

But that's far different than somebody talking about their ex's horse ****. Never mind on the first date, but pretty much ever, if it's unsolicited.

I've had far tighter than my wife, and there's no doubt she knows it. Would I ever, EVER even casually mention it? Even if it was a 'funny story'? Good god, no. Why? It's not that it'd make her insecure (it may, but I don't think so), but it's more along the lines of how I would feel if she did that to me. Why are you thinking/talking about somebody else's vagina???


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## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

MJJEAN said:


> I don't know if it's available in the land of Oz, but KY brand has a lubricant that also warms if you haven't tried it. Your Mrs. might like it very much. I've never used it because DH is a walking furnace, but friends have reported liking it.


It is and we tried it a few years ago as an anal lube.

:surprise::surprise::surprise:

It was way too hot for my wife's backside, which also informed me not to try it either. Aside from anal and through a couple of months after childbirth, my wife has never needed any lube at all. To the point that we'd be fine if she was a lot less naturally lubed down there.



MJJEAN said:


> Ya know, there might be something to that. I don't know about your neck of the woods, but I've watched smoking go from something almost everyone does to something almost no one does. It's almost become a rebellious act. To some men, a smoker might seem like a "bad girl" who'd be more likely to get down and dirty.


When I started dating my wife, she told me she smoked and then asked me if I'd tried Indonesian cigarettes (Kreteks). I told her no and said I didn't like smoking, that said I absolutely love the smell of unburnt tobacco. Anyway not that I asked her, she then quit smoking following that conversation to the point that I have never seen her smoke in my life. I tried smoking when I was 14 and smoked around 2-4 cigarettes, before I decided it was boring and stopped doing it.

That said my wife is "very VERY dirty" when it comes to sex, as nothing at all seems to gross her out.

Although I'm very lucky to be with her, in my experience she hasn't been unique in being highly sexual and up for just about anything that would shock many.

The only odd thing in that respect, is the fact that she didn't lose her virginity, until she was 25 and not long before we started together. So when we started I found her to be pretty inexperienced, a bit awkward and clumsy as well. Yet she was very keen and wanted to do and try everything regardless of whether she'd heard of it before.

I suspect the fact that she was raised in an Italian Catholic migrant family, where her father sometimes called her a **** from the time she reached puberty. Then often called her a *****, after she moved out of home when she was 22, had something to do with her waiting. Since she didn't have sex with anyone until after her father died.

Anyway today my wife and I look like a conservative and boring middle aged couple, who look a bit mismatched with me being short and now fat (although I've lost 6kg/13lb so far this year Yay!), with her being tall and skinny. Yet when we're out she's all over me, we flirt lots, hold hands and kiss all the time (much to the displeasure of our 13 year old daughter, who rolls her eyes whenever we exchange a kiss).

The thing is we have a few different circles of friends, some of them are very conservative, very religious and would be shocked by other friends of ours. Who include a dominatrix who does all sorts of scenes or another woman who makes sex toys and on and on.

When we first started dating my wife (not knowing me very well) set out to shock me, by taking me on a date to meet one of her *** Hag friends at a Tranny Club. When we got there and I didn't know where we were going, I laughed at her and told her I know you're trying to shock me, but it won't work.

Anyway she admitted that she was trying to shock me, so I then told her about the first time I got drunk when I was 15. During a Pub crawl down Oxford Street in Sydney back in 1986 (which is famed for it's gay bars), with two of my then 18 year old, gay school friends (the music was awesome and I still remember that night fondly).

As it turns out what shocked me more, was meeting her conservative church going friends.

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## MJJEAN (Jun 26, 2015)

@Personal

Your post made me laugh. I was raised by a Lutheran mother who was liberal and a Catholic father who was not. I swear, my Dad literally believed until just a few years ago that women only had sex to make their husbands happy. I wish I was joking. My Mom (before she passed in 1996), my sister, and I sent countless hours trying to explain to him that women get horny, too.

When I was 15, I went to my mother to ask her to take me to the doctor so I could get on birth control because I was thinking of having sex with my BF. My mom was disabled, so she had to get a friend of hers to drive me to the appointment because Dad wouldn't. He literally laid in bed with the blanket over his head and refused to come out for hours and hours. A few weeks later, I went on a date with the BF and we did the deed. My dad must have radar, because he called a few friends over, sat at the table getting drunk as skunks, and lamenting over his "fallen" daughter.

Are we too old to talk about 2017 relationships?!!?!


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## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

MJJEAN said:


> @Personal
> 
> Your post made me laugh. I was raised by a Lutheran mother who was liberal and a Catholic father who was not. I swear, my Dad literally believed until just a few years ago that women only had sex to make their husbands happy. I wish I was joking. My Mom (before she passed in 1996), my sister, and I sent countless hours trying to explain to him that women get horny, too.
> 
> ...


Not too old at all, anyway still being in relationships right now I figure we qualify for 2017.

My mothers parents were atheists yet my mother was/is? some sort of spiritual person, whereas my father was a Church of Christ Christian whose parents were very religious. When I was born my father got me a leather bound King James bible which I still have and even read when I was 11.

:surprise:

La La La, covering my ears, my parents aren't allowed to have sex! I can't imagine having that conversation with any of my parents, that said my relationship with them has been more of a love/like hate/dislike kind of relationship.

Anyway this isn't a sex story, yet it's similar in that when my father (who is in his 60's) retired a few years ago, my wife and I found out he had never in his whole life learned how to boil an egg, cook a meal or iron his clothes.

So his whole life up until then he'd been waited on by either his mother, the landlady and then his wife. Which is funny because my mother taught me how to iron my own clothes when I was 15 and wanting to eat I learned to cook as well.

Today having learnt a little bit he now sometimes cooks breakfast, makes lunch and or cooks dinner, yet I suspect my mother still does all of the ironing.

As to birth control that's smart, although in my experience oops it didn't work that one time with the woman who became my ex-wife. Since we stopped using condoms after a year because she was on the pill, yet she eventually got pregnant and then we got married. With the whole box and dice of Catholic, pre marital counselling and the Catholic Church wedding.

Funnily enough that Catholic Church wedding remains a bone of contention with my now mother in law, because my wife and I didn't get an annulment from the Catholic Church, so we didn't get married in that church. So she doesn't think we're married and a few years ago, has even gone as far as trying to hook my wife up with another man from the Catholic church she goes to. My wife's mother who is in her 80's likes to pretend my wife isn't really an atheist and will mend her ways soon.

Although I'm an atheist, I like reading your posts about Catholicism, since to some degree it's familiar to me having been married to a Catholic woman and an ex-Catholic woman. While having been with mostly Catholic women, outside of my marriages. That said I've never gone looking for Catholic women, they just seem to find me.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

MJJEAN said:


> [MENTION=113521]Are we too old to talk about 2017 relationships?!!?!


As far as I can tell, most people younger don't have their groove fully functioning yet. When I talk about sex, their mouths drop and they say "I'll have what she's having". So no, I don't think we're too old to talk about 2017 relationships


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## MJJEAN (Jun 26, 2015)

Personal said:


> Not too old at all, anyway still being in relationships right now I figure we qualify for 2017.
> 
> My mothers parents were atheists yet my mother was/is? some sort of spiritual person, whereas my father was a Church of Christ Christian whose parents were very religious. When I was born my father got me a leather bound King James bible which I still have and even read when I was 11.
> 
> ...


OMG! I was on the Pill for a little over 2 years when I got put on antibiotics for a lung infection, no one told me they would reuce the effectiveness of the Pill, and I got pregnant. I, too, "did the right thing" and married the father. We all know how _that_ worked out... During the marriage, we were using condoms and I got pregnant with #2. Spent 3 days sitting on the couch, crying, when I found out because it felt like prison sentence extension since I'd have to stay married longer. It was so bad, my azzhole exH actually got worried for once in his life and called a friend of mine to come deal with me.

My dad was helpless, too! He was 7 years younger than mom. She was 28 and he 21 when they met. He went right from his mothers home to living with my mother. When Mom passed away, Dad was only 39. Far too young to remain a widower and far too helpless! He drove me batty. I kid you not, I was so desperate to get him married off I was giving tips and tricks to the woman who wanted to seriously date him and that he eventually married.

"So, you're interested in my Dad? You maybe want to marry him? Hallelujah! Here, let me give you this Care and Feeding of My Dad manual. If you need any other advice, don't hesitate to call, day or night."

DH was never taught how to do anything and never lived on his own, so if I die first he either has to remarry immediately, learn to cook and clean, or have enough money to hire someone. Otherwise, he'll starve to death in a filthy house. :laugh:

I'll see your Catholic MIL and raise you my MIL, who trained to be a _nun_ in her early adult years, and a devout FIL who never missed Mass until he got Parkinson's disease and could no longer attend due to his health. They're in their 80's and have been married for nearly 60 years.

I was still married to my exH when I met DH. His parents were aware. Needless to say, it took a while (about 2 years and the birth of our son) for them to fully accept that I was sincere about divorcing and marrying DH. I went through the Annulment process a few years ago when I decided to convert and, although his parents never said anything about it, I know having the Annulment approved meant a lot to them.

My MIL and FIL are now really thinking about their mortality and the afterlife. They are naturally concerned for the children they will leave behind when they pass and the immortal souls of said children are naturally also a concern. Honestly, if I hadn't gotten the Annulment already, I would do it now just to ease their minds.


Of course you kept fining Catholic women! I don't know how many are still practicing, but there are currently around 1 _billion_ Baptized Catholics wandering around. Bound to run into a few!


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