# Kinky Wife, Conservative Husband



## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

I have been with my husband for 10 years! Married for 8 years this year. I am EXTREMELY happy in my marriage in pretty much every single aspect but one. He is literally my best friend, we communicate well, we have the same values, views on household roles, agree how to raise our children. The ONLY issue that we have is sex.

My husband is very conservative sexually, introverted. He tries to please my kinky nature, but he is uncomfortable, and just not into it, and I can tell. For the last 8 years I have internalized everything. I love to role play during sex so I do it in my head, I love to talk dirty so I do that in my head as well. I like it rough and he tries not to be so considerate and more dominant but again he just is not that way. So it's usually forced, and well uncomfortable for him. 

I am honestly not even sure if we can solve this problem. He is introverted, I am extroverted sexually. We can't change who we are, but at the same time I am a little upset that my sex for the rest of my life is never going to be what I want it to be, and it will be all in my mind. 

Any advice would help, but I think we are seriously considering going to counseling because after 8 years I am tired of "discussing" the same issue over and over to no end.


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## bkaydezz (Jul 9, 2012)

How about this...
Just start doing and saying what comes to mind.
That way he doesnt always have his way because of the way he is in bed.
See if there becomes alot of rejection, or he slowly starts to get into it. Thats a good way to find out.

Then i would see a sex therapist for soem advice!


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

He makes it so awkward when I do that because he is just REALLY not into it at all.


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## HereWithoutYou (Jul 26, 2012)

I'd say practice makes perfect. I was awkward at first with different sexual things and the more I did it, the comfortable it got. Now I love some things I thought I'd never like.


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## bkaydezz (Jul 9, 2012)

are you consistent with it.

consitency is a key!


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## Lon (Jun 6, 2011)

I was this way in my marriage, so afraid to be rough. She ended up leaving rather than getting us to counselling to work it out... I met a lady a little while after my separation and she was very submissive, it was very unfamiliar to be dominant at first, however once I started spanking her and hearing her whinces of pleasure and begging for it harder I really got over my hangups in a hurry  For me, once I got a sense of permission the creative juices started flowing, it also helped that she was feisty and would pinch if I didn't control her... so maybe try playfighting a little harder and if you annoy him enough tell him your sorry and offer up your rump for a good hard paddle


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

His identical twin who is OPPOSITE to him in the bedroom told me to do that just push him to do things he doesn't want to...I just get sooooo tired being the one all the time begging him for sex starting it, pushing to try new things.... I just want to be dominated.


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## HereWithoutYou (Jul 26, 2012)

JaLeRi said:


> His identical twin who is OPPOSITE to him in the bedroom told me to do that just push him to do things he doesn't want to...I just get sooooo tired being the one all the time begging him for sex starting it, pushing to try new things.... I just want to be dominated.


You want to be dominated, but he's sort of shy in bed. That's a pretty big gap. It's not impossible, but it will take time. You've just got to get him used to everything.


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## bkaydezz (Jul 9, 2012)

BOOOOOO!

Is he insecure about anything?

Maybe he just doesnt like to be dominant?
was anything different when you first got together?


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

No he has been pretty much the same, he sex drive got less. He got REALLY REALLY conservative for awhile like only missionary conservative. Starting to come out of that about 4 years ago. He is sooooo hot, he is really fit athletic body type. He is hung, he has no reason to be insecure and he is generally a very confident person. He is pretty much the only guy I know that isn't insecure. 

One thing I should mention is that I am his first. We have been together since I was 16, and he was 18 he lost his virginity to me after a year of dating and that was HIS choice... I tried to bed him way earlier in the relationship then tried to respect his wishes the longer we dated


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

HereWithoutYou said:


> You want to be dominated, but he's sort of shy in bed. That's a pretty big gap. It's not impossible, but it will take time. You've just got to get him used to everything.


Tell me about it... during sex he is asking me if i want to change positions. I am like if you want a different position just grab me and make me do what you want and stop asking for permission first...... oh my frustration LOL


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## Lon (Jun 6, 2011)

Whatever you do, don't build resentment about having to work on this issue with him, it may not be entirely the way you like it now, but you have a lifetime together and time to figure it out... and it will get better - make sure to talk about this, tell him that you are tougher than he thinks, your VJJ was made to push 10 lb babies out of, he won't break it.

The most upsetting thing I see is couples who prematurely decide the other spouse is incapable of achieving feats they think are too important to miss out on in life.

He isn't dominant right now because he doesn't know any better, do like his twin suggests (who ought to have a pretty good idea) keep pushing him. I would bet that when your H awakens to what he is missing out on, the confidence he will develop in bed with you will carry over to other parts of his life too.


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## Paulination (Feb 6, 2012)

JaLeRi said:


> Tell me about it... during sex he is asking me if i want to change positions. I am like if you want a different position just grab me and make me do what you want and stop asking for permission first...... oh my frustration LOL


Sweet Jesus some men don't know how well they have got it. I would go buck wild if my wife had your attitude.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

I honestly don't know how many times we have talked about this issue over and over and over and over. He changes for a little bit but then just goes back to how he was.... I guess in some ways he is getting better, he tries to start sex more, and is trying to just "take" it when he wants it... I guess I am getting impatient. 

What set me off was last night we were having sex, and I use a vibrator during sex and I asked him to get it for me. Then it needed batteries and I honestly was SO turned on I told him I had no patience for that right now and I just wanted to **** him. He was so uncomfortable that I swore during sex. He doesn't find that language appropriate because we never curse in our day to day life. I explained I curse in my head all the time I was sorry it came out.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

Paulination said:


> Sweet Jesus some men don't know how well they have got it. I would go buck wild if my wife had your attitude.


I love playing the small delicate woman role in bed. I am only 100lbs and 5'4" so I am not a big girl. Nothing gets me going more then a big man taking me and making me do what he wants... tie me up and let me have it..... oh the fantasy I have... I have sooooo many. I only get to have sex with him for the rest of my life, it just feels unfair that I have to keep all that I am sexually in my head...it could be so good, so hot, so kinky... ugh my frustration


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## Lon (Jun 6, 2011)

Maybe you just need to be you more, instead of worrying about keeping it all in your head. He won't clue in if you don't give him more obvious clues.

Maybe try talking dirty, letting the naughty words come out, but quietly under your breath rather than blurting out loud and throwing him off.

then the next day send him naughty text message thanking him for the Fck last night. Maybe reading it is more tolerable to him for now.

I'm just trying out suggestions here. There are sex therapists that would probably be of great benefit to both of you - and if he is uncomfortable just tell him how important it is to you.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

Lon said:


> Maybe you just need to be you more, instead of worrying about keeping it all in your head. He won't clue in if you don't give him more obvious clues.


I guess it's back on the push him bandwagon... stop being so considerate and doing what he wants, and what makes him comfortable. He will turn down sex from me, I guess for awhile now I just happy he was having sex with me instead of shutting me down. I guess I was scared to push him, you know if we were having sex should I push it.

I can't live my whole life like this... I love him though and would never leave him or cheat everything else we have is so perfect, I would never risk losing him over something like sex. The other areas are much harder to make perfect with another person. This we can at least work on.


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## Lon (Jun 6, 2011)

Sounds like the kind of talk when you check out of a marriage, or are considering an affair. Please don't go there, its nothing but pain, and the thing is it would solve nothing, as well if you go that route he'd be shaken to the point that he'd probably be changed into the kind of person you'd want except you could no longer have.

Sex is the biggest issue in marriage, and this is obviously a dealbreaker to you, so give him a chance - make sure he know that if he is incapable and unwilling to rock your body it will cost him his marriage to you - I guarantee you it will get him unstuck - just don't give up hope in him first, I bet you would be surprised what he is actually capable of.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

I am in this thing till the end. The whole situation makes me sad because it could be awesome. He is a guy he is suppose to have the high drive, but I do. 

I am hot after two kids I am hot, I still can wear a two piece. I dance for him, I strip, I buy cute outfits this could be so good. 

I am just tired of putting all the effort in. 

Right now it's whether or not to go to counseling or not. I would never cheat I am not a cheater, I am to loyal of a person. When you have had hot passionate sex with an ex, it's hard not to compare and wish things were different with the person you are with.


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## Lon (Jun 6, 2011)

If it could be so awesome then you should be hopeful about it not sad. And also don't necessarily buy into the myth that men are supposed to be the HD one, in reality I think atleast half of marriages, especially as time goes on, the W is the HD one.

I do know that you can't control someone but you can control yourself. And that means stop thinking of hot passionate sex with your exes and only seeing disappointment in your spouse. Maybe it is just out of shear frustration that you're coming across as hopeless.

And though I would never advocate divorce, maybe you actually should atleast consider that as an option, instead of letting him off consequence free for his failure to acknowledge your need to spice it up.

As for counseling, I can't think of any reasons why you wouldn't/shouldn't go. Nothing to lose (well, there actually are some really horrific counselors out there so make sure you are getting good, positive and practical advice) but lots to gain.

Anyways JLR I wish you luck, don't underestimate the importance of this, make sure you work at fixing this and hold him accountable for his unwillingness to please you the way you need to be pleased.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

Thinking about the past doesn't help the future you are right this just breeds resentment. I dunno we talked about it tonight, he said he is introverted I am not, that how it is. End of discussion. 

The way we argue is different in 10 years I have never raised my voice to him. He usually raises his voice to me gets defensive and 90% of the time I am in the wrong.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

BTW divorce is never an option for me. There is too much good in this relationship, I would never be able to find a person so compatible for me then him. He is my love.


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## CanadianGuy (Jun 17, 2012)

Hi, 
Sounds to me like your relationship is on really solid ground and you love your husband like no other. You seem very committed to making your sex life work for you both and that is admirable. Something that has been helping me work things out for myself has been reading a lot of posts on this site. The insights about marriage have been enlightening to say the least. Hope this helps.


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## brendan (Jun 1, 2011)

tough one here. I see what you mean though. I was way more hornier than my ex wife and had all the fantasies and ideas. All she wanted to do was missionary position foe 20mins and thats it.

She hated even talking about sex, the we went a year without sex, then it was over. Now i have some new friends that are girls and its so refreshing how open they are. Open to ideas of threesomes and doing there fantasies and talking about it.


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## Lon (Jun 6, 2011)

JaLeRi said:


> BTW divorce is never an option for me. There is too much good in this relationship, I would never be able to find a person so compatible for me then him. He is my love.


Just be careful with this mindset, because it is exactly why many marriages where there is an unfulfilled need end up in an emotional affair (EA) or more, even the most loyal spouse can find themselves enjoying the company of someone who can ignite that spark, meanwhile if you are completely resigned to never ending the marriage it simply means you have no choice but to pursue something extramarital, or at the very least continue punishing your spouse because they are unable to take care of what is supposed to be your own responsibility (ie finding your happiness).

Of course I'm not accusing you, just pointing out that its a pattern seen over and over on this site, and many commenters on both sides of a betrayal will testify that it happened to them.

I believe if the compatibility is really there, then this issue can be worked out, and the only way to do that is leave the resentment behind you while also acknowledging that this truly is a need for your in the relationship.


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## kingsfan (Jun 4, 2012)

JaLeRi said:


> I have been with my husband for 10 years! Married for 8 years this year. I am EXTREMELY happy in my marriage in pretty much every single aspect but one. He is literally my best friend, we communicate well, we have the same values, views on household roles, agree how to raise our children. The ONLY issue that we have is sex.
> 
> My husband is very conservative sexually, introverted. He tries to please my kinky nature, but he is uncomfortable, and just not into it, and I can tell. For the last 8 years I have internalized everything. I love to role play during sex so I do it in my head, I love to talk dirty so I do that in my head as well. I like it rough and he tries not to be so considerate and more dominant but again he just is not that way. So it's usually forced, and well uncomfortable for him.
> 
> ...





JaLeRi said:


> No he has been pretty much the same, he sex drive got less. He got REALLY REALLY conservative for awhile like only missionary conservative. Starting to come out of that about 4 years ago. He is sooooo hot, he is really fit athletic body type. He is hung, he has no reason to be insecure and he is generally a very confident person. He is pretty much the only guy I know that isn't insecure.
> 
> One thing I should mention is that I am his first. We have been together since I was 16, and he was 18 he lost his virginity to me after a year of dating and that was HIS choice... I tried to bed him way earlier in the relationship then tried to respect his wishes the longer we dated


Interesting issue JaLeRi. I say so because your husband sounds like me (minus the athletic body type. I so need to get back into shape).

I didn't have sex until I was 19. i also am introverted in bed in the sense I don't do much risky stuff. Unlike you, my fiancee isn't pushing for more kinky stuff, though I sort of am (I'm wanting to try new stuff but not anything people around here would classify as kinky). Even though I'm opening up more than your husband by the sounds of it doesn't mean I would if I were in his shoes though.

The reason for me is I put to much emphasis on the emotional side of sex. To me sex is rarely sex, it's lovemaking. Big difference. Sex (to me) is just getting laid. Grabbing your woman and pounding her like a board at a construction site. You get the idea.

Lovemaking meanwhile is focusing on that emotional bond, that connection between two spouses that can only be found in that special way in bed. For me, it's hard to feel that love connection when I'm hammering away for all i got and telling her 'I love fckin you in your wet p**sy' 

Maybe your husband is the same way. Maybe to him, sex is more about love than about sex itself. Maybe he wants to be with you emotionally more than physically. As such, it's hard for him to get ramped up into the physical aspect as he doesn't have much connection to that area.

I know I don't, and that's why it's hard for me to push myself into that realm. The only reason I'm doing it now is I'd like to see what I'm maybe missing out on and want to try a few things I've heard/read about but never had the chance to explore in the past (was with a prude for 10 years before. My fiancee says I was 'sexually repressed', and is correct). 

Maybe have a talk with your husband and just ask him what he thinks about when you're having sex. Is he thinking 'Man, I want to see those t*its flying, that's so awesome' or is he thinking 'My goodness, she looks so beautiful right now, I love her.' Big difference in your mental approach to sex between the two. 

If he's more emotionally connected to sex, you'll have to chip away at it. A wall will not come crashing down here and suddenly he's swinging from a trapeze bar, dressed like Thor and calling his unit the hammer of the Gods. Get him to to start seeing this as an important NEED in the relationship for you and then start a plan together to come to an agreement on where you can start to get a bit more frisky in bed. Doing this with the marriage counsellor/sex therapist could be the best approach because it'll add an outside perspective to the discussion. Sometimes it's not so much what the message is, but who it comes from that is important, so having a marriage counsellor/sex therapist saying 'You know, what your wife wants is what a lot of wives want and really isn't out of the norm' could be all it takes. Remember, he has no experience other than you, so he also has no experience outside of you in terms of what women want/like/need, and the image of women given off by the media regarding sex is more along the lines of women being prudes and not wanting sex, which seems to be close to polar opposite of yourself.

One other point, just because you can see your husband as sexy, athletic and hung, doesn't mean he sees it that way. Once again, no comparison for him. He's never had any other woman tell him he's hung like a horse, so he may think you're being kind, or just flattering him. It's the same issue as women who don't believe there husbands when they say they find their wives sexy. The wife looks at themselves in the mirror and wonder what their husbands are smoking and if they had a stroke. Your husband may be thinking the same thing.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

kingsfan said:


> The reason for me is I put to much emphasis on the emotional side of sex. To me sex is rarely sex, it's lovemaking. Big difference. Sex (to me) is just getting laid. Grabbing your woman and pounding her like a board at a construction site. You get the idea.


We have talked about this and you hit the nail on the head. Sex is love making for him. I told him that I like doing the love making sex, but there needs to me more variety. There are times the only kind of sex I want is the loving beautiful sex, but then other times I just wanted to be pounded, curse and be dirty.

He has a lot of issues with sex being anything other then "pure" if I bought sexy outfits he wanted them to be white. He felt they looked more pure and that's what he liked. He is started to be ok with my look being less then pure in the bedroom. 

Recently as well, like most woman I get pms. So I was not in the best moods that day, I was grumpy, irritable. That night I wanted to have sex with my husband because we had not been close all day there had been some tension but nothing had actually happened between us. So I wanted to have sex that night because we hadn't been close all day, I wanted to bond with him. He shut me down because we hadn't been close all day, and he doesn't use sex to bond like that, sex is the result of bonding.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

Lon said:


> If it could be so awesome then you should be hopeful about it not sad. And also don't necessarily buy into the myth that men are supposed to be the HD one, in reality I think atleast half of marriages, especially as time goes on, the W is the HD one.


It could be awesome because there have been moments in the past where it was amazing and so good, and hot and everything I wanted it to be. It is just not consistent at all.


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## Farj (Jul 26, 2012)

I'm having the same trouble with my wife.

Our counselor suggested we take turns being in charge of all details during sex. The person in charge picks the music, candles, time, location, positions, activities, everything. Don't cave in and don't help each other. The in charge person makes ALL the decisions. 

The first couple of times, you be in charge, but go gently. He won't be able to handle everything at once. Remind him to pay attention, because he can follow your example when it's his turn. Move him around, spank him, whatever you want done to you, you do to him.

It could be that he is submissive as well. It's common amoung men. If so, you may have to get used to switching rolls to get what you want.


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## Lon (Jun 6, 2011)

I think Kingsfan hit the right point. Your H is hung up about treating sex as something less, he respects you too much to treat you like an object. I can relate to this as well, I was very similar with my ex (all my exes in fact).

If you have a talk with him, it should likely center around this point. He needs to learn how to let go and trust in himself that he will not lose his respect for you, nor you for him, to enjoy the raw passionate primitive sex like the animals we really are underneath our higher intellect.


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## Henri (Jun 30, 2012)

I agree. I wouldn't do to my wife the things I might enjoy watching in pornography, simply due to respect for her. But it sounds like you have talked about it, but he simply isn't in to it. Perhaps he is submissive in the bedroom as Farj's post suggest, have you asked him? 

Does he have religious beliefs which influence his sexual attitude?


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## mahike (Aug 16, 2011)

Have you tried watching movies, read books that sort of thing. You could even start slow watching "Exit to Eden" R rated 
My wife and I are reading 50 Shades of Grey wow has that spawned some new tricks.


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## Trickster (Nov 19, 2011)

I’ve been with my wife for 20 years now. She was a virgin at 25. I waited over a year for her to be ready. We are best friends even after all these years. Like you, most every other aspect of our marriage was great. Sex was the issue. I just never pressed the issue because she was so innocent. Up until 2 years ago, sex was almost non-existent. 

I was almost ready to leave. I even started to sleep in the spare bedroom. (I am not suggesting that) However that worked. She started to initiate sex, which was something she never done before in 18 years. I started using dirty words to her and she wanted me to call it “making love” instead. Now she will say dirty words but it sounds so PG its funny coming from her. She is trying though.

Now just recentely, she is drifting away again. I’d rather not sleep in the other room again. Her mind is never on sex at all. It takes all that I have to not think about it. I am also thinking a lot about other partners.

After 20 years, she hasn’t really changed sexually. She does her best (I think) to just give me enough and that’s it. Usually when I get a little grumpy, she knows it is that time again. I wish it wasn’t that way.

No matter what, I don’t want to lose my best friend over SEX. I would rather not have to play games like the 180 thing I was doing to get it, which kind of worked for the short term any way.


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## kingsfan (Jun 4, 2012)

JaLeRi said:


> We have talked about this and you hit the nail on the head. Sex is love making for him. I told him that I like doing the love making sex, but there needs to me more variety. There are times the only kind of sex I want is the loving beautiful sex, but then other times I just wanted to be pounded, curse and be dirty.
> 
> He has a lot of issues with sex being anything other then "pure" if I bought sexy outfits he wanted them to be white. He felt they looked more pure and that's what he liked. He is started to be ok with my look being less then pure in the bedroom.
> 
> Recently as well, like most woman I get pms. So I was not in the best moods that day, I was grumpy, irritable. That night I wanted to have sex with my husband because we had not been close all day there had been some tension but nothing had actually happened between us. So I wanted to have sex that night because we hadn't been close all day, I wanted to bond with him. He shut me down because we hadn't been close all day, and he doesn't use sex to bond like that, sex is the result of bonding.


I hate to pry, but to what frequeny do you have sex and how does this compare with the frequency to which he wants to have sex?

I myself was in a very non-sexual relationship with my ex. I still loved her at the time, and so whenever we did have sex, I didn't want anything else because I was so starved for the lovemaking and I knew it'd likely be a while (weeks) before we could do it again that the only type f sex that I even thought of was the lovemaking type of sex. I know though if sex was on the table more often that I wouldn't need that type of sex all the time as I'd have that need met and could dabble into other areas in the bedroom as well.

As for him not bonding that way, that is fine. We all bond differently. That said, he needs to understand that you bond in that way and that's what matters. Not trying to be insensitive to him, but I assume you are aware of what he needs to bond and you try and give him that often. He should be willing to give it back in return.

From your posts it does sound like he is trying to open up, though very slowly. Keep working on that by encouraging him, telling him you are happy when he does these things and finding small ways to expand on what it is he is comfortable with, all the while reinforcing how it helps you bond to him. It will likely take yeras to get where you want to go to, but it will happen if he's willing to try and you are willing to accept a pace of exploration that he is comfortable with.


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## Halien (Feb 20, 2011)

I'd suggest counseling, like others have said.

With that, have you tried to understand where this behavior comes from? In other words, it may not be entirely based on his views about sex, but also wrapped up in misunderstanding his role with you.

I'm the kind of person who stands out for being imposing, I'm told, because of my frame and weightlifting. Had a troubled past, but wanted to change during the time that I met my wife about 27 years ago. I was literally terrified of being threatening to her. Men can get into these roles for cultural reasons, also, and when you mention how small you are, its worth exploring if this had something to do with his initial reservations. Later, though, these insecurities just build upon themselves, in my opinion. It would take some time to communicate that you trust him completely, and would not be offended by a more aggressive approach.

My wife and I can enjoy the more aggressive approach to sex, at times. For us, part of getting there was after we initially pursued a more tantric approach. We began to understand each other better, and to importance of the emotional tension aspect. What I'm getting at is that there may be a chance that your husband can't distinguish between the emotional tension created by a more agressive approach, and the actual physical aggression itself. In other words, he can start by bringing an edge to your time together. The attitude of dominance, when you prefer that, for starters. Focus on that emotional edge, the tension, at first, verbally and in the way he carries himself, and then he may begin to feel more secure about trying new things.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

Henri said:


> I agree. I wouldn't do to my wife the things I might enjoy watching in pornography, simply due to respect for her. But it sounds like you have talked about it, but he simply isn't in to it. Perhaps he is submissive in the bedroom as Farj's post suggest, have you asked him?
> 
> Does he have religious beliefs which influence his sexual attitude?


Yes religion is a factor. We are both very committed Christians


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

kingsfan said:


> I hate to pry, but to what frequeny do you have sex and how does this compare with the frequency to which he wants to have sex?


I could honestly have sex everyday to about a 2 day break at the most. My husband likes sex about 2 times a week or once a week. 

He typically compromise to sex every other day or two day breaks between. He tries hard not to shut me down, still happens now and then.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

Halien said:


> I'd suggest counseling, like others have said.
> 
> With that, have you tried to understand where this behavior comes from? In other words, it may not be entirely based on his views about sex, but also wrapped up in misunderstanding his role with you.


The funny thing is we have a very traditional marriage. I stay home with kids, I cook, clean, make his lunch for him. I do all the laundry. I take care of the kids mostly. I get up with them in the night. He goes to work and makes the money and has supper on the table waiting for him when he gets home. 

He is dominant in everything else, and I am submissive. Just not in the bedroom


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## Lon (Jun 6, 2011)

JaLeRi said:


> Yes religion is a factor. We are both very committed Christians


Even among strongly religious families I think there is a great variance in sexual outlook - some would probably instill the idea that anything goes between consenting married adults, whereas others tend to dictate missionary position.

Personally, that level of detail was never mentioned in my religious upbringing, but was strongly hinted at, but basically the whole idea of sex was instilled in me to be shameful, I think mostly because my mother had a big fear she would raise promiscuous boys. Her horrible model she used on my brother and I worked, on me atleast, I think my brother didn't have the self-discipline to suppress his urges. I now live with all the consequences it has made on the core of my sexual beliefs, and I'm trying to overcome that as much as possible. Sounds like your H was probably also instilled with the same outlook about sex (personally I find it completely "abhorrent" that people claiming to call themselves Christian could ever be actively looking for a ONS or casual sex, but I see it all the time, and it makes me realize just how limited my views were, though I am now very liberal and tolerant towards variety).


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

Lon said:


> Even among strongly religious families I think there is a great variance in sexual outlook - some would probably instill the idea that anything goes between consenting married adults, whereas others tend to dictate missionary position.


I was not raised in a Christian home, but my husband was. His mother did make sex out to be disgusting thing. His father on the other hand had many girlfriends and woman, very sexual even in front of his children. Which also made my husband think sex was disgusting. 

I do not understand why Christians do that. I want my children to be virgins till marriage. Because I think sex is beautiful, pure, and very very special, there is so much trust, and respect in it. That should not be shared with just anyone. It's a sacred thing I feel like waiting and being with one person is a beautiful thing. I honestly wish the only man I was ever with was my husband having a past hurts my current situation having a comparison, instead of only know him and being content. 

I have a laundry list of issues myself. Being raped twice as a teenager, being molested for 12 years by other children, and in return I becoming a child predator molesting other kids. So many issues. So many complicated things. 

I wish my children to only have one partner, I honestly think it's for the best. 

I know people do not agree with this old traditional view my brother has a very different view and does not agree with me. In the end they are my children and I want what is best for them because I love them.


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## Lon (Jun 6, 2011)

I understand about wanting your children to only have one partner... you love them and want their lives to be perfect.

That same attitude you have towards your children's sexual purity, your H has for yours, its why he needs to always make love to you, and never just bang you.

in reality, holding onto that purity will never let your children explore their own sexual needs or desires as they grow into adulthood... saving PIV for marriage would be wonderful, but would you not want them to atleast explore young adults of the opposite sex in some physical/sexual capacity? How will they ever come to know what their preferences truly are, such as if they want to experience raw passionate lust until its too late. It also means relinquishing that for them and letting them find it for themselves, and in my mind they will grow to be much more confident and well rounded if they do.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

SprucHub said:


> He wants what he wants, your feelings and wants be damned. Love is about giving. Real giving is giving what the other person wants, not what you want to give.



Yes. I guess that is how I am feeling.


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## Paulination (Feb 6, 2012)

JaLeRi said:


> He was so uncomfortable that I swore during sex. He doesn't find that language appropriate because we never curse in our day to day life.


Wow. I remember the first my wife said "fVck me harder" during sex. Lets just say I didn't last long after that. I don't know how you are going to get him to lighten up.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

klarson27 said:


> Can you possibly suggest that he watch you with another man to see how you'd like to be handled?
> 
> 
> Just a (crazy) thought.


I think I would throw up in another man touched me


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

JaLeRi said:


> What set me off was last night we were having sex, and I use a vibrator during sex and I asked him to get it for me. Then it needed batteries and I honestly was SO turned on I told him I had no patience for that right now and I just wanted to **** him. He was so uncomfortable that I swore during sex. He doesn't find that language appropriate because we never curse in our day to day life. I explained I curse in my head all the time I was sorry it came out.


1. He is shy in bed.
2. He probably realizes he doesn't know much about what a woman needs to get off and is embarassed to tell you or talk about it? Maybe doesn't want you to think he is less of a man and be turned off?
3. He is possibly having trouble with the vibe cause he thinks you need it to get satisfied. Read: He thinks he is not good enough on his own? Doesn't realize women need more than just vaginal stim at times and it is not a comment on his performance or ability and afraid he won't like the answer if he asks?
4. Once he mentally builds himself up to do some things you like, you stop the mental picture in his head by telling him to get the vibe and then after trying it, oh it needs new batteries?
It's sort of like a fantasy role playing picture in his head which keeps the right mood for what you need and it takes a little time to get there. So when it is disturbed by talking about needing a vibe or fresh batts, hey, what do you expect?
Maybe check the batteries of whatever before you start the intimacy? Then, "Let's Get It On!" Keep it going. It will get easier.
Also, a nice steady consistent build up to where you want to be and what you want to do may be quite a bit of fun? Exploring and learning together always seems to be fun. Just do it in small doses? Maybe?
Hope I gave you some food for thought. I'm definitely NOT an expert. Good luck and have fun with it!


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## klarson27 (Apr 11, 2012)

That's a really tough situation... I'd have to suggest counseling... it's a deep rooted physical desire/need you have. It's a need that I would honestly put on the level of food, shelter, etc. You have this need to be intimate in a very specific way and your husband is not currently able to meet that need. That sounds like it could be a major problem.

Compounding the issue is the fact that it's a somewhat TABOO need that you have. Doesn't matter.. It's a need.

I'd suggest meeting up with a sex therapist and your husband and working through the issue. I can imagine the feeling you must have.. Sounds like he's perfect.. except for your one need.

FYI... wife and I have always had plain vanilla sex for 11.5 years (been mentioning it a lot here).. I started dirty talk and it's been getting crazy ever since (a little over 6 months).. 

One of my favorite things to do is to grab her by the throat (she loves it too).. It's INSANE! (and kinda weird! )

SEE A COUNCILOR... we're just a bunch of crazy peeps, you need a professional experienced with sex issues / couples.


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## Dr. Rockstar (Mar 23, 2011)

Being on a similar situation myself, I can commiserate. I only have three suggestions...

Moderation. If you want to help him explore his sexuality, think of the smallest incrimates of change that you can. Even though you want him to be more dominant, he may need direction at first. Guide him slowly if you can by saying things like "I like it when you touch me here," or "I want you to _______ me tonight."

Second, start sex earlier in the day by writing him love notes over the course of the day. They can be as dirty or clean as you like, but eventually tell him explicitly what you'd like him to do to you. "I just can't wait for you to do ______ to me tonight." then ask him what he would you to do for him. This has worked wonders for us. It helps my wife to think outside of the box because she gets to plan ahead, and it takes the pressure off her because there's no immediacy. She can actually think about something before she decides if she wants to try it.

Finally, I'm going to suggest getting a naughty game. For whatever reason, people are more wiling to follow directions on a box top than they are from their partner. There is an AWESOME game for the iPad and iPhone called Bliss that I cannot recommend enough. I'm 90% sure it was written by Christians, so it's playful but not vulgar. Best of all, it is infinitely customizeable. Before he ever plays his first game, he has to fill out a questionnaire about exactly what he's willing to do, so he knows going in that he doesn't have to do anything he doesn't have to. It takes more of the pressure off of him to perform. And soon I think you'll find him expanding his toons because he's in complete control.

I hope some of these ideas work for you. Good luck!


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## angiesargenti (Jul 29, 2012)

Maybe you should top him. At least then you'll get to be kinky. Just get dominant on him for a while, see what happens. Maybe he's submissive himself, or maybe he just doesn't know how. If you top him, you can show him how.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

Usually am on top. Been talking dirty lately and told him I'm not going to hide who I am in bed anymore just because he might be uncomfortable. 

He says when I talk dirty its like meh ok, doesn't do anything for him... but he isn't turned off by it either so I guess I will just keep pushing and doing things I want to do in bed


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## Chris.N (Jul 31, 2012)

Wow, I just signed up after reading this entire thread. I am having similar issues in my marriage. My wife and I are committed Christians and have been married for 10 years. I am absolutely attracted to her and LOVE sex with her. However, she grew up in a ultra conservative Christian home that NEVER talked about sex. I want to have sex every day or so, but she rarely wants sex (1x every 1-2 weeks). I bought her lingerie and outfits, but she says they are "trashy" and not pure enough. Ya - only white outfits are ok....and absolutely no dirty or naughty talk. I can't even say her name when we are having hot passionate sex, it is considered "wrong" for some reason. I helped her climax recently with a hand massager, only to see her cry afterwards because it was a sin. I love to be rough and be full of passion with her, but she says it is too much of the "flesh" and not pure enough (yet she really enjoys it a lot, but feels shameful afterwards). 

Yes, we have been to couples counseling A LOT. But, she just finds everything "wrong" and "bad" with sex. I am even a therapist and 'should' know how to solve this issue, right? I absolutely love my wife and will always remain committed to her, regardless. I will just keep doing my best. She likes that I am a therapist - at least she gets her emotional needs meet fully. If there is anything I have learned in counseling, it is that we often marry our opposites.


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## kingsfan (Jun 4, 2012)

Chris.N said:


> Wow, I just signed up after reading this entire thread. I am having similar issues in my marriage. My wife and I are committed Christians and have been married for 10 years. I am absolutely attracted to her and LOVE sex with her. However, she grew up in a ultra conservative Christian home that NEVER talked about sex. I want to have sex every day or so, but she rarely wants sex (1x every 1-2 weeks). I bought her lingerie and outfits, but she says they are "trashy" and not pure enough. Ya - only white outfits are ok....and absolutely no dirty or naughty talk. I can't even say her name when we are having hot passionate sex, it is considered "wrong" for some reason. I helped her climax recently with a hand massager, only to see her cry afterwards because it was a sin. I love to be rough and be full of passion with her, but she says it is too much of the "flesh" and not pure enough (yet she really enjoys it a lot, but feels shameful afterwards).
> 
> Yes, we have been to couples counseling A LOT. But, she just finds everything "wrong" and "bad" with sex. I am even a therapist and 'should' know how to solve this issue, right? I absolutely love my wife and will always remain committed to her, regardless. I will just keep doing my best. She likes that I am a therapist - at least she gets her emotional needs meet fully. If there is anything I have learned in counseling, it is that we often marry our opposites.


Am I correct in assuming there was no sex before marriage?

If so, I don't understand how couples in this day and age can do that, even if it is for their religious views. Sex is a HUGE component of a successful marriage. As someone else here put it, it's the glue that binds a marriage together. It's the great peacemaker as well, as with a happy sex life, many other problems can be overcome. 

We would never think it's ok to not be on the same page with our finances, expectations for children, goals, priorities, etc. before going into a marriage, so why is it ok to just leave sex to chance?


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

Chris.N said:


> Wow, I just signed up after reading this entire thread. I am having similar issues in my marriage. My wife and I are committed Christians and have been married for 10 years. I am absolutely attracted to her and LOVE sex with her. However, she grew up in a ultra conservative Christian home that NEVER talked about sex. I want to have sex every day or so, but she rarely wants sex (1x every 1-2 weeks). I bought her lingerie and outfits, but she says they are "trashy" and not pure enough. Ya - only white outfits are ok....and absolutely no dirty or naughty talk. I can't even say her name when we are having hot passionate sex, it is considered "wrong" for some reason. I helped her climax recently with a hand massager, only to see her cry afterwards because it was a sin. I love to be rough and be full of passion with her, but she says it is too much of the "flesh" and not pure enough (yet she really enjoys it a lot, but feels shameful afterwards).
> 
> Yes, we have been to couples counseling A LOT. But, she just finds everything "wrong" and "bad" with sex. I am even a therapist and 'should' know how to solve this issue, right? I absolutely love my wife and will always remain committed to her, regardless. I will just keep doing my best. She likes that I am a therapist - at least she gets her emotional needs meet fully. If there is anything I have learned in counseling, it is that we often marry our opposites.


Yes I have been through all that probably because I am with a man it has been easier to push things. Anything but missionary was sin for awhile. 

He said last night that he can't have sex with me the way I want because he respects me to much. He thinks he will lose respect for me. I told him I completely disagree because I have respect for him and have sex with him how I want.


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## kingsfan (Jun 4, 2012)

JaLeRi said:


> Yes I have been through all that probably because I am with a man it has been easier to push things. Anything but missionary was sin for awhile.
> 
> He said last night that he can't have sex with me the way I want because he respects me to much. He thinks he will lose respect for me. I told him I completely disagree because I have respect for him and have sex with him how I want.


Sorry, not sound logic at all.

While I do agree your husband needs to get over his issues, simply saying "well I don't have that problem, so neither should you' doesn't work and isn't fair in the least. That'd be like saying "I don't agree you need sex 3x a week because I only need it once a week." 

Different strokes for different folks.

Having him admit what was the problem was the first step. Encourage him to make progress, don't slam him for thinking different than you.


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## CleanJerkSnatch (Jul 18, 2012)

Well, how often do you have sex? Get him pent up, I know that after a week or so of me not getting any, I could hardly contain myself. I'm pretty dominant but once in a while its such a turn on if i'm the one getting dominated and ordered around told to stay still, lie down, don't move, shut up, not having control of the pace, etc.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

CleanJerkSnatch said:


> Well, how often do you have sex? Get him pent up, I know that after a week or so of me not getting any, I could hardly contain myself. I'm pretty dominant but once in a while its such a turn on if i'm the one getting dominated and ordered around told to stay still, lie down, don't move, shut up, not having control of the pace, etc.


every other day to once a week.... i have a hard time waiting more then 2 days for sex


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## CanadianGuy (Jun 17, 2012)

JaLeRi said:


> Yes I have been through all that probably because I am with a man it has been easier to push things. Anything but missionary was sin for awhile.
> 
> He said last night that he can't have sex with me the way I want because he respects me to much. He thinks he will lose respect for me. I told him I completely disagree because I have respect for him and have sex with him how I want.


I can understand what he means. Perhaps he finds what you are saying and doing sexually repulsive because he feels that your actions remind him of un-pure and sexually deviant behavior. To this end he may begin to think of you as some kind of "dirty sl*t". He does not wish to think of you in that way and if he does will lose respect for you and will begin to question the kind of woman he married. Regardless of your feelings, if what you are doing in bed is turning him completely off then he will feel less inclined to have sex with you as he does not want the experience. Think of a sexual act that you find repulsive. Imagine that your husband was very turned on by that act and had asked you to do it and said to you " I am going to have sex with you how I want" . We all have different fantasies and expectations. His are different from yours because what you want just doesn't "float his boat" . If my wife wanted me to engage in acts that I was just not comfortable with or turned me off during sex I would find it difficult to continue as I would be less aroused. It would require a great deal of empathy and understanding to continue.


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## CleanJerkSnatch (Jul 18, 2012)

JaLeRi said:


> every other day to once a week.... i have a hard time waiting more then 2 days for sex


As I said, wait it out for a week, then have your way with him anyway you want, he wont stop sex mid way and go "no no no I can't, we can't, sorry" *walks out and leaves*


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

CleanJerkSnatch said:


> As I said, wait it out for a week, then have your way with him anyway you want, he wont stop sex mid way and go "no no no I can't, we can't, sorry" *walks out and leaves*



after a week its over pretty quick


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## Dr. Rockstar (Mar 23, 2011)

Chris.N said:


> I helped her climax recently with a hand massager, only to see her cry afterwards because it was a sin.


I may not be able to help you with everything you mentioned, but have your wife read this:

Masturbation in the Bible

And this one puts Gen 38:9 into more context:

Gen 38:9

This may even help JaLaRe with her husband's frigidness.

I've discovered that religious people (speaking as one myself) who have hang-ups about sex got their information from the church and "accepted knowledge" without ever researching it themselves. Have your spouses do a little research about sex in the Bible, and they'll see that the Bible's rules about sex aren't nearly as strict as most people think, and they're even less restrictive for married couples.

The scripture that helped me get over my own hang-ups and the one that most people tend to forget about married couples and sex is 1 Corinthians 7:5 (as well as being a terrific response to "wives submit to your husbands"). Here's something I just dug up from the Christian Broadcast Network of all places:



> *Does The Bible Allow Sex For Pleasure?*
> 
> There are some religious people who feel that the only reason for sex is reproduction. Others believe that there are higher reasons for sex: The ultimate joining together of a man and woman--the joining together of two spirits; the joining together of two minds; and the joining together of two bodies. In the Old Testament the term for sexual intercourse was "to know" (a husband or wife). The most intimate knowledge of marriage partners comes about through these three joinings in a Christian marriage. This is why Christians can have a much more stimulating sex life than non-Christians. Non-Christians cannot join together in the spirit. They lack that extra dimension.
> 
> The Bible says that marriage partners should offer their bodies to each other in marriage and should not deny each other except for a short season for fasting (see I Corinthians 7:5). God made men and women sexual beings. He made our nervous systems capable of receiving pleasure from the sex act. Sex in marriage is good and holy and ordained of God.


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## angiesargenti (Jul 29, 2012)

JaLeRi said:


> Usually am on top. Been talking dirty lately and told him I'm not going to hide who I am in bed anymore just because he might be uncomfortable.
> 
> He says when I talk dirty its like meh ok, doesn't do anything for him... but he isn't turned off by it either so I guess I will just keep pushing and doing things I want to do in bed


I meant for you to *top* him, not be on top. I mean, boss him around, push him around, you be the dominant one. For an instructional video, go watch Dana Kane on SpankingTube. Hell, it might work.

Good luck, Angie


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## Dr. Rockstar (Mar 23, 2011)

"SpankingTube?" Seriously, that's a thing?

I know I shouldn't be surprised, and yet I am.


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## angiesargenti (Jul 29, 2012)

Dr. Rockstar said:


> "SpankingTube?" Seriously, that's a thing?
> 
> I know I shouldn't be surprised, and yet I am.


It's totally a thing.


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

OP doesn't really sound kinky. She sounds fairly normal, adult, mature and sure of her self. Her husband on the other hand sounds like a child. His 'kink' as it were seems to be being babied and catered to.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

He doesn't want to talk about it anymore... its become like picking at a scab he is just irritated now and needs it all left alone. Last night I was too dominant and loud in talking, and it was just terrible... so awkward afterwards. He doesn't even talk to me I don't even know what kind of sex he is in the mood for. I don't like loud kinky sex all the time, sometimes I want it slow and passionate, personal. I don't know what to do... i guess just leave it alone for awhile now.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

Runs like Dog said:


> OP doesn't really sound kinky. She sounds fairly normal, adult, mature and sure of her self. Her husband on the other hand sounds like a child. His 'kink' as it were seems to be being babied and catered to.



We are just traditional. I like being the little house wife who does everything. At the same time we aren't traditional I do the bill paying, mortgages, mow the law, put down hardwood flooring, tile, roof, use a chain saw in the yard.


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## kingsfan (Jun 4, 2012)

JaLeRi said:


> We are just traditional. *I like being the little house wife who does everything.* At the same time we aren't traditional *I do the bill paying, mortgages, mow the law, put down hardwood flooring, tile, roof, use a chain saw in the yard.*


So you do the house wife stuff (I assume by that you mean cook, clean, etc.) but also pay bills, mow the lawn and do the roofing.

And you have a high sex drive and want to experiment in bed on a regular basis?

Can you be cloned?


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

kingsfan said:


> So you do the house wife stuff (I assume by that you mean cook, clean, etc.) but also pay bills, mow the lawn and do the roofing.
> 
> And you have a high sex drive and want to experiment in bed on a regular basis?
> 
> Can you be cloned?



I hear that a lot, I have issues with wanting to be the "perfect" wife not replaceable. It's hard for me not being "perfect" doing everything I think a man should want, and he just is not into it at all. I told him he would have been happy with the wife that everyone else has the ones that don't want sex often, and when they do they just want it over with. 

Even now in our marriage he doesn't want me to do his laundry anymore. He says I don't cook eggs well enough, so he wants to make his own breakfast, he took over our budget cause he wants to have a reason to go to work. 

perhaps not everyone wants a wife like me.......


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## kingsfan (Jun 4, 2012)

JaLeRi said:


> I hear that a lot, I have issues with wanting to be the "perfect" wife not replaceable. It's hard for me not being "perfect" doing everything I think a man should want, and he just is not into it at all. I told him he would have been happy with the wife that everyone else has the ones that don't want sex often, and when they do they just want it over with.
> 
> Even now in our marriage he doesn't want me to do his laundry anymore. He says I don't cook eggs well enough, so he wants to make his own breakfast, he took over our budget cause he wants to have a reason to go to work.
> 
> perhaps not everyone wants a wife like me.......


Perhaps no.

That said, I'm sure the other 99.9% of mankind still thinks your pretty damn awesome.


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## Zatol Ugot? (Mar 5, 2012)

kingsfan said:


> Perhaps no.
> 
> That said, I'm sure the other 99.9% of mankind still thinks your pretty damn awesome.


:iagree::iagree:

OP, my heart just breaks for you. You sound like most men's perfect mate. I would love it if my wife took more initiative and showed a little more umph in the bedroom (we do a bit already but more is always nice). 
It sounds like his convervative upbringing has done a number on his psyche and it is not allowing him to fully open himself up to what could be a wonderous sex life. Have you ever read the book No More Headaches: Enjoying Sex and Intimacy in Marriage by Julie Slattery? (link below). Ms Slattery is a Christian counselor and the majority of the book is actually the reverse of your situation (HD husband and LD wife) it actually goes into a bit of depth on why sex within marriage is such a great thing and that it is nothing to be ashamed of and Christians should learn to enjoy the fruits of God's design. I bought it and read it because I was interested in what she had to say and my wife actually read it (she is not a reader at all). Very useful insights, especially for the Christian couple. 

Amazon.com: No More Headaches: Enjoying Sex & Intimacy in Marriage (9781589975385): Juli Slattery: Books


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

Zatol Ugot? said:


> :iagree::iagree:
> 
> OP, my heart just breaks for you. You sound like most men's perfect mate. I would love it if my wife took more initiative and showed a little more umph in the bedroom (we do a bit already but more is always nice).


Too much of a good thing maybe. Sometimes I feel like I am just too much for him. I require to much attention in the bedroom, he would rather play video games with his twin at night. We usually hang out when his twin is busy with his significant other. I usually just plan to be alone at night do my own thing, and if he wants to hang out with me its always a pleasant welcomed surprise. 

The more I talk about my life the sadder it seems... probably why I never talk about it to anyone, and when I do its like this. On a forum.


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## CanadianGuy (Jun 17, 2012)

JaLeRi said:


> Too much of a good thing maybe. Sometimes I feel like I am just too much for him. I require to much attention in the bedroom, he would rather play video games with his twin at night. We usually hang out when his twin is busy with his significant other. I usually just plan to be alone at night do my own thing, and if he wants to hang out with me its always a pleasant welcomed surprise.
> 
> The more I talk about my life the sadder it seems... probably why I never talk about it to anyone, and when I do its like this. On a forum.


Totally get the sad part. Do not give up hope. Have faith. It does sound like he loves you.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

CanadianGuy said:


> Totally get the sad part. Do not give up hope. Have faith. It does sound like he loves you.


he would never love another woman as much as he loves me. I know that... i know who I married when I married him, and I accepted my life to be what it is, and wanted it... still do


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## CanadianGuy (Jun 17, 2012)

JaLeRi said:


> he would never love another woman as much as he loves me. I know that... i know who I married when I married him, and I accepted my life to be what it is, and wanted it... still do


That is commitment. Taking the vows to heart and living them.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

If you don't believe in the vows whats the point... I even bought my own wedding ring, didn't get an engagement ring, come to think of it the only thing of value he ever bought for me was a lululemon dress once... when he went out of town


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

People have commented that I am not that kinky. I honestly don't know I was only with 2 boys (teenagers) before my husband and I was a teenager as well. I was 15/16 years old when I was with another person and we were LESS then experienced. 

The things I have asked to do and been shut down on is. My husband stripping, role playing, both dirty talking, being tied up, dominated, licking food off each other, the mile high club (most recent). Dressing up in costumes (addition to the role playing), playing adult board games. 

Things I am not into is pooping on each other, peeing on each other, strangling during climax seems dangerous (never tried it, would consider). I like it rough but I don't like being hurt like bruised, and bleeding.

Things we have done, watched all girl porn (husband thought penis was gross), anal sex (it was ok), blind fold, i have stripped, lap danced..... nothing too crazy


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

Oh yah another thing! I love to make-out and kiss during sex... my husband does not at all...

So i have to refrain from kissing him


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## sandc (Dec 15, 2011)

JaLeRi said:


> His identical twin who is OPPOSITE to him in the bedroom told me to do that just push him to do things he doesn't want to...I just get sooooo tired being the one all the time begging him for sex starting it, pushing to try new things.... I just want to be dominated.


You're talking to his brother about your sex life??


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

sandc said:


> You're talking to his brother about your sex life??


Yah I do. Its his identical twin brother, and I like talking to him because he is on my husbands side, and he is like my brother. They are twins and so close, him and I are friends and even go out together and do stuff sometimes.

He is the only person that knows my husband as well as me. Plus he knew him his whole life before me which helps and they experienced a lot of the same stuff


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## Zatol Ugot? (Mar 5, 2012)

JaLeRi said:


> I require to much attention in the bedroom, he would rather play video games with his twin at night. We usually hang out when his twin is busy with his significant other. I usually just plan to be alone at night do my own thing, and if he wants to hang out with me its always a pleasant welcomed surprise.


I realize that you said that you went into this relationship knowing who he is and what he is like but preferring video games over a loving, adoring and sexually willing wife sounds to be a bit on the selfish and immature side. You're comment that you usually just plan on being alone at night is very sad. Please don't settle to live the rest of your life like this. At the crux of every problem seems to be communication. The problem is that sometimes when we think we are communicating effectively, we're not. If your husband really does love you and would never want to be with another woman the way you say, then he had better stop taking you for granted and at least talk to you often and with the intent on working out what is obviously an issue in the relationship. If not resolved, this will always linger with you and eventually build up to a resentment that will eat you up inside.


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## kingsfan (Jun 4, 2012)

JaLeRi said:


> Too much of a good thing maybe. Sometimes I feel like I am just too much for him. I require to much attention in the bedroom, he would rather play video games with his twin at night. We usually hang out when his twin is busy with his significant other. I usually just plan to be alone at night do my own thing, and if he wants to hang out with me its always a pleasant welcomed surprise.
> 
> The more I talk about my life the sadder it seems... probably why I never talk about it to anyone, and when I do its like this. On a forum.


Wow, I am just sad to read this. Seriously. So rarely does a woman say things like this that it's just heartbreaking.

I've said it before about other HD wives in a situation like yours, I feel for you even more than I feel for HD husbands. At least HD husbands getting turned down is the norm, and they have others to turn to (often even close friends who are going through the same thing). It's not uncommon for a man to be rejected on a regular basis. For a wife though, I imagine it can feel like you are in the middle of the ocean, and you would be embarrassed if your situation ended up exposed to anyone outside of anonymous people on a message baord like this.

I am so sorry you are going through this.



JaLeRi said:


> The things I have asked to do and been shut down on is. My husband stripping, role playing, both dirty talking, being tied up, dominated, licking food off each other, the mile high club (most recent). Dressing up in costumes (addition to the role playing), playing adult board games.


For myself:

*Stripping (me):* I'd be hesitant at first because I have a poor body image myself, but I know I'd have done that ithout a great deal of prodding.
*Role playing:* Always wanted to try this. Would be awkward at first, but would get more interesting with time.
*Both dirty talking: *I'd have the same issue as your hubby at first, with the mental image of you being awesome so therefore not feeling to comfortable calling you a name, or swearing during sex, but once again, I'd overcome this with a little prodding.
*Being tied up:* As long as I wasn't getting tickled, I'd be down with that (I am uber ticklish, which sucks).
*Dominated: *Be awkward a bit at first as well, but I'd love to try this, both ways.
*Licking off food: *Done this. Nothing spectacular, but it was interesting and something I'd do again.
*Mile high club:* Because I don't fly much, never had the chance. Last time I flew was in 2009, and this was the only flight I've ever taken with my fiancee. I thought about asking for it, but there wasn't a chance because the bathrooms were always full and with a line up to boot (must have had a Mexican cook off in the airport or something weird). Still, I'd love to do this, just to say I did.
*Dressing up in costume: *Depends on what you mean by costume. If you're meaning the naughty nurses outfits, yeah, totally fine. If you mean as a cartoon character or some weird anime stuff, not so much.
*Adult board games:* Would love to do this. Always have wanted to.


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

wow, sounds like you have a bigger issue than just the sex, you have some serious communication issues

as strong as your resolve is to stay loyal, you will eventually start to harbor resentment. If I were you I would make an appointment for a MC and let him know that you are going with or without him and stress how much you believe he is needed to be there.


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## kingsfan (Jun 4, 2012)

Zatol Ugot? said:


> If your husband really does love you and would never want to be with another woman the way you say, then he had better stop taking you for granted and at least talk to you often and with the intent on working out what is obviously an issue in the relationship. If not resolved, this will always linger with you and eventually build up to a resentment that will eat you up inside.


100% agree.

I'm sure right now you feel like you said the vows and meant them, so you'll live by them JaLeRi. Eventually though the constant thoughts of what you're NOT getting will seep into your mind more and more and build resentment, especially when you consider the fact we all know, including yourself, that it's rare to find a woman who puts sex as such a high priority as you do. I think you've thought already about how you could have a sexual partner better than your husband, and may even have fantasized about it already.

You will need to get a handle on this issue soon, as if you don't things could grow much worse and could eventually lead to a divorce or an affair. If not, it could still turn into an emotionless marriage, which is just as bad. It sounds like it is already working towards that as well.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

I have been at this too much lately, trying to change him last night I put on one of his dress shirts. Just got mad and told me to stop, stop trying to change who he is. He likes how he is and doesn't want to change so just to stop.

He said he is stressed. He has a hard time dealing with stress. Last summer we were roofing our house which took like 2 weeks in that time he honestly considered leaving me cause he just could not handle being married. He has the roof, his job, and everything going on and all he wanted to do was chill at night. I got really depressed about being ignored for that time and he just couldn't deal with me. 

This must be one of those times we discussed it. If he is really stressed then I just need to be more then perfect and understanding.

I would like to add that our last house we completely gutted to the studs and lived in and renovated the whole thing with 2 kids by ourselves. It took 18 months and my husband worked full-time. Hence how I know how to mud, paint, install cabinets, lights, put down hardwood and tile.


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## Shocker (Jul 26, 2012)

JaLeRi said:


> He makes it so awkward when I do that because he is just REALLY not into it at all.


God I wish my wife had this problem. My wife and I have evolved with this some so it is doable. I felt before like my wife would feel dirty or whatever but that wasn't the case. She draws a strict line on things but she's trying. I'd open up to him a speak frankly and maybe he'll warm up to it. Bet so.

If that is u in your avatar this guy needs to step up! No offense!


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

Shocker said:


> If that is u in your avatar this guy needs to step up! No offense!


Yah that is me, my hair is longer now though


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## Shocker (Jul 26, 2012)

JaLeRi said:


> Oh yah another thing! I love to make-out and kiss during sex... my husband does not at all...
> 
> So i have to refrain from kissing him


Umm...that is not kinky. My wife would hate it if I didn't makeout, talk, etc during. Thats sounds like pretty standard stuff.

Honestly as for the other post and stuff you would like...wondering why someone would have an issue with those things? Does he just feel strange or unmanly by doing those things or something? Could be. I would be careful not to make him feel disrespected with this though. If my wife told me that I'd take that as a personal challenge and fix that.


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## kingsfan (Jun 4, 2012)

JaLeRi said:


> I have been at this too much lately, trying to change him last night I put on one of his dress shirts. Just got mad and told me to stop, stop trying to change who he is. He likes how he is and doesn't want to change so just to stop.
> 
> He said he is stressed. He has a hard time dealing with stress. Last summer we were roofing our house which took like 2 weeks in that time he honestly considered leaving me cause he just could not handle being married. He has the roof, his job, and everything going on and all he wanted to do was chill at night. I got really depressed about being ignored for that time and he just couldn't deal with me.
> 
> ...


I'd back off for a while, like a few months or so. Then bring up the issue again and see what happens *aim for a less stressful time). 

You need to go at it from several fronts. First, you guys need to communicate. About EVERYTHING. It seems that's more his issue than yours, but he needs to communicate with you.

Second, you need to discuss his stress, and how he can handle it better. My fiancee has stressful moments as well, but she's nothing like how she used to be. She used to just go ballastic (in a panicked, frenzied 'I don't know what to do' way) but over the years through our talks she's calmed way down. i stioll handle stress much better than her, but she's much better thaan she used to be as well. It's served to bring down other barriers because she can discuss things without flying off the handle. Her handling her stress better is what's benefited our communication levels better than anything else.

After that all is discussed, then it's time to bring up the sex issue again. Even if you feel like you are repeating things, keep saying them. Make it clear what you NEED (not want sexually, NEED sexually).

Just from reading your posts, I wonder if your husband thinks he doesn't need to change because he knows you won't leave. We all react to situations based on one of two things, the reward we get or the fear of what could happen.

Some of us go to work because we love the job, love the pay cheque, love our co-workers, etc. Some though go because they fear losing their job if they don't, fear being broke if they lose their job, etc.

I submit to you that your husband loves the status quo sexually, so he's fine that way, and likely doesn't have any fear in him of you leaving or cheating on him. Therefore, he has no motivation to change. He needs motivation. I am in no way advocating you have an affair or leave him, but he seems quite content with things they way they are and doesn't seem to be putting any effort into you or your needs, at least from the standpoint of trying to understand and serve them better.

A marriage should be about meeting each others needs and trying to fulfill them. He's not even trying for you sexually, which is what the problem is. If he was trying but it wasn't working out, that's another issue but one which is hard to find fault in. He needs to start trying here, or you'll need to find a motivator for him to try.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

kingsfan said:


> Just from reading your posts, I wonder if your husband thinks he doesn't need to change because he knows you won't leave. We all react to situations based on one of two things, the reward we get or the fear of what could happen.


He knows I would never leave or cheat. He is very secure about that, and if I did he said its my loss and that I didn't deserve him. 

If he cheated on me I would probably hunt down the person he cheated with and put them in the hospital.


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## cuteandshort (Aug 1, 2012)

oh JLR,
I have just read your ENTIRE thread.. all 6 pages. I feel like I am in the same boat somewhat. I want to try new things, and hubby is NOT into it. He likes his status quo.. his pattern that he has set. I too don't know what to do. Also Christians as well.. only I grew up in a very Christian household and he did not.

In fact, when I suggest things, hubby has said I am kinky. Actually used those words. I have not had much success changing hubby. He likes his patterns he has set up in the bedroom. Comfortable with it. 

So I am following your thread... hoping I too can get some answers.


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## Zatol Ugot? (Mar 5, 2012)

JaLeRi said:


> If he is really stressed then I just need to be more then perfect and understanding.


It seems like you are just putting too much emphasis on you and not enough responsibility on him. I agree with King. Back off for a while. Let him know that you are there for him to work through the stresses of life. But if you wait too long to address this, its going to eat you up.

I also agree with Shocker. If your avatar is actually you, you're husband is a lucky man. And before you ask....yes, my avatar is actually me.


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## dblkman (Jul 14, 2010)

My thoughts are you are focusing so much on being perfect that maybe he believes you think HE should be perfect! Sounds like he does not have confidence in his ability to please you the way you want. 

While your post makes you appear to be a "perfect" wife to him you might be the wife that stresses him out. Your quest for perfection may make him look less than perfect. 

I would venture that if he came to this forum he would have a different perspective on this issue.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

My avatar is actually me, you can see my fridge and calendar in the back. LOL

Stress never goes away for him, we are both starting university this fall him doing his bachelor of science and me bachelor of commerce, plus two kids, mortgage and so on and so forth, its going to just get worse. He deals with stress by playing video games and he likes being alone.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

dblkman said:


> I would venture that if he came to this forum he would have a different perspective on this issue.



If he came to this forum and read it he would be sooooo mad at me. He would freak


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## Shocker (Jul 26, 2012)

dblkman said:


> My thoughts are you are focusing so much on being perfect that maybe he believes you think HE should be perfect! Sounds like he does not have confidence in his ability to please you the way you want.
> 
> While your post makes you appear to be a "perfect" wife to him you might be the wife that stresses him out. Your quest for perfection may make him look less than perfect.
> 
> I would venture that if he came to this forum he would have a different perspective on this issue.


Yeah...true. Like I said, be careful with the respect thing with your husband. This one is hitting below the belt literally. 

That said, "he likes to be alone" is a normal guy thing but it causes issues in a marriage. Believe me on that one. Make sure you tell him what you want and need. I mean TELL him and make sure he hears you. I wish so much my wife would have done that LONG before she did. It can be easy to become "roomates" with all those outside pressures. I'm sure he'll respond with the right message from you. Good luck.


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## SprucHub (Jan 13, 2012)

JaLeRi said:


> I have been at this too much lately, trying to change him last night I put on one of his dress shirts. Just got mad and told me to stop, stop trying to change who he is. He likes how he is and doesn't want to change so just to stop.
> 
> He said he is stressed. He has a hard time dealing with stress. Last summer we were roofing our house which took like 2 weeks in that time he honestly considered leaving me cause he just could not handle being married. He has the roof, his job, and everything going on and all he wanted to do was chill at night. I got really depressed about being ignored for that time and he just couldn't deal with me.
> 
> ...


JLR - I can see part of your issue. You are obsessed with being perfect. You want to be everything. Part of this likely comes from his lack of desire - you are chasing him and continuing to do things that you think make you closer to perfect. Like men who take on more chores, this won't get you more/better sex.

Also, as you've described him, he's not fully matured - he likes to hang out and play video games and cannot handle stress. But, he has you wrapped around his finger. Your sexual desire may derive from your not wanting to be in control of everything.

As for him not wanting to change and not wanting to talk, you need to understand that that is not ok. You need to know what you want to be happy. He must care about that, otherwise he is not being a good H. This is not a "just sex" issue. This is him respecting your wants and desires. It is just such selfish and self-centered behavior for him to say that he does not want to [spank you] or do whatever during sex. Why not, what does it cost him? Because it is not Christian? BS! Does he play video games on the sabbath? Seems much less Christian to disobey a Commandment.

Do you actually say to him "I am not happy!"?


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## kingsfan (Jun 4, 2012)

JaLeRi said:


> He knows I would never leave or cheat. He is very secure about that, and if I did he said its my loss and that I didn't deserve him.
> 
> If he cheated on me I would probably hunt down the person he cheated with and put them in the hospital.


So yeah, essentially what is his consequence for refusing to make an effort to meet your needs/desires/wants? 

Everyone has a currency, something they need from a relationship. Obviously, one of your is sex. You need to find one of his and maybe pull back on meeting it for a while. I'm not saying doing a tit for tat, but it serves the purpose of showing him that your needs are important and if he's not willing to make the effort to meet them, then it's not encouraging you to meet his either.


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## Shocker (Jul 26, 2012)

I gotta speak up and I don't play them but video games ain't what they used to be. Plenty of them are adult level. Sorry but I hate people doing that. I've played with my son in the past and its harmless. Well, unless you are ignoring your wife with them.

In general the wife wants to be heard whether the husband is up for it or not.


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## kingsfan (Jun 4, 2012)

cuteandshort said:


> In fact, when I suggest things, hubby has said I am kinky. Actually used those words.


Then you should tell him "Thank you."

Seriously, be kinky, and more power to you. Be as kinky as you want to be and if he's not after you, his loss. 

Where do you women come from? Is there something in the water were you live? I'd love to know what makes some women so interested in sex because I haven't met one whose sex drive last more than about six months.

Must be me. I dunno. Either way, some really lucky, and borderline retarded, men out there who make me want to :banghead:


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## sandc (Dec 15, 2011)

JaLeRi said:


> Yah I do. Its his identical twin brother, and I like talking to him because he is on my husbands side, and he is like my brother. They are twins and so close, him and I are friends and even go out together and do stuff sometimes.
> 
> He is the only person that knows my husband as well as me. Plus he knew him his whole life before me which helps and they experienced a lot of the same stuff


Then.... maybe you married the wrong brother?


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

SprucHub said:


> Do you actually say to him "I am not happy!"?[/QUOTE
> 
> Yes he does play video games on the sabbath. Doesn't work though, but that is between him and God, I am not perfect on the sabbath either.
> 
> ...


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## kingsfan (Jun 4, 2012)

JaLeRi said:


> I never say I am unhappy. His biggest argument is that I knew he was like this, and in 10 years he has been the same, and I need to accept who he is, stop trying to change him. He thinks I have changed, but i haven't just getting tired of not being who i am. He said I am the one changing, and he likes how things are. I dunno.


A: Tell him you are unhappy...if you are unhappy. Just be honest, if you're not happy, say so. 

B: I think that's the biggest line of crap out there in marriage "you married me knowing who I was." Yes, you shouldn't marry someone if you see a big issue beforehand. That said, there isn't this freeze frame moment when people get married, and they remain like that until death do you part. People age, change jobs, go through hormonal changes, kids come into the picture, bills can increase or decrease, you could move, etc. all of which changes who we are and how we act. If your husband thinks he never changes in life, maybe point out somethings that are different about him now compared to 10 years ago.

Honestly, your husbands attitute is making me frustrated a bit, in the sense that I really dislike close-minded people and he seems like one. 'Things are this way and if you don't like them, tough for you.' That's not how a marriage should work.

A marriage is like a house, even if it stays the same in appearance, it really doesn't. You have to replace the shingles, replace windows, paint walls, bring in new appliances, etc. Things need maintenance and work or they will fall apart and then the house can't function at all, even if the appearance is basically the same.

Tell your husband it's time he starts to doctor your rug (pun intended) or things may not keep functioning the way he likes them in the house anymore.


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## SprucHub (Jan 13, 2012)

JaLeRi said:


> SprucHub said:
> 
> 
> > Do you actually say to him "I am not happy!"?[/QUOTE
> ...


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## Shocker (Jul 26, 2012)

kingsfan said:


> A: Tell him you are unhappy...if you are unhappy. Just be honest, if you're not happy, say so.
> 
> B: I think that's the biggest line of crap out there in marriage "you married me knowing who I was." Yes, you shouldn't marry someone if you see a big issue beforehand. That said, there isn't this freeze frame moment when people get married, and they remain like that until death do you part. People age, change jobs, go through hormonal changes, kids come into the picture, bills can increase or decrease, you could move, etc. all of which changes who we are and how we act. If your husband thinks he never changes in life, maybe point out somethings that are different about him now compared to 10 years ago.
> 
> ...


This dude gets it. 

What "it" is I have no idea.


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## lifeisnotsogood (Jun 11, 2012)

50 Shades of gray. I love it. You are every man's dream. It's too bad we never get the entire package.


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## lifeisnotsogood (Jun 11, 2012)

JaLeRi said:


> His identical twin who is OPPOSITE to him in the bedroom told me to do that just push him to do things he doesn't want to...I just get sooooo tired being the one all the time begging him for sex starting it, pushing to try new things.... I just want to be dominated.


Wow, twin who is the opposite. Looks like you married the wrong brother. 

But let me ask you, Why are you talking to his brother about your sex life. I'm sure he didn't know.


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## dblkman (Jul 14, 2010)

lifeisnotsogood said:


> Wow, twin who is the opposite. Looks like you married the wrong brother.
> 
> But let me ask you, Why are you talking to his brother about your sex life. I'm sure he didn't know.


I kinda agree, this is a very dangerous line that is being walked. Things could escalate between your BIL and you very quickly and before you know it an A happens. Best way to prevent ANY misunderstandings is to steer clear of this practice. Also does your H know you talk to his B about this?


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## klarson27 (Apr 11, 2012)

I thought she was saying she talked with her sister-in-law about it.

I think she needs to make him realize that there are men out there who would be all over the kink... I'm sure if he felt threatened he'd be less likely to sit there playing games knowing that someone could be banging his horny / kinky wife..


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## kingsfan (Jun 4, 2012)

klarson27 said:


> I thought she was saying she talked with her sister-in-law about it.
> 
> I think she needs to make him realize that there are men out there who would be all over the kink... I'm sure if he felt threatened he'd be less likely to sit there playing games knowing that someone could be banging his horny / kinky wife..


I wouldn't go that far, but I do agree with the principal. It's hard to motivate someone to do something if they don't have a consequence for not doing it.

I don't really want to pay to replace a broken window, but if I don't someone will eventually just walk into my house and steal my ****, so I know I better replace it. 

He needs to understand that if he doesn't fix this issue, then there could be a series of other consequences awaiting him down the road.


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## tjohnson (Mar 10, 2010)

kingsfan said:


> I wouldn't go that far, but I do agree with the principal. It's hard to motivate someone to do something if they don't have a consequence for not doing it.
> 
> I don't really want to pay to replace a broken window, but if I don't someone will eventually just walk into my house and steal my ****, so I know I better replace it.
> 
> He needs to understand that if he doesn't fix this issue, then there could be a series of other consequences awaiting him down the road.


Talking to brother in law-not cool IMHO

As others have stated what you are looking for seems pretty tame. It is not like you want to wear a big strap on and peg him or something crazy. 

I have not read the 100 posts here....so i may be redundant. Was your H raised strict etc. Perhaps he needs to understand what is normal...perhaps you should have him post here. 

Keep trying and let him know this is important.

Good luck!


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## sandc (Dec 15, 2011)

JaLeRi,
Is your husband okay with you talking to his brother about your husband's sex life? If my wife were talking to my brother about my kinks or lack thereof I'd be p!ssed.


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## sinnister (Dec 5, 2010)

Is he a bigger dude? I know you said he's in great shape, but I mean muscle wise? I have a fat belly but I have a lot of muscle in the arms and legs and I feel I have to really be careful having sex with my wife. I know (on the rare occassion we do have sex) that she'd like it a bit rougher..but honestly I am afraid to hurt her. (not down there...I'm quite average, I mean with my hands..legs whatever).


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## Dr. Rockstar (Mar 23, 2011)

JaLeRi said:


> His biggest argument is that I knew he was like this, and in 10 years he has been the same, and I need to accept who he is, stop trying to change him. He thinks I have changed, but i haven't just getting tired of not being who i am. He said I am the one changing, and he likes how things are. I dunno.


Anyone who says he hasn't changed in ten years and doesn't want to is either lying or is afraid of the future and trying to control it by never letting go of the past.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

sandc said:


> JaLeRi,
> Is your husband okay with you talking to his brother about your husband's sex life? If my wife were talking to my brother about my kinks or lack thereof I'd be p!ssed.


He knows I talk to his brother about stuff, because who else would I talk to, and I need to talk to someone who is safe. His twin loves him as much as he loves himself, and honestly I am viewed as nothing more then his brothers wife, unless you are married to identical twins you just don't understand.

Twin have a very unique relationship, its very different being married to a twin then someone who isn't.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

sinnister said:


> Is he a bigger dude? I know you said he's in great shape, but I mean muscle wise? I have a fat belly but I have a lot of muscle in the arms and legs and I feel I have to really be careful having sex with my wife. I know (on the rare occassion we do have sex) that she'd like it a bit rougher..but honestly I am afraid to hurt her. (not down there...I'm quite average, I mean with my hands..legs whatever).



He is one of those people who was blessed genetically he is 6'1" about 170lbs he has a 6pack without trying, huge shoulders great muscle definition. He eats like a horse. He is hung and well gorgeous he is very smart, he is an electrician by trade and is now starting school to become a dr. he is a perfectionist, he is very organized and clean. He has very good workmanship he does everything well. He plays guitar that he taught himself learned to play songs the first day he tried to play (i have been trying to learn 1 song for 3 months) he can fix everything, we built our first house, gutted our second, he is a really good dad, he is so good with money. He is very practical. 

I honestly could go on and on about all the things I love about him... the only thing I don't is this, his lack of sexuality


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

klarson27 said:


> I thought she was saying she talked with her sister-in-law about it.
> 
> I think she needs to make him realize that there are men out there who would be all over the kink... I'm sure if he felt threatened he'd be less likely to sit there playing games knowing that someone could be banging his horny / kinky wife..


My husband comes from a big family he has 4 half siblings 3 brothers and 1 sister, and two full siblings his identical twin and another brother. I am best friends with his full brothers wife. We don't talk about my sex life, just what it's like being married to the type of men that we married. Out of all his brothers I got the best one. wouldn't trade him not even for his very sexual twin


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

dblkman said:


> I kinda agree, this is a very dangerous line that is being walked. Things could escalate between your BIL and you very quickly and before you know it an A happens. Best way to prevent ANY misunderstandings is to steer clear of this practice. Also does your H know you talk to his B about this?


No worries about his twin and I.... my husband trusts us both fully and knows nothing would ever happen. We both love and respect my husband so much


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## sandc (Dec 15, 2011)

JaLeRi said:


> He knows I talk to his brother about stuff, because who else would I talk to, and I need to talk to someone who is safe. His twin loves him as much as he loves himself, and honestly I am viewed as nothing more then his brothers wife, unless you are married to identical twins you just don't understand.
> 
> Twin have a very unique relationship, its very different being married to a twin then someone who isn't.


Stuff... sure okay. But SEX stuff... specifically? He's okay with that?

I have to admit to not understanding the relationships of identical twins, I know they are somewhat different than most sibling relationships but that's all I know.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

sandc said:


> Stuff... sure okay. But SEX stuff... specifically? He's okay with that?
> 
> I have to admit to not understanding the relationships of identical twins, I know they are somewhat different than most sibling relationships but that's all I know.


Yah my husband really doesn't care i talk about sex stuff with his twin brother. He knows his twin is looking out for his best interests, and i need someone to talk to other then him.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

klarson27 said:


> I think she needs to make him realize that there are men out there who would be all over the kink... I'm sure if he felt threatened he'd be less likely to sit there playing games knowing that someone could be banging his horny / kinky wife..


Years ago before we even had the kids, I said that this is so serious that if things didn't change i wasn't sure if i wanted this marriage. That was a lie, and I hurt him a lot saying that. 

I feel like its an immature move to threaten someone with consequences. I said that what I did was immature and that I would never ever say that to him unless i truly meant it. It makes divorce seem less serious when you talk about it in a none serious manner. 

He isn't the type of guy that if I slept with someone else, or started seeing someone else, or if some other guy hit on me. He would do nothing about it, and just walk away and say I am not worth his time if I am going to do things like that to him. He doesn't put up with that type of stuff. He isn't a jealous person at all. 

So being that type of girl that plays games to make him do what I want doesn't work. The only way this will be fixed is that he decides that he wants it fixed. Currently that is not his mind set and i can't convince him other wise. He also doesn't like being told what to do especially by a woman so I honestly think I am going to have to be patient and wait for counseling and hopefully he has some respect for the counselor we get and listens. I am sure he isn't 100% at fault for this who knows perhaps I am being unreasonable.


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## sandc (Dec 15, 2011)

JaLeRi said:


> Yah my husband really doesn't care i talk about sex stuff with his twin brother. He knows his twin is looking out for his best interests, and i need someone to talk to other then him.


Huh.... interesting. :scratchhead:

Carry on then.


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## sandc (Dec 15, 2011)

JaLeRi said:


> So being that type of girl that plays games to make him do what I want doesn't work. The only way this will be fixed is that he decides that he wants it fixed. Currently that is not his mind set and i can't convince him other wise. He also doesn't like being told what to do especially by a woman so I honestly think I am going to have to be patient and wait for counseling and hopefully he has some respect for the counselor we get and listens. I am sure he isn't 100% at fault for this who knows perhaps I am being unreasonable.


For my part... thank you for not being that kind of girl. That is wonderful. Really you're facing the same issue that many, many men face. I think what you've said here is the best plan. Be patient and try to get him talking about it. There is a reason, hopefully a MC can help bring it to the surface.

You really do sound like a dream girl to me. :smthumbup:


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

sandc said:


> For my part... thank you for not being that kind of girl. That is wonderful. Really you're facing the same issue that many, many men face. I think what you've said here is the best plan. Be patient and try to get him talking about it. There is a reason, hopefully a MC can help bring it to the surface.
> 
> You really do sound like a dream girl to me. :smthumbup:


aww thanks this forum is good for myself esteem, I honestly feel like a dime a dozen, so replaceable


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## SprucHub (Jan 13, 2012)

JaLeRi said:


> aww thanks this forum is good for myself esteem, I honestly feel like a dime a dozen, so replaceable


You are not a dime a dozen - if just from the picture.


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## sandc (Dec 15, 2011)

JaLeRi said:


> aww thanks this forum is good for myself esteem, I honestly feel like a dime a dozen, so replaceable


My dear, you are anything but that. Just hang in there and keep coming back to ask questions. We've got LOADS of opinions here.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

I just feel like there is something wrong with me! Why doesn't he want me the way I want him... ugh


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

JaLeRi said:


> Yah my husband really doesn't care i talk about sex stuff with his twin brother. He knows his twin is looking out for his best interests, and i need someone to talk to other then him.


This creeps me out a bit. That seems very kinky of your husband.

So if your hubby changes his attitude one night ... be careful it is not his twin brother ....

Someone had to say it.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

Entropy3000 said:


> This creeps me out a bit. That seems very kinky of your husband.
> 
> So if your hubby changes his attitude one night ... be careful it is not his twin brother ....
> 
> Someone had to say it.



LOL they maybe identical twins but they don't really look that much alike his twin is like 30lbs more covered in tattoos and has subtle differences in their faces due to broken noses, teeth being pulled, braces


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## klarson27 (Apr 11, 2012)

It sounds as though you're willing to wait for him to change which is a good thing, especially if you both end up going to counseling. But even if you don't go to counseling it seems like you have a solid enough of a foundation to wait until he changes.. People change all the time so it's fairly likely it'll happen. Honestly in the meantime you can keep it a fantasy when you masturbate or while you're having sex with him.

I know for me I had to feel threatened by my wife possibly showing interest in other men (honestly it could've been in my head.. but I felt it) for me to snap out of our sexless rut. I don't think she did it on purpose, it just happened and scared the hell out of me and was the driving force behind the change.


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## Dr. Rockstar (Mar 23, 2011)

klarson27 said:


> I know for me I had to feel threatened by my wife possibly showing interest in other men (honestly it could've been in my head.. but I felt it) for me to snap out of our sexless rut. I don't think she did it on purpose, it just happened and scared the hell out of me and was the driving force behind the change.


Ditto. For me it was an ovarian cancer scare for me to finally get my thinking straight. I'm saying that you should fabricate a disease, and I've never been totally comfortable with deceiving or withholding sex just to prove the point, but that often seems to do the trick.


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## kingsfan (Jun 4, 2012)

JaLeRi said:


> I just feel like there is something wrong with me! Why doesn't he want me the way I want him... ugh


There's nothing wrong with either of you really. He just has a different view on things than you do.

The way you describe him, it seems like he is just more driven by other matters than most men. While I think all men put a priority on work, schooling, etc. we reserve a solid piece of ourselves to focus on sex. Your husband just reserves less than most men.

And btw, you aren't a dime a dozen. If you need to remember that in the future, you should just bookmark this thread. Many men here wish their wives were half as caring sexually as you are. Your husband sounds like he has a dream life (not just in bed but also in other areas you described), perhaps he's just had it come to him so naturally before in everything that he doesn't comprehend the need to 'work' at something.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

kingsfan said:


> And btw, you aren't a dime a dozen. If you need to remember that in the future, you should just bookmark this thread. Many men here wish their wives were half as caring sexually as you are. Your husband sounds like he has a dream life (not just in bed but also in other areas you described), perhaps he's just had it come to him so naturally before in everything that he doesn't comprehend the need to 'work' at something.


Thank you. I am just getting really upset about the whole thing. We are each others firsts, been together since we were 16 and 18 and its been easy. We married at 18 and 20. We did long distance for 2 years between SK and BC in Canada, when we dated. I am his first girlfriend the one previous to me was when he was in grade 10 and was not serious at all.... and he is my first real boyfriend... 

The only sexual fantasy he has is a threesome... so I said if that's what you want then lets do that... i know it would completely destroy us. He said he would ever actually do that, just a fantasy that is never meant to happen. What is with men and threesomes? Is one woman not good enough, cause honestly I feel like I am to much for him why bring another in. 

If we ever got in that situation I am extremely jealous, and was raised in a violent household. If another woman ever touched my husband I would probably beat her to death.


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## kingsfan (Jun 4, 2012)

JaLeRi said:


> Thank you. I am just getting really upset about the whole thing. We are each others firsts, been together since we were 16 and 18 and its been easy. We married at 18 and 20. We did long distance for 2 years between SK and BC in Canada, when we dated. I am his first girlfriend the one previous to me was when he was in grade 10 and was not serious at all.... and he is my first real boyfriend...
> 
> The only sexual fantasy he has is a threesome... so I said if that's what you want then lets do that... i know it would completely destroy us. He said he would ever actually do that, just a fantasy that is never meant to happen. What is with men and threesomes? Is one woman not good enough, cause honestly I feel like I am to much for him why bring another in.
> 
> If we ever got in that situation I am extremely jealous, and was raised in a violent household. If another woman ever touched my husband I would probably beat her to death.


Interesting you are from Canada as well. I'm from manitoba, so I understand the distance between Saskatchewan and B.C. Much greater than it looks on a map and not something you can just drive back and forth between weekends. It's very commendable you two have stuck together through thick and thin like this. 

Btw, you are completely right to be upset by this. It's important to you, therefore you have the right to be upset by it.

My fiancee, she has a phobia of ants. Weird, I know, and she'll completely admit that it's actually completely dumb (her words, not mine). Yet she and I both know that for her to have a successful relationship with someone, that person has to not only except her phobia, but also help her with it to some degree (buy insecticides, be extra-vigilent about protecting the yard from anthills, etc.) She knows if I just didn't care about her phobia or told her to handle it herself, she'd be upset and it would cause an issue in our relationship eventually.

The same is only magnified for sex, so for you, this is a big issue, it isn't a want, it is a need, and at some point your husband will have to get on board with that mindset or there will be bigger complications as a result, as you will see your disappointment turn to frsutration, which will turn to resentment and possibly even anger. When one person resents the other, it's a gateway for an ugly scene. Hopefully you get it fixed.

Btw, the threesome thing is a fantasy for many men, I agree. It's a very mild one for me as well (nothing I'd ever want to actually do) but I think the reason is because it's a fantasy to see women literally falling over themselves to get at you sexually. It's very stimulating to see your woman want you badly, but even more so to see women so eager to have a piece of you that they are willing to share you with another woman, or literally trip over themselves trying to get at you in a sexual way.

So it's a cool fantasy, especially for some men on these boards who can't seem to get enough affection from even one woman (their wife). It's not a big one for me, I'm much more reserved and am more focused on fulfilling other smaller fantasies, like getting met at the door by my wife wearing nothing but high heels, or getting a wake up BJ, or having sex in the kitchen.


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

Tell him that most men would bang you stupid.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

Runs like Dog said:


> Tell him that most men would bang you stupid.


He knows that, doesn't care. When I worked in the public before I became a house wife. I got lots of men's attention I went on free helicopter rides, someone gave me a bike, another man tried to give me diamond earrings and I refused. Men bought me cake for my birthday, bought me lunches on my break. 

They knew I was married too, and had no shot with me. I thought they just wanted to be my friend, be nice to me. I was a lot younger then know a lot better now.


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## SprucHub (Jan 13, 2012)

JaLeRi said:


> He knows that, doesn't care. When I worked in the public before I became a house wife. I got lots of men's attention I went on free helicopter rides, someone gave me a bike, another man tried to give me diamond earrings and I refused. Men bought me cake for my birthday, bought me lunches on my break.
> 
> They knew I was married too, and had no shot with me. I thought they just wanted to be my friend, be nice to me. I was a lot younger then know a lot better now.


This is like a Chris Rock bit - every time a man talks to you he's offering you d**k. "how are you doing" _(would you like some d**k)_. Nice weather today _(how about some d**k)_. 

I think your issue is very analogous to the ant phobia situation. And I disagree with Kingsfan when he said there is nothing wrong with either of you. There is something wrong with a spouse who tells his partner he won't do something that is reasonable because he is not into it. 

People always say it is the little things that count. I think that is the case, because the little things happen often and the big things infrequently. But how people react to the little things can show how they will react to the big things.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

SprucHub said:


> This is like a Chris Rock bit - every time a man talks to you he's offering you d**k. "how are you doing" _(would you like some d**k)_. Nice weather today _(how about some d**k)_.
> 
> I think your issue is very analogous to the ant phobia situation. And I disagree with Kingsfan when he said there is nothing wrong with either of you. There is something wrong with a spouse who tells his partner he won't do something that is reasonable because he is not into it.
> 
> People always say it is the little things that count. I think that is the case, because the little things happen often and the big things infrequently. But how people react to the little things can show how they will react to the big things.


LOL at the Chris Rock bit!


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## kingsfan (Jun 4, 2012)

SprucHub said:


> This is like a Chris Rock bit - every time a man talks to you he's offering you d**k. "how are you doing" _(would you like some d**k)_. Nice weather today _(how about some d**k)_.
> 
> I think your issue is very analogous to the ant phobia situation. And I disagree with Kingsfan when he said there is nothing wrong with either of you. There is something wrong with a spouse who tells his partner he won't do something that is reasonable because he is not into it.
> 
> People always say it is the little things that count. I think that is the case, because the little things happen often and the big things infrequently. But how people react to the little things can show how they will react to the big things.


By saying there's nothing wrong, I'm more referring to the sense that he has indicated he will at least attempt councilling (I believe JaLeRi stated that earlier), and as such hasn't completely shut the door to the concept of enhancing their sex life.

That said, I have also stated that her husband does seem very stubborn and would frsutrate me immensely, so we are likely making the same point overall SpruceHub, he needs to make more of an effort on this little issue (and in the grand scheme of things, this is small compared to a house, education,e tc.) before it morphs into a big thing.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

kingsfan said:


> By saying there's nothing wrong, I'm more referring to the sense that he has indicated he will at least attempt councilling (I believe JaLeRi stated that earlier), and as such hasn't completely shut the door to the concept of enhancing their sex life.
> 
> That said, I have also stated that her husband does seem very stubborn and would frsutrate me immensely, so we are likely making the same point overall SpruceHub, he needs to make more of an effort on this little issue (and in the grand scheme of things, this is small compared to a house, education,e tc.) before it morphs into a big thing.



Haha that's so funny! My husbands co-workers couldn't believe he found a wife that could tolerate him! So funny you say that, LOL


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## CanadianGuy (Jun 17, 2012)

The fact that he doesn't care about your sexual needs speaks volumes about his commitment to your happiness. I recognize that we are all responsible for our own happiness however in a love relationship is it not important to give love to the other person in a efforts to show love and increase their happiness? That said, it would seem from your posts that he's happy being as he is and that you should be happy about that. Kinda screwy.:scratchhead:

If you are not seeing an effort from him at all (?) then he has no commitment to your happiness and the relationship. This is a difficult realization. Ultimately it is your happiness that matters. If you both continue on this path it will not be good for you. Have you asked him what he is doing about increasing his LD or does he not see that as a problem?


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## Shocker (Jul 26, 2012)

Runs like Dog said:


> Tell him that most men would bang you stupid.


 Funny. And completely true. 


This thread got me thinkin...so I talked to wifey last night about this...she fine but open to more. :awink: There were a few restrictions but my point is people need to speak what they want. You never know.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

CanadianGuy said:


> If you are not seeing an effort from him at all (?) then he has no commitment to your happiness and the relationship. This is a difficult realization. Ultimately it is your happiness that matters. If you both continue on this path it will not be good for you. Have you asked him what he is doing about increasing his LD or does he not see that as a problem?



I have begged, asked, made appointments to get his LD looked at.... he is just defensive about it, and thinks I have the issue not him


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## CanadianGuy (Jun 17, 2012)

JaLeRi said:


> I have begged, asked, made appointments to get his LD looked at.... he is just defensive about it, and thinks I have the issue not him


Sounds like my wife is masquerading as a man and is married to you..... 

You and he are at an impasse. If he truly values making you happy and giving love to you in a way you appreciate then he would go. It sounds at the very least he has a very big ego. Not watching the guy-girl porn is an indication of his hang-ups. So much for that nude beach vacation you wanted to take..


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

CanadianGuy said:


> Sounds like my wife is masquerading as a man and is married to you.....
> 
> You and he are at an impasse. If he truly values making you happy and giving love to you in a way you appreciate then he would go. It sounds at the very least he has a very big ego. Not watching the guy-girl porn is an indication of his hang-ups. So much for that nude beach vacation you wanted to take..


HAHA always wanted to visit a nude beach! No tan lines how amazing would that be!


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## CanadianGuy (Jun 17, 2012)

JaLeRi said:


> HAHA always wanted to visit a nude beach! No tan lines how amazing would that be!


It's been quite amazing. Wreck beach - Vancouver.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

CanadianGuy said:


> It's been quite amazing. Wreck beach - Vancouver.


I will have to remember that when I am down on the coast


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## kingsfan (Jun 4, 2012)

JaLeRi said:


> I have begged, asked, made appointments to get his LD looked at.... he is just defensive about it, and *thinks I have the issue not him*


Essentially you do, because you are the only one suffering as a result of this issue. It's hard for him to wrap his head around the fact this a problem when it's not bothering him in the least, and why would it. He gets his needs met and has a wife who wants more. He doesn't have a problem, you do.

Perhaps the problem really isn't about sex at all, but rather about why he doesn't feel the need to meet your needs, or at least the need to try to meet your needs. Marriage is all about trying to meet the needs and shortcomings of your partner, essentially you life each other up and reach goals you couldn't attain on your own. This goes for inside the bedroom as well.

The fact he seemingly doesn't care about your sexual needs (outside of trying counselling, which is a solid start), and also you made allusions to the fact likely wouldn't waste his time on you if another man tried to enter the picture is rather troubling and indicates he may have a bit of a superiority complex.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

kingsfan said:


> .
> 
> The fact he seemingly doesn't care about your sexual needs (outside of trying counselling, which is a solid start), and also you made allusions to the fact likely wouldn't waste his time on you if another man tried to enter the picture is rather troubling and indicates he may have a bit of a superiority complex.



i googled the definition of superiority complex and it does sound a lot like him does not care what others opinions of him are, you can't compliment his appearance or anything cause he doesn't care what you think about him, he dresses and presents himself however he wants, like stained sweat pants, currently growing his hair very long, he just doesn't care what people think of his appearance. He likes overcoming things like becoming an electrician once he felt superior in that field he needed a new challenge hence becoming a dr. not just a dr. he wants to be surgeon. Which is like 14 years of school. He is young and will be in his early 40's when he is done but still fits the profile. People have said that about him when he met them that he came off as a snob like he thought he was better then them. So he tried to change that about himself. He likes being right and will research points to prove himself correct. 

Perhaps we are actually onto something real here, what might actually be the problem


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## Shocker (Jul 26, 2012)

JaLeRi said:


> i googled the definition of superiority complex and it does sound a lot like him does not care what others opinions of him are, you can't compliment his appearance or anything cause he doesn't care what you think about him, he dresses and presents himself however he wants, like stained sweat pants, currently growing his hair very long, he just doesn't care what people think of his appearance. He likes overcoming things like becoming an electrician once he felt superior in that field he needed a new challenge hence becoming a dr. not just a dr. he wants to be surgeon. Which is like 14 years of school. He is young and will be in his early 40's when he is done but still fits the profile. People have said that about him when he met them that he came off as a snob like he thought he was better then them. So he tried to change that about himself. He likes being right and will research points to prove himself correct.
> 
> Perhaps we are actually onto something real here, what might actually be the problem


That sounds like every dude I know. :scratchhead:

Anyway, I cannot get why he wouldn't want to prove you wrong. Strange. Does he lighten up over drinks? Tried it?


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## kingsfan (Jun 4, 2012)

JaLeRi said:


> i googled the definition of superiority complex and it does sound a lot like him does not care what others opinions of him are, you can't compliment his appearance or anything cause he doesn't care what you think about him, he dresses and presents himself however he wants, like stained sweat pants, currently growing his hair very long, he just doesn't care what people think of his appearance. He likes overcoming things like becoming an electrician once he felt superior in that field he needed a new challenge hence becoming a dr. not just a dr. he wants to be surgeon. Which is like 14 years of school. He is young and will be in his early 40's when he is done but still fits the profile. People have said that about him when he met them that he came off as a snob like he thought he was better then them. So he tried to change that about himself. He likes being right and will research points to prove himself correct.
> 
> Perhaps we are actually onto something real here, what might actually be the problem


Perhaps you should approach the sex problem from the standpoint of "you have it lucky to have a vibrant wife like me and I dare you to prove it wrong"

Once he can't (because research will show youa re the execption, not the rule) then poise a second question to him. "To maintain this you have to feed it, or it will dry up. Is this something you want to fail at?"

Not trying to be harsh here, so reword it as you see fit if you elect to try it, but if he has a superiority complex, use it to your advantage and turn the tables on him. If he's so superior, why is letting a sexually vibrant wife wilt in her prime?

To me that's sexually disfunctional, not superior.

EDIT: Additionally, as a side thought, perhaps he doesn't engage in sex as much as you'd like because he doesn't view it as a challenge. As you said, he needs challenges, and you throwing yourself at him in virtually everyway you can certainly isn't a challenge right now (not blaming you at all, IMO you are doing the right thing through your actions, he's just not the right audience for them perhaps). 

Maybe there's a way to make yourself a challenge?

Him needing a challenge may also explain why he views a threesome as a fantasy, as it is a challenge to set up one (searching out a partner alone can be a lengthy ordeal).


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

Shocker said:


> That sounds like every dude I know. :scratchhead:
> 
> Anyway, I cannot get why he wouldn't want to prove you wrong. Strange. Does he lighten up over drinks? Tried it?



We don't drink.... so I don't know he stopped drinking when he was like 17 so like a year before I met him he stopped drinking, so never even seen him drunk ever


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

kingsfan said:


> Perhaps you should approach the sex problem from the standpoint of "you have it lucky to have a vibrant wife like me and I dare you to prove it wrong"
> 
> Once he can't (because research will show youa re the execption, not the rule) then poise a second question to him. "To maintain this you have to feed it, or it will dry up. Is this something you want to fail at?"
> 
> ...



If i talked to him like that he would be less then pleased with me. It took me a few years to learn how to talk to him properly without him getting mad. Which is why I don't really know how to talk to him about this situation we are in without him getting mad.


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## kingsfan (Jun 4, 2012)

JaLeRi said:


> If i talked to him like that he would be less then pleased with me. It took me a few years to learn how to talk to him properly without him getting mad. Which is why I don't really know how to talk to him about this situation we are in without him getting mad.


Yeah, I just wrote it in simple terms. Obviously you'd have to be much more polite about it. 

Maybe you don't even have to 'say it' per se, but rather find a way to make him view it as a challenge?


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

kingsfan said:


> Yeah, I just wrote it in simple terms. Obviously you'd have to be much more polite about it.
> 
> Maybe you don't even have to 'say it' per se, but rather find a way to make him view it as a challenge?


I have no idea how i could do that... but i will definitely think about it


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## sandc (Dec 15, 2011)

He gets mad easy and has a low sex drive. Dang hon. Is it the loud angry words kind of mad or more of a physical mad?

I think you're onto the right track here. You need to make him want you. What attracts his attention? I see men flirting with my wife, it makes me want her. Do you see any kind of patterns like that with your husband?


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

sandc said:


> He gets mad easy and has a low sex drive. Dang hon. Is it the loud angry words kind of mad or more of a physical mad?
> 
> I think you're onto the right track here. You need to make him want you. What attracts his attention? I see men flirting with my wife, it makes me want her. Do you see any kind of patterns like that with your husband?


Loud words. The only time he wants me is when we are getting along really well... not patterns, but that;s also a lack of situations. The only men I am around now are his brothers and his dad. We don't go out ever no babysitter for our kids.

I honestly find his temper very mild. My father it was like walking on egg shells you didn't know if he was going to beat you up or not. Screamed and yelled at us, hit things, very aggressive. He wasn't abusive he only beat me up once (my dad) my brother got it a lot worse.


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## CanadianGuy (Jun 17, 2012)

JaLeRi said:


> I have no idea how i could do that... but i will definitely think about it


Role playing. Nun costume. tee hee.


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## sandc (Dec 15, 2011)

Maybe he does need the challenge. Maybe you need to start playing hard to get. In the mean time you may have to be content with spending quality time with Mr. Buzzy.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

sandc said:


> Maybe he does need the challenge. Maybe you need to start playing hard to get. In the mean time you may have to be content with spending quality time with Mr. Buzzy.


Playing hard to get would probably be the only thing that would work... haha i have never been that girl though. When I want something I go for it LOL. So I am not sure how to be that girl without pissing him off or shutting him down


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## sandc (Dec 15, 2011)

Just so you know it worries me that he gets angry so easily. What's going on in his life that he can't handle things without getting angry?

Would a little role play piss him off?


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

sandc said:


> Just so you know it worries me that he gets angry so easily. What's going on in his life that he can't handle things without getting angry?
> 
> Would a little role play piss him off?


He had a complicated childhood, and was a very angry child, kicked out of numerous schools. There are a lot of factors, he doesn't view it as a problem, and I know how to talk to him properly so it doesn't really come up that often.


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## CanadianGuy (Jun 17, 2012)

JaLeRi,

What do you think you are going to do about your situation? Any suggestions/advice from the TAM forum that you are considering?


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

CanadianGuy said:


> JaLeRi,
> 
> What do you think you are going to do about your situation? Any suggestions/advice from the TAM forum that you are considering?


What I have learned. I am not that kinky, that I am being within reason of my requests. We should go to counseling, perhaps I need to play harder to get, or give more direction like letting him be completely in control one night and "hope" for the best. I have a right to be upset what I am upset about. I am not as hard to deal with as I thought. Everyone wants to bang me LOL


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## jaharthur (May 25, 2012)

I don't know if this has been raised, but since you've spoken to your H's twin, and your H is OK with that, and your H knows his twin is looking out for his best interests . . . .

Has his twin ever told him that he needs to make more of an effort?

Maybe that's impractical, but I was just wondering.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

jaharthur said:


> I don't know if this has been raised, but since you've spoken to your H's twin, and your H is OK with that, and your H knows his twin is looking out for his best interests . . . .
> 
> Has his twin ever told him that he needs to make more of an effort?
> 
> Maybe that's impractical, but I was just wondering.


It would be weird if I talked to the twin and then the twin talked to the husband about us. The only time the twin would talk to his brother about it is if my husband talks to him about it. Which he wouldn't because he doesn't talk to anyone about anything. He is very internal


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

He might not want to go rough because he could worry he might like it too much.

And if he has an emotional link to sex, and this gets severed, well, that might not be too good, to be honest.

I can't imagine using spanking, etc., during sex. Probably because my first girl long term girl friend was nearly beaten to death by her then husband. He put her in hospital for two weeks.

To see my normally together girl friend go to jelly and panic if I made a move that accidentally triggered her, really, really put me off the idea of even mild role play of sexual dominance. 

I wonder if that helped put an end to that relationship? (She left me for a woman.)


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## WonderingWhat'sNext (Jul 25, 2012)

JaLeRi,

I'm so glad you posted this! I have been struggling with this same issue! I find that although a lot of the advice on here is good, sometimes it's even better to hear it from someone who is going through the exact same thing. With my situation, I am 37 and I married a man when I was 30 who was gentle and just so easy to get along with . He is in the military and fit, and is handsome. BUT, that doesn't matter. It's his demeanor... it's his mind that doesn't understand how to be dominant in bed. The truth is, when we first met it wasn't super important to me. We had sex and it was fine. Then, early on, he started this tickling game when he was taking me to bed. I'm like, 'wait, that doesn't turn me on. I'm not your little sister. He wasn't sexual... just tickling me. In my mind I was like 'I'll make him stop that and just push that out of my mind that it ever happened'. I would want kinky things too, like me being on top with oral.. he would do it but he wasn't into it. I felt like it was a chore for him.. and he did it because he loved me. I had to use so much energy fantasizing. Then, in the last year, I have definately had some sort of sexual peak or hormonal change. I am able to have vaginal orgasms where I couldn't before. So I'm like 'YEAH!', lets try all different things. He is still so conservative, and that's when he expressed he doesn't like to do it from behind. I never really cared much before that... but now that I care it's a really big deal. I am starting to enjoy sex and he won't change. I feel like it's weird because the guy is supposed to want more variety or more aggression. He is never aggressive. I told him I wanted to be dominated.. he is very uncomfortable with it. Or he'll do it and it just doesn't give me what I want... he doesn't know how to do it right. He is all happy and bubbling around, and wants missionary... and then gets offended when I tell him I want him to be more serious and that sort of thing. I don't know. I support you in that this is a big deal. I talked to my mom about it and she wants me to stay married no matter what. Everything is just fine in the marriage until we have sex... and then I can orgasm but I am truly mentally unsatisfied. I started craving an affair (which I posted on here). My husband has a issue that sort of fueled the affair, but in reality the biggest problem is that he is not dominant enough - and also in other areas of our marriage. So I just wanted to say, trying to have an affair hasn't gotten me very far. I haven't done it even though I tried to meet several men. It's not just about sex. It's about the whole relationship.. so I've held off. But I'm supporting you in this! I know this is hard! It is a real issue. I've also thought 'How am I supposed to deal with this forever? Is it fair to divorce this guy who loves me so much because I am continually unsatisfied in the bedroom?' There is a lot of guilt. But us women can't just look at porn pictures to be satisfied.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

I really feel for you. I completely understand what you are going through. 

Not being mentally satisfied! That is completely it, I am still wanting more even though physically I am good. 

I have a difficult time reaching climax has something to do with hormones, there are 2 weeks in the month where I can reach easily other 2 weeks not so much. Nothing to do with him, i have always been this way with other partners i never climaxed at all. 

I really just love having sex, and he doesn't and i understand the chore part. They make sex seem like a chore, my husband told me a few times if I could get it up for him, and go on top then i could have sex but he wasn't putting any effort in. Yah sex he doesn't want to have lucky me .

I would never have an affair my husband and I connect on every level so well besides the sex it would be impossible to find anyone more perfect for me. He is willing to go to counseling so I am looking forward to that, he is willing to work on it


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## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

sandc said:


> Maybe he does need the challenge. Maybe you need to start playing hard to get.


I agree with this.

And I can't help but wonder how he would respond if you met his anger with some anger of your own.
You have every right to express your anger just as he does.

I of course would never advise this unless you know with certainty that he is a paper tiger. Basically my thinking is that if you can *safely* shift the current dynamic, you may get some traction in other areas of your relationship.

So? How are you at dealing with anger and conflict?


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## EddieJ333 (Mar 10, 2012)

I wouldn't resist to have a so very beautiful woman asking me to be kinky about intimacy. It would turn me on everytime!


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## kingsfan (Jun 4, 2012)

JaLeRi said:


> What I have learned. I am not that kinky, that I am being within reason of my requests. We should go to counseling, perhaps I need to play harder to get, or give more direction like letting him be completely in control one night and "hope" for the best. I have a right to be upset what I am upset about. I am not as hard to deal with as I thought. *Everyone wants to bang me LOL*


I hope we all get to learn what you learned, especially the bolded, lol. That must do wonders for your self-esteem.



WonderingWhat'sNext said:


> I've also thought 'How am I supposed to deal with this forever? Is it fair to divorce this guy who loves me so much because I am continually unsatisfied in the bedroom?' There is a lot of guilt. But us women can't just look at porn pictures to be satisfied.


While I hope you don't go through with/continue your affair, I do understand where you are coming from. Porn pictures aren't enough for us men either.

It's about intimacy and wanting to be with someone emotionally, but through physical contact. Those same questions you posted in the quote I snipped out above, I've asked myself the same questions before. It's why I'm here. I don't want to be frustrated for another 50 years. It sucks and really impacts your self-esteem, yet you feel guilt if you leave over sex when everything else is great because we've been trained to view sex as unimportant, dirty or just wrong by society. It's the one thing we aren't supposed to talk about to anyone outside of our own bedroom, and the one thing we aren't supposed to be allowed to leave our spouses over, unless the marriage is completely sexless and even then, many think you should stay (not on this forum, just overall).

It's beyond a rock and a hard place.



JaLeRi said:


> my husband told me a few times if I could get it up for him, and go on top then i could have sex but he wasn't putting any effort in. Yah sex he doesn't want to have lucky me .


I know, don't you just feel like you're on top of the world? Chore sex is simply the best! (not).


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

Deejo said:


> I agree with this.
> 
> And I can't help but wonder how he would respond if you met his anger with some anger of your own.
> You have every right to express your anger just as he does.
> ...


My dad was very aggressive, yelled, throw things, hit things. Beat me once when I was 12 and he was drunk. When he got mad at me over whatever .25 on a phone bill. I just had to sit there and take it, not move, not make eye contact, and not talk, and certainly I was not allowed to cry. 

So when a man gets a little angry I react the same way I sit there and listen let him take his anger out, and then when its ok for me to talk I do, but I am usually very controlled and never raise my voice, and try and say things that won't piss him off. My husband is nothing like my dad. Just how I react because of my entire childhood. I get instantly scared when a man raises his voice.


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## sandc (Dec 15, 2011)

JaLeRi said:


> What I have learned. I am not that kinky, that I am being within reason of my requests. We should go to counseling, perhaps I need to play harder to get, or give more direction like letting him be completely in control one night and "hope" for the best. I have a right to be upset what I am upset about. I am not as hard to deal with as I thought. Everyone wants to bang me LOL


Oh please. You are very cute and seem like a real sweetie but for the record, *I* don't want to bang you. Now you just get over yourself. 

Now that THAT's out there let me just say I think you're on the right track here now. No, you are not all that kinky. Sorry, you're normal. You are not being unreasonable. You have a right to your own emotions. And we've already covered the banging.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

sandc said:


> Oh please. You are very cute and seem like a real sweetie but for the record, *I* don't want to bang you. Now you just get over yourself.
> 
> Now that THAT's out there let me just say I think you're on the right track here now. No, you are not all that kinky. Sorry, you're normal. You are not being unreasonable. You have a right to your own emotions. And we've already covered the banging.


LOL thanks! I honestly don't think everyone wants to bang me... just NUMEROUS people kept saying that LOL


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## klarson27 (Apr 11, 2012)

This thread certainly covered a lot of topics.. Very valuable.. I apologize if I offended or said anything inappropriate.. when conversations get sexual it's easy to get sidetracked.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

klarson27 said:


> This thread certainly covered a lot of topics.. Very valuable.. I apologize if I offended or said anything inappropriate.. when conversations get sexual it's easy to get sidetracked.


Its very hard to offend me. I am a mother of two been with my husband for 10 years, and I have been a house wife for the last 5 years. Kind of nice to hear you still have "it"


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## kingsfan (Jun 4, 2012)

JaLeRi said:


> Its very hard to offend me. I am a mother of two been with my husband for 10 years, and I have been a house wife for the last 5 years. Kind of nice to hear you still have "it"


While a lot of the posts in here have been about you having it still, I think it can be extrapolated across to many other women and men in marriages. While maybe not ALL of us married people are still attractive, I'd wager 90% or more are people who would garner some interest from the opposite sex if we were still 'available' so to speak.

Each and everyone of us need to remember we are all attractive to some level or another, and this is especially true for the HD spouses in this forum. It can be very hard to remember, or even admit, we are still attractive, when we are with a spouse who would rather build puzzles, watch TV, play cards or do Sudoku than engage in sex with us. 

I can safely say that based on the words of all the main female posters here (and the odd picture as well) that they are all beautiful and I hope someday your spouse/partner/significant other wakes up and realizes that, if he hasn't already.

The men can find someone else to say that to them, I don't swing that way


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## sandc (Dec 15, 2011)

Well.... I'm not that attractive but I have a good sense of humor. 

And yes, J, you still have it. I just do all the banging with the wonderful woman I married 25 years ago. She's still got it too!! :smthumbup:


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## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

JaLeRi said:


> My dad was very aggressive, yelled, throw things, hit things. Beat me once when I was 12 and he was drunk. When he got mad at me over whatever .25 on a phone bill. I just had to sit there and take it, not move, not make eye contact, and not talk, and certainly I was not allowed to cry.
> 
> So when a man gets a little angry I react the same way I sit there and listen let him take his anger out, and then when its ok for me to talk I do, but I am usually very controlled and never raise my voice, and try and say things that won't piss him off. My husband is nothing like my dad. Just how I react because of my entire childhood. I get instantly scared when a man raises his voice.


Funny how someone posts something and it brings up your own stuff. We call them 'triggers' around here.

You just described my ex-wife. Her parents weren't violent, but very emotionally abusive. It was certainly not OK for her to express her own disagreement or anger. Just like you said, she was expected to sit there and 'take it'.

Try to change this. Seriously. Especially with your husband. It isn't your job to smooth EVERYTHING over ... but I bet you think it is.

You sound like a wonderful wife. Wonderful wives are allowed to get ticked off and let their husbands know it without fear of repercussions.

My marriage ended in part due to sexual incompatibility as well. It takes a toll. It's corrosive. It seeps into all other aspects of your relationship. It affects your self perception and how you see your bond with your partner.

My point; it's worth getting angry about if he refuses to acknowledge that sex is a very important facet of a marriage.

I have dated 3 women who left their husbands due to lack of intimacy, and told their husband outright, if you don't divorce me ... I will cheat on you, and I don't want that. Hard to hear, but admirable.

I have dated women that also made a different choice, that carries bigger consequences and a real stigma (be it a man or a woman that chooses to betray their marriage).

I hope your husband appreciates the investment you make in your relationship. I think you should expect no less than the same from him.


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## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

JaLeRi said:


> Its very hard to offend me. I am a mother of two been with my husband for 10 years, and I have been a house wife for the last 5 years. Kind of nice to hear you still have "it"


Google - sex rank

Also, I don't know if anyone else has already posted Athol's link, but you will likely find some great information here:

Married Man Sex Life | How to have the marriage you thought you were going to have. By which I mean doing it like rabbits.

Athol is also a contributor on TAM from time to time.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

Deejo said:


> Funny how someone posts something and it brings up your own stuff. We call them 'triggers' around here.
> 
> You just described my ex-wife. Her parents weren't violent, but very emotionally abusive. It was certainly not OK for her to express her own disagreement or anger. Just like you said, she was expected to sit there and 'take it'.
> 
> ...


I have been going to counseling. Mostly because I was raped as a teen twice, and didn't figure it out till recently. Date rape, where you know your rapist, even like them, but they still raped you. So a lot of this stuff is fresh in my mind as of recently especially why I am so submissive when a man gets aggressive with me. It allowed me to be raped because I just froze and didn't move, and waited for it to be over. 

I would never leave my husband, my mom was married to my dad for 25 years and was abused emotionally and physically, they fought all the time it was a terrible marriage. Yet my mother was still happy, she created her own happiness. They had so many incompatibilities and no respect for each other. Yet they stay together that many years. Only ended because my dad was finally caught cheating. My mom would of stayed married till one of them died. 

Coming from that and being in a marriage where my husband allows to go away for the weekend and visit my friends and stays home with our kids, he provides, we never disagree on money we are both frugal and savers, we agree religiously, we are both extremely clean, tidy and neat people. We have built a house together, gutted a house completely and got along extremely well for the most part during that extremely stress time. My husband trusts me completely he is never insecure about being cheated on, he allows me to do whatever I want and in return I allow him that same courtesy. We both are hygienic. My sister and two brothers and my parents are all divorced at least once. They had so many incompatibilities that led to each of them getting divorced. 

The only incompatibility that we have is sex. My husband is willing to go to counseling because he is tired of fighting about this as much as I am. We want to fix it. If counseling doesn't work then I will have to make a difficult decision. Stay and be miserable in that area, or leave. I am just not at that point yet. I will have to see what happens when we go to counseling about it.

I am reluctant to leave because I honestly don't believe I will find anyone better suited for me then my husband. I have never been hurt before, I have never had my heart broken. So I doubt the next person I would move onto would get all of my love. No man would love my children like my husband. I love my husband just as much as I love our children.


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## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

In the scheme of things, it sounds like the two of you are doing exactly the right things.

Believe me JaLeRi, everyone around here is a sucker for a success story.

I certainly hope you and your husband share one.

I'm sorry that you were victimized. This is another subject that I think many men should be aware of, and prepared to help their partners with.

1 in 4, 25% of ALL women, are abused or victimized. Most of the women I have dated, have all had stories about being victimized when younger, that they are trying to come to terms with in coping with their new lives being divorced and single. I find it utterly mind-boggling, and tragic. In four cases of my partners, they never told a soul at the time, and believed they had precipitated it.

I hope you get to do your coping and healing with your husband. Sincerely.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

Deejo said:


> In the scheme of things, it sounds like the two of you are doing exactly the right things.
> 
> Believe me JaLeRi, everyone around here is a sucker for a success story.
> 
> ...



My husband as a hard time that I was victimized. He doesn't want to talk about it, or hear about it or anything. I understand that its hurt him that someone hurt me. Difficult to hear about something you can't change.


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## kingsfan (Jun 4, 2012)

JaLeRi said:


> My husband as a hard time that I was victimized. He doesn't want to talk about it, or hear about it or anything. I understand that its hurt him that someone hurt me. Difficult to hear about something you can't change.


That's probably the 'problem solver' or 'needs a challenge' side of him coming out. Because it's a problem that, in his mind, either has no solution, or no solution he is able to provide, he'd rather not deal with it rather than be faced with a problem he can't solve.

If you don't need him to vent to (IE, have a counsellor to talk to as you mentioned) then that's fine. If you feel a need for him to be involved in the solution, even if it's just an ear to listen to, then he needs to be there for that. Marriage is successful based on how well you lift your partner up and help them overcome their flaws or weaknesses. I hope he is willing to help you with that.

I don't know your husband at all, but just based on what you have posted in this thread, he seems rather selfish, in the sense that he'll do what HE thinks is needed in the marriage, and anything above and beyond that is unworthy of his time and effort. Hopefully he corrects this if this is the case.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

kingsfan said:


> That's probably the 'problem solver' or 'needs a challenge' side of him coming out. Because it's a problem that, in his mind, either has no solution, or no solution he is able to provide, he'd rather not deal with it rather than be faced with a problem he can't solve.
> 
> If you don't need him to vent to (IE, have a counsellor to talk to as you mentioned) then that's fine. If you feel a need for him to be involved in the solution, even if it's just an ear to listen to, then he needs to be there for that. Marriage is successful based on how well you lift your partner up and help them overcome their flaws or weaknesses. I hope he is willing to help you with that.
> 
> I don't know your husband at all, but just based on what you have posted in this thread, he seems rather selfish, in the sense that he'll do what HE thinks is needed in the marriage, and anything above and beyond that is unworthy of his time and effort. Hopefully he corrects this if this is the case.


I have never had anyone in my life that I could "talk" to about things. My mother doesn't like talking about things, my siblings and I aren't that kind of close and are having a hard time with life then me. I only ever have had counselors to help me with things. Which I have pursued on my own and dealt with on my own. I don't like to burden people with my problems. I don't want people to really know how damaged I am. Would rather appear perfect and happy. I feel its only fair that i open up to a counselor they are trained to deal with my garbage and are not affected by it. 

I just never expected him to be that person for me. I don't want to make him uncomfortable, and i don't want him to be hurt by something he has no control over. 

Things are just very black and white with him he knows what he wants and doesn't want. If anyone left he would leave me. 
Like i said before I knew who I married when I married him.


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## sandc (Dec 15, 2011)

JaLeRi said:


> I have never had anyone in my life that I could "talk" to about things. My mother doesn't like talking about things, my siblings and I aren't that kind of close and are having a hard time with life then me. I only ever have had counselors to help me with things. Which I have pursued on my own and dealt with on my own. I don't like to burden people with my problems. I don't want people to really know how damaged I am. Would rather appear perfect and happy. I feel its only fair that i open up to a counselor they are trained to deal with my garbage and are not affected by it.
> 
> I just never expected him to be that person for me. I don't want to make him uncomfortable, and i don't want him to be hurt by something he has no control over.
> 
> ...


Well... now you can talk to us. We don't know you and don't judge you. We're just words on a computer screen after all.

Marriage counselling might be helpful. A sex therapist might be more helpful. Maybe your MC can recommend one when you get to that point. The good news is I think you have a fixable problem if your husband is willing to "work the problem."


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

sandc said:


> Well... now you can talk to us. We don't know you and don't judge you. We're just words on a computer screen after all.
> 
> Marriage counselling might be helpful. A sex therapist might be more helpful. Maybe your MC can recommend one when you get to that point. The good news is I think you have a fixable problem if your husband is willing to "work the problem."


I agree i think its very fixable. At least I hope. I think I need to stop talking about this. I am like my mother if I ignore things I am really happy. 

Talking about all this my marriage, past, sex life... getting a little depressed about it all


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

You know what he knew how I was when he married me! 

He knew I was very sexually. He knew that LONG before i knew he wasn't that into sex.

I honestly didn't know he wasn't that into sex I thought he was religiously convicted about having sex before marriage and was trying to abstinent because of his relationship with God.

He knew that I was sexual that's how we met. This guy who raped me told everyone TERRIBLE stories about me and completely ruined my reputation. That's how my husband started talking to me, to tell me what a **** I was... and then he felt bad and kept talking with me and we built a friendship and eventually started dating and fell in love.


He knew I was like this.... why would you marry someone like this... if you aren't that kind of person


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## 16andCounting (Aug 4, 2012)

JaLeRi - I've read all of your posts and at first I thought "man this guy doesn't know how lucky he is!" and I meant that in a sexual way. 

However, while I still think that he's very lucky to have you, I've begun to look at the sexual nature of your dilemma a bit differently.

I think therapy is the order of the day. I think you use sex and submission as a way to deal with your past experiences. Therapy will help you deal with those issues and could bring you and your husband to a closer sexual plane. Your husband, understanding this better through therapy, will be in a better place to give you what you need and desire and I bet those things will change some through help.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

16andCounting said:


> JaLeRi - I've read all of your posts and at first I thought "man this guy doesn't know how lucky he is!" and I meant that in a sexual way.
> 
> However, while I still think that he's very lucky to have you, I've begun to look at the sexual nature of your dilemma a bit differently.
> 
> I think therapy is the order of the day. I think you use sex and submission as a way to deal with your past experiences. Therapy will help you deal with those issues and could bring you and your husband to a closer sexual plane. Your husband, understanding this better through therapy, will be in a better place to give you what you need and desire and I bet those things will change some through help.


I know I have issues... i was molested for 12 years raped twice and my father was aggressive and abusive. I have been to counseling for those issues.... i know all that made me how i am....not entirely sure why it made me hyper sexual you would think it would of gone another way


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## 16andCounting (Aug 4, 2012)

I am no therapist but I would think its actually quite common. Do you think your husband realizes all that has had this affect on you and feels he enabling you by giving in to you sexually?


I really hope the best for you the way you talk about your marriage and your love for your husband really warms my heart.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

16andCounting said:


> I am no therapist but I would think its actually quite common. Do you think your husband realizes all that has had this affect on you and feels he enabling you by giving in to you sexually?
> 
> 
> I really hope the best for you the way you talk about your marriage and your love for your husband really warms my heart.


No I don't think that he is trying not to enable me, because of my past. 

I really do love him... more then my own family as much as my children.... just in a completely different way


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## sandc (Dec 15, 2011)

JaLeRi said:


> You know what he knew how I was when he married me!
> He knew that I was sexual that's how we met. This guy who raped me told everyone TERRIBLE stories about me and completely ruined my reputation. That's how my husband started talking to me, to tell me what a **** I was... and then he felt bad and kept talking with me and we built a friendship and eventually started dating and fell in love.
> 
> 
> He knew I was like this.... why would you marry someone like this... if you aren't that kind of person


Hold the phone. Okay, he met you, by coming up to you to tell you you were a slvt?!? Then he felt guilty about that, dated you, then married you. Here's what I think. By you being very sexually aggressive you are confirming in his mind what the other boys were saying about you back then. They were calling you a slvt, now with you actually liking sex he may be starting to think they were right.

Now, please read this carefully, YOU ARE NOT A SLVT. You were not asking for what happened to you. What happened to you was not your fault. You WERE a victim of a crime. You are a sweet person who is looking for the love from her husband that she deserves. I think you husband has some major issues about your past. I think you may too. Again, I'm not a mental health professional, these are just my thoughts.


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## sandc (Dec 15, 2011)

It sounds like you have been doing some really deep thinking this evening.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

sandc said:


> Hold the phone. Okay, he met you, by coming up to you to tell you you were a slvt?!? Then he felt guilty about that, dated you, then married you. Here's what I think. By you being very sexually aggressive you are confirming in his mind what the other boys were saying about you back then. They were calling you a slvt, now with you actually liking sex he may be starting to think they were right.
> 
> Now, please read this carefully, YOU ARE NOT A SLVT. You were not asking for what happened to you. What happened to you was not your fault. You WERE a victim of a crime. You are a sweet person who is looking for the love from her husband that she deserves. I think you husband has some major issues about your past. I think you may too. Again, I'm not a mental health professional, these are just my thoughts.


yah maybe your right... i just don't even know anymore


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

sandc said:


> It sounds like you have been doing some really deep thinking this evening.


My husband went away for the long weekend to spend time with his twin. So had a lot of time alone


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## sandc (Dec 15, 2011)

I understand. Well, please don't stress yourself over this. I think you should make a list of the things we've said on this forum and take them to a counselor. I would suggest individual counseling for you as well as marriage counseling for both of you. MC needs to really get to the heart of why his sexual drive has lowered. 

Try to just relax and enjoy your kids. Watch some good movies after they go to bed. Do something relaxing.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

sandc said:


> I understand. Well, please don't stress yourself over this. I think you should make a list of the things we've said on this forum and take them to a counselor. I would suggest individual counseling for you as well as marriage counseling for both of you. MC needs to really get to the heart of why his sexual drive has lowered.
> 
> Try to just relax and enjoy your kids. Watch some good movies after they go to bed. Do something relaxing.


Have been watching Mad Men on netflix and watched a movie too.


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## sandc (Dec 15, 2011)

JaLeRi said:


> Have been watching Mad Men on netflix and watched a movie too.


Good for you! My wife's watching Regarding Henry on Netflix while I work. We'll I'm wasting a little time on TAM too.


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## DDC (Jul 16, 2012)

JaLeRi said:


> I have never had anyone in my life that I could "talk" to about things. My mother doesn't like talking about things, my siblings and I aren't that kind of close and are having a hard time with life then me. I only ever have had counselors to help me with things. Which I have pursued on my own and dealt with on my own. I don't like to burden people with my problems. *I don't want people to really know how damaged I am. Would rather appear perfect and happy*. I feel its only fair that i open up to a counselor they are trained to deal with my garbage and are not affected by it.
> 
> I just never expected him to be that person for me. I don't want to make him uncomfortable, and i don't want him to be hurt by something he has no control over.
> 
> ...


I just wanted to speak to those words. Many of my close female friends have confided in me that they have experienced molestation and/or rape before the age of 18. I would say over 50%.

On the same token, as someone deeply involved in mens work and support, I've since discovered that many men I know have also been the victim of sexual abuse. Again, over 50%. I was shocked. 

But in a strange way, it made me feel more connected to humanity as a whole - many men and women have gone through awful, awful, awful things they did not deserve.

Everyone has their issues and from my perspective, I actually have a higher opinion of people who have been through undesirable circumstances and have had the strength and wisdom to address them like you have. This takes tremendous courage. And from my experience, I've felt a deeper personal/emotional connection to such people. 

They're more "real". And they better understand what is important in life.


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

JaLeRi said:


> Yah my husband really doesn't care i talk about sex stuff with his twin brother. He knows his twin is looking out for his best interests, and i need someone to talk to other then him.


From what I've read about your H, I wouldn't think so. Ask him directly. I pretty sure he will freak out. Just ask him to his face directly if he has an issue with you talking about your sexlife to his twin brother



JaLeRi said:


> You know what he knew how I was when he married me!
> 
> He knew I was very sexually. He knew that LONG before i knew he wasn't that into sex.
> 
> ...


Ok, this is f*cked up. I don't want to make a hasty judgement but this seems to be some serious stuff going on. Was it some misguided sense to repair/fix you that he married you?(like the missionaries in the old times, you said he was religious , right?). Can you go more deeper into this? If you aren't comfortable sharing this on an online forum, talk to an Individual counselor. You seem to have some issues(I hate to say this). Nothing outrageous but issues nonetheless. Find a good counselor and get some individual counseling.

You also seem to base your identity of him. That more you talk, the more there problems seem to be. There is something off that I cannot exactly point at


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

warlock07 said:


> From what I've read about your H, I wouldn't think so. Ask him directly. I pretty sure he will freak out. Just ask him to his face directly if he has an issue with you talking about your sexlife to his twin brother
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I guess one point I have to let everyone know is my husband lived in BC and i lived in SK (like north dakota, to washington state) we went to the same school for 1 year. Which is why we had friends from where I lived. His twin brother met my cousin one summer and was talking to her, so I started talking to his twin on the internet you know looking out for my cousin see who she was seeing, then my H found out his twin was talking to me and really let me know what he thought of me. The conversation ended with me saying he didn't know me, and I wasn't like that. He went away from the conversation and felt really bad about what he said to me because he really didn't know just heard rumors. 

I was 15 when we started to talk on the internet as ICQ friends lol.... he was 17 it was around christmas time. We talked on ICQ for awhile he talked to me about religious things and i had a crush on him, cause he was so nice to me and so cute. In the summer he was coming out to see his dad. He lived where I did. I heard he was in town from another cousin of mine so I called his twin and asked if they wanted to get together. My cousin and I picked them up to go out to DQ. My husband and I really hit it off and after we went to DQ we went to the park, then we went to the movie store then to a donut store, went to my cousins house watched the movie and still wanted to find something else to do together because we enjoyed each others company so much. So we spent the rest of the summer together which was like 6 weeks and then he went back to BC. We did long distance for 2 years while I finished grade 11 and 12 then I moved to BC to be with him. We got engaged 1 month after I arrived, and married 4 months later in October.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

Our wedding day October 4, 2004

You can really tell what kind of woman I am by this story.

I legally could not get married in BC because I was 18, and you had to be 19, but the next province over Alberta the legal age was 18... i really didn't want to wait for the spring till I was 19, I knew what I wanted, and I wanted to start my life with him. 

So I asked my parents for permission to marry in BC they said no of course. So i phoned a pastor up in Alberta to see if he would marry us. He agreed and asked me when I hadn't thought about it so I just said well how about monday?! He agreed. So 5 days from that phone call I was married. I grabbed a dress from the mall it was just a summer dress only about 40 dollars, I didn't care I didn't see the point spending a lot of money on something I could only wear once. So we hopped in the car with his mom, twin, brother and brothers girlfriend. He has another brother in the city where we got married, his dad, and my parents who were married at the time all met us at the church. It was a VERY small wedding we went to the government building when we got there and got our papers. Then we got married. 

We drove back to BC that evening (6hr drive) we stopped in a little town on the way back and his mom my MIL paid for a suite for us. Then the next day we went to work. 

Most of my pictures on my profile are from our first vacation/honey moon/my birthday which was this last spring... only 7 1/2 years late... but better late then never. 

We didn't even have wedding rings... i never got an engagement ring. After our son was born 2 1/2 years ago we finally got wedding rings. I told my husband which one I wanted and told him that was all I wanted for my birthday.... but he never got it for me. So i ended up buying it myself with our money. (I stay at home) I bought his as well. Just a simple band only about $150 for mine and $80 for his.

Recently his twin got engaged spent $4000 on the engagement ring. This will be his second marriage already... and I don't think this one will last if they even make it to the altar. To say the least I was a little jealous. 

My husband refuses to buy me jewelry says it is so unpractical spending that kind of money on something you wear. 

We are kind of CRAZY practical. We are on our 3rd home. Everything we have it paid off we have no debt but a mortgage. Even our mortgage payment is cheaper then renting because we save our money so well. We put nearly $60k down on this house we are in. We bought a brand new car from the dealership right before we had our daughter... paid cash for it. I was 21 at the time. 21 years old and paid cash for a brand new car... it was a Honda Fit not expensive, just very practical little car. 

I am not even sure why I am telling everyone this. I guess just to add to my story. I am very lonely this weekend and a little bit bored.


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## sandc (Dec 15, 2011)

It sounds like you pursued him. You even bought your own wedding rings. Don't know what to make of that. Just thinking out loud...


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

My 2 cents - you love each other because you two connect and compliment each other.

that said - you both come with a bunch of issues and baggage that you need to learn to work with and control before they get the better of you and derail things.

there is this sense when you are coming of age, especially if you had a rough teens years that you've finally got this stuff under wraps and know up from down.

News flash - you never really know up from down. You just keep your mind focused on what is important and keep at it.

the two of you love each other - that is your focus point. Believe in each other and know that life is a journey of growth and change. what was true of you yesterday may not be true tomorrow - except that which you choose to be true: loving in your SO no matter what.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

Shaggy said:


> My 2 cents - you love each other because you two connect and compliment each other.
> 
> that said - you both come with a bunch of issues and baggage that you need to learn to work with and control before they get the better of you and derail things.
> 
> ...


I love him so much never loved another person so much in my life... besides my kids but that's a different love because my kids are my responsibility. He never was he was my choice. Just thinking about the last 2 1/2 years. I never stop trying in our marriage, and working on things, and leaving notes, and telling him how much i love him, and how gorgeous he is. Yet i think he has stopped trying... not sure if that's because he knows I will do it all for him... or if he is falling out of love with me.... he still respects me and cares about me i can tell that.... the love part i'm starting to question


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## sandc (Dec 15, 2011)

How are you doing J?


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

sandc said:


> How are you doing J?


Not good... wrote a big email to my husband about everything i talked about on here...

He read it this morning. He isn't talking to me, he is very angry with me, and thinks i'm selfish for sending that email when he was gone having a good time with his family


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## Dan Carruthers (Jul 14, 2012)

There is Love in Depth from the wife.

I think the hubby should just understand the sex part by knowing a Woman's Anatomy and Physiology , with some scientific mind set too.


Women who need it rough or reckless are not unnatural, but it is most natural to such genre..and the Man, should comprehend the same and be at it viz a comprehensive " Art of Coitus".

Well, I would just think that your hubby will not be angry any longer on ur topic discussions or mails etc , if he understands things in the right and apt perspectives . and I suppose he will understand sooner or later..and Things will finally be the Way it should be..and in the aftermaths n continuum , he may be,or should be more happy than what he is now.


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## CanadianGuy (Jun 17, 2012)

JaLeRi said:


> Not good... wrote a big email to my husband about everything i talked about on here...
> 
> He read it this morning. He isn't talking to me, he is very angry with me, and thinks i'm selfish for sending that email when he was gone having a good time with his family


Seems to me there was never a good time to send that email to him. Being angered over when you sent it is a smoke screen for how he feels about the content. You are not selfish. You are working on creating a relationship you can feel wonderful about. I have read this thread with interest and an open mind so I can see how it applies to my own situation. You sound like you give so much for so little in return. Not that the reason you give so much is so that you can receive but you truly enjoying giving selflessly and lovingly.


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

The marriage is happy as long as you keep doing what he wants, right? He knows he does not have to change and might be taking things a little too granted. You just admire him too much. You almost seem subservient to a fault and your whole focus is only on your H(and the kids). You can only put on the happy facade only for so long before you break. I might have missed some posts but do you have any other hobbies ? While I don't advise on playing games, he needs to miss you to realize what he has right no. Maybe a temporary separation ? Discuss your relationship with any of your close female friends or relatives.


I know you strongly deny any chance of having an affair but attention can be a pretty powerful drug in an attraction starved marriage.(I'm sure you enjoyed the comments on your pics) You need not be evil, just weak willed or in a vulnerable position to have an affair or ONS. I'll try to find some relavent threads from the CWI section. I'm saying this because things are still in a fixable state. Sooner or later , the resentment will become too big a barrier to fix the relationship. You need to identify the issues before you attempt to fix them. Sex is just one of them.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

CanadianGuy said:


> You sound like you give so much for so little in return. Not that the reason you give so much is so that you can receive but you truly enjoying giving selflessly and lovingly.


Funny how you read this forum and got that.... my two best friends said the exact same thing, they both felt I was under appreciated and taken for granted. 

He gets home at 1pm today.... so this will be my afternoon and evening


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

warlock07 said:


> The marriage is happy as long as you keep doing what he wants, right? He knows he does not have to change and might be taking things a little too granted. You just admire him too much. You almost seem subservient to a fault and your whole focus is only on your H(and the kids). You can only put on the happy facade only for so long before you break. I might have missed some posts but do you have any other hobbies ? While I don't advise on playing games, he needs to miss you to realize what he has right no. Maybe a temporary separation ? Discuss your relationship with any of your close female friends or relatives.
> 
> 
> I know you strongly deny any chance of having an affair but attention can be a pretty powerful drug in an attraction starved marriage.(I'm sure you enjoyed the comments on your pics) You need not be evil, just weak willed or in a vulnerable position to have an affair or ONS. I'll try to find some relavent threads from the CWI section. I'm saying this because things are still in a fixable state. Sooner or later , the resentment will become too big a barrier to fix the relationship. You need to identify the issues before you attempt to fix them. Sex is just one of them.



Yah no you are right. I have no hobbies, him and my kids are my life. My hobbies are not stuff I can do all the time, like sky diving, cliff jumping....

I am attention starved.... I start university this fall and that terrifies me because I know guys are going to give me attention, and I can't help but love it.... of course i loved the comments on my pictures... that's why I put them on here... then felt bad about it and removed them... this has been a constant struggle for me our entire relationship.

Men pursue me a lot....the last 6 years i stopped listening


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## sandc (Dec 15, 2011)

Men pursuing you is not going to stop. You can only resist for so long before the starvation of intimacy becomes so great that you stop resisting their pursuits. One man is going to come along that will say and do all the right things and... well....

Your husband is taking you for granted. You are afraid of him. You try to make him love you by making him the center of your universe but it doesn't work. I'm starting to think that you may be a candidate for the 180. Start living in a way that makes you happy. Dress nice. Take up a hobby. Have a life outside of your husband. If he sees you making changes it make spark some interest on his part.


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## Plan 9 from OS (Jul 13, 2012)

I haven't read the entire thread, but I'm familiar with the story. I agree with the others that pulling the 180 may be what you need. Also, you are playing the doormat in this marriage, which I find surprising considering you are an attractive woman and get your share of attention from other men. 

I think it's time for you to play "no more Mrs. nice girl". I don't think he respects you as a person and I bet he regularly tells you why your opinion on something is wrong. I bet he always has to be right too. Don't worry about the 180 meaning the end of your marriage. Think of it as a tactical retreat. You need to detach yourself from him for a period of time so that he begins to realize how much you do for him and your marriage. At the same time, you need to begin standing up for yourself and not take him minimizing you anymore. Hit him where it hurts him the most. I'd go buy something nice for yourself and if he complains about it I would stop him in his tracks and tell him that you deserve something nice after all of the sacrifices you do to make this family run. 

If he doesn't like it, tell him to kiss your ass. Also, consider this line to be valuable because one of 2 things will happen: 1) you gain your self respect back and he realizes you won't be his doormat any more and/or 2) you may get him excited to do something kinky with your ass...


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## kingsfan (Jun 4, 2012)

Sorry to hear things weren't well received from the hubby JaLeRi, but that is to be expected. He likely thought everything was fine, only to check his e-mail and see he suddenly has a huge marriage crisis. So his response isn't unexpected, especially coming from a man such as your husband.

Your situation sounds a lot like one my former boss went through. She was a very agressive, outgoing, take on all-comers type of women. Not overly attractive, but good looking and could get guys if she wanted. She was funny, witty, hard-working and smart. Very solid lady.

She was married to a man and you'd swear he was on earth to walk around in God's image or something. She praised him forever. Whatever this man wanted, he got, and with ribbons and bows on. He wanted steak that night? Done. He wanted to play guitar with his buddies? Done. He wanted a 6-hour sex marathon? Done. 

In her eyes, he was the greatest man alive.

Thing is, to everyone else, the guy was a concited prick, basically. He thought he was all that, and acted accordingly. He was very judgemental and if you didn't agree with him, you were wrong. It was just that simple. You din't have a differnt point of view, and there was no way he was wrong. You were. End of discussion.

That attitude carried over into the marriage, and did so from the start. Like you, this woman knew who she was marrying. Why, we don't know, and she really doesn't like talking about the marriage now, but my thoughts are that she just wanted a guy that could take charge and make things happen. And he did that, had a good paying job, was smart, very muscular, and had some great qualities. He was just a poumpous ass is all.

Eventually, it turned out that his constant beliddling and overseeing of everything took a toll on her. Because she was the type to so publicly praise him, when things started to go bad (IE, she started to wake up to who he was I feel) she felt she couldn't really vent to anyone about it for fear of the "I told you so's" coming out. 

As a result, eventually she met a man from her past (he was just a friend before) and because he didn't know much about the husband, she started to confide in him, because he hadn't been around for all the praise she heaped on her husband. She felt she could talk to him.

And talk they did, and talk turned into a lot more talk. Eventually, talk turned into more than talk. While none of us are sure exactly how things went down in the end, we believe she and this friend began an affair, and her husband found out about it. Shortly afterwards, she left her husband and eventually started dating the other man. She and the other man are still together about four years later.

I'm not saying this is you and your husband JaLeRi, but it sounds familiar, and I could see it heading in that same direction. 

We all need to vent, but venting to someone from the opposite sex always has a special meaning to us, likely because when we have someone from the opposite sex agreeing with us, it makes us feel like we aren't just seeing it from our respective sides. We have someone from the opposite sex agreeing with us. This likely goes 10-fold for sexual issues.

I'm glad you expressed yourself to your husband, and I understand his anger. Don't back down to him though, this is an issue with you and, by exntension, an issue for both of you. Whether he likes it or not, he has to start ealing with it, so make him understand that. If one of you isn't happy, eventually both of you won't be happy.

As I said before, a great marriage is built by both partners trying to do their best to cover the others faults, lift them to greater achievements and be their rock to stand on. 

When you mentioned before how it seems like your marriage is all about him and your kids from your perspective, that's fine. Don't stop that. That's what a good marriage is all about from your angle. The only thing missing is that he isn't doing the same thing. He should be focusing all on you as well (and the kids). If he was giving you as much attention as you give him, you wouldn't be here upset right now, nor e-mailing him a list of issues.

Stay strong and focused JaLeRi, remember, you are doing this to save the marriage, not for your own personal gain.

God bless.


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

kingsfan said:


> Sorry to hear things weren't well received from the hubby JaLeRi, but that is to be expected. He likely thought everything was fine, only to check his e-mail and see he suddenly has a huge marriage crisis. So his response isn't unexpected, especially coming from a man such as your husband.
> 
> Your situation sounds a lot like one my former boss went through. She was a very agressive, outgoing, take on all-comers type of women. Not overly attractive, but good looking and could get guys if she wanted. She was funny, witty, hard-working and smart. Very solid lady.
> 
> ...


Thanks I will try not to back down... its so hard I hate to fight, I think I am tired of this happening. I feel insecure about doing this because i don't know if I am making this up and being difficult.

As a child when I was sick my parents never believed me and sent me to school... the only time they believed I was ever sick was when I was puking... rest of the time I was just being a suck, dramatic. So as an adult I know that I always question how i truly feel about things, am I being dramatic? am I just being difficult? I never know if where I stand is on true ground or not...

I have so many people on here and my best friends telling me the same thing, and agreeing with me. I am starting to believe that i'm not just making this up... it is real, it really is a problem.


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## kingsfan (Jun 4, 2012)

JaLeRi said:


> Thanks I will try not to back down... its so hard I hate to fight, I think I am tired of this happening. I feel insecure about doing this because i don't know if I am making this up and being difficult.
> 
> As a child when I was sick my parents never believed me and sent me to school... the only time they believed I was ever sick was when I was puking... rest of the time I was just being a suck, dramatic. So as an adult I know that I always question how i truly feel about things, am I being dramatic? am I just being difficult? I never know if where I stand is on true ground or not...
> 
> I have so many people on here and my best friends telling me the same thing, and agreeing with me. I am starting to believe that i'm not just making this up... it is real, it really is a problem.


Anything that you constantly think about, and those thoughts cause you to feel sad, upset, depressed, hurt, or like you are missing something, is a real problem. That goes for all of life, not just sex.

From the way you have described your problem, it seems like this is a fairly accurate description of what you are thinking/feeling.


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## sandc (Dec 15, 2011)

You need intimacy and connection in a marriage. This is your time to tell him this. This is his time to fix things. In a year or two when you've finally had enough and want to call it quits it will be too late for him to start backpedaling and say "Hey, you're really serious about this aren't you?" He needs to know you're serious now.


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## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

Imagine for a moment what happens if you utterly and completely stop doing everything that you do to support and foster your marriage.

How do you think he would respond? Do you think he would want to address the issues and fix the problem? Or do you think he would back further away and simply blame you ... for everything.

I'm sharing this because it is exactly what I did. The marriage worked because I made it work.

The moment I stopped doing the work and expected her to take some responsibility? 

The entire relationship utterly collapsed.

I suggest you discuss this theme of you feeling compelled to 'carry' the marriage and everyone elses happiness on your shoulders with your therapist.

I'll bottom line it for you. It isn't healthy and it cannot work over the long term. I tried it for nearly 10 years. I kept hoping it would bring my wife closer to me ... instead, the more I did, the more she expected and she continued to move away from me.

I'm not telling you to divorce your husband. What I am STRONGLY suggesting, is that you discover and determine what kind of life you want to live ... for you ... not him.

I honestly think the sexual stuff is secondary at this point. You are very sexual, regardless of how that came into being. I don't feel compelled to question it any more than I feel compelled to question why he seems to be so sexually repressed.

It simply is. And by all appearances, has been this way since you met when you were teens.


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

JaLeRi said:


> Thanks I will try not to back down... its so hard I hate to fight, I think I am tired of this happening. I feel insecure about doing this because i don't know if I am making this up and being difficult.
> 
> As a child when I was sick my parents never believed me and sent me to school... the only time they believed I was ever sick was when I was puking... rest of the time I was just being a suck, dramatic. So as an adult I know that I always question how i truly feel about things, am I being dramatic? am I just being difficult? I never know if where I stand is on true ground or not...
> 
> I have so many people on here and my best friends telling me the same thing, and agreeing with me. I am starting to believe that i'm not just making this up... it is real, it really is a problem.


Just make sure you are fighting for the marriage, not him. It is not about one-upping one another but working for a common goal. 

Try to read some stuff about "Exit affairs" since you are starting University.(no offense)

What do your friends tell about your marriage?


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## JaLeRi (Jul 26, 2012)

warlock07 said:


> Just make sure you are fighting for the marriage, not him. It is not about one-upping one another but working for a common goal.
> 
> Try to read some stuff about "Exit affairs" since you are starting University.(no offense)
> 
> What do your friends tell about your marriage?


Friends felt I was taken for granted.

Husband and I had a big talk we are both going to make some changes my husband is going to find us a counselor next month when we start school.

I think we are headed in a good direction


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

Friends felt I was taken for granted.


That was the feeling I had from most of your posts too.


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

warlock07 said:


> The marriage is happy as long as you keep doing what he wants, right? He knows he does not have to change and might be taking things a little too granted. You just admire him too much. You almost seem subservient to a fault and your whole focus is only on your H(and the kids). You can only put on the happy facade only for so long before you break. I might have missed some posts but do you have any other hobbies ? While I don't advise on playing games, he needs to miss you to realize what he has right no. Maybe a temporary separation ? Discuss your relationship with any of your close female friends or relatives.
> 
> 
> I* know you strongly deny any chance of having an affair but attention can be a pretty powerful drug in an attraction starved marriage.(I'm sure you enjoyed the comments on your pics) You need not be evil, just weak willed or in a vulnerable position to have an affair or ONS. *I'll try to find some relavent threads from the CWI section. I'm saying this because things are still in a fixable state. Sooner or later , the resentment will become too big a barrier to fix the relationship. You need to identify the issues before you attempt to fix them. Sex is just one of them.


:iagree:

I full support this.


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

Jaleri, keep posting on TAM. I think you need it. Try General relationships section or the Ladies lounge. Keep discussing and postingh. It will definitely help you


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## A-hole (Jun 4, 2015)

He's a guy. He will do what he wants - he IS being the dominant one, by the way and in complete control of your sex life - as long as you let him. My suggestion to you is to stop assuming the submissive role and take charge. Stop complaining about how things aren't the way you want them to be and steer the scene the way you want it to go.


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## Annoymous (Jul 10, 2018)

I have had the exact same desires and internal issues. I found out that my husband made an ad that he never went through with posting, on Craigslist, for a blow job which made me stop in my tracks-that all this time he loves me so much, but sexually not so much. I’m not crazy after-all lol. Your story is a mirror to mine and I never thought in a million years he would do that. He too, was a virgin until we married which I thought was just from his faith, and is very conservative. Is it possible your man is asexual or even gay but won’t admit it to himself? Mine always seemed so against homosexuality as well. He is still my heart and the love of my life. Idk..but I do know exactly how this feels..going through it and married 16 years this August. He was also low in testosterone which we are now having treated. Doing more research I found all these indicators do typically point to that. Doesn’t mean he doesn’t love you or isn’t confused his own self.


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## MarriedTex (Sep 24, 2010)

Zombie alert!


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