# The truth is revealed



## lordfire00 (Jun 28, 2014)

Well this very early morning i had a very insightful talk with my wife finally, just from trying to understand why she didnt want me being affectionate with her. The truth is, she just wants to exist in the same house and same bed with me. That means- no affection, no intimacy, no sex, no saying i love u. She has built apparently lots of resentment towards me since we started having kids accoring to her.

That i had never took the initiative to plan things for us or even help her around the house or anything. That i would walk into the house after work and not say anything to her or anyone. She says she no longer has the desire to have sex with me, be intimate, with me, be affectionate with me or even say i love u. She says that is just fine existing with me in the same house and same bed.

She says that she has given me plenty of chances to make things better, showing me how to do things and i still wouldnt do them.

But she could not remember the efforts i took to try and make things better, or put up with her parentd living in and out of our house, disrespect me infront of her parents or sisters. She refuses to forgive me of any wrong doing that i have ever done. I have never, ever,ever cheated on her, emotionally abused her or even hit her. All i have done is love her to the core. She told me that this entire issue that i have with her is because she wont have sex with me. That when she would have sex with me, im a different person. She says that i need to talk to someone about how im feeling (therapist). She says that i have never given her time to herself (totally untrue). So the good things that i have done, have absolutely no creditbility with her. Everytime her parents would stay with us, she would become a different person. She says that i am irrogant, self centered. Since when does wanting affection, sex, intimacy ,and saying i love u become arrogant? She is no longer in-love with me, but loves me. She says she is not going to change how she feels at this point. That if i cant live just in exists with her, that i need to find someone else that will give that to me. So there it is, the entire truth is revealed. Her and i are both 36 yrs old. Me married at 22 yrs old. We dated for 5 months and then got married. We met online. 

Im gonna go talk to someone and based on want the therapist says, i will decide what to do. I love her alot, but she doesnt feel the same way as i do. Not once ever, has or had she said to me, thanku so much for putting up with my parents being here with us and i love u for it.

So, if u will, hit me with ur feedback (open arms)


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## Revamped (Jun 19, 2014)

It's time to pull the plug on the merry go round.

Both of you speak the Truth. The truth in your own versions, that is. So now it's time for some action. She told you her plan, doing nothing to create a better, happier marriage. Now it's your turn to counter that offer. Either you accept it or deny it. The choice is yours.

First of all the banter of accusations needs to stop. You feel you don't get enough affection from her. And you smother her. She feels you constantly harp on having sex, which turns her off. So she turns unaffectionate. And the cycle continues.

Second, I think you both need third party intervention. Someone trained to help you both see each other's side and employ techniques to communicate better. You're not "hearing" her anymore than she is you. Stalemate.

If your marriage is totally broke, then don't waste the time trying to fix it. Break the cycle.


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## Plan 9 from OS (Jul 13, 2012)

Hmmmm. Very hard to say if that is true or not. You just got ILYBNILWY plus what you perceive to be a marital history rewrite - or at least selective marital memory. IMHO, start looking at the possibility that your wife is cheating.


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## PhillyGuy13 (Nov 29, 2013)

You've been replaced. Have you dig a little to see if she is communicating with another man?

She's getting her physical needs met elsewhere, and is now making you out to be an ogre to justify herself in her mind.

There are threads in the Indidelity section that can tell you how to gather evidence to this.

Me? I wouldn't bother. She says she doesn't love you, doesn't want sex with you. I'd rather be alone than live with someone that says that. Notice she will still love in your house though, spend your money. People like your wife give women in general a bad name.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

lordfire00 said:


> She says that she has given me plenty of chances to make things better, showing me how to do things and i still wouldnt do them.


Did you do them or not?


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## lordfire00 (Jun 28, 2014)

I need not to hurt or feel sad first or even scared before i can pull plug. I told her i love her very much, that i want to be with her, and that i want her to want to be with me (in all the ways). I guess its time to get prescribed anti meds so i wont hurt and figure out from there. All i feel at this point from her is pure coldness. As a matter of fact, i blame this All on her parents being around. Mind u, when here parents were not staying with us, she was a different person, but according to her, shr just bit her toungue. So maybe i should pull plug.....??? Lotd of thinking to do


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## PhillyGuy13 (Nov 29, 2013)

In Absentia said:


> Did you do them or not?


Yes, what were the issues and did you work on them?

Also, how many kids/ ages, do both of you work, full time, part time?

And why are her parents with you and for how long?

What country do you live in?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## manfromlamancha (Jul 4, 2013)

And once again, is there a possibility that you have been replaced (at the very least emotionally) by another man ? Sure sounds like it.


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

From the other threads, I guess the problem is that you didn't support your wife enough when their parents were/are there... it must be rather tiring for her. Not sure why they are there, but, since they are there, resenting them is not the way to go.

Not sure how much you do in the household, but women don't particularly like to ask their man to do things... they just want to see the initiative. It's a big turn-off for them. Or maybe you do things so you can have sex... that's another big turn-off...


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## PhillyGuy13 (Nov 29, 2013)

In lieu of keeping one thread, it would be helpful to link other threads here, so people don't have to scour the website for history.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

PhillyGuy13 said:


> In lieu of keeping one thread, it would be helpful to link other threads here, so people don't have to scour the website for history.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


It only took me 20 seconds...


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## lordfire00 (Jun 28, 2014)

*Re: Re: The truth is revealed*



manfromlamancha said:


> And once again, is there a possibility that you have been replaced (at the very least emotionally) by another man ? Sure sounds like it.


I feel that u are right. I feel that i have been replaced by her best friend who is a gay guy.


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## lordfire00 (Jun 28, 2014)

*Re: Re: The truth is revealed*



In Absentia said:


> From the other threads, I guess the problem is that you didn't support your wife enough when their parents were/are there... it must be rather tiring for her. Not sure why they are there, but, since they are there, resenting them is not the way to go.
> 
> Not sure how much you do in the household, but women don't particularly like to ask their man to do things... they just want to see the initiative. It's a big turn-off for them. Or maybe you do things so you can have sex... that's another big turn-off...


The problem that has existed for a long time is, she lets her parents do whatever they want without my wife consulting me. My wife has remolded herself, to living with her parents.


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

lordfire00 said:


> The problem that has existed for a long time is, she lets her parents do whatever they want without my wife consulting me. My wife has remolded herself, to living with her parents.


Have you told her this? Did you put your foot down? Just trying to understand the dynamics...


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## PhillyGuy13 (Nov 29, 2013)

In Absentia said:


> It only took me 20 seconds...


Well bully for you. I'm on my phone not a laptop or tablet.

Good luck OP.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

PhillyGuy13 said:


> Well bully for you. I'm on my phone not a laptop or tablet.
> 
> Good luck OP.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I don't see many members posting links to their previous threads when they open a new one... maybe it should be made compulsory... for those on their mobile...


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## F-102 (Sep 15, 2010)

There may not be another man, per se, but there is the strong possibility that she woke up and realized that there is indeed life beyond you.

Perhaps she regrets getting married so young, and longs for the single party-girl life that she missed.


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## RV9 (Sep 29, 2014)

Cheater alert! Cheater alert!


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## lordfire00 (Jun 28, 2014)

*Re: Re: The truth is revealed*



F-102 said:


> There may not be another man, per se, but there is the strong possibility that she woke up and realized that there is indeed life beyond you.
> 
> Perhaps she regrets getting married so young, and longs for the single party-girl life that she missed.


She was a party girl before me. I think i was her actual first long term relationship. I dont feel depressed, or mad or anything, just sad and hurt. My parents, best friend, and cousin, and brother that know about myarriage problem all agree that althougj her parents do help us out, they create the problem. Well, her mind is in a different mode now, so now i ask myself, what next? What should i do next? Accept just existing and not actually lose her? Or find someone else?


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

I could not stay in a marriage without love or affection. If she is not willing to work with you, and you aren't willing to work on yourself, then what is left?


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## lordfire00 (Jun 28, 2014)

*Re: Re: The truth is revealed*



bandit.45 said:


> I could not stay in a marriage without love or affection. If she is not willing to work with you, and you aren't willing to work on yourself, then what is left?


I will be going to a therapist to help me,. At this point i feel alone.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

What is she going to do without your paycheck? 

How do you know her friend is really gay? We have had several marriages broken up by "gay"guys.


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## anchorwatch (Mar 5, 2012)

Am I right to read you've sat back and allowed her to make all these decisions about your family life without your input? Are you really now considering allowing her to decide that you're going to be celibate too?

I completely agree with Bandit. What's left?

Gay man friend? My a$$!!!


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## lordfire00 (Jun 28, 2014)

The things i helped her with and still do, were not for the sex. They were to hopefully make her see that i was trying and will to change for the sake of our marriage/relarionship.

She just saw of having sex with me to procreate and so there would not be any arguing with me.


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## lordfire00 (Jun 28, 2014)

She is a good mother and at the begining a good wife to me, but wow, how thimgs have changed.


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

LordFire

Make a plan. A long term plan that does not include her in it.

Slowly start to pull back and focus on you.

Slowly start to show your wife what her life will look like without you in it.

Judge her by her actions, not by her words.

And do not be afraid to plan a life without her in it. She might be a coward, a person too afraid to pull the plug on the marriage or be truly honest with you.

HM


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

happyman64 said:


> She might be a coward, a person too afraid to pull the plug on the marriage or be truly honest with you.
> 
> HM


She's been honest with him... she told him she is not interest in sex with him... they can live together in the house and share the bed like brother and sister... he's done something wrong, apparently... but he doesn't know what...


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## MachoMcCoy (Oct 20, 2014)

I've got good news and bad news. First the bad. They rarely come back once they fall out of love. Get used to life without her.

Now for the good news, which is REALLY good.



lordfire00 said:


> Her and i are both 36 yrs old.


You're only 36 and your wife had the decency to tell you this. You have your whole life ahead of you. I was almost 50 with three kids gearing up for college when I had to figure it out on my own. I was stuck. You're not. 

So, what are you going to do? Live another 50 years like this? Or are you going to take back your life. If the former, good luck to you. If the latter, start the 180. NOW. Just ignore the parts about her seeing a better you and coming back. It doesn't work that way. The 180 is for you and you alone. It's not for her. It's not for your marriage. The 180 all about you.

Wives checking out of marriages and blaming the husband. It's a freakin' epidemic, yet we still have posters starting threads like this. Like it came out of left field.

And to all of you that revert to "she's cheating" EVERY TIME...:banghead:

If a woman tells you she doesn't love you any more. Believe her.


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

> She's been honest with him... she told him she is not interest in sex with him... they can live together in the house and share the bed like brother and sister... he's done something wrong, apparently... but he doesn't know what...


That is not being honest. Rewriting the marriage is not being honest.

Her why's suck.

He can choose to accept them, he can choose to ignore them or better yet he can choose to do something about them.

I hope he chooses to act.


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## MachoMcCoy (Oct 20, 2014)

lordfire00 said:


> The things i helped her with and still do, were not for the sex. They were to hopefully make her see that i was trying and will to change for the sake of our marriage/relarionship.



She didn't see them. And if she did, she didn't care. She knows the real you is hiding under those changes you are trying to sell. 

She doesn't love you any more. Please accept that. Can't give you advice from the mess that is my marriage. But you need to understand this while making your decisions.


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## manfromlamancha (Jul 4, 2013)

lordfire00 said:


> I feel that u are right. I feel that i have been replaced by her best friend who is a gay guy.


She doesn't have sex with you - where is she getting this need fulfilled? Surely not from a gay guy?


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## MachoMcCoy (Oct 20, 2014)

lordfire00 said:


> I feel that i have been replaced by her best friend who is a gay guy.


DAMN!! Wrong again. Just when I work up the nerve to tell all you veterans "it's not always a new guy". And there he is.

He's not gay. Trust me on this.

But just because I was wrong on there being a replacement for you, I wasn't wrong about her falling out of love with you.


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

happyman64 said:


> That is not being honest. Rewriting the marriage is not being honest.
> 
> Her why's suck.
> 
> ...


why is it rewriting the marriage? People can fall out of love. The OP says she told him what to do. He didn't answer my question... i.e. if he wasn't happy about her parents being there - what did he do about it?

Yes, it sucks... if my wife told me she wasn't in love with me anymore, I would leave... what's there to save? Kids? Yes, maybe... but he is 36...


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

MachoMcCoy said:


> I was almost 50 with three kids gearing up for college when I had to figure it out on my own. I was stuck. You're not.


That, sadly, sounds very familiar...


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

I don't think there is another man... she is just overwhelmed... her parents and the kids are enough...


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## lordfire00 (Jun 28, 2014)

*Re: Re: The truth is revealed*



MachoMcCoy said:


> She didn't see them. And if she did, she didn't care. She knows the real you is hiding under those changes you are trying to sell.
> 
> She doesn't love you any more. Please accept that. Can't give you advice from the mess that is my marriage. But you need to understand this while making your decisions.


She told me stright out, shes not in-love with me anymore, but she does love me. She is fine with us existing, like her parents do, like my parents do. Except our marriages have been together for a much longer time. See what she is denyjng to her self is, with her parents being around all the time, there is no alone time for her, like there was when they were not here. And rather to admit that, she prefers without saying to just blame no alone time and lack of balance on me.


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## lordfire00 (Jun 28, 2014)

*Re: Re: The truth is revealed*



In Absentia said:


> I don't think there is another man... she is just overwhelmed... her parents and the kids are enough...


Yes to this. And she has always known that i have never like her parents staying with us. Her logic on somethings is backwards.


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## Satya (Jun 22, 2012)

A therapist will help you with your own progress and healing, but honestly a therapist isn't going to make a decision regarding your relationship for you. Maybe he/she give you a little more perspective (which is maybe what you want) but ultimately the final decision is yours. Do you really want to remain in a loveless relationship? Everyone deserves to be with a person who loves and adores them and doesn't have hang-ups about sex.


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

lordfire00 said:


> She told me stright out, shes not in-love with me anymore, but she does love me. She is fine with us existing, like her parents do, like my parents do. Except our marriages have been together for a much longer time. See what she is denyjng to her self is, with her parents being around all the time, there is no alone time for her, like there was when they were not here. And rather to admit that, she prefers without saying to just blame no alone time and lack of balance on me.


Bunch of baloney. 

She may have some affection for you. She may like you, but there is no love there. A wife who loved her husband would not do something like this to him. 

You have your faults. You probably did do things that contributed to her negative opinion of you, but that is all beside the point. She has unilaterally decided to break the marriage covenant by refusing affection and sex. 

My opinion? Demand she join you in intensive marriage counseling for the both of you. If she refuses, or counseling doesn't work, then see a lawyer.


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## Abc123wife (Sep 18, 2013)

lordfire00 said:


> Yes to this. And she has always known that i have never like her parents staying with us. Her logic on somethings is backwards.


Why are her parents living with you? How long have they been there? How much longer do they expect to be living there?

Does your wife work? Do her parents help to financially support the household while they live there? Does your Wife expect you to continue to support her and her parents if you leave (if it is just you supporting the household)?


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## lordfire00 (Jun 28, 2014)

*Re: Re: The truth is revealed*



Satya said:


> A therapist will help you with your own progress and healing, but honestly a therapist isn't going to make a decision regarding your relationship for you. Maybe he/she give you a little more perspective (which is maybe what you want) but ultimately the final decision is yours. Do you really want to remain in a loveless relationship? Everyone deserves to be with a person who loves and adores them and doesn't have hang-ups about sex.


I dont want a therapist to tell me what decision to make, just why is it hard for me to walk away if thats what i decide to do. How to not hurt as i do. How to be able to see the happjness that the future holds or awaits me. I think i in a way fell back in-love with her, and thats what is making it hard for me, but i dont know that for sure.


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## lordfire00 (Jun 28, 2014)

I think maybe, she has made her decision to just be with her parents and our of kids of course.

I didnt mention this. As far as the sex goes....per her - she has at all no desire for sex and god gave me a hand. I think shes resentful that she has no self-time (down side of having ur parents with you)


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## Satya (Jun 22, 2012)

lordfire00 said:


> I dont want a therapist to tell me what decision to make, just why is it hard for me to walk away if thats what i decide to do. How to not hurt as i do. How to be able to see the happjness that the future holds or awaits me. I think i in a way fell back in-love with her, and thats what is making it hard for me, but i dont know that for sure.


I completely understand, LordFire, but it's going to hurt no matter how well prepared you feel you are. I have found that time is a really good healing balm but you do have to go through some initial hurt in order to learn how to process your feelings, acknowledge them, and then carry the lessons forward into your future. I wish you the best of luck on that journey.


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## F-102 (Sep 15, 2010)

I have always contended that there are 7 deadly signs that a man's W is having an affair. She's already showing at least two of them. While I still don't necessarily think that there is a 3rd party involved (although that "gay" friend sounds suspicious), it may not be too far fetched to do a little detective work. 

Start looking through e-mails, Facebook posts, and her phone-especially if she texts a lot. Consider putting a VAR (voice activated recorder) in her car under the driver's seat. Look up a poster named "weightlifter" on this forum. He knows just what to do.


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## dubsey (Feb 21, 2013)

Why would you want to live like this? Co-existing is nothing more than being the best co-parents you could possibly be. You can do that without being married.

Find your happiness, and you'll be a better co-parent than living in your current state, You don't want to model this relationship for the kid(s) either.


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## happy as a clam (Jan 5, 2014)

Sounds to me like it's time to move the parents out and reclaim YOUR home for yourself.

Why are they there?

Whether you stay together and work it out or end up splitting, as a couple you deserve your own space to work through these tough issues. You shouldn't be footing the bill for the parents. I can almost guarantee that much of YOUR money is being spent by HER on THEM.

They are interfering in your life. Time for them to go.


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## WandaJ (Aug 5, 2014)

MachoMcCoy said:


> Wives checking out of marriages and blaming the husband. It's a freakin' epidemic, yet we still have posters starting threads like this. Like it came out of left field.
> 
> And to all of you that revert to "she's cheating" EVERY TIME...:banghead:
> 
> If a woman tells you she doesn't love you any more. Believe her.


"Wives checking out of marriages and blaming the husband." MachoMcCoy - in other threads you said how you were aggressive wtih your wife, how she had to walk on eggshells. And now, after you've lost her for good, you finally understand all the issues. But with thext like this, I am not sure you really do understand. You claiming that women just check out of marriages for no reason, and blame the guy. Do you really believe that this is how it works? All perfect husbands and icy cold wives?


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## lordfire00 (Jun 28, 2014)

Everbody, thanku again for ur advice and responses, i appreciate it very much. I agree that her parents shouldnt be there, i just no longer have the energy emotiomally or mentally to battle. I am drained to the core.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

You have been asked several times why her parents are there, how long, and how long they are supposed to stay?

Why can't you answer these questions?

Also, what kind of physical shape are the two of you in?


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## 6301 (May 11, 2013)

lordfire00 said:


> She was a party girl before me. I think i was her actual first long term relationship. I dont feel depressed, or mad or anything, just sad and hurt. My parents, best friend, and cousin, and brother that know about myarriage problem all agree that althougj her parents do help us out, they create the problem. Well, her mind is in a different mode now, so now i ask myself, what next? What should i do next? Accept just existing and not actually lose her? Or find someone else?


 Ask yourself this. Staying with her, what do you have. An emotional drone. Someone who doesn't really love you like a wife is supposed to. What she's telling you is that she's doing you a favor by being with you, not to mention that it's a whole lot easier then being on her own. 

Is that what you want? To come home every night and share everything with a woman who really doesn't
want to be there but is there only for her convenience and for that you should be grateful. 

I think you could do a lot better then settle for a morsel or two of crumbs.

If it was me, I would let her know that she's more then welcome to pack up and leave and then for good measure, I would bring her high and mighty ass back down to earth and let her know that she doesn't walk on water either and give her enough examples that she realizes it too.


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## As'laDain (Nov 27, 2011)

if your not willing to kick her parents out of the house and take back your marriage, then you go ahead and get that counselor. your going to need advice on how to detach from your wife and move on.


or, you could grow a pair and kick her parents out and fix your marriage. and tell your wife that she is either going to have to work with you to fall back in love or your going to be either A)making her as miserable as you feel, since thats what she seems to be doing, or B)leaving her because she gave up on forever.

but if your willing to leave, i cant fathom why you would not be willing to man up and try to fix your marriage first. your wife is playing the blame game. on top of that, she told you that she refuses to let you know that she loves you. but, of course she is lying to save face. BS. she does not love you. she wants you to sit around sad and miserable. 

actually, she wants you to be like her, but she doesnt understand what your actually feeling. if she felt it, she would be horrified. in her eyes, your just being annoying. 

if you want her to understand what its like, remove all financial support and kick her parents out. that will tell her that you dont care about her at all. tell her you love her and good you wish her good luck, and then walk away. then she would get it. then she would understand exactly what she is doing to you emotionally. but by then it would be too late. 


man up dude.


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## happy as a clam (Jan 5, 2014)

Chaparral said:


> You have been asked several times why her parents are there, how long, and how long they are supposed to stay?
> 
> Why can't you answer these questions?


:iagree:

OP, you have FOURTEEN other threads that are all some version or other of this one.

You're miserable, your wife treats you very poorly, you are at the bottom of her priority list, and she sees no reason to change anything.

It's time to stop wallowing and do something proactive to change your situation.

What are you going to do to move forward and stop being stuck in this limbo h*ll?

Personally, I would suggest that you stop starting new threads. Go back and read all of the advice already given to you in this thread plus the other fourteen, and therein you will find the answer (many times over) as to how to move out of this misery.


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## lordfire00 (Jun 28, 2014)

*Re: Re: The truth is revealed*



Chaparral said:


> You have been asked several times why her parents are there, how long, and how long they are supposed to stay?
> 
> Why can't you answer these questions?
> 
> Also, what kind of physical shape are the two of you in?


My wife originally asked me back in july if it was ok with me for her parents to stay with us for a couple months, until the heat settled where they live, cuz the heat was making her dad sick (he has lukemia).

It took me awhile to think about my decision, cuz i was worried about her changing her attitude with me if they came up. Well i said ok, cuz i was thinking it was gonna be for a short while. After they got here...like a couple weeks later, her dad got really sick and ended up in the hospital, and thats when things slowly started going downhill with us. I never imagined they would turn thid bad. Oh how i was so wromg.


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## lordfire00 (Jun 28, 2014)

*Re: Re: The truth is revealed*



As'laDain said:


> if your not willing to kick her parents out of the house and take back your marriage, then you go ahead and get that counselor. your going to need advice on how to detach from your wife and move on.
> 
> 
> or, you could grow a pair and kick her parents out and fix your marriage. and tell your wife that she is either going to have to work with you to fall back in love or your going to be either A)making her as miserable as you feel, since thats what she seems to be doing, or B)leaving her because she gave up on forever.
> ...


Yes, she has over powered me somehow....but im gonna need the therapist to help me find myself again. To help me restrengthen.

The fact that she is not really a sensitive person makes it really hard. I dont even sleep good at night anymore. She doesnt really have time alone anymore cuz her parents are with us ....and she has raised her standards of a relationship. She wants someone that can take charge and take care of her...and she forgets that she is the kind of person that is very very picky on things like that. It all has to be perfect.


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## lordfire00 (Jun 28, 2014)

*Re: Re: The truth is revealed*



happy as a clam said:


> :iagree:
> 
> OP, you have FOURTEEN other threads that are all some version or other of this one.
> 
> ...


I start new threads so things dont seem complicated.


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## Catherine602 (Oct 14, 2010)

Let us see here. You are supporting this household and you are the one being treated like sh!t? The in-laws have a lot of balls criticizing the hand that feeds them. How ungrateful. I wonder what they would all do if you decided to pull the plug. 

In fact, why not get a temp separation to cool things off. Perhaps they will appreciate what they have. At any rate, you have to try to reconnect with your strength. It will be hard but not any harder than what you are living now. There is no reason for you to be treated this way.


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## lordfire00 (Jun 28, 2014)

Part of what makes it hard dealing with my wife is she rely doesnt show her emotions, except if its that she is annoyed or whatever. As one of use said is right. She is no longer acting as a wife towards me. Im just a doormat at this point. She has killed my self esteem. She has killed my identity. Im not depressed anymore, im just sad. Sad about the situation and how harsh she has become.


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## Revamped (Jun 19, 2014)

lordfire00 said:


> My wife originally asked me back in july if it was ok with me for her parents to stay with us for a couple months, until the heat settled where they live, cuz the heat was making her dad sick (he has lukemia).
> 
> It took me awhile to think about my decision, cuz i was worried about her changing her attitude with me if they came up. Well i said ok, cuz i was thinking it was gonna be for a short while. After they got here...like a couple weeks later, her dad got really sick and ended up in the hospital, and thats when things slowly started going downhill with us. I never imagined they would turn thid bad. Oh how i was so wromg.


Did it ever occur to you that she's watching her father DIE right in front of her? And you're wondering why she has no interest in playing with you?

You really are starting to sound like an insensitive prick.


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## Catherine602 (Oct 14, 2010)

You have just one thing to do to turn this around. Don't depend upon your wife for emotional support. Decrease her importance in your life. Your wife cannot be trusted to support you. Don't depend on her for anything. Start separating your sense of yourself from her judgement. I am serious about a physical separation. You need to regroup. Do you have anyone who can offer you support while you change your focus from your wife?


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## As'laDain (Nov 27, 2011)

ok, well, if you really want to strengthen, then start thinking and acting like you are already strong. 

its not that complicated. act exactly like the person you want to be. you will run into situations where you will want to put yourself back into the victim chair, but that should NOT stop you from picking yourself up again and getting right back at it. over time, the slip ups wont feel like such huge failures anymore. forgive yourself your shortcomings and get back to being the man you always wanted to be. 

seriously, WHAT do you have to lose? the next time your in laws take her time away from you, tell them that you are stealing your wife away for a moment. randomly walk up to her and grab her face and kiss her. hell, do it in front of her parents. set some time for just you and her and tell her parents that this is time you set for you and your wife and they WILL give you some space to connect. then take her out and do something fun. 

if she gets pissed off at you for it, laugh at her. tell her that you dont care of she wants to get all pissy now, you want to have a WIFE! not a room mate!


i mean, if you wanted a room mate, then why not move out and get a room mate to pay half the bills. then at least you could have a girlfriend who WILL show you love. 


seriously dude, WHAT do you have to lose? if she is so dead set on not loving her, then let HER decide to walk away. but dont take it sitting down. your marriage is on a fast road to divorce. her parents are not helping your marriage. you need to get them OUT or find time to get your wife away from them.


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## Catherine602 (Oct 14, 2010)

Revamped said:


> Did it ever occur to you that she's watching her father DIE right in front of her? And you're wondering why she has no interest in playing with you?
> 
> You really are starting to sound like an insensitive prick.


Yes but her husband is still alive. He seems loving and caring enough to help her through her grief.


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

lordfire00 said:


> I will be going to a therapist to help me,. At this point i feel alone.



Alone is not necessarily a bad thing.

Is she working outside the house? It could well be she likes to be in the house for room and board.

The parent issue is not likely a real issue unless you're from cultures that treat parents differently - like a lot of Asian cultures. Western parents generally don't get caught in the middle.


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## As'laDain (Nov 27, 2011)

i dont get this separation thing. he doesnt need to separate from her. he needs to stop questioning himself. his feelings are completely legitimate and he doesnt need to move away from her. 

watching her parents die is not an excuse for tearing her marriage apart. you know where that will land her?

completely devastated when she loses her father and then realizes that she pushed her husband away. FVCK THAT NONSENSE!

dude, you need to reconnect with her. her apprehensions and resenments be damned, she NEEDS to feel connected to someone. and it needs to be you.


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## Revamped (Jun 19, 2014)

Apparently, you've never cared for a terminal person before...

May you never have such a sadness in your life...


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## As'laDain (Nov 27, 2011)

Revamped said:


> Apparently, you've never cared for a terminal person before...
> 
> May you never have such a sadness in your life...


bull crap. you dont let your family fall apart, especially when things are tough.


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## lordfire00 (Jun 28, 2014)

For the record, my grandfathr recently passed away. And some yrs ago, a close uncle passed away. So i know what its like.


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## As'laDain (Nov 27, 2011)

lordfire00, i went back and read some of your threads. 

ok, first of all, you talk like your depressed. i mean, everything is all negative, there is no hope, marriage is over, wife doesnt love me, suicide, nothing works, etc etc etc. 


but i also get the impression that you are quite passive aggressive. so, you do something, expect your wife to act a certain way, and get upset and start to build resentment when she doesnt act the way you want. 

you know what? i can see why your wife doesnt want to be intimate with you. your probably confusing the crap out of her. i mean, if you do something nice for her and then get upset later, without telling her why and what it is you wanted from her, then wouldnt it come naturally that she would learn to not trust you? 


you need to wake up and stop blaming your wife for not being able to read your mind. you need to start MAKING time for the two of you. please dont tell me you would rather wait things out and continue to build resentment until the day that you decide to divorce... 

MAKE TIME FOR THE TWO OF YOU! if that means you have to hire a baby sitter once a week, do it. 

another thing... STOP doing all the lovey dovy things you do. like give her a massage. all your doing is fueling this resentment and making yourself look incredibly weak.
see how it works? you give her the world expecting her to give it back, she doesnt. then you get upset. then you give her the world. and she does not reciprocate. now your really upset and resentment builds. and yet, instead of breaking this vicious cycle, you let it go on and on until you hate her, all the while trying to be the perfect husband, at face value. 

why on earth are you doing that? i mean, how is it working out for you? 


now, the issue with the gay friend is going to have to be addressed. if i were you, i would get ahold of those text messages where she talks about how stupid and clueless you are and save them. you will need them later when you address it. but seriously, you need to work on you. she is only treating you as bad as you are treating yourself. 

ill say it again, man up dude.
your pissing in your own cherios.


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## MachoMcCoy (Oct 20, 2014)

This has noting to do with the parents. She doesn't love him any more.


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## firebelly1 (Jul 9, 2013)

lordfire00 said:


> I think maybe, she has made her decision to just be with her parents and our of kids of course.
> 
> I didnt mention this. As far as the sex goes....per her - she has at all no desire for sex and god gave me a hand. I think shes resentful that she has no self-time (down side of having ur parents with you)


She has had no desire for sex ever? From you comment about her thinking sex is just for procreation and this, I'm wondering if the sex has ever been what you want in the marriage. In which case, 1) she is blaming her low sex drive on you and 2) the two of you are sexually incompatible and that by itself is reason not to stay.


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## MachoMcCoy (Oct 20, 2014)

lordfire00 said:


> She told me straight out, shes not in-love with me anymore...


PLEASE listen to your wife when she says something like this. It's not an act.


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## lordfire00 (Jun 28, 2014)

Thanks for the responses again. I have to find my power again to feel better first.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Revamped said:


> Apparently, you've never cared for a terminal person before...
> 
> May you never have such a sadness in your life...


Yes because sh!tting on your spouse is beyond reasonable if your mom or dad is dying.:scratchhead:


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## lordfire00 (Jun 28, 2014)

*Re: Re: The truth is revealed*



Lila said:


> Lordfire:
> 
> I too have gone back and read all off your other threads, and just to recap:
> 
> ...


I make more than my wife, but that doesnt matter. Ive become extremely resentful because, she is a totally different person when her parents would be around and that i havr been placed on the back burner. 
I know her father is not well, but hes walking, talking etc....he just cant do heavy stuff anymore. 

This morning we got into a little argument again because apparently i followed her uostairs and asked her why she didnt just lay in bed for a few mins like she did before. See what im talking about? Basically, ive become the doormat for all frustration and irritation that everyone else is causing her, and im paying the price. I told her on a side note, i rather her plan things like vacations or events or whatever, cause she is better at doing that than me. I gave her i strong compliment. I have always, always supported her and complimented her in the things she does. All i ask in return is, affection, her love, sex, affirmation...the good stuff. Thats what drives my motivation, nothing else does. There is no privacy in my house anymore, and it has driven me crazy. I have slowly started to back off...and not talk to her much now.
I told her earlier when we were arguing, that she is starting to push me away, and her response (of course from anger or whatever was *good*). She told me before, that whenever she doesnt have sex with me and gives me affection, that i start having an attitude and act the way i have been acting, in other words, thati cant function without it. Well those are needs that motivate me. If she knows that these things are key to making me a great person emotionally, why cant she fullfill this, so i can take care of everything that would help her 100%.... Because she herself doesnt need these things to function, she feels that there is no need to give me these things so im a happy person. But, she would always expect me to rub her feet, give her a massage, do a whole bunch of house besides the regular, and be ahead of the game in everything. This is my argument. Give me what gived me power and motivation and makes me feel her love, and i take care of everything. No arguments, no questioning, no insecurities, nothing. But, she sees and feels different about it.


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## As'laDain (Nov 27, 2011)

ok.... 

i want you to try something... laugh. 

take a good hard look at yourself and laugh. just look at how ridiculous your situation is. isnt it crazy? laugh, and dont stop laughing until your stomach is hurting. 

there is a reason why you need to laugh. you need to get out of your own head. your sabotaging all your efforts. 

now, AFTER you get done laughing, plan some time for just you and your wife. plan out a date, where your going to go, where you will eat, and who is watching the kids and such. set it all up. if you start to get discouraged, get back to laughing. i dont care what you have to do in order to laugh, take a shot of whiskey, hold a pencil in your mouth and look in the mirror, act like a thirteen year old girl while videotaping yourself just so you feel incredibly silly, who cares. just LAUGH!

make sure you take care of everything so that your wife doesnt have anything to worry about. then tell her you are taking her out for a date. 

i have felt and thought the same way you are before. i had to get a bit crazy to get myself out of that rut. so get crazy and LAUGH. dont sulk, dont get all upset, LAUGH. then get back to business. 


you need to do something to change the way you FEEL so that you can be the person you want to be. and laughing at the ridiculously pathetic and sad situation your in is as good a place to start as any. you NEED to start taking charge of your marriage. in order to do that, you need to gain control of how you feel. laughing is probably one of the easiest and quickest ways to learn how to do that. 

do you think you can do that?


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## anchorwatch (Mar 5, 2012)

lordfire,

I hope that before this marriage ends, you might figure out that whining about the lack of sex will never get you laid. Whinny men are not sexually attractive to women!!!

How clueless can one be? She told you she wants you to take the reins when it comes to planning and all you can say to her is she does it better? Are you that lazy? Or is it you won't step up when she ask for something unless you get something? I don't know what is is. I do know if you won't change nothing will change.

Did you even attempt to read any of the books recommended to the men here?


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## Hopeful Cynic (Apr 27, 2014)

lordfire00 said:


> She told me before, that whenever she doesnt have sex with me and gives me affection, that i start having an attitude and act the way i have been acting, in other words, thati cant function without it. Well those are needs that motivate me. If she knows that these things are key to making me a great person emotionally, why cant she fullfill this, so i can take care of everything that would help her 100%.... Because she herself doesnt need these things to function, she feels that there is no need to give me these things so im a happy person. But, she would always expect me to rub her feet, give her a massage, do a whole bunch of house besides the regular, and be ahead of the game in everything. This is my argument. Give me what gived me power and motivation and makes me feel her love, and i take care of everything. No arguments, no questioning, no insecurities, nothing. But, she sees and feels different about it.


You are caught in the classic trap of poor negotiation. You say "I would be XYZ if you did ABC." and she says "I would do ABC if you would be XYZ." and you both feel you have communicated what the problem is and wonder why it isn't automatically solved when neither of you are actually doing the ABC or XYZ to get things started, but waiting for the other person to start first.

There was a thread recently about sex as a chore, and I think that this is one of your major issues. You perform chores, and expect sex in return. That makes her think that sex is yet another chore on the list. It devalues her as a desirable being. You also give her the impression that sex makes you happy, and when you are unhappy, it's her fault for not having sex with you. So she feels that you are putting all the responsibility for your own happiness on her. How desirable does it make her feel that you only come to her for sex when you are unhappy?

I could be overgeneralizing here, but in my limited experience, women want sex after they are already happy, and men want sex to make them happy. And look at your wife's life! She's got a few major things making her very unhappy. The only suggestions I have for you are to do research on caregiver burnout, and maybe hire a cleaning service to ease that burden from both of you.


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## lordfire00 (Jun 28, 2014)

Before i do anything, anything at all, i have to get my mind,thought, body and emotions stable again. What am i going to do? See a therapist and go from there.


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## lordfire00 (Jun 28, 2014)

Just to give a quick example of how my wife is, i text her about going to marriage counseling, and no reply.


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## Revamped (Jun 19, 2014)

Maybe she's tired of your whiny ass.

I know I am.


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## As'laDain (Nov 27, 2011)

lordfire00 said:


> Just to give a quick example of how my wife is, i text her about going to marriage counseling, and no reply.


thats pretty judgmental dude. i mean, did you know what your wife is doing when you texted her? was she busy? was she listening to music trying to calm her nerves down? did she forget to charge her phone? 

how on earth is that an example of "how she is"? but you know what, lets assume for a second that she is purposely ignoring you... why would she do that? you and your wife had a good relationship once right?

did you always paint her actions in a negative light or is this a recent thing? seems to me that if you text her and get no reply, and decide that the only logical explanation is that she is ignoring you, she might as well just ignore you. she is going to be treated like she did anyway. 

this stuff tells me that you really dont know her at all, but you think you do. your assumption is that you know what she is thinking. if you REALLY knew what she is thinking, you would know how to get her to show you some love. but you treat her like she never will. 

dont ask her about counseling anymore. YOU need to get YOURSELF into some counseling. your painting her in a very bad light right now, but its becoming quite obvious that YOU are making it worse. 

its like you expect her to be your lover while you have made her your enemy. :scratchhead:


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

It's a variety of FWB, called EWB...

When you're in such a situation it's not ticket science to predict your partners behavior, response, actions, etc. to any issue. 

Calling your partner out on unacceptable behavior is whining only if you make it whining. It's not likely to have an effect in any case so why bother?

State your position and if it needs to be confrontation make it so in a civilized way. No reason to make it reality TV material. State your position and see what happens. Try to deep dig into your partner's psyche to get your answers.


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## lordfire00 (Jun 28, 2014)

If im sounding whiney, my bad. Thats not what my effortd are at. Its basically, this..she doesnt show her emotions for one thing, and she doesnt really talk about her emotions or whats shes feeling. This is what makes it hard to deal with. 
Well...i guess giving her some space and me going to coumseling is currently the answer for now. What i have learned is, having elderly parents live with u, is very very stressful...and what gets me is, her sister and sisters husband dont deal with this. Im just praying to the almighty for help at this point.


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## lordfire00 (Jun 28, 2014)

If i knew marriage was gonna be like this, never would i have married. And the only reason we got married in the first place was, her parents would not let us live together otherwise. I think our lives would have been much different


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## anchorwatch (Mar 5, 2012)

Life and marriage is what you make it. You don't let others make it for you.


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## anchorwatch (Mar 5, 2012)

Did you read MMSL?


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## happy as a clam (Jan 5, 2014)

lordfire00 said:


> And the only reason we got married in the first place was, her parents would not let us live together otherwise.


Huh?? :wtf:

Since when do PARENTS get to call the shots for their grown children?

Are you really that afraid of her parents?

First you cower to their demands that you can't live together before marriage, and now they pile into YOUR home and you're too scared to tell them to get out.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## lordfire00 (Jun 28, 2014)

One other thing for talk sake. Lets suppose i do have an obsession with her (wife). I dont have any idea how this came about. But i dont believe i am....im actually starting to try and meditate to relax my mind and bring myself slowly and forcefully to a better state. Man, how i miss the way we were at this time last year. Things were fairly good...


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

happy as a clam said:


> Huh?? :wtf:
> 
> 
> 
> Since when do PARENTS get to call the shots for their grown children?



After I have spent a quarter of a million dollars on each of my daughters you better believe I get to call some shots...

Living together is not in my list of things I would accept readily...


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## As'laDain (Nov 27, 2011)

lordfire00, what are YOU capable of doing?

you keep mentioning a whole bunch of crap that you have no control over. you cant dictate how your wife feels, so dont try. hell, i dont think you can correctly interpret how your wife feels, so dont try. 

DO try action on your part and honest communication. stop shooting yourself in the foot.


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## MachoMcCoy (Oct 20, 2014)

lordfire00 said:


> I feel that i have been replaced by her best friend who is a gay guy.


Odd that this was barely touched on once or twice. :scratchhead:


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## alexm (Nov 29, 2008)

MachoMcCoy said:


> I've got good news and bad news. First the bad. They rarely come back once they fall out of love. Get used to life without her.
> 
> Now for the good news, which is REALLY good.
> 
> ...


I like this post, a lot. Says everything that needs to be said, and in a kind, but blunt way.

It's true - once one person says it out loud, it's over. I thought my ex wife could be won back, too. And I see it time and time again here on TAM. It never happens that way, and it's usually a blessing in disguise.

Look at it this way - you two are 36, married for ~14 years and have kids together. She's had a long time to figure this out. Do you think she'd have said the same thing if there were no kids? Or do you think she'd have walked out that door by now? I think the latter.

Listen, if it makes you feel any better, the situation with my ex wife and I was similar (minus the kids). Together about 14 years started dating very young, split up in our early 30's. My ex wife said similar things to me over the years, hints if you will, which I apparently did not listen to, even though I thought I did. I got almost the same speech at the end, except instead of sticking around and existing in the same house, she was gone. But the wording and the sentiment was the same - no longer in love, no longer attracted to you, etc etc etc.

I felt I had been a good husband and did all I could do to make her happy. She disagreed. I can't argue with that, those are HER feelings. This news came out of left field to me, too. But in retrospect, it had been building up over a long time. Perhaps her expectations were too high, perhaps my awareness of the situation was way off.

Last thing - to me, relationships that start early in life are a thousand times more difficult to maintain as you get older. There are definitely success stories and couples who live happily ever after when they start dating in their teens or early 20's. But I'd venture to say far more of them end by the time the couple has hit their 30's.

The fact is, people change a LOT during this time period, and that's okay. People also change a lot in their 30's, 40's, 50's and beyond. But generally speaking, people do the bulk of their learning and growing up prior to 30. I actually feel like I grew up with my ex wife. Her and I were inseparable for a long time, the best of friends, great lovers, passionate, everything. But things change, needs change, life changes. It's incredibly easy to get caught up with somebody based on the amazing past you two had together, as was my case.

By the end of our 14 years together, neither of us were recognizable as our former selves. As in 'not the same person' at all. Had we met in our late 20's or early 30's, we probably wouldn't have been attracted to each other in the least.

Case in point, the woman I am now married to was my first girlfriend (and I her first boyfriend), back when we were in high school. 3 years together back then. We met up again later in life, and hit it off incredibly well. Thing is, she is almost unrecognizable to me as the girl I used to date, and vice versa. Both of our personalities are markedly different, we look different, we act and react differently to things, everything. We honestly might as well be completely new people to each other, and in fact, we are. Obviously we broke up way back then, but had we stayed together, we almost definitely would have grown apart as my ex wife and I did, and you and your wife have. It would have been inevitable. Luckily, we gained all our experience apart from each other, and we've been able to connect now as a result, as opposed to harboring years worth of resentment and changing attitudes and all that fun stuff.


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

yep, we got together when we were 22... we grew up together, really, but also grew slowly apart with time...


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## Lostinthought61 (Nov 5, 2013)

you shall here the truth and the truth shall set you free....

hear is the thing lordfire...you think that by changing "you" however you want to define "changing you" that she will come around to loving you, and so you try it over and over and over agin...maybe she will love me if i do this or that...and after all that you still see no change in her feelings for you...that my friend is the definition of insanity....the outcome is still the same, do not think that she will suddenly have an epiphany and wake up and realize how much she loves you and misses you, those work only in movies..in reality any change in her behavior will take years and that is just a gamble...this is your life, not your wife's...is this how you want to spend it....coming back each year after year telling us the changes you make in yourself to have her fall in love with you again, and how she still doesn't show it? you are depriving yourself of actually meeting someone who wants you, and you want them...sometimes you really can't have what you want...no matter how strongly you wish for it. you can't force someone to love you...sometimes you just need to walk away from a relationship.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

lordfire00 said:


> Thanks for the responses again. I have to find my power again to feel better first.


No, actually, you need to make a plan. Then you feel better AFTER. If your plan includes staying married, you need to dissect what she tells you about why she's unhappy. YOU may feel it's not fair or reasonable or even correct, but it IS what SHE feels. So unless you want to find yourself divorced, you'll listen to her side.

And FTR, are you sure her friend is gay?


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## happy as a clam (Jan 5, 2014)

john117 said:


> After I have spent a quarter of a million dollars on each of my daughters you better believe I get to call some shots...
> 
> *Living together is not in my list of things I would accept readily..*.


Sorry John, I usually agree with your POV, but this one has me stymied...

You CHOSE to have children (sorry if it costs you half a million dollars to RAISE them -- I am spending nearly that much on my two kids' college ALONE -- never mind what I spent to raise them from birth to age 18)

But you CHOSE to have these children... they didn't ASK to be born to you...

If you're going to LORD all the money you spent on raising them in childhood so you could DICTATE what they do in adulthood... I'm sorry, but we're 180 degrees on that.

You don't GET to dictate what adults do, just because you think you have a vested interest.

We turn our children loose,"clip their wings" so to speak at age 18. We hope our life lessons have made an impression. Sure, we're still involved in their lives, BUT THEIR NOT *OUR* LIVES TO LEAD. It's not OUR place (just as it wasn't our parents' place before us) to DICTATE how they spend their adult years. Sure, you can "cut them off" financially because they aren't "behaving" as you want them to, but can you really tell an ADULT what to do?!

If you would "cut them off" because they are living with someone who they love and who makes them happy, well, I just feel sorry for your dynamics, all equated to a monetary "equation". 

We all hope our kids will do what WE want them to do. But we're all given free-will for a reason.

Your post about dictating your daughter's lives, because you spent money raising them, made me feel sad...

OP... sorry for the slight threadjack...


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

I don't object to the living together part from a moral standpoint - but from a practical one. Hell, I lived with their mom for 2 years before marrying.

But, as part of spending said $$$ there are things that I will be paying for till they're 27-28 years old. Medical school for one 

A live in anything is a distraction if you're in a high pressure high stakes anything and your live in is not a fellow med student. At $40k/year expense to me, that's not too much to ask.

Once they're done with their 10+ year each journeys and they're on their own financially they could go live in a free love commune for all I care. 

My experience as a 10+ year college student says that it's too easy to be distracted by a live in and drop out or blow your studies. No morality issues. If someone bestows upon thee a quarter mil I would think they understand


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## nuclearnightmare (May 15, 2013)

Lordfire:

I have some more good news for you. I have a hunch that there just might be a better woman out there for you. Only you can consider that one in depth - you know her better than any of us. is it possible you have shown her more love and respect than she has actually earned??


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## Blossom Leigh (Mar 27, 2014)

lordfire00 said:


> If im sounding whiney, my bad. Thats not what my effortd are at. Its basically, this..she doesnt show her emotions for one thing, and she doesnt really talk about her emotions or whats shes feeling. This is what makes it hard to deal with.
> Well...i guess giving her some space and me going to coumseling is currently the answer for now. What i have learned is, having elderly parents live with u, is very very stressful...and what gets me is, her sister and sisters husband dont deal with this. Im just praying to the almighty for help at this point.


She doesn't trust you... therefore, she self protects.

A woman who trusts her man with her emotions lets them flow freely.

Therefore, if you can't learn how to not shut down a woman, it's not going to matter who the woman is. The story will remain the same...

So, the advice to go fix yourself and get your eyes off your wife's paper and put them on your own... is spot on.


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

I would hope the woman - or man - filters his / her emotions by quite a bit before letting said emotions run wild on me.

Emotions are useful but they're very easy to overload often with no good results...


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## Blossom Leigh (Mar 27, 2014)

john117 said:


> I would hope the woman - or man - filters his / her emotions by quite a bit before letting said emotions run wild on me.
> 
> Emotions are useful but they're very easy to overload often with no good results...



I'm referring to constructive exchanges, so yes, filtered appropriately, but feels safe to share. Thats on me for not making that clear.


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

It's a good clarification. People find their "soulmate" and think they found a therapist...

I don't bother my wife with a lot of emotionally draining issues - but everything her side (a) becomes drama instantly and (b) is on me to resolve.

My older girl - mostly like mom, a drama queen. The younger... Mostly like me. I think I got more drama than a dozen ancient tragedies... So maybe I'm over drama'd...


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## sidney2718 (Nov 2, 2013)

john117 said:


> After I have spent a quarter of a million dollars on each of my daughters you better believe I get to call some shots...
> 
> Living together is not in my list of things I would accept readily...


I hear you, but if they are legally adults there is not much you can do.

My personal belief is that adult children will listen to you on important issues ONCE IN A WHILE. Don't waste your chances. Save the advice until it is really very very important to you.

Living together is, fortunately or not, normal in today's environment.


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

It's not the living together part that's the issue - it's the playing family and getting complacent before completing studies. They could be married by Grand Ayatollah Billy Bob for all I know.

See, the wife and I took that route. At 25, both with graduate degrees and planning doctorates, when the sirens of salary, normal life, and so on started calling us. Like stupid, we both listened. Ten years later we realized that we really should go back to school. And we did. With a toddler and a baby born in the middle of the semester (fall break at least). We were both late 30's when we received our phd's and it was a lot easier than I thought - 10 years in the industry made me a lot smarter than at 25 - but not a good idea in the grand scheme of things. Graduating at 40 killed any chances of a decent teaching position...


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## TRy (Sep 14, 2011)

lordfire00 said:


> I feel that u are right. I feel that i have been replaced by her best friend who is a gay guy.


 Her best friend is not gay. He is bi. As a first step in stealing her from you, he used his so called friendship with your wife to turn her against you. He is now or will be her lover.


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## nuclearnightmare (May 15, 2013)

MachoMcCoy said:


> I've got good news and bad news. First the bad. They rarely come back once they fall out of love. Get used to life without her.
> 
> Now for the good news, which is REALLY good.
> 
> ...



:iagree:

of course I also tend to think that if a husband says it, he also means it and his wife's best course it to take him at his word.

a couple more (nearly) random thoughts. VERBAL communication, on anything and everything that is important, is a requirement of marriage. A spouse unable to do that should be considered very divorceable, early on....
the nonverbal stuff is fine, but it can't take the place of actually SAYING what is on one's mind.

finally - to BELIEVE is to act. I think people that receive the ILYBINILWY or similar speech should consider starting their pursuit of their next partner the following day! not kidding...even if its just checking out the eharmony website or something. the quicker you get going with that the better you will feel, and if the spouse that is "done" has any interest in rekindling anything  that will get their attention. if it doesn't, take that as the best evidence possible that there is nothing else you could have done....


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## nuclearnightmare (May 15, 2013)

As'laDain said:


> thats pretty judgmental dude. i mean, did you know what your wife is doing when you texted her? was she busy? was she listening to music trying to calm her nerves down? did she forget to charge her phone?
> 
> how on earth is that an example of "how she is"? but you know what, lets assume for a second that she is purposely ignoring you... why would she do that? you and your wife had a good relationship once right?
> 
> ...


his story comes accross so different to me, than this. Maybe there are 2 separate camps here on what we think is going on.
has she not essentially told him that 'I won't be a real wife to you, but we can still be friends and take care of our kids and my parents.' she has offered him a deal that is a non-starter, so-called. Not somethng any self-respecting man should consider. and sounds like he knows that self-respect is something he needs to regain.

Lordfire - how do you get along with your FIL? is he a nice guy? If I were in your shoes and was feeling down, I might consider reaching out to him, showing some increased compassion to him given he is suffering from illness. At the same time I'd tell your wife that opposite sex friends don't sleep together; tell her to find somewhere else in your home to sleep. After what she has said to you how can you stand to have her next to you at night??


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

lordfire, have you read Married Man Sex Life Primer yet? You need to read it, like yesterday. And then read No More Mr Nice Guy. She doesn't want affection from or with you because you have turned into a eunuch. You aren't manly any more. Women have to have the hots for men to want to spend time with them. Stop giving her footrubs. Start doing things and expecting her to go with you. Start enjoying your life with or without her so that she can start to fear losing you. And read the damn books!


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## happy as a clam (Jan 5, 2014)

Lila said:


> There are 13 other threads with similar feel to them.


At some point, seeking advice just becomes whining and malingering. Nothing wrong with just wanting a place to vent, but at least be honest.

*Tell us you're not looking for advice per se, just need to unload.*

It's hard to keep giving advice when no one is taking it.

After 13 threads of superb advice, I see where NONE has been taken.


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## nuclearnightmare (May 15, 2013)

Lordfire:

no emotional intimacy, no physical intimacy - what exactly is it about her that is worth suffering over? worth fighting for?

are you capable/able to leave her; separate from her? that's the best suggestion I've seen posted on this thread. yes it's too bad she's under so much pressure and that you guys have 4 young children. but I think you really have to act based on what she told you. let her know (by your actions) that you will be there for your kids, maybe even for her poor father if he needs you, but that you're done 'being there' for her. maybe suggest she go find her gay friend for that.


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## Revamped (Jun 19, 2014)

But, but, but...

Where's the drama in THAT???

If lil Mr Lordfire can't quietly seethe over perceived notions that his wife is out to destroy him, what good is paranoia?

Oh nooooos....


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## Lonely&frustrated (Jan 27, 2013)

Time and time again we see why all of us get so frustrated as I have been. There has been a lot of good advice on here and some bad. You married her and things were great, had children and life seemed good, then there came some bumps along with bitterness and resentment and you tried talking about it with no good results. She may say she's not in love with you and that may be true but I beg to differ, she's not in love with the person she and you have become. Have you both forgotten what love is? You don't do things for each other to get something in return. You do things because you have compassion about the other persons needs, even if it means it makes you work alot and may not get the results you were hoping for, you try and try and give until your last breath. If you are trying with all your heart and soul I guarantee you won't be disappointed. With that being said, you need to study your partner so you know exactly what THEIR needs are, and do it the way THEY like, not how you think it should be. We all believe that what we are doing is the right thing, because after all its what WE feel is right. You could be the most sincere, kind hearted person and still not do the right thing. Love is not a chore but its the hardest thing to accomplish but the most rewarding. She may never be able to tell you what her needs are perfectly, but when she see's that she feels safe letting her heart open up with you again she will let you in and want to be with you.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## kennethk (Feb 18, 2014)

The Gay friend is a big problem. She is leaning on his shoulder for emotional support. You've got to get rid of this guy. He may not be "fully" gay if you know what I mean.

My wife had a best gay friend for 12 years. I didn't know about TAM and all posted here. Happiest day of my life was when he moved from our area. He self destructed and I have clearly told wife there is no room for a third person in our marriage. As far as i can tell, there's been NC and we are doing much better.

12 years... I had to get into my own things since i had lots of time to myself - she would spend hours talking to him on the phone and then days together (we all worked at the same place). I hated it but didnt want to break up a family over it.

If I knew then what I know now, he would have been out the door. Only problem is i think she would have been hot on his heels.

Nuke the Gay friendship ASAP. He is probably adding fuel to the fire.


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## ifweonly (Feb 27, 2014)

alexm said:


> I like this post, a lot. Says everything that needs to be said, and in a kind, but blunt way.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


My wife and I are one of those early marriage couples living "Happily Ever After". I agree that we all change but we have found the key to accepting change is co-m-m-u-n-i-c-a-t-i-o-n. I am not always right and neither is she but if we cannot comprise then we do agree to "Not Agree" and then drop the issue. 

If there is any hope for the OM, it would most definitely include MC for both. He needs to stop complaining and seriously grow a pair and right now his wife doesn't see any at all. I am not sure that she even considers him a "friend" not less a "roommate". 

Something tells me that OM might just as well pack up this marriage and grow up before getting involved with another woman or history will repeat itself. Sorry to be harsh but this is the reality as I see it.


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## FormerSelf (Apr 21, 2013)

A wife can grow lonely and resentful when her needs aren't being met. Her decision to say she wants to avoid all sexual intimacy doesn't mean she is not a sexual person anymore, it means you are doing things that are switching off her attraction TO YOU. Those things may be really hard to hear, but they MUST be heard if you have a any sort of chance to see things change.

It seems like for every complaint of her you are countering with a reason as to why she shouldn't feel that way. That does not invalidate her feelings nor will it score you a point where she'll think, "Oh gosh, he's right! Well I better just shut my mouth and change my mind!" That is a losing battle that many men ignorantly get themselves into then later still scratch their heads while their wife has left or is having sex with another man. 

"B-but, she can't leave! I'm the best thing that's ever happened to her!" I'm not saying that any guy deserves what you are dealing with, but it is very common that men will be very ignorant as to the reasons why their wives will slip out the door.

She feels hopeless and resentful, no longer able to disguise her growing contempt. She says that she is going to shut down, but it probably means she is prepared to get her emotional needs met elsewhere. Good news is that SHE TOLD YOU. No, she doesn't believe that things will change, but at least she brought it up instead of just shutting down, shutting you out and say, "I'm fine. Nothing's wrong."

Still, your attempts to convince her, argue with her, go tit-for-tat, or hover, will only make her feel more claustrophobic. I don't think it entirely has to do with her family, unless you are being relentlessly passive aggressive concerning their presence. Whatever it is, you are engaging in behavior(s) that had been wearing her love down. I am sure she shares some fault in this, not to mention perhaps she is assuming that you can understand what her expectations are...she she may be poorly communicating them...but irregardless, she is blaming you for it.

It this case, it is best that you indeed go work on yourself, hone in on your dysfunctional proclivities or other eras you feel like you need to sharpen. This will always affect a relationship. I'd also be very careful not to absorb every complaint and whim of hers, being that she may be finding fault in everything at this point and it would be fruitless for you to attempt to try to please someone who does not want to be pleased. 

Get off of her gameboard...take your eyes off of her for a while. Let her know you will respect her wishes for space although it is ultimately your desire to work it out. Let her know that although you have struggled with what she said, now you appreciate her criticisms cos it will help you improve, so while you are giving her the space she asks, you will be working on yourself to change some things. Let her know you want her to be happy and are willing to get some stuff fixed to do your part, but you are going to leave her to make a choice. Then go off and work on yourself AND start idealizing what a healthy man looks like, what a healthy marriage looks like, and what you expect your wife to be like. Work on your areas of responsibility, ALWAYS BEING HAPPY AS A PIG IN POOP! 

Do not cry, mope, moan, whine, beg, plead, complain, look lonely or sad or mad..or anything that will show your wife that you are struggling without her. In fact, you need to act like that this was the best thing that ever happened to you. Believe it. Act on it. If you are truly successful at changing your attitude, your looks, your swagger...and show that you can be happy whether she is either in or out of the picture then you did your job.

She will grow curious. She may test your resolve by being a B-word...or try to push your buttons to see if you'll crack...but really it means she is testing to see if the changes that she is started to interest her is bs or not. She may at that point try to reengage...but don't let that be your life goal...as it invites complacency. You truly need to change, raise the bar for your marriage, and then decide if wife is willing to work on herself to join you or not. If not, you have already readied yourself for the next level.


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## Blossom Leigh (Mar 27, 2014)

FormerSelf said:


> A wife can grow lonely and resentful when her needs aren't being met. Her decision to say she wants to avoid all sexual intimacy doesn't mean she is not a sexual person anymore, it means you are doing things that are switching off her attraction TO YOU. Those things may be really hard to hear, but they MUST be heard if you have a any sort of chance to see things change.
> 
> It seems like for every complaint of her you are countering with a reason as to why she shouldn't feel that way. That does not invalidate her feelings nor will it score you a point where she'll think, "Oh gosh, he's right! Well I better just shut my mouth and change my mind!" That is a losing battle that many men ignorantly get themselves into then later still scratch their heads while their wife has left or is having sex with another man.
> 
> ...



Love this post. :iagree:


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## C3156 (Jun 13, 2012)

Lord,

You need to have a paradigm shift with respect to the way you interact with your wife. There have been several good posts on a way to move forward. I suspect that you will not have the self awareness to see what people are trying to tell you until your wife hands you the divorce papers.

FS has an excellent post, I suggest you print it out and read it several times. Once you realize that if you can give your wife what SHE wants not what you think she wants, she will most likely give back.

A therapist can help you with your passive aggressive behaviors and teach you better ways to communicate. They will not fix the problem, only give you tools to use so that YOU can fix the problem.

Good luck.


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## lordfire00 (Jun 28, 2014)

Hi there, thanks for the replies. Well what i have learned is that , my wife has become bitter and extremely resentful towards me. I think the emotions of her fathers passing are still running wild. Im dealing with it the best i can, but its not easy. I am slowly trying to move on with life,


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