# Finally had my "the moment I knew" moment...how to proceed



## J.R. (Sep 25, 2012)

Hi, my husband and I have been together for 18 years, married for 13. We have 2 kids (10 & 2). 
Obviously things have not been great between us - we have become more roommates than anything else. A little bit about our past: he is verbally abusive - knows just what to say to cut me down. Once we had our oldest and now that he is a little bit older the verbal attacks are aimed at him. Our youngest son doesn't even like him. Wants nothing to do with him, but i'm sure this is just a stage of always wanting mama. His verbal attacks are not an all the time scenario - so it confuses me. Because the next day or later on, he and my eldest will be getting along just fine like best buds. 

We had a fight about 6 months ago where he said he didn't feel like i loved him anymore. He complained that we hadn't had sex in over 6 months (which was not true) and that he always gets turned down (well, when he only asks for it when he's drunk and smelling like an ashtray - I have a right to say no). At that conversation, which took place at 1AM and he was tipsy - I was taken off guard, but did admit we were more like roommates at that point. We agreed to try to be more loving to each other. But I also pointed out to him that my feeling for him are intertwined with how he treats the kids. If he is being a total douche to them, I can't stand him. 

Well, I am pretty sure I just had my "ah ha" moment with him. Saturday was very stressful with kids football games (he went into a rage and kicked a kids toy and shattered it because our son didn't know how to put the pads into his jersy pants and was starting to cry because dad wouldn't help him, then proceeeded to call him a P*ssY). Nice, I know. 

Later that night, the entire family was upstairs goofing around and I said it was time for bed for our little one. He was not too happy and refused to come downstairs to change and get ready. So I picked him up - but he was kicking and screaming "put me down" well he threw me off balance and I wound up slipping down some stairs and landing on my butt 1/2 way down. I am sitting there holding our son (whom I did not drop, but shifted to the side a smidge) starting to cry since I hit my tailbone, mid back and head and my son is crying (he hit his heel on something) and my eldest son comes running out of his room and asks dad what happened and he says "Your f*cking mom fell down the stairs again". I am SO shocked by his reaction I feel a need to defend and I say "I didn't drop him" referring to our toddler still crying in my lap. The he says "but he's hurt - holding his foot". So i get up and take him to the couch to check him out - nothing major -just a little red from scrapping the stair. But right then I break down totally because it had just hit me. He didn't even care enough for me to see if I was ok. He would have helped any other person he saw fall downs the stairs. If one our our friends or wifes would have fallen, he would have rushed to help them, but I didn't even get an "are you ok?" 

Hubby comes down about 15 minutes later sees me sniffling and finally says "You ok?" and I break down and let him have it. I tell him its unacceptable that I just fell down the stairs and at no point did you rush to see if i was ok, or if your son was ok but instead we got yelled at. He at first went on the defense asking if I slipped on a stair or missed a stair. When I told him it was because our sons had shifted our weight, he looked at him with such disgust and said to him (he's 2) "So you did this, you caused this". 

So, I had wanted to discuss this more with him last night, but the kids didn't go to bed until late and he acted like nothing happened. 

I had my ah ha moment, but don't know what to do? I know he doesn't care for me anymore - he proved that the other night. I'm so lost.

Thoughts?


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## survivorwife (May 15, 2012)

I am so sorry for your pain. Your story touched me and I understand completely your need to get out, to save yourself and your children. What to do?

First thing: Find a safe place to go. Secure some funds. Make a plan. If you are working and/or can access marital funds, set some aside secretly. Eventually you will get child support, but for now, you need living expenses.

If you have family near you, go to them. If you don't, contact your local woman's shelter in your community. They can advise you. Keeping you and your children safe is the first priority. Always think about that first. The legal stuff can be dealt with once you are safe.

I wish there was more I could help you with, but know that you are not alone and that strangers do care.


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## synthetic (Jan 5, 2012)

This marriage is going nowhere. It's important to make some waves and get out of this dysfunction. Separation is the best path.

Your husband resents you. To be fair, I think his previous cry for more love should've been taken more seriously and used as motivation for counseling. Instead you kicked him further into resentment-land by establishing his treatment of the kids as a condition. That was not very loving of you.

I don't think you should do this in secrecy. You should tell your husband about your intentions and allow him to digest it on his own. There's no need for world war III.


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## survivorwife (May 15, 2012)

synthetic said:


> Your husband resents you. To be fair, I think his previous cry for more love should've been taken more seriously and used as motivation for counseling. Instead you kicked him further into resentment-land by establishing his treatment of the kids as a condition. That was not very loving of you.





Kicked him further into resentment? While he verbally abuses the children? Calls them names? As if he only began acting out against the children AFTER this confrontation? Is it not possible that he was verbally and emotionally abusing the children prior to this discussion?

YES! His treatment of his children SHOULD be a condition? Who else do they have to protect them? Whose job is it to see to their needs and keep them safe but their own parents?

And your last sentence "That was not very loving of you" might apply to the H since she may not be acting very "loving" toward HIM, but it certainly does NOT apply to her children who need her protection and who are her primary interest. He has a temper. He kicks toys. He insults and demeans the children. He is an abuser. She needs to get out and take the children with her. No discussion. No opportunity for further abuse.


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## synthetic (Jan 5, 2012)

survivorwife,

I understand and agree, but he's the father (forever) and her husband (for now). Her leaving and taking the children with her will not change that fact. 

If the abuser has opened up enough to communicate about his desire for more love, it's best to capture the opportunity and guide him towards professional help. It's the best thing for the kids and the marriage.


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## Nma1516 (Sep 24, 2012)

synthetic said:


> This marriage is going nowhere. It's important to make some waves and get out of this dysfunction. Separation is the best path.
> 
> Your husband resents you. To be fair, I think his previous cry for more love should've been taken more seriously and used as motivation for counseling. Instead you kicked him further into resentment-land by establishing his treatment of the kids as a condition. That was not very loving of you.
> 
> I don't think you should do this in secrecy. You should tell your husband about your intentions and allow him to digest it on his own. There's no need for world war III.


This is the same BS you gave me, in another post, just wrapped in different packaging!! What is with you? Why is everything "HER" fault? Men need to take ownership for the wrong that they add to these situations.


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## synthetic (Jan 5, 2012)

Nma1516 said:


> This is the same BS you gave me, in another post, just wrapped in different packaging!! What is with you? Why is everything "HER" fault? Men need to take ownership for the wrong that they add to these situations.


You are more than welcome to ignore my "BS" dear. If all you got from my posts is that "everything is HER fault", then I'm sorry for you.




> Men need to take ownership for the wrong that they add to these situations.


Absolutely.

Only if there was a way to force men and women to do that 

Always start with yourself. Always. It only gets better after that.


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## survivorwife (May 15, 2012)

synthetic said:


> survivorwife,
> 
> I understand and agree, but he's the father (forever) and her husband (for now). Her leaving and taking the children with her will not change that fact.
> 
> If the abuser has opened up enough to communicate about his desire for more love, it's best to capture the opportunity and guide him towards professional help. It's the best thing for the kids and the marriage.


My motto is "safety first"

Negotiate later.

Are you not familiar with the traits of an abuser? You don't STAY and try to change them. You LEAVE and IF they CHOOSE to get better, THEY decide for themselves to get help. Only then can the marriage be repaired, if at all possible.

How can you even suggest that the victims, both the wife and the children remain with an abuser? Guide him towards professional help? Are you kidding me? Abusers aren't "guided" by anything the victims do.


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## J.R. (Sep 25, 2012)

I would like to add that in the past I have gone to couseling and H just laughs at the idea. He says that I only go when things don't go my way or if we have a big arguement. He NEVER comes with me. Well, one time he showed up to one and the entire hour after the session I had to hear how the Dr was a quack and didn't I see how the Dr was all wrong about this and that. I have been looking into couseling again - but once again it will only be for me.


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## synthetic (Jan 5, 2012)

survivorwife said:


> My motto is "safety first"
> 
> Negotiate later.
> 
> ...


Where did I suggest she should stay with him? My very first line was a suggestion to separate 

As for safety, she has said nothing about physical abuse. Only verbal. I don't think she's concerned about safety at all


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## cantmove (Feb 20, 2012)

Syn, I normally agree with a lot of what you say. This time I really don't. I know you didn't suggest that she stay, but saying that she wasn't loving and caused more resentment by putting conditions on their relationship is way off. Peoples bad behaviors are always conditions for working on the relationship. If a father is verbally abusive to his children , his ending that behavior is and should be a condition. He might not have hit his son, but kicking his toy and smashing it then calling him a pu$$y is abuse.


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## synthetic (Jan 5, 2012)

cantmove said:


> Syn, I normally agree with a lot of what you say. This time I really don't. I know you didn't suggest that she stay, but saying that she wasn't loving and caused more resentment by putting conditions on their relationship is way off. Peoples bad behaviors are always conditions for working on the relationship. If a father is verbally abusive to his children , his ending that behavior is and should be a condition. He might not have hit his son, but kicking his toy and smashing it then calling him a pu$$y is abuse.


Okay, perhaps my wording was inefficient.

Before anything, they should separate for now (in a peaceful way) (I already said that)

Abusers fear vulnerability more than anything. As a "loving wife and mother", she could capitalize on small windows of vulnerability shown by her husband and encourage him to be more vulnerable (less resentful).


She will not be able to take those children away from him. They're going to have one and only one father forever. He's going to be in her life and her children's life for the rest of his life.


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## luvintokyo (May 10, 2010)

I couldnt believe what I was reading," it was the lady's fault for not giving him love". The same person that is supposed to protect her and the kids abuse her and the children and she is supposed to stay there, the male ego is unbelievably selfish. Pls look out for the children and yourself.


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## J.R. (Sep 25, 2012)

Ok, so he unexpectedly comes home between work, meetings and heading out for guys night (weekly thing) and he makes like nothing is wrong, which in his mind maybe nothing is. So I tell him I am really upset about the stairs incident still and I go over it again and a few things are clarified on what exactly happened and who said what. All he can say is that he said he was sorry a couple of times (actually he said sorry about acting angry 1 time in person, the next were 1 via text the next day and 1 via email the next day too) and what do I want from him right now. I trully didn't have an answer for him. I got the apology, but it's not enough - but I didn't know what else to ask of him in that moment. I mean - do I just say right then and there while the kids are bickering in the background that I think we need some time apart? I certainly didn't feel that was the right thing to say at that moment, but I can tell you I an unsatisified with just an apology.


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## synthetic (Jan 5, 2012)

> but I can tell you I an unsatisified with just an apology.


Fair enough. What would satisfy you at this moment?


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## ferndog (Dec 2, 2011)

J.R. said:


> Hi, my husband and I have been together for 18 years, married for 13. We have 2 kids (10 & 2).
> Obviously things have not been great between us - we have become more roommates than anything else. A little bit about our past: he is verbally abusive - knows just what to say to cut me down. Once we had our oldest and now that he is a little bit older the verbal attacks are aimed at him. Our youngest son doesn't even like him. Wants nothing to do with him, but i'm sure this is just a stage of always wanting mama. His verbal attacks are not an all the time scenario - so it confuses me. Because the next day or later on, he and my eldest will be getting along just fine like best buds.
> 
> We had a fight about 6 months ago where he said he didn't feel like i loved him anymore. He complained that we hadn't had sex in over 6 months (which was not true) and that he always gets turned down (well, when he only asks for it when he's drunk and smelling like an ashtray - I have a right to say no). At that conversation, which took place at 1AM and he was tipsy - I was taken off guard, but did admit we were more like roommates at that point. We agreed to try to be more loving to each other. But I also pointed out to him that my feeling for him are intertwined with how he treats the kids. If he is being a total douche to them, I can't stand him.
> ...


He may care but like so often, he forgot how to show it. Go to YouTube type in walk away wife syndrome. Should be first video it runs 5:38 I think. View it and see if this discribed your situation. If it is then view it again and learn. Study it
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## J.R. (Sep 25, 2012)

ferndog said:


> He may care but like so often, he forgot how to show it. Go to YouTube type in walk away wife syndrome. Should be first video it runs 5:38 I think. View it and see if this discribed your situation. If it is then view it again and learn. Study it
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Thank you for this site. It hits very close to home, not exactly, but close. I completely agree that he is emotionally shut down from us. He literally comes home and sits in his chair with the laptop all night only to come to the dinner table with his smart phone and look at that the entire time. He's here, but not really. This is an on-going issue - we had arguements about this last year and I implimented a no computer until after kids in bed and no phone at table rule - but over time it's gone to the wayside. I just mentioned it again the other day and he set the laptop aside (angrily) and looked at me and said "now what do you want me to do". I said "how about you play with your kids". He did, but that only lasted 1 night. 

There was another VERY sensitive issue we have dealt with over our years together and it reared it's ugly head again a few months back - during the summer - and he mentioned divorce at that time - asking me if I wanted it. I didn't answer because I was so hurt again by what had happened and went into a depression for a couple of days - but at that time time he never once mentioned ANY of the things mentioned in that video, like going to counseling, church, getting books to save our marriage.


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## ferndog (Dec 2, 2011)

J.R. said:


> Thank you for this site. It hits very close to home, not exactly, but close. I completely agree that he is emotionally shut down from us. He literally comes home and sits in his chair with the laptop all night only to come to the dinner table with his smart phone and look at that the entire time. He's here, but not really. This is an on-going issue - we had arguements about this last year and I implimented a no computer until after kids in bed and no phone at table rule - but over time it's gone to the wayside. I just mentioned it again the other day and he set the laptop aside (angrily) and looked at me and said "now what do you want me to do". I said "how about you play with your kids". He did, but that only lasted 1 night.
> 
> There was another VERY sensitive issue we have dealt with over our years together and it reared it's ugly head again a few months back - during the summer - and he mentioned divorce at that time - asking me if I wanted it. I didn't answer because I was so hurt again by what had happened and went into a depression for a couple of days - but at that time time he never once mentioned ANY of the things mentioned in that video, like going to counseling, church, getting books to save our marriage.


That video was right on in my situation. I was distant and now I have an ex wife because of it. Just like the video said I have changed but she is gone she is now dating and although I didn't show much of my value during the marriage, I do recognize it and I'm too valuable to return to someone that doesn't believe in me.
It's vicious if you think about it. She suffered so much and now she won't get the man she always wanted because her hopes are done. I will sign my divorce papers on the 5th of October. And that door will be closed
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Emerald (Aug 2, 2012)

The abuse will get worse unless he agrees to go to anger management & counseling & that might not even help. You & your children will constantly be walking on eggshells. This will harm their emtional development & they will resent you for not protecting them by allowing it. Read "Co-Dependent No More."


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## Sbrown (Jul 29, 2012)

He needs to quit drinking NOW! This should be a condition of continuing the marriage. And abuse escalates the more it is tolerated. If ANYONE ever spoke to my son like that, lord help them.


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## J.R. (Sep 25, 2012)

Sbrown said:


> He needs to quit drinking NOW! This should be a condition of continuing the marriage. And abuse escalates the more it is tolerated. If ANYONE ever spoke to my son like that, lord help them.


Hi, when I read this I actually thought you might have posted in the wrong link. H does not have a drinking problem - he has a weekly guys night at a guys house. This weekly night away has been a rule of ours since we started dating, he gets one and I get one night a week (if people can make it). 

Why do you think he has a drinking issue? These verbal attacks happen when he is completely sober.


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## Sbrown (Jul 29, 2012)

J.R. said:


> Hi, when I read this I actually thought you might have posted in the wrong link. H does not have a drinking problem - he has a weekly guys night at a guys house. This weekly night away has been a rule of ours since we started dating, he gets one and I get one night a week (if people can make it).
> 
> Why do you think he has a drinking issue? These verbal attacks happen when he is completely sober.


Ok, I guess I was under the impression that he had been drinking during these episodes. How does he get home from guys night out?


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## J.R. (Sep 25, 2012)

Sbrown said:


> Ok, I guess I was under the impression that he had been drinking during these episodes. How does he get home from guys night out?


I think we are getting a tad off topic here. My main concern is the fact he appears to not care for me anymore and verbally abuses our kids and I. And since I have the apology, but am still unhappy I'm not sure how to proceed.


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## FRANC (Mar 2, 2012)

You may have an apology for his uncaring attitude when you fell on the stairs...but your issues clearly go way deeper which is what you need to focus on i think.

A couple of suggestions:

Use a journal or sit at your computer and write down all the problems you have...including anything you may be doing to contribute to the problems...but primarily his behaviors which are making you so miserable, like being angry a lot and verbally abusive (to all of you)/being physically present but mentally absent/ not showing much love or caring towards you or the kids too much of the time. I think that will help you, and you could give him a copy of that (keep the original, you could take it to counseling), and use it as a base to another discussion. 

Its often easier to get things down on paper because you are uninterrupted - conversations often take a different path, and you can forget a lot of things you meant to say.

Or...think about all those things, sit him down, and *tell him to listen and not say anything until you are finished.* Then look him in the eyes, be confident and deadly serious - tell him everything you are unhappy with. Make it clear that just because he doesn't see certain things as a problem - you certainly do. And that certain things if continued will end in the breaking up of this marriage. Make sure he understands you are deadly serious.

In the meantime, go to counseling, maybe suggest he attends. I would definitely tell him he has an anger management issue, which evolves into you/kids feeling abused. *That you refuse to live like this any longer.*

Tell him that how he CHOOSES to deal with these issues is up to him - that you aren't TELLING him to do anything specific, but that he must understand that for all bad behaviors there will be consequences. One day you might just tell him to leave, or that you have filed for divorce.

And if he is really unhappy being married to you...tell him to be honest about it, and take some action one way or another.


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## FRANC (Mar 2, 2012)

If you don't plan on leaving him any time soon (or kicking him out) i think you should start making a note of every day and time he has been abusive/very angry/breaking stuff. You may need it some day, and that day may be soon. Things get forgotten, especially if there are many incidents. 

He may be shocked into making changes if he sees a list of horrible things he has said/done held up to his face...


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