# What to do About RSXW a Sudden Ascension into Emmaus



## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

*I have been a member of the Walk to Emmaus for several years through my church. It is good in promoting a closer walk with God and a deeper understanding and relationship with Christ. 

It has overall been a great experience for me, both in and away from church, as I've made several friends through it from other denominations/faiths other than that of my own(United Methodist). I was quite active at first, but have not been other than at my own church.

Now I got word that my RSWX, who had rampantly cheated on me in marriage and was rather instrumental in later laying financial waste to me in the divorce process!

As is, I do not choose to speak to her and she does not speak to me, but until such time that she comes clean and confesses to her family and friends about her past marital atrocities against me, I want absolutely nothing to do with her!

When she joins the organization, it is accepted protocol to write them a heartfelt letter of congratulations and support, which I just do not think that I could bring myself to do! Additionally, there is a better than average chance that we would eventually be bumping into each other at many of the local/regional events. 

Since the divorce, she has remarried with a man of the same faith I am, and has graciously adopted the Methodist faith, which she ardently refused to do during our union together. She will have access to all of my church friends in the movement and will likely flippantly lie to them about what impacted the demise of our marriage. And as with her own family, she will do her damndest to cast me as the "Man in the Black Hat!" It just seems that she is coming after me as inconspicuously as she can! And I want no part of it! If you want to relive the hell of reading my inaugural post, please feel free to do so!

While I will never lose my steadfast faith in God or in Christ, I want nothing to do with her, in any venue. 

Should I just leave the organization, become more noticeably inactive or what? With what she put me through in our marriage, are my feelings about her in any way justified, or am I just being overly paranoid?

I would guess that I'm greatly governed by the conscientious mantra of Shakespeare when Polonius implored us "to thine own self be true!" *


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## SentHereForAReason (Oct 25, 2017)

This sucks because it hits the soul. You think you are moving along, doing what's best for you and your spirit, something that your former partner can't touch and then they enter into this sacred arena. To be honest, I would talk to your clergy. See what he thinks, be open and as honest as you would with a counselor.

Then go from there.

I'm still going to church with my STBXW and the kids until she moves out and then we will go to separate masses. I did this for the kids and to help with the transition. I would change churches but my kids go to the school connected to the parish and I'm not pulling them from that. I'll stick it out for a few more years. Son will be on to Middle School next year and then Daughter has 4 more years there.


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

As I see it, Arb, you are consumed by anger and by hate.

You cannot let the past remain in the past. You keep it forefront.

You let the stink of the past, it's foul odor wafting incessantly up your nose.
.........................................................................................................

I know your 'type'.
I live with this 'type'.

Hurt me once, hurt me forever.
Never one to forgive, to forget, that is you.

Now, with this attitude, who is getting hurt, damaged by this?

Your' EXW? 
Hah! No way.

Her joining this Church organization has nothing to do with you.
Stop making everything about you!

Live your life, not hers.

Ignore her, that is the best medicine for you and her.

She lives in your mind. 
While in there she is wearing stiletto heals. 
Puncturing your pride and your ego.

Boot her out of there.
She is gone.
Her odor, her stench is not yours to endure, her new man has that honor.

And for that thought, "Thank God!"




The Host-


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## personofinterest (Apr 6, 2018)

This one is tough. When I divorced, neither my ex nor I had been perfect, but he made a big show out of all my shortcomings while virtually ignoring his. I didn't post any details or even the fact that I was getting a divorce on social media. He did, of course prompting sympathetic private messages from many mutual friends, where he could "tell the whole story."

It hurt because even good people typically believe what they want to believe. I cleansed my friends lists quite a bit and laid low awhile.

But I was not about to let it affect my faith or practice of it. He wasn't going to get that. Yes, that was how I saw it at first.

However, as I focused less on his antics and more on where I wanted to be personally and spiritually, I found that while it might hurt, it ultimately didn't matter if others believed "his" version or if he "got away with" hurting me in various ways in our marriage. All that really mattered was my own life and faith and the family and loved ones around me.

If you resign from this organization that is so important to you because of her, you may well be casting aside the very thing that can help you continue to heal. I would say continue to be active in your faith and Emmaus in whatever way you have loved, if she crosses your path, nod and walk on, and just pretend that topic is NOT a topic. Those who want the truth will ask you if she gossips. Those who know YOU won't have to ask. And those who choose to lap up lies...well, they probably aren't beneficial in your life anyway.

And, above all, GOD knows your heart and who you are.


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## TJW (Mar 20, 2012)

arbitrator said:


> While I will never lose my steadfast faith in God or in Christ, I want nothing to do with her, in any venue.


I'm very glad to hear about your faith. I think it is perfectly fine for you to want nothing to do with her. In fact, that's exactly what I'm going to suggest you do.



arbitrator said:


> Should I just leave the organization, become more noticeably inactive or what? With what she put me through in our marriage, are my feelings about her in any way justified, or am I just being overly paranoid?


Yes, I think you should leave the organization. You will not do yourself any favors by exposing yourself to these triggers, or to the lies and gossip she will likely carry to the other membership.

I think your paranoia is justified. Paranoia is not a "feeling", it is a defense mechanism built into our psyche by God. Your paranoia is driven by your ability to predict the outcome of remaining in that organization. The greatest likelihood is that she will continue her past behaviors into the future. It is not wrong to protect yourself and perhaps your family from further hurt.

I don't know what other "feelings" you have. Feelings are simply that, they cannot be justified, nor can they be condemned. It is natural that we have feelings.

It is actions which matter, and actions require justification, if we are to convert a feeling into an action. So, I can only answer in that general way.

There are numerous programs, perhaps connected to churches, perhaps done in an ecumenical format, which are able to bring you into a deeper walk and provide the wonderful edification which you are getting from this fellowship activity. Your own Methodist church is one which is very dedicated to the support of this kind of ministry. There are also many other churches, both denominational, and independent, which host regular programs of this objective.

You also have the resource of the friends you have made, and the newer membership of this program recommended by your friends, to have fellowship with in continuum.


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## Rowan (Apr 3, 2012)

A few years ago, my ex-husband joined Emmaus. That would be my completely unrepentant serial cheating, emotionally abusive, alcoholic, gambling addict, ex-husband. The one with the strong narcissistic tendencies. The one who'd spent our entire 21 years together as a raging atheist, making sure everyone with even a hint of faith in anything knew they were a moron. But, 16 months after our divorce, there he was, joining Emmaus with his new wife. 

He had the nerve to ask my father, who is a deacon, to write him a letter of recommendation. After talking it over with his pastor, Daddy refused, as kindly as possible. I guess he got the recommendations he needed elsewhere, though, because he did join the Walk. My father simply avoids him, except for the requisite polite greeting when it can't be avoided. But I do think Daddy lost a bit of respect for the Emmaus program at that point, at least locally. Knowing they accepted my ex-husband, so very shortly (less than a full year) after his about-face jump into faith, just doesn't sit right with him. The whole thing just smacked of "we need young people!" rather than a true journey of faith with truly committed members. 

Arb, I would say speak to your clergyperson about it. Don't bring your anger and resentment with your ex-wife into it. But do let them know that you are concerned about interacting with her because of the way your marriage ended and the reasons the relationship failed. They may provide some guidance. Ideally, you will find a way to largely ignore her presence, or treat it as inconsequential. But, unless you can dredge up a great deal more apathy for her than you've ever expressed here, you may wish to simply bow out of events where you know she will be. Avoiding her may seem unfair, but it may be your best option.


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## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

Arb, don't let her take one more thing from you. She will be the newbie to the organization and she will carry a few qualms of her own. Go about business as usual and act like you own that place. Don't write anything - good or bad. Don't avoid her or go out of your way to be civil. She is persona non grata to you.


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## BarbedFenceRider (Mar 30, 2018)

This shall be your test. And you will be passing it my friend. I always like to remember that walks in faith, begin and end with our hearts and souls. Not worldly man made attempts of acts or protest. 

When I am watching my own faith to be tested. I am always brought back to Paul. He was thrown into faith suddenly, and many others had their doubts. But realized that he needed to show unrepentant love. And many of his letters describe this very thing. Not the love of a man and woman. Not the love for offspring or worldly possesions. But the love that is our Lords sacrifice. True love.


Let your ex go. Give her love. And in return you will be giving yourself love back! She will need to find her own way to the Lord. Emmaus or not, the path to Christ is a small one. You need only to worry about yourself. But if the torment is too new and painful. Don't hesitate to take a step back from this program. It will not be reflected AT ALL in your faith. You need to heal, and Christ knows this. It's all good. And you can always vent here, and atleast I will always try to be a good listener. 

Another way to look at it is like Sun said earlier. Don't make this about you and her...Make this about what it is supposedly about > Christ. and Christ like....
She lost her job as your wife. And she will be answering to that. We can all have faith in it. But we also cannot be hypocritical and condemn someone then not take stock in ourselves. We always can be mindful that this is all "HIS" plan. And we must have faith. Good things will come of this, that I am sure. God bless brother.
Best of luck.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

I do think its so important for you to be able to forgive her regardless of whether she has repented and apologised or not. The forgiveness is for you not her. 
Having said that, I would not want to be part of something where my ex or my husband's ex was going to be there. We don't see them and have had no contact with them for many many years. Fortunately we don't live anywhere near either of them. 

Do you honestly think she is doing this deliberately to get back at you? How often are you likely to actually be at the same meetings?

As for the writing, you don't need to do that.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

arbitrator said:


> *I have been a member of the Walk to Emmaus for several years through my church. It is good in promoting a closer walk with God and a deeper understanding and relationship with Christ.
> 
> It has overall been a great experience for me, both in and away from church, as I've made several friends through it from other denominations/faiths other than that of my own(United Methodist). I was quite active at first, but have not been other than at my own church.
> 
> ...


Inform people. There is a wolf 🐺 coming among them and you are duty bound to inform them. She is an unrepentant, venomous serpent and people should be informed if not warned.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

I know not many are wired like me but I would also consistently refer to her as an adulteress, (actually I would use far less attractive language) every time I spoke of her or to her which probably wouldn't be often. I would do it very casually and matter if fact like without a bit of ire, as if I was commenting on the weather.

Until she repents, she is an adulteress. There are tons of scriptures to back you up though I'm not familiar with your group and they might be pansies as far as the bible is concerned.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

SunCMars said:


> *As I see it, Arb, you are consumed by anger and by hate.*
> 
> You cannot let the past remain in the past. You keep it forefront.
> 
> ...


* On Point One, I am not consumed by anger nor hate. But rather by a marked sense of uncleanliness and disgust!

On Point Two, I am Christian enough to forgive! But unlike the Heavenly Father, I am only a mortal human and am just way too weak to forget! Perhaps when she confesses her lascivious misgivings to her family and our mutual friends, then, much like God, I'll forget as well!

But that ain't going to happen!!*


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

ConanHub said:


> Inform people. There is a wolf &#55357;&#56378; coming among them and you are duty bound to inform them. She is an unrepentant, venomous serpent and people should be informed if not warned.


*But my greatest fear is that with her power, money, and influence, as far as people that I don't know all that well in the organization are concerned, she would most likely try her damndest to build herself up, all while tearing me down!

For as long as I've known her, that's always been her modus operandi!*


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

arbitrator said:


> *I have been a member of the Walk to Emmaus for several years through my church. It is good in promoting a closer walk with God and a deeper understanding and relationship with Christ.
> 
> It has overall been a great experience for me, both in and away from church, as I've made several friends through it from other denominations/faiths other than that of my own(United Methodist). I was quite active at first, but have not been other than at my own church.
> 
> ...


Expose her for the RSXWretch she is.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

ConanHub said:


> I know not many are wired like me but I would also consistently refer to her as an adulteress, (actually I would use far less attractive language) every time I spoke of her or to her which probably wouldn't be often. I would do it very casually and matter if fact like without a bit of ire, as if I was commenting on the weather.
> 
> Until she repents, she is an adulteress. There are tons of scriptures to back you up though I'm not familiar with your group and they might be pansies as far as the bible is concerned.


*There are too many people within that organization, C-Man, more especially in its leadership who absolutely do not want to "rock the boat" in any way! And because of that factor, I would likely acquiesce, defer my participation, and just let her "have it!"

After all, I think that I'm most capable of finding the Heavenly Father most anywhere that I may look!*


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## notmyrealname4 (Apr 9, 2014)

,


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

notmyrealname4 said:


> blondilocks is right on target again I think.
> 
> 
> But, Arb, I think it would be really,really hard to be around this person. Especially in a place which has become a sanctuary of peace and fellowship for you. Now you can't get away from her there either. Yuck.
> ...


*Great advice! And to be honest, I'm a whole lot like you ~ hate confrontation except where it is due to hurting some other person or someone whom I dearly love or have respect for!

I guess I should prepare myself to see her because there's also the reality that she'll be present at the future weddings of both my sons, since she is so damned close to them and is helping to offer them ongoing financial support which they gladly take! Why make waves when they are receiving something good ~unless, of course, my misery is part of the quid pro quo!

Sometimes this perpetual nightmare just seems to rip my heart out!*


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## UpsideDownWorld11 (Feb 14, 2018)

I know the church does not look kindly on infidelity. But since the church is all forgivy and stuff they may just tell you to pound sand (in a Christian way of course). I'd probably just tell head man, its either her or me and be prepared to walk. But I'm a misanthrope so take it for what its worth.


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## SGr (Mar 19, 2015)

personofinterest said:


> This one is tough. When I divorced, neither my ex nor I had been perfect, but he made a big show out of all my shortcomings while virtually ignoring his. I didn't post any details or even the fact that I was getting a divorce on social media. He did, of course prompting sympathetic private messages from many mutual friends, where he could "tell the whole story."
> 
> It hurt because even good people typically believe what they want to believe. I cleansed my friends lists quite a bit and laid low awhile.
> 
> ...


^^^^^ This!

Sent from my 6045O using Tapatalk


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## Andy1001 (Jun 29, 2016)

Arb I honestly think you are correct with your suspicion that your ex wife is only joining to rub your nose in it. 
You were the guy who wouldn’t put up with her behavior and she can’t accept that you left her. Her money will ensure that she is welcomed by anyone in authority and believe me money talks. I don’t want to get into the religious end of things but I would gradually disappear from any club that welcomed her if I was you.


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## DustyDog (Jul 12, 2016)

arbitrator said:


> *I have been a member of the Walk to Emmaus for several years through my church. It is good in promoting a closer walk with God and a deeper understanding and relationship with Christ.
> 
> It has overall been a great experience for me, both in and away from church, as I've made several friends through it from other denominations/faiths other than that of my own(United Methodist). I was quite active at first, but have not been other than at my own church.
> 
> ...


The fact that your emotions are so wrapped up with her suggests that you have not traveled very far on the path to forgiveness. You will know that you have healed to the extent possible, when memories of her trigger a keen awareness of what you learned from the experience, instead of your current tendency to blame her. Blame is not a beneficial activity. Learn truly to "turn the other cheek" and you may regain a sense of wholeness. Currently you write about her as if she is the enemy. "Love they enemy" and you won't have any.


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## UpsideDownWorld11 (Feb 14, 2018)

DustyDog said:


> The fact that your emotions are so wrapped up with her suggests that you have not traveled very far on the path to forgiveness. You will know that you have healed to the extent possible, when memories of her trigger a keen awareness of what you learned from the experience, instead of your current tendency to blame her. Blame is not a beneficial activity. Learn truly to "turn the other cheek" and you may regain a sense of wholeness. Currently you write about her as if she is the enemy. "Love they enemy" and you won't have any.


Why must we forgive. As the Michael Corleone said, "Fredo, you're nothing to me now. You're not a brother, you're not a friend. I don't want to know you or what you do. I don't want to see you at the hotels, I don't want you near my house. When you see our mother, I want to know a day in advance, so I won't be there. You understand?".

Of course, he had his brother assassinated so I wouldn't go that route, but she is dead to him. And only crazies talk to dead people.


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## DustyDog (Jul 12, 2016)

UpsideDownWorld11 said:


> Why must we forgive. As the Michael Corleone said, "Fredo, you're nothing to me now. You're not a brother, you're not a friend. I don't want to know you or what you do. I don't want to see you at the hotels, I don't want you near my house. When you see our mother, I want to know a day in advance, so I won't be there. You understand?".
> 
> Of course, he had his brother assassinated so I wouldn't go that route, but she is dead to him. And only crazies talk to dead people.


Forgiveness is for the benefit of the one who is doing the forgiving. It need not be done in person, and the person being forgiven need not know it's been done.


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## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

arbitrator said:


> *Great advice! And to be honest, I'm a whole lot like you ~ hate confrontation except where it is due to hurting some other person or someone whom I dearly love or have respect for!
> 
> I guess I should prepare myself to see her because there's also the reality that she'll be present at the future weddings of both my sons, since she is so damned close to them and is helping to offer them ongoing financial support which they gladly take! Why make waves when they are receiving something good ~unless, of course, my misery is part of the quid pro quo!
> 
> Sometimes this perpetual nightmare just seems to rip my heart out!*


Arb, your pain is palpable. DustyDog is right - you haven't traveled very far in your recovery. I see you are now dating a nice lady. Until you can take that marriage and divorce and put them in a box, tie a big ribbon around it and take it out back and set it on fire - any new relationship doesn't stand a chance. The trauma you suffered will color your interactions with others and put them off. How about starting by no longer referring to her as RSXW? How about accepting how your own actions helped to put you in your current financial bind? 

So what if your boys suck up to her? She has probably been a better mother figure to them than their own. They'll eventually figure out her game. 

Don't think that you figure into any of her current actions - you probably aren't even on her radar as it has always been all about her. 

I wish for you peace, Arb. And, love. And, happiness.


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## UpsideDownWorld11 (Feb 14, 2018)

DustyDog said:


> Forgiveness is for the benefit of the one who is doing the forgiving. It need not be done in person, and the person being forgiven need not know it's been done.


While I understand what you are saying. I don't really see any benefits to forgiving someone. Its not like you will ever forget and the sting will always be present. I say use that fire for positive betterment of your life. Maybe that by working harder and earning a promotion or working out harder at the gym.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

arbitrator said:


> *There are too many people within that organization, C-Man, more especially in its leadership who absolutely do not want to "rock the boat" in any way! And because of that factor, I would likely acquiesce, defer my participation, and just let her "have it!"
> 
> After all, I think that I'm most capable of finding the Heavenly Father most anywhere that I may look!*


I think that I would do the same. I wouldn't want to be in the same group as a vindictive ex. Do you have a good church? Does it have a men's group? If not start one. My husband started one at our church and they really enjoy their time together chatting, drinking coffee and praying. At least she cant go to that.:wink2:


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

UpsideDownWorld11 said:


> While I understand what you are saying. I don't really see any benefits to forgiving someone. Its not like you will ever forget and the sting will always be present. I say use that fire for positive betterment of your life. Maybe that by working harder and earning a promotion or working out harder at the gym.


Unforgiveness is very harmful to the one who can't let go. Its bad for you physically and emotionally and spiritually. 
Forgiveness opens the door to healing and freedom. I know people who have forgiven the most awful things and its changed their lives so much.


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

arbitrator said:


> *But my greatest fear is that with her power, money, and influence, as far as people that I don't know all that well in the organization are concerned, she would most likely try her damndest to build herself up, all while tearing me down!
> 
> For as long as I've known her, that's always been her modus operandi!*


Arb you are my friend, but you created this problem. Back when you were going through D you had prepared packages containing detailed proof of her adulterous behaviors that you were going to send out to friends and family in order to prove your innocence and deflate her ability to drag your name through the mud. 

You were all set to send the storks to deliver these care-packages when, being the conscientious person you are, decided to ask your pastor's take. He told you not to... that you needed to exercise Christian love and forgiveness... to be the better person. And that is what you did, depite our frantic pleas to expose her. 

No one was ever informed of her sins, she came through smelling like a rose, and she went right ahead and trashed your rep like you knew she would. 

You chose the high road Arb. You have found that it is cold, lonely and spans deep valleys.


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## Rowan (Apr 3, 2012)

UpsideDownWorld11 said:


> While I understand what you are saying. I don't really see any benefits to forgiving someone. Its not like you will ever forget and the sting will always be present. I say use that fire for positive betterment of your life. Maybe that by working harder and earning a promotion or working out harder at the gym.


Eh. I've honestly found that the sting really _isn't_ always present. No, you don't forget. No, you absolutely don't have to allow the other person to continue to be in your life. But I've found that apathy is much preferred in the long run than hate. At some point, hate, anger, resentment, all the negative emotions, just become a waste of resources. I could be putting all that emotional energy into other, more healthy and positive things. It's not anger and resentment that have me working harder, preparing for a career change, becoming more fit. If it were, then my ex-husband would still have a hand in my life. And I choose not to grant him that. Instead, it's confidence, determination and hope for the future that are fueling those things. 

Don't get me wrong, anger is a great initial motivator. But anger is a hot emotion. It eventually burns down to nearly nothing, unless you continue feeding it. You can't rely on it to fuel yourself, long-term, unless you plan to keep giving it fuel. If you do, then you'll need to continue to find things to be angry about, you'll need to hold on to the bad, you'll need to nurture negativity, bad memories, resentments. Otherwise, the anger will run it's course and you'll be left flat. Much better, I think, to use that anger in the beginning to fuel personal growth. Allow it to lead you to look for other, better, more positive internal motivators. If you do it right, by the time it burns off, you won't need the anger anymore. Because the other person - the one you're no longer thinking ill of, angry at, resentful of, no longer wish compensation or redress from - just won't matter in any meaningful way anymore. They won't be important enough to you to devote the energy it would take to hate or resent them. That apathy? That's what forgiveness looks like.


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## personofinterest (Apr 6, 2018)

> btw, Christians are instructed to forgive. I don't know where they are instructed to forget. Forgetting is physically impossible unless you suffer some type of brain damage.


THANK YOU

I don't know who first joined the terms "forgive" and "forget." But our brains don't work that way!

However, one can forgive without forgetting. There's an article written by a psychologist about why we can't forgive and forget, and the reason it is flawed and faulty is because he joined the two terms. It is possible to forgive, even if the offender doesn't "earn" it. But I digress.

I think we also get confused, thinking "forgive" means "it's okay." It doesn't. I forgave the family friend who molested me (internally, I haven't spoken to him in years). It doesn't make it okay. It was NOT okay. AND I am not required to be his friend.

Arb, only you know how this will affect you. I'll say it kind of makes me mad that she has chosen to invade your safe place  I mean, there are all sorts of religious organizations and retreats out there. Surely she could have found another one!


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

bandit.45 said:


> Arb you are my friend, but you created this problem. Back when you were going through D you had prepared packages containing detailed proof of her adulterous behaviors that you were going to send out to friends and family in order to prove your innocence and deflate her ability to drag your name through the mud.
> 
> You were all set to send the storks to deliver these care-packages when, being the conscientious person you are, decided to ask your pastor's take. He told you not to... that you needed to exercise Christian love and forgiveness... to be the better person. And that is what you did, depite our frantic pleas to expose her.
> 
> ...



*I acted solely on the Pastor's recommendation! And I kept the peace and acquiesced!

It was rather easy for him ~ but kind of tough for me!*


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

Diana7 said:


> I think that I would do the same. I wouldn't want to be in the same group as a vindictive ex. Do you have a good church? Does it have a men's group? If not start one. My husband started one at our church and they really enjoy their time together chatting, drinking coffee and praying. At least she cant go to that.:wink2:


*Yes! I was actually President of our Church United Methodist Men's group for some 18 straight months!*


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

bandit.45 said:


> Arb you are my friend, but you created this problem. Back when you were going through D you had prepared packages containing detailed proof of her adulterous behaviors that you were going to send out to friends and family in order to prove your innocence and deflate her ability to drag your name through the mud.
> 
> You were all set to send the storks to deliver these care-packages when, being the conscientious person you are, decided to ask your pastor's take. He told you not to... that you needed to exercise Christian love and forgiveness... to be the better person. And that is what you did, depite our frantic pleas to expose her.
> 
> ...


He did the right thing. My husband did the same with his former wife., He didn't go round smearing her name and always acted with integrity, decency and fairness. He forgave her even though she never apologised. He was able to move on and meet and marry me very soon and he has been blessed for acting the way he did.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

arbitrator said:


> *Yes! I was actually President of our Church United Methodist Men's group for some 18 straight months!*


That's good, carry on with that and your church instead. :smile2:


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

*The way that I see it, I want my RSXW to have the uplifting spiritual journey that the Walk to Emmaus provides ~ God knows that I believe that she needs the initial impetus of it more than I need it's sustained Christian nurturing! I know that I already have a personal relationship with God, and have access to Him 24/7!

But I do not choose to be a part of her initial spiritual excitement and fervor until such time that she, of her own free will and accord, can muster up the courage to confess to me, to her family, and to our mutual friends exactly what it was that happened between us, and even more importantly, why! 

She's been "forgiven" by me a very long time ago! That was the Christian thing to do! But "forgetting" is foremostly a Godly attribute, which the frailty of my mere human mortality just won't seem to let me develop!*


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

arbitrator said:


> *The way that I see it, I want my RSXW to have the uplifting spiritual journey that the Walk to Emmaus provides ~ God knows that I believe that she needs the initial impetus of it more than I need it's sustained Christian nurturing! I know that I already have a personal relationship with God, and have access to Him 24/7!
> 
> But I do not choose to be a part of her initial spiritual excitement and fervor until such time that she, of her own free will and accord, can muster up the courage to confess to me, to her family, and to our mutual friends exactly what it was that happened between us, and even more importantly, why!
> 
> She's been "forgiven" by me a very long time ago! That was the Christian thing to do! But "forgetting" is foremostly a Godly attribute, which the frailty of my mere human mortality just won't seem to let me develop!*


No you cant forget but you can chose not to dwell on the past. I once heard a very useful phrase about forgiveness.
'Forgiveness isn't letting them off the hook, but taking them off our hook and putting them on Gods hook'. It somehow enables Him to work in that person if we let them go. 

You have to accept though that she may never repent or say sorry, my husband's ex never has and that was from over 13 years ago. She has also probably told her husband lots of nonsense to justify the divorce as well if he is a Christian. 
After all would he have married her if he knew she had cheated?


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

Diana7 said:


> No you cant forget but you can chose not to dwell on the past.
> 
> *I once heard a very useful phrase about forgiveness.
> 
> ...


*Permission hereby requested to use that line, Sweetheart!

That is a most poignant one! *


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## jlg07 (Feb 24, 2017)

Arb, if you do decide to exit the group, I would STILL tell folks about her cheating ways. They should know about the two-faced person they are inviting into the group. Tell them you DO have proof of all of this so that she can't eventually spin it as just hearsay. SHE may be able to use her influence, but I'm guessing word will still get around.


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

I would be like, yeah she is a liar and a cheat. God forgive her. Just be very nice about it.


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

Diana7 said:


> He did the right thing. My husband did the same with his former wife., He didn't go round smearing her name and always acted with integrity, decency and fairness. He forgave her even though she never apologised. He was able to move on and meet and marry me very soon and he has been blessed for acting the way he did.


Personally I always like the Samson route. Knock down the temple and kill everyone even if you have to kill yourself. Just as Biblical.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

sokillme said:


> *I would be like, yeah she is a liar and a cheat. God forgive her. Just be very nice about it.*


*"Dearly Beloved: Avenge not yourselves but rather give place unto wrath: for it is written; vengeance is mine, I will repay saith the Lord." Matthew 12:19 (KJV)

Adhering to this scripture, I firmly believe it when Christ told his followers not to avenge themselves, but to let the Heavenly Father publicly have His way with the oppresser by displaying his loving wrath to them in front of everybody, including the oppressed!

I honestly believe that God commands me to forgive my oppressors of their transgressions against me, but only He can effect "forgetting!" That can only occur when when He "forgives and forgets" as spelled out in Isaiah 43:25. 

He does not want us to forget until such time that we have been personally asked for forgiveness by our personal oppresser! In that case, as mere humans, "to forget" would likely lead to feeling and enduring that very same pain again, over and over!*


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## Andy1001 (Jun 29, 2016)

arbitrator said:


> *"Dearly Beloved: Avenge not yourselves but rather give place unto wrath: for it is written; vengeance is mine, I will repay dairy the Lord." Matthew 12:19 (KJV)
> 
> Adhering to this scripture, I firmly believe it when Christ told his followers not to avenge themselves, but to let the Heavenly Father publicly have His way with the oppresser by displaying his loving wrath to them in front of everybody, including the oppressed!
> 
> ...


Arb I am not going to argue scripture to someone like yourself,there would be no point.
However there is a difference between seeking vengeance and seeking justice.A man of your morals and strong religious views must surely see that your ex wife has besmirched your reputation to all and sundry and is now seemingly going to do it all over again.You have a good name in your locality for doing the lords work but if your ex starts telling her lies and makes a few donations to the right people your previous good works will be meaningless.
I would quietly let some of your fellow worshippers know exactly who they are inviting into their community.

Proverbs 21:15 When justice is done it brings joy to the righteous but terror to evildoers.
I would take this a step further by using the old quote “Not only must justice be done it must also be seen to be done”.
Maybe if you finally reveal the truth about your ex wife you can finally evict her from the place she occupies in your head.
Because she is in their my friend and has taken up residence.


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

arbitrator said:


> *"Dearly Beloved: Avenge not yourselves but rather give place unto wrath: for it is written; vengeance is mine, I will repay dairy the Lord." Matthew 12:19 (KJV)
> 
> Adhering to this scripture, I firmly believe it when Christ told his followers not to avenge themselves, but to let the Heavenly Father publicly have His way with the oppresser by displaying his loving wrath to them in front of everybody, including the oppressed!
> 
> ...


Doesn't have to be about avenging yourself, it can be just telling your story. There is a difference. You don't have to protect here either.

I always like this story better. 



> 28 Then Samson prayed to the Lord, “Sovereign Lord, remember me. Please, God, strengthen me just once more, and let me with one blow get revenge on the Philistines for my two eyes.” 29 Then Samson reached toward the two central pillars on which the temple stood. Bracing himself against them, his right hand on the one and his left hand on the other, 30 Samson said, “Let me die with the Philistines!” Then he pushed with all his might, and down came the temple on the rulers and all the people in it. Thus he killed many more when he died than while he lived.
> 
> 31 Then his brothers and his father’s whole family went down to get him. They brought him back and buried him between Zorah and Eshtaol in the tomb of Manoah his father. He had led[d] Israel twenty years.


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## Decorum (Sep 7, 2012)

Dear brother, I can hardly stand to think of you enduring anything else at her hand.

As far as forgiving, forgetting, exposing, and warning, this verse from our Brother, the Apostle Paul puts it all in context. I know the significance will not be lost on you Arb.

2 Timothy 4:14-15
...Alexander the coppersmith did me much harm; the Lord will repay him according to his deeds. Be on guard against him yourself...


In the end, people and institution will fail us, their calling, and their Lord.

Having men and institutions I have admired over the years fall and disqualify themselves is an ongoing source of grief to me. The older I get the longer the list.


As the verses above go on, I find my only conform for that...

2 Timothy 4:15-18
At my first defense no one supported me, but all deserted me; may it not be counted against them. But the Lord stood with me and strengthened me,...and I was rescued out of the lion’s mouth. The Lord will rescue me from every evil deed, and will bring me safely to His heavenly kingdom; to Him be the glory forever and ever. Amen.

Use your best judgment, don't second guess yourself, and be at peace.

Arb you hold a special place in my heart brother.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

arbitrator said:


> *Permission hereby requested to use that line, Sweetheart!
> 
> That is a most poignant one! *


Yes please do, I have found that very useful as well as I have had to forgive some horrible things. Many think that forgiving them means letting them off the hook, but it doesn't, they still have to account for what they have done and God wants to deal with them. We have to step back and let Him. Maybe this new group will enable Him to begin that work.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

sokillme said:


> Personally I always like the Samson route. Knock down the temple and kill everyone even if you have to kill yourself. Just as Biblical.


Far better to act well and with integrity and receive Gods blessing. 

My husband now has a wife who loves him, step children who he has a great relationship with, and has never been happier.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

*A little explanation is needed in that most of the scripture I cite and believe in is New Covenant ~ "Jesus presence on Earth" and "turn the other cheek!" Much rather than the "eye for an eye" scripture exspoused in the Old Testament! 

What I take from this is that while we are all sinners, God loves us alike in that we are all His children! But that we will all receive some form of punishment, albeit for believers, a lovingly Fatherly admonishment while in heaven, or in the case of nonbelievers, being shown to the gates of Hell!

I digress, but bottom line, I feel it is far better, at least for myself, to refrain from presenting "the cheek" from being slapped in the first place! Few of us have the courage and fortitude of Christ, and I, for one, am most willing to admit that!

I know there are many of you who might take dire exception to my theological thoughts and that there are those of you who stand alongside me! But let it b known that regardless of who you are or what you believe, that I still love you dearly like the brother and sister you are!*


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## Robbie1234 (Feb 8, 2017)

You must do whatever you feel is best for you @arbitrator but as @Andy1001 said you need to get your ex wife out of your head. I honestly think she is mentioned more on tam than anyone else which proves Andy's point. 
Whatever you decide I wish you luck.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

Andy1001 said:


> Arb I am not going to argue scripture to someone like yourself,there would be no point.
> However there is a difference between seeking vengeance and seeking justice.A man of your morals and strong religious views must surely see that your ex wife has besmirched your reputation to all and sundry and is now seemingly going to do it all over again.You have a good name in your locality for doing the lords work but if your ex starts telling her lies and makes a few donations to the right people your previous good works will be meaningless.
> I would quietly let some of your fellow worshippers know exactly who they are inviting into their community.
> 
> ...


*To a certain extent, she is, Andy! I cannot totally refute that! But that's only when I hear of the potentially damaging things that she has done or is going to do!

Since separation/divorce:

(1) She lied, she cheated then lied some more to family and mutual friends about it.
(2) She abandoned the three of us and filed for divorce.
(3) She coaxed my sons back into her fold and financially helped with their collegiate education or favor. 
(4)She's held on to my family's antique furniture to accent the historical mansion we resided in.
(5) She remarried.
(6) She left her lifelong church/faith, a faith that she mocked and ridiculed me about at times, and then after her new marriage, adopted my very own. But different locations, thank God!
(7) She joins Emmaus through her church knowing it is in the same geographical venue that I'm in, and will be interacting with some of my dear friends within.

So is all of this contrived on her part or just merely coincidence? What are the odds?

Other than for TAM, I rarely say anything to anybody about her. I do not like her ~ I do not want to be around her! For me, like a lot of others here, TAM is only a sounding board whereby I can come to vent on my fears, frustrations, and problems!

And I dearly love all of you who offer up advice of any kind knowing that in your hearts, you are truly and primarily concerned with my well being! And for that, I'll be forever grateful! *


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

Diana7 said:


> Far better to act well and with integrity and receive Gods blessing.
> 
> My husband now has a wife who loves him, step children who he has a great relationship with, and has never been happier.


David prayed for the death of his enemies and he was a man after God's own heart.


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

arbitrator said:


> *To a certain extent, she is, Andy! I cannot totally refute that! But that's only when I hear of the potentially damaging things that she has done or is going to do!
> 
> Since separation/divorce:
> 
> ...


On thing your wife sounds like a giant *******. Maybe it's God's will to have you not have to deal with her crap. I feel bad for this new guy there is NO WAY she isn't exactly the same ******* she was with you, with him now. Plus dude some of this is on you you should have fought. For instance why didn't you fight for the family's antique furniture? You should fight now just do it the right way. 

Tell your friends what she did, just tell them asking for advice and how they can help you be forgiving. 

"Friends I am very upset that my ex is coming here, I didn't want to tell you but she did this, this and this. I really want to turn the other cheek but I think the best way to do this is to avoid her. I would ask that you please help me. Please pray for me." No sin in that. I would just keep bringing up all the **** she did (emote) and how you are struggling with that. Christians love that stuff and soon enough everyone in the Church will know.


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## alte Dame (Aug 7, 2012)

If it were me, I would bow out, not because I am non-confrontational, but because life is too short to have to worry about this constantly. 'Will she be there?' 'What is she telling people about me?', etc. ad nauseam. It just wouldn't be worth it to me. It wouldn't be that she won. It would be that she is simply not worth having anywhere in my orbit.

Sometimes a person or two can really poison the atmosphere in a large organization. She's done that for you, no matter how she behaves. Just the fact of her ruins your day.

I understand that it's a matter of principle, but for me the principle would be 'I'm determined to do what I can to make my own life happy and stress-free. I've earned that.'

Just my .02.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

alte Dame said:


> If it were me, I would bow out, not because I am non-confrontational, but because life is too short to have to worry about this constantly. 'Will she be there?' 'What is she telling people about me?', etc. ad nauseam. It just wouldn't be worth it to me. It wouldn't be that she won. It would be that she is simply not worth having anywhere in my orbit.
> 
> Sometimes a person or two can really poison the atmosphere in a large organization. She's done that for you, no matter how she behaves. Just the fact of her ruins your day.
> 
> ...


*AD: I can only wish that I could give you 50 likes for that heartfelt advice!*


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

sokillme said:


> David prayed for the death of his enemies and he was a man after God's own heart.


Christians are told to forgive and pray for our enemies. David wasn't perfect as we know.


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

Diana7 said:


> Christians are told to forgive and pray for our enemies. David wasn't perfect as we know.


I get it, turn the other cheek and such. I am not good at that. I turn the other cheek and then punch in the mouth. So like Paul I pray that God helps me from the sin that easily besets me. 

So pray for justice. Though there is some question in my mind if there really such a thing with Christianity, but then again I guess I should be happy about that as I deserve it too. In the same respect I really like Samson even though he died in the end. At least he took everyone else down with him. 

Whatever I would be glad to be rid of her. If it was me the whole entire world would know everything she did. And it wouldn't be because I wanted revenge it would be because I am just open and tell people exactly what I think and about my life. No sin in that.


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## alte Dame (Aug 7, 2012)

I remember how she treated you, Arb, and a person like that doesn't deserve your attention, in my opinion.


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

I will just say that there is a difference between being forgiving of people who have persecuted you for your faith, and being bullied and taken advantage of, especially by someone in whom you once put total trust. You can forgive, but that doesn't mean you allow your reputation to be tarnished. I'm just saying your pastor was wrong, IMO. 

But all that is water under the bridge. Don't quit the group. If you run into her give her a nod and move on to someone you like talking to. Avoid her. If someone asks why you and her divorced, be honest with them. 

Sit on the other side of the room if you have to, but don't give up something you love just out of fear you might end up having to be around her.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

Diana7 said:


> *Christians are told to forgive and pray for our enemies. David wasn't perfect as we know.*


*Although a sinner who was beloved by the Heavenly Father, David was not a New Covenant Christian and did not ever know the true love of Christ!*


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

sokillme said:


> So pray for justice. Whatever I would be glad to be rid of her. If it was me the whole entire world would know everything she did. And it wouldn't be because I wanted revenge it would be because I am just open and tell people exactly what I think and about my life. No sin in that.



I guess I trust God to deal with them as and when He chooses. My husband didn't feel it was the right thing to go round telling everyone what she did, even though she told people her half truths and lies.


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

Diana7 said:


> He did the right thing. My husband did the same with his former wife., He didn't go round smearing her name and always acted with integrity, decency and fairness. He forgave her even though she never apologised. He was able to move on and meet and marry me very soon and he has been blessed for acting the way he did.


Exposing the truth to family and close friends is not smearing her name. Smearing is when you tell lies about someone as a way of hurting them. She hurt herself by being a cheat and a liar. Arb should not have had to sacrifice his reputation to protect hers.


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

Diana7 said:


> Christians are told to forgive and pray for our enemies. David wasn't perfect as we know.


There is a difference between being persecuted and being picked on and taken advantage of by a loved one. Two totally different contexts.


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

Diana7 said:


> I guess I trust God to deal with them as and when He chooses. My husband didn't feel it was the right thing to go round telling everyone what she did, even though she told people her half truths and lies.


She is lucky she married your husband I guess.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

sokillme said:


> She is lucky she married your husband I guess.


Yes and yet she still met another man and divorced him. No pleasing some people of course. However her loss is my gain and she is still alone 13 years later.


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## Adelais (Oct 23, 2013)

Someone else mentioned this verse:

2 Timothy 4:14
"Alexander the coppersmith did me great harm; the Lord will repay him according to his deeds."

To me this and other verses, where Paul or Jesus describes evil deeds and names the perpetrators, tells me that it is OK to expose wolves masquerading as sheep within the body of Christ. This is in fact to forewarn people so they won't also fall victim.

It is unbiblical for Christians to not speak about, or warn other unsuspecting Christians about the danger of dealing with certain people when those people have not repented or changed their ways.

I also agree that for your own sanity, at least for a time, you should back out of Emmaus because you will be constantly triggered and preoccupied with XWW and her AP at the meetings.

When you need to, tell people the truth about why you are not attending, just like Paul told people about Alexander. Keep your explanations to the point, and truthful. 

"She committed adultery on me for months. She could have just divorced me and called it "even" but that wasn't good enough. 

She tried to ruin me financially, even though she is a billionaire. She managed to take my pre marital assets from me, and she is still a billionaire and I am now unjustly poorer. 

She used money against my sons as well. 

She is a manipulative and wicked person who lies and uses people for her purposes."


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## jlg07 (Feb 24, 2017)

arbitrator said:


> *"Dearly Beloved: Avenge not yourselves but rather give place unto wrath: for it is written; vengeance is mine, I will repay saith the Lord." Matthew 12:19 (KJV)
> 
> Adhering to this scripture, I firmly believe it when Christ told his followers not to avenge themselves, but to let the Heavenly Father publicly have His way with the oppresser by displaying his loving wrath to them in front of everybody, including the oppressed!
> 
> ...


Arb, I wasn't suggesting you tell folks for vengeance. I suggested it to protect YOUR reputation among these folks. I don't think there is anything in the bible about not protecting yourself.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

jlg07 said:


> Arb, I wasn't suggesting you tell folks for vengeance. I suggested it to protect YOUR reputation among these folks. I don't think there is anything in the bible about not protecting yourself.


*I sensed that all along, jlg! Telling folks for sheer vengeance is not really my game! And while I do it here at TAM, it is mostly to jestingly entertain the community ~ but that still does not diminish the fact that I don't like her or even want to be around her! Kind of like being given the choice of a rattlesnake or a water moccasin to pet!

I think that the only thing that I'm seeking to convey is that her infidelity caused me to lose all present and future trust in her, as well as all of those pea brains that she did successfully convince!

And yes, the Bible does admonish us multiple times to always protect ourselves ~ no question about it!

*


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## Rubix Cubed (Feb 21, 2016)

Arb,
I would keep your faith in God and let her have the Emmaus walk to herself. That being said I'm not a fan of the Emmaus walk in the least. Its intent is good but the way it is put into practice is deceptive, using brainwashing techniques to convince the pilgrims they are having a personal Godly experience that is manufactured. Sleep deprivation, giving of gifts, removal of time and communication, secrecy from spouses, "hidden" locations, etc. 
It's is obvious you are a good, moral, God-fearing man, you don't need that mess. Let her have it, but give them a heads up as well.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

Rubix Cubed said:


> Arb,
> I would keep your faith in God and let her have the Emmaus walk to herself. That being said I'm not a fan of the Emmaus walk in the least. Its intent is good but the way it is put into practice is deceptive, using brainwashing techniques to convince the pilgrims they are having a personal Godly experience that is manufactured. Sleep deprivation, giving of gifts, removal of time and communication, secrecy from spouses, "hidden" locations, etc.
> It's is obvious you are a good, moral, God-fearing man, you don't need that mess. Let her have it, but give them a heads up as well.


*From personal experience, you are not brainwashed, but follow a regimen, that if concisely followed with the other pilgrims, makes a religious persons existing relationship with God and Christ fuller and deeper!

In my experience, there was no sleep deprivation, giving of gifts, secrecy from spouses, secret locales, et.al. *


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## Rubix Cubed (Feb 21, 2016)

arbitrator said:


> *From personal experience, you are not brainwashed, but follow a regimen, that if concisely followed with the other pilgrims, makes a religious persons existing relationship with God and Christ fuller and deeper!
> 
> In my experience, there was no sleep deprivation, giving of gifts, secrecy from spouses, secret locales, et.al. *


Glad to hear that they aren't all that way. 
The experience I had with my wife going through it was rife with those things, overlooked because of the end result, but still there. It soured me on the whole movement, as well as partially driving a wedge in my marriage. I probably should have just kept my opinion to myself. Sorry if it offended.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

Rubix Cubed said:


> Glad to hear that they aren't all that way.
> The experience I had with my wife going through it was rife with those things, overlooked because of the end result, but still there. It soured me on the whole movement, as well as partially driving a wedge in my marriage. I probably should have just kept my opinion to myself. Sorry if it offended.


*It didn't even begin to offend me, my friend!

I believe that had any of that occurred, I, as well as several of my friends, would have gladly walked out on them!

Sounds a tad like fraternity hazing or military boot camp to me, which I think that I would have been anything but a willing party!*


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## Rubix Cubed (Feb 21, 2016)

arbitrator said:


> *It didn't even begin to offend me, my friend!
> 
> I believe that had any of that occurred, I, as well as several of my friends, would have gladly walked out on them!
> 
> Sounds a tad like fraternity hazing or military boot camp to me, which I think that I would have been anything but a willing party!*


 My feeling as well. Very controlled/peer pressured and pushed right up to the brink of (but never crossed) unlawful restraint. It was also very secretive with the 4th dayers not supposing to tell anyone anything about it.
6 of the 8 techniques in the article were present.
https://www.learning-mind.com/brainwashing-techniques/

I researched it after I realized what had happened, and found there are far more extreme cases as well. I'm glad you didn't have to deal with any of that and that it was a positive experience for you.


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## DustyDog (Jul 12, 2016)

UpsideDownWorld11 said:


> While I understand what you are saying. I don't really see any benefits to forgiving someone. Its not like you will ever forget and the sting will always be present. I say use that fire for positive betterment of your life. Maybe that by working harder and earning a promotion or working out harder at the gym.


In the process of forgiving, you end up doing some very important things:

1) You admit to yourself that it happened
2) You admit that you PERMITTED someone else to take control over your feelings.
3) You admit that you were hurt.
4) You admit that you were a part of it, because in order to BE hurt, you had to allow it.

Ultimately, we control our feelings. It is perfectly normal and GOOD for us to allow others to temporarily control our feelings - that's part of the interdependence that a relationship requires.

But, when we get hurt, it strengthens us to realize that we made an intelligent and intentional choice to let someone else have that control and a risk we willingly took turned against us. And we resolve that we are strong enough to endure it again, if that's what it takes to love.

And this is what you said - that's how you use the fire to improve yourself - your strength and your resolve.

DD


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

DustyDog said:


> *In the process of forgiving, you end up doing some very important things:
> 
> 1) You admit to yourself that it happened
> 2) You admit that you PERMITTED someone else to take control over your feelings.
> ...


*Profound and meaningful words, DD!

I really appreciate it beyond measure!*


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## Fozzy (Jul 20, 2013)

arbitrator said:


> *The way that I see it, I want my RSXW to have the uplifting spiritual journey that the Walk to Emmaus provides ~ God knows that I believe that she needs the initial impetus of it more than I need it's sustained Christian nurturing! I know that I already have a personal relationship with God, and have access to Him 24/7!
> 
> But I do not choose to be a part of her initial spiritual excitement and fervor until such time that she, of her own free will and accord, can muster up the courage to confess to me, to her family, and to our mutual friends exactly what it was that happened between us, and even more importantly, why!
> 
> She's been "forgiven" by me a very long time ago! That was the Christian thing to do! But "forgetting" is foremostly a Godly attribute, which the frailty of my mere human mortality just won't seem to let me develop!*


Have you really forgiven her Arb? I'm not saying she deserves it. And I'm not saying I could do it in your place either. But it strikes me as incongruous that you (perhaps justifiably) refer to someone you'd forgiven as your RSXW. Maybe just something to chew on. As @DustyDog mentioned, real forgiveness is more for you than it is for the one you forgive.


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

Fozzy said:


> Have you really forgiven her Arb? I'm not saying she deserves it. And I'm not saying I could do it in your place either. But it strikes me as incongruous that you (perhaps justifiably) refer to someone you'd forgiven as your RSXW. Maybe just something to chew on. As @DustyDog mentioned, real forgiveness is more for you than it is for the one you forgive.


You can forgive an ******* for being an ******* while still realizing that said ******* is indeed an *******.


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## DustyDog (Jul 12, 2016)

GusPolinski said:


> You can forgive an ******* for being an ******* while still realizing that said ******* is indeed an *******.


In fact, in order to forgive, you MUST realize that the person did you no harm.

(Edit: My bad. That's the opposite of what I meant. I should have written "MUST realize that the person did you harm.")

It is not humanly possible to forgive and forget. Only God can do that.


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

DustyDog said:


> In fact, in order to forgive, you MUST realize that the person did you no harm.


Doesn’t make any sense.

If there’s no harm there’s nothing to forgive.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

Fozzy said:


> Have you really forgiven her Arb? I'm not saying she deserves it. And I'm not saying I could do it in your place either. But it strikes me as incongruous that you (perhaps justifiably) refer to someone you'd forgiven as your RSXW. Maybe just something to chew on. As @DustyDog mentioned, real forgiveness is more for you than it is for the one you forgive.


*In my heart, Fozz, I have forgiven her! But unlike God, because of my earthly human frailty, I can't seem to forget about what blatant deception happened to me, fearful that lest if I ever forget, it will likely reappear to bite me in the a$$ yet again!

If she would come to me with her "hat in her hand," in a spirit of humility, being apologetic about her marriage-ending behavior, then I seriously believe that I could "forgive and forget," contingent upon her truthful answer is and her emotional demeanor thereof to the question, "Why?"

But we all know that will never happen as her mantra has always been one of a power play, as if one gets in the way, they will get seriously burned!

RSXW is simply an acronym created by one of my other dear friends here at TAM, and in 95% of my postings, I have always tried to use it in levity!

If it doesn't seem like it, then I profusely apologize!*


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## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

RSXW was funny when Gus coined it and put it in the urban dictionary in 2015. It's had a good long run. Maybe it's time to retire it?


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

Blondilocks said:


> *RSXW was funny when Gus coined it and put it in the urban dictionary in 2015. It's had a good long run. Maybe it's time to retire it?*


*Then how else would you suggest that I describe or refer to her?*


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## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

arbitrator said:


> *then how else would you suggest that i describe or refer to her?*


ex-w#2


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## Rubix Cubed (Feb 21, 2016)

DustyDog said:


> In fact, in order to forgive, you MUST realize that the person did you no harm.
> 
> It is not humanly possible to forgive and forget. Only God can do that.





GusPolinski said:


> Doesn’t make any sense.
> 
> If there’s no harm there’s nothing to forgive.


Makes no sense because that is not the proper definition of the word.
for·give
fərˈɡiv/Submit
verb
stop feeling angry or resentful toward (someone) for an offense, flaw, or mistake.
"I don't think I'll ever forgive David for the way he treated her"
synonyms:	pardon, excuse, exonerate, absolve;
stop feeling angry or resentful toward someone for (an offense, flaw, or mistake).
"they are not going to pat my head and say all is forgiven"
cancel (a debt).
"he proposed that their debts should be forgiven"


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## DustyDog (Jul 12, 2016)

Rubix Cubed said:


> Makes no sense because that is not the proper definition of the word.
> for·give
> fərˈɡiv/Submit
> verb
> ...


And, that was a typo on my part. I know better than to have written "to forgive you must acknowledge that the person did you no harm." My error.


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## DustyDog (Jul 12, 2016)

GusPolinski said:


> Doesn’t make any sense.
> 
> If there’s no harm there’s nothing to forgive.


You are correct. I mistyped.


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

Blondilocks said:


> RSXW was funny when Gus coined it and put it in the urban dictionary in 2015. It's had a good long run. Maybe it's time to retire it?


Noooooooooooooooooooo....


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## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

GusPolinski said:


> Noooooooooooooooooooo....


Yes, Trelane, it's time to put away your toys.


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

Eh... not getting that reference.


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## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

GusPolinski said:


> Eh... not getting that reference.


Star Trek - The Squire of Gothos


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

TOS?

Meh.


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## Andy1001 (Jun 29, 2016)

arbitrator said:


> *Then how else would you suggest that I describe or refer to her?*


Like a virus resting between epidemics.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

Andy1001 said:


> Like a virus resting between epidemics.


*Andy: Didn't take you very long to come up with that one, did you?

I love it!*


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## Rubix Cubed (Feb 21, 2016)

arbitrator said:


> *Andy: Didn't take you very long to come up with that one, did you?
> 
> I love it!*


 From RSXW to "_The Virus_", she's like an evolving super villainess.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

Rubix Cubed said:


> *From RSXW to "The Virus", she's like an evolving super villainess.*


*RC: You don't know the half of it! Her Latin name/phylum is  buzzardus skankia . 

It's an accepted fact that buzzards normally leave lots more flesh on the carcass than she saw fit to have left on me!*


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## Nucking Futs (Apr 8, 2013)

Blondilocks said:


> ex-w#2


Or just #2. Or you could use that #2 emoji.


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

arbitrator said:


> *In my heart, Fozz, I have forgiven her! But unlike God, because of my earthly human frailty, I can't seem to forget about what blatant deception happened to me, fearful that lest if I ever forget, it will likely reappear to bite me in the a$$ yet again!
> 
> If she would come to me with her "hat in her hand," in a spirit of humility, being apologetic about her marriage-ending behavior, then I seriously believe that I could "forgive and forget," contingent upon her truthful answer is and her emotional demeanor thereof to the question, "Why?"
> 
> ...


Unless she shows remorse and asks you for forgiveness, you are not Biblically required to forgive her. You can forgive her unilaterally on your own if you want, like Jesus would, but you are not commanded to. 

However, if she ever experiences spiritual conviction and comes to you with contrition and asks for forgiveness, then you are under God's commandment to forgive her, the same way Christ forgave you of your sins. 

The fact that your xWW has never once asked for your forgiveness shows me that the Holy Spirit is not indwelling in her, and that her pious Christianity is only an act. If she was an authentic follower of Christ, she would be convicted by the Spirit, and would at least acknowledge that she did you wrong.


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

In the spiritual realm I can forgive a child molester for molesting my child, but in the earthly realm I can still expect the child molester to be prosecuted to the full extent of the law and pay an earthly penalty for what s/he has done. That is justice. It has nothing to do with spiritual forgiveness. The molester must be punished in such a way as s/he will not be able to or inclined to ever hurt anyone again. 

In his letters to the early churches, Paul repeatedly extolled his church brethren to seek out false prophets and apostates and cast them out. They could be forgiven, eventually, after they repented of their false doctrines and teachings; but until such time they were to be cut off from all communication with the Church until such time as they were deemed safe enough to be slowly accepted back into the body again. 

Arb's wife bore false witness against him in divorce court, stole his retirement and much of his assets, and has even manipulated his sons to accept what she did to their father. She's a wolf in the fold, who deserves no protection from Arb if she is trying to pose as a pious Christian. What if she spies another likely lad at Church she decides would be a good target to fleece? Should not Arb be concerned for his brethren?


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## Middle of Everything (Feb 19, 2012)

You are just too damn nice Arb. You seem like a GREAT guy. One of my favorite posters on here. But I see some of myself in you. TOO DAMN NICE.

Being kind, helpful and an all around nice guy is the way I wish more people were. But they arent. And most never will be. Many will walk all over you if you let them. And you've let them. I think what made me think WTF! the most was YOUR families antique furniture. You just let her keep it? I get her ****ing other guys. Cant stop that if she wanted to do it. But your families antiques? Come on man.

As Bandit has pointed out, standing up for yourself isnt being a bad Christian or even a bad guy. Its just standing up for yourself.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

bandit.45 said:


> *Unless she shows remorse and asks you for forgiveness, you are not Biblically required to forgive her. You can forgive her unilaterally on your own if you want, like Jesus would, but you are not commanded to.
> 
> However, if she ever experiences spiritual conviction and comes to you with contrition and asks for forgiveness, then you are under God's commandment to forgive her, the same way Christ forgave you of your sins.
> 
> The fact that your xWW has never once asked for your forgiveness shows me that the Holy Spirit is not dwelling in her, and that her pious Christianity is only an act. If she was an authentic follower of Christ, she would be convicted by the Spirit, and would at least acknowledge that she did you wrong.*


*Well thought out and put, Bandito!*


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

Middle of Everything said:


> You are just too damn nice Arb.


Arb isn't THAT nice, Have you ever talked politics with him? :laugh:


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## Middle of Everything (Feb 19, 2012)

bandit.45 said:


> Arb isn't THAT nice, Have you ever talked politics with him? :laugh:


Well on that hes just a Unicorn. A religious Texan that isnt a GOP poster child.


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## jlg07 (Feb 24, 2017)

Hey Arb, did you ex actually ever join the group?


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

Middle of Everything said:


> *Well in that he's just a Unicorn. A religious Texan that isn't a GOP poster child.*


*In Texas, I'm deemed politically to be a damned dinosaur!

A conservative Democrat in the mold of Sens. Lloyd Bentsen(TX), J. Bennett Johnson(LA) and John Breaux(LA) or David Boren(OK).

Mom and Dad were both "Yellow Dog" and "FDR/Hoover Depression" Democrats ~ and they raised their little one rather well!

I'm in a world all of my own as these types of Democrats just don't exist anymore!*


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

arbitrator said:


> *In Texas, I'm deemed politically to be a damned dinosaur!
> 
> A conservative Democrat in the mold of Sens. Lloyd Bentsen(TX), J. Bennett Johnson(LA) and John Breaux(LA) or David Boren(OK).
> 
> ...


You gotta let the Donkeys go Arb and be an independent like me. The days of moderate populist Dems are over. These new Bernie Sanders types are nothing but pinko commies.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

bandit.45 said:


> *You gotta let the Donkeys go Arb and be an independent like me. The days of moderate populist Dems are over. These new Bernie Sanders types are nothing but pinko commies.*


*Can't do it, Bandito!

Mom and Dad would crawl up out of their East Texas graves and drive down here and "get me!"*


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

arbitrator said:


> *Can't do it, Bandito!
> 
> Mom and Dad would crawl up out of their East Texas graves and drive down here and "get me!"*


I'll tell you what though...if Trump messes with Amazon and screws up all the good things they do for consumers...I'll lead the damn coup myself. 

Don't mess with my Amazon....


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

bandit.45 said:


> *I'll tell you what though...if Trump messes with Amazon and screws up all the good things they do for consumers...I'll lead the damn coup myself.
> 
> Don't mess with my Amazon....*


*... or my eBay!*


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