# Money for sex...with my Wife???



## Polyman

We have been together for almost 14 years and have 4 children. In the beginning, in our mid 20's, we had a very close and love relationship. Sex may have been every day, some multiple times a day. We are pretty devout religiously and felt that Divine presence brought us together spiritually. My wife has a Masters degree, but I am the only one working and make a very modest income. I admit that I have always struggled financially, and though she is not high maintenance may feel like she has given more than I have. We are both very sexual and she would dress up in lilngerie and heels often. Since we have been having more problems and going to see a MC, she is demanding I give her $400 as an allowance. She says I have not put her 1st financillay and she has had to depend on her brothers and father for a lot of stuff. So now she wont have sex with me, unless I am giving her $100 a week! I'm not about to get pimped!! I have said that I may not be able to afford that 'every week'. 

More I can say, but I want to see some of your responses...male and female please about how I should deal with this. Thanks.


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## swedish

How are your finances set up as of now? If you both know what your monthly expenses are & set up a budget together, you should both know what is left over for other spending/saving if anything. It sounds from your post that she might not have any clue as to what is coming in and going out? Otherwise, sounds as if she is trying to squeeze blood from a turnip.


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## Polyman

So many issues here...I will explain more later in a post. But you are right...she does not know or care how the finances are set up. At one time she took care of the finances, when she was working and in school. Because if this and many other financial woes, I took over all of this. She is actually better than me with money, she is an accountant. WE are not "together" with the finances at all. Not even a joint account. The marriage has been much of a power struggle from the beginning. I gave her too much control and was kind of passive. he was very aggresive and bit of a control freak...Alpha women type.


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## KathyBatesel

Why isn't she working?


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## joe kidd

$100 a week better get me whatever I want whenever I want. I would tell mine if she wants paid like a prostitute , I'm going to treat her like one.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Polyman

Joe...Thats the thing. She thinks that I did get it like that and that she has been "undervalued" financilally so she is demanding her "due" now. What ya think?


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## Honest opinion

Dear OP, I think there is way more into your story than what you said .I don't feel pitty for you yet ,when a wife demand money from her husband that says to me you have been so sheap with her for so long.How could you let your wife take money from her brothers and father and you make modest amount of money??
That 's mean she has no control issue what so ever period.I bet she is staying home to raise the 4 kids,with her degree she could make good money and wan't be needing your 100 dollar a week,and the money is not for sex so don't insult our intelligence please.I have my own income but I still take allowance from my husband,and we come from a religious back ground like you ,where the man has to support the whole family .so do tell more from your story or maybe change it's title.........


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## EleGirl

Well, it's hard to tell.

How much spending $$ has your wife had access to up to now...before she started to ask for $400 allowance?

Do you control all the finances?

Why doesn't she work?

I'd have to see your financial info before I knew if she was out to line here. If she has no access to money and you control it all, well she's fighting for some financial rights in the marriage.

We just do not know.


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## mrstj4sho88

*If yall need money , your wife could work from home. It is more to this than just money.*


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## Cosmos

There has to be more to this than what you're telling us, OP. Why does your W feel that she needs a personal allowance? Why doesn't she have direct access to the family finances and why isn't she aware of how tight things are?

Too many unanswered questions here.


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## mrstj4sho88

*If you don't allow her to work, you could get a second job. Why does she not get money for her needs? She takes care of the kids and you. *


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## Hicks

What does the MC think about her proposal to only give you sex if you give her $400 per month?


Your wife deserves to have money and you should be horrified and embarrased that she needs to go to her family to get money.

As was mentioned above, you need to work with her on a budget where you both decide mutually on where the marital income gets allocated.


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## southern wife

Polyman said:


> Joe...Thats the thing. She thinks that I did get it like that and that she has been "undervalued" financilally so she is demanding her "due" now. What ya think?


I think she should feel very fortunate to have a man take care of her (seeing as she does not work), feed her, and keep a roof over her head, and probably her own car to boot! 

Tell her if she wants to "live like a prostitute", she can hit the street. :smthumbup:

For God's sake, man, she's your WIFE!!! This is absurd!!! 

Does she have access to the "family money"? :scratchhead:


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## southern wife

Also, since she's "undervalued", perhaps she could put that degree to work and *get a job!*


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## janefw

I think people may forget that she HAS a job - raising four children. If she had worked, they would have probably had to hire a nanny to care for that many children, and who does _that _to their kids if they are able to take care of the kids themselves? As they have been together for only 14 years, then even if they had a child every year, those children are still _all _minors. I have three children, and my husband is a SAHD. Two of those kids now drive themselves around, but when all three were minors, there was no way that he wasn't busy constantly taking them to school, taking them to sports and other events, and helping them with homework, etc. I am really gobsmacked that people are so negative about a SAH-parent role, and consider that not to be "work" or a "job". 

I hope that she _does _have a car. I would hate to try to do any of that _without _a car.

Good grief. The attitudes of some people is incredible.


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## southern wife

No one said it wasn't a job in itself. Any parent, including me that works full-time and my hubs does as well, knows that it is. But *she is demanding payment* in order to have sex. I have to wave a BIG :wtf:



> So now she wont have sex with me, unless I am giving her $100 a week!


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## Toffer

Polyman said:


> Joe...Thats the thing. She thinks that I did get it like that and that she has been "undervalued" financilally so she is demanding her "due" now. What ya think?


I think that you tell her that her services are no longer required and that you'll be using that $400/month towards a REAL pro!

Seriously, she's currently not working so for the most part you are paying for her food, shelter and clothing right? Hel! man she's already a kept woman!


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## southern wife

Along with


> My wife has a Masters degree


Why go for the Masters if you're not going to use it?


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## southern wife

Toffer said:


> I think that you tell her that her services are no longer required and that you'll be using that $400/month towards a REAL pro!
> 
> Seriously, she's currently not working so for the most part *you are paying for her food, shelter and clothing right? Hel! man she's already a kept woman!*


:iagree:


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## Emerald

Polyman said:


> So many issues here...I will explain more later in a post. But you are right...she does not know or care how the finances are set up. At one time she took care of the finances, when she was working and in school. Because if this and many other financial woes, I took over all of this. She is actually better than me with money, she is an accountant. WE are not "together" with the finances at all. Not even a joint account. The marriage has been much of a power struggle from the beginning. I gave her too much control and was kind of passive. he was very aggresive and bit of a control freak...Alpha women type.


You said you have always struggled financially but then go on to say she is better with money than you are, yet you have taken over the money. Huh?

I think if she is better with money as an accountant, she should take over the money & give herself her own allowance.

If there is not enough left over after paying bills for her allowance, then she may want to work more or maybe you could get a better job that pays better than a "modest income" because as an SAHM to 4 CHILDREN, she already has a very demanding job.


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## SpinDaddy

Damn, I’m going to have to talk to Ms. Spin. I seriously only get about $40 or so a week and only sometimes extra if I’m taking the kids camping or something. And she still expects me to help with the dishes, take out the trash and give her sex. And she's a SAHM!

Seriously, the way you are discussing the marital dynamics and the management of your finances and responsibilities is weird, troubling and off the mark for two people supposedly working as one.

If the marriage counselor is on board with all this, I’d consider looking for help from someone else – your local auto mechanic perhaps.


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## swedish

Polyman said:


> WE are not "together" with the finances at all. Not even a joint account. The marriage has been much of a power struggle from the beginning.


What is holding the two of you back from talking about finances as a couple at this point i the marriage? If you can figure out a budget as a team, you will eliminate her feeling that she is not a priority in this regard.

As far as withholding sex unless you do certain things...that's a bigger problem - this screams 'i don't want to have sex with you but will go through with it if you give me what I want' Sounds as if she has built up a lot of resentment towards you - I am sure with 4 kids you may not have much 'alone' time but do you 'date' at all? Just the two of you, out to dinner, no kids, etc?


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## GTdad

Toffer said:


> I think that you tell her that her services are no longer required and that you'll be using that $400/month towards a REAL pro!


This is an outstanding reply to her demand.


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## EleGirl

janefw said:


> I think people may forget that she HAS a job - raising four children. If she had worked, they would have probably had to hire a nanny to care for that many children, and who does _that _to their kids if they are able to take care of the kids themselves? As they have been together for only 14 years, then even if they had a child every year, those children are still _all _minors. I have three children, and my husband is a SAHD. Two of those kids now drive themselves around, but when all three were minors, there was no way that he wasn't busy constantly taking them to school, taking them to sports and other events, and helping them with homework, etc. I am really gobsmacked that people are so negative about a SAH-parent role, and consider that not to be "work" or a "job".
> 
> I hope that she _does _have a car. I would hate to try to do any of that _without _a car.
> 
> Good grief. The attitudes of some people is incredible.


The OP says that he makes a very modest income. We don't know what the issues are. One of them might be that they just do not have the $$ for her to have $400 a month. So if she wants money that they do not have, then she would need to get her own job.

No one here is being negative about a SAHP role. We are all asking/wondering what the issues are.


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## SadSamIAm

The answer is to do the finances together. I am guessing that since things are tight, you have a budget.

Show her how much is coming in each month and where it is going. Show her what you are spending on yourself and what she is spending on herself. Once she sees exactly how much money the family has, it will be easier to figure out what 'allowance' you BOTH should get.


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## EleGirl

Polyman said:


> So many issues here...I will explain more later in a post. But you are right...she does not know or care how the finances are set up. At one time she took care of the finances, when she was working and in school. *Because if this and many other financial woes, I took over all of this.* She is actually better than me with money, she is an accountant. *WE are not "together" with the finances at all. Not even a joint account. *The marriage has been much of a power struggle from the beginning. I gave her too much control and was kind of passive. he was very aggresive and bit of a control freak...Alpha women type.


Ok, so she has NO access to your finances and money.

This is not about her charging you for sex. This is about you contolling the $$.

She needs to have access to your finances and money.


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## janefw

EleGirl said:


> The OP says that he makes a very modest income. We don't know what the issues are. One of them might be that they just do not have the $$ for her to have $400 a month. So if she wants money that they do not have, then she would need to get her own job.
> 
> No one here is being negative about a SAHP role. We are all asking/wondering what the issues are.


And until he comes back and gives more of an explanation about what is going on - because I find the whole thing hard to believe, and I do want to know why she is having to go to her family for money - then nobody really knows what is going on.

If she gets her own job, there will be little of that income left after arranging to have the children taken to and from school, and to wherever else they need to go. A full time nanny is an expensive thing, particularly as nobody knows even how old the kids are. If some are still toddlers, then it is a nanny they would be looking at, and imo, unless you are desperate for money and can make enough to cover the nanny and still have something left over, you (generic you) should not be working.


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## EleGirl

Polyman,

Are you coming back to talk to us?


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## janefw

EleGirl said:


> Ok, so she has NO access to your finances and money.
> 
> This is not about her charging you for sex. This is about you contolling the $$.
> 
> She needs to have access to your finances and money.


Exactly.


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## janefw

southern wife said:


> Along with
> 
> Why go for the Masters if you're not going to use it?


Because you can. 

There is no requirement to "use" a Master's degree the moment that the ink is dry. Maybe she will "use" it when the kids have grown up? Maybe she just wanted to develop her mind? She has as much right to get an education as anyone else, so far as I'm aware. Maybe she homeschools her kids .. who knows. There are far more questions than answers here.


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## southern wife

janefw said:


> *If she gets her own job, there will be little of that income left after arranging to have the children taken to and from school, and to wherever else they need to go. *


*

I call "BS". If she is in fact an Accountant, she'd make great money....enough for BOTH of them to pay for care for the kids and plenty left over. JMO! *


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## EleGirl

janefw said:


> And until he comes back and gives more of an explanation about what is going on - because I find the whole thing hard to believe, and I do want to know why she is having to go to her family for money - then nobody really knows what is going on.
> 
> If she gets her own job, there will be little of that income left after arranging to have the children taken to and from school, and to wherever else they need to go. A full time nanny is an expensive thing, particularly as nobody knows even how old the kids are. If some are still toddlers, then it is a nanny they would be looking at, and imo, unless you are desperate for money and can make enough to cover the nanny and still have something left over, you (generic you) should not be working.


She is an accountant with a Master's degree. She should be earning a pretty good income. If she does she could afford to pay for a nanny.

I have always been a working mom. When I was a divorced mom I had a nanny, paid for her on my own income and had enough left over to pay all my bills and have a pretty good life.


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## GTdad

EleGirl said:


> Ok, so she has NO access to your finances and money.
> 
> This is not about her charging you for sex. This is about you contolling the $$.
> 
> She needs to have access to your finances and money.


I agree with Ele, if indeed the wife has no access to the money. That's not reasonable at all unless she has some kind of truly horrendous history with mismanaging money.

BUT. I'd still like to know why she hasn't gotten a job.


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## Toffer

GTdad said:


> This is an outstanding reply to her demand.


GTdad, 

Just thank my passive/aggressive personality! I spent most of my childhood with my mouth getting my azz in trouble!


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## janefw

EleGirl said:


> She is an accountant with a Master's degree. She should be earning a pretty good income. If she does she could afford to pay for a nanny.
> 
> I have always been a working mom. When I was a divorced mom I had a nanny, paid for her on my own income and had enough left over to pay all my bills and have a pretty good life.


And what kind of a life did your child or children have? They were down to one parent, and that parent was not available to even take them to school? Each to their own, but I would rather struggle a little and have a parent available to the child/ren while they are small.


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## janefw

southern wife said:


> I call "BS". If she is in fact an Accountant, she'd make great money....enough for BOTH of them to pay for care for the kids and plenty left over. JMO!


And no parent available to take kids to school or spend time with kids. Nice. 

I don't know why people have kids if they are going to hand them over to someone else to raise them.


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## KathyBatesel

As an accountant, she can probably work from home JUST during the tax season and get the $5200 a year that she says she needs to keep from running to daddy.

But I'm with those who say the OP is being evasive and not telling the whole story.


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## mrstj4sho88

janefw said:


> I think people may forget that she HAS a job - raising four children. If she had worked, they would have probably had to hire a nanny to care for that many children, and who does _that _to their kids if they are able to take care of the kids themselves? As they have been together for only 14 years, then even if they had a child every year, those children are still _all _minors. I have three children, and my husband is a SAHD. Two of those kids now drive themselves around, but when all three were minors, there was no way that he wasn't busy constantly taking them to school, taking them to sports and other events, and helping them with homework, etc. I am really gobsmacked that people are so negative about a SAH-parent role, and consider that not to be "work" or a "job".
> 
> I hope that she _does _have a car. I would hate to try to do any of that _without _a car.
> 
> Good grief. The attitudes of some people is incredible.


*I mentioned her working from home because OP stated they need money. I know a few SAHM that work from home because they need extra money. If they need more income, they have to come together and find it. If he refuses to work two jobs, then wife needs to bring in apart income. If you can afford to have only one income great, they have money problems. If OP starts paying W for sex, he will soon lose respect for her. JMO OP is not telling us the total picture here.*

*Some colleges would let her teach online classes (from home ). *


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## GTdad

janefw said:


> And no parent available to take kids to school or spend time with kids. Nice.
> 
> I don't know why people have kids if they are going to hand them over to someone else to raise them.


It's a valid perspective, and we're blessed that my wife doesn't have to work (although we never have much in the way of spare money), but millions of couples don't have this luxury, and often circumstances dictate that both parents work. I also think it's valid that both parents work if they simply want to both be employed.


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## mrstj4sho88

southern wife said:


> I call "BS". If she is in fact an Accountant, she'd make great money....enough for BOTH of them to pay for care for the kids and plenty left over. JMO!


:iagree:


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## EleGirl

janefw said:


> And what kind of a life did your child or children have? They were down to one parent, and that parent was not available to even take them to school? Each to their own, but I would rather struggle a little and have a parent available to the child/ren while they are small.


My son had a great life.

He has a father. He spent 40% of his time with his dad.

I got him up every morning, got him dressed and took him to school. Our nanny picked him and his 3 best friends up after school every day. She brought them home and the 3 children played after school. The nanny fixed them snacks, looked after them and fixed dinner. 

On days when I worked she picked him up at 3pm and I was home by 6. His friend’s moms picked them up by 6. 

On days when he had no school, his nanny took the kids to places like the water part, museums, etc.

When he was with his dad I worked longer hours so I could work fewer hours on the days that I had my son. 

On weekends, holidays, vacations I spent every minute with my son. 

Not everyone has a choice to stay home with their children but even if they cannot, they can structure their life in a way that their child still has a very good childhood.

I know of cases where the SAHM did such a bad job of taking care of their children that they would have been better off if the mother had gone to work and the children had gone to daycare. Not every SAHM/D is a good influence on their children. 

Each family has different needs, personalities, etc. To judge someone by your own life choices is short sighted. Not everyone has the same situation you have.


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## EleGirl

mrstj4sho88 said:


> *I mentioned her working from home because OP stated they need money. I know a few SAHM that work from home because they need extra money. If they need more income, they have to come together and find it. If he refuses to work two jobs, then wife needs to bring in apart income. If you can afford to have only one income great, they have money problems. If OP starts paying W for sex, he will soon lose respect for her. JMO OP is not telling us the total picture here.*
> 
> *Some colleges would let her teach online classes (from home ). *


How does one find a job that they can do from home? This is a legit question. I'd like to know. 

If he's working full time, then her finding work might be a good idea as the children need time with both of their parents. Plus it sounds like she could earn a lot more than he does.


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## MimiAker

It sounds like she does not have access to the family money. (That is considered financial abuse.) In a marriage the income and the expenses are shared. If she is not high maintenance and has 4 children I doubt that her aim would be to destroy the family home and the kids future. You have some trust issues. Both of you should be able to sit down and discuss family finances. If she has a debit card to the same account as you she would't need to ask money from you. She must be very desperate to ask $100 per round. You are on the wrong track but it seems like you are opened for a change.


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## janefw

There are really very few and far between jobs at home that are on the level, and do make proper money. Someone mentioned teaching online, and that is a GREAT idea. A person does need at least 18 hours of your Master's degree completed first, but you can look for jobs at colleges all over the country that offer online programs. Other than that - all those ads showing people who make thousands of dollars a week working from home - LOL. So not real.


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## GTdad

EleGirl said:


> How does one find a job that they can do from home? This is a legit question. I'd like to know.
> 
> 
> 
> janefw said:
> 
> 
> 
> Someone mentioned teaching online, and that is a GREAT idea. A person does need at least 18 hours of your Master's degree completed first, but you can look for jobs at colleges all over the country that offer online programs.
> 
> 
> 
> Online teaching is HOT right now. An adjunct professor can probably plan on bringing in at least 3K per class per semester.
> 
> Someone else mentioned tax work. 'Tis the season, and she could proably get as much work as she could handle for the next few months.
> 
> All from home.
Click to expand...


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## southern wife

janefw said:


> And no parent available to take kids to school or spend time with kids. Nice.
> 
> I don't know why people have kids if they are going to hand them over to someone else to raise them.


Who says parents are not available to their kids? And how in the h#ll can you survive without a job, especially if you are a single parent? :scratchhead:

I certainly have not "handed my child over" to anyone to raise her. :nono: Granted she is in school now and goes to after school care for an hour or so until we can get off work to get her. I'm thankful for that and it's worth it to know she is safe, fed, and being socialized. She loves her friends there.


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## southern wife

janefw said:


> And what kind of a life did your child or children have? They were down to one parent, and that parent was not available to even take them to school? Each to their own, but I would rather struggle a little and have a parent available to the child/ren while they are small.


Who are you to attack a single mother paying her own way, and her children's way in life? :wtf: 

I'm sure Ele has done an outstanding job at working, raising her kids, and taking care of her own.


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## janefw

southern wife said:


> Who are you to attack a single mother paying her own way, and her children's way in life?


It wasn't an "attack", it was a comment, and I'm a person with an opinon, same as you.


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## EleGirl

She might also be able to find work at home taking in overflow from an accounting agency. She should be doing something to keep her accounting knowledge up to date. Laws do change and it's important to keep up on these. 

She could also take on small business clients.

There was a 3 year period when I worked at home part time. When my son was in school I went into the office.The rest of the time I worked at home.

When I could i'd take a laptop to the park. He's play with his friends, and i'd work on a report. It was great.

I also hired a high school girl to watch my son often when I was home working. He usually had at least one friend over to play with. She would help keep an eye on him so that I could concentrait on my work. It was a pretty inexpensive way to handle the working at home and still having chidlren around.


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## mrstj4sho88

janefw said:


> There are really very few and far between jobs at home that are on the level, and do make proper money. Someone mentioned teaching online, and that is a GREAT idea. A person does need at least 18 hours of your Master's degree completed first, but you can look for jobs at colleges all over the country that offer online programs. Other than that - all those ads showing people who make thousands of dollars a week working from home - LOL. So not real.


. 

*I mentioned it because my friend a sahm does it . The pay is nice and she feels better adding to the household. *


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## southern wife

janefw said:


> And what kind of a life did your child or children have? *They were down to one parent, and that parent was not available to even take them to school?*


Sounds like an attack to me...........on a single mother that's done an outstanding job of balancing career and kids!


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## janefw

southern wife said:


> Sounds like an attack to me...........on a single mother that's done an outstanding job of balancing career and kids!


Well that's a problem with your eyes, not with my words. An attack would be "you are a useless parent" which I did not say and did not think. You are stirring the pot here, and you need to drop the spoon. If the person in question has a problem with me, she can tell me.


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## southern wife

EleGirl, I commend you! You've done an outstanding job with your life and family! :yay:


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## EleGirl

southern wife said:


> Who are you to attack a single mother paying her own way, and her children's way in life? :wtf:
> 
> I'm sure Ele has done an outstanding job at working, raising her kids, and taking care of her own.


My son is 24 now. He still lives at home since he's in college. He's working on a degree in physics w/a minor in math. His GPA is 3.8. He has good friends who all care for each other. He has a couple of good female friends. One in particular who has been his best friend for 4 years.. he's in love with her. But he says he does not want any drama so he's not serious about any woman right now. She feels the same way. His education is his heighest priority.

He worked for a couple of years out of high school to put away money so he would have a savings while in college.

His plan is to go all the way to his PHD.

He has strong, loving relationships with both his father and I.

Yes, I raised an outstanding young man.

(And on top of that he's drop dead handsome and a very caring human )


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## Blonde

Polyman said:


> *She is actually better than me with money, she is an accountant.* WE are not "together" with the finances at all. Not even a joint account.


I think you should hand the finances over to her and you be the one on an "allowance".


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## mrstj4sho88

EleGirl said:


> How does one find a job that they can do from home? This is a legit question. I'd like to know.
> 
> If he's working full time, then her finding work might be a good idea as the children need time with both of their parents. Plus it sounds like she could earn a lot more than he does.



*I mentioned her teaching online classes. Someone else said she could do taxes. She could even be a billing clerk from home. With any stay at home job, you should check the BBB just to be safe*.


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## janefw

Blonde said:


> I think you should hand the finances over to her and you be the one on an "allowance".


LOL. :smthumbup:


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## KathyBatesel

EleGirl said:


> How does one find a job that they can do from home? This is a legit question. I'd like to know.



An accountant? She puts an ad in the local newspaper and local online forums. She asks friends and family to refer people who need tax services. She takes time to visit some local offices and introduce herself to people who will want their taxes done (particularly self-employed people, since that gives her quarterly tax work, too.)





MimiAker said:


> It sounds like she does not have access to the family money. (That is considered financial abuse.) In a marriage the income and the expenses are shared. If she is not high maintenance and has 4 children I doubt that her aim would be to destroy the family home and the kids future. You have some trust issues. Both of you should be able to sit down and discuss family finances. If she has a debit card to the same account as you she would't need to ask money from you. She must be very desperate to ask $100 per round. You are on the wrong track but it seems like you are opened for a change.


I get a somewhat different impression. He said she did the finances previously, so I think he's not abusing her and refusing her access to the finances, but that one or both of them has a problem with making or sticking to budgets. That's just one of the possibilities I see, though. The OP has yet to answer why she doesn't work.


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## EleGirl

janefw said:


> *And what kind of a life did your child or children have? *They were down to one parent, and that parent was not available to even take them to school? Each to their own, but I would rather struggle a little and have a parent available to the child/ren while they are small.





janefw said:


> Well that's a problem with your eyes, not with my words. An attack would be "you are a useless parent" which I did not say and did not think. You are stirring the pot here, and you need to drop the spoon. *If the person in question has a problem with me, she can tell me*.


Your intent was to say that my son could not have possibly had a good life because of assumptions you made. I did take your post as an attack.

That is why I responded in some length to show how I balanced work and raising my son. He has had a wonderful life. I did everything with him that a SAHM does, just during different hours. Actually we did more because most SAHM’s since I have a lot of education in the areas that interest him the most. I read to him every day. As a preschooler his favorite author was Edgar Allen Poe. My son has been interested in science and math since he was about 3. So we used to hang out in museums and science stores. We did experiments, rocketing, and I read him many science books before he could read. As a single child I made sure that he was socialized well by often having friends over and taking his friends on outings. He used to ask me to read him the darn encyclopedias. At 4 he asked me to teach him algebra… so I taught him beginning algebra. I got Hooked on Phonics and taught him to read. By the time he started 1st grade he was reading at the 8th grade level. 

My son has an IQ in the 99%. I was the right mother for him because I understood what a child with that level of IQ needs and knew how to nurture his abilities. 

The list of the ways I spent time with him is too long to put here. My point in this post is that a working parent can give their child as much as any SAH parent can give. IT simply depends on how a person prioritizes their life.


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## southern wife

EleGirl said:


> Your intent was to say that my son could not have possibly had a good life because of assumptions you made. I did take your post as an attack.
> 
> That is why I responded in some length to show how I balanced work and raising my son. He has had a wonderful life. I did everything with him that a SAHM does, just during different hours. Actually we did more because most SAHM’s. I read to him every day. As a preschooler his favorite author was Edgar Allen Poe. My son has been interested in science and math since he was about 3. So we used to hang out in museums and science stores. We did experiments, rocketing, and I read him many science books before he could read. As a single child I made sure that he was socialized well by often having friends over and taking his friends on outings. He used to ask me to read him the darn encyclopedias. At 4 he asked me to teach him algebra… so I taught him beginning algebra. I got Hooked on Phonics and taught him to read. By the time he started 1st grade he was reading at the 8th grade level.
> 
> My son has an IQ in the 99%. I was the right mother for him because I understood what a child with that level of IQ needs and how knew who to nurture his abilities.
> 
> The list of the ways I spent time with him is too long to put here. My point in this post is that a working parent can give their child as much as any SAH parent can give. IT simply depends on how a person prioritizes their life.


Great post and excellent parenting! 

*Edit to add: You, EleGirl, have my utmost respect! *


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## southern wife

janefw said:


> you need to drop the spoon.


I'll keep my spoon, thank you! It feeds me nicely!


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## SadSamIAm

I don't understand why everyone is saying she needs to get a job she can do from home.

They have 4 children. I am guessing they are all fairly young. 

Have any of you looked after 4 children? I would guess it is more work than most full time jobs. I don't think she needs another job!


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## EleGirl

SadSamIAm said:


> I don't understand why everyone is saying she needs to get a job she can do from home.
> 
> They have 4 children. I am guessing they are all fairly young.
> 
> Have any of you looked after 4 children? I would guess it is more work than most full time jobs. I don't think she needs another job!


We don't now if it makes sense for her to get a job or not as the OP has not returend to answer any questions.

However, he says that he makes a very modest income. Perhaps part of the problem is that he does not make enough to support the family. She has been taking money from her family to help with their finances. Many of us have the impression that he does not earn enough to support 4 children and for her to have some spending money. 

So if they need more income she might need to get a job.


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## janefw

SadSamIAm said:


> I don't understand why everyone is saying she needs to get a job she can do from home.
> 
> They have 4 children. I am guessing they are all fairly young.
> 
> Have any of you looked after 4 children? I would guess it is more work than most full time jobs. I don't think she needs another job!


Exactly! I raised three children, and while there is approximately 4 years between each child, when the youngest was a newborn and the next oldest was barely out of diapers, and I had to walk the eldest to school, while taking the two little ones with me, and then get groceries with two little ones in tow, and cook, and clean and do laundry, and then go and pick up the eldest, and do homework with him .. there was not a spare moment for me to spend on myself - let alone on a job outside the home. You can't just leave little ones to cry while you take care of 'business'. It's not fair to them, and it's not fair to the business. Those giving the impression that you can raise four kids giving them your full attention and assistance with one hand, while running a top notch business with the other are just dreaming. 

I was one of those who fought loudly for women to have the right to work outside the home, but that should never have turned into a requirement that a mom _must _work outside the home. 

Why doesn't the husband polish up his own skills and get a better job? Or, he could talk to his wife about him becoming SAHD and her going back to work, if that's what she would be willing to do, to improve their finances. But there should be less talk that suggests she doesn't already "work" for their family.


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## Toffer

Everyone, let's not forget that OP hasn't been back

For all we know, his wife may be taking money from the family for things like clothes and mani/pedis!

Everyone take a deep breath and push back away from the keyboard!


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## Cosmos

Toffer said:


> Everyone, let's not forget that OP hasn't been back
> 
> For all we know, his wife may be taking money from the family for things like clothes and mani/pedis!
> 
> Everyone take a deep breath and push back away from the keyboard!


:iagree:

Without more information it's difficult to comment on this thread.

A W demanding that her H pays her for sex just doesn't ring true, IMO. There's a lot more going on here...


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## Polyman

Honest opinion said:


> Dear OP, I think there is way more into your story than what you said .I don't feel pitty for you yet ,when a wife demand money from her husband that says to me you have been so sheap with her for so long.How could you let your wife take money from her brothers and father and you make modest amount of money??
> That 's mean she has no control issue what so ever period.I bet she is staying home to raise the 4 kids,with her degree she could make good money and wan't be needing your 100 dollar a week,and the money is not for sex so don't insult our intelligence please.I have my own income but I still take allowance from my husband,and we come from a religious back ground like you ,where the man has to support the whole family .so do tell more from your story or maybe change it's title.........


_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Polyman

Thanks for ur response and a lot of what you say is true. Yes there is more to our story and acknowledge my responsibility in it. The title was mean to be provocative to get responses like yours and others. When I get more time I will post more. The main problem is that we are very different. She was raised by her father and brothers. My father died when I was 10, I am the youngest and mother was single parent after. Also have a bro, sis, and grandmother was around a lot. It's been like a power struggle and disharmony, she needing to be more feminine and me growing more manly and assertive. My mom was very docile and sweet if u will. Her father is a good guy, alpha control freak a Lil bit. There more to come later. You may respond meantime. It's all good. Thanks for the openess.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## janefw

I will say that my husband and I both do "allowances". We each take out an agreed amount per month for each of us to spend as we wish from our joint checking account, which is OUR money, even though I am the wage earner, it is not MY money.


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## sandc

I may have missed it but... What does she say she needs the money for? What is she going to do with this $400 monthly?


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## janefw

Nobody knows ....


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## Polyman

No specified reason. But basically gas, children activities, basic pocket money. My thing is that in many things she is very uncompromising and it's caused resentment in me and vice versa for her I suppose of ten decencies of mine. I've said I respect and will work up to that. Like I may have that some months and maybe only half others. Like I had to spend 700 on my car for a recent repair. That would be considered my problem and not factored in for her.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Polyman

SpinDaddy said:


> Damn, I’m going to have to talk to Ms. Spin. I seriously only get about $40 or so a week and only sometimes extra if I’m taking the kids camping or something. And she still expects me to help with the dishes, take out the trash and give her sex. And she's a SAHM!
> 
> Seriously, the way you are discussing the marital dynamics and the management of your finances and responsibilities is weird, troubling and off the mark for two people supposedly working as one.
> 
> If the marriage counselor is on board with all this, I’d consider looking for help from someone else – your local auto mechanic perhaps.


_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## sandc

Polyman said:


> No specified reason. But basically gas, children activities, *basic pocket money*.


My thing is that as a husband and provider you should already be giving her money for gas and childrens activities. I'm really curious what the basic pocket money goes to.

Aren't you?


----------



## Polyman

SpinDaddy said:


> Damn, I’m going to have to talk to Ms. Spin. I seriously only get about $40 or so a week and only sometimes extra if I’m taking the kids camping or something. And she still expects me to help with the dishes, take out the trash and give her sex. And she's a SAHM!
> 
> Seriously, the way you are discussing the marital dynamics and the management of your finances and responsibilities is weird, troubling and off the mark for two people supposedly working as one.
> 
> If the marriage counselor is on board with all this, I’d consider looking for help from someone else – your local auto mechanic perhaps.



No the MC is not. We have only briefly discussed so far, but his position was you have to be together in on the finances of course.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## EleGirl

Does she not already have money for gas and child activities?

What are the things that she is uncompromising about? Give us examples of say 5 of them.

what are "ten decencies of mine"? I do not understand what you mean?

Does she have insight into the finances? Or do you just tell her yes/no to money?


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## janefw

Gas and children's activities are pretty much 'specified' I would think. I don't know about your family, but we spend $450 minimum per month on gas alone. 

Someone needs to be keeping a budget for your family. If not you, then her. You can't just spend $700 on a car repair, and then not have money for gas for your family.


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## EleGirl

janefw said:


> Gas and children's activities are pretty much 'specified' I would think. I don't know about your family, but we spend $450 minimum per month on gas alone.
> 
> Someone needs to be keeping a budget for your family. If not you, then her. You can't just spend $700 on a car repair, and then not have money for gas for your family.


If he does not earn enough money, then yes they can.


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## Polyman

GTdad said:


> I agree with Ele, if indeed the wife has no access to the money. That's not reasonable at all unless she has some kind of truly horrendous history with mismanaging money.
> 
> BUT. I'd still like to know why she hasn't gotten a job.


Turned down a great offer when they wouldn't respond to a scheduling request after having our youngest child. We are very protective of the kids and the change of heart of working came as more kids were more. Many women can identify with this I'm sure. To me, it's not all about having "a job", home business and other things can be done to generate something to contribute.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## EleGirl

Polyman said:


> Turned down a great offer when they wouldn't respond to a scheduling request after having our youngest child. We are very protective of the kids and the change of heart of working came as more kids were more. Many women can identify with this I'm sure. To me, it's not all about having "a job", home business and other things can be done to generate something to contribute.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Would she agree to doing something from home to earn $$. This would also keep her skills up. She could hire a high school kid to help with the children and home chores while she works.


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## janefw

EleGirl said:


> If he does not earn enough money, then yes they can.


Then I guess the kids don't go to school during that period?

The point is the budgeting. As he holds the money reins, he should have a budget in place, and that includes savings for emergencies such as car repairs.


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## janefw

EleGirl said:


> Would she agree to doing something from home to earn $$. This would also keep her skills up. She could hire a high school kid to help with the children and home chores while she works.


Wouldn't the high school kid .. need to go to high school?


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## Polyman

Home schooled...btw.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## janefw

Polyman said:


> Turned down a great offer when they wouldn't respond to a scheduling request after having our youngest child. We are very protective of the kids and the change of heart of working came as more kids were more. Many women can identify with this I'm sure. To me, it's not all about having "a job", home business and other things can be done to generate something to contribute.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


How old are your kids? Do they go to public school or are they homeschooled?


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## sandc

My wife has an economics degree from UC Berkeley. She quit a lucrative accounting job to stay home and raise our two children because she felt called to do that. She's never sought out employment and I've never asked her to. However, she considers it her job to stretch our finances as far as she can. Coupons, sales, etc. Anything she can do to save money. She says it's her "job" and I agree it is hard work.


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## janefw

Polyman said:


> Home schooled...btw.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


So they're homeschooled but you think she can run a business while teaching four kids at the same time?


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## sandc

Polyman said:


> Home schooled...btw.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


As are our children.


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## coupdegrace

Money for sex in marriage is ridiculous, and in a manner of speaking, is no longer marriage, but an arrangement. I dodn't puruse the rest of this thread, but since she has her Master's, what's wrong with her working?


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## janefw

sandc said:


> My wife has an economics degree from UC Berkeley. She quit a lucrative accounting job to stay home and raise our two children because she felt called to do that. She's never sought out employment and I've never asked her to. However, she considers it her job to stretch our finances as far as she can. Coupons, sales, etc. Anything she can do to save money. She says it's her "job" and I agree it is hard work.


See, that I consider to be the job of the stay at home spouse/parent. It looks as though you guys are on the same page - and that's what it takes. You are both working 100% for your family, but one at home, and one outside the home. :smthumbup:


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## janefw

coupdegrace said:


> Money for sex in marriage is ridiculous, and in a manner of speaking, is no longer marriage, but an arrangement. I dodn't puruse the rest of this thread, but since she has her Master's, what's wrong with her working?


She homeschools their four children.


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## EleGirl

janefw said:


> Wouldn't the high school kid .. need to go to high school?


Assuing that her children go to school.. the high school kid does get off of school in the afternoon, is off weekends, holidays, summers, etc. Go figure. If she found 2 kids she should have pretty good coverage. say she earned $30 an hour and paid the kid minimum wage. She might very well be able to earn a lot more than $30.

College kids are good for helping out as well.

The high school girl who helped me out stayed with me through college. At one point she even moved into our spare bedroom when in college. She got free room and board and some money. She helped with my son and house work. 

When a person puts their mind to it, all kinds of creative solutions can be found.


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## janefw

EleGirl said:


> Assuing that her children go to school.. the high school kid does get off of school in the afternoon, is off weekends, holidays, summers, etc. Go figure. If she found 2 kids she should have pretty good coverage. say she earned $30 an hour and paid the kid minimum wage. She might very well be able to earn a lot more than $30.
> 
> College kids are good for helping out as well.
> 
> The high school girl who helped me out stayed with me through college. At one point she even moved into our spare bedroom when in college. She got free room and board and some money. She helped with my son and house work.
> 
> When a person puts their mind to it, all kinds of creative solutions can be found.


He just said she homeschools their four kids. Where do you think she will find time to run a business? If she does her job with them properly (which she will need to, for the sake of their future prospects), then it is truly a full time job.


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## janefw

OP: why don't you go and do some kind of certification and try to get a better job? That would solve your financial problems without impacting the needs of your children.


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## EleGirl

Polyman said:


> Home schooled...btw.


So your wife works hard raising 4 children and home schooling them. But she gets no spending money of her own even for gas and activities with the children?

So you do not earn enough to support your children having a SAHM who home schools.

This is what I'm getting out of what you have told us so far.'

It's ok if this is the case. Either you will need to up your earning ability or your wife will need to go to work (at home or not).

It also sounds like you do not share the details of your finances with your wife, then you get upset when she does not know what they are.

I could be wrong but this is what it's sounding like.


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## sandc

Yeah, I have to agree. Having her homeschool four children and then take on extra work isn't a reasonable request. Don't believe all those homeschooling blogs you read. Espectially where they start these wonderful family-integrated businesses. The story behind them is that the mother is completely tapped out. The only family businesses that succeed are the ones where father, mother, and children ALL work cooperatively from home to start and run the business. The father is essential in this equation. Asking one spouse to do to it all is putting an awful lot on one person. Male or female.


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## ATC529R

sandc said:


> Yeah, I have to agree. Having her homeschool four children and then take on extra work isn't a reasonable request. Don't believe all those homeschooling blogs you read. Espectially where they start these wonderful family-integrated businesses. The story behind them is that the mother is completely tapped out. The only family businesses that succeed are the ones where father, mother, and children ALL work cooperatively from home to start and run the business. The father is essential in this equation. Asking one spouse to do to it all is putting an awful lot on one person. Male or female.


hell I can't even get any work done with one kid home AND a sitter. 

4 kids = 2 jobs!

and if he holds the finances it's up to him to figure it out, or relinquish those duties. I'm sure she could squeeze out a few bucks.


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## sandc

I dunno... ask your wife for a detailed accounting of what she needs the money for. If it seems reasonable I don't see why you wouldn't give it to her. If it's unreasonable, why is she asking?

Something is just not adding up here and I can't put my finger on it.


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## Polyman

mrstj4sho88 said:


> *I mentioned her teaching online classes. Someone else said she could do taxes. She could even be a billing clerk from home. With any stay at home job, you should check the BBB just to be safe*.


Does taxes every year, but that earning is spent as she sees fit. She is not a shallow high maintenance spender and is usually spent on many kids activities and programs, but it is not included in family budget expenses. In other words, I have no say to that income is how it's been.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## EleGirl

janefw said:


> He just said she homeschools their four kids. Where do you think she will find time to run a business? If she does her job with them properly (which she will need to, for the sake of their future prospects), then it is truly a full time job.


It sounds like he does not earn enough money to support the family. If he does not then she does need to help support the family.

This might mean that she cannot home school the children.

On the other hand it takes 3 hours a day to home school children.

By brother and his wife homeschool their children. They both also run a construction business. He works goes to work early. She spends the 3 hours homes schooling them in the morning. Then the kids do their other activities while she puts through the bids, does the billing, planning, buying, etc. 

While the children are doing thier lessons (they guy a cariculum) she can also work. She is not instruction them the entire 3 hours. 

For high school their children will be taking advantage of the local on-line high school and attending a local community college.. it's a program through the local school system in which high school kids attend community college for the last 2 years of high school. They graduate at the same time with the high school diploma and an assiciates degree. So they have their first 2 years of college done.

They are also very active in the Civil Air Patrol and their Church.

All family members also pitch in to cook all meals at home, keep a clean home and talk care of 2 dogs, a cat and an African Grey Parrot.

I know people who work during the day and home school their children in the evening after their day at work.

You will not convince me that home schooling children means that she cannot do anything else but home school.


I know many families who home school and are just as good at running a business, jobs etc.


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## WorkingOnMe

Regarding giving us the whole story, what does your username mean? "Polyman"....is this your only wife? Do you see other women? What's the poly reference for?


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## EleGirl

Polyman said:


> Does taxes every year, but that earning is spent as she sees fit. She is not a shallow high maintenance spender and is usually spent on many kids activities and programs, but it is not included in family budget expenses. In other words, I have no say to that income is how it's been.


How much does she earn doing taxes? Surely she shows this when she files your taxes.

How much say does she have in how the money you earn is spent?


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## EleGirl

sandc said:


> I dunno... ask your wife for a detailed accounting of what she needs the money for. If it seems reasonable I don't see why you wouldn't give it to her. If it's unreasonable, why is she asking?
> 
> Something is just not adding up here and I can't put my finger on it.


She's working at home as a SAHM. She should have some $$ that she can spend on herself and not have to account for. I don't know what that amount is.. it could be $40 a month or $400 a month or more depending on their finances.


----------



## janefw

EleGirl said:


> It sounds like he does not earn enough money to support the family. If he does not then she does need to help support the family.


I disagree. I think that he needs to improve his money earning potential by studying, or gaining certification or bettering himself in his field. Or taking a second job.



> This might mean that she cannot home school the children.


Why would they change the schooling of their children at this point? 



> On the other hand it takes 3 hours a day to home school children.
> 
> By brother and his wife homeschool their children. They both also run a construction business. He works goes to work early. She spends the 3 hours homes schooling them in the morning. Then the kids do their other activities while she puts through the bids, does the billing, planning, buying, etc.


That is TWO people, working together, and the way that they do it. Maybe some homeschooling parents spend more time than that homeschooling their kids - particularly four kids. I also know people who homeschool, and they do not cram it into three hours a day.



> While the children are doing thier lessons (they guy a cariculum) she can also work. She is not instruction them the entire 3 hours.


How do you know what she is doing and for how long?



> For high school their children will be taking advantage of the local on-line high school and attending a local community college.. it's a program through the local school system in which high school kids attend community college for the last 2 years of high school. They graduate at the same time with the high school diploma and an assiciates degree. So they have their first 2 years of college done.


LOL. This couple has been together for 14 years. Even if they had their first child in year , second in year 2, etc, they are still a long way away from getting their kids into college.



> All family members also pitch in to cook all meals at home, keep a clean home and talk care of 2 dogs, a cat and an African Grey Parrot.


But that's all family members. He's not home, remember? That leaves it all on her.



> I know people who work during the day and home school their children in the evening after their day at work.


Not at all an ideal situation, and most parents would not choose to leave their kids under the care of a stranger, then come home after an exhausting day at work and start up again, teaching the kids. It is not a good solution for either the kids or the parents.



> You will not convince me that home schooling children means that she cannot do anything else but home school.
> 
> I know many families who home school and are just as good at running a business, jobs etc.


Good for you. And I know people who put the welfare of their children first, and spend the amount of time necessary, not only to teach their kids, but also to spend the time that kids need with their parents, so that they grow up whole and not neglected. Money isn't everything.


----------



## janefw

Polyman said:


> Does taxes every year, but that earning is spent as she sees fit.


I don't agree with that - unless you keep her so short of money or you waste money, and so she knows she has to keep these earnings separate. But if you don't have a joint checking account (and why don't you?) then neither of you know what the other is spending, right?



> She is not a shallow high maintenance spender and is usually spent on many kids activities and programs, but it is not included in family budget expenses. In other words, I have no say to that income is how it's been.


So now you do have a budget? Color me confused ...


----------



## Polyman

EleGirl said:


> So your wife works hard raising 4 children and home schooling them. But she gets no spending money of her own even for gas and activities with the children?
> 
> So you do not earn enough to support your children having a SAHM who home schools.
> 
> This is what I'm getting out of what you have told us so far.'
> 
> It's ok if this is the case. Either you will need to up your earning ability or your wife will need to go to work (at home or not).
> 
> It also sounds like you do not share the details of your finances with your wife, then you get upset when she does not know what they are.
> 
> I could be wrong but this is what it's sounding like.


She chose to homeschool and I supported it. I don't HAVE her doing it. Never said she is not supposed to have any money or I can't. She deserves this and maybe more. But the constant hostility, uncompromising, and togetherness is draining and I think has affected my assertiveness in money pursuit. I work 2 jobs and have a bachelors. Work in an industry I enjoy but takes a while to move up and promotion. She is a superwoman type and can put more on herself than she needs. In terms of the finances, there is a lot we did wrong and I have been saying that we have to make a transition into being a financially responsible family as opposed to irresponsible. Which means we finally work together within the means and set goals for the future. She is just tired and ready to "be out". I feel empowered if we work as a team. Negativity stagnates and takes a lot out of me which is the case often. This is my weakness and struggle.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Polyman

WorkingOnMe said:


> Regarding giving us the whole story, what does your username mean? "Polyman"....is this your only wife? Do you see other women? What's the poly reference for?


Lol. Again this is to be kind of provocative also. NO, We are NOT Polymourous and yes my only wife.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## janefw

Why the emphasis on being provocative?


----------



## sandc

EleGirl said:


> She's working at home as a SAHM. She should have some $$ that she can spend on herself and not have to account for. I don't know what that amount is.. it could be $40 a month or $400 a month or more depending on their finances.


I see what you're saying but I account for everything I spend. Mostly because my wife was an accountant by profession.  I don't think it's unreasonable to ask where the money went. I don't have a say in every penny my wife spends but by the same token she's very open about where she's spending it. I trust that when she says she needs to spend money, well then, she needs to spend money.

But there seems to be some veil of secrecy regarding some of this money that just doesn't add up.


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## WorkingOnMe

As a tax CPA myself I can assure you that her earning potential is quite high. We are a very small firm and pay our beginning associates nearly $50k. And with just a few years experience associates earn substantially more. I see them being short on money as a pure lifestyle choice.


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## WorkingOnMe

Polyman said:


> Lol. Again this is to be kind of provocative also. NO, We are NOT Polymourous and yes my only wife.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Was the content of the thread also meant to be provocative? Is this all a theoretical exercise? Are you trolling?


----------



## captainkbt

Polyman said:


> We have been together for almost 14 years and have 4 children. In the beginning, in our mid 20's, we had a very close and love relationship. Sex may have been every day, some multiple times a day. We are pretty devout religiously and felt that Divine presence brought us together spiritually. My wife has a Masters degree, but I am the only one working and make a very modest income. I admit that I have always struggled financially, and though she is not high maintenance may feel like she has given more than I have. We are both very sexual and she would dress up in lilngerie and heels often. Since we have been having more problems and going to see a MC, she is demanding I give her $400 as an allowance. She says I have not put her 1st financillay and she has had to depend on her brothers and father for a lot of stuff. So now she wont have sex with me, unless I am giving her $100 a week! I'm not about to get pimped!! I have said that I may not be able to afford that 'every week'.
> 
> More I can say, but I want to see some of your responses...male and female please about how I should deal with this. Thanks.


Oh my gosh....this is wrong on so many levels I dont know where to begin.

Sounds like she is VERY high maintenance and it sounds like she is using sex as a tool/weapon to beat you over the head with which is very wrong. That should never happen in a healthy marriage. I would set some boundries here and tell her how that makes you feel reminding her that she gave some vows when getting married and that its not a business deal. Sounds like much MC is in order as this is not a healthy marriage.


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## EleGirl

janefw said:


> I disagree. I think that he needs to improve his money earning potential by studying, or gaining certification or bettering himself in his field. Or taking a second job.


He may or may not be able to do this. He will have to tell us. It’s one more thing that he has not elaborated on.


janefw said:


> Why would they change the schooling of their children at this point?


If they do not have enough money to live on they might have to change their children’s schooling. Their marriage sounds like it’s in serious trouble. If they divorce she will not be able to home school the children. I think they need to look at every possible solution that will keep their family together, even if it means that the children are no longer home schooled.


janefw said:


> That is TWO people, working together, and the way that they do it. Maybe some homeschooling parents spend more time than that homeschooling their kids - particularly four kids. I also know people who homeschool, and they do not cram it into three hours a day.


They are not cramming. The kids also do homework later in the day on their own just like public school children do. Many home schooling curriculums specify 3 hours of ‘classroom’ instruction/leaning a day. What they do is not hurting their children at all. They pass pass all state level exams at the highest levels.


janefw said:


> How do you know what she is doing and for how long?


Because I go other there and see what they are doing. Because I have discussed it extensively with them and their children.


janefw said:


> LOL. This couple has been together for 14 years. Even if they had their first child in year , second in year 2, etc, they are still a long way away from getting their kids into college.


Let’s say that their oldest is 13. He/she could got into a the high school early college program at age 16. If they have a child 13 or older it’s now time to start getting ready for this.


janefw said:


> But that's all family members. He's not home, remember? That leaves it all on her.


My brother is at work all day just like the OP is. It’s my SIL who takes care of the education and her part of running the business. So the situation is very much the same, There is no reason why the OP cannot come home, help keep the house clean, cook, shop, take kids to activities, etc. 


janefw said:


> Not at all an ideal situation, and most parents would not choose to leave their kids under the care of a stranger, then come home after an exhausting day at work and start up again, teaching the kids. It is not a good solution for either the kids or the parents.


Who says that the kids are with strangers? Often it’s a trusted family member. My mom took care of my son when he was little. She loved it. He loved it. The people a child has to love them the better. 




janefw said:


> Good for you. And I know people who put the welfare of their children first, and spend the amount of time necessary, not only to teach their kids, but also to spend the time that kids need with their parents, so that they grow up whole and not neglected. Money isn't everything.


There you go insulting people again who chose to run their families differently than you would. 
No money is not everything. But when there is not even enough money to pay for gas and chidren’s activities there’s an issue. Money becomes extremely important when there is not enough of it.


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## Polyman

janefw said:


> I think people may forget that she HAS a job - raising four children. If she had worked, they would have probably had to hire a nanny to care for that many children, and who does _that _to their kids if they are able to take care of the kids themselves? As they have been together for only 14 years, then even if they had a child every year, those children are still _all _minors. I have three children, and my husband is a SAHD. Two of those kids now drive themselves around, but when all three were minors, there was no way that he wasn't busy constantly taking them to school, taking them to sports and other events, and helping them with homework, etc. I am really gobsmacked that people are so negative about a SAH-parent role, and consider that not to be "work" or a "job".
> 
> I hope that she _does _have a car. I would hate to try to do any of that _without _a car.
> 
> 
> 
> Good grief. The attitudes of some people is incredible.



Yes. She has car too.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## janefw

EleGirl said:


> Because I go other there and see what they are doing. Because I have discussed it extensively with them and their children.


Not your friend - _this _wife and mom. You don't know her or how she homeschools her kids, or how long she spends with them.


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## janefw

EleGirl said:


> If they do not have enough money to live on they might have to change their children’s schooling. Their marriage sounds like it’s in serious trouble. If they divorce she will not be able to home school the children. I think they need to look at every possible solution that will keep their family together, even if it means that the children are no longer home schooled.


I just disagree. The children come first. He never said they don't have enough money to live on - he said that he doesn't make a lot of money. There is a difference. Getting by isn't a bad thing, so long as parents can raise their children the way that they believe is best. 



> They are not cramming. The kids also do homework later in the day on their own just like public school children do. Many home schooling curriculums specify 3 hours of ‘classroom’ instruction/leaning a day. What they do is not hurting their children at all. They pass pass all state level exams at the highest levels.


But that's the family that you know. I know families who spend their day also doing outdoor activities, because it's not just about books. They got to the park and they gather nature items. They also have socializing time with other homeschooling families and co-ops so that the kids aren't isolated. 



> My brother is at work all day just like the OP is. It’s my SIL who takes care of the education and her part of running the business. So the situation is very much the same, There is no reason why the OP cannot come home, help keep the house clean, cook, shop, take kids to activities, etc.


They are both working on the same business, are they not? That's what I thought you said. They don't have a business they can both work on. She would have to have an entirely separate place to do her business from, that was quiet and uninterrupted.



> There you go insulting people again who chose to run their families differently than you would.
> No money is not everything. But when there is not even enough money to pay for gas and chidren’s activities there’s an issue. Money becomes extremely important when there is not enough of it.


Again, he never said there was no money. He is just complaining that his wife wants money for sex. Supposedly.


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## EleGirl

Polyman said:


> She chose to homeschool and I supported it. I don't HAVE her doing it. Never said she is not supposed to have any money or I can't. She deserves this and maybe more. But the constant hostility, uncompromising, and togetherness is draining and I think has affected my assertiveness in money pursuit. I work 2 jobs and have a bachelors. Work in an industry I enjoy but takes a while to move up and promotion. She is a superwoman type and can put more on herself than she needs. In terms of the finances, there is a lot we did wrong and I have been saying that we have to make a transition into being a financially responsible family as opposed to irresponsible. Which means we finally work together within the means and set goals for the future. She is just tired and ready to "be out". I feel empowered if we work as a team. Negativity stagnates and takes a lot out of me which is the case often. This is my weakness and struggle.


I don’t think I said that you ‘have’ her home schooling… but that she is homeschooling.
I agree that the two of you need to work together on your finances and on solutions. If she is fighting this then there is a huge problem.

Does she realize what it would mean to “be out”? Does she realize that she will no longer be able to home school your children? That she will have to work full time to support herself and the children? That you will most likely have 50% custody so that she will be childless half of the time? And she will be earning a good income so the child support you pay might be low, or she might be paying child support to you?
And with 4 young children, her chances of finding someone to support her is very slim.

Has anyone pointed out to her that she has a lot of reasons to sit down with you and figure this out?

Since she has been taking money from her family and keeps her tax prep money, it sounds like she has a problem with the level of income you are bringing in to support the family. Since you already work 2 jobs she is going to have to fill in for the extra income she wants for give up this expectation. That’s what we call reality.

Has anyone told her this reality?


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## janefw

> There you go insulting people again who chose to run their families differently than you would.


What you are perceiving to be an insult is simply my take on how a family should, I guess, 'work'. The child/ren should be the priority during his/her/their young years. I have nothing against single parents, but I do think that parents who both work 80 hour weeks shouldn't really have children, because they are invariably raised by nannies or other people who are not their parents. You have a success story with your son, but there are others who have seen tremendous damage done to their children by bad 'carers' and by parental neglect. I do feel that parents should not conceive a child without having a really good, doable 'plan' for his/her/their upbringing. A parent at home is always the best choice - mom or dad. Failing that, then at least one parent who can be there for the vast majority of the time, and who is fully involved in the kid/s life or lives. Otherwise, they shouldn't bother having kids, but just get a beta fish or something.


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## EleGirl

janefw said:


> Not your friend - _this _wife and mom. You don't know her or how she homeschools her kids, or how long she spends with them.


What you do not get is that his wife is talking about wanting out... you know... out of the marriage... you know like divorce.

If she divorces him she will need to work full time. She might even end up paying him child support with him having 50% custody. 

Some of us are trying to give alternatives that might help satisfy the things that are causing his wife problems. We are SUGGESTING things. And all you can do is to attack anyone who does not agree with your point of view.


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## EleGirl

janefw said:


> What you are perceiving to be an insult is simply my take on how a family should, I guess, 'work'. The child/ren should be the priority during his/her/their young years. I have nothing against single parents, but I do think that parents who both work 80 hour weeks shouldn't really have children, because they are invariably raised by nannies or other people who are not their parents. You have a success story with your son, but there are others who have seen tremendous damage done to their children by bad 'carers' and by parental neglect. I do feel that parents should not conceive a child without having a really good, doable 'plan' for his/her/their upbringing. A parent at home is always the best choice - mom or dad. Failing that, then at least one parent who can be there for the vast majority of the time, and who is fully involved in the kid/s life or lives. Otherwise, they shouldn't bother having kids, but just get a beta fish or something.


Thanks goodness you do not set the rules for the rest of the population. Other can make their own choices and they produce some pretty wonderful children, even not living by your rules.

Most families I know have both parents working and most have very good children who do very well in life.

I can give you a long list of SAH parents, mostly women, who have messed up their kids so bad that it’s horrible. Like the SAHM who produced 3 drug addicts, all of whom have done prison time. Or the one whose 5 children are into the production of meth… one is now in prison with a 20 year sentence. 

I can also give you a long list of SAHM’s who home school but are so uneducated themselves that they have no business trying to teach their children. How about the SAHM I know who homeschooled her children and used the isolation to indoctrinate her children into hating their father who worked his butt off with 2 jobs so that she’d have the privilege of being a SAHM who home schooled?


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## EleGirl

janefw said:


> Again, he never said there was no money. He is just complaining that his wife wants money for sex. Supposedly.


He said that he does not always have enough money to give her money for gas, child activities. His example was that he has a $700 auto bill to pay. So there is no money for these things.


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## EleGirl

janefw said:


> But that's the family that you know. I know families who spend their day also doing outdoor activities, because it's not just about books. They got to the park and they gather nature items. They also have socializing time with other homeschooling families and co-ops so that the kids aren't isolated.


Did I say that they do not also do these things? NO .... It's not all about the books.


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## EleGirl

janefw,
I'm going to try to not respond to you any more on this thread because we simply disagree.

YOu think that there is only one way to structure a family.

I believe that many good people have come up with ways to structure their family differently. They have mostly raised children who grow into good, productive adults.

And I know for a fact that being a SAHM and home schools is not a formula that always raises children the right way. I've seen it first hand.

So we will have to agree to disagree.


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## sandc

But EleGirl, you do agree that it can? Because that is my situation and my wife and children are doing just fine.


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## janefw

EleGirl said:


> janefw,
> I'm going to try to not respond to you any more on this thread because we simply disagree.
> 
> YOu think that there is only one way to structure a family.
> 
> I believe that many good people have come up with ways to structure their family differently. They have mostly raised children who grow into good, productive adults.
> 
> And I know for a fact that being a SAHM and home schools is not a formula that always raises children the right way. I've seen it first hand.
> 
> So we will have to agree to disagree.


You know, we agree a lot more than we disagree. I have a great deal of respect for the way that you brought your son up alone. You obviously did a great job. Just as you see me holding to one way to structure a family - I consider you to be at least partially blind to the difference between raising one child and raising more than one child. It is an entirely different dynamic. That doesn't make the parents of 'multiple' children better than you or more special than you - it just means it is different. 

I also know that homeschooling isn't always the best way. I have seen a parent who herself struggles with grammar and spelling pass on her own mistakes to her kids.  That really saddens me. But I hope that the other things she does will make up for it at some point, especially the fantastically loving, supportive, close knit family she has given her kids. Sure, that won't mean much when the kids are making college applications, but in my college career, I came across a LOT of students who could not spell or formulate a proper sentence, and I doubt they were all homeschooled.

I differ from you because I do believe strongly that it's better for a child to be raised by one stay at home parent. That's not a criticism of YOU personally, it's just the way I think is best, if it can be worked out. You tell me - do you think it's okay for these high achieving parents to spit out kids and then ignore them? Gosh, look at the British royal family!! If you ever seen any old newsreel (which, no reason you should) there is an especially poignant and sad moment where Prince Charles (then about 10, maybe) goes to meet his parents, and he shakes hands with his mom/the Queen.  And she lets him! No hugs, no kisses. I know that is an exception, because we aren't all royalty, but there are many more families than there should be, where the children come secondary to parental careers. Fine, have your careers - rise to the top of your profession by working a 15 hour day (including weekends) - just don't have kids. Some of the most messed up, screwed up, delinquent, scarred kids I have come across have come from this high achiever families - not from the poor, 'disadvantaged' families.

I am not saying for a moment that women shouldn't have careers. That's not what I think at all. It just needs balance. That's all.


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## janefw

EleGirl said:


> What you do not get is that his wife is talking about wanting out... you know... out of the marriage... you know like divorce.


You are correct that I missed that. It would be a mistake on her part.



> Some of us are trying to give alternatives that might help satisfy the things that are causing his wife problems. We are SUGGESTING things. And all you can do is to attack anyone who does not agree with your point of view.


I thought we were having a discussion based upon our different takes on this. I don't see these as attacks, simply an expression of my opinion, based upon my experience and knowledge. At no point have I made any attacking remarks (i.e. this person is stupid or whatever), and if I have, please feel free to report them.


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## janefw

EleGirl said:


> He said that he does not always have enough money to give her money for gas, child activities. His example was that he has a $700 auto bill to pay. So there is no money for these things.


And that's why they need and agreed budget - and savings. It's not her 'fault' they didn't have the money.


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## tennisstar

Jane, I'm going to second Elegirl. Most of the women I know work, even though they have children. Their children have turned out fine. As a single mom, I had to work while my son was young. He is now grown and is an outstanding young man. He works hard and told me that he learned the value of hard work from me. 

I do know some SAHMs, but most have husbands who make a large amount of money. Most of them have nannies and housekeepers. Most of them live a pretty easy life. I know this certainly isn't the case for women staying home and raising children, though. I just don't know too many SAHMs who are working hard everyday. Of course, just my experience. 

Basically, I think you are somewhat judgmental about moms who work. If you've had the fortune to be a SAHM, consider yourself lucky. Most moms do not have that luxury. And it isn't because they are living the high life. Things are very expensive, and it most often takes two incomes for families to make it.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## EleGirl

janefw said:


> *I consider you to be at least partially blind to the difference between raising one child and raising more than one child*. It is an entirely different dynamic. That doesn't make the parents of 'multiple' children better than you or more special than you - it just means it is different.


I grew up with 7 siblings. I have a clue how a large family can work.

Oh and in the ended up raising 3 children, not just my son. When my son was 10 I remarried and my new husaband moved in with his two DD10 and DS12. I raised them alogn with my son without much help financially or otherwise from their father and mother. So yes I absolutely have a clue about large family dynamics.

I was only talking about my son earlier as an example. Did not know I had to qualify as the mother of more than one.


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## EleGirl

sandc said:


> But EleGirl, you do agree that it can? Because that is my situation and my wife and children are doing just fine.


Of course I agree that a SHAM/D and home schooling and all of that can work. 

I believe that there are many ways to raise children, even large families in which the children can be raised very well. Basically I do not agree that there is only one way to structure a family. I'm trying to provide the OP with alternatives that might help him keep his family together. 

I think it's wrong to guilt him into thinking that SHAM w/homeschooling is a must or his children will turn into delinquents and fail in life. (Not saying that you are doing this.)


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## janefw

tennisstar said:


> Jane, I'm going to second Elegirl. Most of the women I know work, even though they have children. Their children have turned out fine. As a single mom, I had to work while my son was young. He is now grown and is an outstanding young man. He works hard and told me that he learned the value of hard work from me.
> 
> I do know some SAHMs, but most have husbands who make a large amount of money. Most of them have nannies and housekeepers. Most of them live a pretty easy life. I know this certainly isn't the case for women staying home and raising children, though. I just don't know too many SAHMs who are working hard everyday. Of course, just my experience.
> 
> Basically, I think you are somewhat judgmental about moms who work. If you've had the fortune to be a SAHM, consider yourself lucky. Most moms do not have that luxury. And it isn't because they are living the high life. Things are very expensive, and it most often takes two incomes for families to make it.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


You couldn't be more wrong about me. I have worked my whole adult life, other than time out for college (although I continued to work part time) and 2 years as a SAHM. This was during my second (and present) marriage. We have a blended family and I took over my husband's 2 sons from his first marriage (both of whom he has full custody of) and then a year later our son. So I spent those 2 years full time raising the kids until my husband had a massive, unexplained hearing loss and he was "boarded" out of the military. At that point, I had no choice but to go back to work. Trust me- I know all about needing to work. That was in 2002 and I remain the breadwinner. I missed the opportunity to raise the kids full time. I had to deal with my youngest kid crying every day I left the house, and that memory still hurts. Ideally I would have remained the SAH parent but it wasn't to be. That's fine. We have raised (and will continue to raise) three awesome boys, with my husband fulfilling the SAH role. We have my wage and his benefits (from his disabled veteran status) so we are luckier than many, but IMO people shouldn't have kids that they have no time to raise. They miss out on their kids, and their kids miss out on them. Caregivers - however good - don't have the same investment, and nor should they. The parents need to be there, and if a couple both have an 80 hour work week, I maintain that they should not have kids that they will barely be raising. That's my opinion. Not a judgement (that would be if I said 'people who work 80 hours and have kids are evil'), but I have as much right to it my opinion as those who think it's okay to work all those hours and hand their kids over to nannies. There's no need for anything to be judgmental or mean - perhaps we might all have something to learn from each other!


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## EleGirl

janefw said:


> And that's why they need and agreed budget - and savings. It's not her 'fault' they didn't have the money.


It's not his fault that they do not have enough money. He has a college degree and is working 2 jobs. He is probably working very long hours and gets very little time with his children.

I have another brother (#2) who did this while his wife was a SAHM and she home schooled. One of the lessons she taught the children was that their father did not love them because he worked 60-80 hour weeks to support the family. As soon as the youngest turned 18 she filed for divorce. And his children will not talk to him... do you know why? Because they are convinced that mom is right.. he does not love them because she spend his life giving them a SAHM. I hate to say it but the are the most selfish children I've ever seen. My bother has a serious life threatening survgery last year and his daughter would not even go see him. 

I hope that the OP is not doing what my brother #2 did. With his wife's attitude he needs to seriously consider what she is passing on to the children.

The other brother I spoke of earlier #3. 

Brother #1 has 6 children.. he and his wife both worked. He has wonderful chidren.. all grown now and doing very well.


----------



## EleGirl

janefw said:


> You couldn't be more wrong about me. I have worked my whole adult life, other than time out for college (although I continued to work part time) and 2 years as a SAHM. This was during my second (and present) marriage. We have a blended family and I took over my husband's 2 sons from his first marriage (both of whom he has full custody of) and then a year later our son. So I spent those 2 years full time raising the kids until my husband had a massive, unexplained hearing loss and he was "boarded" out of the military. At that point, I had no choice but to go back to work. Trust me- I know all about needing to work. That was in 2002 and I remain the breadwinner. I missed the opportunity to raise the kids full time. I had to deal with my youngest kid crying every day I left the house, and that memory still hurts. Ideally I would have remained the SAH parent but it wasn't to be. That's fine. We have raised (and will continue to raise) three awesome boys, with my husband fulfilling the SAH role. We have my wage and his benefits (from his disabled veteran status) so we are luckier than many, but IMO people shouldn't have kids that they have no time to raise. They miss out on their kids, and their kids miss out on them. Caregivers - however good - don't have the same investment, and nor should they. The parents need to be there, and if a couple both have an *80 hour work week*, I maintain that they should not have kids that they will barely be raising. That's my opinion. Not a judgement (that would be if I said 'people who work 80 hours and have kids are evil'), but I have as much right to it my opinion as those who think it's okay to work all those hours and hand their kids over to nannies. There's no need for anything to be judgmental or mean - perhaps we might all have something to learn from each other!


Who on here is suggesting that both parents should work an 80 hour work week? I certainly am not. HOw aout a 40 hour week. Or one works parttime if income is absolutely needed.


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## janefw

EleGirl said:


> I grew up with 7 siblings. I have a clue how a large family can work.
> 
> Oh and in the end I raised 3 children, not just my son. When my son was 10 I remarried and my new husaband moved in with his two DD10 and DS12. I raised them alogn with my son without much help financially or otherwise from their father and mother. So yes I absolutely have a clue about large family dynamics.
> 
> I was only talking about my son earlier as an example. Did not know I had to qualify as the mother of more than one.


hmmm if it's going to get emotional, I'm out. I didn't say that anyone had to qualify. If you raised someone else's kids on your own (which sounds crazy, but then I also raised another woman's kids, although not alone) then more power to you. But you said you raised one kid with your mom's help. Anyway, as I have said multiple times, this guy' s set up can be changed by HIM improving his earning potential also. No need to uproot kids and push them suddenly into school and - again - the ages of the kids is NOT known, and for her to go looking for a job, which itself will mean the expense of a nanny, and a new wardrobe, before she even gets hired. You don't walk into a $100k job after 14 years at home, regardless of your qualifications on paper. I do know about these things on a firsthand basis in my work life. Their best bet is to sit down and actually have an honest and open dialog about their financial situation. Then draw up a budget. And take it from there. First things first! And part of that dialog is deciding what is best for the kids I.e. not just the adults.


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## janefw

I give up. I'll go back to the OP. Dave Ramsey has an excellent program on how to get back on track financially. Please look into it. What you do need is to play to your strengths. If your wife's strengths are financial planning and finances, it's crazy not to utilize those strengths. Demanding that she get a job will only cause further alienation and may harm your children, so it makes sense to have a serious sit-down, 'state of the nation' (family) conversation. And do it now, don't just wait for disaster to befall you.


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## mrstj4sho88

janefw said:


> Well that's a problem with your eyes, not with my words. An attack would be "you are a useless parent" which I did not say and did not think. You are stirring the pot here, and you need to drop the spoon. If the person in question has a problem with me, she can tell me.


* Let's stay on topic and help the OP with his wife and his problem. The topic is Money for sex ..with my wife *.


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## EleGirl

janefw said:


> hmmm if it's going to get emotional, I'm out. I didn't say that anyone had to qualify.


Ok, I was being snarky.. I was trying to give an example and not write a book when I only spoke of one child. He was 10 when I remarried. So I raised him for 10 years as an only child. 


janefw said:


> If you raised someone else's kids on your own (which sounds crazy, but then I also raised another woman's kids, although not alone) then more power to you. But you said you raised one kid


Well once the children were living in my home what was I to do? Kick them out? Their own SAHM did not want them anymore. She walked out on them. Their own father apparently had a nervous breakdown and became of no help whatsoever. 

When they came to live with me I promised them that I would not leave them as their mother did. I could not kick them out on the street or to foster care. I don’t have the stomach for that. Plus I love them.



janefw said:


> with your mom's help.


I did not say that I raised him with my mother’s help. That implies that she was there all the time. She was the childcare giver for him until he was 4 and stared school. She then got too ill to take care of him. That’s when I started hiring high school & colllege kids and eventually a part time nanny (or in-home care giver).



janefw said:


> hmmm if it's going to get emotional, I'm out. I didn't say that anyone had to qualify. If you raised someone else's kids on your own (which sounds crazy, but then I also raised another woman's kids, although not alone) then more power to you. But you said you raised one kid with your mom's help.


I was talking about what I did to raise my son. I was on my own with him mostly even before we divorced as his dad was in medical school and I was the sole support.


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## mrstj4sho88

janefw said:


> You know, we agree a lot more than we disagree. I have a great deal of respect for the way that you brought your son up alone. You obviously did a great job. Just as you see me holding to one way to structure a family - I consider you to be at least partially blind to the difference between raising one child and raising more than one child. It is an entirely different dynamic. That doesn't make the parents of 'multiple' children better than you or more special than you - it just means it is different.
> 
> I also know that homeschooling isn't always the best way. I have seen a parent who herself struggles with grammar and spelling pass on her own mistakes to her kids.  That really saddens me. But I hope that the other things she does will make up for it at some point, especially the fantastically loving, supportive, close knit family she has given her kids. Sure, that won't mean much when the kids are making college applications, but in my college career, I came across a LOT of students who could not spell or formulate a proper sentence, and I doubt they were all homeschooled.
> 
> I differ from you because I do believe strongly that it's better for a child to be raised by one stay at home parent. That's not a criticism of YOU personally, it's just the way I think is best, if it can be worked out. You tell me - do you think it's okay for these high achieving parents to spit out kids and then ignore them? Gosh, look at the British royal family!! If you ever seen any old newsreel (which, no reason you should) there is an especially poignant and sad moment where Prince Charles (then about 10, maybe) goes to meet his parents, and he shakes hands with his mom/the Queen.  And she lets him! No hugs, no kisses. I know that is an exception, because we aren't all royalty, but there are many more families than there should be, where the children come secondary to parental careers. Fine, have your careers - rise to the top of your profession by working a 15 hour day (including weekends) - just don't have kids. Some of the most messed up, screwed up, delinquent, scarred kids I have come across have come from this high achiever families - not from the poor, 'disadvantaged' families.
> 
> I am not saying for a moment that women shouldn't have careers. That's not what I think at all. It just needs balance. That's all.


*Can you please stay on topic and help the OP....Please stop with the your life and what anyone should and should not do.You are not helping the OP...We all need to stay on topic and that is the OP...Not us...Please stop being mean to other posters and just help the OP.....*


----------



## EleGirl

mrstj4sho88 said:


> * Let's stay on topic and help the OP with his wife and his problem. The topic is Money for sex ..with my wife *.


Well the topic is more broad than that. He explained that he used that title to be provocative. And he explained more in subsequent posts.

It's more about his wife wanting more $400 a month to cover gas for her car, for child activities, etc. And the OP saying that he does not always have that much to give her. 

It sounds like a stuggle over control, power, money and her wanting out of the marriage (maybe). He posted more on that.

This is why the topic of her possibly working to bring in extra income came up by some posters.


----------



## janefw

mrstj4sho88 said:


> *Can you please stay on topic and help the OP....Please stop with the your life and what anyone should and should not do.You are not helping the OP...We all need to stay on topic and that is the OP...Not us...Please stop being mean to other posters and just help the OP.....*


Seriously? I have posted my comments to the OP multiple times and I am not the only one who posted personal information about my own experiences so why pick on me? I have not been mean to anyone, simply responded to them as they posted to me. In the name of fairness, I hope you post this same 'reprimand' to everyone who went off topic - which was somewhere on page 2.


----------



## mrstj4sho88

EleGirl said:


> Well the topic is more broad than that. He explained that he used that title to be provocative. And he explained more in subsequent posts.
> 
> It's more about his wife wanting more $400 a month to cover gas for her car, for child activities, etc. And the OP saying that he does not always have that much to give her.
> 
> It sounds like a stuggle over control, power, money and her wanting out of the marriage (maybe). He posted more on that.
> 
> This is why the topic of her possibly working to bring in extra income came up by some posters.


*I was one of the posters that mentioned it too. But the cat fat within others poster life as a single mother is off topic. I hope we can stay on topic.. *


----------



## janefw

mrstj4sho88 said:


> *I was one of the posters that mentioned it too. But the cat fat within others poster life as a single mother is off topic. I hope we can stay on topic.. *


Cat fat?


----------



## WorkingOnMe

Lol cat fight?


----------



## bkaydezz

Polyman said:


> We have been together for almost 14 years and have 4 children. In the beginning, in our mid 20's, we had a very close and love relationship. Sex may have been every day, some multiple times a day. We are pretty devout religiously and felt that Divine presence brought us together spiritually. My wife has a Masters degree, but I am the only one working and make a very modest income. I admit that I have always struggled financially, and though she is not high maintenance may feel like she has given more than I have. We are both very sexual and she would dress up in lilngerie and heels often. Since we have been having more problems and going to see a MC, she is demanding I give her $400 as an allowance. She says I have not put her 1st financillay and she has had to depend on her brothers and father for a lot of stuff. So now she wont have sex with me, unless I am giving her $100 a week! I'm not about to get pimped!! I have said that I may not be able to afford that 'every week'.
> 
> More I can say, but I want to see some of your responses...male and female please about how I should deal with this. Thanks.


I have to laugh because i just love how you put not about to be pimped !!!!!:rofl:


But thats a joke.
I think she has obviously been left out of somethign for her to feel like you owe her so much. But she still shouldnt be wanting you to pay her for something super intoxicating that is spirituall like you said in the first place.

thats so werid!


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## RandomDude

Oh really? Hell I would just said "I'm sorry I don't do wh--es"

Though you might probably start a fight but lol
Actually DONT say that lol


----------



## WorkingOnMe

RandomDude said:


> Oh really? Hell I would just said "I'm sorry I don't do wh--es"
> 
> Though you might probably start a fight but lol
> Actually DONT say that lol


Ironic.


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## RandomDude

Life is an irony


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## Polyman

janefw said:


> I don't agree with that - unless you keep her so short of money or you waste money, and so she knows she has to keep these earnings separate. But if you don't have a joint checking account (and why don't you?) then neither of you know what the other is spending, right?
> 
> 
> So now you do have a budget? Color me confused ...


Look. She stopped because she felt she was doing too much and wanted me to take care of everything. She was. But then went to the opposite extreme. She is a this or that, black or white kind person. I am not.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Polyman

janefw said:


> Why the emphasis on being provocative?


This was my first time here. I wanted and welcome the responses. I am always trying to be a better me. I'm willing to hear the ugly truth if its constructive. I have been hoping for a site like this. I want to hear other experiences and perspectives.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Polyman

WorkingOnMe said:


> Was the content of the thread also meant to be provocative? Is this all a theoretical exercise? Are you trolling?


No. This real stuff. Guaranteed. Very unorthodox situation I know.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## EleGirl

Polyman said:


> No. This real stuff. Guaranteed. Very unorthodox situation I know.


She's telling you something very important about how she feels. Too bad she cannot seem to articulate it in a much more useful manner.

You might even want to call her bluf. Just tell her ok, if she wants to charge for sex you will leave her alone and keep the money. But if she wants to talk about things on a deeper level you are all ears.


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## Polyman

EleGirl said:


> It's not his fault that they do not have enough money. He has a college degree and is working 2 jobs. He is probably working very long hours and gets very little time with his children.
> 
> I have another brother (#2) who did this while his wife was a SAHM and she home schooled. One of the lessons she taught the children was that their father did not love them because he worked 60-80 hour weeks to support the family. As soon as the youngest turned 18 she filed for divorce. And his children will not talk to him... do you know why? Because they are convinced that mom is right.. he does not love them because she spend his life giving them a SAHM. I hate to say it but the are the most selfish children I've ever seen. My bother has a serious life threatening survgery last year and his daughter would not even go see him.
> 
> I hope that the OP is not doing what my brother #2 did. With his wife's attitude he needs to seriously consider what she is passing on to the children.
> 
> The other brother I spoke of earlier #3.
> 
> Brother #1 has 6 children.. he and his wife both worked. He has wonderful chidren.. all grown now and doing very well.


Yes. You get it! And guess what. Tonight after some arguments over money after I gave her some money and the kids complained about dinner. I said I was going out to buy dinner tonight, but was taking a power nap on couch before going...it was 5:50 pm. She said go tell your dad and basically made me look like I wasn't doing enough to make sure they are fed. They had some pizza for lunch about 2.5 hours earlier. This was probably said over because of angrier earlier argument. Basically making me look like a loser in front if kids. Not a usual thing. Bad PMS twice a month contributes to much or most of this toxicity when it happens. Let me add this, there was also a minor EA with first teenage love. My friend told me it would be all down hill from there. He has been right.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Polyman

bkaydezz said:


> I have to laugh because i just love how you put not about to be pimped !!!!!:rofl:
> 
> 
> But thats a joke.
> I think she has obviously been left out of somethign for her to feel like you owe her so much. But she still shouldnt be wanting you to pay her for something super intoxicating that is spirituall like you said in the first place.
> 
> Famous Pimp Iceberg Slim said he " flipped the game" and would not have sex with his women unt they paid him. That's called pimpology 101...lol. JS
> thats so werid!


_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Polyman

We have been on and off for a long time and may have to separate. It got really ugly tonight in front of the kids. Anyone know about this 180? Thinking bout doing it. Also FYI, we were friends and she got with a guy I knew was bad for her. Married him and had baby, and M did not last one year. This was after I tried to save her from it. After their divorce, we got engaged and later married with an infant who was my stepdaughter. I was not in the best position to take this task on financially and then she got pregnant 3 months later into the M. Every time try and move forward, we get pregnant. I ended up getting a vasectomy, she refused any b control on her part so didn't have much choice if to stay married. Been many sacrifices on both sides. I understand what she wants and want to give it to her. A close friend who observed us said he thought she likes to set me up for failure. Put something on me that is difficult and maybe unreasonable and make me feel bad when I'm slow to or don't achieve it. I'm just saying, this was his observation and I didn't want to agree with. But he had a point. I see it sometimes. Some people may do this to make themselves feel better about themselves. Superior. Your thoughts...
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## EleGirl

Polyman said:


> Yes. You get it! And guess what. Tonight after some arguments over money after I gave her some money and the kids complained about dinner. I said I was going out to buy dinner tonight, but was taking a power nap on couch before going...it was 5:50 pm. She said go tell your dad and basically made me look like I wasn't doing enough to make sure they are fed. They had some pizza for lunch about 2.5 hours earlier. This was probably said over because of angrier earlier argument. Basically making me look like a loser in front if kids. Not a usual thing. Bad PMS twice a month contributes to much or most of this toxicity when it happens. Let me add this, there was also a minor EA with first teenage love. My friend told me it would be all down hill from there. He has been right.


I'm sorry to say this, but if you separate, you can file for 50% custody. Then you will have 50% influence on your children. It will deminish any of this toxic stuff she does.


----------



## EleGirl

Polyman said:


> We have been on and off for a long time and may have to separate. It got really ugly tonight in front of the kids. Anyone know about this 180? Thinking bout doing it. Also FYI, we were friends and she got with a guy I knew was bad for her. Married him and had baby, and M did not last one year. This was after I tried to save her from it. After their divorce, we got engaged and later married with an infant who was my stepdaughter. I was not in the best position to take this task on financially and then she got pregnant 3 months later into the M. Every time try and move forward, we get pregnant. I ended up getting a vasectomy, she refused any b control on her part so didn't have much choice if to stay married. Been many sacrifices on both sides. I understand what she wants and want to give it to her. A close friend who observed us said he thought she likes to set me up for failure. Put something on me that is difficult and maybe unreasonable and make me feel bad when I'm slow to or don't achieve it. I'm just saying, this was his observation and I didn't want to agree with. But he had a point. I see it sometimes. Some people may do this to make themselves feel better about themselves. Superior. Your thoughts...


See the link to the 180 in my signature block below. I think it might do you a lot of good. It will help you protect yourself from her emotional outbursts.

Does she set you up for failure. Don't know enough to make that judgement. 

But it is clear that the meal thing tonight was a setup to make you look bad. Why on earth would she do that? YOu support her and the children, work 2 jobs. Not a good sign at all.


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## Blonde

Polyman said:


> Your thoughts...
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


You need better friends- who are supportive of marriage and of your marriage.


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## Blonde

I suggest you both go through FPU together. Financial Peace University - daveramsey.com

Right on this thread, I see you posting on a mobile device. Those don't come cheap. We don't have one of our own (though my husband's job pays for him to have one). And I see you bought dinner out instead of "beans and rice, rice and beans" as Dave would say.


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## Blonde

Polyman said:


> . She is just tired and ready to "be out".


What does that mean? I notice several have assumed it means "be out" of the marriage, but as a mom who gave up homeschooling and put my children in public school and went to school and then to work as an RN, I think she might mean "be out" of the 24/7 demanding lifestyle with a husband who considers money she gets an "allowance" and listens to friends who talk about her in very disrespectful terms...

Used to be my husband controlled all the finances and so his priorities ruled... among them antique tractors and strip clubbing, while I drove death trap cars with our home-schooled children (and their friends) in them and we had inadequate heat in the house and hot water and dryer did not work.

Good you are going to counseling (but it's expensive too!). We went to Retrouvaille in '04 and got a (poverty) scholarship so it only cost us $65 out of pocket. Very helpful program! Marriage Help Program For Couples


----------



## Blonde

Polyman said:


> Also FYI, we were friends and she got with a guy I knew was bad for her. Married him and had baby, and M did not last one year. This was after I tried to save her from it. After their divorce, we got engaged and later married with an infant who was my stepdaughter. I was not in the best position to take this task on financially and then she got pregnant 3 months later into the M. Every time try and move forward, we get pregnant.


First bad marriage -> baggage. You can help her to heal but not if you listen to your so-called friends cutting her down and criticizing her IMO. You can help her heal by appreciating her strength, talents, contributions to your marriage/family as a SAHM homeschooling mother. And you can help her heal by persistence in working through these issues.


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## Blonde

One more question. How old is your wife? I really hit the wall around age mid 40's (perimenopause). I am a new and transformed woman nowadays past menopause (I think for the better though hubs might argue with that )


----------



## Polyman

Blonde said:


> One more question. How old is your wife? I really hit the wall around age mid 40's (perimenopause). I am a new and transformed woman nowadays past menopause (I think for the better though hubs might argue with that )


We are in mid to late 30s.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Polyman

Blonde said:


> First bad marriage -> baggage. You can help her to heal but not if you listen to your so-called friends cutting her down and criticizing her IMO. You can help her heal by appreciating her strength, talents, contributions to our marriage/family as a SAHM homeschooling mother. And you can help her heal by persistence in working through these issues.


What. This is what I gave doing all along! She knows this. Friends and family know this. Her own family. She is amazing and I tell her this and have not made her feel like she has to work nor has to homeschool, but help guide her and support the decision she makes. We are in a very bad economy too you all know this right? Basic of good, gas, etc has increased over the years.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## See_Listen_Love

Be glad she is creating a discussion point. 

Other spouses complain their wives have an affair, that they should have talked about the problems.

She make a talking point you cannot rugsweep about. If you accept the situation to have no sex she knows what you are...a doormat. And she will act accordingly. Find someone else who can provide or leave you.

So....be grateful you received a big signal, be grateful you are here to get all the advice you could ever wish. Now pray for yourself to be able to decide and act on it.


----------



## Blonde

Polyman said:


> Basic of good, gas, etc has increased over the years.[/size]


Yes. Do you pay for the mobile device you are posting on? How much is that per month? How much do you spend eating out? Do you have any other costly habits? Dave Ramsey can help you get on a budget.

We homeschooled on one income and lived with very tight belts for many years. It can be done. And it sounds like your wife has the skills to do it. Why don't you hand the finances over to her to manage and you live on the "allowance"?


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## janefw

Blonde, I think you may be wasting your time. I have also mentioned Dave Ramsey, and getting a budget, and all the financial stuff they need to do to get straight. If he won't actually sit down and talk to her on the same level - instead of listening, as you said, to people who trash her, and taking on board their criticisms in his attitude towards her - then it won't change. The definition of madness is to keep on doing the same thing over and over, and expecting different results. They both are guilty of this, except obviously she is trying to break out of that. 

By the way, why does she have PMS twice a month? I never heard of a woman having periods twice a month. If she does, then she needs to go and see a GYN.


----------



## Polyman

Blonde said:


> Yes. Do you pay for the mobile device you are posting on? How much is that per month? How much do you spend eating out? Do you have any other costly habits? Dave Ramsey can help you get on a budget.
> 
> We homeschooled on one income and lived with very tight belts for many years. It can be done. And it sounds like your wife has the skills to do it. Why don't you hand the finances over to her to manage and you live on the "allowance"?


Yes. I am familiar with Dave Ramsey. Good reminder
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## janefw

Polyman said:


> Yes. I am familiar with Dave Ramsey. Good reminder


You have to do more than agree it's a good idea. You have to actually take action - go and sign up today. Tell your wife, get her excited and on board with your determination to turn your finances around.

p.s. I don't work for DR or anything - I just have been through his program, and I can highly recommend it.


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## Polyman

See she is better and should manage the finances, but it comes with a cost...unfair attempts at control. I said in this thread, there are control and anger issues probably from childhood baggage I don't want to get into here. Her emotional cycles are up and down often manifested in anger and confrontation.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## janefw

Polyman said:


> See she is better and should manage the finances, but it comes with a cost...unfair attempts at control. I said in this thread, there are control and anger issues probably from childhood baggage I don't want to get into here. Her emotional cycles are up and down often manifested in anger and confrontation.


If she controls the finances then she will be controlling the finances. I don't see there is any way around that. But you don't seem to be doing a very good job, so perhaps this is where compromise comes in. Is it that she doesn't let you spend money the way you want to spend it? Her "emotional cycles" (whatever those are) may be a lot to do with feeling she has no control over anything, and that she may find one week that there is no gas because you didn't budget for a car repair. If she has no access to money, well, I know that frustration well, because that was done to me in the first few months of my marriage. Not having money made me feel like I was an untrustworthy child - fit only to babysit the kids and make dinner. I would be livid if this situation still existed in my marriage - well, I wouldn't still be _in _this marriage. So, if that is how your wife has to live, I don't blame her for being confrontational and angry.


----------



## janefw

Polyman, whenever anyone comes up with a solution, you veer off into a complaint about your wife's behavior. Is there any point in continuing to give you advice if all you want to do is vent?


----------



## Polyman

janefw said:


> You have to do more than agree it's a good idea. You have to actually take action - go and sign up today. Tell your wife, get her excited and on board with your determination to turn your finances around.
> 
> p.s. I don't work for DR or anything - I just have been through his program, and I can highly recommend it.


I appreciate it, and I wl for sure take advantage of this with or without her. But our problems are more than financial. It just might be too late and I might have to deal with that.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## janefw

It will be too late if you just sit around talking about it and don't actually do anything .. but I'm probably done trying to persuade you of that now.


----------



## WorkingOnMe

I get the impression that polyman is very controlling and what he's dealing with is his wife rebelling against that.


----------



## Polyman

janefw said:


> Polyman, whenever anyone comes up with a solution, you veer off into a complaint about your wife's behavior. Is there any point in continuing to give you advice if all you want to do is vent?


Really! I have not rejected any of this advice. I have expressed my shortcomings and people have asked for more info and I am giving a more clear pic if both sides as best I can..,wth...
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## WorkingOnMe

Pm I suggest you read 'no more mr. Nice guy' I wonder if you try to control, but in a passive agressive way. I think that book would be very helpful to you.


----------



## Polyman

WorkingOnMe said:


> I get the impression that polyman is very controlling and what he's dealing with is his wife rebelling against that.


Omg!!! Ok. I will tell you your impression is wrong! Please explain how you came to that? Just the opposite...I was a yes man too much earlier letting her get her way because I wanted to be a "good man", so I have had to take more control in the marriage by her request btw, and she is rebelling against it.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## WorkingOnMe

Yes men can be controlling. Read the book I suggested. If you're not controlling then why not hand the finances over to her?


----------



## Polyman

Polyman said:


> Omg!!! Ok. I will tell you your impression is wrong! Please explain how you came to that? Just the opposite...I was a yes man too much earlier letting her get her way because I wanted to be a "good man", so I have had to take more control in the marriage by her request btw, and she is rebelling against it.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Furthermore, if I was the controlling one would I even care to be on here for advice.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Polyman

WorkingOnMe said:


> Yes men can be controlling. Read the book I suggested. If you're not controlling then why not hand the finances over to her?


I just explained this... And she is the one that handed them over to me. And you think women can't be controlling? The truth is human beings can be controlling, but men are more that women because the ego is larger in the male gender.,,,usually.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Blonde

Polyman said:


> She is actually better than me with money, she is an accountant.





Polyman said:


> She is not a shallow high maintenance spender





Polyman said:


> See she is better and should manage the finances, but it comes with a cost...unfair attempts at control. I said in this thread, there are control and anger issues probably from childhood baggage I don't want to get into here. Her emotional cycles are up and down often manifested in anger and confrontation.


So she is a careful spender and smart with money but you don't want to submit your spending to that wisdom?

Can't find a quote right now, but sounds like you may be secretive with your spending? What do you spend money on that she would cross off the budget if she were in charge? 

And just to lay this question to rest, what gender are the "friends" who are so unsupportive of your marriage in their advice?


----------



## Blonde

janefw said:


> If she controls the finances then she will be controlling the finances. I don't see there is any way around that. But you don't seem to be doing a very good job, so perhaps this is where compromise comes in. Is it that she doesn't let you spend money the way you want to spend it? Her "emotional cycles" (whatever those are) may be a lot to do with feeling she has no control over anything, and that she may find one week that there is no gas because you didn't budget for a car repair. If she has no access to money, well, I know that frustration well, because that was done to me in the first few months of my marriage. Not having money made me feel like I was an untrustworthy child - fit only to babysit the kids and make dinner. I would be livid if this situation still existed in my marriage - well, I wouldn't still be _in _this marriage. So, if that is how your wife has to live, I don't blame her for being confrontational and angry.


^^

Ooh yeah! My "emotional cycles" and "volcanic eruptions" diminished greatly when I dumped my stupid "male on top" theology, stopped depending on my husband to take care of me, and started taking care of my own needs.

We are still married, polyman, but now if I am driving around a death trap rustbucket, I contact 3 car dealers for prices and you better believe he gets right on Craig's list and starts looking instead of ignoring me and/or accusing me of being "contentious" or "unsubmissive". 

I like having "control" I feel ever so much more calm peaceful and horny


----------



## Polyman

Blonde said:


> So she is a careful spender and smart with money but you don't want to submit your spending to that wisdom?
> 
> Can't find a quote right now, but sounds like you may be secretive with your spending? What do you spend money on that she would cross off the budget if she were in charge?
> 
> And just to lay this question to rest, what gender are the "friends" who are so unsupportive of your marriage in their advice?


Who said I didn't want too?? "Cant find a quote".. what is that supposed to mean? What I want and what we NEED is a healthy balance and is what all couples to too have. Sounds to me like you just have some stereotypical issues with men in general.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Polyman

WorkingOnMe said:


> Pm I suggest you read 'no more mr. Nice guy' I wonder if you try to control, but in a passive agressive way. I think that book would be very helpful to you.


Will take a look at it but I have an idea of what you are saying. This may be true to some extent
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Blonde

Polyman said:


> Who said I didn't want too?? "Cant find a quote".. what is that supposed to mean? What I want and what we NEED is a healthy balance and is what all couples to too have. Sounds to me like you just have some stereotypical issues with men in general.


"stereotypical issues"? 
The Pot calling the Kettle black comes to mind. 




Polyman said:


> It's been like a power struggle and disharmony, she needing to be more *feminine* and me growing more manly and assertive. My mom was very docile and sweet if u will. Her father is a good guy, alpha control freak a Lil bit.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Polyman

Blonde...you are free to travel and create so w conflict in some other post. Thanks for your input...smh.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Blonde

Polyman said:


> Who said I didn't want too?? "Cant find a quote".. what is that supposed to mean?


Oh touche! Way to avoid answering my questions!

What gender are the "friends" giving you the marriage killing advice?

Below are the quotes where I gathered "secretive" applies to spending in your marriage. If you deny that any secretive spending is going on, I stand corrected and repent in sackcloth and ashes for misjudging you. 



Polyman said:


> So many issues here...I will explain more later in a post. But you are right...*she does not know *or care how the finances are set up. At one time she took care of the finances, when she was working and in school. Because if this and many other financial woes, I took over all of this. She is actually better than me with money, she is an accountant. *WE are not "together" with the finances at all. Not even a joint account. *The marriage has been much of a power struggle from the beginning. I gave her too much control and was kind of passive. he was very aggresive and bit of a control freak...Alpha women type.





Polyman said:


> Does taxes every year, but that earning *is spent as she sees fit*. She is not a shallow high maintenance spender and is usually spent on many kids activities and programs, but it is not included in family budget expenses. In other words,* I have no say to that income is how it's been.*
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Blonde

Polyman said:


> Blonde...you are free to travel and create so w conflict in some other post. Thanks for your input...smh.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I'm sorry you feel that way. You asked for input and as a formerly SAHM who homeschooled and formerly submitted to my husband in everything and formerly had no control over financial decisions, I identify with your wife and think how I feel may be similar to how she feels.

But you have spoken, and I will cheerfully submit. :smnotworthy:


----------



## WorkingOnMe

Polyman said:


> Blonde...you are free to travel and create so w conflict in some other post. Thanks for your input...smh.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Passive agressive control issues. Ya, I called it.


----------



## mkgal1

Here are links to a couple of articles that may be of help to you:

I Don't Love You Anymore



> How can this be happening? We used to be so in love. What happened? However, someone declaring that they don’t love you anymore is not as abnormal as you may think. Look at the high divorce statistics in our country today. Why do couples get divorced? It usually begins with them falling out of love with each other. But, be encouraged: If you have ever truly been in love in the past, there are specific things you can do to re-ignite the love between you. You should start by determining why your mate has fallen out of love with you. Understanding this critical piece of information can reveal some specific steps that will help you to begin reversing course. Let’s look at some of the most common causes of lost love in a marriage.
> What has caused your mate to fall out of love with you?
> 
> The lack of freedom. Freedom is an essential ingredient for any love relationship to grow and be successful. Why? Because love allows someone to make his or her own choices without being forced, coerced, or manipulated. Think about it. You freely and voluntarily chose to date and marry your spouse. No one forced you to walk down the aisle to be married. You decided to make a covenant promise to live together as long as you both would live. However, if a spouse then descends into controlling, coercive, or manipulative behavior, that love relationship is doomed. It may take many years but the love in that relationship will surely die.
> 
> The lack of equality. Another essential ingredient for any lasting love relationship is equality. Both husband and wife must perceive that they are respected and honored as an equal partner in the relationship. But, if one spouse is used, manipulated, not consulted, not listened to, or put down by the other, the love relationship eventually breaks down. I have observed this problem in both husbands and wives. If a husband believes that headship in his home means that he must dominate and control everything, he will rarely ask his wife’s opinion and will independently make all decisions. By doing so he is declaring that she has little worth in his eyes. Or, in the same way, if a wife makes her husband feel like a child that must obey her every whim, or if she belittles him and his ideas, she is essentially declaring that she considers herself superior to him. This relationship will not prosper. For love to be maintained and grow in any relationship there must be a sense of equality in all aspects of that relationship.


What Causes Love To Die In Your Marriage?



> Is your love for your spouse alive and well? Do you still have that passion that once burned in your heart? Or has your love slowly died? Has the fire gone out?


----------



## Polyman

WorkingOnMe said:


> Passive agressive control issues. Ya, I called it.


Whateva...
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## KathyBatesel

Ok, so I've read and caught up with the last dozen pages!! (Including the hijack... JaneFW, I think you sound like a good person, but the way you express your opinion is so directed that it *did* come off as judgmental and critical.)

Poly, I'm seeing a lot of passive-aggressive traits in the way you're responding to people. In your relationship, this will have you being the "nice guy" to her face, and then behaving in a way that sabotages things. To her, she probably feels as if you stab her in the back. She is using similar techniques with you. 

If she has said she won't have sex unless you give her spending money, she's showing an attempt to be direct, even if it's a misguided one. Now you'll need to do the same. 

Have you told her that you feel emasculated and hurt when she implies you're not a good father? Have you asked her to consider any solutions that you can BOTH live with?


----------



## mkgal1

Diminishing Dominance | MarriageToday

http://www.marriagetoday.com/television/latest-videos/#


----------



## Polyman

mkgal1 said:


> Here are links to a couple of articles that may be of help to you:
> 
> I Don't Love You Anymore
> 
> 
> 
> What Causes Love To Die In Your Marriage?


Ok thanks.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Polyman

KathyBatesel said:


> Ok, so I've read and caught up with the last dozen pages!! (Including the hijack... JaneFW, I think you sound like a good person, but the way you express your opinion is so directed that it *did* come off as judgmental and critical.)
> 
> Poly, I'm seeing a lot of passive-aggressive traits in the way you're responding to people. In your relationship, this will have you being the "nice guy" to her face, and then behaving in a way that sabotages things. To her, she probably feels as if you stab her in the back. She is using similar techniques with you.
> 
> If she has said she won't have sex unless you give her spending money, she's showing an attempt to be direct, even if it's a misguided one. Now you'll need to do the same.
> 
> Have you told her that you feel emasculated and hurt when she implies you're not a good father? Have you asked her to consider any solutions that you can BOTH live with?


The passive aggressive as you call it is an probably an attempt to respond to very bad PMS that happens twice a month. Irregular? Most of our problems stem from this during this time like right now actually. There are about 7-10 days where she is "herself".
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Polyman

Blonde said:


> Oh touche! Way to avoid answering my questions!
> 
> What gender are the "friends" giving you the marriage killing advice?
> 
> Below are the quotes where I gathered "secretive" applies to spending in your marriage. If you deny that any secretive spending is going on, I stand corrected and repent in sackcloth and ashes for misjudging you.


See it's your verbage, which secretive usually implies immoral or cheating type of behavior. You have an image of me in your mind which is the nature of the beast I guess as online identities. But your perception u believe is greatly being shaped by your experiences and view. The more accurate verbage is "uninformed" as opposed to secret. Neither one if us is spending on fluff shallow stuff. We are not shallow individuals at all. My downfall has been not creating a budgeted expense report if you will. So the irresponsibility on my part has been not being assertive in doing this, not being "secret" about any spending. But you can think wherever you want and believe that or not.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Polyman

Blonde said:


> I'm sorry you feel that way. You asked for input and as a formerly SAHM who homeschooled and formerly submitted to my husband in everything and formerly had no control over financial decisions, I identify with your wife and think how I feel may be similar to how she feels.
> 
> But you have spoken, and I will cheerfully submit. :smnotworthy:


So how did that turn out? What was he doing or not doing?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## EleGirl

Polyman said:


> See she is better and should manage the finances, but it comes with a cost...unfair attempts at control. I said in this thread, there are control and anger issues probably from childhood baggage I don't want to get into here. Her emotional cycles are up and down often manifested in anger and confrontation.


You say that was unfairly controlling with finances. In what way did she unfairly control them.? Could you give us some examples?


----------



## EleGirl

Polyman said:


> My downfall has been not creating a budgeted expense report if you will. So the irresponsibility on my part has been not being assertive in doing this, not being "secret" about any spending. But you can think wherever you want and believe that or not.


OK, so this is an area where you might be able to communicate with her via providing information. Do you use any kind of accounting software like quicken to handle your finances? You could easily print out a report monthly for her. Just print them out and give them to her. If she chooses to not look at them, at least you did your part. 

Another way to do this is to just hand her a bank statement monthly. She’s an accountant. She knows how to figure out from what’s coming in and going out.

I wonder if you don’t already use quicken, if you can get it and ask her to help you set it up. You can down load months of previous bank info directly into it. That will give the two of you something to look over to discuss your finances.


----------



## EleGirl

Polyman said:


> The passive aggressive as you call it is an probably an attempt to respond to very bad PMS that happens twice a month. Irregular? Most of our problems stem from this during this time like right now actually. There are about 7-10 days where she is "herself".


Does your wife acknowledge that she is PMSing most of the month?

She is not having 2 periods a month... right?

Could it be that what you are calling PMS is really when she is herself. 

And she's actually a lot easier to deal whith the 7-10 days around her period?


----------



## Created2Write

Ele, just have to say...you're my hero.


----------



## mkgal1

Polyman.....this is from your profile. Is this all just for drama (the continued references to polygamy)....as you said earlier in this thread?

I am a:
Male
Relationship Status
Polygamous Marriage


----------



## romanseight2005

Polyman, your relationship status on your profile says that you are in a polygamous marriage. Do you care to elaborate on that a bit?


----------



## mkgal1

Polyman said:


> The passive aggressive as you call it is an probably an attempt to respond to very bad PMS that happens twice a month. Irregular? Most of our problems stem from this during this time like right now actually. There are about 7-10 days where she is "herself".
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


What you *may* be experiencing from her may not be due to PMS......it *may* be due to your (possible) dynamic of control between the two of you. 

This is a quote from a book review on "Living with a Passive-Aggressive Man"



> "Living With a Passive Aggressive Man" states that dealing with a passive-aggressive person as a spouse *can drive even the most even tempered, rational, and reasonable person to huge levels of uncontrolled anger*. P-As are masters at deliberately goading people.


----------



## EleGirl

Created2Write said:


> Ele, just have to say...you're my hero.


Blush... what did I do?


----------



## EleGirl

mkgal1 said:


> Polyman.....this is from your profile. Is this all just for drama (the continued references to polygamy)....as you said earlier in this thread?
> 
> I am a:
> Male
> Relationship Status
> Polygamous Marriage


Yea, what's this about?


----------



## Cosmos

There are more things going on here than a W asking for money for sex and a W who suffers from PMS twice a month.

OP, if you don't feel that your current MC is working, perhaps it's time to find another?


----------



## Blonde

mkgal1 said:


> Polyman.....this is from your profile. Is this all just for drama (the continued references to polygamy)....as you said earlier in this thread?
> 
> I am a:
> Male
> Relationship Status
> Polygamous Marriage


Oh sheesh. Trolled!


----------



## Blonde

Polyman said:


> So how did that turn out? What was he doing or not doing?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


We are monogamous.

I was weak and easily controlled due to unresolved childhood baggage and a deadly doctrine that a wife is obligated to submit to her husband in everything.

As bad as it was, we always had joint checking and I always had my own credit card which was paid out of the joint checking. So it was my beliefs that allowed the control. When I dumped the beliefs, my husband had a choice: stay married to the alpha feminist, or not. He's still here. 

Controlling the money to the extent you described here- where she can't get gas for the car nor pay for the children's activities (when they are homeschooled)... 

If she exists, I hope she has access to the internet and will wake up and smell the coffee Am I Being Abused? « National Domestic Violence Hotline


----------



## Created2Write

Ele, you just have wonderful advice, a lot of wisdom, and your story of raising your son and other kids...I just have so much respect for you and I agree with so much of what you said.


----------



## Chaparral

His wife is an accountant, this doesn't have anything to do with money.

She isn't selling him sex, she wants to cut him off.

What did she mean by seh ws done?

What are the details of her EA and how do you KNOW its over?

When was the EA and who was it with?

How did you find out and how long did it go on?

Does she go out alone at all?


----------



## Polyman

EleGirl said:


> Does your wife acknowledge that she is PMSing most of the month?
> 
> She is not having 2 periods a month... right?
> 
> Could it be that what you are calling PMS is really when she is herself.
> 
> And she's actually a lot easier to deal whith the 7-10 days around her period?


Yes to all your questions. Except, the PMS self I'd not her true self, but I see it as those negative traits that are suppressed normally having full reign.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Polyman

mkgal1 said:


> Polyman.....this is from your profile. Is this all just for drama (the continued references to polygamy)....as you said earlier in this thread?
> 
> I am a:
> Male
> Relationship Status
> Polygamous Marriage


Sure. Sorry. I did mean to change that, but that's the mood I was in at the time. My only wife for 14 years, however, we do believe in PolygaNy. NOT polyamory. Religious/cultural polygamy though. Judge me if you want, but the truth is we have not had this , though it was a consideration for a while that she suggested. I will change it the status though. is my very first thread and wasn't sure how helpful it would be. This is extremely helpful I must say.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Chaparral

So,you believe in having more than one wife or she believes in having more than one husband?

Doesn't sound like she believes in you being her husband.


----------



## Polyman

mkgal1 said:


> What you *may* be experiencing from her may not be due to PMS......it *may* be due to your (possible) dynamic of control between the two of you.
> 
> This is a quote from a book review on "Living with a Passive-Aggressive Man"


Sorry. This is not accurate. What you have to understand is that this has manifested with other of her family members absent of me . Though they may have some words for some of my shortcomings, we all get also get along well and I come them for advice often to deal with it. Because they are familiar with it.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Polyman

chapparal said:


> So,you believe in having more than one wife or she believes in having more than one husband?
> 
> Doesn't sound like she believes in you being her husband.


Polygany is man providing for more than one wife. But this is not the issue. Our current issues are the same of any other marriage. Or if you would me to expound on that more I can on a later thread, email to you, etc if its that important.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## janefw

What have you actually done since initiating this thread - just out of curiosity? Have you talked to your wife, or set a plan in motion to get your finances sorted out?


----------



## Polyman

janefw said:


> What have you actually done since initiating this thread - just out of curiosity? Have you talked to your wife, or set a plan in motion to get your finances sorted out?


Look. Here is what I have done and plannnnned to do. New year, new focus which actually has begun a few months ago. Thus thread is part of initiating my plan properly or with input of others from your experiences. This comes with a budget for finances, family mission statement, goal setting, etc. but difficult to move forward when the toxic and hostile situations flare up like now.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## mkgal1

Polyman said:


> Sorry. This is not accurate. What you have to understand is that this has manifested with other of her family members absent of me . Though they may have some words for some of my shortcomings, we all get also get along well and I come them for advice often to deal with it. Because they are familiar with it.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


So.....you are sharing your struggles with your wife with her family? If so.....that could (and probably *does*) make her feel sort of "ganged up" on. It could also cause her family to see things in a skewed way.


----------



## mkgal1

Polyman said:


> Look. Here is what I have done and plannnnned to do. New year, new focus which actually has begun a few months ago. Thus thread is part of initiating my plan properly or with input of others from your experiences. This comes with a budget for finances, family mission statement, goal setting, etc. but difficult to move forward *when the toxic and hostile situations flare up like now*.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Does any of that include giving her access to finances in order to put gas in the car.....pay for children's activities.....groceries.....new shoes.....etc?

Toxic and hostile......how exactly? Her asking for $100/week?


----------



## Polyman

Blonde said:


> We are monogamous.
> 
> I was weak and easily controlled due to unresolved childhood baggage and a deadly doctrine that a wife is obligated to submit to her husband in everything.
> 
> As bad as it was, we always had joint checking and I always had my own credit card which was paid out of the joint checking. So it was my beliefs that allowed the control. When I dumped the beliefs, my husband had a choice: stay married to the alpha feminist, or not. He's still here.
> 
> Controlling the money to the extent you described here- where she can't get gas for the car nor pay for the children's activities (when they are homeschooled)...
> 
> If she exists, I hope she has access to the internet and will wake up and smell the coffee Am I Being Abused? « National Domestic Violence Hotline


Wow blonde. You just admitted that you have issue and is very evident. Again, you have a very flawed inaccurate way of seeing this. You seem to line confrontation and want to press my buttons to get a rise out of me. Just because your husband is still there it doesn't mean he enjoys it. He may feel like he is being abused. Women can abuse men psycicigically sometimes. But society doesn't like to acknowledge that. Always a mans fault and he is the abuser
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Polyman

mkgal1 said:


> Does any of that include giving her access to finances in order to put gas in the car.....pay for children's activities.....groceries.....new shoes.....etc?


Uh of course. But this not gonna be one sided. Look I am not denying her money. I giving what I can afford under the circumstances. I manage the finances not control them the way some on here want to say.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Polyman

Created2Write said:


> Ele, you just have wonderful advice, a lot of wisdom, and your story of raising your son and other kids...I just have so much respect for you and I agree with so much of what you said.


Yes. I agree. I do appreciate Elle's advice and input. Thank you. Give more when you can.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Created2Write

Poly, I understand the issue of not having a lot of money. And I know you're looking for advice, which is incredibly honorable. But replying with an attitude is not going to get you anywhere. The posters here are trying to help. I understand feeling like you're being made to be the one in the wrong, when usually issues in relationships go both ways, but as someone here recently told me, you can't change your wife. You can only change yourself. Since you're the one here posting, the responses are going to be about _you_. 

Also, you really haven't given a lot of clear information into your situation, so some people may simply be a bit confused.

I don't really have any advice for you beyond that. I hope that things begin to work out better. For the record, I think your wife has unrealistic expectations. You're working two jobs already. She needs a bit of a reality check, imo.


----------



## mkgal1

Polyman said:


> Uh of course. But this not gonna be one sided. Look I am not denying her money. I giving what I can afford under the circumstances. I manage the finances not control them the way some on here want to say.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I only asked that as earlier you had said there is no joint account. I presumed that meant that her access to money is dependent upon what you hand her......is that true?


----------



## Polyman

Created2Write said:


> Poly, I understand the issue of not having a lot of money. And I know you're looking for advice, which is incredibly honorable. But replying with an attitude is not going to get you anywhere. The posters here are trying to help. I understand feeling like you're being made to be the one in the wrong, when usually issues in relationships go both ways, but as someone here recently told me, you can't change your wife. You can only change yourself. Since you're the one here posting, the responses are going to be about _you_.
> 
> Also, you really haven't given a lot of clear information into your situation, so some people may simply be a bit confused.
> 
> I don't really have any advice for you beyond that. I hope that things begin to work out better. For the record, I think your wife has unrealistic expectations. You're working two jobs already. She needs a bit of a reality check, imo.


My attitude is with one poster in particular. And I am a person that stands for fairness and justice in myself and anyone. I will call out in a heartbeat if someone is being unfair and imbalanced especially when the charges are not true . Earlier points have been made and clarified and someone comes to a conclusion about ignoring the facts of what I posted. Wrong is wrong. I'm pretty sure other healthy minded adults here see this if you follow those posts. Btw, your input is appreciated and accepted.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Created2Write

Polyman said:


> My attitude is with one poster in particular. And I am a person that stands for fairness and justice in myself and anyone. I will call out in a heartbeat if someone is being unfair and imbalanced especially when the charges are not true . Earlier points have been made and clarified and someone comes to a conclusion about ignoring the facts of what I posted. Wrong is wrong. I'm pretty sure other healthy minded adults here see this if you follow those posts. Btw, your input is appreciated and accepted.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


If they're wrong, then indeed you should clarify and correct the statement, but that can be done respectfully as well.  Or, if you think them to be misunderstanding you on purpose, which isn't likely, but if you think they are, then I would recommend ignoring their posts or blocking them. That way you're less frustrated with other posters. 

I only say this because it seems to me that more than one poster is being addressed with at least a little attitude. I could be wrong, and I apologize if I am.


----------



## Polyman

Also, I have agreed with some input about me and openly expressed many of my shortcomings and where I need to do more/better. When someone ignores that and attempts to put something definitive on you based on lack of knowledge and facts that express otherwise.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Polyman

Created2Write said:


> If they're wrong, then indeed you should clarify and correct the statement, but that can be done respectfully as well.  Or, if you think them to be misunderstanding you on purpose, which isn't likely, but if you think they are, then I would recommend ignoring their posts or blocking them. That way you're less frustrated with other posters.
> 
> I only say this because it seems to me that more than one poster is being addressed with at least a little attitude. I could be wrong, and I apologize if I am.


Well, I am a human behind this electronic media. Attitude, emotion, passion is stuff that makes us such. I will say this. If a person expresses that they felt disrespected by my attitude I will respond accordingly. I will try the block in the future if need be. But I don't think my little attitude equated to disrespect. Ok. There was that one post about Blonde husband that may have been below the belt. Perhaps I will block her. But I am wondering where are the comments to the poster who have an attitude and confrontational comments. Strange to me...
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Polyman

mkgal1 said:


> I only asked that as earlier you had said there is no joint account. I presumed that meant that her access to money is dependent upon what you hand her......is that true?


Yes. This is true. I mean she has some other sources of home based income but its not consistent. She decided to dissolve the joint bank account and let me handle everything. Our kids were babies. Post pardem was a variable. She was the one in school at the time. She is an overachiever type and my attempts to slow her down were viewed as being jealous or something like that. I was just trying to keep her from doing too much which now she understands and appreciates a lil more, but that's a strong trait that still exist somewhat.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Polyman

I want to hear from both sides please...how much should a husband take from wife during PMS? Is all behavior excusable? What have you experienced as husbands? How does your husband respond to you?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Created2Write

Polyman said:


> I want to hear from both sides please...how much should a husband take from wife during PMS? Is all behavior excusable? What have you experienced as husbands? How does your husband respond to you?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Imo, PMS is not a justifiable excuse to be disrespectful or mean or intentionally hurtful. While hormones and emotions and things are more extreme sometimes, there is such a thing as self control, and it needs to be practiced during that time of the month same as any other time. 

My husband understands that I get emotional and sensitive during PMS, so he reacts to me with gentleness and understanding. But I don't intentionally try to irritate him or upset him, either.


----------



## Polyman

So do you think he has to walk on eggshells as to what he says during that time cause it may trigger a reaction from you?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Created2Write

Polyman said:


> So do you think he has to walk on eggshells as to what he says during that time cause it may trigger a reaction from you?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Walk on eggshells? No. My husband is usually a respectful person as it is. And the things he does don't usually trigger reactions from me. Well, unless they're positive reactions. But as far as PMS goes, if I say something snappy, he doesn't respond as bluntly as he normally would. But I'm not usually snappy when I'm PMSing.


----------



## Honest opinion

Ok ,waw so polyman so many posts since the first page eh,but anyway the situation is sooo much clear now,in any court no judge rule or give his last call unless he hear both sides to be fair right??,but as we can't hear your wife side of the story it seem to me so clear based on all your posts,your a manipulative character ,controlling husband,sheap one too,your thread title was insulting no truth for it what so ever,plus you blame her PMS for her reactions ,oh god please help her..
You have agood wife with a high degree but chose to stay home and raise 4 kids and home school them ,plus teach them all the religious manners and believes as you stated ,your background is very religious ,plus the activities hmmmm ...you know how much pressure and stress she go through everyday ??this whole money issue thing is just an excuse from your side I suspect an emotional affair is taking place from your side ,believe it or not I can read you like an open page.sorry for the harsh post but it's my honest opinion and don't blame it on my PMS lol.


----------



## Chaparral

Why did you not answer the question about her EA and her being done?


----------



## Polyman

Honest opinion said:


> Ok ,waw so polyman so many posts since the first page eh,but anyway the situation is sooo much clear now,in any court no judge rule or give his last call unless he hear both sides to be fair right??,but as we can't hear your wife side of the story it seem to me so clear based on all your posts,your a manipulative character ,controlling husband,sheap one too,your thread title was insulting no truth for it what so ever,plus you blame her PMS for her reactions ,oh god please help her..
> You have agood wife with a high degree but chose to stay home and raise 4 kids and home school them ,plus teach them all the religious manners and believes as you stated ,your background is very religious ,plus the activities hmmmm ...you know how much pressure and stress she go through everyday ??this whole money issue thing is just an excuse from your side I suspect an emotional affair is taking place from your side ,believe it or not I can read you like an open page.sorry for the harsh post but it's my honest opinion and don't blame it on my PMS lol.


You have the right to your opinion. I will tell you this... I have rarely been accused of being a manipulative person. Not my personality, at least no dominant trait. I won't blame anything on your PMS, but what I am seeing on this post is that people are make assumptions of your character not only based on what they are reading here, but biases due to stereotypes, past experiences, and other frames of reference. Some here may see something familiar in my situation and then draw on something they went through and shape me into that person. Gotta love the net.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Polyman

chapparal said:


> Why did you not answer the question about her EA and her being done?


This was phone Internet stuff. Very upfront with me about it. He outta state. Really just limited to convo and feeling of the past, not sexting or inappropriate stuff like that. But still....over because of lots of things she has realized about herself and women in general at this stage in many marriages. Look up a book called "living in Limbo".
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## See_Listen_Love

Polyman, do you have ADHD?

There have been a lot of passive talkers coming with their problem, you look like a bit addicted to the drama of your situation, or you have ADHD or something....


----------



## Polyman

See_Listen_Love said:


> Polyman, do you have ADHD?
> 
> There have been a lot of passive talkers coming with their problem, you look like a bit addicted to the drama of your situation, or you have ADHD or something....


Is this a symptom of ADHD? Explain why. Or were you just being sarcastic. I'm seriously asking. Elaborate please.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## EleGirl

Polyman said:


> Yes to all your questions. Except, the PMS self I'd not her true self, but I see it as those negative traits that are suppressed normally having full reign.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


If your wife is having 2 periods a month there is something physically wrong with her. Has she gone to the doctor about this? Have you gone with her?

If she has not seen a doctor she needs to.


----------



## Cosmos

EleGirl said:


> If your wife is having 2 periods a month there is something physically wrong with her. Has she gone to the doctor about this? Have you gone with her?
> 
> If she has not seen a doctor she needs to.


:iagree:

If she's having 2 periods a month, her hormones are likely completely out of whack. Raging hormones can trigger some pretty bizarre behaviour, IME.


----------



## Polyman

Cosmos said:


> :iagree:
> 
> If she's having 2 periods a month, her hormones are likely completely out of whack. Raging hormones can trigger some pretty bizarre behaviour, IME.


Yes. I think much of it is a hormonal imbalance. I am looming to arrange that this month. But u get accused of thinking something is wrong with her, or wanting to put her on meds, be I just "don't know how to deal with her", this is how she she's it. I have been holding in and trying not to seperate or D because we have not exhausted all of these options both MC and medical.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Polyman

BTW, most of these grammar errors are my phones auto type and me trying to type fast on a phone.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## EleGirl

Polyman said:


> This was phone Internet stuff. Very upfront with me about it. He outta state. Really just limited to convo and feeling of the past, not sexting or inappropriate stuff like that. But still....over because of lots of things she has realized about herself and women in general at this stage in many marriages. Look up a book called "living in Limbo".


How long did her EA go on?

What has she done to prove that she can be trusted to not do this again?


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## OhGeesh

Polyman I dindn't read everything post, but it seems we started at money, then role reversal, then STAHP, etc and ended up on PMS symptoms.

A budget is as easy as 5th grade math if even that. You can do it in crayon.

I for one give my wife a larger discretionary budget than I get, but I do handle all the finances and all large expenditures. She get's almost whatever she wants in the least materialistic way you can say it.

So, just say it?

I make 3000/mo net pay I have 2700/mo in bills, food, gas, etc etc and only 300 left over.

What's your budget?


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## EleGirl

Polyman said:


> Yes. I think much of it is a hormonal imbalance. I am looming to arrange that this month. But u get accused of thinking something is wrong with her, or wanting to put her on meds, be I just "don't know how to deal with her", this is how she she's it. I have been holding in and trying not to seperate or D because we have not exhausted all of these options both MC and medical.


When you bring this up to her do not mention her PMS. Instead tell her that you are concerned about her having two periods monthly. Even do some research on the internet about the topic. Concentrait on caring about her wellbeing.

How old is your youngest? Could she have depression?


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## Cosmos

Polyman said:


> Yes. I think much of it is a hormonal imbalance. I am looming to arrange that this month. But u get accused of thinking something is wrong with her, or wanting to put her on meds, be I just "don't know how to deal with her", this is how she she's it. I have been holding in and trying not to seperate or D because we have not exhausted all of these options both MC and medical.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


The sooner the better, OP.

When I went through hormonal turmoil (menopause) I felt as though I'd taken leave of my sanity. If your W is having 2 periods a month, she could possibly be feeling the same way.


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## Cosmos

EleGirl said:


> When you bring this up to her do not mention her PMS. Instead tell her that you are concerned about her having two periods monthly. Even do some research on the internet about the topic. Concentrait on caring about her wellbeing.
> 
> How old is your youngest? Could she have depression?


:iagree:

Because this sounds more than your every month PMS.


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## Polyman

Cosmos said:


> The sooner the better, OP.
> 
> When I went through hormonal turmoil (menopause) I felt as though I'd taken leave of my sanity. If your W is having 2 periods a month, she could possibly be feeling the same way.


Did you have to get any treatment or just go through that process?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Cosmos

Polyman said:


> Did you have to get any treatment or just go through that process?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


As the blood tests revealed that it was the menopause, HRT was prescribed. I felt a different person within a week!

How old is your W? Could she be peri-menopausal? At the very least her doc needs to check her hormone levels.


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## See_Listen_Love

Polyman said:


> Is this a symptom of ADHD? Explain why. Or were you just being sarcastic. I'm seriously asking. Elaborate please.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


No, I am serious. The reason is your enormous amount of rationalizing, reacting to posts, verbalizing all of your thinking, etc. etc. reminds me of other posters who were going 'mental' under pressure of the whole situation.

Fear and anxiety, uncertainty and heavy situations cause some people to emotionally freeze and see nothing, and others to become extreme extravert in their reactions and overspeak themselves just to be able to silence what's talking in their face. 

That last is what it looks like to me. You maybe should calm down, stop reacting and start thinking and acting. But take your time. Get a 'slow down' first.


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## Polyman

See_Listen_Love said:


> No, I am serious. The reason is your enormous amount of rationalizing, reacting to posts, verbalizing all of your thinking, etc. etc. reminds me of other posters who were going 'mental' under pressure of the whole situation.
> 
> Fear and anxiety, uncertainty and heavy situations cause some people to emotionally freeze and see nothing, and others to become extreme extravert in their reactions and overspeak themselves just to be able to silence what's talking in their face.
> 
> That last is what it looks like to me. You maybe should calm down, stop reacting and start thinking and acting. But take your time. Get a 'slow down' first.


Just so you know... I was not offended but was shocked at your insight of this. The answer is I have Not been diagnosed with ADHD, however, I myself believe that I exhibit some of the traits associated with it. The next I go to see the MC I plan on bringing this up and try and get tested somewhere. What I have been concluding lately is that my ADHD type traits and those things associated with her PMS don't make for a good mix and is difficult for us to move forward with new incentives in place which is what I am honestly looking to do. Perhaps if we address these issues, the others issues and obstacles will become easier. Your thoughts?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Polyman

Polyman said:


> Just so you know... I was not offended but was shocked at your insight of this. The answer is I have Not been diagnosed with ADHD, however, I myself believe that I exhibit some of the traits associated with it. The next I go to see the MC I plan on bringing this up and try and get tested somewhere. What I have been concluding lately is that my ADHD type traits and those things associated with her PMS don't make for a good mix and is difficult for us to move forward with new incentives in place which is what I am honestly looking to do. Perhaps if we address these issues, the others issues and obstacles will become easier. Your thoughts?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Adex

Polyman said:


> So now she wont have sex with me, unless I am giving her $100 a week! I'm not about to get pimped!! I have said that I may not be able to afford that 'every week'.


In my opinion, while it is not ideal, giving your wife an "allowance" so she has sex with you is acceptable in a marriage. The alternative of not having sex is unacceptable. I don't see it as paying a hooker because she is your wife. $100 a week sounds steep though. 

You should say give me sex 4 times a week and I'll give you $100 every two weeks. That sounds fairer.


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## See_Listen_Love

Polyman said:


> Just so you know... I was not offended but was shocked at your insight of this. The answer is I have Not been diagnosed with ADHD, however, I myself believe that I exhibit some of the traits associated with it. The next I go to see the MC I plan on bringing this up and try and get tested somewhere. What I have been concluding lately is that my ADHD type traits and those things associated with her PMS don't make for a good mix and is difficult for us to move forward with new incentives in place which is what I am honestly looking to do. Perhaps if we address these issues, the others issues and obstacles will become easier. Your thoughts?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I am no therapist so in such a complex situation I can hardly give a reponsible advice. I can only tell you what I would try to do.

That is trying to find an alternative route, without too much confrontation, to heal the relation a little, or possible enough to get to real communication.

So maybe try meditation or relaxtation techniques, or EFT, this tapping system, emotional freedom technique I belief it is called.

Or go together for running/walking each other day, with no talking, just being together in a physical activity.

Or do Tai Chi together, in a class, or just the opposite of that, Thai Boxing classes (only the training).

The idea is that non verbal communication is started, to get to peace of mind with oneself, others, and possibly the partners. The movement of body and mind in relation to others and nature has, in my best opinion, a kind of healing influence on all kind of emotional thought processes in one's mind.

That may lay a foundation for other good things to happen.

Allthough I am not sure if this above exactly is applicable in your situation, I am sure that if you keep trying alternatives you will find something that works for the two of you.


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## Polyman

I also want to add some points about our marriage. We did have and still do have a deep living relationship, deep down. But it's almost like spiritual. Unconditional love and respect there. But when we get into conflicts, I am often reminded how she didn't choose me. I wasn't really her type. See we were platonic friends before marrying. The off and on situation and high energy conflicts drain me, am become a challenge for me to do the productive things I need to do. I have initiated a sort of modified 180 right now. I like your advice and may incorporate it slowly. Well see. It's kind of hard right now. She says she wants to be loved. But how does she expect me to love her, when she is constantly saying and doing things to push me away. She wants me to continue to put her 
On a pedestal while she reminds me of what I'm not doing or " it's too late", or the kind of man she needs or needs me to be. Done so much for this woman. When do I hear, " I want you to be the man in my life and take care of me. I need you to be that for me". Is this so unrealistic?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## See_Listen_Love

When I read this post I think you are on the way to 'salvation'. You express uncommon well insight in your relational dynamics, I cannot imagine else than that will lead to some solution in the near future.

Just expressing my enthousiasme for your observation, I feel hope in that.


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## See_Listen_Love

Polyman said:


> She says she wants to be loved. _But how does she expect me to love her, when she is constantly saying and doing things to push me away._ She wants me to continue to put her
> On a pedestal while she reminds me of what I'm not doing or " it's too late", or the kind of man she needs or needs me to be. Done so much for this woman. When do I hear, " I want you to be the man in my life and take care of me. I need you to be that for me". Is this so unrealistic?


I feel this has to do with the complicated way women want a 'good guy' with some 'bad guy' characteristics, or a 'bad guy' with 'good guy' qualities.

As a man you can't make any logic of that. Some women want you to take the lead while respecting her independence, creating a safe environment for her by leading the way with some authority.

I don't know, this is difficult.


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## blimilim

its not that simple. it might seem like prostitution, but it might be totally different. between the lines it appears that the woman (and maybe the kids) is a hostage in the relationship, she has no money at all and have to beg for a 100$. it means there is a problem, total dependency, and she has to resort to the last hold she has. she probably doesnt buy a dolce every day


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