# Oh crap, I'm in trouble and need help



## Jdub (Jun 16, 2019)

So brief back story. I'm a preacher ( big reason I'm struggling) and have a wife who cheated on me 6 years ago. Things have been pretty good and reconciliation has gone very well. Yes, I still have my moments, but they are few and far between. That is until now. So now there is a woman in the church who texts me two weeks ago and tells me that she needs to talk to my wife and I immediately. So we drop everything and go meet with her where she tells us that her husband had just admitted to an affair. I saw red and couldn't think straight! I actually left the room for a few minutes hoping that my wife would finally tell someone about her own affair, she didn't.

She wanted to try to save her marriage and so I have given her a copy of the rules of reconciliation from on here which I changed to suit her situation. She read them and gave them to him with the understanding that if he doesn't follow them to a T, he's gone. He also wasn't allowed in their bed, although I found out that this has now changed. This affair had been going on under her nose for 5 years!!!!! 

Now the horrible part. Through all of this, the pain and memories of my wife's affair have all come flashing back. And to make things worse, I am now finding myself very attracted to this woman. I know that I have to guard myself and not allow these feelings to grow, but it's hard to get her out of my mind. Her husband is a jerk and I frankly almost want to see him fall on his face. I know that helping her save her marriage is the right thing to do. I just need help to get rid of these feelings. My attraction to her combined with the returning resentment for my wife's affair is driving me insane!!!!! 

Please help.


----------



## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

Time to remove yourself from the church.


----------



## Lostinthought61 (Nov 5, 2013)

curious, after your meeting with her, did your wife say anything to you? is she pretending that the affair never happen or is she trying to console with this sudden anxiety you are facing.


----------



## Jdub (Jun 16, 2019)

Lostinthought61 said:


> curious, after your meeting with her, did your wife say anything to you? is she pretending that the affair never happen or is she trying to console with this sudden anxiety you are facing.


I told her that I had wondered if maybe she would've said something to her about her affair and she just looked at me and said that she didn't want to take a chance of having our kids find out. And I haven't told her about the memories coming back.


----------



## jlg07 (Feb 24, 2017)

I would try to recommend that this woman see a DIFFERENT counselor.
You can be honest and explain to her WHY you need this -- that her story just triggers you too badly.

Have you spoken to your wife about how badly this triggered you? Was she truly remorseful and helped you deal with the affair issues? Did you ever tell folks about her affair, or did you keep everything quiet?


----------



## Jdub (Jun 16, 2019)

jlg07 said:


> I would try to recommend that this woman see a DIFFERENT counselor.
> You can be honest and explain to her WHY you need this -- that her story just triggers you too badly.
> 
> Have you spoken to your wife about how badly this triggered you? Was she truly remorseful and helped you deal with the affair issues? Did you ever tell folks about her affair, or did you keep everything quiet?


I am kind of doing that. I have been trying to make recommendations of resources instead of counseling. Nobody except for myself, my wife, and the pile of crap that screwed her know about it.


----------



## Rocky Mountain Yeti (Apr 23, 2017)

While I agree with @jlg07 that you need to refer her elsewhere, that is only a short term solution. Given your calling as a preacher who is active in counseling, you are likely to encounter similar situations in the future. If you wish to continue in this calling, you have to be able to minister to your flock without such triggering taking place anytime someone comes to you with a case of infidelity. As a betrayed spouse, you are in a unique position of empathy which can make you a more effective counselor so long as you are able to detach enough to not let the infidelity PTSD drive your thoughts. 

I think you probably need some counseling of your own. Ideally, I would suggest a Christian psychologist. Someone who is both practiced in marital psychology and who shares your faith is your best chance at finding a path to both personal healing, and the ability to maintain your calling.


----------



## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

Jdub said:


> I told her that I had wondered if maybe she would've said something to her about her affair and she just looked at me and said that she didn't want to take a chance of having our kids find out. And I haven't told her about the memories coming back.


You understand you are hiding your W affair. It may serve your W well, but it not served you well. 

At this juncture, if your W was concerned how you felt when approached by a woman who wanted to talk about an affair and you left the room she would have pursued you to comfort and ask how you are doing. 

This affair was carpet swept I'm guessing.


----------



## BruceBanner (May 6, 2018)

Jdub said:


> And to make things worse, I am now finding myself very attracted to this woman.


And how in the world does this work? You barely even know this woman.


----------



## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

Jdub said:


> I am kind of doing that. I have been trying to make recommendations of resources instead of counseling. Nobody except for myself, my wife, and the pile of crap that screwed her know about it.


Your W suffered no consequences. I would day your W care very little how you are feeling fight now.


----------



## Jdub (Jun 16, 2019)

BruceBanner said:


> And how in the world does this work? You barely even know this woman.


I've known her for a few years and she has been a friend ours.


----------



## Rocky Mountain Yeti (Apr 23, 2017)

BruceBanner said:


> And how in the world does this work? You barely even know this woman.


One need not know someone to be attracted to them. In fact, very intense attraction can form with no more than a glance. 

Add to that the context here. There are two potentially very powerful elements at play. 

First, this woman is hurting and in need of empathy, sympathy, a shoulder to cry on, even protection. This can really trigger a protective instinct in men which often manifests as attraction. The whole "I'll take care of you" thing easily spills over to places it shouldn't; vulnerability can be a very effective trigger to sexual feelings. Many people become ministers largely due to a desire to be of service to others. Ironically, the same personality traits that led OP to be a minister, may be leading him into these feelings.

Second, as a betrayed spouse, he has a built in bond with this woman, also a betrayed spouse. That can also be a very powerful force. Sharing a common, very powerful negative experience can draw two people together in a way nothing else can. With such strong empathy for such a primal experience, it's almost as if the two are already one in a very intimate way. 

None of this is surprising, and if you understand certain aspects of human nature, it's all perfectly logical. Recognizing where those feelings come from is the first step in being able to deal with them effectively.


----------



## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

Jdub said:


> So brief back story. I'm a preacher ( big reason I'm struggling) and have a wife who cheated on me 6 years ago. Things have been pretty good and reconciliation has gone very well. Yes, I still have my moments, but they are few and far between. That is until now. So now there is a woman in the church who texts me two weeks ago and tells me that she needs to talk to my wife and I immediately. So we drop everything and go meet with her where she tells us that her husband had just admitted to an affair. I saw red and couldn't think straight! I actually left the room for a few minutes hoping that my wife would finally tell someone about her own affair, she didn't.
> 
> She wanted to try to save her marriage and so I have given her a copy of the rules of reconciliation from on here which I changed to suit her situation. She read them and gave them to him with the understanding that if he doesn't follow them to a T, he's gone. He also wasn't allowed in their bed, although I found out that this has now changed. This affair had been going on under her nose for 5 years!!!!!
> 
> ...


Well this is kind of what you signed up for isn't it? You don't seem horrible to me, seems like what you are feeling is normal. Have you talked to your wife about this? What is her take? 

Besides that you should recuse yourself from this other women's situation. 

Or you could just divorce your wife and go find your own piece of mind (preferably not with this married lady). You are well within your biblical rights to do so. I would argue that if you look at the totality of the scriptures on infidelity it's pretty easy that to interpret that the bible advises against staying with an adulterer. Yes you should forgive but probably not stay together. It pretty clearly calls the adulterous women "death". You could interpret that as death to ones spirit in an emotional sense. 

I would ask do you think it is morally right to advise a women to stay with a man who had a 5 year affair? Even to be impartial about that. If he was physically abusing her for five years would your advice be the same? Maybe it would be. I am not sure why 5 years of emotional abuse is different then physical abuse though.

As for your wife -



> she just looked at me and said that she didn't want to take a chance of having our kids find out.


This doesn't sound like true repentance to me, sounds like she is covering her ass. What has your wife done to provide restitution for you?

I guess my overall point is when I read about your situation in my mind it's no surprise you are struggling, maybe you should give yourself a brake and figure if you are really where you need to be.


----------



## faithfulman (Jun 4, 2018)

Jdub said:


> I am now finding myself very attracted to this woman. I know that I have to guard myself and not allow these feelings to grow, but it's hard to get her out of my mind. Her husband is a jerk and I frankly almost want to see him fall on his face.


Well my man, you are a betrayed spouse who has buried but evidently never gotten over his wife's cheating, and you have found yourself interacting with and heavily attracted to another betrayed spouse who frankly should find herself free of her horrible husband.

Do you believe in fate?


----------



## Decorum (Sep 7, 2012)

The white knight in this one is strong!

You want to be her Parousia, riding in as a savior on a white horse to deliver and rescue her.

Stop, just stop. 

Listen, you want, earnestly, desperately want to be understood, comforted, and consoled. 

Your attraction to her is based on your neediness. It is not love.

You have been carrying too much of the load in your reconciliation, because God forbid any of the flock or your kids should find out.

That is not God's way. You have a Bible, David, Abraham, Jacob, Peter; lying, adultery, murder, betrayal. 

God doesn't hide any of it. Be real, have a real ministry.

This deception is not healthy, and you are all the worse for it.

Jesus pointed out two paths, respected the volition of man and God's sovereignty, and left the results there.

"He that covereth his sins shall not prosper: but whoso confesseth and forsaketh them shall have mercy." Proverbs 28:13


----------



## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

@Jdub, you need to get into counselling. And you need to pray for help. Reach out to a fellow preacher for a blessing and for counsel and guidance, too.

God Bless you, brother.


----------



## OnTheFly (Mar 12, 2015)

MattMatt said:


> @Jdub, you need to get into counselling. And you need to pray for help. Reach out to a fellow preacher for a blessing and for counsel and guidance, too.
> 
> God Bless you, brother.


I echo this sentiment wholeheartedly.


----------



## TAMAT (Jun 20, 2015)

Jdub,

So you rugswept the affair, usually doesn't work unless you define a wife who suffers no consequences married to a husband who is dead inside as success.

Your children should be told since your WW cheated on them too. 

The OM should be exposed widely to save other families from your fate.

The OMW should also be told.


----------



## Tasorundo (Apr 1, 2012)

Jdub, why doesn't anyone know? Why does she get to keep that a secret? I am an elder in a church, and I had an affair years ago, and everyone knows. I will tell anyone, anytime it is brought up, forever.

Sin lives in the dark, keeping it in the dark is eating you up.

How old are your kids?

What better picture of Christ in marriage is there than affairs, forgiveness, and recovery?


----------



## TDSC60 (Dec 8, 2011)

White Knight syndrome - coupled with the bond of betrayal by both your spouses. You know what she is going through. Not attraction - just a deep sympathy.

It makes me think that you rug swept your wife's affair. Does no one know what she did? Did the two of you keep it all secret?


----------



## Ric (May 14, 2019)

You know that you should tell her about your feelings.

Without forgiveness there is no love. Work on the forgiveness.

God forgives us of everything as Jesus paid for all our sins. 

Don't be alone with the other woman. Renew your commitment to your wife. She is all you need. 

When I coach guys I tell them it has to start with forgiveness. Forgive yourself - forgive her - forgive whoever needs forgiveness.


----------



## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

Jdub said:


> Now the horrible part. Through all of this, the pain and memories of my wife's affair have all come flashing back. And to make things worse, I am now finding myself very attracted to this woman. I know that I have to guard myself and not allow these feelings to grow, but it's hard to get her out of my mind. Her husband is a jerk and I frankly almost want to see him fall on his face. I know that helping her save her marriage is the right thing to do. I just need help to get rid of these feelings. My attraction to her combined with the returning resentment for my wife's affair is driving me insane!!!!!
> 
> Please help.


If ever there was a more obvious call from God for you to deal with your issues regarding your wife's affair, I cannot imagine what it could be. You're even projecting upon your feelings about your wife's affair partner onto your parishioner's husband. 

You need to step away from your parishioner and seek both individual and marital counseling. Your wife might not see the need for herself to get individual counseling until she attends marital counseling with you and better understands your pain. 

This is your wake-up call. A very dramatic wake-up call from God, I would suggest.


----------



## sideways (Apr 12, 2016)

You being a preacher should know that your answer is in the word of God.

Heb 4:12 "the word of God is alive and powerful, sharper then any double-edged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart".

Get back in the word.

As others have said your wife's affair was never truly dealt with. 

You have the Holy Spirit inside of you and HE should be guiding you right now.


----------



## CantBelieveThis (Feb 25, 2014)

Preacher or not you are still human, and you are definitely harbouring resentment for your Wife affair, that needs to be addressed...you are really in no shape to counsel anyone when you yourself have resentment issues and need help, and your Wife needs to get with the program and be by your side, no secrets, no nonsense.....

Sent from my SHT-W09 using Tapatalk


----------



## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

Tasorundo said:


> Jdub, why doesn't anyone know? Why does she get to keep that a secret? I am an elder in a church, and I had an affair years ago, and everyone knows. I will tell anyone, anytime it is brought up, forever.
> 
> Sin lives in the dark, keeping it in the dark is eating you up.
> 
> ...


Agreed, besides Jesus went and rooted out the sin in the temple, he didn't hide it.


----------



## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

Let me guess you wife is an innocent flower who fell for a wicked predator and just had no idea what she was doing. Am I right?


----------



## Young at Heart (Jan 6, 2015)

Jdub said:


> So brief back story. I'm a preacher ( big reason I'm struggling) and have a wife who cheated on me 6 years ago. *Things have been pretty good and reconciliation has gone very well.* ....
> 
> ..She wanted to try to save her marriage and so I have given her a copy of the rules of reconciliation from on here which I changed to suit her situation. She read them and gave them to him with the understanding that if he doesn't follow them to a T, he's gone. He also wasn't allowed in their bed, although I found out that this has now changed. This affair had been going on under her nose for 5 years!!!!!
> 
> ...


You are wise enough to understand the big picture and identify the pieces to the puzzle. No you need to figure out what to do. 

I think you are wrong about the reconciliation with your wife going well. You have lied to yourself about the reconciliation and your feelings. You and your wife probably need professional marriage counseling for you to get over your feelings and TRULY FORGIVE HER.

As to the other betrayed spouse, You know what you must do and not do. There are lots of good comments as to what is happening.

Good Luck and God bless you.


----------



## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

Jdub said:


> I am kind of doing that. I have been trying to make recommendations of resources instead of counseling. Nobody except for myself, my wife, and the pile of crap that screwed her know about it.


No male from the church including you should be counselling this woman. Your wife is also not in a position ot counsel this woman considering her history. I would suggest you pass the case onto other elders in your church.


----------



## CantBelieveThis (Feb 25, 2014)

sokillme said:


> Let me guess you wife is an innocent flower who fell for a wicked predator and just had no idea what she was doing. Am I right?


Indeed there are so many of those, I love that notion, my W gave me that BS after D-day.... She pulled the "it just happened"....i immediately put her in her place, and told her YOU allowed it to happen and did so knowingly..... And if that wasn't the case then u were raped, in which case you will be taking the POSOM to court..... She never said that again

Sent from my SHT-W09 using Tapatalk


----------



## Jdub (Jun 16, 2019)

Thank you all for the great advice. This is what I need to hear.


----------



## hptessla (Jun 4, 2019)

CantBelieveThis said:


> Indeed there are so many of those, I love that notion, my W gave me that BS after D-day.... She pulled the "it just happened"....i immediately put her in her place, and told her YOU allowed it to happen and did so knowingly..... And if that wasn't the case then u were raped, in which case you will be taking the POSOM to court..... She never said that again
> 
> Sent from my SHT-W09 using Tapatalk


Oh! I wish I had read this before confronted my wife. She did the old 'it just happened' and I countered, as you did with putting it squarely on her (I used an old Montel Williams 'so he fell out of the sky zipper open and landed on you while you were laying down with no pants on?') but given the #Metoo and her attitude toward it I would've loved to have thought and dialed 911 and handed the phone to her, hahaha!


----------



## Lostinthought61 (Nov 5, 2013)

Jdub,a possible reason why you are flooded with thoughts of her affair is that on some level there are still unsettled matters....the OM may not have suffered from his transgressions with your wife, while she may have committed back to the marriage there may still be still unresolved issues, and certainly fear of her sins being played out to the children let alone the community is one of them, and lastly on some level there is in imbalance in your marriage, and as a man that angers you. While the Bible may extrude justice in the hands of God, as mortals its hard not to want to punish them ourselves.


----------



## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

Lostinthought61 said:


> Jdub,a possible reason why you are flooded with thoughts of her affair is that on some level there are still unsettled matters....the OM may not have suffered from his transgressions with your wife, while she may have committed back to the marriage there may still be still unresolved issues, and certainly fear of her sins being played out to the children let alone the community is one of them, and lastly on some level there is in imbalance in your marriage, and as a man that angers you. While the Bible may extrude justice in the hands of God, as mortals its hard not to want to punish them ourselves.


I agree, I think lots of the pain that we feel when this happens is the loss of agency we have in our own lives. Suddenly we are faced with the fact that we are dependent on people who are unreliable. I think the best way to recover is to take agency back in ones own life. 

One of the best things you can do is to emotionally detach at least enough to be reassured that you will be OK if the marriage and relationship ends. Things like going to a Lawyer to see what your rights would be, getting more involved with your own personal hobbies really can help with that. Stop accommodating your spouse as much as you have in the past and generally making them earn their way back. You really have to establish your own identity again and in this way take agency back in your own life.

I think when your rug-sweep and are desperate for the marriage at any cost what you do is you say to your spouse who just betrayed you probably worse then anyone else in your life has, "Here you go no matter what you do I am going to be dependent on you for my future." No WS is worthy of that level of trust, power and frankly honor at that point. At the very least it should take lots of hard work, true remorse and rectitude to just get them into the conversation about this again. 

From what I can see Christians and religious people in general suffer from this more then others. This is because they confuse forgiveness for staying in the marriage. Also because many times they stay because of peer the pressure put upon them by the zealots in their social groups. The thing is, as I have stated in my previous post this thinking is not biblical. 

I have a very hard time believing that the default position is to stay in the marriage when in the old testament there was never any time where the marriage was allowed to continue given the fact that the person who cheated was to be executed. Again there was no reconciliation in the old testament and also no divorce. Those who were cheated on were widowed and in that way permitted to move on with their life. Yet somehow NOW the only acceptable form of Christian forgiveness is to stay in the marriage?

Christian's will use the "God hates divorce" argument but again this is particularly myopic considering in the very same verse an out is given for adultery, actually any sexual immorality. Think about this, when Jesus said those words he was operating under a system where you were not permitted to stay married to a cheater which is why the scenario is not directly addressed. Yes he hates divorce but he hates adultery more, to the point that he would put to death anyone who committed it. I personally this immorality should also include dead bedrooms where one person is gate keeping out of pure selfishness. But I digress.

The point is there has never been a time were God expected someone to stay in a marriage where there has been adultery present. He didn't even give you the choice in the past. Yes Jesus told the adulterous women to go and sin no more, but what he did there was save her life, not her marriage. Which is exactly what the "God hates divorce" scripture does in my mind. It specifically repeals the death penalty for adultery but upholds divorce. I think that is because as you are seeing, staying married to someone who cheats on you is trying to accept the unacceptable and for many people it's just too painful. Remember you are supposed to have fulfilling "abundant" life. 

Dude at the very least take agency in your marriage and in your life. Be the leader and husband that you are supposed to be. Deal with how you are feeling and address this with your wife head on. Give her the consequences that she deserve which at the very least means she need to address you issues that SHE CAUSED YOU! What exactly has she done to promote your healing? To show contrition, remorse and restitution? 

Those thing I just wrote about should be required just to attempt to R but they are not a reason to R. You need to decide what your quality of life you are going to have. So take agency and then decide if you want to stay married to her, and don't let others judge you if you don't. "Let no man judge you in meat or drink." Same principle as the dietary restrictions holds true, even it makes Christians uncomfortable you are free to go if you want.


----------



## ABHale (Jan 3, 2016)

Did your wife ever stop what she was doing in the church or did she continue as nothing happened?

Her not wanting the kids to know, is it for their peace of mind or her own?

Don’t know how the two of you reconciled but it sounds like a rug sweep and forget about it. 

You know forgiveness and staying are two different things right. 

Be honest with your wife about what is going on. It isn’t weakness on your part that you feel this way. It is your wife’s inability to not cheat that has caused this.


----------



## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Repentance means owning up to what you did.

Your wife hasn't made good and you rugswept her behavior so it is causing malfunction in your life, ministry and marriage.

Your marriage needs healing especially before you and her minister anymore.

Neither of you is fit for ministry right now because your own house has not been put in order.

How can either of you help others with their problems when you haven't even healed your own marriage and your wife hasn't even fully repented.

Burying the body doesn't mean you aren't a murderer.

Don't tell me you have dealt with her adultery because you haven't. Neither of you have.


----------



## Rocky Mountain Yeti (Apr 23, 2017)

I'm more than a little skeptical of the "don't want the children to know" excuse.

If the wife was to divulge in a private counseling session with a grieving betrayed spouse, I'm sure the first thought of the poor woman being counseled would be to run to the church youth group and announce to all the kiddies all the details of the minister's wife's infidelity.


----------



## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

BruceBanner said:


> And how in the world does this work? You barely even know this woman.


What?

He knows her well, he sees himself in her pre-dik-ament.

They are aligned, mated to similar circumstances.

Both maligned by their mate.

If he gets close to this woman, he gets near his own woes.

He feels her pain, intimately. Intimately, does he want to help her.

He wants to climb inside her soul and massage the pain away, she hopefully, doing the same to his.

This church member wanted to speak to both you and your wife, she knows, respects boundaries.
Do so, yourself.

Help her, do so.

And by doing so, help thyself.

God kindly placed this woman in your path for healing...... or for tearing off the scab, letting a real healing occur.

Please note!

Your wife was also made part of this airing out of this traitorous pain. She must now face what she put you through.
This is a GOOD thing.

This was done purposely, yes.

Both you, and this parishioner are going to go through a transition. 
A painful one. 
Hopefully, at last, so will your wife.

It is your' job, your' duty, your' calling to see that this comes to a proper end.
Do not be the coward.

Even if it means some measure of forgiveness from you, repentance from your wife, divorce for you and your lady parishioner.

Let us see if your wife is worthy of repentance. After this sharp, stark remembrance.
Let us see if you are worthy of forgiving sin, not of forgetting, past sin.

This is a test, believe Me.
Do not fail your teachings.
Do not fail this woman parishioner.

Do well, live well.





The Helmsman-


----------



## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

Number one, this woman should NOT be encouraged to reconcile with piece of crap who had a FIVE YEAR AFFAIR! No one should!

Number two, your wife's affair seems to have been rugswept, as others have mentioned. You will never be fully over it because of this, but even if you were, I would think this situation would STILL trigger you. (or any BS, for that matter) 

Number three, your attraction to this woman is due to your white knight, KISA tendencies, and the fact that you share that common bond of being betrayed. Refer her down the road, and dont let her reach out to you going forward. I dont think this is something you NEED to share with your wife, but if you do then maybe she gets a little dose of her own rotten medicine.


----------



## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

3Xnocharm said:


> Your attraction to this woman is due to your white knight, KISA tendencies, and the fact that you share that common bond of being betrayed. Refer her down the road, and dont let her reach out to you going forward. I dont think this is something you NEED to share with your wife, but if you do then maybe she gets a little dose of her own rotten medicine.


Yes, this...


3 times no charm..
I love your post sign off...

Life is too short to spend time with people who suck the happiness out of you. 


Aye, yes I do.
So true, not blue, red, read, right on.




THM-


----------



## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

SunCMars said:


> Yes, this...
> 
> 
> 3 times no charm..
> ...


Tis the truth!


----------



## Cat Lady (May 7, 2019)

The first thing that popped into my mind when I read your OP was that you and your wife may call what you did 'reconciliation', but it sounds more to me like you swept it under the rug and hid it. So your wife basically got away with it. She may not want anyone else to know, but I can GUARANTEE that isn't what's best for you. As you are now finding out. 

Everyone else has already given you the same advice I would - do not counsel this woman any more, bring what your wife did out into the light, get some counseling of your own.  Good luck my friend.


----------



## michzz (Jun 6, 2008)

Keeping a false front to the church and your community is not working for ya anymore. 

You gave your wife a pass and she suffered no consequences for her actions.

As another poster wrote, you are no longer able to effectively counsel anyone regarding their marriage, infidelity or not.

And especially not appropriate to counsel any woman at all. You are treading dangerous ground with your bewildering attraction.

Do not lower yourself to your wife's level of behavior.

Personally, if it were me? I'd leave the ministry, at least for awhile. Go drive a truck, work at the mall, anything else. 

And get a divorce. Even if your religion forbids remarriage, they cannot stop a civil divorce. Get away from her. You will gain your life back.

Right now, you are helping her wreck your life. Stop.


----------



## Spicy (Jun 18, 2016)

Simple.

Tell your wife exactly what you told us. You are finding yourself attracted to this other woman and hearing her situation has brought up all of the feelings of the betrayal again.

Be straight up honest with her. Also, once you have said out loud that you are attracted to this woman, that will help it not stay a simmering secret in your mind and heart.


----------



## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

Rocky Mountain Yeti said:


> While I agree with @jlg07 that you need to refer her elsewhere, that is only a short term solution. Given your calling as a preacher who is active in counseling, you are likely to encounter similar situations in the future. If you wish to continue in this calling, you have to be able to minister to your flock without such triggering taking place anytime someone comes to you with a case of infidelity. As a betrayed spouse, you are in a unique position of empathy which can make you a more effective counselor so long as you are able to detach enough to not let the infidelity PTSD drive your thoughts.
> 
> I think you probably need some counseling of your own. Ideally, I would suggest a Christian psychologist. Someone who is both practiced in marital psychology and who shares your faith is your best chance at finding a path to both personal healing, and the ability to maintain your calling.


Its always a mistake for a man to counsel a women and visa versa.


----------



## colingrant (Nov 6, 2017)

You don't need your wife's permission to share her past indiscretions with others. As the first lady of the church, transparency on her part could advance the congregations belief that no one is perfect, and that includes pastors and their wives. Take the lead here.


----------



## [email protected] (Dec 23, 2017)

jdub, your WW seems curiously detached about her A. It's clear that you are triggering a lot, but WW isn't
helping. That's a red flag right there.


----------



## Music_Man (Feb 25, 2017)

Jdub said:


> I told her that I had wondered if maybe she would've said something to her about her affair and she just looked at me and said that she didn't want to take a chance of having our kids find out. And I haven't told her about the memories coming back.


Your last sentence says a lot. Communication is key, and your wife needs to know where, why, and how you are hurting.


----------



## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

Please understand before I say the following that I have spent many years in ministry, to include a position equivalent to a senior deacon.

Why were/are you complicit in hiding your wife's affair?

The poster upthread who suggested you immerse yourself in the word is absolutely correct.

Read Ephesians 5...again...and again...and then explain how hiding her affair is anything more than an attempt to preserve your own personal pride. You triggering over this situation is an example of your proverbial chickens coming home to roost. Rugsweeping has consequences. 

Love your wife enough to stop hiding her sin.

Love yourself enough to refuse to hide her sin.


Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk


----------



## Affaircare (Jan 11, 2010)

@Jdub,

I have also been in ministry in a way--I ran a website for people who are struggling with infidelity. Thus, I think you might find this article helpful: https://affaircare.com/articles/biblical-steps-to-end-an-affair/

I want you to bear in mind, I am not here trying to toot my own horn. I've been on both sides of adultery--my first husband cheated on me, and I cheated on my second husband. As you can see, I've been here on TAM since 2010 and it was during our reconciliation that we both came here. True reconciliation is rare and takes a LOT of work, because essentially the cheating spouse has to UTTERLY change their way of thinking about themselves, their spouse, their marriage and commitment in general. Too often, wayward people don't actually REPENT...they regret that they were caught, or that they would lose their kids or their house or their lifestyle. True reconciliation takes honest REPENTANCE. 

Here's a little image comparing what real reconciliation looks like vs. rugsweeping:










See, as a formerly wayward spouse, one of the first things I did was speak to our kids and our families about what I had done so they knew that my Dear Hubby was not at fault. To the outside world, the way a betrayed reacts can seem pretty harsh, but if the same outside world knew that the big reaction was due to adultery--they'd understand! That big of a reaction is warranted! So the inability to talk to others about her affair raises a red flag in my opinion. There is still SUBSTANTIAL pride there if she can't walk into a room of other ladies from the church and say, "I am embarrassed of the way I behaved toward my darling husband. I committed adultery and yet he forgave me and gave me the chance to redeem myself If that's not an image of how much the Lord loves us, I don't know what is!"...well then there is an issue. 

One of the cornerstones of true RECOVERY is that adultery is called what it is (not some gentle euphamism). Another cornerstone is moving from a habit of "hiding" the truth to a habit of being open and transparent. How can she be transparent if "the kids don't know" and she has to hide it from couples at church? In real life, she is hiding who she truly is--from her biological family and her church family. 

So I realize that none of this answers the problem with the lady at church. Here's the thing: obviously you can't counsel people to whom you are attracted. Refer her to someone else, preferably a wise, older lady in the church who could be a mentor. If you refer her to another male human, you may be putting them both into a place of temptation! 

Next, it is somewhat reasonable for you, a male, to feel feelings for a female who is being open with you, sharing her thoughts and feelings, and being vulnerable. People who "serve" are often very empathetic, and so you care about her hurt and heartache--honestly you probably/possibly wish your wife would open up to you that way! But the problem is not "being tempted"--the problem comes when you act on that temptation. Even Jesus was tempted, so obviously that just is not a sin. But he told Satan to pound sand and in no uncertain terms, and that is what I would strongly suggest you do. RUN from this temptation. Don't justify. Don't prolong it. Just end contact and get away from it. 

Finally, as I mentioned above, part of true recovery after adultery is transparency. Transparency is being "see through" to your partner, so that you let them "see through" all the masks and images to know the REAL YOU. In real life, you are hurting. In real life, you are triggering. In real life, you would let your partner see the real you. You would say it and let her see it. You would share your thoughts and your feelings. So again, sadly, I see a red flag here that not only are you hiding truth from your children (the opposite of transparency) but you hide truth from each other. 

Being that honest, and that transparent, after a betrayal is HARD...and scary...but that is what true recovery would look like. It would be safe to tell the truth. It would be safe to be who you truly are, and she would be safe being who she truly is. Yes, committing adultery is deeply shameful, but that in no way diminishes the great testimony it can be if you turn from it and live a life that demonstrates forgiveness and honesty. 

I am not proud of what I did and how I treated my Dear Hubby. I am not proud of the choices I made. The consequences of the choices I made, hurt. But being open and learning from mistakes teaches others that you CAN do the wrong thing and turn from it. You don't have to doing the wrong thing! And that includes continuing to be dishonest and being prideful. Learning transparency and humility is a very good thing.


----------



## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Jdub said:


> I told her that I had wondered if maybe she would've said something to her about her affair and she just looked at me and said that she didn't want to take a chance of having our kids find out. And I haven't told her about the memories coming back.


So...a recovery built on lies.


----------



## BluesPower (Mar 27, 2018)

turnera said:


> So...a recovery built on lies.


More correctly, no offense, not a recovery... Just rug sweeping.


----------



## Talker67 (Apr 7, 2016)

dude you just can not do it. You are in a trusted position of power, you need to resist these urges at all cost. Being a preacher...just think of it as the devil tempting you...and he is a powerful tempter!

Maybe watch the movie "the last temptation of Christ". Even Jesus was tempted by the devil.


----------



## alte Dame (Aug 7, 2012)

There's so much hypocrisy in all of this. Your WW is the most obvious case. The term rugsweeping has been applied to both of you, but that is too kind for the liar that she really is. She's afraid of the children finding out so that she can maintain *her* image. And she sits there like a hypocrite, thinking only of her own comfort, listening to a poor women recount the same sort of pain that the WW inflicted on you, all without connecting that woman's pain with your own. 

It's all about her. You don't have to let this happen. Stop rugsweeping. Do what you need to do to take care of you. Your WW has no real remorse because she has suffered no true consequences; nothing has made her see the wreckage she created.

The very idea that she could sit there without owning up and without even imagining that it could trigger you tells you a lot. It's all about her.


----------



## michzz (Jun 6, 2008)

alte Dame said:


> There's so much hypocrisy in all of this. Your WW is the most obvious case. The term rugsweeping has been applied to both of you, but that is too kind for the liar that she really is. She's afraid of the children finding out so that she can maintain *her* image. And she sits there like a hypocrite, thinking only of her own comfort, listening to a poor women recount the same sort of pain that the WW inflicted on you, all without connecting that woman's pain with your own.
> 
> It's all about her. You don't have to let this happen. Stop rugsweeping. Do what you need to do to take care of you. Your WW has no real remorse because she has suffered no true consequences; nothing has made her see the wreckage she created.
> 
> The very idea that she could sit there without owning up and without even imagining that it could trigger you tells you a lot. It's all about her.


Well put!


----------



## BluesPower (Mar 27, 2018)

alte Dame said:


> There's so much hypocrisy in all of this. Your WW is the most obvious case. The term rugsweeping has been applied to both of you, but that is too kind for the liar that she really is. She's afraid of the children finding out so that she can maintain *her* image. And she sits there like a hypocrite, thinking only of her own comfort, listening to a poor women recount the same sort of pain that the WW inflicted on you, all without connecting that woman's pain with your own.
> 
> It's all about her. You don't have to let this happen. Stop rugsweeping. Do what you need to do to take care of you. Your WW has no real remorse because she has suffered no true consequences; nothing has made her see the wreckage she created.
> 
> The very idea that she could sit there without owning up and without even imagining that it could trigger you tells you a lot. It's all about her.


Well I think OP is gone, so this probably will not matter anyway. 

I suspect he could not stand the heat about his foolishness and his own hypocrisy. 

But anyway this post pretty much spells it out. 

Further I also shows why many, many pastors should not engage in very much counseling about anything past maybe what the bible says. Most are not trained counselors and as this post shows, they don't even know how to handle infidelity in their own marriage much less advise their flock about it. 

And I am not banging on religion I am just pointing out that this guy is about as clueless as most pastors out there in the real world...


----------



## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

The OP has a lot to think about. Hopefully he will be back after he has processed it all.


----------



## Rocky Mountain Yeti (Apr 23, 2017)

MattMatt said:


> The OP has a lot to think about. Hopefully he will be back after he has processed it all.


Yes, it sounds like he's really only fully facing things for the first time despite the initial shock being well in the past. That can be even more difficult to process. I wish him well, and I wish him peace.


----------



## SnowToArmPits (Jan 2, 2016)

Jdub said:


> Now the horrible part. Through all of this, the pain and memories of my wife's affair have all come flashing back. And to make things worse, I am now finding myself very attracted to this woman. I know that I have to guard myself and not allow these feelings to grow, but it's hard to get her out of my mind. Her husband is a jerk and I frankly almost want to see him fall on his face. I know that helping her save her marriage is the right thing to do. I just need help to get rid of these feelings. My attraction to her combined with the returning resentment for my wife's affair is driving me insane!!!!!
> 
> Please help.


Hi Jdub. Here's my advice, see all this ^^^^ just stop that. Problem solved.

Look I'm an atheist... but maybe spend more time praying and feeling the holy spirit fill you soul, and quit thinking **** like you wrote. 

I'm serious when I say the following, I think your position as a preacher means people are counting on you to rise above being attracted to women outside your marriage. If you want to be a preacher people look up to and rely on, and not just another hypocrite, get your head straight. 

Best of luck mate, I'm pulling for you.


----------



## sideways (Apr 12, 2016)

JDub, as a man who preaches the Word of God you should know that evil flourishes in the dark. The Word shines a light to bring for the truth.

John 8:32 "and you will know the truth, and the truth shall set you free".

The "truth" that he is speaking of is Bible doctrine. His word!!!

What's more important here, your wife's pride or God's word? You should (and DO KNOW THIS)!!!

You want to know why you are FREAKING out about all of this? The Holy Spirit is SCREAMING AT YOU and trying to get your attention.

The Devil knows this, and thus why he's trying to tempt you and he's going RIGHT at you in your weakest area.

Let me say this. Your wife's affair needs to be dealt with. I don't think she needs to be thrown under the bus, but she does need to own up to it and do what she needs to do to help you heal.

I also hope that you see what the devil is trying to do? He doesn't want people to come to Christ to be saved. He's slick enough to put lust in front of you hoping that you'll take the bait. Then it gets exposed in the community, and people hear about it and it gives them an excuse to not follow Christ because looky here.....this man of God is one big HYPOCRITE...preaching about Jesus but having an affair? 

I know you're human and we ALL have the sin nature, but if you TRULY love Christ and are committed to doing HIS will and teaching about the Kingdom than I hope you wake up and see how the Devil is playing you as ONE BIG FOOL if you take the bait.

You KNOW I'm right JDub!!

Get back in the word!!


----------



## WorkingWife (May 15, 2015)

Spicy said:


> Simple.
> 
> Tell your wife exactly what you told us. You are finding yourself attracted to this other woman and hearing her situation has brought up all of the feelings of the betrayal again.
> 
> Be straight up honest with her. Also, once you have said out loud that you are attracted to this woman, that will help it not stay a simmering secret in your mind and heart.


I wholeheartedly agree with this. OP needs to tell his wife what he is feeling for two big reasons:

1. His wife needs to understand everything is NOT OK. There is still work to do to truly recover from her affair.
2. Telling his wife about his feelings will help deflate his feelings for the other woman. When this type of thing is a secret, the power of its draw on you snowballs in your mind, it can become an obsession. If other people know about it, especially your wife, it takes away the mystery and fantasy aspect of it, and makes it easier to step back and be more objective about your feelings and the situation. It also let's the wife know her marriage is not invulnerable and she needs to step up if she wants to keep her man's affections.


----------



## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

@Jdub there's a possibility that the reason you feel drawn to this woman is that you have fellowfeel towards her, you know her pain.

Also, you might be drawn to her because she has not cheated on you. As weird as it sounds that's one of the reasons I fell into an affair. I realised afterwards that I wanted a woman who hadn't cheated on me, as broken and as sick as that sounds.

Prayers for you and everyone involved.


----------



## Jdub (Jun 16, 2019)

First of all, I want to say thank you for the ones who gave me some solid advice. You have helped me tremendously! I realized that those feelings were sympathy and that was it. I told my wife how I felt and she seemed to understand and is in the process of reading "How to help your spouse heal from your affair" by Linda Macdonald. Was her affair rugswept? I'd say half and half based on the chart that Affaircare posted. 

I think where my wife struggles, is that in her mind, she has repented and God has forgiven her and therefore does not remember her sin of infidelity. While it's true the when God forgives sin, He no longer remembers it, with us humans, it doesn't quite work that way. Especially in affairs. So this has been a good thing in having to revisit some of these things. Has she been perfect? No. Has our marriage been good over the past 5 years? Absolutely. That first year post affair was rough, but it has steadily gotten better. There have been a few road bumps, and there probably always will. 

She has done her part in ending the affair with zero contact (except once where he walked up to her to say hi and she called me immediately to let me know what had happened) and I have 24/7 access to all of her electronics and know her passwords. She calls or texts me on her lunch break daily and also when she gets off of work. We all have trackers on our phones and I have VAR'ed her on occasion when I've had to be out of town. She has proven herself trustworthy without her knowledge. 

But, I came here genuinely looking for help, and have received that for the most part. However, this will be my last post on this thread because what I did not come here for was to be abused and called names. Going through an affair as the BS was tough enough. I do not need the people who are supposed to be there for support to slam on me too. You people want to pass judgment on me yet have little to no knowledge of the facts. Maybe just don't post if you don't have anything helpful to say. 

I'm a big boy and can handle the truth. And believe me, some of you told me exactly what I needed to hear regarding myself and this lady who we are trying to help. She is seeing a professional counselor now and I have put my focus to supporting her from a distance and trying to help her husband with his relationship with God. It's my belief that if he can get that on the right path, the rest should fall in line, or at least be a bit easier to get in line. 

I have been reading Dr. Harley's book "Surviving an Affair" and am going to suggest my wife read the chapter where he goes into the whys of telling other people about the affair. I understood and still do with why we concealed it,( I always thought about Proverbs 17:9, plus we live in a very small and gossipy town), but yet see the power in telling certain people our story. 

But, this is me signing off. Thank you again to the ones who showed me grace and gave me words of wisdom, I will not forget. And to the ones who gave me zero grace, well, I say nothing, because why?


----------



## Andy1001 (Jun 29, 2016)

Jdub said:


> First of all, I want to say thank you for the ones who gave me some solid advice. You have helped me tremendously! I realized that those feelings were sympathy and that was it. I told my wife how I felt and she seemed to understand and is in the process of reading "How to help your spouse heal from your affair" by Linda Macdonald. Was her affair rugswept? I'd say half and half based on the chart that Affaircare posted.
> 
> I think where my wife struggles, is that in her mind, she has repented and God has forgiven her and therefore does not remember her sin of infidelity. While it's true the when God forgives sin, He no longer remembers it, with us humans, it doesn't quite work that way. Especially in affairs. So this has been a good thing in having to revisit some of these things. Has she been perfect? No. Has our marriage been good over the past 5 years? Absolutely. That first year post affair was rough, but it has steadily gotten better. There have been a few road bumps, and there probably always will.
> 
> ...


When you come to a forum like this you have to remember that a lot of the people who post here are betrayed spouses or in some cases were the cheating spouse. You are going to get a lot of different opinions. 
You must realize the absurdity of your wife counseling any betrayed person and giving advice. The term poacher turned gamekeeper comes to mind. 
I’m not going to call you a hypocrite but you don’t have any business giving betrayed people advise either. You didn’t handle your own problems too well. 
It comes across as a case of “Do as I say, not as I do”.


----------



## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

Andy1001 said:


> When you come to a forum like this you have to remember that a lot of the people who post here are betrayed spouses or in some cases were the cheating spouse. You are going to get a lot of different opinions.
> You must realize the absurdity of your wife counseling any betrayed person and giving advice. The term poacher turned gamekeeper comes to mind.
> I’m not going to call you a hypocrite but you don’t have any business giving betrayed people advise either. You didn’t handle your own problems too well.
> It comes across as a case of “Do as I say, not as I do”.


The concept of forgiveness and grace also come into play.


----------



## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

Another one done run oft.


----------



## TAMAT (Jun 20, 2015)

Hiding affairs is to Protestant churches what hiding child molestation is to the Catholic church, a wicked social ill they pretend doesn't exist.


----------



## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

Jdub said:


> ...this will be my last post on this thread because what I did not come here for was to be abused and called names. Going through an affair as the BS was tough enough. I do not need the people who are supposed to be there for support to slam on me too. You people want to pass judgment on me yet have little to no knowledge of the facts. Maybe just don't post if you don't have anything helpful to say.


Makes me wonder if TAM should have an FAQ on what to expect in responses, and how to handle things when the heat gets turned up. 

I'm old enough to have survived the flame wars of early usenet days, and wow, if you wanting to thread the needle to keep things calm, it took an amazing amount of patience and a willingness to walk through a nuclear reactor core during meltdown. The Mods here do an excellent job, but new arrivals may expect too much in the way of support and not enough in the way of critical/different thinking. Perhaps that's key. This is not just about support, but also considering all the options.


----------



## BluesPower (Mar 27, 2018)

Casual Observer said:


> Makes me wonder if TAM should have an FAQ on what to expect in responses, and how to handle things when the heat gets turned up.
> 
> I'm old enough to have survived the flame wars of early usenet days, and wow, if you wanting to thread the needle to keep things calm, it took an amazing amount of patience and a willingness to walk through a nuclear reactor core during meltdown. The Mods here do an excellent job, but new arrivals may expect too much in the way of support and not enough in the way of critical/different thinking. Perhaps that's key. This is not just about support, but also considering all the options.


This OP did not get hit that hard. I just don't think that LOTS of people in the ministry like being told they are full of crap, which frankly, they are. 

I say this as someone who was in ministry at one time, and brother I know the crap that goes on. 

See it is easy for him to say that we are all just mean hard people, but much harder for him to admit that 1) He let his wife walk all over him because he is a weak person. 2) He was more worried about what people would say than setting a good example to his flock. and 3) He must have hated hearing that he was woefully under qualified to EVER offer counseling about infidelity...

Like I said, I know these people and his response points to the above observations.

There are a lot of super great people in ministry, and then there are those that don't get it...


----------



## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

BluesPower said:


> This OP did not get hit that hard. I just don't think that LOTS of people in the ministry like being told they are full of crap, which frankly, they are.
> 
> I say this as someone who was in ministry at one time, and brother I know the crap that goes on.
> 
> ...


Three issues are at play here:

1) There is a false doctrine that has permeated the evangelical churches for the last thirty years or so that basically holds that because the husband is essentially the high priest of his family, all problems in the family are ultimately his responsibility...especially in regards to his wife's behavior. So when a Christian woman strays, it is ultimately her husband's fault because he was in some way failing her and not providing the proper leadership and support for her. The evangelical community ran with this idea and it has infected just about every marriage ministry in North America. It really is sickening some of the bilge these so called "Christian marriage specialists" sell to an unenlightened church community. Many church wives get an automatic get-out-of-jail-free card by blaming their affairs on their husband's lack of leadership. 

2) The second problem is that many husbands are coerced by their pastors and church family to rush headlong into forgiveness, when there has been little or no true repentance by the wayward wife. "Forgive, forgive, forgive" is literally pounded into their skulls, even at the threat of social ostracizing if they do not. 

3) Third, the apostle Paul clearly states that when an adulterer sins against his or her marriage, that person is to go before the congregation and publically admit their sin. Very few if any churches require this anymore. The OP never asked his wife to do this, so in a sense he is living in disobedience.


----------



## BluesPower (Mar 27, 2018)

bandit.45 said:


> Three issues are at play here:
> 
> 1) There is a false doctrine that has permeated the evangelical churches for the last thirty years or so that basically holds that because the husband is essentially the high priest of his family, all problems in the family are ultimately his responsibility...especially in regards to his wife's behavior. So when a Christian woman strays, it is ultimately her husband's fault because he was in some way failing her and not providing the proper leadership and support for her. The evangelical community ran with this idea and it has infected just about every marriage ministry in North America. It really is sickening some of the bilge these so called "Christian marriage specialists" sell to an unenlightened church community. Many church wives get an automatic get-out-of-jail-free card by blaming their affairs on their husband's lack of leadership.
> 
> ...


Well put brother, well put. 

Some will think that you and I are bashing the church, but we are not, I know I am not. 

But these three things that you point out are and anathema to the church.

Frankly, they do as much or more damage than the "Sex is dirty" attitude that permeates churches to this day. 

Good Post!!!


----------



## sideways (Apr 12, 2016)

JDub it looks like you hit the eject button and are out of here, but if by chance you do come back (or at least check the responses) please take what I am about to say to heart.

It's one thing to rug sweep your wife's affair and another on counseling this other woman on infidelity. That said, my biggest concern is with you, and specifically you being a man of God, who should be well versed in Bible doctrine, and yet you're reaching out to people on the Internet of all places for help?? 

Not knocking TAM at all as it is a wonderful resource for people who find themselves in this horrible trial and need guidance. However, someone who's studied the word (a preacher) should NOT be scrambling for guidance desperately seeking advice on the Internet for crying out loud. Yes you're human, and have weaknesses and sin just like everyone else, but you of all people should know who and where to turn in a trial of life.

Here's my smell test. Let's say I come to you because I'm a member of your church, and I'm needing guidance with a trial I'm in, and the reason I would be coming to you at all is because I am a believer and I'm wanting to bring the Lord into the equation/situation and thus I'm relying on you as someone who's studied the word and is well versed in doctrine for guidance, and after coming to you, you have no answer for me and point me to the Internet for guidance instead??

JDub this is exactly what you did in your situation. I would be walking away shaking my head wondering if I was in the right Church if you couldn't at least share what God had to say about my situation. To share some specific scriptures as well. I certainly understand it's a process as is any profession, and the longer you're in it the more versed and experience you'd gain. With all that said, for you to hit the panic button in your trial, and run to the Internet for advice, I hope that you can see why I have concerns for you as a preacher who's supposed to know God's word. I mean this is how Christ speaks to us (through HIS word) and just as an accountant is supposed to know balance sheets and numbers etc, a preacher should not just know Bible doctrine but he should also have faith in the Lord's word and to be able to stand on HIS word.

If you can't do this moving forward, please pray and ask the Holy Spirit on guidance on whether or not you are qualified to be a representative of Christ? Remember having known the word (and being a preacher) Christ holds these people WAY more accountable then the sheep.

I'll be praying for you JDub.


----------

