# Marriage in doubt?



## squid1035

I’ve been looking around this forum for a few hours and I thought I’d present my marriage conundrum to you all too. Obviously, I wouldn’t be searching the internet for marriage advice if I wasn’t going through my own troubles as well.

My wife and I have been married for 14 years. I’m 12 years older than her. She was 18 when we met and not too long after we were parents. So, we got married. Since then we’ve had 2 more kids and haven’t had any too many struggles in that time. We actually still laugh a lot together and even up until recently our sexual intimacy has been very good - at least as far as I can tell.

I’d say the one ever-present issue in this family is the external influence of my mother. If ever there was an “evil in-law”, she’d be the case. By her nature she’s domineering, pretty insensitive and often rude, exactly as you’d expect for the stereotypical in-law. The difference being that she happens to be MY mom. I’ve always sided with my wife whenever there were differences between her and my mother. Not because it was the husbandly thing to do - but because she and I really see eye to eye regarding my mother and her attitudes on just about everything. So the troubles don’t just lie between my wife and mother. I have never really gotten along with my mother, even though I was raised in a single parent household, by her. If I had my way, I’d move us far away. But as we are now, I’m currently working and in school and have to rely on my her financially. So it makes things quite complicated. 

Let me get to the heart of what our present struggles are. My wife calls it her soul-searching phase. She’s wondering what her place in life is and what is should/might/could have been. I met her in the Philippines and after we got married, we moved to states. She left behind her parents and family and basically left college after 2 years. She left the only life she ever knew to be with me in the states and raise our family. 

I guess this had been happening for quite some time, but only recently has it so emphatically made itself known as an emergent issue. She seemed to have woken up one day and questioned whether or not our marriage should have ever happened in the first place. 

More back-story: When I asked her to get married she wanted to wait. But me, being the immature yet older guy that I was, really pushed for it. I don’t know, maybe I felt the same too, but I really wanted to be with her and felt it was right to spend my life with her. Sincerely, I felt that. I still feel that. So now, she’s feeling like she missed out on so much. She sees her friends and how they’ve gone on to have college degrees and careers and is ashamed of how her life turned out. That, mixed with a severe longing for her hometown and her mother (who is also in a failing marriage and is having really tough financial problems), has left her pretty mortally depressed. She talks about leaving or just going away somewhere. She’s said she wished I didn’t love her so much so that going away wouldn’t be so burdensome. Her depression seems pretty resolute. 

I’ve suggested that maybe she could go back to school and at least start on a road to success. That perhaps would not only let her feel a greater sense of purpose but that the end-game would be that she could financially help out her family. That doesn’t seem to mitigate her state of mind.

There’s never been any infidelity, from her or me. I’m getting the sense that she just wants to quit everything and go back home. I think our bond is pretty strong. So when there’s a hiccup, it feels devastating. She’s my best friend and it really pains me to see her so sad and hopeless. Maybe I’m being dramatic, but I see the road ahead as being very blurry and gloomy.

Any thoughts? Maybe this isn’t the right forum. But this is where I ended up. There’s more detail. But those are really the bullet points. At the end of the day, I love my wife completely. And I’m pretty sure she loves me too. But our hectic life has seemed to really beat her down to where she often pushes me away and has sometimes blamed me for pushing her into this. How can this be fixed????

I’d love some insight. 


PS, Sorry for any grammatical errors.


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## PBear

Can she finish (or restart) college here? One thing I've often thought is that running away from depression doesn't often work. It would follow you around. It might be different for your wife though, if going back to her own culture is a bit of a cure for her. Does she have any people or connections to her culture around you? Maybe a church or social group?

C
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Nix

We are in very similar situations and I can only imagine the pain you are going through. If it is anything like mine it is devastating. My wife and I have been together for 10 years. She is dealing with mental health issues which have reached an acute stage. She wants to run away and is not thinking about anything other than her own problems. I am part of the problem; I have enabled her terribly. I agreed to support us when she lost her job and now that I have asked her to go back to work, she wants to leave our hometown and return to a city we lived in for a year, which I hated. She wants to go back because that was the last place where she felt good about her career. Her mental health issues, on top of it, are making the situation far worse. 

I am now coping with my grief over my own culpability in bringing about our current situation, my own deteriorating mental state and the very real likelihood that my marriage could be ending or may even already be over. In both of our situations, our partners are questioning their lives and whether/how we fit into them moving forward. All we can do is wait and see what they decide to do. For me that is the hardest part. There is quite simply nothing I can do except do my best to take care of myself. Like you, my wife is my everything. I never thought in a million years that I would be in this position. I am sure you feel the same way. I just wanted to let you know I am here and going through something very similar.....and it sucks!


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## squid1035

Nix,

It's excruciatingly tough. That's the only way to describe it. Like watching a slowly evolving train wreck. 

I think I have enabled my wife too. She left everything for me and our family and now despises me for it. She has literally said that to me. We're in a really difficult place now with no hope in the near future.

Yes, it does suck. Good luck to you.


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## squid1035

PBear,

Yes, she can go back to school here. In fact, she's taken a couple courses here already towards a degree and is thinking of enrolling in the fall. But all of her thoughts and intentions are of going back home to the Philippines and finishing school there...with or without the rest of us.


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## Nix

Squid,

I am glad we have found each other here. Hopefully we can help each other out. I am at my mom's for a couple of days getting distance. The "grief waves" come and go. It's a lot like mourning a death, and in a way I suppose it is a death. Even in a best case scenario, for me, my dreams and hopes of what our life would be are dead. Is it possible for you to get some distance as well or do you not feel that would be helpful? How old are your children?

As I read your latest post I am struck by the thought that our wives must be psychic twins, because my wife is saying exactly the same thing except she's going to another city in the US 1500 miles away. Or so she says. How she will accomplish this with no $ is another story. She is totally financially dependent on me - a huge mistake that I will never make again in this relationship (should it survive) or any other. 

Guilt is a terrible reason to do anything, I have learned.


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## Catherine602

At 18 she was married and having a child, leaving college, moving away from family and country. She really has not had a chance to develop as an independent person before taking on adult responsibilities. 

I say this so you understand where she may be now. You are right, She gave up a lot to be where she is now. Now you are dealing with her realization that her development was arrested at the age of 18. 

Given that, perhaps she can grow without blowing up her family. Do everything you can to give her a sense of control over her life. She can be a wife and mother and still be her own person. 

Can you help her do that? Only you know what areas will lend themselves to her independence and self development. Don't fear the changes, they are normal from the ages of 18- 30 something. Be a part of it. Support her education and career persuit. Also find a way for her to keep in close contact with her family. 

One caution is letting her take the kids out of the country. perhaps her family can come here? 

Make sure to let her know that you want her to have the chance to grow and that it is normal. Become her ally so she does not see you as standing in her way. She may see your anxiety in response to her changes as an attempt to control her. 

It is difficult but try not to go to her with your anxiety. Go to her with a plan as to how the family will adjust to her growth and development.


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## squid1035

Does anybody think it's a good idea to tell her how I feel? Like how sorry I am and how fearful I am of our future together? Or will that only exacerbate her depression?


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## squid1035

Catherine602,

I am absolutely on board with her going back to school and finding a career doing what she wants to do. And we've talked about it a lot. I sincerely want her to accomplish all of that, and she knows this.

We're a little stuck now because I too have gone back to school and she feels like her life has been put on the back burner again. But she can enroll in school, right now. Even taking an online class a semester is progress towards something, right? That's what I tell her. But it doesn't seem to mitigate her emotions.

I am totally in her corner with regard to her successes and accomplishments. I want that for her. She deserves it.

There's new fold developing recently. I've considered moving our family back to the Philippines so that I can get into med school there, in the city where I met my wife. I actually went there in the late 90's to try and go to school, but it didn't take. I met her and we got married. I know, life coming full circle. It's a major life change for all of us. But a potentially enriching life-experience not only for us parents but for the kids as well.

There's hope yet. I appreciate your kind words.


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## I'mInLoveWithMyHubby

squid1035 said:


> Does anybody think it's a good idea to tell her how I feel? Like how sorry I am and how fearful I am of our future together? Or will that only exacerbate her depression?


I always believe that honesty is the best policy. I personally strongly believe that you need to tell her how you feel. If you don't tell her, you run the risk of holding your own resentments of her and yourself. Feelings should be discussed ASAP, especially if there is an issue.

Her depression is not because of you. It's because of herself and she's the only one that can make herself happy.

I'm so sorry your going through this. Trust your instinct. What she's doing is pushing you away. She wasn't robbed of her life, she did choose to marry you. If your wife is depressed, she needs good professional help if she's not already seeking it. Don't ever blame yourself or let her blame you for her unhappiness. This is not your fault.

I had a child very young as well. I never once thought that my child stole my life or time away from me. 

Good luck. I hope she figures herself out soon. It sounds like your a great husband to her.


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## Nix

You should do what you need to do for yourself. If you feel that you need to apologize, go ahead and do it. I apologized to my wife, not that it seems to have made any difference.


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## squid1035

Nix said:


> You should do what you need to do for yourself. If you feel that you need to apologize, go ahead and do it. I apologized to my wife, not that it seems to have made any difference.


Nix,

How long have you been struggling in your marriage? Our issues might have been a couple years in the making but I've only really become aware of it very recently.


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## Catherine602

squid1035 said:


> Does anybody think it's a good idea to tell her how I feel? Like how sorry I am and how fearful I am of our future together? Or will that only exacerbate her depression?


Sorry for what? You did not do anything wrong. You committed to a girl you love. The fact that her age and situation made it difficult is something you had no way of predicting. 

Your love seems very strong and I am certain it did not diminish over the years. I get the impression that you had no intent to hurt her. In fact, you did the honorable thing. A man with no character and morals may not have married her.

Apologizing may be interpreted by her as intent, which is what she is alleging. Please don't agree with her. She is confused now but she has a lot to be thankful for. 

Hopefully she will come to appreciate this. Don't tell her that though.


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## Nix

squid1035 said:


> Nix,
> 
> How long have you been struggling in your marriage? Our issues might have been a couple years in the making but I've only really become aware of it very recently.


Squid, things have been bad for about three years. I was too busy enabling my wife and sinking deeper and deeper into my own codependency to recognize it, let alone do anything about it. 

Our relationship was truly amazing for the first few years. I had found the caring, the love and the acceptance I had not experienced in previous relationships. Two years into the marriage we relocated for my wife's new job, and I couldn't get going out there. So we came home at her suggestion. 

She got another good job within a couple of years in our home city, but she decided to openly flout her supervisors' requests and bail on an important project, so she was naturally fired. Since then she has sunk deeper and deeper into hopelessness, helplessness and self-pity. I tried to play the hero and the rescuer by paying her way and martyring myself to make up for the fact that she lost her job. That plan is now blowing up in my face. Not only am I back to the dysfunctional and crazymaking patterns I fell into in my previous relationships (the ones that I was so thankful to be done with once I found my wife....HA) but my wife has descended into what I now believe is out and out mental illness. 

Did she sabotage her job in our home city? I do not and probably will never know. I am trying to focus on myself. I have spoken to her a couple of times in the last few days about nothing of consequence. I am going back home tonight after spending the last two days at my mom's. I am sure I will have an update.....before I go home I am going to a meeting of Codependents Anonymous to see if they can help me start getting in a healthier place regardless of what happens with my wife.


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## Sussieq

squid1035 said:


> I’ve been looking around this forum for a few hours and I thought I’d present my marriage conundrum to you all too. Obviously, I wouldn’t be searching the internet for marriage advice if I wasn’t going through my own troubles as well.
> 
> My wife and I have been married for 14 years. I’m 12 years older than her. She was 18 when we met and not too long after we were parents. So, we got married. Since then we’ve had 2 more kids and haven’t had any too many struggles in that time. We actually still laugh a lot together and even up until recently our sexual intimacy has been very good - at least as far as I can tell.
> 
> I’d say the one ever-present issue in this family is the external influence of my mother. If ever there was an “evil in-law”, she’d be the case. By her nature she’s domineering, pretty insensitive and often rude, exactly as you’d expect for the stereotypical in-law. The difference being that she happens to be MY mom. I’ve always sided with my wife whenever there were differences between her and my mother. Not because it was the husbandly thing to do - but because she and I really see eye to eye regarding my mother and her attitudes on just about everything. So the troubles don’t just lie between my wife and mother. I have never really gotten along with my mother, even though I was raised in a single parent household, by her. If I had my way, I’d move us far away. But as we are now, I’m currently working and in school and have to rely on my her financially. So it makes things quite complicated.
> 
> Let me get to the heart of what our present struggles are. My wife calls it her soul-searching phase. She’s wondering what her place in life is and what is should/might/could have been. I met her in the Philippines and after we got married, we moved to states. She left behind her parents and family and basically left college after 2 years. She left the only life she ever knew to be with me in the states and raise our family.
> 
> I guess this had been happening for quite some time, but only recently has it so emphatically made itself known as an emergent issue. She seemed to have woken up one day and questioned whether or not our marriage should have ever happened in the first place.
> 
> More back-story: When I asked her to get married she wanted to wait. But me, being the immature yet older guy that I was, really pushed for it. I don’t know, maybe I felt the same too, but I really wanted to be with her and felt it was right to spend my life with her. Sincerely, I felt that. I still feel that. So now, she’s feeling like she missed out on so much. She sees her friends and how they’ve gone on to have college degrees and careers and is ashamed of how her life turned out. That, mixed with a severe longing for her hometown and her mother (who is also in a failing marriage and is having really tough financial problems), has left her pretty mortally depressed. She talks about leaving or just going away somewhere. She’s said she wished I didn’t love her so much so that going away wouldn’t be so burdensome. Her depression seems pretty resolute.
> 
> I’ve suggested that maybe she could go back to school and at least start on a road to success. That perhaps would not only let her feel a greater sense of purpose but that the end-game would be that she could financially help out her family. That doesn’t seem to mitigate her state of mind.
> 
> There’s never been any infidelity, from her or me. I’m getting the sense that she just wants to quit everything and go back home. I think our bond is pretty strong. So when there’s a hiccup, it feels devastating. She’s my best friend and it really pains me to see her so sad and hopeless. Maybe I’m being dramatic, but I see the road ahead as being very blurry and gloomy.
> 
> Any thoughts? Maybe this isn’t the right forum. But this is where I ended up. There’s more detail. But those are really the bullet points. At the end of the day, I love my wife completely. And I’m pretty sure she loves me too. But our hectic life has seemed to really beat her down to where she often pushes me away and has sometimes blamed me for pushing her into this. How can this be fixed????
> 
> I’d love some insight.
> 
> 
> PS, Sorry for any grammatical errors.


First of all, there has to be much more to the story. 

For a variety of reason, she's justified in being unsatisfied. She left her country under less than ideal circumstances. Did she have any family or friends from the Philippines to connect with when she came to America? Did you make any promises about life in America that you haven't been able to live up to? As it stands, you are a 44 year old man with 3 children, dependent on your mother to help you support your family?

If you are familiar with her culture then it should be easy to see why she feels ashamed about how her life is going. She misses her country and her family. She didn't just wake up and wonder if she should have married you. She does know she married too young, and she made a mistake. She's just been trying to make the best of her situation. 

When was the last time she went home to visit? It's something she needs to do and you should make it happen. Remember, it's not all about you and your needs.


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## Sussieq

Catherine602 said:


> At 18 she was married and having a child, leaving college, moving away from family and country. She really has not had a chance to develop as an independent person before taking on adult responsibilities.
> 
> I say this so you understand where she may be now. You are right, She gave up a lot to be where she is now. Now you are dealing with her realization that her development was arrested at the age of 18.
> 
> Given that, perhaps she can grow without blowing up her family. Do everything you can to give her a sense of control over her life. She can be a wife and mother and still be her own person.
> 
> Can you help her do that? Only you know what areas will lend themselves to her independence and self development. Don't fear the changes, they are normal from the ages of 18- 30 something. Be a part of it. Support her education and career persuit. Also find a way for her to keep in close contact with her family.
> 
> One caution is letting her take the kids out of the country. perhaps her family can come here?
> 
> Make sure to let her know that you want her to have the chance to grow and that it is normal. Become her ally so she does not see you as standing in her way. She may see your anxiety in response to her changes as an attempt to control her.
> 
> It is difficult but try not to go to her with your anxiety. Go to her with a plan as to how the family will adjust to her growth and development.


Why shouldn't she take her children home to see her family?


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## Sussieq

Catherine602 said:


> Sorry for what? You did not do anything wrong. You committed to a girl you love. The fact that her age and situation made it difficult is something you had no way of predicting.
> 
> Your love seems very strong and I am certain it did not diminish over the years. I get the impression that you had no intent to hurt her. In fact, you did the honorable thing. A man with no character and morals may not have married her.
> 
> Apologizing may be interpreted by her as intent, which is what she is alleging. Please don't agree with her. She is confused now but she has a lot to be thankful for.
> 
> Hopefully she will come to appreciate this. Don't tell her that though.


Are you familiar with the Filipino culture? He could not have predicted what could come up years later. But he was certainly old enough to at least consider what comes along with an inter-cultural relationship. Surely he had to know she would miss her homeland and her family. But it doesn't sound like he took that into account. People may leave their home countries but their heart will always be there.


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## See_Listen_Love

squid1035 said:


> Does anybody think it's a good idea to tell her how I feel? Like how sorry I am and how fearful I am of our future together? Or will that only exacerbate her depression?


Whatever she does with it, you should communicate your feelings. Maybe this is a new ground for you, maybe you have gone the road of so many on TAM, taking each other for granted and let the impression grow of hopelessness and a boaring future. Talk, find a counselor for more talking.


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## See_Listen_Love

I think it is important to find out what is really bothering her. If you both don't dig deep enough it is possible you do not look at the real cause. For example, if she if feeling that her life is empty, the thoughts about the idealised life when she was 18, fun, enthousiasme, education, students, may seem like a lost paradise.

But going back would not solve the empty feeling, it is very well possible that could be solved in many other way's. 

It could also be that the culture of the US is now bothering her, she gets older and may develop/mature different than society around her. As a European I could imagine that very well.

Or suppose you yourself have become a bit 'middle aged', maybe mentally or physically older than you should be. She is still very young and wants to live life, sees a sober perspective with you growing older faster than she does.

Or, alternatively, SHE grows older faster than you, and mourns about her lost youth. Wants to hide from the 'American wife ideal' by going back to her believed safe haven.

Just my 0.02 of what kan lurk below the surface....


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## squid1035

Sussieq said:


> Are you familiar with the Filipino culture? He could not have predicted what could come up years later. But he was certainly old enough to at least consider what comes along with an inter-cultural relationship. Surely he had to know she would miss her homeland and her family. But it doesn't sound like he took that into account. People may leave their home countries but their heart will always be there.


Yes, I am absolutely familiar with Filipino culture. Both of my parents are Filipino. My father is from my wife's home town. My mother is from the the next island over. I lived in the Philippines for 6 years during which I met my wife and had 2 kids. *MY* heart is still in the Philippines. And I would gladly take her back. It's been 12 years and we've both wanted to go back every day since. But coming up with $9000 on a whim is a stretch, to say the least. It's nearly impossible. I'm the only one that's employed and we're barely making it work now, financially speaking. My mother is helping us out until I finish school. After which, I will plan a trip for us all to go. Believe me, _that's all we both want._

No, she has no family here. She left it all behind. This has not at all been about me. I'm worried for her. She's determined right now to be despondent. If there was a way that I could finance this trip I would. 

This has nothing to do with me not wanting her to go home. Even she is insistent that we all have to go. It's all or nothing. I've offered to pay, even against my instincts - to let her visit home, fearing that she might not get back on that return flight. 

But I'd let her if it meant she'd be happy for a few days.


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## squid1035

See_Listen_Love said:


> I think it is important to find out what is really bothering her. If you both don't dig deep enough it is possible you do not look at the real cause. For example, if she if feeling that her life is empty, the thoughts about the idealised life when she was 18, fun, enthousiasme, education, students, may seem like a lost paradise.
> 
> But going back would not solve the empty feeling, it is very well possible that could be solved in many other way's.
> 
> It could also be that the culture of the US is now bothering her, she gets older and may develop/mature different than society around her. As a European I could imagine that very well.
> 
> Or suppose you yourself have become a bit 'middle aged', maybe mentally or physically older than you should be. She is still very young and wants to live life, sees a sober perspective with you growing older faster than she does.
> 
> Or, alternatively, SHE grows older faster than you, and mourns about her lost youth. Wants to hide from the 'American wife ideal' by going back to her believed safe haven.
> 
> Just my 0.02 of what kan lurk below the surface....


I absolutely agree with you. There just doesn't seem to be a lot of bargaining that she's willing to do. She's enrolled in college here and has taken classes just a few months ago. We were even talking about her enrolling in the fall semester. But for now, it's her "lost paradise" or nothing. 

I'm all for her finding inner peace so long as it doesn't blow apart our family in the process. If that's me being selfish, so be it.

Thanks for the insight.


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## Nix

The hardest part is accepting that we cannot control or change what others do. All we can do is take care of ourselves in the moment.


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## squid1035

Nix said:


> The hardest part is accepting that we cannot control or change what others do. All we can do is take care of ourselves in the moment.


That is a hard and brutal truth, Nix. It's hard to live in this space - hoping for the best but bracing for the worst. Not sure how things took such a sharp turn. But the silence in the house is deafening. 30 days ago things were not all like this. No, it wasn't perfect. But we both seemed happy and at least willing to work through things.

It's the "not knowing" that makes things so hard. I thought I had a good perspective on life. Now, I have no clue.


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## See_Listen_Love

If you want, keep the info coming, talk to her, ask her, ask open questions. With the help you get here, more eyes and brains follow the case, more ideas, more points are picked up.

Hang in, trust things will become better for you. Anyway.....!


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## dsGrazzl3D

I'm not sure I read thru all quite good. 

1-Does your family live with your mom?
2-How much support does your mom provide?
3-Has there been discussions about what each household plans (Moms verse your family) are for the future? 
4-Does your mom expect to support your family for a long (or longer) time while school & job build up, (so presumably you can afford to have more choices and be in better financial place)?
5-Why do you think your mom has been acting in the manner your described? 
(I find that aspect largely unanswered so far, if you could not tell)

Your stories seems vaguely familiar to mine... In the married young due to a child, and being immature. (IMHO every young teen-20something guy is too young dumb and full of cum too truly understand or appreciate the while taking "LIFE-LONG" vows before God). I think you are really trying, but the biggest part I think needed is a change where you talk to your mom. It sounds like your mom has been a large part of your marriage struggles. It sounds to me as though your wife needs to have a way to bond and realize that you mom, you & her all (LIKELY) just want the same thing. I think your wife does not want your mom SO involved. While I believe your mom wants your family not to be such a drain on having her son and grand-kids 'zap~&~tap' her pocketbook so much. It least that may be one aspect. I think it boils down to better communication as a start where maybe your mom could ease up on you & your wife. 

That may help... 

6-Have you discussed the whole family moving back to the islands together?


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## squid1035

dsGrazzl3D said:


> I'm not sure I read thru all quite good.
> 
> 1-Does your family live with your mom?
> 2-How much support does your mom provide?
> 3-Has there been discussions about what each household plans (Moms verse your family) are for the future?
> 4-Does your mom expect to support your family for a long (or longer) time while school & job build up, (so presumably you can afford to have more choices and be in better financial place)?
> 5-Why do you think your mom has been acting in the manner your described?
> (I find that aspect largely unanswered so far, if you could not tell)
> 
> Your stories seems vaguely familiar to mine... In the married young due to a child, and being immature. (IMHO every young teen-20something guy is too young dumb and full of cum too truly understand or appreciate the while taking "LIFE-LONG" vows before God). I think you are really trying, but the biggest part I think needed is a change where you talk to your mom. It sounds like your mom has been a large part of your marriage struggles. It sounds to me as though your wife needs to have a way to bond and realize that you mom, you & her all (LIKELY) just want the same thing. I think your wife does not want your mom SO involved. While I believe your mom wants your family not to be such a drain on having her son and grand-kids 'zap~&~tap' her pocketbook so much. It least that may be one aspect. I think it boils down to better communication as a start where maybe your mom could ease up on you & your wife.
> 
> That may help...
> 
> 6-Have you discussed the whole family moving back to the islands together?


1. No, we don't live with my mother. We did for a little while but we moved into a house that is not far from my mother's house. And that is one source of friction - not enough space. 
2. My mom helps out only a little. I have a full-time job and what she gives is only about 10% of what I earn at work. But if ever there's a financial trouble-spot, my mother will help, with the expressed agreement that we pay her back. And we always do. The problem is that she tends to use her financial favors as leverage towards more control over our family's affairs. It's my fault that I let this happen. I can't quite cut loose because I'm trying to finish school and get us to a true state of financial independence.
3. Right now our plans are to move far away. I've tried playing the role of being there for my mother who lives by herself in huge house. But now, all I want is to go. But that's just not possible right now. 

This leads us to where we are now. Right now my wife's vision of her "happy place" only seems to be where she moves back to the Philippines (with or without me) and picks up where she left off in school and moves back with her parents. Keep in mind that we have 3 kids and that in order to do that we'd have to borrow more money from my mother. So it's a real Catch 22.

My wife wants autonomy now, but isn't willing to wait anymore for it. I'm stumped...


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## squid1035

dsGrazzl3D,

You've pretty much got it nailed in your appraisal. We are in a similar situation as you describe and there needs to be a firm line drawn as to what my mother's involvement should be in our family's affairs.

Even then, I don't know if remedying that issue can rectify or help my wife reconcile the other, more personal soul-searching related struggles she's going through in her own mind.

Thanks for the insight.


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## dsGrazzl3D

I hope the best for you & your marriage!

I have no other *real specific* advice. I can only give a few of my personal favorite quotes I try to live by;

1- Actions speaks louder than words
2- If you can NOT learn from history, then you are DOOMED to repeat it
3- Yesterday is history, Tomorrow is a mystery, but today is a gift, which is why we call it PRESENT (_corny line from Kung-Fu Panada yes I know, but still_)
4- DAD! Albert Einstein was really really REALLY smart... Oh yeah!! Well, if he is *SO* smart then how come he's dead!?!? (_*Yes I love Homer Simpson*_)
5- IF in doubt about love look this up in the bible 
"1 Corinthians 13:1-13" _(in different versions love and charity are used inter~changeably)_

Good Luck!


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## Rough Patch Sewing

squid1035 said:


> That is a hard and brutal truth, Nix. It's hard to live in this space - hoping for the best but bracing for the worst. Not sure how things took such a sharp turn. But the silence in the house is deafening. 30 days ago things were not all like this. No, it wasn't perfect. But we both seemed happy and at least willing to work through things.
> 
> It's the "not knowing" that makes things so hard. I thought I had a good perspective on life. Now, I have no clue.


The more open you are with communication, listening to her when and if she wants to share with you her feelings and so on... the more she will be able to vent the feelings she has inside. She may need this time of silence to figure out everything for herself. That my friend is hard for a loving husband to take, but it can pay off when she does take you up on your offer to listen. I hope and pray that you will be able to make your dreams of finishing school, moving far away, etc. 

Keep up the good fight and please do consider sharing more of your situation and how you think she is feeling!


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## Nix

Squid, it's been a long time since we heard from you. How are things these days?


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## squid1035

Nix,

Things seemed to have died down a bit. The conflict, that is. We've talked a lot of things out and my wife seems to have mellowed out a lot. Mother's Day was tough for her but she's more even-keeled now. 

"We" are good, at least. She's made it clear that she doesn't want "us" to end. But I'm still cautious, trying hard to keep the marriage working and moving forward. 

I've been finding myself watching movies lately that seem to have a common theme of failed marriages. This does nothing to soothe my fears.

Apart from that, I'm just trying to think ahead. I've been planning a get-away for the two of us to commemorate our 14th wedding anniversary. And she seems genuinely happy and excited about it. 

I'm just relieved to see her smiling and laughing again.

-Peace


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## See_Listen_Love

squid1035 said:


> I've been finding myself watching movies lately that seem to have a common theme of failed marriages. This does nothing to soothe my fears.


That it is a good sign, your brain is processing thing. Face and work through your fears. That is good.


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## squid1035

Well, I'm back guys. I just posted this in another thread....



We're in a rough patch now - kind of a continuation of one that began earlier this year. It subsided a bit, but just a few days ago came back. I think I misread what was happening before. 

We've be married for 13 years, together for 15. We have 3 kids now. Earlier this year I thought the breakdown was more over her emotional rut and sort of soul-searching phase, like what's her other purpose other than dutiful wife and mother. Which I wasn't at all resistant to her discovering herself. I encouraged her to try and figure it out and I would help in any way.

But her recent breakdown has been more revealing. She simply says she's tired and exhausted. To my guilt, I messed things up a bit for us financially. Not anywhere near bankruptcy, but one credit card debt can really wreak havoc on a family's already tight budget. And that's what I did. I stepped in s***t again. Even at the behest of my wife. It's totally my fault. 

So now she's at the point where she doesn't think she can muster the strength to not only hang around but fears that I might drag us though the dirt again. She feels that I took her for granted. And I have. Her deepest hurt comes from the thought of even though I couldn't fully reconcile the husband/father that I wanted to be with the person that I thought I really was, she didn't care. She loved me no matter what and was proud of me not matter what. And I just didn't fully appreciate that about her. Not in any way that she could appreciable, at least.

She says she hasn't written off our marriage yet. But she'd rather us be apart and still love each other, than risk staying married and end up resenting each other. Kind of a "I'll destroy this village in order to save it" gesture. 

There's never been talk of anybody else. And we've never dealt or experienced any type of infidelity. We've always had a pretty active physical relationship and we even enjoying working out together, even now. Just a little over a week ago we were giggling at silly shows together and she even told me how much she appreciates that efforts I've been making at really paying attention to her needs.

It's a weird place. I guess I never saw it coming, which makes it all seem so devastating. My instinct is to over-coddle. Which probably comes across as manipulation. She has expressed that sometimes she just wants to move on. I know that time and attention can help mend things. But how much time is too much in terms of not specifically trying to address and remedy a marital problem?

I need insight. I know I messed up and I've expressed that. I'll do what it takes to try and win her back. Maybe we have to kind of go through a re-courtship, albeit a very measured and slow one.

Thoughts?


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## dsGrazzl3D

I've been away for a while... Dealing with work & trying not to piss off my wife by staying up too late. I actually was worried about you b/c of the news recently (Typhoon Haiyan), I was hoping that all your and her family has been accounted (for & hoped this did not add to your stress). 

I just check email & saw your post was still alive & felt bed I had no real advice, also.


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## See_Listen_Love

squid1035 said:


> ....
> My instinct is to over-coddle. Which probably comes across as manipulation. She has expressed that sometimes she just wants to move on. I know that time and attention can help mend things. But how much time is too much in terms of not specifically trying to address and remedy a marital problem?


I think it is not a marital problem. Before it was a personal problem of her self development, which she felt she had missed, and was ashamed off.

Now it is a personal problem of yourself, not being able to do what is expected of you, by yourself, by her, by society.
(welcome to the club...)



> I need insight. I know I messed up and I've expressed that. I'll do what it takes to try and win her back. Maybe we have to kind of go through a re-courtship, albeit a very measured and slow one.
> 
> Thoughts?


I would not advise to go the Nice Guy way of trying to solve this. No More Mr. Nice Guy is your road to follow I think.

Read some self help books about getting out of debt, making a budget and creating wealth.

Couple this with some strength and stamina building physical activity, running and/or lifting weights

Basicly, transform yourself in the direction you wish, and can be passionate about.

She then will have to decide whether she stays with you or not, but _you_ will be saved anyhow.


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## squid1035

See_Listen_Love said:


> I think it is not a marital problem. Before it was a personal problem of her self development, which she felt she had missed, and was ashamed off.
> 
> Now it is a personal problem of yourself, not being able to do what is expected of you, by yourself, by her, by society.
> (welcome to the club...)
> 
> I would not advise to go the Nice Guy way of trying to solve this. No More Mr. Nice Guy is your road to follow I think.
> 
> Read some self help books about getting out of debt, making a budget and creating wealth.
> 
> Couple this with some strength and stamina building physical activity, running and/or lifting weights
> 
> Basicly, transform yourself in the direction you wish, and can be passionate about.
> 
> She then will have to decide whether she stays with you or not, but _you_ will be saved anyhow.



I definitely get your point. I'm reading some self improvement books and trying to get into the right mindset of being positive and trying to progress forward. I can't make her feel a certain way, nor can I control how she reacts towards me. It's a very difficult reality to face. But I suppose all I can do now is go into self preservation mode and hope (against hope) that she might turn herself around back to me.

I've been doing the whole Beachbody P90x thing for a while now and have been steadily keeping a state of decent fitness. I was once pretty obese. So I guess I can keep that up, at the very least.

I don't what's what anymore. Bummer.


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## See_Listen_Love

It is not against all hope. A lot of the time the wife revalues the 'new man' that chooses for himself and starts looking attractive again to her. You have to dig up the old 'you' and refit it with some new methods, gear and habits.

It is almost 100% sure this will greatly benefit you, and not so sure what she will make of it. But the chances of restoring the relation will have grown significant.


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## squid1035

See_Listen_Love said:


> It is not against all hope. A lot of the time the wife revalues the 'new man' that chooses for himself and starts looking attractive again to her. You have to dig up the old 'you' and refit it with some new methods, gear and habits.
> 
> It is almost 100% sure this will greatly benefit you, and not so sure what she will make of it. But the chances of restoring the relation will have grown significant.


We're beginning to revisit some of the same issues and emotions from her break down earlier this year. I'm realizing now that my wife is battling anxiety and depression. She just has so many negative emotions, misgivings, regrets, opportunities lost - all battling for for supremacy in her head. She's all used up. She told me last night that she doesn't feel passion for anything any more. Not even me. She's pretty much given up. She goes on auto-pilot every day, going through the house chores and making sure the kids are all squared away every day and then just kind of implodes at the end of each day. 

I hurts me to hear that she feels no passion or romance anymore. But I guess I'm just being selfish. I ultimately want her to be happy, but this depression is gutting this house. She's been feeling a real sense of urgency to begin a new path towards personal growth and achievement. But along with that come feelings of regret which really work to overshadow everything else. She's overcome by it, smothered by it. I suggest seeking outside help/counseling but she kind of shrugs it off. 

I'm just trying not to get sucked into the vortex too.


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## See_Listen_Love

The good news in your post is that it is at least not your fault that she feels no passion or romance anymore. So when she might heal, the feelings may come back.

The bad news is her not seeking help, it is depression and/or burnout I think.

Maybe you can take a look together at some vids of Eckhart Tolle,

Eckhart Tolle (Spiritual Teacher) - Talking about forgiving (15 min) - YouTube

She needs to learn to forgive herself and others, not look back, and only look to positive things. Work from there.

Maybe also good for you to look at some of the things he has to say.

The processing of all her (and your) feelings is an important communication task. You don't need to find solutions, or talk about causes and guilt. Just tell each other how things made you feel. You will find that talking about it repeatedly will heal and makes them finally go away.


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