# Physical attraction issues in relationship



## popsicality (Apr 10, 2021)

Hey all,

I'm in a relationship with someone I truly adore. She's a great partner and I could name a thousand reasons to back up that claim, but I won't take up your time with them.

As the title suggests, I'm having issues with physical attraction. She's not fit- she's a bit chubby (at least in my opinion) and I'm someone who's a pretty serious athlete and is very fit. I love her to death, but I don't know what to do here. 

I've brought it up with her in the past (because she and I both value honesty and transparency) and it led to an exhaustingly draining and emotional number of conversations before I had had enough and wanted to put it behind us. She, like a lot of women, has a history of struggling with body image, and also hates the idea of a man telling her that she's not "attractive", so her boyfriend isn't exactly her ideal candidate for saying that. 

Any advice would be well-considered and extremely invited. I'm struggling here!


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

If you are not married then let her go so that she can find herself a man who truly adores her and loves her just as she is. Why are you even dating her if you don't find her attractive. After all as we age all of us change in how we look as you will as well so how would you manage then?​


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## CharlieParker (Aug 15, 2012)

Are you asking for advice for you on how to help her change?


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## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

Define a bit chubby.


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## ccpowerslave (Nov 21, 2020)

Did she put on a bunch of weight or is this just you suddenly getting fitter?

I have never had this problem as I always found my wife hot no matter if she gains or loses a bunch of weight. I mean there is a point where it becomes absurd at that point I would be more concerned for her health than my loss of sexual attraction.


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## Luckylucky (Dec 11, 2020)

It’s not going to work out.


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## Mr.Married (Feb 21, 2018)

Let her go... she deserves better than you.


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## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

How old are you both?


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## Andy1001 (Jun 29, 2016)

You say you are a very fit athletic person. What does that mean? 
Are you fit looking like say a swimmer or someone who works out regularly or do you look like a marathon runner ie like a famine victim.
If you aren’t attracted to your girlfriend then for everyone’s sake break up.


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

Move on.


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## Girl_power (Aug 11, 2018)

The thought Of having to change myself and continually work at it everyday just to make my partner attracted to me sounds exhausting and almost abusive. 

We usually all fall within our natural body weight that is a result of our daily habits, choices, lifestyle, and genetics. Sometimes we gain a little bit sometimes we lose a little bit sometimes we go through a fitness period, but then we fall back to what our natural body weight is. 
If you don’t like her at her natural body weight then leave her.


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## NTA (Mar 28, 2021)

Yep, there's a limited number of times that someone can ask "does my butt look big in this?" without causing irritation and for her to have to tolerate some microaggressions about her lifestyle and eating habits. Women also have real challenges with pregnancy and menopause. You will need to accept that whomever you choose will on average grow a size or two in a couple of decades.


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## SpinyNorman (Jan 24, 2018)

She's not interested in perfecting her appearance, so if her appearance is what matters, you should just move on. But considering how many qualities of hers you like, you might want consider this a learning opportunity about your priorities.


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## ccpowerslave (Nov 21, 2020)

NTA said:


> Yep, there's a limited number of times that someone can ask "does my butt look big in this?"


My answer is always, “I dunno I need to see it without clothes on to make a proper comparison.” So far it has never worked spontaneously but the line has paid off later.


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## hamadryad (Aug 30, 2020)

First of all....don't let some shame you for this.....And quite frankly it's wrong, IMO, to call you out for it...Women do the same to guys all the time...They pick guys that they don't find attractive(for a whole variety of reasons) and then try to "fix" them or "mold" them into who they think is "ideal" for them....It rarely works for a myriad of reasons, regardless of gender...A woman can be doing this relentlessly to her man, but the minute her appearance is brought up, then it's a nuclear meltdown and the guy is looked at as the insensitive d-bag that won't accept her for what/who she is...Tremendous hypocrisy in these areas...

The only issue I ever have with this are the guys that want women with toned bodies nice, T/A, and perfect waist/hip ratios and they look like sh!t....or have some other ridiculously high standards that aren't age appropriate...Now* that*, is wrong....

All that out of the way, you should probably let her go...It will be hard, as you said, she has all these other great qualities, but continue and she will be the one posting on here, "why doesn't he want to eff me" and " why does he use porn and not having sex with me?" stuff... because that will probably be exactly what happens...If it gets to that point(or earlier), then it's _on you _for stringing her along...

Just bear in mind, you may never find a woman with the physical appearance you prefer, and with even half the other qualities the woman you already have possesses...But then seeing as how much sexual attraction/incompatibility kills relationships(just look around here on this site), it's something you need to strongly consider...

Measure twice-cut once......


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## theloveofmylife (Jan 5, 2021)

popsicality said:


> She, like a lot of women, has a history of struggling with body image


Gee, I wonder why?


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

popsicality said:


> Hey all,
> 
> I'm in a relationship with someone I truly adore. She's a great partner and I could name a thousand reasons to back up that claim, but I won't take up your time with them.
> 
> ...


2 things. First off everyone from time to time is not in tip top shape. So you have to be thoughtful. A couple of pounds should not be a big deal You can't expect everyone to be fit like an athlete or someone you see on TV. That is those people's job, presumably you both have jobs that are not like that so it's unfair to expect it.

It's hard to tell from your post if your girlfriend/wife? changed or if she was always like this. If she was always like this it's very unfair for you to say anything and frankly she deserves someone who IS attracted to her. I personally like a women with a little meat on her bones so to speak and there are lots of guys like me. So maybe she just isn't the one for you. If you need a very athletic type then find someone who is really into fitness. Never have a relationship with someone with the idea that you are going to change them. That is totally unfair and you will fail anyway.

A little chubby doesn't sound like letting herself go so I say this next part with some warning. If we are talking about my first paragraph then the next part is going to come off as too harsh and unwarranted. Just not nice. But maybe you are couching your words as to not offend so I will right this anyway, besides I do believe this is far if your spouse let's themself go and decides their appearance isn't as important as it was before they got married.

All that being said here is what I have grown to believe about partners who let themselves go, that is at least a passive acknowledgment that they no longer care about your attraction to them. Period. It's a kind of an exiting of the relationship when it comes to attraction. And you have every right to say as much and be hurt by that. 

So you shouldn't say, your fat, or I am worried about your health, though that second bit can be a part of it. I have read enough and been married long enough to have come to the conclusion that the best policy in relationships is to speak plainly what your needs are. You should do that nicely but you should DO IT. That is the only way you can have a truly authentic and honest relationship. 

So what you should say is - "you used to care about being attractive to me, and I liked that part of our relationship. Seems like you don't care about that anymore, that hurts. Why is that?"

Again from your post I am more inclined to believe that she is a "thick" girl and you just are not into her body type. Also sounds like your are not married so I would just take it as a sign an move on. Lots of men like "thick" women. You guys are not well matched.


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## AVR1962 (May 30, 2012)

One of my preferences in men is that they be fit. I cannot be with a person who has a belly or is overweight. This indicates to me that he will not be able to keep up with me, we won't be doing activities together like hiking which I enjoy. It has a huge bearing on my attraction to the person. As much as you like this lady I don't think this is the right match for you.


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## TJW (Mar 20, 2012)

SpinyNorman said:


> you might want consider this a learning opportunity about your priorities.


As we age, our appearance changes. We develop sags and lack of muscular tone, weakness, perhaps even illness. It's wise to make sure our priorities are upon things which can always be delivered.....fidelity, love, companionship.



popsicality said:


> 'm in a relationship with someone I truly adore. She's a great partner and I could name a thousand reasons to back up that claim, but I won't take up your time with them.


My advice is going to be that you take up YOUR time with them, love her as she is, and benefit greatly from the thousand reasons while you do.



popsicality said:


> hates the idea of a man telling her that she's not "attractive"


None of us want to be denigrated by anyone, and especially by the most-important-person in our lives. You have a choice to make. If you are never going to be ok with her body style, then leaving her now is the most humane and least hurtful choice you could make. This is going to be a continual source of pain for her.


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## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

OP hasn't been back. I'm dying to know their ages and exactly how "chunky" she is. And if she has always been like this or if it is a change.

I weighed 105 in my twenties. Now in my early 50s I'm 20 pounds more because I'm not a teeny waif of a girl anymore but if someone called me chunky, in comparison to my girl weight, I'd find it annoying.


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## Andy1001 (Jun 29, 2016)

NTA said:


> Yep, there's a limited number of times that someone can ask "does my butt look big in this?" without causing irritation and for her to have to tolerate some microaggressions about her lifestyle and eating habits. Women also have real challenges with pregnancy and menopause. You will need to accept that whomever you choose will on average grow a size or two in a couple of decades.


The best answer to the question “Does my butt look big in this” is “Your butt looks great”.


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## popsicality (Apr 10, 2021)

Wow, I'm floored by the number of responses I got from you all. 

Thank you all so much for giving me your input, even if it was brash. Actually, especially if it was. I'm not here for sugar-coated fairy tales. 

I can barely remember the questions I was given, but I'll try to answer the ones I do! 

-We are in our mid 20's. 
-We are both very healthy- that's not a concern. She eats incredibly well and I could stand to take notes from her. 
-When I say I'm an athlete I mean that I was a professional athlete and my world was surrounded by beautiful bodies for years. Still is for the most part. 
-I'm not (nor was I ever) trying to change her. I'm stupid, but not that stupid. 
-She has looked like this since the beginning of our relationship, I think. She was never fit, but it does feel like the winter maybe didn't help. 

I got a few prickly comments essentially saying she deserves better. You say this as if I'm choosing to feel this way. It ain't like that. These are feelings that are coming up inside me. I love her. I adore her, and then when I feel her body in my hands and it feels soft, squishy, and for lack of a better word, feeble, I can't help but feel immediately that that's not what I want my hands to feel in my partner. Again, I'm not choosing this. Stop shaming me because this upsets you and try to realize that _it's breaking my heart and I'm scared. _If you're going to respond, please do so with compassion and understanding instead of pitchforks.

Thank you again to everyone who's offered their words. And especially to anyone who has offered their words through the lens of compassion.


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## Sfort (Sep 28, 2019)

People here can sound mean, but a lot of them have been there, done that. They can give you a very good idea of what you're likely headed for. Your problem with your girlfriend is unlikely to be solved. Over time, it will get worse. If you can't accept that, save BOTH of you the heartbreak and move on now. You're asking her to provide something that she may not be able to physically provide.

Said in a friendly tone, if she ever fully understands how you feel about her, you're either toast, or the rest of the time you're in a relationship with her will be strained. 

Even if you go to counseling for your problem, the likelihood of you being able to overcome it is very low. That doesn't mean you shouldn't try, but you asked for opinions, and that's mine -- based on many years of life experiences. Good luck.


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## Girl_power (Aug 11, 2018)

popsicality said:


> Wow, I'm floored by the number of responses I got from you all.
> 
> Thank you all so much for giving me your input, even if it was brash. Actually, especially if it was. I'm not here for sugar-coated fairy tales.
> 
> ...


Her weight wasn’t a problem for you before why is it now? 

The problem isn’t her weight. It’s that you all of a sudden want something different then her. Then who she has always been. 

I understand that you can’t help your feelings and attraction, but these things can be cruel even if they can’t be helped. I think that what is important is how you view the problem... that’s telling. Is the problem that your wife isn’t fit enough, or is the problem that you have changed and require something different to be satisfied? The first one is putting blame on your wife, which I am telling you now that is not the real problem. You need to do some self reflection to understand what the REAL problem is.


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## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

You didn't answer how "chubby" she is.

She feels soft and feeble? Is she really feeble?

How tall is she and what's her weight?

I think you should break up with her. I understand you aren't married. You need to find a hard body female. If you are in your mid twenties though, chances that you are going to find a hard body partner that stays that way for the next 50 to 60 years might be slim. You might need to keep trading them in as soon as they get "squishy"-- your word.


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

She’s not what you‘re looking for and it’s unlikely that she would even want to be that type or else she already would be. You would be doing both of you a favor by moving on now rather than years down the road.


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## lifeistooshort (Mar 17, 2013)

OP, I was waiting to see if you responded before I weighed in and I'm glad you did.

Let's talk....athlete to athlete. Admittedly I'm not a professional, but I am an endurance athlete with a long history. High school/college track, junior Olympic 800m state gold medal, held the hs 1600m division record for a while.....that kind of thing.

Still running and cycling at 47 (and 2 grown sons) and am still known to win overall in a local race. My 55 year old bf says there aren't many like me physically at our age. I say these things not to pat myself on the back....I want you to understand that I get the level of athleticism you're coming from.

End this relationship now. I say this for a few reasons. She isn't what you want physically and you got into this knowing that. She probably felt the vibe from you but now that you've told her I promise there is no coming back for her.

I understand you wanted to be honest and I can appreciate that. However...in this case you should've kept your mouth shut. She will now never feel like she's good enough for you no matter what she does and will secretly resent the hell out of you. She is what she is and needs someone who wants to tear her clothes off as she is. I get that you love her and this is unfortunate, but at this point it is what it is.

I don't fault you at all for this. You also need someone whose clothes you want to tear off. You're a young guy and this is important to you. I'm sure I could lecture you about how bodies change with age (FYI, yours will too), but you may come around to that organically as you age.

I personally don't want a fatty given my level of fitness. But at my age I have a certain tolerance for a little extra softness if the overall level of commitment to health and fitness is there. My bf is quite healthy and rides with me but he has a little middle aged dude middle, and I could care less. I want his clothes off all the time.

But I'm at a much different point in life then you are. You may find your tolerance for a little softness increases with age too.

So do both of you a favor and end this. You will both find what you want. 

I'm the future, NEVER (and I can't use enough never's here) tell your partner they aren't what turns you on. If that's how you feel end the relationship. It's not a crime...you're attracted to what you're attracted to...but it is ****ty to tell someone that the way they were when you started dating is no good. I suppose there is an argument to be made for telling someone that's just let themselves go and is much different then when you met, but not for someone that's how they've always been.

Imagine her telling you that she loves you but your **** just isn't what she would prefer, and she's around big ****s all day. You'd likely never come back from that. It would be better for her to end things without saddling you with that.


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## Benbutton (Oct 3, 2019)

Physical attraction is very important in a relationship as well and you aren't feeling it. You are telling yourself you need to move on, you should always listen to yourself.


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## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

Al_Bundy said:


> I get it. When you're fit and have your crap together you can hook up with cute chubby girls all day with ZERO effort. They admire you in a way the women you are normally around don't and often are much easy to deal with on personal level.
> 
> However as you are seeing, that comfort and ease come at a price and that price is their body. You'll have to move on and find one that can at least pass the boner test.


I can't believe you just basically said "chubby girls" are sexually easy and are easy to deal with but the price is their body sucks.

Disgusting.


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## Girl_power (Aug 11, 2018)

Livvie said:


> I can't believe you just basically said "chubby girls" are sexually easy and are easy to deal with but the price is their body sucks.
> 
> Disgusting.


I wouldn’t bite the bait.


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## hamadryad (Aug 30, 2020)

Livvie said:


> You didn't answer how "chubby" she is.
> 
> She feels soft and feeble? Is she really feeble?
> 
> How tall is she and what's her weight?


To be fair, I am not sure why you are continuing to harp on this...Some people think 5'2" 170 lb women are just "athletic" or "big boned"....It's not about what you think is "right" or appropriate, it's what is bothersome to him, no??...

There really are no right or wrong answers here...There are some guys that think any woman that is willing to actually let them have sex with them are the most wonderful things in the world no matter what they look like, ...In that sense, they really have no "type"....Other guys are more selective...They may get along great with a particular woman, but if they fall outside of their physical "type" various problems start to creep in, especially in the bedroom....I can honestly say that the moment I started to look at girls in a sexual manner, there was really only one physical type that I preferred....It's weird its almost as if all other girls were invisible...This was not learned behavior, can't blame it on TV, porn or the internet, for whatever reason, it's just who I gravitated towards...from day 1... am sure women have the same preferences over the years..

I think people that fall into these categories, have dealt with them in a variety of ways, and you would think if enough positive attributes were present, then it's something that can be overcome, but at the end of the day, they probably would never be truly happy if they don't get the type that they have been ingrained to prefer...Not in my experience, anyway...


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## Enigma32 (Jul 6, 2020)

You're a man in 2021, you aren't allowed to have preferences. Just ignore the people trying to shame you for liking what you like. As you said, you can't help it. 

Here's the problem, our culture will not let you say anything to a woman about her weight...you just can't. There is no way you can bring this up to her productively. She could be 350lbs and stuffing her face with Twinkies 24/7 on her death bed and people will just tell her she's beautiful at any size. You aren't gonna win. 

The only option you have is to decide if you think she is worth it to you. Do you think her many good qualities outweigh your lack of attractiveness for her? If they do, then stick with the girl. I do think that good women are hard to come by. If you can't get over the weight thing with her, then just walk away. She will never lose weight to make you happy and even talking about it will make you a bad guy to all of her friends and family. It's not worth trying.


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## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

hamadryad said:


> To be fair, I am not sure why you are continuing to harp on this...Some people think 5'2" 170 lb women are just "athletic" or "big boned"....It's not about what you think is "right" or appropriate, it's what is bothersome to him, no??...
> 
> There really are no right or wrong answers here...There are some guys that think any woman that is willing to actually let them have sex with them are the most wonderful things in the world no matter what they look like, ...In that sense, they really have no "type"....Other guys are more selective...They may get along great with a particular woman, but if they fall outside of their physical "type" various problems start to creep in, especially in the bedroom....I can honestly say that the moment I started to look at girls in a sexual manner, there was really only one physical type that I preferred....It's weird its almost as if all other girls were invisible...This was not learned behavior, can't blame it on TV, porn or the internet, for whatever reason, it's just who I gravitated towards...from day 1... am sure women have the same preferences over the years..
> 
> I think people that fall into these categories, have dealt with them in a variety of ways, and you would think if enough positive attributes were present, then it's something that can be overcome, but at the end of the day, they probably would never be truly happy if they don't get the type that they have been ingrained to prefer...Not in my experience, anyway...


I asked twice because OP didn't say. I asked because I'm curious. What's it to you?


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## Luckylucky (Dec 11, 2020)

Professional athlete, that helps to know this. I come from a country where I went to school with a lot of professional athletes and had a cousin who was also one, runs in our Aussie veins. 😊

Long term, most of those athletes have a string of failed relationships behind them and eventually the human body doesn’t cope too well with all that training in childhood etc.. and pretty much all of them have ended up far more overweight than the ones who didn’t train hard. Worst-case scenarios, lots of eventual addictions, family breakdown and mental health problems etc. 

It’s very sad and difficult and things really need to change in terms of psychological support and preparation for living life amongst the mortals. I also know partners of athletes who just cannot live up to their body standards and food issues. 

So I’m not sure how professional-professional you are and whether this is you relating to her, rather than the other way around. My cousin had exactly the same issue with one great girl after another after another. It’s totally ok to have a preference and I also used to bang my head against the wall wondering why he wouldn’t just meet a woman who bloody trained as hard as he did!! 

So maybe find someone who shares the same athletic background? She too might be having the same feelings about you & posting somewhere about her utter frustration with your body type and how much you train. 

You’re both very young and sound healthy! We all get old and bodies change for better, worse, they stagnate and evolve too. 50 years from now, will your knees get you in an out of a car? 5 years from now, will your arms perform the way they do? Who knows? But what you DO know now is that you’re not attracted to her physically. And that’s powerful knowledge. Don’t misuse it. 

In the scheme of things, you have youth on your side & it’s ok totally to end this, it’s probably better to. She’ll see and feel that something’s not right, you’ll avoid having sex with her, that pain will hurt her. And you’ll hurt too, you’ll feel lonely wishing you have a woman who jogs with you, lifts weights etc. 

You might stay with her and 20 years later find that athletic girl you love the look of and then regret your whole marriage. Why not find that girl now?? Nobody would blame you for cutting lose now.


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## Luckylucky (Dec 11, 2020)

Al_Bundy said:


> I get it. When you're fit and have your crap together you can hook up with cute chubby girls all day with ZERO effort. They admire you in a way the women you are normally around don't and often are much easy to deal with on personal level.
> 
> However as you are seeing, that comfort and ease come at a price and that price is their body. You'll have to move on and find one that can at least pass the boner test.


Oh Dear 🤦🏼‍♀️

And then when you’re eventually unfit, grey and boring and balding, and the skinny pretty ones look your way, you can still do it with ZERO effort 😝


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## Luckylucky (Dec 11, 2020)

Another thing I saw often in my early days, could it be that you truly think you can do better but lack the confidence to approach the prom-queen? Do that now. 

Age and experience has shown me that many people, men and women do this. Sometimes life is kind and they age like fine wine and suddenly want to upgrade because they can. 

These stories are painful for the ones left behind. 

If this is you, and you’re lacking self-esteem then do something about it now. Don’t let your ego grow when you’re the old guy. Grow the ego now, get someone physically on your level now and don’t be afraid she’s going to upgrade herself later on. Youth is amazing, time is on your side


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## Al_Bundy (Mar 14, 2021)

Could be lack of confidence, but I don't think so. I think more laziness in the sense he might not deem the extra effort it takes to get the beauty queen is worth it. Plus he probably knows that he would just be trading one set of problems for another when it comes to beautiful women. I think he wants the best of both and while there are women out there like that, they're like finding a winning lotto ticket.

You see women do the same thing, at least here in the states. Here a woman who weighs 160lbs is going to be "thinner" than most women. She'll get enough attention that it will soften the will to lose 40lbs and get on that next level. She'll still complain, but won't take any action.


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

popsicality said:


> Wow, I'm floored by the number of responses I got from you all.
> 
> Thank you all so much for giving me your input, even if it was brash. Actually, especially if it was. I'm not here for sugar-coated fairy tales.
> 
> ...


What do you want us to say? You are not attracted to this girl! It's just that simple.

The one thing I will say is you come off a little smug.



> -When I say I'm an athlete I mean that I was a professional athlete and my *world was surrounded by beautiful bodies for years. Still is for the most part.*


What is the point of the last part of this quote? Do you say this a lot to other people? I mean is that a humble brag? Kinda get that sense, look if I had a daughter the three types of guys I would tell her to stay away from are professional athletes, entertainers and Kennedys. So don't act like you are gods gift to this chick, if anything it might work against you. Given the potential of the type of women you have to avoid it's not like it's only a positive, if you really want a long term relationship.

Are you saying you are tempted all the time (which kind of solidifies my point)?

I wonder if you don't somehow think being an professional athlete makes you better then her. If you made her feel bad because is not as physically fit as you then shame on you. And I hope you don't think that.

Anyway I am going to be honest (and that IS COMPASSIONATE). I think you should move on. This is never going to change. It's going to get worse. I won't shame you for wanting what you want, you are not married, that is the whole point of dating. You are allowed to have a type.

I will shame you for holding onto her when you are not attracted to her, or by trying to get her to exercise to fit your type because that is cruel. YES she deserves better. Again there are a lots of men who would be fine with squishy. I personally love that, it feels like a women to me. It's OK that to have different taste, but his women is never going to be what you want. Again you need a women who is into fitness. Sounds like you are around enough of them in the future you should pursue one of them.

Time to adult here and admit you are not attracted to this girl physically. You like her maybe even love her, but that is not enough to build a relationship on. Both of you will be sorry if you try. It won't go away, your taste isn't going to change.

Here is a word of caution what you want requires a particular kind of person, one more time, make sure you date a women who is as athletic and into fitness as you are, because if not you will be unequally matched and it's always going to create a problem.

You were a professional athlete that is a unique kind of culture. I like to work out but hell if I would want to be held to those standards. An hour a day is about the most I can take, it just gets too boring. I like the results and I like lifting but spending hours in the gym is just not for me. I would never want to be married to a women whom that were her thing because honestly we would have nothing in common. Again that is just life, no one is wrong in those circumstances it just is what it is. And most of all it doesn't make either one of us a better catch. The good news is there are women out there who are totally into that. You need to fine one.

Look this girl will get over it, you are not irreplaceable, people brake up all the time. I wouldn't be mean, and be like, I am just not attracted to you, I would just say, you don't think you guys match right to go any further. It happens.

That is the most compassionate advice both of you are going to get. Not everyone is meant to be together and good people can get married and have bad unhappy marriages because of that.


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

lifeistooshort said:


> OP, I was waiting to see if you responded before I weighed in and I'm glad you did.
> 
> Let's talk....athlete to athlete. Admittedly I'm not a professional, but I am an endurance athlete with a long history. High school/college track, junior Olympic 800m state gold medal, held the hs 1600m division record for a while.....that kind of thing.
> 
> ...


This is exactly the type of women you need.


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

Livvie said:


> I can't believe you just basically said "chubby girls" are sexually easy and are easy to deal with but the price is their body sucks.
> 
> Disgusting.


His name fits though.


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## hinterdir (Apr 17, 2018)

popsicality said:


> Hey all,
> 
> I'm in a relationship with someone I truly adore. She's a great partner and I could name a thousand reasons to back up that claim, but I won't take up your time with them.
> 
> ...


Yes, as others have said....why are you with her?
You said "boyfriend" so this is not your wife.
There are 3.5 billion women on the Earth....if attraction is already an issue now and this issue isn't going away why don't you move on from this. You can look for someone you are truly attracted to and she can find a guy who finds her attractive. 
This has future divorce.....future sexless marriage.....future miserable marriage written all over it. 

People should go for compatible mates. So much strife and so many issues that I read about and all I can think about is....these 2 are incompatible....why didn't they recognize this early on and make a peaceful split. 

Unless this is a minor, minor issue to you and isn't super important then you should probably each look for more compatible mates. 
Trust me....if this is an issue now while young and no kids....it will only get worse after 10-15 years of marriage, kids, boring routine, extra pounds of sedentary life....it won't get better.


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

Enigma32 said:


> You're a man in 2021, you aren't allowed to have preferences. Just ignore the people trying to shame you for liking what you like. As you said, you can't help it.


That's not the problem... he can like what he wants, but he shouldn't marry a "chubby" woman if he doesn't like "chubby" women!


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## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

In Absentia said:


> That's not the problem... he can like what he wants, but he shouldn't marry a "chubby" woman if he doesn't like "chubby" women!


I agree.

He should go find an athletic type like he is, for sure.

But keep in mind that sometimes life does interesting things. What if his new athletic girlfriend has the toned "non squishy" body he likes so he marries her, and 5 or 10 years down the road she gets MS or RA and becomes more squishy than this girlfriend was?

What if HE gets MS or RA or something else and becomes more squishy than the original girlfriend was?

I'm still interested to know just how chubby she is. Please tell us, OP.

He says she was always like this. Why did he date her in the first place?


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## Lila (May 30, 2014)

OP, 

You mentioned that you're an athlete and are exposed to beautiful and fit women everywhere you turn. Why didn't you just pick one of those women to date?


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## lifeistooshort (Mar 17, 2013)

Livvie said:


> I agree.
> 
> He should go find an athletic type like he is, for sure.
> 
> ...


Maybe he wasn't successful getting the type he really wanted? Now he has a woman who likes him and he figures he can convince her to become what he couldn't get? Of course I don't know....just throwing out the thought. If he returns he can clarify whether he's actually turned down hardbodies to date this one.

He doesn't mention his particular sport but I can tell you that professional runners are freaking stick figures and a lot of very fit women don't care for that. They want bigger, more muscular dudes. When I got divorced I was approached by more then one (men I've known for years in the community that I never knew were looking) but I don't care for the look. I prefer the big, broad shouldered guy I have 😁

I see skinny, fast male runners with chubby women all the time. My friends and I have often commented on this.


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## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

lifeistooshort said:


> Maybe he wasn't successful getting the type he really wanted? Now he has a woman who likes him and he figures he can convince her to become what he couldn't get? Of course I don't know....just throwing out the thought. If he returns he can clarify whether he's actually turned down hardbodies to date this one.
> 
> He doesn't mention his particular sport but I can tell you that professional runners are freaking stick figures and a lot of very fit women don't care for that. They want bigger, more muscular dudes. When I got divorced I was approached by more then one (men I've known for years in the community that I never knew were looking) but I don't care for the look. I prefer the big, broad shouldered guy I have 😁
> 
> I see skinny, fast male runners with chubby women all the time. My friends and I have often commented on this.


Omg come to think of it, me too! I know of 3 hard core really skinny looking runners and all of their wives are not slender.


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

I think the bottom line in all of this is he is not attracted to who he is dating, and it isn't like the other thread where that guy is OK with it. He isn't. So it's time to move on for both or their sakes.


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## popsicality (Apr 10, 2021)

Hi everyone. 

One person is very persistent in getting to know how chubby she is, so I'll do my best to describe her body.

Her legs lack toning and look like they have some extra on them. She doesn't have an hourglass "womanly" figure, instead, it looks like her middle is just as wide as the top and bottom. Her body lacks the curves that I find attractive in a woman's body because they've been filled in by fat. She's not obese or anything, she's just not fit. 

I can't remember who, but someone thought that I felt that I was being smug because I'm "better" than her (or anyone else who's not fit?) because I was a professional athlete. Nope. I am in better shape and maybe better at suffering. That's about all I'm better at. Moving on... 

Why didn't I just date someone in the sport that I'm in? Well, I did! A few times. None of them worked out. Also it's not like I can just choose any woman and she'll be into me!


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## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

This is the thing - the first time you put your paws on her you knew she was soft and squishy and yet you allowed yourself to develop feelings for her. That's on you. Since she's not doing it for you, move along. You don't get to try to get her to remake herself to your specifications.

I can guarantee you that she won't find you sexy for long, either.


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

popsicality said:


> maybe better at suffering. That's about all I'm better at. Moving on...


Are you though? Seems like you are really struggling with it here.


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## Anastasia6 (May 28, 2017)

I have to agree. You've found a great gal but you aren't attracted to her. Set her free. She shouldn't live with a life time of not being good enough. You aren't going to change and it is unlikely she will change.

I have never understood this purely physical attraction as I find people attractive (yes sexually attractive) based on WHO they are not how they look. But you aren't me.

It can be hard to find someone you are physically attracted to that is also a great personality match. Especially if the physical type normally has a personality that doesn't match your desires. You can do what many men do and find someone who matches your type on the outside even though they don't match on the inside. 

You should keep looking. You maybe lucky and find both. But it would be very unfair to keep a relationship with this young lady. Further you have probably already done life long damage. If you continue your relationship it will only get worse. She'll know. She'll always remember. She'll never be good enough. She will constantly wonder if you still care for her, find her attractive and such. Then there would be kids and old age. Those aren't usually kind.

Set her free.


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## Sfort (Sep 28, 2019)

Get out now and spare her the heartbreak. You will never get past your problem. Find someone who passes your test quickly because with time, she will likely begin failing.


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## ccpowerslave (Nov 21, 2020)

Hmm. The way you describe it, sounds like it could be more her body type than how much extra weight she is carrying.

If the type works for me then a wide range of weights it’s still good. The wrong type at any weight maybe not so much...

I still don’t understand how you ended up together in the first place.


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## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

ccpowerslave said:


> Hmm. The way you describe it, sounds like it could be more her body type than how much extra weight she is carrying.
> 
> If the type works for me then a wide range of weights it’s still good. The wrong type at any weight maybe not so much...
> 
> I still don’t understand how you ended up together in the first place.


It kinda sounds like other people weren't working out and this was his only choice at the time.


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## Anastasia6 (May 28, 2017)

Livvie said:


> It kinda sounds like other people weren't working out and this was his only choice at the time.


Exactly she is plan B. We always tell people don't settle for being plan B or being with plan B. It doesn't work out in the long run.


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## lifeistooshort (Mar 17, 2013)

Dating is all about prioritizing what's important to you and finding the intersection of what you can get and what wants you.


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## GC1234 (Apr 15, 2020)

Truthfully, this is a tough one. When I met my husband, I wasn't physically attracted to him at all, but I learned to love him. When I got pregnant the first time though, he was a d***. He would call me fat daily...daily!. It got to the point where I felt so unattractive that I didn't want to sleep with him. We have sex frequently now, but it's not the same, not much passion anymore. That feeling of 'being unattractive' has stayed with me, even though I personally find myself attractive. 

IMO, you should just leave your girl alone, and let her find someone who is into her. It can really bring a person down if you don't find her attractive.


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## Enigma32 (Jul 6, 2020)

In Absentia said:


> That's not the problem... he can like what he wants, but he shouldn't marry a "chubby" woman if he doesn't like "chubby" women!


You are never going to find a perfect partner. No matter who you get with, you're probably going to have to learn to accept certain things about them because you value others. From what the OP has said here, it sounds like he really likes his lady, but her body shape and his lack of attraction towards her is really starting to get to him. That type of situation isn't exactly abnormal.


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## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

Right. But so does a woman have to have a near perfect body in order for a man to be attracted to her, then?


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## Anastasia6 (May 28, 2017)

Enigma32 said:


> You are never going to find a perfect partner. No matter who you get with, you're probably going to have to learn to accept certain things about them because you value others. From what the OP has said here, it sounds like he really likes his lady, but her body shape and his lack of attraction towards her is really starting to get to him. That type of situation isn't exactly abnormal.


not finding the perfect partner is normal. However OP apparently is motivated by looks or he would find a great lady attractive. He doesn't so he should chose based on looks plus other stuff. There are plenty of people who marry people who aren't their ideal look. But they also don't get hung up on the looks. This is early. If he's going to get hung up now then later will be worse. He'll be very unhappy and probably end up in a sexless marriage. Either because he isn't attracted or because she holds resentment for never being good enough.


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## Anastasia6 (May 28, 2017)

Livvie said:


> Right. But so does a woman have to have a near perfect body in order for a man to be attracted to her, then?


Only certain men


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## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

Well this thread went and got a bit 'judgey' didn't it? For @popsicality, these threads pop up often. They seldom go well. The battle lines are pretty consistent.

Do you have a sense where this relationship is going, or where you want it to go? I apologize, I don't know if I overlooked how long you have been together. In other words, if the expectation is that this relationship has a lifespan measured in months rather years or a lifetime, then I'd recommend rolling with it for as long as you can. You can always try to invite her into your active lifestyle and see if she responds well. If she has no interest, and activity and fitness remain important factors of attraction for you, then the cards are already cast. I have no issue with this, as it certainly reflects my own values and attraction quotient. I do not hate, disrespect, or put down pear shaped, or heavy women. But I won't date them, because I am simply not attracted to them ... at least I haven't met that woman to change my mind yet. Will say that my previous partner started off model thin and easily put on 30 pounds and I didn't care. The attraction stuck, but she also still had curves.

You like what you like. No need to apologize or make excuses for that. But I would also argue that if in the end, you know the appearance of your partner is a deal breaker for you, despite how wonderful she may otherwise be, you are wasting both your time, and hers, in terms of finding partners better suited to you both.


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## Lila (May 30, 2014)

Enigma32 said:


> You are never going to find a perfect partner. No matter who you get with, you're probably going to have to learn to accept certain things about them because you value others. From what the OP has said here, it sounds like he really likes his lady, but her body shape and his lack of attraction towards her is really starting to get to him. That type of situation isn't exactly abnormal.


@Enigma32 what would be your advice if a woman had posted this?

"Hey all,

I'm in a relationship with someone I truly adore. He's a great partner and I could name a thousand reasons to back up that claim, but I won't take up your time with them.

As the title suggests, I'm having issues with physical attraction. He's not fit- he's a bit chubby (at least in my opinion) and I'm someone who's a pretty serious athlete and is very fit. I love him to death, but I don't know what to do here.

I've brought my lack of physical attraction up with him in the past with no resolution".


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## Enigma32 (Jul 6, 2020)

@Lila It depends on the woman. The OP here claims to be a super fit, pro-athlete type. I've been the athletic type most of my life. I used to be a competitive kickboxer when I was young, I played sports every day, and I've been a weight lifter since forever. When I was in my 20's and in really good shape, I wouldn't have dated a girl that was overweight. Not a chance in hell. I've also been exactly in the OPs shoes so I think I know how he feels. He has met this really sweet girl who probably treats him well and he initially thought he could probably get past his initial lack of attraction for her. He maybe even really wanted to move past it but the problem just isn't going away. It's ultimately up to him to decide what he wants to do but his preferences are valid.

Now, on to your example if a female were to ask for the same advice. Is she also rocking the body of a competitive athlete like the OP is or is she another one of those really big girls that posts memes on social media about how thin/fit guys should love curvy women or they aren't a real man? That detail is rather important to me because personally, when I was training each and every day to be in really good shape as a young man, I wasn't doing it so I could date bigger girls. I think those ladies are entitled to their preferences but I also think they are likely delusional.

In the end though, my advice to a female would be exactly the same as it is to the OP. The decision is hers. We all have to weigh the pros and cons of anyone we get with and the level of attraction we have for our partner is just another part of the equation. If she thinks the chubby guy's other good qualities make him worth sticking with, that's her choice. If not, that's a valid decision as well. 

I will say this much. I don't think men are coddled or lied to when it comes to their body shape like women are. There is no body positivity movement for fat guys.....we are just fat guys. I think a man should be emotionally equipped to handle the situation if his wife or GF tells him he needs to lose weight. If my GF told me she wanted me to lose weight, I'd just make her come to the gym with me more often. Problem solved.


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## Lila (May 30, 2014)

Enigma32 said:


> @Lila It depends on the woman. The OP here claims to be a super fit, pro-athlete type. I've been the athletic type most of my life. I used to be a competitive kickboxer when I was young, I played sports every day, and I've been a weight lifter since forever. When I was in my 20's and in really good shape, I wouldn't have dated a girl that was overweight. Not a chance in hell. I've also been exactly in the OPs shoes so I think I know how he feels. He has met this really sweet girl who probably treats him well and he initially thought he could probably get past his initial lack of attraction for her. He maybe even really wanted to move past it but the problem just isn't going away. It's ultimately up to him to decide what he wants to do but his preferences are valid.
> 
> Now, on to your example if a female were to ask for the same advice. Is she also rocking the body of a competitive athlete like the OP is or is she another one of those really big girls that posts memes on social media about how thin/fit guys should love curvy women or they aren't a real man? That detail is rather important to me because personally, when I was training each and every day to be in really good shape as a young man, I wasn't doing it so I could date bigger girls. I think those ladies are entitled to their preferences but I also think they are likely delusional.
> 
> ...


Most everyone else is telling him to let his current girlfriend go so that he can find the woman who he finds physically attractive. Most of us are wondering why the world he got emotionally involved with someone he doesn't find physically attractive. It sounded from your posts that you were encouraging the OP to continue with this girl because "no one is perfect". Personally, I think this is a recipe for disaster.


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## Enigma32 (Jul 6, 2020)

@Lila I know for a fact there are plenty of couples that are happy enough together despite one partner not being all that attracted to the other. Maybe it is a recipe for disaster for many people but it won't be for everyone. We are not all the same and not everyone ranks physical attractiveness that high on a scale of importance. I also think there is a big difference between being grossed out by someone physically and someone just not being your ideal. If they are not your ideal type physically, maybe they aren't as attractive as you like but they could be attractive enough. It's just a matter of priorities.


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## Lila (May 30, 2014)

Enigma32 said:


> @Lila I know for a fact there are plenty of couples that are happy enough together despite one partner not being all that attracted to the other. *Maybe it is a recipe for disaster for many people but it won't be for everyone. We are not all the same and not everyone ranks physical attractiveness that high on a scale of importance.* I also think there is a big difference between being grossed out by someone physically and someone just not being your ideal. If they are not your ideal type physically, maybe they aren't as attractive as you like but they could be attractive enough. It's just a matter of priorities.


But physical attractiveness IS important to the OP. He's obviously struggling with the lack of physical attraction. That's why I think it's a recipe for disaster for the OP to remain in this relationship. 

To be honest, I don't understand how his girlfriend can stay with the OP knowing he doesn't find her physically attractive but to each their own.


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## Enigma32 (Jul 6, 2020)

@Lila yeah, he has some decisions to make. I just don't think the rules are as black and white as most people here seem to believe.


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## NTA (Mar 28, 2021)

> I don't think men are coddled or lied to when it comes to their body shape like women are. There is no body positivity movement for fat guys.....we are just fat guys. I think a man should be emotionally equipped to handle the situation if his wife or GF tells him he needs to lose weight.


This is the difference between now and then when I was child. Every and any adult would call me fat. I wouldn't dare call another person's child fat.

I don't think this health /beauty at any weight is a good idea. I know a couple of women who weren't getting the guys they wanted so they lost weight since they needed to.

And don't think these fat women are reticent. My husband's just a friend ex didn't lose an opportunity to make a dig about my advanced age.


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## Luckylucky (Dec 11, 2020)

Look we rarely ever get the complete package, we’re just not going to end up with all the boxes ticked. 

It’s really ok to have a body type or other attributes that are physically attractive to us, and a list of other things. I dated a lot of men that just didn’t fit my physical ideal and cut them off quickly and I know the same thing happened to me. You can see this in someone’s eyes immediately. It sounds fickle, but their eyes aren’t drinking you in, you just know. Did she look at you this way, did you look at her this way? 

Most of us end up with a list of things we want to change in our partner. Which is sort of ok. It’s not ok though to live with it when it’s a dark spot and it overrides everything else. Also very much not ok to marry someone or prolong a relationship because you can’t find something else or nobody else works out. 

By the way has she ever asked you or given any indication that she feels you’re not into her? Has she explicitly said that she’s noticed something’s amiss?

Whatever you do, never ever tell her it’s her body type.


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## Al_Bundy (Mar 14, 2021)

Livvie said:


> Right. But so does a woman have to have a near perfect body in order for a man to be attracted to her, then?


Depends on the guy's options. In this case he has the option for a classically beautiful woman but has chosen a different route. This girl probably doesn't make the same kind/level of demands that the other women do.

In general you don't have to be "near perfect". The bar has been set so low by the average woman that just not being overweight puts you in the top percentile automatically.


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## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

Al_Bundy said:


> Depends on the guy's options. In this case he has the option for a classically beautiful woman but has chosen a different route. This girl probably doesn't make the same kind/level of demands that the other women do.
> 
> In general you don't have to be "near perfect". The bar has been set so low by the average woman that just not being overweight puts you in the top percentile automatically.


In this case we actually _don't_ know he has the option for a classically beautiful woman. His body may be fit, but we know nothing of his other traits and if he's able to _keep_ a classically beautiful woman.

Maybe this current girlfriend is actually, if you look at all of her traits collectively, at his attractiveness level/about right for what he can pull in.


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## jsmart (Mar 14, 2015)

A very fit guy in his 20s, that probably puts in a lot effort to bring his body to that level is going to want a girl who’s at least reasonably fit. 

I remember this girl that I pursued pretty hard when I was about 20. She was such a sweet girl with a gorgeous face. When I first held her, she was just like OP described, squishy. The lack of tone in her arms and rest of her body just completely turned me off. I pretty quickly backed off because I didn’t want to hurt by having sex with her. I felt guilty because I could tell she was really into me but I couldn’t fake it.

The right thing to do is to gently let her go. She sounds like a great catch for the right guy. Being with a guy who has to mentally psych himself to have sex with a her is wrong. Let her meet a guy who not only thinks she’s a great gal on the inside but is also overwhelmed with passion because of how she looks on the outside.


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## jsmart (Mar 14, 2015)

Livvie said:


> In this case we actually _don't_ know he has the option for a classically beautiful woman. His body may be fit, but we know nothing of his other traits and if he's able to _keep_ a classically beautiful woman.
> 
> Maybe this current girlfriend is actually, if you look at all of her traits collectively, at his attractiveness level/about right for what he can pull in.


Very true. While we men tend to be heavily influenced by a woman’s appearance, women judge men by a much tougher standard. 

An attractive woman with a feminine hour glass figure is going to have the pick of the litter. A gym rat with nothing else going for him would not be at the top of the list for a woman with a lot of options.


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## Luckylucky (Dec 11, 2020)

jsmart said:


> Very true. While we men tend to be heavily influenced by a woman’s appearance, women judge men by a much tougher standard.
> 
> An attractive woman with a feminine hour glass figure is going to have the pick of the litter. A gym rat with nothing else going for him would not be at the top of the list for a woman with a lot of options.


It’s not true, I have a feminine hourglass figure and I was always pushed aside for the tall and toned athletic girls. I was lucky to have found someone who likes my type, but truly most of them wanted the lollipop type. 

I always knew straight away when I wasn’t their thing. And that hurt, no matter how much I worked out I wasn’t going to be able to change my body type and get a flatter bum.


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

Enigma32 said:


> @Lila yeah, he has some decisions to make. I just don't think the rules are as black and white as most people here seem to believe.


I agree with this... but... IMO, it's morally wrong to get involved with someone you don't really fancy. Maybe my opinion is a bit extreme, because we are all human, and actually, I have done it myself! But we split up after a few weeks, because it wasn't going anywhere. She wasn't ugly, she was pretty and very intelligent, but she wasn't just my type, body-wise. I lost interest at the end. And I think I made a big mistake there. She was hurt. A lot.


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## Lila (May 30, 2014)

Luckylucky said:


> It’s really ok to have a body type or other attributes that are physically attractive to us, and a list of other things. I dated a lot of men that just didn’t fit my physical ideal and cut them off quickly and I know the same thing happened to me.* You can see this in someone’s eyes immediately. It sounds fickle, but their eyes aren’t drinking you in, you just know*. Did she look at you this way, did you look at her this way?


Count me as one who wants to be physically desired by my lover/partner. The people with whom I get along great but with whom I do not share mutual sexual desire (of which physical attraction is a huge component) are called friends.


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## jsmart (Mar 14, 2015)

Luckylucky said:


> It’s not true, I have a feminine hourglass figure and I was always pushed aside for the tall and toned athletic girls. I was lucky to have found someone who likes my type, but truly most of them wanted the lollipop type.
> 
> I always knew straight away when I wasn’t their thing. And that hurt, no matter how much I worked out I wasn’t going to be able to change my body type and get a *flatter bum.*


A flatter bum? That’s your problem right there.  All kidding aside, we men do not all have the same taste but the great majority of men will find the typical woman porn actress body as the most attractive. You don’t see to many of the super thin model types nor the extremely fit women type. Clicks don’t lie. 

When I say a feminine hour glass figure, I’m referring to the type of body that most women develop naturally with healthy eating and moderate exercise. I’m not referring to any body positive BS that’s pushed by the corporate media to shame men into thinking obese women are attractive.


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

jsmart said:


> Clicks don’t lie.


Clicks by porn addicts? I see... also, I think you'll find that the body positive message encourages all women to be proud of what and who they are, regardless of the body-perfect chauvinist crap pushed by the male-dominated media.


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## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

jsmart said:


> great majority of men will find the typical woman porn actress body as the most attractive.


Since I don't watch porn, please describe what the typical woman porn actress body looks like. Is it obvious that they have had boob and butt implants? Is it obvious that their faces have been surgically altered? Can you tell if they have had their buttholes bleached? Cellulite removed? Are their arms toned?


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## Sfort (Sep 28, 2019)

Blondilocks said:


> Since I don't watch porn, please describe what the typical woman porn actress body looks like. Is it obvious that they have had boob and butt implants? Is it obvious that their faces have been surgically altered? Can you tell if they have had their buttholes bleached? Cellulite removed? Are their arms toned?


I'm not a regular fan or consumer of porn, but I've seen my share over the years. The women are not the average woman with average features as (I hope) the men are not.


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

Blondilocks said:


> Since I don't watch porn, please describe what the typical woman porn actress body looks like. Is it obvious that they have had boob and butt implants? Is it obvious that their faces have been surgically altered? Can you tell if they have had their buttholes bleached? Cellulite removed? Are their arms toned?


I'm not an expert by any means and I'm not American, but they tend to be Barbie-lookalikes with fake boobs and fake lips, tall and very slim... nothing natural about them.... I'm afraid I can't tell you about anal bleaching...


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## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

This thread makes me want to go lift some weights right now in fear of being called squishy by anyone. I actually just felt my arms and they don't feel squishy to me, but...


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## Al_Bundy (Mar 14, 2021)

Livvie said:


> In this case we actually _don't_ know he has the option for a classically beautiful woman. His body may be fit, but we know nothing of his other traits and if he's able to _keep_ a classically beautiful woman.
> 
> Maybe this current girlfriend is actually, if you look at all of her traits collectively, at his attractiveness level/about right for what he can pull in.


True, I thought in the thread he said professional level which implies more than just being a gym rat or some guy who runs a 5k. I was going off that.

It could have started out as a fling but she was nice to be around. 

I know a lot of heat has been put on this guy, but she's a consenting adult. What happened to strong independent women?


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## NTA (Mar 28, 2021)

Al_Bundy said:


> True, I thought in the thread he said professional level which implies more than just being a gym rat or some guy who runs a 5k. I was going off that.
> 
> It could have started out as a fling but she was nice to be around.
> 
> I know a lot of heat has been put on this guy, but she's a consenting adult. What happened to strong independent women?


Also the pandemic can make strange bed fellows.


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## jsmart (Mar 14, 2015)

Livvie said:


> This thread makes me want to go lift some weights right now in fear of being called squishy by anyone. I actually just felt my arms and they don't feel squishy to me, but...


Lol. You literally made crack up. 

I have to say that this 100 percent applies for men too. No woman likes a squishy guy either. I could only imagine the gauntlet of test that most of you gals place on a guy who hopes to get with one of you.


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## lifeistooshort (Mar 17, 2013)

Livvie said:


> This thread makes me want to go lift some weights right now in fear of being called squishy by anyone. I actually just felt my arms and they don't feel squishy to me, but...


I tell my bf it's one of my goals to keep enough tone that I can wear sleeveless tops and look good and I can hold my arm up and not have it sag 🤣


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## ccpowerslave (Nov 21, 2020)

Al_Bundy said:


> I know a lot of heat has been put on this guy, but she's a consenting adult. What happened to strong independent women?


I dunno. It would never occur to me when I was younger that someone would go out with me a bunch and presumably have a bunch of sex and the whole time they’re thinking, “Damn this guy is fat and repulsive.” I wish he had six pack abs!

I don’t think it’s unreasonable to assume that unless the OP is straight up telling her.


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## re16 (Oct 9, 2012)

This is simple, she checked a lot of boxes but not an important one, physical attraction, which is only defined by the eye of the beholder.

I was in a similar situation with an early girlfriend, moved-on, and then found someone who checks all my boxes.

Time for you to move on and the lesson learned should be to not go past any (personal) red flags in the future. Everyone's red flags and boxes to check are different. You now know this one is important.

Please let her down nicely, this could very painful for her if you don't do it correctly.


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## Hopeful Cynic (Apr 27, 2014)

popsicality said:


> I'm in a relationship with someone I truly adore. She's a great partner and I could name a thousand reasons to back up that claim, but I won't take up your time with them.
> 
> As the title suggests, I'm having issues with physical attraction. She's not fit- she's a bit chubby (at least in my opinion) and I'm someone who's a pretty serious athlete and is very fit. I love her to death, but I don't know what to do here.
> 
> I've brought it up with her in the past (because she and I both value honesty and transparency) and it led to an exhaustingly draining and emotional number of conversations before I had had enough and wanted to put it behind us. She, like a lot of women, has a history of struggling with body image, and also hates the idea of a man telling her that she's not "attractive", so her boyfriend isn't exactly her ideal candidate for saying that.





popsicality said:


> -We are in our mid 20's.
> -We are both very healthy- that's not a concern. She eats incredibly well and I could stand to take notes from her.
> -When I say I'm an athlete I mean that I was a professional athlete and my world was surrounded by beautiful bodies for years. Still is for the most part.
> -I'm not (nor was I ever) trying to change her. I'm stupid, but not that stupid.
> ...


Were you ever attracted to her in the beginning? If her weight hasn't changed much since then, the thing that has changed is your perception. So that's what you need to analyze. It's really normal for the initial burst of new relationship energy (NRE - it's a thing, read about it) to fade over time. In a healthy relationship, limerence type of feelings get replaced with longer more contentment love. In your case, however, they haven't been. The initial physical attraction has faded, and you are feeling its lack. Do you see other women and feel an attraction to them, especially athletic women, and wish your girlfriend looked like them?

If you weren't ever attracted to her, then why did you start a relationship with her? If you just thought she was a great person in a squidgy body, and hoped that her good qualities would make up for the lack of physical attraction, you're learning a painful lesson that attraction is a very important component in a sexual relationship.

The thing now is to do some self-examination. Maybe you're the type of person who craves those limerence feelings, and you'll be happiest in short relationships of a few years duration. Maybe what you've really learned from this experience is that you need an athletic partner. Maybe you need to date an athletic partner for a few years and see how you feel when that limerence fades.

As others have said though, it sounds like you do really care about this woman, just not in an intimate partner kind of way anymore (if ever). You need to find a way to end the relationship that doesn't scar her. You need to frame it as a classic case of "it's not you, it's me" that doesn't sound cliché. She sounds like a wonderful person that many men would find attractive, but you just don't think you're the right person to be in a long-term relationship with her. You've come to love her like a sister or a friend, just not as a lover.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

In Absentia said:


> That's not the problem... he can like what he wants, but he shouldn't marry a "chubby" woman if he doesn't like "chubby" women!


Nor date one.


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## Emerging Buddhist (Apr 7, 2016)

Hopeful Cynic said:


> Were you ever attracted to her in the beginning? If her weight hasn't changed much since then, the thing that has changed is your perception. So that's what you need to analyze. It's really normal for the initial burst of new relationship energy (NRE - it's a thing, read about it) to fade over time. In a healthy relationship, limerence type of feelings get replaced with longer more contentment love. In your case, however, they haven't been. The initial physical attraction has faded, and you are feeling its lack. Do you see other women and feel an attraction to them, especially athletic women, and wish your girlfriend looked like them?
> 
> If you weren't ever attracted to her, then why did you start a relationship with her? If you just thought she was a great person in a squidgy body, and hoped that her good qualities would make up for the lack of physical attraction, you're learning a painful lesson that attraction is a very important component in a sexual relationship.
> 
> ...


Lots for the OP to consider... nicely said.


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

Diana7 said:


> Nor date one.


yes, that too...


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## hamadryad (Aug 30, 2020)

IME, Generally speaking there are 2 kinds of people....

One seems satisfied with just about anything....They aren't going to be "bothered" if their partner gains weight, loses weight, is unfit, unkempt, whatever, cuts their hair off, whatever......These same folks also may be just generally happy with their lives as well...Their jobs may not be great, but they are not going to change, don't bury themselves with what if's and what could have been's and just happily go about their lives...

The other type is seemingly constantly seeking ways of improving or changing, and/or are just never seemingly satisfied...These types are constantly looking around themselves and criticizing and doubting everything about themselves and the people around them...It never ends...

I tend to be in the second group. and always seemed to envy the others in some ways...I have mellowed a bit with age, but still these feelings constantly rear their head...And the crazy part is that there is no real control over it...Its something we all are probably born with, or at the very least,,it's learned at a very young age... I remember as a very young kid, secretly not wanting my own mother to come to my sporting events at school, because she was really overweight and I was embarrassed by her.. It's really terrible...And there were times in my life that I looked over at women I was with and wondered why they decided to order something so fattening from the menu while at a restaurant...Again, this is not something I am proud of...Why can't we all just be out and enjoy the evening?

Anyway, just wanted to point this out...One of the reasons why I posted this is just this morning a guy on my social media put up a picture of his wife with a lovely and loving message as it was her birthday.. ,,,,She is clearly at least 40 lbs overweight and the photo showed her in a terrible light as far as appearance, anyway...But you know what? He didn't care one bit, because that's his woman and he's crazy about her, obviously...

Perhaps the OP is one of the second group...In that case, he may be unfairly criticizing his gf due to the facts I mentioned...I am sure this woman is probably awesome...The people( and I say "us" here) in the second group can be very hard to live with...About all I can advise, is be careful when/if you decide to ditch out on this...Sure, you can be very lucky and get it all...but maybe you wont either....He's still pretty young and maybe this is a time to address this issue and learn to be more tolerant and understanding and look at the whole package, not just the body type...


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## itskaren (Dec 28, 2011)

popsicality said:


> Hey all,
> 
> I'm in a relationship with someone I truly adore. She's a great partner and I could name a thousand reasons to back up that claim, but I won't take up your time with them.
> 
> ...


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## UndecidedinNY (Jul 11, 2013)

Why did you ever ask her out in the first place if she isn't physically appealing to you?

ETA: Never mind, I finished reading. You dated her because she was the best you could get, your "type" wasn't working out for you, but she isn't good enough either. I don't think ANYONE should waste the time of someone they aren't attracted to, or try to force themself to pretend to be attracted, but you really wasted her time and shouldn't waste anymore of it. I'm not here for "take what I can get, and when I can get better, I will". If you really adore her, respect her time (she isn't going to have an easier time meeting someone new as she gets older, so let her start now). 

If you find it hard to make things work with hotter women, well... maybe you are "fit" but not that great looking or nice? Work on yourself to be appealing to the women you want. I don't think anyone should be mad about your preferences, but wasting her time is not ok, and in the long run, at some point, you ARE going to leave her or cheat because you want a different type, and that is also not ok, so just deal with putting in more effort to land the type you like.


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## WandaJ (Aug 5, 2014)

Lila said:


> But physical attractiveness IS important to the OP. He's obviously struggling with the lack of physical attraction.


Physical attractiveness is important to everybody, we just define it differently. We really can not chose to whom we feel attracted, it’s just happpens. I feel like there is too much shaming of OP going on this thread. We all have types. Sometimes we venture outside of what we like because of some other features, but most if us will go back to what attracts us most.


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## Lila (May 30, 2014)

WandaJ said:


> Physical attractiveness is important to everybody, we just define it differently. We really can not chose to whom we feel attracted, it’s just happpens. I feel like there is too much shaming of OP going on this thread. We all have types. Sometimes we venture outside of what we like because of some other features, but most if us will go back to what attracts us most.


I agree, the OP is entitled to like whatever he likes and to make physical appearance a priority. However he doesn't find his girlfriend physically attractive which is why I, as well as many others on this thread, are recommending he break up with her and go find a partner that he does find physically attractive. I'm not sure how that's shaming the OP.


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## NTA (Mar 28, 2021)

> The other type is seemingly constantly seeking ways of improving or changing, and/or are just never seemingly satisfied...These types are constantly looking around themselves and criticizing and doubting everything about themselves and the people around them...It never ends...


It can also be about control and manipulation. I dated a couple of guys in my 20s and they were always harping about my weight. I could get them to stop by threatening to break up with them. And then they would start again.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

WandaJ said:


> Physical attractiveness is important to everybody, we just define it differently. We really can not chose to whom we feel attracted, it’s just happpens. I feel like there is too much shaming of OP going on this thread. We all have types. Sometimes we venture outside of what we like because of some other features, but most if us will go back to what attracts us most.


This is well put. 

Often times we hear people criticising someone of being too picky or not picky enough,,, but the truth is everyone is picky, they just pick something differently than you would or than I would. 

I don't think people should date someone that they know deep in their heart of hearts that they won't be attracted to them or that they won't like them. But there also is something to be said for being open minded in broadening your own horizons and trying some different things. 

But in the OP is as entitled to his own values and criteria and standards as anyone else.


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## lifeistooshort (Mar 17, 2013)

oldshirt said:


> This is well put.
> 
> Often times we hear people criticising someone of being too picky or not picky enough,,, but the truth is everyone is picky, they just pick something differently than you would or than I would.
> 
> ...


OP is absolutely entitled to his own standards and criteria and I believe I said the same thing.

What is kind of ****ty is to actively date and waste the time of someone you know doesn't do it for you, possibly because you can't actually get what you want.

He hasn't responded much except for a few vague posts but he did mention others not being interested in him.

The one thing i tried to call him on is where he told her she doesn't do it for him. That's a dumb thing to say and there's no coming back from it. If she was one way when they met and let herself go it might be ok to mention the effort, but she's always been as she is and he chose to date her anyway.

If she doesn't do it for him then he should end it and should absolutely not feel bad about it.

My feeling is that he can't actually get the hard body he wants, or at least hasn't found one that has other qualities he wants and also wants him. He likes this one and she was interested, so he figured that he could push her into being what he wants physically by telling her she doesn't turn him on.

No and no. She is who she is and if that doesn't work for him he's free to move on. And once you tell a woman she doesn't do it for you there's no coming back anyway. Even if she becomes a hard body she'll still resent him and probably have more options.

Time to cut her loose.


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## Al_Bundy (Mar 14, 2021)

lifeistooshort said:


> OP is absolutely entitled to his own standards and criteria and I believe I said the same thing.
> 
> What is kind of ****ty is to actively date and waste the time of someone you know doesn't do it for you, possibly because you can't actually get what you want.
> 
> ...


Would you say this is the male version of when a woman gets with a guy because she thinks she can change or "fix" him? Only to realize later she can't.


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## lifeistooshort (Mar 17, 2013)

Al_Bundy said:


> Would you say this is the male version of when a woman gets with a guy because she thinks she can change or "fix" him? Only to realize later she can't.


I suppose you could argue there are similarities, though I think it's closer to a woman dating a skinny guy because he has other good qualities but then deciding that he really doesn't turn her on because she desires the hard body buff guys at the gym.

Then she tells him he doesn't do it for her and she needs him to become a buff gym guy even though he was skinny when they met. She continues to complain that he's such a great guy and she doesn't want to give him up but she really needs a buff gym guy to get turned on and whenever she touches him all she can think about is how skinny he is. But she may or may not be able to get said buff guys and even if she does they may not have other qualities she wants.

However, if she truly doesn't get turned on by skinny guys she shouldn't be wasting one's time dating him.


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## Al_Bundy (Mar 14, 2021)

lifeistooshort said:


> I suppose you could argue there are similarities, though I think it's closer to a woman dating a skinny guy because he has other good qualities but then deciding that he really doesn't turn her on because she desires the hard body buff guys at the gym.
> 
> Then she tells him he doesn't do it for her and she needs him to become a buff gym guy even though he was skinny when they met. She continues to complain that he's such a great guy and she doesn't want to give him up but she really needs a buff gym guy to get turned on and whenever she touches him all she can think about is how skinny he is. But she may or may not be able to get said buff guys and even if she does they may not have other qualities she wants.
> 
> However, if she truly doesn't get turned on by skinny guys she shouldn't be wasting one's time dating him.


Maybe we're too stuck in the physical part, yes I know it was specifically mentioned. But isn't both our examples of where a person wants a certain kind of partner and instead of doing the work to get that kind of person, they want someone else to do the work and change for them? In this case OP has done the physical work which works for him well most of the time. But maybe there's something else to get to that next level.

It's not that they can't go out and get what they want, they just might not pay the extra price.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

Al_Bundy said:


> . But isn't both our examples of where a person wants a certain kind of partner and instead of doing the work to get that kind of person, they want someone else to do the work and change for them?


That is very well put as well.


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## lifeistooshort (Mar 17, 2013)

Al_Bundy said:


> Maybe we're too stuck in the physical part, yes I know it was specifically mentioned. But isn't both our examples of where a person wants a certain kind of partner and instead of doing the work to get that kind of person, they want someone else to do the work and change for them? In this case OP has done the physical work which works for him well most of the time. But maybe there's something else to get to that next level.
> 
> It's not that they can't go out and get what they want, they just might not pay the extra price.


Yeah, I guess it is. I can see how it happens where one could meet someone they really like except for that one big thing, and its tempting to think "if I could just get them to change this.....".

FWIW I'm not a fan of taking on projects but I also understand how it happens, so I don't fault him for that. I would argue though that physical appearance and attraction are touchy subjects, and how often do we see complaints that women marry guys they aren't attracted to and how ****ty that is? I don't understand that anyway....I really want a guy I'm into. I look at my bf all the time and think about how good he looks naked. I know men who are great guys but do nothing for me physically and I have no desire to get in on that.

I also stand by my assertion that telling someone that the way they were when you met doesn't turn them on is a ****ty thing to do.

I agree about putting in the work, but at some point dating is about finding a package you're happy with even though you might not get everything you'd ideally want. But you have to prioritize what's important to you. If the physical is important then don't date someone who doesn't check that box. I wouldn't turn away a guy who made more money then me (I'm close to 6 figures) but it's not that important as long as I don't have to support him. That's a low priority to me.

But I do want a guy I'm into so I wouldn't date one I wasn't into.


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## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

Even if his girlfriend works out, loses weight and tones; she still may not have the hour glass figure. Some women just don't have a waistline. I had a sister in law with this type of figure - at 21, a 110 lbs and 5'4" she was straight up and down.


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## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

Al_Bundy said:


> Maybe we're too stuck in the physical part, yes I know it was specifically mentioned. But isn't both our examples of where a person wants a certain kind of partner and instead of doing the work to get that kind of person, they want someone else to do the work and change for them? In this case OP has done the physical work which works for him well most of the time. But maybe there's something else to get to that next level.
> 
> It's not that they can't go out and get what they want, they just might not pay the extra price.


I think maybe he can't get everything he wants.

He says he's dated other athlete types before and it didn't work out. Now he's got an amazing girlfriend, but he's not jazzed about her body type (though it was acceptable enough to start and build a relationship with her🤔).

He's looking for an extremely high caliber and rare woman in all categories.

I think if he could pull that off, he would have already.


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## lifeistooshort (Mar 17, 2013)

Blondilocks said:


> Even if his girlfriend works out, loses weight and tones; she still may not have the hour glass figure. Some women just don't have a waistline. I had a sister in law with this type of figure - at 21, a 110 lbs and 5'4" she was straight up and down.


That's true. Hourglass figures aren't that common.....only 8% of women have a true hourglass figure. 

I do, and when I gain weight I still have a waistline, but my hips, butt, and face get fat. The fat face is the worst.

Most of the hard bodies around him probably aren't hourglass figures. Your point is taken though....if he just wants someone a bit more toned that's one thing. If he's looking for a specific body type that might be harder to find.


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## CatholicDad (Oct 30, 2017)

First, I think attraction is very important for marriage. If you aren't attracted- don't marry them. 

My concern though is that I think many men have unrealistic ideas of what a woman's body is supposed to look/feel like. I think this comes from our culture and from pornography.

When my two oldest kids were young I gave one a blue cup and one a red cup to drink water out of every day. These colors each became their favorite as the grew up and even as adults they both identify these as their favorite colors. I'm not kidding here- my strategy for distinguishing which cup belonged to who- shaped their color preference for life.

Our culture pushing these constant images of these super fit, super attractive ladies everywhere- probably is damaging to men. We obviously can't know if OP is damaged or not- but judging by the prevalence of porn use by men in society I think we can generalize and say there are many, many "damaged" men out there. 

I think though my cup story shows that to some extent preference can be trained and learned and I've experienced this in the couple of decades in being married to my wife. I was always attracted to her but I think my attraction has grown as a result of thousands of pleasurable experiences we've had together. Through the ups and downs of life she's always remained feminine, beautiful, dignified, kind... of course- she's been an angry, ticked off beeotch a few times too- lol.


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## ccpowerslave (Nov 21, 2020)

There are standards of attractiveness that are arrived at statistically. 

Porn is just giving people what they want just like advertising, media (print, television, movies), etc... 

Unrealistic? Not sure about that. These people exist (usually) and even absent the magic of Photoshop generally in a statistically relevant sample they would be more attractive to a larger number of people. I’m sure it has been studied in the literature how much is nature versus nurture.

The OP has vanished seemingly but it would be interesting for me to know if it’s more a body type issue or a pure weight issue or both. I know there are body types I wouldn’t seek out fat or thin.


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## lifeistooshort (Mar 17, 2013)

ccpowerslave said:


> There are standards of attractiveness that are arrived at statistically.
> 
> Porn is just giving people what they want just like advertising, media (print, television, movies), etc...
> 
> ...


It's kind of a chicken and egg question. Porn may give people what they want but it's also a business, so it has to peddle a fantasy to keep people coming back. If porn offered what you see every day anyway why would you keep going back? It's designed to get you addicted just like all industries .....the food industry does the same thing.

In this case you also have a community which represents a very small percentage of the population. Running around athletic communities, particularly if you're a semi pro or a pro, also gives you unrealistic ideas of what the average person looks like. If you can't find someone in the community you might have a tough time finding one who looks like that, and even if you do that person may not continue to look like that.

But I also think most people develop more tolerance for a little softness in the body as they age. This guy is young so of course he wants more.


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## Al_Bundy (Mar 14, 2021)

I think "average" is a poor standard to compare to. Especially since the average person is significantly larger than they used to be. Average used to just mean the person wasn't hot. Now it means overweight. So being better than average is like bragging about being the hottest waitress at Denny's.


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## lifeistooshort (Mar 17, 2013)

Al_Bundy said:


> I think "average" is a poor standard to compare to. Especially since the average person is significantly larger than they used to be. Average used to just mean the person wasn't hot. Now it means overweight. So being better than average is like bragging about being the hottest waitress at Denny's.


You have to take my comment in the spirit with which it was intended.

Besides....if more and more people are overweight then by definition overweight becomes average. Average by definition means where most people fall, and what societies consider "hot" usually involves something less common. Such people have a lot of options because they are not the norm.

When few people were overweight you had to be Marilyn Monroe to be hot. Now if your goal is someone that's athletic or just not overweight you have a smaller pool.


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## Al_Bundy (Mar 14, 2021)

I agree and totally get what you're saying. That last line though.......that sums it up doesn't it? That really shows how far the bar has dropped. 

All hope isn't lost, more affluent areas tend to have more people at a healthy weight and better attitudes about exercise than the general public. You're probably not going to run into your fit girl (or guy) grocery shopping at Walmart, but you can run into her at Whole Foods just after she gets out of yoga class.


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## lifeistooshort (Mar 17, 2013)

For sure. My county in FL is the fittest in the state....there's not really any super rich people (they're all south in Miami/Ft Lauderdale l) but we don't really have poor neighborhoods. Runners and cyclists are everywhere.

The country county next door is a different story.

Talk about shrinking pools.....as I'm in my late 40's I've found that the few of us that are in tip top shape are in high demand by men 40 and up. So many women think you're invisible after 40.....that's poppycock. As soon as my wedding ring came off the men were everywhere.

I met my bf the 1st day I showed up at a cycling club. He wasn't the only one to show interest, but he got to me first and we hit it off.

Stay in tip top shape and you'll be in high demand no matter your age.


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## hamadryad (Aug 30, 2020)

Perhaps because I live in an area where people are generally pretty conscious of their appearance, health and well; being, I can say that around here, finding women with phenomenal bodies well into even their 50's really isn't uncommon...And guys too...there are all kinds of fit people here.. The gym I currently go to is packed with these women...Go about an hour or so west of here, and you can't find a woman that is less than a size 14/16 and many way bigger and none of them are seemingly concerned about what they look like...I am sure they have some like here, just not nearly as common...

Guys like what they like, not because of porn or media, they are generally born/conditioned to like it...Just like most women are born to prefer a guy that is fit/muscular, well put together and groomed, etc....You will hear women banging on about not liking these types, and while maybe they don't pick them as a marital or relationship partner, its not because they aren't physically attracted to them...

About all I can say at this point in the thread, (as most of it is just veering off topic at this point), is when you are selecting a long term partner, if you have any feeling in this area like the OP has, where you don't think you will be happy unless you find someone that fits your physical type, then you would be wise to submit to those feelings and not try to dismiss it...You won't change and probably will never come to truly accept(and be happy) with anyone else...I cant speak for everyone, but the same girls I drew to at 16 are the same women later in life...They may have changed a little due to age, but at the end of the day they are pretty much the same...And most people that are into being fit at some point in their lives, don't just give it up entirely...They may have lulls or times when other aspects of life get in the way, but most of us don't really change...So the likelihood that the fit and active woman you meet at 26 will be some lazy and slovenly slob at 40 isn't likely....In fact in most cases the couples feed off each others energy in these areas... 😉 💪


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

CatholicDad said:


> First, I think attraction is very important for marriage. If you aren't attracted- don't marry them.
> 
> My concern though is that I think many men have unrealistic ideas of what a woman's body is supposed to look/feel like. I think this comes from our culture and from pornography.
> 
> Our culture pushing these constant images of these super fit, super attractive ladies everywhere- probably is damaging to men. We obviously can't know if OP is damaged or not- but judging by the prevalence of porn use by men in society I think we can generalize and say there are many, many "damaged" men out there.


There are obviously cultural and societal influences on who we tend to gravitate towards in a mate, But I do not think you can blame one man's attraction on culture, society or porn. 

Porn today has just as many overweight, middle age and even women in their 60s and beyond as it does liposuctioned and saline enhanced 19 years olds. It's truly an equal opportunity medium. 

But individuals are attracted to who and what they are attracted to. 

Are there people that may kinda like someone that their buddies or their GFs don't think is all that and so it tends to dissolve some of their enthusiasm for getting with them??? Yeah that does happen but that still comes down to individual preference and choice. When someone has genuine burning desire for someone, they don't care what their friends and families think. 

If you were to gather a group of 100 men and 100 women and show each of them pictures of people of the opposite sex, some may place a bit higher preference on things like height, weight, eye and hair color, skin tone, level of fitness etc etc and there where one person may rank someone a 7.5, another person may rank them a 7 and someone else give them an 8. If that same person had bikini tanlines and and a real good manicure and pedicure and ankle chain, I may even give them an 8.5-9. 

But for the most part, everyone is going to rank people fairly similarly and everyone is going to find certain people more and certain people less attractive than others. 

Put Heidi Klume and Jenifier Anniston side by side, some people will one edges the other out more than the other while other people will say that the other is slightly more attractive. 

But all will agree that they are both beautiful women and all will agree they are more attractive than Roseann Barr. 

Porn doesn't have anything to do with that. Heidi and Jenifer are simply much more attractive people and will appeal to a much much wider range of men than Roseanne. They didn't have to see any porn or any of their daddy's Playboys to come to that consensus.


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## lifeistooshort (Mar 17, 2013)

oldshirt said:


> There are obviously cultural and societal influences on who we tend to gravitate towards in a mate, But I do not think you can blame one man's attraction on culture, society or porn.
> 
> Porn today has just as many overweight, middle age and even women in their 60s and beyond as it does liposuctioned and saline enhanced 19 years olds. It's truly an equal opportunity medium.
> 
> ...


Don't forget about plain, old fashioned chemistry.

When it's there other things may not matter, and if it's not there one you may consciously find quite attractive may not do it for you.

Chemistry is a funny thing.

It's unfortunate OP has left the building....this is quite a productive discussion. I do not think a lot of us have shamed him, but I don't think he wants to break up with her and thus can't have this discussion. 

That's really what he needs to do....end things and look for a woman who does it for him.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

CatholicDad said:


> My concern though is that I think many men have unrealistic ideas of what a woman's body is supposed to look/feel like. I think this comes from our culture and from pornography.
> 
> 
> Our culture pushing these constant images of these super fit, super attractive ladies everywhere- probably is damaging to men. We obviously can't know if OP is damaged or not- but judging by the prevalence of porn use by men in society I think we can generalize and say there are many, many "damaged" men out there.


I want to say one other thing about porn. 

If someone is watching a steady diet of 19 year old hard bodies with liposuction and fake boobs etc in porn, it is because that is what they are into in the first place and are seeking it out. 

Porn is on demand today and someone is not stuck with whatever XXX flick is showing at the nasty porn theater in the redlight district today. 

If someone is perving young, perfect bodies, it's because that is what they dig. If someone digs BBWs, there are tons of them out there (no pun intended). If someone is into MILFs or GILFs, there's countless content of those as well. If someone is into Brazilian circus midgets, there's plenty of those out there too. Amputees, burn victims, anorexics, bald chicks, hairy chicks, black, white, red, yellow, purple, aquamarine, there is every size, race, 18-80+ out there. 

My point here is porn is not feeding us one ideal and making us all see one body type or age range as ideal. Porn is following the demand and providing what is sought by the consumer.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

lifeistooshort said:


> Don't forget about plain, old fashioned chemistry.
> 
> When it's there other things may not matter, and if it's not there one you may consciously find quite attractive may not do it for you.
> 
> ...


Chemistry definately is the X-Factor that really can't be quantified and people themselves may not be able to objectively state why they are being as drawn to someone. 

That may be what's taking place with the OP. She may be perfectly attractive to everyone else, but for whatever reason she just isn't cutting it for him anymore.


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## hamadryad (Aug 30, 2020)

I can't say for sure. but I think he(OP) has "chemistry" with this woman, but its just not enough to overcome the appearance/physical issue.,..

It's kinda sad that it boils down to that....but in many cases, IME, its not really something you can suppress or compartmentalize....Its always there, and nothing really will make it go away....


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