# Married for 4 years but have not consumated it



## JustWantToLove&BeLoved (May 9, 2021)

I've been married to the man I had dated for 2 years. I had always been pretty sure that sex was meant for after marriage, so while dating, we had not had sex but I would say, had a pretty decent attraction & sexual drive for each other and have had intimate moments, just not resulting in actual penetration. Fast forward, got married, and perhaps 2 weeks after the wedding, we had tried to have sex but my husband said his erection wasn't hard enough and so it just ended with a heavy makeup but no actual sex. This happened a few times and I started getting worked up about the fact that this was happening. I had tried to delicately ask what the problem was and his response was that perhaps its the smoking, alcohol & weight issue. So I then, trying to be a good and understanding wife, told him to just take his mind off this issues & focus on getting back to shape & quitting smoking, so that he'll have his health back. What i naively presumed would take a few months, has taken 3 whole years & he seems to not fully be engaged in efforts to fix this problem. It's been a roller coaster ride of him being motivated & then when he's "stressed" , he'd use that as a reason to over eat, smoke, drink & really not do anything about the problem. I felt I had been patient with this whole issue and I was starting to get doubtful. I confronted him if I was the issue. Was he not attracted to me? Or perhaps he's gay? Or just really, something to say hey this is the root cause. He's response was, no, I'm not the issue & that he was straight & that he isn't with any other woman. He then finally said he's going to seek professional medical help. I was so thrilled simply because I feel like he's finally put in effort to come to grips with the reality of things and not just be complacent with the fact that I'll always be there. But recently, I've just been getting increasingly frustrated sexually. I've tried to release some of that sexual tension with masturbating & sex toys. I mean, im technically still a virgin despite being married & I've just not heard of such a thing from anyone really. And now I just feel like I'm just not physically or sexually attracted to him anymore. We're like a couple of friends who live in the same house. So I've lost that attraction towards him. I can still do gestures like hugs & stuff, but not really into anything more. The thought of just hooking up with someone else has been increasingly pestering me. I just want to have some sexual action and then go home & continue life. As for the medical help, my husband has been on some medication & treatment but 1 thing that bugs me is he still hasn't quit smoking, despite doctor's advice and helli, just plain common sense. It makes me feel like he isn't serious about getting better and is just dragging me along. Only reason I have not left is because he's financially stable and we've used these 4 years to build a home and my family loves him like their own. I mean, I love him too, but as a good friend. Other aspects of the marriage is pretty decent. Could work on our communication a little more but we're usually on the same page when it comes to important decisions etc. I'm lost & confused. Im afraid if I leave, I'd get the sex but loose everything else that makes a marriage work. I'm torn. All I want is to love & be loved.


----------



## Sfort (Sep 28, 2019)

How old are you two?

There are many things he can do to find out the cause of his ED. If he's not willing to do it, you have to decide if you're willing to die a virgin.


----------



## JustWantToLove&BeLoved (May 9, 2021)

Sfort said:


> How old are you two?
> 
> There are many things he can do to find out the cause of his ED. If he's not willing to do it, you have to decide if you're willing to die a virgin.


I'm 32 and he's 36 this year. I'm sure it's a case of ED. And there's some pretty costly treatments the doctor has suggested, that we've agreed we'd go forward with. But truly, only he knows if he's a 100% into the whole getting better process , coz I've fell for the " I want to fix this" one too many times.


----------



## Sfort (Sep 28, 2019)

JustWantToLove&BeLoved said:


> I'm 32 and he's 36 this year. I'm sure it's a case of ED. And there's some pretty costly treatments the doctor has suggested, that we've agreed we'd go forward with. But truly, only he knows if he's a 100% into the whole getting better process , coz I've fell for the " I want to fix this" one too many times.


ED at 36 is strange. You definitely need professional guidance. You and he sit at the table, draw out a plan, put dates on each step, and do it. A plan without dates is a dream. A plan with dates is a goal.


----------



## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

You ARE just friends and roommates. 

You have a right to a love and sex life. You have a right to experience passion and intimacy. You have a right to have orgasms. You have a right to seek someone that has a true desire for you. 

He had his chance. There's no excuse for being married 4 years and not having sex with your partner. 

If you are religious you can get an annulment as even the catholic church will not consider this a bona fide marriage. 
Even the Vatican and the Pope himself will say that you are friends and roommates and are hopelessly stuck in the friendzone and grant an annulment and bless your subsequent marriage if you choose to remarry. 

It is silly and rediculous to discuss remaining in this situation. You remained in this situation (I refuse to call this a marriage) far far longer than any decent person should have. 

Find a nice little apt you can afford, pack your bags and load the truck. Then wish him well, give him a hug and wish him the best and then go out into the world and find a special someone that actually desires you.


----------



## Sfort (Sep 28, 2019)

JustWantToLove&BeLoved said:


> I've [fallen] for the " I want to fix this" one too many times.


It seems like you have three choices.

1. Live in celibacy. (no thanks)
2. Have an open marriage. (rarely works as planned)
3. Move on.


----------



## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

Sfort said:


> ED at 36 is strange. You definitely need professional guidance. You and he sit at the table, draw out a plan, put dates on each step, and do it. A plan without dates is a dream. A plan with dates is a goal.


He is 36. That should be peak of health and sexual market value for a man. They have been married 4 years and have NEVER had sex. 

He is a dud. 

The only thing to sit down at the table and draw out a plan for is the division of marital property to cut down on lawyer bills in the divorce. 

Yes, sex therapy and medical treatment and diet and weight loss etc can all help improve one's sexual performance. 

But y'gotta look at the spread here between current level of performance and even a minimum amount of adequacy. 

He is 36 years old and they have NEVER had sex in FOUR YEARS of marriage. Going from that to even slightly pleasurable sex is a whole galaxy in distance. 

She's 32 and assuming she is not 300lbs herself, she could go on Tinder and have a coffee date lined up by this evening. 

She needs a life. She needs to get out and live. 

And maybe if she were to pack her bags and go out into the world and get a life, that may motivate him to get off his duff and eat right and stop smoking and exercise and if a few years down the road he is a healthy, virile man that can get it up and their paths cross again and he is whole new man, maybe she can give him another chance at that point if she wants. 

But he obviously ain't cut'n it now so why should SHE invest any more time and energy into this? He's the one that is the dud and he is the one that needs to put in the work to become a functional man. 

Her clock is ticking and her market value is on the decline so she really doesn't have time to put into trying to get him off the couch and put the cigarettes and Budweisers down when she is able to get a date with a healthy functional man before the 10 o'clock news comes on tonight.


----------



## Marc878 (Aug 26, 2015)

Save yourself and get out now.


----------



## theloveofmylife (Jan 5, 2021)

JustWantToLove&BeLoved said:


> The thought of just hooking up with someone else has been increasingly pestering me. I just want to have some sexual action and then go home & continue life.


Don't do that. You're better than that. It will make you feel guilty - and worse. 

The annulment thing sounds like a good option. You deserve to be loved and desired and to have your reasonable needs met.


----------



## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

I need to ask this...

Might he be a closet GAY?

At 36 there are solutions.

1) ED medications.

2) Testosterone gels and shots. At age 36 he should be very frisky.

3) Some new technologies to open broken down blood vessels are being touted.

4) Penile implants. This is the last-resort fix.

Is he diabetic? 

I agree, get a divorce, find someone else.

At least threaten this if he won't seek help.


Finding a lover on the side is not a good choice.


----------



## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

SunCMars said:


> I agree, get a divorce, find someone else.
> 
> At least threaten this if he won't seek help.


I disagree with threatening divorce. 

The best that will accomplish is a begrudging and resentful half-hearted attempt at appeasement which may last as much as two weeks. 

My suggestion is to not threaten but to actually leave and go back on the singles market in earnest. 

If over time he subsequently transforms himself into a healthy, vigorous and virile male (which would probably take at least a year with hucullean effort, more like a couple years to actually be vigorous and virile) Then if she is still on the market when he has transformed into a different person, she can then decide if she wants to risk giving him another chance or not. 

See results first, then decide.


----------



## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

SunCMars said:


> Finding a lover on the side is not a good choice.


I was not recommending finding a lover on the side nor do I think anyone else will make that recommendation either. 

My recommendation is finding someone else, period.


----------



## Captain Obvious (Mar 14, 2021)

Was your husband a virgin when you married? A 36 year old male who hasn't had sex in at least 4 years, when he has had a partner in all that time ready to throw down with him, is kind of a head scratcher. At this point you may need to move on. I know that's easier said than done, but you said it yourself, you've heard "I want to fix this" too many times, I'm guessing for about going on 4 years now. Just don't cheat.


----------



## Mr.Married (Feb 21, 2018)

You are wasting your time, life, and sexual energy. He is a dud .... it’s that simple. You are NEVER going to fix him. Why waste another two years thinking you can ? Dump him.


----------



## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

Mr.Married said:


> You are wasting your time, life, and sexual energy. He is a dud .... it’s that simple. You are NEVER going to fix him.


I grew up in midwest farm country where everyone raised animals, everything from small animals like rabbits and chickens to large agricultural animals like hogs, horses and cattle. 

Out of every herd there were a number of dud males that did not not perform work, did not breed and did not really do anything but take up space and consume. 

They ended up as meat on the table. 

You are correct, SHE is not going to fix him and there is nothing she can do that will turn him around and make him viable. 

Either he does that himself, or he does not. 

The way I see it, she has put herself out there and told him what she wanted and needed out of the marriage and has given him FOUR YEARS to step up to the plate and he has done nothing. 

all the other 3+ billion men on the planet want to have sex lives. I see no reason for her to put in any more of her time or effort.


----------



## Andy1001 (Jun 29, 2016)

If he wanted to have sex with you he would have found a way by now. He’s either gay or asexual. 
Not consumating a marriage is grounds for annulment.


----------



## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

I'm going to go out on a limb and suggest that he knew he was impotent before you ever got married and that is why he didn't press you for intercourse. My guess is it isn't anything physical such as smoking or weight, and I say that because I grew up in the smoking generation and it didn't make anyone have ED, I can assure you. Overweight, unless he's on some med for some underlying condition, I don't think so either. It's more likely mental or some more specialized problem and he needs to see a specialist for that.

To your other problem. I think he married you knowing this and you have a right to be mad about it and mad about that until recently he's done nothing to try to fix it. 

Once you have lost that attraction -- and who wouldn't after being with a guy who doesn't try to fix his life and can't have sex for four years -- it's not coming back. You can make a living and meet another guy. You're entitled to half of whatever you have together and all of what you brought into the marriage. I will say thank God you didn't have kids. All you have to do is get a divorce and divy things up and be done with this. You can't make him fix himself, and trying to do so has put you into the parental role with him, which makes him more of a son or brother to you -- and that is a sex killer even if he didn't have ED!

Lastly, ED can be a lifetime unfixable thing. If he WANTS to get erect, I have to believe he's already tried the pills for it as they are easily obtainable, and that is the best fix they have unless there are surgical options. 

You have no reason to stay. He's not being responsible and probably never was. He may even have only wanted to marry to make people think he was a functioning normal guy. You never know. You may be nothing more than his beard. 

You have this one life. Don't waste it! Move on.


----------



## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

oldshirt said:


> I was not recommending finding a lover on the side nor do I think anyone else will make that recommendation either.
> 
> My recommendation is finding someone else, period.


She, herself, touched on these thoughts.


----------



## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

JustWantToLove&BeLoved said:


> I'm 32 and he's 36 this year. I'm sure it's a case of ED. And there's some pretty costly treatments the doctor has suggested, that we've agreed we'd go forward with. But truly, only he knows if he's a 100% into the whole getting better process , coz I've fell for the " I want to fix this" one too many times.


Look, he would have fixed this years ago if he was motivated. This is mental. Implants or something like that won't solve the problem. Plus you're already not attracted to him and little wonder, not your fault.


----------



## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

So...

What are you going to do with your life?

If, I may ask.

I am curious, from Georgetown.


----------



## Harold Demure (Oct 21, 2020)

This happened to a relative of a friend where she discovered his inability to perform on their wedding night. Nothing was said by the groom before the wedding and they, like you, waited to have sex after they were married.

She decided to stay as he offered a lot of financial support. However, truth is, some 50 years later, she is a twisted, bitter old trout who regretted settling for money instead of love.


----------



## ccpowerslave (Nov 21, 2020)

Agree that this guy sounds like a dud. You could try to fix him but you’re only 32 with a full life ahead of you.


----------



## JustWantToLove&BeLoved (May 9, 2021)

Sfort said:


> ED at 36 is strange. You definitely need professional guidance. You and he sit at the table, draw out a plan, put dates on each step, and do it. A plan without dates is a dream. A plan with dates is a goal.


Agreed, a 100%! Thank you so much. I'll try to have us both sit down & just put timelines & dates to what we want to achieve. Thank you for helping!


----------



## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

4 years is too long. At this point he is overdue for an ultimatum.


----------



## JustWantToLove&BeLoved (May 9, 2021)

Captain Obvious said:


> Was your husband a virgin when you married? A 36 year old male who hasn't had sex in at least 4 years, when he has had a partner in all that time ready to throw down with him, is kind of a head scratcher. At this point you may need to move on. I know that's easier said than done, but you said it yourself, you've heard "I want to fix this" too many times, I'm guessing for about going on 4 years now. Just don't cheat.


No he wasn't. He's had sexual relationship in the past with ex lovers, which is why I'm just dumbfounded. I mean. I'm decent looking. Still actively put in effort to stay in shape, and dress up & self care. I don't want to cheat but I feel like if I could just go out with 1 man that desires me, I'll probably be somehow reminded of the courage I could muster to work this out.


----------



## Sfort (Sep 28, 2019)

JustWantToLove&BeLoved said:


> I don't want to cheat but I feel like if I could just go out with 1 man that desires me


It would be nice if life were so simple.


----------



## Sfort (Sep 28, 2019)

DownByTheRiver said:


> I'm going to go out on a limb and suggest that he knew he was impotent before you ever got married and that is why he didn't press you for intercourse.


And I would go out on that limb with @DownByTheRiver. If you can establish to your satisfaction that he knew, he married you under false pretenses. You have every right to expect a sexual marriage.


----------



## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

4 years of marriage and no sex?
3 yrs and 364 days wasted that you could be in a real relationship.
You make a strong case against waiting until marriage for sex, and I don’t disagree that waiting is the right thing to do.

nothing will fix this. He doesn’t want sex like a normal person or he’d be kidnapping a doctor if he had to in order to make love to his wife.
Stop wasting your time.


----------



## Sfort (Sep 28, 2019)

Evinrude58 said:


> He doesn’t want sex like a normal person or he’d be kidnapping a doctor if he had to in order to make love to his wife.


Truer words have never been spoken.


----------



## Captain Obvious (Mar 14, 2021)

JustWantToLove&BeLoved said:


> No he wasn't. He's had sexual relationship in the past with ex lovers, which is why I'm just dumbfounded. I mean. I'm decent looking. Still actively put in effort to stay in shape, and dress up & self care. I don't want to cheat but I feel like if I could just go out with 1 man that desires me, I'll probably be somehow reminded of the courage I could muster to work this out.





JustWantToLove&BeLoved said:


> No he wasn't. He's had sexual relationship in the past with ex lovers, which is why I'm just dumbfounded. I mean. I'm decent looking. Still actively put in effort to stay in shape, and dress up & self care. I don't want to cheat but I feel like if I could just go out with 1 man that desires me, I'll probably be somehow reminded of the courage I could muster to work this out.


You've waited long enough, I think it's time you move on and enjoy your life. The reason I said don't cheat is because you seem like a good person, and quite a patient person, I just don't want you to stain yourself when you can end it on the high ground and move on and enjoy yourself.


----------



## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

Think back to when you were making out before you got married. Whether you even had your hands or whatever on it or not if you're smushing with someone you can usually feel it if they are rigid. Now it could be that he's rigid for a minute and just loses it too though.


----------



## frusdil (Sep 5, 2013)

I don't think there's much hope here honestly. He's only 36, and been married for four years and not had sex? Wtf??

For me to even consider trying to save this, he'd have to be at the doctors within 24hrs with a goal for 3 months time. I'd also probably go as far as telling him that I'm done discussing this over and over with him and am not prepared to live like this anymore, and that I will be filing for divorce the next day. Being aware that I can stop the divorce at any time. That may shock him into action.

I just can't get over the arrogance of people like the OP's husband, who put the kabosh on a sex life with their spouse and are so arrogant as to believe there will be no consequences. Wow, just wow.


----------



## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

I know he said he isn't gay, but...


----------



## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

frusdil said:


> I just can't get over the arrogance of people like the OP's husband, who put the kabosh on a sex life with their spouse and are so arrogant as to believe there will be no consequences. Wow, just wow.


He didn’t really put a kabosh on their sex life as they never had a sex life. 

Sex obviously isn’t much of a priority with her either as she said she wanted to wait until marriage when they were dating and he said ‘ok’ and then neither lifted a finger and now it’s been 4 years with nothing and she still hasn’t really done anything about it. 

I don’t think he’s being arrogant. I think he’s being himself and the reason he doesn’t think there will be any consequences is because there haven’t been any.


----------



## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

JustWantToLove&BeLoved said:


> I'm 32 and he's 36 this year. I'm sure it's a case of ED. And there's some pretty costly treatments the doctor has suggested, that we've agreed we'd go forward with. But truly, only he knows if he's a 100% into the whole getting better process , coz I've fell for the " I want to fix this" one too many times.


He's shown by his actions how much he cares to bed you. Over YEARS which slam dunks it.

Unless you actively decide to accept you'll have a platonic marriage you need to leave him.

Something that's a hard choice. But simplify your long term goals and think about your future.


----------



## CatholicDad (Oct 30, 2017)

I could imagine he has a closet porn/masturbation habit since the age of 14. Twenty two years of that is enough to "rewire" a man's brain. If this is the case he could probably get better over time if he gave it up. If so though, what a betrayal of the marriage and your needs. I agree with @oldshirt that this is probably very good grounds for an annulment. So, sorry.


----------



## Ethan_c_walker (Apr 6, 2021)

CatholicDad said:


> I could imagine he has a closet porn/masturbation habit since the age of 14. Twenty two years of that is enough to "rewire" a man's brain. If this is the case he could probably get better over time if he gave it up. If so though, what a betrayal of the marriage and your needs. I agree with @oldshirt that this is probably very good grounds for an annulment. So, sorry.


For it to be a valid Marriage it needs to be consummated which it hasn't so I think there are grounds for annulment. Also I agree he must have a porn/masturbation addiction which would explain why he has Ed.


----------



## Mr.Married (Feb 21, 2018)

oldshirt said:


> I grew up in midwest farm country where everyone raised animals, everything from small animals like rabbits and chickens to large agricultural animals like hogs, horses and cattle.
> 
> Out of every herd there were a number of dud males that did not not perform work, did not breed and did not really do anything but take up space and consume.
> 
> ...


I loved the farm analogy. That really planted a solid concept in my mind that I struggle to grasp. I so often wonder how men can act like that. It baffles my mind. My wife would probably at first get concerned but then would get really angry. Being the type of guy that I am I do have difficulty understanding a lot of things men do on this forum and people in general for that matter. For whatever reason your analogy flipped a switch for me. Thank you 👍


----------



## Mr.Married (Feb 21, 2018)

Ethan_c_walker said:


> For it to be a valid Marriage it needs to be consummated which it hasn't so I think there are grounds for annulment. Also I agree he must have a porn/masturbation addiction which would explain why he has Ed.


I’ve never understood this. I like amateur porn as in real people at home. I started checking out porn at about 11 or 12 when we found my buddies dad’s stuff. So that makes 35 years I’ve been checking it out. I can say that it never made me want to have sex less, gave me ED, made my expectations of women and sexuality different, caused me to disrespect women, caused me to fantasize about “porn star bodies “, made me want a 12” schlong, created unreal sexual expectations of my wife, or made me lose sexual interest in my wife in any shape or form what so ever. It however has made me hot to get with my wife plenty times.

I don’t understand the “rewire your brain” comment that I see pop up now and then.

Edit: Any scientific evidence for this? If yes then I would like to read it if you have a link.


----------



## VladDracul (Jun 17, 2016)

JustWantToLove&BeLoved said:


> No he wasn't. He's had sexual relationship in the past with ex lovers, which is why I'm just dumbfounded. I mean. I'm decent looking. Still actively put in effort to stay in shape, and dress up & self care. I don't want to cheat but I feel like if I could just go out with 1 man that desires me, I'll probably be somehow reminded of the courage I could muster to work this out.


In your situation, I'd recommend you get a FWB, at least temporarily. With a little thought and planning, you could do it without him ever being the wiser. I doubt if he's tuned into you enough to notice the little nuances in your behavior. Your problem is going to be, as revealed by your screen name, you'd likely fall in love with the lucky guy. Most folks are not in favor of you taking this action. I feel its similar to a supplier that can't deliver the goods needed and promised. You find another supplier.


----------



## JustWantToLove&BeLoved (May 9, 2021)

He has started his treatment for ED and seems to be pretty positive about it. It gives me hope but I'm afraid to be too hopeful. I'm just going to allow myself some time to work up to a solution to this , for me. I owe myself at least that much.


----------



## Sfort (Sep 28, 2019)

JustWantToLove&BeLoved said:


> He has started his treatment for ED and seems to be pretty positive about it. It gives me hope but I'm afraid to be too hopeful. I'm just going to allow myself some time to work up to a solution to this , for me. I owe myself at least that much.


If you consummate the marriage, is annulment off the table?


----------



## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

Mr.Married said:


> I’ve never understood this. I like amateur porn as in real people at home. I started checking out porn at about 11 or 12 when we found my buddies dad’s stuff. So that makes 35 years I’ve been checking it out. I can say that it never made me want to have sex less, gave me ED, made my expectations of women and sexuality different, caused me to disrespect women, caused me to fantasize about “porn star bodies “, made me want a 12” schlong, created unreal sexual expectations of my wife, or made me lose sexual interest in my wife in any shape or form what so ever. It however has made me hot to get with my wife plenty times.
> 
> I don’t understand the “rewire your brain” comment that I see pop up now and then.
> 
> Edit: Any scientific evidence for this? If yes then I would like to read it if you have a link.


same here


----------



## JustWantToLove&BeLoved (May 9, 2021)

VladDracul said:


> In your situation, I'd recommend you get a FWB, at least temporarily. With a little thought and planning, you could do it without him ever being the wiser. I doubt if he's tuned into you enough to notice the little nuances in your behavior. Your problem is going to be, as revealed by your screen name, you'd likely fall in love with the lucky guy. Most folks are not in favor of you taking this action. I feel its similar to a supplier that can't deliver the goods needed and promised. You find another supplier.


Gosh once someone else says it, it makes sooo much sense. When I said it, it sounded like a cheap lying cheater. Thank you! It really took off the guilt and really just the anxiety around this. I mean i developed anxiety because of this problem hogging me for years and I have to be on meds to be able to fall asleep and sometimes function during panic attacks. I just feel like I've done everything a good wife would do. Even now, I'm not considering leaving him because yes he's financially stable, but I have a pretty decent job too myself. Its just that I don't want him all alone as he's estranged with his family. Me & my family is all he has. Sighhh. Why do I do so much overthinking 🙃


----------



## Mr.Married (Feb 21, 2018)

JustWantToLove&BeLoved said:


> He has started his treatment for ED and seems to be pretty positive about it. It gives me hope but I'm afraid to be too hopeful. I'm just going to allow myself some time to work up to a solution to this , for me. I owe myself at least that much.


You owe to yourself whatever makes you feel best about your choice. I wish you the best of luck but if I were the weather man the future looks overcast and grey ☹


----------



## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

There is no treason for a woman to settle for friends with benefits. Just divorce and move on. Why would you hurt the guy like that? And yes, he will eventually find out.
Just divorce. Yes, you’re overthinking this.


----------



## Ursula (Dec 2, 2016)

JustWantToLove&BeLoved said:


> I've been married to the man I had dated for 2 years. I had always been pretty sure that sex was meant for after marriage, so while dating, we had not had sex but I would say, had a pretty decent attraction & sexual drive for each other and have had intimate moments, just not resulting in actual penetration. Fast forward, got married, and perhaps 2 weeks after the wedding, we had tried to have sex but my husband said his erection wasn't hard enough and so it just ended with a heavy makeup but no actual sex. This happened a few times and I started getting worked up about the fact that this was happening. I had tried to delicately ask what the problem was and his response was that perhaps its the smoking, alcohol & weight issue. So I then, trying to be a good and understanding wife, told him to just take his mind off this issues & focus on getting back to shape & quitting smoking, so that he'll have his health back. *What i naively presumed would take a few months, has taken 3 whole years & he seems to not fully be engaged in efforts to fix this problem.* It's been a roller coaster ride of him being motivated & then when he's "stressed" , he'd use that as a reason to over eat, smoke, drink & really not do anything about the problem. I felt I had been patient with this whole issue and I was starting to get doubtful. I confronted him if I was the issue. Was he not attracted to me? Or perhaps he's gay? Or just really, something to say hey this is the root cause. He's response was, no, I'm not the issue & that he was straight & that he isn't with any other woman. He then finally said he's going to seek professional medical help. I was so thrilled simply because I feel like he's finally put in effort to come to grips with the reality of things and not just be complacent with the fact that I'll always be there. But recently, I've just been getting increasingly frustrated sexually. I've tried to release some of that sexual tension with masturbating & sex toys. I mean, im technically still a virgin despite being married & I've just not heard of such a thing from anyone really. And now I just feel like I'm just not physically or sexually attracted to him anymore. We're like a couple of friends who live in the same house. So I've lost that attraction towards him. I can still do gestures like hugs & stuff, but not really into anything more. The thought of just hooking up with someone else has been increasingly pestering me. I just want to have some sexual action and then go home & continue life. As for the medical help, my husband has been on some medication & treatment but 1 thing that bugs me is he still hasn't quit smoking, despite doctor's advice and helli, just plain common sense. It makes me feel like he isn't serious about getting better and is just dragging me along. Only reason I have not left is because he's financially stable and we've used these 4 years to build a home and my family loves him like their own. I mean, I love him too, but as a good friend. Other aspects of the marriage is pretty decent. Could work on our communication a little more but we're usually on the same page when it comes to important decisions etc. I'm lost & confused. Im afraid if I leave, I'd get the sex but loose everything else that makes a marriage work. I'm torn. All I want is to love & be loved.


Wow, there's a lot in your post here.

First off, don't cheat just to get some action; that will be the biggest mistake of your life. Secondly, I encountered something similar within the first couple months of my own former marriage. My now XH was a 41 year old virgin when I met him, we had sex before marriage, but after marriage, intimacy was something that I found he could turn off like a light switch. He got mad at me for initiating, and for asking him for some intimate time, and he put a stop to sex for a few weeks. After a few weeks, I sat him down and said that I didn't sign up for this, and that I expected him to go get some psychological help for this issue. If he wasn't willing, I asked him how he'd feel about an open marriage (he wasn't into that). So, he got help and things improved, for a little while anyways. It was always a pretty major issue for us though, and it was something that kept coming back again and again. So, I'll warn you that if you DO fix the issue this time around, it may come back again.

Secondly, I'm guessing that you're both fairly young. Young men are usually pretty gung-ho in the bedroom, and for your H to be the polar opposite signals to me that he: may be a closeted gay man, he has some major ED issues that he's too proud to actually get help for, or he's just not that into you. 

To be in a marriage where the only major action you get comes from sex toys, isn't healthy. That was me too. I burned out 3 vibrators in almost 4 years of marriage. That's not a marriage. If it were me, I would sit him down and say "enough is enough". He either wants to put the work in to be in a real marriage or he doesn't; it's his choice. I would give him X-number or weeks to decide, and his action or lack thereof would be your answer. If it was lack of action, I would be gone. I'm not entirely sure, but since you guys haven't consumated your marriage, I think you can get it annulled instead of going through a divorce process. You guys are just roommates, afterall.


----------



## Ursula (Dec 2, 2016)

OK, after reading a few replies now, I redact my previous post. OP, do you want to have children someday? Stop wasting your time with his little boy, get this thing annulled, and find yourself a man who is capable of intimacy. You deserve that, and have put way too many years into this "marriage" of yours.


----------



## JustWantToLove&BeLoved (May 9, 2021)

Ursula said:


> OK, after reading a few replies now, I redact my previous post. OP, do you want to have children someday? Stop wasting your time with his little boy, get this thing annulled, and find yourself a man who is capable of intimacy. You deserve that, and have put way too many years into this "marriage" of yours.


I'm okay to not have children actually. It's more of an expression of love for me, this sex issue. Makes me feel inadequate. I feel like I was so ready to make adjustments just to make this work, to the point of accepting the fact that I may not have kids. But not having made love to your spouse, EVER, is just something I cannot wrap my head around.


----------



## Ursula (Dec 2, 2016)

JustWantToLove&BeLoved said:


> Gosh once someone else says it, it makes sooo much sense. When I said it, it sounded like a cheap lying cheater. Thank you! It really took off the guilt and really just the anxiety around this. I mean i developed anxiety because of this problem hogging me for years and I have to be on meds to be able to fall asleep and sometimes function during panic attacks. I just feel like I've done everything a good wife would do. Even now, I'm not considering leaving him because yes he's financially stable, but I have a pretty decent job too myself. Its just that I don't want him all alone as he's estranged with his family. Me & my family is all he has. Sighhh. Why do I do so much overthinking 🙃


That's fantastic that he's started ED meds, but why hasn't that happened sooner, like 4 years ago? You HAVE done everything that a good wife can do, in fact, you've gone above and beyond for this boy! My XH did well financially too, and I was fine when he left. Sure, it was a challenge going from 2 incomes to 1, but it's doable. Do you work? If your roommate ends up all alone, that isn't your problem, or anything that you can fix. That would be his choice. You also can't fix the fact that he's estranged from his family, and that you and your family are all that he has. That would be a big, toxic guilt trip that you just put yourself on. If you aren't happy in the "marriage", you aren't happy. Once that attraction for someone is gone, it very rarely comes back. I wish you luck, but if I were you, I'd have been gone long ago.


----------



## Ursula (Dec 2, 2016)

JustWantToLove&BeLoved said:


> I'm okay to not have children actually. It's more of an expression of love for me, this sex issue. Makes me feel inadequate. I feel like I was so ready to make adjustments just to make this work, to the point of accepting the fact that I may not have kids. But not having made love to your spouse, EVER, is just something I cannot wrap my head around.


OK, as long as you're good with never having children, then that's a choice that you make. For me, I got married at 35 (XH was 43); divorced at 39, and have cried a LOT of tears about knowing that babies are never in my future. I'm 43 now, and still get sad about it sometimes. Making love to the one that you love is definitely an expression of love, and it's one that has been denied to you for years. Good that he's finally taking a step to fixing things, but I would go into it with my eyes wide open and see how long this effort lasts. I would also suggest to keep a check on your attraction levels towards him; those don't tend to come back once gone, and if you're not attracted to him, it's going to be very hard for you to put out for him. This is what happened with me as well; I'd built up loads of resentment for my H at the time, and that built up over 4 years until I was repulsed. I could have vomited when he wanted sex. Went into the happy place inside my head until it was over. You need to figure out if that's the possible future that you want, and go from there.


----------



## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

JustWantToLove&BeLoved said:


> No he wasn't. He's had sexual relationship in the past with ex lovers, which is why I'm just dumbfounded. I mean. I'm decent looking. Still actively put in effort to stay in shape, and dress up & self care. I don't want to cheat but I feel like if I could just go out with 1 man that desires me, I'll probably be somehow reminded of the courage I could muster to work this out.


Make that one man a good one.
Not just a user.

To me, this is what you want.
You want to know if sexual relations are all they are, um, cracked up to be.

If they are, this will inspire you to find a more normal partner.

Most here believe that good sexual relations are necessary for a good marriage.

You will too, if you find the right man.

That said, be very discreet if you go down that path 

We believe you should divorce first then find a man.

You could officially separate, telling your husband that you consider yourself single. 

This is not as good (morally) as a divorce, but it allows you to get past the secrecy factor in dating other men.


----------



## Mr.Married (Feb 21, 2018)

I’m a “you need a divorce before playing around “ type of guy but I have to say that your case is really screwed up. He is just doing this to save his bacon right now.... no chance in hell that it last. While it isn’t my style I would almost recommend you ask him if you can outsource your needs. 4 years is insane.... I might start thinking their is something wrong with you as well for letting something like this happen. Besides.... if your already losing attraction for him then it’s toast. Your going to be having mechanical sex instead of the “I’m so hot for you” sex. You want the guy who can’t stop staring at your butt/boobs. That’s the guy that wants you !


----------



## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

JustWantToLove&BeLoved said:


> Gosh once someone else says it, it makes sooo much sense. When I said it, it sounded like a cheap lying cheater. Thank you! It really took off the guilt and really just the anxiety around this. I mean i developed anxiety because of this problem hogging me for years and I have to be on meds to be able to fall asleep and sometimes function during panic attacks. I just feel like I've done everything a good wife would do. Even now, I'm not considering leaving him because yes he's financially stable, but I have a pretty decent job too myself. Its just that I don't want him all alone as he's estranged with his family. Me & my family is all he has. Sighhh. Why do I do so much overthinking 🙃


It may all sound like the perfect plan but once you gets with a guy that sincerely desires you and pleasures you, you will fall for him and send your H packing anyway and then the chances are good that your FWB was hooking up with you just for sex. 

Dudes that get with married women are in it just for sex and choose married women so they don’t have to do that other relationship stuff. 

You’re better off in the long run just moving on and finding someone else legitimately. 

Either scenario ends with you H getting dumped anyway.


----------



## Mr.Married (Feb 21, 2018)

While I here jumping up and down on the soap box I’ll add a little more:

Why should ED be the end of a sex life? I can think of a lot of intimacy that doesn’t involve penetration. Washing each other in the shower, bathing together, rubbing each other down with warm oil, oral sex, sex toys, manual stimulation, watching romantic/hot tv show, foot rubs. Hell....buy a strap on and put it to your wife real good. There are countless answers ......


----------



## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

Mr.Married said:


> While I here jumping up and down on the soap box I’ll add a little more:
> 
> Why should ED be the end of a sex life? I can think of a lot of intimacy that doesn’t involve penetration. Washing each other in the shower, bathing together, rubbing each other down with warm oil, oral sex, sex toys, manual stimulation, watching romantic/hot tv show, foot rubs. Hell....buy a strap on and put it to your wife real good. There are countless answers ......


I agree with the above and if I were to limp out, that is what I would do (except the strap on)

However, he hasn’t lifted a finger or done anything to deal with this for FOUR YEARS.

Let’s not forget that he hasn’t had sex with her ever from day-one.

Someone who agreed to no sex before marriage and then hasn’t done anything in 4 years since the wedding is really going to put on a strap on???

The dude hasn’t even given her a finger. 

This is a dead end. 

Time to turn around and find another road.


----------



## JustWantToLove&BeLoved (May 9, 2021)

Mr.Married said:


> While I here jumping up and down on the soap box I’ll add a little more:
> 
> Why should ED be the end of a sex life? I can think of a lot of intimacy that doesn’t involve penetration. Washing each other in the shower, bathing together, rubbing each other down with warm oil, oral sex, sex toys, manual stimulation, watching romantic/hot tv show, foot rubs. Hell....buy a strap on and put it to your wife real good. There are countless answers ......


Absolutely!!!!!! But he doesn't even want to like initiate any of this. We were at least doing that before the wedding. Kisses me ,lasts like 3 seconds. Or pets my head like I'm a child. Hugs me but doesn't let his hands roam. I mean. Gosh. Even I find myself attractive at times. Like hot! And I try my best to hint/ initiate. I'd wear skimpy clothes at home, walk around nude, I wear those boots popping leggings. I make sure I have perfume on, even at home. List goes on.


----------



## Elizabeth001 (May 18, 2015)

JustWantToLove&BeLoved said:


> Absolutely!!!!!! But he doesn't even want to like initiate any of this. We were at least doing that before the wedding. Kisses me ,lasts like 3 seconds. Or pets my head like I'm a child. Hugs me but doesn't let his hands roam. I mean. Gosh. Even I find myself attractive at times. Like hot! And I try my best to hint/ initiate. I'd wear skimpy clothes at home, walk around nude, I wear those boots popping leggings. I make sure I have perfume on, even at home. List goes on.


Gay!
(possibly asexual)


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


----------



## Mr.Married (Feb 21, 2018)

JustWantToLove&BeLoved said:


> Absolutely!!!!!! But he doesn't even want to like initiate any of this. We were at least doing that before the wedding. Kisses me ,lasts like 3 seconds. Or pets my head like I'm a child. Hugs me but doesn't let his hands roam. I mean. Gosh. Even I find myself attractive at times. Like hot! And I try my best to hint/ initiate. I'd wear skimpy clothes at home, walk around nude, I wear those boots popping leggings. I make sure I have perfume on, even at home. List goes on.


Your in a real tough spot. Of all the stories I read about this type of thing I’ll give you an analogy of the best possible outcome except it is usually in reference to men.

Having sex with my wife is as fun as screwing a dead animal. 

After years of “the talk” and therapy and countless trips to the sex counselors it becomes at best:

Having sex with my wife is like screwing an animal that died with half a smile on its face.


The point is: Your not going to get what your looking for.... EVER !!


----------



## MJJEAN (Jun 26, 2015)

You were happy without sex for more than a decade after even the late bloomers become sexually active. You've stayed in a sexless marriage for 4 years. Maybe sex really doesn't matter to you as much as you think it does. Your words say sexlessness is a serious issue for you, but your actions say otherwise.


----------



## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

Mr.Married said:


> Your in a real tough spot. Of all the stories I read about this type of thing I’ll give you an analogy of the best possible outcome except it is usually in reference to men.
> 
> Having sex with my wife is as fun as screwing a dead animal.
> 
> ...


.....or screwing a living animal that is on life support and in a persistent vegetative state.

You present a pretty good analogy IMHO as this describes the spread that I talked about earlier in the thread.

Yes with medical treatment, marital counseling, sex therapy etc improvements CAN be made.

But the question is how much improvement will actually be made and will it be good enough. 

One can argue that going from no sex to having sex with someone in a coma on life support is an improvement. 

But is it acceptable????


----------



## woodyh (Oct 23, 2015)

Seems he just has no interest in sex. I would ask him did he masturbate before marriage? If no, then he has a very low sex drive. I would at least get his hormones checked.
Does he ever masturbate now?


----------



## JustWantToLove&BeLoved (May 9, 2021)

woodyh said:


> Seems he just has no interest in sex. I would ask him did he masturbate before marriage? If no, then he has a very low sex drive. I would at least get his hormones checked.
> Does he ever masturbate now?


Yes he did masturbate before marriage. I've aided a couple of sessions myself. His testosterone level are pretty low and so they're looking at giving him testosterone jabs to bring the number up. As for now, I feel like he gets mini morning erections & that's about it. Dont see him wanking or watching porn.


----------



## badsanta (Oct 13, 2014)

JustWantToLove&BeLoved said:


> Yes he did masturbate before marriage. I've aided a couple of sessions myself. His testosterone level are pretty low and so they're looking at giving him testosterone jabs to bring the number up. As for now, I feel like he gets mini morning erections & that's about it. Dont see him wanking or watching porn.


I have read a great deal of books about sexuality, and while erotic media such as porn is problematic it can also be useful. The most important part of human sexuality is the mind and it needs to be stimulated and developed in order to create desire driven by curiosity. An example might be the curiosity to explore a certain sensation like alternating between hot and cold during oral sex by drinking hot and cold beverages. Another might be to add an altoid mint to provide a little extra sensitivity during oral sex. Those are simple examples and while they only relate to oral sex are ideas that help spark the imagination and elicit some sexual curiosity. So you don't want to do those things as a way to create desire, you mostly want to talk about it and ask him to imagine what those things might feel like. Once he seems interested try to expand on the conversation as much as possible before trying. 

Now porn tends to be overstimulating, but once again it is a topic that you can talk about and see if there is something that would create some curiosity. 

Another technique would be allowing him to watch you pleasure yourself. If that is something you haven't done, you should seriously start sharing a few of those moments with him. 1) it will create some curiosity for him to penetrate you while you pleasure yourself and 2) it will help to eliminate any performance anxiety if he worries that trying penetration may not be pleasing for you so he can focus on his own arousal to help maintain it. 

Regards,
Badsanta


----------



## JustWantToLove&BeLoved (May 9, 2021)

badsanta said:


> I have read a great deal of books about sexuality, and while erotic media such as porn is problematic it can also be useful. The most important part of human sexuality is the mind and it needs to be stimulated and developed in order to create desire driven by curiosity. An example might be the curiosity to explore a certain sensation like alternating between hot and cold during oral sex by drinking hot and cold beverages. Another might be to add an altoid mint to provide a little extra sensitivity during oral sex. Those are simple examples and while they only relate to oral sex are ideas that help spark the imagination and elicit some sexual curiosity. So you don't want to do those things as a way to create desire, you mostly want to talk about it and ask him to imagine what those things might feel like. Once he seems interested try to expand on the conversation as much as possible before trying.
> 
> Now porn tends to be overstimulating, but once again it is a topic that you can talk about and see if there is something that would create some curiosity.
> 
> ...


Thank you so very much. These seem like a good way to perhaps try and kick start things. Definitely useful insight, indeed.


----------



## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

JustWantToLove&BeLoved said:


> Thank you so very much. These seem like a good way to perhaps try and kick start things. Definitely useful insight, indeed.


I don’t mean to sound like a Doubting Thomas here, but those parlor tricks might be fun for a couple that already have an active and engaged sex life and already have mutual attraction and desire for each other along with healthy libidos. 

Is a man that has not ever made love to his wife going to transform into a lover when you hand him mints and tell him they are for oral sex?? 

If he doesn’t have the interest to have touched you in over 4 years, are you going to be comfortable touching yourself infront of him?

What will you do when he glances at you touching your lady bits for a second or two and then goes back to watching his tv show or finger banging his phone? 

Tricks like mentioned the above help inject some novelty and variation into healthy sex lives. They are not therapy for dysfunction ones.


----------



## badsanta (Oct 13, 2014)

oldshirt said:


> Tricks like mentioned the above help inject some novelty and variation into healthy sex lives. They are not therapy for dysfunction ones.


I completely agree about the tricks I used as examples, but my point I was trying to highlight was that sex takes place in the mind. Instead f doing the tricks, she just needs to try engaging in conversation about them to stimulate his mind. Much less about doing the tricks and much more about just talking to them to plant a seed of curiosity. If anything she might have more luck only talking and doing none. 

I'll use a model situation where a husband had almost zero interest in his wife. The wife discovered that when the husband did use porn that he gravitated towards girl-on-girl porn. While he would become suddenly aroused by the idea of his wife sleeping with another woman, at the same time the reality of this made him furious and he shut down any possibility of it happening and also lost his desire in the process. The wife after discovering this about her husband would pretend as if she had been watching her husband's favorite porn and describe to him in detail about what she watched (in reality she watched nothing and was just making it up). This got her husband so aroused that he would climax too easily and way too fast. At the end she was still frustrated that the experience left her with not much to work with in that he was done. However my point being is that everything took place in the mind. The wife did not have to perform any tricks or invite another woman over. All she had to do was to talk about it in a way that got her husband's attention in an arousing way. 

So less doing and more talking. However the main challenge the OP faces is unlocking whatever it is that will get her husband's attention and get the sexual part of his brain activated. That in and of itself is indeed a huge challenge and she likely has little or no clues as to what might do it. 

Perhaps the OP could have her husband talk about some past experiences and share what he liked. That might be helpful if she is not offended that those things happened with someone else and just use them as a learning opportunity. She might discover that these other women had other women or other boyfriends at the same time that created a much different dynamic. 

Badsanta


----------



## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

badsanta said:


> I completely agree about the tricks I used as examples, but my point I was trying to highlight was that sex takes place in the mind. Instead f doing the tricks, she just needs to try engaging in conversation about them to stimulate his mind. Much less about doing the tricks and much more about just talking to them to plant a seed of curiosity. If anything she might have more luck only talking and doing none.
> 
> I'll use a model situation where a husband had almost zero interest in his wife. The wife discovered that when the husband did use porn that he gravitated towards girl-on-girl porn. While he would become suddenly aroused by the idea of his wife sleeping with another woman, at the same time the reality of this made him furious and he shut down any possibility of it happening and also lost his desire in the process. The wife after discovering this about her husband would pretend as if she had been watching her husband's favorite porn and describe to him in detail about what she watched (in reality she watched nothing and was just making it up). This got her husband so aroused that he would climax too easily and way too fast. At the end she was still frustrated that the experience left her with not much to work with in that he was done. However my point being is that everything took place in the mind. The wife did not have to perform any tricks or invite another woman over. All she had to do was to talk about it in a way that got her husband's attention in an arousing way.
> 
> ...


People can feel refreshed and invigorated after a little walk through the park with some fresh air and sunshine.

But people with cancer need an oncologist and state of the art medical treatment.

I get what you are saying but a man that has never made love to his wife in over 4 1/2 years needs professional assessment and appropriate therapies. Not figuring out what porn he likes or mints for oral sex.


----------



## maquiscat (Aug 20, 2019)

JustWantToLove&BeLoved said:


> Gosh once someone else says it, it makes sooo much sense. When I said it, it sounded like a cheap lying cheater. Thank you! It really took off the guilt and really just the anxiety around this. I mean i developed anxiety because of this problem hogging me for years and I have to be on meds to be able to fall asleep and sometimes function during panic attacks. I just feel like I've done everything a good wife would do. Even now, I'm not considering leaving him because yes he's financially stable, but I have a pretty decent job too myself. Its just that I don't want him all alone as he's estranged with his family. Me & my family is all he has. Sighhh. Why do I do so much overthinking 🙃


Scanning through and saw this. I am poly and open and I am telling you this is the wrong move. This is *not *Ethical Non-Monogamy. If you are doing anything on the side without his knowledge or consent then you are a cheater. Given your situation, even telling him that his lack of active working on solving his problems will be considered implied consent, is more ethical than secret on the side affairs.

As to whether or not you stay with him, keep in mind that you are ultimately responsible for only you, and he for him. Never stay with someone just for their sake. That is abusive to yourself. A relationship needs to be a mutual thing, whether it is sexual or not.


----------



## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

maquiscat said:


> Scanning through and saw this. I am poly and open and I am telling you this is the wrong move. This is *not *Ethical Non-Monogamy. If you are doing anything on the side without his knowledge or consent then you are a cheater. Given your situation, even telling him that his lack of active working on solving his problems will be considered implied consent, is more ethical than secret on the side affairs.


I agree with your perspective on what ethical non monogamy is. 

However that perspective assumes that ethical monogamy is taken place in the relationship to begin with and that the reason for the non monogamy to be ethical is to preserve the sexuality and preserve the functioning of the primary relationship. 

However in this situation I would argue that ethical monogamy is not taking place to begin with. 

He has denied her from day one and is not making a sincere effort to address that. 

FOUR AND A HALF YEARS. 

They’ve never had sex and there’s no reason to believe there will ever be a sexual union in the future there is no sexual relationship present in the first place. 

IMHO it doesn’t matter what she does; she could bring home some guy from the bar one night and tell her H to move over in bed to give them some room, I don’t care. 

Now she’s not the kind of person to do anything like that of course, but my point is no sexual relationship exist here in the first place and he has made no effort to accommodate her sexually so what she does with her sexuality is her business and he had no valid claim or vested interest. 

If he is trying to restrict and deny her sexuality while making no attempt to meet her needs - that just makes him an A-hole. 

I would normally agree with you that ethical non monogamy requires informed consent of all parties prior. 

But I would challenge that in this particular instance, it simply doesn’t matter either way. His voice doesn’t count IMHO. 

I mean what’s he gonna do if he finds out - not have sex with her??? He’s already done that from day one?

Is she going to put him at risk of STIs? No, he’s not having sex with her. 

Will she leave him for the OM? 

Yeah, why wouldn’t she? She’s a healthy 32 year old who’s clock is ticking. From an evolutionary standpoint, she should have left him 4 years and 5 months ago. 

Your point is valid and to completely be on the up and up, she should be transparent and obtain consent in all her actions. 

But I would argue that his breach of his end of the bargain is so great that he effectively waives all claims to her sexuality and that what she does with her life and her sexuality is none of his business.


----------



## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

The TLDR version is there has never been a sexual relationship in place since day-one and he has not put in the effort to create one. Even the Vatican would not see this as a legitimate marriage. 

So what she does with her sexuality is none of his business. He has no legitimate claim to her sexuality.


----------



## maquiscat (Aug 20, 2019)

oldshirt said:


> I agree with your perspective on what ethical non monogamy is.
> 
> However that perspective assumes that ethical monogamy is taken place in the relationship to begin with and that the reason for the non monogamy to be ethical is to preserve the sexuality and preserve the functioning of the primary relationship.
> 
> However in this situation I would argue that ethical monogamy is not taking place to begin with.


My point on whether her actions fall under Ethical Non-Monogamy or not are not dependent upon whether or not his actions construe ethical monogamy. I am not in any way trying to support him and his lack of providing for her needs. I look at it as a case of two wrongs do not make a right. In this case, really the best thing is to leave him and start again. However, if she does not wish to, as indicated by her posts, then the ethical thing to do is inform him of her intended actions. Note that I did not say ask him. Normally I am one who shuns the idea of the ultimatum. However, I would find it ethical for her to simply go to him and inform him that since he has failed to provide for her sexual needs, she is obtaining them outside the marriage. If he wishes to leave the marriage that will be on him. It would also give her more leverage should he decide to end things, as she will show that she both was doing without from him and did not hold secret affairs.



> But I would argue that his breach of his end of the bargain is so great that he effectively waives all claims to her sexuality and that what she does with her life and her sexuality is none of his business.


Sadly, by the law that is not necessarily so, at least to an extent, and depending upon the divorce laws of the state. Having an affair, known or unknown, can possibly be detrimental to her in a divorce proceeding. My point about being open about it giving her leverage still hold, I just don't claim that it would be a deciding factor. But it could be. Adultery, as defined by the law, might not be an offense that brings a fine or jail time, but it is still a legal basis for a divorce and often weighs against the person holding the affair. It makes her sexual activities the business of her legal husband, and vice versa. Our noting that he has breeched the social contract means nothing legally, as he has not breeched the legal contract. I have made the argument often that since legal marriage does not require sex, love or children, that it should be available even to those related by blood to each other (purely on the basis of pointing out the logical basis of how legal marriage works and not as an advocate for incest marriage on a legal level). Here in this case, that point moves in the opposite direction, meaning that a lack of sex is not a breech of the legal status.


----------



## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

maquiscat said:


> My point on whether her actions fall under Ethical Non-Monogamy or not are not dependent upon whether or not his actions construe ethical monogamy. I am not in any way trying to support him and his lack of providing for her needs. I look at it as a case of two wrongs do not make a right. In this case, really the best thing is to leave him and start again. However, if she does not wish to, as indicated by her posts, then the ethical thing to do is inform him of her intended actions. Note that I did not say ask him. Normally I am one who shuns the idea of the ultimatum. However, I would find it ethical for her to simply go to him and inform him that since he has failed to provide for her sexual needs, she is obtaining them outside the marriage. If he wishes to leave the marriage that will be on him. It would also give her more leverage should he decide to end things, as she will show that she both was doing without from him and did not hold secret affairs.
> 
> 
> 
> Sadly, by the law that is not necessarily so, at least to an extent, and depending upon the divorce laws of the state. Having an affair, known or unknown, can possibly be detrimental to her in a divorce proceeding. My point about being open about it giving her leverage still hold, I just don't claim that it would be a deciding factor. But it could be. Adultery, as defined by the law, might not be an offense that brings a fine or jail time, but it is still a legal basis for a divorce and often weighs against the person holding the affair. It makes her sexual activities the business of her legal husband, and vice versa. Our noting that he has breeched the social contract means nothing legally, as he has not breeched the legal contract. I have made the argument often that since legal marriage does not require sex, love or children, that it should be available even to those related by blood to each other (purely on the basis of pointing out the logical basis of how legal marriage works and not as an advocate for incest marriage on a legal level). Here in this case, that point moves in the opposite direction, meaning that a lack of sex is not a breech of the legal status.


I don't necessarily disagree with any of that. 

The point you make about the legal implications in divorce regarding adultery is valid. I am in a no-fault state where you could screw half the town and it wouldn't matter so I tend to think in those terms where as there are a few states where adultery can be used to try to scrape up a few more dollars, but even in those states, the actual nuts and bolts outcome when adultery is claimed, it really doesn't amount to anything tangible. 

But again I am assuming this is in the United States. If she is in a country where an adulteress can be doused with gas and set on fire in the town square, I would need to edit my response. 

Is it the moral and ethical higher ground to be transparent and upfront about her intentions? Yeah sure. No real argument there I guess. 

But if it is a no-fault state, I'm not sure what real world advantage it would actually hold at the end of the day. My ultimate recomendation is give him a sisterly hug, wish him, throw your bag over your shoulder and walk away and don't look back. 

But other than that, I think his lack of love and intimacy is so flagrant that I don't really care what you do. I don't think any of it even really matters in the end. Follow your own moral compass and do what you think is best.


----------



## Talker67 (Apr 7, 2016)

JustWantToLove&BeLoved said:


> No he wasn't. He's had sexual relationship in the past with ex lovers, which is why I'm just dumbfounded. I mean. I'm decent looking. Still actively put in effort to stay in shape, and dress up & self care. I don't want to cheat but I feel like if I could just go out with 1 man that desires me, I'll probably be somehow reminded of the courage I could muster to work this out.


time to figure out WHY he can not perform.
i would have a straight talk with him about what DOES turn him on sexually. what type of porn does he watch, if any. What drugs does he take (some drugs have the unfortunate side effect of killing his libido). 
see if he is into some sort of kinky sex, and see if you can role play as his kinky partner in that. there are a TON of kinky ways to have sex, and you might find one that he loves, but is embarrassed to tell you about.
Is he able to get hard if you stimulate him? If not, see a urologist--there might be a medical issue that needs to be addressed.
his former sex partners, were they women? If he is gay, that might be the reason for a lack of libido


----------

