# D-Day #2



## Owyn (Jul 9, 2012)

I have two other threads here, one talking about the original discovery day and a little bit of our history, the other about my concerns during the recovery process. So I won't get into those details here.

I decided to go out for a night on the town with my wife and two of her female friends to relax and relieve some tension. We had a good night, everyone seemed to be having fun, my wife and I were getting along.

I know this was probably not a good time to get drunk, but we started having fun and the drinks kept coming. Anyway, when we got home my wife went to bed but I couldn't sleep, and I started to think about all our problems again. I wanted to talk about it, but obviously she wanted to sleep. So I left the bedroom and spent some time being mad alone.

I woke up a couple hours later and noticed my wife was sleeping with her cell phone right next to her. I became very curious, so I took the phone and turned it on. Right away on the screen was a conversation with the OM. I got really angry. I woke her up and told her what I had just found and read.

We fought for a while about it, she told me it was just a drunken mistake and she hasn't talked to him over the past week. The only time she could have been talking to him is while she's at work, because I moniter when we're at home. I was very close to divorcing her right then and there. She was crying and seemed very remorseful for hurting me again, and I caved... because I love her.

I don't know if I can ever trust her. I can't handle a D-Day #3. I am thinking about telling her we need to get divorced and asking her to leave. But I feel like I will cave again, I don't know if I can go through with it, but I can't keep doing this. She seems to really want to be with me, I believe that, but I also think she won't stop what she's doing... she wants both. I guess I need to commit to the full 180 now.

Thanks for any advice.


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## snap (Oct 3, 2011)

You need to file, 'casue the D-Day 3 is indeed on its way. The affair hasn't stopped.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

She just used the first excuse she thought you'd believe, that she was drunk. So what will she do the next time she drinks? Well actually you don't have to wait for that.

Infatuation is very powerful. It's as simple as that. As long as D remains just a threat, you will find your situation has not changed one bit. Only an outside force like exposure and D can wake a WS up. And even then it's a long shot. But if you want R, you should at least try. This is where the saying comes from, be willing to lose tjhe marriage to save it. Why so extreme? Because your marriage is ALREADY gone but it takes a while to fully accept this tragic truth.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

What she wants to write off as a drunken mistake - should be viewed instead as a drunken admission of her real intentions.

What was the nature of the texts she sent/got back?

And what is the connection to the OM? does she work with him? I scanned your other thread but didn't fully understand the connection there.


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## Gabriel (May 10, 2011)

Yeah, what was the conversation about?


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## Owyn (Jul 9, 2012)

It seems like everyone is of the opinion that the affair is not over... which was my concern. I feel like I have to end it but that's the last thing I ever wanted to do, which is why I've been trying to fix it.

The conversation was actually about me. I think it's rather obvious that some messages were deleted as the conversation was going on, but then she passed out and I was left to find the end of the conversation. 

The part that I seen started with her saying "I need to figure it out", she told me it was figure out our marriage, but I can't believe anything. Then he asked her if there was anyone else and she said no. The he said "soon you're going to snap and come to me" and she only replied with a laugh. She told me that was his wishful thinking, but again, who knows. The last message was him saying "did you fall asleep?".

After her and I talked about it, she wrote him and said "don't ever write to me again". But there's no way to know that she didn't contact him after that and simply explain she got caught.

What is the connection? He's in the military and he attends the gym in the office building she works in.


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## mahike (Aug 16, 2011)

OK if he is in the Military you call the base chaplian where he is stationed. They will call him in and order him to stop seeing a married woman.

File for divorce, you do not have to go through with it but file. She may have stopped the PA but the EA is still going on.

Yep 180 all the way.......

If in a week or two if you do not think thinkgs are moving in the right direction show her the door


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

She texted because she was drunk? More like she was caught because she was drunk. Your denial will be your biggest enemy.


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

What application did she use to chat? The regular chats or in-game chat application?

I posted this in your older thread but failed to follow up with it.




> The way this affair ended is a bit concerning. There is a chance that this might have gone underground. There are chat applications whose txt messages don't show up on the records. Verify using your own methods.


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## Gabriel (May 10, 2011)

Owyn said:


> It seems like everyone is of the opinion that the affair is not over... which was my concern. I feel like I have to end it but that's the last thing I ever wanted to do, which is why I've been trying to fix it.
> 
> The conversation was actually about me. I think it's rather obvious that some messages were deleted as the conversation was going on, but then she passed out and I was left to find the end of the conversation.
> 
> ...


They are still talking. I do believe the "figure it out" was to figure out the marriage. Of course it was. That's what this whole thing is about. Demand she block his number. Or do it for her. This isn't over.


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

Who s the OM? Where did she meet him? Why do you think this isn't physical yet? I apologize if you answered these questions already


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## TDSC60 (Dec 8, 2011)

I hate to say it but a "drunken mistake" can be very revealing. The mind goes to what it REALLY wants to do without the inhibitions of logical thought.

The affair never ended. She was continuing contact at work. She just got drunk and got careless and got caught.

Obviously she has not committed to you and your marriage. She is still questioning what she wants and is continuing to discuss it with OM.

Yep - DDay 3 on the way.


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## morituri (Apr 1, 2011)

Owyn said:


> I have recently discovered that my wife was having an emotional affair. I had been suspicious for just over one week when I confronted her, because she was on her cell phone a lot more and being very protective of the phone. The amount of text messages she was sending/receiving was a lot higher than normal for that week. I believe I caught it early, but I think they were talking for a few weeks around her office before they began texting eachother after work hours.
> 
> When confronted, she denied it and told me she was just talking to friends. I was well prepared for the confrontation, as I had been researching what possible issues could be happening in our marriage to cause this behaviour. I had already believed it was an EA and had papers for her to read about it. She became mad at me for accusing her of an affair.
> 
> ...



She crossed the line in the sand that would turn the ultimatum into reality. Now you painted yourself into a corner and have only two options. Option 1, carry through with the ultimatum and file for divorce (it can be stopped up to the point of finalization) so that she can see that you were not bluffing and are ready to move on with your life without her. Option 2, do nothing and run the real risk of her losing what little respect she has for you, and proceed to turn the EA into a full blown affair and rubbing it in your face, knowing full well that your threats are hollow. If you are smart, you'll go with Option 1 because she will be on a deadline to really end all contact with the OM and do all the heavy lifting to rebuild the marriage before the divorce becomes finalized. But if you choose Option 2, then be ready to suffer being a cuckold husband to a remorseless, cruel, selfish wife who may even take the OM to your home and have sex on the marital bed. Your choice.


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## jnj express (Mar 28, 2011)

What is it that you do not understand

Somewhere after you left the bed---she got on her phone, he called/she called, what's the difference---they talked---He isn't gone, and it's not over

It takes only one moment of weakness, she has sex, and this thing is even worse

It was a drunken mistake, is BS---it was A CHOICE/HER CHOICE---to be on that phone with him----if she iniated the call, you got bigger problems, than you want to admit----if he iniated the call---IT NEEDED TO BE IGNORED, was it---NO

Whether you like it or not---the F'ing Alcohol, needs to be left out of your mge.---what the he*l is she doing getting so drunk, that she passes out---what are the two of you some kind of stupid teenagers, that you also drink to excess

She cries, that she wants to stay in the mge., has she shown it----NO---if she wanted to stay in this mge---she would move heaven and earth, to do the heavy lifting, and gain you back---what does she do---stays in contact, she still is emotionally fixed on him---if she see's him at her workplace (the gym) that is her choice also----does she not know that she CAN GO UP TO HIM AND SAY TO HIM, I AM MARRIED STAY THE F. AWAY FROM ME---If she wanted her mge., that would/could/SHOULD happen.

As to contacting HIS CO---WHY===what for---the other guy owes him nothing---his beef is with his own wife---SHE IS THE PERSON INVOLVED IN THIS MGE, THAT IS ALLOWING ALL OF THIS TO HAPPEN. If his wife stops it---the other guy is doing nothing more than whistling dixie---its his wife that is allowing this to go on and on and on.

On another thread---I talked about punishment/no punishment---here is a perfect example---he lets this wife back in the mge., they go out---get drunk, and she makes contact---WHERE IS THE ACCOUNTABILITY, WHERE IS THE PUNISHMENT---There is none---so what happens---SHE IS RIGHT BACK IN CONTACT

You just really have no clue---what are you doing here, you just do not wanna listen to the advice given to you by EXPERTS


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## Owyn (Jul 9, 2012)

@mahike: That is good advice. I don't know the last name of the OM. I guess I will have to ask my wife for it... I haven't tried to learn a lot about him.

@warlock07: She used her cell phone, some chat application on the iPhone. They do show up on the bill as text messages, that'd how I was alerted before D-Day #1. The OM is just some guy that she met while at work, he attends the gym in the office building she works in. I don't know if there was a PA. But I've mentioned before that I think it would be really hard for her to do that at work, given her position and amount of co-workers... but not impossible. She comes home right after work every day, always has.

@TDSC60: Yes, the drunken mistake is not something I should have taken to... I guess I am in denial. When we're home from work tonight I am going to confront her about the conversation again, after telling her it's been on my mind all day.


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

OP, if they are imessages, they don't show up on the account. They can chat over the data plan. So, you know the differences between text messages and imessages, right?


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## Owyn (Jul 9, 2012)

@morituri: You're right. I do have to go through with it. I just mentioned that I am going to re-open this conversation with her tonight. I realize that I am going to have to tell her we're going to get a divorce... and then do it.

@jnj express: We actually never drink, this was supposed to be a time for us to relax and have fun, but it got out of control and it was not a good idea. I understand what you're saying and you're right. I have a hard time dealing with the emotional problems and I have a hard time accepting the harse reality and advice here. But I do understand the advice is good.

I see this marriage failing and it scares me. Thank you all for the advice you have given. I will do my best to do what I know is right.


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## Owyn (Jul 9, 2012)

warlock07 said:


> OP, if they are imessages, they don't show up on the account. They can chat over the data plan. So, you know the differences between text messages and imessages, right?


Yes, I do. However, they show up on the online account activity I look at. I looked at it. The amount of messages sent/received on the statement were triple the normal value.


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## TDSC60 (Dec 8, 2011)

Owyn said:


> @mahike: That is good advice. I don't know the last name of the OM. I guess I will have to ask my wife for it... I haven't tried to learn a lot about him.
> 
> @warlock07: *She used her cell phone, some chat application on the iPhone.* They do show up on the bill as text messages, that'd how I was alerted before D-Day #1. The OM is just some guy that she met while at work, he attends the gym in the office building she works in. I don't know if there was a PA. But I've mentioned before that I think it would be really hard for her to do that at work, given her position and amount of co-workers... but not impossible. She comes home right after work every day, always has.
> 
> @TDSC60: Yes, the drunken mistake is not something I should have taken to... I guess I am in denial. When we're home from work tonight I am going to confront her about the conversation again, after telling her it's been on my mind all day.


Can someone give him the link to the method for recovering chats on an iPhone?


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## jh52 (Apr 29, 2012)

HI Owyn:

There is a thread on CWI about D-Day3 -- by Dingerdad -- please read it.


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## morituri (Apr 1, 2011)

Owyn said:


> @morituri: You're right. I do have to go through with it. I just mentioned that I am going to re-open this conversation with her tonight. I realize that I am going to have to tell her we're going to get a divorce... and then do it.


The most successful stories of R are when the BS has filed for divorced and started taking steps to move on with his/her life. If the WS is a cake eater, this usually is enough to clear 'the fog' away from the WS because reality has destroyed the illusion created by the affair. More so when coupled with a successful implementation of *http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/24796-just-let-them-go.html#post306559* and *The 180 degree rules*. 

This may sound strange but in order to save a marriage, you must be willing to end it.


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## anonymouskitty (Jun 5, 2012)

Owyn, if my wife had a Dday#2 I'd be out plain and simple, people deserve second chances but not a chance more.


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## TDSC60 (Dec 8, 2011)

Be ready for the "you are trying to control me" speech.

You have to tell her that:
1. You are not trying to control her and do not want to do so.
2. She is free to make her own choices just as you are free to make your choices.
3. That you are in love with her but her choice to bring the OM into your marriage and continue to do so is something you cannot accept.
4. You do not want to, but she has forced you to file for divorce because she has replaced you with OM.
5. She has until the divorce is final to convince you that she truly is in love with you and wants no one but you -physically and emotionally.

Plus now is the time to find out who this guy is.

Morituri is right. To save a marriage you have to be willing to let it go. Read the links he provided. They do work.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

It's been clarified, but I just want to reiterate that filing D is not "ending it" as you seem to think. You and most people think D is extreme. That is the point! No one does it until they are ready to end it if neeed be. But many D's never go through. It's meant to say, I am not joking around, HIM or ME.

Threats don't work; people threaten D over stupid stuff and it's cruel to throw out in arguments so know one believes it. That is why you can threaten; they believed you wouldn't so that's why they feel free to continue the affair.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Owyn (Jul 9, 2012)

@TDSC60: If that's the method of syncing the phone to the computer, it will only recover the messages that were on the phone last time it was synced. In this case, the phone is not synced often, unfortauntely.

@jh52: I've read it... and my wife doesn't seem to be trying that hard, which makes it look bad for me. Transparency is the only step my wife has taken. She has not looked for advice.

@morituri: I have checked out the 180, but not the "just let them go". I will look at it. Thanks.

@TDSC60: She's already said that, she already thinks I'm trying to be controlling. It's going to be a hard confrontation tonight... that may not end well for my marriage.

I appreciate all the advice.


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## Owyn (Jul 9, 2012)

iheartlife said:


> It's been clarified, but I just want to reiterate that filing D is not "ending it" as you seem to think. You and most people think D is extreme. That is the point! No one does it until they are ready to end it if neeed be. But many D's never go through. It's meant to say, I am not joking around, HIM or ME.
> 
> Threats don't work; people threaten D over stupid stuff and it's cruel to throw out in arguments so know one believes it. That is why you can threaten; they believed you wouldn't so that's why they feel free to continue the affair.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I think it is for me. If I get to the point when I need to file for divorce I've already come to the conclusion that it's over and I'm not willing to make it work any more. I don't think I can come back from that, but I don't know. I guess I'll have to see how it goes.


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

Owyn said:


> I think it is for me. If I get to the point when I need to file for divorce I've already come to the conclusion that it's over and I'm not willing to make it work any more. I don't think I can come back from that, but I don't know. I guess I'll have to see how it goes.


We have given you sound advice and if you choose to not use that advice then good luck. 

But you are setting yourself up for a DDay#3, believe me.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

First, his comment to her I think shows it was some kind of PA. This not the comment made by a guy in an EA. Thats a comment a guy who has been with her a few times would make. I suggest a polygraph for her soon.

That's my gut reading on that line.

It also sounds like they've had other talks just like this. She's cut it down with him, and has given him the "I'm trying to work on things with my husband talk", but has had some chats with him.

As for the phone, I think you have a couple options:

Take the iPhone away and replace it a simple phone. Pick a model where you can either not have text turned on, or that can easily have texts recovered.

I think going forward a clear rule has got to be total transparency and no deleted texts.

If you keep the iPhone, then go through and remove all texting Apps, including Skype and games with texting. Then check to see that they are not on her phone ever.

Look up his cell number to find his name ec, and see if you can find his CO/Chaplin and report him. This is not ok in the military and you can send major blow back his way. He obviiously is still pursuing your wife and putting time into responding to her.

Has she cancelled that gym membership? Have you talked to her boss to gain help making sure the OM isn't welcome in the office?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Pluto2 (Aug 17, 2011)

Owyn said:


> I think it is for me. If I get to the point when I need to file for divorce I've already come to the conclusion that it's over and I'm not willing to make it work any more. I don't think I can come back from that, but I don't know. I guess I'll have to see how it goes.


Whether or not you are willing to make it work has not been the question. The real question is whether SHE is, and there is a chance that taking these tough steps will convince her to make changes she hasn't really had to make before now. I wish you luck and I am truly sorry you are going through this.


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## Gabriel (May 10, 2011)

Owyn said:


> Yes, I do. However, they show up on the online account activity I look at. I looked at it. The amount of messages sent/received on the statement were triple the normal value.


If someone is using this chat feature on the iPhone, what app is it, and how would you be able to go onto the phone to check it for content? Curious.


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## Owyn (Jul 9, 2012)

@bandit.45: Yes, I understand that's the case. I'm just having a hard time dealing with the reality.

@Shaggy: Hopefully you are not right, but you make a good point. It's a military gym and she works there as an administrator. I can take anything away from her, but like someone else told me; "if she wants to cheat, she will". I can't stop it, she has to stop it. 

@Pluto2: There is a chance, yes. I believe it will end up there because she hasn't stopped talking to him. So we will see.


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## Owyn (Jul 9, 2012)

Gabriel said:


> If someone is using this chat feature on the iPhone, what app is it, and how would you be able to go onto the phone to check it for content? Curious.


I don't know which app it is exactly. There are plenty of them. It looks just like regular test messaging, but the interface is accessed from somewhere else, in the contacts section. If I find out more, I will post it here.


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

Yes if she wans to cheat she will, but that doesn't mean you let her walk into lions den. So as an administrator she likely has lots of unsupervised / loosely managed time, and full access to the facility, so plenty of opportunity to have sex during work hours.

Also it provides the OM with unrestricted access to her.

If she won't leave the job, then you personally need to go talk with the manager and explain the situation and ask for their help. In particular they can keep and eye out for any shady disaapeances by her and can help you identify who he is and his to contact the military and gt him ordered to back off immediately.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Owyn (Jul 9, 2012)

Shaggy said:


> Yes if she wans to cheat she will, but that doesn't mean you let her walk into lions den. So as an administrator she likely has lots of unsupervised / loosely managed time, and full access to the facility, so plenty of opportunity to have sex during work hours.
> 
> Also it provides the OM with unrestricted access to her.
> 
> ...


If it gets to the point that I have to force them to stop keeping in contact with each other, then I don't even think I want to be in this relationship any more. I need my wife to show some more willingness to work on our marriage. If she doesn't want to be married to me any more, then why should I fight to stay married.

I asked her to leave the job to create space between them and allow our marriage some time to heal. She told me she likes working there and tries to say she won't talk to him or he'll go to another gym. Obviously from all the advice I've gotten here, I'm being lied to.

It's coming to an end. I'm more angry than sad now.


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## TBT (Dec 20, 2011)

Owyn said:


> I'm more angry than sad now.


As well you should be!


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

I would ask you reconsider filing for divorce. I know it sounds harsh, but many of us here feel it is your first best option to knock your wife out of the fog she is in.

Your wife is just like a drug addict. She is addicted to this man and the flowery things he tells her. His words to her cause the dopamine to flow through her brain just like heroin. She gets the same high that a junkie gets whenever she talks to him.

Filing for divorce, and having her served, may "shock" her back into reality and force her back into the real world where she has a husband who is ready to leave her. 

If you file, and the divorce notice has the desired effect, your wife will, if she truly wants reconcilliation, cut off all contact with the OM and move heaven and earth to show you she wants to remain married. If between the time you file and divorce date you come to believe she is truly remorseful, you can either cancel the proceedings or have the divorce date continued. 

If it doesn't have that affect, and she is defiant....well then you get to see the real her and just how much she really values you and her marriage to you. The divorce will already be filed and you will be a few weeks closer to getting the parasite out of your life than you were before.


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

Owyn said:


> If it gets to the point that I have to force them to stop keeping in contact with each other, then I don't even think I want to be in this relationship any more. I need my wife to show some more willingness to work on our marriage. If she doesn't want to be married to me any more, then why should I fight to stay married.
> 
> I asked her to leave the job to create space between them and allow our marriage some time to heal. She told me she likes working there and tries to say she won't talk to him or he'll go to another gym. Obviously from all the advice I've gotten here, I'm being lied to.
> 
> It's coming to an end. I'm more angry than sad now.


You need to understand what is going on chemically in her brain when see even just sees him. She's getting a nice juicing of dopamine the happy affair chemical. Every contact, sighting, interaction gives her another jolt. In essense she is a junkie getting a nice high frm the affair. It's what drives her to go back for more. It's what triggers her texting him when drunk. She wanted a fix so she went out and got a hit.

So while I totally understand where you are coming from about not needing to manage her lilke that, the reality is if you want to avoid divorce you will need to take measures to get her clean and sober from the affair first.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## forlorn99 (May 20, 2012)

Owyn said:


> I have two other threads here, one talking about the original discovery day and a little bit of our history, the other about my concerns during the recovery process. So I won't get into those details here.
> 
> I decided to go out for a night on the town with my wife and two of her female friends to relax and relieve some tension. We had a good night, everyone seemed to be having fun, my wife and I were getting along.
> 
> ...


You need to make a decision I know exactly what I would do and my wife knows EXACTLY what I would do. If you told your wife in very basic language that any further cheating would result in immediate divorce you need to file immediately. If you did not tell her that you need to tell her immediately and forcefully that you will not tolerate it again, there will be no further discussion or talking just divorce. 

I said this to my wife in nearly that exact language "If you cheat again in any way, an email a text ANYTHING and we are done, no talking to chance of making it up to me just a divorce." You need to make her understand that there are no more mistakes no more free passes. If you already made that clear then you need to follow through.


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## TDSC60 (Dec 8, 2011)

Owyn said:


> I asked her to leave the job to create space between them and allow our marriage some time to heal. She told me she likes working there and tries to say she won't talk to him or he'll go to another gym. Obviously from all the advice I've gotten here, I'm being lied to.
> 
> It's coming to an end. I'm more angry than sad now.


Odds are that she was/is lying to you. You have now confirmed she has contacted him. Probably has been all along, just hiding it better. She has been interacting with him at work all along. 

You know from the quote above that she chose her job and her contact with him over you and your marriage. I think she is still addicted to him. "he'll go to another gym" sounds like she knew you were getting pissed off, talked it over with him and they came up with the "go to another gym" horsesh*t.

She has a long way to go before she is ready to return to the marriage - if ever.

You have a hard decision to make. If you have indeed reached the "anger" stage then I would advice not to make a final decision out of anger.

As has been said over and over and over here. Filing for D does not necessarily mean D. I would suggest that you go to your State's website and look up divorce papers. Print them out and have her fill out her portion. Tell her it is your choice not to continue in a marriage with 3 people involved where your trust in her is now destroyed.

Do not present it as an ultimatum. Do not say "If you continue contact with OM, I will divorce you". Tell her that you do not want to control her nor do you think you should. But she has made her choice, now you are making yours.

If you have already told her in the past that contact with OM means divorce, you have to follow through with preparing the paperwork or she will see you as the whimp that will accept her behavior and still eventually let it go with no consequences.


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

The texts are serious red flags. Looks like he was asking her to leave you for him. And they met in the gym. I strongly suspect a physical component in their relationship. Would he ask to leave if it wasn't physical? Not as likely. Or your wife and OM are the most honorable cheaters on earth. 

Their affair went underground. It wasn't a relapse at all. It was an ongoing discussion.



> Then he asked her if there was anyone else and she said no.


This is very concerning. It can be seen as her telling him that she was in other relationships previously.


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## snap (Oct 3, 2011)

File, file file. Your decency at the moment is wasted on them, your fighting for the family is perceived as weakness.


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## snap (Oct 3, 2011)

warlock07 said:


> I strongly suspect a physical component in their relationship. Would he ask to leave if it wasn't physical? Not as likely. Or your wife and OM are the most honorable cheaters on earth.


Let's put it this way: there is no slightest hint yet to suggest the relationship wasn't physical.


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## dingerdad (Nov 23, 2011)

If you've read any of my thread on dday 3 you'll see what's coming. My biggest mistake I think was to lay down the law after dday 2 and tell my wife to move back in the home and fight for our marriage or it was over. If R isn't progressing then my advice would be to seperate. Spend time apart and truely learn what life is going to be like without each other. You might decide its not worth the pain and life on your own is not as scary as you think it is. She will know what the grass on the other side of the fence is really like and will learn if what she is losing in you is worth it. It's brutal to go through but in the long run it might be the best thing for your marriage. You sound like how I was struggling after dday 2. It's going to be nearly impossible for you to love your wife the way she wants you to know. The OM will always be in her mind offering her paradise and an escape from your pain and her guilt. Do the seperation now before it gets to a point where there truely is no going back.


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## TRy (Sep 14, 2011)

Owyn said:


> Then he asked her if there was anyone else and she said no.


 This says that in the other man's (OM) mind you are out of the picture and no long in competition for her heart. BTW, when asked if there was anyone else (i.e. other than him), she should have said "yes there is, as I realize that I love my husband".


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

It looks like your wife has to make a choice tonight, either quit her job and hand over her cell phone and sign up for counseling or leave.

I would approach her in this way very calmly ask for her cell, if she refuses then say nothing and walk away and file tomorrow.

If she gives you the phone then but it in your pocket and inform her that she has lost her privalage and can't be trusted. if she fights you give it back walk away and see a lawyer tomorrow.

If she hands over the phone and doesn't fight you and excepts these consequences then give her spanking and send her to her room.

Sorry guys sometime I can't help but thinking out side the box. She screwed up and the A may not be over but if the contact on the text was just fishing then maybe some punishment is in order, but the context on the text revealed more then divorce her butt. She had her chance.

So what was the context of the message?

See this exact thing happened to me a week after I confronted WW and I addressed it my WW excepted the consequnces fully and now 2-1/2 years later I know our R is true...

BTW my wife got here texting feature back a years later with a new number...

For me it would be strick 2 if the conversation they had was just a fishing expitition. Plus I got to spank my wife.


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## Machiavelli (Feb 25, 2012)

Shaggy said:


> You need to understand what is going on chemically in her brain when see even just sees him. She's getting a nice juicing of *dopamine* the happy affair chemical. Every contact, sighting, interaction gives her another jolt. In essense she is a junkie getting a nice high frm the affair. It's what drives her to go back for more. It's what triggers her texting him when drunk. She wanted a fix so she went out and got a hit.


Don't forget the norepinephrine. And all the happy chemicals in OM's semen that are absorbed into the bloodstream through the walls of the vagina (or sublingually). This is why adulterers never use rubbers.


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## Machiavelli (Feb 25, 2012)

TRy said:


> This says that in the other man's (OM) mind you are out of the picture and no long in competition for her heart. BTW, when asked if there was anyone else (i.e. other than him), she should have said "yes there is, as I realize that I love my husband".


OM asked the question because she's already told OM the BH is getting flushed.


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## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

He was supposed to be talking to her hours ago. And she was already playing the "controlling" card. 

And what's this about DDay#3 coming? It already arrived when she broke NC. 

Yet another rugsweeping, in denial BS.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

You already know this, but it's the in-person contact @ her work building that is sustaining this. And until that contact is eliminated, R is a fail. The idea that the OM will switch gyms for YOU is one of the biggest lies (and jokes) I've seen in quite a while.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LastUnicorn (Jul 10, 2012)

the guy said:


> Plus I got to spank my wife.


:rofl: I love this so hard


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## Owyn (Jul 9, 2012)

An interesting turn of events. Yesterday, as I mentioned in this thread, I planned to confront my wife again and lay it all on the line. When I picked her up from work yesterday she seemed upset.

When we got home she wanted to talk. She admitted to me that she had a problem and wanted to seek help in counselling. She also said she'd look for another job. I was caught off guard by this and don't know what to do. Is it too late? Should I hang on and go to counselling to see where that takes us? Is this just a "good" day and she will have more "bad" days where she changes her mind? Is she buying time to make her decision?

Even after this I asked her the questions I needed to ask her and she gave me all the answers without a problem. But I struggle to believe her so asking questions is not as effective as I'd like.

@bandit.45: I am looking into the process for D. I live in Canada.

@Shaggy: I have been told this and understand why she feels the need to continue it. Last night, I explained this to her and she admitted that she might be in denial about it. I asked her to please do some reading on the subject for herself so she had an understanding what's going on.

@TDSC60: One day she didn't want to change her job, now she says she will look for a new one. I can see that she has been lying to me.

@dingerdad: I believe we were in false R because she contacted the OM, even when I thought she was trying to R. After last night, she seems to want to give it a real try. I feel like separating gives her a chance to be with the OM and see if that's what she wants... and if she comes back to me then I just became her second choice, and I don't want that. If she wants to leave, I think it's over.

@TRy: I haven't thought of it that way. I'm going to have to bring that up in conversation. Thanks.

@the guy: It seems she has made the choice, on her own, to seek counselling now. I posted what I read in the text messages.

@iheartlife: Yes, the contact at work is what's keeping her attached to him. If it doesn't stop, then I know we can't work it out.

I know I am very likely in denial and not accepting the truth as deeply as I should. If she is honestly going to go to counselling and try, I will give us that chance, to see what the counselor can tell us. But I truly understand that any mistakes on her part from now until then HAS to result in D. And I have been starting the 180 to begin to detach myself so I will be able to do it if the time comes.

I appreciate all the help and insight that I've received. Sorry for the long post.


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## Gabriel (May 10, 2011)

Owyn, her change in tune is likely a result of the OM dumping her. If he was pursuing her, she wouldn't be able to resist the ego boost and react this way. 

At the very least he has gotten impatient with her waffling and has told her he wants to "think things over".


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## snap (Oct 3, 2011)

Disregard her words as a lie. Continue to monitor her communications.

All your further decisions should be fact based. Your wife words should not be any influence in that, consider her mute.


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## Owyn (Jul 9, 2012)

Gabriel said:


> Owyn, her change in tune is likely a result of the OM dumping her. If he was pursuing her, she wouldn't be able to resist the ego boost and react this way.
> 
> At the very least he has gotten impatient with her waffling and has told her he wants to "think things over".


I've considered that and I think it would be a positive thing, thanks. My only concern is that it could be a way to buy more time for her to make a decision, but I may be paranoid after all that's happened.

Also, I want to find out if there was a PA, the suggestion from here is that there likely was. Aside from a polygraph, I don't know how to find out for sure. And I/m not sure a polygraph is an option when I live. I'll have to research it.


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## Owyn (Jul 9, 2012)

snap said:


> Disregard her words as a lie. Continue to monitor her communications.
> 
> All your further decisions should be fact based. Your wife words should not be any influence in that, consider her mute.


I agree with you and I don't fully believe what she says. I've told her that as well, that I can't fully believe her because of what's happened.


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## keko (Mar 21, 2012)

Owyn said:


> Also, I want to find out if there was a PA, the suggestion from here is that there likely was. Aside from a polygraph, I don't know how to find out for sure. And I/m not sure a polygraph is an option when I live. I'll have to research it.


Even a polygraph is far from accurate.

PA or EA, what difference does it make? Your wife cheated, multiple times. Disrespected you by stringing you along and lying.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

I would take her up on switching jobs. That's something measurable, presumably she'd rather keep the job she has so this is a good sign.

But remember, actions, not words. Talk about switching jobs is just that, talk.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

Machiavelli said:


> Don't forget the norepinephrine. And all the happy chemicals in OM's semen that are absorbed into the bloodstream through the walls of the vagina (or sublingually). This is why adulterers never use rubbers.


Dude, I flunked HS biology.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## anonymouskitty (Jun 5, 2012)

bandit.45 said:


> Dude, I flunked HS biology.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


You're not the only one. But its true that cheaters don't use condoms.


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## Vanguard (Jul 27, 2011)

Don't let her escape the consequences of her actions. File right now. Stop reading and file.


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## TDSC60 (Dec 8, 2011)

Did she get specific about her admitted "problem"?

What did she admit to?

I have to agree with others, her quick about-face indicates that something happened at work between them that day.

You still have to find out WHO this guy is. What's his name?

Back to the iPhone for a minute. I could be wrong - but I think there is a file in iTunes that saves all text messages - even the deleted ones - each time the phone is backed up. It might benefit you to be able to see ALL past messages between them. I think that each time you back-up the phone it just adds recent message to that file - so they are all there - even the old messages.

Any vets out there who can give OP the instructions for getting to the file? Or am I wrong about this?


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## keko (Mar 21, 2012)

Way to retrieve deleted text messages from iphone - Truth About Deception

That link shows how to get to the backup folder.


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## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

TDSC60 said:


> Back to the iPhone for a minute. I could be wrong - but I think there is a file in iTunes that saves all text messages - even the deleted ones - each time the phone is backed up. It might benefit you to be able to see ALL past messages between them. I think that each time you back-up the phone it just adds recent message to that file - so they are all there - even the old messages.
> 
> Any vets out there who can give OP the instructions for getting to the file? Or am I wrong about this?


*Decipher TextMessage*

How to save / export SMS messages to your computer. Windows or Mac. Decipher TextMessage.










*iPhone Backup Extractor*

iPhone Backup Extractor for Windows and Mac










*MobileSyncBrowser
for Mac + PC*

MobileSyncBrowser | View and Recover your iPhone data


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## morituri (Apr 1, 2011)

anonymouskitty said:


> You're not the only one. But its true that cheaters don't use condoms.


And don't forget that as soon as the penetration happened, the cheating spouse ''got religion", cried and left the AP.


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## anonymouskitty (Jun 5, 2012)

lordmayhem said:


> *Decipher TextMessage*


Couldn't help but notice the name on kelly's phone, kevin conquest.


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## Owyn (Jul 9, 2012)

@iheartlife: I am fully taking her up on this. I don't want it to just be words. I will need to see progress and job ads that she's interested in, and eventually applications being sent. It would be a very good step for us.

@TDSC60: She admitted that she has a problem with wanting to talk to the OM and knows that we can't work on our marriage without her getting help. Which is a positive sign, I think. I know the OM's name.

About the iPhone messages, she does not sync her phone to the computer often, if at all since she got it. The method that keko posted does not work in my situation, because those messages were never backed up to the computer during a sync. I am going to look into the other ways that lordmayhem posted. Thanks.


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## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

Owyn said:


> About the iPhone messages, she does not sync her phone to the computer often, if at all since she got it. The method that keko posted does not work in my situation, because those messages were never backed up to the computer during a sync. I am going to look into the other ways that lordmayhem posted. Thanks.


All messages, whether deleted or not, are in the back up file. Since she doesn't sync her phone to the computer that often, that means they're all still there in the iPhone. The methods I posted *still involve getting into that back up file*. This is a great time to grab that phone and sync it to iTunes on your computer.


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## dingerdad (Nov 23, 2011)

Your situation is so similar to what mine was. It's obvious what you want to fight for and I totally understand. Your wife is lying in everything she says. Partly because she has been lying for so long she does not know how to stop and partly because she honestly has no idea what the truth is, what she wants, etc. She is telling you everything she thinks you want to hear to take the pressure off. Her mind is in turmoil and she'll tell you and the OM anything to ease this. It's not about you, your family or the OM. It's about her.

I don't have any answers for you, I don't know how you bring her back. I don't know what I could have done different to save my marriage. Your wife is gone. She will do everything you ask for awhile and then she's going to want everything you used to give her but you won't be able to give it. You can fake it but she'll know. The most important thing is that you will always be competing with a fantasy. A fantasy life and a fantasy man that can do no wrong. 
I should have not let my wife come back so soon after dday 2. I should have let her go then and lived two seperate lives for awhile. Yes she might run to the OM but she's going to anyway when you can't get past the multiple breeches of trust and the betrayal fast enough....and you wont. It'll stay with you forever...I think you know this as I did but I would not give up on my family either. Let her go. Use her guilt to secure yourself financial, with custody and so forth. Live to seperate lives. Maybe you'll both find each other again someday. Sorry bro. Your marriage is over, your wife is gone. You can keep putting yourself through this torture or move on. Remember you never have up on your family or your marriage. She has. Hold your head high. Your a good man.


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## dingerdad (Nov 23, 2011)

I can't seem to find if you have children or not. If you don't my advice is simple. Run. I know you love her but you know you don't really. You love who she was, you love the woman you married, you love who you hope she can be again. You want to hold her and protect her from the turmoil in her head. You don't love who she is now. You can't. You are angry, mad, hurt betrayed and in more pain than she could imagine caused by her. You will never forget this pain or who caused it no matter how much you want your wife back. If you have no kids let her go. If you have kids then I don't know. Your a man like me. You want to fight for your kids and your family. Having a solid family unit for them and for you. You will make it work and love your wife as I did no matter what you are feeling inside. She does not feel the same way now and might never. Part of you is probably thinking if we can only hold it together untill the kids are older....This is the honarable and right thing to do I believe. I would have never put my happiness ahead of my children's. People who say that they would be better off are full of ****. They need there mother to get her crap together and quit screwing up their lives. If you have kids I support you in continuing to battle. I think in the end it'll only end bad like my marriage did but I am respected and admired everywhere I go for never giving up on my family. My wife is viewed now as a home wrecker, a cheater, a liar, and a betrayer who put herself ahead of her kids. This might not be fair but the world likes right and wrong, good guys and bad guys. Keep fighting if you have kids and in the end no matter what you'll know you did the right thing, you will have no regrets, and your children will have a great dad. I'm sorry for what the future holds for you.


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## dingerdad (Nov 23, 2011)

Message me if you need anything. I've been through multiple ddays now ending in divorce.


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## Acabado (May 13, 2012)

> Owyn, her change in tune is likely a result of the OM dumping her.


Something happened, surely as she was deeper in the fog she wanted answers from OM, about a potential future with him, maybe she just expressed her fellings. If that's the case what happened is OM dropped her like a hot potato, he wanted to get laid and have fun for a while, divorce, custody battles, kids.. nothing of it entered in his mind. Her feelings felt too serious.


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## TDSC60 (Dec 8, 2011)

Owyn said:


> @iheartlife: I am fully taking her up on this. I don't want it to just be words. I will need to see progress and job ads that she's interested in, and eventually applications being sent. It would be a very good step for us.
> 
> @TDSC60: She admitted that she has a problem with wanting to talk to the OM and knows that we can't work on our marriage without her getting help. Which is a positive sign, I think. I know the OM's name.
> 
> About the iPhone messages, she does not sync her phone to the computer often, if at all since she got it. The method that keko posted does not work in my situation, because those messages were never backed up to the computer during a sync. I am going to look into the other ways that lordmayhem posted. Thanks.


She still wants the OM so she is still in the affair big time. Counseling will not help her give him up nor will it help her return to the marriage at this point. You are putting the cart before the horse. SHE HAS TO GIVE UP ALL CONTACT WITH HIM. SHE HAS TO LEAVE THE JOB WHERE THE AFFAIR STARTED. This is more than a "crush" or infatuation for her - if she admits it or not.

When she makes the decision to not see OM and not talk, text, respond to him - only then can counseling help the two of you work on the marriage.

She is going to be going through a withdrawal period or "detox" because she will miss the "high" she felt with him. Be ready for that. 

It will be a tough road ahead for you both. Are you ready and willing to do it. That is the question you have to answer for yourself.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

Yes, I don't mean sending out job applications, I mean leaving her job. Each day means the contact continues and the affair deepens. Anyone can send out job applications; it's the actual quitting and changing of the job that ends contact!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Owyn (Jul 9, 2012)

@dingerdad: I do not have any children. So I guess I'm just fighting for my wife and the life I once loved. We've been together for our entire adult lives, since I was a senior in high school, 10 years ago. 

You're right, I think she is telling me everything that she thinks I want to hear. In fact, you're probably right about everything. I know you just experienced it and I feel so sorry for you because I now know what you've gone through, and I'm not even at the end yet. Not to mention, I don't have the children to care about, so my situation is indeed easier to handle.

I do love who she was and I am fighting to get that back... but it's probably not possible. And I struggle wondering if I'd ever be able to trust her again and go back to our "normal" lives. I believe your advice is accurate and it scares me to follow you on that path. Do you think I should hang on for the counselling sessions that she is currently booking? She has just recently changed and admitted she needs/wants help. After 10 years of commitment, I feel it would be reasonable of me to hang on for a month or two to find out... but perhaps that is my own mind playing tricks on me. In your opinion, should I go to counselling? She also agreed to look for a new job to avoid contact with the OM. Should I be doing the 180 to detach and make D easier if/when it comes to that?

Thank you very much for your input, dingerdad.


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## Owyn (Jul 9, 2012)

@TDSC60: There's full transparency. She's going to be quitting her job, if she's not lying about that. If she is lying, then it's over. Contact should be ended now, if it's not then our marriage will end, I understand and accept that. I did notice some signs of withdrawl after the first discovery day. So I think there were some days where there was no contact, but as I've posted, contact was started again.

@iheartlife: I need to see progress to determine if it's happening. We can't have her instantly quit her job, we would not be okay financially at this time. I need her to find a new job and apply right away.

I realize that my marriage may already be over and I'm hanging onto nothing, but there's also a chance. Doing the 180 to detach to make D easier if it comes to that.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

Owyn said:


> An interesting turn of events. Yesterday, as I mentioned in this thread, I planned to confront my wife again and lay it all on the line. When I picked her up from work yesterday she seemed upset.
> 
> When we got home she wanted to talk. She admitted to me that she had a problem and wanted to seek help in counselling. She also said she'd look for another job. I was caught off guard by this and don't know what to do. Is it too late? Should I hang on and go to counselling to see where that takes us? Is this just a "good" day and she will have more "bad" days where she changes her mind? Is she buying time to make her decision?
> 
> ...


Have you made it clear that you will divorce her if she backslides?


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## TDSC60 (Dec 8, 2011)

Qwyn,

There is nothing wrong with hoping and fighting to get your wife back. Most honorable, self-respecting men have to feel that they did everything possible. You have loved her most of your life so it is perfectly normal to feel like you don't want to give up while there is the slightest chance left.

Is the counseling she scheduled Marriage or Individual? If it is MC I see nothing wrong with you going with her. If it is IC then go with her if you are asked, but do not be surprised if the counselor asks to see her alone. The counselor will probably set the schedule.

Nothing wrong with trying to recover what is lost until you just hit the wall and can't do it any more.

Good luck.


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## Owyn (Jul 9, 2012)

chapparal said:


> Have you made it clear that you will divorce her if she backslides?


Yes, she knows. Even if contact with OM is gone it could still be over if I was to find out more information that I cannot deal with.


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## Owyn (Jul 9, 2012)

TDSC60 said:


> Qwyn,
> 
> There is nothing wrong with hoping and fighting to get your wife back. Most honorable, self-respecting men have to feel that they did everything possible. You have loved her most of your life so it is perfectly normal to feel like you don't want to give up while there is the slightest chance left.
> 
> ...


Thanks TDSC60. It is MC.


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## dingerdad (Nov 23, 2011)

You don't have kids. Go. You can do counseling while seperated. Let her find out what life is like without you. She will have to win you back as you START a new life without her. If she's runs to OM then you'll know you made the right choice. Once you detach a bit you'll know if you are fighting for her or your life. You've got to separate and give it time. Worst mistake I made was forcing my wife into R when she wasn't even close to ready and your wife isnt. You are not ready either. You are in panic mode trying to save and fix everything. You both need time. I know how slowly everything seems to me moving. A day feels like a year. It's going to be extremely hard but I think you know you need to do it. Separating does not have to be the end of your life together. Look at is as a chance to fall in love again without the stresses of marriage, bills, etc wearing on the both of you. Let her find out if the grass is really greener over there. Is it really ever about the OM or about a new life freed from the problems in the marriage. She may find out that your life together was pretty awesome compared to what it's like on her own. Seperate, do the 180. Go to counceling with her if she wishes. In time if your ready maybe start to date. Go from there. No kids, no rush. This is about long term what's best for you. If it does not happen then it will be easier because you have already begone to detach and the fears of the unknown life without her will have started to fade. Do it. Again, you are not giving up on your marriage. She is already gone. If she wants you back she will have to win you back. I also understand that you've been in love since you were kids. I was the same way. The only really serious long term relationship I ever had was with my wife. It's tough.


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## Owyn (Jul 9, 2012)

dingerdad said:


> You don't have kids. Go. You can do counseling while seperated. Let her find out what life is like without you. She will have to win you back as you START a new life without her. If she's runs to OM then you'll know you made the right choice. Once you detach a bit you'll know if you are fighting for her or your life. You've got to separate and give it time. Worst mistake I made was forcing my wife into R when she wasn't even close to ready and your wife isnt. You are not ready either. You are in panic mode trying to save and fix everything. You both need time. I know how slowly everything seems to me moving. A day feels like a year. It's going to be extremely hard but I think you know you need to do it. Separating does not have to be the end of your life together. Look at is as a chance to fall in love again without the stresses of marriage, bills, etc wearing on the both of you. Let her find out if the grass is really greener over there. Is it really ever about the OM or about a new life freed from the problems in the marriage. She may find out that your life together was pretty awesome compared to what it's like on her own. Seperate, do the 180. Go to counceling with her if she wishes. In time if your ready maybe start to date. Go from there. No kids, no rush. This is about long term what's best for you. If it does not happen then it will be easier because you have already begone to detach and the fears of the unknown life without her will have started to fade. Do it. Again, you are not giving up on your marriage. She is already gone. If she wants you back she will have to win you back. I also understand that you've been in love since you were kids. I was the same way. The only really serious long term relationship I ever had was with my wife. It's tough.


I am about to leave work for the day and go be with my with for another evening, talking, and getting insights. I have more questions to ask her everyday. 

At this point, if she's still in the fog, I believe that separating would allow her to go to the OM even if that's not what she truly wants. The she would find out that I am the one she really wants but I wouldn't be able to take her back due to the decisions she made while in the fog. I am going to strongly consider it because I highly respect your advice. Thank you.


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## dingerdad (Nov 23, 2011)

Ok. How about this then. Just go home and "be". No questions, no pressure, no fighting, no crying. Both of you take a night off. I know it's hard.


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## Machiavelli (Feb 25, 2012)

morituri said:


> And don't forget that as soon as the penetration happened, the cheating spouse ''got religion", cried and left the AP.


That is completely understandable because the AP had the smallest tool she'd ever seen and it hurt so much going in. But he couldn't get hard, so it doesn't really matter.


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

Have her leave the job immediately and look for a new job,

Does she have vacation time there? If do have her take immediate vacation or family leave and to use the time to get a new job.

Shell need full transparency of her where abouts during this time, along with having a var in her car.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Owyn (Jul 9, 2012)

dingerdad said:


> Ok. How about this then. Just go home and "be". No questions, no pressure, no fighting, no crying. Both of you take a night off. I know it's hard.


Wow. I didn't read this post until this morning, but this is exactly what we did last night. We got home, walked and played with our puppy, had dinner and watched TV. I thought about our situation a few times over the evening but I didn't say anything. I guess I just wanted to have one "normal" night. It went well, we had fun. Not sure if it makes a difference, but we had sex too, it really felt like a regular life again.

@Shaggy: Yes, she does have some vacation time. However, the OM is in the military as I'd mentioned and he is out of town at the moment. I am thinking about calling his CO, would I be able to restrict him from that base?


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

How do you know he is out of town? When is he due back?

Since she' agreed to a new job, then take her up on it and get cracking.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Owyn (Jul 9, 2012)

Shaggy said:


> How do you know he is out of town? When is he due back?
> 
> Since she' agreed to a new job, then take her up on it and get cracking.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


His unit is gone, I believe he would have to be.

I am taking her up on the new job, I'm going to find out tonight if she has started looking for new positions, and she will have to show me ads so I can verify. I may look for jobs for her and show her options. I also want to know if she's done any research on this topic since I expressed the need for her to learn more about what's going on. I found a good article for a WS to read, I'll ask her to read it.


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## Owyn (Jul 9, 2012)

For those of you reading this, I just learned a new reason that could have lead to my WW changing her mind. Previously, it was suggested that something happened between her and the OM. Recently, her sister exposed the affair to their father and step-mother.

My wife is very friendly, she's making plans for our evenings, and wants to spend more time with me. These are good signs?

Should we read *NOT "Just Friends"* now?


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

When she is in these cooperative moods you needyo get her away from that job ASAP, and to get full transparency from her. Right now she is detoxing from the affair, you need to set things up to avoid a relapse when she gets another dopamine hit from contact with the OM.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Owyn (Jul 9, 2012)

Shaggy said:


> When she is in these cooperative moods you needyo get her away from that job ASAP, and to get full transparency from her. Right now she is detoxing from the affair, you need to set things up to avoid a relapse when she gets another dopamine hit from contact with the OM.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Working on the new job, I've searched for the past two days and there's nothing in our area at this time, not that I've found anyway. I have to keep looking and check more sites.

I have full transparency and she's okay with it. I can talk, call, text, email her any time and she'll respond or answer my questions. I can ask her who's on the phone or look at what she's doing on the computer. She's definitely not trying to hide anything from me when we're together any more, like she was before D-Day.


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## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

Owyn said:


> Working on the new job, I've searched for the past two days and there's nothing in our area at this time, not that I've found anyway. I have to keep looking and check more sites.
> 
> I have full transparency and she's okay with it. I can talk, call, text, email her any time and she'll respond or answer my questions. I can ask her who's on the phone or look at what she's doing on the computer. She's definitely not trying to hide anything from me when we're together any more, like she was before D-Day.


Those are good signs. Just keep in mind, there's been quite a few threads here where the WS initially did the right things in the beginning, just ask beenbetrayed. This is why it's imperative that you continue to monitor her so you can verify if it's true remorse.

You will know when you're in False R. She will tire of being transparent and tell you to rugsweep. She will become emotionally and/or sexually withdrawn again. You begin to see their affair behavior return, etc.

Remain vigilant.


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## Owyn (Jul 9, 2012)

lordmayhem said:


> Those are good signs. Just keep in mind, there's been quite a few threads here where the WS initially did the right things in the beginning, just ask beenbetrayed. This is why it's imperative that you continue to monitor her so you can verify if it's true remorse.
> 
> You will know when you're in False R. She will tire of being transparent and tell you to rugsweep. She will become emotionally and/or sexually withdrawn again. You begin to see their affair behavior return, etc.
> 
> Remain vigilant.


I understand that, and I will continue to moniter for a while to come. It's going to take a long time for her to start to gain my trust back, I've told her that. I will always keep looking for good signs and bad signs. Thanks for reassuring my thoughts that things are starting to look a little better.

I'm thinking about buying *NOT "Just Friends"* today. I told her we need to read some books as well as attend MC, and she agreed. This is a book that was recommended in one of my other threads. Is it an appropriate time to start reading it?


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

Yes, it certainly is. It would have been good reading before you had undeniable proof.

WSs don't necessarily want to read it and it can be tough to know if they had. Flag the passages you think are good for her to look at, or read them aloud to her. But it's mostly a book for you.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Owyn (Jul 9, 2012)

iheartlife said:


> Yes, it certainly is. It would have been good reading before you had undeniable proof.
> 
> WSs don't necessarily want to read it and it can be tough to know if they had. Flag the passages you think are good for her to look at, or read them aloud to her. But it's mostly a book for you.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


We'll probably read it together, as an activity to move forward. I know it will be hard for her to read it and she probably won't want to. And I would rather not read it either, but we've both found ourselves in the position where we must read it.

I'll buy it today if the local book store has it in stock.

Also recommended was *His Needs, Her Needs*. So I'll likely get that book next.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

Yes, there's His Needs / Her Needs and Love Busters, both by Dr. Harley. There are lengthy free questionnaires for both books on Marriage Builders website. She may not feel like filling them out but if you explain to her that they will help you understand her better, you can get her to do it. (And she you, of course.). The other book is The 5 Love Languages, it also has a free website quiz. That one is quick and you might want to read it first.

Another great book is The 7 Principles for Making Marriage Work by Gottman, and if you feel she has boundary issues, (what BS doesn't!) Boundaries in Marriage by Cloud and Townsend.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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