# Did your WS's cheating alter your moral code?



## The-Deceived (Jan 8, 2013)

Even though my WW was always insecure about my faithfulness, I took pride in the fact that I would never actually cheat on her. I had lots of opportunity. Plenty. But I never even came close, as I valued my commitment to my wife, my vows, and my integrity. I was devoted and wore that badge with honor.

Then I find out my wife of 12 years had a 6 month affair. Utterly mind boggling. We are attempting R, and it's going well. She's doing all the right things. She is truly remorseful and tells me daily. Every day she thanks me for the 2nd chance, for being her "knight in shining armour". She also expresses her fear that I'll change my mind and leave her, everyday.

I'm sad to say her affair has changed my moral fiber. I have no intention of having a revenge affair, or getting vengeance. But I don't care as much as I used to. Before I found out, if you told me my wife was cheating on me, I would have lost my mind. The pain was unfathomable. Now if I were to find out she did it again, I would just leave, and not think twice. I wouldn't be mad. I wouldn't ask why. I wouldn't try to fix it. I wouldn't really care.

And for me, I no longer have the super strong feeling of honor, devotion and dedication to my vows that I once had. It's not a conscious decision - not something out of anger or resentment. I just don't care that much any more - because she clearly didn't. 

All my years of faithfulness and integrity meant what? NOTHING. Not a god-damned thing. And now I fear that part of me is gone. It died. And that is so sad.

Did anyone else experience this? Did your values, morals and integrity get ultimately damaged or compromised by your WS's affair?


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## Link182 (May 25, 2012)

Not only did / have I experienced this, I feel like you wrote this about me.

13 months post DDay, just came on me about 2 months ago.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

I went through a period where I decided that marriage is a defunct institution that really means nothing. I've gotten past that somewhat - I don't go around telling anyone who will listen that nobody should ever get married under any circumstances any more - but I don't think of marriage in the same way at all now. My first thought when I hear that someone is engaged is "Quick!! Call it off now before you get hurt!!" If I ever split with hubby I highly doubt I would ever get married again.

I'm not sure that stems so much from an alteration of my moral fiber, or just as a result of a shield I have erected to protect myself, which extend to those I care about when I see them putting themselves out there.

I also find myself thinking that people would be far happier if the societal norm was not monogamy. I read The Change series by S.M. Stirling, and there are a couple of examples of different types of non-monogamous civilizations in it that really got me thinking.


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## The-Deceived (Jan 8, 2013)

Link182 said:


> Not only did / have I experienced this, I feel like you wrote this about me.
> 
> 13 months post DDay, just came on me about 2 months ago.


You mean you felt your moral code change 2 months ago?


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## The-Deceived (Jan 8, 2013)

Hope1964 said:


> I went through a period where I decided that marriage is a defunct institution that really means nothing. I've gotten past that somewhat - I don't go around telling anyone who will listen that nobody should ever get married under any circumstances any more - but I don't think of marriage in the same way at all now. My first thought when I hear that someone is engaged is "Quick!! Call it off now before you get hurt!!" If I ever split with hubby I highly doubt I would ever get married again.
> 
> I'm not sure that stems so much from an alteration of my moral fiber, or just as a result of a shield I have erected to protect myself, which extend to those I care about when I see them putting themselves out there.
> 
> I also find myself thinking that people would be far happier if the societal norm was not monogamy. I read The Change series by S.M. Stirling, and there are a couple of examples of different types of non-monogamous civilizations in it that really got me thinking.


Interesting - I get the wall of protection. Sadly I now have a component of apathy towards the entire thing. Maybe that's a coping mechanism in itself...actually, of course it is.


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## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

My moral code has not change. I have simply tightened up my ability to give the benefit of the doubt to people who enter my or my fiance's life.


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## The-Deceived (Jan 8, 2013)

This is really terrible - but I can't say for certain what I would do under certain circumstances now, where 2 months ago I wore a figurative chastity belt around. Nobody but my wife had access.

And that makes me really sad.


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## Link182 (May 25, 2012)

The-Deceived said:


> You mean you felt your moral code change 2 months ago?


I would not say that I felt it change, but something turned in me. Perhaps it was repressed anger just manifesting itself in this manner. Not sure. I was married for 9.5 years the day I found out about her affair. I had fought hard to make sure my family wanted for nothing, I believe that I tried to be the best husband I knew how, spent time on the road and away from home. Sure I had ample opportunities to cheat, but it never occurred to me to try, after all I was married, married men don't do that I was raised. 

Not that I obsess about having an affair of my own, nor do I seek anything outside my marriage. But like you describe, the things I had always held as pillars of my marriage, fighting for it, defending it, things I always took pride in...it occurred to me that they did not rank as high on my priority chart as they used to.

Now I would not cheat simply to not dishonor myself, I am the man I was raised to be, and I know what I can accept and what I cannot from myself. That is what holds me to the line now, where before the thought of hurting my wife and the look in her eyes as I might break her heart was more than I could bear and certainly higher on the list. Now having sen what she did to us, my value of who I am ranks higher than the pride I once had in defending what she gave away.

I hope that makes sense, just writing off the cuff here.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

The-Deceived said:


> This is really terrible - but I can't say for certain what I would do under certain circumstances now, where 2 months ago I wore a figurative chastity belt around. Nobody but my wife had access.
> 
> And that makes me really sad.


I don't know if that's your moral code having been altered, or a desire for revenge. You've been skirting around the idea of a revenge affair pretty much from the time you came to TAM. You haven't admitted that you want to have one, though.


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## The-Deceived (Jan 8, 2013)

Link182 said:


> I would not say that I felt it change, but something turned in me. Perhaps it was repressed anger just manifesting itself in this manner. Not sure. I was married for 9.5 years the day I found out about her affair. I had fought hard to make sure my family wanted for nothing, I believe that I tried to be the best husband I knew how, spent time on the road and away from home. Sure I had ample opportunities to cheat, but it never occurred to me to try, after all I was married, married men don't do that I was raised.
> 
> Not that I obsess about having an affair of my own, nor do I seek anything outside my marriage. But like you describe, the things I had always held as pillars of my marriage, fighting for it, defending it, things I always took pride in...it occurred to me that they did not rank as high on my priority chart as they used to.
> 
> ...


Sure does make sense. Hoping to take a page out of your book - you have integrity my friend. I hope mine isn't gone. Maybe it's just a stage of the process, but I am rather apathetic about the entire thing right now. Better than immense pain, but not a good sign.


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## The-Deceived (Jan 8, 2013)

Hope1964 said:


> I don't know if that's your moral code having been altered, or a desire for revenge. You've been skirting around the idea of a revenge affair pretty much from the time you came to TAM. You haven't admitted that you want to have one, though.


No, and I don't want to have one. She's utterly terrified that I will. But I will admit that my view of the sanctity of marriage has crumbled. And I realize that's dangerous. 

I know that's terrible - I'm supposed to have more integrity than that. But right now, I don't. I'm not mad, I'm not upset, I'm not hurt. I'm just kinda...numb. I know damn well that's my mind protecting me from the pain - because it was too much.

I hope to find the man I was again. I hope this apathy passes. But I don't want the pain to return.

Sorry to sound like a shallow as*hole. I would never express this anywhere but here. 

Maybe it's inaccurate to say my morals have changed...but my attitude towards fidelity and monogamy certainly have. What a shame.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

Yes, it is a shame. And it may or may not be permanent. The whole process takes SO much time, and it has to happen with or without the WS in the picture.

All I know is that, almost 3 years out, my view is still altered. I like to think I'm wiser, though, not damaged.


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## Link182 (May 25, 2012)

To the above point let me say this, if you are even entertaining the thought of a revenge affair, don't use my words to help you get there, if not forget that line. But if you are, just stop. Don't dishonor yourself for what your spouse has done. Get to IC / MC, or just file.

Don't redefine what you are about because of someone else. If you were not a cheater before, don't become one now. Hear my words, I may not actively defend my marriage in the way that I used to, I used to be down right blunt about it to women who would flirt to me. I thought that my wife would respect that more. I don't do it any less now, I just don't see it as a priority. Because I know who I am, I won't cheat now because it would dishonor me. Perhaps I will get back there one day, when my wife has restored my trust in her, has proven to me that the guns are up and the boundaries of our marriage are once aging established.

It just won't be tomorrow....


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## The-Deceived (Jan 8, 2013)

Hope1964 said:


> I like to think I'm wiser, though, not damaged.


I like this.


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## The-Deceived (Jan 8, 2013)

Link182 said:


> To the above point let me say this, if you are even entertaining the thought of a revenge affair, don't use my words to help you get there, if not forget that line. But if you are, just stop. Don't dishonor yourself for what your spouse has done. Get to IC / MC, or just file.
> 
> Don't redefine what you are about because of someone else. If you were not a cheater before, don't become one now. Hear my words, I may not actively defend my marriage in the way that I used to, I used to be down right blunt about it to women who would flirt to me. I thought that my wife would respect that more. I don't do it any less now, I just don't see it as a priority. Because I know who I am, I won't cheat now because it would dishonor me. Perhaps I will get back there one day, when my wife has restored my trust in her, has proven to me that the guns are up and the boundaries of our marriage are once aging established.
> 
> It just won't be tomorrow....


I hear you - and I won't. Revenge is not something I'm interested in. But my recent shift from pain to apathy was significant. 

Yes - dishonoring myself would be just plain stupid. It's still not in my nature to cheat. And good Lord - even if I wanted to, where would I find the time?? 

I have made a promise to myself (one my wife made me make over and over) and that's this: if I feel the unstoppable desire to step outside the marriage, end it first. I can and will honor that.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

The-Deceived said:


> Even though my WW was always insecure about my faithfulness, I took pride in the fact that I would never actually cheat on her. I had lots of opportunity. Plenty. But I never even came close, as I valued my commitment to my wife, my vows, and my integrity. I was devoted and wore that badge with honor.
> 
> Then I find out my wife of 12 years had a 6 month affair. Utterly mind boggling. We are attempting R, and it's going well. She's doing all the right things. She is truly remorseful and tells me daily. Every day she thanks me for the 2nd chance, for being her "knight in shining armour". She also expresses her fear that I'll change my mind and leave her, everyday.
> 
> ...


I did have a revenge affair. But this was not a deliberate choice, it was born out of confusion and being heartbroken and from self-medicating with alcohol.

Did it change my outlook, my moral code? No. Which is why my revenge affair hurt me more than my wife's affair hurt me, I suppose.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

calvin said:


> My wife had a four month EA with her ex-con ex hs bf,"only" an EA that tore the hell out of me.
> Followed by eight months of calls from the homeless jerk taunting me.
> She saw the pain I was in and didnt care,we are one year in R and its going decent.
> I will never put someone throught this kind of pain.
> ...


Calvin, I think she _*always*_ loved you like crazy but for a while she had a nervous breakdown. Which you helped pull her out of.


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## The-Deceived (Jan 8, 2013)

Man, so many really good guys (and gals) on this site that got stabbed in the back and somehow maintain their integrity and kindness. You folks are pretty damn inspiring.


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## The-Deceived (Jan 8, 2013)

MattMatt said:


> Calvin, I think she _*always*_ loved you like crazy but for a while she had a nervous breakdown. Which you helped pull her out of.


My wife has been desperately looking for answers for her actions - "how could I let this happen?". "What went wrong with me??" "That was not the person I am". 

Can you have a nervous breakdown and maintain gameface when you're at home with you LS? Can you compartmentalize a nervous breakdown??


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## calvin (Jan 7, 2012)

Maybe Hope is right,marriage doesnt mean much anymore.....thats sad.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

The-Deceived said:


> Can you compartmentalize a nervous breakdown??


No, you can't.

You can compartmentalize the cheating, though, so that when you finally come out of the fog, you honestly cannot reconcile what you did with the person you know you are. That's what my husband did.


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

Quote: I have made a promise to myself (one my wife made me make over and over) and that's this: if I feel the unstoppable desire to step outside the marriage, end it first. I can and will honor that.
------------------------------


Damn close to what I asked of my second wife before we got married. I guess she forgot?

Change is inevitable after such grief. Seems like you have very strong feelings being held back by a "dam" built of apathy. I feel the pain of holding back the release of such emotion sometimes. I struggle every day with my beliefs. My moral code is trying to reset. I wish you luck.


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## CleanJerkSnatch (Jul 18, 2012)

The-Deceived said:


> And for me, I no longer have the super strong feeling of honor, devotion and dedication to my vows that I once had. It's not a conscious decision - not something out of anger or resentment. I just don't care that much any more - because she clearly didn't.
> 
> All my years of faithfulness and integrity meant what? NOTHING. Not a god-damned thing. And now I fear that part of me is gone. It died. And that is so sad.



Look at it from this perspective. You should have more honor, devotion and dedication because that is what is required for R.

Your devotion to your wife is truer now than ever before, because she betrayed you. 

Being wounded as you were and her untrustworthy you still accepted to R. That for any spouse, both WS & BS is a difficult path to tread.

IMHO, you're grand, so be proud of yourself and keep growing in strength and dedication for your marriage.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

The-Deceived said:


> My wife has been desperately looking for answers for her actions - "how could I let this happen?". "What went wrong with me??" "That was not the person I am".
> 
> Can you have a nervous breakdown and maintain gameface when you're at home with you LS? Can you compartmentalize a nervous breakdown??


Yes, I believe you can. Well, let's qualify that. Certain mental health issues can be compartmentalised. If someone is having an affair as a result of sexual abuse as a child (we have seen examples of that on TAM) then the WS can have two distinct personalities, the Loyal Spouse who is on show at home, and the WS who comes out to play with the lover/s.

Of course, as has been amply demonstrated here at TAM, when the two personalities collide, the s**t really hits the fan.


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## The-Deceived (Jan 8, 2013)

Hope1964 said:


> No, you can't.
> 
> You can compartmentalize the cheating, though, so that when you finally come out of the fog, you honestly cannot reconcile what you did with the person you know you are. That's what my husband did.


This makes good sense. 

The fog. Pfffft. Everyone has fog lights. I guess some folks just choose not to turn them on.


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## The-Deceived (Jan 8, 2013)

2ntnuf said:


> Quote: I have made a promise to myself (one my wife made me make over and over) and that's this: if I feel the unstoppable desire to step outside the marriage, end it first. I can and will honor that.
> ------------------------------
> 
> 
> ...


Thanks brother.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

calvin said:


> Thanks M&M,yes I saved her from something terrible but I feel my job is done.
> Maybe time for her to stand on her own.
> As far as my moral code,its always been strong,my wife cheating on me mad it stronger,I think it has for her but I'm not sure.
> I thought it was strong in her years ago and I was wrong.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


*Nope. Your next job is to keep loving her until you are so old you need to make your own splints out of Popsicle sticks!*


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## The-Deceived (Jan 8, 2013)

CleanJerkSnatch said:


> Look at it from this perspective. You should have more honor, devotion and dedication because that is what is required for R.
> 
> Your devotion to your wife is truer now than ever before, because she betrayed you.
> 
> ...


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## The-Deceived (Jan 8, 2013)

calvin said:


> Maybe Hope is right,marriage doesnt mean much anymore.....thats sad.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Clearly it doesn't.

Here's an article from my city's newspaper today. YUCK. Depressing.

Calgary spouses among the least faithful in Canada, says online dating site


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## 3putt (Dec 3, 2012)

Hope1964 said:


> Yes, it is a shame. And it may or may not be permanent. The whole process takes SO much time, and it has to happen with or without the WS in the picture.
> 
> All I know is that, almost 3 years out, my view is still altered. *I like to think I'm wiser, though, not damaged.*


Reminds me of a quote....

_Wisdom is nothing more than healed pain._


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## Miss Taken (Aug 18, 2012)

I feel like this experience has strengthened my moral code.

Prior to this, I wasn't a cheater. I guarded my relationship and had the view that if you want to cheat, you leave. You don't invite a third party into the relationship. However, I can say that my boundaries were less stringent than they are now. I trusted blindly and did not require transparency from my XWS. I also didn't think it ought to be required of me - I believed in faith and just trusting each other and not prying into each other's personal business. I also thought it was no big deal if either of us "harmlessly" flirted with someone else like in response to being hit on by a stranger for instance. 

However, I never went further than that. Just the other day, I found emails from two different men on facebook that wanted to cheat online with me and I shut them down real quick, telling them the conversation was inappropriate, that I had a "good" man and family and was not single/not interested in that type of conversation. I also defriended the guys right after. And if someone did hit on me in person, I would tell them I wasn't single. However, perhaps not as quick as I will now in the future.

Before being cheated on, I used to waver between "worse things can happen" to "just divorce/break up and dump the loser". It is always easy to be an expert on hypothetical situations. Having been cheated on, I can see how even "harmless" flirting between strangers can be a slippery slope and while I wouldn't have cheated, I should have been more stringent/assertive when it came to my boundaries on both sides of the coin.

I never realized how painful, gut-wrenching and devastating it feels to be cheated on. Or thought about the ripple effect it has on your family and friends. I knew it must hurt but not to this extent. I will never cheat. I know they say to never say never but I would not knowingly inflict this kind of pain onto another person. I also will be a lot more guarded both of my own fidelity/faithfulness when it comes to opposite-sex interactions when I'm in a relationship and from his end also. That blind/innocent trust and naivety is done, quashed, killed, DEAD.


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## cpacan (Jan 2, 2012)

As for the opening post; no, I would like to think my own moral values have not been affected. But I definitely have become more cynical and realistic in my view on marriage and relationships in general. I probably won't lift an eye brow if my wife cheats again - I will remove myself from the situation without a word.

Also; I will not encourage my own son to engage in a marriage whatsoever. There's a 50/50 chance that it's a waste of both money and future aspirations.


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## calvin (Jan 7, 2012)

cpacan said:


> As for the opening post; no, I would like to think my own moral values have not been affected. But I definitely have become more cynical and realistic in my view on marriage and relationships in general. I probably won't lift an eye brow if my wife cheats again - I will remove myself from the situation without a word.
> 
> Also; I will not encourage my own son to engage in a marriage whatsoever. There's a 50/50 chance that it's a waste of both money and future aspirations.


Christ thats sad but true....
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

The-Deceived said:


> Clearly it doesn't.
> 
> Here's an article from my city's newspaper today. YUCK. Depressing.
> 
> Calgary spouses among the least faithful in Canada, says online dating site


But that's *exactly* the kind of press release that I refuse to use in my day job! 

It is biased rubbish with faked statistics published by a cheater's hook-up site!


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## mad6r (Dec 31, 2012)

The-Deceived said:


> Even though my WW was always insecure about my faithfulness, I took pride in the fact that I would never actually cheat on her. I had lots of opportunity. Plenty. But I never even came close, as I valued my commitment to my wife, my vows, and my integrity. I was devoted and wore that badge with honor.
> 
> Then I find out my wife of 12 years had a 6 month affair. Utterly mind boggling. We are attempting R, and it's going well. She's doing all the right things. She is truly remorseful and tells me daily. Every day she thanks me for the 2nd chance, for being her "knight in shining armour". She also expresses her fear that I'll change my mind and leave her, everyday.
> 
> ...


Being the BS I think my moral values changed for the better, I always thought I would cheat if I had the oppurtinity to do so even with another married woman. Now if I know a person is married I wont even look in that direction. Changing family lives for what? I know what my children are going through because of my WW and would never want to do that to another family. 

My integrity is fully intact and no one, not even my STBXW will take that away from me. I can only hope to pass this on to my 2 boys and show them that we can and will get through this.


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## Keepin-my-head-up (Jan 11, 2013)

Hope1964 said:


> I went through a period where I decided that marriage is a defunct institution that really means nothing. I've gotten past that somewhat - I don't go around telling anyone who will listen that nobody should ever get married under any circumstances any more - but I don't think of marriage in the same way at all now. My first thought when I hear that someone is engaged is "Quick!! Call it off now before you get hurt!!" If I ever split with hubby I highly doubt I would ever get married again.
> 
> I'm not sure that stems so much from an alteration of my moral fiber, or just as a result of a shield I have erected to protect myself, which extend to those I care about when I see them putting themselves out there.
> 
> ...


You ROCK!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LdyVenus (Dec 1, 2012)

The-Deceived said:


> Even though my WW was always insecure about my faithfulness, I took pride in the fact that I would never actually cheat on her. I had lots of opportunity. Plenty. But I never even came close, as I valued my commitment to my wife, my vows, and my integrity. I was devoted and wore that badge with honor.
> 
> Then I find out my wife of 12 years had a 6 month affair. Utterly mind boggling. We are attempting R, and it's going well. She's doing all the right things. She is truly remorseful and tells me daily. Every day she thanks me for the 2nd chance, for being her "knight in shining armour". She also expresses her fear that I'll change my mind and leave her, everyday.
> 
> ...


I feel exactly the same way! Also TAM has taught me that apparently you aren't supposed to ever trust anybody. I am now wondering what's the point then?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## CleanJerkSnatch (Jul 18, 2012)

Miss Taken said:


> Having been cheated on, I can see how even "harmless" flirting between strangers can be a slippery slope and while I wouldn't have cheated, I should have been more stringent/assertive when it came to my boundaries on both sides of the coin.



I agree. I think its a task for both spouses to keep each other building up their weaknesses with each other's strengths. If it was so ever transparent and true compassion in hand, than any spouse would not undermine being checked for any inappropriate and unnecessary behavior.


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## Biscuits (Aug 2, 2012)

Im in that same apathetic stage. 6 months post DDay, my siyuation is unlike any of the other BSs on here, and I dont really know why Im still with my wayward. I think 1 of these days Ill wake up and say to myself, "she did this and that with him" and probably leave. But, I feel like you. I wont wait for evidence of her cheating again, it would probably only take a strong coincidence or inconsiderate remark and Im out the door.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## love=pain (Nov 26, 2012)

Your moral fiber hasn't changed the way you see your wife has. You were brought up to love honor and be completely devoted to your wife and those feelings are gone or not like they were. 
I put it like this before her affairs I would have gave my life for hers with no hesitation now I think I still would but I just don't know might have to stop and think. 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## cantthinkstraight (May 6, 2012)

It reminds me of when I found out santa clause wasn't real.
I still like christmas, but it will never be the same.


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## calvin (Jan 7, 2012)

cantthinkstraight said:


> It reminds me of when I found out santa clause wasn't real.
> I still like christmas, but it will never be the same.


I agree with that.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## N_chanted (Nov 11, 2012)

calvin said:


> I agree with that.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


me too. mostly because it took so much for me to open up and trust my H, and when i finally did it crushed me like nothing else ever has.

I believe in marriage. i want to be married, and i LIKE being married, but it's not the same anymore. it's not US against the world....it's just me, protecting my heart and my kids, and then there is the man that i am married to....and then it's the rest of the world. 

but mostly i just feel alone now. i dont feel like it's a real partnership anymore.


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## RWB (Feb 6, 2010)

The-Deceived said:


> Every day she thanks me for the 2nd chance, for being her "knight in shining armor". She also expresses her fear that I'll change my mind and leave her, everyday.
> 
> But I don't care as much as I used to. Before I found out, if you told me my wife was cheating on me, I would have lost my mind. The pain was unfathomable. *Now if I were to find out she did it again, I would just leave, and not think twice. I wouldn't be mad. I wouldn't ask why. I wouldn't try to fix it. I wouldn't really care.*
> 
> All my years of faithfulness and integrity meant what? *NOTHING*. Not a god-damned thing... It died.


Yep, Deceived, that about sums it up for me after finding out my wife of 30 years had been cheating with OM for years on end. 

I have posted before... "It just changes you". When my wife asks me how? It's hard to describe. I told her that as a 50 years old... I knew that world was harsh, hurtful. That people were capable of anything and was always careful with my trust. But, I still believed she was the one person I could be totally honest, open, and trusting to.

That was before. In reality, she was just like everyone else. In truth worse, in the way she used my trust to further her lies and deception.


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## cpacan (Jan 2, 2012)

RWB said:


> That was before. In reality, she was just like everyone else. In truth worse, in the way she used my trust to further her lies and deception.


Isn't it somehow liberating to wake up and realize the truth - you, your spouse, your marriage - are all just like everybody else. Rose colored glasses has been removed and you start to see the world the way it really is to a higher degree than before.


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## RWB (Feb 6, 2010)

cpacan said:


> Isn't it somehow *liberating to wake up and realize the truth* - you, your spouse, your marriage - are all just like everybody else. Rose colored glasses has been removed and you start to see the world the way it really is to a higher degree than before.


I never thought of it as liberating, but in retrospect, I see your point. It's been over 3 years since finding out the truth. I still remember the days after. As crazy as it sounds, I had sense (like and epiphany) of *Clarity.* 

You could describe it like a "near death" experience. The years of lies she had amassed with her affairs were paper thin now. I could see through her like I had never before. I saw her, her friends as they really are... no longer what I wanted them to be. Understand?

When you are stripped of the facade, the charade that life coats itself in to disguise its ugly truth, you do gain a liberating clarity.


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## The-Deceived (Jan 8, 2013)

cantthinkstraight said:


> It reminds me of when I found out santa clause wasn't real.
> I still like christmas, but it will never be the same.


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## The-Deceived (Jan 8, 2013)

RWB said:


> I never thought of it as liberating, but in retrospect, I see your point. It's been over 3 years since finding out the truth. I still remember the days after. As crazy as it sounds, I had sense (like and epiphany) of *Clarity.*
> 
> You could describe it like a "near death" experience. The years of lies she had amassed with her affairs were paper thin now. I could see through her like I had never before. I saw her, her friends as they really are... no longer what I wanted them to be. Understand?
> 
> When you are stripped of the facade, the charade that life coats itself in to disguise its ugly truth, you do gain a liberating clarity.


Whoa - like a near death experience. That's pretty accurate (I would guess).

Great replies guys.


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## DevastatedDad (Oct 2, 2012)

The-Deceived said:


> Even though my WW was always insecure about my faithfulness, I took pride in the fact that I would never actually cheat on her. I had lots of opportunity. Plenty. But I never even came close, as I valued my commitment to my wife, my vows, and my integrity. I was devoted and wore that badge with honor.
> 
> Then I find out my wife of 12 years had a 6 month affair. Utterly mind boggling. We are attempting R, and it's going well. She's doing all the right things. She is truly remorseful and tells me daily. Every day she thanks me for the 2nd chance, for being her "knight in shining armour". She also expresses her fear that I'll change my mind and leave her, everyday.
> 
> ...


Absolutely. 100% how I feel now.
I haven't caught up on the thread but how far are you past DDay? I am like 7-ish months out.

I am at this point like I just don't care. It is done and I am done addressing it. I don't have 2-7 years to invest in dealing with this issue. Back to life. I want no more pills, no more counseling. who has time to be consumed by this all the time. 

I have the same feeling you mentioned. If it happens again, I walk away but I don't think I would be the least bit angry just more or less "well, I tried. guess it's not meant to be". I am guessing that feeling is because I sort f expect it to happen again so I won't be surprised if it does.

Your post just struck a chord so I wanted to chime in

Now I will read your thread and see if this is completely irrelevant now.


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## Quantmflux (Feb 6, 2013)

If I'm being honest I have to say no to the original question. I've always been pretty jaded and cynical though. Maybe its an inevitable reality of my upbringing.

I think people can have moments of weakness and do terrible things, but situations aren't always absolute or black and white.

To me the details of the situation, and what comes after, make all the difference.

I wouldn't go so far as to say that belief in absolute standards is "naive", but I do think it requires a fair bit of luck. Luck meaning that you have to be fortunate to find someone that has the same standards as you and strength in the same areas. Some might never cheat, but then others might never get drunk and punch someone over nothing. Which is worse? Depends who you ask.

I don't think "marriage means less" these days really. I think in the past people had certain social constructs artificially suppressing impulsive behavior. As a result, there was the appearance that "marriage was forever", but there were *plenty* of skeletons in the closet. It's just that divorce was a scarlet letter that no one wanted. I wouldn't consider that "better" from my POV. Also, in the past men were pretty much free to be womanize while women had to stay silent and take it. Men who cheated were viewed as "just being guys". Women who cheated (and they were pretty rare) were vilified. That's not "better" if you ask me.

Human nature is what it is and humans can be weak and impulsive. Everyone has their weaknesses no matter how perfectly in control they might think they are.

It's a question of what your own personal standards are and what you can or cannot live with.

I think if a betrayal leaves your entire world view altered, it might be best to take a step back and *not* reconcile potentially. I'm not sure with feelings that strong if it would be possible to ever view the betrayer in a good light again. There *are* plenty of other people who would be equally adamant that infidelity is unforgivable and take that vow equally seriously. It might be better to strike out and find one rather than becoming broken and bitter. 

A successful reconciliation can't come from a feeling of total apathy IMO. I think temporarily of course feelings like this can be normal. But if it seems like they will linger forever as long as the betrayer is still around that can't be healthy.


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## The-Deceived (Jan 8, 2013)

DevastatedDad said:


> Absolutely. 100% how I feel now.
> I haven't caught up on the thread but how far are you past DDay? I am like 7-ish months out.
> 
> I am at this point like I just don't care. It is done and I am done addressing it. I don't have 2-7 years to invest in dealing with this issue. Back to life. I want no more pills, no more counseling. who has time to be consumed by this all the time.
> ...


Hey brother - my wife left me Nov 20, 2012 (daughter's birthday) and dday was 4 days later.


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## Goldmember357 (Jan 31, 2012)

As a divorce lawyer i feel marriage is not for most people, its quite sad because most people in general are miserable it seems and failed marriages just make it worse. Id only advice marriage for healthy sane, individuals with a lot of "strong morals" who are on the same page (in many areas). In addition the two individuals should be compatible and exhibit tendencies that those in a "consummate love" would have/exhibit. I do not think humans are made/designed for marriage/monogamy, i think the institution and that which it entails will be dead in the future.

For some people (very few) marriage is a great thing. I also advice all those who have been cheated on to leave and find someone who is entirely against cheating. Oh id also like to say i feel i can read people well, and i personally feel people can tell who will and wont cheat.


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## cpacan (Jan 2, 2012)

Quantmflux said:


> If I'm being honest I have to say no to the original question. I've always been pretty jaded and cynical though. Maybe its an inevitable reality of my upbringing.
> 
> I think people can have moments of weakness and do terrible things, but situations aren't always absolute or black and white.
> Reading the rest of your post, it doesn't sound like you think of infidelity as a terrible thing, does it?
> ...


I liked it because I think there's a lot of food for thought in this. Thanks.


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## awake1 (Jan 29, 2013)

Did it alter my moral code? Yes. I think it has. 

I still would not hide something from someone so their world gets blown up when it happens. Betraying trust is wrong, period. 


If i get cheated on again, if I get a sniff or even the faintest impression, that will be it. 

The person I am now is no longer patient. People are broken, cruel, selfish and manipulative. That is the world we live in.


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## JustGrinding (Oct 26, 2012)

The-Deceived said:


> I'm sad to say her affair has changed my moral fiber. I have no intention of having a revenge affair, or getting vengeance. But I don't care as much as I used to. Before I found out, if you told me my wife was cheating on me, I would have lost my mind. The pain was unfathomable. Now if I were to find out she did it again, I would just leave, and not think twice. I wouldn't be mad. I wouldn't ask why. I wouldn't try to fix it. I wouldn't really care.


This really hits home with me. I’ve dramatically reduced my emotional investment in my wife. Should she stray again, she ‘ll simply be met with, “Here is my divorce petition. Get out. Now.”



The-Deceived said:


> And for me, I no longer have the super strong feeling of honor, devotion and dedication to my vows that I once had. It's not a conscious decision - not something out of anger or resentment. I just don't care that much any more - because she clearly didn't.


Here, we differ a bit. The honor, devotion, and dedication I extended to her are a part of me. They are even more important to me now that I know just how devastating adultery is to the betrayed. She dishonored herself, she didn’t dishonor me. Only I can do that; and now that I know from experience just how precious is that honor, devotion, and dedication, I cling to it even more strongly.



The-Deceived said:


> All my years of faithfulness and integrity meant what? NOTHING. Not a god-damned thing. And now I fear that part of me is gone. It died. And that is so sad.


Yes, I feel that an important part of me has died, and I can never be the same, as whole as I once was. However, to reinforce the theme from above: my faithfulness and integrity mean even more to me now. That it meant nothing to her is a reflection of her moral turpitude and does not in any way diminish my fidelity.

Though I feel my capacity for caring in general has been greatly compromised by this ordeal, my belief in myself and my personal standards of conduct have been greatly strengthened.


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## The-Deceived (Jan 8, 2013)

awake1 said:


> Did it alter my moral code? Yes. I think it has.
> 
> I still would not hide something from someone so their world gets blown up when it happens. Betraying trust is wrong, period.
> 
> ...


Sad but true.


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## The-Deceived (Jan 8, 2013)

JustGrinding said:


> This really hits home with me. I’ve dramatically reduced my emotional investment in my wife. Should she stray again, she ‘ll simply be met with, “Here is my divorce petition. Get out. Now.”
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Good on you.


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## Jasel (Jan 8, 2013)

Quantmflux said:


> Also, in the past men were pretty much free to be womanize while women had to stay silent and take it. Men who cheated were viewed as "just being guys". Women who cheated (and they were pretty rare) were vilified. That's not "better" if you ask me.


That might have been the way things were in the past. Nowadays men cheat because they're dogs and that's just what they do. Women cheat because the man isn't doing something right, are feminists, they need freedom, or "have to discover themselves".


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## Dad&Hubby (Aug 14, 2012)

The-Deceived said:


> Even though my WW was always insecure about my faithfulness, I took pride in the fact that I would never actually cheat on her. I had lots of opportunity. Plenty. But I never even came close, as I valued my commitment to my wife, my vows, and my integrity. I was devoted and wore that badge with honor.
> 
> Then I find out my wife of 12 years had a 6 month affair. Utterly mind boggling. We are attempting R, and it's going well. She's doing all the right things. She is truly remorseful and tells me daily. Every day she thanks me for the 2nd chance, for being her "knight in shining armour". She also expresses her fear that I'll change my mind and leave her, everyday.
> 
> ...



I had the opposite reaction. They cemented my morals, ethics and integrity. I saw the damage my ex-wife wrought (not just with an affair, but with many other abhorrent behaviors) and I made sure I would never cause that upon someone else. I used to be "honest" but would tell little white lies, now you get the full brutal truth from me no matter what. My wife has a husband that she'll NEVER worry if I'll cheat or anything like that. 

Seeing what a deceitful, manipulative, hurtful and venomous person is truly like up close and personal, taught me to make it a mission to be the opposite for myself, my family and my friends.


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## Movingon_ (Feb 13, 2013)

This site really pisses me off. I think it is because I never dreamed in a million years I would have to come here for support. I was with my wife for 22 years. Married for 15. We were high school sweethearts. I have never been with another woman. People who have never been cheated on cannot fathom the pain we have experienced. I would not wish it on Hitler. The one person you think would never so much as over salt your soup could actually inflict life altering pain that will affect you for the rest of your life. How do we cope? For all of you saying that if your spouse cheated again or your new spouse ever cheated, you would not bat an eye and just leave. I get that and am in the same boat. But think about how sad that is. Marriage is something that should be fought for, cherished and a lot of hard work to be put into it. Now, for us, that is a world we will NEVER know again. Marriage, to us, is now something we enter somewhat gaurded. Not willing to put ourselves 100% out there. And those of us with children. it's even worse. NOTHING will ever be the same again. Thoughts of our kids around the holiday dinner table with thier kids, all togehter as a happy family gone forever. The thought of your kids having a step mom and dad. They did not ask nor deserve that. When my ex wife had her affair, I went into denial. Made up every possible exuse for her that maybe she was not having an affair. Now, because we have been cheated on, our views will never be what they once were. Life has changed for us forever. We are in a very infomous club. One that no one wants to join but our numbers are strong and growing. My parents have been married for 60+ years, nine kids and they still to this day hold hands. I always wanted that. Many of us will NEVER know the feeling of a 30, 40, 50 or 60 year anniversary. Just sad. Life sucks. Sorry if my spelling is bad. This is my first ever post on here and not sure if there is a spell check or how to use it.


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## The-Deceived (Jan 8, 2013)

Movingon_ said:


> This site really pisses me off. I think it is because I never dreamed in a million years I would have to come here for support. I was with my wife for 22 years. Married for 15. We were high school sweethearts. I have never been with another woman. People who have never been cheated on cannot fathom the pain we have experienced. I would not wish it on Hitler. The one person you think would never so much as over salt your soup could actually inflict life altering pain that will affect you for the rest of your life. How do we cope? For all of you saying that if your spouse cheated again or your new spouse ever cheated, you would not bat an eye and just leave. I get that and am in the same boat. But think about how sad that is. Marriage is something that should be fought for, cherished and a lot of hard work to be put into it. Now, for us, that is a world we will NEVER know again. Marriage, to us, is now something we enter somewhat gaurded. Not willing to put ourselves 100% out there. And those of us with children. it's even worse. NOTHING will ever be the same again. Thoughts of our kids around the holiday dinner table with thier kids, all togehter as a happy family gone forever. The thought of your kids having a step mom and dad. They did not ask nor deserve that. When my ex wife had her affair, I went into denial. Made up every possible exuse for her that maybe she was not having an affair. Now, because we have been cheated on, our views will never be what they once were. Life has changed for us forever. We are in a very infomous club. One that no one wants to join but our numbers are strong and growing. My parents have been married for 60+ years, nine kids and they still to this day hold hands. I always wanted that. Many of us will NEVER know the feeling of a 30, 40, 50 or 60 year anniversary. Just sad. Life sucks. Sorry if my spelling is bad. This is my first ever post on here and not sure if there is a spell check or how to use it.


I feel your pain. And I agree it's very sad that we are all so jaded and guarded now. It's awful. I will NEVER be as trusting as I once was. If the one person in your life that you're supposed to count on pushed you off of a cliff, how are you supposed to live life the same? You can't - because it isn't the same, and never really was what you thought it was in the first place. It was all an illusion. It was all a lie. And we bought into it. Hook, line and fvcking sinker.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

Those feelings don't last forever, though. AT least, they didn't for me. I am wiser than I was before he cheated, and have some sad experience I can pass on to others, but I am actually in a pretty good place today. I think that those feelings are sharp for a year or two after D day, but then they fade, as you make newer and better memories, and realize that your marriage CAN be better than it was.

At least, that's my experience so far  Three years post D day on March 13 - one month from today!


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## The-Deceived (Jan 8, 2013)

Hope1964 said:


> Those feelings don't last forever, though. AT least, they didn't for me. I am wiser than I was before he cheated, and have some sad experience I can pass on to others, but I am actually in a pretty good place today. I think that those feelings are sharp for a year or two after D day, but then they fade, as you make newer and better memories, and realize that your marriage CAN be better than it was.
> 
> At least, that's my experience so far  Three years post D day on March 13 - one month from today!


So glad you're doing well.


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## Racer (Sep 24, 2009)

Here’s the words and truth, that scares my wife. “When a BS accepts a WS and decides to R, they must also accept infidelity is not a dealbreaker to them.” Facts are simple; In your marriage, you have allowed it. 

Tell yourself whatever you want about how you couldn’t ever do that and blah, blah. When push comes to shove, monogamy isn’t an absolute boundary. It’s more of a ideal or goal to you, not something absolutely necessary.


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## MrMathias (Nov 19, 2012)

Yes, I think it did. 

After three and a half months of FalseR I found myself flirting in ways I wouldn't have before to meet my emotional needs. I would have kept boundaries and stopped myself- no doubt in my mind. After Dday1 I was clearly open to it. 

As far as I'm concerned, we're in a domestic partnership now.


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## LdyVenus (Dec 1, 2012)

DrMathias said:


> After Dday1 I was clearly open to it.


This is where I am too. Combine that with apathy and I think D is eventual in my situation. This makes me wonder how many people have a sucessful R many years down the road.


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## larry.gray (Feb 21, 2011)

LdyVenus said:


> This is where I am too. Combine that with apathy and I think D is eventual in my situation. This makes me wonder how many people have a sucessful R many years down the road.


Particularly when young kids at home is weighing in on the R. Let those kids grow up a little and one of the big motivators is gone.


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## slater (Feb 3, 2012)

1 year out- I think I have fallen out of love with my WW. She seems to have given up on working on the marriage. She is transparent, and faithful, keeping NC, but tired of the work. I am done. But we have small kids. I told myself I would stay for them, but with her quitting I am not sure I can.


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## nxs450 (Apr 17, 2012)

Yeah I feel the same. It has been over 4 years now and I just feel numb sometimes. Basicly feel like things are not the same and never will be. Still don't have the zest for life that I used to have. Have often wondered if a revenge affair was the answer.


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## jnj express (Mar 28, 2011)

Let me tell you---one way or the other you better have it all worked out and together

Most of you are no where near there yet---BUT

When you get into your upper 60's and beyond, and ARE RETIRED---You basically are together ALL THE TIME---24/7, year after year

Its nothing like when you were younger, with work, and kids, and social activities, much of the time, so you were not together ALL THE TIME---tripping over each other----

Your physical body deteriorates, you hurt, your spouse hurts, you both are cranky---and it is much tougher, than anything you experience when younger-------being together ALL THE TIME----is hard, makes working on a mge when younger, look like a walk in the park---and if you have anything causing a rift, it is even tougher

You really have no idea----people say, you walk into your golden years---they arn't so golden---


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## Shadow_Nirvana (Jan 1, 2013)

Well, the question depends on what moral code is. I've recently decided that I definitely won't hold back in any affair chances. Why should ı be the chump who gets cheated on while trying to be the bigger person by supressing my own urges?


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