# Choosing someone who isn't, or is, smarter than you are



## Inbetween (May 28, 2020)

I thought I was marrying a typical college educated man. I find out later the college he graduated from is terribly behind. Some of the things I consider most basic, are new or difficult for him to grasp. It's scary and makes me feel like his mother or teacher instead of his wife. This makes me feel unprotected and worried about our future. I didn't graduate from college, but learned most of my skills through work. I wanted to be good at my job, so I kept learning and picking up skills.

I've dated some very intelligent men and hated how some topics of conversation made me feel stupid. I don't want to make my husband feel stupid, but I want him to better himself.

I've also dated men who weren't that bright, which was ok for me at that time. I wasnt looking to marry these men.

I married my spouse after 2 months of dating- too soon and not at all recommended. I was older and thought it was meant to be. Among other things, I liked that he graduated from college and acted mature. I was getting over someone and I feel my husband saved me and showed me what a trusting relationship is supposed to be like. It was cloud nine until situations came up requiring him to flex that intelligence.

English is his second language, which often makes explaining things even more frustrating. He wants to own a business, but doesn't actively work on his communication skills. He needs to practice active listening and enunciation. He needs to be motivated.

We've discussed this but he doesn't make moves. It has been 6 years, why not work on this already?? I wonder if the issue is the language barrier or is it him but I remember the smartest men I've dated were also ESL.

I'm not perfect or the smartest kid in the room, but I can't help the anger and sadness I feel when he puts me in that mother/teacher role.


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## Luminous (Jan 14, 2018)

Yes, you can help the anger and sadness. You can choose not to let it eat you up or not.

What type of business does he want to get into? Will it require lots of people skills/face to face communication? Is there any aspect that you can contribute to or assist him with whilst he would be setting up?

If you are aware of things he may be facing but doesn't realise, can you sit down and draw out (maybe literally) a mud map of what may be required with regards to skills in this endeavour together?

You chose to marry this man, and this particular scenario may involve you stepping up if you want to help him see whether or not this venture is for him or not.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Inbetween said:


> I thought I was marrying a typical college educated man. I find out later the college he graduated from is terribly behind. Some of the things I consider most basic, are new or difficult for him to grasp. It's scary and makes me feel like his mother or teacher instead of his wife. This makes me feel unprotected and worried about our future. I didn't graduate from college, but learned most of my skills through work. I wanted to be good at my job, so I kept learning and picking up skills.
> 
> I've dated some very intelligent men and hated how some topics of conversation made me feel stupid. I don't want to make my husband feel stupid, but I want him to better himself.
> 
> ...


Besides the issues of his communications skills and enunciation, what are some examples of things that you believe mean that he's not very smart?


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## Mr The Other (Feb 1, 2014)

Inbetween said:


> I thought I was marrying a typical college educated man. I find out later the college he graduated from is terribly behind. Some of the things I consider most basic, are new or difficult for him to grasp. It's scary and makes me feel like his mother or teacher instead of his wife. This makes me feel unprotected and worried about our future. I didn't graduate from college, but learned most of my skills through work. I wanted to be good at my job, so I kept learning and picking up skills.
> 
> I've dated some very intelligent men and hated how some topics of conversation made me feel stupid. I don't want to make my husband feel stupid, but I want him to better himself.
> 
> ...


I was a working class lad in the UK. 
Pretty much every girl I went out with thought she was smarter than me as a given. Part of this was when I would suggest things, they ofter know they were wrong. A few years later, I had a PhD, highly paid senior jobs, which had included IQ tests that I went off the scale with, and suddenly the women I went out with thought I was smarter than them. I started to meet women who would not get what I meant, but would try to understand. It is funny how things change.
I am not sure people are as good at judging their partners intellect or communication as they often think.

I think the key thing is that you want someone to look up to and he is putting you in the opposite role.


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## TJW (Mar 20, 2012)

Dr. Phil has a wonderful saying....."...there are times we make the right decision.....but sometimes, we have to make the decision right...."



Inbetween said:


> I can't help the anger and sadness I feel when he puts me in that mother/teacher role.


Uhhhh..... no, and no....
Yes, you can change your anger and sadness. And, you are putting yourself in the mother/teacher role.
You need to change it, and stop it. Today.



Inbetween said:


> he doesn't make moves. It has been 6 years, why not work on this already?? I wonder if the issue is the language barrier or is it him


He doesn't make moves, because you are the mother/teacher. It is YOU making the moves, and he is following. The issue is not language, or him. It is you.



Inbetween said:


> I don't want to make my husband feel stupid, but I want him to better himself.


This statement, right here, is the nagging-spouse analog of the adulterous spouse "....I love you, but I'm not in love with you...", and of the Southern US "...He's a good ole boy..." 

You need to thoroughly remove yourself from the mother/teacher role, and become a CHEERLEADER. He doesn't lack motivation, he feels disparaged and criticized. Making him feel stupid is exactly what you are doing, although you say you don't want to. If you don't want to, why are you doing it? You obviously feel quite superior to him. And, no, you don't want him to better himself, you want him to be better_ for you_. Your "anger and sadness" shows that.



Inbetween said:


> I find out later the college he graduated from is terribly behind.


So, what ???? You, in your own words, state that you did not need to graduate from college to become successful and good at your job. I agree that people can achieve well without a college degree, even without ever attending a college..... So, why does your husband need a superior college to achieve ? He has an inferior intellect ?? This is what you "tell" him, in your words and actions ......

Ok. Enough Deutsch Uncle.... I want to encourage you....

There's an old southern-gospel song (which speaks of the Lord Jesus Christ) titled "...He Looked Beyond My Fault, and Saw My Need....". I challenge you, today, to make this your watchword of every minute going forward with your husband.....I challenge you to see your husband's need, putting your own aside, and become a "pipe" through which God can flow encouragement and blessing to your husband....

You are the most important person in your husband's life. Bar none. You can make him, or break him..... the choice is yours....

To steal a paraphrase from our president Mr. Obama..... "...yes, you can...."


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## Mr The Other (Feb 1, 2014)

TJW said:


> Dr. Phil has a wonderful saying....."...there are times we make the right decision.....but sometimes, we have to make the decision right...."
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Indeed.
I am sorry to say that I read the OP and was grateful I was not married to her. 
To show little respect, condescend and wonder why he does not have more confidence does seem unaware.
Of course, that is my impression and I will be reading much in that is not there. 
But, I do think spouses should be supportive. If you do not respect your spouse, as I lost respect for my ex-wife, then leave. As a kindness to them.


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## marcy* (Feb 27, 2010)

I am sorry, but just because your English is better than his, doesn’t make you smarter. You don’t have a college education, but felt disappointed that he didn’t finish a good college?! He is ESL student, working on his English skills, of course he can’t go to a good college for now because of English, not because he isn’t smart enough. I went to college here in USA. I chose a college that wasn’t too hard because of language. I came with no English. Didn’t take any ESL classes. I started college 3 years after I came in USA so you can imagine how hard must have been for me. So I went to a community college first and then got transferred to a different college that offered my degree. I have same degree from my country also.
Give him time.


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## SpinyNorman (Jan 24, 2018)

Mark Twain said "We are all ignorant, just about different things."

Since his knowledge seems to make a difference to you, it was a huge mistake to skip figuring out what he knew. Assuming a degree would tell you what he knew is an equally big mistake.

Assuming the mother/teacher role would be an even bigger mistake. Why don't you try to appreciate what he does know, instead of worrying about what he doesn't?


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## Tdbo (Sep 8, 2019)

Your contempt for your husband is stunning.
Your condescension in regards to him just oozes from every sentence.
It's hard to believe he hasn't picked up on it. The term "Respect" must not be in your lexicon.
Instead of encouraging, supporting, and motivating, you would much rather degrade him.
Your overall theme is that he is not very bright. Even though I have never met him, I must agree for two reasons:
1. He tolerates your ugliness.
2. He hasn't put your a** to the curb.
He apparently doesn't float your boat. Give him a gift, the gift of freedom.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

Hey, @Inbetween! Well done! You are working very hard to improve and 'better' your husband. 

But when do you start working on you to improve you and to 'better' yourself?


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## secretsheriff (May 6, 2020)

Yeah.....no

He may not be traditionally intelligent (though we don't know) but YOUR lack of emotional intelligence is stunning.

This is a you problem, not a him problem. Drop the condescension and attitude.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Umm..... Do you love him?

Did you ever?


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## Inbetween (May 28, 2020)

Luminous said:


> Yes, you can help the anger and sadness. You can choose not to let it eat you up or not.


This is proving difficult. I don't want it to eat me up and learn how to, but feel on guard because of some of the bad decisions he's made in the past.



Luminous said:


> What type of business does he want to get into? Will it require lots of people skills/face to face communication? Is there any aspect that you can contribute to or assist him with whilst he would be setting up?


Previously, he wanted to purchase used cars and flip them for profit. I begged him to reconsider because his previous experience doing anything related to purchasing cars was a disaster. He paid 12k for an car later found to be valued below 8k even in great condition. The car had issues from the start and instead of returning it to the friend that sold it to him, he was casual about the mechanical concerns until they progressed to a point that it couldn't be ignored. On top of that, I looked up the VIN and found it was a salvage title, depreciating the resell value significantly. He paid the seller, his friend, $500 for registering something that I discovered was $50. My husband could have discovered this too with a simple internet search. We both know little about cars and I felt going into something like this would be setting us up for failure and leaving me with constant anxiety, watching every business move.

He now wants to own a trucking company. I know some people who do this so thought it would be an OK venture. I did not want to end up being the one doing all of the work because I also work and this is a lot of pressure. I agreed to learn to dispatch, but want us to learn more about owning a business in general before going into it.



Luminous said:


> If you are aware of things he may be facing but doesn't realize, can you sit down and draw out (maybe literally) a mud map of what may be required with regards to skills in this endeavour together?


I've tried to show him before. I downloaded apps on both of our phones to help refresh our math and Excel skills. We would go through it together, like taking a class together and it was enjoyable for both of us at first. After 3 times, he tired of it and stopped. Maybe I can ask him if we can take some of the free classes the community offers?


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## Anastasia6 (May 28, 2017)

What job does your husband currently hold?


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## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

I think you should go your separate ways. You don't think very highly of him, and he should not have to live life with a wife who regards him that way.


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## Inbetween (May 28, 2020)

EleGirl said:


> Besides the issues of his communications skills and enunciation, what are some examples of things that you believe mean that he's not very smart?


Several bad financial decisions, not being wise or observant. I realize now it's mostly lack of street smarts that concerns me when compared to book smarts.
Some financial examples- he bought a car without doing his research and ended up overpaying thousands for a vehicle with a salvage title. He also secretly accrued thousands of dollars worth of debt in loans and credit cards. This almost drove us to divorce, with his aunt agreeing that would be a good decision if he didn't try to fix his mistake. I had to pull the credit report for him to even know how much debt he had. He was out there just paying with ccards instead of the debit and got a huge loan to help his friend. He then let the friend pay it back on his own schedule instead of the bank's schedule, hurting the credit we worked hard to build. Some charges reflected several cash advances. Who does cash advances on a credit card? 
Before this, he put a deposit down for a new car at a dealership that was an hour away from our home. Instead of researching for the best deal, he popped into a dealership during his commute, saw something he liked and I'm certain the salesman talked him into putting a deposit down or he was flexing for his carpool buddy. Instead of taking the time to do his homework, he would have been able to see there were several dealers closer to us, with the same car. He didn't even look around for the best offer. I had him get the deposit back and do his research before getting a new car. He needed a car because of the issue of him being swindled on the other one.


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## Inbetween (May 28, 2020)

Mr The Other said:


> I was a working class lad in the UK.
> Pretty much every girl I went out with thought she was smarter than me as a given. Part of this was when I would suggest things, they ofter know they were wrong. A few years later, I had a PhD, highly paid senior jobs, which had included IQ tests that I went off the scale with, and suddenly the women I went out with thought I was smarter than them. I started to meet women who would not get what I meant, but would try to understand. It is funny how things change.
> I am not sure people are as good at judging their partners intellect or communication as they often think.
> 
> I think the key thing is that you want someone to look up to and he is putting you in the opposite role.


Yes, thank you, and I want to be able to come to him for a change. I don't want to worry anymore. It's taxing.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

He is an absolute mess when it comes to financial decisions and should be kept away from any business dealings.

I would be upset as well but I don't think your original post actually covered the problems.

You cannot really start life and family with someone this irresponsible and reckless.

He really does need to be babysat and I believe you made a mistake.

I didn't graduate high school but was more grown up than this guy at age 21.


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## secretsheriff (May 6, 2020)

I would say that marrying a man after 2 months who you obviously have no respect for isn't very smart either. Just saying…


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

I was married for decades to a man who was brilliant. Very high IQ. Extremely successful in his career. Greatly admired in the community. But no street smarts whatsoever. And an absolute disaster when it came to financial decisions. There are obviously all kinds of people. You have to decide if he’s really what you want.


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## Inbetween (May 28, 2020)

TJW said:


> Dr. Phil has a wonderful saying....."...there are times we make the right decision.....but sometimes, we have to make the decision right...."
> 
> Uhhhh..... no, and no....
> Yes, you can change your anger and sadness. And, you are putting yourself in the mother/teacher role.
> You need to change it, and stop it. Today.


I'm afraid. I would love to put the responsibility back on him, but don't want to risk the little we have by doing so. I want to trust him enough to do this.



TJW said:


> This statement, right here, is the nagging-spouse analog of the adulterous spouse "....I love you, but I'm not in love with you...", and of the Southern US "...He's a good ole boy..."
> 
> You need to thoroughly remove yourself from the mother/teacher role, and become a CHEERLEADER. He doesn't lack motivation, he feels disparaged and criticized. Making him feel stupid is exactly what you are doing, although you say you don't want to. If you don't want to, why are you doing it? You obviously feel quite superior to him.


He's great in a lot of ways and worthy of love. I really want to work up to being his cheerleader all the time. It took a lot of empty promises of him saying he'll work on this or that and giving up for me to start the 'tough love' route. Maybe not tough love, but less of "It's ok, this is how we'll fix this." Now it's more of "This is how your bad decisions, lack of motivation, etc is affecting our marriage (or affecting me) and it's not ok."


TJW said:


> And, no, you don't want him to better himself, you want him to be better_ for you_. Your "anger and sadness" shows that.


I want him to be better for US. For me, for him and my stepchildren. I don't know how he'll be good at this business if he's not willing to improve his knowledge. It's his dream. I don't want him to fail.



TJW said:


> So, what ???? You, in your own words, state that you did not need to graduate from college to become successful and good at your job. I agree that people can achieve well without a college degree, even without ever attending a college..... So, why does your husband need a superior college to achieve ? He has an inferior intellect ?? This is what you "tell" him, in your words and actions ......


It was not about the status of the college that caused me to mention that they were behind. Being a college drop out made me feel like I was behind my peers and envious of those who could afford to finish. I felt a complete college education prepared people in ways I would never now.

His own did not provide him several of the skills needed for the real world -- how to create a resume, typing skills, financial know how, etc. I asked why does he keep having me do these things, didn't he have to do this in college? That's when he disclosed he didn't think it was a good school.



TJW said:


> You are the most important person in your husband's life. Bar none. You can make him, or break him..... the choice is yours....


Thank you, I will keep remembering this and try to be worthy of it. It's my first marriage and his second. I want to be a better wife and be less stressed. I want to learn this skill of making him without raising him. Is that even possible?


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## Inbetween (May 28, 2020)

ConanHub said:


> Umm..... Do you love him?
> 
> Did you ever?


I really do love him, but it feels different. The issues presented make me not trust him with out future, leaving me always on guard and resentful.


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## Anastasia6 (May 28, 2017)

Ok so I have some different thinking on this. I've been around dreamers and pie in the sky people who then have no drive or intelligence to figure out what they 'want' isn't going to work.


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## Anastasia6 (May 28, 2017)

The car thing is pretty bad considering he wanted to flip cars for a business.


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## Inbetween (May 28, 2020)

MattMatt said:


> Hey, @Inbetween! Well done! You are working very hard to improve and 'better' your husband.
> 
> But when do you start working on you to improve you and to 'better' yourself?


I would like to think this is a first step, getting other's opinions instead of staying in my bubble. Also being able to vent a little so it doesn't just direct at him. I asked him if we could go to couples counseling so we could learn how to communicate and work on our issues. We both aren't perfect. It's been empty promises until I pushed the issue further and he finally said no. He thinks it's best just to talk to the elders in our family. I'm going to explore it on my own.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Inbetween said:


> I really do love him, but it feels different. The issues presented make me not trust him with out future, leaving me always on guard and resentful.


After your further enlightenment on the subject, I agree with you 100%.


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## Inbetween (May 28, 2020)

Anastasia6 said:


> Ok so I have some different thinking on this. I've been around dreamers and pie in the sky people who then have no drive or intelligence to figure out what they 'want' isn't going to work.


I would say 'dreamer' is a good word to describe him. A lot less now, but in the beginning there was much of that. He would dream and fast for a few days. 
He does mostly physical work and some admin at his job. He's a real work horse. He has an excellent work ethic for a company, but would like for him to have that same drive to make moves for himself. Someone in their late 40's can't do that type of physical work forever and it's starting to wear on his body. I feel if he improved on his other skills, not just the physical ones, he would have more options and be able to successfully own his own business.


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## Inbetween (May 28, 2020)

SpinyNorman said:


> Mark Twain said "We are all ignorant, just about different things."
> 
> Since his knowledge seems to make a difference to you, it was a huge mistake to skip figuring out what he knew. Assuming a degree would tell you what he knew is an equally big mistake.
> 
> Assuming the mother/teacher role would be an even bigger mistake. Why don't you try to appreciate what he does know, instead of worrying about what he doesn't?


Agreed on all points here.


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## secretsheriff (May 6, 2020)

Inbetween said:


> *Thank you, I will keep remembering this and try to be worthy of it. It's my first marriage and his second. I want to be a better wife and be less stressed. I want to learn this skill of making him without raising him. Is that even possible?*


It's not your job to make him.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Inbetween said:


> He now wants to own a trucking company. I know some people who do this so thought it would be an OK venture. I did not want to end up being the one doing all of the work because I also work and this is a lot of pressure. I agreed to learn to dispatch, *but want us to learn more about owning a business in general before going into it.*


Get in touch with the Small Business Administration (SBA) office where you live. They have online and in person classes. They can teach you how to write a business plan, run a business, etc.

When I was in college one of my classes had the students do projects with the SBA. They broke us up in teams and then we were assigned an SBA consultant. Each team worked with a small business that was trying to startup. What was interesting is that most of the people trying to start a new business ended up not doing it because through the process they learned that business startup is a LOT of work. It's generally much more work than a 9-5 job.

Those who continued with their business development learned a lot and did well in business.

A lot of universities & colleges also have continuing education classes to help people with starting up and running a business.



Inbetween said:


> I've tried to show him before. I downloaded apps on both of our phones to help refresh our math and Excel skills. We would go through it together, like taking a class together and it was enjoyable for both of us at first. After 3 times, he tired of it and stopped. Maybe I can ask him if we can take some of the free classes the community offers?


Yep, tell him to take classes for everything he wants to learn. It's often not a good idea for one spouse to try to be the teacher of another spouse.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Inbetween said:


> It was not about the status of the college that caused me to mention that they were behind. Being a college drop out made me feel like I was behind my peers and envious of those who could afford to finish. I felt a complete college education prepared people in ways I would never now.
> 
> His own did not provide him several of the skills needed for the real world -- how to create a resume, typing skills, financial know how, etc. I asked why does he keep having me do these things, didn't he have to do this in college? That's when he disclosed he didn't think it was a good school.


What was your husband's major in college?

What year did he graduate from college?

What career field does he work in now?


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Inbetween said:


> I would say 'dreamer' is a good word to describe him. A lot less now, but in the beginning there was much of that. He would dream and fast for a few days.
> He does mostly physical work and some admin at his job. He's a real work horse. He has an excellent work ethic for a company, but would like for him to have that same drive to make moves for himself. Someone in their late 40's can't do that type of physical work forever and it's starting to wear on his body. I feel if he improved on his other skills, not just the physical ones, he would have more options and be able to successfully own his own business.


Are you pushing him to own his own business? Or is the business his idea?


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## marcy* (Feb 27, 2010)

EleGirl said:


> Yep, tell him to take classes for everything he wants to learn. It's often not a good idea for one spouse to try to be the teacher of another spouse.


True or she is going to end up like me who does all the computer work for my husband. I helped him even with email , Fb, Insta accounts, resume, etc. I made him lazy volunteering to help him with everything. Oh I have to remember all his passwords too, or he is going to throw a tantrum.🤦‍♀️


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## Inbetween (May 28, 2020)

EleGirl said:


> What was your husband's major in college?
> 
> What year did he graduate from college?
> 
> What career field does he work in now?


He got an Agriculture degree about 20 years ago. It's been about 18 years since he's left that field. He currently works in a warehouse.


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## Inbetween (May 28, 2020)

EleGirl said:


> Are you pushing him to own his own business? Or is the business his idea?


It's his idea.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

marcy* said:


> True or she is going to end up like me who does all the computer work for my husband. I helped him even with email , Fb, Insta accounts, resume, etc. I made him lazy volunteering to help him with everything. Oh I have to remember all his passwords too, or he is going to throw a tantrum.🤦‍♀️


I hope that you are legally an equal partner in this business.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Inbetween said:


> He got an Agriculture degree about 20 years ago. It's been about 18 years since he's left that field. He currently works in a warehouse.


If you don't mind sharing, what college/university did he get his degree from?


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## Inbetween (May 28, 2020)

I don't feel comfortable providing details about the school or location, but it's outside the US. The citizens get free University if they serve in the military.


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## secretsheriff (May 6, 2020)

As you help with classes, how do you plan to address you obvious condescending lack of respect for him?

If we can see it, I guarantee he feels it.


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## Inbetween (May 28, 2020)

Inbetween said:


> I don't feel comfortable providing details about the school or location, but it's outside the US. The citizens get free University if they serve in the military.


Also, the credits didn't transfer to our local university.


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## Mr The Other (Feb 1, 2014)

Inbetween said:


> Several bad financial decisions, not being wise or observant. I realize now it's mostly lack of street smarts that concerns me when compared to book smarts.
> Some financial examples- he bought a car without doing his research and ended up overpaying thousands for a vehicle with a salvage title. He also *secretly accrued thousands of dollars worth of deb*t in loans and credit cards. This almost drove us to divorce, with his aunt agreeing that would be a good decision if he didn't try to fix his mistake. I had to pull the credit report for him to even know how much debt he had. He was out there just paying with ccards instead of the debit and got a huge loan to help his friend. He then let the friend pay it back on his own schedule instead of the bank's schedule, hurting the credit we worked hard to build. Some charges reflected several cash advances. Who does cash advances on a credit card?
> Before this, he put a deposit down for a new car at a dealership that was an hour away from our home. Instead of researching for the best deal, he popped into a dealership during his commute, saw something he liked and I'm certain the salesman talked him into putting a deposit down or he was flexing for his carpool buddy. Instead of taking the time to do his homework, he would have been able to see there were several dealers closer to us, with the same car. He didn't even look around for the best offer. I had him get the deposit back and do his research before getting a new car. He needed a car because of the issue of him being swindled on the other one.


The secrecy is another more serious matter.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Inbetween said:


> It was not about the status of the college that caused me to mention that they were behind. Being a college drop out made me feel like I was behind my peers and envious of those who could afford to finish. I felt a complete college education prepared people in ways I would never now.


I don't think you understand what a college degree is about. 



Inbetween said:


> His own did not provide him several of the skills needed for the real world -- how to create a resume, typing skills, financial know how, etc.


Most universities/colleges do not teach these things. What they teach is the basis of their major. 

20 years ago, a person did not really need to know how to type to get a degree in agriculture. Most do not teach how to write a resume or how to job hunt, though many do have some sort of student support in these areas. But it's not part of the college curriculum.

The curriculum for a degree in agriculture does not teach financial management. Very few degrees do teach financial management, how to run a business, etc. Mostly degrees in business management, financial management and accounting teach these types of topics. 

A degree in agriculture teaches about growing crops, plants, etc.



Inbetween said:


> I asked why does he keep having me do these things, didn't he have to do this in college? That's when he disclosed he didn't think it was a good school.


 The issues you are talking about have nothing to do with him having a college degree. He's not even using much of what he learned when he earned a degree in agriculture.

If he needs to know how to type, how to use excel, write a resume, job hunt, financial management, how to speak English properly, and business management, etc. there are tons of organizations, online courses, etc. that teach all of that.

You are criticizing him for not knowing how to do things that you know how to do. I'll bet that there is a lot that he does on is job that you have no clue of how to do.

If he is not willing to learn from you and/or you do not like teaching him, then tell him to take classes. You can find the source and give him a list of what to look for.

What would be needed for him to advance in the job he has now? Could he take some classes to learn how to supervise or become a manager? That might be a better path for him that starting a business.

All that said, you husband's decisions with over paying for cars is very troublesome. He seems to lack common sense. Keep in mind that most people who have successful businesses failed about 10 times with startup businesses before they go it right. The best teacher out there is failure.

Did your husband learn from his bad choices in over paying for cars, not checking info on the cars, etc?


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Inbetween said:


> Several bad financial decisions, not being wise or observant. I realize now it's mostly lack of street smarts that concerns me when compared to book smarts.


From the things you have said, it's more than street smarts that he lacks. 



Inbetween said:


> Some financial examples- he bought a car without doing his research and ended up overpaying thousands for a vehicle with a salvage title. He also *secretly accrued thousands of dollars worth of deb*t in loans and credit cards. This almost drove us to divorce, with his aunt agreeing that would be a good decision if he didn't try to fix his mistake.
> 
> I had to pull the credit report for him to even know how much debt he had. He was out there just paying with ccards instead of the debit and *got a huge loan to help his friend.* He then let the friend pay it back on his own schedule instead of the bank's schedule, hurting the credit we worked hard to build.


Has his friend paid off the loan yet? 

My take on this is that your husband took out the loan to help his friend without telling you and getting your agreement. This is 100% unacceptable.

Do you now check your husband's credit report monthly to make sure you know what he's doing since he cannot be trusted?



Inbetween said:


> Some charges reflected several cash advances. Who does cash advances on a credit card?


 A lot of people get cash advances on credit cards. Credit card companies encourage it because they make more money that way.

What percentage of your joint income do you earn?

I think that your characterization about the issues you have with your husband is wrong. This is why at first a lot of others were basically put you down. The problem is not that your husband is not smarter than you. People have different levels of intelligence in different areas. His intelligence is in areas that are different than those areas that you are intelligent about.

Your real problem with him is that he is financially irresponsible, has run up debt without your knowledge and your agreement, and he lies to you and hides things from you. He has very little respect for you as these things show. Also, he wants to do things like start a business but does not seem motivated to put in the time to learn how to run a business.

I'm not sure why you would want to stay married to this guy. He does not respect you. You don't respect him for what looks like good reasons.


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## marcy* (Feb 27, 2010)

EleGirl said:


> I hope that you are legally an equal partner in this business.


Not equal. Anyway is the accountant who does most of the work. I do what he is supposed to do himself.


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## Inbetween (May 28, 2020)

EleGirl said:


> I don't think you understand what a college degree is about.
> 
> Most universities/colleges do not teach these things. What they teach is the basis of their major.
> 
> ...


I'm aware of what the degree does, but am barely learning not all schools give students similar studies in basic life skills.

The first year of the one I attended taught things such as interviewing for a job, presentation, resume writing, math, writing, etc. I was going for an Arts degree but the first year covered these subjects. Many students didn't like this first year of 'basics' and found it a waste of tuition when they came to school to learn about art.

If his school or current life experience didn't teach certain skills, I would hope he'd be motivated to learn them on his own. Is that unreasonable? Someone said I can't expect him to do what I would do, then be hurt if he doesn't do it. I get that, but I don't get the lack of motivation. Maybe I'm expecting too much? Or being gullible to believe he will put actions behind his words? I want to understand.



EleGirl said:


> If he is not willing to learn from you and/or you do not like teaching him, then tell him to take classes. You can find the source and give him a list of what to look for.


We've done this and investigated if his credits would transfer, which they didn't. I've shown him Khan Academy, learning through Youtube videos, phone apps, etc. He doesn't take the initiative to complete anything after he starts. Our bank offers free financial classes and I'm hoping one day he will attend one with me. It hasn't happened yet. I feel like I'm doing my part trying to help him and he's not committing. Maybe I make it too easy for him? I really want to understand how someone can have an idea and free resources, but not take a step to use them. I asked him once if he was afraid of failing or if he just wasn't sure of what he wanted. He said that wasn't it. I'm lost at this point.



EleGirl said:


> What would be needed for him to advance in the job he has now? Could he take some classes to learn how to supervise or become a manager? That might be a better path for him that starting a business.


I agree, he's great at his job. Working on his communication skills would be helpful. Sharpening his typing skills. That's just based on what I've seen him do for work. He wants to work for himself and have something to pass on to his kids.



EleGirl said:


> All that said, you husband's decisions with over paying for cars is very troublesome. He seems to lack common sense. Keep in mind that most people who have successful businesses failed about 10 times with startup businesses before they go it right. The best teacher out there is failure.
> 
> Did your husband learn from his bad choices in over paying for cars, not checking info on the cars, etc?


He definitely knows more about cars now, but his current car was negotiated by myself so I haven't seen it put into action yet. Recent events not mentioned here led me to the original post. It's more of the same- lack of urgency when it comes to protecting our finances and not making wise decisions.

We contribute equally to the household but can make it on one income. Correction: Before the debt, we could make it on one income. Sometimes I wonder if this is why he is so comfortable and unmotivated- because I will step in and pick up the slack. We met about a year after his divorce and she took everything. We've talked about me not working so we can spend more time together and his kids can stay for the holidays/vacations. I refuse to quit working until we resolve our issues and pay off the debt.


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## Inbetween (May 28, 2020)

I've been trying and failing to get the formatting for replies just right. Apologies if it doesn't make sense.


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## Inbetween (May 28, 2020)

secretsheriff said:


> As you help with classes, how do you plan to address you obvious condescending lack of respect for him?
> 
> If we can see it, I guarantee he feels it.


Am I ticked off for the things he's done? You bet. Hopefully he'll forgive me for my tone the way I've forgiven his actions.
It's taken a lot to get to this point, but I don't want to stay here. I hate it here. The anger needs to go. And the fear. I'm hoping that will come with understanding and counseling. I picked him and can't be upset with that.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Inbetween said:


> I've been trying and failing to get the formatting for replies just right. Apologies if it doesn't make sense.


I edited your posts to fix the formatting. You can click on "edit" (see the three dots at the top right of your posts?) and edit your posts. If you do that you can see how I edited them to make the format work. 

Just put the "quote" tags one each paragraph or section of the post your are copying if you are breaking the quote up.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Inbetween said:


> I'm aware of what the degree does, but am barely learning not all schools give students similar studies in basic life skills.
> 
> The first year of the one I attended taught things such as interviewing for a job, presentation, resume writing, math, writing, etc. I was going for an Arts degree but the first year covered these subjects. Many students didn't like this first year of 'basics' and found it a waste of tuition when they came to school to learn about art.


Most degree programs have basic classes in the first two years for things like some basic math, maybe beginning algebra, writing, literature, etc. But most do not have classes in thing resume writing, typing, and finances like how to use checking accounts, etc.

Also, school systems in other countries are very different. So, it’s hard to know what classes he got in college. But what you have told use does not sound like a deficient college curriculum. It sounds like a guy who is not motivated to do much at all.



Inbetween said:


> If his school or current life experience didn't teach certain skills, I would hope he'd be motivated to learn them on his own. Is that unreasonable? Someone said I can't expect him to do what I would do, then be hurt if he doesn't do it. I get that, but I don't get the lack of motivation. Maybe I'm expecting too much? Or being gullible to believe he will put actions behind his words? I want to understand.


It's reasonable to hope that he would be motivated on his own to learn the things he needs to learn. It’s not unreasonable to hope for that.

However, you should not be hurt if he does not. Why? Because if you are hurt, it means that you are taking his lack of motivation as a personal reflection or affront on yourself. His lack of motivation has nothing to do with you. It’s just who he is. He’s a hard-working guy who is not motivated to do anything outside of his job. This is no unusual.

Basically, you are trying to change him into the person you want him to be. That’s not going to work. Understand that what you see in him is what you get. That’s who he is. You cannot change him. Either accept him for who he is, and love him for that, or leave him. Anything else is crazy making.

If he says he wants to start a business, give him info about the SBA and other places he can learn about business, then back off. Leave it up to him. If he never does what he needs to do, that’s on him.

Now his driving up debt, hiding debt and lying to you? Again, that’s who he is. If you stay with him, this is your life. You have accepted his bad behavior.

The only person you can change is yourself. So put your effort into yourself.



Inbetween said:


> We've done this and investigated if his credits would transfer, which they didn't. I've shown him Khan Academy, learning through Youtube videos, phone apps, etc. He doesn't take the initiative to complete anything after he starts. Our bank offers free financial classes and I'm hoping one day he will attend one with me. It hasn't happened yet. I feel like I'm doing my part trying to help him and he's not committing. Maybe I make it too easy for him? I really want to understand how someone can have an idea and free resources, but not take a step to use them. I asked him once if he was afraid of failing or if he just wasn't sure of what he wanted. He said that wasn't it. I'm lost at this point.


The reason a person can have an idea and free resources and not take a step use them is that he really does not want to do the business. It’s all talk. So, ignore the talk. Go do your own thing. If there ever is a day when he starts doing the work he needs to do, then you can be there to work with him.



Inbetween said:


> I agree, he's great at his job. Working on his communication skills would be helpful. Sharpening his typing skills. That's just based on what I've seen him do for work. He wants to work for himself and have something to pass on to his kids.


If he needs to learn to type better, there are online courses for typing. Just suggest one of them and leave the rest to him.

If you wants something to leave his kids, he can do it by saving money and investing it. The best thing he can give his children is a chance for a good education so that they can build their own lives.



Inbetween said:


> He definitely knows more about cars now, but his current car was negotiated by myself so I haven't seen it put into action yet. Recent events not mentioned here led me to the original post. It's more of the same- lack of urgency when it comes to protecting our finances and not making wise decisions.


Is this really the life you want? Do you really want to spend your life having to deal with this? If you do, you are going to end up in deep debt with nothing. Is this really what you want?



Inbetween said:


> We contribute equally to the household but can make it on one income. Correction: Before the debt, we could make it on one income. Sometimes I wonder if this is why he is so comfortable and unmotivated- because I will step in and pick up the slack.


Yep, why should he do anything more than he absolutely needs to because you will do it all.



Inbetween said:


> We met about a year after his divorce and she took everything.


Um, she took it all? How much do you really know about the divorce? There are laws about the percentage of assets and liabilities that each spouse gets in the divorce. One spouse does not get it all… unless the other just capitulates. This sounds like more of him not wanting to put out the effort need.



Inbetween said:


> We've talked about me not working so we can spend more time together and his kids can stay for the holidays/vacations. I refuse to quit working until we resolve our issues and pay off the debt.


You quitting your job so he can support you sounds like a very bad idea.


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## SpinyNorman (Jan 24, 2018)

Reading your first post I thought you were saying his intelligence(for lack of a better word that would be harder to type) was causing you to not feel attracted to him, and I felt like "How did you not notice that before marriage?". Also, maybe you were judging him.

Reading later posts, it sounds like you are concerned about his financial sense and career ambitions, and those you're not as involved with before marriage. They also affect you regardless of your mindset. So thanks for clearing it up, if I can think of career advice I will post it. It sounds like you're talking, encourage that. If you have to tell him something is a bad idea, say it in a way that doesn't discourage him from keeping you in the loop.


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

I agree with Ele — don’t ever put yourself in the position of being financially dependent on him. That would be a very big mistake. My husband made several times more annually than I did but he also made bad financial decisions so I always worked. I wanted to be able to support myself. You need to as well.


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## TJW (Mar 20, 2012)

Inbetween said:


> I don't want to stay here. I hate it here. The anger needs to go. And the* fear*. I'm hoping that will come with understanding and counseling. I picked him and can't be upset with that.


I'm going to give you something that helped me, in my own life.... in fact, it was a "turning point"...it was counseling, from which I developed understanding....

I heard a radio preacher on my way to work say this..... _"God can redeem your failure, but not your fear" -_

Fear is why you're angry, and fear is why you "hate it here".... and, it's good that you "don't want to stay here".....but you are getting stuck.....

Please know this.... that God WILL redeem your husband's failure....don't be an overprotective mother.... that comes from fear, too....

and, one of the ways God can overcome your fear, is when you trust in HIM to be your "lead" instead of your husband.... let HIM be the parent to your husband.... let HIM be your support, your "rock", the one you "look up" to, when your husband fails at it.....see, God never fails....He won't fail you, and He won't fail to teach your husband to take on his role in your marriage.....

if you want to know exactly how this is done, take a read at *Proverbs 31*. It's a short chapter, you can read it in 5 minutes, maybe less... this is perfect love...it don't get any better than this...



EleGirl said:


> You quitting your job so he can support you sounds like a very bad idea.


That's an extremely bad idea. If you are afraid now ? Think of what it's going to be like when you can't support yourself and are totally dependent ? And, over time, as you stay home, you'll become less and less employable if you need to return to work.


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## GC1234 (Apr 15, 2020)

My husband didn't go to college at all, and he's very smart in his own way. He's just not patient for paperwork and books. I wouldn't worry about it. I also translate things for him and have to make most of the phonecalls (related to bills, etc) b/c he doesn't speak the language that well... but If he treats you well, then don't let it eat at you.


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