# Father/daughter crisis



## Axete (Jan 4, 2016)

My husband and I have been together for 10 years and have 2 kids. A 9yo daughter and a 5yo son.

My husband and daughter haven't really gotten along for nearly a year now and it hurts to see them this way. She was a sick baby and he was so possessive over her. As a toddler she was daddy's little girl who could do no wrong. I was jealous of their relationship. But now, it seems everything she does isn't good enough for him. 
He picks on her constantly, telling her to grow up, get over things and be someone I think she isn't mature enough to be yet and he does this through yelling and frustration. She cries all the time now, which makes things worse. I can see her happy bubbling self diminish each day and it hurts so much. But I'm torn between helping her and being the supportive wife (which I am often told I'm not). Even when she brought home a prestigous award from school, he did congratulate her, then told her she needed to work harder to get an even higher one next year. Her self pride in her award faded immediately despite my efforts to keep her happy about it. I wanted to take her out as a reward, but she didn't think she deserved it. Needless to say that ended with an argument between my husband and I. I have tried everything to help them, but to no avail.


With our son though, he is apparently perfect in the his eyes. My daughter and son don't get along well either and when they argue, my husband twists what happens to turn into our daughters fault. Even when I point it out, he will say something that hurts her. I tell him all the time to leave her alone.

This is the first time I have written this down, and even I can see how unhealthy this situation is. I know he loves her. And he is a good husband and I don't want to leave him, but I know something has to change and I will leave him if it meant she can be happy again. 

I would appreciate any advice on what to do.


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

If I were you, I would defend my daughter every single time. And I would urge your husband to get counseling for his emotional abuse of your daughter, maybe even demand it.

My concern with your divorcing him is that at her age, a judge would still insist she spend time with him. Right now she has your protection. Without you there, he would be free to abuse her at will.


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## Emerald (Aug 2, 2012)

You husband is abusive to your daughter.

I think he may be to you also. You do say he accuses you of not being a supportive wife. Just to clarify, supportive wives do not allow anyone to abuse their children, even the Father.

Why were you jealous of their relationship when your daughter was younger?

You can seek counseling alone if your husband won't go.


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

jld said:


> If I were you, I would defend my daughter every single time. And I would urge your husband to get counseling for his emotional abuse of your daughter, maybe even demand it.
> 
> My concern with your divorcing him is that at her age, a judge would still insist she spend time with him. Right now she has your protection. Without you there, he would be free to abuse her at will.


Abuse?
He praised her, but mentioned he still wanted her to raise the bar and he is an abuser?

Does anyone actually read what people write?

Please, OP, dad's are not perfect. Try having a positive attitude and really working in a different way on a problem that means a lot to you.
Maybe get a counselor or someone involved to help you change his behavior. I assure you, if he's hurting your daughter or you, he doesn't mean to. You just need to show him in a way he'll understand so he can adjust his responses and such. 

Treat him in a way that shows him you love and respect him and I'll bet he'll respond.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Evinrude58 said:


> Abuse?
> He praised her, but mentioned he still wanted her to raise the bar and he is an abuser?
> 
> Does anyone actually read what people write?
> ...



I suppose you missed this part:

"He picks on her constantly, telling her to grow up, get over things and be someone I think she isn't mature enough to be yet and he does this through yelling and frustration."


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

EleGirl said:


> I suppose you missed this part:
> 
> "He picks on her constantly, telling her to grow up, get over things and be someone I think she isn't mature enough to be yet and he does this through yelling and frustration."


I didn't miss it. But her premier example of him "picking on her" is praising her, then telling her he wants her to work harder and do even better next year".

If that's her worst example of picking at her or "abuse", I'm not impressed.

Them again, he did jump on his wife in the most vulgar manner and tell her she "wasn't supportive". What am animal! Yes, kick him to the curb. I was wrong.
There are two sides to every story. I'd like to hear more examples of the guy's abuse before I'm ready to jump in and tell her to divorce him like other posters.
Is that fair?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Axete (Jan 4, 2016)

The award example was the most recent. She is an exemplary student and at the top her class. He holds her to a height she isn't ready to reach. He reminds her that if she doesn't do well now, she won't do well later. I personally think he puts too much pressure on her. Pushing her to read large books and studying on weekends. She's only 9 and should be outside riding bikes and climbing trees!

He very rarely talks to her without being frustrated. General sibling rivalry always seems to be her fault, no matter what happened. And no matter if I point out the obvious shes still wrong and I'm on "her side". 

If she makes a mistake, like spilling a drink, or forgetting to put the bathroom on the floor, he'll say in an angry tone - "what's wrong with her?", "why doesn't she learn?", "do you like living in a pig sty?" And occasionally "is there something wrong with her brain?" Then he'll be angry with her for a hour or more. And when I say it's ok, it's an easy clean up he'll say I'm on her side and never back him up. 

Right now as I write this he's yelling at her to clean her brothers room properly. When I said they were both playing and should do it together he says she "knows better". I said it was ok, I will help them do it, he said she needs to learn to clean properly. I'll be going back in after this to distract him so he will leave and I can help them.


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## Axete (Jan 4, 2016)

We can't afford counseling at the moment. But even if we could he would never go. He believes family disputes should be kept private. He wouldn't be impressed to find me on here seeking advice.


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## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

Kids don't magically raise themselves. They have parents. There is no shame or harm in challenging them to meet realistic performance goals or to aspire to behavior that is better than that currently displayed. Nine year olds soon become 14 year olds and childish, selfish, or lazy behaviors are no longer funny or cute. You've got about nine more years to transform your child into a productive, law-abiding adult. If your kid doesn't occasionally think you're mean you're not doing it right. Schools hand out awards for maintaining a pulse. If your child is capable of "A+" work but brings home B+ work, that's not cause for great celebration and someone needs to challenge and encourage her to aspire to full potential. Since no two people are alike, it would be rather astonishing if he related to his two children the same. I would expect more from a 9 year old than I would a 5 year old and I think most reasonable people would. What's acceptable and cute at 5 isn't at 9. 

If you didn't think your husband was a pretty great guy you probably wouldn't have married him. He was an acceptable enough parent to make a second child with and to keep around as the father of your kid(s) for 9 years. As you believe your daughter is quite successful in school, whatever you both are doing is apparently working. She cries and complains. That's not lethal and it's pretty common among young females. He shouldn't be treating a healthy 9 year old daughter the same way he treated a sickly infant or toddler. Part of his job is to make her independent, strong, and responsible. If he did not care he would adopt the far easier position of constant coddling and affirmation that creates 30 year old women who still live with their parents and are unable to manage their own lives. This child has two parents. One doesn't think she's capable of behaving in a more mature fashion but that is just one opinion. Perhaps your husband also knows his own daughter and has reason to believe she can. I don't believe anyone rises to greatness or even self-sufficiency without someone pushing them. Your daughter will change. She's supposed to. She's not supposed to act at 9 as she did when she was a happy, bubbly, 6 year old. Her teachers certainly expect her to mature and they won't appreciate or encourage emotional immaturity. 

When I was around 9 or 10, my dad and my grandfather both rode me pretty hard, expected more out of me than I thought was reasonable. The result of all that "abuse" is that I easily managed my own life, supported my family, raised decent kids, served my country, paid my bills and taxes, was never a burden on society and have been handed loads of responsibility every day since I was 18. Never had to really look for work, learned how to give my best in exchange for a paycheck. Generally, I developed into someone they and my own kids could be proud of. I didn't learn that in school or in the military. Got it from the father figures in my life and frequently over the objections of my mother who thought they were being too harsh. Thank God they didn't roll over and allow me to be coddled into adulthood.


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## Axete (Jan 4, 2016)

unbelievable said:


> Kids don't magically raise themselves. They have parents. There is no shame or harm in challenging them to meet realistic performance goals or to aspire to behavior that is better than that currently displayed. Nine year olds soon become 14 year olds and childish, selfish, or lazy behaviors are no longer funny or cute. You've got about nine more years to transform your child into a productive, law-abiding adult. If your kid doesn't occasionally think you're mean you're not doing it right. Schools hand out awards for maintaining a pulse. If your child is capable of "A+" work but brings home B+ work, that's not cause for great celebration and someone needs to challenge and encourage her to aspire to full potential. Since no two people are alike, it would be rather astonishing if he related to his two children the same. I would expect more from a 9 year old than I would a 5 year old and I think most reasonable people would. What's acceptable and cute at 5 isn't at 9.
> 
> If you didn't think your husband was a pretty great guy you probably wouldn't have married him. He was an acceptable enough parent to make a second child with and to keep around as the father of your kid(s) for 9 years. As you believe your daughter is quite successful in school, whatever you both are doing is apparently working. She cries and complains. That's not lethal and it's pretty common among young females. He shouldn't be treating a healthy 9 year old daughter the same way he treated a sickly infant or toddler. Part of his job is to make her independent, strong, and responsible. If he did not care he would adopt the far easier position of constant coddling and affirmation that creates 30 year old women who still live with their parents and are unable to manage their own lives. This child has two parents. One doesn't think she's capable of behaving in a more mature fashion but that is just one opinion. Perhaps your husband also knows his own daughter and has reason to believe she can. I don't believe anyone rises to greatness or even self-sufficiency without someone pushing them. Your daughter will change. She's supposed to. She's not supposed to act at 9 as she did when she was a happy, bubbly, 6 year old. Her teachers certainly expect her to mature and they won't appreciate or encourage emotional immaturity.
> 
> When I was around 9 or 10, my dad and my grandfather both rode me pretty hard, expected more out of me than I thought was reasonable. The result of all that "abuse" is that I easily managed my own life, supported my family, raised decent kids, served my country, paid my bills and taxes, was never a burden on society and have been handed loads of responsibility every day since I was 18. Never had to really look for work, learned how to give my best in exchange for a paycheck. Generally, I developed into someone they and my own kids could be proud of. I didn't learn that in school or in the military. Got it from the father figures in my life and frequently over the objections of my mother who thought they were being too harsh. Thank God they didn't roll over and allow me to be coddled into adulthood.


I can see where you are coming from and I understand what you are saying. I do push her to aspire to be the best she can. But surely there is a limit to a 9yo? I don't think I coddle her at all and I'm sure she doesn't either. I do have higher expectations of her than a 5yo, but I find them to be at a reasonable standard for a 9yo. Just as we have expectations reasonable for our 5yo. Yes he is cute and he deals with his emotions way better than any 5yo I know. He can also take a joke in a manner I wouldn't expect for his age. They are treated different because of they are completely different. But there is a difference between treating them based on their personalities to obvious favourtism.

I have no doubt she has changed which follows the natual course for young girls. The overly emotional response, the it's not fair line and the "everything resolves around me" syndrome are all changes I expect her to go through - granted I wasn't expecting it this soon. But I do think that these changes, combined with her father's expectations of her, are too much for her handle emotionally. He can still play with her can't he? Show her as much love and attention as he does criticising her? Accepting her A+ work as cause for celebration, rather than treat it as second best because it isn't the highest.


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

Please follow your instincts, Axete. They are correct.

I think your husband is abusing both you and your daughter. Do not stand for it! Stand firm in what you know is right. 

Your husband is an unhealthy person. Have you ever asked him about why he feels the way he does? 

If you can listen and get him to share his deeper feelings, probably ones of fear and inadequacy, you might be able to help him start to heal. If he can learn to love and accept himself, he will likely be kinder to you and your daughter, too.

But if he continues to disrespect you and her, you will have to be firm and clear with him. You simply cannot allow him to disrespect you and her. It is a very bad example to your kids. What if your son were to grow up thinking it is okay to disrespect females?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Axete (Jan 4, 2016)

intheory said:


> Why does she clean her brother's room? Why doesn't the boy clean his own room? ETA: I see he is 5. But why is it her job to clean up after him? A nine year old can clean their own room. I don't see why she's responsible for anyone else in the household.
> 
> Please don't take offence, OP? But are you guys from a non-Western culture, in anyway? A culture that is okay with denigrating girls, valuing boys more, making girls clean up after boys etc. etc.
> 
> ...


They were playing and making the mess together and they were supposed to be cleaning it together. My husband got upset when they started arguing over where things go so he made her clean it up herself because she knows how to clean it properly. I was so upset with him. We taught both our kids as early as possible how to pick up after themselves. My 5yo is quite capable of cleaning up his own room.

No offense taken at all. No religion issues here. Cultural? I'm from Australia and my husband is from South Africa. I know how his family works. Not much different from what you've described. But i always stipulated that we would raise a strong independent girl and a good respectful boy. A concept he argreed to and was living by until this past year. I just don't know what has changed or how to fix it.

She is a wondeful little girl. So smart, well behaved, courteous and respectful. Always at hand to help. Well mannered and respectful to others. Uses her Ps & Qs, sirs & mams and excuse me. Both of them can. Just today my 5yo pointed out a lady having trouble with her shopping and dropped her handbag. He asked if we could help her and picked up her bag as I helped with her groceries. I am so proud of them. Which is why it hurts so much when my baby is so heartbroken from her fathers reactions towards her.


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

I'm not fully getting the picture. You say he's doing all these horrible things and I'm reading and just not seeing.

I'm thinking you are going to have to explain in terms he can understand, what the problem is that your'e having with his parenting tactics. I am just an onlooker, and I don't understand. 
You and others are saying he is "abusive" and I am just not seeing it. I see him as being actively involved in parenting and doing his best. 

Yes, a 9 year old is better at cleaning than a 5 year old. If they begin arguing, I don't see the problem with separating them and have her clean up. If she doesn't want to clean, don't play with the 5 year old and pull everything out. 

I think there is a problem, because this is eating at you. I don't think it's imagined. I do think that YOU have become antagonistic and analytical about every single thing your husband says to or about your daughter. YOU are no longer objective. YOU are not respecting his efforts to parent your kids. HE is doing something in a way that makes you protective and unhappy about your daughter. HE needs to start working with you and listening to you. Hearing and listening are different and men are HORRIBLE at it! I am. I'm admitting this. I'm telling you that he doesn't understand what he's doing wrong, and you have to help him see it in a logical manner. 

I'm just saying, you really need some kind of help to understand your husband and he needs help understanding your viewpoint, because this is creating friction between you. From what I've seen, the Dad is an active, loving parent. Yes, he may be unfair or too strict in your mind. You have got to find a way (I realize you're here for that and think that is awesome on your part) to figure this out. It's NOT ALL HIM, I can assure you, based on your comments.
You just have a different mindset than him. I suspect a happy median between the two of you may be best. Sounds like you have great kids! Do you think that is from BOTH of you being caring parents? It sounds like you do.

I sincerely wish I could help and will try to put some time thinking about how to go about it, since I'm thinking I may be guilty of doing some of the things your husband is.


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## Axete (Jan 4, 2016)

Evinrude58 said:


> I'm not fully getting the picture. You say he's doing all these horrible things and I'm reading and just not seeing.
> 
> I'm thinking you are going to have to explain in terms he can understand, what the problem is that your'e having with his parenting tactics. I am just an onlooker, and I don't understand.
> You and others are saying he is "abusive" and I am just not seeing it. I see him as being actively involved in parenting and doing his best.
> ...


I never called him abusive at all. That was used by other posters on here.

But I think you are right. Some of the blame has to lie with me also. Reading through your post has been an eye opener and I thank you for that. I suppose I've gotten so used to protecting her, it's all I do now without thinking. And although I continue to disagree with the tone he uses, some of his wording and do think he expects too much from her, I can see what he is trying to do. She IS changing and she's going through the emotions of that change. I can remember going through that time and I was a nightmare! Although I was older. I'm thinking he can't / doesn't understand this or know how to cope with it. Thank you for your comment. It has truly helped.

I still have to find a way in helping the both of them be able to communicate properly. And yes him and myself as well.


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

I think you've hit on something there. He is seeing her efforts and life through the eyes of an adult. She's not an adult. Sometimes kids that are very advanced for their age might seem to be more of an adult than they really are, causing their parents, or in this case parent, to try to push a little harder than they should. Dad wants results, wants your daughter to be happy, self sufficient, hard working, responsible. Let him know that you want that too, but to just try to back off a little and let you do deal with your daughter as far as the discipline for a while, because the way he is going about it is making both you and your daughter defensive, overly anxious, and just plain upset about it. Tell him you know it's not purposeful on his part and that you know he loves her. Ask him if there's some sort of cue you can give him so your daughter won't know, when he's going overboard. Then he can calm down and let you take over. Sometimes you might need to think about things from his perspective and back him up. That will make him feel more respected if he feels you supporting him--- a complaint he made and I feel is truly how he feels.
I'm still thinking further on this.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Axete said:


> We can't afford counseling at the moment. But even if we could he would never go. He believes family disputes should be kept private. He wouldn't be impressed to find me on here seeking advice.


No, YOU need to go to counseling. Not him. You need to learn how to stand up for yourself and how to defend your daughter in a healthy way that will make sense to HIM. Are you in the US? There are many many agencies who will help you get counseling free or at reduced rate. Start with United Way Worldwide. Or are you really just afraid of him seeing you go?

Also go to her school counselor and tell him/her what's going on so the counselor can start keeping an eye on her.

Aside from you getting professional help, you're going to need to figure out what happened to make him switch like this. It's possible he's scared, or he fears she won't like him, or he just doesn't know how to deal with an older child...have you tried asking?


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

:scratchhead:

What changed? And when? One doesn't just go from loving daddy to hard-ass overnight.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

I wondered that, too, but was afraid to ask.


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