# after an affair: enjoy shared hobbies or abandon them?



## dearhusband (Aug 22, 2011)

*Edited to include background from post 16. Turns out the affair story is unavoidable.
*Edited to warn readers. This has effectively become the thread of my story, and is 90% general advice for my situation rather than the topic I lead with. I envisioned starting another thread with my full story at a later date when I was ready to talk about it more... but it's clear I should be talking about it now... and responding to questions of me in this thread has made this thread about my story.

[Edited explanation of affair from post 16]
She was career driven and taken advantage of by someone twice her age with a lot of power over her when I had very little. She owns her decisions in this, but this kind of situation gets murky fast. In the first six months it was a clearly inappropriate but consensual relationship. She told me about it within two weeks of it starting and it was clearly affair fog. We were headed for divorce. They had true love, nothing felt like this before, yaddayadda. The reality started sinking in at 4 months. At the six month mark she ended it definitively and informed the employer. The employer took it seriously but the reporting relationship did not change. The work environment made that kind of impossible. He began intermittently harassing her, which she kept me informed about. This person continued to have huge control over her career (she was a researcher working in a private lab he directed). The harassment escalated to sex again, but no longer with any delusions of a romantic future. She was being used and knew it, but for a period hid it because she thought she had no choice if she didn't want her career ruined. Turns out employers take this kind of thing seriously. She now no longer works in the lab, got a golden parachute that unfortunately came with some tarnish to the reputation. It's still hard to quantify the impact to her career, but her job is taking a back seat relative to mine for the foreseeable future anyway. I can't say what the "confidential employment action" was for her supervisor, but I believe they canned him. There has been no contact with certainty for 10 months. 

She is committed to our relationship. This issue is not rug-swept. We talk about it all of the time. She is deeply remorseful. We are both in IC and MC. But the whole thing is a cluster to untangle emotionally. And here I was trying to just ask about the dogs.

[Rest of original post]

One thing that seems to be a major issue right now is being able to enjoy a hobby that was a big part of our shared lives pre-affair. I'm wondering if others have had the same problem. Did you have a hobby that was a major part of your pre-DDay marriage? Did you have trouble with it after reconciling? Could you ever really enjoy it with your spouse again?

My wife and I breed dogs and have been doing it seriously for the last 8 Years.* If you're serious and do it right it is a lot of time and work. Between training, showing, breeding management,* keeping the kennels clean and everything it is a lot of work. Not to mention I built all of our kennel and fencing which was no small task. Upkeep on a sizeable setup is not unlike a second job.

It is not a money maker. In fact it's a big net negative. But that's never been the point. It was something my wife was really passionate about and I took on as a hobby really because it was something we could enjoy together. I didn't live for it like she does, but I enjoyed our time together a lot. I love animals.

She had a very demanding job that put a lot of strain on her leading up to the affair. We are talking 70+ hours and a lot of stress. In that time I took most of the responsibility for taking care of the dogs and place. I didn't mind the ton of work because in a way it was a labor of love.

The fact that an affair began and endured through a period where I was literally putting tons of hours supporting our hobby and lives, because she was overburdened at work, in a way just really taints things for me. I didn't have an ounce more to love with. I was a loving husband, took her on dates, and did everything that could be done. Bah.

On the best days it feels like before the affair, but on the worst days it feels like a burden I just resent. This is something that is a major part of our shared lives and I just don't feel the same about it consistently.

Did any of you have a similar experience in reconciliation? Were you able to get the joy back, or did you have to abandon your shared interest? If you abandoned it what was the impact on your This is something that is a major part of our shared lives and I just don't feel the same about it right now. ?

I've told my wife the basic feeling and reasons and she's saddened and remorseful. We've even talked about stopping with the dogs, but I don't know what that would do to our marriage.

If you haven't been into a major hobby like dogs, a personal business, horses, or something else it's probably hard to understand. Wondering what others that are perhaps further down the road of reconciliation have experienced.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

You might feel resentment if you feel your wife used the hobby against you, set you up to have to tend to the dogs so she would have more time for her lover.

Is that the case?

Have you told your wife about this problem?


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

Personally, I would give up the dogs for now. Doing favors for someone that stabs you in the back in the worse way possible just seems like a little to much like being her b!tch.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

BTW, is there any contact now between her and her AP/boss? What consequences have they had?


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## dearhusband (Aug 22, 2011)

I don't think she used it against me or as a tactic to give herself time for the affair. We have discussed it a fair bit. She doesn't seem to understand how I relate this particular thing to the affair when it's been a part of our lives since long before.

Maybe it's more like me being home taking care of the kids during the affair and now that the affair is over i'm looking at things with the kids differently. The problem being dogs are dogs. I don't have a persisting love like one has for children... and now on some days I want to abandon the kids (dogs). We have no children FYI. This would be the right time for us, but we're waiting a few years because if the affair.

This was a tougher situation to describe than I thought it would be. We have this thing that's a big part of both of our lives, and I'm not sure I can separate it from the affair enough for it to continue being part of my life.


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## dearhusband (Aug 22, 2011)

Chaparral said:


> BTW, is there any contact now between her and her AP/boss? What consequences have they had?


No contact. Both careers messed up, his more than hers. In the first round of the affair consent was ambiguous. The second round was coercive and sexual harassment/battery, but she hid it for a while out of fear for her career. So more consequences for him than her, other than the stigma of being the person to report sexual harassment.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

dearhusband said:


> I don't think she used it against me or as a tactic to give herself time for the affair. We have discussed it a fair bit. She doesn't seem to understand how I relate this particular thing to the affair when it's been a part of our lives since long before.
> 
> Maybe it's more like me being home taking care of the kids during the affair and now that the affair is over i'm looking at things with the kids differently. The problem being dogs are dogs. I don't have a persisting love like one has for children... and now on some days I want to abandon the kids (dogs). We have no children FYI. This would be the right time for us, but we're waiting a few years because if the affair.
> 
> This was a tougher situation to describe than I thought it would be. We have this thing that's a big part of both of our lives, and I'm not sure I can separate it from the affair enough for it to continue being part of my life.


An affair kills the old marriage. Reconciliation, if it works, Creates a new marriage and a totally new dynamic. She's in effect asking you to give up so much of your time for her passion for dogs after showing you how little she thought of you and your sacrifice in time and effort that you put into her hobby. How many times were you tending the dogs while her boss was tending her instead of actually working?


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## dearhusband (Aug 22, 2011)

Chaparral said:


> How many times were you tending the dogs while her boss was tending her instead of actually working?


That's the exact thing that pops into my head whenever I'm out cleaning up dog crap or filling in holes in the run.

Puppies are fun and cute but that's only part of the day.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

First off you need the MMSLP book linked to below. Also google the NO MORE MISTER NICE GUY free edition and see if that applies to you. Another great book is LOVE MUST BE TOUGH by James Dobson http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_s...mes+dobson&sprefix=LOVE+MUST+BE+TOUGH,aps,185

How long have you been reconciling and how satisfied things are working out for you?


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

dearhusband said:


> That's the exact thing that pops into my head whenever I'm out cleaning up dog crap or filling in holes in the run.
> 
> Puppies are fun and cute but that's only part of the day.


Have you told her this or are you holding back. Its kind of like doing a hard job for someone when they didn't pay you for the last job. Its hard to stay motivated for someone that doesn't appreciate your effort. She certainly didn't reward your efforts during the affair.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Having a joint hobby is very healthy for a marriage.

But this one has become tainted.

I can see why you feel the way you do. She did not have the time to help you with the work of taking care of the dogs. But she had time for an affair. She did take advantage of you. If she did not have you keeping up everything with the dogs, she would not have been able to have he affair.

Could you find a less labor intensive way to stay in that hobby? One that allowed for the two of you to spend time together but that was not so much of a burden?

Or do you have something that you have always wanted to do that she could do with you? If so maybe sell all your dog stuff and start a new hobby-life.


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## harrybrown (May 22, 2013)

They do not work together anymore I hope?

So she took it underground?


I would stop everything with the dogs, and let her take care of it, it she wants. I would stop cleaning up the poop for her.

She has already fed you too many Shyt sandwiches.

Did she get tested for stds and has she given you a full timeline of the A? Sounds like some of it was exposed. How do you know she is not cheating now with someone else?

Is she transparent?

Good luck to you.


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## manfromlamancha (Jul 4, 2013)

I agree with harry brown! If she cannot see the link between you becoming tainted by this "hobby" and her sleeping with the POSOM while you carried the brunt of the workload with the dogs, then she really doesn't understand what she did to you so her remorse is questionable at best.

If I were you I would be focussing on myself at this stage. If the hobby is tainted, drop it immediately. If she wants to continue with it, then let it be just her. You need to focus on healing yourself.

You have granted her a big allowance in trying to reconcile - she should be falling over herself with remorse and actions to put things right. One of these things should be making sure that you heal properly and really, she should have got rid of this "hobby" as one of her first actions. Especially since she sees how it hurts you to be reminded of what went down (hence me questioning her "remorse").


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## VFW (Oct 24, 2012)

dearhusband said:


> I don't think she used it against me or as a tactic to give herself time for the affair. We have discussed it a fair bit. She doesn't seem to understand how I relate this particular thing to the affair when it's been a part of our lives since long before.


This is quite common actually, it is just resentment for all you have done for her and this is the thanks you get. There is can also be a bit of a delay in the resentment phase to all this. I would make sure that if she wants to do this, she is more than doing her fair share. You could cut back or eliminate if it gets to be too much. You can still enjoy your pets without the breeding program and or showing.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

I would tell her, from what you've said, that the dog kennels are a trigger for you and they remind you of taking care of the dogs while she was taking care of another man.


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## dearhusband (Aug 22, 2011)

I should have known I would end up telling my whole story by way of trying to ask a narrow question...

I've edited original post to include this background. I've been lurking long enough to know 70% of responders won't read beyond the first post before hitting reply 

She was career driven and taken advantage of by someone twice her age with a lot of power over her when I had very little. She owns her decisions in this, but this kind of situation gets murky fast. In the first six months it was a clearly inappropriate but consensual relationship. She told me about it within two weeks of it starting and it was clearly affair fog. We were headed for divorce. They had true love, nothing felt like this before, yaddayadda. The reality started sinking in at 4 months. At the six month mark she ended it definitively and informed the employer. The employer took it seriously but the reporting relationship did not change. The work environment made that kind of impossible. He began intermittently harassing her, which she kept me informed about. This person continued to have huge control over her career (she was a researcher working in a private lab he directed). The harassment escalated to sex again, but no longer with any delusions of a romantic future. She was being used and knew it, but for a period hid it because she thought she had no choice if she didn't want her career ruined. Turns out employers take this kind of thing seriously. She now no longer works in the lab, got a golden parachute that unfortunately came with some tarnish to the reputation. It's still hard to quantify the impact to her career, but her job is taking a back seat relative to mine for the foreseeable future anyway. I can't say what the "confidential employment action" was for her supervisor, but I believe they canned him. There has been no contact with certainty for 10 months. 

She is committed to our relationship. This issue is not rug-swept. We talk about it all of the time. She is deeply remorseful. We are both in IC and MC. But the whole thing is a cluster to untangle emotionally. And here I was trying to just ask about the dogs.


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## soccermom2three (Jan 4, 2013)

If the hobby doesn't bring you joy anymore then stop doing it or take a long break from it. I don't understand why you would torture yourself doing something you really don't enjoy. Hobbies are supposed to fun not bring you down. If your wife wants to continue then she can do it on her own.


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

Me and the old lady do not have the same hobby pre d-day...that hobby was toxic to the marriage.

Just like in our case you and your old lady need to find a new hobby. Again just another consequence your FWW will have to face to show her remorse.

While you are selling of all the paraphernalia you and her can figure out what to do next.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Dump the dogs. If she doesn't get that you were busting your hump taking care of her hobby while her supervisor was busting her hump and the dogs are just one casualty of her crazy crotch episode, then she still has a long way to go to be expressing true remorse.

I will probably keep clear of your threads. This whole situation does not smell good.

I would lay odds that she isn't doing everything she should.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## dearhusband (Aug 22, 2011)

A clarification about dog breeding. If you're not in that world it sounds like a joke. There is a bit of it that is crazy for sure. But it can be a lot of fun and an excuse to travel. And in that community we play a not insignificant role in contributing to the quality of a particular breed. We have generations of lines, imported dogs, etc. 

it's not a hobby at this level that's easy to get in/out of. We probably have on the order of $100k in facilities, equipment, dogs, transportation equipment, frozen semen, etcetera. 

So maybe this makes it a little harder to get out of than that motorcycle I bought...


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## manfromlamancha (Jul 4, 2013)

dearhusband said:


> I should have known I would end up telling my whole story by way of trying to ask a narrow question...
> 
> I've edited original post to include this background. I've been lurking long enough to know 70% of responders won't read beyond the first post before hitting reply
> 
> ...


Sorry, didn't mean to force you into revealing more - however, what I said still stands. You need to focus on your feelings now (and so does she).

It sounds like she made some astonishingly bad decisions for someone who sounds like she is intelligent. Also it sounds like POSOM got off lightly especially with the coercion which, from the way I read it, borders on rape! I would very much want deeper consequences for him other than simply losing his job and having a slightly tarnished reputation.

I would also look at suing the company for alienation of affection in the first place and then for fostering the coercion. Trust me this is serious stuff and will be taken very seriously.

Anyway, even if your wife is truly remorseful (and it sounds like she is more remorseful about being caught and the mess she made of her career etc rather than being remorseful for you and your feelings), she still needs to see that this hobby is badly triggering you and she needs to do what needs to be done by herself without being asked to.


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## dearhusband (Aug 22, 2011)

God. I'm reading my own posts and this whole thing sounds so first world. I'm feeling like Mitt Romney. 

But this stuff has been devastating and painful. Privileged white collars hurt too...


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## dearhusband (Aug 22, 2011)

manfromlamancha said:


> Sorry, didn't mean to force you into revealing more - however, what I said still stands. You need to focus on your feelings now (and so does she).
> 
> It sounds like she made some astonishingly bad decisions for someone who sounds like she is intelligent. Also it sounds like POSOM got off lightly especially with the coercion which, from the way I read it, borders on rape! I would very much want deeper consequences for him other than simply losing his job and having a slightly tarnished reputation.
> 
> ...


I'm not sorry you coaxed it out of me. This is a story people take either side of but your response reflected how I see this and how I wish most people would see it. There's a huge bias against the girl in these situations. Again, she owns a big piece of it. She was naive and at times deceptive. She showed tremendously bad judgement and disregard for me. She first chose another man over me, and then for a while chose her career over me. Both these things I think are done, but it's hard to untangle emotionally. 

Her residual feelings are also very complicated because of the nonconsensual components of the situation. She's been committed to her IC though and has been doing well.

The coercion likely constitutes rape in multiple documented instances and I'm confident she could win in a civil suit against the employer and against the individual. For a criminal complaint though you need to get to beyond a reasonable doubt - and there just isn't enough physical evidence. We've weighed the emotional cost of spending the next couple years in and out of court and for now have decided against the civil route, though the statute of limitations isn't out yet. 

I believe she is honestly remorseful about everything. I have a few triggers apart from the dogs and when I trigger it devastates her.

We will be untangling for years.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

Talking about the affair is good if it doesn't become obsessive. However, the important thing is actions since the last thing you can depend on from a cheater is her/his words and promises.

To be honest, having sex to keep a job seems worse than using falling in love with another man as a reason for an affair.

Was the other man married and does his wife know?


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

BTW, since you do not have kids, how did you figure staying in the marriage was a good idea?


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

dearhusband said:


> A clarification about dog breeding. If you're not in that world it sounds like a joke. There is a bit of it that is crazy for sure. But it can be a lot of fun and an excuse to travel. And in that community we play a not insignificant role in contributing to the quality of a particular breed. We have generations of lines, imported dogs, etc.
> 
> it's not a hobby at this level that's easy to get in/out of. We probably have on the order of $100k in facilities, equipment, dogs, transportation equipment, frozen semen, etcetera.
> 
> So maybe this makes it a little harder to get out of than that motorcycle I bought...


Yea, I looked into getting it to and found that it's a way of life. I can see where it's not an easy thing to just get out of.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

EleGirl said:


> Yea, I looked into getting it to and found that it's a way of life. I can see where it's not an easy thing to just get out of.


I agree but neither is a career. Their marriage hasn't been a priority for far too long and that is why they are here.

Make your marriage THE priority and be a little more concerned about your own well being for a change as well. Love and marriage is about putting your spouse as a very high priority. You have shown understanding of this. Your wife has not and I'm very skeptical that she has learned to make you a priority.

The dogs shouldn't be as important as your well being. Was her career worth throwing your marriage away for?

The dogs, like her career, are casualties from her pathetic behavior.

Let go and develope your marriage and, no less importantly, yourself.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

Have the dogs ever cheated on you? Ever lied to you? Ever disrespected you? 

No. They haven't. But you are thinking of getting rid of the dogs? :scratchhead:


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## dearhusband (Aug 22, 2011)

Chaparral said:


> BTW, since you do not have kids, how did you figure staying in the marriage was a good idea?


Attachment and inertia. I've seen "I still love her" so many times on this forum I won't make you laugh. The kind of unconditional love I once believed in is gone forever, but not just from this relationship for every relationship for me. I still think I love her as much as I would be capable of loving any other partner, and we've generally been pretty happy. But why try? mostly attachment and inertia. 



Chaparral said:


> To be honest, having sex to keep a job seems worse than using falling in love with another man as a reason for an affair.
> 
> Was the other man married and does his wife know?


For someone career driven in a competitive profession who believes someone controls not just their current career but future careers it's an awful reason. But not one I can't understand a little bit. bad all around.

OM is married and OMW knew the first time around. Not sure about the second given the no contact but chances are he kept it a secret.


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

For what it's worth our d-day was 5 yrs ago and the rats nest is a lot less tanglen then it was ...say 2 years past d-day.

Dude with 100 k worth of crap to sell off i imagine you and the old lady could figure out a pretty good hobby.

I suggest selling the crap off and at least take 10k in building a bondage dungon were you can take your cheating wife and bring on a little inquasition and cleanse her of her evil ways.... NOW THAT'S A HOBBY!!!!LOL

Sorry just wired a little...a lot different then most folks


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

MAtt were not talking about a pet dog....this breeding gig is a trigger!

While OP was keeping this business a float his old lady was screwing around.

Sell the assets... it will take time and if my dungeon idea doesn't float then raise phucking birds!!!!

Now I'm on to something....find some other crap to raise ...you both have the knack.


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

dearhusband said:


> Attachment and inertia. I've seen "I still love her" so many times on this forum I won't make you laugh. The kind of unconditional love I once believed in is gone forever, but not just from this relationship for every relationship for me. I still think I love her as much as I would be capable of loving any other partner, and we've generally been pretty happy. But why try? mostly attachment and inertia.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


1st, whats "inertia" mean/

2nd I'd make sure the OMW knew about the second time, and my old lady would be the one to tell her!


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## dearhusband (Aug 22, 2011)

"Inertia is the resistance of any physical object to any change in its state of motion, including changes to its speed and direction. It is the tendency of objects to keep moving in a straight line at constant velocity. " - Wikipedia


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

My I suggest you change the speed and direction of the marriage and take a sharp turn.....
An action that just might keep your old lady from phucking around again.

Anyway back to point.

In our case drinking a fighting was our old hobby and granted I do miss a good chick fight and Mrs. the guy still can carry her own, but its that toxic inviorment that cuased a lot of unhealty choice in our marriage.

In your case ...well actually the point of the thread is should you find a new hobby together and i highly recommend it.

Nor cuz the old one was umhealthy but it brings on a trigger and it is a hell of lot harder to have the grace to forgive your old lady when you have this trigger.

In short the less triggers you can avoid the better you to can work this crap out.

Speaking of trigger...cheap motel's are a b1tch to drive by..but lets not threadjack here.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

the guy said:


> MAtt were not talking about a pet dog....this breeding gig is a trigger!
> 
> While OP was keeping this business a float his old lady was screwing around.
> 
> ...


I know that. Just think he needs to make his wife aware of that fact.

Triggers. Yes. I know about triggers. Most of us here do, goodness knows.

You either work through them or get rid of them.


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

I just think the marriage is so fragile OP might want to simplify his life and dumb the breeding gig and get what little dough he can from it.

Granted its no small task but either is building a dungeon...it takes a lot of hardware.

In a way isn't getting into bondage kind of like breeding animals? You know...with all the cages and leashes 

I make my self laugh:rofl:

Just to be clear, I'm not making lite of OP's shyt storm...I've been through it...just maybe I can bring a small smirk to a rather unhappy event that none of us signed up for.

In short you and your old lady got a long way to go


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

Actually I'm taken back by the fact that you are talking about a dam "hobby" only 10 months out of getting your heart ripped out?

Most would be needing to be talked off the edge from killing the POS that blackmailed their old lady into sex after she wanted to end an affair.


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## dearhusband (Aug 22, 2011)

the guy said:


> Actually I'm taken back by the fact that you are talking about a dam "hobby" only 10 months out of getting your heart ripped out?
> 
> Most would be needing to be talked off the edge from killing the POS that blackmailed their old lady into sex after she wanted to end an affair.


I have my moments. Some days I still obsess about the whole thing, think about ruining his life. I've learned with some other hard life lessons that taking a pound of flesh from another can't replace a pound of flesh you've lost. As much as it sucks that the world is an unfair place without justice, it is. Pursuing justice or fairness in almost all cases is a folly. Better to focus on moving forward.

Or give in and find an alternate use for that dungeon you keep coming back to...


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

I can can get on board with that line of thinking. In fact i have with all the POS that was doing my old lady....BUT ONE!!!!

The double betrayal of your friend and your wife is so painful ...to this day (5yrs mind you) I hope I never see that POS.

Hopefully I do an easy 90 in county for an A&B. My brother holds my jail money for stuff I'll need, but if I end up in state I'm pucked...I'm not built for prison time.LOL

At the end of the day this shyt falls on our old ladies...not the OM...or in my case OM's


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

I still think you should sell off all the dog breeding crap and buy another bike. Maybe one for your old lady and teach her to ride....NOW THAT'S A HOBBY!

Throw in a decend truck and a toy hauler and you can take the bikes cross country and then ride them around town.


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## Dogbert (Jan 10, 2015)

I take it you've considered someone buying you out?


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## imjustwatching (Jul 8, 2014)

dearhusband said:


> I'm not sorry you coaxed it out of me. This is a story people take either side of but your response reflected how I see this and how I wish most people would see it. There's a huge bias against the girl in these situations. Again, she owns a big piece of it. She was naive and at times deceptive. She showed tremendously bad judgement and disregard for me. She first chose another man over me, and then for a while chose her career over me. Both these things I think are done, but it's hard to untangle emotionally.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


The only one who was naive here is you ...
Your wife know exactly what she was doing. She just didn't care about your feelings.


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## manfromlamancha (Jul 4, 2013)

OK couple of things about the civil suit and related matters:

This POSOM is going to do this again - mainly because he didn't really face and real consequences (he will just learn to hide it better next time). His wife needs to know about what he did the second time round because, IMO, that is a million times worse than just cheating on her - he pursued and coerced an employee to have sex with him (as I said sophisticated rapist) and his wife really needs to know this about him (and deal with him accordingly). Once his wife knows the civil suit may take a different turn with both of you suing the company for fostering this. Also she will show him real consequences too.

The company made a poor decision to simply part company with some kind of meagre payoff to your wife (and leaving her with a less than favourable reputation in her career). They should not get away with this as it is a double whammy - enabling creeps like POSOM as well as destroying your wife's career and not paying enough for it. However, your decision is your decision - I would not let them off this lightly.

On other matters - make her aware of what bothers or triggers you as soon as it does and then sit back and observe what she does about it. She should be doing the hard work to remove the triggers i.e. she should be the one to get rid of the breeding practice you have at home (amongst other things).

I am glad you are in counselling and doubly so for her - think reforming cheater as well as rape victim.

Take care


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## cgiles (Dec 10, 2014)

dearhusband said:


> Or give in and find an alternate use for that dungeon you keep coming back to...


Why taint your lovely dungeon, when you can setup him a date with this lovely lady ?










How was your marriage during the second part of the affair, did you noticed something was wrong ? How was your gut feelings ? 

It must be hard for you, between supporting her as she was coerced, and knowing she cheated on you.

Does she stay unemployed ? 
If yes you should take a break of cleaning the dog's crap, and only enjoying the puppies.


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## dearhusband (Aug 22, 2011)

Dogbert said:


> I take it you've considered someone buying you out?


We could get out of it. I don't feel trapped in that regard. It's just something that we can't really take a "trial" vacation from. And it's a little too big of a thing for me to say, "you're on your own with it for now". So I seem to be faced with wondering if I can get over a trigger or if I need to just push for a big change in our lives...



cgiles said:


> How was your marriage during the second part of the affair, did you noticed something was wrong ? How was your gut feelings ?
> 
> It must be hard for you, between supporting her as she was coerced, and knowing she cheated on you.
> 
> ...


our marriage during the second part was fair. work was a huge problem for her. I looked at it more or less as getting through dealing with the situation with her job but obviously I didn't know all of it. The second reveal was devistating and confusing. We went through several months of her trying to deal with things without reporting it before she finally decided she needed to be done. Dealing with it sucked. I thought about leaving. I couldn't tell for sure what of the story was an excuse and what was really plain abusive. I still don't totally know, other than that her story checked out with people who witnessed things in the workplace and has generally been internally consistent. She was not forthcoming with details but never fabricated or produced inconsistencies. Just more details, which I think I now have all of.

She's employed on a new research a grant so she is working but in a different environment and with only a temporary commitment. she is pulling most of the weight with things at home and with the dogs now. But when she wants to plan on a trip or get my help with the dogs I just can't predict how I will feel on any given day. Some days it's great. Some days it's a total trigger.


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

MattMatt said:


> Have the dogs ever cheated on you? Ever lied to you? Ever disrespected you?
> 
> No. They haven't. But you are thinking of getting rid of the dogs? :scratchhead:


:iagree:

:rofl:

Beautiful Matt! Beautiful.


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## dearhusband (Aug 22, 2011)

Oh I'm keeping a particular one of the dogs no matter what. I can keep man's best friend without keeping all of man's best friend's friends.

You know I've been doing pretty well with the whole situation and been more or less at piece with letting things go without trying to ruin the OM. All of this talking is making me feel pretty ****ty and angry with all parties involved. I think I'm giving myself TAM related anxiety (aka reality).


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

dearhusband said:


> Oh I'm keeping a particular one of the dogs no matter what. I can keep man's best friend without keeping all of man's best friend's friends.
> 
> You know I've been doing pretty well with the whole situation and been more or less at piece with letting things go without trying to ruin the OM. All of this talking is making me feel pretty ****ty and angry with all parties involved. I think I'm giving myself TAM related anxiety (aka reality).


No, you are rugsweeping is what you are doing. 

You are not processing your anger. You have a right to be angry, to let yourself be angry, and to tell those who say you should let go of the anger to fvck off. Your wife treated you like garbage. Nothing she did was defendable or acceptable. 

Those dogs are the least of your troubles.


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## dearhusband (Aug 22, 2011)

So is the universal opinion of TAM that cheaters should be canned bar none? 

She's effectively given up her career. I think she's doing her part in many areas. Did she cheat and lie and rip my heart out? yeah. Should I give up and move on? Maybe. Would I be happier with somebody else? I think it's a craps shoot.


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## Mr Blunt (Jul 18, 2012)

> So is the universal opinion of TAM that cheaters should be canned bar none?


*NO*






> She's effectively given up her career. I think she's doing her part in many areas. Did she cheat and lie and rip my heart out? yeah. Should I give up and move on? Maybe. Would I be happier with somebody else? I think it's a craps shoot.


Your triggers will not be real painful forever if you both handle this betrayal right. You will not get LOT better in just one year but you can be in several years from now.


*What she did is going to cause you both to suffer for a while and there is no way out of that.* Do whatever you have to do for YOU to be able to suffer less. If that makes her suffer more then that is just the reality. This is not revenge this is reducing pain and survival and reality.


You will never trust any woman 100% again so take that into consideration if you think you would be happier with someone else. If you are resentful of her then perhaps getting some legal papers post-affair will help. In other words get some legal papers so that she cannot screw you financially in case she gets weak and betrays you again in the future. That will protect you financially and maybe even help you with your resentments right now. *Do you think that will help you?
*


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## dearhusband (Aug 22, 2011)

Thanks Blunt. I hadn't thought about a post-nup much but it's an interesting idea. I don't like the idea of anything that would encourage future concealment but maybe something that would make a dissolution be a little more on my terms because of these events even if that's a few years down the road.

I like to believe that a true reconciliation is possible. Who knows how many happily married old folks went through something like this? If my happily married 70-something parents had I damn sure wouldn't expect it to be broadcast. 

Perhaps TAM and the Internet at large tend to be an echo chamber for the wounded. If everything goes well in our reconciliation there is a 90% chance I won't be posting on TAM in 5 years. If everything goes to pot there is a 90% chance I'll be back her affirming that so many of you saw it coming and I could have avoided years of pain if I just listened... And I'll be coaching some other sucker to call Time of death a lot earlier.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

dearhusband said:


> Thanks Blunt. I hadn't thought about a post-nup much but it's an interesting idea. I don't like the idea of anything that would encourage future concealment but maybe something that would make a dissolution be a little more on my terms because of these events even if that's a few years down the road.
> 
> I like to believe that a true reconciliation is possible. Who knows how many happily married old folks went through something like this? If my happily married 70-something parents had I damn sure wouldn't expect it to be broadcast.
> 
> Perhaps TAM and the Internet at large tend to be an echo chamber for the wounded. If everything goes well in our reconciliation there is a 90% chance I won't be posting on TAM in 5 years. If everything goes to pot there is a 90% chance I'll be back her affirming that so many of you saw it coming and I could have avoided years of pain if I just listened... And I'll be coaching some other sucker to call Time of death a lot earlier.


Or you'll be on TAM saying: "Divorce isn't the only option. My wife and I reconciled. Look, this is what you could try..."


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

dearhusband said:


> So is the universal opinion of TAM that cheaters should be canned bar none?
> 
> She's effectively given up her career. I think she's doing her part in many areas. Did she cheat and lie and rip my heart out? yeah. Should I give up and move on? Maybe. Would I be happier with somebody else? I think it's a craps shoot.


Reconciliation takes a great amount of work and dedication to be successful. I am not pro D or R, that is up to you and who you chose to marry but there are a lot of worrisome factors with your situation.

You appear to believe that you wouldn't be more satisfied with another. Coming from the perspective of a successful marriage, I can't understand why you would believe that.

Secondly, your wife has shown no regard for your marriage as a priority in her life and even now, does not seem to grasp the importance of doing so.

If I were in her shoes, I would warp space if I thought you needed it to heal.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## cgiles (Dec 10, 2014)

dearhusband said:


> We could get out of it. I don't feel trapped in that regard. It's just something that we can't really take a "trial" vacation from. And it's a little too big of a thing for me to say, "you're on your own with it for now".
> 
> *Can't you hire someone few hours a week for replace you ?*
> 
> But when she wants to plan on a trip or get my help with the dogs I just can't predict how I will feel on any given day. Some days it's great. Some days it's a total trigger.


Do you feel guilty for the way you react ? 

I think you should print this and give it to her : Understanding Your Loyal Spouse | AFFAIRCARE

Like someone else advised you, you should read "no more mr nice guy" by robert glover. It's a great book for get back on your feet on an esteem level.
https://7chan.org/lit/src/Robert_Glover_-_No_More_Mr_Nice_Guy.pdf


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

dearhusband said:


> So is the universal opinion of TAM that cheaters should be canned bar none?
> 
> She's effectively given up her career. I think she's doing her part in many areas. Did she cheat and lie and rip my heart out? yeah. Should I give up and move on? Maybe. Would I be happier with somebody else? I think it's a craps shoot.


I didn't say get divorced. 

Where the hell did I say get divorced? I said don't rugsweep your feelings about what her actions did to you. Get angry. Let her see you get angry. Let her have it with both barrels once in a while. How can you be honest and authentic if you don't? I'm not saying to beat her or burn the damn house down, but make it clear to her that you are hurt and that this affair is going to take a long time for you to process and get over.


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## Plan 9 from OS (Jul 13, 2012)

dearhusband said:


> Thanks Blunt. I hadn't thought about a post-nup much but it's an interesting idea. I don't like the idea of anything that would encourage future concealment but maybe something that would make a dissolution be a little more on my terms because of these events even if that's a few years down the road.
> 
> I like to believe that a true reconciliation is possible. Who knows how many happily married old folks went through something like this? If my happily married 70-something parents had I damn sure wouldn't expect it to be broadcast.
> 
> *Perhaps TAM and the Internet at large tend to be an echo chamber for the wounded.* If everything goes well in our reconciliation there is a 90% chance I won't be posting on TAM in 5 years. If everything goes to pot there is a 90% chance I'll be back her affirming that so many of you saw it coming and I could have avoided years of pain if I just listened... And I'll be coaching some other sucker to call Time of death a lot earlier.


Absolutely correct. In particular, CWI is an echo chamber. It's also filled with confirmation bias, group think and can take on the characteristics of a cult. Not all CWI posters are like that but there is a hardened core that is. Unfortunately, it's up to you to sift through the info to figure out what makes sense and what doesn't. Also unfortunately for you, but you also need to take into account that you too may succumb to confirmation bias and only listen to the info that you want to hear.

I'm not a regular CWI poster anymore, but I've been married for long enough to have some good experiences. So take it for what it's worth, here's my take. You were and probably are naive. You believed the fairy tale - that there is that one true love. Even though you appear to no longer believe it, I think you do. I'm here to tell you that you can find a very deep and real marital love with a whole slew of other people out there. There is no "special someone" out there. So what you need to do but I'm guessing you haven't yet, is to take a serious inventory and figure out exactly whether this woman you are with is worth it. You're going to have to put a bunch of metrics together and weight them out - pros and cons. Does physical beauty trump trust? Is she capable of maintaining a serious relationship, or are you two fooling yourselves and are more like really good friends who are living largely separate lives but have some "social things" you do together (like the dog shows). Do you want to have kids with someone who is a known cheater? Do you believe in redemption? And, if you do believe in redemption is it you that has to ultimately be the test case?


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## bigfoot (Jan 22, 2014)

I think that the cacophony of strident voices on this site is NEEDED. Sure folks are jaded, and with good reason. Spousal betrayal is so significant and so far reaching in terms of the number of lives that it impacts that it is important to hear those voices.

Some BS's are so hell bent on staying married that they overlook so many red flags that it is pitiful. They are like Charlie Brown going to kick the football. They will get burned again. They need a wake up call.

Other BS's are bent on living in limbo. They need those voices to keep them off balance and questioning their choices. They need to commit. They can change, but commit doggone it.

Finally, there are the few who are going to leave. Sure, they get a hero's welcome for being strong, but there are voices that challenge that orthodoxy as well. You can't walk away from a broken heart, so perspective is key for them.

In the end, if one is going to stay, leave, or exist in a marriage infected with infidelity, that person is going to have to answer the voices in their own head that say what the faceless posters say on this site. Coming to a forum, where others come at you aggressively with those same questions is good. I view it like football practice. You get banged up pretty good, but come game time, you are better prepared to make crunch decisions.

If you are gonna stay, well, you better be damn sure that you mean it. If you are gonna leave, the same thing. If you are gonna try to live in limbo, well you need to be told to sh*t or get off the pot by someone.

In my view, staying is the most dangerous choice. Whether the cheater cheats again or whether your own soul condemns you for staying, those who stay eat the whole Sh*t sandwich and then kiss the cook. Waking up everyday knowing that is harsh. They need an iron conviction to stay. If they can get that on this site, great. I always wish them well. Real life is way harder than forum life.


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## dearhusband (Aug 22, 2011)

Thanks for the continued feedback. To prove to a bunch of people I don't know on the internet that I wasn't rugsweeping, I picked a big fight.

DH:"Are you sure x happened?"
DW:"x happened."
DH:"Did x really happen?"
DW"x happened."
DH:"really?"
DW:"x happened. You don't trust me!?!"
DH:"Why would I?"

and it went down hill from there, with me getting as angry and yelling as much as Bandit would say I should... on a totally trivial "x" that I don't even care about... But that wasn't the point. The point is never actually the point, know what I mean? But hey, I get to be a little irrational, right? I mean, look at all of the irrationality I kept fighting for her through.

This reveled:
1) I don't trust her fully, and I will probably not fully trust anyone
2) She may not be able to accept that
3) I endure all kinds of irrationality and continue fighting for her
4) She is ready to throw in the towel on the whole relationship as soon as I go a little crazy, at least in the moment...

Or maybe it was just the night. She had a bad day and I wasn't feeling like being a supportive husband. I was an @ss, at least half on purpose. But I get to be @ss sometimes, and be forgiven, right?


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

She should easily understand and forgive the emotional trauma SHE caused.

I don't think she really gets it.

I hope you don't have self esteem issues because many, if not most, men do have more loving and considerate wives who have never cheated on them.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

No she doesn't get it. She doesn't get it all. 

Defensiveness is the one greatest mistake that waywards make to derail a reconciliation.


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## dearhusband (Aug 22, 2011)

I will be discussing this more in IC (tomorrow) before pushing the topic again. Because of work I won't see my wife really until Wednesday evening. In the mean time Ill leave it to her to think about where we left things.

I've read mmsl and nmmng and applied some concepts From Both. Point being I know the lingo and the patterns I'm susceptible to. I don't really fit the nmmng mold generally but I see some aspects of it in our marriage for sure.


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## Welsh15 (Feb 24, 2014)

dearhusband said:


> Thanks for the continued feedback. To prove to a bunch of people I don't know on the internet that I wasn't rugsweeping, I picked a big fight.
> 
> DH:"Are you sure x happened?"
> DW:"x happened."
> ...


Your feelings are perfectly normal. You are allowed to be up and down and throw shiz in her face. I know I did. She needs to take all of it and repeatedly tell you how she sorry is and hopefully soften your feelings and acknowledge how much she hurt you. If she isn't doing that and wants to throw in the towel then she is not willing to do the work for a successful R. Good luck to you sir.


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## South Stand (Dec 17, 2014)

Chaparral said:


> I would tell her, from what you've said, that the dog kennels are a trigger for you and they remind you of taking care of the dogs while she was taking care of another man.


Clearly this is a trigger for you. You need to deal with this sooner rather than later. The longer it goes on the worse it will become. If you don't talk about it, she may not recognize this is a trigger. If she doesn't recognize this she can't work with you through this. If she does recognize it's a trigger, but doesn't take the appropriate actions, good luck. Speaking from experience this will not get better and you will not just wake up one day and forget about it.


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

Honestly, I'd drop the dogs and find some other hobby to share w/ your wife... something that requires much less time, commitment, and poop-cleaning.


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## dearhusband (Aug 22, 2011)

I've discussed the issue twice in IC and once in MC. My wife is willing to cut back and take responsibility for it as her hobby but doesn't want to give it up entirely. I'm game for trying that for a while. We will see what happens.


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

What kind of cut backs are you talking?

If i remember you guys have 100K....so are you selling 50k worth of assets.

My point is what is the cut back in terms of money...not just time...You said you had a lot of dough dropped into this breed of dog.

You would think that a "cut back" also meant assets as well as time.


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## dearhusband (Aug 22, 2011)

We've placed two studs with other breeders and have decided to not keep any from the current litters. We've also agreed not to pursue any new aquisitions. We have a ton of frozen semen from all over the world that i supose could be liquidated but keeping a cryogenic tank topped off is pretty low effort.

So no we haven't really liquidated any assets, but we've started in the right direction. 


I'm learning that time moves strangely with affair recovery. Some weeks the whole world changes, some things take months to change at all.


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