# Hitting the destruct button - wife won't drop affair partner...



## InFlux (Oct 30, 2011)

I’m 42, wife is 40, married 11 years with 2 daughters (10, 7). Long story and the why doesn’t really matter as we each have our own bag of BS but the result is that wife has been in an EA and PA since last October with another married man (with kids no less). IMHO she is going through a classic MLC and is “self-medicating” with the affair. She feels absolved as “I knew about it” after an earlier conversation last year where she expressed her desire to “mess around” and encouraged me to do the same because our sex life was non-fulfilling to her. To be honest it wasn’t great for me either (no physical issues — everything functions) — more of a communication problem, but I told her the fact that we have sexual issues is a symptom of more fundamental unmet needs in the relationship on both sides (e.g. resentment, neediness, expectations, goals, appreciation, respect, etc.) If we worked-on and addressed those issues I’m confident we could fix the symptoms, including the sex. In any event, I told her I do not approve of going outside the marriage because I don’t believe it solves anything but would not prevent her because ultimately we each make our own decisions and have to live with the consequences. I was also thinking, mostly out of frustration at that point, maybe she just needs to get a ONS out of her system. I could deal with that if it helped clarify things for her and got us back on track. Unfortunately, she decided to jump off the cliff like a kid in a candystore instead of focusing on herself and us. Maybe I don’t feel the violation of trust as much (since I "knew about it") but certainly it violated my will. Predictably, things have been going down-hill fast since with me pulling-away further, withholding intimacy, just feeding into the EA/PA even more. She said she “dropped the guy” a few months ago and wanted to reconcile. She presented it to me as a great gift and sacrifice for her (which I’m sure it was — hard to quit cold turkey) but without any sense of remorse for the hurt she caused. I think she was expecting more of a reaction from me but without the remorse I was/am unwilling to let go. I told her I needed to know the MOTIVATION for her dropping the guy and the sudden change of heart towards reconciliation. After pulling teeth I got: she was fearful of not giving our relationship “one last try”, she was fearful for our kids, for the future, she wanted to see if we could learn to love each other like we once did (implying there was no love from her). I was waiting to hear the reason I needed to hear for myself which was something akin to “I want to reconcile because I’ve realized I love you and salvaging that is more important to me than anything else.” I didn’t get it and it crushed me. I believe humans are motivated by either fear or love and I heard fear driving all the reasons she gave me. I needed to hear a love reason. I told her all this and she started the affair up again shortly thereafter when she told me I “could care less” about her “offer” to drop the guy. She went to individual therapy but “had nothing to talk about” after one-and-half sessions. Fast-forward to today I finally decided to file but as crazy as it sounds I’m still holding on to the dream of the marriage I once had, thinking the bull is going to stop rampaging the china shop. She said I was "premature" in filing and we should have tried separation first but she can't tell me what she hopes to get out of it (separation). Personally, I think she may have have BPD or be slightly bi-polar. Grew up in Argentina where she had 24/7 domestic help and an aloof mother (read: "entitled princess"). Her parents split when she was 10 and her father died when she was 14 although she denies that this has anything to do with our current problems -- it's all my fault...


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## Numb-badger (May 18, 2011)

Her head is in space mate. File for D, take control and care of yourself and let reality slap her in the face.
You need to focus on you and the kids - nothing else.
There are lots of posts on this forum that will help, and a lot of experienced members. Please take on board what you see.

Best wishes

N-B


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## aug (Aug 21, 2011)

She's lying to you.

Maybe the other man's wife (OMW) found out about the affair and the OM dumped her. 

Do you know who the OM is? If so, without telling your wife or the OM, talk to the OMW.


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## ing (Mar 26, 2011)

First if all. I am sorry you are with us, the pain you must have suffered over the past year would have been hard to bear.

The next bit of this is going to hurt.

You have done it all wrong. Don't beat yourself up, but you have allowed your wife to control and manipulate you for 12 months.
This has to stop. Now. For your protection.

I will rewrite what you wrote without any of the BS foggy talk.

Last year my wife told me she was going to bang another man. She said I could bang other women too but I thought this was a bad idea. Despite me saying no she went to this other man and opened her legs for him. I decided that I would allow this and continue to support her while the OM and her fcked each other senseless...

You get the idea? Sorry.
IF you want her back then you have to let her go. You have finally told her that you want a divorce. this has put her in a spin because you are finally dumping consequences on her. 


At this stage do not agree to a trial separation. She has had plenty of time to work out what she wants.
If she wants to stop the divorce she MUST end the affair with the OM. 
THis means that there is no contact at all with the OM
She must allow you to access her phone records
She must allow you to access all email and computer accounts.

I agree she may be going through a MLC but this is no excuse for treating you like dirt..

You need to man up and set boundaries. NO more Mr Nice GUy.

She deep in the FOG and is probably exhibiting narcissistic behavior. 

Read here. You will see lots of threads that look almost exactly the same. An affair runs as if by a script. 

DO NOT SHOW YOUR WIFE THIS FORUM. Lock your computer accounts. Only trust half what she says.


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## PHTlump (Jun 2, 2010)

Stop trying to excuse her behavior. An affair doesn't prove that someone is mentally ill, or was neglected as a child. It proves that person is narcissistic and doesn't regard his/her spouse enough to refrain from engaging in behavior that is capable of crushing his/her spouse.

You said her wife is an entitled princess. That's fairly common. She came to you with a sh!t test of sleeping around and you didn't take it seriously enough. Now, she wants to cake eat and sleep with her married man while you're at home with the kids.

You need to crush that fantasy. You've filed for divorce. That's good. You need to expose the affair to the OM's wife. You also need to work on yourself (lose weight, get engaged with hobbies and other people) in order to be ready to move on with your life after your divorce is final.

It is possible that your wife will see you preparing to move on and will realize that she doesn't want to lose you. At that point, she will probably come to you and show you the remorse that you want to see.

If that doesn't happen, at least you're ready to start dating when the divorce is final.

Good luck.


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## Arnold (Oct 25, 2011)

I agree, you made a major mistake by acting like a whipped puppy. Many of us did, however.

Divorce this woman asap. Let her see that you will no longer lick her boots. You are a decent guy and deserve better than this entitled, irrational a-hole.


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## TRy (Sep 14, 2011)

InFlux said:


> Her parents split when she was 10 and her father died when she was 14 although she denies that this has anything to do with our current problems.


Her past has little to do with her current cheating. You are just looking to make excuses for her actions that even she does not buy into.


InFlux said:


> it's all my fault...


It is all your fault. When she first told you that she was going to have sex outside of the marriage, you should have told her that if she wants that then you want a divorce. By not doing that you delayed addressing the issue until it was too late. You cannot undue the affair that you let happen.


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## tacoma (May 1, 2011)

If you want to stop this affair you need to contact the other mans wife and present her with any evidence of the affair you can.
Do not tell your wife you`re going to do this before you do it.

90% chance that the OM will throw your wife under the bus to salvage his marriage.

This will show your wife he ain`t Mr.Wonderful and utterly destroy her fantasy world all in one fell swoop.

After that you need to start the 180 and go ahead and get the divorce papers rolling.

This will leave her in a tail spin because her back-up plan (you) will also have just left her and she`ll quickly realized she`s royally screwed.

If all of this should bring about some true remorse from your wife and IF you`re still interested in fixing your marriage you can then put the divorce on hold.


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## Anubis (Jul 12, 2011)

InFlux,
Something you need to know. You may be living in a "no-fault" divorce state, but that does not mean that the divorce has to be "no-fault". Look up "grounds for divorce" for your state and you might find something like this:

"... if one spouse is at fault for the breakup of the marriage, the court may take that into consideration in determining what is an equitable (fair) division of the couple's property. For that reason, you may want to include fault grounds in your petition for divorce. The statutory rounds for a fault divorce are: adultery, cruel treatment, Etc ..."

If you can get solid evidence of the affair, you could have additional leverage in the divorce. Make her accountable for once (just like you have been all your life). Check with your lawyer. A lot of them just push people straight to the "no fault" path even when there is clear fault because it's easier for them, unless you direct them otherwise (or find a lawyer who doesn't mind fighting for fairness and father's rights.

Also, get over to DadDivorce.com and check out "the list" and other resources there. Being male is usually a disadvantage when it comes to the family law system, so you need all the leverage you can get.

Your wife has made it clear to you that she has Zero (or negative) respect for you. You have no reason to bend over and make it easy for her (and allow her to deny/minimizer her fault) - and she most certainly will do everything she can to get the upper hand. Like others have said, read around here and you will see you are not the first guy this exact thing has happened to... it happens very often, and very predictably.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

She's been having an affair for a year now...if she doesn't want to commit to u and only u either 1. Tolerate living in an open marriage or 2. Divorce her. She will continue to eat her cake as long as there r no consequences. oh and u absolutely must tell OMs wife about the affair without any warning to ur wife or the 9! Beforehand.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

Let her burn. Exposé to the OMW family and the neighborhood anyone with so little respect for their marriage deserve every horrible piece of karma that can be sent their way 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## InFlux (Oct 30, 2011)

Thanks brothers/sisters! I think I was just looking for validation that going forward with my divorce was the right thing. Yes, I'll admit my head was stuck up my ass for the past year, permitting the affair to go on and passively doing nothing constructive about it until filing. In retrospect, I think my marriage was doomed the moment my wife floated the idea in the first place because I fully believe she would have gone behind my back at some point anyways -- I just accelerated the inevitable. In that respect I'm glad I'm getting out now and not when I'm 50!

As far as blowing-up her fantasy land affair -- I've thought about it many times and agree it would feel good to go thermonuclear on it, but, you know what? I'm above that. Life/karma will hit her in the ass. Hard. As much as the OM is a POS it's my WW that initiated everything (yes, I have *copious* amounts of electronic evidence -- emails, pics, etc.) Right now, my wife is amicable to the divorce. She thinks she's in love with her new "Mr. Right" -- we all know how that story's going to end anyways, right? With or without my intervention. And being that she's amicable I'm in the driver's seat because she's just letting the $hit happen to her. She's cool with mediation and doesn't want to fight for anything (I really don't want to go down the litigation route). The reality, also, is that we have to work together for the benefit of our kids going forward and I'm paying attention to the bigger picture. I'm doing what I must for myself -- frankly I could care less who is filling her holes at this point as long as my kids aren't around it. She prefers to keep the house and I'm inclined to let her have it and walk away with my retirement accounts. We want to keep the house for the benefit of the kids (at least in the near term). I'm thinking I'll get something nearby (but not too near!) I filed joint/joint which she's cool with. For myself, I think I'd prefer to have a change of scenery and to help me reset my mental state going forward. With the house there's too many memories...Right now we're both in the house sleeping separately. I don't plan to leave the house until the final judgement is wrapped-up and everything looks good.


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## ing (Mar 26, 2011)

Okay. You seem to be well past the denial state. Which is where people come in mostly. This is why you got hit so hard..

You sound like you have emotionally detached. Read the "Just Let Them Go" thread so that you aren't surprised when your wife starts panicking and making Reconciliation noises.
My stbxw is doing that now and it is hard to see. Reality strikes.

Divorce can be the best outcome but don't leave the house. She needs to do that. Perhaps she could go live with OM?
Your focus now needs to be keeping as much access as you can with your kids. You leaving the house will mean that she can move her lover in and have him live with your children while saying you deserted them.

DO NOT LEAVE THE HOUSE!!


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## Arnold (Oct 25, 2011)

It is fine that you are using the cheating as a "get out of jail free card". I did the same , as before the affair, my wife was an abusive bully. And, explaining to folks that you divorced due to infidelity is much easier than explaining that your wife was constantly mean and nasty to you. Folks get infidelity. Thye have doubts about leaving due to emotional abuse.

But, please, please, stop and think about conceding things in the divorce just to make it faster and easier.

My dad, a very good lawyer, told me as he was dying and after I informed him of my intention to get divorced from my serially cheating wife,"Arnold, I have represented many, many men in this situation. A high% of them just want the pain and humiliation to be over. Whatever you do, do not give away anything you do not have to. You will regret it down the road."

He was exactly right. I did not listen. I wanted this behind me. It cost me untold$$ and interferred with my relationship with my kids. And, once you agree to soemthing, no matter how unfair, it is much tougher to undo.

So, get good representation and instruct your pit bull lawyer to slap you silly if you start the concession business. Take the pain of conflict now, rahter than suffering ten fold over the long haul.


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## InFlux (Oct 30, 2011)

ing said:


> Okay. You seem to be well past the denial state. Which is where people come in mostly. This is why you got hit so hard..
> 
> You sound like you have emotionally detached. Read the "Just Let Them Go" thread so that you aren't surprised when your wife starts panicking and making Reconciliation noises.
> My stbxw is doing that now and it is hard to see. Reality strikes.
> ...


I understand the rational behind not leaving the house. However, I'm still in the house, and if we agree in mediation (not litigation) to a deal that's equitable, the final judgement entered, how is that going to haunt me later if I then move out? Neighborhood perception? Perhaps. But as everyone knows there's three sides to a story. Frankly, if it was up to me and my wants/needs, I'd sell the house and split the proceeds. But I want to keep the house for the benefit of my kids. I was thinking of an alternative -- keep the house as a joint interest with a clause to sell in, say, 5 years. At such point in time the primary resident (myself or her) could either a) buy the other one out of their interest or sell the house and split the proceeds. My plan is not to air our dirty laundry and say she's a disrespectful, cheating, unworthy wife. Remember, I have evidence, she doesn't. If she were to go crazy on me and attempt to tar and feather me it would just be her crazy made up story to which I would respond with REAL PROOF...


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## InFlux (Oct 30, 2011)

The OM is married with kids -- do you really think he's going to drop all that and move in to my house? I've been monitoring their conversations and I know he's just telling her what she wants to hear so he can get what he wants (sex). My STBX may be manic but I don't think she's totally insane...


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## ing (Mar 26, 2011)

InFlux said:


> The OM is married with kids -- do you really think he's going to drop all that and move in to my house? I've been monitoring their conversations and I know he's just telling her what she wants to hear so he can get what he wants (sex). My STBX may be manic but I don't think she's totally insane...


Then your still in denial my friend 
EXPOSE THE AFFAIR to the OMW. She has a right to know what sort of scum bag she is living with.


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## ShootMePlz! (Oct 5, 2008)

Sounds like the OM is getting a free hotel in the future to continue his sex on the side!!! 

Don't think for a minute that you can litigate who can stay over or exposed to the kids without her acceptance either!!! Once the divorce is over she can do what she wants.:banghead:

So see if she will agree in writing to no overnights. 

How has exposure worked??? The OM's wife??


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## InFlux (Oct 30, 2011)

OK -- now I'm thinking I keep house as joint interest with option for me to buy her out or forced sale in, say, 5 years unless we've decided to sell earlier of course. Equity earnings split 50/50 in sale scenario. I give her 50% of the retirement and then she moves out and finds a place of her own. I can live with that. In the meantime I can keep myself busy with major internal/external renovation to make the place "feel" like a new beginning for me. The more I thought about it -- most of the crap in the house is mine anyways. If she resists the idea I'll say I'll expose affair with evidence...

As I said earlier, I haven't exposed affair because I don't care at this point (as far as reconciliation). But I do have to live with this woman in a co-parenting situation for the rest of our lives. Why accelerate a train that's going to run into a brick wall on it's own? If she moves out -- who cares?

I like the no overnights thing. I would spin it as no overnights for either of us while the kids are under the age of consent and are in our custody until such time as we get re-married or file a Declaration of Domestic Partnership with the state.

In a similar vein, if spousal support is awarded, I'm going to get it in writing that it will cease if one or more of the following are true: 1) Half the length of the marriage has elapsed.
2) She has either re-married or filed a declaration of domestic partnership with the state.


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## Sindo (Oct 29, 2011)

ing said:


> Then your still in denial my friend
> EXPOSE THE AFFAIR to the OMW. She has a right to know what sort of scum bag she is living with.


If we were still trying to save his marriage, you could make an argument for that. At this stage, there's no point. In fact it could prove counterproductive. If OMW kicks OM out, then OM will move into his house.

Also, it's probably best not to unnecessarily poke the hornet's nest until the divorce is finalized.


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## ing (Mar 26, 2011)

InFlux said:


> The more I thought about it -- most of the crap in the house is mine anyways. If she resists the idea I'll say I'll expose affair with evidence...


Moving quickly to anger. How many times have you been around that loop. I know I have about a thousand times.

Why don't you want to expose the affair? I suspect, and shoot me down if wrong, that you are so detached and emotionally smashed up that you just can't imagine wanting her at all. 

She will continue to be an ass for as long as she is having the affair. It doesn't matter if you are there or not. 
She will feel entitled to bring in her new lover and introduce him to your children. 
My stbxw, who I threw out, tried to introduce to my eldest [16]. It was less than successful due to her age and the fact she knew what had happened..


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## InFlux (Oct 30, 2011)

Sindo said:


> If we were still trying to save his marriage, you could make an argument for that. At this stage, there's no point. In fact it could prove counterproductive. If OMW kicks OM out, then OM will move into his house.
> 
> Also, it's probably best not to unnecessarily poke the hornet's nest until the divorce is finalized.


That's my thinking -- this is a trainwreck relationship anyways -- I don't _have _to do anything...


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## InFlux (Oct 30, 2011)

ing said:


> Moving quickly to anger. How many times have you been around that loop. I know I have about a thousand times.
> 
> Why don't you want to expose the affair? I suspect, and shoot me down if wrong, that you are so detached and emotionally smashed up that you just can't imagine wanting her at all.
> 
> ...


Let me put it this way -- I reserve the right to play that "hole card" until the time of my choosing (namely after the final judgement is wrapped-up to my liking...)


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## dddivorceee (Oct 30, 2011)

I had the same situation, but without the kids. She was an "entitled princess" who had an affair with a married man with kids, and denied it. Has continued to do so, despite bang-to-rights evidence, and the fact that this man's marriage is ending on the grounds of his affair with my wife. I have to say that I sometimes regret not making the jump first, but at the same time, I wanted to fight to save my marriage with everything I had, first. I think I would have regretted the former more than the latter, in the end. But... be warned, the saying that "hell has no fury like a woman scorned" is wrong. Insert "entitled princess" instead, and it would be correct. No matter how wrong her actions, she will justify herself and then crucify you, involving friends, and of course the children. Beware. And do think of the kids. I am sad not to have any, but happy that the horrible divorce was not complicated by that. I am a child of divorced parents and the damage it did still echoes through my life. I am in my forties. Good luck. Be strong. Stay loyal to your children above all else. Don't use them as pawns.


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## InFlux (Oct 30, 2011)

dddivorceee said:


> I had the same situation, but without the kids. She was an "entitled princess" who had an affair with a married man with kids, and denied it. Has continued to do so, despite bang-to-rights evidence, and the fact that this man's marriage is ending on the grounds of his affair with my wife. I have to say that I sometimes regret not making the jump first, but at the same time, I wanted to fight to save my marriage with everything I had, first. I think I would have regretted the former more than the latter, in the end. But... be warned, the saying that "hell has no fury like a woman scorned" is wrong. Insert "entitled princess" instead, and it would be correct. No matter how wrong her actions, she will justify and then crucify you, involving friends, and of course the children. Beware. And do think of the kids. I am sad not to have any, but happy that the horrible divorce was not complicated by that. I am a child of divorced parents and the damage it did still echoes through my life. I am in my forties. Good luck. Be strong. Stay loyal to your children above all else. Don't use them as pawns.


That's why I'm trying to be the one adult in the relationship and not "poke the hornet's nest" for the benefit of our kids. She is an entitled princess but she's also the mother to my kids and she needs to be the best at that as possible without me ratcheting-up the DEFCON level unless absolutely necessary. If we didn't have kids then I think I would be a lot more scorched earth on the whole thing...


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## dddivorceee (Oct 30, 2011)

Oh, and I contacted OMW. She knew all about it anyhow, but made life nicely harder for OM. Had gone loud about the thing months earlier, to friends/family, including hers. She attempted retaliation with all sorts of lies. Get evidence and record everything, so long as you stay within the law. Really put a spanner in the works for my BXW. Satisfaction, to be sure, for me. You can certainly keep it as an ace in the hole. Hard as it may be, a quiet word to the man may focus his mind on the possibility of his losing his wife and family, and force him to drop the thing. You have quite a strong lever there, if his wife does not yet know. She might do, though. And if the nuclear option is triggered prepared to discover you wife is a more aggressive and selfish liar than you could possibly have imagined. I was not prepared for that... though in retrospect it has made it much easier to be pleased to get rid of the B.


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## Arnold (Oct 25, 2011)

InFlux said:


> Let me put it this way -- I reserve the right to play that "hole card" until the time of my choosing (namely after the final judgement is wrapped-up to my liking...)


Just be careful that you do not explicitly say this or memorialize it, as a judge may view it as extortion. But, you certainly can allude to it such that she gets the message.Just make sure there are no witnesses.
I leveraged my XW's fear re her reputation being tarnished such that I got some concessions. Subpoenaeing her phone records made her realize that this was going to go public if she forced things.


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## dddivorceee (Oct 30, 2011)

InFlux said:


> That's why I'm trying to be the one adult in the relationship and not "poke the hornet's nest" for the benefit of our kids. She is an entitled princess but she's also the mother to my kids and she needs to be the best at that as possible without me ratcheting-up the DEFCON level unless absolutely necessary. If we didn't have kids then I think I would be a lot more scorched earth on the whole thing...


Good for you. The better you play things, the closer to being an old-fashioned honorable man, and the more scrupulously HONEST you are with your kids, the more power you will have and the less they will hurt. You will have their respect, even if she lies in the short-term, and in that short term seems to win. If you are honorable, and the injured party, your kids will know this and it will be good for you and them as the years go by. Not so much for her. But do not fall into the temptation to malign her to them. My father did this and it made me lose almost all respect for him, even though my mother had indeed behaved badly. Just stick to the facts, and realise that they will be torn apart and desperately hurting. The less you attack her, to them, the bigger, better man, better parent, and more victorious you will be. Good luck. I feel for you. I have been through it as a kid, and as a husband, and I know what a s-itstorm you are about to go through. Be easy on yourself.


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## ing (Mar 26, 2011)

InFlux said:


> That's why I'm trying to be the one adult in the relationship and not "poke the hornet's nest" for the benefit of our kids. She is an entitled princess but she's also the mother to my kids and she needs to be the best at that as possible without me ratcheting-up the DEFCON level unless absolutely necessary. If we didn't have kids then I think I would be a lot more scorched earth on the whole thing...


I suppose what I am trying to say is that because she feels entitled to *you and the OM* the fact that you are divorcing her will send her to DEFCON because you have removed an option.
I am not sure your plan will work because it assumes she will stay in this year long fantasy. You can't get much more scorched earth then 
" I'm divorcing you"

Given my own experience even following the advice here, which is to remove yourself as an option, it took seven months for her to see what she had done. Now she wants back in and is disrupting on an equal scale in that direction. 

I think in your case she is almost out of the affair. A couple of months of hard 180 and you actually have control. Not hopefully.


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## dddivorceee (Oct 30, 2011)

And one last thing- divorce is horrible. Horrible. Do try everything before that. It will ramify for the rest of all your lives. 7-12 years are the toughest period of almost any relationship. Seen it many times. But I've also seen people get through almost intolerable anger/strife/bitterness and be a happy family again later on. It can happen. Bear that in mind.


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## Arnold (Oct 25, 2011)

Divorce is tough, I agree. But, sometimes you have no choice. She is not quitting the affair, right? She shows zero remorse or empathy. What else can you do?


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## InFlux (Oct 30, 2011)

Arnold said:


> Divorce is tough, I agree. But, sometimes you have no choice. She is not quitting the affair, right? She shows zero remorse or empathy. What else can you do?


True remorse? No. Does she have a guilty conscience? Yes. Guilty enough to stop her teenage behavior? No. We've been sleeping apart for 6 months but I'll wake up in the morning with her beside me sometimes hugging me. Then she'll disappear for 3 days and tells me to take care of our kids and her 94 year old grandma. Believe me -- it's not like I want divorce. It's not like I haven't done a lot of soul-searching about what that means to everyone -- especially to the two people that have no say in the matter (our kids). However, I also cannot tolerate the situation as it currently exists which is my wife is an out-of-control tornado having a narcissisticly great time at my expense. In the mean time I've taken the high road but am losing myself in the process. I also can't ignore that my wife maybe isn't made of the moral fiber I once thought she was. I've lost respect, trust, and love for what we once had. And even if she were to have a moment of clarity I keep thinking in the back of my mind do I really want to be with this woman for the rest of my life? Can I really be with this woman and be truly happy about that decision? Do I have the will inside of me to put in the massive work required into rebuilding on my side for something I wonder might not pan out? I think I could if I saw true remorse, if I saw a woman fighting for her marriage harder than she fought giving birth to our first-borne, if I saw that she truly "gave a damn" and did whatever was required. Like fully committing to individual/marriage counselling, etc. But I keep coming back to the fact that she has been knowingly pile-driving my feelings just to have some narcissistic fun at my expense. For the past year. I asked her recently why she keeps this affair going instead of trying to work on our relationship and she just said "because it's fun". I filed shortly thereafter...


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## ing (Mar 26, 2011)

Arnold said:


> Divorce is tough, I agree. But, sometimes you have no choice. She is not quitting the affair, right? She shows zero remorse or empathy. What else can you do?


Dump consequences on her. 
Tell her if she wants to continue the affair she has to leave. 
Tell her to finance it herself. 
Split the money up. 
Cancel all joint credit cards. 

Divorce is not a good outcome. You are bound together for life because of the kids. It sucks but it is true.


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## dddivorceee (Oct 30, 2011)

InFlux said:


> True remorse? No. Does she have a guilty conscience? Yes. Guilty enough to stop her teenage behavior? No. We've been sleeping apart for 6 months but I'll wake up in the morning with her beside me sometimes hugging me. Then she'll disappear for 3 days and tells me to take care of our kids and her 94 year old grandma. Believe me -- it's not like I want divorce. It's not like I haven't done a lot of soul-searching about what that means to everyone -- especially to the two people that have no say in the matter (our kids). However, I also cannot tolerate the situation as it currently exists which is my wife is an out-of-control tornado having a narcissisticly great time at my expense. In the mean time I've taken the high road but am losing myself in the process. I also can't ignore that my wife maybe isn't made of the moral fiber I once thought she was. I've lost respect, trust, and love for what we once had. And even if she were to have a moment of clarity I keep thinking in the back of my mind do I really want to be with this woman for the rest of my life? Can I really be with this woman and be truly happy about that decision? Do I have the will inside of me to put in the massive work required into rebuilding on my side for something I wonder might not pan out? I think I could if I saw true remorse, if I saw a woman fighting for her marriage harder than she fought giving birth to our first-borne, if I saw that she truly "gave a damn" and did whatever was required. Like fully committing to individual/marriage counselling, etc. But I keep coming back to the fact that she has been knowingly pile-driving my feelings just to have some narcissistic fun at my expense. For the past year. I asked her recently why she keeps this affair going instead of trying to work on our relationship and she just said "because it's fun". I filed shortly thereafter...


What cruel and stupid behaviour. I am sure she has other qualities which made you marry her in the first place, and perhaps this is temporary. However... She is throwing away a good man for an adulterous lying b-stard, she is dragging her children towards a precipice over which their lives will be irreparably damaged (they can recover and have great lives, but... the harm will be hard and longstanding, without doubt), she is demonstrating flippant cruelty to the man who gave her her children and has fought with what appears to be considerable patience to keep his marriage, for all sakes concerned, despite horrific damage to his male pride (and believe me I understand that anguish). Understood. It just makes me so angry to see this happen. Please take this as a handshake and a tip of the hat from a sympathetic stranger.


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

You're enabling her to eat her cake by keeping her nice safe home, the kids with her, and her married lover.

A house for the kids - ok, the kids ok - but you really need to blow up her affair and torch the nice piece on the side this guy is getting. He has help trash your marriage, and he is suffering no consequence for it.

Not to mention it is the moral thing to do to warn his wife that she is married to a cheating scum bag.

and what is she going to be teaching your daughters ? that it's ok to be a cheating skank.


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## InFlux (Oct 30, 2011)

Shaggy said:


> You're enabling her to eat her cake by keeping her nice safe home, the kids with her, and her married lover.
> 
> A house for the kids - ok, the kids ok - but you really need to blow up her affair and torch the nice piece on the side this guy is getting. He has help trash your marriage, and he is suffering no consequence for it.
> 
> ...


Told her I'm keeping the house she gets to move out. That's it. She said "whatever -- take everything." That's just the rebellious teenager talking. Point is she gets to find a new place for her new life.


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

Talk is cheap. She can say have it, but I bet she feels deeply entitled to cake eating - meaning she wants the house and you continuing to fund her. 

I think you're going about this wrong. I would expose the affair, blow it up out of the water. Then when she's dealing with the loss of that and no longer feeling free and untouchable, only then talk about the terms of divorce.

I predict she will not play nice when you really get down to the details and the signing. she thinks she holds all the cards right now, and likely sees you are the guy who is having the hissy fit and trying to control her unreasonably. From her view, why should you get anything as you're the one who's ending this nice arrangement where she had a warm home and could have sex with anyone she wanted without consequence.


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## InFlux (Oct 30, 2011)

Shaggy said:


> Talk is cheap. She can say have it, but I bet she feels deeply entitled to cake eating - meaning she wants the house and you continuing to fund her.
> 
> I think you're going about this wrong. I would expose the affair, blow it up out of the water. Then when she's dealing with the loss of that and no longer feeling free and untouchable, only then talk about the terms of divorce.
> 
> I predict she will not play nice when you really get down to the details and the signing. she thinks she holds all the cards right now, and likely sees you are the guy who is having the hissy fit and trying to control her unreasonably. From her view, why should you get anything as you're the one who's ending this nice arrangement where she had a warm home and could have sex with anyone she wanted without consequence.


Perhaps...but we're going to mediation soon and I'm going to float this arrangement. Let's see if she balks. If she does, then I hit the destruct button on her fun and tarnish her rep. I've already warned her about it. At least I would feel better in that case that she gave me no choice and showed me her true colors. She's always been so naive, however, I have a feeling she'll rollover...


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## vickyyy (Oct 28, 2011)

You are selfish.OM's wife also deserve to know about affair.You dont have any self respect either.


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## InFlux (Oct 30, 2011)

vickyyy said:


> You are selfish.OM's wife also deserve to know about affair.You dont have any self respect either.


Of course opinions are like a$$holes -- everyone has one. As for mine, I sleep easier at night knowing I'm not complicit in destroying anyone's marriage other than my own (right now it's just my WW and the OM that's complicit for blowing-up two marriages...) As far as I'm concerned my WW initiated all of this and my WW needs to end all of this if she gives a $hit about her marriage/family. If she can't do that in the face of divorce then karma/life will take care of the rest. I will move on, however, and find a partner worthy of my love and affection.


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## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

InFlux said:


> Of course opinions are like a$$holes -- everyone has one. As for mine, I sleep easier at night knowing I'm not complicit in destroying anyone's marriage other than my own (right now it's just my WW and the OM that's complicit for blowing-up two marriages...) As far as I'm concerned my WW initiated all of this and my WW needs to end all of this if she gives a $hit about her marriage/family. If she can't do that in the face of divorce then karma/life will take care of the rest. I will move on, however, and find a partner worthy of my love and affection.


What you don't understand is that your WW and OM already damaged OMW's marriage, she just doesn't know it, it's his fault, not hers, and most certainly not yours. She DESERVES to know what kind of man she is married to so that she can make an informed decision as to the course of her marriage. If the situation were reversed, you would want to know. She's probably in the dark, suffering, and wondering why her gut feelings are screaming at her, while her WH is out cheating with your WW. 

Another reason is that she MAY have information about the affair that you don't know about. It brings another pair of eyes on the affair.

And yet another reason is that if she were to confront her WH about the affair (her DDay), she may take more action than you would. Very few OM are willing to leave their marriages for their OW, that's a fact. OM will most likely throw your WW under the bus, go into damage control, and attempt to save his marriage. 

This is why exposure to the other BS is so important in killing the affair. This is a tried and true method that has worked time and time again here. Shining light on the affair brings it to reality.

Here's an example from the famous Shamwow thread.

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/29971-wife-travels-lot-sex-life-has-stalled-worried-help-155.html

He exposed the A to the OMW, she was thankful, confronted her WH, who promptly threw Shamwow's WW under the bus, and is now doing everything he can to save his marriage.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

vickyyy said:


> You are selfish.OM's wife also deserve to know about affair.You dont have any self respect either.


:iagree::iagree::iagree::iagree::iagree::iagree:

In reality you are now an affair partner. By inaction you are enabling an affair that is destroying another family. And the real reason is you simply don't have the backbone to stand up for both families.

Keeping this info secret from the other mans wife is just as bad as what your wife and the other man is doing. You're manipulating the affair so that you will have a hole card.

What it looks like is you're just trying to slink out of a bad situation with your tail between your legs. 

Just another opinion.


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## dddivorceee (Oct 30, 2011)

chapparal said:


> :iagree::iagree::iagree::iagree::iagree::iagree:
> 
> In reality you are now an affair partner. By inaction you are enabling an affair that is destroying another family. And the real reason is you simply don't have the backbone to stand up for both families.
> 
> ...


And a very harsh one at that! Have you been in a similar situation? If not, then I would climb down from that extremely high hobby-horse you are sitting on, and stow your armour of self-righteous anonymity!


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## Arnold (Oct 25, 2011)

InFlux said:


> Of course opinions are like a$$holes -- everyone has one. As for mine, I sleep easier at night knowing I'm not complicit in destroying anyone's marriage other than my own (right now it's just my WW and the OM that's complicit for blowing-up two marriages...) As far as I'm concerned my WW initiated all of this and my WW needs to end all of this if she gives a $hit about her marriage/family. If she can't do that in the face of divorce then karma/life will take care of the rest. I will move on, however, and find a partner worthy of my love and affection.


I have to disagree with you on this point,although ,in general, I think you ae handling most things alright.
We betrayed spouses need to support each other. It is wrong to let another person be left in the dark. You should tell this guy's wife.


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## Numb-badger (May 18, 2011)

Ok, let's just take this down a notch guys.
Dddivorcee, most of us here KNOW what you're going through. I too have a WW, four kids and a mortgaged house - an established family base. I too have a lot to consider and have tried damn hard at making the marriage work. I am at a point where D or R are equal options for me personally, neither more daunting than the other. What happens now depends on what SHE does.
I agree that filing for divorce in your case is the right thing to do, however I feel that you really should inform the OMW and present her with the evidence - this will allow her to make life desicions for herself and her kids based on the truth. It is what I would want and it's what most other people would want.
I really do not want to offend, so please don't take this next piece as an insult, but rather as the question it is intended:
Do you fear that by exposing the affair to the OMW that your wife may resent you for it and destroy any chance you have of making it work? Or do you in anyway fear that exposure may have other negative consequences towards you and prevent reconcilliation?
All we ask is that you don't hold on to your pride and hope that she will suddenly see the light and make a turnaround - the fog is FAR too strong for that. 
Please reconsider and expose the affair. 99% sure the OM will throw your wife away to salvage his life. Your WW will then be standing over a large dark hole with nowhere to turn. She will have lost her fantasy and her real life. The fog is rarely strong enough to keep a fantasy alive at this point.

Best wishes and take care

N-B


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## Arnold (Oct 25, 2011)

Wel said, Numb. 
Lokk, regardless of whether you diivorce, you don't want this guy around your kids, right?
I was sure I could never forget what my XW did. I knew I wanted a divorce fairly early. I lost all respect for her.
But, I was damned if a guy willing to have sex for a year with a married mom of three young girls was going to be part of their lives. He was single, but I exposed to everyone, kids included. The kids needed to know the type of man he was.
My XW's family made it clear he would never bewelcome into the family. The kids hated him. The affair broke down shortly afer the divorce.


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## dddivorceee (Oct 30, 2011)

Numb-badger said:


> Ok, let's just take this down a notch guys.
> Dddivorcee, most of us here KNOW what you're going through. I too have a WW, four kids and a mortgaged house - an established family base. I too have a lot to consider and have tried damn hard at making the marriage work. I am at a point where D or R are equal options for me personally, neither more daunting than the other. What happens now depends on what SHE does.
> I agree that filing for divorce in your case is the right thing to do, however I feel that you really should inform the OMW and present her with the evidence - this will allow her to make life desicions for herself and her kids based on the truth. It is what I would want and it's what most other people would want.
> I really do not want to offend, so please don't take this next piece as an insult, but rather as the question it is intended:
> ...


Um... I think you meant that for the original poster. I DID expose my wife's affair. Generally I think it is the right way to go. But then... there are other considerations. Namely the psychological health of the OM/OMW's children. In my case, there was no issue there, as she already had some idea. When I exposed the affair and contacted her, I was only half-sure of that. It turned out she was fully aware and was filing for divorce on those grounds. I agree with you in general. But I think you were addressing the wrong person.


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## dddivorceee (Oct 30, 2011)

Arnold said:


> Wel said, Numb.
> Lokk, regardless of whether you diivorce, you don't want this guy around your kids, right?
> I was sure I could never forget what my XW did. I knew I wanted a divorce fairly early. I lost all respect for her.
> But, I was damned if a guy willing to have sex for a year with a married mom of three young girls was going to be part of their lives. He was single, but I exposed to everyone, kids included. The kids needed to know the type of man he was.
> My XW's family made it clear he would never bewelcome into the family. The kids hated him. The affair broke down shortly afer the divorce.


Good for you, friend. And I'm very glad your XW's family didn't close ranks against you. That happened to me. But I let her lie to them- I don't have kids, and have no vested interest in destroying my XW's relationship with her own family. I told them of the affair, and they were sympathetic at first. Then I just stopped communicating with them, and she lied a pretty tale to them, and now that is her mess to deal with. She continues to live a lie, though I am fairly certain not with OM, which is why she's lost the "affair glow" she once had, and has aged 10 years in less than one!


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## MrQuatto (Jul 7, 2010)

ing said:


> Dump consequences on her.
> Tell her if she wants to continue the affair she has to leave.
> Tell her to finance it herself.
> Split the money up.
> ...


:iagree: Yes yes, 

and tell her that her 94 year old grandma is her responsibility, not yours.


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

dddivorceee said:


> And a very harsh one at that! Have you been in a similar situation? If not, then I would climb down from that extremely high hobby-horse you are sitting on, and stow your armour of self-righteous anonymity!


Wow, I must disagree here. From those who have been in the situation it is so very frustrating that a world of people who knew, but kept silent for whatever reason.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## MrQuatto (Jul 7, 2010)

dddivorceee said:


> And a very harsh one at that! Have you been in a similar situation? If not, then I would climb down from that extremely high hobby-horse you are sitting on, and stow your armour of self-righteous anonymity!


ddd, If you take the time to read through many of the threads on here, you will find that almost every one of us were in EXACTLY that same position once, which is why we are here now. So, please don't take this wrong but perhaps you should look at the whole carousel before torching the horse that is not glittering that way you want it to.

Q~


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## PHTlump (Jun 2, 2010)

InFlux said:


> ... I sleep easier at night knowing I'm not complicit in destroying anyone's marriage other than my own (right now it's just my WW and the OM that's complicit for blowing-up two marriages...) As far as I'm concerned my WW initiated all of this and my WW needs to end all of this if she gives a $hit about her marriage/family. If she can't do that in the face of divorce then karma/life will take care of the rest.


You're just rationalizing staying silent.

If you see a man snatch an old lady's purse and run away, do you tell the cops what he looked like and which direction he headed, or do you figure karma will take care of it?

If you see a blind man walking straight toward the edge of a cliff, do you speak up, or do you figure karma will take care of him?

Read some of the threads on this forum about friends and accomplices that knew about affairs and stayed silent, rationalizing that it wasn't their place to interfere in someone else's marriage by alerting one spouse that the other was cheating. I've never seen a betrayed spouse write that they understand and harbor no ill will toward these people. They universally write that they wished someone had the guts to speak up and tell them that they were living a lie. Most often, they can't continue to be friends with these people who kept them in the dark.

If you don't want to tell the OMW of the affair, obviously nobody can force you to. But, you won't convince anybody here that you're doing the right thing.


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## dddivorceee (Oct 30, 2011)

Shaggy and MrQ- 

Shaggy, have been in that situation myself, though not with kids. The OM had kids, we didn't. But her betrayal was immense, prolonged, and horrible. She also went out of her way to lie to our mutual friends, and even family (including my own) about a range of issues to cover her tracks and distract from what she was doing. I did in fact "go loud" about the affair, and DID contact OMW. 

MrQ- Apologies, perhaps. But I can't really be expected to read "all" the posts of every poster on every thread before commenting. Are you seriously suggesting I should? This is not my full time career, after all! Also, I was simply objecting in fairly strong terms to the very strong and rather disparaging terms you set out. I actually fundamentally agree (see above), and have acted that way myself.


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## Halien (Feb 20, 2011)

dddivorceee said:


> And a very harsh one at that! Have you been in a similar situation? If not, then I would climb down from that extremely high hobby-horse you are sitting on, and stow your armour of self-righteous anonymity!


umm ... I think this was why another poster asked you to read a few posts from some of the others before coming in with guns blazing. Most of these people have been through this before.

This isn't like the other forums that you might have seen. I've never been through infidelity, but these people, for the most part, genuinely mean well. Some have been at the receiving end of being kept in the dark.


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## dddivorceee (Oct 30, 2011)

Halien et al: 

Apologies for the strength of what I said. Possibly over the top. Yes. But then I felt the post I was reacting to was pretty over the top aggressive on a personal level as well... using terms like "just trying to slink out of a bad situation with your tail between your legs" and "the real reason is you simply don't have the backbone to stand up for both families" and "just as bad as what your wife and the other man is [sic] doing". If you ask me, that is some very harsh and rather self-righteous critique, no? 

It demonstrates an absolute conviction that a complex situation is absolutely simple, and a comfortableness with belittling and vilifying a stranger over that situation, whose complexities are not necessarily obvious. As I have repeatedly said, in a very similar situation I did inform the OMW, and go loud over the affair. So, if you read the whole thread yourself, you would have found out that I "generally mean well" and am indeed myself one of those who has been "at the receiving end of being kept in the dark", and acted accordingly!


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## Numb-badger (May 18, 2011)

dddivorceee said:


> Um... I think you meant that for the original poster. . . . . I agree with you in general. But I think you were addressing the wrong person.


 yep I did. Got so caught up in trying to put out the flames, I lost sight of where the fire started. 
Sorry Ddd - reaim post to OP


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## dddivorceee (Oct 30, 2011)

Numb-badger said:


> yep I did. Got so caught up in trying to put out the flames, I lost sight of where the fire started.
> Sorry Ddd - reaim post to OP


:smthumbup:


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

InFlux said:


> Of course opinions are like a$$holes -- everyone has one. As for mine, I sleep easier at night knowing I'm not complicit in destroying anyone's marriage other than my own (right now it's just my WW and the OM that's complicit for blowing-up two marriages...) As far as I'm concerned my WW initiated all of this and my WW needs to end all of this if she gives a $hit about her marriage/family. If she can't do that in the face of divorce then karma/life will take care of the rest. I will move on, however, and find a partner worthy of my love and affection.


Well exposing the affair isn't "destroying" anyone's marriage. teh OM and your wife did that all on their own. Exposing is so taht the other betrayed party is aware. In a way, it's protecting them, it's sharing The Truth with them so they aren't played for a fool either. After all, they have the right to know the whole truth about their marriage. Not telling is enabling the affair, IMO. It's covering it up, letting it stew in secrecy. Exposing makes the other BS aware of what's going on so they can make an informed decision about what to do/have a choice in the matter. And get tested for STDs.



dddivorceee said:


> And a very harsh one at that! Have you been in a similar situation? If not, then I would climb down from that extremely high hobby-horse you are sitting on, and stow your armour of self-righteous anonymity!


Most of the people who post in Coping w/ Infidelity have been betrayed themselves...


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## InFlux (Oct 30, 2011)

Jellybeans said:


> Most of the people who post in Coping w/ Infidelity have been betrayed themselves...


Which is the case here.



Jellybeans said:


> Well exposing the affair isn't "destroying" anyone's marriage. teh OM and your wife did that all on their own. Exposing is so taht the other betrayed party is aware. In a way, it's protecting them, it's sharing The Truth with them so they aren't played for a fool either. After all, they have the right to know the whole truth about their marriage. Not telling is enabling the affair, IMO. It's covering it up, letting it stew in secrecy. Exposing makes the other BS aware of what's going on so they can make an informed decision about what to do/have a choice in the matter. And get tested for STDs.


I will tell OMW and not because you've guys been smacking me silly, albeit some of you from your moral high horses!

Look, I've never been through any of this (I would never wish this hell on anyone!) but I do know OM is married and has kids. I'm a father of two of my own. What pisses me off is that kids have no say in any of this $hit including OMW's. I pictured OMW's kids image of their dad (or who they thought was their dad) shattered. Initiated, in part, by a phone call/package that I delivered to their mother. I had also believed, correctly in part, that it's my WW that initiated everything and it remains her responsibility to end it. It's a much stronger statement to the betrayed (me) if she can find that strength within her instead of me hosting an "intervention". 

But here's the thing I'm realizing....She won't. She can't. She had a year to find the courage within her and she failed. She failed even when she turned around and saw the mushroom cloud of her marriage spewing-up into the sky. It's hard to see the truth about yourself or those you most love sometimes. It's easy to look the other way. But *I* couldn't take it any longer. I filed. I moved on mentally. I grieved the loss of the relationship. She lost all of MY respect and HER OWN at the same time. OM initiated the same on his side. It's not MY fault if his kids are affected even if I somehow set the steamroller on his life in motion. Even then it's not MY fault. It's HIS. And now, though my wife is weak willed, I think I need to see if she will take such a "I can give a $hit" attitude about our marriage ending with the OM out of the picture. Even if I have to nuke it from his end.

Thanks for the opposing views.


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## InFlux (Oct 30, 2011)

Any advice for contacting OMW? If I'm going to do this I want to make sure she is the one that I talk to. Don't have her email but I do know their address and her name. Anonymous package? Maybe certified mail I was thinking with a signature required from her. What if OM intercepts? For that matter what if kid intercepts? That one, in particular, would kill me...


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## RadicallyAccepting (Oct 19, 2011)

InFlux - 

Join the club that sucks. Living with a woman in love with another man just sucks, especially when they can't seem to understand that it's a problem - my wife is very upset with me that I've started divorce proceedings, but she won't give "him" up.

I PM'd you with some links. Feel free to PM me if you want to talk. I know where you are, I'm there to, and I find it helps to talk to someone going through the same thing. You're not alone.

RA


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

InFlux said:


> Any advice for contacting OMW? If I'm going to do this I want to make sure she is the one that I talk to. Don't have her email but I do know their address and her name. Anonymous package? Maybe certified mail I was thinking with a signature required from her. What if OM intercepts? For that matter what if kid intercepts? That one, in particular, would kill me...


I recommend UPS or Fedex signature required as the post office is lazy with certified mail and dont always get the right person to sign for it

this a letter you can modify-



> Originally Posted by Jellybeans View Post
> Neal, this is copy/pasted from another thread that I wrote in, but here's how it goes down when you expose:
> 
> Here's the thing about exposure: NEVER GIVE YOUR SPOUSE OR THE OTHER WOMAN/MAN WARNING THAT YOU ARE ABOUT TO EXPOSE. JUST DO IT!!!
> ...


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## dddivorceee (Oct 30, 2011)

InFlux said:


> Any advice for contacting OMW? If I'm going to do this I want to make sure she is the one that I talk to. Don't have her email but I do know their address and her name. Anonymous package? Maybe certified mail I was thinking with a signature required from her. What if OM intercepts? For that matter what if kid intercepts? That one, in particular, would kill me...


Well, tried to defend you a bit but got smacked just as hard. Anyhow... I do think it is right that you let OMW know. However hard that is. Took me nearly 5 months. Eventually, I tracked down her phone number from her name and home address records- just directory enquiry really. And then, after a LOT of pacing, and several abortive attempts (my abort), I just dialled the number. I got a man. I am actually presuming it was OM. I have only met him once, on the night he and my BXW met. I simply asked for her. He said "what is this about"? And I replied: "It is a private matter." To which he replied: "Private matter... hmmm." I think he had an inkling who it was, but was not sure. They were still cohabiting at the time. Then he handed the phone over, and I simply said it out in one line. There was a brief and difficult silence, and then she replied "I know." The conversation became much easier after that, though believe me she didn't enjoy it anyhow, and neither did I. I would suggest doing the same. Packages and mail... thought about it, but too easily intercepted. Email too. I was told by OMW during that conversation that she had tried to email me 8 months before, based on her own suspicions. I never received the email, and am pretty sure my wife intercepted it, warned by her OM. I did not used to hide my email from my wife. Though she did from me for the 8 months previously, and I had confronted her about this, she lying, and me choosing to trust... 

I FULLY understand your concerns about her children and their world being shattered. It was my primary motivation for delay. I thought, well, my marriage is over, but who knows, since I went loud on my side about the affair, it likely ended, and maybe things will be salvageable on the other side. I do not fully agree with the other posters on this. I do think that there is moral complexity here. This is why I chose to defend the reasonableness of your delay. Interesting that almost everyone who attacked me on that basis suggested that I should be aware that there were others who had gone through the same experience, not seeming to notice that that definitely included me! Ah well... 

Good luck. It is a very hard thing to do. But on balance, I feel I did the right thing. You may find, as I did, she knows a lot more than you suppose. Don't, however, expect gratitude. Best wishes.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

InFlux...are you on Facebook? If you are, then maybe you can find her on Facebook and send her a private message there.


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## Sindo (Oct 29, 2011)

Do you really think there's the slightest chance telling OMW will save your marriage? If you do, go right ahead. If you don't then all you're doing is making her suffer. It's short term satisfaction, but you will lose that amicable divorce. 

Think this through. Don't let your own high emotions or those of others get the better of you.

Remember, you can tell OMW any time you want. There is no expiry date. You can tell her now, but you can just as easily tell her after the divorce is finalized. You're holding all the cards right now.


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## InFlux (Oct 30, 2011)

Sindo said:


> Do you really think there's the slightest chance telling OMW will save your marriage? If you do, go right ahead. If you don't then all you're doing is making her suffer. It's short term satisfaction, but you will lose that amicable divorce.
> 
> Think this through. Don't let your own high emotions or those of others get the better of you.
> 
> Remember, you can tell OMW any time you want. There is no expiry date. You can tell her now, but you can just as easily tell her after the divorce is finalized. You're holding all the cards right now.


I hear you -- though I was thinking of blowing things up on his end before our divorce is finalized. That way my WW at least has the opportunity to show me something without any nets. I'm thinking, however, I should tell OMW after we have a deal in mediation, the papers are signed, but before the final judgement is entered. That way I still have an opportunity of pulling the plug. And also, in the event she really doesn't give a damn, then I got the best deal while I had her in a more compliant state of mind...


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## Arnold (Oct 25, 2011)

dddivorceee said:


> Good for you, friend. And I'm very glad your XW's family didn't close ranks against you. That happened to me. But I let her lie to them- I don't have kids, and have no vested interest in destroying my XW's relationship with her own family. I told them of the affair, and they were sympathetic at first. Then I just stopped communicating with them, and she lied a pretty tale to them, and now that is her mess to deal with. She continues to live a lie, though I am fairly certain not with OM, which is why she's lost the "affair glow" she once had, and has aged 10 years in less than one!



Yes, her family's support was much appreciated. I still go on golf vcations with her dad and brothers and her parents, regularly, invite me over for breakfast or dinner.
This served some very good purposes, in addition to my not having to forfeit the relationships I had with them all.
First, it pissed my XW off to no end. And, it was fun to watch how it aggravated her.
Second, I knew, intuitively and through reading, that the cheater often smears the betrayed to family and friends, in aneffort to garner support and to justify. However, when all our acquaintences would see me continuing with her folks, going o plays, attending grandkid functions while sitting with them vs her being off on her own, it helped to undermine her credibility. My kids still loving me did the same.
Finally, it deove a huge wedge between the OM nd my XW. he was confusd as hell. Here, this monster of a husband(me) was still like and loved by everyone that knew us during our marriage. Even as dumb as this guy was(he was her HS boyfriend who she had cheated on when she started having sex withher soccer coach twenty years earlier), he began to see her for hwhat she is.


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## Arnold (Oct 25, 2011)

PHTlump said:


> You're just rationalizing staying silent.
> 
> If you see a man snatch an old lady's purse and run away, do you tell the cops what he looked like and which direction he headed, or do you figure karma will take care of it?
> 
> ...




Very well stated.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Sindo said:


> Do you really think there's the slightest chance telling OMW will save your marriage? If you do, go right ahead. If you don't then all you're doing is making her suffer. It's short term satisfaction, but you will lose that amicable divorce.


I respectfully disagree. It's not even about "saving his marriage" (ok, that's part of it). The main reason is because *THE BETRAYED HAS A RIGHT TO KNOW THE TRUTH. *


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## Arnold (Oct 25, 2011)

Jellybeans said:


> I respectfully disagree. It's not even about "saving his marriage" (ok, that's part of it). The main reason is because *THE BETRAYED HAS A RIGHT TO KNOW THE TRUTH. *


I suppose they are out there, but I can recall no betrayed spouse I have dealt with wishing he or she had not been told. There are , of course the prectical considerations, like the fact that this guy's wife is being exposed to the entire sexual history of the woman he is schtuppping. How likely is it that a woman like Influx's wife has not been with a lot of other gus?
And, the betrayed spouse kept in the dark is deprives of the ability to mitigate her damages. Some of us may have wanted to move on sooner vs hanging in and losing other opportunities for happiness.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

I agree.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

dddivorceee said:


> And a very harsh one at that! Have you been in a similar situation? If not, then I would climb down from that extremely high hobby-horse you are sitting on, and stow your armour of self-righteous anonymity!


Yes I have been in a similar situation, where friends (best man in their wedding) didn't tell me until I pretty much had it figured out.

Sure am glad I didn't mention the chains, junk yard dog, or baseball bat. You would have popped a blood vessel.


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## MrQuatto (Jul 7, 2010)

Sindo said:


> Do you really think there's the slightest chance telling OMW will save your marriage? If you do, go right ahead. If you don't then all you're doing is making her suffer. It's short term satisfaction, but you will lose that amicable divorce.
> 
> Think this through. Don't let your own high emotions or those of others get the better of you.
> 
> Remember, you can tell OMW any time you want. There is no expiry date. You can tell her now, but you can just as easily tell her after the divorce is finalized. You're holding all the cards right now.


I'm sorry but I completely disagree on this. The point of exposing to the significant other can sometimes help to save the marriage but the main reasons to do it are 2 fold. 

1st off is the fact that the significant other deserves to know, as Jelly alluded to. Now there are many who will put up the argument of how it destroys families or causes the significant other to suffer. The reason the suffering takes place and that the family is ruined is because of the infidelity, not the exposure. People have been cheating for hundreds of years. Most get caught. Are you telling me that the suffering is more if someone else inform them of the infidelity, then it is when they... like you... have figured it out yourself? Would the pain be more if you were told 3 months before, or 6 month before you found out yourself? Or would it still just friggin suck, just like it does now?

The other, and in my opinion, more main reason to expose, is to make the affair difficult to continue. Once it is exposed and everyone knows of it, the "forbidden fruit" appeal of it is washed away. Now they are just a cheater... if they continue. Many times, one party or the other kills the affair to try to save their marriage. If the affair is no longer there, then there is a slight possibility the DS may look seriously at trying to reconcile.


Now, in the time that myself, and I KNOW many of the others here have seen the same thing, a marriage will not ever recover i there is an affair ongoing. There are times where exposure helps to stop the affair and other times where it furthers the divide between the BS and the DS and the marriage ends. And lets be honest, if that ends the marriage, the marriage was ending anyway.

But in my experience, there has been painfully few, if any, examples where the marriage was saved by not exposing. So, it is not a moral superiority issue, it is an experience issue. 

If you ask for advice, it can be very likely you will not get advice you want to hear, but I can assure you that everyone here, passionate as we may be, are only here to help and are giving the advice they think you need to hear.

And if we appear pushy or terse, it is only because we are seeing another of countless threads where someone is making the same error in judgment we have seen dozens of times before, knowing that it will run as painful a course as all the others have.

So if my advice here is unwelcome by the OP, I will simply bow out and hope you don't have the same painful experiences so many of us have had.

~Q


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## Arnold (Oct 25, 2011)

I agree with most of your reasoning , Quattro. But, from what I have read, the vast majority of affairs are never detected. Does not change the fact tht it is morally right to tell for the other reasons you state.
But, I think it is a huge misconception that folks have thinking most folks get caught. This is why when a person discovers an affair, he or she is well advised to keep digging, as there were , likely more in the past.


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## InFlux (Oct 30, 2011)

Jellybeans said:


> InFlux...are you on Facebook? If you are, then maybe you can find her on Facebook and send her a private message there.


Yes, I am on Facebook and I found her Facebook profile. Do you think that's a pretty reliable way of getting it to her? Assuming her scumbag husband isn't monitoring her Facebook account, she should read it I would think. I'm thinking I'll just send a message along with my phone number if she wants to call me. She'll probably want some "evidence" (pictures, etc.) to really believe it I would think...

God, I hope she doesn't read that message on her phone in a Starbucks or something!


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## Eli-Zor (Nov 14, 2010)

Before you send the message see of you can find a friend who looks like a sibling or parent ,then message both her and this person asking them to call you urgently due to an issue personal to her , unfortunately you must mention she must not speak to her husband until after she calls you. 

See if the OM has a facebbook page , if so access it and copy as many of the names and facebook links of family and close friends into a secure document . If you do not get a positive response from the wife then you have no choice to do a Facebook exposure , there is a message template should you have to go this route.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Enginerd (May 24, 2011)

InFlux said:


> I hear you -- though I was thinking of blowing things up on his end before our divorce is finalized. That way my WW at least has the opportunity to show me something without any nets. I'm thinking, however, I should tell OMW after we have a deal in mediation, the papers are signed, but before the final judgement is entered. That way I still have an opportunity of pulling the plug. And also, in the event she really doesn't give a damn, then I got the best deal while I had her in a more compliant state of mind...


I think you have it right. Make your deal and sign the papers first. If you blow it up before you complete your deal she may begin to fight the divorce and then only the will lawyers win. Once everything settles down then you can tell the OMW in an attempt to keep him out of your kids lives. However, she can still take her revenge through the children. What ever you do be sure that you tell your kids first because she will most likely make you out to be the bad guy one way or another. I like your attitude and I also believe in karma.

Good Luck


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## Arnold (Oct 25, 2011)

I have no problem with getting the deal in place first.


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## ing (Mar 26, 2011)

Wow.. You all went ballistic on the InFLux! 

Telling the other spouse is something I dd not do. She has a severely disabled child and needs the financial and physical support of her scumbag partner. This is regardless of whether he is cheating or not. Those people who are bound together with kids will probably understand the reason I did not tell. She is between a rock and a very hard place. Even if she did know. What could she do. 
As of a few days ago my stbxw ended the affair under constant and unremitting pressure from me about the effect it was having on the other family. It took her quiet a while to realize it was not about me and our family anymore. i found her behavior abhorrent and it finally got through to her that I would never change my opinion on that and she so desperately wanted my approval..

More than one way of skinning a cat..[sorry puss]


InFlux. My stbxw did almost exactly the same as yours. She was "honest" and told me about the affair and then went and had it anyway! 
Fortunately for me I found this forum and got hit just as hard as you just got hit. 
You must stop enabling her cake eating. 
She probably sees you as a constant and that you will continue to love her no matter what happens. 
She has turned you into a Family Member. You aren't . You were her lover and your love is conditional. 
She needs to understand this. 
So far you have enabled her view of you. When you said "Divorce" she suddenly realized she has pushed you too far. 

Expect fake reconciliation attempts as she tries to find ways to have her cake and eat it too. Watch the communication. Guard your feelings.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

ing said:


> Wow.. You all went ballistic on the InFLux!
> 
> Telling the other spouse is something I dd not do. She has a severely disabled child and needs the financial and physical support of her scumbag partner. This is regardless of whether he is cheating or not. Those people who are bound together with kids will probably understand the reason I did not tell. She is between a rock and a very hard place. Even if she did know. What could she do.
> As of a few days ago my stbxw ended the affair under constant and unremitting pressure from me about the effect it was having on the other family. It took her quiet a while to realize it was not about me and our family anymore. i found her behavior abhorrent and it finally got through to her that I would never change my opinion on that and she so desperately wanted my approval..
> ...


If the OM's wife got rid of POSOM how would he avoid supporting his children? What are the odds he's already been out looking for another affair partner? What if he brings home a major STD the next time?

She deserved/deserves the truth. Don't get me wrong, I believe there are times when the truth can be more trouble than its worth, but not when its about adultery.


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## Arnold (Oct 25, 2011)

I have a severly disabled child, as well ,ing.I am glad my first xw's sister came to me and busted her. I would not be able to take care of my boy ,if I got HIV. 
And, as far as the financial concerns, courts award child suport and spousal maintenance.If she has to take care of her child, he would pay.


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## ing (Mar 26, 2011)

Arnold said:


> I have a severly disabled child, as well ,ing.I am glad my first xw's sister came to me and busted her. I would not be able to take care of my boy ,if I got HIV.
> And, as far as the financial concerns, courts award child suport and spousal maintenance.If she has to take care of her child, he would pay.


THANK YOU. I really needed some help there. I have been struggling with it for a long time. I have the email ready to go, almost hit it several times and then something stopped me. 

It took me some time to get her contact details anyway. I am still not entirely sure I have the right email address but I am now 95% sure. 
Out it will go. Thanks so much.


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## PHTlump (Jun 2, 2010)

Sindo said:


> Do you really think there's the slightest chance telling OMW will save your marriage? If you do, go right ahead. If you don't then all you're doing is making her suffer.


Right. That's why I think doctors should not tell patients when they have a terminal disease. It just makes them sad.


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## Arnold (Oct 25, 2011)

PHTlump said:


> Right. That's why I think doctors should not tell patients when they have a terminal disease. It just makes them sad.


Very nicely put.


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## WasDecimated (Mar 23, 2011)

> Yes, I am on Facebook and I found her Facebook profile. Do you think that's a pretty reliable way of getting it to her? Assuming her scumbag husband isn't monitoring her Facebook account, she should read it I would think. I'm thinking I'll just send a message along with my phone number if she wants to call me. She'll probably want some "evidence" (pictures, etc.) to really believe it I would think...


This is what I did. I wasn't satisfied with the progress my WW and I were making after she swore NC so I decided to contact the OMW to inform her and also to see if she knew anything. I found her on fakebook and sent her a message. I simply and as nicely as possible told her that her husband and my wife were involved in an affair and that I thought she had the right to know. I told her that I had evidence that I would share with her if she was interested. I gave her my cell # and let her know she could contact me if she wanted to talk further.

She called me back almost immediately. I turns out she knew a lot more then I did and her evidence was much better. She sent me many months of messages between my WW and OM...all together...thousands. She was glad to send me copies. This stuff was extremely painful to read for me...it hurt deeply. The point is I got info that I needed and she got what she needed. My wife up until that point had me convinced that her affair was just a EA...now I knew she was a liar and the true extent of it. OM was gaslighting his wife for 1 1/2 years. She was happy to finally realize she wasn't crazy. She started keeping a closer eye on him from her end. After I relieved the messages to my wife she actually showed real shame for the first time.

Our R actually got a lot better after that. Unfortunately it has gone down hill since but that is because my WW can't seem to talk about the affair even know I have so many details.

The OM's wife may already know. She must be at least suspicious even appreciative. I am glad I did because now I know the truth.


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