# Does beauty/height really matter in a forever lasting marriage?



## yargd (5 d ago)

I'm an average looking person, same as my parents. I see beautiful/tall people get an advantage in relationship, jobs, and tend to get more people to support them. I'm wondering if it is important to marry a beautiful/tall wife to get beautiful/tall children. Please share your experience. Thanks.


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## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

Ugly people can have beautiful children and beautiful people can have ugly children. 

Also the same couple can produce both ugly and beautiful children. It's all in how the cookie crumbles.

Surely you know this.


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## blackclover3 (Apr 23, 2021)

yargd said:


> I'm an average looking person, same as my parents. I see good looking people get an advantage in relationship, jobs, and tend to get more people to support them than me. I'm wondering if it is important to marry a beautiful wife to get beautiful children. Please share your experience. Thanks.


I agree, attractive people gets ahead faster - however, finding the loyal person and someone that you enjoy talking to, same level of your thinking, education, complexity and passion is much much better than beauty. 

someone will protect your house when you not there and that someone who will be by your side at your lowest - and dont cheat.


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## yargd (5 d ago)

I edited and added more detail to the question. Tall people also get more respect than short people anywhere in the world. So, does height also important in marriage too?


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

When I'm committed to someone it doesn't matter too much, however the attraction may wane up or down, that's life, no one stays the same however if let's say if sexual attraction wanes I found myself drawing it from other forms of attraction so it was no biggie - for me anyway.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

yargd said:


> So, does height also important in marriage too?


Only for certain positions.


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## ccpowerslave (Nov 21, 2020)

Like begets like.

I would say height for the male is very important. It’s almost a done deal if you’re 6’4” you’ve basically got it made.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

ccpowerslave said:


> Like begets like.
> 
> I would say height for the male is very important. It’s almost a done deal if you’re 6’4” you’ve basically got it made.


Says the lucky giant 😑


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## *Deidre* (Feb 7, 2016)

If we look at Hollywood celebs as an example, they pretty much debunk that theory.

That's ^ in response to your thread title, if looks determine the longevity of a marriage. 

In terms of if that determines what one's children will look like, I don't think that's always a given.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

Everybody has beautiful children. People who don't have life handed to them on a platter develop better life skills than those who do. They are stronger and learn early how to overcome conflict. They learn early people who are mean to you for no reason or shallow reasons are just sad and bad people who likely suffer from low self worth and tear other people down in an effort to elevate themselves because they know they're not that great.

Teach your children to be entertaining so that other people like them for that reason instead of just their looks or money. Don't helicopter parent them. Let them solve their own conflicts. Give them enough freedom when really young to learn to do things and use their imagination. All of that is giving them skills that will serve them better than just being hot looking.

Just for some perspective, I'm older, and I've certainly noticed that the good looking people tend to get hired in jobs in the higher profile part of the company. But think about the bosses who did it. I sure can't think of more than about one who were themselves attractive and they're the ones with the money and power.


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## Numb26 (Sep 11, 2019)

ccpowerslave said:


> Like begets like.
> 
> I would say height for the male is very important. It’s almost a done deal if you’re 6’4” you’ve basically got it made.


True story!!!


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## Numb26 (Sep 11, 2019)

RandomDude said:


> Says the lucky giant 😑


If you have height, looks and money you have it made. Trust me! 😉


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

RandomDude said:


> Says the lucky giant 😑


Hey, I'm 6' 3", now I feel like a midget! 

However my oldest son is almost 6' 5", so that worked out. Youngest 6' 1".

Seeing that Mrs. Ragnar is 5' 3".......you never know what can happen!


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## DonJuan (Oct 20, 2021)

yargd said:


> I'm an average looking person, same as my parents. I see beautiful/tall people get an advantage in relationship, jobs, and tend to get more people to support them. I'm wondering if it is important to marry a beautiful/tall wife to get beautiful/tall children. Please share your experience. Thanks.


If that’s the main reason for picking a mate, to have tall and beautiful children, it might be important. Google the question and their may be better ways of/or understanding how to have y’all tall and beautiful children. My guess is the odds are better if both spouse are tall and beautiful like two professional basketball players. Maybe the odds can be increased by artificial insemination or even adopting a tall, beautiful child.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

DonJuan said:


> If that’s the main reason for picking a mate, to have tall and beautiful children, it might be important. Google the question and their may be better ways of/or understanding how to have y’all tall and beautiful children. My guess is the odds are better if both spouse are tall and beautiful like two professional basketball players. Maybe the odds can be increased by artificial insemination or even adopting a tall, beautiful child.


Remember, look back through the relatives. There may be a circus midget in the bloodline.


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## BigDaddyNY (May 19, 2021)

yargd said:


> I'm an average looking person, same as my parents. I see beautiful/tall people get an advantage in relationship, jobs, and tend to get more people to support them. I'm wondering if it is important to marry a beautiful/tall wife to get beautiful/tall children. Please share your experience. Thanks.


I would hope people pick mates because they are attracted to them, not what kind of kids they think they will produce. 

I'm tall and I know it has been a benefit to me in many ways through out life. That includes attracting my wife of almost 33 years. She likes tall guys. However, she is only 5'4". When we met sex was on the mind, but not how tall our babies would be, lol. I like petite woman, she likes tall men. A match made in heaven.


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## romantic_dreamer (Jun 15, 2021)

Beauty is also rather subjective. My wife while universally recognized as an attractive does not fit description of a super model. she is not tall. But for me she has always been the most beautiful women. What also adds to her beauty is very feminine, kind, sexy personality.


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## Julie's Husband (Jan 3, 2022)

Whether it is important is all in your own world view. Are you living a "reality" existence? Are you living to keep up with the Jones' or for yourself? Check out the science of genetics to answer your question on children. There are a number of permutations when you look at all the genes needed for "tall and beautiful" and they may not all be passed on in the desired pattern.

I have not seen beauty or height as a plus. But then I've lived in outdoors and tech circles. There are no doubt jobs where good looks count.

From my point of view it is all about the total package and how they relate to others. Height and beauty morph over time. I've lost about 3 inches over the years and am definitely no longer a shiny new nickel. My wife does not look like she did 46 years ago, but as I tell her while I look deep into her eyes, "I can see you in there. You can't hide from me."


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## hamadryad (Aug 30, 2020)

What do Jeff Bezos, Warren Buffett, Bill Gates and Mike Bloomberg have in common? They are all enormously successful ,influential;/powerful, insanely rich,....... yet pretty/very short and pretty ugly....lol...

I think looks matter more for women than men...Men get very hung up on this, but its not really as important as its made out to be,...There aren't any male members of my family taller than, maybe 5'10 or 11" and if you lined up all the women we have been with wives/gf's etc, you would be very hard pressed to find any woman that was less than a 7.5 or 8 in looks...

Its far better to be intelligent and interesting...I mean, sure its great to have it all, but its not as important as the media and Hollywood makes it out to be...


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

RandomDude said:


> Says the lucky giant 😑


Yeah, I don't think you have any room to complain. You have attracted women just fine.😉


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## Julie's Husband (Jan 3, 2022)

hamadryad said:


> There aren't any male members of my family taller than, maybe 5'10 or 11" and if you lined up all the women we have been with wives/gf's etc, you would be very hard pressed to find any woman that was less than a 7.5 or 8 in looks...


Ha! I feel like I'm in the Land of the Giants when I go to my sister's house. Hubby and boys are all 6'3" and taller. 😆


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

yargd said:


> I edited and added more detail to the question. Tall people also get more respect than short people anywhere in the world. So, does height also important in marriage too?


Maybe a tall person would get more respect over a shorter one if everything else was equal.

I just got done at a job site. I was there for three months.

I earned very high regard and was respected by nearly everyone and I'm only average height. There were much taller men who were permanently at this site for years that did not get the respect I had by my first month.

I don't fool around but I had many opportunities at this site from women of all heights and that includes women taller than me.

Men who develop themselves and have real confidence get respect and women regardless of height.

I did marry a shorty but that's because I got hit by lightning or something when I saw her.😋


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Numb26 said:


> If you have height, looks and money you have it made. Trust me! 😉





Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> Hey, I'm 6' 3", now I feel like a midget!
> 
> However my oldest son is almost 6' 5", so that worked out. Youngest 6' 1".
> 
> Seeing that Mrs. Ragnar is 5' 3".......you never know what can happen!


Do you know what it's like being 5'11? 😑












ConanHub said:


> Yeah, I don't think you have any room to complain. You have attracted women just fine.😉


Sure but as @frusdil mentioned on the other thread some tall women indeed wont date someone shorter. Besides on online dating being less than 6ft makes me somewhat invisible thank F I have a pretty face! 😣 lol

Bah! If I'm the son of Ragnar I wouldn't have this problem! 😑


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## ccpowerslave (Nov 21, 2020)

Sometimes I don’t even notice shorter people because they escape my lower vision.

What is very disconcerting is fighting someone who has longer reach than me. I don’t like it at all because I’m not used to it.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

ccpowerslave said:


> Sometimes I don’t even notice shorter people because they escape my lower vision.
> 
> What is very disconcerting is fighting someone who has longer reach than me. I don’t like it at all because I’m not used to it.


Thank you for making us feel even more invisible!


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## ccpowerslave (Nov 21, 2020)

RandomDude said:


> Thank you for making us feel even more invisible!


I can’t find stuff in the bottom half of the kitchen cabinets or fridge because they’re too low. Anything down below 3’ or so might as well not even be there.


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## Numb26 (Sep 11, 2019)

RandomDude said:


> Do you know what it's like being 5'11? 😑
> 
> View attachment 95460


Not since 8th grade! 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Numb26 said:


> I'm
> 
> Not since 8th grade! 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣


I wish I was 5'11". Jeesh!


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

ConanHub said:


> I wish I was 5'11". Jeesh!


Why wish that when you can wish to be 6ft+ ! 😑

Wishing for 5'11 is like rubbing a genie and asking for 2 wishes instead of 3!


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

RandomDude said:


> Why wish that when you can wish to be 6ft+ ! 😑
> 
> Wishing for 5'11 is like rubbing a genie and asking for 2 wishes instead of 3!


LoL! You're right. 6ft it is. I'd actually be fine with that and no more.


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## BigDaddyNY (May 19, 2021)

Numb26 said:


> Not since 8th grade! 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣


I know what you mean. I hit 5'11" in 6th grade.


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## ccpowerslave (Nov 21, 2020)

You can go higher, to fly a F35 you can go up to 6’7”. I slam my head into enough stuff at 6’4+ change that I think 6’3” would be fine.

So OP I would be targeting someone around that height.


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## QuestionAssumptions (2 mo ago)

Here is an article that's primarily about the heritability of intelligence but also touches on the heritability of size and what the distribution across all people in both traits likely tell us about evolutionary trade-offs of trying to maximize them. Beauty may have similar trade-offs. It has some food for thought for people looking to maximize those traits through eugenics.

As for the "forever lasting marriages" in the title, my experience is that a person who feels lucky to be with their spouse (feels that they've married up) are less likely to cheat than those who feel they can do better if they look around. So the ideal may be two people who both feel that they've married up (perhaps using different criteria) and feel lucky to be with their spouses.


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## QuestionAssumptions (2 mo ago)

RandomDude said:


> Do you know what it's like being 5'11? 😑


Given the experience I had living in Tokyo being just a bit taller (close enough to 6' to round up and claim it), I'm guessing that where I'd sometimes smack the stop of my head on the subway door frames if I was in the wrong part of my stride, you'd be just fine.  I can imagine being taller than 6' being a pretty miserable experience in Japan. Being tall can also be a pretty miserable experience riding coach on an airline.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

QuestionAssumptions said:


> Given the experience I had living in Tokyo being just a bit taller (close enough to 6' to round up and claim it), I'm guessing that where I'd sometimes smack the stop of my head on the subway door frames if I was in the wrong part of my stride, you'd be just fine.  I can imagine being taller than 6' being a pretty miserable experience in Japan. Being tall can also be a pretty miserable experience riding coach on an airline.


One more inch probably wouldn't make much difference in my day to day. It probably would, however, make a world of difference in my dating life!

Because 6ft is the bare minimum to be considered tall! Lol


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## Numb26 (Sep 11, 2019)

QuestionAssumptions said:


> Given the experience I had living in Tokyo being just a bit taller (close enough to 6' to round up and claim it), I'm guessing that where I'd sometimes smack the stop of my head on the subway door frames if I was in the wrong part of my stride, you'd be just fine.  I can imagine being taller than 6' being a pretty miserable experience in Japan. Being tall can also be a pretty miserable experience riding coach on an airline.


Not miserable at all. True sometimes my height is an issue but for the most part it gives me more freedom.


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## QuestionAssumptions (2 mo ago)

Numb26 said:


> Not miserable at all. True sometimes my height is an issue but for the most part it gives me more freedom.


Newer buildings in Japan have taller doors but the traditional door height (used in the subways when I was there in 1999 -- they might be using taller doors now) were right around 6' and maybe a bit less, so I'd clip them. I stayed in an older apartment for a few weeks with the older door height and banged my head on the door frames frequently. It might help to be a lot taller because you'd see it coming. I was close enough to fitting that i kept forgetting to duck and scraped the top of my head where my bald spot is.

It's interesting that as nutrition as improved, Asians are not as short as stereotypes once suggested. A lot of younger Japanese men are fairly tall and the average height of South Korean men increased about 15cm (~6") in the last 100 years and women increased about 20cm (~8"). So I expect door heights to get higher in Japan and elsewhere in Asia over time.


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## Numb26 (Sep 11, 2019)

QuestionAssumptions said:


> Newer buildings in Japan have taller doors but the traditional door height (used in the subways when I was there in 1999 -- they might be using taller doors now) were right around 6' and maybe a bit less, so I'd clip them. I stayed in an older apartment for a few weeks with the older door height and banged my head on the door frames frequently. It might help to be a lot taller because you'd see it coming. I was close enough to fitting that i kept forgetting to duck and scraped the top of my head where my bald spot is.
> 
> It's interesting that as nutrition as improved, Asians are not as short as stereotypes once suggested. A lot of younger Japanese men are fairly tall and the average height of South Korean men increased about 15cm (~6") in the last 100 years and women increased about 20cm (~8"). So I expect door heights to get higher in Japan and elsewhere in Asia over time.


You do realize that I am Japanese and live in Japan, right? 🤣🤣🤣🤣


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Numb26 said:


> You do realize that I am Japanese and live in Japan, right? 🤣🤣🤣🤣


It's funny though lol I reckon folks probably reckon I look like this 😅


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## Numb26 (Sep 11, 2019)

RandomDude said:


> It's funny though lol I reckon folks probably reckon I look like this 😅
> 
> View attachment 95465


Thought that was you!!! 🤣🤣🤣🤣


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## ReformedHubby (Jan 9, 2013)

Honestly in my opinion its definitely an advantage. At 6 foot 5 I have lived it. Its just something that I feel has benefited me and my Dad, and I can tell its going to benefit my sons too. But like anything else its got some drawbacks. I worked in tech, and while I do well in business development and sales, I have found that even though I have a high level of technical expertise. I get treated the same as pretty women. I have to actually show that I know my stuff in that arena. Nobody assumes a tall GQ kind of dude could be tech savvy too.


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## QuestionAssumptions (2 mo ago)

Numb26 said:


> You do realize that I am Japanese and live in Japan, right? 🤣🤣🤣🤣


Nope, but it doesn't really surprise me and doesn't change that much other than I'm probably telling you things that you already know but others here might not. Wouldn't be the first time I made a bad assumption (my user name is also a reminder to myself), like walking up to European-looking people in Tokyo and assuming they knew English -- my bad.

As I was saying, I don't assume all Asians are short. How tall are you?

One day on the train, I saw a Japanese guy who was so tall he had to tilt his head sideways to not hit his head on the inside ceiling of the train car and I would have considered him exceptionally tall in America, too.

My question to you, though, is did your height ever give you any trouble in Japan in the sense that "the nail that sticks out gets hammered down"?


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## QuestionAssumptions (2 mo ago)

RandomDude said:


> It's funny though lol I reckon folks probably reckon I look like this 😅


Other than picturing cartoon characters with few features (see Scott McCloud's book Understanding Comics), I'm pretty sure most people make all sorts of mistakes imagining others online. That's why I've always loved this cartoon:

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/f/f8/Internet_dog.jpg

Where I ran into trouble at Sea World in Australia was assuming a black woman spoke English. She didn't. She spoke French. It happens.

And, yes, I'd probably picture someone with an Australian flag next to their bio as a stereotypical media Australian, even though the Australian exchange student we had at my high school in the 1980s was ethnically South Asian.


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## redHairs (6 mo ago)

yargd said:


> I'm an average looking person, same as my parents. I see beautiful/tall people get an advantage in relationship, jobs, and tend to get more people to support them. I'm wondering if it is important to marry a beautiful/tall wife to get beautiful/tall children. Please share your experience. Thanks.


It could be difficult to me to fall in love with a guy who is not tall. I don't know why, but I think, my chemistry can't ignite if my height is above of his. And it's very sad. I hope, once science could manage to fix it. Like everybody will have their favorite height.


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## Numb26 (Sep 11, 2019)

I am over 6'5" and close to 280 lbs so I have some difficulty anywhere I go. But in Japan the only places I tend to have issues at are the smaller resturants. Most stores are ok and haven't had problems on trains (with the exception of Osaka local line). 

The people's reaction is another story. 90% of the people I meet are so in awe of my size that they tend to be even more subdued then they normally are. But I do travel a lot between countries and I get worse reactions in the US. 🤣🤣🤣


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Numb26 said:


> 90% of the people I meet are so in awe of my size that they tend to be even more subdued then they normally are. But I do travel a lot between countries and I get worse reactions in the US. 🤣🤣🤣


I'm in awe 😑...and envy 



QuestionAssumptions said:


> even though the Australian exchange student we had at my high school in the 1980s was ethnically South Asian.


Hahahahaha gonna have a good laugh about this one with my mates both Aussie and Indians!!!


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## QuestionAssumptions (2 mo ago)

Numb26 said:


> The people's reaction is another story. 90% of the people I meet are so in awe of my size that they tend to be even more subdued then they normally are. But I do travel a lot between countries and I get worse reactions in the US. 🤣🤣🤣


I think I actually had more culture shock returning to the NYC metro area after living in Japan for more than a year than I did moving to Japan because the relatively subdued and predictable behavior typical in Japan was comfortable and easy once I got used to things compared to the relative chaos in NYC.

Japan was a great place to live, but there was no way I was going to maintain the lifestyle I had when the joint venture I was working for ended (I lived in a 500k yen/month American-style townhouse in a nice area not far from a train station) so I returned to the parent company in the US. There were times when I got some sour looks from Japanese people while living there but, hey, I figured I was was a guest in their country so I didn't bother to get offended by it and may have deserved it a few times for violating social norms while socializing with other non-Japanese people.


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## Lila (May 30, 2014)

"Does beauty/height really matter in a forever lasting marriage?"

Yes. We are all unique and have our particular preferences in what we find attractive. The goal is to find the one whose preferences meet your qualities/attributes, and who have qualities you find attractive. 

Height drives attraction for some women but not so much for others. I don't necessarily associate men's height with success, or attractiveness in general, but maybe it's my personal bias. I feel like men who look after their bodies tend to be successful regardless of height. Again, maybe this is my bias because I've dated 5'6 to 6'6. Height has never driven my attraction but muscular bodies have.


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## Numb26 (Sep 11, 2019)

QuestionAssumptions said:


> I think I actually had more culture shock returning to the NYC metro area after living in Japan for more than a year than I did moving to Japan because the relatively subdued and predictable behavior typical in Japan was comfortable and easy once I got used to things compared to the relative chaos in NYC.
> 
> Japan was a great place to live, but there was no way I was going to maintain the lifestyle I had when the joint venture I was working for ended (I lived in a 500k yen/month American-style townhouse in a nice area not far from a train station) so I returned to the parent company in the US. There were times when I got some sour looks from Japanese people while living there but, hey, I figured I was was a guest in their country so I didn't bother to get offended by it and may have deserved it a few times for violating social norms while socializing with other non-Japanese people.


Older Japanese tend to be very xenophobic but the younger generation has embraced outsiders.


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## Numb26 (Sep 11, 2019)

Lila said:


> "Does beauty/height really matter in a forever lasting marriage?"
> 
> Yes. We are all unique and have our particular preferences in what we find attractive. The goal is to find the one whose preferences meet your qualities/attributes, and who have qualities you find attractive.
> 
> Height drives attraction for some women but not so much for others. I don't necessarily associate men's height with success, or attractiveness in general, but maybe it's my personal bias. I feel like men who look after their bodies tend to be successful regardless of height. Again, maybe this is my bias because I've dated 5'6 to 6'6. Height has never driven my attraction but muscular bodies have.


"Winks at @Lila "


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## Lila (May 30, 2014)

Numb26 said:


> "Winks at @Lila "


"Stares at Numb wondering if he needs potassium to help with that twitchy eye". 😂😂


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## QuestionAssumptions (2 mo ago)

RandomDude said:


> Hahahahaha gonna have a good laugh about this one with my mates both Aussie and Indians!!!


Part of why I'm assuming people are "American" is people are talking about height in feet and inches, not cm. In America, we keep hearing (from Canadians and Europeans) how backward we Americans are being the country other than Myanmar and Liberia who hasn't gone metric.

One of my biggest "What the...?" moments when we visited Australia (also 1999, while living in Japan, while it was a shorter flight) was during a tour around the Gold Coast area. We're going up into the mountains and the tour guilds start talking about how tall they are, giving heights and altitudes in feet, not meters. So after talking about a mountain height, I decide to be a smart-ass and ask them, "So how high is that in meters?" The two tour guides look at each other and get expressions exactly like a lot of Americans would, like they were trying to remember metric conversion numbers that they learned long ago but rarely use and only vaguely remember. I told them not to worry about it.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

World uses metric  










I reckon due to American influence we end up mixing imperial as well especially when it comes to height. 

I also found it is easier to picture someone's height using feet and inches compared to centimetres.


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## Numb26 (Sep 11, 2019)

Lila said:


> "Stares at Numb wondering if he needs potassium to help with that twitchy eye". 😂😂


🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Just an observation....
The men posting most on this thread seem to all have a fairly successful history with getting women.


They also seem fairly successful professionally.


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## Numb26 (Sep 11, 2019)

QuestionAssumptions said:


> Part of why I'm assuming people are "American" is people are talking about height in feet and inches, not cm. In America, we keep hearing (from Canadians and Europeans) how backward we Americans are being the country other than Myanmar and Liberia who hasn't gone metric.
> 
> One of my biggest "What the...?" moments when we visited Australia (also 1999, while living in Japan, while it was a shorter flight) was during a tour around the Gold Coast area. We're going up into the mountains and the tour guilds start talking about how tall they are, giving heights and altitudes in feet, not meters. So after talking about a mountain height, I decide to be a smart-ass and ask them, "So how high is that in meters?" The two tour guides look at each other and get expressions exactly like a lot of Americans would, like they were trying to remember metric conversion numbers that they learned long ago but rarely use and only vaguely remember. I told them not to worry about it.


I have dual citizenship. Raised in the US but live in both countries through the year.


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## Numb26 (Sep 11, 2019)

ConanHub said:


> Just an observation....
> The men posting most on this thread seem to all have a fairly successful history with getting women.


Not counting my marriage. 🤣🤣


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## QuestionAssumptions (2 mo ago)

Numb26 said:


> Older Japanese tend to be very xenophobic but the younger generation has embraced outsiders.


Yup, and I'm sure that's only improved since I was there in 1999. On the other hand, gaijin can get pretty rude and messy, so I had some sympathy for Japanese landlords who didn't want to rent to foreigners.

I haven't had the opportunity to visit or work in Japan again, but I did work for a company that was bought out by a Japanese company and got to interact with their employees (including a French employee) and got to one of their factories in Southeast Asia. Sadly, there are some Americans who think Japan and the Japanese people haven't changed since Pearl Harbor.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Numb26 said:


> Not counting my marriage. 🤣🤣


Yeah. I knew that was coming but you do not seem to have problems getting attractive, short term partners either.😉


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## Numb26 (Sep 11, 2019)

ConanHub said:


> Yeah. I knew that was coming but you do not seem to have problems getting attractive, short term partners either.😉


Worked hard to get here


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

yargd said:


> I edited and added more detail to the question. Tall people also get more respect than short people anywhere in the world. So, does height also important in marriage too?


Not necessarily, my wife gets respect. All 5'03" of her. It is in the way she carries herself. When she worked in the office at a pipe mfg facility, around 425 sweaty stinking welders, 50+ women in offices. If guy cursed and saw her, they automatically apologized to her. But they all knew she was very married and did not tolerate foul language. If a welder came in to the office area and cursed, a foreman or mgr would run them out and apologize for their mouth.

Taller does not equate to respect either. Many younger "kids" teens,20s were very intimidated by me, 23 yr old son said all the kids in school thought I looked mean, the 6'05" guy with pissed off crew cut cop look with piercing blue eyes. But they didn't know I was a big teddy bear who gets choked up when Ellie died on UP!

I have those who are scared of my size, but that is not respect. I know hundreds of convicts that respect me because of my attitude of being fair to everyone and being able to listen and understand someone's point of view. They could not be upset because of my moral stand remained the same and they were given more than enough chances before I had them sent back to prison.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Numb26 said:


> Worked hard to get here


I think hard work is a common theme as well.


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## Dormatte (4 mo ago)

There are no unattractive people.
Everyone is attractive to someone or multiples.

All children are beautiful.


People that meet societies and media standards of defined "beauty" aren't ahead, and don't have advantage over other people.

These types of people don't have it easy like you think they do.

If you view being objectified, lusted after, disrespected, not taken often seriously, having people obsessive, obsessing , having unwanted stalkers and fans, people feeling like they're entitled to touch you, sleep with you, entitled to you because of their looks, working 5x as hard to get the same minimum respect as someone who you define as "average" gets automatically...as living a "privileged" life.....

As easy living...

No one is above or below anyone.

People don't have it as easy as you think.



Improve on your self esteem and self respect and self love and self worth. 

Stop obsessing over skin and surface value.


All that truly doesn't matter....


Don't allow yourself to pass up on possibly lifetime connections and friendships and learning opportunities just because you feel that a person is physically unattractive.


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## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

Lila said:


> "Does beauty/height really matter in a forever lasting marriage?"
> 
> Yes. We are all unique and have our particular preferences in what we find attractive. The goal is to find the one whose preferences meet your qualities/attributes, and who have qualities you find attractive.
> 
> Height drives attraction for some women but not so much for others. I don't necessarily associate men's height with success, or attractiveness in general, but maybe it's my personal bias. I feel like men who look after their bodies tend to be successful regardless of height. Again, maybe this is my bias because I've dated 5'6 to 6'6. Height has never driven my attraction but muscular bodies have.


Same. 

If I'm being honest, I find men who are tall, like over 5'10 ish a turn off rather than a turn on.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Livvie said:


> Same.
> 
> If I'm being honest, I find men who are tall, like over 5'10 ish a turn off rather than a turn on.


So now I'm BOTH 1 inch too short and 1 inch too tall!

😑


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## Numb26 (Sep 11, 2019)

RandomDude said:


> So now I'm BOTH 1 inch too short and 1 inch too tall!
> 
> 😑


Just remember, everyone is the same height laying down.


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## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

RandomDude said:


> So now I'm BOTH 1 inch too short and 1 inch too tall!
> 
> 😑


That's okay, I'm 5'2 so you think I'm short and stubby, I know.


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## Zedd (Jul 27, 2021)

Numb26 said:


> Not since 8th grade! 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣


My 8th grader is 6ft. Everyone's all po'd he doesn't like basketball. 100% a hockey guy.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Livvie said:


> That's okay, I'm 5'2 so you think I'm short and stubby, I know.


Actually I would think you are cute and that's not necessarily bad as per our neighboring thread 😅



Numb26 said:


> Just remember, everyone is the same height laying down.


I'm not always laying down 🤭


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## UAArchangel (2 mo ago)

yargd said:


> I'm an average looking person, same as my parents. I see beautiful/tall people get an advantage in relationship, jobs, and tend to get more people to support them. I'm wondering if it is important to marry a beautiful/tall wife to get beautiful/tall children. Please share your experience. Thanks.


Does being physically attractive contribute to lifelong marriages?
It undoubtedly makes things easier, in addition to having to look their other other qualities than having to get by looking at only their other qualities. 
It's why I say that courtship and keeping yourself as attractive as you can for your spouse is a lifelong and conscientious job.


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## UAArchangel (2 mo ago)

Zedd said:


> My 8th grader is 6ft. Everyone's all po'd he doesn't like basketball. 100% a hockey guy.


If you feed him very well, he can play goalie without having to do anything.
Guaranteed NHL contract.

Is There A Weight Or Size Limit For An NHL Goalie Blocking The Net? (rookieroad.com)


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## Julie's Husband (Jan 3, 2022)

QuestionAssumptions said:


> It's interesting that as nutrition as improved, Asians are not as short as stereotypes once suggested. A lot of younger Japanese men are fairly tall and the average height of South Korean men increased about 15cm (~6") in the last 100 years and women increased about 20cm (~8"). So I expect door heights to get higher in Japan and elsewhere in Asia over time.


Makes sense. When I was growing up in SoCal in the 50s and 60s, many of my neighbors were nisei and were already a height similar to non Asian folk.

On the other hand, our first house was in a 50+ community ("affordable" house at $400K in 2002) and it was obvious that in 1953 they were built for a less tall general population. The counters were uncomfortably low even for us. When my 6'3" brother in law visited he instinctively ducked his head in the house.


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## so_sweet (10 mo ago)

Livvie said:


> Same.
> 
> If I'm being honest, I find men who are tall, like over 5'10 ish a turn off rather than a turn on.


I think I might sort of know what you mean. 

Although I don't think I ever found tall men a turn off, my preference has never been tall men.

My husband is approximately 5'9" and I of course find him very attractive.


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## redHairs (6 mo ago)

Numb26 said:


> I have dual citizenship. Raised in the US but live in both countries through the year.


looks like you have very good Japanese? How old japan people react to your Japanese?


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## UAArchangel (2 mo ago)

QuestionAssumptions said:


> Newer buildings in Japan have taller doors but the traditional door height (used in the subways when I was there in 1999 -- they might be using taller doors now) were right around 6' and maybe a bit less, so I'd clip them. I stayed in an older apartment for a few weeks with the older door height and banged my head on the door frames frequently. It might help to be a lot taller because you'd see it coming. I was close enough to fitting that i kept forgetting to duck and scraped the top of my head where my bald spot is.
> 
> It's interesting that as nutrition as improved, Asians are not as short as stereotypes once suggested. A lot of younger Japanese men are fairly tall and the average height of South Korean men increased about 15cm (~6") in the last 100 years and women increased about 20cm (~8"). So I expect door heights to get higher in Japan and elsewhere in Asia over time.


There is also breeding and mixed race behind it as well. Women want tall guys, so they select the tallest they can get and they have taller children as result.
Dave Bautista is half Filipino and half Dutch-German and he's 6'5"
The Dutch are the tallest people, as an average, on Earth. The average Dutchman is about 6'1" and 7'0" is not as uncommon in Denmark as other countries.


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

ccpowerslave said:


> I can’t find stuff in the bottom half of the kitchen cabinets or fridge because they’re too low. Anything down below 3’ or so might as well not even be there.


That is where a 5'03" wife comes in handy. I, 6'05" self get the high places and she gets the low ones. Height does not matter, my wife is feisty enough to climb this big ole boy and get up where she can look eye to eye. She makes up for her short stature with her french bull dog attitude. 

She was gripping about something once and I started snickering, she said "What are you laughing about?"

I looked at her and said, "I've shyt,... bigger than you!" She could not recover from that one.🤣

She is like the riled up Chihuahua to me the Great Dane.


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

QuestionAssumptions said:


> Given the experience I had living in Tokyo being just a bit taller (close enough to 6' to round up and claim it), I'm guessing that where I'd sometimes smack the stop of my head on the subway door frames if I was in the wrong part of my stride, you'd be just fine.  I can imagine being taller than 6' being a pretty miserable experience in Japan. Being tall can also be a pretty miserable experience riding coach on an airline.


Exactly, my wife says she wished she was tall like me, I said, no you don't because you hit your head on anything.


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## Numb26 (Sep 11, 2019)

redHairs said:


> looks like you have very good Japanese? How old japan people react to your Japanese?


My mother mostly spoke Japanese growing up, she only spoke broken English. So I am fairly fluent.

Edit: Can't really write in It though


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## Zedd (Jul 27, 2021)

UAArchangel said:


> If you feed him very well, he can play goalie without having to do anything.
> Guaranteed NHL contract.


We literally can't keep enough food in the house. The other day, he was hungry and just took the loaf of bread and ate the entire thing. 

Anyway, nah, not a goalie. He's played defense since he was a mite, just like his step-mom. He's a GORGEOUS skater. His step-mom has spent hours and hours staking with him since he was 6 or 7. She taught him how to backward crossover and hasn't wanted to do anything other than play defense since.

Probably a good thing he likes defense too. His mom is 5'10". My bio-dad is 6'7" so he could still have a ways to go.


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## Max.HeadRoom (Jun 28, 2014)

I’m 6 3 and I have felt a positive vibe from the ladies over the years; some have even talked to me about it.

My brother is 5 5 and a bit of a dangerous brawler, I once saw him flip a small car in anger. And that vibe worked for him.

There is someone for everybody


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## manwithnoname (Feb 3, 2017)

I’m going to say yes, because the height of my beauty was decades ago.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Zedd said:


> My 8th grader is 6ft. Everyone's all po'd he doesn't like basketball. 100% a hockey guy.


My 6'4" cousin played soccer and is currently a hockey fan.🙂


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## Zedd (Jul 27, 2021)

ConanHub said:


> My 6'4" cousin played soccer and is currently a hockey fan.🙂


Yeah, he's a soccer guy too. Those are his two sports. I still play a lot of soccer, wife still plays hockey.

Plays defense there too. His coach just made me go get him skate guards/shot blockers because he went an entire soccer practice only using his left foot after blocking a shot in hockey practice with his right earlier in the evening.

He's already got the twins following in his footsteps. hockey and soccer. At least they're in the same complex (ice arena and indoor soccer) for the entire winter.


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

Numb26 said:


> I am over 6'5" and close to 280 lbs so I have some difficulty anywhere I go. But in Japan the only places I tend to have issues at are the smaller resturants. Most stores are ok and haven't had problems on trains (with the exception of Osaka local line).
> 
> The people's reaction is another story. 90% of the people I meet are so in awe of my size that they tend to be even more subdued then they normally are. But I do travel a lot between countries and I get worse reactions in the US. 🤣🤣🤣


We can borrow each other's wardrobe.


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

Livvie said:


> Same.
> 
> If I'm being honest, I find men who are tall, like over 5'10 ish a turn off rather than a turn on.


Don't know what it is, at 6'05" seemed like the short girls were all attracted to me. One runner, she was 5'10" ish and one in college, she was over 6'. Otherwise they tend to be 5'07" ish or shorter.


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## UAArchangel (2 mo ago)

Divinely Favored said:


> Don't know what it is, at 6'05" seemed like the short girls were all attracted to me. One runner, she was 5'10" ish and one in college, she was over 6'. Otherwise they tend to be 5'07" ish or shorter.


Big man, big unit.


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

Zedd said:


> My 8th grader is 6ft. Everyone's all po'd he doesn't like basketball. 100% a hockey guy.


Exactly! My son is a Jr in HS and is 6'06". I can see how 5'03" wife and I look when I see her and him.


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## JLCP (Aug 18, 2021)

ccpowerslave said:


> Like begets like.
> 
> I would say height for the male is very important. It’s almost a done deal if you’re 6’4” you’ve basically got it made.


I am 5'3" and I have turned down dates for lanky guys 6'4" and over. It's just too awkward. There was one tall guy like that where there was an attraction, but I was not on the market at the time.


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

UAArchangel said:


> Big man, big unit.


Had one girl in HS ask me why they call me Big John. 😏

It is like Porky's when girl said, "Why do they call you meat?"


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## Julie's Husband (Jan 3, 2022)

UAArchangel said:


> There is also breeding and mixed race behind it as well. Women want tall guys, so they select the tallest they can get and they have taller children as result.
> Dave Bautista is half Filipino and half Dutch-German and he's 6'5"
> The Dutch are the tallest people, as an average, on Earth. The average Dutchman is about 6'1" and 7'0" is not as uncommon in Denmark as other countries.


The tall nisei neighbors in SoCal were not mixed race.


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## UAArchangel (2 mo ago)

Julie's Husband said:


> The tall nisei neighbors in SoCal were not mixed race.


But they were still selected for marriage for their heights.
Their parents were probably considered tall for their society.


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## Julie's Husband (Jan 3, 2022)

UAArchangel said:


> But they were still selected for marriage for their heights.
> Their parents were probably considered for their society.


No, they were all part of the local population. Most likely diet is the single reason for their height. I know the issei tended to be the height most people visualize Japanese being. In all, there were three generations of immigrant population in the neighborhood by the time I left.


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## UAArchangel (2 mo ago)

Julie's Husband said:


> No, they were all part of the local population. Most likely diet is the single reason for their height. I know the issei tended to be the height most people visualize Japanese being. In all, there were three generations of immigrant population in the neighborhood by the time I left.


It is still both, but that is not to say that both factors are going to be factors with everybody. Some people, despite a poor diet and poor parenting will still grow up to be relatively good looking people who become successful, but that does not mean that a good diet and parenting are irrelevant to the health and well-being of children as they grow into adults. There was still the occasional giant Asian, in spite of the available diet at the times.

Yes, the short the stature of Asians has a lot to do with diet, as rice and little protein are going to be factors in how well somebody grows. It's called the Island Effect. When food availability is poor, animals and humans will shrink to accomodate what is available. But that does not mean that genetics or self-selection have been irrelevant factors in the overall Asian population.

If you let yourself get caught up in the weeds, then the idea of correlation does not exist, because you can find any exception you want that will disprove the rule. However, those exceptions do not eliminate correlation. Genetics, food supply, parenting, health practices will all be factors in the growth of a human being, despite any exceptions that you can find.


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## ccpowerslave (Nov 21, 2020)

JLCP said:


> I am 5'3" and I have turned down dates for lanky guys 6'4" and over. It's just too awkward. There was one tall guy like that where there was an attraction, but I was not on the market at the time.


My wife is a foot shorter than me. I am only lanky at fighting weight and only then if I’m not lifting heavier weights.


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## QuestionAssumptions (2 mo ago)

UAArchangel said:


> There is also breeding and mixed race behind it as well. Women want tall guys, so they select the tallest they can get and they have taller children as result.
> Dave Bautista is half Filipino and half Dutch-German and he's 6'5"
> The Dutch are the tallest people, as an average, on Earth. The average Dutchman is about 6'1" and 7'0" is not as uncommon in Denmark as other countries.


Read the article I posted earlier in the thread about evolutionary selection for intelligence and height. If being super smart or really tall were an unqualified advantage, we'd all be smarter and taller. There are disadvantages to being huge. That article mentions a few. Andre the Giant was billed as 7'4". He had health issues because of his size. He died at 46.

As for women wanting tall guys, yes, that seems to be true, and women tend to want men who are taller than they are. What happens when a 6' woman only wants me who are taller than she is? She'll have a much smaller pool of men she'll consider than a woman who is 5' 2".


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## redHairs (6 mo ago)

Numb26 said:


> My mother mostly spoke Japanese growing up, she only spoke broken English. So I am fairly fluent.


Anyway, I think, your Japaneese is probably the best in this thread


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

UAArchangel said:


> It is still both, but that is not to say that both factors are going to be factors with everybody. Some people, despite a poor diet and poor parenting will still grow up to be relatively good looking people who become successful, but that does not mean that a good diet and parenting are irrelevant to the health and well-being of children as they grow into adults. There was still the occasional giant Asian, in spite of the available diet at the times.
> 
> Yes, the short the stature of Asians has a lot to do with diet, as rice and little protein are going to be factors in how well somebody grows. It's called the Island Effect. When food availability is poor, animals and humans will shrink to accomodate what is available. But that does not mean that genetics or self-selection have been irrelevant factors in the overall Asian population.
> 
> If you let yourself get caught up in the weeds, then the idea of correlation does not exist, because you can find any exception you want that will disprove the rule. However, those exceptions do not eliminate correlation. Genetics, food supply, parenting, health practices will all be factors in the growth of a human being, despite any exceptions that you can find.


Yes, so people can stop being so surprised when I tell folks that I prefer Asian women 5'7+ and find them easily where I live.


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## UAArchangel (2 mo ago)

QuestionAssumptions said:


> Read the article I posted earlier in the thread about evolutionary selection for intelligence and height. If being super smart or really tall were an unqualified advantage, we'd all be smarter and taller. There are disadvantages to being huge. That article mentions a few. Andre the Giant was billed as 7'4". He had health issues because of his size. He died at 46.
> 
> As for women wanting tall guys, yes, that seems to be true, and women tend to want men who are taller than they are. What happens when a 6' woman only wants me who are taller than she is? She'll have a much smaller pool of men she'll consider than a woman who is 5' 2".


Yes, genes play off each other.
You're right that each quality has advantages disadvantages. We tend towards the average, because those who are advantaged tend to be a lot more work to keep and fend off rivals than the average guy.
Another disadvantage of being tall is that cancer is more common among those who are tall than not. Especially those who grew quickly in their teens, because quick growth increased the odds of cellular error which makes cancer more likely. I had that explained to me by a man who lost his leg to cancer and he was a well built 6'8" man.

Although the tallest natural giant that we know of, Angus Macaskull who was a well-built 7'10 and 580lb man, died trying to show off his great strength when picked up a ship's anchor to show he could and he ended stabbing himself in the back with it. A natural giant is just somebody who grew big with no known medical anomalies or reasons for it, other than his natural growth pattern.


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## JLCP (Aug 18, 2021)

ccpowerslave said:


> My wife is a foot shorter than me. I am only lanky at fighting weight and only then if I’m not lifting heavier weights.


This may surprise some, but I don't really notice height that much. All the men in my family are tall- over 6' , and all the women are about 5'3". Not sure why it worked out that way. But, it is that way on both sides of the family. I guess I have a height minimum though. Also, I like dancing and that seems to usually work best when partnered with someone about 6" taller. I guess everyone has their standards and I definitely have a bar for intelligence. I was a gymnast and this gorgeous gymnast liked me (looked like Antonio Banderas), but I just couldn't do it because he was really stupid. But nice .


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## QuestionAssumptions (2 mo ago)

Numb26 said:


> My mother mostly spoke Japanese growing up, she only spoke broken English. So I am fairly fluent.
> 
> Edit: Can't really write in It though


When I lived in Tokyo in 1999, I had a paper atlas of Tokyo that I kept with me whenever I went out to find my way around and bought a Sharp Zaurus PDA that could recognize Japanese characters drawn on a touch pad and could look up Japanese words in an English dictionary. Now, if I were to live in Tokyo, I'd have Google Maps on a smart phone with GPS telling me where I am and I an point my phone camera at Japanese writing with Google Translate running and usually get a useful translation of what the text says (it's good enough that I can read Manga that way). So not being able to read isn't the liability it was even a couple of decades ago.

One of the most sadistic language things I saw in Japan was on a train line from Tokyo to Chiba. The maps in the train car was in kanji. The signs on the platform were in hiragana and romanji. So unless you could actually read the kanji on the map, you couldn't match the map tot he platform signs just by matching shapes and characters.


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## QuestionAssumptions (2 mo ago)

UAArchangel said:


> But they were still selected for marriage for their heights.
> Their parents were probably considered tall for their society.


What you are missing is that a lot of it has to do with childhood calorie and protein intake. When food is scarce and diets are mostly carbs, kids can grow up pretty short. Start feeding the same people with the same genes hamburgers, and they grow up quite a bit taller. Even today in Japan, they practice a lot of portion control in their diets, which is part of why Japan only has a 4.30% obesity rate. I would order things in multiples to get enough to eat and my Japanese co-workers were amazed by me scarfing down a foot-long sub at the Subway I sometimes went to for lunch.

People want to reduce things down to nature OR nurture, but what research into traits often shows is that a lot of things are nature AND nurture, often roughly split down the middle.


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## UAArchangel (2 mo ago)

QuestionAssumptions said:


> What you are missing is that a lot of it has to do with childhood calorie and protein intake. When food is scarce and diets are mostly carbs, kids can grow up pretty short. Start feeding the same people with the same genes hamburgers, and they grow up quite a bit taller. Even today in Japan, they practice a lot of portion control in their diets, which is part of why Japan only has a 4.30% obesity rate. I would order things in multiples to get enough to eat and my Japanese co-workers were amazed by me scarfing down a foot-long sub at the Subway I sometimes went to for lunch.
> 
> People want to reduce things down to nature OR nurture, but what research into traits often shows is that a lot of things are nature AND nurture, often roughly split down the middle.


I included diet when I mentioned that a diet prominent in rice and little protein will have an island effect on a population. The body will draw whatever nutrients it can from what is available, but if it is insufficient or absent it will have an effect on the growth potential of the growth potential of the individual in question. An island effect is a shrinking of a population due to an insufficient food supply. Animals and people adapt by finding various ways, like loss of body mass or shrinking of size, to adapt to the available food supply.


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## frusdil (Sep 5, 2013)

BigDaddyNY said:


> I know what you mean. I hit 5'11" in 6th grade.


Try being a girl, who hit 5'10" in grade 7. Always in the back row of the school photos, with the boys, lol. I was the tallest person in my class until the last year of school. 



RandomDude said:


> World uses metric
> 
> View attachment 95466
> 
> ...


Omg me too!!


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## QuestionAssumptions (2 mo ago)

UAArchangel said:


> Yes, the short the stature of Asians has a lot to do with diet, as rice and little protein are going to be factors in how well somebody grows. It's called the Island Effect. When food availability is poor, animals and humans will shrink to accomodate what is available. But that does not mean that genetics or self-selection have been irrelevant factors in the overall Asian population.


It's not a deep genetic thing. It can shift in a generation or two as diets shift. I live in an area with a lot of South Asian immigrants. The parents, who came from India (etc.) are often fairly small by American standards. Their children, raised in America, are not, especially if they eat American diets. Their genes weren't making their parents shorter. Their diet was.



UAArchangel said:


> If you let yourself get caught up in the weeds, then the idea of correlation does not exist, because you can find any exception you want that will disprove the rule. However, those exceptions do not eliminate correlation. Genetics, food supply, parenting, health practices will all be factors in the growth of a human being, despite any exceptions that you can find.


It's not about exceptions. Height follows a distribution curve determined by genes but the center of that curve depends on the diet. If you have tall genes but a poor diet, you'll be tall among people with a poor diet but may be short among people with a good diet. The genes control potential but diet controls whether the full potential gets reached or not.


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## UAArchangel (2 mo ago)

QuestionAssumptions said:


> It's not a deep genetic thing. It can shift in a generation or two as diets shift. I live in an area with a lot of South Asian immigrants. The parents, who came from India (etc.) are often fairly small by American standards. Their children, raised in America, are not, especially if they eat American diets. Their genes weren't making their parents shorter. Their diet was.
> 
> It's not about exceptions. Height follows a distribution curve determined by genes but the center of that curve depends on the diet. If you have tall genes but a poor diet, you'll be tall among people with a poor diet but may be short among people with a good diet. The genes control potential but diet controls whether the full potential gets reached or not.


The height still varies between populations. The Dutch are averaging 6'1", which is the highest in the world. Since, it's the tallest average in the world, that means everybody else is not averaging 6'1.
It's true and I acknowledge that if the growth of a subsequent generation is immediately larger than the parents that diet is a greater factor than other factors, but it doesn't change anything else I said.


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## QuestionAssumptions (2 mo ago)

UAArchangel said:


> I included diet when I mentioned that a diet prominent in rice and little protein will have an island effect on a population.


The Island Effect is an actual genetic shift. If you put elephants on an island and they evolve into dwarf elephants, their children will also be dwarf elephants for generations, no matter how much you feed them. That's not what we're talking about. I think you are reading too much into genes and not enough into environment. And, yes, there are plenty of people who go the other way and try to explain everything in environmental terms. Even with the same diet, I doubt the average South Korean height will reach the average height in the Netherlands. That's genes. But the average height of a South Korean 100 years ago was much shorter where the difference is a lot smaller now. That's diet.


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## UAArchangel (2 mo ago)

QuestionAssumptions said:


> The Island Effect is an actual genetic shift. If you put elephants on an island and they evolve into dwarf elephants, their children will also be dwarf elephants for generations, no matter how much you feed them. That's not what we're talking about. I think you are reading too much into genes and not enough into environment. And, yes, there are plenty of people who go the other way and try to explain everything in environmental terms. Even with the same diet, I doubt the average South Korean height will reach the average height in the Netherlands. That's genes. But the average height of a South Korean 100 years ago was much shorter where the difference is a lot smaller now. That's diet.


I agree with you on that. If it's an immediate generation change, the potential was always there if all factors that would allow for it were also there.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

yargd said:


> I'm an average looking person, same as my parents. I see beautiful/tall people get an advantage in relationship, jobs, and tend to get more people to support them. I'm wondering if it is important to marry a beautiful/tall wife to get beautiful/tall children. Please share your experience. Thanks.


You're kind of touching on a number of different topics here. 

Yes the tall and beautiful have many advantages in life including attracting other tall and beautiful people for mates. 

However the cosmos seems to favor the average. 

Stay with me here because it would be kind of intuitive to assume that a tall father and mother would have tall children and a short mother and father would have shorter children. 

However When really tall couples get together, their children on average tend to be... well of average height or maybe a little taller than average. 

When short (but otherwise normal and healthy) couples get together their children on average tend to be....... average or perhaps slightly shorter than average. 

The same tends to occur with looks and beauty. 

If the tall and beautiful were dominant traits, then after thousands of generations of natural selection, we should be a race of 20ft tall beautiful giants. 

And even worldwide across all the different races and cultures across oceans and different continents etc, there really isn't a huge variation in average height or beauty. There are some isolated groups of pygmys in the congo basin and generally short statured peoples in the high altitudes of the Himalayas and Andes etc but some anthropologists consider that to be a more a product of nutrition and environmental factors than strictly genetics. 

I don't what the specific reason is, but there is always a reason that the average is the average. If tall and beautiful people always had tall and beautiful offspring and the short and ugly always had short and ugly offspring, then half the population should be tall and beautiful and the other half short and beautiful but that's not what we see in the general population. 

Take 100 adult men at random and put them all together and take 100 women at random and put them all together and there will be spectrum with maybe a couple being very short and a couple being very tall with most falling somewhere within an inch or two of the statistical average. 

There will also be a few that are butt ugly and a few that are drop dead gorgeous with the majority looking normal/average. 

As far as successful marriage, again normal distribution bell curve. The marriage and divorce rates between the tall and beautiful vs the short and ugly will probably within a few points of each other. The difference being that the tall and beautiful marry the tall and beautiful and the short and ugly marry the short and ugly and the average masses marry the average. There are exceptions and outliers of course but for the most part most people are in their own league.


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## QuestionAssumptions (2 mo ago)

oldshirt said:


> Yes the tall and beautiful have many advantages in life including attracting other tall and beautiful people for mates.
> 
> However the cosmos seems to favor the average.


See Regression toward the Mean.


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## Julie's Husband (Jan 3, 2022)

UAArchangel said:


> It is still both, but that is not to say that both factors are going to be factors with everybody. Some people, despite a poor diet and poor parenting will still grow up to be relatively good looking people who become successful, but that does not mean that a good diet and parenting are irrelevant to the health and well-being of children as they grow into adults.


True, but in the local population the increase in height was pretty consistent over the entire nisei generation.


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## UAArchangel (2 mo ago)

Julie's Husband said:


> True, but in the local population the increase in height was pretty consistent over the entire nisei generation.


You are correct and I agree with you that a singular generation change in height is more due to diet than anything else.


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

ccpowerslave said:


> My wife is a foot shorter than me. I am only lanky at fighting weight and only then if I’m not lifting heavier weights.


That is it. I do not consider a 6'05" defensive tackle to be lanky.


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

QuestionAssumptions said:


> Read the article I posted earlier in the thread about evolutionary selection for intelligence and height. If being super smart or really tall were an unqualified advantage, we'd all be smarter and taller. There are disadvantages to being huge. That article mentions a few. Andre the Giant was billed as 7'4". He had health issues because of his size. He died at 46.
> 
> As for women wanting tall guys, yes, that seems to be true, and women tend to want men who are taller than they are. What happens when a 6' woman only wants me who are taller than she is? She'll have a much smaller pool of men she'll consider than a woman who is 5' 2".


My wife says she is attracted to my size/ height because it makes her feel safe when she is with me. Here I thought it had something to do with the big gun I was packing😁.


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

frusdil said:


> Try being a girl, who hit 5'10" in grade 7. Always in the back row of the school photos, with the boys, lol. I was the tallest person in my class until the last year of school.
> 
> 
> 
> Omg me too!!


I went to grade school with a tall lanky girl like that, one that always had the hand made dresses and very long hair. She was Tom boyish and was considered one of the guys. She moved off in 7th grade.

Saw her again in college to become a veterinarian. That girl was 🔥 as a mofo! And already taken.


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

I would say being tall and good looking helps in any aspect of life. But not if the upstairs is empty.


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## BigDaddyNY (May 19, 2021)

frusdil said:


> Try being a girl, who hit 5'10" in grade 7. Always in the back row of the school photos, with the boys, lol. I was the tallest person in my class until the last year of school.


Funny you mentions that. Throughout elementary school there was one girl in my class that was always in competition with me to be the tallest in the class. She was around 5'10" in 6th, that was when I passed her and never looked back, lol.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

frusdil said:


> Try being a girl, who hit 5'10" in grade 7. Always in the back row of the school photos, with the boys, lol. I was the tallest person in my class until the last year of school.
> 
> 
> 
> Omg me too!!


I remember my first year of high school where the girls grew first before the boys so many were taller. One was very tall that I had a crush on, but I was so shy as a kid ☺ even shyer bc she towered over me.

She was one of them who asked me out and I dropped my silly childhood line "your joking" 🤦‍♂️ and she took it the wrong way as if I meant "as if I would date you" lol

Thought it was an upgrade, the last girl who asked me out had a friend to be a wing woman and was like "she likes you" and the girl was like "omg don't tell everyone my secrets" and I was like in response to both of them "errr... so?" 🤦‍♂️


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## ReformedHubby (Jan 9, 2013)

I don't think my initial post addressed the OP's objective. I don't think there are guarantees what your kids will look like, but watching my son go through puberty has shown me just how much physical appearance can change a person's life. My oldest son didn't have much confidence when he entered high school. He felt like he was basically the runt of the litter. His friends were more developed, and he was really skinny. I also suspect he was being bullied. I tried to encourage him, and tell him that he was going to grow but it didn't make him feel any better. He had so little confidence he couldn't even look my girlfriend in the eye when talking to her and would shy away so much that she thought he didn't like her.

Fast forward three years. Not sure what happened, but during the COVID lockdown the kid made up for years of missing growth, and also I'd have to say he is ridiculously handsome now. Like actor or model handsome. He works the counter at his mother's bakery, and quite a few of the women definitely have noticed the change in him. His mother doesn't like the way they compliment him, and I get it. I do think it's a little more accepted for women to say things that are borderline inappropriate about good looking under age boys. He also gets a lot more attention from girls. The kid was confident enough to go to his homecoming dance solo this year and texted me pics of the good time he was having. He now drives his car to the gym several times a week and started lifting weights on his own. These aren't things I told him to do. I think getting affirmation from others boosted his confidence, me telling him he was great didn't do much.

I guess my point is. I don't think my son's attitude about himself would have ever changed without his "glow-up" as his sister calls it. I can tell he is one of those guys that isn't going to have to do much or anything at all to attract the interest of women, even though I wouldn't describe him as aggresive or assertive. None of this has gone to his head, I think right now he just doesn't understand how he went from completely invisible to getting noticed.


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## hamadryad (Aug 30, 2020)

ReformedHubby said:


> I don't think my initial post addressed the OP's objective. I don't think there are guarantees what your kids will look like, but watching my son go through puberty has shown me just how much physical appearance can change a person's life. My oldest son didn't have much confidence when he entered high school. He felt like he was basically the runt of the litter. His friends were more developed, and he was really skinny. I also suspect he was being bullied. I tried to encourage him, and tell him that he was going to grow but it didn't make him feel any better. He had so little confidence he couldn't even look my girlfriend in the eye when talking to her and would shy away so much that she thought he didn't like her.
> 
> Fast forward three years. Not sure what happened, but during the COVID lockdown the kid made up for years of missing growth, and also I'd have to say he is ridiculously handsome now. Like actor or model handsome. He works the counter at his mother's bakery, and quite a few of the women definitely have noticed the change in him. His mother doesn't like the way they compliment him, and I get it. I do think it's a little more accepted for women to say things that are borderline inappropriate about good looking under age boys. He also gets a lot more attention from girls. The kid was confident enough to go to his homecoming dance solo this year and texted me pics of the good time he was having. He now drives his car to the gym several times a week and started lifting weights on his own. These aren't things I told him to do. I think getting affirmation from others boosted his confidence, me telling him he was great didn't do much.
> 
> I guess my point is. I don't think my son's attitude about himself would have ever changed without his "glow-up" as his sister calls it. I can tell he is one of those guys that isn't going to have to do much or anything at all to attract the interest of women, even though I wouldn't describe him as aggresive or assertive. None of this has gone to his head, I think right now he just doesn't understand how he went from completely invisible to getting noticed.




No disrespect, but if any of this is true, I would think I totally failed as a parent....I would think how terrible it was that I couldn't instill in him the confidence and resolve to not let physical "limitations"(I put it in quotes because its almost as if you are characterizing it as a handicap) define who he is and who he would become as a man....

No one's value should be that heavily influenced by a "growth spurt"...Thats ludicrous....So what if he didn't have this supposed growth spurt? He'd be doomed to a life of an insecure incel and loser? crazy....

It was a long time ago now(HS), but I clearly remember plenty of taller kids that didn't fit in, didn't do well with girls, etc...And plenty of shorter guys were at the top of the food chain in terms of confidence and popularity... 

Society has proven time and again that this stuff is bullshyt, yet people continue to peddle it...Hate to be cliche, but what determines a person's worth and value is always what's inside(moreso the case for men than women, btw)....I've been around long enough to have not only experienced it, but seen it a million times over...


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

ReformedHubby said:


> I don't think my initial post addressed the OP's objective. I don't think there are guarantees what your kids will look like, but watching my son go through puberty has shown me just how much physical appearance can change a person's life. My oldest son didn't have much confidence when he entered high school. He felt like he was basically the runt of the litter. His friends were more developed, and he was really skinny. I also suspect he was being bullied. I tried to encourage him, and tell him that he was going to grow but it didn't make him feel any better. He had so little confidence he couldn't even look my girlfriend in the eye when talking to her and would shy away so much that she thought he didn't like her.
> 
> Fast forward three years. Not sure what happened, but during the COVID lockdown the kid made up for years of missing growth, and also I'd have to say he is ridiculously handsome now. Like actor or model handsome. He works the counter at his mother's bakery, and quite a few of the women definitely have noticed the change in him. His mother doesn't like the way they compliment him, and I get it. I do think it's a little more accepted for women to say things that are borderline inappropriate about good looking under age boys. He also gets a lot more attention from girls. The kid was confident enough to go to his homecoming dance solo this year and texted me pics of the good time he was having. He now drives his car to the gym several times a week and started lifting weights on his own. These aren't things I told him to do. I think getting affirmation from others boosted his confidence, me telling him he was great didn't do much.
> 
> I guess my point is. I don't think my son's attitude about himself would have ever changed without his "glow-up" as his sister calls it. I can tell he is one of those guys that isn't going to have to do much or anything at all to attract the interest of women, even though I wouldn't describe him as aggresive or assertive. None of this has gone to his head, I think right now he just doesn't understand how he went from completely invisible to getting noticed.


I'm sure you are aware but make sure he is extra cautious of predatory women.

They will ruin a young man faster than a felony.


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## ReformedHubby (Jan 9, 2013)

hamadryad said:


> No disrespect, but if any of this is true, I would think I totally failed as a parent....I would think how terrible it was that I couldn't instill in him the confidence and resolve to not let physical "limitations"(I put it in quotes because its almost as if you are characterizing it as a handicap) define who he is and who he would become as a man....
> 
> No one's value should be that heavily influenced by a "growth spurt"...Thats ludicrous....So what if he didn't have this supposed growth spurt? He'd be doomed to a life of an insecure incel and loser? crazy....
> 
> ...


I don't take it as disrespect. But as a parent I really do feel that what we and his mother instilled can only go so far. I made the post because I do feel that being taller and being beautiful makes a difference. I think it makes a lot of things easier, an advantage.


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## ReformedHubby (Jan 9, 2013)

ConanHub said:


> I'm sure you are aware but make sure he is extra cautious of predatory women.
> 
> They will ruin a young man faster than a felony.


You ain't lying. My brother's growth trajectory was like my son's. Once he was "discovered" he dated a very attractive young woman that was flat out crazy. She basically took his virginity then proceeded to ruin 8 years of his life. A lot of this red pill stuff goes out the window for shy attractive guys. Some women see them and are determined to "make a man" out of them. If you know what I mean. They have no problem attracting a certain kind of woman.


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## JLCP (Aug 18, 2021)

ReformedHubby said:


> I don't think my initial post addressed the OP's objective. I don't think there are guarantees what your kids will look like, but watching my son go through puberty has shown me just how much physical appearance can change a person's life. My oldest son didn't have much confidence when he entered high school. He felt like he was basically the runt of the litter. His friends were more developed, and he was really skinny. I also suspect he was being bullied. I tried to encourage him, and tell him that he was going to grow but it didn't make him feel any better. He had so little confidence he couldn't even look my girlfriend in the eye when talking to her and would shy away so much that she thought he didn't like her.
> 
> Fast forward three years. Not sure what happened, but during the COVID lockdown the kid made up for years of missing growth, and also I'd have to say he is ridiculously handsome now. Like actor or model handsome. He works the counter at his mother's bakery, and quite a few of the women definitely have noticed the change in him. His mother doesn't like the way they compliment him, and I get it. I do think it's a little more accepted for women to say things that are borderline inappropriate about good looking under age boys. He also gets a lot more attention from girls. The kid was confident enough to go to his homecoming dance solo this year and texted me pics of the good time he was having. He now drives his car to the gym several times a week and started lifting weights on his own. These aren't things I told him to do. I think getting affirmation from others boosted his confidence, me telling him he was great didn't do much.
> 
> I guess my point is. I don't think my son's attitude about himself would have ever changed without his "glow-up" as his sister calls it. I can tell he is one of those guys that isn't going to have to do much or anything at all to attract the interest of women, even though I wouldn't describe him as aggresive or assertive. None of this has gone to his head, I think right now he just doesn't understand how he went from completely invisible to getting noticed.


I think it is wonderful when we see our kids start to flourish and mature into young adults. I will say, however, that I really don't think it has that much to do with height. I think it is more of a package deal,and working out for tall guys would be a definite plus. I think most athletic guys who work-out are good-looking, irrespective of height.
My daughter came into her own in high school and turns heads everywhere because of her good looks, physique, and how she carries herself. She is only 5'2". However, as far as nature/ nurture is concerned, she benefited by being in dance (25-35 hours/week). She is extremely athletic, with a six-pack and muscles that ripple down her back. Even though she is very athletic, she walks with the grace of a dancer. She looks a little bit like Angelina Jolie. Her first prom date was with a handsome, smart, nice boy who was 6'4". She said they were great friends, but did not want to go out with him again. She said he was too tall and he was not as athletic as she is. She and her friend were singled out when we were in Las Vegas and were given VIP entrance to all the clubs- first in line, free concerts, they got to sit at the big tables in front with the extremely wealthy guys who would pay $5 K for the table for the night. They sat with the professional soccer team from UK, top music producers who went to Julliard, and one of the CVS heirs another night. Also, she received a full ride scholarship to a Big Ten school based on academics, dance, and interview. 
So I guess my thoughts overall are that athleticism and intelligence tops height any day of the week. I have seen both men and women athletes who advanced quickly at work. I noticed one woman I worked with that had a college basketball scholarship (she was just 5'8") had the added advantage of chatting with the guys about college and professional sports. She seemed to be on the same plane as the men who were into watching ball games. She was promoted quickly- primarily because of her good relations with the other sports fanatics at work.


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## Numb26 (Sep 11, 2019)

ConanHub said:


> I'm sure you are aware but make sure he is extra cautious of predatory women.
> 
> They will ruin a young man faster than a felony.


Exactly this. Make sure he is well trained and ready for what's out there.


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## Numb26 (Sep 11, 2019)

ReformedHubby said:


> I don't take it as disrespect. But as a parent I really do feel that what we and his mother instilled can only go so far. I made the post because I do feel that being taller and being beautiful makes a difference. I think it makes a lot of things easier, an advantage.


It does. Especially in every day life.


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

Livvie said:


> Same.
> 
> If I'm being honest, I find men who are tall, like over 5'10 ish a turn off rather than a turn on.


I'm 5'10 (1.77 cm)...


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## Julie's Husband (Jan 3, 2022)

ReformedHubby said:


> ... I think right now he just doesn't understand how he went from completely invisible to getting noticed.


Yeah. I've been there and it really messed with my mind. It took 50 years to unload it.


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## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

In Absentia said:


> I'm 5'10 (1.77 cm)...


I think that's the perrfect height


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## frenchpaddy (May 31, 2021)

RandomDude said:


> Only for certain positions.


all the same high in bed


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## frenchpaddy (May 31, 2021)

on here we are all the same high , I am 6ft 3 my wife is 6 ft and our daughter is 5tf 6


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

ReformedHubby said:


> I don't take it as disrespect. But as a parent I really do feel that what we and his mother instilled can only go so far. I made the post because I do feel that being taller and being beautiful makes a difference. I think it makes a lot of things easier, an advantage.


Sure helps finding the car in the Wally World parking lot!😁


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## UAArchangel (2 mo ago)

Divinely Favored said:


> Sure helps finding the car in the Wally World parking lot!😁


That's what the key fob alarm is for.


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

What we find amazing, my wife is 5'03", I'm 6'05" and we fit together perfectly like 2 puzzle pieces. It is like you take one whole (us) and cut a uneven somewhat smaller part off(her) and put us back together and it is perfect, made specifically to fit together. Whether it is tangled up laying on couch or bed, standing in the kitchen or her curled up in my lap like like a kitten with her head on my chest....we just fit together perfectly, it amazes us.


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

ReformedHubby said:


> You ain't lying. My brother's growth trajectory was like my son's. Once he was "discovered" he dated a very attractive young woman that was flat out crazy. She basically took his virginity then proceeded to ruin 8 years of his life. A lot of this red pill stuff goes out the window for shy attractive guys. Some women see them and are determined to "make a man" out of them. If you know what I mean. They have no problem attracting a certain kind of woman.


I drew some attention, when I finally decided I was not gonna find "the girl" that had not already been sleeping around, i gave in to the women at almost 23 and unfortunately threw away my V card. 

Within 6 months I was basically living with a 34yr old red headed nympho and her nurse bestie that was 35 that my GF was trying to loan me out to.

I was like the FNG in Viet Nam that was thrown into the bush(pun intended) during a firefight. I had a big freaking sexual learning curve to overcome and my IQ increased quickly. Year later met my wife, really wish I had waited.

My sister said that song, "I like my women on the trashy side" reminded her of me. Especially when it says, "Son, that's a cocktail waitress in a dolly pardon wig! I know dad, that's the kind I dig"

The early ones tended to be a bit older.....and already divorced once. They were just enjoying the young male sex toy they found.


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## Numb26 (Sep 11, 2019)

Divinely Favored said:


> I drew some attention, when I finally gave in to the women at 22. She was 34 and her bestie was 35.
> 
> My sister said that song, "I like my women on the trashy side" reminded her of me. Especially when it says, "Son, that's a cocktail waitress in a dolly pardon wig! I know dad, that's the kind I dig"
> 
> The early ones tended to be a bit older.....


You aren't alone in that


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## David60525 (Oct 5, 2021)

yargd said:


> I'm an average looking person, same as my parents. I see beautiful/tall people get an advantage in relationship, jobs, and tend to get more people to support them. I'm wondering if it is important to marry a beautiful/tall wife to get beautiful/tall children. Please share your experience. Thanks.


A man should have his manframe in check.men are success objects, women are beauty objects
No matter what age. If you slip less than a 7, you got trouble. Six or below you are on the way to relationship he'll or divorce. Hypergammy is alive no matter what age.


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## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

David60525 said:


> A man should have his manframe in check.men are success objects, women are beauty objects
> No matter what age. If you slip less than a 7, you got trouble. Six or below you are on the way to relationship he'll or divorce. Hypergammy is alive no matter what age.


HAAAAAAAAAAA!!!


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Livvie said:


> HAAAAAAAAAAA!!!


Yeah. Someone needs to tell all those old couples that have been together forever they did it wrong.😋


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