# 19 years and I feel worthless



## Cantgiveupnever (Nov 15, 2017)

Feel like giving up


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## Cantgiveupnever (Nov 15, 2017)

I have been married to 19+ years and am battling with accepting that my wife has given up. I have always had jealousy issues. But for the last two years I've heard so many little white lies and listened to her denying things that are so obviously true that I think I'm going crazy believing her saying I make things up in my head. We have 3 daughters 23,17,14 and I cry every time I imagine having to go a day without them. They don't deserve to go through divorce. She laughs at me when I get emotional and says the reasons I have hurt feelings are stupid. For instance when she stares and literally turns around watching guys walk by while I'm right there then denies doing it. People look I know that but for awkward moments at a time it's obvious it's to upset me. Hanging up phone when I walk in room. Phone ALWAYS facedown. My therapists have told me she's likely having an affair and I've seen so many signs to support that now that it's killing me to deny it anymore. So my question is what do you do when I can't keep forgiving someone who never apologizes and denies causing me pain? Please help.


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## Emerging Buddhist (Apr 7, 2016)

I guarantee you that you are far from being that.

So, what would you lose by letting go of this relationship?


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## Cantgiveupnever (Nov 15, 2017)

I am not sure how to post answer post sorry day one site user. But to answer your question, it's because I can't quit I can't give up, it's not how I function in life. And most importantly, I still am crazy about her. I love her.


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## Cantgiveupnever (Nov 15, 2017)

She has lost all respect for me . But what's killing me is, if she wants me to trust her why would she do things that are specifically making trust impossible?


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

Cantgiveupnever said:


> I have been married to 19+ years and am battling with accepting that my wife has given up. I have always had jealousy issues. But for the last two years I've heard so many little white lies and listened to her denying things that are so obviously true that I think I'm going crazy believing her saying I make things up in my head. We have 3 daughters 23,17,14 and I cry every time I imagine having to go a day without them. They don't deserve to go through divorce. She laughs at me when I get emotional and says the reasons I have hurt feelings are stupid. For instance when she stares and literally turns around watching guys walk by while I'm right there then denies doing it. People look I know that but for awkward moments at a time it's obvious it's to upset me. Hanging up phone when I walk in room. Phone ALWAYS facedown. My therapists have told me she's likely having an affair and I've seen so many signs to support that now that it's killing me to deny it anymore. So my question is what do you do when I can't keep forgiving someone who never apologizes and denies causing me pain? Please help.


What you should do is realize that you have a bad case of codependency, probably get a new IC who can help you. And start to move on. 

I guarantee divorce isn't as bad as were you are now. Don't give up give up on her.


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## Cantgiveupnever (Nov 15, 2017)

Do you think divorce is the only option


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## Emerging Buddhist (Apr 7, 2016)

Cantgiveupnever said:


> I am not sure how to post answer post sorry day one site user. But to answer your question, it's because I can't quit I can't give up, it's not how I function in life. And most importantly, I still am crazy about her. I love her.


What makes you so crazy about her?

Is it worth driving yourself unmindful in such craziness?

I agree on the codependency... your heart and your mind are out of sync.

Are her actions telling you she wants your trust?


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Cantgiveupnever said:


> I am not sure how to post answer post sorry day one site user. But to answer your question, it's because I can't quit I can't give up, it's not how I function in life. And most importantly, I still am crazy about her. I love her.


AT the bottom of each post is a "quote" button. Click on that and then respond to the post.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Cantgiveupnever said:


> She has lost all respect for me . But what's killing me is, if she wants me to trust her why would she do things that are specifically making trust impossible?


Get the book "No More Mr. Nice Guy". Read it. Don't let her see you reading it.

Do what the book says.


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## chillymorn69 (Jun 27, 2016)

Respect your self first if you want others to respect you.

To respect your self you have to have boundries and deal breakers if she acting in a way that hurts you then you have to realize it and respect that you will be happier without her.

And you will be teaching your daughters to respect you and other men in their life.


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## Cantgiveupnever (Nov 15, 2017)

Emerging Buddhist said:


> Cantgiveupnever said:
> 
> 
> > I am not sure how to post answer post sorry day one site user. But to answer your question, it's because I can't quit I can't give up, it's not how I function in life. And most importantly, I still am crazy about her. I love her.
> ...


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## Cantgiveupnever (Nov 15, 2017)

I have never been right during an argument. I have never heard my wife say she's sorry. I have never heard her ask me "how was your day"? I have never been taken serious regardless of the pain I've felt. Maybe God is slapping me in the face telling me something I refuse to hear and I don't belong with this person. But dammit why not? I seek counseling every now and then with most honest approach I always emphasize my sins first and foremost. Maybe I am too damn nice. I think God works through other people and I value all your inputs. Thank you.


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## TAMAT (Jun 20, 2015)

Sounds like she is gaslighting you, she is obviously doing something wrong, but keeps blaming you or denying reality. 

What you need to do is stop accusing, then go into detective mode you will find your answers. 

Hiding or becoming possessive of a phone is a classic and huge red flag. The affair might be emotional over the internet, but there is little doubt she is cheating. 

Tamat


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## Emerging Buddhist (Apr 7, 2016)

Cantgiveupnever said:


> I have never been right during an argument. I have never heard my wife say she's sorry. I have never heard her ask me "how was your day"? I have never been taken serious regardless of the pain I've felt. Maybe God is slapping me in the face telling me something I refuse to hear and I don't belong with this person. But dammit why not? I seek counseling every now and then with most honest approach I always emphasize my sins first and foremost. Maybe I am too damn nice. I think God works through other people and I value all your inputs. Thank you.


When her actions are matching her words, believe them, she is showing you exactly who she is.

You can be kind and strong at the same time, you can be forgiving and strong at the same time, you can be compassionate and strong at the same time, you can be aware and be strong at the same time... you might have noticed a pattern here.

The book recommended may assist or it may make your situation combative if you are going to run a battle of wills, and people unwilling to give up power take it there. 

Boundaries are going to be your friend as you seek your place, whether it be in continuing your marriage or leaving it but if you set a boundary, you are setting it for you, not your wife, and you must be able to maintain it or your attempt will be detrimental.

What boundary would you put the most importance on is the one that brings you the most peace and confidence first... don't shoot for the moon, think of something more within your reach of success. Is there a boundary would you set for your jealousy? I'm curious if it is really an insecurity you are reacting to or if your wife has learned to manipulate this button as a control? 

How would you place that button out of her unfiltered reach?


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## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

Cantgiveupnever said:


> Do you think divorce is the only option


You have a wife who has lost respect for you and may be having an affair. You have to man up and stop playing into her hand.

First of all grow a pair, you have obviously lost your power in the marriage and she has lost respect for you.
Read two important books
No More Mr Nice Guy and second Co_dependency no More by Melodie Beattie. You are too dependent on her for your happiness. You can still have a fulfilled life for yourself so you need to start working on yourself, forget about her for now. Go to IC, read those books, start going to the gym, join a club, etc get out and stop focusing on what is wrong with your marriage.

Do the 180 on your wife, stick to it religiously. 
Go and see a lawyer to see what your options are. 
Do some sleuthing to see if she is cheating, (check the evidence thread to learn how to do this).

It is likely your wife will be taken aback by the changes in you, keep with them. If your new you does not change her around, you are at least a changed man who can move on and meet someone new if needs be. 
You will not lose your kids, they will always be your kids.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

Do you have access to her phone bill? 
Go to Best Buy and by a Sony voice activated voice recorder. Velcro it under the seat of her car. It’s very small for taking personal voice notes test it out first to see how it works.
The first thing you need to do is find out if she is really cheating and with who. Look in the infidelity section here and find the evidence gathering thread. Knowledge is power and you have lost yours.
Secondly, look up the 180 and most importantly quit playin the pick me dance that has the opposite effect of what you are looking for. Let her wonder what you are up to.


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## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

One of the easiest things you can do for your sanity is to stop calling her out on the swivel head routine. Just walk off. When she catches up to you, tell her that you won't walk with a woman who trolls in your presence. When she does it again (and she will), ditch her and drive off. She can find her own way home.

If you don't respect yourself, no one else will.


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## Cantgiveupnever (Nov 15, 2017)

I do have access to Verizon bill and up until the exact day she realized I had her "soccer dad friends" Number in my phone as well they texted and called regularly but she always said it was only about soccer stuff . The day she realized I know him and his phone number she hasn't texted or called him once and that was two years ago. Now his Facebook active status starts at active 1minute ago, active 2 minutes ago, and so on nearly every time I walk in the room. During the day if she texts me from her work I can look over at his active time stamp and if the text was for instance at 943 am his time stamp will say he was active at exactly 943 am. In other words for two years now it appears she is talking to him when I literally walk in the other room. And throughout the day when she finds time to communicate she must be also communicating with him. And it seems logical since she has fiercely refused to ever even mention me on her social media accounts for over 10 years now. And THAT hurts!


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## Cantgiveupnever (Nov 15, 2017)

Blondilocks said:


> One of the easiest things you can do for your sanity is to stop calling her out on the swivel head routine. Just walk off. When she catches up to you, tell her that you won't walk with a woman who trolls in your presence. When she does it again (and she will), ditch her and drive off. She can find her own way home.
> I have seriously considered that.
> If you don't respect yourself, no one else will.


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## GuyInColorado (Dec 26, 2015)

How often are you two having sex? When was the last time? Do you even have a marriage?

Are you working out? Are you in good shape? Make working out and eating/drinking healthy 100% of the time your new addiction. You need to get your confidence back and slimming down and bulking up on muscle will do that. Time to work on yourself and not to care about your wife. You don't tell her where you're going and what you're doing from now on. Hit the gym 1-2 hours 5x a week. Stay late at work. Be busy and don't be at home much. You don't hang out with her from now on. 

It's time for you to man up and make yourself happy. Divorce is in your future, but not quite yet. Start working on yourself and get yourself ready to date other women. This will buy you some time, as one kid for child support isn't too bad for a couple of years. Also, start stashing cash NOW. This is my biggest regret. I wish I would have planned my exit better.


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## Emerging Buddhist (Apr 7, 2016)

As GIC said, time to quit worrying about her and focus on you... if you were a woman I wouldn't say you need to "woman-up" so "manning-up" up equally means you need to "love yourself more" and there is no gender assigned to that.

You are placing way too much importance on what she thinks about you, this is why I say your heart and mind aren't aligned... your heart wants your wife to love you and you are reacting to feeling rejected, your mind is not correctly filtering your hearts reaction and giving you the ability to respond instead of react... these are critical for you seeing a middle path through this.

If you think I am off-base that is your call, each has to walk their own path... but I think your wife is my STBX's long lost sister, I've walked the insults brother, it's time to bend like a reed in the wind as they come flying past you and then get upright again.

Peace be with you.


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## Ynot (Aug 26, 2014)

Screw the VAR advice and checking the phone bill and all the other stuff about whether or not she is having an affair. That stuff will just drive you nuts and it simply doesn't matter. Your problem is much bigger than whether or not she is having an affair. 

Your problem is that you have lost your self. Losing your self is why she may be having the affair and why she has lost respect for you etc. As some one else posted, no one will respect you until you start respecting your self. So start respecting your self. You have her on a pedestal, you worship her. You need to knock her off that pedestal into the hole she dug for herself and then climb out of that hole your self.

I speak from experience. I was married for 24 years. Towards the end I felt much as you do now. And experienced many of the same things you are feeling. When my ex left I was devastated, mainly because I had lost touch with who I was. I had stopped being me in order to try to be whatever it was she wanted me to be. It took me about 2 years to reconnect with who I am. But now I have. 

You are ahead of me because you recognize, but refuse to accept the reality of your situation. So my advice to you is to start, right now, to work on your self. Decide what you want, what you need, how you want to live - and go for it. Do not let the artificial tethers of marriage stop you. 

As to your children, ask your self, do you want to see them grow up living in the nightmare you find your self in now? Kids are perceptive and they see what is going on. Is this what you want your kids to see? That it is OK to walk over another human being and treat them like dirt? Or do you want them to see what happens when someone tries to do that? Your kids will be better served by you standing up for your self, then by you rolling over and "staying for the kids"


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## GuyInColorado (Dec 26, 2015)

Manning up is to start thinking logically, not emotionally. A logical man will replace a wife who doesn't respect him, doesn't desire him, and doesn't love him. That's the mindset you need to get in. You are REPLACING her. You are going to find another woman who loves you and desires you. You have one life, so don't waste another day being miserable and being unfilled. No more regrets! A logical man knows nothing doesn't last forever, there is no such thing as soul mates, there is no such thing as luck, and people/relationships change and need end. 

I'd also say you should do some some soul searching on religion. A logical person will research all of the many religions out there and conclude there is no proof. One thing I've learned is that we all human beings are liers. We all lie, some more than others. Religion is man made, so no surprise it's a big lie. Just think really hard on the story of Noah's ark. Do you really think that was possible? A funny question I'll ask people... "How exactly did Noah account for every animal's specific dietary need during those 40 nights?" No more different than the lies we tell our kids Santa and the Tooth Fairy are real. Sorry, getting off subject.

From my view point, I think religion has controlled you for a long time and kept you in this unhealthy and unhappy relationship for 19 years too long. I'd bet my next paycheck you've never received oral sex from your wife in over 19 years.


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## Cantgiveupnever (Nov 15, 2017)

Emerging Buddhist said:


> As GIC said, time to quit worrying about her and focus on you... if you were a woman I wouldn't say you need to "woman-up" so "manning-up" up equally means you need to "love yourself more" and there is no gender assigned to that.
> 
> You are placing way too much importance on what she thinks about you, this is why I say your heart and mind aren't aligned... your heart wants your wife to love you and you are reacting to feeling rejected, your mind is not correctly filtering your hearts reaction and giving you the ability to respond instead of react... these are critical for you seeing a middle path through this.
> 
> ...


 Thank you so much.


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## Cantgiveupnever (Nov 15, 2017)

Ynot said:


> Screw the VAR advice and checking the phone bill and all the other stuff about whether or not she is having an affair. That stuff will just drive you nuts and it simply doesn't matter. Your problem is much bigger than whether or not she is having an affair.
> 
> Your problem is that you have lost your self. Losing your self is why she may be having the affair and why she has lost respect for you etc. As some one else posted, no one will respect you until you start respecting your self. So start respecting your self. You have her on a pedestal, you worship her. You need to knock her off that pedestal into the hole she dug for herself and then climb out of that hole your self.
> 
> ...


 I very much appreciate you sharing. Thank you. I agree completely.


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## Cantgiveupnever (Nov 15, 2017)

Are overly defensive behavior and little stupid lies and denying obvious things, are theynprmal for women or am I seeing this accurately? For instance one morning about 3am I woke up to see her on her phone and I sleepily asked what are you doing she replied "checking the time", at work she later texted and asked why I always think she's doing something wrong. I didn't even say anything about her doing something wrong. Is that what any wife would say in that circumstance? Btw there are hundreds of those little episodes. I could fill a notebook with them.


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## Emerging Buddhist (Apr 7, 2016)

Cantgiveupnever said:


> Are overly defensive behavior and little stupid lies and denying obvious things, are theynprmal for women or am I seeing this accurately? For instance one morning about 3am I woke up to see her on her phone and I sleepily asked what are you doing she replied "checking the time", at work she later texted and asked why I always think she's doing something wrong. I didn't even say anything about her doing something wrong. Is that what any wife would say in that circumstance? Btw there are hundreds of those little episodes. I could fill a notebook with them.


They are normal for *gaslighting* period... it is not gender specific.

Neither is DARVO (Deny, Attack, Reverse Victim and Offender).

How is your relationship with your children?


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## Cantgiveupnever (Nov 15, 2017)

Emerging Buddhist said:


> Cantgiveupnever said:
> 
> 
> > Are overly defensive behavior and little stupid lies and denying obvious things, are theynprmal for women or am I seeing this accurately? For instance one morning about 3am I woke up to see her on her phone and I sleepily asked what are you doing she replied "checking the time", at work she later texted and asked why I always think she's doing something wrong. I didn't even say anything about her doing something wrong. Is that what any wife would say in that circumstance? Btw there are hundreds of those little episodes. I could fill a notebook with them.
> ...


. So sorry if that came across offensively towards females that wasn't my intention. And thank you for your response.


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## Cantgiveupnever (Nov 15, 2017)

Emerging Buddhist said:


> Cantgiveupnever said:
> 
> 
> > Are overly defensive behavior and little stupid lies and denying obvious things, are theynprmal for women or am I seeing this accurately? For instance one morning about 3am I woke up to see her on her phone and I sleepily asked what are you doing she replied "checking the time", at work she later texted and asked why I always think she's doing something wrong. I didn't even say anything about her doing something wrong. Is that what any wife would say in that circumstance? Btw there are hundreds of those little episodes. I could fill a notebook with them.
> ...


 We are very close. However my oldest daughter is my stepdaughter (I raised) has zero respect for me. But my two youngest daughters are very close to me.


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## Cantgiveupnever (Nov 15, 2017)

GuyInColorado said:


> How often are you two having sex? When was the last time? Do you even have a marriage?
> 
> Are you working out? Are you in good shape? Make working out and eating/drinking healthy 100% of the time your new addiction. You need to get your confidence back and slimming down and bulking up on muscle will do that. Time to work on yourself and not to care about your wife. You don't tell her where you're going and what you're doing from now on. Hit the gym 1-2 hours 5x a week. Stay late at work. Be busy and don't be at home much. You don't hang out with her from now on.
> 
> It's time for you to man up and make yourself happy. Divorce is in your future, but not quite yet. Start working on yourself and get yourself ready to date other women. This will buy you some time, as one kid for child support isn't too bad for a couple of years. Also, start stashing cash NOW. This is my biggest regret. I wish I would have planned my exit better.


She's ready to have sex nearly anytime I want it however a couple years ago when I began to notice the sudden grooming and shady behavior I have seemed to have completely lost the desire to touch her. My instincts are screaming at me that she's absolutely physically cheating but she has convinced me that everything I see and think is made up in my mind and therefore none of it is real. THATS why I can't let go. Because what if I'm wrong.


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## Emerging Buddhist (Apr 7, 2016)

Cantgiveupnever said:


> We are very close. However my oldest daughter is my stepdaughter (I raised) has zero respect for me. But my two youngest daughters are very close to me.


Tough to escape that wedge if a spouse drives that divide, and it's quite possible she did whether it was intentional or not. 

What would be your guess why that respect is missing from SD1? 

Toxic shame comes from trusting the wrong people and listening too often to their value of you rather than the value you hold in yourself.... loving yourself more will "fix your picker" in more ways than one.


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## Broken_in_Brooklyn (Feb 21, 2013)

Cantgiveupnever said:


> I do have access to Verizon bill and up until the exact day she realized I had her "soccer dad friends" Number in my phone as well they texted and called regularly but she always said it was only about soccer stuff . The day she realized I know him and his phone number she hasn't texted or called him once and that was two years ago. Now his Facebook active status starts at active 1minute ago, active 2 minutes ago, and so on nearly every time I walk in the room. During the day if she texts me from her work I can look over at his active time stamp and if the text was for instance at 943 am his time stamp will say he was active at exactly 943 am. In other words for two years now it appears she is talking to him when I literally walk in the other room. And throughout the day when she finds time to communicate she must be also communicating with him. And it seems logical since she has fiercely refused to ever even mention me on her social media accounts for over 10 years now. And THAT hurts!


She clearly thinks you are clueless. Now going forward you will not be if you follow the advice here carefully. Take her phone and act like she misplaced it. Have a data dump done on it if possible. If she is not tech savvy have a tracker installed on her phone. Again, if she is not tech savvy install a key logger on that PC she is using. Install VARs in places she may be talking where you may not be around. Stay clueless in her presence. The time to confront is when you already have definitive proof. Not before.


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## Cantgiveupnever (Nov 15, 2017)

Emerging Buddhist said:


> Cantgiveupnever said:
> 
> 
> > We are very close. However my oldest daughter is my stepdaughter (I raised) has zero respect for me. But my two youngest daughters are very close to me.
> ...


. I'm sorry SD1? What's that


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## Emerging Buddhist (Apr 7, 2016)

Cantgiveupnever said:


> She's ready to have sex nearly anytime I want it however a couple years ago when I began to notice the sudden grooming and shady behavior I have seemed to have completely lost the desire to touch her. My instincts are screaming at me that she's absolutely physically cheating but she has convinced me that everything I see and think is made up in my mind and therefore none of it is real. THATS why I can't let go. Because what if I'm wrong.


You have already let go if you have lost the desire... if you have no desire, show her no desire, or do nothing about correcting that, then you are not in a position to make this better.

If you are not willing to meet this need, what options would you choose for your marriage?


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## Emerging Buddhist (Apr 7, 2016)

Cantgiveupnever said:


> . I'm sorry SD1? What's that


Step Daughter #1


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## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

Cantgiveupnever said:


> She's ready to have sex nearly anytime I want it however a couple years ago when I began to notice the sudden grooming and shady behavior I have seemed to have completely lost the desire to touch her. My instincts are screaming at me that she's absolutely physically cheating but she has convinced me that everything I see and think is made up in my mind and therefore none of it is real. THATS why I can't let go. Because what if I'm wrong.


The only way to 'win' in this roller coaster is to have patience. Stop letting her know you are checking. Do the 180 on her but place a VAR in her car, get a PI to investigate. It will be worth the money. Once you have the proof then dump her. If you continue like this you will drive yourself insane. You need the proof, get it, I am sure it is out there. Follow the evidence thread.

Alternatively, make the decision you cannot live with a wife who does not respect you and whom you cannot trust. Then divorce.


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## TheOriginalAlphaOmega (Nov 16, 2017)

Cantgiveupnever said:


> I am not sure how to post answer post sorry day one site user. But to answer your question, it's because I can't quit I can't give up, it's not how I function in life. And most importantly, I still am crazy about her. I love her.


Are you more obsessed about still being in love with her and possibly losing her, or the "idea" of what she "can" be in your relationship and missing out on the off-chance that she may change into something wonderful for you and you will be throwing all that away if she does "change"?

There's a vast difference, but the feelings are the same. Fear of loss.

You need to find out which one of the about thought patterns truly fit your thinking.

AlphaOmega


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