# How close is too close.



## Tmt81 (Oct 29, 2020)

I have a question regarding my husband and his female friend. He says that they are best friends, but there's too much crossing boundaries. We are helping her out because she doesn't have a place to go so she's sleeping on the couch. There are times where I was told by our roommate that they were sleeping in our bed fully clothed but still. My daughter and I have found them cuddling. When I come home from work I don't know what I will find. Am I just insecure like he says or is my red flag reader on target; something isn't right. They are too close. Please let me know what you think.


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## minimalME (Jan 3, 2012)

To me, your husband is behaving as though he has two wives.

You are not insecure.


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## C.C. says ... (Aug 1, 2020)

This is one of those questions that people ask when they already know the answer but they’re trying to strengthen their resolve to do anything about it.

I think you’re being gaslighted into oblivion, obviously. Or if it’s not so obvious, let me tell you now- giiirl you’re being gaslighted into oblivion.


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## hubbyintrubby (Jul 5, 2019)

Well, you say he's crossing boundaries. Those are you boundaries to enforce. If they're being crossed, it's up to you to make sure he knows what those boundaries look like and up to you to enforce them as such. If it's too far, let him know that and let him know what the consequences of crossing those boundaries looks like to you.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

Really, nuff said here.

Act, or you'll slowly continue a mental decline because you ALREADY KNOW this isn't good, not conducive to you having a good M.


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## southbound (Oct 31, 2010)

Wow. I must be way more old fashioned than you, but there wouldn’t be any questions for me. Sleeping in the same bed clothed? They’ve been cuddling? She’s his best friend? I think it would be normal if he considered you his best friend. You must be more tolerant that wives I know. He would have had the law laid down by now. Sounds crazy to me.


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## Tmt81 (Oct 29, 2020)

I have brought it to his attention, but all I get is attitude. I need to know how to deal with it from here. Any advice?


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## minimalME (Jan 3, 2012)

What are you willing to do? 

You have to mean what you say, and you have to be willing to follow through on any standards that you attempt to implement.

Clearly, he doesn't respect you, and, to me, his behavior is synonymous with adultery.

Do you have a support system? Do you have any wise people around you in your real life who can help?



Tmt81 said:


> I need to know how to deal with it from here. Any advice?


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

I think she's got to go... prepare for a **** storm... by your "husband"...


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## Rowan (Apr 3, 2012)

Tmt81 said:


> I have brought it to his attention, but all I get is attitude. I need to know how to deal with it from here. Any advice?


Me, personally?

"Husband, I've told you the relationship you have with [Friend] is too close for my comfort. You are aware that I'm not okay with your behavior with her. Since you clearly aren't interested in changing that behavior, I can only conclude that you value snuggles from her more than you do our marriage. I'm not okay being your backup plan, fallback position or second choice. I also value myself too much to play the "pick me!" game. So, I am left with no other options than to begin the formal separation process in preparation for our divorce." Then I'd be at my attorney's office the next day having papers drawn up. If, by the time I got home from my visit with my lawyer, she was moved out of our home and out of his life, and he was abjectly remorseful and willing to give 100% to extensive marriage counseling, I might (repeat..._might_) be willing to give him another chance.

But, then, I've dealt with a spouse who didn't respect me and have ZERO patience for that kind of thing now.

Be aware that your boundaries are for you and deal only with your own behavior. He is free to have his own boundaries and to behave in whatever manner he chooses. Telling him he can't snuggle with his gal pal isn't a boundary, but a directive. You're telling him what to do. Which, as you've seen, really doesn't do much. Rather, a _boundary_ would be "I'm unwilling to remain in a relationship with a partner who puts another woman above our marriage". Which means, of course, that enforcing that boundary is about what you do, not about what he does. You can't change him, fix him, save him, or make him be different. But you do get to choose how you react to his behavior and what you tolerate for yourself from your partner.

So, what are you doing to do, with and for yourself, in reaction to his chosen behavior? Because the only thing you're really in control of is yourself and your own behavior. If you're unwilling to tolerate this situation, what are _you_ going to do to change it?


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## Emerging Buddhist (Apr 7, 2016)

minimalME said:


> What are you willing to do?
> 
> You have to mean what you say, and you have to be willing to follow through on any standards that you attempt to implement.
> 
> ...


He shows little respect for himself as well... his love for himself has been replaced with damaging desire.

Only he can fix this, but @Tmt81 has a lot more control with her happiness in this than she may think.

His weakness will probably bring this to brinkmanship... do not set any boundary that cannot be held.

Be sure your actions match your words...


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## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

After reading stories about Wendy D ang, (M urdoch's 3rd third and ex wife) and accounts of other people allowed stay in someone's house for an unspecified amount of time, I have decided that if opening my home to others was the only to do charity, then it just will not happen. It's easier to keep someone out of your house if they were never allowed in.

As someone else said, your husband is acting as if he has 2 wives. I would open the conversation with "She has stayed here long enough. Perhaps she can stay with some of her other friends." It should be obvious why you want her gone. It is your house. You have a child for whom you need to have good role models around, just start telling her when you want her gone. 

Hopefully, your name is on the deed. Also, if you live somewhere that gives squatters rights, you would be wise to get her out ASAP. 

Your husband may be impressed with your take charge approach. Then again he may not. Decide what you plan to next if he doesn't.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

Tmt81 said:


> I have brought it to his attention, but all I get is attitude. I need to know how to deal with it from here. Any advice?


I wouldnt put up with it at all. He is WAY over the boundaries as to what is appropriate. You should be his best friend and there is no way he should be cuddling or lying in bed with another woman.
I would give him a choice, carry on the way he is and and loose you, or stop the cheating(which it is really) and be a faithful husband. Its hard to see how she thinks its ok to act this way in your house. If her refuses to stop, tell him that you will have his clothes packed up and on the doorstep the next day. To be honest I wouldnt trust him at all, he has no boundaies.


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## Tmt81 (Oct 29, 2020)

minimalME said:


> What are you willing to do?
> 
> You have to mean what you say, and you have to be willing to follow through on any standards that you attempt to implement.
> 
> ...


Yes I do.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

An old friend of mine and her husband wanted to bring another woman into their bed for a 3some. 

At first all was well. 

Then he wanted to move this other gal and her school age child into their guest room.

She did not put her foot down despite all my warnings. 

Eventually the other woman and kid were living in their house rent free and he was hooking up with the other gal any time she was out of the house and even when she would fall asleep.

When I would throw a fit and tell her she was being too much of a doormat, she would tell me that she want him to come to his senses, realize it was wrong and make the conscious choice to not have another woman in their home.

Well you can imagine how that all turned out. She was basically replaced right under her own nose.

This is dumb. You don’t need strangers on the internet telling you what’s going on here or what you need to do. 

Trust your own gut and instincts.


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## DallasCowboyFan (Nov 20, 2012)

Best Friend of the opposite sex often = Emotional Affair. That often leads to physical affair. Reading the signs, you are likely already well into both. I think you two should sit down with a counselor and discuss appropriate behavior for married people in outside relationships with the opposite sex. You have a right to feel hurt. None of this is ok. No rational moral compass can say this is ok. I would be talking about how to divide the property because he may not give her up.


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## Tmt81 (Oct 29, 2020)

Thank you all for your thoughts and advise. I believe I have a plan of attack for this problem.


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

Tmt81 said:


> I have a question regarding my husband and his female friend. He says that they are best friends, but there's too much crossing boundaries. We are helping her out because she doesn't have a place to go so she's sleeping on the couch. There are times where I was told by our roommate that they were sleeping in our bed fully clothed but still. My daughter and I have found them cuddling. When I come home from work I don't know what I will find. Am I just insecure like he says or is my red flag reader on target; something isn't right. They are too close. Please let me know what you think.


First I think you should change your picture to hide your identity. 

Listen to this sentence -

Your husband is sleeping with another women in your bed. Your daughter saw your husband sleeping in your bed with another women.

You tell me? 

I mean the question in my mind is why are you cool with this?


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## Nailhead (Sep 21, 2020)

Tmt81 said:


> I have a question regarding my husband and his female friend. He says that they are best friends, but there's too much crossing boundaries. We are helping her out because she doesn't have a place to go so she's sleeping on the couch. There are times where I was told by our roommate that they were sleeping in our bed fully clothed but still. My daughter and I have found them cuddling. When I come home from work I don't know what I will find. Am I just insecure like he says or is my red flag reader on target; something isn't right. They are too close. Please let me know what you think.


Your H has a live in GF. Time she finds her way out of the house.


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## Spicy (Jun 18, 2016)

I would say, “It’s her or me. So who is staying?”


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## SpinyNorman (Jan 24, 2018)

I am ok w/ OS friends for married people, but to me cuddling goes past friendship and TS should not tolerate this. Make it clear either the marriage ends, or this ends and nothing like it ever happens again.


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## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

Spicy said:


> I would say, “It’s her or me. So who is staying?”


Why give him a choice? I would start moving this woman out. That way, my husband would have to take a stand.


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## Rowan (Apr 3, 2012)

NextTimeAround said:


> I would start moving this woman out. That way, my husband would have to take a stand.


Eh. I'd start moving them both out. He's already made his stand.


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

Advice? If he’s unwilling to correct the problem then you’ll have to accept it or move on. You need to decide which it is.


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## Gabriel (May 10, 2011)

Let us know how it goes. I for one have no tolerance for this crap. Let me tell you a short story....

My wife had a close guy friend in college. They were close before I met her. They never dated. During our engagement and first 3 years of marriage, he was mostly out of the picture, but then due to a near death of their mutual friend, they started hanging out more. And they would spend probably 2-3 days together/year, from noon-til midnight, seeing his family members, going places he liked, etc. 

I didn't like it, made me nervous, but since they knew each other before I came into the picture and were never romantic, I felt like I had to allow this. Sure enough, the visits increased in frequency to 4x/year. And when our marriage was in a rocky time, she ended up falling for him, and this led to a deep emotional affair that took 3 years of pain to get through.

This is where you are headed. He will find cracks in your relationship and lean on her, and then.....


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## Avgman (Jan 18, 2019)

I've been through this situation twice with two different women. I know, I should have learned my lesson the first time. Neither time did it end well as both were having physical affairs while I was at work. One we were high school age, last one was 10 years ago. Both times we were helping the guy, the last one we helped him with everything, I was best man at his wedding and all...he played me as he played my wife, she fell for it and I guess I'm a way I did to. I'd be careful, but be honest and either he can respect you or you will have your answer.


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## RClawson (Sep 19, 2011)

As one who worked in female dominated industries for years I can say I have really close female friends. On occassion I go to lunch with a couple of them and have done so for many years. As close as they are to me I would never consider cuddling with them and if I did and my wife found out they would not be sleeping on my couch any longer nor would I be having anything to do with them.


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## frusdil (Sep 5, 2013)

Tmt81 said:


> *There are times where I was told by our roommate that they were sleeping in our bed fully clothed but still. My daughter and I have found them cuddling.* When I come home from work I don't know what I will find. Am I just insecure like he says or is my red flag reader on target; something isn't right. They are too close. Please let me know what you think.


I'm sorry, WHAT?!? Not just no, but HELL NO.



Tmt81 said:


> I have brought it to his attention, but all I get is attitude. I need to know how to deal with it from here. Any advice?


"Husband, I have told your side piece to move out as I am fed up with the two of your carry on." Done.


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## hinterdir (Apr 17, 2018)

Tmt81 said:


> I have a question regarding my husband and his female friend. He says that they are best friends, but there's too much crossing boundaries. We are helping her out because she doesn't have a place to go so she's sleeping on the couch. There are times where I was told by our roommate that they were sleeping in our bed fully clothed but still. My daughter and I have found them cuddling. When I come home from work I don't know what I will find. Am I just insecure like he says or is my red flag reader on target; something isn't right. They are too close. Please let me know what you think.


Totally inappropriate.
Sleeping in your bed?
Cuddling?
Another woman living in your home?

This is WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY over the line. 
I think you have been naive and weak to ever let her live there.
You'd probably be wise to immediately nix this and have her move out and call out your husband about how rude, disrespectful, inappropriate it has been for him to sleep with a woman in your home, cuddle with another woman...etc. 

Just my take.


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## GC1234 (Apr 15, 2020)

This is completely unacceptable. She needs to go, and if your husband has a problem with that, he needs to go also...


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

If OP hasn't cleared this intruder out, this weekend there'll be a threesome at the house.

It's kind of obvious.


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## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> If OP hasn't cleared this intruder out, this weekend there'll be a threesome at the house.
> 
> It's kind of obvious.


I was asking my husband what he thought about Wendy D ang since she was living at an American couple's house in CA when she first arrived in the US. She had an affair with the husband who ended up divorcing his wife and married. Once she got her green card, she she separated from him and divroced him some time later. 

My husband's response to my question was, any time you have an unrelated woman staying in your place especially if she's not household staff, well, that is just asking for a 3 some.


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## SpinyNorman (Jan 24, 2018)

NextTimeAround said:


> My husband's response to my question was, any time you have an unrelated woman staying in your place especially if she's not household staff, well, that is just asking for a 3 some.


I don't think it's that unusual for sexually compatible people to share housing and remain platonic. But if you don't want it in your house, don't have it.

The fact that he was cuddling w/ her is, IMO a big violation.


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## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

I wouldn't give him any choice -- he's already made his choice.
Once someone shows me I don't make them happy anymore, I believe them. And I will never value a relationship in which I have no value. You deserve better than HIM.


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

Tell her to get the F out of your house, and that if she wants your husband, she can take him right along with her other crap. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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