# Attracted To My Therapist



## ElCanario (Nov 11, 2013)

I just began seeing a female therapist a couple weeks ago, and it has to be a case of God (or the Devil) screwing around with my mind. I am a man, 54 years old, and she is 30 at the most and one of the hottest women I have ever seen. Not so much her looks per se as that her whole package - face, hair, body, ethnic background, and personality - is right exactly down my alley in terms of the type of woman who drives me bonkers. I mean, I was "in lust" the second I saw her, and at the time I neither knew that she was going to be my therapist nor had even talked to her. Now, people always say that patients fall for their therapists for various reasons and that it's transference, but I don't think that's the case here. I haven't really been dealing with her long enough to even consider that that type of thing could happen, and I don't even look at her that emotionally. It's just pure lust in this case because she is so beautiful. I do find myself thinking about her at times totally randomly and wish I were in a position where I could get to know her. But I am rational and realistic and know it could never happen - which is why I say someone is playing a really cruel joke on me. How should I deal with this?


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## SpinyNorman (Jan 24, 2018)

Advice:
1) Think with your brain and not your....you know.
2) Failing 1), get a different therapist. 

If she sees your for therapy and goes out w/ you she can lose her license. If she stops seeing you for therapy immediately(even if you terminate it) maybe no one would find out, but she probably won't go out w/ you anyway.


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## ElCanario (Nov 11, 2013)

SpinyNorman said:


> Advice:
> 1) Think with your brain and not your....you know.
> 2) Failing 1), get a different therapist.
> 
> If she sees your for therapy and goes out w/ you she can lose her license. If she stops seeing you for therapy immediately(even if you terminate it) maybe no one would find out, but she probably won't go out w/ you anyway.


Yeah, I get that. I don't expect her to want to go out with me or anything like that. But she drives me freaking crazy......


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## sandcastle (Sep 5, 2014)

Hire Dr. Bob -class of 52- and ask her out for a date on the sofa in her office. You can order in.

She can do the whole Sharon Stone chair scene.

Does that work?


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

Look up Transference. It's not uncommon.


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## ElCanario (Nov 11, 2013)

sokillme said:


> Look up Transference. It's not uncommon.


I thought about that, but I don't think it's transference. If she didn't look the way she did, I wouldn't be attracted to her. Transference is more of a projection of some type of unrealized feelings onto a therapist.


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## sandcastle (Sep 5, 2014)

ElCanario said:


> I thought about that, but I don't think it's transference. If she didn't look the way she did, I wouldn't be attracted to her. Transference is more of a projection of some type of unrealized feelings onto a therapist.


Like if she reminded you of your Mom-

Which I'm thinking she does not.

Why torment yourself when therapists are a dime a dozen?

Just get a referral. Easy, done and over.


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## chillymorn69 (Jun 27, 2016)

Tell her .

If shes good she will refer you to somone else.

If not you might get laid!

Win win either way.


Just joking


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## StarFires (Feb 27, 2018)

Do you think you can be open with her? She's your therapist. You should be able to tell her anything. I'm not talking about your attraction. I'm talking about the reason you went to see a therapist. Can you be open with her? As long as you want her, I think it will be difficult because you need to be vulnerable. I think it's more likely you will find yourself in a position of trying to impress her. So, seeing her can potentially defeat the purpose of counseling. 

And that leaves you in a good position to find a different counselor and asking this one to go out with you. Win. Win.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

Are you married? Is she married? 

Either way find a new therapist. Easy solution.


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## Thor (Oct 31, 2011)

Each state has their own ethics laws, but in general it will be something like a year or two after last being a patient before she could see you socially. Violation means losing her license. So this one's not an option for quite a while.

I think it is good to like your therapist. But when it becomes lust or an emotional distraction it is now hindering your progress. Time for you to find a new therapist.


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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

ElCanario said:


> I just began seeing a female therapist a couple weeks ago, and it has to be a case of God (or the Devil) screwing around with my mind. I am a man, 54 years old, and she is 30 at the most and one of the hottest women I have ever seen. Not so much her looks per se as that her whole package - face, hair, body, ethnic background, and personality - is right exactly down my alley in terms of the type of woman who drives me bonkers. I mean, I was "in lust" the second I saw her, and at the time I neither knew that she was going to be my therapist nor had even talked to her. Now, people always say that patients fall for their therapists for various reasons and that it's transference, but I don't think that's the case here. I haven't really been dealing with her long enough to even consider that that type of thing could happen, and I don't even look at her that emotionally. It's just pure lust in this case because she is so beautiful. I do find myself thinking about her at times totally randomly and wish I were in a position where I could get to know her. But I am rational and realistic and know it could never happen - which is why I say someone is playing a really cruel joke on me. How should I deal with this?


"And how does looking at my tits make you feel?" - is what my therapist normally says to me. (joking)

In my experience, it's difficult to talk sensibly with a bulge in your pants so you should probably get another therapist, or change sex (of your therapist).


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## ElCanario (Nov 11, 2013)

Diana7 said:


> Are you married? Is she married?
> 
> Either way find a new therapist. Easy solution.


I'm divorcing. I don't know her status.


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## ElCanario (Nov 11, 2013)

inmyprime said:


> "And how does looking at my tits make you feel?" - is what my therapist normally says to me. (joking)


My God.....if you only knew.



> In my experience, it's difficult to talk sensibly with a bulge in your pants so you should probably get another therapist, or change sex (of your therapist).


All of this is very true. She definitely has that effect on me. I try not to let her know that. We're gonna have to stop this......she's just a short-term solution anyway, as she's trying to find me a more long-term therapist. I had only gone to the place she works because I was looking for group therapy, and here she is. To make things worse, they don't have group therapy anymore.


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## Laurentium (May 21, 2017)

ElCanario said:


> I try not to let her know that.
> . . .
> she's just a short-term solution anyway


An alternative solution is to tell her about it. That will probably defuse it a bit. If she's hot, it won't be the first time it has happened.


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## sandcastle (Sep 5, 2014)

Group Therapy for what?


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## ElCanario (Nov 11, 2013)

sandcastle said:


> Group Therapy for what?


An old friend, who was my therapist long, long ago, suggested it because she thought if I talked about my problems in a group with other people, I would get multiple perspectives from the other members of the group.


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## ElCanario (Nov 11, 2013)

Laurentium said:


> An alternative solution is to tell her about it. That will probably defuse it a bit. If she's hot, it won't be the first time it has happened.


I don't know if I could do that. I don't tell women stuff like that to begin with, because I am extremely shy and tentative with women. She is hot, extremely.


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## Ynot (Aug 26, 2014)

ElCanario said:


> I don't know if I could do that. I don't tell women stuff like that to begin with, because I am extremely shy and tentative with women. She is hot, extremely.


There are several issues at play here it seems. First off, the purpose of therapy is to focus on yourself and your issues. So if you are creating a fantasy of your therapist in your head, it would probably be best to find a new therapist. You may find it extremely difficult to speak what is really on your mind, rather than saying things you might imagine she would want to hear. 
Secondly, I would encourage you to investigate the root of your shyness. I used to consider my self shy. I have since found that for the most part it was a defensive mechanism I created to protect myself. I imagined I was less than worthy, that people thought lowly of me, thought I was unattractive etc etc. I would avoid women I considered beautiful because I figured I was unworthy of their attention and why would they want mine. After all I was just me, while she was HER! IOW much of my shyness was a result of my own low self esteem. 
So I would switch counselors and I would work on your self esteem if I were you.

I don't think there is anything inherently wrong with being attracted to who ever or what ever type you are attracted to. It is just in this case there are other issues to consider.


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## ElCanario (Nov 11, 2013)

Ynot said:


> There are several issues at play here it seems. First off, the purpose of therapy is to focus on yourself and your issues. So if you are creating a fantasy of your therapist in your head, it would probably be best to find a new therapist. You may find it extremely difficult to speak what is really on your mind, rather than saying things you might imagine she would want to hear.


Hmm. Well, in almost any other situation, I have never had problems speaking my mind about anything. I am not really fantasizing about her (consciously anyway). But when I am in her presence, her presentation just drives me crazy. And yes, it would be pretty tough for me to tell her. 



> Secondly, I would encourage you to investigate the root of your shyness. I used to consider my self shy. I have since found that for the most part it was a defensive mechanism I created to protect myself. I imagined I was less than worthy, that people thought lowly of me, thought I was unattractive etc etc. I would avoid women I considered beautiful because I figured I was unworthy of their attention and why would they want mine. After all I was just me, while she was HER! IOW much of my shyness was a result of my own low self esteem.


Yes, that is it. As I've said, I'm pretty much fearless - except when it comes to women. 



> So I would switch counselors and I would work on your self esteem if I were you.


Been doing that for years, but it just hasn't worked...


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## sandcastle (Sep 5, 2014)

ElCanario said:


> An old friend, who was my therapist long, long ago, suggested it because she thought if I talked about my problems in a group with other people, I would get multiple perspectives from the other members of the group.


CBT?
DBT?

Substance abuse?
Sex?
Shopping?
Gambling?

Fill in the blank for group therapy.


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## ElCanario (Nov 11, 2013)

sandcastle said:


> CBT?
> DBT?
> 
> Substance abuse?
> ...


Dunno what CBT or DBT are. None of the below either (I wish I could have a problem with sex addiction). In my case, just deeply rooted self-esteem problems stemming from childhood.......


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## Townes (Jan 31, 2018)

Interestingly, I just had this conversation with some fellow therapists last night. We've all been attracted to clients before, so it goes both ways. It's best just to acknowledge it openly. She won't be surprised or offended I assure you. Then you just have to decide together whether or not it's a tenable therapeutic relationship. Sometimes talking about it takes the power out of it and you can move forward. Sometimes it's best to transition you to a new therapist. Sounds like you're doing that anyway. Don't entertain hooking up with her as a realistic option though. It happens, of course, but it can ruin lives and careers. Don't do it for her sake as much as your own.


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## sandcastle (Sep 5, 2014)

ElCanario said:


> Dunno what CBT or DBT are. None of the below either (I wish I could have a problem with sex addiction). In my case, just deeply rooted self-esteem problems stemming from childhood.......


Trauma based therapy.

So- here is the rub

1) you have trauma
2) your unresolved or resolved trauma manifests in ways that make it difficult to function.

A) sleep?
B) eating
C) money
D) sexual
E) OCD
F) fear of stuff- going out, flying, animals, touch, germ exposure etc

G) fill in the blank.

Let's talk about the bigger issue.
Hottie therapists are not going anywhere.


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## ElCanario (Nov 11, 2013)

Townes said:


> Interestingly, I just had this conversation with some fellow therapists last night. We've all been attracted to clients before, so it goes both ways. It's best just to acknowledge it openly. She won't be surprised or offended I assure you. Then you just have to decide together whether or not it's a tenable therapeutic relationship. Sometimes talking about it takes the power out of it and you can move forward. Sometimes it's best to transition you to a new therapist. Sounds like you're doing that anyway. *Don't entertain hooking up with her as a realistic option though.* It happens, of course, but it can ruin lives and careers. Don't do it for her sake as much as your own.


Nah, I'd never do that. I never consider that as being possible with anyone.


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## ElCanario (Nov 11, 2013)

sandcastle said:


> Trauma based therapy.
> 
> So- here is the rub
> 
> ...


Well, right now I'm not functioning well because I hate my life. I feel as if I have failed on every level. That's pretty much it. I will probably soon lose my job (no problem, I hate it anyway), my marriage is over (and according to s2bx it has been horrible from the beginning), and there is really nothing going on that I have to look forward to.


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## sandcastle (Sep 5, 2014)

ElCanario said:


> Well, right now I'm not functioning well because I hate my life. I feel as if I have failed on every level. That's pretty much it. I will probably soon lose my job (no problem, I hate it anyway), my marriage is over (and according to s2bx it has been horrible from the beginning), and there is really nothing going on that I have to look forward to.


El Canario-

You just parked your ass on a chair in the biggest and cheapest Group Therapy Session on the planet.

Ready?

Forget the marriage- certain really successful guys have failed at those and you can talk to Anderson for the deets or tune in.


What have you failed at?
Why do hate what you failed at?

Who or what is holding you back from summiting Everest?


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## ElCanario (Nov 11, 2013)

Forgive the length. I've written the whole stupid story:

I am 54 years old, male. I live in a tiny home in a very affluent area of a very affluent state with my wife (52/F) and two boys (20/M and 17/M). My wife and I have been married for 26 years, and the marriage has been really bad most of the time because we both early on came to realize that we were not compatible in terms of personality or family background, and there has been palpable tension in my home and in my physical self almost from the beginning.

We are at the point in which when my wife is not in the room with me, I actually get slightly ill with dread when I hear her coming up the stairs, because I know that nothing good is going to come from the encounter. I liken it to being on an island and seeing a boat flying the Jolly Roger coming up closer and closer, gradually, from a distance. Of course, when she is in the room with me I feel nothing but anger and rage.

I know there is no good outcome to this situation and that a horrible breakup is inevitable. As I told you before, my wife and I have completely different personalities. She is a maniacally driven workaholic who seems to believe that money and material success will ultimately make her happy. She is a mean person who shows bullying and manipulative tendencies,who grew up in a violent home and area.

She is pretty successful in her professional field and is a real go-getter, an extroverted networker. I am quiet, unassuming and somewhat childlike (but far from childish). A young lady of my acquaintance once told me that I had an "innocence" about me.

I grew up in an all-male institution and as a result am very quiet and guarded. Many women who know me (including my wife and mother) say that I am secretive and somewhat sneaky. While I do not exactly agree with this, I do admit that I do not often reveal much about myself to anyone. I do not know why this is except that I find it very bizarre that anyone would want me to tell them what I am thinking deep inside, what someone said to me in a conversation not involving the questioner, or other random details about my life.

I am not trying to hide anything from anyone - I am just a quiet, introverted person who is wary about revealing very much about my inner feelings and inner life (so why am I posting? I am at my wit's end and have nobody to talk to).

In any event, ever since I was about 48 or so, I have come to feel that I am a failure in life. You may or may not believe this from my writing, but I am (or was) a very, very intelligent person. I tested genius level on IQ tests as a child and could have graduated from high school and college very early.

The reason I did not was that my school did not believe in this type of accelerated education. So, strangely, I was an indifferent student throughout my school years because I really never had to expend much energy to maintain an A average. While my friends and housemates went to mandatory study time, I read comic books or listened to music. I simply was not challenged at all, especially during my junior and senior years in high school. I pretty much didn't even go to class senior year.

Still, I graduated third in my class and was able to gain admission to an Ivy League school. There, I struggled academically at first but improved my concentration and work ethic. I was not an academic star but was able to graduate on time. However, despite having a few friends and being involved in some activities that I liked, I was extremely isolated because I could not find anyone to love or, failing that, anyone to have sex with. Pretty horrible situation to be in in college where guys and gals (at least some of them) hooked up with each other on a regular basis.

Even though I was a musician and an athlete, I was overweight, ugly and clueless about how to relate to the opposite sex. Not a great combination. I don't know if any woman was ever interested in me, but if they were, I had no idea and wouldn't have known what to do about it. I considered myself a loser because I couldn't get a woman.

I didn't have sex until three nights before graduation, and didn't have a relationship with anyone until I met my wife three years after that. I was greatly attracted to her spirit and of course her looks, but doubted her motivation for wanting me. I thought she was very intelligent and personable, but the fact that she had been a teenage mom had given me pause.

Combine that with her insane family and scary background and issues that rivaled mine, and that even from the beginning I noticed some things I just didn't like about her, I continued to date and become serious about her.

Why? Well, I was inclined to believe that I had to "settle" for her - note that this is in quotes. Even though I regret getting married because much about our life together has been hell, she is not someone I consider inferior. Just different. We came from different worlds. It's just that I felt it wasn't in the cards for me to find someone who might have been compatible.

When you're a man with a deep need for love and affection (as well as the sex drive of a jackrabbit) but don't kiss a woman until you're 22 and don't have a girlfriend until you're 25, you start to believe that if you don't find someone - anyone, soonest! - you will be alone for the rest of your life. I knew lots of men in that situation, guys in their 40s and 50s who simply had nobody in their life, and they were sad, bitter, defeated people. I didn't want to be those guys.

Despite opposition from my family and meddlesomeness from hers, I felt that we could make it. But despite being together for more than 25 years - I don't think we have made it. We have been at each other's throats (and it's getting worse and worse) since the beginning, and I have grown tired of her domineering, bossy personality. She has gotten tired of my sullen, sometimes furious reaction to her personality.

She sleeps downstairs in the living room; I sleep in the bedroom (her choice, not mine). Our finances are in a state of crisis because although she makes a lot of money (when she works; her work projects are sometimes intermittent) I have been unemployed a lot, I am still undercompensated, and she likes to spend money.

She has threatened to divorce me many times, and I have refused to cooperate because I wanted to raise my kids. In absolute terms, the younger one is about to graduate from HS (2019) and I would not ultimately mind a divorce. But I still fear the nastiness and absolute hell the process will unleash as well as the prospect of being one those lonely, bitter old men who have no chance for sex, love or companionship.

It terrifies me, really, and I don't want to be one of those losers. In my life I have already spent too much time there.

I have had some really bad breaks in life, and I am angry and bitter about them. I have also squandered or potentially squandered opportunity. I hate my job and am so depressed about my personal and professional life I can hardly bring myself to go to work. And it is definitely hurting my job performance. I simply am very bored and preoccupied and cannot concentrate on my work.

I have tried counseling on and off for years with varying degrees of success. I have two counselors now - one male I have seen for a year and a female I just began seeing. I don't know if they will help in the long run, but it is good to be able to talk with someone so my head doesn't explode. The psychiatrists won't give the the medicine I think I might need because of another health condition. So I can't even take any drugs (not that I want them, but I am so desperate I will try anything).

But I can still see beauty and good things and good people. I am not mad at the world. But I am miserable. And save some time from about 1995 to 1998, I have always been miserable. I hate my life. I don't have a marriage, I don't have a sex life, and my professional situation stinks. If I didn't have kids, I seriously would think about killing myself.

I am not suicidal but I do have suicidal ideation. I have definitely given up on life, because I don't see any way out of this mess. I really do not care whether I live or die, because I feel like a useless failure who can't get anything going. I feel my life has been a waste, and I don't want this life anymore.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

inmyprime said:


> "And how does looking at my tits make you feel?" - is what my therapist normally says to me. (joking)
> 
> In my experience, it's difficult to talk sensibly with a bulge in your pants so you should probably get another therapist, or change sex (of your therapist).


:rofl:


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## sandcastle (Sep 5, 2014)

ElCanario said:


> Forgive the length. I've written the whole stupid story:
> 
> I am 54 years old, male. I live in a tiny home in a very affluent area of a very affluent state with my wife (52/F) and two boys (20/M and 17/M). My wife and I have been married for 26 years, and the marriage has been really bad most of the time because we both early on came to realize that we were not compatible in terms of personality or family background, and there has been palpable tension in my home and in my physical self almost from the beginning.
> 
> ...


So where to start?

Your marriage is not getting better. Right?

You are too smart for your job or youself( actually) which means you are bored beyond belief and probably dread every second you have to pretend.

You struggle to find a shred of joy in anything including your babies which creates a tremendous amount of guilt.

You are most likely clinically depressed but realize any drug thrown at you has the chance of taking your suicidal ideation to actual suicide attempt which you will probably be successful at because you are a thinker before you are a doer.


Just throwing it out there.


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## sandcastle (Sep 5, 2014)

And pay no attention to Randome Dude and his emoji!s.

He means well but as a self- professed Sociopath/ narc - he really has a short attention span and whatever attention he does have is all about him.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Wow... really? Attack me for finding a post funny?


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## [email protected] (Mar 1, 2018)

ElCanario said:


> But I still fear the nastiness and absolute hell the process will unleash as well as the prospect of being one those lonely, bitter old men who have no chance for sex, love or companionship.
> 
> It terrifies me, really, and I don't want to be one of those losers.


I guess we're opposites. 

I'm over here in the promised land. SE Asia. Fending off the 19 year olds at 59. I have an incredible wife who allows me girlfriends and part of the cost is having to do her six times in the first day we get back together. She'll be here in eight days. I've been here going on four months and this hedonistic blow-out is coming to an end. 

From there on, once we are both home, it's going back to the old 1-2 times a day "grind" with a girl a little over three decades younger then me. 

I have conversations with guys all the time, even here, and they tell me it is not possible to do this. Well okay, whatever you say. But even 20% of this would be acceptable, lol. 

I had a pretty good plan written down, carried in my wallet, before I met the wife. A list of "must-haves" in terms of traits, and a list of "dealbreakers". And she didn't have to be a teenager. I would have gone as high as, oh, 21 or even 22. I had zeroed in on a specific culture, not just a country but a really narrow profile within it. 

Now, I had a period of many years where I was married to a monster. A victim of child sex abuse that became an abuser as an adult. A real covert demon. It was the one time I made the really, really stupid mistake of saying sex shouldn't be an important determining factor in marrying someone. Gosh, as I look across the menu the old bag had a graduate degree and my lovely wife has a high school education from a really bad school. The old bag was an aerobics instructor and a state record holder in her sport. The young wife has never done a sport of any kind. The old bag played an instrument and the young wife never did. I could go on.

So after that horrible, horrendous experience with the old bag I decided to take a more scientific and deliberate approach to companionship. I didn't use what American society took as the ideal model, especially PC society, and really thought hard about what I wanted. 

It included young and beautiful of course but the main thrust was maniacal devotion to family, especially her husband. A feminist's worst nightmare. A girl whose whole world view revolved around being a mother and wife. 

So here I am. I make less than 1/2 of what I did back then. I could make a lot more, but life is so awesome homeschooling the kids and doing a homesteader type rural existence I would never go back to that. I just hated my life then. And the money just goes soooo much further. 

This is all to say that you get what you want by having a specific plan for it. I did a two-year period where I saw nobody because I was saving up money for my initial blitzkrieg and making sure that I didn't fall into a relationship with anybody who would ruin my program. 

You have to believe in your plan of course. Plan your work, work your plan, because organization is the key to success. Those bitter losers have nobody to blame but themselves. 80% of the world is chock full of women who would die for a shot at an Americano. 

People would have made fun of me for what I put on my list, especially the #1. But it turned out to be bullet-proof.

My guess is that your most dangerous character trait is self-sabotage. You'll find reasons why you can't pull off the lifetime awesome wife. It isn't going to be from American culture, I mean the odds are near zero with feminism so pervasive. The main thing most guys need is a woman who views men as wonderful things they should devote themselves to. Speaking to the last 2.5 million years of evolution that is, and across the world today as well except for the very richest countries. 

You're sabotaging the therapist thing, I mean who says you have to stay with a therapist you are in lust for? That isn't even a question one should be asking. If you leave her as your therapist, then you can **** her. If you stay it will screw up your recovery and you can't **** her. Case closed.


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## Thor (Oct 31, 2011)

ElCanario, have you investigated non-Rx supplements for your emotional health? They may not have the same interaction problems with your other health issues.


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## ElCanario (Nov 11, 2013)

Thor said:


> ElCanario, have you investigated non-Rx supplements for your emotional health? They may not have the same interaction problems with your other health issues.


Hmm.....where would I find something like that?


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## ElCanario (Nov 11, 2013)

[email protected] said:


> I guess we're opposites.
> 
> I'm over here in the promised land. SE Asia. Fending off the 19 year olds at 59. I have an incredible wife who allows me girlfriends and part of the cost is having to do her six times in the first day we get back together. She'll be here in eight days. I've been here going on four months and this hedonistic blow-out is coming to an end.
> 
> ...


OK - so how do you pull something like this off? I'm not in a situation where I can go to some other country and hope to find a young, beautiful local girl who wants to hook up with a ******. Sounds very risky on so many levels to me. I'm also not looking to start another family in my 50s. So what am I supposed to do? I'm not even someone who is attractive to women. 




> People would have made fun of me for what I put on my list, especially the #1. But it turned out to be bullet-proof.
> 
> *My guess is that your most dangerous character trait is self-sabotage. You'll find reasons why you can't pull off the lifetime awesome wife. * It isn't going to be from American culture, I mean the odds are near zero with feminism so pervasive. The main thing most guys need is a woman who views men as wonderful things they should devote themselves to. Speaking to the last 2.5 million years of evolution that is, and across the world today as well except for the very richest countries.


That is probably true in a macro sense.....but I'm not even thinking of another marriage to anyone. That's something I only care to fail at once. I have dreams of the Caribbean or South America in terms of finding someone to hug, kiss and f***, but I'm not expecting love or marriage. Hopefully if I go there a few weeks a couple times a year with a fistful of dollars, that will be something.



> You're sabotaging the therapist thing, I mean who says you have to stay with a therapist you are in lust for? That isn't even a question one should be asking. If you leave her as your therapist, then you can **** her. If you stay it will screw up your recovery and you can't **** her. Case closed.


Well, as for the therapist, I never thought that anything other than me noticing how fine she is would be possible. It's just that every time I see her, I get driven crazy. Not a good place to be.


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## Thor (Oct 31, 2011)

ElCanario said:


> Hmm.....where would I find something like that?


There's a good book called "The Mood Cure" by Julia Ross. She has many natural supplements in there which work very well, and in fact maybe better than Rx meds. Do be aware that they work by providing the building blocks to repair deficits in various necessary compounds in your body, including neurotransmitters. So you cannot take these plus Rx meds without coordinating with your doc. Because you said you have a medical condition prohibiting Rx meds for depression or anxiety, I think you need to consult with a doc and do plenty of online research before you do more than take vitamins.


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## Ynot (Aug 26, 2014)

Commenting on the "loser" aspect of your POV towards your future. No one can make you a loser but yourself. As long as you keep trying you will never lose. Life is not a sport, it may be a game, but it is a continual game and as long as you play you can never lose. You may have some set backs along the way and things may not pan out the way you want, but that is why tomorrow exists.
If you do get a divorce, you will probably come to realize that it was the best thing that ever happened to you. Because now you get a do-over. You get to start to remake your life into the one you imagined it would be once.
One of the things about marriage is that we do tend to marry someone who accentuates who we are, both good and bad. Sometimes that is great. Other times it simply makes our lives more miserable. But once you unburden yourself of that marriage, you have the opportunity to learn from your mistakes. Stop with the self pity and do a little self examination. Explore why you feel like you feel and deal with those issues. Vow to learn whatever it is you are supposed to learn and go out and live a better life.


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## tom72 (Nov 4, 2017)

Very interesting. similar story to me and my ex. My ex because she decided to be a hoe. We were disconnected for a long time due to my self esteem issues however didn't give her the right to do what she done.

I was quite etc, but she would pull me out of my comfort zone, got my social etc. With my intelligence and humbleness, I brought her into reality of life 

We did meet to middle ground most of the time. We setup businesses together using my intelligence while using her "go getter" to push us through. It was fantastic

Have you ever thought of such ways to work together? Use the strengths of each other to build something together?


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## [email protected] (Mar 1, 2018)

ElCanario said:


> OK - so how do you pull something like this off? I'm not in a situation where I can go to some other country and hope to find a young, beautiful local girl who wants to hook up with a ******. Sounds very risky on so many levels to me. I'm also not looking to start another family in my 50s. So what am I supposed to do? I'm not even someone who is attractive to women.


Right. That's what I told you I expected from you. I tell you there's gold under some rocks, and you say the rocks are too heavy to move. 

You can find an excuse no matter what I tell you. But listen champ, I have two nineteen year olds I am juggling right now, neither one of whom I will marry nor have children with. 

Tomorrow is going to be really tricky. With 19 year olds, you have the immaturity to deal with. My ex-girlfriend of 19 apparently saw me with the new 19 year old model and it seems to have really shaken her to the point of begging forgiveness about being so disrespectful to my wife, which is why we fired her. So I agreed to see her tomorrow and if she really behaves herself then I am willing to **** her all day, every day, until my wife comes. She is just wonderful in bed. Why does God see fit to make my sex kitten a drama queen. 

Life is not problem-free. Even drowning in 19 year olds has its problems. Drama, ugh. But the wife is standing by, like the rock of Gibraltar, when I am tired of this drama. 

Now what I told you was I wrote my program down on paper. The wife was the anchor to the whole thing and I had no idea it would be this crazy, but it is crazy in a good way. You have a start right here:



> That is probably true in a macro sense.....but I'm not even thinking of another marriage to anyone. That's something I only care to fail at once. I have dreams of the Caribbean or South America in terms of finding someone to hug, kiss and f***, but I'm not expecting love or marriage. Hopefully if I go there a few weeks a couple times a year with a fistful of dollars, that will be something.


It is absolutely true, no question about it. But I want to focus on the positive. You have a start here with the Caribbean or South America. I left a wake behind me in Chile, Argentina, Peru, and Brazil. lol. There were some affectations about the girls there I felt were imperfections and Asia has been better for my preferences.

But here you have the initial makings of a battle plan. A location. A notion of budget, vague as it may be. So do your research and come up with a solid program. 

It does take more than dollars. I see guys here in paradise complaining they can't get laid. It is clear to me they just self-sabotage. I look at every girl knowing she wants me. And they know that I know. That seems to be the difference. These guys all have more money than me, although I do make more per hour. I have other interests and a modest income is fine with me. 

College kids with minumum wage summer jobs seem to pull off international travel so this is just a matter of planning and budgeting. 




> Well, as for the therapist, I never thought that anything other than me noticing how fine she is would be possible. It's just that every time I see her, I get driven crazy. Not a good place to be.


You have a high IQ. You have other traits that if you felt like it could be turned into positives with your outlook and thereby the objectives.

She's ten years too old for my preferences. Probably too fat as well, even if she looks great for 30. If you set your sights higher, you will hit targets that will surprise others. 

But isn't the objective with the therapist to fix yourself? Can't do that pining away for her *****.


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## Ursula (Dec 2, 2016)

Find a new therapist; one that you aren't attracted to.


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## ElCanario (Nov 11, 2013)

tom72 said:


> Very interesting. similar story to me and my ex. My ex because she decided to be a hoe. We were disconnected for a long time due to my self esteem issues however didn't give her the right to do what she done.
> 
> I was quite etc, but she would pull me out of my comfort zone, got my social etc. With my intelligence and humbleness, I brought her into reality of life
> 
> ...


Well, that would have been nice. But she has decided that she doesn't want to work on or save the marriage - so it is over. No fixing it, no saving it. Waiting until the youngest is out of high school.


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## ElCanario (Nov 11, 2013)

[email protected] said:


> Right. That's what I told you I expected from you. I tell you there's gold under some rocks, and you say the rocks are too heavy to move.
> 
> You can find an excuse no matter what I tell you. But listen champ, I have two nineteen year olds I am juggling right now, neither one of whom I will marry nor have children with.
> 
> ...


So I guess I'm too analytical. I think too much about what could happen, but it's based on what has happened. You seem gifted with the ability to attract women -young women. I'm not good at that. In any case, the 19-year-old crowd isn't for me.....



> Now what I told you was I wrote my program down on paper. The wife was the anchor to the whole thing and I had no idea it would be this crazy, but it is crazy in a good way. You have a start right here:
> 
> 
> It is absolutely true, no question about it. But I want to focus on the positive. You have a start here with the Caribbean or South America. I left a wake behind me in Chile, Argentina, Peru, and Brazil. lol. There were some affectations about the girls there I felt were imperfections and Asia has been better for my preferences.
> ...


So how do you do it? I don't have any experience "picking up" women or getting them to be interested in me at all. 



> College kids with minumum wage summer jobs seem to pull off international travel so this is just a matter of planning and budgeting.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


That's very interesting you say this...tells me what type you prefer and you have a good idea of the type I prefer. A reason I like my T is that she certainly fits my profile - Latina, pretty, brown-skinned, very voluptuous. She's not fat - she's just a whole lotta woman in a pretty small, compact package. 



> But isn't the objective with the therapist to fix yourself? Can't do that pining away for her *****.


Not pining away for her -just wish I could find one of my own.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

ElCanario said:


> I just began seeing a female therapist a couple weeks ago, and it has to be a case of God (or the Devil) screwing around with my mind. I am a man, 54 years old, and she is 30 at the most and one of the hottest women I have ever seen. Not so much her looks per se as that her whole package - face, hair, body, ethnic background, and personality - is right exactly down my alley in terms of the type of woman who drives me bonkers. I mean, I was "in lust" the second I saw her, and at the time I neither knew that she was going to be my therapist nor had even talked to her. Now, people always say that patients fall for their therapists for various reasons and that it's transference, but I don't think that's the case here. I haven't really been dealing with her long enough to even consider that that type of thing could happen, and I don't even look at her that emotionally. It's just pure lust in this case because she is so beautiful. I do find myself thinking about her at times totally randomly and wish I were in a position where I could get to know her. But I am rational and realistic and know it could never happen - which is why I say someone is playing a really cruel joke on me. How should I deal with this?


Either suck it up and don't tell her or change therapists.


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## ElCanario (Nov 11, 2013)

MattMatt said:


> Either suck it up and don't tell her or change therapists.


Well, I ain't gonna tell her....


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

ElCanario said:


> Well, I ain't gonna tell her....


Then just ignore the fact you find her so attractive.

It's not easy, I know.


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## ElCanario (Nov 11, 2013)

MattMatt said:


> Then just ignore the fact you find her so attractive.
> 
> It's not easy, I know.


I'm getting better at it. Saw her tonight, I guess I'm just getting used to her.


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## tom72 (Nov 4, 2017)

ElCanario said:


> Well, that would have been nice. But she has decided that she doesn't want to work on or save the marriage - so it is over. No fixing it, no saving it. Waiting until the youngest is out of high school.


Time to focus on yourself, become that awesome positive man you were when she picked you.


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## [email protected] (Mar 1, 2018)

ElCanario said:


> So I guess I'm too analytical. I think too much about what could happen, but it's based on what has happened. You seem gifted with the ability to attract women -young women. I'm not good at that. In any case, the 19-year-old crowd isn't for me.....


Analytical in one direction only, so it isn't "analytical". That's why I am pointing out we're opposites. It doesn't surprise me, not even the slightest that I can sit down with parents who are younger than me while snuggling with their daughter. 

So I think about what could happen too, which is generally being a hero to everyone in her family:



> So how do you do it? I don't have any experience "picking up" women or getting them to be interested in me at all.


My father told me at a very young age that you should always go for it. The worst that can happen is the girl is flattered but tells you "no". He didn't tell me the best that can happen, but boy Dad - THANK YOU.

And I loathe pick-up artist literature for its disgusting, abusively manipulative approach. I really care for this G.F. and am trying to change her life for the better. I did something for her family, I don't want to detail it here but it was an act of kindness that had her in tears of joy for days. She has a character defect, this drama, and I am certain it has to do with her childhood. 

Sure, I want to **** her. But the thing that I am obsessing over right now is how to get her over this character defect that is so destructive to what she wants out of life. If I can do this for her, I will be overjoyed. I want to be in love, not to have conquests. And there is nothing like the love of a 19 year old to a fat old man like me. I see this the same way I see producing champion athletes and scholars out of the boys I have taught and coached - and I have produced a LOT of them. To see her walk off and be successful in life, wow - this brings the tears to me. 

I also did something for her nemesis' family. Maybe that's the secret, eh? I go to their families. I survey the situation. There is usually something I can do that will change their lives. It might be something as simple as writing a resume for her father and finding an engineering firm that will hire him the next day - and that one thing ends up with him having the next ten years of full employment and promotion to lead foreman. Her little sisters might have pneumonia. It might be a devastating legal situation. Do these pick-up artists talk about how to be the guy that rescues a girl's family? Spending hours at a time in a law library going over case law? 

I guess I've never sat down and thought this through until now, but that's always what happens with my girlfriends. 




> That's very interesting you say this...tells me what type you prefer and you have a good idea of the type I prefer. A reason I like my T is that she certainly fits my profile - Latina, pretty, brown-skinned, very voluptuous. She's not fat - she's just a whole lotta woman in a pretty small, compact package.
> 
> Not pining away for her -just wish I could find one of my own.


That's where the high IQ can do it for you. The life experience. The drive. What if you could turn a 20 year old into that 30 year old: where she is now. Put her on the path to that. A girl who would otherwise be swallowed up in the maw of life's cruelties? 

There is nothing like that feeling. Compare that to "negging" - attacking a girl's self-esteem in order to get down her pants. I feel exactly the opposite - I tell them quite sincerely that I would never put them down. If I point out anything that is a character flaw, it is for the purpose of making them more successful people. I am on their team. 

Your latina already has it. She is doing what I do: changing your life for the better. And look how you are responding with this intense attraction. 

And how would you feel bedding this woman? You'd be thrilled, right? Dream come true. That's how I do it. Reverse the roles and you will understand why the girls want to bed me. 

Six hours from launch sequence. What's gonna happen. Will she blow it again with drama? Or will she turn the corner. That is the kind of thing your therapist worries about with you. The same thing I worry about with this girl. And both of you are more hung up on having sex with us than we are with you.


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## ElCanario (Nov 11, 2013)

[email protected] said:


> My father told me at a very young age that you should always go for it. The worst that can happen is the girl is flattered but tells you "no". He didn't tell me the best that can happen, but boy Dad - THANK YOU.


Nah, the worst that can happen is that the girl is not flattered. They only like it if the person showing interest is attractive. I'm here to tell ya.



> And I loathe pick-up artist literature for its disgusting, abusively manipulative approach. I really care for this G.F. and am trying to change her life for the better. I did something for her family, I don't want to detail it here but it was an act of kindness that had her in tears of joy for days. She has a character defect, this drama, and I am certain it has to do with her childhood.
> 
> Sure, I want to **** her. But the thing that I am obsessing over right now is how to get her over this character defect that is so destructive to what she wants out of life. If I can do this for her, I will be overjoyed. I want to be in love, not to have conquests. And there is nothing like the love of a 19 year old to a fat old man like me. I see this the same way I see producing champion athletes and scholars out of the boys I have taught and coached - and I have produced a LOT of them. To see her walk off and be successful in life, wow - this brings the tears to me.
> 
> ...


Believe me, I'm not trying to call you one of those pick-up artist guys. I hate those sleazy mfs. Please accept my apology for using the words "pick up" at all. 




> That's where the high IQ can do it for you. The life experience. The drive. What if you could turn a 20 year old into that 30 year old: where she is now. Put her on the path to that. A girl who would otherwise be swallowed up in the maw of life's cruelties?
> 
> There is nothing like that feeling. Compare that to "negging" - attacking a girl's self-esteem in order to get down her pants. I feel exactly the opposite - I tell them quite sincerely that I would never put them down. If I point out anything that is a character flaw, it is for the purpose of making them more successful people. I am on their team.


In my coaching career (sports and martial arts) I've always been successful because I make my guys believe they can do anything. In fact, I have beaten NFL players and Olympians in matches by thinking the same way. If only I could translate that to the ladies.....



> Your latina already has it. She is doing what I do: changing your life for the better. And look how you are responding with this intense attraction.


Well, she just happened to be in the right place at the right time....



> And how would you feel bedding this woman? You'd be thrilled, right? Dream come true. That's how I do it. Reverse the roles and you will understand why the girls want to bed me.


Yeah I'd be thrilled. But I still can't figure how you do it, but great that you can.



> Six hours from launch sequence. What's gonna happen. Will she blow it again with drama? Or will she turn the corner. That is the kind of thing your therapist worries about with you. The same thing I worry about with this girl. And both of you are more hung up on having sex with us than we are with you.


Nah, I'm not hung up on that at all, because I never have thought about that as being a possibility.


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## [email protected] (Mar 1, 2018)

ElCanario said:


> Nah, the worst that can happen is that the girl is not flattered. They only like it if the person showing interest is attractive. I'm here to tell ya.


This is your problem right here. This is a fun exchange, so never take it wrong. Below I am thrilled to exchange on this in more detail. 




> Believe me, I'm not trying to call you one of those pick-up artist guys. I hate those sleazy mfs. Please accept my apology for using the words "pick up" at all.


Oh, I didn't take it that way. No apology necessary.

It was important for distinguishing between what is good and what is evil about approaches to relationships and... sex. 

I am very glad we see it the same way. I loathe those *******s. 



> In my coaching career (sports and martial arts) I've always been successful because I make my guys believe they can do anything. In fact, I have beaten NFL players and Olympians in matches by thinking the same way. If only I could translate that to the ladies.....


How thrilling! That we not only have the same kind of background, but that you can understand how this works by experiencing it yourself. 

I've won a lot of titles. If I list them it will "out" me. 

So making believers out of people, yes. You know, the most gratifying thing I ever see in coaching is sending a kid out there against a muscle pig who on paper should just crush him, and having him win. Getting a kid to the state finals who has no business even being varsity. 

I don't really get something though. Winning titles got me on television, in the newspaper, on the radio, and had girls seeking me out. Getting into med school or developing a successful business will do the same thing. 

If you are an instructor/coach then it is automatic bona-fides. You have to be self-sabotaging, and your writing is full of that very thing. 



> Yeah I'd be thrilled. But I still can't figure how you do it, but great that you can.


How do I know that when I meet a girl her two little sisters have pneumonia? Or a migraine problem (neurological) that is mis-diagnosed as a gastro-intestinal problem? I diagnosed cassava poisoning once, and boy do the doctors resent me marching in the hospital and telling them to get out the sodium thiosulfate.

But you do that for a family and they remember you for the rest of their lives. All I needed was the internet and the desire to help in all of these cases. 

I just know that I can help people. If you're smart, and can throw some intense effort into a compact time frame, you might get three months of three-times-a-day sex out of it. I kept a calendar on the wall with one girlfriend and marked every day's total. I think it was 151 times if I recall correctly. 

You mentioned showing up to somewhere in the Caribbean with a fist full of dollars. I think it is Dominican Republic that is famous for sex tourism? Rush Limbaugh got busted doing that if I remember right. 

I think I am on a per dollar basis blowing the doors off buying it. Maybe if you count the value of my time doing research or managing a construction projects I am not. Nothing wrong with buying it. But if you want love and adulation, then help people's lives. 

You already do that. The self-sabotage prevents you from applying it to the girls. 





> Nah, I'm not hung up on that at all, because I never have thought about that as being a possibility.


This is your contrarian goblin lurching out. You started a thread about being hung up on your therapist and went on about how she's your dream girl. 

This is not a logical contradiction to the attraction you profess. The belief you cannot bed her is not a contradiction to the fact you are attracted. 

I can't fix you. I suspect there is a bit of emotional vampire danger with you, meaning getting people involved with helping and dashing their hopes is a character defect. 

But it sure is interesting given our backgrounds.


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## sandcastle (Sep 5, 2014)

[email protected] said:


> This is your problem right here. This is a fun exchange, so never take it wrong. Below I am thrilled to exchange on this in more detail.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Hey OP
Take advice from a dirty old man with not one but 2 - 19 year old hookers in his bed .

I'm thinking maybe 14 year olds cause it is Thai - who , what and WTF.

So normal. Really- anybody and their wife is boinking teens. But hey- we have an agreement!

More people put more effort into their organic kale smoothie.


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## [email protected] (Mar 1, 2018)

sandcastle said:


> Hey OP
> Take advice from a dirty old man with not one but 2 - 19 year old hookers in his bed .


They aren't hookers. I just explained that. Nor are they Thai. 

This says a lot more about you than it does about me. When we cannot address the reality, we just lie about the situation. You've really gone out of your way to lie too. 

Both these girls live near where I am working. They have seen each other because I was at the grocery store with one of them on my motorcycle. There isn't any reason for me to travel more than a block or two. A white guy draws a crowd. There is only one of me anywhere near here. 

You've never been here, so you don't understand what it is like being a rock star in so much of the world. 




> I'm thinking maybe 14 year olds cause it is Thai - who , what and WTF.


lol. Emotions definitely have the best of you. Why not just say they are barnyard animals? Just as much validity. 



> So normal. Really- anybody and their wife is boinking teens. But hey- we have an agreement!



Yes, we do have an agreement. In writing. Normal? No, it's far from "normal" statistically. So there you go again lying about what I have said. 

It really bothers you, sure. 2.5 hours to launch sequence. :smile2:

I'll be thinking of you. 



> More people put more effort into their organic kale smoothie.


So first of all, you lie about the situation, and then say this lie does not demonstrate enough "effort" for you. This is a real weird comment I have seen before from emotion-driven people. I didn't work hard enough, so it is invalid. 

And what a de-rail from the OP.

Because to position himself for this sort of thing takes years. I think the cultural research alone is more than the likes of you would ever put forth. 

I speak the local language. It's my fifth language. How many do you speak? I can play guitar and sing a number of locally popular songs in their own language too. I like doing that for everyone - the men really dig it too. I played at a wedding for one family, and have done a number of performances at outdoor events and (!) churches. lol. 

I mentioned Dominican Republic because of something OP said about two weeks and a fist full of dollars to the Caribbean. It happens to be popular and I don't have a problem with it. But you can do a lot better, meaning get real love out of a companion. 

I spend four or five months living full-time and making a living. I need a girl who cooks and cleans, does my laundry, buys medicine when I am sick, etc. A second wife. You need a second home or retirement to a place in order to pull off a girlfriend. If all you have is a week's vacation, then you don't have many options.

OP has a high IQ. He has physical prowess. I am thinking the trifecta with music too maybe? Hope so. 

Am I right OP?


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## sandcastle (Sep 5, 2014)

[email protected] said:


> They aren't hookers. I just explained that. Nor are they Thai.
> 
> This says a lot more about you than it does about me. When we cannot address the reality, we just lie about the situation. You've really gone out of your way to lie too.
> 
> ...


So- You creep ME out.

Maybe YOU don't creep any other poster out.


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## sandcastle (Sep 5, 2014)

[email protected] said:


> It really bothers you, sure. 2.5 hours to launch sequence. :smile2:
> 
> I'll be thinking of you.
> 
> ...


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## sandcastle (Sep 5, 2014)

yeah
1.5 hours to launch.

Can't wait.


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## sandcastle (Sep 5, 2014)

Lol.

I got it.

Blast away.


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## ElCanario (Nov 11, 2013)

[email protected] said:


> They aren't hookers. I just explained that. Nor are they Thai.
> 
> This says a lot more about you than it does about me. When we cannot address the reality, we just lie about the situation. You've really gone out of your way to lie too.
> 
> ...


Music was my first love in life. I play(ed) piano, bass, horns and percussion all through school and college and young adulthood. And I sing. Well, I did before marriage, kids and this f'd up life I have now. I sang in five languages.


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## ElCanario (Nov 11, 2013)

Well, as I said earlier, this lady being my therapist was just a short-term arrangement. I miss her already though.


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## Cynthia (Jan 31, 2014)

Being too analytical isn't your problem. Combining analytical with dwelling on the negative is your problem. There are lots of good things in life. Find some of them and start to focus on them. When you get up in the morning, decide to be in a good mood and keep that thought until you go to bed. Don't let anything interfere with you good mood. Focus on being in a good mood. Focus on every little thing that goes right and think of yourself as lucky. Try this for a week and let us know how it goes.


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## ElCanario (Nov 11, 2013)

CynthiaDe said:


> Being too analytical isn't your problem. Combining analytical with dwelling on the negative is your problem. There are lots of good things in life. Find some of them and start to focus on them. When you get up in the morning, decide to be in a good mood and keep that thought until you go to bed. Don't let anything interfere with you good mood. Focus on being in a good mood. Focus on every little thing that goes right and think of yourself as lucky. Try this for a week and let us know how it goes.


Well, I just lost my job today. Trying to keep my good mood. It helped that I hated the job with a passion.


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## Cynthia (Jan 31, 2014)

ElCanario said:


> Well, I just lost my job today. Trying to keep my good mood. It helped that I hated the job with a passion.


I'm sorry for the trouble losing your job will cause you.

This could be a blessing in disguise. You can reinvent yourself.


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