# New member



## mattandcandy

Happily married. We've got a good family life balance. We have our problems, but I don't think we do to badly raising the kids.

Im on here looking for help improving the romantic side of things. The romantic side isn't really bad, but there's always room for improvement and Im running out of ideas.

Thanks for reading,
Matt


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## MattMatt

mattandcandy said:


> Happily married. We've got a good family life balance. We have our problems, but I don't think we do to badly raising the kids.
> 
> Im on here looking for help improving the romantic side of things. The romantic side isn't really bad, but there's always room for improvement and Im running out of ideas.
> 
> Thanks for reading,
> Matt


Croeso, Matt!


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## Taxman

Take it from someone who has been doing this for 42 years. Don't stop. We have plenty of friends who just stopped. The marriage got stale, the physicality dropped off, and the marriage either ended or is in a state of being a zombie. Romance waxes and wanes throughout the years. Keeping it fresh, whether from slight variations on your sexual repertoire, or through mommy and daddy only vacations (that was my firm rule, kids get one, we get one.) Relating to one another as lovers rather than Mom and Dad, that has kept it fresh. We found that as we aged, and we kept up being with one another, and treating the marriage as if it were new, has really worked out well. Among our friends we are the ones that have ended up staying together. 

If you get into a practice of acting like this when you are younger, it carries through to your golden years. We are over 60, in pretty good shape, and we have sex, a lot. With no kids in the house, looking and acting young, we are poster children for keeping it going.


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## mattandcandy

Taxman said:


> Take it from someone who has been doing this for 42 years. Don't stop. We have plenty of friends who just stopped. The marriage got stale, the physicality dropped off, and the marriage either ended or is in a state of being a zombie. Romance waxes and wanes throughout the years. Keeping it fresh, whether from slight variations on your sexual repertoire, or through mommy and daddy only vacations (that was my firm rule, kids get one, we get one.) Relating to one another as lovers rather than Mom and Dad, that has kept it fresh. We found that as we aged, and we kept up being with one another, and treating the marriage as if it were new, has really worked out well. Among our friends we are the ones that have ended up staying together.
> 
> If you get into a practice of acting like this when you are younger, it carries through to your golden years. We are over 60, in pretty good shape, and we have sex, a lot. With no kids in the house, looking and acting young, we are poster children for keeping it going.


Thanks Taxman,

I've got a few ideas on how to improve things. I going to run them past TAM first and see if they have other ideas or ways to improve my plans.

Im not sure about kids free vacations, but maybe we could have a weekend away on our own.


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## MattMatt

mattandcandy said:


> Thanks Taxman,
> 
> I've got a few ideas on how to improve things. I going to run them past TAM first and see if they have other ideas or ways to improve my plans.
> 
> Im not sure about kids free vacations, but maybe we could have a weekend away on our own.


Do you both speak Welsh? If not, I would suggest taking Welsh language classes together, plus other classes so you could learn arts and crafts, to find out how to do things together.


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## She'sStillGotIt

mattandcandy said:


> Im not sure about kids free vacations, but maybe we could have a weekend away on our own.


I'm going to let you in on a secret.

Lots of marriages fail (or just die a slow death) because once people (especially women - sorry ladies) have children, they FORGET that they're a man or woman FIRST, then a parent. Instead, they allow their complete identities to morph into being a parent. That's how romance dies, that's how intimacy dies, that's how it all starts going downhill - the minute you forget you're a man or woman FIRST.

Every single year my husband and I went away to a different island in the Caribbean for 2 weeks - just the two of us while our son stayed at Grandma's. They loved their time together - Grandma was in heaven, and the hubby and I got to spend time on our own without being parents for a couple of weeks. He's my ex now for other reasons (this was many years ago) but that doesn't negate what I said.

Stop scoffing at the kids-free vacations. As a married man and woman, you're ENTITLED to reconnect as a man and woman without having your kids attached to your hips. It's not a crime and they WILL magically defy the odds and _*survive *_the time you're gone. Really, they will.

You're MORE than a parent. Don't forget that - it sounds like you already have.


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## Diana7

She'sStillGotIt said:


> I'm going to let you in on a secret.
> 
> Lots of marriages fail (or just die a slow death) because once people (especially women - sorry ladies) have children, they FORGET that they're a man or woman FIRST, then a parent. Instead, they allow their complete identities to morph into being a parent. That's how romance dies, that's how intimacy dies, that's how it all starts going downhill - the minute you forget you're a man or woman FIRST.
> 
> Every single year my husband and I went away to a different island in the Caribbean for 2 weeks - just the two of us while our son stayed at Grandma's. They loved their time together - Grandma was in heaven, and the hubby and I got to spend time on our own without being parents for a couple of weeks. He's my ex now for other reasons (this was many years ago) but that doesn't negate what I said.
> 
> Stop scoffing at the kids-free vacations. As a married man and woman, you're ENTITLED to reconnect as a man and woman without having your kids attached to your hips. It's not a crime and they WILL magically defy the odds and _*survive *_the time you're gone. Really, they will.
> 
> You're MORE than a parent. Don't forget that - it sounds like you already have.


Please remember that many couples don't have that luxury of having family who could have their children for 2 weeks, and even if they did, they couldn't afford a holiday like that, or any holiday.


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## Livvie

I am of the same mind as Diana on this one. Some people can't take two weeks off, and then have ANY vacation time off for anything else the whole rest of the year. Also, many parents unfortunately have to use their valued vacation time to stay home with sick children, children's appointments, attend school functions. Some families with children don't have the funds for annual even week long away holidays with just their spouse, either. Lower income families/couples don't have the same opportunities or luxuries as higher income families. 



Diana7 said:


> She'sStillGotIt said:
> 
> 
> 
> I'm going to let you in on a secret.
> 
> Lots of marriages fail (or just die a slow death) because once people (especially women - sorry ladies) have children, they FORGET that they're a man or woman FIRST, then a parent. Instead, they allow their complete identities to morph into being a parent. That's how romance dies, that's how intimacy dies, that's how it all starts going downhill - the minute you forget you're a man or woman FIRST.
> 
> Every single year my husband and I went away to a different island in the Caribbean for 2 weeks - just the two of us while our son stayed at Grandma's. They loved their time together - Grandma was in heaven, and the hubby and I got to spend time on our own without being parents for a couple of weeks. He's my ex now for other reasons (this was many years ago) but that doesn't negate what I said.
> 
> Stop scoffing at the kids-free vacations. As a married man and woman, you're ENTITLED to reconnect as a man and woman without having your kids attached to your hips. It's not a crime and they WILL magically defy the odds and _*survive *_the time you're gone. Really, they will.
> 
> You're MORE than a parent. Don't forget that - it sounds like you already have.
> 
> 
> 
> Please remember that many couples don't have that luxury of having family who could have their children for 2 weeks, and even if they did, they couldn't afford a holiday like that, or any holiday.
Click to expand...


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## aquarius1

Forgetting we were people first and not parents almost killed it for us.

The point remains the same. Able or not, time is something that should not cost anything.

What about holing up in your bedroom for a couple of hours. It may take a while before intimacy/romance returns. Just be together. Can a sitter (young neighbour) come over for a couple of hours and take them to the park or play with them away from you? Can you house swap with a friend for a few hours?

The thing I hear at TAM time and time again is that men want ROMANCE, which to them is connection and closeness with their partner. Often we women hear "sex" and "just one more thing we have to do" after being tired and taxed out all day.

Some of it is about changing the way of looking at it, both of you. Her understanding how you view this and your understanding about what works and what doesn't.


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## Diceplayer

aquarius1 said:


> Forgetting we were people first and not parents almost killed it for us.
> 
> The point remains the same. Able or not, time is something that should not cost anything.
> 
> What about holing up in your bedroom for a couple of hours. It may take a while before intimacy/romance returns. Just be together. Can a sitter (young neighbour) come over for a couple of hours and take them to the park or play with them away from you? Can you house swap with a friend for a few hours?
> 
> The thing I hear at TAM time and time again is that men want ROMANCE, which to them is connection and closeness with their partner. Often we women hear "sex" and "just one more thing we have to do" after being tired and taxed out all day.
> 
> Some of it is about changing the way of looking at it, both of you. Her understanding how you view this and your understanding about what works and what doesn't.


Exactly what I was thinking. Doesn't have to be two weeks per year. A couple of hours in the bedroom or we have even sneaked away for an hour in a hotel room. I remember being on business travel for a week and the morning I got home, I went and got a hotel room and picked up some lunch. Then went to my wife's place of employment to take her to lunch to reconnect.

A date with your SO at least once per week is critical. Doesn't have to be a dinner and a movie. Have someone watch the kids for two or three hours and watch Netflix, then do the same for them. The point is, make romance and connecting with you SO a priority.


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## aquarius1

The important thing is don't make it about sex. Not at first. Sneak off to a hotel to laugh and lunch. Picnic by the river. Pressure initially is not appreciated. But still, we women have to change our attitude about what it is our partner is looking for. It's not sex. It's emotional connection, closeness. Society tells us its sex. "all men think about/want is sex"

There are some good books out there. His needs/her needs. 5 love languages. But you still have to have that conversation. Men call it sex. Took me 20 years to figure it out. 
My poor husband. Don't know why he was so patient about it. 

When he was finally ready to walk (and so was I) was when I woke up

Don't be me. Don't wait 20 years. It will pass before you know it. And you can't get that time back.


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## EleGirl

How long have you two been married?

How many children do you have and how old are they?


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## LisaDiane

aquarius1 said:


> Often we women hear "sex" and "just one more thing we have to do" after being tired and taxed out all day.



This I simply CANNOT understand -- I mean, I get the concept of it, and I understand that it's a real feeling for some moms, but when my kids were toddlers, I absolutely relished sex with my husband! It was the only time I was being touched for MY pleasure, instead of for the pleasure/needs/demands of my tiny tyrants....it wasn't even that I was sexually excited every time, but it was such a RELIEF to be doing something so adult and just for ME, it reminded me of who I really was and helped give me back some of the energy that caring for my small children took away...and it's always surprised me that so many other moms felt the exact opposite!


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## mattandcandy

MattMatt said:


> Do you both speak Welsh? If not, I would suggest taking Welsh language classes together, plus other classes so you could learn arts and crafts, to find out how to do things together.


No we don't sadly. That sounds like a good idea. I was thinking about something like Tango lessions.


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## MattMatt

mattandcandy said:


> No we don't sadly. That sounds like a good idea. I was thinking about something like Tango lessions.


Then go for both. Cookery classes, art classes, yoga, whatever is available.


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## mattandcandy

She'sStillGotIt said:


> I'm going to let you in on a secret.
> 
> Lots of marriages fail (or just die a slow death) because once people (especially women - sorry ladies) have children, they FORGET that they're a man or woman FIRST, then a parent. Instead, they allow their complete identities to morph into being a parent. That's how romance dies, that's how intimacy dies, that's how it all starts going downhill - the minute you forget you're a man or woman FIRST.
> 
> Every single year my husband and I went away to a different island in the Caribbean for 2 weeks - just the two of us while our son stayed at Grandma's. They loved their time together - Grandma was in heaven, and the hubby and I got to spend time on our own without being parents for a couple of weeks. He's my ex now for other reasons (this was many years ago) but that doesn't negate what I said.
> 
> Stop scoffing at the kids-free vacations. As a married man and woman, you're ENTITLED to reconnect as a man and woman without having your kids attached to your hips. It's not a crime and they WILL magically defy the odds and _*survive *_the time you're gone. Really, they will.
> 
> You're MORE than a parent. Don't forget that - it sounds like you already have.


Apologies, I didn’t mean to sound like I was scoffing. I was very grateful for the advice given on TAM.

We have a few reasons why it would work for our personal situation. It’s not money.

We had kids later and did a lot of traveling first.

I think family holidays are good for our marriage. It’s nice to have the family time together, away from the stresses of work and an untidy house. We really enjoy them and always comeback feeling refreshed.

I do take onboard peoples advice about making time for ourselves. There are a few people on here making that suggestion. I think we could sort out a weekend away together.


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## SunCMars

She'sStillGotIt said:


> I'm going to let you in on a secret.
> 
> Lots of marriages fail (or just die a slow death) because once people (especially women - sorry ladies) have children, they FORGET that they're a man or woman FIRST, then a parent. Instead, they allow their complete identities to morph into being a parent. That's how romance dies, that's how intimacy dies, that's how it all starts going downhill - the minute you forget you're a man or woman FIRST.
> 
> Every single year my husband and I went away to a different island in the Caribbean for 2 weeks - just the two of us while our son stayed at Grandma's. They loved their time together - Grandma was in heaven, and the hubby and I got to spend time on our own without being parents for a couple of weeks. He's my ex now for other reasons (this was many years ago) but that doesn't negate what I said.
> 
> Stop scoffing at the kids-free vacations. As a married man and woman, you're ENTITLED to reconnect as a man and woman without having your kids attached to your hips. It's not a crime and they WILL magically defy the odds and _*survive *_the time you're gone. Really, they will.
> 
> You're MORE than a parent. Don't forget that - it sounds like you already have.


'Some' days you are wise lady, and this day is one.


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## mattandcandy

aquarius1 said:


> The important thing is don't make it about sex. Not at first. Sneak off to a hotel to laugh and lunch. Picnic by the river. Pressure initially is not appreciated. But still, we women have to change our attitude about what it is our partner is looking for. It's not sex. It's emotional connection, closeness. Society tells us its sex. "all men think about/want is sex"
> 
> There are some good books out there. His needs/her needs. 5 love languages. But you still have to have that conversation. Men call it sex. Took me 20 years to figure it out.
> My poor husband. Don't know why he was so patient about it.
> 
> When he was finally ready to walk (and so was I) was when I woke up
> 
> Don't be me. Don't wait 20 years. It will pass before you know it. And you can't get that time back.


We used a get an opportunity last year where we had couple hours on a Friday before needing to collect the kids from nursery on a Friday. We’d go out for an early meal. It was short and sweet, without having to sort babysitters. Our kids are at school now, so we don’t get that opportunity.

We need to look at something like that again. It was good.

I’ll have a read of those books you suggested.

Thank you


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## mattandcandy

LisaDiane said:


> This I simply CANNOT understand -- I mean, I get the concept of it, and I understand that it's a real feeling for some moms, but when my kids were toddlers, I absolutely relished sex with my husband! It was the only time I was being touched for MY pleasure, instead of for the pleasure/needs/demands of my tiny tyrants....it wasn't even that I was sexually excited every time, but it was such a RELIEF to be doing something so adult and just for ME, it reminded me of who I really was and helped give me back some of the energy that caring for my small children took away...and it's always surprised me that so many other moms felt the exact opposite!


I think both sides need work i.e. quality time together and the passionate side of things. I just need help and ideas on how to improve them both.


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## mattandcandy

EleGirl said:


> How long have you two been married?
> 
> How many children do you have and how old are they?


Over ten years and our children are 5 and 3.


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## RebuildingMe

Wow, two weeks a year in the Caribbean without the kids and the marriage still fails. Kind of reinforces the idea that marriage just sucks and men and women aren’t meant to be together in LTR.


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## Taxman

mattandcandy said:


> Thanks Taxman,
> 
> I've got a few ideas on how to improve things. I going to run them past TAM first and see if they have other ideas or ways to improve my plans.
> 
> Im not sure about kids free vacations, but maybe we could have a weekend away on our own.


When we went away for just ourselves, it was to destinations that the children would never appreciate, or it is in an environment where the kids are entertained separately. We took a week in Paris. Stayed in the Montmartre section, the gay village actually. We walked through Paris, ate at the most incredible Bistros, went to the Louvre, and the Rodin galleries, went to the Follies, walked and walked and walked. It was the most romantic week ever. Our eldest has gotten the travel bug, in Med school she found a way for super inexpensive. She would work in the hospitals for part of the day, in return for airfare and lodging. Her and the new hubby just returned from their honeymoon, did something I have been itching to do, two weeks in the far east, Singapore and Thailand. 

My wife and I did do a ton of what I called "Dirty weekends". We live in Canada, but the US border is an hour and a half away. So we book into NY, Niagara Falls or Buffalo, I know of a few hotels with jacuzzis in the room, and Mom and Dad would return from the weekend with a gigantic smile on their face.


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## MJJEAN

mattandcandy said:


> I do take onboard peoples advice about making time for ourselves. There are a few people on here making that suggestion. I think we could sort out a weekend away together.


It doesn't have to be a weekend or any kind of big production. For example, my husband and I, when the kids were young, would set them up in the living room and take over the basement for ourselves. The kids could make sofa forts, eat pizza, drink soda, watch whatever kid show or movie was in, and just do kid things. We'd sit in the basement family room, eat our own pizza, watch a movie, and spend time together. Sometimes we'd turn off the lights, light candles, and just talk until the wee hours. 

When the kids were old enough to be left at home for short periods of time we'd go to the gym together nightly. 30 minutes or so talking alone in the car followed by 30 minutes on cardio. 

I have friends that leave their kids playing video games in the house while they go sit by a fire in the yard.

Get creative and make sure you're spending at least 15 hrs a week together as a couple.


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## mattandcandy

aquarius1 said:


> Forgetting we were people first and not parents almost killed it for us.
> 
> The point remains the same. Able or not, time is something that should not cost anything.
> 
> What about holing up in your bedroom for a couple of hours. It may take a while before intimacy/romance returns. Just be together. Can a sitter (young neighbour) come over for a couple of hours and take them to the park or play with them away from you? Can you house swap with a friend for a few hours?
> 
> The thing I hear at TAM time and time again is that men want ROMANCE, which to them is connection and closeness with their partner. Often we women hear "sex" and "just one more thing we have to do" after being tired and taxed out all day.
> 
> Some of it is about changing the way of looking at it, both of you. Her understanding how you view this and your understanding about what works and what doesn't.


Thank you Aquarius1

This has giving me a few ideas about creating some opportunities.


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## mattandcandy

MJJEAN said:


> It doesn't have to be a weekend or any kind of big production. For example, my husband and I, when the kids were young, would set them up in the living room and take over the basement for ourselves. The kids could make sofa forts, eat pizza, drink soda, watch whatever kid show or movie was in, and just do kid things. We'd sit in the basement family room, eat our own pizza, watch a movie, and spend time together. Sometimes we'd turn off the lights, light candles, and just talk until the wee hours.
> 
> When the kids were old enough to be left at home for short periods of time we'd go to the gym together nightly. 30 minutes or so talking alone in the car followed by 30 minutes on cardio.
> 
> I have friends that leave their kids playing video games in the house while they go sit by a fire in the yard.
> 
> Get creative and make sure you're spending at least 15 hrs a week together as a couple.


Thank you MJJEAN,

I love the basement idea. We have a basement, where we could setup a romantic little space for date nights.


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## mattandcandy

Taxman said:


> When we went away for just ourselves, it was to destinations that the children would never appreciate, or it is in an environment where the kids are entertained separately. We took a week in Paris. Stayed in the Montmartre section, the gay village actually. We walked through Paris, ate at the most incredible Bistros, went to the Louvre, and the Rodin galleries, went to the Follies, walked and walked and walked. It was the most romantic week ever. Our eldest has gotten the travel bug, in Med school she found a way for super inexpensive. She would work in the hospitals for part of the day, in return for airfare and lodging. Her and the new hubby just returned from their honeymoon, did something I have been itching to do, two weeks in the far east, Singapore and Thailand.
> 
> My wife and I did do a ton of what I called "Dirty weekends". We live in Canada, but the US border is an hour and a half away. So we book into NY, Niagara Falls or Buffalo, I know of a few hotels with jacuzzis in the room, and Mom and Dad would return from the weekend with a gigantic smile on their face.


Your holidays sound great. Defiantly make your way over to the Far East, it’s lovely.

We’ve got loads of beautiful weekend destinations on our doorstep. No jacuzzis’s, hot tubs seem to be thing over here.


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## mattandcandy

MattMatt said:


> Then go for both. Cookery classes, art classes, yoga, whatever is available.


I think we'd both enjoy cookery classes and it would help romantic evenings in. I'll take a look.


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## jlg07

Sometimes romantic stuff doesn't need to be a big deal. How about getting flowers for her at random times -- just because.
Grab her hand and hold hands while walking in the mall, or while you are driving.
How about just going up to her at a random time in the day and give her a hug? Make sure when you get home, go to her and get a hug/kiss before even dropping your bag off. How about coming home and just telling her "let's order something for dinner" to give her a break?
Just you and her go to a farmers market on a Saturday morning -- just for an hour or two.

Simple gestures mean a lot.

Also, I agree with folks here on you are not just parents. I've always told my wife that I love my son and would do anything for him, but she and I are the PRIMARY relationship. Kids grows up and leave to have THEIR lives. My wife and I will be there together when that happens so we need to be primary.


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## MattMatt

mattandcandy said:


> I think we'd both enjoy cookery classes and it would help romantic evenings in. I'll take a look.


Bake some Bara Brith!


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## Taxman

mattandcandy said:


> I think we'd both enjoy cookery classes and it would help romantic evenings in. I'll take a look.


My kids, the newlyweds have taken cooking classes so far in Iceland, Singapore and Thailand. I am being promised a green curry next time they do dinner.


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## Taxman

MattMatt said:


> Then go for both. Cookery classes, art classes, yoga, whatever is available.


Excellent advice: We have so far done classes in Latin and Ballroom dancing, and we are going for a ceramics class this winter. I work at least six days and one evening a week in my practice and having a complete distraction during the January to April timeframe helps immensely. We did yoga a few years back, and we try to have a half hour every few days before sack time. We take ourselves out of our comfort zone and have a fun time doing it. It helps that we have a great amount of curiosity, and anything other than accounting (both of us are accountants) is welcomed into our lives at the times of the greatest stress.


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