# Sex Without Intercourse



## Dogbert (Jan 10, 2015)

Could you - or would - you do it?


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## Zouz (May 28, 2014)

If I am single : maybe , but scared of STds

If I am in a sexless marriage , yes if open marriage is agreed and the no feelings are available for partner (ONS).of course partner should be also either single or in an open marriage...


easier and safer to get a toy ....


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## batsociety (Jan 23, 2015)

...what does this mean?


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## Married but Happy (Aug 13, 2013)

Sometimes just oral is plenty.


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## Dogbert (Jan 10, 2015)

Because of ED, because of great pain with intercourse, etc


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## Joylush (Sep 28, 2013)

I have a partner with ED issues. We have to work around it. It can be frustrating for me true but I'm sure it's ten times more frustrating for him. As long as there is a desire to do what it takes to keep it going if at all possible and not use it as an excuse to forgo sex altogether you make the best of it. We get old, we malfunction, but we keep loving all the same.




Dogbert said:


> Because of ED, because of great pain with intercourse, etc


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## Rowan (Apr 3, 2012)

Frankly, I'm trying to wrap my head around the concept that every sexual encounter must, or even should, include intercourse......


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## 'CuseGal (Feb 5, 2015)

I've always gotten the impression that there are a lot of people out there who actually prefer oral to intercourse. At least getting it 

I know I would have been perfectly happy many times in my marriage if my ex-H would have been willing to stop after oral and not proceed to the "next level." He was good at the former and stunk at the latter.


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## Plan 9 from OS (Jul 13, 2012)

Rowan said:


> Frankly, I'm trying to wrap my head around the concept that every sexual encounter must, or even should, include intercourse......


My wife and I have a healthy sex life from a quality and frequency standpoint. We're also a couple that has intercourse during every sexual encounter. I cannot remember the last time I orgasmed with her that it did not include intercourse (PIV with occasional PIA). That's the way she wants it. I'd be more open to oral encounters on occasion, but that's not what she likes.


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

You've never had a stand alone no strings attached blow job?

You've never gone down on your wife and then recieved a blow job?

You've never given each other full body massages with very happy endings (either with hand or mouths) for each of you?


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## that.girl (Aug 27, 2014)

Anon Pink said:


> You've never had a stand alone no strings attached blow job?
> 
> You've never gone down on your wife and then recieved a blow job?
> 
> You've never given each other full body massages with very happy endings (either with hand or mouths) for each of you?


Given... yes. 
Received... no.


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## Cletus (Apr 27, 2012)

For my wife, sex and intercourse are one and the same.


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## Zouz (May 28, 2014)

Anon Pink said:


> You've never had a stand alone no strings attached blow job?
> 
> You've never gone down on your wife and then recieved a blow job?
> 
> You've never given each other full body massages with very happy endings (either with hand or mouths) for each of you?



-I try to go down , she refuses ...
-Never had a BJ , except once or twice with a condom ...

now even vanilla disappeared in 2015 !


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## askari (Jun 21, 2012)

Sex?
Intercourse?
:scratchhead:

You got me there Dogbert.


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## Zouz (May 28, 2014)

askari said:


> Sex?
> Intercourse?
> :scratchhead:
> 
> You got me there Dogbert.


Lol Askari 

In a sexless marriage like ours , we appreciate anything ....

anything that contains the letter S 

My wife caught me one time looking aroused-though I never do anything , just the way I stare- at our 65 years old neighbor ; she told me I am weired.

I didn't want to hurt my wife , just smiled .

The truth is that I find that lady more attractive than my 37 years old wife ( though she is very beautifull...


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## anonmd (Oct 23, 2014)

Anon Pink said:


> You've never had a stand alone no strings attached blow job?
> 
> You've never gone down on your wife and then received a blow job?
> 
> You've never given each other full body massages with very happy endings (either with hand or mouths) for each of you?


Post wedding, no. Well, check that - once, perhaps twice.

This is actually something I am trying to work through with her lately. After years of abysmal frequency it's been better the past couple years but after a period of adequate we're back to a level that while still much better is not enough for me. I'd be OK with making up the difference with some short of intercourse sessions. 

She does seem to be more vaginal orgasm oriented though, get her warmed up to a point and she wants it "IN!". Fine by me of course but lately I am thinking if we can agree that sometimes the preliminaries are OK and don't necessarily need to progress all the way to PIV maybe she would be more willing more often. Sometimes I get the feeling she can't say yes until she has thought about it for a couple days ahead of time because she hasn't thought about it and is afraid she won't turn on.


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## Plan 9 from OS (Jul 13, 2012)

Anon Pink said:


> You've never had a stand alone no strings attached blow job?
> 
> You've never gone down on your wife and then recieved a blow job?
> 
> You've never given each other full body massages with very happy endings (either with hand or mouths) for each of you?


Is this for me or for everyone to answer? Or is it rhetorical?


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## Dogbert (Jan 10, 2015)

Perhape I should have been more specific with my question. 

If sexual intercourse was not an option, could you, would you be content with other options?


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## Chris Taylor (Jul 22, 2010)

I've never had oral sex and manual sex to completion from my wife. It's always PiV or PiA.

She used to get oral to completion from me all the time but now she doesn't like it.

To answer Dogbert's question, yes I'd take other options.


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## Plan 9 from OS (Jul 13, 2012)

Dogbert said:


> Perhape I should have been more specific with my question.
> 
> If sexual intercourse was not an option, could you, would you be content with other options?


If I had to, then I would. My wife is too important to me to lose if she could no longer handle intercourse. If I was the one having the issue, I'm confident my wife would take the other stuff too.


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## Young at Heart (Jan 6, 2015)

Dogbert said:


> Could you - or would - you do it?


Great post. To me ABSOLUTELY.

When I was young and single, it was what you did with nice girls after you had gone out with them a few times.

As I got older and married, intercourse became the standard.

As I get older and talk to my older friends, I have come to the conclusion that at some point intercourse is probably a rare treat for an older couple. I am not yet at that point, but it is a fear of mine. My major problems in this area have only been self imposed, such as after very long 50 to 100+ mile bicycle rides and then the lack of sensitivity lasts less than a week.

As my wife and I enter retirement, one of the things I want to work on with her is exploring alternatives to intercourse, so that we will have a number of options when medical problems take intercourse away as an option.

So, yes, sex with out intercourse is an important option, expecially as we get older. I view it as a circle of life thing. We start out or sex life with sex without intercourse and toward the end of our life, we also (if we are lucky) still get to have sex without intercourse.


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## Mr. Nail (Apr 26, 2011)

Joylush said:


> I have a partner with ED issues. We have to work around it. It can be frustrating for me true but I'm sure it's ten times more frustrating for him. As long as there is a desire to do what it takes to keep it going if at all possible and not use it as an excuse to forgo sex altogether you make the best of it. We get old, we malfunction, but we keep loving all the same.


Thanks for posting this Joy. I'm the ED partner, and I've always assumed it's 10 times more frustrating for her. Maybe it's more even than we thought.
MN


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

*You've never had a stand alone no strings attached blow job?*

*In twenty years of total married life, no more than a half dozen times!*

*You've never gone down on your wife and then recieved a blow job?*

*With extremely rare exception, I fastideously went down on my rich, skanky XW most all of the time! I absolutely loved fulfilling that most manly duty for her! But in all honesty, I really think that I could actually use one hand only to count the resultant number of reciprocations!*

*You've never given each other full body massages with very happy endings (either with hand or mouths) for each of you?*

*In that very same span of time, no more than 2-3 times on me! Hundreds of times on her, both voluntarily and at her request!

So in that regard, please feel free to refer to me as ~ "Deprived and Neglected!"*


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## anonmd (Oct 23, 2014)

To answer the now revised and clarified question:

Yes if I had to but there would need to be an attitude adjustment .


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## Holland (Aug 20, 2012)

We do have lots of sex without intercourse which I simply love but we also have lots of PIV and some PIA. But TBH if the PIV were not there I would be really disappointed as I love the feel of being so close with him.
If it were due to a medical reason, ED then I would be thankful for all the amazing PIV we have had up till now then get on with the rest of our lives and keep the sex life rocking along any way possible.


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## flyer (Jun 23, 2014)

Zouz said:


> Lol Askari
> 
> In a sexless marriage like ours , we appreciate anything ....
> 
> ...



I've got a cousin who's 65. She always was, and still is good looking........And no, I'm not from Arkansas!!:smthumbup:


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## Zouz (May 28, 2014)

I told her once that knowing that she is not into sex a lot ; anything from her side is fine by me ; even an HJ ; before i completed my word she complained that her hands are aching from playing candy crush !

to answer the main question , i will take anything , yes .


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## Dogbert (Jan 10, 2015)

Lila said:


> I've posted on here about this in the past, but H went through a bout of ED caused by anxiety....at age 36/37 and in peak physical condition. We had no choice but to go with other options which, truth be told, were heavily weighed in my favor.
> 
> Would I be content doing it like this forever, probably, but I doubt he could keep up the enthusiasm in such a one-sided sexual relationship for very long.


One sided? There is also prostate massage.


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## doubletrouble (Apr 23, 2013)

I'd give or take whatever was necessary in order to maintain that intimacy.


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## doobie (Apr 15, 2014)

I've had plenty of guys expect to get a blowjob without intercourse - however, none of them have offered to go down on me without intercourse afterwards. It does seem to me that men will expect to get a blowjob as a "favour" from their partner but wouldn't dream of reciprocating when there's nothing in it for them. My LD husband and I haven't had sex for 6 months now and even though he knows it's put our marriage seriously at risk, there has been no offer to do anything for me. I've told him that I'm sexually frustrated on a daily basis, but he just says that he's lost his mojo and is hoping to get it back at some point. In the meantime I'm forced to be celibate.


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## Fozzy (Jul 20, 2013)

Dogbert said:


> Perhape I should have been more specific with my question.
> 
> If sexual intercourse was not an option, could you, would you be content with other options?


With an attentive, engaged, giving wife who enjoys touching and being touched--yes. It would totally be an option.


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## 'CuseGal (Feb 5, 2015)

I remember my exH being furious that I wasn't allowed to have sex for the second and third trimester of my second pregnancy...he wouldn't even consider exploring other options together. Just went out and got what he wanted elsewhere.

If you truly love your spouse, you will find a way to make it work no matter the circumstances. If you don't love them enough (or at all), well, it's no surprise if you can't get past it, now is it?


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## MountainRunner (Dec 30, 2014)

Dogbert said:


> Could you - or would - you do it?


Absolutely. I even told my wife as much just the other evening. She kinda looked at me quizzically and said "Really? Without even a reciprocating BJ?" She knows that I absolutely LOVE giving her "oral pleasure", so I too found it odd that she was surprised.

I know this may sound odd, but she gave me my very first hand job last night and she was incredible. I've always gone for conventional or oral sex before and I've never had a hand job. Damn that woman knows how to send me through the roof...WOOF! LOL!


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

A friend of my wife must be pushing early 60's. Her son is a renowned plastic surgeon. She is stunning. Absolutely stunning. She's married to a guy who could do Yoda without makeup... 

Next question?


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## larry.gray (Feb 21, 2011)

Dogbert said:


> Perhape I should have been more specific with my question.
> 
> If sexual intercourse was not an option, could you, would you be content with other options?


Content? Oh hell no. I'd grieve deeply at the loss of PIV in my life.

Would I make the best of it? Yep. If it was due to my wife's medical condition, I'd try my best to not make her feel horrible about it.


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## larry.gray (Feb 21, 2011)

Rowan said:


> Frankly, I'm trying to wrap my head around the concept that every sexual encounter must, or even should, include intercourse......


Sex without PIV just feels unfinished. The few times it has happened I'm jonesing to get home from work and finish the job.

FWIW, I have a very short refractory period. I can get a BJ to completion and usually don't lose my erection. I can orgasm again in about 15 minutes.


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## larry.gray (Feb 21, 2011)

doobie said:


> I've had plenty of guys expect to get a blowjob without intercourse - however, none of them have offered to go down on me without intercourse afterwards. It does seem to me that men will expect to get a blowjob as a "favour" from their partner but wouldn't dream of reciprocating when there's nothing in it for them.


Please use the term "some men" rather than paint all men with the same brush. Plenty of men would never expect something one sided unless they do it for you.


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## jaquen (Mar 1, 2012)

My wife and I don't consider sex to be just intercourse. Any sexual encounter that's mutually satisfying and leads to orgasms is what we qualify as "sex".


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## Wolf1974 (Feb 19, 2014)

doobie said:


> I've had plenty of guys expect to get a blowjob without intercourse - however, none of them have offered to go down on me without intercourse afterwards. It does seem to me that men will expect to get a blowjob as a "favour" from their partner but wouldn't dream of reciprocating when there's nothing in it for them. My LD husband and I haven't had sex for 6 months now and even though he knows it's put our marriage seriously at risk, there has been no offer to do anything for me. I've told him that I'm sexually frustrated on a daily basis, but he just says that he's lost his mojo and is hoping to get it back at some point. In the meantime I'm *forced* to be celibate.


Not forced.... It's a choice to stay. I wouldn't stay in a sexless marriage. 

You mention plenty of men expected BJ without anything in return but I'm curious did you ever ask? Some Men and women need to know they have the go ahead for such things. Others are aggressive and take. I will have oral with my Gf on occasion with nothing in return....do so cause I love hearing her scream. One of my favorites is to play with her while I'm driving and again nothing in return. I wouldn't slap such an over generalized label to say men do this women do that. Plenty on both sides step up to do things unselfishly.


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## that.girl (Aug 27, 2014)

I can't speak for all men, but I've never been with one that would give me unreciprocated pleasure. On the rare occasions that started that way, they would end up with an erection they wanted me to take care of. My XH never even attempted to give me a freebie. 

Maybe i just need to raise my standards.


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## MountainRunner (Dec 30, 2014)

that.girl said:


> I can't speak for all men, but I've never been with one that would give me unreciprocated pleasure.


Seriously? Wow.


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## doubletrouble (Apr 23, 2013)

I've offered to go down on my W without intercourse. After a blowjob, it takes a little time to get back to a boner stiff enough to have intercourse, but with a little effort it could surely be done. She thinks cunnilingus is gross, though, while I consider it ambrosia.


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## doubletrouble (Apr 23, 2013)

that.girl said:


> I can't speak for all men, but I've never been with one that would give me unreciprocated pleasure. On the rare occasions that started that way, they would end up with an erection they wanted me to take care of. My XH never even attempted to give me a freebie.
> 
> *Maybe i just need to raise my standards.*


There are higher standard men out there. Geez. 

I'll get an erection going down on my lover, but that doesn't mean it has to DO anything. Sometimes it's just as good to look at that quivering, satisfied woman and smile. 

Much of the time, though, I confess after oral she WANTS me inside her.


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## Holland (Aug 20, 2012)

that.girl said:


> I can't speak for all men, but I've never been with one that would give me unreciprocated pleasure. On the rare occasions that started that way, they would end up with an erection they wanted me to take care of. My XH never even attempted to give me a freebie.
> 
> Maybe i just need to raise my standards.


Oh well, at least he is your ex, hoping that means you are free to find a more compatible lover.

My partner would give me NSA oral every day if given the chance. As it is I do get oral pretty much every day but it is me that wants more afterwards so it is a win/win.


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## doubletrouble (Apr 23, 2013)

Holland, that's the way I'd like it at our house. *sigh*


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## southbound (Oct 31, 2010)

Rowan said:


> Frankly, I'm trying to wrap my head around the concept that every sexual encounter must, or even should, include intercourse......


Same here. When I hear people act as though an encounter that doesn't involve intercourse isn't really sex, I guess I haven't had sex in my life as much as I thought.


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## Dogbert (Jan 10, 2015)

To me even the act of a long, lingering, tender kiss IS sex. Strangely though, in the past, the women I did that with actually wanted PIV when on some occasions that was not my intention. Go figure.


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## Holland (Aug 20, 2012)

A long, lingering kiss is foreplay for me, it makes me want to have sex. 

I'm going to blow a gasket if I don't get some soon.


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## Dogbert (Jan 10, 2015)

Yeah there's nothing like building sexual tension throughout the day with foreplay.


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## gluvst (Jan 26, 2014)

For myself, I'd be happy with anything at all but though my wife still says that she loves me, and in many ways, that is obvious if her actions and caring for me in every non sexual aspect of our marriage is an indicator. It's been over seven months since there was any intimate contact of any sort. The intimacy over the last few years before things finally shuddered to a complete halt were almost exclusively limited to her using her hands to help me masturbate to orgasm then she would call it a day and go to sleep. She was good at it but after a few years, even that began to grow old. We have had intercourse no more than twice in the last three years and she just lay there showing absolutely no incentive to really participate of help. Oral has always been out of the question with her and when she did go down on me ( which to me, like most men, is an incredible experience!! ), I always felt guilty after the minute or two of sucking when she would pull away with a disgusted look on her face as the mood was ruined. She was shaved for years - something which she knew I really liked and appreciated and about two years ago during a rare moment of touchy feely, I slid my hand under her panties and found a thick growth of bush. When I commented that she needed to shave, I was bluntly informed that she wasn't doing that any more citing body odor when she was hairless as her reason. ????? I've always loved going down on her and would often see to it that she had an orgasm and ask or expect nothing in return and allow her to cuddle up to me and fall asleep while I lay there as hard as a rock. But, love is give and take and I have always liked to give.

So, I've surrendered and resorted to exploring and considering other means of finding some relief now and as I stray further off the straight and narrow, there isn't even guilt any more about what I am considering. She is happy with no sex and that is how she seems to think it is with me, which is so far from the truth that it isn't funny. I have come to where I regard her lack of concern for my satisfaction as not just selfish and thoughtless, but also cruel, despite the fact that I know that she loves me and cares about me. But it is as if sex is just not a part of her make up and character any more. This from a woman who enjoyed partying with other couples ( soft swinging only ), porn of almost every type including bisexual and even some gay, and together exploring B&D and playful S&M. 

Yes, I know that some of you ladies ( especially) are gnashing your teeth as you read this, but what the heck else should I feel? I have never pushed myself on her and refuse to do so because I respect her and love her, but I'm tired of being left to my own devices. 

I have always had a very strong sex drive and our sex life was for many years, by mutual agreement, excellent and there was certainly no lack of experimentation and exploring. But too many years of "not tonight" have taken their toll and while I love her dearly and would never want any other woman, there is a festering resentment that seems to be building within me that is increased by erection and orgasm issues now from frustration and anxiety. I can only handle rejection for so long and I am well past that point, if you understand what I am saying. 

Women can be complicated and many men ( and even some women ) would agree they can be cruel and yet they are the most alluring creation on the planet. I love women, but I find myself considering other options that at one time, I would never have even thought about. 
I am puzzled as I have read through these forums a lot and not hardly ever posted at how so many women seem to think that just because their urges have faded that their husbands must be the same. I know other middle aged men who are experiencing the same problem and some have gone so far as to switch teams and none that I know of regret doing so. I'm not really sure yet about my doing this, but I have to confess that the curiosity has been within me for a long time and with no changes here in the bedroom, I am thinking that maybe finding another guy who has his life together and is looking for an exclusive no strings arrangement may be my best option. I'm going crazy with her cuddling up to me at night all lovey dovey like everything is perfect while I lay there wanting intimacy so badly. The problem is that as this goes on, I am finding myself wondering whether, if by some strange chance, she ever wanted to make love, if I could even get it up for her now. I seem to have lost something and now the feelings of anxiety simmer and grow each night it seems. 
We have discussed this total lack of intimacy and to her credit, she has finally started to see a counselor to try to work through some issues. I suggested an open marriage several times and the last time I asked, all she said when I suggested that I find one person to be with every once in awhile to get some release was, " I don't know how I'd feel about that". I am not looking for a new life partner or mate - just some release from these male needs that plague me. I'd be happy with even hand jobs again from her, but I can't see anything changing anytime soon or ever. It's like living with my sister...

I wonder how many other husbands, if they were to be totally honest, have ever considered crossing the line and seeking out another guy in the same situation as opposed to the otherwise good marriage being ended. I do personally know one guy who has done so with his wife's full approval and he says that he no longer pesters his wife for sex - there is no rejection and they get along better than they ever have. This wouldn't be my favored solution to this problem, but I am fresh out of ideas as to other options because I have NO desire to be intimate with any other woman, strange as that may sound. I know that a lot of you are going to hate me and feel disgust with what I have said, but that is your prerogative. You aren't where I am and until you have been there, please do not judge me harshly. I am open to suggestions - no flaming, please..


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## tommyr (May 25, 2014)

I would say maybe 1 in 5 sexual encounters with my wife does not ever reach PIV intercourse. We just have fun together with oral, toys, and the explosive combination of oral with toys. Or any random body parts rubbing together until satisfaction. Then we run out of time and energy, so the sex ends without intercourse. It's all good though.


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## Young at Heart (Jan 6, 2015)

gluvst said:


> ....It's been over seven months since there was any intimate contact of any sort.
> 
> ...When I commented that she needed to shave, I was bluntly informed that she wasn't doing that any more...
> 
> ...


Well I was in a sex starved marriage, so I understand some of what you are feeling, although I have no desire for experimentation with guys. Just not my thing.

My suggestion is that you AND your wife see a counselor as you both need help, if you want to save your marriage. Open marriage and getting a little on the side down low is not going to build a strong marriage.

It is clear that your wife has changed since her days of soft swinging and sexual exploration. Have you talked to her about what has changed? Have you asked her what she feels the ideal marriage looks like or includes? Telling her you want an open marriage is not a good way to encourage her to work on fixing what isn't working, in fact it may be a big part of what isn't working.

It sounds like she is emotionally checking out of the marriage, which is usually a "two person cause." That means you have been doing something that she finds hurtful or disrespectful, possibly even without knowing what you were doing. I did and was surprised to learn how badly I had emotionally hurt my wife by trying to be a better provider for her and our children. 

May I suggest you post your own thread to continue this discussion. Good luck to you.


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## Dogbert (Jan 10, 2015)

You might want consider curtailing a bit some of those other "emotional needs" you provide for her. Not as a punitive action but as wake up call that a marriage where one spouse receives more benefits than he/she provides is not going to be a marriage with a future.


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## Zouz (May 28, 2014)

doobie said:


> I've had plenty of guys expect to get a blowjob without intercourse - however, none of them have offered to go down on me without intercourse afterwards. It does seem to me that men will expect to get a blowjob as a "favour" from their partner but wouldn't dream of reciprocating when there's nothing in it for them. My LD husband and I haven't had sex for 6 months now and even though he knows it's put our marriage seriously at risk, there has been no offer to do anything for me. I've told him that I'm sexually frustrated on a daily basis, but he just says that he's lost his mojo and is hoping to get it back at some point. In the meantime I'm forced to be celibate.


doobie , when I hear about a man being sexually deprived I feel just sad .

When I hear about a lady being deprived sexually , I feel anguish and disgust ; The problem in LD creatures and my wife is one of them is that majority of them are so selfish that they will not even try to heal physically , nor give alternatives ; I have told my wife , I can understand if even she tired or not in the mood ;a touch , or HJ or anything can be fine with me ; just give a long french kiss and I will feel great !

LD is not the issue believe me , it is their selfish approach ; they will not even feel bad if you are hurt ; because they don't care except about themselves ;if they enjoy sex it sometimes and initiate it , it is just that they want themselves satisfied .

one night i must have been dreaming and must be a sexy dream ;if she only cared she could have left me enjoying the dream ; she would have just kissed me and touched me ; instead , I just woke up finding her shouting at me , are you crazy , go and do it in toilet !







I don't want to generalize , but


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## Zouz (May 28, 2014)

*When a spouse is here on TAM , from sexual deprivation ; it means only one thing :

The couple have reached the point of no return in their sex life ; it is up to the abused to bare for his children /family or throw the towel and be free.

I stayed for kids *


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

gluvst said:


> For myself, I'd be happy with anything at all but though my wife still says that she loves me, and in many ways, that is obvious if her actions and caring for me in every non sexual aspect of our marriage is an indicator. It's been over seven months since there was any intimate contact of any sort. The intimacy over the last few years before things finally shuddered to a complete halt were almost exclusively limited to her using her hands to help me masturbate to orgasm then she would call it a day and go to sleep. She was good at it but after a few years, even that began to grow old. We have had intercourse no more than twice in the last three years and she just lay there showing absolutely no incentive to really participate of help. Oral has always been out of the question with her and when she did go down on me ( which to me, like most men, is an incredible experience!! ), I always felt guilty after the minute or two of sucking when she would pull away with a disgusted look on her face as the mood was ruined. She was shaved for years - something which she knew I really liked and appreciated and about two years ago during a rare moment of touchy feely, I slid my hand under her panties and found a thick growth of bush. When I commented that she needed to shave, I was bluntly informed that she wasn't doing that any more citing body odor when she was hairless as her reason. ????? I've always loved going down on her and would often see to it that she had an orgasm and ask or expect nothing in return and allow her to cuddle up to me and fall asleep while I lay there as hard as a rock. But, love is give and take and I have always liked to give.
> 
> So, I've surrendered and resorted to exploring and considering other means of finding some relief now and as I stray further off the straight and narrow, there isn't even guilt any more about what I am considering. She is happy with no sex and that is how she seems to think it is with me, which is so far from the truth that it isn't funny. I have come to where I regard her lack of concern for my satisfaction as not just selfish and thoughtless, but also cruel, despite the fact that I know that she loves me and cares about me. But it is as if sex is just not a part of her make up and character any more. This from a woman who enjoyed partying with other couples ( soft swinging only ), porn of almost every type including bisexual and even some gay, and together exploring B&D and playful S&M.
> 
> ...


Gluvst, welcome to SIM.

You have a sexless marriage, you've discussed things with your wife, nothing has happened. Now you seem to think that having sex with another man, and not another woman, might be your salvation. I'm scratching my head because I'm not sure what exactly you want. Men don't "turn gay" in order to avoid the appearance of infidelity. If you think having sex with another man as opposed to another woman will not be infidelity, you're quite wrong. 

So why not be totally honest here? It's totally okay if you've always had fantasies of being with other men, just be honest about it. Now that you've reached a point of sexual desperation you're allowing your deeply hidden gay fantasies out.

But infidelity is infidelity no matter what sex you cheat with. So make up your mind. Is cheating okay or not?

As to your marriage, I would suggest you stop pretending with your wife. She cuddles up with you but you want full intimacy. That seems down right unpleasant and if I were in your shoes I would not be a cuddle bear with a partner who thought sex with me was distasteful. I doubt I would even sleep in the same bed. Stop sending mixed messages.

The imposed celibacy is not right, not normal, not healthy and not something anyone should bear with for the sake of marriage, kids, or assets.

IOW, stop being a pvssy and tell your wife you refuse to live like this. Make your demands known and clear. She either comes clean on why she refuses sex, so that it can be fixed, or you guys split up.


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## missymrs80 (Aug 5, 2012)

Dogbert said:


> Could you - or would - you do it?


I do it often. We TF or do oral of manual stim


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## chillymorn (Aug 11, 2010)

Dogbert said:


> Perhape I should have been more specific with my question.
> 
> If sexual intercourse was not an option, could you, would you be content with other options?


yes if do so in a loving caring I want to do the best I can to keep the sex alive as best we can approach.


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