# STBX: Friends or no?



## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Background: Seperated, can't divorce till next year thanks to OZ law, 1 child, STBX has new bf, I've been dating as well, reconciled as friends recently, etc etc.

Ok, I'm going to need some analysis, and opinions on whether continuing a friendship with my STBX is such a good idea considering her change in lifestyle. Only a few hours ago I had to drive down to the CBD with my daughter in the middle of the night to pick up my STBX who called me asking me to pick her up at darling harbour. Yeah, WTF right?

At first I wondered if her car broke down or something, then she said she didn't drive so I told her to catch public transport, as our daughter was asleep and I'm not leaving her home alone driving all the way down to Sydney just to pick her up. She insisted, told me she doesn't feel safe, been drinking, etc and all that and eventually told me to ask our daughter if she would like to come if I was so concerned about her, even reminded me we're supposed to be friends again. Pretty please and all that jazz too, pulling at my good graces.

Out of curioscity I asked her WTF she was doing all by herself and she said she was there with her friends, but excused herself and told them she would find her own way back home. Yeah, WTF right, it didn't add up as she was never this stupid or careless in the past, well actually yes she was, but not like this. Then she said she wasn't going to take a taxi considering it was going to cost over a hundred bucks.

Well whatever, I couldn't hear her clearly on the phone but I wasn't going to leave her there, nor was I going to leave my daughter home alone and she wanted to come anyway to pick up mum so off we went, daughter slept all the way, stopped in the middle of traffic to pick up STBX, and had an attempted conversation with her on the way back. 

She didn't tell me anything, said she doesn't want to talk about it, just thanked me for driving her home, and snoozed while I was trying to talk to her, rather rude, but whatever, I wasn't going to start an argument with our daughter sleeping at the back. When asked who she was with, she said I wouldn't know them - fair enough, we've both found new friends outside of our joint social circle since our seperation - we had to. 

I asked her why she called me and she said everyone else was asleep, that she didn't want to involve anyone else and that she knew I don't sleep so early, etc etc and other associated BS. I told her to call her boyfriend next time and she didn't respond, awkward silence after I mentioned it too. I don't know why she excused herself from her supposed friends but I definitely could smell the alcohol amidst her perfume.

Well anyway I told her not to make a habit of it, and she agreed, said it's a one off, and that she owes me one, dropped her off, she kissed our daughter good night and that she'll come pick her up for church in the morning and off I went back to my apartment with my daughter who was just as clueless as me with her cute WTF face. She got a little carsick though so we had a midnight snack before going back to bed.

I'm starting to regret being cool with her again if she's going to keep this up. She's not supposed to be my responsibility anymore correct? Quite frankly I still don't get WTF just happened last night, or how I was supposed to react

Thoughts? =/
Restless night last night thanks to her, might go back to bed after this coffee


----------



## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Over 100 views, and no replies, lemme guess; I'm thinking too much again? She's coming over in a few hours should I charge her for petrol at least? Or should I stop being an ass and just accept that hey, this is what it takes to rebuild a friendship?

What about her bf? Who she so claims that they are "just friends" even though she freely admitted to dating? Ah fk it, I'll shut up now


----------



## Shoto1984 (Apr 11, 2009)

Ding Ding Ding... Reply #1  Ok, so she's your X for a reason right? On one hand the reasons were enough to end the marriage and break up a family. On the other you will always have some level of contact with her for parenting issues. In my mind there should be no more then that. While you know each other well and thus there is a comfort level, a continued friendship will likely keep you both from moving on and inhibit the development of future relationships. My two cents....


----------



## norajane (Feb 7, 2012)

It's too soon to even think about being friends. Friends implies a true friendship. You don't have that. And it's not possible right now. 

At this point, focus on being cordial and civil, for the sake of your daughter. That's the BEST you can hope for under the circumstances.

As for what happened the other night, well, you should have told her to spend the $100 on a cab ride. She put herself in that position, so she needs to suck it up and fix it herself, too. That she thought nothing of the impact on your daughter of being woken up in the middle of the night to go pick up mom from a night of partying...


----------



## calvin (Jan 7, 2012)

My wife gave me that line a lot,we can always be friends,this was during her EA,she even met her old hs bf a few times,nothing happend.
Few pecks on the lips and quick hugs,she was nervous in a public place.
I did'nt want her as a friend,I wanted her as my wife.
That being said.What do you want?
I would'nt close any doors or burn any bridges,I would just stay cordial for now and see what happens down the road.
Give it time,few weeks or months.
Sounds like her bf may not be much of a bf or she would have called him to pick her up.
Buyers remorse on her part? Is she testing the waters to get back together with you?
Just keep your cool and be polite for awhile,no need to come to a decision right now.
You two will have to get along to some degree for your daughters sake.
Yeah man,I feel you are thinking too much,dont jump the gun.
Go with the flow,show now emotions,don'nt let her be able to read you.
You have time so dont sweat it for now,see how things go.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

It's great to keep an amicable relationship, especially for the sake of the child that will tie you together for the next however many years. But to drag the two of you out because she doesn't want to spend the $100 on a cab? Tough luck on that, sister.

C


----------



## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

Don't ever tell her when you are going on a date. That's exactly when she will have an emergency for you to deal with.

First and foremost, don't let her interfere with your current or future life. that means anything that could interfere with your work or other women, you need to keep her well away. Don't talk about your dates with her because then she will feel qualified to give you "advice" and usually the same advice, she's not goo enough for you, dump her. 

And don't let her become a teenager that you need to take care. It was very un adult of her to go out, get drunk and have no means to get home. You don't want her to expect you to be escape valve at (her) will.


----------



## calvin (Jan 7, 2012)

Friends discuss a lot of their problems together,seek advice from eachother,lean on eachother in rough times.
Friends have fun together.
Just be friendly twords her,you both do have a daughter together.
Take your time,you dont have to come to a decision right now.
Just keep your cool and think about it and get some more advice.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Ok, so she came over in the morning and rushed out with my daughter to church faster than I could question her, she didn't even come in when she dropped her back. So much for being nice after I did her a huge favor... guess she doesn't want me to interrogate her like what I tried last night. No fair. Bah!



Shoto1984 said:


> Ding Ding Ding... Reply #1  Ok, so she's your X for a reason right? On one hand the reasons were enough to end the marriage and break up a family. On the other you will always have some level of contact with her for parenting issues. In my mind there should be no more then that. While you know each other well and thus there is a comfort level, a continued friendship will likely keep you both from moving on and inhibit the development of future relationships. My two cents....


Yeah, been thinking on that as well, like we're cool now (sort of) - not so awkward when we inevitably have to see each other's ugly faces lol - and I'm questioning the whole idea of being friends with her again when we can be "cool" but doesn't mean we have to be friends.



norajane said:


> It's too soon to even think about being friends. Friends implies a true friendship. You don't have that. And it's not possible right now.
> 
> At this point, focus on being cordial and civil, for the sake of your daughter. That's the BEST you can hope for under the circumstances.
> 
> As for what happened the other night, well, you should have told her to spend the $100 on a cab ride. She put herself in that position, so she needs to suck it up and fix it herself, too. That she thought nothing of the impact on your daughter of being woken up in the middle of the night to go pick up mom from a night of partying...


Aye, I was quite disappointed in her. Our daughter shouldn't have to see that mum can't take care of herself even if this was a one off. So ok, so far, 2 points for no friends, 0 points for being friends.



calvin said:


> My wife gave me that line a lot,we can always be friends,this was during her EA,she even met her old hs bf a few times,nothing happend.
> Few pecks on the lips and quick hugs,she was nervous in a public place.
> I did'nt want her as a friend,I wanted her as my wife.
> That being said.What do you want?
> ...





> Friends discuss a lot of their problems together,seek advice from eachother,lean on eachother in rough times.
> Friends have fun together.
> Just be friendly twords her,you both do have a daughter together.
> Take your time,you dont have to come to a decision right now.
> Just keep your cool and think about it and get some more advice.


Well, personally I want is peace so there won't be dramas/grudges leading up to our divorce. I don't like having to see an enemy every bloody weekend to pick up my daughter lol, hence also why I wanted closure with her before so it wouldn't be so awkward.

It's impossible for us to get back together, we both know that, our dynamics are f--ked and no way we can fix it. That said though, I do still have lingering feelings, don't know about her considering she moved on 1 month after we called it quits.

Ok, 2 points for not being friends, 1 point for waiting, 0 points for being friends.



PBear said:


> It's great to keep an amicable relationship, especially for the sake of the child that will tie you together for the next however many years. But to drag the two of you out because she doesn't want to spend the $100 on a cab? Tough luck on that, sister.
> 
> C


So 3 points for not being friends? I agree with you; I also felt she went a little too far last night.



NextTimeAround said:


> Don't ever tell her when you are going on a date. That's exactly when she will have an emergency for you to deal with.
> 
> First and foremost, don't let her interfere with your current or future life. that means anything that could interfere with your work or other women, you need to keep her well away. Don't talk about your dates with her because then she will feel qualified to give you "advice" and usually the same advice, she's not goo enough for you, dump her.
> 
> And don't let her become a teenager that you need to take care. It was very un adult of her to go out, get drunk and have no means to get home. You don't want her to expect you to be escape valve at (her) will.


Well, she never intruded on my life during the weekdays which is when I go out on dates, I commit my weekends for my daughter. Annoying she picked this time to interfere! She doesn't ask about my dates and I think she's reached the point where she doesn't really care lol. As for her acting like a teenager, yeah, only way to tell her that she can't use me like this though is probably to cut ties for now. So 4 points for no friends.

Ok, majority rules... in addition to her rather unappreciative behaviour today. Alright fellas, I'm going to send her a message telling her that we're better off if we keep our distance from now on, that we're cool with each other and that's all we can expect, and that friendship is impossible at this point of time.

Thanks guys, lets see what happens!


----------



## tobio (Nov 30, 2010)

Out of interest RD, what time of night did she call you?

I understand why you went to get her. What I would advise is to have a strategy in place to deal with this should it happen again. Don't be taken by surprise if she springs something else on you - know how you will act and what you will say if she asks for such favours again.

It might be a short but to-the-point, "don't ask for such favours again because the answer will be no." You might phrase it more gently depending on how she is. Up to you. Then you've outlined your boundary and you all know where you stand.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## JCD (Sep 2, 2012)

You are kidding right?

She put the marriage in the situation where you HAD to leave..and she still wants all the benefits while still not having to give you sex.

Huh.

Got some slow learners in Oz, doncha?

Please note she is refusing to be accountable to you.

Here is a fair metric: if you ask for help like this again, you OWE me answering every question I have to ask on the subject...FIRST. And expenses.

If she refuses or promises 'later' call her a cab and drive away. Even if it is a big waste. She didn't want you anymore. Let the people she 'wants' do the heavy lifting.

This should ensure she never calls you again like this.


----------



## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

You should also keep track of this behavior should you find yourself battling any unfavorable changes in your visitation agreements.


----------



## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

Random


Chalk it up as your ex's head is still up her butt.

She owes you one for sure.

And if she cannot be honest with you then she is not ready to be your friend.

She needs church more than your kid does.

HM64


----------



## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

tobio said:


> Out of interest RD, what time of night did she call you?
> 
> I understand why you went to get her. What I would advise is to have a strategy in place to deal with this should it happen again. Don't be taken by surprise if she springs something else on you - know how you will act and what you will say if she asks for such favours again.
> 
> ...


It was almost midnight, by the time we got there it was past midnight, and by the time we got home it was near 2AM as I had to drive to the CBD, drive her back home which was on the other side of the freakin city, and then drive back. Poor daughter had to be dragged along all the way.

Well there might not be a next time, I've written a rather not-so-friendly SMS but I haven't sent it yet. I'll probably send it after I drop my daughter off to school tomorrow morning.



JCD said:


> You are kidding right?
> 
> She put the marriage in the situation where you HAD to leave..and she still wants all the benefits while still not having to give you sex.
> 
> ...


Aye, I'll keep this in mind. She probably wanted to maintain some sort of "good impression" on her new bf or something, then went out to get p-ssed, and then used me instead of him when she wanted to get home. But I dunno, it's guesswork since she's not being forthcoming about what happened and how she got herself stranded. I won't be this nice the second time.



NextTimeAround said:


> You should also keep track of this behavior should you find yourself battling any unfavorable changes in your visitation agreements.


I'm hoping we don't end up fighting again, but... guess may have to prepare for the worst. She's in her 30s now too, rather lame behaviour coming from her. She seems to be getting worse and worse.



happyman64 said:


> Random
> Chalk it up as your ex's head is still up her butt.
> She owes you one for sure.
> And if she cannot be honest with you then she is not ready to be your friend.
> ...


Aye, if anything I reckon she owes me at least a proper explanation eh? Oh well, too late now.


----------



## deejov (Sep 24, 2011)

You proved you are a decent man who would not leave a scared woman stranded. It's something you would probably do for a stranger, I'm betting. 

Don't stop being decent, but yes when she is ready, she does owe you an explanation, because if she is putting herself in dangerous situations, she needs to get her head out of her butt if she is a mother too. 

My only advice to you would be keep the personal stuff out of it. It's none of your business. But I would tell her.... if she is putting her safety at risk, she will have to account for that as your daughter could be affected. So ask her to give you reassurances that she is no longer going to put herself in dangerous situations.

Of course you care if she is safe. And you should.


----------



## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

I am? No I don't I am, besides I wouldn't do it for strangers because the next thing I know I'll have police in my doorstep the next day thanks to the woman I helped crying "assault" "abuse" "rape" and try to score money off me in court after beating herself up lol

NOT A CHANCE  No good deed goes unpunished in reality, especially here in Sydney! So I'm not a decent guy, STBX was just an exception heh - and if she ever does decide to tell me anything I'll try not to poke too much, as you're right - it's not my business. Still, she's left me in a WTF state and that's no fair especially when she's the mother of my child and has custody of my daughter most of the bloody week. 

Also, what if I was actually asleep? What would she have done then... hmmm, actually come to think of it I should have just silenced the phone and forced her to catch a cab. Serves her right for being so stupid. Ah well, I can't wait to send my not-so-friendly message! Avoiding me today, that was just rude!


----------



## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Ok guys, a small update, I sent the message, and while at work STBX left me 6 missed calls. I haven't responded yet, then sent me an SMS saying that we should talk about this and she can make time during the week. She doesn't seem to be mad then again I didn't hear her voice. Any further tips on how to approach this?

I'll be keeping what has been said so far to account, I should be ready correct?


----------



## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

RandomDude said:


> Ok guys, a small update, I sent the message, and while at work STBX left me 6 missed calls. I haven't responded yet, then sent me an SMS saying that we should talk about this and she can make time during the week. She doesn't seem to be mad then again I didn't hear her voice. Any further tips on how to approach this?
> 
> I'll be keeping what has been said so far to account, I should be ready correct?


Yes
Be ready and just listen.


----------



## Dad&Hubby (Aug 14, 2012)

It's interesting timing of WHEN she wants to be your friend, isn't it?

First you need to be an ex...before you can become friends who are exes. She's pulling you back in, that's all there is to it. It's a form of control. Why did she call you first? Not her current squeeze?


----------



## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

Oh man, you know you can't be friends with her. How are you going to feel the moment you meet her new man and he has that goofy grin on his face? You know the one I'm talking about. You know how she is. That dude going to be smiling from ear to ear for the first 2 years and you'll know exactly what that's all about. And HOW is that going to feel? Ya, it's going to suck knowing what you gave up.


----------



## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Well, if I didn't send her that letter we would still be at odds with each other. It was me who wanted to sort things out after 3 months of relative silence and avoiding each other as much as we could despite our daughter, but I didn't expect her to ask such a favor.

The problem is that we still have to co-exist, our daughter is still very young and going to be part of both our lives for some time and it's not like I can just cut contact unless one of us goes for sole custody but that will just hurt our daughter and I doubt she would go down without a fight if it comes to that.

I've already agreed to meet her for lunch today though, see what she has to say. I won't tolerate anymore rude behaviour from her as she made me feel used and if anything she should apologise for avoiding talking to me the next day after I just did her a big favor. But we'll see how it goes, and as for the OM...

Well if he comes up to me with that grin on his face I'll be happy to wipe it off his face and shove it up his ass. Besides, I'm kinda itching for a fight... it's been a while. I doubt STBX would allow the two of us to meet for that reason unless she wants to see someone get pounded lol. She's seen me lose control and pound people before in the early years of our marriage which led me to a few court cases but nowadays I'm more restraint... I just grapple and humiliate instead lol


----------



## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Ok guys... update =/

I had lunch with her and well, I dunno. At first she tried to scold me for making a big fuss ("As you always do" she says -.- ) over it, I asked her what does she expect after asking such a favor from me followed by her rude avoiding behaviour on Sunday and not to mention her lack of disclosure about WTF happened on Saturday, and that she has to learn responsibility for her actions. She didn't take that very well. In the end we had to calm ourselves down, drop it for a few minutes lest we couldn't even sit together for lunch.

And well, she did calm and so did I, and we had a little chat. She said that she was invited to the harbor on Saturday for dinner and just wanted to let off steam but her friends wanted to take her out instead so she went along but didn't feel comfortable in the end so she left them. I asked her if she was having a mid-life crisis which put a smile back on her face. I told her that she can't rely on me anymore and she has someone else anyway and should have called him instead of dragging both me and our daughter out to pick her up past midnight.

She told me that the only reason she told me about the OM was because she felt I deserved to know and that she wanted to be straight forward and honest with me, and insists that they aren't a couple. She says she's not ready for anything and only went out because I told her to ****** off and he made the move to ask her out not her. She says they are just friends and not even close friends hence she didn't want to call him.

She also mentioned that she regrets calling me now because of all this mess, and should have called a cab instead. I told her that she should have, and that she has to be more accountable. However, I tried not to be so mean, I told her that I understood how she found herself alone in Sydney, and that I was only p-ssed off because she didn't talk to me and tried to avoid me the next day.

She said she didn't want to come in or talk to me because she was embarrassed over the whole situation and didn't want to bother me with her personal life. I sighed, but she asked me if we're cool, and I said fine - but she still owes me. She smiled at least... and well, we left on a mostly positive note. She said that she was hoping now that we're cool we go out as a family because our daughter bugs her every week. I told her that may not be a good idea but I'll think about it. She reminded me that whatever is between us shouldn't come in between our responsibilities as parents because she's the innocent one here.

I was about to say "You should have thought of that instead of fking forcing me to drag her along in the middle of the night to pick you up!" BUT... I bit my tongue >.< But yeah, oh well... so, guess the heat has died down. I dunno though, what you guys make of this? Is she trying to pull me back in as a form of control as you mentioned - using my daughter even? Or is she genuine about being friends?

So much for the OM really, I don't know if she's fking him or not... it's easier to believe that she is so I can shut my mind off her. Hell I dunno


----------



## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

Keep in mind that you can be friends and friendly without being "bff's" that you can call in the middle of the night to help bury a body. She could have called any of her other friends. But she chose to impose on you. Her issue wasn't critical. 

Your STBXW has always had issues with trying to control you. In your marriage, it was through sex and emotions. Now she doesn't have those same hooks, so she seems to be looking for more ways.i think developing some boundaries might be good for both of you, and maybe you can get to beng friends someday. Unless of course, you look at her relationships with her other close friends and see that this is just the way she is..

C


----------



## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

I think you both need time to work on being friends.

Your exw still has some growing up to do which is pathetic at her age.

But she is right about one thing.

You should spend time as a family. It will suck but once you separate your personal lives you will get used to the new normal.


----------



## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Alright, sounds fair I guess, I'm not sure if she'll try to pull something like this again, though, if anything she's still got a hook; my daughter. But I'm very aware of how manipulative she can be, and hell I'm also not so sure about us taking out our daughter as a family, despite the fact our daughter been bugging us both for months now. 

I need my space to move on as well. My sexual attraction to her hasn't really faded either but it's only physical and probably mostly due to having become so familiar with her body over the years, I don't want to get involved with her again knowing what it leads to. Actually come to think of it, the more I think about it, the more I reckon maybe I shouldn't have sent the letter, maybe we would still be both better off not talking to each other.

Hell now that I think about it, I reckon I'm going to avoid her as much as possible, but at least we're cool, and thanks to this debacle maybe she's got it into her head not to try to use me.



happyman64 said:


> I think you both need time to work on being friends. Your exw still has some growing up to do which is pathetic at her age. *But she is right about one thing. You should spend time as a family.* It will suck but once you separate your personal lives you will get used to the new normal.


Really? :scratchhead:

Damn it >.<
And here I was ready to tip toe away from it lol

*sigh* You really think it's a good idea?


----------



## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

Random Dude...I feel you did the right thing - this 1st time ...when she called... shows you are a decent man, care about the mother of your child...even if she did a careless thing....

But as others so clearly laid out on this thread.... let her know you was disappointed in her and you won't be there the next time when she puts herself in a bind- she can call that cab ...you are no longer her husband, it's NOT your responsibility anymore...

Sounds you talked all of this through and are on a good note - for now.

The whole "remaining friends" thing... you will need specific boundaries here with ex's....or she may feel she can lean on you too much..this would be taking advantage of you. 

Figure out your personal boundaries with her, that you will not cross....talk to her about it.. so there is no* surprises* or *Expectations* in the future with her....or slipping back into feelings with her.. Friendship can do that too - without proper boundaries in place. 

Here are some points I found on the net (written for the woman though -but works both ways ) ...

Six Rules For Being Friends With An Ex



> *1.* *Mourning period:* Give each other time to mourn the death of the relationship. The longer you two were together, the longer it will probably take before you are ready for friendship. It could be two months or two years — feel it out. You’ll know when the time is right because both of you will feel ready for it. Let hearts heal and flames fizzle out before hopping on the friendship train.
> 
> *2.** Keep it platonic*: No sex, no kissing, no hand-holding, no flirting, no monkey business. At any time. Ever. Even after nights of heavy drinking.
> 
> ...


----------



## EnjoliWoman (Jul 2, 2012)

Rude and thoughtless of her to make her daughter get up late after already being asleep. You cannot be her safety net. It was immature and inconsiderate.


----------



## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

That's very insightful, thanks SA. No surprises, no expectations, that's a good rule. I guess we'll have to discuss this the next time, I wonder though if it's truly advisable to take my daughter out with her at this point of time.

Those 6 rules... hmmm


> 1. Mourning period


Well, we've been together 7 years, seperation since early this year, but true seperation only last 3-4 months. I don't know about her but she seems checked out enough, and so am I. There are still tinie whinie lingering feelings on my part, but for the most part I'm out... wonder if that's still a danger though.



> 2. Keep it platonic


Aye! Must remember not to get drunk with her! But I don't think we will anyway, considering how damaged our relationship already is and already we're struggling to hold onto what is left. As the saying goes; don't bet anything you're not prepared to lose correct? Heh



> 3. Set clear emotional boundaries


Aye, thankfully she hasn't confided in me nor me her with our personal life. We'll keep our distance with this, besides I think it would be too awkward at this point of time to talk about anyway. I guess in addition we have to set personal boundaries to prevent surprises/expectations as you suggested.



> 4. Seek out a love life


Well, looks like we both have that covered heh



> 5. No relationship analysis


Good thing to remember.



> 6. More than friendly feelings


Thankfully nothing has been expressed to each other at such a possibility, so I guess we're safe.

Ok... maybe a friendship is possible after all, after some boundaries are set. Still don't know about going out as a family but meh, we'll see how it goes. Thanks everyone for your support.

@Enjoli



EnjoliWoman said:


> Rude and thoughtless of her to make her daughter get up late after already being asleep. You cannot be her safety net. It was immature and inconsiderate.


Oh yeah! You have no idea how hard I had to bite my tongue when she tried to lecture me about our "responsibility as parents" lol

Mirror mirror on the wall, who's the biggest hypocrite of them all? Damn, restraint's a b-tch lol... oh hell imagine if I said THAT to her in response! ACK, now that you mention it, I regret not saying that, there would be steam, fire and brimstone but it would have been priceless!


----------



## southbound (Oct 31, 2010)

Shoto1984 said:


> Ding Ding Ding... Reply #1  Ok, so she's your X for a reason right? On one hand the reasons were enough to end the marriage and break up a family. On the other you will always have some level of contact with her for parenting issues. In my mind there should be no more then that. While you know each other well and thus there is a comfort level, a continued friendship will likely keep you both from moving on and inhibit the development of future relationships. My two cents....


I agree. I've never really understood the concept of getting divorced, yet remaining big buddies. 

Unfortunately, when kids are involved, there will be some form of contact for business, so it is best to be civil, but friends, not me.

My x wife divorced me a coupe of years ago because she wasn't happy. To be honest, we probably have one of the most civil divorces I know of. We had a few exchanges early on, but since, we just do what needs to be done and no drama.

Once we were parted, I didn't go back to mow lawns, fix leaky faucets, and all that. She had that when i was there, but it apparently wasn't good enough. I would think it would make it very difficult to move on if you remained friends, especially for the one who didn't want the divorce.


----------



## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

^ Hmmm, good thing for us then that we both want the divorce, we've dealt with our issues for years going in circles and even reconciliation putting our hearts into it still didn't work.


----------



## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

Those 6 rules are good for any OSF, not just one with whom you used to have sex with. Since it's the OSF that is the trajectory for many sexual relationships anyway.


----------



## JCD (Sep 2, 2012)

It's funny...my parents were divorced. They never EVER did anything together again except attend weddings or graduations.

And frankly, I think that was smart.

What your daughter wants is the assurance that absolutely nothing has changed in her life and that if she just puts mommy and daddy next to each other again...POOF...instant family!

That sets an unreasonable burden on you and your spouse (Yeah...mother of the year there...) and sets false expectations within your daughter.

This isn't the full truth...it's just something to throw into the mix of how you want to weigh things.


----------



## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Quite frankly I was hoping our daughter would drop it after a while, and I thought she would considering she got used to her new routine with co-parenting rather well considering the circumstances. I still remember the early days of seperation though, she cried everytime she had to leave either of us. But I guess, even if she got used to the splits, she still really misses being in a family. Oh well, I'm still considering it, but I'll make a decision later.


----------



## Nucking Futs (Apr 8, 2013)

You should not be doing things as a family. You're not a family. You're two families with one shared member.

If you start doing things as a family you're daughter is going to get her hopes up, and that's cruel. The only times you should do things together are things like school events, award ceremonies, that kind of thing. Even those you have no need to sit together.


----------



## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Well guess I can always just try to wait it out and hopefully she'll drop it in a few more months


----------



## hookares (Dec 7, 2011)

"Over 100 views, and no replies, lemme guess; I'm thinking too much again? She's coming over in a few hours should I charge her for petrol at least? Or should I stop being an ass and just accept that hey, this is what it takes to rebuild a friendship?"

Are you kidding?? Sharing custody of your child with your cheating ex wife in no way obligates you to be her "friend". At best you should only be "acquaintances". After my split, I dumped all my "friends" starting with my ex cheater. Had her kids been "ours", it still wouldn't have obligated me to be her chauffeur.


----------



## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

=/ 

She never cheated, she only started dating the OM 1 month after we were seperated


----------



## Nucking Futs (Apr 8, 2013)

RandomDude said:


> =/
> 
> She never cheated, she only started dating the OM 1 month after we were seperated


WTF, she ignored your ****ing safe word and you're defending her? Yeah, she never cheated on you, and what's a little torture between friends?


----------



## el_mario (May 22, 2013)

U used WTF a lot. Shows in a way that u care. The best thing you can do is never to show emotions. Either accept or deny assisting her. Your desire to know who she was with or who she should call also shows her that she is in control of you, especially when she doesn't care to provide you that information. Sounds like she was constantly in control of your prior relationship. If you are going to have any control in your "friendship" keep your desires in check.


----------



## el_mario (May 22, 2013)

My last reply was to your initial post. PS: She avoided u the following night because u keep pressuring her. If you constantly put her in the corner she will always keep her distance. It is so much better if you let her open up to you. Women are like cats, you can't force them to do anything. You just have to accept when they open up to you, and if they don't, don't push them.


----------



## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

STBX maybe many things, but she wasn't a cheater. Not defending her flaws at all - just setting the record straight. 

@El Mario

Most of the time I don't even care about her, I simply wanted to know what got into the mother of my child with her behaviour, she showed great lack of accountability and that's worrisome as an example to my daughter regardless of whether I care or not. In addition I only wanted to know why she didn't call her bf instead of me, as quite frankly I don't care what she does on that part of her life.


----------



## Nucking Futs (Apr 8, 2013)

RandomDude said:


> STBX maybe many things, but she wasn't a cheater. Not defending her flaws at all - just setting the record straight.
> 
> @El Mario
> 
> Most of the time I don't even care about her, I simply wanted to know what got into the mother of my child with her behaviour, she showed great lack of accountability and that's worrisome as an example to my daughter regardless of whether I care or not. In addition I only wanted to know why she didn't call her bf instead of me, as quite frankly I don't care what she does on that part of her life.


Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't her lack of accountability on full display after she tortured you? Wasn't it her opinion that it wasn't wrong for her to continue after you called stop with your safe word, it was your problem for whining about it?


----------



## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

She tortured me way back in the earlier days of our relationship, but was repentant throughout the years. I still banned cuffs and restraints however no matter how hard she tried to earn my trust back. It was the only way and only time she broke me and she did seem to regret it.

The incident on February this year didn't result in any torture, and she felt I made a big deal of it as she let me go eventually after I yelled at her and went on about how after all these years I still didn't trust her. She ignored my safewords to set me free at first and argued with me as she claimed she wanted me to trust her and wanted to prove it. She felt that I ruined the whole night by being a "wimp" (a comment which she took back later) when she didn't do anything. When I mentioned that our hopes for reconciliation after V-day were slim she said she's had enough of my "BS" too and we split.

We've both done our damage to each other as well, she's not the evil-one so to speak. I'm responsible for tearing her away from her faith as well as breaking her down mentally and emotionally, her esteem suffered a huge blow thanks to me, I've tried to repair it in the later years of my marriage but the damage was already done and too late. We've both reduced each other to our knees at least once. We both have our demons.

So hey, I can't hate her. I've got my revenge even if it was unintended. We were just toxic... oh well, past is past


----------



## dymo (Jan 2, 2012)

RandomDude said:


> She tortured me way back in the earlier days of our relationship, but was repentant throughout the years. I still banned cuffs and restraints however no matter how hard she tried to earn my trust back. It was the only way and only time she broke me and she did seem to regret it.
> 
> The incident on February this year didn't result in any torture, and she felt I made a big deal of it as she let me go eventually after I yelled at her and went on about how after all these years I still didn't trust her. She ignored my safewords to set me free at first and argued with me as she claimed she wanted me to trust her and wanted to prove it. She felt that I ruined the whole night by being a "wimp" (a comment which she took back later) when she didn't do anything. When I mentioned that our hopes for reconciliation after V-day were slim she said she's had enough of my "BS" too and we split.


Thanks for clarifying. With the muddled way you've talked about it in previous posts, I think most people (including me) came away with the impression she tortured you on Valentines day even after you used safewords.


----------



## LostViking (Mar 26, 2013)

WTF?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Nucking Futs (Apr 8, 2013)

dymo said:


> Thanks for clarifying. With the muddled way you've talked about it in previous posts, I think most people (including me) came away with the impression she tortured you on Valentines day even after you used safewords.


That's what I thought too.


----------



## JCD (Sep 2, 2012)

Nucking Futs said:


> That's what I thought too.


Hmm...'you need to trust me enough to ALLOW me to be able to torture you...but I promise I won't. And you should trust me since I am ignoring the safe words that we already agreed to. Because I love you and want you to love me enough to trust me not to torture you but to suffer through the mental anguish and flashbacks.'

Not sure of her side of the issue, but whatever you did to her, did it involve physical and mental anguish and suffering? Guilt is painful because it should be.

Oh...and for the record: put me down on the 'No' to friends with her. She is still not trustworthy.

If she wanted to foster trust, she would have let you go the moment you used the safeword on V day. Then after a talk, you might allow her to do it again. She didn't. She wants 'trust' i.e. picking her up, allowing her to tie you up etc...but doesn't want to pay the reciprocal price tag.


----------



## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Not physical no, but I have made her insecure through alot of my flaws in the past. 

- She sacrificed her future within her church community for me as I was not of her faith, but did so without regrets. I sacrificed my fellowship with a nationalist group who although weren't racist, they were not in support of my marriage with my STBX, as she's of a rival race to our people. That led to alot of problems as unlike her, I had my regrets. They loved my daughter though, and didn't judge STBX, they judged me and my decision alone.

- Breaking her down due to her evangelism; as although she had no regrets marrying me she wanted me to change for her, become "saved" so to speak, which led to alot of religious issues until I put the foot down on it. My faith was never hostile or intolerant but when faced with her intolerance I replied in kind, breaking her in the process and to this day her faith has dwindled. She was never an intolerant christian until later, I don't blame her, I blame that specific church/cult she was involved in.

- Embarrassment of my STBX as not only was she not of my race, we kinda stand out in public as couples like us are rare in this country. I hate spotlights, and hence I restrained from public affection which made her feel that I was embarrassed of her, which I was.

- Rejection of her sexually, she had an extravagant drive since we got married, where as I frankly couldn't keep up. I wanted to "be a man" however and put it up with it for years until I tried to establish boundaries but these boundaries well... after plenty of fights which never ended she ended up feeling rejected, unloved, unwanted, etc etc especially when sex seems to be the main love language she understands.

- I have been guilty of fun-flirting with other women, leading her to alot of insecurity along with the rest of above. I also cheated (at least I think I did and everyone thinks I did) on her once with a drunken ONS which I can't remember, this was years before marriage.

- Lack of emotional vulnerability on my part and inability for her to confide in me due to my hardness. She tells me she loves me, and in the past I tell her "I love me too", but when I do say it I really mean it. But it wasn't enough for her.

All of that together and well, it led her to quite some frustration and loss of esteem. I tried to help repair it but I guess I made the mistake of trying to fix everything at once especially when it's already too late. I tried to be a confider but I've failed to be an effective listener at times.

As for trust, its a difficult issue, in some ways I trust her, but in others I would be a fool to trust. Hell I don't know how to explain it; like there are certain things I have relied on her to do in the past and she has never faltered, she does put alot of effort in maintaining her integrity and moral high ground. For instance she has never proven unfaithful despite me wasting quite some money on PIs in the past suspecting her without any red flags only due to her high sex drive. She is also non-materialistic which she never fails to prove either, she even signed a post-nup during our seperation without any argument. So she's generally a decent human being, not someone I could hate.

However, she has demons, her main one is sex. She can be demanding and spiteful especially when rejected. She had alot of pride issues in the past which unfortunately I broke down with what I did above and made her rather needy. Also despite her moral high ground she at times has no quarms with using it to manipulate me, cornering me while keeping all her bases covered - she's extremely intelligent when it comes to that and making people bend to her will. Last few years though, guess I broke most of that. So hey, she has her demons.

I don't know really about this whole friends thing to be honest, at the moment I haven't said much to her since our lunch and she hasn't contacted me. We used to SMS/chat everyday until 3-4 months ago. Maybe we can be friends as in "cool with each other" just not close friends anymore.


----------

