# I do bad things and want to stop



## Michelle C (Aug 15, 2012)

Ok not sure how this will be recieved but i could do with some honest feed back. I suspect it may be painful, but as i dont know anybody on here i hope i can get some honest opinions that i can work with to start helping myself. :-(

Since I was 14 I have only really been interested in other peoples partners. My parents had affairs when I was growing up and shortly before I graduated from uni they informed me that they were going to divorce. I wasn't surprised really, in fact I didn't feel anything when they told me, no sorrow nothing.

I'm not sure if this has affected me in some way but ever since then I am only really excited or attracted to other women's men. This sounds horrible and I suppose it is really? I just can't help myself though. I have had boyfriends of my own but to be totally *honest, I find them boring and predictable. I can't really explain the feeling I get from identifying a guy and setting out to get him. I think I get really high on endorphins or something as I'm in a complete daydream whilst the whole thing is being played out. The downside comes shortly after I achieve my goal. The thing is once I get the guy, I rapidly feel different and have to break it off. The way I see it is that I'm single so I'm not really doing anything wrong. It's the unfaithfull boyfriends or husbands that are the ones who are guilty.*

I know this sounds awful but it's the only way that I can square things in my head. After every occasion with a new man I go through a bit of a guilt trip and try and make a conscious decision not to let it happen again. Then I meet another guy usually through work, and it starts again.

I realise that this behaviour hurts people and ideally I'd like to stop. I've done it for so long now though *(I'm early 30s) that I'm afraid it's too late for me and I'm destined to be a "home wrecker" for the rest of my life. *I suppose I'm also a selfish person in other ways. Being an only child I have always known how to play my parents off against each other to get what I want. I still feel that way now as an adult. I can quite easily manipulate people to get what I want (ok admittedly mostly men ;-). I have about 3 close female friends although we don't see each other that often these days. None of them know what I get up to in my love life as im naturally a very secretive and private person and I think they would disown me if they knew what I was really like. The truth is prefer men's company more than women's, again I suspect this is due to the attention that I get and the fact that most men dont want to share feelings or get into my head.

I can't talk to other women about this and I don't know how to get out of the destructive cycle that I am in. I suppose I want to find out if anybody else has had this problem and what they did to get themselves out of it.

I'm not a bad person (honestly), I just do some bad things and I would like to stop. I just don't know how 

Ps I don't always sleep with the men, sometimes I just need them to tell me they love me or want to be with me more than their partner.


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## MAKINGSENSEOFIT2 (Aug 6, 2012)

You need to get yourself into counseling. Your problems are in your head and you need a Professional to help you.


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## southern wife (Jul 22, 2011)

Yes, counseling is a great start.

Did your parents show love to you? Or were you neglected while they were out having affairs?


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## Michelle C (Aug 15, 2012)

MAKINGSENSEOFIT2 said:


> You need to get yourself into counseling. Your problems are in your head and you need a Professional to help you.



Thanks for your comment. I've tried a therapist, but I couldn't bring myself to tell them the full story. I suppose I felt ashamed


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## Gaia (Apr 27, 2012)

First... counseling. Secondly... it sounds like you have a strong desire to compete and feel like your... "better" then the wives or girlfriends. You really do need to recognize that you are at fault as well... probably moreso for actively engageing and trying to seduce men away from their spouse. Be glad you realize this is a problem... and it is very dangerous behavior because one day you may just try to compete against a female who might have it in her head to eliminate any and all competition at all costs. Meaning some women will either beat the snot out of you or.... snap and try to kill you. It does happen... so.. like I said... counseling for yourself.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Gaia (Apr 27, 2012)

Don't be afraid to let it all out. You need to in order for the counselor to help you.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## southern wife (Jul 22, 2011)

Michelle C said:


> Thanks for your comment. I've tried a therapist, but I couldn't bring myself to tell them the full story. I suppose I felt ashamed


If you didn't feel comfortable with that therapist, find one that you do feel comfortable talking to.


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## KathyBatesel (Apr 26, 2012)

I know you think you want to stop, but your post shows otherwise:

1. You believe you "can't help yourself" from behaving this way.
2. You are in denial about your behavior. "It's the bad boyfriend's fault, not mine. I'm single!" (Never mind that being single doesn't give a person permission to be manipulative and hurtful to others. This justification is complete bullsh*t from the very beginning.)
3. "I realize this hurts other people and ideally, I'd like to stop..." followed by a "BUT that contradicts that entire statement. And the "ideally" part also speaks volumes. 

The bottom line is you only feel good about you when you can crush someone else. It's not about the guy, it's about feeling powerful by beating down another woman. 

If I really thought you wanted to stop, I'd tell you to see a counselor, because there really are deep psychological issues present when a person only feels good about themselves by harming others, but I don't think you'd listen to that. The real reason you didn't tell your therapist is because you don't want to stop, not because of shame. You let plenty of guys see the "real" you.

I know I sound very confrontational. You aren't going to stop without facing a serious dose of reality. If you truly want to stop, you'll see the truth in what I've said, I think. If you don't, you're welcome to ignore this post. My intention is to anger you, just a little, so you'll think about how you respond and how absurd your own reasoning sounds when you repeat it often enough.


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## lisab0105 (Oct 26, 2011)

You get off on the high knowing that these men would risk everything just to be with you...it makes you feel special and sexy. 

And when you ask them if they regret being with you and they say no...that gives you an even bigger high. 

Just because you have a void in your life doesn't mean that the women that these men are betraying have to pay for it. Fix yourself and get a man of your own. 

Flattery and orgasms are not worth the pain of cheating!


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## lifeisnotsogood (Jun 11, 2012)

Hey, don't worry about it. Someday you'll be married and in a perfect relationship. Then Karma will rear its ugly head and it will happen to you. You will be devastated and will wish you had never caused anyone that much pain. So until that day, have a blast.


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## Michelle C (Aug 15, 2012)

southern wife said:


> Yes, counseling is a great start.
> 
> Did your parents show love to you? Or were you neglected while they were out having affairs?



I have a love hate relationship with my mum. During my childhood I remember her telling me that my dad was wicked and was having an affair with his secretary in work and wanted to leave us both. I remember one christmas day my dad crying and pleading with her to get out of bed and share Christmas with me. She didn't and told him to go and spend Christmas with his secretary instead. That was a horrible day! My dad played cricket a lot and used to take me to his matches. My mum never really bothered taking me anywhere and I always put it down to her feeling bad about what my dad was doing. It wasn't unil 2 years later hat I discovered it was actually my mum that had the first affairs, my dad eventually told me that he started seeing this woman in work because my mum was not interested in him anymore and had hurt him by sleeping with an ex neighbour and some bloke she met in the health club. I think my mum has suffered with depression and she can be very nasty to me without any reason.i suppose I started to learn how to get what I wanted around this time. My parents are fairly well off and I used to get lots of nice presents from dad and money off mum. My mum is always critical of how I look and is always telling me how to dress and what to do with my hair etc. she has even on inched me to get a Brazilian wax every month because she read in a magazine thats what all the men want these days !


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

why don't you read the awful and painful stories in CWI and see how destroyed betrayed spouses get?- it takes 2-5 years to heal from infidelity as a betrayed spouse. You've been ignoring the consequences of your actions and the devastation it creates. You really have no idea whatsoever, you can say you get that but in reality you live in the lala fantasyland of whirlwind romance and exciting secret affairs. You don't ever get the bad with the good, it's incredibly selfish to steal what you are taking from other women.


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## southern wife (Jul 22, 2011)

Ugggghhhhhh I'm sorry to say this, but they are very toxic for you. I would recommend that you limit your time with them. When Mum starts in on you about how to look, dress, wax, etc., just tell her that you like the way you look and you have to go. Evenually, hopefully, she'll get the message.


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## southern wife (Jul 22, 2011)

Almostrecovered said:


> why don't you read the awful and painful stories in CWI and see how destroyed betrayed spouses get?- it takes 2-5 years to heal from infidelity as a betrayed spouse. You've been ignoring the consequences of your actions and the devastation it creates. You really have no idea whatsoever, you can say you get that but in reality you live in the lala fantasyland of whirlwind romance and exciting secret affairs. You don't ever get the bad with the good, it's incredibly selfish to steal what you are taking from other women.


:iagree:


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## dblkman (Jul 14, 2010)

Almostrecovered said:


> why don't you read the awful and painful stories in CWI and see how destroyed betrayed spouses get?- it takes 2-5 years to heal from infidelity as a betrayed spouse. You've been ignoring the consequences of your actions and the devastation it creates. You really have no idea whatsoever, you can say you get that but in reality you live in the lala fantasyland of whirlwind romance and exciting secret affairs. You don't ever get the bad with the good, it's incredibly selfish to steal what you are taking from other women.


Unfortunately women like Michele don't consider the consequences of her actions. Selfish people only consider what is best for them and not the women/men they are hurting or even the children that could be involved. The only consolation is she isn't married so no other man is being hurt.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

At your age, you are too old for this game. You know better. 

My guess: you have low self-esteem and are very insecure which is why you are turned on (not off) by other peoples' partners and don't feel you deserve a relationship of your own. Maybe you have a histrionic personality and are self-destructive which is why you do this over and over again.

You already know what to do and what not to do. The question is, will you do anything about it? 

I don't have a lot of pity for someone your age doing what you do. You're a big girl and should make better decisions.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Michelle C said:


> Thanks for your comment. I've tried a therapist, but I couldn't bring myself to tell them the full story. I suppose I felt ashamed


Then you didn't actually do therapy. Until you can own your actions, you will continue living in all this misery.

Oh and while you may have a bad relationship with mom and dad, they are NOT responsible for your actions. You are.


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## jane1213 (Aug 10, 2012)

Oh darling! you probably suffer from love addiction. Please google it if you dont know what it is . If you are neglected as a child, you probably feel this need to be loved by men in your adult life. It is really bad for you because you wont' be able to find the one and settle down with him and start a life.


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## Gaia (Apr 27, 2012)

I disagree jane. If it were love addiction as you call it.... it wouldn't be just limited to taken men. She would be after and turned on by single men as well... but she isn't.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## KathyBatesel (Apr 26, 2012)

Michelle C said:


> I have a love hate relationship with my mum. During my childhood I remember her telling me that my dad was wicked and was having an affair with his secretary in work and wanted to leave us both. I remember one christmas day my dad crying and pleading with her to get out of bed and share Christmas with me. She didn't and told him to go and spend Christmas with his secretary instead. That was a horrible day! My dad played cricket a lot and used to take me to his matches. My mum never really bothered taking me anywhere and I always put it down to her feeling bad about what my dad was doing. It wasn't unil 2 years later hat I discovered it was actually my mum that had the first affairs, my dad eventually told me that he started seeing this woman in work because my mum was not interested in him anymore and had hurt him by sleeping with an ex neighbour and some bloke she met in the health club. I think my mum has suffered with depression and she can be very nasty to me without any reason.i suppose I started to learn how to get what I wanted around this time. My parents are fairly well off and I used to get lots of nice presents from dad and money off mum. My mum is always critical of how I look and is always telling me how to dress and what to do with my hair etc. she has even on inched me to get a Brazilian wax every month because she read in a magazine thats what all the men want these days !


The way I am reading this, I think this is what is going on:

1. You see mom as weak. She couldn't hold her man. 
2. You think you have to "prove" yourself by being stronger than her and not being vulnerable. You can do both by stealing another woman's man and then not letting him get close enough to you that you'd ever find yourself in your mother's shoes. 
3. You also see your dad as weak, but you excuse him for his weakness because you have more fondness for him. This allows you to do what you're doing, because if you used the same kind of judgment on him that you've used on your mother, you'd have to cut men out of your life, too, which would leave you with nothing. 
4. The truth is, you are letting that history control you, which means you're not being strong at all. You're letting your parents' dysfunction run your life.


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

What mean comment? Pointing out how horrific this behavior is may help her understand better what she is a really doing. Are you actually saying she isn't responsible for her action because she may be a love addict?


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

jane1213 said:


> Oh darling! you probably suffer from love addiction. Please google it if you dont know what it is . If you are neglected as a child, you probably feel this need to be loved by men in your adult life. It is really bad for you because you wont' be able to find the one and settle down with him and start a life. *Ignore the mean comment above*. you will be OK.


I'd hardly call my comment "mean." The truth hurts to hear.

Also, this isn't "love addiction." Love addiction is when you chase the high that a new relationship brings. This is an entirely different issue. Her issue is that she keeps paticipating in betrayals and affairs.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Almostrecovered said:


> What mean comment? Pointing out how horrific this behavior is may help her understand better what she is a really doing. Are you actually saying she isn't responsible for her action because she may be a love addict?


It sure sounds that way. :iagree:


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## KathyBatesel (Apr 26, 2012)

Oh, I have no doubt it's an addiction, but that doesn't excuse anyone from taking responsibility for their actions.


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## dwaynewilliams (Feb 1, 2010)

Try therapy again. Maybe with someone else. I'm not going to analyze too much what you posted. I'm sure it isn't easy exposing yourself like that to others. But something like this is too difficult to address alone. You need to build a network and begin to get to the root of the problem. Good luck.


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## BeachGuy (Jul 6, 2011)

Jellybeans said:


> At your age, you are too old for this game. You know better.
> 
> My guess: you have low self-esteem and are very insecure which is why you are turned on (not off) by other peoples' partners and don't feel you deserve a relationship of your own. Maybe you have a histrionic personality and are self-destructive which is why you do this over and over again.
> 
> ...


I agree with you JB. What was that previous post about here enjoying "beating down other women" all about? Jeepers.

Insecurity. You nailed it.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

I find that most men and women who make a habit out of pursuing marrieds/partnered people usually have very low self-esteem and/or are insecure.


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## CandieGirl (Apr 27, 2011)

When I was young, I was somewhat neglected by my mother and her new husband. They weren't bad to me, they were just busy with their own (new) life together. When I realized that I could get men, I set about doing just that. I was thoughtless, selfish, and downright uncaring at times.

Don't make the mistake of thinking that you are permanently scarred, or that you can't change. You sound a lot like me, when I was younger. I behaved terribly at times in my life and I'm not proud of any of it. When I was in my early 30's, I realized that this was not the way I wanted to live my life; and I just stopped. I think a certain amount of maturity is required, however.


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## KathyBatesel (Apr 26, 2012)

BeachGuy said:


> What was that previous post about here enjoying "beating down other women" all about? Jeepers.
> 
> Insecurity. You nailed it.


It's a way that some people deal with insecurity when they can't trust anyone's perceptions. They have to go that extra mile to "see" the proof.


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## CandieGirl (Apr 27, 2011)

KathyBatesel said:


> It's a way that some people deal with insecurity when they can't trust anyone's perceptions. They have to go that extra mile to "see" the proof.


:iagree:

When I was a child, I thought I was terribly ugly; too ugly to go outside, even. I don't know why I thought this, but I remember the other kids not liking me and picking on me in school. Talk about insecurity! I strongly suspect that once I realized I could 'get' guys, I went overboard at it...and I also went after much, much older men. Married, single, girlfriend or not...I admit that there was a definite rush. But in the end, you still end up feeling like crap about yourself...


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

I will give OP props for wanting to change and ask for help, but that doesn't mean she should be babied about what she does/did and by giving her a POV that she likely hasn't taken time to really consider could just be that eye opener she needs to correct that behavior. I think most in this thread are calling out her behavior and not the poster herself.


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## CandieGirl (Apr 27, 2011)

She'll likely get a good dose of reality and stop. I remember thinking that I would never want one of those men as my own man; and then I realized that I was just as bad (or maybe worse) than them for doing what I was doing in the first place. When you lie with dogs, you rise with fleas...


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## KathyBatesel (Apr 26, 2012)

My posts are certainly confrontational, but they are about the behaviors and not the person. 

I don't always come across that way, and there's some reasoning behind it. When such ingrained thought processes have taken over, it means that we've developed coping mechanisms that prevent us from seeing the truth. Hints and kindness don't get through to us because we're shielded from hurting. Unfortunately, we also can't change until we hurt ENOUGH to.


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## jane1213 (Aug 10, 2012)

Jellybeans said:


> I'd hardly call my comment "mean." The truth hurts to hear.
> 
> Also, this isn't "love addiction." Love addiction is when you chase the high that a new relationship brings. This is an entirely different issue. Her issue is that she keeps paticipating in betrayals and affairs.



Yes, you are right. I edited my post right away. I thought it was mean of me to post such a thing anyway . I am really sorry .

Yes, you are right . What goes around comes around, and that might be an eye opener for her.


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## CandieGirl (Apr 27, 2011)

Call me crazy, but it's not enough to stop just because you're afraid of having the same things happen to you further along in life. I don't believe in all that 'karma' crap. She should change her ways because she's acting like a selfish wh0re, and she's destroying lives. Among those, her own.


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## HopelesslyJaded (Aug 14, 2012)

I agree what she is doing isn't right.

On the other hand a married man shouldn't be obtainable. Maybe if there weren't so many willing and it was harder to get an attached man she'd eventually stop. With each successful conquest it just reaffirms for her that it would be idiotic to commit to a man because it's not a matter of if they cheat it's when. If she can get them so could another woman. (yes my UN fits me perfectly)


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## mc1234 (Jun 9, 2012)

I blamed my H for his EA and was very devastated by his betrayal. During IC, my counsellor mentioned that there are women looking for married men to date etc. .Up to that point, I naively thought that a women couldn't do that to another woman :-(

You need to attend IC to why you have set this behaviour as default. I don't think until you have really hurt and felt what a betrayed wife feels, will you realise and stop what you are doing.


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## Paulination (Feb 6, 2012)

Being attracted only to men who are in relationships does not make you a bad person, acting on it does.

Pedophilia would not be an issue if no one ever acted on it (I am not equating your behavior to this, just making a point).


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

jane1213 said:


> Yes, you are right. I edited my post right away. I thought it was mean of me to post such a thing anyway . I am really sorry .


No sweat.


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## MaritimeGuy (Jul 28, 2012)

Michelle

I really do think you need therapy. It appears to me you're addicted to the thrill of the hunt. You seek out men who should for all intents and purposes be unattainable...yet you still manage to get them. I imagine in a way that is very reaffirming to your self esteem. Once you get them though you quickly lose interest. 

You deserve to spend your life with a man who is attainable and still manages to excite you. Hopefully with the right therapist you will find a way to accomplish this.


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## Michelle C (Aug 15, 2012)

Ouch! I suppose I deserve some of that.

I've read all of your comments and have not been offended by any of them. I do have low self esteem, that is true. I am also attracted to older men. The last two men I was involved with we're work colleagues. Th first was 12 years older than me and married. I don't really want to discuss him though because things went very badly wrong. The second was 17 years older and he was my boss. That ended badly as well partly due to interference from the first guy. I can't recall who said it but I think it is true that I try and hurt other women?

I worked for a woman for 2 years before leaving to work for her partner (my boss) in a different company. I left because she didn't give me a promotion that I thought I deserved, she did recommend me to her partner though!. 4 years later and just after coming out of the relationship with the first work guy. I got drunk at a works party and kissed my boss when he dropped me off home. I did my usual routine of pretending I shouldn't have done it and that nothing could happen because he was in a relationship etc. however that's part of how I operate. I could tell he was really interested in me and the next week he asked to speak with me after work. He told me he couldn't get that kiss out of his mind all weekend. Again I hooked him in and told him how lonely I was etc and within an hour we had arranged to meet up for coffee on the Friday at lunch time. When we met up I was very firm and said I was a good girl and didn't date married or taken men ( he didn't know about the first guy at the time). He told me he and his partner were in a rut and he wasn't sure if they were right together anymore (19 years). 

Anyway One thing led to another and within a few weeks he had decided to call ita dy with his partner. He told everybody in work that they had mutually agreed to split but We agreed not to go public with our relationship for 3 months and then we were going to pretend we had just decided to get together as we were both single.however When push came to shove I kept stalling him about announcing our relationship and he kept getting more and more p,d off with me. To be honest I was now beginning to panic and just wanted to get out of the relationship. Ihad already started switching off and acting coolly with him by this point until eventually he asked me if I had second thoughts and I said yes and that I didn't want a relationship with him anymore other that friendship. He seemed ok with it at the time but I think he eventually spoke to the first guy in work about what had happened. his attitude towards me suddenly changed. I suppose I got my just desserts as he lost his position in the company and I didn't get a temporary promotion that I was hoping for. I ended up leaving the company and moving away from the area because I had started to become harrassed by the first guy and his wife.

In hindsight i think I did do some of this to get back at his wife, but I honestly did like him as well.


It's true as well that my only concern is about myself in all of these situations. I don't give a toss about the other women as long as their partners want me more than them that's all that matters. I've had girlfriends and a wife ring me in work and threaten to pull my hair out and punch me etc and I've managed to keep calm on the phone and try and wriggle out of it by acting innocent and claiming that I'm the one who has been persued by their partner.

Omg my life is f,d up :-(

Thank you for all of your thoughts. I may try a therapist again. I am very private in person so I'm not sure if I will be able to open up. I really ought to do something though. Xxx


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## Michelle C (Aug 15, 2012)

CandieGirl said:


> She'll likely get a good dose of reality and stop. I remember thinking that I would never want one of those men as my own man; and then I realized that I was just as bad (or maybe worse) than them for doing what I was doing in the first place. When you lie with dogs, you rise with fleas...


Yes I do feel bad for a bit afterwards. I do have self esteem issues as well. I don't think I'm ugly, but I'm not perfect either. I don't like my ears and my man hands!. I have been thinking about the advice on here and trying to analyse some of the points. I suppose I try and find men who are in a vulnerable state rather than ones who seem confident and happy. I seem to have a radar that can pick up on unhappiness or weakness in men especially. If I'm honest I know I wouldn't stand a chance with a bloke who was really happy in his relationship. I wouldn't even try with a man like this as he would not be interested in somebody like me in a million years.

I've also decided to give the therapist another go. I've found another one in the neighbouring town and I'm going to ring this afternoon to make an appointment.


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## YellowRoses (Jun 2, 2012)

You play games . You are cruel. You are jealous of others. You bear grudges. 

You are afraid to pursue a single man because if he dumped you or it didn't work out, it would be your fault and not the fact he was married.

If you haven't changed by 30, I doubt you will but you will find yourself less successful at what you do as there will be a lot of younger sharks in your particular pool soon enough

You also could easily be a troll, hopefully not


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## Michelle C (Aug 15, 2012)

YellowRoses said:


> You play games . You are cruel. You are jealous of others. You bear grudges.
> 
> You are afraid to pursue a single man because if he dumped you or it didn't work out, it would be your fault and not the fact he was married.
> 
> ...


I am trying to be honest here though and like I said i wasn't expecting to be congratulated on my behaviour. I have some major issues, I know that, hopefully I can change and can learn to have a "normal" relationship. 


As for the abusive comments about my appearance, well, I'll just rise above that one.


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## Feelingdown (Aug 13, 2012)

I'm gonna say troll.

But just in case. If you want to stop you can stop. I don't think it would even involve much will power.


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## YellowRoses (Jun 2, 2012)

Michelle C said:


> I am trying to be honest here though and like I said i wasn't expecting to be congratulated on my behaviour. I have some major issues, I know that, hopefully I can change and can learn to have a "normal" relationship.
> 
> 
> As for the abusive comments about my appearance, well, I'll just rise above that one.


Troll as in internet troll


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## sinnister (Dec 5, 2010)

There's a lot of beating up going on here. This is one tha I actually commend for her strength to come on a forum where the majority of us are holding on to our marriages by a thread with almost no hope left...and admit that she actually breaks them.

OP, the advice you were given to seek help is your only hope. What you're doing eats away at you from the inside out. It destroys what's good about a person and just rots them. Stop the rot. Visit a psych.


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## Michelle C (Aug 15, 2012)

YellowRoses said:


> Troll as in internet troll


Oh ok I'm sorry, I thought you were being abusive about me.

I am not being dishonest with what I have posted if that is what you are trying to imply? I'm being brutally honest with what I have done and how I feel. I will be seeing a therapist in the next few days and hopefully that will help. 

Just so you know. I've been cheated on as well. My bf from uni left me for somebody he worked with just as we were planning to get our first place together. We had been together 4 years and although I don't think we would ever have married I felt really upset about it and most of our joint friends actually sided with him over it!


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## Cherry (Sep 23, 2009)

Michelle C said:


> Yes I do feel bad for a bit afterwards. I do have self esteem issues as well. I don't think I'm ugly, but I'm not perfect either. I don't like my ears and my man hands!. I have been thinking about the advice on here and trying to analyse some of the points. I suppose I try and find men who are in a vulnerable state rather than ones who seem confident and happy. I seem to have a radar that can pick up on unhappiness or weakness in men especially. If I'm honest I know I wouldn't stand a chance with a bloke who was really happy in his relationship. I wouldn't even try with a man like this as he would not be interested in somebody like me in a million years.
> 
> I've also decided to give the therapist another go. I've found another one in the neighbouring town and I'm going to ring this afternoon to make an appointment.


So what do you want to do with the rest of your life? Dating vulnerable married men seems like a hobby to you. Do you know anyone with a happy marriage? Can you appreciate what they have? 

BTW... I really hope you're a troll, and if you're not, I hope you'll get that therapist appointment set up.


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

Michelle C said:


> As for the abusive comments about my appearance, well, I'll just rise above that one.


for the internet
a troll is not about personal appearance 

a troll is someone who intentionally creates fake threads to stir up trouble

still not polite to say it, and if she suspects you of being one then she should PM a mod


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## Michelle C (Aug 15, 2012)

Cherry said:


> So what do you want to do with the rest of your life? Dating vulnerable married men seems like a hobby to you. Do you know anyone with a happy marriage? Can you appreciate what they have?
> 
> BTW... I really hope you're a troll, and if you're not, I hope you'll get that therapist appointment set up.



It's a question that I have often asked myself. Im not sure if I want kids or not. Sometimes I think yes, especially when I visit one of my friends who has a two year old. Yes she is happily married and no I haven't tried anything with her husband either!

On the other hand there are aspects of my life tha I like. I love the freedom I have to go to music festivals or concerts at the drop of a hat. I like going to the pub and not having to worry about getting home for a baby sitter. I think I would want to be married before I had kids as well, and although I like the idea of being married I don't think any sensible man would want anything to do with me as im high maintainence and can be very critical and emotionally demanding. In fact I should come with a government health warning stamped on my forehead.:lol:


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## Michelle C (Aug 15, 2012)

Almostrecovered said:


> for the internet
> a troll is not about personal appearance
> 
> a troll is someone who intentionally creates fake threads to stir up trouble
> ...


Thanks!

It's ok though I've been called worse things than a troll and I don't think she was trying to be offensive.


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## CandieGirl (Apr 27, 2011)

Michelle, I don't think you're a troll at all. I've been there, and completely understand what it is you're going through. I don't feel sorry for you, though. Like me (in the past), you know exactly what you're doing. I suspect you get a thrill of stealing another woman's man. Why do you do it? Because you can.

Learn from this and rise above it. Find yourself. Figure out what it is you really want in life. Then you can find your owb man, hopefully not one like the scumbags that are cheating on their wives and girlfriends with you.

But please be very aware that you will always carry this baggage with you. I am hyper-vigilant about the signs of cheating because I've seen/heard it all from the guys I used to 'date'. I am also super suspicious of most men that have come through my life since then. Because I know that there are women like you (me) out there. So in a way, I guess that's the 'karma' thing.


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## DawnD (Sep 23, 2009)

Michelle C said:


> It's a question that I have often asked myself. Im not sure if I want kids or not. Sometimes I think yes, especially when I visit one of my friends who has a two year old. Yes she is happily married and no I haven't tried anything with her husband either!
> 
> On the other hand there are aspects of my life tha I like. I love the freedom I have to go to music festivals or concerts at the drop of a hat. I like going to the pub and not having to worry about getting home for a baby sitter. I think I would want to be married before I had kids as well, and although I like the idea of being married I don't think any sensible man would want anything to do with me as im high maintainence and can be very critical and emotionally demanding. In fact I should come with a government health warning stamped on my forehead.:lol:


 I think before you even think about children or not, you should come to grips with what you are doing. You are basically starting the cycle that you got in for other kids. You are putting them in the exact same place you were in. 

I think "if they were truly happy they wouldn't want anything to do with me" is a cop out. If you were truly happy you wouldn't seek out attached men. 

Get in to therapy. Instead of worrying what the therapist might think about you, start thinking about what all the wives/girlfriends and their children think about you. I don't honestly believe the men to be clueless, so I am sure after the fact they are well aware of your intent too, so I doubt they keep you on a pedestal. Do you want to be known as the girl who spent her life trying to ruin others lives? Or do you want to be known as someone who escaped a horribly flawed childhood and was still able to pull it together?


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## Michelle C (Aug 15, 2012)

CandieGirl said:


> Michelle, I don't think you're a troll at all. I've been there, and completely understand what it is you're going through. I don't feel sorry for you, though. Like me (in the past), you know exactly what you're doing. I suspect you get a thrill of stealing another woman's man. Why do you do it? Because you can.
> 
> Learn from this and rise above it. Find yourself. Figure out what it is you really want in life. Then you can find your owb man, hopefully not one like the scumbags that are cheating on their wives and girlfriends with you.
> 
> But please be very aware that you will always carry this baggage with you. I am hyper-vigilant about the signs of cheating because I've seen/heard it all from the guys I used to 'date'. I am also super suspicious of most men that have come through my life since then. Because I know that there are women like you (me) out there. So in a way, I guess that's the 'karma' thing.



Thanks candiegirl. I'm not after sympathy I just need the opinions of strangers. Ive looked at therapists already and will be seeing one who specialises in cbt therapy. I don't know what that entails but I'm prepared to give it a go. I'll give some feedback after I've been. :scratchhead:


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## Michelle C (Aug 15, 2012)

DawnD said:


> I think before you even think about children or not, you should come to grips with what you are doing. You are basically starting the cycle that you got in for other kids. You are putting them in the exact same place you were in.
> 
> I think "if they were truly happy they wouldn't want anything to do with me" is a cop out. If you were truly happy you wouldn't seek out attached men.
> 
> Get in to therapy. Instead of worrying what the therapist might think about you, start thinking about what all the wives/girlfriends and their children think about you. I don't honestly believe the men to be clueless, so I am sure after the fact they are well aware of your intent too, so I doubt they keep you on a pedestal. Do you want to be known as the girl who spent her life trying to ruin others lives? Or do you want to be known as someone who escaped a horribly flawed childhood and was still able to pull it together?



Yes:iagree:


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

don't lie or omit anything in therapy, it will be a waste of time and money. Therapists don't judge and seek to help you improve yourself (well a good one would)


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## CandieGirl (Apr 27, 2011)

Another thing I remember thinking, back in those days, was why should I bother trying to settle down with a man of my own, when all he was going to do was cheat anyway? And I kept right on dating unavailable men. The saddest part was I never had to ask them twice, if you know what I mean. I remember one guy who felt remorse, right after we'd done the deed. Said he'd had no reason whatsoever to do that to his wife. I told him fine, we'll never do this / mention this again....we were then involved for over 3 years. I have to say, I didn't (and still don't) have a high opinion of these guys who just seem to be incapable of passing up the free buffet. Some woman throws herself at a man and he just can't refuse? I don't understand.


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## CandieGirl (Apr 27, 2011)

Michelle C said:


> Thanks candiegirl. I'm not after sympathy I just need the opinions of strangers. Ive looked at therapists already and will be seeing one who specialises in cbt therapy. I don't know what that entails but I'm prepared to give it a go. I'll give some feedback after I've been. :scratchhead:


Yes, that's a step in the right direction. You know what you're doing is wrong, and that's good.

Are you seeing someone now? If you are, you have to stop. Stay away from ALL men until you get out of this cycle you're in.


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## YellowRoses (Jun 2, 2012)

Almostrecovered said:


> for the internet
> a troll is not about personal appearance
> 
> a troll is someone who intentionally creates fake threads to stir up trouble
> ...


'Not polite' ?

Sorry but this lady, by her own admission, tramples all over people to get what she wants. I suspect she can handle a little less than politeness.

I called it publicly because I had a doubt and to allow OP to convince otherwise. When a story so bad with a very simple answer (stop it/get professional help to stop it) appears on a pro-marriage forum, I don't think its wrong to be wary.

There are people here who will read this and trigger so badly they'll be in floods for the day. Please don't let it make to the CWI board.


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## Michelle C (Aug 15, 2012)

CandieGirl said:


> Yes, that's a step in the right direction. You know what you're doing is wrong, and that's good.
> 
> Are you seeing someone now? If you are, you have to stop. Stay away from ALL men until you get out of this cycle you're in.



No nobody at the moment. I'm trying to keep my nose clean. I've only been in my new company for a relatively short period of time and as I said things got pretty scary at my last place.


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## Cherry (Sep 23, 2009)

Actually, unhappy married men are the most attainable and available men out there, short term. Pretty easy target when you get down to it OP


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## Michelle C (Aug 15, 2012)

YellowRoses said:


> 'Not polite' ?
> 
> Sorry but this lady, by her own admission, tramples all over people to get what she wants. I suspect she can handle a little less than politeness.
> 
> ...


Oh no that's not my intention at all!

If there was somewhere else I should have posted this then I'm truely sorry


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## MaritimeGuy (Jul 28, 2012)

CandieGirl said:


> I didn't (and still don't) have a high opinion of these guys who just seem to be incapable of passing up the free buffet. Some woman throws herself at a man and he just can't refuse? I don't understand.


I concur with this statement. A lot of people want to heap scorn on the 'other woman'. As I see it however she's not the one who stood up before god, family and friends to publicly make a vow of fidelity. It's the married man in this scenario that did that. Unless he was raped he is 100% responsible for the choice he made. The other woman was just a convenient sperm receptacle. 

I think what shatters a marriage when someone cheats is not the affair itself...it's that they were capable of having an affair. The fact they could place a momentary flash of pleasure ahead of the partner they vowed to love and cherish for life is so incredibly hurtful. It's next to impossible to fully recover from.


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## CandieGirl (Apr 27, 2011)

Cherry said:


> Actually, unhappy married men are the most attainable and available men out there, short term. Pretty easy target when you get down to it OP


 And the happily married men seem to be pretty easy targets, too. It's like they can't help themselves. And to women like our OP, the happier these guys claim to be, the better the challenge. I suppose my own attitude would be different, if I'd been knocked back at least ONCE. 

Sad!


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## YellowRoses (Jun 2, 2012)

If you are genuine OP then I'm sure you are welcome to ask for advice

My opinion is but one and I have little time for someone who has got to 30 and still gets teenage kicks from doing other people over

If you are serious about change, the answer is simple - stop it and get professional help for yourself

In practical terms, the problem with late change (and 30's is late) is that you may well have a reputation to shrug off and its much harder to lose a bad reputation than a good one

You may need to refresh everything - new town, new job , new friends


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## CandieGirl (Apr 27, 2011)

MaritimeGuy said:


> I concur with this statement. A lot of people want to heap scorn on the 'other woman'. As I see it however she's not the one who stood up before god, family and friends to publicly make a vow of fidelity. It's the married man in this scenario that did that. Unless he was raped he is 100% responsible for the choice he made. The other woman was just a convenient sperm receptacle.
> 
> I think what shatters a marriage when someone cheats is not the affair itself...it's that they were capable of having an affair. The fact they could place a momentary flash of pleasure ahead of the partner they vowed to love and cherish for life is so incredibly hurtful. *It's next to impossible to fully recover from.*


:iagree:

That's why it took my SO long to get married myself in the first place.


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

YellowRoses said:


> 'Not polite' ?
> 
> Sorry but this lady, by her own admission, tramples all over people to get what she wants. I suspect she can handle a little less than politeness.
> 
> ...



I agree with your anger and sentiment, however, recently the mods made it clear not to call troll on threads and to PM them instead. It's their board, their rules.


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## Cherry (Sep 23, 2009)

CandieGirl said:


> And the happily married men seem to be pretty easy targets, too. It's like they can't help themselves. And to women like our OP, the happier these guys claim to be, the better the challenge. I suppose my own attitude would be different, if I'd been knocked back at least ONCE.
> 
> Sad!


Our OP claims to target only the weak, vulnerable men, the ones with "problems" in their relationship. 

OP -- what constitutes a "vulnerable" man? Do you know their marriage history, do you lay and wait in the bushes for them to have a bad day at home? Do they confide their problems to you? Do you think about what their families are doing, while they are out with you? What is your role in their marriage? If its a game to you, that game your playing could be destroying a generation of kids..


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Michelle C said:


> Thanks for your comment. I've tried a therapist, but I couldn't bring myself to tell them the full story. I suppose I felt ashamed


 Then how do you expect to stop? Get back to to a therapist and tell them the truth.


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## YellowRoses (Jun 2, 2012)

OK, fair enough AR , but I missed that one 

I don't like 'to tell tales' without giving people a chance first but I can see the logic and apologise if I've missed a forum 'rule'. I tend to use the 'report post' button , does it have to be PM ?


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## bkaydezz (Jul 9, 2012)

oh oh oh....

yes honey you need to see a professional about this.
its like addiction. the more you feed into it the more you want it.


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## bkaydezz (Jul 9, 2012)

that is why the therapist is there!!
be honest.
it will set you free of the shame and guilt and help you!


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## Michelle C (Aug 15, 2012)

Ok thanks everybody for your input.

Just to clarify. 

I have an appointment to see a cbt? Therapist in the next few days. I made the appointment earlier.

I am sorry if I have upset anybody with my post. It was the furthest thing from my mind.

I know i have done very bad things and upset people by having affairs

I am very very private and can't talk about any of this to any of my friends or family and after finding this forum I thought it would be a good place to get some honest feedback from people. 

I appreciate and really value all of your comments even the ones that are a bit aggressive and threatening YR!


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## CandieGirl (Apr 27, 2011)

Cherry said:


> Our OP claims to target only the weak, vulnerable men, the ones with "problems" in their relationship.
> 
> OP -- what constitutes a "vulnerable" man? Do you know their marriage history, do you lay and wait in the bushes for them to have a bad day at home? Do they confide their problems to you? Do you think about what their families are doing, while they are out with you? What is your role in their marriage? If its a game to you, that game your playing could be destroying a generation of kids..


I don't know...maybe the OP just thinks that they're vulnerable and unhappy? I know from my own experience, except for that one dude who was genuinely upset with himself for cheating with me (for all of 3 minutes), the others all lied. The most common excuse was that their wives had stopped having sex with them. In my case there wasn't one attached 30-40-50 something who passed up the opportunity for sex with a young 20 something. They can't all have been unhappy / not having sex, etc. And even if they were, no excuse!


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Michelle C said:


> As for the abusive comments about my appearance, well, I'll just rise above that one.


 The comment was in no way abusive. It was reality. I know a once-beautiful woman just like you who, now, in her 50s, can no longer get any guy she wants to spend money on her; she has lost everything because she's depended on men to fund her for so long - and no man wants to hook up with a once-pretty woman when she's aged out of that group - she can't even get a job any more. That's your future if you don't change.


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

YellowRoses said:


> OK, fair enough AR , but I missed that one
> 
> I don't like 'to tell tales' without giving people a chance first but I can see the logic and apologise if I've missed a forum 'rule'. I tend to use the 'report post' button , does it have to be PM ?


I suppose the report button works too as you have to fill out the reason why you are reporting it


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## CandieGirl (Apr 27, 2011)

Almostrecovered said:


> I suppose the report button works too as you have to fill out the reason why you are reporting it


I've read far more outrageous and ridiculous threads that never get taken down for trollism...trust me, any of you who are reporting the OP, this type of thing happens. All. The. Time.


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## YellowRoses (Jun 2, 2012)

Just to be clear I'm NOT reporting the OP

I don't think her story is particularly outrageous or unbelievable. Its all too believable in fact. But it IS provocative to a lot of loyal or betrayed partners and therefore it is to be hoped that the MOTIVE for posting it is also genuine.


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## Cherry (Sep 23, 2009)

CandieGirl said:


> I don't know...maybe the OP just thinks that they're vulnerable and unhappy? I know from my own experience, except for that one dude who was genuinely upset with himself for cheating with me (for all of 3 minutes), the others all lied. The most common excuse was that their wives had stopped having sex with them. In my case there wasn't one attached 30-40-50 something who passed up the opportunity for sex with a young 20 something. They can't all have been unhappy / not having sex, etc. And even if they were, no excuse!


That's what I was getting at 

OP - this is a good opportunity for you to start changing your ways, with the new job and getting serious about therapy. I bet you can find less harmful hobbies . I hope you will stick around, id be interested in your progress. 

Good luck!


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## CandieGirl (Apr 27, 2011)

YellowRoses said:


> Just to be clear I'm NOT reporting the OP
> 
> I don't think her story is particularly outrageous or unbelievable. Its all too believable in fact. But it IS provocative to a lot of loyal or betrayed partners and therefore it is to be hoped that the MOTIVE for posting it is also genuine.


I agree with you about the story being provocative; however, I do believe it's best to know what's out there instead of being too naive. IE, the big bad OW stealing the happy husband. It doesn't usually play out that way.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Michelle, you're being a good sport, and good on you for seeking help. I think that hearing what some people here say may actually HELP you understand the FLIP side of what you do - how what you do is hurting other people you probably never even meet - the wives and children of the men you target. The pain you hear from some people here is real, devastating, and lifelong. That's pain that you have been causing a lot of women and kids out there. So good for you on looking to change. Please keep posting, and we'll help you chart a path.


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## Michelle C (Aug 15, 2012)

CandieGirl said:


> I don't know...maybe the OP just thinks that they're vulnerable and unhappy? I know from my own experience, except for that one dude who was genuinely upset with himself for cheating with me (for all of 3 minutes), the others all lied. The most common excuse was that their wives had stopped having sex with them. In my case there wasn't one attached 30-40-50 something who passed up the opportunity for sex with a young 20 something. They can't all have been unhappy / not having sex, etc. And even if they were, no excuse!


I didn't sleep with all of these men. It's really more of an emotional thing with me. The need to be wanted especially above somebody else. Somebody earlier said I was competitive. This is true. I have a fiercely competitive streak in me inherited from my dad I think:scratchhead:

I didn't disrespect any of these men either. I didn't think they were bad or nasty. In fact I thought they were all really nice in one way or another. I hated it if any of them talked about their partners and I told them so.

In total I have done this 6 times since I was 18. For those of you in marriages who hate me then you can take some comfort from the fact that all but 2 of those men wouldn't leave their wives/partners for me. They all chose their wives. The two that didn't, well the first was my boyfriend from uni and he ended up going off with somebody he worked with after 4 years. The other was this guy I met at a firemans night out. He left his gf for a week then hightailed it back to her as soon as he came to his senses.

As you can see my personal life is pretty wretched and is defiantly something to be ashamed of. I know it is up to me to change that and I'm going to give it my best shot starting with the therapy.


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## CandieGirl (Apr 27, 2011)

Michelle C said:


> I didn't sleep with all of these men. It's really more of an emotional thing with me. The need to be wanted especially above somebody else. Somebody earlier said I was competitive. This is true. I have a fiercely competitive streak in me inherited from my dad I think:scratchhead:
> 
> I didn't disrespect any of these men either. I didn't think they were bad or nasty. In fact I thought they were all really nice in one way or another. I hated it if any of them talked about their partners and I told them so.
> 
> ...


I didn't sleep with all of them, that's why there was so many...I didn't disrespect the guys either. Well, not back then, anyway. Now, different story. I totally disrespect anyone who behaves that way, man or woman.


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## Ten_year_hubby (Jun 24, 2010)

Michelle C said:


> I don't know how to get out of the destructive cycle that I am in. I suppose I want to find out if anybody else has had this problem and what they did to get themselves out of it.
> 
> I'm not a bad person (honestly), I just do some bad things and I would like to stop. I just don't know how


Michelle,

In a way you are lucky that you are seeking help before you got married and had a couple kids in middle school.

In my humble opinion, your family experiences growing up have left you wanting what you don't have and not wanting what you have. I see this as a maturity issue.

Unless you are compulsive, I would think that you could refrain from inappropriate relationships through learning self control. Are there other areas of you life that are out of control such as spending, drinking, eating, ...? If you are compulsive I would encourage you to seek treatment or join a 12-step group or both.

The next step toward having a satisfying long term relationship is learning to be satisfied with what you have. A lot of people have problems with this, including myself. It can be a constant effort give one's partner the importance and the honor that they deserve in your life. Especially if we didn't see that modeled in our parent's relationship.

I think you have some special gifts that are very valuable and maybe not well recognized. I would ask you to resolve within yourself not to take advantage of hapless broken men and use the considerable talents you bring to the table for some kind of greater good.


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## DawnD (Sep 23, 2009)

Michelle --

Have you ever thought to sit down with a piece of paper, and write down what you want out of life? Just for yourself? With your goals, wants and needs? It truly can be helpful, especially to be able to go back to it and do a status check. 

FWIW, I don't think anyone here hates you. They have the behavior. A lot of people have varying opinions on the roles of OW/OM in relationships. Some believe any and all responsibility lies on the attached person, and some believe that it lies on both the attached person and the OW/OM. My opinion is purely this: If you know you are hurting people, then you are responsible.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

You have severe boundary issues. As well as low self-esteem and insecurities. 

The whole thing about going after your boss and men at work--boundary issues. The fact that you hooked up w/ your BOSS (egads!) and then when he told you he was leaving his wife, you backed out--screams that you have committment issues as well. 

You feel you don't deserve better. So you do this over and over again. Like someone else said, it's not challenging at all to go after someone who is 'unhappy" in their relationship. They are the easiest kind of targets. The fact that you see them as a prize and not as the unfaithful/skeevy people that they are says a lot. If you had self-respect and good self-esteem, you would run the other way and be offended any married/partner guy was trying to get on you. 

Your whole situation is like this book I read called "Getting Rid of Matthew." Same premise. Work chick only digs married guys, gets involved with her married boss, boss finally decides to leave his wife and once Work chick gets what she wants, she spends the entire time trying to get rid of her boss after that. By far one of the most unlikeable characters I've ever read about.

This solution is simple: Stop. 

If you really want to stop doing something, you will. 

It has to come from within though. Talk is cheap. Actions are what matter.

You already know what to do. The question is, will you?


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## Michelle C (Aug 15, 2012)

Ten_year_hubby said:


> Michelle,
> 
> In a way you are lucky that you are seeking help before you got married and had a couple kids in middle school.
> 
> ...


Thank you. I really do over analyse everything to the nth degree. I'm not a compulsive eater, I like my puds, but I make sure I work hard at the gym So I'm still a size 10 uk size. I do drink too much though. I know this. If I open a bottle of wine i will not stop until its gone. I also lose some of my inhibitions when I drink and that's get me into embarrassing situations as well from time to time. As for hidden gifts, they must be really well hidden ! Apart from my academic ability 2 first class honours degrees yayy:smthumbup: I have no other talent or skills.


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## Michelle C (Aug 15, 2012)

Jellybeans said:


> You have severe boundary issues. As well as low self-esteem and insecurities.
> 
> The whole thing about going after your boss and men at work--boundary issues. The fact that you hooked up w/ your BOSS (egads!) and then when he told you he was leaving his wife, you backed out--screams that you hace committment issues as well.
> 
> ...


Omg that sounds embarrassingly like me I think I should read that book who is the author?

I have stopped as well. Currently I'm single. Properly single and I am not " involved" with anyone at the moment. So yes I recognise now is a good time o work on my issues.


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## Cherry (Sep 23, 2009)

Michelle C said:


> Thank you. I really do over analyse everything to the nth degree. I'm not a compulsive eater, I like my puds, but I make sure I work hard at the gym So I'm still a size 10 uk size. I do drink too much though. I know this. If I open a bottle of wine i will not stop until its gone. I also lose some of my inhibitions when I drink and that's get me into embarrassing situations as well from time to time. As for hidden gifts, they must be really well hidden ! Apart from my academic ability 2 first class honours degrees yayy:smthumbup: I have no other talent or skills.


 any desire to stop drinking too? That can contribute to a lot of the cycle you're in. As a drinker, it was so easy to get drunk and not have to really face the demons. I have much more of an overall conscious realization of things in my life. In fact, take away the drinking and theres no way I would've done half the stuff I did, including marrying my H.. but that's another story .


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## Michelle C (Aug 15, 2012)

DawnD said:


> Michelle --
> 
> Have you ever thought to sit down with a piece of paper, and write down what you want out of life? Just for yourself? With your goals, wants and needs? It truly can be helpful, especially to be able to go back to it and do a status check.
> 
> FWIW, I don't think anyone here hates you. They have the behavior. A lot of people have varying opinions on the roles of OW/OM in relationships. Some believe any and all responsibility lies on the attached person, and some believe that it lies on both the attached person and the OW/OM. My opinion is purely this: If you know you are hurting people, then you are responsible.



Yes I think everybody has done this at some stage. I suppose. I am well on my way to achieving my professional and work based goals. I have other goals such as traveling around the world again. I did that when I left uni. It was fabulous. My personal goals are I want a prince charming and I'm still undecided on kids. Somedays yes please other days yuck no thanks. I don't think people really hate me, because they've never met me. I do think they have every right to hate what I have done though.


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## norajane (Feb 7, 2012)

Michelle C said:


> Omg that sounds embarrassingly like me I think I should read that book who is the author?
> 
> I have stopped as well. Currently I'm single. Properly single and I am not " involved" with anyone at the moment. So yes I recognise now is a good time o work on my issues.


Read up on intimacy issues. People who feel like they aren't good enough to have a "real" relationship often self-sabotage (get involved with unsuitable men) in order not to fall in love and possibly be rejected.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Bingo, Nora.


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## Michelle C (Aug 15, 2012)

Cherry said:


> any desire to stop drinking too? That can contribute to a lot of the cycle you're in. As a drinker, it was so easy to get drunk and not have to really face the demons. I have much more of an overall conscious realization of things in my life. In fact, take away the drinking and theres no way I would've done half the stuff I did, including marrying my H.. but that's another story .



Ha ha better not let him see that last line!

I had a real rep at uni for drinking. I could drink anybody (lads included) under the table. The problem is I actually like drinking, I like the way it makes me feel. It makes me happy when I'm sad and it amplifies my fun when I'm having a good time. I suppose i still have an immature student attitude towards drink, but then again so do most of my friends.:rofl:

Example of bad drunk Michelle: Two years ago I spent Christmas with dad, his wife and her family and I got wrecked and started being inappropriate. I don't remember much about it but I think I was being a bit crude towards her sisters son. Apparently asking him about his sex life etc anyhoo I get asked to leave the next day. Dad giving it his usual "we're both very disappointed in you Michelle"look!


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## Michelle C (Aug 15, 2012)

turnera said:


> The comment was in no way abusive. It was reality. I know a once-beautiful woman just like you who, now, in her 50s, can no longer get any guy she wants to spend money on her; she has lost everything because she's depended on men to fund her for so long - and no man wants to hook up with a once-pretty woman when she's aged out of that group - she can't even get a job any more. That's your future if you don't change.



I understand what you are saying but Im not even beautiful now


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## bkaydezz (Jul 9, 2012)

Michelle C said:


> I understand what you are saying but Im not even beautiful now


tsk tsk tsk!!!

no no my dear.
we do not say that.

everyone is beautiful.

you have to realize that!.
its not up to everyone else to decide your beauty but you.
you make yourself beautiful by being you and being worthy of your own self and morality.

the more you bring yourself down, is when you start becoming those thoughts of you and forget to look at whats really in that mirror. 

you at some point have to decide whether or not you want to see you or see the hell inside your mind.

its clear to all of us that you want to change and want to help yourself.

and thats the first step....ADMITTING! right guys
it all follows after that.
you need support and guidance along the way. 
you will find the ending you are looking for if you turn the pages


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## Michelle C (Aug 15, 2012)

turnera said:


> The comment was in no way abusive. It was reality. I know a once-beautiful woman just like you who, now, in her 50s, can no longer get any guy she wants to spend money on her; she has lost everything because she's depended on men to fund her for so long - and no man wants to hook up with a once-pretty woman when she's aged out of that group - she can't even get a job any more. That's your future if you don't change.


Do you know what? I've re read your comment again and basically you've just described my mum! She's just turned fifty, single, obsessed with hooking a doctor or somebodyof equal high standing and getting them to pay for her! She wont get one though because, although she's not bad looking for her age, she's just as rotten as me inside probably more so if the truth be told. Can't dwell on that for long though, I'm going out with her tonight :rofl:

Oh my word, my head is well and truely in the shed over all of this! I'm going to leave it now whilst I'm still slightly sane. I'll check in again in a few days after I've had my therapy. Thanks for all the comments and support.


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## Michelle C (Aug 15, 2012)

bkaydezz said:


> tsk tsk tsk!!!
> 
> no no my dear.
> we do not say that.
> ...


That's so kind of you. Thank you xxx


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## bkaydezz (Jul 9, 2012)

your situation reminds me of the movies heartbreakers with jennifer love hewitt and sigourney weaver and gene hackman, hilarious movie great story. check it out sometime!


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## bkaydezz (Jul 9, 2012)

oh and make sure you do update us!!!!!


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## Ten_year_hubby (Jun 24, 2010)

Michelle C said:


> I had a real rep at uni for drinking. I could drink anybody (lads included) under the table. The problem is I actually like drinking, I like the way it makes me feel. It makes me happy when I'm sad and it amplifies my fun when I'm having a good time. I suppose i still have an immature student attitude towards drink, but then again so do most of my friends.:rofl:
> 
> Example of bad drunk Michelle: Two years ago I spent Christmas with dad, his wife and her family and I got wrecked and started being inappropriate. I don't remember much about it but I think I was being a bit crude towards her sisters son. Apparently asking him about his sex life etc anyhoo I get asked to leave the next day. Dad giving it his usual "we're both very disappointed in you Michelle"look!


Michelle,

None of this bodes well. If you are really interested in moving forward into a satisfying relationship and the life goes along with it, you have to find a way to free yourself from compulsion.

I think you have special sensitivities and are a very perceptive person with regards to people and relationships (just not with yourself). If you could find your way to sober up and set your sights you could have a brilliant career in any face to face profession along with being and exceptional wife and mother. But left unchecked, the path you're on leads to more bad judgement and overpowering guilt


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Michelle C said:


> I understand what you are saying but Im not even beautiful now


 Real men seek with with real, inner beauty. THAT you have control over.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Michelle C said:


> she's just as rotten as me inside


We call that stinkin' thinkin'. You are your own worst enemy as long as you continue to look at yourself as damaged goods. Truth be told, you're just behaving how you were raised to be. That has nothing to do with who you are as a person. If you weren't a good person, your conscience wouldn't have brought you here. You just need to educate yourself on family of origin issues and how they determine the kind of choices you make. TONS of books out there on that. Start reading!


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## hotdogs (Aug 9, 2012)

I could say so much here that would be true but nasty and painful for you to hear. I started to actually but stopped. 

Something about you just caught my pity I guess.

Let's hope you get on the straight and narrow before one of these betrayed other women kills you.


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## Hopefull363 (Feb 13, 2012)

Michelle C, Are you married? If not what are you doing posting on this site and triggering people? This isn't some therapy site. It's name is Talk About Marriage. I think this thread is highly inappropriate.


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## Blanca (Jul 25, 2008)

lifeisnotsogood said:


> Hey, don't worry about it. Someday you'll be married and in a perfect relationship. Then Karma will rear its ugly head and it will happen to you. You will be devastated and will wish you had never caused anyone that much pain. So until that day, have a blast.


Pretty much what happened to me. I was shallow and got a high going after guys; i didn't feel much emotion for them and didn't really care who I hurt. How could I when I didn't even understand what it meant to be hurt. Karma is a b*tch.


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## Emerald (Aug 2, 2012)

Michelle C said:


> Ok not sure how this will be recieved but i could do with some honest feed back. I suspect it may be painful, but as i dont know anybody on here i hope i can get some honest opinions that i can work with to start helping myself. :-(
> 
> Since I was 14 I have only really been interested in other peoples partners. My parents had affairs when I was growing up and shortly before I graduated from uni they informed me that they were going to divorce. I wasn't surprised really, in fact I didn't feel anything when they told me, no sorrow nothing.
> 
> ...


I am glad you shared your story.

Your behavior is self-destructive in the extreme. Yes, counseling is a good 1st step. I mean no disrespect but you may be mentally ill & need more treatment than counseling. It could be something very treatable like depression. I will pray for you.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Hopefull363 said:


> Michelle C, Are you married? If not what are you doing posting on this site and triggering people? This isn't some therapy site. It's name is Talk About Marriage. I think this thread is highly inappropriate.


Hypocritic thinking. We are here to help people. Especially people who really want to improve themselves.


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## bkaydezz (Jul 9, 2012)

turnera said:


> Hypocritic thinking. We are here to help people. Especially people who really want to improve themselves.


yep yep.

besides, i dont see it as triggering.
if thats the case everyone is triggering someone else on here for posting about there fantasy and porn and yadda yadda!!!


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

A lot of us spend our lives trying to get over what our parents did to us. I think this is what is going on. 

The first stage of this is to keep reinacting what went on at home, except as a adult the stakes are higher.

You said that you used to manipulate your parents by playing them off each other. You clearly like your father more than you like your mother.

The older married men you seek out are representative of your father. You manipulate these men way from their wife and simply ignore the wife... who you feel nothing for (a way to express hate or great dislike). These women represent your mother.

You play the same game over and over again... play dad against mom. This makes you daddy's favorite little girl... mommy is not daddy's favorite little girl, you are.

Call me crazy (I've been called worse.  )


But this is what I seen in what you have written.


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## somethingelse (Jun 20, 2012)

So I do know that there are lots of women out there like you.

But another thing I know is....those women are the reasons me and my H are on the brink of divorce. Not because he truly wants or loves these women (my H is a user), but because I'm sick of him and you women who allow them to seduce you into affairs.

The reason you let go of your "catches" once they show you commitment? because you are a user too. You want reassurance from a man, because your whole life all you've seen is lying and cheating. You want to feel like someone is giving something up for you, because your parents never thought about you, and never put you first in their lives. They put their AP's first. 

You need to seek out God, and ask him who he wants you to be. That is my greatest advice for the situation you are in.


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## dgtal (Jun 11, 2010)

Gaia said:


> .. and it is very dangerous behavior because one day you may just try to compete against a female who might have it in her head to eliminate any and all competition at all costs. Meaning some women will either beat the snot out of you or.... snap and try to kill you. It does happen... so.. like I said... counseling for yourself.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I agree. Excellent comment. She is a walking bomb
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## sinnister (Dec 5, 2010)

Michelle C said:


> I understand what you are saying but Im not even beautiful now


Clearly there is some beauty in you or you wouldn't be trying to improve yourself. You women are way way way way too hard on yourselves.:scratchhead:


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## Hopefull363 (Feb 13, 2012)

You guys should really look up the definition of hypocrite before you use it. Also, read through the posts again before you tell me she's not triggering people. I'm not triggering because I've never had to deal with infidelity in my marriage. I just feel sorry for the people that are and are listening to this nonsense. This thread serves no purpose but to incite. The OP obviously needs professional help and she's not going to get it here.


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## somethingelse (Jun 20, 2012)

Do unto others as you would have them do unto you.


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

Hopefull363 said:


> You guys should really look up the definition of hypocrite before you use it. Also, read through the posts again before you tell me she's not triggering people. I'm not triggering because I've never had to deal with infidelity in my marriage. I just feel sorry for the people that are and are listening to this nonsense. This thread serves no purpose but to incite. The OP obviously needs professional help and she's not going to get it here.


I agree with you when it comes to the numnuts who come one here looking for affirmation of their cheating or justify their actions and express no remorse 

this OP hasn't done that, she recognized she has done some horrible things and while she hasn't fully demonstrated remorse, she has come here to learn how to do just that and improve herself and correct her behavior. 

Now, I certainly let her "have it" and tried express just how much damage she has done in her past relationships, but to continue beating that horse after a while only serves to get her in a defensive posture and does not help her keep an open mind as to what she can do to make her choices better ones.


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## Cherry (Sep 23, 2009)

Hopefull363 said:


> You guys should really look up the definition of hypocrite before you use it. Also, read through the posts again before you tell me she's not triggering people. I'm not triggering because I've never had to deal with infidelity in my marriage. I just feel sorry for the people that are and are listening to this nonsense. This thread serves no purpose but to incite. The OP obviously needs professional help and she's not going to get it here.


I thought that too. Also what better place to target unhappy married men.. a message board full of problems.. hmmm

ETA: I'm also giving the benefit of a doubt to the poster that she is reaching out for help, and will set that therapist appt.. and get redirected to support forums for various bad behavior. I dont know.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Emerald said:


> Your behavior is self-destructive in the extreme. Yes, counseling is a good 1st step. I mean no disrespect but you may be mentally ill & need more treatment than counseling. It could be something very treatable like depression. I will pray for you.


:iagree::iagree::iagree:


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## Hopefull363 (Feb 13, 2012)

Cherry that's exactly what I mean. She should be redirected to some other support forum. This is a marriage or committed relationship forum. She's the type of person that is a threat to that. I''m not saying she doesn't have a problem and needs help, but this is not the proper place for her.

Some people are trying to help her and others are obviously triggering, based on the comments. She should reach out for help where she's more likely to get help suited to her problem.


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## somethingelse (Jun 20, 2012)

Hopefull363 said:


> Cherry that's exactly what I mean. She should be redirected to some other support forum. This is a marriage or committed relationship forum. She's the type of person that is a threat to that. I''m not saying she doesn't have a problem and needs help, but this is not the proper place for her.
> 
> Some people are trying to help her and others are obviously triggering, based on the comments. She should reach out for help where she's more likely to get help suited to her problem.


I sort of agree with what you are saying...

She has a problem with having A's with married men, and she's on here talking with MARRIED men and women about this. Why? It makes me question a little bit

I know she may be looking for help, but why on a site full of married people? How are we going to help her? We are the ones she's been playing around with.

At first I thought....well...she is looking for help...I'm still mad about what she's saying, but, at least she's trying to fix it?

But think about it a bit more everyone....I'm sure she could find help somewhere else if she is honest about wanting to be better

Once I talked to one of my H's little past hoochy's, and she said that she was SO sorry! and she DIDN'T know he was married! She couldn't be more sorry! She has a son of her own and she would never want to hurt a family!! Then right after that conversation...

She sent my H a naked photo of herself (and she hadn't actually talked to him in 3 months) 

Sorry eh?


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## Hopefull363 (Feb 13, 2012)

I agree Something else. If the OP were truly sorry and wanted help she wouldn't have found herself here on a marriage thread. She'd be in therapy trying to realize the pain she's caused. Not on a marriage forum causing more pain to people by triggering them.


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## CandieGirl (Apr 27, 2011)

Hopefull363 said:


> You guys should really look up the definition of hypocrite before you use it. Also, read through the posts again before you tell me she's not triggering people. I'm not triggering because I've never had to deal with infidelity in my marriage. I just feel sorry for the people that are and are listening to this nonsense. This thread serves no purpose but to incite. The OP obviously needs professional help and she's not going to get it here.


I'm not sure she needs professional help; people can and do change all the time. I did!


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## Ten_year_hubby (Jun 24, 2010)

I think the combination of heavy drinking and loose morals put the op at grave risk if she continues on this path she


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## bkaydezz (Jul 9, 2012)

Hopefull363 said:


> You guys should really look up the definition of hypocrite before you use it. Also, read through the posts again before you tell me she's not triggering people. I'm not triggering because I've never had to deal with infidelity in my marriage. I just feel sorry for the people that are and are listening to this nonsense. This thread serves no purpose but to incite. The OP obviously needs professional help and she's not going to get it here.


Nonsense? 
Peoples feelings expressed here are not nonsense. 
Thats a cheap shot to throw on your end.
This thread serves a purpose to seek out opinions and 
support as does everyone else here in TAM.

What are you doing here if she CANT recieve help on this site?

Your arguement is a lost cause.


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## bkaydezz (Jul 9, 2012)

Hopefull363 said:


> I agree Something else. If the OP were truly sorry and wanted help she wouldn't have found herself here on a marriage thread. She'd be in therapy trying to realize the pain she's caused. Not on a marriage forum causing more pain to people by triggering them.


You act as if you try to dismiss life in general.
She obviously is sorry, that is why shes trying to turn her self around.
It isnt your decision to decide whether she needs therapy or not.
That is hers entirely.
Her thread serves the puropse in this forum for 
encounters with married partners.


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## KathyBatesel (Apr 26, 2012)

I can't say I find it inappropriate for her to post here. Yes, it is "talk about marriage" but isn't that what she's doing? She is saying, "I'm the kind of person who threatens marriages and I want to stop." If it triggers others, that's not her fault (unless it happens to be an actual person she interacted with in real life.) I'd hope that both her and the people who are hurting because of people like her can benefit from honest and direct exchange. 

Michelle, you said that you pursue other men because of "The need to be wanted especially above somebody else." Do you realize that you are letting weak, dishonest men be your only source of self-esteem? What prevents you from giving yourself the kind of attention and love that would prove you are worthy, rather than relying on this kind of person?


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## bkaydezz (Jul 9, 2012)

She said she left some things out.

Its not good to be bias on soemthing that she is wanting insight on.
Anyone can ruin your marriage. not jsut women like her.
that is why its something personal towards you and what you feel to the thread because of a women like her.
thats not fair.
not everyone is the same.
and she is working on her problem.
thats why we are all here. to recieve help and understanding from others whether we disagree or not.
i dont find it odd she asks married men and women.
if thats the case then its weird for her to recieve professional help because they are married as well.


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## MaritimeGuy (Jul 28, 2012)

I have to think if someone it 'triggered' by talk of infidelity this is not the right place for them to be.


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## NaturalHeart (Nov 13, 2011)

*AWWW SWEETIE BIG HUG- now let me go back up and read your post. *


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Hopefull363 said:


> You guys should really look up the definition of hypocrite before you use it. Also, read through the posts again before you tell me she's not triggering people. I'm not triggering because I've never had to deal with infidelity in my marriage. I just feel sorry for the people that are and are listening to this nonsense. This thread serves no purpose but to incite. The OP obviously needs professional help and she's not going to get it here.


Someone else can't make YOU trigger. You do that yourself. If you don't want to trigger, don't come to a forum.

This thread serves the purpose of urging the OP to SEEK professional help, which she wasn't going to do beforehand. This thread helped her get to that point.


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## somethingelse (Jun 20, 2012)

She already went and saw a therapist. Just didn't want to talk about who she is


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Right. She gave up on therapy. And now, after coming here and our urging to be honest with them, she has rescheduled a new therapist.


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

lascarx's wife. She needed to be someone's drug. And she dumped them once she got that


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## Michelle C (Aug 15, 2012)

Hi im back again. Ok I went to my first therapy session on Friday afternoon.

I spoke to a guy who was really nice and non judgemental. I think he understood how difficult it was for me to open up as he was very patient let me go over the hour (in fact it was nearly two hours by the time I left).


He did focus in on my parents and my childhood and asked questions about other family relations. He recognised that the deaths of my nan and grandad a few years ago had a big effect on me as they were a major steadying influence in my life.

He gave me some information on how cbt works and how you can use some of its methods to question and change your own behaviours. I found this quite interesting but at the same time I also found it a little bit Janet and John level and I'm not sure at this point if it will work for me as I'm a deep thinker already ;-)

I opened up to him about how I felt about some of my affairs. He was particularly interested in how I dealt with the relationship I had with this guy in my last place of work.

I tried to tell him about the one that causes me the most guilt but I just couldn't do it, especially with him looking at me. I really *do need to get that one sorted in my head. He said it wasn't important at this stage, but he did say I would need to confront it at some point.

Although overall i thought it was a bit hit and miss ive already decided that I'm definitely *going back. He thinks maybe 6 sessions will be enough to getting me on the road to sorting myself out. Let's hope he's right 

Ive just had a look through some of he comments posted since I last visited. Again much love and thanks to those of you that have supported and defended my right to be *on here. To those that have been a bit mean. Well that's what free speech and opinions is all about I suppose. I value, respect and in some cases even agree with your opinions as well and I don't blame you or hold it against you for saying what you have said.*


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## Gaia (Apr 27, 2012)

Congrats on the therapy session michelle. I really wish you the best of luck on your new path.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Michelle C (Aug 15, 2012)

Gaia said:


> Congrats on the therapy session michelle. I really wish you the best of luck on your new path.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Thanks


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Hopefull363 said:


> I agree Something else. If the OP were truly sorry and wanted help she wouldn't have found herself here on a marriage thread. She'd be in therapy trying to realize the pain she's caused. Not on a marriage forum causing more pain to people by triggering them.


Hopefull,

You seem to be triggered more than any of the BS's here are. If this thread truly distresses you the way it seems to, then perhaps you might not want to read this thread and leave it to the folks who can handle it.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Michelle C,

CBT is not contrary to deep thinking. It's just very effective. You can also do the deep thinking along with it.

CBT gets rather quick results compared to traditional therapy, which can take years with no real changes in behavior.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Michelle C said:


> He gave me some information on how cbt works and how you can use some of its methods to question and change your own behaviours. I found this quite interesting but at the same time I also found it a little bit Janet and John level and I'm not sure at this point if it will work for me as I'm a deep thinker already ;-)


Michelle, that was a bit rude and disrespectful of the therapist. How is he supposed to know how much you know about the therapy? I know it's your standard method of keeping people at arm's length, you have to start learning to stop putting yourself above other people. He's a professional and a specialist and he knows what the hell he is doing. You are a messed up person who needs help badly. Stop putting on the act and open up and listen to him.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Re: the "6 sessions"--this isn't a numbers game. Therapy can take a long time before you start thinking you've got a handle on things. Or it might not. 

But basically it comes down to YOU recognizing you problem areas and DOING something about it to stop/change bad behaviors.

I think it's going to do you very good once you open up "about the last one" to your therapist. Seems to be a major trouble spot for you. Once you can open up about on it, I think it will be very healing.


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## Michelle C (Aug 15, 2012)

Jellybeans said:


> Re: the "6 sessions"--this isn't a numbers game. Therapy can take a long time before ou start thinking you've got a handle on things. Or it might not.
> 
> But basically it comes down to YOU recognizing you problem areas and DOING something about it to stop/change bad behaviors.
> 
> I think it's going to do you very good once you open up "about the last one" to your therapist. Seems to be a major trouble spot for you. Once you can open up about on it, I think it will be very healing.



I hope so. 

I'm not being disrespectful to the therapist either. He gave some photocopied 10 page booklet with some questions in. To be honest I found the level of questions in it a bit insulting to my intelligence level! However do I understand that it was a one size fits all booklet and wasn't tailored to me individually.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

What I mean is that you are using the information's low intelligence level as a reason that you are...above it. Stop thinking like that. If your intelligence level was so high, you would have fixed yourself BY yourself. You need to get to the point that you realize and understand and admit that you can't do this alone. 

You NEED that humility, Michelle, or this will never work.


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## Michelle C (Aug 15, 2012)

EleGirl said:


> Michelle C,
> 
> CBT is not contrary to deep thinking. It's just very effective. You can also do the deep thinking along with it.
> 
> CBT gets rather quick results compared to traditional therapy, which can take years with no real changes in behavior.



Thanks for this.

I've some some research on cbt already and I've discovered it's the therapy of choice in the uk because it is cheap and has a fairly decent success to cost ratio. I'm looking forward to my next session already. Woo hoo:smthumbup:

Im really looking forward to the part of the course when we can start examining what I can do to stop this behaviour cycle. I think the first few sessions are going to be about him understanding what I'm really like. That's going to be tough I think. Then hopefully I will be able to provide my own answers


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

You may be able to SEE what you need to do, but you will still need his help to GET there. Let him do his job. And letting him see what you are really like is VITAL for him to be able to help you. He won't judge you, Michelle. He isn't like other people. All he wants is to see you happy with yourself.


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## Michelle C (Aug 15, 2012)

turnera said:


> You may be able to SEE what you need to do, but you will still need his help to GET there. Let him do his job. And letting him see what you are really like is VITAL for him to be able to help you. He won't judge you, Michelle. He isn't like other people. All he wants is to see you happy with yourself.



I know you're right. I'm not disagreeing with what you have said.

To be honest I think it's easier talking to a bloke face to face about my stuff rather than another woman. Another woman would judge me, she wouldnt say anything but i would see it in her eyes, I'm certain of that! At least this bloke has nice kind eyes. He seems really genuine and hasnt put me on edge. I think I could probably trust him.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Michelle C said:


> I know you're right. I'm not disagreeing with what you have said.
> 
> To be honest I think it's easier talking to a bloke face to face about my stuff rather than another woman. Another woman would judge me, she wouldnt say anything but i would see it in her eyes, I'm certain of that! At least this bloke has nice kind eyes. He seems really genuine and hasnt put me on edge. I think I could probably trust him.


I find this ineresting and am not surprised. You seem to think women are out to get your or rather, you are in competition with them which isn't healthy.

In fact, I was going to suggest that you get a female therapist. you seem to have a strange relationship with men. Hence you "he has nice kind eyes."



I am pretty perceptive (unfortunately, sometimes--it's a gift and curse).

Do you have female friends?

Therapy is great because you are offloading onto someone who has ZERO connection to your life, they are completely objective. That is why it's awesome to be able to tell someone everything when they don't know you in real life.


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## MaritimeGuy (Jul 28, 2012)

Take the time to get comfortable with this new therapist. I went through some counselling when I was going through my divorce. I learned in that process that your therapist/counsellor has to be a good fit for you. If you're not comfortable with one go to another. 

As for preferring someone of the opposite sex I know I did as well. I'm far more comfortable discussing my 'feelings' with a woman than another man. I would fear the man is judging me thinking to himself 'man up buddy'. I know that's probably not the case, assuming he's a professional, however you can't help the way you feel.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

MaritimeGuy said:


> I learned in that process that your therapist/counsellor has to be a good fit for you. If you're not comfortable with one go to another.


:iagree:


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## Michelle C (Aug 15, 2012)

Jellybeans said:


> I find this ineresting and am not surprised. You seem to think women are out to get your or rather, you are in competition with them which isn't healthy.
> 
> In fact, I was going to suggest that you get a female therapist. you seem to have a strange relationship with men. Hence you "he has nice kind eyes."
> 
> ...


Ha ha don't worry im not going to jump on him. Besides between you and i, I think he may actually be gay  seriously though he seems genuinely nice and one of those non threatening people?

Yes I have female friends, 3 from uni days who I see for weekend breaks or festivals etc. we don't see that much of each other these days as apart from the three of them having boy friends/ hubsters, we live hundreds of miles apart. I was friendly with a girl I worked with who lived nearby and went to day release college with but im afraid that's all over with now

I've got a guy whose a good friend. Again from where I used to work and yes he's single. He's always there for me, bless him. :scratchhead:Infact he's coming up this weekend to stay at mine and we are going to have a fun weekend together he's going to cook me a meal, then we're off to he local pub to watch the football (we support opposite teams) so I'm really looking forward to that AND I get to show him my brand new mini cooper S which I am getting tomorrow! Courteously of the bank of dad:smthumbup: So it's pretty good at the moment.


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## Michelle C (Aug 15, 2012)

MaritimeGuy said:


> Take the time to get comfortable with this new therapist. I went through some counselling when I was going through my divorce. I learned in that process that your therapist/counsellor has to be a good fit for you. If you're not comfortable with one go to another.
> 
> As for preferring someone of the opposite sex I know I did as well. I'm far more comfortable discussing my 'feelings' with a woman than another man. I would fear the man is judging me thinking to himself 'man up buddy'. I know that's probably not the case, assuming he's a professional, however you can't help the way you feel.


Exactly!


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## Michelle C (Aug 15, 2012)

Jellybeans said:


> :iagree:


Yes. If you recall I've tried this before and it didn't work for me. I think that was down to personality and fit!


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

And attitude.


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## Michelle C (Aug 15, 2012)

turnera said:


> And attitude.


I've got plenty of attitude


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Uh, yeah. That's the problem - it's the wrong one!


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## Michelle C (Aug 15, 2012)

Ok I thought I'd bob back and let those of you interested in my situation know how I got on with my counselling.

I completed my last session on Friday last week.

I managed to be completely honest with my councillor about all of my feelings and what I have done regarding relationships etc. he was great and he didn't judge me at all, in fact he helped me realise that I have been taken advantage of by some men and that I shouldn't feel guilty about my actions as I have not abused anybody or forced anybody to do anything that they didn't want to. We are both adults and have the ability to make our own decisions about things. The only exception to his attitude on this was with the guy who had depression, however the therapist seemed to think that I was in a fragile place at the time of this relationship and therefore my judgement may have been impaired.

Basically I have the power to change my life if I want to and he taught me some techniques that have already helped my in situations when I feel vulnerable. 

I even managed to tell him about the situation with my friends Mark and Sue (which I thought I wouldn't be able to do). He was so kind and understanding about what *I did. He made me realise that although what I did was not very nice, I was ultimately trying to *trying to find happiness for myself *in a strange sort of way although I now *realise that I was trying to do it in a destructive, none constructive way.*

I am now even able to recount it to somebody else without the guilt !


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## Henri (Jun 30, 2012)

Re OP. Sounds like you are defining your self-identity on this. You could try writing down who you would like to be, how such a person would act and feel and try to follow that feeling, to get over you habit of thinking.


I haven't been able to read all the posts, sorry.


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## Drover (Jun 11, 2012)

Got in late and haven't read the whole thread, but there's something called pre-selection. It means someone is more attractive to you because someone else has already selected them. It validates your own attraction to them by telling you they must be worthwhile if someone else wants them too. But if you ONLY go after men who have been pre-selected, it sounds to me like you don't trust your own judgement to choose someone who hasn't already been validated by another woman. Self-esteem issues maybe?


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## Michelle C (Aug 15, 2012)

Drover said:


> Got in late and haven't read the whole thread, but there's something called pre-selection. It means someone is more attractive to you because someone else has already selected them. It validates your own attraction to them by telling you they must be worthwhile if someone else wants them too. But if you ONLY go after men who have been pre-selected, it sounds to me like you don't trust your own judgement to choose someone who hasn't already been validated by another woman. Self-esteem issues maybe?



Yes I do have issues about self esteem. I have discussed this with my therapist and this has helped a little. I was already aware that I have self esteem issues. I'm paranoid about loosing my hair as well. A couple of years a ago my boss found me on the floor of our hotel room picking up stray hairs and checking if they were mine and counting them. Im not bald or going bald its just a fear that I have. :-/


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

So no more therapy? Is there a limit or something?

btw, great job!


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## Michelle C (Aug 15, 2012)

turnera said:


> So no more therapy? Is there a limit or something?
> 
> btw, great job!


The councillor advised me that he felt enough progress had been made for us to discontinue the sessions. Unfortunately in England the NHS only goes so far and although I may benefit from having lots more sessions, it's oly fair that the money and resources are spent on other people who need counselling as well.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Ok. Are you going to continue to learn, though? Start reading books? I have learned SO much from just reading a psychology-based self-help book now and then. It's really shaped who I am and helped me raise an amazing daughter who's benefited from everything I've learned.


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## Michelle C (Aug 15, 2012)

turnera said:


> Ok. Are you going to continue to learn, though? Start reading books? I have learned SO much from just reading a psychology-based self-help book now and then. It's really shaped who I am and helped me raise an amazing daughter who's benefited from everything I've learned.


I've got a reading list from him. He also recommended a couple of books which aren't on the list.

He did say that I had some minor problems in my emotional build up. Apparently Ihe thinks I have problems empathising with people. He said this after I told him the big one. That I had an emotional affair with my friends husband Whilst she was recovering from cancer. I mainly did this to boost my self esteem but I also did it to get back at her after she said some really horrible things about me after we had returned from a holiday together. They eventually split up and are now divorced. that's the very quick version of it. It actually took me an hour to tell him the whole tale.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Wow. That was pretty bad. Not who you had the affair with, but that you chose to do it because of something she SAID? I'd have to agree with your IC. That's actually pretty scary that you can do that.


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## Michie (Aug 26, 2012)

Firstly it sounds like your parents cared more about their marriage drama then you, and you came second to their selfish needs. For that I am truly sorry. 
Secondly it sounds that due to this u seek importance, validation, and worth from men that have already chosen someone else then voila chose you and make you first. 

Your not first and you never will be number one to any man unless that man is available to you and only you.

You need to work through your childhood issues with a Pro.

And have a talk or write a letter to your mom and dad about how there marriage, lack of commitment and failure to make you the most special priority has hurt you.




Imo


Also your inability to empathize or put yourself in another person's shoes is frankly quite frightening. 
_Posted via Mobile Device_



Edit crap old thread still stick by my initial statement but really glad u sought help! Way to go!


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