# 8yo's Boundaries, consequences, parents not undermining each other, #2



## madimoff (Feb 17, 2010)

Further to my thread about our 8yo & discipline with Dad coming to & fro
We (dad & I) had a good conversation about how to progress my ideas - I'd defined that I thought he should have boundaries & consequences that Dad & I both agreed on, that I should be in charge when he's not here & that we should TALK to each other to make sure 8yo knows he can't pull the wool over either of us
All went seemingly well
I don't want to overreact and I must say upfront Dad's not feeling too well (cold) and son was showing the first signs of tiredness from a couple of late nights
but:
Last night at mealtime, with clear knowledge that I hold the table rulebook (poor choice of phrase, but it's down to me to decide what is and isn't acceptable table manners) as the meal progressed they were having fun - that's fine - but started to take the mickey a bit out of me getting frustrated that he wasn't behaving as well as I'd hoped
I guess I was doing the rolling eyes in frustration bit, and huffing some, so I can see that's not very helpful and not maybe over-mature, but I get the feeling that Dad just doesn't see how even when something is relatively minor (being flip) it is probably seen in the child's head as undermining the other parent & making it easier to play up with him or her on another occasion
Or am I talking so much BS or being oversensitive etc?
I mean, I am VERY glad dad & I had the talk, VERY much more positive about some of the things he's said, I guess I just want things to happen and 'gel' in son's head that Dad & I are in agreement and when something gets in the way of that I don't best like it

Forgot to say that when I got crotchety about son's behaviour, Dad looked at me, not sure if he pointed at me(think so) and said 'Anger' (we've talked about me during our relationship problems having allowed my anger to gradually develop but I sure wasn't shouting or cussing our son out or smacking or even telling him loudly to do things,) just felt I was repeatedly having to say about elbows on the table, not slurping, etc 
Bear in mind he's 8 not 4!
So Dad saying 'anger' I thought was further undermining?


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## major misfit (Oct 17, 2010)

madimoff said:


> as the meal progressed they were having fun - that's fine - but started to take the mickey a bit out of me getting frustrated that he wasn't behaving as well as I'd hoped
> I guess I was doing the rolling eyes in frustration bit, and huffing some, so I can see that's not very helpful and not maybe over-mature, but I get the feeling that Dad just doesn't see how even when something is relatively minor (being flip) it is probably seen in the child's head as undermining the other parent & making it easier to play up with him or her on another occasion


Was rolling the eyes and huffing some not qualify as undermining dad? I understand what you're trying to achieve here...but maybe it would have been good if you had ignored the shenanigans at the table, and talked to dad later? No eye rolling, no huffing...just sit quietly and calmly and let them do their thing. Apparently dad didn't think what was going on was worthy of correction. Is dad in need of correcting too?  Just askin'...


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## greeneyeddolphin (May 31, 2010)

I think by rolling your eyes and huffing, you were somewhat undermining Dad. So, I think in this case you're both guilty of undermining each other. 

Are you consistent with discipline? My 7 yr old follows basic table manners with very few reminders - maybe once or twice a month. If your son still isn't using proper manners, and you're having to constantly correct them, then it sounds like either you're not effectively teaching him the manners or he just has no respect for you and your authority over him. And it doesn't sound like Dad does much to make him respect you. 

On the other hand, how picky are you being in regard to the manners? For example, even adults can unintentionally slurp sometimes. Or forget and put their elbows on the table. If he's following the manners the majority of the time, maybe let go of the few times he doesn't. 

It really sounds like you and Dad have real trouble with discipline. You seem to each have your own ideas about when and what to discipline and how to do it, and you don't seem to communicate very well to try to find compromises. I would really suggest coming up with a list of basic rules and consequences for breaking them that the both of you can agree on, and then stick to that list when your son breaks one of the rules. That eliminates having to choose a consequence in the moment when you might be angry or upset and you're likely to disagree.


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## madimoff (Feb 17, 2010)

Ok in no order of priority (and remembering laptop issues!)

dad's table manners, however askew from those I might hope our son will have, were and are not my responsibility; he (dad) may accept my 'way' is the better for our son but ultimately it's for us both to police it which is of course an issue in itself

I honestly don't think the rolling eyes huffing was undermining dad because of our conversation the previous day which between the pair of us left me in 'table manner general politeness' charge and the pair of us in overall understanding of what would be acceptable charge 

Absolutely I think he has no respect for me and 'my' rules despite that they are supposedly backed up by dad
floundering still but thanks for the input


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Well, rules have no merit unless they are backed up by consequences. Without consequences, they are just wishes.

Elbows on the table...10 minutes taken off of Xbox time.

Stuff like that.


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## Pandakiss (Oct 29, 2010)

sometimes kids are just kids???

my oldest never said thank you or excuse me or anything in line of manners....but at school it was a different story.

all the please and thank-yous were saved for school. and all the teachers said how well mannered, how polite...i was like who?? what child?? mine?? no you must be mistaken....

so, i let go of screaming at home and just said what the rules were and left it alone. now the other children...no manners what so EVER!!

i just leave them at home..lol. no, but i watch them when we go out and later i will tell them you cant do this or that, and next time you dont you're in trouble.

at home eating habits and manners are little battles, as long as the food is on the plates, not on the walls or hidden somewhere around the room...and sitting down is about 90%...then fine.

if i spent all my time telling them how to eat and how to act...when would i eat??? my food woud be cold and hard...and if i think they are playing to much i just tell the kids, dump your plates and sleep..no talking..just bed..or belt then bed...usually next nite, they are eating and with limited talking.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Yeah, I was kind of thinking that, too. Maybe save the lessons for Sunday night dinner?


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## major misfit (Oct 17, 2010)

I have my 10yo behave at home as he would in public, FOR THE MOST PART. I expect "please" and "thank you". I expect general table manners. For me, it's about creating habits, so you don't "slip up" when you're out somewhere. I'd like to think that I'm not over the top when it comes to manners, though. I'm not going to chastise him for, say...not having his napking in his lap. I'm going to ask him if he wants whatever he's eating to stain his clothes. (I know he doesn't like stained clothes, so that's how I get him on that one). It's not a case of "put your napkin on your lap!" kinda thing.

I DO think that the huffing and eye rolling was undermining dad, in spite of the previous discussion. How would you have reacted if HE had done those things? I find it disrespectful, as well. 

My asking if dad was in need of correction too was a tongue-in-cheek question as to whether you're of the mindset that yours is the best way, and dad's is inferior. I guess tongue-in-cheek doesn't work on a message board. I'll be more up front next time. It's probably a really good thing that dad accepts your "way" as the best way.


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## madimoff (Feb 17, 2010)

I think we'll get there but it'll mean more of me & OH sitting down agreeing what is and what isn't appropriate consequences for stuff: no-one's fault but ours that they weren't properly in place, but I'd say I've been suggesting it for more than a year with til now no real understanding of its importance from dad. Anyway, progress now, however small. 
Just remembered that he says he thinks our son ignores my discipline because there are so many things I pick him up on. He says make some things really important and sound really important and son may start to behave on those points. I get that except that pretty much ALL the things I say - put pjś away, don't wee on toilet seat, dont sniff, use your dictionary, yada yada - are important and without them he'll end up a lazy slightly socially dysfunctional teenager. And all the mums I know are constantly talking about the same things too so it's not just me!


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## greeneyeddolphin (May 31, 2010)

madimoff said:


> I think we'll get there but it'll mean more of me & OH sitting down agreeing what is and what isn't appropriate consequences for stuff: no-one's fault but ours that they weren't properly in place, but I'd say I've been suggesting it for more than a year with til now no real understanding of its importance from dad. Anyway, progress now, however small.
> Just remembered that he says he thinks our son ignores my discipline because there are so many things I pick him up on. He says make some things really important and sound really important and son may start to behave on those points. I get that except that pretty much ALL the things I say - put pjś away, don't wee on toilet seat, dont sniff, use your dictionary, yada yada - are important and without them he'll end up a lazy slightly socially dysfunctional teenager. And all the mums I know are constantly talking about the same things too so it's not just me!


Ok, see, that's where you're wrong. Not putting his pjs away is not going to make him a lazy slightly socially dysfunctional teen. Nor will not using his dictionary. Are those things you'd like him to do? Sure. But if you're also trying to teach him not to urinate on the toilet seat or to be respectful of adults, letting go of the pjs and some other rather unimportant things might be a good idea. As the bigger issues come under control then you begin working on the other less important issues, and eventually he will have learned everything you want him to learn. 

It doesn't happen overnight. And when he's constantly under a barrage of "do this, don't do this" it can get very confusing for him to not only try to remember, but to determine which things are really important and which ones aren't.


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## madimoff (Feb 17, 2010)

Hmmph
Don't you just hate it when someone tells you something you don't want to hear but your gut goes *she might just be right you know* 
Thanks - grudgingly!!!!!


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## madimoff (Feb 17, 2010)

Just by way of bump}update}whatever, 2nd night OH away & son & I had meal at dining table together 1st time in ages, NO complaint from him that I'd turned tv off, conversation flowed, he even volunteered an apology when he did some minor table-manner infraction!
Not everything's been perfect - he was late home after going to a friend's yesterday & this evening I insisted on reducing wii time by 5min every time I had to remind him about homework or whatever, but that too went (relatively) smoothly
So far so good


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