# She wants a trial separation



## Chronotrigger (Feb 6, 2020)

My wife of 9 years says she wants us to separate. This is the second marriage for us both. Her reason: she is terrified of turning 50 next year and wants to see what it's like living on her own. She also doesn't want to have to be expected to care for anyone but herself as she says she's been taking care of others her whole life. We have no children together. She has a son who is now an adult who recently left to be on his own. I have two teenage kids from my first marriage. This is where my confusion starts:
1. She wants us to continue to date and have sex during the separation
2. She wants us to live in our own places but says she wants to be able to come visit me, even stay over at my place from time to time
3. She insists there is no other man. But says she wants to be able to go out on dates if she is asked. She says that doesn't mean having sex, but won't rule out that it could happen
4. She says this is about freedom for her to do what she wants when she wants without having to justify it to anyone.

My questions...

1. Is she just tired of being married and wants to be a free spirit for a while to see if she likes it?
2. She is wearing her wedding ring on the opposite hand now. What does that mean?
3. She says she still is in love with me and cares about me, but says she needs to figure out how to love herself by putting herself first in her life. Is she still in love? How do you do this to someone you love?
4. Is she planning on dating as part of her freedom plan, or is she trying to replace me?


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## Torninhalf (Nov 4, 2018)

She wants to keep you on the side while she samples other men.


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

You’re Plan B. Plan A is whatever else is out there.


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## Trident (May 23, 2018)

Question 5. Why do people sign contracts promising lifetime commitment again after the first lifetime commitment didn't last a lifetime?

People change. Why expect it to be any different the next go around?

There is literally no upside to marriage. And a whole bunch of down.


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

Chronotrigger said:


> My wife of 9 years says she wants us to separate. This is the second marriage for us both. Her reason: she is terrified of turning 50 next year and wants to see what it's like living on her own. She also doesn't want to have to be expected to care for anyone but herself as she says she's been taking care of others her whole life. We have no children together. She has a son who is now an adult who recently left to be on his own. I have two teenage kids from my first marriage. This is where my confusion starts:
> 1. She wants us to continue to date and have sex during the separation
> 2. She wants us to live in our own places but says she wants to be able to come visit me, even stay over at my place from time to time
> 3. She insists there is no other man. But says she wants to be able to go out on dates if she is asked. She says that doesn't mean having sex, but won't rule out that it could happen
> ...


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## DudeInProgress (Jun 10, 2019)

Your wife is telling you very clearly that she does not want you anymore, does not respect you, is not in love with you, and wants to explore/ease into a life without you. She is looking to replace you but wants to keep you as her back up plan. Her actions and stated intent make this crystal clear. Everything else she’s telling you is ********.

You need to take control of your situation immediately and not let your wife dictate the terms of your marriage and eventual divorce - because that’s where it’s going.

DO NOT allow a separation, period.
A separation is only a way to:
1. ease into a divorce at her convenience
and
2. try out another man/men.

Do not allow a separation. She can work on her issues at home, as your wife. You can give her some space without a separation (which does not include dating other men for ****s sake).

She’s either your wife or she’s not. Do not tolerate anything in between.
If she insists she needs a separation to figure things out, YOU file for divorce immediately - because that is what she is choosing. She just wants to do it at her convenience.

If she insists on a separation, she is choosing to no longer be your wife, and she has flat out told you that she won’t be behaving like your wife.
You need to act immediately in your own best interest.

to your questions:
1. No. She’s tired of being married to YOU
2. It means nothing.
3. ********, Don’t be a fool, she is stringing you along. Women do not do this with men they are in love with or respect.
4. First - Who cares, Is there any scenario where are you are OK with your wife dating other men? Second - Yes, she is looking to replace you.


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## rockon (May 18, 2016)

Openminded said:


> You’re Plan B. Plan A is whatever else is out there.


This.


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## Prodigal (Feb 5, 2011)

Chronotrigger said:


> 3. She insists there is no other man. But says she wants to be able to go out on dates if she is asked. She says that doesn't mean having sex, but won't rule out that it could happen


CLASSIC cake-eater mentality.



Chronotrigger said:


> Is she still in love? How do you do this to someone you love?


Yeah, she's "in love" alright - with herself and her own selfish desires. No, you don't do this, or anything remotely like it, to someone you love.

Frankly, I'm baffled as to why you haven't gone nuclear and torpedoed her ass. Complete and utter disrespect for you and the marriage. Instead of asking us whether or not she's "in love" with you, I'd suggest you seek the counsel of a competent attorney ASAP.


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## Marc878 (Aug 26, 2015)

Check your phone bill. Save yourself. Get an attorney and get the D started.

You go down this path you will effectively make yourself her chump.

Download and read “No More Mr Nice Guy” by glover. It’s a free pdf and short.


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## Marc878 (Aug 26, 2015)

Chronotrigger said:


> My wife of 9 years says she wants us to separate. This is the second marriage for us both. Her reason: she is terrified of turning 50 next year and wants to see what it's like living on her own. She also doesn't want to have to be expected to care for anyone but herself as she says she's been taking care of others her whole life. We have no children together. She has a son who is now an adult who recently left to be on his own. I have two teenage kids from my first marriage. This is where my confusion starts:
> 1. She wants us to continue to date and have sex during the separation
> 2. She wants us to live in our own places but says she wants to be able to come visit me, even stay over at my place from time to time
> 3. She insists there is no other man. But says she wants to be able to go out on dates if she is asked. She says that doesn't mean having sex, but won't rule out that it could happen
> ...


Bud only a man with no self respect or worth would consider this. Better wake up now.


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

Let’s condense this:
Hey chump whom is handy but I don’t love or respect, I want to move out and duck other guys and live like a single woman but keep you doing all the **** jobs the other non-chumps won’t do for me. How’s about it honey?

you’re asking if she still loves you? Damn dude. Just...... damn.,,


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

Trident said:


> Question 5. Why do people sign contracts promising lifetime commitment again after the first lifetime commitment didn't last a lifetime?
> 
> People change. Why expect it to be any different the next go around?
> 
> There is literally no upside to marriage. And a whole bunch of down.


There are countless upsides to marriage.


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## Twodecades (Apr 4, 2021)

She is an adult who made an adult decision to marry you. She's turning 50, not 15. Her terms are ridiculous. Do not agree to a separation. I'm so sorry she's being so selfish.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

I believe everything she says. She is tired of answering to people and hasn't had any time for herself. She wants to be on her own, or at least try it. I'm a big believer that everyone should be on their own totally, living alone, for at least a couple of years before they decide to commit to family. It's hard to even know who you are when you're not under the influence of someone else until you've experienced following your own lead for a change. 

It's not a good thing for you because you'll have to assume she dated and maybe slept with someone (at her age, no one is about to date without sex on the horizon -- or any age really). And then it will be ruined for you even if she decides the independent life isn't for her. Just be sure she understands that if you separate, you are also free to date. You'd be within your rights to just tell her you're totally against it. I hope she gets to feel what it's like being independent, personally, but I'm not her husband. I wouldn't like that much.


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## DudeInProgress (Jun 10, 2019)

Evinrude58 said:


> Let’s condense this:
> Hey chump whom is handy but I don’t love or respect, I want to move out and duck other guys and live like a single woman but keep you doing all the **** jobs the other non-chumps won’t do for me. How’s about it honey?
> 
> you’re asking if she still loves you? Damn dude. Just...... damn.,,


+1
Effective and accurate summary of the situation, and with far greater brevity than I can usually manage.


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## DudeInProgress (Jun 10, 2019)

DownByTheRiver said:


> I believe everything she says. She is tired of answering to people and hasn't had any time for herself. She wants to be on her own, or at least try it. I'm a big believer that everyone should be on their own totally, living alone, for at least a couple of years before they decide to commit to family. It's hard to even know who you are when you're not under the influence of someone else until you've experienced following your own lead for a change.
> 
> It's not a good thing for you because you'll have to assume she dated and maybe slept with someone (at her age, no one is about to date without sex on the horizon -- or any age really). And then it will be ruined for you even if she decides the independent life isn't for her. Just be sure she understands that if you separate, you are also free to date. You'd be within your rights to just tell her you're totally against it. I hope she gets to feel what it's like being independent, personally, but I'm not her husband. I wouldn't like that much.


Just no. What you describe above is a woman not suited for marriage. And only an idiot would accept such a proposition from his wife.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

DudeInProgress said:


> Just no. What you describe above is a woman not suited for marriage. And only an idiot would accept such a proposition from his wife.


Exactly. She no longer feels she wants to do marriage.


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## frusdil (Sep 5, 2013)

Absolutely no separation. How dare she ask that of you. What she's asking is for you to essentially sit at home while she dates and sleeps with other men. Yuck.

Tell her it's marriage or divorce. It's that black or white. NO grey.


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## DudeInProgress (Jun 10, 2019)

DownByTheRiver said:


> Exactly. She no longer feels she wants to do marriage.


Which is fine, but he needs to act accordingly.

Which is to tell her it’s over and not dignify her proposal with any consideration or negotiation whatsoever.


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## DudeInProgress (Jun 10, 2019)

DownByTheRiver said:


> Exactly. She no longer feels she wants to do marriage.


And I suspect it’s more that she no longer no longer wants to do marriage with HIM. If she was actually in love with him, she would not be suggesting this.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

DudeInProgress said:


> And I suspect it’s more that she no longer no longer wants to do marriage with HIM. If she was actually in love with him, she would not be suggesting this.


I don't suspect she want to keep up a sexual relationship with him during separation at all if she was thoroughly sick of him. I think she's just wanting to get out from under obligation and responsibility.


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

I'm curious...

What happened in her first marriage.
The truth, the unvarnished truth.

I suspect a pattern is emerging here, no, it emerged long time ago.

She is not, was never marriage material. 

She is too independent, too fickle. 

You were kind enough to raise her son, and _he is now gone.
H_e was the anchor that held her in this marriage.
Oh gee, _now she is going..... gone._

It seems, to her....

Your kids and you are too much work, and are bothersome.
Husband, you did serve your purpose, uh, goodbye, hey, no hard feelings.

I get the way she feels, I do.
But, I do not like it, nope, not a bit.

Let her go, without showing any malice, and without you fighting for the marriage.

Cut her totally out of your life. 

I suspect she was an asset during those nine years. 
Give her credit for that.

Now, at least to you, she has depreciated herself to having zero worth.

Life goes on.....with her, or, without her. 

Life goes on for all of us, some of us with dignity.


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

DownByTheRiver said:


> I believe everything she says. She is tired of answering to people and hasn't had any time for herself. She wants to be on her own, or at least try it. I'm a big believer that everyone should be on their own totally, living alone, for at least a couple of years before they decide to commit to family. It's hard to even know who you are when you're not under the influence of someone else until you've experienced following your own lead for a change.
> 
> It's not a good thing for you because you'll have to assume she dated and maybe slept with someone (at her age, no one is about to date without sex on the horizon -- or any age really). And then it will be ruined for you even if she decides the independent life isn't for her. Just be sure she understands that if you separate, you are also free to date. You'd be within your rights to just tell her you're totally against it. I hope she gets to feel what it's like being independent, personally, but I'm not her husband. I wouldn't like that much.


I strongly disagree. She’s wanting to try out a new penis. Maybe even several. If he falls for this, I don’t even know what to say. He must be one of these new metrosexual guys in touch with his feminine side if he agrees to this request if hers which is not only unreasonable but shows that she believes him to be weak, stupid, naive, and that she has no love for him whatsoever.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

I would agree wholeheartedly to the separation - with the full intention of it being permanent and as a prelude to divorce! 

Like seriously, it's obvious the relationship is already dead with those terms.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

Evinrude58 said:


> I strongly disagree. She’s wanting to try out a new penis. Maybe even several. If he falls for this, I don’t even know what to say. He must be one of these new metrosexual guys in touch with his feminine side if he agrees to this request if hers which is not only unreasonable but shows that she believes him to be weak, stupid, naive, and that she has no love for him whatsoever.


Men always think that because that's the main reason they stray. It's projection. Women don't all think that way.


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

I hope OP is not stupid enough to try to talk or discuss this with her. I would totally respect him if he comes home, hands her divorce papers and says “nope” and walks off. There is nothing more to say in this situation other thAn “bye”, and I left the good off on purpose.


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## DudeInProgress (Jun 10, 2019)

DownByTheRiver said:


> I don't suspect she want to keep up a sexual relationship with him during separation at all if she was thoroughly sick of him. I think she's just wanting to get out from under obligation and responsibility.


That’s what she’s telling him now. Not what is likely to actually happen. Plus, she still wants to keep him around as Plan B in the event that she doesn’t do as well as she thinks out on the market


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

DownByTheRiver said:


> Men always think that because that's the main reason they stray. It's projection. Women don't all think that way.


I disagree. Strongly.


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

My beef is not, her tiring of married life, and wanting to be free of family restrictions.
My beef is that she has wasted nine years of OP's life.
My beef is her wanting to separate, to date others and to string OP along.

To keep the poor man in limbo. Mr. Nice Guy in limbo. 
Selfish,
Umm.

With many women, it is less the sexual intercourse and more the romance they seek.

And, of course, not needing to work, clean and cook for others; plan for others, none of whom are her blood. 

She wants out....it happens.
She went about this in a careless, cold and tawdry way.


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## Tested_by_stress (Apr 1, 2021)

She's lying her face off OP. She either has someone already or has someone on her radar. File for divorce and rid yourself of the situation.


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## theloveofmylife (Jan 5, 2021)

Get a free consultation with an attorney. At least look up divorce laws for your state. Separation for a certain length of time may be a requirement for filing for divorce. Trial separation could also be code for trial run for the new guy.

It's sad that you're going through this, but I think you know the answers to your questions.


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## manowar (Oct 3, 2020)

Chronotrigger said:


> My wife of 9 years says she wants us to separate. This is the second marriage for us both. Her reason: she is terrified of turning 50 next year and wants to see what it's like living on her own. She also doesn't want to have to be expected to care for anyone but herself as she says she's been taking care of others her whole life. We have no children together. She has a son who is now an adult who recently left to be on his own. I have two teenage kids from my first marriage. This is where my confusion starts:
> 1. She wants us to continue to date and have sex during the separation
> 2. She wants us to live in our own places but says she wants to be able to come visit me, even stay over at my place from time to time
> 3. She insists there is no other man. But says she wants to be able to go out on dates if she is asked. She says that doesn't mean having sex, but won't rule out that it could happen
> ...



this is one of the most pathetic things I've read on here. And I've read a lot. Definitely a top 5.

You were played for 9 years as a Provider (Download* Practical Female psychology for the practical man* and pay special attention to Chp 4 on the LOVER/PROVIDER Dichotomy). You're the stable guy for the family. Now she wants those Lovers she pines for in her past. *This is no time to be the Nice Guy who loves his wife with all his heart*. Yep you're a nice guy. This is what happens. You have to get out in front of this. Hit her quick with divorce papers. See what kind of reaction you get. Either she'll go forward with this nutty fairytale or be a fking wife. *You need to stand up to her for once!* Unless you like this idea. Hell, you don't want to disappoint your princess. 

While you're at it - download *NO More Mr. Nice Guy*. I'm confident it applies.

Does she have a promiscuous past that you overlooked because hey that was her past life and " I have no right to make judgments?" Did she cheat during her first marriage. Did she cheat on you? I think there's a high probability she did. But that was ok with you because you found love. *You ignored all the red flags.* Oh, they were there. How do I know? Look at the crap you're getting now. She wants BBB - bigger badder better. That's your answer. It should be pretty clear. She's afraid her looks are fading and she won't be able to attract the guy she thinks she can get. She's going to be mistaken here. She's going to find things a little rougher than she expected. Oh there will be nice guys aplenty. 

She's *abandoning* you and your kids. She doesn't give a shyt! It's all about her. The way you always treated her. Like a Princess.


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## ElOtro (Apr 4, 2021)

Give her as complete and permanent what she asks as partial and temporal.
That would honour both her freedom and also yours. 
She may object your plan, it´s not what she haves in mind.
There is no need for you to negotiate "safe conditions" for her monkey branching.


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## manowar (Oct 3, 2020)

OP are you going to help her move?


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## jlg07 (Feb 24, 2017)

DownByTheRiver said:


> Men always think that because that's the main reason they stray. It's projection. Women don't all think that way.


Except she ALREADY SAYS she wants to date and have sex with other men. IF she left THAT part out, then I would maybe agree with you, but not in this particular case.


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## No Longer Lonely Husband (Nov 3, 2015)

You already know,the answer as to the appropriate course of action. These fine posters just affirmed what you already know. Set her free.


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

She’s lying — there’s someone else.

Tell her you’re fine with the separation but that it won’t be a trial for anything other than divorce.


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## rockon (May 18, 2016)

TJ on

Gus is back!😀

TJ off


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## manfromlamancha (Jul 4, 2013)

OK so lets be clear her. Based on what happened last year and now:


She has weight loss and loses a lot of weight. She looks beautiful now.


She has screwed her friend Jim many times and was still in touch with him during your marriage even though you did not approve.


You think she is not interested in him because he is not attractive and not marriage material - let me tell you are very wrong here - she loves having sex with him no matter what he looks like or if he has failed marriages. I would go so far as to say she prefers sex with him.


Her "break up" with him last year was false and for your benefit only. We all could see that then.


She gets hit on on Facebook several times.


Her son has flown the coup and she is free again.


You represent stability and that is what she is asking you to continue to do while she enjoys her freedom. Her not ruling out sex with other guys should make this very clear to you.

So why on earth do you think you have anything that even resembles a relationship let alone a marriage here???
Kick her ass out as soon as you have lawyered up. You know what she is doing and going to do. By the way, how is Jim doing? He is perfect for her now. Surely you can now see this clearly (you could not last year).


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

DudeInProgress said:


> That’s what she’s telling him now. Not what is likely to actually happen. Plus, she still wants to keep him around as Plan B in the event that she doesn’t do as well as she thinks out on the market


Honestly it doesn't really sound like always having to have a man is her agenda. To me it sounds like the last thing she wants right now is to partner up again but sometime in the future she likely will but maybe not on a big commitment like marriage. This is kind of a perfect example of how some people don't listen to what a woman is telling them and this woman is telling them she's tired of taking care of everybody and wants to be on her own for a while. But she was honest with him that she might date in the future. I don't see any reason why he would sit still for this but I think he's going to have to let her go. Of course there's always the chance that a separation where he can date to might appeal to him.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

jlg07 said:


> Except she ALREADY SAYS she wants to date and have sex with other men. IF she left THAT part out, then I would maybe agree with you, but not in this particular case.


Acording to what HE said she isn't ready for anything like that but she wants to keep the option open for the future which if you're separating of course you would and so I just suggest he does the same. 

Men just can't fathom that sex isn't the number one priority of women like it is men. To me she just sounds like someone who's tired and burned out and wants to do things for herself for a while. Whether she'll like to do it for a long time no one knows but I think it's going to be a moot point because I think he's going to suspect that she's banging someone whether she is or not no matter what she says or anyone else says.


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## VladDracul (Jun 17, 2016)

Chrono, I think you probably already know the score. If the gal wants here freedom, one of two thing is going to happen. You give it to her or she takes it. A much cleaner thing for you to do is divorce her, and take her up on her offer for booty call, as you spend a little time surveying the landscape for younger chicks. I make sure all dates with her includes booty call. I don't think I can recommend her staying over unless you're going to be tapping it throughout the evening. Its going to seem like an eternity anyway between the time you hit it for the last time that day and when she eventually gets up to go home.
At any rate you have an opportunity to make some good lemonade out of the lemons she handing you and won't have to constantly hearing talking and bellyaching after getting your own place.


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## Jamieboy (Jan 14, 2021)

Just read your other thread, she's banging Jim or at least planning to, you are plan B. 

Shes looking to try out her new bod on the general populace and if it turns out she's not hot enough to attract the man she now thinks she deserves. She'll come back to you.

One thing that stuck out in your last thread is when you have the kids she buggers off to the relatives.

She sounds like a total narcissistic. Get some self respect and kick her ass out. She's making a fool of you


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## DudeInProgress (Jun 10, 2019)

DownByTheRiver said:


> Honestly it doesn't really sound like always having to have a man is her agenda. To me it sounds like the last thing she wants right now is to partner up again but sometime in the future she likely will but maybe not on a big commitment like marriage. This is kind of a perfect example of how some people don't listen to what a woman is telling them and this woman is telling them she's tired of taking care of everybody and wants to be on her own for a while. But she was honest with him that she might date in the future. I don't see any reason why he would sit still for this but I think he's going to have to let her go. Of course there's always the chance that a separation where he can date to might appeal to him.


Whatever her motivation, her separation plan is bad for him and he’d be a fool to tolerate it. 
So yes, he’s going to lose her regardless. He can either maintain some dignity and do it quickly on his terms, or slowly and pathetically on hers.


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## frenchpaddy (May 31, 2021)

I agree it is over , and she still likes one side of the op but can't take all so wants out and she kind of wants him on her terms but as you point out this will just become a roll coaster for the op because when she has her new freedom and she wants op as a sex friend and friend she will have her old friend Jim over and she might even have him also as a sex friend so it has been dragged on with a long time because the op is afraid of been alone and willing to except anything other than coming home to a empty house ,


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## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

She's telling you she doesn't want the responsibilities of marriage and being a step mom. She wants to only have to take care of herself. So let her. File for divorce and no helping her with anything - and I mean ANYTHING. No schlepping boxes to her car, giving advice - nothing. She wants to be a single woman - let her deal with it all. You are not her friend or orbiter. 

You have been fired so take the hint and get on with the business of taking care of yourself and your kids. They will thank you.


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## hamadryad (Aug 30, 2020)

Blondilocks said:


> She's telling you she doesn't want the responsibilities of marriage and being a step mom. She wants to only have to take care of herself. So let her. File for divorce and no helping her with anything - and I mean ANYTHING. No schlepping boxes to her car, giving advice - nothing. She wants to be a single woman - let her deal with it all. You are not her friend or orbiter.
> 
> You have been fired so take the hint and get on with the business of taking care of yourself and your kids. They will thank you.



Yeah...this....

We all can sit around and ponder the reasons and rationale, but the bottom line is she isn't happy and wants this life to end...The "separation" is likely just so she doesn't have to immediately blow it all up and can do it in stages...But the end result is the same...

If its a second go round, then there shouldn't be much in the way of financial intertwining and kids, etc...This should be easy...OP should have just done what a buddy of mine did...His wife made the same proposition, almost with the same terms as I recall him telling me...He said nothing...Walked into his home office and purchased/downloaded a divorce off LegalZoom and handed it to her and listed the house a few days later...She was kinda shocked, and they were fully divorced in a matter of a month and a half...When there are no kids(they didn't have either), these things aren't that difficult, IME...Ironically he wound up with a new woman in a short time and is happier than I can recall, I don't know what the ex wife is doing, but suffice to say, she didn't expect him to do what he did..and I think it was great..,..don't play games with her or engage in some "pick me" garbage....

Don't try to rationalize it...She's done...It doesn't matter....My guess is she met someone and wants to try that out, but didn't want to until she got a pass from you(hence the separation)...Who knows? maybe she figured if that didn't work, she can always have a safe landing with you...Don't do that!! Its a horrible position to put yourself in and you will regret it for eternity....


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

You were a chapter in her life. 

She did not even finish it, leaving it mid-sentence.

Yes, she could have waited until OP's teens were also launched, she didn't.

Everyone is entitled to change their mind, and at any time.

Yet, doing so, hurts.

She did not appear hurt.......just relieved.


Her.....

I am separating from you. I need this.
We might divorce, might not, who knows!
I will come by, now and then, again, to talk and reminisce and to relieve your sexual needs.

Don't be hurt by my actions.

..................................................................

The quitter is almost always the villain.

In this case, I am not able to wash this wife's feet.
Yet, I do understand her thinking.

There is no universal justice in life.

Yes, some are born with better odds.
Yes, some have less developed consciences.
Yes, we all have our own needs.

Yes, we are here (in this body, time and place), one time. 
So, make the best of your short life.
Doing so, this, will hurt others.

_
King Brian-_


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## Talker67 (Apr 7, 2016)

kick her ass out. cold turkey, its the only way.

she may come crawling back in a year, at which time you can decide it you actually WANT her back


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## 346745 (Oct 7, 2020)

3. She insists there is no other man. But says she wants to be able to go out on dates if she is asked. She says that doesn't mean having sex, but won't rule out that it could happen

Come on. Wake up. Your wife wants to f--- new c--- and probably suck some, too. She told you as much. Screw the trial separation so she can fool around. Call a divorce attorney ASAP


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## Rob_1 (Sep 8, 2017)

I doubt very much this OP coming back. You can tell from a mile away that he's one of those men that can't handle the truth being told in his face. Specially when they are ruled by fear; fear of being alone, fear of what's next, fear of losing what he thought was his, fears because only a man that has self respect would not put up for one moment being told to be a cuckold, a plan B.

For his own good, let's hope I'm wrong.


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## ElOtro (Apr 4, 2021)

DownByTheRiver said:


> I believe everything she says. She is tired of answering to people and hasn't had any time for herself. She wants to be on her own, or at least try it. I'm a big believer that everyone should be on their own totally, living alone, for at least a couple of years before they decide to commit to family. It's hard to even know who you are when you're not under the influence of someone else until you've experienced following your own lead for a change.
> 
> It's not a good thing for you because you'll have to assume she dated and maybe slept with someone (at her age, no one is about to date without sex on the horizon -- or any age really). And then it will be ruined for you even if she decides the independent life isn't for her. Just be sure she understands that if you separate, you are also free to date. You'd be within your rights to just tell her you're totally against it. I hope she gets to feel what it's like being independent, personally, but I'm not her husband. I wouldn't like that much.





DownByTheRiver said:


> I don't suspect she want to keep up a sexual relationship with him during separation at all if she was thoroughly sick of him. I think she's just wanting to get out from under obligation and responsibility.





DownByTheRiver said:


> Men always think that because that's the main reason they stray. It's projection. Women don't all think that way.





DownByTheRiver said:


> Honestly it doesn't really sound like always having to have a man is her agenda. To me it sounds like the last thing she wants right now is to partner up again but sometime in the future she likely will but maybe not on a big commitment like marriage. This is kind of a perfect example of how some people don't listen to what a woman is telling them and this woman is telling them she's tired of taking care of everybody and wants to be on her own for a while. But she was honest with him that she might date in the future. I don't see any reason why he would sit still for this but I think he's going to have to let her go. Of course there's always the chance that a separation where he can date to might appeal to him.





DownByTheRiver said:


> Acording to what HE said she isn't ready for anything like that but she wants to keep the option open for the future which if you're separating of course you would and so I just suggest he does the same.
> 
> Men just can't fathom that sex isn't the number one priority of women like it is men. To me she just sounds like someone who's tired and burned out and wants to do things for herself for a while. Whether she'll like to do it for a long time no one knows but I think it's going to be a moot point because I think he's going to suspect that she's banging someone whether she is or not no matter what she says or anyone else says.


All of the quoted posts or parts of them (and besides there advices) are implicitly focusing en her mind / intentions / reasons / agenda (wht may or not be there, what is the main for a woman as supposedly different from men, if she is honest or lying about what is in her mind) "et coeteris". 
And they MAY be right or not. _The point is that it may be true and also irrelevant._

An alternative view on the same may show:

- A single man or woman may also date or not, flirt or not, have sex or not. That´s almost solely on them. So this is more about the potential, the freedom to make it / to allow it to happen...or not.
For the ones in a monogamous / exclusive relationship this is not ussually the available options.

- So, all things considered (the "married" life but also potential dates and potential sex) what she is asking for is the right to have the rights of a single one. So if she choose to make them be or not.

- That would be ethically within her rights if solved in a clean way by divorce. But that would be the responsable freedom of adults and not what she is asking for.

- She, like teen, wants a play break, a school recess, vacations from the relationship......with the option to come back when...ready if it happens. She can´t even give guarantees on what she may want along it. The one in charge of waiting for her while unilaterally granting a soft landing coming back is him.

- Whatever are her reasons and priorities as concious ones, the factual meaning of her wishes is not far from wayward thinking / cake eating / monkey branching. 
By the way, it would be the same if asked by a man.

- Again, she may be sincere but certainly not with some deeper "intellectual honesty".

Finally, as m only personal and probably biased already said advice I would give her as permanent and complete waht she asks as temporal and partial.
And this as not negotiable even if she takes back her proposal.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

ElOtro said:


> All of the quoted posts or parts of them (and besides there advices) are implicitly focusing en her mind / intentions / reasons / agenda (wht may or not be there, what is the main for a woman as supposedly different from men, if she is honest or lying about what is in her mind) "et coeteris".
> And they MAY be right or not. _The point is that it may be true and also irrelevant._
> 
> An alternative view on the same may show:
> ...


Some good points but I don't think she's asking for a sex Play break. I think she's tired of being involved and obligated to other people right now and wants out on her own so she has some control over her own life. 

Of course we don't know the conversations going between the husband and wife on this but I'm sure no rational woman would expect him to agree to her dating and I don't believe that that was the point of why she's asking for the separation and that that probably came up during the discussion. I'm sure she expected to be cut loose. I think most states require separation before divorce so the only reason she may be talking about separation is because she wants divorce as the next logical step.


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## Twodecades (Apr 4, 2021)

DownByTheRiver said:


> Some good points but I don't think she's asking for a sex Play break. I think she's tired of being involved and obligated to other people right now and wants out on her own so she has some control over her own life.
> 
> Of course we don't know the conversations going between the husband and wife on this but I'm sure no rational woman would expect him to agree to her dating and I don't believe that that was the point of why she's asking for the separation and that that probably came up during the discussion. I'm sure she expected to be cut loose. I think most states require separation before divorce so the only reason she may be talking about separation is because she wants divorce as the next logical step.


I kind of wondered if she was mentioned the sleeping over, etc. as a way of easing him into the separation with less push back, not because she necessarily intends to do it. But then again, she was pretty blunt in what she wants, so who knows.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

Twodecades said:


> I kind of wondered if she was mentioned the sleeping over, etc. as a way of easing him into the separation with less push back, not because she necessarily intends to do it. But then again, she was pretty blunt in what she wants, so who knows.


I mean, that is why I believe she just wants out from under caretaking and obligation for probably the first time in her life and believe that is mainly why she's getting out. I think she cares about him and I'm sure everyone involved but she has decided she needs a lifestyle change. She wants to make her own decisions as a free woman, and that will include whether or not she wants to date anyone (I don't see her jumping into any new commitment because that's what she's tired of) or whether she still wants to spend time with her soon-to-be ex. Anyone who asks for separation knows logically that divorce is pretty much guaranteed. So they may as well address divorce and keep it clean and legal. And then if there's anything left, great. If not, they are both free to move on. It will be less confusing for the kids.

I do agree with other posters that once separated, they should be on their way to legal divorce, get attorneys to separate money right away so there's no ambiguity there that she's still HIS obligation. And I agree that he doesn't need to get ugly about it since that doesn't seem to be his nature, kudos to him, but that he doesn't need to be doing things for her, though as long as they're married, he will have ownership in maintaining the home, cars, etc, which is why he needs to get himself to an attorney and file papers right away because the wait is long enough and the limbo is awkward and confusing and resentments accrue because you're still legally tied through the property and both have some obligations until that divorce is final and property divided.


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## BigDaddyNY (May 19, 2021)

Chronotrigger said:


> My wife of 9 years says she wants us to separate. This is the second marriage for us both. Her reason: she is terrified of turning 50 next year and wants to see what it's like living on her own. She also doesn't want to have to be expected to care for anyone but herself as she says she's been taking care of others her whole life. We have no children together. She has a son who is now an adult who recently left to be on his own. I have two teenage kids from my first marriage. This is where my confusion starts:
> 1. She wants us to continue to date and have sex during the separation
> 2. She wants us to live in our own places but says she wants to be able to come visit me, even stay over at my place from time to time
> 3. She insists there is no other man. But says she wants to be able to go out on dates if she is asked. She says that doesn't mean having sex, but won't rule out that it could happen
> ...


All of this is 100% unacceptable in a marriage. This separation is an end of the marriage. She moved her ring so guys know she is available. In this arrangement she will date and she will get laid, simple as that. 

Did you ask if it was okay for you to find yourself, date and have sex if you so desire? 

My response to this is we either stay together and get counseling to sort this our or you can have all the freedom you want when we divorce.


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## ElOtro (Apr 4, 2021)

DownByTheRiver said:


> Some good points but I don't think she's asking for a sex Play break. I think she's tired of being involved and obligated to other people right now and wants out on her own so she has some control over her own life.
> 
> Of course we don't know the conversations going between the husband and wife on this but I'm sure no rational woman would expect him to agree to her dating and I don't believe that that was the point of why she's asking for the separation and that that probably came up during the discussion. I'm sure she expected to be cut loose. I think most states require separation before divorce so the only reason she may be talking about separation is because she wants divorce as the next logical step.


Your quoted post is a clear confirmation of the good fit of mine.

You and some others focus in her intentions, agenda, purposes, mind.
And you may be quite right.
And what I´ve said and I´m saying again is all that jazz even if totally true is not enough relevant.

She may not be planning or not even making of sex (or flirting or romantic / emotional interactions or you name it) the main or even the probable thing.and what I´m saying remains true.
As she even said explicitily, the whole package of being in "control over her own life" entails the validity of her eventual / potential freedom of unilaterally decide if to do it or not. That´s what any single is entitled to with everybody blessings.
And not exactly an option for the ones in an exclusive relationship, IMO.

Is it what she haves in mind? I don´t know and it´s of little use to know it.
Is it what she claims as her right to eventually choose about? Yes, she said so (and I would inferr the same anyhow).

In summary, what she is asking for is being single, whith the implied rights in all potential areas of life.
Why not to give her what she wish for?

But........wahtever is honestly in her mind, her husband may not want to be the keeper of his solely own limbo.
And may, consequently choose for a more clean, less ambiguous solution for the sake of his dignity and mental helth.
That is, to divorce.

Once more, I would say the same regardles the genders of the involved.


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## 346745 (Oct 7, 2020)

DownByTheRiver said:


> I mean, that is why I believe she just wants out from under caretaking and obligation for probably the first time in her life and believe that is mainly why she's getting out. I think she cares about him and I'm sure everyone involved but she has decided she needs a lifestyle change. She wants to make her own decisions as a free woman, and that will include whether or not she wants to date anyone (I don't see her jumping into any new commitment because that's what she's tired of) or whether she still wants to spend time with her soon-to-be ex. Anyone who asks for separation knows logically that divorce is pretty much guaranteed. So they may as well address divorce and keep it clean and legal. And then if there's anything left, great. If not, they are both free to move on. It will be less confusing for the kids.
> 
> I do agree with other posters that once separated, they should be on their way to legal divorce, get attorneys to separate money right away so there's no ambiguity there that she's still HIS obligation. And I agree that he doesn't need to get ugly about it since that doesn't seem to be his nature, kudos to him, but that he doesn't need to be doing things for her, though as long as they're married, he will have ownership in maintaining the home, cars, etc, which is why he needs to get himself to an attorney and file papers right away because the wait is long enough and the limbo is awkward and confusing and resentments accrue because you're still legally tied through the property and both have some obligations until that divorce is final and property divided.


Heck, she wants out! So let her go have slutty fun.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

Longtime Hubby said:


> Heck, she wants out! So let her go have slutty fun.


There's just nothing in her request that would suggest she just wants to go have slutty fun. Sounds to me like she's looking to avoid involvement at the present time until sometime in the future possibly when she wants to have that option. She needs a divorce for that.


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

This indecent proposal could only be made to a man she not only cared nothing for, had no respect for, but also shows she has zero empathy for. 
Any reasonable person should know how soul crushing it would be to know your wife was separated and out dating and ****ing other guys, and pretending it wasn’t a divorce and she’d come back for sex regularly.
What man would want a wife to come back for sex, knowing she’s out with other men. It would be dangerous, stupid, incredibly hurtful, and more. No reasonable man would even consider it. To consider it shows certain pathology.


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

DownByTheRiver said:


> There's just nothing in her request that would suggest she just wants to go have slutty fun. Sounds to me like she's looking to avoid involvement at the present time until sometime in the future possibly when she wants to have that option. She needs a divorce for that.


There is to any person on the planet that has a basic understanding of human nature.


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## ElOtro (Apr 4, 2021)

Twodecades said:


> I kind of wondered if she was mentioned the sleeping over, etc. as a way of easing him into the separation with less push back, not because she necessarily intends to do it. But then again, she was pretty blunt in what she wants, so who knows.


"...not because she necessarily intends to do it." Her inner mind intentions, her problem, not his.

And her offer to him of being him ALSO allowed to date and what may follow...A traHollde.
It still amazes me how the ethics of market laws seem to be the implicit paradigm of almost whatever.
Holly Cow! 
She intents to be fair!!! 
What a sweet partner! LOL!
(Is really ALL for rent given the fair values are traded?)

May be his value is a bit higher than the amount offered by her proposal.


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## manfromlamancha (Jul 4, 2013)

DownByTheRiver said:


> Acording to what HE said she isn't ready for anything like that but she wants to keep the option open for the future which if you're separating of course you would and so I just suggest he does the same.
> 
> Men just can't fathom that sex isn't the number one priority of women like it is men. To me she just sounds like someone who's tired and burned out and wants to do things for herself for a while. Whether she'll like to do it for a long time no one knows but I think it's going to be a moot point because I think he's going to suspect that she's banging someone whether she is or not no matter what she says or anyone else says.


I fathom very well how women think. That is exactly what she wanted when she split with her first husband - a fk buddy in the form of Jim and she pulled that trigger many times. She wanted it and she had it - fact. Then she loses weight, gets hit on, reconnects with Jim and now we can't fathom what's on her mind. She wants sex with Jim and some kind of (maybe temporary) stability with OP. What's so hard to fathom?


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

This should put @DownByTheRiver 's theory to bed. She wants to date, and enjoy her new looks and body. 
She timed it to when her son moved out of the house.

*This was all planned,* at least two years ago, when she first started her weight-loss regimen and journey.

Note the date: This was lifted from @Chronotrigger 's 2d thread.


_Nemesis-_

......................................................................................................


Discussion Starter ·  #18  ·  Feb 7, 2020




Let me give a little more backstory - my wife had weight loss surgery about a year ago. She's lost a lot of weight and looks beautiful, but I always thought she was beautiful, even when she was heavier. And I told her so, all the time. Since she lost the weight, she seems obsessed with her looks, looking young and beautiful and she stresses out about aging. Everyone I've talked to about her says she's going through some kind of mid-life crisis and is craving attention from anywhere she can get it. And that may be what's driving her to talk to Jim - she isn't satisfied with the attention that I give her so she's getting it elsewhere. Now I'm not telling you this as a means of justifying her recent behavior - it's just a piece of the puzzle.

That being said, there are new developments. The wife woke up late last night and decided to text Jim. I have my kids every other week and weekend. On the weekends I have kids, I usually stay home with them and the wife goes out to her hometown (about an hour and 15 minutes away) to visit her brother, sister in law and their kids. Her father and step-mother also live down there. But so does Jim. She told Jim last night that when she visits her brother and sister in law on the weekends that I'm not there that he's free to be their "third wheel anytime" and go bowling with the family. I'm betting she doesn't plan on telling me if they meet. No, I am not okay with this... more on that in a minute.

I've been seeing a counselor for about a month now. We've mostly talked about the marriage and the counselor knows the full situation with Jim. I've told the counselor all I can about the marriage and what's going on - she now wants to hear the wife's side of things. The wife agreed to go to a session with me, so we are going tomorrow. The counselor says she will spend about 40 minutes talking with the wife without me and then bring me into the session for the last 20 minutes. I have asked the counselor to stress to my wife that this 'relationship' with Jim is inappropriate and disrespectful to our marriage. She will also stress that Jim needs to seek out a professional counselor and quit using the wife for therapy.

After the counseling session, one of two things (or both) is going to happen if the wife continues to 'counsel' Jim:

1. I am going to tell her that the relationship with Jim has to end and she must either choose her marriage or this thing going on with Jim, but that because of their past, she cannot have both.

2. I am going to text Jim (yes, I have his number) and tell him to back off, that his relationship with my wife is inappropriate.

If the wife chooses not to be with me anymore, or continues talking to Jim behind my back, then I'll tell her to leave. Also, I will be making her file for the divorce and pay for it. I paid for the divorce to my first wife and I shouldn't have had to since she was the one that cheated. That's not going to happen again. And when the wife comes to her senses and realizes what she's lost, no amount of apologizing, groveling or crying is going to bring me back. I can afford to live on my own, with my two kids. She can't. But, that's not my problem if we split up now is it?


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## 346745 (Oct 7, 2020)

DownByTheRiver said:


> There's just nothing in her request that would suggest she just wants to go have slutty fun. Sounds to me like she's looking to avoid involvement at the present time until sometime in the future possibly when she wants to have that option. She needs a divorce for that.


There is this ... 3. She insists there is no other man. But says she wants to be able to go out on dates if she is asked. She says that doesn't mean having sex, but won't rule out that it could happen


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## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

DownByTheRiver said:


> There's just nothing in her request that would suggest she just wants to go have slutty fun. Sounds to me like she's looking to avoid involvement at the present time until sometime in the future possibly when she wants to have that option. She needs a divorce for that.


Someone mentioned OP's other thread that has more information and that it seems she is wanting to try out others.


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## Dictum Veritas (Oct 22, 2020)

Diana7 said:


> There are countless upsides to marriage.


For men, under the current feminist driven legal system? I'm not so sure about this anymore.


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## Dictum Veritas (Oct 22, 2020)

DownByTheRiver said:


> Men just can't fathom that sex isn't the number one priority of women like it is men. To me she just sounds like someone who's tired and burned out and wants to do things for herself for a while. Whether she'll like to do it for a long time no one knows but I think it's going to be a moot point because I think he's going to suspect that she's banging someone whether she is or not no matter what she says or anyone else says.


She stated she wants to date other men. No man is going to date her without wanting sex. She is going to give them what they want for the ego kibbles and companionship. Let's not polish that turd any further here, please, no matter the shine it still stinks to high heaven.


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## manowar (Oct 3, 2020)

I read OPs other thread. Wife losses weight. A few shlubs on FB tell her she's attractive. She sucks it up and wants more of it. She doesn't appear to be so much a predator as I originally thought but rather a Validation Queen which puts a stoic OP in a really bad place. A 50-year-old lady who thinks she's a hottie is what this guy is dealing with. Menopause is around the corner. He's using reason to try to understand her emotions and feelings - babble - which are out of control and as irrational as can be. A woman who is completely misguided.

In two years, she'll be tired of her experiment after getting run through by a dozen or so idiots and she'll be ready to return to her old life with you. She's had her fun. We've all heard that one before. Get out in front.. Get out now. She's on a collision course of blowing up her life. She doesn't respect you. Let her blow it up. Man, you can then pursue hotter and younger women. Do not keep this woman around for sex or anything else. Your time with this drama queen has expired. Sit back and watch the blow-up from afar. Not your problem. Good Luck!


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## CountryMike (Jun 1, 2021)

BigDaddyNY said:


> All of this is 100% unacceptable in a marriage. This separation is an end of the marriage. She moved her ring so guys know she is available. In this arrangement she will date and she will get laid, simple as that.
> 
> Did you ask if it was okay for you to find yourself, date and have sex if you so desire?
> 
> My response to this is we either stay together and get counseling to sort this our or you can have all the freedom you want when we divorce.


Sad your wife is a woman that's not in it for the long haul and she's just now telling you.


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## CountryMike (Jun 1, 2021)

DownByTheRiver said:


> There's just nothing in her request that would suggest she just wants to go have slutty fun. Sounds to me like she's looking to avoid involvement at the present time until sometime in the future possibly when she wants to have that option. She needs a divorce for that.


There kind of is. Sorry to be disagreeable.


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## frenchpaddy (May 31, 2021)

sounds like this woman is getting kinky she has had a sex friend before and he is still sniffing around and she wants to keep the op as one as well , she wants her bread buttered on both sides


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## Mr. Nail (Apr 26, 2011)

I understand the thing about staring down that 50th birthday. I understand needing alone on my own time. 
She is making a mistake. No matter how alone she lives, No matter who she dates or sexes, no matter how much pain she puts her husband or ex husband through, One year from now she will definitely be 50 years old. The point here is not who she wants to bone. The point here is where does OP want to be while she makes her attempt to evade time? It's not a ride I'd sign up for.


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## Chronotrigger (Feb 6, 2020)

Let me clear up a couple of things from the post a year ago. I've had time to see that situation through and know what happened...

It's true that Jim was a previous lover of hers, back before she and I met. She went to school with the guy. Her first marriage ended because her ex husband was dealing and doing drugs and wouldn't stop. She was afraid CPS was going to take her son away. So she ended the marriage. Afterward, she confided in Jim about her situation. She says he offered to be an ear and emotional support for her during that time. They did get drunk one night and had sex, but she says it was meaningless. So last year, Jim was also going through a divorce and he reached out to her for support. She did listen and talk to him, but cut off communication with him because I was insanely jealous. And she's right. I have been an insanely jealous man. I used to believe that men and women could not be just friends - that there was always sex going on. She never slept with him, and says she cut off communication because she was afraid I was going to completely lose it if she didn't. And she was probably right. I do believe her when she says she only wanted to be a friend to Jim.

That situation plays a big part in today. She feels like she cannot have any male friends because I am so jealous and untrusting. She's finally gotten tired of it. That's just one of the traits about me that she's tired of. It all adds up to her wanting, at least, a break. And I believe that's where her desire to have male friends on this separation comes from. She says she's not interested in another relationship, at least right now. But if a male friend asks her to lunch or dinner, she doesn't want to have to give up that friendship for an insanely jealous husband. Yes, I can understand that now. Im an only child, and have always been a loner. Maybe that and my total lack of self esteem were the perfect storm in forging my jealousy. I have a couple of female friends that (even when not married) I don't have any desire to bang. But I do enjoy their company.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

Evinrude58 said:


> There is to any person on the planet that has a basic understanding of human nature.


Men who think about cheating all the time always think women would do the same thing.


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## Chronotrigger (Feb 6, 2020)

I have a better understanding of why she wanted the separation, now. I had a long talk with her last night. She says she truly doesn't know if she wants to continue with me or not but she does know that she she does not want a divorce right now. I admit, I'm not an easy man to be in a relationship with. I've had so many missed opportunities to travel with her, spend time with her family, etc that I shrugged off and took for granted. I also believe this separation needs to happen. I need to work on myself. Those traits she listed that she doesn't like about me are all true and not indicative of a good man in my opinion. And I don't want to be like that any longer.

So, no, I don't plan on dating or hooking up during the separation. I plan on using the time to make me a better person. And some time in the future hopefully we will decide to reconcile. Even if we don't, at least I'll be a better person and far less likely to screw up my next relationship.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Chronotrigger said:


> I have a better understanding of why she wanted the separation, now. I had a long talk with her last night. She says she truly doesn't know if she wants to continue with me or not but she does know that she she does not want a divorce right now. I admit, I'm not an easy man to be in a relationship with. I've had so many missed opportunities to travel with her, spend time with her family, etc that I shrugged off and took for granted. I also believe this separation needs to happen. I need to work on myself. Those traits she doesn't like about me are all true and not indicative of a good man. And I don't want to be like that any longer.
> 
> So, no, I don't plan on dating or hooking up during the separation. I plan on using the time to make me a better person. And some time in the future hopefully we will decide to reconcile. Even if we don't, at least I'll be a better person and far less likely to screw up my next relationship.


Then yay! Win win! 
Good luck to you both!

One thing though, you mentioned you are jealous as if that's a bad thing. When you enter a relationship there needs to be boundaries and of course there will be sacrifices and expectations. 

I sacrificed a ton of my female associates and exs (excluding ex-wife cause of our daughter) and vice versa. And even with ex-wife there are boundaries observed. 

You either failed to be transparent with your wife with these boundaries and expectations from the start, or your wife simply wasn't and isn't mature enough to understand this aspect of relationships.


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

It’s very sad to watch you explain away the fact that your wife had sex with jimbo, actually believe it was just once, and let your cheating wife gaslight you into thinking she’s not wanting to test out other men.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Another thing, since you have made a decision to separate as well, please don't be a sissy and let her stay over. If she wants her freedom she must embrace all the consequences of it.

People are free to pursue whatever lifestyle they wish, so wish your wife the best. It is also ultimately up to you if you wish to allow her to continue using you as a fall back, it's not a healthy way to be - being a doormat, but as mentioned - it is up to you.


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## ElOtro (Apr 4, 2021)

Chronotrigger said:


> They did get drunk one night and had sex, but she says it was meaningless





Chronotrigger said:


> She never slept with him, and says...


I´m a bit confused...
Not sure if I´m in lack on an update on formal Logic.
Would someone tell me when was the "third excluded" principle dropped?
Or is not about logic and the "third excluded" criteria is only outdated in the field of monogamy?


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## Marc878 (Aug 26, 2015)

Chronotrigger said:


> I have a better understanding of why she wanted the separation, now. I had a long talk with her last night. She says she truly doesn't know if she wants to continue with me or not but she does know that she she does not want a divorce right now. I admit, I'm not an easy man to be in a relationship with. I've had so many missed opportunities to travel with her, spend time with her family, etc that I shrugged off and took for granted. I also believe this separation needs to happen. I need to work on myself. Those traits she listed that she doesn't like about me are all true and not indicative of a good man in my opinion. And I don't want to be like that any longer.
> 
> So, no, I don't plan on dating or hooking up during the separation. I plan on using the time to make me a better person. And some time in the future hopefully we will decide to reconcile. Even if we don't, at least I'll be a better person and far less likely to screw up my next relationship.


She’ll be dating enough for the both of you. 

A lot come here and get the idea that if it’s their fault they can fix it. 

Sorry man but you are very naive.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

Sun C Mars, now you're talking about my mother. You say his wife has timed this for when the children are out of the house as if that's a bad thing. My mom waited until both of us girls were out living on our own before she divorced to get away from my dad who had periodic uncontrollable rage. Actually she also waited until the Chihuahua died. 

That's a pretty normal thing. 

I've lost lots of weight many times over my life, and it wasn't ever so I could just run out and be s***** with someone. Again, sex is such a priority for a lot of men that they can't fathom that all women aren't motivated solely by it.


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## DudeInProgress (Jun 10, 2019)

Chronotrigger said:


> I have a better understanding of why she wanted the separation, now. I had a long talk with her last night. She says she truly doesn't know if she wants to continue with me or not but she does know that she she does not want a divorce right now. I admit, I'm not an easy man to be in a relationship with. I've had so many missed opportunities to travel with her, spend time with her family, etc that I shrugged off and took for granted. I also believe this separation needs to happen. I need to work on myself. Those traits she listed that she doesn't like about me are all true and not indicative of a good man in my opinion. And I don't want to be like that any longer.
> 
> So, no, I don't plan on dating or hooking up during the separation. I plan on using the time to make me a better person. And some time in the future hopefully we will decide to reconcile. Even if we don't, at least I'll be a better person and far less likely to screw up my next relationship.


Wow.
This may be the most self flagellating, no-confidence doormat, weak, anti-masculine bunch of excusing/rationalizing garbage I have ever read on this site. And that’s saying a lot.

Having boundaries is not being insanely jealous and it’s not wrong.
Not allowing your wife to have private conversations and private meetings with other men is not insanely jealous, it’s not controlling - it’s good and wise boundary enforcement. It’s protecting your marriage. It’s part of being a man and a husband.
She doesn’t get to have the freedom of being single while keeping the benefits of being your wife. Er, well I guess in this case she does.

Did you absorb nothing of the four pages of nearly identical advice that so many (men and women) here have given you?
Did all of this obvious truth and reality make no impact on you at all?
Are you actually this weak and foolish, or is there some part of you that likes the idea of being a cuckold? Because that’s what you are about to become.

Brother, I’m not trying to attack you - I’m trying to shake some sense into you. You are allowing your wife to lead you down a very destructive path that is going to end up very badly for you. You are acting like a weak, pathetic, undignified doormat of a man

We’ve done all we can here. At this point, you’re either willing/capable of understanding the reality of your situation and taking action or you’re not.
Please go back and read through the responses on this thread, I don’t see how we could’ve laid this out any clearer for you.

That said, you make your own choices. Good luck.


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## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

Chronotrigger said:


> But if a male friend asks her to lunch or dinner, she doesn't want to have to give up that friendship for an insanely jealous husband.


A real male friend wouldn't be asking a married woman to lunch or dinner because that's called a date and a real friend would respect the marriage. Your wife just wants to act single and for you to not give her grief over it.


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

FYI, it is shockingly common, I’d say 9/10 is conservative, that women who get tummy tucks and start getting attention from men that they have never had, or not have had in years—- suddenly “need space” and bang every guy with a pulse.... or just the ones they find more attractive thAn they could get interest from in the past.

this separation has zero to do with your jealousy or your fitness as a husband and everything to do with your wife’s lust for attention and men whom were not atttacted to her in the past. This is simply a case of finding the fountain of youth and obsessively wanting to drink from it.

she ain’t wearing her ring.


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## Marc878 (Aug 26, 2015)

DownByTheRiver said:


> Acording to what HE said she isn't ready for anything like that but she wants to keep the option open for the future which if you're separating of course you would and so I just suggest he does the same.
> 
> Men just can't fathom that sex isn't the number one priority of women like it is men. To me she just sounds like someone who's tired and burned out and wants to do things for herself for a while. Whether she'll like to do it for a long time no one knows but I think it's going to be a moot point because I think he's going to suspect that she's banging someone whether she is or not no matter what she says or anyone else says.


She wants to date other men.
But entitled muffin wants to keep OP on the back burner as plan B just in case she needs a soft place to land.

Hilarious!!!!

OP if you’re smart let this one go. Living the life of a cuckold may not be too pleasant.


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

DownByTheRiver said:


> Sun C Mars, now you're talking about my mother. You say his wife has timed this for when the children are out of the house as if that's a bad thing. My mom waited until both of us girls were out living on our own before she divorced to get away from my dad who had periodic uncontrollable rage. Actually she also waited until the Chihuahua died.
> 
> That's a pretty normal thing.
> 
> I've lost lots of weight many times over my life, and it wasn't ever so I could just run out and be s***** with someone. Again, sex is such a priority for a lot of men that they can't fathom that all women aren't motivated solely by it.


No, it’s not a normal thing. Being your mom doesn’t make it right. It may be great in her situation, but to say they “stayed for the kids” and hide their intentions from their husband is totally wrong. Just be up front and say they want a divorce and do whatever.

you pretending to ignore the fact that this person has lost a bunch of weight, has cheated in the past, and now says she wants a “separation” and she wants to date and “possibly” have sex with other men and say it’s normal is doing this guy a huge disservice.
Pretending women aren’t into sex like men..... yeah, they aren’t. From about 35 and up they’re usually about as horny as a 20 yr old man. 

I don’t disagree that it may not be pure sex she is wanting, but it’s damn sure about getting with other men. She is not being honest with her husband. She clearly doesn’t want him anymore except to use him for security and a safe haven/home if going it on her own isn’t feasible for her. He is trying to grasp at straws and pretend she isn’t the unfaithful, walk away that she is. And he’s going to second guess himself as a result. He’s gonna stay in limbo while she dates other men and she HAS TOLD HIM she’s going to. He’s just to beat down and insecure to see it.

You are doing the OP no favors acting like his wife just needs a break from the routine.
She’s going to separate to date other men and that’s just fact. Not opinion. She told him that.


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## DudeInProgress (Jun 10, 2019)

Let us be thankful for the fools. But for them the rest of us could not succeed. - Twain

Let us be thankful for weak, ineffective men. But for them the rest of us could not succeed in the sexual marketplace. - Dude


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## ElOtro (Apr 4, 2021)

DownByTheRiver said:


> Again, sex is such a priority for a lot of men that they can't fathom that all women aren't motivated solely by it.


Again, and may be I´m biased by may male blindness, but I can agree with you that for a lot of women, sex is not the main reason (if it is one reason at all) for:


Get in a relationship
Stay in a relationship
End a relationship.

*And, moreover, it also seems that for those women, sex is not the main reason to HAVE sex with another man outside the "main" relationship.*

So may be I can be aware and tentatively agree with you, despite me being a man.

But...........with so much focus in the inner side of things (the conjectural reasons why) I´m not still sure of what you mean (besides the points I´ve listed). That is, the apparently naturalized assumptions behind what you are not explicitely saying (may be because you understand them well and think that we also should).
So, excuse me for some not very clever questions so I can illustrate my gender bias:


As "women aren't motivated solely by" sex they will not have sex with an OM?
As "women aren't motivated solely by" sex they MAY have sex with an OM even if for reasons other than sex (perhaps same reasons as the ones why they sometimes have sex and frequently don´t with their own H´s)?
As "women aren't motivated solely by" sex they MAY have sex with an OM just because sex is, for them, not so important after all?
Or, perhaps, that as "women aren't motivated solely by" sex, we men shouldn´t give so much importance to the triviallity of our wives / GF´s / else DESIRING to have sex with us? And to also to stop caring about when they HAVE sex with an OM, because they do it becauses their own good reasons other than sex itstelf????






- Are you saying that


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## Rob_1 (Sep 8, 2017)

Well, I was wrong on the assumption that the OP wasn't coming back, or the reason for it. It turns that it's even worse.

We have a man whose mentality, and naivete makes him look like either a childlike adult unable to be able to rationalize reality, or someone seriously lacking in cognitive reasoning, instead he rationalizes things out of a world made up entirely of his own skewered views of it. No wonder why the wife is sick of him.

It was said before, but this is one of the saddest, most pathetic, self-punishing rationalization I've read in a while.

Obviously, the OP must not have enough world wide experience with the way the world works when it comes to relationships. And obviously, he's on self denial and hopium as to the way how the relationship will end. Plus, he either has very little self respect, or he doesn't mind being a cuckold, because eventually that's were he is going to end up; and I'm betting that he will accept it, but he won't realize that that's when his marriage will be over for real. His wife will not come back, guaranteed.


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## BigDaddyNY (May 19, 2021)

Chronotrigger said:


> Let me clear up a couple of things from the post a year ago. I've had time to see that situation through and know what happened...
> 
> It's true that Jim was a previous lover of hers, back before she and I met. She went to school with the guy. Her first marriage ended because her ex husband was dealing and doing drugs and wouldn't stop. She was afraid CPS was going to take her son away. So she ended the marriage. Afterward, she confided in Jim about her situation. She says he offered to be an ear and emotional support for her during that time. They did get drunk one night and had sex, but she says it was meaningless. So last year, Jim was also going through a divorce and he reached out to her for support. She did listen and talk to him, but cut off communication with him because I was insanely jealous. And she's right. I have been an insanely jealous man. I used to believe that men and women could not be just friends - that there was always sex going on. She never slept with him, and says she cut off communication because she was afraid I was going to completely lose it if she didn't. And she was probably right. I do believe her when she says she only wanted to be a friend to Jim.
> 
> That situation plays a big part in today. She feels like she cannot have any male friends because I am so jealous and untrusting. She's finally gotten tired of it. That's just one of the traits about me that she's tired of. It all adds up to her wanting, at least, a break. And I believe that's where her desire to have male friends on this separation comes from. She says she's not interested in another relationship, at least right now. But if a male friend asks her to lunch or dinner, she doesn't want to have to give up that friendship for an insanely jealous husband. Yes, I can understand that now. Im an only child, and have always been a loner. Maybe that and my total lack of self esteem were the perfect storm in forging my jealousy. I have a couple of female friends that (even when not married) I don't have any desire to bang. But I do enjoy their company.





Chronotrigger said:


> I have a better understanding of why she wanted the separation, now. I had a long talk with her last night. She says she truly doesn't know if she wants to continue with me or not but she does know that she she does not want a divorce right now. I admit, I'm not an easy man to be in a relationship with. I've had so many missed opportunities to travel with her, spend time with her family, etc that I shrugged off and took for granted. I also believe this separation needs to happen. I need to work on myself. Those traits she listed that she doesn't like about me are all true and not indicative of a good man in my opinion. And I don't want to be like that any longer.
> 
> So, no, I don't plan on dating or hooking up during the separation. I plan on using the time to make me a better person. And some time in the future hopefully we will decide to reconcile. Even if we don't, at least I'll be a better person and far less likely to screw up my next relationship.


If a woman is going to lunch or dinner with a man, it is a date. Unless there is a business or similar purpose and it is strictly social, it is a date. If my wife came to me and said she was going to dinner with Tom from work, Richard from the shop in town or Harry her old classmate just to hang out, eat, drink and talk I would ask her if she had gone totally insane. And it isn't because I'm some insanely jealous man. It is because she is married to me and she can't date other men, lol. This isn't rocket science. If it were all truly innocent, then WE would go to dinner with Tom, **** or Harry. If a male friend asks your wife if she wants to grab dinner sometime, she should say sure, me and my husband are free this Friday.

Could a man and woman be just friends, yes, but I feel the risk of romance being sparked while spending alone time together is a non-starter. Look what happened with her friend Jim. A little too much to drink and they were in the sack together. Friends at work sure. Friendly conversations, even on a first name basis with the clerk at a store, sure. Going one on one to dinner with either of those guys, are you kidding me? I guarantee at the end of the date the guy will be wondering if she was into him and where could it lead. It is just human nature. The only way a wife should be socializing with other men is either with her husband or in large groups. This applies if the roles are reversed too.

Have you ever gone to dinner or anywhere alone with any of the female friends you mentioned? I'm really good friends with some of my wife's female friends, but I would never think about us going to lunch or dinner together without my wife.

There is nothing I can think of that you could have done to make it okay for your wife to date other men. Please have enough self respect to not put up with this.


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## manfromlamancha (Jul 4, 2013)

Chronotrigger said:


> Let me clear up a couple of things from the post a year ago. I've had time to see that situation through and know what happened...
> 
> It's true that Jim was a previous lover of hers, back before she and I met. She went to school with the guy. Her first marriage ended because her ex husband was dealing and doing drugs and wouldn't stop. She was afraid CPS was going to take her son away. So she ended the marriage. Afterward, she confided in Jim about her situation. She says he offered to be an ear and emotional support for her during that time. They did get drunk one night and had sex, but she says it was meaningless. So last year, Jim was also going through a divorce and he reached out to her for support. She did listen and talk to him, but cut off communication with him because I was insanely jealous. And she's right. I have been an insanely jealous man. I used to believe that men and women could not be just friends - that there was always sex going on. She never slept with him, and says she cut off communication because she was afraid I was going to completely lose it if she didn't. And she was probably right. I do believe her when she says she only wanted to be a friend to Jim.
> 
> That situation plays a big part in today. She feels like she cannot have any male friends because I am so jealous and untrusting. She's finally gotten tired of it. That's just one of the traits about me that she's tired of. It all adds up to her wanting, at least, a break. And I believe that's where her desire to have male friends on this separation comes from. She says she's not interested in another relationship, at least right now. But if a male friend asks her to lunch or dinner, she doesn't want to have to give up that friendship for an insanely jealous husband. Yes, I can understand that now. Im an only child, and have always been a loner. Maybe that and my total lack of self esteem were the perfect storm in forging my jealousy. I have a couple of female friends that (even when not married) I don't have any desire to bang. But I do enjoy their company.


And what about this not so insignificant statement from her about being free to date other men during the separation and if sex happens, it happens ???

You are blaming yourself and that is not uncommon. Sure jealousy and anger need to be managed within reason. But if she continues to talk with an ex f-buddy while married to you, a little rage and jealousy is completely understood and justified. She has you believing that all she would want from Jim is friendship having slept with him several times (your last thread) and now you say it was only one drunken night !?!?

Buddy you really need to wake up and smell the roses here.


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## Dictum Veritas (Oct 22, 2020)

DudeInProgress said:


> Wow.
> This may be the most self flagellating, no-confidence doormat, weak, anti-masculine bunch of excusing/rationalizing garbage I have ever read on this site. And that’s saying a lot.
> 
> Having boundaries is not being insanely jealous and it’s not wrong.
> ...


Amen to all of this!

In light of OP's self-fragilization and insistence on being the portal carpet, I don't see that I can further assist here save to say, OP, you are doing everything wrong and this will bite you in the posterior, not only in this relationship, which is about to end with your wife walking away with all the goodies, leaving you with a bag of detritus; but also, because you are unwilling to learn or show the semi-rigid bone structure forming the structural back in all mammalians, any future relationships you may have.

Your update about accepting the separation, acquiescing to her terms and conditions and taking blame for setting normal boundaries (in fact agreeing to your wife dating and most likely engaging in sex with other man while still being her fluffy pillow if she chooses) leaves a bitter taste in the mouth of every red-blooded man and paints you in a very pale light as far as strength is concerned.

In spite of what I said here, I truly hope you wake up with a start, act like a person with a drop of testosterone and actually make a positive difference in your life by taking decisive action before this train wreck in progress concludes in your heart and soul's ultimate destruction as is set in motion by your lack of skeletal structure right now.

I sincerely hope I am wrong, but I do not see it.

My ultimate hope is that the harshness of these and similar words will sink in and wake you from this fateful slumber and this pallid dream playing in your mind to avert the real life nightmare unfolding in your life from materializing into full bloom.

Good luck OP, you will need it because your decisions are bound to make your worst fears corporal and luck in spades might be the only thing that could save you from yourself and your torrid, wayward (which is definitely her mindset), uncaring wife.


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## frenchpaddy (May 31, 2021)

putting your self out there on a forum like this is not an easy thing to do because you get responses that are based on the posters life experience and not on your story and many of us have a chip at least one chip , some give advice without reading the whole post or the fellow up posts , I think it is ok for a woman to have a friend and more so a friend that she knows from school ,but I can't think why a friend would feel the need to invite another mans wife to dinner with out her husband , you say you have women friends do you make a habit of taking them out to dinner without your wife and without their husbands , I know I think it is important for my wife to make new friends as we have moved to a new area but I know she would not except a dinner invite as she would feel a bit under a complement to him , 
yes you have wrong on your side but life is full of actions and reactions and you wife might be pushing your buttons a bit in some ways , I can't see how her getting her own place is going to help but if she does I am a believer in given my wife the freedom to live her life in what ever way she wants , but that is me I am very confident and in no way think my wife would ever love someone more than she loves me , then we have got to the point where she can read my mind she is better than me at that 
I think you do trust you wife and you do love her but I think you need to love yourself more and be more open with your self , with out going to expensive help try to have a better look at the man you are and want to be , 
I have all types of friends from church men to Mafia types and even the odd womanizer and we can learn a lot about life from people even if we don't agree with how they live their life my best friend is a libertine and we talked one night when I and my wife were invited for dinner , the one thing i brought home from the night was there is a difference in love making aand sex and before you ask no it was not a dinner before we had a threesome it was just interesting to have a real chat with someone and i know my wife was with that friend one night they had drinks and she did not have more than drinks and he showed her his toy collection which just goes to show you that people can be bad boy type and still have a good side to them , I am just thinking off the top of my head if i ever was sick for a long time he is the one i would trust with my wife and her with him .


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## Jamieboy (Jan 14, 2021)

Human nature is such that if a male and female find each other physically attractive, then given enough time in each others company, feelings will develop. Quite often, where one or both are involved in a relationship this ramps up the sexual tension, as this can create a false sense of security to begin with. 

It then comes down to self esteem and the enforcement of personal boundaries as to if an inappropriate relationship develops. 

For the OP, your self esteem is shattered, you don't love yourself and you are now in a place where you are contemplating accepting a situation that no person with healthy boundaries and self esteem would.

Ask yourself, could you tell your work colleagues about your new relationship dynamic without huge shame and embarrassment? If the answer is yes, then it's all good, but if the answer is no, then set yourself on the path to rebuilding your shattered self worth.

Act with decisiveness and be firm, give her two choices either remain or go, but not one foot in and one out.

Be your own man, do things with your well being in mind. You don't need her, you need only yourself. Stand up tall, respect yourself, act with dignity. You will be more attractive as a result so when she comes to her senses she will doubly feel the loss of you.

If you have made mistakes, learn from them, but this marriage is done. Accept it, grieve for it (in private) and then move forward with purpose.


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## GC1234 (Apr 15, 2020)

Chronotrigger said:


> My wife of 9 years says she wants us to separate. This is the second marriage for us both. Her reason: she is terrified of turning 50 next year and wants to see what it's like living on her own. She also doesn't want to have to be expected to care for anyone but herself as she says she's been taking care of others her whole life. We have no children together. She has a son who is now an adult who recently left to be on his own. I have two teenage kids from my first marriage. This is where my confusion starts:
> 1. She wants us to continue to date and have sex during the separation
> 2. She wants us to live in our own places but says she wants to be able to come visit me, even stay over at my place from time to time
> 3. She insists there is no other man. But says she wants to be able to go out on dates if she is asked. She says that doesn't mean having sex, but won't rule out that it could happen
> ...


Why did she bother to get remarried?


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## Talker67 (Apr 7, 2016)

DownByTheRiver said:


> There's just nothing in her request that would suggest she just wants to go have slutty fun. Sounds to me like she's looking to avoid involvement at the present time until sometime in the future possibly when she wants to have that option. She needs a divorce for that.


is it possible she has some mental issues?
OCD? Madonna/w***e syndrome? Past sexual abuse? Extreme introvert?
in her mind she MAY think it is perfectly OK for her to sleep around while her husband is waiting back home.

either she has a screw loose, or she has been reading too many online Hotwife sites.


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## Chronotrigger (Feb 6, 2020)

Well, we talked again last night and I am taking back my previous statement that it's not a rejection of me. I asked her if I hadn't had all of these negative traits would she still be asking for a separation and she said 'probably not'. Also, I told her that since she's been with several men in her past before me that I saw no reason for her to want to date or have sex with other men while on the separation. She said that she's never been this skinny before as an adult and that she believes she will be attracting a different class of men than she was when she was heavy. I said, what skinny guys? She said no, muscular guys. I'll admit, that hurt. A lot. So yeah, she is thinking about other men. I don't think other men are the sole reason for this separation, but it's definitely part of it.

I agree that the marriage is likely over. But the damage from her and my first wife has been done. My first wife cheated and I left her. My jealousy amped up after that. I've got bad traits that would drive away any woman. I have zero self esteem and I wake up hating who I am each day, not physically, but mentally. I know I can get another girlfriend with no problem, but based on my track record, I'll likely ruin that relationship, too. I'm done trying. Im not wired to be the perpetual bachelor. I feel like this life is a no win scenario. Here's hoping there's a next life and I'm not born with such a defective brain.


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## BigDaddyNY (May 19, 2021)

Chronotrigger said:


> Well, we talked again last night and I am taking back my previous statement that it's not a rejection of me. I asked her if I hadn't had all of these negative traits would she still be asking for a separation and she said 'probably not'. Also, I told her that since she's been with several men in her past before me that I saw no reason for her to want to date or have sex with other men while on the separation. She said that she's never been this skinny before as an adult and that she believes she will be attracting a different class of men than she was when she was heavy. I said, what skinny guys? She said no, muscular guys. I'll admit, that hurt. A lot. So yeah, she is thinking about other men. I don't think other men are the sole reason for this separation, but it's definitely part of it.
> 
> I agree that the marriage is likely over. But the damage from her and my first wife has been done. My first wife cheated and I left her. My jealousy amped up after that. I've got bad traits that would drive away any woman. I have zero self esteem and I wake up hating who I am each day, not physically, but mentally. I know I can get another girlfriend with no problem, but based on my track record, I'll likely ruin that relationship, too. I'm done trying. Im not wired to be the perpetual bachelor. I feel like this life is a no win scenario. Here's hoping there's a next life and I'm not born with such a defective brain.


Do you have some issues, yes, but don't blame yourself for this situation. If your statements here are true your wife is a self-centered, heartless *****. She just told you that you are now beneath her and she needs to find a hotter guy. And she wants to keep you around in case she's wrong about being able to hook up with those hot muscular guys. The marriage isn't "likely" over, it is over. Don't walk, run. IMO the first step to fixing yourself is to tell her to eff off. Maybe get some counseling to take care of yourself and move on. There are lots of other women out there, but you need to regain confidence in yourself.


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## frenchpaddy (May 31, 2021)

even though I am with the one woman my pnly woman ever I think you should be happy that you have had at least 2 good stories in your life time and that you can still go out and have what ever type relationship you wish after this , SO WHAT IF THEY ENDED BADLY AS long as it has not been your doing and you can still respect a woman just I think you should cut this woman off now end it , and when she finds out that she was wrong tell her to stay gone


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## Dictum Veritas (Oct 22, 2020)

Chronotrigger, you need to share this with a friend or family member NOW. You need a person in real life for support, because you have seen your world crumble around you and you are questioning everything. I have been harsh in my previous post, but that was to try to get you to open your eyes.

Now is the time to find your strength, because your eyes have shown you a glimpse of what your heart refused to believe previously. This is a shock and you are vulnerable right now. Please do not think about self-harm. Do not drown in a bottle. Contact a friend or family member, get away from the source of your pain (your wife) in the company of someone you can trust and talk, talk until you have emptied your heart.

This is painful man, it feels like your whole world is exploding and everything you believed in, planned and hoped for and dreamed about just blew up and left you crippled by shrapnel. I know that feeling. A lot of us here do. Only you can now guide yourself to a better future, but right now, you need to contact someone who you can lean on and if there is no-one, then find a local support group or at the very least make haste to get into counselling.

Believe it or not, but none of us has ill-will or bad wishes towards you. The harsher we spoke, the more we wished for you not to commit to a course of action that would destroy you.

Please do not act rashly... Decisively yes, but only once you can see a path towards your future happiness and prosperity. Act only towards that goal because acting on any self-destructive impulse will only place you deeper in a pit and make your path to future prosperity that much harder.

You know your wife does not have your interests at heart, don't even tell her you're hurting, this is counter productive, but other than her, please, please speak to someone sympathetic or at least rational in person ASAP.


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## dubsey (Feb 21, 2013)

I'd let her know if this is what she wants, you'd like a divorce. At least she's being up front and honest that she has a new body and associated ego she'd like to take out and give a spin. She only wants the separation to keep you as a back up.

I'd just get divorced, divide up the assets and go from there. No reason you can't still mess around with her if that's what you both want, but you don't need to financially support this nonsense in any way.


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## snerg (Apr 10, 2013)

Chronotrigger said:


> My wife of 9 years says she wants us to separate. This is the second marriage for us both. H*er reason: she is terrified of turning 50 next year and wants to see what it's like living on her own*.


I got this far - Who's the new person she wants to go have sex with or is already screwing?

I don't need to even read through the other posts in the thread.
I'm going to bet:
1) She has lost a large amount of weight
2) She's getting a ton of guys looking at her
3) Someone has been stroking her ego
4) She has decided it's now her time to go out and have fun
5) You're too nice and she just wants to be friends

My advice - get a lawyer now and start divorce.
She's been cheating and now wants to be free so she can run amok.


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## Rob_1 (Sep 8, 2017)

snerg said:


> I got this far - Who's the new person she wants to go have sex with or is already screwing?
> 
> I don't need to even read through the other posts in the thread.
> I'm going to bet:
> ...


You're dead on on your assessment. The OP needs serious intervention. He's emotionally beaten down to a pulp, and I'm afraid that nothing is getting through him right now. He's too down on himself. He needs to see someone in person that can help him get some sense.


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## ElOtro (Apr 4, 2021)

Chronotrigger said:


> Well, we talked again last night and I am taking back my previous statement that it's not a rejection of me.
> I don't think other men are the sole reason for this separation, but it's definitely part of it.


On her side, not a solely enough reason but a necessary one.
On yours, a quite enough reason even if not the only one. 

Let her go completely, don´t accept ambiguous agreements, have a clean breakup, a clean status and an also clean standpoint to have a personal future.

On your depression, self image issues and what you may want to change about yourself, do something instead of resignation.
Get an IC, a good one (not all of them are).
Do it once you clean your actual inmediate emotional backyard so you can focus un yourself.

Best wishes.


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## Talker67 (Apr 7, 2016)

Chronotrigger said:


> . She said that she's never been this skinny before as an adult and that she believes she will be attracting a different class of men than she was when she was heavy.


and how did she get "so skinny". for months she has been planning on dumping you, and has been working on her figure so she can attract other men. 

Think about that, maybe for six months, she has been working hard to lose weight only because she wants to replace you.

sorry to be harsh, but you have to look at all this with open eyes


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Chronotrigger said:


> Well, we talked again last night and I am taking back my previous statement that it's not a rejection of me. I asked her if I hadn't had all of these negative traits would she still be asking for a separation and she said 'probably not'. Also, I told her that since she's been with several men in her past before me that I saw no reason for her to want to date or have sex with other men while on the separation. She said that she's never been this skinny before as an adult and that she believes she will be attracting a different class of men than she was when she was heavy. I said, what skinny guys? She said no, muscular guys. I'll admit, that hurt. A lot. So yeah, she is thinking about other men. I don't think other men are the sole reason for this separation, but it's definitely part of it.
> 
> I agree that the marriage is likely over. But the damage from her and my first wife has been done. My first wife cheated and I left her. My jealousy amped up after that. I've got bad traits that would drive away any woman. I have zero self esteem and I wake up hating who I am each day, not physically, but mentally. I know I can get another girlfriend with no problem, but based on my track record, I'll likely ruin that relationship, too. I'm done trying. Im not wired to be the perpetual bachelor. I feel like this life is a no win scenario. Here's hoping there's a next life and I'm not born with such a defective brain.


What is defective with your brain right now is that you are blaming yourself for your wife's lack of boundaries and having no backbone to stand up for your own needs of fidelity. Has it ever occurred to you that jealousy can indeed be healthy? To a point of course but I don't see you being some super stalker or having any overbearing demands from your wife.

Your wife simply isn't wife material, you get that, only thing you need to learn for your next relationship is how to separate the wheat from the chaff. Those who are long term material understands boundaries and the sacrifices involved in a committed relationship and not only that, they are happy to make these sacrifices.


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## jlg07 (Feb 24, 2017)

@Chronotrigger , ease up on yourself. YOU did not cause her to decide she wants to bang other guys. SHE is doing that all by herself. If she had real issues with things you've done, then she should have discussed them AS THEY came up. Not get skinny and then drop a bomb on you.

For yourself, get yourself into individual counseling to work on your issues. Start working out, make sure you eat right, improve YOURSELF. No need to worry about her anymore. Develop hobbies YOU have always wanted to do.
She says she MAY want to have sex with muscular guys and YOUR traits are the reason -- that is flat out re-writing your marital history and her trying to justify leaving you for others. That's all it is -- pure justification.

To help YOU start detaching from her, start doing the 180:
180 for Betrayed Spouses 

This is NOT to punish her or anything like that. It's to help YOU detach from her and get moving forward with YOUR life.
Very sorry you are going through this.


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## Talker67 (Apr 7, 2016)

let me lay this here: i have a male friend that sounds a LOT like your wife. blew up his marriage 2 years ago, went to live with some babe in another state. would not listen to any reason.

his wife did not date, waited for him, about a year ago guess who comes crawling back, after is babe dumped him???? they got remarried, and are apparently happy again as a couple.

go figure.

the DID divorce along the way....so keep that in mind....his wife did not treat it like a temporary hall pass for him.


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## Chronotrigger (Feb 6, 2020)

jlg07 said:


> @Chronotrigger , ease up on yourself. YOU did not cause her to decide she wants to bang other guys. SHE is doing that all by herself. If she had real issues with things you've done, then she should have discussed them AS THEY came up. Not get skinny and then drop a bomb on you.
> 
> For yourself, get yourself into individual counseling to work on your issues. Start working out, make sure you eat right, improve YOURSELF. No need to worry about her anymore. Develop hobbies YOU have always wanted to do.
> She says she MAY want to have sex with muscular guys and YOUR traits are the reason -- that is flat out re-writing your marital history and her trying to justify leaving you for others. That's all it is -- pure justification.
> ...


Thank you for sharing the 180. I'll definitely take these to heart!


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## Chronotrigger (Feb 6, 2020)

BigDaddyNY said:


> Do you have some issues, yes, but don't blame yourself for this situation. If your statements here are true your wife is a self-centered, heartless ***. She just told you that you are now beneath her and she needs to find a hotter guy. And she wants to keep you around in case she's wrong about being able to hook up with those hot muscular guys. The marriage isn't "likely" over, it is over. Don't walk, run. IMO the first step to fixing yourself is to tell her to eff off. Maybe get some counseling to take care of yourself and move on. There are lots of other women out there, but you need to regain confidence in yourself.


Here's the kicker - she lost her weight a couple of years ago. Last September I started my weight loss journey. I was 260 pounds and am 6'2". My belly was huge. Since then, I've dropped 68 pounds and the belly is gone. I'm 2 pounds away from my goal weight of 190. The belly is gone and I look much better, but I need to build muscle mass as I'm pretty skinny. I think I need to start with protein supplements and start weight lifting. I know, I need to do this for myself, not her. Still, part of me hopes that putting on some muscle and doing some ab sculpting will make her think twice. If that doesn't work, at least it's a self confidence booster.


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## Dictum Veritas (Oct 22, 2020)

Chronotrigger said:


> Here's the kicker - she lost her weight a couple of years ago. Last September I started my weight loss journey. I was 260 pounds and am 6'2". My belly was huge. Since then, I've dropped 68 pounds and the belly is gone. I'm 2 pounds away from my goal weight of 190. The belly is gone and I look much better, but I need to build muscle mass as I'm pretty skinny. I think I need to start with protein supplements and start weight lifting. I know, I need to do this for myself, not her. Still, part of me hopes that putting on some muscle and doing some ab sculpting will make her think twice. If that doesn't work, at least it's a self confidence booster.


You definitely need to get away from the mindset of doing anything with her in mind. She does not consider you, it's time to answer her selfish motivation with the same.


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## ElOtro (Apr 4, 2021)

Chronotrigger said:


> Here's the kicker - she lost her weight a couple of years ago. Last September I started my weight loss journey. I was 260 pounds and am 6'2". My belly was huge. Since then, I've dropped 68 pounds and the belly is gone. I'm 2 pounds away from my goal weight of 190. The belly is gone and I look much better, but I need to build muscle mass as I'm pretty skinny. I think I need to start with protein supplements and start weight lifting. I know, I need to do this for myself, not her. Still, part of me hopes that putting on some muscle and doing some ab sculpting will make her think twice. If that doesn't work, at least it's a self confidence booster.


Forget the mucles as something to be shown and focus on what muscles are for.
There are a lot of enjoyable practices that will develope an athletic body without the static hypertrophy of muscles for just the looks. Do something and this for your own pleasure and health. Confidence will come from this as a deeper side result rather than because an almost hyteric mtivation.
Because of the same, forget on purpose suplements and get them from a good diet as a life practice.

Over all this, don´t tie your improvements to what she may like or do.
Even if you get muscular, there will always be some others, muscular or not, that will attract her more than her own life partner. I don´t see her worth of your efforts, EVEN if they end as you expect.

You are the prize, my friend.


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

Omg, dude please see someone


Chronotrigger said:


> Here's the kicker - she lost her weight a couple of years ago. Last September I started my weight loss journey. I was 260 pounds and am 6'2". My belly was huge. Since then, I've dropped 68 pounds and the belly is gone. I'm 2 pounds away from my goal weight of 190. The belly is gone and I look much better, but I need to build muscle mass as I'm pretty skinny. I think I need to start with protein supplements and start weight lifting. I know, I need to do this for myself, not her. Still, part of me hopes that putting on some muscle and doing some ab sculpting will make her think twice. If that doesn't work, at least it's a self confidence booster.


please PLEASE see someone. Muscles is not your problem. Self confidence is not what made your wife cheat. She makes the guy in the movie “shallow Hal” look like a great guy.
Your wife doesn’t love you. That’s the problem. I truly believe the person you describe as your wife isn’t capable of love.
She’s a monster.


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## fluffycoco (May 29, 2021)

Chronotrigger said:


> 1. Is she just tired of being married and wants to be a free spirit for a while to see if she likes it?
> 2. She is wearing her wedding ring on the opposite hand now. What does that mean?
> 3. She says she still is in love with me and cares about me, but says she needs to figure out how to love herself by putting herself first in her life. Is she still in love? How do you do this to someone you love?
> 4. Is she planning on dating as part of her freedom plan, or is she trying to replace me?


1. Is she just tired of being married and wants to be a free spirit for a while to see if she likes it?
She is just tired of being married with you.

2. She is wearing her wedding ring on the opposite hand now. What does that mean?
To show you she is still wearing her wedding ring, but for other people, she is a single now.

3. She says she still is in love with me and cares about me, but says she needs to figure out how to love herself by putting herself first in her life. Is she still in love? How do you do this to someone you love?
Maybe she loves you as friend and provider for the past years. But, No, she is not in love with you anymore. She was saying that just to make you feel better and wouldn't harsh on her.

4. Is she planning on dating as part of her freedom plan, or is she trying to replace me?
Really? of course, she wants fresh ....


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