# When will she snap out of it...



## BrianE (Nov 22, 2010)

Preface this to say I haven't been a perfect husband. I've done a lot of things I regret and am now working to better myself and not repeat the past.

Looking back at what I know now about the 5 love languages the wife and I are on the opposite spectrum's. So she's felt the entire 10 years of marriage that I didn't show enough love to her, when I was showing it in different ways.

The past year has been miserable with a lot of fighting and arguing over silly stupid stuff. There were no calm discussion, just yelling. Almost 3 months ago now my wife started seeing another man. Every Time she spent time with him she would come home crying to me and feeling guilty. Then when she did something with me she would cry to him saying she felt like she was cheating on him. a no win situation here.

Since we could do nothing but argue we agreed on a separation. She moved in with a mutual friend and I stayed at the house. We split time with our 2 girls (2 and 8) 1 week on, 1 week off.

I just feel like I don't understand her anymore. When we were together I was always trying to do stuff alone with her and have someone watch the girls for us. She always refused and didn't want to bur-don someone else with our kids. Now that she's with the OM she's the opposite, always pawning the girls off on someone else so she can spend more time with him. I'm having work problems and even asked if she wanted to keep the girls for 2 weeks this time while I focus on work. At first she said yes but then the next day said she's already made plans for next week and it's my week to keep them.

It's a roller coaster ride with her. 1 day she'll be fine and talking to me and really listening and thinking about stuff and the next the line is drawn in the sand and she won't budge. Case in point, Thursday she said she's been thinking of coming home. Friday I saw her for a few minutes at home while she was getting stuff and she broke down crying saying how much she misses her family. Now today, saying she'll go to therapy with me on Saturday but only wants to talk about what we need to do to move forward with the divorce.

I'm slowly losing this battle with myself. Because of all this stress I've already tried to kill myself twice and been committed to the hospital both times.

I still feel deep down she wants to make it work but she is scared and so confused she doesn't know what it'll take to make it happen. Also, she doesn't want to give up her current happiness with the other man to come home to a battle for the next year or more while we work out our problems.

In a way it's weird though because I told her joking. I know you don't like me always getting angry and us arguing but at this point all we fight about is the separation. If that were to stop we would have nothing left to fight about.

man... I'm rambling. Signing off.


----------



## ladyybyrd (Jan 4, 2011)

It sounds like she doesn't know what she wants. She is confused about that she wants to do.


----------



## michzz (Jun 6, 2008)

I am sorry for your separation and your failed wife.

I would suggest you stop relying on the unreliable and get a sitter or a day care service that each of you take the kids to during the day.

At least during this transition so your kids have stability.

Get a child care and custody arrangement in place!

Your wife has abandoned her family.


----------



## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

sorry to hear about your situation. You need to take care of yourself first. And dont ever listen to the lie that killing yourself is the way out. suicide is a PERMANENT solution to a TEMPORARY problem! Please heal yourself... your kids need you. 

You are so worried about her and why is she doing this and that, Please start thinking about your self and what you can control. 

You can not control her so let it go... but you can control what you do and how you act. You are and have to be better then her a cheater. Show your kids what real character is all about show them it's not how you get knocked down that counts, its how you get back up that counts. 

Letting your wife see how weak you feel is not attractive. I know how hard it is but please please please stop. show her a confident man that will move on and succeed and that you are not a cheater and you diserve better. Someone that will respect you.

God knows we all have treated our W like crap or why else would the y cheat, but what you need to do is pick your [email protected]@ up and take control of what you can control, and thats showing her and your kids that you are here and ready to fight for them.

Please stop begging and pleading and be confident that you have control and will move forward with or with out her. Your girls are depending on you.

Beside this the OM may be using your wife to get at your girls , there are alot of sick f*cks out there this is NOT A TIME TO GIVE UP.


----------



## BrianE (Nov 22, 2010)

the kids are fairly well taken care of. During my weeks I've got a friend who is a stay at home mom and she watches the younger one. During her week the friend she is staying with watches her, since my wife works nights. We haven't drawn up any agreements or anything yet. I've told myself for right now that's not what I want, so I'm not going to be the one to do.

She finally agreed to sit down with me and a therapist tomorrow. Although she said she only wants to talk about the divorce and what we need to do to move forward with it. I'm trying to tell myself that's the fog talking and when we get there I can say the things I need to say.

I know in my heart she doesn't want to be doing these things. Especially with the way she's giving up time with the girls for more time with him. She has to know that's not right but at the same time I've come to understand her side as well better. She's finally getting the 1 thing I couldn't give her. She's so happy with him and wants to spend all her time with him and no one else, not me and not her girls. I can almost understand that logic... almost.

So now I'm just going to have to wait till tomorrow so I can say the things I need to say. She's stuck with me for 10 years when I was a bad husband. I can stick with her now while she is a bad wife. I'm going to fight for this marriage.

Oh, and it's hard not to get emotional around her. All these meds they have me on now makes me a cry baby. I use to almost never cry for anything. Now it's water works that I can't seem to control.


----------



## remmons (Dec 20, 2010)

I am going to follow this thread. I almost felt as though I was the one who wrote this. A lot of what you are going through is very similar to what I have been going through, although I haven't had the D word brought up for some time, I am expecting this to come. I am preparing for the worse, but hoping for the best.


----------



## BrianE (Nov 22, 2010)

Right now she's playing the "I can't see you because I don't think you are ready" card. Telling me how I'm feeling and how I'm not ready after Fridays suicide attempt.

I keep saying. Thank you for your concern about my health. It shows you still care. I'm fine and ready.

What's stabbing at me right now is I said she's got to give me opportunities to prove myself. She fired back with, "I did, Friday." That's eating at me right now as if that was my 1 and only chance to win her back and I failed.


----------



## remmons (Dec 20, 2010)

BrianE said:


> Right now she's playing the "I can't see you because I don't think you are ready" card. Telling me how I'm feeling and how I'm not ready after Fridays suicide attempt.
> 
> I keep saying. Thank you for your concern about my health. It shows you still care. I'm fine and ready.
> 
> What's stabbing at me right now is I said she's got to give me opportunities to prove myself. She fired back with, "I did, Friday." That's eating at me right now as if that was my 1 and only chance to win her back and I failed.


Wow! We are on similar paths. I went to my wife's (our) house to try to talk with her, she did not seem all that interested in wanting to talk. I threatened the suicide thing, and the only reaction I got out of her was that she called 911 and said that I was a threat to her and the kids. I have had my two chances to make things right, but unfortunately, I was in a hurry to patch things up. I did not understand, until it was too late, as to the time frame and space that she needed to "heal". She told me that she could no longer live in sin. I did not understand, at first. Well, I found out some other stuff as well. She had infidelity issues that were eating away at her. By my pushing to fix things was only pushing her away further, and closer to the one who gave her the attention that she needed.


----------



## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

Brian, please as hard as it is stop focusing on her. she sees it and feels it and has no interest in the fact /bc no matter what she does you will always be there.

My point is... change that let her see that she will not aways snap her finger and you will come, that is kind of wrong..I'm tring to say that you are always around and she has not felt what it will be like when you have moved on and you no longer need her to make you feel better.

Make your self feel better in time she will see a confident man that can take on the world. Soon the OM and her relationship will start to fade. A day will come when she sees you in a brighter light b/c you are no longer miserable, negitive, and so depend ent on some one else. She some day will see a man that will no longer take sh*t from no one and a man that know how to succeed.

The only way to get there is taking control of what you can control. How you dress, how you smell, how you stand up straight and a smile on your face th that says Im happy and i will kick [email protected]@ if any one trie to stop me.

You seem so worried about what she thinks of you...stop worry about what you think of you and what you can do for your self and make you a better person that is happy, no matter what.


----------



## remmons (Dec 20, 2010)

the guy said:


> Brian, please as hard as it is stop focusing on her. she sees it and feels it and has no interest in the fact /bc no matter what she does you will always be there.
> 
> My point is... change that let her see that she will not aways snap her finger and you will come, that is kind of wrong..I'm tring to say that you are always around and she has not felt what it will be like when you have moved on and you no longer need her to make you feel better.
> 
> ...


I feel as though that this answer was for me as well. Not to impose on anyone elses thread, but I feel that I can also use this info. Thank you for sharing this with us. Maybe both Brian and I will benefit from this.


----------



## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

I hope so guys, this is coming from my own experience, and the thing about it is I know 1st hand how tough it is and it really suck to have to go down this road, but I'm sure the both of you and many others have stuggled with wanting your spouse back so bad and why and how they could do this. 

I started thinking the same way and it just didn't work. I could tell in the look in her eye that it wasn't. So I just stopped looking in her eyes and started looking at my self.


----------



## BrianE (Nov 22, 2010)

Well, the therapy session she agreed to go to last night was a small step forward. She came into the session only wanting to talk about divorce and me wanting to talk about reconciliation.

The therapist (who is a close friend of mine) took a different route. She said we are both hurting so much and have too many emotions so we can't work either one of those. She came up with a 2 month co-parenting plan. Were we neither discuss divorce or reconciliation for 2 months and focus on being civil and being co-parents for the kids.

This works good for me because in the session she said she's afraid of me and being alone with me. She's afraid I'll freak out again and hurt myself and rightfully so. With this 2 month plan I get the chance to prove myself that I'm trying to do better. She even commented at the end of the session that it does look like I'm really trying to be better and appreciates that!

We didn't talk about the OM. She felt that warrants a whole session by itself. Said if my wife is up to it we'll tackle that next Saturday and come up with a plan on how to deal with him.

I didn't get everything I wanted out of the session but felt it was still a success and a small step forward. I just have to really try hard not to screw it up again and take steps backwards.


----------



## BrianE (Nov 22, 2010)

Remmons,

As for the suicide attempts and wanting to hurt myself here are 2 things I'm trying. When I get those high anxiety feelings and my thoughts start to go down that road here is what I've been doing with some success.

1. Always wear a rubber band around your wrist. When you start having those thoughts snap the rubber band until it hurts to much. Yes, your wrist will get red and a little swollen but the temporary and non-permanent pain causes your mind to focus on that instead of the other thoughts.

2. Along the same lines. Squeeze an ice cube until you can't hold it any more. This one has worked the best for me so far. I think because I can squeeze the hell out of the ice cube to let some anger out and the pain causing my mind to refocus.


----------



## remmons (Dec 20, 2010)

the guy said:


> I hope so guys, this is coming from my own experience, and the thing about it is I know 1st hand how tough it is and it really suck to have to go down this road, but I'm sure the both of you and many others have stuggled with wanting your spouse back so bad and why and how they could do this.
> 
> I started thinking the same way and it just didn't work. I could tell in the look in her eye that it wasn't. So I just stopped looking in her eyes and started looking at my self.


With a well meaningful posting from another thread, I have finally "woke up" to the answer that has been staring me straight in the face, that the time and space that she needed, was really what I needed. Since the middle of last week, I have laid off of wanting her back, I have stopped talking to my friends and my Bishop about wanting to reconcile with her. I have started to refocus my attention towards making improvements upon my self, for my self, and not for her. My friends have told me to just continue down the path that I am on, to continually to grow and not worry about her. In due time, she will realize that she is still in her rut and that I will have progressed to the point where if she cannot see it then she is blind or ignorant.



BrianE said:


> Remmons,
> 
> As for the suicide attempts and wanting to hurt myself here are 2 things I'm trying. When I get those high anxiety feelings and my thoughts start to go down that road here is what I've been doing with some success.
> 
> ...


Thanks for the tips, but I feel that I have overcome this low, dark feeling. I look forward to every Sunday where I get to spend 8 magical hours with my daughter. She is my determination, my main reason for my want to live (as well as other reasons, of course). I promised her that I would be the best dad that I can ever be. She is a daddy's girl, and her mother resents this, but her mother does not have enough influence to keep my 4 YO daughter from putting her arm around me and telling me that everything will be all right.


----------



## BrianE (Nov 22, 2010)

You know 1 of the worst parts right now...

She's staying with a mutual friend of ours right now during the seperation. The problem is he lives directly off the main road. The road I take to/from work. There is no alternate route with out really going out of my way and doubling the time it takes to get home.

The weeks when I have the girls. Her car is never there, I mean never. Not in the morning, not shortly after lunch when I get my oldest off the buss and not when I leave to go home. NEVER. So I know she's with the OM 24/7 during those weeks. They work together and spend every minute up each others buts b/c they are madly in love with each other they can't stand to be apart. 

Ever time I drive by my anxiety shoots through the roof and thoughts flood my head of what they can be doing together.


----------



## remmons (Dec 20, 2010)

BrianE said:


> You know 1 of the worst parts right now...
> 
> She's staying with a mutual friend of ours right now during the seperation. The problem is he lives directly off the main road. The road I take to/from work. There is no alternate route with out really going out of my way and doubling the time it takes to get home.
> 
> ...


I am lucky that my route between home and work is away from my wife's place. I would have to deliberately drive down a cross road to see if her car is there or not, but I choose not to. When I get to thinking about my wife and her "fling" my anxiety shoots sky high as well, but it is how I react that counts. I have decided that there is nothing that I can do about it, and so I move on. Hell yeah it hurts, but I have decided to move on with my life, to make a difference, and to show the community that I am the bigger person. I am learning to "let go" and to move on with my life. This was a very difficult step for me to take, it took many friends advice many times to accomplish this. It was a post on another thread that I had read that finally made the advice "stick" to my head.

I finally got tired of all my anxiety attacks and wondering what was going on with her. I have discovered tha tthe harder I tried, the farther that she pulled away. As long as she is doing what she is doing, she will keep digging herself a deeper hole. As long as I keep doing what I am doing, I will continue to soar higher. My Church community do see this, I get all sorts of "How are you doing" and "Keep up the good work" comments. I figured tha tonce she realizes what she is doing and feels guilty, then she will call me and try to work things out. If she does, then Iwill take it slow, but if not, then there will be no great loss. I can find another one.


----------



## BrianE (Nov 22, 2010)

I know, I keep telling myself there is nothing I can do to change what she did or is doing. Some times it helps and other times not so much. For the most part during most days I'm ok and can put it out of my mind. It's just driving by that damned house that always gets me. Doesn't happen every time but at least 80% of the time as I approuch the corner and know the house is right around the bend my heart starts to race. Will her car be there this time.. just this one time put my mind at ease. Nope, not there and know exactly where she is at and what she is doing. Then my heart starts to race even more.

She's supposed to watch the youngest tomorrow morning. So she SHOULD be spending the night at the friends house and not the OMs. That'll put my mind at ease a little, unless I drive to drop her off in the morning and she forgot she was going to watch her today.  I'm always looking for the worst case scenario. 

I'm trying not to show her the hurt and emotions, so that much I've got control over.


----------



## remmons (Dec 20, 2010)

Good luck Brian. I know the pain that you are going through. I still love my wife very much. I sometimes keep expecting that phone call with her on the other end saying "I am sorry, can we work this out?" But in all reality, I know that this won't happen. By me backing off, and literally ignoring her, I know that she will no longer see how I am feeling, and that she will no longer have that control over me. All that she can control for now is my visitaion with my daughter, and even then she really can't, because my visitation has been ordered by the court and she cannot break it. So in a sense, I have some control over her.

Anyway, as I said earlier, lonliness hurts. Knowing that she is with some one else hurts like hell too. But as long as we do not allow this to consume us, we will come out on top. If we lose our wife, that is really not a big deal, as long as we do not lose our kid(s). Call me cold? Maybe, but I feel that she has already passed the cold on to us.


----------



## BrianE (Nov 22, 2010)

Well, I was able to hang in there my our daughters birthday party with her and her family at my house. I have to say my house because that's what my wife calls it now and not our house. 

Got home and she was there with the 2 kids and said she will be leaving in a few minutes. I asked her to stay and go with us to PetSmart so our daughter can spend her bday money. She kept saying no because she is still scared to be alone with me. I kept saying this isn't about us and this is our daughters day. Said we won't be gone long and I know she would appreciate you coming. So she came and it was a non event.

Once we got back home she got some of her things together and left. It was about 5 and the party was starting at 7. She said again, she doesn't want to be in the house alone with me. I calmly said Ok, I can understand that and sorry you still feel that way but I have to accept it.

She got to the house earlier then anyone else and I asked her to help me set everything up which she did. She helped me pass out cake and drinks and everything was going smoothly. After everyone was done she even started doing dishes for me. We didn't speak to each other very much.

Everyone started leaving and I asked her if she would hang around for a few minutes. I thanked her for being there for her daughter, thanked her for helping out with the dishes when she didn't have to. Told her this is still also her house and her family and we would love for her to come home, that I know it's not going to happen soon but to think about it. Told her I hope you can see I'm changing and you don't have to be scared while around me anymore. Gave her a hug, told her I love you. Then she left.

God I don't know how I managed to hold it together that well because now typing this all out I just want to curl up in a fetal position and cry. I did it though, I have to be strong and show her I'm stronger now.


----------



## remmons (Dec 20, 2010)

BrianE. I see that things could have went another direction, or even went south on you, but it didn't. She apparently felt comfortable enough to have hung around and stuck it out. You had shown her that you were not overbearing or over demanding, just relaxed and easy going, let things go how they may. Any pressure on your part would have resulted in her backing off, and by how I interpret your story, it seemed that she did not. This to me shows a sign of promise, but I wouldn't be in a hurry to"patch things up".

Of course the other side of the coin here could be that she was maintaining her composure for the sake of your daughter. But her doing the dishes? There to me is a sign of promise. Hang in there. Let time do its thing. Let her discover on her own how serious you are at committing and keeping the changes that you are making. She will realize this once her eyes have opened up.

I can only wish that my story could go like this. Your story is inspiring. Hang in there!


----------



## BrianE (Nov 22, 2010)

Not only the dishes but before I got home she was washing the bed sheets and suck too, I was shocked to say the least. What does she care if they care clean? She's not sleeping on them.

I asked her if she wants to come this weekend with me and the girls to take our oldest fishing, since I got her a fishing pole for her birthday. She didn't immediately say no, said she would think about it. I said that's all I can ask. She also said she still wants to go to the joint counseling session Saturday so that's a plus as well. I can only imagine how that is going to go because the therapist wants to talk about the OM during this session.

Was happy when I drove to get my daughter off the bus. Since I have to pass by the friend she is staying with. Her car was out front so I know she was there all night after the party and didn't go to see him after being with her family or go spend time with him today.

I'm trying to keep calm and let these baby steps pile up and not be too pushy or demanding.


----------



## remmons (Dec 20, 2010)

> Not only the dishes but before I got home she was washing the bed sheets and such too, I was shocked to say the least. What does she care if they care clean? She's not sleeping on them.


She is probably realizing what she has been missing out on, and that is stability and following a program that she was use to.



> She also said she still wants to go to the joint counseling session Saturday so that's a plus as well. I can only imagine how that is going to go because the therapist wants to talk about the OM during this session.


This is good news! Maybe you should ask the counselor to not bring up the OM during this session. Maybe talk to the counselor regarding what has transpired as of late. He/she will know where to go with this (hopefully).



> didn't go to see him after being with her family or go spend time with him today


Maybe this is another piece of good news. I can translate this as that she did not find what she was looking for, so she is "finding" her place in her life.



> I'm trying to keep calm and let these baby steps pile up and not be too pushy or demanding.


Continue doing what you are doing, obviously it seems to be working. Patience is a must here. Sometimes it takes a great deal of hard work and effort if the relationship is worth saving.

I am hoping that others will chime in here and offer their two cents worth. My instinct tells me that smething is working here, and not to give up or impatient. She is coming aroung on her time, as she is starting to understand the real truth of things.


----------



## jem5 (Feb 6, 2011)

5 Love Languages is an awesome book if you implement it in time.


----------



## BrianE (Nov 22, 2010)

I know of the 5 love languages and we both took the tests before this whole fiasco started. I started to change how I showed love to her but in her words "It was to late and I didn't change fast enough" I got about 2 months before she threw in the towel after that.


----------



## remmons (Dec 20, 2010)

jem5 said:


> 5 Love Languages is an awesome book if you implement it in time.


It may be too late for me, but I will still give this a try.



BrianE said:


> I know of the 5 love languages and we both took the tests before this whole fiasco started. I started to change how I showed love to her but in her words "It was to late and I didn't change fast enough" I got about 2 months before she threw in the towel after that.


I know what you mean by "it was too late..." My changes were too lat, but as I have discovered shortly after, so were hers. She was afraid that my "change" was superficial and only short term. I intend to keep doing what I am doing and to show her that my change is permanent.


----------



## jem5 (Feb 6, 2011)

Yes that is true. My husband was supposed to read that book in our premarital counseling and never did. Keeps saying he will and doesnt. By the time he does I'll be way past over it lol


----------



## BrianE (Nov 22, 2010)

Well, for some reason this morning I wanted to torture myself. When I drop our youngest off at the baby sitters I don't have to drive by the friends house who she is staying with. She's been there Tuesday and yesterday and not with the OM. For some reason this morning I wanted to drive by there after dropping the youngest off. Well, I was nervous has hell when I took the turn onto that road. Got around the corner and... her car was there!  So left me with more hope that this is now 3 days she hasn't stayed the night and spent all day with the OM.


I'm also having to constantly prove that these changes are real and I'm listening more to what she is saying. I've started by repeating back to her what she says to make sure I understand. 1 other thing I've been doing is asking for hugs when we part ways. 1 of her biggies for showing love is physical contact. So I keep asking for hugs to show her I do love her and am trying very hard. She keeps letting me, so I have to hold onto hope for that as well.

I'm still very nervous about this Saturdays session and talking about the OM. Not sure how she is going to take that.


----------



## jem5 (Feb 6, 2011)

Awesome! Let me know how your counseling session goes as me and my husband are making an appointment. Im not sure how thats gonna go. He always asks a lot of questions and I dont want to deal with them because theyre very personal/inappropriate and Im not emotional. My husband is at his moms because I thought that was better than us living together and doing more damage. What do u think?


----------



## remmons (Dec 20, 2010)

Brian, everytime I log on, I keep seeing good news from you. This is awesome! I am happy for your success! As you may have discovered, do not overwhelm her. Apparently the pace that you are on seems to be just right. Keep us up to date. Sounds like you just may have a successful reconciliation story to post on here some day!:smthumbup:


----------



## BrianE (Nov 22, 2010)

God I hope. I could use some good news now. Broke down again at work because the ***** of an owner said I wasn't doing my job properly. But the things she was asking isn't a very reasonable request and most not even possible. It was a good test though of my self control of my anger. Went to my office, closed the door to vent for awhile, took a xanax and tried to let it go.

jem5,
It might have been a good idea to be separated. That's how it was with me and W. Being together through all these emotions was just toxic and did no good. On the opposite side for maybe 6 weeks we went without talking or seeing each other and that became just as toxic for when we did have to see each other we would both blow up. Right now we are at a good middle of the road, not much pressure and most of all listening.


----------



## jem5 (Feb 6, 2011)

Thx! Yeah my husband said some pretty hurtful things yesterday and I decided that it was better we had a break then to make things worse!


----------



## Isabelle (Feb 11, 2011)

My heart goes out to you, sounds like you have been through hell. We have all been guilty of being lousy spouses at one point or another but it really sounds like your W has a lot going on that has nothing to do with you.... insecurities that lead to that kind of behavior pattern were likely developed long before she started her life with you. Everyone deserves to be treated with love, respect and kindness. What you are going through now is not that. Although it seems hard to imagine with all the pain you have endured love and trust is out there for you, be patient and it will find you. I am a firm believer that everything happens for a reason and maybe life has a different plan for you that is greater than all this.


----------



## BrianE (Nov 22, 2010)

I'm not giving up on this relations. The only "everything has a reason" I can come up with for myself is this is for the both of us so we can both be better people for each other. I have to hold onto that for now.

I'm holding onto hope because of what she's doing or lack thereof doesn't match what she is saying. She says it's over and wants a divorce and blah blah blah. Month or so ago I said then we need a separation agreement to make it legal. She hasn't pursued to make it a legal separation. She hasn't even really been looking for a full time job to support herself. The few times I have gotten to talk to her about everything she breaks down crying about how she misses her family and is hurting a lot as well and how she doesn't want to do this to me.

Small steps this morning again. She agreed to watch the youngest for me today since babysitter is out of town today. So she didn't stay the night with the OM. That means she went all week without staying with him! :smthumbup: Then just now a little ray of hope. Maybe it was just a slip and her not thinking about what she said or maybe I'm even reading to much into it. She asked if there was more wipes/diapers at home. She didn't say "your house" like she did Tuesday. She just said "at home." She also continues to let me hug her and tell her I love her when we see each other. So I got that again this morning.

Just need to get through today and see how tomorrows session goes now.


----------



## remmons (Dec 20, 2010)

Brian, keep up the good work. I know personally that it can be difficult at times, but hang in there and stay strong. You sound like that, considering the circumstances, you're doing a great job!


----------



## BrianE (Nov 22, 2010)

Not sure what to think now after today's session.

Bad
She was pretty much saying the marriage is over. No chance to fix it. The therapist even started to agree with her. 
Saying things have gone to far with my abuse to her and where she is now she won't stand for it and is threw. Fell out of love with me years ago and has been faking it.

Not so bad
Therapist said she is happy W is finding her voice and who she is. She thinks it will help though if she's not with OM who will confuse everything and not let her find herself by herself and not have someone else in her ear.

After the session drove her back to friends house. Gave her a hug and told her I love her again. Said don't give up on me, I'm doing everything I can to change myself to be a better person and I just hope maybe months from now she can see that it's real change and we can maybe have a chance at a future. She said Ok. Didn't out right refuse it.

My 1 month sobriety is out the window tonight. I deserve a drink and I've been able to control it for 1 month so I don't see the reason to continue with 100% no drinking.


----------



## Powerbane (Nov 8, 2010)

Augh!!! Say it ain't so!

Put it down Brian. 

You know the answer is not in the bottle!!!

Little progress baby steps. Dude. You didn't get here overnight. It's not going to be fixed overnight.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## BrianE (Nov 22, 2010)

god damnit why does this have to be so freaking hard.

So the girls and I went fishing together for the first time, W didn't want to come. Instead she went to lunch with OM. I was suppose to meet her at the friends house she was staying at around 5:30 to drop the girls off. We finished fishing early, maybe 4:45 and went to said friends house. I texted her saying we finished early and waiting at friends house. Then all the thoughts went through my mind, what am I going to do when I see him drop her off at friends house. Can I control myself and not beat the **** out of him. Well, he was too chicken **** to face me, he dropped her off a block up the street because around 5 I saw her walking up the street. I about lost it, telling my W, what he's to chicken **** to man up and face me. To scared he'll get his ass kicked, what a *****. I about left with the girls and said **** it. Stopped myself, apologized to my W and we went inside to chat.

We talked about changing the girls schedule. Instead of 1 week on/off rotation. I would keep the girls at the house, she would come to the house when I'm leaving for work and watch the youngest one and get the oldest off the bus. Then when I get home she would leave to friends house and get ready for work. She agreed to try it for a week so I packed the girls up and went home. Then the drama starts...

Friend she was staying with for some reason stuck his nose where it didn't belong and got pissed. Called me up all angry saying my W is a wreck and so confused and they are coming to get the girls. I'm like woo wait a minute, we just agreed to try this for a week and that's what I'm doing. He starts going off saying that I'm refusing to let her watch the girls during her week and blah blah blah. They show up at the house demanding to come inside and take the girls. He keeps telling her go inside and get them and if he has to will call the cops. I told him look, this is between my W and me and you are not welcome in the house. He said well, it's her house to. This is were it got good. Nope, not her house any more. We are separated and she said the house is mine so it's MY say and not hers. I shut the door and he stayed outside.

So then I find out what happened. When he got home and didn't see the girls there with her he was confused and blew up. Asking where are they at, why doesn't she have them blah blah blah. So with his anger and confusion W didn't have a chance to tell him what her and I agreed on. So he just called me and started *****ing. This is exactly why I said I didn't want him in the house and will no longer have conversations between W and I with anyone else there. They always want to put their opinions in and confuse W into what she doesn't want to do or has already agreed upon.

So now while this is a trial week for this new routine. I'm starting to think that if she doesn't want to continue it I'm going to refuse her to let this friend watch the girls anymore. I just don't feel safe enough about him watching them anymore after the way he extremely over reacted last night.

then this morning the kick in the face. When she showed up to watch the girls I said I would really like to take her to lunch today and it would mean a lot to me. She said she wouldn't feel comfortable and out right refused it.  F VDay!


----------



## remmons (Dec 20, 2010)

I hate to see so many baby steps takes just to see a huge back slide. I know first hand what the wife's friends will say to them to twist the situation around. She will hopefully come to the realization that the advice given to her by her friend isn't the right advice.

I have to agree with Powerbane. Try not to pick up that bottle. I know first hand that it is only a temporary solution to a problem that cannot be fixed in a short amount of time. Hang in there, try your best to stay strong. You will get through this, in due time.


----------



## BrianE (Nov 22, 2010)

Well, the truth starts to come out or maybe just the hatred but I'm ready to blow my ****ing brains out.

She got to the house way to early this morning so of course it lead to confrontation.

She doesn't drive herself to work because she knows I drive by and see her car out there. He comes to pick her up so her car is always out front.

She almost always sleeps at his brothers house with him.

She only says she doesn't know what will happen in 2-3 months because she doesn't want me to explode if she says there is no chance with us.

Said this morning there is absolutely no chance with us because of the things I've done to her.

Said she's found a man to treat her the way she wants to be treated and wants to spend the rest of her life with him.

Says she doesn't want the separation to get ugly but she will put me through the ringers and possibly jail if she has too.

Plenty of things as well. I remained calm during the whole fiasco but at the same time ready to blow my brains out. She things she'll get all this magical money from the money fairy. I told her I couldn't help her with 1 or 2 bills this month. She freaked saying she'll get the lawyer involved because by law I have to pay 2/3s of all debts. I of course said that's fine but I can't give you "extra" money I don't have. We've always been negative practically every month as it is.

Someone please take me out to the pasture and put me out of my misery.


----------



## BrianE (Nov 22, 2010)

Now she sends me a text saying sorry she was so mean.

I'm trying to tell myself to stay the course. Continually show I'm changing, take baby steps and don't blow up when she gets like this. This mess didn't start over night and won't be fixed over night.


----------



## remmons (Dec 20, 2010)

I'm sorry to hear this Brian. This sounds more like my story. Don't think about blowing your self off. I threatened that to my wife, it only caused more grief and the involvement of cops and a protective Order. Stay on track. Stay focused. Show the community that you are the bigger person here. You may no longer have her, but you still have the kids, Right?

In my life, I have learned to let go of my wife. I have been told that the less I pester her, the better my chances are for reconciliation. She needed her space and time. In a mixed blessing, so did I. Her family told me that if she wishes to continue her affair, let her. She will realize in time that it was not what she was looking for, and she will come back around, calling me. In the mean time, I have grown, I have become the bigger person. My Church does see that I am the better person, I don't have to say a thing. She lost ground in the Church as to where I have gained ground. She is spinning her wheels in the mud, where I am growing in fertile soil.

Don'y give up on her until the final word. Give her the space that she needs. I am sorry to say this, but if this is meant to be, then let it be. Keep those kids of yours close. They do need both parents, but they need a good, strong example, they need at least one stable parent, and that is you.

I don't have the answers, but if you ever need to talk, just PM me, I will be more than happy to be there for you. Good luck!


----------



## remmons (Dec 20, 2010)

BrianE said:


> Now she sends me a text saying sorry she was so mean.
> 
> I'm trying to tell myself to stay the course. Continually show I'm changing, take baby steps and don't blow up when she gets like this. This mess didn't start over night and won't be fixed over night.


It sounds like that she is lost and confused. Right now, she does not know what she wants. Stay strong, stay on course. Be there for her, but do not overwhelm her. Try your best to keep your cool, this is one of the wedges that you will drive between the both of you (I know this first hand). Your stability and strength will be what she needs.


----------



## BrianE (Nov 22, 2010)

Well, this mornings switch for the first time was uneventfull. We had some cansual conversations about fianances and played with the girls a little together.

These extreme ups and downs are so difficult to keep up with. I'm getting better and not letting them bother me though. I just have to keep to my own game plan and let the cards fall were they may.


----------



## BrianE (Nov 22, 2010)

I don't know how much longer I can keep all this up. There are to many things going on at once and I'm ready to say **** it.

1. Of course separated and W is with OM
2. On probation at work because of my attitude (from the separation)
3. Financially broke and we are negative every month. I figure 3-4 months left we can keep this up.

So if I lose my job I lose everything. If I can't get all my bills paid I lose everything. I'm already losing my wife and more then likely she'll be taking the girls with her.

It seems like we've been in this battle for 6+ months now but the separation has only been for 2 months currently. She is still stuck to her guns about being in love with the other man and she checked out of our marriage years ago. Doesn't even know why she feel in love with me in the first place.

Now, this morning. Because of the bills I'm going to have to sell my new puppy I just got to help pay some of the bills. This is the dog I've always wanted and finally got him 2 months ago, right before the separation. So now, yet another thing I'm going to lose.

I'm trying to tell myself this mess didn't happen over night and won't be fixed over night. I just don't know if I can physically and emotionally continue this for another 10+ months and hold out hope she'll come to her senses.


----------



## BrianE (Nov 22, 2010)

The extreme ups and downs continue and I've figured them out, I think.

Last weekend was her weekend with the girls. 1 of those days she brought them to the mall to play on the playground. She even txted to invite me as well. Sat there for awhile and she asked if I'm alright and that this doesn't mess me up? At first I thought she was talking about dinner because I started to cook dinner right before she txted. I said No, we can have dinner here at the food court if she wants. Said no, she meant am I Ok with seeing her. I just said yes, I'm fine, I'm here for the girls.

All week we were pretty good during the switches. Until Friday afternoon. I get home and she just blew up on me for no reason. I just shrugged it off and said Ok, I'll leave you alone while you get ready to leave. Then about an hour or 2 later she apologized profusely saying I did nothing wrong. She was upset at the dryer not working and took it out on me and that wasn't right and she was soo sorry.

Now, this weekend. Friday when she said she was sorry I said I'll probably bring the girls out to do something and she is welcome to come with us and be with the girls. Said she would think about it.

Well, I know for a fact she stayed with OM all weekend long. When I sent a text saying we're going to the park she said Not interested. Man, I got soo pissed. The youngest has been asking for her mama all weekend and now she blows us off so she can spend more time with OM. 

So here is my conclusion. The times it's been good and civil, she has been away from OM. From what I've heard she didn't stay at his place all week last week. We were civil and when she did something wrong she said she was soo sorry about it and it wasn't my fault. Now this weekend, she's back with him and wants nothing to do with me or the girls.


----------



## Powerbane (Nov 8, 2010)

Get yourself an IM (intermediary) and go to a dark dark plan B. No communication to her or her to you. It has to go through the IM. She picks kids up - either the IM is there or it doesn't happen. Same thing when she drops off or you drop off. 

She's cake-eating - and you know it. 

Read up on Plan B over at www.marriagebuilders.com

Plan B will stop a lot of that - otherwise she gets you both - OM and then you and girls. 

Anyone else have anything to add?


----------



## BrianE (Nov 22, 2010)

That's the thing though. We tried the intermediary thing for about 3-4 weeks and it just didn't work, ending up making things worse for both of us. Neither of us can afford daycare and now with us both having separate checking it's making it difficult on both of us to pay the bills properly. so we agreed the kids would stay at the house all the time, she comes to the house when I leave for work and when I get home she leaves for work since we work opposite schedules.

Doing the 1 week on/off with the girls almost caused me to lose my job. I was always having to leave for 45 minutes to get my daughter off the bus and bring her to the office. They got tired of that quickly. Plus, with the separation my attitude towards work has been that of "so what, I've got bigger problems". Neither of us has any relatives close by or good friends that could help with the girls.

She hasn't made anything legal yet and I'm worried if I push to hard she'll go that route and then there is no turning back at that point.


----------



## BrianE (Nov 22, 2010)

Here is my alternative.

Give up.

Tell her she can have the girls and to leave the house. Since I can't afford daycare the girls are herself because if I start bringing them into work again I'm sure I'll lose my job. Tell her as long as she has her stuff in the house I'm not helping her pay her bills; since I'm paying for the house and all associated bills. Then just work out an amount to give her for the girls to help with food and what not.

We're supposed to have another joint session Saturday. So I could bring this up then with a mediator there to help work out any issues she brings up.

The down side is I won't get to see the girls very much.

I'm fairly confident though if I go this route her "friends" (the ones supporting her in the affair) will convince her to make this all legal and take me to the cleaners.


----------



## BrianE (Nov 22, 2010)

Could use some advice on my above comment. Plan to talk to my IT tomorrow and if I want to go through with it the joint session Saturday.

I just don't know if it's what I really want. I'm scared to let her go and not see her anymore.


----------



## remmons (Dec 20, 2010)

BrianE said:


> Could use some advice on my above comment. Plan to talk to my IT tomorrow and if I want to go through with it the joint session Saturday.
> 
> I just don't know if it's what I really want. I'm scared to let her go and not see her anymore.


I was fighting a losing battle from the start. I can't give any advice that will help with the situation, just a little peak into what could be on the way.

Here is the link to my thread. You will see that there is no hope for me. Your path resembles mine somewhat. I have been keeping false hopes into a relationship that was not meant to last. Hopefully yours will not turn out like this.
http://talkaboutmarriage.com/consid...n/22443-any-ways-stop-divorce.html#post265811

I wish you luck with yours.


----------



## BrianE (Nov 22, 2010)

Ok, so here is the best way I thought of putting it during our session Saturday.



"Since you want to separate, let’s go ahead and move in that direction so you can experience what that will be like. If you want to continue down that road, we will. If you change your mind, we’d just have to see where we both are at at that time. The way it is now, it just doesn’t feel fair..."


----------



## BrianE (Nov 22, 2010)

And that session went to hell and a hand basket. Basically just both us yelling at each other for everything we've done to each other. said my plan for her to take the kids and leave isn't fair because she has nobody to help watch them. I felt like saying not my ****ing problem then is it, you chose to leave. therapist said it seems this is the best plan right now for everyone, including the girls so lets keep it the same for 3 weeks and see how it goes.

After the session we out to to BK to grab dinner and were able to talk civilly. She even started to express remorse about not wanting to cheat or divorce because those are 2 big things she doesn't think anyone should ever do. I started saying well I kind of do deserve it for the things I've done but she said no one deserves to be cheated on. I wish we had more time to keep that conversation going. 

Now, this week our oldest (8yo) has started to act up in school. Sleeping in class and not waking up to get attention. She's done it twice now. I know it's because of the separation and her being put in the middle of everything and hauled all over the place on weekends when we swap.

I just want to sit my W down and continue the conversation we had Saturday at BK. Look, I know you didn't want to cheat but you did, you can still stop this. You don't believe in divorce so don't do it. Look at what it's already doing to our girls. The problems between us can be fixed over time with counseling. We owe it to the girls to give it a try and not ruin their lives at such a young age.


----------



## The 13th_Floor (Mar 7, 2011)

BrianE said:


> And that session went to hell and a hand basket. Basically just both us yelling at each other for everything we've done to each other. said my plan for her to take the kids and leave isn't fair because she has nobody to help watch them. I felt like saying not my ****ing problem then is it, you chose to leave. therapist said it seems this is the best plan right now for everyone, including the girls so lets keep it the same for 3 weeks and see how it goes.
> 
> After the session we out to to BK to grab dinner and were able to talk civilly. She even started to express remorse about not wanting to cheat or divorce because those are 2 big things she doesn't think anyone should ever do. I started saying well I kind of do deserve it for the things I've done but she said no one deserves to be cheated on. I wish we had more time to keep that conversation going.
> 
> ...


Aww, poor girls... I was randomly reading this thread and came across that part. I'm sorry, Brian! Please try to keep it together. Give your girls a big hug..


----------



## BrianE (Nov 22, 2010)

I tried to talk to her more before she left for work. Saying again, we've both made many mistakes in this marriage and I hope we can both learn from them and have a better marriage together; not only for ourselves but for our girls as well. That they are hurting as well with everything going on and we need to think about them too. That our problems are fixable and we shouldn't be putting strain on the girls because of our past. Not saying stay in the marriage for the girls but to at least give it a real try, they deserve at least that.

Told her we can work on the finances together. Right now we have a joint account and separate accounts. She's agreed to move her money into the joint account and I'll do the same to pay the bills and then we can each take a little to put in individual accounts to do what we want with. So that's a little step to coming back home.

Also said we should stop doing the my weekend/her weekend thing. We should try to get along together and do things together as a family, even if that means just staying home. This one would be a tough one for her do to while still with OM but she said she will think about it. I told her I know she'll be working late today and it would be hard to come over tomorrow because she would be tired. Asked her why not come home and sleep on the couch like the used to and then she'll already be here and not have to do much else.

The hardest battle I have is earning her trust again. I screwed up the finances and I haven't been there emotional for her for many years. I've finally got myself into counseling and asking for help. Trying to stay hopeful.


----------



## Forgiveness (Mar 9, 2011)

I have been reading some of what you are going through and It must really be hard for everyone involved. The only advice I can give about trust (after my original post I am looking for advice on earning trust back myself) is you have to let her be. She has to be the one to do things. You cant push her it will only drive her away farther from you. Let her ask you if she can sleep on the couch. I am not saying don't ever offer anything, but just not as much. 

You cant let your separation control you. Don't let it cause you to undo all the hard work of you not drinking. It takes alot of control to not drink for someone who has a drinking problem. And from having an alcoholic in my family and a brother who has an addiction problem, they went through so much to stay sober and from what i have seen its an everyday thing. There is no quick fix for it. 

Your kids need you both. You gotta be strong for them and for you not for anyone else. This is your life and your kids, we only get the one life. Gotta live it to the fullest. Those babies will need you for the rest of your life it never ends. My father has been gone since 1987, I was 16. I found a picture of him just yesterday and i burst into tears at work. I hate doing that but when it comes to my dad, i have a hard time controlling my tears even after 20 something years of him being gone.


Really I guess what I am trying to say is be her friend if you can. I am not saying talk about the OM, because that's only hurting you, but just try to be civil and be a friend the best that you can. If she is going to move on with her life without you there isn't much you can do, but you can make yours better and be the best dad you can for your babies.


----------



## BrianE (Nov 22, 2010)

Well, yesterday I wanted to buy her some flowers and talk again. Store I stopped at was all out of flowers so I got some easter chocolates.

Was saying again to give me a chance, I've changed a lot and I know she can tell because she sees the girls are happier around me now. She agreed. Said we don't have to do everything at once because that wouldn't be fair to her. Said just come home and spend the weekend with your family. Doesn't have to mean stop the separation or anything, just time with the family. Said she will have to think about it because it's a hard decision she can't make right now. She did ask a few questions about how it would work, stop the separation, always spend nights at home etc. I said for now just weekends and see how it goes. She even commented on me losing weight! At this point I thought it was better to leave it at that and let her finish getting ready for work and think about it.

About an hour later she left for work and said she needs time to think about it. She still packed her bags for the weekend and said she will not be coming on Friday night. 

I gave it a shot and at least this time she didn't out right refuse it like the past. The only kick in the balls is she now has all weekend with OM who will probably undo all the work I've done this week.


----------



## twotimeloser (Feb 13, 2011)

Brian,

I have followed your story a bit and I want to tell you something directly. Not general advice, not emotional and not in the spirit of forgiveness or reconciliation.

You are not worthless.

That is pretty much it. 

Stop looking at yourself like you do not deserve success in life. Success in your relationships or just general success. Why does she get to live free and without consequence, and you are sentences to life of emotional slavery? Because you like it. Yes, you want to feel the pain, the fear, you deserve it dont you? You are a horrible excuse for a man and should be punished for your failures as a man and husband. 

That is EXACTLY how you are treating yourself. so I am here to tell you to STOP.

Punch yourself in the face right now and say " Beoootch, dont be a sissy" And take control of your life. You have VALUE. You have arms and legs and damn it, you can do anything you want to do. You need to go and do something you are afraid of right now. Dont even think about it, just do it. PROVE to yourself that you are not some lousy piece of human excrement. I know it.. These guys and girls know it.. Why dont you?

Have you ever played baseball, Brian? They teach you to go to the ball for a lot of reason... to shorten the time the runner has, to move you in position better and to create a smaller distance between the thrower and the catcher. Well I am here to tell you to RUN TO THE GOD DARN BALL. You cant spend your life backing up waiting on a fly ball, you need to run TO the ball. 

I am not here to tell you all the ways to save your marriage, because in your state, you should not. You need to become the man you know you should be. 

When i was a young Italian boy, and worried about how girls would respond to me... My uncle Anthony gave me the best advice I have ever gotten. He called it the " F*#k the Beotch" dating advice... Hey Italian, what can i say?

He said, when i wanted to ask a girl out.. I should plan on doing something that I really liked... Movies, arcade, basketball game.. whatever.. Something I wanted to do... and then ask " hey, I am going to the game, you want to come with me?". If she said said no, then.. " F*#k the beotch, I was going anyways." 

The point is, Do not let others drive your self-esteem machine Brian. YOU are responsible for your view of yourself, and what others think... well F*#k them beotches.

Get to a mirror, look in it and say " I am Freaking awesome" You will see it too. Just keep saying it. 

Get in a STRONG mental state, so you can start making Strong decisions. If no one else out there believes in you, then at bare minimum you should.


----------



## BrianE (Nov 22, 2010)

Honestly, I've played the nice guy this long because of our past. I haven't been the best husband and have been verbally and mentally abusive at times. So I've tried to be caring and understanding to show her I'm getting help and changing and not that person anymore. Did I let her take advantage of me? Yes but in the hopes she would see I'm not the same person.

I gave myself a time frame and that come up and led to yesterday. Showed up at the house with a dozen roses and asked her on a date Saturday, dinner and a movie. Said it's not a good idea, she's not ready for that yet and I should give the flowers to our daughter instead. Handed them to her and said to throw them away then, they are for her. Later she thanked me for the roses and said she would think about it. I knew what that meant though, she'll just tell me no again tomorrow and she did this morning.

So the gloves are coming off. Next Saturday we have another joint session to see how things are going. I'm telling her, either you take the kids and go or leave the kids with me and go. No whining about you don't have the resources to take care of them. If you want them then you have to be an adult and parent and figure a way to make it happen. If you don't want that responsibility then I'll take them and not whine about it or ask you for help.

I'm sure after this the lawyers will get invloved but I guess it doesn't matter because if it came to divorce in the end it would have to happen anyways.


----------



## BrianE (Nov 22, 2010)

It's been awhile and for some reason I felt compelled to post an update.

The old/new friend never called so nothing happened there. No biggie.

She was served with divorce papers at work earlier in the month based on adultery. Had/Has 21 days to respond and my lawyer hasn't heard a thing. Her 21 days are up Monday. She really doesn't have the money for a lawyer.

I'm trying to talk her into a separation agreement where I get full custody of the girls until she gets her head on straight. At the same time she not responding to being served we'll move forward with the discovery and forcing her to answer a series of questions based on the affair. Maybe, this will get her to finally start to think about my separation agreement. It's more then fair, many people are saying I'm being to nice but I honestly don't want any harm to her any more. 

I'm over everything finally. It doesn't really bother me as much. 

I lost my job 3 weeks ago and had a major breakdown for 2 days but was able to pull it together and work out some great plans thanks to my Dad. Start new job Monday making 50% more then I was before so that'll be great for the divorce funds!


----------



## ahhhmaaaan! (Mar 26, 2011)

Honestly, you need to let go and stop being a nice guy to her. She flip-flops on a constant basis, which I think have to do with OM advising her. She keeps on doing this to you because you allow it to happen- buying her flowers, coming at her beck-and-call, telling her "I love you" every time you see her. She doesn't respect the nice guy in you, my friend. You need to toughen-up a little more and not make it so easy for her to act this way.


----------



## BrianE (Nov 22, 2010)

Oh, I'm not doing that. I haven't bought or said anything nice to her or led her on in anyway.

I'm talking, last separation agreement I offered a $2k lump sum and she can watch the girls during the day and I'll pay her $200/mo for that. Stuff like that.

I haven't said I love you, or I want you back or anything. The other day she was asking about furniture for her apartment. I was saying I can help her out with that. I can give you some of the furniture in the separation agreement so you can get out of my life. Her biggest thing is not wanting to give up full custody to me. Even though my lawyer says we have a damn good case if it went to court anyways.


----------



## ahhhmaaaan! (Mar 26, 2011)

This is what I mean-"The other day she was asking about furniture for her apartment. I was saying I can help her out with that." Let her figure it out herself, or ask the OM man to do it. Your still her lap dog, bro. Don't you see that? She has no ides of how hard it would be without you if you keep on digging her out of her hole. She needs to fend for herself, so she can realize what she's missing in YOU- GET! IT


----------



## BrianE (Nov 22, 2010)

No, what I'm trying to do is force her to sign a separation agreement under my terms so I can get her out of my life. Hell, like the $2k lump sum. If she signed after that I could save that on lawyer fees fighting. She's getting to know how hard it is b/c I haven't helped her 1 but for anything in a few months now. Just keep trying to get her to sign the a separation agreement.

She's not responding so next week the gloves come off and she'll start to be forced to make some type of action anyways.


----------



## ahhhmaaaan! (Mar 26, 2011)

Press her on it. Let her know that you're not scared of being without her. She needs to be humbled. Don't do anything for her... no matter how trivial.


----------

