# Thanks For VAR Suggestions and Advice this far



## Noah2150

Listen to 1st VAR recording today and found out it is a male coworker she is conversing with constantly, not the female coworker she claims she is always talking to. From what I heard I think she is trying to meet this guy next Saturday possibly for the 2nd or 3rd time(not sure on this as no VAR prior). She was talking really low at times as I listened because our kids were home at the time, so couldn't make out some of what she is saying. My main problem is the lack of being able to purchase the GPS tracker t this time, as it is $100. She further confirmed her deception this evening, y wife is very adamant and will never admit to anything so I must catch her redhanded.

Reminder se has a numeric lock on her Sprint phone.


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## Noah2150

Meant Thus Far In subject line


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## Kasler

You don't need a GPS tracker see if you can get her email or just flat out snatch her phone from her when shes using it and see for yourself.

Confront before the weekend. 

Don't twiddle your thumbs and wait for them to have more sex 

Also shes only adamant because you let her get away with it. Don't play that sh!t. I'm not saying threaten, but you need to make demands and quite frankly, man up.

Also you don't need proof to take action. You know shes cheating, finding the smoking gun won't change what you're going to have to do in the long run.


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## Noah2150

Problem is we just had a huge fight about this a few days ago where she says she doesn't understand why I don't trust her and without solid proof before I bught the VAR yesterday I couldn't prove a thing.Also it really sucks loving so much that you don't wont to lose them after 18 years of marriage.


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## Kasler

You don't need to prove anything. 

And when a partner brings up trust there is almost always something going on so don't doubt what you know for a fact.


Noah, she is already gone. She is in an affair for christ sake. 

If you want her to come back, you need to shut this thing down, but don't delude yourself that because shes sleeping in your house you still have her. That means nothing while shes thinking of another man. 

Like I said, you know shes cheating, shes always with her cell phone and is now locking it. 

Next time you see her using it, snatch it, and you'll know everything within 5 minutes. (add more if you have to sync to the computer to restore deleted texts)


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## EleGirl

Keep using the VAR. If you can download the recordings. Put the files somewhere safe, make copies.

If you do not confront her before her next meetup, is there someone who can follow her to find out where she is going?


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## JCD

Rent a car and follow her yourself


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## The Middleman

You may want to also consider learning more about the next meeting, where andwhen, and follow her to it and confront them both at the same time. Catch them almost "red handed" in a situation she can't deny.


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## SomedayDig

Whatever you do, man, do NOT let on that you are suspicious. That could push this thing far underground. You've already got a lead with the VAR, so good job following what others suggested on your original thread.

I know this is tough. One of the toughest things you're gonna go through in your life. BUT...right now you are in control because you have a head's up. I didn't have that kind of luck. I had to discover my wife's affair on my own by finding a hotel receipt that she forgot to delete from her computer.

If you can find someone to watch you kids next Saturday, do so. If you have any family member around or close friend you can confide in you need to utilize them as a resource and do as a few have said here: Follow her.

The idea of meeting him on a Saturday is, IMO, pretty bad. My wife did the same thing for one reason...she knew I would be home with our children and wouldn't be able to leave the house. It was all about controlling the affair and it's exactly what your wife is doing here.

My advice is pretty much the same as others. Have a trusted person watch your kids next week without your wife knowing it is set up. She can NOT know. Your sitter literally needs to be in the shadows waiting to come into your home as soon as she leaves so that you can immediately get into your car and follow at least a block behind. Think Bond kind of stuff here and use your head. I would bring a good digital camera and make sure the flash is turned off. Not to catch them in the act or anything, but simply to take a picture of her car outside his house.

Then leave. Do NOT confront two people at the same time. You never know if this POS might have a firearm in his house and if you come to his door, he could easily see that as a threat to his property.

She's already been with this guy. Unless you don't want to go as far as I suggested, then you need to confront her this week. Try to get more VAR evidence, but again...do NOT reveal your source when you confront. Forget her phone. She ain't letting it out of her sight and all you need to do is look at your on-line billing to see what numbers she calling/texting. 

Sorry for rambling here. It's early and I haven't had enough caffeine yet.


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## Chaparral

Stick to one thread.


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## warlock07

S what is the plan now ?


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## Cdelta02

Noah,
take a moment to think through this clearly - what do you want to do with this? whats important to you?


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## LetDownNTX

Noah2150 said:


> Problem is we just had a huge fight about this a few days ago where she says she doesn't understand why I don't trust her and without solid proof before I bught the VAR yesterday I couldn't prove a thing.Also it really sucks loving so much that you don't wont to lose them after 18 years of marriage.


Sadly I know what you mean. In reality the love with make you suffer longer, thats the saddest part!


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## Noah2150

Thanks guys and gals, if you knew my wife I really do need to catch her redhanded, she is extremely passionate and convincing when it comes to lying. After our big fight about this last Saturday, when I was suspicious, she was so convincing that I apologized for questioning her. After listening to the 1st recording I know now she is and can be a really good liar.


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## lionsguy22

I think your good with the evidence already. 
I mean she said she was talking to a girl and you confirmed it was a guy. Plus you notice changes in her. Dude you caught her. She will continue to lie if confronted but you know. If you want to keep being **** holded then that's on you.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Noah2150

I am going to plant the VAR in her car tonight, since according to her call log online she talks to him mainly in her car. Hopefully she may flat out mention their encounter. Also, I will try to come up with the money to purchase the GPS tracker before next weekend. This is my plan for now.


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## Will_Kane

Noah2150 said:


> I am going to plant the VAR in her car tonight, since according to her call log online she talks to him mainly in her car. Hopefully she may flat out mention their encounter. Also, I will try to come up with the money to purchase the GPS tracker before next weekend. This is my plan for now.


Do what you must Noah. But you have enough evidence now. You should not tolerate her having a password on her phone and hiding her communications from you. You should not let her go ballistic on you in order to control you and put you in your place. You should work on being able to stand up for yourself when you are right and not feel that you have to have overwhelming evidence every time or else she will go nuclear on you. Go nuclear back or better yet just stick to your guns and walk away and tell her that you only will talk to her when she calms down.


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## Shaggy

1. did you semen test the underwear from before?
2. You need to have this guys wifes number on speed dial
3. if you want to catch her red handed then you need the freedom to follow her - make sure that's arranged for Sat.
4. You do need the GPS to find which hotel they are going to. Borrow the money from a friend, telling them its an early christmas present. A slightly cheaper version would be a pay as you go phone that you install locator software on. Charge it up, and hide it in her car.

And cheaters are at their very heart highly motivated liars.

btw - if you are still having sex with her, then try to spoil the night for the OM by having her first that night!

how do you think you wife will explain her slipping away for hours on Sat to hook up with him?


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## Shaggy

Oh, one trick to figure out the lock code - look at the screen and look for where the grease from her fingers unlocking the code is most visible.


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## Will_Kane

Noah2150 said:


> Listen to 1st VAR recording today and found out it is a male coworker she is conversing with constantly, not the female coworker she claims she is always talking to. From what I heard I think she is trying to meet this guy next Saturday possibly for the 2nd or 3rd time(not sure on this as no VAR prior). She was talking really low at times as I listened because our kids were home at the time, so couldn't make out some of what she is saying. My main problem is the lack of being able to purchase the GPS tracker t this time, as it is $100. She further confirmed her deception this evening, *my wife is very adamant and will never admit to anything so I must catch her redhanded.*
> 
> Reminder se has a numeric lock on her Sprint phone.


What if you catch her red-handed and she still won't admit to it? What if you hear her talking on the VAR saying how good the sex was with this other guy, and then when you confront her she says, _"we were just joking, we always joke that way, it is an inside joke from work, I knew you wouldn't understand and you are so controlling, I can't believe you would spy on me, how dare you, if you don't apologize this instant I'm taking the kids and leaving you and filing for divorce."?_

If this happens, do you apologize and try to actually get a photo of her in the act?


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## Noah2150

@ Shaggy I have a strong suspicion she is going to his house to meet him. Also, if he is using a condom, not sure if semen test will work.


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## the guy

It sound like your old lady is very skilled at her affairs and is well practiced.
I suggest you go a different angle and with the VAR and GPS you start finding out who the OM is and then instead of confronting WW you expose to OM wife/GF or his family.

Let the OM confront her about the affair!

This tactic seem more effective in breaking the affair up, since WW is "doing nothing wrong" why should she stop? So stop the OM by making this affair as inconveinent and as uncomfortable bt teaming up with OM wife/GF and figure out the best way to destroy this affair with out it going deeper undergroung.

The coworker senerio is tough to crack cuz its so well hidden at the work place. Continue to gather more info on OM cuz we all know whats already going on, now its time to find out who.


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## the guy

It appears you want to save this marriage and thats great, just don't let your wife know. In fact this may be an exit affair, but you won't figure that out until your plan move futher along.


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## Noah2150

@ the guy, I've tried to find out the owner's name of the phone online and have come up empty handed thus far. Even after paying a small fee to reveal the name.


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## the guy

Pawn off some crap you guy won't miss and get that $100. The GPS , I believe, will lead to OM, thus leading you two OM wife or GF.


What makes you think they will meet at OM's place, if he is single you may have to expose the A to his parents.


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## the guy

From what you said about your wife I really think exposing the A to OM side of things and letting OM confront WW is a solid tactic in making the A less conviennet and more uncomfortable.

This way you don't have to listen to all her bull crap when the cat is out of the bag.

Sure she will come to you all pissed off, but let her! Hell in some case its a waiting game WW knows BH knows that he know about WW and waits to see who brings it up 1st...but for the most part the AP wants to break it off in fear of lossing his own relationship or further exposure that the wayward can't help but attack the betrayed fro ruining there fun with AP.


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## Noah2150

Actually not a 100% sure she is going to his house. But the two times she was supposedly going to meet her female coworkers it took her quite awhile to get there. The call log shows she was on the phone with him for 32 minutes last Saturday when she left home.


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## the guy

In most cases the OM breaks the A off to save his own relationship, but there are cases Iv'e read were the Om is now aware that the marriage is not what the wayward made out to be and then find that there is someone being betrayed and hence the uncomfort level.

what really sucks id If the AP has a real connection with the wayward and doesn't want to let the A go. Thats when you have to fill and go nuclear with asking your wife to leave and fill...taking the fight to your wife if you will.

Again I still think you will have better results if you start a battle plan that attacks the OM side of things and he break up the affair....I just don't think your wife will....at least not until she is divorced from you (exit affair).


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## Noah2150

This situation is really starting to affect my health btw. I have really slept soundly for over a week.


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## the guy

Noah2150 said:


> Actually not a 100% sure she is going to his house. But the two times she was supposedly going to meet her female coworkers it took her quite awhile to get there. The call log shows she was on the phone with him for 32 minutes last Saturday when she left home.


So the possiblity is there that there is a wife or GF?


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## Noah2150

Yes there maybe.


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## the guy

Onlt you can figure how much you have left in you, but I think finding the OM is a must, and it won't happen if you light this up now.

But again your healthy is important both physical and emotional. If it time its time, but I strongly believe your confrontation will not have the effectiveness that you need.

You need the OM name, but you also need you health! Even after the confrontation....enless your wife drops to her knees and beggs for forgiveness....you will still continue to grieve and your health will be effected...so why not hang tough and get the GPS going.

Its not like you are going to feel all better after the confrontation, especially when she pulls the same old crap and you start apoligizing toher again.

I mean you got some good stuff on her, it just doesn't seem enought to pull her out of the fog, in fact it sounds like nothing will pull her out of the fog.


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## the guy

Do you think you have the strenght to continue and find OM?


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## the guy

Your best play is finding OM wife or GF and expose the A before confronting WW.

Your wife just sounds so off the charts that a better tactic is needed to fight this affair.


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## Noah2150

Yes I really do need to find out who this guy is. From the VAR recording I know he works in the warehouse at her job, while she works inside.


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## Kasler

canuckprincess said:


> Why is it on this site if the wife is cheating you tell the guy to man up but when the bs is a woman everyone seems to say yes you can have a successful R????
> I know this isn't the case in all posts but I've seen it in many. Posters tell the guy to throw her out or talk to a lawyer yet responses seem different if the cheater is a man.
> Do we as a society hold woman to a higher standard?
> 
> You don't need a GPS you already know what's going on, do you need to see them going at it in order to believe it. Makes sense they say men are more visual then woman.
> 
> Be patient and stick with the VAR, that's how I caught my exh years ago. Eventually You will get all the evidence you need but you need to sit tight for a few days. You may want to focus on what you plan on doing when you catch her red handed.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I honestly don't know where you're getting genders from, but if you read plenty of threads like betrayed wife, Sick, brandy, etc. theres plenty of women where D has been heavily suggested. 

It all depends on the circumstances. 

Anyways VAR isn't the red hand catcher most of the time. Good for learning more, but the smoking gun is usually found in the GPS, email, text or semen positive underwear when there has been no marital sex in a while.


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## Shaggy

First, affair sex usually does not involve condoms. Is your wife on BC? If so then no condoms for sure. So check the panties.

Are you still having regular sex with her or has she cut you off?

So you have a range for how far she goes to meet him. It's at least 32 mins drive time, though she might hang up before she gets there, it is at least 32 min.

You should have recorded her mileage on her car to see how far she went. 

Have you checked CC to see if she bought gas that night? If so where.

Get the GPS ASAP, sell something if you have to. Something of hers if you can 

You say it is a coworker. Do you know his name, how do you know it's actually co-worker?


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## Shaggy

Noah2150 said:


> Yes I really do need to find out who this guy is. From the VAR recording I know he works in the warehouse at her job, while she works inside.


OK, that's a start. What hours does she work? 9-5 8-4? 

do you have a var in the car at work too? (often a place for hookups)

are you checking her mileage daily to see if she's going straight to work?

question - why is your wife going out on Sat nights without you? How does she explain that and have the freedom to ditch you at home?


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## the guy

I think for the most part there a 2 distinct difference in affairs.

There is one kind were the betrayed confronts with a minumal amount of the wayward messing around and the wayward breaks down and it comes out and the fragile marriage is addressed

Then there is a confrontation with a minimal amount of the wayward messing around and the wayward denies, won't face the fragile marriage.

In your case your wife will not face her already fragile marriage and continue even under suspicion. Thats way if you have it in you you need to expose the OM to his side and let OM confront WW.

It appears you already confronted your WW and you ended up apoligizing, that in its self should tell you that you need more intel to ignite this affair and blow it out of the water.


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## the guy

Guys she is already in an affair...but with who!

@shaggy, your tactic will confirm a PA and it should be done.

I think money is an issue, your priority is spend it on a GPS then get a semin test.

Hell once you find OM and if he is married and sometimes the OMW will find out if it went PA.


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## Noah2150

She works from 8:30 to 5pm. I will place the VAR in her car tonight for the first time as my 1st recording was inside our home after me going to work yesterday. Yes we are still having sex, I even tred increasing sex more this week as trying to deter this thing.

I agree I do need more intel and the GPS tracker.


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## the guy

Go to the company web site, see if they have a list of employes and if its coilated to warehouse workers.

It could narrow down your search.


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## Noah2150

Also, when she leaves it's usually not real late, once an afternoon as well as early evening to meet her so called female cowrkers.


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## Noah2150

@ the guy I've tried that, no employee list anywhere on the website.


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## the guy

Damb, go GPS.

I think its your best bet.

Finding the OM and exposing it to his side is your best bet. Let him confront your WW.

Even if he is single by using his name during the confrontation will hold more wieght then the past confrontations.

It will also give you the confidence you need....see your not there yet and your wife can read that. 

There is a huge degree of confidence a wayward hears in your tone, your words and your jesture that will shows them you know whats really going on.

What sucks is your chick sound like the kind that would say prove and laugh while she walks away...I'm I right?


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## Noah2150

@ the guy exactly right.


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## the guy

Good luck on your hunt.

Just remember when the time come you have to look back at all the mannerisms you had on your 1st confrontation, and do the oppisite.

In my case my 1st confrontation was a flop and the A continue along with the denial from herand me.

But with in a week I had a text that sealed the deal, and confronted calmly and firmly. I was even comfortable with helping her pack with a smile on my face. That my friend was a turning point, no more dening, no more blame shifting, no more bull crap from her. Just lots of tears from her. I actually left her cry crap and went to the office for the day and worked while I ignored her tect and calls.

Anyway the point is having the confidence that you will no longer tolorate sharing your wife, and showing your WW that with a smile on your face you can move on.

Even though you and me know this is a scary time and not knowing what the WW will do....smile back and leave or beg to stay. sometimes you have to fake to make it. This is ans was a very week moment for me and you.....just don't let your wife know it.


Once WW gets that cent of weakness your cooked!


I still think that the reseach you do on OM will pay off bigger then confrotning her know. It was my experience that knowing more about OM then WW did had a shock and aw effect. It blow my wifes mind when I informed my fWW that the caller ID on her cell was OM daughters name.


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## The Middleman

canuckprincess said:


> Why is it on this site if the wife is cheating you tell the guy to man up but when the bs is a woman everyone seems to say yes you can have a successful R????
> I know this isn't the case in all posts but I've seen it in many.


I personally give the same advice to both betrayed men and betrayed women, however I do find myself harsher on cheating wives when they post vs. cheating husbands, but that's a personal bias on my part. My general advice to all betrayeds, depend on their circumstances and the extent of the deceit and infidelity.

I generally recommend trying "R" in the event of an emotional affair that hasn't crossed the physical line. If the spouse is quick to admit the infidelity and follows all the proper steps, and does the right thing, "R" is in order.

If the affair is physical but is a one time event or one night stand (not serial cheating) I think "R" should be recommended with counseling, total transparency/loss of privacy, etc. as long as the BS can gain a comfort level that this behavior is unlikely to happen again.

If the affair is emotional and physical or involves multiple encounters of unprotected sex, vicious lying, deceit, going underground and gas lighting, I recommend divorce even if the cheating spouse is doing all the right things trying to "R". Some things just should not be forgiven.

Again, just my opinion.



canuckprincess said:


> Do we as a society hold woman to a higher standard?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I don't know about the society at large, but I know that I do. In fact my wife and I had a rather loud discussion about my attitude in this regard recently, but that's a discussion for a different thread.


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## AlphaHalf

Increasing more sex to deter her from having sex with the OM or increasing your chances of catching a STD?????


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## the guy

I think the damamge is done, they already had sexual relations since the affair began so go for have sex...that why you can tell OM wife or GF that you are still very much sexually active with you wife and marriage is not over by any means.

Even if the guy is single and you confront him...then you can tell him the same thing.

I would however suggest you get yours first before she goes out for the night!


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## Pepper123

Sorry that you are going through this Noah. If you are going to consider reconciliation, you may need to start thinking about the fact that he is a co-worker too. One of them will have to go. Only you know what you are capable of forgiving... but you both have to want to make it work. 

Best wishes to you. I hope you are able to find the answers that you need.


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## warlock07

How good is the evidence ? Can she explain it away?

And the guy may be using a payphone or something that his work provides..


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## Noah2150

The VAR recording from yesterday was hard to swallow, I can't ever remember my wife ever talking to me in such a sensual and seductive way as the way she was talking to him yesterday. It really hurt. It could be a work phine, I just don't know. I do want to find out his name. I've heard her mentioned a couple of names when talking about work in casual conversation with me. One name in particular I've never heard her mentioned before.


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## the guy

Is it a full name? or just a first name?

Sexual and seductive is bad, but I think your old lady would be able to dismiss it as flirting (which is bad), but I still think your in a sitch were the the OM has to do the confrontation and break off the affiar.

Especially if he has an SO...it will be even be more affective in breaking up this affair.


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## Noah2150

@the guy, it is a first name only. I think she would say it was flirting also. Still wandering if she will confirm their encounter last Saturday via the VAR this week while in the car.


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## the guy

You already went down this road and you end up apoligizing, even though you have some intel..it takes more...more from you having the confidence to let your wife go.

Again I'm not say you have to want a divorce but you have to get into the right frame of mind. All the intel all the smoking guns won't mean sh1t if you still have the same mind set as you did before.

Its my under standing that the VAR only had a one sided encounter and that OM was on the other end of the phone. Enless you heard an "I love you" or a "I want you"? Maybe even if you had confirmation that they met before and it was "great"... I suggest until the intel confirm who OM is, your setting your self up for more BS.

I could be wrong cuz you heard what you heard, I didn't, so confront but the chance of finding OM is slim.

I think it would mean filling for divorce to get that info out, but even then if this is an exit affair you won't get anymore then you have now.

If you can give the GPS a shot....it hot and heavy now it won't take long...maybe once the GPS is placed a week at the most....maybe a day.

How long until you can get the GPS placed.


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## the guy

Not only to you have to find the right mind set, you have to take into account that your wife knows you are suspicios and thinks she is smarter then you and what ever you nail her with now she has already thought of a plan...she is a few steps ahead of already.

YOU NEED TO BE A FEW STEPS A HEAD OF HER!!!! Get the intel on OM before you make a move. IMHO

Once you have the were and the who you can put it all together with the when that you have now. Then you can expose to OM wife or GF or confront WW.


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## warlock07

Throw her a bait.... Say you have to go to out of town on the days she wants to meet him. Have someone cover you at work just in case..

The guy could just be another scumbag who has an affair phone


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## Thor

Noah, is it correct that you want to try to reconcile with your wife? If so you need to blow the affair up. But if you are wanting to divorce you can just do that right now without proving anything to anybody.

I think there are two ways to go right now with attempting R. One is the path everybody is recommending, which is to gather some intel and then confront her with solid proof. Really it is silly in a way because she knows she is in a PA, and you know she is. You just can't prove it beyond a shadow of a doubt to an outsider. Why do you need to prove to anybody else?

The game you are playing with her now is you trying to convince her you have proof and her poking holes in what you have. Until you catch the two of them in the act you will never have absolute proof, and she can keep gas lighting you as long as you are willing to do this dance with her.

So another strategy to consider is to just file for D this week. Have her served with papers before next weekend. Yes meanwhile continue to try to find out who posom is because that can be helpful data. The strategy to file is you telling her you know enough to be sure she is cheating, and you are not putting up with it. The ball is in her court, and the first thing she has to do is verifiably end the affair. So you file, you have her served at work (so word gets around to posom), and then you tell her you prefer R but unless she complies with your requirements the D will go through. And you keep the D in process.

This is a tough way to go, and you have to be prepared to continue. So you have to decide that you will not be married to her if she continues the affair. What's your position on that? Will you stay with her if she doesn't end this affair immediately? Or will you D her if she doesn't end the affair immediately?

If you will D her if she stays in the affair, it is a strong position to file on her.


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## Silverlining

RightfulRiskTaker said:


> I am not trying to take over your post sir, but boy do I know what you are going through. Please allow me to get some useful advice from your posters in my scenario. I have learned so much here. Any advice on what to do when the affair goes underground? What about if your WS drives for a trucking company and uses a different truck everyday (Can't plant a VAR) and has a secret go phone? I can't afford a PI and already have an app on his phone. Nothing, except encrypted notes and texts - rarely. I understand there are apps that circumvent sWare by diverting calls and messages. Also on the phone bill I see texts back and forth from his # to his # (makes no sense). Occassionally when he delivers to a hotel, gps shows he's there for about 30-45 mins but he explains that it was a delay. The trigger for me is when he omits telling me about an upcoming hotel stop and picks a fight on the phone, stays angry not answering my calls most of the day and is evasive that day. He usually tells me daily where he is going on his routes including hotels, but on those days, I find out via gps and when I call he does not answer right away as he normally does. Help!



Start your own post and I'm sure you will get some great advice. 
Have the mods move this to a new thread.


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## Noah2150

In addition too, I took you guy's advice as too playing like everything is fine game and showing her extra affection all day as to not arise suspicion of my investigation. She in turn was very affectionate to me in return, even kissing me before going to bed and she doesn't do that. To be honest it made me feel as if I am causing her to cheat(is this normal to blame yourself for your spouse cheating). I know and have read some posts about man up and some may think I am a wuss, but I do want to reconcile if possible. I have never in my life loved a woman more than I have loved my wife.


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## tom67

Noah2150 said:


> In addition too, I took you guy's advice as too playing like everything is fine game and showing her extra affection all day as to not arise suspicion of my investigation. She in turn was very affectionate to me in return, even kissing me before going to bed and she doesn't do that. To be honest it made me feel as if I am causing her to cheat(is this normal to blame yourself for your spouse cheating). I know and have read some posts about man up and some may think I am a wuss, but I do want to reconcile if possible. I have never in my life loved a woman more than I have loved my wife.


but if you've read the threads you have to show the strength to move on. Do you want to keep on living like this?


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## keko

Noah do you have a relative or a "real" friend that can tail your wife next time she heads out?


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## Noah2150

@ tom67 no I do not want to live like this, I am still up now and should be in bed for work in the morning, but this situation is causing me to only sleep for 1 to 3 hours at best.


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## Noah2150

@ keko I do not all my family is back east I am here alone with her famly only. As far as friends, i've always kept to myself.


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## tom67

Noah2150 said:


> @ tom67 no I do not want to live like this, I am still up now and should be in bed for work in the morning, but this situation is causing me to only sleep for 1 to 3 hours at best.


I'm sorry to hear that mine left 2 years ago for om they broke up whatever I moved on have gf and may have to take 15 yr old d because she still hates mother for what she did but I digress, you may have to file to wake her up stop reading me and get some rest take care of yourself


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## SomedayDig

Noah2150 said:


> @ tom67 no I do not want to live like this, I am still up now and should be in bed for work in the morning, but this situation is causing me to only sleep for 1 to 3 hours at best.


This is one of the hardest parts about infidelity: The havoc it brings to your physical well being. Those of us who have gone through this know only too well where you are right now, man. It isn't easy in the least bit. I hope you can get some sleep. It's 2:30am where I am. I went to bed at 10pm. It happens sometimes still.

Also, you are NOT causing or even allowing your wife to cheat. That is 100% on her. She has chosen this path on her own. Did she ever ask your permission? No. So, you have to let that part of the emotions go. It's really one of the only ways you're going to get through this next part.

You love your wife. I can see that. I totally get it, too. You want to be able to reconcile with her, but you have to understand that the woman you're living with right now isn't your wife. Not in the sense she should be at least.

That said, any of the stuff that you have read where it says "Man up"...well...don't take that verbatim. I see that as kind of a load of crap. Manning up has absolutely _nothing_ to do with this. IMO that kind of talk does nothing except emasculate guys just like the affair does. This has NOTHING to do with your manhood. You are not wrong in any way, shape or form for loving your wife and wanting to attempt to reconcile your marriage.

Just remember, right now...this woman ain't your wife. If she was, she wouldn't be planning on going to see another man in a few days.

Keep gathering your evidence on the VAR. Find out every single thing you can about this OM. Hopefully, you can get a name before Saturday. Then...when she is getting ready to leave to go see him, THAT is when you say in a very clear voice and from a place of power, "Be sure you really want to do what you're getting ready to do, cuz if you walk out that door tonight, you will not be coming back". Then...do not give up your resources and tell her you know everything - hopefully being able to even give her the OM's name.


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## Noah2150

Didn't do my research on the GPS tracker I was going to buy. Borrowed the $100 today to buy the gps tracker and the guy in radio shack sid there is an activation fee, monthly service and contract to use this device. It is made by Zoom. Any other suggestions about where to get a GPS tracker without this type of hassle. Also, I told my wife I have to work Saturday for 4 hours and she says she will probably be meeting up with a couple of female workers on Saturday. I need to have something in place before then. Please Help.


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## Shaggy

Like I suggested earlier. Get an AT&T android go phone and put a locator app on it. Then just charge it and hide it in her car with the ringer off. Then use the finder to find where your phone has gone.


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## sharkeey

Thor said:


> I think there are two ways to go right now with attempting R. One is the path everybody is recommending, which is to gather some intel and then confront her with solid proof. Really it is silly in a way because she knows she is in a PA, and you know she is. You just can't prove it beyond a shadow of a doubt to an outsider. Why do you need to prove to anybody else?


This is exactly right.

I see this sort of thing all the time on here where the betrayed partner knows their spouse or boy/girlfriend is cheating and yet they continue to ask for ways to get more solid evidence.

It's pointless. What anyone else might think doesn't matter. The courts won't care either. 

The only person that matters is YOU. If you know the truth then it's game over. 

If you're trying to save the marriage then yeah there's a bunch of steps you can take including "exposing to break the affair fog" for whatever that might be worth.

But if you're going to divorce her then save yourself the time and effort of all that GPS tracking and anything else designed to gather proof, and just go see an attorney and file for divorce.


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## Noah2150

@ Shaggy is the locator app accurate?


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## Shaggy

The phones have a GPS built into them and will also use cell phone towers.

When it's got clear sky it's pretty accurate, when its hidden in the car and using the cell towers is still going to tell you the location. Go to the AT&T store tell them you want a go phone for your kid but you are worried about him loosing it do you want to be able to track it and find it when he loses it.

You want to be able to track down where her car is parked. The other option, but far far more risky is to slip the phone into her purse.


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## sharkeey

Shaggy said:


> The other option, but far far more risky is to slip the phone into her purse.


Am I the only one who thinks that it's extremely likely that she'll discover a phone that was slipped into her purse?


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## Silverlining

Do you have an iPad?

You can place the iPad in her car with the locator app (Find iphone) installed through icloud. The iPad must have 3G (4G) not just wifi. 
This app is very accurate!


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## chumplady

> I have never in my life loved a woman more than I have loved my wife.


Noah, I just read your thread and this stands out.

You love a person who you said "passionately" and "convincingly" lies all the time.

You love a person who is actively cheating you and disrespecting you.

Her infidelity is killing your health. You sleep a few hours each night.

You love a person who is probably exposing you to STDs and endangering your health.

I could go on, my point is -- this is NOT a love that is good for you. It's not healthy. I know you want to R and save your marriage -- but with whom? This toxic person? You need to see her for who she IS, not who you wish she was, or her potential. To R, you need remorse, honesty, transparency. You have none of these things.

Some love isn't good for us. Pedophiles "love" children. Addicts "love" drugs. You can detach in love. You can love someone and walk away. 

You need to love yourself too. I don't see a lot of self love. I worry you'll find your evidence, but still need to go down the rabbit hole of chasing for more. I think you need the evidence more for you than for her. She will just lie more artfully and manipulate more passionately. You're the one who needs to believe what he is seeing.


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## donny64

JCD said:


> Rent a car and follow her yourself


Rental car (common, dark in color), halloween wig, hat, glasses. Cheap, easy, effective (says the guy that used to surveil for a living). Bring a camera with some good zoom capabilities.


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## sharkeey

donny64 said:


> Rental car (common, dark in color), halloween wig, hat, glasses. Cheap, easy, effective (says the guy that used to surveil for a living). Bring a camera with some good zoom capabilities.


Why do I get the feeling this isn't going to end well.


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## Pepper123

She will find a phone in her purse... I know I would. 

I think it is fair for him to say he loves her... but if you want to try and reconcile once you expose her, she needs to be willing to give him up completely -- including not working with him.

-- says someone who worked with her AP --


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## sharkeey

I'm picturing this poor guy driving behind them and then parking across the street, peering at them with a telescope while trying to line it up between the fake plastic glasses while the fake moustache tickles his nose, as she reaches into her purse to get a breath mint before kissing the OM and pulls out the spy phone, looks around and sees moustache man just as he sneezes loudly from the itching and then the funny glasses and moustache go flying and he's caught in the act of catching them in the act..


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## tom67

donny64 said:


> Rental car (common, dark in color), halloween wig, hat, glasses. Cheap, easy, effective (says the guy that used to surveil for a living). Bring a camera with some good zoom capabilities.


I have the theme from ispy as my ringtone this week.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## JCD

chumplady said:


> Noah, I just read your thread and this stands out.
> 
> You love a person who you said "passionately" and "convincingly" lies all the time.
> 
> You love a person who is actively cheating you and disrespecting you.
> 
> Her infidelity is killing your health. You sleep a few hours each night.
> 
> You love a person who is probably exposing you to STDs and endangering your health.
> 
> I could go on, my point is -- this is NOT a love that is good for you. It's not healthy. I know you want to R and save your marriage -- but with whom? This toxic person? You need to see her for who she IS, not who you wish she was, or her potential. To R, you need remorse, honesty, transparency. You have none of these things.
> 
> Some love isn't good for us. Pedophiles "love" children. Addicts "love" drugs. You can detach in love. You can love someone and walk away.
> 
> You need to love yourself too. I don't see a lot of self love. I worry you'll find your evidence, but still need to go down the rabbit hole of chasing for more. I think you need the evidence more for you than for her. She will just lie more artfully and manipulate more passionately. You're the one who needs to believe what he is seeing.


Yeah. What is the endgame here? It's a cliche, but let's ask this again.

If it was your brother's girl, what would you advise him. Forget the BJs and the honeymoon to Cancun. Forget the WORDS she says. As you WELL know (or should know at this point) people can lie convincingly.

What is happening is you want an illusion of a woman. You want her to be something she currently is not. And you don't necessarily have a hope that she can or will change.

Think about that. She MIGHT be able to change...and might REFUSE to do that. She is firmly in charge in this relationship. But with her power, she is not using any responsibility...or compassion...or honor...or morality.

So here are a list of questions you need to ask yourself.

If you KNOW she's committing adultery, why do you need more? You KNOW the reality you need to deal with.

If you want more information to 'confront her' what exactly do you imagine will happen? That she will fall to your feet in remorse, confess her sins and become a better person? What if that is NOT her reaction? What do you plan on doing then?

Why are you letting her win every argument? Just because a person can argue effectively, doesn't make them right or a good person. It makes them a good arguer (or lawyer...funny how the lawyer analogies just seamlessly fit with cheaters and cads...)

Do you love THIS woman or your perception of who you thought she was? Has she changed into this new being or was she always like this but she lied and argued her way out of you seeing the real her? (all while in the haze of marital euphoria)

What will you do if she doesn't want to change back...or change into something else?


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## Thor

If the GPS in the car is not an option for $ reasons, how about hiding the VAR in the car? It won't give you a location but it will give you possible phone conversations. And it will tell you how long she drove and approximately how fast by the noise.

I like the cell phone with gps locator app. Be sure you know how to silence all sounds and for cripes sakes don't call it except as necessary to access the locator app. If you can put it where it has some view of the sky, like in a seat back pocket, it may pick up some GPS satellites. GPS signals don't go through metal so you shouldn't put it in the trunk.

Another option may be a GPS device which plugs into your car and uses the car's gps. They make them for tracking teens, but they may be out of your price range, and they may have an expensive activation fee like the one you already looked at.

A couple of friends who can tag team follow her from a distance would be the cheapest way to get the guy's location.


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## keko

Noah2150 said:


> Didn't do my research on the GPS tracker I was going to buy. Borrowed the $100 today to buy the gps tracker and the guy in radio shack sid there is an activation fee, monthly service and contract to use this device. It is made by Zoom. Any other suggestions about where to get a GPS tracker without this type of hassle. Also, I told my wife I have to work Saturday for 4 hours and she says she will probably be meeting up with a couple of female workers on Saturday. I need to have something in place before then. Please Help.


If you want to track the GPS real time you have to pay a monthly fee and in most cases sign a contract. 

Try finding a used phone off of craigslist like Shaggy mentioned and use its locator to track your wife.


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## Noah2150

I mentioned earlier in my post that my wife wont admit to anything unless she is caught red handed. My gut still says she met this guy the Saturday of Thanksgiving, but I have no solid proof. The VAR is currently in her car underneath the driver seat and I have not listened to it yet since the 1st recording inside our home. I will definitely;ook into the AT&T droid go phone option. Also, I was going to place it in the trunk of the car now I know that would disrupt the signal.


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## SomedayDig

If you do go the droid route, I will suggest a free app called Real Time GPS Tracker from greenalp.com. My wife downloaded this onto her phone for me a couple weeks after Dday in March. It's real time and accurate to within a few meters. The bad thing is this - Droids suck for battery life and any GPS app is gonna be a major suck. Make sure it's fully charged and somehow installed "last minute" to make sure you've got good battery life.


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## Noah2150

@somedaydig I forgot about the battery when using this gps on cell phone. This tells me I have to place it on Saturday morning before work rather than Friday night which was my original plane.


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## DavidWYoung

I think JCD covered it all, why do you feel that you need this information? She is gone. You can not LIKE her back to you. Let her go and start a new life without her. I know it sounds uncaring but its not. She left. Now ,you leave. Keep us updated Thanks David


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## SomedayDig

Noah2150 said:


> @somedaydig I forgot about the battery when using this gps on cell phone. This tells me I have to place it on Saturday morning before work rather than Friday night which was my original plane.


Yeah, don't let it sit over night. Definitely place it in the morning. Trust me, you will find a way to do it un-noticed.

Oh, by the way - that program I recommended, yeah...the greatest thing about it is that you can watch the whole thing unfold in real time on your PC through their website. Real Time Tracker

Trust me...this app works quite well. When Regret went to a birthday party for a colegue a few months back, she had it on the whole time. I had the map set to satellite imagry and it literally tracked her as she walked. I could see where she was INSIDE the damn house!! It was crazy.


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## Noah2150

@somedaydig. Wow, I just went to the website and watched a demo. So you guys reconciled after she cheated?


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## Plan 9 from OS

Noah2150 said:


> I mentioned earlier in my post that my wife wont admit to anything unless she is caught red handed. My gut still says she met this guy the Saturday of Thanksgiving, but I have no solid proof. The VAR is currently in her car underneath the driver seat and I have not listened to it yet since the 1st recording inside our home. I will definitely;ook into the AT&T droid go phone option. Also, I was going to place it in the trunk of the car now I know that would disrupt the signal.


Two questions: 1) If you catch your wife red handed, would it be advantageous to you get solid proof in case of divorce or do you live in a no fault state? 2) Do you have any doubts at all that your wife is not cheating on you?

If your answers to the questions are 'no' to both, then you no longer need to go into clandestine ops mode. How can she lie her way out of it when it's between you and her? You already have the VAR and the text messages that incriminate her. I'd confront her again and demand the truth. If she tries to lie her way out of it, then ask her to take a polygraph to prove it. If she refuses, then you know the truth beyond a shadow of a doubt. If she agrees, DO NOT back out and see it through to the bitter end. She may try to pull the "I'll do it, so no need to actually do it" routine...


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## SomedayDig

Noah2150 said:


> @somedaydig. Wow, I just went to the website and watched a demo. So you guys reconciled after she cheated?


We are working on reconciliation, yes. Dday was March 6th, so almost 9 months to the day. It ain't easy. Matter of fact, it's pretty f'ng daunting. 

However, _she_ knows and more importantly DOES the heavy lifting that's required of her. Not a day goes by that she doesn't text me to say she's on her way home and then just during the day to say hello. She goes to individual counseling as well as marriage counseling. I'm not saying she's got this stuff down perfectly. She trickle truthed me til August. Not big stuff either, but that ain't the point - it's the continued lying that is a continuence of the betrayal.

Click my name and look at some of the posts about how tough reconciliation is. I won't ever tell anyone to try it, though. That's a decision that *TWO* parties must make and be 100% willing to give it their all. 50% just won't do it. Ever.

As for the website and tracker...for a free app...it's pretty damn good!


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## Noah2150

@plan 9 I do not know if I live in a No Fault state. As far as what I know. I know for sure this is a male coworker. I know for sure she talks to him everyday for almost an hour on her way to and from work. I know he works in the warehouse, while she works inside the offices. I know the one time I came home early she hung up her cell phone quickly nd said it was this female coworker that we both know, according to the call log online it was him. I do not know if she met him for sure on November 24. Also, I haven't been able to read any text messages on her phone.


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## keko

If she's using a smartphone you might be able to extract the texts through PC.


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## tom67

Noah2150 said:


> @plan 9 I do not know if I live in a No Fault state. As far as what I know. I know for sure this is a male coworker. I know for sure she talks to him everyday for almost an hour on her way to and from work. I know he works in the warehouse, while she works inside the offices. I know the one time I came home early she hung up her cell phone quickly nd said it was this female coworker that we both know, according to the call log online it was him. I do not know if she met him for sure on November 24. Also, I haven't been able to read any text messages on her phone.


Well then you know it is time to confront either this affair ends or she moves out. How much bs are you willing to put up with?


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## Noah2150

@ keko she has a numeric lock on her phone. I brought up the locked phone thing last night. She ave me some lame excuse.


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## mahike

Noah sorry you are here. I have been going through your posts. I really understand the part about not getting the rest. If you have a couple of recorded messages you may want to confront and expose now. Waiting and trying to get more info is going to hurt your health even more.

I would put her stuff out of the house while at work and expose the A to your families at the same time. Let her know you have proof but do not tell her how much.

Go file for D right away and really rock her world. When you get her served make sure they do it at work.

If after all this she wants to come clean and try to work things out. Go for it but in the mean time you need to go shock and awe on your wife.


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## Noah2150

@tom67 This coming Saturday may by my D day.


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## thunderstruck

Noah2150 said:


> @ keko she has a numeric lock on her phone. I brought up the locked phone thing last night. She ave me some lame excuse.


At this point, there is probably no point in pushing that. If you get her to unlock it, that means she has wiped it clean, and has told the OM to find a different means of commo. I didn't read the whole thread, but you asking about the lock tells her that you are on to her, and she has probably taken this deep underground.

Sorry. This sucks. I wish you peace and strength in the days ahead.


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## Soifon

I just want to second the go phone suggestion. My SIL had her phone stolen at work, she turned on the GPS finder and it pin pointed the location close enough that she looked at her sales list and had the exact address of the customer who stole it.

You said you have to work that Saturday. Anyway you can call off, not tell her and be positioned to just follow her that day while she thinks you are at work?

Does your wife use FB? If you think you know the guys first name I would look through her friends list to get his full name. Guarantee if she uses FB he is on there.


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## roostr

Noah, do you know if she takes any time off during the week? Is there a way to see her time off balances from maybe a check stub? Just saying that is she in fact is hooking up with someone from work, its extremely likely that they may be taking afternoons off together. A few hours personal time here and there. What doesnt make sense to me is why would she talk to him for that amount of time before work if she will see him at work? What type of building is it, do they have the opportunity to sneak to be together at work? The VAR should tell you what you need to know is my guess.


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## Noah2150

@rootstr I have been wondering if maybe she has been sneaking away from work as well. It's fairly a good size building. I'm hoping the VAR in the car will shed more light on this matter. I'm planning to retrieve the VAR from her car for the 1st time tonight, to listen to the recording and check the battery life.


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## Noah2150

Also, if the VAR confirms she did meet him on November 24, then I will confront her immediately.


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## sandc

Don't bet the bank on the VAR. Shock and awe will be your best bet. No matter what you hear on the VAR, quietly visit a lawyer. Have some divorce papers drawn up. Have them with you when you confront. Tell her you know everything and that if she doesn't come clean and let you hear from her own lips what you already know, then the D is on. If she still keeps lying then you really don't have much of a chance for R anyway so you might as well just go through with the divorce.

Because really if she loves you and wants to stay married she shouldn't lie about this any longer, not with the threat of D. She should be willing to give up her job, send a NC letter, whatever it takes to keep you. If she does not, you're wasting your time.


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## tom67

Noah2150 said:


> @tom67 This coming Saturday may by my D day.


I'm truly sorry this is happening but this has to come to a head with you not getting sleep and so on.


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## mahike

The shock and awe may get you the best answers. I was not able to get much from the var in the car. To much back ground noise. If you do find stuff you may not want to delay d day. I know I could not surpress the anger and upset I was feeling once I confirmed the A


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## keko

Just to remind you once again, never tell her what or how much you know. Cheater will only confess what you can prove and that's it. If you tell you got a few text messages then she'll just say they were flirty text messages. If you show her how she met him on the 24th she'll claim it was an only one time thing and nothing else. So never tell her what and how you know it, just say you got birds in the sky.


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## the guy

Becareful when you confront, you still don't know the OM full name and if he is married or has a GF. Also, never reveal you source, do not quote what was said on the VAR or when and if you get GPS app.

I suggest you ..make it sound like some one in the ware house and in the office have contacted you, along with other who have seen them together.

My point is you don't want her to search the car looking for your spying devices.

With the rigth intel you can tell her things like "someone you know saw you at xyz" or "someone that knows you saw you and OM (his full name) doing this in the car"

My point is play it smart and don't loose your current resources in gathering intel.


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## the guy

Noah2150 said:


> @somedaydig. Wow, I just went to the website and watched a demo. So you guys reconciled after she cheated?


Digs isn't the only one that R with his old lady, I'm also in an R for 3 years now. What I have experienced and what I have read here is that the confrontation must be as effective as possible.

This includes knowing what she is doing and with whom, and when. This intel leave no room for doubt. This includes have your mind set that with the up most confidence you can live with out her if she continues any contact with OM. Even if you have a smoking gun *you* have to have a certain mind set. Something you havenot had in the past confrontation.

I still even if you show her how much this is in her face she will manage you again, thats why, in this case you really need to find more on OM and have him break off the affair to save his own marriage or relationship with GF.

I also think the returned affection you are getting from you wife is just a sign of how happy she is that you are blind to her fantasy fog.

Hell, I was thinking, if OM was married, you could confront him and blackmail his own marriage. "If you break up with my wife and say nothing to her about our conversation, I want say a word to your wife".
The bad thing about this approach is the affair behavior is never addressed and it will continue with another OM.
The good thing is your wife won't know you had anything to do with the break up and you won't have to deal with her crap.


At the end of the day she needs to address her behavior to affair proof the marriage. With that said the most effective confrontation is exposing the affair to OMW (if there is one).


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## Noah2150

Indeed I was going to say someone the guy talked to about you told me. However I still need to find out his name. I know of a few names she has mentioned from her warehouse but don't know which one. I'm hoping the VAR will give his name. @ the guy, I am cautious of her looking for anything in her car. I must admit to all of you, never in a million years would I have thought this would happened to me, I thought my wife was the most faithful woman in the world.


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## the guy

Your not the only one!!!!!


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## Shaggy

The other approach her is to tell her you know she's crossed the line and has cheated and turn you just leave and go dark on her.

Have a var in a coupe places at home including her car.you just leave without proving your claims or accepting any discussion.

Basically you serve her notice and leave. Let her take care of coming clean and fighting to get you back.


The best way to deal with a cheater is to keep them off balance. Make them do the work, and prove they aren't cheating. If you can expose the OM and ideally humiliate him all the better. I know you don't know the OM, but you might be able to force your wife's hand.

You really should skip work on Sat and have an alternate vehicle to follow her in.


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## Louise7

I really would not try following in the car. That much adrenalin and emotion in a car is a mistake. I tried this and nearly bumped into the scenery. I had the same problem in being unable to access the phone and knowing who the OW was. I went through bank statements and found that he bought petrol and groceries from a supermarket near his office every Friday lunchtime. It was the groceries that did it -I did all the shopping. I called his office direct number at 3pm every Friday for three weeks and he was never there. A quick check revealed he took leave every Friday afternoon. One Friday, I snuck into the carpark, made a note of the mileage and checked it when he got home and 80 miles unaccounted for so from there I could work out how far he went and that helped a lot. 

The gps app on a phone is a good one. For me, it was important to have the information confirmed so that when I confronted and he lied, I would know for sure I was being lied to. 

Noah, I wish you strength and peace of mind and I am sorry you had to find your way here.


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## Noah2150

My plan is to leave work and use the gps to go where she ends up, Supposedly she is meeting up with a couple of female coworkers.


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## Noah2150

@ Louise7 thanks and so you understand that I do need to catch this in the act. I know some said just confront her now, but with my wife, that sort of thing just wont work.


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## Shaggy

Brink a camera with you and take lots of pictures.


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## sandc

Noah2150 said:


> @ Louise7 thanks and so you understand that I do need to catch this in the act. I know some said just confront her now, but with my wife, that sort of thing just wont work.


Do you have a friend you could bring along? It would be good to have someone who has no stake in this along to think rationally for everyone.


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## RWB

Noah2150 said:


> I must admit to all of you, never in a million years would I have thought this would happened to me, I thought my wife was the most faithful woman in the world.


Brother you are in good company. I was so duped that I "let" my cheating wife "explain" herself and hide affairs that it took years before I had proof that she had been serial cheating on me. Seriously... 5 min of VAR would of been all it took. Can you believe that when I confronted without proof... I actually believed her and didn't try to verify. 

I too... thought my wife was the most honest, trusting, faithful woman I had ever met. 

WRONG!


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## warlock07

Shaggy said:


> Brink a camera with you and take lots of pictures.


He might draw un-necessary attention if he is taking pictures


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## keko

warlock07 said:


> He might draw un-necessary attention if he is taking pictures


Hide it inside a t-shirt or a newspaper? 

Im sure he's watched a few James Bond movies.


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## sandc

But if he's going to confront on Saturday who cares if he draws attention? He can have that camera going as he's walking in the door. The look on her face will be priceless.


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## Shaggy

warlock07 said:


> He might draw un-necessary attention if he is taking pictures


I'm thinking its more about documenting him catching her cheating


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## the guy

Noah2150 said:


> @ Louise7 thanks and so you understand that I do need to catch this in the act. I know some said just confront her now, but with my wife, that sort of thing just wont work.


As your past confrontations are proof to this!

Shaggy has a great point, you need to be a few steps ahead of your wife. 

I believe this kid of women will need more then a smoking gun, in fact I'm a firm believer thet in a case like yours your best approach is breaking up the affair by exposing to the OM side of things...and thats finding his wife, GF, or family.


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## the guy

If you follow her and she's at a resturant, whats your plan?

If you follow her and she is at a residentence what your plan?

If she is at a hotel, whats your plan?

See who she meets and if they take seperate cars you might get something.
If your lucky you can get a plate #, but enless you have some friend in lawenforcement it may not yield much. Then again you my get a discription and work from there.

It will be emotional and I'm concerned you will blow it. Confronting her at the "seen of the crime" will not yield much intel IMHO.

in short what is your plan and will you beable to work the plan and get the intel you need to nuke this affair.


----------



## Noah2150

I just have a gut feeling this guy is single or divorced and she is going to his home instead of a hotel, not 100% sure though. Yes I will confront her right then and there if this happens on Saturday. @ RWB, this seems like a nightmare and I'm just waiting to wake up. Also, I don't really have any good friends here as I keep to myself most of the time.


----------



## walkonmars

If you manage to get the OM's car Lic# you can find out 
A LOT about him here:
PublicData.com [ Home Page ]

The monthly fee is small - I've used it to find whose car is parked in front of my house. I also used it when a girl in a car had passed out at the stop sign near our house. It was 4AM. I found her address and went to get her parents. 

It's easy to use.


----------



## the guy

So your gut tells you, you will find her at OM residence.

Instead of taking the address down and doing some research you will knock on this guys door and ask what she is doing there and she will label you a stalker tell you that she is just visiting a friend and close the door on your face.

At the very least head back home, pack her crap up and bring it back to her and then confront her. If in fact this is OM residence, if in fact you find her at a residence.


----------



## the guy

Thanks to walkonmars you have a great option to gather more intel, and have a more effective confrontation then getting a door slammed in your face if they even answer the door.

Again know your enemy and being a few steps ahead of your cheating wife.


----------



## MattMatt

Good luck with what you need to do.


----------



## Shaggy

Do you have keys to her car? Does she have keys to yours?

If you do find her with him consider what you can do about it.

One option is to park yours a bit away or around the block, and drive her car home leaving her stranded.

When you get home the first thing you should do is expose the OM and her fast and swift. Post a picture if you have it. Then go dark on her.


----------



## keko

Shaggy said:


> Do you have keys to her car? Does she have keys to yours?
> 
> If you do find her with him consider what you can do about it.
> 
> One option is to park yours a bit away or around the block, and drive her car home leaving her stranded.
> 
> When you get home the first thing you should do is expose the OM and her fast and swift. Post a picture if you have it. Then go dark on her.


:lol:


----------



## sandc

the guy said:


> At the very least head back home, pack her crap up and bring it back to her and then confront her. If in fact this is OM residence, if in fact you find her at a residence.


This is actually a pretty good exposure tactic. If she is at his house simply go home, pack her stuff, take it back to his house, knock on the door and hand it to whomever answers the door.


----------



## Silverlining

Shaggy said:


> Do you have keys to her car? Does she have keys to yours?
> 
> If you do find her with him consider what you can do about it.
> 
> One option is to park yours a bit away or around the block, and drive her car home leaving her stranded.
> 
> When you get home the first thing you should do is expose the OM and her fast and swift. Post a picture if you have it. Then go dark on her.


ITA!
Just a thought: Most cheaters will not park directly in front of or in the driveway of the persons house they are banging. Also, if he lives in an apartment complex it may be impossible to find out who he is.


----------



## JCD

sandc said:


> This is actually a pretty good exposure tactic. If she is at his house simply go home, pack her stuff, take it back to his house, knock on the door and hand it to whomever answers the door.


No. Leave it next to her car so she can't miss it when she walks out.

letting all the air out of her tires by removing (and taking away) the valve stems is a bonus. After all, it's HIS car too.

**

If you can follow her or have someone follow her and she goes to a hotel, get the room number.

Call her mom and her best friend and ask them to call her at X hotel in room number Y. Inform them of what she is doing.

If POS answers the phone, it's very hard to cover that up when they ask for her by name.

Just saying. Let her rug sweep THAT!

**

Have you considered buying the receptionist at the place they work a REALLY NICE bouquet of flowers, dinner and maybe a gift card? I'm betting she can find the information in about 15 minutes. IF she doesn't tell your wife you approached her.

If there is a woman whom is 'enemies' with your wife, maybe you ask her. She'll do it out of spite. But beware of lies.

Or you can call her HR and say that you have proof that your wife is in a illegitimate affair with a co-worker and let THEM do some investigating. Ask for their fraternization guidelines 'for your counsel'.

Just a few off the wall ideas. But that is only if YOU want to pull the trigger because you can't walk back on this if she discovers it or it doesn't pan out.


----------



## SomedayDig

Just don't forget...if you're going to where this dude might live, do NOT underestimate the fact that he could have a firearm. And he might feel threatened in his home. And you can see where I'm going with this.

I think if you follow her to this guy's house, you need to confront her as soon as she gets there and before she's in the house. I would not knock on the door.

That's just me, though.


----------



## DedicatedDad

SomedayDig said:


> Just don't forget...if you're going to where this dude might live, do NOT underestimate the fact that he could have a firearm. And he might feel threatened in his home. And you can see where I'm going with this.
> 
> I think if you follow her to this guy's house, you need to confront her as soon as she gets there and before she's in the house. I would not knock on the door.
> 
> That's just me, though.


THIS!!! :iagree::iagree::iagree::iagree::iagree:

It's happened before, so be careful Noah... and if you get a chance, read this...
Wife's Lover Shoots Husband Gets Off Free


----------



## Jonesey

DedicatedDad said:


> THIS!!! :iagree::iagree::iagree::iagree::iagree:
> 
> It's happened before, be careful... and read this...
> Lover Shoots And Kills Husband Gets Off Free


Read this story..Sadly i strongly believe the husband was set up


----------



## the guy

Maybe its me, but wouldn't some advice from a lawyer be a great idea right about now?

I think this should be part of the confrontation plan with regards to add in the fact that you have been in contact with a lawyer when you ask you wife why she is sleeping with "Joe Shmoe" the warehouse guy at his house on "cheater lane".

Replace the quotes with actual name and place and you my friend will have a effective confrontation...not as effective as exposing the A to OMW/GF and letting the Om confront your WW but I think it will have an impact when you can name specific names and places.

Wouldn't that be a kicker if your WW was telling the truth and was actually at a girl friend house...the down side would be if the OM was there also.

You have your work cut for you James Bond...do you have the emotional strength?


----------



## LetDownNTX

Shaggy said:


> Do you have keys to her car? Does she have keys to yours?
> 
> If you do find her with him consider what you can do about it.
> 
> One option is to park yours a bit away or around the block, and drive her car home leaving her stranded.
> 
> When you get home the first thing you should do is expose the OM and her fast and swift. Post a picture if you have it. Then go dark on her.


This makes me laugh so hard because it reminds me of a situation I was in. When my WH and I were separated at one point he was living with his BFF and every morning before work this OW would come to his BFF's house, park outside and ride into work with my WH. One day BFF thought it was time I knew about it so he told me I should come over. I found her truck outside the house along with my WH's personal Mustang (he had a company truck that he drove back and forth to work). So I parked my car there and took his Mustang. I got about half way home and looked in the glove box and found the key FOB to her truck. I went back to the BFF"s house and snooped in her truck then left a note on her truck. I started to leave it inside but didnt want to get myself in trouble so how. By the end of the work day when WH and OW came around the corner and saw my car there he nearly **** bricks. He quickly drove around the block, jumped over the back fence, let OW drive his work truck home and asked his BFF why he didnt warn him that I was there...LOL Bff said he didnt know I was there and played dumb. I so wish I would have been a fly on the wall that day.

Oh and I started to throw her key FOB out of the car window driving down the road but decided to keep it. It came in handly a few times at 3, 4 and 5 am when I drove by her house and set off her car alarm :rofl:


----------



## DedicatedDad

Jonesey said:


> Read this story..Sadly i strongly believe the husband was set up


I think your right Jonesey, I read that story and something just didn't seem right from the beginning


----------



## iheartlife

LetDownNTX said:


> Oh and I started to throw her key FOB out of the car window driving down the road but decided to keep it. It came in handly a few times at 3, 4 and 5 am when I drove by her house and set off her car alarm :rofl:


I am not one for revenge but I sure would have enjoyed that myself :rofl:


----------



## Noah2150

Crying right now, just listen to the VAR, think I am going to kill myself


----------



## Pepper123

Noah... stay strong. You deserve better. Don't waste what you have to offer another amazing woman because of your WW.


----------



## keko

What happened?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Noah2150

She is talking about their sexual encounter on the VAR.


----------



## keko

Jump in your car right now and drive somewhere. Clear your mind so you won't do anything rash. 

Forget confronting her as I'm sure you know she'll just dismiss it as flirty talk.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Jonesey

DedicatedDad said:


> I think your right Jonesey, I read that story and something just didn't seem right from the beginning


Damn i was hopping i was miss read it all wrong

The DA wanted to press charges.But political pressure got him to back down...did you see the interview with the so called wife?

no shame no remorse on the question, if you was there to clean
how come you came around the corner when your husband showed up..


----------



## Pepper123

Noah... Call in sick tomorrow and stay home. Do not listen to it again. Don't torture yourself. Take the time to think about what you need to do going forward. Let yourself feel what you need to.


----------



## Noah2150

She is sleeping I am calling my mom and then I m going to kill her right now


----------



## keko

It's not worth it Noah.

Think about it, you'll be spending the rest of your life behind bars for what? Killing a selfish, cheater. It's not worth it bro, you deserve much better then that.

Like I said jump in your car and drive somewhere, it'll clear your mind.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## keko

So was she talking about their encounter on the 24th or another time?

Any other useful info from the recordings?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## SomedayDig

Hey, Noah...it's one of those nights where I slept a whopping 2 hours. The first thread I wanted to check out was yours cuz I know what you're going through is so f'ng tough to handle.

I know you listened to the VAR and heard what you didn't want to hear. Brother...I am so sorry you are going through this. I wish I had TAM when I discovered all of the stuff with my wife having her 5 year long affair. It would have been someplace I could come and vent and talk about what had just gone down.

You need to do one of the hardest things right now and that is just breathe. I know, man. I know.

PM me and I will be more than happy to give you my google chat info so you can talk/type in real time.

I'm so sorry you heard that.


----------



## Noah2150

@ keko yes on the 24th and sounds like other times too


----------



## Numbersixxx

Noah2150 said:


> She is sleeping I am calling my mom and then I m going to kill her right now


Don't do anything stupid!


----------



## barbados

Noah, get you a$$ out of there and go wherever you have to to calm down NOW!! Do not throw your life away on a lying, cheating POS !


----------



## Almostrecovered

sheesh, seems like lately a bunch of BS's are looking to dive off the cliff lately

life gets better folks whether you R or D, things can and will improve


----------



## Chaparral

This gets better, likely better than before. Now you know youmade a mistake and can move forward, leaving the bad baggage behind.

Good luck and prayers.


----------



## Toffer

Been following this for a while

Noah, please just a quick note to let us know you're OK and that you've calmed down....PLEASE!


----------



## Soifon

I hope that you were able to speak with your mother and that she could help calm you. Please remember that what is happening now is fraction of your entire life. You have a lot of it left to live and part of that involves watching your children grow up. I know you are devastated but try to look to the future. You WILL heal from this and you WILL be happy again. I have no doubt that once this is all over with you will find a much happier life with someone else and will look back and be sad that you wasted time with her but glad that you were able to get out and move on. Right now your moment is full of pain and it's hard not to look ahead but try because the sun won't stop rising and this will not last forever.


----------



## LetDownNTX

This is one of those times that your heart breaks for what someone else is going through and you cant even reach out to them.

Noah, please let us know that you are ok and that you didnt do anything stupid!! 

Someday, did he contact you at all after you offered?


----------



## JCD

LetDownNTX said:


> This is one of those times that your heart breaks for what someone else is going through and you cant even reach out to them.
> 
> Noah, please let us know that you are ok and that you didnt do anything stupid!!
> 
> Someday, did he contact you at all after you offered?


Last I heard from Someday, he had NOT contacted him. He also had to go to bed for work, so not sure how things are going.

Hopefully mom could talk him off of the clock tower.


----------



## LetDownNTX

JCD said:


> Last I heard from Someday, he had NOT contacted him. He also had to go to bed for work, so not sure how things are going.
> 
> Hopefully mom could talk him off of the clock tower.


Thank you for letting me know. The sad part is that we dont have a name or a location or any way of finding out anything! UGH!


----------



## snap

Dude, we all here were as hurt as you are at some point, yet we're living proof that there's life after. Go smash something useless, or kick her chihuahua.. anger is normal, you need some healthy outlet.


----------



## tom67

Stay away today then go back home with someone pack her crap up in garbage bags and throw her out she doesn't deserve to live there anymore.


----------



## sinnister

Now is the time that will determine your future man. Stay strong. Cry if you need to for sure. But DO NOT jeapordize your future for this person. Stay strong.


----------



## walkonmars

Sending you strength brother Noah. 
Build your modern day ark - and sail into a better day.


----------



## Silverlining

I am sending you positive thoughts during this difficult time. ((((((( Hugs )))))))


----------



## JCD

If you need to harm her, pack all her undergarments into a trash bag and drive across town to a dumpster. Toss them. If she is anything like my wife, she has hundreds of dollars and a lot of memories (most with you) invested in those things. Their loss will be telling.

You have no idea which ones were despoiled by her so they all got to go.

You might want to leave her her two oldest and rattiest beige bras and granny panties for everyday wear.

I say this not because I really advocate this (though I think it's funny) but because it's a better alternative than assault and battery.


----------



## RWB

Noah,

DDay just plain sux. The suspicions, the wondering, the holding out that it's all just a mistake, in an instant become the worst nightmare. The world you knew is now no-longer...

But, it does not have to be the end. Give yourself time... lots of it. In the weeks ahead, trust me, you will start to see a future. 

Stay strong for those that really matter.


----------



## LetDownNTX

JCD said:


> If you need to harm her, pack all her undergarments into a trash bag and drive across town to a dumpster. Toss them. If she is anything like my wife, she has hundreds of dollars and a lot of memories (most with you) invested in those things. Their loss will be telling.
> 
> You have no idea which ones were despoiled by her so they all got to go.
> 
> You might want to leave her her two oldest and rattiest beige bras and granny panties for everyday wear.
> 
> I say this not because I really advocate this (though I think it's funny) but because it's a better alternative than assault and battery.


Thanks for the smile!! Especially like the idea of leaving the beige bra and granny panties.:rofl:


----------



## cabin fever

It does get better dude. 


right now you need to go into 100% me mode. Worry only about you! right now she is a complete stranger to you, and as weird as she is acting right now, she will be even worse when you confront. 

Sorry your here man. It sucks, but it WILL get better. You will be a complete new man after this. I never realized how strong I really am, till I was in your shoes. 

Try to get out of the house now. Go jog if you have to. I don't jog, but I did and it helped alot! 

DO NOT KIZZ HER AZZ!


----------



## Cdelta02

Speak to us. Are you ok - were you able to get some distance and calm down?


----------



## mahike

Brother I hope you are OK I know we would all like to know. Most of us have been in your shoes. 

I hope you are talking with friends and family right now. You need a good IC right now. We can talk you through this. The anger and the pain it is the worst thing you can feel. I am taking a moment to pray that you are safe and you have not harmed anyone.


----------



## Saki

Noah I strongly recommend you look into individual couseling.

You are going through what is probably the toughest test in your life right now. Your life will probably never feel lower than it feels right now.

Things will get better, but you have to be able to handle this first....

Post up, let us know how you are doing and let us know how badly this sucks....we understand!


----------



## LetDownNTX

iheartlife said:


> I am not one for revenge but I sure would have enjoyed that myself :rofl:


It was awesome! The alarm went off and a minute later the front light went on. I waited a few minutes and then drove by again.

Revenge is sweet!


----------



## walkonmars

LetDown you need to write a book. comic-tragedy!

Noah - you're going to be just like LetDown and so many others - working trough pain and surviving. Stormy days always give way to the sun.


----------



## DedicatedDad

*NOAH STOP!!!*

Get out of there and get your head together, you need to chill out and get your head right, it's not worth it! Don't throw your life away over something like this.


----------



## sandc

Noah,
I know this is your wife, I know she hurt you really deeply, I know you want her to hurt as badly as you hurt now. Trust me, she will. You don't need to physically hurt her. Her insides will be hurting her badly enough. 

Try to get through the pain as best you can for now, it will subside over time. There are other women out there who will not hurt you. But you have to go through this first.

And please, keep coming back and talking to us. Use this forum to help you get yourself through these first dark hours. There are a lot of people here who can help you. Most have been where you are. Most of those can tell you that there is hope. So come back and talk to us.


----------



## Shaggy

Noah get out of the house. Take the var and make a copy of the recording and email it to friends , family, and to her work, especially coworkers,

Exposure is at for effective payback tan you attacking her and going to jail, instead destroy her and the OM. Publically humiliate both of them.


----------



## aug

Make copies of the VAR recording. Have one copy store safe offsite somewhere.

Look at protecting and isolating your finances and assets. Remove yourself from any joint credit cards, debts, loans. Consider revising your will and insurances.

Given what you have written about your wife personality, be prepare for her to come hard after you.

Remember you now know she lies well. And she'll lie big time now to protect herself.

Move yourself into a position of strength and you can take control of the situation better.

Concentrating on the suggestions above, while your emotions are rampant, will help you deal with the situation and your emotions better. Learn to detach and be indifferent.


----------



## Louise7

Noah, please talk to us. Anything just to let us know how you are doing.

Got not much work done today checking this thread.


----------



## theroad

Noah, people helped you get the proof. People are here to help you go through the next step.


----------



## Almostrecovered

he's been online as of 2:40pm eastern time today


----------



## Noah2150

Hello everyone, sorry for all the drama early this morning. I called my mom and she along with my dad talked me out of killing my wife. I woke her up and I think I really scared her and she admitted. She said she was soo sorry and it was honestly the 1st time in 18 y 
ears of our marriage(not sure if that's the truth). She said it just happened and it was during lunchtime at work, not November 24th, according to her. What really shicked me this morning, was when my mom said my dad has cheated on her before, I never knew this as they have been married over 40 years.

My wife says she is really sorry and wants to work this out, i just don't know if this is possible.


----------



## Louise7

Almostrecovered said:


> he's been online as of 2:40pm eastern time today


This is good but it's horrible to think he's hurting and there's nothing we can do to help.


----------



## slater

Good move Noah. You do have options. They're not all roses right now, but in the end you will be OK. I was in your shoes Feb 1, 2012. It was 12:14am when I heard the VAR in my daughter's bathroom. I'll never forget that night.

But it gets better, whatever you decide. Godspeed.


----------



## sandc

Noah2150 said:


> My wife says she is really sorry and wants to work this out, i just don't know if this is possible.


Oh yeah, she's really sorry you caught her. She needs to show true REMORSE for what she did, not feeling bad that she got caught.

Don't make any snap decisions. Take time to think about what it is you want her to do to prove to you that she wants to be with you and that this will never happen again. What is SHE willing to do?

I would say at the least:
She writes him a no contact letter. He never talks to her again for any reason.

She gives you every detail you ask for. This should include his name, phone number, who his wife/girlfriend is.

She should quit her job and look for a new one.

She gives you all passwords to everything, phone, facebook, etc.

Maybe even have her write down a timeline of what happened and when, where, etc.

You could consider exposing him at work.

She made this mess, she has to do the heavy lifting to clean it up.

IF that's even what you want. You don't have to reconcile with her just because your mom took your dad back. YOU decide what YOU want. Take your time and think.


----------



## vi_bride04

Noah2150 said:


> Hello everyone, sorry for all the drama early this morning. I called my mom and she along with my dad talked me out of killing my wife. I woke her up and I think I really scared her and she admitted.* She said she was soo sorry and it was honestly the 1st time in 18 y
> ears of our marriage(not sure if that's the truth)*. She said it just happened and it was during lunchtime at work, not November 24th, according to her. What really shicked me this morning, was when my mom said my dad has cheated on her before, I never knew this as they have been married over 40 years.
> 
> My wife says she is really sorry and wants to work this out, i just don't know if this is possible.



She is a cheater and a liar. You cannot believe anything that comes out of her mouth at this point in time. Only look at her actions to see if the marriage is something that can be saved.

If she does not step up to the plate as a TRUE remorseful WS should, there is no hope for the marriage.


----------



## Saki

Keep that VAR active!!


----------



## MEM2020

Noah, 
None of this really surprised you. 

You need to see a therapist now. Anger is one thing, homicide something else. If you have any questions about that you need to remove yourself from the house.


----------



## tom67

Noah2150 said:


> Hello everyone, sorry for all the drama early this morning. I called my mom and she along with my dad talked me out of killing my wife. I woke her up and I think I really scared her and she admitted. She said she was soo sorry and it was honestly the 1st time in 18 y
> ears of our marriage(not sure if that's the truth). She said it just happened and it was during lunchtime at work, not November 24th, according to her. What really shicked me this morning, was when my mom said my dad has cheated on her before, I never knew this as they have been married over 40 years.
> 
> My wife says she is really sorry and wants to work this out, i just don't know if this is possible.


She is on YOUR timetable now take your time! Don't scare me again like thattake care of you now make her do the heavy lifting!And I suggest kicking her out of the house for some time.


----------



## Soifon

She is a LIAR, flat out. Don't believe for a second this was the only time. Your theme in these threads is that you needed proof for her to admit. Well you have proof of one incident so she admitted to that ONE incident. She won't admit to anything else because she thinks she still thinks she is a step ahead of you and that you will never find out and will believe anything she tells you.


----------



## walkonmars

Take your time. You've had doubts for several weeks - including the very suspicious saturday 'shoping spree' that involved hair and makeup products that have never before been necessary. 

Don't expect the whole truth for a long time. But do listen. If you have thoughts of reconciling tell her you won't tolerate any lie. The truth will hurt - but lies will compound the pain unnecessarily. 

Still you should understand that there'll be much more than what she told you. You should get tested for STIs and she should too. Stay calm. One way or the other you are going to get through this.


----------



## keko

She's sorry but wants to work it out.

Noah she's not sorry, if she was she wouldn't be talking about the encounter days after it and planning for another sexfest.

You got a perfect example of a cake eater plain and simple.


----------



## tom67

Let her family know what she has been doing!


----------



## FryFish

Wow... glad nobody died this morning...

Noah, tell your wife to leave for a while.


----------



## tom67

FryFish said:


> Wow... glad nobody died this morning...
> 
> Noah, tell your wife to leave for a while.


Yes have her leave an then if she shows any remorse I would schedule a polygraph test that's if you want to r if not don't waste your money jmo.


----------



## jerry123

Noah2150 said:


> I mentioned earlier in my post that my wife wont admit to anything unless she is caught red handed. My gut still says she met this guy the Saturday of Thanksgiving, but I have no solid proof. The VAR is currently in her car underneath the driver seat and I have not listened to it yet since the 1st recording inside our home. I will definitely;ook into the AT&T droid go phone option. Also, I was going to place it in the trunk of the car now I know that would disrupt the signal.



Remember that post. 

If you had not found this out by VAR she would still be doing it behind your back. I assume you told her about the VAR as you stated concrete proof would be needed. If so, you have lost that one advantage for future verification if you go R route. 
Right now you can't believe anything she says. I bet that is tough on both of you. 

From what I've been reading it probably was the only time it happened. But if VAR is known by her she will always remember to check for one in car. 

Only you know if she is truly remorseful. And I agree with other posts that she can't keep that job. Them seeing each other everyday will not be good. 

Also, is OM married?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Dad&Hubby

Also please tell us you didn't inform her of the VAR? 

It was said very well above. Don't believe ANYTHING she says, only what she does.


----------



## Louise7

So pleased to hear from you Noah.

Yes, she's sorry. Sorry she got caught. Tell her to leave while you think. You do not have to follow the path of your parents or anyone else here. Just be true to Noah because its him you have to face and live with.


----------



## Shaggy

Have her tell you who the OM is.

Have her quit her job with him.

Exposé him.

Remember what she said on the var. there wasno remorse or guilt in her, she's just saying what she needs to say in order to buy time.

Trust but verify, and never negotiate, never reveal sources.


----------



## Noah2150

Yes I did tell her about the VAR. She has been calling me all day from work. I did not go to work today, still having crying episodes(feel like a weak man for crying). I do realize this only came out after firmly confronting her and she was planning to meet him again. Also, found out he has a girlfriend whom he lives with right now.


----------



## thunderstruck

Noah2150 said:


> ...still having crying episodes(*feel like a weak man for crying*).


BS. You're going through hell right now. Let it all out, brother. Nothing wrong with that.


----------



## roostr

Noah2150 said:


> Yes I did tell her about the VAR. She has been calling me all day from work. I did not go to work today, still having crying episodes(feel like a weak man for crying). I do realize this only came out after firmly confronting her and she was planning to meet him again. Also, found out he has a girlfriend whom he lives with right now.


why the hell did you tell her it was the VAR how you found out? Now she knows she cant talk in the car, you wont get any info regarding if she continues or not. gl2u


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## walkonmars

Even if you were expecting the worst - actually knowing it is a shock. You've taken a severe blow. For the time being - don't respond to her calls. Wait until you've gathered your wits. 

You will wind up saying things you'll regret later - so better to remain stoic. Don't let her see you in tears. Your 18 years of faithfulness meant nothing to her. Nothing at all. She can back off and give you space to breathe. 

Take a few days to decide what it is you want. Re-evaluate her attitude toward you in the last few months. Re-evaluate her attitude during the whole marriage. You've conceded to her whims - the time for that attitude has come to an end. 

Make a list of things you want to know about her affair. She's sure to have belittled you to the OM. She may have friends - the shopping girlfriend comes to mind - that have facilitated her deception. You want to know who these people are.


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## DedicatedDad

Glad to hear from you again Noah...

There's nothing wrong with a man crying after his heart has been ripped out. 
You need to grieve in your own way, so let it out.


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## tom67

roostr said:


> why the hell did you tell her it was the VAR how you found out? Now she knows she cant talk in the car, you wont get any info regarding if she continues or not. gl2u


She is going to have to quit the job anyway
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LookingForTheSun

Don't worry about telling her about the VAR. Now is the time to expose her and him to their entire social circle. Make sure that his GF knows and tell your wife that if there is any hope for your marriage, she needs to contact the wife and give details and apologize. I wish I had done that. That way you know that if she refuses, she is not willing to go out on a limb for you. She needs to be hit hard and fast emotionally to snap her out of any affair fog she may be in. You don't have to stay, but use it as leverage right now to get her to do the dirty work and feel the repercussions of her actions. 

Once exposure is done, do what you feel is necesary. If it is to take a break from her, tell her to find another place to stay. If it is to work through it, make sure you have a good support group (sounds like you have great support in your parents). Surround yourself with friends and family and don't be ashamed to talk about it, cry, scream, or whatever else you feel compelled to do. You did not do anything wrong in this situation. You are better than that. You will come out on top once the smoke clears. Right now, expose them both. 

So sorry you are going through this. You will survive it. We all have. You will too.


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## SadSamIAm

tom67 said:


> She is going to have to quit the job anyway
> _Posted via Mobile Device_



Not sure how quitting her job is related to telling about the VAR! 

Do you mean that when she quits her job, it will automatically mean that she will quit cheating and he won't have to check on her?


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## SomedayDig

SadSamIAm said:


> Not sure how quitting her job is related to telling about the VAR!
> 
> Do you mean that when she quits her job, it will automatically mean that she will quit cheating and he won't have to check on her?


No...it's that apparently she works with the OM. As such, she cannot work there under a rule of NC.


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## tom67

SadSamIAm said:


> Not sure how quitting her job is related to telling about the VAR!
> 
> Do you mean that when she quits her job, it will automatically mean that she will quit cheating and he won't have to check on her?


True just saying any chance of r short term she can't work with this guy. He has to polygraph her also to avoid thr trickle truth
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Thor

Noah, I'm sorry things have gone this way for you. There is no need to make any instant decisions.

First take care of yourself. See your doc for some light meds. For a short time meds can't be beat. Try to get good exercise. Even walking. If you are able, weights or a punching bag. Eat healthy. Cut out all alcohol and other chemicals.

See a lawyer in a day or 2 when you are calmed a bit. The data will help regardless if you D or R.

You have a great bunch of folks here who sincerely care about you. Never hesitate to vent or ***** or just bounce ideas off of this forum.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Saki

I took a week off work after my most recent DDay.

I wasn't doing anythign productive at work anyway, it was actually more fair to the company to have actual time off than to sit there being a shell of a man.

Crying is ok dude. You really need to embrace these emotions rather than repressing them.


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## RWB

Noah,

I know it's bad now. Hear a truth from one that's been there... 

Hold on. There is more "news" to fall out. Trust me on that.


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## Noah2150

Speaking of the past few months before my suspicion arose, she has been quiet towards me than she has ever been. Also, found out this female coworker knew about the affair, I am shocked as we have been to her home where I met her husband as well and considered her a friend to me also.


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## jerry123

I'm sure telling her about VAR was to show absolute proof. Even if he said I know what you are doing because someone told me she would have still denied it till her last breathe. From what I've read in your posts your wife would have kept this going for as long as she could. 

The thing I get from all this is she had no intention of stopping it and admitting to you what she was doing. Not only that, she kept making plans to see him more.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## SomedayDig

So, Noah...here's the deal, man. Your wife just admitted to an affair because she was caught red handed. YOU had to expose it because she had no intention of doing so. As a matter of fact, she did NOT want to expose it cuz she enjoyed that "other life".

I know this only too well because of my wife's affair. I want to offer you this bit of advice if you plan on somehow reconciling...

Your wife IS going to lie to you. She's going to do so because she doesn't want to "hurt" you or "scare" you off. She's going to do so to cover her a$$. Just know that it is just something they ALL do in some form or fashion.

You need to figure out what your deal breaker is. You and you alone are the only one who can make that determination.

SHE needs to be fully transparent in every single aspect of her life. Period. No matter what, do NOT let her blame any of the tiniest speck of this affair on you. SHE was the one who decided to step outside the marriage so the affair is 100% on her. 

Take your time in making a decision. Don't be rash about anything at this stage. Most of all, drink plenty of water and do your best to breathe.


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## bfree

Noah2150 said:


> Yes I did tell her about the VAR. She has been calling me all day from work. I did not go to work today, still having crying episodes(feel like a weak man for crying). I do realize this only came out after firmly confronting her and she was planning to meet him again. Also, found out he has a girlfriend whom he lives with right now.


Noah,

You need to expose this to his gf. *IF* your wife is truly remorseful she will help you to do this by giving you the information necessary. I also agree with everyone else that she needs to leave her job now.


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## tom67

Tell that "friend" that knew about it thanks alot! Before that maybe you could ask her how long it was going on?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## In_The_Wind

Noah my heart goes out to you as well as my thoughts and prayers 
as others have mentioned now is the time that YOU get to decide what is going to become of this marriage take your time get in contact with friends that you trust and may have been thru something similar these guys will help you during times when you feel lonely also here is the 180 plan it is designed to get you back on track it is for you not her or your marriage but you 

The Healing Heart: The 180

and I agree with what others have said about getting alone your spouse since she was the one cheating she should leave and give you space this will help you decide your next course of action 

Good Luck


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## joe kidd

R or D is up to you. If you go the R path , make her earn it. 

She is going to try to justify this by making it your fault for whatever reason. When she starts that crap tell her that is complete bullsh*t.


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## keko

RWB said:


> Noah,
> 
> I know it's bad now. Hear a truth from one that's been there...
> 
> Hold on. There is more "news" to fall out. Trust me on that.


:iagree:

Either with this guy or a few more guys in the past.


----------



## cabin fever

You've just been hurt worse then you have ever been hurt before in your life, by the one person you thought would never hurt it you. 

Its perfectly normal to cry. It would be odd if you didn't. I also took a few days off when I had my DDay. I told my boss, and he was VERY helpful, and worked with me alot. 

Like I said earlier, you will come out of this a stronger person, no matter what you decide todo. 

Lean on your friends and family. Surround yourself with good people. Good things will happen. 

sorry you're going through this, but it will get better.


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## thatgirll007

Take heart, Noah. Most of us have been there and survived. You can get through this.


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## sandc

Noah2150 said:


> Speaking of the past few months before my suspicion arose, she has been quiet towards me than she has ever been. Also, found out this female coworker knew about the affair, I am shocked as we have been to her home where I met her husband as well and considered her a friend to me also.


Tell the friend's husband that his wife was helping your wife to have an affair. Tell him he may want to start investigating his wife. 

Your wife also never talks to this woman again. She is toxic to your marriage.


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## Noah2150

This forum is amazing. I have read all of your post. Thank you guys soo much. I do see my wife somehow may try to blame this on me, it's her personality.


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## tom67

Noah2150 said:


> This forum is amazing. I have read all of your post. Thank you guys soo much. I do see my wife somehow may try to blame this on me, it's her personality.


If she even goes their, calmly grab garbage bags and start packing her s#it no talking, just packing!


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## sandc

Noah2150 said:


> This forum is amazing. I have read all of your post. Thank you guys soo much. I do see my wife somehow may try to blame this on me, it's her personality.


Yes she will. Do not take it. No matter what she says you did just remember than many women have put up with far, FAR worse than you ever thought of doing in your marriage and NEVER CHEATED.

This was her CHOICE. REPEATEDLY. It was not a mistake. Don't let her play that card either. A mistake is wearing mismatched socks to work one day. A choice is intentionally mismatching the socks and wearing them daily.


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## JCD

tom67 said:


> If she even goes their, calmly grab garbage bags and start packing her s#it no talking, just packing!


I would seriously think of doing this anyway, even if you are going to R. She needs a demonstration of exactly where she sits.

I wouldn't tell the husband of the friend she's a cheater, but I'd confront her about it in front of her husband and ask her exactly how far she condones adultery. She has been a very good friend...TO YOUR WIFE. To you she's been an enemy.

Your wife warned him. She went to work and warned him. Call HR and report them both. I hope you VARed her confession. Otherwise she won't readmit it. Consider VARing her in her further conversations today.

I don't know what good will come from further conversation with her. You know her best. If she's only going to blame you and lie some more, than what exactly is the point?

Look up his name and his GF's name. TONIGHT, she gets to admit TO THE GF that she slept with her BF. I don't think that is negotiable. YOU look up her name and number if you can.


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## Machiavelli

thunderstruck said:


> BS. You're going through hell right now. Let it all out, brother. Nothing wrong with that.


Yes, but never in front of the wife.


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## Chaparral

Noah2150 said:


> Speaking of the past few months before my suspicion arose, she has been quiet towards me than she has ever been. Also, found out this female coworker knew about the affair, I am shocked as we have been to her home where I met her husband as well and considered her a friend to me also.


Tell her husband she helps people cheat.


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## Chaparral

This is just a bad of pain you can go through. The only thing worse is the death of a really close family member.

If you are going to loose it arond her, get yourself away from her and greive alone.

Most importantly, this is all on her. Do not be ashamed or feel guilty. If things were bad, and they rarely are here, it was her responsibility to come to you. All this shows is that she is lacking in morals and character. If she blames you in any way, apologize to her...............for marrying her in the first place.





Here is somethiong that may help.



Quote:
Originally Posted by marduk 
I happened to be thinking today about the past year of my marriage. Everyone on these forums were so instrumental in my being in the great place I am today I thought I would post a note about where I was, where I am, and what I’ve learned.

A year ago my marriage was a mess. After 3 kids my stay at home wife spontaneously decided to start going out with her girlfriends again, including a “girls trip” to Vegas. She started a crazy fitness routine, including marathon running and triathalons. She started leaving me at home with the kids 2-3 evenings a week. A rough summer. I was insecure, controlling, alone, and afraid.

Thanks in part to the folks on this forum, life is much better now. My wife only goes out with her friends maybe once a month, and the last time she did, she came home early, threw her arms around me, and told me she’s so happy she gets to come home to me. She goes to the gym maybe once or twice a week for an hour or so in the early evening. When she does leave on races out of town the whole family will go on a camping trip together so we can be there for her at the finish line. The stress level in the house is much lower, and our happiness and respect for each other is much higher. Are things perfect? No – we still fight, have conflict, and disagree. But they’re shorter-lived, not has hostile, and just plain don’t seem to hurt so much. What’s changed? Me. Here’s what I learned:

1. Let her go. You can fight, hold her back, be controlling… and you’ll just look petty, insecure, and weak. Be cool, act secure, give her a kiss and say “have fun.” If she’s going to cheat or leave, she’s going to cheat or leave. It’s better if it happens sooner rather than later in my book. A marriage is a choice, a decision that’s made one day at a time. You’re in or out. This was really, really hard. But I've learned that nothing lasts forever, life is change. We can grow together or apart. I can't force her to decide to want to be with me.

2. Set boundaries, and then stick to them. I found in my marriage that it wasn’t ok to say “I don’t want you to do that” but it was ok to say “would you be ok with me doing that?” And then hold her to it. 9 times out of 10 the behaviour would go away on its own if I stuck to it. For example: if it was ok for her to be gone 2-3 nights a week so would I. After a couple of weeks she was dying to sit on the couch and watch a movie after we spent the evening with the kids together. Conversely, if it's within your boundaries, be cool with it. I started to let her off the hook for minor annoyances a lot more which cooled the stress levels.

3. Be ok with losing her. Seriously. After one of our last bad fights before things got better, I reconciled myself to thinking this might be it. The end of our marriage and little family. I thought out how things would be living on my own, sharing custody of the kids, etc. And as tough as it would be, made peace with it. It wouldn’t kill me, it wouldn’t kill my kids. Very negative experience and one I’d like to avoid at all costs, but we would survive. This changed my attitude and clinginess significantly… and to be blunt scared the hell out of my wife. Just last month she told me “I think you’d be more ok without me than I’d be without you.” And for our marriage, that balance of neediness works. I think it’s an alpha male thing, not sure but it seems to work.

4. Do my own thing. I’m out at least once or twice a week doing martial arts, yoga, weights, cross-fit, trail running, hanging with buddies… you name it. Gives me perspective and gives my wife time to miss me. And I’m in kick ass shape compared to last year, and now instead of me worrying about my wife getting hit on I’m having to deal with having her be upset because other women check me out when we go out. I’m going on a weekend martial arts training camp… and my wife couldn’t say a word after going to Vegas last year. Another thing: I make sure I either do something fun with the kids when she goes out (she’ll have to decide if it’s more important to miss out on family fun or friend fun) or I have fun while she’s out. Even something stupid like a scotch and cigar in the back yard when the kids go to bed so I can kick back and listen to the complete lack of complaining about the cigar stink. Ahh…

5. Be a father to our children. Not just “quality” time but real time. Conversations, walks in the park, helping with homework, taking them to soccer, etc. all seemed to help big time. Not just with my wife, but with all of us. And I also found my “father voice,” the voice of discipline and reason in the family. My kids listen to me a lot more, not in fear, but they know they have to listen. Now my wife comes to me when the kids don’t listen to her, not the other way around.

6. Get some buddies. Guys need close guy friends to do guy stuff. Complain about their wives. Be stupid and macho. Whatever that means to you, it worked wonders for me.

7. Fight different. Walk away rather than blow up. Mean what you say and stand up to it. For example, if I threaten that if she keeps doing x that means I'll do y, then I bloody well do y if she does x. This had two effects: I thought about what I said more, and so did my wife. I think my wife has a need to be able to hold me at my word, even if that’s a bad thing. Not sure why. Using few words in a fight, slowly and quietly while looking her directly in the eye seems to also work. Once it’s said, don’t repeat it. It is what it is.

8. Act from a place of strength. I don’t think my wife wants a weakling. She may say that she’ll want me to be more intimate, vulnerable, etc… I think that’s actually BS. Or at least that she doesn’t mean weak or actually vulnerable. If you have flaws or weaknesses either accept it and move on or fix it. I don’t let my wife try to fix my flaws any more. If she brings something up and tries to fix it I’ll ask her to mind her own business (gently). Not a behaviour that impacts her, those I’ll always try to listen to her on. But I don't let her judge me or try to live up to her expectations any more. I define myself, I don't let her do that for me.

9. Be decisive. Again I think this is an alpha male thing. Make plans. I planned a few date nights, and didn’t ask what she wanted to do. Instead I planned stuff I thought might be fun for us, and asked if she was having a good time. She was, especially if it was stuff she didn’t normally like to do (one time we went to a tattoo expo – I have one small tattoo and she has none – but got us out of our element and we had a blast!) Now if she asks me “what do you want to do” I answer with what I want. Works in bed too – I just made sure she felt comfortable in saying “no.” Don’t bully, be decisive and adaptable.

10. Know what I want from life. This is hard in today’s world. I had to pull my head out of my ass and figure out that I don’t want to sit on the couch every night and watch TV. So now I don’t. At least not every night.

11. Do more macho stuff. Fix something around the house. Dig a big hole in the back yard and plant a tree. Fixing her car, for example, seemed to turn a light bulb on in my wife’s head that reminded me that I’m a man and not one of her girlfriends.

So that’s my list. Hope it helps some of the guys out there. Your mileage may vary, and my marriage may still fail, but I’m in a much better spot in the past year than I have been in a long, long time.

Thanks for everything!


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## turnera

So what are you going to do?


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## Noah2150

I don't know what to do. A part of me says it's over the other part says work it out. I know that I do love this woman very much, but the hurt is almost unbearable.


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## tom67

Take your time you have ptsd right now.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Chaparral

turnera said:


> So what are you going to do?


I would buy another VAR and leave the one he used laying around for her to see, after copying the info onto something else.
I would also tell her I wasn't interested in checking up on her anymore because if my gut even gives me a hint she is screewing up we were through and I will drop her in a New York minute. The new VAR would be well hidden. As a matter of fact, Brinkhouse has a really good VAR that looks like a pen.

Don't forget total access to all communication devices.

He needs to take time and think. Get to his MD for a little med or two and really consider options. Eighteen years is a long time to throw away but he may make a better life with his wife or he may need to find someone that hasn't stuck a knife in his back.


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## walkonmars

Reconciliation is not out of the question. However, she (not you) needs to demonstrate that she's worthy of that gift. and YOU (not she) are the one to decide if that is possible. 

However:
1. You're no where near a position to decide if you want to put an effort at R. 

2. She can't move toward asking for R without coming clean on what she's done. Why she's done it. And a full written timeline of all her activities outside the marriage. 

3. You can't possibly R without having it in your mind that you will be able to forgive her adultery at some point. But you can't even consider forgiveness without knowing the full extent of what she's done. Who was involved, what she bought him & received as gifts. How much of the family income she spent on him. 

TAKE YOUR TIME - don't rush into anything. You have to get hold of your shock. Go to an individual counselor to help you see yourself more objectively. Go to a doctor to get a full checkup. Don't act in haste. What's done is done.


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## Shaggy

She may have called you from work to find out what you are doing, but you know she's also spent all day talking and planning with the OM.

She's been warning him you know, and they've been making plans on what story to tell you nod how he is going to keep his gf from finding out.

They have been making plans on what to reveal and how to keep in touch and how to hook up.

The OM and maybe the female coworker are advising her on how to keep you in the dark while she gets a lawyer, tries to get you out of the house, and how to keep you exposing it at work.

She might be cleaning out bank accounts, see a lawyer . She will try to negotiate with you, failing that she might try to bully you to get you to react so she can call the police and claim domestic violence or fear of it.

You need to be carry a var on you at all times when she is around.

You need to secure. What money you can.

You need today while they are still figuring out what to do, to contact the OM gf. Send her a copy of the var and a note detailing the affair at least what you know.

Going dark on your wife will keep her from passing onto the OM what you are doing or planning.

Assume they are collaborating against you. Remember what she said on the var. her loyalty is to him and the affair. Right now you are a threat to the affair and the OM, so you are a threat to her.

Do not trust that she suddenly came to her senses. Do not believe that she is emotionally hurt by you being hurt. She was well enough to go to work and to make plans with the OM today.

You need to take care of you, and you need to finish exposing the affair to kill it off. You also need to expose to the husband of the female coworker that his wife knew and helped the affair. It's not unlikely that woman is having an affair too with someone at work and your wife and her have been providing cover for each other.


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## Shaggy

And remember before you can R your wife must end the affair. She must be loyal to you. She must have true remorse.


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## Thor

The woman you married no longer exists. The marriage you had no longer exists. You love the woman you thought she was.

The truth really does set you free. Now you know the reality. That is good. Better than not being able to make informed decisions.

So now you go forward with the option of starting a whole new relationship with this new person. Don't try to recapture your old marriage. Evaluate the new rellationship and her based on its own merits not baaed on what you wish they were.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## bfree

Noah2150 said:


> I don't know what to do. A part of me says it's over the other part says work it out. I know that I do love this woman very much, but the hurt is almost unbearable.


I want you to think of something Noah. Think of the pain you are experiencing. Think of the fact that you have this pain BECAUSE you love her so much. Now think of your wife. Does she love you as much as you love her? I want you to think of this to put you in the correct frame of mind. You may very well decide to reconcile. But it takes two very committed people. You KNOW how you feel. You need to make sure your wife SHOWS how she feels. Whether she does everything to make this right will go a long way toward showing you whether she has enough love for you to hold up her end of any reconciliation. She should be doing things like quitting her job, sending a NC letter, helping to expose the affair to the OM's wife or gf. She should be willing to take a polygraph to confirm that she has told you the complete truth. These are things that she needs to do to demonstrate she is truly remorseful. It is no longer about her. This is all about you.


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## donny64

If you cry, don't ever let her see you do it. 

Don't beg her. Don't plead with her. Don't ask her to work it out. SHE needs to be doing all those things, NOT YOU. 

What you should be doing is showing her that you are done. Even if you feel you're not, she should feel that is what you think. You've got to SNAP her out of this whole thing....the lust and excitement fog. The rugsweeping. The trickle truth. The blameshifting. You've got to snap her out of all of it, and the only way that typically works is if you do a hard break away from her and let her see and feel you walking away for good.

There is PLENTY of time to reconcile. That time is NOT now. Now it is time for you to prepare yourself for a new life without her in case she either does not stop what she's doing, or does not do enough to make it right.


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## barbados

Noah, I first want to commend you for doing the RIGHT thing by not doing the WRONG thing earlier today ! I fully understand what you wanted to do, and I am so glad you didn't ! Second, please listen to all the sound advice you are being given. The people here are sincerely trying to help. They are not judging you, they have simply all been where you are now. Stay strong !


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## Noah2150

If she says she wants to work things out, then gets home and changes the password on her Sprint account, doesn't that seem fishy?


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## Cdelta02

No, it's not fishy. She is protecting her actions right now. It may or may not mean she is in contact with OM but it does mean that she may not know what to do right now, whether to protect herself, protect you or the OM. Also she is still in the affair fog and you are nowhere near D or R where she can get a true bearing of her immediate actions now. Everything she does right now is as a broken person, broken not by grief or remorse or anything like that, but just broken inside, which is why she has been looking outside the marriage.


So what do you do now.

Where is chaparral when you need his list ?

So here is what I would suggest, 

Sit her down and in a calm manner talk about what is going on. Tell her if she wants to stick with you, she needs to come clean. She needs to write a timeline of everything that's happened with OM or any other man in the past. She needs to provide details of all encounters, photos sent, people who knew, people who encouraged, places they met, what they did. All of this needs to be written. You could do all this through talk the first time, but after that it needs to be written.

Do this first. Check for her reactions.

Also get an std test done and ask her to get one done too.

There is a lot more to do after this, but you will need time to process and act.

As next steps, if you do want to stick with her, you will need to do polygraphs if you feel she has hidden things.


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## joe kidd

Noah2150 said:


> If she says she wants to work things out, then gets home and changes the password on her Sprint account, doesn't that seem fishy?


Very. It's simple, do this and don't back down. Tell her you want access to EVERYTHING! Let her know if she does not comply then it is over. You will have to be willing to lose her if you want her back. If you give in there can never be respect, not from her and not for yourself. Best of luck man.


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## sharkeey

Noah2150 said:


> If she says she wants to work things out, then gets home and changes the password on her Sprint account, doesn't that seem fishy?


Think positive.

Maybe she's planning a surprise party for you.


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## sandc

Shaggy said:


> Do not trust that she suddenly came to her senses. Do not believe that she is emotionally hurt by you being hurt. She was well enough to go to work and to make plans with the OM today.


This this this. You were a wreck all day and had to stay home. She felt good enough to go to work? Really?

Now she's changed her Sprint password? Really?

They spent the day trying to cover their tracks and figuring out how to manage you.


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## Silverlining

Look at her actions!! Don't listen to her words. 
You need to go global in exposing this. These are the repercussions of her actions. She needs to see the negative consequences or she will continue to cake eat and take this underground. 

*You need to listen to us*. Cheaters all follow the same script. She's being very selfish right now. Not willing to give up the OM unless hellfire rains down on her. Find out who the OM girlfriend is and expose.


You can not save your marriage if she is not 100% remorseful and transparent. 

She is hiding the fact that she is still talking to OM.


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## 3putt

Okay Noah, take this for what it's worth as I only have one post to my credit, but a WW that claims to want to work things out then changes the password on her Sprint account is someone who is not at all serious about trying to work things out. If she were serious, she would've offered up all her passwords to you freely and without reservation. She's in damage control. That's all. 

Sorry.

You're getting played. Don't fall for it.

I would approach her about the change and ask her point blank if she were so serious about making things right then why is she still trying to hide things from you.

If you have nothing to hide, you hide nothing.

Pretty simple concept to me, don'tcha think?

So sorry for what you are going going through. Been there twice myself, so I understand the pain.


----------



## joe kidd

Noah you are getting here what so many betrayed would have loved to have on their D day. A playbook. I do hope you take advantage of it.


----------



## Shaggy

Noah2150 said:


> If she says she wants to work things out, then gets home and changes the password on her Sprint account, doesn't that seem fishy?


No it means she is lying to you. It means she is securing her line of communication from you, so she can continue her affair.

Now if she came hone, gave you her unlocked phone and all passwords, told you she quit working with the OM, and together with you planned on telling the OM gf everything, then there would have been a chance.

Instead your wife has chosen to lie to you and to continue her affair.


----------



## Shaggy

Oh, and I predict she will either tonight or tomorrow announce that she can't be around you because of your anger, or your hurt, or anything she needs to make up to have an excuse to go out.

She might even start an argument calling you controlling.

Whatever she chooses, it will be to go out and meet up with him.


----------



## Acabado

The rules, your boundaires, man. Focus on the rules. Tell her *the rules or immediate divorce*. No bargaining, no grey areas. No discussions. Tell her the rules are *only to STOP YOU *from going to the lawyer tomorrow morning and serve her.

- Quitting job.
- NC letter
- Complete transparence in comunication devices and whereabouts
- Full discosure, including timeline. Polygraph optional. (remember months of red flags, remember, she never fess up!!)
-More optionals;
Getting rid of enabler friend.
IC, MC, books.

Tell her the old marriage is dead, is up to her to make the heavy lifting to fix it. Tell her to get advice on her own on how to fix this.

I'd talk to a lawywer anyway.
Also, find and tell GF. And tell her friend's husband.
Also, keep snooping, GPS, spyware in the phone, keylogging the PC... whatever.
And don't buy ant excuse, justification, blameshifting crap she's going to dish. She own all of it. Just ignore it. Walk away.


Sorry man.


----------



## tom67

Go on spokeo and put theguys name in and you will get a partial address for free I have tried it.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Silverlining

I think Noah's weakness is that he's too afraid to loose her. He doesn't want to do anything fearing it will push her to OM. IMO 

What's better? Getting pissed off or pissed on? 

Find your BALLS!! This man is marking your territory. It's time to go nuclear


----------



## walkonmars

Noah2150 said:


> If she says she wants to work things out, then gets home and changes the password on her Sprint account, doesn't that seem fishy?


Of all the nerve!

I was hoping her phone call earlier in the day meant she was experiencing pangs of guilt for her betrayal. I guess she's counting on dealing with the "OLD" Noah. 

Little does she know a new Noah has emerged. A Noah whose self-confidence is growing. A man who is beginning to see clearly what his world looks like. 

Go cold. See a lawyer tomorrow. Find out what your options are. Don't engage in meaningless conversation. Listen but don't speak except to ask for clarification. The minute you sense deception or blameshifting - walk away. 

Get some rest.


----------



## tom67

Go to spokeo and put the guys name in you will get a partial address for free and for a fee you will get alot.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Acabado

For got about it.

STD test is a must.

Another optional... self exposure to parents.


----------



## keko

Noah2150 said:


> If she says she wants to work things out, then gets home and changes the password on her Sprint account, doesn't that seem fishy?


Fishy? Have you lost your mind noah? Her changing the password screams she doesn't care about you and wants to continue the affair.


----------



## JCD

keko said:


> Fishy? Have you lost your mind noah? Her changing the password screams she doesn't care about you and wants to continue the affair.


It screams something. The problem is that this action can cover a LOT of motives.

She is protecting herself from being humiliated further...or just to keep you in the dark.

She is protecting the OM because his GF is really nice and doesn't deserve a train wreck...or she wants to keep OM from being jobless and homeless...or keep him available for some fun on the side.

She is protecting you so she has a chance in hell of reconciling because if you know the truth, your last sight of her would be her gaining altitude with your boot print on her butt.

So...pick any or all. People are multifaceted things.

SHE is in shock too. Some people curl up in a little ball and others cling to ritual. Of course, she had the added incentive to be in touch with the OM in a way you CAN'T trace.

Contact her HR. THAT might put a kibosh on that form of communication if the love birds want to continue singing sweet nothings to each other on the company dime.


----------



## Doc Who

Noah
Look, this is going to sound harsh, but please listen. The "Take your time" advice can be misconstrued, so I want to give you an explicit understand.
1. Inaction and indecision is not your friend. SEE A LAWYER to learn about what divorce entails. Knowledge is power and right now, you are powerless.
2. Backup that VAR recording somewhere she cannot get to. She will try to destory or erase it.
3. Get to your doctor. This is hard, but STDs are real and can be deadly. That is not hyperbole.
4. Time to decide whether it is better to share her or to lose her. I think in your heart, sharing is not an option. So time to let her know that working it out means she quits hiding and quits screwing around. No other chances and MEAN it.
5. EXPOSE THIS!!!!! OM's gf deserves to know. OM and WW's HR department must know.
6. Detach. You cannot love her back from OM. If she leaves for him it will suck, but you cannot change THAT. All you can do is free yourself from her infidelity.

Brother, SAVE YOURSELF. She has gone soulless. You cannot change that. The selfish, horrible person you now have for a wife is the only person who can. So please, please, please focus on what is best for you and yours, and not her.

Strength to you.


----------



## Chaparral

Noah2150 said:


> If she says she wants to work things out, then gets home and changes the password on her Sprint account, doesn't that seem fishy?


You are not giving much info here. Time for stealth is over. How do you know she changed her password. If she is anything but weilling to show you everything, ask her to leave. Showing weakness now will ruin any chance you have to save your marriage.

Yo are in a war not a pillow fight.


----------



## ArmyofJuan

Noah2150 said:


> If she says she wants to work things out, then gets home and changes the password on her Sprint account, doesn't that seem fishy?


She is just telling you that so she has time to cover her tracks.

Your wife doesn't love you but she does want to use you, its really that simple. If you forgive her right now and try to R is will bite you on the a$$. You are gonna get played.

You need to show her that she can't control you and you are not going to allow her to disrespect you. File ASAP.

She cheated on you and has been lying and making you look like a chump, she needs to convince you she is worth keeping, not the other way around. She deserves to be thrown out on the streets for how she has been treating you.


----------



## Soifon

So an entire day has passed. What have you said to her Noah? What have you demanded from her? Have you demanded to see her phone? Have you demanded to see her phone records? Have you demanded the OM's name and contact info? She is playing you and if you haven't obtained these things you are losing. 

Time is not your friend here. The longer you sit back and do nothing the easier it is to get rid of evidence and concoct stories. She knows you and she knows how to manipulate you. I can already tell that you are not a forceful person and too trusting. You are already believing her lies, deep down you know they are lies but you want to believe them so you are. I don't even know you and I can see that, she KNOWS you and knows exactly how to play you. 

Snap out of it and start taking action or you will be in this situation all over again. Do you want to feel how you did two nights ago ever again? Because if you don't take control now this will all happen again.


----------



## Kasler

^ Denial is a strong force, one not easily toppled.


----------



## turnera

You didn't cave, did you?


----------



## sharkeey

Earth to Noah, come in please.


----------



## Soifon

It just really worries me that he asks if it's fishy that she changed her pw. Really? That is ALWAYS fishy how could it not be under THESE circumstances? Why should the PW even matter unless he A.) Never demanded full transparency (he would have then went through all of her sh!t) or B.) Did and she refused. It has to be one of those and both are very telling that he needs to get his a$$ in gear and start running the show instead of sitting back and waiting for her to make him feel better.


----------



## Saki

Noah

You gotta step up or step out man.

Time to sit in the driver's seat of your life!


----------



## mahike

Noah. I am glad nothing bad happened and I am glad it is out in the open. It sounds like you have decided you want to R. That is great but you have to be tough at this point. I was not and it cost me more hurt, and time to heal.

Some first steps are 
1. she answers all questions right when you ask
2. phone is unlocked and you can see it at any time
3. No Contact Letter. She writes and you send.
4. Expose to the OM's GF and Family and her family
5. This is big she has to quit her job. She cannot work for the same company.
6. MC for both of you and now
7. She must get and STD test and give you the results. This is big and is a must.

If she pushes back on any of this you need to show her the door.


----------



## sandc

I think poor Noah is shell-shocked right now.

Just keep breathing Noah, that's the key.

What's going on?


----------



## tom67

Noah if she won't leave you pack up bro you need to get away from her for a spell and clear your head.


----------



## Noah2150

I am reaching out to a Lawyer today to weigh my options and make plans for an exit. Changing of the password stands out clearly that she wants to hide things even more now and only sorry she got caught. I will go to spokeo to try and get an address. I am also taking you guy's advice and will get tested for an STD. After listening to her talk about the sex with not so sure if he used a condom.


----------



## sandc

Noah2150 said:


> I am reaching out to a Lawyer today to weigh my options and make plans for an exit. Changing of the password stands out clearly that she wants to hide things even more now and only sorry she got caught. I will go to spokeo to try and get an address. I am also taking you guy's advice and will get tested for an STD. After listening to her talk about the sex with not so sure if he used a condom.


Good man.

And no, condoms are almost never used in an affair. Sorry.

You deserve better. You will have better one day. Leave this one for someone else to deal with.


----------



## keko

STD testing is a must. Your health is the more important that anything else right now.

Noah if you can, ask her to move out under the guise of needing private time for yourself. If she does and you decide to divorce her, her being out of the house will help you a ton after the process starts. 

I also hope you didn't throw out the VAR. Keep one on yourself from now on as a protection, incase she'll pull a fake domestic violence on you. That will prove your innocence. If you can source another VAR, place it in her car again as I'm thinking she's discussing what to do with her toxic friends or even OM to take the affair underground or get their stories correct.


----------



## tom67

Stay strong Noah as alot say here you have to be willing to give up the marriage in order to save it you cannot nice her back you can r later but now you have to show her there are consequences for her actions. Buy another var and stick it in the car and carry another one leave the old one out so she thinks you are done checking up. Tell your boss what's going on also no shame in that it's not your fault.


----------



## vi_bride04

Just wanted to give my support to you during this horrible time.

Glad you are listening to fellow TAM members...they know what they are talking about. 

Good luck....


----------



## mahike

vi_bride04 said:


> Just wanted to give my support to you during this horrible time.
> 
> Glad you are listening to fellow TAM members...they know what they are talking about.
> 
> Good luck....


 Most of us know what we are talking about because most of us did wrong and we learned from our mistakes. 

I really had trouble keeping my emotions out of it!


----------



## snap

Noah, you install the VAR and within days pick on her one and only case of extramarital sex? What are the chances?

There is more, but you are unlikely to learn anything from your wife. You are her enemy who threatens her lifestyle.

Expose to the OMW pronto. Expose the lovers to their company HR.


----------



## Noah2150

My wife told me that she is hurt too because I put the VAR in her car. Also, not clear about exposing the affair to HR. Is against company rule or something? And yes she is still trying to indirectly blame this on me. She cried a lot last night.


----------



## Shaggy

Noah2150 said:


> My wife told me that she is hurt too because I put the VAR in her car. Also, not clear about exposing the affair to HR. Is against company rule or something? And yes she is still trying to indirectly blame this on me. She cried a lot last night.


She's hurt because you had the gall to discover her lies. Its a dead on sign that there is no remorse on her part. Her crying might be her bf dumping her.


----------



## sandc

Noah2150 said:


> My wife told me that she is hurt too because I put the VAR in her car. Also, not clear about exposing the affair to HR. Is against company rule or something? And yes she is still trying to indirectly blame this on me. She cried a lot last night.


This is to be expected. It's called blameshifting. This will all somehow be your fault. Just know that it's not your fault.

Yeah, putting a VAR in a car is completely equal to cheating. Shame on you for catching her. Don't take that crap from her.

And yes, MANY companies have policies against workplace affairs. Plus they may be worried about liability. Contact them and expose.

Remember this phrase, "I am not the one who cheated."

Feel free to use it as often as you want.

"You put a recorder in my car!"
"I am not the one who cheated."

"You're invading my privacy, you're trying to control me"
"I am not the one who cheated."

Works pretty good, huh?


----------



## SomedayDig

It's the script Noah. They all do that.


----------



## keko

What a remorseless, selfish b!tch. 

and she has the nerve to blame you for finding out her affair.


----------



## Shaggy

Her actions show that the bf likely hasn't dumped her yet, as she s still covering things up. The crying however might show that he isn't as thrilled to actually have her full time as she thought he would.

He's no doubt not dumping his gf and running off into the subset with her. She is now feeling alone and used because he really jested wanted sex from her, and not her.


----------



## turnera

Noah2150 said:


> My wife told me that she is hurt too because I put the VAR in her car. Also, not clear about exposing the affair to HR. Is against company rule or something? And yes she is still trying to indirectly blame this on me. She cried a lot last night.


She is HURT?

YOU are hurt. She's covering her ass.

I hope you aren't buying this bullsh*t.

Ignore her. "When you are ready to be faithful to me, we can talk."


----------



## SomedayDig

sandc said:


> Remember this phrase, "I am not the one who cheated."
> 
> 
> Works pretty good, huh?


I use it when Regret wants me to clean the kitty litter. I hate the kitty litter 



:rofl: Little levity for us all


----------



## Noah2150

@ sandc, a little chuckle. I definitely am going to use this one. Liablilty?


----------



## sandc

Noah2150 said:


> @ sandc, a little chuckle. I definitely am going to use this one. Liablilty?


Let's say that one of her other coworkers knows about this and is very uncomfortable with it. They eventually quit but then turn around a sue the company for creating a hostile work environment. 

It happens and HR knows this. Most HR departments anyway. Most will not want to take the risk and will take care of this situation quickly. The larger the company the more likely this is.


----------



## tom67

Sandc is correct. Hey why not just go over there instead of calling it will show you mean business also tell them you are keeping ALL your legal options open no specifics oh they will more than likely start investigating pronto!


----------



## snap

Make sure you are unmoved by her waterworks. As to blameshifting, escalate. Enough with eating the BS you're being shoveled with. 

VAR made you hurt? Here, maybe this divorce petition will make you feel better.


----------



## sandc

Yeah, she really has lost the right to feel hurt about anything. She has no clue as to how deeply she really hurt you.


----------



## walkonmars

Talk to your lawyer before you do anything else. Know your rights. Don't be hasty.
Is she still living at the house or did she move out? Out is better for the time being.


----------



## sandc

walkonmars said:


> Talk to your lawyer before you do anything else. Know your rights. Don't be hasty.
> Is she still living at the house or did she move out? Out is better for the time being.


:iagree:


----------



## Noah2150

BTW, we are still both here at home. I know she will be more cautious because of the VAR. I am not going to do it, but she also said I should delete the recordings, because she will never do it again and we need to move past this. I will not delete the arecordings and I have backed them up as well.


----------



## tom67

Noah2150 said:


> BTW, we are still both here at home. I know she will be more cautious because of the VAR. I am not going to do it, but she also said I should delete the recordings, because she will never do it again and we need to move past this. I will not delete the arecordings and I have backed them up as well.


Smart move!


----------



## turnera

EVERY CHEATER says 'we need to move past this.' 

Ignore her. If she EVER gets her head out of her ass and realizes what she did to you, you'll know. Ignore everything until then.


----------



## turnera

So...what is your status now? Has she given you the passwords to her phone/tablet/computer? Has she written a No Contact letter to the OM that YOU will approve and send? Have you demanded that she tell you for the near future where she goes and when so you can verify her whereabouts?

I don't sense remorse yet, just sorrow at being caught. It's only been 24 hours and she is ALREADY getting mad at YOU - she's testing you to see what you will cave on.

This is your ONE chance to get it right. You MUST be strong and unwavering in what you will put up with. She MUST give you her passwords, she MUST write that NC letter. Or she moves out.


----------



## keko

Noah2150 said:


> BTW, we are still both here at home. I know she will be more cautious because of the VAR. I am not going to do it, but she also said I should delete the recordings, because *she will never do it again and we need to move past this*. I will not delete the arecordings and I have backed them up as well.


:lol::lol::lol::lol:

:lol::lol:

:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:


Noah I hope your not buying into this crap.


----------



## walkonmars

There's no "getting past this" until she comes clean with EVERYTHING and ONLY when/if you you think she's been totally honest and is willing to work at being your wife again. 

From what you've posted it does not look promising. 

Go bacck and read all the posts on this thread again. There are many good suggestions on what you should ask and how you should act. Make notes of the suggestions that you feel will work. Then come back and ask for more details.

You are at a turning point in your life, a turning point you didn't ask for. It's time for you to emerge as a confident man and set the course for a rewarding future. It is up to you if you want to include her in that future.


----------



## Chaparral

Noah2150 said:


> My wife told me that she is hurt too because I put the VAR in her car. Also, not clear about exposing the affair to HR. Is against company rule or something? And yes she is still trying to indirectly blame this on me. She cried a lot last night.


This is the easiest one, your gut told you you could no longer trust her and your gut was right. You can't and don't trust her at all now. 

Ask her on a 1-10 scale, how much the VAR hurt her then tell her f*cking another man hurt you, on a 1-10 what she did is 1000+.


----------



## sandc

Noah2150 said:


> BTW, we are still both here at home. I know she will be more cautious because of the VAR. I am not going to do it, but she also said I should delete the recordings, because she will never do it again and we need to move past this. I will not delete the arecordings and I have backed them up as well.


Next time she says something like this stare at her blankly and ask her for each and every outfit she wore when she fncked him. Take them and burn them in front of her. Underwear too.

Then calmly tell her "we move past this when I say we move past this."


----------



## SomedayDig

Absolutely, sandc.

I actually made Regret throw out EVERY pair of underwear and bra. I wouldn't have any idea what she wore, so for me, spending $150 on a dozen or so was worth it. Also, I saw a pic of her yesterday from the night she met the xOM. In it, she is wearing a very nice Silpada necklace.

I just made her toss it out. That's about $80. Then again, this sh-t has NO price when it comes down to it.


----------



## sandc

SomedayDig said:


> Absolutely, sandc.
> 
> I actually made Regret throw out EVERY pair of underwear and bra. I wouldn't have any idea what she wore, so for me, spending $150 on a dozen or so was worth it. Also, I saw a pic of her yesterday from the night she met the xOM. In it, she is wearing a very nice Silpada necklace.
> 
> I just made her toss it out. That's about $80. Then again, this sh-t has NO price when it comes down to it.


Dude... I just can't imagine. Don't know how you do it.

:smnotworthy:


----------



## joe kidd

Noah. Tell her you will decide when you will " get past this". 
Hurt because you put the VAR in the car huh? Tell her to get past that.


----------



## SomedayDig

sandc said:


> Dude... I just can't imagine. Don't know how you do it.
> 
> :smnotworthy:


LMAO...I don't think I deserve the "not worthy" smiley!!

However, it's just the rules I made the morning after Dday. I immediately had her throw out the dress, undies and bra from the previous night as well as the $150 Victoria Secret boots.

Sorry...just the way it was and is. A line was drawn in the sand. If she wanted to stay, she had a choice. My way or the highway. I hate to sound flippant about it. It's just the way it goes.


----------



## bfree

Noah2150 said:


> My wife told me that she is hurt too because I put the VAR in her car. Also, not clear about exposing the affair to HR. Is against company rule or something? And yes she is still trying to indirectly blame this on me. She cried a lot last night.


Tell her if she wasn't a lying cheater you wouldn't have had to go to such lengths. If I remember correctly you had already tried to confront her about this and she denied it all. THAT'S WHY YOU NEEDED THE VAR!!!!!!


----------



## bfree

SomedayDig said:


> LMAO...I don't think I deserve the "not worthy" smiley!!
> 
> However, it's just the rules I made the morning after Dday. I immediately had her throw out the dress, undies and bra from the previous night as well as the $150 Victoria Secret boots.
> 
> Sorry...just the way it was and is. A line was drawn in the sand. If she wanted to stay, she had a choice. My way or the highway. I hate to sound flippant about it. It's just the way it goes.


Its not flippant. Its what was necessary for you to try to overcome the betrayal. If the WS wants to save the marriage then whatever the BS needs the BS gets.


----------



## sandc

SomedayDig said:


> LMAO...I don't think I deserve the "not worthy" smiley!!


I think you do. Guys like me can only speak from a common sense position. You can speak from experience. Glad that guys like you are around. And sorry guys like you exist.

That doesn't look quite right but... you know what I mean.


----------



## SomedayDig

I get ya, sandc. Thanks. I appreciate the compliment.


----------



## joe kidd

SomedayDig said:


> I get ya, sandc. Thanks. I appreciate the compliment.


Yeah there were some things that had to go into the trash. It seems we thought along the same lines.


----------



## TDSC60

She is definitely not sorry for the affair. Does she still refuse to tell you the guy's name? Locking the phone and telling you to to delete the recordings is part of her cover-up. Is adultery considered during divorce where you live? I am thinking it may be or she thinks it is thus the reason for wanting the recorded evidence gone.

Get a bank account in your name only. If you have direct deposit at work have it sent to the new account.

You said you had met your wife's GF and her husband. Talk to him and see if he will give up any info about the guy.

You need to watch your back now.


----------



## workindad

Noah2150 said:


> My wife told me that she is hurt too because I put the VAR in her car. Also, not clear about exposing the affair to HR. Is against company rule or something? And yes she is still trying to indirectly blame this on me. She cried a lot last night.


My XW blamed her cheating on me, not indirectly. Note- she is now my XW.

Good luck Stay Strong
WD


----------



## Acabado

Glad to hear you are talking to a lawyer.
Write down the rules, man. Next time she talks to you tell her she's not remorseful, only sorry she was caught, that she's freee to leave for OM and you feel forced to divorce her, then give her the list of *conditions to stop you in your way to divorce her* immediately. And start implementing the 180.

Identity of OM
NC letter 
Complete transparence.
Full disclosure. Full discosure. Full discosure.
Quitting that job
STD tests.
Self exposure to parents?
MC?, IC?... She makes the appointments
Not just friends? another book?

Tell her it's up to her to fix this. The ball is in her court. But for now you are moving on.

Don't let this chaos stop you to put a little order. Take chargue. Take control. You can always file later, but for now make your demands.


----------



## JCD

Noah2150 said:


> BTW, we are still both here at home. I know she will be more cautious because of the VAR. I am not going to do it, but she also said I should delete the recordings, because she will never do it again and we need to move past this. I will not delete the arecordings and I have backed them up as well.


"We had a chance to 'get past this'. It was when I asked you to come clean and you lied to me. I confronted you on this a couple times. Since you are a liar, you can't be trusted. So you don't get to be 'hurt' that I had to take extreme measures to find out the truth. YOU set up the rules of discovery. I didn't."

"Since I had to play by your rules then, you get to play by my rules now. Reconciling happens the way _I_ want it to. Here are a short list of rules. They are non-neogotiable."

Then just walk away. She can't argue with you. She can't debate and negotiate. She has plain text in front of her.

**

Personally, I'd talk to the woman who posed as your friend. "You helped my wife shove the knife in my back. You saw her with the blade and you kept your mouth shut so now I'm bleeding. So...now I am giving you the opportunity to make things right. Tell me everything you know about this guy and the affair. I'm not asking you to think about it. No calling Mrs. Cheater for advice. No warning everyone. You tell me now, or you don't.

Does: Write everything down.

Doesn't: "Mr. GF. I'd like to tell you that your wife knew my wife was cheating on my and didn't tell me. I don't know if you knew or not, but that's a personally scummy thing to do. We broke bread together. We had fun outings together. So she cannot call me friend. She would rather be friends with a cheating b*tch. Think about her obvious comfort in those moral choices."

Over your shoulder as you walk away.

"Oh...I find it funny that she used YOUR wife as cover for her cheating. I wonder if she ever used MY wife as cover for you. You might want to do some digging yourself. She certainly has a lot of 'girls' nights out."


----------



## Lordhavok

I would still expose all of this, wouldnt care if both of them got fired or not.


----------



## Chaparral

Lordhavok said:


> I would still expose all of this, wouldnt care if both of them got fired or not.


From a post by someday dig. Its about backbone.

* Re: Caught my wife having an EA - how did I do? 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

If you feel like it, tag my name and look at my thread started. You'll see "my side of the story" and others. I exposed to all our close friends and her sister. I left it to her to tell her parents. We lost every friend in that social group, however they also took the xOM side cuz they felt sorry for him when I exposed to his wife and she took him for everything. He was an attorney until I put him on cheaterville and ruined his name and reputation. I didn't file but gave her my attorney name and said it's just waiting in the wings.*


----------



## Noah2150

I really did give her a chance to come clean berfore planting the VAR. The fact she denied it emphatically and I even apologized for me being suspicious about my behavior. It really showed me that she is an excellent if not one of the best liars I've ever known. I think she blieves the VAR is still in her car, but it's not.


----------



## keko

Noah2150 said:


> I really did give her a chance to come clean berfore planting the VAR. The fact she denied it emphatically and I even apologized for me being suspicious about my behavior. It really showed me that she is an excellent if not one of the best liars I've ever known. I think she blieves the VAR is still in her car, but it's not.


Leave the current one out in the open, like on the dinner table but buy another one and hide it in her car again.


----------



## Noah2150

@ keko, think I am going to that.


----------



## turnera

Definitely put another one in the car. Keep one going in the house, too. Keylogger?


----------



## Thor

Doc Who said:


> 3. Get to your doctor. This is hard, but STDs are real and can be deadly. That is not hyperbole.





mahike said:


> 7. She must get and STD test and give you the results. This is big and is a must.


Noah, do this part right for your own health. There are diseases which have no tests for men but do for women. HPV is one, another is Chlamidia. So your wife must get a complete full panel test and show you the results. You must also get tested because you could be positive yet your wife test negative (several possibilities there).

Also, make phone calls before you go to see what they test for. An STD clinic may be a better bet than your regular doc. My regular doc does not do any STD testing, nor does my Urologist! The county clinic does not do chlamidia testing but the Planned Parenthood does.

Get the throat and mouth swab plus all of the blood tests. She gets everything tested.

You will have to go back for follow up Herpes and HIV testing again later. About sixteen weeks for Herpes and about six months for HIV.

Be sure they differentiate between HSV1 and HSV2 on the herpes tests. HSV1 is cold sores but can appear anywhere on the body. Not a big deal medically. HSV2 is genital herpes but can appear anywhere on the body. This is the one you don't want to get. Some tests don't differentiate between the two. After about 16 weeks from last possible exposure to HSV2 you will get very reliable results either positive or negative.


----------



## thesunwillcomeout

keko said:


> Leave the current one out in the open, like on the dinner table but buy another one and hide it in her car again.


Such a great idea!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Noah2150

I was thinking abut the keylogger thing, placing one on her IPAD. Not sure if Apple has security measures against this on the IPAD.


----------



## turnera

iKeyMonitor - Keylogger for iPad and Keylogger for iPhone that logs Keystrokes, Websites and Screenshots


----------



## thesunwillcomeout

Do u still have to jail break? Does she flush her cookies on her iPads browser? My husband cleared his history regularly...never thought to clear cookies. That was a fun one to go through!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Noah2150

I noticed the history is always cleared as well on her IPAD. @ tunera thanks


----------



## Thor

You'll have to jailbreak the ipad to keylog it. Another option is to back it up it to your iTunes. All of her emails and stuff will then backup to your computer when you sync it again later.

We need an iPad expert to step in on this though. You need to be sure when you sync it to your computer she is not notified somehow like via email. When I sync a new iPod to my itunes it sends ME an email because the itunes is in my name. But idk about the iPad and email syncing.

On the VAR. You can attach a mic via wire to many of them. So you could duct tape the var way up under the dash board and then run the mic down along other wires to the bottom of the dash where it could listen. Thus there is no VAR under her seat or wherever you had it. She'll look and think her car is clear.

Do talk to a lawyer. It made me really f'n anxious to make the call but when I did talk to one for about a half hour it really helped to know hard facts about how things work rather than worry or wonder based on common myths.


----------



## Noah2150

What does jailbreak the IPAD mean?


----------



## Noah2150

@ Thor, excellent idea on the VAR and mic


----------



## thesunwillcomeout

Noah2150 said:


> I noticed the history is always cleared as well on her IPAD. @ tunera thanks


what about cookies?


----------



## Almostrecovered

jailbreaking is reconfiguring your iphone or ipad to be broken from Apple's draconian app licensing agreements, it does void your warranty

if you have deft hand you can do it after getting parts in about 20 minutes, tons of how to videos on youtube or you can pay someone $75 or so to do it for you


----------



## thesunwillcomeout

Noah2150 said:


> What does jailbreak the IPAD mean?


just google it -- there are youtube vid's that give you clear instruction how to do it. Not as scary as it sounds.

also, if you both synch ipads, iphones to the same computer, even if you have separate login's for your computer (I'm talking mac) then you shouldn't get an email, at least we don't. (if she has separate login do you have her password?). If not, you can backup on your account. I've done both. But you want to make sure you have synching turned off! You only want to make a backup

I actually dug out txts from the ~library/ /mobile file the txt file (3dod.....) and used a txt editor to go through and do a search for txts to and from OW to my husband. It didn't contain all of the deleted texts, but enough for me to have more proof. (If they swipe texts to delete on an iphone it's less secure that the 'edit' to delete. Unfortunately my h used the 'edit' function only because he didn't know he could've swiped, otherwise he would've. The only way to really retrieve the irretrievable txts is to get them from the phone company (court order??) and or hire a cyber-forensic dude. For the lay person you can only retrieve txts that have been deleted that haven't been overwritten with new content. Someone correct me if I'm wrong....


----------



## Thor

thesunwillcomeout said:


> But you want to make sure you have synching turned off! You only want to make a backup


That is worth repeating because my post was misleading. Syncing should be turned off. Sync means put what is on iTunes onto the iPad. BAD! You want to backup, which is take what is on the iPad and copy it into your computer via iTunes.

There is a decision box when you first attach a new device to your computer iTunes. It asks if you want to sync, and this is where you need to be careful *not* to sync.


----------



## Louise7

Noah2150 said:


> I really did give her a chance to come clean berfore planting the VAR. The fact she denied it emphatically and I even apologized for me being suspicious about my behavior. It really showed me that she is an excellent if not one of the best liars I've ever known. I think she blieves the VAR is still in her car, but it's not.


Hey Noah. You are doing really well, even though you probably don't feel like you are.

Somone else suggested it...leave the VAR where she can see it, beg or buy another and put that in her car. You have said yourself, she lies so you cannot assume she has gone 'no contact.'

I was amazed to find she is 'hurt' by you planting the VAR. As you say, she denied before the VAR. She is just hurt that she got caught.

You are doing an amazing thing in keeping yourself in good shape, for getting ready to be a prize for a woman who will appreciate you. You have no idea how much your strength has helped little me.


----------



## loveisforever

Noah, do not forget to get free consultation from lawyers ASAP. Usually you need at least 3 lawyers to get an initial idea.


----------



## karole

Also, regarding the attorneys, find out who the best ones are and go see everyone of them because they can't represent her after consulting with you. You will have a bulldog and she will end up with a poodle - if you have to go down that road.


----------



## PHTlump

Noah,

She's trying to cake eat. And, right now, you're letting her. Think of your wife as a horse. Before you can ride her, you have to break her.

You can't break your wife out of the fog by sneaking around and letting her think that she got away with an affair. You have to slap her down HARD. Get her out of the house today. Seriously. Pack a bag for her and tell her she can come get whatever else she needs later. Tell her it's only temporary while you decide whether you want to pursue reconciliation. After you've decided, it may be permanent.

Also, you need to go dark. If she's unwilling to be an open book to you, then you should be a closed book to her. Communicate by text only. I think that is your best shot to wake her up and convince her that she needs to end her affair and recommit to you. Right now, it appears that the lesson she's learned is to go further underground.

Good luck.


----------



## the guy

So is your WW still meeting her "friends" today?

I hope you are taking care of your self. You need a montra to force the mind movies out. I would tell my self that "I diserve good things" i would repeat it a hundred times a day. When ever those evil thought come up repeat your montra over and over. Do not let those evil thoughts take over your life...force them out with something positive.

Start working out, lifting wieghts helped me out alot, so did running.


i found that when I went to my favorite resturant and got my favorite dish to go i would take little bites thru out the day, it keep me eating something...even if it was alittle bite it was something.

You have to have your mind set that WW is the bad guy and you did nothing wrong, right now you have to have an ego that you are better then WW and OM. Do not let there bull sh1t define you, you are better then that and show other how confident you are in moving on with or with out your wife.

No matter how weak you really feel you have to be strong, confident and positive..."fake until you make it". This additude will start to do you some good. Do not let your self dwell on this negitive crap...be better then all this because you "diserve good things"


----------



## Noah2150

No she has been crying the past two days. She didn't go anyhwere today, but I don't know if she communicated with him today via text or phone call. @ Louise 7 thank you very much. Also I get my STD results back Monday, but have to wait 6 months before taking an HIV test.


----------



## The Cro-Magnon

Noah2150 said:


> No she has been crying the past two days. She didn't go anyhwere today, but I don't know if she communicated with him today via text or phone call. @ Louise 7 thank you very much. Also I get my STD results back Monday, but have to wait 6 months before taking an HIV test.


Grief at the loss of her OM.


----------



## sandc

The Cro-Magnon said:


> Grief at the loss of her OM.


With a little manipulation thrown in there.


----------



## Silverlining

Noah2150 said:


> No she has been crying the past two days. She didn't go anyhwere today, but I don't know if she communicated with him today via text or phone call. @ Louise 7 thank you very much. Also I get my STD results back Monday, but have to wait 6 months before taking an HIV test.


Don't fall for her crying act. Sounds like she is still not being 100% transparent. 

You need to give her your demands (if you haven't done so already).

Good luck


----------



## JCD

Noah2150 said:


> No she has been crying the past two days. She didn't go anyhwere today, but I don't know if she communicated with him today via text or phone call. @ Louise 7 thank you very much. Also I get my STD results back Monday, but have to wait 6 months before taking an HIV test.


Don't talk to her. You already said your piece.

Go get a bunch of little red circle and blue circle stickers. Than go around the house and start putting blue circles on everything you want. (if you need to keep busy, put little 'A's on her red circles...just saying.

When she asks what you are doing, say 'divvying up the stuff. Here are yours. Put them on what you want'. It's a bit of a mind f*ck, but might clarify your thinking and it's a distinct message.


----------



## Shaggy

Have you gone after the OM and exposed him on his side ?


----------



## Chaparral

What have you told her Noah? Has she admitted the affair now?


----------



## Noah2150

The VAR is gone. I put it in the glove compartment of my car and now it's not there. I know she took it. However , I have a copy of the recording on my pc and online to a free storage space. This woman whom I loved soo dearly is starting to be a stranger to me. She is definitely not being 100% transparent. I've reached out to the OM girlfriend but she wont respond to my messages. I am not sure if she is actively on FB.


----------



## aug

Noah2150 said:


> The VAR is gone. I put it in the glove compartment of my car and now it's not there. I know she took it. However , I have a copy of the recording on my pc and online to a free storage space. This woman whom I loved soo dearly is starting to be a stranger to me. She is definitely not being 100% transparent. I've reached out to the OM girlfriend but she wont respond to my messages. I am not sure if she is actively on FB.



Why dont you burn a few CDs or DVDs? Mail one to your parents for safekeeping. Keep one at work.

You PC can get damaged or stolen or whatever. The online storage may not have it or accessible later.


----------



## aug

Since your VAR had disappeared, it's safe to say she has heard your recording and know what info you have. She now had the time to work her spin on it.


----------



## slater

She may be dumb enough to erase it and think it's your only copy. I would play into this. If she brings up the VAR- act upset etc.


----------



## BrockLanders

Noah2150 said:


> No she has been crying the past two days. She didn't go anyhwere today, but I don't know if she communicated with him today via text or phone call. @ Louise 7 thank you very much. Also I get my STD results back Monday, but have to wait 6 months before taking an HIV test.


The odds of a man getting HIV from vaginal sex with a woman who is not menstruating are nil. People who spread fear over this should walk around in a Faraday cage, lest they be struck by lightning.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Will_Kane

Noah2150 said:


> The VAR is gone. I put it in the glove compartment of my car and now it's not there. I know she took it. However , I have a copy of the recording on my pc and online to a free storage space. This woman whom I loved soo dearly is starting to be a stranger to me. She is definitely not being 100% transparent. I've reached out to the OM girlfriend but she wont respond to my messages. I am not sure if she is actively on FB.


Did you ask her if she took it?

What kind of conversations have you been having with her?


----------



## Chaparral

Noah doesn't tell us much at all.

Messages to facebook can be intercepted, you need to find her and talk to her in person.


----------



## Eli-Zor

SomedayDig said:


> Absolutely, sandc.
> 
> I actually made Regret throw out EVERY pair of underwear and bra. I wouldn't have any idea what she wore, so for me, spending $150 on a dozen or so was worth it. Also, I saw a pic of her yesterday from the night she met the xOM. In it, she is wearing a very nice Silpada necklace.
> 
> I just made her toss it out. That's about $80. Then again, this sh-t has NO price when it comes down to it.


Agree , remove her OM memories and your triggers .
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Eli-Zor

Use every tool at your disposal to find his gf, his parents and siblings . If you cant get hold of his gf expose to his close family and friends , no amount of spin is going to save him when a larger group of people know what he is up to.

Assume your wife has already told OM so ramp up the pressure and do so quickly. Secure those copies offsite where only you can get to.

and do what you fear most , expose to HR

Plus a full 180 , focus on yourself, assume and prepare for the worst
_Posted via Mobile Device_
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## turnera

Have some fun with this, Noah. Go buy a dozen VARs. Put one back in her car and one back in your glove box. Put one on the kitchen table. See what she does.


----------



## turnera

But seriously, you really really need to be standing up to her about this. The more you stay silent, the more you convince her you're a doormat and to be despised and lied to.


----------



## the guy

You mentioned, when you confronted her with the VAR proof that she "wanted to work it out", but it appears she is drifting away with more secrecy.
Have you talked to her about what "working it out" means? 
If she continues to drift away its time to do a hard 180 and cut her off. She needs to see the reality of her choices. You have to suck it up and have the confidence to let her go.

I know it is tough and having been there, I can tell you that being weak and negitive will not help. Your wife has to see that you can move on with out her if she continues to drift away. She must see a confident man.

If you are crying and begging you are lowering your attraction level. Even if you have to fake this confidence and toughness for now it will help you down the road.

I love my wife and I was scared sh1tless off losing her but these cheaters won't start respecting you until you respect your self enough to tell them "no more"!

Have you stated your boundries?
Is what you heard a deal breaker?

Divorce can be just as hard a R so take the time to make a choice and a far as your wife goes you will make that disicion soon enough.

It sucks man, but you can't let her sit on the fence even though you are. 

You guy need to talk about whats next and what you want.

Have you asked her to leave? Do you have the confidence to ask her to leave and except the possiblity of letting her go. Will she respect your boundries?

I have a feeling you aren't there yet and you wife knows this and continues to behave the way she is cuz you have stepped up and talked about your boundries, I sense your affraid to stat your boundries and the consequences for when they are crossed cuz she won't except them and it will push her away.

I think pushing her away is the best bet right now, its time to see how commited she is to "working it out".

There are alot of questions that need to be addressed.

It appears she uses all this crying to avoid addressing the adultory.


----------



## keko

Tell her you're missing the VAR and ask her to give it back to you. 

In the mean time buy another VAR and hide it in her car like yesterday!!!


----------



## SomedayDig

Hmmm...the VAR is missing. How conveeeeenient.


----------



## tom67

You can really f^ck with her by playing the convo on your computer


----------



## snap

Noah2150 said:


> I've reached out to the OM girlfriend but she wont respond to my messages. I am not sure if she is actively on FB.


Facebook now leaves timestamps on your messages if they've been read. Like, "Seen on 30-11-2012"


----------



## naga75

Just posting to subscribe. 
Good luck.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Silverlining

Tell her you want the VAR back. Do not waste another minute on this woman. She is biding her time til she and OM can be together. 

Cancel all credit cards and separate all finances.

You need to pack her bags and send her on her merry way!


----------



## Chaparral

Well I'm not at all surprised she took the VAR. She wants to know what Noah knows. Bad Move to not keep it locked up but if he gets another VAR it can work in his favor. This is a very minor bump considering.

I actualkly suggested he leave it lying around so shecould see it, get another VAR and set her up again.


----------



## Shaggy

Noah,

You had the initiative but you've lost the momentum on of your campaign. 

She was worried about exposure, likely mostly of the OM to his gf. FB isn't panning out, take her name and hit spokeo.com/pipl.com or even the phone book and find a phone number and reach out directly. I would even recommend letter to her, but make it look like an xmas card with no return address.

I think the problem you're facing is the OM is on alert and is intercepting your attempts to out him.

You're wife was worried, but now she is regaining her confidence because the OM hasn't been hit, and she figures if he'll stay with her she can dump you.


----------



## Shaggy

As for the VAR, it's actually a good strategy to plant false vars that can be easily found and removed. It gives them a nice false sense of accomplishment.


----------



## the guy

In a way I'm glad she took the VAR and i hope she listens to everyminute of it. I hope she hears how sickening it is and maybe, just maybe she will see her evil and change.

I know when my fWW reread her text w/OM ..now realizing I had read it, she chnaged. I think once they get found out and that little secret is now out its not so cute and erotic....I think once the text or recording is heared by someone that wasn't supposed to hear it it brings out the huniliation and shame from the ones that wrote or said those evil things.

But then again your WW moral compase may not be so out of wack that it may be best you move on with out her.


----------



## Shaggy

I reminded of the poster who said he made his wife watch the porn movie she made with the OM and go over each frame of it with her.


----------



## grizzly88

please help how do i start a new post


----------



## TBT

grizzly88 said:


> please help how do i start a new post


Click on main page of forum you want....then click on "forum tools" at top of list.


----------



## SomedayDig

TBT said:


> Click on main page of forum you want....then click on "forum tools" at top of list.


Or on whatever forum section you're on you can see the "New Thread" button.


----------



## Silverlining

I think she confiscated the VAR to destroy the incriminating evidence. I just don't see her ruminating over what's on it first.
She was in seek and destroy mode. 

Noah, have you given her your demands? Don't ease up on her. Let her know you made copies and you will post them on FB for all to hear. 

Out this cheating B*tch!!


----------



## the guy

@Silverlining, your most likely right, any one with the more compase to cheat isn't going to listen the the shameful evidence.

But as a consequences for WW and if OP could stomach it I would make WW listen to it with him and explain to him why.


----------



## bfree

OP should upload the audio on Chirbit. Then he can send it to Facebook, Twitter, Tumblr or anywhere else for that matter. Makes a nice Christmas gift.


----------



## Chaparral

bfree said:


> OP should upload the audio on Chirbit. Then he can send it to Facebook, Twitter, Tumblr or anywhere else for that matter. Makes a nice Christmas gift.[/QUOT
> 
> 
> CheaterVille :: Don't Be the Last to Know


----------



## SomedayDig

Cheaterville. Oh...how I love thee.


----------



## JCD

He works on a loading dock. That isn't a high profile job and him nailing an office honey will probably get him some high fives from his fellow co-workers.

But he should need to find another loading dock position. And she should be at the very least embarrassed at work.


----------



## naga75

or maybe when you tell his wife/gf, she will be like the wife of my wifes OM...
"yeah i thought maybe they were seeing each other AGAIN, but i wasnt sure".
wait wait wait...you knew about this and didnt have the common fkn decency to tell me? last YEAR?
thanks.
never underestimate the power of a cheater.


----------



## mahike

Noah I know getting the STD test was hard. I saw it as the lowest point in my life. Did she agree to get one? Are you in IC yet. I really needed it. I had real anger issues. 

Did you expose to your wifes work? What did the lawyer advise?


----------



## crossbar

Well, you've learned a lot of things here and the most important of them all is that cheaters are incredibly good liars. And cheaters will only admit to what you can prove. Since you only accused her of wrong doing on the 24th and you have a recording of her "sexy talk" well, that's all she's going to admit to. 

If she has an Iphone, chances are she recharged it on the home computer. If this is the case, then you need to download an iphone file extractor. Google it and get it. If she charged her phone on the computer then chances are that phone sync'd up with the computer. Therefore, there's a hidden file on that computer that has all of the text conversation that was on that phone. It might work for the ipad too. At any rate it's worth trying. Also, a good spot to place a VAR in a car is to go to your local hardware store and get some heavy duty velcro. Use the velcro on the VAR and secure it under the drivers seat. The glove box is never a good place.


----------



## Noah2150

I will purchase another VAR. I like the idea of placing it deep unthe dashboard and attaching a mic wire to it and running along the other wires in the car. I know she will search underneath her seat now and glove compartment. I told her yesterday that she must have complete transparency, not sure if she relly will though. @crossbar she has a Samsung Galaxy S II. We argued about this all weekend long. She says if I have forgiven her and bring up the cheating one more time then we are finished. @ the guy, it's hard but I am really trying to be tough, most of you may have already been able to tell, that my wife really has always been the dominate one in our relationship. I really am trying to toughen up/


----------



## walkonmars

Noah2150 said:


> ...* She says if I have forgiven her and bring up the cheating one more time then we are finished. @ the guy, it's hard but I am really trying to be tough, most of you may have already been able to tell, that my wife really has always been the dominate one in our relationship. I really am trying to toughen up...*/


After she told you to shut the F up (that what she meant by not bringing it up again) you should have told her to hit the road. That's how you toughen up. 

Forget the additional VAR. She already told you what she intends to do. She has big brass ballzz.


----------



## donny64

> She says if I have forgiven her and bring up the cheating one more time then we are finished.


This is easy then. Tell her you in fact HAVE NOT forgiven her, that she has not earned any kind of a shot at reconcilliation, let alone forgiveness, and she should pack her bags and leave immediately because you are not finished talking about it. Not by a long shot.

Then follow through with it. Right now you want it more than she does. And she sees it. Until she wants it more than you, she will continue with her ways.

Throw her out with divorce papers in her hand. If there's anything worth saving in this marriage, you'll likely see an immediate and substantial change in her attitude.

This is what happens when anyone (man or woman) lets someone completely dominate them in a relationship....but ESPECIALLY when a man lets himself be so dominated. Even the biggest ball busting, dominant personality type female out there will not be attracted to a man she can completely dominate. Just is not happening.


----------



## turnera

Practice this:

Go ahead.


----------



## walkonmars

turnera said:


> Practice this:
> 
> Go ahead.


Love it! Short, sweet, to the point. Very little opportunity to get tongue tied.


----------



## sandc

Noah,
Go to your attorney and have divorce papers drawn up. I'm not sure if it was on this thread or another but call the 3 best divorce attornies in your area and have the free 30 min consult. She can't hire them if they have already consulted with you. Supposedly.

Have the D papers in hand the next time you bring up her affair. Tell her to sign and then get out. Tell her you'll be dropping her stuff off at the OM's place, she can pick it up there.

As far as the VAR goes... well okay but why? She has already cheated on you. You know all you need to know. There are also smartphone apps that let you listen in to sounds where ever the phone is. You may hear something you really don't want to though so think about that carefully.

Have you talked to her HR yet? If not you may want to hold off until after divorce is final. Otherwise she could lose her job and you'll be on the hook for alimony.

Do NOT let this woman bully you. I suspect she already knows she can. I suspect she can bully you pretty good to. Prove us both wrong.


----------



## CH

turnera said:


> Practice this:
> 
> Go ahead.


:iagree:

She called your bluff and you tucked tail and ran.....


----------



## SomedayDig

Noah2150 said:


> We argued about this all weekend long. She says *if I have forgiven her* and bring up the cheating one more time then we are finished. /


Have you forgiven her? I mean...the cat ain't even fully outta the bag yet.


----------



## LetDownNTX

sandc said:


> Noah,
> Go to your attorney and have divorce papers drawn up. I'm not sure if it was on this thread or another but call the 3 best divorce attornies in your area and have the free 30 min consult. She can't hire them if they have already consulted with you. Supposedly.
> 
> Have the D papers in hand the next time you bring up her affair. Tell her to sign and then get out. Tell her you'll be dropping her stuff off at the OM's place, she can pick it up there.
> 
> As far as the VAR goes... well okay but why? She has already cheated on you. You know all you need to know. There are also smartphone apps that let you listen in to sounds where ever the phone is. You may hear something you really don't want to though so think about that carefully.
> 
> Have you talked to her HR yet? If not you may want to hold off until after divorce is final. Otherwise she could lose her job and you'll be on the hook for alimony.
> 
> Do NOT let this woman bully you. I suspect she already knows she can. I suspect she can bully you pretty good to. Prove us both wrong.


In some states you can also print out the papers online (the information papers) and you can leave those laying around. I have a folder with mine filled out that I never threw away. WH bought **** a brick when he saw them the first time.


----------



## the guy

If my wife had the cawl to make the kind of statement your made with regards to not bringing it up any more I would have packed her crap and throw it out.

I just don't get it , your wife screws you over and she is still calling the shots?

You really aren't going anywere are you?

Were is the anger man?

I though she wanted to work it out, but under her terms and thats a perfect set up for her to relaps and have another affair down the road.

You really don't want to live like this do you?

What are the consequences to prevent this from happening again?

Typically when some one commits adultory the marriage is over, so I don't get why she thinks you will keep her around?


----------



## TCSRedhead

Noah2150 said:


> I will purchase another VAR. I like the idea of placing it deep unthe dashboard and attaching a mic wire to it and running along the other wires in the car. I know she will search underneath her seat now and glove compartment. I told her yesterday that she must have complete transparency, not sure if she relly will though. @crossbar she has a Samsung Galaxy S II. We argued about this all weekend long. She says if I have forgiven her and bring up the cheating one more time then we are finished. @ the guy, it's hard but I am really trying to be tough, most of you may have already been able to tell, that my wife really has always been the dominate one in our relationship. I really am trying to toughen up/


Good idea on the VAR - but a few of them. 

Next time she gets upset - tell her you can't forgive her until she tells you EVERYTHING because you don't know if you WANT to forgive her until you know the truth. 

There are sim card readers you can get online - check out the thread talking about the husband's phone showing him having sex with many women - that woman has the right idea. 

Strength isn't always about confrontation and being macho. Stay strong and silent - don't engage when she behaves like that. Tell her you know she's lying and walk away. Go to the gym. Go have drinks with some buddies. Get away from her.


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## Chaparral

I suspected this with your short posts. You REALLY need to read MMSL to understand your wife's disrespect. It could really turn your life around.


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## keko

Noah do you not respect yourself? A wife or anyone for that matter that's says "bring up my cheating one more time and were finished" would no longer be my wife and out of my life the next second.

If you let yourself be disrespected like this then no wonder she's the dominant one and cheats on you.

Forget buying another VAR, just kick her out and divorce her.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Noah2150

You guys are right, I get my results from the STD test tomorrow after that I am meeting with the first of 3 lawyers. I feel disrespected used and abused. I do feel like she is going to keep it up with this OM if I let her.


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## tom67

Noah2150 said:


> You guys are right, I get my results from the STD test tomorrow after that I am meeting with the first of 3 lawyers. I feel disrespected used and abused. I do feel like she is going to keep it up with this OM if I let her.


If she had a little remorse I would say try r your wife has zero. Go to the wharehouse where hr works and tell him she's all yours I'm done with her and walk out.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## warlock07

> She says if I have forgiven her and bring up the cheating one more time then we are finished.


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## walkonmars

Noah2150 said:


> You guys are right, I get my results from the STD test tomorrow after that I am meeting with the first of 3 lawyers. I feel disrespected used and abused. I do feel like she is going to keep it up with this OM if I let her.


This is the only way she _MIGHT_ come around. The shock of you actually doing something will shake her up. She might give him up if she realizes you're gone if she doesn't. Otherwise there's no question that she'll continue - 

Let the gf of the OM know what's going on. She has the right to know what kind of pond-scum she chose for the father of her child.


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## Shaggy

Tell your wife, you've chosen to forgive her cheating, you didn't ever say you would forget it or rugsweep it.

What you have given her is chance to stop cheating and to a chance to again be in the marriage.

You avent given her a hall pass, and you most certainly aren't accepting of her cheating.

I think you'll find that she's still hooking up sonehow at work, perhaps lunch time in the backroom or his car.

Some posters have done senen tests on their wife's panties. I'm assuming your nit have sex with her, or more important she isn't into sex with you. So any semen found wont be from you.


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## jim123

Noah2150 said:


> You guys are right, I get my results from the STD test tomorrow after that I am meeting with the first of 3 lawyers. I feel disrespected used and abused. I do feel like she is going to keep it up with this OM if I let her.


Noah, Count on her to keep up with the OM. You do not need a VAR. Just tell her to leave and file the D. The only chance you have is if you do that. If she leaves then that would have happened anyway.

You also need to do the 180. Do not have any contact with her and start moving on. Take the time to fix yourself. Make a decision on strenght. This is the only way it will work.


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## lionsguy22

Noah2150 said:


> You guys are right, I get my results from the STD test tomorrow after that I am meeting with the first of 3 lawyers. I feel disrespected used and abused. I do feel like she is going to keep it up with this OM if I let her.


At a boy Noah!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Noah2150

Wow, I think she did it again this evening. Calls me and says she is going to the sports bar with a few female coworkers. At 5:10 PM says she is out the door to go there and at around 6:45 pm says she is still there and even did a check in status on FB at the same time. I do think she went there even though she only text me and never called. She says I just wanted to text you just to let you know what I am doing. Manwhile she comes home and has on her sexy red lace pantys She says I know you don't believe I was at the bar. I think she may have been there but met up with this guy prior. Wow, what a stranger my wife has beecome.


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## Noah2150

BTW I am posting this to ask for help on my divorce proceedings to show she was in the wrong and not me as many men are the wrongdoers. I live n Texas.


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## keko

She's rubbing it all over your face but don't lose your temper. Stay the course until everything is settled and you'll have the final laugh.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## keko

Noah2150 said:


> BTW I am posting this to ask for help on my divorce proceedings to show she was in the wrong and not me as many men are the wrongdoers. I live n Texas.


Her affair might get you better settlement in Texas. Make sure to ask the lawyers you'll be visiting.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## sandc

Do NOT have sex with her. Semen test those red panties.


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## keko

He doesn't need to test them. He already knows she's still cheating so what's there to prove? If she had creampie or not?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## happyman64

> She says if I have forgiven her and bring up the cheating one more time then we are finished. @ the guy, it's hard but I am really trying to be tough, most of you may have already been able to tell, that my wife really has always been the dominate one in our relationship. I really am trying to toughen up/



Noah

This is how you toughen up.

Scenario 1.

Honey, please come home tonight. We need to talk. Be home at 6PM.

And as soon as she walks in the door you sit her down infront of the computer and you click this link.



HTML:


http://www.divorcewriter.com/Texas.asp

Fill out the online form together. Let her know if she does not do it with you you will start the D without her. She still has the cooling off period to come to her senses.

or

Scenario 2.

Honey, you go to one more ladies night, lock your cell, delete sent or received message, or lie to me one more time you will fill out these forms.

Hand her the forms from here .



HTML:


http://www.ramosfamilylaw.com/HoustonDivorce/FreeForms/Agreed_Temporary_Order_in_Family_Matters.pdf

Then start filling out the form together.

That is how you get tough. You separate yourself from her infidelity. You move ahead without her.

I understand you love your wife. That woman you married is gone. There is an alien controlling her body now. That alien does not love you, respect you or want the marriage.

So get tough and exorcise the demon right out of her. Do it today.

No more crying Noah. No more missing work or losing sleep. Move forward with your life without her. The sooner you do it the quicker she might notice you are leaving her.

You also should stop with the FB messages to the POSOM's GF and get your butt in the car and go see her. Tell her what her BF has beeen up to with your wife.

And since you called your parents why don't you call her parents and tell them what "beatiful" acts of kindness their darling daughter has been showing posom at work.

That is how you get tough.

Right now you have welcome on your back and she is wiping her feet all over your back everytime she comes home.

And Noah, the next time your wife tells you if you ever mention the cheating to her ever again, go in the garage, get a big piece of plywood and paint "My wife is a cheater" on it.

Put the sign on the front lawn. 

That is how you embarass a cheater.

Hell, take the sign and stand on the corner at the entrance to her job.

I guarantee that will get her attention. And the POSOM's as well.

Stand up for yourself. They are her sins, not yours. So make her accountable for her actions and show her some consequences.

And leave her a message at work with a small piece of the audio recording show she knows you are not stupid, have a copy and will not be ****@d with.

Now get to it. Because if you do not you will never get her back because she will never respect you.

Sorry but it is true.

HM64


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## WyshIknew

happyman64 said:


> Noah
> 
> This is how you toughen up.
> 
> Scenario 1.
> 
> Honey, please come home tonight. We need to talk. Be home at 6PM.
> 
> And as soon as she walks in the door you sit her down infront of the computer and you click this link.
> 
> 
> 
> HTML:
> 
> 
> http://www.divorcewriter.com/Texas.asp
> 
> Fill out the online form together. Let her know if she does not do it with you you will start the D without her. She still has the cooling off period to come to her senses.
> 
> or
> 
> Scenario 2.
> 
> Honey, you go to one more ladies night, lock your cell, delete sent or received message, or lie to me one more time you will fill out these forms.
> 
> Hand her the forms from here .
> 
> 
> 
> HTML:
> 
> 
> http://www.ramosfamilylaw.com/HoustonDivorce/FreeForms/Agreed_Temporary_Order_in_Family_Matters.pdf
> 
> Then start filling out the form together.
> 
> That is how you get tough. You separate yourself from her infidelity. You move ahead without her.
> 
> I understand you love your wife. That woman you married is gone. There is an alien controlling her body now. That alien does not love you, respect you or want the marriage.
> 
> So get tough and exorcise the demon right out of her. Do it today.
> 
> No more crying Noah. No more missing work or losing sleep. Move forward with your life without her. The sooner you do it the quicker she might notice you are leaving her.
> 
> You also should stop with the FB messages to the POSOM's GF and get your butt in the car and go see her. Tell her what her BF has beeen up to with your wife.
> 
> And since you called your parents why don't you call her parents and tell them what "beatiful" acts of kindness their darling daughter has been showing posom at work.
> 
> That is how you get tough.
> 
> Right now you have welcome on your back and she is wiping her feet all over your back everytime she comes home.
> 
> And Noah, the next time your wife tells you if you ever mention the cheating to her ever again, go in the garage, get a big piece of plywood and paint "My wife is a cheater" on it.
> 
> Put the sign on the front lawn.
> 
> That is how you embarass a cheater.
> 
> Hell, take the sign and stand on the corner at the entrance to her job.
> 
> I guarantee that will get her attention. And the POSOM's as well.
> 
> Stand up for yourself. They are her sins, not yours. So make her accountable for her actions and show her some consequences.
> 
> And leave her a message at work with a small piece of the audio recording show she knows you are not stupid, have a copy and will not be ****@d with.
> 
> Now get to it. Because if you do not you will never get her back because she will never respect you.
> 
> Sorry but it is true.
> 
> HM64


Do all this. No more excuses or buts just do it.
Otherwise you have a likelihood of two scenarios.

1. You spend the rest of your life being miserable and trodden on by this harpy.

2. She eventually finds someone available and she leaves.

How often does she wear the red lace panties for you????


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## Noah2150

She never wear those pantys for me. Up again and can't sleep and I realize this marriage is over. I think she has feelings for this gouy as well.


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## Chaparral

Go to this link

The Healing Heart: The 180

If your up see if you can get Texas's divorce packet online and download it.

Go get a set of door locks ang change the locks the next ime she is "late " after work. Don't be cruel though, put her afew things in a garbage bag and set them outside her door.


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## happyman64

Noah2150 said:


> She never wear those pantys for me. Up again and can't sleep and I realize this marriage is over. I think she has feelings for this gouy as well.


She is in the fog Noah.

You need to shake up her world buddy.

Now!!!


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## SomedayDig

Noah2150 said:


> She never wear those pantys for me. Up again and can't sleep and I realize this marriage is over. I think she has feelings for this gouy as well.


Detach Noah. Detach.

You're less than a week out from Dday...kinda...and you _allowed_ her to basically do a GNO?!??!! What is wrong with you, man?! She's out catting around, you catch it on VAR, and she tells YOU she's going out for drinks with the girls?!!

Dude, I would call troll on you so bad right now but I can't. You're simply an example of what every BS should NOT be. 

Unfortunately, you're in for a ton more pain the more you try to keep your head in the sand.


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## OldWolf57

Noah, the minute she said if you mentioned it again you are finished, she TOLD YOU she has No respect for you.

So yes this is a done deal.
What you do is tell her EXACTLY what you was planning before talking to your parents.
THEN tell her she's right. YOU TWO ARE FINISHED !!!
Tell her you just realized she is NOT worth losing your freedom over.

Then help her pack.


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## OldWolf57

Now this may seem like bad advice to some Noah, but this woman is so sure she has you beat down, that she can do and say anything and you will take it.

What you need to do, is stop post and running, and give more details.
These ppl are experienced VETS !!! Let them walk you thru this.
Thy have felt the same things you do now, so lean on them heavily !!!!

I ALMOST wish I could change places with you for this. This is the type of EVIL person that gets my juices running.
But since you are not as EVIL as me, PLEASE let the VETS help you.


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## Shaggy

Grab those panties and get them tested for semen before she washes them. 

BTW cheating wives DO NOT go out for fun drinks and girls nights out when they are trying to R.

So with the red panties and the obvious lie about where she went, she's flaunting her cheating right in front of you and daring you to call her on it.


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## mahike

Noah2150 said:


> She never wear those pantys for me. Up again and can't sleep and I realize this marriage is over. I think she has feelings for this gouy as well.


Noah you need to take care of yourself and sleep is part of it. try exercise and if that does not work see your Dr about some help with that. I was a walking zoombie the first several months.

After you decide on the lawyer you are going to use. Hand her the business card and let her know that you have started the D. This will either flip a switch and she is going to beg to R or she will run the other way.

at least you will know were things really stand.


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## tom67

Shaggy said:


> Grab those panties and get them tested for semen before she washes them.
> 
> BTW cheating wives DO NOT go out for fun drinks and girls nights out when they are trying to R.
> 
> So with the red panties and the obvious lie about where she went, she's flaunting her cheating right in front of you and daring you to call her on it.


Even more of a reason to contact the om gf today after you meet with the attorneys!


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## Lordhavok

Sorry noah, looks like your pissing in the wind here. She has no respect for you and your wasting your time with her. You dont want to always wonder what she's doing and who with do you? You know she's a cheater and she's not remorsefull about it. Cut your losses and get out now, a few years from now this will all just be a bad memory. She's walking all over you man, she'll do it again, your just prolonging the agony.


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## sandc

Noah,
You know, the alternative is you could just accept an open marriage. You get to wait at home for her while she goes out and has sex with whomever she pleases. They call it a hotwife lifestyle. There are guys out there that love this sort of life. They have forums advising men how to get into that lifestyle. They BRAG about how many men their wives have slept with. You could learn to love it too.

I mean, you know, since you don't really want to lay down the law to her or anything you might as well try to enjoy what she's doing...

Right?

(It is my sincere hope this posting pisses you off. You need to be pissed off.)


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## slater

Texas is a "fault" state, but rarely do people file using it. I have a buddy I consulted for my issue, he is a family law judge in another county in Texas, so this is straight from the top. They see it all- all the time. Nothing impresses or moves them. My buddy is ULTRA conservative, ultra pro-family. He hates cheaters, or anyone that puts themselves before the kids. Even in his court, at most you will get split custody and maybe 55% of the assets. That's if you prove adultery!! So most don't go that route as it adds a lot to the cost.

Just get her to agree to 50/50 kids and $$$ and move on.

Regarding her going out- my WW wouldn't dream of asking to go out with the girls. Plus she knows I wouldn't allow it. That's right- I have rules that she folllows now. Not that she has to- but she knows what the alternative is and doesn't want that!

Part of this is your fault (not the cheating, but the aftermath behavior). You have to treat cheaters like children. Children function best when they know the rules. They like to know what they can and can't do. You have failed to make it clear to your wife what is acceptable. By that, I mean you have not made certain actions UNACCEPTABLE. ie, you do x, and we're done. And MEAN IT!


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## sandc

You actually do have to be willing to lose your marriage in order to save it. If she doesn't agree to any of your demands, then the marriage is lost anyway.


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## tom67

sandc said:


> You actually do have to be willing to lose your marriage in order to save it. If she doesn't agree to any of your demands, then the marriage is lost anyway.


I hope he is seeing the lawyers like he said and finds his huevos today he deserves better.


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## sandc

tom67 said:


> I hope he is seeing the lawyers like he said and finds his huevos today he deserves better.


I wish we could take the REALITY BAT and smash the RATIONALIZATION HAMSTER to itty bitty mushy bits.


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## crossbar

Dude, she's so in the fog right now. It's actually sad. You need to broach the subject of divorce. And once she sits down and starts working everything reality is going to smack her in the back of the head.

She'll have financial problems because she won't have your full paycheck to work with. If I were you, I would go for full custody of the kids and have her realize that she might lose her kids over this. If you have joint custody, she won't get as much child support as if she has full custody. She'll only be a part time mom because of joint custody and won't be able to see her kids whenever she wants. She'll lose her live in babysitter (you) and girls night out won't be as frequent.... She'll have to worry about living paycheck to paycheck. She'll have to get her own health insurance, dental and vision. The D Bag won't give up his wife and kids for her......

Goodbye fantasy! Welcome to reality!


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## CleanJerkSnatch

Show her a side of you that is strong, moved on, independent with no need of her, tell her she can wait for the papers and serve her.

She thinks you are a wimp, that you wont leave her, and that is why she is not changing. She even bluffed you, if she hears about the cheating one more time she will divorce you, well just don't talk to her period. Call her bluff, since she also thinks you will not divorce her, print out the papers and leave a half filled copy on the breakfast table or on your work table. 

Get this moving, you aren't a doormat and you wont tolerate the mushroom treatment whatsoever. Tell her the worse she can do to you is hurt your ego but the worst she is doing to others is ruining lives a families.


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## tom67

Buy another var for your protection because if you do stand up to her tonight she will not like not having her way for the first time.


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## CleanJerkSnatch

Put the var recording as your phone ringtone or a certain part of it....


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## OldWolf57

THIS IS NO FOG !!! This is a selfish woman bent on having her way.

Noah, normally I say don't leave your house, but she has you too beat down for it to be healthy around her. So if you can find the strength, ask her to move out. The setting is just too toxic with her around you.


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## Noah2150

My results from the STD tests came back negative for everything. She still says yes she lied about cheating but she swears he wore a condom. The past two days she has been calling me constantly almost every hour. I don't say much as she does most of the talking. Also, it hit that there is an hourly motel pretty close to her job, it's possible this is the place they have been hooking up. I am taking it one day at a time right now. I am still meeting with lawyers at the moment.


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## tom67

Any luck on contacting the omgf? Did she get an STD test? Is she calling you to check up where you are at? anyway what is it that you want Noah take care bro and consider your options and forget what she says and observe her ACTIONS.


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## Shaggy

Have you thought about staking out the motel or her work and see who she's going out with?

Do is she claiming she's stopped cheating and wants to become your wife again?

If so do you have hs full name and details?


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## sandc

Don't answer every time she calls.


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## tom67

sandc said:


> Don't answer every time she calls.


Good point let her wonder wtf you are doing.


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## Louise7

Noah2150 said:


> My results from the STD tests came back negative for everything. She still says yes she lied about cheating but she swears he wore a condom. The past two days she has been calling me constantly almost every hour. I don't say much as she does most of the talking. Also, it hit that there is an hourly motel pretty close to her job, it's possible this is the place they have been hooking up. I am taking it one day at a time right now. I am still meeting with lawyers at the moment.


Really pleased your tests are negative. Why is she calling you? What does she say? 

As for the motel, well, maybe they are meeting there. So, who pays for this? Is there a receipt in her financial papers/purse that might confirm it? A lot of what I knew about my ex came from his bank statements. I just throw that out incase it's worth looking into. I am pleased you are talking to lawyers and hope they are spelling out your options. Most of all, I hope you are doing okay Noah. I think you are doing really well to do half of what you have.

My best to you.


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## sandc

Oh, and please get retested in 6 months. Not sure if you said that already or not. Some STD's take months to appear.


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## CleanJerkSnatch

Stop answering her calls. Do your own thing, she can text you, if anything is needed for the children take care of it, etc.


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## OldWolf57

Noah, plz let us know you are OK.


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## the guy

Dude are you OK?


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## WyshIknew

Doesn't look good, last activity was 12th December.

I know it's his life and none of my business but I do like to hear that someone has successfully reconciled with maximum karma to the AP or that they have successfully divorced and are moving on with their lives.


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## sandc

Ping....


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