# Silent Treatment...beginning of the end?



## Devlin (May 16, 2012)

Hi! I'm brand new here and I'm so glad I found this forum. I really need to talk and I don't have anyone to talk too, and hopefully I can be here for others who need the same support. 

Anyway, I'm 35, married to my husband for 13 years, and have three children, 14, 11, 9. 

Lots and lots of history I can get into, but I'll keep a very long story a little bit shorter and just talk about what's going on now. Over a month ago, I was sick and trying to take a nap in our bedroom before I went back to work, because I work a split. Husband comes in and decides to be 'affectionate'. I am so not in the mood, either for sex or to be bothered. I told him this. He did not stop, just moved his hands. We've had this fight about 700 times before. If he wants something, it doesn't matter to him if I'm tired or sick. He wants it NOW and for me to refuse is extremely upsetting to him. Well, to have him do this while I was sick was upsetting to me, and I lost my temper. 

Not a big huge rant, I can't even remember what I said, but I'm pretty sure it was along the lines of get the hell off of me, stop being a jerk, and let me sleep. Not the nicest behavior on my part, but not the nicest behavior on his part either. 

Sounds like a minor incident? I thought so too. I was mad at the time, but it wasn't anything I was going to string out or have a big fight about.

He hasn't spoken to me since. Today is day 35. 

This is not the first time he's pulled the silent treatment. He does this every few months, sometimes every few weeks, if he gets mad at me. We went to marriage counseling a couple of times and once he agreed that he would limit his silent treatment to 48 hours, during which I would leave him alone and allow him to be upset. At the end of the 48 hours he is supposed to either talk things out with me or let it go. He's pretty much never stuck to that. His record before this was eleven days of not speaking to me. 

This is how it always goes. It gets to a point where I can't stand it anymore and I either apologize if I don't feel like I should or I just confront him so we can get it out. Then we have a big, horrible fight where he denies all responsibility for everything and twists every single thing I say or do even for years back. I'm not blameless in these; when I lose my temper I tend to say a lot of things that I regret. I do try to control this and also to acknowledge my part in whatever the situation is and apologize. The thing is he'll never do that. He will always say that it was 100% my fault. Sometimes I force him to apologize, usually by feeding him a word by word statement that he will deny having made later. So obviously, this cycle isn't working for either of us.

So this time, I could not bring myself to do it. I am so tired of this. So I didn't confront him. I waited to see when he would get sick of this and either confront me or let it go. He's never going to let it go. He's been acting as if he hates me, either giving me loathing looks or refusing to look at me at all. He only speaks to me when absolutely necessary; won't even respond if I say hello or goodbye. He makes disparaging remarks about me to the kids, saying 'oh look, Mom's doing nothing again, etc' (between my split shifts at work). 

I did try to talk to him finally a few days ago. His only response was that I acted crazy and like 'Britney Spears' and I owed him an apology. That really hurt. He knows how sensitive I am about being called crazy; I was recently diagnosed with severe depression and have been taking medication and going to therapy regularly.

So yesterday I'd had enough. I sat down and wrote him a letter. I tried so hard to make it as polite as I could though I wasn't going to let up on how I felt. I told him I didn't feel like I owed him an apology in the first place; he knew I was sick and I asked him to stop. I also said how hurt I was that he was content to let this go on and on. I finished the letter by telling him I knew he loved me but I couldn't go through this cycle anymore, and if he wanted it to end he'd either let this go or agree to go back to therapy, either with me or by himself.

So I really thought that he would respond to this. He hasn't. He is still ignoring, still treating me as if he hates me. I basically asked him in my letter if he loved me enough to try and fix this and now I guess I have my answer. 

I don't know what to do. Do we just go on like this forever? How can a person stop loving another person so fast? How can he hurt me like this and just let it continue? If this was the first time, or it was a rarity, I'd just bite the bullet and apologize. It's not a rarity. It happens over and over and over and I can't do it anymore. My therapist said I have to break the cycle and do something different and I tried and now I don't know what to do anymore. How can I fix our marriage if I'm the only one working on it?


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

You denying him sex is making him feel rejected.
Him ignoring you is making you feel invalidated.

SOmething has to give. 

You were wrong to talk to him in that manner (get the hell off of me) and he is wrong to be on day 35 of the silent treatment (that is abusive, IMO).

My ex and I had a good sex life BUT, he was a master sulkner/ignorer. It gets reallllllllllllly old after a time. It sounds like you've gone to counselling over it and the problem persists. Eventually I left. People who haven't been in a situation where their partner ignores them for days/weeks on end cannot fathom what it's like. It's emotional abuse.

I don't envy you.

You need to talk to him. It takes more energy to ignore someone than to talk to them.

Your marriage is not good/healthy.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Oh and that's just it: you CAN'T fix a marriage alone. It takes two. SO either he is willing to do it with you or he isn't. He sounds like a passive-agressive controlling child.

Oh and..... your therapist is right--about doing something different. Everything you have done hasn't worked so what does that tell you?

The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result...

Just saying


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## lamaga (May 8, 2012)

The silent treatment is something really immature people do.

You guys have more problems than can be solved on an internet chat board. Counseling, NOW.


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## Browncoat (Mar 25, 2012)

You can not go on like this forever. Communication is the life's blood of a marriage.

You have every right to put up reasonable boundaries in the marriage (like letting you sleep when you are exhausted and not forcing his way onto you). He needs to respect those boundaries... and well frankly grow up a bit. He seems like he's throwing an adult temper tantrum if he doesn't get his way.

Tell him you two need to go to counselling. If he refuses, well then go to IC for your own sanity... though given the situation it really is ideal if you both got IC (and some couples therapy together) from the same counselor.


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## Devlin (May 16, 2012)

Lamaga, I agree but he refuses to go back to counseling. I am still seeing my therapist and I'm not going to stop. I asked him in my letter to go to a counselor with me or find his own if he didn't feel comfortable with that. He wouldn't even answer me, which I guess is a reply in itself.

I guess I'd be willing to apologize again but I feel so hurt by his remarks and hateful attitude and to have that all ignored and swept under the rug again...I don't know how I'd get past that resentment. At least I see my therapist again today so hopefully he'll have some feedback on how to proceed from here.


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## Browncoat (Mar 25, 2012)

If he continues to refuse you may need to get his attention.

One way is to take some time to visit family for say a week, leaving him to take care of the kids (assuming he's responsible). Tell him you need time away, and you hope when you get back he will be in more of a mood to talk.

I wish there was a magic formula, and I'm not even sure if my advice is the best... just seems that you need to get him to snap out of it and start talking.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Devlin, dude (rather, dudette). I feel for you.

You apologizing isn't going to change anything or make it better. He is probably SO used to you saying Sorry. And where does it get you? Nowhere, that's where. 

Someone who loves you would not treat you this way. They would work together with you to resolve the problem.

His refusal to go to counselling or owrk on things with you and talk to you send a loud and clear message: he's not into it. That's it.

So what you need to decide is whether you want to tolerate a marriage where this is the norm/fixture. If so, expect more fo the same. If not, at least you get a chance of not living like this. 

Oh and you mention having children. NO DOUBT they pick on on this. What do they say? Does he stonewall them too? How is your hub's relationship with his family/friends/work? Does he do this to everyone or just you? 

Has he been married before you? 

I personally think that people who do this have character issues/disorders. Uptown always brings up BPD. And while I wouldn't discount that AT ALL, I think it's just straight up emotional abuse.


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## lamaga (May 8, 2012)

I'm so glad you are going to IC! You will know how to proceed when you are ready. If he doesn't want to catch the GrownUp train, then you'll deal with that when you are ready. Good luck!


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Browncoat said:


> I wish there was a magic formula, and I'm not even sure if my advice is the best... just seems that you need to get him to snap out of it and start talking.


But that's just it. She cannot "get him" to/make him do anything. He has a choice and his choice is to blank her repeatedly/habitually.

If you have not lived this, count your lucky stars but these people..they don't bend. At all. It's their way or no way. He will only begin talking to her when he wants to. It will have nothing to with her at all. They lack empathy.


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## Browncoat (Mar 25, 2012)

Jellybeans said:


> But that's just it. She cannot "get him" to/make him do anything. He has a choice and his choice is to blank her repeatedly/habitually.
> 
> If you have not lived this, count your lucky stars but these people..they don't bend. At all. It's their way or no way. He will only begin talking to her when he wants to. It will have nothing to with her at all. They lack empathy.


I am blessed to not have lived this out. You are also completely right that she can't make him do jack. Still just hoping the shock and change from such a trip might give him time to reconsider things. Sounds like you would know more than I though.

That's just what I would do in a similar situation.


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## Devlin (May 16, 2012)

Thank you, Jellybeans.

The kids absolutely pick up on this, and they hate it when he says things about me. In fact, the kids are often resentful of him. They say things like "Dad is always mean to us, he just wants us to do chores, he's always mean to you" and I feel terrible when they say this, for both them and him. Sometimes it's justified, he can be very insensitive to their feelings or unrealistic about what to expect from them. At other times I know it's more the contrast between the two of us. I'm the snuggly loving one who can't stand to see them cry, where as he is the one who will yell. A few years he pointed out to me and I had to admit the truth of it, that I played bad cop good cop with him when it came to the kids. I have since then tried to back him up as long as he is not being completely unreasonable, and if he is I try to take him aside and talk about it privately.

I guess it bothers me more than anything that when I know I'm wrong, I try to acknowledge it and improve it and all I hear from him is that he's never wrong, and he does the same things over and over. It's like pounding my head into a brick wall.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

I am not discounting your suggestion at all, Browncoat. She could totally try it. But it's not likely to change anything and that is the truth.  People who do this habitually ... nothing will make it change unless THEY want to change, whether she leaves for a day/week/ or not. 

It's a living hell. It's truly the only way to describe it. I just feel for her because she has kids and they are growing up prob thinking that is a normal family dynamic or may even repeat it themselves down the line or think they aren't good enough for their dad to speak to them. Sad.


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## lamaga (May 8, 2012)

Awww, Dev. You just described my mother's entire life.

I'm so glad you are going to counseling. You cannot fix him. You cannot. The only person you can change is yourself.

I am so very sorry. Please do keep posting here and let us know how it's going.


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

I honestly couldn't be with someone who displayed this behavior. So childish. NOT a husband, imo.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Devlin said:


> Thank you, Jellybeans.
> 
> The kids absolutely pick up on this, and they hate it when he says things about me. In fact, the kids are often resentful of him. They say things like "Dad is always mean to us, he just wants us to do chores, he's always mean to you" .




I'm sorry. 

Was your husband always this way? When did the stonewalling start? What is his relationship like with his parents? Does he blank other people in his life (employees/colleagues/friends)? Does he have a lot of friends? Are his moods very up and down? What kind of nasty things does he say to you? And does it do it at home or in public, too?



Devlin said:


> I guess it bothers me more than anything that when I know I'm wrong, I try to acknowledge it and improve it and all I hear from him is that he's never wrong, and he does the same things over and over. It's like pounding my head into a brick wall.


Well that means you are a healthy person. If you can admit to being wrong and acknowledge it--that is a sign of a person with accountability and healthy adult. Him never admitting fault/flaws says a lot about his character.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

lamaga said:


> Awww, Dev. You just described my mother's entire life.


Was your father a stonewaller? Are they still married? Does he still do it?


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## Devlin (May 16, 2012)

I can't tell you how much it means to me just that you all are listening and replying. I haven't had anyone to talk to in so long. My mom is supposed to be moving in with us next month (she and hubs actually get along great) and when I told her some of the issues she said she thought maybe she shouldn't move in and I almost lost my mind. First of all she needs a place to live as she's retiring, and secondly we live a few hours away from all family and I don't have anyone to turn to for support when I don't have my husband. I really need her and I don't know what I'll do if she doesn't come. So I stopped talking to her about it. 

To answer your question Jellybean, my husband had always shut down when it's been something he didn't want to hear, but it wasn't until about 2005/2006 that the silent treatments (which he has always done) started happening much more frequently and over the slightest thing. Once it was because I returned a cell phone he found to the owner. I mean, hello, why the hell would we keep someone else's cell phone? 

We'd had a really bad time before in 2005; things had blown up with his ex-wife and his daughter, so badly that he basically lost his daughter over it and I know how devastating that was for him. It was bad for me too; I raised her for seven years of her life and I loved her too, but I know it wasn't the same for me as it was for him. 

So I know he's been through a lot with women, on top of what his ex did to him and his relationship with his daughter she'd also cheated on him with a man she'd actually convinced him to move into their home. So I know that's why he doesn't have a lot of trust in me and hates it when I have male friends (I don't have male friends I go out to lunch with or anything but I've been buying baby stuff for a co-worker whose about to have a baby and I gave him some of our older stuff that we didn't need and this really pisses my husband off.) 

I understand these issues he has and why. What I don't understand is why he has to take them out on me. I didn't do anything to deserve this. I am not perfect. I have an awful temper, part of the reason why I started therapy. I can be irresponsible. But it doesn't mean that I deserve this and I know that. 

I should state he's not always like this, or I never would have married him in the first place. We have so much fun together (when he's talking to me) and I make him laugh, which is nice after all these years together, that he still thinks I'm funny and not obnoxious. We had all these plans for our future. 

I just don't know that I can do this anymore. The times that our marriage is great just get shorter and shorter, and the times we're fighting or not talking at all get longer and longer. If it wasn't for the kids, I'd have left already, as much as I love him. 

It's because of them that I'm afraid to go. I know it's not good for the kids to see this between us, but I know how it will be if I leave. He will hate me and he will not hesitate to try to pull them between us. I saw him do it with his daughter. His ex-wife was a horrible person and an terrible mother, but that was still his daughter's mother. This didn't matter to him. Every day he told her (we had custody) what an awful person her mother was. He told her way more than was ever appropriate. I told him this repeatedly. Therapists told him this. He would not stop and his daughter ended up with so many issues between the way they both were with her. I am very afraid to have this happen with our three children. 

You know what I hope more than anything? That I'm just being an oversensitive drama queen. I hope I lay this out for my therapist today and he tells me I'm full of ****, to stop being melodramatic and exaggerating and to apologize and get this over with.

I'm really afraid that that is not what he's going to say and I will be at a complete loss of what to do next.


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## lamaga (May 8, 2012)

Dev, honey, I'm so glad you are here. And I'm glad your mom is coming.

Now...I don't want to get too personal, but is your husband perhaps feeling sexually deprived? That sounds like a very likely explanation for this behavior.

Or, he's just an a**. But I want you to think about the sexual thing -- no need to respond, but you need to give it some thought.

And please do keep posting! It's a small group here and a safe place.


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## Devlin (May 16, 2012)

It's ok Lamaga, I've already gotten pretty personal here and I know those issues can affect a marriage a lot.

There was a point a few years ago where we barely had sex. He told me this really bothered him, so I amped up our sex life. It's very one sided however and I've been pretty blunt about how I feel about that, so I probably hurt him and his pride in that regard. However up until this last fight, our sex life was much better.

He's probably feeling pretty deprived after thirty five days of this utter bull. Since he's not talking to me we're definitely not hitting the mattress. I suppose it's very petty of me to hope he has the blue balls of a lifetime.


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## lamaga (May 8, 2012)

LOL. Nope. I think that's completely normal 

(I kind of hope so, too.)


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

So he is the one who before did want to have sex with you? 

_You know what I hope more than anything? That I'm just being an oversensitive drama queen. I hope I lay this out for my therapist today and he tells me I'm full of ****, to stop being melodramatic and exaggerating and to apologize and get this over with._

You can wish and hope all you want. That isn't going to change anything. The only thing that will change something is both of you making an effort to stop the unhealthy behaviors. Not one of you.

Question: Did he stonewall his ex-wife and ignore her, too? 

That is pretty crappy that he was talking bad repeatedly to his daughter about her mother. To me, that says a lot about him.


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## SadSamIAm (Oct 29, 2010)

Hey Devlin, I can kind of relate to your story. 

When I get rejected time after time, I get grumpy. I will hear how she is too tired and then she stays up until 2am to watch some show. I will hear how we don't have enough privacy and then we are alone at home for 4 hours and she rejects me. All these rejections lead to me being grumpy. 

I know it doesn't help matters, but after being rejected a number of times, I get cold. I don't feel loved and I don't feel like loving. I know it is the wrong response, but it happens.

lamaga asked if maybe he was being sexually deprived. You said your sex life has gotten better, but you didn't really say how often you guys have sex. I can see my wife saying sex has gotten better, even if it has been 3 weeks since we were together.

How long was it between having sex when your husband tried to push you into having sex when you were trying to rest?

Another issue my wife and I have is that my wife needs a push sometimes. Because of her upbringing, feeling sexy doesn't really come naturally for her. At times I need to be pushy. To hold her when she is giving me body language that tells me not to hold her. Often she will come around. She will thank me for putting some pressure on her. She will thank me for understanding her in that way. 

Other times, she gets pissed off. We end up in a fight and if it has been a couple of weeks of rejection for me, I get pissed as well.

Just wondering if some of this same dynamic is in your relationship and might help explain your husband's behavior.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

SadSad--would you ignore your wife for 35 days & counting if she didn't put out when you wanted to? Also, would you do thsi habitually to your wife? Even if she wrote you a letter and apologized and tried to make amends?


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## SadSamIAm (Oct 29, 2010)

35 days is extreme, especially given that she has apologized.

But 20 years of being rejected 90% of the time is extreme as well. 

I have gotten to the point where in my head I have just said I am done. I have been the one to try and try and try again. I tell myself I am not going to try anymore.

I would like to hear her answers to my questions. Do they typically go a week or more without intimacy? Does she reject him and avoid him on a regular basis?

If she really wants to make amends, I would advise her to take action. Not writing a letter or speaking an apology. Actual Action! Ask him to come to bed early. Go to bed with lingerie on. Make him feel wanted and cared for. 

If there dynamic is anything like my marriage, her initiating and showing she wants me, makes all the difference in the world. I instantly go from grumpy and cold, to being communicative and happy and helping around the house.


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## waiwera (Sep 8, 2009)

Some people use the silent treatment as a cruel weapon. They deprive you of their time, conversation, love, hugs...everything. They cut you off... they do it to hurt you. The are angry people, very angry. Their anger scares them because they don't have the skills to communicate it properly... your man needs to learn HOW to express anger in an appropriate way.

I grew up in a house where my Mum would give the silent treatment for weeks. The rage and anger was clear for all to see...simmering just under the surface.

I've also had one friendship that went that way their first time we had a disagreement over something.

The friend I dropped like a hotcake. My mum... I love her and wanted her in my life.
My sister and I confronted her and simply told her we were not putting up with it anymore. She obviously didn't believe us because a few months later she got mad over something and blanked us. 

So we just got on with our lives. We didn't grovel and sweet talk her untill she was 'nice' again. We blanked her back. We went months with no contact. My poor old dad was beside himself and missed his daughters and grandchildren and was contacting us on the sly.

My mum took about 6 months to finally back down..i actually thought she would hang in forever.

We talked and new rules were set, if she blanked us she risks losing contact with us...she doesn't want that.
That was more than a decade ago and she hasn't done it since. Not sure if dad still gets the silent treatment...but that's his battle to fight...he has enabled her to be this way since they married when she was 20 years old....she's 70 now.

I know your situation is different...you live in the same house and he is your H not your mother but the problem is that kids are living this too. You choose to live with it...they don't get a choice.

People only treat you the way you allow them to. Once we refused to be hurt by her actions we took her power away and remember the silent treatment IS a power trip and very passive-aggressive.

I wish you and your children all the best with this...it's not a nice way to grow up.


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## lamaga (May 8, 2012)

So true, Sad Sam. I wish more women understood this.


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## waiwera (Sep 8, 2009)

SadSamIAm said:


> If she really wants to make amends, I would advise her to take action. Not writing a letter or speaking an apology. Actual Action! Ask him to come to bed early. Go to bed with lingerie on. Make him feel wanted and cared for.
> 
> If there dynamic is anything like my marriage, her initiating and showing she wants me, makes all the difference in the world. I instantly go from grumpy and cold, to being communicative and happy and helping around the house.


After 35 days of silent treatment... being blanked & ignored when she speaks to him. He glares at her and says horrible things to the kids but she should dress up in a sexy nighty for him and offer him a good time!

Are you serious??

Affection and conversation are listed as the top two needs for woman in the book 'His Needs Her needs'... he's treated her with contempt for the past month.

Can you even imagine what 35 days of being blanked by your 'loved one' in a angry hostile way might feel like? And of course this is just one of many times he has done this.
It's not a one off because she said no to sex, this is how he deals with his anger...no matter the subject.
This is how sulkers behave. They don't want to/know how to communicate. They want to be right and in control.

You sound very nice and in a normal relationship it probably would be a great plan...but not when you've been through a month of this.

It's gruesome!


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## SadSamIAm (Oct 29, 2010)

waiwera said:


> After 35 days of silent treatment... being blanked & ignored when she speaks to him. He glares at her and says horrible things to the kids but she should dress up in a sexy nighty for him and offer him a good time!
> 
> Are you serious??
> 
> ...



What I was trying to find out is how she was treating him in regards to his greatest need (I'm guessing, but for many men it is physical touch/sex). 

They both have needs. His needs are as important as her needs. Maybe to him, a few years of being rejected is equivalent to 35 days of silence. 

Giving the silent treatment isn't the best way of handling issues. Rejecting your spouse isn't the best way either.


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## waiwera (Sep 8, 2009)

Sam - i absolutely agree his needs are as important as hers. 

She said "no" to him when she was sick and tired and grabbing a quick snooze before going back to work. I don't think that is unreasonable...do you?
I am also interested to know if this is a contributor to his anger, if it happens often.... something has him very angry.

But they can't discuss the issue because he's sulking and glaring at her and not answering her when she asks him a question. Then once she has grovelled and he's speaking to her again he carpet sweeps...because he doesn't know HOW to communicate what's upsetting him or what needs aren't being met.... he just sulks.

Nothing can happen... doesn't matter the topic.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

waiwera said:


> After 35 days of silent treatment... being blanked & ignored when she speaks to him. He glares at her and says horrible things to the kids but she should dress up in a sexy nighty for him and offer him a good time!
> 
> Are you serious??
> 
> ...


BINGO!!!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Enginerd (May 24, 2011)

The silent treatment is a very bad deal. I think I've pulled it off for one day once. I like sex too much to carry on for 35 days :smthumbup:. Wow! It's so unhealthy for everyone. He needs to grow up.

You mentioned that you've been diagnosed with severe depression and are on meds. However you didn't talk about how this affects your relationship and if your husband might be feeling neglected as a result. When you say you were sick does this mean you were physically ill or were having some depression? The reason I ask is that your husband may be getting tired of dealing with your depression if it's been going on too long. I'm not defending his behavior at all, but there have been times when it was difficult for me to be the bigger person when my wife was depressed and not interested in affection. It gets old after a couple of years and one can become resentful. Again I'm not saying this all your fault but the silent treatment is basically a form of resentment and you need to figure out what he resents. Based on your description I'm gonna make a wild ass guess that his resentment is due to you being emotionally unavailable due to your severe depression. I suffer from mild depression and know that I'm not really all there when it happens. You have been diagnosed with severe depression which is serious stuff.

Peace


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## River1977 (Oct 25, 2010)

Browncoat said:


> One way is to take some time to visit family for say a week, leaving him to take care of the kids (assuming he's responsible). Tell him you need time away, and you hope when you get back he will be in more of a mood to talk.


This is what you should do, but please by no means should you leave your children. That could be twisted into accusing you of abandonment, and you don't want to take that chance. But, do take them and leave for a week or two. You said yourself you can't take this anymore. The opposite of not taking it anymore is sitting there taking it......and then there will be the next time.......and the next time.

It would make no sense to apologize to him. It never did in the past either. Nor would it make any sense to give him sex, as you were so ridiculously advised to do. That might make him feel better and break his silence, but it won't address the issue of his abuse, nor will it prevent him doing it the next time. And, as you already know, there certainly will be a next time......a next time for whatever his next nonsensical reason is going to be. 

You have taught him to control you in this manner by allowing yourself to be controlled. Had you never tolerated it in the first place by apologizing for not doing anything and always trying to smooth things over, then there would never have been a second and certainly not a third time. Stop the cycle now and show him you will not put up with this anymore and will not take the blame for it either.



Devlin said:


> If it wasn't for the kids, I'd have left already, as much as I love him.
> 
> It's because of them that I'm afraid to go. I know it's not good for the kids to see this between us, but I know how it will be if I leave. He will hate me and he will not hesitate to try to pull them between us. I saw him do it with his daughter. His ex-wife was a horrible person and an terrible mother, but that was still his daughter's mother. This didn't matter to him. Every day he told her (we had custody) what an awful person her mother was. He told her way more than was ever appropriate. I told him this repeatedly. Therapists told him this. He would not stop and his daughter ended up with so many issues between the way they both were with her. I am very afraid to have this happen with our three children.


You can never avoid him PASing (parent alienation syndrome) your children because he does it now while you are still with him. He does it right there in your face, so staying under his controlling abuse for the kids' sake is just an excuse not to face the facts. "For the kids" is the number 1 reason women give for staying in abusive relationships. It's not the number 2 reason because "I love him" is really #1, but at least half of abused women feel the kids is a better-sounding scapegoat. They fear the judgment of other people for admitting "I let him abuse me because I love him." They recognize it doesn't make sense. And, honestly, it doesn't. Yes, I am one who stands in judgment, and the kids being the excuse doesn't make sense either.

Additionally, you risk two more exceptions to your logic. The first is the example the dynamic between you and your husband is setting for your children. I don't know their genders, but your girls will growing up thinking they are supposed to be mistreated, or that it's okay to be mistreated by their husband. They are not in your skin and don't know how you feel or how it affects you. All they know is what you show them, what they see. And, they see a woman being mistreated by a man. That is what I saw growing up and as a result I had zero respect for my mother. I didn't understand why she took it from my dad all the time. I wanted her to speak up for herself. I wanted her to fight back (verbally when he attacked her verbally and physically when he attaced her physically). Finally, one day when I was 11, I took matters in my own hands. I could tell what was about to happen when he was backing her into a corner. I said to myself "If he hits her, I will hit him, and that's what I did. When he lunged for her, I jumped on his back and tried to strangle him, and then my two older sisters found the nerve to jump on him too.

My parents' dynamic, I am sure, is the reason I became completely intolerant of abuse of any kind. That, however, is not what is normal. It had the opposite affect on me that it normally has on girls. Domestic abuse is very often a learned behavior and a cycle that repeats through generations. Girls who see their mother abused are more likely to tolerate disrespect and mistreatment in whatever form (sexual, physical, verbal, emotional, and psychological abuse). 

If you have boys, they are also affected by growing up thinking it is okay to mistreat their woman. Your sons will be abusive to their girlfriend/wife and also their own children. This is what they live, so this is what they know. This is your example. It's what you and your husband are teaching your sons and daughters. Raising children neither begins nor stops at teaching them to say please, thank you, and keep their room clean. 

The second exception is the affect of what they hear and witness has on their young psyche. Dad mistreats them and mistreats mom. They're self esteem and sense of identity are being torn to shreds. What they see and hear between the two of you is you being treated as worthless. Children are not intuitive. Children are very selfish and only see their world in the way it relates to them. Therefore, if mom is worthless, then so am I.

I want to tell you I really apologize for anyone thinking and trying to convince you your husband is justified because you refused him sex. It sounds very much like your husband always blaming you and how you can never be right about anything. Abusers justify their actions by whatever means they can use to their advantage (you noticed that member confess in so many words that he abuses his wife and that's just the way he is). Not getting sex is no excuse to mistreat you. This is not your fault in any way at all. This is, in fact, even more deplorable that you weren't feeling well and he was being so extremely inconsiderate. I don't care how often you tell him no. There is no excuse at all. If he doesn't like ever being told no, then it's up to him to leave the marriage, refusing to tolerate ever being rejected. And, that is your decision to make right now - to refuse to tolerate your husband's power plays for controlling you.

Romeo's Bleeding


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## River1977 (Oct 25, 2010)

Enginerd said:


> The silent treatment is a very bad deal. I think I've pulled it off for one day once. I like sex too much to carry on for 35 days :smthumbup:. Wow! It's so unhealthy for everyone. He needs to grow up.
> 
> You mentioned that you've been diagnosed with severe depression and are on meds. However you didn't talk about how this affects your relationship and if your husband might be feeling neglected as a result. When you say you were sick does this mean you were physically ill or were having some depression? The reason I ask is that your husband may be getting tired of dealing with your depression if it's been going on too long. I'm not defending his behavior at all, but there have been times when it was difficult for me to be the bigger person when my wife was depressed and not interested in affection. It gets old after a couple of years and one can become resentful. Again I'm not saying this all your fault but the silent treatment is basically a form of resentment and you need to figure out what he resents. Based on your description I'm gonna make a wild ass guess that his resentment is due to you being emotionally unavailable due to your severe depression. I suffer from mild depression and know that I'm not really all there when it happens. You have been diagnosed with severe depression which is serious stuff.
> 
> Peace


Perhaps you were too excited to justify her husband's actions, but it appears you missed too many of the other points. Again, that might be because you zeroed in and focused on her (diagnosis) being the one at fault, despite your repeated disclaimer not to be blaming her.


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## waiwera (Sep 8, 2009)

River1977 - it really is difficult growing up in this kind of home isn't it.

I remember night after night of silent dinner times. I remember many christmas mornings spent feeling anxious and sad (Christmas was a common time for a row to happen and then the silent treatment) The air was ice cold and it used to give me tummy aches as a little child.

I used to get so mad at my Dad for not standing up to her...my sister and I were too little to confront her...he should have protected us from her behaviour but he didn't/doesn't have the...courage?? or communication skills either I guess.

I know it has affected me as an adult...for one threads like this send me into a flurry of posts!!


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

Dev: I'm living through nearly a calendar year of the silent treatment from my STBXW; along with separation and a grand divorce proceeding.

Your H needs to know that his participation in counseling is tantamount to saving your relationship. Don't issue ultimatums, but state it as matter-of-factly as you can. If he still refuses to communicate, you may have no other option left.

I'm so very sorry to see you having to go through this, but I feel that unless this is a shared effort on both of your parts, that the success of your relationship is greatly in peril. Best of luck to you!


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## River1977 (Oct 25, 2010)

waiwera said:


> River1977 - it really is difficult growing up in this kind of home isn't it.
> 
> I remember night after night of silent dinner times. I remember many christmas mornings spent feeling anxious and sad (Christmas was a common time for a row to happen and then the silent treatment) The air was ice cold and it used to give me tummy aches as a little child.
> 
> ...


Yes, Waiwera, it is very difficult. The sad part is - and something I neglected to mention to Devlin - children blame themselves. As part of their little selfish world, they think what is happening is somehow their fault, and any child psychiatrist will attest to that. I never spoke those words to my mother or anyone, but it's how I felt. When I was little, I always found myself trying to make her laugh and feel better after he had verbally beaten her to a pulp. So, I was either to blame and had to apologize to her, or I felt I had to make her feel better. Either way, I was responsible. As I grew older, I grew tired of him and his behavior, and I lost respect for her. By the time I was 11, I was just sick of it all and wanted it to stop.

It's really something that what I described happen was, as in your home, on Christmas day. And yes, I just wish I could make some of these women see the light and get some self esteem. I realize that women are sometimes the abuser, and I say the same things to the few men who complain of their wife's abuse. But most often and historically it is women being abused.


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## ShawnD (Apr 2, 2012)

that_girl said:


> I honestly couldn't be with someone who displayed this behavior. So childish. NOT a husband, imo.


(not related to this thread):
It's possible for people to be ok for years then suddenly turn crazy.
Human DNA contains a lot of inactive garbage and remnants from previous versions of humanity. Our DNA also contains remnants of viruses that insert themselves into the host's DNA. HIV is an example of one of these viruses that becomes part of your DNA. Sometimes the junk in our DNA is only junk because it's missing a key piece of the puzzle. There's always that one in a million chance that a retrovirus you are exposed to will add itself to your DNA and activate one of these "junk" genes. 
junk DNA Science in Society Blog
This hypothesis explains a lot about mental illness and why some people can just suddenly turn crazy.


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## 381917 (Dec 15, 2011)

I think you should have sex with him when he wants sex unless you are really sick. I just think that is what a wife (or husband, for the matter) should do. I don't think he should be giving you the silent treatment ever it's very immature. Did you turn him down for sex with regularity before the last time?


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## Devlin (May 16, 2012)

Wow, lots of feedback to catch up on!

Today actually ended up being pretty eventful. We had an appointment with our son and husband and I get into the car and he doesn't go to the school to pick him up. Instead, he drove us to a marriage counselor. I was happy that he took the initiative to do that, but pretty damn pissed off that he didn't tell me about it or get my feedback before doing so.

I think the session was productive. He gave his side first, and when I responded I didn't hold back. I said this wasn't really about the stupid fight anymore, it was about the silent treatment, the cold looks, the snide remarks. I think in a way this didn't turn out the way he thought it would, because the therapist didn't give me a pass on everything, but he very definitely told my husband ignoring me for 35 days was extremely destructive and to never do it again. We also talked about him blindsiding me with the appointment, etc. Not everything was resolved; we're going back next week but he's talking to me again. I'm glad and yet I still feel resentful, and I feel wary. We've been down this road before and when the therapists start going places he doesn't want to go, he quits. 

But maybe this time will be different; maybe it won't. I do know that I can't keep going through this same thing. It's one thing for him to get mad. I get mad too. I'm not always reasonable, but this silent treatment thing is way too much. I have felt so unloved and hopeless for over a month. When he didn't respond to my letter yesterday, I really thought it was over. This is not something I'm going to be able to get past overnight, but at least now I have some hope, which is more than I could have said yesterday.

SadSam, regarding the sex, the last time I'd had sex with him before 'the incident' had been about two days before. He'd said in the past that he wasn't happy with our sex life, so I made an effort to improve it and we'd been having sex about three times a week.

But even if we hadn't, I have to say I don't think anyone has the right to force sex on their spouse. I have been down the road before of 'giving in' when I didn't feel like it on a regular basis, and all that did was make me feel resentful and like sex is a chore. So now, if I say no, I mean no. I don't want him to feel rejected, but I also cannot bear to feel bullied or coerced into sex. 

And regarding my depression; I know this is something that he's had a hard time dealing with. (my illness was an actual physical illness by the way). I am much, much better now but there was at least a year where I hadn't even realized how bad off I was. I knew I was always in a bad mood and exploded easily, but I didn't realize how much I wasn't enjoying life until I got better and could feel the difference. I guess I understand how hard that was for him, but it was awful for me too, and I made the effort to get help. I just want him to make the same effort for me.

Anyway, I'm exhausted after this very long day, though there are still some more things I want to address. When I have a clearer head tomorrow I will post again, but for now, again thank you all for listening. It has very much helped me to look at this from some different angles.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Devlin, 

I think that when you did not respond the way you normally do to his silent treatment your husband back himself into a corner and did not know how to get out of it and save face. His unannounced trip to the MC is i suppose the way he finally found that he could live with.

It's a good sign that he chose a MC as the mediator he needed to end his silly/hurtful strike. 

There is a chance that your not giving in has led to a good place... hopefullly he will not try the silent treatment again if he thinks you will to kissing up to him in the future to end it.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Glad to hear he's talking to you again but, I'd be wary. Notice how he just randomly sprung an MC appt on you w/o even so much as talking about why he's giving you the silent treatment. Again, it's what he wants, when he wants. So my exH. 

You say this has become a pattern in your relationship. It's emotional abuse. Read up on it. 

What did he say about not even acknowledging the letter you wrote him?

No doubt his silence contributes to your depression. I remember when I still lived with my ex, I was anxious all the time. I felt out of my mind sometimes. And I hated coming home from work. When he would get home and open the door,I would have automatic panic attacks. I had no idea if he would be happy/upset. My sleep patterns were messed up and I had migraines that would last for months on end. It was a VERY visceral thing. I am so sorry you are going through this. 

Hard consequneces are really the only thing that is going to work. Because this dynamic has become the "norm" in your marriage.


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## SadSamIAm (Oct 29, 2010)

Devlin, I am glad to hear that your husband arranged the MC session. It means her really does care about you and your marriage.

Also, since you guys had just had sex two days before the episode, my 'diagnosis' doesn't apply to your situation. I guess I was thinking too much about my own circumstance and how I feel after being rejected for a long period of time.

Happy the counselor gave him grief about his 'silent treatment'. Sounds like you both have issues to work on and seeing that you are both wanting the MC, is a great sign. Lets hope he sticks with it.


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## Enginerd (May 24, 2011)

River1977 said:


> Perhaps you were too excited to justify her husband's actions, but it appears you missed too many of the other points. Again, that might be because you zeroed in and focused on her (diagnosis) being the one at fault, despite your repeated disclaimer not to be blaming her.


Perhaps you didn't read my post carefully. I read and understood the other points but I saw no evidence she was accepting any amount of blame(in her inital post). It always takes two to tango. I specifically said I'm not defending his behavior. He's being a child. I also did not blame her. I suggested her severe depression may have something to do with it. Its a chicken vs egg thing. Did she become depressed because he's emotionally stunted or is the husband fed up with her depression and doesn't have the tools to deal with it. Only she knows the truth, but if she understands his resentment she will understand how to fix her relationship.


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## Cosmos (May 4, 2012)

I can quite see that your H could feel rejected by the way you spoke to him - however, trying to have sex with someone who is obviously sick, refusing to take no for an answer then giving them the silent treatment for that length of time (over a _month_???) is not only emotionally abusive, but passive aggressive, too.

If you want to stay in this relationship, my only suggestion is more counselling.


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## waiwera (Sep 8, 2009)

Devlin- great to hear he got told 'what's what' by the counsellor, was he at all shocked to be told to never give the silent treatment again... 

Only problem i see is what will he do instead? Sulking is what he knows to do when he is mad. What will he do now...is he going to learn about anger management and communication (related to conflict)?

Weird him taking you to the MC without you knowing, does at least suggest he wants to make things right and it is very difficult to speak to someone when your sulking isn't! Can he not see how childish and ridiculous it looks. Sulkers always remind me of the 3 year old who folds his arms across his chest and holds his breathe...cause he's mad at you!


Just remember if you want this cycle to change you really do need to stand your ground. He can only do this to you if you allow him to.

You and your children deserve a better life than the one you've led for the past month!

((hugs))


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## River1977 (Oct 25, 2010)

Like EleGirl said, he'd backed himself into a corner and had to find a way to break the silence since you didn't do it as you always did. It's great how you stood your ground, and great for not taking the blame and apologizing for HIS actions. But, whatever he thought he had to do for whatever his reasons, bravo to him for doing it. And bravo to you for not buckling under his pressure. See what I meant by you teaching him to control you that way? You took a very big step in teaching him how to treat you better.

I especially like this......


Devlin said:


> But even if we hadn't, I have to say I don't think anyone has the right to force sex on their spouse. I have been down the road before of 'giving in' when I didn't feel like it on a regular basis, and all that did was make me feel resentful and like sex is a chore. So now, if I say no, I mean no. I don't want him to feel rejected, but I also cannot bear to feel bullied or coerced into sex.


and this too......


Devlin said:


> I guess I understand how hard that was for him, but it was awful for me too, and I made the effort to get help. I just want him to make the same effort for me.


My goodness, girl, you are so sensible.


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