# Husbands told to sleep on the couch



## Keke24 (Sep 2, 2016)

I first came across this concept on TV and now on TAM. When there is a disagreement between couples it is not out of the norm for the woman to ask the man to leave the bedroom and go sleep on the couch. 

Where did this originate? Is this strictly a western practice?

What makes it ok for a woman to ask her husband to do this? Women who have done this, what happens if your husband refuses? How does he know when it's ok to return to his bed?

Men who have been sent to the couch, how did you feel when asked to do this? What did you do to get this punishment? Any men out there who have been sent to the couch and refused?

In what circumstances would it be ok for a husband to direct his wife to the couch instead of their marital bed?


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## EllisRedding (Apr 10, 2015)

Not sure how much of this actually happens vs. being more of a "joke". Similar to men being in the doghouse (literally lol). 

I have never had this done to me, nor have I ever asked anyone to do. I could see maybe if you found out your SO was cheating on you (granted, if that was the case I would not want to sleep in that bed which may have been used for the extracurricular activities), but pretty childish if you do this just b/c you have an argument with your SO.


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

I have never been "sent to the couch". My wife, back in our dark days, once threw a remote control at me out of anger and told me to get out of the bedroom at bedtime. I shrugged my shoulders, told her no, and went to sleep.

Frankly, any partner (man or woman) that is "ordered' out of the bedroom, and actually complies, may have larger problems than the one who thinks they have the power to do the ordering.


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## tropicalbeachiwish (Jun 1, 2016)

I've never done this nor have had it done to me. My husband & I fight fair, I believe. That's something we established very early in our relationship. 

But there have been times when I certainly didn't WANT him sleeping in the same bed. If I have trouble sleeping, whether it's because he's talking in his sleep, snoring, coughing, etc, I'm the one that'll go to the couch to sleep.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

*I've never quite requested either of my XW's to ever vacate the marriage bed in favor of the family couch, but I have voluntarily traveled there myself whenever their abhorrent childish or drunken behavior and actions duly dictated that I go ahead and make that move on my own! 

In either their or even my pissy state of mind, I just did not want to be remotely anywhere around them!*


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## badsanta (Oct 13, 2014)

Hypothetical Situation: Husband orders the wrong widget that wife needs replaced yesterday! Husband blames wife for mistake because she was not detailed enough when demanding him to order said widget ASAP. 

Option A: Staying in a bedroom where my wife is upset with me and needs time to calm herself. 

Option B: Staying on a comfy couch with 1080p streaming 5.1 surround movies my wife refuses to watch with me while I eat my favorite snacks as I pass out for the night.



















Whoever says sleeping on the couch is a punishment is likely a husband that has a serious lack of imagination!


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## CharlieParker (Aug 15, 2012)

Whoever is more frustrated might go to the spare bedroom. It's more of cooling off kind of thing and usually we will eventually wind up in the same bed, either ours or the spare.


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

Depends on what's playing on TV... If its Lifetime Movie Network, it's an easy choice.

The part about the sacristy of the marital bed is a bit overblown. We had children co-sleep with us and it was not uncommon for one of us to sleep elsewhere. Never impacted our (back then good) marriage. And vice versa, when our marriage started going under we still shared the bed.


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## Keke24 (Sep 2, 2016)

Well this is interesting, I never imagined this would be quite the treat @badsanta seems to suggest. The only tv is in our room so I guess it would be serious punishment in that case lol.

If anything it would piss me off if my partner deliberately chose to sleep on the couch in response to an argument. And in the past he hasn't taken it too well when I scout off to the next room to cool off after an argument.


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## badsanta (Oct 13, 2014)

Keke24 said:


> Well this is interesting, I never imagined this would be quite the treat @badsanta seems to suggest. The only tv is in our room so I guess it would be serious punishment in that case lol.
> 
> If anything it would piss me off if my partner deliberately chose to sleep on the couch in response to an argument. And in the past he hasn't taken it too well when I scout off to the next room to cool off after an argument.


 @Keke24 it is all about "personal space." It may be wise for the two of you to discuss how you argue and how allowing for some personal space to cool off can actually be helpful. 

Your husband may be upset if he feels you are giving up and running away from arguments. So if you need space to cool off, acknowledge the problem and request some space to just think through things on your own for a while as a way to call a "truce" with one another and that you will come back to finish the argument once you have gathered you feelings and thoughts a little better.

Otherwise things can get too emotional.


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## GuyInColorado (Dec 26, 2015)

My ex wife kicked me out of the bedroom, stopped doing my laundry and cooking for me. She was a SAHM. I slept on an air mattress down in the basement. I detached even more, started an EA, and divorced her a few months later. She begged me to change my mind. She did the 180 her counselor told her to do and it wasn't the outcome she wanted. But we were in a 100% sexless/loveless marriage for the last 4+ years, so it was a sham anyways. We're both much happier now and can actually have civil conversations about our children.


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## 225985 (Dec 29, 2015)

I prefer to sleep on the couch or in the other bedroom


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## tropicalbeachiwish (Jun 1, 2016)

blueinbr said:


> I prefer to sleep on the couch or in the other bedroom


 

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


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## 225985 (Dec 29, 2015)

tropicalbeachiwish said:


> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk




The dog takes up the whole king bed


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## tropicalbeachiwish (Jun 1, 2016)

blueinbr said:


> The dog takes up the whole king bed


Lol. Mine does a pretty good job of that too and he's only a 22 pounder! If i move to the couch, the dog will just follow me then try to cram in the couch with me. Sorry, thread jack. 

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## uhtred (Jun 22, 2016)

We actually have separate bedrooms due to her insomnia. Long ago when we had a small apartment, I slept on the couch so that she could sleep better.

Being "told" to sleep on the couch is a whole different matter. No one has the right to chase their partner out of the bedroom. If they don't want to sleep in the same bed, they can move to the couch themselves.


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## Keke24 (Sep 2, 2016)

badsanta said:


> @Keke24 it is all about "personal space." It may be wise for the two of you to discuss how you argue and how allowing for some personal space to cool off can actually be helpful.
> 
> Your husband may be upset if he feels you are giving up and running away from arguments. So if you need space to cool off, acknowledge the problem and request some space to just think through things on your own for a while as a way to call a "truce" with one another and that you will come back to finish the argument once you have gathered you feelings and thoughts a little better.
> 
> Otherwise things can get too emotional.


I get the need for space to cool off and think things through before trying to resolve an argument. Perhaps taking some time away in a different room may help but we seem to have difficulty getting a good night's rest when either one is away from bed so I don't think taking an entire night away would work for us. 

This all came up because my partner made a semi serious joke about doing anything to avoid being sent to the couch in response to a hypothetical argument we were discussing. And I thought "why in the would would I do that to you? and why in the world would you be open to me doing that to you?".

And then I saw a new thread on here where the poster asked her husband to sleep on the couch in response to a disagreement over her car needing repairs vs him wanting to go to a football match. So I thought I had to find out more.

I've always been clear that I strongly dislike the reference of the woman being in charge or the woman being referred to as the boss in the relationship or the last say on a decision automatically being the woman's... you get what I mean. Men being sent to the couch feels like an extension of that idea. It seems disrespectful to think that the woman "owns the bed" and has a right to send the man off. And I can't understand a man repeatedly accepting this and following her wishes either.


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## UnicornCupcake (Dec 8, 2016)

My husband slept on the couch LAST night.
I told him I didn't want to be sleeping beside him this night and I didn't expect him to be chivalrous or man enough to offer up the bed so I nestled my damn self on the sofa. Of course, once I'm all established he insists I take the bed.

Personally, I think men should sleep on the couch if they're in the "doghouse," but I think women should be sent there or offer to go just as equally. I guess I feel whomever is upset should have the "right" to the bed. It's hard to determine that, though...


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## BetrayedDad (Aug 8, 2013)

To force another spouse to sleep in a different area of the house, or to remove yourself, over a disagreement shows an incredible amount of immaturity.

Me personally, I'd be on my way out of the relationship. I can't fathom why any sane person would want to stay married to a grown child.


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## Buddy400 (Aug 30, 2014)

Keke24 said:


> I can't understand a man repeatedly accepting this and following her wishes either.


Bill Burr has a great bit where some guy is talking about how he's been spending a lot of time on the couch and says "you know how it is".

To which he replies: "No, actually, I don't".


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## UnicornCupcake (Dec 8, 2016)

Keke24 said:


> And then I saw a new thread on here where the poster asked her husband to sleep on the couch in response to a disagreement over her car needing repairs vs him wanting to go to a football match. So I thought I had to find out more.


Hey now, I never asked or expected him to sleep on the couch. I offered it up first because I was the one who needed space. I have a real snarky way with words if I'm angry so I have to remove myself in order prevent further damage.

Crikey, it wasn't even bout needing car repairs. It had nothing to do with him taking care of my car. my post was about him ensuring I get to where I needed to go safely and being prioritized over a football match. I needed a partner to help me FIGURE out what to do (tow, leave, etc.) not someone to fix my car, lol. He's not a mechanic.
How quickly things get misinterpreted.


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## TheTruthHurts (Oct 1, 2015)

UnicornCupcake said:


> Hey now, I never asked or expected him to sleep on the couch. I offered it up first because I was the one who needed space. I have a real snarky way with words if I'm angry so I have to remove myself in order prevent further damage.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




My W and I established long ago (decades) that we would never go to bed angry.

It's unnecessary, builds resentment, and fosters misunderstanding.

We don't have to agree but we do have to talk enough to get our points across and be heard.

We rarely fight though. We agree on the major things and defer to whomever his the most passionate about the rest.


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## Keke24 (Sep 2, 2016)

UnicornCupcake said:


> Hey now, I never asked or expected him to sleep on the couch. I offered it up first because I was the one who needed space. I have a real snarky way with words if I'm angry so I have to remove myself in order prevent further damage.
> 
> Crikey, it wasn't even bout needing car repairs. It had nothing to do with him taking care of my car. my post was about him ensuring I get to where I needed to go safely and being prioritized over a football match. I needed a partner to help me FIGURE out what to do (tow, leave, etc.) not someone to fix my car, lol. He's not a mechanic.
> How quickly things get misinterpreted.


Didn't intend to misrepresent your posting. My comment was based strictly off of what you shared in your opening thread post: "I'm usually very vocal and all about a conversation, but I've asked him to sleep on the couch. " That lead me to believe you told him to sleep there. Thanks for clarifying.

Why does any spouse have the right to ask the other to sleep elsewhere?


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## Keke24 (Sep 2, 2016)

TheTruthHurts said:


> My W and I established long ago (decades) that we would never go to bed angry.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


That sounds ideal but very difficult in practice. 

Sometimes I'm so upset, it's difficult to say anything at all. Particularly if it's something that has come up repeatedly. You know the argument is going to be the same, there's nothing left to say except to hear the other person go even more into depth on their known point of view and vice versa.


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## CharlieParker (Aug 15, 2012)

TheTruthHurts said:


> My W and I established long ago (decades) that we would never go to bed angry.


Our deal is we can go to bed angry, and we can wake up angry but we can't go bed angry one more time. I think it's better to discuss something when rested rather right before going off to sleep.


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## tropicalbeachiwish (Jun 1, 2016)

Some use it as a way of punishment and some use it as a way of getting some space to cool off.


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## heartbroken50 (Aug 9, 2016)

I asked my H to sleep on the couch after discovering him cheating online. I felt completely justified... not like a child at all.

I would like to be on my way out of the marriage, but due to extenuating circumstances that's not possible right now. 

So, since we failed to reconcile, I have since fixed up a very comfortable extra bedroom for him and we are now just roommates.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Not really.

I have been upset and went to the couch for the night and so has she.

That is a pretty cold punishment for the one left in the bedroom because we love each others' bodies and comfort.

If one of us is mad enough to take that away, we get to talking quickly.


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## stixx (Mar 20, 2017)

heartbroken50 said:


> I asked my H to sleep on the couch after discovering him cheating online. I felt completely justified... not like a child at all.
> 
> I would like to be on my way out of the marriage, but due to extenuating circumstances that's not possible right now.
> 
> So, since we failed to reconcile, I have since fixed up a very comfortable extra bedroom for him and we are now just roommates.


Why didn't you just say "There's your new bedroom cheater" and let him fix it up himself?


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## heartbroken50 (Aug 9, 2016)

stixx said:


> Why didn't you just say "There's your new bedroom cheater" and let him fix it up himself?



I've been soft on him because of our extenuating circumstances... H has cancer. At the time I kicked him out of our room he was stable. He slept mostly on the couch for a little over a month... 

Then his cancer returned, he had major surgery and needed a more suitable room to recover in. So I bought him a bed, new bedding ... the works.

We've been married 20 years... have 3 teenagers. He is now inoperable... stage 4. I'm not heartless...given the circumstances, with him dealing with chemo and limited time, I stay so that my kids aren't robbed of time with him.

Sorry for the TJ.


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## Haiku (Apr 9, 2014)

UnicornCupcake said:


> I guess I feel whomever is upset should have the "right" to the bed.


Lol, no room for abuse there. 🤣


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## tigerlily99 (Nov 21, 2015)

I've always thought the 'ordering' H to sleep on the couch was immature and weird too. 
Surprisingly (to me) my husband will sometimes sleep downstairs when he feels upset with me. It usually feels like a punishment because I would never tell him to sleep on the couch for any reason. I love him to be in bed with me too much.

Funny story about the doghouse though, when we were much younger he got drunk at a party we were at a friend's house. He thought I was upset at him for drinking so much so he crawled into their doghouse. 
Funny guy! 
We laugh about that now.


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## Andy1001 (Jun 29, 2016)

UnicornCupcake said:


> My husband slept on the couch LAST night.
> I told him I didn't want to be sleeping beside him this night and I didn't expect him to be chivalrous or man enough to offer up the bed so I nestled my damn self on the sofa. Of course, once I'm all established he insists I take the bed.
> 
> Personally, I think men should sleep on the couch if they're in the "doghouse," but I think women should be sent there or offer to go just as equally. I guess I feel whomever is upset should have the "right" to the bed. It's hard to determine that, though...


Maybe if you weren't so far up your own ass you would realise how ridiculous you sound.


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

I think a gentleman will go to the couch if his wife asks him to.

Refusing, or telling her to sleep on the couch, is a real sign of boorishness, imo.


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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

I don't know exactly about rights in terms of sleeping on various furniture pieces...but it has happened a few times that I'd go and sleep in a spare bedroom after an argument (my own choice). I don't like doing it but when the atmosphere is tense, it's better to give each other space to cool down. My wife has also left one or two times but we usually sort things out on the night. Neither of us have kicked each other out.
That's why a while ago, I bought really comfy furniture 
The severity of the argument sometimes determines the distance...I think once we had a bad argument and I went to sleep to a hotel. Or if it's really very bad, i go travelling to another country...
One or two times, I considered applying for virgin galactic human space flight. But it worked out in the end and i didn't have to go (still have a space suit though). Plus they are not flying yet anyways.
So it depends


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

Keke24 said:


> In what circumstances would it be ok for a husband to direct his wife to the couch instead of their marital bed?


I guess if he wanted to assert his complete dominance in the marriage, leaving her with no power at all, absolutely defenseless and at his mercy.

I could not even look at a "man" like that.


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## Andy1001 (Jun 29, 2016)

jld said:


> I think a gentleman will go to the couch if his wife asks him to.
> 
> Refusing, or telling her to sleep on the couch, is a real sign of boorishness, imo.


So it's ok for the husband to be treated like a naughty child and sent to the naughty corner.And you believe this will make a wife respect her husband.I'm not being sarcastic I really would like to know.


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

Andy1001 said:


> So it's ok for the husband to be treated like a naughty child and sent to the naughty corner.And you believe this will make a wife respect her husband.I'm not being sarcastic I really would like to know.


I see husbands as powerful, Andy, not at all in the "naughty child" category. A man could ultimately do whatever he wanted to a wife. Few women can physically overpower a man. 

I think a man who can be patient and empathetic to a woman's feelings is a man who will inspire his wife's devotion. When Dug takes that approach with me, I can't help but eat out of his hand. The trust is just so powerful.


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## BetrayedDad (Aug 8, 2013)

heartbroken50 said:


> We've been married 20 years... have 3 teenagers. He is now inoperable... stage 4. I'm not heartless...given the circumstances, with him dealing with chemo and limited time, I stay so that my kids aren't robbed of time with him.


Wish I had the compassion you did. I'd of still tossed his ass out. 

You might not be heartless but he was to be screwing around on you.


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## Keke24 (Sep 2, 2016)

Andy1001 said:


> So it's ok for the husband to be treated like a naughty child and sent to the naughty corner.And you believe this will make a wife respect her husband.I'm not being sarcastic I really would like to know.


This was my thought process when my partner alluded to me sending him to the couch. It would be impossible for me to not, even if it was subconscious, lose some respect for a man who I could order to sleep away from our bed in response to a disagreement. I am very weary of promoting behaviours that would inadvertently affect my level of respect for my partner. I think once the respect for a man starts to chip away, so too does the woman's sexual attraction - for me at least.


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

Keke24 said:


> This was my thought process when my partner alluded to me sending him to the couch. It would be impossible for me to not, even if it was subconscious, lose some respect for a man who I could order to sleep away from our bed in response to a disagreement. I am very weary of promoting behaviours that would inadvertently affect my level of respect for my partner. I think once the respect for a man starts to chip away, so too does the woman's sexual attraction - for me at least.


I think you feel much more powerful in your relationship than I do in mine. 

We are likely viewing this from opposite ends of the power spectrum.


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## Keke24 (Sep 2, 2016)

jld said:


> I think you feel much more powerful in your relationship than I do in mine.
> 
> We are likely viewing this from opposite ends of the power spectrum.


Please expound if you don't mind...


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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

heartbroken50 said:


> I've been soft on him because of our extenuating circumstances... H has cancer. At the time I kicked him out of our room he was stable. He slept mostly on the couch for a little over a month...
> 
> Then his cancer returned, he had major surgery and needed a more suitable room to recover in. So I bought him a bed, new bedding ... the works.
> 
> ...


How awful. Can I ask what is "online cheating" in this case?


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## Robbie1234 (Feb 8, 2017)

jld said:


> I think you feel much more powerful in your relationship than I do in mine.
> 
> We are likely viewing this from opposite ends of the power spectrum.


I have read lots of your posts and I think you are Very dominant in your marriage


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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

Keke24 said:


> This was my thought process when my partner alluded to me sending him to the couch. It would be impossible for me to not, even if it was subconscious, lose some respect for a man who I could order to sleep away from our bed in response to a disagreement. I am very weary of promoting behaviours that would inadvertently affect my level of respect for my partner. I think once the respect for a man starts to chip away, so too does the woman's sexual attraction - for me at least.




Has this actually happened? (That one of you ordered the other to sleep on the couch). Until it actually happens, it's impossible to know what the dynamic turns out to be. There's no need to pre-empt losing sexual attractions or worrying about it too much until I actually happens! 
If my wife is so upset that she couldn't be in same room with me, she is the one who usually leaves. 
Once she was too upset and told ME to go away while I tried to calm her down. I did leve, out of respect to her needing the space. It has nothing to do with being a child. (Incidentally when I need *my* space to calm the f down, I find it very difficult to obtain..). So who is in control will probably be in the eye of the beholder. But does it matter? Is it not more important to sort out the actual argument eventually? 
What are you guys arguing about for a start? 


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## m00nman (Nov 29, 2014)

For some, separate beds are a blessing. OTOH to actually be *ordered* by a spouse to sleep on the couch is beyond the pale. If they're upset, then THEY should be the ones to withdraw. Odds are they aren't going to actually be able to sleep anyway.


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## Keke24 (Sep 2, 2016)

inmyprime said:


> Has this actually happened? (That one of you ordered the other to sleep on the couch). Until it actually happens, it's impossible to know what the dynamic turns out to be. There's no need to pre-empt losing sexual attractions or worrying about it too much until I actually happens!
> If my wife is so upset that she couldn't be in same room with me, she is the one who usually leaves.
> Once she was too upset and told ME to go away while I tried to calm her down. I did leve, out of respect to her needing the space. It has nothing to do with being a child. (Incidentally when I need *my* space to calm the f down, I find it very difficult to obtain..). So who is in control will probably be in the eye of the beholder. But does it matter? Is it not more important to sort out the actual argument eventually?
> What are you guys arguing about for a start?
> ...


Not happened, this is all hypothetical. He suggested that this was a request he wouldn't be surprised get/obey. I was secretly appalled because I would never suggest this as I think it would be me treating him like a child. 

Note, I do get the need for space during disagreements. I don't get a woman ordering her husband to sleep on the chair when "he is in the doghouse". By now my partner and I realize choosing to sleep away is a punishment to the person who stays as we both have serious trouble getting a decent rest when the other is away. So yes we will get away to have more personal space but wouldn't choose to spend the entire night away. I've gotten pissed enough to be ready to separate and even in that instance did not consider either one of us sleeping away for the night.

"But does it matter? Is it not more important to sort out the actual argument eventually?"

It definitely is, you're right. That is my focus right now in my relationship - figuring out how to resolve arguments quicker.


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## DustyDog (Jul 12, 2016)

badsanta said:


> Hypothetical Situation: Husband orders the wrong widget that wife needs replaced yesterday! Husband blames wife for mistake because she was not detailed enough when demanding him to order said widget ASAP.
> 
> Option A: Staying in a bedroom where my wife is upset with me and needs time to calm herself.
> 
> ...


Option C: Apologize for blaming.

Blame has no place in a relationship you're trying to nurture.


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## DustyDog (Jul 12, 2016)

Keke24 said:


> I first came across this concept on TV and now on TAM. When there is a disagreement between couples it is not out of the norm for the woman to ask the man to leave the bedroom and go sleep on the couch.
> 
> Where did this originate? Is this strictly a western practice?
> 
> ...


As far as I can tell, anything that is in the form of an order, a requirement, an ultimatum - basically attempts to control another person - will result in an immediate and continuing decline in the health of the relationship until the person attempting the control realizes they're doing it, stops and apologizes and promises to try to be collaborative in the future. "ordering" people sets up a competition - the words "right" and "wrong" get thrown about like gloved boxing fists, along with "fault", and people start thinking of "winning" which is only useful in a competition. A good relationship is not a competition - you're on the same team!

Having said that, I voluntarily do not sleep in the bedroom. Not because there's any animosity, but because she's basically gathered everything in there that lets her retreat to her cave. It's a very tiny room, she had to have a HUGE king-sized bed - so she could be all the way at one edge, have not one but THREE oval dog beds in the middle, leaving the other slim edge for me. Despite the tiny room, there's a huge dresser, two large nightstands and the TV which is nearly always on. The only path for me to enter to "my side" requires me to twist sideways to fit between stuff. Then...said bed is on the floor, so the tiny dogs can jump up onto it. When I wake up, what I see is the TV, on the stand, looming over me. In an earthquake (we get them), I'd probably be toast.

So, for me it's the couch in the living room, which is the only room I'm able to keep moderately free of clutter...and the only one in which I don't feel claustrophobic.


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## heartbroken50 (Aug 9, 2016)

inmyprime said:


> How awful. Can I ask what is "online cheating" in this case?



He had 6 month long very graphic sexting affair with a woman on the other side of the country through an online game app. 



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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

Keke24 said:


> Not happened, this is all hypothetical. He suggested that this was a request he wouldn't be surprised get/obey. I was secretly appalled because I would never suggest this as I think it would be me treating him like a child.
> 
> Note, I do get the need for space during disagreements. I don't get a woman ordering her husband to sleep on the chair when "he is in the doghouse". By now my partner and I realize choosing to sleep away is a punishment to the person who stays as we both have serious trouble getting a decent rest when the other is away. So yes we will get away to have more personal space but wouldn't choose to spend the entire night away. I've gotten pissed enough to be ready to separate and even in that instance did not consider either one of us sleeping away for the night.
> 
> ...




Maybe he was just joking that you may be too dominating? (Outside of bedroom, obviously 

It's sometimes difficult not too read too much into things. Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar (or whatever non sense S Freud may have said).


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## Keke24 (Sep 2, 2016)

inmyprime said:


> Maybe he was just joking that you may be too dominating? (Outside of bedroom, obviously
> 
> It's sometimes difficult not too read too much into things. Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar (or whatever non sense S Freud may have said).
> 
> ...


I don't think he was joking. This is part of the reason why I didn't let on how appalled I was. There are past examples of similar things he's said that suggests he isn't. The one that always sticks out is the time I overheard him and his best friend discussing their openness to being slapped by their partner for doing something wrong. They said they would probably" love the woman even more" as it would prove she couldn't be jerked around and she must have very strong feelings towards them (paraphrasing, except the quotations). I'm slowly becoming more and more aware that my partner wants me to be domineering but he doesn't understand the holistic impact of female domination in a relationship. 

This is a cultural thing and in his situation, it's been exaggerated by an aggressive, somewhat cold mother, and a cowardly father. Corporal punishment, single parents, the absence of strong male figures, overbearing male egos. These and more are a big part of what's screwing up the male identity in my culture.


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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

But not letting anyone jerk them around can't be a bad thing surely? I'm just trying to work out what you are reading into his words. You mean it sounds somewhat condescending? ("She wants to boss me around, how cute" type of thing).

Ok it could be a cultural thing too but I think male chauvinism is prevalent in all societies (to some extent). Or it could be just two guys joking around. I think my wife has a bad 'allergic' reaction if she gets even a hint that I might perceive her as less superior, intellectually or in any other aspect. She is the youngest sibling in her family and I think they usually over compensate because they might get put down by others too often, I'm not sure.
It doesn't sound like he is saying anything deliberately hurtful? More that you are not so sure how you should be taking it?
It could be "flirting gone wrong". Men are often terrible at it and sometimes can't tell the difference between flirting and belittling someone.


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## Keke24 (Sep 2, 2016)

inmyprime said:


> But not letting anyone jerk them around can't be a bad thing surely? I'm just trying to work out what you are reading into his words. You mean it sounds somewhat condescending? ("She wants to boss me around, how cute" type of thing).
> 
> Ok it could be a cultural thing too but I think male chauvinism is prevalent in all societies (to some extent). Or it could be just two guys joking around. I think my wife has a bad 'allergic' reaction if she gets even a hint that I might perceive her as less superior, intellectually or in any other aspect. She is the youngest sibling in her family and I think they usually over compensate because they might get put down by others too often, I'm not sure.
> It doesn't sound like he is saying anything deliberately hurtful? More that you are not so sure how you should be taking it?
> ...


I'm reading that (not surprisingly), he's attracted to women like his mom and women who are admired (I'm tempted to say idolize but that may be too strong of a word) by his culture. This type of woman has male domineering characteristics. She's the boss in her relationship and has no problem slapping her man around for example. Anyone who knows a few Caribbean women, knows this domineering female persona is distinctly common. I think this kind of Caribbean woman evolved in response to some of the difficulties surrounding the male gender that I mentioned in the previous post. And whatever other factors I'm too much of a layman to figure out.


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## Andy1001 (Jun 29, 2016)

DustyDog said:


> As far as I can tell, anything that is in the form of an order, a requirement, an ultimatum - basically attempts to control another person - will result in an immediate and continuing decline in the health of the relationship until the person attempting the control realizes they're doing it, stops and apologizes and promises to try to be collaborative in the future. "ordering" people sets up a competition - the words "right" and "wrong" get thrown about like gloved boxing fists, along with "fault", and people start thinking of "winning" which is only useful in a competition. A good relationship is not a competition - you're on the same team!
> 
> Having said that, I voluntarily do not sleep in the bedroom. Not because there's any animosity, but because she's basically gathered everything in there that lets her retreat to her cave. It's a very tiny room, she had to have a HUGE king-sized bed - so she could be all the way at one edge, have not one but THREE oval dog beds in the middle, leaving the other slim edge for me. Despite the tiny room, there's a huge dresser, two large nightstands and the TV which is nearly always on. The only path for me to enter to "my side" requires me to twist sideways to fit between stuff. Then...said bed is on the floor, so the tiny dogs can jump up onto it. When I wake up, what I see is the TV, on the stand, looming over me. In an earthquake (we get them), I'd probably be toast.
> 
> So, for me it's the couch in the living room, which is the only room I'm able to keep moderately free of clutter...and the only one in which I don't feel claustrophobic.


You're relationship IS a competition and you have lost every round.How lower can a man sink than to sleep on a couch so three dogs can sleep on his bed.
Grow a set.


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## WhiplashWish (Mar 20, 2017)

Um...snoring. She tends to snore. If the bed jiggle (I jiggle the bed, she usually stops snoring without waking) doesn't work, I resign myself to the comfy green couch and curl up under a blanket or two.


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

Keke24 said:


> Please expound if you don't mind...


The fact that you worry that he would listen to you, and that his listening would make you lose respect for him, indicates to me that you are in a different position than I am in my marriage.

I absolutely want my husband to listen to me. I am afraid he won't listen. His listening to me, and really considering my thoughts and feelings, makes me feel like I have some agency in the marriage. Without his willingness to do that, I would feel completely powerless. And that is a very vulnerable place to be.


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

Robbie1234 said:


> I have read lots of your posts and I think you are Very dominant in your marriage


I have as much power as he allows me to have.

When you do not have money of your own, and you are emotionally (and otherwise) dependent on your partner, you are not very powerful. 

Again, a vulnerable place to be.


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## Keke24 (Sep 2, 2016)

jld said:


> The fact that you worry that he would listen to you, and that his listening would make you lose respect for him, indicates to me that you are in a different position than I am in my marriage.


Huh? Don't think I said this.


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

Keke24 said:


> Huh? Don't think I said this.





Keke24 said:


> This was my thought process when my partner alluded to me sending him to the couch. *It would be impossible for me to not, even if it was subconscious, lose some respect for a man who I could order to sleep away from our bed in response to a disagreement.* I am very weary of promoting behaviours that would inadvertently affect my level of respect for my partner. I think once the respect for a man starts to chip away, so too does the woman's sexual attraction - for me at least.


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## Keke24 (Sep 2, 2016)

@jld I think we're communicating very differently here.

Me saying this: *"It would be impossible for me to not, even if it was subconscious, lose some respect for a man who I could order to sleep away from our bed in response to a disagreement."*

Just does not equate to this interpretation from you: *"The fact that you worry that he would listen to you, and that his listening would make you lose respect for him, indicates to me that you are in a different position than I am in my marriage."*


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

Keke24 said:


> @jld I think we're communicating very differently here.
> 
> Me saying this: *"It would be impossible for me to not, even if it was subconscious, lose some respect for a man who I could order to sleep away from our bed in response to a disagreement."*
> 
> Just does not equate to this interpretation from you: *"The fact that you worry that he would listen to you, and that his listening would make you lose respect for him, indicates to me that you are in a different position than I am in my marriage."*


There is certainly always risk of communication difficulties on forums.

Please feel free to help me understand what you meant if it was different from what I understood.

If you asked him to sleep away, would you not really want him to do it?


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## Andy1001 (Jun 29, 2016)

jld said:


> I have as much power as he allows me to have.
> 
> When you do not have money of your own, and you are emotionally (and otherwise) dependent on your partner, you are not very powerful.
> 
> Again, a vulnerable place to be.


You are an educated woman,you were a teacher at one stage and you home schooled your children.You have no reason whatsoever to feel vulnerable about not bringing money into your marriage.If necessary you could get a job immediately as a private tutor.I checked this out myself and these people do not come cheaply,you can hire an educator easily enough but one with a track record is not so easy to find.If I recall correctly some of your kids are college age and were always educated at home,by you.
Do not believe for one minute that what you do has less intrinsic value than if you went out to work and left your children in daycare or school.


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## badsanta (Oct 13, 2014)

...


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

Andy1001 said:


> You are an educated woman,you were a teacher at one stage and you home schooled your children.You have no reason whatsoever to feel vulnerable about not bringing money into your marriage.If necessary you could get a job immediately as a private tutor.I checked this out myself and these people do not come cheaply,you can hire an educator easily enough but one with a track record is not so easy to find.If I recall correctly some of your kids are college age and were always educated at home,by you.
> Do not believe for one minute that what you do has less intrinsic value than if you went out to work and left your children in daycare or school.


That is very kind, Andy. Thank you for the encouragement.

I don't think my life would be nearly as good without Dug, though.


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## TheTruthHurts (Oct 1, 2015)

jld said:


> I think a gentleman will go to the couch if his wife asks him to.
> 
> 
> 
> Refusing, or telling her to sleep on the couch, is a real sign of boorishness, imo.




I think a lady will go to the couch if her husband asks her too.

Refusing, or telling him to sleep on the couch, is the real sign of a woman who doesn't know her place or how to care for her man, imo


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## Keke24 (Sep 2, 2016)

jld said:


> There is certainly always risk of communication difficulties on forums.
> 
> Please feel free to help me understand what you meant if it was different from what I understood.
> 
> If you asked him to sleep away, would you not really want him to do it?


I wanted to get across that:

1. My partner suggested that he would comply if I asked him to sleep on the couch in response to a disagreement.

2. I would never order my partner to sleep on the couch in response to a disagreement. I think it's belittling.

4. Hypothetically, if I did decide to order him to sleep on the couch and he complied, it would affect my level of respect for him. I would interpret this as him allowing me to treat him like a child. 

Does that clarify things? I absolutely want him to listen to me and vice versa. Him listening is a great thing in my book and would perhaps increase my level of respect for him, not negatively affect it.


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

TheTruthHurts said:


> I think a lady will go to the couch if her husband asks her too.


I think this is disgraceful.

I would be appalled if my sons ever treated their wives like this.



> Refusing, or telling him to sleep on the couch, is the real sign of a woman who doesn't know her place or how to care for her man, imo


Not every woman is a domme, TTH . . .


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## TheTruthHurts (Oct 1, 2015)

jld said:


> I think this is disgraceful.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Domme? I think you're confused by that term.


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

Keke24 said:


> I wanted to get across that:
> 
> 1. My partner suggested that he would comply if I asked him to sleep on the couch in response to a disagreement.
> 
> ...


Thanks for the clarification, Keke.


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

TheTruthHurts said:


> Domme? I think you're confused by that term.


I think I am well aware of what it means.

You want a woman to take care of you, correct? Make you feel safe and secure?

That is a domme.


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## TheTruthHurts (Oct 1, 2015)

jld said:


> I think this is disgraceful.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



@jld I was merely supporting your dainty, powerless female argument and taking it to its logical conclusion using your example. You are saying women are weak and powerless and therefore must comply with their powerful husbands, which implies that a true lady knows her powerless place in a marriage and freely accepts her husbands wishes. Makes perfect sense to me. Not my marriage but I guess that's your belief system 


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## Keke24 (Sep 2, 2016)

Andy1001 said:


> You are an educated woman,you were a teacher at one stage and you home schooled your children.You have no reason whatsoever to feel vulnerable about not bringing money into your marriage.If necessary you could get a job immediately as a private tutor.I checked this out myself and these people do not come cheaply,you can hire an educator easily enough but one with a track record is not so easy to find.If I recall correctly some of your kids are college age and were always educated at home,by you.
> Do not believe for one minute that what you do has less intrinsic value than if you went out to work and left your children in daycare or school.


 @jld I second what Andy has presented here.

If you are a SAHM, lady! kudos to you. What my mother would have given to be a SAHM to her 6 kids... 

I am not a mother so I may just be saying this out of ignorance but I just couldn't do this. I stayed home for 3 months while my partner worked and that alone was enough. I think it's much easier just having a job.


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## TheTruthHurts (Oct 1, 2015)

jld said:


> I think I am well aware of what it means.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Ha ha no I said nothing like that and clarified in a post that occurred at the same time as yours


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

TheTruthHurts said:


> @jld I was merely supporting your dainty, powerless female argument and taking it to its logical conclusion using your example. You are saying women are weak and powerless and therefore must comply with their powerful husbands, which implies that a true lady knows her powerless place in a marriage and freely accepts her husbands wishes. Makes perfect sense to me. Not my marriage but I guess that's your belief system
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


They may have to comply temporarily. But it would not be safe to stay with such a man.


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

Keke24 said:


> @jld I second what Andy has presented here.
> 
> If you are a SAHM, lady! kudos to you. What my mother would have given to be a SAHM to her 6 kids...
> 
> I am not a mother so I may just be saying this out of ignorance but I just couldn't do this. I stayed home for 3 months while my partner worked and that alone was enough. I think it's much easier just having a job.


I'm sorry your mother did not have that opportunity, Keke. 

I am sure in some ways it may be easier to have an outside job. I bet it would be freeing. 

Andy is very kind. But I do not think it would be as easy for me as he thinks. And I am not just speaking in a financial sense. My life, in every sense, is completely bound up with my husband. Our children, the last 24 years, he is an intrinsic part of all of that. It would be very hard to ever separate my life from his. 

And fortunately I don't think that will ever need to happen. But I do not think for one minute that I would not be vulnerable.


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## TheTruthHurts (Oct 1, 2015)

jld said:


> They may have to comply temporarily. But it would not be safe to stay with such a man.




Jld you are an anomaly in the modern era and your advice reflects that. I don't know of anyone who thinks or acts the way you do, but my grandmother who passed away in the 1980's while in her 80's might have shared a couple of your views.

Nope - I take that back. She eloped in the 1920's but she and my grandfather stayed living with their parents and didn't inform anyone of their marriage. It was because she wanted to continue working and married women weren't allowed to work at Standard Oil (her employer) and most employers at the time. So she was less submissive and didn't buy into the notion that women are subservient to men as you indicate you believe in your responses.


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## DustyDog (Jul 12, 2016)

Andy1001 said:


> You're relationship IS a competition and you have lost every round.How lower can a man sink than to sleep on a couch so three dogs can sleep on his bed.
> Grow a set.


Nonsense. It is not "My" bed, it is OUR bed. No competition.

She feels comfy having LOTS of "her stuff" in the room where she sleeps, and that includes OUR dogs. Even if the room had only a single bed, I would not be comfy in a tiny little 9x9 room - just how I grew up, with more space. If I wanted to make it a competition, I'd insist on re-claiming the 20 X 15 utility room (which was master bedroom before a previous owner remodeled 20 years ago) as master bedroom - but I'm not bound to that concept enough to want to go through that effort.

She would prefer that I not leave the room, but understands the claustrophobic sense.

If the value of a man, in your view, is where he sleeps.....honestly I can't think that shallow!!!!!


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

TheTruthHurts said:


> Jld you are an anomaly in the modern era and your advice reflects that. I don't know of anyone who thinks or acts the way you do, but my grandmother who passed away in the 1980's while in her 80's might have shared a couple of your views.
> 
> Nope - I take that back. She eloped in the 1920's but she and my grandfather stayed living with their parents and didn't inform anyone of their marriage. It was because she wanted to continue working and married women weren't allowed to work at Standard Oil (her employer) and most employers at the time. So she was less submissive and didn't buy into the notion that women are subservient to men as you indicate you believe in your responses.
> 
> ...


I think women, generally speaking, are vulnerable, TTH. Whether that translates to submissive or subservient may be debated.

There are certainly ways of tempering that vulnerability. Marrying a trustworthy man and having the ability to support themselves are a few that come to mind.


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## Andy1001 (Jun 29, 2016)

TheTruthHurts said:


> Jld you are an anomaly in the modern era and your advice reflects that. I don't know of anyone who thinks or acts the way you do, but my grandmother who passed away in the 1980's while in her 80's might have shared a couple of your views.
> 
> Nope - I take that back. She eloped in the 1920's but she and my grandfather stayed living with their parents and didn't inform anyone of their marriage. It was because she wanted to continue working and married women weren't allowed to work at Standard Oil (her employer) and most employers at the time. So she was less submissive and didn't buy into the notion that women are subservient to men as you indicate you believe in your responses.
> 
> ...


It may not be a common occurrence these days but who can argue against a mom staying at home with her kids at least up to school age.You call Jld an anomaly but that doesn't mean she is wrong.My gf is expecting a baby (any day now) and I would love her to be a sahm.I have looked into home educating my daughter and I realise I may not be able to do it myself but I will happily pay for a private tutor if necessary and if I could get one who has home educated kids up to college age I will be delighted.


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## TheTruthHurts (Oct 1, 2015)

Andy1001 said:


> It may not be a common occurrence these days but who can argue against a mom staying at home with her kids at least up to school age.You call Jld an anomaly but that doesn't mean she is wrong.My gf is expecting a baby (any day now) and I would love her to be a sahm.I have looked into home educating my daughter and I realise I may not be able to do it myself but I will happily pay for a private tutor if necessary and if I could get one who has home educated kids up to college age I will be delighted.




I wasn't taking about being a SAHM. My w did that too for their first 10 years or so nor was I talking about home schooling 


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## Mr. Nail (Apr 26, 2011)

In the second year of our marriage I was ordered to the couch. For coming home after midnight being out playing role playing games with a bunch of guys. She left a note on the door. I went to bed anyway. Cold feet and all. We discussed it in the morning.
My first thought upon reading the title of the thread was "she didn't say Who's couch." Which goes along with the old Chinese proverb "Woman who sends husband to doghouse, often find him in Cat House.
With age and health and medications we both voluntarily go to the couch now. Either because we are restless of because I'm snoring. About the talking in sleep. I was known to do it as a teen but have not had complaints in marriage. Mrs Mail on the other hand doesn't exactly talk in her sleep she just makes these very sexy moans and similar sounds. I don't leave over those, In fact I live for them. I haven't heard any lately, pity.


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## MrsHolland (Jun 18, 2016)

I have been so pissed off with MrH a few times that I went to sleep on the couch, he simply hates that and I understand why but it is better for me to have some space. It's a tricky one because I need space when we have had an argument and he needs to be close, hard one to work through.

Oh and apparently I laugh in my sleep, funny thing is one of my daughters does too


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## Andy1001 (Jun 29, 2016)

DustyDog said:


> Nonsense. It is not "My" bed, it is OUR bed. No competition.
> 
> She feels comfy having LOTS of "her stuff" in the room where she sleeps, and that includes OUR dogs. Even if the room had only a single bed, I would not be comfy in a tiny little 9x9 room - just how I grew up, with more space. If I wanted to make it a competition, I'd insist on re-claiming the 20 X 15 utility room (which was master bedroom before a previous owner remodeled 20 years ago) as master bedroom - but I'm not bound to that concept enough to want to go through that effort.
> 
> ...


You are being rode so hard you really ought to be wearing a saddle.Of course your room feels claustrophobic,there's three ****ing dogs with their own beds sleeping on your bed,a tv,wardrobe and all your wife's crap to keep you company.You haven't the balls to "claim"the utility room and if you are told to leave the house by your wife you will.If I can make one recommendation,use some lube on those saddle sores.
Again,grow a pair.


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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

Keke24 said:


> I wanted to get across that:
> 
> 1. My partner suggested that he would comply if I asked him to sleep on the couch in response to a disagreement.
> 
> ...


Are you sure he is "allowing" it? Maybe he is pre-empting it by joking about it...You don't know what he might do if it actually comes to that. (Sex drive back up? I hope so 

Are you sure you are not reading too many hidden meanings into his behaviour that might not be there? (I remember you wrote something about having a concern regarding his potential reactions to a painting of yours; it turned out to be nothing in the end. Unless I am misremembering). 

For some reasons, we sometimes assign hidden meanings and sometimes misconstrue intentions; my wife does it frequently and I find it hard to make her believe that she builds some things up in her head. Sometimes she is correct though so I am not saying your worries are not valid. Just that you seem to worry about losing respect/sexual attraction to him because your image of him might change due to something that may or may not happen.


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## frusdil (Sep 5, 2013)

My husbands ex wife once sent him outside to sleep! They'd argued, she grabbed his swag, threw it down the stairs and told him to sleep outside, then she locked him out. And he did!!! He was getting more and more agitated as he was telling me about it, and when I asked why on earth he allowed her to do that to him he said "I had the best ****ing night's sleep in years not having to sleep next to....THAT!" bahahahahaha.

I asked him why he didn't break in and said to him if he ever locked me out, I'd be in the garage looking for anything I could use to smash that front door wide open, hehehehe.

Neither of us would ever order the other out of our bed...never.

I will never understand why so many men tolerate this.


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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

MrsHolland said:


> I have been so pissed off with MrH a few times that I went to sleep on the couch, he simply hates that and I understand why but it is better for me to have some space. It's a tricky one because I need space when we have had an argument and he needs to be close, hard one to work through.
> 
> Oh and apparently I laugh in my sleep, funny thing is one of my daughters does too


Funny. My wife argues with me sometimes in her sleep. And I often don't know she's sleeping when I argue back. 
Anyway, I have been sleeping 70% of the time in the guest room for the last 6 years due to one of the kids always occupying the bed with my wife. Hopefully after this last one (one year old), I can come back "home"soon... Though she may have got used to having the bed mostly to herself and it will be interesting....I read somewhere that most successful marriages (whatever that means) have the partners sleeping in separate beds...Difficult to believe.


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## GTdad (Aug 15, 2011)

We have a king-size semi-motionless waterbed. My wife would have to kick me out at gunpoint.


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## Andy1001 (Jun 29, 2016)

DustyDog said:


> Nonsense. It is not "My" bed, it is OUR bed. No competition.
> 
> She feels comfy having LOTS of "her stuff" in the room where she sleeps, and that includes OUR dogs. Even if the room had only a single bed, I would not be comfy in a tiny little 9x9 room - just how I grew up, with more space. If I wanted to make it a competition, I'd insist on re-claiming the 20 X 15 utility room (which was master bedroom before a previous owner remodeled 20 years ago) as master bedroom - but I'm not bound to that concept enough to want to go through that effort.
> 
> ...


I have read your other post about how great it is to sleep on the couch with your tv and surround sound.
There is an episode of the Simpsons where Kirk Van Houten (Millhouses Dad) has been thrown out by his wife and Homer comes to see him at his two roomed bachelor apt.Kirk shows Homer his bed which looks like a car.Kirk proudly says to Homer "I sleep in a sports car,what do you sleep in"
Homer says "I sleep in a big bed with my wife".
Last time dude.Grow a pair.


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## Andy1001 (Jun 29, 2016)

frusdil said:


> My husbands ex wife once sent him outside to sleep! They'd argued, she grabbed his swag, threw it down the stairs and told him to sleep outside, then she locked him out. And he did!!! He was getting more and more agitated as he was telling me about it, and when I asked why on earth he allowed her to do that to him he said "I had the best ****ing night's sleep in years not having to sleep next to....THAT!" bahahahahaha.
> 
> I asked him why he didn't break in and said to him if he ever locked me out, I'd be in the garage looking for anything I could use to smash that front door wide open, hehehehe.
> 
> ...


I once went with an on/off gf to Florida for a few days,we stayed in a hotel in Orlandn the second night we had a fight and she made a big melodrama about telling me to sleep on the couch in the room,she had booked it in her name and threatened to call reception and have me thrown out even though I had paid for it.I rang the Grand Floridian hotel in the Disney complex,booked a suite,they sent a limo to collect me and I stayed there on my own for four nights.I had the park tickets in my wallet and she had just a couple of hundred bucks spending money.I told her as I was leaving that when she apologised I would give her the ticket but she never did.


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## kag123 (Feb 6, 2012)

Sleep in my house is miserable to be honest. Both H and I have sleep problems and we usually start in bed together and end up waking up somewhere else, because we couldn't sleep. I kept a tally sheet next to my bed the other night and marked each time I woke up enough to look at the clock. It was 10 times by morning.  

Anyway - I do not believe in "ordering" a spouse to do anything, ever. But I've been plenty angry enough to need to be away from H, and in those cases I sleep on the couch myself. I've even been so angry that I've left the house completely, but only for a few hours. 

H never gets angry or upset about anything. His lack of reaction actually makes me more mad lol. I don't want yelling, and I don't ever raise my voice either, but to have a conversation with someone and they have zero response and not even a facial expression that shows they registered what you said? That's when I have to get some space. He never comes after me, and goes right to sleep in the bed when I leave. So I guess it works for us. I don't do it as punishment, I do it because I don't want to lose my mind and completely blow a gasket. 

The whole "Don't go to bed angry" thing is beyond my comprehension!


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