# Am I A Perv or Is She Dull?????



## Sonny (Oct 1, 2008)

Hi, 

Actually looked up Webster definition of Pervert, Lecher etc. FAR too vague. I really have no issues with my wife but she has called me a pervert at times, we have sex and oral often enough but I always want to up the game and take it further. I don't know if it's allowed to post examples of what I mean, and what she's said here ad what I want to do. Maybe can pm with some people to see?


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## Mclane (Apr 28, 2016)

Why does it matter what the people here think?

It's what your wife thinks that matters.


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## 225985 (Dec 29, 2015)

Yes you are perv per your wife.


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## anonmd (Oct 23, 2014)

Meh, if you are having sex less than a few times a week that is standard LD commentary from time to time.


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## Rowan (Apr 3, 2012)

Sonny said:


> Hi,
> 
> Actually looked up Webster definition of Pervert, Lecher etc. FAR too vague. I really have no issues with my wife but she has called me a pervert at times, *we have sex and oral often enough but I always want to up the game and take it further*. I don't know if it's allowed to post examples of what I mean, and what she's said here ad what I want to do. Maybe can pm with some people to see?


So, frequency is not the issue, but rather your desire for more varied sexual experiences?

That you have a shoe fetish and want to give her pedicures or lick her toes is one thing. That you're into Furries and want to dress up like a giant panda bear for sex is perhaps something else. There is a rather staggering variety of desires within the realm of human sexual interest. Not everyone is going to be turned on by the same things. So, is what you want fairly mainstream, or are you interested in things that might legitimately give your partner pause? 

Also, you said you "always want to up the game and take it further." What does that mean? Have you perhaps given your wife the impression that whatever she does, it's never quite enough?


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## Married but Happy (Aug 13, 2013)

Calling you names is an attempt to shame and control you, because her libido or comfort zone is less than yours. It's dishonest, manipulative, and unloving of her - but she may not even be conscious of her transgression.


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## Maricha75 (May 8, 2012)

1. @Sonny, it is fine to post examples of what you would like to try. You are asking for advice, and any examples shared SHOULD be taken in that context.

2. @Mclane, Sonny is asking for advice about whether he truly is as bad as his wife implies or not. There is nothing wrong with asking, especially since it seems he truly does not know if his requests are *that bad*.

As @anonmd stated, calling the spouse a pervert is fairly standard for a lower drive person. But, OP said they have "sex and oral often enough", so it doesn't seem, to me, that his wife is actually LD. It sounds like he wants to do more things, not that he wants to increase frequency.

Sonny, how long have you been married? How often do you have sex? And what kinds of things are you wanting to try?


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## WonkyNinja (Feb 28, 2013)

Sonny said:


> Hi,
> 
> Actually looked up Webster definition of Pervert, Lecher etc. FAR too vague. I really have no issues with my wife but she has called me a pervert at times, we have sex and oral often enough but I always want to up the game and take it further. I don't know if it's allowed to post examples of what I mean, and what she's said here ad what I want to do. Maybe can pm with some people to see?


It would depend upon what you want to do.

Tickling your lover from head to toe with a feather might by classed as kinky, perverted would be using a whole live chicken.


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## Sonny (Oct 1, 2008)

Well first, poster above asked "What does it matter what we think?" well then why does this forum even exist? the purpose of a forum is people get a collective opinion or information on any range of topics in life. 

Nothing I've done or suggested is too "out there" she was sunbathing in the back yard once and I took a picture of her from inside the house and texted her outside saying "Enjoying my view" her response: "Your a pervert?" really? because I enjoy looking at you???? I just left the house for the day. 

Sexually I've suggested things that are gross to her like 69 (she doesn't want oral on herself finds it disgusting but me she likes giving) I asked her to get high heels and dress ****ty in the bedroom and she says that's too perverted. She won't go down on me after being in her because that's "unclean and perverted."

I've told her it's my fantasy to be in full control, she does whatever I say, like submissive woman type stuff, no way, yet all those romance novels on her Kindle are filled with stories like that. Apparently she's interested in that....

So it's not me asking "How do I get her to do these things?" because that's a fool's errand, would be with resistance, more is this that perverted???

Mariacha We've been married 18 years.


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## dash74 (Jan 3, 2015)

Sonny,

Did you ask for a basket job?

They say it takes one to know one, so tell me and will let you know.

But all joking aside you may be in for a shock after kids, sounds LD unless it's done in joking playful manner


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## Sonny (Oct 1, 2008)

2 kids....


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## dash74 (Jan 3, 2015)

Sonny said:


> 2 kids....


She has been this way all 18 years


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## richardsharpe (Jul 8, 2014)

Good evening
there is no absolute standard. I don't consider anything safe sane and consensual to be bad, but that doesn't mean that it is wrong not to want non-traditional sexual activities. 

Compatibility is everything. 

I would never call someone a perv, or dull - but there are certainly people who want to do much more or much less that I do.


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## Sonny (Oct 1, 2008)

Dash: Yes, BJ's got much better though.


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## jerry123 (Apr 9, 2012)

Ok, 18 years is a long time. I've been married that long and if my wife called me a perv I'd respond by throwing a joke about it. "Yup, I am. I've got the stamina of a 19 year old kid."

What you are basically doing (picture comment) is stoking her desire that you find her sexually attractive. Nothing wrong with that. 

A lot of men in marriages have the type of wife you have. 

I assume you two had pretty good sex while dating?
Then kids come along and she's in mommy world and sex dwindles. Then they get older and you basically just have sex once in a while and she gives BJ's. But won't explore anything else. 

I would suggest buying the download version of MMSLP. (Married mans sex life primer)

Few questions. 

How old are you and her?
How old kids?
Are you both in good shape physically?
Any major debt?
Good jobs?
You dress well?


I tend to believe, unless there is something medically wrong with her, most healthy women have the same desire to have sex and try things with their spouse. And they hide it well because they don't want to be seen as a ****. 

Last question, was she ever sexually abused as a child?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Maricha75 (May 8, 2012)

I wouldn't say it's perverted, but I am not your wife. Some of the things you listed, I wouldn't do, either, but not because I think they are perverted. It just isn't anything I am interested in DOING. Fortunately, my husband is in agreement. 

Regarding the picture, I don't think that is perverted at all. If it weren't for the other things you listed, I would interpret it as a joke... which I have said/done to my husband. 

Have you ASKED her why she enjoys reading about those things, but is unwilling to try them with you? Obviously, you aren't going to force her to try anything, but I am curious about her view on oral. I realize there are women who do feel that way (and it honestly isn't something I can wrap my head around), but did she EVER allow you to go down on her? Or did she say "no" from the very beginning? 

Honestly, it appears she does have hangups... but about herself. She doesn't want to taste herself, feels dirty if she is pleasure the same way you are... and doesn't want to dress "slu++y"... I think part is her own body image, and another part could be upbringing... maybe mom and/or grandma told her only slu+s do those things. Beyond talking with her, to find out WHY she feels thus way, I have no idea what to advise. But, though I wouldn't do some of what you listed, I don't think the requests are perverted. But... I am not her, either.


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## dash74 (Jan 3, 2015)

People have limits, but that said I sent my wife a d pic (first d pic ever) last weekend and asked her if she wanted a ride and she called me a pervert after she hopped on.

I guess if her calling you a pervert makes you feel bad you need to talk about it 

And both of you take this in private Interactive Sex Questionnaire for Couples | Mojo Upgrade it can help you open a dialogue


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## anonmd (Oct 23, 2014)

You are not perverted, she has some issues which are typical. She may work through them on her own as the children get older and move out.

You might also gently suggest occasionally that her circle of acceptable activities is a little on the small side and maybe she had some ideas on small things to try since in marriage typically there is a circle of what each partner wants or is willing to do and what you actually wind up doing is only the overlap which in your case is pretty narrow...


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## Sonny (Oct 1, 2008)

jerry123 said:


> Ok, 18 years is a long time. I've been married that long and if my wife called me a perv I'd respond by throwing a joke about it. "Yup, I am. I've got the stamina of a 19 year old kid."
> 
> What you are basically doing (picture comment) is stoking her desire that you find her sexually attractive. Nothing wrong with that.
> 
> ...


 *NO*


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

I see two things. One, that really sounds like something she picked up from her mom - a mindset, if you will. Or an unwillingness to be free and spontaneous in the bedroom. It's possible to change that in her, but it would have to be handled very carefully.

Two, it's likely that after 18 years, she just sees you as her companion now, not her lover. So anything other than vanilla is going to be gross to her. For that, you would need to start building your...mysteriousness back up - dating her, taking her breath away, swooping her up and giving her a passionate minute-long kiss, things like that.

if she is as restricted as it sounds, and came from what she believes her mom believes, she might be willing to try new things...if she felt 'helpless' - meaning 'omg he was so hot I don't know what got into me, I had no control, it wasn't my fault.' That way she can continue to tell herself she's virtuous and doesn't do perverted things, she just couldn't help herself.. 

Finally, how much time do you spend just touching and cuddling, WITHOUT it leading to sex? I hear this one issue more often than any other issue women have - can't you just hug me without grabbing my ass? kind of thing. If you try to be more affectionate without 'wanting something,' I imagine you're going to find her much less critical over whether you're a perv. Try to remember what it was like when you were dating, happy to see each other, excited, butterflies...take her on dates, hug and cuddle, talk more and ask her about herself so she sees you are interested in more than just a vessel for sex...and things might change.


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## Marduk (Jul 16, 2010)

Sonny said:


> Well first, poster above asked "What does it matter what we think?" well then why does this forum even exist? the purpose of a forum is people get a collective opinion or information on any range of topics in life.
> 
> Nothing I've done or suggested is too "out there" she was sunbathing in the back yard once and I took a picture of her from inside the house and texted her outside saying "Enjoying my view" her response: "Your a pervert?" really? because I enjoy looking at you???? I just left the house for the day.
> 
> ...


Why did you marry her?


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## Sonny (Oct 1, 2008)

Maricha75 said:


> I wouldn't say it's perverted, but I am not your wife. Some of the things you listed, I wouldn't do, either, but not because I think they are perverted. It just isn't anything I am interested in DOING. Fortunately, my husband is in agreement.
> *
> What wouldn't you do???*
> 
> ...


*Yeah good point. Thank You*


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## Capster (Jun 10, 2014)

Sounds like maybe the perfert word is being overused by her as a defense mechanism. Taking a pic of your wife in a swimsuit certainly is not perverted. Now if it was the neighbor lady...

Some things (like dressing in high heels) you'd have to tell her in advance. However, with the submissive stuff, why are you trying to get her to talk about it? Just do it (start of little by little) and see what happens? I asked my wife for stuff for 20+ years, and the answer was always no. I think asking shows a weak frame on our part. If she has any submissiveness in her, she might let you take her there more easily than trying to get her to talk about it.


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## jerry123 (Apr 9, 2012)

Ok, you read MMSLP. It's not about just manning up. 

It's about transforming yourself into the guy your wife wants to try new things with. 

Being mysterious/adventurous is something that may strike her desire to be more open. 

Same with me. My wife from years 10-15 mostly would be vanilla sex. I was out of shape (not obese) guy who never dressed up or dressed nice. 
Hence I get the book and start reading. Lost 22 lbs. started lifting weights... therefore I went from a size 35/36 to a 32. So I had to buy new clothes. 

My SR went from a 6 to an 8. Her SR went to maybe a 7 because growing older as a women is much different than growing older as a guy.

My wife now has an assortment of kinky dress up stuff and slu!!y 5 inch heel shoes. 

Don't think you can't change at your age. I am 47 and in the best shape of my life. 



I really think something would kick in if you did some physical shape changes.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Marduk (Jul 16, 2010)

Have her read this:
What Keeps Couples Happy Long Term - WSJ

And then this:
Science proves it: Dan Savage is right - Salon.com

And then declare to her that your philosophy of marriage is that you're GGG. Meaning, Good, Giving, and Game for anything.

And you would like her to join you in that journey.


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## Maricha75 (May 8, 2012)

@Sonny, really, it's the heels and slu++y outfits that I don't do. Never have. Well, I tried wearing heels a long time ago, but it ended badly. I can't even stand up in them without twisting my ankle, now. Not worth risking a sprain or break, for either of us. The outfits... again, not our thing. Mostly, it's the idea of spending so much money for so little fabric. 69 is very rare, but not out of the question. And going down on my husband after... never came up, so idk. Maybe I would, maybe not. But it isn't out of the question. I'm submissive to a point. If he were to say "I want you to do whatever I say", in a sexual situation, he would be met with "f*$# off". While I would be willing to do much of what he would want, I wouldn't do "whatever [he] says", either. But this is another thing he knows, so wouldn't request it, either.

But there are other things that some consider mainstream and we won't do. We have been married 16 years (next month), and our kids are 15, 9, and 7.

Honestly, reading the books to fall asleep isn't far-fetched. Unless there is a decent plot to the story... YAWN. The ones I have read have bored me. It got to the point where I actually would flip pages to get PAST the sex because it was that boring. My mom, actually, would read them to fall asleep, too.


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## Mclane (Apr 28, 2016)

Sonny said:


> Well first, poster above asked "What does it matter what we think?" well then why does this forum even exist? the purpose of a forum is people get a collective opinion or information on any range of topics in life


I don't think there's any point whatsoever in asking people what they think because it doesn't change anything, it certainly won't alter his wife's response.

Forums like these are a good place to get advice, discuss and develop strategies to save or dissolve relationships, to catch a possibly cheating spouse, or even to discuss legal strategy with those who have been down that road before. Those are of course only a few examples of many.

But to ask "Do you think I'm a pervert" and get a range of yes and no answers isn't going to fix anything at all. No matter what the majority vote might be on the subject.

My 2 cents.


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## Marduk (Jul 16, 2010)

Maricha75 said:


> @Sonny, really, it's the heels and slu++y outfits that I don't do. Never have. Well, I tried wearing heels a long time ago, but it ended badly. I can't even stand up in them without twisting my ankle, now. Not worth risking a sprain or break, for either of us. The outfits... again, not our thing. Mostly, it's the idea of spending so much money for so little fabric.


Easy fix for the heels. Put them on when you're in bed only.

A semi-easy fix for the outfits is that stockings can make anything sexy. For like, $5 or something.

If you wanted fixes, of course. Sounds like neither one is either one's thing.


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## Mclane (Apr 28, 2016)

marduk said:


> stockings can make anything sexy. For like, $5 or something.


Not some of the "women" I've had the displeasure of meeting for a first date after seeing rather deceptive online dating profile pictures. 

That's like saying wrapping a walrus in a trenchcoat makes it attractive to a sperm whale.


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## Marduk (Jul 16, 2010)

Mclane said:


> Not some of the "women" I've had the displeasure of meeting for a first date after seeing rather deceptive online dating profile pictures.
> 
> That's like saying wrapping a walrus in a trenchcoat makes it attractive to a sperm whale.


I meant "anything" as in "any outfit that shows her legs."


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## Maricha75 (May 8, 2012)

marduk said:


> Easy fix for the heels. Put them on when you're in bed only.
> 
> A semi-easy fix for the outfits is that stockings can make anything sexy. For like, $5 or something.
> 
> If you wanted fixes, of course. Sounds like neither one is either one's thing.


Nope. The heels aren't happening, period.

Stockings... meh. Maybe. Providing you mean thigh high or the like. If full length, around the length of pantyhose, no. Long story short, I can't do those... bad skin reaction when I have worn them... even with trying different options others have done to try to prevent a reaction.


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## Mr. Nail (Apr 26, 2011)

@Sonny , I wonder if she doesn't like the idea that you are a pervert (whether or not you really are), it gives her the opportunity to enjoy sex without the orthodox guilt, after all it was your idea. The things you are suggesting are not dangerous or terribly unusual. But they are not h=n her comfort zone and she derives a sense of control in being able to restrict them.

Here is what I see as a problem. She finds her body parts and processes to be disgusting, or gross, or just plain icky. And that is no way for a healthy person to think of them self. It's a bit worse than poor body image (which she also has).

You need to show her by your words and actions that you don't find any of her gross, icky, or in any way objectionable. What you did with the window was good. Her reaction might have been flirty instead of off putting. More complements, more sneaking peeks. Openly appreciate her and every part of her. And If she doesn't call you pervert 3 times a week you are falling down.


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## Vega (Jan 8, 2013)

turnera said:


> Finally, how much time do you spend just touching and cuddling, WITHOUT it leading to sex? I hear this one issue more often than any other issue women have - can't you just hug me without grabbing my ass? kind of thing. If you try to be more affectionate without 'wanting something,' I imagine you're going to find her much less critical over whether you're a perv. Try to remember what it was like when you were dating, happy to see each other, excited, butterflies...take her on dates, hug and cuddle, talk more and ask her about herself so she sees you are interested in more than just a vessel for sex...and things might change.


DING! DING!! DING!!! For the WIN!!!!!!!


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## sscygni (Apr 13, 2016)

turnera said:


> Finally, how much time do you spend just touching and cuddling, WITHOUT it leading to sex? I hear this one issue more often than any other issue women have - can't you just hug me without grabbing my ass? kind of thing. If you try to be more affectionate without 'wanting something,' I imagine you're going to find her much less critical over whether you're a perv. Try to remember what it was like when you were dating, happy to see each other, excited, butterflies...take her on dates, hug and cuddle, talk more and ask her about herself so she sees you are interested in more than just a vessel for sex...and things might change.


Ooohh, I resonate with this one, but is it so hard to see that the two are connected? If I am getting enough sex to satisfy me it is very easy to be casually intimate without thinking about more. If, on the other hand I am seriously deprived, its hard not to want every kiss to lead to something else.

Starve a dog for three weeks and then wave a steak under their nose and expect them just to take a whiff. Not likely.


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## phillybeffandswiss (Jan 20, 2013)

LOL. Doom and gloom.

Did you sit down and talk to her about the pervert comment? Was it jovial, but there was an act you wanted, she said "no" and now you are sensitive to it being an insult? Dude, you took a voyeuristic picture and sent it to her. No offense, but in this day and age it is what perverts do. It's your wife so, it isn't, but hopefully you understand why I think she may be kidding. I did something similar, my wife called me a pervert and I didn't even think it was about manipulation. 

So, what really happened? 
What is the context?
Have you talked to her?


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## WorkingWife (May 15, 2015)

Sonny said:


> Well first, poster above asked "What does it matter what we think?" well then why does this forum even exist? the purpose of a forum is people get a collective opinion or information on any range of topics in life.
> 
> Nothing I've done or suggested is too "out there" she was sunbathing in the back yard once and I took a picture of her from inside the house and texted her outside saying "Enjoying my view" her response: "Your a pervert?" really? because I enjoy looking at you???? I just left the house for the day.
> 
> ...


None of this sounds perverted to me at all. And your wife is "wrong" to call you a pervert. That is a disrespectful judgment of your pretty mainstream sexual desires.

*But *how do you react when she does not want to do things that you want to do? Do you say no problem and move on to something else? Or do you wheedle, whine, keep asking - or make a disrespectful judgment of her, like say she is uptight, frigid, no fun, boring in bed, etc?

If you are constantly pushing her to do things she has already said she does not want to do, she may be using the pervert line to protect herself from what she feels is harassment/judgment/bullying from you.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

sscygni said:


> Ooohh, I resonate with this one, but is it so hard to see that the two are connected? If I am getting enough sex to satisfy me it is very easy to be casually intimate without thinking about more. If, on the other hand I am seriously deprived, its hard not to want every kiss to lead to something else.
> 
> Starve a dog for three weeks and then wave a steak under their nose and expect them just to take a whiff. Not likely.


*shrug*

Your choice.

Start to see her as more than a piece of ass, start to respect her for her mind, maybe she'll want more sex.


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## sscygni (Apr 13, 2016)

turnera said:


> *shrug*
> 
> Your choice.
> 
> Start to see her as more than a piece of ass, start to respect her for her mind, maybe she'll want more sex.


I don't disagree with that premise, all I am trying to say is that its a two way street. There are positive reinforcement loops and negative reinforcement loops.

You seem to be of the opinion that all responsibility for breaking a negative loop lies on the man. If the relationship is actually a partnership, both parties should be working to break the loop.

Oh, and she is a PhD Physics, respecting her mind is not something I have a problem with.


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## Marduk (Jul 16, 2010)

sscygni said:


> I don't disagree with that premise, all I am trying to say is that its a two way street. There are positive reinforcement loops and negative reinforcement loops.
> 
> You seem to be of the opinion that all responsibility for breaking a negative loop lies on the man. If the relationship is actually a partnership, both parties should be working to break the loop.
> 
> Oh, and she is a PhD Physics, respecting her mind is not something I have a problem with.


My wife and I had a conversation a few years back that was enlightening to us both.

She said something to the effect of "why can't we be like when we were dating, and we'd cuddle on the couch every Friday night watching a movie, and you'd hold me all the time, and all that mushy stuff?"

And I thought about it and thought it was totally a fair ask and agreed to do it more.

But I also added "you know, back when we were like that, we were also having sex multiple times a day all weekend long."

To which, she dutifully replied "well, if you'd do that, we'd probably have sex more."

And I added "and if we'd have sex more, I'd probably do that more."

We agreed it was a cycle, and to work on it. And we did and we do.


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## Marduk (Jul 16, 2010)

Of course, now that I reflect on that conversation, it was actually in context of her girlfriend complaining that her husband doesn't pay any attention to her at all any more.

And I pointed out that she started dropping hints and laughing about always denying him sex a few years back, and that probably has something to do with it.

If you want things to be like when you were dating, do the things you did when you were dating.


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## Capster (Jun 10, 2014)

turnera said:


> Finally, how much time do you spend just touching and cuddling, WITHOUT it leading to sex? I hear this one issue more often than any other issue women have - can't you just hug me without grabbing my ass? kind of thing. If you try to be more affectionate without 'wanting something,' I imagine you're going to find her much less critical over whether you're a perv...


You make it seem like it's always a master plan by the man to have sex. It is sometimes. But I admit that I am so into my wife lately, that any type of cuddling leads to me getting aroused. for instance, she loves getting her back scratched, and I enjoy doing it every night, but admittedly I get aroused every single time. So it would be very difficult, for me anyway, to cuddle like this with it not leading to some level of sexual desire, at least when in bed. But it's not some deviant plan to get into her pants. It just works out that way.


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## wantshelp (Mar 10, 2016)

turnera said:


> Finally, how much time do you spend just touching and cuddling, WITHOUT it leading to sex? I hear this one issue more often than any other issue women have - can't you just hug me without grabbing my ass? kind of thing. If you try to be more affectionate without 'wanting something,' I imagine you're going to find her much less critical over whether you're a perv. Try to remember what it was like when you were dating, happy to see each other, excited, butterflies...take her on dates, hug and cuddle, talk more and ask her about herself so she sees you are interested in more than just a vessel for sex...and things might change.





sscygni said:


> Ooohh, I resonate with this one, but is it so hard to see that the two are connected? If I am getting enough sex to satisfy me it is very easy to be casually intimate without thinking about more. If, on the other hand I am seriously deprived, its hard not to want every kiss to lead to something else.
> 
> Starve a dog for three weeks and then wave a steak under their nose and expect them just to take a whiff. Not likely.


This discussion really touches a nerve with me too. I agree with @sscygni. My wife is very LD. When I haven't had sex in 2 months, I can guarantee I am looking for any opening for physical affection. I think anyone expecting non-sexual touching and cuddling from their sex starved partner is completely unreasonable. If a partner wants non-sexual touching and cuddling, to me, that comes only after sexual desires are met. My wife knew that she was starving me of affection and sex and to avoid hurting me she would avoid any touching or affection so that she wouldn't get my hopes up for sex. This is our death spiral. I am somewhere at the end of the spiral where we don't have sex, touch or even talk much anymore.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

sscygni said:


> I don't disagree with that premise, all I am trying to say is that its a two way street. There are positive reinforcement loops and negative reinforcement loops.
> 
> You seem to be of the opinion that all responsibility for breaking a negative loop lies on the man. If the relationship is actually a partnership, both parties should be working to break the loop.
> 
> Oh, and she is a PhD Physics, respecting her mind is not something I have a problem with.


Again, I'm just telling you what the female psyche experiences. If you want to ignore that, feel free. And keep experiencing what you're still getting.

You are out of line saying that what I said gives all responsibility to the man. What I said was that you say it's 'hard' to just cuddle with her without grabbing her woman parts because, well, you're a man and you have needs, and I said well, then you get what you're getting. Women have to feel safe with their men, and they have to know that every touch from you isn't going to be a sexual one, because that's not how most women react positively. That's all.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Capster said:


> You make it seem like it's always a master plan by the man to have sex. It is sometimes. But I admit that I am so into my wife lately, that any type of cuddling leads to me getting aroused. for instance, she loves getting her back scratched, and I enjoy doing it every night, but admittedly I get aroused every single time. So it would be very difficult, for me anyway, to cuddle like this with it not leading to some level of sexual desire, at least when in bed. But it's not some deviant plan to get into her pants. It just works out that way.


I'm not telling you guys you're wrong to get aroused.

I'm telling you that if you want your wife to be fully on board with having sex, you should consider giving her SOME times with you when you control those urges and don't grab her boobs or her vagina. Men usually grow up thinking about how to score more sex and women usually grow up thinking about how to find a man who will romance her. 

There needs to be a place somewhere in between where you BOTH get some of what you want. I'm just saying, if you want her to not be 'on guard' all the time that you're going to grab at her, DON'T GRAB AT HER every time.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

wantshelp said:


> This discussion really touches a nerve with me too. I agree with @sscygni. My wife is very LD. When I haven't had sex in 2 months, I can guarantee I am looking for any opening for physical affection. I think anyone expecting non-sexual touching and cuddling from their sex starved partner is completely unreasonable. If a partner wants non-sexual touching and cuddling, to me, that comes only after sexual desires are met. My wife knew that she was starving me of affection and sex and to avoid hurting me she would avoid any touching or affection so that she wouldn't get my hopes up for sex. This is our death spiral. I am somewhere at the end of the spiral where we don't have sex, touch or even talk much anymore.


And this is where you make it clear that you won't stay in a relationship where she withholds the most important thing to you. You two should have great, open, honest communication so you both feel safe to say what you're feeling, without getting defensive. So I'd say work on that first.


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## sscygni (Apr 13, 2016)

turnera said:


> You are out of line saying that what I said gives all responsibility to the man. What I said was that you say it's 'hard' to just cuddle with her without grabbing her woman parts because, well, you're a man and you have needs, and I said well, then you get what you're getting. Women have to feel safe with their men, and they have to know that every touch from you isn't going to be a sexual one, because that's not how most women react positively. That's all.


Peace 0


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

Married but Happy said:


> Calling you names is an attempt to shame and control you, because her libido or comfort zone is less than yours. It's dishonest, manipulative, and unloving of her - but she may not even be conscious of her transgression.


how can you say that when you dont even know what it is he wants?
:surprise:


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## Maricha75 (May 8, 2012)

Diana7 said:


> how can you say that when you dont even know what it is he wants?
> :surprise:


But we do, now. He nailed it. Even I lean more toward what he said.
@Anon Pink would tell you I am one of the most sexually conservative women on this board. She might even go so far as to suggest that I am sexually repressed.  With that in mind, my leaning more toward what @Married but Happy said... I would say that might mean he's onto something.


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

As a PhD physics she should be able to understand the value of stockings and a garter belt... Surface Tension 

Seriously, it depends on how playful overall is she. As a husband of a PhD applied math I see little that tells me she appreciates the simple things in life.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

Maricha75 said:


> But we do, now. He nailed it. Even I lean more toward what he said.
> @Anon Pink would tell you I am one of the most sexually conservative women on this board. She might even go so far as to suggest that I am sexually repressed.  With that in mind, my leaning more toward what @Married but Happy said... I would say that might mean he's onto something.


what makes others think that you are sexually repressed?


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## Maricha75 (May 8, 2012)

Diana7 said:


> what makes others think that you are sexually repressed?


Just conversations on TAM, my views on certain subjects, different things I will not do, with or without my husband. None of which is important to the current thread. OP listed examples of things he would like to try, and I already gave my opinion on those. The only point I was making here is that given my views, known by many on here, Married but Happy's post was spot on... or close to it, at least.


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## *Deidre* (Feb 7, 2016)

Was this the case when you were dating her? In reading threads here at times, don't understand how couples go from having sex like bunnies, to once they're married...the wife is calling the husband, a pervert, but nothing has changed in terms of what the husband might like to do, sexually?


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Sonny said:


> Well first, poster above asked "What does it matter what we think?" well then why does this forum even exist? the purpose of a forum is people get a collective opinion or information on any range of topics in life.
> 
> Nothing I've done or suggested is too "out there" she was sunbathing in the back yard once and I took a picture of her from inside the house and texted her outside saying "Enjoying my view" her response: "Your a pervert?" really? because I enjoy looking at you???? I just left the house for the day.
> 
> ...


She honestly sounds repressed.

She obviously enjoys her erotic novels.

Does she have a strict or religious upbringing?

You are not a perv.

Christian here, with my wife almost 25 years with two adult children and we do a lot more than what you listed.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

Maricha75 said:


> But we do, now. He nailed it. Even I lean more toward what he said.
> @Anon Pink would tell you I am one of the most sexually conservative women on this board. She might even go so far as to suggest that I am sexually repressed.  With that in mind, my leaning more toward what @Married but Happy said... I would say that might mean he's onto something.


LOL! Yup, Maricha is conservative, IMO. In someone else's opinion she might be a tad freaky.

OP, when your wife calls you a pervert stand proud, puff out your chest and tell her that she's so hot even a monk would think lacivious thoughts around her. Embrace your pervert. Nurture your pervert. 

Perverts, unite and own our freak flag. No more shall we allow the pervert designation to imply that our dirty minds are somehow unnatural. The unnatural are those who lack the imagination and game to explore just how creative sex can be.


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## Fozzy (Jul 20, 2013)

Anon Pink said:


> LOL! Yup, Maricha is conservative, IMO. In someone else's opinion she might be a tad freaky.
> 
> OP, when your wife calls you a pervert stand proud, puff out your chest and tell her that she's so hot even a monk would think lacivious thoughts around her. Embrace your pervert. Nurture your pervert.
> 
> Perverts, unite and own our freak flag. No more shall we allow the pervert designation to imply that our dirty minds are somehow unnatural. The unnatural are those who lack the imagination and game to explore just how creative sex can be.


:smthumbup::iagree::toast::yay::allhail:


The "perv" accusation p!sses me off SO MUCH. But in the end, like so many insults, it says more about the other person more than it does you.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

ConanHub said:


> She honestly sounds repressed.
> 
> She obviously enjoys her erotic novels.
> 
> ...


*Committed loving Christians preeminently have the inate capability of being the sexiest, most 
incoragable people on earth!*
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Marc878 (Aug 26, 2015)

Sonny said:


> Well first, poster above asked "What does it matter what we think?" well then why does this forum even exist? the purpose of a forum is people get a collective opinion or information on any range of topics in life.
> 
> Nothing I've done or suggested is too "out there" she was sunbathing in the back yard once and I took a picture of her from inside the house and texted her outside saying "Enjoying my view" her response: "Your a pervert?" really? because I enjoy looking at you???? I just left the house for the day.
> 
> ...


Damn!!!! I just realized I'm a perverted pervert!!!!! >

Now I have to find something to blame it on. Hmmmmm


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## Marc878 (Aug 26, 2015)

Maricha75 said:


> @Sonny, really, it's the heels and slu++y outfits that I don't do. Never have. *Well, I tried wearing heels a long time ago, but it ended badly. I can't even stand up in them without twisting my ankle, now. Not worth risking a sprain or break, for either of us.* The outfits... again, not our thing. Mostly, it's the idea of spending so much money for so little fabric. 69 is very rare, but not out of the question. And going down on my husband after... never came up, so idk. Maybe I would, maybe not. But it isn't out of the question. I'm submissive to a point. If he were to say "I want you to do whatever I say", in a sexual situation, he would be met with "f*$# off". While I would be willing to do much of what he would want, I wouldn't do "whatever [he] says", either. But this is another thing he knows, so wouldn't request it, either.
> 
> But there are other things that some consider mainstream and we won't do. We have been married 16 years (next month), and our kids are 15, 9, and 7.
> 
> Honestly, reading the books to fall asleep isn't far-fetched. Unless there is a decent plot to the story... YAWN. The ones I have read have bored me. It got to the point where I actually would flip pages to get PAST the sex because it was that boring. My mom, actually, would read them to fall asleep, too.


Ahem, um well you really don't use heels in that situation to walk around in. :wink2:


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## CuddleBug (Nov 26, 2012)

Sonny said:


> Hi,
> 
> Actually looked up Webster definition of Pervert, Lecher etc. FAR too vague. I really have no issues with my wife but she has called me a pervert at times, we have sex and oral often enough but I always want to up the game and take it further. I don't know if it's allowed to post examples of what I mean, and what she's said here ad what I want to do. Maybe can pm with some people to see?



Try this on her:

- oiled foot job
- oiled breast job
- anal sex
- oral
- 69
- reverse cowgirl
- cowgirl
- spoon
- doggy
- frog doggy
- toys
- sweet syrup and whipped cream
- tie her to the bed blind folded

If this makes you a perv, she is LD.


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## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

CuddleBug said:


> Try this on her:
> 
> - oiled foot job
> - oiled breast job
> ...


How on earth does that make her Low Desire/Drive?


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## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

Ahem, what is frog doggy (for those who might want to know)?

Anal sex can be dangerous for the woman so I wouldn't classify that as a common sexual behavior. Actually, anal sex as a norm has become more popular in the last 30-40 years. It wasn't always considered appealing to men or women.


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## Maricha75 (May 8, 2012)

Marc878 said:


> Ahem, um well you really don't use heels in that situation to walk around in. :wink2:


Ahem. I already discussed this with marduk. At some point, I know I would stand up, forgetting I have them on. Again, not worth it *for either of us*. The only one who needs to agree is my husband (and he and I are the "us" I am talking about).


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## Maricha75 (May 8, 2012)

CuddleBug said:


> Try this on her:
> 
> - oiled foot job
> - oiled breast job
> ...


Utter nonsense. First of all, he already said 69 and oral are out, had you actually taken the time to read more in the thread. I asked him for examples. And, he said they DO have sex often. She is just not *adventurous*... Hell, half of this would not be done with my husband. So that means I am LD? Bullshyt.


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## LosingHim (Oct 20, 2015)

WonkyNinja said:


> It would depend upon what you want to do.
> 
> Tickling your lover from head to toe with a feather might by classed as kinky, perverted would be using a whole live chicken.


I laughed SO hard at this!!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LosingHim (Oct 20, 2015)

I don't think anything you've asked is perverted in the slightest, but I'm pretty open sexually. 

I'm not a huge fan of 69 because to me it's awkward, but my husband loves it so we do it often. 

I consider my husband a huge perv. I tell him all the time, but I say it in a joking way. I get out of the shower sometimes and he's staring. I'll cover myself in a joking way and say "no peeking Mr. Perv!" But I really don't think he's an actual pervert, he's just got a high drive and it's evident. He's told me before I'm the best sexual partner he's ever had, big reason being because of all of the different things we've tried. And nothing is too far out there, we just try to do things that keep it exciting.

The only things I can't do that my husband has asked for is 

#1) a strip tease. I just feel so stupid even trying it. I don't consider myself overtly sexy and trying to BE sexy while all eyes are on me just feels weird. 

#2) he's said he wants me to get down on all 4s and crawl across the floor all sexy like and then give him a Bj. I've tried so many times but I just end up laughing. Again - it's the not really viewing myself as an overly sexual being while all eyes are on me that I just can't do. I just feel silly doing it.

Those are my hang ups. It sounds like your wife just has some hang ups too.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Marc878 (Aug 26, 2015)

LosingHim said:


> I don't think anything you've asked is perverted in the slightest, but I'm pretty open sexually.
> 
> I'm not a huge fan of 69 because to me it's awkward, but my husband loves it so we do it often.
> 
> ...


#1 - beauty is in the eyes of the beholder. Women don't have to try very hard. The sexiness is there. But they just don't ever seem to get this.

They pick out that one self perceived flaw that isn't noticed and project it over their whole being. 

#2 - put a sock in your mouth and bite down hard til you get to your destination. Giggling is allowed here.


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## Marc878 (Aug 26, 2015)

Trying to figure this one out

Oral Sex

Is that when you talk about it ? :|


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Blondilocks said:


> Ahem, what is frog doggy (for those who might want to know)?
> 
> Anal sex can be dangerous for the woman so I wouldn't classify that as a common sexual behavior. Actually, anal sex as a norm has become more popular in the last 30-40 years. It wasn't always considered appealing to men or women.


My wife and I have no interest and never have. I love her enough that if she wanted it I would do my best but it would be her thing to orchestrate because I don't desire it. Fortunately, we are like minded.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

LosingHim said:


> I don't think anything you've asked is perverted in the slightest, but I'm pretty open sexually.
> 
> I'm not a huge fan of 69 because to me it's awkward, but my husband loves it so we do it often.
> 
> ...


Mrs. Conan has stripped for me. He doesn't want others to watch, does he??!??
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Bluesclues (Mar 30, 2016)

OP I don't think any of the things you want sound pervy either. Some of the hang ups other posters have are making laugh because I have some of them too.

I think taking a picture of her sunbathing is flattering. But then I would wonder if he is looking at it analyzing my flaws. I tend to point them out preemptively which is not cool. Learning how to take a compliment. 

69. Meh. Not my favorite. I can't concentrate on any good feelings because I am trying to do my job. 

FM heels. I am a clutz. My H has a picture of me wearing ridiculously talk heels in a store. I am literally hanging on to a counter to stay standing. But I like how I look in that picture - may revisit that one for not standing purposes. 

Strip tease. See above about being a clutz. My first marriage was sexless, my fault. We literally went years without. I tried to break out of it by doing a strip trease, had a sciatic nerve incident during, broke an ankle and threw my back out. Very sexy. 

My advice to you would be to stop asking and just do it. If I am asked "hey what do you think if you did xyz" I can find all the reasons in the world why something is a bad idea. If my H says "do X, now" well the odds are good I will, at least once. And you are already being told you are a perv and rejected - what do you have to lose?

My current H got me to have sex right in the middle of the front lawn one night. If he had thrown out the idea of that there is no way in heck ever that would happen - cul de sac neighborhood? What if the neighbors saw? Would they let their kids play with ours? What if the police were called? Not to mention my fear of ticks. Oh hell no. But he didn't ask, he just did, and so did I. Now will it happen again - probably not - but it is a great memory.


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## LosingHim (Oct 20, 2015)

Bluesclues said:


> OP I don't think any of the things you want sound pervy either. Some of the hang ups other posters have are making laugh because I have some of them too.
> 
> I think taking a picture of her sunbathing is flattering. But then I would wonder if he is looking at it analyzing my flaws. I tend to point them out preemptively which is not cool. Learning how to take a compliment.
> 
> ...


My husband loves sex in risky places. Some of our best bonding moments come when were sitting out by the fire pit in the back yard having a few beers and talking. We also have a pool. My husband has red hair so he tends not to stay out in the sun for long.

We have a six foot privacy fence, but we also have a nosy neighbor. He's a friend of ours, but he also just pops his head up over the fence constantly.

One night we were sitting by the fire and he talked me into having sex in one of the adirondack chairs. We had no sooner finished (it was around 1am) and neighbor popped his head up over the fence!

Last summer it was an especially hot day and I was in the pool. He came out and we were swimming. We ended up having sex on the pool steps. We no sooner finished and up pops the neighbors head over the fence! 

The neighbor has since moved, he and his wife divorced, but I'm looking forward to maybe being able to have some outdoor sex without worrying about Wilson popping his head over the fence!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LosingHim (Oct 20, 2015)

ConanHub said:


> Mrs. Conan has stripped for me. He doesn't want others to watch, does he??!??
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Lol no. At least not that I'm aware of!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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