# What makes people angry when they don't get sex?



## brownmale (Apr 20, 2015)

What makes people angry when they don't get sex? Is it just physical? Emotional? Or more complex than that?

(This is more true for men, I feel)


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## leon2100 (May 13, 2015)

I get angry because I'm only thinking about myself


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## badsanta (Oct 13, 2014)

brownmale said:


> What makes people angry when they don't get sex? Is it just physical? Emotional? Or more complex than that?
> 
> *(This is more true for men, I feel)*


Generally speaking men that do not get sex over compensate with porn and masturbation. While the human body can reasonably withstand masturbation, it was never designed to have unlimited internet porn which by all means (even us guys agree) is over stimulating. This causes our brain to deplete our available dopamine resources and results in a strong release of prolactin into our hormones to shut down our desire so that our bodies can recoup. The result is the following for males:

*Depleted dopamine: *One becomes oversensitive to things that are stressful or painful and drastically reduces patience to deal with normal everyday nuisances. 

*Excess Prolactin: *Decreased desire for sexual activity which makes women including your wife appear unappetizing. 

So men in this situation have a tendency to be irritable while at the same time also find their wives unappealing as the body resets itself which can take a few hours to two days depending on age a recent activities. 

Regards, 
Badsanta


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## MarriedDude (Jun 21, 2014)

brownmale said:


> What makes people angry when they don't get sex? Is it just physical? Emotional? Or more complex than that?
> 
> (This is more true for men, I feel)


I wouldn't say angry...frustrated maybe...depending on the situation. 

Medical condition...frustrating -but what are you gonna do -other than pray its temporary. 

Distance -temporary...frustrating -but temporary

Purposely denied sex for no other reason than being an asshat?...yep angry. But also starting the clock. I'm only gonna put up with that for so long before I'm out. 

To answer your question...the part that would make me angry would be the NO sex part.


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## Wolf1974 (Feb 19, 2014)

The physical aspect can be backed off a bit though masterbation. But over time that is never enough to replace the smells, tastes, and experience with a partner.


The emotional aspect hits far quicker for me. After a week or so I loose the feeling for connection with my partner. 

So they are both can make me upset, sad, even angry i suppose if purposely being withheld but the emotional hits me first


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## committed_guy (Nov 22, 2011)

brownmale said:


> What makes people angry when they don't get sex? Is it just physical? Emotional? Or more complex than that?
> 
> (This is more true for men, I feel)


To me sex represented the culmination of our love, physically and spiritually. My wife was saying not to that constantly. At the same time telling me she loved me, and that my hurt was invalid.


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## AlphaMale74 (Oct 15, 2014)

The Real Reason Why Men Want to Have Sex: https://youtu.be/dOKjrwio1Bw


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## stevehowefan (Apr 3, 2013)

I got upset and whiny because for me it was emotional. My wife wasn't interested in sex, hugging, kissing, or being close to me. Mind you, she would have sex, but she didn't want to have sex. So in that sense I was lucky. My physical needs were met, somewhat, but my emotional needs were definitely not. I whined and complained, told her I wished she understood. That, in turn, turned her off even more.


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## Noble1 (Oct 25, 2013)

For me, its the reason why there is no sex.

Like others said, if its medical, understandable, etc. its a bit easier to get over.

If its emotional/physical blackmail it just makes me feel empty.

(and a bit used as well...good enough to work and provide but not good enough to want to please)

((for me I do understand a bit why my wife can't/won't....but its getting harder and harder to give her a pass))


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## Kristisha (Apr 29, 2013)

Even for medical it's really hard because you need to feel intimate with the one you love. Especially when it's over a long period of time..


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

AlphaMale74 said:


> The Real Reason Why Men Want to Have Sex: https://youtu.be/dOKjrwio1Bw


This was cute for like, church moms.

(Nothing against church moms).

But it really has a lot of stereo types in it that if you don't already believe them, just sound stupid. The speaker is saying "women think this" and "men think that" as if we are all the same, and that is something we need to stop doing in general. We need to say "some men/women think this". Because there are large groups of men and women who DO think exactly like this speaker....but those of us who don't and never have thought like that just think she sounds ignorant...because she acts as if she can speak for all women. She also says "sex to him is like conversation to her" which is VERY stupid to state as if every man and woman would agree with that.

But...

For a church mom who did hold those stereo types, it was cute.


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## CuddleBug (Nov 26, 2012)

brownmale said:


> What makes people angry when they don't get sex? Is it just physical? Emotional? Or more complex than that?
> 
> (This is more true for men, I feel)



When I really get in the mood and Mrs.CuddleBug usually never is, all the excuses a LD can make, yep, I get angry. She isn't there for me and taking care of my needs as her own.

So if its really bad, I just relieve myself using a sex toy and its done and over with. I don't crave or think about sex for a while then.

No need to be sexually starved going stir crazy.


Is sex emotional to me? Yes.

Sex to me is physical and emotional. That bond a hubby and wife share. I love and need it all.


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## Holland (Aug 20, 2012)

brownmale said:


> What makes people angry when they don't get sex? Is it just physical? Emotional? Or more complex than that?
> 
> *(This is more true for men, I feel)*


Stop with the unfounded gender stereotypes firstly. If you want to get anywhere it might help to learn a little bit more about women.

I start to get a little pissed off at about day 3, I can maintain my composure for the most part but if something or someone annoys me then I can lose it pretty quickly. It is something I have had to learn to keep under control and turn it into humor instead.

As to the why? No real idea, for me I think it is the sexual release valve needing to be let off. It is not emotional, I can get emotional connection through simply talking on the phone. So for me it is all about sexual frustration that leads to anger.

But going solo does not really fill the void so there must be a physical connection component in there as well.


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## thread the needle (May 4, 2015)

Because your spouse knows the only choice you have instead of putting up with their utter lack of concern for your needs is to give up half your **** and miss out on your kids growing up when you dump them on their ass as you are forced to find a mate that is more sensitive to your needs and reasonable expectations to be intimate with your spouse as the understanding was not to be room mates but life long lovers. 

If they have a problem with being a lover then they are obligated to figure it out for the sake or fairness and for the sake of the success of the marriage and self respect for doing their best at what they signed up for. Since they are not and your other options are also of monumental pain and loss, it is infuriating they don't give a damn to resolve the matter and in the mean time make the very best effort to meet as close to the middle ground as is humanly possible until it gets figured out. 

When someone takes full advantage having you over a barrel of $hit, it's infuriating blackmail


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## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

There are billions of women who don't give me sex. I only get upset with one, probably because only one occupies the position of "wife" in my life. Only one finds it is within her purview to decide whether or not I get to be a fully functioning human being. If her refusal came with divorce papers I would have no problem with it. My problem is that she expects 100% faithful performance from me and 100% loyalty from me while being perhaps 5% of a wife.


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## Hopeful Cynic (Apr 27, 2014)

I don't know why, but this thread gave me an epiphany.

Lots of readers are angry about how long it takes George R.R. Martin to write his Game of Thrones books. Readers get angry when he blogs about football, attends SF conferences or edits some anthology instead of working on the next book. Readers even get mad because they think he's unhealthy and might DIE before finishing the series.

Reading other books is not as enjoyable as reading his. Only George R.R. Martin can write like George R. R. Martin. Re-reading his books is not the same as reading a brand new one when you don't know what shocking thing is about to happen. People get excited about posted publication dates, and then angry when they are pushed back. He started writing the series; his fans feel that he owes it to them to finish it.

Not getting the next book when you want it is just like not getting sex from your spouse! Only your spouse can have sex with you, no one else. Your spouse promises sex, and then postpones. Your spouse married you, but then won't uphold what you feel is part of that commitment.

Neil Gaiman's Journal: Entitlement issues...


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## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

I think with very few exceptions, those who serially withhold sex would also be the ones to scream the loudest if their alleged mates went outside the marriage for sex of affection. Can't have it both ways. An expectation for sexual fidelity comes with the understanding that there will be reasonable sexual performance.


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## where_are_we (May 24, 2013)

Physical and emotional.

Frustrated that you can't have the contact.

Hurt because they don't want you.


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## richardsharpe (Jul 8, 2014)

Good evening
For me the problem is the rejection and the feeling that she must be very selfish to not be happy to do this.

Maybe it is also because it is evidence that she is not what I imagine her to be.


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## brownmale (Apr 20, 2015)

Wolf1974 said:


> The physical aspect can be backed off a bit though masterbation. But over time that is never enough to replace the smells, tastes, and experience with a partner.


It's also the prostrate massage a guy gets from PIV sex. Masturbation can't substitute that. Besides, as you rightly point out, nothing beats the sexual act WITH a living, human partner with emotions. 

For that matter, even if she shows little emotion, I'd anyday prefer it to masturbation.

The only time when masturbation takes an upper hand is when her drama gets simply too much, along with repeated rejections...



Wolf1974 said:


> The emotional aspect hits far quicker for me. After a week or so I loose the feeling for connection with my partner.
> So they are both can make me upset, sad, even angry i suppose if purposely being withheld but the emotional hits me first


The other thing that really hurts is when she expects me to fulfil all my duties -- as daddy, financial provider, solution provider to any and all problems, etc -- and won't do the job she's the only woman (or person) who can do for me in the world, without pushing me into guilt, cheating or shame.


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## brownmale (Apr 20, 2015)

committed_guy said:


> To me sex represented the culmination of our love, physically and spiritually. My wife was saying not to that constantly. At the same time telling me she loved me, and that my hurt was invalid.


So did you accept the argument that your hurt was invalid?


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## southbound (Oct 31, 2010)

i wouldn't call it angry, but it was often very frustrating when I was married. I think one thing is the casualness with which I was often turned down. I could be on fire, but with her it was no big deal to turn it away. It was with the same attitude as not taking any mashed potatoes as they are passed around the table; no big deal.


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## askari (Jun 21, 2012)

I think when we get married we all think it will be easy....sex on tap as it were.
Of course you still have date nights, buy her flowers etc she may cook you dinner etc....you kinda fall into a nice comfortable routine that you are both happy with.
She gets what is important to her and he gets what is important to him.

One of the things that is far more important to him than her is sex. Its what makes us men!

Being rejected hurts. It is a bash to our ego. When our spouse says 'darling, not tonight, I'm tired', we hear 'I don't want to have sex with you'.
Some men get angry when they get rejected, some sulk.

If we get rejected more and more I think most men just get despondent and switch off.

You know if you put your hand in a flame its going to hurt, so you don't do it.
You know if you try to ask for or instigate sex with your spouse you will get turned down, it will hurt so you stop asking.

When she instigates you jump at the opportunity....then after a time you start thinking 'Hang on...whenever SHE wants it she gets it, yet when I want it I don't. I'm being taken for an idiot'.

At that point many mens pride kicks in and they start rejecting their spouses. I know I will get bashed for this, but I think alot of men think sex with their wife is a fundemental right - not legally but in an animalistic way. When we are denied it we eventually give up.

Men who are only getting bread and water at home are far more likely to be tempted by a hamburger outside the home....


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## ericthesane (May 10, 2013)

It is not getting sex that makes you angry.

That, and sad, and frustrated, and doubtful and it saps you of energy and initiative and self worth in almost any other area of life. You become a worse parent, a more difficult colleague, a terrible spouse, and acting out in all manner of negative ways.

The refusing spouse does not see the connection between A and B very often.

I have personally given up asking. I am done. I will leave and in the process of getting organized to do so and if all goes well, it may be that I will be out on or about the 4 year anniversary of our last intimate day. The logistics is quite challenging. It is not a new story; these things happen every day, and the experiences I have are retold often here on TAM and other similar fora.


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## UMP (Dec 23, 2014)

Imagine never being able to scratch an itch.
That would eventually make me angry.
Same as back pain. After days and days and days of back pain, unable to find relief no matter what position you find yourself in, anger results.
I find lack of sex no different.


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## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

In what other aspect of an adult's life is one free to do only what they want on the days they feel like it? Every other vow, contract, or relationship I've been in since I was 18 expected specific performance regardless of how I felt. Do you feed your kids only when they bring home straight "A"s on their report card? Does your wife get fed and medical care only on the days you are thrilled with her? 
What frustrates many people, I think, is that marriage is no longer a commitment at all. I've been told right here on this forum by a number of people that I have no right to expect any performance of any kind from my wife. A relationship wherein couples are free to do or not do as they happen to please isn't a marriage and it requires no vows or legal paperwork. That is what we would call "shacking up".


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## Wolf1974 (Feb 19, 2014)

unbelievable said:


> In what other aspect of an adult's life is one free to do only what they want on the days they feel like it? Every other vow, contract, or relationship I've been in since I was 18 expected specific performance regardless of how I felt. Do you feed your kids only when they bring home straight "A"s on their report card? Does your wife get fed and medical care only on the days you are thrilled with her?
> What frustrates many people, I think, is that marriage is no longer a commitment at all. I've been told right here on this forum by a number of people that I have no right to expect any performance of any kind from my wife. A relationship wherein couples are free to do or not do as they happen to please isn't a marriage and it requires no vows or legal paperwork. That is what we would call "*shacking* up".


Yep that's what I do :smthumbup:


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## Purple Cat (Dec 6, 2012)

For me, it is not anger but frustration and disappointment. Just last weekend we had a date night where both kids were spending the night at friends or grandma. My wife has been busy with school but had just finished for the semester. I was thinking all week that we would have sex. After I cooked dinner (her requested meal), a nice walk, cuddling during a movie, and me giving her a 30 min massage, I tried to initiate but was turned down and was asked if we could try in the morning. 

Next morning she was still tired and wanted to sleep until we had to get the kids. 

I guess I was a little short later in the day and she wondered where the attitude came from. 

I was not mad but disappointed and frustrated. I think it is worse when I anticipate something will happen and get my hopes up.


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## Melvynman (Mar 19, 2014)

brownmale said:


> What makes people angry when they don't get sex? Is it just physical? Emotional? Or more complex than that?
> 
> (This is more true for men, I feel)


Yes it is far more complex than that! 

"Make love not war" is truly a better solution! 

Modern day examples of just how complex this issue is. Women in the middle east sexuality has been completely controlled by men for thousands of years. How long has the fighting been going on? Are the people sexually frustrated and for how long? 

American conservative politics is dominated by sexual freedom issue. Congress passes laws about female reproductive rights before doing anything else! They are also the first to want to go to war in the middle east. Are conservative sexually frustrated and want war? 

When a gunmen shoots and kills innocent people. Do we ask when was the last time he had sex and bonded with someone? 

Sexually frustrated people are very dangerous and sexually frustrated societies love war!


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## ocotillo (Oct 17, 2011)

brownmale said:


> What makes people angry when they don't get sex? Is it just physical? Emotional? Or more complex than that?


Why do tempers get short when people are sleep deprived?

Why do tempers get short when people are hungry?

Why do tempers get short when people are thirsty?

Why do tempers get short when it's uncomfortably hot?

Why do tempers get short when a caffeine or nicotine or some other dependency goes unmet?

Do these questions need to be answered? :smile2:


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## BostonBruins32 (Nov 2, 2013)

Back when I used to initiate and get rejected, the anger/frustration I think came from a beat down on the self esteem. The actual physical part never made me angry, as in theory I could resolve that myself. So for example, when I was single, I would try to find a partner for sex, but if i couldnt, no big deal.

As for when you are in a relationship, I think some of us unfortunately fall into the trap of expectations. "If are married to me, you must be willing to(with some form of regularity) have sex with me." This expectation may be unreasonable in a a relationship. So when your expectations aren't met, you get emotionally angry/frustrated. This goes for any type of expectation (job you're applying for, etc..)


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

Anger is a wonderful motivator - to do great things or silly things.


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## Fozzy (Jul 20, 2013)

BostonBruins32 said:


> Back when I used to initiate and get rejected, the anger/frustration I think came from a beat down on the self esteem. The actual physical part never made me angry, as in theory I could resolve that myself. So for example, when I was single, I would try to find a partner for sex, but if i couldnt, no big deal.
> 
> As for when you are in a relationship, I think some of us unfortunately fall into the trap of expectations. "If are married to me, you must be willing to(with some form of regularity) have sex with me." This expectation may be unreasonable in a a relationship. So when your expectations aren't met, you get emotionally angry/frustrated. This goes for any type of expectation (job you're applying for, etc..)


This is exactly correct. Expectations only set your partner up for failure.


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

Actually it's better than that. I think in many cases the LD's are using sex - or lack thereof - as a tool for their own purposes. Decouple sex and you're in control. 

Don't get me wrong, it's not like I don't want a meaningful intimate life but take sex out of the picture and the relationship gets a whole lot more clarity. I wish it wasn't like that but it is.


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## Tulanian (Feb 23, 2013)

I don't think you can describe a "why" that would apply to all people being refused sex. Everybody is different, all relationships are different. What we're left with is our own experiences, and trying to relate those to what others experience.

For myself, what made me angry was this feeling of utter rejection. That was one thing we got right in the early years. She was always very enthusiastic, actually wanted me. In fact, for years her libido was higher than mine. We had dry spells, but often they were my fault. 

We were together for 20 years, but things really started to fracture, permanently, around 2007. We were more distant, less communicative, less open, had less sex. We went a year with no contact, then started reconnecting...which was when my son wound up spending a week in a mental hospital. After that, he was our sole focus, not each other. We spent two years trying to get him diagnosed and treated. Ultimately, we went two years without sex, and it was...too much. I tried to initiate once, and she told me to go get a prostitute. I felt completely unloved, and unlovable. Sh was supposed to be the ONE person in the world in who's eyes I was okay. She was supposed to be the one who wanted me. She stopped being that (for reasons that are my fault to a very large degree).

I left when I found myself emotionally cheating, even thinking I was in love with another woman. I KNEW that I WOULD cheat physically, and that is unacceptable to me. My dad did that. My uncles did that. I absolutely WON'T do that. So I left.

I left after spending my youth, and my attractiveness, on that one relationship. I used to be thin, and reasonably handsome. Now I'm old, and fat, or at least that's how I feel. The kind of women who are attracted to someone like me have no appeal for me.

Yeah...sorry for being so damn cheerful.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

An accidental overdose of gamma radiation???
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

I tend not to believe that most people are emotionally stupid or autistic. Any functional person has a pretty good idea of what their behavior does to the people close to them. They sense well that there are boundaries to what you can say and do and get away scott-free. People who claim to be blind to this are really just being indifferent or, cruel.


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## ocotillo (Oct 17, 2011)

BostonBruins32 said:


> This goes for any type of expectation (job you're applying for, etc..)


I'm going to disagree with the comparison. A *prospective* employer is under no obligation to say, "yes" and that would certainly be a very unreasonable expectation on the part of the applicant. However if they do chose to enter into that formal relationship, then they are going to have to conform to certain basic ethical principles. For example, it's not only unethical, it's illegal for an employer to enjoy the benefits of compensating you on an overtime exempt basis while at the same time, docking you for absences of a day or more when you are both able to work and willing to work. 

I'm not comparing marriage to employment (That's crass...) but it is a formal human relationship that we enter into voluntarily and like all human relationships, it is based on a set of ethical principles.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

thread the needle said:


> Because your spouse knows the only choice you have instead of putting up with their utter lack of concern for your needs is to give up half your ****


:scratchhead: And here I thought it was because men feel love and give love through sex mostly. So when the sex is not there, their feel-good, in-love hormones drop so low that they start to feel miserable. they want to reconnect and be all lovey and feel good.

The only reason a man objects to low sex is because cannot get it elsewhere. So if the wife tells him to go get sex from someone else, he'd be happy?


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Fitnessfan said:


> It makes me angry because I have so much to give and the only person I want to give it to isn't taking. I can't get that wonderful feeling from anyone else so it makes me angry that he is unable or unwilling and I am left with only with either unhappy or immoral choices.


:iagree: This is why I would get angry when sex was withhold. 

During sex our feel-good and connection hormones are produced in up-taken in large amounts. It feels good emotionally and physically. The more we give sexually to our spouse, the more we get in return.

It' s a wonderful feedback loop between two people .. when it's love making. (when it's just sex that feed-back look gets broken).

When the feel-good hormones drop off, we start to feel bad, upset, even angry.

IF rejected a lot, well we feel rejected and unloved. And that makes a person feel bad, angry, etc.


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

Physical intamacy is the way I feel loved and connected to my wife. If withheld, I start feeling disconnected and unloved. "She would not withhold herself unless she does not love me or want to be connected/close to me." 

She becomes a room mate. I do not feel lovey/dovey toward room mates. I shut down emotionally to protect my feelings...she becomes an adversary so to speak. I become closed off/emotionally unavailable. 

She may continue to say " I love you" but her actions are far louder. I may say it back, but what I think is "Yeah Right.....What ever"

One day I got to the FU point and the oneitus changed. I no longer felt the deep deep emotional love for her. Quit basing my value on her perception of me and our marriage. Lost 65 lbs in 2 months, buffed out and started detaching some/aloof.

Scared the **** out of her.....good!
Told her one night I would divorce over a sex less marriage as I feel it is infadelity to the marriage and a violation of biblical marriage vows.


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

Some may not believe this. I don't care. Here it is. Yes, I was denied sex many times. The only things that made me angry about being denied were these:

1. No with not even a hint of an explanation.

2. Repeated No's without a hint of an explanation and some talking out an issue(s).

3. No repeatedly and complaining if I took care of things myself.

4. No and then after I took care of things myself, her mind changed and she was angry because I believed her No and took responsibility for my own happiness. 

Yes, all of these things happened to me in either one or both marriages.


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## BostonBruins32 (Nov 2, 2013)

ocotillo said:


> I'm going to disagree with the comparison. A *prospective* employer is under no obligation to say, "yes" and that would certainly be a very unreasonable expectation on the part of the applicant. However if they do chose to enter into that formal relationship, then they are going to have to conform to certain basic ethical principles. For example, it's not only unethical, it's illegal for an employer to enjoy the benefits of compensating you on an overtime exempt basis while at the same time, docking you for absences of a day or more when you are both able to work and willing to work.
> 
> I'm not comparing marriage to employment (That's crass...) but it is a formal human relationship that we enter into voluntarily and like all human relationships, it is based on a set of ethical principles.


But unless you specifically said pre marriage "x amount times per week" and agreed up on it, then the expectation is misaligned. 

Essentially 1 time ever 5 years could be enough for one spouse and not enough for the other(and could be considered ethical and truly an adequate rate for one spouse in the marriage). If one expects once every 5 years and the other expects once a week, then you have an expectation issue.


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## joannacroc (Dec 17, 2014)

Fozzy said:


> This is exactly correct. Expectations only set your partner up for failure.


This. I learned a lot from my failed marriage, not least don't marry a cheating scumbag, but perhaps more importantly, that being with someone who doesn't share your level of desire is an obstacle. Not necessarily one that can't be overcome if the willingness to work on things is there, but an obstacle nonetheless. Expecting your partner to be someone they're not is an exercise in futility and only leads to pain for everyone involved.


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## Fozzy (Jul 20, 2013)

Divinely Favored said:


> Physical intamacy is the way I feel loved and connected to my wife. If withheld, I start feeling disconnected and unloved. "She would not withhold herself unless she does not love me or want to be connected/close to me."
> 
> She becomes a room mate. I do not feel lovey/dovey toward room mates. I shut down emotionally to protect my feelings...she becomes an adversary so to speak. I become closed off/emotionally unavailable.
> 
> ...


65 pounds in 2 months?? Sounds like rage-fueled weight loss. Been there, done that. The problem I have is I need to maintain some level of rage to keep the weight off


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## ocotillo (Oct 17, 2011)

BostonBruins32 said:


> But unless you specifically said pre marriage "x amount times per week" and agreed up on it, then the expectation is misaligned.


I would agree that things like frequency must be mutually agreed upon, but I don't think that invalidates the idea that sex is a reasonable expectation in marriage. 

Marriages in the Judeo-Christian tradition usually involve a vow of fidelity and our acceptance of that vow is not free of consequence. If, as a prerequisite of marriage, our spouse had to take a solemn vow to only ever eat food that we personally provided, they would be in a real pickle if we refused to honor the ethical corollary to that vow because their options would be reduced to starving, breaking the vow or asking to be released from it. 

I understand that food and sex are not identical equivalents; that severe lack of food will eventually kill you while severe lack of sex will only make you miserable. I'm not drawing an analogy here, I'm simply using food as an example to illustrate an ethical principle that is no less real even if nobody dies. :smile2:

The point here is that our spouse, in good faith places their trust in us. Turning our back on them after that fact would therefore be an extraordinary display of bad faith. 





BostonBruins32 said:


> Essentially 1 time ever 5 years could be enough for one spouse and not enough for the other(and could be considered ethical and truly an adequate rate for one spouse in the marriage). If one expects once every 5 years and the other expects once a week, then you have an expectation issue.


In a _relationship_ needs are usually defined by the person who is in need. Our own lack of need is not a need unto itself and it would be a contradiction in terms to attempt to define it that way. (Although I've seen some creative attempts....)

In other words, it's neither here nor there if we're perfectly happy going a week without speaking to our spouse. (Or five years without sex.) There is nothing ethical about it if it hurts them.


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## Kristisha (Apr 29, 2013)

Fozzy said:


> 65 pounds in 2 months?? Sounds like rage-fueled weight loss. Been there, done that. The problem I have is I need to maintain some level of rage to keep the weight off


What I found is that it's easier to lose a big amount of weight that keep it off. You have to work out twice as hard and very careful with what you eat


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