# The Drama Triangle



## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

The Drama Triangle

It's a good read, if you're interested. It's helping me a lot.


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## Phenix70 (May 6, 2012)

Using the Emotion Diamond to escape my own family Drama Triangle has been the greatest feeling in the world.
Once someone gets to the point where they no longer will participate in the dysfunction that masquerades as a family, it's the most empowered one can feel after a lifetime of insanity.


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

With my husband, I'm working on removing myself from the Triangle. I am usually the bad guy or rescuer. He is the victim and when I am the bad guy, he is the rescuer. Oye. 

I am learning to just say what I feel/my truth and stick with it. Even if it makes me feel bad for hurting his feelings.

But he's very good at trying to suck me back in. Oh lordy. That's what I'm dealing with now.


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## Phenix70 (May 6, 2012)

that_girl said:


> With my husband, I'm working on removing myself from the Triangle. I am usually the bad guy or rescuer. He is the victim and when I am the bad guy, he is the rescuer. Oye.
> 
> *I am learning to just say what I feel/my truth and stick with it. Even if it makes me feel bad for hurting his feelings.*
> 
> But he's very good at trying to suck me back in. Oh lordy. That's what I'm dealing with now.


I think this is key to getting to a healthy place.
It can be difficult when you're the only one getting help, if your H isn't also working on his issues, it can start to feel like an up hill battle.
As they say in AA, keep working the program, it works!


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

Yes. He is all talk. Big say of what he's "gunna do", not a lot of action...if at all. That's FINE but I don't have to tolerate it. I won't nag him to call doctors or therapists. He was in therapy, stopped that. Ok. Shows me what he is capable of. 

I know it's hard to look inside and deal. I've been there and been growing since.

I'll need to have a conversation with him soon. He's under the impression (because I said I'd think about it) of working things out.

It just simply can't happen. I realized I was being the rescuer...not wanting to hurt him or let him get hurt because I do know his issues. But....I gotta take care of me first.


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## Phenix70 (May 6, 2012)

that_girl said:


> Yes. He is all talk. Big say of what he's "gunna do", not a lot of action...if at all. That's FINE but I don't have to tolerate it. I won't nag him to call doctors or therapists. He was in therapy, stopped that. Ok. Shows me what he is capable of.
> 
> I know it's hard to look inside and deal. I've been there and been growing since.
> 
> ...


Amen!
Getting away from this dynamic is similar to learning the Power of Saying No, without apology.
I think for women, we're the ones who are "encouraged" to keep the peace at any cost.
That often means not standing up for ourselves, not saying no, or apologizing when we do stand up for ourselves.
The power of being able to say no without apology means we're free to express our true feelings with no guilt & to me that's the ultimate in being healthy.
Let the guilt go, stand up for yourself & those who can't deal, will be left behind, even if it is a spouse.


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

Yea. I truly believe I'm done. It's a weird place to be. I love him and wish him well, but....I'm done trying to save someone who has no intention of doing the work.

It's not my job.

I want to be LOVED. Not just kept around because I fill needs. I want to be loved for being ME...without needing anything from me at all.


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## Phenix70 (May 6, 2012)

that_girl said:


> *Yea. I truly believe I'm done. It's a weird place to be.* I love him and wish him well, but....I'm done trying to save someone who has no intention of doing the work.
> 
> It's not my job.
> 
> I want to be LOVED. Not just kept around because I fill needs. I want to be loved for being ME...without needing anything from me at all.


You know you're done when you can think of him & not feel anything more than wanting the best for him.
The anger is gone, as is the romantic love & the dread of "what is going to happen today?"
Does it feel like relief, an almost eagerness to move on? 
That's when I knew I was done with my past dysfunctional relationships.


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## Cosmos (May 4, 2012)

I first heard about the drama triangle back in the 70s, and it's really useful to see how this plays out in dysfunctional relationships!

Good link!


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

Yes. I love him. I want him the best for him. But I see him as any family member. A bond to where I will help in times of trouble, but that's about it. I have lost "it". I had "it" for a long time with him. But I think after this 2nd time of him just telling me HE'S done...I learned that 1) I'm ok on my own and 2) I quite like it.

He's been around a lot lately...and I'm at the point where I just need him to go. It's hard to navigate with kids but, it can be done. I don't mind him coming over a few times a week and hanging out....I don't hate the man. 

But I'm done. I'm ready to begin my life.


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## Phenix70 (May 6, 2012)

that_girl said:


> Yes. I love him. I want him the best for him. But I see him as any family member. A bond to where I will help in times of trouble, but that's about it. I have lost "it". I had "it" for a long time with him. But I think after this 2nd time of him just telling me HE'S done...I learned that 1) I'm ok on my own and 2) I quite like it.
> 
> He's been around a lot lately...and I'm at the point where I just need him to go. It's hard to navigate with kids but, it can be done. I don't mind him coming over a few times a week and hanging out....I don't hate the man.
> 
> But I'm done. I'm ready to begin my life.


You sound like you're in a really good place, a very good place actually.
I especially like that you stated you don't hate him, as I'm sure there are people who wonder how you can't.
Those are the ones who don't understand your situation, or they have not moved on to a healthy dynamic of their own.
Stick to your guns, you know what you need, you are getting better everyday, it's too bad he was not able to as well. 
Wishing you the best!!


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

Thank you 

I am in a good place. I felt myself sliding back recently and caught myself...understanding the dynamics now and where I DON'T want to be.

I don't hate him. I understand him and have compassion. Maybe too much at times. He's doing nothing TO me...it's just happening AROUND me. His issues are his own and they are rough. Who am I to judge?

I just have to remove myself from it. Which is what I need to do...the conversation has to happen soon. By Tuesday.


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## Cosmos (May 4, 2012)

I also found this rather interesting, because it shows how differently men and women have been taught to respond to anger:-
_
"If you have been taught, as men in particular have been taught, that fear and sadness are bad, anger is probably the only emotion that you will experience. If you have also been taught that anger
is bad, you will suppress that as well and begin to behave with passive aggression. Unable to directly express anger, you will seek indirect covert ways of expressing it. Because most women
have been taught that anger is bad, women shut down on anger and either turn it against themselves or become victims of everyone else's anger."_


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

Yes. There was another part in there talking about growing up in chaos...you're basically numb. You don't know what you feel and you can't express it at all. You only know if it wasn't for -fill in the blank to blame- you wouldn't be where you are.

I am only where I am because I choose to be there. If I want a different path, I choose it. I used to blame. My dad, my mom, my past lovers...I get it. Takes the focus off of yourself. People want to help you...save you.

I learned to save myself. He, on the other hand, is still a victim. Waiting for me to rescue him and when I don't...he will blame. I will be the persecutor. 

It said you MUST be the persecutor in order to escape the triangle. You must be willing to take on that role and BE OK with it. Accept it and KNOW YOUR BOUNDARIES. So I have to get stronger before I'm "the bad guy" for saying no to him wanting to work things out. Something hit me when I askd why he wanted to work it out and he said, "Because you're awesome. *You take good care of me. This is the best home I've ever had."*

While that is super sweet, his reason was NOT ABOUT ME. Not about me a'tall. It is about HIM and his needs and his need to have a home and comfort which I so want him to have, knowing his story. But...I want to be LOVED. Not just take care of someone. I dunno. Those words spoke wonders to me.



I won't bring up the past...but I'm sure he'll one day realize that you can't leave someone twice and say certain things to someone without smashing a part of them that once burned brightly for you. 

I'm done. Feels good.


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

Cosmos said:


> I first heard about the drama triangle back in the 70s, and it's really useful to see how this plays out in dysfunctional relationships!
> 
> Good link!


I first heard of The Drama Triangle from another poster here on TAM, but I am very familiar with the dynamic. I have seen it at work in many dysfunctional relationships, and even some seemingly " normal" relationships.

But one of my personal mantras is a quotation by Albert Einstein that goes like this:
*" No problem can be solved using the same level of consciousness that created it.."*

So I perfectly understood the Drama Triangle concept the first time I saw it. I just never knew there was a name other than dysfunctional for it.
The first concept of it I saw was from a psychologist called Stephen Karpman.
I tried to share it with a poster here who complained of the same type of dynamic in his marriage , but he never responded.

It is a very empowering theory if understood properly and put into use.


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

Yes. Already, I am seeing myself backslide into the role I once played...with him. A role I no longer want. This time I am stopping it.

I cannot fix this. More importantly, I do not want to fix it. 

I don't know the future. I don't know what will happen...I do know that this divorce will go through and then life will be what it is.


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## Phenix70 (May 6, 2012)

that_girl said:


> Yes. There was another part in there talking about growing up in chaos...you're basically numb. You don't know what you feel and you can't express it at all. You only know if it wasn't for -fill in the blank to blame- you wouldn't be where you are.
> 
> *I am only where I am because I choose to be there. If I want a different path, I choose it. I used to blame. My dad, my mom, my past lovers...I get it. Takes the focus off of yourself. People want to help you...save you.
> 
> ...


:smthumbup::smthumbup::allhail:


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

that_girl said:


> Yes. Already, I am seeing myself backslide into the role I once played...with him. A role I no longer want. This time I am stopping it.
> 
> I cannot fix this. More importantly, I do not want to fix it.
> 
> I don't know the future. I don't know what will happen...I do know that this divorce will go through and then life will be what it is.


It's just looking at the problem from a _different perspective_ in spite of how you feel about the problem / person.
You must know that you have done all that you can humanly do.

This takes a certain level of self awareness and confidence.


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

Positive Triangle

A friend just sent me this. I love it. It's what I want in a mate. Never settling for less.

Yes, I have done all that is possible. I have worked through so much regarding him and this marriage...and myself.

I feel good saying I'm done. I feel I've done everything except let the cycle repeat a 3rd time.


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

that_girl said:


> Positive Triangle
> 
> A friend just sent me this. I love it. It's what I want in a mate. Never settling for less.
> 
> ...


Good stuff.
I'll do some research on it.

Thanks for the link!


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

I just love the idea of Creator and Challenger and Coach.

I mean, that will create a brilliant life.


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

I haven't read everything as yet, but if the same principle stands,
Then the positions of Creator, Challenger and Coach would be interchangeable at any point or position in the relationship

It completes the purpose of relationships , because everyone in the relationships contributes positively and nobody see's themselves as victim or prosecutor.

Completely different relationship dynamic. 
Different approach to problem solving.


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## Cosmos (May 4, 2012)

that_girl said:


> Yes. There was another part in there talking about growing up in chaos...you're basically numb. You don't know what you feel and you can't express it at all. You only know if it wasn't for -fill in the blank to blame- you wouldn't be where you are.
> 
> I am only where I am because I choose to be there. If I want a different path, I choose it. I used to blame. My dad, my mom, my past lovers...I get it. Takes the focus off of yourself. People want to help you...save you.
> 
> ...


It sounds like you've got a good handle on the dynamics of your relationship. A book I read around the same time as learning about the drama triangle was "Scripts People Live" - http://www.amazon.co.uk/Scripts-People-Live-Transactional-Analysis/dp/0802132103. Some really good insight in there, too!


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## Cosmos (May 4, 2012)

Caribbean Man said:


> So I perfectly understood the Drama Triangle concept the first time I saw it. I just never knew there was a name other than dysfunctional for it.
> The first concept of it I saw was from a psychologist called Stephen Karpman.
> I tried to share it with a poster here who complained of the same type of dynamic in his marriage , but he never responded.
> 
> It is a very empowering theory if understood properly and put into use.


It certainly is. It actually gives us a simple framework to analyze some of our seemingly complex interactions with others

Transactional Analysis has fascinated me for a long time, and I read several of the late Eric Berne's books ("Games People Play," " I'm OK, You're OK" and "What Do You Say After You Say Hello?"). Really interesting stuff!


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## tryingtobebetter (Aug 6, 2012)

I am a fan of TA as well. Learned about it over 25 years ago now.

Only yesterday I was talking to someone and referred to the game 'why don't you and him fight?'.


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## Mrs. T (Aug 5, 2011)

Drama Triangle? I've never heard the term but am looking it up right now. I have a feeling my first marriage fit the category.


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

Cosmos said:


> It certainly is. It actually gives us a simple framework to analyze some of our seemingly complex interactions with others
> 
> Transactional Analysis has fascinated me for a long time, and I read several of the late Eric Berne's books ("Games People Play," " I'm OK, You're OK" and "What Do You Say After You Say Hello?"). Really interesting stuff!


I am not familiar with it , but Transactional Analysis Theory sounds quite interesting.
I Googled it and had a little read.

This part;

.a theory of personality
.a model of communication
.a study of repetitive patterns of behaviour

Interests me mostly.

I have always believed that people don't openly say who they are and in order to know beyond the persona they present a person has to listen, see and " feel" exactly what they are saying.

I read a book years ago that dealt with a similar topic, but focused on intimate relationships, and how to see beyond what a lover / spouse is saying and get what they are _not_ saying, or are unable to say, but wished that you knew. I think the title of the book was ; 
_" Why I don't want you to know who I am.."_ or something like that. Can't remember right now. I've tried Googling it but didn't get the results I'm looking for. 
Lol, 
Maybe I'll find the book in one of the many boxes of books I have in storage.


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## Cosmos (May 4, 2012)

You might find this of interest, CM:- Transactional Analysis


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