# What is you thought.



## StillSad (Nov 30, 2012)

Little back ground, my WW and I are about 9 months out from DDay. I had a huge trigger yesterday and when I saw the OM for the first time since DDay.

Today I asked if she regretted anything. This is what she said.


As I have said before it was the feelings and the way he made he feel that was attractive. I can't go back and change how I handled the situation, I can only work with the present situation. At the time it was the only way I knew how to deal with everything, I'm not saying that it was the correct way and I am still working on how to deal with my own emotions now. I won't say I regret anything because while it hurt you and me it got us to where we are today. I believe that to be a better place. I know that probably angers you but looking back on it, in the frame of mind I was in, I did not see any way out of the situation I was in. I realize now that it was the worst thing I could do to us and that might be unforgivable for you but it was the best I could for the feelings, emotions, frame of mind, I was in. I know I have changed a lot in the past few months and I will continue to change. I may not be giving you the answers you want but it is the truth and that is the best I can give you.

I'm so confused right now.


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## Toffer (Jan 31, 2012)

OUCH!

Well at least you can say she's being honest but to tell you the truth, it would have been better to say something along these lines:

"Yes I regret it. I regret the pain and hurt I caused you and our family. I regret that I leid to you, the man I married and swore fidelity to. I shouldn't have sought validation outside of our marriage but i did. I do not regret the fact that it got us to where we are now".

If I had heard that response, I probably would have crashed and burned. She's actually JUSTIFYING her affair by telling you it IMPROVED your marriage! What a load of horsesh!t!


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## ody360 (Feb 1, 2013)

Ouch. That is basically saying sorry but im really not remorseful. Im glad i did it cause now i have you doing and im getting what i want so the pain i put upon you (us) in the end was worth it cause now i have what i want. You changed to make me happy. so ive changed a little but not really and sorry this is how i feel so deal with it. Selfish response right there. ouch.... Very cold dude.

Also sounds like trouble for the feature and that she really didnt learn anything but if it gets bad ill just do this again..


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## StillSad (Nov 30, 2012)

toffer,
That exactly what I said. That she is trying to justify the affair.


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## Toffer (Jan 31, 2012)

SS,

I agree. This is not a spouse who is truly remorseful and therfore probably not really in R with you.

Waht were the consequences she suffered due to this affair? Did you expose her to her friends and family? What about the OM? Was he exposed?


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## tacoma (May 1, 2011)

She's trying to rationalize the affair because it " it got us to where we are today"

Bull****, I'd keep an eye on that one.


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## badbane (Jun 9, 2012)

She was honest. I would like to point out that you might want to ask her why "IT was the only way she knew how to deal with things at that time." While honest I would do my best to take a sledgehammer to this statement. Because there isn't truth to that statement. You two were married she could have done plenty of things to deal with things. Like getting a MC, talking to you, and/or not going outside your marriage. It is good she is talking to you but, it sounds like her head is still in the wrong place. 

Look it is crucial that you be honest. You voice your feelings and emotions and you don't just accept honesty about the past from your WS. It is one thing to say yes I regret it however I am happy that we recovered and our marriage is much better now. 

9 months is a drop in the bucket. It takes years to truly begin to forget but neither of you will ever truly forget what happened.


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## Plan 9 from OS (Jul 13, 2012)

Aside from her telling you that she wants this to work, what has she offered up to you of proof of her willingness to work with you on this. She gave you her passwords and you have access to her stuff. That's good, but has she went into details about when, where, how many times and what all did you do? Do you know if she and him used protection? There is an awful lot that is still unresolved, and frankly was swept under the rug from what I have observed in your original thread. Can you update on on what happened between 12/8/12 thru today?


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## HarryDoyle (Jan 19, 2013)

Basically she is saying "the ends justify the means." I see where she is coming from, my relationship is a lot better now than it has been for 20 years. But there were better ways to get there! My WW fully realizes this and has told me this numerous times, and I truly believe her. On D day I basically took out my gun a told her to shoot me in the head before you even think of doing anything like this again. I was pretty serious at the time, and she got the message. I had her write a list of all the things she could have done instead of ripping my guts out, and I did the same thing. We both came up with a whole page. (And none of them required me getting shot in the head!) There is never an excuse to cheat!


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## azteca1986 (Mar 17, 2013)

ody360 said:


> Also sounds like trouble for the feature and that she really didnt learn anything but if it gets bad ill just do this again..


If the end justifies the means in her mind, then she actually _learned_ that being unfaithful gets her what she wants.

What happens if she finds herself in a similar place to before?


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## Toffer (Jan 31, 2012)

SS,

Sadly, you can pretty much expect to spend the rest of your married life monitoring her. If you're OK with this, then by all means continue down the R road. It's your decision.

I will say that I do believe that without true, heartfelt remorse (and I sure don't see that in her statement) your Reconcilation is in danger and your marriage will probably suffer too.

Sorry you find yourself in this situation


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## Acabado (May 13, 2012)

HarryDoyle said:


> Basically she is saying "the ends justify the means."


That's actually the worrisome piece. Making lemonade from lemons. Pure rationalization.
About the rest I don't see it a justifying but honesty admiting she had to grow up to behave better. She didn't know then how to cope properly, she's learning, growing up. Let's face it, sometimes it takes horrible actions and consequences to. I believe it's positive. 
_"When i was a child i thought like a child"...._

ETA
Of course it's rhe most palatable version of it. From you other thread I beloieve you are a conflict avoider and you don't "talk about it" too much. Can you see more changes? Has her train of tought s changed¿ Because radical honesty and emotional transparence ig what it takes to learn whether she's starting to get it or not. A short letter like that is very little info.


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## chillymorn (Aug 11, 2010)

don't know your whole story but I would be making an exit plan.


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## JustGrinding (Oct 26, 2012)

StillSad said:


> I'm so confused right now.


Please don't confuse confusion with the shock in being confronted with the type of woman to which you're married.

She's showing you her dearth of character, integrity, and caring for ANYONE other than herself. Believe her.


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## MarriedTex (Sep 24, 2010)

By her logic, you now have a free pass to go have an affair of your own. You're in a sad place. Pounding some little hottie would make you feel better about yourself and your relationship, I'm sure. 

I wonder how that logic would work for her?


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## CH (May 18, 2010)

She just told you

Sucks to be you, I won.

But at least she's truthful about it, I'll give her that.


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## AngryandUsed (Jun 23, 2011)

Sorry ss. She is not even saying sorry. 

Time for you to focus on yourself. Seriously.

Why did you ask that question?


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## weightlifter (Dec 14, 2012)

WTF is her frame of mind?? Ugh. Be very very VERY careful.

She is still transparent?


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

What I heard, is I got what wanted, and it did hurt ME, and I'd even do it again given that save choices.

Not one ounce of care for the scars you now have, r the complete lack of trust of her you will always have.

This isn't much of an R based on those words. About all you can say is at least it was honest. It does reflect a deep lack of real compassion.


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## DavidWYoung (Feb 3, 2012)

What is IT that she brings to the relationship that makes it worthwhile?

If you can not find IT, pop smoke!


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## Joey Joe Joe Jr. Shabadoo (Mar 22, 2013)

StillSad said:


> Little back ground, my WW and I are about 9 months out from DDay. I had a huge trigger yesterday and when I saw the OM for the first time since DDay.
> 
> Today I asked if she regretted anything. This is what she said.
> 
> ...


My wife and I are in a pretty difficult attempt at R right now as well. She had an EA, not a PA. However, her statements to me on several occasions have matched your wife's statement almost to a T. I just point this out to tell you that I kind of think of it as a partial understanding on their part, not a full understanding. It's almost as if they know what they did was wrong, are feeling the pain of it, but are not yet ready or willing to admit the full impact of it to themselves. At the same time, you need to see it as a pretty common script that such people follow during R, and it doesn't represent the taking of proper responsibility. I wouldn't condemn her for saying it, but make clear to her she hasn't really "gotten it" yet from your point of view as the BS.


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## badmemory (Jul 31, 2012)

StillSad said:


> I won't say I regret anything because while it hurt you and me it got us to where we are today.


If my WW told me that, I would respond to her thusly:

_"Where we are today? You make it sound as though the ends, no matter how painful to me, justify the means. There's no doubt we have re-focused on our marriage and things are a lot better than before in many respects. Especially your attitude toward me.

But let me remind you that because of the emotional scars inflicted, I now don't have a since of permanency with us. Not like before. And if I don't, you shouldn't either. 

I love you but I still don't trust you. I'm trying to be a better husband, but the mind movies and insecurities I suffer don't allow me to be as affectionate and as loving as I could be;as I want to be. It's a waiting game for me; wondering when these thoughts will fade.

Yes we're more polite and thoughtful with each other. But you're afraid to upset me. That can't be good for you and isn't sustainable in the long run.

I'm optimistic we'll get there someday. But what you did will always be in the back of my mind. I hope you can remain patient and remorseful. Because to me, your means will never justify our ends."_

Just food for thought Stillsad. But let her know how YOU feel, about the way she responded.


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## Catherine602 (Oct 14, 2010)

She is not where she should be 9 months out. Are you certain she is not still seeing the OM? My interpretation is that if she should get into the same space she was when she cheated then she would cheat again. She mentioned herself almost exclusively. . 

Is a better marriage her reward for cheating? That is not right. I dont hear sorrow, regret, or empathy for your pain. She also sounds much too sure that you will not dump her. 

Decide what you need her to show you to alleviate your pain. Let her know that what she said shows an incredible amount of hubris for a person who has been so immoral. 

I think you should give it 3 more months. That is the 1 yr mark. then review where you are. You could have D her when you found out. It would have been less painful than living with a careless FWW. think about it, what would life be like without her. What are the odds that she will cheat again if the conditions were right? 

It will take you yrs to get over this. Would those yrs be better spent with a fresh relationship untainted by deception?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## verpin zal (Feb 23, 2013)

"I won't say I regret anything because while it hurt you and me it got us to where we are today."


This is what I love most about waywards: they ALWAYS need to bang someone else to fully understand whether they love you or not. Caught? Oh no problem. Their love for you is eternal. "It was absolutely nothing, just sex. Hey yo, why so upset? I said I love you and it was nothing. Can't you just forget it and move on? Hell, it even made us get closer than before, we should rejoice, even."

I would not be overly fond to see how these people actually "hate", and what they do if and when. Or while.


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## phillybeffandswiss (Jan 20, 2013)

She told you that she is a manipulator that will do anything, up to hurting you, to get what she wants with no regret.

She told you that because she knows you better than you know yourself. My wife was in an EA and while she tried to poo poo it, if she told me she had no regrets we'd be having massive problems.
There would be NO confusion with me.


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## Hardtohandle (Jan 10, 2013)

If she was more remorseful in the beginning, I think as time goes by she is minimizing the affair. Basically, Yea it was bad but get over it now. 

If she always was like this, it seems she just settled for you. Basically when she got caught, she weighed her circumstances and propositions and decided to stay with you. That is until someone else better in her eyes comes along.

I think you should print this out and give it to her on the way to the marriage counselor and address it there together.

Maybe we are going overboard because we are all in the same boat. But I don't think so.


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## Hurtin_Still (Oct 3, 2011)

StillSad said:


> Little back ground, my WW and I are about 9 months out from DDay. I had a huge trigger yesterday and when I saw the OM for the first time since DDay.
> 
> Today I asked if she regretted anything. This is what she said.
> 
> ...



...out of ALL that...here's what I zero'd in on : _*"I won't say I regret anything because while it hurt you and me it got us to where we are today".*_

....I'm at 17+ years past d-day ....am getting a vibe of the same flavor from my WW ....and can tell you ...it's not gonna' get better.

...and...having said that, I'm truly sorry from the bottom of my heart that you're where you're at now


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## Acabado (May 13, 2012)

From you other thread.


> 1*2-07-2012* With in a two weeks of finding out, I had realized if I didn't fix my depression I was going to lose my wife and kids. I change and she said the past 5 months I have been the father and husband she has always wanted. *However she says she is still mad at me for not support her in the period I was having my depression.*


At DDay and even at that point (5 months after DDay it was all pure, unadulterated blameshifting.
Then


StillSad said:


> *As I have said before it was the feelings and the way he made he feel that was attractive. I can't go back and change how I handled the situation, I can only work with the present situation. At the time it was the only way I knew how to deal with everything, I'm not saying that it was the correct way and I am still working on how to deal with my own emotions now. *I won't say I regret anything because while it hurt you and me it got us to where we are today. I believe that to be a better place.* I know that probably angers you but looking back on it, in the frame of mind I was in, I did not see any way out of the situation I was in. I realize now that it was the worst thing I could do to us and that might be unforgivable for you but it was the best I could for the feelings, emotions, frame of mind, I was in. I know I have changed a lot in the past few months and I will continue to change. I may not be giving you the answers you want but it is the truth and that is the best I can give you.*


I left out purposely the "problematic" piece (huge red flag), becasue it's already fully discussed nad higlighted. The rest measn she changed the focus from you (depression, neglect) and the marriage to her, her "poor" way to manage things. It's not exactly owning her stuff, just a small improvement from where she was nine months back.
It's the only positive comment I can do.
At this minute of the game it's a shame she still doesn't own her stuff. To me it's not enough.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

There have been many couples who claim their relationship is much better now than before the affair. The biggest reason being that now they can communicate. Saying that they are better off now does not exclude being sorry that she caused so much pain. The way she said could be improved but we need to be consistent, actions speak louder than words.


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## BobSimmons (Mar 2, 2013)

azteca1986 said:


> If the end justifies the means in her mind, then she actually _learned_ that being unfaithful gets her what she wants.
> 
> What happens if she finds herself in a similar place to before?


Hand clap right there!! So no responsibility for her actions, somehow makes becomes the martyr of the marriage but having an affair but bringing it to a "better place". Like aztec said, when she's bored in the future or has feelings for someone else, what's to stop her from doing it again...heck it's ok because it's probably better for the marriage that she acts on her feelings right?


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