# My lack of caring drove her off



## SailingSoloAgain (Feb 5, 2012)

My wife of 7 years left 6 days ago. I'm crushed and have no where to turn, although I know there wouldn't be relief from the pain and loneliness if there was somewhere to turn.

I didn't do anything drastic, just drove her away gradually by taking her for granted. She's one in a million, has a heart of gold, but still I managed to drive her off. 

I got the 'I love you but...' speech last Saturday night, followed shortly with "I want a divorce". I'm certain there's no other man, although I suspect an online emotional affair.

I never thought it would come to this.


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## CSeryllum (Jan 23, 2012)

your situation is (though lacking detail) similar to mine.

Communication was an issue, on both ends, she is at heart a good person, though troubled and easily overcome with emotions.

I got the same talk, "I love but i'm not IN love with you" quickly followed by "I think we should divorce."....she was always very honest with me for the 8 years we had together...but then I started noticing inconsistencies...walking out of the room ...when she got phone calls (she never did that ever before)...Eventually, through a lot of snooping on my part, I found she was having an emotional affair with someone online. 

It's not easy to deal with...and you have a chance to reconcile, or divorce...but either way, stick it out. It's going to really be difficult, there will be a lot of lonely nights. Find a hobby, get things off your mind through being around loved ones and friends.


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## SailingSoloAgain (Feb 5, 2012)

I actually had written a very long post. Then I thought perhaps she may be here getting her own support and recognize it, I thought better of posting the whole thing, and kept it brief. 

She wants to keep the separation secret, no ones knows but her parents (where she moved to) and the possible online EA. Not that that matters to me, I have no one to talk to, my nearest friend is halfway across the country, I have none here. My family would be no help, my mother is aged and my older brother has decided he wants to spend the rest of his life in the middle of nowhere in Asia. I did talk to my friend on the phone earlier and it was helpful, he was encouraging, is very wise in this sort of thing and suggested I do what she asks and give her space to find herself.

In the last couple months if I fell asleep watching TV I'd wake up and she'd be on her PC in the other room. I became suspicious and considered a key logger but didn't take that step. I confronted her about this behavior but it happened several more times. She spent increasing amounts of time on her PC but it's her work / hobby so it's plausible. 

She's been out of work for 3 years, with a couple terrible jobs in between that I urged her to leave after she came home crying a few times. I work from home so we've pretty much been together 24 X 7 for the last 3 years.

I read another post about getting text transcripts. Her phone is in my name. I just got out the bill and am thinking about calling. My hands are shaking, I don't know if I will just now, I need to calm down and think this through.


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## CSeryllum (Jan 23, 2012)

Yea similar situation. She wanted to keep our separation secret, I even had to sit through thanksgiving with all of her friends, with all of them asking when we were going to have kids and what our future plans were..because she didn't want any of them to know...pretending is not good for you...only good for her. Don't give into that if it makes you uncomfortable.

My friends and family are on the other side of the country, I moved to Houston to be with her when she got a new job, so I left everything behind.

Don't keylog, since that is illegal in many states (almost all of them now actually.)

As far as calling the numbers you see, to find out who they are... I can't blame you...but be careful with that, because if she finds out...she'll turn very nasty to you, and use your lack of trust in her as a reason behind her actions, and she'll build it up until, likely, she decides to stay gone.

I would sit her down, confront her calmly and peacefully, and explain that you just need to understand. Offer her time and space...take this time to work on yourself...push emotions aside as best you can, and focus on what you can do to make your own life better. If she decides to stay because she loves you, fantastic...if not...well, you've been working on yourself, and will have steady ground to stand on when it comes time to move forward.

It's not easy brother, but we'll make it.


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## SailingSoloAgain (Feb 5, 2012)

You're a good man C. I handled my last 2 divorces exceedingly poorly, more like a raving lunatic. So far handling this separation much better. Practice makes perfect. At any rate I haven't done anything crazy that would make a reconciliation exceedingly unlikely. She says she's wiling to go to MC but even so, I think the general odds make it unlikely. 

I wasn't thinking of calling numbers, I read you can get a transcript of text messages from your cell company. But I'm not sure I want to know at this point. Strong suspicion is enough to bear right now, why add more weight.


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## CSeryllum (Jan 23, 2012)

Depends on the carrier, but most of them require a court order to divulge that information, even if you are the account holder.

I will also say that the need to know will drive you insane. I know, because I had questions to which I wasn't getting answers, so I started snooping...something I thought i'd never have to do. I found things that gave me some answers...but then generated even more questions. If you go looking, what you learn you can't unlearn, be prepared for that reality should you choose to seek the truth on your own. Also understand that what you could find, may be distorted by what you are afraid you will find...for instance, if you find a receipt from a restaurant you know you didn't go to her with...you'll think she was there with another man. However, it is equally likely she was there with her sister, a friend, or a coworker. Your own mind will betray you more often than you'd like to believe.

As far as being a good man...I try, just trying to keep my head above water like the rest of the world...Stay strong!


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## Starfish girl (Feb 6, 2012)

I hate the "I love you but I'm not in love with you" thing. It's the worst thing in the world to hear when you love someone so much.


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## SailingSoloAgain (Feb 5, 2012)

I'd never heard of ILYBINILWY before Star, but reading through forums here and on another site, it's unbelievably common. And rarely if ever used by a man.

You're right C, snooping is bad and will drive me crazy. Despite a lot of advice to the contrary that I see, I think it just invites more demons into your thoughts. I'll just let this thing run its course. Maybe she'll come back, maybe not. Maybe I'll still be interested in that, maybe not

Another rough night. Up till midnight, starting reading "Honoring the Self" in an attempt to understand and improve self esteem. Very depressing. I'm a wreck and have been one for some time according to the book. Literally scary stuff. I'm pretty sure that's a significant contributor to what started this whole mess. Too bad I didn't have a wife that would stand by me through this, it appears fixable. Now I'm not so sure.

Woke up at 1:00 for a bit. Woke up at 2:00 for a bit, woke up at 2:30 and threw in the towel on trying to get back to sleep at 5:15. Thought I'd come downstairs and talk to you kind folks. Maybe the demons will cut me me slack and go bother someone else for a while.

I'm going to try and see a Dr today and see if I can get something to make me sleep. Didn't want to do that but nothing's changing in that department and sleeping hasn't been problem since... the last time I got divorced. This sort of thing is what makes people my age (53) drop dead, and my dead butt will be here at this PC for a long, long time before anyone notices. I'd prefer to avoid that if possible.

Got a note from the DW this morning. can you believe this: "Hey. My email is doing that pop up thing again where it's asking for my password all the time. Can you tell me what I need to do to fix it? I can't remember. I'm trying to send you those pictures.
Thanks Honey."

Yeah, I'll get right on that. Sit tight.

One other thing I've noticed that really puts the icing on the cake is that in addition to this, I'm reliving my prior 2 divorces and the pain associated with them. They both left unexpectedly for other men, and caused excruciating pain for years. I thought they were far behind me now.


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## Lon (Jun 6, 2011)

SSA, more than likely you didn't push her away, she was pulled away. Her "possible online EA" is likely the root and possibly just the tip of the iceberg. She is in an affair, and so you can't believe her words or actions because she is in the fog (search that term on here). Stop blaming yourself, by doing so you are simply validating her decision for her.

Either way you will find that you will have to prepare yourself to let her go, but that is difficult if you are not ready. If you want to fix the marriage it takes both of you, so that would mean having to kill her affair before you can do anything, so gather what evidence you can, if you find something don't confront yet, just keep looking until you have a good grasp of the true extent of it first.

If there really is no OM and nothing pulling her out of the marriage then you simply have to believe her when she says she is done. However if/when you find more evidence of her infidelity then once you know what you are dealing with you confront, she will trickle truth you (which is why you need to have good intel because you can NEVER trust a cheaters words). And you will be able to discover what she really wants, if she continues to lie it means she is in the fog still and can't be remorseful, in which case you expose the affair to her family, the OM's family etc, and don't be timid about this, it is your right to do what you need to do and if you want to have any chance to save your marriage you need to put your foot down, stop putting her on a pedestal.


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## SailingSoloAgain (Feb 5, 2012)

Excellent advice Lon, thank you


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## Lon (Jun 6, 2011)

My intent is simply to encourage you to move forward on this no matter what the outcome may be. I was in similar place 9 months ago, and since have been coming here, talking with peers and experts in real life and becoming acutely aware of the dynamics in relationships that we never seem to notice are at work when we are in the midst of it.

One thing I am realizing about husbands that have been left, especially about ones that are seeking help on marriage sites, is that they ALWAYS blame themself, and there is ALWAYS an external factor that has enabled the wayward wife to take action, and it is usually in the form of a physical or emotional affair.

So by advising you to get to the bottom of it it encourages you to take some kind of action, which is all you need to get your self esteem and confidence back. Once you have those back you will realize that you cannot downplay the significance of infidelity. The big unknown that only you have control over is how soon, if at all, you get to that realization, and whether or not it is before your point of no return (with regards to what kind of behavior you are willing to accept in your spouse).

For me, by the time I understood what happened to me and got back on my feet it was way too late for me to offer R - my ex W was too far down a path that she chose to take alone. I sometimes regret that I didn't wake up sooner and make changes when I had a chance to keep the marriage, however in the bigger picture I am now realizing that she has always wanted to go down her path by herself anyway - it makes me angry she stole precious years from my life, but I am grateful for the child she gave me and for the good experiences we shared.

No matter what anyone tells you here, and no matter what your outcome, you will go through it at your own pace, you have to do this by yourself but you are not alone and you will come out ahead. You've been divorced before so you are probably all too familiar with the pain, just remember it is a tool to help you mold your life into the one you want.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Lon said:


> My intent is simply to encourage you to move forward on this no matter what the outcome may be.
> 
> No matter what anyone tells you here, and no matter what your outcome, you will go through it at your own pace, you have to do this by yourself but you are not alone and you will come out ahead. You've been divorced before so you are probably all too familiar with the pain, just remember it is a tool to help you mold your life into the one you want.


:iagree:

Sailing, I have a question about your previous divorces: did your ex-wives cite any "lack of caring" on your part for them deciding to leave/end the marriage? I ask this in order to see if there is a pattern in your relationships. Please don't take offense, I am just trying to paint a bigger picture.


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## SailingSoloAgain (Feb 5, 2012)

Thank you Lon and Jelly for you thoughtful replies.
Jelly, no offense taken, you asked in the spirit of helping. My first marriage ended in probably less than 3 months but due to state laws an 18 month separation was required. I was still on the honeymoon when she left. We were from different worlds. She was a model in NY, lived the high life and enjoyed the limelight. We hung out with celebrities occasionally, I was standing next to Bruce Springsteen when he was introduced to his current wife. Me? I got up at 5:00 AM and fixed typewriters for a living. What she ever saw in me I don't know, but our lives were completely incompatible and the marriage was doomed to failure from the start. I doubt I ever considered that in advance. Sometimes you don't question your luck, particularly if at age 24 you're the envy of all your friends. It was probably shortly after she realized it would never work that she left. No warning, and I never saw or spoke to her again. She may have drowned at sea for all the closure I was afforded.
I'm convinced the 2nd one lost her marbles. Pretty strong diet pills were available over the counter then and she developed a sweet tooth for them. She acted weirder and weirder by the day. She went on a business trip and came back 2 weeks late, I was unable to locate her in that time. She left her 13 year old daughter too, knowing I'd take care of her. I was actually saving money for this girl's college education. Shortly after she moved out and took her daughter, the kid ran away and hitchhiked 700 miles back to our home town to live with her grandmother and be with her old friends. She wasn't concerned and didn't reunite with her for years. 

Due to those situations and some parental initiated childhood incidents, 'fear of abandonment' is the understatement of the century. It's closer to abject, crippling terror that slowly builds after I bond with a love interest. I think that drives me to be controlling, and that doesn't sit well. Despite my long winded posts, I am a terrible conversationalist in person, and my current wife bore the brunt of that. Over the years I had less and less to say to her, despite her frequent requests to not behave that way. They fell on deaf ears.

But today is a new day. I saw a Dr yesterday, he gave me xanax. I'd never taken it before. In my case it's nothing short of a miracle drug. I slept 10 hours, got up, did 30 minutes on my nordic track and worked out with weights. I feel better than I have in 6 months or more. My old hobbies seem interesting again. I want to go do things. I'm full of hope. I'm able to push negative thoughts out of my mind, I can concentrate at work. I'm questioning whether she had an EA, it may have been her long distance girlfriends combined with my uncanny ability to jump to conclusions. I have high hopes for an MC session tonight.

Even if my hopes are dashed, I know I'll be alright. Destitute perhaps, but alright.


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## Lon (Jun 6, 2011)

> got up, did 30 minutes on my nordic track and worked out with weights. I feel better than I have in 6 months or more. My old hobbies seem interesting again. I want to go do things. I'm full of hope. I'm able to push negative thoughts out of my mind, I can concentrate at work


Great! This is the best thing you can do for yourself. I found that holding onto the postive thoughts like hope and energy, and keeping the negatives out as much as possible is the way to get to where you want to be. You haven't mentioned kids, if you don't have any it makes it a lot simpler to get free and clear, and if you do have them they are a wonderful source of inspiration to do right by them.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

I can see why you would have a fear of abandonment considering how your last two marriages ending.

One thing you can work on is not being so controlling. Identify what things you do that you term "controlling" and work to correct them. Also, try to be more conversational (is that a word?) Converse more with people.

My ex was emotionally distant and it broke me. He also didn't have much to say which made it worse. Have you talked to your wife recently?


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## SailingSoloAgain (Feb 5, 2012)

Yes my controlling nature is on top of her dislike list. I'm in a leadership position at work. I'm a licensed captain (hobby) and responsible for peoples lives on occasion, what I say goes. It bleeds over at home. I tend to take control of everything I possibly can. But I know it's exasperating for others and I'm working on it. Well I am now at any rate. I believe I've made good progress.

We went out to dinner last Thursday, had a wonderful time, no lulls in the conversation, I was intensely interested in what she had to say. we laughed and had a good time. We went to my car for a heart to heart. No arguing, just meaningful conversation. Afterwards I sang "you were always on my mind" to her, never sang her a song before. She said she'd never forget that. Gave her some roses I had in the back seat. We kissed long and warmly when we parted.
She texted me Saturday AM said she was in town for a haircut, could she stop by to visit the cat. I said sure. We talked productively, she looked in the fridge for something to eat, I suggested lunch. Another great, fun meal.
She stopped in afterwards, we chatted kissed goodbye fondly. She asked if I was doing anything Sunday, I said no, let's go out and do something really fun. Oh, and if you like, you can bring your toothbrush along. 
I know this is the anti-180 and against all conventional wisdom I'm pitching some serious woo, but it feels like the right thing to do.
Later that night I sent an email, thanking her for the wonderful time, and being unable to resist putting my foot in my mouth, I reminded her that she could bring her toothbrush.
That was where things took a turn for the worse. She said I was putting too much pressure on her ( I know I had it coming), canceled Sunday and we've exchanged a couple brief emails since then.

Well it's time for our first MC session, wish me luck.
Neither of us have kids from this or prior marriages. The time was never right, now it's too late.


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