# Where do I start?



## lady323 (Nov 12, 2010)

This may be long....

I have been married 6 years (we are an older couple). A couple of years ago, while I was traveling he called me to say he had a friend (female) of a friend (female) in Canada that was in jail due to domestic abuse and both husband/wife were put in jail. This friend “W” lives out of the country and called my husband to see if he could help “S” out as she had nobody up there. Needless to say he got in his car and drove and sorted things out as much as he could considering he wasn’t family. He came back and then he became involved in the situation and was brought into the case due to seeing her physical wounds, damaged to the house, etc. No problem. However, since then and over the years he has been either flying or driving to Canada—telling me he is helping her fix up the house the ex damaged, going to court with her (still ongoing), helping her move to an apartment, helping her move again to another part of Canada. Going to China to meet her family. Then last year he was blaming me as he had issues with the custom border patrol and they took away his nexus speed pass. He told me that they told him they had a record of someone calling them telling them when you’re coming, what car you drive, etc. For the life of me I have no idea why they would be stopping and questioning him as I for one wouldn’t have called. Of course to this day he has yet to tell me what exactly happened as every time I ask he tells me he doesn’t want to get into it.

Long story short, he tells me he isn’t having an affair and that she is just a good friend. She calls numerous times a day and from the side of the conversation I hear it’s all innocent. He has told me if he was being unfaithful he wouldn’t be sleeping with me. I don’t understand why he feels the need to call her and vice versa so many times. He calls her in the morning while she drives to work, calls her when she drives home, asks her what she’s cooking for dinner, etc. The kicker is when I ask a question he gives me the minimal response and from what I can tell when she may ask the same question, he elaborates so much more in the response. 

Also, a couple of times I had come home from work and she had her webcam on at work and when I asked why she would have the webcam on her while she’s working and you say you don’t know as you don’t have your webcam on and you say you totally forgot about it. I say it’s so freaky and you would then minimize the screen. btw he doesn't work.

I admit I am not the greatest communicator but I am at wits end as to what to do. To me, he may not be in a physical affair but it certainly seems like it’s an emotional affair. I brought that up and he laughed and made me feel like I was the “stupid” one for even thinking that. 

The kicker is I haven’t met her and when I say I would like to meet her, his response is, I have my friends and you have yours. 

Not sure what else I can do and would appreciate any input men/ladies take on the above. Am I just being delusional?
Sorry for the rambling.

Thanks


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## DayDream (May 25, 2011)

He is in an emotional affair, at the very least. This is encroaching upon your life and your marriage, and it's time he let this other woman go. It's gone beyond the good samaratain clause. It's looking pretty darn fishy, and something more is going on so don't let him try to pull the wool over your eyes and make you feel silly for thinking so. Just read up on all the other EAs going on on this site and you'll recognize the signs.


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## DayDream (May 25, 2011)

_Elly73: Husband mentoring a young girl 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hello All,

Thanks for taking the time to read my post. I am new to this group. I am married to a wonderful man. Both mid/late 30's with 3 children. The last several months my husband has been coaching this young woman (well really our age I think, but she is single). I noticed he talked about her quite a bit so I decided to check his email. Her name was everywhere. They have sent over 100+ emails, lots of skype chats and phone calls. I know there has been no sex as she lives in another state and they have not met. But clearly she has a crush on her wise old mentor - my hubby. She tells him how good he makes her feel, how she could not get through her college course without his guidance and that he is her lifesaver. He is clearly loving it. 

The bad news is he cracks lots of cutsie jokes with her, he is bending over backwards to help her and he clearly is lapping up all her praise and adorationl. I can tell he is being slightly flirty. I played a voice message from her and she is French and has a beautiful voice. I think my husband is quite smitten with her. The fact is she clearly adores him and looks up to him. They have had lots of conversations outside of her studies and I can tell he is taken by her. He has complimented her quite a bit and she is very very beautiful - I saw her photo. God knows what they talk about on the phone. She wrote to him that she loves their long conversations.

The only thing that makes me feel better is he does mention me quite a bit. Though having read some threads it seems men do that as a way to releieve their guilt and to keep things from getting to out of hand. And it seems he cut her off for a good few months - then he rekindled their contact. He said to her in an email that he is always there for her.

She has indicated she is going to be coming to our state at xmas time to visit her sister. She said it twice. He seemed to ignore that comment but has kept on talking to her.

My question is do you guys think I need to worry? I know he is taken with her. I am shocked he would encourage their communication. I am worried. Is this the beginning of an emotional affair? Thank you! Elly_

This is from a woman from the Private forum with a very similar circumstance right now to yours.


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## lady323 (Nov 12, 2010)

Would appreciate any suggestion as to the best way to approach hubby and tell him my feelings so that he doesn't come back and say that its my own insecurities.


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## DayDream (May 25, 2011)

The bottom line is it doesn't matter what he comes back and says. YOU need to get tough and bluntly tell him this relationship with this OW has gone too far, it isn't about insecurities it is about propriety...it is an improper relationship and has gone beyond your comfort level and you are not happy with it. End of story. YOU WANT IT STOPPED. You are his wife, you have a right to feel this way. He ends it or he can find another place to live. This relationship between him and this other woman IS NOT RIGHT. She is single now, tell him she can find her OWN MAN to take care of her, NOT YOURS.


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## Mrs Chai (Sep 14, 2010)

Hello,


Welcome to TAM. I am sorry for the circumstances of your visit, but you will find a lot of supporters here for you! We use a lot of acronyms, so if you have any questions on their meanings please don't hesitate to ask for clarification.


I am going to refer you to a lot of different threads. The reason I do this is because there is a lot of good advice in them that is relate-able to your situation. Please take the time to review these as they may clarify questions you may have about terms used and they way we suggest moving forward with a situation with a WS.


I reviewed your thread and I agree with you that there is definitely something going on and you are not getting the full truth. This is what's called trickle truth (TT). Wayward Spouses (WS) often due this as a form of control – either to maintain the affair or to not reveal the severity of the betrayal they have conducted (covering up a much bigger lie). TT is hard to overcome and the only way to stop it is to call them out when they are doing it.


You agree that your husbands relationship with this woman is inappropriate. You haven't said that you made this statement to him, though I do see that you've dropped more than enough hints. At this stage, you can't be anything but blunt with your husband. He is going to evade, TT, and gaslight you. You need to prepare yourself for this as this seems to catch a lot of people off guard.


http://talkaboutmarriage.com/mens-clubhouse/22317-spousal-gaslighting.html

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/58163-how-handle-gaslighting.html


At this point in time you have no real hard evidence. There are PLENTY of red flags that I'm confident enough to say that your husband is up to his ears in an EA and it would be hard for me to believe it hasn't already crossed into the realm of a PA.


You need to gather evidence. You need to install keyloggers into his computer. You will want his text logs off of his phone. I'm not the tech person to ask about this sort of thing, but we have members out there that can refer good programs for you to use. A VAR (voice activated recorder) will be helpful for you to hide in his car. Most cheaters speak to their affair partner in their car – whether they are on the phone or physically in the car with them.


You may want to ask one of the mods to move this to Coping with Infidelity. This will ensure you get more focused responses specific to your situation.


There are a few other threads you may want to read:


http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/10964-steps-stop-affair.html


I hope this helps and please let us know how things go as you proceed forward.


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## youkiddingme (Jul 30, 2012)

So sorry you are in this mess. Yes. He is having an affair. What you have described here is unbelievable behavior. NO WIFE should ever have to tolerate their husband being this involved with another woman. It is absolutely crazy.
I think you need to get into counseling first. This man has obviously learned to manipulate you in unbelievable ways. YOU NEED help!! If you let him lead you on after the first time he went up there....it means that YOU are unable to tell when you are being taken advantage of in huge ways! You should never trust yourself on this matter. Get with a counselor or level headed friend and have them help you learn to take a stand.
Why is he not working?????


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## CH (May 18, 2010)

Emotional affair? No man drives that far for an emotional affair. I've I'm driving 4+ hours to meet a girl, I better be getting some sugar during those visits.

Tell him he ends contact with her or you end contact with him and he moves out.


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## ShawnD (Apr 2, 2012)

cheatinghubby said:


> Emotional affair? No man drives that far for an emotional affair. I've I'm driving 4+ hours to meet a girl, I better be getting some sugar during those visits.


Interesting hypothetical, but let's say the reward for going there is to do cocaine and drink alcohol with her, and there's no sex involved. Is this better or worse than driving there and sleeping with her without the drugs?



> btw he doesn't work.


Bail. I would go nuts if I had to support a parasite.


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## Emerald (Aug 2, 2012)

Yeah.....cheaters rarely admit to cheating.

Are you financially independent? Who owns the home you both live in or do you rent?

I once had a boyfriend who would go to another woman's house "to fix stuff", ie, have sex with her, so everytime I hear that excuse I roll my eyes.

I'm sorry; I wouldn't stand for it & would tell him to go live with the OW.


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## Mr Blunt (Jul 18, 2012)

*Your success is going to depend on how many serious consequences you can hold over his head or actually put into action.* He is on a drug (the high man can get from women) and is an addict. He is not going to listen to your rational points; no addict ever does.

Assuming you have some real serious consequences to put into action, the next question is how strong are you? *Can you put his feet to the fire if you have to suffer some also?*

I do feel sorry for you but my empathy will do you no good in getting your husband to be jolted out of his addiction.


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## fallensoldier (May 6, 2012)

If he's visiting her several times a year, what makes you believe he isn't in a physical affair ??


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## lady323 (Nov 12, 2010)

Thanks for everyone's input and I really should force the issue with him.

What are people's thoughts on my calling the OW and confronting her? MH is from a different culture (Australia) and to him this would be "normal/innocent behavior and the OW is Chinese and if I was in her shoes I would be glad that someone is helping....however, I do not want to make excuses but maybe I am just in denial and delusional......

Thanks


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## greg54 (Nov 2, 2012)

Does he call you numerous times per day? Does he call you driving to and from work? Does he watch you on the webcam while you're at work?

I'm sorry but this whole thing seems very unfair for you. As a man I see emotional involvement as more serious perhaps than physical. You shouldn't have to live like this - either make him drop it or get out.


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## DayDream (May 25, 2011)

Tell him to cut off the relationship. Tell him you don't want him visiting her ever again. Tell him you want proof he cut off the relationship...make him do it in front of you if you can. Monitor the situation. If you find out he has contacted her anyway, then you call the OW and tell her to back off. When he throws a fit because you did that, tell him if he wants to continue to contact this OW, you two are over.


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## I'mInLoveWithMyHubby (Nov 7, 2011)

I just read your post from last year. Your husband is nothing, but a freeloading cheater. He's using you as a free roof over his head and free meals. I would of been very leery to why he's been divorced 3 previous times.

He is sending you red flag after red flag of a serial cheater. It's up to you if you want to continue on this path. He's not going to change into a better person. Personally I'd be serving him ASAP with divorce papers. The longer you remain married to him, the more spousal support he will get. Yes, he will get spousal support from you since you are the breadwinner and supporting him.


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## CandieGirl (Apr 27, 2011)

Bloody Canadians...


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## lady323 (Nov 12, 2010)

Thanks everyone. 

I got home yesterday and he was on the phone with the speaker on but when I came into the house he picked up the phone and took it off speaker. I sarcastically said oh it must be private. 

Once he was off the phone we had our conversation about this and why would I make a comment like that as he said he didn't want to be rude with the speaker. Bottom line is it's over. He told me that he had put together separation papers back in April but never signed them....but now he will and would like me to sign them so that we can have an amicable separation. He as clearly told me he wants nothing from me and will leave whenever I tell him. 

The bottom line is when I told him there's a 3rd person in the marriage he scoffed at that and again said there's nothing going on. When I brought up the fact that she calls constantly and vice versa he then mentioned that I had never called him while he was home etc and why would that bother me with her calling. I said it would be different if I knew her and he again said she has no interest in meeting me. I said in a husband/wife relationship it is good for each other to meet each other's friends. Once again he made the comment he could care less about my friends and I shouldn't be so nosy about his friends. 

Now the question, I am naive but is there such a thing as "separation papers" or is this divorce papers? I haven't seen anything yet as I told him I am not going to do anything until I have me procedure next week as I need someone to drive me.

It's finally hitting home that as much as I love this man it may be best to call it a day on this relationship.


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## SlowlyGettingWiser (Apr 7, 2012)

DON'T SIGN ANYTHING UNTIL YOU HAVE YOUR OWN ATTORNEY READ THEM!

Not someone Hubby knows/recommends. SOMEONE INDEPENDENT.

This man has not gone through 3 previous divorces without learning SOMETHING (including how to screw you over legally/financially while lying to your face).

Kick his AZZ out TODAY. Hire a cab, call a friend to drive you to your procedure next week.


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## DayDream (May 25, 2011)

I'm sorry he hurt you! Kick him to the curb. You should have someone that cares about your friends and your feelings and needs. Save your love for a man like that. He's out there.


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