# Should I be worried?



## RGoldman

Been lurking for a few weeks. My gut says something is going on, and I think there are signs from other people. So here goes...

My wife of 10 years, and us mostly together in high school for another 4 dating before that, seems to have changed a few months ago. Some of the girls where she works got her a membership to a spa and gym thing for christmas. Please understand that she has to look hot bc she is a drink waitress in a major LV casino resort, so this isn't a big deal at face value. The better the girl looks and the friendlier she is, the bigger the tips, so it makes sense. What bothers me is that she works all day and then spends another thrre to four hours at this gym three or four days a week late at night. This has cut majorly into our time together, we have dinner then she is gone until around 11 or so.

I also work nearby and we used to lunch together a few times a week, but this also has changed as she now hangs with these new youngr friends, and we don't do as much together on days off anymore bc she is with these other girls most of the time now or "needs some space". Her job is a high turnover position, so a few of the girls have been with h er for the 8 years she has been working there, but most come and go. A couple of the long term girls at her work I know and are good friends with me, but my wife has distanced from them too starting last christmas. One of them is concerned bc of the chatter she overhears at work about the gym trainers being "totally hot" guys. She hasalso heard the these girls refer to me as Deadweight and Loser and a few other names. This friend has also learned none of these girls, about 8 of them, are married but they have boyfriends. The BFs also get trashed talked except for a few that are "cool" or "OK with it". My friend doens't hang around for details, but says she and another girl i know there are concerned about my wife joining in with this talk and this group.

I'm wondering what to do. Should I ask for more time togetheer? Should I be suspicious? Could this just be a crisis thing for her bc we're coming up on 30? I feel like i'll do damage if I'm wrong bc she hasn't been with anybody else since school before we married. Also, this is the first time she seems to be hiding something from me. Should I look into this more and see if I should be worried?


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## keko

Plenty of red flags. 

Can you check her emails and texts without her knowing?


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## Chaparral

Start here

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/32002-welcome-tam-cwi-newbies-please-read-3.html


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## iheartlife

She may not be having an affair, but she may as well be.

I said this recently in another thread. Cheaters think that as long as the physical side of things hasn't taken off, then they are still in the clear.

But cheating starts way before then--essentially, it the creation of a secret private life from which the spouse is excluded.

By that definition, even if all your wife is doing is hanging out with a bunch of toxic friends at all hours, she has already crossed over.

She is no longer sharing her inmost thoughts, feelings, dreams, and fears with you. Your goal if you want to bring her back from the brink is to crack through this shell that she's hardening against you.

If you sense there are other signs that she has taken on a BF of some kind, *lay low until you have solid evidence*. A big rookie mistake that is almost a given is to confront the spouse with a big show with a teeny bit of evidence. Even if the evidence is 100% solid, you risk driving the affair deep underground where you are tricked into thinking everything's ok. And then you wake up some time later and to your dismay it's still going on.

In the meantime, I'd push hard to have lunch with her at least 2x a week and to have her cut back on gym time. Christmas isn't so long ago--whatever she was doing before then, that should be the standard now too. See what she says to that.

Oh, and is there a reason why you can't start going to the gym with her?


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## TBT

You live one life,she lives another.No time together isn't really what happily married people do to keep their marriage strong.Communication seems to be already breaking down if you can't address the situation in a forthright manner with her.Your concerns should be a concern to her and visa versa.In my opinion you should be worried.


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## AngryandUsed

I agree with iheartlife.

Now, you should start acting normal, do vigilance work. Collect all evidences.

DO NOT CONFRONT until you collect the evidences with which you will be able to conclusively prove.


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## Gabriel

It's pretty textbook IMHO. She is 30, these other girls are 21-22, and your wife never got to play the field. These girls probably jump from BF to BF and are fun to hang with, so your W is becoming addicted to being with them and getting little pieces of their lifestyle she never got to have.

This is very hard to break. She's also been working as a beer girl for 8 years at the same place? It sounds like (no offense) that your W isn't maturing, or doesn't have a lot of aspirations to improve her position. So what's keeping her doing this job? I think it's the lifestyle of being around a party, being around young attractive people. 

Have you ever thought of leaving LV to maybe find better work elsewhere? To me it sounds like a change of scenery would be your best shot here. But if that isn't possible, start competing for her time by taking her out. You say she's hot. Great. Show her off by taking her to dinner, lunch, etc - don't even ask. Just tell her - "Hey honey, I got us reservations at XX tonight", etc, etc. You have to make time with you as interesting as it is with her friends. I know that is tough - I've been there once.

Good luck


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## iheartlife

Gabriel said:


> Have you ever thought of leaving LV to maybe find better work elsewhere? To me it sounds like a change of scenery would be your best shot here. But if that isn't possible, start competing for her time by taking her out. You say she's hot. Great. Show her off by taking her to dinner, lunch, etc - don't even ask. Just tell her - "Hey honey, I got us reservations at XX tonight", etc, etc. You have to make time with you as interesting as it is with her friends. I know that is tough - I've been there once.
> 
> Good luck


I love this idea. Take charge, show strength and self-confidence, she's YOUR woman--it is a big turn-on. Don't think it's been said yet--pleading, begging, crying, she will find any such behavior REPULSIVE. Play it cool, calm, strong.


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## jnj express

Couple of things---1st---many mge's. hit a boring, same old, same old---phase at 7 to 10 yrs---so that problem needs to be dealt with-----AFTER----you yank your wife out of whatever she has going---and she does have something going on

Gym---a good workout needs only 1 to 2 hrs---3 days a week, on a regular schedule---if she is spending longer, and at night, something else is going on

A married woman---does not spend all of her social time with younger chicks--who think they are so hot---that they can run around putting their male friends---DOWN-----

Your wife's nasty remarks about you---are a sign of her "dissing" you big time---and the changes she is making in re: your mge. itself, are major red flags

Other posters can advise about electronic devises you can use---to find out what she is up to

Do not confront unless you have solid---printed out/recorded evidence---then go after her very harshly if necessary

Do not deny that you have marital fidelity problems---CUZ YOU DO!!!!


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## TDSC60

Big time red flags.
Spending more and more time with younger single girls.
Moving away from more stable GFs.
Spending days off with toxic friends instead of you.
"Needs more space" - standard talk of someone moving away from a marriage. They "need space" to conduct their new, secret lifestyle without you.
If your wife is joining in with the "Totally hot trainer", and you are "dead-weight" and a "loser" talk , you should most definitely be concerned. 

This is the beginning of what could be the end of your marriage. 

If you feel that your wife is into a PA with one of the "hot trainers" or some other man, gather your evidence, then confront.

If you feel it has not gone that far yet, you need to tell her that you are not comfortable with these new single friends and you cannot accept how she is spending more and more time away from you.

Be prepared for her getting mad, calling you controlling, even listing every little thing you have done in the past that upset her , most of which you will not remember.


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## iheartlife

TDSC60 said:


> Be prepared for her getting mad, calling you controlling, even listing every little thing you have done in the past that upset her , most of which you will not remember.


Yes, let's head this one off at the pass, shall we?

Wanting to be with your spouse, and feeling alienated because your spouse is spending time with people who openly DISRESPECT you, is NOT controlling. Got that?? (I'm a woman, BTW.)

(Sorry, I've just had it up to here with BSs coming here believing that particular POS from their checked-out spouses.)


Another thing I forgot to mention: experts say spouses need at least 10, generally around 15, and in your case 20 hours of *uninterrupted quality time* to make sure their marriage is strong. Add up the #'s and let us know where you are on that scale, out of curiousity.


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## Chaparral

The easiest first thing you do is get to best buy, purchase a var (voice activated recorder) and some heavy duty velcro and put it under the drivers seat of her car.

What kind of phone does she have? Does she ever turn loose of her phone?


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## OldWolf57

RGold, this is good stuff from good people, so pay attention to them. You came with a question, an by coming here you answered it. If you are so troubled that you are here, you need to 1st, decide what outcome you are looking for, if things go off the rails in the marriage. Are kids involved. So lets say worst case, what is a deal breaker for you. Try to have a plan for evidence or no evidence, either way, you want changes because you miss her.


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## lovelygirl

RGoldman said:


> I feel like i'll do damage if I'm wrong bc she hasn't been with anybody else since school before we married. Also, this is the first time she seems to be hiding something from me. Should I look into this more and see if I should be worried?


Just because she hasn't had anybody before you is no excuse to her cheating on you.
If she wants some space that's fine. The way she organizes her space is what matters and by your post we understand she's not doing it the right way.


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## the guy

Trust us, she already did the damage, your just quitely looking for proof and facts so you can make an infomrative and accurate dicision about your marriage.

Man you chick is showing so many red flags you don't even have a clue.

Please do your marriage a favor and educate your self about infidelity.

Stop asking her she will lie, go stealth and confirm what we here at TAM have already experienced.

Hire a PI to scope out the gym, get a GPS 1/2 the time she's not at the spa, and plant a VAR in the car.

Again you can find out alot more if you educate your self and start protecting your marriage 1st by gathering, 2nd expose, 3rd confront, 4th consequences.


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## RGoldman

Wow, thx all. I only have a minute while she's at the store getting some dinner.

I guess some background is in order....

-We were on agan and off again in school, so she had others in the teenage years and we even double dated when we were with others, but we evenyually liked each other best

-I should join a gym bc I am borderline obese. It hurts to go from school sports star to what I am now and I wonder if this is one of the reasons she seems to be losing interest

-I agree the young girls are toxic, but they are young and i se this all the time with that age, it just sucks my W is acting like them now when i thoght she was past all this

-no kids, planned that for our 30's when we would have better income

-guys hit on her all the time, the loser types even in front of me. she still brushes them off but it used to upset her when they did this, now it seems to make her day better

Tonight I'm going to ask her about my going to the gym with her and see what happens. I'm not quite ready to get the recorders yet, and her cell and email are clean, as is her FB page.


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## keko

Her cell/email are clean as in everything was deleted or nothing explicit came up?


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## iheartlife

keko said:


> Her cell/email are clean as in everything was deleted or nothing explicit came up?


Do you have access to her cell phone bills? When I took a look at my WS's, his AP's phone #'s (cell and home) nearly jumped off the page. As did the calling patterns (11 pm on a Saturday night, 20 minutes on Christmas day, and the like).


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## Chaparral

Have you checked cell phone records with what is actually showing up on the cell phone. You need to look at the phone bill to see what phone numbers are called/texted a lot. Number of a boyfriend might be listed under someone else's name. Texts will be deleted from the phone but still show up on the bill.

The var is the best course and if something is going on you don't have time to mess around as these things go nuclear in a short time span.

I don't think you are ready to face what may be going on.


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## Will_Kane

*Tonight I'm going to ask her about my going to the gym with her and see what happens. I'm not quite ready to get the recorders yet, and her cell and email are clean, as is her FB page. *

Good first step. But I suggest you don't ask her if it will be OK. I suggest you go separately, sign up for the gym, then let her know you did it after the fact. Tell her you thought it would be a happy surprise for her that you wanted to get in shape. Let her know you don't expect her to hold your hand at the gym, you're a former athlete, you know hot to get back in shape without her. Once at the gym, you can go your separate ways, but at least you can travel there and back together. Her response will give you a good idea of how she feels about you.

She should embrace it enthusiastically. But you already know she will not. She likes the attention from the hot trainers at the gym. If not something worse.

She cannot stop you from going to the gym. In the end, I would go whether she liked it or not.


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## Machiavelli

RGoldman said:


> -I should join a gym bc I am borderline obese. It hurts to go from school sports star to what I am now and I wonder if this is one of the reasons she seems to be losing interest


Naw. It can't be that.



RGoldman said:


> -I agree the young girls are toxic, but they are young and i se this all the time with that age, it just sucks my W is acting like them now when i thoght she was past all this


I see women in their 50's everyday who still do it.



RGoldman said:


> -no kids, planned that for our 30's when we would have better income


Dodged a bullet there, but you might want to look up what happens to female fertility rates after age 30.



RGoldman said:


> -Tonight I'm going to ask her about my going to the gym with her and see what happens. I'm not quite ready to get the recorders yet, and her cell and email are clean, as is her FB page.


Man, you need to get with the program. Why aren't you ready? Are waiting for the "train" to leave the station? Maybe your lucky and she hasn't got on board yet. You need to gather intel now.

As for the gym, don't ask her anything. To coin a phrase, "just do it."

How often do you get it on with her? does she initiate? 

Go to this blog:Married Man Sex Life | How to have the marriage you thought you were going to have. By which I mean doing it like rabbits. and buy the guys book and read it tonight.


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## Chaparral

Will_Kane said:


> *Tonight I'm going to ask her about my going to the gym with her and see what happens. I'm not quite ready to get the recorders yet, and her cell and email are clean, as is her FB page. *
> 
> Good first step. But I suggest you don't ask her if it will be OK. I suggest you go separately, sign up for the gym, then let her know you did it after the fact. Tell her you thought it would be a happy surprise for her that you wanted to get in shape. Let her know you don't expect her to hold your hand at the gym, you're a former athlete, you know hot to get back in shape without her. Once at the gym, you can go your separate ways, but at least you can travel there and back together. Her response will give you a good idea of how she feels about you.
> 
> She should embrace it enthusiastically. But you already know she will not. She likes the attention from the hot trainers at the gym. If not something worse.
> 
> She cannot stop you from going to the gym. In the end, I would go whether she liked it or not.


As a matter of fact, a friend of mine finally relented and decided to surprise his wife at her gym one Friday after work. He waited for two hours. When she showed up at home in her gym clothes the cat came out of the bag. She's now living with one of his best friends.


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## Will_Kane

*Should I be worried?*

Yes, you should be very worried.

*Chapparal: I don't think you are ready to face what may be going on.*

I agree. Prepare yourself for the absolute worst. I fear that your world is about to be turned upside down. We on these threads read stuff like what you've posted all the time. When it involves trainers at the gym, usually it's a physical and emotional affair by the time the betrayed spouse (you) have caught on.

3-4 hours at the gym four times per week is abnormal. No one needs that much working out to maintain muscle tone for a waitress job.

Your wife's former friends would not tell you they've heard you are being called "deadweight" and "loser" if you were not being called that. They probably are trying to warn you that your wife is cheating on you, without coming out directly and telling you straight.


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## Machiavelli

chapparal said:


> As a matter of fact, a friend of mine finally relented and decided to surprise his wife at her gym one Friday after work. He waited for two hours. When she showed up at home in her gym clothes the cat came out of the bag. She's now living with one of his best friends.


That's the way to play it. It can be educational on many levels when you don't show all your cards.

OP, is your wife's gym coed or women only?


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## OldWolf57

well at least you have been warned. But just for argument, say you do compare the phone records online, to what's on the phone as far as tx's are concern, and theres no matching. WHAT ???" oh I tx my friends more now " Its good there are no kids on this train. Also you could just set her down, and explain you did'nt get married to be alone. When she says you are blowing this out of perportion, explain the times she spend with friends and the gym, plus the lunches. In fact, start going to the gym with her. If she say something about space. Just say you are doing it to get back into shape for the single life. Give her a wakeup, because you are living single now.


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## TDSC60

RGoldman said:


> -I agree the young girls are toxic, but they are young and i se this all the time with that age, it just sucks my W is acting like them now when i thoght she was past all this
> 
> Tonight I'm going to ask her about my going to the gym with her and see what happens. I'm not quite ready to get the recorders yet, and her cell and email are clean, as is her FB page.


These young girls are termed toxic because they are enabling and encouraging unacceptable behavior by your wife. They also seem to be incredibly disrespectful verbally to you and your marriage. Thus toxic. Nothing to do with their age.

Damn near every betrayed spouse who balked at the idea of a VAR have latter kicked themselves in the rear end for not doing it sooner. Are you actually saying that finding the truth about your wife (good or bad) is not worth $40-$60? But it's your choice. Please do not give us the crap about invasion of privacy. This is secrecy, not privacy. There is no place in a marriage for secrets.


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## iheartlife

TDSC60 said:


> These young girls are termed toxic because they are enabling and encouraging unacceptable behavior by your wife. They also seem to be incredibly disrespectful verbally to you and your marriage. Thus toxic. Nothing to do with their age.


Totally agree. They could be people her age or older who are all married but who complain and make fun of their spouses and encourage her to belittle you right along with them. I've had a couple of 'friends' like that.

Plenty of young people don't engage in this behavior.


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## Entropy3000

Will_Kane said:


> *Tonight I'm going to ask her about my going to the gym with her and see what happens. I'm not quite ready to get the recorders yet, and her cell and email are clean, as is her FB page. *
> 
> Good first step. But I suggest you don't ask her if it will be OK. I suggest you go separately, sign up for the gym, then let her know you did it after the fact. Tell her you thought it would be a happy surprise for her that you wanted to get in shape. Let her know you don't expect her to hold your hand at the gym, you're a former athlete, you know hot to get back in shape without her. Once at the gym, you can go your separate ways, but at least you can travel there and back together. Her response will give you a good idea of how she feels about you.
> 
> She should embrace it enthusiastically. But you already know she will not. She likes the attention from the hot trainers at the gym. If not something worse.
> 
> She cannot stop you from going to the gym. In the end, I would go whether she liked it or not.


Absofreakinlutely


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## warlock07

RGoldman said:


> Wow, thx all. I only have a minute while she's at the store getting some dinner.
> 
> I guess some background is in order....
> 
> -We were on agan and off again in school, so she had others in the teenage years and we even double dated when we were with others, but we evenyually liked each other best
> 
> -I should join a gym bc I am borderline obese. It hurts to go from school sports star to what I am now and I wonder if this is one of the reasons she seems to be losing interest
> 
> -I agree the young girls are toxic, but they are young and i se this all the time with that age, it just sucks my W is acting like them now when i thoght she was past all this
> 
> -no kids, planned that for our 30's when we would have better income
> 
> -guys hit on her all the time, the loser types even in front of me. she still brushes them off but it used to upset her when they did this, now it seems to make her day better
> 
> Tonight I'm going to ask her about my going to the gym with her and see what happens. I'm not quite ready to get the recorders yet, and her cell and email are clean, as is her FB page.



I think her friends are letting you on that there is something sinister going on without getting too much involved in the ensuing drama. They are giving you a heads up so that you could find it on your own. Take them into confidence and ask these friends if they know more. Tell them that you will not involve them further or reveal to your wife your sources


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## bryanp

It sounds like you don't have much of a marriage. She works at stays for hour at the spa and gym. She is sending you a clear message that she has no interest in being with you. What are you going to do when you find out she is cheating on you?


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## Thor

I am not ready to jump to the conclusion she is boinking the personal trainer. Staying vigilant but not paranoid would be my advice in terms of infidelity.

At this time I would suggest you attack the relationship issues rather than question her. Don't ask her what she is doing every night, don't complain about her ditzy (****ty?) young female friends. Instead, tell her you want to spend more time together with her. Lead the relationship by planning things together. Tell her you feel things slipping a bit because you are both getting so busy, and you want to reconnect with her. Make it a positive conversation with her, not a nagging or complaining experience. Ask her what she would like more of or less of in the relationship.

If she is having a bit of a mid life crisis as 30 approaches, being positive with her is a better approach than *****ing at her. But still keep your eyes open. I think it a red flag that her previously close friends are saying things to you about her behavior.


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## Jellybeans

Nobody hangs out at a gym for 4 hours unless they work there.

Something is up.


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## keko

Jellybeans said:


> Nobody hangs out at a gym for 4 hours unless they work there.
> 
> Something is up.


:iagree:

For 4 days, late at night, yep she is doing things she shouldn't be.


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## Almostrecovered

GPS her car to see if she is even at the gym


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## morituri

Or her body is getting a special "work out".


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## Toffer

R,

I hope you've reconsidered about getting the recorders and such.

I think you have a problem here

Investigate, Investigate, Investigate!


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## Entropy3000

morituri said:


> Or her body is getting a special "work out".


She may have changed professions. Maybe doing some "modeling" or eye wide shut stuff. 

The free gym membership I find interesting. Yeah that happens.


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## TDSC60

If she has an iPhone you can activate the "Find My phone" function. It should tell you if she is at the gym the whole time.

Of course that won't tell you if she leaves the phone in her car and takes a little drive with someone else or hops in a car for some parking lot action.


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## Jellybeans

You should just show up at the gym and tell her you wanted to surprise her.


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## lovelygirl

Jellybeans said:


> You should just show up at the gym and tell her you wanted to surprise her.


This must be it!!!

It should happen as a real fact. Just show up there and see her reaction!!!


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## morituri

Entropy3000 said:


> She may have changed professions. Maybe doing some "modeling" or eye wide shut stuff.
> 
> The free gym membership I find interesting. Yeah that happens.


That's a possibility. Some wives have become escorts behind their husband's backs.


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## Entropy3000

morituri said:


> That's a possibility. Some wives have become escorts behind their husband's backs.


Normally I would not even go there, this is Las Vegas. She is a ****tail waitress and gets hit on a lot by guys looking for sex. Some of these guys do have money to throw away. Or just play the role for the trip. I could see some guy trying to find out if she had her price.

I am going to get beat on for suggesting this but, she may just be a type of escort. Money is probably pretty good.


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## keko

Entropy3000 said:


> I am going to get beat on for suggesting this but, she may just be a type of escort. Money is probably pretty good.


OP, did her income increase? Is she stashing "tips" somewhere? Or did she start buying expensive items without your knowledge?


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## Machiavelli

lovelygirl said:


> This must be it!!!
> 
> It should happen as a real fact. Just show up there and see her reaction!!!


She won't have a reaction, because she won't be there.


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## Machiavelli

Entropy3000 said:


> I am going to get beat on for suggesting this but, she may just be a type of escort. Money is probably pretty good.


Well, she _is_ a ****tail waitress in vegas. Maybe she's moved up to "bottle hostess."


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## Entropy3000

Machiavelli said:


> Well, she _is_ a ****tail waitress in vegas. Maybe she's moved up to "bottle hostess."


Yes, yes ... this. That would make perfect sense.


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## lovelygirl

Machiavelli said:


> She won't have a reaction, because she won't be there.


What's the point of going there if she won't be there then?


He should to see her LIVE reaction.


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## iheartlife

lovelygirl said:


> What's the point of going there if she won't be there then?
> 
> 
> He should to see her LIVE reaction.


I think they are joking that she has a "gym" membership at someone's house or a motel. The OP hasn't taken any steps to find out where she is, just that she's gone for super long periods of time and says she's at the gym.


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## the guy

OP is going to ask to go to the gym, his WW will say no and give OP some lame excuss that he will except.

OP needs more time to except the unexceptable, only then will he confront with out proof, and WW will deny and OP will except this and month will go on before its so in his face that he will finaly take the steps to protect him self.

The writing is on the wall he just cant see through the forest.

Why do hot chicks seem to blind us guys?

BTW do even professional athelets work out this much?


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## keko

the guy said:


> Why do hot chicks seem to blind us guys?


I don't think its about being hot or not. Most guys expect their partners to be just like them, honest/loyal. These expectations grow as the years go on and after a decade or two they miss the red flags of an affair.


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## TDSC60

keko said:


> I don't think its about being hot or not. Most guys expect their partners to be just like them, honest/loyal. These expectations grow as the years go on and after a decade or two they miss the red flags of an affair.


:iagree:

That was exactly my case. Wife was in an EA with a person she met at the gym (Aerobics class). I knew something was wrong and had an uneasy feeling about this "friend". But I trusted her and could not even imagine her being unfaithful.

The point is, that if you have total trust and cannot imagine your spouse could ever cheat, you are not looking for the signs and don't recognize them for what they are.


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## happyman64

R,

Do not ask her to spend more time with you.

Give her a halfhour lead and go to her gym. See if she is there or not.

Maybe give her an hour.

If she is there join the gym since you say you are heavy.

Do not ask, just do it.

When she says she needs her space tell her she gets that at work.

Lose the weight and see if she wakes up. If she is still acting suspicious then you need to sit her down and get the truth from her.

Work on you but do it with her. You do not need her permission.

HM64


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## RGoldman

Thanks to all of the advice. Like a map in all the chaos, rly helps. 

I checked the phone records, lots of calls to the usual friends. Even the Toxic ones, but no unusual patterns. btw not a iphone.

Income is variable bc of tips, so hard to track that except for end of year tax stuff. Also it is 99% of time given as cash or added to bill and taken from drawer, again as cash. No way of nowing how much on her at any given time, but can be several hundred.

No gps in cars.

I hve also started checking her clothing for signs since i do the laundry. nothing yet.

I did check her bags though. No condoms or toys, but perhaps worse in that i found bc pills.  She has used these before, but usually tells me when and we have not been very active lately due to my health. This feels like a kick in the groin.

I bought a recorder today after finding the pills and will put it in by morning in her car.

After last night dinner, we talked about her away from home so much, my health, her Toxifriends. She says not to worry, but surprised me by saying we will go to MC in two weeks or so, just needs to find a provider through work insurance. This caught me by total surprise bc she never got defensive or angry, just said the answers wil come where there is a third party to be there with us. This seems too easy, and she was too cool about it while i was a mess inside.

I also have to say she is a very striking beauty, so guys hitting on her anywhere and anytime is the norm. Dirty blond and shaped like a barbi doll will make guys bold.

Today i got called by one of her coworkers who found a young waitress to spy for us. She will ask about which gym, and spend the next several days finding out more. this seems the best way for now. the friend called bc my wife was flirting heavily with a group of guys-about 12 of them!-joking about buying her drinks or getting a room for her break time or after work. very much against policy and decided to bring in spy before contacting personell department to try and catch the whole Toxifrinds group if possible. my wife was all smiles the whole time and they were hugging and touching her. 

Coworker says she feels for me and to prepare for possibly worst news possible during MC meeting. It hurts, but i feel the need to start gaining some distance

PS--sorry about the horrible typing, but i'm just not myself right now


----------



## bryanp

You need to get things in order and seeking out an attorney to understand your options. It is pretty obvious that she is cheating on you.


----------



## keko

R,

If there are any surveilance store nearby try them for a GPS. Or you can very cheap ones on the internet with fast shipping.

Can you actually follow her to see which gym she is going to? Or somewhere else?

Also check her panties for semen, you can find test kits in stores or on internet.


----------



## happyman64

"She says not to worry, but surprised me by saying we will go to MC in two weeks or so, just needs to find a provider through work insurance. *This caught me by total surprise bc she never got defensive or angry, just said the answers wil come where there is a third party to be there with us"

I do not like the sound of this RG. What the Hell does she need 2 weeks for. Do not wait for her. Dig deep. 

It sounds like she is making plans on her own. 

Not good.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## keko

Also,

Absolutely no sex with her, "if" she is using bc then she is getting creampied. Get tested for STD's just incase.

Also ask your "spy" to take pictures/videos.


----------



## Chaparral

Are there numbers that only show up once or twice?

If you don't recognize the numbers, look them up on spokeo .com.


----------



## iheartlife

RGoldman said:


> I did check her bags though. No condoms or toys, but perhaps worse in that i found bc pills.  She has used these before, but usually tells me when and we have not been very active lately due to my health. This feels like a kick in the groin.


I am so sorry.


----------



## Humble Pie

RGoldman said:


> Been lurking for a few weeks. My gut says something is going on, and I think there are signs from other people. So here goes...
> 
> My wife of 10 years, and us mostly together in high school for another 4 dating before that, seems to have changed a few months ago. Some of the girls where she works got her a membership to a spa and gym thing for christmas. Please understand that she has to look hot bc she is a drink waitress in a major LV casino resort, so this isn't a big deal at face value. The better the girl looks and the friendlier she is, the bigger the tips, so it makes sense. What bothers me is that she works all day and then spends another thrre to four hours at this gym three or four days a week late at night. This has cut majorly into our time together, we have dinner then she is gone until around 11 or so.
> 
> I also work nearby and we used to lunch together a few times a week, but this also has changed as she now hangs with these new youngr friends, and we don't do as much together on days off anymore bc she is with these other girls most of the time now or "needs some space". Her job is a high turnover position, so a few of the girls have been with h er for the 8 years she has been working there, but most come and go. A couple of the long term girls at her work I know and are good friends with me, but my wife has distanced from them too starting last christmas. One of them is concerned bc of the chatter she overhears at work about the gym trainers being "totally hot" guys. She hasalso heard the these girls refer to me as Deadweight and Loser and a few other names. This friend has also learned none of these girls, about 8 of them, are married but they have boyfriends. The BFs also get trashed talked except for a few that are "cool" or "OK with it". My friend doens't hang around for details, but says she and another girl i know there are concerned about my wife joining in with this talk and this group.
> 
> I'm wondering what to do. Should I ask for more time togetheer? Should I be suspicious? Could this just be a crisis thing for her bc we're coming up on 30? I feel like i'll do damage if I'm wrong bc she hasn't been with anybody else since school before we married. Also, this is the first time she seems to be hiding something from me. Should I look into this more and see if I should be worried?


should you be suspicious?? YES, of course based on her recent needs on "wanting free time". What is your response to her needs to be alone? Also, by what her co-workers have informed about the hot trainers should also raise an eyebrow. Get some spyware and keep a close eye on her.


----------



## Humble Pie

oh man, this doesnt look good, you expressed your concerns and she didnt put much emotion into the convo... I would start to prepare yourself for some troubling news. 

What about the gym? did you ever say you wanted to start going, with her, to spend more time together?? I thought that was a great idea!


----------



## Entropy3000

He does not want to tip his hand. He wants to show up at the gym unannounced when she is supposed to be there. That is critical.

But he inferred he did not even know which gym. You would think he could have asked her which gym she is at.


----------



## Gabriel

RGoldman said:


> I did check her bags though. No condoms or toys, but perhaps worse in that i found bc pills.  She has used these before, but usually tells me when and we have not been very active lately due to my health. This feels like a kick in the groin.
> 
> *Is there any way you can make an excuse for looking through her bag and finding these? Maybe you needed a set of keys or something? This way you can confront just on this issue and gauge her reaction.*
> 
> 
> After last night dinner, we talked about her away from home so much, my health, her Toxifriends. She says not to worry, but surprised me by saying we will go to MC in two weeks or so, just needs to find a provider through work insurance. This caught me by total surprise bc she never got defensive or angry, just said the answers wil come where there is a third party to be there with us. This seems too easy, and she was too cool about it while i was a mess inside.
> 
> *You sound way too passive here. If my wife said that to me I would tell her that we weren't leaving the table until she told me what the f*ck she was talking about, even if it was bad. And this whole thing doesn't make sense to me. Why would she say not to worry? Could it be that she has some other marital issue she wants to discuss, that has nothing to do with infidelity? In other words, "don't worry I'm not messing around, but there's some other stuff we need to talk about, and it'll have to wait until MC". The "not worry" comment could also mean nothing has happened YET, but she's come close, and thus, wants to nip some things in the bud in MC now.*
> 
> I also have to say she is a very striking beauty, so guys hitting on her anywhere and anytime is the norm. Dirty blond and shaped like a barbi doll will make guys bold.
> 
> *Others might think I'm being mean here, but you've mentioned several times how hot your W is. Can I ask what you are doing to improve yourself? Are you working out? Are you climbing the ladder at your job? If my wife was as hot as yours seems to be, I would constantly be looking to man up to ward off the temptation of other men. I would be on edge about this, especially given her job. So while you are right to worry about what she is doing, how about thinking about what you can do?*
> 
> 
> Today i got called by one of her coworkers who found a young waitress to spy for us. She will ask about which gym, and spend the next several days finding out more. this seems the best way for now. the friend called bc my wife was flirting heavily with a group of guys-about 12 of them!-joking about buying her drinks or getting a room for her break time or after work. very much against policy and decided to bring in spy before contacting personell department to try and catch the whole Toxifrinds group if possible. my wife was all smiles the whole time and they were hugging and touching her.
> 
> *Okay look. Your W is a flirt. This is probably why she is still a waitress after 8 years. She loves the attention. Most women do. Also, people love gossip. Once they are suspicious of something, let the soap opera begin. This is Vegas - your W has been letting men touch her for 8 years. It seems worse now because of your new suspicions. Let the coworkers to recon, but don't be too quick to judge what they say. *
> 
> Coworker says she feels for me and to prepare for possibly worst news possible during MC meeting. It hurts, but i feel the need to start gaining some distance
> 
> *Of course the news could be bad, or it could be something else. But bottom line is your W has maintained or even increased her sex rank to something way higher than yours, and you are being very passive. Man up. Go to the gym. Be confident. Be bold like the other guys. Don't be a wimp. Lose weight. Do these things in addition to what you are already doing. Also, I wouldn't wait 2 weeks for MC. I would demand she tell me NOW WTF she wants to say because it will eat you alive every minute of every day otherwise.*


----------



## RGoldman

Update:

VAR is in her car today. I had friends put it in after I gave them a key to the garage and car. That way I could keep an eye on her while she slept and she won't have any clue anything happened. They will also call her to make sure it works during her commute. Tonight should be the first listening in. We're going to do that at my friend's house as well so she won't see anything at home.

I have made an appointment with my doctor about the stress and to start losing this weight...and to get tested. As I made the call, I knew I was doing this for me, not her. Now when I look at her, she isn't my wife anymore. She left months ago. Sucks though. We live like roomates now.

I had a talk with an old buddy this morning who says he has seen this stuff before. He's a bartender at a locals place and he said he has seen more crap going on than you can imagine. Says its tough to watch and hear about regular customers cheating when he knows the spouses, but then they cheat too. He thinks my W is either having a PA with one of these trainer guys, maybe is into a group thing, or might be call girl working just over the county line. Just hearing this seems to be pushing the cold reality into my head. He also said to take control so this doesn't drag out and kill me like it has with other people. Right after I post this I'm calling her work to arrange a MC ASAP, and I'm going to tell them about the flirting incident.

Something I have noticed. Friends "we" had from her work, my work and around the area are starting to rally around me. I'm getting calls and texts of support. It makes a big difference. And they all seem to be angry with her. I have offers to spy on her, beat the other guys, stay at their place and just go out so I'm not alone. She has her own set of friends now, and I now know we live in different worlds.

Before I forget, she has not said which gym it is, if there even is one. Tonight one of my guys is going to follow her when she leaves for her workout. I hope this works. He offered to beat the other guy, but that will just get him arrested so I said no to that, just find out where the hell she is going.


----------



## Almostrecovered

some good planning there

good luck


----------



## keko

Good plans, make sure to keep your cool in the mean time.

Make sure to know every detail before confronting her. Who she is doing it with, where she is doing it, how many times she is doing it.

Also start moving money into a seperate account slowly. Put valuable items/documents into a safe.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## keko

Also be careful of informing too many friends of it, it might just end up in your wife's ear.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Shaggy

I'm thinking there isn't any gym sorry.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Almostrecovered

Shaggy said:


> I'm thinking there isn't any gym sorry.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


he'll find out tonight tho


----------



## happyman64

Good plan RG.

Go see a doctor for yourself and use these 2 weeks wisely.

HM64
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## the guy

Prepare your self, getting and gathering this painful information will be hard and very emotional, you will want to jump the gun. Don't no matter how painful you want the whole story, the facts, the truth. 
Once have this truth, it will be a more effective confrontation. Do not reveral your sources or how and what you know. You have no reason to tell her she will see how confident you are when you confront her.

Having all the facts, or at least most of the facts to be willing to let her go when you confront her will be empowering. She will lie, deny, and give 1/2 @ss excusses, but you will know better.

There could be a burner phone in her work locker or in the car.

Its odd, there should be a consistant phone number that you don't recognize....It could be someone you both know....becareful who you trust!!

If the friend losses her in LV traffic, I suggest a GPS and plant it your self...I'm very concerned on who you trust, since there are no strange phone numbers that are standing out on the usage page.


----------



## the guy

Please post here before you confront, the experience here will help you alot.


----------



## RGoldman

Now I'm pissed off!!!!!!

Got a call about an hour ago from my guy who tailed her tonight. As expected she left work this evening and headed straight for the gym, a big one on the west side of town. About 45 minutes after that, she came out and threw her bag in her car, then got into a slick BMW that pulled up. My friend got a few bad pics with his cell, but it is her getting into that *******'s car.

So we have him, right? It gets worse. He says they drive about ten minutes to a rly rich neighborhood and go to a huge house with several expensive cars out front. My friend says lots of money here, def upper class. The place is surrounded by fences and gates, but he can see what is going on. Mr. BMW gets her out and they kiss then walk like a couple up to a patio on the side of the house. They meet some people they obviously know and spend a few minutes in the crowd talking. This is where I lose it, and I asked my friend over and over if he was sure this is what he saw. He swears he is telling the truth. She kisses mr. BMW for about a minute, then goes right into the arms of the other guy and starts kissing him with some woman hugging her from behind. This couple takes my W into the house and leave Mr. BMW outside. We have pics of the house to show her, with his car there.

I'm numb, and so goddamned angry! The guys I'm with now won't let me go home. I've agreed to stay the night here and they are going to help me change the locks and pack her stuff tomorrow. I DON'T EVER WANT TO SEE THAT CHEATING ***** AGAIN!!! Time to call a lawyer i guess.


----------



## Complexity

damn is she a swinger with several men? that's just disgusting


----------



## the guy

Stay strong brother, you have a plan work the plan.

1) protect your self and get the lawyer, seperate accounts and file
2) never reveal your sources.
3) go dark and keep your cards close, work your plan that will benifit you.

Right now you have the upper hand, now she is in the dark so use it to your advandage.

Stay strong you know what you need to do, you now have confirmation that the steps you now take have fact, truth and reason behind them.

Don't blow it by going half c*cked and confronting her.

Make a plan and work the plan.


----------



## the guy

please leave her in the dark and work your exit plan then once all your ducks are in a row....confront.


----------



## the guy

sound like she hanging out in Henderson, cant think of any part of town that ritsy?

Any way with a licence plate# and an address the PI can get the rest. You might be able to go on the internet and find more info.

Again take a breath and make a plan right now the more information you have the more power. 

This could be some consistant affair with these poeple or worse. what are you realy dealing with.

I guess at this point does it realy matter to you...a deal breaker?


----------



## the guy

I'd put a PI on her, it should be cheap you have alot to go off of. It just so curious I'd want to know who and what is realy going on.

Is Mr. BMW pimping? maybe it just a BF who like to swing? Really who are these poeple?


----------



## Will_Kane

Is this for love or fun or money?

Regardless, very disturbing.

My advice would be to hold off on confrontation, sit on this info if possible until after you see the lawyer and get all your ducks in a row.

It doesn't sound like this is the kind of thing you will be able to get past and reconcile.


----------



## lovelygirl

OH MY GOD! What a swinger and a cheater she is!!

What's the point of a PI now that you have the pictures of her kissing with 2 other dudes? You have pure evidence to show here there!


----------



## the guy

I would want to know who Mr, BMW is and whos house it was. I'm thinking OP won't know the extend of her affair. To me it looks like a escort set up. Did Mr. BMW go inside with the couple?

If it was me I would want to know the true extent of my wife affair, b/c we can both agree the WW wont give him the truth.
I see it as getting unaswered question, that all.


----------



## Humble Pie

the only good thing that comes out of this my friend is that you now know the truth and you can start to move on in your life and not have to be wondering anymore.


----------



## Humble Pie

i dont know, I wouldnt even confront her... this is totally disgusting, a swinger!!! just leave her be, dont give her the satisfaction of confrontation... i mean what can she really have to say?


----------



## morituri

This should come to you as no surprise my friend. Tomorrow go to a divorce attorney's office and file for divorce.


----------



## the guy

:iagree:
Today you are dealing with facts, and with that, you can make accurate dicision.
IMHO OP is up one more then most, no gaslighting, no limdo, and the pure fact that any dicision will be based on true fact and not suspicion, speculation, or even accusation.

A confidence that shamwow had when he pulled the trigger!

Enless you believe your WW when she tells you they are just friends or "business asociates" .


----------



## Chaparral

If it makes you feel better find out who everyone invovled in and put them on cheaterville.com.

Good luck


----------



## Gabriel

It seems your W is a high-priced hooker/escort. I don't view this as a person whose fallen in love and is leaving you for someone else. She's using her looks and body to live a very subversive lifestyle. 

Going back to her comment about not worrying and MC....not sure what the "don't worry" part is anymore. Maybe she thinks this is just a job and thus doesn't view it as cheating.


----------



## MrK

You got what you need. Time to leave. Have your boys continue the surveillance for the courts, but it's time to go. Time for the 180. Make yourself better. 

Just go.


----------



## keko

Is she close with her family?

If she is time to send out pictures of her.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## happyman64

RG
Do not confront. I hope you read this before you go home.

Get all your ducks in a row.

See an attorney.

Then confront. Use a PI as well.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## iheartlife

happyman64 said:


> RG
> Do not confront. I hope you read this before you go home.
> 
> Get all your ducks in a row.
> 
> See an attorney.
> 
> Then confront. Use a PI as well.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I agree on the PI. You appear to have a more complicated situation than a run-of-the-mill affair. You also need some independent verification, do you really want to just rely on your friend swearing and some grainy cell phone photos for precisely what is going down.

I am so sorry, and I am glad to hear you have such supportive friends in your life.


----------



## Initfortheduration

Strength to you my friend. She's swinging, so she has potentially become infected with some skank disease. One thing I will say, you have some fantastic friends. Very supportive. When you do confront, real non challant, turn to her with a slightly concerned look on your face and ask her:

"Aren't you afraid of getting HIV or syphilis? I mean you obviously embraced the life of being a wh*re. I'm obviously getting the full battery of STD tests, because there is no telling what kind crud is crawling around inside you. You really should get tested. Not that I particularly care about your skanky a$$ anymore, but there could be other innocent spouses out there, that don't deserve what you might be spreading while you are....well....spreading".


----------



## Initfortheduration

Of course, do the standard, drain the bank account, separate finances. She'll make the money back fast, on her back.


----------



## lovelygirl

Gabriel said:


> It seems your W is a high-priced hooker/escort..


Oh. Yeah and she's so cheap and easy to get laid probably. 

You should be ashamed of her, really!


----------



## Gabriel

Thinking more about this on my ride into work. Could she be doing pornography? I keep going back to what she said at dinner the other night. Why would SHE initiate MC? Maybe its to out herself as moonlighting as a porn star? Maybe she's going to justify it as making more money so they could start a family, but is worried about what the OP will think, so that's why she wants to wait for a third party to be present?


----------



## keko

Gabriel said:


> Thinking more about this on my ride into work. Could she be doing pornography? I keep going back to what she said at dinner the other night. Why would SHE initiate MC? Maybe its to out herself as moonlighting as a porn star? Maybe she's going to justify it as making more money so they could start a family, but is worried about what the OP will think, so that's why she wants to wait for a third party to be present?


She got used to it and doesn't see what's wrong with it. 

R, 

If you can wait a few more days find a better camera and take better pictures of her all while preparing yourself for divorce.

Changing the locks might not be legal, is she on the lease/mortgage? If she is take most of the valuable furniture to a friends house until D is final.

If there are any cash/financial document somewhere in house put them in a safe.

Always a keep a VAR on yourself so she wont press domestic violence on you.

Good luck!


----------



## Almostrecovered

pretty crazy


----------



## lordmayhem

Almostrecovered said:


> pretty crazy


:iagree:

Talk about an interesting plot twist. Wow. So sorry you're going thru this.

I definitely agree with iHeartlife. Hire.A.PI.Now. This is no ordinary affair. This is deviant behavior. She may be like Tover's WW, a submissive or something like that. Maybe she doesn't like vanilla anymore.


----------



## Almostrecovered

It's not that she doesn't like vanilla, she likes it when you mix all of Baskin Robbins' 31 flavors together


----------



## warlock07

I am thinking more of an escort than a swinger. He should call the cops on her when she is with the client. That Mr.Mercedes was the pimp.

What f*cked up situation is this!!! Horrible.


----------



## Entropy3000

warlock07 said:


> I am thinking more of an escort than a swinger. He should call the cops on her when she is with the client. That Mr.Mercedes was the pimp.
> 
> What f*cked up situation is this!!! Horrible.


Very possible that this is just the house for that night. Her pimp brought her to the party. She is the entertainment.

Is anyone surprised here?


----------



## warlock07

Some kind of escort ring I think.(The women are for the entertainment of the rich and influential members of the party. That is a pretty standard behavior in some circles) The woman's intimacy with his W tells that this is not her first time there. if the place where she works is in cahoots with her, they will destroy the OP. He needs to collect as much evidence as he can without blowing it up.Then go nuclear. They don't have kids(?), so this should be a cut and clear.


----------



## Gabriel

Entropy3000 said:


> Very possible that this is just the house for that night. Her pimp brought her to the party. She is the entertainment.
> 
> Is anyone surprised here?



No


----------



## warlock07

He should tell her that he tested positive for HIV at some routine tests at his work place and it must have been because of a recent blood donation he did. Then see her react.


----------



## razorsedge

warlock07 said:


> He should tell her that he tested positive for HIV at some routine tests at his work place and it must have been because of a recent blood donation he did. Then see her react.


:rofl: Not laughing at the situation by any means, this is a funny, but AWESOME idea!


----------



## keko

Another example of how toxic new friends can ruin not only the person but their spouse/family as well. Shame.


----------



## Entropy3000

Oh I guess there may be toxic friends, but hey she is a c0cktail waitress in Vegas. Has been for many years. She may have moved up to Bottle Hostess as was suggested. How many times a day do you think she gets pawed on and offered money by folks he feel they can buy people? Some men feel that the hostess comes with the price. For all we know she pursued this lifestyle on her own. I do agree having escorts and pimps as friends would be toxic. Thinking she went into this eye wide open ( yes it reminds me of the movie Eyes Wide Shut ).


----------



## keko

I dont blame her, just for that part, being stuck in a risky/deadend job for 8 years. It was inevitable for this to happen. Her reaction to MC alone shows how much she got used to that life style.


----------



## calif_hope

*This kinda reminds me of a couple of Penthouse Forum stories I read! *


----------



## Blue Moon

Have a drink, relax, be alone with your thoughts. Make some phone calls to price lawyers and see what the next step is. You want to be methodical in your approach and firm. And though you have a smoking gun, be prepared for her to sell you any line of bullsh*t that makes it seem OK or blows what you thought you saw to bits. 

I say this because you're going to have to be strong within before you confront her. So many guys get themselves hyped up like "F*ck that b*tch, it's over!" when they find out some info. But as soon as they confront, she manipulates or deflects and the guy turns back into a teddy bear. Know what you know and deal with yourself within before you make a move. That will prevent you from playing yourself.


----------



## Machiavelli

Entropy3000 said:


> Very possible that this is just the house for that night. Her pimp brought her to the party. She is the entertainment.
> 
> Is anyone surprised here?


Speaking as an old gigging guitar player, I would never allow my wife or serious girlfriend to work as a ****tail waitress or a barmaid. That's pretty much saying you're okay with your wife getting around. All the ****tail waitresses I ever knew were divorced, bar none.


----------



## Machiavelli

calif_hope said:


> *This kinda reminds me of a couple of Penthouse Forum stories I read! *


Unfortunately for me, I've actually been involved in a couple of those stories.


----------



## Machiavelli

Ron Goldman,

What kind of relationship does your wife have with her folks? Gather more info on her activities and expose to the parents, if she has any, but have ironclad proof. Even though you're too much of a man to put up with her crap (I commend you on your decisive decision of immediate divorce) maybe her parents will be in a position to rescue her.

I don't think you need a PI for the divorce because you know all you need to know and this is a no kids, no assets, no-fault divorce. But a PI _would_ be good to get ironclad evidence of her depravity to show her family. You may need a forensic accountant to find out where she has her cash stash, but the attorney will help you with that.

I guarantee you're getting ready to lose a lot of weight very fast. Take the opportunity to start hitting the weights at the same time 3X per week. Force yourself to eat protein even if you don't feel like eating, which you won't. This is a good opportunity to raise your sex rank. Not much of a silver lining, but I guess we take what we can get.


----------



## Chaparral

Its probably too late but I think you need to get a lot more info before you confront your wife. The info you have says a lot, but I would want to know who is invoved and if anything illegal is going on. Of course I would want a little revenge under most circumstances like these.


----------



## the guy

:iagree:
There is a degree of uncertianty that needs to be investigated. The uncertianty of how far gone is she and the extend of her unhealthy behaviors.


----------



## RGoldman

i wasn't even going to post tonight, but it is like writing in my journal and very cathartic. Very, very emotional day. My world has dropped out from under me and i have that free falling sensation going on. I wish what happened was a story, but my god it is FOR REAL!!! I never thought this crap could happen, but many of you and some of my IRL friends guessed it. I knew something was going on, but I never ever would have. You just dont ever think this stuff is for real, going on all around you.

I'll start with the good.

Friends that stand by you during your worst nightmare are priceless. God bless them all.

A house I own because my parents gave it to me when they retired and insisted it remain in my name only. Now I know why. If you think she will fight for it, keep going.

Separate bank accounts because of her tips. We even filed separately because of that.

Most waitresses really are good women. My STBExW and her little group are the exception. Remember one of the waitresses is helping us from her work, and she even called me when my STBExW failed to show for work today. She will call me everyday to make sure i'm ok.

I now have room in my house for a home gym!! Have to smile at something, right?

STBExW's confession.

The bad.

She slept in our house last night, left for work around 1o, waited and circled back in an hour later when we were there packing and changing locks. A very Oh ****! moment. She wanted to know why I didn't come home. I told her why with 3 letters and 3 numbers--BMW 750.

She called her boyfriend to get him to come and help. She used a cell i have never seen before. He wisely stayed away when she said I had friends with me. One of my boys even grabbed the cell and unleashed a mix of profanity I never heard from him before to her BF. I can't thank my boy enough. He even got scratched by the *****.

The VAR cannot be recovered.

She blames *ME* for everything.

STBExW's confession.




So, we got caught and it was ugly as soon as she got out of her car. Screaming, yelling, swear words everywhere, tears and just honest crying because of what we were doing. We moved the argument inside to avoid police attention.

Inside I listened, my friends questioned bc there was no way i could speak clearly or confidently. We showed her the cell pics of her, the plate info from the BMW, the address to the house she went to, and we gave her a description of her activities including times. I wanted to throw up, still do actually. Anyways, she caved in right there, and said it was all my fault. Because of my weight and health, she became disgusted with me and started to see other men about 2 years ago.

This is very difficult. I need to breathe and step away and come back as i write.

She said it started with drinks and petting at local bars, moved to ONS, and then a few BFs. All of this during my day time work hours in the morning or her girls night out, and never at our home. Late last year a BF of one of her Toxic friends asked her out bc he knew about her girls night out habits. She dated that couple to try something new. They in turn introduced her to a swingers club. If you guessed swinger, well there it is.

We asked if she was a hooker or escort. No. What else did she try? Just about everything. Protection? Not used in the club. She said her initiation night would kill me, and i I agreed to let that one stay quiet.

She said the club is very protective and they all get tested a couple times a year. Because I was not in this, they were pressuring her to drop me or leave the club. She wanted in and said some of the perks are help from other members. They apparantly have lawyers in the club, and doctors. She was planning to leave me very soon.

We asked her why she wanted in? They have a system for single women there. They sign up for what they will do, for how long, and with whom. She is going to be the girlfriend of that older couple for a year and in return get travel, an apartment, clothing, you get the picture. I guess they call it Sugar Daddy.

Anyways, she will not contest since she already started to file for D because of my health. She doesn't want anything from me except her things, which i allowed her to go through the house and have packed. I indicated that if she tries to gouge me that all these details she shared will come out in a new filing.

I really don't care what she does anymore, she is out of my house and soon out of my life.

Enough rambling, and i'm so tired.


----------



## warlock07

That is horrible. I am shaking as i typed this. I don't know how you controlled yourself


----------



## Humble Pie

can't imagine what you are going through, the sooner you stop seeing her, and all contact the faster you can move on and put this POS person behind you. What trash!! sorry man


----------



## OldWolf57

Man I feel for you. You are a much better man than me. BIG SHOTS HUH !! Man I would get a good camara with a good lens, and for the next while Stakeout the house taking pics, Then make POSTER of ALL The BIG SHOTS and POST THEM AS ADs for NEW MEMBERS To the CLUB. SHOWING THESE BIG SHOTS as LEADING MEMBERS of the SWINGERS CLUB as INCENTIVE. HANG THEM ON FENCES, LIGHT POSTS and anywhere I could. But I understand, you just want to move on. GOD BLESS Bro.


----------



## Kallan Pavithran

warlock07 said:


> That is horrible. I am shaking as i typed this. I don't know how you controlled yourself


:iagree::iagree::iagree:


----------



## lovelygirl

keko said:


> Another example of how toxic new friends can ruin not only the person but their spouse/family as well. Shame.


Oh please. Don't blame the toxic friends. She's not a child to be easily affected by her friends.
She's an adult, concious of her actions and should be held responsible for what she does.


----------



## warlock07

Does her family know? Go nuclear on her. Why do you want to still play nice with her?


----------



## happyman64

RG

Your wife has turned into a selfish coward leading a very risky lifestyle.

Detach, detach, detach from her. She is not the women you married. Nor will she ever be.

Let her family know what she has done, what she is doing so they are aware of her life choices she has made.

You have all the details you need. She has turned into a bisexual cum bucket.

You now owe her nothing.

Move on my man. Time to move on.

HM64
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Gabriel

Well there you have it. Not a surprise at all. But that doesn't make this any less horrific.

What you need to do though, is get yourself healthy. Work out as much as possible, drop the weight ASAP. Spend a lot of time with your friends - it sounds like you have excellent ones, and that will help you tremendously. Lean on them.

Just wait until you drop the weight and look better, become more confident and even get another girl. Your EX might even get jealous. 

Bottom line is your W has been in this environment so long that she has simply become completely shallow. The shallowest person I've ever heard about on this board. 

Get well. Put her behind you and move on. She is not normal. This isn't how people behave in the real world.


----------



## river rat

Your wife is a sociopath. Be forever grateful that you are rid of her. Now start working on getting yourself into better physical and emotional health. Good luck. Prayers of all of us are with you.


----------



## Chaparral

From what you say she is being paid to be one of the single women inthe group.

If I were you and had the money, a PI would get info/pictures on all the members and out them all. Starting with cheaterville.com. Anytime someone googled their name..............bazinga


----------



## keko

R, 

Be glad she will be out of your life. 

Make sure to workout as much as possible. If you haven't already, tell the details to her family and friends.

Also buy some drinks to the friends that stood by you.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Count of Monte Cristo

Wow!

That's completely f*cked up!

I guess your stbxw took those 'whatever happen in Vegas stays in Vegas' commercials too literally.

I'm so sorry.


----------



## OldWolf57

Two thumbs up Chap, bazinga. Have yourself checked for VD, no matter what she said. Just try to make sure the Doc is not a member.


----------



## MrK

I know we all agreed to not do this any more, but...

From being a little paranoid about a new gym membership to uncovering a huge secret swinging lifestyle, just 3 1/2 days later? With full admission of an "initiation" night? There were even a couple of mentions of Penthouse Forum stories.


----------



## Initfortheduration

And they're going to help her with an apartment? Swingers club? She's a wh*re, plain and simple. So they write the check for the apartment or give her cash. She is a prostitute. I know you want to move on, but the thing about good friends, they can be very vengeful when someone they love is betrayed like this. Don't be surprised if the sh!t starts hitting the fan in her life, real quick.


----------



## chaos

Good riddance. Go get yourself tested for STDs and start getting yourself into healthy shape. Nothing helps a person feel great about him or herself than taking good care of his or her body.

Hopefully one day your soon to be ex-wife will experience her own cripling health issues and will be dumped by those she considers her friends.


----------



## keko

One thing I don't get is she gave up a steady marriage, good husband, house for a sex parties. She probably doesn't even have any real savings or retirement. Can't people in these situations see just a few years ahead? What will happen to them? That they're being used and will be thrown out sooner or later.


----------



## lovelygirl

keko said:


> One thing I don't get is she gave up a steady marriage, good husband, house for a sex parties. She probably doesn't even have any real savings or retirement. Can't people in these situations see just a few years ahead? What will happen to them? That they're being used and will be thrown out sooner or later.


Easy and cheap people like her don't have enough brain to realize what they're losing.


----------



## Machiavelli

MrK said:


> I know we all agreed to not do this any more, but...
> 
> From being a little paranoid about a new gym membership to uncovering a huge secret swinging lifestyle, just 3 1/2 days later? With full admission of an "initiation" night? There were even a couple of mentions of Penthouse Forum stories.


speaking of which, what happened to the Wow....'s thread?


----------



## Initfortheduration

keko said:


> One thing I don't get is she gave up a steady marriage, good husband, house for a sex parties. She probably doesn't even have any real savings or retirement. Can't people in these situations see just a few years ahead? What will happen to them? That they're being used and will be thrown out sooner or later.


A lot of *****s live for the moment. Nothing sadder then an old one. They'll dump the skank as she ages.


----------



## Gabriel

keko said:


> One thing I don't get is she gave up a steady marriage, good husband, house for a sex parties. She probably doesn't even have any real savings or retirement. Can't people in these situations see just a few years ahead? What will happen to them? That they're being used and will be thrown out sooner or later.


Oh I get it completely. He explained it. He gained a lot of weight, had some health problems. Her sex rank stayed really high - it was no longer a match for his. She saw this - others maybe even said, "THAT's your husband?". It got in her head. 

Also, she's a freaking waitress. What retirement? She probably sees this lifestyle as a way to save money for a few years. More than she would have any other way. These swingers are rich, they'll take care of her, even for awhile, while she socks it away.

It's not that hard to see how that could happen. The issue isn't logic. It's morality, loyalty and love, which this person has zero of.


----------



## lordmayhem

Although she denies it, she's nothing more than a prostitute. 

And that initiation night? Probably a gang bang. I would continue with a PI, expose the whole group. The good thing is the house in in your name, no kids, finances already separated. She's not the person you married, not anymore. The person you married died a long time ago. Kick this new person to the curb.


----------



## Cubby

Gabriel said:


> Oh I get it completely. He explained it. He gained a lot of weight, had some health problems. Her sex rank stayed really high - it was no longer a match for his. She saw this - others maybe even said, "THAT's your husband?". It got in her head.
> 
> Also, she's a freaking waitress. What retirement? She probably sees this lifestyle as a way to save money for a few years. More than she would have any other way. These swingers are rich, they'll take care of her, even for awhile, while she socks it away.
> 
> It's not that hard to see how that could happen. The issue isn't logic. It's morality, loyalty and love, which this person has zero of.


:iagree: Yes, the sex rank changed. Plus her job subjected her boundaries to a continuous assault, night after night. Eventually the boundaries eroded, and she rationalized what she was doing. It's easy to see how a person with weak character could fall into her behavior.


----------



## brokenbloke

Not that it really matters but the initiation night most certainly was a gang bang of sorts, probably involving some nasty, degrading, or kinky stuff. 

OP, remind yourself that your wife is now a prostitute. She is a hore, plain and simple. She traded in her marriage and relationship to be banged by a group of people in exchange for travel and an apartment. She sold her dignity for some material goods. I say remind yourself of that because you don't want that type of woman, and there are plenty of woman out there with actual morals who you will meet.

You're obviously in alot of pain so one way I would recommend dealing with it is through physical excercise. For men especially, excercising, moving, keeping busy is a great way to deal with the pain. It also has the added benefit and making you look and feel better.

In time when the pain subsides you might want to read some books like Married Men Sex Life Primer and other books that deal with how to be the kind of man that attracts and keeps hot, faithful women. No you no longer are in a marriage, thats in a rut or otherwise, for whom the book is explicitly intended, but its content is very applicable and useful for any guy at any stage. Her becoming a hore is not your fault. She made her own unscrupulous decisions. However, from the sounds of it you let yourself go a bit and that likely made it more likely for her to look elsewhere. (Reading the book now and it's got such great insight). Anyways, all in due time.

Take care of yourself dude. You're in a world of hurt as many here have been before you. Detach yourself from this woman as much and quickly as you can, hang out and be with your friends and family, confide in them, HAVE FUN with them, it will help get your mind of it as best you can. And take care of yourself. Starting working out alot, join some sport teams, take up a martial arts etc. It will help immensely. And eat better as well. You're shell shocked right now so you need to do these things to be to deal with them, both physically and emotionally. Take charge, don't be passive and let this whole situation continue to affect you. Be your own man and deal with it on your own terms as much as possible.

Come here to vent as well, it's a great support group. Good luck


----------



## river rat

MrK said:


> I know we all agreed to not do this any more, but...
> 
> From being a little paranoid about a new gym membership to uncovering a huge secret swinging lifestyle, just 3 1/2 days later? With full admission of an "initiation" night? There were even a couple of mentions of Penthouse Forum stories.


That occurred to me, also, but in the spirit of giving him the benefit of the doubt, I didn't think I'd post it. Thanks to you for saying what I was thinking.


----------



## Entropy3000

brokenbloke said:


> Not that it really matters but the initiation night most certainly was a gang bang of sorts, probably involving some nasty, degrading, or kinky stuff.
> 
> OP, remind yourself that your wife is now a prostitute. She is a hore, plain and simple. She traded in her marriage and relationship to be banged by a group of people in exchange for travel and an apartment. She sold her dignity for some material goods. I say remind yourself of that because you don't want that type of woman, and there are plenty of woman out there with actual morals who you will meet.
> 
> You're obviously in alot of pain so one way I would recommend dealing with it is through physical excercise. For men especially, excercising, moving, keeping busy is a great way to deal with the pain. It also has the added benefit and making you look and feel better.
> 
> In time when the pain subsides you might want to read some books like Married Men Sex Life Primer and other books that deal with how to be the kind of man that attracts and keeps hot, faithful women. No you no longer are in a marriage, thats in a rut or otherwise, for whom the book is explicitly intended, but its content is very applicable and useful for any guy at any stage. Her becoming a hore is not your fault. She made her own unscrupulous decisions. However, from the sounds of it you let yourself go a bit and that likely made it more likely for her to look elsewhere. (Reading the book now and it's got such great insight). Anyways, all in due time.
> 
> Take care of yourself dude. You're in a world of hurt as many here have been before you. Detach yourself from this woman as much and quickly as you can, hang out and be with your friends and family, confide in them, HAVE FUN with them, it will help get your mind of it as best you can. And take care of yourself. Starting working out alot, join some sport teams, take up a martial arts etc. It will help immensely. And eat better as well. You're shell shocked right now so you need to do these things to be to deal with them, both physically and emotionally. Take charge, don't be passive and let this whole situation continue to affect you. Be your own man and deal with it on your own terms as much as possible.
> 
> Come here to vent as well, it's a great support group. Good luck


Also not that it matters it is hard to beleive one would overnight go from faithful wifey to being gang banged. I could be wrong. Just saying this was probably a lifestyle change that involved other forms of infidelity along the way much earlier than this.


----------



## Count of Monte Cristo

killthecheaters said:


> your life will be better ... and her she will die with all of her BF's and OM .. in horrible ways .. her mother is a ***** .. and also parents all the guys she slept are ***** and ******* .. they will die horribly soon.


Huh? 

Wishing death on others is never a good idea. Also, you know nothing about this woman's parents to be making those kinds of statements.


----------



## Entropy3000

RGoldman said:


> i wasn't even going to post tonight, but it is like writing in my journal and very cathartic. Very, very emotional day. My world has dropped out from under me and i have that free falling sensation going on. I wish what happened was a story, but my god it is FOR REAL!!! I never thought this crap could happen, but many of you and some of my IRL friends guessed it. I knew something was going on, but I never ever would have. You just dont ever think this stuff is for real, going on all around you.
> 
> I'll start with the good.
> 
> Friends that stand by you during your worst nightmare are priceless. God bless them all.
> 
> A house I own because my parents gave it to me when they retired and insisted it remain in my name only. Now I know why. If you think she will fight for it, keep going.
> 
> Separate bank accounts because of her tips. We even filed separately because of that.
> 
> Most waitresses really are good women. My STBExW and her little group are the exception. Remember one of the waitresses is helping us from her work, and she even called me when my STBExW failed to show for work today. She will call me everyday to make sure i'm ok.
> 
> I now have room in my house for a home gym!! Have to smile at something, right?
> 
> STBExW's confession.
> 
> The bad.
> 
> She slept in our house last night, left for work around 1o, waited and circled back in an hour later when we were there packing and changing locks. A very Oh ****! moment. She wanted to know why I didn't come home. I told her why with 3 letters and 3 numbers--BMW 750.
> 
> She called her boyfriend to get him to come and help. She used a cell i have never seen before. He wisely stayed away when she said I had friends with me. One of my boys even grabbed the cell and unleashed a mix of profanity I never heard from him before to her BF. I can't thank my boy enough. He even got scratched by the *****.
> 
> The VAR cannot be recovered.
> 
> She blames *ME* for everything.
> 
> STBExW's confession.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So, we got caught and it was ugly as soon as she got out of her car. Screaming, yelling, swear words everywhere, tears and just honest crying because of what we were doing. We moved the argument inside to avoid police attention.
> 
> Inside I listened, my friends questioned bc there was no way i could speak clearly or confidently. We showed her the cell pics of her, the plate info from the BMW, the address to the house she went to, and we gave her a description of her activities including times. I wanted to throw up, still do actually. Anyways, she caved in right there, and said it was all my fault. Because of my weight and health, she became disgusted with me and started to see other men about 2 years ago.
> 
> This is very difficult. I need to breathe and step away and come back as i write.
> 
> She said it started with drinks and petting at local bars, moved to ONS, and then a few BFs. All of this during my day time work hours in the morning or her girls night out, and never at our home. Late last year a BF of one of her Toxic friends asked her out bc he knew about her girls night out habits. She dated that couple to try something new. They in turn introduced her to a swingers club. If you guessed swinger, well there it is.
> 
> We asked if she was a hooker or escort. No. What else did she try? Just about everything. Protection? Not used in the club. She said her initiation night would kill me, and i I agreed to let that one stay quiet.
> 
> She said the club is very protective and they all get tested a couple times a year. Because I was not in this, they were pressuring her to drop me or leave the club. She wanted in and said some of the perks are help from other members. They apparantly have lawyers in the club, and doctors. She was planning to leave me very soon.
> 
> We asked her why she wanted in? They have a system for single women there. They sign up for what they will do, for how long, and with whom. She is going to be the girlfriend of that older couple for a year and in return get travel, an apartment, clothing, you get the picture. I guess they call it Sugar Daddy.
> 
> Anyways, she will not contest since she already started to file for D because of my health. She doesn't want anything from me except her things, which i allowed her to go through the house and have packed. I indicated that if she tries to gouge me that all these details she shared will come out in a new filing.
> 
> I really don't care what she does anymore, she is out of my house and soon out of my life.
> 
> Enough rambling, and i'm so tired.


Just catching up here. Yes she was passed around and was viewed for all to see. Yes in gang bang style. Drugs no doubt as well. Probably was involved in everything imaginable.

Anyway, yeah this validates my feeling that this did not happen over night.

This is very much EYES WIDE SHUT. Certainly more crude but the same idea.

Sorry dude. In a way this makes it easier to make the break. Not any real middle ground here.


----------



## Machiavelli

Entropy3000 said:


> Also not that it matters it is hard to beleive one would overnight go from faithful wifey to being gang banged. I could be wrong. Just saying this was probably a lifestyle change that involved other forms of infidelity along the way much earlier than this.


No question about it. When I was much younger and single a married woman asked me to get into an aspect of this so-called "lifestyle" with her. I had zero interest in it for myself, but I was curious as to how a previously Christian woman could get into it. The answer: baby steps. 

It's the rationalization hamster doing its thing.


----------



## bandit.45

Poor guy.

This is awful. I'm staying off this thread folks.


----------



## calif_hope

Hey, 

Why don't you give a local TV reporter a call and expose this swingers club.........a station in my area did a 3 part report on a local club/members......fun to watch........the reporter won a regional emmy.


----------



## Jonesey

Holly **** :-(

Damn i wish this was troll thread..:-(


----------



## MrK

brokenbloke said:


> Not that it really matters but the initiation night most certainly was a gang bang of sorts, probably involving some nasty, degrading, or kinky stuff.


Yeah, your right that it doesn't really matter, but I think we've all thought about initiation night and came up with our own fantasies...er,..uhm..I mean...uh...CONCLUSION, yeah...that's it; intillectual analytical conclusion of what went on. How it pertains to the story, I mean.

And yes, my "conclusion" included a gang-bang, now that you mention it. And some toys. And a really big snake.

Not that it matters.


----------



## Shaggy

So you should expose this sex club wide and far. Call the local media, they love this kind of story.

Start a blog and post the photos you have of it.

Print a flyer with the photos and the story and mail it to all the houses in the neighborhood. This will expose it to the neighborhood nicely. I mean the houses in the neighborhood of the place she went in the BMW too.

If you can find where she's living now, do the same to the neighborhood there. These sex club people are very sick people and the neighbors need to know what kind of people are living near them 

Her happy sex club world will come crashing down and they will dump her for being the one to cause it.

Find who the OM is and expose to his clients and employer.

Oh, and she likely has a nice fat bank account someplace with lots of cash in it. Get your lawyer to go find it and go after it.



Do not tell her you are don't it, just expose it. Do it tomorrow.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Shaggy

Oh and expose her at work and expose to the bf and husbands of these other girls in the group so these men know what their wives maybe involved in with her.

You have a lot of exposing you can and should do here.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Beowulf

To the OP,

My friend, I have no words. And for those that know me that is not like me. I am literally sick to my stomach right now. All I can say is that the karma bus is being fueled up right now and when it reaches its destination it won't be a pretty sight. My God.


----------



## Beowulf

bandit.45 said:


> Poor guy.
> 
> This is awful. I'm staying off this thread folks.


I can't do this one either Bandit. I'm literally sick at this.


----------



## Hope1964

Holy crap. This is insane. I am still processing what you posted. Holy crap.


----------



## TDSC60

Shaggy said:


> Oh and expose her at work and expose to the bf and husbands of these other girls in the group so these men know what their wives maybe involved in with her.
> 
> You have a lot of exposing you can and should do here.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I am literally sick over what she has done. I don't normally advocate revenge, but in this case, I think spending a little time to try and find out what you can do to nail her to the wall might be time well spent.

First stop lawyer.
Second stop accountant, try to find funds she has been hiding, they are there somewhere. Lawyer might hook you up.
Third stop - police station - I don't know the laws where you are but what she is doing can only be termed as prostitution.
And don't forget her employer. They might like to know there is a prostitution ring operating in their casino.

Good luck.


----------



## Shamwow

TDSC60 said:


> They might like to know there is a prostitution ring operating in their casino.
> 
> Good luck.


Wouldn't be the first in Vegas, that's for sure. Hell, some of the cops are probably partaking in such "clubs".

I would say you should expose this far and wide, but also realize that precautions should be taken for your safety. If this is really what you're describing, the people who will be taken down will certainly seek retribution, and have the means to make it happen. Bear in mind that since your STBXW told you some of those details, exposure could very well put her in harm's way, and right quick. Next stop, you.

Perhaps it's time to consider a move? And certainly you owe your W nothing at this point, but it could be a death sentence if she doesn't get the heck outta town too. Not your problem, but not a good thought either.

Good luck. Take care of yourself first, but realize this is similar to toying with the mafia. Much lower scale, but all of these "prominent citizens" will be...umm...slightly agitated at having their lavish lifestyles and reputations stripped from them and perhaps spending some time in prison. I imagine hookers/strippers disappear fairly regularly, especially in a place like Vegas.

She has really put you up sh!t creek.


----------



## keko

Shamwow said:


> I imagine hookers/strippers disappear fairly regularly, especially in a place like Vegas.


I wouldn't be surprised if one of the doctors that is involved put her to sleep.....


----------



## Shamwow

keko said:


> I wouldn't be surprised if one of the doctors that is involved will put her to sleep.....


Wouldn't be as precarious if she were single and doing such things. But it blows my mind they would "initiate" a married woman, without her husband's consent or knowledge. Talk about stupid.


----------



## TDSC60

Shamwow said:


> Wouldn't be the first in Vegas, that's for sure. Hell, some of the cops are probably partaking in such "clubs".
> 
> I would say you should expose this far and wide, but also realize that precautions should be taken for your safety. If this is really what you're describing, the people who will be taken down will certainly seek retribution, and have the means to make it happen. Bear in mind that since your STBXW told you some of those details, exposure could very well put her in harm's way, and right quick. Next stop, you.
> 
> Perhaps it's time to consider a move? And certainly you owe your W nothing at this point, but it could be a death sentence if she doesn't get the heck outta town too. Not your problem, but not a good thought either.
> 
> Good luck. Take care of yourself first, but realize this is similar to toying with the mafia. Much lower scale, but all of these "prominent citizens" will be...umm...slightly agitated at having their lavish lifestyles and reputations stripped from them and perhaps spending some time in prison. I imagine hookers/strippers disappear fairly regularly, especially in a place like Vegas.
> 
> She has really put you up sh!t creek.


Not a lawyer but I think prostitution is illegal in Las Vegas.

I agree that shining the light on this situation could cause some form of pay-back. But still, going to the police and providing the info he has so far could get the investigation started and they do not have to involve him after that. If they choose not to investigate then let it go. 

A TV reporter might be even better since they can legally protect their sources.

I don't think I could just let it go. I hate entitled, rich people who think they can buy anything they want regardless of the effect on the innocent.

From his last post it appears that the cat is out of the bag anyway as far as the people she is involved with. They know that he knows. That in it's self could be enough for them to take some kind of action.


----------



## RGoldman

Did not sleep, but i feel free now, and yes somewhat heartbroken.

As I said before, this was going on behind my back for about two years and it escalated. How did i miss the signs?

and she is very volatile when she doesn't get her way. We caught her plain and simple, true to her form she went BOOM! I was lurking for a few weeks on TAM before i finally had the courage to post. I'm actually glad my friends pushed me and we chased her **** down this quickly. All done, over now except for some damn paperwork.

Test results I'll find out next week.

She is exposed at work, but her HR dept can deal with that crap, not me. she can tell her family, not me. Besides, her mother is a bi tch.

My boss gave me the rest of the week off. He was here yesterday when it all went down. And the irony, i joined a gym today since i had the time.

I have decided to just let her go her way. she will suffer what she starts, so i'm not chasing her or her friends anymore.

I rly don't want to think about what she did when she joined this group. she also made threats that there are ppl with power in the club. 

I need to build my new life starting this morning.

So, Thanks for all the support, but i'm moving on. God Bless You All.


----------



## Gabriel

Shamwow said:


> Wouldn't be as precarious if she were single and doing such things. But it blows my mind they would "initiate" a married woman, without her husband's consent or knowledge. Talk about stupid.


Is it explicitly illegal though? People can have sex with whomever they want. Figuratively, she's a hooker because they are going to set her up with an apartment, etc, but since they aren't paying cash, can't they just say they are letting her crash at one of their places they own? If there's no explicit exchange of money, I'm not sure what "bringing this thing down" really means.

Swingers clubs are consentual - nobody's getting raped, right? So.....what can the OP really do other than maybe just embarrass some people?


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## Shamwow

Agreed. He's probably in danger now.

And I didn't mean to imply that he shouldn't expose because it's dangerous. I can't stand the idea of rich pricks pretending to be upstanding while defiling others so blatantly, and getting away with it.

Just pointing out that many details should be thought through before exposing. Then expose.


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## brokenbloke

MrK said:


> Yeah, your right that it doesn't really matter, but I think we've all thought about initiation night and came up with our own fantasies...er,..uhm..I mean...uh...CONCLUSION, yeah...that's it; intillectual analytical conclusion of what went on. How it pertains to the story, I mean.
> 
> And yes, my "conclusion" included a gang-bang, now that you mention it. And some toys. And a really big snake.
> 
> Not that it matters.


Come up with your own conclusions. And no a gang bang is hardly a fantasy, not for myself at least. Guess maybe you're different.


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## MrK

brokenbloke said:


> Come up with your own conclusions. And no a gang bang is hardly a fantasy, not for myself at least. Guess maybe you're different.


Lighten up. It was a joke.


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## keko

RGoldman said:


> I have decided to just let her go her way. she will suffer what she starts, so i'm not chasing her or her friends anymore.
> 
> I rly don't want to think about what she did when she joined this group. she also made threats that there are ppl with power in the club.
> 
> I need to build my new life starting this morning.


As much as most people would want to take revenge, you're doing the right thing by letting it go. Possibly you could face repurcussion's from those "influential" people but its not worth it. At the end of the day your stbxw will get dumped.


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## brokenbloke

MrK said:


> Lighten up. It was a joke.


Fair enough. Tone is difficult to infer over the internet (smilies help though)  Took it as you calling me a perv...


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## brokenbloke

I'm undecided about the exposure aspect. I think we here at TAM all like the idea of WS and their ilk being exposed but maybe it would just be best for the OP just move on. It takes alot of energy, emotional and physical, to expose such a...complicated situation and maybe just detaching himself from the situation as best and quick as he can and beginning his new life is healthiest for him at this point. I dunno, could be wrong though. 

Good job on joining a gym. Work on yourself now. Be the best man you can be in every area of your life, for your own sake. Good luck.


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## Chaparral

I would hire a PI to get hte info on these people with picuters and send it all to all the TV staions in town annonymoustly. F*ck every last one of them. They shouldnot be allowed to ruin more familes for their perverted pleasures. 

The idea of just slinking off and licking one's wounds is as repugnant as what the rich swingers are doing. They raped his family and there will be more.


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## Shaggy

I think sham is being dramatic, these people aren't the mafia, they a sleazy swingers.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Shaggy

And go after her money, she likely has a good amount stashed.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Shamwow

Shaggy said:


> I think sham is being dramatic, these people aren't the mafia, they a sleazy swingers.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


You're probably right...just saying we don't know them, or the level of the situation. If there's an "initiation" we're not talking people who pick up a girl at Denny's for a good time later. There's also probably an understanding about not talking. I certainly would tread lightly.


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## Shaggy

Shamwow said:


> You're probably right...just saying we don't know them, or the level of the situation. If there's an "initiation" we're not talking people who pick up a girl at Denny's for a good time later. There's also probably an understanding about not talking. I certainly would tread lightly.


That's my point. By outing it she will be persona non grata with the group. They'll dump her, but nothing from tv.

Obviously OP knows where they live etc. the nice note to the neighbors would be the most effective here.

These people are idiot subburb dweebs who have watch too many bad pirn films. Sure initiation was likely her being used and passed around etc. did she go away for anygirs weekends etc in the past and come home exhausted. 

Please expose these sickos before the recruit any other wives and ruin more marriages.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Chaparral

Machiavelli said:


> speaking of which, what happened to the Wow....'s thread?


He must have deleted it. That sure is puzzeling. Moma came home and his thread got deleted. Why would that happen?


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## iheartlife

deleted post


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## Machiavelli

chapparal said:


> He must have deleted it. That sure is puzzeling. Moma came home and his thread got deleted. Why would that happen?


She probably keylogged him . I've been lurking on that cheating wife board somebody linked to and it's all about countermeasures, as well as crowing about how their OM's are so much better in the sack than their BH's. They even use the same shorthand we do. Once they get caught, it'll be "it was never abut the sex and OM was the size of a vienna sausage."


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## warlock07

Machiavelli said:


> She probably keylogged him . I've been lurking on that cheating wife board somebody linked to and it's all about countermeasures, as well as crowing about how their OM's are so much better in the sack than their BH's. They even use the same shorthand we do. Once they get caught, it'll be "it was never abut the sex and OM was the size of a vienna sausage."


What are you guys talking about? Whose thread ?


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## keko

Talk About Marriage - View Profile: Wow...


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## Chaparral

warlock07 said:


> What are you guys talking about? Whose thread ?


Not Whose ......Wows


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## Chaparral

keko said:


> Talk About Marriage - View Profile: Wow...


Thanks, I PMed him but I think he is being held hostage.


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## warlock07

Got me confused for ShamWow for a second.


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## keko

chapparal said:


> Thanks, I PMed him but I think he is being held hostage.


But it's still much better then where Rgoldman was for the last two days.


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## Shaggy

Ron

If these sex sleazy bags of hers are so powerful, how come she was still working as a waitress? Surely such powerful people would have set her up in a nice cushy job?

I think you'll find that they aren't so much after all and you right now hold the key to ending her happy affair world. You just gotta have the balls to do it.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## TBT

There's only so much shelf life on the higher end of her profession,then she'll get relegated on down the line into obscurity.Ron's revenge will be him living a much better and more fulfilling life.


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## morituri

This thread should have been titled "Eyes Wide Shut"


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## the guy

I'm amazed OP got the full story, and Yes I think she laid it all out on the table. Even though I'm surprised she did him right by letting OP know how far she had gone and how long she has stepped out.

Even though Op will most likely never come back he got the answers that I was so affraid he never would get. 
That was My concern, so often we a betrayed go off never knowing what was really going on and the unanswered question suck.

Even thuough painful OP now can see through the forest and can take the step knowing exactly what his WW has become and move on.

Again I can't believe he got the whole story but I'm glad he now has this painful truth. Its so much easier for him to move on and let go IMHO

I'm sure there are arguement for maybe being left in the dark, but then there is this struggle of "is divorce the right thing", or "will I have regrets" as painful as it is I think OP is better off knowing everything.


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## morituri

Part of the allure of doing something forbidden is precisely because IT IS forbidden. The OP's wife was involved in a secret, double-life that provided excitement in large part because it was forbidden. But now that she has been exposed and that a divorce is a certainty, the allure will be diminished because now she won't have a home that she can return to and a husband waiting to give her companionship. After the orgies, she will end her days alone, emotionally empty and unloved - just ask bandit.45 how casual sex is working for his stbxw.


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## bandit.45

Its eating her alive.


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## the guy

That is so true, the unhealthy life style in front of OP WW will forever give her emptyness. 

The snowball effect that started 2yrs ago is so familiar to me and what my fWW went through. The unhealthy behavior all starts with a particular issue and is handled in the wrong way and this fake excape leads to even more unhealthy behaviors. But at the end of the day it all just an exscape.

I have a feeling that she will continue to use the swinger life style until the feeling of being used and her emotions get trambled over and over again that it will be years before she break down and gets out and finds help.

As a unicorn (life style term for single women) her soul pupose is to satisfy other couples (healthier couples) want for sexual plesear. She will only be used as there toy, all the while these couple move on with out her. Just like many toyes, they often get boring.


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## morituri

If she was a party girl that never got married, then I can see her continuing unabated in this lifestyle but consider that before she became the person she is now, she was a woman who fell in love with a man and married him to share her life and grow old together. The person she was is bound to intrude into her thoughts from time to time and probably cause her turmoil. All the men and women she will encounter will be users who will lose no sleep about discarding her when she no longer suits their purposes. These people will be ones riding the karma bus that will roll over her many times over.


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## the guy

Interesting, that old value system versus the new value system. Hopefully that old value system come back sooner then later and can have a healthy life.
But for now I think fantasy land will mask her hidden pain, that and the unhealthy influence of her new BF will keep the new value systme in place.

It makes sence, that old value system will rise up after enough abuse she gets with her current values


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## Beowulf

That lifestyle will age her incredibly fast. When she hits the wall her "sponsors" will toss her out into the garbage like a broken sex toy. Her life will not be a pretty one. It will be full of pain and anguish.


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## Shaggy

Her only value to these people is a piece of meat to use for sex. There is a good chance she using drugs like coke or meth as well.

Wanna bet how little emotional support they are giving her right now? No one likes when their pets need attention, it spoils the mood.

This is why I strongly suggest OP notifies the neighbors as a way to throw sand into her relationship with these people.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Chaparral

morituri said:


> Part of the allure of doing something forbidden is precisely because IT IS forbidden. The OP's wife was involved in a secret, double-life that provided excitement in large part because it was forbidden. But now that she has been exposed and that a divorce is a certainty, the allure will be diminished because now she won't have a home that she can return to and a husband waiting to give her companionship. After the orgies, she will end her days alone, emotionally empty and unloved - just ask bandit.45 how casual sex is working for his stbxw.


Its hard to imagine that it won't take long for her to realize she is getting paid, albiet with trips, an apartment, etc. to be a *****. She may call it something else but if I were OP I would make sure everyone and especially she knew this is what any normal person would think.

She is being badly used by people that should know better. If she was my wife /relative, friend, I would be aon a mission from hell to make them regret what they had done. Cheaterville.com would only be my first stop.


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## Chaparral

This should also be a wake up call for Rgoldman to get his sh!t together and get back in shape and stay that way.


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## the guy

I have a feeling he knows what he needs to do. Even though we may never hear from him again, at least he took the step and got the truth. That is a big step for many that struggle. I think he's been struggling for 2 yrs and it was this site that gave him the validation that all his close friend had been pushing this whole time.


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## morituri

chapparal said:


> Its hard to imagine that it won't take long for her to realize she is getting paid, albiet with trips, an apartment, etc. to be a *****. She may call it something else but if I were OP I would make sure everyone and especially she knew this is what any normal person would think.
> 
> She is being badly used by people that should know better. If she was my wife /relative, friend, I would be aon a mission from hell to make them regret what they had done. Cheaterville.com would only be my first stop.


Organized crime may not be as powerful as it was years ago in Vegas but it still involved in the sex trade. You fvck with them and you're dead. If she's involved with shady people then her fate may not be a pretty one.


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## Chaparral

morituri said:


> Organized crime may not be as powerful as it was years ago in Vegas but it still involved in the sex trade. You fvck with them and you're dead. If she's involved with shady people then her fate may not be a pretty one.


Another good reason to out the whole bunch and get her away from that life. Hooking ain't easy.

He could get the info out annoymously.

Lots of hookers get offed by their pimps, mafia or not.

Their friends just think they skipped town, unless they are being made an example.


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## Shaggy

morituri said:


> Organized crime may not be as powerful as it was years ago in Vegas but it still involved in the sex trade. You fvck with them and you're dead. If she's involved with shady people then her fate may not be a pretty one.


If she was involved with anything like that she would have been long gone before this and would be out working and likely on drugs. It helps keep them working that way since youve got a hook into them.

In ths case it's upper middie class trash that think they are beng oh do cool having their swingers circle, when in reality they all have paheitic broken relationships that will end in bitterness,divorce, and cheating, nothing special here,no mob, just morons.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## keko

Shaggy said:


> In ths case it's upper middie class trash that think they are beng oh do cool having their swingers circle, when in reality they all have paheitic broken relationships that will end in bitterness,divorce, and cheating, nothing special here,no mob, just morons.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


My thoughts as well. If they were really "powerful" they wouldn't be chauffering their toy around or pick her up when she was kicked out of her house.


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## RGoldman

An update since I have gotten so many messages of support from so many of you. 

Last I heard, Ex is flown around to various vacation spots by her "owners" and basically used like a toy. In my mind and heart, I have let go and she is free to live that lifestyle she chose. In time I'll forget, but can I forgive? I don't know. The paperwork is going thru uncontested and should be a "no brainer" since neither of us wants anything from each other.

I'm much calmer now, as you can tell that I type much better now. :rofl:

But, here is the best parts. No STD's! :smthumbup: And, I have already met somebody new at the gym where I have lost 10+ pounds already. she is in much better shape than me, but keeps me working to my goal. She is a friend of one of the waitresses that helped fire my Ex and knows my story. My friends still stay by my side and keep me moving forward.

I have to admit though there were some rough days where the self blame and depression really kicked in, but one day i woke up and felt free. Really don't know a better word than free. My old marriage seems like a fading bad dream now, until the lawyers call but that will stop soon.

Take Care Everyone!

PS my friends and I are soon going to confront a jerk who is beating a female friend of mine and some other sick crap he does to her. Good to be on this side of the fight, and not in it.


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## the guy

Thanks for the update brother and it sound like your going to be just fine. Working out does wonders for me and it just a great way to spend the energy.

You will be so much better off in years to come you have no idea...I just feel it. It seem at least for me when you go through something this traumatic, there is always a great reward in the end.

Just like on the other side of the coin the wayward has to deal with the karma bus. It all takes time but we weep what we sow!!!!!!

When we are in are golden years with a SO to take care of each other, I have a feeling your X will be alone in trailer park filled with a hundred cats and cat boo, only to be found dead by the mailman with no one to give a damb about her except her hungry cats.

Stay strong man and good things will come your way.


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## Shaggy

And did you expose the sex ring to her employer and the neighbors of the house? If not then why not?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## keko

Good to hear R. 

Take your time with the girls and try not to settle for the first one. Since you know what the red flags of a cheater are, take one step at a time.

Also prepare yourself when/if your ex comes begging you to help her out. More then likely she'll be thrown away with nowhere to go. Keep your ground and don't give in.


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## happyman64

R,
I am glad that your head and heart are on the mend.

Life will get better as time goes on.

And cherish your friends my man. It sounds like you have a good crew to hang out with.

Screw your exwife. Do not give her a 2nd thought. She will find out soon enough what it feels like to be discarded property.

I am glad the std test came out negative.

And the workouts with your lady friend are good. I hope she whips your head, body and maybe even your heart into better shape for you.

Cheers to a better, brighter future!

Warmest Regards,

HM64

Ps
Thankyou for letting us know how you are. Do not be a stranger in the future.....
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## warlock07

Hopefully she won't end up in porn


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## happyman64

W,
She probably already has a porn filmed during her initiation.

She is no longer RGoldman's problem. 

HM64
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## lordmayhem

Her ambition in life was to become a sex slave/prostitute?

Was she that hot? She's going to end up disappearing one day and just be yet another missing person in the NCIC list. Truly sad.

And a new chapter is beginning.


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## warlock07

lordmayhem said:


> Her ambition in life was to become a sex slave/prostitute?
> 
> Was she that hot? She's going to end up disappearing one day and just be yet another missing person in the NCIC list. Truly sad.
> 
> And a new chapter is beginning.


There are many that live this lifestyle. How she ends up depends on how she manages herself after this. There are many successful narcissist and sociopaths living out there. She is none of his concern now.


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## Machiavelli

lordmayhem said:


> Her ambition in life was to become a sex slave/prostitute?
> 
> Was she that hot? She's going to end up disappearing one day and just be yet another missing person in the NCIC list. Truly sad.
> 
> And a new chapter is beginning.


Maybe it's just a sequel.


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## RGoldman

Not my job to expose the ring, especially since no one is forced into the group. Some of my Buds have filed tips to local law, but it isn't my problem anymore. Right now I need to repair me and help others through this kind of nightmare. scary just how many bad marriages are out there, and how many predators are waiting to scoop these people up and twist them into somebody you wouldn't even know anymore.


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## the guy

Its a sign of the time brother, a sign of the time!!!!!!!!

I'm lucky I got my fWW out when I did, sorry it didn;t turn out the same for you but sometimes things are ment to be so I know good thing are in front of you, in fact from the sound of thing, they already are.

BTW going to the Strat. next week and visiting MIL over in Henderson. Going to the GreenDoor....NOT!!!

Stay cool brother it should be starting to warm up these days.


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## Shaggy

Actually outing them helps make it difficult for them to do this with others. It's turnings blind eye to them and not holding them accountable that helps enable it.

Did you expose to her family and friends so they know just what kind of cheap $&$&$ she has turned into?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## the guy

@shaggy, this crap is a life style, and there are several puplic clubs in Vegas, hell there two that I know in San Diego.

My point is this isn't about preventing "them". it about having your own boundries to stay away from "them".

a wierd analogy would be comparing prohibition with sex...and look what happened to prohibition.

Again Shag- it a life style if it wasn't the specific couple in this thread it would be another or another or another. OP STBXW made her choice, all beit influenced by her BF, she is infact an adult.

I see you comparing it to exposing an affair, but even with affairs if the spouse has left and its an exit affair then it over and time to just let it go. I totaly get the warning other and preventing others, but....

In this case you are tryiny to expose a life style and in this part of the country folks stay out of other folks business, it was like that when the town was first built and it reamins that way. This coming from the-guy that has family in this part of the country.

I don't want to argue, but I do in fact aggree with you in all cases, but in this case and this case alone I have to disaggree.


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## happyman64

Rgoldman is right. His stbxw is not his problem.
The swingers group is not his problem.

His ww has to face her own consequences for life choices she has made.

Good for you RGoldman......
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Chaparral

I would expose the ring. But the improtant thing is have you told her family what she is doing? Would they care that she is exposing herself to such an extremely dangerous situation? You may not care what she does but her family should be given the oppurtunity to "save" her.


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## morituri

Sending a hello to a fellow San Diegan, the_guy.


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## zsu234

Wow! This is like "Boogie Nights" on acid


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