# My Wife is separating from me - Loooong Post



## OutOfTheBlue

Where do I start?

Married 22 years
Three children, 21, 18 and 11


I came from a loving childhood but my W did not. She has suffered from chronic low self esteem since the day I met her and probably for most of her childhood. She was young when we married, only 18. I was 24. She was extremely possessive and regularly flew into jealous rages (throwing things or hitting me) if I spoke to someone else (male or female but worse when female). I could not be 10 minutes late without getting the third degree. This went on for years but decreased in regularity.

About four years ago my W took a shine to the son of our landlord, who would come to the house to do repairs. He only visited a handful of times but this was enough for my W to become smitten. She started to act like a teenager and I knew something was wrong. I also suspected a third party. At the time, she was in therapy and attributed her new mood to the work with the therapist. I knew differently (she's not a good liar) and after two months she admitted to me what had happened. She told me that she was attracted to this man and that she had told him this. When I asked what his response was, she said that he had told her that he was in a relationship but if he wasn't he may have been interested. I went to visit this man and asked him what had happened, he told me that he didn't know what to say when my W propositioned him. He agreed not to come to the house for any reason unless I was there. When I returned home and told my W that he was not interested, she cried. This went on for a few weeks. She assured me that nothing physical had happened but she still had feelings for this man.

We agreed to go to MC, which we did for a number of months. My W's behavior was described as child like by the C and she suggested that my W carried on IC to try to help with her low self esteem. We gave up the rented house and bought a house of our own. Things seemed to be much better between us. At this time my Dad was diagnosed with cancer and I was distraught. I also went to IC to help me deal with life's problems. My W gave me great support during the two years of his illness and for a year after his death (he died a year ago, tomorrow) She was with me every step of the way. She has been great with my Mum as well, giving her practical and emotional support. One month ago, we finally finished all that had to be done for my Mum, including relocation closer to us, so we could help her. 


My W told me last Saturday that she didn't love me and wanted to separate. No, "I love you but not in love with you" rubbish, just a straight, "I have no feelings for you". She told me that since she felt this way, that she could not live with me any more. She said that, although this must be sudden for me, it was not for her. She said that she had been trying to make it work but it just wasn't. She said that events that took place previously had made her realise that I was not for her. She said that she wanted someone to make her feel special and that I didn't. Due to my W's low self esteem, she does not accept compliments or believe that someone could love her. All the attempts I have made through our marriage to let her know that I love her have been rebuked.

My daughters 18 & 21 are as shocked by this news as I am and they are very angry with my W. They have told her that if there is another man or she tries to take custody of their brother 11 or force the sale of the house, then she will never see them again. They have asked my W the same questions I have, as the are just as bewildered as me. They get the same answer. I do not love your Dad, I can't be here and I must do this for me. She has told me that she does not want me to sell the house, that I have done nothing wrong and she doesn't want to punish me any more than she is.

I have decided that as much as I love my W and always saw us growing old together, that I must let her go. I have told her that I love her, that I don't agree with what she is doing but that I accept her decision. I had suggested IC and MC but she has not taken up this suggestion as she now seems hellbent on getting out. She has been busy this week getting advice on housing and financials.

I somehow get the feeling that she is trying to find happiness on the outside as there is none on the inside. I also think that she sees this as a challenge as she has told me that she thinks I think she can't survive on her own. I told her that this was not a competition to me.

I am at a loss as to why she is doing this but I have decided that I must do a 180 for my own sake.

Sorry for the long post


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## aug

OutOfTheBlue said:


> My W told me last Saturday that she didn't love me and wanted to separate. No, "I love you but not in love with you" rubbish, just a straight, "I have no feelings for you". She told me that since she felt this way, that she could not live with me any more. She said that, although this must be sudden for me, it was not for her. She said that she had been trying to make it work but it just wasn't. *She said that events that took place previously had made her realise that I was not for her. She said that she wanted someone to make her feel special and that I didn't. Due to my W's low self esteem, she does not accept compliments or believe that someone could love her. * All the attempts I have made through our marriage to let her know that I love her have been rebuked.



Looks like you're doing the right thing by "letting her go".

From reading your story, there are a few ideas that pop into my head.


1. She learned to hide her current EA or PA better.

2. Even people with low self esteem knows if someone loves them or not. Heck, a baby knows instinctively if you love him/her or not. Why cant an adult?

3. Take full advantage of her guilt right now and get her to sign (even if it's handwritten) and witnessed (by your adult daughters?) a financial and custody agreement favorable to you.

4. She probably feels that time is running out for her to see what sex/love with another man is like. And, to enjoy her independence as a single person? Mid-life crisis? Her impulses/desires are strong right now if she so dead set to leave.


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## lpsscc

I'm kinda going through the same thing but I was asked to leave my marital home and family so she could "be alone"...wth?

After so much reading and time (separated 6 months) I have come to the conclusion that the only way to have a chance to survive is to:

1. The person you loved is dead.
2. Let them go be a dumba$$.
3. Be a good Dad/Mom and have as much fun as you possibly can.
4. In two years when they have FAILED in creating a new blessed life without you and they come crawling back (like a 99.9% probability).... you can then decide what you want to do then.

In the meantime do not try and stop them. Help the hell out of them. Push them along and smile knowing they have just screwed the hell out of themselves.

My opinion.


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## OutOfTheBlue

aug said:


> Looks like you're doing the right thing by "letting her go".
> 
> From reading your story, there are a few ideas that pop into my head.
> 
> 
> 1. She learned to hide her current EA or PA better.
> 
> 2. Even people with low self esteem knows if someone loves them or not. Heck, a baby knows instinctively if you love him/her or not. Why cant an adult?
> 
> 3. Take full advantage of her guilt right now and get her to sign (even if it's handwritten) and witnessed (by your adult daughters?) a financial and custody agreement favorable to you.
> 
> 4. She probably feels that time is running out for her to see what sex/love with another man is like. And, to enjoy her independence as a single person? Mid-life crisis? Her impulses/desires are strong right now if she so dead set to leave.


Thanks for the response aug

Point 1 - I have considered this but she would need to improve her lieing 1000% to achieve this based on the last time. The last time, it was the obvious happiness that gave it away. This time, there is nothing but sadness.

Point 2 - She knows I love her but through our marriage she has believed that no-one could love her. The two people in her childhood who should have shown her love, didn't.

Point 3 - We are writing down the agreement now and it will be signed in front of a solicitor next week.

Point 4 - I think that everything you say in there is applicable to this mess. W is acting like she must do this to save herself. A part of me thinks she is trying to prove a point to herself and to me.

Through our marriage I have encouraged her to take up some interests, to get a career, to get a life but she chose to stay safe in her little bubble, at home with little socialising. I think she has reached an age where she sees her life passing her by.

I asked her the other day to read some real examples of people who have done what she is going to do. She admitted, that she can see herself in these examples. She could see that almost all of these people did not find what they were looking for and in some cases regretted what they had done. Something struck a chord with these examples as she took them to her friends when she went for a chat but I don't know if she produced them.

I told her that if she wanted to change her life she could do so within the confines of her marriage and that I would support her through these changes but the answer is no.

This was the point I decided to back off.


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## OutOfTheBlue

lpsscc said:


> I'm kinda going through the same thing but I was asked to leave my marital home and family so she could "be alone"...wth?
> 
> After so much reading and time (separated 6 months) I have come to the conclusion that the only way to have a chance to survive is to:
> 
> 1. The person you loved is dead.
> 2. Let them go be a dumba$$.
> 3. Be a good Dad/Mom and have as much fun as you possibly can.
> 4. In two years when they have FAILED in creating a new blessed life without you and they come crawling back (like a 99.9% probability).... you can then decide what you want to do then.
> 
> In the meantime do not try and stop them. Help the hell out of them. Push them along and smile knowing they have just screwed the hell out of themselves.
> 
> My opinion.


There's a lot of truth in what you say but it is difficult when you love someone and you can see them making a huge mistake. I feel that what she wants from life is right here under her nose, if she would only open her eyes.

I agree that I must do this though, for myself and the kids if nothing else.


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## lpsscc

OutOfTheBlue said:


> There's a lot of truth in what you say but it is difficult when you love someone and you can see them making a huge mistake. I feel that what she wants from life is right here under her nose, if she would only open her eyes.
> 
> I agree that I must do this though, for myself and the kids if nothing else.


Man I am so right there with you. I hate to say it but keeping her well being in the front of my mind and repeating to myself that "if she could only see" is what kept me spinning for months and months. It was not until I figured out that I am only in charge and can only help ME (and my kids). And the fastest way for them to get through their mess (and effectively "help" them) was to completely remove all emotional, friendship, support etc so they can find out for themselves how great their life is going to be. VERY hard to do. I'm still trying to do it.

In my case this attitude brought her back but now it looks like we are heading down the same road again. Oh well.


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## OutOfTheBlue

lpsscc

During our marriage, I have probably only been out socialising on my own, perhaps twenty times. This was entirely due to her fear of me meeting someone else. (remember she saw herself as not deserving my love and that other women were more attractive to me)

As you can imagine these occasions were not enjoyable, wondering what abuse I would get on returning home.

But, if she has any doubts about what she is about to do (she has already stated that she may find out that she does have feelings for me after all) then I can use this to my advantage.

I think that if I start going out socially, she may begin to think that I may move on quicker than her, which would take away the path back for her. This tactic could plant the seed.


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## lpsscc

I feel your concern. I would continue on doing what makes you comfortable - leaving a door open if that is the case. Only you know when you've had enough...

I apologize if I sound like a downer. I'm just pretty jaded about it all myself. I left the door open for way too long and she just put it in my face and didnt respect the things I did for her to "help" her. It wasn't until I started doing stuff just for me with no regard to her feelings that she started coming back around. This just happened in the last month or so.

Case in point, my wife does not want to get divorced anymore but she does not want to live together....WTH? I allowed her to circle back too soon and now she is holding the cards again.

Pathetic.


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## OutOfTheBlue

lpsscc

Sorry about what you are going through. You seem to have been on a long journey with this.

I intend to adopt the no contact, no niceties policy very quickly. The door may or may not be open but only I will decide if it is. If she ever decides to try to again, it will be under agreed conditions.


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## lpsscc

OutOfTheBlue said:


> lpsscc
> 
> Sorry about what you are going through. You seem to have been on a long journey with this.
> 
> I intend to adopt the no contact, no niceties policy very quickly. The door may or may not be open but only I will decide if it is. If she ever decides to try to again, it will be under agreed conditions.


I wish you the greatest luck Sir. Nothing wrong with leaving a little hope alive just in case but don't stay in denial too long like I did. Protect yourself and try to move on (even if it's just for appearances) for your sake.

Good luck!


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## OutOfTheBlue

W is going to see a flat today and sort out bank details. I have told her that I have accepted what she is doing. 

Our conversations have become short and sweet and I respond to her in a matter of fact way - no emotion.

As I mentioned in my first post, sometimes I feel as though she sees this as a challenge - to prove to herself but more importantly to me, that she can do this. She has made two comments this week stating that I think she can't do this. I have said nothing to her, to elicit this response.


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## OutOfTheBlue

W applied for the flat. Pending credit checks, it's hers.


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## OutOfTheBlue

W sees solicitor tomorrow. I have drafted up my requirements for a legal separation document (Scotland). The fact that I did this took the wind out of her sails. All I got was an OH.

If she thinks she's in the driving seat, she's got another think coming.


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## Unsure in Seattle

Sure- it poked a bit of a hole in her little fantasy or whatever it is that she's lost in.

Good for you.

Be true to yourself and your kids, and please realize that you deserve better than this. 

Best of luck.


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## OutOfTheBlue

Unsure in Seattle said:


> Sure- it poked a bit of a hole in her little fantasy or whatever it is that she's lost in.
> 
> Good for you.
> 
> Be true to yourself and your kids, and please realize that you deserve better than this.
> 
> Best of luck.


My daughter said something to me tonight that hurt as well as pleased.

She said "Dad, mum doesn't deserve you"

When my daughter left the room, I cried because I felt closer to her than I ever have. I love her so much, it hurts.


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## OutOfTheBlue

I have just been thinking that today hasn't been the worst day since the bomb. I have eaten better and I even cracked a joke (I am known for my humour)

I hope it continues


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## OutOfTheBlue

W been to solicitor today for advice. If she follows the advice given, I am screwed financially. Even if we draw up a legal separation agreement, it can be overruled at a later date if deemed unfair. (Scottish Law) My W is being very amicable just now but that may not last (what if I moved on quicker than her)

My only safe option is to agree to a settlement, which would require me to obtain a loan or a re-mortgage. 

I need some time to consider my options now.


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## OutOfTheBlue

W got flat, leaves tomorrow

Wow that was quick

Desperately, trying to gather my thoughts here - this is a whirlwind


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## OutOfTheBlue

Sorry for venting but my head is spinning.

Part of me wants this to happen. Do I want to be with a woman who walks out on her kids?

She either has someone else or she is going through a serious MLC.

I'm a little angry tonight.


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## Dedicated2Her

Out of-----calm down. This happens a lot. As a man, you have a decision to make. Are you willing to wait for her? She will be back. Can you forgive and can you wait? If you can, this experience will change your life for the good as a man. Most men can't wait. They can't change. The one's that do, most of them fall to pride. She is a mess, don't jump on the crazy train with her.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## OutOfTheBlue

Dedicated2Her said:


> Out of-----calm down. This happens a lot. As a man, you have a decision to make. Are you willing to wait for her? She will be back. Can you forgive and can you wait? If you can, this experience will change your life for the good as a man. Most men can't wait. They can't change. The one's that do, most of them fall to pride. She is a mess, don't jump on the crazy train with her.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Thanks for the advice.

I am ok this morning and even though this is the official moving out day, I am at work as normal. Luckily, I have a lot of good people who are looking out for me.

It's too early to say whether I will wait for her or not. A lot will depend on her behaviour going forward. I will carry on with my life as best I can but at this point, she is not my focus.


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## OutOfTheBlue

My W just popped back to my house to collect some things. She said that she would pop back tomorrow for more stuff and to see the kids. She said that she didn't want the kids to think she was abandoning them - well, you know what? I bit my tongue. I said nothing.

The only thing I said was that you text me before you come.


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## Dedicated2Her

Depend on her behaviour? It will be crazy, up and down, uncharacteristic of her to say the least. The real question lies in will you take this time to just work on you and wait. Don't analyze her as you will fry your brain.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## OutOfTheBlue

Dedicated2Her said:


> Depend on her behaviour? It will be crazy, up and down, uncharacteristic of her to say the least. The real question lies in will you take this time to just work on you and wait. Don't analyze her as you will fry your brain.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


When I said behaviour, what I meant was, whether she got involved with another man during her journey. At this point, I do not know how I would deal with that.

As for time, I have plenty. I will get on with my life but there will be no room for other women other than my normal chatting - I need a break from relationships.


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## OutOfTheBlue

Did my first online food shop tonight with the help of my daughter. I am sure she was taking advantage when she kept saying we normally get these Dad, oh and those as well, oh and............

I'll give her a little leeway for a few weeks 

She's been a Godsend during my first night without my wife


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## OutOfTheBlue

*Re: My Wife is separating from me - Day one*

Well, that's day one. Something I forgot to say, when my wife officially left last night, at the point of saying, I am going, she hesitated when all I said was Ok. This hesitation seemed to last for ever.

What was she looking for? Was she expecting me to break down and cry, beg her to stay or was she wanting me to wish her good luck? I don't know but she didn't get whatever she was looking for.

Today, she came to see the kids. She started to remind me of things that needed to be done, such as washing, ironing etc. I politely reminded her that those tasks were my responsibility, not hers, I said that I would make mistakes but I would learn from them. I told her I did not want her doing any organising in my home and that her only purpose for being here was to see the kids.

I don't think my stance is going down well. Believe me, I still love my wife but I am not about to make this easy for her.

Also bought some new clothes today and will be cooking dinner for my Mum tomorrow.

It's still difficult though and I have a long journey ahead.


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## OutOfTheBlue

Just got a text from my youngest daughter, who is out with her friend tonight.

She said, "did mum bother to come and see us and was she bothered that I wasn't there"

I replied that she was here and was disappointed that daughter was out.

I lied. My W barely mentioned that daughter was out.

Why didn't she simply send daughter a text.


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## Anewlife

aug said:


> Looks like you're doing the right thing by "letting her go".
> 
> From reading your story, there are a few ideas that pop into my head.
> 
> 
> 1. She learned to hide her current EA or PA better.
> 
> 2. Even people with low self esteem knows if someone loves them or not. Heck, a baby knows instinctively if you love him/her or not. Why cant an adult?
> 
> 3. Take full advantage of her guilt right now and get her to sign (even if it's handwritten) and witnessed (by your adult daughters?) a financial and custody agreement favorable to you.
> 
> 4. She probably feels that time is running out for her to see what sex/love with another man is like. And, to enjoy her independence as a single person? Mid-life crisis? Her impulses/desires are strong right now if she so dead set to leave.



Too weird. Same thing here.


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## Anewlife

OutOfTheBlue said:


> Where do I start?
> 
> Married 22 years
> Three children, 21, 18 and 11
> 
> 
> I came from a loving childhood but my W did not. She has suffered from chronic low self esteem since the day I met her and probably for most of her childhood. She was young when we married, only 18. I was 24. She was extremely possessive and regularly flew into jealous rages (throwing things or hitting me) if I spoke to someone else (male or female but worse when female). I could not be 10 minutes late without getting the third degree. This went on for years but decreased in regularity.
> 
> About four years ago my W took a shine to the son of our landlord, who would come to the house to do repairs. He only visited a handful of times but this was enough for my W to become smitten. She started to act like a teenager and I knew something was wrong. I also suspected a third party. At the time, she was in therapy and attributed her new mood to the work with the therapist. I knew differently (she's not a good liar) and after two months she admitted to me what had happened. She told me that she was attracted to this man and that she had told him this. When I asked what his response was, she said that he had told her that he was in a relationship but if he wasn't he may have been interested. I went to visit this man and asked him what had happened, he told me that he didn't know what to say when my W propositioned him. He agreed not to come to the house for any reason unless I was there. When I returned home and told my W that he was not interested, she cried. This went on for a few weeks. She assured me that nothing physical had happened but she still had feelings for this man.
> 
> We agreed to go to MC, which we did for a number of months. My W's behavior was described as child like by the C and she suggested that my W carried on IC to try to help with her low self esteem. We gave up the rented house and bought a house of our own. Things seemed to be much better between us. At this time my Dad was diagnosed with cancer and I was distraught. I also went to IC to help me deal with life's problems. My W gave me great support during the two years of his illness and for a year after his death (he died a year ago, tomorrow) She was with me every step of the way. She has been great with my Mum as well, giving her practical and emotional support. One month ago, we finally finished all that had to be done for my Mum, including relocation closer to us, so we could help her.
> 
> 
> My W told me last Saturday that she didn't love me and wanted to separate. No, "I love you but not in love with you" rubbish, just a straight, "I have no feelings for you". She told me that since she felt this way, that she could not live with me any more. She said that, although this must be sudden for me, it was not for her. She said that she had been trying to make it work but it just wasn't. She said that events that took place previously had made her realise that I was not for her. She said that she wanted someone to make her feel special and that I didn't. Due to my W's low self esteem, she does not accept compliments or believe that someone could love her. All the attempts I have made through our marriage to let her know that I love her have been rebuked.
> 
> My daughters 18 & 21 are as shocked by this news as I am and they are very angry with my W. They have told her that if there is another man or she tries to take custody of their brother 11 or force the sale of the house, then she will never see them again. They have asked my W the same questions I have, as the are just as bewildered as me. They get the same answer. I do not love your Dad, I can't be here and I must do this for me. She has told me that she does not want me to sell the house, that I have done nothing wrong and she doesn't want to punish me any more than she is.
> 
> I have decided that as much as I love my W and always saw us growing old together, that I must let her go. I have told her that I love her, that I don't agree with what she is doing but that I accept her decision. I had suggested IC and MC but she has not taken up this suggestion as she now seems hellbent on getting out. She has been busy this week getting advice on housing and financials.
> 
> I somehow get the feeling that she is trying to find happiness on the outside as there is none on the inside. I also think that she sees this as a challenge as she has told me that she thinks I think she can't survive on her own. I told her that this was not a competition to me.
> 
> I am at a loss as to why she is doing this but I have decided that I must do a 180 for my own sake.
> 
> Sorry for the long post


That last paragraph has me re-assesing my own perception of my situation.


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## that_girl

Sad that she'd just walk out on the kids. I couldn't imagine having to say a lie like that  Thankfully, as deadbeat as my ex is, he texts our daughter every day and they talk quite a bit.


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## Anewlife

lpsscc said:


> I'm kinda going through the same thing but I was asked to leave my marital home and family so she could "be alone"...wth?
> 
> After so much reading and time (separated 6 months) I have come to the conclusion that the only way to have a chance to survive is to:
> 
> 1. The person you loved is dead.
> 2. Let them go be a dumba$$.
> 3. Be a good Dad/Mom and have as much fun as you possibly can.
> 4. In two years when they have FAILED in creating a new blessed life without you and they come crawling back (like a 99.9% probability).... you can then decide what you want to do then.
> 
> In the meantime do not try and stop them. Help the hell out of them. Push them along and smile knowing they have just screwed the hell out of themselves.
> 
> My opinion.


:iagree:


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## OutOfTheBlue

*Re: My Wife has separated from me - the journey*

Well, day two nearly done. Been a bit down and haven't felt well today but managed to pick myself up and get on with the chores that needed doing - lots of cleaning, washing and cooking. Having to cook ahead because I just won't have time when I get in from work. Roast beef today, lasagne tomorrow. This housekeeping is hard work.

No contact from W at all today, not even the kids. I don't understand this as she did so much for and with them. I can only assume she is in a very thick fog. It's difficult trying to explain to the kids what is going on, when I don't understand myself. all I can say is that mum is going through a difficult patch and that it has nothing to do with them - mum still loves them. Perhaps she is struggling to deal with the anger they have shown.

For those who are in a similar position, if you can, please let other people help you. This weekend, I have had phone calls from friends and family and emails from people I only know through other forums/blogs. It all helps to know that others care and support you.

Take care all


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## desert-rose

Good for you that you're being strong. I'm sorry that you're having to go through this. You're doing the right thing with the 180 and focusing on you. It's going to be really tough, but, you've got your daughters and you know you're doing the best thing you can in this situation. Take things one day at a time!

Hang on to your support structures and be kind to yourself.


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## OutOfTheBlue

Day three nearly done. My son was upset this morning - missing his mum. That hurt me.

It sent me off to work in a sad mood. Throughout the day, I have felt anger towards my W for doing that to my son but I have calmed down. I told my son that I would buy him a mobile tomorrow, so that he could have a direct contact with his mum and anytime he felt sad he could contact her.

On the way home I began to think about why my W had left so suddenly. After a few minutes of torture, I managed to banish the thoughts. I realised that if there were bad reasons (someone else), then that is something she has to live with, not me.

Eldest daughter is away with boyfriend tonight and youngest is at a concert in Glasgow, so it's just me and my son. We're having some quality time.

BTW, the lasagne was very good.

Sorry for turning this thread into a blog. It helps me but more importantly I hope it helps others in a similar situation. You're not on your own.


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## OutOfTheBlue

*Re: My Wife has separated from me - the journey*

Ok, I'm not going to count the days anymore. It's negative.

Getting a little more organised but it's still hectic. W txt this morning asking if son was ok, I answered short and sweet - Yes.

Can't operate normally at work yet. Some people manage to bury themselves in work during difficult times. I can't seem to manage that. Feeling tired all the time doesn't help.

Thoughts of infidelity entered my head again today but I think I have it conquered - banished the thoughts quickly - not my problem.

Bought son his mobile today, so he is now able to contact mum as often as he wants. W only needs to txt me about important son stuff.

Got a good surprise when I got home tonight - daughter (18) had done the housework and sorted washing etc. She put a lot of effort into it. The place was immaculate. Very, very proud of her - actions speak louder than words - her actions yelled "I love you Dad"

This would be so much harder without my fantastic kids.


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## OutOfTheBlue

*Re: My Wife has separated from me - The journey*

Ok, so I get my son a mobile yesterday and he makes contact with his mum last night. They exchange txt's and I think, that's good.

I then get a txt from W this morning saying "Everybody Ok"? Why did she not just ask them? Go figure.


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## OutOfTheBlue

*Re: My Wife has separated from me - the journey*

Up and down day today. Feeling upbeat one minute, down the next. Slept in this morning (first time in years) and was tired all day.

W came to see kids today from 3:00 - 5:30. She questioned my daughter as to why I was buying new clothes  

My daughter said she was quite blunt with my W. I've asked her to try not to fall out with her mum as she is going through a bad patch.

My W bumped into my mum as she was leaving - they spoke for a few minutes. My mum said she didn't look happy. It may have just been because of the awkward situation.

What my mum said did make me feel concerned for my W's well-being though. I know I must resist this but it is difficult when you are used to supporting someone. In the past, when my W went through any difficult patch, I would be the one to pick up the pieces and fix it, even when I was on the receiving end. Old habits die hard. Why do I have compassion for someone who is breaking my heart? Go figure. In hindsight, my always fixing and forgiving has probably played a part in why we are here today.

Anyway, gotta go, washing up to do.


----------



## ArmyofJuan

You are doing good and you have to continue to ignore her.

It takes at least a good 6 weeks of LC/NC before the WS starts cool down about all the negative stuff in the M. When they leave or have A's, they magnify all the negative aspects of the M and suppress all the good. Once you are out of the picture then reality starts to slowly slip in and things suddenly don't seem so bad.

You need to plan your life moving forward without her. If there's a chance to R down the road it will be from her trying to stop you from leaving her behind. The best thing you can do is act indifferent towards her so she will realize you are not there anymore for her. She has to struggle on her own to appreciate what you use to do for her. Think of her as a child that doesn't understand how dependent they are on their parent. If you help her in any way, you will be enabling her. 

She'll come snooping around eventually once she sees that you are not chasing her. Time is your friend so use this time to work on you and the kids and forget about what she is doing.


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## OutOfTheBlue

ArmyofJuan said:


> You are doing good and you have to continue to ignore her.


You are correct. I must absolutely resist any temptation to be Mr helpful guy. I can see what is happening. As I slowly start to get away from the morning nausea, the feeling of despair, the lack of appetite, I start reverting to type - It's Ok W. I will fix it for you. 

Not any more.

Today was a better day at work. I managed to start conversations with people, rather than speaking when spoken to.
W sent me the same txt as yesterday asking if son was ok. I answered "He's fine". We sent a few txt's back and forward tonight regarding finances and son, once they had run their course, I did not answer her last one.

Today, I had thoughts of whether she will come back or not but I also had thoughts about whether I would take her back. At this point, there is no doubt that I would take her back but in a few months- who knows - she may not be quite as in control of this situation as she thinks.


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## OutOfTheBlue

Much better day at work today- definite progress there.

W didn't txt this morning. I didn't txt her. W picked up son from school today as arranged. Son said last night that he didn't want to stay over with his mum as she doesn't have broadband (for his XBox) and she doesn't have a big TV. I told him that the time away from his games is good for him and that he should go and be with his mum. Daughters are visiting W on Sunday.

For anyone in a similar position, read up on the 180, digest it and do it. I am and I am feeling better by the day, not great but better.


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## morituri

OutOfTheBlue said:


> Much better day at work today- definite progress there.
> 
> W didn't txt this morning. I didn't txt her. W picked up son from school today as arranged. Son said last night that he didn't want to stay over with his mum as she doesn't have broadband (for his XBox) and she doesn't have a big TV. I told him that the time away from his games is good for him and that he should go and be with his mum. Daughters are visiting W on Sunday.
> 
> For anyone in a similar position, read up on the 180, digest it and do it. I am and I am feeling better by the day, not great but better.


You mean this?



> WARNING: The 180 is NOT a manipulation tool to make your spouse end his/her affair and commit to do the work of marital recovery, IT IS an emotional empowerment tool to help you become emotionally strong so that you can move on with your life - with or without your spouse. No one wants to be perceived as pathetic. 180 makes you look strong. Strong is attractive.
> 
> 1. Don't pursue reason, chase, beg, plead or implore.
> 2. No frequent phone calls.
> 3. Don't point out "good points" in marriage.
> 4. Don't follow her/him around the house.
> 5. Don't encourage or initiate discussion about the future.
> 6. Don't ask for help from the family members of your WS.
> 7. Don't ask for reassurances.
> 8. Don't buy or give gifts.
> 9. Don't schedule dates together.
> 10. Don't keep saying, "I Love You!" Because if you have a brain in your head, he/she is at this particular moment, not very loveable.
> 11. Do more then act as if you are moving on with your life; begin moving on with your life!
> 12. Be cheerful, strong, outgoing and independent.
> 13. Don't sit around waiting on your spouse - get busy, do things, go out with friends, enjoy old hobbies, find new ones! But stay busy!
> 14. When home with your spouse, (if you usually start the conversation) be scarce or short on words. Don't push any issue? No matter how much you want to!
> 15. If you're in the habit of asking your spouse his/her whereabouts, ASK NOTHING. Seem totally uninterested.
> 16. Your partner needs to believe that you have awakened to the fact that "they (the WS)" are serious concerning their assertions as to the future (or lack thee of) of your marriage. Thus, you are you are moving on with your life? with out them!
> 17. Don't be nasty, angry or even cold - Just pull yourself back. Don't always be so available? for anything! Your spouse will notice. More important, he/she will notice that you're missing.
> 18. No matter what you are feeling TODAY, only show your spouse happiness and contentment? Make yourself be someone they would want to be around. Not a moody, needy, pathetic individual but a self assured individual secure in the knowledge that they have value.
> 19. All questions about the marriage should be put on hold, until your spouse wants to talk about it (which may not be for quite a while). Initiate no such conversation!
> 20. Do not allow yourself to lose your temper. No yelling, screaming or name calling EVER. No show of temper! Be cool, act cool; be in control of the only thing you can control? YOURSELF!
> 21. Don't be overly enthusiastic.
> 22. Do not argue when they tell you how they feel (it only makes their feelings stronger). In fact, refuse to argue at all!
> 23. Be patient and learn to not only listen carefully to what your spouse is really saying to you? HEAR what it is that they are saying! Listen and then listen some more!
> 24. Learn to back off, keep your mouth shut and walk away when you want to speak out, no matter what the provocation. No one ever got themselves into trouble by just not saying anything.
> 25. Take care of you. Exercise, sleep, laugh & focus on all the other parts of your life that are not in turmoil.
> 26. Be strong, confident and learn to speak softly.
> 27. Know that if you can do this 180, your smallest CONSISTENT action will be noticed far more than any words you can say or write.
> 28. Do not be openly desperate or needy even when you are hurting more than ever and are feeling totally desperate and needy.
> 29. Do not focus on yourself when communicating with your spouse. It's not always about you! More to the point, at present they just don't care!
> 30. Do not believe any of what you hear them say and less than 50% of what you see. Your spouse will speak in absolute negatives and do so in the most strident tones imaginable. Try to remember that they are also hurting and afraid. Try to remember that they know what they are doing is wrong and so they will say anything they can to justify their behavior.
> 31. Do not give up no matter how dark it is or how bad you feel. It "ain't over till it's over!"
> 32. Do not backslide from your hard earned changes. Remain consistent! It is the consistency of action and attitude that delivers the message.
> 33. When expressing your dissatisfaction with the actions of the wayward party, never be judgmental, critical or express moral outrage. Always explain that your dissatisfaction is due to the pain that the acts being committed are causing you as a person. This is the kind of behavior that will cause you to be a much more attractive and mysterious individual. Further it SHOWS that you are NOT afraid to move on with your life. Still more important, it will burst their positive little bubble; the one in which they believe that they can always come back to you in case things don't work out with the OM/OW.


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## OutOfTheBlue

morituri said:


> You mean this?


Yep, that's the one. I have pretty much followed this to the letter but I can't quite manage the cheerful bit yet.


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## morituri

OutOfTheBlue said:


> Yep, that's the one. I have pretty much followed this to the letter but I can't quite manage the cheerful bit yet.


Watch and/or listen to a lot of comedy on a daily basis. I still do and it always does wonders for my overall well being. I'm serious.


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## OutOfTheBlue

morituri said:


> Watch and/or listen to a lot of comedy on a daily basis. I still do and it always does wonders for my overall well being. I'm serious.


A very good idea.

---------------------------

I was not looking forward to today. Last Saturday was the first day after my W left and it wasn't a good day, Sunday seemed worse because I didn't feel well.

Today, however, was a good day. I slept in until 9:30 (can't remember when I did that) and I felt refreshed. I vacuumed, ironed, washed, cooked and more importantly I ate better.

No contact at all with W. That suits me fine.

I also lifted the dahlia tubers for the winter. When my Dad died last year, I found a packet of dahlia seeds, which he never got round to sowing. I encouraged my Mum to sow these seeds, which she did. I planted the resultant seedlings in my garden as Mum was moving home. When she visited tonight, she was overjoyed to see the tubers sitting drying out. I am going to divide them, so we both can have some next year.

I was thinking today, why am I managing so well. When my W dropped the bomb, I wondered how I could survive. I felt like my life was over. I had to take two days of work because I just couldn't face it. I thought I would be an unshaven, bleary eyed wreck. I think there are a number of reasons why that hasn't happened.

Great support from my Kids and Mum
Great support from friends
Great support from online people, who I have never met
Doing the 180
Keeping busy

But there is one thing that struck me. Since my W had her EA or whatever it was a few years back, I think I have subconsciously been waiting on the day she would do it again, or leave me to pursue the dream. That day has arrived and you know what, I am still here, I am still alive, I still have things to live for. There are a lot of people worse off than me. I will have some difficult times ahead and some down days but you know what? I will survive them as well.


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## OutOfTheBlue

Had another good day today. 

Son came back this morning at 10:30 and after the normal reunion, he was straight on the XBox to catch up with his buddies. Some of his online buddies are in the US, so I have to watch out for nocturnal playing. Fortunately, I can normally hear the drone of the XBox, so I catch him in the act 

My daughters were supposed to visit their Mum today - they didn't go. I questioned them as to why. They said that they were busy. I told them to contact their Mum, give their apologies and re-arrange. I said that I didn't want their Mum to feel as though they were abandoning her. I got a look from them that made me feel like an alien. I explained to them, that two wrongs don't make a right, if you tell your Mum that you are visiting, then you visit.

At this point, I am comfortable with my approach to the situation (180) but I do not want my kids to be any part of that. They are of course, entitled to their own opinions but to agree to an invitation and then not turn up, is not what I want them to think is acceptable.

I've also been thinking today about my 180. It is working a treat for me. I feel in control of what is happening to me. However, I am worried about my W. She has stated in the past few weeks, that everyone would be better off, is she wasn't here. I don't think she is seriously suicidal but I am conscious of the possibility. Any attempt to find out her true feelings at this point would destroy my 180 but I could never live with myself if she ever did follow through on her thoughts. I don't think she would and I am staying with the 180 but I will monitor the situation.


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## allthegoodnamesaregone

My wife gave me the speech back in July and the usual distant behavior that precedes it. It's only now four months on things seem like the new normal, even with doing an extreme 180 from day one. 

You are going to find that some days are good and others, well, your mind will say things like " all I have to do is make a hard right into the rock face at 60mph and this pain will end". If you get to the second state please see a doctor, talk with your close friends, they will keep an eye on you and be of the best help anyone could have. It's going to be a real roller coaster for you, you have to look at it as she is NOT coming back and live your life accordingly. The change and strength you show through all of this is the only hope they will come back. The problem being quite often we as the dumpee's make so many changes in ourselves we don't want them back six months or a year later when whatever they've been through has run it's course, which is where I am right now some days.

My wife appears to be in much the same state as yours and I worry for her sanity, all you can do is inform her family and friends your concern and let them deal with it. Anything you say or do will be taken as an attack.


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## AudrinaG

As a wife in a situation where i have asked my husband to leave and he has taken this "no emotion" approach, i have to say you aren't going to "win" by making her realize how miserable she is without you.
Do you really want her to seek happiness or do you want her to stay in your marriage just because YOU believe you are giving her what she needs?

For years i told my husband i was unhappy and i tried to support him and understand his lack of motivation, underemployment, and lack of responsibility for big financial issues. He never agreed there was a problem and instead nitpicked me. 
when i finally asked him to leave it was because i felt like i would be better off without him and i did have fantasies of a great life. i quickly saw the grass is not greener. After time apart i did see why i had fallen in love with him. He started doing his own grocery shopping, lost weight, opened a bank account and taking care of himself. He got a social life again. 

We are giving it another try but he is now acting like i have to "win him back" and being kind of a *********, spoiling the kids at his house so i look like the bad guy, etc. 
I don't want to "WIN" i want a marriage where i feel loved and valued. The person that bitterly waits for their partner to fail, when they clearly are not meeting that partner's needs, does not deserve their wife/husband back. Marriage isn't about proving each other wrong. 

And taking pleasure in your child saying hurtful things about her mother makes me feel sick. That woman bore you three children and probably gave you a pretty decent life. How dare you.


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## AudrinaG

makes me wonder...dumpees if you "make changes" AFTER you have been dumped, why didn't you make those changes BEFORE, which may have prevented the dumping altogether?


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## OutOfTheBlue

AudrinaG said:


> As a wife in a situation where i have asked my husband to leave and he has taken this "no emotion" approach, i have to say you aren't going to "win" by making her realize how miserable she is without you.
> Do you really want her to seek happiness or do you want her to stay in your marriage just because YOU believe you are giving her what she needs?
> 
> For years i told my husband i was unhappy and i tried to support him and understand his lack of motivation, underemployment, and lack of responsibility for big financial issues. He never agreed there was a problem and instead nitpicked me.
> when i finally asked him to leave it was because i felt like i would be better off without him and i did have fantasies of a great life. i quickly saw the grass is not greener. After time apart i did see why i had fallen in love with him. He started doing his own grocery shopping, lost weight, opened a bank account and taking care of himself. He got a social life again.
> 
> We are giving it another try but he is now acting like i have to "win him back" and being kind of a *********, spoiling the kids at his house so i look like the bad guy, etc.
> I don't want to "WIN" i want a marriage where i feel loved and valued. The person that bitterly waits for their partner to fail, when they clearly are not meeting that partner's needs, does not deserve their wife/husband back. Marriage isn't about proving each other wrong.
> 
> And taking pleasure in your child saying hurtful things about her mother makes me feel sick. That woman bore you three children and probably gave you a pretty decent life. How dare you.


What a load of garbage. Did you actually read what I have written or just select bits that meet your agenda? Do you actually understand what you are talking about? Do me a favour, get off your pedestal and re-read it.


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## OutOfTheBlue

AudrinaG said:


> makes me wonder...dumpees if you "make changes" AFTER you have been dumped, why didn't you make those changes BEFORE, which may have prevented the dumping altogether?


Now you're beginning to sound like a victim


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## AudrinaG

i did read the whole post. your quick and angry reply indicates to me there is more to this story than your side. I think the 180 thing is a dangerous power play that soothes ego temporarily and helps you cope, but won't necessarily bring her back in a healthy way. If she is a woman you love, don't play a game.


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## OutOfTheBlue

AudrinaG said:


> i did read the whole post. your quick and angry reply indicates to me there is more to this story than your side. I think the 180 thing is a dangerous power play that soothes ego temporarily and helps you cope, but won't necessarily bring her back in a healthy way. If she is a woman you love, don't play a game.


I would normally try to give a reasoned response but I think it would just fly straight over your head.

I was tempted to take the same approach as you and make assertions about your character and the impact that has had on your own relationship but I think I will just give it a miss.

Now, if you're done, I would like to do my daily post.

Thanks


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## OutOfTheBlue

Had a good day at work.

D's went to mums tonight. D(18) came home crying. She was sad that mum was living on her own in a little flat. She thought that mum was ok but not happy. I txt W to keep in contact with D as much as possible. I encouraged D to visit mum as much as possible.

D is frustrated that I can't fix it. I told her that the door was still open for mum but if I interfered it could push her further away.

It's hard to explain to D the difficulties of the situation.

D's told me that mum thinks we aren't coping and they assured her that we are. I don't know what to think of this. in fact, I am a little worried. I do not want W to feel that what she contributed to our family can be easily replaced because it can't. As I alluded to last night, I have a conflict with my 180, in that I do not want anything bad to happen to W.


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## aug

AudrinaG said:


> As a wife in a situation where i have asked my husband to leave and he has taken this "no emotion" approach, i have to say you aren't going to "win" by making her realize how miserable she is without you.
> Do you really want her to seek happiness or do you want her to stay in your marriage just because YOU believe you are giving her what she needs?
> 
> For years i told my husband i was unhappy and i tried to support him and understand his lack of motivation, underemployment, and lack of responsibility for big financial issues. He never agreed there was a problem and instead nitpicked me.
> when i finally asked him to leave it was because i felt like i would be better off without him and i did have fantasies of a great life. i quickly saw the grass is not greener. After time apart i did see why i had fallen in love with him. He started doing his own grocery shopping, lost weight, opened a bank account and taking care of himself. He got a social life again.
> 
> We are giving it another try but he is now acting like i have to "win him back" and being kind of a *********, spoiling the kids at his house so i look like the bad guy, etc.
> I don't want to "WIN" i want a marriage where i feel loved and valued. The person that bitterly waits for their partner to fail, when they clearly are not meeting that partner's needs, does not deserve their wife/husband back. Marriage isn't about proving each other wrong.
> 
> And taking pleasure in your child saying hurtful things about her mother makes me feel sick. That woman bore you three children and probably gave you a pretty decent life. How dare you.


I read some of your older posts. You may want to start your own thread in one of these forums.


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## allthegoodnamesaregone

AudrinaG said:


> makes me wonder...dumpees if you "make changes" AFTER you have been dumped, why didn't you make those changes BEFORE, which may have prevented the dumping altogether?


Probably because most of us had little idea there was a need for any changes. I was a pretty dynamic guy when I met my wife, but over the the years dropped most things that made me seem that way to become a loving husband and father. The sports car was traded in on a family car, the motorcycle was sold to buy a new washer and dryer, the weekend trips for two once a once month became, nights out friday and saturday became yearly child centered vacations and out to a movie a half dozen times a year. 

I knew this was what married life was like when I signed on for it, a couple of years of freedom pre children, 20 years of mortgages and child rearing, then on our own again. This is reality, to expect a husband or wife not to be changed by all that is unrealistic to the extreme. 

In my case I simply did not have a whole lot to change as far as the home front was concerned. I already did 70% of the cooking, cleaning and laundry because I had a home office, cooked breakfast every morning because I was an early riser and did the whole kid ferry to everywhere thing for the last 18 years. Physically I'd gained 15 lbs in 24 years, but 189lbs. @ six foot two is not out of shape by any stretch and we had relations at least three times a week right up to a couple of days before she left. He reason for going? the famous "I've not been very happy for a while", and "no I'm not interested in counseling" People who know us well say my wife is a fool, in retrospect I'm beginning to agree.


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## OutOfTheBlue

allthegoodnamesaregone said:


> Probably because most of us had little idea there was a need for any changes. I was a pretty dynamic guy when I met my wife, but over the the years dropped most things that made me seem that way to become a loving husband and father. The sports car was traded in on a family car, the motorcycle was sold to buy a new washer and dryer, the weekend trips for two once a once month became, nights out friday and saturday became yearly child centered vacations and out to a movie a half dozen times a year.
> 
> I knew this was what married life was like when I signed on for it, a couple of years of freedom pre children, 20 years of mortgages and child rearing, then on our own again. This is reality, to expect a husband or wife not to be changed by all that is unrealistic to the extreme.
> 
> In my case I simply did not have a whole lot to change as far as the home front was concerned. I already did 70% of the cooking, cleaning and laundry because I had a home office, cooked breakfast every morning because I was an early riser and did the whole kid ferry to everywhere thing for the last 18 years. Physically I'd gained 15 lbs in 24 years, but 189lbs. @ six foot two is not out of shape by any stretch and we had relations at least three times a week right up to a couple of days before she left. He reason for going? the famous "I've not been very happy for a while", and "no I'm not interested in counseling" People who know us well say my wife is a fool, in retrospect I'm beginning to agree.


You are correct. I had little idea that anything was seriously wrong. The week before my W dropped the bomb, we were discussing the garden and at some point, my W mentioned that all the leaves were brown.

and we burst into song

Me - And the sky is grey
W - I've been for a walk
Me - On a winter's day
W - I'd be safe and warm, if I was in LA
Me - California dreaming
W - on such a winter's day

Me - Stopped into a church ...........................

At the end we laughed.

(The Mamas & the Papas)

Now, that is not the interaction of a couple who are in serious trouble. That's what I thought.


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## allthegoodnamesaregone

OutOfTheBlue said:


> You are correct. I had little idea that anything was seriously wrong. The week before my W dropped the bomb, we were discussing the garden and at some point, my W mentioned that all the leaves were brown.
> 
> and we burst into song
> 
> Me - And the sky is grey
> W - I've been for a walk
> Me - On a winter's day
> W - I'd be safe and warm, if I was in LA
> Me - California dreaming
> W - on such a winter's day
> 
> Me - Stopped into a church ...........................
> 
> At the end we laughed.
> 
> (The Mamas & the Papas)
> 
> Now, that is not the interaction of a couple who are in serious trouble. That's what I thought.


Things were tense the last three weeks, but she said it was "Hormones & fibroids" and " We were good". 

Directly after my wife had left I spent weeks going over every little detail I could think of that I might have caused to bring about her leaving.
I was sure there must have been something I'd missed or messed up, I even made a list. Looking at this list made in the depth of my despair now is almost laughable, there is nothing on there that would warrant even an argument about let alone ending a marriage. 

The only thing that might have made things easier is more money, but then she would would have used the old "you are never home, you are always working" excuse to have an A.


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## OutOfTheBlue

allthegoodnamesaregone said:


> Things were tense the last three weeks, but she said it was "Hormones & fibroids" and " We were good".
> 
> Directly after my wife had left I spent weeks going over every little detail I could think of that I might have caused to bring about her leaving.
> I was sure there must have been something I'd missed or messed up, I even made a list. Looking at this list made in the depth of my despair now is almost laughable, there is nothing on there that would warrant even an argument about let alone ending a marriage.
> 
> The only thing that might have made things easier is more money, but then she would would have used the old "you are never home, you are always working" excuse to have an A.


I am far from Mr perfect but my W was far from Mrs perfect. I accepted these imperfections from my W. When she used to comment to me about her stretch marks or her stomach that she couldn't get rid off after the pregnancies, I used to tell her that she got these bringing our children into the world and that I loved her the way she was (and I did). She would never accept this.

It's hard to love someone who refuses to be loved.


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## morituri

AudrinaG said:


> I think the 180 thing is a dangerous power play that soothes ego temporarily and helps you cope, but won't necessarily bring her back in a healthy way. If she is a woman you love, don't play a game.


You have a misconception about what the 180 degrees rules are all about. The 180 is not, and will never be, a manipulation tool to have an unfaithful spouse end his/her affair and commit to all the heavy work needed to rebuild the marriage. Its purpose is to help the betrayed spouse become emotionally strong so that eventually he/she will be able to move on with his/her life with or without his unfaithful spouse. 

If your husband implemented the 180, he may have reached a point of not needing you and being quite happy to live his life without you. He may now be asking himself questions such as, why does she want me now? why should I go back to her? what is in it for me? The 180 is not a game.


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## OutOfTheBlue

Work good today again. I am lucky that I have some very good work colleagues. It is surprising (disappointing) how many of them have been through the same. I used to be proud of the fact that I had been married twenty plus years and remained faithful to my W for those years. I didn't think I would become just another statistic.

Our throwaway society seems to now include relationships. It's hardly surprising considering how we are brainwashed daily by commercials telling us that we should get the latest model of everything. The fact that you can't afford it, is just a minor detail. The fact that your affair will split your family up, is just a minor detail. You deserve to get rid of the old and bring in the new.

Then there's Hollywood telling us that affairs are romantic, the grass is greener, it's all ok. Of course, the movie always concentrates on the new love, the butterflies, the passion. It would hardly be a box office smash if it concentrated on the broken hearts, the split families, the damaged kids, the financial meltdown.

Anyway, that's my vent over and I feel better.

Need some advice. 

My son finds staying with his mum boring. W told me this tonight and son confirmed it. I am caught again between my 180 and providing financial assistance to W to get broadband. I think it is important that my son spends 3 nights a week with his mum but as it stands, he is not going to do that. Is this w's responsibility? I don't want son to suffer due to a few £'s per month. 

Any opinions?


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## OutOfTheBlue

Strange day today. Had a few negative thoughts about my future. At this point if my W was to txt me that she wanted to come back, I don't know what I would think. I certainly wouldn't be jumping with joy. I am trying to figure out why that is. Is it because I am still raw from the pain she has caused me and the kids? or is it fear of going through the same pain again? or perhaps I have realised that I can live without her. Only time will tell I suppose.

I also considered a future on my own and what that would be like. Would I be lonely? would I be happy? At work, I look at women and imagine myself with them in a relationship but regardless of how much I like them or find them attractive, it just doesn't work. I suppose my thoughts will meander and maybe even completely change direction a few times as I go through this journey.

My son was supposed to go to his mum's flat after School today and return in the evening. He didn't want to. Again, I think it is because of the same reasons I posted last night. I'm still looking for advice on that, if anyone has any? Just had a thought - maybe I should try to find something else he would enjoy instead of giving in to his XBox needs? Must think about that.

One laugh I did have today was when I realised I was discussing, which variety of washing powder was best for whites


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## allthegoodnamesaregone

Don't get the broadband for her, but do encourage your son to visit. It's up to him to tell her he does not want to stay over, she'll get a look at what it's like when you decide to leave and not everyone see's it her way.


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## OutOfTheBlue

allthegoodnamesaregone said:


> Don't get the broadband for her, but do encourage your son to visit. It's up to him to tell her he does not want to stay over, she'll get a look at what it's like when you decide to leave and not everyone see's it her way.



You are correct, I shouldn't get the broadband but I feel as though I am caught between a rock and a hard place. He did tell her today, that he didn't want to go. I need to find a way of encouraging him to spend time with his mum. D (18) is having a Chinese takeaway with W on Saturday night, so that is good.


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## OutOfTheBlue

Good day today - work is getting better. I read Janie's post earlier and I too like my programming and like Janie, I also can't spent too much time in the company of "Dorks", or as we call them "Geeks" I find them extremely boring. They do not share my sense of humour. I will tell you a funny story one day - it involves a noose 

I am an IT Manager and I am fortunately responsible for the development of our inter company intranet. This gives me the opportunity to play, oops, I mean work on database driven web applications :smthumbup:

Did a bit of Christmas shopping on Amazon tonight. I was able to buy my son some boy's toys - 4 channel radio controlled helicopter (I think this will be kept at W's flat, to encourage him to visit) and a fully working model of a combustion engine. These are things that my W would not let me buy previously.

No contact with W at all today. Hope she is ok.


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## This is me

OOTB - Curious about a couple of things as I can relate to your thread. How often are you communicating with each other and do you leave it all up to her with the 180?

I hear from her about every other day and never initiate contact.


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## allthegoodnamesaregone

I swear both the wife and I are both pulling 180's, she only contacts me about seeing the kids or family business. If she was on a forum like this I'd loved to she what she's been saying about our sitch. ;~)


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## OutOfTheBlue

This is me said:


> OOTB - Curious about a couple of things as I can relate to your thread. How often are you communicating with each other and do you leave it all up to her with the 180?
> 
> I hear from her about every other day and never initiate contact.


It's probably been almost daily, since it is only a fortnight since she left. I expect that will drop once we get into a routine and get all the finances sorted. She initiates about 80%. I only contact when I really have to, normally when it is something about my son. I don't do idle chat and I try to keep txts to the point and I won't answer a txt that doesn't really need an answer.


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## OutOfTheBlue

I was quite tired today. Son got me up in the middle of the night wanting his mum and I slept in again this morning :sleeping:

I thought today about some of the things my W said to me before she left. She said that we should have separated a few years back when she had her EA. She also said that she wanted someone to make her feel special and that I didn't do that.

For a few days I beat myself up for not being as attentive as I could have been. Then I thought about the events that led up to her EA. 

I need to go back about 7 years from that point, just when my son was born and I lost my business. I used to be a timber contractor with a small crew. I was forced into mechinisation due to the price of wood but this was never really sustainable due to imports from the baltic states. They could put timber in the docks in Scotland cheaper than I could put it on the forest track. Of course they didn't have health & safety rules or the need for insurances and all the other costs that I had.

Those where difficult times, probably the most financially difficult in our marriage. We lost our home and were forced to rent. My W was a home maker (don't laugh at the back) and renting wasn't what she wanted. I went back to college and also studied with the open university in the area of IT. After a few years of studying and part time jobs, I managed to get an entry level position in IT. After a few years of hard work and continued education, I finally landed the position of IT manager in the same company, which is where I am today.

Financially, we were in a better position than we had been in our entire marriage. Then the EA happened.

In my first post, I mentioned that we gave up the rented property and purchased our own house. One of the main reasons, was obviously to get away from the landlords son but also, I thought, to give my W the owned home she wanted. Now, although we were better off financially than we had ever been, getting back on the property ladder again is not easy and we had to settle for a house the needed a lot of DIY.

If you remember, this was at a time when my Dad was diagnosed terminally ill with cancer. I was working silly hours on IT projects, ripping out rooms and re-fitting and dealing with the emotions of my Dad dying and trying to support my Mum.

So, if my W has somehow managed to figure out I am on this forum (doubtful) and if she is reading this - I know I am not perfect but what the hell did you expect from me. I never went drinking with the boys, I never ever considered womanising and more importantly, I never abused you physically or mentally. I supported you through some very questionable behaviour caused by your childhood problems and yet you want someone to make you feel *special*.

You had that person, he was right by your side - if only you had looked.


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## allthegoodnamesaregone

If it's any consolation it's not your fault, many of us here have gone through the same scenario, damned if you do and damned if you don't. You work hard to get the lifestyle you and your spouse want, only to have it thrown in your face later that "You were never home", you spend all you time working around the home and don't go out drinking and suddenly you're "clingy" and "don't give them any space" . It's all bull, just an excuse, there is no reason for anyone to have an affair. If a spouse is not happy they should say so in no uncertain terms, and if the issues cannot be resolved get a divorce, again it is not your fault, neither was it mine


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## OutOfTheBlue

allthegoodnamesaregone said:


> If it's any consolation it's not your fault, many of us here have gone through the same scenario, damned if you do and damned if you don't. You work hard to get the lifestyle you and your spouse want, only to have it thrown in your face later that "You were never home", you spend all you time working around the home and don't go out drinking and suddenly you're "clingy" and "don't give them any space" . It's all bull, just an excuse, there is no reason for anyone to have an affair. If a spouse is not happy they should say so in no uncertain terms, and if the issues cannot be resolved get a divorce, again it is not your fault, neither was it mine


I know, you are correct. Sometimes we just need to blame ourselves or at least try to blame ourselves to make sense of a senseless situation. We can't understand their thoughts, so we look at the only alternative - ourselves. This is wrong - just because we can't understand their thinking doesn't mean we are at fault. We may not be perfect but we are not cheaters.


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## This is me

OutOfTheBlue said:


> I know, you are correct. Sometimes we just need to blame ourselves or at least try to blame ourselves to make sense of a senseless situation. We can't understand their thoughts, so we look at the only alternative - ourselves. This is wrong - just because we can't understand their thinking doesn't mean we are at fault. We may not be perfect but we are not cheaters.


This is so true. Our first MC asked her if she thought I was a mind reader. Even in the past months I will make corrections to things she complains about me and then she moves the target. 

Last night my Brother in Law tllk me aside and told me straight to my face that I did nothing wrong and to not beat my self up about it. His words were very refreshing to hear.


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## allthegoodnamesaregone

This is me said:


> This is so true. Our first MC asked her if she thought I was a mind reader. Even in the past months I will make corrections to things she complains about me and then she moves the target.
> 
> Last night my Brother in Law tllk me aside and told me straight to my face that I did nothing wrong and to not beat my self up about it. His words were very refreshing to hear.


Funny how often it is the brother in law that will back you up . Mine has become my best friend this past four months, he's recently divorced and has been through the wringer as well. He says hardly even recognizes his sister anymore either.


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## OutOfTheBlue

Wow, in my case it is the W's Dad, she has no brothers. He always thought that I have changed his daughter for the good.

He always praised us for managing to get back to a stable financial situation by our own means after a difficult time. We were his pride and joy, which is easy to understand, since his wife, my W's mother left him for another man and his daughter, my W's sister left her H for another man. Do you see a pattern emerging?

To continue from last night. I am not going to take the blame for my situation. I did the best I could, in difficult circumstances. I was competing against a fantasy that my W had, a prince charming, a knight in shining armour, the perfect man. The fact that my W barely knew him, didn't make any difference. I was being compared to the new love. I didn't stand a chance. 

Nothing I did after that event could have prevented what has happened. Only my W could have prevented it by listening to what was being said at our MC sessions, by accepting that what she did was wrong, by looking inside instead of outside for her happiness. Thinking back, I don't believe she ever truly apologised for what she put me through - that should have told me something.


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## OutOfTheBlue

Pretty good day today. I've been very busy as usual. NC with W. 

Prior to my W leaving, we had stripped the livingroom with the intention of re-decorating before Christmas. The job requires, plastering, new floor, new skirtings & door surrounds and of course wallpaper & paint. My D asked me last week if I was still going to do it as it wasn't a very nice room for Christmas, I said, of course I am. So, last week I booked a week of work in mid December. I am so glad she asked. It helped me realise that although my W has gone, most of my family are still here and I owe it to them to make Christmas as good as I can under the circumstances.

My D went to her mums last night and they had a Chinese together. That pleased me. However, when my D came home, she told me that she had suggested W comes home for Christmas day. She said that W thought it wouldn't be a good idea and that dad wouldn't be happy. My D said to her that dad would accept it, if it was what the kids wanted. My W said the atmosphere would spoil it. I said to my D, that it was a nice thought but if mum was to come home for Christmas, then it would need to be something that mum wanted. I also said that we need to consider the mixed messages her brother would get from such a situation. She thought about it and said she wouldn't mention it to mum again. I think she understood what I meant as she gave me a big cuddle before going to bed.

The real exciting news from today, is that I made broccoli and stilton (blue cheese) soup - sounds disgusting, tastes delicious, for the first time. My D's just loved it and they have claimed what is left over for their lunch tomorrow. I have now mastered this soup and home made mushroom soup as well - carrot and coriander next :smthumbup:


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## OutOfTheBlue

W txt last night after I made my post. She asked what was happening to son, since it was a school holiday. I said, my mum was looking after him but that she could if she wanted (remember, I want son to spend time with his mum). She said she would.

When I came home tonight, I found out that she had not taken my son to her flat but that she had stayed here and had cleaned son's room. I then found out that she had taken our dog for a walk. What the hell is she playing at? Does this ease her conscience? Is she missing these normally mundane chores? Does she want it to look like a friendly breakup? Does she think she can have her cake and eat it?

I txt her tonight - "When you are here can you stop doing things, including walking the dog. You are sending mixed signals to our son. These are my responsibilities, not yours".

I don't think I am being harsh , do you? She has decided to move on with her life, she should allow me the same courtesy. She won't be able to do these things, if I meet someone else.
Although meeting someone else at this point is not even on my mind, it may happen at some point in the future and if I allow my W to carry on like this, it could cause my kids to go through a second separation - now, that's not fair.

Why can't she see this?


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## morituri

You were right in telling her that. She made the decision to leave you and the family home. She should not expect that she has the right to do those mundane things, no matter how much she misses them. But more importantly, what you stated about her giving the wrong message to the kids that she is back, is right on the money. She is being thoughtless in her behavior, but then that isn't new, is it?


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## OutOfTheBlue

morituri said:


> She is being thoughtless in her behavior, but then that isn't new, is it?


Correct

-----------

After last night's txt my W didn't txt me until tonight asking what was happening with our son tomorrow as the teachers are on strike. I asked her if she wanted to see him as my mum or my D would watch him, she said she did, so I agreed. There will be no housework or dog walking this time.

She then txt saying that we must think about Christmas. I txt back, son will be with me Christmas day and he can be with you on Christmas night. She then txt back saying that D had suggested that she came for Christmas dinner. Well, I never expected her to mention that, even though she said it was D's suggestion. I txt back - I do not think it would be a good idea, since it would give son the wrong signals but she was welcome to see son on other days during the holidays. She txt back - I understand. I thought, at last, you are beginning to understand.

I realised today, with the affirmation from morituri, that I was taking the correct stance. It would be so easy to fall into the trap of thinking that it's good to have her about the house, doing things but it is not. It would only be satisfying her needs, you know, those needs she abandoned for her new life. In reality, it wouldn't help me and it certainly wouldn't help my kids.

I feel much more in control of my life and more importantly, my kids are benefiting from me being in control of the situation.


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## OutOfTheBlue

Work was good today - more involved than lately - beginning to look at future projects.

Thought about W's recent behaviour. She is definitely missing the mundane chores she once, probably disliked. I thought about her txt last night, the one about Christmas day. I still can't believe she suggested it, not because she wasn't thinking about the effects such a proposition would have on our son but that she showed a little bit of weakness. That is not her.

Now, this is an important stage for those on the 180. Do not succumb to this apparent weakness, it may mean your spouse is having second thoughts, it may simply be a testing of the water but it also may mean absolutely nothing. Remember, your spouse is in never never land and may not be making sense. 

You must continue to concentrate on yourself, make the changes needed to adapt to your new life and if you have kids, their lives. At this point you are probably still the only one in your relationship who is thinking straight, keep it that way.


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## morituri

Maybe she's experiencing a little of the old 'be careful what you wish for, you just might get it'.


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## OutOfTheBlue

morituri said:


> Maybe she's experiencing a little of the old 'be careful what you wish for, you just might get it'.


Yep, I think so.

------------------

NC from W since the Christmas txt.

The thing is, this will be the first time in her life, my W has had to stand on her own two feet. When I think about it, she has never taken responsibility for any of her actions. Well, now she is out in the big, wide world, she will have to take responsibility. I won't be there for her, fixing things.

When I think back to our MC, our counselor said that my W's perception of the marriage was almost parent/child like. My W believed that she could behave badly but I would still be there to fix it. When I think of the time when she had her EA, I felt that she told me about it, not because she wanted to fix our marriage but that she wanted me to fix her fantasy.

Now that I've had a couple of weeks on my own (or is it three?), I have had time to reflect on her past behaviour. If she were to phone me tonight, wanting to come home, the answer would be no. Now, I am not saying that I don't still love my W because I do and I am not saying that I would never have her back because I would but I would need to think about it. A few weeks on her own, is not enough time for her to see what the big world is really like, to learn to accept responsibility, to rid herself of this childlike outlook on life.

The very least I would expect is some serious IC for my W and MC for both prior to any moving back.

Whatever happens from this point forward and whoever that is with, I can guarantee you this, my life will not be as it has been.


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## OutOfTheBlue

Not much to say today. Work was even better - starting to get back into things.

W taking son to cinema tomorrow, pleased about that.

Eldest D had a night in tonight, which is as rare as a white Christmas in Australia. I really enjoyed our chat, which lasted over an hour. We mostly discussed mum and what my D's were thinking about. It turns out, that my D's were more aware of my past struggles with their mum, than I thought. They are very proud of my attempts to keep our family together.

I told my eldest D that mums behaviour is because of her childhood and not to take it personally. I want my D's to be close to their mum but to also understand, that mum's past behaviour is not normal - it is a result of her childhood. I am not protecting W, I am protecting D's. I asked D to keep in contact with mum and to not let what is happening affect their relationship with mum.

I have always been a very positive person. I have needed to be. When a glass is somewhere in the middle, I don't see it has half empty, I don't see it as half full, I see it as full, just needing a top up, if that makes sense.

I hope W is ok - I feel for her. I will survive this, I hope she does as well.


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## OutOfTheBlue

When I dropped my son off today, I spoke with W for the first time in almost three weeks. We spoke mostly about finances and in particular our life insurances. She said that she couldn't afford to keep running her car - I thought, no **** Sherlock - I said I know, they are expensive to run.

I get the feeling that she is treading very carefully with her words even though I am being very relaxed in my approach. She mentioned Christmas day again. I said again, that I didn't think it would be a good idea, she said that we can explain to my son that she is just coming for the day. I said, what happens if you keep coming round to the house in this way and in six months time I meet someone else and you have to stop it, our son will go through another separation. I said, that is not fair. She didn't respond.

Why is she so desperate to come for Christmas day? Is it because of me? No, she left me. Is it because of the kids? maybe but she also left them. Is it because she will be lonely on Christmas day? maybe but that was her choice. What is she up to? The answer is still no.

Son went to cinema and McDonalds with W but didn't want to stay the night at W's flat.


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## morituri

Who knows what she is thinking. From what you write of her, she doesn't seem to be the type to open up and share her deepest thoughts and feelings.



OutOfTheBlue said:


> I said, what happens if you keep coming round to the house in this way and in six months time I meet someone else and you have to stop it, our son will go through another separation. I said, that is not fair. She didn't respond.


Good job. The more you show her what life will be like after the divorce, the more she will see that you are not her backup plan. The fact that you told her that you are open to having another woman in your life is something she probably never thought about. She's reaping what she's sown, and it may not be to her liking.


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## OutOfTheBlue

morituri said:


> Who knows what she is thinking. From what you write of her, she doesn't seem to be the type to open up and share her deepest thoughts and feelings.


You are absolutely spot on. I didn't know that had come across in my writing. My W was never one to share her feelings. With an insecure person such as my W, sharing feelings makes them vulnerable, open to hurt. I always felt that she never showed affection, so that when I did the inevitable (cheat on her), it wouldn't hurt as much. Unfortunately, this negative approach caused an emotional separation in our marriage, which in turn caused my W to state that she wanted someone to make her feel special. No-one can make her feel special, she won't let them.

A little more background on my W. Between the ages of ten and twelve, prior to her parents splitting up, her mother would say things such as, you're dad is up at so and so's house having it away with his wife and her dad would say thing like, you're mother's at work having an affair with so and so.

After her parents split, they would try to use her as a messenger. Her dad would say things like, how is the **** today.

Now, I am not making excuses for my W. It's not her fault she was dealt a bad hand but it is her responsibility to play that hand as best she can. She didn't, she just accepted the bad hand and allowed it to govern her life.

My D said to me today, that she thought mum was wanting to come home for Christmas because she wasn't happy. She thinks that mum probably just wants to come home. I said to her that, that may be the case but it also may not. I explained that mum was used to me fixing things ( I didn't go into the parent/child relationship) and perhaps she was just expecting me to fix Christmas day for her. I also explained to D, that if mum wanted to come home, then mum would need to drive that and not me. I said that mum would need to learn that she can't up and leave as and when it suits, otherwise we could be in the same position in a year's time. I told her not to build her hopes up, as mum is going through a difficult time just now and what we think mum is thinking may not be the case. She has a mature head for an eighteen year old.

Anyway, after many culinary successes lately, my pork casserole was a disaster today - back to the drawing board on that one - dog was happy though


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## morituri

It was great how you explained the situation to your daughter so that she can see that you are not acting in an irrational and vengeful manner towards her mother. Good job.

It would seem to me that one of the deal breaker conditions for you to allow her to return would be that she willingly enter IC (individual counseling) so that she can address and resolve the issues that have prevented her from sharing with you her deepest thoughts and feelings (intimacy). She needs to know that you do not want to return to the old marriage and that she will have to put genuine effort to create a new marriage based on a healthier relationship dynamic that will satisfy both of your needs as husband and wife. If not, then the course will be set for divorce and the two of you going your separate ways.


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## OutOfTheBlue

morituri said:


> It would seem to me that one of the deal breaker conditions for you to allow her to return would be that she willingly enter IC (individual counseling) so that she can address and resolve the issues that have prevented her from sharing with you her deepest thoughts and feelings (intimacy). She needs to know that you do not want to return to the old marriage and that she will have to put genuine effort to create a new marriage based on a healthier relationship dynamic that will satisfy both of your needs as husband and wife. If not, then the course will be set for divorce and the two of you going your separate ways.


I think you have a very good grasp on my situation morituri.

I also think that any reconciliation would be dependent on IC for my W, followed or combined with MC for both of us ( I am not perfect). One thing I am certain of, is that I will not be living my life as I was prior to the separation. If that is without my W, then so be it. 

In fact, I have already began the journey of improving my life. I have reconnected with my kids and I am enjoying that. My daughters and me are speaking to each other at a level we've never achieved before. They are even being civil to each other  Tonight, I started to remove the old storage heaters from the livingroom and because of that my daughters did ironing, washing up and took the dog for a walk. I think, they too are learning something.

I am also making decisions about household things, such as food, decor etc and it is liberating. Things that would take weeks or months to decide, I am deciding in a couple of days. 

For the first time in ages, myself and my three kids were all together tonight and I said one of the lines from the you tube video of the talking dog (look for it - 73 million views - morituri, remember you said about watching comedy). I said "What was in there" in the same voice as the video and we all burst out laughing.

My W is more than welcome to join in with this new family bonding but she can only do this by taking responsibility for her behaviour and doing something about it. The choice is hers.

S is going to mum's flat tomorrow and D's are going on Saturday night.


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## morituri

Great update OutOfTheBlue. You and your kids are living life the way it is meant to be.

The youtube video you are referring, is it 'Ultimate Dog Tease'? If it is, it is hilarious. I can feel for the poor dog's plight regarding what his owner did with the bacon.:rofl:


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## OutOfTheBlue

morituri said:


> The youtube video you are referring, is it 'Ultimate Dog Tease'? If it is, it is hilarious. I can feel for the poor dog's plight regarding what his owner did with the bacon.:rofl:


That's the one - it's hilarious alright. If anyone is feeling a bit down, play it, it will bring a smile to your face. Ultimate Dog Tease

Not much happening today. Son went to his mum's flat after school and returned tonight before I got in from work. I had filled an envelope full of school stuff that I had mostly dealt with but W needed to see. 

One of the items, was my son's concert, which is taking place next week and you need to book your slot. The concert takes place on one day but there are two shows. My son returned tonight and said can you book mum's slot.

I txt W, saying I was going to afternoon show (I'm on holiday next week) and, which one did she want. She txt back - evening. That suits me. She said he needed certain clothes. I told her that I would contact school tomorrow and sort out what was needed.


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## OutOfTheBlue

Good day at work today. Had fun moving our Intranet and SQL server from one domain to another - lots of problems 

I asked my D (18) to get some boxes from her work today, so we could pack some of mums stuff, which is sitting in the livingroom. I needed it clear for my holiday at the end of this week. D txt her mum to say what was happening and mum said she would come and collect her stuff. A few hours past and W had not appeared, so D txt her again. W txt back, saying that she would be there shortly. When she arrived, D asked her why she was so late. W said, because she didn't want the neighbours to see her taking stuff from the house, so she waited until it was dark. She said to D that she didn't want neighbours talking. D said that they already were - nothing bad, just amazement.

When my D told me this, I thought, Eh!, on the day my W left, I don't believe she was too concerned about what the neighbours thought. Her attitude has obviously changed.

W then proceeded to txt me five times asking about the new floor I was about to lay. Each time, I answered short and sweet. The temptation was there to ask her what the hell it had to do with her but I am in a good place just now, so I was polite. W said our D has been good, I answered, no, she has been brilliant.

All schools in the area are closed tomorrow at noon due to weather forecast, so W is coming to get S from school.

My mum is going to my S's concert with me next week, which is good for my S and for my mum.


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## OutOfTheBlue

Just a quick note.

Tonight, I decided to become a forum supporter. I have gained so much from this forum, that I have decided to support it. The financial outlay is small but hopefully helps. I know that there are a lot of people on here, who are in financial meltdown due to circumstances who are in no position to contribute but if you are ok financially and you are being helped from this forum, please consider supporting it. 

Unfortunately, after we have moved on from the forum, there will be countless others who will face exactly what we are going through. I want to do my little bit to make sure they have the same support that we have just now.


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## OutOfTheBlue

Very good day at work.

I went to phone my mum tonight and I normally just push the redial button (kids seldom use main phone) and up pops a local number. I type it into google and find out it is a local beauty salon. My W was here today, to get my S from school and she has used my phone to book an appointment at a beauty salon. Do you think, she is going there to improve her appearance for my benefit, I doubt it, no this will be for that guy she wants to make her feel special.

I am sorry but I am not happy - who the hell does she think she is, coming into my home and using my phone to make such appointments. It may seem no big deal but after what she has put me through, you would think that she would use a little bit of common sense ( and before you say anything morituri, I know, I know, lol). I think I am justified in my anger, imagine I had abandoned my family, telling my W that i had no feelings for her and that I wanted a woman to make me feel special. I then return to her home and use her phone to make an appointment at a hair replacement clinic (it's the only thing I could think off). Do you think she would be happy? I doubt it.

I picked up my mobile to txt her what I thought of her but I have posted here instead. Can she actually ever think of anyone but herself


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## SadSamIAm

Phone the beauty salon and cancel her appointment. Tell them she would like to come a couple of hours later.


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## OutOfTheBlue

SadSamIAm said:


> Phone the beauty salon and cancel her appointment. Tell them she would like to come a couple of hours later.


Believe me, I am tempted but that would just be stooping to a level I am not prepared to go to. 

If I were to ask W what she was thinking off, she would be bemused, such is the self centered character she is.

I'm better off without her.


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## OutOfTheBlue

I have a bit of a quandary regarding my eldest daughter. She came home tonight and told me that she is not happy about mum using our phone and internet to look up beauty salons. She is adamant that mum should not be treating this house as a second home, somewhere to go when she needs something or she is lonely.

I am very surprised by her grasp of the situation and there's not much I can disagree with in what she is saying but I asked her to not fall out with mum over it. I told her that mum has become used to me fixing things and it will take a little while until she realises that I am no longer there for her.

The quandary is, that I understand what she is saying but I do not want her to fight my battles. I also have to consider that she is probably not fighting my battles but her own, she is after all a couple of years older than her mum was, when she gave birth to her. I cannot believe how mature my daughters have been during this horrible time.

Tonight, I have thought back to the births of my kids and how magical it was. I was at each one and by the time my third one was born - my son - I considered myself a veteran. Those were very special occasions for me, very emotional and often tearful. I watched as each of our beautiful children entered this world. I was so proud of my W each time she went through the pain of labour and childbirth. On each of these occasions, the pride I had for my W was immeasurable. I loved her with all my heart. Words can not truly describe how I felt about my W on these occasions.

Now that she wants a man to make her feel special, I can only assume that she was deaf, dumb and blind during these wonderful occasions. She could not have found a man anywhere on this planet, who could have made her feel more special than I did. That really, really hurts. How could she forget those times. How could she forget the weeks that I tended to her wounds after our first child, when she tore like a paper towel. How could she not see my obvious respect for women and especially her, due to what she went through during childbirth. 

Sorry about the pity party and the ramble tonight but like so many of us on here, I am at a loss sometimes.


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## allthegoodnamesaregone

I go through the same thing when ever I think of my own children's birth. How any couple who had gone through that could devolve into what our relationships have become is incredibly sad. I used to look through our photo albums a lot, I can't anymore...


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## OutOfTheBlue

I know.

We've all heard the old jokes about the doctor putting in the extra stitch down there for the husbands. Nothing could have been further from my thoughts. My W was my W, I didn't accept her as she was, I loved her as she was. Her stretch marks, her little belly that she couldn't get rid off, didn't bother me in the slightest, in fact I liked it, she was a real woman, the mother of my kids and still very sexy in my eyes.

Will Mr perfect think the same way - I doubt it, otherwise there would be no need for beauty salons, would there?


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## Eli-Zor

Your daughter sees this with greater clarity than you , lock you wife out of the house . She chose to leave let her leave.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## OutOfTheBlue

This is a difficult night for me. Tonight, I found out that my W has been sha**ing another man. What makes it really difficult, is that it was my daughters who found out, through friends of friends. My daughter, stood in tears, telling me. I feel her pain.

I txt my W and apart from a feeble reply, she has not denied it. My D has vented her anger big style tonight and W is not responding to any txt's. 

I have told W, what I think of her and this is not anger, it is realisation. She has burned her bridges as far as I am concerned, she can rot in hell. She has put me and my kids through hell and I will never forgive her for that. The door is now closed. I do not want to set eyes on her again. My focus, from this point forward will be my kids and me.

I will be filing for divorce and I will be fighting for full custody of my S if I need to.

The guy she has been with, has just separated from his W because he can't keep it in his pants. He is the local sleazeball. I wonder if he made my W feel special.

Expect my posts to be a little bit erratic over the next few weeks as I come to terms with this.


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## OutOfTheBlue

I thought I had prepared myself for this outcome but I was wrong. I can't stop the tears, I am hiding from the kids. I am gutted that she could do this to me. 

My D txt her, saying that she has betrayed the most important people in her life, how could she do that. She told W that she was finished with her, she would never see her again, she hated her for what she had done, she called her filth, she said she had betrayed the best man my W could ever hope for - I had to walk away at that point. Being caught between my love for my D and my loathing of my W is not easy

I can't argue with my D, I feel exactly the same.

She has cheated on me, I can live with that, she has cheated on her kids, I can't live with that. I don't want her poisonous ways having any influence on my kids.


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## allthegoodnamesaregone

Sorry mate, I feel your pain. Mine did the same thing after 24 years and two kids together, hooked up with a guy she met playing WOW. If it wasn't so sad it would be laughable, the OM is fat, has poor social skills and is just coming off having had his live in of ten years cheating on him. He's also ten years younger than my WAW. 

It's real easy to "have a relationship" via text reality is different. It should be interesting how he handles living with a woman in peri-menopause ;~)


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## allthegoodnamesaregone

OutOfTheBlue said:


> I thought I had prepared myself for this outcome but I was wrong. I can't stop the tears, I am hiding from the kids. I am gutted that she could do this to me.
> 
> My D txt her, saying that she has betrayed the most important people in her life, how could she do that. She told W that she was finished with her, she would never see her again, she hated her for what she had done, she called her filth, she said she had betrayed the best man my W could ever hope for - I had to walk away at that point. Being caught between my love for my D and my loathing of my W is not easy
> 
> I can't argue with my D, I feel exactly the same.
> 
> She has cheated on me, I can live with that, she has cheated on her kids, I can't live with that. I don't want her poisonous ways having any influence on my kids.


My kids have just done pretty much the same this past week. My WAW lied to them about the affair time table, she tried to tell them she met the OM well after she left in mid summer.They figured it out that it started before she left and are livid about it.


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## OutOfTheBlue

allthegoodnamesaregone said:


> My kids have just done pretty much the same this past week. My WAW lied to them about the affair time table, she tried to tell them she met the OM well after she left in mid summer.They figured it out that it started before she left and are livid about it.



They all lie, cheaters that they are. At this point, I detest my W, I hate her.

Was I out of order to tell her to go f**k off and and live life with special man. This may seem extreme but I detest her for what she has done. There is no way back as far as I am concerned. She can just get, right out of my life, she is poison.

As far as I am concerned, she is nothing less than a *****.


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## allthegoodnamesaregone

Well... you are going to got through a series of strange emotions, rage is just one. I'm coming up to six months since the speech and I'm finally getting to the stage I'm tired of thinking about it, I'm "cried/numbed/raged" out and want to move on. I've come the conclusion WAW/MLC is a mental illness and I'm not qualified to be part of its treatment plan, it's all her's.


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## morituri

If your W had filed for divorce and waited until after it had been finalized before starting another relationship, this ordeal could have been avoided altogether. Now she faces the possibility of losing her children forever. She couldn't wait, could she? What an idiot!


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## OutOfTheBlue

morituri said:


> If your W had filed for divorce and waited until after it had been finalized before starting another relationship, this ordeal could have been avoided altogether. Now she faces the possibility of losing her children forever. She couldn't wait, could she? What an idiot!


morituri,

She bedded this man before she left me. I have asked her if she had sex with him before the last time we had sex, as I need to get tested but she is not responding.

She's suddenly gone quiet. I asked her if the cat had got her tongue, or is it still wrapped round his d*ck. Maybe not the most mature thing to say but what the hell, I am done with her.


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## morituri

When women walk away from their long term marriages to be with another man, they pretty much checked out the marriage. You have the choice of trying to fight for reconciliation or you can file for divorce and move on with your life. The choice is yours of course but realize that the odds are against any recovery once this happens. So choose wisely.


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## OutOfTheBlue

All day she has been denying it, although she didn't deny it last night, she just asked what was going on and who was saying that.

I suppose they all say that. If this turns out to be true, which I believe it is, then I am finished with her. if she can't prove otherwise, then as far as I am concerned it is true. I don't know how she can prove otherwise but that's not my problem.

Her biggest issue though, is that her D's don't believe her either and they have told her that unless she tells the truth, then she will not see them again.

She txt me asking how she can fix it with D's. I told her that, that was her problem not mine. I told her that she had broken the trust of her whole family and whilst that may be ok to do that with me, it's not ok with her kids. You got yourself into this mess, you get yourself out. She hasn't txt back, she doesn't like the truth.

I was in the kitchen making dinner and both daughters were there. They told me, that they wanted me to find someone else, someone who would appreciate me. I am a bit confused about this, I thought they would want mum and dad together regardless. Is this anger, or do they really see things for what they are - no hope?

My D's don't recognise my W anymore, they think she is someone different. They don't like what they see.

I asked my S, when he last received a txt from his mum and he can't remember. What a cold hearted ***** she is. There are people who can't have children, who would make much better mothers, than this woman. Life is not fair.


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## OutOfTheBlue

It appears that the word B*tch is not allowed 

I must remember to mask my sweary words with ******'s


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## morituri

Asteriks are not the only substitutes you can use to mask a word, for example b!tch (much better isn't it?).

I've no doubt that you are emotionally much stronger than your daughters and you can ride this sh!t storm but please consider getting them into counseling. For a short period their anger and bitterness towards their mother's actions is a natural response but over the long run these toxic twins can poison their young lives and negatively affect their adult relationships. So please consider getting them into counseling.

It's a good thing you told your wife to fix the mess she created. She broke it, she owns and pays for it.


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## OutOfTheBlue

Now I don't know what to think. My W is denying everything and there's a new twist in her favour. My D's boyfriend has told me that the source of the rumour is very unreliable and is a known gossip. He also said and that these sort of rumours are typical of where we live.

He told me that a few weeks ago, the same man was rumoured to be having it away with the local barmaid. He said that was extremely unlikely as she is young and good looking and he is the village sleazeball.

My D, now wishes she hadn't mentioned it as it may not be true.

For my D's sake, I am now telling them to take the rumour with a pinch of salt and give mum the benefit of the doubt. I have no other choice.

This is a roller coaster and I want off. My head is a mess. Is it true, is it not, I honestly don't know.


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## OutOfTheBlue

Trying to get myself back on track today as the last few days have derailed me a little bit. If she didn't sleep with this guy, then she will do it with someone soon. I just don't trust her. I need to get the focus back on me and the kids.

For those who have followed my thread, this is the week that I was supposed to do the refurb on the livingroom. Woke up to four inches of snow on Saturday morning, which hampered getting rid of rubbish and picking up materials and then I get the bombshell on Saturday night. Anyway, I got back on with it today and made some good progress. Nearly done the plastering and got the skirtings and door surrounds off. D (18) is giving me encouragement - That wall your plastering nearly looks flat dad 

My W txt today saying that I was putting ideas in my D's head and that it wasn't helping. She got both barrels. I said quite a bit, which included.

I don't need to put ideas in my D's head to destroy your relationship with them, you are doing a good job of it on your own.

Why have you not txt your S in days. I told him today, that you were struggling to keep your phone topped up and you were looking for a new price plan and this was not the first time I have lied to protect the kids.

Don't you dare cast aspersions my way, I am ten times the parent you are. She didn't answer but she did txt S.

Because of the events on Saturday night, I didn't get an opportunity to update on my W using my phone and computer for her beauty salon nonsense. I sent her a txt saying that she was not to come into the house again as she was treating me with contempt, you left me after stating you wanted another man who would make you feel special and then you come into my home and make enquiries to a beauty salon and you weren't even discreet about it. She txt back saying that she was sorry and wouldn't do it again and that she never said she was looking for another man. I txt her saying she was not to go in the house again.


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## Why Not Be Happy?

Hang in there!


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## OutOfTheBlue

Why Not Be Happy? said:


> Hang in there!


Thanks

-------------------

Feeling better tonight. Went to S's concert today. It was really good (Cinderella Rockerfella). For a small school, they have some very talented pupils. I realised how much my S is just a small version of me, although he has a lot more hair. 

My D (18), who has helped so much lately, won £100 in the raffle - karma. She said to me, I didn't buy the ticket, you did, so you can put it towards the livingroom refurb. I told her not to be silly, I bought the ticket for you, so it's yours. She gave her brother £20. What a fantastic young woman she is.

The thing, that has pleased me most today was my W. She came to the house after going to the evening show and asked to see D. I don't know all that was said but W was crying and wanted to make peace with D. She promised my D, that the rumours where not true and she hasn't been with any man. I think that watching my S at his concert has tugged a few heart strings. I told my W earlier in a txt that she needs to accept our D's anger, as it is to be expected. She needs to accept that she has caused hurt and that it's her responsibility to repair the damage. I desperately want them to make up but it needs to be W driving that and tonight she took an important step.

W, listened to my request and knocked on the door tonight. At this point, I can barely look at her. I don't want anything to do with her.


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## OutOfTheBlue

Well, to add to my woes, I was send for an xray today after suffering from a cough for the last eight weeks. After examination and explaining my symptoms, the doctor told me to go to the hospital. ( we have walk in xray facilities in our hospitals). I was ok with this until I read the the letter that I took. It said check for lesions. I know what these can be.

After leaving the hospital, I thought about my kids and I broke down. I sat and cried in my car for a few minutes. There was an element of self pity in there as well. I could barely speak to my D when I got home. 

I broke my 180 and spoke to my W. She told me to stay calm and that these sort of tests are precautionary. She is probably correct.

At this point, I don't give a sh!t about my 180 or whether my W sleeps with another man. I want my kids to have a dad.

I hope that I am over reacting at this point but the thought of my kids suffering more just breaks my heart. Maybe what I am going through is exaggerating my feelings.

My W leaving me has been firmly put into perspective.

I won't get the results until next week.

Am I being tested, have I been bad in a past life, I don't know but even though I am a strong person, I feel I am getting close to my limit. 

stop the life roller coaster, I want off.


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## OutOfTheBlue

Sorry for bringing doom and gloom to the forum but I can't discuss this with the people that mean the most to me. I would be causing them undue worry at this point.

As you can imagine, I am extremely fragile at this time. I imagine the worst in every situation. I hope that is all it is.

Whatever happens, this is a life changing experience for me.

Any words of support will be gratefully received.


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## OutOfTheBlue

Over the next few days, I am going to endure the biggest test I have ever faced. My kids want the livingroom done for Christmas. At this point, I am failing them, I can't focus on the task. I am being consumed by other events.

If there is a God out there, can you please give me the strength to do what needs to be done. I do not want to fail my kids.

All you God fairing people, can you please say a prayer for me, I desperately need it just now.

This is, without doubt, the worst I have ever felt in my life.


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## DailyGrind

OutOfTheBlue - I've not commented on your thread til now. I really feel for what you are going through. I know my situation, with just the WW, is causing me more stress and heartbreak than i though I could stand. Adding health issues.....I can only imagine.....actually....I can't! I hope and pray for you, in your situation. Please hang in there! Try to focus on your kids, and Christmas. The rest HAS to wait. My prayers on the outcome of your tests!


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## OutOfTheBlue

DailyGrind said:


> OutOfTheBlue - I've not commented on your thread til now. I really feel for what you are going through. I know my situation, with just the WW, is causing me more stress and heartbreak than i though I could stand. Adding health issues.....I can only imagine.....actually....I can't! I hope and pray for you, in your situation. Please hang in there! Try to focus on your kids, and Christmas. The rest HAS to wait. My prayers on the outcome of your tests!


Thank you - your support is appreciated. This is without doubt, the biggest test I have ever faced. In the last year, I've lost my Dad, I've lost my wife, I do not want my kids to lose me. I know that even if it is serious, I won't be gone tomorrow but the thought is still frightening. I know that I could deal with any outcome - death does not frighten me. However, the thought of my kids going through more heartache just brings me to my knees.

Hopefully, this will be just one of the other scores of problems that can imitate cancer.


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## warlock07

Don't panic. They are probably and most likely nothing. They happen all the time. Worrying about it won't help you a bit.


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## OutOfTheBlue

warlock07 said:


> Don't panic. They are probably and most likely nothing. They happen all the time. Worrying about it won't help you a bit.


I know, I know. it's just that when you keep getting knocked down, you start to expect it. The fact my Dad died from cancer of the esophagus doesn't help either. The doctor asked if I had any trouble swallowing, which I don't and he said it won't be anything to do with the esophagus.

I am hoping for acid reflux, which can give the exact same symptoms as I have. I have been suffering from heartburn as well.

Had a mixed day today, positive for a little while and then down for a while. Managed to do a little work on the room and put up the outside Christmas tree with my D


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## OutOfTheBlue

I forgot that I also spoke to W today. It was a very amicable conversation. I told her how well I was doing on my own. Everything I said to her about my situation post separation was pretty much all positive.

She on the other hand is not sleeping at night. If she is to survive the separation, then I think she will need to find someone else soon. Single life does not appear to be suiting her.


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## OutOfTheBlue

W txt this morning asking if I was ok. I told her I was slightly better.

I watched my S writing out Christmas cards tonight, I had to leave the room, as I broke down. I am such a chicken heart when it comes to them. At this point, I am failing them and I need to get my act together.

W has txt a couple of times today about kid stuff and my current situation.

In one txt, she stated that sh!t happens and that she knows I am strong enough to deal with it. She then goes on to say, that I have managed to get rid of one sh!tty thing in my life - her.

Why is she saying that? Does she realise that she is a big part of the problem?

I don't know, I just want to get through next week with a positive outcome. At this point, I don't care about anything except my kids.


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## OutOfTheBlue

LarryJms said:


> Hi My name is "Larry" just want to share my experience with the world on how i got my love back and saved my marriage... I was married for 7years with 2kids and we lived happily until things started getting ugly and we had fights and arguments almost every time... it got worse at a point that she filed for divorce... I tried my best to make her change her mind & stay with me cause i loved her with all my heart and didn't want to loose her but everything just didn't work out... she moved out of the house and still went ahead to file for divorce... I pleaded and tried everything but still nothing worked. The breakthrough came when someone introduced me to this wonderful, great spell caster who eventually helped me out... I have never been a fan of things like this but just decided to try reluctantly cause I was desperate and left with no choice... He did special prayers and used roots and herbs... Within 7 days she called me and was sorry for all the emotional trauma she had cost me, moved back to the house and we continue to live happily, the kids are happy too and we are expecting our third child... I have introduced him to a lot of couples with problems across the world and they have had good news... Just thought I should share my experience cause I strongly believe someone out there need's it... You can email me on larryjms49 at gmail dot com to get the spell caster's contact... Don't give up just yet, the different between "Ordinary" & "Extra-Ordinary" is the "Extra" so make extra effort to save your marriage/relationship if it's truly worth it.
> 
> Regards
> Larry.


I think you should stay on yahoo chat.

Take your sh!t somewhere else.


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## OutOfTheBlue

Ps

If you want me to send you my bank account details because you have a large sum of money waiting for me here they are.

Account No - Go F*ck yourself
Sort Code - Go F*ck yourself


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## OutOfTheBlue

I wish this damned cough would go away. It's a constant reminder. My chest is hurting because of it. If I take anything to soothe it, it just gives me heartburn.

Did a bit more DIY today, best day since Wednesday.

My W is being very supportive. She's texting me every day, asking if I am ok. I told my W that my Mum was moving back to where she came from, in January. She txt back, that's another thing I've messed up. She is concerned about how my Mum will cope. She also told me to be positive and not worry about things that haven't happened, she said that she had spent 22 years doing that. (remember jealousy issues)

Is my W starting to get a conscience? Is she realising that she played a big part in our marriage breakdown? I don't know but she is definitely different.

At no point have I mentioned any reconciliation or anything remotely close to it. I have told her that I look forward to having a future with my kids.


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## OutOfTheBlue

Not much happening today. Managed to do two thirds of the new floor in the livingroom, should finish it tomorrow. Looking much better already.

W txt tonight asking if I was ok. One of the tragedies of this whole mess, is that my Mum misses my W. They used to go out every Saturday. My W provided my mum with a lot of support after my Dad died and she needed it. Of course, she also provided me with a lot of support.

When I think back to what my W actually did for my mum and Dad during my Dad's illness, perhaps I wasn't as appreciative as I should have been. In all honesty, she was a rock. It was my W that forced my Dad to go into hospital towards the end as my Mum was just out on her feet. Not many people stand up to my Dad. It was fortunate that she did, my Dad died a couple of days later and required medical intervention that would have been too late had he been at home. 

My Mum asked me the other night if there where any signs of problems in the romantic department, which should have indicated a problem. I told her that if our marriage had been judged solely on that area, then our marriage had improved exponentially throughout it's time. She couldn't understand this, I told her that I couldn't either.

I obviously didn't go into detail but our sex life up to the end was really good, much better than it had been in the earlier years - much, much better. Go figure.


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## morituri

If your wife is not a toxic person, maybe you should consider encouraging both women to continue their relationship.


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## OutOfTheBlue

morituri said:


> If your wife is not a toxic person, maybe you should consider encouraging both women to continue their relationship.



Wow, once again, you have the situation sussed. Today, I did exactly that. They are meeting tomorrow morning. The only condition I put on my Mum was no relationship talk.


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## OutOfTheBlue

My W went to see my Mum today. What I expected to be an hour get together ended up two and a half hours. They cuddled at the end.

I told my Mum last night, that I have said all I am going to say to my W about our separation. I told her that if my W found another man and they wanted to keep up their relationship, then that was ok with me. My Mum thought that she would be betraying me, I told her that was nonsense. Life is too short for silly arguments.

I just want to have the chance to move forward with kids.

Haven't had the results of my X-Ray yet.


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## morituri

Marriage aside, your mother can give your W good advice because she's a woman, like her, who has lived longer and seen many more things than she has. Your W, or STBXW, needs all the good advice she can get to become a better person and parent.


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## OutOfTheBlue

morituri said:


> Marriage aside, your mother can give your W good advice because she's a woman, like her, who has lived longer and seen many more things than she has. Your W, or STBXW, needs all the good advice she can get to become a better person and parent.


Exactly,

I do not think my W has been given good advice from her Mother. My W needs to experience life without me, I have made things too easy, I have accepted behaviour that I shouldn't have. It may take my W to move on with her life, meet someone else and deal with her issues, to become the person she wants to be. I doubt very much, that I will be around for her. I am enjoying my family life with my kids.

I got my X-Ray results back today - they were normal. Good news there but still need to get to the bottom of my problem.

I am going to break away from relationship talk and mention someone who has been a great help to me. I will call him B. B has had his own problems in the past, he has had to endure battles with alcohol, battles with his marriage and lately, battles with smoking. He hasn't had an easy time but he has achieved much more than he realises.

Why do I mention B? Well, I mention B because here was a man who didn't know me, a man who has and still is, facing his own demons. The only thing we had in common, was an interest in the football team we supported. That football team is Celtic.

The night my W left me, I posted on my favourite Celtic blog about my predicament and I was inundated with messages of support. I had people sending me their e-mail addresses because they had suffered similar, or just because they wanted to help. B was one of them. He was extremely open about his own battles and offered support to me based on his own experiences. His support has been magnificent.

When I went to the doctors last week, I e-mailed B, he immediately sent me his mobile No, which I duly called. B chatted with me for a while and gave me an outlet for my worry and some practical advice.

After txting my W this morning about my results, I txt B next. That will tell you what I think of B.

To a man I have never met but hopefully will soon, thank you so much buddy, you are an absolute gem.

Just because someone has betrayed us or has acted in a way we can't understand, keep your faith in human nature. There are a lot of good people out there.


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## Powerbane

Just goes to show you that "Angels" abound wherever you go. Keep the faith my man. Either way you will survive and be better in the end.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## OutOfTheBlue

Powerbane said:


> Just goes to show you that "Angels" abound wherever you go. Keep the faith my man. Either way you will survive and be better in the end.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Thank you my friend, you are correct.

On the subject of angels, here is one of my all time favourites.

Sarah McLachlan


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## OutOfTheBlue

For those of you following the 180 for the purposes of getting your spouse back , stop reading now. Although, you should know, that is not what the 180 is about.

My W is coming for Christmas day. My W raised the subject again after meeting with my Mum. I said I was ok with it, as long as we treated my S with caution. I think we can do that.

You may be wondering why I would allow this, well to be honest, life is too short and the kids are all in favour of this. I have accepted my W's position and there will be no attempt to impress my W, I am quite happy as I am. I will do, what I normally do on Christmas day, spend most of my time in the kitchen - I always cook Christmas dinner.

My Mum is going to my Brother's but I will have my S, both of my D's and my eldest D's boyfriend and my W to cook for.

This may be a mistake but I will live with it.


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## morituri

Perhaps your mother and kids could help you keeping your wife engaged in conversation while you go about doing your business in the kitchen.


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## OutOfTheBlue

Well, Christmas day was a disappointment, why? because I was ill. For a few days prior to Christmas, I was feeling ill and losing my appetite. On Christmas morning, I could not even think of food, never mind look at it or cook it. My W therefore took over the duties. Not what I wanted but at the time, I couldn't care less.

My W arrived at 10am for the opening of the presents. She noticed I was not well and asked if I wanted her to cook, I had no choice. After a couple of hours of dry vomiting (remember, little food for two days), I retired to my bed for a couple of hours. I could not sleep though.

When I got up, dinner was nearly ready. I had a small sideplate of food, which I could barely get down, although I felt slightly better than I had in the morning.

This was not what I had wanted for Christmas day but I tried to make the most of it. We all sat and watched a movie in the afternoon after dinner. It was very relaxed. My W was very complimentary on the work I had done to the livingroom and I mean, very complimentary. In the past she would have found fault. I assured her, the effort was for the kids. 

She did not leave straight after the movie, in fact, she asked me when I wanted her to leave. I told her to leave when she felt she had satisfied herself that Christmas day had been a success for the kids. She stayed another hour. She txt me later, saying that she had forgotten a small present for our S. It was sweets. I told her that there was ample to keep our S going and not to worry about it. She then txt, that she hoped we had enjoyed the day. I said that we had except me because I was ill.

There have been no txts today. As far as I am concerned, it is business as usual. This was a one off, there will be no more. If she thinks she can have her cake and eat it, she has another think coming.

ps I managed some soup and some fruit today. I feel better for it


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## hurtingsobad

I called my ex and wished her a Merry Xmas. Didn't expect a reply, nor was any given.

I have decided I can't seek forgiveness with one who doesn't know how to forgive themselves.

On to the mediator Friday.....as Nixon once said "Sock it to me!"


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## OutOfTheBlue

It's been a few days since I posted. I am feeling better by the day but not quite there yet. My appetite is very slowly returning but I vomited again today, due to the coughing. However, my mood is lifting, so that is positive.

Christmas, overall was a bit of a disaster but I need to be thankful for what I got. I got to spend Christmas day with my three kids and what's not to like about that.

I have to be honest, my W being there has not helped me, in fact, it has set me back a little bit. My W is a beautiful woman, something I have always been aware of and to be honest, a little scared of as well. She turns heads and a part of me has probably always feared that a handsome younger man would come along and take her away. I think that outcome is highly likely now. I think she is focused on the fantasy side of life, rather than the reality, I can't win that one.

I try to remember the old adage, beauty is only skin deep. It helps.

I look forward to getting back to work and getting my life back in order.


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## jimmmy

Let her be the Dumb Ass, stand back and watch but you'll need time and if you want to pick up the pieces, your girl is right she doesn't deserve you...


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## jimmmy

Do not help her, I'm sure she'll come round eventully, stick to your guns.It's what I've done/ am doing.I'm going through a tough time too, girlfriend has gone ,2 months, 2 children with emotional problems, girlfriend seeing another guy and couldn't care less who she hurts...she has common points with your wife coming from a loveless childhood with a near absent father...that's why it's so natural to inflict the same on her man and kids who have done only their best to make her happy.This is obviously not enough for some people who need to be traeted like royalty and give nothing in return...if she returns she has a NEED to....


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## OutOfTheBlue

jimmmy said:


> Do not help her, I'm sure she'll come round eventully, stick to your guns.It's what I've done/ am doing.I'm going through a tough time too, girlfriend has gone ,2 months, 2 children with emotional problems, girlfriend seeing another guy and couldn't care less who she hurts...she has common points with your wife coming from a loveless childhood with a near absent father...that's why it's so natural to inflict the same on her man and kids who have done only their best to make her happy.This is obviously not enough for some people who need to be traeted like royalty and give nothing in return...if she returns she has a NEED to....


Sorry for your pains, I know it's tough. I have three kids as you know - the way I look at it is this, I have lost a quarter of my family, my W has lost three quarters. Who's worse off? If I were to be brutally honest, the most important part of my family without doubt, are still here.

My W is a troubled woman and will probably need to hit rock bottom before she realises her mistakes. I won't be here when she does.


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## OutOfTheBlue

Wishing all those who are suffering just now, a better 2012.

Happy New Year


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## OutOfTheBlue

I haven't had a txt from my W for a few days, then I receive this one this morning
......................

How are you today?
I didn't know if I should have wished you a happy new year but I will. Happy new year.

I hope you can be happy, you deserve to be. I hope you are feeling better now. I think you are doing great and I am sorry for what I have put you through, not just two months ago but for the last 22 years.

Be happy

I txt her back wishing her a happy new year and said that I hope she finds the happiness she is looking for
...................

Is my W getting a conscience or is she just feeling sorry for herself?


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## morituri

Who knows what goes inside another person's head, but her text does contain an acknowledgement from her that she has not been as committed to you as you've been to her. You may want to consider replying back to her with something along the lines of:

"Change is often painful but necessary in order to grow. I have grown to realize that I deserve more in life and in love. I will no longer settle for less. I sincerely wish you peace and happiness on your new chapter in life."

As far as her being a beautiful woman is concerned, it can be both a blessing as well as a curse. Beautiful women attract many men, many just want to have sex with them and then dispose of them. These women know this fact very well and yearn to find a man who will love them for what's inside them more than what's on the outside. Your wife will soon find this out once she starts dating other men. There is more than a good chance that she will have her heart broken more than once. She'll find out how hard it is to find a man of quality and that the grass is often less greener on the other side.


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## dymo

I wonder if she's trying to justify her leaving by saying that you're better off without her? By taking blame for the past 22 years, can say she's not just leaving for her own happiness, but for your happiness too. If she convinces herself that you were unhappy with the marriage all along, then her leaving is a selfless act instead of a selfish one.


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## Pathfinder

OutoftheBlue, I think you deserve a freaking medal. I am new to this. My wife and I are not seperated but she gave me all the usual c**p about loving me but not in love and yada yada. We still are together and I have gone 180 on day 3. I don't know what the future hold but this thread has been an inspiration. Hell if you can do it then maybe I can too! I love my wife like mad. I have changed and become a very kind, gentle, loving and considerate man that treats my wife like royalty. However the fog is in and that is that. Its such a pity that people fall like this and cause such devastation. Its such a pity that people can't accept and forgive and try but then life can be very cruel. I have grown into what my wife told me the other day is the most amazing man she has ever met. Its all bulls**t. She is gone and now I must just erase her from my heart. Not easy by any stretch but this thread, this blog and your journey is helping me believe I can maybe survive this, pick myself up and carry on and maybe even learn to smile again. I wish you the best and keep posting please, I support you all the way! Your kids are awesome and I think you are doing an amazing job! Hang in there
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## OutOfTheBlue

morituri -

I said something close to what you were suggesting when I told her that I wished her a happy new year and said that I hope she finds the happiness she is looking for.

dymo - 

It is a possibility. The strange thing is, she is praising me more than she ever did when we were together. She also said in a later txt, that she knows there will be someone out there for me, who will make me happy. I replied, that I have no doubt, that I will find someone. I'll probably never figure out what she is up to. 

Pathfinder - 

I'm glad this thread is helping you. It helps me as well. I realised very early on that my W meant what she was saying and that there was no point in trying to change her mind.

It took me a couple of weeks to get over the initial shock, which is to be expected. When you do the 180, you must do it for the right reasons. Accept their decision and move on. It's hard but you have no choice. There is only one person that you can change in these situations and that is yourself.

In my case, I had my three kids who needed stability. It was up to me to provide that and I have done the best that I can. 

If you stick to the 180 and do what needs to be done, especially where kids are involved, then you will feel better about yourself. Your own self esteem will get a boost. Mine has. I am in control of my destiny, not my W.

I am now in a situation were I feel my kids are comfortable enough with the situation, that I am now taking a back seat when it comes to their Mum. I only monitor my S, to make sure he is ok. The last time I mentioned my W to my D (18), she said that she didn't want to talk about her mum as she had lost feelings for her. Previously, I would have txt W to get it sorted but my D's are making their own decisions now and I shouldn't interfere.


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## Pathfinder

Well Outoftheblue, you are going to get there one day, that much I am sure of. Your story is very sad and unfortunately too common but at least the good news is that you have a great relationship with your kids, you are surviving and have grown as a person and you have a truckload of people on TAM that share your pain, support you and even take courage from you. Keep it real. Now I am gonna go back to my thread and vent some more


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## Tap1214

Outoftheblue ....Been reading your thread and I have a feeling your wife was having a relationship with someone else (maybe EA or PA) ...who knows! But Mother of 3 won't just walk away like that, unless she has someone on the side. I may be wrong, but just sayin'. 
Either way, I command you for being strong, and for listening to all the advice people are giving here. They really do care and as with others, I will be praying for you and your family.
Here's a good quote:
"Every adversity, every failure, every heartache carries with it the seed of an equal or greater benefit." ~ Napoleon Hill


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## OutOfTheBlue

Tap1214 said:


> Outoftheblue ....Been reading your thread and I have a feeling your wife was having a relationship with someone else (maybe EA or PA) ...who knows! But Mother of 3 won't just walk away like that, unless she has someone on the side. I may be wrong, but just sayin'.


Tap1214, that is something I have considered and it may be true but I will never know for sure. I am learning to live with the idea that she has either recently been involved with another man in an EA or PA or that she is planning to do so very soon.

To be honest, I am getting to the point were I don't really care. I have decided that my W has gone and there is nothing I can do about it. Do I really want a future with a woman who has treated me and her kids so poorly. The answer to that, is moving very close to the no camp.

Yes, we all want to save our marriages but there is a limit and I am reaching it. I am now back at work after the festive holidays and I am focusing on getting back to where I was - me and the kids. My W's parents have played a huge part in my W's behaviour. I am damned if my W is going to have the same influence on my kids. Thankfully, my D's seem to have a very good grasp of what is going on. They are more aware of my W's past behaviour than I thought.


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## Tap1214

That's wonderful that you have a great relationship with your daughters. Right now, they need you more then ever!

Hang in there and be strong and remember, you have only ONE life to live ...Make a best decision for yourself and for your children.

Wish you luck Mr. Outoftheblue!


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## OutOfTheBlue

Tap1214 said:


> That's wonderful that you have a great relationship with your daughters. Right now, they need you more then ever!
> 
> Hang in there and be strong and remember, you have only ONE life to live ...Make a best decision for yourself and for your children.
> 
> Wish you luck Mr. Outoftheblue!


Thank you Tap1214, your support is appreciated.

Got a txt from W tonight, first since the 2nd, asking me if I am glad to be back at work and if I am feeling ok. I txt back saying that I am glad to be back amongst my work colleagues and that I am feeling fine and doing well. W is being very friendly. Guilty conscience perhaps?


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## Tap1214

Yes, probably! But stay focus on your work and children. 
And always remember "Never make someone a priority in your life who only sees you as an option"! 
Just don't take her back or have her move back home, for all the wrong reasons!


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## OutOfTheBlue

Tap1214 said:


> Yes, probably! But stay focus on your work and children.
> And always remember "Never make someone a priority in your life who only sees you as an option"!
> Just don't take her back or have her move back home, for all the wrong reasons!


Absolutely. If it wasn't for the kids, I would cut her out of my life completely. I am caught between a rock and a hard place with the kids, especially my S. He has stated that he does not want to go to W's flat. My W asked me if she could come to the house whilst I was at work to see my S, I wanted to say no but couldn't.

Before my W arrived, I txt her to say that I had gathered up the last of her belongings and that they would be in the hall for her to collect.

If my W wants to be part of my life, which I don't think is the case, then it will be under conditions set by me. The problem is, I know that there are women out there who would love to have a man like me and would treat me as I should be treated. I think that would be my best option.


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## OutOfTheBlue

My S got me up last night for the third night in a row. I txt my W this morning asking her to give him some additional attention over the next few days. A few amicable txts passed back and forward until the one where she blamed me for our S being unsettled.

She stated it was because I wasn't a proper Dad to my S and that is why he is missing his Mum so much. I really tried to bite my tongue but I couldn't and for the first time I lost my cool and used the F word in a txt.

My W, who was at my house at the time seeing my S, then proceeded to explain to my D (18) that her brother was struggling because of Dad. My D went mad and ordered my W out of her room. My D's are asking me what planet is their Mum on. 

Now, I am not saying I was a perfect Dad because I wasn't. I got caught up in work a lot of the time and didn't spend as much time with my kids as I should have but I also had a lot to deal with and my W was at the root of most of it.

My W is a very mixed up woman and it seems to be getting worse.


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## morituri

It's called blameshifting. She has to demonize you in order for her to justify her behavior. Usually seen when a spouse is deep in an affair - who knows, maybe she is in one right now.


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## OutOfTheBlue

morituri said:


> It's called blameshifting. She has to demonize you in order for her to justify her behavior. Usually seen when a spouse is deep in an affair - who knows, maybe she is in one right now.


It would make a lot of sense but she is adamant (aren't they all)

I am pleased to say that I am making good progress. My plans for the future, do not include my W. I have been speaking with a female work colleague quite a bit recently and although she is not even available, it has made me realise that I find other women interesting and they find me interesting. It has helped me move on.

My S has gone through a difficult patch recently as it started to sink in. Fortunately my W has at last realised the impact her actions have had and is reacting appropriately. I have been paying particular attention to him and his sisters have great.


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## OutOfTheBlue

I haven't heard from my W since Monday and you know what? I don't want to.

Going to the Zoo tomorrow with the kids. Mixed feelings about it as I hate animals living in a Zoo - not so bad with a safari type park but not a cage. Edinburgh Zoo has a couple of Pandas and we are booked to see them at 9.15am. I can't find the charger for my camera battery though :-(

Catch up later.


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## OutOfTheBlue

What can I say, today was brilliant. Kids enjoyed their day, I enjoyed my day. Very happy tonight. When we left the zoo, we found the nearest McDonalds, which for Edinburgh Zoo, is Corstorphine. I had two big mac meals . Now that would normally be bad news but I've lost a stone in weight over the past couple of months. I am just happy that I have my appetite back.

D's have txt me tonight, telling me, that they really enjoyed today.

W txt me, asking how our day at zoo went. I told her, it was brilliant. Not heard back from her. Hmmmm.

Life is good. :smthumbup:


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## CarolAnn

Why should she care how your day at the zoo with the kids went? She is selfish and evil, and she is yanking your chain. Evidently, it is working, since you are wondering why she didn't text back.


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## OutOfTheBlue

CarolAnn said:


> Why should she care how your day at the zoo with the kids went? She is selfish and evil, and she is yanking your chain. Evidently, it is working, since you are wondering why she didn't text back.


Whoaa, back the train up. My W is many things, selfish, yep, troubled, yep, evil, absolutely not. I can think of many people who are evil, my W doesn't even come close to that category.

My W may be trying to yank my chain but the "hmmmm", I put at the end of my post suggests that I am fully aware of what is going on. Did I txt her back wondering why, she hadn't replied, no I did not. You need to read a bit more into my posts and stop making assumptions.


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## CarolAnn

I have read all your posts. No, you did not text her back. You did wonder why, though.


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## OutOfTheBlue

CarolAnn said:


> I have read all your posts. No, you did not text her back. You did wonder why, though.


After 22 years of marriage and less than 3 months of separation, that is to be expected. Acceptance takes time and I think I am doing good. I'm not having a go at you, your comments are welcome but memories can not be wiped after a few months.

As I said before, life is good :smthumbup:


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## OutOfTheBlue

Things are moving on nicely. One thing that happened when I was at the zoo, is that I took a good picture with my camera. I bought a Canon digital SLR last year and I have struggled to find the time or the motivation to use it. The picture at the zoo, which I was accused of downloading of the internet when I made it my wallpaper on my work PC, has re-kindled my desire.

I have arranged with a woman at work to photograph her daughters horses as a practice exercise. I am really excited about this. My love for photography could be the interest that moves me forward. If I could only combine that with my love for Celtic football club, I would be in paradise. (B if you are reading, the pun in that last sentence was deliberate) 

Life is getting better :smthumbup:


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## OutOfTheBlue

For those who are following my 'blog' and find themselves in the same situation as me, then listen to what I am about to say.

There is life after separation, honestly, there is. Here's the secret, let go, just let go. You can't control your spouse but you can control you. Focus on yourself and if you have them, then your kids as well. It's not easy to begin with, that's to be expected but keep at it, you can do it, you are worth it.


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## Why Not Be Happy?

Nice post!


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## OutOfTheBlue

Well, the day of reckoning has arrived. My W came to the house today to speak to my D's. She had something to tell them. They interrupted her and said, "don't tell us but you have another man"

She said yes and guess what? No, don't bother, you already know what I am going to say. Yep, it is the guy who the rumour was about. She tried to say that she only got together with him after we separated. My daughters gave her both barrels - called her a liar, told her to get out of the house. She eventually left.

My daughters are livid, not just because their mum has been having an affair but because she is lying. They hate her. I can't disagree.

When I came in from work, my youngest D came down to see me and she told me straight away. I am proud of her for doing this and really pleased that she felt she could. I am furious though, that my W once again, left my D's to tell me something like this. Luckily, my D's know that I am ok with the situation.

I was also left with the pleasure of telling my S. I didn't want to but I was left with no choice. I couldn't have him finding out from someone else or bumping in to "other man". I couldn't rely on W dealing with this in a mature manner. 

A bit upset tonight as you can imagine. I will go now but don't worry, I will be ok. My D, who is out tonight has already txt me, telling me she loves me but more importantly, she txt her wee brother asking him if he's ok. I love her to bits for that. Welling up here, better go.


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## canguy66

I'm glad they blaster her, and it warmed my heart that your D texted your son to see if he was ok. Proof they know the difference - means you did a great job teaching them values along the way. :smthumbup:


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## CSeryllum

I'm glad to hear that you are handling it well, and that you have wonderful children who support you. Good for you <3

I often wonder...when my divorce is final...how soon after will she fly out to visit the "man she's just friends with online"...I've already found that she was browsing for deals on plane tickets to visit him....but said "nothing more than that has happened or will, it was just a thought"......but I know that if nothing went down...it will, soon as she can do it "guilt free" and i'll also have to hear the "It just sort of happened" story


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## OutOfTheBlue

canguy66 said:


> I'm glad they blaster her, and it warmed my heart that your D texted your son to see if he was ok. Proof they know the difference - means you did a great job teaching them values along the way. :smthumbup:


When my S told me that, I had to leave the room, as I filled up.

If I can take a positive from this mess, it's that I realise how much I love my kids and they love me.


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## OutOfTheBlue

CSeryllum said:


> I'm glad to hear that you are handling it well, and that you have wonderful children who support you. Good for you <3
> 
> I often wonder...when my divorce is final...how soon after will she fly out to visit the "man she's just friends with online"...I've already found that she was browsing for deals on plane tickets to visit him....but said "nothing more than that has happened or will, it was just a thought"......but I know that if nothing went down...it will, soon as she can do it "guilt free" and i'll also have to hear the "It just sort of happened" story


It's amazing, the lengths they will go to (cheaters) to relieve the guilt. In most cases, they will make the situation much worse in their pursuit of trying to prove the opposite of what we know to be the truth.


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## OutOfTheBlue

I stood and looked at my S sleeping tonight and it brought me to my knees. I feel his pain ten fold. How could anyone inflict so much pain is beyond me. What kind of creatures exist amongst us, creatures, that would bring so much pain.


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## dymo

Have you any plans to file for divorce?


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## OutOfTheBlue

dymo said:


> Have you any plans to file for divorce?


Yes, I will be divorcing her on the grounds of adultery. I am also going to file for full custody of my S. I want her out of my life.


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## Why Not Be Happy?

Hang in there and continue to be strong!


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## OutOfTheBlue

Why Not Be Happy? said:


> Hang in there and continue to be strong!


I will do my best - Thanks. 

It hasn't been a great day as you can imagine but it has been far from a disaster.

Trying to get myself together again. One thing I know for sure, W is the past, she will play no part in my future. What I am struggling with, is the guy she has picked is a womaniser and not very handsome either. My daughter described him as a creep. What does that say about me?


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## OutOfTheBlue

Bad day today. I am going through a spell of self pity. I did not deserve to be treated this way. I will allow myself this self pity for a week as the tears help the healing process. I will not allow it to take over me though. In a few weeks, I will be back to where I was. 

We often forgive people who don't deserve it, simply because we don't want to lose them.

Let them go. We deserve better.


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## OutOfTheBlue

Quick update.

The self pity has gone - unfortunately replaced by anger but I feel that beginning to subside. Trying really hard to get rid of the images of her being with another man. 

Got an appointment with a divorce lawyer. W has agreed to my terms. Hopefully get papers served in the next month.

I could not be with a woman at this point and the thought of sex disgusts me but I suppose that's natural and will fade in time. I see it as a lustful, dirty act but that's just because my W has acted in a dirty manner. I want to go out and get another woman to punish my W but I won't, it would be unfair on the woman, on my kids and also me, as it's not what I truly want. 

I just want to get back to where I was, in control of my life.

I have encouraged my S to go out with his mum, as hard as it was to assure him everything was ok and I wanted him to see mum. They go out tomorrow. D's are a different kettle of fish, they have disowned their mum and there's no signs of change.


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## dymo

How's it going?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## OutOfTheBlue

dymo said:


> How's it going?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Sorry I've been absent for a while. After going through a few difficult months where everything seemed to conspire against me, I feel I am seeing the light at the end of the tunnel.

When you suffer pain and you are subjected to more pain before you have had time to recover, you become even more susceptible. Suddenly things that you would normally take in your stride become big issues, issues that drive you further down, making you even more susceptible. It's a vicious circle. 

The latest issue was a letter from my wife's solicitor wanting a£10k as a settlement. I couldn't believe it, the woman who had left me for another man, tore her family apart, now wanted to inflict further pain. I was furious. Her daughters were furious. How could she do this?

I threatened, that I would do everything in my power to keep her son away from her and I meant it. I did a little research on Scottish law, regarding separations and divorce and what I could do to keep her son away from her.

After a week of this, I slowly realised that she could have taken me for a lot more but more importantly, I realised, that I was contemplating, using my son to get back at her. That shocked me. How could I use my son to get back at my wife. That would be so damaging to him. Fortunately, I came to my senses. I realised that the most important thing to me was my son's welfare. I backtracked and accepted her demands and agreed a favourable custody arrangement, which meant that I was the primary parent but she could have almost unrestricted access to my son.

After doing this, I feel so much better. I feel as though I have let the anger go. I feel that I have drawn a line in the sand. The anger was holding me back. It is now time to move on with my life.


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## morituri

OutOfTheBlue, she may get £10k but she'll loose something infinitely far more valuable, the love and respect of her daughters. What a fool.


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## warlock07

never posted but I was following your thread from the beginning. Missed the last few posts confirming the affair. Too bad, huh? And it happens to be the village sleazeball. I wonder how much your wife was the reason for his divorce too. Looks like it had been going for sometime. You might want to talk to his wife to find out how long this had been going on. Atleast she could have told you the truth when you found out the first time...

Too bad, the people we trust our heart in...


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## working_together

I think your wife is in a very bad place at the moment. I knew from the beginning of your posts that she left you for this man. It was so abrupt and quick for her to decide to move out. It's hard to believe that one would abondon her children for a man...

Try to keep details of your divorce and your squabbles with your wife from all three children, they don't need to hear any of it. Your daughters have already formed their own opinion on her based on what their mother has done to you, leave it at that. Even though they are older, it is still stressful for them to digest. My son who is almost 22 knows very little concerning my separation from his dad. I say very little out of respect for his father and trying to encourage a relationship for them. It's difficult not to chime in when they say negative things about their own parent. 

all the best


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## Mamatomany

working_together said:


> I think your wife is in a very bad place at the moment. I knew from the beginning of your posts that she left you for this man. It was so abrupt and quick for her to decide to move out. It's hard to believe that one would abondon her children for a man...
> 
> Try to keep details of your divorce and your squabbles with your wife from all three children, they don't need to hear any of it. Your daughters have already formed their own opinion on her based on what their mother has done to you, leave it at that. Even though they are older, it is still stressful for them to digest. My son who is almost 22 knows very little concerning my separation from his dad. I say very little out of respect for his father and trying to encourage a relationship for them. It's difficult not to chime in when they say negative things about their own parent.
> 
> all the best


My adult kids know as much or as little as they want. I don't want them wondering or questioning rationality and I want them to learn from my mistakes. I am probably in the minority here but I also rely on them. They are my only family in the area and I need their help w/ the house/kids etc esp since he has just walked away from responsibilities.


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## OutOfTheBlue

I appreciate the comments.

People at work are asking me if I've won the lotto because I appear so happy.

In a way, I have won the lotto as I feel as though I have turned a corner. Saturday night was a blast, nothing too intense with the woman I was with but the best laugh I have had in a long time. I felt alive again - something that has been missing for a long time. 

I returned home as I promised myself I would and I'm glad I did. My son kept asking his granny, "when is dad coming home"


Regarding my daughters. They are old enough to understand what has happened here. I am faced with a choice of trying to convince them that mum's behaviour is ok or allowing them to see it for what it is. I have chosen to let them see it for what it is. I cannot let them believe that this type of behaviour is normal or acceptable. I think I am choosing the lesser of the two evils. As time passes, I will try to help my daughters patch up their relationship with their mum. This will be on the basis that they understand, that mum's behaviour, is a result of poor parenting and not that this behaviour is not normal.

My son, on the other hand has been protected 100% from the gory details.

My W, will regret the day she walked out on her family. Unfortunately for her, we will all have moved on.


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## bandit.45

My hats off to you sir. You are an axample we men should all follow.


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## OutOfTheBlue

bandit.45 said:


> My hats off to you sir. You are an axample we men should all follow.


Thank you. Your comment is really appreciated. 

It's been a difficult journey, of that there is no doubt but it is only that, a journey. The most important point is, we have within us the ability to determine the destination. We must grasp this. Yes, it is hard and at times, excruciating and there can be many obstacles in the way but we can do it. :smthumbup:


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

My eldest D informed me tonight that her mum and her mum's new boyfriend where in the local pub on Thursday night. Now, how did I know that would happen. I'll tell you why, she is a thoughtless, self centered, ***** of a woman. She knows my daughter spends time there.

She approached my D, who had caught sight of her as she entered the pub. She spoke to my D as though nothing had happened. My D told her that she had nothing to say to her. My W then proceeded to blame me for turning my D against her. My D put her in her place, explaining it was her behaviour, that has caused the situation.

Will this woman ever know when to stop pressing the self destruct button. Unfortunately, I doubt it.


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## bandit.45

While your W is drinking herself into a stupor, you should be down at the gym turning yourself into Mr. Sexy Macho Stud man. Get in shape and after the D date, date, date.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## OutOfTheBlue

bandit.45 said:


> While your W is drinking herself into a stupor, you should be down at the gym turning yourself into Mr. Sexy Macho Stud man. Get in shape and after the D date, date, date.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


LOL, I actually laughed out loud there. I pass a gym on my way to work every morning, does that count?  

I could maybe get to the Sean Connery type of Macho man but my Brad Pitt days are over.

Having said that, I spent fifteen years of my life on a chainsaw, felling trees and I developed, what I consider, slow grown muscle, which is different to the bloated body builders. I can put men half my age to shame and it wouldn't take much to get back in shape.

Hmmm, maybe I should stop off at the gym on the way home :smthumbup:


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## bandit.45

Get a makeover bro. Treat yourself to some new clothes and a nice haircut. Take care of yourself for once.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## morituri

It seems that the roles of parent and child have been reversed. Your daughter is now the mature adult and her mother is now the arrested development, temper tantrum throwing brat.


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## OutOfTheBlue

bandit.45 said:


> Get a makeover bro. Treat yourself to some new clothes and a nice haircut. Take care of yourself for once.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I'm doing exactly that, although haircuts don't make much difference to me these days ;-) I am taking better care of myself than I have in years. Shaved my mustache off, now clean shaven, take care of what hair I have, clean well trimmed nails, polished shoes, crisp creases on my shirts etc, etc. The mustache removal has taken years off me. I'm just a sex God now  

Seriously, I am feeling good about myself but I think that is in part to do with looking after myself better, which has got the attention of the ladies but also the fact that I have maintained my dignity throughout this sordid mess. My W's credibility has crashed, whilst mine has rocketed.

What puzzles me though, is that people still think it is strange for men to want to look after their kids in these situations. I have a number of mates, who would walk over hot coals for their kids. I often get a bemused looks from people when they realise I have the kids. Maybe, they think it strange that a mum could leave her kids? 

Life is good :smthumbup:


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

morituri said:


> It seems that the roles of parent and child have been reversed. Your daughter is now the mature adult and her mother is now the arrested development, temper tantrum throwing brat.


To be honest, I noticed the difference quite early. In fact, had it not been for my D's, I might have thought I was going mad. Fortunately, they were well up to speed from the beginning and found their mum's behaviour as bizarre as I did.

I am so pleased that my W's behaviour throughout our marriage appears to have had no effect on my D's. Thank God for small mercies.


----------



## warlock07

How do you think she met this man? This must have been going on for quite some time. Their affair was totally off your radar, wasn't it?


----------



## Why Not Be Happy?

Blue:
You and your children sound like you're doing great----all things considered. You are a family....and a strong family (just minus 1).
Listen to Bandits advise----treat yourself well and take care of yourself.
On a side note...I was lucky enough to travel to Scotland once. Truly some of the friendliest/nicest people I have ever met (although some were at bit tough to verbally understand). Beautiful country!
Good luck Blue!


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

warlock07 said:


> How do you think she met this man? This must have been going on for quite some time. Their affair was totally off your radar, wasn't it?


I think I posted earlier, maybe not, that she was working for this man. Looking back, I remember one night I came home from work and she could barely look me in the eyes. I suspected then, that something had happened. She is welcome to him as far as I am concerned, it won't last. Two cheats never last, especially when one of them has a serious problem with jealousy.


----------



## bandit.45

OutOfTheBlue said:


> I think I posted earlier, maybe not, that she was working for this man. Looking back, I remember one night I came home from work and she could barely look me in the eyes. I suspected then, that something had happened. She is welcome to him as far as I am concerned, it won't last. Two cheats never last, especially when one of them has a serious problem with jealousy.


You are correct. They have maybe a 2% chance of their relationship lasting more than a year. They will devour one another with their dysfunctional personalities. 

You on the other hand, will meet a woman who will make you completely forget why you ever married this harpy in the first place.


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Why Not Be Happy? said:


> Blue:
> You and your children sound like you're doing great----all things considered. You are a family....and a strong family (just minus 1).
> Listen to Bandits advise----treat yourself well and take care of yourself.
> On a side note...I was lucky enough to travel to Scotland once. Truly some of the friendliest/nicest people I have ever met (although some were at bit tough to verbally understand). Beautiful country!
> Good luck Blue!


Cheer mate. We are doing well. I had my first night out a couple of weeks ago and had an absolute blast. It raised my spirits more than any drug could. Luckily, I have a few work colleagues, male and female, who are also saying the same. They are telling me that I need to focus on myself now and by doing so, my kids will benefit even more. They are correct.

I'm glad you enjoyed your visit to Scotland. We are generally, a very friendly and welcoming people, with a great sense of humour. Yes, we can be hard to understand but most are well capable of reverting back to the English language  It is a beautiful country and the ruggedness can bring strong men to their knees.


----------



## bandit.45

OutOfTheBlue said:


> I'm glad you enjoyed your visit to Scotland. We are generally, a very friendly and welcoming people, with a great sense of humour. Yes, we can be hard to understand but most are well capable of reverting back to the English language  It is a beautiful country and the ruggedness can bring strong men to their knees.


My STBXW and I went to Scotland around five years ago.... the most beautiful country I've ever been too. We stayed for two weeks and had the time of our lives. 

I loved it all... the landscape, the history, the pubs, and, of course, I loved the people the most. I see now where we Americans get our down to earth directness and quirky sense of humor, given that so many of us are of Scots descent. I felt completely at home there... much more so than in England or Ireland. The Scots have a humor that is more lively and less dry than the English. 

The only thing I did not like about Scotland were the midges. Bloodsucking little vampires! Urghhhh. 

We visted Glencoe one day, and me being the ignorant Yank, I thought I would walk out into the glen, off the path, for a nice stroll. I got maybe twenty feet and sunk up to my knees in the waterlogged peat. My wife was helpless trying to get me unstuck. Luckily a gaggle of German tourists were on hand to pull me out. Talk about humiliating!


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

bandit.45 said:


> My STBXW and I went to Scotland around five years ago.... the most beautiful country I've ever been too. We stayed for two weeks and had the time of our lives.
> 
> I loved it all... the landscape, the history, the pubs, and, of course, I loved the people the most. I see now where we Americans get our down to earth directness and quirky sense of humor, given that so many of us are of Scots descent. I felt completely at home there... much more so than in England or Ireland. The Scots have a humor that is more lively and less dry than the English.
> 
> The only thing I did not like about Scotland were the midges. Bloodsucking little vampires! Urghhhh.
> 
> We visted Glencoe one day, and me being the ignorant Yank, I thought I would walk out into the glen, off the path, for a nice stroll. I got maybe twenty feet and sunk up to my knees in the waterlogged peat. My wife was helpless trying to get me unstuck. Luckily a gaggle of German tourists were on hand to pull me out. Talk about humiliating!


Ha ha Bandit, you won't be the last to get stuck in a peat bog. And as for the infamous midge, the scourge of the west of Scotland. I hate the little blighters as well. Many attempts have been made to repel them but the only thing that works, is growing the skin of a Rhino 

The one thing about us Scots is we are equally capable of laughing at ourselves, as well as others. Outside of my family, I take nothing serious in life - a day without a laugh, is a day wasted. :smthumbup:


----------



## Mamatomany

OutOfTheBlue said:


> LOL, I actually laughed out loud there. I pass a gym on my way to work every morning, does that count?
> 
> *I could maybe get to the Sean Connery type of Macho man but my Brad Pitt days are over.
> 
> Having said that, I spent fifteen years of my life on a chainsaw, felling trees and I developed, what I consider, slow grown muscle, which is different to the bloated body builders. I can put men half my age to shame and it wouldn't take much to get back in shape.*
> 
> Hmmm, maybe I should stop off at the gym on the way home :smthumbup:


You are sounding hot! Too bad you live about 7 time zones away!


----------



## morituri

OutOfTheBlue said:


> Outside of my family, I take nothing serious in life - *a day without a laugh, is a day wasted*. :smthumbup:


Truer words have never been spoken.


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Mamatomany said:


> You are sounding hot! Too bad you live about 7 time zones away!


That's the beauty of the Internet. Once you get past my false teeth, glass eye and wooden leg, I am very hot  Only joking.

If we weren't 7 times zones away, then a night out, would be on the cards.

Went out on Saturday night and had another blast. No women involved, just an absolutely brilliant night. People were dancing on the seats in the pub. I perched myself at the bar, which meant lots of interaction with people as they ordered their drinks. The most beautiful woman in the bar insisted on dancing with me as I was the only one who knew the words to Meat Loaf's songs. Her boyfriend was a bruiser though, so I played cool :smthumbup:

Life is good


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

morituri said:


> Truer words have never been spoken.


It should be taught in school.


----------



## bandit.45

Mamatomany said:


> You are sounding hot! Too bad you live about 7 time zones away!


Momma's horny again.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Mamatomany

bandit.45 said:


> Momma's horny again.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Almost always! LOL 
You can't deny he made himself sound GOOD! I could see a lumberjack's body and hear that accent, who couldn't fall for a Sean Connery accent!!


----------



## bandit.45

I bet you like Gerard Butler Momma.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Mamatomany

bandit.45 said:


> I bet you like Gerard Butler Momma.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I haven't seen him in a lot, but Dear Frankie He's nice to look at, I won't lie.


----------



## bandit.45

Gerard played the king in 300.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Mamatomany

bandit.45 said:


> Gerard played the king in 300.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I will have to catch that one too and PS I love you. 
Some movies H wouldn't go to and because of kids we didn't get out a lot in last few years. I do have netflix though


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Mamatomany said:


> Almost always! LOL
> You can't deny he made himself sound GOOD! I could see a lumberjack's body and hear that accent, who couldn't fall for a Sean Connery accent!!


I'm glad you are 7 time zones away because you would be in for a big disappointment


----------



## Mamatomany

OutOfTheBlue said:


> I'm glad you are 7 time zones away because you would be in for a big disappointment


I highly doubt it 

I was thinking today on my way home from work how long it's been since I have had a hug by a male that was over 40. A kiss. Intimacy... way too long.


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Mamatomany said:


> I highly doubt it
> 
> I was thinking today on my way home from work how long it's been since I have had a hug by a male that was over 40. A kiss. Intimacy... way too long.


Stop it woman, you'll have me buying an air ticket if you keep up with this  Will they let me take my chainsaw on the plane :nono:


----------



## Mamatomany

OutOfTheBlue said:


> Stop it woman, you'll have me buying an air ticket if you keep up with this  Will they let me take my chainsaw on the plane :nono:


Kinky!
No worries, I have 2 working chainsaws!!


----------



## warlock07

_cough __cough _ Ahem

What is going on here?


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

warlock07 said:


> _cough __cough _ Ahem
> 
> What is going on here?


Ha Ha, just a little fun. Momma's maybe got two chainsaws but she aint seen the size of mine.


----------



## Mamatomany

OutOfTheBlue said:


> Ha Ha, just a little fun. Momma's maybe got two chainsaws but she aint seen the size of mine.


Whoa!! I gotta passport and never been to Scotland 
I lived in England and never made it up there. 



How true, it was fun and made me smile
We have to have some fun sometimes things around TAMs and in our real world get awfully intense.


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Mamatomany said:


> How true, it was fun and made me smile
> We have to have some fun sometimes things around TAMs and in our real world get awfully intense.


Exactly, we deserve to have some fun - we are good people going through difficult times.

You lived in England and didn't visit Scotland? That's like visiting hell but giving heaven a miss :smthumbup:


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

robinson009 said:


> Hello Friend, I just read your post and I feel so sympathetic for you because I really understand the condition you are presently.,


Wow, thank you for that. You have changed my life.

ps, you forgot the most important part - my bank details :scratchhead:


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

OutOfTheBlue said:


> You lived in England and didn't visit Scotland? That's like visiting hell but giving heaven a miss :smthumbup:



Just to point out, that was a joke. I have many very good friends who are English.


----------



## bandit.45

Mamatomany said:


> Whoa!! I gotta passport and never been to Scotland
> I lived in England and never made it up there.
> 
> 
> 
> How true, it was fun and made me smile
> We have to have some fun sometimes things around TAMs and in our real world get awfully intense.


Scotland is a beautiful windswept verdant panorama of hills and glens, lochs and forests, ancient castles and modern cities, and then it has this crappy, dingy, backwards country called England to the South of it.


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

bandit.45 said:


> Scotland is a beautiful windswept verdant panorama of hills and glens, lochs and forests, ancient castles and modern cities, and then it has this crappy, dingy, backwards country called England to the South of it.


Wow, that's brutal Bandit. Unfortunately, I can't really argue against it.


----------



## bandit.45

F*ck the UK! Scotland should be free and independent.


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

bandit.45 said:


> F*ck the UK! Scotland should be free and independent.


Whilst I agree with the sentiments Bandit, Scotland has it's problems, like many countries. We have a problem with Catholics and Irish people, just like America had\has with black people. They are not welcome by many sections of our society. This is predominately a west coast issue but other areas are not immune.

This issue is not widely known throughout the world because our media is part of the problem. Protestant supremacy is rife in this country.

It truly saddens me to say this but it is the truth. 

Unfortunately, independence only offers more of the same, much, much more.

I am not Irish, I am Scottish. I am not Catholic, I am Protestant.


----------



## keko

Freedom!!!!!




J/k


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

keko said:


> Freedom!!!!!
> 
> J/k


Freedom from what? Don't sit 3k miles away from here without giving reasons!!!


----------



## keko

OutOfTheBlue said:


> Freedom from what? Don't sit 3k miles away from here without giving reasons!!!


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

keko said:


>


You give me Holywood!!! The actor is laughable, the theme, even more so. Deary me. Please research your Scottish ancestry, don't watch Holywood movies.


----------



## keko

Oh Im not Scottish, just wanted to add a little humor


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

keko said:


> Oh Im not Scottish, just wanted to add a little humor


Oh, In that case, I'm really, really sorry for being so critical. Your humour is appreciated.

Feel bad now. I'm just passionate about my country.


----------



## keko

OutOfTheBlue said:


> Oh, In that case, I'm really, really sorry for being so critical. Your humour is appreciated.
> 
> Feel bad now. I'm just passionate about my country.


No apology needed.

BTW just like bandit said it, my hats off to you for handling this situation like this.


----------



## Mamatomany

OutOfTheBlue said:


> Just to point out, that was a joke. I have many very good friends who are English.



LOL Too funny. 

Yeah, I had every intention to go! My mum's family has it roots there and my dad's from England. We backpacked into Ireland and planned Scotland and stuff came up... We lived there back near Cambridge in the early 90s. Loved Ireland, it felt like home. We planned on going to Scotland but something came up and then I didn't get another opportunity while we lived in England. It's truly been a destination when I go back that direction. I truly dislike the average 'beer' they have here in the US. I like the real stuff  and LOVE Scotch which I hear may scare men, is that true?


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

keko said:


> BTW just like bandit said it, my hats off to you for handling this situation like this.


Thanks, I appreciate that. It just pains me that there are so many of us in this situation. When I read some of the posts on here, I consider myself lucky, some have it much worse than me. I couldn't imagine being a thousand miles away from my kids, it would break my heart.


----------



## Almostrecovered

what's under those kilts anyways?


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Almostrecovered said:


> what's under those kilts anyways?


It's a secret. Best left to the imagination


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Mamatomany said:


> LOL Too funny.
> LOVE Scotch which I hear may scare men, is that true?


Haven't heard that one but according to the Discovery channel, Scotland is the world's UFO sighting, hotspot - see where I am going with this? We make Whisky, we see UFO's. :smthumbup:


----------



## bandit.45

I wasn't a big fan of the Braveheart movie. What irked me is that at the Battle of Stirling there was no bridge. I mean, the reason the Scots won that battle was because they trapped the English on the bridge! You would have thought they could have spent a hundred grand or so to build a mockup! 

Anyway, Rob Roy was a better movie.

I bought a kilt in Edinburgh! I chose the McDuff tartan from my dad's mom's family. My mom was Scots on both sides (Colquhoun and McNab) but I don't like her family! LOL! I've only worn it once when my wife and were... um... roleplaying.


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

bandit.45 said:


> I've only worn it once when my wife and were... um... roleplaying.


Oh, I got a real laugh out loud moment there - brilliant. However, the vision I got is not so good  Perhaps you could enlighten Almostrecovered 

ps agree on the Rob Roy movie - much better. Unfortunately, Hollywood churn out so many movies that are so factually inaccurate, it's laughable. Such a shame.


----------



## warlock07

bandit.45 said:


> I wasn't a big fan of the Braveheart movie. What irked me is that at the Battle of Stirling there was no bridge. I mean, the reason the Scots won that battle was because they trapped the English on the bridge! You would have thought they could have spent a hundred grand or so to build a mockup!
> 
> Anyway, Rob Roy was a better movie.
> 
> I bought a kilt in Edinburgh! I chose the McDuff tartan from my dad's mom's family. My mom was Scots on both sides (Colquhoun and McNab) but I don't like her family! LOL! I've only worn it once when my wife and were... um... roleplaying.


Pics..:rofl:


On a more serious note, what a waste of memories..


----------



## bandit.45

Yeah no kidding. I also discovered after I wore it that I was allergic to wool. But let's not go there.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Mamatomany

OutOfTheBlue said:


> Haven't heard that one but according to the Discovery channel, Scotland is the world's UFO sighting, hotspot - see where I am going with this? We make Whisky, we see UFO's. :smthumbup:



Yes! I am out to taste all the scotch and pick my favorite only after I have tried them all! Before that I was a Crown Royal drinker. lol Oh paranormal... UFOs I knew when I lived in the UK there were some sightings off off the Bentwaters area. 



Oh btw I have a great imagination!!


----------



## Mamatomany

bandit.45 said:


> I wasn't a big fan of the Braveheart movie. What irked me is that at the Battle of Stirling there was no bridge. I mean, the reason the Scots won that battle was because they trapped the English on the bridge! You would have thought they could have spent a hundred grand or so to build a mockup!
> 
> Anyway, Rob Roy was a better movie.
> 
> I bought a kilt in Edinburgh! I chose the McDuff tartan from my dad's mom's family. My mom was Scots on both sides (Colquhoun and McNab) but I don't like her family! LOL! I've only worn it once when my wife and were... um... roleplaying.


Here I thought Rob Roy was just a drink! LOL 
Oh I wanna hear about the allergy 
I have some Scottish here too. I guess really my entire roots so far from the "UK" I can go back as far as 1500s.


----------



## bandit.45

Let's just say part of me swelled up, but not in a good or useful way.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Mamatomany

bandit.45 said:


> Let's just say part of me swelled up, but not in a good or useful way.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Man that must have sucked ****s! 
Sorry couldn't resist. I do work w/ men and stuff like that just comes out. So are you like seriously allergic to wool? or just sensitive? Maybe it was the tartan itself you were allergic too(j/k). 
I am guessing there was wool to skin contact for that to happen. ouch. I guess you pushed down the benadryl!


----------



## bandit.45

Mamatomany said:


> Man that must have sucked ****s!
> Sorry couldn't resist. I do work w/ men and stuff like that just comes out. So are you like seriously allergic to wool? or just sensitive? Maybe it was the tartan itself you were allergic too(j/k).
> I am guessing there was wool to skin contact for that to happen. ouch. I guess you pushed down the benadryl!


Yeah, wife and I were getting frisky and she asked me to wear it. I went commando underneath and things got very creative sex wise. 

Then in the middle of the night when we were asleep I woke up itching and I had a rash all over my groin and ass. It went away after a day or so but it hurt like hell. I haven't worn the cursed thing since. 

Maybe I pissed off some ancestral spirits or something by wearing the wrong tartan. What do you think Out Of The Blue?


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

bandit.45 said:


> Maybe I pissed off some ancestral spirits or something by wearing the wrong tartan. What do you think Out Of The Blue?


Bandit, did you not know about the old clan curse? The wearer of the tartan, who role plays, shall be visited by the spirits. I don't need to explain the punishment 

Someone send me a link today, regarding men's hair removal cream. Look at the first review. I immediately thought of you :smthumbup:

Amazon Review


----------



## [email protected]

bandit.45 said:


> Yeah no kidding. I also discovered after I wore it that I was allergic to wool. But let's not go there.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


LMFAO!! I just laughed out loud, properly. I'm in bed & think I woke up the STBXH in the other room! (bonus) 
My little girl is like her Mummy, could happily sleep through an earthquake !!

I have images Bandit... All involve chaffing
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## bandit.45

Yeah, yuk it up [email protected] Yuk it up...
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Mamatomany

Man, the images I have of some of the men on here!!! I am hoping several of them are starring in my dreams tonight.


----------



## bandit.45

If I'm in your dream I'll wear my kilt for you tonight Momma. Might have to wear some boxers underneath though.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Happy birthday to me, Happy birthday to me, Happy birthday dear Graham, Happy birthday to me.

48 Years young today.

:smthumbup:


----------



## bandit.45

Happy Birthday brother!


----------



## warlock07

:birthday:Happy birthday


----------



## keko

happy birthday!!!


----------



## Traggy

happy bday


----------



## bandit.45

OutOfTheBlue said:


> Bandit, did you not know about the old clan curse? The wearer of the tartan, who role plays, shall be visited by the spirits. I don't need to explain the punishment
> 
> Someone send me a link today, regarding men's hair removal cream. Look at the first review. I immediately thought of you :smthumbup:
> 
> Amazon Review


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

bandit.45 said:


>



OOOOOOhhhhhh wow, you Scotsmen are well equipped


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Thanks for the birthday wishes. I went out on Saturday night again. It was fun  I had an opportunity with a woman but gave it a miss as she was young enough to be my daughter. I have my morals and that's not what I am looking for.

My workmates (male and female) keep asking me if I'm on the pull. I answer no and sometimes get strange looks. They seem to think that being single means you are automatically looking for a woman.

I tried to figure out why I wasn't going out looking for another woman. 

Could it be that I am not over my wife yet? The answer is no; she will play no part in my future and I am happy with this.

Could it be that I don't trust women any more. The answer is no; I have been treated badly by two women in my life. It doesn't mean that all women are bad, it just means I need to smarten up when choosing one.

I eventually came to the answer and it is twofold.

1) I am completely comfortable on my own. In fact, I am enjoying my new found freedom. I am happy to be doing things for myself for once and not for a woman, who didn't appreciate me. I don't need validation from a female as to whether I am a good guy. I know I am. The support from my kids prove that to me.

2) This one was an eye opener and it took me quite a while to realise. As a young man, I had my fair share of quick and short relationships. During these young years, the physical side was the target. The aim was to bed the best looking girl you possibly could. After this phase, I only had two serious relationships but both of these ended up becoming physical fairly quickly.

I realised what I have been missing - Romance, yes, romance, true romance. The excitement, the anticipation, the all night talks, the candle lit dinners, the hugs, the emotional connection. No, I am not on the pull. My days of being on the pull are in the past. If I never find this romance, then I am destined to be on my own. That does not fill me with fear. I will make it either way.

Life is good, life is very good.


----------



## Traggy

I am a few miles behind you on this path, I can not wait to get caught up to you.

I am getting there.

Congrats on the new found insight


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Traggy said:


> I am a few miles behind you on this path, I can not wait to get caught up to you.
> 
> I am getting there.
> 
> Congrats on the new found insight


It depends on your starting point mate. In hindsight, I always knew my wife had problems. She has probably done what I should have done. I tried to keep my family together but that may have been a mistake.

My kids seem to be responding very positively, so, something must be right. I am also responding positively, I am getting back to the person I used to be and I am enjoying that.

Life is good, life is very good.


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

My W send my son a txt yesterday asking "How are you getting on with me not being there?" Now what sort of a question is that to ask a 12 year old? How can he answer that? What does she want the answer to be? Stupid woman.

After nearly six months, she asks this.


----------



## Mike11

OutofTheBlue 

Just tell him not to respond to her, is he in regular contact with her ? 

I think the doubts are starting to eat at her and she is seeking validation from him, don't let him answer that, or answer with something unrelated, she is looking for emotional support for what she has done and obviously the bad decision that she has made

Stay strong


----------



## Conrad

OutOfTheBlue said:


> My W send my son a txt yesterday asking "How are you getting on with me not being there?" Now what sort of a question is that to ask a 12 year old? How can he answer that? What does she want the answer to be? Stupid woman.
> 
> After nearly six months, she asks this.


And you think this isn't related to the post immediately before it?


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Conrad said:


> And you think this isn't related to the post immediately before it?


I know, I know. I shouldn't be surprised. Every few weeks she throws a curve ball


----------



## Conrad

OutOfTheBlue said:


> I know, I know. I shouldn't be surprised. Every few weeks she throws a curve ball


The better you do, the worse she'll get.

Wear it as a badge of honor.


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Mike11 said:


> OutofTheBlue
> 
> Just tell him not to respond to her, is he in regular contact with her ?
> 
> I think the doubts are starting to eat at her and she is seeking validation from him, don't let him answer that, or answer with something unrelated, she is looking for emotional support for what she has done and obviously the bad decision that she has made
> 
> Stay strong


Very insightful Mike. You're the third person to suggest something along those lines. Your advice has been taken on board. My son hasn't answered txt and I can see that he is feeling awkward. Just need to clear my head and figure out the best way forward for my son.


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Conrad said:


> The better you do, the worse she'll get.
> 
> Wear it as a badge of honor.


I know what you are saying but I fear the damage she can cause to my son on her way down.

To be honest, I can't enjoy her demise. I actually pity her. I feel sorry for her. I want her to move forward with her life and sort out her issues.

But, rest assured though, she will not be part of my life again.


----------



## Conrad

OutOfTheBlue said:


> I know what you are saying but I fear the damage she can cause to my son on her way down.
> 
> To be honest, I can't enjoy her demise. I actually pity her. I feel sorry for her. I want her to move forward with her life and sort out her issues.
> 
> But, rest assured though, she will not be part of my life again.


I wish I had words to console you.

But, users use people. They usually don't discriminate in those choices. Only when they hit rock bottom is there potential for re-evaluation and growth.


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Conrad said:


> Only when they hit rock bottom is there potential for re-evaluation and growth.


Powerful words Conrad and therein lies the absolute truth. This stands true for all who have chosen a destructive path in whatever area and for whatever reason.

Let's hope they emerge in better shape than they entered.


----------



## Chaparral

OutOfTheBlue said:


> My W send my son a txt yesterday asking "How are you getting on with me not being there?" Now what sort of a question is that to ask a 12 year old? How can he answer that? What does she want the answer to be? Stupid woman.
> 
> After nearly six months, she asks this.


It amazes me how often this comes up here and the betrayed spouse (son) lies and says something like "We're doing fine".

His answer should be " How the hell do you think we're doing"?

Its really simple, honesty is the best policy. 

Or if its true ..............".Hey we couldn't be better, gotta run."

Don't take it easy on her, no one wins.


----------



## bandit.45

OOB is an authentic man. He respects his children and they in turn honor him. 

His wife does not have an authentic bone in her body. Like all people who lack authenticity, she must resort to cheap shots and underhanded actions to validate herself now that she no longer has a husband and family to authenticate and validate her existence. 

It is horribly tragic. She is not redeemable. Forgive me for waxing religious, but the only one who can pull her back from the abyss is the Man Himself. But she has to let go of the bottle and the barstool and reach out her hand. Will she?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Conrad

bandit.45 said:


> OOB is an authentic man. He respects his children and they in turn honor him.
> 
> His wife does not have an authentic bone in her body. Like all people who lack authenticity, she must resort to cheap shots and underhanded actions to validate herself now that she no longer has a husband and family to authenticate and validate her existence.
> 
> It is horribly tragic. She is not redeemable. Forgive me for waxing religious, but the only one who can pull her back from the abyss is the Man Himself. But she has to let go of the bottle and the barstool and reach out her hand. Will she?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


bandit,

Allow me:

*The hell with the b*tch!*


----------



## bandit.45

Conrad said:


> bandit,
> 
> Allow me:
> 
> *The hell with the b*tch!*


You have learned well Grashoppa.....


----------



## Conrad

Hope you feel better soon.


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

chapparal said:


> It amazes me how often this comes up here and the betrayed spouse (son) lies and says something like "We're doing fine".
> 
> His answer should be " How the hell do you think we're doing"?
> 
> Its really simple, honesty is the best policy.
> 
> Or if its true ..............".Hey we couldn't be better, gotta run."
> 
> Don't take it easy on her, no one wins.


All I can say on this subject, is that my kids have transformed before my eyes, especially my son. He has gone from being a spoilt, lazy boy, to a responsible, soon to be teenager. He keeps his room tidy, brings his laundry down for washing, does his homework days ahead of time and generally tries to do his best. Tonight, he prepared his own packed lunch for a day out with school tomorrow. I did not ask him to do this.

After the initial turmoil, I set some ground rules, which weren't drastic but were not what he was used to and he didn't like it. I therefore took the approach of praising the positive things he did but not scold him for the negatives. I gave him responsibility and left it to him to decide how he would deal with this. He has responded magnificently. he is not the lad he was six months ago. 

He could quite easily say to his mum, I am doing much better now than I was when you were here but I don't want him to do that. Since he is unaware of the real background of his mum's behaviour, I need to treat him as though nothing but a separation has taken place. I have asked him to respect his mum when she txt's by replying to her. I suggested to him that he replied to the last txt by just saying "Hi mum, I'm fine", which he did.

As far as I'm concerned, my S does not need to be involved in the re-education of my W. My D's are well capable of putting her in her place


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

bandit.45 said:


> OOB is an authentic man. He respects his children and they in turn honor him.
> 
> His wife does not have an authentic bone in her body. Like all people who lack authenticity, she must resort to cheap shots and underhanded actions to validate herself now that she no longer has a husband and family to authenticate and validate her existence.
> 
> It is horribly tragic. She is not redeemable. Forgive me for waxing religious, but the only one who can pull her back from the abyss is the Man Himself. But she has to let go of the bottle and the barstool and reach out her hand. Will she?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Unfortunately, I am not a religious man but fortunately, I admire those who are. However, I do know right from wrong and I am a man with very strong beliefs on morality. I may not answer to God but I have to answer to myself. In many respects, that is harder, as I do not forgive myself easily.

I think my W has a way to go on her journey before the light finally shines through. I hope that day will come, not for me but for her and more importantly, for her kids.

Thanks for your support Bandit.


----------



## bandit.45

OutOfTheBlue said:


> Unfortunately, I am not a religious man but fortunately, I admire those who are. However, I do know right from wrong and I am a man with very strong beliefs on morality. I may not answer to God but I have to answer to myself. In many respects, that is harder, as I do not forgive myself easily.
> 
> I think my W has a way to go on her journey before the light finally shines through. I hope that day will come, not for me but for her and more importantly, for her kids.
> 
> Thanks for your support Bandit.


I'm not that religious either, although I do believe in a higher power.

I do however believe in _grace_, wherever it may come from, and I hope one day your wife settles down enough to find it, somewhere, and gain some peace with herself. She is useless as a mother and as a person until then.


----------



## morituri

OOB,

Romance is not going to drop on your lap like in the movies. If you truly want it, you are going to have to go find it. Granted that right now you are recovering from the end of your marriage and are in no shape to jump into another committed relationship (rebound) but eventually you will have to go out and meet women. When you do, keep in mind the following.



> *“How to Judge a Person’s Character”* by Marius Panzarella.
> 
> The biggest mistake a person can make is to get into a relationship (be it business, personal, or romantic) with the wrong person. You can literally ruin your own life.
> 
> So how can you tell if a person is trouble or not? Here are some tips on how to judge a person’s character before getting involved with them.
> 
> *1) Look at who their friends are*
> 
> The first thing you should do is to look at who their friends are. As I have mentioned in the past, you can judge a person’s character by looking at their choice of friends.
> 
> Don’t believe me? Do the “Rule of 5”* test and you’ll see how true this is!
> 
> *You can judge a person’s character 99% of the time by looking at the five closest people they associate themselves
> with.
> 
> *2) Look at their past actions*
> 
> Call me cynical, but I find that 90% of the time, you can judge a person by looking at their past history. As I always say, “once a liar, always a liar.” A person who has gone through 17 ex-girlfriends or boyfriends is NOT going to think that YOU are “the one” for long.
> 
> *3) Look at their actions, not their words*
> 
> While you are judging their actions, make sure you don’t fall prey to the victim stories that people with character problems always invent for themselves. Guys, don’t just believe ALL three of her ex-husband were abusive jerks. Ladies, don’t believe he’s “trying” to stop his bad habits.
> 
> As I always say, actions don’t lie, words do!
> 
> *4) Look at how they treat other people*
> 
> People with bad character tend to be self-centered. They may put you at first (more like pretend to put you at first) when they see a benefit, but as soon as they benefit is gone, they will start treating you like dirt. So rather than judging a person based on how they treat you while they still have something they want from you, judge them based on how they treat people that are not so useful to them.
> 
> *5) Look for lies or exaggerations*
> 
> Look for lies or exaggerations. See if their stories match up. Use your head and turn that B.S. detector on!
> 
> *6) Look for addictions*
> 
> Look for addictions to alcohol, drugs, gambling, and prostitution. Many people with character problems have one kind of dependency or another.
> 
> *7) Look at their attitude towards life*
> 
> Look at how the person looks at the world. See if they like blaming the world instead of taking responsibility for their own actions. See if they are so negative that they resent everything and everyone around them. (Stay AWAY if that’s the case!)
> 
> *8) Look at their beliefs and whether their actions are congruent with their beliefs.*
> 
> Finally, look at a person’s beliefs and see if they belong to a train wreck. But don’t just look at their beliefs. Follow the “actions, not words” rule and see if their actions are CONGRUENT with their beliefs. That’s where a lot of people fail!


----------



## Why Not Be Happy?

Blue and Bandit: You guys are great! Stay strong!


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

morituri said:


> OOB,
> 
> Romance is not going to drop on your lap like in the movies. If you truly want it, you are going to have to go find it. Granted that right now you are recovering from the end of your marriage and are in no shape to jump into another committed relationship (rebound) but eventually you will have to go out and meet women. When you do, keep in mind the following.


How I am going to approach this is to mix with lots of women. Although, I am only interested in socialising at this point, I am discretely making sure that people at work know I am single. There are about 200 women at my work.

I'm going out with three women from work tomorrow night. They decided to join me on a night out as they know I have had a number of great nights out lately and they are wondering why. All of these women are spoken for but it will still be good for me to sharpen my socialising skills. 

Of course it goes without saying, that these women are completely out of bounds as far as I am concerned. I would not entertain anything other than harmless fun.


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Why Not Be Happy? said:


> Blue and Bandit: You guys are great! Stay strong!


We're all great


----------



## Mamatomany

Conrad said:


> bandit,
> 
> Allow me:
> 
> *The hell with the b*tch!*


I know it hurts but the guys are right! You are such catch... it's easy to see in your posts. Move on! I still regret you aren't closer!!!


----------



## bandit.45

Mama would treat you right.


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Mamatomany said:


> I know it hurts but the guys are right! You are such catch... it's easy to see in your posts. Move on! I still regret you aren't closer!!!


Thank you Mama. It is such a shame that most of us are so far away from each other. I could only imagine some fun times if it wasn't the case :smthumbup:


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

bandit.45 said:


> Mama would treat you right.


Oh, I'm sure she would 

I'm just about caught up on your own threads. You have been through some tough times my friend.


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Took my kids out for a meal last night. It is my youngest D's 19th birthday today. It was great to see us all so relaxed together and having fun.

As I type this, my W has just popped a birthday card through the door. I hardly recognised her. She has obviously put a bit of effort in. Good for her but she would be better investing time and money in some IC instead of clothes and cosmetics.

Anyway, on to a more serious matter, what am I going to wear tonight? Leather trousers - check, gold medallion - check, fake chest hair - check.......... Only kidding lol


----------



## bandit.45

We all have. The walking wounded are we. I just hope I can get through this with as much style as you have shown.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

bandit.45 said:


> We all have. The walking wounded are we. I just hope I can get through this with as much style as you have shown.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Bandit, I consider myself fortunate. I am a confident person with enough self belief to get through this. I am fortunate that I can dismiss most things that are not life threatening and focus on the positives. Having said that, the journey over the last six months has not been easy but I am a long way down the road from the original car crash. The good thing is, I am no longer looking back at it, I am looking at the bright lights I see ahead.

You have strengths and weaknesses, just like the rest of us. Focus on your strengths. Like most of us on here, you have strong beliefs, with good morals and you come across as a genuine, wear your heart on your sleeve type of guy. Don't just read these words, don't just say them, digest them and believe them. Wear them as a badge. Walk with your head held high. You have attributes that money can't buy, that drugs can't substitute and that no-one can take. Use these attributes, don't accept second best, you deserve better.


----------



## Why Not Be Happy?

Bandit and Blue:
You guys are the best!


----------



## bandit.45

Thanks Blue. That means a lot. Because I do not feel that way right now. The exact opposite actually.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## proudwidaddy

Bandit you are one of the most genuine men I've encountered on this website; I can tell that you wear your heart on your sleeve (unlike me I wear my hear on both sleeve's, both pant legs, hehe). What blue says is true....we need to define ourselves not by other people and their beliefs of us, but by what we think of ourselves. 

I'll give you two words of wisdom that have been told to me at various times in my life:

1) Character is how you act when no one is around to notice (brother I know you have character)
2) If everything you did was broadcasted on the front page of a newspaper, and you can still hold your head high....you are doing something right.

The future does have something good in store for all of us, sometimes we just have to go through a bumpy road to get there. Keep your head up!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## bandit.45

Good stuff Proud. Thanks.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## cabbage65

this place freaking rules


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

I was going to post how good my night out was on Saturday but then I thought about how many on here weren't having quite as good a time as I am.

Then I changed my mind and decided I would as we all need a little encouragement. For some reason my mind wandered into thinking about not tempting fate. Why, I don't know but I thought that maybe I should just keep my positive life changes a little more low key.

Half an hour ago, I received a phone call saying my brother was in hospital having suffered a mild heart attack. I thought about the strange feeling I had earlier. I am sure that it was pure coincidence but when you get knock after knock after knock, you begin to expect them.

Well I'm not going to fall into the same old negative trap that I would have. Having lost my Dad 18 months ago, my wife leaving 6 months ago, I am certain that I am not going to lose my brother now. Nope, I am not crossing bridges before I come to them, I am refusing to take that path. See you soon Bro.


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

And just as I finish that, I burst into tears. Bloody hell


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Ok again


----------



## bandit.45

Good luck Blue. I hope your brother makes a full recovery.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

bandit.45 said:


> Good luck Blue. I hope your brother makes a full recovery.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I'm sure he will Bandit - Thanks. How did I know you would post? Here's a man who's facing his own demons but still has empathy for others. Your a good man Bandit.


----------



## bandit.45

I'm a hot man. Its almost 100 F here in Arizona. What's the weather like in bonnie Scotland right now?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

bandit.45 said:


> I'm a hot man. Its almost 100 F here in Arizona. What's the weather like in bonnie Scotland right now?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


It's almost tropical. 8 degrees C, 46 degrees F. We had a nice sharp frost on Sunday morning. There will be many gardeners crying. Top temp on Saturday was 5 degrees C, 41 degrees F. :smthumbup:


----------



## jpr

I am sorry to hear about your brother, Blue. I understand how it is easy to slip into a negative attitude...waiting for other shoe to drop.

You seem to have a handle on it right now, and you seem to be trying your best to stay positive.

I am sending positive thoughts your way too. ...keep us posted.


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

jpr said:


> I am sorry to hear about your brother, Blue. I understand how it is easy to slip into a negative attitude...waiting for other shoe to drop.
> 
> You seem to have a handle on it right now, and you seem to be trying your best to stay positive.
> 
> I am sending positive thoughts your way too. ...keep us posted.


Thanks buddy, your words are appreciated. I am busy trying to convince my Mum that everything will be ok, whilst trying to deal with my own worries.


----------



## bandit.45

Hope your ex doesn't stick her nose in it.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## keko

Hope your brother recovers Blue.


----------



## bandit.45

OutOfTheBlue said:


> It's almost tropical. 8 degrees C, 46 degrees F. We had a nice sharp frost on Sunday morning. There will be many gardeners crying. Top temp on Saturday was 5 degrees C, 41 degrees F. :smthumbup:


Mmmmm. Wish I was there.

There is a particularly nice pub in Crieff caled the Meadows that I visited. I ended up talking to an old gentleman named Peter there, and we sat for at least four hours and had the most interesting, intense conversation I have ever had with a stranger. He teased me because I don't drink, so I repaid him by beating him soundly at pool. 

By closing time we felt like old friends. 

Scottish pubs are the best, especially on a cold night.


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

bandit.45 said:


> Hope your ex doesn't stick her nose in it.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Bandit, I passed on the news to her tonight because my brother has a soft spot for her. He knew she was a troubled woman and felt sorry for her. He doesn't know the full details of our separation but he does know how much help she gave to my mum and dad, when my dad was dying. I will leave it as that.

The main reason I told her, was that at the weekend, I found out my brother in law is dying from cancer. He doesn't have long. I was disappointed that I wasn't informed of this. I will not stoop to this level.

Rest assured, I do not need her to get through this and this will not be an opening for her to get back into my life. I have other people I can turn to for support and TAM is part of that.


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

keko said:


> Hope your brother recovers Blue.


Thanks buddy


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

bandit.45 said:


> Mmmmm. Wish I was there.
> 
> There is a particularly nice pub in Crieff caled the Meadows that I visited. I ended up talking to an old gentleman named Peter there, and we sat for at least four hours and had the most interesting, intense conversation I have ever had with a stranger. He teased me because I don't drink, so I repaid him by beating him soundly at pool.
> 
> By closing time we felt like old friends.
> 
> Scottish pubs are the best, especially on a cold night.


You are absolutely spot on Bandit. Scottish pubs are great, especially when it's mid winter and there's a log fire. You're not a stranger for long in a Scottish pub and there are many tales just waiting to be told by the old timers.

It should be on everyone's "to do before I die" list.


----------



## Chaparral

I do like this. My father has traced part of our ancestry to Scotland. Have you ever heard of Loudoun castle?

Good luck and prayers for your brother and your whole family.

Chap


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

chapparal said:


> I do like this. My father has traced part of our ancestry to Scotland. Have you ever heard of Loudoun castle?
> 
> Good luck and prayers for your brother and your whole family.
> 
> Chap


Yes I have and it is truly beautiful. Unfortunately, it has succumbed to theme park status to ensure it's existence. Very sad. What is your father's link?

Thanks for your words of support.


----------



## bandit.45

OutOfTheBlue said:


> Bandit, I passed on the news to her tonight because my brother has a soft spot for her. He knew she was a troubled woman and felt sorry for her. He doesn't know the full details of our separation but he does know how much help she gave to my mum and dad, when my dad was dying. I will leave it as that.
> 
> The main reason I told her, was that at the weekend, I found out my brother in law is dying from cancer. He doesn't have long. I was disappointed that I wasn't informed of this. I will not stoop to this level.
> 
> Rest assured, I do not need her to get through this and this will not be an opening for her to get back into my life. I have other people I can turn to for support and TAM is part of that.


Forgive me if I was not paying attention to the thread, but is she living with the OM now?


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

bandit.45 said:


> Forgive me if I was not paying attention to the thread, but is she living with the OM now?


No, she still has her own flat. To be honest, I couldn't care less


----------



## morituri

If by accident you do get lucky, do kiss and tell. 

That goes for you to bandit.45


----------



## bandit.45

morituri said:


> If by accident you do get lucky, do kiss and tell.
> 
> That goes for you to bandit.45


Not me brother. Bandit.45 is off the market.... for a long, long time.


----------



## morituri

Life has a habit of throwing us curved balls and a "long, long time" may not be as long as you might think bandit.45


----------



## bandit.45

morituri said:


> Life has a habit of throwing us curved balls and a "long, long time" may not be as long as you might think bandit.45


No problem. I'm a good pinch hitter. I'm the Lenny Harris of life batting.


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

My brother is still in hospital - hooked up to the monitoring machines. He is supposed to go to Edinburgh for furthers tests. I am sure he will be ok but you just can't help worrying.

I am trying so hard to not let this drag me down. I realised that it is these times when you really miss having someone to lean on, someone who can share the burden, someone who can give you a little support. I am so glad I have good friends at work and of course TAM.

When my brother gets the all clear, I will tell you about my latest nights out


----------



## bandit.45

OutOfTheBlue said:


> My brother is still in hospital - hooked up to the monitoring machines. He is supposed to go to Edinburgh for furthers tests. I am sure he will be ok but you just can't help worrying.
> 
> I am trying so hard to not let this drag me down. I realised that it is these times when you really miss having someone to lean on, someone who can share the burden, someone who can give you a little support. I am so glad I have good friends at work and of course TAM.
> 
> When my brother gets the all clear, I will tell you about my latest nights out


I know when I had my angioplasty a few weeks back I was scared... really scared, and I didn't have anyone there for me except a couple of old friends of mine who came to see me before they wheeled me in. You need to make your brother know you are there for him and that you care. He's lucky he has you.


----------



## Mamatomany

bandit.45 said:


> I know when I had my angioplasty a few weeks back I was scared... really scared, and I didn't have anyone there for me except a couple of old friends of mine who came to see me before they wheeled me in. You need to make your brother know you are there for him and that you care. He's lucky he has you.


Just having someone there is nice. Plus afterwards. My surgery wasn't nearly as serious but it was nice to know someone was checking in on me in February... and knew to leave (I react badly to anesthesia - mood killer).


----------



## bandit.45

Mamatomany said:


> Just having someone there is nice. Plus afterwards. My surgery wasn't nearly as serious but it was nice to know someone was checking in on me in February... and knew to leave (I react badly to anesthesia - mood killer).


Gawrsh....

Mama, ThatGirl.... so many of us have come down with maladies and have had to have surgeries over the past few months. It makes you realise what a toll all this adultery business takes on a person's health. 

We all need to keep supporting each other to get out and exercise and eat right.


----------



## Mamatomany

My son just had organic and local food delivered to our door (local being w/in the state of Texas). It won't feed our house for long but it's pretty cool!


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Well, the day has arrived. I must admit, it is a little earlier than I thought it would be.

It started with the "I am sorry for what I have done to you" txt, through the "Finally realised, the mistake I made" and on to the "You were my rock and I have lost you"

Yes, the fog has finally lifted with my W. The problem for her though, is I have moved on. I have no interest in reconciliation. I have pointed this out to her but the txt's keep coming.

Silly woman.


----------



## bandit.45

OutOfTheBlue said:


> Well, the day has arrived. I must admit, it is a little earlier than I thought it would be.
> 
> It started with the "I am sorry for what I have done to you" txt, through the "Finally realised, the mistake I made" and on to the "You were my rock and I have lost you"
> 
> Yes, the fog has finally lifted with my W. The problem for her though, is I have moved on. I have no interest in reconciliation. I have pointed this out to her but the txt's keep coming.
> 
> Silly woman.


What does it feel like? I haven't gotten that message from my STBXW yet.

Is it empowering, satisfying, saddening? I want to be prepared when or if I get such a message.


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

bandit.45 said:


> What does it feel like? I haven't gotten that message from my STBXW yet.
> 
> Is it empowering, satisfying, saddening? I want to be prepared when or if I get such a message.


It was saddening. I did not want to hear it. I would have preferred to hear that she was moving on and happy. I got no satisfaction from it at all.

Your emotions will not be measured by the message but by where you are personally.

I am beyond reconciliation.


----------



## morituri

It tastes bittersweet.


----------



## bandit.45

Did she tell you this in person, over the phone, e-mail... how?


----------



## Mamatomany

OutOfTheBlue said:


> Well, the day has arrived. I must admit, it is a little earlier than I thought it would be.
> 
> It started with the "I am sorry for what I have done to you" txt, through the "Finally realised, the mistake I made" and on to the "You were my rock and I have lost you"
> 
> Yes, the fog has finally lifted with my W. The problem for her though, is I have moved on. I have no interest in reconciliation. I have pointed this out to her but the txt's keep coming.
> 
> Silly woman.


She knows she screwed up and lost her one fine Scotsman! 
I would never take mine back either. I am at the F U stage and I am moving on  not that he'd ever want to come back. 
I was looking over our texts, fb chats, and emails and realized that he was kinda nice in the beginning but as the 180 hit he and I detached. I am okay w/ that, I know that there are men out there that will like me, appreciate me, and sex me up!! Yep! I won't have to beg for it!! 


I am so glad you are where you are and I hope you can feel good about it too.


----------



## Mike11

OutOfTheBlue said:


> Well, the day has arrived. I must admit, it is a little earlier than I thought it would be.
> 
> It started with the "I am sorry for what I have done to you" txt, through the "Finally realised, the mistake I made" and on to the "You were my rock and I have lost you"
> 
> Yes, the fog has finally lifted with my W. The problem for her though, is I have moved on. I have no interest in reconciliation. I have pointed this out to her but the txt's keep coming.
> 
> Silly woman.



Now why am I not surprised from this, Classic, OutOfTheBlue this is way early but with all honesty very expected, the fact that you were able to disconnect from her emotionally and not feed her emotional needs to any side(by showing complete indifference), coupled with the last message to your son I believe this is causing her to seriously doubt her own motives and what she has done and come to some bitter realizations there, too bad that you already moved on, this is already the 3rd case that I know of, expect some REAL "coronation street" drama coming your way


----------



## morituri

bandit.45 said:


> Did she tell you this in person, over the phone, e-mail... how?


In person, before her mental breakdown. In the cafe store as I was leaving and she tried to give me her new phone number. I told her no because I already was involved with another woman (present girlfriend). The devastatingly painful expression on her face was unmistakeable. It brought me no joy at all, only sadness.


----------



## canguy66

OutOfTheBlue said:


> Well, the day has arrived. I must admit, it is a little earlier than I thought it would be.
> 
> It started with the "I am sorry for what I have done to you" txt, through the "Finally realised, the mistake I made" and on to the "You were my rock and I have lost you"
> 
> Yes, the fog has finally lifted with my W. The problem for her though, is I have moved on. I have no interest in reconciliation. I have pointed this out to her but the txt's keep coming.
> 
> Silly woman.


Good for you! Several friends have told me my ex needs to find herself and settle some issues. Only then will she realize what and whom she's lost, but by then it will be too late since I will have moved on. I can't speak for her journey, but I am moving on.


----------



## bandit.45

morituri said:


> In person, before her mental breakdown. In the cafe store as I was leaving and she tried to give me her new phone number. I told her no because I already was involved with another woman (present girlfriend). The devastatingly painful expression on her face was unmistakeable. It brought me no joy at all, only sadness.


Knowing your story and the awful way you had to find out about her infidelity, I have to say I really don't feel all that sorry for her. 

Broken people... why do they have to break the backs of our lives with their baggage?


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Quick update.

My Brother is in the Royal Infirmary in Edinburgh awaiting an angiogram, with the likelihood of an angioplasty to follow. The fact that others are bypassing him (pun not intended) at least means he's not considered in immediate danger.

My W's last few txt's to me were quite dramatic. She is opening up in a way that I never expected. However, I am aware that there could be a bit of emotional blackmail in there. One of her txt'x almost sounded like a goodbye. Instead of contacting her, I sent a txt to her dad (the only good one in her family) and simply said to him that his daughter sounded a bit down. He checked in on her the next day and thanked me for telling him.

For those who have followed my thread, I think I mentioned that my doctor prescribed AD's (Prozac) back in January after a particularly difficult time. I have been off them for two months now and I am determined I am not going back on them (let's just say, they didn't agree with my digestive system)

After the bad news about my brother this week and my W throwing a curve ball, I still feel I am coping. The secret to that, I put down to socialising. I mentioned before that it has been the best medicine I have ever had; far better than the AD's. I intend to continue that. My next night out is a week tonight. :smthumbup:

Can I just add that I am not being flippant about depression. I have seen how damaging it can be within my own family. If you are depressed, please seek medical help. You cannot just "snap out of" depression.


----------



## Chaparral

OutOfTheBlue said:


> Quick update.
> 
> My Brother is in the Royal Infirmary in Edinburgh awaiting an angiogram, with the likelihood of an angioplasty to follow. The fact that others are bypassing him (pun not intended) at least means he's not considered in immediate danger.
> 
> My W's last few txt's to me were quite dramatic. She is opening up in a way that I never expected. However, I am aware that there could be a bit of emotional blackmail in there. One of her txt'x almost sounded like a goodbye. Instead of contacting her, I sent a txt to her dad (the only good one in her family) and simply said to him that his daughter sounded a bit down. He checked in on her the next day and thanked me for telling him.
> 
> For those who have followed my thread, I think I mentioned that my doctor prescribed AD's (Prozac) back in January after a particularly difficult time. I have been off them for two months now and I am determined I am not going back on them (let's just say, they didn't agree with my digestive system)
> 
> After the bad news about my brother this week and my W throwing a curve ball, I still feel I am coping. The secret to that, I put down to socialising. I mentioned before that it has been the best medicine I have ever had; far better than the AD's. I intend to continue that. My next night out is a week tonight. :smthumbup:
> 
> Can I just add that I am not being flippant about depression. I have seen how damaging it can be within my own family. If you are depressed, please seek medical help. You cannot just "snap out of" depression.


Do you have an excercise/weight lifting routine? I have found that lifting immediately makes me feel better physically and mentally. So much so that I think its weird. Don't really like the leg work that much though. LOL


----------



## bandit.45

My angioplasty went without a hitch, although I was not anywehere near as sick as your brother. They caught mine before there was any heart damage.

The procedure is quite fast and, to be honest, I've been through worse. A dislocated elbow I had back when I was sixteen was far worse than going through angioplasty. 

But it is very scary. They'll wrap his leg up in a big gauze cast and poke a huge hole in the femoral artery to run the catheter through. They'll put him into twilight sleep. Honestly the most painful part was the IV needle in the arm. I was aware of what was going on but felt no pain. The whole procedure only took about 45 minutes. They put four stints in four different places. 
A couple of days rest and observation and they send you home. He'll have to take Plavix and some other blood thinners for a few weeks. And at the end he'll feel much better. 

So just be there for him and let him know you're there. As for your STBXW, ignore her.


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

chapparal said:


> Do you have an excercise/weight lifting routine? I have found that lifting immediately makes me feel better physically and mentally. So much so that I think its weird. Don't really like the leg work that much though. LOL


No I don't. At my age and having worked in an office environment for the past ten years, I would only take to weights after a thorough medical. My nephew, who plays rugby union has commented on leg work and how demanding it is. It's more of a cardiovascular workout than a muscle pumping workout.

Having said that, if you exercise to your limits in whatever pursuit, even walking, you will naturally feel better. :smthumbup:


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

bandit.45 said:


> My angioplasty went without a hitch, although I was not anywehere near as sick as your brother. They caught mine before there was any heart damage.
> 
> The procedure is quite fast and, to be honest, I've been through worse. A dislocated elbow I had back when I was sixteen was far worse than going through angioplasty.
> 
> But it is very scary. They'll wrap his leg up in a big gauze cast and poke a huge hole in the femoral artery to run the catheter through. They'll put him into twilight sleep. Honestly the most painful part was the IV needle in the arm. I was aware of what was going on but felt no pain. The whole procedure only took about 45 minutes. They put four stints in four different places.
> A couple of days rest and observation and they send you home. He'll have to take Plavix and some other blood thinners for a few weeks. And at the end he'll feel much better.
> 
> So just be there for him and let him know you're there. As for your STBXW, ignore her.


Cheers buddy, that puts my mind at rest a little. I mentioned you to my brother today. Bandit is now famous in Scotland


----------



## bandit.45

OutOfTheBlue said:


> Cheers buddy, that puts my mind at rest a little. I mentioned you to my brother today. Bandit is now famous in Scotland


Just tell all the bonnie ladies you know.


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

bandit.45 said:


> Just tell all the bonnie ladies you know.


Do you think I'm stupid? As far as the ladies are concerned, you don't exist 

You may get away with the charm with the ladies but I'm on to you. Stay in your own territory or Blue will need to get his own kilt on (minus the swollen bits) and go to war.

:rofl:


----------



## Mamatomany

OutOfTheBlue said:


> Cheers buddy, that puts my mind at rest a little. I mentioned you to my brother today. Bandit is now famous in Scotland


I talked about both Blue and Bandit in class.... 200 students... lol


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Mamatomany said:


> I talked about both Blue and Bandit in class.... 200 students... lol


Sweetheart, you don't know what that means to me. Thank you - teary eyed here.

ps, watch that Bandit guy, he's trying to muscle in on my territory


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Mamatomany said:


> I talked about both Blue and Bandit in class.... 200 students... lol


Just realised - 200 students!!! You're a brave girl


----------



## Mamatomany

OutOfTheBlue said:


> Sweetheart, you don't know what that means to me. Thank you - teary eyed here.
> 
> ps, watch that Bandit guy, he's trying to muscle in on my territory


Blue, there's plenty of love to go around!! btw - first come first served


----------



## Mamatomany

OutOfTheBlue said:


> Just realised - 200 students!!! You're a brave girl


It's a slow year


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Mamatomany said:


> Blue, there's plenty of love to go around!! btw - first come first served


Blue quietly checks out tickets for flights to US :

Shhhh!!! Don't let that Bandit guy know


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Ok, I've just had 20'000 views on my thread. If it was you, you are entitled to a night out with Blue. Congratulations 

Small Print:
Guys can just F*ck Off 
Girls must be like Mama, jpr, krismimo and oldgirl
And you pick up the tab.

:smthumbup:


----------



## pidge70

OutOfTheBlue said:


> Blue quietly checks out tickets for flights to US :
> 
> Shhhh!!! Don't let that Bandit guy know


I don't think you would have to worry about bandit. Don't you know women over here LOVE a Scottish accent? Just listening to Sean Connery speak gets me all kinds of excited......to quote that_girl....RAWR!


----------



## Mamatomany

Baby Blue... I am only happy to be servin'!!


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

pidge70 said:


> I don't think you would have to worry about bandit. Don't you know women over here LOVE a Scottish accent? Just listening to Sean Connery speak gets me all kinds of excited......to quote that_girl....RAWR!


Only problem is - If I spoke in my true language, you would struggle to understand a word of it  Sean Connery speaks in a very diluted version. Having said that, I can control my language and still speak English with a heavy Scots accent.

So, go get your RAWR! :smthumbup:


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Mamatomany said:


> Baby Blue... I am only happy to be servin'!!


Love you


----------



## pidge70

OutOfTheBlue said:


> Only problem is - If I spoke in my true language, you would struggle to understand a word of it  Sean Connery speaks in a very diluted version. Having said that, I can control my language and still speak English with a heavy Scots accent.
> 
> So, go get your RAWR! :smthumbup:


Totally forgot Gerard Butler too............*swoon*


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Ok,

Little test here

Gaun gies ma baccy

Roughly translated = Please give me my tobacco

Sean Connery would never say that


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Ur ye gonnae no dae that = Are you not going to do that 

Try it with a Scots accent, go on, give it a go


----------



## bandit.45

OutOfTheBlue said:


> Blue quietly checks out tickets for flights to US :
> 
> Shhhh!!! Don't let that Bandit guy know


Tell you what Blue. You come to the states and schmooze Mama, and Ill fly to Scotland. I've had an itch to do some fly fishing on the Tay, and while I'm there I'd like to get to know some of the locals...if you know what I mean.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Mamatomany

bandit.45 said:


> Tell you what Blue. You come to the states and schmooze Mama, and Ill fly to Scotland. I've had an itch to do some fly fishing on the Tay, and while I'm there I'd like to get to know some of the locals...if you know what I mean.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Hey! 
I am not sure how to take this!!


----------



## moxy

Blue, I hope your brother gets well soon. Good to hear that he seems to be hanging in there.

I'm sorry that your WW has begun emerging from the fog too late, but glad to hear that you're strong enough to be wary of her and emotionally equipped to handle it.

Btw, Scottish accents are indeed lady-killers! All this talk has me mopey bc stbxh is in Scotland and I am not. Ah well. I may travel there anyway and just not go to his city. If you travel to the US, even reading the phone book will make you Mr Heartthrob among the gals. 

Best wishes in all things.


----------



## bandit.45

Mamatomany said:


> Hey!
> I am not sure how to take this!!


Well look, you and Blue seem to be getting cozy, and jpr is hooking up with Canguy, OldGirl and Krismimo are married.... Where does that leave me? I sure as hell aint gonna hook up with Proud!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## moxy

bandit.45 said:


> Well look,Where does that leave me? I sure as hell aint gonna hook up with Proud!
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Amusing images....


----------



## bandit.45

pidge70 said:


> *I don't think you would have to worry about bandit.* Don't you know women over here LOVE a Scottish accent? Just listening to Sean Connery speak gets me all kinds of excited......to quote that_girl....RAWR!


Gee...thanks.


----------



## pidge70

bandit.45 said:


> Gee...thanks.


Sorry.......I actually think cowboy hats and dusters are hot. Can't get my man to wear it though......


----------



## moxy

OutOfTheBlue said:


> Ok,
> 
> Gaun gies ma baccy
> 
> Roughly translated = Please give me my tobacco
> 
> Ur ye gonnae no dae that = Are you not going to do that


Both of those made me happy to read, and I imagined them being said by NEDs. 

Reading the parliament page is also a good measure of the differences between Scots and American English. Or, "Trainspotting".




pidge70 said:


> Sorry.......I actually think cowboy hats and dusters are hot. Can't get my man to wear it though......


Agreed. Cowboy hats are hot. And, cowboy boots (especially on women).


----------



## cantmove

bandit.45 said:


> Well look, you and Blue seem to be getting cozy, and jpr is hooking up with Canguy, OldGirl and Krismimo are married.... Where does that leave me? I sure as hell aint gonna hook up with Proud!
> _Posted via Mobile Device_



Hey, didn't I just offer myself up to you yesterday??? I think I just got dissed!!!!


----------



## Mamatomany

moxy said:


> Amusing images....


I wouldn't know... I haven't seen a picture of Bandit yet!!


----------



## moxy

Mamatomany said:


> I wouldn't know... I haven't seen a picture of Bandit yet!!


Nor have I. I just imagine what people look like based on their avatars and self-descriptors, usually.


----------



## cantmove

I haven't seen pictures of anyone but I'm convinced that Bandit and outoftheblue are hot!!!


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

cantmove said:


> I haven't seen pictures of anyone but I'm convinced that Bandit and outoftheblue are hot!!!


Ok, I'm definitely not posting my pic now


----------



## proudwidaddy

Bandit it's your loss...I'm surprisingly gentle


----------



## Mamatomany

OutOfTheBlue said:


> Ok, I'm definitely not posting my pic now


Come on you guys!! Give us something!! I showed you mine! jpr and old girl showed you theirs!! Play fair


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Mamatomany said:


> Come on you guys!! Give us something!! I showed you mine! jpr and old girl showed you theirs!! Play fair


I tried to take a pic tonight with my camera on timer. I wasn't impressed, I realised how old I look. It knocked me a bit. These past few years have certainly taken their toll 

I will try to conjure up the courage to give it another go.


----------



## jpr

OutOfTheBlue said:


> I tried to take a pic tonight with my camera on timer. I wasn't impressed, I realised how old I look. It knocked me a bit. These past few years have certainly taken their toll
> 
> I will try to conjure up the courage to give it another go.


awwww..i often think the same thing when I see recent pictures of myself. We are our own worst critics.

I hope you conjure up the courage to share.


----------



## moxy

jpr said:


> awwww..i often think the same thing when I see recent pictures of myself. We are our own worst critics.
> 
> I hope you conjure up the courage to share.


So far, all the pictures I've seen depict people who are totally hot. You know why? They're real. Even on an online forum, it's the personality that comes through in the pixels.


----------



## [email protected]

OutOfTheBlue said:


> I tried to take a pic tonight with my camera on timer. I wasn't impressed, I realised how old I look. It knocked me a bit. These past few years have certainly taken their toll
> 
> I will try to conjure up the courage to give it another go.


I know exactly what you mean. I feel like I have aged a decade in the past 6 months. My self esteem is shot to pieces. If I dont think I'm attractive how can I expecy anyone else to think that of me.

It's something else I have to work on..


----------



## proudwidaddy

I uploaded a picture of me, for those of you who were wondering what I look like


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

proudwidaddy said:


> I uploaded a picture of me, for those of you who were wondering what I look like


I'm sure the ladies will be impressed.

Check out cantmove's pic. Yet another beautiful TAM lady


----------



## proudwidaddy

I agree Cantmove is very beautiful
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## bandit.45

cantmove said:


> Hey, didn't I just offer myself up to you yesterday??? I think I just got dissed!!!!


Cantmove I am a cad. 

So sorry I ran over you like that. To make ammends I am sending you a very special pic by PM. Hope to get it to you tonight. Its not a pic of me, but a pic of a very special treasure I found while hiking in the mountains here in SE Arizona.... and its only for you.


----------



## OldGirl

proudwidaddy said:


> I uploaded a picture of me, for those of you who were wondering what I look like


Proud! You handsome devil you. If I was single and 20 years younger... Cute kids too


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

When I think life is conspiring against me, I give myself a gentle nudge.


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

OldGirl said:


> Proud! You handsome devil you. If I was single and 20 years younger... Cute kids too


20 Years?????? You've got to be joking, you're a young lass in my book


----------



## OldGirl

Blue - You're very sweet to say that! If you look at my picture you'll see a young man with long hair and a scruffy beard standing behind me. That's my son. Whenever I try to forget how old I am, the sight of my children reminds me 

I'm still waiting to see your picture. What's good for the goose is good for the gander


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Had to get a doctor in to see my Mum tonight. She had trouble breathing. I think my brother's situation is playing on her mind. They put her on some sort of machine to help her.

I am being tested here. I must have done something wrong at some point. Whoever is responsible for testing me this way, take a hike, they will both be ok - you got that?


----------



## OldGirl

Sorry Blue  How is your brother doing?


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

OldGirl said:


> Sorry Blue  How is your brother doing?


He was chirpy this morning, not so much tonight. The next couple of days should clear things up a bit.

Thanks for asking (youngster)


----------



## OldGirl

OutOfTheBlue said:


> He was chirpy this morning, not so much tonight. The next couple of days should clear things up a bit.
> 
> Thanks for asking (youngster)


Be sure to keep us updated. You, your brother and your mother are in my thoughts.


----------



## bandit.45

When it rains it pours, doesn't it Blue?


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Thanks for the support guys. Quick update before heading to work: Phoned Mum and she is breathing much better. She had a spell on a nebuliser last night, which has helped. A nurse will be out to see her today.


----------



## cantmove

OutOfTheBlue said:


> Thanks for the support guys. Quick update before heading to work: Phoned Mum and she is breathing much better. She had a spell on a nebuliser last night, which has helped. A nurse will be out to see her today.


So glad your mom feels better. Hope things continue to look up for your brother as well. Sending prayers your way.


----------



## cantmove

Thanks Proud and Outoftheblue. Compliments feel so much nicer when they come from good men. Now if you guys could just come to Mobile so I could get them in person it would be perfect!!!!


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Mum is much better tonight and brother is getting out of hospital tomorrow :smthumbup:

Those good wishes and prayers sent my way have done the trick. Together, we are strong.

Thanks friends.


----------



## OldGirl

That's wonderful news, Blue. Makes me very happy


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

OldGirl said:


> That's wonderful news, Blue. Makes me very happy


I'm pleased it does. People like us know what's important in life.


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

cantmove said:


> Thanks Proud and Outoftheblue. Compliments feel so much nicer when they come from good men. Now if you guys could just come to Mobile so I could get them in person it would be perfect!!!!


Oh how I would love that. We could do a TAM road trip to see all the national parks, I've always wanted to see. I've always been in love with the scenery in the US. John Muir, who was born less than 30 miles from where I live, petitioned tirelessly, to save areas of natural beauty in the US. He helped to create amongst others, Yosemite and Sequoia national parks.

Maybe one day, I will get my wish.


----------



## Mamatomany

OutOfTheBlue said:


> I tried to take a pic tonight with my camera on timer. I wasn't impressed, I realised how old I look. It knocked me a bit. These past few years have certainly taken their toll
> 
> I will try to conjure up the courage to give it another go.


Send one private to me and I will see you;-) and let you know if it's as bad as you think or photo tips... chin up etc. 

I think sometimes we are too critical of our own photos... I know I am. We look at our hair, face, neck, rest of body etc... it's so hard when our self-confidence is low.


----------



## Mamatomany

OutOfTheBlue said:


> Oh how I would love that. We could do a TAM road trip to see all the national parks, I've always wanted to see. I've always been in love with the scenery in the US. John Muir, who was born less than 30 miles from where I live, petitioned tirelessly, to save areas of natural beauty in the US. He helped to create amongst others, Yosemite and Sequoia national parks.
> 
> Maybe one day, I will get my wish.


I <3 John Muir!


----------



## OldGirl

OutOfTheBlue said:


> Oh how I would love that. We could do a TAM road trip to see all the national parks, I've always wanted to see. I've always been in love with the scenery in the US. John Muir, who was born less than 30 miles from where I live, petitioned tirelessly, to save areas of natural beauty in the US. He helped to create amongst others, Yosemite and Sequoia national parks.
> 
> Maybe one day, I will get my wish.


I'm right next door to Yosemite & Sequoia. Pick everybody up (Mama, Proud, Cantmove, Bandit, JPR, etc. etc.) on your way out, and I'll be your tour guide


----------



## Shiksa

oldgirl- we are in the same neighborhood!


----------



## cantmove

Cheers for blues family!!! 
Please do pick me up along the way. I haven't been to Yosemite nor Sequoia but The Smokey's , Acadia, Shenandoah and Hot Springs are nice. I'm taking my 12yr.old son to Arizona this summer to see the Grand Canyon and Saguaro and the Petrified Forest. Come on over Blue, between Old Girl and myself we can show you a good time.


----------



## Why Not Be Happy?

Happy to hear the better news Blue.


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Ok, where can we get an RV? Bandit? 

I've got visions of a National Lampoon\Wild Hogs type journey :smthumbup:


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Mamatomany said:


> Send one private to me and I will see you;-) and let you know if it's as bad as you think or photo tips... chin up etc.
> 
> I think sometimes we are too critical of our own photos... I know I am. We look at our hair, face, neck, rest of body etc... it's so hard when our self-confidence is low.


Are you into photography Mama? It's one of my interests but just can't get the time. I bought a Canon EOS 70D DSLR just before separation and really need to get going with it. I have good theory but little practise and don't know if I can "see" the image. I can see them in my mind but can't seem to see them through the camera, if that makes sense.

When I get a chance to get a half decent pic of myself, I will let you see it first.


----------



## bandit.45

OutOfTheBlue said:


> Ok, where can we get an RV? Bandit?
> 
> I've got visions of a National Lampoon\Wild Hogs type journey :smthumbup:


My wife would probably be happy to let you use hers for free, as long as you drop her off at her OM's house in El Cajon.


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Ok guys, decided to take a wee break from TAM. Will catch up soon. Thanks to those who have supported me through my journey and especially my recent difficulties.


----------



## OldGirl

Take care


----------



## bandit.45

Here is a parting gift for you Blue

I showed this to Cantmove, but I thought you would all like to see this bird that I took a picture of in the mountains during my backpacking trip last weekend. 

I saw him in a dry gully near the summit of the Rincon Mountains, just east of the Sahuaro National Park near Tucson. The bird is an Elegant Trogon, and it is one of the rarest birds in the U.S. They migrate up along the Sierra Madre in Mexico and can only be found in the extreme southern mountains of Arizona. I have heard about these birds all my life, but never saw one until last Saturday. It was one of the most exciting moments of my life and a real privelege. 

Maybe when you all do your road trip you can come to Tucson and we'll all go see if we can find another one!


----------



## cantmove

Take good care of your Mum & brother and of course yourself. Be happy and I hope we hear from you soon.


----------



## Mamatomany

OutOfTheBlue said:


> Are you into photography Mama? It's one of my interests but just can't get the time. I bought a Canon EOS 70D DSLR just before separation and really need to get going with it. I have good theory but little practise and don't know if I can "see" the image. I can see them in my mind but can't seem to see them through the camera, if that makes sense.
> 
> When I get a chance to get a half decent pic of myself, I will let you see it first.


I use to love to play w/ cameras and would love your camera! Sadly I am often just trying to keep up w/ the kids and need something I can slip into my purse but would love a better camera sometime... someday.

Can't wait to see my Scotsman!


----------



## pidge70

Just wanted to drop by and say hello. I saw a guy in a kilt today and thought of you.....lol I hope all is well with you!


----------



## [email protected]

OutOfTheBlue said:


> Ok guys, decided to take a wee break from TAM. Will catch up soon. Thanks to those who have supported me through my journey and especially my recent difficulties.


All the best xx:smthumbup:


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

pidge70 said:


> Just wanted to drop by and say hello. I saw a guy in a kilt today and thought of you.....lol I hope all is well with you!


Hey, thanks pidge, that is so sweet


----------



## pidge70

OutOfTheBlue said:


> Hey, thanks pidge, that is so sweet


Ye're welcome! or maybe this one....'s e do bheathaur beatha


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Can't believe two weeks have passed already.

Quick update. As you know, my ex turned to me after she went through a bad patch, what that bad patch was, I don't know. I suspected that she was not with bf any more. I was mature and actually quite kind about the situation but let her know in no uncertain terms, that there was no way back. I think she accepted this. I think she is now back with bf.

During my break from TAM, I have spent a lot of time looking at myself (no - not in the mirror) and questioning where I am and where I want to be. I want to take this time on my own and use it positively. If I end up being on my own for the rest of my life, then I know that I will be ok, if on the other hand I meet a lovely lady, then she will get a better "me". 

One of my issues was smoking. I have smoked for as long as I can remember. I have made many attempts to cut down and whilst successful for periods of time, I never managed to keep it up. Every time I tried to do it, life would conspire against me and I would pick up the old cigarettes again. 

What an absolute load of sh!t. These are the typical excuses that smokers come out with. They are excuses, nothing more, nothing less. I realise that now.

I have looked at what I have survived recently and compared that to giving up smoking. There is no comparison. I can't remember being in tears, on my knees and feeling as though my life was over because I couldn't have a cigarette. 

I ran out of cigarettes at the beginning of the week and I haven't smoked one since. More importantly, I won't smoke another one, ever again.

Approximately 7 months ago, my life was falling apart. Today, I only see positives, opportunities and light at the end of the tunnel.

ps - kids are thrilled by me stopping smoking 

Life is good :smthumbup:


----------



## Nsweet

If it makes any difference, she would have gone back to him regardless if you took her back or not. It's better that you didn't enable her to walk back into your life without proving herself ,and now they can ruin their relationship even faster without you interfering.


----------



## bandit.45

Good news brother. That's awesome!

Glad you had some closure with the ex. Sounds like he's not happy with the OM and was hoping to get her hooks back into you. Glad you saw it for what it was.....talk. 

But I predict she'll be back again in the future, looking to get into your good graces. Her relationship with the OM sounds like a debacle. They'll get in another scrap and he'll kick her loose and she'll be looking for another tree to land on.... you. Typical tree monkey behavior.


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

pidge70 said:


> Ye're welcome! or maybe this one....'s e do bheathaur beatha


Wow, do you realise what you have said in Gaelic? I could only do that on the the second Friday of the month....

Only kidding


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

bandit.45 said:


> Good news brother. That's awesome!
> 
> Glad you had some closure with the ex. Sounds like he's not happy with the OM and was hoping to get her hooks back into you. Glad you saw it for what it was.....talk.
> 
> But I predict she'll be back again in the future, looking to get into your good graces. Her relationship with the OM sounds like a debacle. They'll get in another scrap and he'll kick her loose and she'll be looking for another tree to land on.... you. Typical tree monkey behavior.


I agree buddy. He was plan A, I became plan B, he then became plan C and I have no doubt, I will become plan D.

Luckily, we know how this tune goes :smthumbup:


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

[email protected] said:


> All the best xx:smthumbup:


Thank you sweetheart


----------



## jpr

OutOfTheBlue said:


> Approximately 7 months ago, my life was falling apart. Today, I only see positives, opportunities and light at the end of the tunnel.
> 
> ps - kids are thrilled by me stopping smoking
> 
> Life is good :smthumbup:


Oh, this is just so fabulous! It made me smile reading it. 

Congratulations, OutOfTheBlue!...and thanks for the happy update. 

You are a strong guy--and you can conquer anything at this point.


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

jpr said:


> You are a strong guy--and you can conquer anything at this point.


This is what worries me jpr. I feel as though I could conquer anything. Will I be punished for this???

I have survived 23 years with a woman that could break any other man within months (as appears to have happened).

I was worried that this has taken it's toll on me. It has but I am slowly rebuilding.


----------



## jpr

I don't understand. Why would you be punished? It sounds like you are taking control of your life, your happiness, and your health.

You are an incredible person to have endured all that you have...but, it is time for you to take care of yourself now. ....it sounds like you are doing just that--it sounds like you are successfully creating your own happiness.


----------



## OldGirl

Pidge saw a guy in a kilt and thought of you, and I saw this and thought of you. See how much you're missed here 











Very glad to hear you've quit smoking :smthumbup:


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

OldGirl said:


> Pidge saw a guy in a kilt and thought of you, and I saw this and thought of you. See how much you're missed here
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Very glad to hear you've quit smoking :smthumbup:


Thank you YoungGirl


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

jpr said:


> I don't understand. Why would you be punished? It sounds like you are taking control of your life, your happiness, and your health.
> 
> You are an incredible person to have endured all that you have...but, it is time for you to take care of yourself now. ....it sounds like you are doing just that--it sounds like you are successfully creating your own happiness.


I am, honestly I am. Sometimes I question life too much.

For the past six months I have donated money every payday, to a charity that is close to me. That charity, is for neuroblastoma, a cancer that affects children.

On Sunday night, I learnt that the wee girl I was supporting had unfortunately passed away. I was devastated. When I found out, I cried like a baby ( I had received messages from Niamh on Twitter) oh boy, did I cry. I was devastated by this news. If I posted a picture of Niamh (Neve), you would be too.

What I have endured is nothing compared to the parents of these children.

As hard as it is, I will move my focus on to to another child who is facing this terrible disease. Unfortunately, there are are many


----------



## bandit.45

jpr said:


> I don't understand. Why would you be punished? It sounds like you are taking control of your life, your happiness, and your health.


He's Scottish hon.

Whole damn country has this "it's wrong to be happy" complex. It was the ONLY thing about the Scottish people that I did not find endearing.


----------



## jpr

bandit.45 said:


> He's Scottish hon.
> 
> Whole damn country has this "it's wrong to be happy" complex. It was the ONLY thing about the Scottish people that I did not find endearing.


I like it when you call me "hon".


----------



## bandit.45

jpr said:


> I like it when you call me "hon".


As in "sweet as...." 

When I was over there I talked to a gentleman in a town called Crieff, and he described Scottish people as "intrinsically dour". 

They don't trust happiness. 

If you read what the kings of England repeatedly did to them, over a history of a thousand and a half years, its not hard to understand why.


----------



## Lifescript

Outoftheblue, 

Your post has inspired me. I read your story and know what you've gone through. Don't they all come back at some point when their fantasies are over? 

I also feel like I want to help children. I know this is where my passion lies, thought about becoming a teacher once don't know why I didn't. When you think about what some parents go through with sick children you put everything in perspective and realize one's situation is not that bad. 

Glad you're doing good.


----------



## warlock07

OutOfTheBlue said:


> I am, honestly I am. Sometimes I question life too much.
> 
> For the past six months I have donated money every payday, to a charity that is close to me. That charity, is for neuroblastoma, a cancer that affects children.
> 
> On Sunday night, I learnt that the wee girl I was supporting had unfortunately passed away. I was devastated. When I found out, I cried like a baby ( I had received messages from Niamh on Twitter) oh boy, did I cry. I was devastated by this news. If I posted a picture of Niamh (Neve), you would be too.
> 
> What I have endured is nothing compared to the parents of these children.
> 
> As hard as it is, I will move my focus on to to another child who is facing this terrible disease. Unfortunately, there are are many


I have nothing but the highest respect for you


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

One week, no cigarettes and I'm not using nicotine patches. Cigarettes can go f*ck themselves. It's not easy but it's not impossible either. Only side effect is that I have a very short fuse just now. 

:smthumbup:


----------



## jenny123

I have been following the story on facebook of a local teenage boy who had neuroblastoma. He just passed away at 13 years old. It really puts things into perspective. I feel for those parents and siblings
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

jenny123 said:


> I have been following the story on facebook of a local teenage boy who had neuroblastoma. He just passed away at 13 years old. It really puts things into perspective. I feel for those parents and siblings
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


It is a truly awful disease. It just breaks my heart that family's are suffering so much with this. In the event of a relapse, there is no protocol in the UK to continue treatment. The only available option is treatment in Philadelphia, which costs astronomical sums. This is what drives most of the fund raising.

I donated again to Niamh's fund this payday as the money will go to good use.

If we go through life without suffering what these parents do, then we should consider ourselves very, very lucky


----------



## cantmove

I'm so happy for you that you quit smoking. That is a wonderful gift to yourself. Not letting your ex back in after you have been through so much is also a gift to yourself. You are brave and you are strong. I hope I find myself there one day soon.

I'm sorry about Niamh. I can't imagine what parents go through when they lose a child for any reason. I know things like this put the pain we are going through into perspective. Last week my friend lost her three month old to SIDS. It was the most difficult funeral I have ever been to. I couldn't stop holding on to my son. I would take what I'm dealing with over that for the rest of my life. 

You are an inspiration and I'm glad you're back for however long that is.


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

cantmove said:


> I'm so happy for you that you quit smoking. That is a wonderful gift to yourself. Not letting your ex back in after you have been through so much is also a gift to yourself. You are brave and you are strong. I hope I find myself there one day soon.
> 
> I'm sorry about Niamh. I can't imagine what parents go through when they lose a child for any reason. I know things like this put the pain we are going through into perspective. Last week my friend lost her three month old to SIDS. It was the most difficult funeral I have ever been to. I couldn't stop holding on to my son. I would take what I'm dealing with over that for the rest of my life.
> 
> You are an inspiration and I'm glad you're back for however long that is.


Thank you so much cantmove. Your words are appreciated and I fully understand what you are saying.

Sometimes we are so caught up in our own situations, we don't see what's happening around us. That's not wrong, it's far from wrong. Our situations vary and our ability to deal with them also vary. These are very emotional and complex areas.

I consider myself fortunate. I am a naturally a fun loving guy, with a lust for life (took that from my Dad). I am easily pleased. I am not without my weaknesses though.

My weaknesses are drugs, family and children. 

Drugs - Cigarettes are drugs, drugs, which I am confident I can beat (day 10 now)

Family - I worry too much about my family. I know that and I know the impact that has on my health.

Children - I will live with this one. I care for them, regardless. They may be my kids, your kids, the junkies kids. They are kids, nothing more, nothing less. I just wish I had more time to spend with them.


----------



## Mamatomany

I miss you my Scotsman! I hope all is going well with you. I almost hoped for a reunion... but thought about my TAMs men... You are so strong. Miss you!


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Mamatomany said:


> I miss you my Scotsman! I hope all is going well with you. I almost hoped for a reunion... but thought about my TAMs men... You are so strong. Miss you!


Mama, I'm not as strong as you think. If I was, your words would not have brought tears to my eyes. I try to be as strong as I can be.

I miss you too sweetheart


----------



## Nsweet

Anti depressants and exercise really do help you to stay strong.


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Nsweet said:


> Anti depressants and exercise really do help you to stay strong.


I would say that exercise and diet are the two most important things we can use to help ourselves and I would most certainly advise anyone to seriously look at these areas. Don't forget that good friends are also very important - someone to open up to. If you don't have that, then TAM is a good alternative. If you can't bring yourself to do that for whatever reason, then feel free to PM me.

:smthumbup:


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Just thought that I would add - AD's can be a life saver. Never, ever think that AD's are a sign of weakness, they're not. Sometimes we all need a little help to get us past difficult times. AD's can play a huge part in this.

You may be on them for a few months, you may be on them for the rest of your life - it doesn't matter. What's important is - *doing what's right for you*


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Oh, forgot to say, cigarettes can just f*ck off


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

OMG, I can't believe I almost forget the most important info. The receptionist at work asked me what I thought of blind dates. I told her that I was very wary of them, as I needed to know someone first. I told her that I was just at the socialising stage.

I then asked her why. She said that she thought I was perfect for her younger sister, who, according to her, was better looking, slimmer and more attractive than her and more importantly someone who is very much like myself.

What should I do?


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Sorry for the mass postings. You know that I work in IT because I download everything at once. Don't worry ladies, I have my exceptions


----------



## bandit.45

OutOfTheBlue said:


> I then asked her why. She said that she thought I was perfect for her younger sister, who, according to her, was better looking, slimmer and more attractive than her and more importantly someone who is very much like myself.
> 
> What should I do?


Don't do it. You're not ready.


----------



## jpr

Awesome! ...go for it! 

Take a risk.

To quote a tennis shoe company's slogan: "Just do it!"

(...oh...--aren't tennis shoe's called "trainers" in the U.K.? ...)


Do it.

...that is how you decided to quit smoking. You just did it. 

Just do it.
....and then tell us all about it afterwards.


----------



## bandit.45

Don't.

Not until you are utterly and completely over your wife... that is to say, when you can watch her get hit by a bus and have no emotion... then you'll be ready to date.


----------



## jpr

bandit.45 said:


> Don't.
> 
> Not until you are utterly and completely over your wife... that is to say, when you can watch her get hit by a bus and have no emotion... then you'll be ready to date.


Bandit...no offense, but that is just ridiculous.

Do you honestly think that you are ever going to be utterly and completely over your ex? Really...? Life goes on. ...and we all need to move on too. You are never going to be 100% ready. ...and if you wait that long, your life is just going to pass you by.



Sometimes you need to jump in the pond for a while. ....you can always come out and dry off if the water is too cold.


----------



## bandit.45

If Blue brings emotional baggage into his dating he's going to crash and burn and just feel worse.


----------



## jpr

bandit.45 said:


> If Blue brings emotional baggage into his dating he's going to crash and burn and just feel worse.


You don't have to be so fatalistic, Bandit. 

I don't believe that Blue is going to "crash and burn"

It is just a date.

He is not getting married.

Sometimes you need to let yourself take a risk so that you CAN move on and move forward. 

Nothing in this life is 100%. You can think about things all you want....and you can plan your "recovery" process to the letter.. and make a checklist for yourself of all the things you need to accomplish before you can let yourself go on a date. 

But, still...that doesn't guarantee that you won't "crash and burn" later on in your life.

I think that we all now possess more skills now than we did before. I think it is possible for us all to "crash" again....but, I think that we are all much better equipped to deal with that "crash"...I don't believe that Blue will "burn" if he goes on an innocent little date.

You think too much, Bandit. ...that little Bandit Brain is working too much! 

...but, that is just my opinion. I may be dishing out dangerous advice. I am not a professional by any means.


----------



## bandit.45

I crashed and burned twice with my STBXW. 

Not much left unscorched with me. I'm all scar tissue. 

I just want Blue to be careful.


----------



## jpr

bandit.45 said:


> I crashed and burned twice with my STBXW.
> 
> Not much left unscorched with me. I'm all scar tissue.
> 
> I just want Blue to be careful.


Poop happens.

We need to pick up the pieces and move on. ...experience people, make connections, give love, LIVE!

As Blue has eluded to in his previous posts about his charity...life is precious and beautiful. 

Take some risks. You will survive. You will be okay.


----------



## jpr

...are we having our first fight, Bandit? 

...maybe we can make up later on tonight? ????


----------



## bandit.45

jpr said:


> ...are we having our first fight, Bandit?
> 
> ...maybe we can make up later on tonight? ????


No we're good angel. I'm just in a crap mood today. 

OOB needs to follow his heart I guess. He's a grown man, he doesn't need us telling him how and who to date.


----------



## jpr

bandit.45 said:


> No we're good angel. I'm just in a crap mood today.
> 
> OOB needs to follow his heart I guess. He's a grown man, he doesn't need us telling him how and who to date.


I am sorry you are in a poopy mood, Bandit. 

Here are a few more sad faces to let you know that I care...



...I think you just need a good boinking.  Just to get it out of your system. Lighten your mood...and make you stop taking life so seriously.


----------



## bandit.45

jpr said:


> I am sorry you are in a poopy mood, Bandit.
> 
> Here are a few more sad faces to let you know that I care...
> 
> 
> 
> ...I think you just need a good boinking.  Just to get it out of your system. Lighten your mood...and make you stop taking life so seriously.


Problem is darlin', with all these meds I'm on, my libido is toast. I couldn't boink anyone if I wanted to. 

You're right though. I need to lighten up.


----------



## warlock07

I'm with jpr on this one. You will never get over someone 100%. OOB knows what is best for him anyway..

Also always be careful of blind dates..Don't go to one with any expectations..


----------



## canguy66

warlock07 said:


> I'm with jpr on this one. You will never get over someone 100%. OOB knows what is best for him anyway..
> 
> Also always be careful of blind dates..Don't go to one with any expectations..


I _saw _that advice coming. Oh wait...


----------



## warlock07

wat?


----------



## UpnDown

if you dont wanna go on it.. i will!


----------



## jpr

bandit.45 said:


> Problem is darlin', with all these meds I'm on, my libido is toast. I couldn't boink anyone if I wanted to.
> 
> You're right though. I need to lighten up.


Maybe you wouldn't need all those meds if you could boink someone?

....it is a vicious cycle, isn't it?

We should do an experiment. Go off your meds for a couple of days...go boink someone..and then tell us how you feel.  ...I am sure that there are some lovely ladies on this board who would be willing to participate in this experiment.


----------



## Nsweet

What meds are you taking Bandit? 

If it's anything that just lowers your sex drive without taking away your ability to have an erection you can still get your mojo back, and possible lower the dosage over time. The only down side is you're going to need to practice getting more erections throughout the day and masturbation without ejaculation. After a few weeks if you don't feel you can boink everything that bends over, I'll give you a dollar.


----------



## canguy66

Nsweet said:


> What meds are you taking Bandit?
> 
> If it's anything that just lowers your sex drive without taking away your ability to have an erection you can still get your mojo back, and possible lower the dosage over time. The only down side is you're going to need to practice getting more erections throughout the day and masturbation without ejaculation. After a few weeks if you don't feel you can boink everything that bends over, I'll give you a dollar.


Hope you feel pumped after that advice, Bandit. *cough*
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## jpr

canguy66 said:


> Hope you feel pumped after that advice, Bandit. *cough*
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


...oh my, Canguy. That one was pretty bad.

Real groaner.


----------



## canguy66

jpr said:


> ...oh my, Canguy. That one was pretty bad.
> 
> Real groaner.


You sure you didn't mean "moaner"?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## jpr

canguy66 said:


> You sure you didn't mean "moaner"?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I knew it! I KNEW you were going to turn that word into "moaner"...as soon as I hit ENTER on my keyboard, I thought "Oh no. I know what Canguy is going to do"...

....but, then, I thought that would leave itself open to a pretty good "That's what she said" opportunity. 

I think I know you too well, Canguy. Our relationship is becoming too predictable. 

...we need to shake things up a bit. ....keep each other on their toes.


----------



## Chaparral

I have no idea how long one should wait to date. But one friend was in such bad shape that I thought he was possibly suicidal. He started dating awoman and his personality turned back to his old self almost instantaneously. He's a new man and no longer gives a whoot about his ex(or friend she cheated with) who cheated on him as soon as his youngest step daughter left for college. I wonder if sooner isn't better than later.


----------



## canguy66

jpr said:


> I knew it! I KNEW you were going to turn that word into "moaner"...as soon as I hit ENTER on my keyboard, I thought "Oh no. I know what Canguy is going to do"...
> 
> ....but, then, I thought that would leave itself open to a pretty good "That's what she said" opportunity.
> 
> I think I know you too well, Canguy. Our relationship is becoming too predictable.
> 
> ...we need to shake things up a bit. ....keep each other on their toes.


I will always have a good/bad pun or one liner. You see, I'm me that way. But I can be unpredictable in other areas you know. Ahem... shall I PM you?


----------



## warlock07

canguy66 said:


> I will always have a good/bad pun or one liner. You see, I'm me that way. But I can be unpredictable in other areas you know. Ahem... shall I PM you?



You guys!!


----------



## bandit.45

It's like the Dating Game for BSs.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Ok, my decision was to give it a miss. Why? I'm not 100% certain. The plain truth is that I am happy being on my own. I am currently making life changing decisions that I'm scared I wouldn't make if I were in a relationship.

That may sound pathetic but that's where I am


----------



## bandit.45

OutOfTheBlue said:


> Ok, my decision was to give it a miss. Why? I'm not 100% certain. The plain truth is that I am happy being on my own. I am currently making life changing decisions that I'm scared I wouldn't make if I were in a relationship.
> 
> That may sound pathetic but that's where I am


It's not pathetic....it's smart.


----------



## canguy66

Good for you. If you're happy being single, there is nothing wrong with that at all. Best wishes with your decisions.


----------



## ScottH454

Thanks for this post an keeping it updated. My wife just left yesterday an I was looking for how long it takes to move on an read this thread first. While five months seems like a really long time you sound better towards the end. I know my separation is for the better an could see it coming so I hope to move on sooner.


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

ScottH454 said:


> Thanks for this post an keeping it updated. My wife just left yesterday an I was looking for how long it takes to move on an read this thread first. While five months seems like a really long time you sound better towards the end. I know my separation is for the better an could see it coming so I hope to move on sooner.


I'm glad you find the thread helpful. That is part of the reason I pop back and update it.

I think our recovery depends on a number of factors. The reason the relationship ended, the length of the relationship, the perceived strength of the relationship, the mental strength of the individuals concerned, ..... ad infinitum. No two separations will ever be the same.

OOB has just passed day twelve without cigarettes. This weekend was a challenge as I went to a rally with my son and encountered lot's of situations where cigarettes would normally play a part - eg you reach your destination, get out of the car and go to light up a cigarette. Although I was never even slightly tempted to seek a cigarette, I was surprised.

I managed to get out with my camera though, which was good, as I had been promising myself I would. Trying to remember how to take pics of fast moving cars was a welcome challenge.

Although this is an old Ford (Escort), it has a Cosworth engine and was the only car that managed all four wheels off the ground at this bridge.


----------



## Dollystanford

OutOfTheBlue said:


> OOB has just passed day twelve without cigarettes. This weekend was a challenge as I went to a rally with my son and encountered lot's of situations where cigarettes would normally play a part - eg you reach your destination, get out of the car and go to light up a cigarette. Although I was never even slightly tempted to seek a cigarette, I was surprised.


congrats! It's been exactly three months since he walked out and I can't even think about giving up smoking yet - have you just gone cold turkey?

loving the car btw :smthumbup:


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Dollystanford said:


> congrats! It's been exactly three months since he walked out and I can't even think about giving up smoking yet - have you just gone cold turkey?
> 
> loving the car btw :smthumbup:


Almost cold turkey. I use those little inhalator (sp) things - no patches. You are allowed up to twelve capsules a day - I use one. I aim to get rid of that too but don't want to be too bravado. I've done good work up to now but don't want to get too carried away with myself 

To stop smoking, you must get your head straight. When you want to and I mean, really want to, you will do it. :smthumbup:

ps, I think car is cool too. It's scary to be be in full manual on your camera (which you need to be) and be surrounded by pro's. They were also given the best positions


----------



## Why Not Be Happy?

Awesome photo! Good job quitting smoking...


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Why Not Be Happy? said:


> Awesome photo! Good job quitting smoking...


Thanks buddy. Two weeks today and going well. Work colleagues have been warned that I'm just a little bit less tolerant than they have grown to expect - My advice, support me in this or pay the price. They don't want to see OOB angry


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Had a difficult day today. Heart wrenching for me. Will explain later. Still no cigarettes.

Mama - how are you sweetheart?


----------



## bandit.45

I haven't heard from Mama in two weeks. She PMed me a couple weeks ago and she seemed...I dunno....off. Talking some strange stuff. I'm really worried about her. She talked like she was in a really bad place, and since then she has not responded to my PMs.

PM her OOB and see if you can get through to her. She digs you.


----------



## cantmove

I'm sorry for whatever you are going through. Please let us know what is going on, maybe we can help.Thinking about you.


----------



## [email protected]

OutOfTheBlue said:


> Had a difficult day today. Heart wrenching for me. Will explain later. Still no cigarettes.
> 
> Mama - how are you sweetheart?


Hope you are ok OOB x (((((((((HUGS))))))))))))


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Sorry, I may have accidentally given the wrong impression, nothing has happened to me, just someone I know.

I had a gentle reminder yesterday, that we are not alone with our suffering. Every day, I have lunch with two lovely ladies. This has been the case for many months. In fact, this started about seven months ago, when I went through my separation.

Both of these ladies have helped me in their own way, whether it be humour or the occasional reality check.

Yesterday, was a day for a reality check. Both of these ladies have one thing in common, their mother's are receiving treatment for breast cancer. One of these ladies is also going through a difficult time with her husband, who is, at this time, going through a difficult time himself. From what has been said, it sounds like he has suffered some form of nervous breakdown.

Yesterday, this lady came to my office. She started to tell me about her mother. Her Mother was in worse shape than she thought. What didn't help though, was that her husband couldn't support her. When they got home after visiting her mother, she asked him for a cuddle and he point blank refused. She asked why, he said, he just didn't want to. This absolutely stunned her. At a time when she most needed support from her husband, he wasn't there for her. She was furious with him.

Although she had promised herself that when she spoke about it she wouldn't break down, she did. It was horrible to see, I could have cried for her. I went to her and I gave her a very long cuddle. We sat for half an hour, chatting about her situation.

Two things became clear. Her parents had not kept her fully up to date with her mother's situation and her husband couldn't help because he wasn't strong enough to deal with the situation.

I was conscious that I had given her, what her husband couldn't - a cuddle. I wasn't wrong in doing that and I'm sure she would know that. I explained to her that I thought her husband was in a bad place just now and was struggling to help himself, never-mind anyone else. I said, it's not that he doesn't want to help you, it's that he just can't.

I gave her my mobile and email and told her to feel free to offload on me any time things got on top of her. She text last night saying that her husband was able to talk about it and admitted that he was just struggling with the whole situation.

Hopefully they can work on things together and that he will get himself into a position where he will be able to support her. They both have some very difficult days ahead.

For those who have followed my thread, I don't need to say this but for those who haven't, I have very strong beliefs regarding marriage. Although this lady is an attractive woman, she is no more than a friend to me who can lean on me when needed. I assure you, it will remain that way. 

ps, I played golf with some work colleagues today. The first time I have played in fifteen years. I gave up, all those years ago, due to frustration. I hadn't swung a club since then. You know what? I actually played better today, than I did way back then and I thoroughly enjoyed the day. I think I will be taking up golf again. My social life is getting so busy :smthumbup:


----------



## Dollystanford

of course you weren't wrong to support her, it was exactly what she needed 

you are an honourable man my scottish friend


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Dollystanford said:


> of course you weren't wrong to support her, it was exactly what she needed
> 
> you are an honourable man my scottish friend


Thanks Dolly. I am indeed an honourable man and you are correct, she really needed a little support. Sometimes I feel I need to say these things as I still get the odd nudge, nudge, wink, wink comments from men at work because I am friendly with a lot of ladies. I remind them, that I am also friendly with a lot of men, doesn't make me gay.

Friends and their welfare are important to me. That stands for Men and Women.


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Here's something that will make you feel old. I recently started ripping my CD collection onto my computer. One of the albums I copied was a set of three discs by Bruce Springsteen (Live 1975 - 1985). I bought this three disc set 26 years ago, in 1986 - wow, 26 years ago. I can't believe it - I bought this album a quarter of a century ago. 

A brilliant album by the way  The spiel before he started the River is just magical. Racing in the street is getting a good blasting just now :smthumbup:


----------



## bandit.45

OutOfTheBlue said:


> Here's something that will make you feel old. I recently started ripping my CD collection onto my computer. One of the albums I copied was a set of three discs by Bruce Springsteen (Live 1975 - 1985). I bought this three disc set 26 years ago, in 1986 - wow, 26 years ago. I can't believe it - I bought this album a quarter of a century ago.
> 
> A brilliant album by the way  The spiel before he started the River is just magical. Racing in the street is getting a good blasting just now :smthumbup:


And now the Boss's lead guitar player is an actor playing gangsters. Go figure.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

bandit.45 said:


> And now the Boss's lead guitar player is an actor playing gangsters. Go figure.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Didn't know that.

I just love how most of his music relates to the real life struggles of ordinary people. You don't have to be in the US to get that.


----------



## bandit.45

OutOfTheBlue said:


> Didn't know that.
> 
> I just love how most of his music relates to the real life struggles of ordinary people. You don't have to be in the US to get that.


Hell yeah. Van Zandt was in the Sopranos.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Check your pm's bandit


----------



## bandit.45

OOB I'm on a party date with a lady friend right now (taking a breather at this moment while she chats with girlfriends) and I'm having a blast. 

Find a lady friend to go out with and have some fun.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

bandit.45 said:


> OOB I'm on a party date with a lady friend right now (taking a breather at this moment while she chats with girlfriends) and I'm having a blast.
> 
> Find a lady friend to go out with and have some fun.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Woohoo Bandit.....way to go. You just continue with your blast. Don't you dare post any more to TAM. I mean it - switch your phone off - do it now, right now.

There's gonna be some broken hearted ladies on here tonight.


----------



## Dollystanford

we are weeping and wailing and rending our garments over here (but we're very happy for Bandit  )

and she's talking to her girlfriends huh? about what I wonder


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Dollystanford said:


> we are weeping and wailing and rending our garments over here (but we're very happy for Bandit  )
> 
> and she's talking to her girlfriends huh? about what I wonder


Hey lady, you're on my timezone. Why are you up at this time? I have an excuse, I'm waiting up on daughter (she doesn't know of course) Explain yourself


----------



## Dollystanford

I don't really sleep at the moment 
crashed about midnight, up again at 2, can't get back to sleep - insomniac don't you know
waiting up on daughter ha ha - not being a 'dad taxi' then?


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Dollystanford said:


> I don't really sleep at the moment
> crashed about midnight, up again at 2, can't get back to sleep - insomniac don't you know
> waiting up on daughter ha ha - not being a 'dad taxi' then?


Sometimes I just put my feet in it  I assume everyone is ok and there couldn't be any reason why someone would be posting at 3am on a TAM forum doh!!!!

Luckily for me, eldest daughter has become taxi but the downside is that I have to worry about both of them. 

Hope you get your sleep pattern sorted - it's very important - I know, I've been there and to an extent I still am.


----------



## Dollystanford

ah they'll be alright, we didn't even have mobile phones when I was staggering around London p*ssed at 3 in the morning back in the day!

my mum used to say 'I never sleep until your key hits the door' and I used to think 'yeah that's why I can hear you both snoring from the down the street'


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Dollystanford said:


> my mum used to say 'I never sleep until your key hits the door' and I used to think 'yeah that's why I can hear you both snoring from the down the street'


Ha ha. I must admit, I have been guilty of that a few times.........zzzzzzzzzz


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

My ex came to the house tonight with some photos that my son had asked her for. She came across as being very nervous. Her lip was quivering. Why, I do not know. I think that if my son wasn't there, she may have broken down - I may be wrong.

Maybe, she just feels awkward standing at the door. I banned her from entering the house back in February, when she announced she was with another man.

Other than that, she looks ok. I hope she is happy with OM.


----------



## Dollystanford

how did you react - were you cool?

I was driving home from the supermarket today and saw my ex driving in the other direction at 60mph in a 30mph zone  so we both stopped in the middle of the road and had a bizarre conversation about him having to go to B&Q to get a new drill bit. Honestly, life is weird sometimes no? I literally felt nothing, it was like talking to an acquaintance


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Dollystanford said:


> how did you react - were you cool?
> 
> I was driving home from the supermarket today and saw my ex driving in the other direction at 60mph in a 30mph zone  so we both stopped in the middle of the road and had a bizarre conversation about him having to go to B&Q to get a new drill bit. Honestly, life is weird sometimes no? I literally felt nothing, it was like talking to an acquaintance


Oh, I was cool, I was so laid back, I was almost horizontal 

I'm glad I've now had two face to face meetings with her and I have been very cool. Like you, I felt nothing.


----------



## Dollystanford

the Braveheart and the Lionheart, that's us :rofl:


----------



## MyselfAgain

Wow guys, I'm impressed! I don't think I could deal with seeing my stbxh.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## bandit.45

I'm glad I live in a big spread out city. I have not seen the ex in a month. 

Glad to here your ex is not affecting you any more. It must be killing her that she has no sway on you, and that she is on the outside looking in. Sad really.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Chaparral

bandit.45 said:


> I'm glad I live in a big spread out city. I have not seen the ex in a month.
> 
> Glad to here your ex is not affecting you any more. It must be killing her that she has no sway on you, and that she is on the outside looking in. Sad really.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I think the quivering lip is an indication the karma bus isn't a fun ride for long. Throwing away your family has got to leave a mark once it sinks in that is exactly what you did.


----------



## Nsweet

OutOfTheBlue said:


> My ex came to the house tonight with some photos that my son had asked her for. She came across as being very nervous. Her lip was quivering. Why, I do not know. I think that if my son wasn't there, she may have broken down - I may be wrong.
> 
> Maybe, she just feels awkward standing at the door. I banned her from entering the house back in February, when she announced she was with another man.
> 
> Other than that, she looks ok. I hope she is happy with OM.


Oh, she was just fighting back those tears of guilt.


----------



## bandit.45

chapparal said:


> I think the quivering lip is an indication the karma bus isn't a fun ride for long. Throwing away your family has got to leave a mark once it sinks in that is exactly what you did.


Yeah I would say she probably has some big tread marks on her back. 

Still it is sad in that it was all completely avoidable. Again we see the great Circle of Dumb-assedness at work: Make dumbass choices.....experience dumbass consequences.


----------



## morituri

OM probably dumped her and now she is all alone. Sucks to be her.


----------



## bandit.45

morituri said:


> OM probably dumped her and now she is all alone. Sucks to be her.


....daughters despise her, husband no longer gives a hoot....


----------



## morituri

I went back and reread OOTB's first post of this thread and it is obvious that she is one disturbed, broken woman who is in serious need of therapy. I wouldn't be surprised if she experiences an mental/emotional meltdown soon though I hope not for her sake as well as the children's.


----------



## Dollystanford

I just went back and read it too
I hope his ex meets my ex - they'd have a rip-roaring time together


----------



## Why Not Be Happy?

Blue:
Congrats for having it so together. You're doing great!


----------



## morituri

Blue,

I cannot stress the importance of going dark as much as possible for your emotional well being. I know that in your case it is very hard because of your young son. Continue keeping *every interaction* with her short and to the point regarding him. 

Last year I made the bad choice of engaging my ex-wife in conversation when I accidentally bumped into her out on the streets. Then a few months later when I found out she had attempted suicide and had to be institutionalized, I was once again thrown into emotional turmoil. Luckily it was short lived and my ex was released to her parents custody (she's been in therapy and doing well). I learned the hard way that just because one gets divorced, it doesn't necessarily mean there is no more emotional bonding left with the ex.

Hopefully, you will never experience what I went through but if your stbxw does go through a mental/emotional breakdown you need to have emotional buffers in place and some of the best ways is to limit the amount of communication with her and when there is the need to do so, to not allow her to get you to interact with her on any other level that is not child care related. I know that you are already doing this but I just wanted to show you why it is important in terms of your emotional health.


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

morituri said:


> Blue,
> 
> I cannot stress the importance of going dark as much as possible for your emotional well being. I know that in your case it is very hard because of your young son. Continue keeping *every interaction* with her short and to the point regarding him.
> 
> Last year I made the bad choice of engaging my ex-wife in conversation when I accidentally bumped into her out on the streets. Then a few months later when I found out she had attempted suicide and had to be institutionalized, I was once again thrown into emotional turmoil. Luckily it was short lived and my ex was released to her parents custody (she's been in therapy and doing well). I learned the hard way that just because one gets divorced, it doesn't necessarily mean there is no more emotional bonding left with the ex.
> 
> Hopefully, you will never experience what I went through but if your stbxw does go through a mental/emotional breakdown you need to have emotional buffers in place and some of the best ways is to limit the amount of communication with her and when there is the need to do so, to not allow her to get you to interact with her on any other level that is not child care related. I know that you are already doing this but I just wanted to show you why it is important in terms of your emotional health.


Your advice is noted. I am so comfortable with my situation, that it would be easy to become complacent and allow her to build emotional ties.

Although I hope it never comes to it, she is definitely in an at risk group. The last outburst proved that but I also think there was an element of testing in there, to see what my reaction would be. 

A surprising thing happened today. The lady at work who thinks I would be ideal for her younger sister brought a picture of said sister to work. She was a surprisingly good looking woman.

I told her that her sister was a very attractive woman (I was being honest) but I wasn't interested in dating. I said I preferred to be on my own but still enjoyed socialising with women. She then said that we should forget about the blind date remarks and just go out for a meal. Hmmmmm!!

I will update if there are any changes


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

ps. No cigarettes for three weeks tomorrow. :smthumbup:


----------



## jh52

OutOfTheBlue said:


> Your advice is noted. I am so comfortable with my situation, that it would be easy to become complacent and allow her to build emotional ties.
> 
> Although I hope it never comes to it, she is definitely in an at risk group. The last outburst proved that but I also think there was an element of testing in there, to see what my reaction would be.
> 
> A surprising thing happened today. The lady at work who thinks I would be ideal for her younger sister brought a picture of said sister to work. She was a surprisingly good looking woman.
> 
> I told her that her sister was a very attractive woman (I was being honest) but I wasn't interested in dating. I said I preferred to be on my own but still enjoyed socialising with women. She then said that we should forget about the blind date remarks and just go out for a meal. Hmmmmm!!
> 
> I will update if there are any changes


It wouldn't hurt to have a female with you out for a meal. IMO


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

jh52 said:


> It wouldn't hurt to have a female with you out for a meal. IMO


Of course, you are correct. I'm in a little zone just now, which I hope I escape from.

On other matters, I was due to fly down to Bristol at the beginning of next week on business matters. I hate flying..... and all the waiting associated with it. So, I told my work, get me a hire car and I'll drive there. They reluctantly accepted that, even though it was the cheaper option.

Here's the real test, I have seldom been away from my kids for more than one night. I will be in Bristol from Monday to Wednesday at the very least.

This is just another test for me. I will pass it


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Getting nervous now. I am now travelling down south on Sunday. Why do I hate being away from my kids. This is not normal, I almost feel panicky that I will be 8 hours away from them.

I worked all over the UK when I was young. At the age of nineteen, I stayed on my own in a caravan, mid winter, in the middle of the forest where I was working. I remember my drinking water freezing solid inside the caravan. Three months I was there, never gave it a second thought. 

Another time, my mum contacted the police to track me down as I didn't return home as I was supposed to. They found me. I returned home a year later. (that was bad - I made my Mum ill with worry)

Fast forward 25-30 years and I am the complete opposite. Not good.

On a different matter, I have been following Bandit's latest exploits and whilst I am very happy for him, I am starting to question and maybe even doubt myself. I have little interest in sex. Very, very scary!!!

I am, however very interested in interesting women and very much enjoy the company of women and because of this, I know that I don't have a problem with women in general. I really hope the wanting comes back. As a man it's almost embarrassing to say this.

I think I alluded to the reason in some previous posts. I have had my fill of sex, good sex, wild sex, dirty sex.

I can't say the same for romance, love, devotion. This is what I miss (never had).

I hope that when I find the above, the sex part will fall in to place.


----------



## aug

OutOfTheBlue said:


> Getting nervous now. I am now travelling down south on Sunday. Why do I hate being away from my kids. This is not normal, I almost feel panicky that I will be 8 hours away from them.



Because you love them very much?


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

aug said:


> Because you love them very much?


I do, very much but I deal with consultants who travel the country in their line of work. I don't doubt they would rather be at home with their family's but they don't seem to be afflicted with this, almost panicky worry.


----------



## Dollystanford

OutOfTheBlue said:


> I think I alluded to the reason in some previous posts. I have had my fill of sex, good sex, wild sex, dirty sex.
> 
> I can't say the same for romance, love, devotion. This is what I miss (never had).


ahhh we are brothers in arms babe, I never really had that either 

it will fall into place for you when you find it  I always have hope that I will find the man who wants to worship me (and shag me senseless)

Consultants are used to being away from their families - you aren't. They don't like it but needs must and all that

I shouldn't imagine you're looking forward to the drive either....

But congrats on the ****, I'm jealous!


----------



## bandit.45

The best love is when you have the best of both worlds: hot sex and emotionally intimacy. I experienced short durations of this with my ex, but it was always fleeting. 

Now that I look back, I don't think any of it was real. She was a consumate actress.


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Dollystanford said:


> ahhh we are brothers in arms babe, I never really had that either
> 
> it will fall into place for you when you find it  I always have hope that I will find the man who wants to worship me (and shag me senseless)
> 
> Consultants are used to being away from their families - you aren't. They don't like it but needs must and all that
> 
> I shouldn't imagine you're looking forward to the drive either....
> 
> But congrats on the ****, I'm jealous!


Cheers Dolly,

Going good on the ciggies, difficult week ahead but that's no excuse to falter. I need to stay focused. I will be shattered after the drive, that's why I am going on Sunday.

Well, I'm obviously not dead yet, as the words "shag me senseless" raised a little interest  (for our American friends, there is a huge pun in there)


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

bandit.45 said:


> The best love is when you have the best of both worlds: hot sex and emotionally intimacy. I experienced short durations of this with my ex, but it was always fleeting.
> 
> Now that I look back, I don't think any of it was real. She was a consumate actress.


That's what I am looking for Bandit. I want the emotional part first or if I'm really lucky, like you, both at the same time.


----------



## bandit.45

OutOfTheBlue said:


> That's what I am looking for Bandit. I want the emotional part first or if I'm really lucky, like you, both at the same time.


What waywards don't understand, is that when they cheat and lie and decieve us, it makes us question not only everything that happened during their affair, but it puts all the years before that into question. Every "I Love You", every "I'm so happy I have you"....the truthfulness of the whole marriage is put on the chopping block.


----------



## [email protected]

OutOfTheBlue said:


> Getting nervous now. I am now travelling down south on Sunday. Why do I hate being away from my kids. This is not normal, I almost feel panicky that I will be 8 hours away from them.


Congratulations, Blue you are a sane, loving & doting Dad... which makes you a good guy...an absolute turn on for alot of us women 




OutOfTheBlue said:


> On a different matter, I have been following Bandit's latest exploits and whilst I am very happy for him, I am starting to question and maybe even doubt myself. I have little interest in sex. Very, very scary!!!
> 
> I think I alluded to the reason in some previous posts. I have had my fill of sex, good sex, wild sex, dirty sex.
> 
> I can't say the same for romance, love, devotion. This is what I miss (never had).
> 
> I hope that when I find the above, the sex part will fall in to place.


this really hit home with me Blue.. Ah yes, the wounds are still fresh and its difficult to get past it. For me my lasck of desire has more to do with what sex represented in my last relationship. 

My STBX and I were very compatable, I became very comfortable with him and we had few boundaries. 

This made it all the more humiliating when I found out that there was someone else. I felt used by the fact he could betray me after how vulnerable I had made myself to him over the years. He used sex as a means of control for his affection. 

At this point in time, I'm not sure I will ever be able to make myself vulnerable to a man again... *this will pass *(like some of the other feelings I have experienced since Dday) and I'll start boffin everything that moves and making up for the time I've wasted on the a-hole...

Quite apart from that I need someone to compare him to!!! He might have been sh1te all these years & I'e been missing out on fireworks!!!


----------



## [email protected]

bandit.45 said:


> What waywards don't understand, is that when they cheat and lie and decieve us, it makes us question not only everything that happened during their affair, but it puts all the years before that into question. Every "I Love You", every "I'm so happy I have you"....the truthfulness of the whole marriage is put on the chopping block.


Never a truer word spoken x


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

bandit.45 said:


> What waywards don't understand, is that when they cheat and lie and decieve us, it makes us question not only everything that happened during their affair, but it puts all the years before that into question. Every "I Love You", every "I'm so happy I have you"....the truthfulness of the whole marriage is put on the chopping block.


That's the truth. The more you put in, the more damaging it is.


----------



## bandit.45

You know you Brits are so silly. 

I worked on a ranch in New Mexico when I was a kid that was 4,000 square miles in area (200x200 miles). We would haul horses the length and breadth of it weekly and never thought anything of it. Thats roughly half the size of England. 

Its nothing for us Yanks to drive 1000 miles in 24 hours to get from one part of the States to the other. 

Except fpor OOB in the North, you all live so relatively close to each other. Why don't you all have a TAM get-together over there? I bet [email protected] and Dolly would jump on that Scotsman! OOB wouldn't stand a chance! :rofl:


----------



## Dollystanford

I'm game 

can you handle it OOB.......


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

bandit.45 said:


> You know you Brits are so silly.
> 
> I worked on a ranch in New Mexico when I was a kid that was 4,000 square miles in area (200x200 miles). We would haul horses the length and breadth of it weekly and never thought anything of it. Thats roughly half the size of England.
> 
> Its nothing for us Yanks to drive 1000 miles in 24 hours to get from one part of the States to the other.
> 
> Except fpor OOB in the North, you all live so relatively close to each other. Why don't you all have a TAM get-together over there? I bet [email protected] and Dolly would jump on that Scotsman! OOB wouldn't stand a chance! :rofl:


Yeah yeah, we know, everything in the states is bigger, including waistlines 

In all honesty, I don't think they would jump on me. I am a bit older than them and possibly a bit boring.

I'm fine as I am


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Dollystanford said:


> I'm game
> 
> can you handle it OOB.......


Can I handle it? Not a hope in hell 

I will need a bit more time time before I could ever handle a woman like you Dolly


----------



## bandit.45

Now for that crack about our waistlines.....


----------



## Dollystanford

OutOfTheBlue said:


> Can I handle it? Not a hope in hell
> 
> I will need a bit more time time before I could ever handle a woman like you Dolly


now how do you know until you try?


----------



## YellowRoses

Good luck OOB with the trip - I know the feeling, have become a home bird too 

Read your story yesterday BTW, and you deserve the biggest card on Sunday - you are dad of dads and your kids know it


----------



## YellowRoses

bandit, your ranch probably had 3 people on it !

England has over 1000 people per sq mile. that would mean saying 'excuse me, excuse me' to about 120000 people for me to get to the Scottish border even 

I have found someone on here though that lives a mere stone's throw away from me


----------



## bandit.45

When I went to Scotland and England I was amazed at how compressed everything is. Thats why I would go batsh!t if I lived there: I have to have space.

Great place to visit though. I'm planning on going again in the next year or two by myself so I can take my time and see the sights I didn't get to see the first trip because my ex spent all her time shopping!


----------



## YellowRoses

Can NEVER understand shopping when travelling - I've come to see the place, not buy what I can also buy at home


----------



## Dollystanford

ha ha imagine coming here and going SHOPPING!!

WTF???


----------



## bandit.45

Dollystanford said:


> ha ha imagine coming here and going SHOPPING!!
> 
> WTF???


You had to know my ex. She was insane for fashion...spent half her money on clothes and shoes.

P.S.

You Brits have great tweeds and woolens that are hard to get here. That's what she was after.


----------



## Mike11

bandit.45 said:


> You had to know my ex. She was insane for fashion...spent half her money on clothes and shoes.
> 
> P.S.
> 
> You Brits have great tweeds and woolens that are hard to get here. That's what she was after.


The Tartan Kilts... :smthumbup:


----------



## Dollystanford

bandit.45 said:


> You had to know my ex.


nah, reckon I can live without that


----------



## Nsweet

bandit.45 said:


> You had to know my ex. She was insane for fashion...spent half her money on clothes and shoes.


You must be so relieved not having to fake interest in her fashion any more. "So tell me what you think..... This one, or this one.... Does this look ok to you?".... Yeah, I didn't like that either. Oh, and how great is it to actually be on time now?


----------



## Dollystanford

hey nsweet, it only takes me 15 minutes to get ready, I know you're only 12 years old but.....


----------



## Nsweet

Yeah 12 ears younger than how old you pretend to be


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

Chilling tonight with a blast of the Boss. Racing in the Street, is one of my favs, closely followed by, The River, Jersey Girl, My Hometown, Darlington County, Downbound Train..........................

I love the live version of The River, were he speaks about his dad and how they didn't get on (until the end of the story, when you realise, that wasn't the case). Very emotional stuff.


----------



## bandit.45

OutOfTheBlue said:


> Chilling tonight with a blast of the Boss. Racing in the Street, is one of my favs, closely followed by, The River, Jersey Girl, My Hometown, Darlington County, Downbound Train..........................
> 
> I love the live version of The River, were he speaks about his dad and how they didn't get on (until the end of the story, when you realise, that wasn't the case). Very emotional stuff.


You dig the Boss huh? His older albums were the better ones.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Conrad

bandit.45 said:


> You dig the Boss huh? His older albums were the better ones.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Tramps like us, Baby we were Born To Run!


----------



## pidge70

Hey OOB, I need a cool Tam to cover up my poor head or maybe a nifty balmoral bonnet.......


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

A fantastic live performer. I found out accidentally that my daughters were planning to get me tickets for his next visit to the uk. I saw him many years ago in Newcastle, must have been mid 80's. 

He's got a few venues this month on his Wrecking Ball tour but I can't make it because of work commitments.


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

pidge70 said:


> Hey OOB, I need a cool Tam to cover up my poor head or maybe a nifty balmoral bonnet.......


LOL, Don't know what it is but there's something about you I like


----------



## pidge70

Tis the Irish in me


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

pidge70 said:


> Tis the Irish in me


Ah, the old Celtic connection. I knew there was something


----------



## pidge70

Plus, I have a sexy voice now too. Just had brain surgery this past Saturday and the tube they had down my throat bruised me and made my voice all "gruff"........lol


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

pidge70 said:


> Plus, I have a sexy voice now too. Just had brain surgery this past Saturday and the tube they had down my throat bruised me and made my voice all "gruff"........lol



You had what??????? I didn't know. If you mentioned that on TAM, I'm sorry I missed it. Hope the reason for it wasn't too serious and I hope it was successful.

Big hugs sweetheart 
xxxx


----------



## pidge70

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/general-relationship-discussion/48285-having-brain-surgery.html


----------



## pidge70

OutOfTheBlue said:


> You had what??????? I didn't know. If you mentioned that on TAM, I'm sorry I missed it. Hope the reason for it wasn't too serious and I hope it was successful.
> 
> Big hugs sweetheart
> xxxx


Thank you mah mukker. Hope that is right.....lol


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

pidge70 said:


> Thank you mah mukker. Hope that is right.....lol


That's pretty good - Anyway, you can say what you want tonight. I'm so sorry I didn't catch your post. I am so glad it turned out ok.

I occasionally take a break from TAM because I get consumed with other people's issues, maybe that's why I missed it.  

I am so pleased you have come through this and it appears you have a great man by your side.

Love to you and your wonderful family
xxxx


----------



## OutOfTheBlue

pidge70 said:


> http://talkaboutmarriage.com/general-relationship-discussion/48285-having-brain-surgery.html


I promised myself that TAM would stop upsetting me.

I allowed a few tears for this. You're a very brave girl :smthumbup:


----------



## pidge70

OutOfTheBlue said:


> I promised myself that TAM would stop upsetting me.
> 
> I allowed a few tears for this. You're a very brave girl :smthumbup:


Don't be upset...I am well. I'm very stubborn, not going to let anything keep me down!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## pidge70

OutOfTheBlue said:


> That's pretty good - Anyway, you can say what you want tonight. I'm so sorry I didn't catch your post. I am so glad it turned out ok.
> 
> I occasionally take a break from TAM because I get consumed with other people's issues, maybe that's why I missed it.
> 
> I am so pleased you have come through this and it appears you have a great man by your side.
> 
> Love to you and your wonderful family
> xxxx


Thank you!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## OutOfTheBlue

I've been preparing for my business travels all day today 

Son's clothes washed, ironed and put away. Done the same to my shirts and trousers but they're hanging from the door - shoes polished etc, etc......

Food cooked, chicken, pasta, vegetables etc, etc...... kids are quite fond of my latest dish - pasta twists, with just enough mayo to coat, add some cooked chicken and splash liberally with lemon and lime juice. Lovely after-taste.

When you are not used to travelling for business purposes, it can be a bit of a chore. You always think you are going to forget something.

One good thing though, Google maps (street view) - found my hotel and the parking spaces and the directions from there to the business I am going to. Looks like a lovely place 

Don't know if the hotel has wireless available, if the don't, they will be gettin telt (getting told in England) :smthumbup:


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## bandit.45

I live on Google Earth. I use it to find new commercial properties. 

I still think Google is on a quest for global domination, but for now they have some useful tools.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## OutOfTheBlue

bandit.45 said:


> I live on Google Earth. I use it to find new commercial properties.
> 
> I still think Google is on a quest for global domination, but for now they have some useful tools.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Google, the new Microsoft ???????


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## bandit.45

The new Third Reich......
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## OutOfTheBlue

bandit.45 said:


> The new Third Reich......
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Maybe!! but there's worse than Bill Gates!! Agree?


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## OutOfTheBlue

Don't you just love "random" on your music player. It keeps throwing up those classics, you almost forgot. :smthumbup:


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## bandit.45

OutOfTheBlue said:


> Maybe!! but there's worse than Bill Gates!! Agree?


Agreed. 

By the way my Scottish friend,

What foot do you kick with?

What does that mean?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Dollystanford

safe journey OOB, hope you've packed enough Irn Bru!


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## OutOfTheBlue

bandit.45 said:


> Agreed.
> 
> By the way my Scottish friend,
> 
> What foot do you kick with?
> 
> What does that mean?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I've heard it before. It seems to have religious roots. Celtic (Catholic) Rangers (Protestant) which side are you on, which foot do you kick with.

Unfortunately, the songs sung by the Rangers supporters suggest they don't want people who suffered from the Irish famine to be in Scotland. What they don't realise is, the Irish famine affected both Catholic and Protestant Irish people.

They want to send their own "people" home!!!!! 

Fortunately for me, I support the club that really doesn't subscribe to this ideology.

I am neither Irish, nor Catholic but I am very welcome by all Celtic supporters.

The famine that ravaged Ireland, killed Catholics and Protestants.

Do you want to know why that happened????


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## OutOfTheBlue

Dollystanford said:


> safe journey OOB, hope you've packed enough Irn Bru!


LOL, my girders are long and strong 

Our US pals will be lost with that one 

Thank you sweetheart


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## lamaga

I'm not lost! And I've actually tasted Irn Bru! (But not twice  )


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## OutOfTheBlue

lamaga said:


> I'm not lost! And I've actually tasted Irn Bru! (But not twice  )


Did you taste it after a super hangover?????

If not, please exit this conversation


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## Dollystanford

OutOfTheBlue said:


> LOL, my girders are long and strong
> 
> Our US pals will be lost with that one
> 
> Thank you sweetheart


and you're a Celtic fan - so you must know and love my favourite footballer....


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## lamaga

Hungover? Moi?


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## OutOfTheBlue

Dollystanford said:


> and you're a Celtic fan - so you must know and love my favourite footballer....


Past or present?


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## OutOfTheBlue

lamaga said:


> Hungover? Moi?


In that case, you are excused  Always handy for a bad day


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## Dollystanford

past - for both of us...but once seen never forgotten 

Paolo sings Bubbles!

Goal against Wimbledon

I'm a Hammer


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## bandit.45

I played rugby for a few weeks when I was in the Navy. Got bored with it.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## OutOfTheBlue

Dollystanford said:


> past - for both of us...but once seen never forgotten
> 
> Paolo sings Bubbles!
> 
> Goal against Wimbledon
> 
> I'm a Hammer


Who couldn't love Paolo. What a character and at times an absolute footballing genius. I'm glad he's still involved in football. ps, I have a wee soft spot for the Hammers, one of my previous bosses was a season ticket holder. He told me a few stories involving Millwall fans.


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## Conrad

bandit.45 said:


> I played rugby for a few weeks when I was in the Navy. Got bored with it.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I've heard rugby players have leather balls.


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## bandit.45

Conrad said:


> I've heard rugby players have leather balls.


And empty heads.


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## Dollystanford

OutOfTheBlue said:


> Who couldn't love Paolo. What a character and at times an absolute footballing genius. I'm glad he's still involved in football. ps, I have a wee soft spot for the Hammers, one of my previous bosses was a season ticket holder. He told me a few stories involving Millwall fans.


you know they do hats that are half Celtic and half West Ham? ha ha

Millwall - the only fans that lose a game and smash up THEIR OWN F*CKING TOWN ha ha ha


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## Dollystanford

bandit.45 said:


> And empty heads.


rugby is played by posh boys in this country so they are generally quite well educated

although I grant you it doesn't necessarily mean there's much up top


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## OutOfTheBlue

Dollystanford said:


> you know they do hats that are half Celtic and half West Ham? ha ha
> 
> Millwall - the only fans that lose a game and smash up THEIR OWN F*CKING TOWN ha ha ha


Ha Ha, we have that here too. Rangers fans do the exact same. We won, let's destroy a city, we lost, let's destroy it a little bit more.


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## bandit.45

Are you guys talking rugby or soccer football?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Dollystanford

'soccer football' - adorable!
we are indeed talking about soccer football darling 

to the rest of the world it's just 'football'


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## OutOfTheBlue

bandit.45 said:


> Are you guys talking rugby or soccer football?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Oh dear dear Bandit. You really must get out of the US more often. Football never was and never will be, what you do in the US.

The US adopted our name for football and then tried to rename the original. We don't play soccer, we play football. ie, we kick the ball with our feet.

You guys play some game that mostly involves handling the ball. Hey, how about handball as a name??????


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## bandit.45

OutOfTheBlue said:


> Oh dear dear Bandit. You really must get out of the US more often. Football never was and never will be, what you do in the US.
> 
> The US adopted our name for football and then tried to rename the original. We don't play soccer, we play football. ie, we kick the ball with our feet.
> 
> You guys play some game that mostly involves handling the ball. Hey, how about handball as a name??????


(Yawwwnn) Whatever....


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## OutOfTheBlue

Just a quick note to say I travelled down to destination today. Six and a half hours driving wasn't as bad as some people at work said it would be. I took a half hour break at the half way point.

I've got a TV and broadband. More importantly, my daughter is taking control back home. "It's with me Dad" she said. oooooohhhh....Go girl, go. :smthumbup:


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## bandit.45

OutOfTheBlue said:


> Just a quick note to say I travelled down to destination today. Six and a half hours driving wasn't as bad as some people at work said it would be. I took a half hour break at the half way point.
> 
> I've got a TV and broadband. More importantly, my daughter is taking control back home. "It's with me Dad" she said. oooooohhhh....Go girl, go. :smthumbup:


Good for her! Hope you have a pleasant trip back home. Take your time and drive the path less travelled. See the landscape a bit.


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## Dollystanford

OutOfTheBlue said:


> I've got a TV and broadband. More importantly, my daughter is taking control back home. "It's with me Dad" she said. oooooohhhh....Go girl, go. :smthumbup:


awww, they get all grown up
I love it and I hate it


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## OutOfTheBlue

bandit.45 said:


> (Yawwwnn) Whatever....


Awww, C'mon Bandit. You have a world series, that doesn't involve the world, you have a game called football, that seldom involves the feet.

Stop trying to force your ways on others.

Do you want to know where the US is heading? Do You?


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## OutOfTheBlue

bandit.45 said:


> Good for her! Hope you have a pleasant trip back home. Take your time and drive the path less travelled. See the landscape a bit.


I wish I had brought my camera now, as I have seen some unexpected delights.


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## bandit.45

OutOfTheBlue said:


> Awww, C'mon Bandit. You have a world series, that doesn't involve the world, you have a game called football, that seldom involves the feet.
> 
> Stop trying to force your ways on others.
> 
> Do you want to know where the US is heading? Do You?


Blessed oblivion.......:corkysm60:


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## Dollystanford

bandit doesn't care, he has an appointment with some melted butter


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## t_hopper_2012

OutOfTheBlue said:


> Oh dear dear Bandit. You really must get out of the US more often. Football never was and never will be, what you do in the US.
> 
> The US adopted our name for football and then tried to rename the original. We don't play soccer, we play football. ie, we kick the ball with our feet.
> 
> You guys play some game that mostly involves handling the ball. Hey, how about handball as a name??????


I've never understood why people want to make such a big deal out of soccer/football. What about flashlight/torch, truck/lorry, elevator/lift? Don't get me started on the crazy way you pronounce "schedule" in the UK, either.


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## Dollystanford

t_hopper_2012 said:


> I've never understood why people want to make such a big deal out of soccer/football. What about flashlight/torch, truck/lorry, elevator/lift? Don't get me started on the crazy way you pronounce "schedule" in the UK, either.


I think it's because if you go ANYWHERE else in the world - to South America, Europe, Asia, etc. and say 'football' they will immediately think of OUR football

the other stuff not so much 

and don't get ME started on the way you pronounce aluminium, basil or oregano


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## OutOfTheBlue

bandit.45 said:


> Blessed oblivion.......:corkysm60:


Ok, ok, I agree, sometimes it's the best way buddy.


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## bandit.45

Our wierd sports that no other countries like have absolutely nothing to do with our f*cked up economy and overall social malaise. 

Americans are goofy, non-conformist people and that's the way we like our sports. We like stuff we can throw money at. 

Any bush tribe in the back forty of Africa can clear out a field and make a futball pitch. Futball is third world to Americans. 

But now that we are being bred out of existence by the Latino community, futball will replace American Football as the premier sport in probably fifty years? 

So you Eurpopeans will eventually have your revenge against us ugly, non-conformist Americans.


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## Dollystanford

fifty years? England might have won another tournament by then


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## OutOfTheBlue

Well, that's the business trip over. I must admit, I enjoyed it. It was good to get out and see other places and other people.

As you know, I was unsettled and a bit worried about being away from my kids but I think I needed to experience that. I can't always be there for them and I, more than them, need to realise that.

The problem now, is that the meetings where so successful, that they will become more regular - probably every two months. I will just have to get used to it. 

ps

When I was at my most nervous and believe me, I mean nervous about my trip, I received a surprise "Fathers Day" message from someone on TAM. That message gave me the biggest lift I've had since my separation. 

OldGirl, thank you so, so much. If my arms could stretch over the ocean between us, you would be getting a huge loving hug right now.


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## Dollystanford

I knew OldGirl was here watching over us all 

we miss you OldGirl!


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## OutOfTheBlue

Quick post - sorry for the lack of updates, very, very busy at work.

Good news - I've been off the cigarettes for six weeks today  Had a good night out on Saturday - wasn't even remotely tempted to have a smoke


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## Dollystanford

hi darling, was wondering where you were!
I'm so jealous, I'm smoking RIGHT NOW 
and I didn't even want it ha ha


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## Mamatomany

Ummm Good for you! I thought about you a lot today while watching Brave. The kilts, the using of the kilts when etc to escape the tower trap... All the accents. Miss you;-)


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## bandit.45

Watch out for Texan kilt chasers OOB. They have no shame.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Mamatomany

No shame at all and livin' pretty wild these days! 
Lookin' for someone just as wild to play with!!


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## OutOfTheBlue

Ok guys, I put up a pic for my friends to see. Sorry about the stern look and the lack of shaving today but it was a spur of the moment thing. OldGirl persuaded me to do it


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## jpr

awwww...nice photo, Blue.


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## OldGirl

Thank you, Blue. You're looking good! I like the scruffy face 
It's so nice to be able to put a face to the name.
It's nice to be able to get a little peak out the window at your garden too.


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## OutOfTheBlue

OldGirl said:


> Thank you, Blue. You're looking good! I like the scruffy face
> It's so nice to be able to put a face to the name.
> It's nice to be able to get a little peak out the window at your garden too.


Hi Sweetheart, I was reluctant to post any pics because I have aged so much, these past few years. Honestly, it shocked me. You gave me the strength to do it.

G


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## Dollystanford

Hey OOB, love the photo!! :smthumbup:
although when it first comes up as a small pic it looks like you've blacked yourself out (like they do with the SAS ha ha)


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## bandit.45

I like the photo OOB! Sheesus you look like my math teacher from high school! Dead ringer!


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## warlock07

He was your math teacher. he relocated


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## cantmove

You haven't checked in lately. Hope all is good with you and your family.


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## OutOfTheBlue

cantmove said:


> You haven't checked in lately. Hope all is good with you and your family.


Thanks for asking cantmove. Things are going ok. I have been on lately but I seldom go past the pm's


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## OldGirl

Here's my postcard for you, Blue, from my camping trip.


This is in honor of your fellow Scotsman, John Muir, the "Father of the National Parks". He petitioned the US congress for the National Park bill that was passed in 1890, establishing both Yosimite and Sequoia National Parks.

Sure hope you're able to make it over here to see Yosimite someday.


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## OutOfTheBlue

OldGirl said:


> Here's my postcard for you, Blue, from my camping trip.
> 
> 
> This is in honor of your fellow Scotsman, John Muir, the "Father of the National Parks". He petitioned the US congress for the National Park bill that was passed in 1890, establishing both Yosimite and Sequoia National Parks.
> 
> Sure hope you're able to make it over here to see Yosimite someday.


Thank you so much OG, I love it, that was so sweet. I remember the discussion earlier in the thread about John Muir and his work to create the national parks. Thank God he did.

Oh, how I would love to visit Yosemite, Yellowstone, Kings Canyon, Redwood, Saguaro, Grand Teton and Sequoia and many, many more. I believe there are now over 50 national parks?


----------

