# If you stayed: How to get over the sex part?



## NatashaYurino (Jan 2, 2012)

I'm wondering about how those who chose to stay and give a second chance manage the fact that the sex their spouse/SO had with the OM/OW may have been better than what they have with you.

How do you get over the feeling that your spouse/SO might be comparing you to the OM/OW, specially when you have sex? 

How do you get over the feeling that there's no point in even trying anymore since the OM/OW already won because the sex they could give was made better by things you cannot give to your spouse/SO yourself, such as the feeling of novelty, variety and the naughtiness of doing something forbidden?

What did you do to get your self-esteem back? And how did your spouse/SO help you?

*I'd like to read answers from both men and women since I know both genders might have different issues when dealing with this subject. Answers from the unfaithful partners are welcomed also.*

Thank you.


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## SweetAndSour (Feb 25, 2012)

Sex is better in some occasions than other. It doesn't matter who is the partner much.

Monogamy is a bigger thing than just that. 

For a matching couple in monogamy, there is no OM/OW and comparison with other people.

And there is no second chance, when monogamy is broken, it is gone. 

If it comes to that, you have bigger problems than being a better focker than OW/OM.


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## Cletus (Apr 27, 2012)

I will not ask my wife this question, especially since the premise is in my case accurate.

I will presume to speak for her when I say she believes that she is overall the better complete package when everything is factored in - which is also true. Since she does not really care to be the best sex partner anyone could ever have, she is not unduly hurt by the fact that we both know for certain that she is not.


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## Bananapeel (May 4, 2015)

That's one of the reasons I didn't offer a reconciliation to my XW when she cheated. I knew that in her mind I couldn't compete with the OM because they had a secret relationship and everything was novel. I was a far better looking guy, in better shape, much more successful, far smarter, much bigger wiener, great husband/father, etc. and it didn't mean anything to her. If you think you can't compete then you are being truthful to yourself because it isn't the actual sex act that makes it better but the risk and excitement, and that is something you can't compete with. So your options are to accept your situation of being permanently in second place or dump the cheater and start over fresh with someone that you won't have that relationship baggage with. Either is fine as long as you are making an informed decision that you can live with.


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## SweetAndSour (Feb 25, 2012)

For my second answer to your question;

I was able to get over my Xwife's cheatings twice without much trouble.

Since from the beginning of our relationship with my Xwife, I was out of her league according to social standards, I was too good for her physically, socially and financially. She was deeply in love with me, and adored me, I liked her. It was enough for me for starts. She always had the sense of inadequacy in our relationship. For an example she was ashamed of her big but, but I liked that, she never got it.

During our marriage she had two affair partners which both were inferior to me. She quit her affairs when I become aware and pull the strings.

She was in repentent mode and threw her lovely BBW body in front of my penis.

I didn't care much about OMs.

Being better than OMs and too good for my X helped in that respect.

Much later I learned that It was not just two OM's. She was a psycho serial cheater while simultaneously deeply in love with me, go figure. Problem was much bigger than other men being better in sex than me.

She is my X now.


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## jorgegene (May 26, 2012)

my answer would be that you don't ever get over it. rather you learn to live with it.

that's about the best you can do. eventually real love and enough of it might lessen the hurt to the degree that you can enjoy it again.


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## Pepe1970 (Aug 25, 2017)

NatashaYurino said:


> I'm wondering about how those who chose to stay and give a second chance manage the fact that the sex their spouse/SO had with the OM/OW may have been better than what they have with you.
> 
> How do you get over the feeling that your spouse/SO might be comparing you to the OM/OW, specially when you have sex?
> 
> ...


I placed a post very similar to this one not long ago. 
"Mind of a cheating woman" 
I never got a straight answer, maybe because the guys here didn't want to bite my head with their honest point of views. Most of them concentrated in why to give second chances and some of them took a chunk from me based on that issue.
Anyway, in my opinion and personal experience with my wife is that she had the best satisfying sex ever with the OM, as she put it. 
And Probably the best she will ever have I add because competting with that, is a lost fight from the start.
Now the thing is that you need to make clear to the wayward spouse that you're not going to be jumping hoops for him/her in order to erase those memories from the affair.
I made my peace with that thought of competition to win her over.
I always find the way to retract when I find myself tempted to try to do better than the OM did.

Sent from my QMV7A using Tapatalk


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

NatashaYurino said:


> I'm wondering about how those who chose to stay and give a second chance manage the fact that the sex their spouse/SO had with the OM/OW may have been better than what they have with you.
> 
> How do you get over the feeling that your spouse/SO might be comparing you to the OM/OW, specially when you have sex?
> 
> ...


I think this is one of the reasons why I could not stay with a person who had cheated. I honestly don't think that I could ever have sex with them again. Something very special has gone and as you say, the thought that they were thinking of the om or ow when having sex with you would be awful. 
Adultery is so serious and has such far reaching consequences such as this. Thats why so many end the marriage. Its shattered beyond repair.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

Pepe1970 said:


> I placed a post very similar to this one not long ago.
> "Mind of a cheating woman"
> I never got a straight answer, maybe because the guys here didn't want to bite my head with their honest point of views. Most of them concentrated in why to give second chances and some of them took a chunk from me based on that issue.
> Anyway, in my opinion and personal experience with my wife is that she had the best satisfying sex ever with the OM, as she put it.
> ...


I honestly dont know how you can stay with a partner after they said to you.


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## She'sStillGotIt (Jul 30, 2016)

NatashaYurino said:


> I'm wondering about how those who chose to stay and give a second chance manage the fact that the sex their spouse/SO had with the OM/OW may have been better than what they have with you.


It's rarer than a blue moon when a cheater actually *admits* to their BS that the sex was better with their affair partner.

The standard reply most cheaters give is that the affair sex was just 'ok' or 'boring' or 'bad' or 'routine' or 'unremarkable,' but they did it anyway because they just liked the feeling of being _desired._  So yes, all 235 times they continually went BACK for more sex, it was all about their need to be _wanted_. 

And then they'll tell the BS that sex with them is SOOOOOOO much *better* than it was with their affair partner because they have that 'love connection' because they're married, and blah blah blah. With the cheesy lies they tell, cheaters should be used car salesmen.


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## Rocky Mountain Yeti (Apr 23, 2017)

Diana7 said:


> I honestly dont know how you can stay with a partner after they said to you.


Yep. That's a truly unrecoverable statement. No way making peace with that one. No where, no way, no how. There hasn't been a rocket built yet that could get me as far or as fast away from that relationship as I would have to get.


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## Rocky Mountain Yeti (Apr 23, 2017)

She'sStillGotIt said:


> It's rarer than a blue moon when a cheater actually *admits* to their BS that the sex was better with their affair partner.
> 
> The standard reply most cheaters give is that the affair sex was just 'ok' or 'boring' or 'bad' or 'routine' or 'unremarkable,' but they did it anyway because they just liked the feeling of being _desired._  So yes, all 235 times they continually went BACK for more sex, it was all about their need to be _wanted_.
> 
> And then they'll tell the BS that sex with them is SOOOOOOO much *better* than it was with their affair partner because they have that 'love connection' because they're married, and blah blah blah. With the cheesy lies they tell, cheaters should be used car salesmen.


They just end up being used relationship salesmen. And they are trying to sell you on repurchasing the exact same relationship they traded in in the first place! 

How twisted is that?


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## She'sStillGotIt (Jul 30, 2016)

Pepe1970 said:


> Anyway, in my opinion and personal experience with my wife is that she had the best satisfying sex ever with the OM, as she put it.


There must have been a blue moon recently. A cheater who actually told the _*truth*_?

I'm still reeling.

She sounds like a real keeper, Pepe. 

I'm sorry you don't feel worthy of being with someone who actually respects you. :frown2:


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## TJW (Mar 20, 2012)

NatashaYurino said:


> I'm wondering about how those who chose to stay and give a second chance manage the fact that the sex their spouse/SO had with the OM/OW may have been better than what they have with you.


I stayed, and tried to give the second chance. But I knew she compared, it came out of her own mouth, in a further effort to "blame" me for her affairs.

I didn't even consider the "limerence" effect. I didn't know anything about this at the time. I did consider "novelty", but it had no weight in my thoughts.

I had a very hard and long time to recover my self-esteem, and my WW did not help me in any way, fashion, or form. She was hell bent on convincing me that I "caused" her adultery.



RockyMountainYeti said:


> That's a truly unrecoverable statement.


Yes. It was. After a year and a half of "trying", I became a total "refuser", and I no longer "tried". It became f---- you, and the donkey of Ezekiel 23 you rode in on....


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

Bananapeel said:


> That's one of the reasons I didn't offer a reconciliation to my XW when she cheated. I knew that in her mind I couldn't compete with the OM because they had a secret relationship and everything was novel. I was a far better looking guy, in better shape, much more successful, far smarter, much bigger wiener, great husband/father, etc. and it didn't mean anything to her. If you think you can't compete then you are being truthful to yourself because it isn't the actual sex act that makes it better but the risk and excitement, and that is something you can't compete with. So your options are to accept your situation of being permanently in second place or dump the cheater and start over fresh with someone that you won't have that relationship baggage with. Either is fine as long as you are making an informed decision that you can live with.


It's like trying to play a game where the rules are not fair. What is the point.


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## Cletus (Apr 27, 2012)

Sorry, OP, you'll have to spend a bunch of time weeding out the topic challenged posters who would rather advance their "you shouldn't even bother" agenda rather than answer the question you actually posed.

Good luck.

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

The problem with this thinking is from any objective observer YOU are the one who is settling. NOT HER. Who cares about sex lets just talk about life. NO ONE would want a person like her as a spouse if they knew from the get go that this was what she would do. She is damaged and undesirable not you. 

I always feel bad for people who R but more so for the folks who somehow think they have to win over someone who really isn't worth the effort. Think of it she treated you like crap and you are trying to live up to her expectations? What is wrong with this picture? It reminds me of kids who used to be bullied in high school but still desperately tried to seek affirmation for the same kids that bully them. Makes no sense. 

Once your spouse cheats on you any thought of staying with them is always compromising your life in some way. They are not a prize you are, you are the best she is going to do at this point if she is going to live and honest life. She is lucky you stay with her. See her for who she really is and you won't care so much. She should be trying to live up to you, not the other way around. 

Truth is, I think if a BS really gets that they don't stay. Most of us post like this because we are objective observers and we get it and think it, not because we are mean. Your wife doesn't deserve your sex or anything else. That's just the truth, who cares if she is satisfied at this point. hopefully you will get this one day and then you will be free.


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

TJW said:


> Yes. It was. After a year and a half of "trying", I became a total "refuser", and I no longer "tried". It became f---- you, and the donkey of Ezekiel 23 you rode in on....


You became a healthy healed individual who was now thinking totally rational.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

Cletus said:


> Sorry, OP, you'll have to spend a bunch of time weeding out the topic challenged posters who would rather advance their "you shouldn't even bother" agenda rather than answer the question you actually posed.
> 
> Good luck.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk


Maybe we should lie and say it will all work out?


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## Cletus (Apr 27, 2012)

Diana7 said:


> Maybe we should lie and say it will all work out?


Or perhaps you should accept that it can work out, though not always nor perhaps even most of the time, and answer the poster's questions for how to proceed or, lacking useful input, move along. The poster wasn't asking the question "Should I do this", the specific question was "*If you stayed:* How to get over the sex part?" It's condescending to think that the poster doesn't realize that this is a difficult question, requiring input of the form "I couldn't do it - why should you?"

Every single time someone here tries to tackle reconciliation, the pile on from the "You need to accept that this just isn't possible" crowd fires up. Expand your imagination to those who place just as high a value on a marriage as you do AND have a greater capacity for forgiveness in the face of human frailty.


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## Married but Happy (Aug 13, 2013)

I am ambivalent about offering an opinion on this, since I haven't been in a cheating scenario where this is a concern. I do have a perspective from swinging, open relationships, and polyamory, though, that might apply in some way. First of all, sex is just one important dimension of a relationship, and exists in the context of everything else that is good and worth keeping - and things that are not good or simply adequate. Having had a great deal of sexual variety, I will say that some partners bring something special or extra in terms of sex (usually in some particular, but not overall), but may lack important traits in other areas. And even having that special sexual something doesn't mean that the overall experience is consistently better, and certainly doesn't mean any relationship with that person will be better than the primary relationship. If the primary relationship is fundamentally good, then some good sex with someone else has no real bearing or impact overall - or doesn't when cheating isn't involved, anyway. It's when the core relationship has many issues, then someone else being better in even one way may tip the balance.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

*God knows, I guess that I can deal with the physiology of their slick, slimy parts sliding in and out of each other in their insatiable quest for covert lust!

But what I absolutely cannot fathom and deal with are the lies, rampant deception and heartlessness that they exhibit to the person that they had previously pronounced their matrimonial vows to before God, Clergy, Family, Community, and more importantly, each other!*


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## Cletus (Apr 27, 2012)

NatashaYurino said:


> I'm wondering about how those who chose to stay and give a second chance manage the fact that the sex their spouse/SO had with the OM/OW may have been better than what they have with you.


Are you the best lover your spouse has ever had? The best conversationalist? Best raquetball player? Best everything?

Why does it not bother you that a previous relationship was a better musician, linguist, or romantic?

To successfully navigate the issue with sex, you should probably make sure that your partner has come to an understanding about why they strayed, especially if they did so specifically for sex. They need to do some significant and convincing soul searching to discover why they felt both driven and entitled to get it outside of the marriage, and why they now understand why that was a particularly bad solution to the problem. 

Now I'll say something that is not a popular position to take here - if you partner found better sex outside of the marriage, and it wasn't just NRE, then you have now been given the opportunity to become a better lover. If you were coasting before, or apathetic, or unskilled and uncaring, then you decide not to continue to be so in the future. 

And finally, as alluded to at the start, recognize that you may never be the best. We wasted hundreds of pages on that thread not long ago 'round here. If you absolutely, positively must be the best your spouse has ever had, then you'd better get really, really good at it or come to peace with accepting the lie you'll inevitably have to swallow.

Unless you married a virgin, there's already a pretty decent chance that your spouse has had better than you, even with no infidelity whatsoever. That's just the way it is.


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## TJW (Mar 20, 2012)

Cletus said:


> Why does it not bother you that a previous relationship was a better musician, linguist, or romantic?


Who says it doesn't ?


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

It helps to be arrogant!

I probably wouldn't reconcile but if I did, she would be pretty thoroughly disgusted with herself and any act she did with OM by the time I got done with negative reinforcement while making her spill on the details.

I also would be far more concerned about how she was performing for me and pleasing me.

I wouldn't have been the one to F up. She would be bending over backwards to knock my socks off and worshipping at my alter in the bedroom.

She would have something to prove, not me.

She would have shame to overcome, not me.

We would eventually get to more even ground but the wayward has the heavy lifting to do and that includes ponying up in the sex department.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

P.S. I am easily the best lover my wife has ever had.

Hard to beat 27 years of exclusive experience and hard work.


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

In first marriage, I sort of had the arrogant attitude and that allowed me to continue. She was humble and willing to put out. 


The issues I would have today are not the same as then. The divorce laws have changed. No one really has a right to be superior and controlling, even if that is what it takes. Those demands can be taken to court and used against a husband. I think that is a reason why many won't encourage reconciliation.

On, the other hand, it takes that kind of attitude and actions from the BS to get the job done. If the WS is truly sorry and remorseful, they will allow for quite a bit of penance, where a self-righteous WS will not. 

Being the WS is a consummate liar, I'd have a tough time believing, even with remorsefulness present. 

Some folks can forget easily and some cannot. 

Some BS' want to forget, but friends and relatives who helped will never forget. Reconciliation is not just between spouses, but relatives, children, in laws, and friends or former friends, church groups, organizations and on and on. It's as life changing as divorce.


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## Spoons027 (Jun 19, 2017)

I'm in the camp that says you find a way to live with it and accept it. It may take a lot of therapy and possibly introspection on whether you can live with that info for the rest of your life, but to me, I think it's more about accepting it happened rather than getting over it and going from there.


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## rv10flyer (Apr 26, 2018)

NatashaYurino said:


> I'm wondering about how those who chose to stay and give a second chance manage the fact that the sex their spouse/SO had with the OM/OW may have been better than what they have with you.
> The need to know about sexual frequency, oral sex, orgasms, and sexual attributes of the OM disappears with the passage of time. I bet I am better at certain techniques, but we do not play the compare game.
> 
> How do you get over the feeling that your spouse/SO might be comparing you to the OM/OW, specially when you have sex? We did not and will not discuss their sexual experiences. What good would it do us. She was with me for many other reasons for 29 yrs, not just the sex.
> ...


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## hurts-so-bad (Jun 30, 2017)

NatashaYurino said:


> I'm wondering about how those who chose to stay and give a second chance manage the fact that the sex their spouse/SO had with the OM/OW may have been better than what they have with you.
> 
> How do you get over the feeling that your spouse/SO might be comparing you to the OM/OW, specially when you have sex?
> 
> ...


The simple answer is, you never do. I asked every Dr. I could, "what is the magic pill?" What is the magic saying that stops these mind movies and torture and after a year, 3 months and 9 days, there is nothing. This is the worst thing someone could do to somebody.


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## Rocky Mountain Yeti (Apr 23, 2017)

Cletus said:


> Or perhaps you should accept that it can work out, though not always nor perhaps even most of the time, and answer the poster's questions for how to proceed or, lacking useful input, move along. The poster wasn't asking the question "Should I do this", the specific question was "*If you stayed:* How to get over the sex part?" It's condescending to think that the poster doesn't realize that this is a difficult question, requiring input of the form "I couldn't do it - why should you?"
> 
> Every single time someone here tries to tackle reconciliation, the pile on from the "You need to accept that this just isn't possible" crowd fires up. Expand your imagination to those who place just as high a value on a marriage as you do AND have a greater capacity for forgiveness in the face of human frailty.


Well, that's a yes and a no.

In general, there are posters who line up to wail about the foolishness of reconciliation regardless of India ideal desires and unique circumstances. So in general, you make a good point.

But in this specific case, given what was said and continues to be said, the unique circumstances presented here don't le d themselves to successfully reconciliation. As long as the wayward maintains the position that sex was far better with the AP, this is no longer about forgiveness or human frailty. 

The real bottom line here is that, while advice may help "getting very the sex part" the reality is that getting over it may be the worst thing to do... again, in this particular case. It's not a function of "I didn't or couldn't R, so neither should you," but rather your your special circumstances make it inadvisable. Even granting forgiveness and making allowance for human frailty doesn't require remaining in a sham marriage as a prerequisite.


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## Rocky Mountain Yeti (Apr 23, 2017)

Cletus said:


> Are you the best lover your spouse has ever had? The best conversationalist? Best raquetball player? Best everything?
> 
> Why does it not bother you that a previous relationship was a better musician, linguist, or romantic?
> 
> ...


Two things. First, speaking generally, those other things are not intimate things. They are things we can do with anybody. It is a false equivalency to throw sex into the same bucket with them. Second, specific to this situation, the wayward said sex with the AP was far, far better. This is a particularly huge gulf that is not so easily bridged. And we all know sex is not just mechanics, the quality is greatly impacted by the emotional connection as well. This speaks not only to the breadth of the gap. But the breadth ascwell.


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## UpsideDownWorld11 (Feb 14, 2018)

In my opinion, the sex is the hammer blow that shatters the marriage. But, the rest just compounds the problem. They went shopping for the hammer, chose the shiny new hammer, and brought the hammer home even though the old, trusty hammer had never failed them. Maybe they left the hammer to watch after the nails under false pretenses while he/she was out hammering with her new shiny hammer behind old hammers back.

Ok, I'll stop with the hammer metaphors. I just think it's just the compounded effect of infidelity that just makes it a losing battle most of the time. The sex is just the death blow.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

Cletus said:


> Or perhaps you should accept that it can work out, though not always nor perhaps even most of the time, and answer the poster's questions for how to proceed or, lacking useful input, move along. The poster wasn't asking the question "Should I do this", the specific question was "*If you stayed:* How to get over the sex part?" It's condescending to think that the poster doesn't realize that this is a difficult question, requiring input of the form "I couldn't do it - why should you?"
> 
> Every single time someone here tries to tackle reconciliation, the pile on from the "You need to accept that this just isn't possible" crowd fires up. Expand your imagination to those who place just as high a value on a marriage as you do AND have a greater capacity for forgiveness in the face of human frailty.


Its not about forgiveness, its about what a devastating and permanent effect that an affair has on the sex life and intimacy and that wont be forgotten and often cant be resolved which is why in many cases the marriage ends.


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## TJW (Mar 20, 2012)

Diana7 said:


> Its not about forgiveness, its about what a devastating and permanent effect that an affair has on the sex life and intimacy and that wont be forgotten and often cant be resolved which is why in many cases the marriage ends.


I've heard stories about how people have "better" marriages after an affair. I can understand how this may be, if the affair "wakes up" BOTH partners and causes both of them to seek help for the issues which preceded the affair. 

There are many aspects of marriage. I cannot imagine that sex improved, but possibly some of the other issues. I think sex could not possibly improve, and most likely, would get worse.


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## Taxman (Dec 21, 2016)

I keep going back to one of my earliest divorces. She had the affair, and it was like she had driven a stake through his testes. They attempted reconciliation, and the hysterical bonding waned within a few days. He was in his forties, and had never suffered ED in his life. They first went the route of prescriptions. Within a week, his erections were non-existent. Nothing was working. (I got this from the husband, who remained a client) He was frustrated beyond belief, as something else cropped up, morning wood. He was waking up with erections. He could masturbate to orgasm. The minute, she got within a few feet of him, the erection disappeared. They enlisted the help of a sex therapist. Tried exercise after exercise to no avail. The suggestion was made by the therapist to see what effect another partner would have. They hired a call girl, and he was fully functional. They tried again. Nope. She invited another woman into the bedroom, and had a front row seat watching her husband enjoy the hell out of her best girlfriend, the minute his wife touched his arm, his erection collapsed. He literally screamed at her in frustration. That was the end. She started calling herself his kryptonite. They divorced soon afterward. He is remarried, and living a nice comfortable life, his new wife is a nice and pretty woman. The ex wife is not having a good time of it. She has been in therapy for years now, trying to understand what made her destroy a man that never did a wrong thing, or said a cross word to her. She is deeply depressed, and has difficulty in social situations. She has remained alone as I think she is terrified of having another relationship.


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## TJW (Mar 20, 2012)

I wanted to "like" your post, but I was moved by the pain and hurt that these people feel now, and couldn't quite bring myself to say "like", but I do like your post in it's information and thanks for bringing an "outsider" view.....



Taxman said:


> She has been in therapy for years now, trying to understand what made her destroy a man that never did a wrong thing, or said a cross word to her.


Really? The innocent always "pay" for the guilty. It has been ritualized over millennia, and in the central event of history. 

How hard can it really be for her to understand, that her own damnable selfishness, depravity, entitlement, and lust are the "fault" here ?

Shouldn't the venerable lyrics be given a small adjustment ?

There IS a good guy,
There IS a bad guy,
There's only you, and me....


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## Rocky Mountain Yeti (Apr 23, 2017)

Taxman said:


> it was like she had driven a stake through his testes.


Weeeeelllll....... thanks for the most brutal visual that will pop into my mind all week!


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## Cletus (Apr 27, 2012)

TJW said:


> I've heard stories about how people have "better" marriages after an affair. I can understand how this may be, if the affair "wakes up" BOTH partners and causes both of them to seek help for the issues which preceded the affair.
> 
> There are many aspects of marriage. I cannot imagine that sex improved, but possibly some of the other issues. I think sex could not possibly improve, and most likely, would get worse.


No time to post details right now, but you are wrong. Sex was the source of or issues, and it did improve after. 

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk


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## Bananapeel (May 4, 2015)

OP, the questions you are posing are coming from a lack of confidence on your part. It's normal to have your confidence shattered post infidelity but if you can gain it back you won't care what he did with her or how it was because your internal focus will change. To regain your confidence you need to focus on yourself and doing things that make you happy and fulfil your vision of what you want to accomplish (personal goals/relationships/physical fitness/work/finances/etc.) in your life rather than being dependent on another for your happiness. Maybe read some books on co-dependency and implement some strategies from them? 

As I said on page 1, I never tried to reconcile with my wife after her affair. But having been with other women since her I can tell you that I have never once asked how their other lovers were or what they did because I don't really care. I just care about whether we have a mutually satisfying sex life and if not I'll find someone better. That's what confidence looks like...basically you care about your relationship in the moment rather than focusing on past relationships between others that are out of your control. If I ever was dating a woman that compared me unfavorably to another man I'd leave without a second thought.


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## Taxman (Dec 21, 2016)

TJW said:


> How hard can it really be for her to understand, that her own damnable selfishness, depravity, entitlement, and lust are the "fault" here ?


I was doing their tax work for a while before the "incidents", as she referred to them. I came to the conclusion, well before there were therapists involved, that she had problems with boundaries, and, what I consider a death knell for relationships, she was looking for approval from outsiders. It mattered little to her, before she screwed up, what he thought of her. She felt that he HAD to be nice to her, and in her screwed up mind, resented it, as she thought it was false. Their d-day caught me by surprise. He kicked her to the curb. Devastated her world, in anger and frustration. He could not understand, as she did everything correctly and NOTHING indicated that she was carrying on a completely different life. Then, he saw the texts, and the use of the company suite during lunch. The guy was nothing special. He was married as well. So, dday encompassed just about every vengeful act one could imagine. He was good. The AP and the WW were not only fired, their company successfully sued to recover some false hotel claims. The AP lost his marriage, and his separation alone was draconian to a great extent. He is virtually penniless. She was struggling for a long time to find a job. Her next position was out of her field and at 70% of what she used to get. She got religion PDQ. He kept her at arms length for awhile, and then the HB fizzled in a very short period of time. That was really the end, although now, he says that his one three way in his life, was really a two way, and his wife sat at the end of the bed looking thoroughly crestfallen while her best GF and her husband were having some really good sex. He said he looked into his wife's eyes while he was having vigorous sex with her girlfriend. He saw her reaction, and knew that his marriage was done. He said that he saw the deepest sadness wash across her face, and it did not matter to him. It was at that moment that the realization that she was the cause of this washed over both of them.


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## *Deidre* (Feb 7, 2016)

If it were to happen in my marriage, I think there would always be this part of me that was now rating as second place, or something. Like he doesn't really want to be with me, but out of fear, divorce, and all that, he would be coming back to me, but still have his mind on the OW. I know there are some situations where these things work out and reconciliation is possible, but it always seems like something forced the WS back. They didn't end the affairs on their own, they were threatened to end them, or they felt threatened, and so they come back to the marriage afraid of a divorce, but not really wanting their marriage partner. Just what I've noticed from threads I've read here, and stories I hear.


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

The affair sex my old lady had was painful to learn about , but the lies were even more painful, IDK why it wasn't a deal breaker for me.

So let me type this out and see if you fine folks can make heads or tails of my …..rant.

#1 gut feeling why.....is I have had many chick before M and my old lady has had a few guys...but no more then me but maybe a little less. We both started young so by our late teens we both and at least 1/2 dozen....me...almost a dozen.

#2 during the affairs. M sex was never a problem. Me both initiated and being young still...it just was something we both liked even if we couldn't see eye to eye on other aspects of the young M.

#3 at about the 7th year of M alls we had was sex, the other stuff like talking, caring and just being intimate was just not part of the M. take care of the kids, work, drink, and phuck.(screw).


#4 from the 8th to the 19th yr of M we even became more distant. She did her thing. I did mine. At the end of the day as long as the kids were cared for, my penis was cared for...then the rest didn't matter much (to me). Again she had her thing. I had my thing. I was so in love with working and she just took care of the kids and partied....

Her parties were with other moms with kids the same ages, so the MO was "take care of my kids while I screw around and I'll take your kids while you screw around".


#5 at the very least I did keep my head in the sand as long as I was still getting laid and when I was done with my old lady she stayed out of my way.

#6 the reality was I just didn't care!


After typing out all this crap I believe the thing is. While I was getting BJ. Anal while slapping my old lady on the butt the whole time.....the OM was the guy holding her hand, kissing her and saying what she wanted to hear.

So to sum it up all these OM's were getting affair sex as currency my old lady paid to feel wanted.

And ya screwing my old lady before she went out for her "girls night out" was me just using her, but again this whole M was set up to fail from the start, it was all sex based. I have realized that taking my wife the way I did was just me getting mine before some other guy. And her putting out was just her way of reliefing her guilt while she gave some strange sloppy seconds. At the end of the day it was all toxic behavior mixed in with codependencies and crap we faced as really young kids.... we both found our way to escape.


The good news is we both got help, even though I never cheated I have my issues (duh)……

My old lady could have left me for any number of guys, but even with me pushing her away and pushing her around, she......hell if I know.... but we are still together.
Kids have great jobs and married good spouses that come from good stock. LOL


In short 2010 was a turning point in the M and again sex is the glue that keeps us banging "only" each other....but these days we also spend more time holding hands and kissing and only after that do I spit in my hand and reach down her panties.

Sorry folks....you guys get the jest to this post. It was the lies, not the sex that I think about 8 yrs later....I'm just wired different then most!

BTW 
We both got an STD in Jr High, 5 yrs before we even met.....(just to give you perspective on what side of the tracks we both came from).


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

Just to follow up...My last post will never make you feel any better about the betrayal your SO did.
It was solely my perspective....writing down my thoughts of shyt that happened to me yrs ago.
I can read the pain many have when I read "he/she was my one and only" or "we were each others first".


Again just adding another perspective from the other side of the tracks kind of post.


I wish you all the best in your healing.


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## BluesPower (Mar 27, 2018)

Cletus said:


> Or perhaps you should accept that it can work out, though not always nor perhaps even most of the time, and answer the poster's questions for how to proceed or, lacking useful input, move along. The poster wasn't asking the question "Should I do this", the specific question was "*If you stayed:* How to get over the sex part?" It's condescending to think that the poster doesn't realize that this is a difficult question, requiring input of the form "I couldn't do it - why should you?"
> 
> Every single time someone here tries to tackle reconciliation, the pile on from the "You need to accept that this just isn't possible" crowd fires up. Expand your imagination to those who place just as high a value on a marriage as you do AND have a greater capacity for forgiveness in the face of human frailty.


The problem I have with your take on this is this: YOU sound completely and totally unhappy that you stayed in your marriage. If I am wrong correct me. 

Also, sometimes it is better to just tell people the truth, even if they don't want to hear it. Yes, it is our version of the truth, but it is truth as far as we are concerned. 

I did not really even divorce my wife for he affairs, I divorced her because she was just a horrible person that I was a fool to ever stay with as long as I did. 

I was never threatened by her affairs (2) sexually, I was a better man, and better in bed than anyone she ever slept with. Hell, I had to teach her what her clit was for when we got married. 

It was the disrespect, that is the killer. Once she was gone, I never looked back. 

My Ex is not half of the women that my GF is, and my GF is older than her and 10 times better in bed than she ever was. You know, all of the women that I have been with were better than her, because they were not her...


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## I shouldnthave (Apr 11, 2018)

I haven't read any responses yet.

But honestly? Perhaps I have an ego the size of Texas, but none of that ever crossed my mind.

I am still convinced I am the cat's meow when it comes to acts of passion, and I always knew it was all about him, not me.

Now, I have also been a WW, how did he get over it, what went through his mind. I can only go off of what he told me, and his actions. But I think talking about it honestly helped, and I was more than willing to live out any fantasy he suggested.


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

@BluesPower….Can't like your post twice so ((((high five))))


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## I shouldnthave (Apr 11, 2018)

ConanHub said:


> It helps to be arrogant!
> 
> I probably wouldn't reconcile but if I did, she would be pretty thoroughly disgusted with herself and any act she did with OM by the time I got done with negative reinforcement while making her spill on the details.
> 
> ...


This is spot on, although I have always been higher drive than my husband, so putting out was never an issue.... But his wish is my command - and tell ya the truth I like it that way.

For some, like people contemplate here, I am sure their sex lives can never recover.

Ours keeps getting better and better, it's better than it has ever been.


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## Cletus (Apr 27, 2012)

BluesPower said:


> The problem I have with your take on this is this: YOU sound completely and totally unhappy that you stayed in your marriage. If I am wrong correct me.


Me? No, I am not unhappy that I stayed. I would honestly say that if I knew 35 years ago what I know today, I would probably choose a different route - just to avoid all of the headache. But that's not the same as saying that I wish I had ended it after 20 years Time Served, with kids and a life. 

I am glad that we reconciled. Our sex life is better than it was before. And yeah, that's partly because having a one night stand for sex outside of your marriage can be a pretty clear Wake Up Call to your partner. One I don't recommend, but still...

My wife is a better wife than she was before. I am a better husband. We are a better couple. A divorce would have cost us the opportunity to discover our older, more mature, more dedicated selves. 



> Also, sometimes it is better to just tell people the truth, even if they don't want to hear it. Yes, it is our version of the truth, but it is truth as far as we are concerned.


Fair enough, but there are objectively a couple of posters here whose entire reason for existence on this forum seems to be to try to talk people out of even considering reconciling, because _they_ couldn't possibly imagine doing it. Since they cannot imagine it, it must not be doable, or wise, or reasonable. 

Fine. That's the right answer for some. And the wrong answer for others - especially the ones who are asking a question that does not start with "should I" but rather "how do I". Telling people what they should do is risky business. Telling them what they can do, if they so desire, is so much more useful.


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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

ConanHub said:


> P.S. I am easily the best lover my wife has ever had.
> 
> 
> 
> Hard to beat 27 years of exclusive experience and hard work.




We all would love to write our own reviews 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

inmyprime said:


> We all would love to write our own reviews
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Like I said, it helps to be arrogant.:grin2:

And right.


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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

I shouldnthave said:


> This is spot on, although I have always been higher drive than my husband, so putting out was never an issue.... But his wish is my command - and tell ya the truth I like it that way.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




All this talk...Makes me a little jealous. Maybe I should suggest a little extramarital  -action to my wife. I could do with a little bit of old-fashioned altar worshipping at my feet right now.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Haiku (Apr 9, 2014)

NatashaYurino said:


> How do you get over the feeling that your spouse/SO might be comparing you to the OM/OW, specially when you have sex?


My former wife had partners before me so I figured there’s always the possibility any partner will make some comparison but I never gave it much value. I did my best to express my love, loyalty, and devotion through my words and daily actions. 

I’m not even close to the most educated, successful, attractive, or the best at intimacy. I loved her very much and with my warts and all think I’m a decent person. As it turned out I wasn’t exactly what she was looking for in life. The infidelity repeated a couple more times and then we amicably ended our marriage. 

I believe she’s happy in aspects of her life today and not as happy as she could be in others. Lol, that describes everyone though. I think that she’s happy she isn’t cheating anymore because living in the dark takes its toll on a decent person too. 

I’m content in life and don’t beat myself up over her wanting someone else not me. 

I hope you find peace with what you’re are struggling with.


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## SweetAndSour (Feb 25, 2012)

the guy said:


> The affair sex my old lady had was painful to learn about , but the lies were even more painful, IDK why it wasn't a deal breaker for me.
> 
> So let me type this out and see if you fine folks can make heads or tails of my …..rant.
> 
> ...



The Guy, I appreciate your contribution.

I find some similarities in your experience and mine. Except that I never knowingly let my wife go out and fock other guys. But like you, I was continued to be her main man in her eyes and was sexually served by her during her escapades.

After her first affair, We were back in a month and I was not moved emotionally much as the result of what she did.

That is different than cuckoldery. It was the result of the value that she had in my life, she didn't worth much for me, before or after her affair then. 

In that kind of dynamics, You don't care much about the OMs or the quality of sex they have.

It is very easy to get over the sex part of their affair when you don't care. It is still sick and doesn't help to create a better relationship.

Later she destroyed my life and harmed my kids tremendously but that doesn't belong to this thread.


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## TAMAT (Jun 20, 2015)

I shouldn'thave, wrote in reference to her affair *But I think talking about it honestly helped.*

That's what many betrayed spouses never get and what keeps them in limbo until they die, divorce or give up. 

The affair does not end until the truth is told. Otherwise it is just a continuation of the state of dishonesty which enabled the affair in the first place. 

I know the why of my WWs affairs, which I actually don't care about, but not the what happened sexually.

Tamat


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

TAMAT said:


> I shouldn'thave, wrote in reference to her affair *But I think talking about it honestly helped.*
> 
> That's what many betrayed spouses never get and what keeps them in limbo until they die, divorce or give up.
> 
> ...


The wayward quickly learns how to manipulate the BS. They figure they can tell believable lies. Many times the BS does believe. How can the BS ever be sure of the truth? I think it would be difficult. I feel like there is too much respect lost. Why would a wayward need to tell the whole truth? I don't think they ever will. I think that loss of respect is a particularly difficult issue to get over.

Edit: My guess is, that's what needs worked on. Respect must be earned to be worthwhile.


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

Once I buried my head in the sand it got really easy to lose respect for WW. Once the respect is gone my old lady was nothing more then a belly warmer. 


And granted...my old lady lost respect for a husband who didn't care if she was home or not, it was safe to say respect was lost all the way around.


Once both spouses stop caring any thing can happen and usually does.


Never really thought of my self as a cuckold, but more of a wife beating rapist who back in 2009 didn't like what I had become. A few years later my old lady didn't like who she became so we both hit the reset button in our personal life and our M.


So lets just say getting over her A sex was not as much as an issue as fixing my self and it was up to my old lady to keep up or get out after realizing the life I was living was going to but me back in county or even worse state.

I think many BS live a quality life and command respect but just don't get respect from their WS and that's a hard bill to swallow as a BS and the willingness to start screwing their WS again.

I think it's the BS that loses the respect for the WS. I think it's why getting over the A sex is so hard for many BS.


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## bigfoot (Jan 22, 2014)

This sex thing really has multiple layers. Men cannot really grasp the physical aspect from a woman's perspective nor a woman a man's.

Porn has also skewed things. I see so many post from betrayed men about "porn star" sex they think their wife had. Oddly, porn stars don't have porn sex in their private lives. Crazy positions?! Think leg cramp. All of that athletic stuff is for athletic folks. If you watch enough amateur porn, and I have, you will see that it is pretty simplistic. Maybe speed, or duration, but in the end, it is the old in and out...friction.

Big ****s are not every woman's thing. Some like the cervix hit some do not. Having hit my share, I can say that those who don't REALLY don't. Again, porn screwed with your mind.

Just banging and getting an orgasm is actually hard for a lot of women. Comfort, feelings, and a whole lot of stuff matters. Many women enjoy the closeness. I don't get it, but I can tell you that being willing to cuddle or talk or just hold a woman has opened more...um...legs than seeing a bulge in my pants. 

Truthfully, I got more play by getting in a woman's mind than anything. My point, as a dude, you cannot understand sex from a woman's perspective and you are getting hung up on your mind movies.

Believe me, if good **** was THAT awesome, she would have left you the moment she got it. Same for men. If the Pu$$y was that awesome, they'd leave.

I have never had sex so awesome that i would base a relationship on it. In the beginning, it was awesome. It was new. The first time I ate McDonald's, my mind was blown. Now, I will eat it as a last resort. Check out the show Master of None. I think season 2. The lead has wild sex with his woman and they are both blown away. Then, later, not so much.

It hurst, you feel like you cannot compete, like they are fantasizing about AP, or comparing you and saying, well at least he cares for me, so I will sacrifice sex for pitiful old BH. Stop. The big issue is they cheated. Good ****, big ****, awesome ****, limp ****, small ****, bad sex, in the end they cheated. For me, that is the issue. If the **** was good enough to betray me or not worth betraying me, gtfo.


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## Vinnydee (Jan 4, 2016)

Cheated on twice and never stayed. How could I believe someone who is a proven liar? How do I trust someone who has proven untrustworthy? I would have forever been suspicious every time she was away from me or change her routine, etc.. She would eventually get tired of my suspicions and accusations which may drive her to cheat again. You can forgive but never forget. 

Turns out that both times it was good that I left. My ex fiancé went on to cheat on her husband and then marry a woman. She also developed mental problems due go becoming a drug addict. The second one ended up as a prostitute to pay for her crack addiction and had a crack baby. Had I stayed with them my life would not be as great as it has been or allowed me to meet my wife of 46 years.

Do you want a wife who will run into the arms of another man every time you have an argument with her, do not show her enough attention, or drinks where there are guys around? If yes then stay with her. I read an article written but several Psychologist who said that unless the cheating spouse takes 100% responsibility for their cheating and does not make it seem like you drove them to do it, blame alcohol or minimize what they did by making it seem that they did not do all the sexual things that they did, the changes of them not cheating again is slim.


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## TJW (Mar 20, 2012)

One Eighty said:


> I have anger toward him for this but also for my WS for willingly putting me into this position of humiliation and ridicule.


My DW and I both are survivors of cheating spouses. We told each other before marriage that it would be "...one strike, you're out...", there would be no counselors, pastors, therapists, etc.... and no possibility of reconciliation.....EVER....


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

the guy said:


> Once I buried my head in the sand it got really easy to lose respect for WW. Once the respect is gone my old lady was nothing more then a belly warmer.
> 
> 
> And granted...my old lady lost respect for a husband who didn't care if she was home or not, it was safe to say respect was lost all the way around.
> ...



Oddly enough, it's been said abuse is about control. Yet, you say it didn't bother you that she who many believe is an abuser's "property", was "allowed" to give the most intimate gift she could give to you... to others. It always strikes me as confusing. 

Didn't mean to derail the thread. It just caught me off guard to realize that.


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

TJW said:


> My DW and I both are survivors of cheating spouses. We told each other before marriage that it would be "...one strike, you're out...", there would be no counselors, pastors, therapists, etc.... and no possibility of reconciliation.....EVER....


How did you bring yourself to believe her? 

How did you allow yourself to trust her? 

I know she isn't the person who betrayed your trust.


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## rv10flyer (Apr 26, 2018)

2ntnuf said:


> How did you bring yourself to believe her?
> 
> How did you allow yourself to trust her?
> 
> I know she isn't the person who betrayed your trust.


Which is one reason I wanted to R with my wife as long as she was remorseful. We also have teenage children. At 40+ years of age, your new woman or man is most likely not a virgin, many have seen them naked, and 50-75% have cheated before. Of course most are not going to admit that they have cheated to their new lovers. It would not matter who I chose to be with, I would not trust them. Anyone is vulnerable for an affair under the right circumstances. If one thinks otherwise, they are fooling themselves. As far as AFFAIR SEX...It is the best out there. It just does not last and the reason why few AP’s ever stay together long term.


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

rv10flyer said:


> Which is one reason I wanted to R with my wife as long as she was remorseful. We also have teenage children. At 40+ years of age, your new woman or man is most likely not a virgin, many have seen them naked, and 50-75% have cheated before. Of course most are not going to admit that they have cheated to their new lovers. It would not matter who I chose to be with, I would not trust them. Anyone is vulnerable for an affair under the right circumstances. If one thinks otherwise, they are fooling themselves. As far as AFFAIR SEX...It is the best out there. It just does not last and the reason why few AP’s ever stay together long term.


Man, I hate to agree with this. It's very cynical, but I think there is quite a bit of common sense in your post. 


I knew this before my second wife left. I tried very hard to tell her, but she would not or could not understand. Now, she's probably living as we lived before she went wild. It was calm and peaceful. We talked. We did things together and though one might not have been extremely interested in the activity, we still had fun because it wasn't bad and it was nice to see the partner smile and be happy. That all changed. I wish I understood why... oh well. No sense in thinking about what might have been. Waste of life and time.

I wonder if that's another reason why men don't want to get too attached? I think so.


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## TJW (Mar 20, 2012)

2ntnuf said:


> How did you bring yourself to believe her?
> 
> How did you allow yourself to trust her?
> 
> I know she isn't the person who betrayed your trust.


Yes, she isn't the same person who did that, and I'm not the one who did it to her. But she and I have a common experience. We both KNOW how painful it is to be the BS. If either one of us were to cheat, after having KNOWN that, it would point to extreme moral turpitude and the phrase "depraved indifference" is pretty descriptive.

Both of us recognize that we will not allow ourselves to go through that again. Neither one of us is going to even try to salvage, reconcile, etc....because we both tried this, failed, and got nothing but emotional torture.

If one of us so totally disrespects the other so as to commit adultery, there's nothing to stay for.


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## UpsideDownWorld11 (Feb 14, 2018)

rv10flyer said:


> 2ntnuf said:
> 
> 
> > How did you bring yourself to believe her?
> ...


There is no sure way to know. But I have come to realize there are good bets and there are bad bets. I always knew my XW was a bad bet, I just hated to admit it. 

Trust once broken is very hard to regain. Betrayal, no way. Some things just can't be made whole again once broken
Once I started over I eventually found someone with the moral foothold that I can trust. And like you, I trust almost no one. 

Maybe I'm a fool, but I'm willing to wager I'm not this time around (I wouldn't have put a dime on my the last black mare). If this one fails me, I would be utterly shocked and probabaly will go all MGTOW. But I dont think all people are the same and unless your picker is broken, its up to you to choose wisely. With a trained eye, you can usually spot the morally bankrupt .


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## daisygirl 41 (Aug 5, 2011)

You get over it. The sex with the AP isn't better it's just different. 5 years down the line I go weeks without thinking about it. You've just got to let it go if you truly want to move on


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## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

UpsideDownWorld11 said:


> With a trained eye, you can usually spot the morally bankrupt .


Yes you can.

The easiest ones to spot are those who don't live by the standards they hold others to.


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## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

One Eighty said:


> Good post. It reinforces what I said about getting over this or in my case NOT getting over it. For me its not so much whether or not the WS liked the sex, its that they let themselves be intimate with another person, while with me. I was the one entitled to see her naked, touch her naked body, no one else. Once that barrier was crossed all else is just minor additional details. Somewhat adding to the pain but really the line that mattered most to me was crossed long before the penis went into the vagina.
> 
> One other thing about this that bothers me, is the other guy. Not just the WS but the other guy. I can't get past the fact some other dude, had my wife, knows what she looks like naked and touched her all over. Knowing she was married. I can't stand the thought of him out there in the world living large like nothing happened and having good memories of doing things with my WS that only I was supposed to be able to do. Perhaps bragging to his buddys. Perhaps laughing at how he fooled me. I have anger toward him for this but also for my WS for willingly putting me into this position of humiliation and ridicule.


On very limited occasion I have played with a very limited number of other married women, when I wasn't married to them following the dissolution of my first marriage.

I certainly didn't pursue them or encourage them to be with me, yet they did want me and the way I saw it and see it. Is that they are entitled to have sex with whomever they like. Plus and more significantly if they don't respect their own marital vows, I feel no obligation to respect them either.

At the same time as holding that belief, I have never cheated on any of my sexual partners despite plentiful offers (especially when I was younger).

It's not the other men and women that I worry about, it's those who promise fidelity yet choose to not honour their promises and cheat with others that worry me. If married people chose not to cheat, their would simply be no "other" men and women.

That said knowing that they were married and or finding out that they were married, did see me stop what we were doing in most all instances.

If it's any consolation I never bragged about such experiences, I never had anything that wasn't enthusiastically offered, wanted or enjoyed. I fooled no one, I didn't hide anything, I didn't knowingly participate in subterfuge. I also didn't/don't laugh about it and do not feel those other men are lesser beings for having wives who sought sex elsewhere. In fact their husbands were not a consideration to me at all. I didn't do anything to them or have anything that wasn't enthusiastically and consensually offered and shared. I just enjoyed what was offered.

That said having been cheated on in my first marriage, I also have no problem with the other guy. Since he made no promises to me, therefore he owed me nothing, and he certainly didn't partake in anything that wasn't freely and enthusiastically offered by my ex-wife.

My ex-wife was the one who betrayed me, who cheated, who willingly had sex with the other guy despite her promise of sexual fidelity to me. She is the one who chose to hurt me. The other guy who made no promises to me, simply availed himself of the opportunity.

As a consequence of that I took my hurt and redirected it solely towards my ex-wife, since she was the only person responsible for her egregious betrayal.

So I dumped her and moved on since her actions made her opportunity to be with me forfeit.

Which was far easier than trying to sleep with the enemy who knifed me in the back. While telling myself the lie that it was the other guys fault that she chose to knife me, and that she was a victim of innocent happenstance.

As to entitlement, even though I am married to my 2nd wife I do not feel I have an entitlement to her body sexually (she is not my property). Amongst other things we are together because she chooses to share sex with me frequently. On the other hand if she chooses to infrequently share sex with me or never share sex with me, I will replace her with others who will. Likewise if she has sex with others without my informed consent, and I find out about it I will also replace her.

Although this may seem a callous perspective, I don't care if other people cheat on their sexual partners. All I care about is that my sexual partners don't cheat on me. As a consequence of not wanting my sexual partners to cheat on me, I do not ever cheat on them.

If no-one cheated on their sexual partners in a sexual relationship, there would simply be no sexual infidelity.


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

Personal said:


> On very limited occasion I have played with a very limited number of other married women, when I wasn't married to them following the dissolution of my first marriage.
> 
> I certainly didn't pursue them or encourage them to be with me, yet they did want me and the way I saw it and see it. Is that they are entitled to have sex with whomever they like. Plus and more significantly if they don't respect their own marital vows, I feel no obligation to respect them either.
> 
> ...


Gross.


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## UpsideDownWorld11 (Feb 14, 2018)

One Eighty said:


> The married AP in my case, definitely put a ton of pressure on my WS to get her to do his bidding. He was a repeat offender, a very skilled player. After Dday, WS showed me the evidence of his hot pursuit of her. He then continued to pursue her for 6 more years post Dday. Even put a GPS tracker on her car to get to her. And I know for a fact that he bragged about his prior conquests before my WS, so why not brag about having gotten her? He also participated in the subterfuge of course. Being an experainced cheater, he knew a lot of tricks to tell my WS on how to keep it secret.
> 
> This is why people get killed sometime over affairs.


Sure, but your WS was the gate-keeper. You have to resign yourself to the fact that there is always going to be someone who tries to get in if she is reasonably attractive (by that I mean she doesn't have 3 heads). Don't get me wrong I think anyone that takes part in an extramarital affair knowingly is a morally corrupt human being. But my fight was never with the AP, hell he did me a favor, I divorced a worthless wife without wasting more than a decade of my life.


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## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

One Eighty said:


> The married AP in my case, definitely put a ton of pressure on my WS to get her to do his bidding. He was a repeat offender, a very skilled player. After Dday, WS showed me the evidence of his hot pursuit of her...


Your wife's willingness to cheat on you with this other man, should tell you everything you need to know about her.

Regardless of his behaviour, your wife chose to cheat on you. As much as it might make you feel a little bit better about her to think she is not solely responsible for this, he didn't force her to be with him she volunteered.

The betrayal of her promise of fidelity to you is entirely on her. Although it's a bitter pill to swallow, at least she has shown you who she really is.


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## BluesPower (Mar 27, 2018)

One Eighty said:


> Ok, guys, so I admit that my post only touched upon my WS briefly but I did say: _ also for my WS for willingly putting me into this position of humiliation and ridicule._
> 
> You have to realise that, while I did take acts of vengeance upon the OM, my WS has suffered far more. I divorced her. Took away her financial security. Am holding her in the Charade limbo world. (See my thread "Charade.") Yes, she is perhaps most responsible for my pain. The gatekeeper failed me.
> 
> ...


I am sorry brother, but you are delusional. Maybe this is why you play the game with your Ex.

This is not how it works, it never is. If this makes you feel better then fine I won't condemn you. 

It is weird to me, on one level you seem sane, competent, and articulate. 

Then I read these type of thoughts it sounds like a crazy person. 

She did what she did, evidently because she thought she could win a RICH man that would give her the life of luxury that she wanted. You, her kids, your family were not even a consideration. 

She willingly did it. Further, women like her send signals to men like him. Like a ***** in heat. 

Your feelings are misplaced, but the delusion that you live in is just silly...


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## TJW (Mar 20, 2012)

Personal said:


> Your wife's willingness to cheat on you with this other man, should tell you everything you need to know about her.


Yes, it is rather a complete "message"..... one which cannot be ignored..... the truth is, that she preferred another man over you. She would rather have sex with him than with you. In fact, she thought you would acquiesce to her choice while continuing to support her, change diapers, washing clothes and dishes, putting gas in, changing the oil in her car so that she would be provided transportation for her and the OM.

There is no way in hell that I could ever "get over" that message.

In fact, I will not even, ever again, attempt to "get over" it. I will forgive her, in time, for my own benefit, but I will no longer be her indentured servant for a bowl of pot pie and a pity screw once a month.


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## TJW (Mar 20, 2012)

One Eighty said:


> I still think it is delusional to NOT see him as an attacker. A danger to be repelled by whatever means necessary.


And, mostly, I think it's delusional to not see my WW as the "attacker", and as an ever-present danger.


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## BluesPower (Mar 27, 2018)

One Eighty said:


> So the fact that he cheated on his wife at least a dozen times before, his own admission, that means nothing? That doesn't mean he is a skillful pick up artist? That he preys on vulnerable women, over and over, means nothing? That he knows the devastation he is bringing into their lives and their children's lives, that means nothing?
> 
> So my WS gave out signals, maybe, so what. I still think it is delusional to NOT see him as an attacker. A danger to be repelled by whatever means necessary. A villain to be punished by whatever methods I chose.
> 
> Your reaction is surprising to me. Perhaps you feel attacked by me? Did you sleep with MW?


What you don't seem to want to see, is that HE is not your issue, your ExW is and always has been. 

This is the delusion that you allow yourself to be in. If she was not looking for a richer replacement, he would have never stood a chance. She freely admits that she wants someone richer than you, and even then, she may screw you because you are good in bed. 

And yes, I have done things that, as I am older, I am not proud of. But none of those women, in my case were chased. 

All I am saying is that, the OM took what was offered. Yes he chased, yes he romanced, because that is his game. But none of it would have happened if she was not open to a replacement for you. And what maybe was worse, is that she did not have the excuse that you were not meeting her sexual needs or giving her attention. No, she was and actually still is fulfilled in those areas. 

It was about the potential money. By the way, that is the only reason his wife stays with him anyway. If she still is. 

No she wanted the money, no matter how stupid she was. She threw you and your children away for money. 

But the attacker that you should be worried about is your wife, a traitor from within...

The thing is that you really understand this, deep down, but you do not want to embrace it. Which, hey, that is completely your choice. As crazy as it is, it is your choice to see things that way...


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## BarbedFenceRider (Mar 30, 2018)

For the male side....When you have those feelings of competing with another for your wife, How does the little soldier behave? In mine, it was like a wilted flower. Ain't nothing gonna move that little guy! lol Hell, I even tried thinking of Sophia Vergara during "handy" time...NOPE, wouldn't budge.

I also lost my drive. I had mind movies of her with the OM. And that turned me off completely. I'd rather go hunting and shooting. Now THAT did help! Did I mention, one of my "therapy" devices is a new shotgun? lol
Having her touch me at night in bed was a mind bender as well....

I ended up reading lots of articles and realized that my wife didn't have the explicit sex romp with her OM. It stayed EA for her. I only caught it by accident... But, over time and patience, with practice...We have resumed relations and look to grow it. But, I have to admit. While I still make "love" to her...It is remarkably different. I can still leave her if things don't turn right side up, and it wouldn't matter. It would be just sex, and I would get it somewhere else.


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

One Eighty said:


> Ok, guys, so I admit that my post only touched upon my WS briefly but I did say: _ also for my WS for willingly putting me into this position of humiliation and ridicule._
> 
> You have to realise that, while I did take acts of vengeance upon the OM, my WS has suffered far more. I divorced her. Took away her financial security. Am holding her in the Charade limbo world. (See my thread "Charade.") Yes, she is perhaps most responsible for my pain. The gatekeeper failed me.
> 
> ...


Women have many more potential suitors offering their services than men. I imagine that helps harden some to different approaches, while others allow themselves to use those men as a cuckold to the marriage. That's how I see some of the men.


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## TAMAT (Jun 20, 2015)

In support of 180s position....

The OM attacked not just his wife, but his kids, what the OM did to his children is the least forgivable.

The OM knew what effect this would have on WW, because he had done it before, there is no forgiveness for repeat offender. He also had to have known what the long term consequences would be for 180s children.

180 did what he could to keep the family intact and spare his children immediate pain, but there is a great likelyhood 180 will separate 10 or 20 years from now and it will still hurt his kids.

We laugh at Saudi Arabia where they stone Adulterers but there is some societal wisdom about that practice that in a less self-centered age would seem like common sense.

180 what have you done to make OM life hell?

Tamat


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## BluesPower (Mar 27, 2018)

TAMAT said:


> In support of 180s position....
> 
> The OM attacked not just his wife, but his kids, what the OM did to his children is the least forgivable.
> 
> ...


Guys, I understand that it makes some men feel better hating on the OM. I get it, and they are POS's no doubt.

But that is not now, nor ever was, the proper place for the hatred. 

It just does not work that way. 

Everyone should realize that...


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## Trumbull (May 2, 2018)

As some have said, you do not get over it, you learn to live with it.

I do not have a hang up on if the OM was better at sex than me or was he bigger than me, etc. My primary issue is that she gave it up so easy. She was a virgin when i met her and she did not seem to have a problem with getting in bed with him. She did not hesitate to let me know how good the sex was with the OM. I do understand that those with a multitude of partners prior to marriage, this may not hurt as much.

You always live with the fact that it was not as special as you thought, she did not love you as much as you thought, that the one you love is capable of betraying you.


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

Trumbull said:


> As some have said, you do not get over it, you learn to live with it.
> 
> I do not have a hang up on if the OM was better at sex than me or was he bigger than me, etc. My primary issue is that she gave it up so easy. She was a virgin when i met her and she did not seem to have a problem with getting in bed with him. *She did not hesitate to let me know how good the sex was with the OM.* I do understand that those with a multitude of partners prior to marriage, this may not hurt as much.
> 
> You always live with the fact that it was not as special as you thought, she did not love you as much as you thought, that the one you love is capable of betraying you.


Damn man.


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## michzz (Jun 6, 2008)

I stayed for my kids and in denial about the full scale of the ex-wife's betrayal.

Once I knew the full scope of things? I was physically repulsed by the mere thought of it. Nevermind any physical contact with her.

Of course, she, in her selfishness, only took that to mean I wanted to punish her.

And she added that to her stack of excuses for having cheated. I was "too judgmental" of her so that justified it AFTER the cheating had ended and her secrets were out.

Did you get that? Because I would not be intimate after finding out her multi-year affair, that assuaged her guilt (if any) that she might have had.


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## [email protected] (Dec 23, 2017)

Where's Natasha?


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## TJW (Mar 20, 2012)

Trumbull said:


> You always live with the fact that it was not as special as you thought, she did not love you as much as you thought, that the one you love is capable of betraying you.


When you get to the "place" that there was absolutely no "special" aspect of it whatsoever, the only one she loved was herself, and the only thing she would have seen as a "betrayal" is if YOU ceased to be a paycheck-on-legs and a built-in-babysitter......

......then you're on the road toward "over it"....


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## TJW (Mar 20, 2012)

michzz said:


> Did you get that? Because I would not be intimate after finding out her multi-year affair, that assuaged her guilt (if any) that she might have had.


I seriously doubt there was any guilt in the first place. A person involving themselves in a multi-year affair has already stuffed a fist in the face of his/her conscience so many times....the conscience has "shut up"....

One of the most amazing things I ever witnessed was how she expected that the day after D-day ? Things would just return to the way they were......with absolutely no effort required of her.....her affairs were MY FAULT, I was the one who had to get "fixed".... she was the "normal" person......


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## michzz (Jun 6, 2008)

michzz said:


> ...
> 
> Did you get that? Because I would not be intimate after finding out her multi-year affair, that assuaged her guilt (if any) that she might have had.





TJW said:


> I seriously doubt there was any guilt in the first place. A person involving themselves in a multi-year affair has already stuffed a fist in the face of his/her conscience so many times....the conscience has "shut up"....
> 
> One of the most amazing things I ever witnessed was how she expected that the day after D-day ? Things would just return to the way they were......with absolutely no effort required of her.....her affairs were MY FAULT, I was the one who had to get "fixed".... she was the "normal" person......


Yup, no effort required despite being told effort was required.

I think I have that T-shirt!


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## CantBelieveThis (Feb 25, 2014)

I never really had an issue here with sex or mind movies, I took me a while and therapy to find out that's likely because I had a lot of women before I married, and did all kinds crazy stuff (3somes, Public, one night stands, etc) during early 20s....where W only had one lame boyfriend before me.
So to me was like, whatever, I done it all.. And knew a lot of it is overrated.... And I just know there no way some new dude that doesn't know her was going do any better than me....(I caught her saying this to one of her toxic GFs during her A)
Now biologically please know that naturally we men are going to struggle with that, is wired in there pretty deep, so do a lot of reading and learning, it helped me understand that the human mating system is pretty lame, so don't make it more than it is...... 

Sent from my BTV-W09 using Tapatalk


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## BarbedFenceRider (Mar 30, 2018)

CBT is like me in a way...I was young single and free. Wild oats and all, but in some ways, detached from the whole emotional thing. But with the wifey, it became more "whole" and more complete. And when THAT is taken from you, even if it's in your own mind, everything else gets questioned...

One thing thinking about it today, is that my wife STILL doesn't get it. I think her grasp of human biology and psychology is limited at best. lol We would be in the MOMENT, and then I start thinking, this doesn't feel right, or am I smelling an OM on her, whatever! Then, performance disappears and she is like "oops, your getting old!" [email protected]!!!!!

But, as the saying goes, you can only truly fix yourself and go from there. And thats what I did, and do. I feel better about myself, and am more surefooted in the relationship now.


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