# Article: Why Women Leave Men They Love



## MAJDEATH (Jun 16, 2015)

Why Women Leave Men They Love: What Every Man Needs to Know

As a marriage counsellor working with men and women in relationship crisis, I help clients navigate numerous issues. While many situations are complex, there’s one profoundly simple truth that men need to know: Women leave men they love.

They feel terrible about it. It tears their heart out of them. But they do it. They rally their courage and their resources and they leave. Women leave men with whom they have children, homes and lives.

Women leave for many reasons, but there’s one reason in particular that haunts me, one that I want men to understand: Women leave because their man is not present. He’s working, golfing, gaming, watching TV, fishing…the list is long. These aren’t bad men. They’re good men. They’re good fathers. They support their family. They’re nice, likable. But they take their wife for granted. They’re not present.

Women in my office tell me: “Someone could come and sweep me off my feet, right out from under my husband.” Sometimes the realization scares them. Sometimes it makes them cry.

Men, I’m not saying this is right or wrong. I’m telling you what I see. You can get as angry, hurt or indignant as you want. Your wife is not your property. She does not owe you her soul. You earn it. Day by day, moment after moment. You win her over first and foremost with your presence, your aliveness. She needs to feel it. She wants to talk to you about what matters to her and to feel that you’re listening to her. Not nodding politely. Not placating. Definitely not playing devil’s advocate.

She wants you to feel her. She doesn’t want absent-minded groping or quick sex. She wants to feel your passion. Can you feel your passion? Can you show her? Not just your passion for her or for sex; your passion for being alive. Do you have it? It’s the most attractive thing you possess. If you’ve lost it, what’s the reason? Where did it go? Find out. Find it. If you never discovered it, you are living on borrowed time.

If you think you’re present with your wife, try listening to her. Does your mind wander? Notice. When you look at her, how deeply do you see her? Look again, look deeper. Meet her gaze and keep it for longer than usual, longer than what’s comfortable. If she asks what you’re doing, tell her: “I’m looking into you. I want to see you deeply. I’m curious about who you are. After all these years I still want to know who you are, every day.” But only say it if you mean it, if you know it’s true.

Touch her with your full attention. Before you put your hand on her, notice the sensation in your hand. Notice what happens the moment you make contact. What happens in your body? What do you feel? Notice the most subtle sensations and emotions. (This is sometimes described as mindfulness.) Tell her everything you’re noticing, moment after moment.

But you’re busy. You don’t have time for all this. How about five minutes? Five minutes a day. Will you commit to that? I’m not talking about extravagant dinners or date nights (although these are fine too). I’m talking about five minutes a day to be completely present with the woman you share your life with. To be completely open– listening and seeing without judgement. Will you do that? I bet once you start, once you get a taste, you won’t want to stop.

Note: The gender dynamic outlined above is reversible. It can go both ways.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

What are your thoughts on this article?


----------



## Adelais (Oct 23, 2013)

MAJDEATH said:


> Women *leave* because their man is not present. He’s working, golfing, gaming, watching TV, fishing…the list is long. These aren’t bad men. They’re good men. They’re good fathers. They support their family. They’re nice, likable. But they take their wife for granted. They’re not present.


One can substitute "stop needing their husband" or "grow emotionally distant from their husband" for *leave*



MAJDEATH said:


> Women in my office tell me: “Someone could come and sweep me off my feet, right out from under my husband.” Sometimes the realization scares them. Sometimes it makes them cry.


Women who tell the author that need to be confronted for their fairy tale twisted thinking. No one can sweep a married woman off her feet unless she is open to cheating. She should either deal with her marriage, or get a divorce before she entertains any ideas about being with someone other than her husband.

The rest of the article seems like a bunch of fluff. A healthy marriage needs more than the 5 minutes a day the author suggests. Did this article come out of Redbook or Ladies Home Journal? Blech!


----------



## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

*The article having been duly written, published, and read, does it in any way, at least in the authors eyes, still justify the woman's subsequent "cheating" and infidelity episode simply because their lover fails to "hear them?" If so, wouldn't that, in and of itself, be nothing more than a form of emotional blackmail?

Lastly, would God ever find such a rationale to be theologically sound and acceptable?*
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## jdawg2015 (Feb 12, 2015)

Complete garbage.

Maybe the guy is not present because the wife is a lazy blob who doesn't want to do much with their husband.

The article puts it all on the man. If some women is so easily swept away from a guy, he's better off without her. Good riddance.


----------



## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

Very good article, MD. Paying genuine attention to our spouses, really seeking to understand them, can make a big difference in our marriages.


----------



## soccermom2three (Jan 4, 2013)

Great article. I actually lived this. My husband's hobbies and interests had taken over our marriage. In addition, he works 24 hour shifts. We were two people living in the same house and having sex. There was no romantic relationship. One morning we started talking about our relationship and how it could be better. I'm so glad that my husband was willing to listen to me and not dismiss my feelings. I think our marriage is better now than it's ever been.


----------



## CharlieParker (Aug 15, 2012)

A chapter title from my fav relationship book is "The worst thing a man can do to a woman is leave her alone but married".


----------



## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

And here is the article Why women leave or cheat - What every man should know

The article is based on whatever bottled whine the spouses brings to the counsellor:

"He/she is always working!"

"So, why did you insist on buying the McMansion, meaning your spouse has to work long ours at two jobs to pay off the mortgage whilst you stay at home?" (I can't imagine the author of this article asking such a hard question...)


----------



## jdesey (Dec 6, 2015)

I have A different problem. After a break up and reunion my ex fiancé doesn't want to see me a whole lot. About 2 times per week. It's hard to be patient


----------



## jdawg2015 (Feb 12, 2015)

And while he was doing hobbies did you ever make an effort to join?

Seems like it was both of you ignoring each other whereas the article lays it all on the man.

Plenty of women pull the same crap. The guy stays home and works on the house and chores while little Ms Jane decides she is entitled to girls nights out and then the stable husband back home is too boring and she does the same thing. Guys fault in that case too?


----------



## blahfridge (Dec 6, 2014)

The article doesn't mention how many marriages become completely child centered, thus killing the attachment to each other. 
My H wanted alone time with me only for sex, otherwise it was always about the children. I learned to create a life with work and friends and, yes, with the now mostly grown kids, that doesn't include him. We are polite and respectful to each other, but the deep connection is gone.


----------



## lifeistooshort (Mar 17, 2013)

jdawg2015 said:


> Complete garbage.
> 
> Maybe the guy is not present because the wife is a lazy blob who doesn't want to do much with their husband.
> 
> The article puts it all on the man. If some women is so easily swept away from a guy, he's better off without her. Good riddance.


Well in that case said guys shouldn't be on TAM crying that their wife wants a divorce, yet they often are.

If you don't care then why is it a problem?


----------



## lifeistooshort (Mar 17, 2013)

jdawg2015 said:


> And while he was doing hobbies did you ever make an effort to join?
> 
> Seems like it was both of you ignoring each other whereas the article lays it all on the man.
> 
> Plenty of women pull the same crap. The guy stays home and works on the house and chores while little Ms Jane decides she is entitled to girls nights out and then the stable husband back home is too boring and she does the same thing. Guys fault in that case too?


How's the defensiveness working for your marriage?
Just wondering.


----------



## LBHmidwest (Jan 3, 2014)

Justify Justify Justify


----------



## lifeistooshort (Mar 17, 2013)

LBHmidwest said:


> Justify Justify Justify


Hmm, the same way that men who don't get the sex they're entitled to justify leaving? If you want to you can call any reason at all justifying. 

People who don't get needs met will detach and possibly leave. Period.


----------



## Holland (Aug 20, 2012)

As a woman that has the most wonderful, attentive, high EQ, intelligent, alive and involved man in her life I can say there is a lot of truth in the article. We spend many quality hours together and we talk for hours, we laugh together everyday and we have a sex life that I never thought I would have. If he were not a connected man that embraces our relationship I would leave him.

Of course all relationships are individual and genders can be reversed but the overall gist is a truth that many men do not want to acknowledge. Be present and be vital, if your partner does not embrace these qualities in you then there are other issues at play.

The article is not saying all is on the mans shoulders, it is saying that if you have a partner that wants a healthy and fulfilling relationship with you make sure you embrace and honour that and do not let her become numb to you or you will lose her.


----------



## jdawg2015 (Feb 12, 2015)

I'm the one who filed for divorce from my exW. She was the lazy one in the marriage and I did all the "work".

When your marriage to a guy 19 years older than you finally blows up just remember, "I told you so".



lifeistooshort said:


> How's the defensiveness working for your marriage?
> Just wondering.


----------



## jdawg2015 (Feb 12, 2015)

Did you even read the title and the article? OMG.

It's clearly a gender biased writing. You seem to be reading what you want to hear.

The article is garbage because, as written, that guy would be a classic nice guy....




Holland said:


> The article is not saying all is on the mans shoulders, it is saying that if you have a partner that wants a healthy and fulfilling relationship with you make sure you embrace and honour that and do not let her become numb to you or you will lose her.


----------



## EllisRedding (Apr 10, 2015)

Wait, so this disclaimer is put at the bottom of the article:



> Note – The gender dynamic outlined above is reversible. It can go both ways


Yet the entire article is based on the man's shortcomings and justification of the woman leaving, with the doosy (sp?) being:



> “Someone could come and sweep me off my feet, right out from under my husband.”


Sorry, what a load of BS, and what I mean by that, I read the article and I see the issues being genderless. Also, did these women talk to their Hs about, or did they go with the "subtle hints" or "he should just know garbage" I have seen posted before. If you are in a relationship and you ignore your SO, take them for granted, make everything else a priority over them, you run the risk of pushing that person away, plain and simple. 

Of course there are women who will read this article and relate to it, just like there will be men who will read the article and relate to as well.


----------



## lifeistooshort (Mar 17, 2013)

jdawg2015 said:


> I'm the one who filed for divorce from my exW. She was the lazy one in the marriage and I did all the "work".
> 
> When your marriage to a guy 19 years older than you finally blows up just remember, "I told you so".


Well then I'd say this thread doesn't apply to you. It applies to women who walk but have husbands who didn't want it.....that doesn't sound like you.

I'll assume your last statement was for the sole purpose of being nasty, since you in fact have no idea what goes on in my life or marriage, or anything else about my situation. 

If you had such an attitude in your marriage that might be why she didn't want to do anything for you.


----------



## jorgegene (May 26, 2012)

the premise i think is valid. we ignore our spouses and take them for granted at our own peril.
woe and shame to those that do this. and i think it works both ways, not just for men.

what bothers me is however is the implication that it's ok then to leave.


----------



## TX-SC (Aug 25, 2015)

I agree with the concept of the article but think it shouldn't be gender specific. Both partners need to give to the marriage. It doesn't all fall on the husband and not all women are saints in this regard.


----------



## Ynot (Aug 26, 2014)

Being "present" is not as easy as the article makes it out to be. In fact I would argue if the women were more "present" as well perhaps there would be some level of understanding as to why her man isn't. All of us, are battered by the expectations of modern life. As men we are expected to work hard, provide for our families, be involved with our children, take care of our homes, etc, etc. The same is also true of women. The difference is that when women do this they are celebrated as super women, who can multi-task and balance home and work (even when or especially so when they are not interested or capable in meeting the need of the man). Men are expected to just understand and accept, since we are portrayed as stoic, emotionless beings. Yet no where in the article is the woman's need to be "present" and recognize the real pressures that prevent a man from being present as well addressed. Instead, men need to be more present, despite the dead lines at work, the goals they have to meet at work, the gutters that need cleaned, the tuition that needs paid, the roof that needs replaced, the car that needs repaired, the child's saturday soccer game that conflicts with the work schedule or yard work that needs done etc. etc.
None of this is to say that women do not face the same realities, only that in the case of women, it is the man who is expected to adapt, where as in the case of men, they are simply not "present".


----------



## UMP (Dec 23, 2014)

Ynot said:


> Being "present" is not as easy as the article makes it out to be. In fact I would argue if the women were more "present" as well perhaps there would be some level of understanding as to why her man isn't. All of us, are battered by the expectations of modern life. As men we are expected to work hard, provide for our families, be involved with our children, take care of our homes, etc, etc. The same is also true of women. The difference is that when women do this they are celebrated as super women, who can multi-task and balance home and work (even when or especially so when they are not interested or capable in meeting the need of the man). Men are expected to just understand and accept, since we are portrayed as stoic, emotionless beings. Yet no where in the article is the woman's need to be "present" and recognize the real pressures that prevent a man from being present as well addressed. Instead, men need to be more present, despite the dead lines at work, the goals they have to meet at work, the gutters that need cleaned, the tuition that needs paid, the roof that needs replaced, the car that needs repaired, the child's saturday soccer game that conflicts with the work schedule or yard work that needs done etc. etc.
> None of this is to say that women do not face the same realities, only that in the case of women, it is the man who is expected to adapt, where as in the case of men, they are simply not "present".



What is wrong with the man being expected to adapt?
Life is not fair, never has been and never will be.

Why not own your situation with a smile?

I think that's all my wife is looking for, a man who owns his shiit and when things don't go as planned, adapt.

If you build it, she will follow.


----------



## VermisciousKnid (Dec 27, 2011)

Interesting that in response to the "he works too much" complaint some guys say "She wanted a new car and a McMansion" but it seems just as likely that he wanted those things as much as she did or he felt that he was supposed to do earn enough to be upwardly mobile. 

It's a consumerist society and many people are sucked in to it without questioning if it's a sane way to live. 

I worked with a woman who dropped out of the "rat race" in the city and moved to a rural town for 15 years while raising her kids were young. She had a high position in the company that she just walked away from. Said it was the best decision she ever made. 

I've met very few people who intentionally decided to "trade down" in life. It always seems to be about trading up.


----------



## IIJokerII (Apr 7, 2014)

jorgegene said:


> the premise i think is valid. we ignore our spouses and take them for granted at our own peril.
> woe and shame to those that do this. and i think it works both ways, not just for men.
> 
> what bothers me is however is the implication that it's ok then to leave.


 A perfect response if I ever read one.... I suppose if the rationalization is deep and convoluted enough, it can invariably become accepted that abandoning a loved one is not only justifyable but one is entitled to do so... I bet my children are glad I do not follow this same logic cause lord knows I don' ever get enough ego kibbles... Ooop, I mean, Appreciation or respect for my efforts. Cause according to this article, I should abandon them, cause that's what unconditional love means nowadays.... What's in it for me....


----------



## Ynot (Aug 26, 2014)

UMP said:


> What is wrong with the man being expected to adapt?
> Life is not fair, never has been and never will be.
> 
> Why not own your situation with a smile?
> ...


Nobody said a man shouldn't adapt. Did they?
No one ever said life is not fair either, did they?

But just because something is not fair does not mean we should all roll over and just accept our fate, does it?

My point was and still is that women must also be "present" in the relationship and not just sit back and ignore all the realities that prevent a man from being fully present as well. Our society has created this image that men are just emotionless creatures who only think in cold hard facts (as in another post I had responded to) with little to no discussion of the very real issues that men have to deal with. 
I did own my situation. I was not happy with being treated as a walking ATM who's only purpose in life was to fund everyone else's life while denying I had any needs of my own. I wasn't expected to feel I was just expected to accept. 
But there is a big difference between adapting to a situation where life did not go as planned and being expected to give up your all just so that some one else can be happy.
It is a two way street and as I said as long as the expectation is just for the man to adapt or to own shiit as you put it, with not only little similar expectation from women, but actual glorification of NOT adapting or owning any of the shiit themselves, we will continue to produce unhappy marriages and failed relationships. 
Nope, marriages fail because men are not present, with no real discussion of how present she was in adapting to the realities that the man may have been dealing with that made him not present. After all men are expected to be men, they don't have any real emotions. They only operate on the basis of cold hard facts.


----------



## IIJokerII (Apr 7, 2014)

UMP said:


> What is wrong with the man being expected to adapt?
> Life is not fair, never has been and never will be.
> 
> Why not own your situation with a smile?
> ...


 Perhaps..... But then again I've never seen a bird fly particularly well with just one wing.....


----------



## Ynot (Aug 26, 2014)

VermisciousKnid said:


> Interesting that in response to the "he works too much" complaint some guys say "She wanted a new car and a McMansion" but it seems just as likely that he wanted those things as much as she did or *he felt that he was supposed to do earn enough to be upwardly mobile. *
> 
> It's a consumerist society and many people are sucked in to it without questioning if it's a sane way to live.
> 
> ...


Well now you've met two. I gave up a promising corporate career to start my own business in the small town we had moved to raise our children in. I used to drive over an hour to and from work and was expected to work 50 to 60 hours a week as well. During the time that I did this, I felt like a trapped animal. All I did was commute, work, come home, have a wife and kids and house and yard work that required time and had no time for me or anything I wanted from life. 
Once I started my own business, I got to be the Dad I always dreamed of being. I coached sports for my kids. I took them practice when I didn't, I took them to and from school, I packed their lunches, I went to every game, match, recital, performance, tournament etc. 
But that wasn't enough. I didn't have a "real" job. 
Bottom line is it takes two people on the same page to make it work. My ex constantly wanted a bigger house, a nicer car, better furniture etc. After a while I still felt like I was on a treadmill with no end to my effort in sight. She was never interested in living life to enjoy life, only with keeping up with the Joneses.
In regards to the bolded section - yep most men feel they are supposed to earn enough to be upwardly mobile. It is very sad that so few men and women choose to work to live instead of live to work. But then again, men aren't supposed to feel. Afterall they don't have emotions and only operate based on cold hard facts.


----------



## Ynot (Aug 26, 2014)

IIJokerII said:


> Perhaps..... But then again I've never seen a bird fly particularly well with just one wing.....


Also in regards to "If you build it, she will follow." The poster forgot to add "as long it is what she wants"


----------



## UMP (Dec 23, 2014)

I agree, it is a two way street.

I did tell my wife several years ago that I needed sex (GOOD sex) at least twice a week, or this ATM was moving on.

She changed.

On my end, I don't complain, I don't whine and I listen to my wife. She likes to talk.
In fact, on our first date I don't think she even took a breath. I hate to talk. So I changed.

I guess the point I am getting at is I believe a man needs to lead, with a smile and be present.

I agree with the OP article.

Having said this, you do need TWO people that are at least willing to meet each others needs, regardless, or it just will not work.


----------



## lifeistooshort (Mar 17, 2013)

Ynot said:


> Being "present" is not as easy as the article makes it out to be. In fact I would argue if the women were more "present" as well perhaps there would be some level of understanding as to why her man isn't. All of us, are battered by the expectations of modern life. As men we are expected to work hard, provide for our families, be involved with our children, take care of our homes, etc, etc. The same is also true of women. The difference is that when women do this they are celebrated as super women, who can multi-task and balance home and work (even when or especially so when they are not interested or capable in meeting the need of the man). Men are expected to just understand and accept, since we are portrayed as stoic, emotionless beings. Yet no where in the article is the woman's need to be "present" and recognize the real pressures that prevent a man from being present as well addressed. Instead, men need to be more present, despite the dead lines at work, the goals they have to meet at work, the gutters that need cleaned, the tuition that needs paid, the roof that needs replaced, the car that needs repaired, the child's saturday soccer game that conflicts with the work schedule or yard work that needs done etc. etc.
> None of this is to say that women do not face the same realities, only that in the case of women, it is the man who is expected to adapt, where as in the case of men, they are simply not "present".


I think in the case of many of these women they don't know how to help him be present. So like men they try everything they know how, but said guy doesn't respond or communicate.

Women aren't the only ones that don't communicate their needs well, many men don't. Ok, so a guy might tell you "I need more sex", but that's not what he means; what he wants is her to desire sex with him, so even if she provides it he's still po'd that she doesn't seem to want it. Often this is made worse by porn use where women fake and scream even though they guy's put forth no effort at all for them. Yet he doesn't want to entertain what's really involved in creating desire, and even worse he chose a spouse based on how much he wanted to have sex with her and little consideration for how much she really wanted him or what kind of partner she'd make.

I tell my sons all the time that there is far more to choosing a partner then how pretty she is....that will only get them so far.

I think the advice to continue to date your spouse and take care of yourself is golden. So many times I've seen guys on TAM crying that their wife wants out so now they're hitting the gym..... so his wife wasn't worth the gym before? I'm sure this is true of many women too but there are just so many more men than women here. And us women know that our appearance and shape are issues for guys, but I think fewer guys realize how much of an issue appearance is for women. They assume if they're bringing home a paycheck that's good enough. 

Except that money might get a woman to stick with you and even let you have sex with her, but it won't in and of itself create desire.

Your spouse deserves the best you have to offer, yet often they become the punching bag to be treated in ways you'd never treat your boss or your friends because you think they're stuck with you.

People are fond of citing vows when it relates to staying married yet conveniently forget the vow to love, honor, and cherish. We should all ask ourselves what we've done to love, honor, and cherish our spouse today; there are a few here whose first response to that will be "but what have they done for me?". That is unhelpful; you don't control your spouse....you do control you. Change starts with you. 

If in the end you decide your spouse either can't or won't reciprocate you should contemplate moving on.


----------



## UMP (Dec 23, 2014)

lifeistooshort said:


> Your spouse deserves the best you have to offer, yet often they become the punching bag to be treated in ways you'd never treat your boss or your friends because you think they're stuck with you.


Yes, This in a nut shell.
If you are being the "best" you can be, without whining and complaining all the time, or tooting your own horn, 9 times out of 10 she will follow. IMO.

The op article mentions the word "aliveness." I believe "aliveness" is contagious and worth following.


----------



## lifeistooshort (Mar 17, 2013)

UMP said:


> Yes, This in a nut shell.
> If you are being the "best" you can be, without whining and complaining all the time, or tooting your own horn, 9 times out of 10 she will follow. IMO.
> 
> The op article mentions the word "aliveness." I believe "aliveness" is contagious and worth following.


Absolutely. And in fairness I hold myself to the same standards. ...i have my moods like everyone but I try very hard to give my hb the best I can. 

An i always successful? Probably not, but I think about it and try.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## staarz21 (Feb 6, 2013)

Ynot said:


> Being "present" is not as easy as the article makes it out to be. In fact I would argue if the women were more "present" as well perhaps there would be some level of understanding as to why her man isn't. All of us, are battered by the expectations of modern life. *As men we are expected to work hard, provide for our families, be involved with our children, take care of our homes, etc, etc. The same is also true of women. *The difference is that when women do this they are celebrated as super women, who can multi-task and balance home and work (even when or especially so when they are not interested or capable in meeting the need of the man). *Men are expected to just understand and accept, since we are portrayed as stoic, emotionless beings. *Yet no where in the article is the woman's need to be "present" and recognize the real pressures that prevent a man from being present as well addressed.* Instead, men need to be more present, despite the dead lines at work, the goals they have to meet at work, the gutters that need cleaned, the tuition that needs paid, the roof that needs replaced, the car that needs repaired, the child's saturday soccer game that conflicts with the work schedule or yard work that needs done etc. etc.*
> None of this is to say that women do not face the same realities, only that in the case of women, it is the man who is expected to adapt, where as in the case of men, they are simply not "present".


Bring in a relationship or taking a huge step like getting married brings on more responsibility for both men and women. 

If you have issues coping with the stress of work, owning a home, caring for kids, etc....then don't be married. Rent a house. Change jobs. It's not an excuse at all for ignoring your partner. 

YOU decide how stressful your life is. It really isn't that difficult to pay attention to your partner while they are speaking to you. That goes for both men and women. 

By the way, women have to adapt to plenty of things as well. Men aren't the only ones that have to change things in a relationship (at least in successful relationships).


----------



## Ynot (Aug 26, 2014)

staarz21 said:


> Bring in a relationship or taking a huge step like getting married brings on more responsibility for both men and women.
> No crap, that is exactly what I have said
> If you have issues coping with the stress of work, owning a home, caring for kids, etc....then don't be married. Rent a house. Change jobs. It's not an excuse at all for ignoring your partner.
> That is so much BS I won't even get into it. Everybody gets stressed out and are not always present. Speaking of listening to your partner, where is in the article does it ever advise a woman to first try to find out why her man may not be present instead of just blaming the man for not being present
> ...


No one said it was an excuse, nor did anyone say women don't and can't adapt. But I have news for you - EVERYBODY worries about these things. But in the case of men, we are just expected to shut up and not feel the stress, because that is what we have been conditioned to believe. Women on the other hand are celebrated as "super women" when they do the same thing. My point was that women have just as much obligation to be present as men do. Many women just expect that men won't "whine or complain" and because of that they don't feel as though they have any obligation to understand why a man may not be "present"
it isn't a matter of not being stressed, it is an issue of the other side recognizing their partner may be equally or more stressed and making an effort to understand that before just deciding that they are "unfulfilled". Instead we only read about how men aren't emotional and only act based on clod hard facts.


----------



## Lukedog (Nov 18, 2015)

The saying is "a husband and wife should function like two wings on the same bird; they must work together or the marriage will never get off the ground."

A relationship is 100/100. Each person should give it their all. Sometimes there will be more give or take on each others part, and that's when one party should be the rock for the other. Open and honest communication is a must in any relationship; this builds trust. You need to "trust" your partner that they will be "there" for you, for whatever reason you need them to be "there"; physically, mentally, emotionally, spiritually. Respect is earned when you see your partner working just as hard as you to make that bird fly.


----------



## staarz21 (Feb 6, 2013)

> Bring in a relationship or taking a huge step like getting married brings on more responsibility for both men and women.
> No crap, that is exactly what I have said
> If you have issues coping with the stress of work, owning a home, caring for kids, etc....then don't be married. Rent a house. Change jobs. It's not an excuse at all for ignoring your partner.
> That is so much BS I won't even get into it. Everybody gets stressed out and are not always present. Speaking of listening to your partner, where is in the article does it ever advise a woman to first try to find out why her man may not be present instead of just blaming the man for not being present
> ...





Ynot said:


> No one said it was an excuse, nor did anyone say women don't and can't adapt. But I have news for you - EVERYBODY worries about these things. But in the case of men, we are just expected to shut up and not feel the stress, because that is what we have been conditioned to believe. Women on the other hand are celebrated as "super women" when they do the same thing. My point was that women have just as much obligation to be present as men do. Many women just expect that men won't "whine or complain" and because of that they don't feel as though they have any obligation to understand why a man may not be "present"
> it isn't a matter of not being stressed, it is an issue of the other side recognizing their partner may be equally or more stressed and making an effort to understand that before just deciding that they are "unfulfilled". Instead we only read about how men aren't emotional and only act based on clod hard facts.



Well, I guess that solves that. Thanks for being a jerk when I was only stating my opinion. I wasn't even attacking you, so what is your problem? Why are you attacking me? 99% of the time on this forum, I am standing up for the men on here and I am really starting to regret it when people like you come out of your hole in the damn ground to attack someone for no damn reason. 

It's not that hard to go to google and find an article that will tell women what men need....holy hell we see that stupid sh*t on here all of the time. Get off of your damn high horse. This article is for both men and women. 

I'm so sick of people in general on this stupid forum that seem to think that because the article said MAN or WOMAN that they are applying it to every freaking one of them. The article CAN GO BOTH WAYS. It even said so at the bottom. You just have to read it objectively which apparently some of you are having a hard damn time doing. 

If it doesn't apply to you, why are you so p*ssed off? Did you read the damn thing? It says that women want to connect with their partners!!!!!!! That includes talking about when you're stressed about stuff. Some women prefer that men show their emotions...IN FACT, there have been so many threads started by women who HATE the fact that their H's show no emotions. So, I don't know where you're coming from with that crap. 

AND I didn't say that women didn't need to be preset at all...The door swings both ways.I think that's pretty damned obvious. If you think that ANYONE here thinks that ONLY men need to be present, I would LOVE for you to point them out. Most everyone here would say that both people need to be present. 

Some people....smh.


----------



## EllisRedding (Apr 10, 2015)

My issue with the article is it is nothing more than fluff with no substance. It provides no background for these relationships and makes it seem like the W was doing everything correct in the relationship, the H was the one that failed her ... Naturally, the author took this route because it is sexier to make it gender specific than to apply to both genders (the feeble attempt at making it gender neutral with the bottom disclaimer is a joke). As well, trying to poke holes into what the W did wrong would probably go against the target audience the author is trying to get. All I see are couples who failed each other, whether it be from poor communication or otherwise. An article around that would be far more useful, especially in promoting accountability by both people in making the relationship work.


----------



## Ynot (Aug 26, 2014)

staarz21 said:


> Some people....smh.


Yeah the nerve of some people! I mean I respond to an article entitled "Why *Women* Leave Men They Love: What Every Man Needs to Know" that specifically is addressed to MEN and I have a problem? I also love how it is OK for you to attack me as in "If YOU have a problem with stress you shouldn't get married" Yeah but I am the one being a jerk?
All I did was question the underlying assumption that men just aren't "present" when there is no discussion of any effort being made on the part of the woman to understand why. Apparently even that is too much for some people. I imagine that next I will be called misogynistic or something for not accepting the assumption that men are to blame because they are not "present".


----------



## staarz21 (Feb 6, 2013)

Ynot said:


> Yeah the nerve of some people! I mean I respond to an article entitled "Why *Women* Leave Men They Love: What Every Man Needs to Know" that specifically is addressed to MEN and I have a problem? I also love how it is OK for you to attack me as in "If YOU have a problem with stress you shouldn't get married" Yeah but I am the one being a jerk?
> All I did was question the underlying assumption that men just aren't "present" when there is no discussion of any effort being made on the part of the woman to understand why. Apparently even that is too much for some people. I imagine that next I will be called misogynistic or something for not accepting the assumption that men are to blame because they are not "present".


I didn't attack you. You interpreted it that way. That's not my fault. 

Like I said the list in endless on what women do wrong too. I mean, you're acting like this is the ONLY article written EVER about why relationships end. 

Here let me help you feel better:

3 Reasons Men Leave Women They Love - eHarmony Advice

5 Reasons Men Break Up With Women They Love

Reasons We Dump Women - AskMen


Apparently, women are insecure, needy, can't stay attractive enough, we make you fear losing your independence and freedom, we don't respect you, we are naggy, we underestimate you, we manipulate you, we berate you, we try to change you, we don't appreciate you, we neglect you, and we don't love. 


Seriously? I mean ANY article can be posted. Why don't you research why men leave women they love, then discuss it here instead of misinterpreting my post and going off on me for no damn good reason. It's not hard. Many men have PLENTY of opinion pieces on how terrible women are. It doesn't hurt my feelings any because I know I am not like that. I know I gave my all. So, I would look at the article, roll my eyes a little and move on. There would be no reason what so ever to get this upset over it at all, because it wouldn't apply to me, personally. 

By the way, you misquoted me. I said,* "If you have issues coping with the stress of work, owning a home, caring for kids, etc....then don't be married. Rent a house. Change jobs. It's not an excuse at all for ignoring your partner. 

YOU decide how stressful your life is. It really isn't that difficult to pay attention to your partner while they are speaking to you. That goes for both men and women." *

All of that is general "you" since obviously I don't know you personally. I can't even believe that has to be explained, but then again...I guess I can.

I'm done here.


----------



## Holland (Aug 20, 2012)

jdawg2015 said:


> Did you even read the title and the article? OMG.
> 
> It's clearly a gender biased writing. You seem to be reading what you want to hear.
> 
> The article is garbage because, as written, that guy would be a classic nice guy....


Yes I read the article and while I don't usually read online articles of this nature I do not agree that the premise behind it is rubbish. 



> Women leave for many reasons, but there’s one reason in particular that haunts me, one that I want men to understand: Women leave because their man is not present. He’s working, golfing, gaming, watching TV, fishing…the list is long. These aren’t bad men. They’re good men. They’re good fathers. They support their family. They’re nice, likable. But they take their wife for granted. They’re not present.


 From the article.

If you think this is rubbish then all power to you but it might be a clue into why your life is as it is. If you think it is rubbish that women (in general) want their husband/partner to be "present" and involved then this may be where you have gone wrong. 

It is not gender biased writing to say that women want their partner to be part of an engaged life with them. The author also stated that these men are good people but they take their wife for granted. Trust me, not many women would be happy in a situation like this.

The article is about why women leave men they love, the content of that article reflects that issue. This may be confronting for some people, that uneasiness should be a trigger for them to do some introspection.


----------



## Ynot (Aug 26, 2014)

staarz21 said:


> I didn't attack you. You interpreted it that way. That's not my fault.
> 
> Like I said the list in endless on what women do wrong too. I mean, you're acting like this is the ONLY article written EVER about why relationships end.
> 
> ...


Good thing you are done, you clearly can't even begin to understand what you have written yourself. Generic "you"? Sure thing. Next time don't capitalize the word and/or quote me and maybe you won't feel so attacked. Talk about being sensitive!
Nobody was discussing other articles we were discussing the article posted in the OP, but don't allow that to deter your little pity party.


----------



## jdawg2015 (Feb 12, 2015)

Exactly. 

Articles like this are why some uneducated woman would read it and feel entitled to leave. I mean, how dare my husband work 10 hours days while I'm enjoying the extra spending and shopping. He should be here with me while I'm shopping damn it! (sarcasm)



IIJokerII said:


> A perfect response if I ever read one.... I suppose if the rationalization is deep and convoluted enough, it can invariably become accepted that abandoning a loved one is not only justifyable but one is entitled to do so... I bet my children are glad I do not follow this same logic cause lord knows I don' ever get enough ego kibbles... Ooop, I mean, Appreciation or respect for my efforts. Cause according to this article, I should abandon them, cause that's what unconditional love means nowadays.... What's in it for me....


----------



## tech-novelist (May 15, 2014)

MAJDEATH said:


> Women in my office tell me: “Someone could come and sweep me off my feet, right out from under my husband.”


I'm trying to visualize that position, but I can't. >


----------



## jdawg2015 (Feb 12, 2015)

And if a guy wants his wife around more because she's out and about, long work hours, etc then the TAM feminist brigade will label the guy a control freak and tell him "yo girl, leave him he ain't no good for you".



Ynot said:


> No one said it was an excuse, nor did anyone say women don't and can't adapt. But I have news for you - EVERYBODY worries about these things. But in the case of men, we are just expected to shut up and not feel the stress, because that is what we have been conditioned to believe. Women on the other hand are celebrated as "super women" when they do the same thing. My point was that women have just as much obligation to be present as men do. Many women just expect that men won't "whine or complain" and because of that they don't feel as though they have any obligation to understand why a man may not be "present"
> it isn't a matter of not being stressed, it is an issue of the other side recognizing their partner may be equally or more stressed and making an effort to understand that before just deciding that they are "unfulfilled". Instead we only read about how men aren't emotional and only act based on clod hard facts.


----------



## Holland (Aug 20, 2012)

jdawg2015 said:


> And if a guy wants his wife around more because she's out and about, long work hours, etc then the TAM feminist brigade will label the guy a control freak and tell him "yo girl, leave him he ain't no good for you".


The article is about women that want their partner to be more engaged in their relationship. If she wants him around more how did you turn that into she wants to be out more? Your response above seems to be very clouded with your own issues.


----------



## jdawg2015 (Feb 12, 2015)

Hello, we are discussing the topic of the article and IS NOT about my "issue". 

What I find is a subset of TAM women who I need to put on BLOCK. Congrats, you're the first. Next up is JLD.

I am convinced some of you are on some swingers cult.


Holland said:


> The article is about women that want their partner to be more engaged in their relationship. If she wants him around more how did you turn that into she wants to be out more? Your response above seems to be very clouded with your own issues.


----------



## Holland (Aug 20, 2012)

jdawg2015 said:


> Hello, we are discussing the topic of the article and IS NOT about my "issue".
> 
> What I find is a subset of TAM women who I need to put on BLOCK. Congrats, you're the first. Next up is JLD.
> 
> I am convinced some of you are on some swingers cult.


You seem to have lost the plot.


----------



## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

MAJDEATH said:


> Why Women Leave Men They Love: What Every Man Needs to Know
> 
> As a marriage counsellor working with men and women in relationship crisis, I help clients navigate numerous issues. While many situations are complex, there’s one profoundly simple truth that men need to know: Women leave men they love.
> 
> ...


Personally I have never experienced this.. my husband's hobby is "our family".. me & the kids.. primarily his main focus.. he's always been this way, he's very consistent.....

And I love it, love it, love it.. 

I have seen the flip side however.... I believe THIS happened to our son.. he wasn't giving his girlfriend enough time & attention...I even went to him and WARNED HIM he was F**king up and she would leave him.. 

He blew me off.. feeling she loved him so much (after all she was plastering it all over social media - "over compensating" it what it was- looking back)

And guess what... Mama was right... she WAS swept off her feet by a friend of his who weaseled his way in between them.. this guy acting like his new best friend.. meanwhile getting her off alone when son couldn't make "the time".. 

He's learned a very very hard lesson here.. still not even over her all the way, now she's engaged to someone else.. When she broke up with him.. she was texting me -to make sure he'd be OK.. and she said to me... 

She wanted to be with someone who wanted to be with her all the time, not someone she had to compel...she also told him before it happened - she didn't feel they were "best friends" anymore.. 

So I can see the truth in this article.. I would also leave a man if he wasn't "Present" enough...this would drag me down & I'd wonder what I was missing.. A man can fulfill those deep places.. where we still feel exhilarated to bring everything to him.. but it can turn slowly.. and surely if we start feeling like a burden.. or he's too busy with all the other things going on.. his friends, his hobby.. his ______ etc...

I know how deeply it resonates with the heart & soul of a woman.. at least those like me.. I couldn't even blame son's GF for leaving him (after 3 & a half years).. even though I want to hate her.. in reality.. I'd probably do the same thing.. 

The only difference between us would be.. she didn't b**** about it.. but silently grew resentful then she was "DONE".... whereas I would be very mouthy about it.. telling him ..I'm not happy.. we need some changes to find our peace.. I'd be demanding about it.. or we'd have to split.. he'd have a heads up... 

I guess Men need to decide what is better.. a silent sufferer.. or an aggressive diva who tells you what for.. 

Good article... Don't neglect the gift you've been given in love..


----------



## Annie123 (Apr 27, 2015)

I don't think anyone leaves a partner that they love. When a person is taken for granted, abused, feels alone in a marriage, is cheated on, or has their feelings dismissed etc, they first start resenting their partner, then they fall out of love with them and THEN they leave.


----------



## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

I remember watching a tape of an old American TV drama about divorce lawyers. I think it had Mariel Hemmingway in it, I think it was called "Civil Wars". There was an episode where a wife was demanding a divorce because she stated her husband was cheating on her. He was not. He said he was not. He had proof such as it is he was not. She would not be moved. They went all the way to the end. He agreed to divorce her. They were granted a divorce in court. And the conclusion of all of that she ran up to him crying, "All I wanted was your attention!!". His response was "Are we done here?" And he walked away. 

Be careful what you wish for, I guess.


----------



## Lukedog (Nov 18, 2015)

Annie123 said:


> I don't think anyone leaves a partner that they love. When a person is taken for granted, abused, feels alone in a marriage, is cheated on, or has their feelings dismissed etc, they first start resenting their partner, then they fall out of love with them and THEN they leave.


Your absolutely right about that. And also trust is also lost. When we trust one another to "DO" a relationship and that trust fails, it takes alot of work to get it back. Sometimes you just can't get it back.


----------



## See_Listen_Love (Jun 28, 2012)

SimplyAmorous said:


> Personally I have never experienced this.. my husband's hobby is "our family".. me & the kids.. primarily his main focus.. he's always been this way, he's very consistent.....
> 
> And I love it, love it, love it..
> 
> I have seen the flip side however....


I have also seen another flipside, with an extreme lovey dovey couple, friends of us, where the man, as a jazz musician, (came to?) lead a double life, unknown to his wife.

If a man feels the need to fit in a group culture pattern of being the loving husband and perfect family man, it can be his 'job' to do so, and if his personal needs are not acknowledged, or not known even to himself, he can get to feel suppressed and become frustrated. Outwards still the perfect husband, Inside a prisoner looking for a way out.


----------



## WhyMe66 (Mar 25, 2016)

MAJDEATH said:


> Why Women Leave Men They Love: What Every Man Needs to Know
> 
> As a marriage counsellor working with men and women in relationship crisis, I help clients navigate numerous issues. While many situations are complex, there’s one profoundly simple truth that men need to know: Women leave men they love.
> 
> ...


My major thought is that I wished I'd known this a year ago...


----------

