# Sex in a limo or other creative places



## justis (Mar 5, 2015)

Many years ago my wife had a affair. We've dealt with it and moved on. But recently after a near break up certain details of the affair came to light. Namely that they had sex in a limo. There was also some bondage, something we've never done and frankly I have no interest in. Let's say this was more than an affair. Almost 25 years ago she left me for this guy. Long ago. Lasted a couple of months. She actually hired a limo and they had sex in it. Now this is only significant because she would have never done this with me in a million years. Still wouldn't. And therein lies much of the problem. We have a fantastic sex life. But I'm stuck on this thing. She says it's illegal and she'd never do it because of that. Is it illegal? Tinted glass. You can't see in. It's private. 

So partially I'm hurt because it happened. My arch enemy whom I've never met got kind of the ultimate with my wife and she won't do that ultimate thing with me. So if it's not illegal I can try it or what other adventurous dangerous safe and not exactly illegal places can we have sex so I can help put this damage behind me?


----------



## askari (Jun 21, 2012)

Illegal? Errr no! The only time it might be illegal is if other people can see and and it causes alarm or distress. Is having sex in a caravan or motorhome illegal? No.

There are laws in the UK - as there are similar ones in the US etc - regarding public decency. 

Is having sex in the middle of a deserted forest illegal? No. Unless you can be seen and cause alarm/distress.

I've had sex in afew (for me!) 'creative' places...outside by a swimming pool (nearest neighbours were 3 miles away)...in a car (haven't we all)....and have been BJ'd whilst piloting a small aircraft!
All with GF's.....not wife.


----------



## batsociety (Jan 23, 2015)

People tend to go all out when they have affairs. They're already doing something risky and exciting, it makes them crazy. The possible consequences seem to be what drives them.

The legality of the limo thing is debatable - in my state it's kind of confusing. You can be charged if you do something in a place where anyone would reasonably expect to be seen - like a park, or a street corner, whatever. But then a heap of people get done for banging in single room bathrooms with locked doors. So even if you're not physically seen, if people have an idea of what you're doing that's good enough. There's also this sketchy law about being naked on state property. So either way, you get caught and you're screwed (in both ways). 

But dude, just keep in mind that replicating your wife's affair probably isn't going to help you at all.


----------



## justis (Mar 5, 2015)

Yeah. That's just it. I don't really want to replicate the act. I just want her willing to do it with ME. I'd rather find a relatively legal alternative, but the limo is like the perfect thing. I can't think of another semi public, private place to have sex that TOPS the limo. As I said, to me that's kind of the ultimate F. She said it was nothing. 2 minutes. That the sex WE have is far greater and better than the sex they had. I believe her. Still 2 minutes of bad sex with a beautiful, willing, hot to trot woman in back of a limo is memorable. I'd rather know that my wife would do that or something like that for me rather than for *******. Does that make sense?


----------



## T&T (Nov 16, 2012)

Justis,

I don't understand the logic, She had an affair and had sex in a limo many years ago and you want to do the same? No matter how you spin it you are replicating the act. 

Don't you think this may "trigger" her and the thought of doing it again may repulse her? A memory flashback? 

I'd suggest finding another way...I can't see this going well for either of you.


----------



## justis (Mar 5, 2015)

Well, what's another way? That's kind of what I'm asking. Of course I see that. But you know it was 25 years ago and we have done a lot of work on our relationship and dealing with the affair. This is just new info that set me spinning a little bit.


----------



## T&T (Nov 16, 2012)

justis said:


> Well, what's another way? That's kind of what I'm asking. Of course I see that. But you know it was 25 years ago and we have done a lot of work on our relationship and dealing with the affair. This is just new info that set me spinning a little bit.


My concern is that could harm your relationship by triggering her memory. I could see it ending in disaster...

Just google best places to have public sex. 

https://www.google.ca/search?q=publ...&oe=utf-8&gws_rd=cr&ei=XJMBVYmqDY36yAS9oYLIDA


----------



## justis (Mar 5, 2015)

I understand. I've googled that before. 

Here's the deal. I've asked her, wanted to have sex in the backyard, in the kitchen, in unusual places. The answer is always NO! Then she told me this and I'm like WTF? How come as*h*** got the prize? So to me for me to work this through i her to be willing to be dangerous. Obviously a limo is not a great idea. But with the tinted glass and you can park it anywhere it's an ideal sexual encounter machine. I want to find something that's better. I really do.


----------



## Flying_Dutchman (Oct 29, 2014)

So,, you're not interested in bondage,, you just want to have 'normal' sex with her in a limo cuz another guy did.

It'll be just like at home,, plus tinted windows, a vague awareness of motion and another guy watching your åss go up and down. Then you have to pull over if you want a post coital ciggy or the bathroom.

And you still won't enjoy it, cuz the green-eyed monster never lets go. You'll need to hear her tell you it was better than with OM and when she says "Sure, honey." you won't believe her anyway. Nature of the green beast.

You're buying into something that'll only cause you further misery if you persue it.


Jealousy is a negative emotion. It only gets bigger if you feed it.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## T&T (Nov 16, 2012)

Well, it's probably out of her comfort zone and had a moment where she caved. Alcohol induced maybe?

Why not start off more slowly? A very nice, quiet, dimly lit, restaurant where you can let your hands wander a bit. Go on a weeknight when it's a lot slower. Or, a late dinner after a few drinks. 

Baby steps...It may never turn her on, but there's only one way to find out.


----------



## happy as a clam (Jan 5, 2014)

One day after a shopping trip, my SO pulled into the garage, lowered the garage door, and proceeded to "do it" right there in the truck, in the garage. Surprised the h*ll out of me, and I must say it was fun! No need to worry about getting arrested as we were in the privacy of our own home (no kids to worry about either.)

I agree with the others. Make your own memories; don't try to re-create a tawdry sexual experience that she had with another man. The whole time she will be remembering him, and you will be triggering, thinking about her having sex with him.

Scrap the limo idea. Go for the garage.


----------



## justis (Mar 5, 2015)

I think some of you aren't hearing me. It's not sex in limo just bc green monster did. I've ALWAYS wanted that kind of sex and she's knows it. It was almost like a passive aggressive thing for her to do it with HIM rather than me.


----------



## justis (Mar 5, 2015)

Another thing to make clear. It was not an affair. She wasn't cheating. She left me.


----------



## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

*Provided that it can be seen and observed, even through the conveniece of tinted glass, then it's a "public indecency" rap~ in most jurisdictions, a misdemeanor offense!

But if it cannot be seen or observed ~ then it's largely nothing, other than two consenting adults having sexual relations!

No limo or garage experience here! Does doing it in a pickup truck either out in the woods or an open cow pasture remotely count?*


----------



## justis (Mar 5, 2015)

Another thing. I'm not jealous of this AH. not that I've never been jealous but I'm not the jealous type. Our marriage would never last if either of us were. I think he's an AH and he pisses me off. They both did. I don't believe in affairs. I've never had one and never will. So I'm not in fear of it jealous of the green monster. He's gone. 

Btw I like the garage idea.


----------



## happy as a clam (Jan 5, 2014)

arbitrator said:


> *
> But if it cannot be seen or observed ~ then it's largely nothing, other than two consenting adults having sexual relations!*


How about the limo driver patiently sitting up front with the privacy screen closed, feeling the car *rock like a hurricane* -- does that count as being "observed"??!! 

:lol:


----------



## Shoto1984 (Apr 11, 2009)

So maybe drop the whole "what happened in the past" part and just look at what you'd like. I'm hearing a more spontaneous / adventurous sex life. How about a more spontaneous / adventurous life in general with some fun sex thrown in? That might be a better approach that she might be more able and willing to go with. Are there things you both enjoy doing? Is there anything slightly "out there" you or she would like to try? Things that come to mind are spontaneous overnight or weekend trips. Maybe buy her a nice gift for absolutely no reason. Would she be into going for a trail ride on horses? Go dancing. Even a nice dinner and a movie if that's outside of your routine. I think if you set a tone of fun and spontaneity (ie feeling more alive and in the moment) you'll be on your way.


----------



## justis (Mar 5, 2015)

We do things. Go out to dinner. WE go on trips. Her job takes her places and sometimes we go together. I threw her two big extravaganza parties recently: one for her birthday atop a penthouse. It was a surprise and another where I got a tux, rented a "LIMO" bought her a 25 anniversary ring and we went to a great expensive restaurant. That was also a surprise. I buy her dresses sometimes. Christmas was big.

We have a great sex life. But nothing dangerous. I'm like a kid. I still am as sexually attracted to her as I was when we first met. She's like, "We just had sex last week!" I'd be happy with every night. And she loves the sex, although she also says she can take it or leave it. That has me confused. She always orgasms. Making sure she orgasms is as important for me as my own. Maybe more so. Sometimes it's twice a week, rarely three times. That'd be my goal.


----------



## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

happy as a clam said:


> How about the limo driver patiently sitting up front with the privacy screen closed, feeling the car *rock like a hurricane* -- does that count as being "observed"??!!
> 
> :lol:


*Got a friend of mine who I officiate football with that owns a limo service. He tells me that they are up front with their clients in telling them that they cannot be seen by outside sources of the vehicle, and as long as all parties are over the age of majority, if they subsequently request that the driver turn the camera off, then they will comply. They are also informed that if they engage in sexual conduct of any kind within the confines of the vehicle, then there will be a hefty tack-on surcharge. However, if they declare prior to actually contracting the vehicle, that sexual activity could occur within the scope of the evening, then they can pay a precontractual surcharge that is not nearly as much as the one for the undeclared spontaneous sex surcharge, normally referred to as a "cleaning fee."

He also told me that when ever anyone under the age of 21 rents the limo service, the camera stays on regardless, for liability purposes! And that the windows between the compartments remain open!*


----------



## happy as a clam (Jan 5, 2014)

Wow arb... who knew that "arranging" sex could be such a complicated financial transaction?!?!


----------



## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

happy as a clam said:


> Wow arb... who knew that "arranging" sex could be such a complicated financial transaction?!?!


*Trust me, m'dear! It's all about the money!

I've been talking to this guy about contracting a limo for my final game as a football referee, which should be in the next 2-3 years.

But let's just say that I'm not counting on any sex in there, more especially with a bunch of miscreants like those guys on my officiating crew!*


----------



## happy as a clam (Jan 5, 2014)

arbitrator said:


> *Trust me, m'dear! It's all about the money!
> 
> I've been talking to this guy about contracting a limo for my final game as a football referee, which should be in the next 2-3 years.
> 
> But let's just say that I'm not counting on any sex in there, more especially with a bunch of miscreants like those guys on my officiating crew!*


Well, just to be sure that you don't get hit with the super-duper upcharge AFTER the fact, go ahead and negotiate the upfront "discounted rate" for sex. You just never know...

:rofl:

(Sorry for the thread jack, OP)


----------



## Flying_Dutchman (Oct 29, 2014)

lol - I wanna see the contractual clauses now. 

If sex takes place, are 'spillages' assumed or do they have to be inspected for? I'd be miffed if I used a condom and paid the same surcharge as a couple who didn't.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Thor (Oct 31, 2011)

Justis, don't do the limo thing. It is guaranteed to be a disaster. If it goes poorly you will be even more disappointed that your wife wasn't into it with you. This happened when I tried to do midnight sex on the beach with my wife, and she declared "This isn't nearly as exciting as I expected". Yeah, but she used to do that with one (or more) of her bf's before we met. And now it isn't exciting with me?

But if it goes great you'll be wondering if it was good because she was remembering the fun she had with the other guy.

I think Shoto is correct that you should be thinking in terms of making things great now and into the future. Stop comparing to the past. You can never live up to the image in your own mind of what the past and the OM was like.

Do you have an idea what her resistance is due to? Just low libido? Or is she worried about her image? Does she thing she is a bit overweight?

Perhaps you can ease into more adventurous sex by first working on having more fun. Go out on more interesting dates, such as a piano bar rather than just a restaurant, for example.


----------



## justis (Mar 5, 2015)

Thor said:


> Justis, don't do the limo thing. It is guaranteed to be a disaster. If it goes poorly you will be even more disappointed that your wife wasn't into it with you. This happened when I tried to do midnight sex on the beach with my wife, and she declared "This isn't nearly as exciting as I expected". Yeah, but she used to do that with one (or more) of her bf's before we met. And now it isn't exciting with me?
> 
> But if it goes great you'll be wondering if it was good because she was remembering the fun she had with the other guy.
> 
> ...


Yeah. We also go to hotels. She's not overweight. She doesn't have an image problem. She knows she's fine. She works hard and getting ahead is what is primarily on her mind. She leads a multi million company and travels across the country. So sex is not really what gets her excited. Sorry to say. Buying a bigger house and car is what seems to give her a "boner." I'm not a corporate type. I'm a musician. She likes powerful men. 

We do go out to hear music sometimes. NBA games.


----------



## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

Shoto1984 said:


> So maybe drop the whole "what happened in the past" part and just look at what you'd like. I'm hearing a more spontaneous / adventurous sex life. How about a more spontaneous / adventurous life in general with some fun sex thrown in? That might be a better approach that she might be more able and willing to go with. Are there things you both enjoy doing? Is there anything slightly "out there" you or she would like to try? Things that come to mind are spontaneous overnight or weekend trips. Maybe buy her a nice gift for absolutely no reason. Would she be into going for a trail ride on horses? Go dancing. Even a nice dinner and a movie if that's outside of your routine. I think if you set a tone of fun and spontaneity (ie feeling more alive and in the moment) you'll be on your way.



This :iagree:

I think you missed shoto's point about adventure and spontinaity. You want it, she doesn't. Yet this OM had it and for a while she wanted it but she then rejected it. Why? Was it too much of a good thing? Since she rejected it, she has pigeonholed herself and its your job to bring her out of it.

And this is not a job for the faint of heart.

You said she likes bondage but you're not into it. Think about that for a minute. If a woman likes bondage why do you think that is? Being bound removes all responsibility and sense of agency so doing or acting outside of the proper roles we've resigned ourselves to becomes a much easier pill to swallow. 

She tried the spontaneous adventurous life, but it was too much. She turned it off and doesn't know how to turn it on part way. Only you can unlock those doers and she has given you a way, bondage.





justis said:


> We have a great sex life. But nothing dangerous. I'm like a kid. I still am as sexually attracted to her as I was when we first met. She's like, "We just had sex last week!" I'd be happy with every night. And she loves the sex, although she also says she can take it or leave it. That has me confused. She always orgasms. Making sure she orgasms is as important for me as my own. Maybe more so. Sometimes it's twice a week, rarely three times. That'd be my goal.



You sound like a fantastic husband who goes out of his way to make his wife feel loved. 

Get a pair of Velcro handcuffs, cuff her hands behind her back, play with her breasts for a while then tell her to give you a BJ. I think you'll find a highly excited woman who is eager to please and most especially be pleased.

She said she was interested, you said no. You said you wanted risky sex, she said no.

Stale mate. You blink, she blinks you both win!


----------



## justis (Mar 5, 2015)

No, I never said she liked bondage. The OM liked it. They did it for about a week she says until she said no more. The OM was a as*h**e. 

I like her in mini skirts. If she wore mini skirts just around the house once in awhile I'd be happy. She says she's too old for them. I say just wear them for me. You don't even need go out. In fact I'd prefer if you didn't. She wears lingerie every once in a great while. I love that. I finally got her to throw out all of her lame panties, so she only wears sexy panties now.


----------



## Maria Canosa Gargano (Jan 30, 2015)

arbitrator said:


> *Got a friend of mine who I officiate football with that owns a limo service. He tells me that they are up front with their clients in telling them that they cannot be seen by outside sources of the vehicle, and as long as all parties are over the age of majority, if they subsequently request that the driver turn the camera off, then they will comply. They are also informed that if they engage in sexual conduct of any kind within the confines of the vehicle, then there will be a hefty tack-on surcharge. However, if they declare prior to actually contracting the vehicle, that sexual activity could occur within the scope of the evening, then they can pay a precontractual surcharge that is not nearly as much as the one for the undeclared spontaneous sex surcharge, normally referred to as a "cleaning fee."
> 
> He also told me that when ever anyone under the age of 21 rents the limo service, the camera stays on regardless, for liability purposes! And that the windows between the compartments remain open!*


Where can I rent this service? :smthumbup:

But one question. Why 21? Is it to make sure that no one is sneaking alcohol on, or are they giving a few years as a buffer in case anyone is lying about their age.


----------



## justis (Mar 5, 2015)

The point I was making, and my theme for all of this and my ONLY problem, that might be being missed: She was willing to do that bondage thing for him, even though she didn't like it. That's totally not her. No way. Her unwillingness to do things for me, whether it's limo sex, or miniskirts or sex in the backyard is the theme. We DO have great sex. So DOES let me do things to her and she does things to me. Gives great and fantastic BJs, when she has too. LOL.We have sex more than she wants be less than I do. It's a compromise that works. Sometimes she really really is horny. When we do it I can make her horny every time. There are things I know how to do that gets her in the mood almost every time. The SEX isn't the problem. The past with the OM isn't even the problem. We've really dealt with that. It's just this new wrinkle on it that stands in contrast with what she's is NOW willing to do and not do.


----------



## Young at Heart (Jan 6, 2015)

justis said:


> I think some of you aren't hearing me. It's not sex in limo just bc green monster did. I've ALWAYS wanted that kind of sex and she's knows it. It was almost like a passive aggressive thing for her to do it with HIM rather than me.


I don't think it is a good idea, but you sure seem to want to do it.

My advice if you must do it, is call a couple of limo companies. Tell them that would like the evening services of one of their limo's and driver, and ask if they have deeply tinted windows that can't be seen in (often the case as long as interior lights are OFF!), that you want a limo with a privacy shield/screen between the passengers and the driver (some do, some don't). 

While your at it, ask if it has a built in bar and what the cost of liquor is or if you can bring a bottle of your own champagne? 

Then expect to be floored by the price! 

I have been in a number of limos associated with high end business meetings in NYC and in vacation resorts. They tend to be all over the place in terms of features.

P.S. If you do this have it stop at some view spot restaurant/bars (or fancy hotels) and wait for you while you and your spouse go in for a drink. At one of the spots, tell her to go to the bathroom and take off her panties. Then wander out to have the limo pick you up, knowing what will happen next. Good luck.


----------



## justis (Mar 5, 2015)

LOL. I have a friend who owns a limo service and have used the limo service already. I have another friend who is a limo driver and chauffeur. My friend who owns the limo business gives me great deals on pricing. I've talked about this with my driver friend already. 

The OM didn't ever do oral sex. IF I did this I'd probably just go down on my wife. I'm great at it and he never did this, limo or not!


----------



## justis (Mar 5, 2015)

BTW I want to make clear that the OM was an as*h*** not because he was into bondage. He was just an ass. He tended to get too rough and this upset my wife. As I said she's not into that stuff anyway. She was just trying to please him. I have nothing against it, I'm just not into it. She might like spanking. She asked me once after we got back together again. I tried to and we ended up laughing because it just wasn't us. And it seemed to be a hold over from OM.


----------



## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

Sorry I obviously mis read your posts.

Have you heard of this....

Mile High Club


----------



## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

Anon Pink said:


> Sorry I obviously mis read your posts.
> 
> Have you heard of this....
> 
> Mile High Club


*Anon: Does that mean that if a person "did it" up on top of Pike's Peak, that they would qualify for membership?*


----------



## Flying_Dutchman (Oct 29, 2014)

justis said:


> We have sex more than she wants be less than I do. It's a compromise that works.


Fantastic! A mature, mutual compromise.


So,,, 



justis said:


> The SEX isn't the problem. The past with the OM isn't even the problem. We've really dealt with that. It's just this new wrinkle on it that stands in contrast with what she's is NOW willing to do and not do.


,,, why consider messing that up by failing to accept her as she is NOW, with the boundaries she has NOW?

You haven't dealt with it. At least, not your own obvious need to compete with and beat the OM/àsshole.

First the bondage and the limo (that he did, you haven't),, now going down on her in the limo cuz that's a thing he didn't do. It's like, "He's beating me at the net so I'll lob the båstard!"

You can deny it's jealousy all you like,, but you resent the things he did and you want to best him by doing stuff he didn't do.

Competing,, for a prize you've already won.

Didn't you ever hear the phrase, "Never argue with an idiot. They'll drag you down to their level and beat you with experience." - ?


Well,, you're competing with an àsshole and you're in danger of losing the same way. By becoming the 'best' àsshole.

How? By letting a decades old event interfere with your head and potentially ruin an otherwise good relationship with your wife if you don't accept her as she is NOW.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## justis (Mar 5, 2015)

Flying_Dutchman said:


> ,,, why consider messing that up by failing to accept her as she is NOW, with the boundaries she has NOW?
> 
> You haven't dealt with it. At least, not your own obvious need to compete with and beat the OM/àsshole.
> 
> ...


Well yep. I think this is the truest thing so far. I AM competing with *******. He had the ultimate f*** with MY wife. Jealous? Hm. Could be. I haven't thought of it that way. 

We dealt with the the fact that the betrayal happened and why it happened and what my role in it was-- why she even looked outside the marriage. I definitely own some culpability in this. 

I DO feel that what's the deal with me grabbing your ass? Why won't you wear miniskirts? Why don't we screw in the backyard? You did these things with him. 

Yes, she's not that person any more. She's realized this was a terrible time in her life. She doesn't look back at these events with fond memories. She's deeply ashamed. And yes, my bringing it up to her is perhaps a passive aggressive act of pushing her nose in it. "See? You did this to me!" And I've even got ED since finding out about this limo thing. 

So it has started as my effort to become cause over this thing. How can I strike back at this psychological damaged I've got -- perhaps from this? My answer has been to find a substitute or a replacement, or even do it myself - with her in limo, or in garage, backyard, mountain top, a boat. Whatever. The mistake some people make is to have a revenge affair. I don't believe in affairs or betrayal. And it only makes it far, far worse. Is this he same thing? Yes, perhaps it is. 

But there is a sense of her making up damage done. OK, so great. Let's go crazy. Then let's put it behind us.


----------



## alexm (Nov 29, 2008)

justis said:


> Well, what's another way? That's kind of what I'm asking. Of course I see that. But you know it was 25 years ago and we have done a lot of work on our relationship and dealing with the affair. This is just new info that set me spinning a little bit.


This is semi-facetious, but why stop there? Why not ask her what other interesting things she's done with boyfriends before you, and then try to replicate them?

I get that it's because of the affair itself. You were with her before and after this guy, and that hurts your ego.

But the long and the short of it is this: people will do different things with different people. The affair is a red herring, and you're stuck on it. Your wife has likely done things with other men, before you, that she has not (or will not) do with you, either. And probably vice versa.

The only reason this should bother you is if this is something you wanted to do with her BEFORE her affair, yet she refused, and did with the OM anyway. Simply because it's something she did with the OM and not with you is no reason to want it, nor will it soothe your ego, I promise you. It has nothing to do with you not being good enough for her to do it in a limo with. It has everything to do with it being a thing she happened to do with the OM, perhaps on a whim. And clearly not something she wants to repeat. Because flashbacks, that's why.


----------



## justis (Mar 5, 2015)

alexm said:


> This is semi-facetious, but why stop there? Why not ask her what other interesting things she's done with boyfriends before you, and then try to replicate them?
> 
> I get that it's because of the affair itself. You were with her before and after this guy, and that hurts your ego.
> 
> ...


That's what I'm trying to say. This type of thing is exactly the type of thing I wanted to do before we got married and/or in the early days of our relationship. She showed no interest but she did with him. 

\And of course you're right. It's nothing she wants to do again. And it was on a whim, probably to prove how much she's willing to do for him, for whatever reason. 

As a matter of fact I have no interest in what she did with boyfriends before we got together. I WISH she had had sex with them in limos. That would lesson the ego bruise a little. In fact the idea of her having sex with some guy in a limo turns me on a little. Just not with him. LOL. And I know quite a bit about former boyfriends and sex. Doesn't bother me a bit. It's the betrayal. Of course it is. And mainly, in this case the fact that type of sexual activity I've always been interested in she has refused. In fact I think her doing it to him is a passive aggressive act against me exactly because it is the type of thing I always wanted.


----------



## I Don't Know (Oct 8, 2013)

I'm on the fence about this. That said, even if she did do it, it won't solve anything. It'll just be something else, wondering if it was better with him, or even the fact that you had to ask and he just got it. 

I believe she should want to do all kinds of crazy with you. But fact is she doesn't. Would she want to with someone else? Who knows. Do you have anything that was "just for you" and not the OM? If so it might help to focus on that.


----------



## justis (Mar 5, 2015)

Anon Pink said:


> Sorry I obviously mis read your posts.
> 
> Have you heard of this....
> 
> Mile High Club


No problem. Yes, of course I have heard of the Mile High Club. It seems to be one of the least erotic places I can imagine. But in part because I've thought of those tiny bathrooms. Buying an expensive ride on a plane that specializes in that sort of thing takes some of the spontaneity, don't you think? She's in planes every week and I'm blah about them. But thats for the idea! It's otherwise a good one. 

If I sailed that'd be a perfect place - sail boat. But alas.


----------



## justis (Mar 5, 2015)

I Don't Know said:


> I'm on the fence about this. That said, even if she did do it, it won't solve anything. It'll just be something else, wondering if it was better with him, or even the fact that you had to ask and he just got it.
> 
> I believe she should want to do all kinds of crazy with you. But fact is she doesn't. Would she want to with someone else? Who knows. Do you have anything that was "just for you" and not the OM? If so it might help to focus on that.


Oh yeah. We have great sex. I'm into oral everything. She loves that. She calls me her great lover. He was into oral nothing. Traditional and bondage. I'm into creative, some romantic. 

I really believe I won't ever wonder whether it was better with him. She might be reminded of that, since she did it with him and I'm obsessed with this thing. But I know I'm a better lover than he was. 

My wife and I are truth tellers, as painful as it might be. For us, that's the only way.


----------



## jorgegene (May 26, 2012)

arbitrator said:


> *Anon: Does that mean that if a person "did it" up on top of Pike's Peak, that they would qualify for membership?*


personally, I vote YES!


----------



## jorgegene (May 26, 2012)

ooops.

I forgot. Denver is 5,280 feet (one mile high). That means everybody that does it there belongs too?


----------



## Flying_Dutchman (Oct 29, 2014)

justis said:


> I DO feel that what's the deal with me grabbing your ass? Why won't you wear miniskirts? Why don't we screw in the backyard? You did these things with him.
> 
> Yes, she's not that person any more. She's realized this was a terrible time in her life. She doesn't look back at these events with fond memories. She's deeply ashamed. And yes, my bringing it up to her is perhaps a passive aggressive act of pushing her nose in it. "See? You did this to me!" And I've even got ED since finding out about this limo thing.
> 
> So it has started as my effort to become cause over this thing. How can I strike back at this psychological damaged I've got -- perhaps from this?


Not just you,, most everyone 'stuck' in these situations focuses on the negative. That's something only you can fix. Not by lashing out with 'substitutes' cuz that won't make you feel better and might hurt her. You focus on the positives.

First, you won the prize. 

Then, the rest of it, like,,

Did it occur to you that maybe she never liked bondage and sex in limos,, but never realised that till she'd actually done it?

Maybe she left him cuz he always wanted to tie her up in tool sheds,,, and returned to you cuz you're happy to have sex in a bed.

Teenagers fùck like rabbits and think they're 'soulmates'. Six months later they hate each others' guts. There's more to a good relationship than sex.


You reached a compromise with your wife. Maybe he was a cràp compromiser - another reason she came back to you.

She concluded he's an åsshole too.


She went on a misguided voyage of discovery,, didn't like what she found and came back with a better knowledge of what she likes. You,, and 'normal' sex in beds.

The potential effect of focusing on the negative could drive a wedge between you and drive her away.

Maybe you pressuring her about the skirts and grabbing her ass reminds her of him insisting she cuffs herself, or whatever. A taker,, not a giver. Reminds her of an åsshole she left and a time she was ashamed of.

You're letting something she did (and regrets) for 15 mins ruin your own present and, potentially, your wedded future.

Likely, the limo 'scene' is representative,, a manifestation,,, of all your concerns regarding the affair. All the pent up anger looking for an outlet.

Understandable,, but it's a mirage. No water (solution) there by replicating it.

She's at the root of the anger but the way you process it is down to you.

You've negotiated a sex life. Try talking to her about this without the pressuring or anger.

You're half way to recognising it's down to you. If you can't manage it as a couple get yourself some therapy. That should help you maintain positive focusing.

Try that. Stay focused on what you have rather than on the myth you've built up around the limo thing.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## justis (Mar 5, 2015)

I can't like this on my iPhone, but I would if I could. BTW I'm
Not focusing oh the negative. This is only a small part that has grabbed my attention. I try and do things with her beyond sex. Duh. And I'm grateful for the sex we do have. And I'm coming to grips with as$hole. He was 15 years her senior! She was 25 or something. Still young enough to be stupid. 

Thanks.


----------



## justis (Mar 5, 2015)

That 50 Shades of Grey thing. She hated it. Put the book down after only a few pages. Thought it was disgusting. I have wondered whether it reminds her of that.


----------



## Oldmatelot (Mar 28, 2011)

Craziest place we have ever done it is in the captains chair on the bridge of a Royal Naval warship. Onboard party alongside.


----------



## WonkyNinja (Feb 28, 2013)

askari said:


> I've had sex in afew (for me!) 'creative' places...outside by a swimming pool (nearest neighbours were 3 miles away)...in a car (haven't we all)....and have been BJ'd whilst piloting a small aircraft!
> All with GF's.....not wife.


So you had the control wheel and she had the joystick?


----------



## WonkyNinja (Feb 28, 2013)

happy as a clam said:


> How about the limo driver patiently sitting up front with the privacy screen closed, feeling the car *rock like a hurricane* -- does that count as being "observed"??!!
> 
> :lol:


If OP is really lucky then Limo driver will be feeding the hidden webcam through his phone link and they may be observed by many on Limo drivers PPV website.


----------



## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

hose bed of a fire engine.


----------



## Fozzy (Jul 20, 2013)

Flying_Dutchman said:


> So,, you're not interested in bondage,, you just want to have 'normal' sex with her in a limo cuz another guy did.
> 
> It'll be just like at home,, plus tinted windows, a vague awareness of motion and another guy watching your åss go up and down. Then you have to pull over if you want a post coital ciggy or the bathroom.
> 
> ...


Nailed it.

OP, you say you aren't jealous, but you're hung up on why the a-hole got the prize and now you want the prize too. How is that not jealousy?

I understand what you're feeling, and I'd be lying if I said I might not be feeling the same thing if I was in your situation, God forbid. But acting out on this is just not going to go well for you.

You said this was a long time ago. Maybe she doesn't want to do this anymore not because of you, but because of her age. Maybe she's grown out of wanting public sex. Maybe she found out the first time around that she just didn't like it. 

Find some other direction to take your sex life that you can look back at and say "that's just for us". It will be a lot more satisfying in the long run.


----------



## Voltaire2013 (Sep 22, 2013)

Justis, 

How and when did you find out about the limo thing? I have a feeling it's recent. And I'm reading you loud and clear on the hurt. She did things with him/for him she would never do for you. You can read all the threads which mention this very same thing, affair sex is naughty sex, things are done by a woman in rapture that she would never share with her husband. It's devastating to the ego, no matter how the clinicians explain it.

Cheers,
V(13)


justis said:


> That 50 Shades of Grey thing. She hated it. Put the book down after only a few pages. Thought it was disgusting. I have wondered whether it reminds her of that.


----------



## justis (Mar 5, 2015)

Fozzy said:


> Nailed it.
> 
> OP, you say you aren't jealous, but you're hung up on why the a-hole got the prize and now you want the prize too. How is that not jealousy?
> 
> ...


Could be. I see what some are saying about jealously. I'm not jealous of HIM. He's an as$hole who went to prison. There's nothing redeemable about this guy. I'm jealous that he got her to do something I didn't. Ok. I'll buy that. 

She's grown up. She's a successful and well respected professional woman. I'm asking her to do something childish and perhaps a little ****tish. And something that reminds her of how terrible she treated me.


----------



## justis (Mar 5, 2015)

Voltaire2013 said:


> Justis,
> 
> How and when did you find out about the limo thing? I have a feeling it's recent. And I'm reading you loud and clear on the hurt. She did things with him/for him she would never do for you. You can read all the threads which mention this very same thing, affair sex is naughty sex, things are done by a woman in rapture that she would never share with her husband. It's devastating to the ego, no matter how the clinicians explain it.
> 
> ...


We had a crises in October. We had some counseling. Saved our marriage. In the process we talked about this debacle that happened when she left me almost 25 years ago. We had thought it had all been talked out. We thought all the details had been laid bare. She was asked if there's anything else I perhaps didn't know. And she said this - like I'm not sure I told him this or not. It came out casually. It also so happened that it occurred outside a restaurant we used to go to. The place is owned by a friend of mine. He could have seen them at his restaurant as he's the kind of guy who's always there and greeting guests. I don't know. And then I they both got up and went to the parked limo, did it and came back to rejoin their party. Oh yes and they screwed every night. I knew that part already. LOL. 

It just suddenly hit me like a ton of bricks. I hadn't known about this. I hadn't pictured them f***ing before. I had also been able to just blame him a little more. He wooed her away from me in a moment of weakness. He was wealthy and could help her professionally. But here she is the one who planned this evening. She paid for the limo. A surprise I think. She said she couldn't really afford it, but she did it. She doesn't know why. I know her. She likes to impress her man. She likes to impress me too, but never with a limo or something quite that extravagant. Suddenly I saw that *SHE* did this. *SHE * got the limo. SHE took him to one of our restaurants. I'm pretty sure SHE gave him that look and took him by the hand and led him to the limo. I think I know her pretty well. 

Yes, a long time ago. Yes I hadn't been the most responsive, sensitive husband. But I didn't deserve to be treated like that. She left me and our first born, 8 month old son. It was a disaster of epic proportions. I had washed my hands of her after trying to get her back failed. And after some bouts of cruelty I realized there isn't anyway I could have anything to do with her. But it took awhile for her to realize. And she begged and begged and apologized and was in despair. We slowly built what he could out of the ashes. And we built a very successful marriage, I thought. 

But in October she suddenly wanted to leave me. No affair. No man. But this all came rushing back. The only thing that hit me hard was this thing. I'll get over it. But this is some of the baggage that comes with it. Yeah, it's not just the limo and not just an affair. Far deeper waters than that. And not jealously. F that. Very deep seated anger and resentment. Make no mistake. I love her deeply. She is the love of my life. I'd die for her. I just will no longer be taken advantage of. Certainly not like that. And yes, there are times when I feel I'm due. Mini skirts every once in awhile around the house would do fine. I'd be happy with having sex in the living room in under her mini skirt. And I get resentful when she says no. And I don't think that's too much to ask.


----------



## justis (Mar 5, 2015)

Personal said:


> Forgive my ignorance here, because I may have misread your post but didn't your wife cheat on you with this man in a limousine and didn't she cheat on you with him for 8 weeks of sex?
> 
> In other words she may have enjoyed it and you may remind her that she enjoyed it by getting her to watch/participate in reruns. If you want her sexual adventures with other men to come to the front of her mind so that she is thinking about other men, feel free to pursue this.
> 
> Otherwise let it go and make your own history with her instead of reliving another mans history.


I HAVE made my own memories with her. That was 25 years ago with this creep. Two children later. We've had far greater sex together than she had with him. I believe her when she tells me this. I know how good it is. I also know she doesn't lie to me about these things. She'll say things that are hard to hear. But this I believe. Our sex in a limo would be nothing like their sex. Nothing. I'm getting over this idea. But some people here like to play therapist and assume things they don't know. 

Last years she told me that she seriously doubts there are many women who can boast that their husband brings them to orgasm every time they have sex. The unfortunate truth is it's not through intercourse. But I do get her to come without fail. I have no doubts that our sexual relationship is a great one and far better than what she had with d**k wad. I could give you details but there's no need. He could do somethings well. But there are reasons I got the prize. Sex is a reason. I'm not intimidated by him sexually. I'm not. You'll just have to trust me or not. Even with my ED thing that's going on. It is probably a part of this thing too.


----------



## Voltaire2013 (Sep 22, 2013)

Justis,

She held onto that tidbit, didn't she? Then says it casually? That's plain awful and I hope you called her out on it. Who would you say leads the marriage, or is it shared responsibility? What was the reason in October? Who usually initiates sex? You're hitting close to home for me. 

Cheers,
V(13)



justis said:


> We had a crises in October. We had some counseling. Saved our marriage. In the process we talked about this debacle that happened when she left me almost 25 years ago. We had thought it had all been talked out. We thought all the details had been laid bare. She was asked if there's anything else I perhaps didn't know. And she said this - like I'm not sure I told him this or not. It came out casually. It also so happened that it occurred outside a restaurant we used to go to. The place is owned by a friend of mine. He could have seen them at his restaurant as he's the kind of guy who's always there and greeting guests. I don't know. And then I they both got up and went to the parked limo, did it and came back to rejoin their party. Oh yes and they screwed every night. I knew that part already. LOL.
> 
> It just suddenly hit me like a ton of bricks. I hadn't known about this. I hadn't pictured them f***ing before. I had also been able to just blame him a little more. He wooed her away from me in a moment of weakness. He was wealthy and could help her professionally. But here she is the one who planned this evening. She paid for the limo. A surprise I think. She said she couldn't really afford it, but she did it. She doesn't know why. I know her. She likes to empress her man. She likes to empress me too, but never with a limo or something quite that extravagant. Suddenly I saw that *SHE* did this. *SHE * got the limo. SHE took him to one of our restaurants. I'm pretty sure SHE gave him that look and took him by the hand and led him to the limo. I think I know her pretty well.
> 
> ...


----------



## justis (Mar 5, 2015)

Voltaire2013 said:


> Justis,
> 
> She held onto that tidbit, didn't she? Then says it casually? That's plain awful and I hope you called her out on it.


I did call her on it. But we had put this stuff so far behind us it really caught us BOTH by surprise how I reacted to it. She can be passive aggressive for sure.



> Who would you say leads the marriage, or is it shared responsibility?


 She leads the marriage I'm afraid to say, but it's the apparency of a shared marriage. It's supposed to be. I was the stay at home dad and basically raised our sons. She earns more than I do.

One of our issues was her making decisions without my input which I will no longer tolerate. Not even the small things. 




> What was the reason in October?


The reason in October was her tiring of me not making enough money. Not really helping enough. Her job responsibilities were and still are incredibly stressful. I think her coming in from the road and me hounding her about sex was no longer attractive. I hadn't really picked up the stick. I hadn't been romantic or taken her out and spoiled her. 25 years of marriage. We hit our doldrums. That's the death knell for any marriage. It takes work, creativity and passion. In her defense she HAD done a lot through they years to prop us up. She HAD done what she could to impress me and make up damage. To be the good wife. I think she came to her end. THEN I had to woo her. Even after all that she deserved to have the man of her dreams. She deserves a great guy. I am that great guy. I think she knows that again now. But I'm suddenly wounded again. And these are dangerous wounds.


> Who usually initiates sex? You're hitting close to home for me.
> 
> Cheers,
> V(13)


I am always pressing her for sex and she is almost always saying no. So when we have it is when SHE decides it's time. That is unless it's a special thing like we go out of town and take a hotel or have a prearranged date. Even then she can beg off until I whine enough for her to give in. Sometimes I'll start slowly by massaging her feet and just getting her hot. 



Good questions. Thanks for understanding.


----------



## Fozzy (Jul 20, 2013)

It happened over 20 years ago, but for you it just happened yesterday because you just found out about it. It's new anger and new resentment, regardless of how old the deed was. What are the chances you can get her back in to marriage counseling for a little more therapy--or barring that, what about a little IC for you to help you work through this?


----------



## justis (Mar 5, 2015)

Personal said:


> Despite that, you think it's a good idea to revisit another man's history.
> 
> 
> 
> What is your marriage worth?


Limo or mini skirt? I'm talking mini skirt. He had nothing to do with that. He was going to get her breast implants. He did that for all of his women.


----------



## justis (Mar 5, 2015)

Fozzy said:


> It happened over 20 years ago, but for you it just happened yesterday because you just found out about it. It's new anger and new resentment, regardless of how old the deed was. What are the chances you can get her back in to marriage counseling for a little more therapy--or barring that, what about a little IC for you to help you work through this?


Maybe.


----------



## Fozzy (Jul 20, 2013)

Did the issue of the mismatched sex drives get addressed in the previous round of therapy? That's a MAJOR issue for the HD spouse (you) and compounded with these new revelations I'm willing to bet the anger from one issue is feeding off the other.

Think about it. In your view, your wife doesn't really want to have sex with you that much under any circumstances, then at the SAME TIME you get slapped with a mind movie of her chasing after some piece of crap and making plans for them to have sex in public. You're trying to reconcile those two things at the same time and it's difficult to separate then from now. The reason you're having a sexual mismatch now is for reasons wholly separate from what happened then, but because of the timing of the revelation, its getting all glommed up together for you.


----------



## justis (Mar 5, 2015)

Fozzy said:


> Did the issue of the mismatched sex drives get addressed in the previous round of therapy? That's a MAJOR issue for the HD spouse (you) and compounded with these new revelations I'm willing to bet the anger from one issue is feeding off the other.
> 
> Think about it. In your view, your wife doesn't really want to have sex with you that much under any circumstances, then at the SAME TIME you get slapped with a mind movie of her chasing after some piece of crap and making plans for them to have sex in public. You're trying to reconcile those two things at the same time and it's difficult to separate then from now. The reason you're having a sexual mismatch now is for reasons wholly separate from what happened then, but because of the timing of the revelation, its getting all glommed up together for you.


Exactomundo. The HD of me is not as huge an issue. She will accommodate me at least once a week. I'm not great with that, but at least it's not less. And if I claim blue balls, she's accommodating. LOL. She must've had a high school boyfriend that accused her of giving him blue balls, so she doesn't want to be accused of that! LOL. 

She considers twice a week, but says I'm dreaming if I want more than that! Lol. 

But you're correct. It's all glommed together in this one bunch. And they are separate issues. For sure. We did not deal with frequency of sex per se. She and I talked about it in planning, but it was not a part of our therapy. We were just trying to save our marriage at that point.


----------



## Fozzy (Jul 20, 2013)

I really think you should get back into MC with her if she's willing. Either one of those issues could wreck things, but both together...


And the kicker is that for HER, neither of these issues are recent, nor critical so she's probably having trouble wrapping her mind around why they're big deals to YOU. MC might help her adjust to those ideas, as well as give you both a path to work through them.


----------



## Voltaire2013 (Sep 22, 2013)

justis said:


> I did call her on it. But we had put this stuff so far behind us it really caught us BOTH by surprise how I reacted to it. She can be passive aggressive for sure.
> 
> She leads the marriage I'm afraid to say, but it's the apparency of a shared marriage. It's supposed to be. I was the stay at home dad and basically raised our sons. She earns more than I do.
> 
> One of our issues was her making decisions without my input which I will no longer tolerate. Not even the small things.


That's a good start. You need to lead your marriage. Not is a sexist 'me man, you woman' kinda way, but in an assertive, confident Man way. Have you read Married Mans Sex Life Primer? It's not the be all end all of self help books, but I imagine you'll have quite a few aha! Moments reading it. She wants you to lead, it's not about being the primary breadwinner, it's about taking charge so she doesn't feel like she has to. 




> The reason in October was her tiring of me not making enough money. Not really helping enough. Her job responsibilities were and still are incredibly stressful. I think her coming in from the road and me hounding her about sex was no longer attractive. I hadn't really picked up the stick. I hadn't been romantic or taken her out and spoiled her. 25 years of marriage. We hit our doldrums. That's the death knell for any marriage. It takes work, creativity and passion. In her defense she HAD done a lot through they years to prop us up. She HAD done what she could to impress me and make up damage. To be the good wife. I think she came to her end. THEN I had to woo her. Even after all that she deserved to have the man of her dreams. She deserves a great guy. I am that great guy. I think she knows that again now. But I'm suddenly wounded again. And these are dangerous wounds.
> I am always pressing her for sex and she is almost always saying no. So when we have it is when SHE decides it's time. That is unless it's a special thing like we go out of town and take a hotel or have a prearranged date. Even then she can beg off until I whine enough for her to give in. Sometimes I'll start slowly by massaging her feet and just getting her hot.


See book above for more answers to this. Has she ever compared you to being another child for her to care for? I'm probably projecting here. 


Get back to dating and romancing her. Plan something for just the two of you and don't act all butt hurt if you don't have sex afterwards. Keep at it, but also make sure those resentments of yours from way back when are addressed. I have a feeling the limo revaluation opened the door in your mind to that room you keep locked up. Use the search feature here on resentments, a lot of the posts I read gave me clarity on how to handle them. Don't ever beg for sex again, ramp it up so she comes to you. Plenty of info here on how to get to that state. 

I'm glad you both overcame the Oct event but obviously there are lingering issues. I saw mentioned in posts after mine that you are HD, implying she is LD, that may be true but the D is not drive, it's desire. Be the man that she wants and needs. 






> Good questions. Thanks for understanding.


I'm trying, just as you are. This place is a goldmine for those who listen. Hell, you have women telling you how to seduce here, and for free! It all starts in her mind. 

Just curious, what do you play? I'm thinking guitar or piano. 

Cheers,
V(13)


----------



## justis (Mar 5, 2015)

Fozzy said:


> I really think you should get back into MC with her if she's willing. Either one of those issues could wreck things, but both together...
> 
> 
> And the kicker is that for HER, neither of these issues are recent, nor critical so she's probably having trouble wrapping her mind around why they're big deals to YOU. MC might help her adjust to those ideas, as well as give you both a path to work through them.


That's true. She's having a hard time understanding why I'm so messed up over this thing. 

I told her a couple of weeks ago, "Come on. You gave him, my rival . . " 

"He's NOT your rival!" 

"Well I know, but in a sense he is. You gave HIM the ultimate f***."

Exasperated she said, "How's that the ultimate f***? It wasn't even good. Two minutes. It was nothing. It wasn't even anything for him." 

"Yeah well I don't know. For a guy, or at least for me, screwing a beautiful woman in the back of a limo outside a restaurant is a pretty big deal, even if it's not good. You're not going to forget that any time soon."


----------



## justis (Mar 5, 2015)

Voltaire2013 said:


> That's a good start. You need to lead your marriage. Not is a sexist 'me man, you woman' kinda way, but in an assertive, confident Man way. Have you read Married Mans Sex Life Primer? It's not the be all end all of self help books, but I imagine you'll have quite a few aha! Moments reading it. She wants you to lead, it's not about being the primary breadwinner, it's about taking charge so she doesn't feel like she has to.


Hm. I may have over stated somethings. I'm not a passive person at all. I'm very assertive actually. But something's she has just done without me knowing. Whenever I found out the **** hits the fan, sometimes with as much gentleness as I can muster. 

I have not read it and I'm not a self help person. I have a lot of mother wit and self knowledge of my own. But thanks. Who knows? I might check it out!





> Has she ever compared you to being another child for her to care for? I'm probably projecting here.


Never thank god. She has mentioned resentment about being a patron for the artist. LOL. Perhaps she's not home enough to make this claim. Remember I'm home a lot more than she is. 




> Get back to dating and romancing her. Plan something for just the two of you and don't act all butt hurt if you don't have sex afterwards. Keep at it, but also make sure those resentments of yours from way back when are addressed. I have a feeling the limo revaluation opened the door in your mind to that room you keep locked up. Use the search feature here on resentments, a lot of the posts I read gave me clarity on how to handle them. Don't ever beg for sex again, ramp it up so she comes to you. Plenty of info here on how to get to that state.


Once again I think I over stated begging for sex. Pressure might be a better term. I've never begged. I've never even asked. It's generally an implied touch or a raised eyebrow or joking like, "seems like a good time to me." But if she refuses I might mope and look a bit dejected or flop over in bed, but never beg and never press it much further. 



> I'm glad you both overcame the Oct event but obviously there are lingering issues. I saw mentioned in posts after mine that you are HD, implying she is LD, that may be true but the D is not drive, it's desire. Be the man that she wants and needs.


Yep. That's what I'm working on. I saw what she was talking about like I never had before. I always thought I was such a great guy. Everyone thought I was a great guy. One of the obstacles she had to overcome was everyone thinking I'm such a great guy and how could she ever consider leaving me. Well in truth I wasn't such a great guy. I was pretty self centered. She was always the one planning the birthday parties and making dinner arrangements and weekend getaways or vacations. I was always saying, "Sounds like a great idea!"

Well I've changed. I have to be careful to now fall back into old patterns. But yes, I've done some great parties and surprises and spared little expense to give her the best that I got. She deserves this. 







> I'm trying, just as you are. This place is a goldmine for those who listen. Hell, you have women telling you how to seduce here, and for free! It all starts in her mind.
> 
> Just curious, what do you play? I'm thinking guitar or piano.
> 
> ...


Good guess. Guitar.


----------



## Fozzy (Jul 20, 2013)

justis said:


> That's true. She's having a hard time understanding why I'm so messed up over this thing.
> 
> I told her a couple of weeks ago, "Come on. You gave him, my rival . . "
> 
> ...


Was he your rival a year ago? Or only since the new information?


----------



## justis (Mar 5, 2015)

Fozzy said:


> Was he your rival a year ago? Or only since the new information?


Neither. 25 years ago. He's the one my wife left me for 25 years ago. She left for a few months. Me and the boy. I never met him. I never competed with him. He just saw her, decided marriage meant nothing. Hired her for his company. Wooed her. He had to have her and got her, for a time. 

No. He's not my rival. She's right. But in the sense that 25 years ago he took her from me, with her consent, made him a rival. In that sense he will always be my rival. He's the one who took her. He's the one she saw fit to leave me and her son for briefly. She was momentarily insane. That's the way we look at it. Postpartum. She lost her pregnancy weight quick. Probably was feeling vulnerable and not attractive after having a baby. This guy saw her and went CRAZY. She's a very attractive woman. I think she's more attractive now than she was then. And she STILL gets attention from much younger men. And there have been flirtations. Hell I've had major flirtations too. That's not the problem. The problem is what you do with them.


----------



## Voltaire2013 (Sep 22, 2013)

Overall it sounds like you're on three right path. Think of the book I mentioned as a couple of lessons with Satriani. Not Segovia mind you, but a great companion. ;-)

Ask anyone I work with and I'm the greatest guy ever too. A crazy girlfriend once told me something I should have listened to - 'why can't you be the guy at home that you are at work?' She worked with me and I took no bullsh1t. I'd get home and be passive. The key is being aware of your actions. It takes time and self correction. You seem to be there. 

A phrase I learned here when dealing with bullsh1t like decision making with out me is an unemotional 'I'm not happy with xxxx' don't freak, be calm and logical. Let her know you would not do same to her and you would appreciate the respect and courtesy in the future. Go from there. Trust me, I was a compete ass in my marriage for a few (ahem) years. She hated that her girlfriends all thought I was the cats meow compared to their husbands, but she was right. Also, don't be surprised if she's unsure this is a long term change and not a short term fix. Let her judge you by your actions. 

Only recently did my wife start initiating sex at times, prior it was all me, or all my hand, some Guinness and a helluva lot of resentment. She tells me it's like I turned a switch back on. It took 2 years to get there. 2 friggin years! In the end it was worth it all, but it's a long game.

Regarding your ED, once her walls were down and we had a more emotionally connected sex life, I lost all my staying power. I really don't believe in Judaeo-Christian God watching over all of us, but if he does exist, this is what he does to let us know.  During our 'lean years' of sex I could go all night. Thanks Obama!

You need to resolve the limo thing for you, and see how she can help. I have a feeling she has a boatload of resentments too. You both need to have a good talk about this, maybe with a therapist. When I finally did she told me she 'checked out', but we got past that. Not easy, but we did. 

I terms of leadership, something as simple as me replying to 'where do you want to go to dinner?' Answered with 'I don't know where do you want to go?' Drove her up a wall. Seems inconsequential, but it matters, that's where the book I mentioned helps. 

Sounds like you have the right idea, it's all about making it happen. 

I wish you all the luck I can. I'm sure the mini skirts are not far off. ;-) I wound up buying my wife lingerie, picking it out with her to see what she likes as well. It doesn't come out everytime, but it's in the rotation, which is a far cry from 2 years ago.

Also, not really a good guess on guitar, us Bass players make no money unless we are session musicians or super Jazz aficionados. Drummers are crazy people. Simple deduction. Off topic, best Pink Floyd album - WYWH, or Animals? 

Cheers,
V(13)



justis said:


> Hm. I may have over stated somethings. I'm not a passive person at all. I'm very assertive actually. But something's she has just done without me knowing. Whenever I found out the **** hits the fan, sometimes with as much gentleness as I can muster.
> 
> I have not read it and I'm not a self help person. I have a lot of mother wit and self knowledge of my own. But thanks. Who knows? I might check it out!
> 
> ...


----------



## Nucking Futs (Apr 8, 2013)

justis said:


> BTW I want to make clear that the OM was an as*h*** not because he was into bondage. He was just an ass. He tended to get too rough and this upset my wife. As I said she's not into that stuff anyway. *She was just trying to please him.* I have nothing against it, I'm just not into it. She might like spanking. She asked me once after we got back together again. I tried to and we ended up laughing because it just wasn't us. And it seemed to be a hold over from OM.





justis said:


> That's what I'm trying to say. This type of thing is exactly the type of thing I wanted to do before we got married and/or in the early days of our relationship. She showed no interest but she did with him.
> 
> \And of course you're right. It's nothing she wants to do again. *And it was on a whim, probably to prove how much she's willing to do for him, for whatever reason. *
> 
> As a matter of fact I have no interest in what she did with boyfriends before we got together. I WISH she had had sex with them in limos. That would lesson the ego bruise a little. In fact the idea of her having sex with some guy in a limo turns me on a little. Just not with him. LOL. And I know quite a bit about former boyfriends and sex. Doesn't bother me a bit. It's the betrayal. Of course it is. *And mainly, in this case the fact that type of sexual activity I've always been interested in she has refused.* In fact I think her doing it to him is a passive aggressive act against me exactly because it is the type of thing I always wanted.





justis said:


> I did call her on it. But we had put this stuff so far behind us it really caught us BOTH by surprise how I reacted to it. She can be passive aggressive for sure.
> 
> She leads the marriage I'm afraid to say, but it's the apparency of a shared marriage. It's supposed to be. I was the stay at home dad and basically raised our sons. She earns more than I do.
> 
> ...





Fozzy said:


> Did the issue of the mismatched sex drives get addressed in the previous round of therapy? That's a MAJOR issue for the HD spouse (you) and compounded with these new revelations I'm willing to bet the anger from one issue is feeding off the other.
> 
> Think about it. In your view, *your wife doesn't really want to have sex with you* that much under any circumstances, then at the SAME TIME you get slapped with a mind movie of *her chasing after some piece of crap and making plans for them to have sex in public.* You're trying to reconcile those two things at the same time and it's difficult to separate then from now. The reason you're having a sexual mismatch now is for reasons wholly separate from what happened then, but because of the timing of the revelation, its getting all glommed up together for you.


I left all those quotes so folks could see context, but here's the actual message I got from reading through this thread.

*She was just trying to please him. **And it was on a whim, probably to prove how much she's willing to do for him, for whatever reason. **And mainly, in this case the fact that type of sexual activity I've always been interested in she has refused. **I am always pressing her for sex and she is almost always saying no.**

your wife doesn't really want to have sex with you 

**her chasing after some piece of crap and making plans for them to have sex in public.*

I'm sorry to say it, but it doesn't appear your wife was ever really into you. She's certainly not now.


----------



## justis (Mar 5, 2015)

Nucking Futs said:


> I left all those quotes so folks could see context, but here's the actual message I got from reading through this thread.
> 
> *She was just trying to please him. **And it was on a whim, probably to prove how much she's willing to do for him, for whatever reason. **And mainly, in this case the fact that type of sexual activity I've always been interested in she has refused. **I am always pressing her for sex and she is almost always saying no.**
> 
> ...


That's ridiculous to make a flat out statement like that based on a one sided view of a situation you no nothing about. Our relationship has always been passionate. I'm not writing about because I'm writing about THIS. Pointing out by highlighting things I said about a betrayal and my coming to terms with issues relating to it sight unseen is harmful and baseless.


----------



## justis (Mar 5, 2015)

WTF. My wife loves to have sex with me. I'm the only one who has ever consistently made her come. WTF are you talking about?


----------



## justis (Mar 5, 2015)

I'll tell you an interesting thing. She has said sex was the only area that was perfect with us. What had me so confused was we had great sex the week before she said she wanted to leave me. Two weeks before we took a trip and had great sec two nights in a row that SHE initiated. I wasn't expecting the second night. But she practically tore my clothes off. 

So our problem has never been sex. It may have been frequency and it may have been my desire to have certain type of sex, but she has always enjoyed the sex we had and has frequently said I was the best lover she's ever had.


----------



## justis (Mar 5, 2015)

And I suppose you missed the point that she just has to be the one who initiates sex? And she initiates it at least once a week. Sometimes more. It just has to be on her terms. That's just how she is. She doesn't like me to initiate. And for her age once a week is maybe a lot. We don't know anyone else our age who is as sexually active as we are. She just turned 50 and I'm 9 years older.


----------



## Voltaire2013 (Sep 22, 2013)

Whoa, simmer down fella, that's one posters viewpoint. I know it's hard but try not to take it personally. 
People are trying to help. Take the good and leave the rest. 

Cheers,
V(13)




justis said:


> And I suppose you missed the point that she just has to be the one who initiates sex? And she initiates it at least once a week. Sometimes more. It just has to be on her terms. That's just how she is. She doesn't like me to initiate. And for her age once a week is maybe a lot. We don't know anyone else our age who is as sexually active as we are. She just turned 50 and I'm 9 years older.


----------



## askari (Jun 21, 2012)

*


happy as a clam said:



One day after a shopping trip, my SO pulled into the garage, lowered the garage door, and proceeded to "do it" right there in the truck, in the garage. Surprised the h*ll out of me, and I must say it was fun!

Click to expand...

*


happy as a clam said:


> No need to worry about getting arrested as we were in the privacy of our own home (no kids to worry about either.)
> 
> 
> And this is what sex, either in a BF/GF relationship or marriage should be all about. Fun!
> ...


----------



## justis (Mar 5, 2015)

Voltaire2013 said:


> Whoa, simmer down fella, that's one posters viewpoint. I know it's hard but try not to take it personally.
> People are trying to help. Take the good and leave the rest.
> 
> Cheers,
> V(13)


No. That's not trying to help. That's trying to harm. Do you know how destructive statements like that can be? You show me how that's is trying to help anything. My wife has said that of her friends and women she works with, knows and work for her, she doesn't believe anyone has the sex life she does. No one has sex as frequently, passionately or has organisms as much. When someone comes and filters statements out of context and makes a blanket statement that my wife simply doesn't want to have sex with me -- I mean seriously WTF? Without questioning, like you have done to gain a picture or some clarity?


----------



## YupItsMe (Sep 29, 2011)

Sex in limo is the ultimate? 

Umm Bullchit

Once a week is no big deal either. 

I agree with the trigger thing and I feel bad for you that your wife doesn't want you to initiate. 

That is not normal. 

Did she initiate with her affair partner or did she let him initiate. 

I wonder if that has anything to do with BDSM? 

Might be worth looking into that to get past that annoying coc k block


----------



## Coldie (Jan 2, 2014)

justis said:


> Many years ago my wife had a affair. We've dealt with it and moved on. But recently after a near break up certain details of the affair came to light. Namely that they had sex in a limo. There was also some bondage, something we've never done and frankly I have no interest in. Let's say this was more than an affair. Almost 25 years ago she left me for this guy. Long ago. Lasted a couple of months. She actually hired a limo and they had sex in it. Now this is only significant because she would have never done this with me in a million years. Still wouldn't. And therein lies much of the problem. We have a fantastic sex life. But I'm stuck on this thing. She says it's illegal and she'd never do it because of that. Is it illegal? Tinted glass. You can't see in. It's private.
> 
> So partially I'm hurt because it happened. My arch enemy whom I've never met got kind of the ultimate with my wife and she won't do that ultimate thing with me. So if it's not illegal I can try it or what other adventurous dangerous safe and not exactly illegal places can we have sex so I can help put this damage behind me?


Congratulations on you working through the affair and sticking with her. I probably couldn't have done it, so you have something in you that I do not have. However, we are very alike in that I would not only get a limo, I would get the biggest limo your city has to offer and f**k my wife from the front to the back, and maybe pour wine for her as we pass by the bar section.

It's not about replicating the act, it's about not letting her have some special memory that every time she sees a limo she knows "Oh my, that reminds me of __________." It's about knowing she will take the same risks with you. It's about knowing she didn't give him anything special, because you dedicated you entire life to her and no one but you deserves that special moment. And it may not be special to her anymore, but it's something you need. This isn't therapy for her, it's therapy for you. She had her cake. Once you are cheated on, I'd imagine you are never the same. She should be bending over backwards to help erase any mental movies you've ever had about her and your nemesis. 

My two cents. Maybe some men can forget things or just not think about them, but introverts need closure, and if closure for him is sexing his wife better than she has ever been sexed in a limo, then so be it. He deserves closure.


----------



## Flying_Dutchman (Oct 29, 2014)

Coldie - that'd be all well and good if his wife were 100% willing,,, but she ain't,, and Justis knows she ain't.

So, making or coercing her into doing it won't help their relationship. More to the point, it won't cure him,,, cuz even if he got the act done he'll still know that she was less willing than before plus the guilt of making her do it.

It'll be WAY less satisfying than he may imagine it to be and risks making what he has worse.

Not minimising his pain,, just saying he won't find the cure to it in the back of a limo.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## justis (Mar 5, 2015)

Coldie said:


> Congratulations on you working through the affair and sticking with her. I probably couldn't have done it, so you have something in you that I do not have. However, we are very alike in that I would not only get a limo, I would get the biggest limo your city has to offer and f**k my wife from the front to the back, and maybe pour wine for her as we pass by the bar section.
> 
> It's not about replicating the act, it's about not letting her have some special memory that every time she sees a limo she knows "Oh my, that reminds me of __________." It's about knowing she will take the same risks with you. It's about knowing she didn't give him anything special, because you dedicated you entire life to her and no one but you deserves that special moment. And it may not be special to her anymore, but it's something you need. This isn't therapy for her, it's therapy for you. She had her cake. Once you are cheated on, I'd imagine you are never the same. She should be bending over backwards to help erase any mental movies you've ever had about her and your nemesis.
> 
> My two cents. Maybe some men can forget things or just not think about them, but introverts need closure, and if closure for him is sexing his wife better than she has ever been sexed in a limo, then so be it. He deserves closure.


THANK YOU!!! That's exactly right. This is exactly how I feel. For our 25 anniversary in December I got the biggest limo they had. We didn't have sex in it. We were still working past some stuff. But that's exactly how I feel.


----------



## justis (Mar 5, 2015)

And for clarity, I'm saying that my wife said that compared to HER FRIENDS she has more sex. I didn't say or mean to imply she has more sex than anybody. This is a perception thing SHE HAS.


----------



## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

I wouldn't really be into sex in a hired limo just for the fact of how many GERMS and other people have probably been in it. Ew.

But I'm a big germaphobe.


----------



## justis (Mar 5, 2015)

Before anyone can actually help anyone else, they should try to UNDERSTAND them and their particular situation and not project their own things, biases, history, insecurities into the equation. Or as little as maybe possible. That take reading, duplicating and understanding. Collide understood better than anyone what I'm dealing with and going through. Voltaire has been fantastic in communicating with me in a reasonable manner. I don't believe there is any particular right or wrong. For my wife once a week is great and the perfect amount for her. She is correct for her. There's no normal. For her and her GF who are married that and organisms is better than the norm. That's what is real for her. That is correct. 

If one is trying to help, and I never asked for help beyond advice for adventurous tips on sexual places, you don't say, dude it's obvious, she doesn't want to have sex with you. Not said as an opinion or a question, but as a fact. Nothing there is helpful for anything. It naked go - whoa! Really??? Is that even possible? How would you know, culling through cutting and pasting unrelated things I typed out of context to make some kind of connection? Whoa. 

I was hoping to get some supportive people here, as a brand new guy. And I have found some. But I've also found a lot of passive aggressive and others. These kinds of issues we've all likely had in one form or another are sensitive and take a certain sensitivity or their handlings can have devastating impacts.


----------



## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

justis said:


> I was hoping to get some supportive people here, as a brand new guy. And I have found some. But I've also found a lot of passive aggressive and others. These kinds of issues we've all likely had in one form or another are sensitive and take a certain sensitivity or their handlings can have devastating impacts.


Well, this is an open forum. So you are going to hear all kinds of things when you make a post. Take what you like/need as far as advice/opinions go and leave the rest.


----------



## Nucking Futs (Apr 8, 2013)

All right, calm down. Your wife is not as sexually attracted to you as she was to the other guy she left you for. I didn't make that point to hurt your feelings, I made that point so you'll understand why she's not as willing to be sexual with you as she was with him. You want to have a sex life with her like she had with him, you need to correct that attraction. You need to figure out what it was about him that made him irresistible to her and what it is about you that makes you so resistible and make some changes. Once you get to the point where she's as hot for you as she was for him, most of the stuff you want to do will be on the table like it was for him.

And by the way, for most couples your age, once a week is not great, it's adequate. Damn near minimal. The fact that she will not have sex with you when you initiate, it has to be her idea, needs to worm it's way into you conscious mind and you need to think about that a little bit. If she was that into you she would respond to your desire. Your sex may be good when you have it, but you have it only when she wants it, not when you want it.

There are things you can do to correct this situation. I'm not tolerant of high strung people who leap to righteous indignation when an unpleasant truth is pointed out to them, so this is the last you'll see of me on this thread. There are plenty of people here that can help you, I'll leave it to them. Good luck.


----------



## justis (Mar 5, 2015)

That is f**ing BS! You have no idea what you're talking about. You're talking BS. You have no idea. She didn't leave me for sex. She left me for MONEY.


----------



## I Don't Know (Oct 8, 2013)

You should settle down. Seriously. 

She left you for money....paid for limo with OM.
She didn't leave you for sex....had daily sex with OM.
You are the best lover she's ever had....doesn't want it often.

You can see how some posters might get the idea that she was more attracted to the OM than you. BTW, sexual attraction isn't always about who is the best lover or gets her off every time.

Now you can tell me how full of sh1t I am too and not to tell you to settle down.


----------



## Plan 9 from OS (Jul 13, 2012)

I Don't Know said:


> You should settle down. Seriously.
> 
> She left you for money....paid for limo with OM.
> She didn't leave you for sex....had daily sex with OM.
> ...


OP. Actions speak louder than words. Stop listening to what your wife has to say on the subject and listen to what she's telling you through her actions.


----------



## Thor (Oct 31, 2011)

Plan 9 from OS said:


> OP. Actions speak louder than words. Stop listening to what your wife has to say on the subject and listen to what she's telling you through her actions.


:iagree:

Your wife over the years has shown you who she really is. What she did during that brief period with the other guy was not the real her. Maybe she was experimenting. Maybe she had some image of what she should be doing, but ended up not enjoying it. Maybe she was used and manipulated by the other guy into doing things she wasn't enthused about.

You are seeing today who she really is. You're not likely to change it. You might be able to get some of your kink needs met by her, but don't expect her to be wildly enthusiastic or to initiate such things.

I think you are projecting or imagining aspects about the other guy and about how your wife felt about sex with him at the time. You have not shown any evidence that your wife saw the relationship as good at the time, nor that she enjoyed the sex all that much.


----------



## Anon1111 (May 29, 2013)

Hi

I haven't read the whole thread-- just your opening post.

I can tell you that if I commit my life to a woman, I expect that whatever she has to offer sexually she will offer to me.

I think this is a pretty standard expectation from a male perspective.

I would be very very frustrated if I found out that even pre-marriage my wife was doing wild crazy stuff that she had refused to do with me. Not sure I would even be able to tolerate that scenario.

I DEFINITELY would not be able to tolerate a scenario where she cheated on me and did crazy stuff with some other guy, then expected to come back home and resume her totally vanilla sex life with me. 

This is totally emasculating. Not trying to rub it in, that is just how I see it.


----------



## BradWesley (May 24, 2013)

Forget the past. You two need to write your own history.

Keep looking for something new and different


----------



## Anon1111 (May 29, 2013)

Flying_Dutchman said:


> Fantastic! A mature, mutual compromise.
> 
> 
> why consider messing that up by failing to accept her as she is NOW, with the boundaries she has NOW?
> ...


Yeah, but he didn't win the prize.

She has a lower standard for him than for other men.

She was willing to do things she didn't "like" for this other guy that were way more extreme than what OP wants. 

So what prize has he won? Devotion to someone who was more interested in some random jerk than her husband?

This is a reflection of her desire for her husband-- it's just not as high as it was for the other guy.

It's a sh*tty thing to realize, but I don't think you can deny it.


----------



## Anon1111 (May 29, 2013)

After reading the rest of the thread, I am pretty surprised at a lot of the responses.

I don't think it is OP's job to get over this.

I think it is his wife's job to prove to him that he is #1 for her.

He justifiably still has doubts about this. It is not a nice feeling to be committed to someone for life and suspect that she really reserved some part of her sexuality for someone other than you. That is not how it is supposed to work in my opinion.

I also got the impression from many of OPs posts in this thread that his wife has a little habit of trying to test him (e.g., complaining about him not making enough money, etc).

I think it is interesting that the guy that she went for ended up in prison and seemed to generally treat her and other women like a piece of meat (e.g., offering to get them breast implants, bondage, etc).

OP-- it seems to me that your wife has a little bad girl inside of her, but she just wants to be the good girl for you.

I am not trying to attack you-- this is just what I see from your posts.

If I were you I would be thinking of ways I could treat her like a bad girl.


----------



## Flying_Dutchman (Oct 29, 2014)

Anon1111 said:


> If I were you I would be thinking of ways I could treat her like a bad girl.


And how does one 'treat' a bad girl? They're as entitled to have their boundaries respected the same way a 'good' one is.

Somehow, I don't think the 'treating' you're suggesting involves any kind of present,, like buying the good girl a meal or the bad one a drink.

It sounds rather sinister,, like to 'treat' her in a way she might not like.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Anon1111 (May 29, 2013)

Flying_Dutchman said:


> And how does one 'treat' a bad girl? They're as entitled to have their boundaries respected the same way a 'good' one is.
> 
> Somehow, I don't think the 'treating' you're suggesting involves any kind of present,, like buying the good girl a meal or the bad one a drink.
> 
> ...


The point is her "boundaries" are malleable depending on who she is with.

Her stated boundaries are really meaningless. Her boundaries are what she's actually done. 

She chose to do naughty things with some dirtbag. She chooses not to do those things (or even things much less degrading) with her own husband.

That is not a boundary. That is a choice.

To me, that choice tells me she is not a nice girl. So why would you keep up the facade that she is?

Why would you not instead treat her exactly as the dirtbag did?

She apparently liked that more, as evidenced by her actions.


----------



## Flying_Dutchman (Oct 29, 2014)

Anon1111 said:


> Why would you not instead treat her exactly as the dirtbag did?
> 
> She apparently liked that more, as evidenced by her actions.


Well that's easy. I wouldn't treat her like the dirtbag did cuz she didn't like it and returned to Justis.

She liked it LESS,, as evidenced by the far more significant action of her leaving him.

Suggesting that Justis treat her the same way a guy she left treated her seems counterproductive to me.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Anon1111 (May 29, 2013)

I guess I don't see why it's an old issue. She is denying him today.

Also, this is new news. She kept this from him for all these years. What else did she choose not to tell him? It speaks to trustworthiness.

Again, many people seem to be acting as though it is his job to let it go. OP is not the one who screwed someone else in a limo- she did. She chose to do it, chose not to do it with her husband EVER, chose to keep it a secret and for some reason chose to bust it out years later in therapy. It is HER problem and she should be searching for a way to make it up to him.


----------



## altawa (Jan 4, 2015)

Coldie said:


> Congratulations on you working through the affair and sticking with her. I probably couldn't have done it, so you have something in you that I do not have. However, we are very alike in that I would not only get a limo, I would get the biggest limo your city has to offer and f**k my wife from the front to the back, and maybe pour wine for her as we pass by the bar section.
> 
> It's not about replicating the act, it's about not letting her have some special memory that every time she sees a limo she knows "Oh my, that reminds me of __________." It's about knowing she will take the same risks with you. It's about knowing she didn't give him anything special, because you dedicated you entire life to her and no one but you deserves that special moment. And it may not be special to her anymore, but it's something you need. This isn't therapy for her, it's therapy for you. She had her cake. Once you are cheated on, I'd imagine you are never the same. She should be bending over backwards to help erase any mental movies you've ever had about her and your nemesis.
> 
> My two cents. Maybe some men can forget things or just not think about them, but introverts need closure, and if closure for him is sexing his wife better than she has ever been sexed in a limo, then so be it. He deserves closure.





Anon1111 said:


> I guess I don't see why it's an old issue. She is denying him today.
> 
> Also, this is new news. She kept this from him for all these years. What else did she choose not to tell him? It speaks to trustworthiness.
> 
> Again, many people seem to be acting as though it is his job to let it go. OP is not the one who screwed someone else in a limo- she did. She chose to do it, chose not to do it with her husband EVER, chose to keep it a secret and for some reason chose to bust it out years later in therapy. It is HER problem and she should be searching for a way to make it up to him.


I agree with both of the above, 100%. This is totally on her to fix, no question. IMO, I would never have gotten back with her in the first place. And, honestly, I wonder if this shouldnt be moved to CWI.



I Don't Know said:


> You should settle down. Seriously.
> 
> She left you for money....paid for limo with OM.
> She didn't leave you for sex....had daily sex with OM.
> ...


I also agree with this. Her actions do not match her words. The incongruities just don't match up.


----------

