# Am I Anti-Social or are most Men like me



## SadSamIAm (Oct 29, 2010)

I need a life outside my business and family. My children are getting old and in a couple of years they will all be done high school and will be on their own.

I moved away from my 'home town' to go to school. The 'close' friends that I had growing up all live a long ways away from me. 

The past 30 years, I have spent my time building a business and a family. My social life has been for the most part, going to kids sporting events. I know many guys from work and from these sporting events, but I don't consider any of them 'friends'. Not guys that I would call to go to a movie or out for coffee. I play squash in a men's league and have met many guys. We have a good game, we have a couple of beers afterwards, but I would never call any of them to do something outside of squash. They are acquaintances, but not really 'friends'.

I know my father was the same way. He spent all of his time with family and with work. He had no real friends. When they retired, it bothered him that my mom had friends and would always be going for coffee or shopping with her friends.

Am I normal? How do grown men, get friends?


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## MaritimeGuy (Jul 28, 2012)

I'm the same as you. I'm interested in hearing what others have to say.


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## Hicks (Jan 14, 2011)

Normal


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## rj700 (Jun 22, 2012)

Pretty much same here. Kids sporting events, other fathers from boy scouts, but no real contact outside those activities.

We socialize with other couples in the neighborhood. Some of the guys get together every other month or so to play poker, but that's about the extent of it. Other than that, I'd say I have one really good friend, but we probably only go out a few times a year. My W's world is centered around the kids too. She knows more people, particularly other moms, but they don't go out together or gab on the phone.

I don't really feel left out or lonely for other male companionship.


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## In_The_Wind (Feb 17, 2012)

Normal


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## iamsofaking (Sep 4, 2012)

Normal.


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## Chris Taylor (Jul 22, 2010)

Normal, but only to a degree.

You get out to play squash... what do those other guys do? Do they do anything outside of work, family and squash?


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## anotherguy (Dec 14, 2011)

I am surprisingly similar.

You know - I know a bunch of guys... friends of friends, old friends etc who are the opposite. Thee are constantly going out with the guys, stripclub, golf, cigar smoking types. These are the guys that are forever at the local eagles/sonsofitaly/mens clubs. Guys that maybe never left the town they grew up in. For the most part - these guys are the ones with troubled or broken relatonships. Not always, but a high %.

I also know (fewer) guys who are a little more in the middle of the road - gragarious guys who have lots of friends and still do some of the going out with the guys but not nearly as much as the first group I describe - but are also generally happy professionally and personally/family-wise.

Me - we get together maybe twice a year for poker. Once or twice a year for golf... maybe a football game or 2... but really the overwhelming bulk of my time is spent working at work or doing domestic stuff at home with the kids and family. I can count on 1 hand the number of close guy friends I have. Shrug. With 2 kids younger than 10, thats just the way it is for me. Maybe that will change in another 15 years when we are heading towards having an empty nest.

You are right though same for me... my dad was more like I am (or I more like him, rather). He spent his life working and being a family guy mostly. I definitely learned to admire him for that as I got (much) older - I see him now as the biggest hero in my life. When I was young I thought he was kind of a stiff - though I respected him no doubt about it. I guess maybe the nut doesnt fall that far from the tree.

I dont mean to elevate a 'personal failing' into a virtue here. I think I could, should, do a better job cultivating friends - but I also think balance is important, and I still feel that my family and my job are at the top of the list at the present stage in my life. Though I am not intentionally 'setting an example' for my kids, i do see that my family and work ethic is undoubtedly something I picked up from dear old dad and if I can be 1/2 the father he was - i will be lucky indeed.

sorry of I got off track a little bit... dad died about 5 years ago and I get all weepy about it - but I notice how everyone remembers him for the same sorts of things I do, and admires him for it.


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## SadSamIAm (Oct 29, 2010)

Chris Taylor said:


> Normal, but only to a degree.
> 
> You get out to play squash... what do those other guys do? Do they do anything outside of work, family and squash?


I have been playing with these same guys for maybe 8 years. I know their names, where they work. I know a bit about their families, but not much. They are quite a bit older than me (in their 60s and I am not quite 50). We go out for a beer and wings after we play on Tuesday nights and we talk about hockey or football or politics. I consider them acquaintances, but not real friends.

I am actually golfing with one of them tomorrow. He is a financial consultant and asks me to do things from time to time, but I am pretty sure his main motivation is for me to buy some investments from him.

I had a few friends from high school that I would consider best friends. I went through a tough break up just after graduating high school and I poured my heart out to one of my best friends (best man at my wedding). 

Just seems that after marriage/kids, it is very hard to find close personal friends like you had back in high school. The only guys I know that have very close personal friends are those that didn't move away and have the same friends high school/college.


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## MaritimeGuy (Jul 28, 2012)

I think the point about balance is important. I would think if you spend every weekend golfing with your buddies and going out for drinks in the evening it's going to take away from your life with your wife and kids. On the other hand if you never do it that too probably impacts who you are and oddly may also take away from your wife and kids. The trick is to find the right balance. Of course on this matter for me it's a case of "take my advice...cause I'm not using it".


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## MaritimeGuy (Jul 28, 2012)

SadSamIAm said:


> Just seems that after marriage/kids, it is very hard to find close personal friends like you had back in high school. The only guys I know that have very close personal friends are those that didn't move away and have the same friends high school/college.


I feel like I get busy with work and family for long stretches of time such that when I do have time to get together with friends I've neglected them for so long I'm embarassed to reach out to them.


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## SadSamIAm (Oct 29, 2010)

anotherguy said:


> I am surprisingly similar.
> 
> You know - I know a bunch of guys... friends of friends, old friends etc who are the opposite. Thee are constantly going out with the guys, stripclub, golf, cigar smoking types. These are the guys that are forever at the local eagles/sonsofitaly/mens clubs. Guys that maybe never left the town they grew up in. For the most part - these guys are the ones with troubled or broken relatonships.
> 
> ...


I could have written this myself.

The guys with 'good buddies', spend more time drinking and carrying on and do have more problems

My wife and I have been having some issues and I have been trying to do a 180. Much of this is to look after yourself. Go out and do things for yourself. I just find it hard to do, as I don't have any real 'friends' to hang out with.


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## anotherguy (Dec 14, 2011)

SadSamIAm said:


> I could have written this myself.
> The guys with 'good buddies', spend more time drinking and carrying on and do have more problems
> 
> My wife and I have been having some issues and I have been trying to do a 180. Much of this is to look after yourself. Go out and do things for yourself. I just find it hard to do, as I don't have any real 'friends' to hang out with.


see? your not a wierdo. OR.. maybe you are but you are not alone. ;-)

You got anybody? Brother? Anybody similar age with kids you know? 

Man - its hard to start from zero. Someone you can watch MNF with at some cheesy bar every week?


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## Ten_year_hubby (Jun 24, 2010)

SadSamIAm said:


> I need a life outside my business and family.
> ...
> How do grown men, get friends?


Just a suggestion, call the local Boys and Girls Club in your area and ask them what you can do to help. Get involved helping other people and you will have plenty of friends


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## Enginerd (May 24, 2011)

Normal. Only single guys have friends.....


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## Stonewall (Jul 5, 2011)

same here you are normal


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## waiwera (Sep 8, 2009)

WOW.. when i read sadsams post I thought... is that my husband?
But after reading the responses... my husband could be any of you 

What is with this.. ?. :scratchhead:

Are you 'happy'? Whatever that means to you.


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## 94nole (Aug 2, 2012)

I see you as doing what responsible husbands and fathers do. In my opinion, your focus should be your wife and your kids and then your business. Especially if your life haven't finished high school. I know that high school kids and parents don't generally spend a ton of time together...but you don't want to be off on a golf course or drinking at a bar with your buddies when your kids or wife needs you. Just my opinion. "No success in life can compensate for failure in the home."


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## bribrius (Jun 29, 2012)

i think most guys might be somewhat antisocial.

i am to some extent, i will go out and play golf or out on the lake or ocean with friends from time to time. Have a few beers and relax kind of thing. 

but i dont have any friends i see or talk to on a daily or even weekly basis.


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## husbandinneed0910 (Jun 26, 2012)

SSIA I think it is normal. I am the same way.


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## sharkeey (Apr 27, 2012)

I have 2 or 3 guy friends I hang out with occassionally.

One friend 2-3x a month, the rest.. rarely.

I'm a single guy, divorced 5 years.

Most of the women I meet say guys they meet have zero or very few friends.


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## kag123 (Feb 6, 2012)

94nole said:


> I see you as doing what responsible husbands and fathers do. In my opinion, your focus should be your wife and your kids and then your business. Especially if your life haven't finished high school. I know that high school kids and parents don't generally spend a ton of time together...but you don't want to be off on a golf course or drinking at a bar with your buddies when your kids or wife needs you. Just my opinion. "No success in life can compensate for failure in the home."


Glad to see this thread. My H has been struggling with the same thoughts - truthfully, so have I. Glad to see it's somewhat normal (at least for guys).

I think H and I both subscribe to the above statement for the most part. We've got so much going on in our lives with work/family, it seems impossible to think about making any serious friendships on the side as individuals. What little free time we have, we always seem to prioritize in this order - family activities, date nights, friends (meaning mutual friends that we go out with together).

I don't think it's so strange (as long as neither spouse is unhappy that way). Most of the adults with long-term marraiges have this dynamic, and there's got to be a reason for the correlation, right? I have read a lot of threads on here that push for each spouse to have their own friends and outside activities and I have always felt that's just not "us". Maybe later in life, but not right now with two preschoolers at home and each working 50-60 hours a week. 

H struggled after reading "No More Mr. Nice Guy" which advocates having a group of male confidants/friends - which he has never really had. Now he is on a search for some, which is fine (whatever makes him happy!) but I am a little worried that he thinks he's abnormal now and is so caught up in what the book says that it's making him self conscious.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

My husband is like this too... for the most part... he is busy with family, our kids, their many activities .....my friends are his friends -their husbands, etc. 

He has men friends to call if he needs something....we see them on occasion, they may drop in ... but It's very rare for him to call on them...unless needing help on the Truck or something...men & their projects.... He's never been the type to hang with the guys... he says he gets enough male bonding at work every day.

We enjoy getting together with other couples -out & about -that is more common for us.


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## Lon (Jun 6, 2011)

Hey Sam, me too. Grab a beer and lets talk man stuff on TAM. So... how about those [your local sports team]?

:toast:


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## takeshi (Sep 26, 2012)

same here

I have no motivation to explore new friends, both male & female.


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## oddball (Sep 5, 2012)

I am the same. Work and family dominate. I still have very good friends from school and college, but none live in my city. I will always remain family focused, but I do miss having a few good male friends to do stuff with occasionally. My wife and I do socialize, but as a couple. I think I need to get out more, and try and meet new men! It has been bothering me, but this thread makes me feel more normal.....whatever that is!


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## MaritimeGuy (Jul 28, 2012)

I think we've established that it is common. The question is is it healthy?

I think to what I call the "airplane theory" when I ponder this. What I mean by the airplane theory is the instruction to put your own oxygen mask in place before attempting to help others. The obvious corollary of this is that if you're passed out from lack of oxygen you're no good to others. 

In order to be the best husband and father you can be you need to be healthy physically, mentally and emotionally. Wouldn't part of this be having a healthy social life outside of your family? Again, keeping in mind that there needs to be a balance.


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## C123 (Jun 20, 2012)

NORMAL. 

I think it's healthy if you care more about your spouse and children than going out to the local bar/stripclub/racetrack etc.

I'm 32, been married for 10 years and have a 2 year old and I can count the number of true friends I have on one hand. I almost never hang out with them because life gets in the way. I know they're my true friends though because every time we get together, it's like nothing changes and I know if I needed help with something they'd be there in a heartbeat.

I joined a country club 4 years ago and made some friends out there, but they are "golf" friends. I don't hang with them outside of the course and frankly, that country club takes me away from my family more than I'd like so I'll probably quit and then no longer have those friends.

I'm happy managing a stable of 5 or less friends. If I need to get away and have a beer, one of them is always available. Sadly, 2 of them are way out of state so I see them only two or three times a year.

To be honest, I've tried to make new friends and although it's easy to hit it off with a potential friend, there always seems to be a reason why it never develops into a friendship and after a short time, it fizzles out. I'm okay with that now because I choose to devote my energy to my family.


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## Posse (Jan 30, 2012)

MaritimeGuy said:


> I think we've established that it is common. The question is is it healthy?
> 
> I think to what I call the "airplane theory" when I ponder this. What I mean by the airplane theory is the instruction to put your own oxygen mask in place before attempting to help others. The obvious corollary of this is that if you're passed out from lack of oxygen you're no good to others.
> 
> In order to be the best husband and father you can be you need to be healthy physically, mentally and emotionally. Wouldn't part of this be having a healthy social life outside of your family? Again, keeping in mind that there needs to be a balance.


It is far healthier to have outside social activity. It also makes you more attractive to your wife. 

I used to be at home all the time, work, then family, and nothing else. I had friends, but we seldom got together.

As my kids are now in high school and becoming more and more independent, I am transitioning to having more and more social activities, renewing old hobbies, and doing things with friends more and more.

I discussed it with my kids. They encouraged it. 

I have found that I am happier and healthier for it.


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## CandieGirl (Apr 27, 2011)

Doesn't seem uncommon; most of my girlfriends' husbands are the same. So is my Dad. Not only that, but they rarely even WANT to do anything outside of work or home/family life. The wives all have their own lives. Seems lonely for both.


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## anotherguy (Dec 14, 2011)

Posse said:


> It is far healthier to have outside social activity. *It also makes you more attractive to your wife.*
> ...


gads. must every thread turn into a no more mr niceguy commentary? It makes you more attractive. laugh. 

Nobody said 'no outside social activity'.

If you were screwed up and feel better now and have finally found happiness that you were lacking - honest - I am thrilled for you. Really, I am. 

Dont project abnormality or unhappiness on me however. Its really not that necessary - and I dont subscribe to that club. In fact - I think it is, on balance, total BS.


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## Lon (Jun 6, 2011)

CandieGirl said:


> Doesn't seem uncommon; most of my girlfriends' husbands are the same. So is my Dad. Not only that, but they rarely even WANT to do anything outside of work or home/family life. The wives all have their own lives. Seems lonely for both.


Yes, incredibly lonely - for men and likely their w's - I know it was for both my ex and I. For me, it's not that I didn't WANT to do anything outside of the house just that I couldn't find the first step to making that possible, and my ex had no problems in that regard so she was long gone more and more and I felt left behind, burdened holding the responsibility of parenting my child in the evenings, living within our family budget (had to scrimp even more since she was always going beyond our financial means). That lasted for so long I really dropped off the earth and it was especially bad since I worked at home too, there were entire weeks that would go by where I only ever got out to pick up the mail or take out the trash. It was horrible and I am finding a huge personal challenge trying to restart my social life, just seems to constantly take more mental energy than I can muster. Being a hermit is sad and lonely, but it seems less unpleasant and futile than constantly trying to prop up one sided friendships.


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## Jason439 (Jul 16, 2012)

I think it's unhealthy. I started fishing about 12 years ago after a long break from it. I've met tons of people while out fishing. 

I have met 4-5 great guys that I consider close friends. We regularly meet for fishing most of year. During the winter, we usually get together on a Wednesday night for a coffee/ chat. 

When I didn't have a hobby and outside friends, I was grumpy and miserable. 

Find a hobby, get out and enjoy your hobby. The friends will come as well.


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## Jason439 (Jul 16, 2012)

Oops. Dbl post


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## costa200 (Jun 27, 2012)

Between working my a$$ off and spending time with the family and some hobbies i really don't have much time for an extended group of friends. And i find myself pretty happy these days. 

But i'm a teacher. I spend my day talking to people (little and big). So i really don't lack in social contact.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

MaritimeGuy said:


> I think we've established that it is common. The question is is it healthy?


Here is my take on this.. I think it is healthy if your wife DIGS it...appreciates your love of family -Time with her.... If she complains you need more of a life -while she is out gallivanting with her girlfriends, then you have an issue. The marriage/ social life is unbalanced and it is unattracting to her... 

Every couple is different, just as every individual is -hopefully you're a good match. 

As for me....I truly LOVE the fact my husband IS the way he is... very devoted to family... he makes me laugh cause he often says ...."I hate people" in a nonchalant way.... which is really funny -cause he is well loved by others..... the guys at his workplace accually argue over who gets to work with him, I get the biggest charge out of this... they all hate each other, want to turn each other in, backbiting & he is caught in the middle - gets to hear all their BS, the likable one. Little do they know -he thinks they are all A-holes...well he does like 2 of them. 

My husbands view on this is ......"why would I want to spend time with anyone else... that's why I got married, to be with my wife". 

It's healthy ~ for us..


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## Jeapordy (Aug 12, 2012)

This is a great thread. I always felt I was abnormal for not having any CLOSE friends. It seemed like my work, and family life consumed 95% of my time. And in the other 5%, I just didn't have the energy (or didn't feel like expending the energy) to have close friends. I have work friends, and I have couple friends, but you can't have really personal and confidential talks with either of those groups. I won't have those kinds of converstations with anyone unless I completely trusted them, and that takes a long time. There are times when I'd love to vent to a friend. 
My problem is that I am not a super outgoing person. I can't stand in a group of guys and shoot the sh*t for hours. There are people in my boat club that can do that for hours. Not me. I get bored with all the BS and stories pretty quick. Maybe that makes me anti-social. 
I also think part of the problem is the messages we see all around us. Every TV show has a group of guys that have been friends forever and know everything about each other. So I always thought that this was the way most men were. 
My neighbor is my age and has kids the same age as mine. We are pretty good neighbor-friends. He will go to strip clubs, golfing, etc. with his buddies, but I don't think he considers them good friends. I just don't want to do those things with casual friends, but he is fine doing that. For me its a trust thing.
So maybe the issue is not having good friends. Maybe the issue is that we (the men on TAM) require more intimate relationships before we want to spend time with other men.


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## waiwera (Sep 8, 2009)

Hubby decided a couple of years ago that he needed to get out more and be more social, it seemed life was all about work and chores ( we're on a small farm) and doing stuff for the kids. He needed some fun and some time-out but he couldn't get motivated to find a 'hobby'. 

So I quit my fairly time consuming 'hobby/job' and we looked for somethings we could do together, especially something social.

We do 'Ceroc' once a month. H has two left feet but has learnt half a dozen moves and we get a lot of enjoyment out dancing together at organised ceroc functions and other places that have dancing opportunities. It's also something we 'practice' at home...after a few wines on a friday night... nice!

Then I took up fishing with him and have been surprised at how much i enjoy it. He used to miss out as he saw it as time away from home. Now we do it together. He's got a real buzz out of it. Bought me really nice gear...all pink to go with my kayak. I've even got a lucky fishing shirt 

We also do various workshops together about once a month. We get to learn new skills like earthbuilding, bee keeping and cheesemaking which in turn increases conversation subjects (not that we ever run out of stuff to talk about )

What I'm saying is that 'social' doesn't HAVE to mean hangin out with your mates. I'm his best friend these days (according to him)...he wants to hang out with me. 

I am very cool about that!


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## Lon (Jun 6, 2011)

I'm cool with hobbies, I make time to try things and do the things I like, I just haven't really found any joy or fun with them. I can't tell if I don't have any fun because I'm depressed, or if its that I'm depressed cause I don't have any fun. My mind just can never get completely off of my responsibilities, I can never get on vacation because there is always a little bit of anxiety about something. The only time I ever feel an ounce of relief is when I'm at home visiting the parents, knowing that my son will get some attention from grandma, that I have nothing to do or think about, Dad usually comes up with good ideas of things to do and I can just put it all out of my mind.

Life just seems constantly too hard. Maybe I need a vacation to an all-inclusive, and then meet some friends there.


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## Jason439 (Jul 16, 2012)

Waiwera, i think its great that you and your H fish together. My W hates it.

I should mention that fishing is also something both my sons love. Almost more than me. I get to spend quality time with my boys doing something we all love. 

In my case, fishing is like my therapy. A time to unwind, relax and forget about life's issues for a few hours a couple times per week.


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## waiwera (Sep 8, 2009)

Jason439 - I thought i was going to hate it too. 

Started off refusing to bait my hook or kill anything I caught, I do everything now except filleting them when we get home.

We'd been fishing together for a few months when we had to move our kayaks quickly one day to get out of the way of some [email protected] with jet ski's. I quickly put my rod into the holder thingie and started to paddle but I hadn't placed the hook right and a hunk of wet & stinky defrosted fish bait swung around and slapped me across my face and mouth. I have never been so grossed out and hubby knew it...

But ya know all I could think was how glad I was that the hook didn't get me in the eye or something and I smiled (a fish guts in between the teeth smile) to hubby to let him know I was OK...

He reckons he was sooo proud... that's the day I became a true fisherwoman! 

It was also the day I learnt the importance of securing my hook 

I decided to try fishing with him after reading 'His Needs Her Needs'. There is a chapter about men wanting to spend recreation time with their spouses...so I gave it a go. It was a good move!


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## Mavash. (Jan 26, 2012)

Normal.


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## sharkeey (Apr 27, 2012)

I don't get the lure of fishing.

Pun intended of course.

Sitting there all day hoping to hook a fish. Maybe you'll catch one, maybe you won't, maybe you'll keep it, maybe you'll throw it back.

Boring.

And smelly.


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## waiwera (Sep 8, 2009)

sharkeey said:


> I don't get the lure of fishing.
> 
> Pun intended of course.
> 
> ...


Aww... sharkeey you've been fishing in the wrong places... (big) fish are plentiful in my sparkly waters. I've never NOT caught fish. If we go out once a week (for an hour or so)... we get enough fish for several meals.

Boring.....nah... hubby is a laugh a minute and the scenery is spectacular! Plus we've met some really neat likeminded people while out. 

Smelly ... yes! ( doesn't always taste too good either ) But we jump in the shower when we get home, soap each other up really really well, rinse then go enjoy fresh snapper for dinner 

I really never knew how much fun fishing could be!


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

costa200 said:


> Between working my a$$ off and spending time with the family and some hobbies i really don't have much time for an extended group of friends. And i find myself pretty happy these days.
> 
> But i'm a teacher. I spend my day talking to people (little and big). So i really don't lack in social contact.


Same here. My time is valuable to me. I get plenty of interaction. I go on plenty of business trips and so on. I occasionally go to lunch and have a few beers with friends. The weekends especially is my time with my wife and / or family. Realize I missed many weekends in my life working to support my family. I prefer to spend my time with them.


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## CO_MOM (Sep 14, 2012)

My husband is pretty anti social as well. We used to go out once a year, for his company party. He switched jobs, no more company party. I got a new job, so we went to my company party. He has three really close friends, his brother (they didn't grow up together and only got close a few years ago when their dad died), my brother, and my cousin (which happens to be his boss). We don't even go out to eat very often where we live because it is a very, very small community and he doesn't care to visit with people, and you know everyone and they always stop to talk.

Waiwera...I totally get that! I recently started doing more things with my husband now that the kids are older. The kids love to go fishing, and we always have a great time. But the other thing I have realized, is that I absolutely love to go hunting with my husband as well. I bought a tag last year thinking we could at least spend some time together since he is gone so much during hunting season, and I had the opportunity to shoot my first bull elk. It was one of the most amazing things ever, and the look on his face when it happened was priceless!


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## SadSamIAm (Oct 29, 2010)

I am glad to hear that I am normal. 

One thing I didn't mention in my original post. Is about 'couple friends'? As I said, I have a few guys I golf with and a few guys I play squash with. I have some guys I know regarding work. All I consider acquaintances, not real friends I would ever confide in or ever really invite to do something else. Most all these guys have wives, but I have only met a couple of them and never do anything with them.

We have couple friends, but every single one of them are friends of my wife's. The wives are friends and so I have become friends of their husbands. Again, not real friends, that I would ever call outside of our 'couples' get together.

I am guessing this 'couples' dynamic is also pretty common.

By the way, I think that the way we normal people are is good. When the children are home and family should come first. I am worried about life after children. Wonder what we will do once the kids have moved out. Right now, my life is work, children and my wife. 

I am thinking I need to put some effort into being better friends with my squash, golf, work acquaintances. Those that are in the same point of life as myself. They are probably thinking the same as me. No reason why I couldn't ask a couple of them if they want to go see some car crash/violence movie (not a chick flick) or something. I should ask them more about their lives and families. Guessing that we all could be better friends.


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## waiwera (Sep 8, 2009)

CO_MOM said:


> Waiwera...I totally get that! I recently started doing more things with my husband now that the kids are older. The kids love to go fishing, and we always have a great time. But the other thing I have realized, is that I absolutely love to go hunting with my husband as well. I bought a tag last year thinking we could at least spend some time together since he is gone so much during hunting season, and I had the opportunity to shoot my first bull elk. It was one of the most amazing things ever, and the look on his face when it happened was priceless!


CO-MOM - how cool are you!! i'm a bit scared of guns... I use a bow and arrow for hunting, although I only go after small critters... rabbit, pheasant, turkey etc.. all smaller than a breadbox. So I think your really awesome! Bet hubby was proud of you too!

And yes we're loving our time together now the kids are older and busy doing their own thing... so nice to hold his hand instead of one of the kids also nice to go to adult restaurants etc... 

Sadsam .. fear not. If your relationship is good now it will only get better once the focus starts to move back to the two of you and less on the kids.

We are having so much fun. We can be SPONTANEOUS. We've haven't been that in nearly 20 years. 
We can decided on the spur of the moment to go to dinner, go fishing or ...geez... we can just go bed and have sex if we feel like it!

Loving it


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## CO_MOM (Sep 14, 2012)

We have the couples thing with my brother and his wife. My SIL is my best friend, as well as my brother being my husbands best friend. My brother and his wife have 2 kids, a 23 year old son in the Army and a 19 year old daughter that has moved in with her boyfriend of 4 years. Since both of the kids are out of the house now, it seems that they fight so much more than they ever did before. I was just mentioning that to my husband the other day, since my SIL ended up at our house at midnight! But, neither of them really have hobbies, the like to go out 4 wheeling, they hunted for the first time last year, and they are in a bowling league in the winter time, but nothing that is constant. On the other hand, they love to take my kids more often now :smthumbup: and they never fight with the kids around.


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## CO_MOM (Sep 14, 2012)

Waiwera, my husband bow hunts as well, I haven't tried it yet, maybe down the road. One thing at a time, I guess! Our 13 year old daughter is actually going to rifle hunt a deer this year, so excited!


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

My life is pretty much like he OP,and I ask myself the same questions.
I used to scuba dive and go rifle hunting a lot, just a few years ago, now I hardly do it anymore.

I deal with people throught the day so I don't really like crowds in my free time.

However, going to the gym and hanging out with other guys is good enough for me.
Whenever I go out with my wife, its just two of us alone.
I prefer it like that.
Maybe I'm getting old.


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## Lyris (Mar 29, 2012)

I wish my husband had some friends. He's always been pretty self-sufficient, but before we had the kids he had more people he saw socially. I love seeing him interact with other people, he's so funny and cool. 

I keep encouraging him to get back into one of his hobbies. Maybe now our girls are getting older he will feel like he can. He always says our girls and I are all he needs, but I know he enjoys talking to other people too.

I have lots of friends, in comparison, and without them I would not enjoy my life nearly as much as I do. My brother has lots of good friends too, and he's managed to maintain them even though he (and they) have young children now. 

I actually didn't realize having very few friends was pretty normal for a lot of men.


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## takeshi (Sep 26, 2012)

or can I say male does not need a lot of friends.


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## BookOfJob (Jul 6, 2012)

Lon said:


> I'm cool with hobbies, I make time to try things and do the things I like, I just haven't really found any joy or fun with them. I can't tell if I don't have any fun because I'm depressed, or if its that I'm depressed cause I don't have any fun. My mind just can never get completely off of my responsibilities, I can never get on vacation because there is always a little bit of anxiety about something......


Lon, try to let go and embrace the chaos (can't say I've done a good job in this either).

But, there's gotta be something you liked to do before you got married, right? Try to dig it out and hang out with people of the same interest. That's always the easiest avenue to make friends.

E.g. after the crises and implosion of my domestic life, I kicked start my amateur radio hobby again verrry sloowly. There are people I can confide and I consider friends. I can go to meetings and participate as much as I can tolerate (volunteering, these things can go out of control). Also 'borrowing' my dad's motorbike on weekends kinda breathe a sense of freedom and masculinity into me.

Someone wise told me once that losing friends after the arrival of kids is normal. However, now I wonder if that changed me as a person and helped brought me into this crises. So, I will try to fight this and keep a balance.


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## 30_going_on_50 (Sep 28, 2012)

Enginerd said:


> Normal. Only single guys have friends.....


Winner winner chicken dinner!!! My wife and kids are my world.......I don't miss the "Hey, dog wanna go get some beers?" at all.

When I have free time it's wife or go drive one of the sports cars.


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## jaquen (Mar 1, 2012)

I don't know how "normal" this is, or not, but in my life it's unacceptable to be devoid of friendship.

Friends are vital to my existence. They always have been, and always will be. My wife feels exactly the same. We both have extremely close and best friends, and I have quite a lot of them. I can't even imagine my life without these people, many of whom are even closer than family. 

But I suppose if that's never been important to you, and you've never felt empty without them, is there really any point at this stage of trying to learn out to make friends? It just seems to me that friendship is one of those things that you either get, or don't get. And if you don't get it, why try?


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## Jason439 (Jul 16, 2012)

jaquen said:


> I don't know how "normal" this is, or not, but in my life it's unacceptable to be devoid of friendship.
> 
> Friends are vital to my existence. They always have been, and always will be. My wife feels exactly the same. We both have extremely close and best friends, and I have quite a lot of them. I can't even imagine my life without these people, many of whom are even closer than family.


My wife and I are the same as you. I'd be miserable if I didn't have interests outside of my family life. She would be the same.


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## jaquen (Mar 1, 2012)

Jason439 said:


> My wife and I are the same as you. I'd be miserable if I didn't have interests outside of my family life. She would be the same.


It's just yet another way my life, and marriage, seems to differ wildly from the general TAM collective.


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## VermisciousKnid (Dec 27, 2011)

Lon said:


> Yes, incredibly lonely - for men and likely their w's - I know it was for both my ex and I. For me, it's not that I didn't WANT to do anything outside of the house just that I couldn't find the first step to making that possible, ... Stuff removed... Being a hermit is sad and lonely, but it seems less unpleasant and futile than constantly trying to prop up one sided friendships.


I prefer to do things where I can meet people and be useful at the same time. So there's working with a crew on the local Habitat for Humanity house or in the food pantry at the church around the corner. None of those people will become my friends probably, but the nature of the activities guaranty that the people will be good and decent. The banter is usually lighthearted and fun. Industrious people are so much better to be around than lazy ones. I defy anyone to make you feel guilty about taking time to do that. 

I'll occasionally blow off chores to tinker in the garage which doubles as my workshop. I build and fix all kinds of things around the house so I find that enjoyable. You do have to give yourself permission to be "off the clock" occasionally. The world doesn't come to a screeching halt when you take a break!


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## anotherguy (Dec 14, 2011)

jaquen said:


> I don't know how "normal" this is, or not, but in my life it's unacceptable to be devoid of friendship.
> ...But I suppose if that's never been important to you, and you've never felt empty without them, is there really any point at this stage of trying to learn out to make friends? It just seems to me that friendship is one of those things that you either get, or don't get. And if you don't get it, why try?


did anyone say 'devoid of friendship'?

There is a vast difference between spending the majority of your time growing - being with - your family and being devoid of friendship.

also 'why try'? Really, is that what you think?  I didnt go back and read most of this... maybe I missed something.


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## anotherguy (Dec 14, 2011)

jaquen said:


> It's just yet another way my life, and marriage, seems to differ wildly from the general TAM collective.


The more I read TAM.. the more thankful I am. 

No kidding.


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## jaquen (Mar 1, 2012)

anotherguy said:


> did anyone say 'devoid of friendship'? There is a vast difference between spending the majority of your time growing - being with - your family and being devoid of friendship.


Are you the OP? Because his original post, and the ideas therein, are what I'm addressing. And yes the OP absolutely did make it clear that his life is devoid of friendship. 

So you might want to roll them eyes right back in place my friend. 



anotherguy said:


> also 'why try'? Really, is that what you think?  I didnt go back and read most of this... maybe I missed something.


Yes, you clearly have missed some things. Or I have. Or we both have. Who knows?


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## Lon (Jun 6, 2011)

jaquen said:


> I don't know how "normal" this is, or not, but in my life it's unacceptable to be devoid of friendship.
> 
> Friends are vital to my existence. They always have been, and always will be. My wife feels exactly the same. We both have extremely close and best friends, and I have quite a lot of them. I can't even imagine my life without these people, many of whom are even closer than family.
> 
> But I suppose if that's never been important to you, and you've never felt empty without them, is there really any point at this stage of trying to learn out to make friends? It just seems to me that friendship is one of those things that you either get, or don't get. And if you don't get it, why try?


Friendships have always been vital to me, and important and I feel empty without. I am not "devoid" but many times I wish I could just call someone and know they'd listen. I also wish someone would call me just once so I could listen. I want to make more friends, just don't for some reason, and I'm feeling kinda desperate lately to know why. I'm not anti-social, I have good communication skills, hygiene is fine, I don't dominate conversation but I usually have good ideas, I'm supportive and honest, like WTF, what is wrong that I have no single best friend in my life? Do I push them away somehow? Am I guarding my heart too much? I know when I was at my worst: right after dday and separation, I was able to reach out and found good friends and it actually felt great, was the first time in a long time I felt connected to anyone, why can't I have that kind of relationship when there is no crisis? I have tried maintaining that friendship with them, and they are still there but months and years will go by where we are completely out of contact. I honestly need friends that are in my lives daily - not that I have to contact them every day, but who are actually IN my life, not just there when I need a life preserver.


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## jaquen (Mar 1, 2012)

It seems it's hard for adult men to make friends. I know a lot of articles, and even books, have been written on the topic.

I have a lot of acquaintances, friends, close friends, and a few best friends. The best friends are the ones I am extraordinarily close with, people who are basically family. I don't have friends because we share a hobby, or have a "reason" to be friends. Those, to me, are acquaintances. My actual friends are in my life because I love them as people, and hang out with them for the sake of themselves. They are awesome human beings that I count it a privilege, and a blessing, to know.

These are people from all stages of my life, and some of them have only been in my sphere for a couple years. So I've made friends outside of the childhood/school arena (mostly male, but a few females). I think that a lot of men have trouble making friends because a lot of men are socially conditioned to not put themselves out there in an honest, open, and potentially vulnerable way. It might feel emasculating on some level, or terrifying.

The only reason that I do not have trouble making friends is because I am unusually emotionally available for a man. I do not adhere to a lot of the social conditioning, and hyper masculine posturing, that a lot of us men deal with and can keep men locked up in solitary confinement. I express love openly, and unapologetically, to all the important people in my life, whether that be my wife, my family, or my friends. If I think someone is cool, I don't hide my intentions or desires to be friends. If I love someone, or am grateful for their presence in my life, they know it. If somebody is uncomfortable with that level of emotional transparency, they're not a close or best friend of mine.

It comes down to what is absolutely vital for you, and how much of yourself you're willing to put out there. I grew up with really, really poor, absentee male role models, and as a result I seldom got the kind of affirmation that I needed from other men. So when I became old enough I made the decision that I'd build my own army of brothers, and fill the voids that others left behind. I put A LOT of who I am out on the table, and as a result I get A LOT back. My friendships are plentiful, and I actually find myself often thanking God for the relationships in my life, and all the love. But that requires a level of openness and transparency that a lot of people just aren't comfortable doing. It also might require a level of _need,_ and insufficiency, that a lot of other men might not have.


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## Lyris (Mar 29, 2012)

I think a lot of adults, male and female, have difficulty making new friends and maintaining old ones. I have seen very similar threads on female-dominated forums, with lots of women wishing they had 'sex in the city' style friends.

After I read another thread all about feeling like an outsider, socially and then another introvert/extravert thread where the overwhelming majority of responders identified as introverts I developed a theory. My theory is that introverts are much more likely to be active on message boards, and that is why they are over-represented. I think 75% of people are extroverts, but this wasn't reflected in the thread I mentioned at all. 

But men do seem to have fewer friends generally. And maybe they are more likely to ride on their wives' coat tails, and so get some of the benefits without putting in any effort. I was thinking about the importance of friends this week when we went away and a friend of mine came over to feed our guinea pigs, bring the bins down and check the mail. I've had friends look after my kids, feed the cat, check on our house, lend us their ute, give unwanted appliances, pass on baby clothes, bring us food after my babies were born, help at my kids' parties...I could go on and on. And I've done all those things too. So I feel comfortable asking for help when I/my family needs it because I've given help to others. 

If I was like my husband, we would have had to pay for all that stuff, or go without. Friends are a wonderful resource in every sense.


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

In my thirties, I had lots of friends, and would socialize a lot.
Now in my forties,and focusing on my business, whatever friends I have are those I have in my business network.

The only social functions I attend are those where I can see an opportunity to meet movers & shakers and expand my network.

Maybe its not the best thing for me. But right now that's what I need to move ahead.

Just a phase in my life I guess.


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## sinnister (Dec 5, 2010)

I don't have friends. With all of the girls sports, and school stuff and me trying to get some sleep and have no time or desire to try and hang out with other dudes.


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## southbound (Oct 31, 2010)

I'm not a socializer and don't have guys I hang out with. It feels more normal to me now that i read this. 

I don't know if this is true with anyone else, but I just don't "connect' with anybody on a deep friendship level anymore. It's not that I'm the neighborhood weirdo or keep something hanging out my nose, i just don't click with people beyond the acquaintance level much anymore. I don't meet guys that I have the urge to be around on a deep friendship level anymore. 

Maybe there's just too much kid in me. I don't mean that I'm a 40+ year old that tries to act like a teen. Most would describe me as a very responsible, laid-back, somewhat distinguished guy, but I'm still more interested in whether you've seen Clint Eastwood's latest movie rather than talking politics or 401ks.


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## jaquen (Mar 1, 2012)

southbound said:


> Maybe there's just too much kid in me.


Funny, because I think it's the ever living "kid in me" that keeps me open to awesome, real friendships. They were very important to me then, and they're even more important to me now.

It's very, very hard for me to wrap my mind around the notion that there are people who are genuinely uninterested in friends. They add so damn much to who I am as a person in this life, and I know my wife feels the same about hers.

This thread is very eye opening because it's so, so far removed from my reality, and the reality of the people in my life. I've never come across such a large swatch of people totally uninterested in close friendships. It's truly throwing me for a loop to be honest.


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## Enginerd (May 24, 2011)

jaquen said:


> Funny, because I think it's the ever living "kid in me" that keeps me open to awesome, real friendships. They were very important to me then, and they're even more important to me now.
> 
> It's very, very hard for me to wrap my mind around the notion that there are people who are genuinely uninterested in friends. They add so damn much to who I am as a person in this life, and I know my wife feels the same about hers.
> 
> This thread is very eye opening because it's so, so far removed from my reality, and the reality of the people in my life. I've never come across such a large swatch of people totally uninterested in close friendships. It's truly throwing me for a loop to be honest.



I think most of the guys here would like close friends but no longer think it's a priority because of personal disappointments or the realization that in the end it's about your family. If you've ever had a near death experience you would understand what I'm saying. Because of this I think less men are willing to put themselves out there as they age. When I was younger I would put myself out there on a daily basis but now I rarely find someone who I would trust and that I share common values with. The guys I see with the most friends are the ones who still live in their home town or they are the go with the flow types that need more social interaction to be validated. That said I wish I had a few more close friends.


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## jaquen (Mar 1, 2012)

What about the friends you did make in your youth? What happened to them?


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## frootloop (Dec 20, 2010)

jaquen said:


> What about the friends you did make in your youth? What happened to them?


I also have very few close friends, and would like to make more. The friends from my youth are all far away - they are connected to me on FaceBook, but we *never* talk unless I run into them when I'm back in the home town.

I'd say I have maybe 3 good friends total that I could "ask out" to do something with. Two guys, and one girl I knew from high school. I've been going to "meet ups" (via meet up.com) to try to meet some more people to befriend.


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## southbound (Oct 31, 2010)

jaquen said:


> Funny, because I think it's the ever living "kid in me" that keeps me open to awesome, real friendships. They were very important to me then, and they're even more important to me now.
> 
> It's very, very hard for me to wrap my mind around the notion that there are people who are genuinely uninterested in friends. They add so damn much to who I am as a person in this life, and I know my wife feels the same about hers.
> 
> This thread is very eye opening because it's so, so far removed from my reality, and the reality of the people in my life. I've never come across such a large swatch of people totally uninterested in close friendships. It's truly throwing me for a loop to be honest.


I wouldn't say I'm uninterested in friends or that I work to not have them, life just happens and things change, and I'm somewhat of an introvert, so it's not something I burn to do. Being that you have always had close friends, that's just your norm, so it probably would seem weird for you to not have them.



Enginerd said:


> I think most of the guys here would like close friends but no longer think it's a priority because of personal disappointments or the realization that in the end it's about your family. If you've ever had a near death experience you would understand what I'm saying. Because of this I think less men are willing to put themselves out there as they age. When I was younger I would put myself out there on a daily basis but now I rarely find someone who I would trust and that I share common values with. The guys I see with the most friends are the ones who still live in their home town or they are the go with the flow types that need more social interaction to be validated. That said I wish I had a few more close friends.


Good points. Like I stated before, I just don't find people that I "click" with beyond an acquaintance anymore and share common interests and values with. You mentioned the go-with-the-flow guys. I see a lot of people who just love the interaction so much that they can just fall in with anybody. I suppose that is a useful skill, but I just don't possess it. Some people can adjust their personality to fit whatever people they are with and love it. I'm not saying they are putting up a front, but they are just able to slightly adjust to be with people.

I even asked a guy recently who i noticed has the ability to socialize with anyone. I asked, "Are you able to be your true self when you are with other people?" He said, "Well, not really. I feel the most relaxed when i am around my brother, but if I cut up with everyone else like i did him, people would probably think I was crazy."

With me, I can't truly enjoy myself unless I can be myself 100%, and I find very few people anymore that i feel that way around. I's rather just be at home alone that with a bunch of guys watching football that i can't feel truly comfortable with.

I do have a brother and a cousin that I am close with, but some people don't count family in the friend category. The bottom line is, though, I am happy. It's not something I dwell on.


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## jaquen (Mar 1, 2012)

southbound said:


> I do have a brother and a cousin that I am close with, but some people don't count family in the friend category. The bottom line is, though, I am happy. It's not something I dwell on.


A friend is a friend, regardless of whether you share blood or not. I'm happy for you that you've got your brother and cousin to be close friends with. That's more than a lot of people have.


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

jaquen said:


> Funny, because I think it's the ever living "kid in me" that keeps me open to awesome, real friendships. They were very important to me then, and they're even more important to me now.
> 
> It's very, very hard for me to wrap my mind around the notion that there are people who are genuinely uninterested in friends. They add so damn much to who I am as a person in this life, and I know my wife feels the same about hers.
> 
> This thread is very eye opening because it's so, so far removed from my reality, and the reality of the people in my life. I've never come across such a large swatch of people totally uninterested in close friendships. It's truly throwing me for a loop to be honest.


I understand what you are saying.
But I think it has something to do with age and priorities.

With me, the last best male friend I had known from my youth tried to swindle me over $100K in a contract I TENDERED FOR AND GOT. He was a partner in my business.

The male " friends" I now have are those in business. All we talk about is 
" skrill" [ money], and try to flip deals,so that we all benefit
[ financially ]and so on.
We don't discuss personal stuff.

Maybe for me its just a phaee,
I really don't know. But I think age has something to do with it.
Something happens to a man psychologically when he crosses 40 years.
A lot of stuff changes almost instantly.


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## jaquen (Mar 1, 2012)

Caribbean Man said:


> I understand what you are saying.
> But I think it has something to do with age and priorities.
> 
> With me, the last best male friend I had known from my youth tried to swindle me over $100K in a contract I TENDERED FOR AND GOT. He was a partner in my business.
> ...


Yeah, that definitely sounds totally different than the types of friendships I have. None of them are based on business, even the ones that are in my particular career. The best friends I have are basically family. My relationships with them are very personal.

It also just might be nature/nurture? My father died knocking at 70's door, and was very social, and had close friends his entire life.


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## southbound (Oct 31, 2010)

I'm sure it depends on how someone defines "friend" too. Some people like to have a high friend count and count everyone they talk with on occasion and get along with as a friend, which I see that too. In that regard, I guess i have several friends, but not close friends i hang out with.

I stated before that I am close with my brother and cousin. With them, I can feel as comfortable around them as my favorite t-shirt feels. We don't have to monitor what we say or worry that one might be "shocked" by what the other says. We can have different opinions, but it never turns to argument, it just turns to fun with us. If I'm late to something, I could just be truthful and say, "Hey, give me a break, I took an enema and it took longer than I expected." We can feel free to be "dumb" around each other if we're working on a project. We don't size each other up and see who can be the biggest man in the crowd. Even if there are periods of silence when together, we feel totally comfortable. That is how i feel around a close friend, and I just don't find that kind of comfort and freedom with most guys i meet and, therefore, don't form what i call close friendships and guys I would enjoy hanging out with.


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## jaquen (Mar 1, 2012)

southbound said:


> I'm sure it depends on how someone defines "friend" too. Some people like to have a high friend count and count everyone they talk with on occasion and get along with as a friend, which I see that too. In that regard, I guess i have several friends, but not close friends i hang out with.


Truth. Those people I would call "acquaintances". I have acquaintances, friends, and best friends...

For me my best friends are...



southbound said:


> I stated before that I am close with my brother and cousin. With them, I can feel as comfortable around them as my favorite t-shirt feels. We don't have to monitor what we say or worry that one might be "shocked" by what the other says. We can have different opinions, but it never turns to argument, it just turns to fun with us. If I'm late to something, I could just be truthful and say, "Hey, give me a break, I took an enema and it took longer than I expected." We can feel free to be "dumb" around each other if we're working on a project. We don't size each other up and see who can be the biggest man in the crowd. Even if there are periods of silence when together, we feel totally comfortable. That is how i feel around a close friend, and I just don't find that kind of comfort and freedom with most guys i meet and, therefore, don't form what i call close friendships and guys I would enjoy hanging out with.


Exactly this.


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## Enginerd (May 24, 2011)

jaquen said:


> What about the friends you did make in your youth? What happened to them?


I grew up in So Cal and moved away in my late 20's. The culture was very shallow in my circle there and I simply grew out of it. My friends are now spread out all over the country and we no longer share the same values. Its seems we all ran away from SO Cal one way or another. I talk to them on FB occasionally but we are not close by any stretch.


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

jaquen said:


> Yeah, that definitely sounds totally different than the types of friendships I have. None of them are based on business, even the ones that are in my particular career. The best friends I have are basically family. My relationships with them are very personal.
> 
> *It also just might be nature/nurture? My father died knocking at 70's door, and was very social, and had close friends his entire life.*


.....and my dad & mom were divorced when I was very young.


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## MaritimeGuy (Jul 28, 2012)

My definition of friend would be someone you would feel comfortable calling at 2AM cause your car broke down in the middle of nowhere. 

There's a quote I enjoy, "A friend will come bail you out of jail the morning after. A real friend will be sitting there beside you saying, 'Damn that was fun!'" 

For me it's not that I don't want good friends. It's just that after work, family and time to myself I rarely have time left for anyone else. On the odd occasion that I do, I can hardly expect someone I haven't contacted in a while to drop everything to spend time with me.


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## jaquen (Mar 1, 2012)

MaritimeGuy said:


> On the odd occasion that I do, I can hardly expect someone I haven't contacted in a while to drop everything to spend time with me.


Well yes, a close or best friend would. For those rare few you are allowed to expect that.


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## Lyris (Mar 29, 2012)

I just listened to an interesting podcast about male-to-male intimacy, non-sexual intimacy. Thought some of you might be interested too.

Friday Talkback: Male Intimacy - Life Matters - ABC Radio National (Australian Broadcasting Corporation)


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

southbound said:


> I'm sure it depends on how someone defines "friend" too. Some people like to have a high friend count and count everyone they talk with on occasion and get along with as a friend, which I see that too. In that regard, I guess i have several friends, but not close friends i hang out with.
> 
> *I stated before that I am close with my brother and cousin. With them, I can feel as comfortable around them as my favorite t-shirt feels. We don't have to monitor what we say or worry that one might be "shocked" by what the other says. We can have different opinions, but it never turns to argument, it just turns to fun with us. If I'm late to something, I could just be truthful and say, "Hey, give me a break, I took an enema and it took longer than I expected." We can feel free to be "dumb" around each other if we're working on a project. We don't size each other up and see who can be the biggest man in the crowd. Even if there are periods of silence when together, we feel totally comfortable. That is how i feel around a close friend, and I just don't find that kind of comfort and freedom with most guys i meet and, therefore, don't form what i call close friendships and guys I would enjoy hanging out with.*


*

*

Had a few friends like this when I was in my late teens. One of them is dead, one I haven't seen in thirty years and one of them, screwed both my first wife(when we were dating, I found out after the marriage) and my second wife. I told my second wife to stay away from him or he would break us up. All he wanted was to get into her pants. "NO SIR!", she said. Well, that was beyond the point of reconciliation. Who needs close friends.


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## Sennik (Feb 15, 2011)

SadSamIAm said:


> Am I normal? How do grown men, get friends?


Sounds normal to me. I am very much in the same boat as you. By the time all three kid's extraculliculars and spouse time is taken care of there isn't much time left over for maintaining friendships like I had back in HS/college. 

I do have a couple friends from 20+ and 35+ years ago that I talk to and occassionally go out for breakfast and catch up with but that's about it. Most friends are casual acquaintences through kid's activities.

Having said that I don't think I'll have a problem once the nest is empty. I've always been able to make friends but it takes me a while to develop from casual to good. 

Looking forward to taking my Diavel and wife on some cross-country motorcycle trips in the not so distant future and making some more friends in that circle, should be interesting


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## Tall Average Guy (Jul 26, 2011)

SadSamIAm said:


> I know my father was the same way. He spent all of his time with family and with work. He had no real friends. When they retired, it bothered him that my mom had friends and would always be going for coffee or shopping with her friends.
> 
> Am I normal? How do grown men, get friends?


How much of this is based on the definition of "friend"? Are those people your mom was going out with friends or just acquaintances?

I know I am similar, though part of that is that I don't call someone a friend lightly. I have lots of acquaintances and do things with them (golfing, trivia night, poker), but would not call many of them friends. But that is just me.

I do think it is unhealthy to not have some people to do things apart from family and work. Defining yourself in only those two areas leaves a person too constrained.


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## SadSamIAm (Oct 29, 2010)

I think it has a lot to do with definition. I have many acquaintances and many of them might call me a friend. A friend is someone that I would call if I had an issue. I wouldn't call any of my acquaintances. The friendships I formed in High School/College are deeper than any relationship I have had since.

What I have found is that when my wife and I are getting along, this lack of friends doesn't bother me. I look forward to retiring with my wife. Going golfing with her. Travelling the world with her. 

But our relationship is strange. We can go from fighting bitterly to being madly in love. At least that is how I feel and how I read her as well.

If our relationship ended or if something happened to her, I would be lost for a while. But I am confident and out going. Just have never really needed to reach out.


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