# Looking for some advice here



## Needingadvice86 (Apr 7, 2017)

So here's some backstory on my situation. My husband and I have been together for 9 years married almost 5. We have 2 kids, one biologically his but he adopted my oldest. Our youngest is special needs and disabled and right around the same time we received a diagnosis for her (may 2014) we also found out my BIL had brain cancer (he has since passed away  this past june) and my MIL had breast cancer (she is ok now luckily). There have always been bickering mainly about finances and sex. I've always felt as though his interests are with others. Even in the beginning he started watching p*** instead of having sex. We've fought over it and he would say it would stop and it wouldnt. Over the past two years though things have gotten worse. 

Fast forward to spring of 2016 when I found him emailing women from Craigslist. I confronted him and he instantly admitted but said that he wouldn't say or make promises only that he would stop. I believed him and he said it didn't go any further and I didn't look any further. Over the last year I had my doubts and would find the p*** but would let it go because they at least he wasn't still messaging women. 

We were still arguing and this past thanksgiving we got into a bad argument where I told him I felt alone in our marriage I felt like he didn't love me anymore and was only still in our marriage because he was comfortable and afraid of what the situation would look like with not being with our kids daily. He's even said he would stay just for the kids in the past. He promised that while we fight that there is no one else was no one else and that I'm the only one and he does love me. We agreed to work on things and really try. If we couldn't see a change by the time we moved to a new town for my,job in February (yes 2 months ago) then we would be done. I agreed and started working on my attitude and being more happy. I tried being nicer and not being so stressed out. I tried to let him make more decisions on his own about things (like Xmas shopping things he said he never got to do but wanted to do. He said one of his big problems with me was/is never being happy with what I have, my bad attitude and needing things to be done my way all the time. I don't completely agree but hey if that's what he sees then I'm willing to change some things). We were doing great.......I thought. Three days before Xmas I woke up and for some reason picked up his phone to find out he had been on a local hook up website. He shut it down that day but wouldn't come clean about everything. Since that day, since December 22nd I have been told and found out that he had at least one affair email account, had several accounts for numerous and I mean numerous hook up sites or cheat on your spouse sites, constantly emailing Craigslist personal ads, and was consistently talking to one woman that I know of. I also know that he was sending d*** p*** to her and countless,other people and video chatted with her while messaging me that he loves me. She knew about me but didn't know we were "working on things". They planned to meet up and have sex and he's admitted to wanting her more than me at the time but she called it off. This hurt me the most of it all....the other woman. 

I've also learned from him (at least he says) that he was looking for someone else because he wanted to be happy. He's told me I've let myself go, that I look like a boy because I like to wear jeans and t-shirts, told me I'm nasty, and told me that he wants what he wants and that he wants to wants me and wants to love me and then changes it and says he's not good with words and that's not what he meant (he has never been good with words so I give him that). I've also learned that I guess the sex we were having was boring to him but I'm literally open to anything go on the bedroom and he's always turned me down so I'm confused there. 

Here we are now in April. I truly believe that he has stayed off of those sites and isn't talking to anyone anymore. We have moved but now we are experiencing other problems. He claims his sex drive isn't what it was before and that he just doesn't want to have sex that much because he's lazy. Well his browser history from two/three months ago says different. Then there's the fact that he will get aroused and then tell me no or that he wants to go do something else (play his game, watch tv). Last night was the ultimate let down for me as his wife and I think the final slap in my face that it really is me!!!!! We get in the mood, he's aroused and ready to go, I'm naked and on top of him and he goes soft and asks for p***. Now don't get me wrong. If we are watching it together to get started that's fine I'm ok with that. I like watching it too. And I've watched a lot of it myself and have never desensitized myself to sex before anyone says that and I know I've watched more than he has. (I've always been on the high sex drive end of things and always been into watching it just don't like it when it used instead of me) my issue with last night is he should have stayed aroused if he's attracted to me and wanting me right? 

He claims I'm making this into a problem when it isn't and I need to grow up and act like a woman with children and real problems i,stead of the fact that it wasn't ready when I wanted on my terms. Be said that he gives me a little and I try to take take take. He also said that he can't help around the house, help with the kids, work and do extra things with the kids and still have sex like I want. I don't think I should have to choose and I don't think it should be that hard. I mean. I am his wife. He should want to and if not then hit road. I'm not here just to be a mom and cook dinner. 

Am I over reacting? Is my marriage over? Does my husband really,not want me? Was his attempts to cheat really a sign that this needs to end and that he needs/wants something that isn't me and I can't give him? I need some help here.


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## NWCooper (Feb 19, 2013)

I think your husband has shown you who he is over and over and you need to believe him. He's a cheater and a liar, and he is trying to shift blame onto you. He has also seen you are going to let him get away with being a cheater and liar, so why should he change? I am unsure why you would even WANT to have sex with someone that would hook up with randoms from Craig's List.


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## WilliamM (Mar 14, 2017)

I don't think you are over-reacting. I think most people would have been much less forgiving of the attempts to cheat, even if he didn't succeed in following through. There's no need to know if he did manage to cheat or not. That's for you to decide about.

All that counts is you do want him to include you in his sex life, and he won't. It's obvious he is pursuing sex without including you. That hurts. You are definitely not over-reacting.

Lots of people will ask why you give him so many chances. But love can be funny that way. People might give advice about how to change him.

You two need to be in marriage counseling together if you hope to save your marriage. I suspect your husband does not care enough to do that with you, because I have a low opinion of men. But maybe he will.

He is a chronic liar, a cheat, has many sexual problems which you can't even begin to work on until he gets past his inability to tell the truth. It's pretty bleak, but a marriage counselor could help if you both really want to try.

Good luck.


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## Satya (Jun 22, 2012)

I hope you went to get STD tested. 
If not, call to make the appointment today. You need to take care of yourself. 

He's a serial cheater willing to risk your health. I don't care if you lack hard-core evidence. It's clear what he wants. You're desperate for love from a person who clearly doesn't love or respect you. Right now, I'm wondering if the person really afraid of divorce is him... Or you? 

Why would you value yourself so little to even think an unremorseful husband is capable of what you're expecting? It's one thing to perhaps "let yourself go," but he's obviously creating the perfect storm to make you feel insecure while he carries on doing what he wants and continues to check out.

Do you want your kids to find his Craigslist communications? Crack down on that crud, tout de suite. If he wants this to be his life, he can pursue his fantasies without you.


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## Needingadvice86 (Apr 7, 2017)

Thanks for the replies guys. I wanted to add that over the course of the last year he has hardly slept and come to bed. Another thing is, i never said he wasn't sorry for what he did. There was just a point where he knew just saying sorry w as my going to work. 

To those who say why would you want to stay??? My husband, my best friend, just lost his big brother, the father figure in his life, his best friend, the man that introduced us, a man that was in our lives daily. So what makes me any more of a woman for giving up on him and walking away from him and our marriage during one of the hardest times of his life. He's never lost anyone before. His parents are in their 70s so he doesn't really remember his grandparents. He has agreed to go marriage counseling which is something o didn't think he would do. I've asked him what makes this time different. He explained to me that when he noticed he I didn't cry anymore when I told him to decide what he wanted and to get his **** together or get out and went to work and if he wasn't home when I got off work then j knew what he decided and I didn't care I just wanted the games over with. This happened right before Xmas. He said he realized he was pushing me too close to losing me for stupid things. He has said he was in a weird place not knowing how to deal with everything from our disabled daughter to both his mom and brother being diagnosed with cancer in the same month and then 2 years of us taking care of his brother and basically watching him die in front of us. 


I'm not saying what he did was right. I'm saying there are things that make some sense. One thing I have to remember is that he as far as I know only got as far as he did with the one woman. I also forgot to mention he's a stay at home dad, doesn't have a cell phone plan only has an old cell with Wi-Fi because of finances. He doesn't drive never has because of anxiety. He has diabetes but doesn't manage it well. He's also on Zoloft to help with his stress with his brother. 

Our situation is odd unique and strange, I know, but I'm not ready to give up on my husband to find out that all the attempts to cheat to everything were because he didn't have the right outlets to deal with his grief or didn't know how to ask for help. I've tried trust me. Its just hard.


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## Needingadvice86 (Apr 7, 2017)

Oh and since we've moved,in Feb he has come to bed with me every night. Has barely been on his phone, I've been working less hours so we've been spending more husband and wife time together during the day. I've lost 35 lbs. He does compliment me several times daily where before if we talked we fought. It seems like now we are getting along we are even communicating better about money just not sex


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## WilliamM (Mar 14, 2017)

One therapeutic effect strangers on a message board can have, which I have seen, is causing someone to defend themselves and/or their loved ones and fix their issues in spite of the message board people.

So we may attack your husband and say that's no excuse for the slimy things he did, and you might defend him. I say grief just doesn't cut it as an excuse, and you say people grieve in different ways.

Personally I think setting up a meeting with someone else is inexcusable, but actually affairs are excusable, so planning one is. My life is full of problems, past and present, so I sure can't say you make bad decisions.

The advice to get tested for STD is great advice, and you need to do that! You need to do that no matter if you defend your husband or not, no matter if you believe him or not, no matter what. Please get tested!


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## Needingadvice86 (Apr 7, 2017)

Its not that I don't want to hear the advice but for people to bash someone and say such negative things when all I'm doing is looking for help is wrong. I'm not asking for people to out down my husband I have enough in my head over what he's done. I'm looking for advice on how to move forward and how to tell if its really me or not. What I'm not looking for is people telling me how wrong it is what he did. I know that. He knows that from what he's said and demonstrated outside of the bedroom lately. 

Another thing I don't need is people assuming because we've hit a bad spot that I'm an irresponsible person who doesn't take care of herself. I'm a 30 yr old woman who goes to The Dr regularly. Gets tested yearly at my yearly check up and got tested as soon as I found out how far it went which all proof and his statements have only proven that he's tried not actually followed through. To judge me and assume I'm and idiot and don't know how to take care of myself is,not helping my situation and honestly is no better than him or anyone else putting me down when over and over in a post it says Get tested get tested get tested. Well no ****!!!!! That's not what I'm here for. I'm not here for junior high sex ed on how to make sure I'm protected. 

Sorry for being rude but when replies don't have anything to do with my questions and only state how stupid I am it completely defeats the purpose of this or any other forum.


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

The behavior your husband is involved in is addictive and representative of the fact that he is a broken person.

You need to come to the realization that your husband is NOT EVER going to marriage material, that you are not required to stay married to him, that what he is doing is even declared a reason to divorce him by God, and that you would really have to search hard to find a worse candidate for a husband.

Stop allowing yourself to be emotionally traumatized on a constant basis by this man, and GET OUT of this "marriage". 

YOU CANNOT FIX THIS MAN.

He doesn't even want to be fixed. He wants sloots and *****s. He's human garbage.

Please, get out. He is very likely to give you a disease that could easily end your life.


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## WilliamM (Mar 14, 2017)

It's okay to be rude. 

Many people don't get tested. Unless you say you did, the assumption is you didn't.

You are not over-reacting.

While that single statement may be all you were hoping to get in response to your story, it is probably not all you will get.

Good luck.


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

No, you aren't over reacting.

Yes, your marriage is over.

Your husband is seeking to mitigate his infidelity because of his grief. You feel like you should cut him some slack. I am no stranger to caregiving for terminal loved ones, I've done it and lost 3, 2 siblings and my mother. Also while trying to piece together a distant and disconnected marriage. Damn, if I had known that my grief gave me leave to sleep around maybe I would have coped better! I feel totally cheated now.

He has felt lost and adrift, I get that, but have you ignored his attempts for closeness? Have you emotionally abandoned him? Have you ignored his distress because of your stress? Have you turned away from sex with him? Have you rejected him? If you can answer no to these questions then marriage counseling isn't needed. Individual therapy is needed because your husband doesn't want sex, rejects you, seeks out others, seeks out release through porn while ignoring you and these are all HIS problems!

I suggest you move this thread to CWI because you need to start seeking to separate yourself from your husband and this marriage. It is the only way he will honestly and fully take responsibility for his issues and if he wants the marriage to work he will work therapy so he can be a husband/father.

He isn't your best friend, your best friend wouldn't reject you, lie to you and then insult you. You still love him, that's okay but it doesn't mean the marriage will work.


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## Emerging Buddhist (Apr 7, 2016)

Looking outside for this happiness is looking in the wrong direction... and how he is looking outside is causing him even more suffering.

What does he accept in his suffering? What is he ready to accept?

We are with our partners for may reasons... enriching and being enriched in a shared life strikes my mind first as I type this so it must be my truth for me, what is your truth?

Anxiety, diabetes, loss, insecurity, medicated... my what a handful for self to deal with.

Life is hard... your husband has found this to be more truth than he can handle right now, and if he won't accept his suffering he will continue to share it to those he has relationships with, neither enriched no enriching for either of you. In a nutshell, he has to feel good about himself before he can feel good about others, especially his wife.

So how would you share that he's loved and wanted, alive for a reason?  Is it your job to convince him he is stronger than these unmindful things that have entered his life?

Not to convince him no... he has to do that himself.

Your love should be a spiritual hand up at the moment... he has had the hand out and you have been gracious about it so remember to take care of yourself because there are times when we don’t realize we’re actually drowning when we’re trying to be everyone else’s lifeline.

Looking outside for this happiness is looking in the wrong direction... and how he is looking outside is causing him even more suffering.

What does he accept in his suffering? What is he ready to accept?


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

My take:

You are highly sexed.

You are very aggressive. This makes him feel that making love to you "on a regular basis" is too much work, too much drama. Hence, the porn, hence the "nice" OW that he is trying to hook up with.

You are easily angered. You spend a lot of time being angry.

You are easily flustered.

These behaviors are pushing him away. As a rule, with few exceptions, men like women who are not high maintenance, high tempered, aggressive, "overly passionate". They want a passionate women, but not if she is overbearing. The passion must be [love and sex] related. Not raw aggression.

Dominant women are not sexy to most men. Oh, those aggressive tendencies are nice for short term relationships......for one-night stands. 

Now, you may be just fine during lovemaking. It is the time before and after the lovemaking sessions that drive him away. 

No man wants to walk on eggshells. Does not want to dance before every performance in the bedroom. 
........................................................................................................................................................

Problem:

This is you. You ARE this way. Why should you have to change for him to desire you, to show you intimacy "on a regular basis"?

Because you love this man. You want to regain his devotion, his love, intimacy and passion.

If you do change, do it first for yourself; then, for this relationship, or any future relationship.

A very soft spoken, kind, feminine women can win over a Snow Man. She can melt his frozen resolve very quickly.

Talk is cheap. Action comes at a cost. You believe he is worth it? 

OK, kitty...find some catnip....then go lick his fur.


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## badsanta (Oct 13, 2014)

Needingadvice86 said:


> Oh and since we've moved,in Feb he has come to bed with me every night. Has barely been on his phone, I've been working less hours so we've been spending more husband and wife time together during the day. I've lost 35 lbs. He does compliment me several times daily where before if we talked we fought. It seems like now we are getting along we are even communicating better about money just not sex


In the past when the two of you have had sex, has he struggled to satisfy you in any way? Or do you primarily try and have sex for the purpose of trying to please him and make him happy?

Generally speaking many women on this forum that might be sexually frustrated would advocate that you take responsibility for your own sexual pleasure and when possible try and share that with your husband. As one lady put it, "I'm about to go enjoy a good orgasm, and it would be nice if you wanted to join me!" The implications of that means that she was not ashamed to admit that she would be masturbating alone in the event her partner was unable to join her for whatever reason. As a guy this is rather extraordinary concept because it implies that there is no action required and that the man can enjoy being a spectator, for which I doubt many men would be able to resist participating in the excitement at some point. 

Some women on TAM that have husbands that struggle with psychological erectile dysfunction, say that such a problem tends to subside after he experiences holding his partner while she orgasms repeatedly (all on her own, or perhaps with him using a vibrator). 

I don't know if that will help you two or not, but it the best advice I feel I can offer. I had to resist the urge to say negative things about how your husband treats you, so I will leave it at this... You should feel very confident in the fact that you deserve for your husband to treat you better, and you should have no hesitation or shame in communicating that to him in whatever means you need to that helps the two of you find a happier place together.

Regards, 
Badsanta


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## Jessica38 (Feb 28, 2017)

Needingadvice86 said:


> Our situation is odd unique and strange, I know, but I'm not ready to give up on my husband to find out that all the attempts to cheat to everything were because he didn't have the right outlets to deal with his grief or didn't know how to ask for help. I've tried trust me. Its just hard.


No, your situation is not unique. Many marriages go through challenges of loss and all of life's ups and downs and do so without one spouse cheating. Your husband is looking to cheat on you, if he hasn't already. He has betrayed your trust by searching for other women and initiating contact with them. You are accepting crumbs in your marriage by tolerating this abuse, because you are not yet ready to leave him. He has already left the marriage by initiating contact with other women for the purpose of getting together with them.

Your marriage is over. It is only a matter of time before he physically cheats, if he hasn't already. You have enough evidence already to consider your husband unfaithful to your marriage.


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

SunCMars said:


> My take:
> 
> You are highly sexed.
> 
> ...


Oh FFS!!!! Seriously? I mean do you honestly think her manbaby husband is intimidated by her ability to seek what she wants? Does her manbaby husband have itty bitty shriveled up testicles so that when a woman comes on to him it scares man baby away? 

Overly passionate? Oh really? Exactly how many times a week is a woman supposed to want to have sex before she crosses the line from appropriately passionate to overly passionate? More than two means she's a *****? Is a woman allowed to initiate sex or is she supposed to cross her fingers and hope man baby notices? And how would manbaby notice if he's chatting up other women on Craigslist?

Sarcasm off. 

Dominant women are actually very sexy to a LOT of men. You're just plain wrong because the BDSM section at literotica has MORE male submissives than female, more Female dominant than male. So no, a lot of men are in Gaga drooling love with a woman who can say, "get your tongue down her and down stop until I say you can!"

Anyone who is routinely left sexually frustrated and emotionally ignore would be easily angered. I know I sure as hell get very *****y when I haven't gotten laid often enough. And you have made several posts detailing your anger and frustration with being sexually ignored.





> Now, you may be just fine during lovemaking. It is the time before and after the lovemaking sessions that drive him away.
> 
> No man wants to walk on eggshells. Does not want to dance before every performance in the bedroom.
> ........................................................................................................................................................
> ...




And now we have a man telling the betrayed spouse that her husband's cheating is because she wants sex too often and has frightened and intimidated her husband so that he needed to seek out "nice girls" who weren't so overly passionate? If this betrayed spouse wants to save her marriage, she needs to but on that submissive kitty collar and start kneeling at her husband's feet waiting for him to decide to pay attention.

OP, I hope you see the double standard being thrown at you and I hope you bat that **** down like a good cat!


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

How often do the two of you have sex, say in the last 3 to 4 months?


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

Anon Pink said:


> Oh FFS!!!! Seriously? I mean do you honestly think her manbaby husband is intimidated by her ability to seek what she wants? Does her manbaby husband have itty bitty shriveled up testicles so that when a woman comes on to him it scares man baby away?
> 
> Overly passionate? Oh really? Exactly how many times a week is a woman supposed to want to have sex before she crosses the line from appropriately passionate to overly passionate? More than two means she's a *****? Is a woman allowed to initiate sex or is she supposed to cross her fingers and hope man baby notices? And how would manbaby notice if he's chatting up other women on Craigslist?
> 
> ...


Uh, OK!

Her husband is an a-hole. We know that. 

*She wants to stay with him, regardless.*

*Did she not say she wanted a way to win him over, warts and all? She did not want to hear that she should divorce him. I merely complied.
* Mistake?

I merely complied with her wish. I gave her some pointers. I do not agree with them because, frankly, he is not worth a plug nickle.

That will be the last time I give a woman [here] want she wants to [hear]. Of course what I wrote is pure B.S.

That said, she should dump him.

Oh, and I stick to my guns on aggressive women. Most men want to come home to a Sweetie, not an Amazon. It wears on ya.

Same with women. How many women want to live with an angry, bitter. wound tight dude? Do you think they would want to cozy up to him for sex?

Even the best posters....are not, sometimes. <-----------Joke

Do some men like BDSM? Sure, a small percentage. But that normally is role playing and fantasy. Not real beatings and all the other stuff, unmentioned or course!

Then again, I do not know what goes on at your house. <----------Joke

This post was..... my bad.


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

Emerging Buddhist said:


> What does he accept in his suffering? What is he ready to accept?
> 
> ......
> 
> What does he accept in his suffering? What is he ready to accept?



Will you explain this to me? I don't understand what this means?

I was thinking I should send you a private message to ask for an explanation but then I thought maybe it isn't exacltly a threadjack because it does pertain to OP's husband.



@SunCMars

LOL, I thank you for the correct spelling of here and hear. When my fingers are flying across the key board at the speed at which I think, they have little discernment for homonyms. 

I should not have become so angry at your post. I apologize, even though I believe you are wrong in your assessment of men being easily intimidated.  I've found that men can handle a great deal of stress but kind of suck at emotional entanglement upheaval. If they can't punch it, spit at it, or **** it, they're not sure how to handle it. <---- gross and nearly unforgivable over simplification but it amuses me so I post it as often as I can.


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## Emerging Buddhist (Apr 7, 2016)

Not a problem @Anon Pink.

In his anxiety he is needing to rely on pharma-induced mindfulness, if there can truly be such a thing... the loss of his brother whom he loved dearly and looked up to reliant as well as a pillar in his life, and his own frailty in diabetes which he doesn't manage well is suffering he is not overcoming.

Accepting each of these and being ready to accept each of these lead to the same place although two entirely different tasks, one a preparation, the other an action.

Preparing to be ready (acceptance) is the series of learning to be kind enough to ourselves to not create suffering from suffering, recognizing that life while wonderful in all it is, will likely take at times more than it gives and it's how we handle those times when the balance is not in our favor that will either lessen our suffering, or add to it. It is in this practice that we ready ourselves for the next step...

Accepting and living through the suffering with giving ourselves the best love we can muster... eating right, balancing our medication for our health, not creating suffering for other through our action and choices... true acceptance.

Too often, we try to shortcut and jump strait into acceptance without preparing... and like any unprepared task that doesn't come easy, we land more disappointed than when we began, and more frustrated looking for even easier unmindfulness to ease pain in our lives.

As much as we want it to be, cyclic suffering is never black and white.

Not knowing the OP's husband, I do not know how he is prepared but she would, and if she would share and we listen, that may help understand better the offerings of this site.

Thank you for asking... peace be with you.


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

Thanks for your reply but as you can see I'm still confused.




Emerging Buddhist said:


> Not a problem @Anon Pink.
> 
> In his anxiety he is needing to rely on pharma-induced mindfulness, if there can truly be such a thing... the loss of his brother whom he loved dearly and looked up to reliant as well as a pillar in his life, and his own frailty in diabetes which he doesn't manage well is suffering he is not overcoming.


Okay this is the first part I'm not fully getting.

Mindfulness of his loss, his own frailty, and the consequent and inescapable suffering. If I restated that correctly, what exactly is one to do, think, contemplate, feel, etc, in order to be mindful of these things?





> Accepting each of these and being ready to accept each of these lead to the same place although two entirely different tasks, one a preparation, the other an action.


Lead to the same place? Inner Peace? Wha....?




> Preparing to be ready (acceptance) is the series of learning to be kind enough to ourselves to not create suffering from suffering, recognizing that life while wonderful in all it is, will likely take at times more than it gives and it's how we handle those times when the balance is not in our favor that will either lessen our suffering, or add to it. It is in this practice that we ready ourselves for the next step...


Learning to be kind enough to ourselves to not create suffering from suffering. The practical application would be....eating right? Getting enough sleep? Getting appropriate exercise? What about psychologically beating ourselves up? Loss necessarily includes regret, guilt, even anger and hostility, it's one thing to kindly eat right but those emotional traps can't be so easily navigated. It is those emotional traps that, many times, prevent us FROM being kind to ourselves. 

Maybe I just don't understand the concept of mindfulness.




> Accepting and living through the suffering with giving ourselves the best love we can muster... eating right, balancing our medication for our health, not creating suffering for other through our action and choices... true acceptance.


Okay this makes sense. Just do the best you can each day to take care of yourself. Just do what you can and allow that some days you will take good care and other days you may not. Right?

If I have that right, here is where it really confuses me: what if you have that mindset of each day to just try to do the best you can, accept that some days your best isn't enough. IOW, it's actually allowing further sinking? Sleep, eat, move...what if none of those are consistent enough to keep from sinking deeper and deeper? The guilt of knowing that your best isn't enough, knowing the sinking continues actually exacerbates the sinking. How is mindfulness or acceptance supposed to work in this situation?





> Too often, we try to shortcut and jump strait into acceptance without preparing... and like any unprepared task that doesn't come easy, we land more disappointed than when we began, and more frustrated looking for even easier unmindfulness to ease pain in our lives.


Preparing to accept...? I don't understand. "I accept that today I was able to hit one of the three (sleep, eat, move) and not able to hit two. But the downward slide continues, and I accept that."




> As much as we want it to be, cyclic suffering is never black and white.
> 
> Not knowing the OP's husband, I do not know how he is prepared but she would, and if she would share and we listen, that may help understand better the offerings of this site.


I understand cyclic suffering. Spiral emotional processing. Spiral downward and dip into an aspect of pain, process that and spiral upward for a time. Ignoring the painful issue and gaining some strength before spiraling downward again, dip further into the painful issue and process for a time before spiraling upward again. This process is repeated over and over and over and over. Cyclic suffering, cyclic processing, cyclic healing. 

Ideally, during the processing phase a coping skill is learned, insights are gained, progress is made. That progress, in practical terms, means that during the upward spiral the upward movement is ever so much higher than before. Ideally. 

Sometimes the depth and breadth of emotional pain means it might take many many dips doward before enough has been processed in order to actually move incrementally higher at the upward phase. 

This kind of spiral processing is healthy, even when the ideal isn't realized because there are enough segments upward to keep from sinking and not getting back up.

It becomes unhealthy when the spiral downward never gets back up. It dips down, begins to move up but dips right back down and instead of incremental upward cycles, it has become incremental downward cycle. The upward swings that were supposed to allow strength to gather were insufficient to allow strength to gather before shifting back down and so the downward swing went a tad deeper than it had before. The upward swing didn't even make it to where it was before and the next downward swing went even deeper. The unhealthy destructive cycle has begun. Or as you put it, creating suffering from suffering?

How does mindfulness or acceptance or preparation to accept work in this situation?


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## Emerging Buddhist (Apr 7, 2016)

Anon Pink said:


> Thanks for your reply but as you can see I'm still confused.


I wish I understood the multi-quotes better… I shall have to learn them better in the future. 

___



Anon Pink said:


> Emerging Buddhist said:
> 
> 
> > In his anxiety he is needing to rely on pharma-induced mindfulness, if there can truly be such a thing... the loss of his brother whom he loved dearly and looked up to reliant as well as a pillar in his life, and his own frailty in diabetes which he doesn't manage well is suffering he is not overcoming.
> ...


As we adjust to the loss of those we love it is natural to grieve and be sad from missing them as part of our lives and as the world seems negative from this loss we have to be aware least our grieving takes over and overshadows all other things in our lives or allow us the desires to mask the pain though unhealthy means… accepting that loss will happen and is part of life unmasked, this is being mindful.
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Anon Pink said:


> Emerging Buddhist said:
> 
> 
> > Accepting each of these and being ready to accept each of these lead to the same place although two entirely different tasks, one a preparation, the other an action.
> ...


I see this simply as one learns to crawl before walking… the goal is to first understand forward motion to get to something or somewhere, then upright and steady but not without preparation of first standing and learning balance. This is preparation for mindfulness and what is mindfulness if not inner peace? 
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Anon Pink said:


> Emerging Buddhist said:
> 
> 
> > Preparing to be ready (acceptance) is the series of learning to be kind enough to ourselves to not create suffering from suffering, recognizing that life while wonderful in all it is, will likely take at times more than it gives and it's how we handle those times when the balance is not in our favor that will either lessen our suffering, or add to it. It is in this practice that we ready ourselves for the next step...
> ...


Mindfulness: This is thrown around so much these days it is easy to lose the true concept… to a Buddhist it is simply to be fully aware of the present, of the moment, and to not be confused by all swirling around you in the business that takes away from being calm (happy, content, desires at bay) in life.

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Anon Pink said:


> Emerging Buddhist said:
> 
> 
> > Accepting and living through the suffering with giving ourselves the best love we can muster... eating right, balancing our medication for our health, not creating suffering for other through our action and choices... true acceptance.
> ...


If one has guilt and anxiety, then I would suspect one would know that better is possible… I know I do when I recognize that guilt hasn’t solved my past lack of effort and being anxious over it will do nothing for my future. I have this control of my happiness and while the path is not an easy one, it will lead to a better one and that motivation (often eight-fold driven in it’s simplicity) keeps me afloat in dark times.

OP’s husband is in dark times… I am only sharing what has helped me and if she sees value in sharing with him, my time here is not lost.
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Anon Pink said:


> Emerging Buddhist said:
> 
> 
> > Too often, we try to shortcut and jump strait into acceptance without preparing... and like any unprepared task that doesn't come easy, we land more disappointed than when we began, and more frustrated looking for even easier unmindfulness to ease pain in our lives.
> ...


Accept that the past is over and you still have work to do on the other two being happy in the one you hit and continue to practice that success, in time the other two will come. 
___



Anon Pink said:


> Emerging Buddhist said:
> 
> 
> > As much as we want it to be, cyclic suffering is never black and white.
> ...


There was a philosopher who said something along the lines of “letting go of what I am, allows me to become what I might be be”… today I am potentially many things that will not be helpful in being happy and calm in life (this is probably more true than I like!) If even a moment less in one area that is detrimental is placed in that in life that is more for the balance, then I have succeeded in this one moment… and removed suffering from suffering.

How does this apply to the OP? Obviously my challenges are quite different than hers, but if she wants to help her husband then understanding where he is at in his actions and behaviors is critical, especially how they impact and influence their marriage. I stated earlier in a post he is looking for things outside his relationship for relief of his pain, this is like trying to stop bleeding from a cut artery with a band-aid. 

In the end, it is in her recognition of why the wound that can be treated is left to bleed and helping her understand enough to convey that need for treatment to her husband in a way he can understand so he allows her to help.

This may not be a path she can share with him, but in the end if he doesn’t, the seed has not been missed.

Some may see it as a flaw, but I do not see her husband in the way others do in this thread… even if he is lost at the present.

Compassion and non-judgement are practiced today…


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

@Emerging Buddhist

View attachment 52553


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## crocus (Apr 8, 2016)

Anon Pink said:


> Thanks for your reply but as you can see I'm still confused.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Anon you are a compassionate flower indeed.
On the topic of doing your best,
The realization one may find is that it's not ever "not good enough" but dropping that concept altogether.
You always do your best. With the knowledge and skills you have today. Some days it is better than others. You do what you know. That is all. If you know more, you will do more.
It is this way because that is reality.
There can be no other way to look at it. Because it cannot be changed. Deciding it was not good enough is causing your own suffering. A subtle but profound shift...

So you accept the past (yesterday and 5 minutes ago) And move onto tomorrow. And just do your best. It takes awhile to keep reminding yourself that it cannot be changed. Hindsight is a stubborn habit. 






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## Holdingontoit (Mar 7, 2012)

crocus said:


> You always do your best.


Some do. Some don't. Some of us are dedicated to the proposition that we will never do our best. Some of us are terrified of even trying.


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## crocus (Apr 8, 2016)

Holdingontoit said:


> Some do. Some don't. Some of us are dedicated to the proposition that we will never do our best. Some of us are terrified of even trying.




And when you are terrified....your best is just that. How you behave when you are terrified. 

Even if, as you say, dedicated to not doing your best, well that is the best version. You are doing your best at being "never good enough". 
If you weren't, you would behave differently.
Dedicated does mean just that.

The problem is thinking you should or must be different when you in fact are doing your best to be "never good enough ".

The problem is comparing your best to someone else's. 
You are trying to achieve "never good enough ". You did your best. I guarantee it.


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