# Divorce & two kids under 6.



## Sarah13 (Dec 9, 2020)

I have been with H for over a decade but only 4 married so "short term marriage" its absurd I am wondering How does anyone begin to move on, he has made millions of dollars and I've made nothing,and signed a prenup I was forced into it under duress but I don't think I would win in court against him and his money. And I would like to handle it without that stress of court battle for the kids sake Its causing me so much anxiety and panic attacks I feel so guilty for not agreeing to some terms he has proposed or he thought was a "good amount of money" i guess my question is has anyone or is anyone going through the same thing ?? I am so worried that the offer he made is maybe the best I will ever get but he has controlled money and everything for so so very long and I worry if I don't accept it than I will be totally left out to dry single mom of two no career no home. I am in such a panic state I just don't know who to trust anymore my lawyer, him, parents, friends I am just so scared and not ready for my marriage to end.
I took care of the house kids cleaning all things home wifes do but I did work full time for most of our relationship until of course covid-19. my question is anyone sign a prenup and won fighting it? what state etc. and 2nd anyone think I should move into a home he owns for a year till i can get on my feet i dont want to move but I will be made to i just know it ughhh.


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## manfromlamancha (Jul 4, 2013)

I am not an expert in US law but prenup or no prenup, he has two kids and a wife with no earnings that he leaves behind - you will be entitled to quite a bit of support. I do not know what has offered you, but your first action is to determine if your lawyer is any good. Did he/she come recommended? Do they have a good track record in divorce cases? If so, then that is who you trust first and foremost. If not, then you need to get a killer shark of a lawyer and he should end up paying for your lawyer.


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## Lance Mannion (Nov 24, 2020)

Sarah13 said:


> I have been with H for over a decade but only 4 married so "short term marriage" its absurd I am wondering How does anyone begin to move on, he has made millions of dollars and I've made nothing,and signed a prenup I was forced into it under duress but I don't think I would win in court against him and his money. And I would like to handle it without that stress of court battle for the kids sake Its causing me so much anxiety and panic attacks I feel so guilty for not agreeing to some terms he has proposed or he thought was a "good amount of money" i guess my question is has anyone or is anyone going through the same thing ?? I am so worried that the offer he made is maybe the best I will ever get but he has controlled money and everything for so so very long and I worry if I don't accept it than I will be totally left out to dry single mom of two no career no home. I am in such a panic state I just don't know who to trust anymore my lawyer, him, parents, friends I am just so scared and not ready for my marriage to end.
> I took care of the house kids cleaning all things home wifes do but I did work full time for most of our relationship until of course covid-19. my question is anyone sign a prenup and won fighting it? what state etc. and 2nd anyone think I should move into a home he owns for a year till i can get on my feet i dont want to move but I will be made to i just know it ughhh.


Courts don't allow children to move from one parent's home of luxury to another parent's home of squalor. The courts seek to equalize living standards for the children.

Courts do not honor child support conditions from pre-nups. You can bargain your interests as an adult but you have no right to bargain away your children's interests, the court always steps in and will place their priority first. 

This means that the poorer spouse gets a lifestyle boost of some sort via child support.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

What does your lawyer say? He will know all the legal ins and outs far better than anyone here.


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## Galabar01 (Mar 20, 2019)

In the US, I don't think a prenup will have anything to do with the child support that you are entitled to.


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## Galabar01 (Mar 20, 2019)

What Can and Cannot be Included in Prenuptial Agreements - FindLaw


Helpful list of the items that can and cannot be included in a premarital (or prenuptial) agreement. Learn more at FindLaw's Marriage Law section.




family.findlaw.com




.

_Decisions Regarding Child Support or Child Custody_
A prenup cannot include child support or child custody issues. The court has the final say in calculating child support. The court determines child support based on a "best interest of the child" standard, with several factors at play. A court would never uphold a provision of a prenuptial agreement that dealt with child support, child custody, or visitation, because these are issues of public policy. The court retains the power to decide what is in the child's best interest and will not deny a child the right to financial support or the opportunity to have a relationship with a fit parent.


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## StarFires (Feb 27, 2018)

You are too worried and confused for me to think you have consulted with an attorney. But that is what you need to do. Once you do that, you will have much, much less to worry and be confused about. You will have the information you need.

If you don't have money for an attorney, lawyers in most areas offer a free 1-hour consultation. That's enough time for you to know where you stand and what to expect.

Also, your attorney can petition the court for emergency support for you and the kids while the divorce proceedings take place until an agreement or a decision is made. Additionally, your attorney can ask the court to make him pay your attorney fees. That's contingent, of course, but you won't know until you ask.

You are too afraid of your husband to maintain contact with him, so don't communicate with him at all during the divorce proceedings. If you must communicate with him, make sure you don't talk about the divorce. That way, you won't allow him to scare you and pressure you into anything, and believe me, he will definitely try. You are way too vulnerable and already proving yourself to be susceptible to that. Just let the attorneys work everything out. You will be informed every step of the way because you will have decisions to make in order for each side to come to any agreement. If you cannot agree, the court will decide for you.

And he cannot MAKE you do anything. You will more than likely be able to maintain yourself and your children wherever you want to live.

The most confusing things you stated are that you signed a preup and yet he has made you an offer. Why did he make an offer if he has a prenup? The settlement terms would already be laid out in the prenup, so was the offer regarding child support? Others have already advised you about child support, so I won't go into that. If his offer didn't involve child support, then what you're saying doesn't make any sense to me. And if you are so worried and frightened, why do you want to challenge the prenup? Additionally, why do you think he can MAKE you live someplace you don't want to live? Your story has so many holes in it that it sounds like stories that trolls bring to boards like this. I'm not saying you are a troll, I'm saying you should clarify some of these inconsistencies that have no basis in legality. You might be quite young, but surely you haven't lived under a rock. These questions I'm asking are common knowledge. I'm also wondering why you say he forced you to sign a prenup. How does forcing someone to sign a prenup happen?


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## Sarah13 (Dec 9, 2020)

Galabar01 said:


> In the US, I don't think a prenup will have anything to do with the child support that you are entitled to.





StarFires said:


> You are too worried and confused for me to think you have consulted with an attorney. But that is what you need to do. Once you do that, you will have much, much less to worry and be confused about. You will have the information you need.
> 
> If you don't have money for an attorney, lawyers in most areas offer a free 1-hour consultation. That's enough time for you to know where you stand and what to expect.
> 
> ...




by "MAKE" he did the day before the wedding, and HE MADE ME b/c he would not marry me if I didn't sign it. 
also, I am not a troll that post junk on random boards. This is MY VERY FIRST BOARD ON THIS SITE OR ANY SITE so again, thank you for that. 
as for the Prenup I know kids are not anything to do with it and court will be in the favor of the children child support is just that child support. I am asking about after that other then the kids with child support. what people if they have HAD a prenup and kids what was the outcome.
I wrote this when I was extremely upset and emotional, so maybe its a little confusing and confused you to go on a hell of a rampage of accusations. For being scared of my husband, I'm not scared of my husband he would never hurt me physically. I am worried about losing my home my lifestyle my kids lifestyle and being alone for the 1st time in 20years (ya i know time for big girl pants right...your next comment).... this like I have built with this man and being a home wife sense covid-19, its worried me and being left with nothing because of the prenup. if it could actually hold up which I did ask MY ATTORNEY and she said it would not but I want real life people talking about it not what someone I pay telling me what I want to hear. you know what mean. thanks 
also as much as I would love to be young again, I am not young by any means and I am not stupid as you seem to think I am. and I am worried and confused also because of the way he is trying to get me to "sign an agreement that is so great and fair to me" and we have a prenup so yes if I brought it to court I would lose his "offer" but I am not telling offer because thats private. I am wondering why is he offering anything when we have one and if he truly thinks in reality if it went to court I would win and I would win more then his offer, because of all the terms I signed under was very very stressed unfair and very unknowing I was not consulted fairly, but I also dont want to drag it out and become this huge fight so I just wanted to see what other ppl in the world have been though in this kind of situation sorry you feel there is holes in the story but some holes are meant to be there thank you for your reply much appreciated


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## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

Listen to your attorney. No one in real life or on-line will have as much information on your case as your attorney.


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## Hiner112 (Nov 17, 2019)

Your lifestyle is likely to change significantly but that is true for both parties for almost all divorces. 

In my state (Virginia) child support is based on a chart and in my case the amount that was about a third of our gross income split proportional among the parents relative to the amount of time the kids are with each of them. For example, if he makes all the money and you have the kids 100% of the time, you'd probably get 1/3 of his income. If the kids split time 50/50 then you'd probably get 1/6. If you make money too, then the amount you get would go down by the ratio of your income and his.

Random internet strangers who don't have law degrees and all the details are a lot less likely to give good advice than a lawyer that does have all the details.


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## StarFires (Feb 27, 2018)

Sarah13, calm down please and stop being so defensive. You stated.....

_"I don't think I would win in court against him and his money."_

and.....
_"I am just so scared"_

and.....
_"he has controlled money and everything for so so very long"_

and.....
_"i dont want to move but I will be made to i just know it"_

Your whole post is so fraught with fear. Who would interpret me saying you're afraid of your husband as being about physical abuse? I was talking about your fear of his money and the power he has over you. You misinterpreted my response completely and became defensive because I didn't call you a troll. I said it was like a troll with so many holes that don't make sense and not very well thought out and also doesn't appear as though you have already consulted with an attorney.

For anyone to be able to advise you regarding your prenup, they would have to be well-versed in contract laws, particularly those in your state, and would have to read your prenup. But this is not a board of lawyers and no one has seen your contract. So if your attorney said it won't hold up in court AND he has made you an offer outside the prenup, then it's pretty clear that the prenup is not legally ironclad. That answers the confusion about him having a prenup and also making an offer, but no one here could know that. If she said she can beat the prenup and he has made an offer, then that means the prenup is either not legally binding or it contains loopholes that can easily be escaped.

You're worried and panicked and going through a divorce you don't want, so it's understandable you would be upset but not so upset over things that really don't seem all that problematic. So I naturally thought you were young and naive to not understand things that are generally known, but you became defensive about that too.

If you don't calm down and stop working yourself into such a state, you will allow your husband to exploit your fears and walk all over you while your lawyer and the court will be trying to prevent that. Your current state of mind will be working against your own best interest.

You're so afraid of your husband that it's also understandable you don't trust your attorney, but you don't have a choice. You HAVE to trust your attorney because she's the only one on your side. Your husband certainly is not on your side. His only concern is to try to prevent your attorney from taking him to the cleaners. That's why he made you an offer. Just using my own imagination based on the way this scenario appears, my guess is his own attorney advised him to make you an offer because just like your lawyer said she can beat the prenup, his lawyer also read the prenup and knows it can be beaten. He's trying to protect his client by advising him to make you an offer. So it's good you didn't accept the offer. Your attorney is trying to protect her client too, so trust your attorney.


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

Go with what your attorney says. They don’t stay in business long if they just tell clients what they want to hear.


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## jin (Sep 9, 2014)

I would get a second opinion on the prenup. Usually they are not enforceable if signed under duress.

A prenup signed on a wedding day with no independent legal advice would be worthless in my country.

Edit. I misread your reply OP. If your attorney said the prenup world not hold up then you might still want to get a second opinion. But from what you described signing a prenup a day before wedding raises the question of its validity. If you didn't get indépendant advice that you paid for i.e your lawyer not your husbands lawyer before signing it then it may not be worth the paper is written on.


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## jlg07 (Feb 24, 2017)

Also Sarah -- your H is TRYING to pressure you (AGAIN) into accepting a deal that is good FOR HIM. He is not thinking about YOU or your kids AT ALL. You said "he is trying to get me to "sign an agreement that is so great and fair to me" and we have a prenup so yes if I brought it to court I would lose his "offer" but I am not telling offer because thats private. "
That is pure scare tactics and he's hoping that you will just lay down and accept it.
DO NOT. Listen to your lawyer, start reading about divorce laws in YOUR state so that you can understand more about it....
You will get through this.


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## Lance Mannion (Nov 24, 2020)

Absent a pre-nup you're looking at some type of split on the marital assets accumulated over the last 4 years. I'm assuming that the bulk of his assets were accumulated before the last 4 years.

You saying you signed under duress doesn't make it so. Your husband's lawyer would know, and would counsel him, to make sure that there was no duress. So, if you claim duress, be prepared for your husband's side to show that there was no duress.

The offer is actually more generous than the prenup? Take the offer.


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## StarFires (Feb 27, 2018)

Sarah13 said:


> by "MAKE" he did the day before the wedding, and HE MADE ME b/c he would not marry me if I didn't sign it





Lance Mannion said:


> You saying you signed under duress doesn't make it so. Your husband's lawyer would know, and would counsel him, to make sure that there was no duress. So, if you claim duress, be prepared for your husband's side to show that there was no duress.
> 
> The offer is actually more generous than the prenup? Take the offer.


Sorry, Lance, but none of that is true. She said he forced her to sign by threatening not to marry her, and it was the day before the wedding. That constitutes duress.

And one of the dangers of coming to a board like this for legal advice is someone telling her to go against her lawyer's advice and make a settlement/sign an agreement they know nothing about.

snipped


jin said:


> *But from what you described signing a prenup a day before wedding raises the question of its validity*. If you didn't get indépendant advice that you paid for i.e your lawyer not your husbands lawyer before signing it then it may not be worth the paper is written on.


↑
This is the problem right here. I didn't even catch it until Jin said it. All I knew was her attorney and her husband both are well aware that the prenup is no good, and he's trying to cover his arse before her lawyer gets a chance to tear him apart in court. That's the reason no one here has any business advising her to take his offer.

It makes good sense to consult an attorney and have them look over a contract before signing it, but it's not a legal requirement here in the US. So I'm pretty sure not having an attorney advise her wouldn't be the reason to negate the prenup unless his attorney acted in an advisory position to her. But if there was no lawyer advising her, then that part wouldn't matter in court.

However, *the duress aspect* is the key. That matters BIG time! Obviously, since we haven't seen the prenup, we don't know if there are any unbinding particulars it may contain that caught her lawyer's eye (and seems obvious to me it caught his lawyer's eye too), but the duress aspect alone is enough for the court to set the prenup aside.

Excerpted from the link above.....

*1. The wedding is right around the corner.*
.....If one person shows up with a prenup the night before the two tie the knot, that may count as duress. The other person may only sign to avoid the public humiliation of canceling the wedding at the last minute.

And from *this Florida link*.....

Duress is a condition of mind produced by an improper external pressure or influence that practically destroys the free agency of a party and causes him to do an act or make a contract not of his own volition. Two factors must be proven to establish duress:

*(a) that the act sought to be set aside was effected involuntarily and thus not as an exercise of free choice or will and

(b) that this condition of mind was caused by some improper and coercive conduct of the opposite side. Duress involves a dual concept of external pressure and internal surrender or loss of volition in response to outside compulsion. *

So there you have it, Sarah. The prenup is no good. Your lawyer is going to rip right through his booty cheeks with razor sharp accuracy, and he's scared as he can be. He's scared enough for both of you. That's why he made you an offer. DO NOT let anyone here or anywhere else in your life convince you to take his offer. Listen to your lawyer. She's a sharp cookie.

And @jin is too. Bravo to you!


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## Lance Mannion (Nov 24, 2020)

StarFires said:


> Sorry, Lance, but none of that is true. She said he forced her to sign by threatening not to marry her, and it was the day before the wedding. That constitutes duress.
> 
> And one of the dangers of coming to a board like this for legal advice is someone telling her to go against her lawyer's advice and make a settlement/sign an agreement they know nothing about.
> 
> ...


I concede my error. I didn't see her follow-up reply. The husband and his lawyer were stupid for pulling that "day-before" stunt knowing the legal precedents on duress.

That said, the legal precedents on duress are fricking stupid. She has full agency, if she didn't want to sign, she should have refrained and called his bluff and see whether he would cancel the wedding. By signing, now she trapped him into a marriage he didn't want - he wanted a prenup protection, otherwise he wouldn't get married. So either way, she is the victim of duress or he is the victim of being tricked into a marriage.

All that said, the assets we're talking about here are those accumulated within the 4 year span of the marriage. How much wealth did he accumulate in those 4 years?


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## StarFires (Feb 27, 2018)

Lance Mannion said:


> By signing, now she trapped him into a marriage he didn't want - he wanted a prenup protection, otherwise he wouldn't get married. So either way, she is the victim of duress or he is the victim of being tricked into a marriage.


Nope. Nope. Nope. If anything, he tricked himself. And he tricked himself by tricking her into the prenup. Why don't you see that right there is the whole point of duress into signing a prenup is not legally binding. A person does it the way he did - threats and last minute - for the sole purpose of tricking the other person.. It didn't work out the way he planned. He shot himself in the foot. But that was not at all HER doing. She didn't trick him into anything, and it's an awfully skewed way of seeing things to call it HER trickery just because she benefits in the end due to his failed and insanely sorry attempt. That's what lawyers are for. Thank goodness Sarah has a good one.


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## Lance Mannion (Nov 24, 2020)

StarFires said:


> Nope. Nope. Nope. If anything, he tricked himself. And he tricked himself by tricking her into the prenup. Why don't you see that right there is the whole point of duress into signing a prenup is not legally binding. A person does it the way he did - threats and last minute - for the sole purpose of tricking the other person.. It didn't work out the way he planned. He shot himself in the foot. But that was not at all HER doing. She didn't trick him into anything, and it's an awfully skewed way of seeing things to call it HER trickery just because she benefits in the end due to his failed and insanely sorry attempt. That's what lawyers are for. Thank goodness Sarah has a good one.


I'm not disagreeing that he made a legally bad move with that strategy. The clear point is that he wanted to be married under conditions of prenup, not under conditions of state law. Would he have married her if she refused to sign the prenup? I think he would have called it off, but who really knows. She should have called his bluff.


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## StarFires (Feb 27, 2018)

Lance Mannion said:


> I'm not disagreeing that he made a legally bad move with that strategy. The clear point is that he wanted to be married under conditions of prenup, not under conditions of state law. Would he have married her if she refused to sign the prenup? I think he would have called it off, but who really knows. She should have called his bluff.


I didn't address your "called his bluff" comment before because I often can't deal with hypotheticals. I can only work with what the two of them actually did because those are the circumstances.

But yeah, she should have called his bluff. Not called his bluff actually, but called off the wedding and told him to go to hell. It was a low life move on his part. But again, I can't deal with that because it's not what happened.

Just to counter your hypothetical, what if he had presented the prenup in a reasonable time frame and she signed it? Legally binding prenups get signed all the time. That's why I have no sympathy for what kind of marriage he wanted and the position he ended up placing himself in. It was just as easy to do it the right way, rather than attempting to take advantage of her.


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## Lance Mannion (Nov 24, 2020)

StarFires said:


> I didn't address your "called his bluff" comment before because I often can't deal with hypotheticals. I can only work with what the two of them actually did because those are the circumstances.
> 
> But yeah, she should have called his bluff. Not called his bluff actually, but called off the wedding and told him to go to hell. It was a low life move on his part. But again, I can't deal with that because it's not what happened.
> 
> Just to counter your hypothetical, what if he had presented the prenup in a reasonable time frame and she signed it? Legally binding prenups get signed all the time. That's why I have no sympathy for what kind of marriage he wanted and the position he ended up placing himself in. It was just as easy to do it the right way, rather than attempting to take advantage of her.


I invested in my prenup when I was 21 and I married at 27.

As to the OP, the marriage is only 4 years long, so I wonder how much wealth he is trying to exclude.


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## StarFires (Feb 27, 2018)

Lance Mannion said:


> I invested in my prenup when I was 21 and I married at 27.
> 
> As to the OP, the marriage is only 4 years long, so I wonder how much wealth he is trying to exclude.


I don't know but if prior behavior is any predictor, my question would be how much wealth is he trying to hide. I bet her attorney is on it though.

That was really, really wise. I would never have signed one, but I do think prenups are a good idea. That probably sounds contradictory, I don't know, but I understand people wanting to protect their fixed and liquid assets. I don't believe every person can be trusted just because somebody loves them.

LOL I remember a movie (You've Got Mail, I think) where a guy was going into his 5th or 6th (or 7th) marriage and wrote into the prenup that she must give him sex every day. That became a go-or-no go negotiation. It was so funny.


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## StarFires (Feb 27, 2018)

@Lance Mannion, I meant to add that if they live in a community property state, half of that 4 years of accumulation is hers. Plus child support added on. And that would be what he's trying to protect.

I can't say I blame him entirely. Just should have done it honestly.


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## Lance Mannion (Nov 24, 2020)

StarFires said:


> I don't know but if prior behavior is any predictor, my question would be how much wealth is he trying to hide. I bet her attorney is on it though.
> 
> That was really, really wise. I would never have signed one, but I do think prenups are a good idea. That probably sounds contradictory, I don't know, but I understand people wanting to protect their fixed and liquid assets. I don't believe every person can be trusted just because somebody loves them.
> 
> LOL I remember a movie (You've Got Mail, I think) where a guy was going into his 5th or 6th (or 7th) marriage and wrote into the prenup that she must give him sex every day. That became a go-or-no go negotiation. It was so funny.


No man in the West should get married under the corrupted family law regimes in place. So many bad precedents established and now enforced.

Prior wealth is usually excluded, it's about wealth earned during the marriage. The sticky point is that "money earns money" so his wealth earned prior to marriage is going to be earning wealth during the marriage and she didn't do a damn thing to have an iota of influence on the momentum of that process.


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## StarFires (Feb 27, 2018)

Lance Mannion said:


> No man in the West should get married under the corrupted family law regimes in place. So many bad precedents established and now enforced.
> 
> Prior wealth is usually excluded, it's about wealth earned during the marriage. The sticky point is that "money earns money" so his wealth earned prior to marriage is going to be earning wealth during the marriage and she didn't do a damn thing to have an iota of influence on the momentum of that process.


One good thing about the law though is that it's no respecter of persons (not in this regard, that is). There are many spouses who did influence the process and contributed to the growth of wealth. And, there are those who gave up their own life's ambitions to support their spouse's ambitions. That's why the laws were written the way they are. No one gets shorted unfairly even though someone benefits unfairly. All are subject to the points of law and all benefit in the same manner.

The way you feel about it is the reason prenups originated. Everyone has a way to protect themselves if they want to.


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## Lance Mannion (Nov 24, 2020)

StarFires said:


> One good thing about the law though is that it's no respecter of persons (not in this regard, that is). There are many spouses who did influence the process and contributed to the growth of wealth. And, there are those who gave up their own life's ambitions to support their spouse's ambitions. That's why the laws were written the way they are. No one gets shorted unfairly even though someone benefits unfairly. All are subject to the points of law and all benefit in the same manner.
> 
> The way you feel about it is the reason prenups originated. Everyone has a way to protect themselves if they want to.


If you have, say $10 million, being managed for you by wealth advisors or stuck in a mutual fund, what, exactly, is your spouse contributing to the process of building that wealth? Heck, even you're not contributing anything to the active management of that money, you're paying someone to manage it for you. If your portfolio is growing 10% per annum, that's a million dollars, under community property law, the spouse is entitled to $500,000 per year derived from the wealth you earned before you were married.

Not seeing any rationale which has made sense thus far. 

Giving up one's life ambitions in order to support a spouse's ambitions. Sure, if you give up a career in City X or Country B in order to move elsewhere and you cannot now engage in your career but your spouse's career is advanced, this needs to be addressed equitably. But staying at home to raise children is not about giving up life's ambitions, it's about adopting a new ambition and the stay at home parent is benefiting in a way that the working parent cannot - they have more bonding time with the kids, they get emotional rewards from being there to witness all manner of firsts for the kids, etc.


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## StarFires (Feb 27, 2018)

Lance Mannion said:


> If you have, say $10 million, being managed for you by wealth advisors or stuck in a mutual fund, what, exactly, is your spouse contributing to the process of building that wealth? Heck, even you're not contributing anything to the active management of that money, you're paying someone to manage it for you. If your portfolio is growing 10% per annum, that's a million dollars, under community property law, the spouse is entitled to $500,000 per year derived from the wealth you earned before you were married.
> 
> Not seeing any rationale which has made sense thus far.
> 
> Giving up one's life ambitions in order to support a spouse's ambitions. Sure, if you give up a career in City X or Country B in order to move elsewhere and you cannot now engage in your career but your spouse's career is advanced, this needs to be addressed equitably. But staying at home to raise children is not about giving up life's ambitions, it's about adopting a new ambition and the stay at home parent is benefiting in a way that the working parent cannot - they have more bonding time with the kids, they get emotional rewards from being there to witness all manner of firsts for the kids, etc.


So again, thank goodness for divorce laws being the way they are. Your point of view is respecter of persons, few of whom (or at least one segment) you have any respect for or their contribution. No matter really because the law is what it is. And again, thank goodness.

And you obviously disagree with me saying being a SAHP is much harder than working away from home.

Nevertheless, I won't be discussing anymore as it's gotten way off topic and generally uncomfortable.


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## hamadryad (Aug 30, 2020)

StarFires said:


> Nope. Nope. Nope. If anything, he tricked himself. And he tricked himself by tricking her into the prenup. Why don't you see that right there is the whole point of duress into signing a prenup is not legally binding. A person does it the way he did - threats and last minute - for the sole purpose of tricking the other person.. It didn't work out the way he planned. He shot himself in the foot. But that was not at all HER doing. She didn't trick him into anything, and it's an awfully skewed way of seeing things to call it HER trickery just because she benefits in the end due to his failed and insanely sorry attempt. That's what lawyers are for. Thank goodness Sarah has a good one.


Was there a gun involved or could she have simply just not signed it??

All we are hearing is her story and not his(just like pretty much any topic on this board)....And of course lawyers tell clients what they want to hear, then tell them when it doesn't work out..."oh well..I did my best for you"...I have little sympathy for people in these cases....If you don't want to do it(marry someone under those conditions), then just don't....You can't sign something and cry foul when it doesn't work out...Its the same BS people whine about when the car they bought and knew they couldn't afford gets taken away on the repo guys hook...

Anyway...I know quite a few very wealthy men and have heard all of the stories....For one, NONE of them didn't provide very well for their children, and many wound up providing quite well for the women they divorced(even with pre nups) ...I never saw any "tricks" other than the one instance where the woman was a lesbian and tricked the guy(a close personal friend of mine) so she can have a lavish lifestyle, some kids, and her girl toy...

Many high earning men(and some women) need to protect their assets from gold diggers or even people that aren't but that's what they want to do before entering into a contract that has a significantly better than 50% chance of failure...People that are good earners are usually smart, not stupid or naive..


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## StarFires (Feb 27, 2018)

hamadryad said:


> Was there a gun involved or could she have simply just not signed it??
> .....
> I have little sympathy for people in these cases....If you don't want to do it(marry someone under those conditions), then just don't....You can't sign something and cry foul when it doesn't work out...Its the same BS people whine about when the


At a time like that - THE DAY before the wedding - lots of people, women especially, don't have the presence of mind to make that kind of rational reversal of their decision, and that is the reason for the duress laws. You rejected that in the two attorney's explanations that I offered, the second of which specifically quoted the law as it is written in the State of Florida. There are similarly-written laws around the country. What matters is how it is written in her state. It's interesting that he does some calculated and filthy underhanded crap to his intended, yet you bash her for having a moment of confounded sense of judgment, and then you proceed to extol the goodness of other men you know, while pointing out one dirty female. So, it's a good thing the duress laws regarding prenups are not based on your passionately-biased lack of sympathy. They take the obvious into consideration instead.



hamadryad said:


> All we are hearing is her story and not his(just like pretty much any topic on this board)


Yep, that's all boards like this ever get 99.9 percent of the time, yet we all respond with our opinions, experiences, and biases, so it doesn't matter that the same occurred in this instance too. But his side of the story wouldn't change the facts anyway - it was the day before the wedding, and he threatened her. The best he could do is disclaim his true intentions to say that pressuring her wasn't his objective. Even if he lied and said he didn't threaten her, it being the day before the wedding that he presented it to her for signing satisfies the law in many states that constitutes nature of duress.


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## hamadryad (Aug 30, 2020)

StarFires said:


> At a time like that - THE DAY before the wedding - lots of people,* women especially,* don't have the presence of mind to make that kind of rational reversal of their decision, and that is the reason for the duress laws. Y


Was he rescuing her from eating cockroaches off the street in some Third World country where he found her with his thoughtful proposal, or it just "buyers remorse" on her part because he wants out? Were you there to witness the arm twisting or do we just accept that adult people(women especially, as you say) are too naive to capably understand that if you cant understand the meaning of a legal document, then you either consult with someone who can, or get an attorney to review it before signing...These are supposed to be the times when women are empowered, right?, you've proceeded to set them back at least 75 years with that comment...

Thank God the women I know wouldn't ever fall for that crap..if it is in fact crap, (you nor i really know) and not just bitterness at what now simply looks like a poor decision on her part if she wanted to rope some rich guy in to take care of her for eternity....

We all have to live with poor decisions and sometimes it costs us financially or otherwise...She was smart enough to consult with a lawyer now, but wasn't when she signed a legal document then...pfft..

Even saying all of this, I bet anything that what he is offering and what the kids will receive is probably very fair...I don't know this for sure, but just a hunch, based on what I have seen in the past...


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## StarFires (Feb 27, 2018)

hamadryad said:


> Was he rescuing her from eating cockroaches off the street in some Third World country where he found her with his thoughtful proposal, or it just "buyers remorse" on her part because he wants out? Were you there to witness the arm twisting or do we just accept that adult people(women especially, as you say) are too naive to capably understand that if you cant understand the meaning of a legal document, then you either consult with someone who can, or get an attorney to review it before signing...These are supposed to be the times when women are empowered, right?, you've proceeded to set them back at least 75 years with that comment...
> 
> Thank God the women I know wouldn't ever fall for that crap..if it is in fact crap, (you nor i really know) and not just bitterness at what now simply looks like a poor decision on her part if she wanted to rope some rich guy in to take care of her for eternity....
> 
> ...


You posted your opinion and I responded to that. Your opinion isn't going to change and neither will mine. So I'm not reading this one because I'm not interested in going back and forth about the same silliness.


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## hamadryad (Aug 30, 2020)

StarFires said:


> You posted your opinion and I responded to that. Your opinion isn't going to change and neither will mine. So I'm not reading this one because I'm not interested in going back and forth about the same silliness.



Sure...;.no problem...

Just like we believe that after all the parties, all the prep, all the reservations, etc...after never discussing this tenuous topic, he took a pre nup out of his jacket pocket at 11pm the night before the wedding, with a "sign or else!!" in highlighter on the envelope.... yep.....sure....that's exactly how it went down..

Nope...more believable is that it was brought up numerous times and was rug swept and back burnered....then perhaps she figured she ran out of time and excuses and it wasn't going to magically disappear, then she signed it...so that she's calling that "duress"

I have no way to really know, but have a far better chance at believing the second scenario...


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

OK, folks, let's keep it on topic and calm, please? Thank you.


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## Lance Mannion (Nov 24, 2020)

hamadryad said:


> Sure...;.no problem...
> 
> Just like we believe that after all the parties, all the prep, all the reservations, etc...after never discussing this tenuous topic, he took a pre nup out of his jacket pocket at 11pm the night before the wedding, with a "sign or else!!" in highlighter on the envelope.... yep.....sure....that's exactly how it went down..
> 
> ...


There's a story, video, of an NBA? player who kept pestering his fiancee to sign the prenup, she kept putting it off for months. Seems she talked to her mother and girlfriend and lawyer and they counseled against it. He insisted the night before the wedding and she now, for the first time, flatly refused. He cancelled the wedding the next morning, then went partying with the wedding guests and ended up banging the bridesmaid.


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