# I know 2 wrongs don't make a right but



## lovemylife26 (Mar 21, 2012)

some days I want to do something so stuipd just for a minute. I know I would never but still it crosses my mind from time to time.
And with him keeping the serect it makes the last year more harder.
I know I can't be the only one to think this. And if I'm shame on me.


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## totamm (May 1, 2012)

I'd like to say I feel the same but I can't recall ever wantiing to do something stupid, not even for a second. 

Reckless and adventerous? Maybe.

Immoral and illegal? Absolutely.

Vindictive and spiteful? Sure,the thoughts were there.

But never stupid. That's just not productive.


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## lovemylife26 (Mar 21, 2012)

totamm said:


> I'd like to say I feel the same but I can't recall ever wantiing to do something stupid, not even for a second.
> 
> Reckless and adventerous? Maybe.
> 
> ...



ok point taken stupid was not the right word I guess. 
Some of your ideas are more like it.


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## GROUNDPOUNDER (Mar 8, 2013)

lovemylife26 said:


> some days I want to do something so stuipd just for a minute. I know I would never but still it crosses my mind from time to time.
> And with him keeping the serect it makes the last year more harder.
> I know I can't be the only one to think this. And if I'm shame on me.


lml, are you talking about a RA?


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

lovemylife26 said:


> some days I want to do something so stuipd just for a minute. I know I would never but still it crosses my mind from time to time.
> And with him keeping the serect it makes the last year more harder.
> I know I can't be the only one to think this. And if I'm shame on me.


Oh, I might know where you are coming from. I not only thought about doing something stupid. I actually did something stupid, too.

All power to you for not actually doing something stupid.:smthumbup:


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## lovemylife26 (Mar 21, 2012)

sadly I haven't yet but man it's very temping I'm not going to lie. 
And it sucks when you ask questions and makes your self estem go down so low, because he never said or called me that in the 15 years we have been together.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

lovemylife26 said:


> sadly I haven't yet but man it's very temping I'm not going to lie.
> And it sucks when you ask questions and makes your self estem go down so low, because he never said or called me that in the 15 years we have been together.


Want to talk about it? We are here for you, if you do.:smthumbup:


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## SaltInWound (Jan 2, 2013)

lovemylife26 said:


> sadly I haven't yet but man it's very temping I'm not going to lie.
> And it sucks when you ask questions and makes your self estem go down so low, because he never said or called me that in the 15 years we have been together.


He has resorted to name calling?


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## lovemylife26 (Mar 21, 2012)

SaltInWound said:


> He has resorted to name calling?



I found out more names he called her (sweet loving names)
I never got nothing but my name. 
But now he does and it makes me cringe and makes like he is proving a point...hope that makes sense.


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## lovemylife26 (Mar 21, 2012)

MattMatt said:


> Want to talk about it? We are here for you, if you do.:smthumbup:


Thanks. It sucks.
I never thought I would think of doing something like that. But temperation always comes knocking when you want them to hurt. ( i haven't done anything)
Do I just keep this to myself the thoughts and feelings.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

lovemylife26 said:


> Thanks. It sucks.
> I never thought I would think of doing something like that. But temperation always comes knocking when you want them to hurt. ( i haven't done anything)
> Do I just keep this to myself the thoughts and feelings.


My wife cheated on me. Well, in fairness to her, she told me she would have an affair, but would come back to me, and she did.

We rugswept. I began self-medicating with alcohol and eventually fell into a stupid revenge affair. Which made me feel worse than my wife's affair did.


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## SaltInWound (Jan 2, 2013)

lovemylife26 said:


> I found out more names he called her (sweet loving names)
> I never got nothing but my name.
> But now he does and it makes me cringe and makes like he is proving a point...hope that makes sense.


I think I understand. He never gave you a pet name, until recently, and since you found out he was using pet names with "her", it makes you feel second class. Sort of like having sex with your husband and suddenly he uses a new position and you question why and then later you find out he has been having an affair and suddenly your stomach and heart sinks, because you realize it wasn't something he researched or created specially for you......it was done out of habit, spilled over from the other relationship and you also realize the extra effort he gave to the other person that he never gave to you all those years.....not even when your relationship was new. Sorry you are dealing with this. There always seems to be something new that makes us feel worse.


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## JustSomeGuyWho (Dec 16, 2012)

SaltInWound said:


> I think I understand. He never gave you a pet name, until recently, and since you found out he was using pet names with "her", it makes you feel second class. * Sort of like having sex with your husband and suddenly he uses a new position* and you question why and then later you find out he has been having an affair and suddenly your stomach and heart sinks, because you realize it wasn't something he researched or created specially for you......it was done out of habit, spilled over from the other relationship and you also realize the extra effort he gave to the other person that he never gave to you all those years.....not even when your relationship was new. Sorry you are dealing with this. There always seems to be something new that makes us feel worse.


This is how I "discovered" my wife had sex with someone else during a 13 month separation. Towards the end of the separation, she wanted to have sex with me ... highly unusual .. and she really wanted to get her freak on, doing things she had never done before or since we were dating ... extremely unusual. It was hot but the red flags were flying. She has never given me a reason not to trust her ... when we're under the same roof, lol. 

I had already suspected something since I would stop by and unexpectedly find my daughters with a babysitter. I would text her and ask why she yet again left the kids with a babysitter instead of asking me to take them (I wanted every opportunity to be with my kids) ... and then she would refuse to tell me who she was out with ... when she had always been an open book our entire marriage.

We don't talk about it


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## Acabado (May 13, 2012)

> I know 2 wrongs don't make a right *but*


Evil, evil word.


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## SadandAngry (Aug 24, 2012)

lovemylife26 said:


> I found out more names he called her (sweet loving names)
> I never got nothing but my name.
> But now he does and it makes me cringe and makes like he is proving a point...hope that makes sense.


Maybe you'll feel better for this. Pet names actually suck! They de-individualise the person they are given to. Anybody could be sweetie, or honey buns, or what ever idiotic thing, but you are your name, you are special, you are individual, so next time he gives you one of those names again, stop him dead in his tracks, and make sure he knows to never, ever call you one again. Esp. if he used them during his affair!


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## still.hurting (Dec 10, 2012)

lovemylife26 said:


> I found out more names he called her (sweet loving names)
> I never got nothing but my name.
> But now he does and it makes me cringe and makes like he is proving a point...hope that makes sense.


Yep, I know that feeling all too well...

For me, I not only got called 'special' names, I also never got sweet beautiful poems or the heartful msg's he texted her, longing to speak to her, touch her and comfort her, etc... And one thing that bothers me most is, he would say encouraging things to her to lift her spirits, nearly the same words that I would say to him... And felt gutted reading sex msg's, him describing what he wanted to do to her, after we had done and said and roll played the exact thing the night before.....! Just SICK!

I have so many 'triggers', I couldn't go to my favorite beach for over a year after finding out that he had a ONS there 7 years ago (which I only found put about through his text msg through another affair in 2011) and, couldnt go there as he text her a fantasy about him marring her at 'his' favorite beach and sneaking off with her after the ceremony to make love to her there.... GRRRR, he just killed MY favorite place in the whole world to go!
We still can't go to that beach!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## still.hurting (Dec 10, 2012)

Oh, AND YES, I too have thoughts of a RA... nearly did it too, but guit came over me!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Racer (Sep 24, 2009)

RA’s... very common thought. I’ve done sort of hybrid of walking along the cliff edge. Long because I’m sort of doing this. It isn’t right and I know it. But I do think it helps my marriage, particularly in the earlier phases of R.

Two things; I go out with a group of friends that includes females... my wife is not invited and knows it. One of my support people is a young attractive woman... we know each other’s dirt and talk about very personal things.

My wife hates both these things. However, she has no control or say about it. Basically, I make her learn how to cope with herself ramming home the concept that you really do not have any more control in a marriage than your spouse allows you to have; Control is given when you respect and care enough about your spouse that you don’t want to hurt them. 

This sort of thing I’m doing she did a lot in the past; And a hell of a lot worse. I was opposed to it. She does try and throw my words back at me. I simply tell her I’ve adopted her terms on what is and is not ok in a marriage.... I can empathize ‘why’ and now I need that too.

So she has to deal with the ideas that we are two individuals. That is what she created. I flip the tables; Back when she was doing this, what did she believe I should be doing so she didn’t need that outside life? Then follow up with “Why aren’t you doing that now, and instead are making the choices I did by forbidding it? Did that work?” I reinforce that I learned from her and I do actually have boundaries in place; however, my emotional state and my feelings of security and sharing in OUR relationship isn’t there (she is defensive and watches out for herself versus me). I need to talk, to be heard, and outside perspectives... Sorry TAM... Forums just don’t cut it for really deep stuff. I do have boundaries and am careful.... but it is playing with fire. I’ve also warned her that I do know when I started trying to forbid her, that’s when she started hiding to avoid the confrontation. This is particularly why I’m not hiding it and seem willing to fight. Better to fight than hide since the fight does help me reinforce the boundaries I have instead of learning I can get away with it.

She should also learn from me. Do what it takes to up her value and drop expectations of how marriage should be... Those are expectations for a healthy marriage, ours is not and she knows why. Start accepting we’re damaged, and start working on fixing her end. If she is successful, I’ll go back to respecting her enough that I wouldn’t want to escape her or talk to someone else about my problems. I want to do all this with her and feel reasonably secure my wife actually does have my best interest at heart versus just her own selfish ones and self-protection. She needs to work on the perception I have of who she is and where she stands. 

And btw; she has been working on her end. I talk less and less with the support person about my issues, and actually miss my wife when out without her. I want her there with me now and have started painting the picture of my marriage as close to reconciled with these folks and the hard road it’s taken to get here. That where we are nearly 4 years post DD.


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## highwood (Jan 12, 2012)

I was just thinking this morning that I wish that H could feel what I feel...the paranoia/the need to check everything. It pisses me off that because morally I have no desire to sneak around behind somebodys back and he knows it as I have told him that I believe that you end one relationship before beginning another..

I so badly want him to wonder what I am up to, I wish he had the need to check on what phone calls I am making, etc. I have said in anger to him that I hope one day if it is not me that he experiences what it feels like to be cheated on.


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## highwood (Jan 12, 2012)

I should add as well that when he knows I am checking up on things that I feel angry with myself as I feel that I am giving up some of my personal power away to him. I often think that when someone knows that you are scared that they are going to do something to you that it kind of gives them the upper hand...


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## Lovemytruck (Jul 3, 2012)

This stuff is what makes it hard for R to work in the long run. I remember those feelings of revenge. It is hard to shake. I thought about the RA too, but as many of you, I just could not do that sort of thing.

I read these posts and I felt that same need to "educate" my exWW about the pain, the fear, and the over-whelming sense that I was not important during her affair. It was truly devestating to know that I was not good enough.

After another d-day 5 months after a previous d-day, I decided that I would "window shop". It was like Racer's version of walking near the edge of the cliff. I was so mad one night that joined an Internet dating site to see what was out there.

Oh my! Lol! After 23 years of being a faithful husband, it was a rush to see what was available within a short radius of my home. 

I also did lots of reading about dating, attraction, and used those skills to flirt. It was fun. It helped repair some of the damaged ego that I had suffered.

I ended up divorcing. My point is this; R is probably more challenging emotionally than quitting a marriage after betrayal.

My "educating" my exWW about those things I mentioned certainly happened. She didn't get to experience the deceit and lying, but she definately felt some hurt from her actions. 

I say this with a just shy of a 2 year perspective. The revenge factor for me has gone, and I do want her to find happiness again. My heart tells me that hurting her back probably did serve some benefit to her. It helped me then, but I am at a place now where it is over. I am now respectful of her, even though we are divorced. The other thing is regret. I don't know if I feel any for what I did.

Hope this helps a little. My life is now back on track in a wonderful new marriage! I would dare say that I am a better person because of the suffering. It does suck having to go through it. 

Strong emotions such as anger, hurt, regret, guilt, revenge all play a big role in dealing with betrayal. Learn from them. They will teach you who you are, and will shape what you will become.


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## Racer (Sep 24, 2009)

Lovemytruck said:


> After another d-day 5 months after a previous d-day, I decided that I would "window shop". It was like Racer's version of walking near the edge of the cliff. I was so mad one night that joined an Internet dating site to see what was out there..


At first, I started off like that. The simpler, less risky detached anonymous websites versus face2face. AM/POF/Match... I let her discover these accounts; they spy on you too. The excuse in my head was looking for her and the OM’s (which I found).... but also noted the quantity and quality of women out there which at least helped the fantasy that I wouldn’t be alone for long and relieve some of that fear of starting over. Not real profiles and blew off any attempts at contact, but still... just knowing as well as knowing those butterflies at finding your spouse on those types of sites..

The next step that really torqued her off. Along with the regular self-help and infidelity books, I got “The Game” (a pick-up artist book). And I started the ‘missions’; Self-confidence boosters. I started the gym, bought a new wardrobe, new haircut, cologne, new grooming, etc. I started initiating conversations with other women like waitresses even when with my wife. These other women responded... So this also helped break my wife of the idea that I “was lucky she would put up with me because no other woman would even like me”. She’d even taunt me like “if you want her so bad, then maybe I should leave..” and I was fine with that. I made it clear that if she wouldn’t have me, other’s would gladly take her place; And it wasn’t just words... smiles, chit-chat, comments about my looks were made in front of my wife by younger, hotter women (I just ignore it was probably for a bigger tip). 

I think that is when she started to grasp a new perception. I tolerated her. She wasn’t up on a pedestal anymore and hadn’t really considered or seriously thought about me actually rejecting her as ‘nothing special’. That’s not how it’s supposed to be in their book. So caught up in the thrill of dating others that they just assume they are a prize to be won. Turn the table. I am the prize and she significantly devalued her worth in my head to that of a common barfly.

Hint about waywards: Any attention you get they WILL see as a pass or attempt to seduce you. And because my wife thinks I am oblivious to ‘the game’ and naive, I just don’t see it...  I just know my wife has every reason to be paranoid and see conspiracies.... She knows, as well as me, I have ever reason in the world to have an affair without feeling any remorse or compassion for her. The trick: A foggy unremorseful wayward doesn’t understand it is a choice.... no self respecting unremorseful wayward takes full responsibility, therefore they were seduced and this other person was responsible. I used it against her.​
It’s walking the cliff.... You are on a wayward path, but just keep veering at the edge so you don’t fall. My WW got to experience just a taste of that BS panic and dread and finding out there isn’t a thing you can do to stop them.... powerlessness, paranoia, fears are realized. Then comes the desperation (assuming they still care).

And again... I’m talking these events were early in our process when I was still dealing with heavy fog, a wife who wanted the marriage (on her unacceptable cake-eating terms) and I had nothing left to lose. I was prepared to divorce and took a massive risk. I was also strong enough and thick skinned enough to absorb massive amounts of anger and venom that comes along with this..... Do not think they’ll get sweet on you


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## Lovemytruck (Jul 3, 2012)

Racer,

You just wrote my story. Lol! I did walk the cliff. I eventually decided that the "lucky me" for getting her back could do better.

It was venom once I moved out and let her know I was dating again. Divorce could not happen soon enough, even though she fished a few times to get me back.

Now that the dust has settled, it is good again.

*Lovemylife26* - sorry you are in this spot! I would bet that your revenge and anger feelings will linger for some time. Eventually they will be replaced by renewed love, or apathy. If you feel your confidence is damaged, focus on that instead of just getting even with a RA.

It is difficult to deny those strong feelings. Identify them, and try to realize that they likely will fade over time. Do what is BEST for YOU, and don't react in a harmful way (to yourself).

My goal was to be happily married. I found out that my wife had to be changed in order to meet my goal. 

Have a great day!


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