# Being Argumentative Versus Having Different Opinions



## anne1208 (Nov 16, 2015)

I should preface all this by saying that my husband and I suffered a miscarriage three weeks ago, it's not to say that these problems weren't prevalent before, but the past couple of weeks they are way worse.

I will also preface this with I dont know for sure but I think he has ADHD....

Anyway, so my husband has a serious anger issue. I always say that he manifests his emotions as anger bc he only has two emotions - totally happy go lucky or totally agitated/mad/raging. NOTHING in between. Even with the miscarriage he noted that he watches me go through many types of emotions over it - frustrated, worried, sad, etc., and he said he only feels angry.

So anyway, lately hes been flying off the handle and accusing me of being "argumentative" and "challenging" him all the time. 

Thursday he needed me to go pick him up at home (he works from home) and have me take him to the garage to pick up his Jeep that was getting repairs. It took the garage a week to get the part, no big deal bc my husband has a company vehicle to use, too. Anyway, the shop closes at 7, and so he says "i need you to leave work at 4" and i go "i can leave at 5 to come get you". He FLEW OFF THE HANDLE about that. No reason to. Long story short, I left work at 5 Thursday, picked up him, dropped him off at the garage, and that was fine. But the entire morning was him accusing me of just saying 5 to counter him. He even pointed out "well you can choose to go in late but you cant LEAVE early?" when the reason I was late for work Thursday morning was because I was in the bathroom with stomach issues. He wouldn't hear of it!! He just was convinced i was insisting 5 versus 4 to be passive aggressive and argumentative. I kept saying after the miscarriage i've been struggling to focus at work, and have been my most productive in the afternoons, even pointing out that i stayed until 6, 7 every evening bc i was dragging in the mornings and on a roll in the evenings, so yeah, im gonna stay until 5 and we can still get your jeep.

Fast forward to sunday, we are looking at houses together...we would be able to get preapproved earliest like, Feb 1, but just going to some open houses to get a feel for what we like. At one point on the drive back home he says he likes the So-and-so subdivision the best, and the two houses for sale there, and i just said "i know me too, thats the smallest subdivision so i hope there is still a house or two for sale there by the time were pre-approved." He FLEW OFF THE HANDLE again, insisting that i "have to be so negative" all the time, and challenge everything he says, why do i have to point out the obvious that those houses may not still be available...

He then is like "ALL YOUVE DONE ALL DAY IS ARGUE WITH ME ABOUT THESE HOUSES". and i left for two hours and was trying to think of what else we disagreed on. All i could remember was one house had a hall bath that was white tile and dark cabinets and he said it was bland, and i was like "Ohh no! i like it. very simple and neutral, good for a hall bath." So when i got home, and he goes back into insisting that "all i did all day was argue with/challenge him" i asked for specifics....and the only one he could recall was the one i could recall we: the hall bath. I tried to explain that just bc we have differing opinions, i am not "arguing" with him or "challenging" him, and he can feel its bland, thats fair! but i liked it, and he shouldnt take it personally if i think a dang bathroom is fine when he doesnt. 

Then this morning he looks up our car insurance. Last month my Explorer needed a new transmission so we sold it and my brother gave me his 2002 Altima he didnt want or need anymore - we thought we were havign a baby and also planned to buy a house so we wanted a cheap car to hold us over past all those expenses. So Friday i needed to meet my brother at the BMV to transfer title and stuff so i needed to add it to our insurance. The woman said it would be an extra $40 a month Nov, Dec, Jan, then it plus Jeep would restart in Feb for a 6 month premium of $618. I just said okay and that was it. I was going to pay the nov bill today.

Well my husband this morning, again in a perfectly happy mood as he always is right before he explodes into anger, looks up progressive and sees the altima on there and asks me about the $40. I explain im paying that per month until Feb then we can split the 6 mo premium in Feb. Well, he thinks $40/mo extra for that car in addition to our jeep is too much. I told him i think it's fine, and ill just pay it until Feb. He is like "you need to call them" and i ask him why, what does he want me to accomplish by calling? he tells me he thinks its too much and why cant they charge a cheaper 3 month until everything restarts in feb? I tell him i dont know, but if he thinks it should be cheaper, HOW much cheaper, and if they say no, then what would I say? And i say "I am fine payin $40/mo for 3 months, but if you have specific expectations on what it should be, you should call them instead oe me" He is SO ANGRY through all of this and i ask why he is angry AGAIN....and hes like "yorue arguing with me AGAIN" and i am like, no i am totally fine with the insurance price. You arent. And thats fine, but if you arent okay with what i will be paying the next three months, you should call them, but i am fnie with it."

He then is like no YOU need to call...and i again explain i am fine with it, i think its reasonable and ill pay it. Hes insisting im arguing again, when all im doing is standing by my opinion that its fine, respecting that he thinks it isnt, and refusing to call to exact whatever goal he wants, when he could do so more effetcively.

I also was like, i pay all our bills, track our mortgage qualification stuff (savings, credit scores, etc), have had to be on the phone with the docs office seemingly every day re: some blood tests or insurance issues related to miscarriage stuff, had to call the funeral home to arrange cremation, etc. Im like, "i do all our general bills and household stuff plus the extra stuff lately and am struggling to keep up with work too, im sorry but im not inclined to add the insurance phone call back onto my list when im fine with it."

So thats it, thats JUST THE PAST WEEK....its like he cant handle the fact that i am not just 100% agreeing with him and going along with his every whim ALL THE TIME, that being my own person with my own positions and opinions, who also never tries to persuade him or insist that he adopt my opinions, telling me how difficult and argumentative and combative i am. 

I really don't know what his problem is. I feel like he used to do this a little on occasion, but this past week or two it's been absolutely awful. I am feeling depressed and trapped bc he is acting like a crazy person.


----------



## tech-novelist (May 15, 2014)

Do you have children?


----------



## anne1208 (Nov 16, 2015)

No kids


----------



## Nucking Futs (Apr 8, 2013)

anne1208 said:


> No kids


Is this the man you want raising your kids? Is this the kind of behavior you want your children to learn?


----------



## anne1208 (Nov 16, 2015)

I came to this forum to get some insight into his behavior, not just a "don't have kids with this man" response. It isn't insightful.

Also, like i said, it's not like he's never gotten mad before, but lately it's become a problem after the miscarriage, is like, everyday. Its relentless. I've been with him for six years and I cant figure out why suddenly he's acting like I am "arguing" with him all the time when I am not, and his anger is so persistent and over the top.


----------



## MenMarsWomenVenus (Nov 16, 2015)

anne1208 said:


> I came to this forum to get some insight into his behavior, not just a "don't have kids with this man" response. It isn't insightful.
> 
> Also, like i said, it's not like he's never gotten mad before, but lately it's become a problem after the miscarriage, is like, everyday. Its relentless. I've been with him for six years and I cant figure out why suddenly he's acting like I am "arguing" with him all the time when I am not, and his anger is so persistent and over the top.


My wife is exactly the same, she has huge anger problems, and the very smallest thing can turn from a comment to a blazing row. I don't know how to fix things either, I do my best to keep my tempter as when someone is attacking you it's almost impossible not to blow up, but I try and show her calmly that her behaviour isn't acceptable.

That said, she says sorry until the next time it happens, and things never change unfortunately. She will not take responsibility for it, she says no one is perfect and that's it really. Don't really get why she is so angry with me though as I am the one who has stood by her all her life.


----------



## Nucking Futs (Apr 8, 2013)

Don't buy a house or have kids with him until you get to this straightened out. He needs counseling but you can expect a fight to get him into it. Good luck to you.


----------



## anne1208 (Nov 16, 2015)

That's what is frustrating...everything he's gotten mad about, the next day he is apologizing and saying he acted like a jerk and was overreacting. It used to be he'd act that way once every few weeks, totally apologize if not beat himself up over it the next day, and things would be fine for a few weeks until it happened again.

Now after the miscarriage it's relentless. We were fine for one week after it, then weeks 2 and 3 he's an angry mess - like, totally happy or flipping out over nothing out of nowhere. He literally apologized like crazy on Friday and Saturday about Thursday, then blew up sunday again, then apologized later on sunday and this morning, and then blew up again this morning!! 

It's painful to watch the guy get so regretful and mad at himself about acting like a fool, and its a huge waste of our time for him to get SO PISSED over nothing.


----------



## MenMarsWomenVenus (Nov 16, 2015)

anne1208 said:


> That's what is frustrating...everything he's gotten mad about, the next day he is apologizing and saying he acted like a jerk and was overreacting. It used to be he'd act that way once every few weeks, totally apologize if not beat himself up over it the next day, and things would be fine for a few weeks until it happened again.
> 
> Now after the miscarriage it's relentless. We were fine for one week after it, then weeks 2 and 3 he's an angry mess - like, totally happy or flipping out over nothing out of nowhere. He literally apologized like crazy on Friday and Saturday about Thursday, then blew up sunday again, then apologized later on sunday and this morning, and then blew up again this morning!!
> 
> It's painful to watch the guy get so regretful and mad at himself about acting like a fool, and its a huge waste of our time for him to get SO PISSED over nothing.


I think this is how they deal with emotions. I try and get my wife to "talk" about why she is so angry, but that is near on impossible, I get no where. I think a lot of it is based around fear, fear of coming to term with the fact you have issues. I have told my wife I have dealt with my issues and I have for years, taken them head on and not buried my head under the sand, however when it comes to anger I think it's easier for these people to pretend it's ok because they don't know how to deal with it properly.


----------



## tech-novelist (May 15, 2014)

This sounds like BPD to me. Look it up, see if he fits it, and then decide if you want to remain with someone like that.
I know I wouldn't.


----------



## anne1208 (Nov 16, 2015)

@technovelist

Thanks. That is interesting bc I found out about BPD lately when a girlfriend of mine was showing weird patterns of behavior regarding first her in-laws and then a friend of hers, where its like, she was so sweet and nice but then when she percieved either in laws or this other friend doing something that ever-so-slightly offended her and she was so angry and hateful and just wanted to cut them all off. Then in September she did the same thing to our mutual friend, over NOTHING - this one thing made her mad and she cut off our friend after years of friendship. I started to wonder about her and after some research came to BPD...like, everythign is totally rosy or THAT PERSON IS AWFUL AND WRONG and they need to cut them off, with nothing in between.

So after thinking about her behavior for awhile, and wondering if shes BPD, i was almost inclined last night to compare the way my husband had been acting to my friend's behavior - both had the same hallmarks of everythings SUPER GREAT and im so perfect and wonderful or ive totally wronged him and he cant stand to even look at me. Its totally ridiculous. Maybe he is this way somewhat and the recent stressors has brought it out really badly, i dont know.


----------



## MenMarsWomenVenus (Nov 16, 2015)

technovelist said:


> This sounds like BPD to me. Look it up, see if he fits it, and then decide if you want to remain with someone like that.
> I know I wouldn't.


Why does everyone label people as BPD on this forum, that's a little extreme. This guy isn't having problems functioning he's just got serious anger issues


----------



## MenMarsWomenVenus (Nov 16, 2015)

anne1208 said:


> @technovelist
> 
> Thanks. That is interesting bc I found out about BPD lately when a girlfriend of mine was showing weird patterns of behavior regarding first her in-laws and then a friend of hers, where its like, she was so sweet and nice but then when she percieved either in laws or this other friend doing something that ever-so-slightly offended her and she was so angry and hateful and just wanted to cut them all off. Then in September she did the same thing to our mutual friend, over NOTHING - this one thing made her mad and she cut off our friend after years of friendship. I started to wonder about her and after some research came to BPD...like, everythign is totally rosy or THAT PERSON IS AWFUL AND WRONG and they need to cut them off, with nothing in between.
> 
> So after thinking about her behavior for awhile, and wondering if shes BPD, i was almost inclined last night to compare the way my husband had been acting to my friend's behavior - both had the same hallmarks of everythings SUPER GREAT and im so perfect and wonderful or ive totally wronged him and he cant stand to even look at me. Its totally ridiculous. Maybe he is this way somewhat and the recent stressors has brought it out really badly, i dont know.


She probably just wants to get away from a toxic relationship, that's common sense, not BPD lol!


----------



## tech-novelist (May 15, 2014)

MenMarsWomenVenus said:


> Why does everyone label people as BPD on this forum, that's a little extreme. This guy isn't having problems functioning he's just got serious anger issues


From the OP:
"I always say that he manifests his emotions as anger bc he only has two emotions - totally happy go lucky or totally agitated/mad/raging. NOTHING in between."

That certainly sounds like BPD (black/white splitting) to me. Where am I going wrong?

Also, I don't label everyone as BPD. I may have done that five times in the last year, after reading hundreds of threads.


----------



## VermisciousKnid (Dec 27, 2011)

MenMarsWomenVenus said:


> Why does everyone label people as BPD on this forum, that's a little extreme. This guy isn't having problems functioning he's just got serious anger issues


That's like saying: "Why are you calling this guy an alcoholic, he just has a serious drinking problem." 

Denial prevents you from treating the problem.


----------



## anne1208 (Nov 16, 2015)

I am skeptical of the BPD label as well. Im pretty open minded about modern day psychology but i tend toward thinking BPD shouldnt be a "diagnosis", it seems like more of a description of a personality type. In other words, once youve gotten to the point of labeling a person as such, theres not much to solve by doing so except be like "okay theyre BPD i need to get away!" and frankly if theres no better insight into how to deal with someone with supposed BPD traits then it is a useless label to me.

I think my friend is that way and my husband is that way, but whether theyre BPD or not i dont think it helps improve things.


----------



## VermisciousKnid (Dec 27, 2011)

anne1208 said:


> I am skeptical of the BPD label as well. Im pretty open minded about modern day psychology but i tend toward thinking BPD shouldnt be a "diagnosis", it seems like more of a description of a personality type. In other words, once youve gotten to the point of labeling a person as such, theres not much to solve by doing so except be like "okay theyre BPD i need to get away!" and frankly if theres no better insight into how to deal with someone with supposed BPD traits then it is a useless label to me.
> 
> I think my friend is that way and my husband is that way, but whether theyre BPD or not i dont think it helps improve things.


Labeling an illness doesn't cure it but it could help you deal with it. 

I remember seeing an interview with a brilliant inventor who always had problems with interpersonal interactions. Being unable to have normal relationships with people was a source of much sadness and anxiety in his life.

He was evaluated by specialists and learned that he was on the autism spectrum. It was then that he realized that he wasn't "doing things wrong", his brain is literally wired differently than other people's brains. That doesn't fix anything but it lets him understand that he has a condition that requires different approaches to some problems. 

In the case of BPD there are specific types of therapies that are effective in treating it. There's no way you would invent them on your own.


----------



## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

Why be that grandiose? Ordinary paranoid narcissists do this all day every day. They're right you're wrong. Period.


----------



## anne1208 (Nov 16, 2015)

Does anybody have any suggestions on how to react to somebody who gets hot tempered? The labeling is nice but narcissist, ADHD, BPD, just a grieving angry dude, whatever he may be, what i'd really like is some input on how to react to this sort of thing.

He gets angry in a half second and it takes eight hours to come down from it. I don't understand


----------



## gouge_away (Apr 7, 2015)

anne1208 said:


> @technovelist
> 
> Thanks. That is interesting bc I found out about BPD lately when a girlfriend of mine was showing weird patterns of behavior regarding first her in-laws and then a friend of hers, where its like, she was so sweet and nice but then when she percieved either in laws or this other friend doing something that ever-so-slightly offended her and she was so angry and hateful and just wanted to cut them all off. Then in September she did the same thing to our mutual friend, over NOTHING - this one thing made her mad and she cut off our friend after years of friendship. I started to wonder about her and after some research came to BPD...like, everythign is totally rosy or THAT PERSON IS AWFUL AND WRONG and they need to cut them off, with nothing in between.
> 
> So after thinking about her behavior for awhile, and wondering if shes BPD, i was almost inclined last night to compare the way my husband had been acting to my friend's behavior - both had the same hallmarks of everythings SUPER GREAT and im so perfect and wonderful or ive totally wronged him and he cant stand to even look at me. Its totally ridiculous. Maybe he is this way somewhat and the recent stressors has brought it out really badly, i dont know.


Lol, Before we you put your hubs on suicide watch, lets unpack these emotions.

His black/white to me sounds like he isn't coping well. That he feels such a wide range of emotions that he is *choosing* to express the easy ones.

You both should be in counseling over the loss of your child, I say this because neither of you has adjusted well. It's easy to acknowledge that each other aren't adjusting, and even acknowledge ourselves, but more difficult to bounce back alone, especially when you don't know where your partner is at.

These emotions all need their time to be felt and processed, defaulting to happy/mad really cheapens the life experience, and burns marriages out.


----------



## anne1208 (Nov 16, 2015)

@gouge_away

Thank you for the insight! I agree that my husband is kind of "missing an opportunity" for lack of a better term, and burning ME out by reverting to anger about everything. 

Meanwhile I am feeling and processing genuine emotions and feel like my progression regarding the miscarriage has been more peaceful. If anything right now, my biggest problem is him, not the miscarriage, bc he seems to be directing all his anger and disappointment at me.

I am going to a therapist over all of it bc it was a lot to deal with and is becoming more so now that my occasionally hot headed husband is in this string of almost daily blowups. I can't handle him. I emailed him and invited him to come with me but he hasn't responded and I know already how he feels about therapy/counseling - he would never do it.


----------



## norajane (Feb 7, 2012)

Try reading this book: Why Does He That? Inside the Minds of Angry and Controlling Men. It might give you some insights into what is happening with your H.

Amazon.com: Why Does He Do That?: Inside the Minds of Angry and Controlling Men (9780425191651): Lundy Bancroft: Books

I would suggest therapy both of you, both to deal with your loss and to deal with his anger issue. He isn't going to change unless you make it a point that you don't want to walk on eggshells around him all the time and constantly be attacked for "making" him mad.


----------



## gouge_away (Apr 7, 2015)

He needs to allow himself to feel these other emotions.

Happiness and contentment is pretty flow, it feels great, euphoric at times and is pleasurable.

Anger, well, that's also pleasurable, punishing others feels a lot better than punishing yourself, pointing out the failings of others feels a lot better than seeing your own fault, judging others feels better than being judged, or self shame...

What your husband needs to know is that these other emotions don't just vanish because we choose to ignore them, sadness and loss fvcking sucks, failing svcks, being behind on bills svcks, nobody wants to process that but we must process it because otherwise we are losing out on the redemption, reconciliation, and resolve.

Without those 3… he's going to be stuck a miserable ahole for a very long time, and not to many well adjusted women put up with that for very long these days.


----------



## anne1208 (Nov 16, 2015)

@norajane thanks for the book suggestion I will get the book!!


----------



## anne1208 (Nov 16, 2015)

gouge_away said:


> He needs to allow himself to feel these other emotions.
> 
> Happiness and contentment is pretty flow, it feels great, euphoric at times and is pleasurable.
> 
> ...


I fancy myself to be a well adjusted woman most of the time, and I am wondering why I got into this lately. Granted, these interactions were usually spaced out so he is generally more agreeable. It's just lately with the miscarriage stuff he insists he is fine, and is day after day being miserable and I am wondering why I am engaging with somebody who keeps flying off the handle over nothing.

My husband loves to stick his head in the sand about truths he doesnt want to face. I like to face things head on, bc the quicker you deal with an uncomfortable truth, the quicker you get used to it, deal with it, move past it. He and his mom have a history of expecting everything to be perfect, insisting everything is, and that their SO positive, and then when stuff doesn't go their way they seem to deal with it very clumsily - like, zero mental preparation to admit life isnt perfect and you can feel crappy and down and process stuff.

My husband and MIL both got mad at me for insisting that my pregnancy seemed "off" and that a miscarriage seemed imminent. His mom even has delusion enough that she kept insisting there was "no way" i was going to have one bc "miscarriages are rare" nv, they are not and she and everyone of her three sisters has had at least one. Then at 14 weeks I had one, and they were like "oh you were right" and since then he and his mom have been a pain in the butt emotionally.


----------



## norajane (Feb 7, 2012)

gouge_away is correct - he needs to recognize and accept that his anger is a cover for his other emotions. Frustration, helplessness, fear, shame, embarrassment, humiliation, sorrow, grief, feeling out of control...it's much easier for him to express his feelings under the blanket heading ANGER rather than to feel what is underneath.

Of course, this does YOU no good. HE needs to understand this and accept it and find other ways to express his feelings instead of anger, especially anger that he takes out on you.


----------



## Phil Anders (Jun 24, 2015)

Sure sounds like your recent tragic loss is at the root of it. Was H fully on board with having kids, since this would've been your first? Is he submerging guilt and resentment at himself for having dismissed your fears? Is he subconsciously blaming you for "miscarrying" (an awful word, IMO--it has blame baked right in)? Lots of potential threads there even if he doesn't have some big flaming PD...stress can bring out the worst in people.


----------



## Satya (Jun 22, 2012)

Definitely get the book Norajane recommended. It is eye opening. 

I know you don't want to hear certain advice, but violent anger is only a precursor to something potentially physical. He is an abuser. 

You want advice on dealing with his anger? You don't. You leave the room when he has a tantrum. You leave the house. You tell him you will only talk w/ him when he's calm & civil and if he refuses, you LEAVE. Rinse & repeat. Stay consistent. Read that book. Hope for the best.


----------



## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

anne1208 said:


> I came to this forum to get some insight into his behavior, not just a "don't have kids with this man" response. It isn't insightful.
> 
> Also, like i said, it's not like he's never gotten mad before, but lately it's become a problem after the miscarriage, is like, everyday. Its relentless. I've been with him for six years and I cant figure out why suddenly he's acting like I am "arguing" with him all the time when I am not, and his anger is so persistent and over the top.


There are a couple of things. First, this anger WILL NOT GET BETTER, WILL ONLY GET WORSE if you stay.

Why? 

Because you are accepting being treated this way. He has no reason to treat you with respect because YOU aren't respecting yourself enough to say 'stop it.' You aren't leaving the room when he yells at you. You aren't leaving the house when he harasses you. You aren't saying 'treat me with respect or I'm moving out.'

Second, if I were you, I would be taking a look at your phone/text records to see if there's an odd phone number he's been in contact with a lot. His actions are suspicious. It may be nothing, but one very common sign of a cheating spouse is getting consistently angry at the betrayed spouse (out of guilt) and taking it out on them. I'm not saying he is, but you're asking for thoughts, and that's mine - check and if you find nothing, move on to other possible reasons.


----------



## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

anne1208 said:


> Does anybody have any suggestions on how to react to somebody who gets hot tempered? The labeling is nice but narcissist, ADHD, BPD, just a grieving angry dude, whatever he may be, what i'd really like is some input on how to react to this sort of thing.
> 
> He gets angry in a half second and it takes eight hours to come down from it. I don't understand


Here's what my therapist told me to do:

You explain calmly that you do not deserve to be argued with, yelled at, or treated badly (that's your boundary) and that, if he chooses to do it anyway, you are going to remove yourself from his vicinity (your consequence for his crossing your boundary) every time he does it. He's free to be that person, but he won't do it with you around. 

And then you follow through: Yell at me, I leave the room for 20 minutes. If you yell at me again when I come back in the room, I go for a walk or a drive for an hour or two. If you jump on me again when I return, I'll pack an overnight bag and go stay at a friend's house or a hotel for the night. If you do it again when I come home the next day, I'll turn right back around and leave again, for TWO days. Next time, three days. Then a week. As soon as you can learn to control your anger, I'm ready to participate in a relationship with you again. If you can't or won't control your anger, we have nothing more to say, because I don't deserve it.


----------



## anne1208 (Nov 16, 2015)

Phil Anders said:


> Sure sounds like your recent tragic loss is at the root of it. Was H fully on board with having kids, since this would've been your first? Is he submerging guilt and resentment at himself for having dismissed your fears? Is he subconsciously blaming you for "miscarrying" (an awful word, IMO--it has blame baked right in)? Lots of potential threads there even if he doesn't have some big flaming PD...stress can bring out the worst in people.


He always wanted kids, and right when we got married. I was always on the fence about kids but warmed up to it. He doesn't blame me at all - the doctors were very dismissive about some of the bleeding issues i had like "Oh it happens!" and didn't have me come in despite several phone calls. I doubt it wouldve affected the outcome but he seems to be directing most of his blame toward them, if anyone - but also seems to understand miscarriages usually are based on something beyond your control.

He does have a lot of guilt about dismissing my fears - from the night in the ER on, he has brought up many times that he feels terrible for dismissing my concern as being overly worrying and negative. But he also says the doctors' reassurance that things were fine perpetuated his feeling that they were and that his wife should stop overreacting. Now, he feels in the wrong re: that and i told him numerous times that he just wanted stuff to work out well so it's okay he was trying to be positive and stamp down my concerns, however clumsily he may have been doing it.

The most telling thing aside from his describing all his feelings about the miscarriage as "Anger" is that he felt "blindsided" by the miscarriage - that he wishes he knew that this might happen. I found that to be a peculiar statement given he told me he heard the word miscarriage out of my mouth almost every day and was sick of seeing the statistics and how common they were. Because his mom and the doctors kept saying i was "fine" he said he was convinced i was and felt blindsided by it happening, and that he now knows a positive pregnancy test does not mean you will get a baby, and that's how he felt. 

I also was fine telling friends and my own relatives I was close to about the pregnancy early on bc im a pretty frank person and knew i could tell people who i was also comfortable talking about the miscarriage to. On the other hand his mom who seems to compete with her three sisters over their kids marrying and their having grandchildren, kept insisting everything was fine and she wanted to "announce" to the family about the pregnancy as early as 8 weeks. I told my husband he'd prob want to wait, knowing full well he is NOT the type who would want his relatives to know about it were it to end in miscarriage - he is a very self conscious individual. Well, bc his mother was pushy he was like "cmon itll be fine! youre not gonna have a miscarriage we saw a heartbeat stop overreacting" so i thought well its his funeral if this backfires and told him and his mom ok fine.

And then i have a miscarriage at 14 weeks.

Well, now he doesnt like all those people knowing and the day after thne miscarriage he got mad at his mom and told her "next time we are doing it [my wife's way] and NOT telling people until WE Are comfortable." 

So I also think he is stressed that the whole world knows (im fine with people knowing, whatever...)....it may sound insignificant but when you have a guy who is pretty guarded about his appearances to people and usually careful about his personal life with is meddling extended family, i think hes also overwhelmed, if not embarassed or shameful feeling about it bc of so many people knowing. 

His cousin's who is his same age is also having a baby, due the same day ours was supposed to be. 

So yeah, he has a lot going on regarding all that and he just isn't handling it well, and his moms behavior didnt help - this wouldve been her first grandkid and when we told her at 7 weeks and she found out about her sisters daughter in laws pregnancy she REALLY pushed us to letr her tell everyone and then she even had the baby shower scheduled at her niece's house for a set date, too, everything....

my husband set himself up for that discomfort and i saw it coming but when i warned him that this would all REALLY SUCK if i miscarried, and he insisted i was overreacting, just go with it - well, hindsight is 20/20 for him i guess, and now hes feeling angry and im getting the brunt of it/


----------



## anne1208 (Nov 16, 2015)

turnera said:


> Here's what my therapist told me to do:
> 
> You explain calmly that you do not deserve to be argued with, yelled at, or treated badly (that's your boundary) and that, if he chooses to do it anyway, you are going to remove yourself from his vicinity (your consequence for his crossing your boundary) every time he does it. He's free to be that person, but he won't do it with you around.
> 
> And then you follow through: Yell at me, I leave the room for 20 minutes. If you yell at me again when I come back in the room, I go for a walk or a drive for an hour or two. If you jump on me again when I return, I'll pack an overnight bag and go stay at a friend's house or a hotel for the night. If you do it again when I come home the next day, I'll turn right back around and leave again, for TWO days. Next time, three days. Then a week. As soon as you can learn to control your anger, I'm ready to participate in a relationship with you again. If you can't or won't control your anger, we have nothing more to say, because I don't deserve it.


Thank you, that is what I am trying to do - it is hard when im having a perfectly normal saturday afternoon and suddenly i feel forced to leave my house bc my husband is flipping out again - all plans have changed suddenly bc is having a tantrum. it gets exhausting. but yeah i feel like thats all i can do, ignore his poor behavior - refuse to engage and cut him off. Leave him alone with his thoughts - it's pretty sad, its akin to sending my husband to his room to think about what he's done - but i guess if your ability to control your emotions is on par with a toddler then you should be treated like one.


----------



## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

anne1208 said:


> Thank you, that is what I am trying to do - it is hard when im having a perfectly normal saturday afternoon and suddenly i feel forced to leave my house bc my husband is flipping out again - all plans have changed suddenly bc is having a tantrum. it gets exhausting. but yeah i feel like thats all i can do, ignore his poor behavior - refuse to engage and cut him off. Leave him alone with his thoughts - it's pretty sad, its akin to sending my husband to his room to think about what he's done - but i guess if your ability to control your emotions is on par with a toddler then you should be treated like one.


Look at it like training a kid to stay in their bed at night. Have you ever watched SuperNanny? It's the number one problem she faces - parents who let their kids get out of bed at night. She makes the parents steel themselves for ONE tough night - doing nothing but putting the kid back in bed, over and over and over, sometimes for hours, until the kid's finally so exhausted that he/she gives up and just goes to sleep. The next time, _they remember_ what they went through last night and just accept that they no longer get to get out of bed. It's a long, harrowing night for the parents, _but it works_.

It might take him a week or two to figure out you really MEAN it - that you WILL just turn around and walk away if he barks at you, no matter what's going on. But he WILL eventually get it, and understand why.

I'm guessing you are the only person he treats this way, right? Then that means he KNOWS better, he CAN control himself, it's just you he feels like he can do it to - because he's not afraid of your reaction. Everyone else, he knows better, he doesn't want them upset with him or to fire him. 

So it's up to you. A tough slog until he gets it, but he really has no choice but to get it, as you will continue to remove yourself. Unless he's just plain abusive (read that book!), and then nothing's going to make him better.

Nowadays, when my H slips and treats me poorly, I don't even have to say a word. I just give him that look, and turn around and leave. HE KNOWS why. And his poor treatment of me has gone WAY down. Almost gone, in fact.


----------



## anne1208 (Nov 16, 2015)

turnera said:


> Look at it like training a kid to stay in their bed at night. Have you ever watched SuperNanny? It's the number one problem she faces - parents who let their kids get out of bed at night. She makes the parents steel themselves for ONE tough night - doing nothing but putting the kid back in bed, over and over and over, sometimes for hours, until the kid's finally so exhausted that he/she gives up and just goes to sleep. The next time, _they remember_ what they went through last night and just accept that they no longer get to get out of bed. It's a long, harrowing night for the parents, _but it works_.
> 
> It might take him a week or two to figure out you really MEAN it - that you WILL just turn around and walk away if he barks at you, no matter what's going on. But he WILL eventually get it, and understand why.
> 
> ...


Yeah what's funny is that i think of supernanny when dealing with him, too. And yes, its just me that gets the brunt of his ADHD or whatever it is-fueled tension. 

I will just have to keep working on ignoring him. I seriously feel like its a giant bid for attention - not just the getting mad, but when he drags out "being mad" for HOURS over nothing - the pouting and huffing and puffing is so transparent and ridiculous seeming. Sometimes i really wish he could watch a video of how he acts, especially because as a woman I can tell you that the sexual attraction to a man who is angry/emotional/yelling/riled up, is NOT there.


----------



## tech-novelist (May 15, 2014)

anne1208 said:


> Yeah what's funny is that i think of supernanny when dealing with him, too. And yes, its just me that gets the brunt of his ADHD or whatever it is-fueled tension.
> 
> I will just have to keep working on ignoring him. I seriously feel like its a giant bid for attention - not just the getting mad, but when he drags out "being mad" for HOURS over nothing - the pouting and huffing and puffing is so transparent and ridiculous seeming. Sometimes i really wish he could watch a video of how he acts, especially because as a woman I can tell you that the sexual attraction to a man who is angry/emotional/yelling/riled up, is NOT there.


Maybe you should video him when he is doing that and show it to him?


----------



## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

When someone disagrees with me too often and for no good reason (you have to trust your own judgement there), I think they are inventorying reasons to demonise and to ultimately dump me.

A lover/ spouse can do it. A boss can do it. A friend who has grown tired of you can do it.

My mother does it with me as well. Now that I speak to her less often she pulls that sh!t less often.

They may not have any fancy (BPD, NPD, ADHD, BVDs, whatever.....) problem at all. They may be decent lovely people to the rest of the world. But you may be in their way at the moment. 

So you're no longer a human being. Just an obstacle.


----------

