# Reconcile or walk away?



## SARAHMCD (Jul 2, 2014)

My husband and I were married almost 8 years, no kids, separated now for 3 weeks. I was the one who left and it took me several years to make this decision. There was no abuse, we weren't really fighting, and there was no infidelity. I had tried talking to him about my concerns in our relationship before (his negativity, his anxiety, his passivity, our lack of intimacy and connection) but I was met with blank stares and slight agreement, but no change in actions. 
The last thing I wanted to do was leave. So now, finally, he is saying that I'm the best thing that ever happened to him, he'll do anything not to lose me and he's agreed to counselling (he blatantly refused before). He went for one consultation on his own. Had a lot of positive things to say about it, but had no plans for ongoing therapy or a plan for us to reach a reuniting stage. 
Now when I email him my thoughts (which seem to really hit me first thing in the morning, waking up alone, so its hard for me to talk to him the phone due to work), his responses are more negative "a leapord doesn't change his spots", etc. That I married a cop and that's just who he is - they view the world in a negative way and have a hard time leaving that behind when they come home. Everyone is assumed to be an a** unless they prove him wrong - that's his general assessment of the world. 
His anger and negativity is not really generated at me, but at the world. His father was a cop and he has zero good memories of his childhood. His father was either not around or when he was, he wasn't involved with his wife or kids. Sounds familiar. 
I would love to get back together. My leaving was what I saw as my only hope of reaching him on the importance of us getting the process started of talking about our communication problems and his anxiety/anger issues. 
So I've assigned him the task of finding us a marriage counsellor (another or our issues is that I do everything in our relationship- finances, social plans, etc) - which he has agreed to since its really his only option if he wants to get back together but he fears its just going to be us ganging up on him telling him everything he's doing wrong. He wants me to take responsibility too. Which I will - for my lack of communication. I'd also like to learn to be more assertive and ask for what I want. I want to learn what I've done wrong in the relationship to get us here. And maybe I' m putting too much emphasis on our relationship to make me happy instead of being responsible for my own happiness? I have confidence these smaller issues can be corrected. 
Do I now step back and wait for him to take charge - stop communicating beyond yes or no answers? Can I have hope that he will work on his general anger and negativity issues or should I accept the fact that its ingrained in him and just won't change? 
Should I set a timeframe for our reconciliation? 
I know I need to have patience....its just so hard to know if I should hang on, try to work things out or simply move on.


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## SecondTime'Round (Jan 15, 2015)

I don't see anything here that is not fixable. People CAN become less negative and pessimistic and angry. It's one of the reasons I'm in IC, and I'm not a cop. 

I do think he really NEEDS to be the one to set up the MC, though. I don't think I've been non-communicative (yes and no answers), especially considering you admit communication is one of your weaknesses.....if he's giving something (setting up counseling), you probably should be, too.


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## WandaJ (Aug 5, 2014)

MC should help, and you both would benefit from indivndual counseling. But you have to be aware, that he will never be a cheerful guy, that's his personality.


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## SamuraiJack (May 30, 2014)

SARAHMCD said:


> And maybe I' m putting too much emphasis on our relationship to make me happy instead of being responsible for my own happiness?


This.
Right here.

Start creating your own hapiness and it MIGHT rub off on him.
MC and IC would be a great way to examine this.

I have several Law Enforcemnet freinds...all but a few are very cautious when dealing with people and can see darkness easier than many other people I know.


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## jb02157 (Apr 16, 2014)

SARAHMCD said:


> My husband and I were married almost 8 years, no kids, separated now for 3 weeks. I was the one who left and it took me several years to make this decision. There was no abuse, we weren't really fighting, and there was no infidelity. I had tried talking to him about my concerns in our relationship before (his negativity, his anxiety, his passivity, our lack of intimacy and connection) but I was met with blank stares and slight agreement, but no change in actions.
> The last thing I wanted to do was leave. So now, finally, he is saying that I'm the best thing that ever happened to him, he'll do anything not to lose me and he's agreed to counselling (he blatantly refused before). He went for one consultation on his own. Had a lot of positive things to say about it, but had no plans for ongoing therapy or a plan for us to reach a reuniting stage.
> Now when I email him my thoughts (which seem to really hit me first thing in the morning, waking up alone, so its hard for me to talk to him the phone due to work), his responses are more negative "a leapord doesn't change his spots", etc. That I married a cop and that's just who he is - they view the world in a negative way and have a hard time leaving that behind when they come home. Everyone is assumed to be an a** unless they prove him wrong - that's his general assessment of the world.
> His anger and negativity is not really generated at me, but at the world. His father was a cop and he has zero good memories of his childhood. His father was either not around or when he was, he wasn't involved with his wife or kids. Sounds familiar.
> ...


I think you've been awful hard on him, basically you are demanding that goes to marriage conseling, and I can tell you first hand from a man's prospective that it doesn't work and it is as you say, it's two women ganging up on a man. I find marriage couseling seeks to take away all a man is. If that's all you are offering him, no wonder you've made him mad and negative, my wife has done that to me to. That often happens when all you have to offer someone is an ultimatim. 

Try to look at what you're offering him from his propesctive, maybe that will help you see that you're really not giving him a chance.


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## SARAHMCD (Jul 2, 2014)

JB02157,
I'm curious as to what your advice is. If he's dealing with a very toxic personality issue (negativity and anger), and suffering health consequences for it - high blood pressure, anxiety and depression (which led to a long period of self medicating with prescription drugs), never mind shutting himself off to me and others close to him, what suggestion do you have for helping him besides counselling? To note, he did go see a psychiatrist recently (a first step after years of me suggesting it) but only for one counselling session. Which he actually had positive things to say about - but did not take it upon himself to set up regular ongoing therapy. As far as I know he hasn't bought any books and refuses to go on a site like TAM. 

So how do I help him and us without at least trying MC? Its the only way I can think of to get him talking. Help!


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## ladymisato (Aug 5, 2014)

SARAHMCD, is there any possibility of you finding happiness in the marriage without fixing him? Could you, for example, tolerate him as he is and develop friendships to satisfy your social needs?

If you can do this that would buy you time to work on him patiently.


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## SARAHMCD (Jul 2, 2014)

I've certainly considered the option of simply tolerating it - and that's what I've been doing for the last few years. But I find myself incredibly lonely in a marriage where I get virtually no attention. He comes home and is watching TV and on his tablet, then about an hour before bed, takes a sleeping pill, goes to bed where the TV goes on again, and then passes out. Sex is virtually non-existent, as are all forms of intimacy unless I initiate. 
So yes, I could go out and live my own life, but I also want a partner SOME of the time. For instance, I like to travel, but I don't want to always rely on girls weekends or going alone. I got married for a reason - to have a partner in crime not a roommate. I do make plans for us - asking him all along the way for his opinion. But again, I'm always the one left making the plans. He would never initiate us going out or travelling anywhere, or doing anything for our anniversary, etc etc. 
Hence, the separation. I wanted him to take me seriously because he just wasn't and we were just getting more and more distant and living separate lives. I'm not asking for a lot really. Just for him to initiate occasionally - show some interest in wanting to do something with me, go somewhere with me, wanting to have sex again, etc. I'm fine with taking on the bulk of it but i do need a willing participant or it gets pretty lonely. 

He tells me that he does this - just goes along with whatever I want to do - to make me happy. That he doesn't want to suggest anything because it might upset me. It might be the WRONG thing. He's incredibly non-confrontational. 
So we need to figure out how to communicate better or this just isn't going to work. I need him to be more assertive in order for both of us to be happier. This is why I strongly believe we need MC. 
Thanks for your input everybody!!!


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## ladymisato (Aug 5, 2014)

SARAHMCD said:


> I've certainly considered the option of simply tolerating it - and that's what I've been doing for the last few years. But I find myself incredibly lonely in a marriage where I get virtually no attention.


Please understand that I am not dismissing your frustrations. But you must weigh that against a divorce which is where a breakup will naturally lead. It may be that you can draw attention to your concerns by threatening divorce, as a separation does, but you are toying with a disaster.



> He comes home and is watching TV and on his tablet, then about an hour before bed, takes a sleeping pill, goes to bed where the TV goes on again, and then passes out. Sex is virtually non-existent, as are all forms of intimacy unless I initiate.
> So yes, I could go out and live my own life, but I also want a partner SOME of the time. For instance, I like to travel, but I don't want to always rely on girls weekends or going alone. I got married for a reason - to have a partner in crime not a roommate. I do make plans for us - asking him all along the way for his opinion. But again, I'm always the one left making the plans. He would never initiate us going out or travelling anywhere, or doing anything for our anniversary, etc etc.


You have every right to be disappointed with him. And I am in no way suggesting that you should give up and tolerate this forever. I am, rather, hoping to persuade you to back off from the separation and take a different approach.



> Hence, the separation. I wanted him to take me seriously because he just wasn't and we were just getting more and more distant and living separate lives. I'm not asking for a lot really. Just for him to initiate occasionally - show some interest in wanting to do something with me, go somewhere with me, wanting to have sex again, etc. I'm fine with taking on the bulk of it but i do need a willing participant or it gets pretty lonely.


I fear that this is not going to get you what you want. Sometimes threats can move a person to change but more often it just invites retaliation. I worry especially that someone in law enforcement is going to be very tempted to respond uncooperativly to threats (though you did describe him as "non-confrontational").



> He tells me that he does this - just goes along with whatever I want to do - to make me happy. That he doesn't want to suggest anything because it might upset me. It might be the WRONG thing. He's incredibly non-confrontational.
> So we need to figure out how to communicate better or this just isn't going to work. I need him to be more assertive in order for both of us to be happier. This is why I strongly believe we need MC.


His non-confrontational can be leveraged in other ways. You are acknowledging at least some minimal level of effort on his part to please you. And I don't doubt that MC could help if he took it seriously. But that's a big if.


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## SARAHMCD (Jul 2, 2014)

So if separation wasn't the "answer" than what is? I tried to talk to him on many occasions - both verbally and sending him long notes. When I spoke verbally he completely shut down. Literally wouldn't say a word, just stared at me. I suggested he get back to me when he feels like talking...I would wait until a better time. Nothing. 
When he told me recently that he's finally ready to talk - that he had to hit rock bottom (me leaving) for him to realize how upset I was. He just thought I'd had a bad day at work. WHAT???? Nothing I said had anything to do with work. But in his mind, that's the only thing that could possibly upset anyone that much- his job. It's what defines him. 
I obviously need help with my communication skills in dealing with him since I haven't done such a good job before!

I want to move back home. I hate being separated and I do NOT want it to lead to divorce. I accepted the risk when I left because I felt there was no alternative. But I think if I move back now, nothing will change. He'll see it as a sign that things are all better and we can go back to our old routines. That's if we don't really start talking. Again, we need help there. 

So what do you suggest I do to move us forward?


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## jb02157 (Apr 16, 2014)

SARAHMCD said:


> JB02157,
> I'm curious as to what your advice is. If he's dealing with a very toxic personality issue (negativity and anger), and suffering health consequences for it - high blood pressure, anxiety and depression (which led to a long period of self medicating with prescription drugs), never mind shutting himself off to me and others close to him, what suggestion do you have for helping him besides counselling? To note, he did go see a psychiatrist recently (a first step after years of me suggesting it) but only for one counselling session. Which he actually had positive things to say about - but did not take it upon himself to set up regular ongoing therapy. As far as I know he hasn't bought any books and refuses to go on a site like TAM.
> 
> So how do I help him and us without at least trying MC? Its the only way I can think of to get him talking. Help!


I honestly don't think that it's wise to shove marriage counseling down his throat...or else. It's really hit or miss whether it works, and there is a tendancy for it to be women oriented and for men just to be told a series of things they are doing wrong. If my wife told me marriage counselling or else I would refuse it to. 

Two things that I think would be helpful are to have him see a doctor about his high blood pressure. There are alot of medications out there that do work wonders for it. Secondly is that I get the impression that he's sensing that you're not really giving him a chance, only this marriage counseling idea. If you really are serious about saving your marriage (I'm not sure you are...only looking for validation to walk), set some time for you to TALK together in an atmosphere where he knows he's not going to get attacked or given ultimatums. Make some plans to get away together and do things you both like to do. I do think that you will do much better trying to sort this out amongst yourselves rather that get a marriage counseler involved who only has one objective, to get you to schedule more appointments. I really think that if he sees that you are serious about LOVING him then he will do the same. People aren't "toxic" overnight, it takes awhile to get there and it takes awhile to stop. 

I definitely think your marriage is salvagable, but you have to make it clear to him that's what you want. 

My marriage is in the same place yours is and if I put myself in your husbands shoes I would say that the thing that I want most of all is for my wife to want to be with me and save the marriage.


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## ladymisato (Aug 5, 2014)

SARAHMCD said:


> So if separation wasn't the "answer" than what is? I tried to talk to him on many occasions - both verbally and sending him long notes. When I spoke verbally he completely shut down. Literally wouldn't say a word, just stared at me. I suggested he get back to me when he feels like talking...I would wait until a better time. Nothing.
> When he told me recently that he's finally ready to talk - that he had to hit rock bottom (me leaving) for him to realize how upset I was. He just thought I'd had a bad day at work. WHAT???? Nothing I said had anything to do with work. But in his mind, that's the only thing that could possibly upset anyone that much- his job. It's what defines him.
> I obviously need help with my communication skills in dealing with him since I haven't done such a good job before!


I will not deny that leaving him will get his attention. And I sympathize with your frustration with his lack of communication. The problem is not your communication skills. But you have more choices than leaving or staying and communicating.



> I want to move back home. I hate being separated and I do NOT want it to lead to divorce. I accepted the risk when I left because I felt there was no alternative. But I think if I move back now, nothing will change. He'll see it as a sign that things are all better and we can go back to our old routines. That's if we don't really start talking. Again, we need help there.
> 
> So what do you suggest I do to move us forward?


Here is my simplistic suggestion: ask for some concession before returning home. It can be anything as small as a promise to talk once a week. Go back home. Tolerate him but don't accept him as he is. Instead, go to work on changing him patiently.


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## SARAHMCD (Jul 2, 2014)

jb02157 said:


> I honestly don't think that it's wise to shove marriage counseling down his throat...or else. It's really hit or miss whether it works, and there is a tendancy for it to be women oriented and for men just to be told a series of things they are doing wrong. If my wife told me marriage counselling or else I would refuse it to.
> 
> Two things that I think would be helpful are to have him see a doctor about his high blood pressure. There are alot of medications out there that do work wonders for it. Secondly is that I get the impression that he's sensing that you're not really giving him a chance, only this marriage counseling idea. If you really are serious about saving your marriage (I'm not sure you are...only looking for validation to walk), set some time for you to TALK together in an atmosphere where he knows he's not going to get attacked or given ultimatums. Make some plans to get away together and do things you both like to do. I do think that you will do much better trying to sort this out amongst yourselves rather that get a marriage counseler involved who only has one objective, to get you to schedule more appointments. I really think that if he sees that you are serious about LOVING him then he will do the same. People aren't "toxic" overnight, it takes awhile to get there and it takes awhile to stop.
> 
> ...


Unfortunately, it got to the point of an ultimatum because he refused to take my concerns seriously and talk to me at all. I absolutely want my marriage back on track. I've told him this a lot since we split up - even while we were splitting up. I used to be very loving to him but it stopped being reciprocated. I was rejected in many ways. He knows that he puts up walls but isn't sure how to stop doing that. Obviously whatever I've tried hasn't worked thus far. Just being loving is not enough to make him loving back. This is why I need better or different skills to learn how to deal with his anger, his anxiety, and the fact that he just shuts down when he's home. Doesn't want to talk at all (I just mean in general, not about us), or when he does its an angry rant, doesn't want to ever do anything or plan anything (like trips, etc). I need him to be present in the relationship - to be a true partner. 
I want fun, sex, intimacy, someone to share the day to day with. That's where we need to get to. He roadblocks pretty much all of those with some bad habits. And I need to learn how to get around them. Mostly I need us to both TALK about what we want the relationship to look like going forward and make sure we're on the same page even. 
We're meeting this Friday to try to start the process so wish me luck!


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## Chuck71 (Nov 5, 2012)

He needs IC in a bad way and you seem to have tried all avenues.

You tried the subtle approach and the in face too.

You obviously are miserable and he can't see the forest for the trees

Maybe filing for D will "wake him up"

There is something he is not wanting to face..... and he fears it will

make him confront it in IC or MC. Do you know what it may be?


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## SamuraiJack (May 30, 2014)

Sometimes life does imitate art...remember Looney Tunes?

Might have to drop a piano on him...


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## Orange_Pekoe (Jan 5, 2015)

It sounds to me like you are on the right track. Asking him to find the marriage counsellor and book a time, will:

1. Show you that he is taking charge (you mentioned you usually did all of the planning in your marriage).
2. Show you that is putting effort in to the relationship.

And ultimately, that will build trust.

My husband used to say that he'd do things and then not do them...over the course of 3 years, it eroded the trust I had in him. 

And yes - you do have to find the courage to create your own happiness, rather than look for others to make you happy. If we rely on others to make us happy, then believe you me, we'll be miserable most of the time and people will always fall short of our expectations.


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## SARAHMCD (Jul 2, 2014)

So here's my update:
I met with my DH tonight at a restaurant for dinner. It's been 2 weeks since I saw him or spoke to him outside texts. 
I had sent him a list a few days ago basically describing how I would want our relationship to look in a perfect world. Lots of communication, cuddling, sex regularly, connecting, etc. But also living our own lives.
So I had to bring it up - the whole discussion of "us" once again. I asked if he read my text - since he hadn't replied. As he said, that's not his preferred way of communicating. Fine. But keep in mind that he hasn't called me or asked to meet in 2 weeks - we've been separated for a month now - broke up 6 weeks ago.
Yes, he'd read it, and agreed with most parts of it. Said he liked being given a specific list -a way of life he can understand and bad habits he can give up (we can give up). I certainly own parts of it. 
But that was it. He hasn't looked into counselling or doing any self-help other than one counselling session. Said he wants to be back together but other than some lack in our intimacy, didn't really see much wrong with how we were. But is willing to go for counselling - whatever will make me happy. 
The point is, I want him to go to help himself. For example, this past weekend I couldn't meet with him or talk to him because he was in a depression/anxiety spell. What that means is he was flat out for 5 days. Not eating (probably throwing up) and laying on the couch. I thought it was because of us. NO!!! It was because of some (what I consider) minor incident at work. Same old sh**. He was flat out due to being caught drinking soda where he wasn't supposed to. Yup, that's what did it. And I've lived with this for a long time, he goes into these depressions about once every 3-4 months He's taking Effexor, Xanax and Ambien. 
Listen, I try my best to understand and sympathize with his depression and anxiety (I've lived with it for 8 years - and experienced some of my own panic attacks) but again, shouldn't this serve as an example of why he needs to get his own IC? 
He still hasn't arranged an MC or a regular IC. Wanted to see what I wanted to do. Really? 
So no initiative at all to fix himself. Said he hit bottom when I left but hasn't done a thing since. No exercise routine, no counselling, not even trying to talk to me....what does that tell me? 
Should I really wait this one out? If so, how long do I wait for him to show me a little effort, a little priority in his life? He's already set up a dating profile - did that before I'd even left the house - basically within a week of me becoming that walk away wife I hear about. 
So tonight I was really expecting some effort on his part. Just a little sign that he was making me priority. That I was important. But I didn't see anything, other than slight agreement to what I had emailed him. Said he would look into counselling (ok, its been 6 weeks - what is taking so long?). 
I was really disappointed and had a good cry when I got home. I'd actually set up my condo for "company" hoping tonight might be some sort of small reconciliation - but I realized we are no where near that. I have no desire to have sex with someone who I've been married to for 8 years and has not put in any effort to make a phone call even. To me or a counsellor. 
When do I throw in the towel? Frustrated.


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