# Wanting a great Marriage, not just a good one



## DancingBear (Nov 17, 2012)

My Wife and I been Married 10 yrs, Two great kids, 8 & 3, great home life, etc.. We both enjoy our lives we have built. She is a stay at home Mum.

She has never been really into sex that much, although I did get her to experiment a bit before we were married, nothing too crazy.

However, I am now 37, and feel like our marriage needs more. She only does Missonary, and I never see her naked, and rarely get to touch her, anywhere. Its so frustrating, and my self esteem has gone way south. She is drop dead gorgeous, 110lbs.
She is really busy with the kids, understandable, but she is a stay at home mom in a nice town, nice house. I help out with everything, but I stand my ground now more than I used to, hoping it would drive her to me.

After we had sex last week, I was bummed that it was so boring again for the same as its been for more than 5 yrs, no oral or anything. She doesn't want oral, or want to give it to me. Its all about what she prefers, not even kissing or anything. I havent kissed my wife for more than 5 seconds in longer than I can remember. 

So, I brought it up calmly, and she basically said I was putting her down, and she was sorry that she wasn't good enough for me, in a rude voice. and I should be happy with the good things in my life, and that I was being a negative person. I told her no, that I am a good person, and deserve affection. She said its not me, that its what she prefers. I asked her what about what I prefer?, I told her she has a selfish heart, and that open communication is the most important thing, etc. I told her that I think she has intimacy issues, and may need to see someone. 

I don't get it, I have taken the Alpha stance the past year, in alot of ways. I started going to the gym, I look great, and other women notice. I give her cards, flowers, but she never shows affection, ever. Never grabs me for a hug, or grabs my hand. 
I asked her why she thought that I would just accept this forever? The worst part is that she wont talk about it, or blames me for focusing on the negative. She is wondering why I have all of these expectations of her? She says only yourself can make you happy. Can someone offer me some guidance, or lift my head from the sand? Thanks!


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## Trying2figureitout (Feb 3, 2011)

So let me get this straight...

You have sex with your wife complain about quality and insist she go to an intimacy therapist. I a good person and you deserve her affection.

Do you see an issue with what you did?
From her standpoint?

What if your wife doesn't like cards or flowers?

Mine told me that already so it makes my life easy.
You have a ways to go you need to get smarter about how to handle your wife... alpha is not a cure all.


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## DancingBear (Nov 17, 2012)

It wasn't the same day, sorry it was a couple of days later


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

Just keep pushing the envelope...but push it with communication. Refuse to ignore the problem or rug sweep it. 

Sure she may at first continue to say that you are focusing on the negative, etc. Do not let this deter you. Drive it home until you get some answers and reactions.

At the same time, please educate yourself about the different sex drives we all have. Try to really understand that many people (both men AND women) have low sex drives and when this is the case, they do not feel as if they are "holding out". They simply don't think of sex as a need, and they don't feel closer or more in love through sex. This is a valid position, just like having a high need for sex is a valid position. Problems occur though, when both spouses who have opposite sex drives think only THEIR position is correct and that the other one should change.

In reality, no one, including your wife, changes unless they choose to. So if you require change from her (which is totally your right to do so, it is YOUR marriage) then you are going to need to be able to back this up with the actual intention of leaving the marriage.

If not, if you just "hope" she will change but you aren't going to leave her either way, then you are going to end up with the same misery forever.

I know that doesn't seem fair and when people are new to asking for help with this problem, they don't want to hear it. People don't want to hear "your only power is the power to leave". And yet, that is true for all married people, whether they understand it or not.

You haven't described enough about your wife for us to know if there are other issues at play that could be affecting her sex drive, so for now I am just assuming she has a lower sex drive than you do. Have you stopped to realize that if she was married to a man with a lower sex drive, she might be happier? I think it is helpful for people in your position to see it this way so they can stop feeling like a victim in their situations. No one is "stuck". Everyone has options.

You always have the power.

It is just that that power you have is the power to walk your own feet out the door and that wasn't quite the power you were hoping for.


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## vegasruby (Apr 30, 2013)

"Wanting a great Marriage, not just a good one"

Sex is what makes a great marriage? At least you are honest about what you consider a great marriage. Lots lie or sugarcoat to look good.


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## DancingBear (Nov 17, 2012)

but does that not seem so selfish to leave my kids, and my family, and my house, to sit in a room with only my pride?

I guess my own happiness is more important? That is hard to wrap my head around, really, it is!

Especially for someone like me. Yes she has LD, she must. Its hard to imagine that its not me, but I guess it isn't


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## Trying2figureitout (Feb 3, 2011)

DancingBear said:


> but does that not seem so selfish to leave my kids, and my family, and my house, to sit in a room with only my pride?
> 
> I guess my own happiness is more important? That is hard to wrap my head around, really, it is!
> 
> Especially for someone like me. Yes she has LD, she must. Its hard to imagine that its not me, but I guess it isn't



Its "LD" for you. Otherwise her libido is fine.

So it is you.

Are you the type to run or fix it? Do you honor your lifelong vows or not?


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## DancingBear (Nov 17, 2012)

"Sex is what makes a great marriage"? Well, its the icing on the cake for me. I would say good sex is. I pictured my thirties to be a time to explore each other, and to have fun.

We spend so much time together, as it is. She has never even wore a cute nighty or anything to bed our whole marriage. its just strange to me. 

Im not that mad, I just think its weird behavior to not want to please your husband, ever!

Imagine if she started dating a new guy, and didn't do any of this.


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## DancingBear (Nov 17, 2012)

"Its "LD" for you. Otherwise her libido is fine.
So it is you.
Are you the type to run or fix it? Do you honor your lifelong vows or not?"

I would love to fix it, and have tried to communicate about it repeatedly, Does she honor her lifelong vows?

I think she is not by being a distant, and non communicable spouse.

If it is me, then why stay with me, and pretend forever?
Tell me the truth, is she incapable of this?


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

DancingBear....no one, not even your wife, knows if she is capable or not. And she won't know until you decide if it is a deal breaker for you or not.

And what are you talking about, sitting alone with your pride, if you left?

Where did you get that? I'm advocating that you leave (if she will not or cannot change and you determine it is a deal breaker for you) AND FIND ANOTHER WOMAN WITH A COMPATIBLE SEX DRIVE.

No idea why you thought I meant to sit alone with your pride. Silly boy.


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## vegasruby (Apr 30, 2013)

Dancingbear,

I think I can relate a little. 

My husband has a job where a lot of marriages fail. A lot of wives get fet up. We have both been committed in this marriage for 20 years. We are in it for the long haul. We have gotten through storms. In my view, my husband should know I love him and will stick by him. I am not super affectionate. Does that mean I don't love him? No. I am very proud of my marriage and very proud of my husband. We do not kiss more that 5 seconds like you and your wife. That is due to me. Sorry to say my husband is a sloppy kisser. My husband and I communicate very well. I have a low sex drive. No surprise my husbands is higher. I don't like long drawn out sex. We do more than just the missionary position. I don't like being coerced against my volition into anything. I can understand your wife. On TV we watched a TV show that had sex scenes that were basically soft porn. I could see it got him going. I told my husband that it is a TV show and I am not an actress. I have never been a nymph. He married me knowing how I was. I can understand your wife. I can see your side too. If I can help I will. You might need to accept her nature. Do you want somebody to fake?


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## Trying2figureitout (Feb 3, 2011)

DancingBear said:


> "Its "LD" for you. Otherwise her libido is fine.
> So it is you.
> Are you the type to run or fix it? Do you honor your lifelong vows or not?"
> 
> ...


She stays because she loves you... if she didn't she'd be gone.
She is not incapable of being sexual. She can be very sexual with you.

It probably just isn't on her mind and she's waiting for something to happen.
You both have childhood and marital baggage.

It is not an exact science.... and you are up against nonsense.
You CAN affect change... if you REALLY want to.

If you want a better marriage....

Do what companies who acquire other companies do. They look at th OLD company with a critical eye and uncover every inefficiency.

Look at your OLD marriage from the outside.
Figure out EXACTLY what you want, why it isn't working. Plainly state it to yourself.. believe in it.
Look in the mirror at your actions/words of the past. What could you do better? What can she do better?
Listen intently to what your wife says... study her.. learn about her.
Fix the dynamics (As they say alpha-up but remain true to yourself)
Remain focused on that goal. EVERYDAY.
Don't whine and complain... be nice/friendly and fun.
Plan communications. Mine were every six months like clockwork.

So most of the time settle into a baseline behavior... decent but NOT FANTASTIC.

Give her plenty of space and time.

I will have a Post later with all the details... for now stop the bleeding. (STOP COMMUNICATING for at least six months on sex)

You have to look at your marriage objectively. You have to compartmentalize THE ISSUE.

Mine was 90% OK... I worked on achieving the extra 10% every day in some way... I was NEVER without a plan.
That is why I saw success.

Simplify it and work the issue. Your wife heard you... shut up for now.


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## Wiserforit (Dec 27, 2012)

DancingBear said:


> So, I brought it up calmly, and she basically said I was putting her down, and she was sorry that she wasn't good enough for me, in a rude voice. and I should be happy with the good things in my life, and that I was being a negative person.


Manipulative blame-the-victim-by-playing-the-victim tactic.

This is very hurtful. Please ignore the attacks from others who are not listening to the problem and just choosing to inject their own issues into this.

Marriage is above all else communication. When one spouse attacks the other for communicating their feelings then you have a war going on, not marriage.

In this case you bring something that is hurting you to the attention of the other spouse. They turn the tables on you and say that you are victimizing them by bringing it up, and making it look like it is your fault. Adding in the sarcastic insult for effect. 

A marriage counselor is not going to let that happen. One of their big jobs is being an impartial referee.

If she asked you to take out the garbage and you responded with "Oh, so you are saying I'm not good enough for you" then she would look at you like WTF is wrong with you.

This kind of manipulative act is in the long run even more hurtful than the original problem. If you can't tell your spouse about your feelings without being made to feel even worse, then you start to ask why you have a spouse. They are supposed to be on your team. 

So you need an impartial referee that is going to disalow her defensiveness from prohibiting communication.


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## Lionlady (Sep 12, 2012)

Your wife is acting selfish and mean. Geez...it seems like a lot of people are total jerks. It makes me so glad I'm married to someone kind who actually wants me to be happy. 

I don't know what to say. If you come to your wife and say you want your sex life to be better and she basically says no and gets mad at you for having feelings...well what is there to say? That's not the behavior of someone who really loves you.


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## Trying2figureitout (Feb 3, 2011)

Wiserforit said:


> Manipulative blame-the-victim-by-playing-the-victim tactic.
> 
> This is very hurtful. Please ignore the attacks from others who are not listening to the problem and just choosing to inject their own issues into this.
> 
> ...


No third parties.... no referee. This isn't some court of law.

OP needs to change the dynamics of his marriage on his terms. Own up to his part of the impasse and move the marriage forward. Stand up to his wife. Don't be afraid of her.

Be willing for things to get worse so they can get better later.... key concept.

MC is a waste of time,money and is counterproductive.

This is between him and his wife. IF he wants a better marriage he needs to earn it.
Refusers hate MC because they know they'll have to face their non-actions. Best thing MC is for is as a threat. Leverage.

Keep in mind things can be said many different ways so you don't come across as a "negative person" its better to come off as the "reasonable and loving person"

I believe its all dynamics in OPs case. His marriage as is sounds unsustainable. So FIX it.

Don't ever accept the unacceptable.


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## Cee Paul (Apr 11, 2012)

I want a sophisticated lady in public but a total freak in the bedroom, but so far that is like trying to find a treasure of pirates gold at the bottom of the ocean.


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## vegasruby (Apr 30, 2013)

Wiserforit said:


> Manipulative blame-the-victim-by-playing-the-victim tactic.
> 
> 
> Marriage is above all else communication.


I agree 100% that communication is marriage as well as extremely important. 

When people bring up sex and say they aren't happy some people take that personally and become defensive. Our society is big on sexual performance. Not measuring up can tear you down. I don't think in every case it is one manipulating. Sex is a touchy subject.


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