# Masturbation in Marriage and Fantasizing about Others



## ChknNoodleSoup (Oct 20, 2012)

I've been writing in the CWI section for a while. Had been in pain and turmoil for months. Finally in a decent place. WH had an emotional affair (I suspect a physical one too, but have no proof) and I'm separated now, while he keeps playing the kid card to stay in both our lives. Anyway, the point is, we got to fighting again yesterday and I said it wasn't OK he had sexual fantasies about the OW and that he masturbated to her (not in person, but he told me he thought of her while doing so). He was trying to downplay his affair. He said I'd be "hard-pressed" to find a man who hasn't thought about other women while taking care of his business. He says he's always fantasized about others, sometimes me, but "other women pop in his head!" I've never (until recently since our marriage fell apart) have fantasized about anyone else. Part of me feels it's wrong. I'm turned on by other people but it's always him that I thought of. Question is, is it true? Do loving couples fantasize about others rather than their spouses when they're "taking care of business?" Or is it just one more thing he wants me to feel bad about? Sorry, was young and a virgin when married, so I'm sorry if this sounds like a dumb question.


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## canttrustu (Feb 22, 2012)

You know, I'd bet the farm that most men do fantasize about others at some point. Now, the real sore spot is that SHE is already a thorn in your side. He likely could have gone w/o telling you this but in the interest of full disclosure he was likely just being honest. I'd bet that EVERYone who has had an EA has taken this step. Just most dont disclose this much detail to their spouse since its not something that can be proven. I would think this is completely normal. You just have the added misery of who she is. So sorry for that. Im sure thats something you could have gone forever not knowing. My bigger question is did he disclose this only when pressed by you or did he volunteer it?


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## ChknNoodleSoup (Oct 20, 2012)

canttrustu said:


> You know, I'd bet the farm that most men do fantasize about others at some point. Now, the real sore spot is that SHE is already a thorn in your side. He likely could have gone w/o telling you this but in the interest of full disclosure he was likely just being honest. I'd bet that EVERYone who has had an EA has taken this step. Just most dont disclose this much detail to their spouse since its not something that can be proven. I would think this is completely normal. You just have the added misery of who she is. So sorry for that. Im sure thats something you could have gone forever not knowing. My bigger question is did he disclose this only when pressed by you or did he volunteer it?


He told me this to "wake me up." I was gone for a while on a trip, when I came back, he was all weird, found out he was meeting with her, I asked him what he wanted, he said he doesn't know. I asked him what when on between them and he said he has feelings for her, been hanging out with her, going out to dinner, etc. I said did you sleep with her, he said no, I said have you done anything sexual and he divulged that, so I guess in trying to be honest. Or whatever. Since then, we were trying to reconcile, we never got intimate, he never was into R, and I walked in on him several times "taking care of himself." And I can't help but think he was thinking of her, because he isn't in a place to want to think about me. But I guess, even when people aren't in this bad place, men just naturally think about other women?


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

As a guy, I can say that throughout my marriage, when I was masturbating, I was thinking about someone else. I might think about the woman I saw in front of my in the coffee shop, it might be from a movie I saw recently (porn or not), it might be a "flashback from way back"... But unless my wife and I had a really hot sex session, I wasn't likely to be thinking of her. 

C


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## canttrustu (Feb 22, 2012)

so yes, he was being honest. As awful as that was, honesty is a rare thing in a WS. Did he still have contact with her during R?


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## BeachGuy (Jul 6, 2011)

PBear said:


> As a guy, I can say that throughout my marriage, when I was masturbating, I was thinking about someone else. I might think about the woman I saw in front of my in the coffee shop, it might be from a movie I saw recently (porn or not), it might be a "flashback from way back"... But unless my wife and I had a really hot sex session, I wasn't likely to be thinking of her.
> 
> C


Same here. Men are visually stimulated so I'd bet the majority do the same thing. I'm sure since women are more emotionally stimulated, it sounds completely disgusting for men to visualize strangers when doing the deed. But it is what it is.

A female friend of mine once asked me if I did that; visualized women. When I said yes she was blown away. She said another male friend of hers had told her he did that too and she didn't belive him, because she never ever visualized another man. She said she concentrated on how it was making her feel and nothing more. That blew me away.

But...in answer to OP, he should've kept that little tidbit of information to himself. This isn't a stranger he's visualizing, but someone he's already had an EA with at least.

Men and women will never understand each other. :rofl:


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

I've said in other posts, when some people go on a rant about guys watching porn and masturbating... Would you rather your husband think about your sister while he spanks his monkey, or watch porn and think about some anonymous porn star while he does his business. Cause he's going to be thinking about SOMEONE else...

C


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## ChknNoodleSoup (Oct 20, 2012)

canttrustu said:


> so yes, he was being honest. As awful as that was, honesty is a rare thing in a WS. Did he still have contact with her during R?


Yes, they work (and travel) together and she lives close by. Great, ha? He even lied about hanging out with her recently, again. He says he'd done with her and over her, but then I find emails, pictures, etc. This last time, I saw a picture of them somewhere after he specifically lied about her not even being in that place, when I asked him, he confessed then told me "it wasn't a big deal." Needless to say he blames this whole thing on me, and won't leave me. So I decided to separate and I'm currently in our place till he gets back, then next week I'm moving out. 

Aslo canttrustu, love your siggy!


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## ChknNoodleSoup (Oct 20, 2012)

Thank you for your responses, I'm glad to know. However, I do think fantasizing about strangers is different than about people you know. If he was fantasizing about some hot chick on the street, or on TV, I'd be OK. But to fantasize and "take care of himself" about a woman he likes and sees every day is a no-no for me.


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## canttrustu (Feb 22, 2012)

ChknNoodleSoup said:


> Yes, they work (and travel) together and she lives close by. Great, ha? He even lied about hanging out with her recently, again. He says he'd done with her and over her, but then I find emails, pictures, etc. This last time, I saw a picture of them somewhere after he specifically lied about her not even being in that place, when I asked him, he confessed then told me "it wasn't a big deal." Needless to say he blames this whole thing on me, and won't leave me. So I decided to separate and I'm currently in our place till he gets back, then next week I'm moving out.
> 
> Aslo canttrustu, love your siggy!


that really is a shame. There is NO hope for R as long as there is contact imo. He will never stop the fantasy. Mine wouldnt have either. Had to quit his job to go NC. I feel for you. I know that even though we were attempting to R, it wasnt really getting where it needed to be while he had contact. It took him months to start realizing some of the things he had done and the effect they had. It took mos. for him to realize he was rewriting marital history. He believed things and said things that were FAR from true all because he still had contact and was still fogged out. Still believing his own lies. The lies he'd told himself to justify what he was doing in his own head. NC started in early May- it wasnt until August that the fog was noticeably less and he was starting to see the reality and gravity of his actions. IF you can get him away from HER, you might have a chance. That very well could mean a new job. Mine went 6 mos unemployed but it beat the hell out of the misery of watching him walk out the door and into the fire every morning.


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## canttrustu (Feb 22, 2012)

ChknNoodleSoup said:


> Thank you for your responses, I'm glad to know. However, I do think fantasizing about strangers is different than about people you know. If he was fantasizing about some hot chick on the street, or on TV, I'd be OK. But to fantasize and "take care of himself" about a woman he likes and sees every day is a no-no for me.


And this is why NC is a MUST. He wont stop thinking about her until he's had sufficient time w/o his 'drug'. Its the only way. Is she married? Have you exposed them to their company HR? Cease their 'travels' together. He will not and possibly can not do this on his own. IF you have any hope of saving your marriage you will need to step it up.


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## ChknNoodleSoup (Oct 20, 2012)

canttrustu said:


> And this is why NC is a MUST. He wont stop thinking about her until he's had sufficient time w/o his 'drug'. Its the only way. Is she married? Have you exposed them to their company HR? Cease their 'travels' together. He will not and possibly can not do this on his own. IF you have any hope of saving your marriage you will need to step it up.


I exposed him our parents, and some friends. She's divorced. I thought about HR but my therapist advised me against it. Honestly, this whole thing has turned me off of him. In my view he is a loser and I do not care to make this work anymore. I know that's lame but I hurt too bad for too long to keep this up. And he's constantly lying and rewriting history and the more he tries to find more fault with me the more I'm done with him. He's attacking my core being and he is not worth that much hurt.


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## jaquen (Mar 1, 2012)

ChknNoodleSoup said:


> Question is, is it true? Do loving couples fantasize about others rather than their spouses when they're "taking care of business?" Or is it just one more thing he wants me to feel bad about? Sorry, was young and a virgin when married, so I'm sorry if this sounds like a dumb question.


You would be very, very hard pressed to find a man who only fantasizes about his girlfriend or wife exclusively. That's extremely rare.

For a long time actually the only woman I fantasized about was my lady. And that was made more possible because I use to hardly ever fantasize about sex. And even I knew that was extremely out of the ordinary, and that didn't last. I was frank too about it at some point, and told her that my fantasies include other people now, because I fantasize much more than I use to. She was kinda disappointed, but not mad, and she recognized that she was a little spoiled by my atypical mental solidarity.

However normal, healthy fantasizing doesn't have much to do with this:



ChknNoodleSoup said:


> I said it wasn't OK he had sexual fantasies about the OW and that he masturbated to her (not in person, but he told me he thought of her while doing so)


If my wife cheated on me and then admitted that she still uses the other man as a center of her fantasizes, than my response would be to leave her and let her enjoy that fantasy till her heart's content. That is extremely ugly, and something he should NEVER have told you.


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## 40isthenew20 (Jul 12, 2012)

My entire life, I have always thought of a litany of women while masturbating. Some with each other! Sure, I have also thought of my wife at many times, but guys go through phases. Some days we want a totally different feeling and reaction, so you go to a porn clip that is akin to an ex, or a neighbor, etc. 

It's nothing more than just guys being guys and the perverts we are. Even when I tell my wife that I jerked off about her, she doesn't believe me. She knows that doing that is a release and fantasy type of thing, so it's not a big deal or jealousy issue.


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## canttrustu (Feb 22, 2012)

40isthenew20 said:


> My entire life, I have always thought of a litany of women while masturbating. Some with each other! Sure, I have also thought of my wife at many times, but guys go through phases. Some days we want a totally different feeling and reaction, so you go to a porn clip that is akin to an ex, or a neighbor, etc.
> 
> It's nothing more than just guys being guys and the perverts we are. Even when I tell my wife that I jerked off about her, she doesn't believe me. She knows that doing that is a release and fantasy type of thing, so it's not a big deal or jealousy issue.


And THIS is normal. Completely. But still doing it with OW in mind and telling his W ??? Ouch. Just ouch.

OP- Its completely understandable that you are done. Its a choice and its yours to make. His loss. Peace be with you.


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## kingsfan (Jun 4, 2012)

For me, yes, I do often fantasize about someone else when I masturbate. But that someone else is NEVER someone I know. I usually fantasize about a naked chick I seen in a porn or something and try and put myself in place of the guy that was doing her. To me, masturbation is just a release, no emotional connection, so I just need an image to get off to.

I also find that masturbating to my fiancee doesn't help me because the only reason I'm masturbating is because sex is unavailable for some reason and masturbating to her image just makes me want her more and does little to help curb my actual sexual desire, which is why I'm masturbating in the first place.

Masturbating about someone you know to me is a means to get more emotionally attached to that person. It links them sexually even moreso in your mind. I guess the real question is, does your husband want that (to form a sexual bond with that other person) or not?


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## MaritimeGuy (Jul 28, 2012)

kingsfan said:


> I guess the real question is, does your husband want that (to form a sexual bond with that other person) or not?


I would suggest if at some level he didn't want to have sex with her...thinking about her wouldn't get him erect. 

I agree...at this point he has to remove himself from any contact with her if he has any hopes at all of reconciling with you. Even if he isn't likely to go any further with her it's going to be painful for you to wonder what he is doing when he's around her. No one in a truly comitted relationship wants to put their spouse through that kind of pain.


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## Chris Taylor (Jul 22, 2010)

I read somewhere (is that vague enough?) that most men fantasize about someone they know and most women fantasize about strangers.

Being a guy, I'd say the guy part is correct. I have masturbated to thoughts of my wife, former girlfriends, actresses, co-workers, TAM ladies (OK, just made that up) but if my wife asked, I'd only say I thought about her. Why bring a sh!tstorm on yourself?


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## kingsfan (Jun 4, 2012)

I guess I'm different than you Chris, as I rarely fanasize about my fiancee when i masturbate and she's the only person I know that I can remember fantasizing to.

I do agree though, why bring a sh!tstorm on yourself?


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## MaritimeGuy (Jul 28, 2012)

I think today the majority of men masturbate to porn. Unless they're photoshoping there wifes face onto the model in the movie I think by definition they're masturbating to someone other than their spouse.

Masturbating to the image of an affair partner is an entirely different issue altogether though.


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## Chris Taylor (Jul 22, 2010)

MaritimeGuy said:


> I think today the majority of men masturbate to porn. Unless they're photoshoping there wifes face onto the model in the movie I think by definition they're masturbating to someone other than their spouse.
> 
> Masturbating to the image of an affair partner is an entirely different issue altogether though.


If you're married, maybe with kids, sitting at the computer masturbating to porn isn't that easy. I'm usually in the shower so my mind is the only thing I have.


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## 40isthenew20 (Jul 12, 2012)

canttrustu said:


> And THIS is normal. Completely. But still doing it with OW in mind and telling his W ??? Ouch. Just ouch.
> 
> OP- Its completely understandable that you are done. Its a choice and its yours to make. His loss. Peace be with you.


You misunderstood my comment some. I will tell my wife tst I thought of her, not another woman, but she thinks that I'm just saying that. She's not jealous of my thoughts, I suppose, and has enough self- confidence to not let it bother her that I may masturbste to someone else on a porn clip. 

And why is the OP 'done' in your opinion? She was looking and hoping for something to not worry about (amongst a host of other issues involving her H which need attention) and I and some other guys here just said that jerking off to other women is not the end all.


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## canttrustu (Feb 22, 2012)

40isthenew20 said:


> You misunderstood my comment some. I will tell my wife tst I thought of her, not another woman, but she thinks that I'm just saying that. She's not jealous of my thoughts, I suppose, and has enough self- confidence to not let it bother her that I may masturbste to someone else on a porn clip.
> 
> And why is the OP 'done' in your opinion? She was looking and hoping for something to not worry about (amongst a host of other issues involving her H which need attention) and I and some other guys here just said that *jerking off to other women is not the end all.*


Because she said she cant get him away from OW. That he is questioning her very core. Because SHE said she's done. thats why.




I think doing it while thinking of other women is totally normal. I think doing it while thinking about AP and telling your wife and not having sex with your wife- NOW you have a problem. Her H isnt just doing it to other women, he's doing it while thinking about OW. WAY different...

I think maybe you misread.


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## canttrustu (Feb 22, 2012)

ChknNoodleSoup said:


> Yes, they work (and travel) together and she lives close by. Great, ha? He even lied about hanging out with her recently, again. He says he'd done with her and over her, but then I find emails, pictures, etc. This last time, I saw a picture of them somewhere after he specifically lied about her not even being in that place, when I asked him, he confessed then told me "it wasn't a big deal." Needless to say he blames this whole thing on me, and won't leave me. So I decided to separate and I'm currently in our place till he gets back, then next week I'm moving out.
> 
> Aslo canttrustu, love your siggy!


This is what Im referring to.


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## *LittleDeer* (Apr 19, 2012)

My opinion is that many men do think about other women. However some don't. And some try not to.

In all honesty I used to think bout different men, usually I'd fixate on one for a while, sometimes someone I knew. I have a HD, but I also made that choice. Now I make the choice not to do that, because I personally don't see it as a good thing.

He does not have to think about the other woman. He is making that choice.


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## jaharthur (May 25, 2012)

I'd say there are some pretty clear distinctions here.

Fantasizing about a stranger, or even somebody known but off limits now and forever: OK, at least in my book.

Fantasizing about somebody with whom you've had an affair while you're supposedly attempting reconciliation: Not OK.

Rubbing your spouse's nose in the fact you are fantasizing about the OW: unforgiveable.


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## ChknNoodleSoup (Oct 20, 2012)

Yep and to make it all ever greater, he now decided he wants to not divorce.


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## jaquen (Mar 1, 2012)

ChknNoodleSoup said:


> Yep and to make it all ever greater, he now decided he wants to not divorce.


What he wants is irrelevant.

Are you going to divorce him?


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## ChknNoodleSoup (Oct 20, 2012)

jaquen said:


> What he wants is irrelevant.
> 
> Are you going to divorce him?


85% of me does. That part of me hates him. Hates what he put me through and how he's acting. 10% of me is influenced by fear, parents, family and even love. I feel that if he changes I should wait and that I should hold on to marriage because marriage is about the good and the bad. 5% of me wants this over one way or another.


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## east2west (Oct 19, 2012)

Its not unusual at all. But I'm surprised he told you. I guess he's trying to be truthful. But the truth is not always helpful.


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## firedog1 (Sep 17, 2012)

Don't think it is a male only thing. Women fantasize too. 
He is doing it about a woman he has an affair with is just plain sick! Kick his ass out!


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## Michael A. Brown (Oct 16, 2012)

Try to fix your marriage just for the sake of your kid.


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## kingsfan (Jun 4, 2012)

ChknNoodleSoup said:


> 85% of me does. That part of me hates him. Hates what he put me through and how he's acting. 10% of me is influenced by fear, parents, family and even love. I feel that if he changes I should wait and that I should hold on to marriage because marriage is about the good and the bad. 5% of me wants this over one way or another.


So really 90% of you wants a divorce because the only way this will be over in the short-term is by leaving. If you stay, you will still be left wondering if he's being faithful, if he's stopped talking to this other woman, if they will be another woman, if..., if..., if...

I'd talk to your parents and family, see what they think of the situation. You may find they aren't as opposed to divorce as you think. I know for me part of why I stayed as long as I did was fear that my parents would disown me or something. Turns out they were overly supportive.


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## IndyTMI (Oct 26, 2012)

I masturbated in front of my wife last night while we were watching TV. I told her that watching FoxBusiness while doing so just wasn't doing it for me. She switched the channel over to Bravo and the Housewives of Beverly Hills was on. I told her there was only one of those women that I found attractive, which is Brandi...all of the other women were too superficial or too surgery altered to be a turn on. 
There wasn't enough of her on the screen, so I grabbed my iPad and pulled up some porn. She asked what kind of porn I normally watch, but I didn't reply because I had told her previously what I fantasize about with her...so that is the type of video I normally watch (anal). Because she will not go there, I will not watch that type in front of her.
I proceeded to pleasure myself while watching the video (some little hot Asian chic), looking over at my wife a few times to see her facial expressions...she was smiling gleefully.
I think prior to the past couple of weeks, she would have felt like the OP, but since I have been completely open with her about my sexuality and my wants and needs, she doesn't seem to feel threatened in the least bit...knowing that I fantasize about other women while taking care of business.
But, knowing he was fantasizing about an EA or PA, I do see that as a bit different.


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