# very short version . . .



## heart of darkness (Feb 14, 2014)

of much longer post.

Joined in Feb 2014 to discuss unfinished business/difficulty finding right therapists. Didn't post after that, just lurked at times. Have experienced a lot of trauma in addition to my husband's past infidelity - too difficult to read the stories here sometimes.

Back today because I'm having an extreme reaction to a film I saw 2 days ago - "My Old Lady." Major infidelity plot line, showing how destructive it can be decades later. Having a really difficult time with all the triggers and have pretty much no one to talk to about this. 

Post was really difficult to write, and then it went to moderation, I guess because I hadn't been on for so long. It's been over 6 hours - no idea how long normal review time is. Posted on tech issues forum to ask - that post went through. 

Posting this summary post hoping it will go through and I'll get a response from someone. Really struggling.


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## Forest (Mar 29, 2014)

Hey there, Heart-

I can feel your anxiety thru your post. I understand what you say about something triggering you very strongly. I have a little in common with you, I'd think. In my case I found out 20 years later, and have been struggling hard for almost a year now.

The sense and worry that you're never going to recover is very hard to deal with sometimes. In my case I had a couple positives in that my spouse ended this business, and transformed herself into a better person a long time ago. For many that would be enough to get past the pain, but (so far) not for me.

From reading your prior posts, its unclear how your husband has handled this matter. I can tell you that anything short of full acceptance of culpability-- and true remorse -- would seem to make recovery impossible.

I know you were hoping he would seek counseling. He would have to want this, and institute it himself to seem committed, IMO.
Couples counseling is always good, positive, but what happens between the two of you when you talk is the real nitty-gritty.

You can talk, take pills, read, etc until your mind is numb, but your spouse will have to take the lead to bring you out of the funk. Still, they can only do so much. You attitude also matters greatly. No matter how unfair it all is, you'll still have to come up with strength to carry on.

I'm no poster child for the proper way forward, to be sure. I'm far from good at this, but I've gleaned some insight, anyway.

At any rate, I'm hoping for the best for you. You can handle more than you think. Just don't OVERthink things. Easy said than done.


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## heart of darkness (Feb 14, 2014)

Forest said:


> Hey there, Heart-
> 
> I can feel your anxiety thru your post. I understand what you say about something triggering you very strongly. I have a little in common with you, I'd think. In my case I found out 20 years later, and have been struggling hard for almost a year now.
> 
> ...


Hope I'm doing this reply right - hard to tell.

Thank you for your response, Forest - and for going back to read my earlier posts. In my longer original post from today (which now I guess is completely MIA, although it would be helpful if it still showed up), I wrote some about what has been happening with my husband and me. 

After a huge amount of researching, we started counseling with a "marriage-friendly" therapist. Unfortunately, I don't think she has much experience with infidelity, and I really needed to tell our story and have it witnessed and validated. She kept veering us back to her narrow therapeutic style. After 5 months and over $1,000 in co-pays, very little progress with her. So she's history. Have my own therapist, too, who's supposed to specialize in "trauma" but it feels more like rent-a-friend/write-a-check, and he doesn't seem to listen especially well. SO sick of bloody therapy - for this and plenty of other issues over the years. 

As far as telling the story is concerned, I've asked my husband to start writing it - from two perspectives: what actually happened, and in reverse, as if it had happened to him. That will help - and we won't have to pay somebody to pretend to listen.

My husband has been sincerely remorseful, and genuinely seems to understand the accumulated injuries that his actions have done to me and to our marriage. Some significant collateral damage continues to play a role, and I'm struggling with that, too. One practice that we've started that helps tremendously is that he apologizes to me - once a day, sometimes more often - for some specific way in which he hurt, or frightened, or betrayed me. Usually he volunteers this, sometimes I ask for more, but he's willing. This has made a huge difference.

Wish that other post had shown up - one of the things I mentioned was that I've experienced so much bad stuff that I trigger/experience powerfully sad memories simply from being awake. I've been desperately trying to rebuild new experiences and relationships to help balance and soften the pain, but it's not gone very well. This time of year is filled with anniversaries of loss and trauma, and it overlaps with the holiday season. Triggers are like machine-gun fire.

Even though coming here is hard for me, I think telling the whole story here will be more helpful than what we've attempted with therapists. So I think that's what I'm going to do. A little at a time.

Thanks again for your helpful and friendly reply.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

heart of darkness said:


> of much longer post.
> 
> Joined in Feb 2014 to discuss unfinished business/difficulty finding right therapists. Didn't post after that, just lurked at times. Have experienced a lot of trauma in addition to my husband's past infidelity - too difficult to read the stories here sometimes.
> 
> ...


Sorry you are going through this. This is why I avoid films about infidelity. Triggers and stuff...


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## rustytheboyrobot (Nov 20, 2013)

I have two good friends who will tell me whether or not I should watch any movie. They have the best (but still incomplete) understanding of this type of horror.

I don't know how to avoid the triggers though. They are everywhere. What's worse is that they are nowhere. Nowhere. You can't run from them but you can hide them.

I do a lot of meditation. Go sit in a chair and imagine this. Me saying this to you. Go outside. Or inside. Or sit on a bed. It doesn't matter.

Relax your fingers. Concentrate on nothing else. You are just going to relax those fingers. Then move up, breathing deep, deep and you feel that breath, and then you relax your hands. Make your hands limp. Keep breathing. Then you move to your arms.

You get the idea. I'm not doing well today or I'd offer you more. I do guided meditation in a little local support group. I took yoga classes for about five years. You would not believe how many people literally break down and cry during guided meditation. Just the ability to relax, just a bit, for just a little bit, is so amazing.

Do not watch movies like that. Ever. Get up and leave. Go outside. Meditate. Good luck and I'm sorry you are here with us.


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## drifting on (Nov 22, 2013)

Heartofdarkness

Triggers, had a few of those myself. They are painful and hit you at any given time. Forest preserves, mini vans, a certain name, work, a certain iPhone ringtone, and on and on. I am almost nine months out from d-day and beginning to get anxious about the upcoming holidays. I have had numerous panic attacks thrown in because I didn't have enough triggers apparently. Hope you don't get those as they suck. I have tried to reduce the number of triggers I have. Yeah, that didn't work either. I find its time that helps me with a trigger. Of course a bottle of Jack Daniels seems to help too! Good luck to you.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## heart of darkness (Feb 14, 2014)

Matt Matt - thanks for your supportive response. Living post-infidelity is such a before/after thing. So many reminders of who you were, what your life was before the betrayal, even if they're not powerful triggers. 

I didn't know the film had an infidelity plot line, although I might have gone if I had. More on that in my other replies below.


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## Lancer (Sep 15, 2014)

Unfortunately movies and/or TV shows with an infidelity/affair based plot will often cause triggers. I am not sure if that ever goes away and sometimes it catches you by surprise. Sorry for what you are going through.


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## heart of darkness (Feb 14, 2014)

rustytheboyrobot said:


> I have two good friends who will tell me whether or not I should watch any movie. They have the best (but still incomplete) understanding of this type of horror.
> 
> I don't know how to avoid the triggers though. They are everywhere. What's worse is that they are nowhere. Nowhere. You can't run from them but you can hide them.
> 
> ...


Rusty - thanks for the mini guided meditation. I have alot of experience with this modality, going all the way back to the late 80s when I was doing adult children of alcoholics work during the breakup of my first marriage. I continued to do guided imagery, etc for years, during other periods of crisis and loss. For a long time, it helped a lot. 

At this point, not so much. Partly because doing the same recordings/exercises that I'd done previously are now unhappily associated with unexpected outcomes, lost relationships, etc. And anything with words in it tends to just give my mind more to chew on.

I've had insomnia for 4 years, and I sometimes do progressive relaxation, which helps a little. At this point, the only recordings that work are things like ambient music, delta waves - things that don't tap into the memory banks but just work on a more visceral level. 

Yoga - sigh. I did it off and on for years - at one point into restorative yoga with all the props and things. But I've actually had several grief associations with yoga classes, and a couple of really inappropriate, callous remarks from instructors. So much for "namaste." I was getting the opposite of what I'd gone into it for. I still have the all the restorative stuff, so maybe someday I can begin to do this on my own at home. Right now I'm processing so much trauma that I'm not ready to go there yet.

I wish my original post had shown up because it explained more. There are a lot of life experiences that are hard to for me to watch in a play, film or TV show. Infidelity is just one of them. But sometimes I watch because it's validating, if the story is presented in a supportive way that doesn't dismiss or justify. Generally, though, infidelity is the hardest story line to watch, and I do mostly avoid those. Already planning to NOT see Gone Girl, based on a single line in a review I read.

But I didn't know this about My Old Lady, and the triggering wasn't immediate, especially because the film so clearly showed the decades-long effects on other people. Maggie Smith's character was mostly portrayed as self-absorbed and in huge denial/rationalization about the massive damage her behavior had done to her own daughter and her lover's son. Also, I was with a new group of women through a social network I just joined, and since I wasn't feeling overwhelmed yet, I wasn't so uncomfortable that I had to leave.

I was thinking of this as an excellent "teachable moment," not just about infidelity, but about how destructive family secrets are, about how parental abandonment/emotional abuse can affect children their entire lives. I'm living with that myself, and I have a disabled sister who is the way she is because of our dysfunctional family and a lifetime of inadequate care and support. I'm also the same age as the Kline's character. So there was a whole lot of stuff going on for me in this movie.

What I think caused the triggers and feeling completely overwhelmed by them was when I went online looking for reviews, expecting that most of them would get what I described above. The reviews have potentially more power to influence and change social perceptions than the films themselves. Not everyone is going to see the movie, but lots of people take 5 minutes to read a review - and THAT'S what they're going to remember. With virtually everything that's published being online forever, the POV of the reviews could be what shapes public consciousness of issues more than the films.

So I was completely demoralized to find that so many of the reviews didn't get it. I understand that critics are going to have their own opinions, but the commentary was as much about the social issues as the artistic ones. There were a few that nailed it. Some didn't get it at all. But the ones that both made my brain implode and aggravated the triggers were the ones that clearly acknowledged the extent and length of the trauma, neglect, and abuse that these characters experienced - and then proceeded to bash them for their pain and brokenness. I felt a kind of universal invalidation for my own experience, the characters in the film, and every one who's ever been abused as a child or betrayed as an adult.

Other than my sister, I had no one to talk to about this. More on why I'm so isolated when I can tell my story. So as the weekend went on, I was feeling worse and worse. My husband was camping (yes, he really was) so he wasn't here, either. By the time my original post went AWOL, I was not in a good state.

Anyway, finally put up the short version post, and got these responses, which helped alot. Thanks again for your compassion and suggestions.


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## heart of darkness (Feb 14, 2014)

drifting on said:


> Heartofdarkness
> 
> Triggers, had a few of those myself. They are painful and hit you at any given time. Forest preserves, mini vans, a certain name, work, a certain iPhone ringtone, and on and on. I am almost nine months out from d-day and beginning to get anxious about the upcoming holidays. I have had numerous panic attacks thrown in because I didn't have enough triggers apparently. Hope you don't get those as they suck. I have tried to reduce the number of triggers I have. Yeah, that didn't work either. I find its time that helps me with a trigger. Of course a bottle of Jack Daniels seems to help too! Good luck to you.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Yeah, they are everywhere, and you can only do so much to avoid/reduce them. I have a bunch of stuff in my house - mostly papers that need to be sorted, tossed, filed. I literally can't go through them except in very small batches because of all the reminders. Some to do with the infidelity, some from other things that just turned out very bad.

For a long time in my life, time did help with the effect that trauma and loss had on me. But eventually the trauma bucket kept filling up, and now even old wounds have more power than they used to. Because they all resonate in the same places - the need to feel connected, the need to feel safe, the need to be heard and validated, and the need for identity. That last one's really powerful, I've found, because we all need our identities to be ones that we've chosen, not ones that have been thrust on us. And there's only so much you can consciously do to spin that.

I do have severe anxiety - showed up 4 years ago when the insomnia did. I need medication for it. I don't have Jack Daniels, but yeah, I do need to reach for a glass of wine or drink at times to take the edge off. Don't know if I've ever had an outright panic attack, but it's felt awfully close. Sorry you're struggling with this, too. Thanks for the response - hearing from supportive people has really helped.


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## Hardtohandle (Jan 10, 2013)

I would imagine your original post was pushed down by the number of replies to other threads that bumped them up above your original post..

I would keep everything to one thread and just make it this one. 

Here is your Original posts:

First Post



> I have been reading this site for awhile, but finally registered today.
> 
> My story is long and complicated, and I don't have the emotional or mental energy to try to tell it all right now. Short version: my husband is the cheating spouse, stuck deep in rationalization and denial. He really does believe his own skewed version of the truth, including outright lies. Plenty of gaslighting, blame-shifting, and trickle-truth. Even though we are working on restoring our marriage and making some progress, he's got a foot in both worlds. Sometimes he is clear-headed and loving; other times, it's all no-accountability-it's-her-fault delusions. I am suffering beyond description.
> 
> ...


Second post


> Dang- almost done with new post then clicked out of it somehow. Hope it didn't go to mods. Will try to reconstruct.
> 
> Sorry for long delay in checking back. Appreciate responses here and in PMs. Husband NOT currently unfaithful, but was close to. Continue to make progress. More loving behavior, apologies, fewer outbursts. Still in rationalization fog, but not as much as a month ago.
> 
> ...


Third Post


> know I'm new here. I understand that my reluctance to share more details about my situation may make people suspicious about me or my veracity. I am not a troll, not a plant. I am exactly what I said in my prior posts.
> 
> My husband has shared his skewed version of the "truth" - I can't even call it that, because it's so NOT the reality - with many people over the years. The pattern is he tells a lie, distortion, or partial story that makes him the victim, me the problem. Other people respond "poor you" and believe him without challenging anything he says. Often there are obvious holes in his story, and the other people know enough of our history that they should be asking some questions. Nope, they swallow it all, he gets heard and validated, which reinforces the lies to the point that he begins to believe them.
> 
> ...


Fourth Post


> Originally Posted by beautiful_day View Post
> I simply went to my family doctor and asked for a recommendation for a therapist. They have lists - and this was in a very rural area.
> 
> Your husband's behavior sounds very familiar to me. I completely understand how you feel - I put up with it for 6 years, desperately trying to make our marriage work and all the time he and his girlfriend were sneaking around and plotting behind my back. Meanwhile, I was losing my mind because I was being so severely gaslighted.


Your response to that post


> Thank you for your response. Over the years, I have sought referrals for therapists - sometimes related to infidelity, sometimes for other issues - from MDs, other therapists, websites. I have made phone calls - sometimes a therapist will talk to me, sometimes a gatekeeper blocks the way. Even a couple of the ones I spoke to turned out to have misrepresented themselves once I got in their office.
> 
> So from much personal experience with BAD therapists (not just for infidelity), and from reading sites like this one, I know how critical it is to find the right support for infidelity. The FAQ on the marriage-friendly therapist link above was very clear about how many professionals have few qualifications to adequately counsel couples, regardless of what issues they're facing. Even if my doctor had a "list" I'd still have to vet them, ask very specific questions about their experience, etc - and then cross my fingers.
> 
> I cannot, due to my concerns about the toxic friends, reveal more about my history except to say that it doesn't mirror yours. (And I'm sorry for what you experienced, BTW.) I hope to get to the point where I feel comfortable sharing more here. My focus, and my husband's, are on repairing - with the right professional help. He's less in rationalization/fog mode, but ongoing progress needs an experienced couples counselor, who can address all our issues.


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## heart of darkness (Feb 14, 2014)

Lancer said:


> Unfortunately movies and/or TV shows with an infidelity/affair based plot will often cause triggers. I am not sure if that ever goes away and sometimes it catches you by surprise. Sorry for what you are going through.


Yeah, you don't realize how widespread these storylines are until you have these responses to them. They don't always affect me, except maybe a moment's discomfort, especially if the POV is anti-infidelity, the characters get a comeuppance, etc. If it's presented as normal/no big deal, that's when it's harder to watch.


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## Hardtohandle (Jan 10, 2013)

You can run a internet in private browsing.. It will not record or keep track of anything you do.. It is commonly called the Porn button.. 

For example on Google Chrome Internet Browser, under Files it is called *New Incognito Window*..

For Safari it is called* Private Browsing*..

All browsers have this option.

The reason it came up in your searches is because the browser tracks and retains history of what you did.. If you searched on a different browser than the one you posted on, it will not come up or shouldn't unless it is popular and getting google bombed. I don't see that happening either.

How long ago was the affair ?
How long did it last before you found out ?


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## heart of darkness (Feb 14, 2014)

hardtohandle - 

Thanks for going back and quoting my "original" original posts. It will be helpful to have some backstory all in one thread, as you said.

Sorry if it was confusing, but yesterday, since I hadn't posted in so long, the "original" post I referred to was one that I wrote about my triggering response to the film and tried to post yesterday. It went to moderation, and never showed up.

I've pretty much reconstructed that post in my responses here, so I think it's okay at this point.

Sorry again for any confusion, and thanks for your help with bringing my initial story into the thread.


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## harrybrown (May 22, 2013)

Sorry for your pain. 

Time (years of time) are helping to dull the pain some.

Doing things for me, like exercise helps with my attitude. (some days the anger is way out of control) However some days are better than others.

But you can't fix this my yourself. You do need the one that caused the pain to be helpful and supportive. I am hoping that your H will do what he can to be so much help. 

I do hope you find a good counselor. If you do, let us know how to get in touch with that counselor.

Hoping you will have better days.


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## Forest (Mar 29, 2014)

Triggers, triggers everywhere. 

I am currently on my 3rd TV remote after smashing a couple due to adulterous story lines on otherwise fine BBC-type series off Netflix. Its just everywhere.

The last one was about 3 weeks ago after hearing a woman deliver the old "I never meant to hurt you" line.


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## Q tip (Apr 15, 2014)

Forest said:


> Triggers, triggers everywhere.
> 
> I am currently on my 3rd TV remote after smashing a couple due to adulterous story lines on otherwise fine BBC-type series off Netflix. Its just everywhere.
> 
> The last one was about 3 weeks ago after hearing a woman deliver the old "I never meant to hurt you" line.


Well at least you did not hit the window while inside the car in the driveway...


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## heart of darkness (Feb 14, 2014)

Hello to all the friendly and supportive people here,

Sorry to have started this thread and then not shown up for a week. Had ANOTHER, completely unexpected triggering event with another film last Monday (Oct 13). I walked in prepared to be disturbed by the religious aspect (as it was billed), and was completely blindsided by the MULTIPLE infidelity storyline. And the infidelity was mostly treated as a comedy - people were laughing. Fortunately, it was a short (20 min.), so my husband and I hightailed it out of there. I was very upset at being hit with this TWO times in THREE days, and my husband's behavior afterwards didn't help. He was sympathetic and supportive when he heard about my experience with "My Old Lady". But this time, after some minimal sympathy, he checked out. I confronted, he reacted, and it was a very bad night.

He has apologized since then, but I'm still feeling worn out. I really need an absence of additional trauma, especially with my lifelong history and the many anniversary events around this season of the year. 

My energy and trauma triggers have put me in lower-functioning-than-usual mode. Just didn't have the stamina to come back here last week.

I see that my original post on this issue - the one that disappeared into moderation - has been posted and bumped by a mod so that it's on the first page (thank you, mods). Title of that post is *"just saw film "My Old Lady" - now triggering like mad" *. It's a long post, and because it was MIA a lot of what I said in that post shows up here in some of my responses. Sorry for the repetition.

I still have to respond to some people here, but that's not going to happen today. I will try to get back on here more regularly over the next several days - even though just reading the stories, let alone telling my own, creates as much trauma/anxiety as it relieves.


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## Thor (Oct 31, 2011)

I watch nearly no regular tv due to triggers. There was one on the sitcom Big Bang Theory a couple of weeks ago and I had to walk away half way through. Movies I check out the plot online before watching, but sometimes get surprised.

Anyhow, heart of darkness I suggest a trauma therapist for you. You have PTSD symptoms but they don't officially call it that because you didn't witness or experience a violent act. PTSD techniques may be what you need to overcome things. EMDR therapy is reportedly very effective for some people.

I also wonder if some mild anti-anxiety or anti-depression therapy would be helpful. I always recommend the book "The Mood Cure" for some cheap, effective, safe nutritional remedies. Things like amino acids and vitamins, which in the right combinations and timing can be very very effective.


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