# Too harsh with moocher siblings?



## sahtrader (Dec 19, 2017)

I guess I have my fair share of financial issues. My husband wants a career that's traditionally low paying and I'm trying to ensure our family stays afloat financially in the long run. Now there's another problem. I have two moocher siblings. One has been mooching off her now deceased husband and now moves from place to place depending on who is gullible enough to let her live with them. She knows I'll never take her in because she refuses to work and wants someone to take care of her 100%. Last month, a brother who has been in state care since he was 13, tells me that he went to court and received approval for being his own guardian. Basically, he got the right to get out of state care and be on his own. That's an accomplishment but he is really in no shape to provide for himself or even his own medication. He has schizophrenia, Asperger's, and the list goes on. He does not have the proper paperwork to get a job, or so he says, and it would take weeks or even years to get it. I think he's lying about the paperwork. He's just looking for someone to take care of him 100% like my sister is doing to her gullible friends. Since I'm the most well off, my brother thinks it's ok to respond in a nasty way, when I told him that he cannot move in with us. Even with my own financial issues, the thought crossed my mind to at least help him with food, but it's plain to me that he sees me like an ATM. I'm thinking of my husband and daughter when I refused to help him at all after he blew up at me for telling him he cannot move in with us. Think I'm being too harsh by not helping him at all?


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## happy as a clam (Jan 5, 2014)

Nope. Not too harsh.

It’s not your responsibility to provide shelter and financial assistance for adult siblings. Maybe a one-off situation (car repair, unexpected bill, etc.) you could assist with a small amount if he’s in dire straits, but not regular money funneling to him. 

If he can’t provide for himself and take care of his own needs, back to the state care facility he goes!


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## Andy1001 (Jun 29, 2016)

sahtrader said:


> I guess I have my fair share of financial issues. My husband wants a career that's traditionally low paying and I'm trying to ensure our family stays afloat financially in the long run. Now there's another problem. I have two moocher siblings. One has been mooching off her now deceased husband and now moves from place to place depending on who is gullible enough to let her live with them. She knows I'll never take her in because she refuses to work and wants someone to take care of her 100%. Last month, a brother who has been in state care since he was 13, tells me that he went to court and received approval for being his own guardian. Basically, he got the right to get out of state care and be on his own. That's an accomplishment but he is really in no shape to provide for himself or even his own medication. He has schizophrenia, Asperger's, and the list goes on. He does not have the proper paperwork to get a job, or so he says, and it would take weeks or even years to get it. I think he's lying about the paperwork. He's just looking for someone to take care of him 100% like my sister is doing to her gullible friends. Since I'm the most well off, my brother thinks it's ok to respond in a nasty way, when I told him that he cannot move in with us. Even with my own financial issues, the thought crossed my mind to at least help him with food, but it's plain to me that he sees me like an ATM. I'm thinking of my husband and daughter when I refused to help him at all after he blew up at me for telling him he cannot move in with us. Think I'm being too harsh by not helping him at all?


Your husband and your siblings seem to think that you are a walking ATM.Between your husband wanting to suddenly become a farmer while you continue to work and look after your child and now two mooching siblings on the scene you must be exhausted dealing with them.
What you need to do is look after yourself and your child and make it clear to your husband that he either shapes up or ships out.
As for your siblings,don’t give them a dime and under no circumstances allow either of them to move in,they will never leave.


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## lifeistooshort (Mar 17, 2013)

I have lots of experience with mooching siblings.....both of mine are like that.

Do yourself a favor.....do not get involved with these bums. Getting rid of them is not easy.....learn from my experience. I know it's hard but moochers have a different world view.....my sisters think that because I have something and they don't they're entitled to it. Never mind that I have two degrees that I paid for myself and take my rear end to work every day while they partied and acted like bums, they're entitled to benefit from my work.

Nope. 

Don't go there.

I have been asked why I turned out so different then my sisters.....I think it's because I don't think the world owes me anything. They they they are owed and thus get pissed off when the world doesn't deliver.


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## sahtrader (Dec 19, 2017)

Not too harsh. Good to know. I was the gullible sister helping my brother, until one day I realized that he was a pro at laying on the guilt thick to get what he wants. Have not helped him since. I wonder why I did not turn out like them too. My brother and sister don't care about the hard work I put into accomplishing things. For them, if we share the same blood, the ones that are "poor" have the right to take from the rich. Who cares if the "rich" one only has one more dollar than they do. They're still entitled to 5 of the rich ones dollars.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

How old are your brother and your sister?

Why isn't your brother on SSI or some other disability income program?


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

Yes, oh yes!

They lived with us, mooched off us. My wife never could say no. Her relatives, not mine.
Mine delivered indifference or envy.

Her's delivered a smile and an open hand. 

It was The Martian in me that held this at bay. I resisted full out surrender.
We housed them, fed them, lent them money, now lost.

I was never selfish, money flowed in. It flowed in because I worked two or three jobs, my wife too, worked long hours.

In the end, it stopped.
Because?
They moved to warmer climes.....or they died.

I am not bitter. Not a bit. 
But I would have been richer in old age by a third.

SunCMars-


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## TBT (Dec 20, 2011)

This may also be exacerbated by your feelings of being,as you've said in your other thread,a 'milk cow' in your marriage.


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## DTO (Dec 18, 2011)

Agreed, especially if he has all those health issues. Your limited ability to provide plus his seeming ungratefulness is a bad combination. What happens for living expenses if he can't get / keep a job? (And will anyone even hire someone so young, emancipated or not?) What if he has higher than usual medical bills?



happy as a clam said:


> Nope. Not too harsh.
> 
> It’s not your responsibility to provide shelter and financial assistance for adult siblings. Maybe a one-off situation (car repair, unexpected bill, etc.) you could assist with a small amount if he’s in dire straits, but not regular money funneling to him.
> 
> If he can’t provide for himself and take care of his own needs, back to the state care facility he goes!


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## Pam (Oct 7, 2010)

My brother convinced our aging mother to make him joint on all her accounts; in fact, she outright gave him one checking account. Since she never let me see her bank statements, it took a few years for me to catch on (when at tax time, the balance was the same as the year before, even though she had a steady income). I demanded to also be made joint so that I could see what was going on; begged and pleaded with him to stop spending her money, he promised and kept right on. I finally told him that if he wrote one. more. check. I would prosecute him for Elder Abuse. He stopped, but still would call and tell me he needed to come get money from Mom quite frequently. I always said no. Then he was diagnosed with Alzheimer's and now I don't think he remembers what a check is.


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## sahtrader (Dec 19, 2017)

My decision has been made. I was not being too harsh to not take any of my siblings in. Especially since there is not a whole lot of extra money to go around. In fact, I decided to cut off all contact with the schizophrenic sibling after he barraged me with death threats and accusations. Not to mention, let law enforcement know what's going on. I did not want to take him in. The state probably got tired of taking care of him and released him from custody. Thanks all for your help.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

sahtrader said:


> I guess I have my fair share of financial issues. My husband wants a career that's traditionally low paying and I'm trying to ensure our family stays afloat financially in the long run. Now there's another problem. I have two moocher siblings. One has been mooching off her now deceased husband and now moves from place to place depending on who is gullible enough to let her live with them. She knows I'll never take her in because she refuses to work and wants someone to take care of her 100%. Last month, a brother who has been in state care since he was 13, tells me that he went to court and received approval for being his own guardian. Basically, he got the right to get out of state care and be on his own. That's an accomplishment but he is really in no shape to provide for himself or even his own medication. He has schizophrenia, Asperger's, and the list goes on. He does not have the proper paperwork to get a job, or so he says, and it would take weeks or even years to get it. I think he's lying about the paperwork. He's just looking for someone to take care of him 100% like my sister is doing to her gullible friends. Since I'm the most well off, my brother thinks it's ok to respond in a nasty way, when I told him that he cannot move in with us. Even with my own financial issues, the thought crossed my mind to at least help him with food, but it's plain to me that he sees me like an ATM. I'm thinking of my husband and daughter when I refused to help him at all after he blew up at me for telling him he cannot move in with us. Think I'm being too harsh by not helping him at all?


You seem to have an issue with this. Was one of your parents an alcoholic? You most likely married someone a lot like one of your parents; we all do. And children of alcoholics usually either learn to become the Giver or learn to become the Taker (like the alcoholic).

fwiw, you are correct in telling your brother you can't help him. If he thinks he's capable of being on his how, well, he needs to be on his own. What you CAN do is, after he has shown himself capable of caring for himself, surprise him with a care basket now and then. Nothing he can depend on, though. 

I know it's tough to say no, but honestly, saying no IS helping him. Stand firm.


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

lifeistooshort said:


> I have lots of experience with mooching siblings.....both of mine are like that.
> 
> Do yourself a favor.....do not get involved with these bums. Getting rid of them is not easy.....learn from my experience. I know it's hard but moochers have a different world view.....my sisters think that because I have something and they don't they're entitled to it. Never mind that I have two degrees that I paid for myself and take my rear end to work every day while they partied and acted like bums, they're entitled to benefit from my work.
> 
> ...


I attribute that, this, to over indulgent parents.
Parents who give them everything, expect nothing in return, such as good grades, proper behavior.

Now this hypothesis is not a given but common. At least from my perspective.
Gawd, I pity my grandkids, them having to face the world after been, uh, royally indulged....sheeesh.

The other thing of note, facing children, children of broken homes, one parent, being weak, or on alcohol or drugs. Most of these children follow suit, never rise to the occasion, likely the
cocaine-shun. Out of their bunch, oddly, one will excel. Who da' thunk?

I arose out of the second group. 
Being a child of WWII veterans and drunks. But, we did have two parents, as screwed up as they were.
My siblings all suffered, I did the best. Huh? What? :smile2:


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

sahtrader said:


> Not too harsh. Good to know. I was the gullible sister helping my brother, until one day I realized that he was a pro at laying on the guilt thick to get what he wants.


Have you ever watched Chicago Med? Great show, but the point is that there are a brother and sister on that show. The older sister is a nurse. She worked to help pay his way through medical school. But he's a moocher. And a horrible doctor. Because he's goofed his way through his whole life. She's having trouble with her boyfriend now because he wants her to stop enabling her brother, but she's all 'but we're family!' and meanwhile the brother is coming close to killing people. 

But the reason I bring it up is watching HOW he does it. He's so smooth in his way of getting his sister (or anyone else) to do his work for him. You should go back and watch the show.


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## wxman3441 (Aug 30, 2012)

This really hits home. My partner has 3 siblings, aged 37, 24 and 21. Nice people and good to me but they are more concerned with getting their hands on booze, smokes, pot and drugs than making good financial choices. My partner fairly often bails them out with 20 bucks here and there and my partner's mother's bf pays for things like car insurance and registration. It's insane.


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## ChargingCharlie (Nov 14, 2012)

Hits home with me as well. My wife has an older sister who is a mooch and a drama queen. She's "borrowed" several thousand from us (with promises to repay it, which she hasn't done and it's been around five years). She's also "borrowed" from her parents, who don't have a whole lot, and my wife ended up having to pay a large bill for her parents because they didn't have the cash to pay it at the time (to be fair to her parents, they don't know that we paid it, and they would be upset if they found out - they would have had the cash if they didn't "loan" the money). There's more, but not going to go into the rest. 

Needless to say, you're not being too harsh.


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## Taxman (Dec 21, 2016)

Believe you me, we have been barraged by my wife's sister. Her marriage ended in four months. Combination of her mental illness coupled with her marrying the Momma's boy from hell. So, for four weeks after the marriage, he mentally abused the crap out of her, then dumped her on my in-laws driveway, let her know he was keeping the wedding presents (and that was massive, over 300 at the wedding...my FIL was livid). So, she acts out shortly thereafter, and her psychiatrist commits her to a psych ward. It gets better...First week on the ward, it's mother's day, and the floor is quiet. The two junior nurses they had watching the floor that morning decided to take a coffee break. SIL finds the door unlocked, and is flying on anti-psychotic meds. She exits the floor, and the hospital, nobody notices a mid 20's nearly naked woman walking down a major street on a Sunday morning. She walks down into a subway station, walks right past the ticket taker, who was dozing in his booth. Gets to track level, and slides herself down onto the tracks. Subway motorman approaching the station notices that she is on the tracks and hits the emergency stop. The subway slides, superheating the wheels. The train amputates her right leg at the hip, the grease and heat cauterize the wound. She is permanently disabled, and immediately, her psychosis goes into overdrive. She has been in and out of care for the last few decades. Problematically, she has demanded to be taken into her siblings' homes. Every attempt to have her reside with a sibling has ended badly. She is somewhat physically capable, however, demands to be catered to hand and foot 24/7. She has demanded that siblings quit their jobs or sell their businesses to care for her, and consequently, she demands cash, only to fritter it away within hours, then will demand its replacement. She has been living in a series of half-way houses and hospitals, however, she will demand on a weekly basis to be moved to either another half way or one of our homes. She has been put on allowances, and then when she has given it away to other patients, she demands to take more. The verbal abuse is amazing. I have been called MF more times than I can count. My wife, her older brother and kid sister grow ever wearier of going through this on a near daily basis. We put our foot down last week. She was given her allowance for a week, and promptly gave it to her roommate for cigarettes. As we were a half block away, my cell goes off. "I just gave everything to XXXX, you need to come back and give me more." To which I replied, "You got your money for the week, and you pissed it away, so see you next week." I got a long scream and was called an MF again. I replied, "Learn to live without, it will do you some good, and if you call and ask again, I will miss next week."


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## MaiChi (Jun 20, 2018)

It is totally disabling to just be taken over by someone else and housed, fed and clothed without a general progress plan in place. It means the cared for would lose all incentive to mature as an adult and be in charge of themselves. Best to ask what the long term plan is and what short term investment is required to realise that plan, then how much is your contribution to your plan and what is the shortfall? Help with the shortfall if you can. If you cannot then the plan is wrong, back to planning and come up with a more viable plan. 

For 6 years I told my sibling who had land to just grow a cash crop and that he would be rich in less than 18 months. He dismissed me as giving useless advice and him and wife wanted donations from us. 

Four years ago he started growing things on his 6 acre place. Today he is so rich he has built a new house, has two trucks, is supplying a who veg market with fresh produce almost daily. people come and buy truckloads of stuff. Now he says I did not push him hard enough for six years. Its my fault either way. But I am happy now that he gives me money here and there.


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## Betrayedone (Jan 1, 2014)

Taxman said:


> Believe you me, we have been barraged by my wife's sister. Her marriage ended in four months. Combination of her mental illness coupled with her marrying the Momma's boy from hell. So, for four weeks after the marriage, he mentally abused the crap out of her, then dumped her on my in-laws driveway, let her know he was keeping the wedding presents (and that was massive, over 300 at the wedding...my FIL was livid). So, she acts out shortly thereafter, and her psychiatrist commits her to a psych ward. It gets better...First week on the ward, it's mother's day, and the floor is quiet. The two junior nurses they had watching the floor that morning decided to take a coffee break. SIL finds the door unlocked, and is flying on anti-psychotic meds. She exits the floor, and the hospital, nobody notices a mid 20's nearly naked woman walking down a major street on a Sunday morning. She walks down into a subway station, walks right past the ticket taker, who was dozing in his booth. Gets to track level, and slides herself down onto the tracks. Subway motorman approaching the station notices that she is on the tracks and hits the emergency stop. The subway slides, superheating the wheels. The train amputates her right leg at the hip, the grease and heat cauterize the wound. She is permanently disabled, and immediately, her psychosis goes into overdrive. She has been in and out of care for the last few decades. Problematically, she has demanded to be taken into her siblings' homes. Every attempt to have her reside with a sibling has ended badly. She is somewhat physically capable, however, demands to be catered to hand and foot 24/7. She has demanded that siblings quit their jobs or sell their businesses to care for her, and consequently, she demands cash, only to fritter it away within hours, then will demand its replacement. She has been living in a series of half-way houses and hospitals, however, she will demand on a weekly basis to be moved to either another half way or one of our homes. She has been put on allowances, and then when she has given it away to other patients, she demands to take more. The verbal abuse is amazing. I have been called MF more times than I can count. My wife, her older brother and kid sister grow ever wearier of going through this on a near daily basis. We put our foot down last week. She was given her allowance for a week, and promptly gave it to her roommate for cigarettes. As we were a half block away, my cell goes off. "I just gave everything to XXXX, you need to come back and give me more." To which I replied, "You got your money for the week, and you pissed it away, so see you next week." I got a long scream and was called an MF again. I replied, "Learn to live without, it will do you some good, and if you call and ask again, I will miss next week."


WOW, just WOW!


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## msrv23 (Jul 14, 2017)

As someone who has an entitled sibling, their entitlement can be like a black hole as long as the entitlement itself isn’t fixed. The more you help, the more they’d ask and the day you say no is the day they hate you and call you names.

I have a brother with BPD traits, and despite our relationship being rocky in the past as we were never close, he often asked for small favors and help. Occasionally there is a bit of money involved but not much.
Then once he asked for a loan. If it was something important I’d be willing to help but it was for a gadget and I said no. He had a job by then.
My husband convinced me to say yes as last time as he will mature so I said yes. We ended up having to ask for the last few pays that were missing and he thought we were making a fuss instead of just giving as family. Later my husband told me how he complained and called me names while the two of them were contracting the loan at a store.

I’m also the one who got a better life, because I persisted and worked hard. He had his chances but often opted for easiest paths.
Deep down he is insecure about my success and projected the inferiority to us. Once he and my husband had a conflict and despite me agreeing with my husband I avoided taking sides. What happened was that he wanted me to side with him, saying how my husband is not family and he is my brother and proceeded to stop talking to us for a long time. It was not even a big deal, but that’s the thing about entitlement and BPD. Everything is a huge deal and I either am on his side to give him everything or I’m hated.

It’s hard to create boundaries and say no to a sibling. But we must have boundaries. If the other person can’t respect it, the relationship is one sided anyways. Sometimes there is just no point in trying harder to mKe things fine. Better live our lives happily with boundaries then being dragged into toxicity.


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## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

We have a moocher sibling but my W and I do not assist. She has lost the family home, not worked a regular job in 25 years and works the system for monthly government checks. Every conversations ends with, "I need money." We are sorry, but if you are not helping yourself to get on your feet then we can not help you. If you are working hard to get going and simply down on your luck then we help. 


We have no qualm saying no. Seem harsh but we are not the Bank of Siblings and Loans.


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## ChargingCharlie (Nov 14, 2012)

Yeswecan said:


> We have a moocher sibling but my W and I do not assist. She has lost the family home, not worked a regular job in 25 years and works the system for monthly government checks. Every conversations ends with, "I need money." We are sorry, but if you are not helping yourself to get on your feet then we can not help you. If you are working hard to get going and simply down on your luck then we help.
> 
> 
> We have no qualm saying no. Seem harsh but we are not the Bank of Siblings and Loans.


This is excellent. I wish my wife would know how to say no. Her sister blames her problems on either her multiple ex-husbands or her many former employers - of course it's not her fault. Our problem is that my wife is for some reason deathly afraid of upsetting her sister. The joke that her brother and I have is that we don't want to win the lottery, as then that sister will have both hands out every day, and on top of that she'll post it all over social media (she's a Facebook queen).


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## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

ChargingCharlie said:


> This is excellent. I wish my wife would know how to say no. Her sister blames her problems on either her multiple ex-husbands or her many former employers - of course it's not her fault. Our problem is that my wife is for some reason deathly afraid of upsetting her sister. The joke that her brother and I have is that we don't want to win the lottery, as then that sister will have both hands out every day, and on top of that she'll post it all over social media (she's a Facebook queen).


Got to learn to say no and if feelings are hurt so be it. Some people will take advantage and play on "we are family" crap. No sir. My W would get so upset talking with her sister on the phone. I eventually said she needs to stop talking to her sister as the upset is not worth it. My W cut her off. Best thing she every did. That was 20 years ago. Her sister still comes sucking around every now and then. And much like your SIL...every ill she suffered is do due someone else and that someone else owes her. I still can not figure out how my SIL got the state we live in to pay her electric bill that was $1200.00. She can work the system. Professional!


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## Rocky Mountain Yeti (Apr 23, 2017)

It may be possible to be too harsh with honest, hardworking, dedicated, and competent family members who suddenly and inexplicably through no fault of their own find themselves in a temporarily untenable situation...

.... but that is exceedingly rare, and not what you are facing.

As you said yourself, they are "moochers." It is quite impossible to be too harsh with a moocher. There is no such thing as too harsh with a moocher.... they are deserving of nothing more than a swift 2x4 upside the head.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

Andy1001 said:


> Your husband and your siblings seem to think that you are a walking ATM.Between your husband wanting to suddenly become a farmer while you continue to work and look after your child and now two mooching siblings on the scene you must be exhausted dealing with them.
> What you need to do is look after yourself and your child and make it clear to your husband that he either shapes up or ships out.
> As for your siblings,don’t give them a dime and under no circumstances allow either of them to move in,they will never leave.


What is wrong with being a farmer? Its a pretty important job surely? Also many wives have to work as well.


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## personofinterest (Apr 6, 2018)

Diana7 said:


> Andy1001 said:
> 
> 
> > Your husband and your siblings seem to think that you are a walking ATM.Between your husband wanting to suddenly become a farmer while you continue to work and look after your child and now two mooching siblings on the scene you must be exhausted dealing with them.
> ...


He knows nothing about it. It's some wild-haired fantasy.

Just read some of the other threads.


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## phillybeffandswiss (Jan 20, 2013)

Diana7 said:


> What is wrong with being a farmer? Its a pretty important job surely? Also many wives have to work as well.


He knows this, but the OP's husband is who Andy is addressing, not farmers in general.


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## Andy1001 (Jun 29, 2016)

Diana7 said:


> What is wrong with being a farmer? Its a pretty important job surely? Also many wives have to work as well.


 @Diana, farming is one of the hardest jobs imaginable. Every day experienced farmers are going to the wall,losing farms which have taken generations to build up. My own family in Ireland farm in a small way and it’s not viable unless you also have a full time job.
This guy hasn’t the faintest idea of what is involved,especially with regards to animals. Seven days a week.Animals require care every day,not just Monday to Friday. 
And if he’s thinking of growing crops,the investment needed in land,machinery and fertilizer is frightening. 
For someone to just decide to be a farmer because he likes the idea is equivalent to your local taxi driver deciding to race his car in formula one at Silverstone.
He can try but he’s going to fail.


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