# update



## oxygene

Ok, so after lots of thinking I decided to take on board alot of the advice that has been given in response to my first post yesterday. In my head I have accepted that if she will not change immediately I will have the strength to end it; I've also already spoken to a theropist (for my sake, not a marriage councilor yet).

Yesterday I took the kids to my parents to look after for a while and sat down with my wife. I made sure I was calm, I told her I need a wife and my kids need a family unit, but not at any cost. I told her how it's made me feel and the feelings if betrayal I feel. I told her unless contact with C ends right now it is over, she told me she needs to make sure he's ok and to let her ring him. I told her in no uncertain terms making contact with him of any kind is unacceptable, it's total darkness or it will be over.

I told her that in order for us to attempt to repair and move on she must give me access to all electrical devices, and tell me each form of contact she uses with him (fb, WhatsApp, sites etc). I took her phone and blocked/deleted each form of contact. She told me this was over the top and tried to turn this by saying that this shows I could never trust her again and "i can't do this to her because it's unfair". I told her this it absolute, and if she can't accept this term it's over.

I told her she will tell parents, extended family, Cs spouse. She said she couldn't and burst into tears, so (and I'm not sure if this is "right") I told them. I took her to her parents, my parents, Cs parents. There were lots of tears, but not from me (not outwardly). 

Yesterday evening after the roller coaster day she told me she was committed and wanted to try and make this work, and that if she could take it all back she would, of course I want to believe it, but until I see firm actions backing this up I reserve judgement.

This morning I woke up, and my wife was already awake, we had a relatively normal chat and she seemed fine. She then went quiet, I didn't enquire as I didn't want to appear needy because it is obvious what she's thinking. After half hr of silence she tells me that her instincts are telling her to go to C and find out if he is ok (to say his wife didn't take the news well is an understatement, I've heard she has already moved a few hundred miles away to her parents, and taken Cs children with her). Again I reiterated (suprisingly calmly which I am proud of myself for), that if there is any contact at all it is over and she will not be coming back. I got up with the kids and wife stayed in bed "thinking", she's up and about now and we have a normal Sunday routine planned out.

I will keep you updated, and the replies to my first post yesterday have helped me massively see the wood through the trees, so thanks again.

I've been reading a few studies of children with separated biological parents, and although it hurts me to think I wouldn't see them as often if we do split, I have realised that actually it's perfectly normal to be able to raise balanced and healthy children from this type of parental relationship (which I'm sure alot here know already from personal experience). I do feel better and in control at the moment, we will see what happens.


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## oxygene

Her father is here, upstairs with her giving her a lecture. I can hear the desperation in her voice, I refuse to fight and beg to keep her here. One of the original responders to my first post likened the healing process to first allowing the person that cheated to hit rock bottom, like a drug addict. It has only been a short time since the affair was outed, but already I can see that this is 100% true. 

In my heart of hearts I do believe it is over, and it will be her that ultimately makes that decision, but I do feel confident (and strangely at ease) with the fact that this is a very real possibility, and I do accept it.


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## ThePheonix

If you want to stay with her at all you're making the right moves. She'll work on you to ease up. Her wanting to check on "C" is not surprising but it shows she up to her neck with him. She's likely wanting to see where he stands.
I agree with you that is only a matter of time before you or her just calls it quits. Her actions and not her words will reveal where you stand with her. In the meantime, hold her feet to the fire and don't let up. You'll flush her out, one way or another. I personally wouldn't continue to live with a woman that wanted another man.


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## Thound

"c" is a player. He is either trying to get his wife back, or moving on to his next conquest. As far as your children are concerned, it is important for you to show them what a MAN is. There are not many examples of real men anymore. This is your opportunity. Stay strong and resolute.


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## GusPolinski

@oxygene, I'm curious... where do you live?

Please be as general (Europe, North America, etc) or as specific (London, NYC, etc) as you like.

Again, just curious. Apologies if you've already mentioned this elsewhere.


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## GusPolinski

Oh, and also... the only remaining "contact" that should be allowed between your WW and OM is the "no contact" letter.


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## SadandAngry

Just a note, it's better for everyone if you stick to just one thread. You've taken some big steps in the right direction for you, and your kids. Good work.


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## Satya

You're doing great. Very glad you told family the truth. Exposure may have been your saving grace. I honestly rarely ever see another method used by posters work so well. 

Nevertheless, stay completely vigilant and steadfast. Think of her as a total junkie.... She is desperate for her fix and would sell her own soul to have it for 5 minutes. You're going to have to restrain her (in a figurative sense) until she starts to come down off that high.


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## jim123

See an attorney as soon as you can. Get everything in order. You need to be strong. Start the 180. Tell her she can have C but the kids can not be with him.

By the way, if you are in the US, it is normal that the court will not allow the kids to be around another person for about a year.

You can not nice her back.


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## Spotthedeaddog

What new life are you building together to distract her from her loss? (normal to be concerned about the person her hormones were all ramped up for - but giving a hormone addicit "just a bit more, for now" won't fix the problem. Substitute addiction is really only good option.


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## drifting on

Oxygene

I agree with seeing a lawyer, start the divorce paperwork. Also leave this paperwork out in plain sight for her to see. Tell her the marriage rests on her, ask her if she would approve of this if you had done it? Tell her you have no trust, trust was destroyed the minute she allowed the third person in your marriage. If you had done this would she trust you? Whatever she says, ask her if you did it would she approve? 

Lay out your boundaries, contact "C" and tell him if he knows what's best to stay away from your family. Tell him you will go after him legally. As for your wife I see no remorse but so much regret for getting caught. Your wife will contact "C", this I am sure of, she should not be caring at all about his feelings or if he is ok. Your wife, and I thought this was crazy too, will need time to grieve the loss of her relationship with "C". That's right, every MC will tell you this, as screwed up as that sounds. 

Your best way to do this is small limited conversations at best. Ask your wife how you would like to split the finances. What does she want for custody, alimony, child support, then say no to everything she wants. You need to shake her up without physically touching her. Show her that you will fight her tooth and nail to minimize anything she gets. You need to be hard, you need for remorse to begin settling in for her. If she doesn't have remorse, you show her you will be just fine without her.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Marc878

Amazing how quick full Exposure ends everything. You made great decisions timely and established control. Nice job!!!!!!

I would reinterrate that the divorce work will continue and be ready if she makes contact again.

Sounds like she's wanting to badly.


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## ConanHub

Not bad.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## JohnA

Good morning Oxgene,

Your timeline is remarkably quick, to quick. If true it does prove two points: the best time to confront is while the fog owns the WS and when a decsion must be made even the less then ideal action is far superior then no action.

- Friday night you confront head on,
- Saturday AM your begin posting for a little over an hour.
- Saturday afternoon (early?) you take the kids to your patents house.
- Saturday afternoon you froce your wife to reveal her actions to her patents, your parents and the ONW.
- OMW leaves her WS and travels out of state with her children.
- You find a therapist/consular and seek advice.
- You pick up the kids and bring them home.
- Sunday early AM you have a descussion with WS.
- Sunday morning FIL cones to your home and is currently lecturing your WS.

Did I miss anything? 


- You read several articles about raising children as a divorced couple.


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## JohnA

Ok, Oxgene here are my thoughts.

Your wife"s and your emotions are painfully raw. Both of you will be lashing out at each other, comments will be made that cannot be taken back. Use the 180 to protect yourself from lowing yourself to her level. You grasp that you are the only one right now that wants to save the marriage, and even you have doubts it can be. 

Only by using empathy as a tool/weapon on your part can save this marriage. Know what she is thinking, feeling, and likely to do and why is the first step. Here is her dilemma: In her heart and mind she is a good person. Her actions are not the actions of a good person. She is extremely sensitive to how others perceive her. She reconciles this by rewriting history, omitting facts, gas lighting and blame shifting. Use this site, IC and MC to prepare and avoid pitfalls. Always respond calmly.

On the subject of why no contact by her with OM is important to you. If she tries to reason with you on the subject perhaps suggest that no spouse can survive in a marriage that they know they are a poor second place. Acknowledge that her feelings are strong but at the same you cannot live with, well...."sloppy @@@@@@". Stress any contact other then a NC letter, which she can say she hopes he will be ok, will diminish the ability of the two of you parenting your children in the future. Like marriage, parenting requires mutual respect, if one parent knows the other holds the other in disdain it undermines both parents ability to parent.

Con't on next post


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## eastsouth2000

to all this is not his first thread.
here is his first thread.
http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/293938-devastated.html

this dude really needs the help of more experienced members.

hope you guys can post articles for him to study.
cause i believe for JFO(Just Found Out) there's a lot to read and a lot to study!


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## italianjob

You did fine, Oxgene, great improvement in just one day, Stay strong and don't back off.

Remember you need to get tested for STDs, and so needs your wife.

And investigate on the swinger site/reviews matter. There's no need to subscribe to such a site to have an affair with someone you already know and see every day, so there could be much more you need to discover in this story.


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## JohnA

Hi Oxgene, to continue my last post: qqYour wife is under seige this weekend. But tomorrow is a new day, you go to work, kids in daycare and now her resentment which has been simmering all weekend will emerge and take hold. What actions will she take? Understand right now she blames you for turning her into a lying cheating adulteress. Any husband who does this deserves what he gets. She wants you gone, humiliate, and devastate. Begging and crying only serves to justify and encourage this belief, any reasoning only is an attempt by you to unfairly shift the blame for her actions onto her. Do not listen to er words at all, do mot trust her apparently good actions. You need to let her stew in her emotions until they burn out. Expect sudden outburst of justifications and blameshiftimg. Use the 180 to ask/take time to consider your response. Force yourself to be polite and reasonable, within the goal of protecting yourself. Encourage her to seek a job. 

Plan on brief conversations only this week. Speak only warmly about yr children. Tonight make a list of individual assets and joint assets. Tomorrow first thing before work, take steps to protect your share, and only your share of joint asset. Find and see a lawyer. Discuss the range of outcomes to how a divorce will play out. 

Begin to explore and accept the underling issues ad fault lines in your marriage. They are real and mutual in nature. The hardest thing for both of you to accept is they never excuses or provide a reason for adultery. For example a childhood with physical abuse, does not provide a reason for the abused to become the abuser. 

Will con't


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## G.J.

oxygene said:


> I was on the iPad, and noticed in the safari history that *she'd spent alot of time browsing a swinger site,* followed a link and took me to a page she had set up.... on this particular site you can "endorse" people and give them reviews. *She had a review from C, and she had reviewed C in returned, was very detailed.*
> 
> I saw her taking photos of herself whilst in the bath
> 
> I checked Cs profile, and he had a new "endorsement"... linked to a profile that clearly had *new pictures of my wife on it... *
> 
> Then last night; not being able to deal with it any longer I decided to bluff, I waiting until the kids went to bed and confronted her and told her I knew everything. She burst into tears


You need a complete time line as its looks like not only did she sleep with this guy but indulged in the swinging scene

In fact id bet she did

please get tested for STDs A.S.A.P.


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## Be smart

Sorry if I am rude but why are you still married to this woman?
She told you she is in love with C and even now she wants to check on him to see if he is OK. 

Your wife is worried about C and his problems with his wife because she left him and she took kids with her,but SHE NEVER TALKS ABOUT YOUR FAMILY and ABOZ DAMAGE SHE DID TO YOU AND YOUR FAMILY !!!

I will say this again,your wife was not only in Affair with C,she got swaped with others trust me on this one.


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## Marc878

Yep, this isn't over by a long shot.

The thing she needs to understand is she's making a choice you or OM.

Get your finances in order just in case. You'll know which way she's gonna go shortly.

This may be the most emotional time for you both. Be vigilant!!!!!

You don't want to have to go through this saga two or three times.


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## F-102

I like the fact that YOU told them, and didn't let HER do it, otherwise, she would have made it look like she was innocent, that it was all YOUR fault that she was driven into the arms of another man, that you are a CAN (Controlling, Abusive Neanderthal), etc...

Well played, sir!


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## lifeistooshort

The saddest thing about this is that she's likely just another cheap piece of arse to C. This is often the case and something that isn't usually considered by wayward women. Very possible that she thinks a lot more of C than C thinks of her. 


If you don't want your marriage regardless of what happens with AP it's one thing, even if it is a sh!tty thing to do. But to fvck up a marriage that you otherwise want for someone that's probably fvcking a bunch of others is just plain stupid. 

I think OP handled this well. His wife will need a little time to process his latest actions but hopefully will make the right decision and abide by his boundaries.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## carmen ohio

oxygene said:


> Ok, so after lots of thinking I decided to take on board alot of the advice that has been given in response to my first post yesterday. In my head I have accepted that if she will not change immediately I will have the strength to end it; I've also already spoken to a theropist (for my sake, not a marriage councilor yet).
> 
> Yesterday I took the kids to my parents to look after for a while and sat down with my wife. I made sure I was calm, I told her I need a wife and my kids need a family unit, but not at any cost. I told her how it's made me feel and the feelings if betrayal I feel. *I told her unless contact with C ends right now it is over,* she told me she needs to make sure he's ok and to let her ring him. *I told her in no uncertain terms making contact with him of any kind is unacceptable, it's total darkness or it will be over.*
> 
> I told her that in order for us to attempt to repair and move on she must give me access to all electrical devices, and tell me each form of contact she uses with him (fb, WhatsApp, sites etc). I took her phone and blocked/deleted each form of contact. She told me this was over the top and tried to turn this by saying that this shows I could never trust her again and "i can't do this to her because it's unfair". *I told her this it absolute, and if she can't accept this term it's over.*
> 
> I told her she will tell parents, extended family, Cs spouse. She said she couldn't and burst into tears, so (and I'm not sure if this is "right") I told them. I took her to her parents, my parents, Cs parents. There were lots of tears, but not from me (not outwardly).
> 
> Yesterday evening after the roller coaster day she told me she was committed and wanted to try and make this work, and that if she could take it all back she would, of course I want to believe it, but until I see firm actions backing this up I reserve judgement.
> 
> This morning I woke up, and my wife was already awake, we had a relatively normal chat and she seemed fine. She then went quiet, I didn't enquire as I didn't want to appear needy because it is obvious what she's thinking. After half hr of silence she tells me that her instincts are telling her to go to C and find out if he is ok (to say his wife didn't take the news well is an understatement, I've heard she has already moved a few hundred miles away to her parents, and taken Cs children with her). *Again I reiterated (suprisingly calmly which I am proud of myself for), that if there is any contact at all it is over and she will not be coming back.* I got up with the kids and wife stayed in bed "thinking", she's up and about now and we have a normal Sunday routine planned out.
> 
> I will keep you updated, and the replies to my first post yesterday have helped me massively see the wood through the trees, so thanks again.
> 
> I've been reading a few studies of children with separated biological parents, and although it hurts me to think I wouldn't see them as often if we do split, I have realised that actually it's perfectly normal to be able to raise balanced and healthy children from this type of parental relationship (which I'm sure alot here know already from personal experience). I do feel better and in control at the moment, we will see what happens.


Dear oxygene,

You have done remarkably well as compared to most BHs on TAM/CWI.

I would just point out that, having drawn a line in the sand -- telling your WW that any further contact with the OM means _"it is over"_ -- you must be prepared to go through with it or you lose all credibility.

Be aware that there is a very high likelihood (much greater than 50%) that she will contact the OM again. You need to have a system in place to increase the likelihood of your uncovering this and, if it happens, you need to react immediately. Hence the importance of closely monitoring her communications and consulting in advance with a divorce attorney.

Also, start focusing on your own well-being. Get as much rest as possible, watch your diet, exercise regularly and avoid alcohol and drugs. Whatever happens with your WW, you will face numerous challenges in the weeks and months ahead. Your greatest assets to help you deal with these challenges are your physical, mental and spiritual health.

Wishing you and your family the best.


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## aine

Oxygene, you are doing well, but you must keep the pressure on. 
Don't believe a word she says, everything coming out of her mouth now will be to lessen the pressure on her from the exposure. She is still very clearly in the A fog wanting to check up on C, when she should be concerned with you and her own family. Make her draft that NC letter now, sit down with her while she does it and sends it. Proceed with caution. 

Progress as if you were getting a divorce, set all your ducks up in a row, let her see you mean business. The sad reality is, if she was doing more than having an A with C (i.e. swinging, etc) then this M may be irrecoverable, you have to get your head into the space, that this may not work out.
There will be many bumps along the way, but you have started well. Keep posting


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## anchorwatch

oxygene said:


> Her father is here, upstairs with her giving her a lecture. I can hear the desperation in her voice, I refuse to fight and beg to keep her here. One of the original responders to my first post likened the healing process to first allowing the person that cheated to hit rock bottom,* like a drug addict*. It has only been a short time since the affair was outed, but already I can see that this is 100% true.
> 
> In my heart of hearts I do believe it is over, and it will be her that ultimately makes that decision, but I do feel confident (and strangely at ease) with the fact that this is a very real possibility, and I do accept it.





carmen ohio said:


> Dear oxygene,
> 
> You have done remarkably well as compared to most BHs on TAM/CWI.
> 
> I would just point out that, having drawn a line in the sand -- telling your WW that any further contact with the OM means _"it is over"_ -- you must be prepared to go through with it or you lose all credibility.
> 
> Be aware that there is a very high likelihood (much greater than 50%) that she will contact the OM again. You need to have a system in place to increase the likelihood of your uncovering this and, if it happens, you need to react immediately. Hence the importance of closely monitoring her communications and consulting in advance with a divorce attorney.
> 
> Also, start focusing on your own well-being. Get as much rest as possible, watch your diet, exercise regularly and avoid alcohol and drugs. Whatever happens with your WW, you will face numerous challenges in the weeks and months ahead. Your greatest assets to help you deal with these challenges are your physical, mental and spiritual health.
> 
> Wishing you and your family the best.



Hello, Oxygene.

You did well, setting boundaries and using exposure. There is much more to be dealt with yet. 

You'll do well to pay attention to Carmin's post. 

1) Drug addicts usually fail a few times before they break their addiction. 

2) Be careful with ultimatums. 

Hoping for the best for you and your family


BTW, have you read this thread, http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/32002-welcome-tam-cwi-newbies-please-read.html#post430739


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## Roselyn

OP, you did very well in dealing swiftly with your wife's affairs. I say affairs as not only that she has a physical and emotional affair, but I believe that she also engaged in the swinging scene. She wants to continue her relationship with the Other Man with the excuse of she wants to know if he is "Okay". Really?

You need to consult a divorce attorney ASAP. See a psychologist to work on your state of mind. Woman here. Your wife is not committed to you, your marriage, nor your children. She shows no remorse at all. She is sorry that she got caught.

Sorry you are here.


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## oxygene

Hi guys.

Thank you for your responses for both of my posts. I'll continue with the updates if I may as I do find communicating what is going on helpful, and I do appreciate the feedback (good and bad).

I'll just start by responding to someone that suggested my situation has moved so quickly it might not be true, and that if it is true it suggests "dealing with the issue whilst still in the fog" might be a decent approach. I agree it has moved quickly, but I can assure you it is 100% genuine and real.

I'll start from where I left off previously, but before I do I just want to give this post a health warning. I suspect a parts of what you're about to read will incite a few negative comments and I'll be told I shouldn't have said a particular thing, but I think it's important I share an accurate depiction of the truth and I don't try and crowd please... I guess one of the ironeys of this situation is that you don't get to practice, and anyone that is unlucky enough to experience a unfaithful spouse has to try and deal with it in the "right" way first time round, and blend it with the pain they are suffering, and believe me when I say I'm feeling a lot of pain deep down.

To respond to another question, I'm from the East if England.

Anyway, on Sunday afternoon her father left after giving her his 2 pence worth around how stupid she was. He was brutal, telling her she's a fool, how could she throw away her marriage over such a weird man (even before affair was outed "C" was not very popular within the extended family). He offered to take our 2 children with him for a few hours so wife and I could talk, again. Whilst her father was here my wife kept saying that being with me since I found out just felt like she was going through the actions, and her instincts were telling her to go to C to make sure he was ok. Father then left.

My wife was upstairs crying, I called up that when she was ready she will come down and we will talk, after 10 minutes she appeared blurry eyed and we sat down. I started by saying that I won't keep her here and force her not to contact C, but we should understand the consequences of her actions. I told her that my point still stands, that if there is any contact it's done, and explained that It is well known in the family that C is not a good father to his own 2 kids, he is not (clearly!) a good partner to his now ex wife. He never stayed faithful to her and was using swinger and affair sites for years, he wasn't overly involved in anything his children did (well known fact within the family). I told her in no uncertain terms that this man will not contribute to the upbringing of my children, and if she wants to go to him then so be it, but she will not be taking my I children with her. If someone else is to contribute to the upbringing if my children if my wife and I do split that's fine, as long as they are a decent man, but he is not one of those people. 

I do not want to go into detail about other aspects of my life, but I do have the means to earn an income without spending much time outside of my home, and can have a very flexible working day. Because of this, I explained to her that I do have the means, and the will to fight her for full custody of my children. I explained to her that I have the edivence that he has been active in sex swinger and affair sites for years and I can demonstrate this, I also have the evidence that she had a presence in those sites too (however if it was to impress him or to sleep with others I don't know). I can and will call character witnesses against him to demonstrate he is a **** father. I will fight so he does not contribute in anyway to my children's upbringing. I probably wouldn't win custody away from their mother if we went down that path, but I will fight for the sake of my kids, I will not let that sexual deviant, moral-less individual guide my children in any way. 

At that point she angrily tells me I'm blackmailing her, and I'm using our children as a weapon, I tell her that I'm not blackmailing her at all but she has to understand the consequences if her actions if she leaves and expects to take my children with her to him. I tell her she can go if she wants to, but they are not going with her if she wants to run to his bed.

She then says that she feels like "everyone is ganging up on her" and I'm turning everyone against her. I tell her that unfortunately the world does not revolve around her and whether she likes it or not people have an opinion. I think in her head she thought she could do what she wanted, run off into the night with my kids into his house and that's ok. That and no one should have an opinion different to her own, and I would and should just suck it up and let it happen with no resistance at all. This does confirm to me that she sees me as a weak f£&king doormat, but it's not going to happen.

The previous day (Saturday) I blocked all forms of contact I could with C, with her agreement (on her cell, on the iPad). Yesterday evening in tears she tells me she loves me and wants to make us work again, but then she admitted in "desperation" she had tried to ring him on Sunday morning but her phone wouldn't let her due to the locks we (I) put in it. I told her the fact that she tried to do it was a clear breach or our agreement of no contact (although I didn't make that point very calmly I'm not going to lie). I get up and walk to the front door, open it, and tell her that if she needs to see him that badly to go and I'll see her in court. At this point I felt ok, I sat down and completely ignored her, she paced around the room for a few minutes then closed the door and went to bed. I went up a couple of hours later after watching a movie.

Today (Monday) I got up, help get the kids ready for school then went to work, it was amicable. Throughout the day I got a few messages from her on my phone, some generic conversation starters, a couple of "I love you's". I was busy and to be honest I really couldn't be bothered to respond, I mean why should I let her dictate when we will and will not have a normal conversation so soon after what she has done. I refuse to allow her any control over me, and I see that even talking in her terms is a victory that I will not allow her to have right now. I did speak to her briefly around lunchtime when she rang me to tell me something about something my youngest boy had done, but that was it.

Driving home I'm wondering if she'll try and be "normal" when I get back, and wasn't sure how I wanted to react. I walked through the front door, kids run up to me and give me a big squeeze and tell me they love me, I look up and she's sitting on the sofa puffy eyed, I ask her if the kids have been good all day and she says "they're fine, but I'm not". Then she dashes upstairs and I can hear her crying, I know those tears aren't for me, and I left her to get on with it. She came down a little later and we sat in the same room for a while and got involved in some idol chat, she kind of tried, but I wasn't very engaging, rightly or not my instincts told me to give her the cold shoulder so I did. 

She's now gone to bed alone, and I'm sitting here writing this and watching TV.

Despite everything I really do still love with all my heart, it's kind of sad really because at this point in time I find myself wishing I didn't.


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## Marc878

Nice job. If you are to get over being the doormat you must remain strong and become the head of your household like you should have been before.

Weakness in a man is not attractive to a woman. Nice work in explaining what the OM really is by the way.

Like I said earlier this is not over. Even if this doesn't work out you'll become a better man in the future. Someone your kids can look up to. Congrats on that!!!!


Best wishes to you and your family.


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## jessi

You are doing the exact right thing, you are fighting for your marriage and your family nothing less will be exceptable.......
the ball is in her court now and her actions are the only thing worth anything right now, words mean nothing she will say whatever she has to, to get what she wants right now.
I think your approach is strong and loving, she has to realize what she will give up for this loser......affairs are addictions and he has conned her like a pro, when I went through this I got my fight on too, I didn't just let them sit back and steal my life my family.......
You give them one chance at redeaming themselves and then you walk.........
The affair has been exposed to all I hope, the reality should have burst the fantasy bubble by now, keep that pressure up......no contact is key.....
She will go through withdrawal and it will be hard to watch but keep in mind the woman she is now is not your wife just some stupid girl who got caught up in her ego.....you will see when your real wife emerges but it takes a few weeks.......
As time goes on for you, you too may not want to continue knowing what you do now, trust and loyalty are huge in a marriage........and if she isn't on board a 100% it won't work......
It is one hard recovery for BS's it will take everything in you and everything about her commitment to do this......
No one could blame you for ending the marriage because of who she is now.............
stay strong my friend.......you are amazing and fighting for what is yours.......be proud.


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## Be smart

Your wife is doing nothing to help you. It is like you are the cheater and swinger not her.
She break your heart and she break your family but she is crying for C. 

I am asking you again,why are you still married to this woman? She clearly told you she is in love with C and she likes her swinger lifestyle.

Earn your respect back because you will need it when your kids grow up and you dont want them to see their mom on dates with other guys.

Help yourself and your kids future life--Divorce her.


----------



## Be smart

jessi said:


> You are doing the exact right thing, you are fighting for your marriage and your family nothing less will be exceptable.......
> the ball is in her court now and her actions are the only thing worth anything right now, words mean nothing she will say whatever she has to, to get what she wants right now.
> I think your approach is strong and loving, she has to realize what she will give up for this loser......affairs are addictions and he has conned her like a pro, when I went through this I got my fight on too, I didn't just let them sit back and steal my life my family.......
> You give them one chance at redeaming themselves and then you walk.........
> The affair has been exposed to all I hope, the reality should have burst the fantasy bubble by now, keep that pressure up......no contact is key.....
> She will go through withdrawal and it will be hard to watch but keep in mind the woman she is now is not your wife just some stupid girl who got caught up in her ego.....you will see when your real wife emerges but it takes a few weeks.......
> As time goes on for you, you too may not want to continue knowing what you do now, trust and loyalty are huge in a marriage........and if she isn't on board a 100% it won't work......
> It is one hard recovery for BS's it will take everything in you and everything about her commitment to do this......
> No one could blame you for ending the marriage because of who she is now.............
> stay strong my friend.......you are amazing and fighting for what is yours.......be proud.



Wait a minute,you are telling him he needs to fight for her and their marriage. I think his wife should FIGHT FOR HIM and beg for forgivnes and another chance.


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## italianjob

I'll repeat myself:

GET TESTED FOR STDs

At the very least she's been ****ing for months a POS who has been around quite a bit.

Don't have sex with her until you have both been tested.

And I also think you should try to find out what she was really up to on those swingers site.
If she was being "swapped" by her lover, and has grown to like that lifestyle, she might not be wife material anymore (unless you're into swinging too) and you might be wasting your time here


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## oxygene

Be smart said:


> Your wife is doing nothing to help you. It is like you are the cheater and swinger not her.
> She break your heart and she break your family but she is crying for C.
> 
> *I am asking you again,why are you still married to this woman? *She clearly told you she is in love with C and she likes her swinger lifestyle.
> 
> Earn your respect back because you will need it when your kids grow up and you dont want them to see their mom on dates with other guys.
> 
> Help yourself and your kids future life--Divorce her.


The honest answer to your question, is that at this point in time she not the woman I married, not the woman I've devoted 10 years if my life too, not even the woman she was 6 months ago. 

I want to blame him, but I know it takes two to tango. He dangled the carrot, but she conciously took a bite and preceded to look me in the eye and lie time and time again. It's as if she's a completely different person right now, I want to get my "old" wife back. 

I'll probably get slated for saying this, but I am 100% sure her cheating behaviour is new. Up until our second child was born we were always very close, we still were after he came along but parenting and life in general meant we didn't have as much time for each other as we would have liked, and I don't think that's unusual at all.

He was the catalyst to all of this, but she jumped off the edge of the cliff, and if I can get her back I genuinely want to, but not at any cost... I hope that kind of makes sense and answers your question.


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## ThePheonix

I agree Bsmart. A "marriage" is committment of two people (ideally of the opposed sex) to each other. If I've got to fight and force someone to have that commitment, it doesn't have a lot of value. I can replace or do without anything without value.


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## anchorwatch

Stay the course, Oxygene. Strong, calm, yet resolved. Control is key. 

It will take time for the fog of addiction to clear and for her to start to think straight. Breaches of no-contact will set the clock at zero and start the process over again. That could include affair gifts, letters, his social media sites, places they frequented, etc. 

You might find time to read about it. 

Anatomy of an Affair - The Chemistry of Love - Marriage AdvocatesMarriage Advocates


How are you holding up? Eating? Sleeping? Make sure to take care of yourself. You family depends on you. 


Best


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## lifeistooshort

Oxygene, tell your wife that the guy she's so concerned about that she's willing to trash her family over him sees her as one wh0re in a long line of wh0res. 

Because that is likely the case.

And that comment about the kids being ok but she's not.....ignore that. That's a pathetic cry for attention from someone who sees herself as a victim in all of this and wants you to feel bad for her.

That probably seems like a crappy thing to say to her but if you genuinely want her back it's imperative that she understands that she is nothing but a convenient hole for this dirtbag and you are her husband who would do most anything for her. And yet all she can think about is whether said dirtbag, who could really give a rat's behind about her, is ok. Do you think he's that concerned if she's ok? Ha ha, he's probably on to his next wh0re as we speak.


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## NoChoice

OP,
For what it is worth I applaud your desire to keep your family intact and I believe that you are acting in a manner conducive to that end, as much as anything can be. You have to realize that the woman your dealing with now is not your wife but at the same time she is. This has always been in her character but, until now, has remained dormant. Circumstances have aligned that have caused it to surface. Part of it may have to do with you two drifting apart, part of to do with the stress and confinement of motherhood, it is multifaceted. This in no way excuses her behavior nor justifies her decision to cheat, though it was less a decision than a inevitability due to the flaw in her character. It does not mean that you in any way caused it other than your involvement in her life, but it could have just as easily been any man. The flaw is in her and it just needed the right combination of events to become activated.

So now the task for you is to deal with it, if you so choose. It is a complex combination of personality traits that have her confounded presently. Pride, selfishness, desire, pleasure, resentment, love (her version of it at least) and many more are all swirling around in her mind like debris in a tornado. She will need assistance sorting through the flotsam if she is to arrive at any sort of ordered conclusion and learn and grow from this event. This early in the process it is simply naive to think that she will suddenly realize her folly and immediately begin to behave with contrition and deep remorse, that will take time as she sorts through it all and, with your help, begins to see just how errant her behavior truly was. Then, at that point, you will begin to see a woman seriously contrite and expressing deep remorse and regret.

I know you did not sign up for advanced psychological training but she will need you to be her "guide" through this process IF you are willing and desire to do so. The odds of her reaching the point of true understanding are much greater with your help than without it. Of course it is entirely up to you as to whether or not it is worth it and no one could blame you if you decided it was not, the choice is entirely yours.

If you accept this role, which by the way you have already begun to accept, then you must continue to stress upon her the importance of the boundaries you have initiated and when she attacks you with statements such as "your trying to blackmail me, using the kids" you must calmly and rationally explain to her that all of the consequences that she is experiencing and will experience are directly in response to HER actions. You must make her see that it is HER that has caused this by breaking her solemn vow and besmirching her honor and her integrity. She must know that her actions are careless, reckless and destructive not only to her family and marriage but to her personally as well. She has risked her marriage, her family and extended family and her health and she must be made to see this.

When she tells you she wants to see if C is okay, you need to reiterate that you are not okay and that C is used to taking care of himself. He is not unfamiliar with handling situations, gleaned from years of experience as a swinger and philanderer. She must be made to see that C was a man of very low character, displayed poor parenting skills, is devoid of honor and integrity and is completely self absorbed. All the while you must display the characteristics that make you the man you are, including patience and ration and yes, I realize how difficult that last part is, believe me.

This will in no way be easy so do not delude yourself otherwise, R never is. However, if she can indeed reach the point I spoke of above then your marriage will be stronger and less vulnerable than it ever could have been before. Her character flaw will now have been exposed and dealt with thereby giving her the ability to see just how deviant her previous thought process was. She will be as your "old" wife only better, new and improved, if you will. You have many difficult days ahead and I sincerely wish you good fortune and strength. If we can be of assistance we are here.


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## bfree

oxygene said:


> The honest answer to your question, is that at this point in time she not the woman I married, not the woman I've devoted 10 years if my life too, not even the woman she was 6 months ago.
> 
> I want to blame him, but I know it takes two to tango. He dangled the carrot, but she conciously took a bite and preceded to look me in the eye and lie time and time again. It's as if she's a completely different person right now, I want to get my "old" wife back.
> 
> I'll probably get slated for saying this, but I am 100% sure her cheating behaviour is new. Up until our second child was born we were always very close, we still were after he came along but parenting and life in general meant we didn't have as much time for each other as we would have liked, and I don't think that's unusual at all.
> 
> He was the catalyst to all of this, but she jumped off the edge of the cliff, and if I can get her back I genuinely want to, but not at any cost... I hope that kind of makes sense and answers your question.


Oxygene, I'd like to point out something that probably seems obvious to us but is more than likely a fact that you'd rather not accept. You will never get the woman you married back. That woman no longer exists. She is irrevocably changed, as are you. Your relationship was a confluence of both your personalities. You will never trust her 100% again, nor should you. Your image of her will never be what it once was. She on the other hand has poisoned her soul. She has committed the ultimate marital betrayal and you just don't come back from that unchanged. Even if she did manage to disentangle herself from this OM emotionally she has shared her heart with another. If she does eventually come to a place of remorse her guilt will be overwhelming. It always is to truly remorseful waywards. This paralyzing guilt may lessen with time but it will always be with her.

You need to understand that your wife is gone, your marriage is dead. You need to accept that. It is possible that you can build an entirely new marriage with this new woman but it isn't going to be easy. You might find when all is said and done that you don't like the new woman your wife has/will become. She may not like the new man you are now and will be in the future. Your new marriage may not be stable enough to survive long term. These are facts that you need to acknowledge. These are facts that are undeniable and inevitable.


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## Be smart

oxygene said:


> The honest answer to your question, is that at this point in time she not the woman I married, not the woman I've devoted 10 years if my life too, not even the woman she was 6 months ago.
> 
> I want to blame him, but I know it takes two to tango. He dangled the carrot, but she conciously took a bite and preceded to look me in the eye and lie time and time again. It's as if she's a completely different person right now, I want to get my "old" wife back.
> 
> I'll probably get slated for saying this, but I am 100% sure her cheating behaviour is new. Up until our second child was born we were always very close, we still were after he came along but parenting and life in general meant we didn't have as much time for each other as we would have liked, and I don't think that's unusual at all.
> 
> He was the catalyst to all of this, but she jumped off the edge of the cliff, and if I can get her back I genuinely want to, but not at any cost... I hope that kind of makes sense and answers your question.


I understand you my friend,you wish this thing never happend. Well I wish it to and I dont even know you,but I can feel some pain for you just reading your posts.

Every marriage have problems and wife and husband should talk to each other,not go to swinger sites and lie and cheat on each other.

Why did you not go and cheat on her,BECAUSE YOU LOVE HER and you respect her,you love your family? On the other hand your wife cheated on you,fell in love with another man and join swinger sites.

She is more worried about him and his problems then she is worried about yours,how much she hurt you and your family.
Damn she is crying over him,did she even apologize to you? 

I wish you and your kids the best,and I would like to help you,but I cant. The only person who can help you is you by earning your respect back,your "balls" back.


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## JohnA

Good evening Oxgene,

First I think you are doing great. To many BS (both men and women) go numb and refuse to first take steps to protect themselves and their children. As a result the WS runs wild and compounds the disaster, not in degrees but in leaps and bounds. 

I suggested in an earlier posts you need to get into your wife's head to understand what her likely actions will be, thereby putting yourself in position to protect yourself and or strike. I have known two men and one women in this lifestyle. For C he needs the validation that he can get a women and get her to f other men for him. Your wife was a huge win for his ego, being married to a successful man. These men typically trade women back and forth for the night. Once her trade value drops, he moves on. Why don't the women see this? They have a hole in themselves that they think the OM fills. Also C violated one of that groups biggest rules: it is not cheating because both married partners participate.

It is better then 50/50 that she contacted him today and he refused to step up, hence the tears. I am telling you from personal experience that right now she hates you and blames you, not herself or C, for her becoming one of those pathetic women who allows herself to passed around.


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## GusPolinski

oxygene said:


> The honest answer to your question, is that at this point in time she not the woman I married, not the woman I've devoted 10 years if my life too, not even the woman she was 6 months ago.
> 
> 
> 
> I want to blame him, but I know it takes two to tango. He dangled the carrot, but she conciously took a bite and preceded to look me in the eye and lie time and time again. It's as if she's a completely different person right now, I want to get my "old" wife back.
> 
> 
> 
> I'll probably get slated for saying this, but I am 100% sure her cheating behaviour is new. Up until our second child was born we were always very close, we still were after he came along but parenting and life in general meant we didn't have as much time for each other as we would have liked, and I don't think that's unusual at all.
> 
> 
> 
> He was the catalyst to all of this, but she jumped off the edge of the cliff, and if I can get her back I genuinely want to, but not at any cost... I hope that kind of makes sense and answers your question.



How many children do you have?

Sorry if you've already mentioned that, but I noticed that you said "second" above instead of "youngest".


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## sidney2718

oxygene said:


> Despite everything I really do still love with all my heart, it's kind of sad really because at this point in time I find myself wishing I didn't.


People having an affair often have a distorted view of reality. That's called The Fog. What is not so well known is that the betrayed spouse also is in a fog at the start.

You are in a fog. You are in a difficult horrible situation that you never will forget, but the pain will go away and you will find that your love for her will fade. Nobody who loved you could do to you what she's done. You'll come to see that soon enough. 

For now, hang on. It is a roller coaster.


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## sidney2718

oxygene said:


> The honest answer to your question, is that at this point in time she not the woman I married, not the woman I've devoted 10 years if my life too, not even the woman she was 6 months ago.
> 
> I want to blame him, but I know it takes two to tango. He dangled the carrot, but she conciously took a bite and preceded to look me in the eye and lie time and time again. It's as if she's a completely different person right now, I want to get my "old" wife back.
> 
> I'll probably get slated for saying this, but I am 100% sure her cheating behaviour is new. Up until our second child was born we were always very close, we still were after he came along but parenting and life in general meant we didn't have as much time for each other as we would have liked, and I don't think that's unusual at all.
> 
> He was the catalyst to all of this, but she jumped off the edge of the cliff, and if I can get her back I genuinely want to, but not at any cost... I hope that kind of makes sense and answers your question.


So after your second child was born you and your wife didn't have as much time for each other as you would have liked. But she had time for the OM, didn't she?

That's what I meant when I wrote above that you are in a fog.


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## SadandAngry

You're doing well. Very well. Doing what you need to to give your marriage at least a chance to survive. Maybe it will, maybe not, you'll figure that out later.

I'll say this, to those that believe his ww needs to be the one doing everything, to be the one fighting, while in theory that ought to be true, in practice, that's not going to happen. She's useless right now, an addict in withdrawal. Depending on her to save anything is the same as throwing it all away.

Her time to fight will come later, when the fog clears for both of them, and the emotional roller coaster really gets going. When the anger comes, the betrayal, the blame, the sorrow, the exhaustion. Those are coming, but not right away.

That's when she will get tested. When she will need to suck it up, if she wants her family to remain intact.


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## Bibi1031

bfree said:


> You need to understand that your wife is gone,
> 
> *Irrevocably gone to the point that she is no longer marriage material. Has it not registered yet that she changed you, your kids, and your marriage for a dirt bag and she joined him in the swingers life style? Can you truly reconcile that? *
> 
> your marriage is dead.
> 
> *100% dead. You cannot rug sweep the fact that she changed your life for a d0uchebag; what does that make her?*
> 
> 
> 
> You need to accept that.
> 
> *Can you really accept that; or you haven't really noticed just how awful your situation really is? *
> 
> It is possible that you can build an entirely new marriage with this new woman
> 
> 
> *Seriously think about this. Is she someone you can truly trust 100%?*
> 
> 
> You might find when all is said and done that you don't like the new woman your wife has/will become.
> 
> *I don't think you really like her now, it's just that your denial is too thick to realize just who she truly is now.*





Believe me I know. My husband of 21 years got involved with an alcoholic prostitute. This guy is a great scientist, but an emotional retard. I had to get tested for STDs; you have to do this too. She is an irresponsible idiot! I will second the poster that asked you: why are you still married to this moron/I mean woman?

Sorry for the harshness, but you gotta wake up and smell the coffee dude!

Bibi


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## Sports Fan

Chris first of all sorry you are going through this.

Given the complexity of this most difficult situation you have handled it beautifully. There truly is no manual or training on how to handle a situation like this.

Only by taking a very hard line do you stand any hope of saving the marriage if thats what you want. 

Your wife must know that there are consequences for her actions and most importantly you need to enforce any said consequences if she violates any of your terms.

Deep down i suspect she is too scared to leave you at the moment given that you are the main bread winner and you have made it extremely clear you will fight her for the kids etc.

You have done well in breaking the fog by exposing, and the hard line you have taken.

Keep it up. You have a long way to go and only by staying strong can you work through this.

At the very least if it doesn't work out with your wife your strong actions will allow you to keep your dignity intact.

I have been where you are and feel your pain.

Wishing you the best and keep us posted.


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## Locke.Stratos

You're doing fine, better than most but don't lose your resolve. You set clear boundaries [for her not to (attempt to) contact C] and she broke them. You have to enforce your consequences and try move on otherwise she'll continue to see what she can get away with. You giving her the silent treatment or being passive aggressive won't help your situation. If you fail to stand firm she will lose even more respect for you.

Yes you still love her. You've been togother for a long time and she is your wife. That won't fade instataneously. You'll doubt and question yourself constantly, and this will be extremely difficult. Some distance and perspective might help.

Her thoughts and feelings are with C and there is not much you can do or say to her to affect that. Your wife _is_ a different person. The person she is now is a woman who doesn't respect and is not in love with you. She is disconnected from you and isn't emotionally invested or in the space to be that woman, to be in this marriage. Along with the pain of her adultery you shouldn't have to deal with that mess. I recommend you follow through and file and then focus on your and your children's well-being (wellbeing?).


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## aine

Your old marriage as you knew it is DEAD. If you want to remain married to your WW you and she will have to create a new marriage which will requires years of hard work from her especially and hours of counselling with no guarantees at the end. Are you ready for that? If you are , good luck to you.


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## Chaparral

ThePheonix said:


> I agree Bsmart. A "marriage" is committment of two people (ideally of the opposed sex) to each other. If I've got to fight and force someone to have that commitment, it doesn't have a lot of value. I can replace or do without anything without value.


The door is open. He's not forcing her to do anything.

Personally, I would go to prison before I let my children be near her POS boyfriend.


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## Chaparral

I like the idea of pointing out she's just one in a long list of women and that's his addiction.

Show her the proof of his swinger activity. Don't stop there, show it to anyone you can, anonymously if you need to.

Let her know she is just a recruit for him to have sex with but more importantly to trade to other men and couples.


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## Roselyn

OP, why are you electing the life of torture with this woman, in the guise of your wife? This woman is simply crazy. She is acting out like she is the victim and you are her jailer. 

She is crying to get sympathy for her infidelity. She is demonstrating her plight in the presence of your children. What kind of example is this woman to your children? This is an unacceptable environment for your children. Show her the door! She has no job, a cheater, an embicile = total loser. 

See your lawyer and divorce this woman who is pining for her lover and her swinging lifestyle. She has no job, poor mother, and a poor wife. See a psychologist to straighten your mindset.


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## D.H Mosquito

From what I'm reading she is heart broken and there is no love or empathy from her to you and giving you nothing to work with in rebuilding your marriage, I would be sorely tempted to have her bags packed and offer to drop her there and never bother her again and rebuild your life with your kids you're a bigger man than me and great that you have been so cool and calm in all your dealings in this traumatic time my thoughts are with you and rooting for you pal


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## TheTruthHurts

OP - what's happening? You're getting a lot if sh*t for sticking with this but I don't think you're deluded at all and I think you have an inkling of what the WW now is but mixed with a little hope. That's admirable - and you're stonger than me or most for seeing that. Some part of her is still in there and you are giving her a huge gift to try to help her get that part to reemerge before the final decision.

You are also very smart to take this time to work her out of the fog in protection of the kids. No doubt they would be emotionally and possible severely physically damaged if WW continued on her prior path without your somewhat stern and paternal guidance.

Yes she's now a junky. Maybe addiction advice would also help with the crap that will come next. Don't know - just seems like it will follow a particular pattern. The normal affair fog is probably not the same - for all intents and purposes she's likely been (voluntarily) wh*red out in all this and that is a taste of forbidden fruit that might leave some lingering twisted (emotionally) desires. Not saying this to be hurtful though - sorry to have to be explicit. But it is that aspect that it is very important to protect your kids from. I don't fully get swinging - but in an affair situation it had to involve all manner of humiliation, submission, cruel disrespect (to you) and taboo... Not a pleasant ****tail to fight against.

So stay the course and if you break things off eventually at least you can know you didn't leave her behind in such a horrible place as a person and you protected the kids as much as possible.

(Lol c0cktail got blocked so to speak above)


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## it-guy

For the longest time I also wanted to get my “old wife” back. That thought haunted me. I thought back to the times when things were great, and we loved one another very much.

But then I finally realized that what I wanted never really existed in the first place. It was just an illusion. I didn’t really know my wife (now ex-wife). That is a hard pill to swallow…..that you have been wrong about someone for so long. But it is reality.

Your wife will never be who you thought she was, or who you want her to be. She is her own person who makes her own choices, good and bad. Just like you make your own choices.

You have to make your decisions based on what you have now. Don’t even waste your time hoping for the best. That will lead to massive disappointment. I have learned to live very much in the moment these days.
This is not at all bashing my ex-wife. As a matter of fact, I care about her, and wish her well. This is pointing out flawed thinking on my part. I was wrong to torture myself with hope, and to try to “fix” the situation.


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## it-guy

People say "let them go" for a reason. She has to make her own choices. If she comes back and you still want to R, then great! At least you would know she really wants to in that situation. But if you try to force it, you may just end up on this forum yet again.


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## Chaparral

Could you tell from her posts whether or not they were swinging with other couples? Has she told you what they did?


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## Chaparral

Btw, you now have to gps her car, put find my phone on her phone, and place var's in her car and in your house. All she has to do is buy a burner phone or a pay phone to contact him and/or meet up.


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## cdbaker

Sounds like you handled it well. The only thing I wouldn't have done was to go into as much detail as you did about how you will fight if it goes to divorce. I think that is tipping your hand way too early, and it will make her consider those consequences when deciding what she wants to do. Truthfully, if she decides to stay to reconcile with you, you will want it to happen because she decides that she loves you and your family together, and earnestly wants to make it work for the right reasons. You don't want her to ultimately decide to stay partially out of fear that she will lose her kids to you. That will breed resentment in her that will last a long time, and it could cause her to try to take the affair underground and just pretend to work on the reconciliation while in the meantime planning a more "civil" and less scandelous exit from the marriage that wouldn't look so bad in front of friends/family and judges, so that her character and that of the OM won't be useful in the divorce court.

In other words, she might realize that she's really screwed up by going about this the way that she has, that in a divorce, she isn't going to emerge from this very well at all, possibly losing a good custody arrangement, losing the respect of her friends/family, her scandal broadcast to everyone she knows, etc. Instead, she could try to return for 3-12 months or so, pretend to work on the marriage, then announce that the marriage can't be saved and try filing for divorce properly, and because she "tried" to do the right thing for a while first, by giving it a "real effort", then people will have more sympathy/understanding for her.

I'm not at all saying that this will happen. I'm just wanting to reinforce that you want her to stay for the right reasons.

Also, having been in a VERY similar situation that you are in (wife got involved in an affair with another married man who was a serial cheater, wept openly for days and weeks afterwards while her friends/family were all revolted by what had happened, OM temporarily disappeared to salvage his own marriage after his wife found out, etc.) I would very much advise that you continue to pay very close attention to her activities, AND her behavior. In my case, my wife was a miserable wreck for a week or two, started seeing a therapist, we even went so far as to take from her the keys to her car when myself or a family member wasn't home with her so she couldn't go see OM. Then her mood somewhat abruptly improved, which she attributed to finally somewhat getting over him, acknowledging that he was a scumbag, etc. In truth, they both ended up getting burner phones to communicate (He must have visited her at home and exchanged new phone numbers or something like that) and the affair had resumed, albeit deeper underground. I didn't find out about it until about two weeks later when his wife called me at work to tell me that she had found his burner phone, to alert me that the affair was back on.

So keep paying close attention, but honestly I did just about everything that you did and she still was able to sneak this past me, so I wish you all the luck!


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## Iver

I know it's been mentioned before but you and your wife need to get tested for STD's . 

This is important, not just from the obvious health concerns. It's a tool to drive home to your wife the realities of what she's done. I'd make this a deal breaker. She has to get to the doctor, get tested and show you the results in writing. If she won't do this or drags her feet, then make clear you will start divorce proceedings. No if ands or buts allowed.

Do you know the full story of what went on? And is this the first time? The fact that the OM is a known swinger and your wife knew this is alarming. I don't want to pile on but this implies your wife has serious problems or is much more of a player than you think.

Making her take a poly test and see what she admits to is something to consider.


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## ThePheonix

Chaparral said:


> The door is open. He's not forcing her to do anything.


The point I was hoping to make Chappy is if fighting and forcing her is what it takes to keep her, you don't have anything. If my old lady ever wanted another guy, its adios. Ain't no way I'd be fighting for her.


----------



## oxygene

Hey guys, I'm writing this in bed alone as she has done a disappearing act. She's been sending me strange messages all day, telling me "I'm a great dad", "she's ashamed", "she can't think", "she loves me". I basically ignored them. When I got home from work she told me my sister had been to visit her (she doesn't know, I havent had time to take my wife and tell her yet). I told my wife she should have told her what's she's done because she'll be finding out soon anyway, my statement didn't contain much emotion.

She then tells me she was going for quick walk to clear her head as she had been stuck in all day "thinking", that was 3 hours ago. I have bathed, fed, played with my kids, put them to bed, cleaned up, had a shower and she is still missing. 

I checked to see if C still had an active profile on his swinger site, it's disappeared, I'm not an idiot. I'm assuming (in fact I'm sure) she's either contacted him and told him I plan to use this as edvidence in a custody battle if it comes down to it, or he's trying to prove his "love" for her by removing it. She's obviously had contact with him, that I am sure of. Luckily I already have screen grabs.

A part of me feels like I should be worried about her, but this is a clear abandonment in my eyes. 

It's been 5 days now since I confronted her, and In my heart I've known for a little longer than that. I've already had enough. I'm giving up on her and our relationship, I need to make sure my kids are ok. I feel like I've lived a year this past week. A few of you have said that even if we Somehow do come through this I'll be married to a different woman I knew, in a different marriage. I've been thinking about this today and I can see it's true. I've decided I don't want to pour my life, soul and efforts into a stranger that used to be my wife.

I feel like I've given up too easily, but I don't want to trust her again. Strangely I feel strong, stronger and more confident than I've felt in a long time. I'm speaking to a lawyer tomorrow, I'm booked in for an STD test on Friday. You all have different views and that is fine, but inside I feel like I can hold my head up high, be proud, and hopefully be a stronger individual when this is over. I've definitely made mistakes, both how I have approached parts of the problem, and how I approached parts of our "relationship" before I knew. She has given me two amazing children and I will always have a special bond with her because of them, but it will end there.

I know this feeling I have at moment is probably a placebo, and it's going to hurt like hell over the next few weeks, but I'm ready to jump off the cliff.

I thank you for your continued support.


----------



## anchorwatch

She's got to face and sort her own demons, O. 

You can't do it for her.


----------



## farsidejunky

You are making the right decision, brother.

Stay strong. The madness from her is far from over.


----------



## NoChoice

oxygene said:


> Hey guys, I'm writing this in bed alone as she has done a disappearing act. She's been sending me strange messages all day, telling me "I'm a great dad", "she's ashamed", "she can't think", "she loves me". I basically ignored them. When I got home from work she told me my sister had been to visit her (she doesn't know, I havent had time to take my wife and tell her yet). I told my wife she should have told her what's she's done because she'll be finding out soon anyway, my statement didn't contain much emotion.
> 
> She then tells me she was going for quick walk to clear her head as she had been stuck in all day "thinking", that was 3 hours ago. I have bathed, fed, played with my kids, put them to bed, cleaned up, had a shower and she is still missing.
> 
> I checked to see if C still had an active profile on his swinger site, it's disappeared, I'm not an idiot. I'm assuming (in fact I'm sure) she's either contacted him and told him I plan to use this as edvidence in a custody battle if it comes down to it, or he's trying to prove his "love" for her by removing it. She's obviously had contact with him, that I am sure of. Luckily I already have screen grabs.
> 
> A part of me feels like I should be worried about her, but this is a clear abandonment in my eyes.
> 
> It's been 5 days now since I confronted her, and In my heart I've known for a little longer than that. I've already had enough. I'm giving up on her and our relationship, I need to make sure my kids are ok. I feel like I've lived a year this past week. A few of you have said that even if we Somehow do come through this I'll be married to a different woman I knew, in a different marriage. I've been thinking about this today and I can see it's true. I've decided I don't want to pour my life, soul and efforts into a stranger that used to be my wife.
> 
> I feel like I've given up too easily, but I don't want to trust her again. Strangely I feel strong, stronger and more confident than I've felt in a long time. I'm speaking to a lawyer tomorrow, I'm booked in for an STD test on Friday. You all have different views and that is fine, but inside I feel like I can hold my head up high, be proud, and hopefully be a stronger individual when this is over. I've definitely made mistakes, both how I have approached parts of the problem, and how I approached parts of our "relationship" before I knew. She has given me two amazing children and I will always have a special bond with her because of them, but it will end there.
> 
> I know this feeling I have at moment is probably a placebo, and it's going to hurt like hell over the next few weeks, but I'm ready to jump off the cliff.
> 
> I thank you for your continued support.


Do not be surprised if you feel differently tomorrow. They do not call it a roller coaster for nothing. Time will ultimately allow you to decide as you sort through all of the emotions swirling wildly in your mind. You will run the gamut from deep loss to rage to indifference and everything in between. In the end you will decide what is best for you and the children to the very best of your ability.

In the interim, simply take care of yourself and those children, you are their only stable parent at the moment. Their best interest is not foremost in her mind so it is up to you. I wish you strength and good fortune.


----------



## ThePheonix

oxygene said:


> I know this feeling I have at moment is probably a placebo, and it's going to hurt like hell over the next few weeks, but I'm ready to jump off the cliff.


When you have doubts about your actions, ask yourself if, knowing what you know now, you would marry her all over again. (don't make having the kids part of it. Its only to keep things in perspective.)


----------



## Iver

Difficult choices can become easy when you really have no choice. You made it very clear the consequences of her actions. Unless she can somehow prove she didn't contact the OM I don't see what other options were available to you.

That being said you will probably have joint custody after the divorce. If that is the case I hope you can encourage your STBXW to get some IC (ind. counseling) 

Her behavior - hooking up with someone she knows is a swinger/dirt bag- is alarming.


----------



## JohnA

She most likely has metup with him. Her fanasty bubble is deflating and she is desperate to see if any of it was real. Understand he is her all wise mentor. At this point the blame games kick in. Right now she hates you for turning er into a chea tart. You are the evil one destroying her life and stealing her children. You need to be punished.

This is yet another valuebof the 180. Use it to shield yourself against this onset of emotions. Do not respond, a response only adds fuel to the fire. Do not even say I disagree, say only I regret you feel this way and let it burn out. 

While I understand her need for closure with him, your need to know she values you more by going cold turkey far out weighs this. In a very real sense by going to him she has put in your mind that you will always be second choice.


----------



## sidney2718

Her "vanishing" is worrisome. If she's stays missing for two days, file a police report.

I say this because there is the odd chance that she's hurt herself. And there is the most likely chance that she's gone off to see the OM. When it comes to the inevitable custody battle, a police report could come in handy.


----------



## Sports Fan

Gone missing you say.

(Cough Cough) Chris's place comes to mind.

Seriously change the locks while she out.


----------



## G.J.

If she's not done anything stupid she will be doing what a lot of women do in this stage and that is to sort out with the OM and see what's on offer

Be prepared for her to come back to you very remorseful with a solid story giving as little truth as she can get away with

This will test your resolve if you have decided your course

Just trust your instinct and what you know and have seen as this is a women who has given her self away for sex and may be to more than the OM just to please him


----------



## it-guy

you sound pretty strong dude. This place you are in is very difficult. I know I probably make it sound easy. And it IS easy....when you are close to 5 years out like me  It absolutely sucks where you are right now, and I am sorry for that.

Stay strong for you and your kids, knowing that you are doing what is right. Things will work out one way or another. I am actually impressed with how you seem to be handling this so far.


----------



## anchorwatch

You thought you could be strong. You weren't ready for this. Addicts fail. Now comes the hard part. Steel yourself.


----------



## PhillyGuy13

You've done well these past few days. Before your most recent update, I was going to comment that once the weekend is over and you are back to work she will make every effort to meet up with him. I'm just surprised it took until Tuesday.

Stay strong, keep posting. You sound like a great dad. That's priority one at this point.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Roselyn

If I'm the betting kind, I would bet that she would come back home if her lover will not leave his wife and family for her. She is making herself available to him. You are Plan B for her as demonstrated in her disappearing act. Be ready for this to happen.

See your attorney ASAP as you've planned. You really need to see a psychologist as I believe that your emotions is going to be at a roller coaster ride. You need to have some emotional assistance as your stress level is going to escalate.

Your wife cares only about herself and her lover presently. Take care of yourself and your children. Sorry that you are here.


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## eastsouth2000

oxygene said:


> +
> 
> I know this feeling I have at moment is probably a placebo, and it's going to hurt like hell over the next few weeks, but *I'm ready to jump off the cliff.*
> 
> I thank you for your continued support.


DONT YOU EVEN!

think of your children!

you are not alone man thousands if millions of people go through this.

this is what we call crisis in our lives. it happens to all and we must do our very best to cope.

Things look bleak but they will get better. Have Faith and Trust.

There is always light on the end of a dark tunnel.
Just Keep Moving Forward!

If there is something you must not give-up on. That's your self.
Never ever give up on yourself!


----------



## Decorum

Oxygene,

Your natural instinct are dead on, keep trusting them.

Cheating changes you. She has become the product of her choices.

She does not love or respect you any longer, often women in these situations do not want to leave a marriage that gives them 80% of what they need they just want to get that other 20% on the side.

Till they get caught and it all comes crashing down. Then we see the spectical of a woman throwing away 80% for 20%.

Often as consequences mount they come running back but not for the right reasons. They have become a "taker" trying to negotiate their best deal. The cost to you (which is great) does not even factor into their thinking.

From my read your wife has not shown real remorse yet. It may happen IDK. Many WW's fail and contact the Om again breaking NC that is more the rule than the execption.

Its a bad sign that she is risking everything to meet up with him again. Dont doubt for a second thats what happened.

You have to follow through and file imo.

Maybe if she works her butt off to show remorse, the future can be different, but her current focus is her own fulfillment and I cant see her having it in her.

Stay the course and make good decisions from a position of strength, the only uncertanity you have to live with now is what you allow.

This is a stomach turner.

I really wish you and your family well.
Take care.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## the guy

sidney2718 said:


> Her "vanishing" is worrisome. If she's stays missing for two days, file a police report.
> 
> I say this because there is the odd chance that she's hurt herself. And there is the most likely chance that she's gone off to see the OM. When it comes to the inevitable custody battle, a police report could come in handy.


That and it will look bad that you didn't try to find her. 
If by some slim chance she got killed the cops will be looking at you.

Call the cops now then go down and fill out a report after 24 hours....cover your @ss!


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## the guy

Granted she will be pissed you called the cops, but bad behavior has consequences.

I mean it's not like she told you she was going out for the evening......SHE WENT FOR A PHUCKING WALK!!!!!

She deserves getting the cops called on her for pulling this shyt.


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## Mr Blunt

If you are through with her then focus on ONLY you and your children. You will be tempted to be drawn back into being involved with her is some way but be much disciplined. You have decide that she is history for you so make sure that you do not waste any time with her but do everything to build yourself up and your children.


Your future is with you and your children and you need to be very determined because the draw back to her will be strong and often. 


Get all the help you can from every source; be diligent and you will have a better life than you have right now.


----------



## SadandAngry

eastsouth2000 said:


> DONT YOU EVEN!
> 
> 
> 
> think of your children!
> 
> 
> 
> you are not alone man thousands if millions of people go through this.
> 
> 
> 
> this is what we call crisis in our lives. it happens to all and we must do our very best to cope.
> 
> 
> 
> Things look bleak but they will get better. Have Faith and Trust.
> 
> 
> 
> There is always light on the end of a dark tunnel.
> 
> Just Keep Moving Forward!
> 
> 
> 
> If there is something you must not give-up on. That's your self.
> 
> Never ever give up on yourself!



He's speaking metaphorically, he means he is ready to proceed with a divorce. As he should. I'd head out to the hardware store and buy an external lockset to put on your bedroom door. Toss all her **** in the spare room, and keep your room locked all the time. You likely can't lock her out of the house legally, but that room will send a message, for what it's worth (not a lot, but it'll take a while for the living well is the best revenge to pay dividends, you gotta take what you can get now).


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## SadandAngry

One other thought. You made the ultimatum, and now you're about to follow up, It might be pointed out that you can stop pursuing the divorce at any time. Once you start, you should have a point to proceed to, no matter what. Something that will show your resolve, and something you've decided that she cannot influence. I don't know what that point is, maybe once you talk to the lawyer, options will be clear. Maybe once she gets served papers at the very least.


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## Chaparral

Have you checked her phone records? Notified anyone?

Did she come back?

The odd messages worry me more than the leaving.


----------



## Be smart

Now you need to be even stronger my friend for yourself and your kids.

Dont go into depression. Play with your kids,talk to your family,friends or therapist.

I would like to know about her phone and mail records,or did she buy a new phone for herself and C?

One more thing,did she ever apologize to you? I know she is crying for C but I thought she loves her kids 

Prepare yourself because she will come back with NEW lies. Also I wish you luck with STDs check.



Stay strong


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## ThePheonix

Oxygene, I told you back a post #3 she may bolt if you hold her feet to the fire. Her compulsion to dialog with cuz was beyond revealing. You've got a tiger by the tail my man. If I'z you, I turn her loose before she does any more damage.


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## Decorum

The eye of the hurricane is passing over.

The wind changes direction next.

Poor guy.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## JohnA

It's 7;30 am in London. He has not posted in over a day. Not good. Hope he, his kids, and wife are physically ok. Any uk members see anything in the papers?


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## sidney2718

JohnA said:


> It's 7;30 am in London. He has not posted in over a day. Not good. Hope he, his kids, and wife are physically ok. Any uk members see anything in the papers?


I'm concerned too. I hope the OP lets us know.


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## cdbaker

I'm guessing that she is feeling extremely lost and scared. Remember, for women SECURITY is one of their biggest needs. The security of knowing they have shelter, food, someone who loves them, friends who will support them and call on, etc. For her, all of that has immediately been put in jeopardy. Regardless of how she imagined all of this panning out (leaving you for OM eventually, this just being a secret fling that would end quietly someday and the marriage would soldier on) she certainly didn't think she would lose EVERYTHING so suddenly. No I'm sure her family won't disown her, but her shame runs deep right now and she knows they won't support her right now. OM probably is backpedaling too. Even if she were thinking about a long term future with OM, she knows that possibility has been severely damaged now, that her family already probably hates him, that no reasonably decent person would support such a relationship, at least not for a long while after a divorce.

Plus, suddenly being cut off from the lifeline of lovey-dovey good feelings she was getting from OM, feeling mostly alone at home all day, afraid of what might come out next, with no support system, etc. will be ENORMOUSLY difficult for her to get through. If she's "relapsed" and contacted him (which I'm guessing she has at least tried to do), I wouldn't at all be surprised. Again as I mentioned in my last text, I've been through this exact situation myself with my wife.

As someone else said above, realize that you're probably still on an emotional roller coaster, that your feelings will change substantially from day to day. Don't feel like you need to make any major decisions right now, or stick to any decisions you feel like you committed to recently. In fact, I'd avoid any major decisions until the waves have calmed a bit, both with you emotionally and your wife's emotions and actions in the immediate aftermath of everything.


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## turnera

oxy, it's fairly predictable that she 'had' to have one last contact with him. It would be like telling you that you could never see your child again and weren't allowed to say goodbye to him.

Just pointing out that her deep need to do this is not a direct justification that she's a horrible person. Just human.

That said, I'd like to know what happened next.


----------



## oxygene

Hi guys. Again, I feel like I have lived a lifetime in the last couple of days. I shall carry on the update. Apologies for not posting for a couple of days, laywer/her/life have been a whirlwind.

So, Wednesday evening gmt she does a disappearing act, I posted to you guys then went to bed. At 1:30am I get a call from her dad, he tells me she rang him and told him she chose C, and she was taking my kids to him. I broke down and told him that it is never going to happen. Her "5 min walk" led her to his home where she decided she wanted to be with him, fine. But she will not take my kids. My dad in law tells me he is coming round as he will not let her take them... Her own father doesn't trust her. 

She turns up around 3 am and is confronted with me telling her (with more emotion than I Care to admit) that there is no way she will ever take my kids away from me to him, and her parents telling her she is a disgrace to their family. Her dad lectures her for a good few minutes telling her she is a disgrace, that she has ruined his family and his relation with his bro (his bro is C's step father), that he used to be proud of her, that he feels dirty because of her actions. I sat and listened full of emotion. She says it was a "misunderstanding" and she would never take our children out of our family home, my father in law is adamant that's what she said. 

She sits there nonchalant, not appearing to care about the madness her actions are causing. Her parents were laying into her like you wouldn't believe, telling her to F off to C and we will cope as a family unit, telling her that she is a disgrace, that they 100% stand by me... They kind of made it worse... But they were there for me, I appreciated their support.

They left finally around 4am Thursday morning, I told my wife it was over and went to bed. Told her she was not welcome in my bed and made her sleep on the couch. 

Next morning I took my wedding band off, told her I wanted hers too (wedding band and engagement ring), she gave them to me. I should have had a meeting 100 miles away but I cancelled due to lack of sleep. I took my ring and hers, went to the shed and attempted to cut them in half. They are all platinum so my hacksaw couldn't do the job.. It was kind of comical... At one point I was standing there beating the living #%^* out of the rings with a 2lb lump hammer but to no avail, in the end I stood out the front of my house and threw them as far as I could, I needed to because they represented nothing anymore, just 10 years of lies being married to a stranger.

Me taking the rings off of her affected her a lot... But.... It was the call she received that afternoon (yesterday, Thursday) that changed her... It was C, he told her that "maybe she should try with her marriage, because he was going to try to get his family back too" - translation - he doesn't want her. Suddenly Her tune changes, she's remorseful, she wants to change, she hates what she has done. I was tempted to believe her hot air, but I refrained. It is exactly what a couple of you hinted at, ie she was looking for the "best deal" she could get. She wants him, she wanted to take my kids to him, he turned her down, now she wants me. I'm sorry but I don't deserve it.

I tell her I'm not interested and I'll see her in court, she begs me not to "put kids through court", I tell her I have no choice and I can't trust her. She is not a fit mother at present, I want to believe her but u can't.

I tell her to write down what she wants (asset splits, child access etc), and if I agree we can avoid court, if we can't agree I will take it to the law. She starts writing, but tells me it's too painful to write it down... I know she is trying to manipulate me. I tell her she has to complete it, if I can agree to her expectations we'll get it endorsed through a lawyer, if it isn't something I can agree to I will drag her through the courts and fight with every ounce of strength to gain custody of my kids. I feel her emotions have clouded her beyond recognition. I do not love this woman. She might be "in the fog", but it's too late to save the marriage, there's only so much pain I can take before resentment will never allow her into my heart again, and we've more that passed that point. 

She keeps trying to play the victim, telling me her parents hate her and she will never have a proper relationship with them again (her dad especially has taken it harder than I have, he is off work with stress, I love him but I know ultimately she is his daughter and he will come round to love her again no matter who she is with and who she's chooses, and quite rightly), telling me she is confused. I have spoken to a lawyer, I have not locked her out if family home but she will sleep away from me. She keeps telling me she doesn't know what to do, I have given her until the Sunday to offer me a solution (post marriage I mean, if I can avoid a court battle I will but I want her to give an offer which avoids that), unless she agrees that I have children the majority of time I feel I have no choice but to take my case in front of a judge.

She seems lost at the mo, she says her short comings are my fault, it's my fault I disposed of rings, it's my fault there is no chance between us, it's my fault she betrayed me etc. In the pit off belly I love her for giving me my 2 gorgeous kids, but I can't help but hate what she has done to this family. I will not allow her to manipulate me or the situation anymore. 

Divorce and court, unless she can offer me something better then it'll be just divorce.

Tonight (Friday) I left her at home and went out with a friend of mine (asked my parents to have the kids, didn't want her at home alone with them). Had a few drinks and put the world to rights. I didn't think about her once, I told my friend what she's done, I felt better, I'm not ashamed.

I'd by lying if I said this is easy for me. My mind is constantly full of "what ifs". I hate her, I love her, I hate her, I love her. At the mo I'm successfully managing the weaker moments, and will continue to do so, because I genuinely do not trust her state of mind at present.

Post C giving her the cold shoulder, we had a very frank conversation around the circumstances about how "it" began... I do not wish to share the convo, but needless to say she said things like "I thought I'd do it once just to get it out of my system"... I'm man enough to share with you that I have had a lot of temptation and opportunities over the years I have been with her, and I never for one monent ever considered cheating on her, and have always turned them down/avoided situations and stayed true to my wife. Some details of that convo were horrific and will hurt me for a long time.

Thank you for your continued support.


----------



## turnera

Wow. Your strength is admirable. I would advise not to move too quickly. Don't make decisions in the heat of the moment. It's possible that this could be her rock bottom and she could come out the other side a completely new woman, worthy of marrying. Just don't go rushing, ok?


----------



## G.J.

Stiff upper lip chap

You deserve better and eventually *WILL* find some one who respects you and will love you the same way you love them as there's a whole world of nice women out there

Women like her are a minority don't ever forget that


----------



## Bibi1031

I am truly sorry that you have to listen to all that ugliness. It's not fair, but it is what it is in your particular situation. 

Keep the focus on your kids. She will take her journey and you yours.

Fight for your kids. She will be a hot mess for a while. She will be her poor parents responsibility. I feel terrible for her parents. This $hit is very hard. 

(((((hugs))))) I know your going through hell, but you gotta keep on going. No other way through this mess.

Bibi


----------



## farsidejunky

turnera said:


> Wow. Your strength is admirable. I would advise not to move too quickly. Don't make decisions in the heat of the moment. It's possible that this could be her rock bottom and she could come out the other side a completely new woman, worthy of marrying. Just don't go rushing, ok?


Not until she owns the affair. 

Even then... I'm not normally a plan B / plan A endorser, but if there was ever a shining example, the last 48 hours is it.

I don't see how I could do it, T.


----------



## Divinely Favored

She was C's ***** and nothing more who chose immoral sex romps over her husband and children....always remember that!!!! She even told you! You can find a MUCH, MUCH BETTER wife than a lying adulterous woman.


----------



## bfree

I'm so sorry that things have turned out this way. The fact that she is mega blameshifting doesn't bode well if a reconciliation were to be attempted. But as Turnera said stranger things have happened. It was fairly predictable that C would not want her once he knew he could have her. When the fantasy becomes reality its not nearly as sweet. One thing to remember, most couples that divorce still love each other on some level. It's usually not lack of love that causes a divorce. Broken trust, erosion of respect, a buildup of resentment are the more usual causes. You will always love your wife. You just might not be able to be married to her.


----------



## italianjob

Whatever you decide, before you even think about the chance of reconciling with her, find out everything you would be forgiving.
I'm afraid that whatever came out in that convo may just be the tip of the iceberg. That swinger site stuff sounds quite disturbing...

Stay strong.


----------



## Bibi1031

italianjob said:


> Whatever you decide, before you even think about the chance of reconciling with her, find out everything you would be forgiving.
> I'm afraid that whatever came out in that convo may just be the tip of the iceberg. That swinger site stuff sounds quite disturbing...
> 
> Stay strong.


Not only that, her blame shifting is not helping one bit. No remorse. No owning to the damage she caused Oxygen or her kids. She has a long, sad, disturbing road ahead of her.

Oxygen knows her plan B will never be good enough. Heck, I don't think her Plan A would ever be good enough.

That convo was very disturbing indeed...too many mind movies Oxygen to not realize bridges have been burned beyond recognition.

I'm truly sorry, but at least your limbo is ending...that is the worst part of this roller coaster ride...Limbo Sucks!

Bibi


----------



## JohnA

I am thankful she did not hurt herself, other then that nothing for her except good luck, try not to make the same mistake again. 

As to her, she will remain broken until she realIzes it is not about her anymore. As to her pleas:

First: yes there are fault lines in the marriage. Yes they need to be fixed, but why should you not fix them with a new wife? Why??
Her decision to commit adultery. Adultery is an ugly cruel word. Adultery and affair are like murder to killing. While murder away involves killing, killing is not always murder.

Do a hard 180. Ask her father to make sure the mother of your children has a safe place to sleep and something to eat. I am asking you to be coldly indifferent. Do not ever leave her alone with your children. Believe her when she said she wants to take the children. In a sense 'C" block heel. Use your inlaws and family to help you.

If you break the 180, ask her does she realize the mind movies that are running though your mind? Does she want a listnof porn sites to view? Does she understand the term "sloppy @&@&" ask her is she women enough to heal you first?

Next "C". He must be dealt with. Leave no cancer cell behind. Have the heart of an assassin. Only act with cold precision. I will post a link to a thread to another UK poster on how he destroyed his OM job, and is driving him from his community.


----------



## JohnA

Sorry he is on another board. Would you care for me to PM you the link ?


----------



## GusPolinski

oxygene said:


> Hi guys. Again, I feel like I have lived a lifetime in the last couple of days. I shall carry on the update. Apologies for not posting for a couple of days, laywer/her/life have been a whirlwind.
> 
> So, Wednesday evening gmt she does a disappearing act, I posted to you guys then went to bed. At 1:30am I get a call from her dad, he tells me she rang him and told him she chose C, and she was taking my kids to him. I broke down and told him that it is never going to happen. Her "5 min walk" led her to his home where she decided she wanted to be with him, fine. But she will not take my kids. My dad in law tells me he is coming round as he will not let her take them... Her own father doesn't trust her.
> 
> She turns up around 3 am and is confronted with me telling her (with more emotion than I Care to admit) that there is no way she will ever take my kids away from me to him, and her parents telling her she is a disgrace to their family. Her dad lectures her for a good few minutes telling her she is a disgrace, that she has ruined his family and his relation with his bro (his bro is C's step father), that he used to be proud of her, that he feels dirty because of her actions. I sat and listened full of emotion. She says it was a "misunderstanding" and she would never take our children out of our family home, my father in law is adamant that's what she said.
> 
> She sits there nonchalant, not appearing to care about the madness her actions are causing. Her parents were laying into her like you wouldn't believe, telling her to F off to C and we will cope as a family unit, telling her that she is a disgrace, that they 100% stand by me... They kind of made it worse... But they were there for me, I appreciated their support.
> 
> They left finally around 4am Thursday morning, I told my wife it was over and went to bed. Told her she was not welcome in my bed and made her sleep on the couch.
> 
> Next morning I took my wedding band off, told her I wanted hers too (wedding band and engagement ring), she gave them to me. I should have had a meeting 100 miles away but I cancelled due to lack of sleep. I took my ring and hers, went to the shed and attempted to cut them in half. They are all platinum so my hacksaw couldn't do the job.. It was kind of comical... At one point I was standing there beating the living #%^* out of the rings with a 2lb lump hammer but to no avail, in the end I stood out the front of my house and threw them as far as I could, I needed to because they represented nothing anymore, just 10 years of lies being married to a stranger.
> 
> Me taking the rings off of her affected her a lot... But.... It was the call she received that afternoon (yesterday, Thursday) that changed her... It was C, he told her that "maybe she should try with her marriage, because he was going to try to get his family back too" - translation - he doesn't want her. Suddenly Her tune changes, she's remorseful, she wants to change, she hates what she has done. I was tempted to believe her hot air, but I refrained. It is exactly what a couple of you hinted at, ie she was looking for the "best deal" she could get. She wants him, she wanted to take my kids to him, he turned her down, now she wants me. I'm sorry but I don't deserve it.
> 
> I tell her I'm not interested and I'll see her in court, she begs me not to "put kids through court", I tell her I have no choice and I can't trust her. She is not a fit mother at present, I want to believe her but u can't.
> 
> I tell her to write down what she wants (asset splits, child access etc), and if I agree we can avoid court, if we can't agree I will take it to the law. She starts writing, but tells me it's too painful to write it down... I know she is trying to manipulate me. I tell her she has to complete it, if I can agree to her expectations we'll get it endorsed through a lawyer, if it isn't something I can agree to I will drag her through the courts and fight with every ounce of strength to gain custody of my kids. I feel her emotions have clouded her beyond recognition. I do not love this woman. She might be "in the fog", but it's too late to save the marriage, there's only so much pain I can take before resentment will never allow her into my heart again, and we've more that passed that point.
> 
> She keeps trying to play the victim, telling me her parents hate her and she will never have a proper relationship with them again (her dad especially has taken it harder than I have, he is off work with stress, I love him but I know ultimately she is his daughter and he will come round to love her again no matter who she is with and who she's chooses, and quite rightly), telling me she is confused. I have spoken to a lawyer, I have not locked her out if family home but she will sleep away from me. She keeps telling me she doesn't know what to do, I have given her until the Sunday to offer me a solution (post marriage I mean, if I can avoid a court battle I will but I want her to give an offer which avoids that), unless she agrees that I have children the majority of time I feel I have no choice but to take my case in front of a judge.
> 
> She seems lost at the mo, she says her short comings are my fault, it's my fault I disposed of rings, it's my fault there is no chance between us, it's my fault she betrayed me etc. In the pit off belly I love her for giving me my 2 gorgeous kids, but I can't help but hate what she has done to this family. I will not allow her to manipulate me or the situation anymore.
> 
> Divorce and court, unless she can offer me something better then it'll be just divorce.
> 
> Tonight (Friday) I left her at home and went out with a friend of mine (asked my parents to have the kids, didn't want her at home alone with them). Had a few drinks and put the world to rights. I didn't think about her once, I told my friend what she's done, I felt better, I'm not ashamed.
> 
> I'd by lying if I said this is easy for me. My mind is constantly full of "what ifs". I hate her, I love her, I hate her, I love her. At the mo I'm successfully managing the weaker moments, and will continue to do so, because I genuinely do not trust her state of mind at present.


She showed you precisely who she is and exactly that she wants (and make no mistake, if it were still on offer, she'd be out the door) when she pulled her disappearing act, and her continued attempts at blameshifting serve to underscore that.

F*ck that noise.



oxygene said:


> Post C giving her the cold shoulder, we had a very frank conversation around the circumstances about how "it" began... I do not wish to share the convo, but needless to say she said things like "I thought I'd do it once just to get it out of my system"... I'm man enough to share with you that I have had a lot of temptation and opportunities over the years I have been with her, and I never for one monent ever considered cheating on her, and have always turned them down/avoided situations and stayed true to my wife. Some details of that convo were horrific and will hurt me for a long time.
> 
> Thank you for your continued support.


Once? LOL.

It was WAY more than once, and there was probably more than just a single OM.

Hell, I'd be willing to bet that there were a few OWs as well.


----------



## VFW

Right now emotions are obviously very high and I understand your anger and frustrations with her. However, there is little gained by going to court, the only one who wins in court are attorneys. Eventually, you and your wife need to agree on child custody and property settlement. Also while you have negative feelings for her now, your children still love her and you need to restrain from outbursts when they are home. I think you also should consider counseling to be prepared for co-parenting going forward. You are going to go through a plethora of emotions, that is fine, but don’t let them overcome good decisions. Hang in there big guy, I know this is tough.


----------



## Marc878

Hmmmmm, what does she have to do to convince you it's over??? She was taking the kids to him.

You aren't even plan B. Ugh


----------



## Be smart

Oh God this woman. She will never understand what she has done to you and your family.
She is still blaming you for her cheating and destroying your marriage.

In other hand it is a good thing she told you she wants to be with C,because you can proceed with D papers and get rid of this woman. Also your healing can start when you show her your back.

Stay strong and spend a lot of time with your kids. Ignore your soon to ex wife,no hugs,no listening to her crying about C.


----------



## oxygene

GusPolinski said:


> She showed you precisely who she is and exactly that she wants (and make no mistake, if it were still on offer, she'd be out the door) when she pulled her disappearing act, and her continued attempts at blameshifting serve to underscore that.
> 
> F*ck that noise.
> 
> 
> 
> Once? LOL.
> 
> It was WAY more than once, and there was probably more than just a single OM.
> 
> Hell, I'd be willing to bet that there were a few OWs as well.


It was definitely more than once.. That's just how the conversation started and how she tried to justify her actions. In her own mind I think she was trying appease me, saying things along the lines of "we didn't do anything kinky, he didn't do anything that you couldn't". 

She detailed every time they met up for sex, which I worked out anyway. She'd say she was going out for drinks with her friends, then text me around 12am saying she's going to a club. She'd leave here, go to a hotel, have sex a couple of times then come home. She'd spend all day talking to him whilst I was at work, they'd send each other pictures, she'd get jealous when we was being active on swing site with other women. One thing that cuts real deep, on more than one occasion she had sex with him, then comes home and wakes me up, pretends she's drunk and had a good night out with friends then had sex with me. I had std Test today, it was horrible, due results early next week, I hope I'm clear.

If you're 18, single and have regular "friends with benefits" I can half understand that kind of behaviour, I think a lot of us have been there in our younger days chasing as much tail as we can... But to do it to someone you've devoted your life to, it's a complete power play, I just don't get it.


----------



## Be smart

oxygene said:


> It was definitely more than once.. That's just how the conversation started and how she tried to justify her actions. In her own mind I think she was trying appease me, saying things along the lines of "we didn't do anything kinky, he didn't do anything that you couldn't".
> 
> She detailed every time they met up for sex, which I worked out anyway. She'd say she was going out for drinks with her friends, then text me around 12am saying she's going to a club. She'd leave here, go to a hotel, have sex a couple of times then come home. She'd spend all day talking to him whilst I was at work, they'd send each other pictures, she'd get jealous when we was being active on swing site with other women. One thing that cuts real deep, on more than one occasion she had sex with him, then comes home and wakes me up, pretends she's drunk and had a good night out with friends then had sex with me. I had std Test today, it was horrible, due results early next week, I hope I'm clear.
> 
> If you're 18, single and have regular "friends with benefits" I can half understand that kind of behaviour, I think a lot of us have been there in our younger days chasing as much tail as we can... But to do it to someone you've devoted your life to, it's a complete power play, I just don't get it.


Oh man .
This is another reason for you to serve her with D papers as soon as possible.

This shows me she has no respect or love for you at all.


Sorry again you are going through this


----------



## turnera

farsidejunky said:


> Not until she owns the affair.
> 
> Even then... I'm not normally a plan B / plan A endorser, but if there was ever a shining example, the last 48 hours is it.
> 
> I don't see how I could do it, T.


Ok, first, understand that I am NOT siding with her, minimizing what she did, or blaming oxy. I'm just providing my 'feeling' about how this all went down.

All I meant is don't take legal steps quickly when you can't tell if you're doing it because you're emotional or because it's what you really want. 

And his wife has gone through the biggest shock of her life - the way he magically stood up to her as he did, which we all know is NOT the norm in the outside world.

Overall, I think he acted admirably. But reading his first post-DD post, as I was going through it, I saw a man who was hurting, but who also wasn't really showing her a way home in a way that would make sense to HER. What I mean is, he seemed, from his description, stone cold. Strong, yes, which is what we always push, but I didn't see anything in there (maybe he skipped it) about how he wanted her and was willing to make a great life together; all I saw was 'I own you now and you'd better do what I want.'

But at the same time, from HER perspective, he shut her down like an iron mask and I can see how in a 24-hour period she went from being herself to being the world's biggest pariah with NO hope but to be his slave for the rest of her life. (again, HER viewpoint, as foggy as it was)

Given the way her family tore into her, and (from what he describes) a total lack of concern for her from oxy, I could see how she felt...why stay?

She was upset...he ignored her. She cried...he went into another room. He left her alone, he pushed for more shaming (telling her to admit what she did to his sister? really? On top of everything else?)...I just don't see how she felt that staying would be anything but torture.

Maybe it's just a miscommunication in how I read his posts. I hope so. Or maybe he's hurting so bad he can't let himself be vulnerable. I'm just saying to slow down, get a little more communication going before you go down the scorched earth path and take her kids away from her.

Given how FAR, and how HARD, she was pushed against a wall by him and her entire family - in such a short period, and then being further shamed by being 'walked' to each family to share her shame, and then being told to basically start telling everyone who calls what she did...her considering taking the kids to be with C seems a fairly normal knee-jerk response on her part.


----------



## oxygene

turnera said:


> Ok, first, understand that I am NOT siding with her, minimizing what she did, or blaming oxy. I'm just providing my 'feeling' about how this all went down.
> 
> All I meant is don't take legal steps quickly when you can't tell if you're doing it because you're emotional or because it's what you really want.
> 
> And his wife has gone through the biggest shock of her life - the way he magically stood up to her as he did, which we all know is NOT the norm in the outside world.
> 
> Overall, I think he acted admirably. But reading his first post-DD post, as I was going through it, I saw a man who was hurting, but who also wasn't really showing her a way home in a way that would make sense to HER. What I mean is, he seemed, from his description, stone cold. Strong, yes, which is what we always push, but I didn't see anything in there (maybe he skipped it) about how he wanted her and was willing to make a great life together; all I saw was 'I own you now and you'd better do what I want.'
> 
> But at the same time, from HER perspective, he shut her down like an iron mask and I can see how in a 24-hour period she went from being herself to being the world's biggest pariah with NO hope but to be his slave for the rest of her life. (again, HER viewpoint, as foggy as it was)
> 
> Given the way her family tore into her, and (from what he describes) a total lack of concern for her from oxy, I could see how she felt...why stay?
> 
> She was upset...he ignored her. She cried...he went into another room. He left her alone, he pushed for more shaming (telling her to admit what she did to his sister? really? On top of everything else?)...I just don't see how she felt that staying would be anything but torture.
> 
> Maybe it's just a miscommunication in how I read his posts. I hope so. Or maybe he's hurting so bad he can't let himself be vulnerable. I'm just saying to slow down, get a little more communication going before you go down the scorched earth path and take her kids away from her.
> 
> Given how FAR, and how HARD, she was pushed against a wall by him and her entire family - in such a short period, and then being further shamed by being 'walked' to each family to share her shame, and then being told to basically start telling everyone who calls what she did...her considering taking the kids to be with C seems a fairly normal knee-jerk response on her part.


From what I'm gleaning from your post you are saying she is the victim since her activities have been outed.

No disrespect, but you sound like my wife. I have NOT tried to own her, I have NOT used her kids against her, I have NOT tried to shame her. I have merely been honest, with regards to my kids, with regards to what she has done to me.

I am my kids father and will fight 100% for them, I do not feel she is being a sane individual at present, so why wouldn't I tell her exactly what I'll do if she tries to take them away, why wouldn't I tell her the truth about how hard I'll fight and the consequences of her actions? Maybe u should have pretended everything she did is ok so SHE feels better about herself. I do not want to be confrontational, and I have taken negative comments on the chin, but ur talking out your a$$.


----------



## brooklynAnn

Oxy, I am like you. You hurt and betray me, we are done. I am pulling out the big guns. I don't care about your feelings and I will take everything I can take.

It's your responsibility as a father to protect your kids. That, mean you take the kids if you have to. Don't buy into her bullish!t of being a victim and not knowing what she should do. She does not get to blame shift this on you. 

I like the actions you took. I wish more spouses would take the reins when something like this happen. Until, she wakes up you do what you have to do in order to survive and keep the kids going.


----------



## turnera

oxygene said:


> From what I'm gleaning from your post you are saying she is the victim since her activities have been outed.
> 
> No disrespect, but you sound like my wife. I have NOT tried to own her, I have NOT used her kids against her, I have NOT tried to shame her. I have merely been honest, with regards to my kids, with regards to what she has done to me.
> 
> I am my kids father and will fight 100% for them, I do not feel she is being a sane individual at present, so why wouldn't I tell her exactly what I'll do if she tries to take them away, why wouldn't I tell her the truth about how hard I'll fight and the consequences of her actions? Maybe u should have pretended everything she did is ok so SHE feels better about herself. I do not want to be confrontational, and I have taken negative comments on the chin, but ur talking out your a$$.


Looks like you did NOT read my caveats, where I in no way gave her a pass or blamed you.

What I SAID was that it sounds like you came across as cold and uncaring, and that could possibly translate into 'no hope.' That is all. And I hope I misunderstood.


----------



## TheTruthHurts

Turnera - I'm a bit confused by your post too. Are you simply saying that she was so selfish, deluded, and foggy to not think a day of reckoning would ever come? Because if that's it then of course many would agree. Only someone as delusional as her would have behaved so astonishingly horrendous and not expect everyone around her to be completely horrified, ashamed and just plain dirty for being in the same room. Even her father has issues with his own brother for her and POSOM's incredible behavior.

This is one of those situations where it's of us are wincing at the thought of her having to even live with herself after this.

There is no other play than "stone cold" against this soulless crazy selfish bi*ch.

Man this is horrendous...


----------



## turnera

First, we don't know she's a cold, heartless b*tch. She MAY just be a typical PEA-riddled junkie who has lost who she used to be. I've seen much worse in cheaters.

Second, ALL I'm saying is that the method of delivery MIGHT have been too far overboard, too BORG.

And that that method of delivery MIGHT have something to do with the way she went crazy and ran away. Psychologically speaking, it adds up.

That is all I said - that and not to jump into decisions until you've calmed down.


----------



## Marc878

turnera said:


> First, we don't know she's a cold, heartless b*tch. She MAY just be a typical PEA-riddled junkie who has lost who she used to be. I've seen much worse in cheaters.
> 
> Second, ALL I'm saying is that the method of delivery MIGHT have been too far overboard, too BORG.
> 
> And that that method of delivery MIGHT have something to do with the way she went crazy and ran away. Psychologically speaking, it adds up.
> 
> That is all I said - that and not to jump into decisions until you've calmed down.


Put yourself in OP's shoes. Seems like exposure just showed where she really wanted to be. Now she may become a wonderful wife after everything settles down. 

Good lord who would want that baggage?


----------



## turnera

After everything settles down...

which is WHY I posted and said don't go making rash decisions.


----------



## turnera

Marc878 said:


> Seems like exposure just showed where she really wanted to be.


Exposure is one thing.

Dragging your WS around to family member after family member, on the first night, and FORCING her to admit her adultery, on the first night, is not exposure. 

Exposure is what you do AFTER you confront your spouse and she refuses to end the affair.

He SHAMED her. And then shamed her some more by telling her she had to tell his sister ('since she'll know soon enough anyway'). What's next? Facebook? Twitter? National Enquirer?

And then he THREATENED HER by saying if she didn't do exactly as he said, she would be left alone, destitute, without her kids.

Strength is one thing, if combined with at least a HINT of compassion. 

This was scorched earth. I'm surprised she didn't try to kill herself.


----------



## Marc878

There is a point of no return. You never know but I think she crossed it.

As for the humiliation it goes with the territory.


----------



## the guy

turnera said:


> All I meant is don't take legal steps quickly when you can't tell if you're doing it because you're emotional or because it's what you really want.
> .


The statement would have made sense last week, but after being confronted and then wanting to work it out, OP's old lady goes for a phucking "walk"........then all bets are off........ she choose the OM period!

Time to take legal action!

I think that "walk" was the deal breaker....in fact I KNOW it was the deal breaker. It would have been mine.

I mean I can appreciate a good sl^t but #1 I won't share and #2 OP's old lady made a life changing choice and now it back fired.


On a side note I can see C telling her all kinds of lies, bangs her, and while lying in bed, she make a phone call to her dad telling him about her new life.
OM over hears this convo with her dad and says " hey i just wanted to bang you one last time, and the last thing i want is an old lady and a couple of kids.... I'm a swinger.....it's time for you to get out of my bed and leave".....

At the end of the day she had a choice after being confronted...face the consequences...like all the things turnera mentioned, be with oxy, and stay with a sure thing or.... go off with the swinger dude.

Sorry oxy, you could have had fun with that dumb sl^t if only she would have never gone for that "walk". Again I'm the kind of guy that can appreciate a good sl^t as long as I don't have to share her (I'm wired different then most).

At the end of the day it's hard to find a loyal sl^t that can make a commitment to only be your sl^t.......she choose someone else....time to take legal action and go find the kind of women you want to be with.


----------



## turnera

the guy said:


> At the end of the day it's hard to find a loyal sl^t that can make a commitment to only be your sl^t.......she choose someone else....time to take legal action and go find the kind of women you want to be with.


Sometimes I'm embarrassed to be part of TAM.


----------



## Mr Blunt

> *By OXYGENE*
> I told her unless contact with C ends right now it is over, she told me she needs to make sure he's ok and to let her ring him. I told her in no uncertain terms making contact with him of any kind is unacceptable, it's total darkness or it will be over.
> 
> Anyway, on Sunday afternoon her father left after giving her his 2 pence worth around how stupid she was. He was brutal, telling her she's a fool, how could she throw away her marriage over such a weird man
> 
> I told her that my point still stands, that if there is any contact it's done, and explained that It is well known in the family that C is not a good father to his own 2 kids, he is not (clearly!) a good partner to his now ex-wife. He never stayed faithful to her and was using swinger and affair sites for years, he wasn't overly involved in anything his children did (well known fact within the family). I told her in no uncertain terms that this man will not contribute to the upbringing of my children, and if she wants to go to him then so be it, but she will not be taking my I children with her
> 
> Yesterday evening in tears she tells me she loves me and wants to make us work again, but then she admitted in "desperation" she had tried to ring him on Sunday morning but her phone wouldn't let her due to the locks we (I) put in it.
> 
> Up until our second child was born we were always very close, we still were after he came along but parenting and life in general meant we didn't have as much time for each other as we would have liked, and I don't think that's unusual at all.
> 
> So, Wednesday evening gmt she does a disappearing act, I posted to you guys then went to bed. At 1:30am I get a call from her dad, he tells me she rang him and told him she chose C, and she was taking my kids to him.
> 
> My dad in law tells me he is coming round as he will not let her take them... Her own father doesn't trust her.
> 
> It was the call she received that afternoon (yesterday, Thursday) that changed her... It was C, he told her that "maybe she should try with her marriage, because he was going to try to get his family back too" - translation - he doesn't want her. Suddenly Her tune changes, she's remorseful, she wants to change, she hates what she has done
> 
> She wants him, she wanted to take my kids to him, he turned her down, now she wants me.
> 
> she says her short comings are my fault, it's my fault I disposed of rings, it's my fault there is no chance between us, *it's my fault she betrayed me etc.
> *



OXYGENE
You made yourself super clear and she knew exactly where you stood. She deliberately put C ahead of you on many occasions. She is very weak and cannot be trusted; even her father cannot trust her. She may be able to recover somewhat from this enormous selfish act in the years to come but she cannot expect you to take anymore stabs in the heart. 

It is very sad when innocent children have to pay the price for a partner that will choose their own ego and other selfish desires over their children but that is what she did. She will regret this for the rest of her life but OXYGENE is a strong man that gave her more than one chance. To say that she was in a fog is the understatment of the year and not even close to being able to understand her. 

*Why would a woman do what she did while knowing that her betraying partner never stayed faithful to his wife, used swinging and affair site for years and was a poor father?* I hope someone can give an explanation because this is mind boggling!


----------



## the guy

Marc878 said:


> There is a point of no return. You never know but I think she crossed it.
> 
> As for the humiliation it goes with the territory.


Speaking of humilation....your old lady is covered in it....I can't believe she had the balls to come back to you.

Who in the hell thinks they can run off with a player and bring the kids along?

I mean the OM is a known swinger...and yet your old lady thinks OM is worth taking a "walk" for!


----------



## Dyokemm

Turnera,

I almost always agree with and appreciate your posts.

And I do not disagree with you that Oxy's WW might have felt there was no hope.

However, if there was ever a time for her to realize the following things, this was it:

1) she was barely 24 hours into D-Day in a situation where her BH had just found out that she was screwing at least this one POS that he had ALREADY warned and confronted her about several times....of course Oxy was going to be OFF THE WALL p*ssed off after this.

And 

2) her M was literally hanging by a thread, and one further mis-step was going to mean the end of her life as she knew it.

That scene where SHE involved her own parents in a choice so reprehensible that even her own mom and dad came to her marital home in the middle of the night and stood unequivocally on the side of her BH.....this is a line I don't think there is ANY coming back from.

I don't think Oxy should ever consider changing course here.

Walking to this POS's house and then calling her parents to tell them she is choosing POS and going to take her kids out of their own beds in the middle of the night and remove them from their father to move to this sh*tbag's house.

Wow...easily one of the most disrespectful and horrendous decisions a WS has ever taken on any thread I've read.

And I don't know what Oxy's family and in-laws are like.....but if C was a member of my extended family....not only would he be a persona non grata forever for doing this to another relative....but he would actually have to 'disappear' from any contact with any of my uncles or cousins....there would be serious ramifications.


----------



## F-102

Really, she thought that she would move in on his family and home, kids in tow, and simply "replace" his W and kids? And then, she had the audacity to call her parents with the news... was she expecting them to be happy with her for making the "right" choice? Tell her that I have some beachfront property to sell her in Wyoming!

Like all women who get involved with married men, she really thought that he would welcome her into his marital home with open arms and kick his W out. Instead, he threw her under the bus.

And then she thought: "I'll go back to oxy, he will be so happy that I chose (settled for) him, that he will forgive me, we will be a family again, and then we will all have so many laughs over this someday..."

But instead, you showed her that you weren't buying it, and that you were made of sterner stuff.

Winston would be very proud of you!


----------



## turnera

Dyokemm said:


> That scene where SHE involved her own parents in a choice so reprehensible that even her own mom and dad came to her marital home in the middle of the night and stood unequivocally on the side of her BH.....this is a line I don't think there is ANY coming back from.


Did I miss something? How did *she* involve her own parents? He took HER there to her parents to spread her shame, from what I read. And after she left, she reached out to the only people she thought she could trust to save the situation, but even her own dad came over to further harangue her and shame her.

You guys are being very reactionary and purposely missing my points. You KNOW I always side on the betrayed spouse's side. 

I just think he took it too far, and she then faced a 500-foot wall of shame and humiliation, and she lost all hope.

He could have handled it with strength, easily. He made his point. Telling her to tell his sister...that was too far. And it made HIM look ugly.


----------



## minasaenz

turnera said:


> Did I miss something? How did *she* involve her own parents? He took HER there to her parents to spread her shame, from what I read. And after she left, she reached out to the only people she thought she could trust to save the situation, but even her own dad came over to further harangue her and shame her.
> 
> You guys are being very reactionary and purposely missing my points. You KNOW I always side on the betrayed spouse's side.
> 
> I just think he took it too far, and she then faced a 500-foot wall of shame and humiliation, and she lost all hope.
> 
> He could have handled it with strength, easily. He made his point. Telling her to tell his sister...that was too far. And it made HIM look ugly.


no, they are talking about the second time when his WW called her parents that she was going with C and that she was going to take the kids. 

This woman is crazy T. She can't just take the kids of Oxy.


----------



## Dyokemm

Turnera,

Check his last update.

When she went on her 'walk', she called her own dad from POSOM's place and told him she chose C....and was going back to the house (note, this is in the middle of the night OP says) to get her kids.

Her own dad came to Oxy's house to prevent her taking the kids....of course when she got there, she denied she ever really planned on taking the kids from their dad.


----------



## minasaenz

Dyokemm said:


> Turnera,
> 
> Check his last update.
> 
> When she went on her 'walk', she called her own dad from POSOM's place and told him she chose C....and was going back to the house (note, this is in the middle of the night OP says) to get her kids.
> 
> Her own dad came to Oxy's house to prevent her taking the kids....of course when she got there, she denied she ever really planned on taking the kids from their dad.


What he said


----------



## sidney2718

I'm going to jump in here and try to explain what I think Turnera was talking about. Of course she is more than capable of explaining herself, but most here have already decided that she's WRONG, Wrong, wrong, and no more need be said.

Let's look past the current situation. There are three groups involved here. There is Oxygene, his wife, and the kids. The kids need their parents. Totally destroying the wife won't help the kids a bit and, in fact, will hurt them in the long run.

So what should be done for the wife? Right now she has been stripped of her wedding ring, it is lost beyond recovery. That's a very dramatic gesture. She has no home to come to, no bed to rest on, and no children to hug and love. She's been totally abandoned by C, which hurts since she was willing to give up everything for him, and she's been totally abandoned by Oxygene.

How can she accept that this is all her fault. That she's dug herself a hole so deep that life has no meaning for her any more. If Oxygene ever loved her, and he did, and if her kids still love her, and they do, she needs a path out of the hole that can allow her to live her life in some fashion.

I am not talking reconciliation here. I'm talking rehabilitation. Oxygene holds all the cards at this point. The best she can hope for is to go to court and get what she can, including part custody of the children. I think Oxygene should go along with a suitable divorce that he can live with and that provides something for her.

And he'll have to deal with her in issues of child care. So they have to develop a way to talk to each other without descending into recriminations.

Right now she's surviving by shutting everything out and blaming it all on oxygene. She needs psychological help. I'd encourage her parents to help her as well. They are, after all, her parents and will provide help in the end. And there's a lot more.

In the end, she's not really a cold wet t*rd lying there in the gutter. She's a living, breathing human being who made a series of choices that were horribly bad and wrong. But she's still a human being.

None of this is a put-down of Oxygene, who doubtless wants nothing to do with her any more. But I think that he should wait a bit before drawing up a final list of what he wants from a divorce. She might even end up being remorseful enough for Oxygene to have a reasonable post-divorce relationship with her.


----------



## Dyokemm

"So, Wednesday evening gmt she does a disappearing act, I posted to you guys then went to bed. At 1:30am I get a call from her dad, he tells me she rang him and told him she chose C, and she was taking my kids to him. I broke down and told him that it is never going to happen. Her "5 min walk" led her to his home where she decided she wanted to be with him, fine. But she will not take my kids. My dad in law tells me he is coming round as he will not let her take them... Her own father doesn't trust her.

She turns up around 3 am and is confronted with me telling her (with more emotion than I Care to admit) that there is no way she will ever take my kids away from me to him, and her parents telling her she is a disgrace to their family. Her dad lectures her for a good few minutes telling her she is a disgrace, that she has ruined his family and his relation with his bro (his bro is C's step father), that he used to be proud of her, that he feels dirty because of her actions. I sat and listened full of emotion. She says it was a "misunderstanding" and she would never take our children out of our family home, my father in law is adamant that's what she said."

Turnera,

Here is the relevant part of his last update.

And I know you always side with the BS....I'm thinking you must have misread this part.


----------



## turnera

Honestly, if my H slvt-shamed me the way oxy did, kicked me out of the bedroom, dragged me all over town to spread my shame, destroyed my rings, and then told me to shame myself some more...I'd be thinking C was a better option, too.

And we don't know anything about what their marriage was like before this all happened. Only his side. If he's capable of this scorched earth policy, it makes me wonder what life was like BEFORE this happened.

Again, I am NOT blaming oxy for her cheating.

I'm just trying to say that a little head clearing is in order.


----------



## minasaenz

turnera said:


> Honestly, if my H slvt-shamed me the way oxy did, kicked me out of the bedroom, dragged me all over town to spread my shame, destroyed my rings, and then told me to shame myself some more...I'd be thinking C was a better option, too.


you can't be serious. Most women would have more sense than she has. C is a bad man. He was cheating on his wife with her and then he was also cheating on her because he was swinging with other women. No one in their right mind would go with C.

This girl is seriously ill, no buts about it.

as to her being shamed, well, he needed help from the people that could shake sense into her. desperate times require desperate measures. surely you understand the peculiarities of this particular situation T.


----------



## Mr Blunt

> *By Turnera*
> Honestly, if my H slvt-shamed me the way oxy did, kicked me out of the bedroom, dragged me all over town to spread my shame, destroyed my rings, and then told me to shame myself some more...I'd be thinking C was a better option, too.


Turnera
Did OXY react very strongly? YES he did

*Turnera WHO DREW FIRST BLOOD?*

She drew blood from the heart of his heart and had chances to stop the daggers but did not.

I like a LOT of your posts but cannot see this one as good as many of your others


----------



## turnera

IDK. There was a way to handle this, and he started OUT doing it exactly as we want them all to. Strong, determined, one chance only. Full of integrity.

But in my opinion, he lost that integrity after he started dragging her around. Now, I know that I tell BHs to insist their WS tell their parents. It's part of my to-do list to ensure success. 

But it's a far cry from saying "I want you to go tell my parents what you did and apologize" to TAKING her there on the first night, while she's reeling from the shock, and saying, basically, 'Do it. Do it. Tell them what a slvt you are.'

No integrity there.

And because she 'drew first blood' he gets to act like a cold-stone killer, basically, and slvt-shame her?

I mean, sure, he can do whatever he wants. I'll just say again that I'm not surprised he got the response he got. Psychology will out.


----------



## Mr Blunt

> By Sidney
> Let's look past the current situation. There are three groups involved here. There is Oxygene, his wife, and the kids. The kids need their parents. Totally destroying the wife won't help the kids a bit and, in fact, will hurt them in the long run.
> 
> So what should be done for the wife? Right now she has been stripped of her wedding ring, it is lost beyond recovery. That's a very dramatic gesture. She has no home to come to, no bed to rest on, and no children to hug and love. She's been totally abandoned by C, which hurts since she was willing to give up everything for him, and she's been totally abandoned by Oxygene.


After reading Sidney’s post I have to say that I hope that Ms. Oxy does not do anything real foolish. I worry that Ms. OXY has seemly lost everything that matters to her and maybe v devastated. I am not saying one thing against OXY but hope that Ms. OXY gets the right help so that she does not do something that will harm the children. Frankly, I hope that Ms. Oxy’s parents come to her side to get her help.

Oxy is a very strongman but he is not expected to take on Ms. Oxy’s devastation. *Ms. Oxy needs to be helped because she has those children and children almost always need their mother!*


----------



## Dyokemm

Turnera,

I agree that Oxy let the hammer fall HARD after he confronted her...but in his defense, she was not immediately remorseful or willing to unequivocally end it with this POS.....she only got remorseful after he dragged her to family members to expose the A.

Frankly, at that point with her initial attitude, she deserved it....especially considering who this sh*t bag was and the massive amounts of gaslighting and lies she had been feeding him for months....after all, he had confronted her specifically about this sh*tbag long before.

That said, I do agree with you that Oxy, in his anger, then continued to 'pile on'....especially when he told her to tell his sister, because she is going to know anyway.

That was a twist of the knife, and I agree WW may have reached the conclusion it was hopeless.

However, I still think she must have known the two points I mentioned in a post above....in particular that her entire M and family life as she knew it was hanging by a thread.

Yes Oxy's anger was white hot....but less than 48 hours after discovery, she would be foolish to be shocked by that fact.

So she let her despair drive her to make one of the worst decisions I have ever read about a WS making.

Bad enough to recontact POSOM, after all though she is hardly the first WS to pull that dumb stunt....but to call and involve her own parents in that drama about the kids in the middle of the night was beyond inexcusable.

She didn't just choose POSOM....she openly declared her choice to her own dad in the middle of the night, and threatened to drag the kids smack dab into the middle of the drama.

Totally reprehensible IMO.


----------



## MattMatt

I think there is an argument that she shamed herself and her own family by her actions and her fogbound thinking.


----------



## minasaenz

MattMatt said:


> I think there is an argument that she shamed herself and her own family by her actions and her fogbound thinking.


Yes, what he said.

I honestly don't think anything Oxy will or would or could have done would of changed anything. His WW is in the throws of this very addictive and destructive affair. She lashes out at him because she has no remorse and hates him. 

She shamed herself. Oxy did the best he could under the incredible circumstances. He didn't do it out of malice, he did it out of desperation. 

these are desperate times for this family.


----------



## tom67

Dyokemm said:


> Turnera,
> 
> I agree that Oxy let the hammer fall HARD after he confronted her...but in his defense, she was not immediately remorseful or willing to unequivocally end it with this POS.....she only got remorseful after he dragged her to family members to expose the A.
> 
> Frankly, at that point with her initial attitude, she deserved it....especially considering who this sh*t bag was and the massive amounts of gaslighting and lies she had been feeding him for months....after all, he had confronted her specifically about this sh*tbag long before.
> 
> That said, I do agree with you that Oxy, in his anger, then continued to 'pile on'....especially when he told her to tell his sister, because she is going to know anyway.
> 
> That was a twist of the knife, and I agree WW may have reached the conclusion it was hopeless.
> 
> However, I still think she must have known the two points I mentioned in a post above....in particular that her entire M and family life as she knew it was hanging by a thread.
> 
> Yes Oxy's anger was white hot....but less than 48 hours after discovery, she would be foolish to be shocked by that fact.
> 
> So she let her despair drive her to make one of the worst decisions I have ever read about a WS making.
> 
> Bad enough to recontact POSOM, after all though she is hardly the first WS to pull that dumb stunt....but to call and involve her own parents in that drama about the kids in the middle of the night was beyond inexcusable.
> 
> She didn't just choose POSOM....she openly declared her choice to her own dad in the middle of the night, and threatened to drag the kids smack dab into the middle of the drama.
> 
> Totally reprehensible IMO.


:iagree::iagree:
How rare is it when the in laws defend against their own child.

She is really chasing an affair high that in 20 or so years her kids don't want anything to do with her as in grandchildren.
But hey the grass is greener.
Now this is harsh and I feel for the husband and especially the kids.
I agree with most of this but come on she just died.

MGTOW HQ ? Men Going Their Own Way Forums ? View topic - Man Wins Lottery. Will He Blow It?


----------



## Dyokemm

Here are the specific points about her initial reaction BEFORE he took her around to expose that I am talking about.

"I told her unless contact with C ends right now it is over, she told me she needs to make sure he's ok and to let her ring him. I told her in no uncertain terms making contact with him of any kind is unacceptable, it's total darkness or it will be over.

I told her that in order for us to attempt to repair and move on she must give me access to all electrical devices, and tell me each form of contact she uses with him (fb, WhatsApp, sites etc). I took her phone and blocked/deleted each form of contact. She told me this was over the top and tried to turn this by saying that this shows I could never trust her again and "i can't do this to her because it's unfair". I told her this it absolute, and if she can't accept this term it's over.

I told her she will tell parents, extended family, Cs spouse. She said she couldn't and burst into tears, so (and I'm not sure if this is "right") I told them. I took her to her parents, my parents, Cs parents. There were lots of tears, but not from me (not outwardly)."

And even after this, he still had to deal with this the next morning: 

"After half hr of silence she tells me that her instincts are telling her to go to C and find out if he is ok (to say his wife didn't take the news well is an understatement, I've heard she has already moved a few hundred miles away to her parents, and taken Cs children with her). Again I reiterated (suprisingly calmly which I am proud of myself for), that if there is any contact at all it is over and she will not be coming back."

So Oxy's WW was FAR from committed or remorseful immediately after being confronted.

As I said before, IMO, she deserved being taken from place to place and exposed when she was continuing with this attitude and behavior.


----------



## TheTruthHurts

T - this is 1000% on her - she must own her sh*t. I get that it's tough and hopeless to come face to face with a sh*t sandwich of their own making. Yes she is and probably should feel hopeless about all this - because there is no or very very very little hope she can restore what she has smashed into a million pieces. Yes that is hard but it is reality and it is her reality. It's not OPs fault he showed her what she must own. Sorry


----------



## BrokenLady

I've read this whole thread & as a BS, as a human being! I feel desperately sorry for the OP's experience. My beloved brother took his own life after being brutally betrayed by his W. I think (at the start) many BS's would love the resolve that the OP has demonstrated. It was 'by the book' followed by some real revenge torture! I was just a pathetic 'Pick Me!' wimp for the longest time. 

What Turnera said was.....
"Given how FAR, and how HARD, she was pushed against a wall by him and her entire family - in such a short period, and then being further shamed by being 'walked' to each family to share her shame, and then being told to basically start telling everyone who calls what she did...her considering taking the kids to be with C seems a fairly normal knee-jerk response on her part."

To be completely honest, after reading all of this I don't agree. It really triggered me. I thought suicide would be the "normal knee-jerk response on her part."! PLEASE be observant. She's now been slapped down by C too. What real choices does SHE have left in her life (from her perception)? I have first hand experience of the LIFE TIME of emotional carnage that the suicide of a parent inflicts on their children & families. 

This isn't a 'Right' vs 'Wrong' post. This is a real live human being we are talking about.


----------



## Be smart

Please tell me this one,how can a husband or wife be wrong if they expose affair to family members and friends ?

Just put yourself in position where your wife or husband cheated on you and you would do the same thing. She was having sex with C and maybe others then coming back to her husband. I want to throw up.

He took of wedding rings,of course he took them,they have no meaning to him anymore.
He exposed her affair. Good thing. Damn she told him she wants C and she wanted to took children from him.

What is he going to do,stay at home,watching kids while she is out with swinger friends !!!


He did a great job and I hope he would find someday a woman who will respect him and love him.


----------



## JohnA

I hear you broken lady. My aunt's death was ruled a suicide. To this day I think it was actually accidental, if the BF had come home on time there was plenty of time to "save" her. In the end I think it was just a drama play.

So 0P does she have a friend you respect that you can reach out to and ask them to check in on her? I did to two of my WW friends. I was explicit with them that I did not want them to advocate for me, I was done and wanted her gone, but rather their friend had hooked up with a drunken ass. I never spoke with either again, either they could or could not help them.


----------



## JohnA

Oxygene 

I think both turnera and dokyemm are right. You need to find a way to achieve both there points. I have a habit of reviewing the past posts of individuals who have impressed me with a post. Both these gentleman have made many good points in past posts. Do you know how to find past posts of an individual? 

Research, research, research. You have a crisis on your plate. Would you care for other recommendations?


----------



## aine

the guy said:


> The statement would have made sense last week, but after being confronted and then wanting to work it out, OP's old lady goes for a phucking "walk"........then all bets are off........ she choose the OM period!
> 
> Time to take legal action!
> 
> I think that "walk" was the deal breaker....in fact I KNOW it was the deal breaker. It would have been mine.
> 
> I mean I can appreciate a good sl^t but #1 I won't share and #2 OP's old lady made a life changing choice and now it back fired.
> 
> 
> On a side note I can see C telling her all kinds of lies, bangs her, and while lying in bed, she make a phone call to her dad telling him about her new life.
> OM over hears this convo with her dad and says " hey i just wanted to bang you one last time, and the last thing i want is an old lady and a couple of kids.... I'm a swinger.....it's time for you to get out of my bed and leave".....
> 
> At the end of the day she had a choice after being confronted...face the consequences...like all the things turnera mentioned, be with oxy, and stay with a sure thing or.... go off with the swinger dude.
> 
> Sorry oxy, you could have had fun with that dumb sl^t if only she would have never gone for that "walk". Again I'm the kind of guy that can appreciate a good sl^t as long as I don't have to share her (I'm wired different then most).
> 
> At the end of the day it's hard to find a loyal sl^t that can make a commitment to only be your sl^t.......she choose someone else....time to take legal action and go find the kind of women you want to be with.




Enough of the sl*t talk, she's the mother of his kids, his partner for many years, her actions despicable for sure but have a bit of respect, you ignoramus!


----------



## aine

turnera said:


> Did I miss something? How did *she* involve her own parents? He took HER there to her parents to spread her shame, from what I read. And after she left, she reached out to the only people she thought she could trust to save the situation, but even her own dad came over to further harangue her and shame her.
> 
> You guys are being very reactionary and purposely missing my points. You KNOW I always side on the betrayed spouse's side.
> 
> I just think he took it too far, and she then faced a 500-foot wall of shame and humiliation, and she lost all hope.
> 
> He could have handled it with strength, easily. He made his point. Telling her to tell his sister...that was too far. And it made HIM look ugly.


Turnera, I get what you are saying, there are limits to vengefulness and the response of OP through his pain and hurt may well have crossed a line. The OP was seeking some form of justice. As some say revenge is an attempt to transform shame into pride and is primitive and destructive when taken to extremes. In his pursuit for reparation, exposure , to shame her for the damage done, he himself crossed a lone imo, it was no longer about justice or reparation but about crushing her or obliterating her completely. Revenge has to be tempered with some humanity, afterall she's still the mother of his kids, still someone he spent a fair part of his life with. And the sad thing is this will not give him the release he needs. The desire to exert his dominance will not increase his stature. Her remorse cannot be coerced.

I'll probably get blasted for this post, and I want to reiterate that what she did was awful but the extremes of dragging her around to declare her shame smacks of something from the Scarlet Letter, would any of you like that approach for your daughter, sister etc? BS must also maintain their dignity in the midst of such calamity, revenge in all its extremes does not work.


----------



## Dyokemm

Sorry,

I don't see that Oxy crossed any lines.

She was unremorseful, still wanted to stay in contact with this scumbag POS, was refusing transparency in communications, and refused to tell their families what she had done.

Faced with all of that, I do not have a problem that he came down with a harsh exposure of her disgusting A (and possibly more that he doesn't know about since this sh*tbag POSOM had her active with him on swinger sites).

And she STILL was wanting to see the dirtbag the next morning.....and later tried to defend her A to her own father when he came over to talk privately with her (based on what Oxy said he could overhear of their conversation in another room).

Oxy was NOT dealing with a remorseful WW ready and willing to end her A and save their M....forcing her to face the truth of what she was risking in the harshest way was about the only chance he had for saving his M and family at that point.

And she STILL went to POSOM....chose him, brought her parents into the drama by calling her dad to announce her decision, and then planned to drag her own young kids right into the middle of the drama by snatching them out of their beds in the middle of the night.....a fact confirmed by her own dad, despite her denials afterwards.

She only truly changed her tune entirely when POSOM called her and broke it off the next day.....then she was suddenly remorseful and wanted to save the M.

Who wants to bet that the reason C called and dumped her because HE heard a huge diatribe from his step-dad about the situation?

I bet one of the first calls WW's dad made that next morning was to his brother, C's step-dad, unloading on him for what a POS his scummy step-son was being, continuing the A and destroying the family of this man's grandchildren.

As soon as the family heat stepped up on POSOM, he threw her away fast to try to minimize his pariah status in the family.

In other words....the harsh exposure killed the A.

Unfortunately, Oxy's WW's monumental mid night shenanigans with POSOM may have cost her the last chance of saving her M and family.

I know if I were Oxy, I would never give R a second thought after such a publicly disrespectful and disgusting display of loyalty to a cheating, swinger obsessed POS like C.


----------



## aine

I think at the point he dragged her around he knew there would never be a R. You cannot coerce remorse, a person is either remorseful or not, she wasn't and will never be. He knew that.


----------



## sparrow555

turnera said:


> Ok, first, understand that I am NOT siding with her, minimizing what she did, or blaming oxy. I'm just providing my 'feeling' about how this all went down.
> 
> All I meant is don't take legal steps quickly when you can't tell if you're doing it because you're emotional or because it's what you really want.
> 
> And his wife has gone through the biggest shock of her life - the way he magically stood up to her as he did, which we all know is NOT the norm in the outside world.
> 
> Overall, I think he acted admirably. But reading his first post-DD post, as I was going through it, I saw a man who was hurting, but who also wasn't really showing her a way home in a way that would make sense to HER. What I mean is, he seemed, from his description, stone cold. Strong, yes, which is what we always push, but I didn't see anything in there (maybe he skipped it) about how he wanted her and was willing to make a great life together; all I saw was 'I own you now and you'd better do what I want.'
> 
> But at the same time, from HER perspective, he shut her down like an iron mask and I can see how in a 24-hour period she went from being herself to being the world's biggest pariah with NO hope but to be his slave for the rest of her life. (again, HER viewpoint, as foggy as it was)
> 
> Given the way her family tore into her, and (from what he describes) a total lack of concern for her from oxy, I could see how she felt...why stay?
> 
> She was upset...he ignored her. She cried...he went into another room. He left her alone, he pushed for more shaming (telling her to admit what she did to his sister? really? On top of everything else?)...I just don't see how she felt that staying would be anything but torture.
> 
> Maybe it's just a miscommunication in how I read his posts. I hope so. Or maybe he's hurting so bad he can't let himself be vulnerable. I'm just saying to slow down, get a little more communication going before you go down the scorched earth path and take her kids away from her.
> 
> Given how FAR, and how HARD, she was pushed against a wall by him and her entire family - in such a short period, and then being further shamed by being 'walked' to each family to share her shame, and then being told to basically start telling everyone who calls what she did...her considering taking the kids to be with C seems a fairly normal knee-jerk response on her part.


You post is similar to

"I really don't mean to offend you but you are an idiot"

"I really don't mean to offend you but you seem to a *********"

Or even better

"Well, he only committed the robbery. But when the police put the pressure on him by chasing, he responded negatively but carjacking and murdering the driver."


Posts like yours are infantilizing women... Do you really think women cannot take responsibility for their actions ? Would you under any circumstances make a similar post if the genders are reversed.


----------



## eastsouth2000

expose everything to everyone. if there is something i've learned through reading through out the forums. its exposing it all.
to bring back everyone to reality.


----------



## sparrow555

turnera said:


> oxy, it's fairly predictable that she 'had' to have one last contact with him. It would *be like telling you that you could never see your child again* and weren't allowed to say goodbye to him.
> 
> Just pointing out that her deep need to do this is not a direct justification that she's a horrible person. *Just human.*
> 
> That said, I'd like to know what happened next.





turnera said:


> Ok, first, understand that I am NOT siding with her, minimizing what she did, or blaming oxy. I'm just providing my 'feeling' about how this all went down.
> 
> All I meant is don't take legal steps quickly when you can't tell if you're doing it because you're emotional or because it's what you really want.
> 
> And his wife has gone through the biggest shock of her life - the way he magically stood up to her as he did, which we all know is NOT the norm in the outside world.
> 
> Overall, I think he acted admirably. But reading his first post-DD post, as I was going through it, I saw a man who was hurting, but *who also wasn't really showing her a way home in a way that would make sense to HER.* What I mean is, he seemed, from his description, stone cold. Strong, yes, which is what we always push, but I didn't see anything in there (maybe he skipped it) *about how he wanted her and was willing to make a great life together; all I saw was 'I own you now and you'd better do what I want.'*
> 
> But at the same time, from HER perspective, he shut her down like an iron mask and I can see how in a 24-hour period she went from being herself to being the *world's biggest pariah* with NO hope but to be his slave for the rest of her life. (again, HER viewpoint, as foggy as it was)
> 
> *Given the way her family tore into her,* and (from what he describes) a total lack of concern for her from oxy, I could see how she felt...why stay?
> 
> She was upset...he ignored her. She cried...he went into another room. He left her alone, he pushed for more shaming (*telling her to admit what she did to his sister? really? On top of everything else?)...I just don't see how she felt that staying would be anything but torture.*
> 
> Maybe it's just a miscommunication in how I read his posts. I hope so. Or maybe he's hurting so bad he can't let himself be vulnerable. I'm just saying to slow down, get a little more communication going before you go down the scorched earth path and take her kids away from her.
> 
> Given how FAR, and how HARD, she was pushed against a wall by him and her entire family - in such a short period, and then being further shamed by being 'walked' to each family to share her shame, and then being told to basically start telling everyone who calls what she did...her considering taking the kids to be with C *seems a fairly normal knee-jerk response on her part*.





turnera said:


> Wow. Your strength is admirable. I would advise not to move too quickly. Don't make decisions in the heat of the moment. It's possible that this could be her rock bottom and* she could come out the other side a completely new woman, worthy of marrying*. Just don't go rushing, ok?






turnera said:


> Exposure is one thing.
> 
> *Dragging your WS around to family member after family member, on the first night, and FORCING her to admit her adultery, on the first night, is not exposure. *
> 
> *Exposure is what you do AFTER you confront your spouse and she refuses to end the affair.*
> 
> *He SHAMED her. And then shamed her some more by telling her she had to tell his sister ('since she'll know soon enough anyway'). What's next? Facebook? Twitter? National Enquirer?*
> 
> *And then he THREATENED HER by saying if she didn't do exactly as he said, she would be left alone, destitute, without her kids.
> *
> Strength is one thing, if combined with at least a HINT of compassion.
> 
> This was scorched earth. *I'm surprised she didn't try to kill herself.*



This takes cake for being the most manipulative post I've seen on this site. I was just listing all your excuses in one post highlighting some of them but the last one really takes the cake. OP was so cruel that she could have killed herself. 


I wish there was some criteria so that nutcases don't post on marriage forums and give advice





turnera said:


> Sometimes I'm embarrassed to be part of TAM.



Yes, you should be. 

You said you are divorcing. Are you projecting your own situation on here ? Are you also cheating in your relationship which is why you identify with his wife so much ?


----------



## MJJEAN

turnera said:


> Did I miss something? How did *she* involve her own parents? He took HER there to her parents to spread her shame, from what I read. And after she left, she reached out to the only people she thought she could trust to save the situation, but even her own dad came over to further harangue her and shame her.
> 
> You guys are being very reactionary and purposely missing my points. You KNOW I always side on the betrayed spouse's side.
> 
> I just think he took it too far, and she then faced a 500-foot wall of shame and humiliation, and she lost all hope.
> 
> He could have handled it with strength, easily. He made his point. Telling her to tell his sister...that was too far. And it made HIM look ugly.


I don't think telling her to tell his sister was too far. Both sets of parents already knew. The affair was with OP's step-cousin and OM's wife also already knew. That means OP's parents, Aunt, Uncle, Step-Cousin and his wife plus OP and his wife were all coping with and discussing the affair and it's long term effects on the extended family. There's no way OP's sister wasn't going to find out and probably soon. OP's WW might as well have told her while she was visiting just to get it out of the way.


----------



## sparrow555

turnera said:


> *Honestly, if my H slvt-shamed me the way oxy did, kicked me out of the bedroom, dragged me all over town to spread my shame, destroyed my rings, and then told me to shame myself some more...I'd be thinking C was a better option, too.*
> 
> And we don't know anything about *what their marriage was like before this all happened.** Only his side. If he's capable of this scorched earth policy, it makes me wonder what life was like BEFORE this happened.*
> 
> *Again, I am NOT blaming oxy for her cheating.
> *
> I'm just trying to say that a little head clearing is in order.



This woman must be trolling.. She just gave a 100 reasons why oxy was the reason and just ended it with the opposite line..

I seriously think there is some projection going here with Tunera..

if C calls her this moment, she would leave oxy in seconds.


----------



## eastsouth2000

aine said:


> Turnera, I get what you are saying, there are limits to vengefulness and the response of OP through his pain and hurt may well have crossed a line. The OP was seeking some form of justice. As some say revenge is an attempt to transform shame into pride and is primitive and destructive when taken to extremes. In his pursuit for reparation, exposure , to shame her for the damage done, he himself crossed a lone imo, it was no longer about justice or reparation but about crushing her or obliterating her completely. Revenge has to be tempered with some humanity, afterall she's still the mother of his kids, still someone he spent a fair part of his life with. And the sad thing is this will not give him the release he needs. The desire to exert his dominance will not increase his stature. Her remorse cannot be coerced.
> 
> I'll probably get blasted for this post, and I want to reiterate that what she did was awful but the extremes of dragging her around to declare her shame smacks of something from the Scarlet Letter, would any of you like that approach for your daughter, sister etc? BS must also maintain their dignity in the midst of such calamity, revenge in all its extremes does not work.


Exposing the affair to relatives is not revenge, its just having to face reality.

Specially exposing the affair to FOO[family of origin aka parents]. (that is extremely important, I asked of you how many BS have not informed the FOO and have suffered the consequence?, how many?. exposing to FOO is extremely gravely important. failure to expose to FOO has had always caused BS to be alienated to relatives and disrupted relationships with children. Yet time and again the response was why do you care what others think. And in the end every time BS is to blamed for not having informed FOO. would you like the BS to suffer in silence instead?)


The reality that affairs is never alright

So you'd be willing to hide the affair to protect reputation?

Revenge is when you use gasoline and rocks to carry out your vengeance. I have seen and experience waywards being drag through our streets and pelted with stone. now that's vengeance!

words, words mean nothing. stick and and stone breaks your bones but words can do you no harm!

I for one value the important relationship with my wifes FOO.


----------



## farsidejunky

sparrow555 said:


> This woman must be trolling.. She just gave a 100 reasons why oxy was the reason and just ended it with the opposite line..


Really?


----------



## farsidejunky

sparrow555 said:


> you said you are divorcing. Are you projecting your own situation on here ? Are you also cheating in your relationship which is why you identify with his wife so much ?


Really?!?


----------



## lostmyreligion

sparrow555 said:


> This woman must be trolling.. She just gave a 100 reasons why oxy was the reason and just ended it with the opposite line..
> 
> I seriously think there is some projection going here with Tunera..
> 
> if C calls her this moment, she would leave oxy in seconds.


Really?

You seriously think "This woman must be trolling"?

Turnera has well over 30,000 posts. On this site alone.

You have what? 226 posts?

She's almost always spot on. If I ever start a thread with my full story, I would be extremely grateful if she were to post on it. As it is, I haven't had to because I've found what I needed in so many of her posts to others in similar straights.


----------



## eastsouth2000

turnera said:


> Honestly, if my H slvt-shamed me the way oxy did, kicked me out of the bedroom, dragged me all over town to spread my shame, destroyed my rings, and then told me to shame myself some more...I'd be thinking C was a better option, too.
> 
> And we don't know anything about what their marriage was like before this all happened. Only his side. If he's capable of this scorched earth policy, it makes me wonder what life was like BEFORE this happened.
> 
> Again, I am NOT blaming oxy for her cheating.
> 
> I'm just trying to say that a little head clearing is in order.


oxygen is pretty new to this, telling family members about the affair first is not **** shamming. informing only his closest of friends of his situation still with in acceptable.

that's asking for help, from people you dearly trust.
like me a family oriented person. will go to relatives to inform them to ask for advice and assistance.

I believe the choice between telling his FOO of the affair or WW's FOO. the better choice to ask for assistance is WW's FOO.
noting that the OM is a relative.

The alternative would have to suffer in silence.

Its clear from the attitude of the WW. that the drastic measure's were warranted.

Risking his life and health by his WW participating Swinging.


----------



## old red

**** shaming???? 

remember, oxy's wife is an adult and could have said: "no, i'm staying at home, you can go and inform the family by yourself." after all, she was adult enough to go and fook her cousin (by marriage); she was adult enough to open up her marriage without telling her husband; and she was adult enough to set up a swinger's profile on a hook up site. however, some posters think that she is the victim here, and that oxy is some wicked mr chillingworth (did i get my usa literary allusion right?). 

seriously, if you're so concerned for the ww, why not start with a question to the op, and ask him how her accompanying him went down and if there was any coercion involved, rather than straight away accusing him of **** shaming. talk about kicking an op when he is down...


----------



## Roselyn

OP, after reading all the posts here, yours and others, I believe that you should complete the divorce proceedings. Listen to your attorney carefully. You must preserve your sanity throughout this ordeal. Do not take the blame for what has transpired. I've noticed blameshifting to you by some posters here.

Your wife attempted to totally abandon you, but her lover did not want her. She had told you that she chosed her lover over you. She would have left you if her lover decided to leave his family for her. She attempted to return to you; therefore, you are the Plan B. I believe that she is also attempting to use your children against you. You must realize that your wife is not the person you thought she is. You had expectations of what a wife should be, but not your reality.

Exposing her infidelity to your family and hers was the right action to do. Here in TAM, the majority of the posters will advise you to expose the cheater. My family would have shamed me as well if I have done what your wife did. My father would definitely take the same position as her father did; afterall, grandchildren are involved. My father would have been in his late 80's today and believed strongly in honor. A cheating woman, especially a mother, is totally a dishonorable individual. 

Do not waffle back and forth. You have been decisive throughout this horrible ordeal. Your resolve is admirable. I do not say "divorce" easily as I just celebrated my 35 years of marriage (first marriage for both of us). I am 57 years old and a career woman. 

I believe that your children will need to see a counselor and you need to see a psychologist. You must have the right mindset as you move forward. I truly wish you recovery from your ordeal.


----------



## Locke.Stratos

turnera said:


> *Did I miss something? How did she involve her own parents?* He took HER there to her parents to spread her shame, from what I read. And after she left, *she reached out to the only people she thought she could trust to save the situation, but even her own dad came over to further harangue her and shame her*.


She involved her own parents by calling them in the middle of the night to tell them that she had chosen to be with C and would be taking her children to him.

She wasn't trying to save the situation. That's not why she reached out to the only people she thought she could trust to save the situation.

She went for a '5 minute walk' that led her to C's home. She then called her parents and told them that she had chosen to be with C and would be going to take her children from their home and bring them to C. 

That is why her own dad came over, not to further harangue her and shame her, BUT to prevent her from taking the children from their home during the night and bringing them to C.



oxygene said:


> So, Wednesday evening gmt she does a disappearing act, I posted to you guys then went to bed. *At 1:30am I get a call from her dad, he tells me she rang him and told him she chose C, and she was taking my kids to him.* I broke down and told him that it is never going to happen. Her "5 min walk" led her to his home where she decided she wanted to be with him, fine. But she will not take my kids. *My dad in law tells me he is coming round as he will not let her take them*...


Maybe you might have missed the above, I don't know. You're kind of one of the last poster here I'd expect to write what you've written in your last few posts:surprise::crying::smile2:.


----------



## eastsouth2000

If even the parents are so against OM I believe OM is really no a good person at all,
is that in the first place OM already has children with her cousin, two in fact. they are married? not even divorced yet?
OM not taking care of his own two children.
An affair would have been one thing, but to join in a swinger site. And Participate in Swinging is whole another level in it self.

and now OP family is on the verge of divorce. the OM reject her told her. he fix the problems with his family.

what are WW's options? she already said that she picks OM wants a divorce, but then OM rejected her? she's in limbo!

everything is already shattered nothing left here but for a clean break.

this WW needs to be on the Jeremy Kylie Show! Thats Brits for yah!


----------



## Chaparral

If I remember correctly, about eighty five percent of men that catch their wife cheating do not give a second chance. Her choice to dis his offer of reconciliation so quickly was pure stupidity considering who she was cheating with. 

Frankly she did what I thought she would do and then her swinger boy friend did what I thought he would do. It just happened a lot faster than I thought.

She doesn't have the skills and character to be a wife and mother. She didn't just make one idiotic mistake, she made multitudes of decisions that any normal person avoids.


----------



## Chaparral

eastsouth2000 said:


> If even the parents are so against OM I believe OM is really no a good person at all,
> is that in the first place OM already has children with her cousin, two in fact. they are married? not even divorced yet?
> OM not taking care of his own two children.
> An affair would have been one thing, but to join in a swinger site. And Participate in Swinging is whole another level in it self.
> 
> and now OP family is on the verge of divorce. the OM reject her told her. he fix the problems with his family.
> 
> what are WW's options? she already said that she picks OM wants a divorce, but then OM rejected her? she's in limbo!
> 
> everything is already shattered nothing left here but for a clean break.
> 
> this WW needs to be on the Jeremy Kylie Show!


I doubt seriously that her boyfriend dumped her for his own family. She was just another cog in his rotation. He no doubt thinks she's an idiot thinking he would settle down with one woman with kids. She may end up in his rotation but he's a swinger and he likes it. Husband's be damned.

I'm guessing he will end up learning a painful lesson before this is over, at least he would if I were involved.


----------



## Decorum

turnera said:


> Honestly, if my H slvt-shamed me the way oxy did, kicked me out of the bedroom, dragged me all over town to spread my shame, destroyed my rings, and then told me to shame myself some more...I'd be thinking C was a better option, too.
> 
> And we don't know anything about what their marriage was like before this all happened. Only his side. If he's capable of this scorched earth policy, it makes me wonder what life was like BEFORE this happened.
> 
> Again, I am NOT blaming oxy for her cheating.
> 
> I'm just trying to say that a little head clearing is in order.


You accuse him of slvt shaming draw a gratuitous inference about what life with him was likely like, and make excuses for her continued (affair crack) disloyalty. All without any parity.

Doesnt matter how many posts you have Tunera, your lack of of objectivity here is appaling and your projection is obvious. Your posts (at the very least) "appear" duplicitous.

Having said that I agree with your fundamental proposition.

Some people put themselves in very fvked up situations from which they do not have the life/relationship skills to extricate themselves.

If reconciliation is desired (and they are genuinely remorseful, sometimes even that needs to be explained) then they need guidence and direction on how to stop inflicting pain and to promote healing.

Remorse is a grace that empowers our soul to endure. If she had a smidtgen of remorse this could have gone very differently.

This early on that is all that could have saved her.

Whose fault is it that it was lacking? Ox's? Certainly not. It happens within the mind, will, and emotion of the WS, perhaps part of the larger mystery of why people make the chioces they do, even the choice to cheat.

The fact that she was in a PEA fog because of her choice to cheat notwithstanding.

Choices matter, action have consequences, and cheating changes you.

Whether someone recognizes it or not, realizes it or not, who you are becoming is the most imporgant series of choices you are currently making in your life.

You dont get a pass for being a poor, affair crack addicted, hopeless and desperate cheating woman, you only get to live with your choices, and those around you, thats life.

If he wanted reconciliation as an option, then to the extend she lacks the skills to circumnavigate it, he needs to make a pathway clear (without comitting) to protect his interests in the relationship, including counseling.

Looking on from a distance she did not appear remorseful when confronted with the truth, she didnt want it, and was never a canidate for reconcilation. Who knows what the future holds though?

If it were me and I wanted to end the marriage because of her infidelity ( completely reasonable) then I would consider her lack of skills a blessing in disguise.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Chaparral

BTW, after seeing what she has admitted to since the second DD, the only mistake he made was trying to reconcile before getting the full truth. And he still doesn't have it all!


----------



## Decorum

Chaparral said:


> BTW, after seeing what she has admitted to since the second DD, the only mistake he made was trying to reconcile before getting the full truth. And he still doesn't have it all!


Agreed, and early on a BS should not commit to reconciliation only consider it and take whatever time is needed to agree to offer it if the WS is around and remorseful.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## eastsouth2000

she's already in too deep in swinger life style to come back to vanilla monogamous romance.

as they say "you cant put the genie back in the bottle" with this one.


----------



## Decorum

eastsouth2000 said:


> she's already in too deep in swinger life style to come back to vanilla monogamous romance.
> 
> as they say "you cant put the genie back in the bottle" with this one.


Its possible, we just dont know yet.

RDMU's thread looked for all the world like that was the case, she was being groomed for bdsm but when the truth came out it had not gone that far. Afaik.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## turnera

sparrow555 said:


> You said you are divorcing. Are you projecting your own situation on here ? Are you also cheating in your relationship which is why you identify with his wife so much ?


lol, I have never said I was divorcing. And I have never cheated.
I was trying to get oxy to take a step back and breathe, and see what happens without doing further damage.

It's obvious no one is willing to look at this as anything other than a horrid evil woman - as you are wont to do - so I'm not going to further this line of discussion.


----------



## JohnA

Hi decorum,

What is Afaik?

Also a link to the poster you mentioned?

Any talk about reconciliation by a WS when the affair is first disclosed is knee jerk. In this case nothing happens, except more damage to both the BS and WS, until the fog that both are in us broken. 

True reconciliation occurs when both spouses are at 50k, otherwise same shyt, different day.


----------



## Dyokemm

Turnera does not deserve the attacks and ridiculous accusations that have been thrown at her over the last couple pages.

She is one of the posters I most respect here, despite the fact I happen to disagree with her on this specific situation.

People should knock off this nonsense.


----------



## SoulStorm

I just think turnera was feeling some compassion for the ww because she was told to confess and then was escorted to do so once she refused. I do agree that the OP had every right to out her and I also agree that she is an adult and did not have to go with him. But she chose to go. She could have said no, I'm not doing that.
I respect turnera's opinion. I don't necessarily agree with it, but I respect it.

As far as sl_t shaming goes, she started that herself the moment she crossed the lines with C.


----------



## Decorum

JohnA said:


> Hi decorum,
> 
> What is Afaik?
> 
> Also a link to the poster you mentioned?
> 
> Any talk about reconciliation by a WS when the affair is first disclosed is knee jerk. In this case nothing happens, except more damage to both the BS and WS, until the fog that both are in us broken.
> 
> True reconciliation occurs when both spouses are at 50k, otherwise same shyt, different day.


Hi John thanks for the link.

Afaik= as far as i know.

Agreed re reconciliation, both it and remorse often occurs in stages one step forward one back though.

Hopefully we will hear from oxy how he is holding up
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## drifting on

Dyokemm said:


> Turnera does not deserve the attacks and ridiculous accusations that have been thrown at her over the last couple pages.
> 
> She is one of the posters I most respect here, despite the fact I happen to disagree with her on this specific situation.
> 
> People should knock off this nonsense.




I agree with this post, and I fully understand what turnera was trying to tell OP. Any decision on d-day is a knee jerk reaction. You should make that decision after you have collected your emotions. Turnera was advising the same I do, gather yourself before making a decision. I believe it is best to wait some time before making a decision based upon scattered emotions. Did OP sl-t shame her? Yes. Obviously the WS has many issues, she needs to fix those, she doesn't need a vindictive person to try and break her completely. With OP's reaction she knows this marriage over, his way of dealing with the betrayal pushed her away, and she's still broken and went right to OM. How shocking.

This is a sad story, sad that people have jumped up to beat up a poster like Turnera. I don't believe in purposely trying to harm someone, well OM excluded, but Turnera was being the calm in a storm.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Decorum

turnera said:


> It's obvious no one is willing to look at this as anything other than a horrid evil woman - as you are wont to do - so I'm not going to further this line of discussion.


Case in point. Confirmation bias. Emotional reasoning.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## The Middleman

turnera said:


> Exposure is one thing.
> 
> 
> 
> Dragging your WS around to family member after family member, on the first night, and FORCING her to admit her adultery, on the first night, is not exposure.
> 
> 
> 
> Exposure is what you do AFTER you confront your spouse and she refuses to end the affair.
> 
> 
> 
> He SHAMED her. And then shamed her some more by telling her she had to tell his sister ('since she'll know soon enough anyway'). What's next? Facebook? Twitter? National Enquirer?
> 
> 
> 
> And then he THREATENED HER by saying if she didn't do exactly as he said, she would be left alone, destitute, without her kids.
> 
> 
> 
> Strength is one thing, if combined with at least a HINT of compassion.
> 
> 
> 
> This was scorched earth. I'm surprised she didn't try to kill herself.



Shaming is exactly what was required and deserved. Sorry the OP did the right thing.


----------



## sidney2718

Dyokemm said:


> Sorry,
> 
> I don't see that Oxy crossed any lines.
> 
> She was unremorseful, still wanted to stay in contact with this scumbag POS, was refusing transparency in communications, and refused to tell their families what she had done.


Yes. You are right. But by forcing her to go along with him while HE told his parents and her parents is an act of shaming her. Most of the time the BS tells the parents without the WS being present.



> Faced with all of that, I do not have a problem that he came down with a harsh exposure of her disgusting A (and possibly more that he doesn't know about since this sh*tbag POSOM had her active with him on swinger sites).


It isn't the exposure that is being portrayed as unnecessary. It is the harshness of it. It was unintentional, I'm sure. But it really destroyed her. And yet as I pointed out above, he still has to deal with her practically on a daily basis. That's going to be hard.



> And she STILL was wanting to see the dirtbag the next morning.....and later tried to defend her A to her own father when he came over to talk privately with her (based on what Oxy said he could overhear of their conversation in another room).


It is clear that she wanted the OM "the next morning". Probably because oxygene had left her with no place to go. Nowhere.

Nobody on this earth who is sane wants to be made to stand in the public square shouting "I'm a ****, an evil dirty ****. I f**k anything I can. Throw garbage at me. Make me suffer!"



> Oxy was NOT dealing with a remorseful WW ready and willing to end her A and save their M....forcing her to face the truth of what she was risking in the harshest way was about the only chance he had for saving his M and family at that point.
> 
> And she STILL went to POSOM....chose him, brought her parents into the drama by calling her dad to announce her decision, and then planned to drag her own young kids right into the middle of the drama by snatching them out of their beds in the middle of the night.....a fact confirmed by her own dad, despite her denials afterwards.
> 
> She only truly changed her tune entirely when POSOM called her and broke it off the next day.....then she was suddenly remorseful and wanted to save the M.
> 
> Who wants to bet that the reason C called and dumped her because HE heard a huge diatribe from his step-dad about the situation?
> 
> I bet one of the first calls WW's dad made that next morning was to his brother, C's step-dad, unloading on him for what a POS his scummy step-son was being, continuing the A and destroying the family of this man's grandchildren.
> 
> As soon as the family heat stepped up on POSOM, he threw her away fast to try to minimize his pariah status in the family.
> 
> In other words....the harsh exposure killed the A.


Yup. If there had been more thought given to what the desired outcome was, it might have been done in a less nuclear way. Look at the time scale of all this.



> Unfortunately, Oxy's WW's monumental mid night shenanigans with POSOM may have cost her the last chance of saving her M and family.
> 
> I know if I were Oxy, I would never give R a second thought after such a publicly disrespectful and disgusting display of loyalty to a cheating, swinger obsessed POS like C.


You've got the midnight shenanigans right. And I don't think that anyone is now proposing a reconciliation. But she has to live, doesn't she? Does she have a place to go? Does she have any money? Has any thought been given to the kids and how she will see them?

The courts will not be at all happy with oxygene if she's just left in the street to fend for herself.


----------



## oxygene

Hi guys

This thread has been very active the past 24 hours, but for all the wrong reasons I think.

I will not be lowering myself by trying to justify my actions, or outlining the type of life my wife had before I found out etc. I find the mud throwing and almost emotional bullying completely disrespectful, I will no longer be sharing my journey.

Thank you for support and advice the majority of you have given in goodwill, it has helped focus my mind, and sharing has given me a small release from the madness around me.

Oxy out.


----------



## sidney2718

eastsouth2000 said:


> oxygen is pretty new to this, telling family members about the affair first is not **** shamming. informing only his closest of friends of his situation still with in acceptable.
> 
> that's asking for help, from people you dearly trust.
> like me a family oriented person. will go to relatives to inform them to ask for advice and assistance.
> 
> I believe the choice between telling his FOO of the affair or WW's FOO. the better choice to ask for assistance is WW's FOO.
> noting that the OM is a relative.
> 
> The alternative would have to suffer in silence.


You are right. But the telling of family and friends is usually done by the betrayed spouse alone, not by dragging the WS around with you and having her sit there while you expose everything. THAT was the act of shaming that may have totally broken her.

We all advocate killing the affair by exposing it. That doesn't mean carving a scarlet letter into her forehead.


----------



## sidney2718

The Middleman said:


> Shaming is exactly what was required and deserved. Sorry the OP did the right thing.


What was gained by it? They STILL have to get along. They will be coparenting for a number of years yet.

This did not make it easier.


----------



## The Middleman

Does it really matter? She gave Oxygen a load of sh1t, he just wouldn't take it and gave her back some of his pain. I would have done what he did, maybe even more.


----------



## MattMatt

oxygene said:


> Hi guys
> 
> This thread has been very active the past 24 hours, but for all the wrong reasons I think.
> 
> I will not be lowering myself by trying to justify my actions, or outlining the type of life my wife had before I found out etc. I find the mud throwing and almost emotional bullying completely disrespectful, I will no longer be sharing my journey.
> 
> Thank you for support and advice the majority of you have given in goodwill, it has helped focus my mind, and sharing has given me a small release from the madness around me.
> 
> Oxy out.


Thanks for chasing Oxygene off TAM. That was so smoooth.


----------



## WorkingOnMe

Oh wow. The guy who escorts his wife on her walk of shame finds emotional bullying disrespectful! That's rich. You honestly think what you're doing here is 'sharing your journey'?


----------



## MattMatt

WorkingOnMe said:


> Oh wow. The guy who escorts his wife on her walk of shame finds emotional bullying disrespectful! That's rich. You honestly think what you're doing here is 'sharing your journey'?


This is not the first time this has happened with a BS calling out other posters on TAM for being disrespectful about their WS.

Juicer was one example as was Chris.


----------



## WorkingOnMe

MattMatt said:


> This is not the first time this has happened with a BS calling out other posters on TAM for being disrespectful about their WS.
> 
> 
> 
> Juicer was one example as was Chris.



Notice the trend? Emotionally abusive men deflecting. Juicer did some pretty horrible things to his wife too.


----------



## Marc878

turnera said:


> lol, I have never said I was divorcing. And I have never cheated.
> I was trying to get oxy to take a step back and breathe, and see what happenas without doing further damage.
> 
> It's obvious no one is willing to look at this as anything other than a horrid evil woman - as you are wont to do - so I'm not going to further this line of discussion.


Turneras logic and insight are as good as I've seen. Although I don't Agree with her here it is a forum.

Her opinions matter as much as anyone's.


----------



## Iver

Perhaps Oxy could have handled the situation better, I don't know. Most people don't have a lot of experience with their wife wanting to run off with the children to a relative who's a swinger. 

It seems Oxy has left the building whilst the posters here squabble amongst themselves. I hope he checks back with the posters who have constructive comments. I hope my comments fall into that category.

The relevant question here isn't the disclosure of the affair. It's been noted before but to me this is the elephant in the room...What is wrong with her that she thought it would be OK to exposure her children to "C"? What is wrong with her that she thought she could take the children and run off with a married man who is a swinger? 

I think Oxy needs to get a restraining order against "C" if possible - even if not possible he should attempt this as a wedge against his wife. The idea of exposing young children to this person is horrifying to me - I think everyone knows what I mean by that, I won't spell it out.

The STBXW needs help and I would hope her parents have enough compassion to take her in but foremost the children need to be protected.


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## Roselyn

This is not TAM's best moment. If Oxygene rolled over for his wife, posters would tell him he's a "cuckhold". He chosed to deal with his cheating, unrepentant wife in the open. She could have countered his allegations in front of their family to defend herself. Oxygene did not hide behind any types of games. As a consequence of putting Oxygene on the defensive, he decided to leave TAM.

I wish that he would return and would post an update so that others can learn from his journey. There was only one Betrayed Husband that stood up and made "good" of his unfortunate journey with his cheating wife; that was "Bashful Bull". I don't recall anyone calling him out on beating the Other Man and going to jail for his actions. This thread is the other way around.

Oxygene, if you revisit, there are posters here who disagree with opinions with whom you took offense. I wish that you would return and update your situation. So many could learn from your case.


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## The Middleman

WorkingOnMe said:


> Notice the trend? Emotionally abusive men deflecting. Juicer did some pretty horrible things to his wife too.



Oxygen was emotionally abusive? After what happened to him, after everything SHE DID, he is the abusive one? Somehow I don't think so. He wasn't the only one doing the abusing. None of this would have happened if she she didn't bang another guy and then chose the POSOM over her husband. If it were me, I would have broadcast her walk of shame on the internet.


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## MattMatt

WorkingOnMe said:


> Notice the trend? Emotionally abusive men deflecting. Juicer did some pretty horrible things to his wife too.


Before or after her long term affair?


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## Threeblessings

Wow! My husband was the cheater in our marriage. I wish he would have fought for ours like you are with yours. FYI - we used to live in East Anglia now Australia. All the best, Oxygene.


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## Be smart

I wish you and your kids the best my friend. I hope you will come back here,some of us could learn a lot just reading your thread.

I used to have problems in my life and I accidently found this forum. Belive me I was reading day and night,especially when I was on my night shifts in hospital.

Some of posters are really good and I learn a lot from them and I will tell you I was "chasing" after them. I was looking where are they posting next and go there and read it .

Stay stong


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## eastsouth2000

sidney2718 said:


> You are right. But the telling of family and friends is usually done by the betrayed spouse alone, not by dragging the WS around with you and having her sit there while you expose everything. THAT was the act of shaming that may have totally broken her.
> 
> We all advocate killing the affair by exposing it. That doesn't mean carving a scarlet letter into her forehead.


coin the word "dragging her" such a harsh term. as if OP was physically dragging that person across the street kicking and screaming?
-i prefer both of them went together as mature adults of there own will?
-isn't that an attack on the OP?

having her sit there?
she was free to go any time.

totally broken?
was she ever? after that she still wanted to pursue the OM, who is still married to her cousin.

no one carves a scarlet letter, by calling on BS FOO. if WS called his FOO maybe.


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## NoChoice

I sincerely believe that we become overzealous with our advice insomuch as it is received. OP was and is hurting and his wounds are open and raw. Hearing that he has worsened his plight by (over)reacting is no doubt more insult added to injury. Perhaps more than he could bear to accept. I do understand what the poster was trying to relate in that OP's wife was overwhelmed by his response however, I feel the response was not only appropriate but necessary. OP's wife needed to be held accountable and I believe the pressure put upon her was crucial to her growth.

Informing everyone and openly "shaming" her was necessary for her to see not only the seriousness of what she had done but also the fact that is was universally condemned by all who found out. The prospect was posited that she had nowhere to turn and could have turned suicidal but we are overlooking one very important point. She did indeed have a way out, a way to be restored to everyone's good graces, a way to feel the love and support of her family, OP's family and even possibly OP. It was as easy as accepting and understanding her wrong and being contrite and remorseful. Do you think for one second that if she had done that that her parents would not have jumped in and helped her sort through this mess and get her life straight again?

She instead chose to go to C. In essence, she is the one who shamed herself, brought scorn and judgement upon herself and, in essence, thumbed her nose at her family. If anything the exposing that OP did was insufficient not overboard.

In any event, OP I wish you good fortune and strength as you walk the path ahead.


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## eastsouth2000

WorkingOnMe said:


> Oh wow. The guy who escorts his wife on her walk of shame finds emotional bullying disrespectful! That's rich. You honestly think what you're doing here is 'sharing your journey'?


wow cant believe you still attacking the OP there. harsh much?
walk of shame where?

your pretty rich though?

--------------------------

I could clearly see though. The perceptions of others, seeing that the involvement of parents in issues.

To most seems like such a foreign concept.

I believe this is case where two idea's about family clash.

Clearly Oxy comes from the group that values close family ties. And that big decision are for most of the time made with the consent of Family and Extended Family.

Treating the Parents & Siblings, as on the level of other people. I believe is not in Oxy's upbringing.

So to assume that by calling it shamming to call upon Parents. as if they are not that involved in your life. could be made by those people who do not share such extremely close familial bonds.

I see that Oxy and Family of both sides living very closely in a small community. With in almost walking distance of each other.


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## ConanHub

aine said:


> Enough of the sl*t talk, she's the mother of his kids, his partner for many years, her actions despicable for sure but have a bit of respect, you ignoramus!


I love that guy! She is a slvt. Just because you give birth does not qualify you to be a mother or mean a woman deserves respect.

The guy is wired different and appreciates the term. For him it is endearing.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## sidney2718

MattMatt said:


> Thanks for chasing Oxygene off TAM. That was so smoooth.


I do believe that he wanted help vis-a-vis saving his marriage. He didn't get that.


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## sidney2718

The Middleman said:


> Oxygen was emotionally abusive? After what happened to him, after everything SHE DID, he is the abusive one? Somehow I don't think so. He wasn't the only one doing the abusing. None of this would have happened if she she didn't bang another guy and then chose the POSOM over her husband. If it were me, I would have broadcast her walk of shame on the internet.


You want no excuses for her behavior, but you offer excuses for Oxygene's behavior...

We all understand that the OP was very angry and upset. Who wouldn't be? But what did he gain by humiliating his wife?

But his point seems to have been that he wanted help on determining if his wife was truly repentant. He didn't get that from us and we are all to blame for it.


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## The Middleman

sidney2718 said:


> You want no excuses for her behavior,
> 
> *There are no excuses for her behavior, period.*
> 
> but you offer excuses for Oxygene's behavior...
> 
> *I offer no excuses for his behavior because as far as I'm concerned he did nothing wrong. He went with her to everyone in their lives that was important to them and asker her to tell them what she did to him. What's wrong with that? Did it shame her? Yes. Is the shaming a bad thing? Not in my opinion. Maybe if there was more shaming going on, this behavior would happen less frequently. She deserved that walk of shame.*
> 
> We all understand that the OP was very angry and upset. Who wouldn't be? But what did he gain by humiliating his wife?
> 
> *Most likely he thought that it was the right thing to do. But just maybe he wanted a certain level of satisfaction of inflicting an emotional pain on her that was similar to what was inflicted on him. I say similar because there is no pain equal to knowing your wife was bringing another man's semen home. Her shame was nothing in comparison.*
> 
> But his point seems to have been that he wanted help on determining if his wife was truly repentant. He didn't get that from us and we are all to blame for it.
> 
> *She wasn't repentant, she couldn't let go of the other man. I didn't weight in on Oxygen's thread until he was unfairly attacked. I didn't see that he did anything wrong. He just wasn't going to accept being a second choice or take bullsh1t laying down. *


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## eastsouth2000

sidney2718 said:


> * But what did he gain by humiliating his wife?*


were is the humiliation?, 
did he tell his neighbors? NO 
did he tell the community? NO

what is it with this detached attitude towards parents and siblings?

as if when you talk to your parents their different people?
as if when you talk to your siblings their different people?

uh? no secrets among family members? 
as if parents and siblings are other people?
------------------------------------------------------
clearly this is not your typical
affair with another person unknown to everyone.

this is different case where everyone involved including OM is family.

as if cousin and relatives are not family?

of course family has to be involved in this.
------------------------------------------------------
always live by the code:
Veritas liberabit vos (the truth shall set you free)


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## Stang197

This man did not shame his wife. She shamed herself. This so called mother and wife deserves everything she got. Maybe if this was the norm people would not do this sort of disgusting behavior.


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## Stang197

Of course I am a jerk for the way I handed my own situation.


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## The Middleman

Stang197 said:


> Of course I am a jerk for the way I handed my own situation.


In some ways yes, in other ways no.


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## bfree

What I am trying to understand is what people have against the truth? If you do something wicked and it comes to light you should be ashamed of your behavior. If shame is a consequence of poor behavior then so be it. There were no lies told here. There was only truth. I fail to understand why as a society we have come to believe that coddling people is the correct response. Obviously it doesn't work so why continue? Truth can be harsh. Truth can be painful. But lies are always more damaging.


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## Adelais

I am a bit baffled by the whole concept that oxygene was harsh. 

Committing adultery is brutal. Oxygene merely held his wife's feet to the fire to give her a wake-up call.

Oxygene has exercised amazing self control imo. Other BS'es have beat up the affair partner, slapped their WS and/or verbally abused them, thrown the BS's things on the front lawn, broken wedding pictures, etc. whilst in the midst of the initial phase. All oxygene did was keep his cool, do a PERFECT 180, (which most here would have been telling him to do had he been out of control) dispose of their wedding rings, and escort his cheating wife to various family members to own her "stuff." She didn't have to go along, but she did.

Oxygene is not responsible for his cheating wife's father's response.

Another thing that is strange, is that although oxygene's WS never spoke of suicide, posters here brought it up and talked about it as if she had threatened it. Cheaters are selfish and self centered. They don't commit suicide.  Oxygene's wife was still in "I need C" mode, not "I'm so sorry for what I did, I'm a worthless human being" mode. She was no where near even thinking about suicide. She was thinking about how to connect with C again.

Oxygene, if you need to process things with others who understand and who have been where you are, please come back. There are plenty here who don't think you went overboard, or that you abused your wife. You did what you thought you had to do, and it is never pretty. You would have never even considered doing what you did had she been faithful.

I've read of many BS's who have taken off, and even destroyed or sold their wedding rings upon discovery of an affair. Oxygene can buy new rings to symbolize their new marriage if they reconcile. The old marriage has been destroyed by his wife's choices, and all he did was get rid of the rings that are a reminder of a broken promise.


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## TheTruthHurts

Is there a reset button?? Moderators - is it possible to roll this discussion back and summarized the last several pages with "a number of posters discussed their opinions on OPs actions with respect to the past few days" and leave it at that?

OP could certainly use a forum to vent and get constructive feedback - wouldn't it be appropriate to offer that?


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## Stang197

This man wasn't harsh.... He was a real man. No one should ever tolerate this behavior. He was lenient. He could have thrown her crap in the street and posted everything on the Internet and that would still show incredible self control.


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## Stang197

I am amazed how some people expect other people to react to these situations. This man stands to lose everything for her selfish acts. If he stays he loses and if he leaves he loses..... So she might commit suicide. Ya right. Men in this situation are far more likely to commit suicide. People completely coddle these selfish women.


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## Stang197

Not sure how I feel about some of the people on this forum. This man should have been welcome to vent here, not run off by self righteous jerks. Can't believe people could treat this man this way.


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## EleGirl

I'm closing this thread. It's gotten way out of hand.

If the OP decides to come back he can either open an new thread or PM a moderator to re-open this one.


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