# Honest answer from men?



## Armom123 (Dec 8, 2014)

We've been married 20 years. My husband hasn't initiated sex for at least 15 years. We've been to counseling for communication last year, and made improvement. We've talked about his issue and he's acknowledged its a problem but he has discussed he is not willing to take medicine for testosterone deficiency and doesn't want to make effort to change anything. Only a advice from counselor is for him is to keep trying (abviously after all these years that doesn't work). I don't know what to do... I feel too young (I'm attractive and active) to not have a sex life and it's really hard on my self esteem over all these years. I hate to give up, what can I do?


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Has he had his T levels checked and had a full physical? You don't mention this.

Does he view porn?


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## Cre8ify (Feb 1, 2012)

He has to know you are deadly serious. My wife did not move back toward me until she saw that I had everything in place to leave. I was going out with friends, took up hobbies, became a good cook, ironing my new clothes, making the bed, engaging women everywhere we went, working out like a banshee and looking completely self sufficient. For me, I had to be willing to lose it to have a chance to save it.


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## Thor (Oct 31, 2011)

Has he said anything to you about you rejecting his advances? Did you have a good sex life at one point? Did he initiate? Have you always cheerfully agreed to sex when he initiates?


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## Armom123 (Dec 8, 2014)

Honestly, we had incredible intimacy before we were married and after is when it went down hill. Sounds strange being we have been married 20 years, but it really has been a problem on going. But with a child and careers I have put up with it. Now that we are about to be empty nesters and he has specifically chosen not to take a testerone supplement after being tested low, I'm really frustrated. I should also mention he is a negative peson and workaholic, and can be a self professed "mean" person at times due to low self esteem from childhood, but I think he is a good person. I love him very much, but also see the writing on the wall he is who he is and I don't expect change. I'm not trying to be negative, but I also want to be realistic.


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## Armom123 (Dec 8, 2014)

Also I'm asking real opinions because our therapist/ counselor has unfortunately been in of no help


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## Armom123 (Dec 8, 2014)

No, we've never had any negative experiences with me rejecting him


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## Armom123 (Dec 8, 2014)

Hmmm, did that work long term cre8ify?


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## Armom123 (Dec 8, 2014)

No porn


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

I suggest that you find a marriage counselor who is also a sex therapist.

Often times, when a person (men and women) turn their marriage sexless, it's because they are harboring resentment and anger towards their spouse.

Is there anything that you can think of that your husband is upset about? Does he tend to express his negative feelings in a passive aggressive manner?


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## ChristianGrey (Nov 27, 2014)

Armom123 said:


> I feel too young (I'm attractive and active) to not have a sex life and it's really hard on my self esteem over all these years. I hate to give up, what can I do?


Do you actually feel the need for having sex i.e. feel Horny or is it just to help with your self esteem?

A good furk usually takes care of the need for sex. Self esteem needs are a bit more complicated.


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## ankh (Oct 14, 2012)

Armom:

Are you burning through the C-cell batteries?


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## Cre8ify (Feb 1, 2012)

During the summer of 2012 we were 3X, sometimes 4X per week. Now I will say that included me using all sorts of strategies like staying just outside her reach, leaving questions as to where I was, and finding opportunities to be a rather conspicuous alpha. To be honest, it got tiring. The residual effect is we went from 25+ years of 1X per month and am now at 1X to 2X per week and if it goes longer, my wife is the one who is freaking out and looking to get us together.

BTW, my wife is one of the good people--great heart, fantastic mother, woman of faith who walks the talk. I still had to be willing to give all that up to get where we are. This is a high stakes game.


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## nuclearnightmare (May 15, 2013)

OP:

I assume his doctor told him the benefits outweigh the risks if he takes the T supplement?

generally I think that a spouse should consider sexual engagement an important part of marital love. if your partner does not want to have sex with you, to me that is equivalent to the partner no longer loving you (with rare exceptions......)


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## Trickster (Nov 19, 2011)

Armom-

I am in the process of doing the samevthing as Cre8ify

Working out like crazy, new hobby's, flirting with women with my wife around, new clothes, grew a goatee..

I stopped texting her if I am working late.

I spray on cologne right before I come home.

Since my wife acts like a roommate, I've stoped doing her laundry. I wash mine as well as my daughters. 

I used to cook dinner most of the time. Now I will put a frozen lasagna in the oven. 

I sleep in the other room.

I drink my morning coffee in the other room. I no longer need that morning conversation.

I am not afraid of house work. I continue to do that. A female neighbor friend came over to visit. (Our daughters are friends). She is one of the women who flirts... She asked us if we had a maid recently because our place was clean. She said she she could pay me "another way" because she doesn't have money. My wife just laughed.... I would have to clean with or without my wife... 

As of now, we haven't had sex since Sept 27. I would rather have no sex than hope for sex and get nothing....


Like nucular said.. No sex = no love

So far, there is no change. She still acts like all is fine...One of us is going to cave soon.

THIS IS SO EXHAUSTING...


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## DoF (Mar 27, 2014)

Time for Divorce. Your husband doesn't love you or care about you enough to meet your sexual desires.

This has nothing to do with HIM or HIS drive. It has everything to do with meeting his loved ones expectations. He should be going up and beyond and also know what's at stake (you divorcing or even cheating). I would NOT recommend #2, but I would #1.

Based on his actions, he doesn't love you or care about you.

Do you want to stay with someone like that? I wouldn't


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## BuddyL33 (Jul 16, 2009)

Armom123 said:


> We've been married 20 years. My husband hasn't initiated sex for at least 15 years. We've been to counseling for communication last year, and made improvement. We've talked about his issue and he's acknowledged its a problem but he has discussed he is not willing to take medicine for testosterone deficiency and doesn't want to make effort to change anything. Only a advice from counselor is for him is to keep trying (abviously after all these years that doesn't work). I don't know what to do... I feel too young (I'm attractive and active) to not have a sex life and it's really hard on my self esteem over all these years. I hate to give up, what can I do?


Weigh your options. What do you gain/lose by staying? What do you gain/lose by leaving?

Only you can decide. But from my stance, once one person in the relationship stops trying, the relationship is over.


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## Cre8ify (Feb 1, 2012)

Armom--The over riding thing that drove me to do what I did was I loved my wife and would have done anything for her. Her, not so much. She was just not that into me. That imbalance was a deal breaker as I deserve someone who loves me completely. Maybe you can find something to hold onto if you think about "how into you do you need him to be". 

Trickster--I only outlined the ways I built tension. There was another whole set of action plans to make her feel sexy--text what I was going to do to her tonight, talk much more during sex especially about how hot she is, massage oil, create sexy settings, get my hands in her hair and on her neck all day and brush against her, and of course, talk to her, i.e. listen. I could not have brought her to me if I did not fill her up emotionally.



> But from my stance, once one person in the relationship stops trying, the relationship is over.


QFT Buddy.


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

So....what have you started recently? I was confronted with this albeit more bluntly "The is 100% your problem have to make 100% of the moves do all the work and be willing to let me say no as much as and whenever I like no matter what. But the instant you stop working for it you're the one who's screwing everything up!"

My response was "I already have a job, thanks anyway"


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## Cre8ify (Feb 1, 2012)

That is one substantial cart of bullsh*t Dog. When my wife rejects (and I always call it rejection because she hates that loaded language) she is responsible to initiate the next time. She hates that. Her little advances are so nuanced that I can easily ignore them and she still owns the responsibility. She also learns that having to be the aggressor is not all that easy.


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## ChargingCharlie (Nov 14, 2012)

Wow, that's bad. I constantly have to hear about how tired she is, how her head hurts, how bad her cramps are, ad nauseum. Sprinkle in how sex is too much work and how she can't have sex unless she's had a few drinks, but she won't drink as she doesn't want to have a headache (which she always has anyway), and you get no sex. Best part is when she tells her friends that I never initiate - why would I ever initiate when you're constantly telling anyone and everyone about how you're on your deathbed? 

To be fair, she'd probably give in, but it would be duty sex (hurry up and finish). Our last session was like this - about two minutes in and she's trying to get me to finish so she can clean up and go to bed. Don't need that - I get more from my hand.


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## Thor (Oct 31, 2011)

Why won't he take the T supplements?

Is there some kind of child sex abuse or other abuse in his childhood?


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## richardsharpe (Jul 8, 2014)

Good evening armom123
This sounds like a typical low desire /high desire relationship - and there are many threads here on this. They rarely improve despite the best efforts of the HD person.

Personally I would suggest that you leave. I am one of the very rare cases where things did improve (after 25 years- and life is incomparably better. 

Live is too short to wait in the hope that intimacy will appear, and intimacy is too important to live without.

Tell him that you are not willing to live like this anymore.


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## Chris Taylor (Jul 22, 2010)

Just going to echo what a lot of others said. He has to step up.

Explain to him that a fulfilling, intimate sexual relationship is needed in a marriage. It goes hand-in-hand with monogamy. You both vowed to forsake all others but that implies that you would NOT forsake each other. That is what he is doing.

Tell him you promised monogamy but not celibacy and his options are:

1 - Step up and deliver on his promises,

2 - Agree to an open marriage, or

3 - Divorce

Divorce MUST be on the table. If he believes you'd never do that, you've already lost.


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## WhitsEnd (Dec 5, 2014)

You should talk with him about having an open marriage.


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## Moops (Sep 26, 2014)

You are lucky. Some men initiate sex *every day*. Imagine the hell the woman who live with those men go through?


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## Young at Heart (Jan 6, 2015)

Armom123 said:


> We've been married 20 years. My husband hasn't initiated sex for at least 15 years. We've been to counseling for communication last year, and made improvement. We've talked about his issue and he's acknowledged its a problem but he has discussed he is not willing to take medicine for testosterone deficiency and doesn't want to make effort to change anything. Only a advice from counselor is for him is to keep trying (abviously after all these years that doesn't work). I don't know what to do... I feel too young (I'm attractive and active) to not have a sex life and it's really hard on my self esteem over all these years. I hate to give up, what can I do?


I am so sorry. You do seem to understand the issues and have talked to him about them, which is better than most folks.

I do have questions in two areas. First, what has changed after 15 years that makes you want to change the status quo? Do you recognize that change after this long will require a several months or years for you to develop a new equalibrium between you of intimacy?

My Second, is you must have tried some things that didn't work. Are there some things you haven't tried? My feeling is you might want to ask him to go with you to sa sex therapist and marriage conselor. 

The MW Davis book the Sex Starved Marriage really helped me. The book Still Sexy after All these Years helped my wife. You might want to read that book as well. 

If you can't get him to a sex therapist conselor, you might want to figure out if there are some "non-sexual" things that the two of you can do that you will view as sex and help you build intimacy. There are a lot of alternate sex books out there that have comprehensive lists of various types of "sexual acts." You might get such a list, make two copies and ask him to put a check beside any he would be willing to try.

There are lots of non-traditional things couples do that aren't PIV sex, but are "sex." You just might find some that the both of you enjoy. I know one guy who had prostate cancer and is totally impotent and yet he still has active sex live with his wife (TMI!), luckily it is not me. 

Our sex therapist told us that ideally, sex should be playful, exporatory and sometimes fail and cause you to laugh.

Good luck to you.


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