# Scheduling Sex



## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

Does anyone schedule the sex they have with their spouse? Does it work for you? Do people not like this idea?
I have brought up the idea of scheduling it before and my wife has been against it. At the same time she wants to have sex more often, but the result is that we don't. I would like it if it was scheduled and we knew when to anticipate it, look forward to it and know it would be happening.


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## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

GutShot7 said:


> Does anyone schedule the sex they have with their spouse?


My wife and I don't schedule sex at all and through 24 years of being together we never have.



> Does it work for you?


Yes not scheduling sex for us works well. Since we have always shared a very frequent, rich and varied non-vanilla and vanilla sex life.



> Do people not like this idea?


I don't like the idea, to me it would suck the joy out of sex and would turn it into nothing more than a dull chore.



> I have brought up the idea of scheduling it before and my wife has been against it.


Why is she against it?



> At the same time she wants to have sex more often, but the result is that we don't.


Why don't you?



> I would like it if it was scheduled and we knew when to anticipate it, look forward to it and know it would be happening.


Are you able to get sexually aroused without sex being scheduled?

Is your desire to have sex on a schedule, an extension of your desire to have your wife conform to your way of doing things?


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

Personal said:


> Why is she against it?
> 
> Why don't you?
> 
> ...


I don't advise her on everything she does. That would result in way too many arguments and not everything requires advise, she is quite good at many things she does. So your phrasing of control is out of bounds. 

I think she has equated the idea of scheduling it to being a chore like you said. Me, I view it as a way of making sure it happens and the anticipation can be helpful. I often am more in the mood in the mornings and she is more in the mood in the evenings, as a result neither often gets what we want.


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## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

GutShot7 said:


> I often am more in the mood in the mornings and she is more in the mood in the evenings, as a result neither often gets what we want.


So if she wants it in the evening and you want it in the morning, I don't see why you don't have sex in the morning and in the evenings as well.


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## ah_sorandy (Jul 19, 2018)

Personal said:


> So if she wants it in the evening and you want it in the morning, I don't see why you don't have sex in the morning and in the evenings as well.


Perfect solution... I'd want to fit in a quicky at lunch time too.

Now I just need to book a flight.!!!. Lol.


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

Personal said:


> So if she wants it in the evening and you want it in the morning, I don't see why you don't have sex in the morning and in the evenings as well.


There have been times where we have done that, sex at night and the next morning. That is rare though since the other person often doesn't want to do it at night or in the morning. Its not just that one prefers doing it at the other time, it is also that we don't like doing it at our preferred time.


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## CharlieParker (Aug 15, 2012)

GutShot7 said:


> it is also that _*we*_ don't like doing it at our preferred time.


So, where’s the problem? You both don’t like doing at your preferred times? Easy fix, don’t do it. Or am I missing something?


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## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

GutShot7 said:


> I view it as a way of making sure it happens


If it doesn't happen without scheduling, you are on a fools errand if you think scheduling will change it. Since if you and or your wife already turn down sex, scheduling won't guarantee that either of you won't continue to turn down what is scheduled.

Plus given that you both have your preferred times, how are you going to agree to a time, when you can't agree to begin with?

Whenever I want sex I just start kissing my wife, or I tell her to show me her pink bits, or I pick her up and put her on our bed, or I bend her over and pull her knickers aside or down, or I tell her to put my **** in her mouth, or I spread her naked butt cheeks apart, on and on etc.

Whenever my wife wants sex, she just starts kissing me, or she asks me if I want to do it, or she says I want you to **** me, or she comes up to me and flashes me her pink bits, or she unzips me and puts my penis in her mouth, or she leads me to the bed and pushes me down onto it, on and on etc.

At the end of the day one can schedule all they like, yet it still requires initiation and wanting it for it to happen.


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

CharlieParker said:


> So, where’s the problem? You both don’t like doing at your preferred times? Easy fix, don’t do it. Or am I missing something?


That is often what happens, we don't do it. We average just under once a month throughout the year. In the past year I would say we have done it 7-9 times.


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## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

GutShot7 said:


> That is often what happens, we don't do it. We average just under once a month throughout the year. In the past year I would say we have done it 7-9 times.


What's below explains what's above.



GutShot7 said:


> I chose practical without the passion for marriage.


Which is a recipe for what you have.



GutShot7 said:


> I can't completely be myself because it upsets her too much.


If I felt I had to be that way with any sexual partner, I would sensibly dump them immediately.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

I see nothing wrong with sheduling sex, especially if you have children in the house. If they are there you cant just have sex anytime. It works for some people.


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

Personal said:


> What's below explains what's above.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Can't just dump someone immediately in a marriage. There is a lot more to it than that. 



Diana7 said:


> I see nothing wrong with sheduling sex, especially if you have children in the house. If they are there you cant just have sex anytime. It works for some people.


No kids involved here.


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## minimalME (Jan 3, 2012)

I agree, and this reflects my maritial experience.

_Very early_ in our marriage, I tried scheduling sex, because we weren't having any.

That lasted one week, before I was told no more scheduling.

In 20 years of marriage, it never significantly improved.



Personal said:


> If it doesn't happen without scheduling, you are on a fools errand if you think scheduling will change it.


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## Mr. Nail (Apr 26, 2011)

Trying to have sex with someone who:
doesn't like having sex with you,
has said sex is a chore,
avoids having sex with you,
resists having sex with you,
is sexual harassment.
While you "Can't just dump someone immediately in a marriage" you can in fact just dump someone who is only pretending to to be "in a marriage", Because they dumped you years ago.
Wouldn't life be easier with a spouse who loves you and enjoys having sex with you?


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## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

GutShot7 said:


> Does anyone schedule the sex they have with their spouse? Does it work for you? Do people not like this idea?
> I have brought up the idea of scheduling it before and my wife has been against it. At the same time she wants to have sex more often, but the result is that we don't. I would like it if it was scheduled and we knew when to anticipate it, look forward to it and know it would be happening.


When I first read this post, I was thinking she was higher desire and you lower. But later posts make it sound like she's willing to have sex more often, but it's just not working out?

How did you ever drop to 7-9 times/year? What is the role of sex in your marriage? Has it been like this from the beginning? Have desire levels changed for either of you? Who is getting rejected, or is it mutual?


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## minimalME (Jan 3, 2012)

When a person tells you they want more sex, but you end up not having any sex - they don't want sex.

Or rather - control trumps sex.

Two people who both want sex have sex.


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## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

GutShot7 said:


> Can't just dump someone immediately in a marriage. There is a lot more to it than that.


You are mistaken, I have been divorced and it was very easy.

I told her I was done with her and moved out. Then following the obligatory separation period of twelve months that was required we got divorced.

If you choose to settle for less, you are certain to get less.


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## CharlieParker (Aug 15, 2012)

I tend to say we schedule 95%+ of our sex, which is true, but it’s more accurate to say we make room in our schedules for sex (ie we prioritize it in a deliberate unspontaneous kind of way). We have a saying, “it’s not like we’re not going to have sex”.


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

Mr. Nail said:


> Trying to have sex with someone who:
> doesn't like having sex with you,
> has said sex is a chore,
> avoids having sex with you,
> ...


I know my spouse loves me and I know she wants to have sex with me. Shes just not very adventurous with the sex, wants the same old thing and that's boring to me, I dont want that anymore.


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

Casual Observer said:


> When I first read this post, I was thinking she was higher desire and you lower. But later posts make it sound like she's willing to have sex more often, but it's just not working out?
> 
> How did you ever drop to 7-9 times/year? What is the role of sex in your marriage? Has it been like this from the beginning? Have desire levels changed for either of you? Who is getting rejected, or is it mutual?


Well the fact that we want it at different times, different days plays a large role. We had the normal first year of marriage sex every other day. After that it dwindled significantly. We went through times when we did it more often while trying to have kids. Then it became more of a chore for both of us where the goal was not pleasure but pregnancy, that took a toll on us. When we more or less gave up on kids our sex life never really recovered after that.


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

Personal said:


> You are mistaken, I have been divorced and it was very easy.
> 
> I told her I was done with her and moved out. Then following the obligatory separation period of twelve months that was required we got divorced.
> 
> If you choose to settle for less, you are certain to get less.


Even if there isnt a lot of passion thede is still plenty of love in my marriage. We dont want to hurt each other. Leaving someone you love doesnt happen on a whim.


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## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

GutShot7 said:


> Even if there isnt a lot of passion thede is still plenty of love in my marriage.


Cool then given the fact you and your wife evidently resent the hell out each other (read your advice discussion), and you are loathe to have sex with her because it's boring. Don't let me dissuade you from carrying on with your understandably virtually sexless marriage.


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

Personal said:


> Cool then given the fact you and your wife evidently resent the hell out each other (read your advice discussion), and you are loathe to have sex with her because it's boring. Don't let me dissuade you from carrying on with your understandably virtually sexless marriage.


We have differences, I dont agree that we resent the hell out of each other. And I didnt say loathe. Just saying that I'm tired of the same old sex in our bed.


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## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

GutShot7 said:


> And I didnt say loathe. Just saying that I'm tired of the same old sex in our bed.


Given that you and your wife only share sex 7-9x a year, someone in your marriage is evidently loathe to have sex in it.

That said do carry on.


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

Loathe is a strong word. Do I look forward to sex with her anymore, not really. As I said it has gotten boring. Unfortunately she is happy with the boring sex, just wishes it happened more often.


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## PieceOfSky (Apr 7, 2013)

Scheduling sex never worked for us, because my wife has zero desire, for me at l least. She agreed to a schedule at one point, and perhaps once or twice made herself available. But, it soon felt like scheduled rejection, and I’m done with rejection. So, I let it go.

Perhaps it doesn’t have to be either-or. Perhaps you could use a schedule as a fallback, like “We will have sex on Saturday night or Sunday morning, if we’ve not had non-scheduled sex during the week before.“ Alternate morning and evening to accommodate your differences.

What exactly makes scheduling attractive to you? What about non-scheduled sex is less than preferred to you?

Does she initiate and you turn her down, and vice-a-versa?


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

We have both tried to initiate and been turned down at times, it happens. Scheduling it can help both of us be mentally ready for it, then each of can make sure we are personally in the mood for it when the time comes. And it can help ensure it happens without going many weeks or months without which happens.


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## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

GutShot7 said:


> We have both tried to initiate and been turned down at times, it happens. Scheduling it can help both of us be mentally ready for it, then each of can make sure we are personally in the mood for it when the time comes. And it can help ensure it happens without going many weeks or months without which happens.


You've been to marriage counseling? Or perhaps even a sex therapist?


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## Mr. Nail (Apr 26, 2011)

GutShot7 said:


> I know my spouse loves me and I know she wants to have sex with me. Shes just not very adventurous with the sex, wants the same old thing and that's boring to me, I dont want that anymore.


9 times a year is sexless. Someone who wants to have sex with you doesn't arrange (through rejection) a sexless life. Now either she wants a sexless life or you do.


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## badsanta (Oct 13, 2014)

GutShot7 said:


> Does anyone schedule the sex they have with their spouse? Does it work for you? Do people not like this idea?


My wife and I usually end up scheduling things about 75% of the time. When we were struggling to connect we had about a year where we scheduled 100% of the time.

Here is what that is like. Life is messy and stressful. Odds are you both show up in the bedroom not in the mood and emotionally disconnected from one another. Getting naked and attempting to feel close to one another feels awkward and uncomfortable. Any anticipation of it being great (while you are having problems) will likely serve to make things more difficult. So while in a state of trying to reconnect with one another on an emotional level while cuddling and rubbing each other's back, these are the things that help set the mood:

Reviewing the things that were challenging in recent days
Being thankful and noticing each other's efforts in the home
Discussing ways to improve your quality of life together
Making plans to do something positive and fun together
Making plans to help each other work on each other's self improvement
Segue into talking dirty to one another
Eventually what you end up with are building a set of tools (emotionally) to help you better connect as a couple when you otherwise feel disconnected. THIS is critical. Things don't always happen naturally. It gets too easy to withdraw or disconnect when things are uneasy which only serves to create a downward spiral and vicious cycle of falling apart. Scheduling intimacy I think is purposely uncomfortable. But it is all about working together as a couple to confront that discomfort and overcome it. Once you learn what it takes to do that, the intimacy that follows is way better than the stuff that happens spontaneously and naturally.

Regards,
Badsanta


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

Casual Observer said:


> You've been to marriage counseling? Or perhaps even a sex therapist?


We have never done marriage counseling. I'm not against it, she has said she doesnt want to, I dont know why.


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

Mr. Nail said:


> 9 times a year is sexless. Someone who wants to have sex with you doesn't arrange (through rejection) a sexless life. Now either she wants a sexless life or you do.


I dont want a sexless life, but as I said, sex with her doesn't excite me.


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## minimalME (Jan 3, 2012)

Are you watching pornography?



GutShot7 said:


> I dont want a sexless life, but as I said, sex with her doesn't excite me.


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

minimalME said:


> Are you watching pornography?


Very rarely, prefer not to, but sometimes need a quick finish.


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## minimalME (Jan 3, 2012)

Is there a specific reason you're not attracted to your wife? 

Have you ever been genuinely attracted to her? Has she gained weight? Or do you think it might be related to her behavior and treatment of you?



GutShot7 said:


> Very rarely, prefer not to, but sometimes need a quick finish.


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## Mr. Nail (Apr 26, 2011)

GutShot7 said:


> I don't want a sexless life, but as I said, sex with her doesn't excite me.


Often here we say that a sexles partner either doesn't want sex, or doesn't want sex with their partner. That is exactly what you just said. You want an active sex life, but you don't want to have sex with your wife.
Now you just have this to deal with:


GutShot7 said:


> Can't just dump someone immediately in a marriage. There is a lot more to it than that.


Honestly, I do have some sympathy for you. Sexually my marriage is in the dumps, and emotional detachment is an ongoing problem, but I get easily 3x the sex you're having. The fact that neither one of you is amiable to doing something about that speaks volumes.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

I can say scheduling time together as a couple works, whether we have sex or not, we both know we could. 

Without scheduling we average 4 to 6 times a week, but spend time together beyond sex, too, just because we can.


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> I can say scheduling time together as a couple works, whether we have sex or not, we both know we could.
> 
> Without scheduling we average 4 to 6 times a week, but spend time together beyond sex, too, just because we can.


4-6 times a week? Are you still in your first year of marriage?


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

minimalME said:


> Is there a specific reason you're not attracted to your wife?
> 
> Have you ever been genuinely attracted to her? Has she gained weight? Or do you think it might be related to her behavior and treatment of you?


She has gained a significant amount of weight and that hinders the physical attraction and behaviors dont help it.


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## Mybabysgotit (Jul 1, 2019)

GutShot7 said:


> Does anyone schedule the sex they have with their spouse? Does it work for you? Do people not like this idea?
> I have brought up the idea of scheduling it before and my wife has been against it. At the same time she wants to have sex more often, but the result is that we don't. I would like it if it was scheduled and we knew when to anticipate it, look forward to it and know it would be happening.


Yes, we started scheduling it about 6 months ago. For the past 5 years or so, we were averaging 2x per week, however, as I got older I noticed if i'm not actively thinking about it, i'd rather just kind of watch a movie and relax, or just talk. I think she was the same way so scheduling works well for us. In fact last night she was mentioning that it was one of the best decisions we made. Further, we have not had one fight since we started scheduling it, where previously we had at least one a month (our fights are where we just don't talk). It might not work for everyone, but it works well for us.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

GutShot7 said:


> 4-6 times a week? Are you still in your first year of marriage?



Not quite. That's a fun thought though.

No, we have children, and grandchildren.


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> Not quite. That's a fun thought though.
> 
> No, we have children, and grandchildren.


Grandkids and you have sex that often. I cant imagine why at that age.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

GutShot7 said:


> Grandkids and you have sex that often. I cant imagine why at that age.


It's great, the varieties in living, person to person. 

I can't imagine why not at this age, or any age, health permitting.


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## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

GutShot7 said:


> Grandkids and you have sex that often. I cant imagine why at that age.


Yikes. Is that what you think getting older means? No reason for physical intimacy, as if, thank goodness, that's something you don't have to think about anymore? That could be OK if you and your partner are on the same page and sex just doesn't have AND never did have any real meaning to BOTH of you. But if it once did, it could again, and it puts both of you at very high risk of unhappiness and cheating.

I'm also bothered, although many would understand perfectly, by your remarks about her weight and that you no longer find her attractive. If thinking about sex with your wife is like "Why would I want to; she's fat & unattractive and she can't do anything fun or different because she's not physically able to" then she probably knows this and what does she think about it? Is she OK with you thinking like that? Because if she's not, and if you can't find it within your heart to love her as she is, to see her beauty in spite of the folds of skin that didn't used to be there... then your issues go far beyond the frequency of sex. And they (the issues) might not have solutions that allow you to be happy while remaining married.

You don't have to be happy while married. Many stay married anyway and would never consider unhappiness to be a reason to leave. 

What do you want? What is your dream future? If your wife was here, what would she be saying?


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## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> It's great, the varieties in living, person to person.
> 
> *I can't imagine why not at this age,* or any age, health permitting.


Because, you know, your wheelchair and all. LOL Don't you dare mention your motorcycle.


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## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

GutShot7 said:


> Grandkids and you have sex that often. I cant imagine why at that age.





Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> It's great, the varieties in living, person to person.
> 
> I can't imagine why not at this age, or any age, health permitting.


I'm with you, @Ragnar Ragnasson , but could be his view is not as unusual as we think. We wouldn't bat an eye if it came from a woman, so why does it seem so unusual coming from a guy? I pray to never ever feel that way. Even if it means I have to deal with rejection or inability to perform. I want that closeness, that connection, that physical bonding with my wife for as long as it's possible, and I've fought like hell to get her past her traumas so she might get there too. Giving up would be the easy thing.

Why can't we just do the easy thing? Some of us just aren't wired that way. But maybe @GutShot7 is.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

Blondilocks said:


> Because, you know, your wheelchair and all. LOL Don't you dare mention your motorcycle.



Ha! Very true. Riding almost daily to work still.


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## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

Blondilocks said:


> Because, you know, your wheelchair and all. LOL Don't you dare mention your motorcycle.


This is on-topic only because it illustrates that sex isn't something that has to stop because you've gotten older and might be in a wheelchair. If you desire and enjoy sex, you may be able to find a way. 







And of course there's this- Motorcycle Sex Positions


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

Casual Observer said:


> Yikes. Is that what you think getting older means? No reason for physical intimacy, as if, thank goodness, that's something you don't have to think about anymore? That could be OK if you and your partner are on the same page and sex just doesn't have AND never did have any real meaning to BOTH of you. But if it once did, it could again, and it puts both of you at very high risk of unhappiness and cheating.
> 
> I'm also bothered, although many would understand perfectly, by your remarks about her weight and that you no longer find her attractive. If thinking about sex with your wife is like "Why would I want to; she's fat & unattractive and she can't do anything fun or different because she's not physically able to" then she probably knows this and what does she think about it? Is she OK with you thinking like that? Because if she's not, and if you can't find it within your heart to love her as she is, to see her beauty in spite of the folds of skin that didn't used to be there... then your issues go far beyond the frequency of sex. And they (the issues) might not have solutions that allow you to be happy while remaining married.
> 
> ...


Sex has never been about intimacy for me. I like sex and other means of being physical, but it isn't one of my so called love languages. Sex for me is about physical attraction and the bodies response to that attraction. I still love her and care about my wife even if there isn't a lot of physical attraction left. 
What do I want? Dream Future? Those seem like loaded questions, wouldn't even be sure where to begin with that.


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## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

GutShot7 said:


> Sex has never been about intimacy for me. I like sex and other means of being physical, but it isn't one of my so called love languages. Sex for me is about physical attraction and the bodies response to that attraction. I still love her and care about my wife even if there isn't a lot of physical attraction left.
> *What do I want? Dream Future? Those seem like loaded questions, wouldn't even be sure where to begin with that.*


I think you need to work on that before you can really get anywhere. Why those are "loaded" questions is... a question? Why are you here? There must be a want, a need. Maybe it's just for validation that you're normal. Or perhaps the opposite. But most are looking for something. What is it?

And again, if your wife was here, what would she be posting? Would her take on things be similar to yours?

In your thread about your spouse not being able to handle advice, and then adding in this, it seems like you guys tolerate each other, and are maybe on the road to becoming an older and bickering married couple that doesn't have a lot of fun together. You described things like helping in the kitchen as a chore. I was kind of like that for a very long while until I decided that was an attitude, not a task. Meaning it was all how I looked at it, and I could, and now do, look at just about anything my wife asks me to do, with her, as something I look forward to and enjoy, because it's with her and for her. If it makes her feel good, it makes me feel good.

And before you think I'm saying I've got this great marriage, umm... I've got 1,620 posts here largely because I don't. Not yet. Major trust issues, major resentment issues on her part, lots of odd things that have taken hold or been there since the beginning and grown over 42+ years. I could have, many would say I should have, given up. But I haven't and I'm still hoping things will work out because I'd like to grow old and die holding this woman's hand. Despite everything that's gone on. 

Do you want your wife to feel good?

How old are you guys? Why did you get married? Do you have kids? What do you do for fun?


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## Imagirl (Aug 17, 2020)

Sure, we schedule it when we're doing something a little bit naughtier that we have to plan in advance. But I don't care. Schedule it, wake me up with it, throw me over the table when I walk by, pull the car over. I'm game.


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

Casual Observer said:


> I think you need to work on that before you can really get anywhere. Why those are "loaded" questions is... a question? Why are you here? There must be a want, a need. Maybe it's just for validation that you're normal. Or perhaps the opposite. But most are looking for something. What is it?
> 
> And again, if your wife was here, what would she be posting? Would her take on things be similar to yours?
> 
> ...


I know what I want in my dream future, but its a lot to get into here. At the same time I might know what I want, doesn't mean that is where the future is headed; life is complicated. 
If my wife were here posting in the sex category she would probably say that she wants to have sex more, she might even post saying that I have low drive, which I do for her, but not in general. And no I don't let her know that, that would hurt her. 
Tolerate each other? sometimes that is what it seems like, other times we are friends or roommates who get along just fine and do life together. Older, bickering, married couple that doesn't have a lot of fun together, that is often a fitting description of us. 
No kids here, late 30s, married my best friend at the time, and I don't do as much as I would like to for fun.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

GutShot7 said:


> I know what I want in my dream future, but its a lot to get into here. At the same time I might know what I want, doesn't mean that is where the future is headed; life is complicated.
> If my wife were here posting in the sex category she would probably say that she wants to have sex more, she might even post saying that I have low drive, which I do for her, but not in general. And no I don't let her know that, that would hurt her.
> Tolerate each other? sometimes that is what it seems like, other times we are friends or roommates who get along just fine and do life together. Older, bickering, married couple that doesn't have a lot of fun together, that is often a fitting description of us.
> No kids here, late 30s, married my best friend at the time, and I don't do as much as I would like to for fun.



You've got some hard choices to make, my friend. 

In your late 30s there's hopefully a long time ahead for you both.

Take the long view. But decide to either happily accept each other; improve the relationship, end the relationship. But decide you must. No decision is still a decision. 

Or your W may surprise you and she may make a decision that you may or may not like. It's not all in your hands alone.


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## Dadto2 (Aug 11, 2020)

Sex is not a meal (ok, not to some) and it should NEVER be scheduled. If so, how boring would the sex be? Sex should be spontaneous. And never the same. One time, make love to your wife...and the next time, F your wife.


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## leftfield (Mar 29, 2016)

I don't really think your problem is scheduling. Especially after ready through all of the comments. Its seems you have issues with being attracted to your wife. With understanding that sex is a bonding process for most people, and others.

Having said that I will answer your original question about scheduling. For years my wife and I debated the idea of a schedule. With me wanting more sex and no schedule. And her wanting a schedule to mentally prepare for it (just like you want). Then one day I finally came up with a schedule I could live with, so I asked if she still wanted a schedule? She said: yes. So I told her the schedule I would accept is once every morning and once every evening with some busier weekend thrown in too. After a little more discussion, that is the schedule we accepted. We have never once managed to keep that schedule, but we have never had frequency issues since we implemented it. 

I really think you and your wife need to have some honest discussions. And yes, they will include some painful information.


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

Dadto2 said:


> Sex is not a meal (ok, not to some) and it should NEVER be scheduled. If so, how boring would the sex be? Sex should be spontaneous. And never the same. One time, make love to your wife...and the next time, F your wife.


My wife prefers to have sex in our bed and rarely anywhere else. We have done it there enough as far as I am concerned. There are plenty of other rooms in the house and many other places outside of the house I haven't done it where I would like to check off the bucket list. Needless to say, she isn't spontaneous with sex.


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> You've got some hard choices to make, my friend.
> 
> In your late 30s there's hopefully a long time ahead for you both.
> 
> ...


I've had some of those hard choices in the back of my mind for a while. My issue is I want life to be simple with very little emotion involved. Dealing with emotion, I avoid at all costs. My W has make the choice for a few years now that I don't like, if she made a different one I think I would be much happier.


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

leftfield said:


> I don't really think your problem is scheduling. Especially after ready through all of the comments. Its seems you have issues with being attracted to your wife. With understanding that sex is a bonding process for most people, and others.
> 
> Having said that I will answer your original question about scheduling. For years my wife and I debated the idea of a schedule. With me wanting more sex and no schedule. And her wanting a schedule to mentally prepare for it (just like you want). Then one day I finally came up with a schedule I could live with, so I asked if she still wanted a schedule? She said: yes. So I told her the schedule I would accept is once every morning and once every evening with some busier weekend thrown in too. After a little more discussion, that is the schedule we accepted. We have never once managed to keep that schedule, but we have never had frequency issues since we implemented it.
> 
> I really think you and your wife need to have some honest discussions. And yes, they will include some painful information.


The attraction component is a motivator for why I want to schedule sex, it can help me be mentally and physically prepared to have sex with her. 

Your story with the scheduled you proposed is funny. I would be happy with scheduling it once a week. With alternating weeks being in the morning and in the evening. As long as we had a designated day for that week that it was going to happen, I could be prepared for that.


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## leftfield (Mar 29, 2016)

GutShot7 said:


> The attraction component is a motivator for why I want to schedule sex, it can help me be mentally and physically prepared to have sex with her.
> 
> Your story with the scheduled you proposed is funny. I would be happy with scheduling it once a week. With alternating weeks being in the morning and in the evening. As long as we had a designated day for that week that it was going to happen, I could be prepared for that.


Yes you would be happy with the schedule you propose, but you are failing to see that you are just using the idea of a schedule to paper over your real problems. Which include; you don't find your wife attractive, you are bored with sex, you don't find sex bonding, you two cant agree on a time of day. Trying to cover the bigger issues with a schedule will most likely cause more issues.


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

leftfield said:


> Yes you would be happy with the schedule you propose, but you are failing to see that you are just using the idea of a schedule to paper over your real problems. Which include; you don't find your wife attractive, you are bored with sex, you don't find sex bonding, you two cant agree on a time of day. Trying to cover the bigger issues with a schedule will most likely cause more issues.


But it would ensure that sex happens and she would have one less thing to get emotional about and maybe she would be happier overall. If she was happier overall with the relationship my hope is that she would do a few other things around the house that she knows makes me happy. 
Means to an End.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

GutShot7 said:


> The attraction component is a motivator for why I want to schedule sex, it can help me be mentally and physically prepared to have sex with her.
> 
> Your story with the scheduled you proposed is funny. I would be happy with scheduling it once a week. With alternating weeks being in the morning and in the evening. As long as we had a designated day for that week that it was going to happen, I could be prepared for that.



I dunno my friend. Something here is a bit off. Your saying it's so torturous to have sex with W that you have to work yourself up to it and you don't want to be caught unaware.

If it's that bad, there are changes coming you haven't even thought of yet.

She may want to D you.


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## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

leftfield said:


> I don't really think your problem is scheduling. Especially after ready through all of the comments. Its seems you have issues with being attracted to your wife. With understanding that sex is a bonding process for most people, and others.
> 
> Having said that I will answer your original question about scheduling. For years my wife and I debated the idea of a schedule. With me wanting more sex and no schedule. And her wanting a schedule to mentally prepare for it (just like you want). *Then one day I finally came up with a schedule I could live with, so I asked if she still wanted a schedule? She said: yes. So I told her the schedule I would accept is once every morning and once every evening with some busier weekend thrown in too. After a little more discussion, that is the schedule we accepted. We have never once managed to keep that schedule, but we have never had frequency issues since we implemented it. *
> 
> I really think you and your wife need to have some honest discussions. And yes, they will include some painful information.


You didn't come up with a schedule; you came up with what sex would look like to you if everything went well. Your ideal, your ability, your desire. Your wife understood and somehow life in the real world established a compromise that you both found workable. I think that's probably the best-possible outcome, but calling it a "schedule" is a bit misleading. Largely because a "schedule" provides a measurable accomplishment, and falling short of the "schedule" would be seen as a bad thing. That doesn't describe your situation.

For many, not all, when a "schedule" is routinely missed, it loses its value. It may be even worse than not having a schedule at all, because it signals that the person who was unhappy with the frequency really isn't serious about needing the change.


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## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

GutShot7 said:


> The attraction component is a motivator for why I want to schedule sex, it can help me be mentally and physically prepared to have sex with her.
> 
> Your story with the scheduled you proposed is funny. I would be happy with scheduling it once a week. With alternating weeks being in the morning and in the evening. As long as we had a designated day for that week that it was going to happen, I could be prepared for that.


I don't know if it's a really good thing you don't have kids, or if having kids would shake you up and get you to recognize that the world can still be an OK place even if everything doesn't go as planned. Rolling with the punches doesn't seem to be your specialty. But please, do not read this as a suggestion you should have kids!!! Even if you did want them, you've got lots of things to fix first.

"Mentally and physically prepared to have sex with her." When did this start? Was it this was when you met? It's just such an odd thing. If the two of you were asexual, ok, maybe, but you've said that's not the case for you. It sounds like you get aroused thinking about or seeing attractive women, just not your wife.

Your wife is as sexy and attractive as you believe she is. That's all on you. And it could be something you can't overcome, if you can't see her that way. Unfortunately, while you may not find her sexy and attractive, she herself may be quite sexual, and have needs both for sex and validation. Without knowing her, I feel really sorry for her.

You mentioned elsewhere the two of your are in your 30s. A lot of time ahead for both of you. Think about her for a moment, not you. She deserves a shot at a happy life with someone who truly loves her. Can you be that person? What would it take?


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> I dunno my friend. Something here is a bit off. Your saying it's so torturous to have sex with W that you have to work yourself up to it and you don't want to be caught unaware.
> 
> If it's that bad, there are changes coming you haven't even thought of yet.
> 
> She may want to D you.


It is not torturous to have sex with her. I just don't get that turned on by her. So being prepared for it makes it easier to know when to get turned on and be ready. It would also make it easier to avoid doing anything solo leading up to our scheduled time. 
She has made it clear in the past that D is not something she has any desire for. She is more concerned that I would leave her at some point. 



Casual Observer said:


> I don't know if it's a really good thing you don't have kids, or if having kids would shake you up and get you to recognize that the world can still be an OK place even if everything doesn't go as planned. Rolling with the punches doesn't seem to be your specialty. But please, do not read this as a suggestion you should have kids!!! Even if you did want them, you've got lots of things to fix first.
> 
> "Mentally and physically prepared to have sex with her." When did this start? Was it this was when you met? It's just such an odd thing. If the two of you were asexual, ok, maybe, but you've said that's not the case for you. It sounds like you get aroused thinking about or seeing attractive women, just not your wife.
> 
> ...


Kids is a different conversation altogether. Biologically it is not happening, we have been down that road and it took its toll on our relationship as well. 
We aren't asexual, its just that I am not physically attracted to her anymore. Other attractive women, easy arousal, I see other attractive women all of the time, they are in much better shape than her at this point. She does have needs for sex and validation. That is in part why I think a schedule would be helpful because it would do better to ensure the sex happens and she might feel more validated by it happening. Validation through words is not a strong point of mine. 
We both deserve to be happy in life, that is a very true statement. Do I think we are the best person for one another, no, but right now, we are who we each have.


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## leftfield (Mar 29, 2016)

Casual Observer said:


> You didn't come up with a schedule; you came up with what sex would look like to you if everything went well. Your ideal, your ability, your desire. Your wife understood and somehow life in the real world established a compromise that you both found workable. I think that's probably the best-possible outcome, but calling it a "schedule" is a bit misleading. Largely because a "schedule" provides a measurable accomplishment, and falling short of the "schedule" would be seen as a bad thing. That doesn't describe your situation.
> 
> For many, not all, when a "schedule" is routinely missed, it loses its value. It may be even worse than not having a schedule at all, because it signals that the person who was unhappy with the frequency really isn't serious about needing the change.


Was it a schedule or not? Probably not. But we called it a schedule and its what we agreed on. My point in sharing was to try and help the OP see that implementing a schedule may not be the best use of his efforts. As pointed out in your second paragraph, broken schedules maybe even worse than not having a schedule. There is a high likely hood that he and his wife would end up with a broken schedule, if they can even manage to create a schedule. 

I have doubts that schedules every work. Maybe for 1 in 100 couples that try and utilize them. Has there been 1 comment yet about a successful schedule?


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## leftfield (Mar 29, 2016)

GutShot7 said:


> It is not torturous to have sex with her. I just don't get that turned on by her. So being prepared for it makes it easier to know when to get turned on and be ready. It would also make it easier to avoid doing anything solo leading up to our scheduled time.
> She has made it clear in the past that D is not something she has any desire for. She is more concerned that I would leave her at some point.
> 
> 
> ...


Why not create your own schedule and when you are mentally prepared for it, start something with her.


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

leftfield said:


> Why not create your own schedule and when you are mentally prepared for it, start something with her.


I would like to, I just don't know how to bring it up with her without her getting emotional about it.


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## Imagirl (Aug 17, 2020)

Have sex with her to make her happy so she makes you happy? Make your goal making her happy for no other reason than you want to see her happy. If every person in a committed relationship did that I think there'd be far less people seeking out forums like this.


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## leftfield (Mar 29, 2016)

GutShot7 said:


> I would like to, I just don't know how to bring it up with her without her getting emotional about it.


Bringing up a schedule makes her emotional? Or instigating sex makes her emotional?

What I am suggesting is you make a schedule for you. You don't need to share it with her. You just keep the schedule in your own head. On the days you schedule, get yourself mentally ready and than instigate.


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## badsanta (Oct 13, 2014)

GutShot7 said:


> Very rarely, prefer not to, but sometimes need a quick finish.


Regarding porn, you say you need it very rarely. So I would assume then that most of your self pleasuring activities do not require the use of porn. If so that is a healthy thing!

My question then would be to ask if this is something you can share with your wife? If not, then why would that be a problem for her to see you when that happens?

What I am getting at here is that it is often the topic of masturbation that causes shame a drives relationships apart. Shame and guilt will only serve to cause problems in a relationship. So if the idea of masturbating in your wife's presence mortifies you, then whatever is causing you to feel that way is the same thing disrupting intimacy in your marriage. 

Regards, 
Badsanta


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

leftfield said:


> Bringing up a schedule makes her emotional? Or instigating sex makes her emotional?
> 
> What I am suggesting is you make a schedule for you. You don't need to share it with her. You just keep the schedule in your own head. On the days you schedule, get yourself mentally ready and than instigate.


Bringing up a schedule makes her emotional because then she wants to focus on the reasons we need a schedule and gets upset instead of focusing on ensuring that we actually have sex more often. 
I have tried to do the "schedule in my own head thing" but it has often resulted in being turned down because she wasn't in the mood at the time. 



badsanta said:


> Regarding porn, you say you need it very rarely. So I would assume then that most of your self pleasuring activities do not require the use of porn. If so that is a healthy thing!
> 
> My question then would be to ask if this is something you can share with your wife? If not, then why would that be a problem for her to see you when that happens?
> 
> ...


Well, most of the solo acts dont involve porn, but they do involve non porn pictures of attractive women. Not doing it without some form of visual stimulation, that would be a waste. 
Also, not sure what you want me to share with my wife in regards to this???


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## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

GutShot7 said:


> Bringing up a schedule makes her emotional because then she wants to focus on the reasons we need a schedule and gets upset instead of focusing on ensuring that we actually have sex more often.
> I have tried to do the "schedule in my own head thing" but it has often resulted in being turned down because she wasn't in the mood at the time.
> 
> 
> ...


I think you need to do one of two things. Either change your truth, or share it with her. She deserves to know that you essentially find sex to be a chore and that you would rather have sex with one of the women in the pictures you masturbate to. You are using porn in the most-damaging way possible, as far as relationships go. You are using porn to avoid the truth. It's a substitute, something that keeps you going so you can avoid the conversations that need to be had.

I just feel more and more sorry for your poor wife. How can she be "in the mood" when she's living a life of rejection? Most women don't quickly spring to attention like guys do. They need time, they may have what's called "responsive desire" which you may be taking as lack of interest. 

There's little doubt in my mind that your wife must have some pretty bad self-esteem issues by now. You probably do too. Individual therapy would be a great place to start. Not marriage counseling, because what you have is pretty far removed from the concept of marriage, especially given your relatively-young age. Neither of you should be seeing a therapist whose job is to keep you together. Each of you needs to figure out whether you should be with your partner in the first place. Why? Because all the momentum I read is going in the wrong direction.


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## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

I don't think she's going anywhere.... He does almost everything around the house/in their life and she does nothing. She's not going to give up that scenario.


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

Casual Observer said:


> I think you need to do one of two things. Either change your truth, or share it with her. She deserves to know that you essentially find sex to be a chore and that you would rather have sex with one of the women in the pictures you masturbate to. You are using porn in the most-damaging way possible, as far as relationships go. You are using porn to avoid the truth. It's a substitute, something that keeps you going so you can avoid the conversations that need to be had.
> 
> I just feel more and more sorry for your poor wife. How can she be "in the mood" when she's living a life of rejection? Most women don't quickly spring to attention like guys do. They need time, they may have what's called "responsive desire" which you may be taking as lack of interest.
> 
> There's little doubt in my mind that your wife must have some pretty bad self-esteem issues by now. You probably do too. Individual therapy would be a great place to start. Not marriage counseling, because what you have is pretty far removed from the concept of marriage, especially given your relatively-young age. Neither of you should be seeing a therapist whose job is to keep you together. Each of you needs to figure out whether you should be with your partner in the first place. Why? Because all the momentum I read is going in the wrong direction.


I don't know what you mean by "change your truth." 
I have no intention of sharing with her my feelings about sex with her and my lack of attraction to her, that would hurt her even more. I want to avoid emotional situations, not create ones that are more intense. 
As for the porn, as I said, rarely ever use that. Pictures of attractive women, yes I look at and use those, excellent app for that. 
You feel sorry for my wife? But not me?
Personally I feel for both of us, I know we each deserve more and could be happier in a different situation, but the reality is that she has it better than I do. 
Self-esteem; she might suffer from low self esteem. I have battled it for much of my life, but in recent years I have been more at my peak of self esteem, doing much better.


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## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

GutShot7 said:


> I don't know what you mean by "change your truth."
> I have no intention of sharing with her my feelings about sex with her and my lack of attraction to her, that would hurt her even more. I want to avoid emotional situations, not create ones that are more intense.
> As for the porn, as I said, rarely ever use that. Pictures of attractive women, yes I look at and use those, excellent app for that.
> You feel sorry for my wife? But not me?
> ...


"Change your truth" means find a way to embrace and love your wife for who she is, if you can. You may not be able to. That's ok. Better to figure that out sooner than later. But if it is the case that you cannot "change your truth" and love her for who she is, then yes, you need to tell her.

I'm really flustered here. Your marriage is going nowhere, you're in your 30s with most of your lives ahead of you, and you want to condemn her to whatever is is you're not willing to talk with her about... for the rest of her life? How is that being kind to her? That's a prison sentence. She should have a choice based on truth. What has she done to you that's so terrible that you don't think she should have a chance at finding happiness with someone?

If she up and left, would you feel sad or relieved?


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## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

Casual Observer said:


> "Change your truth" means find a way to embrace and love your wife for who she is, if you can. You may not be able to. That's ok. Better to figure that out sooner than later. But if it is the case that you cannot "change your truth" and love her for who she is, then yes, you need to tell her.
> 
> I'm really flustered here. Your marriage is going nowhere, you're in your 30s with most of your lives ahead of you, and you want to condemn her to whatever is is you're not willing to talk with her about... for the rest of her life? How is that being kind to her? That's a prison sentence. She should have a choice based on truth. What has she done to you that's so terrible that you don't think she should have a chance at finding happiness with someone?
> 
> If she up and left, would you feel sad or relieved?


Keep in mind she has equal responsibility here in remaining in the marriage. They are in the same marriage, and she is also deciding, every day, to stay. I'm sure she is well aware of the problems they have.


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

Casual Observer said:


> "Change your truth" means find a way to embrace and love your wife for who she is, if you can. You may not be able to. That's ok. Better to figure that out sooner than later. But if it is the case that you cannot "change your truth" and love her for who she is, then yes, you need to tell her.
> 
> I'm really flustered here. Your marriage is going nowhere, you're in your 30s with most of your lives ahead of you, and you want to condemn her to whatever is is you're not willing to talk with her about... for the rest of her life? How is that being kind to her? That's a prison sentence. She should have a choice based on truth. What has she done to you that's so terrible that you don't think she should have a chance at finding happiness with someone?
> 
> If she up and left, would you feel sad or relieved?


You seem to be focused on her feelings in this marriage, there is also mine to consider. You call her being in this marriage a prison sentence, while I don't think it is perfect (how many marriages are), she still has a good situation. 
If she up and left, which I know is highly unlikely based on the many years of knowing her, I would be both sad and relieved. I love her, it would be sad, it would also provide me the chance to move on and find something different.


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## Mr.Married (Feb 21, 2018)

Deleted


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## Mr.Married (Feb 21, 2018)

GutShot7 said:


> Grandkids and you have sex that often. I cant imagine why at that age.


Have you ever had a diagnosis as having a condition or being on a spectrum????


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## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

Livvie said:


> Keep in mind she has equal responsibility here in remaining in the marriage. They are in the same marriage, and she is also deciding, every day, to stay. I'm sure she is well aware of the problems they have.


You're making an assumption that she has a clue that her husband finds sex with her to be something he wants to avoid because he doesn't find her attractive. He has made his unwillingness to tell her the truth, to do anything that might elicit an emotional response, well-known.


GutShot7 said:


> You seem to be focused on her feelings in this marriage, there is also mine to consider. You call her being in this marriage a prison sentence, while I don't think it is perfect (how many marriages are), she still has a good situation.
> If she up and left, which I know is highly unlikely based on the many years of knowing her, I would be both sad and relieved. I love her, it would be sad, it would also provide me the chance to move on and find something different.


Could you describe how she's in a good situation? Or why you don't think she should know the truth?

Yes, I am focused on her feelings, because I believe you are really low on the empathy scale, which fits with many who have suffered from very low self-esteem, as you said you have in the past. 

Also, regarding a prior message, the fully-clothed beautiful women you're getting off to? That's porn. Just because they have clothes on doesn't make it any different. It's how you view it in your mind that counts, and in your mind, you're having sex with these women. Porn per se may not be a terrible thing; some guys use porn as a way to "get ready" for their wives. But when it's used as a substitute, and especially when used to avoid dealing with why it's a substitute, that's really destructive porn.


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## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

GutShot7 said:


> 4-6 times a week? Are you still in your first year of marriage?


I'm 49 and on my second marriage, while my 50 year old wife is on her first, and we have been together for 24 years (married for 21). Plus we also have had two children together who are now 19 and 17. Yet we share sex together at a minimum of 4x a week, while a lot of the time it is at least 6x a week. Plus we still often share sex together at 8-9x a week as well.

Likewise throughout every ongoing sexual relationship I have been in, including my first marriage there has always been lots of frequent sex. All without scheduling ever being a thing with anyone.



GutShot7 said:


> If my wife were here posting in the sex category she would probably say that she wants to have sex more, she might even post saying that I have low drive, which I do for her, but not in general. And no I don't let her know that, that would hurt her.


Are you having sex with other people? Because if you aren't, perhaps you don't have much of a sex drive to begin with. Since if I were getting shared sex at 2-3x a week or less as the norm, I would certainly find other people to share sex with.



GutShot7 said:


> But it would ensure that sex happens and she would have one less thing to get emotional about and maybe she would be happier overall. If she was happier overall with the relationship my hope is that she would do a few other things around the house that she knows makes me happy.
> Means to an End.


It is a fools errand to believe that more sex will see your wife doing more chores. That kind of covert contract nonsense never works.


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## badsanta (Oct 13, 2014)

GutShot7 said:


> I want to avoid emotional situations, not create ones that are more intense.
> As for the porn, as I said, rarely ever use that. Pictures of attractive women, yes I look at and use those, excellent app for that.


Next question.... These photos of attractive women that you look at while self pleasuring. Why is it that you don't consider that to be porn. Generally speaking pornography is described as any form of visual stimulation that someone uses to enhance/facilitate masturbation. For example a lingerie catalog when viewed by someone shopping for a new bra is a non-pornographic sales catalog. However if someone uses that catalog because they find it to be sexually stimulating in a visual way, then it is used as a form of pornography. 

If you visit a porn site there are categories and keywords for content devoted to "fully clothed" women. 

I think you are lying to yourself about using porn. You need to admit to your wife that you use porn and ask her to help you with that. It is nothing to be ashamed about. 

Regards, 
Badsanta


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

Mr.Married said:


> Have you ever had a diagnosis as having a condition or being on a spectrum????


no, why would you ask that?



Casual Observer said:


> You're making an assumption that she has a clue that her husband finds sex with her to be something he wants to avoid because he doesn't find her attractive. He has made his unwillingness to tell her the truth, to do anything that might elicit an emotional response, well-known.
> Could you describe how she's in a good situation? Or why you don't think she should know the truth?
> 
> Yes, I am focused on her feelings, because I believe you are really low on the empathy scale, which fits with many who have suffered from very low self-esteem, as you said you have in the past.
> ...


My wife isn't completely clueless, she knows that the situation between us isn't ideal and I think she is smart enough to know that her weight plays in to the attraction factor. She has tried multiple diets over the years, but hasn't been able to stick with it long term. 
Why she is in a good situation? She has a husband who loves her, is loyal to her. Financial situation is good, I take care of 90% of the household needs. Much of the practical aspects of life are in the positive for her. 
We have very different views on "porn." You also seem to contradict yourself when you say that some guys use it as a way to get ready for their wives, as if that is ok, but then when you use it on its own it is not. That seems odd.


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## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

badsanta said:


> I think you are lying to yourself about using porn. You need to admit to your wife that you use porn and ask her to help you with that. It is nothing to be ashamed about.


If it is nothing to be ashamed of, why would anyone in their right mind need to seek help for looking at it?

With these kind of ideas, no wonder some people have less than stellar sex lives.


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

Personal said:


> I'm 49 and on my second marriage, while my 50 year old wife is on her first, and we have been together for 24 years (married for 21). Plus we also have had two children together who are now 19 and 17. Yet we share sex together at a minimum of 4x a week, while a lot of the time it is at least 6x a week. Plus we still often share sex together at 8-9x a week as well.
> 
> Likewise throughout every ongoing sexual relationship I have been in, including my first marriage there has always been lots of frequent sex. All without scheduling ever being a thing with anyone.
> 
> ...


Never cheated, haven't had as much as a kiss with someone else since I have been with my wife. I do believe my sex drive is just fine, though I don't think I would ever desire having sex 8-9 times a week, I see no need for that even if I was with someone very attractive. 
Happy people often do things for others. When my wifes "bucket" of positive things gets filled it is just natural that she would return the favor. That is how people naturally work.


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

badsanta said:


> Next question.... These photos of attractive women that you look at while self pleasuring. Why is it that you don't consider that to be porn. Generally speaking pornography is described as any form of visual stimulation that someone uses to enhance/facilitate masturbation. For example a lingerie catalog when viewed by someone shopping for a new bra is a non-pornographic sales catalog. However if someone uses that catalog because they find it to be sexually stimulating in a visual way, then it is used as a form of pornography.
> 
> If you visit a porn site there are categories and keywords for content devoted to "fully clothed" women.
> 
> ...


I think we are getting into semantics regarding it then at this point. To me; porn is either still pictures of people without clothing in a sexual nature or videos of people in sexual acts. 
Pictures of attractive people that are clothed, sometimes more sometimes less clothing, are still people clothed, just how you might see them out in public at a restaurant or at the pool.


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## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

GutShot7 said:


> When my wifes "bucket" of positive things gets filled it is just natural that she would return the favor. That is how people naturally work.


Except that isn't what happens with your wife, so it ought to be pretty clear to you that isn't how all people naturally work.

So you can tilt at windmills to no end all you like, by wishing that your wife will conform to the way you think the should behave. Yet that isn't going to change the real world that you actually live in.


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

Personal said:


> Except that isn't what happens with your wife, so it ought to be pretty clear to you that isn't how all people naturally work.
> 
> So you can tilt at windmills to no end all you like, by wishing that your wife will conform to the way you think the should behave. Yet that isn't going to change the real world that you actually live in.


It won't magically transform her in to what I want, no. But it doesn't hurt. When we do positive things for one another, it pushes us to do positive things back for the other. It may not result in everything the other person wants, but it is better than nothing.


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## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

GutShot7 said:


> But it doesn't hurt.


More shared sex potentially gets more shared sex, while more shared chores potentially gets more shared chores or not.

Yet make no mistake more chores do not mean more sex, and more sex does not mean more chores.


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

Personal said:


> More shared sex potentially gets more shared sex, while more shared chores potentially gets more shared chores or not.
> 
> Yet make no mistake more chores do not mean more sex, and more sex does not mean more chores.


People want and care about different things. Physical touch is one of my W love languages, while acts of service is one of mine.


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## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

^^^ Shrug... As I said, tilting at windmills.


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

Personal said:


> ^^^ Shrug... As I said, tilting at windmills.


The biggest benefit is keeping her less emotional. If I don't have to deal with emotional outbursts, then things are going better in everyday life.


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## heartsbeating (May 2, 2011)

GutShot7 said:


> Does anyone schedule the sex they have with their spouse? Does it work for you? Do people not like this idea?


We don't... and haven't... and the idea wouldn't appeal to me. 

The closest approach that does appeal, if we're using verbal communication (although our interactions are more ignited through non-verbal means) is along the lines of, 'tonight, lets ----' which is interchangeable with 'wanna ----?' Oh such sweet words...! haha. But yeah, it's on. And typically accompanied with flirting and a bit of fun tension.


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## heartsbeating (May 2, 2011)

GutShot7 said:


> We have both tried to initiate and been turned down at times, it happens. Scheduling it can help both of us be mentally ready for it, then each of can make sure we are personally in the mood for it when the time comes. And it can help ensure it happens without going many weeks or months without which happens.


Body language plays a part in our marriage. Along with other aspects of personality and such. We could be watching TV together, and I'm not even thinking of sex, when he might gently reach over and stroke my hair - then give it an unexpected playful / sexy pull. Instantly my focus switches. Then his eyes tell me. Conversely, I can be a real flirty pants with him, but at times I just glance to him with what's on my mind, and he's replied 'Oh yeah?'

However, if I've felt completely tapped from work, he might suggest that he'll make me feel better (meaning through sexy time), but there are moments when I just need some alone time to chill. Like the unintended 2 hours on the piano I just had! With that time to myself in music, I cried. And I rarely cry...! Stiff upper lip and all that was gone... emotions linked to an upsetting scenario of the day surfaced and released while I played. Then he gave me a big hug. I digress.


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## heartsbeating (May 2, 2011)

GutShot7 said:


> It is not torturous to have sex with her. I just don't get that turned on by her. So being prepared for it makes it easier to know when to get turned on and be ready. It would also make it easier to avoid doing anything solo leading up to our scheduled time.


If I knew that my husband wasn't attracted to me and had to psyche himself up to be sexual together... there's no way in my mentals I could get right with that - for either of us. And, I'd likely stay well clear of intimacy if I sensed this and be considering an out.


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## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

GutShot7 said:


> The biggest benefit is keeping her less emotional. If I don't have to deal with emotional outbursts, then things are going better in everyday life.


This is an interesting statement. I mean, sure, it would be great if my wife were less emotional and more logical about things. If she could just play by my rules. Not so much my rules but my way of looking at things. Why can't she adopt my attitudes about things, my ways of dealing with things. Oh. Wait. She's not me. And sometimes there will be conflict, which rises to an emotional level because we haven't adequately dealt with notions of privacy and boundaries.

The goal shouldn't be to suppress negative emotions. The goal should be to reduce the root cause of them. I have first-hand knowledge of the massive damage that can be done to a person, to a relationship, by keeping painful secrets, and dealing with depression by taking Prozac instead of dealing with the actual problem. Nothing good will come from it. 

You think my total focus has been on your wife. We'll switch that right now. You're not a monster. You have feelings. And it must eat away at you to think that your wife is married to someone that feels at least a bit repulsed when it comes to physical intimacy with her. You carry that secret, at least you believe it's a secret, with you every day, every time you see her. That's a terrible burden. At some point that could, maybe likely would, lead to depression. But instead of telling the therapist the root problem, you'll play the game to get the meds, and you'll take your Prozac and feel less depressed, while still carrying that burden. Your empathy, whatever there was of it, will all but disappear as you become unable to "read" people. You won't be sad and depressed, but you won't ever feel really happy again either. 

Sometime down the road your wife discovers something that makes it clear what your real feelings have been about her. All of a sudden you're in a situation that overwhelms the Prozac and you feel helpless and afraid and angry. And fear being alone. Complete loss of control because your secret is out. It's a crapshoot whether you become lucky or extraordinarily unlucky if your wife gives you an ultimatum- individual counseling and marriage counseling and it's HER choice of whether she wants to put together the pieces, after your life has finally been dissected and examined and roto-tilled.

Why risk all that, for the sake of having a more-compliant wife at the moment? If you truly love this woman, fix your relationship now. Tell her how it tears you apart, this lack of desire you have for her. That you fantasize about other women, and that you would would prefer a marriage in which you fantasized about her, and her, you. Tell her the truth so she can make the best decision about her life. And whatever that decision is, it will also be the best decision for your life as well.


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## Mr. Nail (Apr 26, 2011)

GutShot7 said:


> Grandkids and you have sex that often. *I cant imagine* why at that age.


No, indeed you can not.
Your marriage is in terrible danger. You are dealing with a set of personalities and events that would wreck a strong relationship.
Here is a short list. 
You have no intimate connection.
You have no trust.
You have sex based trauma.
Your relationship is held together by one person doing chores. (trying to nice her into love)
You are conflict avoidant at all cost.

Here is my final advice (assuming you are still listening to me): Get a qualified board certified personal therapist, and go regularly.


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## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

You had no passion for your wife when you married her. You were pragmatic. Just what were these practical reasons? Do any of the following apply:
she had money
she had property
she had family influence
she could help with your career
she was the only game in town
she was the only one who would have you

You say you love her; but, it's obvious you don't even like her. I suggest you put the both of you out of your respective miseries and get a divorce. You are still young enough to find that woman who inspires passion and then you'll marvel at the thought that you ever questioned older people having sex. People over forty, fifty, sixty, seventy have lots and lots of sex.


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

Blondilocks said:


> You had no passion for your wife when you married her. You were pragmatic. Just what were these practical reasons? Do any of the following apply:
> she had money
> she had property
> she had family influence
> ...


We were friends with common values, a relationship ensued.


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

heartsbeating said:


> If I knew that my husband wasn't attracted to me and had to psyche himself up to be sexual together... there's no way in my mentals I could get right with that - for either of us. And, I'd likely stay well clear of intimacy if I sensed this and be considering an out.


Thus why I dont want her to know that. Too much hurt there.


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

Casual Observer said:


> The goal shouldn't be to suppress negative emotions. The goal should be to reduce the root cause of them. I have first-hand knowledge of the massive damage that can be done to a person, to a relationship, by keeping painful secrets, and dealing with depression by taking Prozac instead of dealing with the actual problem. Nothing good will come from it.
> 
> You think my total focus has been on your wife. We'll switch that right now. You're not a monster. You have feelings. And it must eat away at you to think that your wife is married to someone that feels at least a bit repulsed when it comes to physical intimacy with her. You carry that secret, at least you believe it's a secret, with you every day, every time you see her. That's a terrible burden. At some point that could, maybe likely would, lead to depression. But instead of telling the therapist the root problem, you'll play the game to get the meds, and you'll take your Prozac and feel less depressed, while still carrying that burden. Your empathy, whatever there was of it, will all but disappear as you become unable to "read" people. You won't be sad and depressed, but you won't ever feel really happy again either.
> 
> ...


I am trying to fix things right now, thus why I came here to get advice on how to make specific situations better. 
As for telling her how I truly feel about her, that would hurt her to her core too much, not willing to do that to her. If our marriage were to ever end, it will end in a less harmful way than that.


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## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

GutShot7 said:


> We were friends with common values, a relationship ensued.


Then be her friend and tell her the relationship isn't working out.


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

GutShot7 said:


> 4-6 times a week? Are you still in your first year of marriage?


The Honeymoon can continue if both put forth the effort to make each other a priority. My beloved(52) and I(48) have been together 24 yrs. and cant keep our hands off each other. 15yr old son said last night, "I cant believe yall are just gonna make out in the kitchen in front of me!" 
I just came up behind her and was biting her on the back of the neck and she responded by turning around for a kiss and embrace. It is important to keep love alive. Equally important for my kids to see, set the example of how a marriage should be, to choose your mate wisely and continuously show affection. When wife and i hug my 15 yr old joins in with bear hug the both of us. He is 15, 6'04" ,250lbs and wears a 14 shoe.


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

Blondilocks said:


> Then be her friend and tell her the relationship isn't working out.


That would hurt her. And she would want more information, which in turn would hurt her more. Not what I want to accomplish.


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## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

GutShot7 said:


> That would hurt her. And she would want more information, which in turn would hurt her more. Not what I want to accomplish.


This is another example of your need to control the outcome.


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## Dadto2 (Aug 11, 2020)

GutShot7 said:


> That would hurt her. And she would want more information, which in turn would hurt her more. Not what I want to accomplish.


Brother, you are just going to continue going in circles then. You need to make a move to break the cycle.


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

Blondilocks said:


> This is another example of your need to control the outcome.


Attempting to control as many variables in life as possible to achieve specific outcomes or avoid others just seems logical.


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## badsanta (Oct 13, 2014)

Personal said:


> If it is nothing to be ashamed of, why would anyone in their right mind need to seek help for looking at it?
> 
> With these kind of ideas, no wonder some people have less than stellar sex lives.


I am not sure what you are saying, but if someone is in a sexless marriage as a result of habitually looking at photos of attractive women during self pleasure.... ummm yes they need help.

Especially when you consider the fact that he can not even talk about this with his wife... double ummm yes they need help. 

Now if this was something his wife knows about and it had no impact on their intimacy, then indeed there is no problem what so ever. Pictures of attractive women would then be no more harmless than playing with a nerf gun.


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## badsanta (Oct 13, 2014)

GutShot7 said:


> I think we are getting into semantics regarding it then at this point. To me; porn is either still pictures of people without clothing in a sexual nature or videos of people in sexual acts.
> Pictures of attractive people that are clothed, sometimes more sometimes less clothing, are still people clothed, just how you might see them out in public at a restaurant or at the pool.


Unless you can speak openly about this topic with you wife and allow her to ask questions about it. You have a problem. 

Otherwise it is like her trying to solve problems in your marriage while being lied to because you are omitting certain information. Avoiding confrontation is NOT an excuse. Avoiding confrontation is yet another symptom of this problem. 

Badsanta


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## Mr. Nail (Apr 26, 2011)

GutShot7 said:


> Attempting to control as many variables in life as possible to achieve specific outcomes or avoid others just seems logical.





Mr. Nail said:


> You are conflict avoidant at all cost.


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

badsanta said:


> I am not sure what you are saying, but if someone is in a sexless marriage as a result of habitually looking at photos of attractive women during self pleasure.... ummm yes they need help.
> 
> Especially when you consider the fact that he can not even talk about this with his wife... double ummm yes they need help.
> 
> Now if this was something his wife knows about and it had no impact on their intimacy, then indeed there is no problem what so ever. Pictures of attractive women would then be no more harmless than playing with a nerf gun.


The lack of regular sex (I don't view it as sexless) in our marriage has nothing to do with looking at other attractive women. It is not a cause of the less sex, it is an effect of the current lack of attraction to the wife. There is a significant difference there.


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

Ok? Avoiding conflict isn't an outright bad thing on its own.


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## badsanta (Oct 13, 2014)

GutShot7 said:


> The lack of regular sex (I don't view it as sexless) in our marriage has nothing to do with looking at other attractive women. It is not a cause of the less sex, it is an effect of the current lack of attraction to the wife. There is a significant difference there.


Generally speaking there are certain things that can kill a man's libido such as certain medications. Masturbation is one of those things due to the refractory period and the respective hormones produced that make subsequent sex unappetizing.

If you were to abstain from masturbating, then sex with your wife would become more desirable. You would also find her more sexually attractive as a result. 

A very common problem is that men resort to masturbation because it is fun, pleasurable, soothing and easy. Combined with certain sexually stimulating materials (most often porn) it can also become overstimulating and overindulging. The result of which there can be no more interest in natural sex with a spouse. 

If you ask your wife for help, it is not really that of getting help for an addiction. But more so to help be aware as a couple of certain habits and behaviors that may be problematic. Some couples embrace porn together. Some wives will even pick out porn for their husband's to watch. The idea is that you don't want certain behaviors to pull you away from your spouse. They can be modified to help you each feel closer and better know one another. 

Regards, 
Badsanta


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## badsanta (Oct 13, 2014)

GutShot7 said:


> Ok? Avoiding conflict isn't an outright bad thing on its own.


Avoiding conflict is a huge problem!









Lessons from a Couples Therapist: Conflict Avoidance Can Destroy Your Marriage


Conflict avoidance is one of the biggest topics that keep coming in couples counseling sessions. Holding off c




psychcentral.com


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

badsanta said:


> Avoiding conflict is a huge problem!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


You want me screw up the rest of my marriage by confessing one component to my W, not a chance. That's not worth it at all. I don't want to create even more controversy than there already is, I want less. I want to make the day to day loving easier, not more difficult to deal with.


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## badsanta (Oct 13, 2014)

GutShot7 said:


> You want me screw up the rest of my marriage by confessing one component to my W, not a chance. That's not worth it at all. I don't want to create even more controversy than there already is, I want less. I want to make the day to day loving easier, not more difficult to deal with.


If you go to your wife and admit that you have a problem and ask her to help you with it, that is the only chance you have to actually make things easier. 

Otherwise she is fighting a battle against an unknown problem and can't help improve the relationship with teamwork. 

Imagine my wife trying to help me loose weight. I completely cut out all my unhealthy foods. In secret I stop by McDonalds regularly for double cheeseburgers and milkshakes. I think nothing of it because I feel they are insignificant but would cause a huge fight if my wife found out about it. However if I go to her and admit that I am doing something problematic and ask her to help me, that is a good thing and will likely help improve the situation. Odds are she could help me find alternatives that would be a healthier snack to help me avoid going to McDonalds.


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

badsanta said:


> If you go to your wife and admit that you have a problem and ask her to help you with it, that is the only chance you have to actually make things easier.
> 
> Otherwise she is fighting a battle against an unknown problem and can't help improve the relationship with teamwork.
> 
> Imagine my wife trying to help me loose weight. I completely cut out all my unhealthy foods. In secret I stop by McDonalds regularly for double cheeseburgers and milkshakes. I think nothing of it because I feel they are insignificant but would cause a huge fight if my wife found out about it. However if I go to her and admit that I am doing something problematic and ask her to help me, that is a good thing and will likely help improve the situation. Odds are she could help me find alternatives that would be a healthier snack to help me avoid going to McDonalds.


The only problem I would have to admit to her are the issues I have with her. Some of those I want to address, but do so in a simple/subtle way that wont elicit an emotional response from her.


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## minimalME (Jan 3, 2012)

Well, since you seem determined to live as you have been, just continue on the way people have for thousands of years, and ignore all the problems. And that's a genuine suggestion.

Whatever your income allows, hire people to get stuff done around your house. Hire a maid. Hire a cook. Hire a lawn guy.

Or, adjust to the reality that it's all on you, and stop complaining about it. _Accept it._

You want more 'fun' in your life? Then go do the enjoyable things you want to do. She doesn't have to come, if she doesn't want to. She can go off and do her thing.

If this makes her angry, then stay bored and unfulfilled.

Sex life? Get it when you can, however she prefers, so that you don't have to deal with her unpleasant emotions.

Stay married, get through each day, and carry on.

I may have missed it, but out of all the posts you've written and all the advice you've been given, I don't recall you once agreeing and saying, 'I'm gonna do that.'

Concede that this is the life you've chosen, and stop talking about it. 🤐



GutShot7 said:


> You want me screw up the rest of my marriage by confessing one component to my W, not a chance. That's not worth it at all. I don't want to create even more controversy than there already is, I want less. I want to make the day to day loving easier, not more difficult to deal with.


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## Mr. Nail (Apr 26, 2011)

Mr. Nail said:


> Your marriage is in terrible danger. You are dealing with a set of personalities and events that would wreck a strong relationship.


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

minimalME said:


> Well, since you seem determined to live as you have been, just continue on the way people have for thousands of years, and ignore all the problems. And that's a genuine suggestion.
> 
> Whatever your income allows, hire people to get stuff done around your house. Hire a maid. Hire a cook. Hire a lawn guy.
> 
> ...


I dont want to continue as is, I want to improve the situation. But I also want to do so with as little emotional turmoil as possible. I came her looking for advice on how to get from A to B without causing other issues. 
Yes I want more fun, I need more time for that. You say hire people to do things arrou d the house, that seems like a waste of money and then there might not be money for the fun. 
Its complicated and not a simple answer


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## Imagirl (Aug 17, 2020)

GutShot7 said:


> You say hire people to do things arrou d the house, that seems like a waste of money and then there might not be money for the fun.
> Its complicated and not a simple answer


Fun doesn't have to cost money. The idea is that if housework is a problem to just pay someone and solve the problem. Pick a battle, is the money more important or is the housework getting done more important? 
I can relate with her... Maybe. If I were your wife is probably be similar. If I'm asked to help and then everything I'm doing isn't done the right way I'd start to shut down. In fact when i started doing most of the cooking I told my guy to stay out of the kitchen lol As far as porn, while I don't have major issues with it (althoigh it did pay a part in my divorce... Another story) my man has folders full of me being his porn star. He looks at those. Can you do that? What woman would object to that?


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

Imagirl said:


> Fun doesn't have to cost money. The idea is that if housework is a problem to just pay someone and solve the problem. Pick a battle, is the money more important or is the housework getting done more important?
> I can relate with her... Maybe. If I were your wife is probably be similar. If I'm asked to help and then everything I'm doing isn't done the right way I'd start to shut down. In fact when i started doing most of the cooking I told my guy to stay out of the kitchen lol As far as porn, while I don't have major issues with it (althoigh it did pay a part in my divorce... Another story) my man has folders full of me being his porn star. He looks at those. Can you do that? What woman would object to that?


Much of the fun I want to do, does cost some money. If we each did our part around the house, the time it takes would be minimal, then we could focus on fun. Maybe that is the way I can try to approach it with her. Personally I enjoy doing some housework, just wish I didn't have to do it ALL. 
Not sure what you are asking me "can I do that" in reference to. Look at pictures of my wife? Not sure what good that would do?


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## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

GutShot7 said:


> I dont want to continue as is, I want to improve the situation. But I also want to do so with as little emotional turmoil as possible. I came her looking for advice on how to get from A to B without causing other issues.
> Yes I want more fun, I need more time for that. You say hire people to do things arrou d the house, that seems like a waste of money and then there might not be money for the fun.
> Its complicated and not a simple answer


What about asking her what she would like? 

This is sounding more and more like the Stepford Wives. You want to control as much as possible, and that includes her. That's just not fair. She is a person all by herself, whether you are in the picture or not. Many of us here would die for their partner if it came to that. We would put their needs first. Their lives first. And that makes us happy, for some weird, unfathomable and illogical reason. Sometimes we stray from that, sometimes we stray too far and have to remember what it is about our partner that sparks that feeling, what it is about us that feels best when doing something for them. 

Not to them. For them. And not because we know better. Because we love them and want the best for them. Not what's convenient for us. Hopefully what's best for the relationship.


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## Deepsouthdude (Feb 12, 2020)

OP has pretty much shot down every input and suggestion offered in this thread. I don’t see how this is going to result in marriage improvements.


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

Deepsouthdude said:


> OP has pretty much shot down every input and suggestion offered in this thread. I don’t see how this is going to result in marriage improvements.


The main suggestions have been either to tell her the truth about how I feel or just leave her alone. Neither of those seem like beneficial suggestions.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

GutShot7 said:


> I dont want to continue as is, I want to improve the situation. But I also want to do so with as little emotional turmoil as possible. I came her looking for advice on how to get from A to B without causing other issues.
> Yes I want more fun, I need more time for that. You say hire people to do things arrou d the house, that seems like a waste of money and then there might not be money for the fun.
> Its complicated and not a simple answer


Take this in a constructive way, and this is why folks come to forums, to get perhaps an outside opinion or objective opinion, call it what you will.

Sometimes OPs are agreed with, disagreed with, or just listened too fir compassion when needed.

After all the your posts and the various ideas members have out out there the one consistent thing I'm seeing is this.

You ready?

You just want to disagree with everyone and reinforce that you know better.

And how the whole problem is none of you and all of the Ws, or others, or circumstances, but not in any part to do with you.

Well my friend there has been a great number and variety of suggestions shared to you.

It's time you pick something, any, none, partial. Or top complaining. 

It's almost like you don't want there to be an answer.

Best of luck to you sir. The rhetoric is getting too circular, I'll just excuse myself and say no more.

Good luck!


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> Take this in a constructive way, and this is why folks come to forums, to get perhaps an outside opinion or objective opinion, call it what you will.
> 
> Sometimes OPs are agreed with, disagreed with, or just listened too fir compassion when needed.
> 
> ...


I know I am part of the problem. I made my bed when I said I Do, I just want to find a solution that makes things easier without making them harder along the way as well. 
Yes, honesty is great and best in most situations. But that will just cause more pain and emotion in this circumstance. I'm looking for an approach, maybe a communication strategy that makes things easier to deal with and avoids any emotion along the way. This would be for the sex situation as well as others in the marriage. My wife doesnt like how I deal with emotion so my prefefencecus to keep emotion out if the equation as much as possible.


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## Girl_power (Aug 11, 2018)

Don’t take this personal OP, but your marriage is my fear. The way you take about your wife, I hope to God my husband would divorce me and let me find someone who actually loves who I am. 
It sounds like you are just tolerating her. There doesn’t sound like any love there, it makes me really sad for her.


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

Girl_power said:


> Don’t take this personal OP, but your marriage is my fear. The way you take about your wife, I hope to God my husband would divorce me and let me find someone who actually loves who I am.
> It sounds like you are just tolerating her. There doesn’t sound like any love there, it makes me really sad for her.


There is love both ways. I love her very much. Even if we divorced I would want her to be happy afterwards. Ideally I'd want to keep in touch and know that she is doing well because I care about her. 
In love is a diffent story.


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## Girl_power (Aug 11, 2018)

GutShot7 said:


> There is love both ways. I love her very much. Even if we divorced I would want her to be happy afterwards. Ideally I'd want to keep in touch and know that she is doing well because I care about her.
> In love is a diffent story.


You don’t even sound like you like her. It’s all negative. You come in here trying to improve your sex life by scheduling it, then you disclose that she wants more sex, that you refuse sex with her, and you find her unattractive, she doesn’t excite you anymore, and the sex is boring.

So what do you want? Because it doesn’t sound like HER.


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

Girl_power said:


> You don’t even sound like you like her. It’s all negative. You come in here trying to improve your sex life by scheduling it, then you disclose that she wants more sex, that you refuse sex with her, and you find her unattractive, she doesn’t excite you anymore, and the sex is boring.
> 
> So what do you want? Because it doesn’t sound like HER.


It sounds negative because I come here focusing on the things I want to fix, not focusing on good things, dont need help with any of that. 
We both turn down sex at times, often because of timing is what I stated, so it's not me refusing sex with her. 
Right now I want the current situation to improve. You ask do I want her? Long term, no. But that's not where we are at right now.


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## Prodigal (Feb 5, 2011)

Here's what I'm getting from you thus far. Please feel free to correct me if I'm wrong. You like attractiveness in a woman; it's what gets you in the mood. Your wife has let herself go, to some extent. You don't want to hurt her feelings. In fact, it sounds to me as if emotions are something with which you aren't comfortable.

But here's what I'm seeing: Both of you are halves. Two halves don't always make a whole. They make two halves. She carries the load of doing all the emoting. She's sloppy. (I don't know if she's lazy about housework or is just a slob.) You carry the load of being logical, analytical, and organized one.

These different approaches can become incompatibilities that doom a marriage, or dilute it to nothing more than making the best of the situation. Sometimes people seek out their polar opposite in order to "complete" themselves. They say opposites attract. Sure, if they appreciate one another's differences. I'm getting a clear sense that you don't appreciate, or even like, her differences.

Emotions are who we are. Lots of people aren't comfortable with delving into their own emotions or anyone else's for that matter. But there's no way around having an honest discussion with your wife. Sounds like neither of you are all that happy or satisfied. Sometimes we have to get down and dirty to rectify a situation. 

I don't know if your wife goes off her stick when she gets emotional, or if it's just you being uncomfortable that makes you gun shy of telling it like it is. JMO.


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

I understand and agree with most of what you said there. 
Not sure what you mean by off her stick?


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## Prodigal (Feb 5, 2011)

GutShot7 said:


> Not sure what you mean by off her stick?


I mean feeding into her own emotions to the point that she gets loud, cries, isn't listening to reason, not putting forth a rational argument/discussion. You see her emotionalism through your own prism of logic. You have mentioned several times your wish to avoid emotional reactions. Is it because you are uncomfortable with that or does she go off the deep end (or off her stick) a bit?


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## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

GutShot7 said:


> You ask do I want her? Long term, no. But that's not where we are at right now.


The only reason you can say this with a clear conscience is because you have suppressed emotions and empathy. And that is not a normal, healthy mental state.

You ask why I think she's the person to feel badly for, not you. Why do you need anyone to feel badly for you? It feels like you're looking for validation for not dealing with emotion & empathy because they create situations you choose not to deal with.

What you are looking for here, empathy and emotion for you position, is exactly what you are denying your wife.


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## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

GutShot7 said:


> I know I am part of the problem. I made my bed when I said I Do, I just want to find a solution that makes things easier without making them harder along the way as well.


You took the easy path to marriage by marrying your best friend. And, now, you want an easy solution to the problems created by having taken the easy path. If there was an easy solution, you would have found it by now.

However you go about it, it's going to hurt. The longer this goes on, the more it will hurt her. Is that a kindness you would want bestowed upon you?


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## Prodigal (Feb 5, 2011)

I'm going to drag out that old, tired cliché: Life ain't easy. Sorry, but that is just the way it rolls. I wanted an easy way out of my marriage to a raging alcoholic. I didn't get it. But I can truthfully say that going through the difficult part - the parts I didn't like and downright hated at times - brought me to where I am now.

And I'm in a helluva lot better place than I was 10 years ago.


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

Prodigal said:


> I mean feeding into her own emotions to the point that she gets loud, cries, isn't listening to reason, not putting forth a rational argument/discussion. You see her emotionalism through your own prism of logic. You have mentioned several times your wish to avoid emotional reactions. Is it because you are uncomfortable with that or does she go off the deep end (or off her stick) a bit?


Crying, aggressive verbal outbursts, not wanting to talk at all. 
I don5 like dealing with those things, I'd rather find a solution, fix and move on.


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

Casual Observer said:


> The only reason you can say this with a clear conscience is because you have suppressed emotions and empathy. And that is not a normal, healthy mental state.
> 
> You ask why I think she's the person to feel badly for, not you. Why do you need anyone to feel badly for you? It feels like you're looking for validation for not dealing with emotion & empathy because they create situations you choose not to deal with.
> 
> What you are looking for here, empathy and emotion for you position, is exactly what you are denying your wife.


You have empathy for the emotional aspect of all this for my wife. I would also like to be in a relationship where positive emotion goes both ways, but am not. In addition, the everyday aspect is of life are not what I want and are much more difficult for me than her. Practically, she gas an easier and more comfortable life than me.


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

Blondilocks said:


> You took the easy path to marriage by marrying your best friend. And, now, you want an easy solution to the problems created by having taken the easy path. If there was an easy solution, you would have found it by now.
> 
> However you go about it, it's going to hurt. The longer this goes on, the more it will hurt her. Is that a kindness you would want bestowed upon you?


It already hurts, I'm trying to prevent too much unnecessary hurt added on to it. There is nothing wrong with also trying to make things better along the way.


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## Prodigal (Feb 5, 2011)

If she starts having meltdowns when you want to discuss emotionally-laden issues, could it be that she is manipulating you? After all, she's aware you don't like her having such outbursts, right? So you back down. JMO but the way to approach this is to tell her, in no uncertain terms, that you WILL discuss such issues, but you will not do it while she's carrying on. Leave the room. Leave the house. Revisit the issue. Boundaries. Have them in place, enforce them, and then speak your peace.

I was married to a man who REFUSED to discuss important issues pertaining to our marriage. He actually left the house for the night when I brought up one particular issue. No, I wasn't yelling, screaming, or crying. But he couldn't handle it. That's when I knew it was time for me to just let it go and leave. 

You can't spend the time in your relationship dodging emotional bullets and getting nothing resolved. I don't see it ending well with that M.O.


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## badsanta (Oct 13, 2014)

Prodigal said:


> I was married to a man who REFUSED to discuss important issues pertaining to our marriage. He actually left the house for the night when I brought up one particular issue. No, I wasn't yelling, screaming, or crying. But he couldn't handle it. That's when I knew it was time for me to just let it go and leave.


There it is from the other perspective. A man that avoids confrontation is someone that comes across to his wife as being, "unable to handle it!" Will that make her feel safe and protected in the relationship? NO! 

I am guessing as an example if and when the OP gets a letter in the mail from a health insurance company explaining his benefits, stating that a recent claim was denied, and that he owes thousands of dollars for an emergency procedure because it was not pre-approved... best to just pay it and avoid confrontation. No point in contacting the service provider to help them discover that something was incorrectly filed. Also no point in getting the health insurance company to actually document the allowable amount should there be a balance due so that the bill is just $250 instead of $5,000.

Odds are his wife has to deal with all that kind of stuff in the marriage since he as a man avoids confrontation. The resulting stress likely takes a toll on her health and prevents her from taking better care of herself.

My point here is to illustrate how avoiding confrontation and addressing problems directly just makes everything worse!

Regards, 
Badsanta


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

badsanta said:


> There it is from the other perspective. A man that avoids confrontation is someone that comes across to his wife as being, "unable to handle it!" Will that make her feel safe and protected in the relationship? NO!
> 
> I am guessing as an example if and when the OP gets a letter in the mail from a health insurance company explaining his benefits, stating that a recent claim was denied, and that he owes thousands of dollars for an emergency procedure because it was not pre-approved... best to just pay it and avoid confrontation. No point in contacting the service provider to help them discover that something was incorrectly filed. Also no point in getting the health insurance company to actually document the allowable amount should there be a balance due so that the bill is just $250 instead of $5,000.
> 
> ...


I handle those situations, it's not that I avoid confrontation, i don't really mind it with others because i don't have to deal with their emotion, i can walk away from it. The previous post where the husband couldn't handle the important discussions, that reminded me of my wife, she doesnt handle them well and gets emotional. I have no problem confronting issues and dealing with them practically, just need others to keep emotion out of it.


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## Girl_power (Aug 11, 2018)

GutShot7 said:


> I handle those situations, it's not that I avoid confrontation, i don't really mind it with others because i don't have to deal with their emotion, i can walk away from it. The previous post where the husband couldn't handle the important discussions, that reminded me of my wife, she doesnt handle them well and gets emotional. I have no problem confronting issues and dealing with them practically, just need others to keep emotion out of it.


But your wife is a women with emotions. So you can’t handle confrontation with your wife.


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## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

Girl_power said:


> But your wife is a women with emotions. So you can’t handle confrontation with your wife.


He wants to handle confrontations where he believes he can control the outcome. Once she gets emotional, he loses that control. My wife believed, maybe still believes, that if she gets too emotional, starts crying, that others (me, or a therapist) will back off. She wants people to back off. And for years everyone backed off.

It's taken her a very long time to understand that, for the things that put our marriage into jeopardy, the only time she's been fully truthful about her feelings has been when she completely breaks down. That's when she says the "bad" stuff that's in her mind that she doesn't want to deal with, doesn't want to admit that's what she's thinking. So to get anywhere, you have to push her, hard, into the territory where she'll break down and get mad and emotional. That's what it took to get her to say "I've resented sex for 40 years." 

So it could be that @GutShot7's wife is similar to mine that way, keeps things pretty much bottled up inside, which is how he prefers. He doesn't want her to get emotional because she'll then tell the truth, and he doesn't want to hear it. Because then he might lose control. As long as she doesn't get overly emotional, he can believe whatever he wants.

Sometimes, I'd think pretty much all the time, it's best to confront the truth. Get the secrets out and deal with them. If you're not able to stay married, then geez, stop torturing each other. If the two of you are strong enough to find a new path forward, great. But get to the truth. Everyone deserves the truth. It's not as if you're allowing somebody to die in peace instead of telling them on their deathbed that their husband had been running around on her for the whole marriage.


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## GutShot7 (Aug 2, 2020)

Casual Observer said:


> He wants to handle confrontations where he believes he can control the outcome. Once she gets emotional, he loses that control. My wife believed, maybe still believes, that if she gets too emotional, starts crying, that others (me, or a therapist) will back off. She wants people to back off. And for years everyone backed off.
> 
> It's taken her a very long time to understand that, for the things that put our marriage into jeopardy, the only time she's been fully truthful about her feelings has been when she completely breaks down. That's when she says the "bad" stuff that's in her mind that she doesn't want to deal with, doesn't want to admit that's what she's thinking. So to get anywhere, you have to push her, hard, into the territory where she'll break down and get mad and emotional. That's what it took to get her to say "I've resented sex for 40 years."
> 
> ...


I agree with everything you said up until the "get the secrets out and deal with them." I know I would be strong enough to find a new path forward, but I really don't think she would be. I wish she was, but based on her actions and things she has said, shes not. 
I want to have my cake and eat it too; the day to day life to be happy and and easy to deal with along the path until we each figure out what the something better will be for our lives and how to get there.


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## Talker67 (Apr 7, 2016)

GutShot7 said:


> Does anyone schedule the sex they have with their spouse? Does it work for you? Do people not like this idea?
> I have brought up the idea of scheduling it before and my wife has been against it. At the same time she wants to have sex more often, but the result is that we don't. I would like it if it was scheduled and we knew when to anticipate it, look forward to it and know it would be happening.


if you simply can not "find the time" to have sex during the week, always one excuse after another, SCHEDULING sex makes a lot of sense. It takes away the "i was not prepared for sex tonight" excuse. And in a LD spouse, it gives them a couple days to think about the upcoming day, and maybe succeed in getting them horny too.


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