# What happened to is she cheating? by invi



## Slow Hand (Oct 4, 2015)

Like the title says, what happened to the thread Is she cheating by invisible man? 

I was reading it at and when I went to the next page, it was gone? Did she cheat on him? What ended up happening? ugh....


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

Mods probably thought it was a troll thread and yanked it.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## JohnA (Jun 24, 2015)

Agreed it was most likely a troll. He got.sloppy towards the end.


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## Slow Hand (Oct 4, 2015)

It's so hard to tell, maybe I'll get better at it the more time I spend here. :surprise:


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## 225985 (Dec 29, 2015)

Yes, it gets easier to spot the trolls after spending more time here.

ETA: I did not read the post by invisibleman. I was just commenting to Slow Hand.


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## invisibleman (Apr 7, 2016)

Or maybe invisi deleted his own thread after realizing it was a f*cked up mistake and the only thing you can learn on this f*cked up site is how to f*ck up already f*cked up marriages. Would explain why he's not banned from the site.

To the bitter harpies, self-righteous bastards, and troublemakers on this site:

Misery likes company and you are all so miserable in your own little sewers you can't help but want to pull everyone down with you. Here's a clue. You're still going to be just as miserable even if you pull everyone you know down. 

You screwed up your own marriages and you are so dumb you really believe it was 100% your ex's fault. Newsflash! There's no such thing as a "victim" in divorce. Just people who admit their part and people who deny it. If your still in denial and feeling hurt about all the crap that happened to a good person like you, do everyone a favor and just SHUT UP. You have nothing to add to any conversation. 

Look in the upper left hand corner of your screen and you'll see the words is "Talk About Marriage" not "Advocate for Divorce." Marriage is hard and sometimes people look for a place to vent. If your best friend went off about his wife would your first reaction be "get a divorce?" Assuming you have any decency, the answer is NO! You'd ask questions, find out more about the story, and suggest some things he can do to deal with the situation. Why do you then default to "divorce, divorce, divorce" on this site? You're either stupid or you don't care. 

If you're not funded by divorce attorneys to drum up business then you're just the miserable scabs of humanity. Get use to your well deserved misery. It's not going to get any better for you. 

Hey f*king moderator p*ssys. I've just f*cking violated every one of your little precious rules put in place protect this f*cked up pity party. Shut down my account!


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## 225985 (Dec 29, 2015)

@invisibleman I did not read your story. I don't care if you cheated or she cheated. If you asked for help it's too bad you did not get it.

Yep, too many are quick here to throw out the "divorce" advice, especially if it's advice given to a guy. Can't tell you how many times I have read "Divorce her!"

As with any free site, sometimes you get what you pay for. I actually donate (support) to this site because the advice I got was worth the money.

Good luck


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## syhoybenden (Feb 21, 2013)

Hey, chill. You've gone through (going?) a lot. Everything seems amplified.

Understand, this is largely a community of tortured souls propping each other up. Can't help that there'll be conflicting advice at times, but it doesn't, usually, come from a bad place.

Hang in there, and try and cut this place a little slack and maybe, just maybe, some folks here will do likewise.


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## Rubix Cubed (Feb 21, 2016)

@invisibleman
Some of us were rooting for you, but I guess at this point there's been no change in your situation.
I hope it all sorts out to be as benign as possible for you.


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## Slow Hand (Oct 4, 2015)

He got excellent advice from many of the members, he just chose to bend the answers to fit his agenda as @marduk pointed out in the thread and to listen to the "she's cheating crowd".. He was quick to fly off the handle and not listen, there were many members telling him to calm down and there wasn't enough to go on. I wish I could have read the rest of it, lol, now I feel like I missed something. I think I was on page 30.


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

blueinbr said:


> @invisibleman I did not read your story. I don't care if you cheated or she cheated. If you asked for help it's too bad you did not get it.
> 
> Yep, too many are quick here to throw out the "divorce" advice, especially if it's advice given to a guy. Can't tell you how many times I have read "Divorce her!"
> 
> ...


As is the case w/ any other poster, he was given plenty of good advice, along w/ a bit of not-so-great advice. Additionally, by the time that the wheels started to come off, he was advised by many to calm down and look at things from a more rational, reasoned perspective.

Unfortunately, he allowed himself to become an ultra-paranoid, sleep-deprived rage baby and, as a result, very nearly destroyed his marriage.

And that's if you even believe any of it -- as has already been pointed out, the thread had a certain "HurtDude" feel to it.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## sideways (Apr 12, 2016)

Invi, I followed your entire thread while it was going on. I would think any reasonable individual would realize that when asking for advice you're going to receive good as well as bad advice. A CEO, a coach, etc, takes it all in, and then decides what direction they want to go.

You came to the Internet for advice, and from what I saw in your thread you received some EXCELLENT wisdom. We're there some bad suggestions? Yes. However, just like anything else in life, sorting out the good from the bad was up to you and you alone.

A wise man would just ignore the fools advice, but if you were truly in the situation you were in, you'd be EXTREMELY GRATEFUL to the people who were giving you great advice (most of it coming out of their own pain and mistakes). 

To come back to the site, and spew all this venom tells me your situation has gotten worse, or it's still where it was....in a bad place. Nobody on this site put a pistol to your head, and made you say (or do) anything. You are where you are right now by your own doing. 

I sure hope that you find the peace and solitude you're looking for. There were a lot of people on here who again took their time to help help a total stranger, and I hope moving forward, your adult temper tantrum doesn't keep these same people from helping others who will come here seeking advice. 

It's up to you, and you alone, to be able to weed through which is wisdom and which is garbage.


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## G.J. (Nov 4, 2014)

I spoke to Sandra N about that thread and she replied

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KzFQokknfU8


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## pinkroses (Jan 12, 2016)

I am new to this site and have been reading up on a lot of the stories and i can say that this site by far has taught me how most married men think.

First thing i noticed is how the men on here protect each other. I love the way they refer to each other as 'bro' or 'dawg', it's as if they've known each other for years and play golf with each other on the weekends. The bond seems very strong between the males here. They really do rally around each other when one of them is going through a rough patch.
Secondly, this site has taught me that married men really do love their wife. I’m female so naturally most of the relationship forums I’ve joined are predominately female. I’ve read that when a man marries, he does so because he has become of age, status and he’s in a mature place in his life. I never considered that when a man gets married, he is actually also very much in love with the woman he’s getting married to. I understood that he loved her but not the extent that I’ve read on this site.

To see a man break down on here because his wife cheated (or is cheating) on him shocked me to my core. I couldn’t believe it. The statement that men do not fall in love as deeply as women do is nothing but a myth. This site has proven to me beyond any reasonable doubt that men do in fact love their wife and they love them very deeply; with all of their flaws, men truly do care about the woman that they married. This site has also taught me that the most important gift I can give to my husband is my respect and my loyalty.

There is another site I’m a member of. It’s mostly stories about the other woman and how the married man that these women are in an affair with refuse to leave their wife for them. If these other women would come here and spend time reading this section -Coping with Infidelity, these other women will understand why married men rarely leave their wife. (I am not the other woman, the man I was with left me for a married woman).


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## rzmpf (Mar 11, 2016)

Most people told him to gather information and confront calmly and that he should investigate divorce as an option because no one knew how it would play out. Of course you had the "all women are slnts and she is surely cheating so divorce her a$$ asap" faction but you always have them.

No one told him to go crazy, 
no one told him to get drunk and destroy her phone, 
no one told him to accuse her of using the money for hotels when he knew otherwise, 
no one told him that he should accuse her of having an affair with his brother.

Most said that she had poor boundaries and there was no proof of anything physical although it's hard to proof otherwise because of them working and going on trips together. But having a PI follow them for an extended period of time basically excluded that there was something major going on when they were in town (like going to a hotel on lunch break).
Most said that he should see a doctor for his sleeping problems.
Most said that he should remain calm and not freak out.

The fallout at his wife's company was caused by OMW because she reported the alleged affair to HR.

He said in the beginning that he had a happy marriage, that everything was near perfect. Well now it was an already f** up marriage? How come? In fact he was asked numerous times if he has ever been abusive, he said no. In the end many thought otherwise and according to a text from his wife he should now understand why she calls his mother when he is stubborn and that she only puts up with it because she loves him so much. So it's interesting that he now accuses people of being in denial of the reason for their divorce when he himself seemed to be in denial about his own marriage. People here can only work with what they are being told.

Supposing the story was/is true in the first place.


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## G.J. (Nov 4, 2014)

pinkroses said:


> I am new to this site and have been reading up on a lot of the stories and i say that this site by far has taught me how most married men think.
> 
> First thing i noticed is how the men on here protect each other. I love the way they refer to each other as 'bro' or 'dawg', it's as they've known each other for years and play golf with each other on the weekends. The bond seems very strong between the males here. They really do rally around each other when one of them is going through a rough patch.
> Secondly, this site has taught me that married men really do love their wife. I’m female so naturally most of the relationship forums I’ve joined are predominately female. I’ve read that when a man marries, he does so because he has become of age, status and he’s in a mature place in his life. I never considered that when a man gets married, he is actually also very much in love with the woman he’s getting married to. I understood that he loved her but not the extent that I’ve read on this site.
> ...


WOW Sis :wink2:
I've never really thought about that angle that females think men don't love as deep and sometimes as unconditional as men... that's sobering


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## 225985 (Dec 29, 2015)

pinkroses said:


> First thing i noticed is how the men on here protect each other. I love the way they refer to each other as 'bro' or 'dawg', it's as they've known each other for years and play golf with each other on the weekends. The bond seems very strong between the males here. They really do rally around each other when one of them is going through a rough patch.


yes, guys who can relate to a male OP in a similar situation will rally to the OP. But understand, guys in general relate to guys better than they can relate to woman, so the guys post more often if OP is male. 

In my case the men hit me harder than the women, with the women providing more "protection."


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## nursejackie (May 22, 2015)

Invisible- you are standing at the top of a high bridge and staring down at the water below-you ask several people around you what you should do….a few say close your eyes and jump….would you blindly follow their advice just because they gave it to you and then curse them as you drown??

A reasonable person would listen to all the advice given and reflect on their own unique situation and move forward in a way that they feel will best suit their needs. Sometimes you'll hear an "I told you so! and sometimes you'll here a "Not what I would've done- but good on you" Of course we all understand that you were not in a reasonable state-and there is empathy here for that too.

Most advice here comes from the heart. Sometimes the heart has broken and the advice is given through well earned scars.


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## Maxo (Mar 8, 2016)

The story was completely made up,although entertainig. As was said,by the end he got sloppy.


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## jsmart (Mar 14, 2015)

pinkroses said:


> I am new to this site and have been reading up on a lot of the stories and i say that this site by far has taught me how most married men think.
> 
> First thing i noticed is how the men on here protect each other. I love the way they refer to each other as 'bro' or 'dawg', it's as they've known each other for years and play golf with each other on the weekends. The bond seems very strong between the males here. They really do rally around each other when one of them is going through a rough patch.
> Secondly, this site has taught me that married men really do love their wife. I’m female so naturally most of the relationship forums I’ve joined are predominately female. I’ve read that when a man marries, he does so because he has become of age, status and he’s in a mature place in his life. I never considered that when a man gets married, he is actually also very much in love with the woman he’s getting married to. I understood that he loved her but not the extent that I’ve read on this site.
> ...


This is one of the only sites that men are not immediately shut down by moderators for speaking truth. 

I'm always advocating that BHs go to LS's OW section. It really is a window into the mind of a WW. There are a lot of good people there but the moderators are quick to pull post or even ban members if you hurt the delicate sensibilities of these WWs. 

These 2 sites, along with SI, have showed me there really are huge differences between the sexes. On average, men who cheat have no intention of leaving their wife. Despite what he'll say to his affair partner to keep the sex on tap, his wife is plan A and as you've seen on LS, they throw the OW under the bus real fast. Which is because men are logical. They understand if she's willing to cheat on her first husband and father of her kids, how much more is she to do that to her 2nd husband who she doesn't have kids with.

It is the complete opposite for women. Once they start to cheat, the husband is replaced completely by the OM. The majority of the time sex stops for husband, while OM gets porn star sex including act that husband was turned down for years on. These woman start dreaming of running off with OM. They think emotionally and go with the fog they're in. but of course, these guys are not going to leave their wife with their kid to be with a cheating woman and another man's kids.

In the end, the MM, goes back to his BW with new confidence that strongly attract his wife, they actually can have a stronger marriage. The MW on the other hand loses her ability to love her BH and it leads to divorce. MM lives happily ever after with his marriage and family intact, MW ends up a divorcee with kids in a broken home while she trolls Tinder or Match for men of lower sex rank than the husband she betrayed.


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## Maxo (Mar 8, 2016)

G.J. said:


> WOW Sis :wink2:
> I've never really thought about that angle that females think men don't love as deep and sometimes as unconditional as men... that's sobering


Lots of anti-male propoganda and depictions support this proposition. It is untrue,but,like most stereotypes provides a nice,shorthand method of categorizing folks for the intellectually lazy.


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## jsmart (Mar 14, 2015)

You're right @Maxo . The media portray men as players who have no feelings and not capable of being loyal. While women are ALWAYS portrayed as victim regardless of their actions. If she's an adulteress, she was pushed their by the husband. It's in the movies, TV shows, magazines. Even supposedly male oriented magazine's and websites push the feminist line. Advocating for men to "step up" and marry these carousel riders wanting a soft landing.


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## TDSC60 (Dec 8, 2011)

I was reading IMs thread and even responded to a couple of his posts until he said he accused his wife of having an EA with his brother because she was texting him questions about a truck she intended to buy IM. At that point it was clear he was entirely off the rails so I stopped responding.


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## Maxo (Mar 8, 2016)

jsmart said:


> You're right @Maxo . The media portray men as players who have no feelings and not capable of being loyal. While women are ALWAYS portrayed as victim regardless of their actions. If she's an adulteress, she was pushed their by the husband. It's in the movies, TV shows, magazines. Even supposedly male oriented magazine's and websites push the feminist line. Advocating for men to "step up" and marry these carousel riders wanting a soft landing.


Once one starts researching the false propositions set forth by third wave feminists(wage gap,rape culture,patriarchy and domestic violence relative prevalence), it is an eye opener what we are being fed.


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## rzmpf (Mar 11, 2016)

jsmart said:


> You're right @Maxo . The media portray men as players who have no feelings and not capable of being loyal. While women are ALWAYS portrayed as victim regardless of their actions. If she's an adulteress, she was pushed their by the husband. It's in the movies, TV shows, magazines. Even supposedly male oriented magazine's and websites push the feminist line. Advocating for men to "step up" and marry these carousel riders wanting a soft landing.


Media portrayal of both sexes is completely unrealistic and leads to unrealistic expectations on both sides but even more on the female side.
Add a social and legal system that often treats men as second class citizens, no wonder more and more men don't want to be a part of that.


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## dash74 (Jan 3, 2015)

jsmart said:


> "step up" and marry these carousel riders wanting a soft landing.


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## JohnA (Jun 24, 2015)

@invisibleman:

Who hurt you? How and when? 

You say haters I say people who been burned badly and it is their grief and pain that drive their responses. These responses are every bit important for a WS seeking reconcilliation as any other. Why ? Because they are valid raw HUMAN reactions no different then lust or envy. For the WS it is important to know how their BS might react and prepare for it. 

Their response is no different then your's that I liked. So again: who hurt you or are you still playing a role?

Spend sometime reading LosingHim's threads on the effects of cheating on the BS.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

G.J. said:


> WOW Sis :wink2:
> I've never really thought about that angle that females think men don't love as deep and sometimes as unconditional as men... that's sobering


Just because one woman on TAM thinks this, does not mean that all women thing this is true. She does not speak for all, or even most women. She only speaks for herself. Keep that in mind.


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## rzmpf (Mar 11, 2016)

EleGirl said:


> Just because one woman on TAM thinks this, does not mean that all women thing this is true. She does not speak for all, or even most women. She only speaks for herself. Keep that in mind.


It would be highly improbable that she is the only woman out there that thinks/thought that way. So even if it's a tiny percentage of western socialized women out there who thinks like that, it's quite a number. Recognizing that such a worldview (still) exists is quite an eyeopener.


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## TX-SC (Aug 25, 2015)

There are only two possibilities here:

1) IM is a troll and his entire post was fake. 

Or... 

2) IM is an extremely volatile man with no control over his own actions. He can't have a reasonable conversation without dropping the F bomb every other word and he is prone to emotional outbursts at home resulting in lots of stuff getting broken. 

I'm not sure which is correct, but both are sad.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

I preferred it when you were really, _really_ invisible...

You need some serious professional help.

Anger management as a starting point.


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## alphaomega (Nov 7, 2010)

I don't think it was a troll. Just a guy that let his hamster wheel get the best of him to react a bit to emotionally. Understandably, considering how he burned the bearings off the wheel in three short days. 

Invisible, if your reading this, then still please take time to calm down. Like I said, this stuff takes months to sort out, not days. Keep calm. And breath.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## The Middleman (Apr 30, 2012)

TX-SC said:


> There are only two possibilities here:
> 
> 1) IM is a troll and his entire post was fake.
> 
> ...


I'm going with number 1.


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## sidney2718 (Nov 2, 2013)

TX-SC said:


> There are only two possibilities here:
> 
> 1) IM is a troll and his entire post was fake.
> 
> ...


If number 2 is correct we have to add that he must be a very very difficult man to live with. Breaking stuff is violence and an obvious threat to a wife.


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## Maxo (Mar 8, 2016)

sidney2718 said:


> If number 2 is correct we have to add that he must be a very very difficult man to live with. Breaking stuff is violence and an obvious threat to a wife.


Sounded like his wife was no barrel of monkeys,as well? Didn't she actually fling some papers at him? Talk about violent...
.


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

EleGirl said:


> Just because one woman on TAM thinks this, does not mean that all women thing this is true. She does not speak for all, or even most women. She only speaks for herself. Keep that in mind.


That cold wind again.

I need to move farther South.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

SunCMars said:


> That cold wind again.
> 
> I need to move farther South.


What do you mean by cold wind?


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## always_alone (Dec 11, 2012)

jsmart said:


> These 2 sites, along with SI, have showed me there really are huge differences between the sexes. On average, men who cheat have no intention of leaving their wife. Despite what he'll say to his affair partner to keep the sex on tap, his wife is plan A and as you've seen on LS, they throw the OW under the bus real fast. Which is because men are logical. They understand if she's willing to cheat on her first husband and father of her kids, how much more is she to do that to her 2nd husband who she doesn't have kids with.
> 
> It is the complete opposite for women. Once they start to cheat, the husband is replaced completely by the OM. The majority of the time sex stops for husband, while OM gets porn star sex including act that husband was turned down for years on. These woman start dreaming of running off with OM. They think emotionally and go with the fog they're in. but of course, these guys are not going to leave their wife with their kid to be with a cheating woman and another man's kids.
> 
> In the end, the MM, goes back to his BW with new confidence that strongly attract his wife, they actually can have a stronger marriage. The MW on the other hand loses her ability to love her BH and it leads to divorce. MM lives happily ever after with his marriage and family intact, MW ends up a divorcee with kids in a broken home while she trolls Tinder or Match for men of lower sex rank than the husband she betrayed.



Of course, another read on this situation is that WM is simply cake-eating, and just wants to make sure the wife is tending the homestead while he finds himself some hotties to have sex play with. So yes, he throws OW under the bus and then picks up another later. Until eventually BW gets tired of it and leaves him, and he spends the rest of his days on Tindr looking for women who are desperate enough to want him.

But WW, on the other hand, is checked out of marriage and looking for a full replacement. Not just nookie on the side. So she leaves BH and finds an OM to settle down with.


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## jsmart (Mar 14, 2015)

always_alone said:


> Of course, another read on this situation is that WM is simply cake-eating, and just wants to make sure the wife is tending the homestead while he finds himself some hotties to have sex play with. So yes, he throws OW under the bus and then picks up another later. *Until eventually BW gets tired of it and leaves him, and he spends the rest of his days on Tindr looking for women who are desperate enough to want him*.
> 
> But WW, on the other hand, is checked out of marriage and looking for a full replacement. Not just nookie on the side. *So she leaves BH and finds an OM to settle down with*.


Some of the serial cheaters will do that but most cheaters are just opportunist. Most women will not allow themselves to be some guys side piece so it's not to easy to replicate. What seems to be VERY common is a boss or mgr that abuses his position of authority to take advantage of many women's desire to submit to a powerful man. These types of men, can have access to many women over the years.

A serial WH trolling Tindr? Please, guys that can convince a woman to be a side piece will not need to resort to such measures. You also have to remember that women and men are different. Women want the desirable man. If he's a player/bad boy, that just makes him more desirable. Men are the complete opposite. The good time sally is for ONS and STR's only.

The WWs that end up being divorcees with kids are in for a tough row, which will include lying about a big part of her past. No quality man will want to marry a woman that cheated on her husband and father of her kids. He'll definitely "date" her but invest in her, be there for her & her brood, only thirsty betas that are usually older and lower sex rank than the husband she betrayed would take that risk.


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

@EleGirl 

I assume that you think most men [not all;-} have deep feelings and are not cold calculating fish. If so, the below applies to you.
___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

Ahhhh OOOO Gah...Error, error!

Not you...not you.. You be temperate for moi....balm..y for others

Knot me up for being obtuse.

I am not Droll, nor Troll, am here on TAM giving sideways responses to banged up posters.

And yea, I tick a few off, and the others...I hope to [as do good Primate Groomer Buddies].....off-tick them.

So sorry >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> !

I hope I gave @invisibleman a smile, where none had before. More than likely it was the standard WTF. Those three letters have self-stitched in my minds-eye; an imprint from my yet..short stay on Earth.


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## Marduk (Jul 16, 2010)

Can someone clue me in?

Sheesh, I take a weekend off TAM and I miss the season finale cliffhanger, only to find out that it got deleted.


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## rzmpf (Mar 11, 2016)

marduk said:


> Can someone clue me in?
> 
> Sheesh, I take a weekend off TAM and I miss the season finale cliffhanger, only to find out that it got deleted.


What was the last thing you read?


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## Marduk (Jul 16, 2010)

rzmpf said:


> What was the last thing you read?


Last thing I remember was a bunch of us like Far telling him to chill and questioning his level of anger given what actually happened. Plus his mom getting involved to protect his wife.

Probably last thing I read was from fri afternoon.


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## rzmpf (Mar 11, 2016)

marduk said:


> Last thing I remember was a bunch of us like Far telling him to chill and questioning his level of anger given what actually happened. Plus his mom getting involved to protect his wife.
> 
> Probably last thing I read was from fri afternoon.


She went to his mom's house, kids were left at home. Next night (i believe) she returned to see after the kids with MIL and all stayed at the family home for the night. 

Next day, because OMW had gotten HR involved, they called the wife that there was an investigation, OP already had an IC appointment (which many found odd), skipped that to accompany his wife to her company (there were some timing issues as to when what happened which made more people suspicious) and there they sat for hours watching other people getting called into rooms to report, he didn't talk to his wife or she to him so he basically had no clue what was really going on. 

Then his wife was "interrogated" and the alleged OM appeared. Meanwhile he went home to the children and returned later. Still no information. Then it appeared that his wife fired a bunch of people and OM was also let go. OP then made some statements that his marriage may not have been so perfect as he thought and that was the end of it.

No more updates and more speculation about him being a troll and subsequent deletion of the thread by whomever.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

SunCMars said:


> @EleGirl
> 
> I assume that you think most men [not all;-} have deep feelings and are not cold calculating fish. If so, the below applies to you.
> ___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
> ...


Are you posting drunk or high? Your posts don't even make any sense at all.

I'm afraid many people do find logic a bit too cold for their liking.


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## michzz (Jun 6, 2008)

Gender generalizations "always" have holes in them. But there are enough patterns that convince each gender of a truth.

For example, I think women have more opportunities to cheat since all they have to do is crook their finger and there is at least one or two men a day that will be interested.

Note: I didn't say that they wee interesting in some way to the lady, just that their options are many. A typical man cannot crook his finger and get women to be interested on anything near that frequency.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

michzz said:


> Gender generalizations "always" have holes in them. But there are enough patterns that convince each gender of a truth.
> 
> For example, I think women have more opportunities to cheat since all they have to do is crook their finger and there is at least one or two men a day that will be interested.
> 
> Note: I didn't say that they wee interesting in some way to the lady, just that their options are many. A typical man cannot crook his finger and get women to be interested on anything near that frequency.


Yet men cheat more often than women do.


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## Marduk (Jul 16, 2010)

EleGirl said:


> Yet men cheat more often than women do.


Given the high drive for both genders to lie about it, plus the added social dimension of previous generations of women having "nice girl" garbage imposed on them during their formative years, and the fact that both sexes report having done it within a standard deviation of each other...

I'd say it's pretty much the same, within a reasonable margin of error.


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## syhoybenden (Feb 21, 2013)

Invisibleman reappeared to say that he had deleted his own thread and then proceeded to dump on TAM for inciting him to rash and ill reasoned behaviours. He might be a troll, sure, but my feel is that he's a poor sap totally overwhelmed by forces beyond his understanding and control. I think he's just lashing out because he's in pain and has no idea where to go from here.


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## Maxo (Mar 8, 2016)

jsmart said:


> Some of the serial cheaters will do that but most cheaters are just opportunist. Most women will not allow themselves to be some guys side piece so it's not to easy to replicate. What seems to be VERY common is a boss or mgr that abuses his position of authority to take advantage of many women's desire to submit to a powerful man. These types of men, can have access to many women over the years.
> 
> A serial WH trolling Tindr? Please, guys that can convince a woman to be a side piece will not need to resort to such measures. You also have to remember that women and men are different. Women want the desirable man. If he's a player/bad boy, that just makes him more desirable. Men are the complete opposite. The good time sally is for ONS and STR's only.
> 
> The WWs that end up being divorcees with kids are in for a tough row, which will include lying about a big part of her past. No quality man will want to marry a woman that cheated on her husband and father of her kids. He'll definitely "date" her but invest in her, be there for her & her brood, only thirsty betas that are usually older and lower sex rank than the husband she betrayed would take that risk.



While I agree with some of this,it neglects the fact that past late thirties,the woman's sex drive and.capability often surpasses the man'with his dwidling testesterone levels and incipient ED.
THUS,the recent cougar phenomenon with older,more sexually capable women seeking sex with younger,more capable men.
So,it seems to me that more and more we are seeing the true nature of the female sex drive,with its capacity for multiple sessions sans recovery time and multiple orgasms.
Older men may find mates,but if they go younger or even the same age,they may,absent good genetics,find themselves overmatched sexually.


----------



## Maxo (Mar 8, 2016)

EleGirl said:


> Yet men cheat more often than women do.


I read that in the 25-45 demographic. Women cheat more frequently than men and the overall cheating rate remais higher for men because women past 65 or so do not cheat as much.
With Viagra etc. Older folks are now cheating more frequently but hypergamy seems to give older men an advantage in landing yonger women because older women have lost much of their physical attractiveness whereas old fat rich powerful guys remain as targets to younger status and money seeking females.
Older women ,past the cougar age may have difficulty arousing men due to the focus on visual attractiveness whereas a fat wallet etc.can still excite awoman even if the guy is toadlike.


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

EleGirl said:


> michzz said:
> 
> 
> > Gender generalizations "always" have holes in them. But there are enough patterns that convince each gender of a truth.
> ...


Of all those I know of personally that committed adultry. 8 WW, 3WH. Cheating wives hold the lead by wide margin.


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## jsmart (Mar 14, 2015)

Maxo said:


> While I agree with some of this,it neglects the fact that *past late thirties,the woman's sex drive and.capability often surpasses the man'with his dwidling testesterone levels and incipient ED.*
> THUS,the *recent cougar phenomenon with older,more sexually capable women seeking sex with younger,more capable men.*
> So,it seems to me that more and more we are seeing the true nature of the female sex drive,with its capacity for multiple sessions sans recovery time and multiple orgasms.
> Older men may find mates,but if they go younger or even the same age,they may,absent good genetics,find themselves overmatched sexually.


Maxo baby. You've been bamboozled. The whole cougar thing is so blown out of proportion to it's actual size. Not saying there not some truth to it but Hollywierd, including the porn industry is pushing an agenda. The cougar agenda is part and parcel of the glamorization of divorce, or should I say frivorce. (divorce for frivolous reasons) and the push to destroy the family.

As for women having a higher sex drive as they get older, that too is part of the cougar lie. Yes, there's a spike in early 30s but if believed the tell-a-vsion or the mainstream magazines you would think women in their 40s are sex bunnies. Why would nature spike a woman's sex drive when she's approaching infertility. Not buying it.

Going by the commercials for Viagra and other drugs, you'd think most men in their 40s can't have an erection or meet their wives needs. The complete lopsidedness of post from high drive partners complaining about their low drive partners being overwhelmingly men wanting more. Tells me that too is not reality.

Both sexes can find a partner if they make themselves desirable. Doesn't matter the age or sex but you must not confuse being able to get a sex partner and being able to have a loving relationship where you're loved and both partners are there through the tough times not just the good.


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## Herschel (Mar 27, 2016)

Women are just better liars. Men may cheat more for the physical aspect of it, and while they can lie, they tend to cave easier, maybe out of guilt or something.

Women heat more for the emotional aspect of it. They lie because they are married to an ahole who doesn't treat them right. He doesn't deserve to know the truth cause eff him.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## happy as a clam (Jan 5, 2014)

SunCMars said:


> @EleGirl
> 
> I assume that you think most men [not all;-} have deep feelings and are not cold calculating fish. If so, the below applies to you.
> ___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
> ...


WTH?

Care to translate, SunC? 'Cause that really didn't make much sense, at least to me anyway.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## G.J. (Nov 4, 2014)

The ganja is strong in this one


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

EleGirl said:


> Are you posting drunk or high? Your posts don't even make any sense at all.
> 
> I'm afraid many people do find logic a bit too cold for their liking.


My rat-a-tat is resting for now. No, I am a near-TeeToller, no drugs, save Ibuprofin for carpal tunnel from typing so fast. 

Never bait a Martian! Nor date!


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Divinely Favored said:


> Of all those I know of personally that committed adultry. 8 WW, 3WH. Cheating wives hold the lead by wide margin.


Of those I know closely, 23 men have committed adultery; 2 women have.

The numbers seem to depend on who we know. That's why blind studies that ask the question of hundreds , or thousands, of people from mixed backgrounds are much more reliable than antidotal stories.


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## becareful (Jan 28, 2016)

It is my belief that when men lead by example, women will follow. I don't mean anything sexist by that, but if more men stepped up and be faithful husbands of integrity who love their wives and are there for them, it would give their wife one less reason to stray. Not blame shifting, but it takes two to make a marriage work. The husband can't neglect his wife emotionally due to work or whatever, and expect his wife to not look elsewhere to have her needs met. Sadly there are way too many men in society today who choose to drift along rather than lead by example.

Finally, men need to recalibrate their wife pickers. It kind of baffles me that many men pick their women to marry based on personality, looks, etc., only to later on realize they should have put faithfulness and morals at the top of that list. There are men who would take back a cheating gf or fiance, and wonder why they stray later on in the marriage. Not everyone who cheats will cheat again, but why take the risk? Why compromise on integrity?


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## Maxo (Mar 8, 2016)

jsmart said:


> Maxo baby. You've been bamboozled. The whole cougar thing is so blown out of proportion to it's actual size. Not saying there not some truth to it but Hollywierd, including the porn industry is pushing an agenda. The cougar agenda is part and parcel of the glamorization of divorce, or should I say frivorce. (divorce for frivolous reasons) and the push to destroy the family.
> 
> As for women having a higher sex drive as they get older, that too is part of the cougar lie. Yes, there's a spike in early 30s but if believed the tell-a-vsion or the mainstream magazines you would think women in their 40s are sex bunnies. Why would nature spike a woman's sex drive when she's approaching infertility. Not buying it.
> 
> ...


No,I get it,the hype and all. But,my real point is that for some strange reason,perhaps feeling threatened,many men refuse to recognize that a lot of women have voracious sex drives,
You can see it in the posts about infidelty,where men and women cling to this notion that women cheat,primarily,for emotional needs meeting purposes vs men ,mainly for sex.
I realize this is anecdotal,but whenI was younger,but before I made much money,I was in really good physical shape due to my athletic career in school. The same was true of my teamates.
All of us were,routinely,propositioned to have sex by married and single women. None of us had any emotional connection to these women at all. Those that partook,my self excluded,told me that the women just wanted sex and had no interest in an emotional connection.
At that point in our young lives ,like most guys that age.maybe even moreso due to conditioning,we all had a much greater capacity for sex,quantitatively.
Even way back then,the cougar deal was going on,although not publicized by porn and women's magazines.
The truth is that men are losing testosterone at somewhere about 1-2 percent a year after age 25 or so.
Women's estrogen levels are also depleting,resulting in a higher testosterone to estrogen ratio as they age,up to a point.
With testosterone as the driving agent in sexual desire and it overpowering the lower estrogen levels( the testosterone does not increase but the ratio changes as it relates to estrogen), the women' sex drive overtakes and surpasses the men's at some point.
It does make some sense from an evolutionary standpoint,as in the hunter gatherer days,many men were killed young,and the women,who were on the homefront subjected to lower risks( other than childbirth,which was a significant risk) ,would still have some potential mates for procreation if they matched up,drivewise,with the youner,surviving males.
Men in their 30's and 40's are said to be experiencing ED at higher rates than inthe past. Our diets contribute both due to additives that destroy testosterone and our obesity( look at group photos of men from 70 years ago and now. The difference in obesity is remarkable.)
So,( sorry this was long) ,my conclusion is that many women are much higher drive than they let on,not disclosing due to societal disapproval. They cheat every bit as much,if not more,for sex as men do. Society is threatened by this for some reason.
So,althoughhypergamy does play a role in a cheating man's prospects of finding a mate vs a cheating woman,I think there are a fair number of both genders that simply want to get laid and to experience variety.
I am thinking about this off the top of my head and I am sure there may be some holes in my theory.


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

Maxo said:


> While I agree with some of this,it neglects the fact that past late thirties,the woman's sex drive and.capability often surpasses the man'with his dwidling testesterone levels and incipient ED.
> THUS,the recent cougar phenomenon with older,more sexually capable women seeking sex with younger,more capable men.
> So,it seems to me that more and more we are seeing the true nature of the female sex drive,with its capacity for multiple sessions sans recovery time and multiple orgasms.
> Older men may find mates,but if they go younger or even the same age,they may,absent good genetics,find themselves overmatched sexually.


Perfectly stated.

Men have more moving parts. More can go wrong and does. 

The failure of the male sexual system is rarely a systemic issue. No, it is one part of the perfect pounding storm that takes a holiday or fails to cooperate. As a result of one wayward domino, the cannon fails to launch its projectile.

The intended climax got picked off at second or third base. Remember, the shortstop plays for the other team. Your happiness is not his concern. 

You need a strong bat and well placed balls to hit a home-run into the center-fold bleachers. 

Mother Nature and Father Untimely ration the good equipment and give it to the young bulls. The equipment is time-stamped, a product of planned obsolescence.

Makes perfect sense to me. Allowing a grey haired grandpa to be a "Daddy" would be a frail limb on Mankind's Family Tree. The limb would soon die, dropping the child onto an unforgiving forest floor.

That...does not compute.


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## always_alone (Dec 11, 2012)

jsmart said:


> A serial WH trolling Tindr? Please, guys that can convince a woman to be a side piece will not need to resort to such measures. You also have to remember that women and men are different. Women want the desirable man. If he's a player/bad boy, that just makes him more desirable. Men are the complete opposite. The good time sally is for ONS and STR's only.
> 
> The WWs that end up being divorcees with kids are in for a tough row, which will include lying about a big part of her past. No quality man will want to marry a woman that cheated on her husband and father of her kids. He'll definitely "date" her but invest in her, be there for her & her brood, only thirsty betas that are usually older and lower sex rank than the husband she betrayed would take that risk.


Errrr, what are you trying to prove here? Reality is that a lot of guys cheat with prostitutes, and so they are paying dearly for their "piece on the side". They are also big users of all sorts of apps for cheating purposes. Think AM, Tindr, you name it.

And no quality woman wants a dumped cheater, who is known to step out, who never appreciated what he had at home. So when they get dumped by their BWs, they will have to find some desperate woman who is lonely enough and has low enough self esteem to take the risk.


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## always_alone (Dec 11, 2012)

michzz said:


> Gender generalizations "always" have holes in them. But there are enough patterns that convince each gender of a truth.
> 
> For example, I think women have more opportunities to cheat since all they have to do is crook their finger and there is at least one or two men a day that will be interested.
> 
> Note: I didn't say that they wee interesting in some way to the lady, just that their options are many. A typical man cannot crook his finger and get women to be interested on anything near that frequency.


Seriously? You clearly do not know what it's like to be a woman. Or you have an incredibly low opinion of men.

Or maybe both?


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## michzz (Jun 6, 2008)

michzz said:


> Gender generalizations "always" have holes in them. But there are enough patterns that convince each gender of a truth.
> 
> For example, I think women have more opportunities to cheat since all they have to do is crook their finger and there is at least one or two men a day that will be interested.
> 
> Note: I didn't say that they wee interesting in some way to the lady, just that their options are many. A typical man cannot crook his finger and get women to be interested on anything near that frequency.





always_alone said:


> Seriously? You clearly do not know what it's like to be a woman. Or you have an incredibly low opinion of men.
> 
> Or maybe both?


I don't think you understood my comment.


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## jsmart (Mar 14, 2015)

always_alone said:


> Errrr, what are you trying to prove here? *Reality is that a lot of guys cheat with prostitutes, and so they are paying dearly for their "piece on the side".* They are also big users of all sorts of apps for cheating purposes. Think AM, Tindr, you name it.
> 
> And *no quality woman wants a dumped cheater, who is known to step out, who never appreciated what he had at home*. So when they get dumped by their BWs, they will have to find some desperate woman who is lonely enough and has low enough self esteem to take the risk.


All cheaters are scvm. A guy that has to use a prostitute is not a catch. But are you honestly telling me that a guy that can convince a woman to give herself knowing he's married doesn't have game or isn't the type that can attract women? 

I've seen with my eyes and read countless time of women going for the player/bad boy types. Not just young 20 somethings. I'm talking middle aged married mothers leaving good men as well as older divorcees continually ending up with guys that everyone around them can see are trouble. The decent guys pursuing these women get friend zoned.


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## wmn1 (Aug 27, 2014)

Maxo said:


> The story was completely made up,although entertainig. As was said,by the end he got sloppy.


My question is if this is truly Invisibleman who went on this rage post a page back, then why is his total number of posts listed at 1 ? 

Is this guy who freaked out on the prior page an imposter too ?


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## wmn1 (Aug 27, 2014)

michzz said:


> I don't think you understood my comment.


yes always_alone jumped to a conclusion. 

I really don't agree with her assessment of men and prostitutes either


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## wmn1 (Aug 27, 2014)

EleGirl said:


> Yet men cheat more often than women do.


stats are showing that women are closing this gap very quickly


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## wmn1 (Aug 27, 2014)

michzz said:


> Gender generalizations "always" have holes in them. But there are enough patterns that convince each gender of a truth.
> 
> For example, I think women have more opportunities to cheat since all they have to do is crook their finger and there is at least one or two men a day that will be interested.
> 
> Note: I didn't say that they wee interesting in some way to the lady, just that their options are many. A typical man cannot crook his finger and get women to be interested on anything near that frequency.


I agree with you here


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## Herschel (Mar 27, 2016)

wmn1 said:


> My question is if this is truly Invisibleman who went on this rage post a page back, then why is his total number of posts listed at 1 ?
> 
> Is this guy who freaked out on the prior page an imposter too ?


The NCAA vacated his posts when the thread was deleted.


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## phillybeffandswiss (Jan 20, 2013)

jsmart said:


> These 2 sites, along with SI, have showed me there really are huge differences between the sexes. On average, men who cheat have no intention of leaving their wife. Despite what he'll say to his affair partner to keep the sex on tap, his wife is plan A and as you've seen on LS, they throw the OW under the bus real fast. Which is because men are logical. They understand if she's willing to cheat on her first husband and father of her kids, how much more is she to do that to her 2nd husband who she doesn't have kids with.
> 
> It is the complete opposite for women. Once they start to cheat, the husband is replaced completely by the OM. The majority of the time sex stops for husband, while OM gets porn star sex including act that husband was turned down for years on. These woman start dreaming of running off with OM. They think emotionally and go with the fog they're in. but of course, these guys are not going to leave their wife with their kid to be with a cheating woman and another man's kids.
> 
> In the end, the MM, goes back to his BW with new confidence that strongly attract his wife, they actually can have a stronger marriage. The MW on the other hand loses her ability to love her BH and it leads to divorce. MM lives happily ever after with his marriage and family intact, MW ends up a divorcee with kids in a broken home while she trolls Tinder or Match for men of lower sex rank than the husband she betrayed.


You know what's funny this is a really good post, but I learned the complete opposite. I've found men and women keep up appearances they are different, but at the end of the day men are just as emotional and women are just as horny as we claim about the other gender. I believe we have been so conditioned to see the differences, we ignore the ever present similarities.


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## jorgegene (May 26, 2012)

pinkroses said:


> I am new to this site and have been reading up on a lot of the stories and i can say that this site by far has taught me how most married men think.
> 
> First thing i noticed is how the men on here protect each other. I love the way they refer to each other as 'bro' or 'dawg', it's as if they've known each other for years and play golf with each other on the weekends. The bond seems very strong between the males here. They really do rally around each other when one of them is going through a rough patch.
> Secondly, this site has taught me that married men really do love their wife. I’m female so naturally most of the relationship forums I’ve joined are predominately female. I’ve read that when a man marries, he does so because he has become of age, status and he’s in a mature place in his life. I never considered that when a man gets married, he is actually also very much in love with the woman he’s getting married to. I understood that he loved her but not the extent that I’ve read on this site.
> ...


very wonderful, thoughtful post.

i think you're right that generally speaking men love their wives very much. more than commonly thought or credited for. but men do have problems expressing that love and fall victim to complacency, and or focusing on the wrong priorities. that does invite problems, although i am in no way making excuses for cheating.

i'ts when a crisis occurs, like infidelity, or ILYIJNILWY, or a wife wanting to leave that kicks them back into reality and they realize just how much they do love and care.


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## Maxo (Mar 8, 2016)

phillybeffandswiss said:


> You know what's funny this is a really good post, but I learned the complete opposite. I've found men and women keep up appearances they are different, but at the end of the day men are just as emotional and women are just as horny as we claim about the other gender. I believe we have been so conditioned to see the differences, we ignore the ever present similarities.


This is right, IMO.


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## Maxo (Mar 8, 2016)

jorgegene said:


> very wonderful, thoughtful post.
> 
> i think you're right that generally speaking men love their wives very much. more than commonly thought or credited for. but men do have problems expressing that love and fall victim to complacency, and or focusing on the wrong priorities. that does invite problems, although i am in no way making excuses for cheating.
> 
> i'ts when a crisis occurs, like infidelity, or ILYIJNILWY, or a wife wanting to leave that kicks them back into reality and they realize just how much they do love and care.


I do not feel men have anymore difficulty expressing love than women do. In fact, I think thy may do a better job many times. Poets, philosophers, authors, artists etc, all have high % of men among them. Men are very effective communicators and very much in touch with their emotions for the most part.


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## jorgegene (May 26, 2012)

Maxo said:


> I do not feel men have anymore difficulty expressing love than women do. In fact, I think thy may do a better job many times. Poets, philosophers, authors, artists etc, all have high % of men among them. Men are very effective communicators and very much in touch with their emotions for the most part.


yes indeed, but those you refer to are expressions of love in the abstract, not the everyday, day in day-out expressions of love that are needed to maintain the passion. this is where a lot of men (certainly not all, but most?) have problems. we can be great and passionate pursuers and then........?

and by the way, i'm not sure women are any better at it. i not speaking from speak from their point of view.


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## ReformedHubby (Jan 9, 2013)

phillybeffandswiss said:


> You know what's funny this is a really good post, but I learned the complete opposite. I've found men and women keep up appearances they are different, but at the end of the day men are just as emotional and women are just as horny as we claim about the other gender. I believe we have been so conditioned to see the differences, we ignore the ever present similarities.


Well said, just because men care a lot about sex it doesn't mean we aren't emotional. Its no secret that I'm a serial wayward. Being honest my biggest fear is screwing things up so bad that I end up living out the rest of my days without companionship and dying alone. Its difficult to find something real, and there is nothing glamorous about being a "playboy" as you cross from your fifties into your sixties. I run in a circle of guys that have promoted mistresses to wife 2.0 or even 3.0, and all of them say they'd give anything to have their first wife back.


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## Maxo (Mar 8, 2016)

Life gets in the way for both genders, as does the novelty wearing off. But, this applies to both and, if folks get realistic re expectations vs pining for the Harlequin Romance unreality, they can see that love is expressed in many ways other than that which is done during courtship.
The ability to express love , abstractly, dose translate, IMO, to the ability to express it while in a relationship. But, with kids, bills, jobs etc. people only have so much energy. 
Again, I agree with you that neither gender seems to have a greater ability in this area. Men may have a slight edge, as, typically, they are a little more in touch with their feelings than women, but it is not that much, IMO.


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## TX-SC (Aug 25, 2015)

What a very philosophical group we have here! It's interesting to read all of this. I'm firmly in the belief that both sexes have the same general reason for cheating: THEY WANT TO! I do not want to cheat, so I keep my boundaries intact. My wife is the same. I don't buy the "It just sort of happened!" argument. There are just too many opportunities to say no.


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## rzmpf (Mar 11, 2016)

TX-SC said:


> I don't buy the "It just sort of happened!" argument.


Because it's basically a nonargument. Nothing just happens, everything has reasons, action, reaction etc.

People rationalize behaviour, lower their boundaries, let their emotions take over when the rational mind screams stop, they compartimentalize, lower inhibitions through alcohol, deny, lie and whatever else people do to validate their actions. But after all these actions it "just happened"?

It's always a process that could be stopped. But it isn't because they choose not to stop while making all these little steps (or a big one).

"I let it happen", "I did everything to make it happen" or "I made it happen" would be the correct "excuses". "It just happened" is just a cop out to avoid responsibility.


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## always_alone (Dec 11, 2012)

wmn1 said:


> yes always_alone jumped to a conclusion.
> 
> I really don't agree with her assessment of men and prostitutes either


From where I sit, neither you nor michzz understood my comment. As a woman, I cannot crook my finger and have men interested in me. 

Now maybe you will conclude from this that I am significantly more repulsive than the average, and that is certainly possible.

But do know that I am not the only woman to say such things.

(Oh, and well, *someone* is keeping those prostitutes in business. And there are an awful lot of them just about everywhere in the world you go.)


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

always_alone said:


> From where I sit, neither you nor michzz understood my comment. As a woman, I cannot crook my finger and have men interested in me.
> 
> Now maybe you will conclude from this that I am significantly more repulsive than the average, and that is certainly possible.
> 
> ...


Well, maybe you could and just do not realise it? 

There have been three occasions when women have been throwing themselves at my feet and I was blissfully unaware of it. 

Though my wife warned me, but I was too insecure to be aware of it.

The first time actually resulted in my stupid, drunken RA. The other two subsequent occasions I took my wife's warning to heart and luckily didn't get into trouble!


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## michzz (Jun 6, 2008)

always_alone said:


> From where I sit, neither you nor michzz understood my comment. As a woman, I cannot crook my finger and have men interested in me.
> 
> Now maybe you will conclude from this that I am significantly more repulsive than the average, and that is certainly possible.
> 
> ...


The context of my comments is that each gender gets convinced of some "truth". I pointed out a very common one for men to believe--which I still believe to be true.

There are other "truths" that many women believe about infidelity that I do not.

You refuting my belief, is why I decided you didn't understand my comment.


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## wmn1 (Aug 27, 2014)

always_alone said:


> From where I sit, neither you nor michzz understood my comment. As a woman, I cannot crook my finger and have men interested in me.
> 
> Now maybe you will conclude from this that I am significantly more repulsive than the average, and that is certainly possible.
> 
> ...


In my experience, you are very, very wrong. 

Regarding my conclusions, I have made none. For all I know, you look like Jennifer Lawrence. 

Last week, I was in a bar in Roanoke, Virginia. Lucky to get a table by the door because the place was packed. Had a good view of the bar and restaurant area. 80% of the women who walked in when I was paying attention got looks, a lot of them. Then I had two guys walk in, one looked like Luke Bryan. I said to my wife, 'watch, this guy is not going to get any looks'. I've had this same argument before with her so I tried to prove a point. He got one or two among some 40 women in the bar.

I have seen this experience over and over again.

My wife gets hit on and gets more looks than I do all the time. And I am not a bad looking guy. 

Guys are dogs, women care about the emotional. Not always but normally. Can't judge emotional by looking at someone walking through the door, can you Always_Alone ?

Oh BTW, my wife agreed with me


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## Marduk (Jul 16, 2010)

wmn1 said:


> In my experience, you are very, very wrong.
> 
> Regarding my conclusions, I have made none. For all I know, you look like Jennifer Lawrence.
> 
> ...


I used to think that.

And then I worked out, started dressing good, got some promotions at work and got hit on so much that I had to start paring it all back.

I know a guy who's an ex model. A friend of a friend. He's so good looking that women will literally line up to talk to him. He's married, has kids, and literally the girls will form a line next to him just to be near him.

It's very odd to see it. I've never had that happen.

I think everybody has cognitive biases. Everybody sees it as hard to attract attention, but what it really is being is hard to attract attention from those you want. Who are busy getting attention from people like you, but not from the guys they want.

So everybody sees themselves as hard done by and nobody's happy about everything. Except the other gender has it easier.

What does this guy complain about? Not being able to sit on a barstool next to his wife without getting interrupted every 5 minutes.


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## wmn1 (Aug 27, 2014)

marduk said:


> I used to think that.
> 
> And then I worked out, started dressing good, got some promotions at work and got hit on so much that I had to start paring it all back.
> 
> ...


you know Marduk, it's funny. There's another theory. It is almost like women can sniff out things. When I was single, could never get hit on. When married or committed, they were lining up.

Sometimes I think they know. Do they ? No but it just seems to work out that way. Odd but thanks for sharing your story


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## Rubix Cubed (Feb 21, 2016)

wmn1 said:


> you know Marduk, it's funny. There's another theory. It is almost like women can sniff out things. When I was single, could never get hit on. When married or committed, they were lining up.
> 
> Sometimes I think they know. Do they ? No but it just seems to work out that way. Odd but thanks for sharing your story


 I expect that has a lot more to do with how you carry yourself and the lack of desperation.


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## Thor (Oct 31, 2011)

If we looked at the middle 50% of the population in terms of looks, money, and self confidence, women have an enormously easier time finding a casual sex partner.

One of these Average Joe men walks into a busy bar on a weekend night. Also an Average Jane walks in. Average Jane could walk up to almost any man in there and have him leaving with her for sex in the parking lot in under a minute. But the Average Joe probably would not find a woman to go out for sex in the parking lot even after the whole evening of working over every woman he could.

Absolutely there are ex-model men, the professional athlete, or a guy who arrives in a $100k super car who will get tons of attention from many women. But they are the exception.


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## Slow Hand (Oct 4, 2015)

wmn1 said:


> you know Marduk, it's funny. There's another theory. It is almost like women can sniff out things. When I was single, could never get hit on. When married or committed, they were lining up.
> 
> Sometimes I think they know. Do they ? No but it just seems to work out that way. Odd but thanks for sharing your story


I think the truth is, a man becomes more desirable when a woman knows he's taken, the reasons are many, I'm sure, but, I've seen it too. I think there are even studies on this, but I'll post some snips from articles instead.




> Why Women Are More Attracted To Men Who Are Taken
> 
> Reason one suggests that men who have already been “chosen” must have been chosen for good reason. A woman’s logic might say, “If the guy is good enough for her and she's not more awesome than I am, then the guy is likely to be good enough for me, as well.”
> 
> ...





> Why Taken Guys Seem Sexier
> Are women man-stealers at heart? Cosmo gets to the bottom of why women are attracted to unavailable guys.
> 
> According to a new study, this phenomenon isn't limited to our Hollywood crushes. After asking single women to describe the characteristics of their ideal man, researchers at Oklahoma State University showed them a picture of a guy who was their "perfect match" and asked if they would date him. When the women were told that their perfect match was single, 59 percent of them said they'd go out with him. When they were told he had a girlfriend, 90 percent said they would. The conclusion: Merely knowing that a guy is spoken for makes
> him more appealing. Given that this freaky news is bound to set off major alarms (are all women man-stealers at heart?!), we decided to dig deeper to find out what's really behind this taboo attraction.


This one talks of single women, I believe we can include married women as well. :frown2:



> Why Do Single Women Like Taken Men?
> 
> Here’s the scenario: You've been single for a while and no matter how you try to woo the ladies, your suave pickup lines and quips bear no fruit. Then, one evening when your dignity has all but bottomed out, you make nice with a jaw-dropper and soon find yourself in a new relationship. Things progress beautifully, and as they do, you notice that you’re getting an abnormally high number of bicep-squeezes, do-me eyes and knee-slapping laughs from attractive women who aren’t yours to bring home. In an unlikely turn of events, it seems that your success with one woman has made you successful with all women. So what gives?
> 
> Like a moth to a flame, single women are drawn to a man in a relationship. It’s a fascinating coincidence — one that is frustrating and unfair for the newly tied-down gentleman. Just when the gettin’s good, he’s not allowed to get. Nevertheless, the reasoning behind this phenomenon will help you be a better man, whether you’re single or taken.


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## Maxo (Mar 8, 2016)

wmn1 said:


> In my experience, you are very, very wrong.
> 
> Regarding my conclusions, I have made none. For all I know, you look like Jennifer Lawrence.
> 
> ...


I see it differently with women hitting on guys and looking for sex at least as much as men.


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## Marduk (Jul 16, 2010)

Thor said:


> If we looked at the middle 50% of the population in terms of looks, money, and self confidence, women have an enormously easier time finding a casual sex partner.
> 
> One of these Average Joe men walks into a busy bar on a weekend night. Also an Average Jane walks in. Average Jane could walk up to almost any man in there and have him leaving with her for sex in the parking lot in under a minute. But the Average Joe probably would not find a woman to go out for sex in the parking lot even after the whole evening of working over every woman he could.
> 
> Absolutely there are ex-model men, the professional athlete, or a guy who arrives in a $100k super car who will get tons of attention from many women. But they are the exception.


I don't agree. 

If you talk to a lot of women, a lot of them will tell you about being basically invisible. 

And then I payed attention to my attention. And they're right.


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## ReformedHubby (Jan 9, 2013)

Thor said:


> Absolutely there are ex-model men, the professional athlete, *or a guy who arrives in a $100k super car who will get tons of attention from many women.* But they are the exception.


I don't spend much, but I do have a thing for exotic cars. Having experienced it, that kind of attention is unsettling to me. I've had a woman hit on me in a forward manner at a gas station once. She didn't even care when I told her I was married. I even had an older lady at a stop light telling me to pull over so she could get my contact info for her daughter. Its bizarre, in any case even if I was single, I wouldn't want to be in a relationship with someone that was only interested in me because of my car. With that said I do think it supports your statement. I doubt anyone would even notice if I drove a Kia.


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## Maxo (Mar 8, 2016)

ReformedHubby said:


> I don't spend much, but I do have a thing for exotic cars. Having experienced it, that kind of attention is unsettling to me. I've had a woman hit on me in a forward manner at a gas station once. She didn't even care when I told her I was married. I even had an older lady at a stop light telling me to pull over so she could get my contact info for her daughter. Its bizarre, in any case even if I was single, I wouldn't want to be in a relationship with someone that was only interested in me because of my car. With that said I do think it supports your statement. I doubt anyone would even notice if I drove a Kia.


Hypergamy in action.


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## Rubix Cubed (Feb 21, 2016)

ReformedHubby said:


> I don't spend much, but I do have a thing for exotic cars. Having experienced it, that kind of attention is unsettling to me. I've had a woman hit on me in a forward manner at a gas station once. She didn't even care when I told her I was married. I even had an older lady at a stop light telling me to pull over so she could get my contact info for her daughter. Its bizarre, in any case even if I was single, I wouldn't want to be in a relationship with someone that was only interested in me because of my car. With that said I do think it supports your statement. I doubt anyone would even notice if I drove a Kia.


Case in point.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BAfWm7oidhU


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## always_alone (Dec 11, 2012)

michzz said:


> The context of my comments is that each gender gets convinced of some "truth". I pointed out a very common one for men to believe--which I still believe to be true.


Yes, I have to agree that many, many men are convinced of this "truth". And I wholeheartedly concur that the scare quotes are entirely appropriate.


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## Thor (Oct 31, 2011)

marduk said:


> I don't agree.
> 
> If you talk to a lot of women, a lot of them will tell you about being basically invisible.
> 
> And then I payed attention to my attention. And they're right.


When I was in college, one of my acquaintances spent a summer working at the beach. He would approach attractive young women and ask them point blank "hey, wanna fvck?". He reported a success rate of about 1:50. This was without any preliminary softening up, such as buying them drinks or using funny lines on them at the bar. Just walking up and propositioning them.

He was of average attractiveness and of reasonable physical condition (way better than average for today's fat college youth).

I seriously doubt the average college aged woman would have had to ask anywhere near 50 young men before getting one to say yes.


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## Marduk (Jul 16, 2010)

Thor said:


> When I was in college, one of my acquaintances spent a summer working at the beach. He would approach attractive young women and ask them point blank "hey, wanna fvck?". He reported a success rate of about 1:50. This was without any preliminary softening up, such as buying them drinks or using funny lines on them at the bar. Just walking up and propositioning them.
> 
> He was of average attractiveness and of reasonable physical condition (way better than average for today's fat college youth).
> 
> I seriously doubt the average college aged woman would have had to ask anywhere near 50 young men before getting one to say yes.


There's a video floating around somewhere where an attractive guy did that, and then an attractive girl did that. I don't think either one got any takers. 

Because that's just weird. I had a girl do that once. Creepshow. 

Although I have been super forward and have it work.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Marduk (Jul 16, 2010)

ReformedHubby said:


> I don't spend much, but I do have a thing for exotic cars. Having experienced it, that kind of attention is unsettling to me. I've had a woman hit on me in a forward manner at a gas station once. She didn't even care when I told her I was married. I even had an older lady at a stop light telling me to pull over so she could get my contact info for her daughter. Its bizarre, in any case even if I was single, I wouldn't want to be in a relationship with someone that was only interested in me because of my car. With that said I do think it supports your statement. I doubt anyone would even notice if I drove a Kia.


I will say that I could not believe the spike of women that came on to me after I got a recent highly visible promotion.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Rubix Cubed (Feb 21, 2016)

marduk said:


> I will say that I could not believe the spike of women that came on to me after I got a recent highly visible promotion.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


 Plenty of shallow gold diggers out there, as demonstrated in the vid I posted (and there are plenty more of them).


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## phillybeffandswiss (Jan 20, 2013)

LOL. Gotta love intelligent men and women using confirmation bias to prove a point.

Men are horny when they leer, women are slvts. It's slowly changing, but women are subtle.


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## Marduk (Jul 16, 2010)

Rubix Cubed said:


> Plenty of shallow gold diggers out there, as demonstrated in the vid I posted (and there are plenty more of them).


Don't think so. These were career women making good money. 

I think some of it was trying to further their careers and some of it was attraction to power maybe.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## G.J. (Nov 4, 2014)

Owwww cute, True Love................


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## Rubix Cubed (Feb 21, 2016)

marduk said:


> Don't think so. These were career women making good money.
> 
> I think some of it was trying to further their careers and some of it was attraction to power maybe.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


 Gold digger still fits. They just want more of it, and are using a slightly different methodology, albeit more intelligent, to get it.


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## always_alone (Dec 11, 2012)

Rubix Cubed said:


> Gold digger still fits. They just want more of it, and are using a slightly different methodology, albeit more intelligent, to get it.


It's gold digging to have an accomplished and successful career?


Pffffffft!


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## always_alone (Dec 11, 2012)

marduk said:


> Don't think so. These were career women making good money.
> 
> I think some of it was trying to further their careers and some of it was attraction to power maybe.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


What the stats show is that people, both men and women, seek people of similar education and socioeconomic status.


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## syhoybenden (Feb 21, 2013)

Hmm. I've just noticed invisibleman has been banned. He deleted his own thread then came back to make one post on page 2 of this thread throwing a fit over TAM and taunting the mods to ban him. Guess he got his wish, but I hope it's not permanent because I still think the guy needs us for real, and not for trollish sport.


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## GROUNDPOUNDER (Mar 8, 2013)

IMHO, InvisibleManhood was not an authentic BH. Yes, he may have been cheated on in the past, but much of what he'd written seemed out on a limb, stretched and out right made up. He had some serious inconsistencies also.

Most of use weren't buying it anymore, so he "scuttled" the thread and "went down with the ship".

Which makes me think... I wonder if his wife is still in that HR meeting?...


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## Rubix Cubed (Feb 21, 2016)

always_alone said:


> What the stats show is that people, both men and women, seek people of similar education and socioeconomic status.


Married or not...apparently.


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## Rubix Cubed (Feb 21, 2016)

always_alone said:


> It's gold digging to have an accomplished and successful career?
> 
> 
> Pffffffft!


When you use someone else's husband to get it ,Yes.


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## always_alone (Dec 11, 2012)

Rubix Cubed said:


> When you use someone else's husband to get it ,Yes.


You have a point, assuming said husband is wearing a highly visible sign that he is attached. Lots of guys don't, and it makes it hard to know. 

And TBH I think what a lot of guys don't realize is that this sort of attention often isn't an actual come-on. It serves another purpose entirely.


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## Rubix Cubed (Feb 21, 2016)

always_alone said:


> And TBH I think what a lot of guys don't realize is that this sort of attention often isn't an actual come-on. It serves another purpose entirely.


 Please continue with what that purpose would be.


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## ReformedHubby (Jan 9, 2013)

always_alone said:


> And TBH I think what a lot of guys don't realize is that this sort of attention often isn't an actual come-on. It serves another purpose entirely.



I think I see where you're going with it. There are lots of wealthy older guys with one foot in the grave with beautiful women on their arm. I'd agree that scenarios like that are a farce, but I don't think either party cares, both are getting what they want out of the "relationship".


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## always_alone (Dec 11, 2012)

Rubix Cubed said:


> Please continue with what that purpose would be.


Marduk already said it: career advancement and power.

If you (one) are in a position to "make things happen" (aka job opportunities, promotions, fame, recognition, awards, high-powered contacts, whatever), you will find yourself with a whole new set of "friends", both male and female. Because they want you to "make things happen" for them. And, of course, opposite sex will totally capitalize on the flirt factor if at all possible.


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## Rubix Cubed (Feb 21, 2016)

always_alone said:


> Marduk already said it: career advancement and power.
> 
> If you (one) are in a position to "make things happen" (aka job opportunities, promotions, fame, recognition, awards, high-powered contacts, whatever), you will find yourself with a whole new set of "friends", both male and female. Because they want you to "make things happen" for them. And, of course, opposite sex will totally capitalize on the flirt factor if at all possible.


 Gotcha. That was also what I meant in post 102 
"They just want more of it, and are using a slightly different methodology, albeit more intelligent, to get it."


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## always_alone (Dec 11, 2012)

Rubix Cubed said:


> Gotcha. That was also what I meant in post 102
> "They just want more of it, and are using a slightly different methodology, albeit more intelligent, to get it."


Fair enough, I suppose. I've never really though of people trying to advance their careers as gold diggers before, but ultimately, I guess that's ultimately the main reason we go to work.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

ReformedHubby said:


> I think I see where you're going with it. There are lots of wealthy older guys with one foot in the grave with beautiful women on their arm. I'd agree that scenarios like that are a farce, but I don't think either party cares, both are getting what they want out of the "relationship".


But not always.

There was a case some years back in the UK. A very rich very old man met an attractive model.

They married. He changed his will to be in her favour.

Not long after, he died. 

His children and relatives were outraged and their lawyers launched an action against her portraying her as a wicked gold digger who had bent the mind of a much older man who she had no real feelings for.

However the case ended when she was found dead.

In the suicide note that she left she wrote she said she sorry but she could not stand another day of life without the love of her life, her husband, at her side.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Thor (Oct 31, 2011)

An arrangement in a marriage of convenience is not wrong if both people are on board. I was close for a while with a woman who entered into such an arrangement. She was in her 30's and breaking into a male dominated field with her own business. She married a man 25+ years older who was an internationally known celebrity within that field. They did have very fond feelings for each other and were great friends, but weren't romantically in love. He got his trophy wife, she got the professional ticket punched.

They're still together 20 yrs later. Gold digging? Maybe on one level, but there is no pretense between them, and there is real respect between them.


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## Rubix Cubed (Feb 21, 2016)

MattMatt said:


> But not always.
> 
> There was a case some years back in the UK. A very rich very old man met an attractive model.
> 
> ...


 The question is was the suicide note in the model's handwriting or one of the children's handwriting? I'd guess the latter.


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## syhoybenden (Feb 21, 2013)

Cynic.


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## TX-SC (Aug 25, 2015)

It has been my experience that attitude and the vibes that you put off make more of an impact than your physical looks. Yes, attractive people do get more chances, but people who have self confidence, either men OR women, seem to have the best luck getting a partner (short or long term). My wife was (and still is) a very attractive woman when I met her. However, she is an introvert with not a lot of self confidence. Prior to me she had relatively little dating experience. I am more outgoing and extroverted and I have more self confidence. I had 10-times more dating experience than she did at the same age. 

Unless you are in a swingers club, going up to someone you don't know and asking them to screw is just plain creepy. I don't care WHO you are and what you look like. If it was a club situation, and the come-on was a LITTLE more subtle, I think there would have been a big difference in the outcome of the guy on the beach approaching women. The same would certainly be true for a woman doing the same.


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## Rubix Cubed (Feb 21, 2016)

syhoybenden said:


> Cynic.


I prefer realist or pragmatist.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

Rubix Cubed said:


> The question is was the suicide note in the model's handwriting or one of the children's handwriting? I'd guess the latter.


No, it was judged as suicide.

And his will stood.

So the children murdering her would have not been logical.


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## ReformedHubby (Jan 9, 2013)

MattMatt said:


> No, it was judged as suicide.
> 
> And his will stood.
> 
> So the children murdering her would have not been logical.


I here you man. Its a beautiful love story. But, its also an outlier.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

ReformedHubby said:


> I here you man. Its a beautiful love story. But, its also an outlier.


It was actually a Coroner's inquest. Hardly known for love stories. 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

I avoided this thread because I figured it couldn't be much better than the original troll thread.

Turns out this one is a train wreck, for a different, yet familiar reason.

May the gender wars resume.

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk


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