# Ex co worker said "Let's get dinner"



## Ohokiknow22 (9 mo ago)

Hi all,
For a bit of back story; I used to get along very well with a female co worker, I'm male and married and she had a boyfriend.

Im a tradesman and she was a scheduler so we would be sending texts back and forth most days about work related things but we would have a joke here and there as well. Usually there would be a few gifs and emojis.
She left for another town a few months ago and we both sent a msg saying we would miss each other. 

It so happens that I have been working in the same town that she moved to recently and I got a msg from her out of the blue saying "Are you in _insert town_ for two weeks 👀👀?"

At the end of the day I sent back "Maybe" with a smug type gif. She then sent "Let's get dinner" with a gif.

I'm not really sure if she just wants to have dinner as mates or something more, I'm pretty confused!

what do you guys think? Should I go have dinner as friends or not?


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## hairyhead (Oct 30, 2015)

Just go but tell your wife beforehand. Have dinner as friends and don't do anything stupid.

Guys can have female friends.


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

If you’re wondering—- automatic no. Trustworthy husbands don’t put themselves in iffy situations. Ask yourself if you’d like your wife having a one on one dinner in a different town with a male coworker that may have interest in her. No? There you go.


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

Ohokiknow22 said:


> Hi all,
> For a bit of back story; I used to get along very well with a female co worker, I'm male and married and she had a boyfriend.
> 
> Im a tradesman and she was a scheduler so we would be sending texts back and forth most days about work related things but we would have a joke here and there as well. Usually there would be a few gifs and emojis.
> ...


Sure but be sure to bring your wife along with you though. 

Oh.. 

Cut it out dude, Your married. full stop. 

Don't be an ass.


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

Evinrude58 said:


> If you’re wondering—- automatic no. Trustworthy husbands don’t put themselves in iffy situations. Ask yourself if you’d like your wife having a one on one dinner in a different town with a male coworker that may have interest in her. No? There you go.


He is not wondering. He knows what he is, he just wants the board to endorse him.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

Ohokiknow22 said:


> Hi all,
> For a bit of back story; I used to get along very well with a female co worker, I'm male and married and she had a boyfriend.
> 
> Im a tradesman and she was a scheduler so we would be sending texts back and forth most days about work related things but we would have a joke here and there as well. Usually there would be a few gifs and emojis.
> ...


Absolutely not.
Do you want to get burnt? If not don't play with fire. 

Either that or tell the lady that you and your wife will look forward to having a meal with her. I bet she will go silent.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

hairyhead said:


> Just go but tell your wife beforehand. Have dinner as friends and don't do anything stupid.
> 
> Guys can have female friends.


Married guys shouldn't go on dates with other women.


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## hairyhead (Oct 30, 2015)

Diana7 said:


> Married guys shouldn't go on dates with other women.


Dinner with a friend is not a date.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

hairyhead said:


> Dinner with a friend is not a date.


Dinner with a married man and another woman is a date.


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## D0nnivain (Mar 13, 2021)

Ohokiknow22 said:


> I'm not really sure if she just wants to have dinner as mates or something more, I'm pretty confused!
> 
> what do you guys think? Should I go have dinner as friends or not?


I am a woman. I could see myself sending a message like hers, knowing an acquaintance was in town & simply wanting food & to catch up, all above board. So I'm inclined to give her the benefit of the doubt.

If you are unsure because you don't know how your wife would feel, talk to your wife. Understand though there is a difference between can I consume food in the company of another woman vs can I go on a date with somebody else? Grabbing a slice of pizza or a burger at 6:30 & going home alone by 9 is fine, dining in a romantic bistro sipping wine not so much. Going to her house for dinner -- just no. 

You also know yourself. The fact that your asking . .. do you want something to happen or would you be perfectly content not to eat fast food alone? If the former, stay away.


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## manfromlamancha (Jul 4, 2013)

First of all in most cases men and women cannot be mates. Acquaintances at best. Second of all, the fact that you are asking this question means you should not be going on any dinners with women other than your wife or relatives.


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## Andy1001 (Jun 29, 2016)

Guys just read his name. 
He’s having a laugh.


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

sokillme said:


> He is not wondering. He knows what he is, he just wants the board to endorse him.


It is the dumb tease-up to the dirty deed, then, OMG, your were right, remorse.

Some people are voyeurs, some like to seen, doing the lead-up to bumping uglys.
..................................................................

Bored people love to write yarns.
Some are so good, they spin those Ox Tales from raw flax.
................................................................

What are they putting in that OZ water?

..............................................................

Carry on poster, you have our (divided) attention!


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

Ohokiknow22 said:


> Hi all,
> For a bit of back story; I used to get along very well with a female co worker, I'm male and married and she had a boyfriend.
> 
> Im a tradesman and she was a scheduler so we would be sending texts back and forth most days about work related things but we would have a joke here and there as well. Usually there would be a few gifs and emojis.
> ...


Tell her you'll be bringing your wife.


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## *Deidre* (Feb 7, 2016)

I don’t see anything wrong with getting dinner with a friend of the opposite sex _*except*_ that in this case, you’re wondering if she wants something else. If you’re “confused,” your gut may be telling you to not go because you have that feeling that she may be interested in something else. I wouldn’t put myself in a situation if I felt that a male friend of mine might be interested. You just can sense these things.

One way to see if she just wants to remain friends? Ask her if your wife can join. That’ll give you the answer, by her reaction.


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## D0nnivain (Mar 13, 2021)

For all of those who are saying that OP should bring his wife, that is not logistically possible. As I understand things, he's away from home in a far away town where this OW happens to live now. 

Again somebody with good, strong boundaries can have dinner with opposite sex friends. People with fuzzy or loose boundaries needs to avoid the slippery slope.


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## *Deidre* (Feb 7, 2016)

If you suspect OP that this friend has other ideas, it would be best to decline the invite.

I do think you can be friends with the opposite sex but often times, one or the other catches feelings ...my husband I started off as friends, for example.☺


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## LATERILUS79 (Apr 1, 2021)

You are a married man. Stop flirting with another woman. 

No need to say that you miss her. You could have said, "I enjoyed working with you, sorry to see you go"

Answering that you maybe in town with the smug emoji sounds like flirting to me. No need to be doing this.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

Ohokiknow22 said:


> Should I go have dinner as friends or not?


I firmly believe that men and women CAN be just friends. The way I would deal with an invitation like this is I would ask myself how I would feel if my H did it. If him doing it would bother me, then I won't do it. I have been pretty well served by the "do unto others" mantra during my marriage. It sounds like you have a weird feeling about it, like you think she may think there's more to it. We have instincts for a reason, they help us with survival. 😉 Trust your gut.


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## theloveofmylife (Jan 5, 2021)

LATERILUS79 said:


> You are a married man. Stop flirting with another woman.


This. I was thinking the same thing. It sounded flirty, as you noted. 

Nope!


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

D0nnivain said:


> For all of those who are saying that OP should bring his wife, that is not logistically possible. As I understand things, he's away from home in a far away town where this OW happens to live now.
> 
> Again somebody with good, strong boundaries can have dinner with opposite sex friends. People with fuzzy or loose boundaries needs to avoid the slippery slope.


It's people with loose boundaries who go out for one on one meals with people of the opposite sex. I have strong boundaries and this situation would be a total no no.


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## hairyhead (Oct 30, 2015)

Diana7 said:


> It's people with loose boundaries who go out for one on one meals with people of the opposite sex. I have strong boundaries and this situation would be a total no no.


Completely wrong.

I have dined with female colleagues and friends over many years. There was never any impropriety and my wife always knew.


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## *Deidre* (Feb 7, 2016)

It’s not about that, though. The OP is wondering if the ex coworker may want something more so if you know that someone is sending signals that are potentially more than “friendly,” you should try to avoid those situations.

From the OP:
“I'm not really sure if she just wants to have dinner as mates or something more, I'm pretty confused!”


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

hairyhead said:


> Completely wrong.
> 
> I have dined with female colleagues and friends over many years. There was never any impropriety and my wife always knew.


That's your choice. I wouldn't do it. I know far too many people who had affairs which started with people getting too close at work.


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## hairyhead (Oct 30, 2015)

Diana7 said:


> That's your choice. I wouldn't do it. I know far too many people who had affairs which started with people getting too close at work.


That's fine but your sweeping statement is not correct.

This forum is such a sad place. Everyone jumps to the assumption that EVERYONE just wants to have affairs with anyone from the opposite gender and that platonic relationships do not exist.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

hairyhead said:


> That's fine but your sweeping statement is not correct.
> 
> This forum is such a sad place. Everyone jumps to the assumption that EVERYONE just wants to have affairs with anyone from the opposite gender and that platonic relationships do not exist.


It was a statement in reply to a poster who said that those with fuzzy or loose boundaries shouldn't risk it. I said that those with strong boundaries wouldn't risk it. That's what good boundaries are for, to protect the marriage.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

hairyhead said:


> That's fine but your sweeping statement is not correct.
> 
> This forum is such a sad place. Everyone jumps to the assumption that EVERYONE just wants to have affairs with anyone from the opposite gender and that platonic relationships do not exist.


Maybe you don't know many people whose opposite sex friendships became more. It happens all the time and I know loads of such affairs. On TAM we see it all the time.


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## Ohokiknow22 (9 mo ago)

hairyhead said:


> That's fine but your sweeping statement is not correct.
> 
> This forum is such a sad place. Everyone jumps to the assumption that EVERYONE just wants to have affairs with anyone from the opposite gender and that platonic relationships do not exist.


You're not wrong mate, I just wanted some advice and for the most part I'm just getting attacked and mocked!


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## Pip’sJourney (Mar 17, 2021)

Ohokiknow22 said:


> You're not wrong mate, I just wanted some advice and for the most part I'm just getting attacked and mocked!


 I know you are feeling attacked and mocked, but honestly they are giving you their opinion. Personally, as a wife, if I knew the other woman it would matter less.. unless there were issues. Does your wife know her? if they do know each other and you run it by your wife and it is ok.. do it. Just DO NOT keep it a secret.

Another option would be to have dinner with her and a few other mates.. or friends.


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## jk1223 (11 mo ago)

The fact that you have concerns means no. I don't think you can trust yourself. Maybe you can meet at a burger joint for a quick lunch but that's it. I think men and women can be friends in the right context. For example, I drove a male friend to a car dealership to pick a new vehicle. As a thank you, he took me to lunch at a Mexican restaurant in our town. No alcohol consumed, not trying to hide anything, husband knew the whole thing. Not a big deal. I have another male friend that I could not have done the lunch thing with. Our relationship chemistry is different and does not need to be put in that light. Obviously, you are falling into that category. Walk away before you do something incredibly stupid.


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

Not all similar situations lead to affairs but some do. I’m divorced because of a workplace “friendship” that over time went too far. I suggest you don’t.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

Ohokiknow22 said:


> You're not wrong mate, I just wanted some advice and for the most part I'm just getting attacked and mocked!


Most replies are advising you not to go. Not sure how that is attacking and mocking?
Maybe you haven't got the answers you wanted?


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## LeGenDary_Man (Sep 25, 2013)

Ohokiknow22 said:


> Hi all,
> For a bit of back story; I used to get along very well with a female co worker, I'm male and married and she had a boyfriend.
> 
> Im a tradesman and she was a scheduler so we would be sending texts back and forth most days about work related things but we would have a joke here and there as well. Usually there would be a few gifs and emojis.
> ...


Maybe you are just being nice to her but I would consider "miss each other" part inappropriate in your case. You can be nice and responsive to her in your messaging but do *not* flirt with her.

It is up to you to accept her offer for having dinner with her (alone) *but *take your wife into confidence in relation.


Tell your wife that a former co-worker showed up in your town for some work and contacted you.
Tell your wife that the former co-worker suggested having dinner with her and you are considering on "courtesy basis."
Tell your wife that you will decide appropriate time and venue for having dinner with the former co-worker and update her [your wife] accordingly. The venue should be a resturant (or) a cafe [Public space].
Tell your wife that you will keep your smartphone active throughout. You should.

If your wife approve then proceed as per the plan *but* avoid consuming alcohol with your former co-worker. If your wife does *not* approve then ask her if she would be OK with you having *lunch* with the former co-worker during working hours instead? If your wife still have reservations then it would be for the best to invite the former co-worker to your *home *to have dinner with *both* you and your wife some other day. This would be reasonable Middle Ground for you in the end.

Your wife's feelings and consent are important considerations in this matter. Her input should count in regards to the company you wish to keep.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

Ohokiknow22 said:


> You're not wrong mate, I just wanted some advice and for the most part I'm just getting attacked and mocked!


I’m sorry you feel that way, I don’t think it’s the intent. Remember many on here have experienced the worst possible outcomes of situations like this. They’re not accusing you of cheating, they’re warning you how these things can go. It’s also hard to communicate tone on a message board so frankness or word choice can make something read totally different than the author intended.


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## Captain Obvious (Mar 14, 2021)

Ohokiknow22 said:


> You're not wrong mate, I just wanted some advice and for the most part I'm just getting attacked and mocked!


Do you find your former co-worker sexually/physically attractive?


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## hairyhead (Oct 30, 2015)

Diana7 said:


> It was a statement in reply to a poster who said that those with fuzzy or loose boundaries shouldn't risk it. I said that those with strong boundaries wouldn't risk it. That's what good boundaries are for, to protect the marriage.


No you said

"It's people with loose boundaries who go out for one on one meals with people of the opposite sex."

I have strong boundaries which is why I can and do socialise with female friends. Just as my wife will socialise with male colleagues and friends. The difference is we talk about it before hand and hide nothing.


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

Ohokiknow22 said:


> You're not wrong mate, I just wanted some advice and for the most part I'm just getting attacked and mocked!


You are !!

That is part of the schtick here.

No one is going to cut you some slack.
Not if you do not deserve it.

Do not take it personal, imagine if it were you giving some advice to yourself.

Keep posting, we are all strangers on the Ethernet.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

hairyhead said:


> No you said
> 
> "It's people with loose boundaries who go out for one on one meals with people of the opposite sex."
> 
> I have strong boundaries which is why I can and do socialise with female friends. Just as my wife will socialise with male colleagues and friends. The difference is we talk about it before hand and hide nothing.


As I said it was in response to another posters comments. 
I can see no possible reason for me to ever go out for a meal with a guy who I am not related to. To me it's like a date. Mr D would always be part of any friendship with a guy, it would be a joint friendship. Neither would he have a meal out with another woman. We have boundaries and having seen so many people get too close to others at work and blow up their lives, it's a boundary I will keep.


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## hairyhead (Oct 30, 2015)

Diana7 said:


> As I said it was in response to another posters comments.
> I can see no possible reason for me to ever go out for a meal with a guy who I am not related to. To me it's like a date. Mr D would always be part of any friendship with a guy, it would be a joint friendship. Neither would he have a meal out with another woman. We have boundaries and having seen so many people get too close to others at work and blow up their lives, it's a boundary I will keep.


That's fine but don't project your boundaries onto others with sweeping generalisations.

You do NOT know others' circumstances.


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## Marc878 (Aug 26, 2015)

If your wife was in your position with a male coworker what would you think?


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## Marc878 (Aug 26, 2015)

Diana7 said:


> Married guys shouldn't go on dates with other women.


Correct. It is a date.


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## tarduck (Apr 1, 2021)

Agree with Diana on this one.


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## BigDaddyNY (May 19, 2021)

DownByTheRiver said:


> Tell her you'll be bringing your wife.


@Ohokiknow22 This is the best answer. Either say no, or say, sure, I'll check when my wife is available and we'll all meet up. You are married, so no solo dates with other women. That is called dating, a single person's activity.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

hairyhead said:


> That's fine but don't project your boundaries onto others with sweeping generalisations.
> 
> You do NOT know others' circumstances.


I repeat, I was answering another posters comment.

Plus, circumstances dont change the fact that having wise boundaries with the opposite sex 
is just plain common sense. 
It's all about protecting our marriages.


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## Ohokiknow22 (9 mo ago)

I may as well come clean and tell the whole story, I am in fact thinking seriously about going to dinner with her and cheating on my wife...that's going to piss a lot of you off!

To be honest, I don't feel loved at all by my wife, she rarely ever touches me and she calls me names constantly, when I got The texts from the woman in question I have to admit it made me feel good that someone actually wants to spend some time with me and since then I have been feeling all warm and fuzzy inside thinking about embracing another woman that reciprocates it.

I know the right thing to do is work my marriage or get divorced but those are not always options when your wife wouldn't agree to the former and I don't want to do the latter because I love my kids too much.

Before you all get up in arms I most likely won't go on the "date" once everything is said and done, I'll just keep living in the loveless marriage I'm in but at least I felt wanted for a fleeting moment.

I'd also like to mention that I was chased by a receptionist at one of the business we serviced five years ago and I flat out told her sorry but I was married, she tried it on many times after that and I said sorry but no every single time. This was back when there was more love in my marriage so I'm not the cheating asshole that a lot of you think I might be.

Thanks for all the replies, some more than others.


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## hairyhead (Oct 30, 2015)

Diana7 said:


> I repeat, I was answering another posters comment.
> 
> Plus, circumstances dont change the fact that having wise boundaries with the opposite sex
> is just plain common sense.
> It's all about protecting our marriages.


That's not how I read your message. I read it as more general and very sweeping. I am not "getting" at you, I just find elements of this forum frustrating. The starting point of many discussions are "he/she is cheating" or "he/she is going to cheat".

You are correct we do have to protect our marriages however I think your (and many others) approach is quite severe. We have to protect our houses, our cars etc but we don;t encase them in concrete or install Fort Knox type security. Restricting extra marital, platonic activity in extremis is not healthy. Allowing your partner some open and honest, platonic, freedom brings freshness to the relationship. Different experiences, different opinions, different conversations, new idea and so on.

We are married 32 years and in all that time we have never stopped (other than financially) each other going out with colleagues/friends irrespective of gender, going on group holidays on our own (I regularly ski with a large group made up of couples, singles and married people on their own). My wife went on holiday to visit a male friend from University days. Their relationship was purely platonic then and is now but they have a lot of shared interests and he lived somewhere she wanted to visit. I had no qualms about agreeing to that holiday.

If I felt that I had to restrict her activity or movement because of mistrust then I would not have married her or I would get out of the marriage.

The OP has now declared his hand as being unacceptable my initial advice would be different. If he is planning to cheat then the honourable thing is to get out of the marriage or, at least, seek counselling and NOT cheat until that process is resolved.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

hairyhead said:


> That's not how I read your message. I read it as more general and very sweeping. I am not "getting" at you, I just find elements of this forum frustrating. The starting point of many discussions are "he/she is cheating" or "he/she is going to cheat".
> 
> You are correct we do have to protect our marriages however I think your (and many others) approach is quite severe. We have to protect our houses, our cars etc but we don;t encase them in concrete or install Fort Knox type security. Restricting extra marital, platonic activity in extremis is not healthy. Allowing your partner some open and honest, platonic, freedom brings freshness to the relationship. Different experiences, different opinions, different conversations, new idea and so on.
> 
> ...


Well he wants to cheat, he has just admitted that. Which sort of proves my point. 

No our boundaries are not severe in anyway, just wise. I wouldn't ever want to go out with another guy as if in a date anyway. I have too much respect for my husband and my marriage. If I go out for a meal or holiday it will be with my husband.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

Ohokiknow22 said:


> I may as well come clean and tell the whole story, I am in fact thinking seriously about going to dinner with her and cheating on my wife...that's going to piss a lot of you off!
> 
> To be honest, I don't feel loved at all by my wife, she rarely ever touches me and she calls me names constantly, when I got The texts from the woman in question I have to admit it made me feel good that someone actually wants to spend some time with me and since then I have been feeling all warm and fuzzy inside thinking about embracing another woman that reciprocates it.
> 
> ...


So if you aren't a cheater why even ask? You know it's wrong and you know that a woman who has sex with another woman's husband is dispicable. 
Concentrate on your marriage and your wife.


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## D0nnivain (Mar 13, 2021)

Diana7 said:


> It's people with loose boundaries who go out for one on one meals with people of the opposite sex. I have strong boundaries and this situation would be a total no no.





Diana7 said:


> It was a statement in reply to a poster who said that those with fuzzy or loose boundaries shouldn't risk it. I said that those with strong boundaries wouldn't risk it. That's what good boundaries are for, to protect the marriage.


People draw their boundary lines in different places. Yours say no meals with opposite sex people. Fine. 

My boundaries are different. No _romantic_ meals with an opposite sex person but consuming food one on one in a public place & talking about neutral subjects is just fine in my book. I work in a social, male dominated profession. If I couldn't eat with men not my husband I'd rarely get anything accomplished. It's all business & rarely personal. When the topics stray too far from work or small talk I reign 'em back in. Eating is not cheating.



Ohokiknow22 said:


> I may as well come clean and tell the whole story, I am in fact thinking seriously about going to dinner with her and cheating on my wife...that's going to piss a lot of you off!
> 
> * * *
> 
> ...


You don't want to consume food & catch up. You want to cheat. So dinner with this woman is not a good idea. If you love your kids, be happy. Divorce your wife & dine with whomever you want. Your kids don't need you in a loveless marriage taking jobs away from home & pining for other women.


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## BigDaddyNY (May 19, 2021)

D0nnivain said:


> People draw their boundary lines in different places. Yours say no meals with opposite sex people. Fine.
> 
> My boundaries are different. No _romantic_ meals with an opposite sex person but consuming food one on one in a public place & talking about neutral subjects is just fine in my book. I work in a social, male dominated profession. If I couldn't eat with men not my husband I'd rarely get anything accomplished. It's all business & rarely personal. When the topics stray too far from work or small talk I reign 'em back in. Eating is not cheating.
> 
> You don't want to consume food & catch up. You want to cheat. So dinner with this woman is not a good idea. If you love your kids, be happy. Divorce your wife & dine with whomever you want. Your kids don't need you in a loveless marriage taking jobs away from home & pining for other women.


Going to dinner one on one with a colleague or customer in a business setting, which is somewhat "social", is much different than just a straight up social lunch, dinner or drink.


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## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

Ohokiknow22 said:


> I may as well come clean and tell the whole story, I am in fact thinking seriously about going to dinner with her and cheating on my wife...that's going to piss a lot of you off!
> 
> To be honest, I don't feel loved at all by my wife, she rarely ever touches me and she calls me names constantly, when I got The texts from the woman in question I have to admit it made me feel good that someone actually wants to spend some time with me and since then I have been feeling all warm and fuzzy inside thinking about embracing another woman that reciprocates it.
> 
> ...


LOL I would play the violin for you but, unfortunately, it is stuck under my fingernail. Carry on.


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## BigDaddyNY (May 19, 2021)

Ohokiknow22 said:


> I may as well come clean and tell the whole story, I am in fact thinking seriously about going to dinner with her and cheating on my wife...that's going to piss a lot of you off!
> 
> To be honest, I don't feel loved at all by my wife, she rarely ever touches me and she calls me names constantly, when I got The texts from the woman in question I have to admit it made me feel good that someone actually wants to spend some time with me and since then I have been feeling all warm and fuzzy inside thinking about embracing another woman that reciprocates it.
> 
> ...


I understand you aren't happy in your marriage. However, keep in mind that loving your children and cheating on your wife do not mesh with one another. Even if you have no love for each other. It will blow up and impact your children.

Why won't your wife work on the marriage?

What makes you think your kids are better off living in a toxic household vs splitting time in two happy households?


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## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

Ohokiknow22 said:


> I know the right thing to do is work my marriage or get divorced *but those are not always options* when your wife wouldn't agree to the former and I don't want to do the latter because I love my kids too much.


Of course they're both options, to claim otherwise is complete BS and you know it.

Plus if you want to stay married to someone who won't touch you (which is nuts by the way), there's nothing stopping you from being ethical about it. And telling your wife, that in the face of your marital relationship devolving to a sexless relationship. That you will have sex outside of your marriage as you please, and she is welcome to do the same as she pleases (and or divorce you as well).


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## *Deidre* (Feb 7, 2016)

No matter what is going on in your marriage OP, don’t cheat. Why not just divorce your wife?

As if cheating is the best and only option for struggling marriages.😔


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## hairyhead (Oct 30, 2015)

D0nnivain said:


> My boundaries are different. No _romantic_ meals with an opposite sex person but consuming food one on one in a public place & talking about neutral subjects is just fine in my book. I work in a social, male dominated profession. If I couldn't eat with men not my husband I'd rarely get anything accomplished. It's all business & rarely personal. When the topics stray too far from work or small talk I reign 'em back in. Eating is not cheating.


Common sense at last. Thank you @D0nnivain 




BigDaddyNY said:


> Going to dinner one on one with a colleague or customer in a business setting, which is somewhat "social", is much different than just a straight up social lunch, dinner or drink.


It can be both. I know many of my colleagues on a social level so eating out may well cover both business and social. In some cases I have met their partners and vice versa. For me these meetings are not dates, they are non-romantic, platonic catch-ups held in public places.


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## BigDaddyNY (May 19, 2021)

hairyhead said:


> It can be both. I know many of my colleagues on a social level so eating out may well cover both business and social. In some cases I have met their partners and vice versa. For me these meetings are not dates, they are non-romantic, platonic catch-ups held in public places.


I personally don't think a married man or woman should have one on one meetings with the opposite sex in a setting that is primarily social. I understand the intent is not romantic, but I just feel it isn't appropriate. My wife feels the same way. Years ago she worked in the back office of an electrical parts distributor. Men and women from there often went on group lunches together to a near by place they were regulars at, no big deal and I'm okay with that. One day a bunch of people backed out and my wife ended up at lunch with just one of the men in the office, a married man. We all knew each other as couples too. Completely platonic. Half way through they both agreed they would never be doing it again solo like that. It felt too much like a date, even if they were just talking about each others respective spouses and work stuff.

A one off with someone you have not seen in a long while and won't be seeing again anytime soon, maybe that is okay. Someone you work with every day and see all the time, nope, not going to feel right to me.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

hairyhead said:


> Common sense at last. Thank you @D0nnivain
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Common sense comes in protecting a marriage.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

*Deidre* said:


> No matter what is going on in your marriage OP, don’t cheat. Why not just divorce your wife?
> 
> As if cheating is the best and only option for struggling marriages.😔


I often wonder if people don’t cheat, or do things that are destructive like establish inappropriate friendships, because they want to end the marriage but they lack the courage. If they cheat they claim it was the spouse that ended it because, “I was willing to work on it but he/she was too insecure to get over it.”


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## BigDaddyNY (May 19, 2021)

TexasMom1216 said:


> I often wonder if people don’t cheat, or do things that are destructive like establish inappropriate friendships, because they want to end the marriage but they lack the courage. If they cheat they claim it was the spouse that ended it because, “I was willing to work on it but he/she was too insecure to get over it.”


I have no doubt that some people are cowards and take this route to end their marriage.


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## hairyhead (Oct 30, 2015)

Diana7 said:


> Common sense comes in protecting a marriage.


Protecting or throttling?


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## Zedd (Jul 27, 2021)

BigDaddyNY said:


> I personally don't think a married man or woman should have one on one meetings with the opposite sex in a setting that is primarily social. I understand the intent is not romantic, but I just feel it isn't appropriate.


I don't necessarily disagree with this, but, as a counter-point - if one of the people is in a position of authority and that person is willing to do group or 1:1 lunches, happy hours, shared dinner while traveling, etc with someone of the same sex, you HAVE to be willing to do it with the opposite sex. Just because it's outside of the office or working hours, doesn't mean you're not ripe for discrimination allegations.

As an example, if we've traveled somewhere for work, and a few of us meet up at the hotel bar or something, I either need to be - not one of the first people out, but literally the first person out, or I need to be the last one out/stay and close down the bar with them.


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## *Deidre* (Feb 7, 2016)

TexasMom1216 said:


> I often wonder if people don’t cheat, or do things that are destructive like establish inappropriate friendships, because they want to end the marriage but they lack the courage. If they cheat they claim it was the spouse that ended it because, “I was willing to work on it but he/she was too insecure to get over it.”


Yea, possibly. I don’t honestly think that cheating is all about the marriage. It’s a choice someone makes who most of the time, doesn’t necessarily want to get divorced, yet wants to have their cake, and eat it too. They want to stay married but also want to pretend they’re single.

That’s why so many spouses “get caught” by their wife/husband, and the cheating spouse begs for a second chance. They don’t want to divorce, they just want to have the “best of both worlds.” At least that’s been my observation.

The OP has now admitted to wanting to explore potentially something more with this ex worker. It’s now no longer about if you’re married, can you have friends of the opposite sex. To which, I say yes you can but not if you or the other person is interested in more. That’s not really a friendship, at that point.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

*Deidre* said:


> Yea, possibly. I don’t honestly think that cheating is all about the marriage. It’s a choice someone makes who most of the time, doesn’t necessarily want to get divorced, yet wants to have their cake, and eat it too. They want to stay married but also want to pretend they’re single.
> 
> That’s why so many spouses “get caught” by their wife/husband, and the cheating spouse begs for a second chance. They don’t want to divorce, they just want to have the “best of both worlds.” At least that’s been my observation.


Agreed. They're greedy and entitled. But in this case, it seems the OP is tired of being married to his wife and this seems, maybe subconsciously, like an escape route for him.


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## BigDaddyNY (May 19, 2021)

Zedd said:


> I don't necessarily disagree with this, but, as a counter-point - if one of the people is in a position of authority and that person is willing to do group or 1:1 lunches, happy hours, shared dinner while traveling, etc with someone of the same sex, you HAVE to be willing to do it with the opposite sex. Just because it's outside of the office or working hours, doesn't mean you're not ripe for discrimination allegations.
> 
> As an example, if we've traveled somewhere for work, and a few of us meet up at the hotel bar or something, I either need to be - not one of the first people out, but literally the first person out, or I need to be the last one out/stay and close down the bar with them.


There are going to be some business situations that may drive the need for it. I've been in all levels of management from supervisory to executive and lots of business travel, so I know what you are talking about. You do have to treat everyone equally, no doubt about it. However 1 on 1 has always been rare and when it has happened, it was business related and didn't repeat frequently. 1 on 1 meetings would typically be conducted on company time. Happy hours would always be as a group, not 1 on 1. 

This thread really isn't about those unique business situations. This is about a lunch/dinner date that is clearly social and just so happens to involve people that were business associates. When the activities switches from mostly business to mostly or totally social then there is a problem.


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## Zedd (Jul 27, 2021)

BigDaddyNY said:


> This thread really isn't about those unique business situations. This is about a lunch/dinner date that is clearly social and just so happens to involve people that were business associates. When the activities switches from mostly business to mostly or totally social then there is a problem.


Completely fair. I was just providing a counter-point to the Mike Pence "never alone with someone from the opposite sex" crowd.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

TexasMom1216 said:


> I often wonder if people don’t cheat, or do things that are destructive like establish inappropriate friendships, because they want to end the marriage but they lack the courage. If they cheat they claim it was the spouse that ended it because, “I was willing to work on it but he/she was too insecure to get over it.”


Yes some people are probably that disgusting.


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## theloveofmylife (Jan 5, 2021)

Ohokiknow22 said:


> I know the right thing to do is work my marriage or get divorced but those are not always options when your wife wouldn't agree to the former and I don't want to do the latter because I love my kids too much.


Right, because cheating on your wife (which is also cheating on your kids) would be so much better for them. That hardly ever ends badly.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

I 


Zedd said:


> Completely fair. I was just providing a counter-point to the Mike Pence "never alone with someone from the opposite sex" crowd.


I greatly admire Mike Pence. If you have to have a meeting/meal/ drink with a person of the opposite sex then bring someone else along. Or meet in your office with the door open. There are ways of doing this if you really want to. 
I know a pastor who does this He will always bring another lady along if he is meeting a woman for prayer/counselling/help. Billy Graham had the same very high standards.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

Diana7 said:


> I
> 
> I greatly admire Mike Pence. If you have to have a meeting/meal/ drink with a person of the opposite sex then bring someone else along. Or meet in your office with the door open. There are ways of doing this if you really want to.
> I know a pastor who does this He will always bring another lady along if he is meeting a woman for prayer/counselling/help. Billy Graham had the same very high standards.


This is a little off topic, but people tend to misunderstand what Mike Pence was really saying. The media made it sound like he didn't have dinner alone with other women because he can't control himself or because women are succubus (succubi? what's the plural?) that will sexualize the encounter. That wasn't it. It was to avoid the appearance of impropriety and to not embarrass his wife by making her deal with accusations against him. It's actually a surprisingly respectful position for a religious man. He is a public figure, and even if he weren't, if other people saw him having dinner alone with another woman, assumptions could be made, and he would have to respond to them and his wife would have to deal with that embarrassment. He isn't avoiding those situations because of a flaw in his or the woman's character, he's avoiding them because he's avoiding ANY appearance that he is unfaithful because that would hurt his wife.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

TexasMom1216 said:


> This is a little off topic, but people tend to misunderstand what Mike Pence was really saying. The media made it sound like he didn't have dinner alone with other women because he can't control himself or because women are succubus (succubi? what's the plural?) that will sexualize the encounter. That wasn't it. It was to avoid the appearance of impropriety and to not embarrass his wife by making her deal with accusations against him. It's actually a surprisingly respectful position for a religious man. He is a public figure, and even if he weren't, if other people saw him having dinner alone with another woman, assumptions could be made, and he would have to respond to them and his wife would have to deal with that embarrassment. He isn't avoiding those situations because of a flaw in his or the woman's character, he's avoiding them because he's avoiding ANY appearance that he is unfaithful because that would hurt his wife.


Yep. A very sensible boundary to have.


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## LeGenDary_Man (Sep 25, 2013)

Ohokiknow22 said:


> I may as well come clean and tell the whole story, I am in fact thinking seriously about going to dinner with her and cheating on my wife...that's going to piss a lot of you off!
> 
> To be honest, I don't feel loved at all by my wife, she rarely ever touches me and she calls me names constantly, when I got The texts from the woman in question I have to admit it made me feel good that someone actually wants to spend some time with me and since then I have been feeling all warm and fuzzy inside thinking about embracing another woman that reciprocates it.
> 
> ...


You have marital problems then.

You need to ask yourself this question: How cheating can address your marital problems?

You have kids and you love them. You should be a role-model father to them. A father who decides to cheat cannot be one.

If your wife is denying you (and rude to you) then this dynamic is *not* fair to you. This issue should be addressed.

Your wife have given you children and this suggest that she liked you and was intimate with you for some years. So what changed now? 

Apply for a leave and spend time with your wife to have an honest conversation with her.

When you are back home, create positive tone and impression.

1. Take your wife to dinner somewhere. Talk about food and good stuff - nothing else.

Test your wife in the night in your bedroom by touching her and see how it goes. If she deny you then do not react *but* sleep. Commence serious talks on the next day.

2. Let your wife know that you want to address your marital problems with her. This should be your stance by default.

3. Let your wife know that you feel neglected, rejected, and your frame-of-mind is disturbed because she rejects your intimate advances. You want your marriage to work but you have "needs" and "breaking-point." This dynamic can lead to a tragic outcome which is not good for your family unit.

4. You must find out why your wife is acting the way she is and/or denying you lately. 

There must be a reason and/or pent-up feelings inside her. Make sure that somebody is not filling her head behind your back as well. Your kids might know something and can give you meaningful pointers - if they are old enough to understand things around them.

This should be your top priority for now.


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