# Do you need to know the details?



## AZMOMOFTWO (Jun 30, 2008)

Anyone has been through this with their spouse cheating, do you need to know the details? What if your spouse doesn't like telling you and feels they are protecting you? 

Sunday night was interesting...I'm not a big drinker but I did a lot that night (superbowl). My husband decided it was time to take kids home and said he'd come and get me when I was ready. I'm not a partier but was having a great time with girls and we were talking about men so most of the men scattered...

While he was gone this guy started hitting on me. I didn't think anything of it. This is a big group of our friends and there are parameters. There is flirting but its always harmless stuff, teasing but never serious. This guy was new, brought by another friend as just a guest, not a date and he was single I guess looking to hook up. That's not the kind of parties we have, our families are there etc so I was a bit clueless that and too much to drink. I thought he was being nice. My friend figured it out and told him to back off, and he wouldn't. Now I'm on to him but he would not leave me alone. Finally the other guys made him leave. You just don't do that around these people. When my husband got back they were telling him "we had you covered and that guy won't be back". He seemed not at all perturbed. Is that weird? The other guys were more mad at that guy than my husband.

So that was the first thing then my closest friends got in to a fight. He doesn't like crowds and most of these people are her family or friends since childhood and he gave her an ultimatum. I knew it wasn't serious and so did she. In fact she stayed the night and said whatever, he'll get over it. She went to bed but her family and friends started discussing her and saying she should leave him etc. etc. 

Well I stepped up and said "you can't help who you love" and if she was happy with him then let them be etc. I was really defending the relationship. Well I've not told anyone about the affair (except all of you here on this forum!) but my reactions were not normal I was very defensive of their marriage so my friend took me aside and she just knew. She said "when did he have an affair?"...we weren't even talking affairs only about marriage and she knew. ..wow I've never talked to any of my friends about this. But then again not sure if it was a good thing, she doesn't keep her mouth closed when she has something to say. So when my husband picked me up, she sat him down and told him she loved us both but he better figure out what he wants before he loses it and he told her he knew what he wanted and was intent on keeping me and she just reinforced some of his thoughts. ...not sure how I feel about this I can't believe she did it..

We went home though and I think I just hit a boiling point of not knowing everything and being angry but never showing it and he got all of it that night. I needed to unload those pent up feelings and he needed to hear how badly he hurt me. He did confess what was weighing him down were three things 1) this was the first and only affair but 3 years ago he asked a girl out but didn't go through with it 2) this affair that he had which ended last summer was much longer than he confessed. 3) yeah he told her he loved her but didn't mean it, was saying what she wanted to hear to get what he wanted (something I specifically asked him and he denied before). 

I do feel a ton of bricks has been lifted but it was a pretty heart to heart. I told him I was leaving if he couldn't be truthful with me because if he's still lying we have no chance to build trust. I meant it, I don't know where I was going but I was. 

Not sure if this conversation was a good thing, it was highly emotional and he started by saying "I'm not going to do this with you right now" and he was angry when he said it. But that is what he said when he was having an affair and I wanted to find out what was going on. But I stood my ground and told him if we don't do this right now then we don't do it at all. I've lived with this for nearly a year and its overdue. All of a sudden his whole demeanor changed and he said you're right let's talk but can we do it calmly (I was a bit emotional). 

At first afterward it felt strained but we're getting back to where we were and I feel a huge weight off. Its funny expressing anger I always thought bad...but maybe it was a good thing not just for me but him too. I saw firsthand his guilt and pain and I did tell him I forgive him and I meant it and now he needs to learn to forgive himself....

Anyway love to hear your thoughts if you have ever been through this (or not) but my advice to anyone who has ever cheated, if you are working it out come completely clean unless your spouse doesn't want to know details then respect that. Its easier to do it sooner rather than drag it out!


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## Cooper (Apr 18, 2008)

Well in my situation I did not want to know all the details. My marriage was done, what was the point in inflicting myself to further pain? 

I have to say in reading all the post about infidelity the cheating partner learns to lie by degrees. Even after being caught they still lie. They have created a pattern of betrayal and they are just use to lying, it's easy and natural for them. Think about it, "no there is no one else", "well yea, I talk to him/her a lot, but their just a friend","well, we never had sex","well, maybe some hugging and kissing", "well maybe we had sex but only once", "well I never loved him/her", "well yes I told them I loved them but didn't really mean it". Does this pattern sound fimiliar? 

If a cheater comes clean immediatly in my mind there me be a way to save the marriage. But how long of putting up with 90% lies and 10% truth before you say enough? I put up with years of lies hoping she would change, she never did. Tomorrow is our day in court and I am glad. I wish we had divorced years ago, it is wonderful not to have to deal with a liar on a daily basis. 

Every person is different, but a chronic liar is a terrible person to be in a relationship with. So to answer your question, if the person has lied and lied again what makes you think you will ever know the true details anyway? So why ask.

Cooper


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## sunflower (Dec 15, 2008)

Ya I agree even with whatever a liar tells you how are you truely going to beleive that because they have lied about everything else. But if he is showing you not just telling you actions speak louder then words.


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## AZMOMOFTWO (Jun 30, 2008)

Cooper said:


> They have created a pattern of betrayal and they are just use to lying, it's easy and natural for them. Think about it, "no there is no one else", "well yea, I talk to him/her a lot, but their just a friend","well, we never had sex","well, maybe some hugging and kissing", "well maybe we had sex but only once", "well I never loved him/her", "well yes I told them I loved them but didn't really mean it". Does this pattern sound fimiliar?
> 
> But how long of putting up with 90% lies and 10% truth before you say enough? Cooper


These are a lot of my thoughts too...its why I check his email but maybe he knows I do it so I see what he wants me to see. Who's to say he doesn't have another email account...when one lies and gets caught, they maybe just get better at lying???

My gut tells me he has come clean and it was my gut that led me to know that he was cheating. Trying to trust him because that's what a spouse does I ignored signs but my head was saying you are such a fool. But that's what led me to confirm it and I found the emails. Now he's learned to delete. It does feel different now and whenever I've checked on him everything is as he says (in the beginning, I'd look up customer addresses and drive by there just to see that he was where he said for example)...every day actions are the only thing that matter and even a small lie about something insignificant will cause whatever trust that rebuilt to leave. 

I don't know...


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## AZMOMOFTWO (Jun 30, 2008)

Actions do speak louder than words. I realize the other night I was trying to push him away, pushing all the buttons. I thought he would leave. I was testing him. Not intentionally but when I sat down and thought about why I said some things that I did, I realized it. 

One thing I have learned through this whole process is to trust ME. One thing I said to him and I think this is really true..."you cheated on me because you KNEW I would take you back" and he was right. He said that yeah he knew there was a pretty good chance I would. That was me then and that's a line he nor anyone will ever cross again and keep me, but I guess where I'm unclear is with what happened before how much of that can I live with?


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## TGolbus (Nov 3, 2008)

I have learned to trust what I know. Instead of looking for e-mails, I look at behavior, actions, etc. You can't fake those very well, or for very long. If he comes clean you will be able to tell. If you have doubts - trust that.
Focus on living going forward - not the past. If he chages, you will know.


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## moogvo (Dec 21, 2008)

I wanted to know everything, A to Z. What I got was a fantastic total fabrication which contained one ow two true facts, but about 95% of it was hockey. After a couple of weeks went by, I found out more, then another 2 weeks and more... Finally, I found e-mails and evidence that it had been TWO men and not just one.

I finally told her that I was not going to live this way, and while nothing inappropriate has taken place since she confessed the affair to me, I just wasn't going to hear any more lies. She finally came out with a LOT more than I probably wanted to know, including details of things I could never have found out about.

It hurts like I am just finding out all over again, and I am angry that my entire holiday season (including my 40th birthday) was taken away from me and shared with another man. I am hurt, angry, and dammit, I WANT my birthday party... and I WILL HAVE IT! (Even if I have to throw it myself!)

There was a BIG fight last night when she finally "Got it". Finally, she understood how devastated I am over the affair. We'll see.

To answer your question, Yes TOTAL DISCLOSURE, in my opinion is the ONLY way. Otherwise, there are still secrets. What kind of marriage can you have when you begin with keeping secrets?

~Moog


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## sunflower (Dec 15, 2008)

Interesting. Ya when I was told I was told in the bathroom by my ex best friend and then my husband came in and all he said was no matter what those are still my girls he didnt give me a explanation nothing. Then his friend drove me home he came home maybe 15 minutes later we sat on the coach he said nothing really I went up stairs hoped in the shower and bawled my eyes out. He threw up and went to bed PASSED OUT. Then the next day we talked you could tell he was really scared and the reality hit. It was a hard day. LOTS OF TALKING CRYING. but I tell you he stuck with me through alot of BS and that was over a kiss and rub he didnt even have sex with her not even close. SO its just amazing what I put him through cause I think that I would have said ENOUPH already.


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## AZMOMOFTWO (Jun 30, 2008)

TGolbus said:


> I have learned to trust what I know. Instead of looking for e-mails, I look at behavior, actions, etc. You can't fake those very well, or for very long. If he comes clean you will be able to tell. If you have doubts - trust that.
> Focus on living going forward - not the past. If he chages, you will know.


Thank you for this insight, I think this is right on target and I will try to do that from now on.


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## AZMOMOFTWO (Jun 30, 2008)

moogvo said:


> It hurts like I am just finding out all over again, and I am angry that my entire holiday season (including my 40th birthday) was taken away from me and shared with another man. ~Moog


Wow...this happened to me only it was my 39th birthday and Mother's Day too! On MD, we went camping with my H and I, and our 2 kids, another couple and HER! I did not know anything was up but I was upset he brought her along, he said he didn't the other couple did and she did sleep in their tent. My birthday I knew he didn't want to take me out and it was duty so I said would you rather have time alone, he said yes forgetting it was my birthday. I took the kids and we went away while he stayed home having sex with her... holidays are not on my favorite list. 

I share your sentiment but I guess my guard comes up and I just no longer want to celebrate any holidays, anniversaries etc. I feel like they lead to disappointment. I shared that with him and we'll see what he does with it. This year is my 40th..


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## AZMOMOFTWO (Jun 30, 2008)

sunflower said:


> Interesting. Ya when I was told I was told in the bathroom by my ex best friend and then my husband came in and all he said was no matter what those are still my girls he didnt give me a explanation nothing. Then his friend drove me home he came home maybe 15 minutes later we sat on the coach he said nothing really I went up stairs hoped in the shower and bawled my eyes out. He threw up and went to bed PASSED OUT. Then the next day we talked you could tell he was really scared and the reality hit. It was a hard day. LOTS OF TALKING CRYING. but I tell you he stuck with me through alot of BS and that was over a kiss and rub he didnt even have sex with her not even close. SO its just amazing what I put him through cause I think that I would have said ENOUPH already.


I found out due to HUNDREDS of text messaging going on. I confronted him and got "we're just friends, she was looking for advice", but this woman a friend of mine could no longer look me in the face. I KNEW but tried to say it wasn't happening. He denied it but then he was saying that he wasn't happy, not committed to the marriage and thinking maybe it was over but no he wasn't having sex with her...But no longer able to stand it I searched, and I found emails and photos he sent to her confirming it. Yet he still denied it. Lots of tears, lots of talks. 

I also figure that if he does truly want to be with me, he will support me through this pain and do whatever it takes to minimize it. So I'm going to focus more on his behaviors now and learn to trust him based on that.


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## sunflower (Dec 15, 2008)

Ya I for sure think that its the NOW that matters. I just am a very prideful person so it was really hard to get past how it all came out and how he acted in front of her with it all being out still trying to act like the whatever guy you know. I guess I just thought in that situation you were supposed to break down saying sorry I love you I dont want to lose you instead I got a cold shoulder. But it was all differant in the next day and from there on.


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## 97gone (Feb 3, 2009)

Telling the truth,and straight anwers about the affair will help minimize trust issues moving foward. I know this first hand, my wife to this day has yet to come clean. I found out most of the details( SHE TOLD HER FRIEND AND OTHERS WHO OFFERED THE INFO TO ME). When the bond of trust and respect are broken,the deceived husband/wife are entiteld to have all questions fully explained, no have truths ect.


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## sunflower (Dec 15, 2008)

Ya I agree with you I think that if you are more open and tell all in the beg. it makes the trust rebuilding better. But its scary excpecially when you are telling them and they are freaking out it makes you back down and sweeten the blow so to say.


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## onlylonelyone (Jan 26, 2009)

NO...........you don't need the details. All that does is hurt you. Sex is sex use your imagination if you have to. Why on earth would you want to know the nasty details? Thats like pouring alcohol on an open wound. No no no........


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## sunflower (Dec 15, 2008)

so you would imagine the worst no way. I am a need to know it all person. I couldnt just say oh dont tell me dont want to know.


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## onlylonelyone (Jan 26, 2009)

Nothing could be worse than someone cheating on you. Why would you need the details of sex with another woman???? Just curious, why? Isn't knowing he was intimate with someone other than you enough information? I would be curious how he felt about her. Like, is he in love with this other woman? That would be the worst for me. I can imagine the two naked together if I had to on my own. I don't need details to that.

I can tell you wanting and getting the details really confuses you. My friend had to know as well. Then saw the other woman. She was so unattractive it about killed my friend. All she could wonder is how could he do this to her with such a nasty woman????? Most men do cheat with women not as attractive as their wife. I don't know why, just read it in a book, it seems to be the norm. Then the wife tries to compare herself to that, and is completely confused, and insecure for no reason.

It is placing blame where it doesn't belong. Bottom line the husband did wrong, and it wasn't the wifes fault he cheated. There is no excuse in the world that can sway that blame...ever.....You control your own actions, no one makes you do anything you don't want to do. Keep the blame where it belongs anything else is just a distraction.


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## sunflower (Dec 15, 2008)

Ya I agree but still I guess the wanting to know is to see if its something that you do together or make sense of what it really was you know. But Ya the worst thing is when the women looks like your sister. EVERYONE thought that we were sisters so.... Ya I cant really bash on a women that looks like i do wtf was he thinking well I couldnt tell ya OH WAIT I CAN he was figuring out us.


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## onlylonelyone (Jan 26, 2009)

My friend said her husband told her that the woman was younger, and looked up to him, made him feel important, etc.....It didn't have anything to do with how she looked. He was turning 40, it scared him, and a 20 yr old found him attractive at work and thats how it happened. It seems a man cheats more because he feels insecure, and needs an ego boost more than it being something his wife isn't fulfilling, or did wrong.
Thats why I say the less misery to the wife the better......

I would probably want to know details as a reflex reaction, but there is a big difference in wanting to know and really needing to know, ya know, lol.....?


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## onlylonelyone (Jan 26, 2009)

I do have to say, watching my friend go through hell with the affair definately woke me up a bit. I used to sit for hours over coffee talking to my husband about his business and flying, childhood memories, etc.... After 10 years it's hard to keep listening to the same old stuff, but I just suffer through it. It makes him proud to brag about himself, and I just act like I haven't heard the story 50 times already, lol. I think little things like that help keep them high up on the pedestal where they think they belong, lol....I always tell him what a good Dad, husband and provider he is. Even though he's gained a few pounds I make sure to tell him how sexy he is (even if I am secretly wondering if he's going to have a heart attack or something, lol). I can still make him blush if I try hard enough. The little things go a long way with a man. If he cheats on me, I know it wasn't because of me, he just didn't appreciate me. That will be his loss, ya know?


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## 97gone (Feb 3, 2009)

Who said the questions have to be about sex, relationships and marriage covers a lot of ground.


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## onlylonelyone (Jan 26, 2009)

97gone said:


> Who said the questions have to be about sex, relationships and marriage covers a lot of ground.



It was my interpretation of the question.


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## sunflower (Dec 15, 2008)

Well I agree that if you keep up and make the relationshop great its better chance of being faithful but shoot even the best of relationships faltur I dont think that its always the bad ones there are some great ones that end up this way


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## onlylonelyone (Jan 26, 2009)

I totally agree.....Some people just think the grass is greener, and don't appreciate or even know what they have sometimes. They don't know how lucky they are until they sleep around and then all of the sudden "OMG, I screwed up".... Usually that OMG moment doesn't kick in until the spouse finds out, lol. It can definately happen to anyone, and not to make excuses but if everyone knew they would get caught and hurt their spouse and maybe children I doubt many would do it. Thats why I believe it doesn't usually have too much to do with the spouse even though he/she is the one who gets so hurt out of the deal. Thats why they say it is such a selfish act.


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## sunflower (Dec 15, 2008)

It is very selfish it hurts all the family to not just the other I agree Our children were dealing with pain to maybe they werent sure what kinda pain but they knew something was up. SAD but ya my husband had the oppertunity to kiss her again she said one night "I could kiss you right now but I am not going to" and he said GOOD I dont want you to. So that right there says alot about him I THINK atleast cause if it were me who knows its like well its already happend so what worst could it be.


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## AZMOMOFTWO (Jun 30, 2008)

sunflower said:


> Ya I for sure think that its the NOW that matters. I just am a very prideful person so it was really hard to get past how it all came out and how he acted in front of her with ...


I know what you mean. This is an issue for me. My H and this girl hung out in front of me and there was another couple too (her best friend is married to my husband's friend). There were times when I know he said something negative about me in front of them. So here I am the outsider in a relationship where I should be the only insider. 

We have talked about some of that behavioral, he's pretty ashamed. But he needed to know what bothered me most is that he made me the outsider. We've talked about some specific situations and I don't want excuses or lies. We've had some very healthy conversations on that subject. I don't mean we bring up every little issue but I wanted him to know my key hot buttons. 

Here's a biggie...I went out of town and took my daugher. My husband was home with our 4 year old son. Sensing something was up and already addressing him that how much time he spent with this girl was affecting our marriage I said please do not see her while I am gone and please keep her away from my son. I have that right to say who spends time with him. 

He lied, said he did not see her the whole time. My son tells me the whole story. My H tells me my son was confused. I told him he is not confused and do not ever use my son that way again. He was told not to tell me. I also said that if he ever did that again I would take legal action to keep her away from my son. He then admitted and apologized (but continued to see her). We've discussed this and he is extremely ashamed. I don't use harsh words but I tell him the kinds of things I'm still processing. Its helped to discuss it and not in a "you did this" way. In the end talking about some of these issues has helped. 

He's very uncomfortable talking about it but he's been willing. I just always wonder is he softening the truth and then get scared he'll go down that avenue again. Because WHILE he was cheating on me, he went to great lengths to make sure I thought he was happy so he wouldn't have to "deal with it"...maybe that's why I feel I need to knwo the details??? :scratchhead:


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## AZMOMOFTWO (Jun 30, 2008)

97gone said:


> Telling the truth,and straight anwers about the affair will help minimize trust issues moving foward. I know this first hand, my wife to this day has yet to come clean. I found out most of the details( SHE TOLD HER FRIEND AND OTHERS WHO OFFERED THE INFO TO ME). When the bond of trust and respect are broken,the deceived husband/wife are entiteld to have all questions fully explained, no have truths ect.



:iagree:


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## AZMOMOFTWO (Jun 30, 2008)

sunflower said:


> .... its scary excpecially when you are telling them and they are freaking out it makes you back down and sweeten the blow so to say.


That's exactly what my H does and he admits to it. He says its fear that if I know everything I'll say that's it I can't do this and the other thing is he knows it will upset me and he doesn't want to do that. 

I'm trying to balance and just ask things that are most important for me to know and not just get every little detail. Like I wanted to know if he told her he loved her. His first answer "I don't really ever remember using those words". Which is not a "no" and I told him I know him that's a yes so just tell me and let's move past it. It took him until just recently to admit that yes he did say that and that he intentionally manipulated her by saying those words but he thought I'd think even less of him. Not sure that changes anything for me but feeling more confident that he'll tell me the truth going forward. 

I know though he's hid some things. I told him that I went out on an emotional limb, you have completely betrayed me but asked me to trust you again. I am doing that, and yet if it happens again it will be so much worse for me but I'm risking that so now go out on a limb for me, tell me what I want to know. Tell me something you have never told me. I guess I wanted him to take some risks too...:scratchhead:


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## AZMOMOFTWO (Jun 30, 2008)

onlylonelyone said:


> NO...........you don't need the details. All that does is hurt you. Sex is sex use your imagination if you have to. Why on earth would you want to know the nasty details? Thats like pouring alcohol on an open wound. No no no........


Not necessarily the details of sex but it was important for me to know when, how frequently, when it stopped and where it happened. Beyond that I don't think I asked much more. Just more things like what promises where made, when I was out of town what happened, those kinds of things. And yeah it does hurt but yet I seem to NEED that info...


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## AZMOMOFTWO (Jun 30, 2008)

onlylonelyone said:


> Nothing could be worse than someone cheating on you. Why would you need the details of sex with another woman???? Just curious, why? Isn't knowing he was intimate with someone other than you enough information? I would be curious how he felt about her. Like, is he in love with this other woman? That would be the worst for me. I can imagine the two naked together if I had to on my own. I don't need details to that.
> 
> I can tell you wanting and getting the details really confuses you. My friend had to know as well. Then saw the other woman. She was so unattractive it about killed my friend. All she could wonder is how could he do this to her with such a nasty woman????? Most men do cheat with women not as attractive as their wife. I don't know why, just read it in a book, it seems to be the norm. Then the wife tries to compare herself to that, and is completely confused, and insecure for no reason.
> 
> It is placing blame where it doesn't belong. Bottom line the husband did wrong, and it wasn't the wifes fault he cheated. There is no excuse in the world that can sway that blame...ever.....You control your own actions, no one makes you do anything you don't want to do. Keep the blame where it belongs anything else is just a distraction.


actually your viewpoint is same as his, he said if situation were reversed he would only want to know it happened and no details but he's slowly starting to understand my needs. 

Interesting, this girl was definately not hot...no way do I feel she is more attractive but she is a lot younger so I guess that gives me some feeling of inadequacy. Although he said "she was convenient, it was never about her" so I guess that makes sense. She's kind of ... dull .... lazy ... unmotivated and very negative. That's not the kind of person he is usually around. I do know she pursued him, I saw it myself and said something and he denied it and the phone bill always shows her calling first and so he said yeah I took advantage... still I wonder why her.


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## sunflower (Dec 15, 2008)

Yup I totally understand the fear of forgiving that person and them doing it again putting you right back to that heart ach. I am soooooooo scared that will happen. He has told me he noticed a big differance in me though that I am showing him more love that last couple days. I have to try to let him in and if he breaks my heart then its his loss I have to take that chance though.


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## Granny7 (Feb 2, 2013)

AZMOMOFTWO,
I'm glad that you were able to get all the anger out, I think it's a good thing to do. I did it in the beginning 25 yrs. ago after I found out. I never got all the details from CH, had to get in touch with OW to try and see if stories made any sense. I did get some information, as the only way I got anything was looking for charges, no internet back then. I saw the two weekend charges, I begged for the truth every time I would find one. First he would deny it, as he originally told me that it was a year of lunches. Now it was a weekend, he promised that was the only one. Two weeks later, found another one, promised nothing else after initially denying the last one. Then their was another one. So, all I got was lies, that's why I got in touch with the OW. I should have called her H since he originally sent me the letter telling me about the 3 yr. affair, along with his love letters to her. I don't know why I didn't go over a talk to him and get more information, since my H wasn't giving it. Something for others to think about. He had sent me a letter 3 yrs. before, but my CH explained his way out of that one, he was always home, except for a conference and I trusted him totally and loved him very much. We had a very good marriage, I gave him everything. But looking back on it, I gave and he took. 

In hindsight if anyone gives you a clue to your spouse having an A, follow through on it, don't take their word. I should have questioned him, her now ex-husband as he would have been able to tell me some things. I couldn't get any truth from my H, didn't want to discuss it, got very angry and defensive. Five yrs. of therapy still no real answers or good reason's for what he did. She came on to him, he was about 37 and liked her boosting his ego. No one had ever done it before, even though I did. You can't compete with someone new if you have a weak H. He wouldn't have ever started anything, but to this day I don't know why he forgot he was married to me. 

I'm getting off the topic. Details were very important to me and I couldn't get them from him, her's sort of meshed with his, but I think they were in touch with each other. Now 30 yrs. later, it has all come back, due to some very strong triggers of how he was acting. I thought he was having another A, but he wasn't. Just a lot of life changes that made me feel unloved again and it made me think of how he had been 25 yrs. before. He was drinking more, anger, etc. So, in defensive of this other person, it's not always what you want. You decide to move on, still love your H, but it's never the same kind of love, but it's hard to throw away 25 yrs. now I'm at 51 yrs. so it's even harder. 

Now, we are going through hell as he claims to not remember hardly anything and I still want closure to what actually happened during those 3 yrs. of my life. So, I understand what this person is going through. I didn't ask for it to come back. But now that it has, I can't let it go. I'm going through depression and finally went on anti-depressants as I don't know what I'm going to do now. Not even sure if their is any love left. So, for anyone out there, get whatever information you can, don't give up. My mistake was not telling him to get out when he continued to lie to me. But I had just had cancer surgery and was weak, so a lot of things played into what my decisions were back then. I still wish that I had gotten that divorce 30 yrs. ago as my life isn't happy now. We are trying to work it out and he's going to couseling also, but I still don't have the answer's I want and he claims to have put them out of his mind. I don't buy it. So, I feel, at least for me that I do want to hear the details. I want that 3 yr. puzzle filled in and see how involved he was with her. He owes me that.
Granny7


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