# I feel alone.



## jmcdaniel05 (Mar 3, 2013)

I hope someone can help. My wife and I are in our third year of marriage now and things seem to be getting rocky. She has been working as a bartender for a little while now and has started to drink more which was no big deal. Well, now she has been going out with her friends three or four times a week. She'll get off at 1 a.m. and not be home until four or later. Now this isn't every week, but still we might only get one or two nights a week together which is nice when it happens. However, if I want to spend any time with her I have to be the one to come to her. If I want a kiss it has to come from me. Sex is down to like one or two times a month. Everytime I try to ask her to spend more time with me or show me more affection it just starts a fight and I get the feeling like she thinks I am being too clingy. Recently, I have tried to pull away from her a little hoping she would try to pull me back but it seems to be just as bad. Last night, I came home from work and she was in the bedroom and I said hey to her but then I just sat out in the kitchen until it was time to go to bed hoping she would ask me to come to lay with her or even ask me what I was doing or anything but I got nothing. It didn't even seem to bother her at all. When I got into bed I tried to talk to her about it and she said I was just trying to start another fight. She says she loves me but I don't feel it. She tells me that I am being ridiculous whenever I say anything and that I am reading into things when there is nothing there or I am being insecure. I don't know what to do. I feel like she is not even attracted to me anymore. Somebody please help!


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## All of a sudden (Jan 24, 2013)

How old are you? I dont think her behavoir is acceptable in a marriage. I would start going down there and see whats going on. Sounds like shes having fun partying and doing the bar seen, which comes with attention from other guys. If shes not cheating yet, that behavior usually leads to it. So you will either have to join her or set some rules that are acceptable to you. If she doesn't care, not much you can do but tell her to move into her bar.


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## Wiserforit (Dec 27, 2012)

jmcdaniel05 said:


> I hope someone can help. My wife and I are in our third year of marriage now and things seem to be getting rocky. She has been working as a bartender for a little while now and has started to drink more which was no big deal. Well, now she has been going out with her friends three or four times a week. She'll get off at 1 a.m. and not be home until four or later. Now this isn't every week, but still we might only get one or two nights a week together which is nice when it happens. However, if I want to spend any time with her I have to be the one to come to her. If I want a kiss it has to come from me. Sex is down to like one or two times a month. Everytime I try to ask her to spend more time with me or show me more affection it just starts a fight and I get the feeling like she thinks I am being too clingy. Recently, I have tried to pull away from her a little hoping she would try to pull me back but it seems to be just as bad. Last night, I came home from work and she was in the bedroom and I said hey to her but then I just sat out in the kitchen until it was time to go to bed hoping she would ask me to come to lay with her or even ask me what I was doing or anything but I got nothing. It didn't even seem to bother her at all. When I got into bed I tried to talk to her about it and she said I was just trying to start another fight. She says she loves me but I don't feel it. She tells me that I am being ridiculous whenever I say anything and that I am reading into things when there is nothing there or I am being insecure. I don't know what to do. I feel like she is not even attracted to me anymore. Somebody please help!


Typical "blame the victim" behavior. Something is up, something seriously wrong. She doesn't want to say what it is, so she calls you insecure, clingy, overly suspicious, etc. for questioning her. That is the worst part of emotional or physical affairs: the mental abuse the cheating spouse heaps upon the victimized spouse. 

I'd say start the 180. Look below for it. Others are going to recommend the super secret spy program with the key logger, voice activated recorder, private eye or whatnot. 

Do you have full access to cell phone, email, facebook and all?


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## CuddleBug (Nov 26, 2012)

jmcdaniel05 said:


> I hope someone can help. My wife and I are in our third year of marriage now and things seem to be getting rocky. She has been working as a bartender for a little while now and has started to drink more which was no big deal. Well, now she has been going out with her friends three or four times a week. She'll get off at 1 a.m. and not be home until four or later. Now this isn't every week, but still we might only get one or two nights a week together which is nice when it happens. However, if I want to spend any time with her I have to be the one to come to her. If I want a kiss it has to come from me. Sex is down to like one or two times a month. Everytime I try to ask her to spend more time with me or show me more affection it just starts a fight and I get the feeling like she thinks I am being too clingy. Recently, I have tried to pull away from her a little hoping she would try to pull me back but it seems to be just as bad. Last night, I came home from work and she was in the bedroom and I said hey to her but then I just sat out in the kitchen until it was time to go to bed hoping she would ask me to come to lay with her or even ask me what I was doing or anything but I got nothing. It didn't even seem to bother her at all. When I got into bed I tried to talk to her about it and she said I was just trying to start another fight. She says she loves me but I don't feel it. She tells me that I am being ridiculous whenever I say anything and that I am reading into things when there is nothing there or I am being insecure. I don't know what to do. I feel like she is not even attracted to me anymore. Somebody please help!



I wouldn't be surprised if she is starting to see someone else......the signs are starting to show.

First of all, your wife shouldn't be working in a bar and as a bartender. That's recipe for disaster, all the hot guys in there, drunk, hitting on her, you are no were to be seen, you get the idea, just bad.

She gets off work at 1am? Then goes out with friends and gets back at 4am??? And you are married to her?

Bars, pubs, etc. are fine when you are single and looking to get action, but when married, no - no.

Like I said, I wouldn't be surprised if she is starting to see someone else.....be prepared for this. If she truly loved you, every chance she gets, she would be home with you. So, 1am she comes straight home!!!


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## JustSomeGuyWho (Dec 16, 2012)

CuddleBug said:


> I wouldn't be surprised if she is starting to see someone else......the signs are starting to show.
> 
> First of all, your wife shouldn't be working in a bar and as a bartender. That's recipe for disaster, all the hot guys in there, drunk, hitting on her, you are no were to be seen, you get the idea, just bad.
> 
> ...


Unfortunately I completely agree with this. Let me ask ... she gets off work at 1:00am because the bar is closed ... where does she go? All the other bars are closed too.


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## donny64 (Apr 21, 2012)

You need to stop pulling back as a manipulative effort. You're expecting fast results with a short term solution, and it's not working.

Pull back for the right reasons. Because she's not acting as a wife you're deserving of should, and as a result, you are going to prepare yourself to walk away from this if her behavior does not change.

Women aren't stupid. There's a huge difference between the "silent treatment" and sulking versus "pulling back". They will see the difference. You need to get yourself in the mindset you are truly "pulling back" and away from her, and preparing to detach from her. At the same time, you are bettering yourself for your own health and welfare, as well as to attract a new mate. Do THAT, and she will take notice...if she cares to. If she doesn't, well then bud, you are in a much better position to start a new life without her.

Get in THAT mindset, get THAT confidence, and she will likely take notice.


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## eric415 (Feb 11, 2013)

I'm the husband who allowed his wife to go out and drink with friends and not come home at a reasonable hour. Sex life went down the tubes and now discovered she's been having an affair for 1.5 years. The partying lifestyle is not something a married woman should be doing. Her behavior sounded a lot like mine. Time to set some boundaries. I never did and it cost me everything. Read no more me nice guy and do the 180. If you need help on tracking her and she has an iPhone, I have ideas. Pm me. Time to fight for your marriage while you may still have time.


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## donny64 (Apr 21, 2012)

:iagree: This. Eric has been there, and seen the results.

I also know of someone else close to me who is now going through the same thing. He has just moved out of his home, while his wife is off nailing some guy she met during "GNO" time. He can't "prove it" definitively yet, but ALL the red flags are there.

Married people have no business, with extremely rare exception, to be out that late for GNO or BNO. Happy hour and home by 10 is one thing. Coming home at 4 a.m. is COMPLETELY another. I don't care how late she works! She has days off...THOSE are the days for the occassional GNO or blowing off steam. NOTHING good is going to happen between midnight and 6 a.m. A person who is considerate of their spouse would NEVER put them in the position to even have to wonder. A once in a blue moon, pre-planned "stay over" at a buddies house, again, is one thing. An "I got too drunk and stayed at a friend's house" is completely another. If you're drunk, spend the $50 if it takes that much, grab a taxi, and carry your azz home. 

I go out for BNO happy hour one night every week. I am virtually NEVER home after 10, and certainly never after midnight. Even though the W says she's okay with it if I stay at my buddies house (it's a 50 plus mile trek for me to get home), I simply refuse to do that to her. And I'd most certainly not "be okay with it" if she did it to me. One time would get a serious "pull back" and some in depth investigation. And that's if...IF everthing is wonderful between us. She's refusing to kiss me, not showing affection, and we are having problems? One time is too many. Two times would have my azz out the door to let her have as many GNO's as she desired.

A big clue...a GNO or BNO that "runs over", and which also includes unanswered texts, phone calls, or a "battery died" dead phone....well, someone is "jumping the fence" and jumping somene else. NO EXCUSE for that....EVER. You get your azz home at a reasonable time, and should something happen and you don't, you'd better be jumping at the chance to answer that phone or text every single time my number comes up. Everyone has a cell phone, to include your "friend" you're staying with. Every single convenience store has $8 usb chargers. Get one and charge your damn phone. No excuse for being unreachable. And also no excuse for calling someone "controlling" or a pest because you're not home when you promised you'd be home and they're trying to reach you.

The times someone can legitimately be out past midnight, AND have a "dead phone" should be one in a million. A spouse, again, who loves and is considerate of their mate would understand and never put their mate in that chitty of a place. Not that you've encountered the "dead phone" thing yet, but when boundaries are so loose, it is usually the "next step" taken after late nights out which continue to be tolerated.

Funny how I would even like my W to go out a bit more (gives me some "me time"), and how I virtually NEVER call her to "check up on her" when she's out. Because I see it every single time she does go out with the girls, that she's in a rush to get back home to me. You KNOW when your woman loves you. You feel it in your gut. Just like you KNOW when something isn't right, and feel THAT in your gut. Listen to your gut.


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## donny64 (Apr 21, 2012)

BTW, if she has said you're being too "clingy", LISTEN TO HER. She doesn't like it, and she's warning you! She says you're "insecure". LISTEN TO HER. She is telling you exactly what you need to do to up her attraction for you. This is typically one time you can most certainly take what a woman says at complete face value (there is typically no double talk or sugar coating when a woman says this to a man). If she says this, it's because that is how she feels. This is not code for "leave me alone so I can screw around" like the "you're controlling" thing can sometimes be. If she says you're clingy or insecure, that is usually something a woman will never say to man who is not those things. Why? Because someone who is not those things would laugh at her and walk away if he was not clingy and was in fact secure. 

Stop being clingy. Stop being insecure. A quality woman simply DOES NOT LIKE THAT. Women who are trying to take advantage of doormat guys, or women who themselves are insecure and clingy like that. So STOP IT. Get an air of confidence about yourself. Be independent and not co-dependent. And reap the rewards of a woman who knows she has to be on her game and work to keep you. Don't fake it...be it.


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## Stonewall (Jul 5, 2011)

something is wrong here. Start snooping.


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## King Ding Dong (Feb 23, 2013)

Should be added to marriage vows, if your cell phone is dead, hightail your ass back home.


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## eric415 (Feb 11, 2013)

2 things

1 - trust your gut. I ignored mine and I get effed. Once I listened to it and followed up I found the truth. 

2 - Start reading No More Mr Nice Guy. It's about making you a better person so that your not insecure and clingy. I'm half way through and it's been a revelation.


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## Waking up to life (Nov 29, 2012)

Geez, I feel guilty staying out til 8 p.m. after work with my coworkers like twice a year. There is no way in hell that her staying out til 4 a.m. several times a week is normal or ok. She needs to grow up...she's not a single college girl any more. Wow dude, you have some major problems. You need to sit her down and explain to her that her choosing to hang out and drink with other people til 4 a.m. is unacceptable to you. She doesn't just "get" to have her own way like that. Don't let her dismiss you. Tell her she can either put on her big girl panties and have a meaningful conversation with you at home, or she can do it in a marriage counselor's office. If she chooses neither one, then inform her that she is choosing to end your marriage. Her choice.


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## Cubby (Mar 28, 2012)

My infidelity-meter started vibrating as I read the opening post. Classic 'there's-another-guy-in-the-picture' signs. Google 'signs my wife is cheating on me' and see how many apply to your situation. And don't think your wife is different, that she's not capable of doing that to you.

It's a big mistake to let your wife tend bar. Lots of drunk guys looking for chicks. Your wife's getting pummeled with attention, so the chances are great that whatever boundaries she has are going to erode in that environment.

First thing to do is to quietly investigate....no that's the second thing. First thing is to change your demeanor. No more neediness and clinginess. (Girls are repulsed by that) From now on you're firm, confident and strong. (Girls dig that) Now go into James Bond mode and find out the truth and document it. But don't let her know what you're doing and don't confront with your first couple of nuggets. Come here first with your findings and go to the Coping with Infidelity forum for first-rate advice.


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## Cubby (Mar 28, 2012)

Oh, and here's how to investigate: Look up cell phone records. Go online and open up an account. They'll have the detailed call records. Look for a number that's called often. Look at text records. If possible, grab her phone. If there's suspicious activity, get a VAR (voice activated recorder) and velcro under her car seat.

It could be though, that all the inappropriateness is going on at the bars. Do you have a trusted friend that could drop in and watch her?


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## jmcdaniel05 (Mar 3, 2013)

Ok guys look, I made it sound a little worse than it is. We do have three kids and I am 26 she is 25. I feel I need to add though that last year from about October through December we were basically split up she said we were not talking enough anymore and I was kind of to stubborn to fight for her. We wanted to wait til after the holidays to get a divorce for the kid's sake. Anyway I guess it was the Christmas spirit or something but she asked if we could work it out, so we did. We got back together and now I love her more than ever before. She does give affection back when I show it to her. I do feel the love when she says it and we're together. I know enough to know that she's not cheating and she does not go out as often as it sounds, but I work during the day and she works at night on the weekends. Sometimes a few days during the week. We had a great day together today and we talked last night. She says that it is going to take some time for her to get back to where things used to be even though I thought we were past all of that. I have looked at her cell phone and there is never anything there but calls and texts from friends. I have went to the bars also when she is out and she is always just hanging out with her friends. Like I said I know she's not cheating not saying that she might not be enjoying attention from other guys but she does usually tell me what happened or different things.


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## King Ding Dong (Feb 23, 2013)

Just sayin, looking at the phone by itself is not good enough. She can delete individual items. Must compare to to the detailed bill. Look for holes. Some phones like the iPhone show deleted messages in the backup. 

Sounds like you completely trust her with it now. So what's the issue? 

Your gut?


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## Machiavelli (Feb 25, 2012)

That's a good boy, just go back to sleep now.


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## JustSomeGuyWho (Dec 16, 2012)

jmcdaniel05 said:


> Ok guys look, I made it sound a little worse than it is. We do have three kids and I am 26 she is 25. *I feel I need to add though that last year from about October through December we were basically split up she said we were not talking enough anymore and I was kind of to stubborn to fight for her. We wanted to wait til after the holidays to get a divorce for the kid's sake. *Anyway I guess it was the Christmas spirit or something but she asked if we could work it out, so we did. We got back together and now I love her more than ever before. She does give affection back when I show it to her. I do feel the love when she says it and we're together. I know enough to know that she's not cheating and she does not go out as often as it sounds, but I work during the day and she works at night on the weekends. Sometimes a few days during the week. We had a great day together today and we talked last night. She says that it is going to take some time for her to get back to where things used to be even though I thought we were past all of that. I have looked at her cell phone and there is never anything there but calls and texts from friends. I have went to the bars also when she is out and she is always just hanging out with her friends. Like I said I know she's not cheating not saying that she might not be enjoying attention from other guys but she does usually tell me what happened or different things.


Uhmmm ... you were split up and going to divorce because you weren't talking enough anymore .... with 3 kids?

Ok, we'll be here when you come back.


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## See_Listen_Love (Jun 28, 2012)

jmcdaniel05 said:


> Ok guys look, I made it sound a little worse than it is.


No, if it is true what facts you gave, it sounds very clear.

You are the needy person, once or twice a month sex, asking for her attention.

That with a drinking, GNO, late home type of girl.

I do not need to repeat parts of your original post, because all of it is screaming in loud colors the standard situation you see so much here.

You are the backup plan, the doormat. The ultimate beta. Sorry.


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## Holland (Aug 20, 2012)

jmcdaniel05 said:


> I hope someone can help. My wife and I are in our third year of marriage now and things seem to be getting rocky. She has been working as a bartender for a little while now and has started to drink more which was no big deal. Well, now she has been going out with her friends three or four times a week. She'll get off at 1 a.m. and not be home until four or later. Now this isn't every week, but still we might only get one or two nights a week together which is nice when it happens. However, if I want to spend any time with her I have to be the one to come to her. If I want a kiss it has to come from me. Sex is down to like one or two times a month. Everytime I try to ask her to spend more time with me or show me more affection it just starts a fight and I get the feeling like she thinks I am being too clingy. Recently, I have tried to pull away from her a little hoping she would try to pull me back but it seems to be just as bad. *Last night, I came home from work and she was in the bedroom and I said hey to her but then I just sat out in the kitchen until it was time to go to bed hoping she would ask me to come to lay with her or even ask me what I was doing or anything but I got nothing.* It didn't even seem to bother her at all. When I got into bed I tried to talk to her about it and she said I was just trying to start another fight. She says she loves me but I don't feel it. She tells me that I am being ridiculous whenever I say anything and that I am reading into things when there is nothing there or I am being insecure. I don't know what to do. I feel like she is not even attracted to me anymore. Somebody please help!


Nothing will improve if you behave like this. Hoping she would come out to you, what were you thinking? She was in the bedroom, why didn't you just make a move on her then and there?

I hate to say this, makes me cringe but seriously you need to _man up_ mate.


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## Kaboom (Feb 6, 2013)

Ok, I've been cheated on. I've been through it all, the extreme jealousy, rage, the worry of not knowing, the snooping, stalking, you name it, I've done it.

And none of it was worth it.

Many people tell me I'm "brutally honest", because I am. I don't beat around the bush. I don't snoop. I look at the facts, the red flags, the big picture, and I confront.

To the OP: Your wife has clearly embraced the single lifestyle. There's no questioning it, there's no denying it, your own statements paint that as absolute fact. She's going out after work 3-4 nights a week. She's most likely saying she's with her friends, but it's pretty clear she's probably going to some dude's house or seeing someone in some fashion.

Does she tell you who she was with? What she did? If you want to snoop, forget the key loggers and phone trackers, etc.. it doesn't matter. That just peoples own narcissism and morbid curiousity for the details. Details shouldn't matter. If she's lying to you, and cheating on you.. why on earth would the details matter? I'll tell you why.. because you want it to work SO BAD, that you want to know every possible detail to try and find a way to minimalize the offenses and make sense of it (not YOU per se, but people who snoop), when the big picture is that she's cheating, lying, and making a fool of you.

Just approach one of her girl-friends, one that she was supposed to be out with the night before.. and ask them point blank, what they did, where they went, and if she's cheating on you.. the delay in the answer, the aversion of the eyes.. will tell you everything you already know.

You are nothing more to her than a security blanket.. you replaced her parents in her eyes. Someone to take care of her food and shelter needs so she can selfishly go out and party and do what she wants.. with no consideration for you or your feelings. Do these things:

Find out. Full frontal assault, don't accuse her, tell her you KNOW. Let her confess the rest.
End it. Kick her out or leave.
Get a lawyer and a divorce immediately. She's already gone, you are a fool to try to stay and make it work.


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## Plan 9 from OS (Jul 13, 2012)

jmcdaniel05 said:


> Ok guys look, I made it sound a little worse than it is. We do have three kids and I am 26 she is 25. I feel I need to add though that last year from about October through December we were basically split up she said we were not talking enough anymore and I was kind of to stubborn to fight for her. We wanted to wait til after the holidays to get a divorce for the kid's sake. Anyway I guess it was the Christmas spirit or something but she asked if we could work it out, so we did. We got back together and now I love her more than ever before. She does give affection back when I show it to her. I do feel the love when she says it and we're together. I know enough to know that she's not cheating and she does not go out as often as it sounds, but I work during the day and she works at night on the weekends. Sometimes a few days during the week. We had a great day together today and we talked last night. She says that it is going to take some time for her to get back to where things used to be even though I thought we were past all of that. I have looked at her cell phone and there is never anything there but calls and texts from friends. I have went to the bars also when she is out and she is always just hanging out with her friends. Like I said I know she's not cheating not saying that she might not be enjoying attention from other guys but she does usually tell me what happened or different things.


I don't care if she only stays out until 4 am with "friends" only once a month. But something is up. Does she tell you where she went, who she spent that time with and what she was doing? NO? Then you have a big problem. 

If I were you, I'd make having your wife quit working as a bartender as a condition for you two reconciling. This is a terrible job to have for a married couple with kids. What type of place does she work at? An old man's bar, nightclub, sports bar, other?


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## Kaboom (Feb 6, 2013)

jmcdaniel05 said:


> Ok guys look, I made it sound a little worse than it is. We do have three kids and I am 26 she is 25. I feel I need to add though that last year from about October through December we were basically split up she said we were not talking enough anymore and I was kind of to stubborn to fight for her. We wanted to wait til after the holidays to get a divorce for the kid's sake. Anyway I guess it was the Christmas spirit or something but she asked if we could work it out, so we did. We got back together and now I love her more than ever before. She does give affection back when I show it to her. I do feel the love when she says it and we're together. I know enough to know that she's not cheating and she does not go out as often as it sounds, but I work during the day and she works at night on the weekends. Sometimes a few days during the week. We had a great day together today and we talked last night. *She says that it is going to take some time for her to get back to where things used to be even though I thought we were past all of that*. I have looked at her cell phone and there is never anything there but calls and texts from friends. I have went to the bars also when she is out and she is always just hanging out with her friends. Like I said I know she's not cheating not saying that she might not be enjoying attention from other guys but she does usually tell me what happened or different things.


The bold part screams 'affair'. Anyone can delete specific texts and call logs in a matter of seconds, probably when she gets in her car to come home. There's a lot of red flags in your posts, too many to ignore. Maybe things are different as you say, but in my experience.. if it walks like a duck.. 

And believe me, I KNOW what it's like to want to go out and party.. I have a child, I'm in my mid-life crisis. I feel bad when I go out drinking with the guys (4-6x a month roughly), and I am 100% transparent with my wife about it- she knows where I am and who I'm with. But more than that, I give her 5x the attention when I'm around to make up for it. That lets her know that I'm not doing it because I want out, but that I'm exploring MY social life. I encourage her to go on GNO's as well, but she's a hausfrau, in the sense that she just prefers to stay at home and read a good book. She's understanding that I go out, and I even flirt and stuff, but it's all innocent and she doesn't get any rejection from me. That's where your wife is different. She's keeping you at arms length, and not taking you into consideration at all. The red flags speak for themselves.


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## CuddleBug (Nov 26, 2012)

Kaboom said:


> Ok, I've been cheated on. I've been through it all, the extreme jealousy, rage, the worry of not knowing, the snooping, stalking, you name it, I've done it.
> 
> And none of it was worth it.
> 
> ...


You sound like me. :iagree:


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## Kaboom (Feb 6, 2013)

CuddleBug said:


> You sound like me. :iagree:


It's sad really. I've become cynical, un-affectionaite, unromantic, and jaded. I don't wear it on my sleeve, I come off as a normal and laid back guy, but when the testing, red flags, bs meter happens, I get colder than alaska in mid winter and drive straight to the point. I don't put up with any BS like that ever again. I guess in that regard, I kinda-sorta understand women in the sense of why they can become so cold and heartless in an instant.


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## Code-Welder (Dec 17, 2012)

jmcdaniel05 said:


> Ok guys look, I made it sound a little worse than it is. We do have three kids and I am 26 she is 25. I feel I need to add though that last year from about October through December we were basically split up she said we were not talking enough anymore and I was kind of to stubborn to fight for her. We wanted to wait til after the holidays to get a divorce for the kid's sake. Anyway I guess it was the Christmas spirit or something but she asked if we could work it out, so we did. We got back together and now I love her more than ever before. She does give affection back when I show it to her. I do feel the love when she says it and we're together. *I know enough to know that she's not cheating* and she does not go out as often as it sounds, but I work during the day and she works at night on the weekends. Sometimes a few days during the week. We had a great day together today and we talked last night. She says that it is going to take some time for her to get back to where things used to be even though I thought we were past all of that. I have looked at her cell phone and there is never anything there but calls and texts from friends. I have went to the bars also when she is out and she is always just hanging out with her friends. *Like I said I know she's not cheating *not saying that she might not be enjoying attention from other guys but she does usually tell me what happened or different things.


Sadly you are not thinking clearly. Your first post was a more clear thinking expression of what is happening. I did not think my wife would cheat or was cheating, I was fooled too.

There is a problem in your marriage and my only suggestion is both of you see a good councilor together or you see one alone. I think one session with a good councilor will open your eyes to your reality.


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