# Never KNEW she was unhappy!???



## Sandy55 (Jun 3, 2009)

RW said in a thread (sorry RW, am using this as an example, and didn't want to hijack your thread....): "_She tells me I never showed her enough affection until everything comes crashing down and she's right. I don't realize things until the 11th hour and it has been a curse of mine not just in this relationship_."


THIS is a *continual *refrain from spouses, especially males. AFTER the marital roof has fallen in!

Can some men on here (and females if this has been the case) explain to me why this happens, why do men seem to not pick up on cues, is it that we women repeat our issues so much, it is like a stuck record? Do we come across with empty threats? Are you simply not aware or in denial? WHAT is it about men that they do not LISTEN until the world falls in on them???

Enlighten me, PLEASE! I am a wife who begged and pleaded, wrote letters, emails, and my dh just was like, when I filed for divorce, he ACTUALLY sat on the stand and told the JUDGE: "I had no clue she was unhappy with me!" 

WTF is THAT? (Obviously I've not managed to resolve this issue in my head...:rofl:)


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## Blanca (Jul 25, 2008)

My H does the same thing. i continually, and repeatedly tell him that im miserable on a daily basis because of the lack of sex. he stands there and says, 'oh i didnt know.' 

i think its because he's honestly ok with how things are so he forgets. and i dont walk around like a zombie all the time so i guess the only time he's reminded is when i bring it up. 

I told him this weekend that i wasnt going to bring it up again. and that one day im going to leave and he's going to stand there and wonder why im so upset.


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## Feelingalone (Apr 22, 2009)

Sandy, you know it is not "especially males". You were doing all of thiose things (I wish my w did all of those things), but most don't go to those lengths.

When someone is their own world they are in their own world. Thinking if only this would happen or that, that it would be all okay. You think it is just another day after word because I don't believe people keep pushing. People just let it go after a while and then it erupts again and the letters, the talks, etc. happen. If someone would continue unending then it would push it so fast as this message board wouldn't be needed. People would just have it out.

It is no ones fault, it just happens. That is what i think. Of course I'm a dumb idiot who didn't hear it.


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## Richard Ward (Aug 4, 2009)

I'm still searching for my own answer to that question. I'm horrible at showing emotion and think I have some strange mental block sometimes when it comes to dealing with bad situations. One argument would "wake" me up and I would acknowledge it and know what I needed to do, what we needed to do. Then I would try to proceed with the good times and push forward without actually resolving the issues that started the conflicts.

I don't know why I do it and for the longest time I didn't realize that I may have a problem because it didn't just start recently, and it didn't just start with my current relationship.

I guess I can only explain it like this: Most women (and men) don't want to be in a slump forever, so they live and let live. Unfortunately it takes a brick wall and a Mack truck to make me realize that things aren't going well and I'm always late to catch that bus.

I mean well, and have a good heart full of love. I just lack a lot of common sense sometimes and putting 2 and 2 together escapes my mind.


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## voivod (Aug 7, 2008)

Sandy55 said:


> RW said in a thread (sorry RW, am using this as an example, and didn't want to hijack your thread....): "_She tells me I never showed her enough affection until everything comes crashing down and she's right. I don't realize things until the 11th hour and it has been a curse of mine not just in this relationship_."
> 
> 
> THIS is a *continual *refrain from spouses, especially males. AFTER the marital roof has fallen in!
> ...


because we're not so good at translating your "cues". no two women have the same set of "cues."

used straightforward language. say what you mean and mean what you say. if it's about the money i'm spending, tell me _that._ don't bust my a$$ over the "wrong" trash bags (true story).


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## sisters359 (Apr 9, 2009)

No, we can be very explicit and STILL get no response or something half-assed and temporary. I know that in at least 2 cases (mine and my sister's), our husbands said they didn't know we were so unhappy b/c we "didn't scream and cry about it." WTF? If you love someone, you listen to what is important to them and you make an effort, consistently and whole-heartedly. Will you fu*k up sometimes? Sure, but the pattern will be positive so the mistakes will be exceptions, not the rule. 

I don't care how much he says he loves me, if his actions don't demonstrate that, I don't feel loved. And don't anyone give me the "Five Languages of Love" stuff, either. Listening and responding is pretty essential in a loving relationship, whether it is about sex, household chores, finances, or whatever. Grown people would often rather choose to be alone than stuck with someone who does not care ENOUGH to listen and respond. Pretty simple, if you ask me.


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## voivod (Aug 7, 2008)

sisters359 said:


> No, we can be very explicit and STILL get no response or something half-assed and temporary. I know that in at least 2 cases (mine and my sister's), our husbands said they didn't know we were so unhappy b/c we "didn't scream and cry about it." WTF? *bet you screaming and crying wouldn't make anything clear*If you love someone, you listen to what is important to them and you make an effort, consistently and whole-heartedly. Will you fu*k up sometimes? Sure, but the pattern will be positive so the mistakes will be exceptions, not the rule.
> 
> I don't care how much he says he loves me,*great 'tude* if his actions don't demonstrate that, I don't feel loved. And don't anyone give me the "Five Languages of Love" stuff, either.*then put your fingers in your ears and say lalalala..i can't heeeeaarrr you* Listening and responding is pretty essential in a loving relationship, *as is communicating straight forward*whether it is about sex, household chores, finances, or whatever. Grown people would often rather choose to be alone than stuck with someone who does not care ENOUGH to listen and respond. *grown people don't live by the my way or the highway ultimatum either*Pretty simple, if you ask me.


attitudes like that leave gigantic margin of error. congrats. you win.


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## Sandy55 (Jun 3, 2009)

voivod said:


> say what you mean and mean what you say. if it's about the money i'm spending, tell me _that._ don't bust my a$$ over the "wrong" trash bags (true story).


I BET it was something like my paper towels and paper plates story/fights. 

DH uses paper towels and paper plates - all the time. He grew up with a family that used many. They still do. DH still does.

When I met DH I NEVER used paper towels OR paper plates. I grew up with a family of EIGHT kids and not very well off, so those were luxury items in my mind.

DH and I when we first got married had HUGE issues when he'd come home with paper plates, and paper towels and USE them like they were nothing! Well, I was just out of my mind, because EVERY single paper plate that got used and thrown away *all I could hear was "cha-ching!*". MONEY WASTED!

It was awful! My dh thought I was nuts. But my parents had NO money for milk let ALONE paper towels and paper plates!

Oh, we have BUNCHES of me being the penny pincher and him being the spend thrift issues! Even when he'd say: "Well I make XYZ amount of money!". ALL I'd think is "WOW, look how much money I could be packing away in a savings account..."

I'd never used paper towels, paper plates, ZIP lock bags, the list goes on and on.

So you can IMAGINE how I felt when he bought me a ROLEX on our HONEYMOON. I had to practically swallow my tongue not to say: "BUT DH! If we invested that money, we could put new shingles on the house in ten years...." :rofl::rofl::rofl:


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## Sandy55 (Jun 3, 2009)

Richard Ward said:


> I'm still searching for my own answer to that question. I'm horrible at showing emotion and think I have some strange mental block sometimes when it comes to dealing with bad situations. One argument would "wake" me up and I would acknowledge it and know what I needed to do, what we needed to do. Then I would try to proceed with the good times and push forward without actually resolving the issues that started the conflicts.
> 
> I don't know why I do it and for the longest time I didn't realize that I may have a problem because it didn't just start recently, and it didn't just start with my current relationship.
> 
> ...


THIS post is exactly WHY I _*keep trying*_ with my own DH! Because he said these nearly exact same things to me several times over the last 15 years. 

I do believe it is a man thing, and the reason I think this is that it has some primordial beginning. IF a MAN were to pick up on every little nuance like a woman, then HE would not be able to FOCUS on the very stressful TASK of protecting and bringing home the bacon (hunt down, trap meat). I KNOW it sounds corny and some will say "Well, we are not in the stone age anymore Sandy..." BUT if you will notice WOMEN pick up and remember all sorts of cues and can see a global view of EVERYTHING surrounding her...and I think this is because women have to "read" her environment, to hide and protect herself (stone age, primordial...) her young and understand babies who do NOT speak. 

I know, probably a dumb theory...but I think has some validity.

THIS is why we men and women need to be supportive and understanding of faults...esp those we see repeated from man to man, time and time again!


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## Amplexor (Feb 13, 2008)

Great query Sandy

I fall into that category and it nearly cost us our marriage. There is a lot of psycho-babble that is out there on that subject but one that carries a little weight for me is that many men tend to have a fight or flight mentality when it comes to conflict. When it comes to our spouses the flight manifests itself in withdrawal and denial. Withdrawal to get away from the issues and denial to tell ourselves everything will work out in the end. When one spouse withdraws, after a time, the other will too. Since you have both withdrawn, there is little conflict. Arguments that then arise in the marriage are about little unimportant issues (Pick up your socks! I hate it when you dry your pantyhose on the shower door!) and not the core issues. In our case my wife had simply given up in trying to tell me I was not meeting her emotional needs. We both work and are raising our kids and I have always pulled my weight around the house. Cooking, cleaning,…. I did those things very well and thought I was being a great husband but…..that wasn’t what she needed. My wife’s need (love language) is quality time not acts of service. Emotions fell off, intimacy fell off, sex fell off, communication fell off…. But for my part I just thought we were in a rut and things would work out in the end. I felt that because our marriage had been so good for so many years it would fix itself. Fatal mistake. My wife fell into an online then telephone EA and disconnected from me. I was completely blind sided and only then did I really look at the marriage and what had happened to it over the previous few years. So to men and women both, when your spouse tells you that there is something wrong, something missing, feels unfulfilled….listen and make a real effort to look at yourself, your spouse and your marriage and address it early on. My wife and I are still together but I wished I had addressed the issues when she first tried to tell me. It would have been a hellofalot easier road to travel. My $.02


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## voivod (Aug 7, 2008)

Sandy55 said:


> I BET it was something like my paper towels and paper plates story/fights.
> 
> DH uses paper towels and paper plates - all the time. He grew up with a family that used many. They still do. DH still does.
> 
> ...


omg sandy...

the trash bag saga is like yours sorta in reverse.

when beth was a youngster, her family was pretty poor. they would buy stuff based on price rather than value. so she got the shoes that wore out quicker, the cheap bike that broke, etc. then when we were together in the beginning, i made zilch (early in radio career. you'd be embarrassed to find out that entry level dj's make like 1000 bucks a month!) and we lived in a tiny one bedroom apartment, drove a 1500 dollar car, scrimped but never saved.

then, ten years in, i hit it relatively big. 110k/year. but i was used to buying cheap stuff. that's what we did to get buy. so one afternoon bethie asked me to go to target and pick up some trash can liners. so i get there and start price shopping. found the cheapies, bought em. never thought twice about it.

i get home with 'em, beth tries to put one in the pantry trash can, it tears, and she flips out. really. of course me in those days was ultra-defensive. i argued. it escalated to a full blown shouting match.

that's my reference point. whew!


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## JDPreacher (Feb 27, 2009)

Well, most men are dense...that's just easy.

But, in defense of my species, there is way too much hinting, giving clues, too much dependence on offering cues...not enough direct information. Men are busy thinking about money, cars, sex, drugs, rock&roll, whatever...and we often just miss the obvious.

So, make it more obvious to us...instead of giving clues, cues and boo-hoos...just be direct and up front...

Preacher


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## Richard Ward (Aug 4, 2009)

I'm seeking professional help on why I'm unable to effectively listen to my Wife and also remember things in general (not just what she says). She bawked at the idea of us both going to a "shrink" (I said Relationship Coach) and insisted I need the help. I have a feeling that she thinks I may be a little crazy and she's just perfect.

I know I need the help, but I have a feeling it may not be to benefit our relationship... I was really taken aback by her shock and comments and she came off calling me, without saying it, a nut case. Kinda hurt, but we'll see.


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## Sandy55 (Jun 3, 2009)

Richard:

Wow. My dh has called ME a nut case too! :rofl: He also says I am the ONLY one who needed counseling. Let me tell you a secret, if someone thinks they DON'T need counseling, RUN! :rofl: Those are the scary people, to me. A person who can't see they may have a few parts to oil :rofl: needs a tune up!

Amp: Great post.

V: We also did the trash bag thing! Even the can in the pantry! :rofl: It was ME who went to get trashbags and I price shop too, at times, so I got those generic bags. DH pulled one out of the box and went to shake it out to line the can and it blew a freakin' hole in the bottom! He turns around and looks at me and says:

"Nice going, bag lady". He was referring to my cheap tendencies when it comes to scrimping cash....:rofl:

I should have replied: "Glad I could help, Nut Job". :rofl:


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## Richard Ward (Aug 4, 2009)

Sandy55 said:


> Richard:
> 
> Wow. My dh has called ME a nut case too! :rofl: He also says I am the ONLY one who needed counseling. Let me tell you a secret, if someone thinks they DON'T need counseling, RUN!


Really? The way she put it... it made me feel really bad, like I'm a dumb #@$^* or something but she first suggested this. Maybe if I called it marriage consulting it would've gone over better but she said she didn't need to see a shrink and really took offense to it. It hurt me a lot, like more than I'm even willing to admit, that I'm going to see help for my problems but she thinks she has zero problems and it really resinates how I feel that everything is my fault. Very sad indeed. I really wanted her to do this with me, together.


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## boz (Jul 14, 2009)

"Can some men on here (and females if this has been the case) explain to me why this happens, why do men seem to not pick up on cues, is it that we women repeat our issues so much, it is like a stuck record? Do we come across with empty threats? Are you simply not aware or in denial? WHAT is it about men that they do not LISTEN until the world falls in on them???"

Hi all - I have been in this situation quite recently. I found out about 2-3 months ago that my wife wasn't happy (which led to her having an affair for about 5-6 months prior). Strange thing is that I knew there was something wrong from about a year ago...

My wife was becoming distant, there was more belligerence towards me, simple conversations became a 'I can top that...', sex life became virtually non-existent, etc. So there were a lot of signals which I did see. But ignored...

I ignored many of these signals because to me our life hadn't changed. However, she was changing. We had a 1.5 year old at the time, so my wife was finding independence again (i.e. she was leaving him at day care the odd day, it was easier to get out with him and 'have a coffee' with him if that is what she wanted). She also needed to get affirmation external from the relationship - it wasn't enough that I thought she was beautiful, she needed to get that from others. Prior to our son she was in a job role where she got that sort of 'flirtation' from her co-workers (all innocent at that stage). And I believe her life which was consumed with our son now had 'space' for her mind / life to wander and she changed.

So the signs were there. And I ignored them. Actually, probably better to say that I didn't know what they meant or how to deal with them. I always thought things will be better soon - she will come out of it... After coming on here though I now realise that these are very common signs and I only wish I knew what these signs meant. My wife was unhappy in our relationship. It would have been far easier to repair our relationship a year ago when these signs started to appear then now.

In short, I saw the signs, didn't understand. But it is clear that these signs are common, and I only wish I knew about them before. But then again, why would I know about them before if I went into the relationship in good faith that things will be good (i.e. why would I research 'how to know if your relationship is going sour).

Good question...


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## dobo (Jun 30, 2009)

My husband seems to have learned an awful lot by his ex- leaving him. He's the most attentive, tuned-in guy I've ever met. Hard to believe he wasn't like this last time out. But he wasn't.

The truth is, some people just don't WANT to put in the effort to learn the skills necessary. Richard is doing a wonderful thing by going to counseling on his own. And even if his wife is being a little less helpful than she could, I bet she'll benefit if she will allow Richard to grow. But she may not realize that she has a motivation to want things to stay the same and she's unconsciously trying to derail his efforts. If he changes, she's going to have to change, too and that's tough to do! She'll have to admit her failings as he becomes more conscious of his actions and her responses. Maybe Richard could try compassion when she's so obviously defensive. She really might not be aware of her own fear or, she is aware but afraid of what might be required of her.


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