# Sex, in general, is depressing to me. How can I change?



## x2startermom (Jan 8, 2010)

Honestly, I really don't like sex. It feels like a chore to do it with my husband. This makes me feel sad because I know he enjoys it. When I do enjoy it, it is VERY (can't stress that enough) RARE. Out of the, guessing, 10 to 20 times during the course of our four years of marriage I've only enjoyed it MAYBE 2 to 5 times. 

It is EXTREMELY hard for my husband to please me. He doesn't know how hard it is. When I've told him the "correct path" to pleasing me he ends up doing what pleases him. If it's something I really want to do he tells me to earn it, which REALLY hurts. I have told him that it hurts when he says that.

As for masturbating, I don't like it because I end up crying myself to sleep. The way I view it is as fantasy/ies that will never come true. Porn just makes me physically ill for that reason too. 

In short sex, in general, is torture (not the good kind) to me. What can I do to change it? Would like to for my marriage and husband. Biggest reason is because I know we will be doing it next week and I want to enjoy my husband. My ultimate goal is not to get physically ill just thinking about sex.


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## relationshipscanwork (May 23, 2012)

Okay, I am sorry You have had an unpleasant sex life. I have been with my partner for 4 years and we have sex atleast 3 times a week by my choose ( I am the female and my boyfriend always please me).

Does it hurt you? Stress can cause your vaginal muscles to tighten to the point that it hurts to have sex. This might be part of the problem, take a long bath or shower and read or daydream or have a glass of wine. Anything that may help you relax.


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## PHTlump (Jun 2, 2010)

You should both go to a sex therapist.

Did I read you correctly that, over a four year marriage, you have had sex a total of 10-20 times? That's tragic. I'm not surprised, given how rare it is, for your husband to try to make it as good as possible for him. Maybe he's being passive-aggressive against you for limiting sex so much.

Basically, you need to have more sex. It is possible that more sex will raise your libido. And, if you need to, get a vibrator to use during sex. That may increase the quality enough for you to enjoy it.

Just spit-balling some ideas.

Good luck.


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## x2startermom (Jan 8, 2010)

I don't know why he does it, it could be that reason, PHTlump. My husband gets real irritated when I tell him to use the vibrator. I know this is a tragedy.

relationshipscanwork, it doesn't hurt at all. I've never been too keen on sex. Throughout my life I've done research on women and sex, still it has done little to none to help up my liking of sex.

I refuse to take pills, bad history with them. Never abused 'em but just don't like 'em.


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## J'Accused (May 12, 2012)

This is a subject that has ruined my marriage, my wife's avoidance of her sexual issues, seek help, sex with your husband should never be seen as a chore if it is you are heading towards splitsville maybe not tomorrow but eventually. Because he will get tired of having to cajole and twist the arm of an unwilling partner and eventually you will build a resentment towards him, I know because it happened to me. There must be attraction issues on your part, you must get in touch with what ignites your libido and if it is not your husband, DO NOT WASTE years of your lives trying to start a fire in a rainstorm. Remember this is the unique and defining factor in your relationship because this is the only person you are suppose to have sex with, so you have taken the first step, recognize the problem now take the next address the problem.


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## J'Accused (May 12, 2012)

But it also seems, from what you say, your husband has to listen to your needs too, seek an intimacy therapist


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## x2startermom (Jan 8, 2010)

I'll just call the local church and see if I can't get counseling there.


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## J'Accused (May 12, 2012)

Thats a good idea and start, may i ask what denomination you are as i am familiar with different religions attitudes toward sex


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

x2startermom said:


> I'll just call the local church and see if I can't get counseling there.


Do you really think that a church is going to help you with this?

You would benefit the most from a sex therapist. Since you have never really enjoyed sex there is a real issue with you and sex.

When your husband tells you to 'earn it'. What does he expect you to do to earn it?

Tell him you have earned it because you are filling his sexual needs, have been for a long time. So you want yours filled as well.

my ex told me once that he was not responsible for my orgasms. so the next time we were having sex, I just stopped in the middle and rolled over as if I was going to sleep. He complained alright. My response was that I was not responsible for his orgasms either. He got the point.


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## Cre8ify (Feb 1, 2012)

My wife and I both went through fire and brimstone Catholic school and I know for a fact i am still working that good girl modeling off my wife after 26 years. The church may not be your best answer, maybe find the best help possible rather than easy, available help. The stakes are high enough to warrant it. Everything about your relationship can expand and blossom after you enjoy an ongoing intimate connection.


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## J'Accused (May 12, 2012)

There are many Christian religions that realize that a healthy sex life is essential to a long lasting marriage, it depends on the role religion plays in the persons life, maybe op doesnt have access or resources to a profession intimacy therapist, even the Catholic church, which i was also raised in, is coming around, we should just ad-homonym reject the role religion can play in fixing this problem. but when OP uses torture as a description of sex with her husband intervention is needed


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

J'Accused said:


> There are many Christian religions that realize that a healthy sex life is essential to a long lasting marriage, it depends on the role religion plays in the persons life, maybe op doesnt have access or resources to a profession intimacy therapist, even the Catholic church, which i was also raised in, is coming around, we should just ad-homonym reject the role religion can play in fixing this problem. but when OP uses torture as a description of sex with her husband intervention is needed


I have been Catholic all my life. I don’t know why you say that the CC ‘is coming around’. It has always understood the importance of sex in a good marriage.

When we are suffering from physical and/or mental disorders we go to the right kind of doctor not the Church for treatment. The OP has some serious, deep seated issues that need a lot more than spiritual help.


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## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

Did you know you didn't particularly like sex before you got married?


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## Stonewall (Jul 5, 2011)

unbelievable said:


> Did you know you didn't particularly like sex before you got married?


From her description of his actions pursuant to her expressed needs during sex; I'm guessing she might actually like sex if he concentrated on pleasing her. 

It makes me sad to read these kinds of posts. Its so easy to have a good sex life if each just placed the spouse above themselves.


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## J'Accused (May 12, 2012)

Sorry Elegirl you are wrong I had 16 years of formal Catholics School education when it came to the sacrament of Vocation there were 3 allowable vocation, marriage, Clergy, Single Lay person, as specifically on the subject of sex, the cc, up until 90's reaffirmed that sex in marriage was for the explicit purpose of procreation and not for personal pleasure, until recently this has been there policy. You misconstrue everything, the mere sign the op is looking fo help and realizes there is a sexual dysfunctionality, maybe the OP doesnt have the resources to go out and hire Dr. Phil maybe her church can offer her some help, and did you read what my first suggestion was to her? you have to read with comprehension,


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## Cookie99 (May 21, 2012)

Starter mom

Sex in general. I wonder if most of us are not darn lucky to have fulfilling sex in a marriage in the first place. 

The statement of yours that you have to earn it to have sex like you want stunned me especially since your guy is masturbating. Thinking about it one of the reasons we are not having sex in our marriage is apparently through my actions I have rejected my wife since the start of our marriage in so many different ways so essentially I arrived at a point that I have not earned it. 

For better or worse we have ended up with worse. Being told you have to earn it must hurt really bad. So sorry for you! If my wife told me what she really wanted and needed it would just encourage me that much more not make me say well if she earns it ...at one point in our marriage. Now I just do not know if it would help but I would listen.

For your and my situation it seems some outside parties and counseling are all most essential. If your guy is key on this great for you two. If not, you are like me as my wife said no she does not need or want the outside counseling help with me. So at this point I am only concentrating on my flaws I have to work on and not concentrating on ours (hers).


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## x2startermom (Jan 8, 2010)

1st page people's questions:
Elegirl - Husband wants me to be more obedient. As for the church helping me, I don't have the finances to go to an intimacy therapist.

unbelievable - Yes, even before marriage I knew I didn't like it.


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## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

If you knew before you got married, you must have also known that sex was an expected part of marriage. How did you talk yourself into entering a marriage? Did you intend to "put up with" sex or maybe you believed your feelings about sex would somehow change after marriage. Sorry for being blunt, but this is one aspect that defies logic for me, that folks who know full well that they have little interest in sex willfully enter into marriage and predictably end up depriving their partners.


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## x2startermom (Jan 8, 2010)

unbelievable - Honestly I thought the more sex I had the more comfortable I'd feel with it.


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## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

So why is your husband getting laid only 5 times a year? Please forgive my bluntness, but judging only from your posts, it appears your intent wasn't followed by serious action. It appears you talked yourself and your husband into marriage and then you began pushing him away.


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## x2startermom (Jan 8, 2010)

Most of it is due to we've been separated for about 3 years. Mainly me living with his mom. Also we have never made time for it.


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## PHTlump (Jun 2, 2010)

You don't need a sex therapist yet. You've been married for four years, but separated for three. You each seem to resent the other. 

You have serious marital issues. I think you should go to a marriage counselor. If you your church offers this for little or no cost, then use that resource. Just keep in mind that counselors are like any other profession. There are good and bad counselors. If you get a counselor that one, or both, of you don't like, try to switch counselors.

You need to get your marriage on firmer ground while working on your sexual issues. They are intertwined.

Good luck.

P.S. As for your husband disliking your use of a vibrator, it's understandable, but childish. Tell him that no man's equipment can vibrate at 6000 rpm. So he's not particularly inadequate, so much as a human being with no attached accessories. And, if it can help you relax and enjoy sex more, you may have more sex. More sex just might get him over his objections pretty quickly.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

J'Accused said:


> Sorry Elegirl you are wrong I had 16 years of formal Catholics School education when it came to the sacrament of Vocation there were 3 allowable vocation, marriage, Clergy, Single Lay person, as specifically on the subject of sex, the cc, up until 90's reaffirmed that sex in marriage was for the explicit purpose of procreation and not for personal pleasure, until recently this has been there policy.* You misconstrue everything*, the mere sign the op is looking fo help and realizes there is a sexual dysfunctionality, maybe the OP doesnt have the resources to go out and hire Dr. Phil maybe her church can offer her some help, and did you read what my first suggestion was to her? *you have to read with comprehension*,


Your post is a boarderline personal attack on me. This is uncalled for.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

x2startermom said:


> Most of it is due to we've been separated for about 3 years. Mainly me living with his mom. Also we have never made time for it.


Ok, so this is some very important information that was not in the original post.

Why are you two not living together?


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## nader (May 4, 2011)

x2startermom said:


> unbelievable - Honestly I thought the more sex I had the more comfortable I'd feel with it.


From what you described, it sounds like you haven't tested this theory. Once or twice a week is a bare minimum for most healthy couples, unless neither of them like sex. 

He needs more opportunity to learn how to please you.. that takes practice. When you have sex with him, he's probably so happy to be getting anything from you at all that he doesn't know how to slow down and make it good for you too.

If he doesn't want to use the vib. on you, it's probably because it makes him feel incapable of pleasing you, which is a HUGE blow to any man's ego. A vib should be an extra tool or one of many flavors.. not a replacement for his ****/fingers/tongue. You guys just need more practice, and it will take lots of patience and communication from both of you. And it's something you will need to intentionally make time for, even if that means watching less TV or not staying out quite as late - or whatever it is you guys do instead of sex!

When you have sex, does he go down on you? If not, that would be a good start, but ideally you should be willing to do the same.

Being separated for that long, and moving in with his mom... but you're hoping to reconnect with him sexually? That sounds really really complicated. But it's likely he's incredibly disappointed and resentful at getting so little from you sexually, whether or not he's actually expressed that to you.


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## ocotillo (Oct 17, 2011)

EleGirl said:


> Tell him you have earned it because you are filling his sexual needs, have been for a long time. So you want yours filled as well.


You're an insightful participant and I make a point of reading what you write, but I'm lost...

How is sex once in 73 days at best fulfilling either of their needs?


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## x2startermom (Jan 8, 2010)

As for why we are not living together it is because of finances. He has never gone down on me, even though I have gone down on him NUMEROUS times. Actually I'm living with my folks. I do want to reconnect with him in all aspects of our life. The things we do instead of sex is taking care of our three kids.


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## J'Accused (May 12, 2012)

Ok, now we are starting to get more details, you have children, and have been physically separated, and have been somewhat endured mental emotional cruelty, and it seems like you u have financial issues and you wonder why sex isnt first and foremost on your mind? These issues are all interrelated. This is not a one person issue and it needs to be addressed for the future of you and your kids. But I would first ask yourself what is your 3 year plan, where do you want to be in 3 years and ask your husband the same and see if there is any compatibility.


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## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

If the primary purpose for having sex with your husband is for you to climax I can understand the disappointment. If you decided that a sexual "win" was a stronger marriage, a happier husband, and deeper intimacy, then every sexual encounter with your husband would be a success. People tend to do that which they are good at. It's hard to build intimacy once every couple or three months. I bet if the frequency was increased, your husband would settle down and pay closer attention to pleasing you.


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## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

The post below is wrong in every way. She has told him what she needs to enjoy sex and he refuses to do it. When he knows how to please her and refuses, and expects it to be all about him - that is incredibly selfish. Having more sex with a selfish HD partner is not going to change their behavior.






unbelievable said:


> If the primary purpose for having sex with your husband is for you to climax I can understand the disappointment. If you decided that a sexual "win" was a stronger marriage, a happier husband, and deeper intimacy, then every sexual encounter with your husband would be a success. People tend to do that which they are good at. It's hard to build intimacy once every couple or three months. I bet if the frequency was increased, your husband would settle down and pay closer attention to pleasing you.


_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## x2startermom (Jan 8, 2010)

I have no clue to where my husband sees us in three years. As for me right now I'd settle for a house, bought and paid for, and a car, B&P plus able to drive it. When I say able to drive it I mean legally, as I don't have permit or license.


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## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

A guy who hasn't been laid in 3-4 months isn't likely to perform like 007 in bed. If I hadn't had sex with my wife in 4 months and she handed me a vibrator, I probably would be all that receptive, either. Get the basic sex to something that resembles at least an acceptable minimum for human beings and then introduce the toys. The last thing this guy wants after being deprived for months is to be told his wife prefers a mechanical penis. If he's not getting laid but once every 3-4 months and he hasn't bailed, he's not entirely selfish.


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## cloudwithleggs (Oct 13, 2011)

J'Accused said:


> This is a subject that has ruined my marriage, my wife's avoidance of her sexual issues, seek help, sex with your husband should never be seen as a chore if it is you are heading towards splitsville maybe not tomorrow but eventually. Because he will get tired of having to cajole and twist the arm of an unwilling partner and eventually you will build a resentment towards him, I know because it happened to me. There must be attraction issues on your part, you must get in touch with what ignites your libido and if it is not your husband, DO NOT WASTE years of your lives trying to start a fire in a rainstorm. Remember this is the unique and defining factor in your relationship because this is the only person you are suppose to have sex with, so you have taken the first step, recognize the problem now take the next address the problem.


Hahaha my estranged husband would say things that pleasured me were a chore, i can understand why she doesn't want sex, i am HD but i don't want sex any more either, she needs to leave him.

The man is selfish, why on earth would anyone want to sleep with a selfish man.


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## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

She didn't like sex but got married anyway. Not sure if H knew he was marrying someone who loathed sex or not. The one who doesn't like sex gets 360 sex free days every year. The one who does like sex gets 360 days of sexual frustration every year. From this scenario, you have concluded that the sexually deprived party is selfish because he is reluctant to use a vibrator or perform oral sex? Her wishes don't get completely fulfilled 5 times a year and he's the bad guy?


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## x2startermom (Jan 8, 2010)

I think the main reason why I don't like sex is because I've RARELY had a good experience with it. Another reason would be I knew little to nothing about sex, minus pregnancy, when I was having sex. That includes premarital sex.


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## IAMCIV (Nov 8, 2011)

Am I getting this right, you say you've had sex 10-20 times in four years of marriage and have 3 kids?

It sounds to me like you like sex, or at least would like it but not with someone who isn't interested in your needs/desires.

You have fantasys, and say after masurbation you cry? :scratchhead: Sounds to me like if you were fulfilled you'd desire that more... Is that a correct assesment?


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## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

Unbelievable,
I understand that your current situation is very frustrating. And that these types of posts might cause you to "trigger". 

That said, I am going to make a very concise set of observations:
1. Surveys say that most women cannot O from intercourse
2. The OP said despite giving him a fair amount of oral - he has NEVER returned the favor
3. So he won't do oral and won't agree to use a vibrator

Because of this - the experience is consistently bad for her and yet she is supposed to learn to like it or just give it a lot anyway.





unbelievable said:


> A guy who hasn't been laid in 3-4 months isn't likely to perform like 007 in bed. If I hadn't had sex with my wife in 4 months and she handed me a vibrator, I probably would be all that receptive, either. Get the basic sex to something that resembles at least an acceptable minimum for human beings and then introduce the toys. The last thing this guy wants after being deprived for months is to be told his wife prefers a mechanical penis. If he's not getting laid but once every 3-4 months and he hasn't bailed, he's not entirely selfish.


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## Phenix70 (May 6, 2012)

You've been married for 4 years, but lived apart for 3 of them.
How is it you are even still married?
How often do you see one another & where do you see each other?


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## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

MEM11363 said:


> Unbelievable,
> I understand that your current situation is very frustrating. And that these types of posts might cause you to "trigger".
> 
> That said, I am going to make a very concise set of observations:
> ...


I guess I've just never lived in a world where I was free to quit participating if someone didn't blow my skirt up high enough. It would be wonderful if she had mind altering orgasms every time. Her husband should care enough to do whatever is in his power to give her great sex. How he's going to get good at batting if he only gets to the plate 4 times a year is a mystery. My vows mentioned each of us being faithful and pledging each other our troth. There was no escape clause which stated "unless she doesn't give you mind blowing orgasms." Some people aren't great lovers. Some people don't even like sex at all. Do the vows mean anything or don't they? My kids get fed when they're hungry, not when I just happen to be in the mood to cook. If someone was habitually neglecting my most basic need, I wouldn't be on fire to rock their world.


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## ScaredandUnsure (Nov 17, 2011)

Okay so she should have sex multiple times with a man who flat out refuses to meet her sexual needs and do what? Be happy with that? Except it? Realize that she won't have an orgasm with a selfish partner who won't listen to her needs, but is expected to have sex with him and meet his needs? He'd get good at pleasing her if perhaps he LISTENED to what she was saying, she might actually enjoy sex if she had a partner who LIKED to please her.


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## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

Unbelievable,
I honestly believe your mindset is the cause of many a sexless marriage. I am not saying it is the cause of your personal marital issues, simply that it is an approach that would cause many LD partners to shut down. I guess you and I agree totally on "expected result" and disagree completely on responsibility each partner has on achieving it. 

I don't think you are generally an extremist, on this topic it seems your anger is eroding a sense of balance and fairness. And likely not helping your sense of humor. Humor and wrestling can be the best foreplay in the world. 

My wife and I routinely banter about her "wifely duties" and like all good humor, it is based on truth. 
Me: darling, I believe I am going to ask you to perform your wifely duties tonight
Wife: making a face, "do I HAVE to"?
Me: cheer up, this close to 50 erectile dysfunction is just around the corner
Wife: you're just saying that in case I get fat and you lose your attraction to me, so you have a "ready made" excuse
Me: nope - when I get ED even my hot little 30 year old GF won't be able to get me properly hard
Wife: walking over to a kitchen drawer opening it and asking "babe have you seen the knife sharpener - I could have sworn I left it in here"

Of course the balance is what enables the humor. I have no anxiety about being "rejected" because she loves me enough to consistently make an effort to show me physical love. And she has no anxiety about me cheating despite her condition preventing intercourse. 




QUOTE=unbelievable;778296]I guess I've just never lived in a world where I was free to quit participating if someone didn't blow my skirt up high enough. It would be wonderful if she had mind altering orgasms every time. Her husband should care enough to do whatever is in his power to give her great sex. How he's going to get good at batting if he only gets to the plate 4 times a year is a mystery. My vows mentioned each of us being faithful and pledging each other our troth. There was no escape clause which stated "unless she doesn't give you mind blowing orgasms." Some people aren't great lovers. Some people don't even like sex at all. Do the vows mean anything or don't they? My kids get fed when they're hungry, not when I just happen to be in the mood to cook. If someone was habitually neglecting my most basic need, I wouldn't be on fire to rock their world.[/QUOTE]
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Your husband’s displeasure with using the vibrator is that it probably reinforces that he, himself cannot please you.

Does he expect you come from intercourse? That is not realistic since most women cannot do this. We are just not built in a way that the penis stimulates where needed. There are things that you can do during intercourse to help you come. Do you know how to do this?
Do you masturbate on your own? I’m just wondering if you have low sex drive or are just not comfortable with sex because you are inexperienced.

The counseling at Church can help on some level. But I still think you need sex therapy for yourself first. You might be able to find some help in books. I have one that has to do with helping a woman become more comfortable with herself and with sex. I’ll look for it and post the name of the book when I find it.

You are right with one thing. The more sex a woman has, the more they will want and enjoy it. Our hormones build with each sexual encounter making up want more. Men are different. Men just want sex.. most of the time. It’s interesting because the way our homones work, the man can basically set the woman’s level of sex drive based on the amount of sex he has with his partner.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

ocotillo said:


> You're an insightful participant and I make a point of reading what you write, but I'm lost...
> 
> How is sex once in 73 days at best fulfilling either of their needs?


I agree that they are not having sex often enough. But…… 
She is filling his needs at the moment they are having sex. He is not filling her needs while they are having sex.
How often would you have sex with a person if they refused to participate in bringing you to an orgasm?
While they are actually having sex she tells him how to please her and his response is that he’ll give her sexual pleasure (an orgasm) when she earns it. And he wants her to have sex again? Ain’t gonna happen often if at all. If at the time they are having sex, he would respond to what she asks for, then maybe she'd be more willing to have sex.

What I see are two people who are not willing to meet each other's needs. So they both hold back.

One of them is going to have to be the one to give in first is this marriage is going to work at all. She’s the one here so she’s the one who needs to give in first if she wants to fix what she is complaining about.

To do this she is going to have to have sex more often. Let him know that she’s up having it once or twice a week with the intent on increasing more after say 3 months. But she needs him to be more responsive to her needs.

Further, I believe from what x2startermom has some issues that she needs to work on by herself with her own sexuality. That’s why I have suggested that she look into material for sex therapy.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

x2startermom said:


> I think the main reason why I don't like sex is because I've RARELY had a good experience with it. Another reason would be I knew little to nothing about sex, minus pregnancy, when I was having sex. That includes premarital sex.


Another way to learn about sex and get more 'experience' is to watch porn.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

x2startermom said:


> I think the main reason why I don't like sex is because I've RARELY had a good experience with it. Another reason would be I knew little to nothing about sex, minus pregnancy, when I was having sex. That includes premarital sex.


What was missing to make these experiences not good?


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## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

MEM11363 said:


> Unbelievable,
> I honestly believe your mindset is the cause of many a sexless marriage. I am not saying it is the cause of your personal marital issues, simply that it is an approach that would cause many LD partners to shut down. I guess you and I agree totally on "expected result" and disagree completely on responsibility each partner has on achieving it.
> 
> I don't think you are generally an extremist, on this topic it seems your anger is eroding a sense of balance and fairness. And likely not helping your sense of humor. Humor and wrestling can be the best foreplay in the world.
> ...


_Posted via Mobile Device_[/QUOTE]

LD spouses aren't unusual and I'm hardly to blame for all of them. Whatever my mindset is, it didn't impact my present wife before we met but both her prior adult relationships turned into sexual deserts at her insistence. I've been living with, married to, and having sex with women over three decades. Not until my present relationship have I been with a woman who pushed me away. The woman has depression, bipolar, etc, etc. I didn't infect her with those ailments nor did I diagnose her. She didn't quit her career because my mindset but because she was too mentally ill to continue. The well is dry. There is nothing but dust on the bottom. It doesn't matter how I lower my bucket or how I feel about lowering my bucket. If my wife wasn't interested in having sex with just me, I might think you have a valid point. She's not interested in sex. With anyone or by herself. I realize I vent freely here. I don't lay this heavy crap on my wife. There'd be no point. She wouldn't be receptive in the slightest because empathy is another casualty of her illnesses. I didn't create the universe. I didn't inspire or write the Bible. I do read it. I don't believe marriage puts any sexual obligations on wives that don't also apply to husbands. The "rule" is that neither party refuses sex with the other except by mutual consent and only for a very limited time. If that position is extreme, God must be extreme because it's His instruction. I don't believe any marriage counselor would suggest that having sex 4 times a year is a great plan for a healthy marriage.


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## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

Un,
I honestly believe your integrity/commitment level is great. I also believe that your wife is seeking "the bottom" with you. Meaning she is carefully trying to gauge the minimum she can do and remain married. Ultimately this is your choice to make. My guess is that when your wife feels "safe/secure" she treats her partners very badly - hence her third round of sexually starving a man. 

I have never seen a situation improve when the man starts with: I will never divorce my wife over "list of very bad behavior" because I vowed to stay married for life. You strike me as chronically angry. I learned something very early in my marriage: when momma ain't happy...
I taught my wife something very early in our marriage: When poppa feels deprioritized, that warm blanket of financial, emotional and physical security begins to unravel

Your wife is never going to leave you. She can't or won't work and has convinced you she can't even make a bit of effort to alleviate your misery. Kind of interesting. The "sick" person has arranged a situation fully to their advantage while the healthy person is in an angry/accelerated aging state. 




unbelievable said:


> _Posted via Mobile Device_


LD spouses aren't unusual and I'm hardly to blame for all of them. Whatever my mindset is, it didn't impact my present wife before we met but both her prior adult relationships turned into sexual deserts at her insistence. I've been living with, married to, and having sex with women over three decades. Not until my present relationship have I been with a woman who pushed me away. The woman has depression, bipolar, etc, etc. I didn't infect her with those ailments nor did I diagnose her. She didn't quit her career because my mindset but because she was too mentally ill to continue. The well is dry. There is nothing but dust on the bottom. It doesn't matter how I lower my bucket or how I feel about lowering my bucket. If my wife wasn't interested in having sex with just me, I might think you have a valid point. She's not interested in sex. With anyone or by herself. I realize I vent freely here. I don't lay this heavy crap on my wife. There'd be no point. She wouldn't be receptive in the slightest because empathy is another casualty of her illnesses. I didn't create the universe. I didn't inspire or write the Bible. I do read it. I don't believe marriage puts any sexual obligations on wives that don't also apply to husbands. The "rule" is that neither party refuses sex with the other except by mutual consent and only for a very limited time. If that position is extreme, God must be extreme because it's His instruction. I don't believe any marriage counselor would suggest that having sex 4 times a year is a great plan for a healthy marriage.[/QUOTE]
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## x2startermom (Jan 8, 2010)

Pg 3-
IAMCIV - As for the kids and sex, yes. If my fantasies were being full filled, yes.

Phenix70 - The only thing I can think of why we are still married, is God. That's it. Beyond that I'm clueless. We see each other, MAYBE once a month. That is when I'm living with my parents and/or his.

EleGirl - He has told me that he has felt me come from intercourse, even though I emotionally haven't felt it. I have no clue how to climax from intercourse. Yes, I do masturbate on my own. The only thing I can think of that didn't make the experiences good was an emotional connections with the person.

Side Question - What does LD mean?


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## DTO (Dec 18, 2011)

x2startermom said:


> I have no clue to where my husband sees us in three years. As for me right now I'd settle for a house, bought and paid for, and a car, B&P plus able to drive it. When I say able to drive it I mean legally, as I don't have permit or license.


Okay, it seems a few more things are coming into focus:

I'm going to assume that with 3 kids, no car, and no license, you do not work. Further, I am going to assume that you depend on your husband (when you are together) to do all the driving and such that you could take care of during the day.

Your desire to have a home and another car bought and paid for within three years probably is unrealistic. Very few people make a salary which would allow that to happen within three years, and those that do probably endure jobs with a significant amount of stress. A more reasonable expectation is to have a car and license first (so that you can make more efficient use of your time) and a home with an affordable payment (mortgage or rent) within that time. Keep in mind that you have three kids to support, and want money to do stuff for yourselves as well.

Also, that your future goals are financial is telling as well. When the question was posed "where do you see yourself in three years" I expected an answer with more relationship orientation, like "connecting better", "living together as a family", "a mutually satisfying sex life". That your first answer was house and car paid for, and you have no idea what he wants, communicates to me that you prioritize yourself over him in this regard.

Honestly, my ex was heavily money oriented, and I found that extremely off-putting - to the extent that it was hard to care about what she wanted sometimes. You need to communicate to your husband that you appreciate your relationship first, then his fatherhood second, and then the paid for home and other financial stuff down the list.

You also need to ask him what he wants out of life, and find a way to meld that with yours. Let's say he says "I know about your need for financial security, but even if it were possible providing that would mean I have to work two jobs and I don't want labor to consume my life". What would you say then?


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## DTO (Dec 18, 2011)

cloudwithleggs said:


> Hahaha my estranged husband would say things that pleasured me were a chore, i can understand why she doesn't want sex, i am HD but i don't want sex any more either, she needs to leave him.
> 
> The man is selfish, why on earth would anyone want to sleep with a selfish man.


Really, she would "settle" for a house and car paid for in three years, plus support their three kids, and he's the apparently selfish one?


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## DTO (Dec 18, 2011)

Phenix70 said:


> You've been married for 4 years, but lived apart for 3 of them.
> How is it you are even still married?
> How often do you see one another & where do you see each other?


Exactly. How did they manage to conceive three children during one year of active marriage? Also, if the marriage is that bad, why are they still popping out kids?


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## DTO (Dec 18, 2011)

ScaredandUnsure said:


> Okay so she should have sex multiple times with a man who flat out refuses to meet her sexual needs and do what? Be happy with that? Except it? Realize that she won't have an orgasm with a selfish partner who won't listen to her needs, but is expected to have sex with him and meet his needs? He'd get good at pleasing her if perhaps he LISTENED to what she was saying, she might actually enjoy sex if she had a partner who LIKED to please her.


Actually, I think this is a bit exaggerated. I would say her attitude should be that she is _very_ demanding of him in her own way and needs to find a way to invest in him in a manner commensurate with what she wants to get from him.

In isolation, it's fine to want a nice home and car and be free from financial encumberance. In isolation, it's great that she wants a good sex life. I'm sure there are other things she wants. But, taking it all together, one must ask what she is willing to do to make him feel valued and wanted in some part of the relationship?


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## DTO (Dec 18, 2011)

EleGirl said:


> What I see are two people who are not willing to meet each other's needs. So they both hold back.
> 
> One of them is going to have to be the one to give in first is this marriage is going to work at all. She’s the one here so she’s the one who needs to give in first if she wants to fix what she is complaining about.


I might be reading too much into this, but I perceive a woman who is very demanding of her husband in other areas as well. If she complains about the sex, he might just feel that she is piling it on and he's being used. He might wonder in what area of the marriage does he get to be served by her in return?

I wonder what might happen if she were to simply step up the sex while working on the satisfaction issue? Or, if she were to pay more attention to him in other ways? The imprtant thing to keep in mind is that he needs to feel he is getting his at some point. If she is very demanding in one area (say, finance) then she needs to be just as selfless in some other area to maintain a sense of overall balance.


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## x2startermom (Jan 8, 2010)

What does HD and LD mean?

DTO - Thank you. As for what I would say, I don't know. Reason being we haven't been able to have a place of our own for more than about 5 months.


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## ScaredandUnsure (Nov 17, 2011)

DTO said:


> Actually, I think this is a bit exaggerated. I would say her attitude should be that she is _very_ demanding of him in her own way and needs to find a way to invest in him in a manner commensurate with what she wants to get from him.
> 
> In isolation, it's fine to want a nice home and car and be free from financial encumberance. In isolation, it's great that she wants a good sex life. I'm sure there are other things she wants. But, taking it all together, one must ask what she is willing to do to make him feel valued and wanted in some part of the relationship?


I don't see how it's a bit exaggerated at all. He refuses to go down on her, says she has to "earn" pleasure, and won't listen to her when she tells him what she likes. No I think it screams really loudly that he is a selfish partner who has absolutely no interest in his partners satisfaction. No wonder the woman doesn't enjoy sex, I sure wouldn't either. I'd choose a vibrator over a selfish lover too.


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## DTO (Dec 18, 2011)

x2startermom said:


> What does HD and LD mean?
> 
> DTO - Thank you. As for what I would say, I don't know. Reason being we haven't been able to have a place of our own for more than about 5 months.


HD means High Drive - the parther with the stronger sex drive

LD is the opposite of HD

I just wanted to clarify that there's nothing at all wrong with wanting your own place or financial stability. However, you want to guard against being overly demanding in an area for which your husband on his own cannot meet your need.

The way I view it is that being financially demanding is more taxing than being sexually demanding. The level of support you want either requires a large savings (accumulated over many years of hard work and sacrifice) or a very large income. If you make him feel that he is a means to achieve your need for security, he might turn around and in a sense see you as a means towards his sexual needs.


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## DTO (Dec 18, 2011)

ScaredandUnsure said:


> I don't see how it's a bit exaggerated at all. He refuses to go down on her, says she has to "earn" pleasure, and won't listen to her when she tells him what she likes. No I think it screams really loudly that he is a selfish partner who has absolutely no interest in his partners satisfaction. No wonder the woman doesn't enjoy sex, I sure wouldn't either. I'd choose a vibrator over a selfish lover too.


I think you might be missing my point. I do agree that he sounds like a selfish (or at least a demanding) lover.

But, sex does not exist in a vacuum. My assertion is that if the OP is demanding in her own way (i.e. financially) her husband might see sex as a way to "even it out", so to speak.

My advice to the OP is to communicate with him and set some joint goals that take into account his priorities and ability to provide. I would like to not see a dynamic where she takes, then he takes, and they both feel unappreciated and used.

If my ex had come to me and said "I expect to have, at a minimum, a fully paid house and fully paid car for me within three years" I would feel at least as used as the OP does regarding sex - if not more so - simply because of the effort needed to meet that expectation. While I am not a retribution type of guy, I can certainly see where someone would respond to this with a "two can play that game" mindset.


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## ocotillo (Oct 17, 2011)

EleGirl said:


> She is filling his needs at the moment they are having sex. He is not filling her needs while they are having sex.


I got a very different impression from the OP, but I'm probably wrong here.



EleGirl said:


> What I see are two people who are not willing to meet each other's needs. So they both hold back.
> 
> One of them is going to have to be the one to give in first is this marriage is going to work at all.


That's a fact that can't be emphasized strongly enough.


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## IAMCIV (Nov 8, 2011)

x2startermom said:


> Pg 3-
> IAMCIV - As for the kids and sex, yes. If my fantasies were being full filled, yes.
> 
> Phenix70 - The only thing I can think of why we are still married, is God. That's it. Beyond that I'm clueless. We see each other, MAYBE once a month. That is when I'm living with my parents and/or his.
> ...


Well if I was having one kid every five times I had sex, I don't think I'd like it very much either... just kidding, well wait, maybe not.

Oh and he shouldn't be telling you he felt you come, you should be telling him you came...

Your husband sounds like a very very selfish person. As a married man my wife's pleasure is one of my highest priorities. Its not hard to see why you find sex depressing. It's supposed to bring you two closer together, not allow him to deposit sperm inside you. Maybe he is so self conscience about his own ablities to please you that he doesn't care to know your desires? If he doesn't know what you desire, he won't fail as a lover...

It just seems like you should focus on your relationship first. If you don't know why you are together, then why would you be alaramed you don't enjoy sex with him? 

Marriage at times could just be a piece of paper, or a couple of rings? If you didn't have those items, you probably wouldn't desire sex with this person. Why do you think you should desire it because "you're married" but none of the other components of the relationship are there?


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## Inside_Looking_Out (Apr 8, 2012)

Maybe I am not interpreting what you have said correctly, but it seems to me that your husband suffers from a delusion that he is in more of a dom/sub type relationship than a marriage. You have used phrases like 'earn it' and he wants you 'to be more obedient'. Not having a car or being able to drive, staying pregnant even though finances obviously should be telling you to stop having kids!

All of this sounds akin to a couple that I am friends with. They have a dom/sub relationship and have for over a decade. He works, she stays home. She doesn't drive, have a phone or really much contact with the outside world. Do I get it? Nope, but it works for them, and she is happy with the lifestyle. She was mentally and physically abused as a child, and that has carried over into her inability to feel confident in making life decisions for herself. When someone else schedules and sets forth rules for her, she is happier and more confident. It's pretty extreme in their case, he plans when and what she eats, what chores she does throughout the day, what she wears and so on. 

It took a long time for me to be okay with being around it. One day I asked my friend (I am friends with him more than her) to explain it. He said that it wasn't really about 'power', it is more about him providing this to her to show her he care about her and that she is on his mind all the time. And she is, it's a constant responsibility that he must focus on. It's a huge amount of work, and she has to trust that he has her best interest in mind, and that he knows her well enough to know what will give her satisfaction and what will not. 

It sounds to me as though your husband wants all the dominance but is not willing to put forth the effort, the care and the nurturing that makes that kind of life a mutually satisfying lifestyle. 

If that is the case, then that is not a dom/sub relationship, that is not a mutually satisfying marriage, it sounds more like an abusive relationship. One person takes and demands, but does nothing to create a feeling of love and trust in the relationship.

I am not sure what advice to give you as to what to do...that is something that you will have to work out for yourself. You say that God is your reason for staying in the marriage, but God also says both parties in the marriage should be respected. It sounds as though that is not the case.


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## J'Accused (May 12, 2012)

x2tarter, I hope you had a relaxing holiday weekend. I have been thinking about your issue with sex and it still seems funny with all that you are dealing with, that this issue is the problem. Seriously you have to prioritize your life, sex is a physical manifestation of your love and for some women its easier than others, but I think all women would agree its better when you are happy and not so stressed. So first thing you are way too dependent on other people, get your drivers license, step one. You will be surprised what a small accomplishment will make you feel better about yourself. Now you relationship sounds complicated, too much for anyone here to give you the guidance you need, but these intimacy issues can only be solved with total honesty with your spouse and yourself


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