# Adult Children of Emotionally Immature Parents



## Ursula (Dec 2, 2016)

Could I get some thoughts from you guys, please? I'm sure the long-time regulars remember the issues that I have with my family, and it's reared its head again. 

Situation: My BF and I have VERY casually chatted about moving in together eventually; my folks know this. They also know that I will not be selling my home, but plan to rent it for future income. Even if I'm single, this is my plan, and they've known this for years now. So, this weekend, we mentioned it again, and my mother started in on me not putting my home up for collaterol to buy a home with BF. I was a bit gobsmacked; a bit; she doesn't really listen, so it wasn't super surprising either. Long story short, she gave me this talk twice, and then I asked her to please stop and that I had heard and understood her. She didn't stop, so I asked again, then my dad got in the mix, and then I yelled. Long and loud. It wasn't my proudest moment, and I later appologized. But, also said that I really don't appreciate being treated the way they treat me. They see nothing wrong with it, and continue as they have for years. And of course, because I raised my voice, the entire situation was my fault. I've appologized 3 times.

That being said, I just finished reading a book called "Adult Children of Emotionally Immature Parents" by Lindsay C. Gibson, PsyD. Excellent book by the way! Needless to say, I didn't portray the methods in the book that I just read about. I know this relationship with my folks didn't deteriorate overnight; it's probably about 25 years in the making. 

I'd like to get some thoughts. Here are mine: I need to pick and choose what I tell my folks. I need to close contact with them a bit. Not stop seeing them altogether, but just not as much. Battles need to be chosen; if my mother wants to say her bit umpteen times, and it really isn't hurting anyone, I should just shut my mouth, then go live my life. OK, go (and thanks for reading)!


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## Prodigal (Feb 5, 2011)

I, too, have read Dr. Gibson's book. I grew up with a mother who was immature and downright hateful. What worked for me? I cut her out of my life. I don't regret it. She wasn't going to change, so it was my responsibility, for the sake of my sanity, to decide how much I wanted her in my life. Same goes for you.

Your parents are what they are. Frankly, I would detach big-time and refuse to get lured into anymore of their nonsense. I cut bait when I realized I didn't particularly like my mother. She controlled me when I was a child with her rages, threats, and beatings. By the time I was 20, I left home and never returned. Although she had lessened her manipulative techniques since she knew I could leave anytime I desired, the damage had been done.

It's up to you as to how much damage and fallout you are willing to absorb from this point forward. I wouldn't share squat with someone like your mother. I mean, what's the point? Keep it cordial and superficial. Why try to have a mature adult relationship with someone who isn't capable?


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## Andy1001 (Jun 29, 2016)

@Ursula I remember some of your other posts about your family, particularly your mother. 
You need to stop trying to get your parents approval and/or blessing about how you live your life.
They’re never going to change. So either stop giving them ammunition to fire at you or accept that their toxic treatment of you is going to continue.


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## happyhusband0005 (May 4, 2018)

Ursula said:


> Could I get some thoughts from you guys, please? I'm sure the long-time regulars remember the issues that I have with my family, and it's reared its head again.
> 
> Situation: My BF and I have VERY casually chatted about moving in together eventually; my folks know this. They also know that I will not be selling my home, but plan to rent it for future income. Even if I'm single, this is my plan, and they've known this for years now. So, this weekend, we mentioned it again, and my mother started in on me not putting my home up for collaterol to buy a home with BF. I was a bit gobsmacked; a bit; she doesn't really listen, so it wasn't super surprising either. Long story short, she gave me this talk twice, and then I asked her to please stop and that I had heard and understood her. She didn't stop, so I asked again, then my dad got in the mix, and then I yelled. Long and loud. It wasn't my proudest moment, and I later appologized. But, also said that I really don't appreciate being treated the way they treat me. They see nothing wrong with it, and continue as they have for years. And of course, because I raised my voice, the entire situation was my fault. I've appologized 3 times.
> 
> ...


I think your thoughts are just about perfect. Let them say what they're going to say and then ignore and do what you want. I'm a bit more sarcastic and theatrical with these situations. When my mother goes on about something she disagrees with me on I might get up and start searching around the room like I lost something until she asks what I'm looking for, then I'll reply I'm trying to find whoever asked for your opinion.


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## Mr. Nail (Apr 26, 2011)

I had emotionally mature parents. I had financially mature parents. Why take a loan out on one house to buy another house, you can take a loan out on the new house. I'm gobsmacked too. 

So the problem is that your parents offer you, not so much advice as Directions. My Sister is like this. She was widowed at a much too young age. So as a result she is the expert Single Woman. I have 2 daughters who are also single women. Every twice a year or so she captures one of them and lectures them for a half hour on how to invest for the future. The trouble is she really isn't an investor, She is a tightwad She was born a tightwad. I know this because she still had Halloween candy on Easter. Ninety percent of typical (not using the word Normal) people can't live that way. 

My Daughter just stops listening when sis (aunt) goes into lecture mode. She nods her head and pretends to listen as the words slip into one ear and slide out the other. Kind of the same way I listen to my mother in law.

Have you tried the nevertheless statement? "Mom that's an interesting Idea and it might even work, NEVERTHELESS I've already decided what I'm going to do and I'm not changing my mind.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

Stop telling them anything about your personal financial moves. I mean, unless you owe them money, it's none of their business. Just exclude them. They don't even have to know you OWN the house you live in.


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

Welcome back.

I remember your parent-stories. The advice is still the same: limit your time and be careful what you tell them because they’ll never change.


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## Luckylucky (Dec 11, 2020)

I like the other poster’s idea of just listening to the advice. And even better, the one about not even going into detail about your plans!


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## joannacroc (Dec 17, 2014)

I think everyone wants to feel respected, included parents. Whether they are emotionally mature or not. And part of that involves feeling listened to. I can definitely relate as my parents were very overbearing and not very mature in my 20s. As I aged they backed off a bit. Think what helped me was just hearing them out, nodding, and saying something noncommittal like "thanks for your advice. I hadn't thought about it that way. I'll have to think about it." 

You're not promising to do what they say, but you're hearing them out and making them feel validated while doing whatever it was you were gonna do anyway. They key is not to sound snarky. Sometimes they might get mad if you don't follow their advice but that is their perogative. Your job is just to stand by your decisions - wrong or right, they are choices you made and you are the one who will get to celebrate them or clean them up, so it;s really not their place anymore to weigh in. Just let them get it out of their system. Nod, smile. Then do whatever it was you were gonna do.


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## SpinyNorman (Jan 24, 2018)

joannacroc said:


> I think everyone wants to feel respected, included parents. Whether they are emotionally mature or not. And part of that involves feeling listened to.


I'd agree w/ this, but @Ursula told them she heard and understood them, which should have taken care of that.


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## Elizabeth001 (May 18, 2015)

Prodigal said:


> I, too, have read Dr. Gibson's book. I grew up with a mother who was immature and downright hateful. What worked for me? I cut her out of my life. I don't regret it. She wasn't going to change, so it was my responsibility, for the sake of my sanity, to decide how much I wanted her in my life. Same goes for you.
> 
> Your parents are what they are. Frankly, I would detach big-time and refuse to get lured into anymore of their nonsense. I cut bait when I realized I didn't particularly like my mother. She controlled me when I was a child with her rages, threats, and beatings. By the time I was 20, I left home and never returned. Although she had lessened her manipulative techniques since she knew I could leave anytime I desired, the damage had been done.
> 
> It's up to you as to how much damage and fallout you are willing to absorb from this point forward. I wouldn't share squat with someone like your mother. I mean, what's the point? Keep it cordial and superficial. Why try to have a mature adult relationship with someone who isn't capable?


Same here. Same story and same advice 


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

Ursula said:


> I've appologized 3 times.


You don't have to apologise at all. So go on try it, you might like it.


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## SpinyNorman (Jan 24, 2018)

You know what infuriates me? When I'm using some website, I click a button and it doesn't do what I expect. 

You know what infuriates people who "push your buttons"? When you don't give them the reaction they want. 

Don't do this wantonly, you listen to them the first time, the second time you interrupt them and tell them what you did, and the next time you smile and pretend you didn't hear them, or you leave or something else that doesn't acknowledge their disrespect.


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## Prodigal (Feb 5, 2011)

I just want to add something else here. I realize why you are still trying to keep your parents in the loop when it comes to the decisions you are pondering. You want them to BE the parents you need and want - caring, respectful, wise, supportive. Sadly they can't be that. All you can do is grieve the loss of what you never had and never will have. I'm sorry I can't offer more.


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## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

I wish it were otherwise, yet the best thing for me is to keep my parents at a significant distance and have little to do with them.

Of which the older I get, the easier that is to do.

You can do it to.


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## Luminous (Jan 14, 2018)

Start being selective with what you tell them. I have had to do this with mine due to them projecting their own doubts/insecurities, whilst at the same time being borderline patronising.

I look at from a point of view, that their experiences in life give them a safety 'box', that they cannot (or chose not to) see outside of. They cannot relate to my own experiences and as a result defer to the default of treating me like was a child when they can't relate, despite having a track record of successfully accomplishing many things throughout my adult life that they have had no experience with.


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## frusdil (Sep 5, 2013)

Your parents sound much like my in-laws. We stopped telling them things years ago. It's not so much the advice they would give but the fact that they (especially MIL) will find something negative about literally every situation.

When my husband was going for a new job, that was a huge step up from what he had, and that he really wanted, I said to him to not tell them until we know whether or not he had it (he got it), because they will just try and talk him out of it. It's turned out to be the best thing he could have done for our family, but most especially, himself.


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## Affaircare (Jan 11, 2010)

Hey @Ursula, 

I too remember your stories about your family and how they impact you. I think I can make this somewhat brief--I'll try! 

My family is very emotionally immature. If you remember, my mom beat us kids and was mentally ill...and my dad didn't want to face it so he drowned his pain in the beer. So as a young child my mom (mom's are supposed to be nurturing, right?) HIT me with a board, and my dad (dad's are supposed to protect you, right?) ran away so he could be in denial and left us to get hit. SMH. It was a mess. 

As I grew older and did therapy and became a mom myself and experienced some of life, I came to realize that both parents actually kind of hit a certain young age and just never matured again after that. They had their own issues that they mostly denied, even to themselves, and thus they were never addressed. My mom expected me to want her approval because she had spent her whole life seeking her dad's approval and never got it. My dad did not understand what love actually is because he's an alcoholic. There you have it. Of course, like any child I WANTED a nurturing mom and a protecting dad, but that just was not who I had as parents. 

So one of the first things I had to stop denying myself was that they'd ever BE the parents I wanted. That just wasn't them. They are who they are, and yeah honestly that can kind of suck, but it is what it is. If I want nurturing and protection, don't turn to them! See, I think that is partially where you keep making your mistake. You want them to be *_ and _*, and that's not who they are. Then when they are true to themselves, you're all hurt by it because you wanted them to be *_ and _*. Hate to tell ya, girl, but that's not happening. 

So just accept that they are who they are. EXPECT them to act as they act. When someone shows you who they are...believe them! 

Next, I did not spend my life very close to either one of my parents, and I am SO MUCH BETTER for it. I mean that I moved from the Midwest to the West and having that many miles physically between has allowed me the chance to have them as emotionally close as I see fit. And I don't see fit to be very emotionally close with either one, even to this day. I can speak with them both cordially. I do call for celebrations and holidays. But when my mom starts going over the edge (like when she's manic), she'll write me long, zealous religious letters about being sinful and I just tear them up and don't call her for a little while. Usually in a couple weeks she "comes down" and is closer to sanity so then I'll answer back. The point is that I get to choose for myself how much closeness works FOR ME (or doesn't). And if either one of them has a conniption fit about it, or becomes verbally abusive or disrespectful, I have a rule: I will speak my truth once. If they continue, I just say goodbye. They are 1000+ miles away--what are they going to do? If they want to fume, they can fume...1000 miles away from me. And I'm okay with that because I stood up for me and my choices and how I want to live my life, and they get to choose how they want to live THEIR life. 

I would not particularly recommend just letting them say whatever they want to say to you and ignoring it. I mean, words have power, and if you hear things often enough YOU begin to believe that! So rather than letting them go on and rail against you or disrespect you, I would think maybe the wiser way to view "choosing the hill you'll die on" might mean more like not getting yourself into the positions where they have a chance to act that way toward you. Like, why tell them about your plans with your house and renting, etc.? That is very literally NONE of their business? Were you hoping they'd approve? Were you hoping they'd tell you it's a smart move? I mean, if you go to unapproving people for approval, guess what? You're going to get disapproval! So don't put yourself in that position. Tell them ONCE and then if they can't be respectful, just get up and walk out the door and don't talk to them for several days or a week or whatever you deem appropriate. Just do it. You are a grown woman! You do you.


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## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

Some parents just don't ever stop thinking they have the right to control you.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

@Ursula Your parents created you, so they have that going for them.

But at some point they seemed to lose all sense of proportion.


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## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

My parents were the same way. My mother still is. On boards dedicated to narcissism, one talks about how these types find ways to rile you up because that's how they get their "supply."

Maybe I was the easiest to control Always wanting to please everyone. And then wanting others to see things from my POV. Like others here, I minimize what I tell my mother. I've learned the hard way: the more that you disclose, the more material they have to work with. 

I've learned a few communication techniques as well. One is to be obtuse when they are trying to get you talk about something that you don't want to. Because my mother has called me stupid enough times, I can really shut down a conversation with her by saying "Well, I guess I'm just stupid, like you say."

I don't look for her approval anymore.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

My mother was invasive. And critical. But she took good care of me while allowing me a lot of autonomy when young, so I'm not really complaining.

But she always liked to see if she could find something personal and sneak and read it. When I was in my 40s, she came to visit and I could tell she was trying to get into my locked file box. She was in a huff about it all the rest of the week because I wouldn't let her in that. Just nutso.


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## Ursula (Dec 2, 2016)

Thanks for the thoughts, guys! Very good advice you all give, and it gives me a lot to chew on.









@Prodigal, I'm starting to realize that, and it makes me a little sad. I know things will never change because they just aren't capable of giving what they don't have to give. As a kid, they were great at pointing out my downfalls and doling out spankings and punishments if they thought it was warranted. However, when I was actually upset about something, I'd be told to "grow the hell up". They aren't capable of emotional closeness, and are probaby scared to death of it.

@Mr. Nail, I haven't tried the "nevertheless" statements, but will give that a try in the future.

@DownByTheRiver, I know, I NEED to just stop letting them in. This is my fault 100%. The stupid thing is that I've always wanted a solid relationship with them, so I always have tried to gain their acceptance/respect, and sometimes I do for awhile, but it seems to get thrown back in my face more often than not, so it really is pointless to try. I need to get that through my head.

@joannacroc, I like that advice: listen, acknowledging and letting them feel like they're also heard, but not promising anything to them. And yes, they do own their actions and feelings (or, they're supposed to, anyways), and I own mine. Smile and nod, smile and nod...

@SpinyNorman, you are also correct in that once the lectures start, they don't stop; I can hear the same thing 7..8.. times. It sucks that they don't hear me but I'm expected to hear them continuously. Although perhaps if I just go about with what @joannacroc suggested, and just say non-committal comments, maybe they'll back off. I've never actually tried the specific words that she suggested.

@Personal, funny, that's what my sister said when I talked to hear about it: stop apologizing. I just felt bad about blowing up and yelling, which is totally out of character for this kid. There are other ways, I know that.

@frusdil, @Luminous, YES! I think you hit on something there with the "safety box" thoughts. I think that some parents just can't see past their own experiences and can't realize that their kids can actually be fairly successful and accomplished. Frusdil, congrats to your husband on landing his dream job!

@Affaircare, oy, I'm so sorry you had to deal with that on such a grand scale. That sucks for you and your siblings. Good for you for going to therapy and doing the deep digging to overcome your childhood. Did you ever confront your parents about this? And you hit the nail on the head: I do want them to be good parents, and while I do realize that that's just not who they are, I keep hoping (and trying). My mother said that I don't understand because I'm not a parent. True, I don't _really_ get it to that extent, but I do still get it to the extent that I can (this is to do with her constant lecturing). She also said that I might have been a worse mom (than her, I'm guessing is what she meant). Very nice comment (head smack). And, I've often thought about moving and putting distance between us. I do know that when BF and I move in together (way into the future), that she will probably calm down. ATM, she worries, a LOT. She worries about me being on the road, and will have me call her to let her know I made it home OK. This is everyDAMNday. I don't enjoy it, but feel guilty when I don't do it. And yes, if a person hears something often enough, they believe it. Even into adulthood, if I had a different opinion than my mother or wanted to do something she didn't want me to do, she ask if I was stupid. My dad only once told me that my opinion meant nothing to him and to shut up. Things like this stuck with me until this day. I try not to let them affect me to the point that they had been though. And yeah, by telling them about renting my home out eventually, that they would approve of me a little more. And yeah, I get your drift: they're not the people I should be going to with anything other than superficial stuff.

I really do know what I need to do, but know that this situation didn't happen overnight, so it won't change overnight. They'll never be the parents I need them to be, and while that's sad, it's also kind of powerful to realize. Now, it's just a matter of changing my ways with them. Maybe I'll go read that book again...


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## Ursula (Dec 2, 2016)

NextTimeAround said:


> My parents were the same way. My mother still is. On boards dedicated to narcissism, one talks about how these types find ways to rile you up because that's how they get their "supply."
> 
> Maybe I was the easiest to control Always wanting to please everyone. And then wanting others to see things from my POV. Like others here, I minimize what I tell my mother. I've learned the hard way: the more that you disclose, the more material they have to work with.
> 
> ...


I feel your pain; my mother has also called me stupid way too many times. I'm sorry that you had to live through that!


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## Ursula (Dec 2, 2016)

DownByTheRiver said:


> My mother was invasive. And critical. But she took good care of me while allowing me a lot of autonomy when young, so I'm not really complaining.
> 
> But she always liked to see if she could find something personal and sneak and read it. When I was in my 40s, she came to visit and I could tell she was trying to get into my locked file box. She was in a huff about it all the rest of the week because I wouldn't let her in that. Just nutso.


OMG, you just reminded me of something similar: while going to grade school, my mother would ALWAYS go through my book bag and pencil case to "make sure I brought everything home". She would read notes that friends gave me, and she once read my poetry book while I had the dog outside. Came back and and her comment to me was "well, this sure makes a person think". I asked her what about, and she said "you". That's as far as that went, but at the time, I was suicidal and my writing reflected that. My folks motto: sweep it under the rug is you don't like it!


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## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

Ursula said:


> OMG, you just reminded me of something similar: while going to grade school, my mother would ALWAYS go through my book bag and pencil case to "make sure I brought everything home". She would read notes that friends gave me, and she once read my poetry book while I had the dog outside. Came back and and her comment to me was "well, this sure makes a person think". I asked her what about, and she said "you". That's as far as that went, but at the time, I was suicidal and my writing reflected that. My folks motto: sweep it under the rug is you don't like it!


I bet if you had left some things out so that she didn't have to search for it, she would have been less interested.

I wish I had understood sooner people's need to be passive aggressive.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

Ursula said:


> @DownByTheRiver, I know, I NEED to just stop letting them in. This is my fault 100%. The stupid thing is that I've always wanted a solid relationship with them, so I always have tried to gain their acceptance/respect, and sometimes I do for awhile, but it seems to get thrown back in my face more often than not, so it really is pointless to try. I need to get that through my head.


Right. It's normal to want validation and especially when you feel you have done well and have some coming, but you'll never get it from them. You rationally tink that if you do well, they'll have to acknowledge that sometime, but they won't because you are a threat to them. My guess is they knock you down to elevate themselves and make themselves feel better for a minute, because they messed up their own lives and are not happy. It's called "leveling." It's their own low self-esteem. That's who does that.


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## Ursula (Dec 2, 2016)

DownByTheRiver said:


> Right. It's normal to want validation and especially when you feel you have done well and have some coming, but you'll never get it from them. You rationally tink that if you do well, they'll have to acknowledge that sometime, but they won't because you are a threat to them. My guess is they knock you down to elevate themselves and make themselves feel better for a minute, because they messed up their own lives and are not happy. It's called "leveling." It's their own low self-esteem. That's who does that.


And that's just plain ole sad to do that to someone, if that really is the case with them. It's like being bullied; bullies do it because they feel inferior or badly somehow and need to make themselves feel better in the moment.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

Ursula said:


> OMG, you just reminded me of something similar: while going to grade school, my mother would ALWAYS go through my book bag and pencil case to "make sure I brought everything home". She would read notes that friends gave me, and she once read my poetry book while I had the dog outside. Came back and and her comment to me was "well, this sure makes a person think". I asked her what about, and she said "you". That's as far as that went, but at the time, I was suicidal and my writing reflected that. My folks motto: sweep it under the rug is you don't like it!


Ugh. I mean, I think sometimes parents do have to invade their kids' privacy some to be sure they're safe, but obviously, that's not why SHE was doing it or she'd have taken you straight to a therapist.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

Ursula said:


> And that's just plain ole sad to do that to someone, if that really is the case with them. It's like being bullied; bullies do it because they feel inferior or badly somehow and need to make themselves feel better in the moment.


Yup, that's it.


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## Ursula (Dec 2, 2016)

DownByTheRiver said:


> Ugh. I mean, I think sometimes parents do have to invade their kids' privacy some to be sure they're safe, but obviously, that's not why SHE was doing it or she'd have taken you straight to a therapist.


My folks didn't believe in therapy (don't know or care if they do now), and they don't believe in taking meds for depression or anxiety; mental illnesses. This is why I never told them I was suicidal; I'd probably been told to slap a smile on, get outdoors and I'd feel better. Little did they know that I was bullied and harassed at school.


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## SpinyNorman (Jan 24, 2018)

Prodigal said:


> I just want to add something else here. I realize why you are still trying to keep your parents in the loop when it comes to the decisions you are pondering. You want them to BE the parents you need and want - caring, respectful, wise, supportive. Sadly they can't be that. All you can do is grieve the loss of what you never had and never will have. I'm sorry I can't offer more.


It would be nice if her parents respected her, but the essential role parents play is when children are small. Personally, rather than grieving why someone doesn't behave as I like, I'd rather invest that energy in finding people who do. This world has no shortage of people.

I've seen my share of Favorite Children who grew up thinking being the Favorite would be the pass that allowed them to coast through life and found out different way too late. I feel sorry for them.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

They don't believe in it because they don't want someone telling them what loser messes they are. They don't want to deal with yours either for the same reason.


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

Toxic parents feel that you are theirs to control forever. I only felt completely free once my mother was gone (when I was in my early 40’s) and finally a life-long weight lifted off my shoulders. 

It’s up to you to change how you deal with them because they aren’t going to change how they deal with you. Why would they? They don’t consider themselves to be a problem.


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## Elizabeth001 (May 18, 2015)

Ursula said:


> My folks didn't believe in therapy (don't know or care if they do now), and they don't believe in taking meds for depression or anxiety; mental illnesses. This is why I never told them I was suicidal; I'd probably been told to slap a smile on, get outdoors and I'd feel better. Little did they know that I was bullied and harassed at school.


When my mother found out about my attempted suicide as a young teen (I tried to hide it from her and my step-father), they told me next time they would help me do it. 

Toxicity is toxicity...doesn’t matter where it comes from. 

It took me until my 30s to cut her out of my life and it wasn’t easy. I wanted her love and acceptance so badly but reached a point where I knew I would never get it and I was only hurting myself by trying.

She passed away years ago and my sisters banned me from the funeral. I don’t think I ever mourned her but I mourned the loss of the relationship we both COULD have had, and then I let it go. We’ll have to work it out on the other side, if there is one.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## Ursula (Dec 2, 2016)

Elizabeth001 said:


> When my mother found out about my attempted suicide as a young teen (I tried to hide it from her and my step-father),* they told me next time they would help me do it.*
> 
> Toxicity is toxicity...doesn’t matter where it comes from.
> 
> ...


Ouch, what a terrible thing to say, I'm so sorry. 

@Openminded, I recently had a conversation with a girlfriend about that: losing our parents and finally feeling free. It's so sad though that it comes to that point.


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

Yes, it definitely is sad that part of you feels great relief when you are finally free of your toxic parent(s). I only had one parent who was toxic and while I mourned the relationship we didn’t have once she was gone, I was not unhappy not to have to deal with the stress anymore.


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