# Porn and Society.



## Crypsys (Apr 22, 2010)

I would like to explore a topic for a bit and I didn't want to de-rail anyone's thread with it so I thought I'd start a new one. Amplexor, I hope you don't mind me referencing a post you made in another thread as a starting block??



Amplexor said:


> If they have self confidence issues about their looks, weight or sexual abilities, finding out will exacerbate them. It could leave them feeling unloved and undesired. Especially if the porn has replaced much of the couples’ sexual intimacy.


I am in a 100% agreement with you there.



Amplexor said:


> Your spouse may also wonder what you are bringing to the bed with you when you are making love. Who or what you may have seen on line that you are thinking about when you make love to them.


If people are going to imagine someone else in bed with them they don't need porn to do that. If someone wants to imagine something porn won't make a difference as to whether they do it or not. 



Amplexor said:


> I don’t know if I can classify the use of porn as “cheating” but it can definitely hurt your spouse and that is wrong in any form.


100% agree



Amplexor said:


> If both spouses are OK with it or share it together, that’s fine. Consenting adults and all and I have no problem with that from a marriage standpoint.


100% agree




Amplexor said:


> But I do have a problem with it from a moral and social standpoint. I am not a prude or holy-roller by any stretch but I do believe that making love is supposed to be between two loving people in a committed relationship. Not something to be filmed for the almighty dollar and the entertainment of others. Porn hurts lots of people. The young man or woman at a college party that gets drunk and does something stupid while some perv videos it and sells it on-line for a hundred bucks. It will no doubt be an act they will regret for the rest of their lives. The porn industry uses people then tosses them aside like a used condom when they have served their purposes. There are very few Jenna Jamison stories of wealth and celebrity status. Not to mention the many who leave the “business” diseased, addicted and broken. It pollutes the minds of our young people and desensitizes them to what making love is all about. It sets unobtainable expectations for them in choosing a mate and partner. It exposes them to acts of violence, incest and rape and presents it as “normal” with selections like menu items at a diner. Point and click for your selected debauchery. It is a pollutant in our moral fiber and it is available 24X7 on virtually every device connected to the Internet. Some on this forum disagree with me that it isn’t just a trivial “release” for someone to engage in. That’s fine, we are all entitled to our opinions, but we have seen many on this forum who have suffered from it. Lost their marriage, their love, their money, their trust, their self esteem, their job… OK, I’m done.


The porn industry would not exist if people didn't want to watch porn. They are simply there giving the people what they are wanting. I think the pertinent question is WHY is porn such a big industry? Porn does not decrease our moral fiber one bit. It's just a reflection of what our ACTUAL moral fiber is at the current time. Porn will stop being a big deal when society as a whole deems it's not important. Porn is not a cause, it's simply a symptom.

I think this society as a whole has some pretty screwed up notions of what is "normal" and okay. On one hand we are bombarded with ads and television shows flaunting sexuality. Yet on the other hand we put a stigma on people who act sexually in real life. It's a very odd double standard. Here, let me sell you this juice drink by showing a lady in a bikini. But yet kids, sex is only for marriage, if you even think about sex your evil. IMO that's messed up as you can get.

I think America in a way is a repressed society and we are now starting to see the effects of that repression. People are no longer content to stay married "just because". Women are starting to not be as afraid of acknowledging they themselves have a sexual nature. But how many families actually talk about sex with their children? It's few and far between sadly, it's like that elephant in the closet. We have friends who are not open about sexuality with their older children and still try to "hide" the fact they have sex from their kids. I've had this discussion with my coworkers and all of them generally keep the fact that they have sex "quiet" from their children. I'm not saying invite the kiddos in to watch, etc. But what is wrong with showing them that it's perfectly normal for parents to have sex, etc. Our kids are still a bit young for a deep discussion, but they do know that Mom and Dad have private time together. As they get older, they will know what that private time entails. But for now at least, it's teaching them that it's perfectly normal and healthy. It's no wonder kids are growing up confused!!!

Sorry if this went way around off topic, but that too is something I feel pretty strongly about!!


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## steve71 (Feb 5, 2010)

Hi Crypsys,

you raise some interesting questions. And Amplexor's ideas resonate with me up to a point but I think there are other things to consider before arriving at judgments. I draw a distinction between what I consider 'porn' - the industrialized, impersonal, standardized exploitation of sexuality for profit and what I consider to be erotica - the wholesome celebration of real people's sensuality and beauty. I abhor the former and exalt the latter. 

Somehow I assume you're thinking of visuals - or do you include novels and other forms of porn and erotica?


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## Crypsys (Apr 22, 2010)

steve71 said:


> Somehow I assume you're thinking of visuals - or do you include novels and other forms of porn and erotica?


It's interesting you bring up novels, etc. Many novels are much more explicit in their nature then many porn vids. Yet, the same stigma does not surround the book erotica as does the visual erotica. 

I personally have no issues with any type of erotica as long as it's consensual for all parties.

I'm interested in where and why you draw a distinction between say an erotic novel and something like "Debbie Does Dallas". Granted to write takes much more talent IMO. But, why is there a distinction?


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## steve71 (Feb 5, 2010)

Crypsys said:


> It's interesting you bring up novels, etc. Many novels are much more explicit in their nature then many porn vids. Yet, the same stigma does not surround the book erotica as does the visual erotica.
> 
> I personally have no issues with any type of erotica as long as it's consensual for all parties.
> 
> I'm interested in where and why you draw a distinction between say an erotic novel and something like "Debbie Does Dallas". Granted to write takes much more talent IMO. But, why is there a distinction?


Hi Crypsis

I reckon there are a range of reasons for the difference in stigma. Reading a novel is a private, cerebral activity. Somehow the content becomes our own internal, unseen property. Images are often more public and can engage lots of people all at once - some of whom won't want to see them. Rodin's sculpture 'The Kiss' was unveiled to scenes of outrage and fist-fights...some people felt public space and decency had been violated. Blues music - and more recent rock music - used to provoke condemnation too for it's supposedly 'lewd pulsating rhythms'.

I think words and images work on our imaginations in differing ways and for me pictures are much more powerful than words both as private experiences and in the public arena. They have a kind of factual quality as if something is being proved. Pictures hit us very directly - we don't have to be literate or speak the lingo to 'get' a picture. Think of, say, Russian WW2 propaganda posters - they helped move a whole devastated nation out of despair to defeat fascism and are still powerful images today.

Translate all this into erotica and it's a very heady brew. My own preference is for a just little restraint, the artful tease, the sideways smile so full of promise...I like my imagination to be unlocked to sweep me away. My problem with mass-produced porn is that it bypasses my imagination - somehow I can't participate, I can only behold the done deed. And it looks so samey. I think that's selling sexuality short. And, of course, there are all the questions about exploitation. My solution is to visit some of the photo-sharing sites where real people combine high-quality artistry with a wholesome pleasure in their own sensuality. A lot of folk work with real devotion to produce beautiful collections of images and enjoy sharing them. I reckon that's as good as it can get for me.

I must confess i've never read 'Debbie goes to Dallas' - perhaps I'm missing something! I'm not much of a reader - the last erotic novel I read was...I've forgotten!

I was wondering about your observation that you live in a repressed society. I've never been to the US but I have the impression you have a very diverse society but that people defer to religious sensibilities. I'm from the UK and ours is a mainly secular society and we're pretty relaxed about sexuality in general. We used to have a self-appointed guardian of public morals called Mary Whitehouse. She had a limited impact on erotica but was an ardent, articulate and very charming campaigner right into her eighties. Her clean-up tv campaigns were always compromised by a complete failure to confront the plague of tv violence - cop shows and so forth. So in the end she was seen - wrongly - as merely an enemy of sensual pleasures. But you have some pretty vehement campaigners don't you?


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