# Foreign Affair



## NonSequiturer (Sep 30, 2012)

Sorry this is a bit long but it’s been going on for two years and there’s a lot to tell. Also, I’m writing this to get it out of my system and I want to get the whole story down. I’m also writing to get some sympathy and understanding and some ideas and wisdom from the community about what’s happened to me. I happened upon this website last night and found it very helpful. I had looked through other similar websites but for whatever reasons this one resonated more. Maybe because I’m in a relatively better place at the moment. I’ve read several stories similar to mine on this website and was really surprised at the similarities. I guess like many men I never thought I’d be in this position. I guess somehow I thought what had happened to me was so bad that it couldn’t have happened like this to others. Maybe I just wasn’t aware that this kind of insanity and pain really existed.

Anyway, here’s the story. My wife has been having an affair for the past two years. We have been married 11 years and have two children. We’ve been living overseas for the past five years where I work in a different country every few years. I’m American but my wife is not. I met her about 13 years ago when I was working in her country as a volunteer teaching English abroad. We dated for about 18 months before we were married despite that fact that women aren’t supposed to have boyfriends in her country and a foreign boyfriend would be hugely forbidden. Her culture and mine are very different. But she was fun, sexy, smart, outgoing, rebellious, crazy, etc. and that was attractive. I was in a really immersive volunteer program so I got to know her culture and language well and I felt I understood her. She seemed to be more open-minded and adventurous and cosmopolitan than other people from her country and I liked her a lot and came to love her. She didn’t fit in exactly with my American friends but well enough because she was fun-loving and adventurous and we went out a lot and had fun. I started to feel like I wanted to marry her. 

After we married we moved to the U.S. and then things changed a great deal. Naturally, because she had never left her country before and had left her family and any support networks she had, she became extremely dependent on me. This caused a lot of stress in our marriage. Also, I admit that I did not support her well enough emotionally after this happened and worse that I behaved in a way that made her feel I regretted the whole marriage or that I didn’t want her around or that I preferred the company of other people. All this caused her to severely lose her confidence to the point where she became very anti-social and self-conscious. In my defense, although I was definitely not ready for marriage, I did want to marry her and I did want to be with her. I should also mention that this was NOT a mail order bride type of thing. I wasn’t comfortable with myself and how people felt about me so I began to feel like she wasn’t helping me out at all in making people like me more. I wasn’t ashamed exactly but I did not make her confident in my love for her. Also, like a jerk, before we were married, before we were engaged really but after I knew I wanted to marry her, I wanted “one more fling” to test the waters and I cheated on her for a period of about one week with someone I had met. I confessed, we fought, made up. Soon after, we were married. I admit freely that these are true statements and in our trying to settle things I have admitted all of these failures to her. These are bad things and on balance it may seem to an outsider that I didn’t actually want to marry her. But I did. I did love her and did want to spend the rest of my life with her. I was not emotionally supportive enough but I was not mean. Just sort of reluctant and resentful of losing my freedom a bit and feeling like on the one hand I did love her but on the other she was a burden. I guess in a way that might be normal in many starting couples. 

So, partly for those terrible reasons and I think partly because of moving to a new country and all the pressures there, partly from leaving her family (family is hugely important in her culture) where everything was taken care of to a new country where we had to learn to live independently, make our own money, cook our own food, etc. she started to become very depressed, anxious, self-conscious and paranoid. I tried my best to help her but my solutions (go see a psych, be more active, take meds, try to get out of the house and take any job) were all inappropriate for the type of person she is—that is, very stubborn, closed minded and a little lazy. A lot of times, my help made things worse. She saw me as trying to control her, that I was nagging her or that I wasn’t happy with her when I was just trying to help her get over her depression, to try to get her to integrate into my culture somewhat, to try to get her towards a career, etc. This wasn’t entirely to make me feel better about her or to relieve my burden but also because I began to be concerned about her.

Anyway, for the first three years we struggled and fought a lot. She depended on me for everything and eventually would not—or could not—support herself or have a life independent of me. Since she didn’t have any friends I felt pressured to spend more and more time with her and less and less time without her. She was very jealous of my time and did not like it when I went out with my friends. Eventually, we almost never went out and when we did it was upsetting to her. This was partially enabled by my own relatively milder social anxiety and anti-social tendencies. So eventually I lost contact with most of my friends and spent nearly all my time with her. During this time I was also starting a career and although I did fairly well at it the time was stressful. Sometimes I was embarrassed being married to someone who could not face anyone I knew. I was constantly explaining her to people. Sometimes, she was jealous of female coworkers who she heard about or had seen on the rare times we went out. I never cheated or had an emotional relationship with any of them although I may have obviously had crushes on some which had as much to do with me being flawed as with feeling like “I wish I had that instead of the burden I have.” 

My wife did manage to have a job sometimes but she usually quit because she felt people didn’t like her or were sabotaging her. I frequently tried to discuss her problems with her but if I didn’t agree completely with what she felt or thought we argued. I admit I may have leaned too hard on “tough love” techniques but at the same time knew that at best she didn’t understand what people meant and at worst was being delusional or paranoid. She even felt like my family hated her or laughed at her when it wasn’t the case. They are a bit white bread but opened minded and did like her a lot. 

At some point during that first three years she had a tiny affair. This happened because she was unable to find any friends, and unable to feel comfortable with anyone ever. When she did finally meet a friend, a man, he eventually made a move on her and basically conned her into having sex with him. This happened when I was abroad for a month. I forgave her and tried to never use it as leverage against her. I put it down, and still do, to her extreme loneliness and depression and need for human contact apart from what I was giving her (which I think was a lot). I don’t think she ever meant to have sex with him and was upset about it partly because she really did want a friend.

After three years we had our first child and things got sort of better. She did have post-partum depression but was a very good mother. Or son was great. My career grew. I felt more in love with her and more comfortable handling her needs and not going out. We had more money. Her depression and social anxiety persisted but we, I felt, bonded better over having a child. I was ok with having a not entirely reliable stay at home mom but who was a great mom. I could afford that arrangement and I was waiting for her to improve to the point of being able to get over her Social Anxiety (or whatever it was). I hounded her less about her problems and accepted them better, if not entirely. I stopped asking her so much to go look for mental health treatment. The major problem at this time was that we almost never went out by ourselves without our son.

After five years we had a second child and my career progressed to the point where I was given an overseas position. We moved overseas (to developing country Y) for me to work (but not to her country). In country Y, we were required to live in an American community with the close support of the American organization. The expectation was that people with the organization would socialize with each other (dinner parties, play dates, softball games, picnics, etc.) It was not particularly easy to integrate into the actual culture of that country so most Americans spent time with each other. She remained very scared and self-conscious around strangers, and Americans in particular. This environment made her social anxiety worse. So we continued to keep to ourselves and dealt with the gossip and pressure from not being social. I just tried to keep her happy and hoped that she would get better. I myself had a few friends but she had none. She did occasionally host a dinner for people but only after I pressured her into it. I was trying to get her to be outgoing but also trying to fit in. Once again, we almost never went out alone without our children. At this point she did go see a psychiatrist and he helped her somewhat but after three or so sessions she stopped going. She did also try Effexor but quit after a few months.

After that first year assignment I volunteered to go work with the organization in a dangerous country (call it country Z) where she could not come. Admittedly, it was partly to be alone (see introvert above). Partly to get away. But also, partly to advance my career to the point where I could make more choices about my overseas assignments and even try to get posted to her country. So, I went to country z for a one year tour and she moved back to her country with our children. While living there, she was able to visit me. I did my vacations in her country. I get along well enough with her family and am comfortable in her culture and am able to speak her language, although not fluently. We had a great time when she visited me. She stayed for a month at a time, twice, leaving the children with her mother. It felt great and it felt like our marriage improved a great deal. She still did not go out with the friends I had made there but she did make her own friends in this country (which is culturally similar to hers). Also, she made business contacts in that country and we began a small business exporting from that country to her own where she set up a women’s clothing boutique. And here my troubles began.

She hired a family friend to be the boutique’s main clerk. He was a young man—a university student—in his early 20s. I had met him and he was a nice guy although a bit too dreamy and flaky. Very good looking, played guitar, smoked dope and was intense and sensitive. Everyone liked him because he was very cool. When I visited her country on my vacations we hung out although I never connected well with him because his English wasn’t that great but I liked him. It was obvious my wife liked him a great deal and I was happy she had a buddy. It should be noted her that in her country having a male buddy is only borderline acceptable but he was such a puppy that I didn’t think anything of it. Plus I trusted her because while having a male buddy is nearly unacceptable, having an affair in her country is HUGELY unacceptable. When I was back at my assignment in the dangerous country she would call and frequently talk about the store, her family and…him. Still, I didn’t think anything. My assignment ended in the Spring and I was set to go to my next post, at a new country—not hers but once again, near it and with a similar culture. Not dangerous so she could join me with our children.

But, she really dragged her heels coming to join me. She wanted to continue to stay in her own country for the summer until the week before the children had to go to school. Eventually, she did come but as late as she could. The situation was the same as before regarding the scrutiny from the American community, but I was determined to not care and to insulate her from it as much as I could and help her be as comfortable as possible. I did continue to pressure her to engage but as much out of concern for her and her depression and aimlessness. She still did pretty much nothing but take care of the children and read or watch movies. I encouraged her to go to children’s birthday parties.  To not be so jealous of my time. To go socialize a bit. This made her angry again as it had before. Still, our marriage was for the most part good and stable but in retrospect it’s clear she had changed. She seemed to be more panicky about her depression. She insisted more often than ever that I’d be better off without her. She cared less about our finances. Let me blow money on dumb hobbies and didn’t complain. She talked even less about the future. Then, at one point she really, really wanted a third baby. Then she didn’t. 

At this time she still had the boutique in her country--which was an hour flight away--and the family friend/clerk was still running the place. She visited her country a couple of times for a week or two to deal with the shop and during that time she stayed with him which she told me about. I was open minded and thought of her happiness first and didn’t think anything of it. Not jealous or suspicious. The business was bleeding money but I saw it as a way for her to develop some kind of career and help build confidence so I didn’t care at all. She talked about him as a friend and I didn’t think anything of it.

After the summer and autumn, she left for her country as soon as the children had Christmas vacation. I joined her a few weeks later and stayed with her and her family for a week. While there, the family friend/clerk hung around her and her family. He was friends with her brother and cousins. I remember we had a good time. One night I bought alcohol for everyone and we stayed up late playing cards. The clerk had too much to drink and at one point sat unusually close to my wife, leaning on her shoulder. In her culture, this was very inappropriate behavior and would instantly signal to all present what was going on. But cool dude, open-minded me, didn’t think the worst, but was only sort of annoyed at her tolerance of his puppy dog behavior. I think it was the next day or the day after that the first real blow hit. She told me she was not going to come back to my country of assignment with me and the children were staying too. Said she couldn’t be away from her country again in the expat community. She couldn’t live that life any more. I guess I subconsciously saw this coming and was extremely upset and depressed. Not despondent, not crying but definitely more upset and shocked than I had ever been. I didn’t know what was happening and I felt like all the support I had been trying to give to her during our marriage and her depression had been for nothing and worse had been taken for granted. I didn’t understand why I had to be the source of her problems when I was doing everything that I could to make her feel better about herself and at the same time trying to keep our lives moving forward. We argued and I convinced her that this would not be good for our family, or our children. She agreed to come back and did fly back with our children to the country where we were living. About a month after that, she somehow gathered up the strength to confess to the affair with the clerk. On my 40th birthday no less (she forgot it was my birthday). That was in January 2011.

It was a total surprise and I was absolutely crushed. Called in sick for work and stayed home crying and arguing with her and begging. At first, she insisted she was going to leave me and marry him. Or she would stay with me until she got her U.S. citizenship (we never got it for her because of bureaucratic bull****, because I was busy, and because she was too unorganized) and then she would marry him and take him to the U.S. so she wouldn’t have to face the shame of what she did and the ostracizing she’d get from her family. She begged me to help her in this. She wanted to be free and said that if I really loved her I’d help her in this. She had to be away from the expat life and in her own country or at least with someone who really understood her and cared for her. She needed to be away from the pressures of being with an American in an expat community. She couldn’t deal with going to visit my family. She felt so great and free away from me and with him. When I asked her how long the affair had been going on she said that it only started a few months earlier when she went back to her country to tend to the store. I doubted it but took her word for it.

I guess after a while she either felt bad for me in my misery, or decided to change tactics after our long discussions and my sorrow. Eventually after a lot of talking and her feeling more and more guilty and seeing what she was doing she agreed to try to work things out but only if I agreed that she could move back to her country after the children finished school in the Summer. Again, all I wanted was for her to be happier, less depressed, more outgoing again, so I agreed to that. We talked about what my next move would be after the current post. We talked about me getting assigned to her country. Or, quitting my job and finding a permanent job in her country since I wouldn’t be able to stay there permanently with my current job but only a two or four year assignment. So, she planned to move back and I would stay alone for the last year of my assignment and try very hard to get assigned to her country. We lived like husband and wife again for the next six months. I don’t really remember much from that time. I don’t remember if she visited her country or not during those six months or not. We seemed to be happy. I don’t remember if I mentioned her boyfriend or not. I guess I assumed that her relationship with him was over. Or knew that it was over. She wasn’t the same towards me but she wasn’t unloving or distant. Significantly, she now refused to ever visit the U.S. or my family again in addition to insisting on living back in her country. But I figured we needed healing so I agreed to that, hoping she would change her mind later. Summer came, and she and the children moved to her country. Over the summer and the next Autumn I visited two or three times. Things were fine during those times as far as I can remember. The boyfriend was no longer a family friend because her mother had found out about the affair. The bf knew it and no longer visited her nuclear family although he remained friends with her cousins. At some point in 2011 she closed the boutique and sold all her inventory because the business wasn’t making any money. She didn’t start another business or find a different job.

Then, December 2011 came and I made plans to take our children to visit my family in the U.S. I flew to her country first to pick them up to spend a few days with her. Then the next blow came. While there, she told me she absolutely needed to be away from me and all Americans forever. She needed to be free. She could only ever be happy, not the extremely depressed person she was, if she was away from me. She knew we needed to stay in contact, and maybe even live together for a time for the children’s sake, but she wanted me to promise that I would let her go and that eventually we wouldn’t live together any more. But, she never said when or how that would happen. Divorce or just me staying in a different country for a job. She still wanted to stay married for the sake of the children and maybe that would mean I would even move back in with her and have a sham marriage. Or maybe it would mean that we would stay married until the children were old enough to not have divorce affect them all that much. She didn’t talk any more about marrying her BF. Once again, I was really upset. Bargaining, begging and all that. I asked about the BF and she claimed it had nothing to do with him and that they were now just friends. She didn’t really budge this time and somehow I calmed down. I had to get on plane the next day and so wanted some peace first. She stayed somewhat careful and aloof and I tried to control my emotions. The day I left, a half hour before I had to leave for the airport, we were sitting on her balcony talking and smoking. I got up and went into the bedroom to take a shower. While getting undressed I could hear her phone ring outside the window. I heard her talking and although I couldn’t understand what she was saying the tone in her voice was clear and I knew she was talking to him. It wasn’t as total a surprise as the previous January but I really thought she had ended it with him so it was almost as crushing as the first DDay. This time though I was more angry than sad. I confronted her and she at first lied about who she was on the phone with but then admitted it. We fought some but then I had to get to the airport so I left with the children.

After three weeks, came back. She came to the airport to pick us up and was very cold. I stayed there two days and it was stressful and awkward. She stuck to her guns about not ever “being with me again” although admitted that she might have to actually live with me. I browbeated her into having sex with me and she did in a moment of weakness but it felt really bad. I went back to my home in the neighboring country for the last six months or so of my assignment. For the first few months we barely talked on the phone at all. We had five minute conversations. For a while I played around with trying to find a girlfriend on the internet and that kept my mind off of things for a while but eventually I gave up because I didn’t want to lead anyone on. After a while my wife and I talked a bit more but it always collapsed into arguments. At some point in February maybe, my assignment to her country came through. I was to start there for a four year assignment in late summer 2012. She wasn’t against it, even encouraged it somewhat, so I could come back to our children and be their father. I honestly believe she considers that more important than her BF, her freedom, etc. So it felt like a good idea. I felt hopeful that maybe we could still fix things. She didn’t exactly discourage me of this idea. Then, I visited them once for a week long trip for her brother’s wedding and it was awful. She admitted to still seeing her BF “from time to time.” She admitted to still sleeping with him sometimes but that they weren’t really together. Lots of fighting, depression and sadness from me. Her family could tell something was wrong and she became extremely angry for “ruining the wedding.” I went back home and we fought a bit on the phone but eventually sort of fixed things. Soon after, my assignment ended and I went on a month vacation in the U.S. by myself and got my mind somewhat clear from my job, my marriage. I then moved to her country for the four-year assignment and moved back into a house permanently with her and our children. That was about six weeks ago.

For the first few days, it was fine. I was well relaxed after a month’s vacation and I had gotten to a good point in my mind about her. I was doing a kind of fake-180, pulling back to see if she’d come to me. She did, actually, for one night but then regretted it the next day and told me so. Saying she had sex with me because she “wanted to see” if she felt ok about it at all, since we were back living together. Again, I was crushed. 

That started a big fight during which she pretty much told me everything about the affair. It started when I was in the dangerous country, right after she opened her store. It had been going on continuously since that time and was still going on. She very aggressively called me out on how I treated her early in our marriage. Was unapologetic about the affair, saying I caused it. Blamed me for her depression because I didn’t support her well enough emotionally when she first came to the U.S. Said I ruined her. She said that she loved her BF more than she ever loved me and that he loved her more than I ever did. Sex with me was always pretend for her and it was beautiful with him. Our marriage was worthless and she never felt happy in it after I failed to love her properly from the beginning. She insisted that it wasn’t just that the marriage was new or that marriage was difficult but that I didn’t actually want her. She wouldn’t believe, and I feel like she’s never really believed, that I did love her. There were no good times with me. She was acting the whole time. I drove her crazy. I shouldn’t have been surprised about the affair. I had to just let her go. Her behavior had more to do with needing to get away from me and back in her own culture for her mental health than with her affair. After this bad argument she claimed she knew for sure that she loved him. She claimed she got everything off of her chest and now she knew she was right.

However, she wanted me to stay with her for the next four years for the sake of the children and appearances but she wanted me to be happy with her seeing her BF still. At first, shell-shocked from all those new revelations, I agreed. She continued to talk to her BF although she didn’t yet go to see him since it was a hard thing to pull off secretly in her country. She didn’t flaunt her phone calls with him but didn’t hide it exactly either. I started going nuts. I spied on her cell phone. Gave her the silent treatment. Drank a lot. We fought and discussed, etc. I slowly came to the conclusion that there was no way I could handle an “open marriage” for the sake of the children for four years or for god knows how long. How could I last like that for four years when I couldn’t even last a week without drinking and with sleeplessness? I more or less pulled an ultimatum, saying that I had to go, that there was no way I could live that way. I couldn’t live in an open marriage. Also, I played the custody of the children card for the first time ever. Eventually, she broke down under my logic, arguing, etc. and agreed to try to put things back together. It was, in a sense, calling her bluff. I think that either she really does want to stay together for the children, is afraid of ruining her life further, afraid of her family, and maybe afraid of losing me for good. I also learned around this time that her close relationship with her BF caused her extended family to basically understand what was happening although it was never really confirmed to any but her mother, her brother and a cousin. So pretty much everyone had an idea. If we did get a divorce, it would confirm the rumor. So she agreed to try again.

Over the next week or two, we had sex, tried to be more loving. She admitted though that she still needed to talk to her BF to break up with him and help him get over it. I believe that she meant it sincerely. But we still fought a lot about our marriage and the affair over the next few weeks. We did go see a MC once but quit after one time because she didn’t like him. We went up and down and talked a lot. She still didn’t see that she did anything wrong and although she was trying to love me again she wasn’t doing it for her or me but for the children. She said I forced her to stay with me by not agreeing to live only as roommates. Forced her to try to fix things. She admitted to still calling her BF every other day to coach him through the break up. At one point she admitted to an emotional one-night stand with him on the phone talking about her depression (instead of talking to me about it). During that kind of up and down, just starting to fix things time I tried to apply the 180 rules a few times but my heart wasn’t in it and it was just manipulation. Then one night she told me she finally ended it with him for good, that he was extremely angry with her for getting back with me and that he stopped answering calls from her. But the ups and downs continued. Her depression continued. Her blame of me continued. Her talk of leaving me after four years continued to some extent although she agreed to try. I saw this as the healing process. 

But finally, I guess about five days ago, during one long conversation, I hit my breaking point when she told me that her happiest time in the previous 11 years was when she was away from me, living in her country, with our children, and in a relationship with her BF. Things were better before I arrived the previous month. Now she was nervous again. Trying to keep me happy. Under pressure to be something she wasn’t. No longer free. Also, the sex we had been having over the previous 7-10 days was still acting for her and she had to force herself to do it. This wasn’t exactly new information but I finally got tired of hearing it. Tired of being blamed for everything. Tired of listening to her troubles and then tired of her pretty much ignoring or arguing with any sort of heartfelt advice I gave her. Tired of trying to convince her that I loved her and wanted her to be happy. Tired of being emotionally yanked around. I got really drunk too. 

The next day I stayed home with a hangover while she took the children to an amusement park all day. I spent the day thinking about a lot about stuff. Somehow after the night before my brain and heart had shifted enough to the point that I knew I had to emotionally divest myself, take control of what was happening, and really do the 180. I needed to NEVER talk about our troubles with her again. I needed to let her do whatever the hell she wanted and I needed to do whatever I wanted. Not see her family if I didn’t want to. NOT agree to listen to her stories of depression. NOT give her advice. NOT try to put on a happy face for her. NO MORE compromising or double standards. Not bend over backwards admitting my role in her affair when she didn’t see she also did wrong. I’ve been able to keep it up for the past five days although I’m probably acting a bit more coldly towards her than the 180 rules advise. Still, it’s a lot easier this time than over the previous month but we’ll see how it goes. I’ve decided that I want to leave her as soon as I can and I’m starting to feel less concerned about how this will hurt the children and more about my own mental stability. I’m trying to take control of what’s happening instead of trying to bargain with her. 

I feel like for the past two years I’ve conceded and conceded and forgiven and tried to understand and it’s gotten me nowhere. Even our entire marriage actually. She has not moved one inch in admitting she’s wrong or admitting other reasons why she had the affair or admitting our marriage wasn’t as bad as it was. It wasn’t. I was good to her, as loving and supportive as I could be at the time (yes, not as much as I should have), tried to help her in her troubles, let her decide how much or how little she wanted to integrate into my culture and with my friends, didn’t pressure her to work, was very patient with her needs, didn’t drink, didn’t cheat, helped her invest in her own business, happily gave her parents money to expand their house, happily gave her brother money to pay for his marriage (he’s a great guy actually and deserved it), had a joint checking account, trusted her, said sorry as much as I needed to and tried not to go to bed angry. My reward for that was an affair and her asking me to once more agree to let her have what she wanted—a loveless, sexless, emotionless marriage and possibly a boyfriend. The reason she felt she was owed that is because of what I had done to her eight years earlier when we were first married. Once again, I admit and have admitted to her, that I did not love her properly. I did NOT give her all the emotional support she needed as a new bride in a foreign country. I agree that I contributed a great deal to whatever problems there were with our marriage. Also very important is that I FULLY understand that there’s much more here than an affair. I know that leaving her country caused her severe emotional and mental problems, even before the affair. I know that we both made a wrong decision in marrying each other and neither one of us was prepared to handle an intercultural marriage and that this was a HUGE factor in our marriage troubles and in her need to have an affair. But we did build a life and a family together that I valued above everything and I did love her and put her before me.

Ultimately, I feel like she did this because she gave up on me and on our marriage. A fun cool dude from her culture speaking her language came along and made her feel special again after 10 years of marriage and depression. The love was new, the sex was new, there was no past baggage, no foreign husband’s family, he was a sensitive guitar playing poet with a 25 year old’s body and libido. He was younger and less educated than her and less worldly so not intimidating. He gave her emotional comfort when she was sad. She got to take care of him and feed him. She got to show him all these things she had learned in the many countries she had lived in over the past few years (with me) and feel important and smart. 

In some ways, I understand why she feels like she deserves to have all that. He’s from her culture and they connect in that way that I can’t with her. We did have a hard time—although not unusually hard—and this is a new start for her. She probably does feel less depressed with him and more at ease and less pressured. But still, he has no real education and no prospect for a job. I’m paid an international salary when he would be paid a local salary even if he did get a job. He’s very young. He would not be able to support my children or give them the life they should have as American children. Although I’m not against raising them in her culture, I do want them to have international standard education which would be too expensive for the two of them working by themselves partly because she seems incapable of managing the social pressures of a work environment and he has no real education or job prospects. So it would really be me paying for it all. Also, he probably feels wonderful to her now but I know that the honeymoon won’t last because, naturally, honeymoons don’t last. In fact, he may be the worst thing that ever happened for her. He certainly can’t give her the financial support I have. And probably the pressure of how their relationship started, and the family pressure on him and her, and him not having a job, and our children coming to understand what happened… How could it be paradise for much longer. I want to give her her freedom and let her be with the man she loves but to me it just seems like one big fantasy. Especially when you consider that she doesn’t actually want that to start until four years from now. I could give her her freedom but I know this is a massive mistake for her and that she’s ruining everyone’s lives here. At one point, despite what she says right now, I know she loved me and that things were better. At this point they’re bad but that has as much to do with the affair as with how I treated her at the beginning.

So right now we’re living together in a largish house with our two children. They go to bed at night sleeping in the same bed as she has pretty much done since the birth of our first child and I close my door to my room. I know she feels the 180 and that it’s different this time and so is being extra nice to me. She tried to talk to me once about how bad she feels about what’s happening but I told her I didn’t want to talk about her problems or our marriage anymore. She claims she isn’t talking to this guy any more but I’m sure that’s temporary and right now I don’t really care if she does. All I care about right now is getting through an evening with her after work and after the children go to bed without talking at all about our marriage or her depression. I’m doing what I want to do with my free time and if it’s watching a DVD then well she can watch too but we aren’t watching together. We never went out as a couple after our children were born so there’s no worries about that. I mostly just hole myself up in my room and read or game. She reads, surfs the internet, goes to bed and the next day we start again. I’m going to continue like this until she changes her attitude substantially or until the time is right for a divorce. I’m not sure when that will be. I also worry about the children and right now I’m on the fence about staying together for them and living through a loveless marriage or just enduring whatever pain a divorce will bring and trying to start my life over. Just sort of waiting for something to happen right now.


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## KanDo (Jun 15, 2011)

Ok. What the heck is wrong with you!You are living a cuckold life and in some perverse way accepting blame. Why are you allowing this? I would take my children back to the USA YESTERDAY! I would divorce this woman, either in the US or her country if it is easier. I would bring her back to her family and tell them they can have her and I would let EVERYONE know why. I'm quite glad you didn't get her citizenship. You say you are worried about the children; but what are you teaching them about relationships.

Please respect yourself and get out of this nightmare. You are being used so badly I wish I could reach through the computer screen and shake you by the shoulders! How could a divorce be worse than what you have now? (it can't!)

Grow some testicles. Act like a man and demand the respect you deserve.


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## AlphaHalf (Aug 5, 2012)

You are making unlimited excuses for her behavior. STOP. Get your children and Divorce her. You need to go to counseling. That woman is poison. She is using you and you're allowing her with your many, many bullshyte excuses. Divorce her and stop being a doormat, in your case a landing strip.
Get your pride and self esteem back, Take care of your children and move on from her.


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

Wow.

Get the kids back to the US.

File for D, and seize their passports.

Expose her AFFAIR to her parents and family.

Expose the OM to his parents and family, and to hers.

Tell her she can leave and go back if she wants but the children stay in the US with you.

Stop letting her live the happy life of a cheater, stop letting her play with your emotions with her selfish lies and justifications.

Fact: She's a wife who betrayed her husband and children to have a sexual affair with another man.

Expose this fact wide and far.


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## wiigirl (Jun 14, 2012)

KanDo said:


> Ok. What the heck is wrong with you!You are living a cuckold life and in some perverse way accepting blame. Why are you allowing this? I would take my children back to the USA YESTERDAY! I would divorce this woman, either in the US or her country if it is easier. I would bring her back to her family and tell them they can have her and I would let EVERYONE know why. I'm quite glad you didn't get her citizenship. You say you are worried about the children; but what are you teaching them about relationships.
> 
> Please respect yourself and get out of this nightmare. You are being used so badly I wish I could reach through the computer screen and shake you by the shoulders! How could a divorce be worse than what you have now? (it can't!)
> 
> Grow some testicles. Act like a man and demand the respect you deserve.


:iagree:








_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

BTW - everything she has told you is straight out of the cheating wife standard list of things to say. Everything - there is nothing in there that is unique to her.


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

WTF man!!! I had to stop reading in the middle. I hope this isn't some fiction. This is horrible. Get some help for yourself and kick your leech of your wife out. If she does not have a visa, dump her in her country and expose her to the family.

She is not fit to be a mother.


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## NonSequiturer (Sep 30, 2012)

In all fairness to her and not to defend but I have never felt like she was using me for my citizenship. It's not like that. Not trying to argue with anyone who comes to the conclusion that she's using me but if that's why you came to that conclusion, it really isn't true. If she were, I don't think the problem would exactly like that. She's not interested in my money but would take it only to support the children in the event of a divorce.


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## NonSequiturer (Sep 30, 2012)

Shaggy said:


> BTW - everything she has told you is straight out of the cheating wife standard list of things to say. Everything - there is nothing in there that is unique to her.


Thanks. This site is rapidly making me understand that.


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

NonSequiturer said:


> In all fairness to her and not to defend but I have never felt like she was using me for my citizenship. It's not like that. Not trying to argue with anyone who comes to the conclusion that she's using me but if that's why you came to that conclusion, it really isn't true. If she were, I don't think the problem would exactly like that. She's not interested in my money but would take it only to support the children in the event of a divorce.


But what if she is being manipulated by her lover ? 

And is she from south asia ?

Why haven't you exposed her to her family ?


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## Kasler (Jul 20, 2012)

Jesus christ. Theres being a beta and then theres being a BETA.

I would say Man up, but after nearly a decade of your balls being tucked away in her purse I'm not sure you'd be able to. 

I'm not trying to offend you, but you are way too passive and it is that beta male passiveness that has ENABLED her all these years.

If you made a stand not to tolerate this crap and let her know it wouldn't be accepted, you most likely wouldn't be here right now.

She kept doing it because you kept groveling and putting up with it.

Stop worrying about her problems. You may think your children are blind and unaware of whats happening but they aren't and this will impact them negatively to see their father be abused by their mother.


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## NonSequiturer (Sep 30, 2012)

warlock07 said:


> But what if she is being manipulated by her lover ?
> 
> And is she from south asia ?
> 
> Why haven't you exposed her to her family ?


He might be but it doesn't seem like it. He loses in the long run from this relationship too because his family would be greatly shamed as well. I wouldn't be surprised if the international connection was a factor but not in a manipulating way. They're both too childlike and romantic to do that.

Yes, South Asia. I guess that wasn't that hard to figure out.

I haven't exposed her because I don't want to further damage things in that way. If I go the divorce route, they'll figure it out since they've heard rumors already.


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## NonSequiturer (Sep 30, 2012)

Kasler said:


> Jesus christ. Theres being a beta and then theres being a BETA.
> 
> I would say Man up, but after nearly a decade of your balls being tucked away in her purse I'm not sure you'd be able to.
> 
> ...


Yes I know I should stop worrying about her problems at this point. I worried about her problems before because I loved her and she was mentally ill. Maybe that was enabling. She's not a bad person. Just very, very shortsighted, stubborn and pessimistic. Again, not trying to argue. Just trying to clarify.


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## Emerald (Aug 2, 2012)

So you married a cool, sexy, foreign chick but felt she was a "burden" to you & "all marriages are like that in the beginning"...NOT...she was depressed being away from her country, family & friends & you tried to "fix her" (you are not a doctor)..so you were a bit "mean" to her & controlling........ugggg not to mention you cheated on her before marriage.....ugggg

However, despite the above, her cheating his not your fault. Divorce her & she can be with the man who she is happy with.


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## KanDo (Jun 15, 2011)

NonSequiturer said:


> Yes I know I should stop worrying about her problems at this point. I worried about her problems before because I loved her and she was mentally ill. Maybe that was enabling. She's not a bad person. Just very, very shortsighted, stubborn and pessimistic. Again, not trying to argue. Just trying to clarify.


*Stop making excuses!* She is using you. No one suggested it was for the immigration aspect. You are supporting her and her affair. And stop saying she is a nice person. *SHE IS NOT!*Nice people don't cuckold their husband. 

Please get your act together. Salavage your life and your children. No more excuse.


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## 67flh (Sep 26, 2011)

grab your kids, hop on a plane and disappear,no warning just do it..


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## Kallan Pavithran (Jan 17, 2012)

AHHHHHHHHHHHHH,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,................

Where is your balls, Try to find it back even if you need FBI or CIA for that.

Expose her to all of her community.

There is really something wrong with you come back to US dont stay with your children else they will get the feeling that Its OK to be a cuckold as dady did.


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## Falene (Dec 31, 2011)

You need to get your kids back to the US yesterday!!!! (Pretend fifty people are screaming this into your ear!) Get reassigned as soon as you can no matter what the cost.

If this is not an option, I would force her into giving you sole custody under her native country's jurisdiction under the threat of telling her family about her affair. That way, if it all blows up, she cannot legally keep the kids from you and start country hopping.

I would not leave my children with her under any circumstance simply due to her emotional unstability and her need to "undo" what she sees as years of torture.

Beyond that, I am so sorry you are here but you drew first blood on the affair front and she responded in kind. You didn't deserve her affair anymore than she deserved yours but that point is somewhat moot now.

I also don't know what you expected when she came to the US but you know how we can be and I find your lack of support for her to be very unkind indeed.

I cannot imagine this marriage being saved. If I were you, I would focus on the kids and getting through their childhood doing as less damage to them as possible. I would insist that her affair partner be removed from the business entirely, never be allowed around the children or her family, again under the threat of exposure. You are never going to be okay looking at his arse on continual basis.


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## NonSequiturer (Sep 30, 2012)

Emerald said:


> So you married a cool, sexy, foreign chick but felt she was a "burden" to you & "all marriages are like that in the beginning"...NOT...she was depressed being away from her country, family & friends & you tried to "fix her" (you are not a doctor)..so you were a bit "mean" to her & controlling........ugggg not to mention you cheated on her before marriage.....ugggg
> 
> However, despite the above, her cheating his not your fault. Divorce her & she can be with the man who she is happy with.


You're right. But as I said, things improved after time and I treated her much better. She didn't progress though. She just had an affair. I didn't meet her emotional needs at first which caused her emotional needs to increase dramatically. I could never catch up.

I can't come back to the U.S. because my career is overseas. I'd have to quit my job. 

Anyway, I appreciate the urging to be more ALPHA male about this. I'm trying. I'm really sincere in the 180 stuff and am feeling better about myself and what happened. I'm not shouldering the blame anymore in my own brain and I'm not talking to her at all about the problems so not taking her side. She's playing nice. Actually we're really just not talking at all unless it's needed. I don't know if that's pure 180 or not but it's not the silent treatment. I'm doing my thing and she's doing hers. I'm trying to keep things from getting worse for myself in terms of emotions because it's affecting my job and health. I'm not trying to get back with her and not ruling out divorce. I really believe that my children come first and so far they haven't been dramatically affected by anything.


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

NonSequiturer said:


> You're right. But as I said, things improved after time and I treated her much better. She didn't progress though. She just had an affair. I didn't meet her emotional needs at first which caused her emotional needs to increase dramatically. I could never catch up.
> 
> I can't come back to the U.S. because my career is overseas. I'd have to quit my job.
> 
> Anyway, I appreciate the urging to be more ALPHA male about this. I'm trying. I'm really sincere in the 180 stuff and am feeling better about myself and what happened. I'm not shouldering the blame anymore in my own brain and I'm not talking to her at all about the problems so not taking her side. She's playing nice. Actually we're really just not talking at all unless it's needed. I don't know if that's pure 180 or not but it's not the silent treatment. I'm doing my thing and she's doing hers. I'm trying to keep things from getting worse for myself in terms of emotions because it's affecting my job and health. I'm not trying to get back with her and not ruling out divorce. I really believe that my children come first and so far they haven't been dramatically affected by anything.


She is playing nice because you are giving her everything she wants and accepting to live a her cuckold.

Oh, and you refuse to expose the cheating, to cut her off financially, or to stand up to her.

What's left for her to actually be upset about?

Do you also pay for her vacation travel so she can meet up with the OM?


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

Emerald said:


> So you married a cool, sexy, foreign chick but felt she was a "burden" to you & "all marriages are like that in the beginning"...NOT...she was depressed being away from her country, family & friends & you tried to "fix her" (you are not a doctor)..so you were a bit "mean" to her & controlling........ugggg not to mention you cheated on her before marriage.....ugggg
> 
> However, despite the above, her cheating his not your fault. Divorce her & she can be with the man who she is happy with.


How much can he carry her ? And people learn through relationships. You just don't turn up to the marriage day as a complete perfect package. OP did not know how to deal with him being her only source of social contact. He later adapted to suit her needs, didn't he ? 

OP, she learnt how you would react to infidelity from her first experience. You chose to ignore it and she learnt the she could get away with cheating without much. Here is a woman that repeatedly cheated and cuckolded you and you are trying to win her back!! This total post is ridiculous. He behavior is utterly selfish and cruel.

What is your plan ? What did you expect by posting here ? repair your marriage?


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

This is the most frustrating post I've come in a long time. OP, did you have a difficult childhood ?


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## SomedayDig (Jul 17, 2012)

This whole story is a non sequitur!

Bring home your foreign wife and she's totally dogging you by having multiple affairs and you still want to be with her?

I'm curious...since you just signed up yesterday and posted this story about doing the 180 and whatnot - where did you learn that technique? You said you started doing the 180 five days ago. What specifically did you do?


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## NonSequiturer (Sep 30, 2012)

warlock07 said:


> OP, she learnt how you would react to infidelity from her first experience. You chose to ignore it and she learnt the she could get away with cheating without much. Here is a woman that repeatedly cheated and cuckolded you and you are trying to win her back!! This total post is ridiculous. He behavior is utterly selfish and cruel.
> 
> This is the most frustrating post I've come in a long time. OP, did you have a difficult childhood ?


Wow. I didn't expect the reactions I'd get from this. Maybe it's the way I wrote it? I don't understand how my situation is more ridiculous to readers than some of the others here. She didn’t repeatedly cheat. It was twice. I didn’t “chose to ignore it” the first time but forgave her and moved on. I definitely agree that I shouldn’t have been surprised that it happened a second time because of the first time but I don’t agree that I should have cut her loose instantly after the first time. And I’m surprised to hear that from someone who has clearly been around this website for a while. I’m not trying to win her back. I’m trying to move on as I’ve said. Also, how is a difficult childhood relevant here? I didn't by the way.



> What is your plan ? What did you expect by posting here ? repair your marriage?


I don't really have a plan right now. It's been less than a week since I radically changed the way I'm thinking about this and understanding that I need to be proactive and stop catering to her. By posting here, I expected some feedback and sympathy and understanding. I'm not thinking about repairing my marriage at all right now. I'm thinking about repairing my mental state. Then I’ll come up with a plan.



> Bring home your foreign wife and she's totally dogging you by having multiple affairs and you still want to be with her?
> 
> I'm curious...since you just signed up yesterday and posted this story about doing the 180 and whatnot - where did you learn that technique? You said you started doing the 180 five days ago. What specifically did you do?


Yes. As I said, I loved her. We have two children together. We don't want to ruin their lives. I read about the 180 from these kinds of websites. It's fairly simple. I'm trying to do exactly as it guides. I understand the distinction between doing a 180 to manipulate the situation in some way and doing it to regain mental strength. I had done the first but now I'm firmly doing the second.



> Where is your balls, Try to find it back even if you need FBI or CIA for that.


There have been a few posts like this and I have to say they are not helpful at all. It might be more helpful to me if you explain what you mean by not having my balls or not being ALPHA instead of this sort of accusation. Was I being too passive in being patient with a wife who needed attention? How should I have dealt with someone with mental illness? Should I have thrown her out because she was severely depressed? Should I have given up, particularly when this person was an immigrant? I don't think so. Maybe you could argue that I should have shown her even MORE tough love than I did so as not to enable her but that didn't seem like the right thing to do at the time. Should I throw away a marriage that was before the affair very important to me and worth being in despite the problems? Should I risk losing custody of my children and have them grow up in a situation that isn’t as good as they could have it?


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## Weeravadee Kitsapan (Jun 11, 2012)

Is she Thai?


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## NonSequiturer (Sep 30, 2012)

No ka.


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## hookares (Dec 7, 2011)

NonSequiturer:
"Wow. I didn't expect the reactions I'd get from this. Maybe it's the way I wrote it? I don't understand how my situation is more ridiculous to readers than some of the others here. She didn’t repeatedly cheat. It was twice. I didn’t “chose to ignore it” the first time but forgave her and moved on. I definitely agree that I shouldn’t have been surprised that it happened a second time because of the first time but I don’t agree that I should have cut her loose instantly after the first time. And I’m surprised to hear that from someone who has clearly been around this website for a while. I’m not trying to win her back. I’m trying to move on as I’ve said. Also, how is a difficult childhood relevant here? I didn't by the way."

These post may seem harsh to you but there's wisdom , of sorts,in each.
What people are trying to make you aware of is that NOW is the time to react since you didn't choose to do so when you fiorst became aware of her cheating.
For example, had I been aware of my ex's first affair, she would have had to place a paper bag over her lover's head in order to climb into the sack with him because of the beating I would have given him.
I chose to ignore the signs and twenty years later, my story became worse than yours.
Good luck.


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## badbane (Jun 9, 2012)

NonSequiturer said:


> Sorry this is a bit long but it’s been going on for two years and there’s a lot to tell. Also, I’m writing this to get it out of my system and I want to get the whole story down. I’m also writing to get some sympathy and understanding and some ideas and wisdom from the community about what’s happened to me. I happened upon this website last night and found it very helpful. I had looked through other similar websites but for whatever reasons this one resonated more. Maybe because I’m in a relatively better place at the moment. I’ve read several stories similar to mine on this website and was really surprised at the similarities. I guess like many men I never thought I’d be in this position. I guess somehow I thought what had happened to me was so bad that it couldn’t have happened like this to others. Maybe I just wasn’t aware that this kind of insanity and pain really existed.
> 
> Anyway, here’s the story. My wife has been having an affair for the past two years. We have been married 11 years and have two children. We’ve been living overseas for the past five years where I work in a different country every few years. I’m American but my wife is not. I met her about 13 years ago when I was working in her country as a volunteer teaching English abroad. We dated for about 18 months before we were married despite that fact that women aren’t supposed to have boyfriends in her country and a foreign boyfriend would be hugely forbidden. Her culture and mine are very different. But she was fun, sexy, smart, outgoing, rebellious, crazy, etc. and that was attractive. I was in a really immersive volunteer program so I got to know her culture and language well and I felt I understood her. She seemed to be more open-minded and adventurous and cosmopolitan than other people from her country and I liked her a lot and came to love her. She didn’t fit in exactly with my American friends but well enough because she was fun-loving and adventurous and we went out a lot and had fun. I started to feel like I wanted to marry her.
> 
> ...


Okay I just had to read this while not trying to shake my head over and over. Yes you screwed up with the marriage part. However she chose not to try to integrate into American Society. She probably really enjoyed the fact that she was with the rich american. Then you get married and she leaves her comfort zone. My major question is why didn't you bring her home to the states to see how she would react to it. I mean you could have found small groups of people who have immigrated from her country and given her a foothold. But regardless it is good that you accept your part in the marriage.




Now comes the tough love part. You have run, rug swept, and accepted her lifestyle. You have in no way made it hard for her to have an affair. The affair was continuous and ongoing. It means that she has probably been sleeping with him very regularly. In my head if my wife was emotional attached and was having sex with another man regularly. I would have told her family, and friends, and everyone else.
Not because I am an evil vindictive SOB, but because this man she is with can't possibly be a good influence on your children. Since you travel and are away from them extended periods this OM will likely be spending a fair amount of time with the kids. Do you really want their step dad or mom's boyfriend to be a pot smoking 25 year old hippie. Of course not, I think you need to take a break from work. Get your kids in America. Divorce this woman because she is unstable and is unwilling to face the truth. 

You need to understand the second she started looking for attention and affection in an inappropriate manner, is the second the marriage was compromised. That means that she is getting all this love (emotional and physical) from someone outside of the marriage. That means that the marriage then becomes just a credit line.
She could have divorced you and then been with the other man. It would have been far less insult to her, her family, and you if she had. Instead she did the most dishonorable thing possible. Until you end this ridiculous relationship with the OM you don't stand a chance. You do realize that you are paying for this man to screw your wife. 

You need to stop trying to be the nice guy here. You are just hurting yourself and your children. I don't for the life of me get how you think that you don't understand that your kids are seeing this OM probably as much as you are. 

You need to either expose her or you tell her you are going to expose her for her actions, because what you did was nothing compared to sleeping with another man. That will get her attention. Then you tell her you will not accept staying married with her unless she is fully committed and loyal. Right now you are your WIFE's fall back plan. If you don't think she is just manipulating you to are dead wrong. She is playing you, using the kids as pawns, to protect her relationship with the OM. How long do you think this OM is going to stick around once he realizes this much older woman can't give him his free handout? 

Set your damn boundaries and enforce them. What you don't understand is that she is as much at fault as you in the way the marriage went to hell. In her country I am willing to bet it is male dominated. That means that if you want her to go out, not only should she do it, but her culture has raised her to be that way. It isn't your fault she got homesick and wanted to go back to her mommy and daddy. 

I think you need to stop with the passive agressive stance here. We all read your story. When you go back behind your story and start trying to make us see things in a different light. Or try to spin things guess what. We see the reg flags waiving. Don't you see that you are still trying to take up for this woman like she is the shy anti social woman that you needed to protect. Guess what? She is at home now and isn't anti social or shy. No in fact she is suddenly confident, and brazen. This woman is insanely selfish and has put the blame on you so she doesn't have to face the truth. 

Put an end to it. You are not your wife's plan B. You need to tell her this. You wife is enjoying a very good lifestyle in her home country thanks to your paycheck. In return she sleeps with some pot smoking hippie. I am willing to bet she is helping him out financially. Why else would a 25 year old pot smoking hippie stick around. 

You have enabled this for far too long. You have been running from this for far too long. Decide what you want.

If you are going to R. Then lay out the ground rules. rule number one is she is not to speak, to the OM until the day you are dead. 
Rule number 2 You both will go see a marriage councilor regularly and will not quit because you don't like what you were told. (she probably quit because she didn't like hearing that her excuses for what she has done were getting nixed faster than she could make them up. )
number 3 She will do whatever in necessary to try to integrate into American Society. 

Then you make up whatever else you need her to do to prove to you that she is willing to do whatever it takes to save her marriage. 

Stop letting her dictate to you how your marriage is supposed to be. You're letting this woman ( who wants and open marriage) tell you what you have to do to keep her. WHY IN THE HECK WOULD YOU SAY YES.
WHY ARE YOU TAKING THIS?

Now if you realize this woman is not the woman that she pretended to be when you two got married, then proceed with D. OR if she won't commit to your boundaries and to what you need her to do to keep your marriage then D. You need to expose this because her family is probably trying to sweep this under the rug to avoid the dishonor it will bring to her family. Which is probably a good thing since your wife will finally face the real truth of what she has chosen to do. Her actions are what has caused all of this. Not the problems in your marriage. Hell everyone has problems, I am willing to be there are successful marriages out there with more complications than yours without infidelity. 

Stop treating this woman like she is the helpless woman you had to do everything for. She didn't try, That is a fact. How many other women have come to this country from hers and been just fine? probably plenty. So yea I don't by that she gave it her all. I think she just doesn't like to do or try things that require effort and her not being the one in control. 
Also how does a woman get CONNED into sex. I mean really I do not care what country you are from and how hard life is. She really did not need the job and she could have just left instead she had sex with him. Given the fact that you know she is willing to cheat, how likely to do you think that the "conned" story is really accurate? 

All right I am done I hope you listen and follow the advice given. You deserve to be happy and your kids deserve a stable home. your wife is not willing to do either. So for goodness sake if you go with D get your kids back to america and dissolve this marriage. I hope to goodness you didn't get offically married outside the US. that will complicate things. But I suggest you cut back on your career some and start focusing on your kids now. They are your most important thing now.


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