# 5 Months into Separation



## jfscprof (Apr 24, 2012)

Yup, just another separated dude with a need for some, what? Catharsis? Support? Answers? I don't know. I'll try to be succinct:

Stats:

Married: 16
Together: 18
Kids: S 11, D 7
Separated: 5 months
DDay: EA June 2011, PA May 2012

Tumultuous from the word go. I was coming off of my first marriage when the W and I met, so wasn't eager to jump into another serious relationship. That said, she was everything I was looking for, so let the heart overrule the mind. Made for a rough beginning.

Because I was cautious due to my first marriage (yes, she cheated on me), I never fully opened up to the W. As a result, she never fully felt secure in our relationship, and since she was/is insecure to begin with, we devolved into fighting. A lot. Because I never used to be a confrontational kind of guy, I turned increasingly to the bottle to weather the emotional storm our relationship was. You can figure out the rest.

Fast forward to 2009. I was in the military and coming up on retirement in June of 2009. HUGE stress, and the drinking went through the roof. Subsequently, so did our arguing. It came to a point in the winter of '09 where we got physical with each other. I initiated the row by slapping her hands away from me, and it devolved from there. No punching or slapping, but a lot of pushing and shoving and carnal frustration. Finally, in June of '09 after driving my daughter home drunk after a daddy/daughter date, I came to my senses and finally hit bottom WRT my alcoholism. I acknowledged my problem, went cold turkey, and quit drinking for a year. That first year really was about being sober for me, so my focus was on me and not the family. The second year, 2010 - 2011 was trying to figure out my guilt and how to make things right in our relationship.

Well, by the time I was coming out of my fog, my W was entering into hers with a guy I coached little league with, and whose children were good friends with ours. I found out about how much they were talking to each other from a friend of mine, and when I took a look at our phone bill it confirmed his point. They were talking almost an hour EVERY day, in addition to several texts a day. Naturally, I confronted her and asked what was going on, to which she went to "the script" and denied anything untoward was taking place -- they were just friends. When I did some research on EA's and recognized how my issues had precipitated her attraction to the other man (recently divorced), I immediately laid down the ultimatum that she had to go NC, and that I wanted the two of us to really work on making our marriage better. She tearfully agreed, concurred with the decision to see a MC, all while maintaining a relationship with the OM from her work phone (I found this out later. You all know the script)

So, for a year I feel like we're really trying to work it out. We have our ups and downs, but I figured after 17 years together that was bound to happen. Fast forward again to March of 2012. I took a week long trip to Germany for work, and when I returned, things were . . . off. With the MC she was very defensive, so when we got home I suggested we not even worry about sex (since that was one of our standard sore points) and just go to our separate corners. Well, she jumped on that and turned it into, "We need to separate. I need my space. ILYBNILWY." Blah, blah, blah. Script again.

At first we agreed to an in-house separation, but then it turned into the need for me to move out of the house. I know what you experienced hands are thinking about now, because I've been trolling this site since I DID move out. At any rate, I did.

You all know the rest. I moved out 16 April. I was at the house for her birthday on the third of May, and she asked if I'd mind watching the kids while she went and got a spray tan. She inadvertently left her phone behind so, feeling in my gut that something has been up for over a year, I checked her texts and sure enough found a conversation between her and a friend describing her PA with the OM. In detail. Nice.

So here we are. I'm in my own apartment now, while she stays in the house with our kids so as to disrupt their lives as little as possible. She's finally come out of the fog WRT the OM, but it was only within the last few weeks that the realization hit her that he wasn't in love with her like she was with him. Now she says she doesn't know what to do. She "cares" for me, but doesn't have feelings for me. She wants to work on herself, but can't articulate what, exactly, that means other than how I interpret it as: I-get-to-be-on-my-own-without-the-worry-of-financial-issues. Maybe I'm wrong.

So that was VERY long winded. Here's my dilemma. I was absent for most of our marriage, and alcoholism exacerbated the issue. Now that we are where we are, the wisdom on this sight says to go 180, to get a pair and stand up to her, etc, etc, etc. My problem is that accepting that course of action puts me right back where we were before. How do I express to her how I've recognized the error of my ways without looking like a weakling she would have no interest in whatsoever, while at the same time not appearing as though I've learned nothing from our past?

Sheesh!


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## Couleur (Apr 4, 2012)

You and your wife are both damaged and have both damaged your marriage, but it seems to me that you are taking all the right steps to get your life together -- no more drinking, doing the 180, trying to see if you can repair the marriage, not using the kids as weapons. Even if your wife is paying attention to what you are doing it will take a sustained effort (let's say 1 month for every year of marriage) to convince her that you have truly changed.

What concerns me is that your wife may not be paying attention, may not be doing any of the heavy lifting, and if this is so then all of your efforts will be for nothing.

So....
make sure that your wife is in counseling. I'd prefer IC and MC, but if she's not ready for MC yet, at least have her do the IC.
I'd make sure to have a very blunt conversation and find out if you and she have the same view of your separation (you think you might reconcile, does she, truly deep down share this view?).
Keep on doing the 180, and to the extend that you can start doing even more father-kid activities. Nurture that relationship, especially since you are not in the house and kids tend to view the parent who is absent as the "bad guy" even if it is the in-house parent who had the affair, etc.

What are you reading? Who are you talking to?


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## jfscprof (Apr 24, 2012)

Couleur, thanks for your well considered response. First, I really haven't talked to anyone. My W asked that I not expose the affair, to which I've agreed, not least because our children would be the ones to suffer. I wish I could throw the antiseptic of light on the whole sordid affair, but the kids matter.
Second, I've read, "The Divorce Remedy" "The Love Dare" "Light Her Fire" as well as a host of online fora and other literature. I've been searching for "right" while she seemingly has been doing not a lot of anything.

Though it's her weekend with the kids, I'm taking my daughter on a trip to Maryland to visit with one of my best friends. They have a daughter who's the same age as mine, so I thought I could do a father/daughter weekend.

I guess my whole thing boils down to whether I'm patient enough to see this thing through, or not. We had an exchange today that went this way:

After a phone call where I was straight business, she texted:

"I guess u haven't the patience after all?"

To which I replied, 
"1 question: What does working on yourself mean? What is your vision for that?"

She called at that point, and I answered (I know, I know), and then she said:
"You can be happy now and don't have to worry about good days and bad."

So I responded:
"Shannon, I want our marriage to work but I'm tired of the drama. Please stop calling until you have an idea what it is we're doing. "I don't know" ain't cuttin it anymore. Know, and we can move fwd. I want nothing more than to be with you."

She came back with the guilt:
"Everything I wanted us to be never happened . . . I guess I juste wanted too much. You will never know how much I loved you."

And I stupidly responded:
"And with your blinders on, you'll never know how much you are loved now."

Anyway, that's where we are. I appreciate your comments and hope this can move us forward.


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## ImStillHere (Apr 25, 2012)

I agree with Couleur, she needs IC. Both of you do, actually. 

She won't be able to move forward in a healthy way towards R--or D, for that matter--unless she gets her life in order. If you are willing to wait for her to get better, then more power to you. 

In the meantime, all you can really do is focus on yourself (yes, the 180) and spend as much time as possible with the kids. 

By the way, other TAM regulars (Lifescript, Our Vision Shattered, UpandOver, and Synthetic, to name a few) have threads on similar situations to yours and have had wives recognize changes in them via the 180, even if they are living separately. But, of course, it doesn't always lead to R. It just depends on the couple. 

I hope everything works out the best for both of you.


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## jfscprof (Apr 24, 2012)

Thanks, ImStillHere. I'm all over the map right now and just wish I could figure out what "right" looks like. Whenever I try to go 180 and keep it "just the facts, ma'am" it feels all wrong. That was my problem leading up to the EA/PA, so how can it be what's going to work now?

I have been focusing on me (working out, enrolling in a PhD program, trying to make new friends, being a better dad for my kids, etc.) and I've truly enjoyed reintroducing some happiness into my life. That said, I'll have days like yesterday where it all just comes crashing down for no apparent reason. I feel like I've been going through this metamorphosis, which is what's important, but my W has done nothing for herself. I get no feedback from her other than how she doesn't love me anymore, and how she needs to work on herself, but I see nothing.

My heart tells me to be patient, suck it up, and let her go about healing in her own way and in her own time (the OM is out of the picture, by the way -- her fog has been lifting in that regard), but my mind tells me to cut her loose and let her figure things out on her own without the added "stress" of our so-called relationship. I'm just tired of all the freakin' mind games and chess moves. And ultimately, I want what's best for our kids. If we D, then they will have to move out of the house and into an apartment away from all of their friends. Sucks!

I wish I was smarter and stronger with regard to this stuff. It's really tearing me apart!


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## jfscprof (Apr 24, 2012)

*Re: 5 Months into Separation -- And I Just Went All In*

Well, had lunch with the W today after what was a rough night. Thought about it pretty much all night and decided I have to let her go. Outside of the kids and finances, I determined that the only way she can work on her issues, and the only way I can avoid the crazy, is if we essentially go NC. I have to let her live her life on her terms, and I have to live mine on my terms. If it's meant to be, then we'll know soon enough. If it's not, we'll know that too. We have a year before we can file for divorce, so I plan on using that year to let her go and let the chips fall where they may.

I've either just screwed any chance I have at R, or I just saved my marriage. Who knows? I sure don't, but I feel better for expressing my unconditional love for her, rather than hanging on for dear life and squeezing any emotion right out of her. Thoughts from this awesome crowd? The folks who have "been there, done that?"


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## Feelingalone (Apr 22, 2009)

What you did jfscprof, in my opinion, was the only thing for you to do. To not only free her, but really to free yourself. 

However, the rollercoaster isn't over. You'll have highs, lows and everything in between. Everyone goes through the five stages of loss during separation or after divorce. Even your kids, they just might not show it on the surface.

I wish you well on your journey.


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## C3156 (Jun 13, 2012)

*Re: 5 Months into Separation -- And I Just Went All In*



jfscprof said:


> Thought about it pretty much all night and decided I have to let her go.


Based on what I read, this is all you can do. She has given you the ILYBINILWY already. Now she is just stringing you along because she wants to hold on to something since the OM left her.

She is done but does not have the courage to just say it out loud. You have done what you can, now worry about you and being the best Dad that you can.


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## jfscprof (Apr 24, 2012)

Thanks, Feelingalone and C3156.

I know the roller coaster is just getting started. This was far and away the most difficult decision I've ever had to make, and one of the most counterintuitive. What a complete mess!

As it stands right now, neither one of us is planning on dating, but should either of us decide that's what we want to do, we've agreed to let the other know.

And I will focus on my kids and on myself for the time being to try and ease their angst and any fears they may have. They've been pretty stoic so far, but like you say, Feelingalone, they don't always wear their emotions on their sleeves.

It's helpful having this great support board, and I guess I'll just write a daily entry or so as a means of catharsis, and as a means to corral my thoughts. Any advice, input, 2X4's to the head, etc. will be greatly appreciated. Thanks!


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## Feelingalone (Apr 22, 2009)

jfscprof,

As you said, keep working on yourself. You've overcome some things that not many do in life. For a somewhat similar story to yours, read through Breakin Down the Walls in the Private Member's section by Voivid. He battled health and addiction problems that contributed to his marriage dissolving, although he has choosen just recently to reconcile (even after divorcing). This has taken years to develop. 

But the best thing he did, was work on himself...


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## jfscprof (Apr 24, 2012)

Feelingalone said:


> jfscprof,
> 
> As you said, keep working on yourself. You've overcome some things that not many do in life. For a somewhat similar story to yours, read through Breakin Down the Walls in the Private Member's section by Voivid. He battled health and addiction problems that contributed to his marriage dissolving, although he has choosen just recently to reconcile (even after divorcing). This has taken years to develop.
> 
> But the best thing he did, was work on himself...


_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## jfscprof (Apr 24, 2012)

Feelingalone, thanks, and that's definitely the plan. I'll check out his post for sure. For me, quitting drinking was easy, dealing with the carnage it wrought in my personal life, and the overwhelming guilt that came with that dawning realization has been the hard part. The thing that really stinks is that I know I'm the guy my W wished I'd been all along and I want to do nothing but put her up on that pedestal where she belongs, but I'm afraid I'm too late. THAT'S what really eats me up fight now!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## ImStillHere (Apr 25, 2012)

jfscprof, are you in IC? 

BTW, I strongly urge you to hold off on dating until you are officially D. Adding another person to this situation isn't good, especially when you have so much change (wife, kids, school, etc.) going on in your life.

At this point, your life is unstable. Is it fair to bring someone else into an unstable environment? Take care of yourself and your family first.


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## RDL (Feb 10, 2012)

Hello,

Firstly you need to come from a position of understanding. There are complex and powerful emotions at work and they are poorly understood. 

Your situation has many similarities with the patterns described in WomensInfidelity. I strongly suggest you read the book for a good explanation of the causes and emotions involved from your wife's point of view. 

Come back with feedback after reading please.


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## jfscprof (Apr 24, 2012)

Freedomcorp, I appreciate the input, and I actually read Michelle Langley's book as soon as I had discovered the EA back in June of 2011. While there's a lot in her book that makes sense, there's also a lot that isn't taken into consideration for our particular circumstance. I think there are some things about her thesis I can see in my W, but there are other powerful factors from our past, not least of which was living with an alcoholic, so I use her info as a data point and nothing more. Thanks.

On another note, we're in day 2 of our NC gambit, and my W called me out of the blue to tell me about a conversation she had with her girlfriends about their husbands, their sex lives, how they handle conflict, etc. From that she apparently came away feeling as though maybe we weren't too far off the "normal" mark after all. She is still talking in absolute terms, "You never . . ." or "You always . . ." or "We always . . ." which I call her on, but I find this to be an encouraging sign. Am I being gullible, or stupid? I mean, it's not like she's had any time to miss me, this is only day 2, and we started this course of action at lunch yesterday, so what should I take away from this?

As always, the keen insight from you veterans of the emotion wars is sought after and welcome! Thanks.


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## ImStillHere (Apr 25, 2012)

jfscprof said:


> so what should I take away from this?


Nothing, right now. As Conrad would say, keep observing her actions. Stay NC as much as possible. 

If this type of awareness continues (after a period of months or so), then you two can talk more about it. 

Are you in IC?


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