# So I Have A Friend Whose Wife Had An Affair...



## MountainRunner (Dec 30, 2014)

...with a young girl who lived with them.

This post is about human nature, religion, and how "religion" doesn't always work to help people, so you've been warned.

He and his wife are Baptist and have been very active in their church. He is ordained and a drummer for the band. They attend functions at the church all the time...or at least...they used to...before the "church" kicked them to the curb after the lesbian affair was discovered.

What I found so disturbing about this whole sordid affair was how he and his wife were ostracized and finally kicked out of the congregation. The young lady was homeless and needed a place to live so my friend and his wife took her in, gave her a room. After some time, my friend (who was a former employee of mine) discovered that his wife and the young lady were "exploring their sexuality" with toys and whatnot. Without going into any great detail, it was discovered and she was convicted and is now a sex offender. She went to jail for about 9 months. During this time, their church turned their backs on them and would not allow them to worship...Way to go guys...I'm sure that is EXACTLY what Jesus would do.

And now to my friend...

He forgave her, took her back, and it has been 4 years since the event.

My friend is a "true" Christian IMHO...The congregation on the other hand? I hope they all burn in Hell for what they did to these people. Christians? Laughable. Another reason why "religion" leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

I am not religious, nor have I ever been baptized...For reasons that I just described. I don't want to be affiliated with a "religion" that casts out sinners. When I studied Theology in Catholic School, forgiveness, tolerance, understanding was the message I got from the Beatitudes and other scripture.


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

Having witnessed some of the events leading up to a few people being asked to leave a church (sometimes nicely, other times not so much), I can tell you that it's not something that the leader of a congregation does or takes at all lightly.

Still, at some point a shepherd has to be more concerned w/ the overall well-being of his or her flock than he/she is w/ a couple of wayward sheep, especially if said sheep make a _habit_ of wandering about.

And it's possible that may have been -- at least to some degree -- what happened here.


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## thatbpguy (Dec 24, 2012)

I agree.

"Religious" does not equal "genuine believer".


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

thatbpguy said:


> I agree.
> 
> "Religious" does not equal "genuine believer".


It's worth nothing that the opposite is also true.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

I'll disagree with you on this one.

Some dumb ass mutherfvxker uses church and charity to rape or molest kids in my congregation and they better hope the authorities get to them before I do!

Christians that don't protect kids are a waste of skin.

Child molesters need to stay the hell away from kids.

Church should be a safe place for families and children.

Your friend's wife fvcked it up. Not the church.

I have zero sympathy for child molesters and rapists.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

P.S. A lot of my abusers were hiding in church. My wife lost her virginity as a teenager from a married deacon that was supposed to be shepherding the youth.

Once people become sex offenders, you have to consider the safety of the innocent ahead of the offender.

You want the nice reformed child rapist involved with your little ones?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

How old was the homeless girl?


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## TRy (Sep 14, 2011)

MountainRunner said:


> What I found so disturbing about this whole sordid affair was how he and his wife were ostracized and finally kicked out of the congregation. The young lady was homeless and needed a place to live so my friend and his wife took her in, gave her a room. After some time, my friend (who was a former employee of mine) discovered that his wife and the young lady were "exploring their sexuality" with toys and whatnot. Without going into any great detail, it was discovered and she was convicted and is now a sex offender. She went to jail for about 9 months. During this time, their church turned their backs on them and would not allow them to worship.


 So your friend's wife is a convicted child molester that served time in jail for molesting a young homeless girl that needed a place to stay, and you are mad that the people of the church do not want them around their children? Many people think of child molesters as the lowest of the low, and would hold the church responsible for allowing a convicted child molester to be around their children. You may be comfortable having a child molester in your life, but do not be so judgmental of people that are not. I for one find it amazing that you appear to think that molesting this powerless young girl, such that jail time was served, is not a big deal to you.


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## Roselyn (Sep 19, 2010)

I disagree with you in your condemnation of the church here. I do not belong to any church nor a Christian. I am an agnostic. Your friend is ordained and his wife is a child molester and took advantage of a homeless girl. His wife will be around children and young people who are gullible. If his wife's behavior does not bother him, then such rules don't apply to his flock. No, he should be out in the curb with her.


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## AliceA (Jul 29, 2010)

So they took in a very vulnerable girl, obviously, as she was homeless, and the wife ended up having sexual relations with her.

I have to wonder if the fact that it was a woman who did it makes it somehow better than if a man did it?

Anyway, that aside, I would have to consider who I would want to associate with if I were part of a group of people. That's all the church he visited was, a group of people with some similar interests, in this case, religion. If I had a person who preyed on a young person, I assume under the age of 18 since she was convicted, in my group, I would consider leaving that group. It has nothing to do with forgiveness as I'm not the one against who she committed the crime so I have nothing to forgive. I do however have a vested interest in who I associate with, and someone who would take advantage of a young person in such a way is not someone I want in my life and certainly not near my own children.

Note I'm not religious, but I see what many people are trying to achieve with it, and that is to have some sort of moral guidelines. Obviously she didn't choose to follow any of those. The fact that she served time doesn't suddenly make her see the light or be a better person, all it means is that she got caught. If an organisation shows that they forgive someone taking advantage of a young person under their care, aren't they saying that it's okay? We've recently seen a lot about the Catholic Church protecting priests who were committing crimes against children and people HATE the fact that the Church didn't disrobe them and kick them to the kerb as soon as the crime was discovered. They would've saved many children from the same fate if they'd taken a harsh stance from the get go.


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## yeah_right (Oct 23, 2013)

I haven't been to church in years and no plans to go anytime soon. Not the biggest fan of organized religion. I prefer to just live by the golden rule as best I can.

With that said, the church was within its rights to ban them. She's a convicted child molester. I wouldn't want a child molester around my kids, no matter the circumstances. If I ran an organization that served youth, I would feel obligated to protect them. If that means removing two long-term members to keep the flock safe....well, you betcha I'd do it. Your friend may give her another chance, but no one else is obligated. 

There are consequences for the choices we make in life.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

I can't bring myself to apologize for my explosive sentiments but I like you and I'm sure you feel for your friend. 

I'm sorry for the situation but kids need protecting.

I nearly killed a man when I was 14 who was strangling and raping my 13 year old sister.

He was a member in good standing in our church. I knew him for what he was and I was just a boy.

The useless idiots in our church accepted him even though he was obviously evil.

None of the so called men stood up for my sister. None of them protected us from him so at 14 I said goodbye to what little human softness I had left from a lifetime of abuse and gave myself to cold rage.

I did what should have been done by a Christian man but no one had the backbone.

I went nuclear on him. I was so black, I don't even remember everything but I had him dead to rights in seconds with a huge knife ready to slide into his heart.

The only reason that sack of shyt is breathing today is because my mom heard the commotion and saw that I was about to take a life and screamed like the gates of hell just opened.

I am scarred. I hate what I had to become to save my sister.

I shouldn't have had to be my sister's savior. If not me then no one because all those "good" Christian men don't get angry and are so good to forgive and shame anyone else who has reservations about letting a fvcking monster loose near my 13 year old sister!

What happened to us would have been prevented if the church had been more about protecting kids instead of ignoring the wicked under the guise of forgiveness!

If I'm out of line, I do apologize. I'm obviously close to issues like this and I want folks to get it.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## AliceA (Jul 29, 2010)

That's truly terrible, Conan. I'm very sorry to hear that you and your sister went through that.

This thread makes me think of a quote from Boondock Saints that has always stayed with me: "Now, we must all fear evil men. But there is another kind of evil which we must fear most, and that is the indifference of good men."

People have to stand up and say that it's not okay. You don't just get to say sorry and all is forgiven. That's a major problem with religion in the first place imo. Apparently all you have to do is ask for forgiveness and your sins are wiped clean. It's BS. They are never wiped clean. It happened and you don't get to wipe that from your slate.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

I believe you can be forgiven so you don't have to endure eternal punishment but that doesn't take away repercussions for your actions here and now.

Despite it all, I became a Christian 12 years later.

I swing a sharp sword though.

I have sent people to jail and had others barred from church for predatory behavior.

I have made many enemies among all the "nice" Christian men who don't raise their voices or get angry but women and children are safe near me and they know it and love me for it.

I have to even question if someone really is good who does nothing. It does seem more evil than bad guys doing bad things. At least I know what a bad guy is about.
_Posted via Mobile Device_

P.S. Thanks breeze. I still almost feel out of control just talking about it thirty years later.


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## Kitt (Jun 3, 2015)

If your friends wife was convicted as a sex offender, does that mean the young lady was a child under 16?


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

Kitt said:


> If your friends wife was convicted as a sex offender, does that mean the young lady was a child under 16?


I stopped short of pointing ^this^ out, but plenty of others have already done so, so yeah... I'd think that would've been the case.

Additionally, if this woman had any sort of leadership role within their church (choir/worship director, Sunday school teacher, etc), then I can see how the church's leadership -- or even the rest of the congregation -- would've more or less had their hand forced in showing her the door.

As for the rest of it... anyone else ever notice that the folks that seem to whine and moan the most about forgiveness are the ones that are in perpetual need of it?


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## Wolf1974 (Feb 19, 2014)

I have a very skewed view so be warned.


My x wife was religous and had an affair. Church couldn't have cared less about it when I exposed her. When I read your story my first thought was the "church" was probably more upset about the fact this was a lesbian affair Than an affair itself. Had it been a man probably would have been no big deal.

Throughout my life and especially my career I have seen religion used as a scapegoat so many times I could puke. Murders, rapistist, child molesters all I have interrogated and many have said this sentence to me "only God may judge and I know he will forgive me". Now this would be one thing except you find out the church actually does forgive this **** heads because everyone....sorry except gay people apparently....deserve forgiveness. Seriously WTF

I have a huge problem with organized religion. Has nothing to do with what they believe but rather the people who so often accompany this organizations. You don't need to go to a building once a week to be a person of good and morale character. I think your friend was handed a gift by seeing the truth of what these people are really like


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## MountainRunner (Dec 30, 2014)

Kitt said:


> If your friends wife was convicted as a sex offender, does that mean the young lady was a child under 16?


She was 17.


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## MountainRunner (Dec 30, 2014)

GusPolinski said:


> As for the rest of it... anyone else ever notice that the folks that seem to whine and moan the most about forgiveness are the ones that are in perpetual need of it?


Are you insinuating that I'm whining about forgiveness @GusPolinski ?


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

MountainRunner said:


> Are you insinuating that I'm whining about forgiveness @GusPolinski ?


Sorry, no. It was a random thought from my own life.

That said, I can see how you could've read it that way. Apologies.


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## Kitt (Jun 3, 2015)

MountainRunner said:


> She was 17.


Their state must see 17 and under as a child. I see 18 and under as a child personally. I find it interesting that you are disturbed by the churches' behavior more than your friend's wife molesting a child in their home. I'm saying this as a non- believer who doesn't think much of religion at all......the churches first responsibility is to keep a child molester out of their ranks. Just because the molester was a woman and the sexual assault was on a female child doesn't make any difference to me. The church was right, the woman was wrong, and a 17 year old homeless girl is a child in my eyes, especially susceptible to suggestion and being led by a respected ordained music leaders wife's molestation.


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## Thundarr (Jul 4, 2012)

Wife's bad choices really messed things up but she can learn from this. So think about this from the churches point of view. They must have felt the church it's self was used and betrayed. Letting him remain a deacon might have felt like condoning or not holding their leaders accountable. So while he's no longer a deacon at the church I don't think we can say if the the church has forgiven them for not. Plus a church is made up of it's body of members. I bet many of the members would like to see them in the pews and would show compassion and want to help them.

My thoughts are this.
- The wife made really poor choices and she's paid for them and paying for them. That doesn't mean she's not redeemable.
- The girl shouldn't have had the opportunity. It's shameful that the wife let this happen no matter the circumstances. Hopefully she doesn't have lasting trauma from this and can learn from it in some way.
- The church was put in a bad position and made a choice some agree with and others don't. Let's cut them some slack because it wouldn't be an easy thing to figure out.
- The husband was likely put in the worst position of everyone. He's made his choice to be there for his wife so she should feel blessed for that.


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## TRy (Sep 14, 2011)

MountainRunner said:


> Are you insinuating that I'm whining about forgiveness @GusPolinski ?


 @MountainRunner: GusPolinski may not have meant that you were in need of forgiveness, and apologized for inadvertently insinuating such. But are you saying that you were not whining about forgiveness when you said "And now to my friend...He forgave her, took her back, and it has been 4 years since the event. My friend is a "true" Christian IMHO...The congregation on the other hand? I hope they all burn in Hell for what they did to these people."? 

IMHO when it comes to child molesters (heterosexual or homosexual), I hope that there is a special place in Hell for what they did to these young people. That is up to God of course, but I can hope otherwise just like you did for the church goers that did the right thing in protecting their children.


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## Kitt (Jun 3, 2015)

One more thought....I don't consider this an affair...it doesn't equate to an affair because of inequalities...children aren't able to consent due to the disparity of the adult/child role.


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## staarz21 (Feb 6, 2013)

If the wife is a convicted child molester...the Church isn't to blame for kicking them out of there. Sorry, but they can't allow her (by law) around children. They can forgive her, but the law says she can't be around kids. The Church has to follow the law. Unfortunately, the wife made a HUGE mistake. A mistake that got her convicted. It's not up to the Church to go around the law and allow them back in. 

Hoping that those people "burn in hell" for following the law (like they HAVE to) is a bit extreme in my opinion. The wife can be forgiven, she just can't be allowed around children. Children attend Church. She can try to find a Church with all adults and be welcomed there, or she can start an in home Church for just adults. She can worship in her home, many worship services are televised on cable these days. She isn't banned from God - legally she isn't allowed around children.


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## staarz21 (Feb 6, 2013)

Kitt said:


> One more thought....I don't consider this an affair...it doesn't equate to an affair because of inequalities...children aren't able to consent due to the disparity of the adult/child role.


I agree...and to add to that, they were giving her a place to stay because she was homeless. This can be seen as a way of taking advantage of a young, homeless girl - even if that's not what happened...the girl might have felt as a way of keeping her new home, she needed to continue with this behavior. 

I mean, the girl couldn't have come out of a good situation if she was homeless at 17....Then she got pulled/jumped into an affair with an older, married woman...sounds like she had issues. The wife should have known better.


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## Thundarr (Jul 4, 2012)

staarz21 said:


> If the wife is a convicted child molester...the Church isn't to blame for kicking them out of there. Sorry, but they can't allow her (by law) around children. They can forgive her, but the law says she can't be around kids. The Church has to follow the law. Unfortunately, the wife made a HUGE mistake. A mistake that got her convicted. It's not up to the Church to go around the law and allow them back in.
> 
> Hoping that those people "burn in hell" for following the law (like they HAVE to) is a bit extreme in my opinion. The wife can be forgiven, she just can't be allowed around children. Children attend Church. She can try to find a Church with all adults and be welcomed there, or she can start an in home Church for just adults. She can worship in her home, many worship services are televised on cable these days. She isn't banned from God - legally she isn't allowed around children.


Good point Staarz. It's not that different from cases of a teachers having sex with a student. In this case it was the wife and not the deacon himself but churches see a married couple as a unit and therefore wouldn't make her leave but let him stay.

Do you think confirmation bias is part of what really has you angry at the church MountainRunner? It seems like you've lumped everyone who goes to the church together as judgemental and bad. I tend to think there are good and bad people in church and there are good and bad people not in church.


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## morituri (Apr 1, 2011)

staarz21 said:


> If the wife is a convicted child molester...the Church isn't to blame for kicking them out of there. Sorry, but they can't allow her (by law) around children. They can forgive her, but the law says she can't be around kids. The Church has to follow the law. Unfortunately, the wife made a HUGE mistake. A mistake that got her convicted. It's not up to the Church to go around the law and allow them back in.
> 
> Hoping that those people "burn in hell" for following the law (like they HAVE to) is a bit extreme in my opinion. The wife can be forgiven, she just can't be allowed around children. Children attend Church. She can try to find a Church with all adults and be welcomed there, or she can start an in home Church for just adults. She can worship in her home, many worship services are televised on cable these days. She isn't banned from God - legally she isn't allowed around children.


I agree but beg to differ on your use of the word "mistake" for the wife convicted for having sex with a minor girl. A MISTAKE would have been drunken ONS with the girl in which the day after it happened, the wife would have been so devastated and remorseful by her behavior, that she would have never again chosen to be alone with the girl and she would have told her husband she had sinned. But from the information provided from mountainrunner, it seems, maybe I'm wrong, that it was not a one time incident involving alcohol but a series of CHOICES made by the wife multiple times to cheat on her husband which eventually got her caught, prosecuted and convicted.

An affair is never a mistake, it is a series of deliberate choices.


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## OnTheFly (Mar 12, 2015)

This thread is a pathetic attempt to slag Christians. I'm very happy for the thoughtful responses.


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## staarz21 (Feb 6, 2013)

morituri said:


> I agree but beg to differ on your use of the word "mistake" for the wife convicted for having sex with a minor girl. A MISTAKE would have been drunken ONS with the girl in which the day after it happened, the wife would have been so devastated and remorseful by her behavior, that she would have never again chosen to be alone with the girl and she would have told her husband she had sinned. But from the information provided from mountainrunner, it seems, maybe I'm wrong, that it was not a one time incident involving alcohol but a series of CHOICES made by the wife multiple times to cheat on her husband which eventually got her caught, prosecuted and convicted.
> 
> An affair is never a mistake, it is a series of deliberate choices.



I agree. I should have said it was a choice. That is more correct.


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## yeah_right (Oct 23, 2013)

OnTheFly said:


> This thread is a pathetic attempt to slag Christians. I'm very happy for the thoughtful responses.


To me it has nothing to do with Christians. Replace Christians with Jews, Muslims, Hippies or Satanic Fish People and my response would have been the same. An organized group has the right to remove someone who could be a potential danger to their children.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

morituri said:


> I agree but beg to differ on your use of the word "mistake" for the wife convicted for having sex with a minor girl. A MISTAKE would have been drunken ONS with the girl in which the day after it happened, the wife would have been so devastated and remorseful by her behavior, that she would have never again chosen to be alone with the girl and she would have told her husband she had sinned. But from the information provided from mountainrunner, it seems, maybe I'm wrong, that it was not a one time incident involving alcohol but a series of CHOICES made by the wife multiple times to cheat on her husband which eventually got her caught, prosecuted and convicted.
> 
> *An affair is never a mistake*, it is a series of deliberate choices.


It was not an affair. It was a adult abusing an under age girl. That is not an affair.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

MR.. how was the the abuse discovered? Who told the authorities?

There are most likely congregations that cater to adults who have these these types of problems and criminal records. Perhaps your friend and his wife can get active in one of those.


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## morituri (Apr 1, 2011)

EleGirl said:


> It was not an affair. It was a adult abusing an under age girl. That is not an affair.


True it was abuse but still it was no mistake. Abuse and affairs are choices.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

morituri said:


> True it was abuse but still it was no mistake. Abuse and affairs are choices.


I agree that they are choices. 

My only point was to emphasize that it was not an affair as a few people are calling it that.


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## AliceA (Jul 29, 2010)

I'm a bit confused by the idea of forgiving someone for a transgression committed against someone else. "You stole her handbag?! Oh ok, I forgive you", "You beat that person. Nevermind, I forgive you". Makes it sound like they think they're a god, going around forgiving other peoples sins. "They" meaning someone in general as an example, not targeted at anyone.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LonelyinLove (Jul 11, 2013)

I would have kicked her out of the church too. 

And if he continued to support her.....well, church is no place for child molesters or their fan club.


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## *LittleDeer* (Apr 19, 2012)

I wouldn't want a pedophile at church either.


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## Shoto1984 (Apr 11, 2009)

So with the "he who is without sin..." message in mind, I think the most "Christian" thing to do would be to welcome them back. The sticky part of this one is the crime of child molestation and the (unresolved I think) question of recovery vs. recidivism. Maybe establish a separate ministry not unlike the clergy that minister in prisons etc. The cynical part of me says that institutional religion is big business and if welcoming a criminal back to the flock is going to run paying customers off than they don't get welcomed back.


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## TRy (Sep 14, 2011)

EleGirl said:


> It was not an affair. It was a adult abusing an under age girl. That is not an affair.


:iagree::iagree:
That in a nutshell says it all.

It bothered me when the OP stated that "the "church" kicked them to the curb after the lesbian affair was discovered", and stated that the "wife and the young lady were "exploring their sexuality". The OP minimized the fact that the wife was abusing an under age girl, and falsely tried to redefine it as being a lesbian affair. He minimized the abuse of an under age girl aspect of this so much, that the main thing that the OP "found so disturbing about this whole sordid affair was how he and his wife were ostracized and finally kicked out of the congregation". While most would find abusing an underage girl to be the disturbing part of this story.


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## BrockLanders (Jul 23, 2012)

*LittleDeer* said:


> I wouldn't want a pedophile at church either.


Calling someone who had sex with a 17 year old a pedophile is absurd.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

BrockLanders said:


> Calling someone who had sex with a 17 year old a pedophile is absurd.


You are right.

pedophile - a person who is primarily or exclusively sexually attracted to prepubescent children. 

The wife is not a pedophile. 

But she did take advantage of a girl who was in need.

In my state, and many others, for those under 18, it's consider sexual abuse if the age difference is more than 5 years or so. This is because an older adult usually has control of the situation and can manipulate the teen into behaviors that they might not do otherwise.


.


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