# Cheated on my wife with porn



## cndrwil (Oct 18, 2012)

My wife and I have been married for just over 2 years now. She is older than me by 12 years, and has 2 children that are married and have children of their own. She was married for about 16 years before. About a month ago, she went on my computer, not a big deal, my computer is open to all who come to our house. She found porn on there, and when she asked me about it, I didn't want to lie and say it wasn't me so I told her the truth, that I watched porn from time to time, maybe a few times a month.

She lost it. She considers all people that are in a relationship that watch porn are cheaters. She feels that she is not pretty enough or skinny enough for me now. She is disgusted with me and won't speak to me. She is moving out at the end of the month, I am living in the camper. Her children won't tell her that their husbands watch porn also because they are scared of her reaction to this. They say they support me, but if they don't tell her, is it really support? She has agreed to sit and talk to me twice since she found the porn 30 days ago. I of course have begged and pleaded with her that it meant nothing, that it was just fantasy. That when I look at her I look at my wife. She doesn't believe me. She thinks it is cheating plain and simple. I should point out that she was cheated on in her first marriage. I know that porn is wrong, how would you feel if it was your daughter, etc. And I can honestly say that I will never watch it again. She says that even the thought of me being close to her makes her feel sick to her stomach.

I don't know how in depth to get here, but I need advice and I am willing to answer any questions. I am truely lost without her in my life. She took me from being a drunk that had no future to being a person that people really find to be a happy person.

She says she doesn't have any self esteem and that I have put her back in that dark place she thought I brought her out of. She says she has no strength, but she is the strongest person I know. I also know that she doesn't like to admit when she is wrong, so I believe that once she walks out that door, she will never let me back in her life.

I have been seeing a counciller to help myself with these feelings that I have been going through, but it just doesn't work. She truly is my best friend, and I don't feel that I really have anyone else to fall back on to talk to. 

I am just looking for some advice here. I have given her all the space I can, and let her be with her thoughts.


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## Trying2figureitout (Feb 3, 2011)

Its not just PORN why she flew off the handle.

Its deeper she hold deep resentment of you and that was just an easy out for her... she's over the top on this.

Probably best you find out now. You didn't do anything other than what most men do from time to time especially it their wives don't keep them sexually satisfied.

Porn IS NOT cheating. Because its not a real human interaction. Its about the same as a steamy romance novel is to women. Same sort of reaction generated in the brain... Men (Visual) Women (Emotional/Relational). Both are SMUT.

You should stop if wife doesn't like it but no reason for her to fly off the handle... its something else guaranteed. Kudos for you telling her "Yeah I watched some Porn" at least you were honest!!

Your wife has issues if she is that threatened by some Porn. She needs to go cry herself to sleep.

If you feel you need to....Write her a heartfelt apology letter and read it to her... let her know that you are sorry you hurt her. That will will learn from this blah blah blah. Won't do it again then stick to what you promised her.

Get her to move on or let her go... shes damaged goods and stuff like this will resurface later.Beware.

Its not really about you its HER and her demons from childhood and previous relationships.
Id throw it back at her at some point and have her prove Porn is cheating... she can't.


Do that later after things calm down and she still holds it over your head.

Use this to your advantage... she way overreacted.

You need to be strong...you apologized... fessed up. Make sure you don't over-react trying to please her. She needs to process this incident an move on. Not that much of a biggie so don't treat it like one!

STOP BEGGING AND PLEADING NOW! That makes you look WEAK. Move on yourself from this incident. Distance yourself from the moment she discovered the Porn. Move on in your life and wait for her to catch up.

You did NOTHING horrible. She needs to come to grips with that, quit feeding her. ManUp

Good Apology....move on.
I wouldn't move out make her divorce you first if shes that crazy. Move back in .
No need to live in a camper when you are married.

If she refuses to let you in call the police. You two need to hash this crap out in your marital home together. Let her be sick to her stomach...make her clean up her own vomit. Be strong now more than ever... shes not stable. Don't let her do this to you. Be strong.


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## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

Porn isn't my thing but I don't consider it "cheating" nor would it be a legitimate issue to toss a husband out or to go bat crap crazy over. You're a guy. Naked women appeal to you because you're a guy, just like every guy that's ever inhabited this earth. If she doesn't think she's skinny enough, she can find the grid coordinates to a gym. Clothed or not, as long as you have eyes, you will be looking at women. If a woman thinks her husband doesn't notice other women, she's delusional. As a practical matter, is looking at porn adding something to your life? It's kind of a sad waste of time as far as I can tell. In your case, it turns your wife into a drama queen nut job, so is the pleasure worth the hassle? Her kids don't need to be in the middle of your marital business one way or the next. To them, she's "mom" and "grandma" and that's the extent of their relationship with her. There's nothing to be gained by even talking to them about it. They are blood and you're the guy that's been married to Mom for two years.


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## 40isthenew20 (Jul 12, 2012)

Tell her to grow up and stop overreacting. Porn is not cheating and you have nothing to apologize about. Tell her that she should blow you every time you have the urge to watch some porn. She'll get the point.


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## Chelle D (Nov 30, 2011)

It is just dirty pictures type site? or videos??
Or was it one of those sites that you actually have interraction with the someone on the other end? (ie video chating, or chat box?)

I think I would be upset if hubby went to a porn site with chating available.. or two way video chat.

But as far as him watching the videos...Nope, that's not cheating. 

She is over reacting if it is just looking at dirty pictures. She needs some counseling.


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## Mavash. (Jan 26, 2012)

cndrwil said:


> She took me from being a drunk that had no future to being a person that people really find to be a happy person.


I'm going to guess she's a bit touchy from this or she thinks since she helped you she owns you. To say it's a HUGE overreaction to leave over porn is an understatement. 

How long ago did you quit drinking? Did you guys seek help to heal from the ramifications of this?


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## cndrwil (Oct 18, 2012)

I thought there might be some talk of how porn is bad... And I do believe that it is not really the correct thing to do. In response to the question of what kind of porn... It was lesbian type porn videos. No live stuff. The kind of stuff that could never happen in a marriage of two. And I would never ever want to share my wife with someone else. 

In regards to the something deeper comment, I am thinking that too. I keep wondering if it was my start a project never quite get to finishing it until a month or two or three later, and going way over budget on them. Not picking up my clothes right away. Or maybe just not helping around the house enough. I do all the outside yard work and all the "man" things in the house, even do the dishes every once in a while. 

I kind of think it may have been the added stress of having her daughter and her husband, and their 4 year old living with us for the last few months, but she would never say that, and I loved having them around, but we just never had that tv night on the couch or get up sunday morning and lounge in our underwear till noon time. There was never just us time. 

In regards to the bj comment, actually I don't really need to comment on that one.

Thanks for the comments so far, I would like to hear someone say it may be wrong though. I sure am feeling that right now.


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## Chelle D (Nov 30, 2011)

IMO... if she was married for 16 years before.. She's no spring chicken to a mate watching porn. Either that, or her ex was extremely good at covering his tracks when he watched porn, or bought nudey magazines.


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## Trying2figureitout (Feb 3, 2011)

cndrwil said:


> Thanks for the comments so far, I would like to hear someone say it may be wrong though. I sure am feeling that right now.



Self-defeatist attitude?

Its not wrong and widely accepted as things men do sometimes.
Just like women and bachelorette parties.... or girls nights out.

Should have hid it better that was YOUR MISTAKE.

Use Incognito Chrome and CCleaner. Don't download it just stream it.

BTW I'm off porn 'now' to try to resolve my marital impasse.
Pretty much bored with most of it anyhow. Rather have my wife fer sure.


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## cndrwil (Oct 18, 2012)

Thanks Trying.... I am off it now too. Would take my wife any day over a porn actress.

Chelle, I think that she thinks because her exhusband cheated before, the porn is just the start. That one day I will be doing it to her too. I just wish she would trust me when I say it could never happen. I would rather walk away than try to hide it. But I can't lie to her, she sees right through me. 

Mavash, I didn't quit drinking, I just quit drinking all the time. We still go out and have fun, and I have my beer on the weekend, but I don't think she ever thinks she owns me over it. I would really like for her to say councilling is in the cards, but she won't talk to me about this so I am in the dark. As far as she is concerned it is about cheating and nothing more. If it were about other faults of mine, which I am sure is a lengthy list, I could possibly accept it, but she won't say.


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## Mavash. (Jan 26, 2012)

I still think she's overreacting. I had a bible thumping friend who is so against porn you have NO idea. In a twist of fate her husband ended up being hooked on the hard core stuff. They went through a rough year or so dealing with his addiction but she didn't leave him over it and yes she considers it cheating too.


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## waiwera (Sep 8, 2009)

cndrwil - was porn discussed before you married?
It's one of those things like religion, politics, child rearing etc that folk tend to have firm views on. Good if you both know each others views before the marriage.

In my view i don't like porn (or smutty romance novels). I turns me off way more than turning on but if my husband wants to look he can... 'I'm not the boss of him'. He's a grown man and I don't consider it cheating.
At the same time he knows i find it yuck and he sure as he!! isn't getting any action off me if he's been watching it. 

We both know where we stand. I don't think you two did.

PS: Good on you for being upfront. Too many on these boards suggest lying to you spouse about porn, which just makes my blood boil. Honesty is always the way to go.


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## wiigirl (Jun 14, 2012)

Mavash. said:


> I'm going to guess she's a bit touchy from this or she thinks since she helped you she owns you. To say it's a HUGE overreaction to leave over porn is an understatement.
> 
> How long ago did you quit drinking? Did you guys seek help to heal from the ramifications of this?


:iagree:









_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## cndrwil (Oct 18, 2012)

Waiwera, we never did discuss that at any time. I didn't know she had such strong feelings on it. I knew that she probably wouldn't approve, but not to this extent. Her son actually threw her nephew a playboy video last thanksgiving... we all laughed had a good chuckle about it.

I have been reading a few of the strings on here tonight, and yes some of them do promote lying. I said it before, she can see right through me when I lie, so I don't bother doing it to her. To not get caught, I just think what would she say about this, and I usually make the decision not to put myself in a postion where I would have to lie.

I guess I am kind of lying to her through this... Her step son watches alot of porn, maybe what she saw was his but he would never come forward with that information, and I wouldn't want to put him in this boat I am in right now.

I just hope she comes around I guess. Self defeatist attitude, I guess, but she is the one I want to be with for the rest of my life. I made that vow on our wedding day, and I will stick to it until she says its time not to.


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## Cee Paul (Apr 11, 2012)

My wife detests porn and has forbidden me to watch it but hasn't wanted to sleep with me for almost 9 months now, so I'll be damned if she's shutting me out of both forms of pleasure, so when I get turned down by her I turn to porn later on when she's asleep or if she's maybe out running errands.

*And guys don't forget to erase your browse history when you're done, or she can easily check on your latest activities or searches*


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## moxy (Apr 2, 2012)

Her reaction to "just porn" seems pretty extreme -- unless she is religious, it was somehow interactive like with cams and cybersex conversations, or there is more to the story than you are sharing. It could well be the straw that broke the camel's back, however.

How was your sex life before the incident? How were the two of you getting along before the incident? Do you both work and bring income to the household? Do you both contribute to domestic chores and upkeep? Do you talk to each other? Were there lots of fights and arguments? How did you react when she first found out? What are your fights and arguments like when you do have them?

It is too much to ask your step-kids to confess their husbands' interests in porn. Their refusal to share the info doesn't mean a lack of support. If they're telling you they support you and trashing you behind their back, that's different. Hopefully, when she vents about it, they say that they don't think it seems to be too extreme or that it isn't their business or something else rather than fanning the flames of your wife's anger. It's not too much to ask them to remain neutral.

Your wife has been betrayed and is probably very sensitive. The lying and secrecy is worse than the act itself. So, the fact that you were hiding this behavior has obviously really upset her. I wonder if she felt that she wasn't getting enough sex in the first place and then discovered this...?

Can you appeal to her to give you one last ditch effort? Like maybe go to Marriage Counseling for just four sessions with a person trained in infidelity and porn addiction (not that you're addicted, but as she is hypersensitive to the issue, such a skill in a counselor would help). Let her know that you don't want to lose her and that you will stop watching porn because it upsets her. In her mind, you were the one that cheated so you're the one that has to do the heavy lifting to demonstrate that you do want a life with her and that you will restrict your sexuality to your marriage and not porn. Now, if that isn't something you can do or are willing to do, then let her go. If, however, you are willing to ditch the porn, then you need try to make it up to her. Don't excuse it or try to get her to see it as no big deal. Tell her that you understand you screwed up; while you didn't see it as a big deal yourself, you now understand that she sees it as a big deal and you won't do it again. Maybe she will agree to counseling and give you a chance. If she doesn't, then you will have to give it some time to settle before asking again or you will have to move on.


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## moxy (Apr 2, 2012)

cndrwil said:


> I guess I am kind of lying to her through this... Her step son watches alot of porn, maybe what she saw was his but he would never come forward with that information, and I wouldn't want to put him in this boat I am in right now.


Do not drag someone else through the mud with you like a dishonorable rake. You watched the porn. She is mad at you. Dragging someone else into the shame isn't going to absolve you of it and it isn't going to make her want to give you a second chance. At best, you'll look like you're trying to convince her not to be bothered by something that bothers her a heck of a lot, just to avoid her anger. At worst, you'll look like a guy who can't deal with his mistakes and has to drag other people into it just so he doesn't feel bad. 

Leave other porn watchers out of it. This problem is between you and your wife. She doesn't want you watching it. She found out that you does. She is checked out of the relationship. You know you did this thing that she is objecting to. You have two choices: 1) stick to your guns and say "there's nothing at all wrong with it and I'll continue"; or 2) accept that it is objectionable to her and give up the porn. #1 will guarantee her departure sticks. #2 gives you a chance to work things out. If you lie about #2, you will crush her; so, if you don't really mean to give it up and make good with her, then let her go.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

> *waiwera said* : It's one of those things like religion, politics, child rearing etc that folk tend to have firm views on. Good if you both know each others views before the marriage.


 I agree, people NEED to be honest about it before they marry. I knew my BF/now Husband had 300 playboy mags under his bed and liked that sort of thing... even though I was a good girl , I never felt threatened by this somehow... 


IF Your wife is willing to sit down with you & talk this out, salvage this relationship - consider buying this book ...to read together >>








Love and Pornography: Dealing with Porn and Saving your Relationship: Books









It was written by a husband AND WIFE ....who decided to hear each other out ..no matter how painful.... with the determination to understand each others feelings ....and to NOT throw their marriage away that easy over the porn issue ...as your wife seems so willing to do. Far too many women feel this way and they put up a wall without even listening to the husband... very very sad .  Infact destructive. 

This couple has WALKED your shoes... this wife can relate to every perceived hurt a woman feels .....but also this man will be able to explain the allure in porn -but also that doesn't mean a man fails to love & cherish his wife at the same time......it goes both ways.... and every couple owes it to themselves to UNDERSTAND the other .... before throwing a relationship away . Addiction to porn & using it over a wife is another issue entirely -not what this book is about. 

I bought the book for pure curiosity...(Me & mine enjoy a little soft porn together now)... I didn't read it to the end, but I believe the husband gives it up willingly, not out of compulsion, threats or fear tactics from his wife....but only after he FELT HEARD by her....how utterly important... and he heard her side as well. 

It would be awesome to read such a book together and talk openly after so many pages. 

Far too many women JUMP like a crazy person when they hear their men have looked at some porn.... I got a little too religious at one time & had my day of over-reacting -when I would find files on his computer (always about those Playboy bunnies)... I'd post scriptures on his desktop, I think I cried a little bit..but he never denied me & was at my beck & call ... couldn't ask for a better husband. Now I let him look at anything he wants, I like it too! 

But at that time...I did not understand the male psyche .... nor did I ever read a paragraph to how Testosterone affects the brains of men... women just don't get it. I started LOVING it when I had a Test increase, so I fully "get it" now and for me, It would even be a deal breaker if the man didn't allow me to watch it ! -- So go figure. 

It is a rare rare man who doesn't slip a little porn now & then, even if they are his convictions. One of man's greatest battles. >> Every religious man worth any salt knows this - why such books have been written >> Every Man's Battle: Winning the War on Sexual Temptation One Victory at a Time 

I hope your wife will come to reason in this...


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## dubbizle (Jan 15, 2012)

My Friend you are a grown man so start acting like one and don't hide things,if you like porn let her knoiw and she will either accept you for who you are or she can find somebody else.

To me that is just crazy and this is why when people are dating they should not hide things,let it all out because that bshould stop the problems in the future. Yes my wife knew I watched porn before we got married and I still do and we have a very good sex life.


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## 45188 (Sep 13, 2012)

I consider some porn cheating but at the same time I try to reason with myself over it. Cam *****s? That is definitely cheating. There is interaction with cam *****s. They can talk to you you can talk to them.

Videos isn't cheating. It's too impersonal. Him jerking off to other girls sickens me inside though. 

When I caught my spouse with it, I no longer felt special. I no longer felt like 'his one and only'. Some girls just can't deal with it. I'm not as close as I was with him before. I'm suspicious of everything now. Hell he's always suspicious of me and gets jealous if I check out a tv actor.. But he watches porn? Pfft...


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## Trying2figureitout (Feb 3, 2011)

kipani said:


> I consider some porn cheating but at the same time I try to reason with myself over it. Cam *****s? That is definitely cheating. There is interaction with cam *****s. They can talk to you you can talk to them.
> 
> Videos isn't cheating. It's too impersonal. Him jerking off to other girls sickens me inside though.
> 
> When I caught my spouse with it, I no longer felt special. I no longer felt like 'his one and only'. Some girls just can't deal with it. I'm not as close as I was with him before. I'm suspicious of everything now. Hell he's always suspicious of me and gets jealous if I check out a tv actor.. But he watches porn? Pfft...


Really?? Less special?

So now you hold it over your husband...
Ok princess.


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## controlledchaos (Oct 14, 2012)

Cee Paul said:


> My wife detests porn and has forbidden me to watch it but hasn't wanted to sleep with me for almost 9 months now, so I'll be damned if she's shutting me out of both forms of pleasure, so when I get turned down by her I turn to porn later on when she's asleep or if she's maybe out running errands.
> 
> *And guys don't forget to erase your browse history when you're done, or she can easily check on your latest activities or searches*


Haha, nobody makes those mistakes these days. Oh, wait.. 


@ Cndrwil, this doesn't sound like a 'normal' situation - her being 12 years older than you, already married for 16 years before you, etc. There's a bit of a history here, and she has some things to work through. 

It's fine for a spouse to not enjoy their partner looking at porn, but her reaction is absolutely irrational. Stand your ground, and for pete's sake, get her family to speak sense into her if you cant.


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## anony2 (Apr 28, 2012)

kipani said:


> I consider some porn cheating but at the same time I try to reason with myself over it. Cam *****s? That is definitely cheating. There is interaction with cam *****s. They can talk to you you can talk to them.
> 
> Videos isn't cheating. It's too impersonal. Him jerking off to other girls sickens me inside though.
> 
> *When I caught my spouse with it, I no longer felt special. I no longer felt like 'his one and only'. Some girls just can't deal with it. I'm not as close as I was with him before. I'm suspicious of everything now. Hell he's always suspicious of me and gets jealous if I check out a tv actor.. But he watches porn? Pfft...*


Same with me. It hurt me tremendously that I was not "enough" for my husband that he felt the need to go and look at other women's naked bodies. 

Of course, when I tried to explain this to him, he acted like I was nuts and that it was my problem. Well, now it is "our" problem because as you said, it made me feel less special to him and suspicious of him. That effects both of us, not just me. 

The marriage counselor said that our problem is trust. Is it any wonder?


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## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

If watching porn is cheating, then watching an action movie is murder. If someone is adult enough to marry, they are adult enough to make their own moral decisions. A vagina is a sexual organ and not a weapon or a badge of authority. Want to lord over people? Be a prison guard and get paid to do it.


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## controlledchaos (Oct 14, 2012)

anony2 said:


> Same with me. It hurt me tremendously that I was not "enough" for my husband that he felt the need to go and look at other women's naked bodies.
> 
> Of course, when I tried to explain this to him, he acted like I was nuts and that it was my problem. Well, now it is "our" problem because as you said, it made me feel less special to him and suspicious of him. That effects both of us, not just me.
> 
> The marriage counselor said that our problem is trust. Is it any wonder?


wow.


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## controlledchaos (Oct 14, 2012)

kipani said:


> I consider some porn cheating but at the same time I try to reason with myself over it. Cam *****s? That is definitely cheating. There is interaction with cam *****s. They can talk to you you can talk to them.
> 
> Videos isn't cheating. It's too impersonal. Him jerking off to other girls sickens me inside though.
> 
> When I caught my spouse with it, I no longer felt special. I no longer felt like 'his one and only'. Some girls just can't deal with it. I'm not as close as I was with him before. I'm suspicious of everything now. Hell he's always suspicious of me and gets jealous if I check out a tv actor.. But he watches porn? Pfft...


And wow. 

Before we even got married, my other half would buy me porn or adult magazines when traveling overseas. Once she even bought me a VHS tape if I remember correctly. 

Nothing kinky on her part, she just wasn't insecure.


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## anony2 (Apr 28, 2012)

controlledchaos said:


> And wow.
> 
> Before we even got married, my other half would buy me porn or adult magazines when traveling overseas. Once she even bought me a VHS tape if I remember correctly.
> 
> Nothing kinky on her part, she just wasn't insecure.


Wow...:sleeping:


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## anony2 (Apr 28, 2012)

unbelievable said:


> If watching porn is cheating, then watching an action movie is murder. If someone is adult enough to marry, they are adult enough to make their own moral decisions. A vagina is a sexual organ and not a weapon or a badge of authority. Want to lord over people? Be a prison guard and get paid to do it.


In my marriage vows, it said "forsaking all others". 

It didn't say "but porn is allowed because men are visual".

What did your marriage vows say?


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## controlledchaos (Oct 14, 2012)

anony2 said:


> Wow...:sleeping:


Sorry for keeping you up. 

Your man will *always* be physically attracted to other women, no matter how good you look, how great a wife and person you are, or how amazing you are in the bedroom. 

The fact that you went to marriage counseling for it, as you've alluded to, blows my mind. 

You have absolutely no reason to be hurt.


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## Trying2figureitout (Feb 3, 2011)

anony2 said:


> In my marriage vows, it said "forsaking all others".
> 
> It didn't say "but porn is allowed because men are visual".
> 
> What did your marriage vows say?


Forsaking all others (Humans) not images/videos. Porn is an image.
No vow was 'broken'... now if you don't like it fine but quit trying to rationalize that a husband 
broke a vow to you.... geez.

Everyone has vices. Men need that visual stimulation. You don't know because YOU AREN'T A MAN.

You are way off base on this.


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## Liam (Nov 13, 2009)

waiwera said:


> cndrwil - was porn discussed before you married?
> It's one of those things like religion, politics, child rearing etc that folk tend to have firm views on. Good if you both know each others views before the marriage.
> 
> In my view i don't like porn (or smutty romance novels). I turns me off way more than turning on but if my husband wants to look he can... 'I'm not the boss of him'. He's a grown man and I don't consider it cheating.
> ...


:iagree:

OP - You really should have discussed this beforehand. She is clearly insecure about porn in the first place, so that + the lying(or not being upfront) is like a double whammy for her. 

Is she being unreasonable? Yes, maybe. But not being upfront about things like this is not healthy. Hopefully you can both talk about this together - why she has such a problem with it, why you weren't upfront about it, why she reacted the way she did, why you _want_ to view porn and so on. It's the only way forward.


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## anony2 (Apr 28, 2012)

Trying2figureitout said:


> Forsaking all others (Humans) not images/videos. Porn is an image.
> No vow was 'broken'... now if you don't like it fine but quit trying to rationalize that a husband
> broke a vow to you.... geez.
> 
> You are off base.


So *who* are in those pictures?

If porn is "just an image" as you say, then there would be no problem with 'CHILD' porn...after all, those are "just images", right?

You are way off base.


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## EnjoliWoman (Jul 2, 2012)

Geez I didn't realize people were so uptight about sexuality still.

Watching porn is NOT cheating to me unless there is interaction (the camera thing or IM windows) OR if you are choosing porn over your spouse by either not initiating sex because you're already sexually satisfied or turning your partner down.

It's merely voyeuristic. Have you never glanced in a window at night and caught someone making out or having sex and watched for a moment? Or if that's never happened can you honestly say you wouldn't look? Is that cheating? Porn is just pre-recorded vs. live.

I used to live in an apartment where a couple on the ground floor had a sliding glass door to the patio in their bedroom and never closed the blinds. Sometimes sitting on the balcony at night you could see them going at it. I thought it was sexy.


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## Trying2figureitout (Feb 3, 2011)

anony2 said:


> So *who* are in those pictures?
> 
> If porn is "just an image" as you say, then there would be no problem with 'CHILD' porn...after all, those are "just images", right?
> 
> You are way off base.


Give me a break...Child porn is illegal since they are not of the age of consent.

Whats your vice? Or are you perfect.

its images not a person! No threat there.


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## EnjoliWoman (Jul 2, 2012)

anony2 said:


> So *who* are in those pictures?
> 
> If porn is "just an image" as you say, then there would be no problem with 'CHILD' porn...after all, those are "just images", right?
> 
> You are way off base.


That's a nutty example. Because CHILDREN cannot give consent to sexual activity. Even if it's not recorded it's still a crime of molestation. Consenting adults is different. Comparing those two is crazy.


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## I'mInLoveWithMyHubby (Nov 7, 2011)

Wow, she went off the deep end!

My hubby was a little upset when I received a free video from a "toy" store. He thought I ordered it, which I did not. I was curious, the kids were not home, so I popped it in the DVD. I watched maybe 2-3 minutes of before realizing this wasn't for me. I saved the video in case my hubby wanted to watch it.

I was quite surprised by him being upset that I watched it in the first place. I thought all men were okay with porn. I've seen other videos for fun in my early 20's out of curiosity. Anyways, porn is not for me and obviously it's not for my husband either.

I see nothing wrong with porn. My dad had his playboy magazines and us kids would find them and read the articles. We couldn't figure out what was so good about these articles as our parents told us that's why my dad had them.

There must be something more serious going on with your wife. This is not a deal breaker type of situation. Not unless you were enquiring for an escourt or a happy ending massage. Your wife has very low self esteem issues. 

I really don't know what else to say, but I'm sorry your in this situation. It seems like she's playing a silly game. She should be talking this over with you instead of exploding like a bomb. Good luck.


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## anony2 (Apr 28, 2012)

EnjoliWoman said:


> That's a nutty example. Because CHILDREN cannot give consent to sexual activity. Even if it's not recorded it's still a crime of molestation. Consenting adults is different. Comparing those two is crazy.


Sexual activity? 

I thought porn was just images????


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## anony2 (Apr 28, 2012)

Trying2figureitout said:


> Give me a break...Child porn is illegal since they are not of the age of consent.
> 
> Whats your vice? Or are you perfect.
> 
> its images not a person! No threat there.


AGAIN, IF it is 'just images', then child porn wouldn't be illegal, because they are "just images" of children...


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## controlledchaos (Oct 14, 2012)

anony2 said:


> Sexual activity?
> 
> I thought porn was just images????


Oh dear. :banghead:


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## EnjoliWoman (Jul 2, 2012)

anony2 said:


> Sexual activity?
> 
> I thought porn was just images????


_Images_ of _consenting adults_ that are erotic. No need for smugness like you think you're right. This is all about personal opinion.

You must have some issues with self-esteem or are completely uptight or have/had a partner with a porn addiction for such extreme reaction to something so natural and human.

I've watched two cats have sex, too - that doesn't make me into beastiality. 

If your personal opinion that porn is cheating, I sure hope you and your spouse or SO are on the same page.


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## controlledchaos (Oct 14, 2012)

anony2 said:


> AGAIN, IF it is 'just images', then child porn wouldn't be illegal, because they are "just images" of children...


No it's illegal because its recordings of the underage kids being forced into doing sexual acts. How does that compare to other, legit porn? :scratchhead:


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## anony2 (Apr 28, 2012)

controlledchaos said:


> Oh dear. :banghead:


Still don't get it?

Here is another example, if it is "just images" then you wouldn't have any problem with your wife taking 'just images' and handing them out to your friends, right?

:lol:


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## anony2 (Apr 28, 2012)

controlledchaos said:


> No it's illegal because its recordings of the underage kids being forced into doing sexual acts. How does that compare to other, legit porn? :scratchhead:


I wasn't talking about children being forced into doing sexual acts, I am talking about naked pictures of children. 

If it was "just images", then you would have no problem with men having naked pictures of your daughter/son.


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## Trying2figureitout (Feb 3, 2011)

anony2 said:


> AGAIN, IF it is 'just images', then child porn wouldn't be illegal, because they are "just images" of children...


Snuff films?...

Basically its what society will accept... we don't accept exploited kids.

Big difference.

We don't accept glamorizing murder.

Regular Porn is nothing more than a diversion many times becuse the wife doesn't give it up nearly enough... a vice. Just like drinking, gambling or drug use.
An issue exist when it affects he relationship because its use is abused.... possibly affecting spousal sex life. I understand ladies who prefer their husbands don't use it... fine.
But if you are UNWILLING give your husband sex whenever and however he wants then be prepared for a grump of a husband... Porn is your friend makes him much nicer to you!'

Mrs I control our sex life....allow sex when 'i'm in the mood"

If the wife has an issue then the husband should take that into account... but breaking vows talk is FLAT OUT NUTS.

Holding a grudge over it that is NUTS TOO

He's an adult. he's married and needs more than shes giving him.
Like most every married guy!!!!!!
Men are visual usually a better orgasm when seeing it.

Again I'm off porn now. I'm trying to improve our marriage.


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## EnjoliWoman (Jul 2, 2012)

anony2 said:


> AGAIN, IF it is 'just images', then child porn wouldn't be illegal, because they are "just images" of children...


They ARE just images but they are images of consenting adults and there are humans behind the images but not humans anyone is going to seek out to f*ck any more than they are going to run out and have dinner with Jennifer Aniston.

Put it this way - if you refused to have sex with your SO, but let him masturbate to a video of you masturbating, is that just an image? To him it sure the heck is - he's not getting the "real thing".


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## anony2 (Apr 28, 2012)

EnjoliWoman said:


> _Images_ of _consenting adults_ that are erotic. No need for smugness like you think you're right. This is all about personal opinion.
> 
> You must have some issues with self-esteem or are completely uptight or have/had a partner with a porn addiction for such extreme reaction to something so natural and human.
> 
> ...


Yes it is about personal opinion, and I am pretty sure that YOU started out with smugness by stating that people are "hung up", so please do not project onto me your own attitude. 

The wife in this instance has every right to ask for a divorce because she has her deal breakers and this was one of them.


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## anony2 (Apr 28, 2012)

Trying2figureitout said:


> Snuff films?...
> 
> Basically its what society will accept... we don't accept exploited kids.
> 
> ...


"Basically its what society will accept"...

Apparently, the wife doesn't accept this and she has EVERY RIGHT not to. Who are you to tell her that HER deal breakers are wrong?


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## C3156 (Jun 13, 2012)

controlledchaos said:


> Nothing kinky on her part, *she just wasn't insecure*.


Bingo.

To the OP: I am not sure how you equate porn to cheating, all you are doing is looking at naked pictures. Men are visual creatures and I don't know to many of them who don't appreciate and enjoy a little porn now and then. We, as men, have no intention of chasing after the women in the pictures nor do most of us fantasize about the women afterwards. I like to look at naked women and I still love & desire my wife. 

There is a reason that your wife feels threatened by porn. This is likely _not your fault_, she was jaded in the past and feels very insecure about it. Her response to finding it on the computer was extreme and was the result of more than just the porn. Moving out? WTF?

Having been jaded myself, I would let her go, to much drama for my taste. If this is how she reacts to porn, I can only imagine how she is otherwise.

As a side note, I am not sure I understand some of the ladies responses that they feel "less special" when thier man views porn nor do I get how a picture threatens a woman. It is just a picture. How women can complain when they flock to see a movie like "Magic Mike"? I am generalizing, however I see it as a double standard.


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## 45188 (Sep 13, 2012)

Its not about insecurity. Its about the feeling of not being enough. Some people aren't like this, some are. When we make someone the center of our world we expect to be the center of theirs. Plain and simple.


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## EnjoliWoman (Jul 2, 2012)

anony2 said:


> Yes it is about personal opinion, and I am pretty sure that YOU started out with smugness by stating that people are "hung up", so please do not project onto me your own attitude.
> 
> The wife in this instance has every right to ask for a divorce because she has her deal breakers and this was one of them.


But she didn't tell him what her 'deal breaker' was! She NEVER in TWO YEARS told him that she viewed porn as cheating! If this was a deal breaker, she should have told him. Most people can assume cheating is a deal breaker but the common perceived definition of that is having an intimate encounter (kissing, touching and sex including mutual masturbation) with another human being IN PERSON.

I'm sorry that you have obviously had a bad experience or two in your life with the name "agony" but that doesn't mean everyone has the same experience.

I would be surprised if my boyfriend thought porn was cheating. I think I need to ask him now.


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## anony2 (Apr 28, 2012)

EnjoliWoman said:


> But she didn't tell him what her 'deal breaker' was! She NEVER in TWO YEARS told him that she viewed porn as cheating! If this was a deal breaker, she should have told him. Most people can assume cheating is a deal breaker but the common perceived definition of that is having an intimate encounter (kissing, touching and sex including mutual masturbation) with another human being IN PERSON.
> 
> I'm sorry that you have obviously had a bad experience or two in your life with the name* "agony" *but that doesn't mean everyone has the same experience.
> 
> I would be surprised if my boyfriend thought porn was cheating. I think I need to ask him now.


Most people don't tell others what their deal breakers are until they come upon them. 


My name is not agony, my name is ANONY.


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## EnjoliWoman (Jul 2, 2012)

anony2 said:


> Most people don't tell others what their deal breakers are until they come upon them.
> 
> 
> My name is not agony, my name is ANONY.


Oops. Misread. Anony as in 'anonymous' - got it.

Huh - well I told my boyfriend what MY deal breakers were. Seems an important part of the discovery process in a budding relationship.

There are plenty of other things that would give pause for an important conversation about where the relationship was going but to not tell someone "I will divorce you, no exceptions if you do _______" and expect them to be mind readers is wrong.

He is willing to never look at porn again now that he knows. She is flat-out refusing to even give him another chance. That's a shame.


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## southern wife (Jul 22, 2011)

cndrwil said:


> she won't talk to me about this so I am in the dark.


Why not write her a letter......tell her how you feel....what's in your heart, and leave it for her where she will find it.  She needs to hear what you want to say to her - one way or another.

If she's ready to throw you away like that, I'm wondering if she even loves you.


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## Dad&Hubby (Aug 14, 2012)

Wow, what a reaction, but not surprising.

For the people who consider porn wrong. It's wrong for you and that's okay. You're allowed to have your feelings. I hope you told your spouses the extent of your issue with it BEFORE going up oneside of them and down the other, otherwise it wasn't fair on your part. The reality is the majority of society considers that theres nothing wrong with porn, and odds are your husbands felt that way. Now if you never stated this hard and fast rule for you, then he did nothing wrong. Feelings about porn are opinions. I'm speaking about LEGAL porn, not illegal and deviant porn. Opinions are never "right and wrong" like a court of law. If you stated your feelings about porn AND THEN your husband was watching it, then there's an issue. MC is recommended at that point (not to teach your husband how wrong he is, but how to solve this difference of opinion in your marriage. Work together to solve an issue).

Porn is totally acceptable in my marriage, but if my wife felt as strongly as you do, I wouldn't watch it..with one caveat, she better take care of me EVERY time I'm horny. That would be our agreement. If me watching porn and masturbating bothers her, I would forgo it, but she also has to accept the responsibility of never saying no (within reason of course, I'm not speaking like the day her father dies or something)


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## controlledchaos (Oct 14, 2012)

kipani said:


> Its not about insecurity. Its about the feeling of not being enough. Some people aren't like this, some are. When we make someone the center of our world we expect to be the center of theirs. Plain and simple.


You are, but not all couples are perfectly balanced sexually. If you and your husband are, perfect. For others, porn comes in handy once in a while. It's not malicious. It's a form of relief. 



anony2 said:


> Who are you to tell her that HER deal breakers are wrong?


But even you, the voice of reason, has gone to counseling about it rather than pack your bags and end the relationship. 
I think all we're saying here is that her reaction is extreme beyond belief. 



anony2 said:


> Most people don't tell others what their deal breakers are until they come upon them.


We're not living in the 1950s. Porn is a billion dollar industry for good reason. You can keep your blinkers on all you like, but the reality is that it's viewed and enjoyed by many perfectly normal, happy individuals. Its really not the 'taboo' it once was, therefore coming across a husband using it shouldn't be such a shock.


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## southern wife (Jul 22, 2011)

kipani said:


> *Its not about insecurity. Its about the feeling of not being enough.* Some people aren't like this, some are. When we make someone the center of our world we expect to be the center of theirs. Plain and simple.


Which *IS insecurity*. 

Insecure means: subject to fears, doubts, etc.; not self-confident or assured: an insecure person. 

I am TOTALLY secure with myself and who I am. I don't have to be the "center of someone's world" to be secure with myself. That is not love; it's being needy and *insecure*.


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## Chris Taylor (Jul 22, 2010)

In terms of "deal breakers" and telling in advance, how many of us really do that? I'm sure "cheating" is discussed in advance, but how many of us discussed the following "deal breakers"?

-drinking to excess (when there has been no past evidence)

-driving recklessly (when your spouse has never received a ticket)

-going on two week vacations alone (when they never did this before)

You just can't list everything that would derail a marriage before hand but when it comes up (either because it has happened or know about it elsewhere), you discuss it rationally. OP's wife did not do this.

OP has also not come back (unless I missed it) to indicate what their sex life was like before this happened. I think we need to know this since "living in a sexless marriage" may have been one of hi s "deal breakers".


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## Mavash. (Jan 26, 2012)

I used to be insecure about porn in relation to my husband and then I grew up. Statistically 80% of men watched porn last year and yet only a small percentage ever cross that line into addiction. I'm no longer insecure because I get these truths. Heck I'll even watch it with him now. I'm so over it.


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

southern wife said:


> Why not write her a letter......tell her how you feel....what's in your heart, and leave it for her where she will find it.  She needs to hear what you want to say to her - one way or another.
> 
> *If she's ready to throw you away like that, I'm wondering if she even loves you.*


:iagree:
Finally!
A sensible, unbiased comment from a woman _without_ the emotional baggage........


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

Dad&Hubby said:


> Wow, what a reaction, but not surprising.
> 
> *For the people who consider porn wrong. It's wrong for you and that's okay. You're allowed to have your feelings. I hope you told your spouses the extent of your issue with it BEFORE going up oneside of them and down the other, otherwise it wasn't fair on your part. *


^^^^^^
This here is the substantive issue.

So ,
I hate tattoos. My wife knows this.
Suppose she went and got a tattoo,
Should I then berate her, make her feel as though she is the worst thing on the face of the earth, and threaten divorce?

Is it ok for me to explain to her AFTER SHE GOT THE TATTOOS that it is a deal breaker?

Sounds like madness to me.


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## controlledchaos (Oct 14, 2012)

TrustInUs said:


> My husband I don't use porn in our marriage because of our religious views. I also gave up romance novels for the same reason. these things were discussed in depth and in our *marriage counciling prior to getting married*.


You had counseling before even getting married? 

How is romance against religion? 

Getting off topic here but I think the OP has a lot to process as it is, and some good points have been made by all.


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## southern wife (Jul 22, 2011)

TrustInUs said:


> Is that your way of telling people to stop commenting or offering advice?


I think he was patting us on the back, not telling us to stop. :scratchhead:


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## anony2 (Apr 28, 2012)

southern wife said:


> Which *IS insecurity*.
> 
> Insecure means: subject to fears, doubts, etc.; not self-confident or assured: an insecure person.
> 
> I am TOTALLY secure with myself and who I am. I don't have to be the "center of someone's world" to be secure with myself. That is not love; it's being needy and *insecure*.


You can be totally secure with yourself, but that doesn't mean that you are 'secure' in the relationship. After all, how many people have come on here totally secure that their partner was not cheating, only to find out that they were?


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## Dad&Hubby (Aug 14, 2012)

controlledchaos said:


> Originally Posted by TrustInUs View Post
> My husband I don't use porn in our marriage because of our religious views. I also gave up romance novels for the same reason. these things were discussed in depth and in our marriage counciling prior to getting married.
> 
> You had counseling before even getting married?
> ...


I think you're making a common mistake to think that marriage counseling is only when there are problems. Many religions (smartly so) have couples do some sort of counseling (usually labeled something else though) before marriage so both parties go into the marriage with a little better of an understanding about each other and what's REALLY needed for marriage. It's a smart idea and should be promoted.

On a separate topic. To the people who have a very strong aversion to porn in their marriage. I've always been curious. Where do you set the boundary of what's accepted and what's not.

Love scenes in movies?
Romance Novels?
Any form of nakedness in movies/television?

I'm curious because I wouldn't know where to draw the line if I took that strong of a stance.


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## peasnrice (Oct 18, 2012)

It's possible that something else is bothering her and the porn was like the final straw, or the specific porn she saw contained something that truly bothered her. Writing her a very detailed letter to clarify your views and feelings, including how you didn't understand it would be a problem but now that you know you are willing to give it up. Make sure to ask for details on what bothered her specifically so you can help make things right. Even if you said these things before to her, reading them might give her more time to absorb them. Keep a copy of the letter for yourself as well, for reference (in case you forgot something specific you said and she asks about it, it will help avoid misunderstandings).

I commend you for your honesty and your unwillingness to hide porn from your spouse. For me, my husband watching porn wouldn't be an issue, but if he watched it and hid it from me, that would be a huge one! Our case is a bit different though 

I've had boyfriends and girlfriends in the past that loved a variety of legal (I definitely wouldn't be ok with someone liking something featuring kids, animals, murder, etc.!!!) porn, and I only ever had a problem with one person, and that was because he was doing chat type stuff with local women, and he did also meet up with a few of them and cheat. Any kind of chat is out for me now, but I would be ok with story exchanges (like with fan fiction) as long as all the characters were fictional and there was no serious flirting between my partner and the people he/she exchanged stories with. But everyone has different limits and I think it's fair for you and your wife to set whatever ones both of you can live with. One thing though, and I don't think that you, the OP, feel this way, but I saw it expressed in a few other posts that if you aren't allowed to watch porn then your wife must satisfy you anytime you please. NO NO NO NO NO. That's horrible, like some type of sexual slavery and a quick path to a divorce. Nobody *owes* anyone anything. It's just a matter of making sure you are in a compatible partnership. Communication is key here. I really hope this works out for you.

As I read through some of the posts in this thread I was shocked by the stereotypes and advocates of lying. There are a wide range of people that like a wide range of things. I'm female and I love porn, but my husband doesn't. I can't sleep without some kind of "release" whereas he doesn't touch himself ever. I have a very strong sex drive and he is demisexual. Porn is an outlet for me because my husband likes a lot of intimacy and romance in bed, which while awesome and all, sometimes I want something else. I don't need or expect my partner to fulfill all of my sexual desires. I feel like that would be more damaging to insist on something like that. My husband knows I watch porn, and even during movies he's always asking me if I'm attracted to different actors, like its a trivia game or science experiment, ha ha! Meanwhile I pester him about how seeing an attractive actress naked really doesn't create a reaction in him (it's hard to imagine!) but it doesn't, and I've checked the evidence  

I do clear my browser history, but that's just out of respect (I don't think most straight guys want to see two dudes tying each other up for fun times, ha!) not because I'm hiding anything. I have had partners I could share porn with and I miss that, as well as pointing out cute people to each other, but that's ok. My husband is the perfect person for me. However, not being able to watch porn would be a deal breaker for me, but so would owning a motorcycle. He knows that, so it's no big deal. Reading this thread makes me grateful that he is so understanding.


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## Dad&Hubby (Aug 14, 2012)

TrustInUs said:


> Just to add I found out there were 6 week non religious pre-engagement courses for couples thinking about marriage, similar to what we did. I know it doesnt sound romantic but the topics were so indepth and many people don't talk about these things before marriage.
> 
> I'm not a perfect Christian so giving things up is still hard at times, I still watch some romantic movies and probably shouldn't watch any according to some. I don't get aroused by mild love scenes but I get very aroused by romance novels with explicit scenes. That's really the issue for me. My husband isn't into chick flicks so he doesn't have that problem lol.


I really appreciate your answers because you can tell they're based in your religious beliefs more than anything. 

I also enjoy your answer about the other items, because you're addressing what your religion doesn't agree with which is being aroused by something other than your spouse. Thank you.


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## controlledchaos (Oct 14, 2012)

TrustInUs said:


> Indepth Premarital course w councelor besides the 2 short classes required by our pastor, wanted to be sure before marriage.....
> 
> Erotic scenes are like written porn in my opinion....
> 
> Is that your way of telling people to stop commenting or offering advice?


Okay so your views are based on religion, not logic. Got it 

Do you consider it a sin to be turned on by erotic writing, even if it's fiction? 

If your husband paged through 50 Shades of Grey, would that be grounds for a fight, counseling, and even divorce?

I don't mean to be antagonistic, but I genuinely am curious about this as it's so far removed from the world that I live in. Whether that's good or bad remains to be seen.


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## EnjoliWoman (Jul 2, 2012)

It could just be semantics BUT -

I view "deal breakers" as things that will NOT be tolerated at ANY level and are considered immediate grounds for terminating the relationship. Whether the person goes through with ending the relationship or not is up to the couple.

Whereas there are a LOT of things that are problematic in a relationship that surface over time but are seen as 'workable' if both parties are willing.

I think deal breakers under that definition should be discussed before marriage. Sure there are things that will come up that are less than desirous in a relationship - those are things to be worked through mutually.

But the OPs issue is he didn't know it was a dealbreaker - grounds for immediate 'termination' of the relationship. There is probably a lot more to the story than on the face of it.


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## controlledchaos (Oct 14, 2012)

TrustInUs said:


> 1) It's comments like these that makes me hesitant to share why we do certain things in our marriage. I'm not judgmental and even if I don't agree with the way people do things in their own marriage. I do not belittle, minimize, or try to change their views. I am here to learn though
> 
> 2) yes, fiction, fantasy, same category as porn in our marriage.
> 
> ...


It sounds like you're quite open minded and realistic actually. I can't say I agree with what your faith tells you is wrong, but I respect that after having devoted yourselves to that faith, you're doing what you can to stick to it.

I'm sure there's religious threads on here for those type of debates anyway. 

The misleading thing is when users comment on issues as if they are of a strong opinion about it, but its actually not really their opinion at all, it's what religion tells them is right or wrong.

So in future when I think to myself, 'This person is craaazy, that makes no sense!', I'll bear in mind they could be religious. 

And vice versa applies to you too of course


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## *LittleDeer* (Apr 19, 2012)

Cee Paul said:


> My wife detests porn and has forbidden me to watch it but hasn't wanted to sleep with me for almost 9 months now, so I'll be damned if she's shutting me out of both forms of pleasure, so when I get turned down by her I turn to porn later on when she's asleep or if she's maybe out running errands.
> 
> *And guys don't forget to erase your browse history when you're done, or she can easily check on your latest activities or searches*


I don't get this at all.

You have allowed your wife to shut you down, then for revenge you watch porn. 

Why not stand up for your self? :scratchhead: Why be sneaky and lie by omission? That just compounds issues, and if your wife finds out, tells her that you are not man enough to stand up for your needs and wants. IMO

Personally, I do see watching porn as a reason to leave, especially if the boundaries are clear from the beginning. Just because it's no big deal for many here, doesn't mean it's not an important value that someone else has.

That said, if it wasn't really discussed earlier (and are you sure it wasn't), then I think you need to get counselling.

And are you sure it wasn't an excuse for her?


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## *LittleDeer* (Apr 19, 2012)

controlledchaos said:


> It sounds like you're quite open minded and realistic actually. I can't say I agree with what your faith tells you is wrong, but I respect that after having devoted yourselves to that faith, you're doing what you can to stick to it.
> 
> I'm sure there's religious threads on here for those type of debates anyway.
> 
> ...


I'm not religious, and I believe porn is very unhealthy, and morally wrong. I believe it harms intimacy and sex lives, and don't feel it has any place in relationships.


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## See_Listen_Love (Jun 28, 2012)

Porn is like any other stimulant, it can be good or bad depending on the circumstances.

If you look porn, sit at the tv, use alcohol, smoke, eat ..._too much_, it is very bad for yourself and your family. Like any addiction.

If you use these things in _moderation_ it is a tool of relaxation and comfort, which can be very good for yourself and your family. Because unwinding and finding inspiration (also for your sex life) is a benefit.

That being said, I know that the cultural and religious context you live in can have very different views on that. You have to decide for yourself how to deal with that. Take a stand and inform her about your opinion. 

I saw some very weak sentences of you, that indicate you have not formed a strong character also on other issues. You need to man-up. No more mr Nice guy, read it and do it.


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## hehasmyheart (Mar 11, 2010)

Were there issues with sex? If you weren't very sexual with her, she might think you would have rather done that than have sex with her.

That was the first big issue in my marriage. I felt like it was a replacement for me because he would turn me down for it (saying too tired from working).


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## See_Listen_Love (Jun 28, 2012)

anony2 said:


> Same with me. It hurt me tremendously that I was not "enough" for my husband that he felt the need to go and look at other women's naked bodies.
> 
> Of course, when I tried to explain this to him, he acted like I was nuts and that it was my problem. Well, now it is "our" problem because as you said, it made me feel less special to him and suspicious of him. That effects both of us, not just me.
> 
> The marriage counselor said that our problem is trust. Is it any wonder?


The idea that one's spouse is like the ideal, perfect spouse for one is fundamentally flawed. There exists no ideal, perfect spouse, only in imagination, as a concept.

In general people circle around the median of the average guy or wife. When no other information is available, accept that about half of humanity are more or less better spouses than you are, and the same amount are worse spouses than you are. This on all issues, like housekeeping, dealing with finances, communicating, having good looks, being a good sex partner, etc. etc. Probably you are mediocre on an absolute scale. 

A man looking at other women is nothing else than him looking a other cars, you can love to see a beautiful car, without wanting to have it in reality. You can be perfect satisfied and happy with the car you have, how old and ugly it may be. 

The enthusiasm for the driving of beautiful super cars in Top Gear is comparable to viewing beautiful women in erotic action, for the standard man. Just my opinion of course.

Conclusion: You don't _have_ to be perfect, and he is not _obliged_ to valuate you as perfect. 

He only needs to love you!


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## controlledchaos (Oct 14, 2012)

*LittleDeer* said:


> You have allowed your wife to shut you down, then for revenge you watch porn.
> 
> Why not stand up for your self? :scratchhead: Why be sneaky and lie by omission? That just compounds issues, and if your wife finds out, tells her that you are not man enough to stand up for your needs and wants. IMO


It's not about revenge, it's about taking care of a physical need. 

One school of thought could say that it's actually out of respect to the wife - rather than push and nag for sex, be patient and give her space. At times like that, porn can be handy. 



*LittleDeer* said:


> I'm not religious, and I believe porn is very unhealthy, and morally wrong. I believe it harms intimacy and sex lives, and don't feel it has any place in relationships.


I disagree, but then I'm not your husband so that's okay. 
In excess it certainly can harm a relationship, as can alcohol, drugs, television, etc. 



See_Listen_Love said:


> Porn is like any other stimulant, it can be good or bad depending on the circumstances.
> 
> If you look porn, sit at the tv, use alcohol, smoke, eat ..._too much_, it is very bad for yourself and your family. Like any addiction.
> 
> If you use these things in _moderation_ it is a tool of relaxation and comfort, which can be very good for yourself and your family. Because unwinding and finding inspiration (also for your sex life) is a benefit.


^ that.


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## Adex (Aug 1, 2012)

I just read the OP and haven't read anything else, but to me watching porn IS NOT cheating. It's ridiculous to even take it to that point. While it may offend some wives, it's safe to say it isn't cheating.

I watch porn occasionally mostly to take care of myself. My wife doesn't really care and let's me do my thing in fact. I appreciate that and it works out well. I feel bad for the OP.


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## 45188 (Sep 13, 2012)

What is cheating to one person isn't to another. Theres a thread somewhere on TAM that talks about a guy who has cyber sex with chicks on the internet all the time. He considers it not cheating. Would you?

I for one know my husband would be absolutely crushed if he caught me masturbating to porn. It's just how some people feel and some people feel very strongly. For me, it upset me. I won't lie. But.. I got over it.

Hell even Dr Phil says porn is cheating. Some men DO consider it cheating. So do some women. 

But porn just makes me feel insecure because HE told me that I was the only one. When I caught him spanking it to porn, that was an ouchie. 

Some women are okay with their men checking out other women. It would make me very uncomfortable. But to each their own, right? OP is just trying to understand his wifes views.

I do however think she's being extreme. I was over the porn thing in a couple days. The feeling lingers and I wonder how many women he fantasizes about now, because before I had this picture painted in my head about him. That I was enough. He painted it there for me. Then he wrecked my view of him when I found his crap. 

He tried to hide it. We'd never brought up porn in the relationship before. Why? It's a given. Most women don't like it. Question is OP did you have ANY clue how against it your wife was? Because frankly to me it sounds like shes trying to get out of the relationship. Maybe an ex of hers had a porn addiction.


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## controlledchaos (Oct 14, 2012)

kipani said:


> Question is OP did you have ANY clue how against it your wife was? Because frankly to me it sounds like shes trying to get out of the relationship.


I agree with that. She's either a totally unreasonable anti-porn crusader, or she is using this as an excuse. 

If she truly loved you and wanted to be with you, I don't believe this would be grounds for divorce. 

@ kipani, sincerely, please understand that males have the ability to view sex and love as two very different things. With a wife they go together, but its very easy to simply take care of a sexual need while either thinking of, or looking at another woman - ie: porn. 

I'd be willing to put money on the fact that if your husband looks at or has looked at porn, it has nothing to do with you or your deficiencies. It's to take care of a need of his, with absolutely no emotional connection whatsoever. 

Unless he is addicted, it will not affect your marriage at all, and if anything, could help you at the times when you're simply not in the mood or aren't feeling up for it. 

My opinion on it anyway.


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## 45188 (Sep 13, 2012)

Well he was mocking you.. Controlled, don't mock trust . I mean just because you don't respect their reasons doesn't mean they should be mocked for having them. I'm sure you could be mocked about some of your beliefs too. Treat others as you want to be treated and all that..

And yeah, I understand that. I've read that it's usually always the women who develop the emotional attachment after sex rather than the men. Still hurts a little. Trying to reason it out of me but my lizard brain is possessive. I cover my breasts during sex and stuff now because hell, theirs are big fake and perky! I've had kids dammit! But with women, we use ourselves and our experiences and put ourselves in their position. That's her problem. She's very very closed minded.


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## controlledchaos (Oct 14, 2012)

TrustInUs said:


> I'm not sure where you're getting at but I take this to be a little mocking. Not sure how I mislead, but in my post to the OP, I was trying to make the point that even I won't react that strongly if I were in her situation but we talked about it prior.
> 
> You make the mistake assumimg that my only reason for not using porn is because of my faith and that would be wrong, although it is now a major reason. It was also relative to the point I was trying to make to the OP.
> 
> I personally don't think someone is crazy because they have different views or do different things. I just rend to think they were raised with different experiences that myself. That probably comes from being judged on everything from gender, race, income level, etc.


I suppose what I'm saying is that in real life I'd never even get into a discussion about such a topic with a religious person, so when reading these boards one subconsciously assumes that we're discussing with like-minded individuals. But when some of the responses come back, it's clear to see where the opinions come from. 

In other words, you're not thinking for yourself and what should and shouldn't be acceptable, you're thinking based on what religion has told you. 

That might sound disrespectful but I'm trying to explain my view on it and why I think that religion has the ability to distort and affect relationships (not to mention wars!). 

I fully understand that you probably feel the same about non-religious types though.


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## controlledchaos (Oct 14, 2012)

kipani said:


> I've read that it's usually always the women who develop the emotional attachment after sex rather than the men. Still hurts a little. Trying to reason it out of me but my lizard brain is possessive. I cover my breasts during sex and stuff now because hell, theirs are big fake and perky! I've had kids dammit! But with women, we use ourselves and our experiences and put ourselves in their position. That's her problem. She's very very closed minded.


Don't do that!  
Believe me, he loves you just the way you are. A man wants a real woman at home. One that is a good wife, mother, and intimate partner. And covering up isn't going to help him in terms of feeling neglected (and thus looking for porn possibly). 

A man only wants a perky pornstar for a very specific reason, which believe me, is forgotten about very shortly after


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## johnnycomelately (Oct 30, 2010)

Adex said:


> I just read the OP and haven't read anything else, but to me watching porn IS NOT cheating. It's ridiculous to even take it to that point. While it may offend some wives, it's safe to say it isn't cheating.


The vast majority of men watch porn. Many women do too and both genders read porn, like 50 Shades, does that make us all cheaters?

This is about her insecurities or she is looking for an excuse to get out of the relationship. She is being childish and petulant over something very normal.


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## controlledchaos (Oct 14, 2012)

TrustInUs said:


> You also ASSUME that in the case of porn that I had no thoughts or boundaries before I dedicated myself to my faith.


So you had a lot of fun in life before then? :smthumbup:

Okay, I will stop harping on about religion. 



johnnycomelately said:


> The vast majority of men watch porn. Many women do too and both genders read porn, like 50 Shades, does that make us all cheaters?
> 
> This is about her insecurities or she is looking for an excuse to get out of the relationship. She is being childish and petulant over something very normal.


Aah, a refreshing view.


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## Trying2figureitout (Feb 3, 2011)

PORN is just another of a very long line of ELECTRONIC challenges to a marriage.

FACEBOOK
PORN
EMAIL
TEXTING
REALITY TV
VIDEO GAMES/APPS
ONLINE DATING SITES
SKYPE
DISPOSABLE CELL PHONES
VARS
HIDDEN CAMERAS
GPS
KEYLOGGERS
REALISTIC SEX TOYS


Things were better when you couldn't seek out so easily.... joy.
People don't know how to handle..digital freedom. They are ill-equipped to use it correctly

Nearly 100% of all failed/struggling marriages started with one spouse using one or more forms of electronic activity in the above list seeking something outside the marriage.

One reason I hate FB and Smartphones... and I'm a TECH guy.


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## Jamison (Feb 10, 2011)

Your wife and her feelings come before porn, period. Make a choice because obviously its not something you can have both of. Just my 2 cents.


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## southern wife (Jul 22, 2011)

I think the OP is gone.


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## controlledchaos (Oct 14, 2012)

Jamison said:


> Your wife and her feelings come before porn, period. Make a choice because obviously its not something you can have both of. Just my 2 cents.


When she's so adamant about something, that is true. I think the issue here is that he didn't know she felt like this until after it happened. 



southern wife said:


> I think the OP is gone.


Hate it when that happens.


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## ThatOneGuy (May 23, 2012)

I'll admit that I am married and watch my share of porn. I don't think this is uncommon among married men. I'm not in a particularly happy marriage right now (I'll let other posts explain that) but I feel like even if my marriage was great I would still watch a little porn on occasion. I consider it entertainment just like music, books and movies involving people I've never met. I think it improves my libido, helps quench that male thirst to stray, keeps me up to date on techniques and makes me a more faithful husband. When done in moderation I think it is a healthy activity as long as you're not watching the type of porn that is demeaning to women because your wife could easily take offense to that.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

TrustInUs said:


> I also gave up romance novels for the same reason.


I would never do this for a man, if he expected or wanted this, I would think there was something wrong with him (not saying yours does, I realize it is a choice you made)......I







amorous romance. Completely a JOY, also I seek out every HOT R rated movie to be found. 

If I had any brains, I would have been reading alot more of those smut books in my younger years -cause it always turned me on - like a dripping switch. 

When I was a Christian....or let's say...tried to be.... it only caused me to feel "like I was sinning" when I enjoyed these things, like God was displeased with me.... like I had to PUSH them down...which played over into my feeling guilty about fleshly pleasures/oral sex (felt that is only what Bad girls do, strippers, what you see in porn).....

I regret this more than anything in my marriage....cause deep down, I was a DIRTY vixen in a cage ~ not realizing my power to entice, allure ~ the joy in sexual liberation with my own husband. 

He would refer to me as a "Nun" on occasion - talking to one of our guy friends...when they would joke around about sex....he was kidding of course but there was an element of truth in it. Too much of a Good girl. I felt embarrassed if he even seen my body in the light. I was HIS wife !! 

Just saying... I know you have made a point of not judging others who disagree with your views here...I have taken notice of this. And do applaud that :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: .... Our individual stories are all different. 

After I lost my religion ...started reading secular books on the subject....I came alive in the bedroom & shed all that shame about my body , masterbation & enjoyed getting DIRTY, the dirtier the better. I might have even went a little too far in some ways.. but it's all been a blessing for us. 

I wish so badly this would have happened 20 yrs ago.




> *ThatOneGuy said*: I feel like even if my marriage was great I would still watch a little porn on occasion. I consider it entertainment just like music, books and movies involving people I've never met. I think it improves my libido, helps quench that male thirst to stray, keeps me up to date on techniques and makes me a more faithful husband. When done in moderation I think it is a healthy activity as long as you're not watching the type of porn that is demeaning to women because your wife could easily take offense to that.


 I agree 100%.... my husband doesn't masterbate to it, but this is because if he did, he'd have nothing left for me & I wouldn't be a happy woman....not with my drive !! I push his limits. 

I love watching it - it arouses ideas, inspires







~ not that I need any more of that.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

> *TrustInUs said:* But I have learned my lesson so I'll try to keep it to myself.


 No No No ... we all should share how we feel... even if not very popular, the norm, different...no need at all to feel -you need to keep your discoveries to yourself...don't want you to feel this way. 

It is *ALL GOOD* to have many perspectives/ experiences presented here at TAM... this can't be done on a christian forum (I got eaten alive -scripture slamming ~then thrown off the 2nd time - :rofl: looking back).

But think about it... this Original poster might be helped by your words here >> "But if me and my husband decided to use and focus all of our energy on each other, and not become aroused other than with each other it was only fair". 

For this original Poster ...maybe your words there will resonate with him... to come to THAT Place... or at least believe he can... given his situation here, with a wife who thinks he is slime over a little porn, worthy of divorce.....trying to live as YOU and yours could be HIS answer.

Think about it....If HE came more YOUR way... and his wife could get a little hint of where I am coming from... it could be the magic pill to have them meet in a happy middle. 

So truly... ALL views, experiences, have some value....each poster needs to gleam what resonates for him or her . :smthumbup:


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## controlledchaos (Oct 14, 2012)

SimplyAmorous said:


> After I lost my religion ...started reading secular books on the subject....I came alive in the bedroom & shed all that shame about my body , masterbation & enjoyed getting DIRTY, the dirtier the better. I might have even went a little too far in some ways.. but it's all been a blessing for us.


I love your attitude towards this. Couples shouldn't have any inhibitions or reservations with each other, in the privacy of their own bedroom. 

Btw you said you _tried_ to be a Christian. If I may ask, what were your reasons for trying, and what made you decide against it eventually?


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## Mavash. (Jan 26, 2012)

controlledchaos said:


> I love your attitude towards this. Couples shouldn't have any inhibitions or reservations with each other, in the privacy of their own bedroom.
> 
> Btw you said you _tried_ to be a Christian. If I may ask, what were your reasons for trying, and what made you decide against it eventually?


I feel the same as SA. I didn't grow up in a Christian home (thank goodness) so my sexuality was in tact when I got married. I've always been the vixen.

My problem was when I decided to become more spiritual and that path led me to church. I was 33 years old and looking back the brainwashing they did to me was astounding. I took bible studies for women which were about marriage. One was called every woman's battle. It said no masturbation, no smutty novels, no soap operas, no porn....are you kidding me? Well they just sucked the vixen right out of me and for a while I bought it too.

In my quest for spirituality and enlightenment I kept seeking eventually realizing that those bible studies were written by HUMANS not God. And those humans are flawed with insecurities and fears.

Can those things cause problems if used in excess? Absolutely but to ban them completely out of fear is just overkill.

I still consider myself a Christian but I won't be stepping foot in a church anytime soon. That is not the God I know and love. Organized religion is not for me. And I'm back to being a vixen.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

controlledchaos said:


> Btw you said you _tried_ to be a Christian. If I may ask, what were your reasons for trying, and what made you decide against it eventually?


I grew up with a Mom who left me, and my home life was a bit sour with a step mom who didn't want me there... I used to attend Youth Group with a friend... I wanted a better life for myself... I had high hopes, High dreams, met Boyfriend at 15... have masterbated since I was 11... Probably the only thing in my life I would have outright LIED about & turned as red as a lobster if someone asked me. 

I was always ashamed of that...needing to DO THAT... it is less taboo for Guys... but girls !! I believe I was always HIGH drive...no way for me & boyfriend to keep our hands off each other, but I was YOUNG!! so the guilt/shame merry go round started in my head... we were being *DIRTY*.... we should be as pure as the driven snow according to Youth group, all those teachings in the church, we did manage to NOT have intercourse.... just meeting young and taking on alot of GUILT about what we did - was the beginning of _*Repression *_for me. 

It started years before marriage... I trusted God for answers to prayers, ya know... but I had in my head, for instance, if we died in a car wreck, we would go to hell for touching each other.... this is such a MIND FvCK for teens.....if I could go back in time.... and just use REASON.... and screw these beliefs that all LUST is deserving of hellfire... that I despised anyway...even felt God was an ogre ....but still tried to hold on to in belief....in my innocence....trying to live a certain way to GRANT approval for a GOD to bless my life.. our future. 

When we married we had trouble with my hymen, you know what I thought, it was God's judgement on us for touching each other all those years. That thought came in anyway. It was all RELIGION with me. 

And I don't mean to say I think all Christains are whacked, our oldest son is a worship Leader, most of my friends are christians....I LOVE many scriptures in the bible, but the Churchs stance on SEXUALITY ..... is just warped, they expect people to do NOTHING before marriage -then all of a sudden flip a switch when you marry ~ now we can dress like the stripper, seduce like the stripper, and jump right into oral sex too !! and the dirtier the better....yeah right !!! It didn't work that smoothly for me.

I feel the world goes too Far (too loose before marriage) ... but the Church is too Strict. A little LUST is gooood, just shows you are alive, we can still control where we draw our personal boundaries with each other before we marry, taking on all that guilt/shame was just a waste of my life. I wouldn't take back anything we did, just the mindset that accompanied it. 

Reading about the roots of Christian Doctrine had me realize I have more in common with the Heretics of old....I've always been a questioner anyway. Love this book: 2000 Years of Disbelief: Famous People With the Courage to Doubt: James A. Haught:  My mind resonates with the majority of these thinkers... I've had the same arguments for years. 

I now consider myself a Free thinker that hasn't lost all of my morals.... the Golden Rule & Reason IS my religion. (sorry for the book)


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

Mavash. said:


> I took bible studies for women which were about marriage. One was called every woman's battle. It said no masturbation, no smutty novels, no soap operas, no porn....are you kidding me? Well they just sucked the vixen right out of me and for a while I bought it too.


 Ain't that the darn reality of it!!! Let's add Rock music to that list too... 

I spent some time in my youth reading all this dribble about why Rock music is from the pit of hell (Tipper Gore ~ "Hell's Bells" video ).... and I loved it the whole freaking time...a great joy in my life....I think my mind has always been *divided* -which caused me to be *stunted* in many ways when I was younger.

I felt guilty about watching soap Operas too ~ but I wasn't going to stop - loved Guiding Light & Young & the Restless... I remember burning my Guns & Roses CD in the fire, but what for...when "Welcome to the Jungle" came on the radio, I still turned it full blast singing my heart out....also loved "Highway to Hell"...

I was one mixed up young girl... trying to live like a christian with all that on my mind....while I was reading all these christian books at the same time.... I was back and forth, so when it came to sex.... we just "rode the fence". In our consciences ~ we felt good about "waiting" - but we knew others would still judge us. 

*** People can go a lifetime with this divided mindset on sex... for instance... we have a Guy friend in his 40's , he would talk to us about some of his GF's, well this one would come over once a week, they would have great sex, then afterwards, he would hear her praying in the bathroom, then one day she asked HIM to pray with her -for forgiveness....

He starts :rofl: at this point -saying "Is she crazy...we just had mind blowing sex and she wants me to feel bad about it - I'm not sorry!!" -- she was Catholic, and felt sex outside of marriage is a SIN - black & white.. but yet, she knew she was going to keep engaging in it - how pointless is this [email protected]#$%^& 

At least when I was young, I KNEW we were not going to stop touching each other in those places... so I didn't keep asking God to forgive me... I've always tried to breach where Religion goes too far..it is something impossible to define really... I guess in the end, it all comes down to what works for each couple, how they feel loved & respected, I don't know...without the religious baggage that hinders our sexuality ~ that brings joy to our union with another. 



> In my quest for spirituality and enlightenment I kept seeking eventually realizing that those bible studies were written *by HUMANS *not God. And those humans are flawed with insecurities and fears.


 I feel the same, the way women & slaves were used in the Old Testament, too much disturbs my mentality - I just don't have that much faith in men holding a pen in their hands. 



> still consider myself a Christian but I won't be stepping foot in a church anytime soon. That is not the God I know and love. Organized religion is not for me. * And I'm back to being a vixen*.


Amen Mavash !! I still go to church -make an appearance now & then.... but I don't hide the fact I no longer claim to be a christian....I've been bold enough, or one might say STUPID enough... to open myself to judgement in front of a handful of christian woman & say ...."Yeah... we like a little porn, it's spiced our marriage up!! " ..... Oh the looks I have gotten. 

Makes life interesting anyway!


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## trey69 (Dec 29, 2010)

So hows it going OP? You haven't been back in awhile.


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## imnotthesame11 (Oct 20, 2012)

thats not cheating. she has issue with it.


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## cndrwil (Oct 18, 2012)

Well I tried to log in the other day and post my replies, but I was having issues with the firewall I installed to block sites that weren't within the parameters I wanted. 

I do agree with the post that we are to digital today. Had my wife and I married 15+ years ago, I probably wouldn't have known or done anything online. But thanks to free websites, fb, twitter... we know share and do things online we never would have before. She just posted on FB what I did.

I didn't realize this would turn into a discussion about all the things it has... and i have read all the posts, just wanted some advice. I do believe I screwed up by not being honest with her, but I never did try to hide it. I do believe that she was right when she believes it was cheating, although I don't agree with the term cheating.

I thought I might get some ways to show her there would be no more lies, or hiding. A way to prove to her that I love her, and only her. I honestly don't know why I watched the porn, and yes it was my porn, not the son in laws. I won't drag the kids into this even if they say they support me.

thanks for the posts though... opened my mind about how touchy this topic really is.


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## See_Listen_Love (Jun 28, 2012)

Mavash. said:


> In my quest for spirituality and enlightenment I kept seeking eventually realizing that those bible studies were written by HUMANS not God. And those humans are flawed with insecurities and fears.
> 
> Can those things cause problems if used in excess? Absolutely but to ban them completely out of fear is just overkill.
> 
> I still consider myself a Christian but I won't be stepping foot in a church anytime soon. That is not the God I know and love. Organized religion is not for me. And I'm back to being a vixen.


I almost don't dare to bring up the point, but from an European perspective Americans tend to have strange religious habits.

I think it's the same fanatic behaviour that makes it possible to have these great Olympic achievements for the USA, that leads to extremities on religous grounds. 

Absolute truths, made up by the leaders of the movement, get indoctrinated into the people. I see this even at schools, the army, the home defense, etc. etc. 

So it's in my opinion not something that belongs to the Christian belief, but something from the American culture.


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## Viseral (Feb 25, 2011)

Everyone in this forum needs to read "The Male Brain" by Louann Brizendine and her corresponding book "The Female Brain" to gain a much stronger understanding of our own biology and how it affects our behaviors. They're easy entertaining reads that give you a lot of "ah hah" moments and surprising insights into our own relationships:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/0767927540

http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/0767920090


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## oldgeezer (Sep 8, 2012)

cndrwil said:


> She lost it. She considers all people that are in a relationship that watch porn are cheaters. She feels that she is not pretty enough or skinny enough for me now. She is disgusted with me and won't speak to me. She is moving out at the end of the month, I am living in the camper.


I dunno if I'm much of one to talk... since I have been through the same thing, sort of. My situation isn't probably the same, since for me, it was crutch to just "get by" in a dysfunctional relationship. 

First, I don't actually think that the basis for this is porn itself. It's about other things, and they manifest themselves when it draws them out. First, her insecurities about her looks and body. She even said so - along with her being insecure about how she views her life with you. 

Second, I'd guess that somewhere in her background is some buried abuse or other sexual issues. 

My wife spent 20 minutes about how terrible it was for me to see another woman and get aroused. Then she spent 10 minutes trying to say it was ok to see a hot woman in a skimpy bikini at the beach. The difference to me is absolutely baffling - since a hot women in real life is vastly more tempting or arousing. Until I figured out the difference is in her mind, not mine. She wasn't worried about things when she could watch ( supervise ) me. Duhhh. Insecurity. The need to manage others again. 

There, however, is REAL hurt associated with it. There is a grain of truth that you needed or wanted the fantasy that wasn't her, and the female of the species really does believe she should be your everything. We're wired differently in that department, and yet we should respect it. 

If you got into this not having any idea it's a "big thing" to her, then you need to communicate it to her after she's been cooled off on her own, and that you want to discuss it. I can't tell you how many stories I've read where one or the other thinks nothing of it, yet the partner is utterly devastated. That's what happens when we make assumptions that people we have an intimate relationship are totally eye to eye with our needs and expectations.


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## johnnycomelately (Oct 30, 2010)

cndrwil said:


> Well I tried to log in the other day and post my replies, but I was having issues with the firewall I installed to block sites that weren't within the parameters I wanted.
> 
> I do agree with the post that we are to digital today. Had my wife and I married 15+ years ago, I probably wouldn't have known or done anything online. But thanks to free websites, fb, twitter... we know share and do things online we never would have before. She just posted on FB what I did.
> .


That is abuse. She is attacking you publicly because of her insecurities.


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

cndrwil said:


> I do agree with the post that we are to digital today. Had my wife and I married 15+ years ago, I probably wouldn't have known or done anything online. But thanks to free websites, fb, twitter... we know share and do things online we never would have before. *She just posted on FB what I did.*


Dude,
Your wife is abusive.
There is no excuse for this type of reaction from her.
She has now resorted to public humiliation.
If you a cool with this, and thinks that somehow it will enrich your marriage, then more power to you.


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## 45188 (Sep 13, 2012)

Porn is natural they say, but did you know it destroys 56% of marriages? Because women like feeling like we're the only ones. Many of us close up and throw up heavy emotional walls over the porn thing. Why should we make ourselves so vulnerable to somebody who masturbates to other women? After all, most of us don't do it. Only something like 30% of women watch porn. That's less than 1/3rd of the female population.

Is Porn Really Destroying 500,000 Marriages Annually? | Psychology Today

But this is obsessive porn. Did she see a big collection of porn? If she did, she probably does think you're addicted. 

Hows the sex? Regular? If not she is going to attribute porn to your low sex marriage. 

When you DO have sex, do you initiate? Please initiate. She might think you're uninterested otherwise.

Here's another study she might have seen somewhere..

Men who use internet porn 'likely to become hopeless in the bedroom' | Mail Online


As I stated previously, this isn't for all couples. But your wife feels strongly strongly strongly about this. Please answer about the sex questions?


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## See_Listen_Love (Jun 28, 2012)

johnnycomelately said:


> That is abuse. She is attacking you publicly because of her insecurities.


:iagree:

Do YOU want to be married to this black and white thinking women??

This is plain evil, she has psychological issues that will not go away by humiliating you.

Serve her right away divorce papers for this. Don't even think about living with this unloving acting of her.

If she still would want you, she has to own the problem, otherwise you leave.


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## See_Listen_Love (Jun 28, 2012)

kipani said:


> Porn is natural they say, but did you know it destroys 56% of marriages? Because women like feeling like we're the only ones. Many of us close up and throw up heavy emotional walls over the porn thing. Why should we make ourselves so vulnerable to somebody who masturbates to other women? After all, most of us don't do it. Only something like 30% of women watch porn. That's less than 1/3rd of the female population.
> 
> Is Porn Really Destroying 500,000 Marriages Annually? | Psychology Today
> 
> ...


The first article and link to a website are strongly treating porn as a taboo. Well, it reminds me of the television preachers, preaching with their smiling wife next to them that you be pure, and later on banging the secretary in the back.

It's like the idea of democracy in communist Russia. It makes me sick. I wonder how you can fool so many people in these modern day and age with such nonsense....

...and then I reminder the communists succeed in fooling hundreds of millions of people for 70 years the lived in paradise....and all they saw on television and movies from the west was specially made propaganda to fool them....

People, think for yourself please. Use at least some science to enlighten the dark ages of conservatism.


Btw: The second link leads is to an sensation article about nothing.


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## johnnycomelately (Oct 30, 2010)

kipani said:


> Porn is natural they say, but did you know it destroys 56% of marriages?


That is absolute rubbish.

http://www.ehow.co.uk/list_7666866_10-top-reasons-couples-divorce.html

http://www.empowher.com/sex-amp-relationships/content/top-10-reasons-divorce

http://poweroftwomarriage.com/info/reasons-for-divorce/

You should know that any headline that has a question mark after it _(Is Porn Really Destroying 500,000 Marriages Annually?)_ is probably simply trying to attract attention and has no basis in evidence. 

See Betteridge's Law of Headlines: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Betteridge's_Law_of_Headlines


----------



## 45188 (Sep 13, 2012)

but johnny.. many women do see porn as infidelity. saying its propaganda without providing any proof of ptopaganda is kinda silly. the article I posted at least provides sources and just because you don't like what they have to say doesn't mean they're not true. Its hard for a man to understand female psyche. You Guys just disregarded it without checking into it because of bias I suspect, especially given the tone.

If you're curious why not start a thread and ask the girls of tam their opinions?


----------



## johnnycomelately (Oct 30, 2010)

kipani said:


> but johnny.. many women do see porn as infidelity. saying its propaganda without providing any proof of ptopaganda is kinda silly. the article I posted at least provides sources and just because you don't like what they have to say doesn't mean they're not true. Its hard for a man to understand female psyche. You Guys just disregarded it without checking into it because of bias I suspect, especially given the tone.
> 
> If you're curious why not start a thread and ask the girls of tam their opinions?


I didn't say anything about propaganda. 

Every respectable study on reasons for divorce does not even mention porn. 

Making sexist generalisations about what 'you guys' do doesn't help either. I don't disregard the female psyche at all. My wife, like most confident women, understands that porn use is simply a release that is important in a healthy marriage and poses no threat whatsoever.


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## endlessgrief (Feb 19, 2012)

It sounds like your wife has some serious deep down issues regarding porn. I used to be like your wife. When I caught my H viewing porn, I flipped out. My issues regarding porn were born when I was a little kid and my father used to watch porn all day, even if we kids were home. My father had porno magazines all around the house, even in the bathroom for "toilet reading." 

I knew I couldn't hold a candle to those airbrushed beauties and I became very insecure. My mother was very heavy and my father would call her names like fat azz, pig, disgusting, etc. I decided at 12 years old that when I grew up and got married, there would be no porn allowed in the house. 

After tons of therapy, I realized why I viewed porn the way I did and was able to "get over it" and not take it personally and not view it as cheating. 

I hope she wakes up and puts things into perspective before she makes a huge mistake. She's gotta do some serious soul searching and find the ugly black roots of her porn aversion.


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## controlledchaos (Oct 14, 2012)

If you're insecure, porn has no place in your relationship. If not, in moderation it's completely harmless (religious reasons aside).

My Monday morning two cents.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

cndrwil said:


> She just posted on FB what I did.


All her male friends will be thanking God they aren't married to her ! And her women friends with any common sense will be embarrassed for you.

How utterly ridiculous. Posting that on FB - just makes her look like a whiny baby. If I was her friend, I'd have words for her, she'd be getting in indepth private message ~ of how bad this makes her look & some sympathy for YOU. Geeze [email protected]#$%^&


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## 45188 (Sep 13, 2012)

^hahahaha..

And no Johnny wasnt talking to you about the propaganda thing. Was talking to See Listen Love. As for the porn and relationships thing well...

Men's Porn Use Linked to Unhappy Relationships | Women & Self-Esteem | LiveScience

Another reputable source. There are a few women in this very thread posting scathing remarks on porn. =/

OP are you really telling us the whole story??? That seems a bit insane.


----------



## johnnycomelately (Oct 30, 2010)

kipani said:


> ^hahahaha..
> 
> And no Johnny wasnt talking to you about the propaganda thing. Was talking to See Listen Love. As for the porn and relationships thing well...
> 
> ...


Again that is bunk science, if you consider for a moment that the vast majority of men use porn it is impossible to separate out porn use as a factor. You are basically condemning most men as being bad lovers, bad partners and heading for divorce.


----------



## Chris Taylor (Jul 22, 2010)

cndrwil said:


> Well I tried to log in the other day and post my replies, but I was having issues with the firewall I installed to block sites that weren't within the parameters I wanted.
> 
> I do agree with the post that we are to digital today. Had my wife and I married 15+ years ago, I probably wouldn't have known or done anything online. But thanks to free websites, fb, twitter... we know share and do things online we never would have before. She just posted on FB what I did.
> 
> ...


cndrwil... can you give us some background?

How was your marriage in general? Any other issues?

How was your sex life? Were you satisfied with your sexual relationship with your wife? Were you using porn to help with masturbation?

Do you consider your wife attractive? Just curious as to whether there were issues that led to the porn use.


----------



## 45188 (Sep 13, 2012)

Johnny I was pretty confident until I saw that crap on his screen. So it applies to me. I mean seriously, if I'm as pretty as he says I am why is he watching porn? It didn't compute! Until I came to tam and started a thread "Why do men watch porn when they're in a relationship." as I said - I still feel deeply insecure. 

Yeah the vast majority of men use porn.. But do their women know? I'm GLAD he hides it. He hides it because he KNEW it would make me insecure. I'm pretty sure it would make him insecure! I talked to my girlfriends about their boyfriends with porn and a lot of them swear their bfs don't even watch porn! A few months ago, I woulda sworn the same.

Therein lies the danger. Us finding OUT you watch porn :rofl:

FFS man, if you're going to be dating me I don't want to see some chicks ass as your facebook timeline picture and you clicking "like" on pictures of half naked ****s.

I'm starting another thread about this! I'm really curious now! And yes op for the billionth time, HOW WAS YOUR SEX LIFE??


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## Jamison (Feb 10, 2011)

To the OP, now that you have people saying it is a form of cheating and others who say its not, your head is probably even more confused! Bottom line is this, if your wife sees it as cheating then guess what, thats the way she sees it, period. It is what it is for your situation. If she sees it as that, and you feel bad about it, then thats whats got to be dealt with. It does not matter if some tell you it is, if some tell you its not, what matters is how she sees it and what you both feel you need to do to save your marriage. Good luck.


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## anony2 (Apr 28, 2012)

SimplyAmorous said:


> All her male friends will be thanking God they aren't married to her ! And her women friends with any common sense will be embarrassed for you.
> 
> How utterly ridiculous. Posting that on FB - just makes her look like a whiny baby. If I was her friend, I'd have words for her, she'd be getting in indepth private message ~ of how bad this makes her look & some sympathy for YOU. Geeze [email protected]#$%^&


That is kinda funny considering on this website, people actually say to "out" the spouse that is cheating, on a daily basis.

Sounds to me as if she is following along with that ideology of shaming him, the same way that outing a cheater to family members would be shaming them.


----------



## 45188 (Sep 13, 2012)

It's true, but many people don't consider porn to be cheating, while many do. Refer to my post earlier about the guy who was constantly cybering women online but didn't consider it cheating.

So far according to my TAM poll (In siggy) in general women aren't okay with it, while men are. So far NO male has voted that they don't like porn. It's kind of what I expected.


----------



## johnnycomelately (Oct 30, 2010)

anony2 said:


> That is kinda funny considering on this website, people actually say to "out" the spouse that is cheating, on a daily basis.
> 
> Sounds to me as if she is following along with that ideology of shaming him, the same way that outing a cheater to family members would be shaming them.


He isn't cheating.


----------



## anony2 (Apr 28, 2012)

johnnycomelately said:


> He isn't cheating.


According to the wife, he is. Are you saying that she is wrong? 

Do you get to decide what other people's deal breakers are?


----------



## 45188 (Sep 13, 2012)

Theres another thread on here about a muslim man who is just crushed / disappointed his wife watched porn. Check my siggy Johnny and take my poll please.


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## johnnycomelately (Oct 30, 2010)

anony2 said:


> According to the wife, he is. Are you saying that she is wrong?
> 
> Do you get to decide what other people's deal breakers are?


So watching porn is cheating? That is immature and diminishes the experiences of those who have actually been cheated on. What next? Masturbation is cheating? Looking is cheating? Please.


----------



## 45188 (Sep 13, 2012)

When I caught my boyfriend with his porn I was just really sad, but I didn't feel 100% betrayed - it's borderline though. It does wreck your self esteem. When my ex cheated on me, I lost like 15 pounds from grief. It's more like extreme disrespect than flat out cheating. As we've told you before, porn sends most women the message that they weren't good enough. That they're just something to have sex with and the women they really desire are those untouchables on the computer screen. 

I dono johnny, if you were out with your wife and there was a hot ass guy walking by and she jerked her head around to check him out and you saw the lust on her face, how would it make YOU feel? That's not even porn. Just looking. But think about it.

I mean you can sit there and call people stupid for their views all you want but you refuse to listen to anything other than what you believe anyway. Narrow minded. Everything you don't agree with is BS, because you can't see it their way..

OP still hasn't answered our sex life question


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## anony2 (Apr 28, 2012)

johnnycomelately said:


> So watching porn is cheating? That is immature and diminishes the experiences of those who have actually been cheated on. What next? Masturbation is cheating? Looking is cheating? Please.



Good thing we have you here johnny, otherwise, we would all have to form our own opinions and live by them. :scratchhead:

:rofl:


----------



## johnnycomelately (Oct 30, 2010)

anony2 said:


> Good thing we have you here johnny, otherwise, we would all have to form our own opinions and live by them. :scratchhead:
> 
> :rofl:


Well according to your logic if I decide my wife is a coconut, she is a coconut and you all have to agree that she is a coconut. 

The OP did not cheat. He did not have sex with another person, he didn't form an emotional bond with another person. Are you really saying that he cheated? Really? Every man or woman who looks at a naked picture of another person is cheating?


----------



## anony2 (Apr 28, 2012)

johnnycomelately said:


> Well according to your logic if I decide my wife is a coconut, she is a coconut and you all have to agree that she is a coconut.
> 
> The OP did not cheat. He did not have sex with another person, he didn't form an emotional bond with another person. Are you really saying that he cheated? Really? Every man or woman who looks at a naked picture of another person is cheating?


That is the epitome of a strawman argument. Do you know what that is?

The wife gets to decide FOR HERSELF what cheating is. 

If the wife decides that if her husband looks at other women naked is cheating, that is HER OPTION.

You cannot change that, so you might as well deal with it.


----------



## 45188 (Sep 13, 2012)

What about sexting Johnny? Is that cheating? No physical or emotion has to be involved.


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## johnnycomelately (Oct 30, 2010)

anony2 said:


> That is the epitome of a strawman argument. Do you know what that is?


Yes.



anony2 said:


> The wife gets to decide FOR HERSELF what cheating is.


I have decided FOR MYSELF that my wife is a coconut. How dare you disagree with me!



anony2 said:


> If the wife decides that if her husband looks at other women naked is cheating, that is HER OPTION.


No, its not. 



anony2 said:


> IYou cannot change that, so you might as well deal with it.


You cannot change the fact that he didn't cheat.


----------



## anony2 (Apr 28, 2012)

johnnycomelately said:


> Yes.
> 
> I have decided FOR MYSELF that my wife is a coconut. How dare you disagree with me!
> 
> ...


If you know what a strawman argument is, then you would have understood that your argument made no sense at all and didn't have anything at all to do with this thread. 

This man's wife didn't decide WHAT he was, she decided what she would allow in her marriage...Get that? *HER marriage*, not YOUR marriage. *SHE gets to decide her deal breakers,* and if SHE deems that watching porn is cheating, then that is totally up to her. 

You cannot change HER OPINION of what cheating is and HER OPINION is that porn is cheating. Your opinion of what cheating is, doesn't mean jack **** in HER marriage. EVERY couple decides for themselves what cheating is IN THEIR own MARRIAGE. Not you. 

Get it?


----------



## See_Listen_Love (Jun 28, 2012)

kipani said:


> ^hahahaha..
> 
> And no Johnny wasnt talking to you about the propaganda thing. Was talking to See Listen Love. As for the porn and relationships thing well...
> 
> ...


Kipani, this is NOT a reputable source, but I can understand how this confuses people by it's superficiallity. It's a scientific shame.



> Sex and self-esteem
> 
> The findings showed that the statistical link between frequency of porn use and relationship dissatisfaction was partially explained by low self-esteem among the women in these relationships. _*But that doesn't prove that porn necessarily caused the women's self-esteem to drop. It's a chicken-and-egg problem, Stewart said: Women whose partners watch a lot of porn might begin to feel more insecure. Or women who feel bad about themselves might seek out or stay with porn-loving guys more often than secure women.*_ [6 Tips for a Happy Relationship]
> 
> _*The study is limited to a youthful demographic, and most of the relationships were short-term*,_ Stewart said. Because most of the couples _*weren't co-habitating*_, the women might not know how much porn their partners actually watched, she said.


The title of the article is based on these erroneous sources of information.

Bad feeling girls in a short term relation about the suspected porn use of their *living apart* boyfriends!

And then concluding like the one in the article........:scratchhead:


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## controlledchaos (Oct 14, 2012)

johnnycomelately said:


> Well according to your logic if I decide my wife is a coconut, she is a coconut and you all have to agree that she is a coconut.


:smthumbup:



anony2 said:


> The wife gets to decide FOR HERSELF what cheating is.
> 
> If the wife decides that if her husband looks at other women naked is cheating, that is HER OPTION.
> 
> You cannot change that, so you might as well deal with it.


In every relationship it only takes one nutcase to mess it up. In johnnycomelately's case, its him thinking his wife is a coconut. In the OP's, it's his wife's unreasonable, extreme views on cheating. 

*She* needs help, and her narrow mindedness is going to make life very difficult. 

But as someone said a while back, it's probably just a weak excuse to get rid of the OP. 

And @ anony, we can respect if a woman doesnt like porn in the relationship, but that needs to be made clear from the outset and it should never, never be a deal breaker. 

If a girl told me that I'd think she was a completely insecure, weak individual, and I wouldn't want anything to do with her as she doesn't even have the self confidence to realise that what she brings to a relationship is much more than what a random pair of porn tits can. 

My wife knows I look at other naked women occasionally, but it doesn't affect us in any way and I don't shove it in her face. It's my private time and in fact it's got nothing to do with her. We are both fine with that.


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

controlledchaos said:


> :smthumbup:
> 
> 
> *In every relationship it only takes one nutcase to mess it u*p. In johnnycomelately's case, its him thinking his wife is a coconut. *In the OP's, it's his wife's unreasonable, extreme views on cheating. *
> ...


:iagree:

I pity the husbands of some of these women.
These women are deranged control freaks. There is absolutely nothing the OP can do to please this woman. 

Today its his glimpsing at porn, tomorrow it will be some other petty issue that suddenly becomes a " deal breaker."

Yes,
"..She gets to decide HER deal breakers....." albeit WHENEVER she sees it fit to decide such.


----------



## johnnycomelately (Oct 30, 2010)

anony2 said:


> If you know what a strawman argument is, then you would have understood that your argument made no sense at all and didn't have anything at all to do with this thread.
> 
> This man's wife didn't decide WHAT he was, she decided what she would allow in her marriage...Get that? *HER marriage*, not YOUR marriage. *SHE gets to decide her deal breakers,* and if SHE deems that watching porn is cheating, then that is totally up to her.
> 
> ...


So do you think that if she could sue for divorce on the basis of infidelity because he looked at porn? No, of course not. 

We can't change the universally accepted definition of infidelity based on what one person says. Fine, he upset her. But he was not unfaithful. She can define it as cheating if she wants to and so can you, but you can't force the whole world to accept your definition.

OP, if she insists that you have cheated why not suggest she calls a lawyer and sees if he agrees that what you have done is cheating?


----------



## johnnycomelately (Oct 30, 2010)

kipani said:


> What about sexting Johnny? Is that cheating? No physical or emotion has to be involved.


No emotion involved in sexting? Really? *Two* people telling each other they want each other, how sexy they are, what they want to do to each other? Sounds pretty emotional to me.


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## 45188 (Sep 13, 2012)

johnnycomelately said:


> No emotion involved in sexting? Really? *Two* people telling each other they want each other, how sexy they are, what they want to do to each other? Sounds pretty emotional to me.


Telling someone you want to screw them isn't really emotional, its instinctual. Its like a sexting one night stand. No feelings have to be involved. I mean for you, if you need feelings there to have sex with somebody, that's great - but this isn't the case with a LOT of people.


----------



## controlledchaos (Oct 14, 2012)

Its physical in that you're getting naked for someone else, and them for you. With porn there is no personal connection whatsoever. 

My wife doesn't like me watching soccer, but just because she feels so strongly about it doesnt mean that she isn't a bit extreme in her views and probably needs to learn to lighten up a little. I'd hate to get divorced for sneaking a peek when its on just because she is totally unreasonable and won't flinch on her deal breakers.


----------



## 45188 (Sep 13, 2012)

Haha we're all in a blown out argument now. We should probably just leave it alone and wait for the OPs answer on his sex life at home. Because if hes masturbating to porn more than hes making love to his wife.. That IS cheating.


----------



## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

kipani said:


> *Haha we're all in a blown out argument now. We should probably just leave it alone and wait for the OPs answer on his sex life at home*. Because if hes masturbating to porn more than hes making love to his wife.. That IS cheating.


^^^^^^^^
Maybe she caught him posting/ reading on TAM and decided that it was a " deal breaker?'


But I think in his original post he mentioned that he had just only viewed it [ porn ] a few times.


----------



## anony2 (Apr 28, 2012)

controlledchaos said:


> :smthumbup:
> 
> 
> In every relationship it only takes one *nutcase* to mess it up. In johnnycomelately's case, its him thinking his wife is a coconut. In the OP's, it's his wife's unreasonable, extreme views on cheating.
> ...


So you are going to shame her into submission by calling her names because society has accepted porn as a norm for men and she hasn't? Should she be called names because she hasn't jumped on the bandwagon?

Pretty soon society is going to accept emotional affairs as the norm for women because women are more emotional creatures, just like men are more visual and if men gripe about it, we can call you all nutcases and insecure and tell you it ins't cheating.

Sounds fair, doesn't it?


----------



## anony2 (Apr 28, 2012)

controlledchaos said:


> Its physical in that you're getting naked for someone else, and them for you. With porn there is no personal connection whatsoever.
> 
> My wife doesn't like me watching soccer, but just because she feels so strongly about it doesnt mean that she isn't a bit extreme in her views and probably needs to learn to lighten up a little. I'd hate to get divorced for sneaking a peek when its on just because she is totally unreasonable and won't flinch on her deal breakers.


Except for the many women whose husbands used porn as the catalyst to start looking up women to meet with...yep, you can tell them that they were nutcases for not wanting their husbands watching porn.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argumentum_ad_populum

At one time, it was not against the law to beat your wife...so should we really appeal to the populace on this subject?


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## richie33 (Jul 20, 2012)

We are talking about a marriage. The guy could be a amazing husband and father. He looked at porn
and now all that is down the drain? I understand how it can hurt a woman but destroy a marriage????
Sorry but I don't get it.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## ScarletBegonias (Jun 26, 2012)

when i was younger I would have had the reaction the wife had(being upset,feeling insecure...NOT throwing away the relationship).for some reason now that I'm older I don't care if my partner looks at/watches porn as long as it isn't hidden from me.
I'm talking about "typical" porn that the average man might watch.nothing with kids or animals or snuff stuff.rape porn would freak me out too.

I can't say whether or not porn use is cheating because everyone feels differently and there are too many variables to give a solid answer. Viewing a short porn clip of two women having sex might not be considered cheating but having a short video session/chat with two women doing it might be considered cheating.Too many exceptions and situations.

I DO think this wife over reacted.yes it's ok to be upset and disgusted if that's how you feel about porn but to throw away the marriage over some casual viewing?

I wonder if maybe she has other resentments toward you and this porn thing is her ticket to getting rid of you without actually having to address the real issues.


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## Chris Taylor (Jul 22, 2010)

The argument that this is a deal breaker because the wife says it is just can't be right.

If the wife said trying to have sex with her was a deal breaker, would that be right? There has to be an agreement between the parties of what a deal breaker is and whether it is reasonable.

Most of us guys feel that watching porn is NOT a reasonable deal breaker, and reacting the way OP's wife did without discussing it being a deal breaker beforehand was wrong.


----------



## southern wife (Jul 22, 2011)

kipani said:


> Haha we're all in a blown out argument now. We should probably just leave it alone and wait for the OPs answer on his sex life at home. Because if hes masturbating to porn more than hes making love to his wife.. That IS cheating.


Having sex with yourself ................IS CHEATING? :rofl:


OMG, we're all a bunch of cheaters!!! :lol:


----------



## anony2 (Apr 28, 2012)

Chris Taylor said:


> The argument that this is a deal breaker because the wife says it is just can't be right.
> 
> If the wife said trying to have sex with her was a deal breaker, would that be right? There has to be an agreement between the parties of what a deal breaker is and whether it is reasonable.
> 
> *Most of us guys feel that watching porn is NOT a reasonable deal breaker,* and reacting the way OP's wife did without discussing it being a deal breaker beforehand was wrong.



Sorry, but at one time, 'most guys' thought it was okay to beat their wives. Does this mean that beating your wife was a good thing to do for the marriage?


It is totally misogynistic to think that men get to decide what women's deal breakers are. Women are capable of thinking for themselves, we do not need men to do it for us.


----------



## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

southern wife said:


> Having sex with yourself ................IS CHEATING? :rofl:
> 
> 
> *OMG, we're all a bunch of cheaters!!! * :lol:


----------



## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

Chris Taylor said:


> The argument that this is a deal breaker because the wife says it is just can't be right.
> 
> If the wife said trying to have sex with her was a deal breaker, would that be right? *There has to be an agreement between the parties of what a deal breaker is and whether it is reasonable.*
> 
> .


:iagree:
Apparently to some people it's " misogynistic " whenever a man decides stand up for himself and to call B.S on his wife's or any other woman's power / control games.
Why did his wife seek to further humiliate him by placing it on fb?

When I was a boy my younger sister always played that card.
She would ask me to play with her and whenever she was loosing, change the rules to suit her.
Whenever I protested, she would throw a tantrum, give me a speech on how " boys are supposed to treat girls ", and grab her toys and storm off.

I simply stopped playing with her whenever she asked.


----------



## controlledchaos (Oct 14, 2012)

anony2 said:


> So you are going to shame her into submission by calling her names because society has accepted porn as a norm for men and she hasn't? Should she be called names because she hasn't jumped on the bandwagon?
> 
> Pretty soon society is going to accept emotional affairs as the norm for women because women are more emotional creatures, just like men are more visual and if men gripe about it, we can call you all nutcases and insecure and tell you it ins't cheating.
> 
> Sounds fair, doesn't it?


She doesn't feel any shame - she posted their private issues on facebook to humiliate him. I don't think she would care what I think. Anyway, she's probably too busy flicking light switches on and off 100 times so that she doesnt fall off the edge of the earth. 



anony2 said:


> Except for the many women whose husbands used porn as the catalyst to start looking up women to meet with...yep, you can tell them that they were nutcases for not wanting their husbands watching porn.
> 
> Argumentum ad populum - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> At one time, it was not against the law to beat your wife...so should we really appeal to the populace on this subject?


Yes, like cigarettes lead to heroin addictions.. 

Porn is not against the law, and until the second coming happens (don't wait around), it never will be. It's a billion dollar industry that creates jobs for young people who are trying to get through college. It's not all bad. 



southern wife said:


> Having sex with yourself ................IS CHEATING? :rofl:
> 
> 
> OMG, we're all a bunch of cheaters!!! :lol:


****, I cheated on my wife this morning then.


----------



## southern wife (Jul 22, 2011)

controlledchaos said:


> ****, I cheated on my wife this morning then.


:lol:



I cheated on Saturday!


----------



## controlledchaos (Oct 14, 2012)

southern wife said:


> :lol:
> 
> 
> 
> I cheated on Saturday!


You're about due for another session of infidelity then :bounce:


----------



## anony2 (Apr 28, 2012)

anony2 said:


> Sorry, but at one time, 'most guys' thought it was okay to beat their wives. Does this mean that beating your wife was a good thing to do for the marriage?
> 
> 
> *It is totally misogynistic to think that men get to decide what women's deal breakers are. * Women are capable of thinking for themselves, we do not need men to do it for us.





Caribbean Man said:


> :iagree:
> Apparently *to some people it's " misogynistic " whenever a man decides stand up for himself and to call B.S on his wife's or any other woman's power / control games.*
> Why did his wife seek to further humiliate him by placing it on fb?
> 
> ...


So not what I said...Please do not lie about me or what I SAY.

Deciding what to do or what you want in YOUR OWN MARRIAGE is not a power play or an attempt to control.


----------



## anony2 (Apr 28, 2012)

controlledchaos said:


> Yes, like cigarettes lead to heroin addictions..
> 
> Porn is not against the law, and until the second coming happens (don't wait around), it never will be. It's a billion dollar industry that creates jobs for young people who are trying to get through college. It's not all bad.


Another strawman argument, no one said that cigarettes lead to heroin addictions, but pot is called the gateway drug for a reason. 

Beating your wife was not always against the law either, does that mean it was good for the marriage?


----------



## controlledchaos (Oct 14, 2012)

anony2 said:


> Women are capable of thinking for themselves, we do not need men to do it for us.


You're a woman though, and you're not - your beliefs come from somewhere else if I remember correctly.. 



anony2 said:


> Another strawman argument, no one said that cigarettes lead to heroin addictions, but pot is called the gateway drug for a reason.
> 
> Beating your wife was not always against the law either, does that mean it was good for the marriage?


I've smoked pot. It didn't lead to anything other than the munchies. 

Are you insinuating that porn is not only grounds for divorce, but should be illegal too?

Are you even capable of going to the beach with your man? There are other women there in bikinis you know. What if he does the unthinkable and looks at one??  :nono: 

Someone call the marriage counselor.


----------



## anony2 (Apr 28, 2012)

controlledchaos said:


> You're a woman though, and you're not - your beliefs come from somewhere else if I remember correctly..
> 
> 
> I've smoked pot. It didn't lead to anything other than the munchies.
> ...



My beliefs?? 

My beliefs come from my experience and have nothing to do with this thread. I am not religious, nor do I believe in any religion. 

I am not insinuating anything, I am saying that the OP's wife has a right to make *HER OWN *deal breakers. 

The rest of your post is strawman BEE-ESS.


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## ScarletBegonias (Jun 26, 2012)

anony2 said:


> I am saying that the OP's wife has a right to make *HER OWN *deal breakers.


I agree with this.

The whole situation could have been avoided had the wife said at the beginning, I hate porn with the fury of a thousand dragons and if you view it I will go off the deep end and flip out.

She should at least give him another chance now that he knows without a doubt exactly how deep her loathing is for porn.


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## southern wife (Jul 22, 2011)

controlledchaos said:


> You're about due for another session of infidelity then :bounce:


:iagree: :iagree: :iagree:


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## southern wife (Jul 22, 2011)

controlledchaos said:


> I've smoked pot. It didn't lead to anything other than the munchies.


:lol: And a good nap! :rofl:


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## controlledchaos (Oct 14, 2012)

anony2 said:


> My beliefs??
> 
> My beliefs come from my experience and have nothing to do with this thread. I am not religious, nor do I believe in any religion.
> 
> ...


Aah yes you're the insecure one, not the religious one. My mistake :smthumbup:

Of course she does, but that doesn't mean that she's correct in her views. My wife slept till midday on Sunday. It's a deal breaker for *ME*. I think I might publicly humiliate her than serve her divorce papers. Fair?

You're defending this woman is because you cannot deal with the fact that your husband might be physically attracted to other females. It must be awesome being the only sexy female left on earth.


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## controlledchaos (Oct 14, 2012)

ScarletBegonias said:


> The whole situation could have been avoided *had the wife said at the beginning*, I hate porn with the fury of a thousand dragons and if you view it I will go off the deep end and flip out.
> 
> She should at least give him another chance now that he knows without a doubt exactly how deep her loathing is for porn.


Well yes, that is the point. She's treated it in the same category as if he raped a small child. It's naked adults, come on.

If I may ask, why do you hate porn so much?



southern wife said:


> :lol: And a good nap! :rofl:


You do know you might go blind btw, from this illicit form of cheating.


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## ScarletBegonias (Jun 26, 2012)

controlledchaos said:


> Well yes, that is the point. She's treated it in the same category as if he raped a small child. It's naked adults, come on.
> 
> If I may ask, why do you hate porn so much?


where did you read I hate porn?

:scratchhead::scratchhead:


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## controlledchaos (Oct 14, 2012)

ScarletBegonias said:


> where did you read I hate porn?
> 
> :scratchhead::scratchhead:


Sorry, here:


> I hate porn with the fury of a thousand dragons and if you view it I will go off the deep end and flip out.


Read too fast


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## ScarletBegonias (Jun 26, 2012)

controlledchaos said:


> Sorry, here:
> 
> Read too fast


"wife should have said, I hate porn...."


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## anony2 (Apr 28, 2012)

controlledchaos said:


> Aah yes you're the insecure one, not the religious one. My mistake :smthumbup:
> 
> Of course she does, but that doesn't mean that she's correct in her views. My wife slept till midday on Sunday. It's a a deal breaker for *ME*. I think I might publicly humiliate her than serve her divorce papers. Fair?
> 
> You're defending this woman is because you cannot deal with the fact that your husband might be physically attracted to other females. It must be awesome being the only sexy female left on earth.


I remember you now, you are the dumb one, not the one with common sense.... 

Opinions are not right or wrong or correct or incorrect. It is the OP's wifes OPINION that porn is cheating, which is neither right or wrong. IT IS HER OPINION. 

If you want to divorce your wife for any reason, that is YOUR RIGHT. It does not matter to me one lick if it is fair or not fair, because other people do not get married or divorced based on MY opinion of what is fair or not. 

I am defending this woman's right to have a say so in her OWN marriage, if you had a brain, you would be too...if you do not stand up for people's rights, then yours will be taken away right along with everyone else's. 

I know that my husband is attracted to other women and I knew this all along... it was him that freaked out when he thought I was looking at a few men at the local grocery and a restaurant. 

:lol:


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## southern wife (Jul 22, 2011)

controlledchaos said:


> You do know you might go blind btw, from this illicit form of cheating.


I thought you went blind without it? :scratchhead:

:rofl:


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## controlledchaos (Oct 14, 2012)

anony2 said:


> I remember you now, you are the dumb one, not the one with common sense....


Says the anti-porn crusader.  



> I know that my husband is attracted to other women and I knew this all along... it was him that freaked out when he thought I was looking at a few men at the local grocery and a restaurant.


That's not entirely the whole story, is it:


anony2 said:


> It hurt me tremendously that I was not "enough" for my husband that he felt the need to go and look at other women's naked bodies.
> 
> Of course, when I tried to explain this to him, he acted like I was nuts and that it was my problem. Well, now it is "our" problem because as you said, it made me feel less special to him and suspicious of him. That effects both of us, not just me.
> 
> The marriage counselor said that our problem is trust.


You have your own insecurity issues to worry about. The last thing you should be doing is blindly standing up for someone else who has made it her 'right' to throw her husband out because she couldn't deal with feeling inadequate.


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## controlledchaos (Oct 14, 2012)

southern wife said:


> I thought you went blind without it? :scratchhead:
> 
> :rofl:


Well you might go blind if you get too close when your man is doing it, I know that much :ezpi_wink1:

(Edit: Thats a blind wink, not a creepy one.)


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## johnnycomelately (Oct 30, 2010)

ScarletBegonias said:


> "wife should have said, I hate porn...."


I agree with this. If you have an objection to what is normal human male behaviour the onus is on you to make that clear before you get married.


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## sweetpea (Jan 30, 2007)

Please keep the thread on topic. We are waiting to hear from OP. We don't want to scare him off TAM with name calling, bickering, and hijacking his thread. Name calling and hijacking thread are against the rules of TAM. Please review the forum guidelines for further clarification or pm a moderator with questions about the guidelines. 

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/general-relationship-discussion/2117-forum-rules-please-read-first.html


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## DavidWYoung (Feb 3, 2012)

Porn is NOT Cheating.


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

FrenchFry said:


> If OPs wife has made it very clear from the beginning that porn is *not ok* in any circumstances in their relationship (which I kind of get the feeling that this is so) then that is her dealbreaker.


Sorry,
But you are wrong.
She NEVER mentioned that it was a deal breaker for her at any time until she discovered it on his computer, which she checked regularly. In fact, this was the only time she ever saw it on his computer. 
He never knew before that she was offended by it.
BTW, it was girl/girl porn.

Page 1, post # 14, 10.17.2012 @ 9.34 PM. Posted by the OP himself in response to another female poster's question:

"........*Waiwera, we never did discuss that at any time. I didn't know she had such strong feelings on it. I knew that she probably wouldn't approve, but not to this extent. Her son actually threw her nephew a playboy video last thanksgiving... we all laughed had a good chuckle about it....."*

In fact, the general consensus on in the beginning of the thread was that his wife was overacting.
A person male or female ,cannot decide what a dealbreaker is in a relationship without first informing their partner, BEFORE.

You cannot make the rules up and change them as you go along.
That type of behaviour is borderline.


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## ladybird (Jun 16, 2010)

Cee Paul said:


> My wife detests porn and has forbidden me to watch it but hasn't wanted to sleep with me for almost 9 months now, so I'll be damned if she's shutting me out of both forms of pleasure, so when I get turned down by her I turn to porn later on when she's asleep or if she's maybe out running errands.
> 
> *And guys don't forget to erase your browse history when you're done, or she can easily check on your latest activities or searches*


 Clearing the history doesn't really get rid of it, all the info is stored on the hard drive waiting to be over written! There are programs to undelete it. If they really want to know what you have been up to, it isn't that hard to find out, if they know how to look for it.


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## ladybird (Jun 16, 2010)

kipani said:


> Its not about insecurity. Its about the feeling of not being enough. Some people aren't like this, some are. When we make someone the center of our world we expect to be the center of theirs. Plain and simple.


DING DING DING!!! Exactly!!


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## ladybird (Jun 16, 2010)

Even if she would have told him about her dislike of him viewing porn, he probably would have done it anyway. He just would have hid it better and not left it out in the open! I am just saying

She thinks that viewing porn is cheating, that is her right. Everyone has their own views of cheating, just because one person does not believe that one thing isn't cheating doesn't mean that someone else doesn't have the same views. Cheating can mean all kinds of different things depending on who you ask!

Everyone takes things differently.


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## controlledchaos (Oct 14, 2012)

sweetpea said:


> Please keep the thread on topic. We are waiting to hear from OP. We don't want to scare him off TAM with name calling, bickering, and hijacking his thread. Name calling and hijacking thread are against the rules of TAM. Please review the forum guidelines for further clarification or pm a moderator with questions about the guidelines.
> 
> http://talkaboutmarriage.com/general-relationship-discussion/2117-forum-rules-please-read-first.html


Pretty pointless making bans and _then_ posting this message. A quick heads up/warning before hand would have sufficed. 

I also disagree that I did any name calling or thread hijacking - I was keeping it on topic with what was being discussed. Users make up a thread, and we all share opinions which are then discussed, dissected, and recalled. 

Having said that, I now know what consists of thread hijacking, so won't do it again. 

It would be wonderful if the OP made a long overdue return though


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## DrDavidCOlsen (Oct 7, 2012)

Porn is a complicated issue in marriage. Porn moves us away from intimacy, and often creates a wedge in marriage. It triggers different reactions in spouses. Your wife's reaction certainly sounds powerful.
Getting individual therapy for yourself is a very good move. See if she will consider getting into some intensive couple therapy. More then likely there are deeper underlying issues that need to emerge.
David Olsen, PHD, LMFT


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## controlledchaos (Oct 14, 2012)

I think in summary, we all need to hear more details of the circumstances involved from the OP. 

Porn in moderation, with an understanding partner, isn't always a problem in marriage. Abusing it or going against your partners clear wishes can be.


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## vcy0812 (Nov 9, 2012)

My husband and I watch porn together and when we are apart. I don't consider porn cheating, it isn't like you have any intentions to sleep with the women you watch. Unless you are watching sex tapes of you and an ex, I really don't see the problem. For my husband and I, it is about exploration and it gives us ideas about stuff we want to try or whatever. We both know that pornography is adult entertainment and nothing else. It is about fantasies and excitement, nothing else. 

I think she overreacted and since she didn't say anything to you about it before, there may be another issue going on here with her. I think you guys should try and sit and talk about it and she needs to be honest with you about the underlying issue. Maybe because she is older than you are, this makes her feel insecure, like you may leave her for someone younger and like the women in porn. Since she didn't say that it was something she wouldn't tolerate in your marriage, I don't see how you are in the wrong. But, if it bothers her that much and you still want to be together, then you guys need to reach a compromise. For me, it seems a little extreme to end a marriage over porn.


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## DavidWYoung (Feb 3, 2012)

Woman on woman porn is really, really not cheating! Really!


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## Chelle D (Nov 30, 2011)

DavidWYoung said:


> Woman on woman porn is really, really not cheating! Really!


Even if the wife is the one watching? Would you feel it was somewhat cheating if you caught your wife looking at woman on woman porn?


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## Soccerfan73 (Jul 30, 2011)

Chelle D said:


> Even if the wife is the one watching? Would you feel it was somewhat cheating if you caught your wife looking at woman on woman porn?


I would be happy actually. But so it goes. To each their own I suppose.


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## MrsSloPok (Nov 12, 2012)

I was your wife once. I fought with my husband over him watching porn. I said all the same things...you're thinking of them when having sex with me....what am I doing wrong?....you're not happy anymore...etc.

But I realized that it really has nothing to do with me. Its not because I don't satisfy him. Its because we're human and sometimes we just wanna look cause' we're curious or because we're not having sex enough and that's a way for him to relieve himself without physically sleeping with someone else. Alot of my issues with my husband looking at porn was because I had trust issues from other relationships and I brought that into our relationship. I honestly believe she's lying about her reasons for her problems with porn...I don't think it disgusts her and she's just totally against it. Good luck!


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## honeysuckle rose (Jun 11, 2010)

Trying2figureitout said:


> Forsaking all others (Humans) not images/videos. Porn is an image.
> No vow was 'broken'... now if you don't like it fine but quit trying to rationalize that a husband
> broke a vow to you.... geez.
> 
> ...


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## honeysuckle rose (Jun 11, 2010)

ladybird said:


> DING DING DING!!! Exactly!!


Yup. That's why you don't make anyone the center of your world. People will always disappoint you. Men will always think about screwing someone else whether he looks at porn or not. If we are really honest, how many men are going thru their memories of past lovers or porn they have seen when they are w/ u? A smart man would never tell bcuz it would hurt u too much. Yeah, he loves you. But you are the warm place he sticks his penis bcuz ur available. Marriage for a man has what incentive if he can't get off on a regular basis w/ a woman who is more readily available?

It is what it is. If u can get over it & get on w/ ur life, ignoring most of what u know is true, the happier u will be.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Open up now let it all go (Sep 20, 2012)

I also don't "need" sex, music, tv, friends, vacation, more then one set of boxers and pretty much anything besides water food and shelter. Doesnt mean we should jump to concluding that we can make our partners give whatever they enjoy in life without having some.proper.communication about it.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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