# Need a new perspective



## Woundedheart (Apr 2, 2014)

Unfortunately for the 2nd time and for my 2nd marriage I need advice.

I have been married with my 2nd wife for a little over a year. I suppose a little of a update, I have recently discovered that I have ADD and a anxiety and depression disorder. (I am supposed to be on anti-depressants now) So I suppose maybe I can be a bit much emotionally. I am really a nice guy. I have been too much of a door mat in the past though (expectantly with my ex with). I have been divorced for 4 years. 

Well, the new concern is that my wife all the sudden started talking to stereo typical cheater speak (or that is what it seemed like from my last experience). So I proceeded to look in her journal (feeling a little guilty). Turns out she most recently talking about another guy she found attractive. She was comparing him to me and I was (big time) at the short end of the stick. This man is known, he works for/with her and just contributed a 10k (right after I confronted her) item to her business. Saying how week and small I seemed. 

I helped her create her business and have debt up to my gills trying to make her dream a reality. I could not live independently right now. 

I confronted her right after and she said she said that she want to explore her feelings for him but had not cheated. I explained why i did what did as far as checking thing out. She said I was not treating her to fair standard. That is comparing her to my ex wife. Now she wants my promise to never read her diary and ok to keep her phone private as to keep me from "exploring" in the future. 

I feel completely unlovable right now


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## Tasorundo (Apr 1, 2012)

The answer is no. She does not get those freedoms, or the freedom to 'explore her feelings' for him. She is married to you, if she wanted to explore feeling for other men, then she should get a divorce.


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## Spoons027 (Jun 19, 2017)

‘Explore her feelings for him’ but did not cheat? Nah, she’s waxing poetic. She wants to explore other men, she shouldn’t be married. And OP, you shouldn’t have to JADE with her if you know what’s up.

If she wants full privacy with her journal and phone, tell her you wanted a faithful spouse who knows what she wants instead of keeping her options open when in a committed relationship.


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

She can explore those feeling all she wants...as your ex wife. 

Either way, you are now seeing the character make up of your wife, and it isn't pretty. You basically financed her ability to start her business, and this is her response to it?

Furthermore, I would consult an attorney regarding the debt. I can't possibly see you having to shoulder all of that if this does go south.

Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk


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## Bananapeel (May 4, 2015)

You're not unlovable but SHE is not showing you love or respect. Since you've been through this before you know the end of this story will be her cheating with this new guy and you divorcing her. The question you need to ponder is how long you want to drag this out for. Definitely sucks, but at least you aren't being blindsided and can make informed decisions.


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## Woundedheart (Apr 2, 2014)

She now says that she will try marriage counseling (though only after texting me that she wanted to sell the house and separate) . So yesterday sucked.  

I am inclined to try that but honestly I have some heavy reservations. She has already told me that she was not willing to put me/my needs in front of her business needs.

So at best this is a Emotional affair right?


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## Woundedheart (Apr 2, 2014)

Would it be bad form to break said gift ?


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## shesgone (Feb 4, 2011)

Woundedheart said:


> Unfortunately for the 2nd time and for my 2nd marriage I need advice.
> 
> Well, the new concern is that my wife all the sudden started talking to stereo typical cheater speak (or that is what it seemed like from my last experience). So I proceeded to look in her journal (*feeling a little guilty*). Turns out she most recently talking about another guy she found attractive. She was comparing him to me and I was (big time) at the short end of the stick. This man is known, he works for/with her and just contributed a 10k (right after I confronted her) item to her business. Saying how week and small I seemed.
> 
> ...


While I am no expert by any means or even close to it, hell I am not even sure that my own marriage will work out at this time..... But if I had this staring me in the face I know what my desicion would be DIVORCE!!

Why the hell should you feel guilty for looking at something? She isn't sorry she did it, she is sorry she got caught. 

If she wants to explore her feelings for this other dude she needs to do it single. If my wife would have told me this, I would have divorced her the next day, no questions asked.

Not treating her fair? She was stupid enough to write in a journal that she has feelings for another man. I can tell you now this would be another immediate divorce no questions asked. 

And whatever you do, dont think you are unlovable, this is all on her shoulders as she is the one lusting after another man.

Read the book "No more Mr Nice Guy". You sound alot like me, I assure you it will help you out.


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## [email protected] (Dec 23, 2017)

Woundedheart, reread your first post. You will see that you are still doing the doormat part. Stop it now! Do your hard 180! File on the ***** now!


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## Broken_in_Brooklyn (Feb 21, 2013)

Woundedheart said:


> She now says that she will try marriage counseling (though only after texting me that she wanted to sell the house and separate) . So yesterday sucked.
> 
> I am inclined to try that but honestly I have some heavy reservations. She has already told me that she was not willing to put me/my needs in front of her business needs.
> 
> So at best this is a Emotional affair right?


Nor should you put her needs in front of yours. Sell the house and her business as it is half yours.


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## Bananapeel (May 4, 2015)

Woundedheart said:


> She now says that she will try marriage counseling (though only after texting me that she wanted to sell the house and separate) . So yesterday sucked.
> 
> I am inclined to try that but honestly I have some heavy reservations. She has already told me that she was not willing to put me/my needs in front of her business needs.
> 
> So at best this is a Emotional affair right?


Is this what you want/expect from a spouse? If it is then go to MC and try working on things. If it is a deal breaker then kick her to the curb. Also, what will happen to her business if you leave and pull out your share of the assets? 

Yup, that is the best case scenario.


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## Gabriel (May 10, 2011)

Well, you are in a trap, aren't you? This woman married someone that was willing to pony up a whole bunch of money to get her business off the ground. Mission accomplished.

So now you are in debt. What about her? What happens if you leave the marriage? Would she be able to subsist her business? Isn't she in debt also?

Might be that once she wrung you dry of funds, she is now looking for the next sugar daddy to finance her business and life.


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## SentHereForAReason (Oct 25, 2017)

Woundedheart said:


> She now says that she will try marriage counseling (though only after texting me that she wanted to sell the house and separate) . So yesterday sucked.
> 
> I am inclined to try that but honestly I have some heavy reservations. She has already told me that she was not willing to put me/my needs in front of her business needs.
> 
> So at best this is a Emotional affair right?


At the very least, yes this is an emotional affair right now. Sounds like all of the makings of them both ramping up, if they haven't already to start 'sealing the deal'. What's crazy is that she is so bold to not even hide it and call you out on it and tell her to give you privacy. As it's been said, you can give her all the privacy that she wants, a real wife or husband would not want this type of privacy, so give it to her as a divorcee. 

In addition to being a failure of a life partner and spouse .... I'm getting the vibe even in general terms, she's not a shining beacon of compassion and love. 

Sorry you are dealing with this (again) as you know, it doesn't end well in this type of situation, especially where the straying partner refuses to go all in on restoring the marriage.


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## sunsetmist (Jul 12, 2018)

I read your other thread from 2014--wife of almost 20 years in 4 year affair, denigrating you and planning to leave with AP. Her friends and family facilitated her infidelity. Your kids from that marriage are essentially adults now.

**You are currently feeling overwhelmed. If I were you, first I would see a lawyer who will give you truth about what a divorce would mean financially, etc. I'm thinking her business is likely a marital asset. Do you have a friend, family, or church where you have a confidant?

What is the 10K gift? Sounds like he is buying her affection. Hard to know if just an EA at this time. If nothing else she puts business, herself, her EA partner before you. In a good marriage one 'cuts off attraction,' not explores it. 

Many adults function well with ADD--are you taking meds? Your anxiety and depression may be the result of heavy debt and feeling that all was not well in your marriage. Don't second guess yourself at this time. You are lovable and have value. There are many folks out there looking for a good man. Continue to work on yourself--good for you. MC may be enlightening and help you in the future if not now.

If this leads to divorce, do some IC and figure out what is wrong with your 'picker'.


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## Rob_1 (Sep 8, 2017)

OP. For the love of God. Read your initial post. You are still being a weak doormat, being walk all over. 

What I don't understand is why haven't you got hold of a lawyer yet, instead of wondering about her reactions toward you. Are you that desperate to try clinging to this already failed marriage?

You already know that she doesn't value you. She used you for the economical part for her business. Now that she has her business you're nothing to her.

How can you still being there after she told you, she wanted to try another guy? One thing is to have ADD and anxiety, that does not justify having no self-respect. 

Please, see your lawyer and find where you stand with the business, and overall financials in this sham of a marriage to get out of it a least with your dignity and manhood intact.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

Woundedheart said:


> Would it be bad form to break said gift ?


Not necessarily. Though it would probably be illegal.


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## Ynot (Aug 26, 2014)

BTW find some way to document this $10k gift to her business, because it now half yours!


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

Woundedheart said:


> Unfortunately for the 2nd time and for my 2nd marriage I need advice.
> 
> I have been married with my 2nd wife for a little over a year. I suppose a little of a update, I have recently discovered that I have ADD and a anxiety and depression disorder. (I am supposed to be on anti-depressants now) So I suppose maybe I can be a bit much emotionally. I am really a nice guy. I have been too much of a door mat in the past though (expectantly with my ex with). I have been divorced for 4 years.
> 
> ...


She’s a) full of **** and b) lying.

Either way, she wants to keep her comms private?

That’s cool.

Keep your funds private as well.

File for divorce ASAP.


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## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

Grow a pair and stop acting like you are afraid to lose her
See a lawyer for your option.
Learn to detach by doing the 180 for you.
Tell her you will not accept her furtive behaviour
If she wants to explore, you want a divorce
She has broken your trust so no, she does not get to have privacy 
If she doesn’t like it, she know what to do.
You want the money she owes u set up as a debt repayable in x years for x% percent 
You have to toughen up and play hardball now. She doesn’t respect you


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## OutofRetirement (Nov 27, 2017)

Do you have a stake in her business?

Based on your situation (married who invested in her business), what would happen about the business if you divorced? I think you need to get an attorney in your locale to tell you what to expect.

The way she acted and what she said, it seems like she doesn't care about you never mind love you. You found out she loves another man and thinks he is better than you, her response was stop your snooping.

You don't have to leave yet if you are not ready. But at least you can prepare. And hope you are ready before she leaves first.


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## Sparta (Sep 4, 2014)

OP really dude come on you’ve been through this already once and you’re you’re thinking it to them to people don’t have emotional affairs people f.uck.! First of all please for the life of God show some strength dude. Go talk to that guy OK.! let him know who he is messing. I can’t believe You have to be told the guys trying to move in on your territory and he talk s.hit about you. Handle it be a man.!


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## BluesPower (Mar 27, 2018)

Sparta said:


> OP really dude come on you’ve been through this already once and you’re you’re thinking it to them to people don’t have emotional affairs people f.uck.! First of all please for the life of God show some strength dude. Go talk to that guy OK.! let him know know who he is messing. I can’t believe You have to be told the guys trying to move in on your territory and he talk s.hit about you. Handle it be a man.!


 @Sparta, you and I both know this is not an emotional affair. 

He needs to divorce and start over.


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## Lostinthought61 (Nov 5, 2013)

can her business be sold since you are in debt, those debts need to pay off so she will have to lose her business end of story or buy you out.


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## Rubix Cubed (Feb 21, 2016)

If you choose the doormat path again and go to MC, what are you going to do when an incompetent counselor sides completely with your cheating wife and the 2 of them (3 if you count Daddy Warbucks) gang up on you to convince you it's all your fault. Odds are good this will happen. It's an MC's ob to save the marriage even at the cost of your sanity. 


*Do yourself a HUGE favor and go hire a bulldog lawyer to get you through your divorce and get your money back.*


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## Sparta (Sep 4, 2014)

Man is it ever.? Blues power There is a distinct pattern when it comes to the nice guy syndrome or The guy that is baffled beyond believe and and is and most of all comes off extremely week. Which makes a woman’s Vijay like Death Valley. And of course making themselves so unattractive to women. You might as will be dead or kryptonite any woman on this planet. I don’t get it I didn’t know any human being could even come off so weak. 

What really boggles my mind is they can read all the threads where strength was guiding that BS to gaining back control of his or her Life. Even getting the WW and WH to give a more favorable outcome when splitting assets and child custody when divorcing.


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## Rick Blaine (Mar 27, 2017)

1) Your wife is having a full-blown affair. She wants to separate so she can be with her new beau.
2) You need to establish firm boundaries. Not in a month, not next week, right now. Which means...
3) File for divorce ASAP. Have her served at work.
4) Hire an attorney. In all likelihood, half of your debt is her debt, and half of her assets are your assets. So waste no time. Your marriage is toast, as your wife is showing you her true colors.
5) Avoid contact with her as much as possible. There is nothing to discuss and you need to be a man of action. 
6) Very sorry you are going through this again. Ending it now will save you more heartache and $$$ down the road. 
7) Consider this a test. Decisiveness, conviction, and action will make you a new man if you dare to try. 
8) Fix your picker.


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## mickybill (Nov 29, 2016)

You said that you have been together about a year? And she wants to sell the house and separate?
Do it. You will save yourself a lot of heartache as she will continue this kind of crap forever.

Sell the house , take your money out of "her business" and split. Let the gift giver take over the role of sugar financier.
Is it a real business or a busy work money losing business? 

And what sort of $10,000 "donation" did the OM make to a "friend"


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## Mr.Married (Feb 21, 2018)

You have already set up the doormat dynamics in your new relationship. This relationship is only headed further down if you stay.

1. Divorce
2. Stop being a doormat/nice guy
3. Fix your woman picker (you continue to pick the wrong ones)
4. Date longer before getting married (use this period to decide if your door-matting again)

Easier said than done right! 

Anyways...ditch the wife now...she has one foot out the door already....and probably one other part of her anatomy.


EDIT: 2 divorces does not make you a failure unless you don't learn from your mistakes. Do it right the 3rd time by changing yourself for the better. No person is perfect
and we all have our flaws. This situation does not mean you are "broken" ...... but not learning from it does. Chin up....Good Luck


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## Woundedheart (Apr 2, 2014)

Thanks for your guys input. I suppose more history is needed for me. I had a really really bbad childhood. My mother was deathly ill and me and my dad were her only care givers. I was severely bullied at school also. So I do have a lot of self-esteem issues. I am trying to fix my baggage. Was seeing a counselor. I just stopped only to find another. So I am all about self growth. I need to still hit my goals.


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## Woundedheart (Apr 2, 2014)

I am taking some time away. I will not be obsessing over what my wife does. Either I see something in marriage counseling or I am out of there. I can not be a backup plan anymore.i rather be homeless than be where I am now. (This debt has killed my credit) I need to see more.


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## Woundedheart (Apr 2, 2014)

And I need to retire nfrom picking. This **** sucks. I do not think I could trust anyone else.


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## She'sStillGotIt (Jul 30, 2016)

Woundedheart said:


> Thanks for your guys input. I suppose more history is needed for me. I had a really really bbad childhood. My mother was deathly ill and me and my dad were her only care givers. I was severely bullied at school also. So I do have a lot of self-esteem issues. I am trying to fix my baggage. Was seeing a counselor. I just stopped only to find another. So I am all about self growth. I need to still hit my goals.


You can still spend the next 20 years in therapy 'working on you' but that doesn't mean you can't take out the trash here and now. Stop making excuses.


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## Woundedheart (Apr 2, 2014)

No excuse. Just perspective. I know where things are probably going, I just have to make a 100 percent sure. I am taking a break this weekend and visiting family out of state.


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## Mr.Married (Feb 21, 2018)

Woundedheart said:


> No excuse. Just perspective. I know where things are probably going, I just have to make a 100 percent sure. I am taking a break this weekend and visiting family out of state.


That's a good start but it is already VERY clear to everyone else. The relationship is done...very done. Remove it from your life.

Not harping here but listen up: When you loose respectable value in a woman's eyes....it's finished. She will only use you for her one sided benefit thereafter until the next guy comes along.
Don't put yourself through that.....she is already out the door and sniffing the trail...likely much more. The low esteem guys on here always take the worst kind of beating emotionally, don't be
that guy. Take charge now and make it happen on your own terms. You'll be surprised how much that alone can bring you some satisfaction and self worth. Childhood problems can be tramatic
but they do not define your life...only you do.


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## Gabriel (May 10, 2011)

Sparta said:


> Man is it ever.? Blues power There is a distinct pattern when it comes to the nice guy syndrome or The guy that is baffled beyond believe and and is and most of all comes off extremely week. Which makes a woman’s Vijay like Death Valley. And of course making themselves so unattractive to women. You might as will be dead or kryptonite any woman on this planet. I don’t get it I didn’t know any human being could even come off so weak.
> 
> What really boggles my mind is they can read all the threads where strength was guiding that BS to gaining back control of his or her Life. Even getting the WW and WH to give a more favorable outcome when splitting assets and child custody when divorcing.


Nice Guy Syndrome is simply denial. The nicer you are the stronger the denial. The stronger the denial, the nicer guy you are. Simple as that. People who like to close their eyes, cover their ears and say lalalalalala are the ones we all pick on as "nice guys". They just don't want to believe their lives aren't what they want them to be.


I say this because I was a denier for awhile myself, never thought my wife could be "that person". I knew her actions were truth, but couldn't reconcile that with who she was (at least for awhile). I was in denial she was capable of falling for someone else.

Only when the pain of not knowing/believing overcomes the pain of the truth behind it will a betrayed spouse shed the "nice" behavior. Only then.


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## MyRevelation (Apr 12, 2016)

OP ... you simply have a defective "picker". You thought you were marrying for love, etc., but she saw you as a nice guy, with a nice checkbook, that was easily manipulated. It really sucks that there are people like your W out there, but its time to man up and see her for what she is and make the cleanest break possible.

As for the $10K "gift" ... you've had a couple of suggestions ... one was to break it and the other was to secure it to preserve half of its value as a marital asset. I don't think there's much to save here, but if you see some value that you want to try to R with your W ... I'm the kind of guy that would DEMAND NC with OM forever and would then "spike" the gift as a very visual reminder of just how serious I was in that DEMAND.


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

Woundedheart said:


> No excuse. Just perspective. I know where things are probably going, I just have to make a 100 percent sure. I am taking a break this weekend and visiting family out of state.


Your wife has told you "SHE WANTS TO EXPLORE HER FEELLINGS WITH THE OM"............

Nothing but 100% absolute metaphysical certitude about her feelings for YOU.
BTW, he's not giving her 10k$ gifts without getting sex. She's banging him, and for while.

You are wasting time not seeing an attorney. She's likely working on her escape plan as we type.

Your past needs to be your past. Start being the man you want to be. Simple as that. Yeah, it hurts. It'll hurt worse to continue as you have been.


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## Rob_1 (Sep 8, 2017)

I still don't understand why this "nice guy" term. 

Nice guys are not nice, they're weak men; a lot of times pathetically so.


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## BluesPower (Mar 27, 2018)

Woundedheart said:


> Thanks for your guys input. I suppose more history is needed for me. I had a really really bbad childhood. My mother was deathly ill and me and my dad were her only care givers. I was severely bullied at school also. So I do have a lot of self-esteem issues. I am trying to fix my baggage. Was seeing a counselor. I just stopped only to find another. So I am all about self growth. I need to still hit my goals.


You know what, that may all be well and good. Glad you survived. 

Dude, you need to file for divorce and start a different life, You understand that right? 

As for self growth... Now is the time to stand up and be a man even if you are not sure how. 

Step one, divorce this woman, ASAP...


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## Woundedheart (Apr 2, 2014)

At this time, we are devorcing. I hate marriage. I feel sick.


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## Rob_1 (Sep 8, 2017)

This is the correct path. Just make sure you get a good lawyer that has extensive knowledge on the business distribution matters, don't let her try to keep it all for herself. 

Do not falter.


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## Rubix Cubed (Feb 21, 2016)

Woundedheart said:


> At this time, we are devorcing. I hate marriage. I feel sick.


 Do not falter from this decision, it's the best thing you can do. You WILL get through it and if you work on yourself you will be a far better person than you could ever be shackled to a user leech such as your wife.


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## VladDracul (Jun 17, 2016)

Wounded my man, as hard as it is divorcing her is the best thing you can do. "Explore her feelings for him" is womanese for I want to be with him so get lost". Chances are she's the kind of woman that feels like a new man every now an then and she'll be seeking new blood after you're history and she's married to her new future ex-husband. Take my word for it Dawg, once you're rid of this parasite, your financial situation will vastly improve.
I don't know how your marriage/business is structured, but if you financed part of it, you my be due for a piece of the action.


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## [email protected] (Dec 23, 2017)

Woundedheart, referring to an earlier post, don't get mad. Get even. It does great things for the self concept. Live well. It'll drive your ex nuts.


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

I know you feel sick right now but that will pass. 

This is the best path for you. Take it.


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## Sports Fan (Aug 21, 2014)

Your immediate response to her wanting to explore her feelings for another man should be instant divorce. Nobody kicks in $10,000 towards her business unless she is sleeping with him. Hire a Shark of a Divorce Lawyer recoup your money and get everything you are entitled too. Do not play nice or fall for the old lets settle amicably trick once she realises you are likely to receive a settlement that is a lot greater than she anticipated.


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## BetrayedDad (Aug 8, 2013)

Woundedheart said:


> I confronted her right after and she said she said that she want to explore her feelings for him but had not cheated. I explained why i did what did as far as checking thing out. She said I was not treating her to fair standard. That is comparing her to my ex wife. Now she wants my promise to never read her diary and ok to keep her phone private as to keep me from "exploring" in the future.


The only thing your “wife” wants to explore is the OM’s genitalia.... the only thing you should be exploring is local divorce lawyers in your area. She’s having an emotional affair at best that’s about to turn sexual.

The tours over boyo. She has checked out permenantly. Read the quoted paragraph carefully. Not only does she have no intention of stopping, she doesn’t want you to keep investigating because knowing you’re getting cucked will hurt your feelings.... WTF?!?

You might be her husband but you’re not her man, you’re plan B. I don’t believe she was ever invested in this relationship, you’re just a placeholder for husband number three. Whatever love she had, she gave away long ago to another man.

This relationship will end one of two ways. The least you can do for your self respect (if you have ANY left) is go out like a man and be the dumper, not the dumpee. Even if she took you back and she will never really love you. Don’t waste your life.


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## Gabriel (May 10, 2011)

[email protected] said:


> Woundedheart, referring to an earlier post, don't get mad. Get even. It does great things for the self concept. Live well. It'll drive your ex nuts.


Good advice. However, I really don't think his wife will care how he lives unless he becomes financially able to help her again.

Chick is a gold digger. All she wanted was money to start her business, and she got it. Now she's searching for her alpha male to be her lover. Probably found it.

She has no more use for Wounded Heart. He should just stay single after this and not fall for someone's plea for marriage. At least not for many, many years.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Woundedheart said:


> I am really a nice guy. I have been too much of a door mat in the past
> 
> she said she said that she want to explore her feelings for him but had not cheated
> 
> I explained why i did what did as far as checking thing out. She said I was not treating her to fair standard. That is comparing her to my ex wife. Now she wants my promise to never read her diary and ok to keep her phone private as to keep me from "exploring" in the future.


One, what did you ever do to STOP being a nice guy? Apparently nothing.

Two, she is already cheating just by being willing to TALK TO and FLIRT WITH another man while being married. So you married a cheater. Period. Accept it. Now, what are you going to DO about it?

Three, hell NO you don't promise to stay out of her stuff when she has already proven to cheat.

You should never have paid for her 'business.' That made you look even MORE like a doormat.

The only hope you have now is to tell her 'hand over all electronics, stop ALL contact with this man, or move out - NOW - and the court will make you pay half of all the debt we have accumulated in the divorce.'


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## Woundedheart (Apr 2, 2014)

I am in such a dark place right now. This is worse for me than the last time.


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## Woundedheart (Apr 2, 2014)

If I make it that far... Devorice is certian.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Woundedheart said:


> I am in such a dark place right now. This is worse for me than the last time.


Why? Do these women have some sort of superiority over you? Are they 'worth' more than you? Deserve more?


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## [email protected] (Dec 23, 2017)

Wounded, don't do anything to yourself! They will have won then. We are looking forward to you getting rid of this medusa.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

Woundedheart said:


> If I make it that far... Devorice is certian.


You need to see someone about your depression. Now.


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## Devastated wife (Feb 19, 2018)

Wounded, I am so sorry that you are having to go through this not once, but twice. I can't imagine how you feel. Your wife sounds like a very selfish person and she doesn't deserve you.

Be kind to yourself and take the time to heal properly; don't rush into another relationship. Do the things you enjoy doing and spend time with people who you enjoy being around.

This woman is not worth your time, karma will find her eventually, just let her go. You need to concentrate on yourself.

It sounds like you could do with some individual counselling, that should be a priority right now. You will get through this.


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## Ursula (Dec 2, 2016)

My thoughts: those who have nothing to hide, hide nothing. IMO, she's already cheating if she wants to explore her feelings for another man while married to you. I also don't think she has the right at this point to lock her phone and hide her diary. If I were you, I would keep snooping around, and keep a record of things, but also keep it on the down-low. Don't let her know that you're digging around.


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## BluesPower (Mar 27, 2018)

Ursula said:


> My thoughts: those who have nothing to hide, hide nothing. IMO, she's already cheating if she wants to explore her feelings for another man while married to you. I also don't think she has the right at this point to lock her phone and hide her diary. If I were you, I would keep snooping around, and keep a record of things, but also keep it on the down-low. Don't let her know that you're digging around.


You know, in a lot of cases I would agree with this. But not this one. 

This affair, and yes it is a full blown physical affair, has been going on a while. They did not have their ducks in a row when OP caught her. She wanted to suck up his money and comfort for a while before she left him.

Then of course she lied, and said what she did. But for her to say that she was exploring her feelings with him, and for him to actually believe it or a second... Wow, that is beyond the pale. 

This man just needs to move on. She is gone, and she has been gone for a long time...


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## skerzoid (Feb 7, 2017)

Woundedheart.:

1. You are hinting that you are thinking about suicide. You stop that and get yourself to a doctor now. Do not let this biatch win! 

2. Find your anger, and dump your sorrow, & dump your worthless partner while you are at it.

3. Stop trying to be loved. That will come on its own when you start doing things for yourself. Its Okay to not be nice! In fact, in this instance its okay to be an assahola!

4. And here is another idea: women are attracted to strength, courage, and decisive actions (and in a lot of cases, MONEY, POWER, & FAME. WHO KNEW!?). Anyway, if you are not a rock star or political candidate, stick with the strength and courage.

5. Feeling unloved and down on yourself? There are women who will love you but not if you come across clingy, weepy, and dependent. You have to develop an attitude toward yourself that is not dependent on what you see as being a "nice guy". 

6. And If you want a laugh, look up "gold digger pranks" on youtube.com>


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## Woundedheart (Apr 2, 2014)

Finally I'm feeling not happy, but at least not where I was. I am trying to get on anti depression meds but it's taking too long. 

I starting to concentrate on things I need to go forward. House is being listed and if things go well my finances might just equal 0 at the end instead of what I was looking at. 

I'm beginning to feel my anger. So I still have a lot more to do on me.


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## jlg07 (Feb 24, 2017)

Great Wounded, use the anger to motivate you to get things done that you need. Follow your plan and don't let anything distract you from what you want to do here. Glad you are getting some help, and try to exercise, eat/sleep to help you physically handle the stress.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Exercise and getting outdoors is the single best thing you can do for depression outside of meds.


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## Woundedheart (Apr 2, 2014)

Hello all, I am doing better. Or as good as could be in my situation. Divorce is still the only destination this is going, I have met with a lawyer and our house is listed. So all said I have a few things I need help interpenetrating. 

She says that my time and effort in our marriage was not waste. Hmmm?

She says that I am ethically wrong for taking the wedding rings? (only time she has cried in front of me was when I confronted her/when she told me this)

She says I was not present sometimes.. Probably because of our different work schedule and/or my ADD. She never mentioned it until I found out about the other guy. 

She says I need to stop beating her up mentally over this (all i've said accumulate into maybe a few hours, and I have not even raised my voice. I just am looking for some sort of reason why I in this predicament.... again. 

I just want t o figure out what I did wrong in this relationship. I tried to follow all the books advise about communication and such. I want a refund for those books

Is it me? I feel like the Charlie Brown of Marriages


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

You didn't do anything wrong. At least nothing that justifies cheating. Stop taking blame from a cheater.


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## skerzoid (Feb 7, 2017)

Woundedheart said:


> Hello all, I am doing better. Or as good as could be in my situation. Divorce is still the only destination this is going, I have met with a lawyer and our house is listed. So all said I have a few things I need help interpenetrating.
> 
> She says that my time and effort in our marriage was not waste. Hmmm?
> 
> ...


You are doing fine.

1. *Stay the course.*

2. *File for divorce.* It will take a while. You can watch her actions, (not her words). If she shows true remorse, then you can consider R.

3. *STD test?* Sets a tone.

4. *Timeline *checked against Polygraph results.

5. *Full Transparency* of all electronics.

6. * No Contact letter *perused by you and sent immediately.

7. *180 Technique*, google it.

8. *Keep working on your goals*.

9. Remember, *Strength, Courage, and Decisive Actions.* *Even if you don't feel like an Alpha yet, fake it till you make it!*


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## Woundedheart (Apr 2, 2014)

I hear you, I'm just trying to approach this academically. I want to use this to grow from. 

Though on the flip side, when I was able to embrace my own short coming with my 1st marriage I was able to put a lot of the pain away. Not that I deserved either affair, just trying to get myself out of the "victim" frame of mind.

Oh and at this point even if she wanted to R, There is no way I would want to touch her. It is 100% over in my mind. 

Thanks


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## BluesPower (Mar 27, 2018)

Woundedheart said:


> Hello all, I am doing better. Or as good as could be in my situation. Divorce is still the only destination this is going, I have met with a lawyer and our house is listed. So all said I have a few things I need help interpenetrating.
> 
> She says that my time and effort in our marriage was not waste. Hmmm?
> 
> ...





Woundedheart said:


> I hear you, I'm just trying to approach this academically. I want to use this to grow from.
> 
> Though on the flip side, when I was able to embrace my own short coming with my 1st marriage I was able to put a lot of the pain away. Not that I deserved either affair, just trying to get myself out of the "victim" frame of mind.
> 
> ...


You have several problems: 

1) You are a knight in shining armor (kisa), you want to save them. 

2) You are too nice of a guy, you don't value yourself. You don't understand your worth. 

3) Most marriages will not withstand different shifts they just don't. They require time and investment in each other. Tending the garden so to speak. I don't know what books you read, could you list them?Maybe you did not understand the concepts the right way.

4) Your picker is broken. You need to date around and not get too involved with one until you have sampled the field. Then when you find one that THINK that you want to be with, you date her for a while, don't get her pregnant, and don't get married. You let her PROVE that she is worthy of a guy like you.


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## BluesPower (Mar 27, 2018)

By the way...

Everything, absolutely everything that she told you was horse crap. She is blame shifting to make herself feel better for being a POS cheater. 

You need to tell her that. She is completely unable to take responsibility for what she did. Do try not to pick someone like her again...


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## Woundedheart (Apr 2, 2014)

Well I think I will start this time around in just focusing on some personal goals and really work on the self esteem. Any one have any suggested resources?


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

Woundedheart said:


> Hello all, I am doing better. Or as good as could be in my situation. Divorce is still the only destination this is going, I have met with a lawyer and our house is listed. So all said I have a few things I need help interpenetrating.
> 
> She says that my time and effort in our marriage was not waste. Hmmm?
> 
> ...


Tell her to bite your shiny metal ass. 

You didn't do anything wrong, and she is out of line trying to pin the blame for HER betrayal on you. Don't allow her to do this, the very least she can do is own her ****.


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## anchorwatch (Mar 5, 2012)

Woundedheart said:


> Well I think I will start this time around in just focusing on some personal goals and really work on the self esteem. Any one have any suggested resources?



No More Mr. Nice Guy

Boundaries: When to Say Yes, How to Say No to Take Control of Your Life

"I'm a Nice Guy, the nicest guy you'd ever want to meet. Why doesn't she want me?"

Get some male friends!


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## red oak (Oct 26, 2018)

Woundedheart said:


> I just want t o figure out what I did wrong in this relationship. I tried to follow all the books advise about communication and such. I want a refund


You may well have done nothing wrong.
What I have learned in life: the culture we live in damages everyone to a degree.

Most relationship books are trash designed to set failure in motion from the start. 

Sad state of society is women often chase those they can't have, or those with money. Sad state of society is the one individual a man should be able to show his vulnerabilities to, (his wife) is the one person who will often resent him for it, and use it to her advantage. That's the way they are taught.
It sucks. It's the way it is. 

Foid for thought. In most cases where a man chases after another's wife, he is looking for an ego trip PERIOD! Those relationships don't often last, because once the newness of the trophy has worn off after divorce from current spouse, she will become as less than...

A wise woman who had been divorced 3 times once told me, "people get divorced thinking a new relationship will be better, but you only exchange one set of problems for another because you take your problems with you or draw them to you."

What I'm saying: fix yourself so you don't carry anything over.

Your STBX wont be doing this so her problems will be carried over.


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## sunsetmist (Jul 12, 2018)

As @BluesPower has said do NOT believe her--actually do not talk to her any more than necessary. She is not your friend, but rather your STBX. She wants to justify her cheating--do not allow this. Your wanting to improve yourself is great--just do not take advice from her. Glad you are feeling stronger.

You are doing her a favor by divorcing. She has bled you dry and now is starting on her next victim. IMO: she loves only herself and you could have done nothing to make this better.


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## personofinterest (Apr 6, 2018)

"Sad state of society is women often chase those they can't have, or those with money. Sad state of society is the one individual a man should be able to show his vulnerabilities to, (his wife) is the one person who will often resent him for it, and use it to her advantage. That's the way they are taught.
It sucks. It's the way it is. "

I wasn't taught this way, and neither was any woman I know. Maybe you should lay off your heavy dose of the red pill.


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## bigfoot (Jan 22, 2014)

Let's look at this rationally. Don't stop after my next sentence.

1. You ARE be a bad partner. Thing is, we are ALL bad partners. Of course, we and you are also FANTASTIC partners. That's life. Heck, my kids are great and sometimes I can't stand them. I'm an awesome dad and sometimes I know I suck. THAT is freaking life. My point is that we run the gamut. In the end, we are just doing our best in light of nature and nurture. Good days, minutes, years whatever. 

If you are not physically, emotionally, or mentally abusive as OBJECTIVELY understood, then you are fine.

2. Relationship books suck. They do. How to be awesome, how to je the one they want, etc. They are crap. Basically, don't be yourself but be the person I am telling you to be and then it is all rainbows and unicorns. Bull****. Be yourself. I know an absolutely stunning woman. Sexy as hell. Pursued by men and women, and by rich and famous as well as down and out. We get along great. Thing is, even if I had the chance to date, sleep with or marry her, I WOULD PASS. She is a dear friend. Still, with all of the baggage she brings, there is no way on this planet I would get with her. My point is that I know the real her. Not the outside. Not when she throws on the charm. 

Apply that to those books. Throw in the charm and she's yours. Okay, but take off the mask and it's you. If a book tells you how to be authentic, caring and honest, I support it. Then a woman who is looking for that PLUS your faults is the one for you, assuming you can put up with her faults.

3. Where and why are you picking these women? How are you in a relationship? Do you listen or just hear? Are you looking to be completed or are you complete and looking? Sometimes we get into relationships with the wrong people or for the wrong reasons or with the wrong approach. Evaluate that.

In the end, she did a really screwed up thing. So, consider the source when she criticizes you. Don't let your confidence be shaken by someone who betrayed it.

Bottom line, you are like every other decent guy out there. Good days, bad days, but in the end, a decent guy. There are decent women out there that no book is gonna help you get or stay with. Burn the ones you have because they tried to turn you into someone that you are not.


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## Lostinthought61 (Nov 5, 2013)

She owns 100 percent of the shame 100% of the affair...and that alone is mental cruelty that she bestowed on you...she is full of it


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## red oak (Oct 26, 2018)

personofinterest said:


> "Sad state of society is women often chase those they can't have, or those with money. Sad state of society is the one individual a man should be able to show his vulnerabilities to, (his wife) is the one person who will often resent him for it, and use it to her advantage. That's the way they are taught.
> It sucks. It's the way it is. "
> 
> I wasn't taught this way, and neither was any woman I know. Maybe you should lay off your heavy dose of the red pill.


Simply stated for benefit of OP.

Depending on the source 69-80% of all divorces are filed by women. Think it is called the WAW syndrome here. There's a psychology behind it.

Red pill? LOL. Please dont insult me.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

You realize, right, that Walkaway Wife Syndrome is the result of long-term, consistent apathy and indifference on the part of the husband, right? THAT is the psychology: falling out of love with a man who expects a woman to be his lover, maid, cook, friend, and mother to his kids but won't invest in an equal amount of effort.


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## Rubix Cubed (Feb 21, 2016)

Woundedheart said:


> Is it me? I feel like the Charlie Brown of Marriages


This is all of her blameshifting and gaslighting that's making you feel that way. It's bull****. She has to re-write the marriage with you as the bad guy because if she doesn't she will have to accept the fact that she is a lecherous using parasite, and do you honestly think she will be able to do that? No way so you'll keep being made out to be the bad guy because of your KISA tendencies.



turnera said:


> You realize, right, that Walkaway Wife Syndrome is the result of long-term, consistent apathy and indifference on the part of the husband, right? THAT is the psychology: falling out of love with a man who expects a woman to be his lover, maid, cook, friend, and mother to his kids but won't invest in an equal amount of effort.


 Longterm apathy wouldn't be possible as they were married "a little over a year", still in the honeymoon stage. He invested plenty and stated in his OP if anything he was too emotional. She had a plan and executed it, she's no walk away wife. She's a slither away leech.


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## [email protected] (Dec 23, 2017)

WoundedHeart, you didn't do a damn thing wrong! "She says...she says...she says", who gives a crap what she says. She'll say anything and everything to shift blame to you. It's what you say that counts!!


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## Luminous (Jan 14, 2018)

personofinterest said:


> "
> 
> I wasn't taught this way, and neither was any woman I know. Maybe you should lay off your heavy dose of the red pill.


It happens POI. I have witnessed it, had a small amount of personal experience in it also.

It takes an emotionally mature woman to look past what is essentially, a primal response. 

Women will 'say' they want a man who can be open and vulnerable, but when it happens they lose sexual attraction because he is not viewed as one who can handle anything, who is strong anymore.

A woman who has her **** together can see this for what it is, will realise that he is also human. It is good to know that there are still women out there that have the approach you have.


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## personofinterest (Apr 6, 2018)

red oak said:


> personofinterest said:
> 
> 
> > "Sad state of society is women often chase those they can't have, or those with money. Sad state of society is the one individual a man should be able to show his vulnerabilities to, (his wife) is the one person who will often resent him for it, and use it to her advantage. That's the way they are taught.
> ...


That stat makes me laugh. Because, of course, NONE of these women could POSSIBLY have an actually reason for filing.

Dont insult an entire gender just because you're bitter


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Rubix Cubed said:


> Longterm apathy wouldn't be possible as they were married "a little over a year", still in the honeymoon stage. He invested plenty and stated in his OP if anything he was too emotional. She had a plan and executed it, she's no walk away wife. She's a slither away leech.


I wasn't talking about her. Red oak was talking about WAWs in general.


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## Rubix Cubed (Feb 21, 2016)

turnera said:


> I wasn't talking about her. Red oak was talking about WAWs in general.


 I obviously misunderstood.


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## Gabriel (May 10, 2011)

Woundedheart said:


> I hear you, I'm just trying to approach this academically. I want to use this to grow from.
> 
> Though on the flip side, when I was able to embrace my own short coming with my 1st marriage I was able to put a lot of the pain away. Not that I deserved either affair, just trying to get myself out of the "victim" frame of mind.
> 
> ...


Good - remember this. There is a decent chance this guy dumps her between now and your divorce being final. When/if that happens, she'll have no lily pad and she'll come running back to you, try to seduce you into bed, etc.. DONT FALL FOR IT. DONT EVER BE AN OPTION FOR HER AGAIN.


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## Woundedheart (Apr 2, 2014)

My 1st wife tried to start a dialog, but i abruptly put a stop to that. I will not, would not go there again. My STBX has broken the marriage beyond repair at this point. 

It just seems so damn surreal, less month ago she was saying how much she loved be and how great I was


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## anchorwatch (Mar 5, 2012)

You have a tendency to pick low hanging fruit. 

Why?


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Great book for you to read before you ever date again: Getting The Love You Want. Explains why you keep picking the wrong people.


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## No Longer Lonely Husband (Nov 3, 2015)

Woundedheart said:


> Well I think I will start this time around in just focusing on some personal goals and really work on the self esteem. Any one have any suggested resources?


Sir, you have taken a hit, a hard one at that. No one can make you feel inferior unless you all them. Sounds like you are looking for some” pull yourself up”books. Look up Jim Rohn, Brian Tracy. I would encourage you to read a book by Clebe McClary, a Marine that was severely wounded in Vietnam, and has overcome. You can too.

Now read Grow a Pair by Larry Winget, and No More Mr Nice Guy.

You can do it. “improvise, adapt, overcome.”


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## No Longer Lonely Husband (Nov 3, 2015)

Woundedheart said:


> I am in such a dark place right now. This is worse for me than the last time.


From my reading between the lines,I would encourage you to get with a mental health professional NOW. ADD and depression in many instances go hand in hand. Trust me on that, been there done that. I am not ashamed to say when I hit my low point I prayed for death. Long story I don’t care to rehash. I was diagnosed with PTSD, and ADD. Thankfully, my son encouraged me to seek help. Now, three years later my life could not be better. Point being, right now you see no way out. The truth is there is a way out. Where you are now is temporary and understandable given the fact you have been betrayed. 

You will not leave this dark place instantaneously, it will require hard work on your part to address your issues and be honest with yourself. Others, including myself, have climbed out of the dark abyss known as betrayal, and you will also, if you follow the advice of seasoned folks on here like @drifting on and @turnera and others too numerous to mention who are far more wise than I can ever aspire to be.

Secondly, get yourself into a gym and exercise. It takes the edge off. Eat healthy, and do not imbibe to excess as it only amplifies the dark feelings. You can come out stronger on the other side and I bet you will.

Read my tag line by Sir Winston..” If you’re going through hell keep on going”.


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## VladDracul (Jun 17, 2016)

Woundedheart said:


> Well I think I will start this time around in just focusing on some personal goals and really work on the self esteem. Any one have any suggested resources?


I do my man. PM me about an old boy I know that's an excellent resource.


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## VladDracul (Jun 17, 2016)

anchorwatch said:


> "I'm a Nice Guy, the nicest guy you'd ever want to meet. Why doesn't she want me?"[/URL]


Yep. Two common phrases women say to nice guys are, "You're not my type" and, "Lets just be friends".


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## Woundedheart (Apr 2, 2014)

Well I overheard at least one of her friends trying to talk he out of the affair (after I already knew). 

Makes me feel a little better that someone else in our world sees how messed up this situation is.


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