# Expecting to much?



## Stevespatrol (May 19, 2018)

Long time reader first time post.
Been married for 11 years and have 5&3 year old boys.
I have known my wife for 19 years.
I’m 37 and she is 36.
I have a high sex drive and she only does when she is ovulating.
We only have sex when she is in the mood and the sex only gets wild when she wants it to be and if she only feels like a quickie that’s all that happens.
I used to ask for it a lot and for the last 2 years she yells and screams at me saying is that all you want from me.
So fast forward to now and I don’t ask at all for it and have now just accepted that we will only have sex when she wants it.
She now gets angry and frustrated when I do t ask for it or initiate and she thinks I don’t love her anymore.
I’m just sick and tired of being accused of wanting it all the time.
We can go 2 1/2 weeks without it and she won’t even bat a eye lid but when she is in the mood I’d better be or else.
What should I do?


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## Cynthia (Jan 31, 2014)

If she is yelling and screaming at you about anything at all, that is a problem. Yelling and screaming at your spouse makes for an adversarial relationship, which is the opposite of what marriage is about. First you have to deal with the adversarial aspect of your relationship. She is acting like your enemy. I hope you don't yell and/or scream at her about anything.


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## Stevespatrol (May 19, 2018)

No I don’t yell at her at all.
I used to ask for it every second day and I think one night she just had enough and yelled and said is that all you think about etc etc but after being rejected so often I have just given up asking. But as soon as she is in the mood and it’s all go I will treat her to fore play and oral until she is begging for it.
Is just get frustrating that the show only happens when she wants it.


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## Tatsuhiko (Jun 21, 2016)

Did you sit her down and tell her that you DO still want it all the time, but that her rejection keeps you from asking for it?


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## Cynthia (Jan 31, 2014)

What I am saying is that it doesn't matter if you are being reasonable or unreasonable. It is a problem that your wife thinks it's okay to yell at you when you are asking her for something. There is no reason for her to yell. That is rude and uncalled for. Does she yell at you other times too?

People should be able to work through issues together. She doesn't seem to be willing to work through this with you, but is manipulating you to shut up when you ask for something she doesn't want. That's uncalled for. I think you need to set some boundaries with your wife about how she treats you and the two of you need to work through your sexual incompatibility. This is much easier said than done apparently. Looking around these forums you will notice a lot of people complaining that their spouse isn't nearly as interested in sex as they are and the lower drive spouse thinks something is wrong with the higher drive spouse. The only way I can see of working through it is to set some boundaries. I recommend you go to marriage counseling.



Stevespatrol said:


> No I don’t yell at her at all.
> I used to ask for it every second day and I think one night she just had enough and yelled and said is that all you think about etc etc but after being rejected so often I have just given up asking. But as soon as she is in the mood and it’s all go I will treat her to fore play and oral until she is begging for it.
> Is just get frustrating that the show only happens when she wants it.


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## Stevespatrol (May 19, 2018)

I do think there are other issues that do influence her mood as we have 2 young boys. I thought things were improving but I think counseling is in order.


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## Spicy (Jun 18, 2016)

Disclaimer: I rarely ever understand people not wanting to have sex.

Maybe, if your kids are needy and clingy she feels touched out because they are so young. Just a little thought. Is it something you have nocticed since kids, or was she always this way?


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## Stevespatrol (May 19, 2018)

Been like it way before kids come along


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## Cynthia (Jan 31, 2014)

Stevespatrol said:


> I do think there are other issues that do influence her mood as we have 2 young boys. I thought things were improving but I think counseling is in order.


We all have things that influence our mood, but rather than letting our emotions control us, adults control their emotions. People who cannot control their emotions who then act in a hostile manner towards others are not healthy people. She is teaching your children these habits as well. She is responsible for her emotions and how she handles herself. Yelling and screaming shows a lack of self-control. You don't have to put up with her mistreating you.

You can't make her do anything, but you can set boundaries and you can tell her to stop it when she is behaving in a hostile manner towards you. You can also tell her that there is nothing wrong with you wanting sex and you want her to stop trying to make it look like something is wrong with you when you want sex.


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## DTO (Dec 18, 2011)

Stevespatrol said:


> Long time reader first time post.
> Been married for 11 years and have 5&3 year old boys.
> I have known my wife for 19 years.
> I’m 37 and she is 36.
> ...


My initial thoughts are that there is a lot of space between asking so much she yells at you, and not asking at all. Are you sure you're just asking for it without pestering her about it?

That being said, if she's consistently refusing, you're under no obligation to keep asking and then being rejected. It sounds like she wants the validation of being told she's sexy and desirable without actually providing sex / meeting your need.

My recommendation is to handle it one of two ways. First, you just stop asking and go about your own business; do something for yourself or with the kids but without her. Second, you do ask her and give her the opportunity to provide. If she refuses, then go do something without her. Your attitude should be that it's as much her loss as yours if she chooses to not meet your need; your actions (that you got your own stuff to do) should communicate that attitude.


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

Guess what happens when she goes through menopause and possibly NEVER wants it. 

Answer: a sexless marriage because she doesn’t care enough about you to want to have sex with you just to be close to you or to help satisfy your needs. She needs to read up on how a man feels about getting sex. It isn’t all about the sex, it’s about feeling wanted and close and desired and LOVED. For her to say all you want is sex is disgusting. You married her and had kids with her. You invested your future with her.
I think your wife is pretty selfish.

I actually know how it feels to be pressured for sex. It’s a huge turnoff. And it kills desire.
However, once or twice a month, and only when SHE wants it—— that’s not you, it’s her.

It’s unlijely you can fix this. People do what they want to do, and don’t do what they don’t want to do.

There is likely no way for you to make her want to. She either does or she doesn’t.


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## Cynthia (Jan 31, 2014)

I agree with Evinrude58. Your wife isn't interested in what you need or want. She is so annoyed by you voicing your desires that she yells at you. This is not how marriage is supposed to work.

In marriage, the two of you should absolutely have each other's backs. If there is a problem, you are supposed to work together to resolve it. In a case like this, you and your wife should be working together to solve this, so that you are both getting your needs met. But that is not what's going on. Your wife obviously does not care what your needs are. She is self-focused to the point that she is willing to hurt you to get your to leave her alone. That is not a healthy marriage at all.

Things will not get better unless you do something to resolve this. Setting boundaries with your wife and letting her know that this is in no way, shape, or form okay for her to treat you this way is a start. Explaining to her that you two are going to work together to resolve her bad attitude and her lack of desire to meet your needs and that you expect her full participation is a start.

If she agrees and begins to work on resolving these issues, you are on the right track. If she blame shifts or in other ways refuses to participate in having a healthy marriage, you will have to take other measures to be healthy.



Evinrude58 said:


> Guess what happens when she goes through menopause and possibly NEVER wants it.
> 
> Answer: a sexless marriage because she doesn’t care enough about you to want to have sex with you just to be close to you or to help satisfy your needs. She needs to read up on how a man feels about getting sex. It isn’t all about the sex, it’s about feeling wanted and close and desired and LOVED. For her to say all you want is sex is disgusting. You married her and had kids with her. You invested your future with her.
> I think your wife is pretty selfish.
> ...


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## Cynthia (Jan 31, 2014)

There is no excuse for her mistreatment of him. If she has a problem, she needs to work through it, not yell at her husband. If he's gotten to the point of "pestering" because his wife refuses to have sex with him, your approach is not going to resolve the problem at all.

You are telling him how to respond to rejection by doing something else. How does this solve anything?



DTO said:


> My initial thoughts are that there is a lot of space between asking so much she yells at you, and not asking at all. Are you sure you're just asking for it without pestering her about it?
> 
> That being said, if she's consistently refusing, you're under no obligation to keep asking and then being rejected. It sounds like she wants the validation of being told she's sexy and desirable without actually providing sex / meeting your need.
> 
> My recommendation is to handle it one of two ways. First, you just stop asking and go about your own business; do something for yourself or with the kids but without her. Second, you do ask her and give her the opportunity to provide. If she refuses, then go do something without her. Your attitude should be that it's as much her loss as yours if she chooses to not meet your need; your actions (that you got your own stuff to do) should communicate that attitude.


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## TheBohannons (Apr 6, 2018)

I don't understand the "asking for sex" thing. Do people literally "ask" for sex in a marriage or LTR? What do you actually say? 

Just curious. I have always been in a relationship where if one person reached, it was on. If there was not full on sex, one would relieve the other then get some sleep.


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## Where there's a will (Feb 10, 2014)

She is no longer in love with you but she will say she loves you. In reality she may not love you beyond that which lies in her comfort zone. You have to make these points to her and establish the truth that " with my body I honour you" actually means that promises to love are being broken and that you have a plan to get counselling in order to restore the marriage. Her response may be negative but better to move on now than in another ten years. The ball is very firmly in her court so long as you call out rhe bad behaviour.


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## Hopeful Cynic (Apr 27, 2014)

Evinrude58 said:


> Guess what happens when she goes through menopause and possibly NEVER wants it.
> 
> Answer: a sexless marriage because she doesn’t care enough about you to want to have sex with you just to be close to you or to help satisfy your needs. She needs to read up on how a man feels about getting sex. It isn’t all about the sex, it’s about feeling wanted and close and desired and LOVED. For her to say all you want is sex is disgusting. You married her and had kids with her. You invested your future with her.
> I think your wife is pretty selfish.
> ...


Sex is something wonderful that happens between two partners, for BOTH their enjoyment, when BOTH want it. Why are you criticizing this wife instead of the poster? He can't change his wife; he can only act on advice we offer to change himself and his approach. He needs to read up on how a woman feels about getting sex. It isn't all about the sex, it's about feeling wanted and close and desired and LOVED. The main difference (I'm generalizing but run with it) is that for the man, those things arise out of sex, and for the woman, they are needed before sex.

I'd guess, by the fact that he describes his initiation as 'asking' for sex that he's making her feel like he doesn't love her, he just wants sex from her. Whatever he's doing that makes her feel like all he wants is sex is what she perceives as disgusting. She thinks he is pretty selfish, demanding sex when she doesn't feel like it.

Instead of 'asking' for sex, he could be 'offering' sex. Treat it like a gift, for her pleasure, instead of a demand for your pleasure, which is her current understanding of his initiations. Making it a generous act instead of a demanding act would go a long way to making her feel loved.

Also, if she's only got a noticeable libido when she's ovulating, there's a big hormonal influence going on. Maybe she's got responsive desire the rest of the month. Which can be dealt with, by figuring out what makes her respond. Evidently it's not just by 'asking.'

The yelling and screaming is a whole 'nother issue. No adult should treat anybody that way.


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## Stevespatrol (May 19, 2018)

Thanks for the response ladies and gents Muchly appreciate the feed back.
Back in January she asked if I could help more around our new home on my days off and she will try and put in more effort in the bedroom.
I have Fridays and Saturdays off and work 60/65hrs a week. I take our 2 boys to swimming lessons on the Friday morning then go back home after swimming and vacuum and mop the house and clean the bathrooms. The on the Saturday I’m outside landscaping the entire day.
I have explained to her that sex to me is not about penis in Vagina but how it connects us emotionally and physically. I always help her cum first then I finish.


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## DTO (Dec 18, 2011)

CynthiaDe said:


> There is no excuse for her mistreatment of him. If she has a problem, she needs to work through it, not yell at her husband. If he's gotten to the point of "pestering" because his wife refuses to have sex with him, your approach is not going to resolve the problem at all.
> 
> You are telling him how to respond to rejection by doing something else. How does this solve anything?


I understand that there is no excuse for her mistreating him. My advice was to get him to not feed the cycle, but rather detach and do his own thing.

What it accomplishes is denying her what she wants from the relationship. If she's yelling at him for simply asking for normal marital stuff, then nothing he says about it will convince her to start meeting his needs. Trust me, I know this from experience.

He needs to show her that not only does he not need sex from her, but he can thrive without it. Once he takes away the validation she seeks and starts living a happy life apart from him, she can then either decide (on her own) to step up her game and not yell at him + do a better job as his wife. Or she can do more for herself. Either way, it's a win for him.

At the end of the day, I feel that if she doesn't step it up soon he is better off divorcing her and finding someone who's wants and needs are more compatible with his own. Kids at 5 and 3 aren't so young that they can't watch TV for 30 minutes while mom and dad reconnect. But this advice (to divorce if it doesn't get better) seems a little drastic for the tone of this thread.


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## Stevespatrol (May 19, 2018)

Divorce won’t be on the cards. I can’t do that to my boys.


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## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

Stevespatrol said:


> We only have sex when she is in the mood and the sex only gets wild when she wants it to be and if she only feels like a quickie that’s all that happens.


So your wife is more dominant than you.



Stevespatrol said:


> I used to ask for it a lot and for the last 2 years she yells and screams at me saying is that all you want from me.


Ideally you ought to be flirting a little bit daily, things like some touch or the way you look at her, telling her what you will do to her, or a direction to do something etc). All done in such a manner that you can escalate that into some sex, whenever there is opportunity and the mood strikes you.

In my experience I have found with many women that when they say "you only want me for sex", telling them "yes that's what I want you for" without explanation or caveat has considerable sexual mileage.

Though my wife has never yelled and screamed at me, she has sometimes said things I don't like. Yet I kid you not on some of those occasions, I have told her "if you keep going, I will have to put my **** in your mouth" and then proceeded to do exactly that when she has kept going.



Stevespatrol said:


> So fast forward to now and I don’t ask at all for it and have now just accepted that we will only have sex when she wants it.


If only you realised that being a passive aggressive sulk, does not make a man sexually attractive to women.

No wonder she thinks you don't love her, if only you owned your sexual desire for her, were more sexually overt and spent quality time with her (you know things like being able to talk to her in person).



Stevespatrol said:


> She now gets angry and frustrated when I do t ask for it or initiate and *she thinks I don’t love her anymore*.


Small kids doesn't help, not spending much quality time together at all doesn't help at all, her probably feeling a little isolated while you are at work doesn't help either. Combined with you acquiescing and not initiation because you fear rejection doesn't help significantly.



Stevespatrol said:


> I’m just sick and tired of being accused of wanting it all the time.


Do you want it all the time or do you not want it all the time? Do you have a high sexual drive or do you not?

Seriously if you want to have sex with your wife frequently, you would do well to own that. Without feeling a compulsion to tell fibs, by saying you don't want her for that when your actions at one point showed you did.

You either want to have sex with her frequently or you don't. Either way being honest with yourself and being honest with her, is likely to get you more mileage than telling her what you think you ought to say.

If you are sick and tired, stop denying the reality of what you want.



Stevespatrol said:


> We can go 2 1/2 weeks without it and she won’t even bat a eye lid but when she is in the mood I’d better be or else.


Good for her, if only you were more assertive you might be in a better position yourself.



Stevespatrol said:


> What should I do?


Apply some backbone and stop trying to be nice at the expense of your own desires.


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## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

Stevespatrol said:


> Been like it way before kids come along


Do you ever get the feeling, you knew this was the best you were ever going to get so you settled for it? Seriously none of this should be a surprise to you, yet you pressed on anyway!!!


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## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

Stevespatrol said:


> Thanks for the response ladies and gents Muchly appreciate the feed back.
> Back in January she asked if I could help more around our new home on my days off and she will try and put in more effort in the bedroom.
> I have Fridays and Saturdays off and work 60/65hrs a week. I take our 2 boys to swimming lessons on the Friday morning then go back home after swimming and vacuum and mop the house and clean the bathrooms. The on the Saturday I’m outside landscaping the entire day.
> I have explained to her that sex to me is not about penis in Vagina but how it connects us emotionally and physically. I always help her cum first then I finish.


So presuming Sunday-Thursday you work circa 13 hours a day and sleep about 8 hours a day. Then factor in meals, hygiene and travel to and from work into your timing as well. You don't spend much time with your wife on an in-person conversational level at all. Which does you both no favours in you being attractive to your wife.

On top of that if you think that letting your wife have a break while doing the lions share of chores. Through your two days off while taking your kids to outside activities is the path to much sex, you are on a fools errand.

Doing chores doesn't generate sexual desire, being sexual does.

As to this emotional schtick about connecting with sex, you would probably get far more mileage by connecting with her through quality conversational time. While telling her you want to have sex with her, because you lust after her as a sex object and want to have her in all sorts of animalistic ways.


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## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

Stevespatrol said:


> No I don’t yell at her at all.
> I used to ask for it every second day and I think one night she just had enough and yelled and said is that all you think about etc etc but after being rejected so often I have just given up asking. But as soon as she is in the mood and it’s all go I will treat her to fore play and oral until she is begging for it.
> Is just get frustrating that the show only happens when she wants it.


Well if it wasn't for her initiating, it wouldn't happen at all.

If you don't like your limited sexual frequency, then stop being so passive. And step up and do some of the sexual lifting in your relationship by initiating more frequently.

So feel free to tell her to take her panties off and the like after some flirting along the way previously.

As to being rejected so often, stop being a sensitive petal, so what if she says no. What's so hard about saying, "well that sucks for you that you won't be getting any".

Plus asking, really asking?

What does that look like? what do you say? Is their any sexual tension present when you ask? Or is it just a lame out of nowhere "can we have sex" or the like?

As to her yelling, why don't you just tell her to "shut the **** up", or "piss off until you can control yourself".


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## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

Very difficult to fix an issue that is rooted in many years of precedent. Especially when many of those years were prior to having children. 






Stevespatrol said:


> Long time reader first time post.
> Been married for 11 years and have 5&3 year old boys.
> I have known my wife for 19 years.
> I’m 37 and she is 36.
> ...


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## Stevespatrol (May 19, 2018)

Wow some of your are to the point and I value your comments and I will try some of those suggested ideas a go.
I guess with some of the responses that some have been hurt the same way?


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## Married but Happy (Aug 13, 2013)

Stevespatrol;19520041I guess with some of the responses that some have been hurt the same way?[/QUOTE said:


> Yes, indeed - long sexless first marriage for me. Try the suggestions given, try counseling, and if all fails, try divorce. I did all that and more, and only divorce worked (I found someone better matched in many ways). I hope you don't need that final solution.


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## BluesPower (Mar 27, 2018)

TheBohannons said:


> I don't understand the "asking for sex" thing. Do people literally "ask" for sex in a marriage or LTR? What do you actually say?
> 
> Just curious. I have always been in a relationship where if one person reached, it was on. If there was not full on sex, one would relieve the other then get some sleep.


This is such a good question. I have never ever been in a relationship where I had to ask for sex. 

I really don't even understand the concept. I have been really tired once with GF and I asked her if we could take that ONE night off, and we could make love in the morning. If she had said no, I would have taken care of business, but she was OK as long as we were together in the morning. 

With all of these relationships where sex is a problem, why are people even in those relationships???

I am not the brightest light bulb in the box, but even I understand that is sex is not happening, there are problems in the relationship... Further, for me, unless there is some injury or sickness, if there is no sex, there is no relationship...


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## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

BluesPower said:


> TheBohannons said:
> 
> 
> > I don't understand the "asking for sex" thing. Do people literally "ask" for sex in a marriage or LTR? What do you actually say?
> ...


BluesPower I'm not sure how old you are but... if say you were in your mid to late 50s and your partner wanted sex around 6 days a week but physically that was too much for you, how would you handle that?


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## Married but Happy (Aug 13, 2013)

Livvie said:


> ... if say you were in your mid to late 50s and your partner wanted sex around 6 days a week but physically that was too much for you, how would you handle that?


Speaking for myself, I'd see a hormone specialist, have my testosterone checked, and try to get a prescription for testosterone if even slightly below "average." I'd also get Viagra or Cialis if that is needed to keep up that many days a week. And of course, staying in good shape and eating well to have stamina would be important. Actually, being in this age group, this is what I've done.

My wife is a bit younger, but also in this age group, and is hormonally challenged as well. She has also see the same hormone specialist (we often go together), and has tried a variety of things to increase her libido closer to previous levels. It's a continuing challenge for both of us, but sex is too important to us both - and to what we want for our relationship - to let it slide any sooner than is unavoidable. We still manage 6 days a week, and sometimes more when we occasionally still have sex 2 or 3 times in a day.

Everyone is different, of course, and what they desire - and what they can actually handle consistently and happily - can vary greatly person to person, or for an individual over time. When you and your partner are on the same page, whatever the amount of sex, all is well. When you have a significant, unbridgeable mismatch, is when serious relationship problems can arise, particularly if the less interested partner makes no effort to compromise or take care of themselves to improve.


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## Marc878 (Aug 26, 2015)

Get used to living the life of a doormat is about the best you can hope for.

Unless at some point there is so much respect gone she dumps you for a man.


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## BluesPower (Mar 27, 2018)

Livvie said:


> BluesPower I'm not sure how old you are but... if say you were in your mid to late 50s and your partner wanted sex around 6 days a week but physically that was too much for you, how would you handle that?


Well I am 54, and I am a high drive guy. 

And I have certain rules that I live by. One rule is "If your woman want sex you give it to her". 

Now, GF and I have one more year until we can live together full time, she has another year that she wants to teach, before she retires. 

But, when we are together we usually have sex between 2 and 3 times a day. It is more sometimes but usually around that number. 

I am happy with 1 to 2 times a day if it slows down when we are together full time.


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## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

BluesPower said:


> Livvie said:
> 
> 
> > BluesPower I'm not sure how old you are but... if say you were in your mid to late 50s and your partner wanted sex around 6 days a week but physically that was too much for you, how would you handle that?
> ...


That's great! However, if your body were to change and you physically were not up for it more than a few times a week, how would you handle that?


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## Buddy400 (Aug 30, 2014)

Stevespatrol said:


> Long time reader first time post.
> Been married for 11 years and have 5&3 year old boys.
> I have known my wife for 19 years.
> I’m 37 and she is 36.
> ...


The advice given here to men in sexless marriages just gets worse and worse.

But, I'll give it one last go.

Your wife allows sex only when she wants it. She expects you to be ready to satisfy her when she does.

Your wife will not have sex when you want it. She either doesn't have any idea how important it is to you or she simply doesn't prioritize your happiness (almost certainly the latter).

Your wife likes the ego boost she gets from knowing that you desire her but feels no need to actually fulfill your desires.

You have two choices; try to improve your sex life or work on regaining your self esteem.

I'd recommend the following:

Have ONE talk with her. Explain that having sex is the way that you emotionally bond with her; less sex, less emotional connection. When you feel emotionally disconnected, you build resentment for her and this isn't good for the marriage. Lacking sex, you're only sticking around for the kids. Once they grow up, you can't make any guarantees about the marriage.

Sex is entirely one sided. You are expected to make her feel desirable by initiating even though she turns you down the vast majority of the time. You are expected to satisfy her sexual needs when she wants, yet she doesn't see any need to satisfy yours. The one-sided nature of your sex life is causing you to lose desire for her. If this continues, you are likely to begin turning her down when she wants sex unless you specifically want it at the same exact time. This can't continue and will likely end with a completely sexless marriage with both of you resenting the other. You are currently expected to care about her happiness (cleaning Friday & Saturday, etc.) but she doesn't seem very concerned about your happiness. 

If she's willing to work on this, you're willing to try initiating again. But, if she continues to reject your advances most of the time, you are going to stop initiating and likely start refusing her rare initiations. 

If she doesn't have any interest in making things better, then stop initiating and start refusing.

Don't just refuse sex. Refuse to do anything for her that you are doing only for her benefit (when she asks you to do something, you say no and she asks why, say "I'm not in the mood" or "I don't feel like doing that now").

Do your fair share around the house (and if you're working 60-65 hours a week, that shouldn't be much). Find things to do without her that make you happy. Smile and be pleasant. 

Make your plans to exit when the kids are old enough.

You'll get even less sex this way, but at least you'll get to keep your self-esteem and she will lose the power to control your actions (Her: "if you go out with the guys again I'll ......" You: "You'll what? not have sex with me?")

Maybe she'll see that the new reality isn't working out for her (probably not), but at least it'll be working out for you.


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## UpsideDownWorld11 (Feb 14, 2018)

Stevespatrol said:


> Thanks for the response ladies and gents Muchly appreciate the feed back.
> Back in January she asked if I could help more around our new home on my days off and she will try and put in more effort in the bedroom.
> I have Fridays and Saturdays off and work 60/65hrs a week. I take our 2 boys to swimming lessons on the Friday morning then go back home after swimming and vacuum and mop the house and clean the bathrooms. The on the Saturday I’m outside landscaping the entire day.
> I have explained to her that sex to me is not about penis in Vagina but how it connects us emotionally and physically. I always help her cum first then I finish.


LOL, you gleefully accepted duty sex and then she reneged. Cruel!

She is probably resentful that she has to wear the pants in the relationship. Stop catering to her will. Learn the word "no", repeat it over in over in the car ride home and employ it regularly. If she gives you ****, give her **** back. 

Then the next time she comes to you for her needs, forego the oral, throw her on the bed, apply slight pressure to her throat/collerbone area, smack her a&& and f88k her brains out. She doesn't want her girlfriend to f88k her, she wants her husband to. Thank me later.


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## BluesPower (Mar 27, 2018)

Livvie said:


> That's great! However, if your body were to change and you physically were not up for it more than a few times a week, how would you handle that?


I really don't know. I never thought of it. 

I never thought I would live this long, based on some of the stuff I did in my youth, so I sometimes feel that I am on borrowed time. 

Here is the deal, sex is important to me. I don't date women that are LD, never have or stopped shortly after finding out.

So I really don't know. My equipment would have to just stop working for me and even then, I would try to be there for my partner. 

I am good at many aspects of sex, not just PIV...


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## Cynthia (Jan 31, 2014)

Why is your wife a SAHM if she expects you to clean and manage the home? Is your wife overwhelmed?

I think you and your wife need to some serious communication. If she is expecting you to work 60-65 hours per week and help her with the basic household chores, something is not right. Rather than simply telling your wife what you want, which hasn't worked anyway, find out what is going on with her. Why does she feel she needs help in managing the home and why isn't she interested in sex? The two of you should be working together to get both of your needs met as well as the needs of the family.

Relationship shouldn't be transactional, which is what it sounds like is happening in your marriage, except you are not getting your payment from the transaction. If you do something with a payment in mind that you haven't expressed and received an affirmative response to, that is called a covert contract. It's not very effective, as you have seen.

From my experience as a SAHM/SAHW, the reason why I quit my job to stay at home was to make things easier for my husband and I. Once I quit my job, we had a lot more time to spend together and for him to enjoy our family. We ended up with three children who I homeschooled all the way through.

The only time I have denied my husband sex was when we were working through some serious issues that had to be addressed and I was emotionally unwilling to have sex due to these serious issues. Also, my husband doesn't ask for sex and I don't ask my husband for sex. I'm not sure whether you are really asking or if you are telling her what you want and she's saying no.

Asking for sex seems to me that there is a disconnect going on. Sex should be part of a healthy, loving relationship where there is positive communication and physical affection happening outside the bedroom which at the end of the day regularly leads to sex. Not once a week or once a month, but 2+ times per week unless both partners are low drive and both find the relationship satisfying emotionally and physically with less sex.

The problem in your relationship isn't that your wife isn't giving you enough sex. There are some fundamental issues that need to be resolved and at the core is that you are your wife are not on the same page nor are you united in working to make your marriage and family work for all of you.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

No more asking. It's possible to respectfully, tactfully, firmly, just start with her. Never answer W if she starts talking. At most be prepared with a pat short answer similar to "we'll get to that later", or shorter, and keep moving forward. 

This doesn't involve you doing all the home chores so you feel "like you earned it". Or waiting too late at night, or for her to "finish watching a TV show". 

It's normal to want sex every night or as your age and health dictates.....but if you want to get closer to her just start......
If she gets violent and throws you off, that will give you more information on what else may be the or related problem. 

It's not normal to ask for sex, but to just start.....
If you have a sex talk, just have it once, and tell W you're not going to have the talk again.....you get tired of repeating it and you know she's tired of hearing it so be clear once, and act accordingly afterwards. Only you know your specific circumstance.

That said as you've read here, this isn't a unique circumstance, there is much good advice here.

Don't be an asker, be a let's go person. See what happens.


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## DTO (Dec 18, 2011)

Stevespatrol said:


> Divorce won’t be on the cards. I can’t do that to my boys.


Understood, and that's your prerogative. But understand that your willingness to take a stand against her treating you this way is the only real leverage you have. If you aren't willing to divorce over this, then she won't have any incentive to treat you better than she does now.

Also consider that you can't force her to stay married to you. I see two troubling signs: one is (or course) her yelling at you for requesting sex while demands it on her timetable, and two is that she is playing that game where she promises to try harder at sex in exchange for some concession from you, but fails to come through on her end of the deal. She sounds very selfish and high maintenance (on top of other things).

Having your intimate needs go chronically unmet has a way of grinding on you. What's going to happen after more years of working 12 hour days and then busting your tail at home under the current circumstances? Most likely, you'll fall short (by her standards) in some area and then you run the risk of her leaving anyways.

I've been down this road. I didn't bug my ex for anything and she still walked out. Trust me when I say you're far better off taking a stand now rather than trying to stick it out for the next 15 years.


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## Cynthia (Jan 31, 2014)

DTO said:


> Most likely, you'll fall short (by her standards) in some area and then you run the risk of her leaving anyways.
> 
> I've been down this road. I didn't bug my ex for anything and she still walked out. Trust me when I say you're far better off taking a stand now rather than trying to stick it out for the next 15 years.


Yep. If you do nothing and think that you can maintain the status quo, you are likely very wrong. It will probably only get worse as the two of you (and your children with you) will sink further into dysfunction. Now is the time to make a plan and implement it. Either you two are going to work together to make a better marriage or things will only get progressively worse.

You are the only one you can control, so if you want things to change you are going to have do some things to make changes. Your wife will respond one way or another, but she will have choice but to respond. She won't be able to stay the same when things around her aren't the same.


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## UpsideDownWorld11 (Feb 14, 2018)

Take control now or she may walk out on you down the road (in the not so distant future). Then it may be another man or she just isn't happy, either way she's gone. You dont won't divorce? Too bad, cuz it only takes one. I been there and lots other divorcees here have.

Go get a book called the Married Man Sex Life Primer and No More Mr. Nice Guy.


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## DTO (Dec 18, 2011)

Personal said:


> If you don't like your limited sexual frequency, then stop being so passive. And step up and do some of the sexual lifting in your relationship by initiating more frequently.
> 
> As to being rejected so often, stop being a sensitive petal, so what if she says no. What's so hard about saying, "well that sucks for you that you won't be getting any".
> 
> As to her yelling, why don't you just tell her to "shut the **** up", or "piss off until you can control yourself".


To the first and third items I quoted, the issue is that the OP has keeping a semblance of peace and preserving the marriage as the goal, not having a satisfying relationship. So he's likely to suck up whatever treatment she dishes out, at least for the time being.

To the second item, I think that's exactly the wrong approach. It looks like she gets significant validation from knowing he finds her attractive - the actual sex isn't necessary or even wanted so she rejects it. Him going to her and asking for sex is just reinforcing her sense of safety and stability, at least IMO. I think it be good for her to feel a little threatened and unsure about his regard for her. Then she might actually try to meet his need instead of taking him for granted.

Having been through this myself, if I had to choose between a happy wife who ignored my needs and a somewhat less happy one who felt she had to be "on her toes" a bit and tended to my needs even when that wasn't her first preference, I would take the second one - all day, every day. You'd like to think that your spouse would willingly love and please you, but not everyone is built like that. And if you're married to someone who isn't, that's just the dynamic you need to have.


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## DTO (Dec 18, 2011)

I like all of this, and have only one thing to add:

Your wife doesn't get to set your priorities. Her job is to understand what they are and then work with you to get them met, or tell you forthrightly that she isn't into it so that you guys can figure out how to proceed.

Some women will assert that what you want is less important then what they want, that you're childish, selfish, etc.; my ex certainly did. The reason is they want to avoid meeting your need and the consequences of their behavior. If your wife were to flat out tell you "sorry, but I'm selfish with sex. We'll have it when and how I want it, period", you'd tell her to pound sand and do your own thing. But if she can convince you that you are unreasonable, then she can have her cake and eat it too.

Don't fall for it. Your attitude should be that your wants and needs matter just as much as hers.



Buddy400 said:


> The advice given here to men in sexless marriages just gets worse and worse.
> 
> But, I'll give it one last go.
> 
> ...


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

Personal said:


> As to her yelling, why don't you just tell her to "shut the **** up", or "piss off until you can control yourself".


This may be the worst overall advice I have ever read on here no offense. And that is saying something. I am not sure what you are posting on but this is not going to help. I am all for being assertive but better to do it without losing your ****. That just shows you are not really confident anyway.


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

DTO said:


> Understood, and that's your prerogative. But understand that your willingness to take a stand against her treating you this way is the only real leverage you have. If you aren't willing to divorce over this, then she won't have any incentive to treat you better than she does now.
> 
> Also consider that you can't force her to stay married to you. I see two troubling signs: one is (or course) her yelling at you for requesting sex while demands it on her timetable, and two is that she is playing that game where she promises to try harder at sex in exchange for some concession from you, but fails to come through on her end of the deal. She sounds very selfish and high maintenance (on top of other things).
> 
> ...


In other words you can't nice your way into making your wife not be a jerk. She probably feels like you are a pushover and doesn't like it. You should never love someone enough to let them abuse you. Time for some had boundaries. Lots of times in life we get the life we except.

If it were me I would sit her down and ask if she really wants the marriage. Because her lack of effort tells you she doesn't. Tell her it's not worth wasting time if that is the case.


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## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

sokillme said:


> Personal said:
> 
> 
> > As to her yelling, why don't you just tell her to "shut the **** up", or "piss off until you can control yourself".
> ...


Well you are wrong, but you aren't the first so don't feel bad about it.

My recommendation was for him to tell her, at no point did I suggest he lose anything, yell at her, rage in kind or do anything else of that nature.

Telling her ought to be done at a conversational volume, and delivered entirely deadpan without expressing any emotion. The expletive usage and direction from him will likely cause her some pause and throw her pattern, since it will be coming out of left field since the OP is not assertive.

If she then rethinks her behaviour well and good, if she gets more enraged he can calmly ask her if she needs help with her rage.

Yet at no point is it a good idea for him to weather such nonsense and humour such poor behaviour from her. Because to do that, is to maintain the approach that sees him in the mess he is in.


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## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

DTO said:


> To the first and third items I quoted, the issue is that the OP has keeping a semblance of peace and preserving the marriage as the goal, not having a satisfying relationship. So he's likely to suck up whatever treatment she dishes out, at least for the time being.


Sure he is likely to remain passive lest he rock the boat, which is an untenable approach if he is wanting his situation to change. Since he is so passive in order to try to stave off (if ever caught) or prevent confrontation (if never caught), I suppose if he wants more sex he can choose to cheat on his wife instead.



DTO said:


> To the second item, I think that's exactly the wrong approach. It looks like she gets significant validation from knowing he finds her attractive - the actual sex isn't necessary or even wanted so she rejects it. Him going to her and asking for sex is just reinforcing her sense of safety and stability, at least IMO. I think it be good for her to feel a little threatened and unsure about his regard for her. Then she might actually try to meet his need instead of taking him for granted.


At no point have I suggested the OP ask for sex, I don't know about you but initiation for me in all of my ongoing sexual relationships looks like handling them and telling them what I want them to do. It's doing that and being sexual and flirting and owning my sexual desire that has always seen me have an enormous amount of sex. If they don't want to have sex they will say no and then they miss out in that moment. Yet the initiating by being sexual or telling them to do sexual things, gets their mind thinking about sex, it excites them sexually and gets them in the mood for it.

My wife has read plenty of posts here, where passive men find themselves in sexless sexual relationships. Yet with every one that she has read, she said that if she were with them she wouldn't want to have sex with them either.

Some of her friends are likewise with men that they are loathe to have sex with. Because the men they are with are so passive about sex and think that asking for sex is enough to turn them on.

When people say they are in sexless or near sexless sexual relationships and then describe their situation, it is never a surprise to us that their sex lives aren't. In fact from what they described it seems like it was inevitable, given the way they approach such things.



DTO said:


> Having been through this myself, if I had to choose between a happy wife who ignored my needs and a somewhat less happy one who felt she had to be "on her toes" a bit and tended to my needs even when that wasn't her first preference, I would take the second one - all day, every day. You'd like to think that your spouse would willingly love and please you, but not everyone is built like that. And if you're married to someone who isn't, that's just the dynamic you need to have.


Having never experienced a sexless or limited sex sexual relationship (because I don't behave like the people who do), I've never thought any of my sexual partners would want to willingly love and please me, just because they are in a sexual relationship with me. It's that kind of lazy thinking and presumed entitlement, that sees so many people have sexless or near sexless sexual relationships in the longer term.

Love is one thing sex is another.

If one wants to grow love through the long term they need to make the time to share what's behind the surface and not be afraid of change. 

If one wants to grow sexual desire for the long term they need to continually tickle that sexual desire and not be afraid of change.

If one wants both of those things they need to take the time to do both.

Sex is no substitute for love and love is no substitute for sex

Men who buy into this happy wife, happy life nonsense. That think they ought to do all for their wife while pleasing them at every turn, are (for the most part) setting themselves up to experience sexless marriages. Since being pampered does not generate wanton sexual desire.


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## Stevespatrol (May 19, 2018)

Ok people many many mixed responses.
We had another talk the other night and here is what she said.
She said that she is stressed about a few things in our life being getting our eldest in to a new school and her current job coming to an end and a few other little stresses.
She said she is just not interested at the moment and I have to be patient.

So now my new approach will be im too stressed to sleep beside her and too stressed to help out as much as I am.

Or 

Do I be patient and when she comes knocking for some I turn her down and show her the same


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## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

Being playful with an edge is ten times better than kissing your wife’s ass.






Personal said:


> Sure he is likely to remain passive lest he rock the boat, which is an untenable approach if he is wanting his situation to change. Since he is so passive in order to try to stave off (if ever caught) or prevent confrontation (if never caught), I suppose if he wants more sex he can choose to cheat on his wife instead.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

Stevespatrol said:


> Ok people many many mixed responses.
> We had another talk the other night and here is what she said.
> She said that she is stressed about a few things in our life being getting our eldest in to a new school and her current job coming to an end and a few other little stresses.
> She said she is just not interested at the moment and I have to be patient.
> ...


Well judging by your response I think you are determined to make sure, you never share any sex with your wife at all going forward.


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## Holdingontoit (Mar 7, 2012)

Personal said:


> Well judging by your response I think you are determined to make sure, you never share any sex with your wife at all going forward.


Not sharing any sex by choice is better than OP pretending he is trying to obtain sex when he isn't.

OP, you have a choice to make. If you want any chance of sex with your wife, you have to be more aggressive. You have to trigger conflict. You have to take a chance not only that she will shoot you down, but she will hold your failed attempts against you in other parts of the relationship.

If you are totally opposed to taking any risk and totally opposed to triggering any conflict, then you are choosing not to have sex with your wife. She isn't rejecting you, you are making a conscious choice to stay - but not to take the action that has a chance of resulting in her finding you sexually attractive. 

At this point, there is NOTHING you can do to trigger her interest that does not involve risk, conflict, and you feeling uncomfortable. There is no magic wand. No pill that you can take or give her. No "line" you can say or conversation you can have that will help you. In fact, pretty much anything you say will make things worse.

Take a chance. Or resign yourself to never having sex again. Not because she rejects you. But because you have decided to - as @MEM2020 likes to say - place a higher value on protecting your ego than on having more sex. Which is OK. You are an adult and free to make that choice. But if you do, own it.

It took me 13 years of fighting against reality to accept that I was making that decision. 13 years of refusing to accept that I was making a choice not to have sex. 13 years of feeble attempts that were designed to protect my ego more than they were designed to produce desire in my wife. This included marriage counselling, sex therapy, etc. So when I say feeble attempts I don't mean just sending her an email or sitting her down to talk among ourselves. I admitted the problem to third parties. But I did not do what was required.

Don't take as long as I did to accept reality. Stop trying to look for a path that does not exist. You are banging your head against the rock wall, hoping to break the rocks. You will break your head first. I know the path behind you is narrow and jagged and you are afraid that you have no idea where it leads and that you might fall off the cliff before you get anywhere better. But living in the cave alone without sustenance will kill you just as surely. It just takes longer and hurts more.


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## DTO (Dec 18, 2011)

Stevespatrol said:


> Ok people many many mixed responses.
> We had another talk the other night and here is what she said.
> She said that she is stressed about a few things in our life being getting our eldest in to a new school and her current job coming to an end and a few other little stresses.
> She said she is just not interested at the moment and I have to be patient.


But I hope you understand that you don't have to be patient. That is, there is nothing wrong with refusing to give her a pass because of the above-noted circumstances. In fact, I recommend you don't give her a pass.

What you have described above as obstacles to sex are just a part of everyday life. Part of being an adult is learning how to deal with life's issues while still being a good employee, parent, and spouse. Your wife doesn't sound terribly mature; she sounds like a whiny teenager who has two assignments due tomorrow that's she's procrastinated on, and she's pissed because you've asked her to do the dishes.

Look at this way: even if she were being genuine during this discussion with you, she's still not taking any responsibility for resolving this issue. She's putting it on you to suck it up until she feels like having sex. That is not loving, at all. And, there's always the possibility that she just doesn't want sex with you (or at all), and this is her way of deflecting responsibility so that there's no repercussions for her sexual refusal.

I would tell her that her excuses are not acceptable. Life is rarely (if ever) smooth and easy; her expecting you to wait until such conditions exist therefore is unreasonable. Therefore, you will not continue being attentive and supportive to someone who places so little priority on you in return, so she needs to figure it out (with your support, of course, should she commit herself to making lasting and meaningful improvement).

And then, you need to back up your spoken stance with your behavior. Don't be around so much. Do stuff with your kids (or by yourself) and exclude her. Handle business for you and your kids but refuse any honey-do requests. The point is you want her to know that she can't take you for granted.

Of course, you need to make sure you have something going on for yourself. If you have a crappy job, don't help out at home, are a total slob, have poor manners, never catered to her needs (before thsi sexlessness started, that is), etc. then you might not have much luck with this approach. A look in the mirror before embarking on this journey is always wise.

If you're a decent guy, I'd be surprised if you didn't see at least some attempts at improvement, simply because your wife values you being around. If she didn't see any value in you, she'd probably have left already. She could always decide that it's too much for her / not worth her while. But at least you'd see some movement on her part, which is more than you're getting now.


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## PigglyWiggly (May 1, 2018)

responsive desire.......this seems like a classic case of you two both not understanding that and her not understanding that sex is more than just an orgasm for you. I think there is a thread in the Women's section about what sex mean to men. I bet you fit the common mold in that thread as do i.






edit: found the thread...take a look http://talkaboutmarriage.com/ladies...what-mans-sexual-nature-his-sexual-needs.html


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## Mstanton (Feb 8, 2011)

She's pulling bull on you my man.


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## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

...


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