# I'm at a loss / help



## DALE CHOSA (May 14, 2014)

I need advise from a women's point of view.

My wife and I have been together going on 21 years with 4 kids which are all grown up. My wife is beautiful, caring, smart and loves me to death. Last September I got mad because we didn't make love and she snapped and said she didn't feel like making love all these years because she doesn't have that desire anymore and hasn't for years. She only did it because she knew it was important to me and to keep us together. I finally heard her and felt bad for pushing her to make love to me when she wasn't in the mood.
We went 3 months without making love and last December we did and it was nice.
It's been 5 months now and still she doesn't want to make love, but says she loves me.
My question is how can a women sleep with me cuddle in the morning, hug me, kiss me through out the day, but have no desire for Intimacy?
We work and live together and get along great except for the bad subject of I like making love to my wife!!!
Like I said we are together all the time so there's no cheating going on..

I'm truly at a loss / any thoughts.


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## doobie (Apr 15, 2014)

Just like you and your wife, my husband and I live and work together (we both work from home). We have a great relationship in many ways, apart from the fact that our sex life is practically non-existent. We've only been married for 18 months (both in our fifties) and have only had sex about a dozen times since we got married. This time, it's been three months since we had sex. We had "the talk" three weeks ago and my husband agreed that we need to revive our love life but nothing has happened since then. He is very LD (due to medication/health issues) and has confessed that despite the fact that he thinks I'm desirable, he never feels sexual in any way. This is taking a huge toll on our marriage, with me being upset about the lack of intimacy on a daily basis, but trying to hide the fact as I don't want things to get worse. When I do show how depressed I am, it seems to make my husband angry. We still kiss (pecks on the forehead or cheek) and cuddle, but there's just no thrill or intimacy there. Because the latest interval between us having sex has gone on for so long, I'm actually getting to the stage where I'm losing my desire for him. Like you, I can't understand how he can cuddle and kiss me and not feel any need for intimacy or sex. This is tearing me apart and I'm now fearful that my marriage will end over this issue. 

I know this won't help you with your problem, but just wanted to let you know that you're not alone, there are plenty of us out here who have a real desire for a healthy and regular sex life and have to ignore our desires on a daily basis.


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

My STBXW was like your wife. Note the STBX part... You could try to follow the "Married Man's Sex Life Primer" and see where it gets you, but I doubt it will make a difference.

The problem is that your wife's needs are all being met. Well, aside from you bugging her about sex all the time... So she has no reason to change her behaviour. The MMSLP may help destabilize her little world enough that she fears that her needs will not continue to be met.

C


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## sinnister (Dec 5, 2010)

PBear said:


> My STBXW was like your wife. Note the STBX part... You could try to follow the "Married Man's Sex Life Primer" and see where it gets you, but I doubt it will make a difference.
> 
> The problem is that your wife's needs are all being met. Well, aside from you bugging her about sex all the time... So she has no reason to change her behaviour. The MMSLP may help destabilize her little world enough that she fears that her needs will not continue to be met.
> 
> C


I agree with all of this. OP - I fear its too late for you though. Its been going on too long for her to change now.

Mine has been going on about 7 years.


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## IndyTMI (Oct 26, 2012)

DALE CHOSA said:


> I need advise from a women's point of view.
> 
> My wife and I have been together going on 21 years with 4 kids which are all grown up. My wife is beautiful, caring, smart and loves me to death. Last September I got mad because we didn't make love and she snapped and said she didn't feel like making love all these years because she doesn't have that desire anymore and hasn't for years. *She only did it because she knew it was important to me and to keep us together*. I finally heard her and felt bad for pushing her to make love to me when she wasn't in the mood.
> We went 3 months without making love and last December we did and it was nice.
> ...


It's sad when she doesn't want it for her or have the desire to make you happy.

This is the same as my ex, that's why she is now my ex. Yes, sex and desire ARE that important!


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## Hicks (Jan 14, 2011)

DALE CHOSA said:


> I need advise from a women's point of view.
> 
> My wife and I have been together going on 21 years with 4 kids which are all grown up. My wife is beautiful, caring, smart and loves me to death.
> .


If you consider love a feeling then you are right.
If you consider love an action, then you are wrong.



DALE CHOSA said:


> Last September I got mad because we didn't make love and she snapped and said she didn't feel like making love all these years because she doesn't have that desire anymore and hasn't for years. She only did it because she knew it was important to me and to keep us together.
> .


I would rather have a wife who loves me and therefore she makes love with me because it's important to me then one who does not really love me but wants to have sex because she is horny.

In other words, a woman who wants to make you happy is the rare and precious thing.




DALE CHOSA said:


> My question is how can a women sleep with me cuddle in the morning, hug me, kiss me through out the day, but have no desire for Intimacy?
> .


Because sex is not important to women in the way it is important to men.

Your wire is normal. What happened is you allowed a normal "test" that wives give you from time to time to kill your sex life. Epic fail.


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## DALE CHOSA (May 14, 2014)

Thanks for your thoughts.

Sounds like I have a alot of work ahead of me to have her fall back in love with me or move on..


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## Happilymarried25 (Mar 19, 2014)

DALE CHOSA said:


> Thanks for your thoughts.
> 
> Sounds like I have a alot of work ahead of me to have her fall back in love with me or move on..


Why would you move on? It sounds like you have a great marriage, other than the no sex part. Yes I know sex is important but it sounds like you have a loving relationship that a lot of marriages don't have. If it does come down to that then have a serious talk with her and tell her that not having sex is a deal breaker you can't live with out and you won't so she will have to change her mind about not having sex or you will move on. Give her a chance to change so she knows how serious this is. She probably thinks everything is fine between the two of you because of how loving you two are towards each other outside of the bedroom. Like a lot of men in sexless marriages you will probably become resentful and not be so loving and then she will notice things are not so great.


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## askari (Jun 21, 2012)

The marriage 'deal' is full of obligations...aaprt from teh obvious ones like 'in sickness and in health' etc.

You become a team - you share household chores, you take it in turns to do the not so exciting things (like empty the dish washer!) if the husband sprains his ankle the wife should massage it, strap it up etc...if the wife has a stiff neck the husband should (without being asked) massage it.

Its all about looking after one another - a team.

A very important part of a marriage and bonding is sex. Sex is particularly important to men because its how we bond. No sex and we feel rejected, unloved, unwanted unappreciated etc.

If there is no sex in the marriage, sooner or later the husband will become resentful and start withdrawing....with the inevitable consequences.


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## DTO (Dec 18, 2011)

DALE CHOSA said:


> I need advise from a women's point of view.
> 
> My wife and I have been together going on 21 years with 4 kids which are all grown up. My wife is beautiful, caring, smart and loves me to death. Last September I got mad because we didn't make love and she snapped and said she didn't feel like making love all these years because she doesn't have that desire anymore and hasn't for years. She only did it because she knew it was important to me and to keep us together. I finally heard her and felt bad for pushing her to make love to me when she wasn't in the mood.
> We went 3 months without making love and last December we did and it was nice.
> ...


Not a woman, but I would suggest asking her:

1) How does she become comfortable with getting her marital needs met (non-sexual touching, companionship) but (now) openly rejecting yours? To me, that is respect issue.

2) Given that she hasn't wanted sex in years but kept at it because she knew it was important to you and the marriage, does the fact she now rejects sex mean maintaining the marriage has lost importance?

3) Has she considered that your ability to meet her needs depends on her meeting yours?

4) What, if anything, is she willing to do to get back to a point where she can meet your marital needs? Is she willing to look at this as a loving sacrifice for you rather than something unpleasant she no longer wants for herself?


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## ClimbingTheWalls (Feb 16, 2013)

I think you need to explore with her why she hasn't felt like having sex for years. I suspect she was centred around the children. However, her comments make me think that she did feel like having sex at some early stage in the relationship. Therefore it may be possible to get that back. 

What are you like physically? Have you got slack, let yourself go, put on weight? 

Do you spend quality time together, doing "date" type stuff? If not, you need to.

Also, there's no point in allowing her to put off sex for months on end. That will build resentment and start eating into other areas of the marriage. What she has done is put you in a position where you now don't feel like making advances because you will always wonder whether you are pressuring her into something she does not really want to do. That's a killer. If she was able to go with the flow before, then she should be able to do so now and you are somehow going to have to get over the psychological issues of wondering whether she is really into it.


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## COfan (Oct 4, 2012)

Actually, your wife's lack of desire is pretty normal for women. I wouldn't be overly alarmed. Do you think she'd be willing to read a book that's directed toward women who are feeling the same way she is about sex? I highly recommend this read: No More Headaches by Dr. Julianna Slattery.


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## DALE CHOSA (May 14, 2014)

She knows how I feel about sex, I have had that talk with her several times and all she says is she doesn't have the desire to do that and until she does she's not going to.

She did like making love to me in the early years of our relationship and she said even toward the end of our sex life it was satisfying but she has no desire and doesn't know if its because of menopause which was 10 years ago or or or?
She says she doesn't resent me for pushing her to make love at least 4 times a month until last September. I didn't feel like I was pushing her into sex because I would advance and she would then pull me to her. But she said if she didn't then I would be pissy until we did. I asked her why didn't she tell me this years ago so we could have fixed it then and not now after all these years????So I don't have a clue.
She has said that if I can't deal with it and am not happy with waiting for now she will move out. And she doesn't know if she will ever get the desire for sex again.
She wants me to wait for her desire to come back and I said fine but how does it come back if we don't at least go there without the sex, like a massage or making out?

We are both not over weight, very clean and normal looking and I have taking massage lessons and bought the massage oil and set up the towels and candles and massaged her back one night, but I stopped after her back because I could see she wasn't into it. We talked about that and she said she didn't know where I was going with all that. I told her from the start this is not going to lead to sex just a massage.


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

You ask how a woman can completely lose her sex drive and frankly she must not have had a very strong sex drive to begin with.

I have a strong sex drive and even when I am stinky haven't showered and really don't want sex, all he has to do is lay between my legs and it's game on. Kind of annoying actually. I don't get to hang onto my mad for very long!

I can tell you this, if you don't INSIST she make her lack of sex drive a priority to understand AND fix, nothing will improve. Get her to talk openly and honestly about what she liked about sex what she didn't like and more importantly WHY. Get her to understand how she would feel if you stopped wanting to touch her at all, would she still feel loved? If she says yes she full of sh!t.

If it were me, I'd do everything. In my power to fix the relationship and seek answers and then I'd cut bait and leave. I think anyone who is upset about their sexless marriage is foolish to stick around and go without. Life is so much better with sex.


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

COfan said:


> Actually, your wife's lack of desire is pretty normal for women. I wouldn't be overly alarmed. Do you think she'd be willing to read a book that's directed toward women who are feeling the same way she is about sex? I highly recommend this read: No More Headaches by Dr. Julianna Slattery.


Ummmm No. Just....NO.


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

Take her up on her offer to move out. Let her feel the full brunt of what she's losing through her choices.


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## Fozzy (Jul 20, 2013)

WorkingOnMe said:


> Take her up on her offer to move out. Let her feel the full brunt of what she's losing through her choices.


She IS the one making the ultimatum here. I'd suggest start with Anon's suggestion. Tell her it's time to get serious about fixing the problem, get a commitment, and hold her to the fire for following through. If she doesn't--, see above.


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

WorkingOnMe said:


> Take her up on her offer to move out. Let her feel the full brunt of what she's losing through her choices.



Doing that will also validate her view that OP is in it for the flesh only. 

This isn't a risk vs reward discussion unfortunately. 

Let her move out and be done with it is fine. But her risk of losing what she already has in the marriage is dwarfed by her perceived benefit of not having sex.

The underlaying reason is selfishness and ignorance for the most part. Aka jihad. And we all know how well jihadis can be turned around...


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## Fozzy (Jul 20, 2013)

john117 said:


> Doing that will also validate her view that OP is in it for the flesh only.
> 
> This isn't a risk vs reward discussion unfortunately.
> 
> ...


If you frame it as a matter of "sex now or get out", then yes you're right--it would validate her view. If you frame it as "work on this marriage with me or get out" I think it will probably be viewed differently. Maybe not more positively, but she might respect the position more.


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

Right. But if she's getting her needs met (her only) why bother working on the marriage (both)


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## DALE CHOSA (May 14, 2014)

Apparently women are wired tougher then men. She doesn't have a clue how hard it is to live, sleep next to and work with all day with a smile knowing she has no desire for me and doesn't want to fix it. She just wants the feeling to come back????????


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

Dale part of what you need to do is own up to the fact that by tolerating the situation and not leaving her, you are enabling her behavior. It makes you part of the problem.


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

WorkingOnMe said:


> Dale part of what you need to do is own up to the fact that by tolerating the situation and not leaving her, you are enabling her behavior. It makes you part of the problem.


:iagree:

This!

I know it feels horrible, soul crushing even. But if you play nice, you won't get nice back. Play hard ball and make it more uncomfortable for her NOT to work at it then it is to let things remain the same.


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

Anon Pink said:


> :iagree:
> 
> I know it feels horrible, soul crushing even. But if you play nice, you won't get nice back. Play hard ball and make it more uncomfortable for her NOT to work at it then it is to let things remain the same.



As I wrote in a different thread, playing hardball and making it uncomfortable for her NOT to work at it could result in her taking a martyr attitude aka Jihad Jane and good luck after that.

One step further down the abyss aisle is marital warfare and that's pretty much the end of it. She has all the validation in the world that you're only in it for the flesh part.


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## askari (Jun 21, 2012)

Anon Pink said:


> :iagree:
> 
> This!
> 
> I know it feels horrible, soul crushing even. But if you play nice, you won't get nice back. Play hard ball and make it more uncomfortable for her NOT to work at it then it is to let things remain the same.


:iagree: 2!

As long as you appear to accept the situation why should she make any effort.

She needs to be told in very simple words; sort yourself out and I am happy to help you, but its got to come from you. I am not prepeared to live in a sexless marriage anymore. We have a year.

Couldnt be more blunt than that.

But if you say it you have to stick to it. If after 12 months there is no improvement, leave. No one can say she wasnt told.


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## rocksrock (May 16, 2014)

Come on guys! It happens! Women can lose their sex drive., men too. Don't think for one minute that we like it any better than you do. Its not somthing we can control, most of the time. She loves you by not making you live in a sexless marriage. She doesn't do it out of duty but because she knows how important it is to you and tried not to hurt your feelings by telling you. So go ahead and tell her to get out for being there for you and show her you really don't love her, just her body. If a man loses his sex drive you all gather around and call NASA to help this poor man and come up with 30 different medications to fix his life ending problem. It happens to a woman? Oh well, kick her out and find someone 20 years longer. At least with her you will be dead by the time she loses hers.


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

When you accumulate 2000 posts like the rest of us it may be more obvious why we say what we say. With 2 posts...


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## Ditch (Apr 16, 2014)

Anon Pink said:


> You ask how a woman can completely lose her sex drive and frankly she must not have had a very strong sex drive to begin with.
> 
> I have a strong sex drive and even when I am stinky haven't showered and really don't want sex, all he has to do is lay between my legs and it's game on. Kind of annoying actually. I don't get to hang onto my mad for very long!
> 
> ...


She is getting what she wants without giving what you want. So, you cut back on the touching and cuddling, eventually she will notice and say something or get mad about something else, a over reaction to what ever the something else is. Then you say " What's behind all this?" She should mention the lack of touching or intimacy, then you bring up your side of the equation. Touching doesn't always have to lead to intimacy, but never isn't a option either. Every relationship has things, one or the other doesn't care for, but does it anyway. Even Dr Laura tells women, do you enjoy it once it starts, then let it happen. 
If she still isn't interested, then its time to bail!


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## Ditch (Apr 16, 2014)

rocksrock said:


> Come on guys! It happens! Women can lose their sex drive., men too. Don't think for one minute that we like it any better than you do. Its not somthing we can control, most of the time. She loves you by not making you live in a sexless marriage. She doesn't do it out of duty but because she knows how important it is to you and tried not to hurt your feelings by telling you. So go ahead and tell her to get out for being there for you and show her you really don't love her, just her body. If a man loses his sex drive you all gather around and call NASA to help this poor man and come up with 30 different medications to fix his life ending problem. It happens to a woman? Oh well, kick her out and find someone 20 years longer. At least with her you will be dead by the time she loses hers.


If he was in it just for "her body", he would have left after a week of no sex, obviously he is seeking out help, maybe you should as well.


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## khaleesiwife (May 9, 2014)

I feel your pain. If he is LD then can't he be present while you masterbate? Is he willing to go the distance since it's clearly going to be an issue for you if this problem is prolonged? Just a suggestion..


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## DALE CHOSA (May 14, 2014)

I think at first it was all about the sex because I didn't understand why she didn't want to.
Now after months it's truly about she doesn't love me enough to want to at least just for fun. She says its satisfying when we did even when she wasn't in the mood and I pushed her not hearing her or me just being pig headed and thinking everything was okay.

She said I can't give her time without bringing the subject up and see if things settle down and come back together?

Regardless It's been 9 months and we have made love once, so I will try and not focus on that and give her some space and see if it turns around. If it doesn't she will have to move out and leave our business and do what she wants without us.

It just sucks after all these years of building a life together that she wouldn't have talked to me as she felt that way so we could have fixed it then. And the fact that I was an idiot and didn't listen to her. ahhhhhhhhhh


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## DALE CHOSA (May 14, 2014)

So if she loves me why doesn't she have the desire to make love to me?
Is it because she wasn't in the mood all those years and she felt obligated to do it anyway, and then one day says she's not going to unless she has those feelings back?
Everything I have read says it's a lack of emotions we lost along the way and now she looks at me differently.
That makes since but her not wanting a Divorce and for us to go on with out sex is fine with her. But not me, so am I wrong should I just shut up and go along hoping it will all come back and we can continue our journey in life or stop the pain now and find someone who will want me for everything.


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## CuddleBug (Nov 26, 2012)

DALE CHOSA said:


> I need advise from a women's point of view.
> 
> My wife and I have been together going on 21 years with 4 kids which are all grown up. My wife is beautiful, caring, smart and loves me to death. Last September I got mad because we didn't make love and she snapped and said she didn't feel like making love all these years because she doesn't have that desire anymore and hasn't for years. She only did it because she knew it was important to me and to keep us together. I finally heard her and felt bad for pushing her to make love to me when she wasn't in the mood.
> We went 3 months without making love and last December we did and it was nice.
> ...



You're married for 21 years. :smthumbup:

You have 4 kids that are grown up and out of the house. :smthumbup:

You now have more time for yourselves and together, to do whatever you want. :smthumbup:


Your wife knows you desire her sexually and find her hot, yet she doesn't desire and want sex much anymore.

Your wife is to take care of your needs "sexual" as her own and its never what she only wants. Otherwise, she is being selfish and not loving.

Now after having 4 kids, that will alter her hormones and she's in her 40's?, menopause may have set in. Both will mean no interest in sex much, if at all. Only thing she can do, is see the Doctor, get her hormones checked out, explain that to the Doctor. He or she may give meds to get her hormones and sex drive back to normal again. But she has to want to do this. If she doesn't want to, or sees this as an issue, there is nothing you can really do.

If your wife truly loves you, she will want to have sex with you, often, spicing it up and if not, she would of gone to the Doctor years ago and nailed her low sex drive.

She is probably comfy in the marriage. Has gotten away with having very little sex with you so far, so why change?

She is getting what she needs at the expensive of you not getting what you need.

No woman or man should think its fine and healthy to only have sex once every few months. That is grounds for divorce!!!

I say, come home with divorce papers. If she gets upset and says, I want to make this work, then she still loves you and make it work with her. If she doesn't freak out, then you know she doesn't really love you.


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## DALE CHOSA (May 14, 2014)

Thanks Cuddle bug,

I calmly sat her down and explained that I loved her and wanted this to work and at the end of this week we should cuddle and see where it goes and if she doesn't feel anything then she needs to see a Doctor about her hormone pills she has been on for 10 years.
She agree's


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## DALE CHOSA (May 14, 2014)

Turns out she still doesn't want to make love because she says she doesn't have the feelings or desire to do that.
She says she doesn't think about sex with me or anyone else.
I asked why she can kiss me cuddle and hug me and that's ok.
She didn't have an answer

I told her we will get through summer and go from there

I'm still at a loss


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