# Wife cheating, I really don't think it will stop



## justwow

I need advice. I am totally confused, and have no idea what to do.

A couple of months ago, my wife told me that she cheated on me. We had been hanging out with a bunch of people and she had sex with someone. When she told me, I just cried forever. I didn't know what else to do. However, she was drunk at the time if that matters. Based on that, and the fact that I love her and she confessed on her own, and that I don't want to ruin the lives of my two children, I forgave her and we moved on.

Recently, she had been acting odd. She kept asking to check my phone for text messages, and saying that she smelled womens perfume and deodorant on me (FYI, I have NOT been cheating and I work in an office full of men). Last night, she was texting in the store and I tried to look at her phone. She fought me tooth and nail for it, but when I got it I noticed that it was password protected. She refused to tell me what the password was, and said that the message was something personal her sister sent me, and her sister didn't want me to know.

When I got home I went on the internet and looked at her text messages records. It was from our California area code, and her sister lives in Chicago. To stop rambling, it ended up being one of her old sex buddys that she has been sexting and reminiscing about old sexual encounters with. She says nothing physical happened with him yet. She also says that the multimedia messages she sent / received were jokes and not audio and video of them messing around. I asked if there had been any audio video stuff and she said 'I don't think so but I don't recall. I don't believe that for a second. I asked if there was more / other people and she said no.

I feel obligated to write this next part. Early in our marriage (4 year anniversary soon) I wrote dirty to two girls I never met before on the internet. Totally wrong. I felt like the scum of the earth for what I'd done. When we talked about it I admitted everything, cried to her, and told her it would never happen again. It hasn't.

However, when I bring up this latest incident to her, it's different. She shows no remorse, and tries to justify her actions (We don't talk dirty EVERY time we text, for example). I've told her that I feel very hurt and I don't know what to do, and her response is 'well, I don't know what to tell you'. I honestly feel like she wants a divorce, but doesn't want to initiate it, so eventually all the sneaking around will be discovered and I'll divorce her.

Sorry for the mismatched rambling, but I am hurt and confused. I have not been perfect, but I kept my word. I don't want to think that because I screwed up in the past, I have to be treated like this.

MOST IMPORTANTLY, I love my kids. I don't want to hurt them or ruin their lives, but I don't know what hope there is for my marriage. She has cheated in every relationship she has been in, and apparently this one is no different. Any advise would be great. Please. Thanks for reading my novel here.

EDIT: I forgot to add that we have been to two marriage counselors. She has refused to go back to either, one after one visit and one after two.


----------



## workindad

No remorse, no desire to participate in MC, not good signs to me. I'd insist on no contact and require her to share her passwords, etc. She obviously lies to you. In her current frame of mind, she won't stop. You need to ask yourself if you will be her doormat and want to raise your kids like that.


----------



## Tourchwood

May be you are not going to like this. 
record all these messages, get a copy, monitor computer activity, go to court and divorce her. she is playing with you. 
better be safe than staying with her then getting STD.


----------



## MrK

justwow said:


> We don't talk dirty EVERY time we text, for example).


There you go. Not inappropriate EVERY time. It's only a part time affair. Only OCCASIONAL infidelity. What's your problem? And she already admitted to the OTHER infidelity. Get over it already.

Sorry. No human being could be that stupid to expect her husband to believe this is anything but what it is. 

SCARE THE CRAP OUT OF HER!!! Bundle up the kids and go to your parents. Tell her that until this is over, you're separated. If it doesn't end, divorce. I don't know different state laws, but I'd guess that courts give kids to the more responsible parent just about everywhere.


----------



## Jellybeans

If she refuses to cut off her affairs and has no remorse, you have 2 options: accept living in an open marriage or be done with her. Did she have sex with the guy at the party while you were also there? Also...I am curious...did she cheat on her last guy with you?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Pit-of-my-stomach

You mention wanting advice...

First question and only one that matters, what do you want?

When you know what you want (in or out) and your 100% commited to that, we can help. You may not get exactly what you want, but the collective wisdom here can certainly point you on the track that will give you the best chance of getting it. There will be a whole group of people here that will hold your hand through it, but you have to tell us which way you want to walk.

Start with what you want. Before you know what that is, nothing else really matters.


----------



## Cypress

This is a really bad sign. If she is not in a EA she is heading for one quickly. I would let her family, your family and all your friends know. See if you can find out who she is sexting. If they find out she is married, they might stop. She will be angry, but she may stop out of embarrassment.

Next I would put spy software on the phone, to catch all of her texting. I would not cancel the phone contract, she will just get her own phone. Put a GPS tracker in her car, in case she wants to hook up with these weasels.

She is getting some of her needs met through this behavior. Get 'His Needs/ Her Needs' try to get her to read it. You can both fill out the questionnaires, and find out how to take care of each other.


----------



## justwow

Jellybeans, when I met her she was single, so she did not cheat on her last man with me. And yes, I was walking between the party and my in laws house but she screwed him sometime while I was there, or at least around.

POMS, To be honest I don't know what I want. I guess in a perfect world I would want to be with the mother of my kids in a faithful relationship and have the best family possible. However, based on my knowledge of her past cheatings, both with me and other people, I just can't see it. Even if she were to tell me today right here and now that she will never have any inappropriate contact, verbal, physical or whatever with another guy, I wouldn't be able to bring myself to believe it. Perhaps that is my own character defect saying that, I just believe it is the reasonable, logical, brutally honest side of me saying that. I listed my own shortcoming in my original post to acknowledge that I am not perfect, but I don't feel that I should have to live a life being my wife's private investigator. If there is any hope that we can live a faithful life together, please tell me, as I would love to hear it. However, I want honest replies, which is what all of you have given me, so I truly thank you.

Let me just add these two text messages we just exchanged:

Me: Can you even say honestly that you think this will stop? Honestly.

Her: I can't say for sure but I can definitely try my hardest to stop Hun!

What?!? You can't even make a committment to me that you won't cheat again? Are you freakin kidding me? Am I overreacting, or just seeing this for what it is? Thanks for the help, every post really helps, and that is the truth.


----------



## justwow

Cypress, her family knew about the first affair when she had sex with that guy. They kept her secret for her and don't give a rats behind. Her mom got divorced because she cheated on her husband, and one sister is currently cheating on her husband (and they have three kids). Her family just doesn't care. I don't know if they know about the sexting, but I'll bet they do. The person she is sexting knows she has a family. I could tell my parents...wow, that would be a nightmare. My wife would never forgive me for that, but maybe I should. My parents are anti-divorce no matter what, and would tell us to work through it with a counselor, despite two failed tries. From what I know, you get out of counseling what you put into it, and based off of our last two tries, she won't be putting much into a third time.


----------



## Cypress

Get on to MarriageBuilders.com and start reading. Nothing you are going through is unique. Start a thread in the Infidelity forum. You will have a large number of knowledgeable and experienced people helping you.


----------



## marksaysay

Great advice, cypress. That site gives great advise.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## justwow

OK, I will check that site too. Thanks to everyone who responds, as everything I read helps.

In my opinion, that text message confirms my worst fears. She is not willing to make a committment to stop cheating. She left the door wide open to cheat again, because now if she does she can say 'Well, I tried". Again, trying be realistic as much as it hurts and makes me want to cry, that does not sound like the talk of someone who is willing to do whatever it takes to keep the marriage together and not have affairs or cheat.


----------



## marksaysay

It's so funny to see a story almost identical to mine. My wife cheated and then started the very same thongs your wife is doing with the sexting and stuff. She then told me that by asking her to stop, I was forcing her to make a decision about us (we had separated in order to give her space or so I thought). Sadly to say, my wife hasn't stopped yet.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## justwow

And that's what I am afraid of. I love my wife to death, but given her history and her refusal to commit to not cheating ever again, I feel that continuing would just be setting myself up for heartbreak (again). I wish it weren't true, but that is the reality as I see it. In that text message where I asked if she honestly thought this would stop, I would have liked to see a response that said 'I'll do whatever it takes' or 'I'll do such and such to make sure this never happens again'. To me, saying that she is 'not sure, but she will try her hardest' is leaving the door open for more affairs. Why else would you say you aren't sure if you can stop. I'm trying to be realistic despite the pain. Am I off base, or do I have this right?


----------



## marksaysay

You're pretty much on the money. She will only stop when she wants to.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## the guy

Now that you have faced the reality of it, which is hard for some guys...some guys have a lot of denial, I did.

You have to make the tough dicision here. I understand you want your kids to grow up in a healthy home..unbroken if you will, but you are not the cause of this. Your wife is, so I hope you can show your kids what its like to be strong and what it is to stand up for ones self and not tolorating bad behaviors from others. Its important that they see this as wrong. So please take this into consideration, and teach .....give your kids an example of a healthy relationship by finding someone else that shows you respect, you owe it to the kids.

For now it is important that you journal and keep posting her. Another thing is QUITELY gather the the evidence, not to prove she's cheating, but to protect your self in the future. See she will rewrite history and make you the bad guy. Especially if your kids are to young now. When they get older you can set them straight with all the lies your wife will tell them now.

#1 rule stop crying and no begging,b/c people want what they can't have. I know your wife has your number and she truely believes you will take what she gives you. So stop taking scraps and man up. You can't control her but you can control what you tolorate. So stop and distance your self from your wife. Protect your self by putting up the wall that will prevent you from more pain.

She has you were she wants you, take back the power my distancing your self. Spend more time with the kids with out her,work out, get back into a hobby, and stop finacing her cheating by closing your joint account.

Show her the confidence that you can move on with out her and it will be her choice to come along. Turn this around and it should be up to her to follow you...not you follow her and accept her bad behavior. Give her a taste of what it will be like when you are no longer around.

Again you can't control her but you can control what you do and how you want to be happy. This is important for your kids to see. It is not your fault that your W broke up the family.

She has your number so change that and empower your self with confidence and strength in that you do not have to take this sh8t and you can move on.


----------



## justwow

Guy, thanks for your post. I believe that you are right, and that my wife does think that I will take whatever she gives me. I probably would too, at least until this point. It is easy for me to be realistic posting here, but when I see her it's not so easy, because I do love her. I am trying to distance myself and show that I am not okay with this. I slept on the couch last night, no hugs, kisses, or I love you on the way out the door today for her, just for my kids. 

My feelings confuse me. On one hand, it is hard not to hug and kiss her. On the other hand, it seems to be equally hard at this point not to run out and get a divorce lawyer. I mean, I am as confident as I can be at this point that nothing will change. I didn't even feel like this when she cheated the first time, which was the PA she had. However, I feel like the evidence is beating me over the head at this point. I think I read something on these forums to the effect of "Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me. Fool me three times...doesn't matter, because there won't be a third time." Sorry if I skewered that by the way.

Also Guy, what you said about the kids helps. More than anything, I want my kids to grow up the best way I can raise them, so this affecting them has me terrified. I don't want them to to be traumatized, but I also don't want them to think this behavior is okay or have to deal with mommy and I arguing about this. Like every parent, I want them to not make the mistakes / misfortune that I had. I grew up with parents who outside of extreme reasons (abuse, etc) don't condone divorce, so wrapping my head around this is hard. Thanks for all the kind words, as all of this is helping.


----------



## Jellybeans

Now is NOT the time to be weak. You asked and she told you STRAIGHT UP she isn't sure if she can cut off screwing around w/ other men. Not the naswer you wanted, but she has shown you who she is so you need to believe it.

DO get tested for STDs ASAP. Who knows how many people she's been with. This is the same woman who had sex with someone at a party that YOU, her husband, were at!

If OM is married/partnered -- TELL HIS/THEIR wives/Signifcant others.

Do not hug and kiss her. She is disrespecting you. BADLY. Do not reward this behavior. 

If you roll over, it will set a very bad "doormat" tone. What I would do if I were you is tell her -- "I am glad you were honest with me about not knowing whether you can stop having affairs with multiple men. I appreciate you candid honesty. However, that doesn't work for me. I refuse to live in an open marriage. So if that is your choice, I will take the appropriate actions including up to and filing for divorce. I will not let my children grow up in an environment where they think repeated adultery is ok by one of their parents."

END POINT...and WALK away. No more talking to her. You need to treat her the same way you would treat a colleague: cordial but all business-like. NO emotions whatsoever.

The thing is you NEED to back this up with actions. If you don't and you start crying and begging her to stop and pleading with her, coddling her, she is going to see right through your words, cause that is all they will be and keep doing whatever the f she wants. You need to show her you are a man who respects himself and right now she does not respect you one bit. If you do not respect yourself, nobody in the world will.

And women do not love men they don't respect. That is an unwritten rule somewhere. 

Oh and one more thing:

DO NOT leave your home. If she wants to carry on with other men, SHE can leave.


----------



## ahhhmaaaan!

"I love my kids. I don't want to hurt them or ruin their lives."- Didn't she already do this. She cheated not only on you, but on your kids too. Why can't BS's with kids see this? She cheated on the entire family, dude.


----------



## bobbie

My novel, _Truth Games_, Truth Games: Amazon.co.uk: Bobbie Darbyshire: Books explores marital infidelity in 1970s London UK, when the freedoms of the swinging 60s began to run into trouble. It’s the two blazing hot summers of 75 and 76 and a group of friends are getting way out of their depth in infidelity. It's a really thought-provoking read that covers all angles, including a husband who knows his wife is cheating and decides to stay with her.


----------



## morituri

I recommend that you read Dr James C Dobson's book 'Love Must Be Tough' which unlike 'Surviving An Affair', doesn't tell you to be her doormat and an enabler of her affair.


----------



## Jellybeans

^ Excellent book. I also recommend it.


----------



## ing

Jellybeans said:


> Now is NOT the time to be weak. You asked and she told you STRAIGHT UP she isn't sure if she can cut off screwing around w/ other men. Not the naswer you wanted, but she has shown you who she is so you need to believe it.
> 
> DO get tested for STDs ASAP. Who knows how many people she's been with. This is the same woman who had sex with someone at a party that YOU, her husband, were at!
> 
> If OM is married/partnered -- TELL HIS/THEIR wives/Signifcant others.
> 
> Do not hug and kiss her. She is disrespecting you. BADLY. Do not reward this behavior.
> 
> If you roll over, it will set a very bad "doormat" tone. What I would do if I were you is tell her -- "I am glad you were honest with me about not knowing whether you can stop having affairs with multiple men. I appreciate you candid honesty. However, that doesn't work for me. I refuse to live in an open marriage. So if that is your choice, I will take the appropriate actions including up to and filing for divorce. I will not let my children grow up in an environment where they think repeated adultery is ok by one of their parents."
> 
> END POINT...and WALK away. No more talking to her. You need to treat her the same way you would treat a colleague: cordial but all business-like. NO emotions whatsoever.
> 
> The thing is you NEED to back this up with actions. If you don't and you start crying and begging her to stop and pleading with her, coddling her, she is going to see right through your words, cause that is all they will be and keep doing whatever the f she wants. You need to show her you are a man who respects himself and right now she does not respect you one bit. If you do not respect yourself, nobody in the world will.
> 
> And women do not love men they don't respect. That is an unwritten rule somewhere.
> 
> Oh and one more thing:
> 
> DO NOT leave your home. If she wants to carry on with other men, SHE can leave.


:iagree::iagree:
This is almost identical situation to mine.
DO NOT LEAVE THE HOUSE. 
She has decided that you and the kids are secondary to her own desires.


----------



## lordmayhem

Jellybeans said:


> Now is NOT the time to be weak. You asked and she told you STRAIGHT UP she isn't sure if she can cut off screwing around w/ other men. Not the naswer you wanted, but she has shown you who she is so you need to believe it.
> 
> DO get tested for STDs ASAP. Who knows how many people she's been with. This is the same woman who had sex with someone at a party that YOU, her husband, were at!
> 
> If OM is married/partnered -- TELL HIS/THEIR wives/Signifcant others.
> 
> Do not hug and kiss her. She is disrespecting you. BADLY. Do not reward this behavior.
> 
> If you roll over, it will set a very bad "doormat" tone. What I would do if I were you is tell her -- "I am glad you were honest with me about not knowing whether you can stop having affairs with multiple men. I appreciate you candid honesty. However, that doesn't work for me. I refuse to live in an open marriage. So if that is your choice, I will take the appropriate actions including up to and filing for divorce. I will not let my children grow up in an environment where they think repeated adultery is ok by one of their parents."
> 
> END POINT...and WALK away. No more talking to her. You need to treat her the same way you would treat a colleague: cordial but all business-like. NO emotions whatsoever.
> 
> The thing is you NEED to back this up with actions. If you don't and you start crying and begging her to stop and pleading with her, coddling her, she is going to see right through your words, cause that is all they will be and keep doing whatever the f she wants. You need to show her you are a man who respects himself and right now she does not respect you one bit. If you do not respect yourself, nobody in the world will.
> 
> And women do not love men they don't respect. That is an unwritten rule somewhere.
> 
> Oh and one more thing:
> 
> DO NOT leave your home. If she wants to carry on with other men, SHE can leave.


:iagree:


----------



## justwow

Jellybeans, thank you for your post and advice, and thanks to everyone else who posted their advice and support. I will try and address everything you suggested.

Both other men, the one from the PA and the sexting buddy, are single, so no wives to inform.

I should get tested for STDs immediately, you are right.

You called it on the rolling over / doormat thing. I had a talk with her last night to basically her that I am not willing to spend the rest of my life with someone who can't commit to not cheating and who has no problem looking into my eyes and lying through her teeth. After I said everything I wanted to (remaining calm but firm), it was her turn to talk. She basically said she wanted to snuggle in order to share her feelings. I told her that is absolutely not going to happen and she flipped. She just doesn't get it. I revisited her unwillingness to commit to not cheating, and she confirmed to my face that she can't say it won't happen again because 'She isn't a psychic and she can't see the distant future'. What a load.

I am working on the walking away part, but as you said I am NOT leaving my home. Just not happening. I am trying to set that up in a way that will cause as little discomfort for my children as possible. As someone pointed out, she did not only cheat on me but on the kids and our family as a whole. However, my kids are innocent victims in this and I want them to feel as little pain as possible.

At the end of our discussion, she finally said how she was feeling about the situation, and she was 'slightly leaning toward divorce' also. Like I said before, I kind of feel that subconsciously that is what she wanted all along, but I'll never know that for sure. This is all extremely difficult for me, but I guess that is to be expected. I appreciate all your continued advice and support. Sorry if it sounds like I am leaning on all of you, but you all are telling me things that I need to hear, and I cannot thank you all enough.


----------



## baldmale

She is in fantasy land. It's your job to be strong for yourself and your kids. Your wife is gone gone gone. Rational discussions with her are not possible right now, so don't try to have one. 

I look back on some of my talks with my wife in the days after d-day and I think "what a waste of breath." You need to take action. Don't cry, beg, or plead. No ILY's and please stop types of talks. Even "think of your kids" won't work. WW's knew what they were risking when they got involved with other people, yet they cheated anyway. You reminding them at this point won't do any good.

I was firm and clear with my WW. And strong. I told her that she had 3 days (new year's was coming) to stop all contact, become totally transparent, come home (i asked her to leave), and commit to the marriage. Otherwise, I was filing divorce paperwork. And I would have. Btw, filing is not the same thing as being divorced, but it sends a clear signal that you are not option B, and that you won't tolerate her cheating ways. The second day I gave her a schedule of visitation for our daughter until the court figures out custody. I told her that I hoped she chose her family, but that I can only control my own actions...and adios if that's what she wanted.

She snapped out of it quick. And came home remorseful. You gotta find a way to snap her back, otherwise this present day hell will linger and linger while she cake-eats; has her family with boyfriends on the side. I recommend drawing a line in the sand so you're not posting on here months from now about her fence-sitting ways. PUSH HER OFF THE FENCE, at the risk of her NOT landing on your side.

THIS IS HER FAULT. SHE HAS RISKED HER FAMILY. AND POOR BABY NEEDS TO STOP NOW IF SHE IS TO HAVE ANY HOPE OF RETURNING TO HER FAMILY.

good luck. hang in there.


----------



## justwow

baldmale, thanks for your comment and support. You are right, I need to be firm. I think taking action is the right thing to do. The only thing is...If I push her off the fence so to speak, I am pretty sure I DON'T want her landing on my side. Feels kind of cold to say, but that's how I feel. She has already told me pretty clearly that she cannot commit to not cheating again, and as I told her, that is an absolute deal breaker for me. I am not willing to deal with this the rest of my life, or give my children the impression that this type of behavior is going to be okay when they are grown up.

Another big thing for me is the (in my eyes) absolute lack of remorse. Aside from the initial "Sorry, WTF do you want me to say?" she has yet to even apologize for this, much less beg for me not to divorce her. She has made her position clear in my eyes. Even if I was willing to stay in a relationship where I am guaranteed to be cheated on (I am NOT willing, as I would imagine none of you would either), I am also not willing to contract an STD that she brings home from a fling. Even taking my wishes out of the equation, that is risking the life of my children's father, and I can't do that.


----------



## baldmale

She isn't remorseful right now because she is still actively involved. She can't guarantee it won't happen in the future because she is still actively involved. These things would likely change if she STOPS and chooses you and her family. 

Don't bother even listening to what she says. It's likely untrue anyway or at least so colored by her affair lens that she won't even recognize herself when she looks back on this time. An alien has taken over her body and mind...get HER back and you can recover. Your job is to get that alien out of your wife.


----------



## justwow

Believe me, I am trying to believe that an alien has taken over her mind. It just feels like that alien has always been there. She has cheated in every relationship she has ever been in, and while I feel like I may have been a fool for thinking that our love was so strong that it wouldn't happen to me, I think I would be a bigger fool for thinking that it is not a virtual lock to happen again, especially based on her actions, and what she has told me. I do hear what you are saying, its just honestly hard to believe. Someone with a lifelong addiction to cocaine is not going to be able to quit without some SERIOUS effort on their part, and she is not willing to put forth that effort. I know that's kind of a crummy comparison, but it's the best I could come up with at the moment. Thanks for talking to me, btw, it helps.


----------



## baldmale

You're right, she can't just stop, come home, and carry on like she has before. Some major changes will be required; I think the marriagebuilders site calls them "extraordinary precautions." She would have to act in a way that is much different to how she has in the past. Of course now she would not consider it because she IS addicted to the fantasy.

To go with your drug addiction analogy, there are success stories there. People who were on coke can stop...they may always be "recovering addicts," but work everyday to stay clean and in recovery. But your wife needs to get into rehab and detox first, then each day work to stay clean and move your joint recovery forward. 

Maybe she needs a rock-bottom before she's willing to do that work. Maybe she'll have a moment of clarity based on your actions and start the process. She can get there though. People are the sum of their choices. She CAN choose to stop and commit to you and her family (for life). Or you can choose to file for divorce.

Back to work, will check in later. GL


----------



## alphaomega

Listen to these people. They know what they are talking about.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## justwow

I agree, people with drug addictions can stop, most certainly. However, they have to be 100% willing to stop, and willing to change anything and everything to do so. In my eyes, she is not. She has already confirmed to me that she is leaning towards divorce. A couple months ago when she told me about the PA, she said she was willing to change everything / do anything to make it better. That was obviously BS. I feel that I have an overwhelming amount of evidence staring me in the face saying that this is not going to change. At this point I feel that my best choice is to follow Jellybeans' advice a couple of posts back and do everything I can to protect myself and my kids. To me, that means separating with her leaving the house, and preparing for D. Seriously sucks the big one to even believe that this is possible, but I didn't make this choice.

I do want to make clear how much I appreciate your opinions, suggestions, etc, as well as those from everyone else. I just want you to know that I am only saying what I feel, and not that someones opinions are wrong. After her wanting to quit MC twice after two visits max, her statements that she will not commit to me only, her past history, her history with me, her lack of remorse, her leaning towards divorce herself, etc., I just really feel like there is no hope for her to be faithful. Perhaps that is normal to feel in my situation, but I just feel like it is the blunt truth, and honestly I feel weird that I am not in some sort of denial about it right now.


----------



## alphaomega

She may have meant it months ago. But you swept it under the rug too easily. Now, she knows you will roll over and tolerate anything she dishes out. Show her how wrong that logic is.

God! Kids or no....as soon as she said "...don't know if I can stop".... I would have said..."well, I can see the future clearly, and it doesn't include you in it anymore.". You need to shock her back to reality. Show your boundaries. Also....get rid of the fear of losing her. You should never fear this. I did....but after my separation I realized two weeks later life was much much better than dealing with an SO in the fog, blaming me for the affair.

Go read about manning up and nice guys in the men's forum. You will benefit from this.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## justwow

Thanks alpha, I'll go read those right now. Matter of fact, I am not afraid of losing her at this point. Not one bit, unless I'm in denial about it. The fact that she said she doesn't know if she can stop (which means she won't as far as I'm concerned) is kind of refreshing. I don't feel that I have the guesswork that most people in my situation would have. You know, 'will she get better' or 'can she ever change'... stuff like that. I feel the answer is pretty obvious, and so is the action that I should take.

I feel at this point my best and only option is to be firm, not give an inch, stick to my guns and take necessary steps to move on with my life such as separating and D. I'm not willing to go through this again, and thats a fact. I'll go read those posts you mentioned now, thanks.


----------



## Jellybeans

Good. Remain that way--unafraid of losing her.

SHE is the one who should be afraid of losing YOU. 

Never forget that. You have done nothing wrong.


----------



## Looking_Goggles

justwow said:


> Believe me, I am trying to believe that an alien has taken over her mind. It just feels like that alien has always been there. *She has cheated in every relationship she has ever been in*, and while I feel like I may have been a fool for thinking that our love was so strong that it wouldn't happen to me, I think I would be a bigger fool for thinking that it is not a virtual lock to happen again, especially based on her actions, and what she has told me. I do hear what you are saying, its just honestly hard to believe. Someone with a lifelong addiction to cocaine is not going to be able to quit without some SERIOUS effort on their part, and she is not willing to put forth that effort. I know that's kind of a crummy comparison, but it's the best I could come up with at the moment. Thanks for talking to me, btw, it helps.


Don't want to beat up on you, but the Bolded statement pretty much sets how this is going to play out, she's not going to stop & you can't force her to stop. (You can do everything within your power to make it hard/not subsidize it, but you can't stop what she isn't willing to stop). You have my sincere sympathy, you've got a rough road ahead of you.

Many of the links they suggested seem to be good, as I can't give much advice on the details of how to deal with this from personal experience. But I can give one or two words of advice on some specific topics.

1) Get yourself to a lawyer. You're in CA, so it's a community property state (so that means divorce is going to suck bad for both of you), but you can get raped in the courts if you aren't prepared. You need to defend yourself & the kids, which means being ready to drop the hammer if it comes to that. Even if you want to stay committed to the relationship, you *HAVE* to protect yourself, as she isn't going to.

2) You're eventually going to end up in an ultimatum situation: her flings OR you + kids. These really are the only two options, but right now she wants both and she's basically getting both. There's some really good people on these forums that can help with that & some books that would help a lot.

3) She has made her choices, your only option is how you respond & carry yourself. But that doesn't mean you should not be changing yourself. You will need to deal with the issues of your own searching for others early in the marriage & why you made a decision to marry an unfaithful wife. These issues both have huge consequences for you & your children. They will need to be addressed, but can be in time, after the initial triage.

Now, this one might not be straight up advice, more just brain storming, but if it comes to the ultimatum point, why should you have to leave? She can leave (or you can kick her out) and keep the kids in their own home. She's the one making the decisions to wreck the marriage, she shouldn't benefit from the situation.

I don't envy your situation, but you need to be ready for all possibilities and ready to respond properly. You've got a lot of work ahead of you, to which I can only say "Godspeed" and get to reading up everything possible and do what's necessary for you & the kids.


----------



## justwow

Beans, thanks for all your support. I am going to remain strong and move forward.

LG, thanks for your support. Believe me, I don't take it as you beating up on me. The things someone needs to hear very often are not easy. I appreciate you saying what needs to be said. As for the points you addressed...

1. My father is a lawyer and works for the county we live in. Couldn't ask for a much better legal situation than that. I do hope that we can agree on terms as much as possible outside of court, and I think that for the most part that will be possible. However, I have read some of Jellybeans' posts and am aware that cheaters who wouldn't stop and were for divorce can tend to go nuts when said divorce starts to become a reality. While I consider myself hopeful in this area, I am preparing for the worst.

2. I feel that she has made her choice already, and chose flings. That is an extremely f'n stupid and selfish decision to make, but she made it and not me. As such, as I start to move forward with this whole thing I don't think it possible for me to accept an 'I've changed my mind I want you back' from her, which may or may not come. Am I being to cold to have made up my mind on this subject already? It just seems that once people are going through this they will say just about anything to make it stop and go back to the easy, comfortable life. That has been confirmed on this site by reading what everyone else has gone through.

3. Something I definitely have to look at. I had no self esteem really when we got together, and I was blind. That is no longer the case. Nevertheless, this is definitely something to look at.


----------



## justwow

Well, I am going to my parents house tonight after work to tell them about this. They don't know about the earlier PA or the most recent cheating. I don't imagine they will be happy. Unlike my wife's side of the family, my parents care very much for both of us, which is probably why my wife asked me to not tell them. Well, I agreed last time. Not this time. My wife is going to absolutely flip when she finds out I told them, but I don't care. I am doing what I think is right this time. They would have to know sooner or later...might as well be now.

Their first concern will be the kids, which is good. However, they are also of the opinion that when kids are involved divorce is bad, unless something truly serious is going on like abuse. I agree that divorce should always be taken seriously, especially when kids are involved, but sometimes there are other issues that can prove to be serious and negative as well, such as this one. I am quite terrified at the moment to be honest.


----------



## Runs like Dog

Is it still cheating when you know about it, she knows you know about it and she doesn't stop? I think that's called balling lots of other random guys. You're way past 'cheating'.


----------



## justwow

Didn't know what else to call it. You're absolutely right though. She has made her position known, and I am done. I am not married to be the second guy in her life (or third or fourth).


----------



## unbelievable

You can't stop her from cheating but you can stop her from cheating on you.


----------



## Entropy3000

Runs like Dog said:


> Is it still cheating when you know about it, she knows you know about it and she doesn't stop? I think that's called balling lots of other random guys. You're way past 'cheating'.


Ouch. Good point.


----------



## Wolf359

justwow, You are doing the right thing, I know you are. One thing I would like to know, is what was her home life like as a kid ? I ask this thinking, if it's a genetic in her family or a learned thing. Also one very, very important thing is to make copy's of this site and all other evidence of her cheating (include your feelings and maybe a voice recording of you talking about why you are doing the things in the relation ship, like you are. It will help 10 - 15 years down the road when your kids ask why you did what you did. Also you need to expose to your and her family's and friends. I think I might try to find out who the guy is, and expose to there family as well. You may ask why bother, well it's the right thing to do. So the next guy my have a fighting chance, if she gets inbarest a little.


----------



## morituri

Here's something for you to consider conveying to her the next time you talk to her (if you haven't done this already):

*"You and I share different moral value systems when it comes to marriage. For you it is totally acceptable to have a one-sided open marriage where you get to sleep with any man anytime you want but is unacceptable for me to do the same. I on the other hand, find it totally unacceptable to have either of us have extra-marital affairs. So due to this chasm between core beliefs that separates us, I have no choice but to end the marriage and move on with my life. Hopefully in time I will meet another woman who will share my core beliefs of marriage and together we will be able to form a true marriage"*


----------



## Jellybeans

morituri said:


> here's something for you to consider conveying to her the next time you talk to her (if you haven't done this already):
> 
> *"you and i share different moral value systems when it comes to marriage. For you it is totally acceptable to have a one-sided open marriage where you get to sleep with any man anytime you want but is unacceptable for me to do the same. I on the other hand, find it totally unacceptable to have either of us have extra-marital affairs. So due to this chasm between core beliefs that separates us, i have no choice but to end the marriage and move on with my life. Hopefully in time i will meet another woman who will share my core beliefs of marriage and together we will be able to form a true marriage"*


say this and back it up with actions!


----------



## justwow

Thanks everyone for all your comments and help.

Wolf359, the latest OM is single and knows she is married, so there isn't much to tell there. Also, her family knows about all this, so there isn't anyone to tell there. I told my parents last night, I'll get to that in a sec. As far as her behavior, her parents divorced about 7 or 8 years ago because her mom cheated on her dad at the beginning of their marriage and waited 20 years to tell him. When he found out he divorced her. She has also cheated in her relationships. I would guess that is part of it, perhaps a big part, is because her mom / sisters more or less support her cheating, and the sisters do it as well. Classy bunch.

I talked to my parents last night, the ones who are almost ALWAYS against divorce. They said...they would support my decision to get a divorce, and my dad is checking with some people to get me a lawyer. Wow...never thought that would happen in a million years. So he is going to get me a lawyer to talk to and ask all the questions I have.

My wife was way pissed when I told her that I told my parents. She said "I am not going to keep any of your secrets anymore and air all your dirty laundry to them too!". She said she won't hold back with my mom anymore, and they do see each other all the time because my parents love their grand kids. As if my parents should be made to suffer in any way, shape, or form because my wife cheated? What a big f'ing mess this is gonna be. 

I was hoping that we could decide how to handle everything out of court (as much as legally possible anyway) to minimize stress and pain for everyone involved. I am still hoping for that, but I am bracing myself for a total sh!tstorm. What a mess.


----------



## Squiffy

LOL... she is pissed that you told your OWN parents? Does she think you are going to lie to them??? And now she wants to 'get you back' for telling them? Hmmmm.... Not sure what that says about her, I guess she is clearly more worried about herself than anyone else. 

I wish you all the best for the road ahead, and hope that you will be able to sort it out once all the initial fuss has died down.


----------



## justwow

Thanks Squiffy. Yeah, I have come to terms that none of this is going to make much sense. I mean, we have two wonderful kids. We are going to have to be civil forever for their sake, even if we don't want to sometimes. I just don't want being civil to be one sided. Oh well, I guess there really isn't much that I can do at this point other than to press forward and keep doing what I am doing.


----------



## lordmayhem

justwow said:


> My wife was way pissed when I told her that I told my parents. She said "I am not going to keep any of your secrets anymore and air all your dirty laundry to them too!". She said she won't hold back with my mom anymore, and they do see each other all the time because my parents love their grand kids. As if my parents should be made to suffer in any way, shape, or form because my wife cheated? What a big f'ing mess this is gonna be.


Her sense of *entitlement *is simply amazing. She screws around on you multiple times, rubbing it in your face, yet she expects you to take her secret to the grave or something to that effect. She can't stand that her good girl image is about to take a major hit.

The apple sure doesn't fall far from the tree as far as her family is concerned. Did you know about her family history before you met her? 

Anyway, the mess was inevitable the moment that your WW wouldn't stop her cheating ways. Like mother, like daughter/sisters. The only thing you can do is stay strong for yourself and your kids.


----------



## justwow

Mayhem, yes I knew about her ways soon after we started dating. She told me. However, I thought that since we were in love, yada, yada, yada, BS, BS. Stupid I know. You're right, her sense of entitlement is indeed mind boggling.

Hearing that she wasn't going to stop her cheating, or wouldn't make a commitment to do so, was pretty devastating. However, there was a very small part of me that was relieved. If she had promised to stop, I doubt I would have believed it. Confirming that she won't stop was what I thought anyway, I just was surprised that she said it. Sure don't see any way around a D at this point, as fixing a marriage takes two, and by my count we would be one short.


----------



## justwow

So we are one hundred percent headed to divorce. Talked about it last night. Luckily, it sounds like we are going to be pretty civil (in comparison to those that duke it out in court anyway) about it for the kids sake. She already agreed to 50/50, and it sounds like we should be able to work the rest out before we even get to mediation.

However, my stbxw is just becoming more and more evil. She found the numbers of the divorce lawyers in my phone last night, and asked what it was for. I told her, divorce, flat out. She was only worried about me trying to take full custody of the kids. She is fairly happy about the divorce. She even walked outside to have a smoke and CALL THE OM to tell him!!! Are you f'n serious? She now admits she never broke off contact with him. I said, 'So know that you know we are getting a divorce you are making plans to have d!ck waiting for you when we're done?' and she seriously said 'Hell Yeah!'. Just...wow. Also last night she was talking about this person with a giddy smile on her face, saying how he is 'more mature' and 'more fun'. I took in a single mom with a three year old (four years ago) because I loved them, and he is more mature???

I don't think I have ever felt so miserable. I just want this divorce to be done yesterday. I think the only reason I've kept it together (mostly) is because our papers aren't signed, and I don't want her to reneg on her agreement with the kids. Plus, I am going to have to see her for the rest of my life for the kids sake. Life blows ATM.

I also told her that I am not willing to live with a woman that is continuing an affair, so she needs to make plans now to GTFO. She has surgery (hysterectomy) scheduled for June 10th, and she won't be able to do heavy lifting for a while afterwards. I don't think it's realistc for her to leave before then, and I don't want to abruptly disrupt the lives of my kids either. Is waiting until after she heals too long to give her the boot? Again, I am willing to be patient until the papers are signed for the sake of my kids.

It's hard to believe that I was such a bad judge of character. Maybe I was blinded by love or something. I just don't know how to feel right now


----------



## Jellybeans

justwow said:


> She even walked outside to have a smoke and CALL THE OM to tell him!!! Are you f'n serious? She now admits she never broke off contact with him. I said, 'So know that you know we are getting a divorce you are making plans to have d!ck waiting for you when we're done?' and she seriously said 'Hell Yeah!'.


Don't do this anymore. Talking about OM. Talking about anything other than your kid and the divorce. Those are the only two things you should be discussing.

Did you file already? See a lawyer STAT. NO MORE talking to her about anything ok??? Get whatever you agreed on in writing fast before she renegs.


----------



## justwow

Beans, I have an appointment with a highly recommended D lawyer on Monday morning to talk about everything. You're right, it was a mistake to even listen to her talk about the OM, it won't serve any purpose besides inflaming the situation. What about the moving out thing. I want her out, but I don't want to rapidly displace my kids. This is going to suck badly enough for them as it is. More than anything, I don't want to push the issue until the papers are signed, cause I don't want her to get pissed off and reneg.


----------



## Jellybeans

Whatever you do, DO NOT MOVE OUT!!!!!!!!!!!!! 

Again, at this point, you are going to treat her like a co-worker: cordial but all-business. 

NO emotions.


----------



## justwow

Believe me, I am not moving out. She knows that she is the one that will be leaving. I am just wondering if I should push for it to happen ASAP, or leave it be until the paperwork is signed. I am strongly leaning towards the latter.


----------



## mikey11

justwow said:


> She has cheated in every relationship she has been in, and apparently this one is no different.


did you know this before you got married?

if so, that should have been a big red flag


----------



## justwow

Mikey, you're right, it should have. However, I blindly fell in love and, well, this is how it turned out.


----------



## Jellybeans

Well youo've already told her straight up she needs to GTFO so she knows she's not appreciated in the home. 

Do you rent/own? Is her name on anything? Right now, she knows what you've said. Let her dig her own hole. I would not press further if I were you. Just try to keep away from her as much as you can.

I would DEFINITELY get to your lawyer on Monday no matter waht and have it signed ,sealed, delivered (whatever it is that you're filing). Waste no time.


----------



## justwow

Thanks Beans. We rent from my parents, so her name is not on a lease or anything. Despite her knowing she is unwanted at the home, she is lazy and will not leave without a swift kick in the hindparts, partially cause it's easy and partially because she doesn't have many options on where to go. I think that you are right not to push the issue right now. Thanks (everyone) for talking to me, this all just sucks the big one.


----------



## Eli-Zor

Get her out now and do not worry about her operation, it's her problem, her FB can start filling the gap. File for full custody and include in the initial separation agreement that your child is not to be exposed to the OM or other men, it is done frequently in such agreements. When she is out set up a schedule and cut off all contact with her, any future contact is via a trusted intermediary and is only about the child or the schedule. Buy a VAR and carry it on you at all times, record the conversations and protect yourself. Keep the finances firmly split and she pays half of all existing bills.

Be tough and look after your family and you, let her fall down on her own.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## justwow

I hear you Eli, it's just tough because she would have nowhere to go atm, and while that's fine for me that would affect the kids big time. She has no job, and therefore no money. I am pretty terrified that if I did some of that she would reneg on her agreement to go to mediation and have 50/50 custody. I will be talking about all this with my attorney, but I REALLY don't want to put the kids through a violent court battle if I can avoid it. They didn't sign up for any of this. I truly understand the need to be strong and firm right now, but I want to do that without traumatizing my kids further. Despite the fact that this is all her fault, I am trying to be responsible as possible for my kids.


----------



## Eli-Zor

You are at war, your goal is to get full custody of your children, she has chosen her route let her sink, stop being a nice guy and stop supporting her. It is not her decision for a 50/50 custody it is the courts, get your lawyer to fight for you. Why would even want to consider the OM having your kids half the time, it will be far worse later if you let this slide now.As long as she talks to the OM she does not stay with you. 

Firm up, smile but be unrelenting in your journey.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## justwow

Well, I certainly don't have a problem with a clause or something that prevents her from taking the kids around the OM, but if we go straight to court that means no mediation. No mediation means that there is no way I am going to be happy afterwards, since the judge will decide what's right, not me. I totally agree with her bouncing, since she won't stop with the OM.

It's just...If we go straight to court instead of mediation, I can guarantee you that the kids will suffer more than they are going to now. Believe me, the fact that I am considering all these things (letting her stay til after the operation, mediation, etc) is based SOLELY on the fact that I care about my kids. I am going to have to deal with her for the rest of my life for the kids, and I truly believe that if we get into a super nasty battle the kids will suffer from it. Thanks for talking to me about all this. It is nice to hear opinions sometimes that are not exactly what I am thinking. I appreciate all the continued conversation and support.


----------



## sexuallyfustrated

justwow said:


> Jellybeans, when I met her she was single, so she did not cheat on her last man with me. And yes, I was walking between the party and my in laws house but she screwed him sometime while I was there, or at least around.
> 
> POMS, To be honest I don't know what I want. I guess in a perfect world I would want to be with the mother of my kids in a faithful relationship and have the best family possible. However, based on my knowledge of her past cheatings, both with me and other people, I just can't see it. Even if she were to tell me today right here and now that she will never have any inappropriate contact, verbal, physical or whatever with another guy, I wouldn't be able to bring myself to believe it. Perhaps that is my own character defect saying that, I just believe it is the reasonable, logical, brutally honest side of me saying that. I listed my own shortcoming in my original post to acknowledge that I am not perfect, but I don't feel that I should have to live a life being my wife's private investigator. If there is any hope that we can live a faithful life together, please tell me, as I would love to hear it. However, I want honest replies, which is what all of you have given me, so I truly thank you.
> 
> Let me just add these two text messages we just exchanged:
> 
> Me: Can you even say honestly that you think this will stop? Honestly.
> 
> Her: I can't say for sure but I can definitely try my hardest to stop Hun!
> 
> What?!? You can't even make a committment to me that you won't cheat again? Are you freakin kidding me? Am I overreacting, or just seeing this for what it is? Thanks for the help, every post really helps, and that is the truth.[/QUOT
> 
> I read the different post/threads on this site to help me and to ensure myself that I am not alone however everytime I do my heart goes out thosee who are enduring betrayal.
> 
> I'm a straight shooter and I am going through my own betrayal with my husband so I am not judging at all.
> IT'S NEVER GOING TO END!!! EVER!!!!
> This woman has no respect for you, your family or your marriage. This woman has no respect for her self or she would not cheat on every man she's with with any man in site.
> 
> If you want and believe that change is possiable than by all means I'll never take that away from you...PRAY PRAY AND PRAY some more. But I think you know exactly what you need to do for your own sanity. She doesn't seem worth what you want to give. And to me thats what every betrayed person here wants. Honesty, faithfullness, support, respect and unconditional love.
> Good luck!!


----------



## Shooboomafoo

In my state, even after intial hearing, the judges refer you to mediation to work out the details. For the main reason to keep from doing so himself/herself. The more you work things out on your own the less they will have to tie up the courts doing so. 
Leaving it to the judge and they will throw their hands up in the air and call "Standard Possession orders", and you get every other weekend and one night per week. Unless you have some provable case in terms of her being an unfit mother, and unfortunately infidelity is nothing. My brother walked into his house asking his step son where mommy was, and the little boy said " shes in the bedroom with "A-hole OM name here).
The only thing that got him full custody was after the custody evaluator saw the closet his kids were sleeping in at the OMs house, and the physical assault my brothers ex committed on him.
Do the best you can with what you can, and remember that it can allllll be modified later, when finances tighten up, and you are standing back on your own two feet. Nothing is permanent.


----------



## justwow

That's what I am afraid of. She has already said she is okay with 50/50, and if I were to try and get full custody we would be in court for sure, and like you said, I would end up with one day a week and every other weekend. Infidelity matters a lot to me, but doesn't mean a damn thing in court. I am pretty confident that we can work everything out in mediation, but if I start pushing for full custody and telling her to GTFO immediately, that will go out the window. I am really leaning towards being patient until the paperwork is signed and approved by the judge, or as soon as I can without her retaliating in court. Doesn't mean I am going to speak to her in the meantime about anything besides the kids though.


----------



## turnera

justwow said:


> She basically said she wanted to snuggle in order to share her feelings.


Translation: I was raised to use my sexuality to get what I want. Come closer so I can manipulate you.


----------



## justwow

Yup, pretty much. That's exactly what I got of it. Or, she was feeling uncomfortable and wanted to hold me to make it more comfortable for her to tell me why she decided to destroy our marriage.

On the subject of sex, I am having a really difficult time going from regular sex to no sex. I know this is something that everyone going through a D has to deal with, but I didn't realize how much it was going to suck. What the heck to do? And before anyone suggests, DIY helps but as we all know it ain't the same .


----------



## turnera

justwow said:


> It's just...If we go straight to court instead of mediation, I can guarantee you that the kids will suffer more than they are going to now.


Why? What exactly does this mean to you?


----------



## turnera

justwow said:


> That's what I am afraid of. She has already said she is okay with 50/50, and if I were to try and get full custody we would be in court for sure, and like you said, I would end up with one day a week and every other weekend. Infidelity matters a lot to me, but doesn't mean a damn thing in court. I am pretty confident that we can work everything out in mediation, but if I start pushing for full custody and telling her to GTFO immediately, that will go out the window.


 Your lawyer can prevent this from happening.


----------



## turnera

justwow said:


> On the subject of sex, I am having a really difficult time going from regular sex to no sex. I know this is something that everyone going through a D has to deal with, but I didn't realize how much it was going to suck. What the heck to do? And before anyone suggests, DIY helps but as we all know it ain't the same .


 Seriously? We're going on day 2 and you're suffering? You'd better start changing your mindset, jw.

Oh, and get a spiral notebook and write out a complete timeline of everything she has done, from day of marriage to today. Keep it updated. You may need it in court.


----------



## Jellybeans

justwow said:


> On the subject of sex, I am having a really difficult time going from regular sex to no sex. I know this is something that everyone going through a D has to deal with, but I didn't realize how much it was going to suck. What the heck to do? And before anyone suggests, DIY helps but as we all know it ain't the same .


I know sex is wonderful but you need to be more worried about your kid and your relationship's disintegration. You will get laid again, I promise. (Just don't get laid by your wife--it's weird typing that). LOL.


----------



## Pit-of-my-stomach

justwow said:


> On the subject of sex, I am having a really difficult time going from regular sex to no sex. I know this is something that everyone going through a D has to deal with, but I didn't realize how much it was going to suck.


You have no idea. lol. Actually maybe u do or will...

I have not had sex in 2 years!!! I have not kissed a women in 2 years!!!

That is WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY past unbelievable.


----------



## justwow

Don't worry, the sex thing was just a little outburst, just a small temper tantrum.

Tunera, I just know that in mediation we work things out together as much as possible. That way we both leave as happy as possible, knowing what the outcome would be beforehand. This would also prevent us bickering in court, which would cause more resentment between us that I would be afraid of. I am afraid that the kids would pick up on stuff like that. Please correct me if I am wrong tho, as I've never done any of this before.


----------



## sexuallyfustrated

She is fairly happy about the divorce. She even walked outside to have a smoke and CALL THE OM to tell him!!! Are you f'n serious? She now admits she never broke off contact with him. I said, 'So know that you know we are getting a divorce you are making plans to have d!ck waiting for you when we're done?' and she seriously said 'Hell Yeah!'. Just...wow. Also last night she was talking about this person with a giddy smile on her face, saying how he is 'more mature' and 'more fun'.

F her thats just cruel!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## turnera

They may pick up on it for a week or two, but the more important goal should be to ensure the best outcome for them in the long term. Do you envision your wife becoming promiscuous in the future, having many men over? If so, they may be better off with YOU in the main home. Things like that to consider.


----------



## findingmyway

Think of how much better off you will be without her. She would certainly not stop.


----------



## ForTheWin

Use every bit of restraint you have to be calm, and smile around her, but immediately get a lawyer and tell him (or her) you want to divorce your wife. Listen to his/her advice. Do not vilify the mom to the kids. Be calm, stay within the law. Do not pursue trying to find all the details of the cheating, because it will only make more questions (trust me). Move on. There are other women out there that do not have an inclination to cheat. Later, when you heal, you can find one of them. Good luck brother.


----------



## Roselyn

You are represented by an attorney. Listen to what she/he has to say to you. Don't be a wet noodle to your cheating wife. She has manipulated and cheated on you. She has no respect for you. Accept that she is an unremorseful serial cheater.

You must move on. See a psychologist to set your mind straight. You need to heal. Sorry you are here.


----------



## Vulcan2013

Zombie thread! 2011


----------



## bandit.45

Oooooooo. Someone is being naughty.


----------

