# Bachelor parties and strip clubs



## Tomara (Jun 19, 2013)

My fiancé’s son will be getting married soon. My fiancé casually stated something about visiting strip clubs might be on the agenda for his sons party. Not that he would be the one taking everyone but would be there if it happened.

Without missing a beat, I said that was a hard NO for me and our relationship. He knows how my relationship with my ex was so it shouldn’t be a surprise that I feel this way.

I explained that it was his choice to make. If he goes then there will be no marriage for us in December. 

Am I just being a ***** about it or should I find a way to accept it if I could????




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## OnTheFly (Mar 12, 2015)

Is it common for the Dad to hang out with the kid for the stag?

Seems odd, but I haven't gone on any of these lately.

You have a hard boundary. 

Seems reasonable.


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## Volunteer86 (Aug 2, 2017)

I don't know your past so that sounds like it is part of your reasoning. I don't see the big problem as he was upfront and honest about it and not much that can't be seen on a computer or watching porn. I think my biggest issue is that he may or may not be going with his son. I didn't catch if he was going with him or it may happen. But as a father even on his bachelor party I wouldn't want to think I was helping expose him into anything like that. I have saw some dance clubs just as wild as strip clubs. Now if you had a problem with it in your past and he knows that he should either not go or not go to that part of the party. He should respect your answer though if you tell him you have a problem with that then he shouldn't but that is just me...


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## Prodigal (Feb 5, 2011)

Tomara said:


> Am I just being a ***** about it or should I find a way to accept it if I could????


I don't think you should attempt to accept it. You've set a boundary. Don't compromise. You've stated no wedding will occur if your fiancé goes to the stag party. If you back down, I doubt he'll take you seriously if any either/or situations occur in the future. Boundaries are for you, and what you will and will not accept.

JMO.


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## Tomara (Jun 19, 2013)

OnTheFly said:


> Is it common for the Dad to hang out with the kid for the stag?
> 
> 
> 
> ...




In this part of the country it’s normal to go with on the bachelor party. I am assuming it will be a big drunk feast and we all know that drinking can make us behave in ways we would not normally. 


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## personofinterest (Apr 6, 2018)

This is your boundary. The fact that your boundary will trigger some people on here is not relevant. It is your boundary, and you have stated it clearly. Now your fiance just has to decide if it's more important to marry you or more important to watch naked ladies dancing.


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## StillSearching (Feb 8, 2013)

Tomara said:


> My fiancé’s son will be getting married soon. My fiancé casually stated something about visiting strip clubs might be on the agenda for his sons party. Not that he would be the one taking everyone but would be there if it happened.
> 
> Without missing a beat, I said that was a hard NO for me and our relationship. He knows how my relationship with my ex was so it shouldn’t be a surprise that I feel this way.
> 
> ...


Perfectly reasonable.
Be clear, don't waver.


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## wilson (Nov 5, 2012)

I think it's reasonable for you to ask him not to go. I've been on bachelor parties where the dad came along for the early activities and then went home when the rest of us went to the strip club. It didn't seem like that big of deal.

I think it's important that you approach this with a reasonable perspective. A strip club is not a sex orgy. I've been many times and I find it kind of boring after about 10 minutes. "BOOBS! Boobs! boobs ...boobs. oh, the game is on TV"  So I would say don't approach it with the assumption that he's a horndog who won't be able to control himself and you can't believe he'd even consider going. But I totally support your preference that he doesn't go regardless.


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## OnTheFly (Mar 12, 2015)

Tomara said:


> In this part of the country it’s normal to go with on the bachelor party. I am assuming it will be a big drunk feast and we all know that drinking can make us behave in ways we would not normally.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


ah, ok, thx!

You're not being a ******!


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## Middle of Everything (Feb 19, 2012)

Bachelor parties do not have to be strippers and booze. And the new reaction to those of days gone by, bachelorette parties dont have to be trolling for dill and booze.

I played golf for mine. With friends. No strippers afterwards. Not even any booze really. Have done paintball with someone else at theirs. Golf for another friend. 

Have I been to stripper ones? Yes. Two. Designated driver for both. Both with family from either side. Not that fun when you are sober and in a relationship. I went out of obligation. Very meh.

Stick to your guns Tomara. Its not 1950 or so when this kind of bachelor party was expected. People can do what they want now. If that is tits and booze then I can see that being a legit problem for some. I wouldnt want my wife to go out for booze and johnson, so why should I go out for booze and naked women?


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## Tomara (Jun 19, 2013)

I have no reservations in saying the guys will be boozing it up and looking for fun. This seems to be the norm for this kind of country living. I listen to what my fiancé tells me he did when he was divorced. Very different then how I behaved while divorced.

He knows how I feel about strip clubs so I hope he makes the right decision.

I don’t mind him going out for a bit but come home when they head to naked women dancing, lap dances, and back room misbehaving!


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## Tomara (Jun 19, 2013)

Prodigal said:


> I don't think you should attempt to accept it. You've set a boundary. Don't compromise. You've stated no wedding will occur if your fiancé goes to the stag party. If you back down, I doubt he'll take you seriously if any either/or situations occur in the future. Boundaries are for you, and what you will and will not accept.
> 
> 
> 
> JMO.




I am not the type to let someone walk over me. If he goes then I will be looking for a new place to live and calling off our wedding. It took me a long time to grow at set so to speak after my divorce but once I did, I stand up for myself. 


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## CharlieParker (Aug 15, 2012)

You let him of your hard boundary, in advance. You’re right he has a choice to make. My wife never had a problem with me going to strip clubs (was semi work related) but if she did it would be an easy choice, don’t go.


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

Was he aware of your feelings on this before, or did you just spring this on him when he mentioned it? I will be interested to know how he responds.


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## dubsey (Feb 21, 2013)

I don't think you should give on your boundary if it's important to you.

But, if you're going to have a hard line, you also need to be prepared for him to think this boundary isn't appropriate, and to part ways.


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## Andy1001 (Jun 29, 2016)

Tomara said:


> I am not the type to let someone walk over me. If he goes then I will be looking for a new place to live and calling off our wedding. It took me a long time to grow at set so to speak after my divorce but once I did, I stand up for myself.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Good for you. 
It doesn’t matter what anyone else thinks, this is your boundary and nobody gets to tell you how to think. 
As an aside you could mention that the only thing more pitiful than grown men paying to watch some “dancer” take her clothes off is having their fathers with them while they do it. 
And as another aside you could offer to give him a personal “dance “ some night. 
Just sayin.


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## personofinterest (Apr 6, 2018)

I wonder what the response on here would be if a betrayed husband had the boundary that he did not want his future bride maintaining a close buddy buddy friendship with her lifelong male friend.


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## Tomara (Jun 19, 2013)

3Xnocharm said:


> Was he aware of your feelings on this before, or did you just spring this on him when he mentioned it? I will be interested to know how he responds.




He is aware that these types of behaviors are a terrible trigger for me. He knew my limits the day we became an exclusive couple. 

No cheating, no hookers, no underground New York stuff having the hell beat out of you while you watch two women get it on. 

My past was colored with pretty dark, sick colors. 






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## Rocky Mountain Yeti (Apr 23, 2017)

This is your boundary. You do not need our validation. Stand your ground.

I understand you may be a little concerned that you're being overly restrictive. That's understandable, but don't let any self doubt cloud your judgment or dissolve your resolve. 

If it's any help, I'll tell you that I've done the bachelor party thing a half dozen times and we've _never _gone to a strip club or hired strippers. I never believed the so called logic behind the "tradition," that on the eve of your dedicating your life to one woman, you should get crazy and go out of single life with a bang (possible pun intended). Rather one should be focusing on the new life and love to come. 

I'd be more interested in why this man thinks this is necessary and if/why he's willing to throw a grenade into your relationship. I recommend a heart-to-heart in which you demand he explain to you why he feels the need to do it. And don't accept the usual "everybody does it," "boys will be boys," "it's tradition," or "it really doesn't mean anything" cop outs. No... make him describe exactly what he gets out of it and how whatever that is is more meaningful than your expectation of devoted behavior in an intimate relationship. When faced with such a challenge, most guys will realize they're all wet and abandon the plan. Of course, if he gets indignant and doubles down, that'd be good to know as well.


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## Mr. Nail (Apr 26, 2011)

personofinterest said:


> I wonder what the response on here would be if a betrayed husband had the boundary that he did not want his future bride maintaining a close buddy buddy friendship with her lifelong male friend.


And Girls night outs,
And MIL moving in,
And Romance novels, 
In general we encourage everyone to have and respect boundaries, Unless they are old short men.


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## personofinterest (Apr 6, 2018)

Mr. Nail said:


> personofinterest said:
> 
> 
> > I wonder what the response on here would be if a betrayed husband had the boundary that he did not want his future bride maintaining a close buddy buddy friendship with her lifelong male friend.
> ...


 Aw, bless its heart…



I don't see any reason for any married person, male or female, to be partying it up in inappropriate places. So a girls night out that includes bar hopping and strip clubs should be a no no. But go ahead and swallow that red poll sweetie


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## CharlieParker (Aug 15, 2012)

Tomara said:


> No cheating, no hookers, no underground New York stuff having the hell beat out of you while you watch two women get it on.


Fair, fair,  (and that’s coming from a New Yorker who had his bachelor party in pre-Disney Times Square).


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## sa58 (Feb 26, 2018)

Tomara said:


> He is aware that these types of behaviors are a terrible trigger for me. He knew my limits the day we became an exclusive couple.
> 
> No cheating, no hookers, no underground New York stuff having the hell beat out of you while you watch two women get it on.
> 
> ...


Stand your ground 

The key word here is exclusive. Why does he feel
the need to go to a strip club ? How would he feel 
if you and your friends decided to have a party for 
the fiance and you? Say maybe in Vegas.


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## Tomara (Jun 19, 2013)

He would tell me to go but I am not that type. GNO for me consists of deep water aerobics twice a week with a female instructor 


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## Chuck71 (Nov 5, 2012)

Tomara said:


> He is aware that these types of behaviors are a terrible trigger for me. He knew my limits the day we became an exclusive couple.
> 
> No cheating, no hookers, no underground New York stuff having the hell beat out of you while you watch two women get it on.
> 
> ...


He knew your boundaries a long time ago. I seriously doubt he would do something to fracture

his relationship with you, especially in front of his son. But we know what large amounts of alkie

can do. So this would be called an "unneeded situation." Most of the guys I know and hang out

with...and who like to "party it up," we just go to the lake, booze it up, talk guy stuff, collect car keys.

It's like an old thread here where the guy's W went to bachelor-ette party and they all took turns

letting the male stripper stick his junk in their mouth. I'm pretty certain they got D over it.

But that was an "unneeded situation" which could have been avoided. Y'know... just like this one.


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## Mr. Nail (Apr 26, 2011)

I'm not swallowing a Red Pole.
There haven't been any red poles since Solidarity.
Mock me all you want, just don't throw me off the bus.


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## jorgegene (May 26, 2012)

Rocky Mountain Yeti said:


> This is your boundary. You do not need our validation. Stand your ground.
> 
> I understand you may be a little concerned that you're being overly restrictive. That's understandable, but don't let any self doubt cloud your judgment or dissolve your resolve.
> 
> ...


This!

I never got the bachelor party thing either. I think it's a dumb tradition. When my brother (best man) asked me if I wanted one, I said heck no!

I get that some people think it's cool, but not me.

As to your question...............stand your ground!


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## Tomara (Jun 19, 2013)

We have rarely disagreed so that was why I asked the question here. Just double checking myself I guess.

We shall see what happens in the end.


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## Middle of Everything (Feb 19, 2012)

Chuck71 said:


> It's like an old thread here *where the guy's W went to bachelor-ette party and they all took turns
> 
> letting the male stripper stick his junk in their mouth*. I'm pretty certain they got D over it.
> 
> But that was an "unneeded situation" which could have been avoided. Y'know... just like this one.


Say what?!?!

I have to tell myself there are actually people like this when I read it on the ole interwebs. I guess I should be happy to be so sheltered that stuff like that sounds fake.


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## uhtred (Jun 22, 2016)

Many years ago a good friend of mine was getting married and I was invited to the bachelor party. My wife was horrified and had images of wild orgies with prostitutes or something, and said she really didn't want me to go. So I didn't - no reason to upset her. (she was already upset after having heard some other news about me that disturbed her -though I believe I was blameless).

Anyway, turns out the bachelor party was going out for a few drinks. No hookers, no strippers, no mass intoxication. Just a few old friends getting together for a few hours. 

I would suggest to most women that they not object to their partners going. Its the sort of thing that is remembered in a negative light for a long time.


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## frusdil (Sep 5, 2013)

Chuck71 said:


> It's like an old thread here where the guy's W went to bachelor-ette party and they all took turns
> 
> letting the male stripper stick his junk in their mouth. I'm pretty certain they got D over it.
> 
> But that was an "unneeded situation" which could have been avoided. Y'know... just like this one.


Eeeewww! Really? I don't blame him for divorcing her!

Tomara, hold firm to your boundary. It's not unreasonable - not that it matters what we think, this is your boundary.


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## CraigBesuden (Jun 20, 2019)

Nothing wrong with a hard boundary. But remember that men can make boundaries, too. It’s not Biblical to ever deny a H sex without his consent...


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## CraigBesuden (Jun 20, 2019)

> I never got the bachelor party thing either. I think it's a dumb tradition. When my brother (best man) asked me if I wanted one, I said heck no!


Imagine the Wild West in the 1700s and you are about to marry your mail order bride. You are hanging out with your single guy friends, still a single man and it’s your last day of freedom....

Today you’re a fiancé in an exclusive relationship, with a bunch of guys who are married or otherwise in exclusive relationships, doing the same party. They say it’s your last day as a single man, but it really isn’t. So things can go awry.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

CraigBesuden said:


> Nothing wrong with a hard boundary. But remember that men can make boundaries, too. It’s not Biblical to ever deny a H sex without his consent...


That is a two way street with caveats, strictly by the Bible that is.


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## Tomara (Jun 19, 2013)

CraigBesuden said:


> Nothing wrong with a hard boundary. But remember that men can make boundaries, too. It’s not Biblical to ever deny a H sex without his consent...




Everyone has a boundary they don’t want crossed and should be respected. He does not lack in the sex realm. I am more outgoing and like to try new things, much more than him. I try to be careful with him because he didn’t have the ****ed up sex life I had with my ex. 


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## Tomara (Jun 19, 2013)

ConanHub said:


> That is a two way street with caveats, strictly by the Bible that is.




Amen


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## FieryHairedLady (Mar 24, 2011)

No strip bar. 

How did he respond?


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## sa58 (Feb 26, 2018)

Tomara said:


> Everyone has a boundary they don’t want crossed and should be respected. He does not lack in the sex realm. I am more outgoing and like to try new things, much more than him. I try to be careful with him because he didn’t have the ****ed up sex life I had with my ex.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


This is clearly a boundary that he knew about for a while.
This is something you have been open and honest with him 
about. He should understand and respect that. Your objection
to him doing this did not suddenly come out of the blue. If you 
or him suddenly set a new boundary then that is a different thing. 
That would be something you and him talk about and work out 
together. This is not that, he should understand that. 

One thing to remember about boundaries and things you will not
tolerate. Sometimes if you give in a little ( just once, no harm ) it can turn
into a lot more backing down in the future. 

You sound like a very loving and understanding person.
Take care , I think this will work out well for you.


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## She'sStillGotIt (Jul 30, 2016)

I respect your boundary, however, I could never tell a man what he's "allowed" to do and what he's not "allowed" to do. He's not my teenage son, he's a grown man.

I mean, it goes without saying that if he was going to a strip club with a bunch of mouth-breathers that I would want him to *respect* me enough not to act like a desperate, hormonal degenerate paying for a private dance (or whatever) back in the VIP lounge, etc. etc. It IS possible for a guy to go to a strip joint, have a few beers, enjoy the view, hand out some dollar bills, make lewd comments to his buddies, secretly wish his wife looked like the 22 year old blond with the naval piercing, and _still_ not act like a complete imbecile.

It's rare, but it does happen. :grin2:


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## ReformedHubby (Jan 9, 2013)

Middle of Everything said:


> Say what?!?!
> 
> I have to tell myself there are actually people like this when I read it on the ole interwebs. I guess I should be happy to be so sheltered that stuff like that sounds fake.


Definitely not fake. Alcohol and group thinking can go very bad , very quickly depending on the group collective Heck...group thinking is bad even without alcohol. Remember New Coke? Just tried some again yesterday....an absolute abomination. But I digress...regarding bachelor parties... in my youth I went to tame ones and I went to wild ones. I saw my brother-in-law cheat at one. I never told though. So family being there doesn't really guarantee anything.


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## ReformedHubby (Jan 9, 2013)

accidental duplicate


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## Andy1001 (Jun 29, 2016)

Chuck71 said:


> He knew your boundaries a long time ago. I seriously doubt he would do something to fracture
> 
> his relationship with you, especially in front of his son. But we know what large amounts of alkie
> 
> ...


I remember that thread but it was on Reddit. The guy helpfully provided a link to a photo of his fiancée and the male stripper, he asked people whether they thought his penis was actually in her mouth or just brushing her lips. 
His fiancée and a group of her girlfriends organized regular gno’s and always had strippers. They had a private social media page showing all the photographs but one of the girls “accidentally” put her picture on Snapchat. He got a hard time from his friends until his fiancée gave him the password to the page and all hell broke loose. 
They got back together but a lot of people divorced or split up, apparently some of the pictures left nothing to the imagination.


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## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

She'sStillGotIt said:


> I respect your boundary, however, I could never tell a man what he's "allowed" to do and what he's not "allowed" to do. He's not my teenage son, he's a grown man.
> 
> I mean, it goes without saying that if he was going to a strip club with a bunch of mouth-breathers that I would want him to *respect* me enough not to act like a desperate, hormonal degenerate paying for a private dance (or whatever) back in the VIP lounge, etc. etc. It IS possible for a guy to go to a strip joint, have a few beers, enjoy the view, hand out some dollar bills, make lewd comments to his buddies, secretly wish his wife looked like the 22 year old blond with the naval piercing, and _still_ not act like a complete imbecile.
> 
> *It's rare, but it does happen.* :grin2:


Are you sure about that?:grin2: Even partial imbeciles are lip-curling.

To be fair, I don't think she told him what to do - she advised him of the ramifications of potential actions. His decision. Otherwise, the poor baby would be claiming that he was blindsided - blindsided I tell ya. The horror.:surprise:


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## Tomara (Jun 19, 2013)

She'sStillGotIt said:


> I respect your boundary, however, I could never tell a man what he's "allowed" to do and what he's not "allowed" to do. He's not my teenage son, he's a grown man.
> 
> I mean, it goes without saying that if he was going to a strip club with a bunch of mouth-breathers that I would want him to *respect* me enough not to act like a desperate, hormonal degenerate paying for a private dance (or whatever) back in the VIP lounge, etc. etc. It IS possible for a guy to go to a strip joint, have a few beers, enjoy the view, hand out some dollar bills, make lewd comments to his buddies, secretly wish his wife looked like the 22 year old blond with the naval piercing, and _still_ not act like a complete imbecile.
> 
> It's rare, but it does happen. :grin2:




I disagree with you. It’s okay to tell how you feel and what you expect. 

It’s not okay for my future husband to go look at naked women, throw money, and act like a general jackass. 

I do want him to adult.


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## personofinterest (Apr 6, 2018)

Wow… for my bachelorette party, we all went to Dairy Queen and ate copious amounts of ice cream, then we went back to my house, watched the princess bride, and my married bridesmaids gave me some pointers on wedding night 6 lol. I was a Virgin so I was worried about it.


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## Theseus (Feb 22, 2013)

Tomara said:


> Am I just being a ***** about it or should I find a way to accept it if I could????


I think it's a little extreme, but you have the right to set your own boundaries however you want. As does he. 

But have you been to a strip club? People think it's one big orgy and it's nothing like that. People aren't having sex (except in rare cases), it's just women rubbing up against the customers, and only those customers who are paying for it. It's actually not any more contact with other people than if you were in a crowded elevator or subway car. 



Tomara said:


> I disagree with you. It’s okay to tell how you feel and what you expect.
> 
> It’s not okay for my future husband to go look at naked women, throw money, and act like a general jackass.
> 
> I do want him to adult.


If that's good with you both, then that's fine. But I couldn't handle that attitude day to day myself. I already have a mother, I don't want to be married to another one.


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## personofinterest (Apr 6, 2018)

I'm cracking up that having a boundary about one naked party means she is his mother. Talk about overblown.


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## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

Theseus said:


> I think it's a little extreme, but you have the right to set your own boundaries however you want. As does he.
> 
> But have you been to a strip club? People think it's one big orgy and it's nothing like that. People aren't having sex (except in rare cases), it's just women rubbing up against the customers, and only those customers who are paying for it. *It's actually not any more contact with other people than if you were in a crowded elevator or subway car.
> 
> ...


Damn, I've been riding the wrong elevators and subway cars because I've never once had a woman shove her tits in my face or want to grind on my lap or stick her ass in my face (nor a man). I must live in la-la land.


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## CraigBesuden (Jun 20, 2019)

Bachelorette parties where male strippers do that? Are you sure you aren’t talking about Dancing Bear porn videos?


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## ReformedHubby (Jan 9, 2013)

personofinterest said:


> I'm cracking up that having a boundary about one naked party means she is his mother. Talk about overblown.


I don't think he meant it that way...but I could be wrong. I think he was saying he wouldn't appreciate being addressed in that manner. As in mother to son scolding from his wife.


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## ReformedHubby (Jan 9, 2013)

CraigBesuden said:


> Bachelorette parties where male strippers do that? Are you sure you aren’t talking about Dancing Bear porn videos?


Yeah...I have always thought that. There are a few legendary threads around here that I think are bunk and that one is one of them. For those that don't know what it is...my friend Deformed Hubby told me that there is this dancing bear website with women and male strippers....its supposed to be "real" but its all an act and everyone is a paid performer. The videos have been circulating a while and are marketed as "real", and they have been scaring the crap out of men whose wives/girlfriends are going to bachelorette parties. I am not saying a woman wouldn't get ornery with a male stripper, but....I don't think the fairer sex would engage in it nearly as much as men do. They react to strippers much differently than we do.


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## lucy999 (Sep 28, 2014)

@Tomara what was your fiance's response?

And it's your boundary. Totally fair and no you aren't being a *****. I hope he makes the right choice!


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## CraigBesuden (Jun 20, 2019)

ReformedHubby said:


> I don't think the fairer sex would engage in it nearly as much as men do. They react to strippers much differently than we do.


That’s why it’s important to have the groom’s father at the bachelor party. If the groom is unsupervised, all hell could break loose! j/k

My brother threw my bachelor party and it included at strip club. My FIL and his FIL were both in attendance. I was smashed from a dozen shots before we got there. Nothing crazy happened. We kept throwing bills in front of my wife’s 71 yo Grandpa so that the dancing girl would focus on him, then bought him a lap dance in the VIP room. When we left, he said he’d popped a viagra and Grandma was up waiting for him. lol

We have a neighbor who is an emergency room nurse. She told us they have a certain day of the month where the ladies from that establishment come in for testing and to have their hoohaas examined. She said it’s really nasty. If all they were doing was dancing, those medical visits wouldn’t be necessary.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

ReformedHubby said:


> CraigBesuden said:
> 
> 
> > Bachelorette parties where male strippers do that? Are you sure you aren’t talking about Dancing Bear porn videos?
> ...


The problem is that at male strip clubs, you can touch the dancers. The rules are different because they don’t believe the male dancers are at risk like female dancers are. So the women can touch these guys bodies. You have to pay for a private dance to touch the **** but plenty of women are happy to pay for that (depending on the ****).

So while there are lot less male strip clubs and a lot less women going to them, it is actually different in this way. Even without a private dance, you can touch their chest, arms, legs, stomach and ass.


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## ReformedHubby (Jan 9, 2013)

Faithful Wife said:


> So while there are lot less male strip clubs and a lot less women going to them, it is actually different in this way. Even without a private dance, you can touch their chest, arms, legs, stomach and ass.


Makes sense...women customers in female strip clubs are also allowed to be more "hands on". I have seen this, but have you also found it to be true?


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## CraigBesuden (Jun 20, 2019)

When it comes to porn, strip clubs and the like, if you are religious then it’s understandable that you’d have a firmer line against that stuff. It comes with the territory.


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## CraigBesuden (Jun 20, 2019)

FaithfulWife said:


> So the women can touch these guys bodies. You have to pay for a private dance to touch the **** but plenty of women are happy to pay for that (depending on the ****)... Even without a private dance, you can touch their chest, arms, legs, stomach and ass.


Are the women allowed to perform oral on the guy or just touch his tool with her hands?

What percentage of women do that? Married and engaged women, too?


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## Tomara (Jun 19, 2013)

Theseus said:


> I think it's a little extreme, but you have the right to set your own boundaries however you want. As does he.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




How do you read I have an attitude? If I was his mother, I would say you can’t go period, I gave him a choice. You may think strip clubs are fine and dandy, that you. Keep your snarky remarks to yourself... now that’s attitude.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

CraigBesuden said:


> FaithfulWife said:
> 
> 
> > So the women can touch these guys bodies. You have to pay for a private dance to touch the **** but plenty of women are happy to pay for that (depending on the ****)... Even without a private dance, you can touch their chest, arms, legs, stomach and ass.
> ...


Just like female strip clubs, these things happen in private rooms so what is officially allowed is not the same as what happens.

There are some clubs which are literally just a dance show like the chippendales or thunder down under stuff. Those shows are truly innocent (though you may still be able to touch a dancer if he comes close enough and you put money in his banana hammock) but you would be doing this under a spot light in a crowd and you have to stay seated.

The seedy private clubs are where the nasty stuff happens.

I would say any women going to a seedy club know what goes on there and would potentially be a very naughty lady. Unless she was being dragged by friends and did not know how things really are there. How many of them get so naughty as to put their mouth on a strange ****, I have no clue. I have been to these places only a couple of times and was hiding in a corner the whole time so no strange stripper **** could get close to me. 

I went to support friends and mine were not terribly naughty but I sure saw some others being naughty.


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## Tomara (Jun 19, 2013)

personofinterest said:


> I'm cracking up that having a boundary about one naked party means she is his mother. Talk about overblown.




Hey that’s what I was thinking. Way off base.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

Tomara said:


> Theseus said:
> 
> 
> > I think it's a little extreme, but you have the right to set your own boundaries however you want. As does he.
> ...


Tomara I’m sorry for the thread jack. Wanted to say I’m all on your side.

I don’t know if I missed this but what was your fiancés response immediately when you said no, it’s not ok. Did he say oh ok honey? Or did he have a look on his face that said one way or another what he is thinking now?


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## Tomara (Jun 19, 2013)

Faithful Wife said:


> Tomara I’m sorry for the thread jack. Wanted to say I’m all on your side.
> 
> I don’t know if I missed this but what was your fiancés response immediately when you said no, it’s not ok. Did he say oh ok honey? Or did he have a look on his face that said one way or another what he is thinking now?




You are fine lol

I have not gotten a yes or no I am not going as of yet. He is well aware of how I feel due to past issues, I had hoped he understood. Shoot I hope he does understand. 


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## TheDudeLebowski (Oct 10, 2017)

This is an easy one girl. Your boundary is yours. Stick to it. Further, it's not like this is a strange or random boundary. Many women and men feel the same way you do about stripclubs. It's a very common and completely understandable boundary. I'm not even sure why you're questioning yourself on this one.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Theseus said:


> If that's good with you both, then that's fine. But I couldn't handle that attitude day to day myself. I already have a mother, I don't want to be married to another one.


Yeah, I wouldn't marry my mother either but she would have no say in regards to visiting strippers or not. My wife absolutely gets to determine the kind of man she is married to or not.

I would be angry enough to file for divorce if Mrs. C told me I wasn't her dad and went on a GNO to see strippers.


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## CraigBesuden (Jun 20, 2019)

ConanHub said:


> I would be angry enough to file for divorce if Mrs. C told me I wasn't her dad and went on a GNO to see strippers.


Fair enough. As long as it runs both ways.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

CraigBesuden said:


> Far enough. As long as it runs both ways.


No issues here. Women have always taken off their clothes for me without monetary compensation.


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## Tomara (Jun 19, 2013)

CraigBesuden said:


> Far enough. As long as it runs both ways.




Has to go both ways for a good marriage. I don’t do GNO. When I go out it’s a date with my fiancé. 


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## samyeagar (May 14, 2012)

What a timely thread.

My wife and I have very different boundaries on this topic, with mine being very close to yours. We also have very different sexualities and views on sex. Very early on in our dating, I made it clear that I had a deal breaker hard boundary when it comes to sexual contact with people who are not me. So no surprises for her.

My step daughter is getting married in September, and her bachelorette party is at the end of August. It is a destination party where they are renting a condo for several days, and the plan is to be constantly drunk the entire time. Activities include wineries, swim up bars, and strippers at the condo. Several of the women who are attending have a tendency to push boundaries and are flexible with what they consider acceptable sexual interaction while in an exclusive relationship. They are also unable to keep their damned mouths shut about such things, so anything that happens will be a secret for about 2.4 seconds. In short, this is a disaster waiting to happen.

I am not going to harp on my wife, or give warnings and ultimatums before she goes because she's an adult and knows exactly where I stand, and I have to trust her to make the right decisions.


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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

Tomara said:


> My fiancé’s son will be getting married soon. My fiancé casually stated something about visiting strip clubs might be on the agenda for his sons party. Not that he would be the one taking everyone but would be there if it happened.
> 
> Without missing a beat, I said that was a hard NO for me and our relationship. He knows how my relationship with my ex was so it shouldn’t be a surprise that I feel this way.
> 
> ...




Is that for his Stag due? Why is he inviting his dad to come with him? Or are you against your step son going to one of those?

I admit, going to strip clubs is a really poor way to spend their time but I’m not sure it should be your call to tell your fiancé how to bring up his son.


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## Rocky Mountain Yeti (Apr 23, 2017)

InMyPrime said:


> Is that for his Stag due? Why is he inviting his dad to come with him? Or are you against your step son going to one of those?
> 
> I admit, going to strip clubs is a really poor way to spend their time but I’m not sure it should be your call to tell your fiancé how to bring up his son.
> 
> ...


I missed where OP was telling fiance how to raise son... her only boundary expressed was in relation to fiance's behavior as far as I could tell.


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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

Tomara said:


> I have no reservations in saying the guys will be boozing it up and looking for fun. This seems to be the norm for this kind of country living. I listen to what my fiancé tells me he did when he was divorced. Very different then how I behaved while divorced.
> 
> He knows how I feel about strip clubs so I hope he makes the right decision.
> 
> ...




Ok if it’s about not wanting your fiancé to go to a strip club, I think it is reasonable to express your lack of enthusiasm about it...
However the fact that you have to dress it up as an ultimatum, tells me that something doesn’t seem quite right with your relationship.


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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

Andy1001 said:


> Good for you.
> 
> It doesn’t matter what anyone else thinks, this is your boundary and nobody gets to tell you how to think.
> 
> ...




Yes, I wonder if his dad is also going to be 
‘sitting in’ during their wedding night, to watch his son receive his last bj? What a weird tradition...It seems bit inappropriate.


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## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

Tomara said:


> You are fine lol
> 
> I have not gotten a yes or no I am not going as of yet. He is well aware of how I feel due to past issues, I had hoped he understood. Shoot I hope he does understand.
> 
> ...


I'm all for boundaries, and the expression and enforcement of them. Don't know what your history is that makes you believe your husband-to-be, would go make an 'ass' of himself simply by being present ... at a strip club ... for his son's bachelor party. I have no context if your husband-to-be has already demonstrated questionable behavior.

What I do know, is that if my wife-to-be decided she could determine how and where I choose to celebrate with my son for his wedding, by threatening to cancel our wedding and move out; I'd pay for the U-haul truck.

I'm not telling you that your boundary makes you a b*tch. I am saying you should be aware of the potential consequences, and perhaps even entertain what the reality may actually be, as opposed to your view of what the reality may be.

There is no doubt in my mind, that if you approached the topic with me, as laid out here ... I'd tell you to pound sand. That's the funny thing about boundaries. You tend to have and want to enforce them, after being taken advantage of.

I hope you and your SO, find a compromise that keeps each of you in the others good graces.


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## Chuck71 (Nov 5, 2012)

Andy1001 said:


> I remember that thread but it was on Reddit. The guy helpfully provided a link to a photo of his fiancée and the male stripper, he asked people whether they thought his penis was actually in her mouth or just brushing her lips.
> His fiancée and a group of her girlfriends organized regular gno’s and always had strippers. They had a private social media page showing all the photographs but one of the girls “accidentally” put her picture on Snapchat. He got a hard time from his friends until his fiancée gave him the password to the page and all hell broke loose.
> They got back together but a lot of people divorced or split up, apparently some of the pictures left nothing to the imagination.


It was on TAM......I have never read Reddit. The thread, I'm guessing is 2-3-4 yrs. old


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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

Tomara said:


> We have rarely disagreed so that was why I asked the question here. Just double checking myself I guess.
> 
> We shall see what happens in the end.
> 
> ...




He won’t go. That’s what will happen.


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## samyeagar (May 14, 2012)

InMyPrime said:


> Ok if it’s about not wanting your fiancé to go to a strip club, I think it is reasonable to express your lack of enthusiasm about it...
> However the fact that you have to dress it up as an ultimatum, tells me that something doesn’t seem quite right with your relationship.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


The difference between a boundary and ultimatum is often very subtle.

If you give the stripper and handy, I will divorce you. - Ultimatum
I cannot remain in a relationship with a person who plays with strippers. - Boundary


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## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

InMyPrime said:


> Yes, I wonder if his dad is also going to be
> ‘sitting in’ during their wedding night, to watch his son receive his last bj? What a weird tradition...It seems bit inappropriate.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


WTF kind of strip clubs do y'all go to? And in what reality do you believe that young men are actually having any kind of sex in these strip clubs prior to their nuptials?

Please see my signature for reference.


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## Rocky Mountain Yeti (Apr 23, 2017)

InMyPrime said:


> Ok if it’s about not wanting your fiancé to go to a strip club, I think it is reasonable to express your lack of enthusiasm about it...
> However the fact that you have to dress it up as an ultimatum, tells me that something doesn’t seem quite right with your relationship.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


What good is a boundary without consequences?


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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

personofinterest said:


> Wow… for my bachelorette party, we all went to Dairy Queen and ate copious amounts of ice cream,



Are you sure it was ice real cream and not some yoghurt bull**** substitute? 



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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

personofinterest said:


> I'm cracking up that having a boundary about one naked party means she is his mother. Talk about overblown.



It’s the form. No man likes to have a mother but most seem to end up with one...More importantly, no woman needs to have a husband child.
I agree with Shesstillgottits.


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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

CraigBesuden said:


> We have a neighbor who is an emergency room nurse. She told us they have a certain day of the month where the ladies from that establishment come in for testing and to have their hoohaas examined. She said it’s really nasty. If all they were doing was dancing, those medical visits wouldn’t be necessary.



What’s in them? Grandparents’ pubical hairs?
I presume the strippers do a lot of ‘jobs on the side’....



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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

CraigBesuden said:


> Are the women allowed to perform oral on the guy or just touch his tool with her hands?
> 
> What percentage of women do that? Married and engaged women, too?



What a terrible job it must be...being a male stripper. Just another day at the office, having to fight off all these eager brides-in-waiting paying to blow you...


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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

Rocky Mountain Yeti said:


> I missed where OP was telling fiance how to raise son... her only boundary expressed was in relation to fiance's behavior as far as I could tell.




I misunderstood the first post where it wasn’t clear (to me) whether the ultimatum was in relation to his son or himself. Later posts made it clear!


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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

samyeagar said:


> The difference between a boundary and ultimatum is often very subtle.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



It’s subtle but there’s still a difference...if I knew my wife wouldn’t be happy for me to go to a trip club, I wouldn’t go. If she said ‘either strip club or my club!!!’, I would probably go, just to see what happens....


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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

Rocky Mountain Yeti said:


> What good is a boundary without consequences?



Wasn’t talking about consequences.


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## Rocky Mountain Yeti (Apr 23, 2017)

InMyPrime said:


> Wasn’t talking about consequences.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I know. Hence my question.


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## Middle of Everything (Feb 19, 2012)

samyeagar said:


> What a timely thread.
> 
> My wife and I have very different boundaries on this topic, with mine being very close to yours. We also have very different sexualities and views on sex. Very early on in our dating, I made it clear that I had a deal breaker hard boundary when it comes to sexual contact with people who are not me. So no surprises for her.
> 
> ...


Swap this whole scenario with slightly more manly stuff and I think if I suggested this for a bachelor party for my son in 10+ years, I think my wife would punch me in the nuts and ask me what Ive been smoking.

For the bolded parts above, is that code for anything that isnt penetration isnt really sex and therefore isnt cheating? 

Lastly with the bolded you say they "cant keep their damned mouths shut about such things" like its a bad thing. For all involved if my wife/fiance/girlfriend/SO is sucking ****, getting eaten out, giving handjobs or just plain making out with guys at such a thing, I want to f-ing know about it.


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## TheDudeLebowski (Oct 10, 2017)

I never had a bachelor party. One of those things certain folks might regret. Like when some people settle down in their teens and later regret not living that single life and all that. 

Meh, I've done my share of partying. For some reason, a bachelor party seems kinda lame lol. How about those dudes that get a hotel room and hire a stripper. Lmao. 12 dudes getting drunk in a hotel room together with one girl who's only there to get paid. What a party lmfao!


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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

Middle of Everything said:


> Lastly with the bolded you say they "cant keep their damned mouths shut about such things" like its a bad thing. For all involved if my wife/fiance/girlfriend/SO is sucking ****, getting eaten out, giving handjobs or just plain making out with guys at such a thing, I want to f-ing know about it.



I agree. I would at least expect her to bring me back some pictures as something to jerk off to. Pornhub ain’t what it used to be anymore....



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## TheDudeLebowski (Oct 10, 2017)

Middle of Everything said:


> For the bolded parts above, is that code for anything that isnt penetration isnt really sex and therefore isnt cheating?


I'm going to guess they were talking about women who openly flirt for the attention and are maybe a little too handsy and talk about inappropriate sexual things with married men to get the ego boost and attention from them. I worked with some women who are like this. All you have to do is not feed them what they want and they leave you alone. There's a lot of guys who use them to stroke their own egos. 

I'm not talking about some innocent conversation with a hint of flirtation. I think men and women talking theres sometimes a little of that and I don't have a problem with it. I'm talking about women who will go way overboard like putting their ass up against you and going "oops" with a big smile. Rubbing their tits against your arm and going "mmmm you like that?" And similar. Just way past a casual but not sexual flirtatious comment during a conversation. Theres women who do this to men they have no real interest in, they just get a high off the attention they get from it.


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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

TheDudeLebowski said:


> I never had a bachelor party. One of those things certain folks might regret. Like when some people settle down in their teens and later regret not living that single life and all that.
> 
> 
> 
> Meh, I've done my share of partying. For some reason, a bachelor party seems kinda lame lol. How about those dudes that get a hotel room and hire a stripper. Lmao. 12 dudes getting drunk in a hotel room together with one girl who's only there to get paid. What a party lmfao!



You haven’t missed anything.
I’m actually organising one for a close friend. He’s the last ‘one of us’ to get married and we are simply planning a get away together, have a grill some steak, drink some whiskey and do some hiking/bonding. No wimmins allowed to distract ass from some manly bonding sessions!!! 
Can’t promise there won’t be any spooning though...A man’s gotta do what he’s gotta do.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

Now, I'm going to take the opposite position and add a couple comments- no rock throwing yet please.

I've been to some great bachelor parties, no, no sex or anything that one could "legalese" out of saying it wasn't sex, no worries there.

There has been strippers. I've left before strippers as a rule, but not always tbh.

And these aren't regular happenstance, very infrequent. 

On a sep note:

Yes, one can easily get sex originating at some strip clubs, if one has cash. Saying diff just isn't the case.

Never have, seen those who do.

I'm with OP, H not to ho, but she should def couch it tactfully. 

I'm aware this situation is a trigger OP, so certainly I don't know all the nuances in the relationship, I'm with you. 

Telling some men not to do something in ultimatum form can be their trigger, it's certainly mine, right or wrong.

But I'm with you, good luck!


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## TheDudeLebowski (Oct 10, 2017)

InMyPrime said:


> You haven’t missed anything.
> I’m actually organising one for a close friend. He’s the last ‘one of us’ to get married and we are simply planning a get away together, have a grill some steak, drink some whiskey and do some hiking/bonding. No wimmins allowed to distract ass from some manly bonding sessions!!!
> Can’t promise there won’t be any spooning though...A man’s gotta do what he’s gotta do.
> 
> ...


I went backpacking with my uncle one year about a decade ago. We were both underprepared and didnt watch the weather like we should have. Storm rolled in and it was freaking freezing. All our gear was soaked. Couldn't get a fire going. We spent all night cuddling under a space blanket to stay warm. Uncomfortable at first, but we had no option really so it only felt weird for a second until our warmth stopped us from shivering uncontrollably. Then it didn't feel weird anymore. Felt like we were going to live. Lol. 

No cuddling past that sir. Your wife might not like it.


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## samyeagar (May 14, 2012)

Middle of Everything said:


> Swap this whole scenario with slightly more manly stuff and I think if I suggested this for a bachelor party for my son in 10+ years, I think my wife would punch me in the nuts and ask me what Ive been smoking.
> 
> For the bolded parts above, is that code for anything that isnt penetration isnt really sex and therefore isnt cheating?
> 
> Lastly with the bolded you say they "cant keep their damned mouths shut about such things" like its a bad thing. For all involved if my wife/fiance/girlfriend/SO is sucking ****, getting eaten out, giving handjobs or just plain making out with guys at such a thing, I want to f-ing know about it.


Yeah, pretty much anything other than penetration isn't really sex, and not really full on cheating. Inappropriate, distasteful, maybe even disrespectful, but not actually cheating. And yeah, because of they way they are, I am not worried a bit about things happening and me not finding out.


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## Middle of Everything (Feb 19, 2012)

samyeagar said:


> Yeah, pretty much anything other than penetration isn't really sex, and not really full on cheating. Inappropriate, distasteful, maybe even disrespectful, but not actually cheating. And yeah, because of they way they are, I am not worried a bit about things happening and me not finding out.


Feel for ya man.

I know you cant force people to do things, but I sure as hell would ask my wife why she would want to be friends with and do things with people like that. I would wager a response of "well she's nice and a good friend to me. Doesnt do those things to me". Which would leave me still thinking why would you want to be friends with someone like that?


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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

TheDudeLebowski said:


> I went backpacking with my uncle one year about a decade ago. We were both underprepared and didnt watch the weather like we should have. Storm rolled in and it was freaking freezing. All our gear was soaked. Couldn't get a fire going. We spent all night cuddling under a space blanket to stay warm. Uncomfortable at first, but we had no option really so it only felt weird for a second until our warmth stopped us from shivering uncontrollably. Then it didn't feel weird anymore. Felt like we were going to live. Lol.
> 
> 
> 
> No cuddling past that sir. Your wife might not like it.




If it is between life and death, even some gentle **** sucking between old friends might be acceptable to my wife...
She’s a good lad when it comes to these things, as we say here.


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## TheDudeLebowski (Oct 10, 2017)

samyeagar said:


> Yeah, pretty much anything other than penetration isn't really sex, and not really full on cheating. Inappropriate, distasteful, maybe even disrespectful, but not actually cheating. And yeah, because of they way they are, I am not worried a bit about things happening and me not finding out.


That's almost unbelievable that someone could give head and think it's not cheating. Notice I said almost.... wow!


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

He knows it is your boundary. He is phishing, he is testing you and your boundary.

Uh, testing it {{already}} before you are even married?

Testing your resolve. 

...............................................................................................
His son can do whatever he and his fiancee agree on.

Your fiancee can do the same. I hope he chooses wisely.

Actually, I hope he chooses based on *his* true beliefs.

This will be a test for him. 

Do not say another word on this matter, see how much he respects your feelings.
Seriously, say nothing when and if he brings it up again.

If you must.....
Then very calmly tell him, "You know how I feel about it".

Now is the time to ferret out any hidden gremlins in his personality.

Hand him the rope, see if he hangs himself.


KB-


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

samyeagar said:


> What a timely thread.
> 
> My wife and I have very different boundaries on this topic, with mine being very close to yours. We also have very different sexualities and views on sex. Very early on in our dating, I made it clear that I had a deal breaker hard boundary when it comes to sexual contact with people who are not me. So no surprises for her.
> 
> ...


I would think making the decision to even attend the booze brained penis fest was the wrong decision from the get go.


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## samyeagar (May 14, 2012)

TheDudeLebowski said:


> That's almost unbelievable that someone could give head and think it's not cheating. Notice I said almost.... wow!


Oh, there'll be times where it's been be a few days that we haven't done anything, then will have a mutual m session, then the next night she say she really wants to have sex because it had been a few days, so even in the confines of our relationship, she makes a very clear distinction.


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## TheDudeLebowski (Oct 10, 2017)

InMyPrime said:


> If it is between life and death, even some gentle **** sucking between old friends might be acceptable to my wife...
> She’s a good lad when it comes to these things, as we say here.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Probably a sign of a healthy relationship when they prefer you don't die.


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## personofinterest (Apr 6, 2018)

I'm kind of chuckling at all the people who seem so defensive on behalf of this poor man as if not going to see women get naked is going to be some huge sacrifice that stunts his personality. What is with people who are that upset over a complete strangers boundary?


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## TheDudeLebowski (Oct 10, 2017)

samyeagar said:


> Oh, there'll be times where it's been be a few days that we haven't done anything, then will have a mutual m session, then the next night she say she really wants to have sex because it had been a few days, so even in the confines of our relationship, she makes a very clear distinction.


Between piv and other activities, yes there's a difference. Doesn't mean blowing someone else isn't cheating.


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## Theseus (Feb 22, 2013)

personofinterest said:


> I'm cracking up that having a boundary about one naked party means she is his mother. Talk about overblown.


Look again. The OP said: _"it’s not okay for my future husband to look at naked women"_


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## Theseus (Feb 22, 2013)

Tomara said:


> How do you read I have an attitude? If I was his mother, I would say you can’t go period, I gave him a choice.


My impression is that the choice was: "You can go, but I won't be here anymore when you get back". Is that wrong?



> You may think strip clubs are fine and dandy, that you. Keep your snarky remarks to yourself... now that’s attitude.


You asked for opinions. Why are you upset I gave mine? I even said your choice was just fine for you, it just wouldn't work for me. I didn't say you are doing anything wrong.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

InMyPrime said:


> If it is between life and death, even some gentle **** sucking between old friends might be acceptable to my wife...
> She’s a good lad when it comes to these things, as we say here.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


At my age many of my female friends are old(er). Some I've even known a long time 😉.

What's the age cut-off?

😎😎 just kidding, I think I get you.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

InMyPrime said:


> You haven’t missed anything.
> I’m actually organising one for a close friend. He’s the last ‘one of us’ to get married and we are simply planning a get away together, have a grill some steak, drink some whiskey and do some hiking/bonding. No wimmins allowed to distract ass from some manly bonding sessions!!!
> Can’t promise there won’t be any spooning though...A man’s gotta do what he’s gotta do.
> 
> ...


This is the best part of bachelor parties if close friends. It's getting to visit with good friends you may not get to see except sporadically because of distances and schedules. 

Yes, there's generally a lot of drinking but, as not a regular thing, is ok for many, ymmv.

I've never been to a bachelor party of "12 guys in a hotel room with a girl paid to be there, as was described in above post somewhere" get together. 

I'm not judging but I've never done it that way. I probably wouldn't go to one that wasn't for a close friend, anymore, except if DW said No, I forbid it, instead of waiting on my good judgement or just sharing her preference. 

If she "forbade it" then I'd def go even if I didn't go to the strip club part of the evening. Or I might. Depends if it turned into a "thing".

But I see both sides, anyway, so no matter.

I'd like to think OP would have been tactful in expressing her preferences, to enlist her fiance's support, rather than bust out with an ultimatum and expect him to "obey" in first contact on the matter.

And trust him before she infers she doesn't. 

They'll be ok.


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## Tomara (Jun 19, 2013)

InMyPrime said:


> Is that for his Stag due? Why is he inviting his dad to come with him? Or are you against your step son going to one of those?
> 
> I admit, going to strip clubs is a really poor way to spend their time but I’m not sure it should be your call to tell your fiancé how to bring up his son.
> 
> ...




His Dad is one of his best friends. I am not telling my fiancé what to tell his son, damn he’s 27 years old. What he does is his business.


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## Tomara (Jun 19, 2013)

Right now I am at work so I can’t respond totally. I really wish it was a bachelors party of good old friends fishing, drinking and talking about youthful behavior.

I am kind of astounded that some of you think this topic is funny. 

Strip clubs are past my boundary, what I feel is acceptable. Ultimatum, call what you will.

I am the one that lived through 16 years of marriage to a man that was truly sick in the head. Were you ever given a STD that made you have to have a hysterectomy? At 38 I could have had another child but he took that away. Did you ever have to tell someone you were really attracted to “ hey I have an STD?” Watch them run? Known what it’s like to find out the person you love has been cheating on you for seven years? 

Have the mind movies of you husband with numerous hookers? That so many years your life was a lie?

Divorce and then realize that your ex divorced you and the kids? Start your life over having to raise your kids 24/7? Have your income cut by 75%? 

So call it purple I don’t care, I can’t live a life with that kind of behavior even if it seems harmless to most of you. I have been single for 18 years so being with someone for the rest of my life now is something I take dead serious. We have to be on the same page. Do I think he will cheat, no but I didn’t think my ex would cheat either.

Sun C Mars- your post was right on.


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## Decorum (Sep 7, 2012)

For what it is worth I agree with your boundary, and your position.


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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

Tomara said:


> Right now I am at work so I can’t respond totally. I really wish it was a bachelors party of good old friends fishing, drinking and talking about youthful behavior.



That’s how I think you should put it to him, instead of an ultimatum. That way, you will make it about your values, rather than about you (IMHO).



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## MarriedTex (Sep 24, 2010)

Deejo said:


> I'm all for boundaries, and the expression and enforcement of them. Don't know what your history is that makes you believe your husband-to-be, would go make an 'ass' of himself simply by being present ... at a strip club ... for his son's bachelor party. I have no context if your husband-to-be has already demonstrated questionable behavior.
> 
> What I do know, is that if my wife-to-be decided she could determine how and where I choose to celebrate with my son for his wedding, by threatening to cancel our wedding and move out; I'd pay for the U-haul truck.
> 
> ...


Agree with Deejo. Your boundary treats him like a child - as if he had no self-control in such a situation. Assuming that everyone goes into a backroom and gets it on is a fear-driven stereotype borne out of lack of knowledge. 

The only thing you're accomplishing is creating a wedge for your husband. Either he can drive that wedge between you and him or he can drive it between him and his son. I understand that you have fears and those should be expressed, along with a firm expression of a reasonable boundary that you can live with (i.e. look but don't touch.) 

He may not go anyway, out of deference to your original boundary. You may think that you won. But you have already lost. Setting of unreasonable boundaries -and this is an unreasonable boundary despite the chorus of other posters stating otherwise - will sow the seeds of resentment. Either you trust him or you don't. You've just posted a big flashing sign saying you don't trust him. If the relationship is indeed that fragile anyway, I know the choice I would make if I were him.


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## Middle of Everything (Feb 19, 2012)

MarriedTex said:


> Agree with Deejo. Your boundary treats him like a child - as if he had no self-control in such a situation. Assuming that everyone goes into a backroom and gets it on is a fear-driven stereotype borne out of lack of knowledge.
> 
> The only thing you're accomplishing is creating a wedge for your husband. Either he can drive that wedge between you and him or he can drive it between him and his son. I understand that you have fears and those should be expressed, along with a firm expression of a reasonable boundary that you can live with (i.e. look but don't touch.)
> 
> He may not go anyway, out of deference to your original boundary. You may think that you won. But you have already lost. Setting of unreasonable boundaries -and this is an unreasonable boundary despite the chorus of other posters stating otherwise - will sow the seeds of resentment. Either you trust him or you don't. You've just posted a big flashing sign saying you don't trust him. If the relationship is indeed that fragile anyway, I know the choice I would make if I were him.


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## Tomara (Jun 19, 2013)

Our relationship is not fragile in the least and no wedges are being driven anywhere. It’s a simple choice he has to make based off the knowledge that we have shared with each other. 


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## Rocky Mountain Yeti (Apr 23, 2017)

MarriedTex said:


> Agree with Deejo. Your boundary treats him like a child - as if he had no self-control in such a situation. Assuming that everyone goes into a backroom and gets it on is a fear-driven stereotype borne out of lack of knowledge.
> 
> The only thing you're accomplishing is creating a wedge for your husband. Either he can drive that wedge between you and him or he can drive it between him and his son. I understand that you have fears and those should be expressed, along with a firm expression of a reasonable boundary that you can live with (i.e. look but don't touch.)
> 
> He may not go anyway, out of deference to your original boundary. You may think that you won. But you have already lost. Setting of unreasonable boundaries -and this is an unreasonable boundary despite the chorus of other posters stating otherwise - will sow the seeds of resentment. Either you trust him or you don't. You've just posted a big flashing sign saying you don't trust him. If the relationship is indeed that fragile anyway, I know the choice I would make if I were him.


I don't see it that way. 

My wife knows I'm 100% solid and I would never cheat in any way shape or form. I could be sitting in a strip club and have the hottest possible woman custom built to my exact specifications in every way come up and flaunt herself in front of me and offer herself in every way with zero chance of getting caught.... and I would still not take the bait. 

But she would still disapprove of my going to such a place. In that, I don't see my self as being treated as a child at all. Despite how solid I am, and how I know exactly who I am and how she has zero reason for concern, I don't find this to be an unreasonable boundary at all. It is something we agree on and it works both ways. It is one of the ways we are a good fit for each other. And our now 32 year long marriage which has been through a number of things which would have broken many marriages, is in no way fragile.

p.s. I find it interesting how OPs boundary supposedly introduces a wedge into the relationship... as if his wanting to go to a strip club or hire strippers doesn't. Pretty one sided analysis there.


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## personofinterest (Apr 6, 2018)

Look boys. We get it. You think looking at writhing naked women is an inalienable right.

But denigrating this womans boundary just makes YOU look bad.

Hopefully her fiance isn't a baby.


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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

Rocky Mountain Yeti said:


> But she would still disapprove of my going to such a place.



Again, disapproving is not the same as giving someone an ultimatum...
Anyway, I think it’s much ado about nothing. I would place a big bet that he’s not going to go. Or that they are not going to a strip club.

The problem with ultimatums is that you have to follow through...And if he is going to go, she would have to cancel the wedding otherwise he will lose respect for her for good and it’s the last time she can use this card on him.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

MarriedTex said:


> Agree with Deejo. Your boundary treats him like a child - as if he had no self-control in such a situation. Assuming that everyone goes into a backroom and gets it on is a fear-driven stereotype borne out of lack of knowledge.
> 
> The only thing you're accomplishing is creating a wedge for your husband. Either he can drive that wedge between you and him or he can drive it between him and his son. I understand that you have fears and those should be expressed, along with a firm expression of a reasonable boundary that you can live with (i.e. look but don't touch.)
> 
> He may not go anyway, out of deference to your original boundary. You may think that you won. But you have already lost. Setting of unreasonable boundaries -and this is an unreasonable boundary despite the chorus of other posters stating otherwise - will sow the seeds of resentment. Either you trust him or you don't. You've just posted a big flashing sign saying you don't trust him. If the relationship is indeed that fragile anyway, I know the choice I would make if I were him.


You're projecting maybe a little?

Her fiance was well aware of the boundaries way before this came up.

It would be similar to you having an established boundary about your wife not going anywhere alone with an ex and she suddenly decides to push against that well established boundary anyway.

My wife and I have the exact same boundaries when it comes to strippers and none of what you just posted applies to us or OP.


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## Middle of Everything (Feb 19, 2012)

personofinterest said:


> Look boys. We get it. You think looking at writhing naked women is an inalienable right.
> 
> But denigrating this womans boundary just makes YOU look bad.
> 
> Hopefully her fiance isn't a baby.


I have an inalienable desire to make my wife writhe while naked.


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## Andy1001 (Jun 29, 2016)

ConanHub said:


> You're projecting maybe a little?
> 
> Her fiance was well aware of the boundaries way before this came up.
> 
> ...


I agree with you fully. 
How can a woman telling her husband to be that she’s not prepared to stay with a man who goes to strip shows be accused of breaking boundaries. 
Any man who gets his thrills by looking at some woman waving her tits around for money needs to get a life. 
And any man who says it’s the principal of the matter may have things in their past (or current) life that they are ashamed of.
What is more pathetic than some loser putting dollar bills into some other losers knickers, all the while thinking to himself “I’m the man”. This is the nearest they will ever get to a hot women I suppose. 

On a different subject do many of the men posting on this thread have daughters?
What career would you like her to follow?


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## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

Then again, nowhere is it written that Tomara can't attend the bachelor party. If daddy gets to enjoy the show, then invite mom and all of the rest of the family. Fun times!

FWIW, I always have to (just have to) roll my eyes when some kid proclaims a parent is a bestie. Really? Really?? Cut those bloody apron strings before you get married.


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## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

I'll be clear, that I have no issue whatsoever with the OP deciding to declare and enforce her boundary. I don't have the entire context of what has happened to each in their past, what they have discussed, awareness of deal breakers etc.

Depending upon how this discussion was expressed and approached would have everything to do with how I would respond. And in the case outlined in the post ... the circumstances and the nature of the discussion, the OP would have smacked right into one of MY boundaries. And just like her, I would enforce it. 

That's how boundaries work.

I'm not saying her husband should or will choose to defy her. In my case the strip club is immaterial. It's not about actually going to a strip club at all. It's about respect. She wants to assure he respects her, and I would want my fiance to respect me ... the terms used to describe the interaction demonstrate a lack thereof ... potentially on both sides. The fact that he hasn't already verified his decision indicates that he's either letting her stew ... or he's struggling with the decision.

The expression of the boundary has created a win/lose scenario. Which is unfortunate. As I said, I do sincerely hope it resolves without friction.


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## Andy1001 (Jun 29, 2016)

Blondilocks said:


> Then again, nowhere is it written that Tomara can't attend the bachelor party. If daddy gets to enjoy the show, then invite mom and all of the rest of the family. Fun times!
> 
> FWIW, I always have to (just have to) roll my eyes when some kid proclaims a parent is a bestie. Really? Really?? Cut those bloody apron strings before you get married.


And don’t forget all the “people think we’re sisters” bs that some women come out with about their daughters.
Maybe some people do, these people are called visionary impaired.


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## Middle of Everything (Feb 19, 2012)

Andy1001 said:


> I agree with you fully.
> How can a woman telling her husband to be that she’s not prepared to stay with a man who goes to strip shows be accused of breaking boundaries.
> Any man who gets his thrills by looking at some woman waving her tits around for money needs to get a life.
> And any man who says it’s the principal of the matter may have things in their past (or current) life that they are ashamed of.
> ...


I have a daughter. And you are right sir.

I have even received flak from some for stating I hope she never wants to be a cheerleader even. As Ive stated they are just a step away from being strippers. Didnt go over well with some.:grin2:


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## wilson (Nov 5, 2012)

I think things are getting muddled by discussing whether strip clubs are okay or not. The reality is that everyone has certain boundaries around things like sex, religion, politics, etc. They often seem silly or overly restrictive to other people, but they are very common. I'm not sure of the backstory of the OP, but it sounds like there is something very triggering to her if he goes to the strip club. I don't see it as a problem for someone to have boundaries around sex, alcohol, drugs, or other similar things with someone they are considering for marriage. There are some things you just really want to be 100% on the same page about in a life-long commitment. As long as she's upfront about it and accepts that he may leave, I don't see a problem with it.


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## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

If a partner is doing something to defy their SO just because they don't want to be told what to do, then maybe they're just too immature to be married. Yeah, go ahead and stand in the street while a semi bears down on you. See if I care - I don't have to clean up the splatter.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Andy1001 said:


> I agree with you fully.
> How can a woman telling her husband to be that she’s not prepared to stay with a man who goes to strip shows be accused of breaking boundaries.
> Any man who gets his thrills by looking at some woman waving her tits around for money needs to get a life.
> And any man who says it’s the principal of the matter may have things in their past (or current) life that they are ashamed of.
> ...


I'm definitely trying to hold back a little here but I'm having same damn thoughts.

If a couple agrees about strippers, great.

I'm really not getting all this push back though, from guys that think paying women to take it off is almost a man's rite of passage and an acceptable pastime.

I have negative respect myself for such attitudes.


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## Tomara (Jun 19, 2013)

Deejo said:


> I'll be clear, that I have no issue whatsoever with the OP deciding to declare and enforce her boundary. I don't have the entire context of what has happened to each in their past, what they have discussed, awareness of deal breakers etc.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Deejo he not my husband but my fiancé. I don’t think he will attend but he’s not come right out and said as of yet. We have been together for 4 years and he’s never done a single thing for me to doubt how he feels about me.

I do trust him and love him. I however, will never trust blindly again in my life. Maybe this is my failure I have to live with the rest of my life.


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## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

Tomara said:


> Deejo he not my husband but my fiancé. I don’t think he will attend but he’s not come right out and said as of yet. We have been together for 4 years and he’s never done a single thing for me to doubt how he feels about me.
> 
> I do trust him and love him. I however, will never trust blindly again in my life. Maybe this is my failure I have to live with the rest of my life.
> 
> ...


Hey @Tomara, I read your follow-up about the issues you faced in your previous marriage. I'm sincerely sorry that happened to you. I'm very glad that you have met someone that makes you feel safe and loved enough to commit to, once again. That's why I do hope this takes care of itself.

I thought I'd never remarry ... and yet here I am. Those kinds of surprises in life are pleasant and welcome.

Your post is interesting to me about the concept of love, trust and boundaries ... and how they are expressed, and what we do with them. Honestly I think something in the wording of how you presented your initial post, likely triggered me. Not angry, or confrontational, but I could absolutely see the scenario you laid out happening with my ex. In the interest of being a supportive and loving husband, somehow I morphed into a doormat, whom my partner took for granted and who thought her will and wishes, always outweighed my own ... which I allowed and enabled ... far longer than I should have. So that would be the origin of my boundary. 

I appreciate these kinds of discussions, and your candor about your feelings, and your very unfortunate previous experiences. That kind of openness is what makes this place work so well.

I truly hope you get to refer to your partner as 'husband' soon.


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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

Is whether being a stripper a worthwhile profession really going to become the subject of this thread?


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## Tomara (Jun 19, 2013)

Cutting apron strings is a laugh to me. I think it’s great to be best friends with your adult children. I am best friends with my daughter. If this is a mid west deal here in the country then that’s okay. Family is important.

My daughter didn’t want to go out on her bachelorette party, I was her maid of honor. She wanted all of us girls to take a pole dancing class. I could only ask her if she wanted her mom to have a concussion on her wedding day!!!! We stayed home and had a glass of wine instead.

For every man on here that feels it’s fine to watch naked women shakin their **** when you have a warm willing body at home, priorities are messed up. Go home and have that visual excitement with your partner. Naw she might not be that 20 year old you are slobbering over but it’s someone you share a loving, caring, sexual life with.




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## Tomara (Jun 19, 2013)

Deejo said:


> Hey @Tomara, I read your follow-up about the issues you faced in your previous marriage. I'm sincerely sorry that happened to you. I'm very glad that you have met someone that makes you feel safe and loved enough to commit to, once again. That's why I do hope this takes care of itself.
> 
> I thought I'd never remarry ... and yet here I am. Those kinds of surprises in life are pleasant and welcome.
> 
> ...




Deejo thank you so kindly for reading what I posted. I have been around here for a long time and understand 100 % how life has changed how we deal. We learn from each other and we discard what is useless info. 

I have spent 4 years with his man, I wish to trust he will make the correct decision.
I can’t make him but I can pray. 

Since you know a little bit more about my history you understand why I place those
Boundaries. I will never again be lead blindly and be that loving caring dormat! You can understand I will walk away if it is crossed. Self preservation.... that’s the only two words I can come up with right now.


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## Tomara (Jun 19, 2013)

InMyPrime said:


> Is whether being a stripper a worthwhile profession really going to become the subject of this thread?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk




Exactly, I do believe “thread jack” is in order. Thank you IMP for you words. I am listening to what people are saying but some of the posts are pure bull****. I raise cows so I can see it and smell it from a distance.


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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

Tomara said:


> My daughter didn’t want to go out on her bachelorette party, I was her maid of honor. She wanted all of us girls to take a pole dancing class.



So I think I may have a solution for you where everyone will be happy: how about you go to those pole dancing classes like your daughter planned for you, let your fiancé and his son go to the strip club, let them do the whole bonding thing, as parents do, but instead of the actual strippers, it’ll be you performing that evening for them. That way, everyone gets to bond and nobody gets to cheat! 
Plus it will be a great story to tell the grand kids. 
Seems like a perfect family night out.

Actually, if you think I’m being funny...I’m not. I once accidentally ended up at a strip/erotic show with my mum.....I was maybe 14 or so. I can’t remember how but it was an ‘Erotic Exhibition’ rather than a seedy strip club in the city centre and maybe my mum thought it was a good idea for me to absorb some of the culture in the new country we just arrived in...Anyway, I remember being embarrassed because I was called onto stage to hold a banana for one of the girls who was supposed to perform some kind of act with it but while she was ‘warming up’, I peeled it open and took a bite off it instead because I was hungry.

I hope I made my mother very proud that day.



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## Rocky Mountain Yeti (Apr 23, 2017)

InMyPrime said:


> So I think I may have a solution for you where everyone will be happy: how about you go to those pole dancing classes like your daughter planned for you, let your husband and his son go to the strip club, let them do the whole bonding thing, as parents do, but instead of the actual strippers, it’ll be you performing that evening for them. That way, everyone gets to bond and nobody gets to cheat!
> Plus it will be a great story to tell the grand kids.
> Seems like a perfect family night out.
> 
> ...


Actually, that sort of thing has happened. I had a colleague who told his wife he and his buds were going to the strip club. She said no. He said you can't stop me. So, defiantly asserting his manhood and dominance over his manor, he climbed in the truck with his buddies and off to the club he went. 

Well the reason they had to go that night was that it was amateur night and they were excited to see the new meat. Well, she also knew this, so she trotted down there and got in the queue. A couple hours into the evening, her number came up and she proceeded to put on a show for the crowd, but especially focusing on his buddies. She wasn't two minutes in before he stomped out. 

He never went again. (as far as I know)


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## Middle of Everything (Feb 19, 2012)

Rocky Mountain Yeti said:


> Actually, that sort of thing has happened. I had a colleague who told his wife he and his buds were going to the strip club. She said no. He said you can't stop me. So, defiantly asserting his manhood and dominance over his manor, he climbed in the truck with his buddies and off to the club he went.
> 
> Well the reason they had to go that night was that it was amateur night and they were excited to see the new meat. Well, she also knew this, so she trotted down there and got in the queue. A couple hours into the evening, her number came up and she proceeded to put on a show for the crowd, but especially focusing on his buddies. She wasn't two minutes in before he stomped out.
> 
> He never went again. (as far as I know)


Bet his buddies stayed.:grin2:


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## Tomara (Jun 19, 2013)

Rocky Mountain Yeti said:


> Actually, that sort of thing has happened. I had a colleague who told his wife he and his buds were going to the strip club. She said no. He said you can't stop me. So, defiantly asserting his manhood and dominance over his manor, he climbed in the truck with his buddies and off to the club he went.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




OMG now that would have been a site to see but maybe not one to remember. Tough to see your wife preforming those acts for others!!!! 


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Tomara said:


> OMG now that would have been a site to see but maybe not one to remember. Tough to see your wife preforming those acts for others!!!!
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Absolutely righteous however. You want to look at other women stripping? Why not your wife?>


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## Rocky Mountain Yeti (Apr 23, 2017)

Tomara said:


> OMG now that would have been a site to see but maybe not one to remember. Tough to see your wife preforming those acts for others!!!!
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I certainly didn't need to be there, but I was not above laughing at him when I heard the next day, and giving him a big fat "serves ya' right!" 

He was probably as shocked that I "didn't have his back" as he was by what his wife did. Took a while for the clue bird to land on his shoulder.


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## Tomara (Jun 19, 2013)

InMyPrime said:


> So I think I may have a solution for you where everyone will be happy: how about you go to those pole dancing classes like your daughter planned for you, let your fiancé and his son go to the strip club, let them do the whole bonding thing, as parents do, but instead of the actual strippers, it’ll be you performing that evening for them. That way, everyone gets to bond and nobody gets to cheat!
> Plus it will be a great story to tell the grand kids.
> Seems like a perfect family night out.
> 
> ...




Bet that is a memory you will never forget! My daughter has been married for 6 years,
I still swear to god I would have a concussion if I tried pole dancing at my age. I would be on one of those buzz feed videos that everyone laughs at.

See, I don’t have a stick up my ass and can enjoy jokes and stories. 


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## Tomara (Jun 19, 2013)

ConanHub said:


> Absolutely righteous however. You want to look at other women stripping? Why not your wife?>




Watching your wife strip is great but would ya want all those smelly guys reaching in her g string? Not a good retirement.
Best left for home enjoyment.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Tomara said:


> Watching your wife strip is great but would ya want all those smelly guys reaching in her g string? Not a good retirement.
> Best left for home enjoyment.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Wouldn't happen here except at home.:smile2:

I have always thought that it would be funny for a guy to go to a club and see his wife or daughter performing.

Whoops! Hahahahahaha!!!>


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## frusdil (Sep 5, 2013)

Setting and enforcing a boundary is not the same as being controlling, issuing ultimatums or having a parent child relationship.

At the end of the day he still gets to make the decision.


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## Tomara (Jun 19, 2013)

frusdil said:


> Setting and enforcing a boundary is not the same as being controlling, issuing ultimatums or having a parent child relationship.
> 
> 
> 
> At the end of the day he still gets to make the decision.



@frusdil I am not controlling but as I stated in the first post it is my boundary. It’s up to him to decide. This could be a big changing factor in my life. One I will take on and deal with to the best of my ability. I can and have lived by my choices. I hate being backed into a corner. 


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## frusdil (Sep 5, 2013)

@Tomara I know you're not honey. I was agreeing with you, sorry if my post didn't come across that way


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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

Tomara said:


> See, I don’t have a stick up my ass and can enjoy jokes and stories.



That’s refreshing 

But if you don’t get that (pole) stick near the ass soon, you won’t make a very good stripper! 



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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

THRD was an extremely jealous person. He would never like or approve his SO or spouse doing this.....ogling. The thought that she enjoyed it would be painful. 

Why tempt the devil?

For the same reasons he would not go to these strip clubs himself. 

One time while on active duty in the Army, he sat in the car while his buddies went into a strip club. Not because he was a prude, rather because he had pride. He did not want others to think that he felt this behavior was enjoyable. He felt sorry for the women in there, felt some contempt for the men. 

When he saw that they were going to spend most of the night in there, he knocked on the window where they were sitting and told them he would be next door at a normal tavern, drinking a beer and watching TV. He would have walked back to base had it been closer!

Naturally, they teased him for not going. He laughed it off. 



KB-


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## CraigBesuden (Jun 20, 2019)

Meriam-Webster defines an ultimatum as a “final proposition, condition, or demand
especially : one whose rejection will end negotiations and cause a resort to force or other direct action.”

YourDictionary.com: “The definition of an ultimatum is a demand which, if not met, will end a relationship or otherwise result in some serious consequence. When a woman says to her boyfriend ‘marry me or I am leaving you,’ this is an example of an ultimatum.”

How does a “boundary” not qualify as an ultimatum?


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## personofinterest (Apr 6, 2018)

Guess what?

Doesn't matter

The OP doesn't want her future husband going to strip clubs.

And she is not obligated to change that BOUNDARY.

Good grief people


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## faithfulman (Jun 4, 2018)

samyeagar said:


> Yeah, pretty much anything other than penetration isn't really sex, and not really full on cheating. Inappropriate, distasteful, maybe even disrespectful, but not actually cheating. And yeah, because of they way they are, I am not worried a bit about things happening and me not finding out.


I call bull**** on that.

I have seen real bachelorette party pictures - not from the internet - of a woman on a hammock with her legs spread and her tits out, with the "stripper" between her legs dry humping her.

I have seen pictures of that same stripper rubbing his speedo-covered **** in a woman's face.

One of these women was about to be married and the other was in a 15+ year relationship with children.

Both of those things are cheating. And inappropriate. And distasteful. And disrespectful.

And again, both are cheating.


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## faithfulman (Jun 4, 2018)

CraigBesuden said:


> Bachelorette parties where male strippers do that? Are you sure you aren’t talking about Dancing Bear porn videos?





ReformedHubby said:


> Yeah...I have always thought that. There are a few legendary threads around here that I think are bunk and that one is one of them. For those that don't know what it is...my friend Deformed Hubby told me that there is this dancing bear website with women and male strippers....its supposed to be "real" but its all an act and everyone is a paid performer. The videos have been circulating a while and are marketed as "real", and they have been scaring the crap out of men whose wives/girlfriends are going to bachelorette parties. I am not saying a woman wouldn't get ornery with a male stripper, but....I don't think the fairer sex would engage in it nearly as much as men do. They react to strippers much differently than we do.


Plenty of bad **** goes down at bachelorette parties, just the same way that bad **** goes down at bachelor parties.

Here is the recipe: stupid drunk idiots who think that a bachelor/bachelorette party is some kind of limbo where the rules of behavior that constitute cheating doesn't exist, add some "ringleader" types who cajole, pressure, and normalize behavior that is unacceptable, and a "stripper" in a private place that is not a strip club.

You don't think it happens? It happens all the ****ing time. You have the internet, start googling and you'll find plenty of pics and videos of idiots doing this stuff. And it is easy to tell what is staged a "Dancing bear" video and what is real.

Women in particular seem to want to take pictures of each other doing things that will haunt them for the rest of their life, kind of a "mutually assured destruction" practice.


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## faithfulman (Jun 4, 2018)

samyeagar said:


> What a timely thread.
> 
> My wife and I have very different boundaries on this topic, with mine being very close to yours. We also have very different sexualities and views on sex. Very early on in our dating, I made it clear that I had a deal breaker hard boundary when it comes to sexual contact with people who are not me. So no surprises for her.
> 
> ...


"Strippers at the condo"

I guarantee you that what will go down will be way outside of "stripping" and there is a good chance that it won't be just the males stripping.

See what I bolded there? Big mistake. Warn her. Tell her exactly what's up. Because when the liquor starts flowing, inhibitions go down, peer pressure goes up, rationalization starts, and bad things happen.

And then you have to deal with it rather than preventing it.

Go find some pics on the internet and show her how disgusting these parties get.


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## faithfulman (Jun 4, 2018)

@Tomara - not only are you within your rights to enforce this boundary, ultimatum whatever the **** anyone wants to call it - you are smart to tell your fiance exactly how you feel about it.

Nothing good can come from it. At best, nothing untoward happens. At worst it gets completely out of hand.

Prior commenters trotted out the oft-cited, "trust" of your partner to know the line to not cross.

This is exactly how bad **** goes down, because "the line" is moved throughout the night with alcohol, pressure and increasingly lowered inhibitions.

He needs to know your line.

In fact, the more innocent types are the most vulnerable and may often make a bad choice that affects them for the rest of their lives.

***

And by the way, for any readers, I am no prude. I worked in night clubs in my youth that were frequented by strippers.

I ****ed some of those strippers. And in general, in my life, I get it going with the chicks.

But I have never been to a strip club, never wanted to go to one.

I'm not paying anybody to tease me and get me hot and bothered. I find that to be ridiculous.

Because if chicks are getting naked for me, then I want to be rubbing up on them and then ****ing them.

But that's just me.


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## lifeistooshort (Mar 17, 2013)

I don't understand the need for these things.

I mean, most people have been around the block before they get married, so this just seems like a way to justify what is at best inappropriate behavior and at worst cheating.

When I got married I went to a Mexican restaurant with about 10 girlfriends and we all drank and yakked about women stuff (yes, that included husbands...but it was all in good fun).


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## No Longer Lonely Husband (Nov 3, 2015)

Nothing good ever happens in a strip club. I have only been to one three times in my 57 years, and the first time was in the Corps and one of my buddies slugged a guy who turned out to be an officer, thankfully nothing further transpired. Second time one of my drunken friends pulled out a camera and took a photo of the stripper and the two bouncers roughed him up. The last time was with a group of couples as the wives were curious as to what went on in one of those joints, and several drunks tried to hit on the ladies. If my pals and I were not sober, we would have been in trouble for breathing the **** out of this group. Commons sense prevailed and we promptly exited the joint. I have absolute no interest in going back to one.


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## TheDudeLebowski (Oct 10, 2017)

No Longer Lonely Husband said:


> Nothing good ever happens in a strip club. I have only been to one three times in my 57 years, and the first time was in the Corps and one of my buddies slugged a guy who turned out to be an officer, thankfully nothing further transpired. Second time one of my drunken friends pulled out a camera and took a photo of the stripper and the two bouncers roughed him up. The last time was with a group of couples as the wives were curious as to what went on in one of those joints, and several drunks tried to hit on the ladies. If my pals and I were not sober, we would have been in trouble for breathing the **** out of this group. Commons sense prevailed and we promptly exited the joint. I have absolute no interest in going back to one.


The theme of all these stories being when your buddies are drunk, they start ****. When sober, you walk away. I dont know how that's a strip club issue. I know people who I can't hang out with when they drink because something always goes down. Doesn't matter if it's at a strip club or a house party.


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## Tomara (Jun 19, 2013)

Honesty if G wishes to see naked and get his jollies he can stay home. If he wants to pay a few bucks to see naked then I would love to make a few bucks. We both will enjoy.

But, I still can’t pole dance for him without hurting myself

I stand by my boundary/ ultimatum. I even asked my father his thoughts on the subject and he said he didn’t understand that kind of behavior. 

If G want to go for a few cocktails early in the evening I am fine with that. He needs to come home when the boys go out to the strip club. 


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## Rubix Cubed (Feb 21, 2016)

@Tomara

Has the party happened yet? If so what was the verdict?


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## Spicy (Jun 18, 2016)

OP, personally, I’m offended he is even considering going. If he knows your history, and loves and respects you, why would this even be a consideration?

When his son mentioned it, he should have told him right then he would not be attending this, no discussion...He should have told him that he knows it would hurt you, and he would never do that intentionally. End of story! 

You say you have been together for 4 years, and have a great relationship. He already _knows exactly how you feel about this stuff._ Why not be a man and just make the right decision here, without dragging you into it? Does he need to justify to his son that his future wife won’t approve? Absurd!

Shame on him that this was even a discussion with you. The only thing he should have said to _you_ about it, should have been IF you inquired, “Baby of course I told him I’m not going to a strip club, I would never do that to you.”

If he is a man that wants to go to this, is he the man for you?


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## She'sStillGotIt (Jul 30, 2016)

Back in the late 80's early 90's when male reviews were popular, I was part of a community group and on the Ladies Artillery.  It was our job to hold fund-raisers throughout the year to support the men and women in the department.

At one point we started holding male reviews in our main hall because they were really good money-makers. The guys were not overly pleased with that choice of fund-raiser, but it was fun as hell. I ain't gonna lie.

But here's the truth - these women turn into animals. I'm not kidding. *Animals*. The dancers have always told us that women grab their privates, offer them sex all the time, and all kinds of things. I saw the grabbing first hand during the shows and I saw women whispering in their ears and coming onto them as well.

One night in particular, at the end of the night around midnight, there were even more horror stories. My then-husband walked into the mens room to go to the urinal and he saw one of the stalls was occupied. All he could see was the bottom half of a woman on her knees (and the bottoms of her high heels) and some guy's bare feet in front of her knees (he was obviously standing in front of the woman). Gah.

Secondly, a drunk woman and one of the strippers had to be pulled off the pool table back in the guy's lounge, and told to go get a room somewhere else.

Lastly, more than a few women got into trouble when their friends were foolish enough to bring cameras and ended up taking pictures of the 'fun,' getting pictures of their friends in compromising positions with the dancers. Some were completely innocent and the pictures were just funny because you could clearly see that the dancer was just funnin' on them, but some of the other pictures were not so innocent or goofy. More than one wife got in hot water and that's all I'm going to say about that. :surprise:


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

I second @She'sStillGotIt.

The number of women who act like men in heat rises each generation. 

We can blame this on internet porn, liberalism, women's rights, whatever. 
Whatever feels good is OK as long as nobody gets hurt. Europe is way ahead of us in terms of sexual freedom.

I was raised in a upper middle class suburb and yet I saw neighbors act in ways bizarre ways when alcohol was present.

I want to think that this is cyclical, that each generation swings one way and then back. 
I likely am sadly mistaken.

Sexual freedom is here to stay. We can only hope our daughters and loved ones do not get overly wrapped up in this way of living.
It is good to enjoy life and one's sexuality. Just do so smartly, employing a healthy consideration and enjoy thoughtful moderation. 

Yeah, right!


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## CraigBesuden (Jun 20, 2019)

Rubix Cubed said:


> @Tomara
> 
> Has the party happened yet? If so what was the verdict?


Waiting with bated breath!


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## CraigBesuden (Jun 20, 2019)

Spicy said:


> When his son mentioned it, he should have told him right then he would not be attending this, no discussion...He should have told him that he knows it would hurt you, and he would never do that intentionally. End of story!
> 
> You say you have been together for 4 years, and have a great relationship. He already _knows exactly how you feel about this stuff._ Why not be a man and just make the right decision here, without dragging you into it? Does he need to justify to his son that his future wife won’t approve? Absurd!


I dunno...

My BIL is an atheist who hates religion and would never go into a church. On Christmas, he likes to watch the Pope performing mass and mock him.

If my SIL were invited to her niece’s baptism, should she even need to discuss it? Just immediately decline to attend the baptism because her husband wouldn’t approve? Does H get to “approve” where W goes, even including family events?


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## Andy1001 (Jun 29, 2016)

CraigBesuden said:


> I dunno...
> 
> My BIL is an atheist who hates religion and would never go into a church. On Christmas, he likes to watch the Pope performing mass and mock him.
> 
> If my SIL were invited to her niece’s baptism, should she even need to discuss it? Just immediately decline to attend the baptism because her husband wouldn’t approve? Does H get to “approve” where W goes, even including family events?


I think equating a babies christening and visiting a strip club with your son as “family events” is stretching things a bit. Are you being obtuse, stirring the pot or playing devils advocate?


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## Rocky Mountain Yeti (Apr 23, 2017)

CraigBesuden said:


> I dunno...
> 
> My BIL is an atheist who hates religion and would never go into a church. On Christmas, he likes to watch the Pope performing mass and mock him.
> 
> If my SIL were invited to her niece’s baptism, should she even need to discuss it? Just immediately decline to attend the baptism because her husband wouldn’t approve? Does H get to “approve” where W goes, even including family events?


Holy false equivalencies, Batman!


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## Mr The Other (Feb 1, 2014)

faithfulman said:


> Plenty of bad **** goes down at bachelorette parties, just the same way that bad **** goes down at bachelor parties.
> 
> Here is the recipe: stupid drunk idiots who think that a bachelor/bachelorette party is some kind of limbo where the rules of behavior that constitute cheating doesn't exist, add some "ringleader" types who cajole, pressure, and normalize behavior that is unacceptable, and a "stripper" in a private place that is not a strip club.
> 
> ...


I was in my 20's in Edinburgh (Scotland) on a batchelor (stag) party. Some signs banned stag and hen (batchelorette) parties, and some only banned hen do's. We were surprised, but we saw plenty of stag parties who were dropping social inhibition to do things they would not normally do (opening up and discussing life and feelings) and plenty of hen parties who were dropping social inhibition to do things they would not normally do (which is why they were not allowed in bars).


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## Rubix Cubed (Feb 21, 2016)

Andy1001 said:


> I think equating a babies christening and visiting a strip club with your son as “family events” is stretching things a bit. Are you being obtuse, stirring the pot or playing devils advocate?


D) All of the above.


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## Tomara (Jun 19, 2013)

CraigBesuden said:


> Waiting with bated breath!




He did not go with his son. However, last night was his bachelor party. As he was walking out the door, he said they were going to dinner see you later. I said, have fun. I woke up at 1 am and no fiance, sent a text asking him where the **** are you? No answer from him. I woke up again at 2am, still not home. He got home at 2:30am. 

I asked him this morning what happened? They ended up going to one country bar, then the guys took him to a strip club and he stated he did not go inside but sat out in the car with a friend while the rest of the guys went in. He said then his friend and him walked to a bar close to the strip club and had another drink.

I asked him why he didn’t text letting me know he was going to be really late. His answer, I just didn’t. Really?!?

I am sitting here at my desk at work seriously thinking about calling off my wedding on the 28th. My heart is broken and my head is just pissed off. He knew exactly how I felt about that type of bachelor party. He said I will never do that again yet he did it this time and made his excuse fit his actions.

I am meeting him after work to finish picking up the rest of the wedding decorations. I don’t know what to do. My anger tells me to just disappear for a bit and leave him hanging while I figure out if I want to marry him. God I am a mess!




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## uhtred (Jun 22, 2016)

Do you think he is lying?

Also, imagine the scenario: Friends say they are going to dinner, but actually take him to a strip club. (or the "dinner" is at a strip club). Puts him in an extremely awkward social position. Imagine the same if you went to what you were told was a tame bachlorette party / dinner. Then a stripper comes out - would you walk out on your friends, and get an uber home? 






Tomara said:


> He did not go with his son. However, last night was his bachelor party. As he was walking out the door, he said they were going to dinner see you later. I said, have fun. I woke up at 1 am and no fiance, sent a text asking him where the **** are you? No answer from him. I woke up again at 2am, still not home. He got home at 2:30am.
> 
> I asked him this morning what happened? They ended up going to one country bar, then the guys took him to a strip club and he stated he did not go inside but sat out in the car with a friend while the rest of the guys went in. He said then his friend and him walked to a bar close to the strip club and had another drink.
> 
> ...


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## Tilted 1 (Jul 23, 2019)

Tomara said:


> He said I will never do that again yet he did it this time and made his excuse fit his actions.
> 
> I am meeting him after work to finish picking up the rest of the wedding decorations. I don’t know what to do. My anger tells me to just disappear for a bit and leave him hanging while I figure out if I want to marry him. God I am a mess!
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


The first sentence he admitted he went to the strip club, and said he would never do again. 

As to your wedding, only you can know what to do. From your first post until now. He just gave you a glimpse of your marriage to come. ( When things matter)

ls this one of those compromise's you are going to make. Is the key to unlocking your dismay, is this worth the weight of burden? 

If not then go and have your self a wonderful wonderful wedding day. And knowing full well that marriages are compromise's to the end. 

If you choose to marry him, when you see him, show him you love smile and be gleeful and shine. Do not bring up again. And choose your battles carefully and wisely. We all fail and when you do fail, then bring his memory back to this moment. And move on. 

Don't let, advice here make your choice. YOU make the decision. And then accept it as a loving thing to do for your future husband. Or......??????


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## Tilted 1 (Jul 23, 2019)

Every time I reform in one direction I go overboard in the other!! 




This is sound advice..


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## wilson (Nov 5, 2012)

Regardless of what happened, it's going to be tough to work through this. Is he worth doing that work to move past this?

You can try checking out his clothes to see if they have evidence of the strip club, such as glitter, makeup, or perfume. 

At a minimum, he didn't text you back when you clearly were worried and had valid reasons to be worried. It seems like a he has a lack of concern. I suspect that will be a recurring behavior. 

If you decide to work through this, it would be a good opportunity to get in writing what you consider cheating. Explicitly state everything you would consider cheating, such having emotional chats/texts, intimate chats/texts, extended one-on-one social time with other women, strip clubs, and so on. This way he won't have any wiggle room if he repeats the behavior.


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

This is who he is. You have to decide if that’s who you want.


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## Tomara (Jun 19, 2013)

I told him I needed time to process after he said he was sorry. I am calm now but he will know that simple texts are important to way lay worry. I gave him the choice of being married to me or being in the bachelor mode.

I think I will check out his clothes from last night, I am praying he told me the truth.


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## Tilted 1 (Jul 23, 2019)

Tomara said:


> I told him I needed time to process after he said he was sorry. I am calm now but he will know that simple texts are important to way lay worry. I gave him the choice of being married to me or being in the bachelor mode.
> 
> I think I will check out his clothes from last night, I am praying he told me the truth.
> 
> ...


Maybe you should, 

call it off if this is the way you are starting the rest of your life. And suspicion, added with the flavor of infidilty. It's black or white, ..... Right or wrong,.... Yes or no. This is no way to start the marriage. 

Call it, quit wringing your hand and accept it or don't. Because if you don't make a definitive choice you shown you don't love him enough to forgive.

I will bow out, because you are bringing up this as an excuse because you are scared. And any marriage that starts like this is doomed for failure.


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## re16 (Oct 9, 2012)

Tomara said:


> then the guys took him to a strip club and he stated he did not go inside but sat out in the car with a friend while the rest of the guys went in


You realize how ridiculous this sounds right... as in there is no way this is how it went down.


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## Tilted 1 (Jul 23, 2019)

Last one , Why are you giving him the choice, and you not making it? Are you not a grown woman who knows what she wants?


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## Tomara (Jun 19, 2013)

Tilted 1 said:


> Last one , Why are you giving him the choice, and you not making it? Are you not a grown woman who knows what she wants?




I am making a choice. Yes I am a grown woman but we all have fears.


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## Tilted 1 (Jul 23, 2019)

Tomara said:


> I am making a choice. Yes I am a grown woman but we all have fears.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Tomara, 
Don't have fears just chalk this up to a lesson learned
And move forward. Blessings to you.


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

I think you’ll choose to buy his story (as illogical as it is) so you can stay.


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## Tomara (Jun 19, 2013)

Openminded said:


> I think you’ll choose to buy his story (as illogical as it is) so you can stay.




So I can stay? I am hurt and confused but I am certainly not needy, don’t have my own money or don’t have a place I can go to. Staying is the least of my worries right now. 

I just spoke to him and told him that he hurt me and my thoughts right now are to leave. I have to remove the hurt and think with a clear head. Yes, I may stay, I do love him. That just doesn’t evaporate in seconds. 

I have been put through the ringer with an ex husband that cheated on me for 7 years with other women and prostitutes. I am well aware what lying looks like now, I can spot it from a mile away.

My problem may trigger some but please don’t talk down to me or believe I am a simpleton. 


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## Prodigal (Feb 5, 2011)

Would it be feasible to postpone the wedding for awhile? I think you need time to really process your feelings. From what you've reported, it sounds like he lied to you about the strip club visit. I'd be extremely suspicious of his not answering his phone when you called him several times late at night.

If you don't feel right about marrying him right now, don't feel guilty about it. Go with your gut instincts on this. JMO, but I vote to postpone the wedding for several months so you can work this out.


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## Rob_1 (Sep 8, 2017)

My take: as much as you both love each other, it looks like you are not compatible. This is a big think in a relationship, and in the long run it will eventually make you both fail.

It looks like to him going to a a strip joint it's not a big thing, because honestly, most men don't go there because they think they will get anything, it's just a male environment, except for the percentage of sick puppies that actually go there to try to get some/mentally masturbate. But to you due to your previous experiences all men are like that/will do what what's done to you and that's your dealbreaker, but it looks like he is/will eventually resent you for it because your are telling him what he can/can't do. This does not bodes well for the relationship. 

There's not right or wrong just Imcompatibility. Just for the record I hate going to a strip joint. It makes me feel stupid being there, but I've been there a few times in my life, but thankfully, it's been a few decades for me since the last time.


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## frusdil (Sep 5, 2013)

uhtred said:


> Do you think he is lying?
> 
> Also, imagine the scenario: Friends say they are going to dinner, but actually take him to a strip club. (or the "dinner" is at a strip club). Puts him in an extremely awkward social position. Imagine the same if you went to what you were told was a tame bachlorette party / dinner. *Then a stripper comes out - would you walk out on your friends, and get an uber home?*


Yep.


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## Adelais (Oct 23, 2013)

Breaking off an engagement is a lot easier than getting a divorce, which is what you will be doing in a few years if you marry this guy.

He wanted to go to the strip club with his son, but didn't since you protested.

He claims he didn't go into the strip club the other night, but stayed outside. If your fiance were a boyscout or born again Christian, I might believe this, but he is the same guy who wanted to go with his son to a strip club.

He is lying, sorry. And he is not even married to you yet.

This is a sign of things to come.


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

Tomara said:


> So I can stay? I am hurt and confused but I am certainly not needy, don’t have my own money or don’t have a place I can go to. Staying is the least of my worries right now.
> 
> I just spoke to him and told him that he hurt me and my thoughts right now are to leave. I have to remove the hurt and think with a clear head. Yes, I may stay, I do love him. That just doesn’t evaporate in seconds.
> 
> ...


Your post mentioned (unnamed) fears. That’s what I based my response on.


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## syhoybenden (Feb 21, 2013)

Tomara said:


> He did not go with his son. However, last night was his bachelor party. As he was walking out the door, he said they were going to dinner see you later. I said, have fun. I woke up at 1 am and no fiance, sent a text asking him where the **** are you? No answer from him. I woke up again at 2am, still not home. He got home at 2:30am.
> 
> I asked him this morning what happened? They ended up going to one country bar, then the guys took him to a strip club and he stated he did not go inside but sat out in the car with a friend while the rest of the guys went in. He said then his friend and him walked to a bar close to the strip club and had another drink.
> 
> ...


:wtf:

Jeez.

He KNEW how you felt about it but then went and did it anyways.

And then did not answer any of your calls.

Welcome to your future.


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## lucy999 (Sep 28, 2014)

Tomara said:


> Without missing a beat, I said that was a hard NO for me and our relationship. He knows how my relationship with my ex was so it shouldn’t be a surprise that I feel this way.
> 
> I explained that it was his choice to make. If he goes then there will be no marriage for us in December.


This was your OP. I'm not posting this to be mean or cruel. I'm putting this here to remind you of your convo with your fiance. To see it in black and white. I realize feelings and situations change. But this is a big boundary (and a reasonable one). If you cave on this, you will have set the tone for your entire marriage--that you will state your boundaries, he will cross them, and you will cave.

He will stick to this lie (which is laughable). This is where the rubber meets the road. 1. He lied to you and 2. He doesn't respect your very reasonable boundary on this issue.

Do you want a marriage like this? Because I guarantee this is what your future looks like. Think with your head and not with your heart.


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## MJJEAN (Jun 26, 2015)

Deejo said:


> WTF kind of strip clubs do y'all go to? And in what reality do you believe that young men are actually having any kind of sex in these strip clubs prior to their nuptials?
> 
> Please see my signature for reference.


I haven't even read the whole thread yet. I keep seeing this kind of comment and I have to say that, yes, there is sex in the champagne room as long as you're willing to pay for it.

Around here, strippers charge average $20 for a lap dance. $40 for a VIP room trip. $80+ for the "champagne room", which is usually a nicer version of the VIP rooms. In the non-public rooms, strippers will absolutely negotiate sex acts for a "tip". Standard oral to completion is around $60-$80. Actual sex, depending on the type of sex act, tends to run about $120-$150 for full PIV to orgasm. 

Do all strippers have sex or some form of sex (handy, oral) with customers for money? No. But here, it's fairly expected since so many do.

How do I know? 

I used to live in an apartment complex and befriended a few young ladies who were working as strippers. Spent some time hanging out, being a friend and grabbing them a bottle before they had to "dance", and providing safe transport home as some dudes will try to follow the ladies as they leave. I could tell you all some stories!

I also have a few perpetually single guy friends who regularly pay strippers for sex. It's slightly less expensive than contacting the local escorts online (streetwalkers are very rare here now as most prostitutes advertise online solo or through an escort service), they knows they're attracted to the girl as they've already met, and it's a simple go in, enjoy the scenery, pay the dancer, get off, go home. No muss, no fuss.

Wanna know the truly weird thing? A former stripper friend, who I met after she'd quit, once got paid $300 to travel to a gentleman's work and leave a snail trail on his desk. That's it. Nothing more. Lots of girls I've met who used to do sex work actually got paid MORE to do something like that then they ever did for sex acts.

And anyone who thinks ladies don't do the same kind of things men do at strip clubs are delusional. My friends mom got crabs from her one time strip club visit for a family member's engagement. I've watched girls get lap dances, put their hands in the bananna hammock, and stroke from taint to tip. I've seen the member in mouth. I've seen basic dry humping I am pretty sure resulted in a badly hidden orgasm for the lady. I could go on, but the point is that women don't seem any less susceptible to losing their minds in the strip club.


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## MJJEAN (Jun 26, 2015)

Tomara said:


> So I can stay? I am hurt and confused but I am certainly not needy, don’t have my own money or don’t have a place I can go to. Staying is the least of my worries right now.
> 
> I just spoke to him and told him that he hurt me and my thoughts right now are to leave. I have to remove the hurt and think with a clear head. Yes, I may stay, I do love him. That just doesn’t evaporate in seconds.
> 
> ...


You put a boundary in place. He stomped it and then lied to you. What are the odds he really did just drop everyone off at the titty bar and walk to a nice dive bar full of other old guys for a drink while the rest stared at and got attention from scantily clad physically fit women who are willing to do quite a lot for a few bucks? I wouldn't believe it for a second. To add insult to injury, he knew how you felt and then refused to answer your calls. Know why? He didn't want you to hear "Cinnamon" working for her $$ in the background.

Your ex cheated on you for years with other women and hookers. This one seems not much better, if at all. I think maybe the issue is you. If you've ended up with 2 men who can't seem to be honest and faithful, you need your man picker calibrated. I'd call off the wedding. If you're not willing to do that then at least postpone it.


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## Tomara (Jun 19, 2013)

I know women also go to stripe clubs. However, this one does not. I want my excitement for a man to come from the man I am with. 

I can’t even think about the what if’s right now as his whole family is coming to dinner tonight. 

I do believe that I will have a talk with father Don in the next couple of days, as he is the one marrying us. I am praying that I am just over reacting to a small thing. Not once in the four years I have been with this man has he ever given me worry that he would cheat. 

Yes I did lay down the law last night. I simply said how hurt I was and that I am thinking twice about marrying him.


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## syhoybenden (Feb 21, 2013)

Muchas palabras!

Tell him you're going to hit the pause button on the wedding for a few months, and then DO it.

Let him know that he has now to prove himself not to be what he just proved himself to be.

It's your life. Not anybody else's. If there's a bit of social inconvenience now ... it's all on him.


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## She'sStillGotIt (Jul 30, 2016)

OP, again, this is *just my opinion* and it's clearly not that of any of the other posters - but that's what makes this board so interesting, right? 

I, too, was married to a *serial cheater* who literally crossed ANY line he could. NO ONE was off bounds if he thought he was going to get himself laid - he'd hit on family members (wives of his brothers and cousins, not siblings), wives of fellow firefighters/EMTs, my sisters and my brother's wife, wives of friends or coworkers - he had no boundaries at all and would hit on anyone. Literally, he had NO boundaries. He'd go to any strip bar and anywhere else if he thought he'd get lucky.

I left him and never looked back. That was almost 30 years ago.

He's been remarried for years (and is still a serial cheater) and my adult son just told me that after taking a 23&Me DNA test that his wife bought him for his birthday this past summer, two adult children he knew nothing about have come forward, knocking at his door. One is from before I met him and the other is aged 3 years younger than our only son, which means the 2nd one happened on my watch (so far - but who knows how many others have yet to come forward?) I've known for years what a scoundrel he is, but I never really thought about kids running around that might be his. So my only child has at least 2 half-siblings - so far - and really isn't an 'only' child after all.

My point is, my ex was a cheating piece of goat **** just like *your* ex.

But I can't visit the sins of my sleazy serial cheating ex-husband (whose illegitimate kids are all now coming home to roost) onto my current husband because it's not FAIR to him to do that. He's given me exactly ZERO reasons to distrust him and until he does, I'm going to continue respecting his decisions and believing he's respecting me. You called it a boundary but really, it was an ultimatum - go to the strip bar and I won't marry you 'because it's my boundary.' That was an ultimatum. And it was based on what someone _else_ did, not your fiancee.

I'm just playing devil's advocate here and if I'm being honest, his story about not going into the strip bar and going to another bar instead that night sounds kind of feeble. Would I believe him? No, I wouldn't. But in his defense, all he wanted to do was attend his son's bachelor party and enjoy it without it causing some kind of cataclysmic event in his personal life due to the past actions of a low-down serial cheater. I think there are worse things in this world than spending an hour or two in a strip bar with your son and all his groomsmen while they embarrass the groom-to-be and drink like a bunch of frat boys. 

Another truth is that if your fiancee REALLY wanted to go to a strip bar and act the fool, he could do that all on his own while claiming to be at Home Depot or anywhere else. He doesn't *need* to use his own son's bachelor party as his venue to act out at a strip bar. I mean, that's just a fact. Quite honestly, it's virtually impossible to try to control WHAT your fiancee sees with his own two eyes, 24 hours a day, 7 days a week. And again, this is due to someone ELSE'S bad behavior and not his own. But it's impossible to police what he actually sees. Hell, I see more skin showing on my favorite show, "Temptation Island," than I ever have in a strip joint.

Again, it's just my 2 cents and you asked for our opinions, so that's why I'm writing this. My opinion is that it was unfair to ask him to choose between marrying you or being able to enjoy his son's bachelor party from start to finish without having to come home early only because of your insecurities *due to your ex-husband's past behavior*. It wasn't for religious reasons, it wasn't for moral reasons, it was because of what your ex did. And that's really unfair to visit that on your current fiancee if he HASN'T given you any reason to distrust him. 

This novella was just my 2 bits.


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## Married but Happy (Aug 13, 2013)

personofinterest said:


> This is your boundary. The fact that your boundary will trigger some people on here is not relevant. It is your boundary, and you have stated it clearly. Now your fiance just has to decide if it's more important to marry you or more important to watch naked ladies dancing.


That's one way to put it. I'd put the choice more as, "Now your fiance has to decide if it's more important to marry you or more important to to support his son in a major life transition." So, his transition, or his son's. I think he could ask his son if he'd be okay without his presence, and go from there. If it were me, I'd be happy to not go. On the other hand, I would take exception to such an _ultimatum_ over what seems to be a relatively innocuous event. Maybe if you'd _asked_ him not to go given your boundaries, it would be different. In his shoes, I'd be wondering what other limits you'd impose in the future, and would question if the relationship is worth it.


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## sunsetmist (Jul 12, 2018)

My understanding was he did not go to son's party, but DID go to his own for marriage to @Tomara and then lied about what he actually did.

Likely, he was rooted on and dared by his friends, but who knows what he would do next time, if he is so easily influenced by his friends?

Is this worth a poly? Problem is now trust is destroyed...


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## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

@Tomara, this bachelor party was for your fiance - was it not?

In your neck of the woods, how long does it normally take to go out to dinner and then drive to a bar for a drink?

How long was your fiance gone?

His "I just didn't" excuse for not texting you is telling. No apology, no kiss my ass, no nothing. He couldn't care less that he caused you concern.

You might want to call off dinner tonight. You don't want to reward bad behavior. And, you certainly have grounds to not want to cook for his family.


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## Tomara (Jun 19, 2013)

Some here are going back to his sons party and he did not go. 

I can’t cancel dinner for his family, to late in the day and part of them don’t like me anyway. Just more fuel for them.

I can Check his story as far as the strip club yes I can. do I think he went in.... no. Do I think he went to another bar right by the strip club? Yep and the distance and the name of the bar fits. No glitter, no perfume, no make up found. Nothing in is wallet proved he was a dollar man that night.

Did this man disrespect me by not answering my text??? Hell yes. I am still so mad about that I can’t see straight. 

What I have lived is such a sorry story, it would make ones toes curl. But do I lay that at my fiancé feet and whip him to death? 

That is a hard answer. Was he wrong? 200 percent. A week from today I have to look at this man, in gods eyes and be sure of my vows. Can I do that at this very minute? NO

Everyone that comments must understand that I have 7 days to decide my life. Dear god I wouldn’t want to wish that on anyone. 

I am trying to decide if one evening cancels out 4 years of being a wonderful person. Not once in the last four years has he ever crossed a boundary, not even with his sons bachelor party. He was a passenger to the party his dumb ass single friend put into play. 

Who here has never made a mistake? Not me since I told him I would only date him. How does he feel? Sorry from his actions. This is not a wait and see in a couple of months, I have 7 ****ing days!!!!!!!




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## Married but Happy (Aug 13, 2013)

Blondilocks said:


> His "I just didn't" excuse for not texting you is telling. No apology, no kiss my ass, no nothing. He couldn't care less that he caused you concern.


It sounds like a little acting out because he was probably annoyed at her for her ultimatums re: his son's party. I'd be pissed off, too. However, if that's the extent of his response after 4 very good years as the OP says, and living up to her demands, then I think she should forgive him. If she can't then I think he's may be the lucky one.


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## sunsetmist (Jul 12, 2018)

I'm feeling that only you are there and know the real man. Sounds like you believe him--looked him in the eye to do so? Still curious while he did not return your texts.

Of course, if he so chose, he could have 'gotten into trouble' in the random bar or anywhere else. Bottom line, sounds like you want to stay with him. He knows your feelings. He knew he was hurting you by not responding and that is suspect.

Would a pre or post-nup be appropriate? I think you will decide to marry, but do not do so just because of time invested.


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## Adelais (Oct 23, 2013)

Well, TAM isn't going anywhere whether you marry him or not.

I hope the dinner goes well tonight and your wedding is beautiful.

Best wishes!


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## Tomara (Jun 19, 2013)

I found out about the truth of what happened during the bachelor party in regards to the strip club. I am satisfied that he did not break my trust nor ignore my boundaries. 


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## syhoybenden (Feb 21, 2013)

Mmm hmm.


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## uhtred (Jun 22, 2016)

I think this is a great answer. 

Clearly you and he view things like strip clubs differently - and that may apply to a wide range of things. Why set your self up for misery - end it and each find someone compatible. 




Rob_1 said:


> My take: as much as you both love each other, it looks like you are not compatible. This is a big think in a relationship, and in the long run it will eventually make you both fail.
> 
> It looks like to him going to a a strip joint it's not a big thing, because honestly, most men don't go there because they think they will get anything, it's just a male environment, except for the percentage of sick puppies that actually go there to try to get some/mentally masturbate. But to you due to your previous experiences all men are like that/will do what what's done to you and that's your dealbreaker, but it looks like he is/will eventually resent you for it because your are telling him what he can/can't do. This does not bodes well for the relationship.
> 
> There's not right or wrong just Imcompatibility. Just for the record I hate going to a strip joint. It makes me feel stupid being there, but I've been there a few times in my life, but thankfully, it's been a few decades for me since the last time.


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## cp3o (Jun 2, 2018)

Tomara said:


> I found out about the truth of what happened during the bachelor party in regards to the strip club. I am satisfied that he did not break my trust nor ignore my boundaries.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Well done.

I wish you a long and very happy marriage.


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

How did you find out what happened?


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## Tilted 1 (Jul 23, 2019)

Tomara said:


> I found out about the truth of what happened during the bachelor party in regards to the strip club. I am satisfied that he did not break my trust nor ignore my boundaries.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Then, l will say this for future opportunities in your marriage... I will say, do not draw ultimatum's that you think you can bluff him. Boundaries of course. But you have to have the strength to do this. I am just saying, in a lot of marriages l see the weakest woman, is the one who say that will never happen to me and says in front of her friends I'll never back down. But in the end as so many do they back down. 

I am not saying you are doing this but be wise not to.


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## Tomara (Jun 19, 2013)

There was no backing down on my part. Before I got the whole picture / story Saturday I had pretty much told him if he wanted to act single then stay single, the wedding was canceled. He apologized several times for not sending me a text to let me know he was okay. So, wedding or not, he knows that it can’t happen again (the no text crap an no bachelor parties ever again.)

If he chooses to participate in infantile behavior, he will be single doing it.




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## moon7 (May 5, 2013)

Tomara said:


> My fiancé’s son will be getting married soon. My fiancé casually stated something about visiting strip clubs might be on the agenda for his sons party. Not that he would be the one taking everyone but would be there if it happened.
> 
> Without missing a beat, I said that was a hard NO for me and our relationship. He knows how my relationship with my ex was so it shouldn’t be a surprise that I feel this way.
> 
> ...



Idk why bachelor parties are so common is the US, but that would be a dealbrraker for me.

If my partner prefers to risk my piece of mind and our relationship so he can go to a party, then he is not relationship material. He is already going to the wedding party and that should be enough, after all.


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## common sense (7 mo ago)

faithfulman said:


> Plenty of bad *** goes down at bachelorette parties, just the same way that bad *** goes down at bachelor parties.
> 
> Here is the recipe: stupid drunk idiots who think that a bachelor/bachelorette party is some kind of limbo where the rules of behavior that constitute cheating doesn't exist, add some "ringleader" types who cajole, pressure, and normalize behavior that is unacceptable, and a "stripper" in a private place that is not a strip club.
> 
> ...


it doesn't haunt them. they are only taking pictures and videos to get off on their depravity


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## Marc878 (Aug 26, 2015)

It doesn’t matter what anything else thinks.


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## Andy1001 (Jun 29, 2016)




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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

Zombie Cat says "That party was over a long time ago."


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