# Bipolar Wife - What's the Truth?



## Drover (Jun 11, 2012)

My wife was recently diagnosed as Bipolar Disorder I after a severe manic episode with major psychotic break. Our marriage has not been good for quite some time, and during all this she said some things to me that were pretty awful about what she wants/needs from me that I don't give her. 

The issue I'm having is that during all this, she also thought the FBI was after her, and other assorted craziness. So now I'm trying to sort out what she really wants from what was just bipolar craziness. She actually has forgotten much of what happened during her episode and tries to cover up how much she remembers ans doesn't. When I try to talk about it, she refuses. 

Any thoughts/ideas how to figure out what she really wants vs. what was manic nuttiness?


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## Kurosity (Dec 22, 2011)

This can be tough to navigate. May be try listing the things she has said to you and review them and something might pop out at you. I think that even in a manic state there is still some things that are said that is true just amplified because of their disorder. So look for repeating themes in the things she says all across the board and you might strike gold. But ask too about it when she is level.
I use to get so mad at my H (Bipolar) for feeling like I had to read into everything he said because I was never sure until I had a grasp on his highs and lows. He has several a year and always in the same months occasionally he will have a rapid episode here and there and now I just know when it is and is not his disorder affecting him. It helps that he is on mood stabilizers to keep things level more often.
I feel for you and your wife because it is hard on everyone. I can see why she would avoid talking about her episodes. I once read a letter from a Bipolar man who said it hurt to see him self doing things that he did not want to do. Like being trapped and unable to stop things from happening while strapped to the surgeon's table. You can see, hear, and feel everything but can do nothing to stop it.


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## lotsoflove (Jun 11, 2012)

I feel like you will only be able to figure out what she really wants after she settles into a treatment and therapy program, since she has just been recently diagnosed. I would tread lightly here. I am sure she is ashamed and feeling a bit helpless, like her brain has betrayed her. Let her know you want her to feel better/happy and that you hope after some progress you guys can address some of the issues that have been brought up.


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

Why didn't you disclose this info in your last post about being assertive and then being put down for it?


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## Drover (Jun 11, 2012)

that_girl said:


> Why didn't you disclose this info in your last post about being assertive and then being put down for it?


Because I was intentionally looking for advice isolated from this fact.


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## Drover (Jun 11, 2012)

lotsoflove said:


> I feel like you will only be able to figure out what she really wants after she settles into a treatment and therapy program, since she has just been recently diagnosed. I would tread lightly here. I am sure she is ashamed and feeling a bit helpless, like her brain has betrayed her. Let her know you want her to feel better/happy and that you hope after some progress you guys can address some of the issues that have been brought up.


Another problem we're facing is that she's in denial about the illness. She has agreed to stay on her meds "for now" but she completely denies there's anything wrong with her. This started as soon as she became stable. Prior to that she was accepting of the diagnosis and was telling me about her guilt over things she did, etc. Now she's in complete denial. I'm really just playing a game for time, hoping we can all convince her she needs the treatment before she goes off of it again.


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## Uptown (Mar 27, 2010)

Drover said:


> My wife was recently diagnosed as Bipolar Disorder I after a severe manic episode with major psychotic break. Our marriage has not been good for quite some time.


Drover, some of the dysfunctional behaviors you describe -- verbal abuse, blame-shifting, and irrational anger -- may be due to an issue more serious than bipolar-I. A recent study of nearly 35,000 American adults (pub. 2008) found that half of the bipolar-I sufferers also suffer from full-blown BPD (Borderline Personality Disorder). This implies there is a 50% chance your W also suffers from BPD. See Table 2 at Prevalence, Correlates, Disability, and Comorbidity of DSM-IV Borderline Personality Disorder: Results from the Wave 2 National Epidemiologic Survey on Alcohol and Related Conditions.


> She wanted me to be more dominant. The problem is that when I do it, she fights it.... Why is she acting that way when she wants this? [From your "Pants" thread.]


One possibility, as Halien suggests in your "Pants" thread, is that you are trying to control the wrong things. Perhaps you are. Another possibility -- indeed, a 50% probability if those study results are correct -- is that your W has strong BPD traits in addition to bipolar. 

BPDers have such a weak, unstable self image that they yearn to live with a person having a strong personality. They need that person to stabilize and ground them, giving them a sense of direction. This is why BPDers typically hate to be alone. As soon as they find a strong person like that, they are in heaven for 3 to 6 months, believing they have found the perfect soul mate. Yet, as soon as their infatuation evaporates, they become resentful, feeling like the mate is trying to control them. 

Hence, when a woman has a weak sense of who she is, she will desperately crave to be around a strong man but, after several months, she will feel like she is losing her own identity in his strong personality. She thus will complain about "being controlled." 

My exW was that way. If I bought her a present, she resented the fact that I picked it out. If I asked her ahead of time what sort of gift she would like me to buy, she felt that I was the one deciding _when_ it could be bought. And, if we agreed on her having her own separate budget for such frills, she felt that I somehow had been the one to dictate the budget. As I learned, the result is a lose-lose situation because a BPDer will be unhappy if you do not help to ground and center her, and she will be equally unhappy if you do.


> It doesn't matter what the decision is she wants to turn it into a big drama and argue it to death, and will probably get nasty about it if she doesn't get her way.


If she has strong BPD traits, this behavior is typical. BPDers (i.e., those with strong traits) lack the ability to control their emotions and therefore often experience intense feelings. Over the years, they become so used to this that they get bored easily when the intensity is missing. They therefore generally have little interest in finding solutions. Instead, they usually only want to create drama. 

Another reason for the drama is to push the spouse away when they are feeling suffocated and controlled by the intimacy. This is why they tend to create fights -- over absolutely nothing -- immediately following a great weekend or intimate evening spent together.


> Any thoughts/ideas how to figure out what she really wants vs. what was manic nuttiness?


Drover, I suggest you see a clinical psychologist -- for a visit or two by yourself -- to obtain a candid professional opinion on what it is you are dealing with. Certainly, I don't know whether your W has most BPD traits at a strong level. Moreover, only a professional can diagnose BPD. I nonetheless believe you can spot the red flags if you take time to read about them. There is nothing subtle about traits such as verbal abuse and temper tantrums.

An easy place to start is my description of such traits in Maybe's thread at http://talkaboutmarriage.com/general-relationship-discussion/33734-my-list-hell.html#post473522. If that discussion rings a bell, I would be glad to discuss it with you and point you to good online resources. Take care, Drover.


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## *needaunderstand* (Jun 11, 2012)

look durning my episodes, i remember every thing that i say. i regret much of what i say but i remember. some things i say, i say them to hurt the person im mad at. not because it s true. but because im are mad.


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## CallaLily (Jan 13, 2011)

Drover said:


> she also thought the FBI was after her, and other assorted craziness.


Doesn't sound like bipolar to me. Although she could have that along with another mental illness, believe it or not people can have more than one. I would get a second opinion.


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## thunderstruck (May 9, 2012)

Drover said:


> Because I was intentionally looking for advice *isolated * from this fact.


It doesn't work that way, at least it didn't with my depressed/anxious W. I went on a mission to grow my sack back a few years ago. My W appreciates most of the benefits of being with the "new" confident/strong me, but it also sends her into a tailspin from time to time. In your case, mix in BP, and you are rocking the foundation under your wife's feet.

You'll have to choose your path. For me, I refused to return to walking on eggshells to soothe my wife. It will likely cause my marriage to end sooner, but I've accepted that.


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## Drover (Jun 11, 2012)

CallaLily said:


> Doesn't sound like bipolar to me. Although she could have that along with another mental illness, believe it or not people can have more than one. I would get a second opinion.


This is one of the differences between BP I and BP II. BP I has more severe manic episodes that often have psychosis, paranoia, etc that accompany them. She's a pretty classic case actually, and she received identical diagnoses at two hospitals.


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## Drover (Jun 11, 2012)

thunderstruck said:


> It doesn't work that way, at least it didn't with my depressed/anxious W. I went on a mission to grow my sack back a few years ago. My W appreciates most of the benefits of being with the "new" confident/strong me, but it also sends her into a tailspin from time to time. In your case, mix in BP, and you are rocking the foundation under your wife's feet.
> 
> You'll have to choose your path. For me, I refused to return to walking on eggshells to soothe my wife. It will likely cause my marriage to end sooner, but I've accepted that.


I'm aware the two things aren't separable in practice. I was trying to get information that way so the focus of the thread would NOT be on one thing versus the other.


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

CallaLily said:


> Doesn't sound like bipolar to me. Although she could have that along with another mental illness, believe it or not people can have more than one. I would get a second opinion.


actually no, this does happen in the extreme manic states where the thoughts race so much that the person exhibits schizophrenic symptoms. It isn't common but it isn't extremely rare or unheard of


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## CallaLily (Jan 13, 2011)

Drover said:


> This is one of the differences between BP I and BP II. BP I has more severe manic episodes that often have psychosis, paranoia, etc that accompany them. She's a pretty classic case actually, and she received identical diagnoses at two hospitals.


Is she on meds? And Yes I'm sure there is a difference between BP I and BP II. But like I said, sometimes there are other mental disorders that go along with the one.


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## trey69 (Dec 29, 2010)

Are you in therapy? If not, might be a good idea for you to seek some counseling for yourself. If you are living with someone with a mental illness you need some help as well. You might want to seek out a counselor who specializes in mental illness, so they can help guide you and give you some suggestions of things to do or try when she has a episode. 

As far as trying to figure out what she really wants vs. whats manic nuttiness, thats probably something you will beat your head against the wall over. No one will probably know that for sure.


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

Bipolar can in fact exhibit paranoid delusions as an additional affect of a psychotic break. I have experienced depression psychosis with paranoia as part of my life with bipolar. Never experienced marked paranoia on a manic phase though.


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## Drover (Jun 11, 2012)

CallaLily said:


> Is she on meds?.


This was her first manic/psychotic break and was just recently diagnosed. She is now on meds, and just got stable a little over a week ago.


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## Drover (Jun 11, 2012)

trey69 said:


> Are you in therapy? If not, might be a good idea for you to seek some counseling for yourself. If you are living with someone with a mental illness you need some help as well. You might want to seek out a counselor who specializes in mental illness, so they can help guide you and give you some suggestions of things to do or try when she has a episode.


Yes, I started counseling on my own last week and am going to NAMI support groups.


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

Drover said:


> Because I was intentionally looking for advice isolated from this fact.


But it's not isolated when it's the same person.


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## trey69 (Dec 29, 2010)

Drover said:


> Yes, I started counseling on my own last week and am going to NAMI support groups.


Its good you are in counseling and finding some support. Its really all you can do at this point. Take one day at a time.


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## Kurosity (Dec 22, 2011)

NAMI will help you a lot. I suggest study everything you can get your hands on about the disorder and talk with both consumer and family at these NAMI groups because they can help you more then most can to understand and be prepared for another crisis.

It will take time for her to come to terms with being bipolar. It is a lot to deal with. My husband told me once after his diagnosis that it was not fair to learn the extreme amounts of energy he loved were part of his illness and not part of him. He worried that things he thought were part of his personality were going to go away with the medication. He was sad that "there was something wrong with him" for weeks after he was told. He still hates it and avoids telling anyone because people are very in to believing the myths and stigma of "mental illness". I too have had my fair share of the uneducated judgment. Once had a coworker ask me if I was afraid my H would kill me and the children........but I am now just going on and on.

I would suggest going to Family counseling (instead of MC) because there are going to be new dynamics to your family life that you might want help getting through and making changes that help everyone. Build your self a support system.
Like I said before to understand what your wife wants you will have to pay attention and when she is level ask her.


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