# Not any better



## lostluv (May 12, 2008)

Hey guys, I'm back again. I have been trying to stay open and positive to see what happens with my husband but it's just not working. The only time we are getting alone is if we are not communicating. We are both dead set on our side is the right side and don't want to concede to the other side. I apparently ticked him off again yesterday (obvious by actions). I asked him last night if there was anything he wanted to talk about and he said no. This morning I asked him if he was at least going to tell me what I did and he refused. I told him fine to have fun sulking then (I know not productive). I'm just tired of begging him to communicate only to end up in the same cycle of arguements. Later on he sent me a text apologizing for the way he was acting. I didn't respond to him because I'm not ready to let it go and couldn't think of anything positive to say. I just don't want him to think he can treat me however and thenn make it all better by saying he's sorry. To make all of this worse our anniversary is next week. We have already talked about it in regard to finances and time and have nothing planned. He says that's one of the things he's stressed about: He wants it to go well. I am working all day that day and so is he then there are things to do for the kids that evening. Sadly, this does not bother me. It actually relieves me to thing that I will be able to use our busy schedule to avoid making a big deal of the day. I just don't see any point in celebrating such a disasterous situation as what our marriage is at this point. I'm sure these thoughts make me look like a really horrible wife, and who knows...maybe I am. I'm just tired, frustrated, and ready to run! Help! Anyone?


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## Blanca (Jul 25, 2008)

Ok i read some of your previous posts. you dont sound like a bad wife. you sound really frustrated and confused. you dont want to hurt your kids, your finances, but at the same time you're tired of this lack of communication and intimacy in your relationship. You feel controlled and ignored by him but then confused when he sporadically clings to you by telling you he loves you all the time. is that about right?

What have you tried, besides talking, to communicate with him? In the last few months have you tried anything different then what you have already been doing?

Have you tried listening to him without talking? Are you interested in his side, and how he expresses his side? 

If he completely understood you, and your needs, what would he do differently?


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## lostluv (May 12, 2008)

His clinging isn't really sporatic, it's pretty constant. Always has been. If I don't respond with the affermative " I love you too" he gets all bent out of shape, so I say it to keep the peace. I would love to hear his side of the story but he doesn't comunicate. Even when I ask him to do so it's always the same. He tells me he loves me and always wants to be with me. He tells me that is the decision he has made and that's the way it is. Tells me if I would just make the same decision that all would be well. As for the lack of intimacy, sure that is my doing. I have no desire to be intimate with him. I realized the other day just how long that has been true when I was thinking about our 5 year anniversery and how trapped I felt being alone with him for the whole weekend and how I felt the same way on our 9th. The only time I really felt relaxed was when we were out and about, at least then I didn't feel pressured to be intimate and perform. I know this sounds gastly, but it's how I feel. When he calls me to say hi or see how my day is going I get irritated and wonder why he has to call. Like I have said before, I truely enjoy the time away from him.
As for what I have tried: I've tried talking, listening, reading, writing, even telling him I would no longer be trying to save the marriage and if he wanted such it was up to him. Where has all of this gotten us? We are still together but there is no communication (sure we talk about the kids, day to day stuff, etc. Just not about us or the marriage) On average we have sex once a month because I feel guilty for not allowing him any. He calls it "making love" but there are no emotions or attachments involved on my part. 
I just feel I am stuck in this dark, lonely, bismal abiss whith no way out and no hope.


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## sunnygirl (Nov 23, 2008)

Ack! Tell me about it. I feel like I am in the same boat. I have come to realize men are just different about communication than women. I can NEVER read my husband, at all. He always seems upset to me, but it is just his direct New Jersey accent, I guess. This has caused numerous fights. 

Like you, I am in no way attracted to my husband, but I put out every now and then just to keep the peace. I'm so tired of doing this. I feel like there is this huge void in my life that I'm not sure I can live without much longer. In every other respect, our relationship is OK, but just OK. No fireworks, butterflies, or anything. There really never has been, which makes me wonder if there ever could be in the future. I'm so sad right now and just want out, but I don't want to hurt him. He really does love me and I am his whole world.

I guess I don't really have much advice for you, but I know where you are coming from and I can sympathize.


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## lostluv (May 12, 2008)

Thanks sunnygirl, at least I don't feel like I'm the only person in the world who feels this way. Now if I could just figure out what to do with it.


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## magicsunset08 (Oct 30, 2008)

lostluv & sunnygirl. What has caused this? I feel i am in the same boat with my wife. She fell out of luv with me sometime ago, had an affair. I never saw it coming. Things are better now, but I don't feel the emotinal connection with her at all. I don't think she will let me totally back in. She's the one who had the affair. I have fixed many things that may have caused her stress in the past. I just don't think she looks at me that way any longer. I love her, but quite frankly i am getting tired of trying to keep her happy so she will pay attention to me. It goes both ways. I am a great communicator. I love to talk and listen and help with issues> My wife is not like that. I obviously can't help you with your issues. I was just curious, why aren't you attracted to your husband anymore. Is it because he is "trying too hard?"


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## lostluv (May 12, 2008)

For me I think it is all of the years of trying to communicate and getting nowhere. Feeling that I was the one who was doing all of the giving. He would say that he would change, and occasionally would for a bit, then it was right back to the way things were. I did alot of changing for his benefit and never felt I was reciprocated or appriciated for it. I always feel there is something he would like me to do different or more. We still have the same disagreements about the same stuff we have had for YEARS. When I try to get him to address the issues he would rather just wait for them to pass. I have told him that I can not live like this and want things to be different, I'm still waiting. 
Don't get me wrong, I have had my fair share of mistakes in our relationship and some of them have been really big (affair) but he says he doesn't care because he loves me and thats all that matters. Then I get told if he can see past my imperfections because he loves me then I should be able to do the same for him. I feel like this is his way of holding things over my head and trying to control me. It also only furthers my thought process of "maybe I don't love him....so why stay".
He says he is simply trying to connect and show interest in my life by calling or texting me all the time, asking where I am, what I'm doing, etc. I see it as being checked up on and smothered. 
I have always been less of an affectionate person than he, in the beginning I would try to show more affection to make him happy because he said that's what he needed. Even then constant hand holding and always wanting to kiss and hug on me in public bothered me. (I come from a very non-affectionate home) Now having him do so even at home is almost more than I can stand. I do not try to stop him when he makes physical contact, but I do try to keep it as brief as possible.
We had a big blow up over the summer and I told him how unhappy I have been for years, he wanted to work it out so I said we would try. After a few months I told him it wasn't working and I was tired of trying. Told him that if he wanted to stay married it was up to him to make it happen. Since then I have felt totally unattached to our marriage and there has been no attempt to communicate about "us" by either he or I.
If it wasn't for our girls I would probably be long gone. I care about his feelings too but he is an adult and can take care of himself. He has already told me that if I try to divorce him he will make it as bitter as possible for me and fight me every step of the way. I am very independant and assertive, I know I could handle it but I'm afraid of what it would do to my kids.
I'm not sure I answered you question or not and am pretty sure I have repeated some of the same stuff from some of my other post (sorry all) I just started typing and forgot to pause.


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## MarkTwain (Aug 1, 2008)

lostluv said:


> As for the lack of intimacy, sure that is my doing. I have no desire to be intimate with him. I realized the other day just how long that has been true when I was thinking about our 5 year anniversery and how trapped I felt being alone with him for the whole weekend and how I felt the same way on our 9th. The only time I really felt relaxed was when we were out and about, at least then I didn't feel pressured to be intimate and perform. I know this sounds gastly, but it's how I feel. When he calls me to say hi or see how my day is going I get irritated and wonder why he has to call. Like I have said before, I truely enjoy the time away from him.





lostlove said:


> I have always been less of an affectionate person than he, in the beginning I would try to show more affection to make him happy because he said that's what he needed. Even then constant hand holding and always wanting to kiss and hug on me in public bothered me. (I come from a very non-affectionate home) Now having him do so even at home is almost more than I can stand. I do not try to stop him when he makes physical contact, but I do try to keep it as brief as possible.


Reading your two quotes above, I wonder why you even bother. You despise the guy's very existence. In turn he has something very wrong with him to put up with your behaviour. One of you needs to fix him/herself.


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## lostluv (May 12, 2008)

Fair enough, suppose I deserve that...


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## MarkTwain (Aug 1, 2008)

lostluv-

Well that's honest of you to take it on the chin from me. 

The thing is sweetheart, the title of this thread is "Not any better". I assumed that meant you wished it were better. In order for that to happen you would need to stop the tit for tat bickering and start loving each other. It only takes one to start.

Every day the pair of you create your marriage. you are both putting energy into making a bad music. Why not fire the composer, and try working on a different melody?

PS: see if this fits: http://talkaboutmarriage.com/ladies-lounge/3223-beating-myself-up.html#post29767 (my post #7)


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## lostluv (May 12, 2008)

I guess in all honesty I'm not sure if I want it to be better or just over. I do not deny him of most things he wants such as a kiss when one of us leaves or comes home, a kiss goodnight, etc. I still tell him I love him, but only whe he says it first. We still shair the same bed. In general we are able to co-exist pretty well. We just don't communicate for ****. I try to initiate conversation by asking him what is bothering him, but he doesn't answer. Probably for the same reasons I don't talk to him about what is bothering me. It never goes well and eventually we end the conversation (or arguement) in silence and then after a bit go on with life as if it never happened. That's kinda his favorite way to deal (ignore it and it will go away).
I do not despise him I just have lost all desire to be married to him. I stay because it is the "right" thing to do. It's what he wants and it keeps the kids from going through the turmoil of a bitter divorce. So instead I stay and just trudge through each day doing my "job" as a wife and mother.
As for him, he says he stays because he loves me that much and because he wants nothing more than to spend the ret of his life with me.


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## MarkTwain (Aug 1, 2008)

lostluv-

As I said in that other thread, it's the closeness in marriage that causes the contempt and turn off. It's because the other person reflects your worst fears to you. YOUR worst fears. That's why some people find relief in superficial affairs - there is no challenge, they keep their spouse on for that role, and save all the good stuff for the affair.

If you left your hubby and found another perfect male, all would be well until you settled down and got close. Then it would all repeat - not exactly the same, but close enough to make you realise you might have better spent your time saving your current marriage.

If you were willing to look deep within and be willing to grow and move to the next level, you would find that you and your husband could craft a marriage that was the envy of all your friends. It's not hard, just unusual.

It's no effort really because it's about letting go.

Letting go of who you think you are, and finding out who you really are.
​


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## lostluv (May 12, 2008)

MarkTwain-
I'm not sure I am following you. Maybe I am just dense. What fears? My biggest fear has already happened. I am in a marriage with someone I feel I no longer love and that I resent do to all of the changes I have made over the years to be the perfect wife and keep the marriage happy. I now look back and feel that I was happier when I was the other person: more independant, self confident, not second guessing everything I do and say and whether or not it will offend my H or send him into a tizzy. 

I watched my mother constantly conform to my father's ideas of who she should be and how she should act and always swore i would never do that. Like me for who I am or leave. I never stuck to that and now I am resentful of that fact.

Right now I see my H as a roommate on co-parent to our children but have no desire to have it be any more than that. I feel I have been used and manipulated for his happiness for too many years.

I just want to be loved for being me. However, I don't feel that is possible in my current marriage. I would leave but I have taken to heart all the time that he has said it would destroy him and our girls. Not to mention, I know financially he can not make it on his own. 

I guess I am having such a tough time with this because I am embattled with myself. I want to get out but feel it would be too devistating to everone involved to do so. So I stay, but I can't figure out what to do to make staying feel better for me.


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## MarkTwain (Aug 1, 2008)

lostluv said:


> Right now I see my H as a roommate on co-parent to our children but have no desire to have it be any more than that.


What you have put in the above quote clearly states what you want. So it is highly likely that things will continue just as they are or even get worse.

To answer your question, just re-read your last post. It is full of fear and resentment. In fact, re-read your whole thread. I think you don't love yourself, and you are blaming your husband.

The closeness of marriage squeezes our worst fears out of their hiding places, and right into our faces. Then we project those fears onto our spouse. Of course, the same thing is happening to him, and he is projecting onto you but his fears are different to yours.

The lack of desire and love you are experiencing for him is due to this projection. You are not seeing him as he is, you are seeing your own hologram of him.

Actually, we never see things as they really are, but we can allow the hologram to be a better match to reality if we have the desire to tread the path of truth. Or we can stay in the illusion, find another partner, and repeat the whole thing, warts and all.


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## lostluv (May 12, 2008)

Ok, so I finally got him to talk to me last night after 3 months of no communicaton. There was alot of him saying that yes he was unhappy and why. It was basically givin as it is my fault because if I would just do this or that then things would be beter. I asked how he can go through life and not want to discuss the things that are bothering him. He says that he is just concentrating on the positive and doesn't wan't do disturb the forward progress. When I asked him what forward progress he saw because I am not seeing it he got really quiet, stared off into space and the conversation ended. We went to sleep without so much as a goodnight to each other. This morning we basically are back to the minimal interaction again. So now what? Was I wrong to say what I did? I just don't get it.


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## MarkTwain (Aug 1, 2008)

lostluv-

No you were not wrong. You need to keep up the communication. He may not be used to it, so he has to get used to it. If he thinks things have been getting better, that sounds good.

What are his list of complaints?


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## lostluv (May 12, 2008)

I'm not sure he actually does think things are getting better. I asked him to give me examples and he had none.

As for his list of complaints:
I am too distant
I do not respect him
I do not provide enough to him phisically and sexually
I care too much about my other friends
If I would just focus on being in the marriage and ignore the negative feelings I would get over them.
I have used money he feels was his to do as he wanted with to pay bills.

The list goes on but that is the general layout of it.


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