# HOPE for overcomimg adultry



## Mr Blunt (Jul 18, 2012)

Hope for overcomimg Adultry


I thought that I would post this thread because I think that not enough attention is given to those that overcome adultery for years. I can understand why there is so many threads and attention given to those that are hurting so bad because they have not overcome adultery. In fact you can see by checking out the 10,564 threads on this section “Coping with Infidelity” how much attention is given. That is one of the largest sections on TAM. In contrast, you can also see that the section titled “Long Term Success in Marriage” is one of the smallest on the whole TAM web site with only 301 threads.

I am hoping that this thread will help someone that is suffering due to infidelity. I think that a person that has many years of overcoming adultery can offer a lot to those that are so discouraged. Sometime ago I posted a thread that asked how many had around 5 years or more in successful recovery and if I remember right there were only two; WAZZA and Amplexor. I have not seen many posts by Amplexor on this “Coping With Infidelity” section but I do see that WAZZA stills posts and I read a lot of his posts. 

With this thread I want to reprint just a section of a thread that is from the “Long Term Success in Marriage”. The title of the thread is “How we overcame adultery” by Bestblu1 and the link is
http://talkaboutmarriage.com/long-term-success-marriage/8698-how-we-overcame-adultery.html

I hope that you read this thread as Bestblu1’s success at his last post was over 3 years long and his story is remarkable! I would like to hear from Bestblu but the thread stopped after 3 years. I hope that it will help someone and if there are any comments about this thread I would encourage you to post them.


How we overcame adultery 
Thread by Bestblu1 October 2009
http://talkaboutmarriage.com/long-term-success-marriage/8698-how-we-overcame-adultery.html

By Bestblu1
________________________________________
My wife and I have been married for 30 plus years. We have 5 children and 3 grandkids.

In July 2009, I discovered that she had been cheating on me for about 12 years. We have recovered and are doing very well. It may seem hard to believe but it's true.

If there is anyone who sincerely wants to overcome the pain of an adulterous relationship, I may be able to share some things that can help you. The things we did to get our marriage back on track are working for us.

I really believe that our story can help others who truly want to restore their marriage and trust. Let me know if you would like any advice. 




July 12, 2012 Three years later

*Originally Posted by loveisforever* 
It is very nice of you to take your wife back. But for the sake of responsibility, justice, and considering the human nature, it is natural outcome to let her go anyway. Your case is an exception that parallels with the fact that some criminals can be changed into good person by self remorse after being caught without punishment. It is really nice to get everyone happy with forgiveness and forgetfulness. It just does not work all the time , or most of the time. Your story is encouraging for the cheaters.


*Response by Bestblu1*
You are absolutely correct that it doesn't work all the time. But it does work sometimes. Nowhere in my thread have I ever suggested that our results would or could be the same for every situation. However I do believe that for those situations where both parties truly want it to work out, it is possible. There are plenty of stories of failure on this forum. Nothing wrong with one or two stories of success. And by the way, success is relative to your situation. For some betrayed parties success may be successfully moving on from a relationship where the cheating spouse does not want to change. For some it is reconciliation and rebuilding of the marriage. 

I will continue to try to tell our story in a way that doesn't appear to be an attempt to "make everyone happy with forgiveness and forgetfulness". There is a lot of forgiveness in my situation but I will never forget, nor will my wife. That is not possible.

I disagree with your assessment that my story encourages cheaters to cheat. In my case, forgiveness has encouraged my wife to change. Cheaters don't really need encouragement to cheat do they? Judgement and unforgiveness on the other hand can keep people from changing. 

Here is an account from the New Testament that explains how I view forgiveness:

John 8:1-11

"1 but Jesus went to the Mount of Olives.

2 At dawn he appeared again in the temple courts, where all the people gathered around him, and he sat down to teach them. 3 The teachers of the law and the Pharisees brought in a woman caught in adultery. They made her stand before the group 4 and said to Jesus, “Teacher, this woman was caught in the act of adultery. 5 In the Law Moses commanded us to stone such women. Now what do you say?” 6 They were using this question as a trap, in order to have a basis for accusing him.

But Jesus bent down and started to write on the ground with his finger. 7 When they kept on questioning him, he straightened up and said to them, “Let any one of you who is without sin be the first to throw a stone at her.” 8 Again he stooped down and wrote on the ground.

9 At this, those who heard began to go away one at a time, the older ones first, until only Jesus was left, with the woman still standing there. 10 Jesus straightened up and asked her, “Woman, where are they? Has no one condemned you?”

11 “No one, sir,” she said.

“Then neither do I condemn you,” Jesus declared. “Go now and leave your life of sin.”

True, some will not change no matter what. But I believe the chance of them changing is greater if they feel truly forgiven. And if they don't change, that's on them not the person that forgives them.


*COMMENTS?*


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## user_zero (Aug 30, 2013)

so he thinks forgiveness and having no consequences are the same thing. hmmm.... :scratchhead:

I respect his decision. I mean its his marriage, his life. but I don't agree with him. I mean 12 years for god's sake. do you have any idea how many marriage anniversary , birthdays , Christmas , valentine days are there? for 12 years , his partner was not 100% with him. there was someone else unbeknown to him who he was sharing his wife with.

I ask myself why would he need religious words to prove that his decision was/is right, if it was/is such a rational/reasonable decision.

somethings very wrong here!


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Mr Blunt,

There are many success stories. People tend to not stay here and talk about it. They go on with their lives.

On this forum there is a huge emphasis on punishment of the WS. There is very little support for recovery. And there is even less emphasis on as BS looking at their contribution to that poor state of the marriage.

IT would be good to have more success stories.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

user_zero said:


> so he thinks forgiveness and having no consequences are the same thing. hmmm.... :scratchhead:
> 
> I respect his decision. I mean its his marriage, his life. but I don't agree with him. I mean 12 years for god's sake. do you have any idea how many marriage anniversary , birthdays , Christmas , valentine days are there? for 12 years , his partner was not 100% with him. there was someone else unbeknown to him who he was sharing his wife with.
> 
> ...


What consequences do you think this wife needed to have? What punishment does he need to meter out to her to satisfy you?


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

user_zero said:


> so he thinks forgiveness and having no consequences are the same thing. hmmm.... :scratchhead:
> 
> I respect his decision. I mean its his marriage, his life. but I don't agree with him. I mean 12 years for god's sake. do you have any idea how many marriage anniversary , birthdays , Christmas , valentine days are there? for 12 years , his partner was not 100% with him. there was someone else unbeknown to him who he was sharing his wife with.
> 
> ...


His wife was very lucky, im my opinion. She could so easily have given him an STD. 

However, I am genuinely pleased they recovered.

Of course, Christ did add an important provision: "...and sin no more."


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

Of course no one cheated on Jesus either. A mile in his sandals and like that.


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## Ovid (Oct 11, 2012)

Runs like Dog said:


> Of course no one cheated on Jesus either. A mile in his sandals and like that.


Judas...
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## user_zero (Aug 30, 2013)

EleGirl said:


> What consequences do you think this wife needed to have? What punishment does he need to meter out to her to satisfy you?


maybe I chose the wrong words to post , I don't know. when you use the word punishment you're suggesting a malicious intent. which I assure you its not my intention. I don't think punishing someone because they cheated on you is a right think to do. the right think I believe is to have consequences. and these consequences is different for each BS's and WS's. I can't give a specific set. its their job. and only they can do it. the point of having consequences is to make sure the affair doesn't happen again.

here some people think that divorce is a punishment. which I disagree. you see marriage is a contract between two people. they took vow in front of family , friends and God. yes both of partners contribute to the state of marriage. BUT only one of them cheats. why? and btw cheating isn't solution. I've been reading TAM's , LS , ... for the past three years and not even one situation I've seen that actually solved anything. 

the thing that's bothering me is that this guy's spouse was cheating on him for 12 years. I mean that's not a ONS or a few months. that's 12 YEARS. (pretty long time to understand what you're doing isn't solving anything) and when somebody asks him why he is reconciling. he comes up with a religious phrase about not condemning sins and forgiveness. that makes me think : 
1- he is married to his wife for 30 years or so.
2- he probably after all of this time couldn't live without her. can't see a life without her (which is personal choice and I respect that).
3- he is obviously a very religious person.
4- he wanna stay with his wife. he needs a strong anchor so this decision would make sense to him. so he would not lose self-respect. the strongest anchor is religion (for him).
5- so in his mind , he is connecting divorcing his wife with a way of punishment of a 'sin' AND staying with his wife with forgiveness (which is a religious virtue). therefore he stays with his wife. saves his self-respect. have a peace of mind because of his virtues decision. (I'm not mocking)

I know I don't know his whole story. but when I read it that was the first thing came to my mind. 
personally I don't think staying or ending a relationship (marriage) after cheating is a good or bad decision. what makes it a bad or good decision is how do you stay/end , why do you stay/end , on what terms do you stay/end.
if you consider these , I think you would agree that the only person who could with 100% certainty can say whether his decision was right or wrong is himself.

PS: If I insulted anyone , I'm truly sorry. that was not my intention.


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## Truthseeker1 (Jul 17, 2013)

Well if he is happy and at peace with his decision - good for him - but 12 years is a long time to betray someone...a long time....


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## Truthseeker1 (Jul 17, 2013)

and no it was not his fault that his wife cheated for 12 long years....


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## aug (Aug 21, 2011)

Truthseeker1 said:


> and no it was not his fault that his wife cheated for 12 long years....


It's surprising that he did not pick up on any clues of her cheating in the 12+ years.


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## Truthseeker1 (Jul 17, 2013)

aug said:


> It's surprising that he did not pick up on any clues of her cheating in the 12+ years.


I read some of the linked thread and had to stop - I did not get it at all. And I do not view all affairs the same way - but she had a lover for over a decade....that is a lot to get over. I hope he is at peace with his choice and happy - but I don't get it at all.


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## Mr Blunt (Jul 18, 2012)

> Quote of User Zero
> so he thinks forgiveness and having no consequences are the same thing. hmmm....


How did you come to that judgment? Posting some backup to substantiate your point would give your position more credibility.

It seems to me that what the OP stated was the opposite of what you concluded. Here below are a few quotes from the OP that substantiates that his position is opposite of what you concluded



> *
> Quotes of Bestblu1*
> Now, I watch everything she does. I check her email regularly. I check her phone records. I ask her periodically about her activities. I scrutinize how she talks, the expressions on her face, her ability to look me in the eye when I ask her hard questions.
> 
> ...




User Zero, Did you read the thread?


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## Mr Blunt (Jul 18, 2012)

> *Quote of User Zero*
> I ask myself why would he need religious words to prove that his decision was/is right, if it was/is such a rational/reasonable decision.
> *somethings very wrong here!*



*What is wrong?*


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## user_zero (Aug 30, 2013)

yes he is monitoring. but when it comes to reasons for reconciliation , he comes up with religious statements. I already posted the reason for my conclusion in my second post on this thread, Did you read it?

I understand that when there are a lot of affair threads which ends in divorce, it is good we read a successful reconciliation story. it gives hope. don't get me wrong I think threads like Reconciliation, Why we don't cheat , .... are a most. those are positive ones. but this one doesn't feel right to me. that's just it. I'm not looking for punishment , satisfaction , .... 

PS: I'm just happy my opinion has no effect on his choices, therefore no responsibility would fall on my shoulders.


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## thatbpguy (Dec 24, 2012)

First and foremost, if two people can really overcome betraying, then I think it's great. They have won my deepest admiration.

As to that quote in John, it is out of context. The context is two-fold. First, that all sin and fall short of the glory of God. Second, that God has the authority to forgive sins. 

As to what the Bible does say....

First, the 7th of the 10 Commandments is, "Thou shalt not commit adultery" (Exodus 20:14). The New Testament is replete with teachings on betrayal (Matthew 5:28, II Peter 2:14, I Corinthians 6:18 to list a few). 

Next, Under the law of Moses the penalty was death by stoning. (Deuteronomy 22:21 ff, John 8:4,5). The only other capitol punishment besides betrayal is murder. The only grounds in the Bible for divorce is also betrayal. Evidently, although only God can forgive sins, but the consequences for betrayal is pretty steep. I could expand on all this but I don't think it necessary.

But let's lay that aside for now.

The damage done by betrayal is so great and can affect so many that overcoming it FULLY is very hard to do. 

There is no automatic right for a second chance for a betrayer. 

So I have maintained that anyone given a second chance and especially those who's spouses are able to overcome their betrayal against them, the marriage, the family, the children... then they should see as if it is a true gift from God and live a life acknowledging such.

And now the disclaimer for nit picky people.... I realize that the other non betraying spouse isn't perfect and some are downright despicable. But rarely is there true justification for betrayal.


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## Mr Blunt (Jul 18, 2012)

> * By thatbpguy*
> So I have maintained that anyone given a second chance and especially those who's spouses are able to overcome their betrayal against them, the marriage, the family, the children... then they should see as if it is a true gift from God and live a life acknowledging such.



*I get the impression from reading Bestblu’s thread that is what happened to his wife. The reprint below is one of the statements by Bestblu that leads me to that conclusion*



> Once I verbally forgave her, she told me later, she felt *something inside of her change*. Remember, she had been concealing this for 12 years and it was tormenting her.


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## thatbpguy (Dec 24, 2012)

Mr Blunt said:


> *I get the impression from reading Bestblu’s thread that is what happened to his wife. The reprint below is one of the statements by Bestblu that leads me to that conclusion*


I have great respect for them.


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## jay_gatsby (Jun 4, 2013)

EleGirl said:


> Mr Blunt,
> 
> There are many success stories. People tend to not stay here and talk about it. They go on with their lives.
> 
> ...


Yes, this site needs a more moderate view. Because of the nature of what this site is intended for, it tends to read like the evening news... all the bad, but attention grabbing headlines, and little good news (the success stories).


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## Mr Blunt (Jul 18, 2012)

> Quote of User Zero
> so he thinks forgiveness and having no consequences are the same thing. hmmm....
> 
> By BLUNT
> ...



Yes I read it and you did not post any quotes from the OP. With your statement of 
* “so he thinks forgiveness and having no consequences are the same thing"*
* is not substantiated by the OP’s posts.*


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## jay_gatsby (Jun 4, 2013)

thatbpguy said:


> And now the disclaimer for nit picky people.... I realize that the other non betraying spouse isn't perfect and some are downright despicable. But rarely is there true justification for betrayal.


:iagree: I only quoted the last part but I agree with the whole post.


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## Mr Blunt (Jul 18, 2012)

> I have great respect for them.



I am amazed! This man Bestblu has shown what it is to live the higher spiritual plane of Christianity. Who ever said that Christianity is for the weak is ignorant of real Christianity.

*I cannot remember ever seeing such reconciliation, grace, and forgiveness in an adulterous marriage! Outstanding!*


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## jay_gatsby (Jun 4, 2013)

Mr Blunt said:


> I am amazed! This man Bestblu has shown what it is to live the higher spiritual plane of Christianity. Who ever said that Christianity is for the weak is ignorant of real Christianity.
> 
> *I cannot remember ever seeing such reconciliation, grace, and forgiveness in an adulterous marriage! Outstanding!*


It takes a man of courage and faith to do what he did. Not many of us out in the real world would be able to do what he did though.


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## Mr Blunt (Jul 18, 2012)

> *Originally Posted by Mr Blunt *
> I am amazed! This man Bestblu has shown what it is to live the higher spiritual plane of Christianity. Who ever said that Christianity is for the weak is ignorant of real Christianity.
> 
> I cannot remember ever seeing such reconciliation, grace, and forgiveness in an adulterous marriage! Outstanding!
> ...



Very true Jay very true!
I wonder if I would have the courage and faith to do what Bestblu did?


I wonder if one of the reasons that this thread is ignored by some is that they do not what to do what Bestblu did; they want an easier answer….. not one that takes a lot of courage and faith.


If infidelity occurs then the BS has every right to divorce. If he/she decides that the WS is truly remorseful and has proved that with actions and decides to R then the BS needs to step up to the plate. Stepping up to the plate means to take some of the actions that Bestblu did and other successful TAM posters and stop nurturing your hurt. Are you going to hurt? Sure you are but it is the BS and WS job to stop feeding the hurt and get busy doing everything positive to make themselves better and to promote the R.

*Stop fostering the thoughts about how wrong you were done, how much you have been hurt, how much you have lost, etc. That will do nothing but drag you down and hurt the R. Turn the hurts into a motivation to improve yourself.*


If you really want to R there are enough posts on this TAM website to give you all the initial information you need to R. Bestblu’s thread is one, B1 and EI’s thread is another, and WAZZA has over 20 years of successful R.

*So make up your mind. Either Divorce or go all out for the R!!*
I like what my counselor told me after almost a year of counseling. He said either divorce or shut up about all the triggers and rehashing and get busy doing the hard work and go full speed promoting the R.


I can fully understand the rehashing for the first 6 months but there comes a time when you need to stop picking at your wounds and start being proactive towards R with positive actions!


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## Vanguard (Jul 27, 2011)

That passage from John 7.53-8.11 is not in the oldest manuscripts of the New Testament.


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## russell28 (Apr 17, 2013)

EleGirl said:


> Mr Blunt,
> 
> There are many success stories. People tend to not stay here and talk about it. They go on with their lives.
> 
> ...


This is because the poor state of the marriage prior, is a tiny little problem compared to the infidelity.. The BS contributed to the poor state of the marriage, along with the WS.. and the WS contributed even more to the poor state of the marriage, by not confiding in the BS, and instead bringing a third party into the marriage. So the BS' contribution was tiny, compared to the contribution of the WS/AP to the destruction process. The last thing a BS wants to hear after finding out they've been cheated on for years, is how they were 'controlling' or there was 'no communication'... screw that, the real issue was that you were considering/having/had an affair.. not that the BS didn't bring you flowers, anymore...

I agree that most long term success stories would probably avoid this site, or sites like it, to not have it always in their face.. what would the benefit to that be? I'd say more people that use this forum are still in the discovery phase, or trying to cope or find a path.. People that have found that path, no longer need it.


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## russell28 (Apr 17, 2013)

Mr Blunt said:


> Very true Jay very true!
> I wonder if I would have the courage and faith to do what Bestblu did?
> 
> 
> ...


I can't flip a switch, so if I still feel pain, or hurt, I can try hard to think positive thoughts, I can fight the negative, but I can't just turn them off. So saying 'shut up', telling me to ignore triggers sounds good in theory, but in reality they happen. So you can be all in with R, but with the realization that there will be hurt, there will be triggers, and they will taper off with time.. the WS needs to understand, and help the BS deal with them, not tell them to 'man up' and rub dirt on it... 
My wife will tell me positive things to get me out of a funk.. should I feel bad because I go into a funk? She had five years to cheat on me, I get six months to get over it? Why the time frame, can't I just do my best and hope to do it as soon as possible? Now I have to have limits to the amount of time I can hurt? Can I be sad on my 25th anniversary that's coming up in a couple months or is that not okay? I know I will be.. and I know I will fight with everything I have to stay positive, to keep compassion for my wife, to be understanding and to be kind... It's not enough that I'm strong and can show compassion and forgiveness, now I have to limit my own feelings of grief and pain.. I wonder if that MC has ever been cheated on. 

So I disagree with divorce or shut up... I still might divorce, probably won't.. I think our R is going well, but I sure won't shut up until I have nothing left to say on the topic. I think I should be allowed time to sort it out, not be pressured or rushed. That could lead to more resentments and things that aren't good for the R also.. it works both ways.


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## JMGrey (Dec 19, 2012)

Ovid said:


> Judas...
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Yikes, that standard applied to WSs definitely won't prompt any reconciliation:



> The Son of man goeth, even as it is written of him: but woe unto that man through whom the Son of man is betrayed! good were it for that man if he had not been born.
> 
> *Gospel of St. Matthew, XXVI, 24*​


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## Racer (Sep 24, 2009)

Mr Blunt said:


> *So make up your mind. Either Divorce or go all out for the R!!*
> I like what my counselor told me after almost a year of counseling. He said either divorce or shut up about all the triggers and rehashing and get busy doing the hard work and go full speed promoting the R.
> 
> 
> I can fully understand the rehashing for the first 6 months but there comes a time when you need to stop picking at your wounds and start being proactive towards R with positive actions!


Agh... but there’s a third stage. I too have been around awhile, but am in only a partial successful R. There is the WS to contend with;a marriage takes two.

That third stage is when the proactive part of R ends and the marriage begins to return to normalcy. My WW is a black/white thinker, so there is no grey. What that means is when she felt we were reconciled (as she defines what that is in her head), she stopped doing the ‘make up’ stuff and started back up the old routines; general complaining. That’s fine, we are far enough along: But I changed. What I once would tolerate in a marriage, I won’t anymore. The bar is set where I believe it should be for myself in actions, and where it should be for how I should be treated; and it is well grounded. She can set her own bar for herself, but not decide where mine should be set.

So the issue is her trying to restore the old dead marriage and those dynamics. I’m not playing along. So the adultery is behind us and we are into less traumatic marriage problems and dynamics... the same ones that eventually led to her adultery.


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## badmemory (Jul 31, 2012)

russell28 said:


> I can't flip a switch, so if I still feel pain, or hurt, I can try hard to think positive thoughts, I can fight the negative, but I can't just turn them off. So saying 'shut up', telling me to ignore triggers sounds good in theory, but in reality they happen. So you can be all in with R, but with the realization that there will be hurt, there will be triggers, and they will taper off with time.. the WS needs to understand, and help the BS deal with them, not tell them to 'man up' and rub dirt on it...
> 
> So I disagree with divorce or shut up... I still might divorce, probably won't.. I think our R is going well, but I sure won't shut up until I have nothing left to say on the topic. I think I should be allowed time to sort it out, not be pressured or rushed. That could lead to more resentments and things that aren't good for the R also.. it works both ways.


I would suspect that every BS's R is different depending on myriad of factors - not the least of which is the WS's resolve to work on the marriage.

But after two years of R with my wife - by in large successful so far, I've learned I have to accept some realities. Some good, some not so good, but things I didn't realize in the weeks after Dday. I don't presume that all BS's in R will agree; I'm just saying these are my own experiences.

- There does come a point after a year or so where rehashing the A is counter productive. If the WS is trying hard, opening the wounds can discourage their efforts.

- After two years, I still think about the A every day, about her betrayal and what I'd like to do to the POSOM. But now, I use other outlets to vent, like this one; and I try to internalize my worst thoughts when with her - for the sake of our marriage. After a few minutes, those thoughts dissipate; and I'm OK. They have lessened over time and the triggers aren't nearly as frequent.

- While I agree that the BS has to do their part of working on the marriage, I'm finding that the enthusiasm and affection I have available for her has a lower ceiling than it could have otherwise. I don't feel guilty for this. She created it, and I'm doing the best I can do. No matter how long we remain married, I will always carry the burden of knowing that my wife cheated on me. And she'll have to carry that burden as well. I used to hope that would change; now I don't believe it ever will.

- Despite this, I've become philosophical about my circumstances. As long as I'm content enough now, versus imagining how my life would be without her, I think I can accept this compromise - as long as she continues to do her part and is understanding about my limitations. Now, after two years, I'm realizing that it's not so much her remorse and heavy lifting I need any more, as much as her love and affection. 

So, it's easy for a counselor to tell you that the BS should go all in to work on the marriage when in R. In theory I agree. But that's easier said than done, when dealing with the ever present thoughts of betrayal.


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## Racer (Sep 24, 2009)

I like what you had to say about accepting certain realities that aren’t good. It becomes a choice whether you can deal with it. Like my wife, she lies, really big lies and will continue to dig her grave deeper when called out. It took me figuring out under what circumstances she feels that need to lie... and it all has to do with her looking really bad in the reflection she see’s in my eyes. So I work with it as best I can; I make sure she knows that I accept flaws in people and do not ever expect perfection. I accept her irrational thoughts and will poke fun at them. All this so she doesn’t have to see herself as pond scum whenever she screws up and feel she needs to hide it from me... She hopefully knows that it’s ok to screw up things every now and again in my eyes.

Also, you are right about that glass ceiling. My story is bad. My wife is a SA. As such, I consider it somewhat like having a tiger as a pet. There is an inherent danger there and you need to watch out and be willing to put it down (divorce). You kind of stayed prepared (the boy scout in me) that some day that tiger might get grumpy and decide to tear into you. Until then, you have fun owning a tiger, but you keep your eye out and your guard up just in case. I like to think of it as a “Xtreme” marriage (done in my best monster truck announcer voice). Gotta stay positive... It’s a rush being married to her. Boring it isn’t.

So, there’s emotional independence and distance from something you know may only be a temporary thing. You rely on her less for your emotional needs. The result is that it’s a conduit that flows both ways... I too find I’m less enthusiastic and have much less affection and draw to her than I did prior to DD. Some of it is also related to destroying the pedestal. Now I know she’s just human like the rest of us and not some deity gracing me with her presence.


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## badmemory (Jul 31, 2012)

Racer said:


> I Until then, you have fun owning a tiger, but you keep your eye out and your guard up just in case.


Now that's a perspective on R that I've never come across before. Good stuff.


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## Thorburn (Nov 23, 2011)

badmemory said:


> now that's a perspective on r that i've never come across before. Good stuff. :d


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## tulsy (Nov 30, 2012)

The religious overtones in this thread are so pronounced I thought it was in the "Politics and Religion" sub-forum. LOL

Fortunately, overcoming adultery doesn't automatically amount to staying with the person...IMO, you can overcome it on your own. 

Honestly, I could never stay with someone who had a 12 year affair behind my back. I don't believe for one second that staying makes you any more righteous in the eyes of a deity; if anything, I believe it's the worst decision you could make given the way it would affect the rest of your life...you would never be able to completely get past it; it's ugly head would keep appearing. I think that having the strength to dissolve the "marriage" and move on without her would be much more commendable. I mean 12 years??!!

You can forgive someone if they have repented and asked to be forgiven...if you want to. If you don't want to, you don't have to. You can just let it go and move on with your life. You don't owe them anything. Just my opinion.

The guy forgave his wife within 2 hours of telling him...2 hours, 12 years of affair, forgiven. That screams of rug-sweeping...there is no way she could divulge all the details of a 12 year affair in 2 hours, so that to me is rug-sweeping quite a bit.

He could agree to attempt reconciliation within 2 hrs....but not forgive all trust-passes, since he would be forgiving stuff he doesn't even know yet. 

Personally, I would never forgive her for that. It's one of the worst things someone could do to you....it should be the last thing you accept from your "best friend". But hey, if he's happy with a lying, cheating wife that can't be trusted, and if he's fine checking her phone, email, VARs, GPS, and mileage for the rest of his life, more power to him. That's not a normal healthy marriage, IMO. 

That's my 4 cents.

_PS: I want to finish by saying that whatever makes them happy, that's good for them. I could never tolerate or forgive something like that, but that's just me. If he can actually forgive her and they can live out their days happy, great for them._


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## Anuvia (Jul 10, 2013)

Everything is all good until the next time she cheats on you. I wouldn't be doing victory laps if I were you.


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## russell28 (Apr 17, 2013)

tulsy said:


> The religious overtones in this thread are so pronounced I thought it was in the "Politics and Religion" sub-forum. LOL
> 
> Fortunately, overcoming adultery doesn't automatically amount to staying with the person...IMO, you can overcome it on your own.
> 
> ...


I've been in R for about six months after my wife had a 5 year LTA.. I checked phone, gps, that stuff for a few months.. I don't check them anymore.


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## Racer (Sep 24, 2009)

russell28 said:


> I've been in R for about six months after my wife had a 5 year LTA.. I checked phone, gps, that stuff for a few months.. I don't check them anymore.


I still do 4.5 years out. Made that mistake once before of 'not checking'... Should have would have saved me about 4 more years of adulterous behavior. I don't expect to find anything, nor do I do it with that 'I gotta know' panic. It's more like random stuff. She tells me she's working late.... I verify her location.

Random gps at lunch time. If she's doing a GNO, I drop off "so she can drink" or a couple of her friends pick her up. A ton of little things just to verify.

Trust but verify. Words to live by.


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## Mr Blunt (Jul 18, 2012)

> *By Russell*
> I can't flip a switch, so if I still feel pain, or hurt, I can try hard to think positive thoughts, I can fight the negative, but I can't just turn them off. So saying 'shut up', telling me to ignore triggers sounds good in theory, but in reality they happen. So you can be all in with R, but with the realization that there will be hurt, there will be triggers, and they will taper off with time. the WS needs to understand, and help the BS deal with them, not tell them to 'man up' and rub dirt on it...





Russell, you are right there will be hurt and triggers that is for sure. I should have been clearer. I am saying that you should concentrate on NOT *“feeding” *and *“fostering”* those negative thoughts and hurts that will bombard you. I am not denying they will be coming at you often and trying to tear you down; they come to me every now and then and it has been over 20 years!

My post specified a WS that is “truly remorseful and has proved that with actions” not some WS that tells you to 'man up' and rub dirt on it...




> I get six months to get over it? Why the time frame, can't I just do my best and hope to do it as soon as possible? Now I have to have limits to the amount of time I can hurt? Can I be sad on my 25th anniversary that's coming up in a couple months or is that not okay? It's not enough that I'm strong and can show compassion and forgiveness, now I have to limit my own feelings of grief and pain.. I wonder if that MC has ever been cheated on.


Russell, I did not say 6 months to GET OVER IT; *I said 6 months to stop REHASHING and picking at your wounds*.
I am talking about bring up the same thing over and over again that does nothing but drag you both down. What good does it do to keep telling the WS and yourself that you have been craped on, that the WS is a cheater and a betrayer, and that they have caused permanent damage? *I can understand that for the first 6 months, though that is damage also, but I think that if you are going to improve that rehashing and picking at the wounds is harmful especially after 6 months* 



> “…. I know I will fight with everything I have to stay positive, to keep compassion for my wife, to be understanding and to be kind...


*That is very encouraging Russell!* That is part of what I am trying to promote. I think that you and I are not that far apart and it seems that you are doing some of the actions of the successful R people of Bestblu, Wazza, and B1 and EI.






> So I disagree with divorce or shut up...


*That was told to me when I was rehashing and picking at my wounds for about a year*. The MC told me that and it pissed me off! However, in retrospect, I see that I needed that blunt truth. That was one of the reasons that I decided to R but I can fully understanding anyone that would decide to D.
*I needed to get off the fence!*


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## Mr Blunt (Jul 18, 2012)

> By Racer
> She can set her own bar for herself, but not decide where mine should be set


*I like that statement!*


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## Mr Blunt (Jul 18, 2012)

> *By Bad Memory*
> But after two years of R with my wife - by in large successful so far, I've learned I have to accept some realities. Some good, some not so good, but things I didn't realize in the weeks after Dday. I don't presume that all BS's in R will agree; I'm just saying these are my own experiences.
> 
> - There does come a point after a year or so where rehashing the A is counter productive. If the WS is trying hard, opening the wounds can discourage their efforts.
> ...


*Very good post Bad Memory; very real and true!*


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## Mr Blunt (Jul 18, 2012)

> By Russell
> I've been in R for about six months after my wife had a 5 year LTA.. I checked phone, gps, that stuff for a few months.. I don't check them anymore.


I see that as a possible positive sign. Perhaps Russell is convinced that his wife is dead serious about R or that Russell is getting strong enough that he is not going to be the monitoring police. Maybe both? Just my guess; Russell can explain if he wants to.

I quit monitoring my wife also. I concluded that I was going to build myself up and if she wanted to go back to her secrecy and betrayal then I would get strong enough that I would move on and not be crushed again.


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## BetrayedAgain7 (Apr 27, 2013)

Mr Blunt said:


> I see that as a possible positive sign. Perhaps Russell is convinced that his wife is dead serious about R or that Russell is getting strong enough that he is not going to be the monitoring police. Maybe both? Just my guess; Russell can explain if he wants to.
> 
> I quit monitoring my wife also. I concluded that I was going to build myself up and if she wanted to go back to her secrecy and betrayal then I would get strong enough that I would move on and not be crushed again.


Its been 9 months since DDay for us. Still early days I know.

For the most part I move through R OK. I still check and verify about once a month. (GPS. Keylogger. Full access to networks, emails and phone) He is also very remorseful and fully on board with helping me through it. 

There have been a couple of times where I have felt a bit suspicious about something but they've eventually proven to be completely unfounded. 

I can't explain though how much I trigger when I'm confronted with something that could be even remotely suspicious. My heart starts racing, I have major palpitations and find it difficult to breathe properly. 

I don't know if I can keep doing this for years and years though, so I hope one day the trust really does comes back.


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## russell28 (Apr 17, 2013)

Racer said:


> I still do 4.5 years out. Made that mistake once before of 'not checking'... Should have would have saved me about 4 more years of adulterous behavior. I don't expect to find anything, nor do I do it with that 'I gotta know' panic. It's more like random stuff. She tells me she's working late.... I verify her location.
> 
> Random gps at lunch time. If she's doing a GNO, I drop off "so she can drink" or a couple of her friends pick her up. A ton of little things just to verify.
> 
> Trust but verify. Words to live by.


The GPS at lunch time shows you what, where her phone is? GPS when working late.. is there a 'back room' at work? After you drop her off for GNO, can't someone else 'pick her up' right after? So you may think you're 'verifying', but in reality, if they know you might have put a VAR in the car, they aren't going to talk in the car.


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## russell28 (Apr 17, 2013)

Mr Blunt said:


> I see that as a possible positive sign. Perhaps Russell is convinced that his wife is dead serious about R or that Russell is getting strong enough that he is not going to be the monitoring police. Maybe both? Just my guess; Russell can explain if he wants to.
> 
> *I quit monitoring my wife also. I concluded that I was going to build myself up and if she wanted to go back to her secrecy and betrayal then I would get strong enough that I would move on and not be crushed again*.


This is it in a nutshell.. and it's just another obsessive behavior that's not benefiting either party in R with a WS that's clearly not still in an A and doing everything they can to repair what they've torn down. So yes, both. Thank you for sharing all of this.


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## Racer (Sep 24, 2009)

russell28 said:


> The GPS at lunch time shows you what, where her phone is?.


Ummm yes. What it shows me is that she says where she is; or at least her phone which she'd never leave behind is. Does it prove she isn’t having an active affair? Hell no. It’s just a chunk of information. Add that to a bunch of other information and I’d have no reason not to trust the data.

What I should also mention is she is active about being transparent and accountable. So she forwards that email from her boss asking her and her team to work (doubt it is spoofed since it went to multiple people). She calls from a land line so I get the caller id. She makes sure to tell me what she got the team for lunch so that charge doesn’t look out of place.


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## russell28 (Apr 17, 2013)

Racer said:


> Ummm yes. What it shows me is that she says where she is; or at least her phone which she'd never leave behind is. Does it prove she isn’t having an active affair? Hell no. It’s just a chunk of information. Add that to a bunch of other information and I’d have no reason not to trust the data.
> 
> What I should also mention is she is active about being transparent and accountable. So she forwards that email from her boss asking her and her team to work (doubt it is spoofed since it went to multiple people). She calls from a land line so I get the caller id. She makes sure to tell me what she got the team for lunch so that charge doesn’t look out of place.


My point is just that the stuff you mention about her attitude, her sending you emails, calling you, trying to reassure you of where she is and what she's doing is more valuable than a gps signal telling you a phone is in location x. In my case, my wife was actually having sex with the guy right in work.. so the gps would have told me she was in work, not that her pants were on. If they know you're looking at phone records, they don't use that phone to call the OM.. they use a landline that you don't have access to the records for.. or a friends cell phone, etc....


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## theroad (Feb 20, 2012)

For those that say how could that BH recover after his WW had an affair for 12 years I will say no matter what happens it could of been worse.

Affair could of been 13 years, 20 years. OM could of knocked up the WW.


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## Acabado (May 13, 2012)

theroad said:


> I will say no matter what happens it could of been worse.


So waht? I get no relief from this kind of thinking.


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## BobSimmons (Mar 2, 2013)

Truthseeker1 said:


> I read some of the linked thread and had to stop - I did not get it at all. And I do not view all affairs the same way - but she had a lover for over a decade....that is a lot to get over. I hope he is at peace with his choice and happy - *but I don't get it at all*.


This and then some... 12 years.. 12 years wow. I don't get it nor do I want to. Good luck to the man.


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## Truthseeker1 (Jul 17, 2013)

BobSimmons said:


> This and then some... 12 years.. 12 years wow. I don't get it *nor do I want to.* Good luck to the man.


Or hope I ever had to. I hope he is in a good place - but I really took no inspiration from his story. Just my opinion....


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

You just never know. That's what I learned over the course of my marriage. 

My ex-husband had a PA 30 years ago. I stayed. I thought it was over and maybe it was. Or maybe it really wasn't. A few years his AP came back into the picture. Or maybe she never left. I don't know for sure and never will. I decided to get out and my divorce was final earlier this summer. 

So I'm very cynical about R. Because you never will know for sure. You will always wonder. And you could be right. In hindsight I wish I had gotten out then and not wasted those years. Because that's how I look at them now. Wasted. 

However, it's done and I'm moving forward and I'm happy with my life.


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## Mr Blunt (Jul 18, 2012)

> Originally Posted by BobSimmons
> This and then some... 12 years.. 12 years wow. *I don't get it nor do I want to. *Good luck to the man



*To BobSimmons
I get it and here is why:*



> After around 2 years of R….quote of Bestblu
> But I wanted to post an update and say that things have progressed to a "better" normal than before. By better I mean *our relationship is the strongest it has ever been*. We are nicer to each other than we have ever been in our marriage and we enjoy each other's company more than we ever have.
> 
> After around 3 years of R….quote of Bestblu
> ...


*It is inspirational to me when a person can overcome such horrible devastation as adultery.*


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## Mr Blunt (Jul 18, 2012)

> truthseeker
> Or hope I ever had to. I hope he is in a good place - but I really took *no inspiration from his story*. Just my opinion....


To Truthseeker
Would you get inspiration if he would not have forgiven and then divorced her?

It is inspirational to me when a person can overcome such horrible devastation as adultery.

*It is not inspiring to you that this man and his wife saved a marriage that is now together with children and grandchildren and are better than they ever were?*



> Quote of Bestblu
> Also, it's important to mention that I didn't just stay and work things out for me. I did it for her, for our kids (who do know what happened by the way) and our grand kids. I understand the ramifications that a divorce can have on extended family, and as much as is possible within me, I am determined for our marriage to be an example of overcoming adversity. I believe she feels the same way.


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## Truthseeker1 (Jul 17, 2013)

Mr Blunt said:


> To Truthseeker
> Would you get inspiration if he would not have forgiven and then divorced her?
> 
> It is inspirational to me when a person can overcome such horrible devastation as adultery.
> ...


I'm glad they are happy - I just don't get it and find no inspiration from this story ...but that is my opinion...


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## tulsy (Nov 30, 2012)

Mr Blunt said:


> Would you get inspiration if he would not have forgiven and then divorced her?


I wouldn't say inspired, but I would respect the guy a lot more for leaving. His marriage was a joke for 12 years....at best, they should have gotten a divorce, parted ways, and after being apart, if they wanted to be together again, started dating all over again, a long loving MONOGAMOUS courtship, then possibly years later, re-marriage. That would amount to a new relationship, which I could respect. Holding on to a "marriage" like this??! There is nothing commendable about that.



Mr Blunt said:


> It is inspirational to me when a person can overcome such horrible devastation as adultery.


Overcome doesn't have to mean staying married to the person. I'm not even sure I believe this story. 12yrs...that's like having a second husband the whole time....that's not marriage at all. Marriage is supposed to be forsaking all others, not having 2 people for 12 years. 

What does it inspire you to do exactly? Stay the course, regardless of what your partner does, or how long your partner cheats on you? 



Mr Blunt said:


> *It is not inspiring to you that this man and his wife saved a marriage that is now together with children and grandchildren and are better than they ever were?*


What was there to save? For 12 years, there really wasn't a marriage...only on paper. I'm sure anything would seem better to this guy...he was in the dark for so long. 

Who knows if his kids are even his? This guy had no idea that his wife was having an affair for over a decade...just clueless....and then how he found out, and how she confessed everything right away (ya, right), and then how he forgave her of everything within 2 hrs??

I think this "story" is BS, made up by someone with religious values in order to spread the message of, "stay married regardless, it gets even better, trust us".

I not convinced the story is real.


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## Mr Blunt (Jul 18, 2012)

> Reply by Tulsy
> What was there to save? For 12 years, there really wasn't a marriage...only on paper. I'm sure anything would seem better to this guy...he was in the dark for so long.
> 
> Who knows if his kids are even his? This guy had no idea that his wife was having an affair for over a decade...just clueless....and then how he found out, and how she confessed everything right away (ya, right), and then how he forgave her of everything within 2 hrs??
> ...



Bestblu answered another person like you in his thread. Here is his answer reprinted below:



> *Quotes of Bestblu*
> For this to work for us, you don't have to understand.
> 
> I have discovered a trend with many (not all) of the skeptics who post (at least on this thread). There is a tendency to criticize but there is little in the way of constructive guidance.








> Reply by Tulsy
> The religious overtones in this thread are so pronounced I thought it was in the "Politics and Religion" sub-forum.
> 
> I think this "story" is BS, made up by someone with religious values in order to spread the message of, "stay married regardless, it gets even better, trust us".


You seem to be a bit hostile to religion as you have mentioned it twice in this thread.
*
Is it the forgiveness part that upsets you so much? * The reason that I ask you this is that your avatar appears to be the opposite of forgiveness. *You avatar shows a man viciously beating something with his fist. Are you real angry about something?*


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## Phenix70 (May 6, 2012)

Openminded said:


> You just never know. That's what I learned over the course of my marriage.
> 
> My ex-husband had a PA 30 years ago. I stayed. I thought it was over and maybe it was. Or maybe it really wasn't. A few years his AP came back into the picture. Or maybe she never left. I don't know for sure and never will. I decided to get out and my divorce was final earlier this summer.
> 
> ...


That's how I feel as well.
To me, the last thing I want to do is feel as if I have to be the one to check up on my spouse to make sure he's doing what he says he is doing.
It's exhausting just thinking about it.
If my H cheats, our marriage is over, there will be no R.
I refuse to stay married to a person who would betray me that way.



Mr Blunt said:


> To Truthseeker
> Would you get inspiration if he would not have forgiven and then divorced her?
> 
> It is inspirational to me when a person can overcome such horrible devastation as adultery.
> ...


What would have been more inspiring to me would have been her not cheating to begin with.
I would rather read about the successful marriages that have made it through the years without cheating, those are the marriages I aspire to, NOT the ones where one or more of the spouses has cheated & R'd.
Because as I posted above, if my H cheats, I'm done, there are no 2nd chances.
Cheating is my absolute hard line boundary, as it is for my H as well.


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## Refuse to be played (Jun 7, 2013)

theroad said:


> For those that say how could that BH recover after his WW had an affair for 12 years I will say no matter what happens it could of been worse.
> 
> Affair could of been 13 years, 20 years. OM could of knocked up the WW.


Wasn't there someone on here where that was the case? WW had a 20 year A and youngest wasn't his. I think he took her back as well.


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## jay_gatsby (Jun 4, 2013)

Refuse to be played said:


> Wasn't there someone on here where that was the case? WW had a 20 year A and youngest wasn't his. I think he took her back as well.


There are many such stories of Betrayeds taking back (or recociling with) their Waywards after LTAs. The mindset of those willing to do that is very diverse. Very few ultimately work, most don't. Those that do reconcile succesfully, their reporting should be taken as "inspirational" just for the fact that most of us would not have done it that way. Inspirational probably not best word, but for a lack of better one - it will do. They are probably in the minority. What probably is more important are the ones that don't come back and tell us what happened, the ones who's threads have gone cold. The CWI thread is full of them!


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## Mr Blunt (Jul 18, 2012)

> *Originally Posted by Mr Blunt *
> To Truthseeker
> Would you get inspiration if he would not have forgiven and then divorced her?
> 
> ...





Phenix, This section of the TAM is called *“Coping With Infidelity”*. That means that we discuss and read about how people cope with INFIDELTY. Also this thread is titled *“HOPE for Overcoming Adultery” *We could not have been clearer about the subject and topic in this section of TAM and this thread.


If you just want to “read about successful marriages that have made it through out the years without cheating…” you need to stop reading this area in TAM and find another thread.

The fact of the matter is that there are people that have been cheated on and those that want to R could probably use some encouragement, hope, and inspiration. The linked thread by Bestblu has already given some people inspiration.


You stated that 
“ if my H cheats, I'm done, there are no 2nd chances.”
Cheating is my absolute hard line boundary, as it is for my H as well.

*Then why are you reading and commenting on this thread? *I am not trying to change your mind and have agreed that a BS has every right to D based on infidelity. Your stated position is one that could be a good thread but it is not on topic in this thread.


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## Phenix70 (May 6, 2012)

Mr Blunt said:


> Phenix, This section of the TAM is called *“Coping With Infidelity”*. That means that we discuss and read about how people cope with INFIDELTY. Also this thread is titled *“HOPE for Overcoming Adultery” *We could not have been clearer about the subject and topic in this section of TAM and this thread.
> 
> 
> If you just want to “read about successful marriages that have made it through out the years without cheating…” you need to stop reading this area in TAM and find another thread.
> ...


Oh please, unless a MOD comes in to tell me not to post in a certain area, I'm going to post wherever I want to post, if you don't like it, don't read it. 
Who are you to tell another member of this board what they can or cannot post?
So keep your sanctimonious attitude & give it a rest already.
This is a PUBLIC message board, anyone can post here or anywhere else on this board. 
It's "Coping With Infidelity" which ALSO includes divorce, otherwise this section would be called "Reconciliation After Infidelity." 
And for the record, I'm not the only who disagreed with whatever agenda you're trying to push in this thread, but good try there buddy, I'll give you an "A" for effort.


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## tulsy (Nov 30, 2012)

Mr Blunt said:


> Bestblu answered another person like you in his thread. Here is his answer reprinted below:
> 
> _There is a tendency to criticize but there is little in the way of constructive guidance._


Your poster-boy for reconciliation only considers guidance constructive if it means staying together. BTW, I can't speak for the other person you are talking about, but I did offer guidance in that direction, which you seemed to completely miss or ignore:

*at best, they should have gotten a divorce, parted ways, and after being apart, if they wanted to be together again, started dating all over again, a long loving MONOGAMOUS courtship, then possibly years later, re-marriage. That would amount to a new relationship*




Mr Blunt said:


> You seem to be a bit hostile to religion as you have mentioned it twice in this thread.
> *
> Is it the forgiveness part that upsets you so much? * The reason that I ask you this is that your avatar appears to be the opposite of forgiveness. *You avatar shows a man viciously beating something with his fist. Are you real angry about something?*


So mentioning your obvious religious agenda automatically amounts to hostility towards it? Gimme a break, dude.

Something else you completely missed .... my signature, in red, explains the context of my avatar. It's from a movie called "Office Space", and the man just lost his job....he is actually taking his aggression out on a broken copy machine.


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## Juicer (May 2, 2012)

I find this interesting, but maybe more religious men are more likely to reconcile? Or maybe just more religious people in general?

At my old church, a member's wife cheated on him. I don't know who with, or the details, but it was ugly, and she had a child that wasn't the husband's. But he forgave her, and they are reconciling, and he treats the child as his own. 
Is he happy? I don't know, I don't go to that church anymore. 

I do know, that I could NEVER do that. Maybe because I don't have kids and I want to know they are mine. 


I was cheated on, and I divorced. 
But I stopped my church going over a year ago. I hadn't been married for decades. 
But I don't understand how people can do it.


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## maincourse99 (Aug 15, 2012)

Runs like Dog said:


> Of course no one cheated on Jesus either. A mile in his sandals and like that.


Judas betrayed Jesus, remember? Jesus understood betrayal.


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## maincourse99 (Aug 15, 2012)

Mr Blunt said:


> Hope for overcomimg Adultry
> 
> 
> I thought that I would post this thread because I think that not enough attention is given to those that overcome adultery for years. I can understand why there is so many threads and attention given to those that are hurting so bad because they have not overcome adultery. In fact you can see by checking out the 10,564 threads on this section “Coping with Infidelity” how much attention is given. That is one of the largest sections on TAM. In contrast, you can also see that the section titled “Long Term Success in Marriage” is one of the smallest on the whole TAM web site with only 301 threads.
> ...



Research it, as another poster said, this passage from John it is not found in the oldest manuscripts. It's spurious.


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## Mr Blunt (Jul 18, 2012)

> Reply by Phenix
> And for the record, I'm not the only who disagreed with whatever agenda you're trying to push in this thread, but good try there buddy, I'll give you an "A" for effort.


Chill out a bit Phenix.
The agenda I am pushing is as the title says “HOPE for overcomimg adultery”
That agenda is a very important agenda in this forum!
*How much experience do you have with adultery?*


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## Mr Blunt (Jul 18, 2012)

> Tulsy
> Your poster-boy for reconciliation only considers guidance constructive if it means staying together.


*Tulsy, would you post a quote by the “Poster-boy” that substantiates your statement above?*
The poster-boy’s quotes below do not seem to substantiate your statement.



> *Quotes of Bestblu*
> I told my story, and continue to tell it, not because I think that I have the answers for everyone who has been hurt by infidelity.
> 
> Nowhere in my thread have I ever suggested that our results would or could be the same for every situation






> So mentioning your obvious religious agenda automatically amounts to hostility towards it? Gimme a break, dude.


As stated before, my agenda is “HOPE for overcomimg adultery” 

You and Phenix can try to use the religion card to discredit success but for those that want to examine success.... you trying to put a negative spin on Bestblu putting his marriage back together helps no one.


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## WYWife (Sep 10, 2013)

"The damage done by betrayal is so great and can affect so many that overcoming it FULLY is very hard to do. There is no automatic right for a second chance for a betrayer. So I have maintained that anyone given a second chance and especially those who's spouses are able to overcome their betrayal against them, the marriage, the family, the children... then they should see as if it is a true gift from God and live a life acknowledging such."

Perfectly and eloquently put. I hope you don't mind if I "borrow" this to put in a letter to my STBXH. Having lived through one infidelity by him and trying to forgive and move forward I see his old habits coming back and I'm not going down that road again.

Thank you.


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## Phenix70 (May 6, 2012)

Mr Blunt said:


> Chill out a bit Phenix.
> The agenda I am pushing is as the title says “HOPE for overcomimg adultery”
> That agenda is a very important agenda in this forum!
> *How much experience do you have with adultery?*


I think you need to take your own advice, it could prove quite helpful to you.
As for your agenda, you seem to be projecting, since I never mentioned anything about religion, the thought never even crossed my mind. 
Interesting that you went there, maybe it's closer to the truth than you want to admit. 

How much experience do I have? 
Let me count the ways, my mother & step father, he had a child with another women.
My father & step-mom, still don't know why he even bothered to get married, he was cheating before & after they got married.
My husband's father cheated on his mom, he got remarried, he then cheated on his new wife with my husband's mom.
My FI cheated on me, found out when I walked in on him talking to her on the phone. 
Friends & other family members who have dealt with cheating spouses, some stayed, but most didn't 
So yeah, I'd say I have some experience.
How much do YOU have?


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## russell28 (Apr 17, 2013)

Phenix70 said:


> That's how I feel as well.
> To me, the last thing I want to do is feel as if I have to be the one to check up on my spouse to make sure he's doing what he says he is doing.
> It's exhausting just thinking about it.
> If my H cheats, our marriage is over, there will be no R.
> ...


So you would prefer to read things that agree with your point of view and have happy endings. Good post.


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## Mr Blunt (Jul 18, 2012)

> *Reply by Phenix*
> ………….How much experience do I have?
> Let me count the ways, my mother & step father, he had a child with another women.
> My father & step-mom, still don't know why he even bothered to get married, he was cheating before & after they got married.
> ...


My spouse started her infidelity in 1986 and ended in 1987.
We employed some of the same things that Bestblu did.
*Our SUCCESSFUL Recovery is now in the 26th year.*
We are a very close family including childen and grandchildren

It is sad that that your family had so much infidelity. *Did any one of them reconcile and have a successful relationship? * If they did, and you wanted to, you could give us some information that would offer some hope for those that want to R.


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## Thebes (Apr 10, 2013)

I overcame it the first time but after that I never did and don't intend to. I'm not stupid, I see how he looks at other women, he would do it again if he could sneak around behind my back and do it.

If my husband ever stops cheating it will be because he is so old and wrinkled up no young woman could stand to look at him.

Its been years since he has cheated but that doesn't mean a thing with him.


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## Phenix70 (May 6, 2012)

Mr Blunt said:


> My spouse started her infidelity in 1986 and ended in 1987.
> We employed some of the same things that Bestblu did.
> *Our SUCCESSFUL Recovery is now in the 26th year.*
> We are a very close family including childen and grandchildren
> ...



Oddly enough, my parents (mom & step dad) did get a divorce BUT they own a business together & are each other's best friend.
They have a "different" relationship, it's what it is & makes them happy, as long as they're happy, I'm okay with it.
For them, it was better for them not to be married, yet stay bet friends.
My dad (he's my step but raised me from 4yo, so he IS my dad) has repeatedly said his biggest mistake in life was hurting (cheating) on my mom. 
It is sad to hear him, at almost 70yo, lament his choices. 
Hindsight is a bit*h. 

My IL's ended up remarrying each other, much to the chagrin of their respective families, including my H & his sister.
My FIL is a piece of work, he went through stage 4 throat cancer last year & my MIL almost walked out on him because he was so horrible to her.
My H went to visit & left within hours of getting there, that's how bad his dad was.
He was mean before the cancer & got worse afterward.
Why she puts up with him, I have no idea, he is unpleasant & treats her terribly, with no mind to who is around. 
Then laughs when she gets upset, it's the most toxic thing I've ever seen & my own dad had a child with another woman! 

My father died, he did divorce & never R'd with his last wife.
I say last, because he was married 3 times.
As you can see just from my own family history, I have done an incredible amount of my own therapy.

How I feel regarding R is greatly shaped from seeing what my own parents experienced, when it did happen with my FI, I just said "no, this won't be my life" & ended the engagement.
He actually cried when I ended it, wonder where all that concern was when he was busy doing the deed with another woman.
Years later I'm glad that he did cheat, otherwise I never would have met my H, he's by no means perfect, but we fit together perfectly well & I want to keep it that way.
Hence why I feel so strongly about reading stories of strong marriages, I want to do what I can within my own power to keep our marriage healthy. 
My feelings about R are only what I could not personally do.


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## MrMathias (Nov 19, 2012)

Racer said:


> Also, you are right about that glass ceiling. My story is bad. My wife is a SA. As such, I consider it somewhat like having a tiger as a pet. There is an inherent danger there and you need to watch out and be willing to put it down (divorce). You kind of stayed prepared (the boy scout in me) that some day that tiger might get grumpy and decide to tear into you. Until then, you have fun owning a tiger, but you keep your eye out and your guard up just in case. I like to think of it as a “Xtreme” marriage (done in my best monster truck announcer voice). Gotta stay positive... It’s a rush being married to her. Boring it isn’t.


As I recall you once suggested that staying involved with a WW was akin to keeping a dog that once bit you- forever keeping in mind that a bite happened, and could happen again. 

Now, you've upgraded to 'tiger'!!! You sir, must have an interesting relationship.


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## Mr Blunt (Jul 18, 2012)

> Quote of Phenix
> How I feel regarding R is greatly shaped from seeing what my own parents experienced, when it did happen with my FI, I just said "no, this won't be my life" & ended the engagement.
> He actually cried when I ended it, wonder where all that concern was when he was busy doing the deed with another woman.
> 
> ...




*Quote of Phenix
“….I feel so strongly about reading stories of strong marriages, I want to do what I can within my own power to keep our marriage healthy.”*

I like the way you think in your situation! You are smart to have keeping your marriage healthy as a top priority. I think that if both partners have that priority and work at it then infidelity will be less likely. A couple that has had to deal with adultery and has saved the marriage/relationship had to have a strong marriage or at least something in the relationship that was strong to begin with. After the adultery I think there is a trade off in most couples. You lose in some areas but you can gain in other areas. In fact WAZZA has said that his marriage is better now after over 20 years of R. Not because of the infidelity but because of the actions they both took.


If you have read the “reconciliation” thread you know that B1 and EI are building their marriage up. They only have about a year and a half but they have both said that their marriage now is better than it has been in years. Again, not because of the infidelity but because of the actions they both have taken.

I Hope that you and your husband NEVER have to face infidelity; it is one of the biggest relationship killers of all time. For some of us it is too late we already had to face it.


*For those that really want to R, have something to work with, and BOTH are willing to take the right steps then I think that R can be the best choice under that situation*. I think that Bestblu, Wazza, B1 and EI, have information and hope that may benefit some.


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## Racer (Sep 24, 2009)

MrMathias said:


> As I recall you once suggested that staying involved with a WW was akin to keeping a dog that once bit you- forever keeping in mind that a bite happened, and could happen again.
> 
> Now, you've upgraded to 'tiger'!!! You sir, must have an interesting relationship.


Good to see you are still around and from what I can see of Mrs.Mathhias, you are still in R.

Yep... The dog story is a true one and a bit longer; Still have scars from that. So I went with the Seigfred and Roy where they forgot the nature of a tiger. I won't forget.

It's also a later issue in all this R stuff that you run across. So, the first two years of R are still pretty rollercoaster as far as emotional goes for you. You get used to it sort of. Very strong emotions that get you pumping all sorts of hormones through your veins. But by year 3, it's not so much with just occasional highs. Year 4 and it is back to the regular old issues of kids, house, job. It feels like something is missing, and I do believe it's those highs and lows of your emotional state. 

It feels "boring" now... You miss those rushes, the passion, the overwhelming urge to take action, etc.. So, I do what I can to keep some excitement there and trying to avoid routine.


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## Mr Blunt (Jul 18, 2012)

Racer. You can not forgive yourself for staying in the relationship with your wife and letting all those things happen to you. You feel like a WUZZ

You are emotionally detached and you are bored.


Your wife cannot forgive herself fro her past

*Racer
Did you find anything in Bestblu’s thread that might help you?*


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## bestblu1 (Oct 21, 2009)

I discovered this thread today and realized what a long time it's been since I posted anything. I appreciate that this thread was started and I just wanted to cut in and mention that life is good, as good as I suppose it possibly could be considering the whole story. 

For those who have questioned the authenticity of the story, for what it's worth, I am not a troll and everything I posted is the truth, the whole truth.... (regarding the sequence of events and the process that we went through to reconcile).

The skepticism that is apparent in some of the comments of this thread is not lost on me. I get it. 

I just wanted to pop in to say that my wife and I are doing well.


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## StuckInAL (May 8, 2014)

im ~7yrs in R ....and not religious in any way. R isn't just for the overly religious....

you are 100% correct in that there just aren't many threads here dealing w/successful R....the few topics posted by users in R usually seem to degrade into "you were stupid for staying..."..."you should just get a D now"...."she's def. going to cheat on you again"....etc....etc...


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## sammy7111 (Apr 19, 2014)

I would have a once of respect for a man that would let his wife get over on him for that long and then try to take the blame for her cheating
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Harken Banks (Jun 12, 2012)

Truthseeker1 said:


> and no it was not his fault that his wife cheated for 12 long years....


But maybe it was. I am not saying it was. Just that maybe it was. I think many BS feel so strongly about this stuff cause we feel like we did everything and more. We went the extra mile. Long suffering and all that. So it was injury on top of insult.

Every now and then someone will post that their spouse cheated and it was their fault, at least to some degree. Chr*st, I feel like I have had the sh*t kicked out of me day in and day out for more than a decade and that being as naïve as I am I had felt that if I compensate for the nastiness and anger with more accommodation and fun in the house . . .. And that is rewarded with further abuse.

So, as Best wrote, this is not a prescription, just a reconciliation story. Wishing you the best.


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## LongWalk (Apr 4, 2013)

There are many reconciliation stories worth following: 

RoadScholar, who is Catholic, is struggle forward. His thread could use some women posters to lighten the tone from BH.

LostLove stopped coming to TAM, shortly after he revealed that he was considering attempting R with his somewhat remorseful WW. He may have felt that R would be condemned. But if he made that decision then his TAM friends ought to have supported him.

I suppose I am not alone in hoping that Racer and Harken can some how move their former WW.

Life is not simple.

My ex just asked me if her new boyfriend could drive me and my daughters to the airport on Friday. No thanks. After being on TAM I know that is a boundary.


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## Truthseeker1 (Jul 17, 2013)

Harken Banks said:


> *But maybe it was.* I am not saying it was. Just that maybe it was. I think many BS feel so strongly about this stuff cause we feel like we did everything and more. We went the extra mile. Long suffering and all that. So it was injury on top of insult.
> 
> Every now and then someone will post that their spouse cheated and it was their fault, at least to some degree. Chr*st, I feel like I have had the sh*t kicked out of me day in and day out for more than a decade and that being as naïve as I am I had felt that if I compensate for the nastiness and anger with more accommodation and fun in the house . . .. And that is rewarded with further abuse.
> 
> So, as Best wrote, this is not a prescription, just a reconciliation story. Wishing you the best.


No it wasn't it was on her. I'm glad he is happy but the affair was not his fault it was hers.


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

I'm happy that bestblu1 and his wife are doing well, and it's good (and, to be honest, absolutely critical) that bestblu1 was able to muster the courage, humility, and maturity to both realize _*and*_ admit that, by way of neglect, he had contributed to an unhealthy marital environment in which his wife could and did cheat. 

*BUT!!!* 

She spent _TWELVE YEARS_ giving herself to another man. That's twelve years -- over one-third of their marriage -- during which she wasn't the wife that she could and should have been.

Look, this can be debated all day, but it really does come down to the basic tenet that we use day in and day out here on TAM...

Each spouse is (generally speaking) equally responsible for the state of the marriage up until the point at which the WS engages in adultery. The decision to commit adultery, however, is 100% on the WS AND, from that point forward, a greater share of any blame to be meted out for the state of any marital disfunction or discord is, quite fairly, placed on the WS.


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

GusPolinski said:


> I'
> Each spouse is (generally speaking) equally responsible for the state of the marriage up until the point at which the WS engages in adultery. The decision to commit adultery, however, is 100% on the WS AND, *from that point forward, a greater share of any blame to be meted out for the state of any marital disfunction or discord is, quite fairly, placed on the WS.*


So any conflict after the affair is more on the WS, regardless of the circumstances? She or he basically wears the scarlet letter forever?

Why would a WS stay in a "marriage" like this, Gus?


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

jld, note that I said "a greater share", not "all". And, to be clear, I'm talking specifically about the period of time between the onset of the affair and D-Day, which I'd define as the day on which the _complete_ truth is known (for many BSs this may actually be D-Day #2, #3, etc). Once the truth is known, and either reconciliation or divorce has been chosen as the path, the dynamics change. So I wouldn't say forever -- that's both unrealistic and unhealthy.

As for why a WS would choose to stay in a marriage while engaged in an affair...? I wouldn't presume to know, and I'm sure that the reasons will vary to some degree for each, but I'd think that it would basically amount to a desire to "cake-eat" i.e. to enjoy the relative socioeconomic security offered by marriage while simultaneously pursuing emotional and/or sexual gratification outside of said marriage.


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

Well, I guess I misunderstood. I thought you meant all conflicts, for the remainder of the marriage.


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

jld said:


> Well, I guess I misunderstood. I thought you meant all conflicts, for the remainder of the marriage.


No, absolutely not.


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## Mr Blunt (Jul 18, 2012)

> *By Bestblu*
> I just wanted to cut in and mention that life is good, as good as I suppose it possibly could be considering the whole story.
> 
> I just wanted to pop in to say that *my wife and I are doing well*



Thank you Bestblu for your comments. You have around 5 years into your R and you and your wife are doing well. Your story is an absolute HUGE shot of HOPE for overcoming adultery!!

*If you want then I hope you will check in every now and then and update.* Your story is very interesting and I think has the possibility to help a lot of people!






> *
> StuckInAL*
> Imp ~7yrs in R ....and not religious in any way. R isn't just for the overly religious....



Congratulations StuckInA!!
I do not know a lot about your story but 7 years of R tells me that you and your wife are doing something right.






> *Mrs. John Adams*
> We are 30 years past dday...happier than we ever were...


*Mr. and Mrs. John Adams are a HUGE positive addition to this TAM forum!*
35+ years of marriage and 30 years past dday!
We have very few couples that have a successful R and they BOTH post on TAM and that have 30 years in R!
Frankly I do not know of any couple that has NOT had adultery in their marriage that are as loving to each other as Mr. and Mrs. Adams.


*For me nothing gives credibility to R like the LONG TERM SUCCESS* and Mr. and Mrs. Adams have the longest period of R than any on TAM that I know of. We are lucky to have them here at TAM!



*B1 and EI*
They bring a whole other HOPE to those dealing with infidelity.
I am not going to try and cover the enormous benefit these two have brought to TAM.

EI has written enough on TAM that a book could be made. She is an excellent writer and very transparent and honest. If you do not learn something from her posts then you are brain dead. B1 is by far the best 2-year reconciler on this whole CWI forum IMO. His attitude and approach/actions are stellar. Again, if you really want to read the Good, the Bad, and the Ugly you can read the Reconciliation Thread by B1. *The bottom line for B1 and EI is that they have endured great pain but have kicked Mr. Infidelity right in the AZZ!*

*CONGRADULATIONS B1 and EI on your upcoming June 21, 2014 wedding/renewal/Anniversary/VICTORY!!!!*

I will also be celebrating on that day as we all will be celebrating my Father and Mother’s 68th anniversary!!! We are a very close family and we know all the good, bad, and ugly of my parents 68 years but the bottom line is that when you add up the score it spells SUCCESS!!!!!


WAZZA is another one that used to post here a lot but I have not seen much of him lately. However, know that he has *over 20 years of R and has said that his marriage is better now than it has ever been.*


*Philat*
You can just tell that Philat is a humble, peaceful man that has found some contentment. I forget how many years he has of Successful R but he is another inspiration. Gald that we have Philat!

*Amplexor*
Has over 5 years of successful R and has plenty that we can learn from



My guess is that there are others but I just cannot remember them. *So if any of you out there would like to share your story that promotes hope for overcoming adultery with successful R then please do so.*

I think that we need to highlight these successful people that have reconciled for years and can give a lot of hope. Presenting these success should help to balance out the many posts that do not give much hope.



Finally, if anyone wants to learn some methods, actions, attitudes that have been helpful in a positive R then you have these people above to start with. If you just want to spew your bile of hatred and pessimism then you might find that some other threads will fit your agenda better than this one.



I was once told that in a situation where there is infidelity that you will be faced with many choices. However, the one that is certain is that you will be faced with the choices of the BBs. *The BBs are that your choices will result in ether you becoming BITTER or BETTER; your choice!*


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## love=pain (Nov 26, 2012)

Any story of reconciliation is great and brings hope to all those who are facing that challenge, just like everything else in this game of infidelity people take different paths and use different tools but if the outcome is a successful marriage where both parties are happy then who cares how they got there.
Not everyone's way of reconciliation seems viable to me that is to say I don't think I have the personality and temperament to go about my reconciliation they way the have but as I am still an infant in this process I will never rule anything out.

I will say that I don't think reconciliation ever ends, you never overcome infidelity completely, like an addiction in order to keep the demons at bay you have to deal with it every day.
It is this area the thought that 20 years from now this will still be an issue (although at 67 I may be drooling and wearing a bib) that scares, worries, depresses me the most.
That is not to say there won't be good times there have already been lots of them since dday but I truly never see a day when our marriage won't have the taint of infidelity on it.


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## Mr Blunt (Jul 18, 2012)

> *By Love=pain*
> Any story of reconciliation is great and brings hope to all those who are facing that challenge, just like everything else in this game of infidelity people take different paths and use different tools but if the outcome is a successful marriage where both parties are happy then who cares how they got there.
> Not everyone's way of reconciliation seems viable to me that is to say I don't think I have the personality and temperament to go about my reconciliation they way the have but as I am still an infant in this process I will never rule anything out.
> 
> ...








> I am still an infant in this process I will never rule anything out


*
You are a wise man*




> I will say that I don't think reconciliation ever ends, you never overcome infidelity completely, like an addiction *in order to keep the demons at bay you have to deal with it every day.*
> 
> 
> It is this area the thought that 20 years from now this will still be an issue (although at 67 I may be drooling and wearing a bib) *that scares, worries, depresses me the most.*


Love=pain
You do not have to be worried or depressed. It has been 20+ years since d-day and I am in my 60s. You will be in your 60s some day.


I do not deal with it everyday and the only time I think about it is when I read some threads here at Tam. That is my choice so if I wanted I could just not read TAM and I would be free from the demons for months at a time. In fact I rarely have demon problems even when I read TAM.



*For me one of the major keys to emotional health for me is that I have improved myself body, mind, and spirit for the last 20+ years*. I no longer spend much time thinking how I was crapped on and the great injustice of it all. Everybody gets dumped on big time at least once in their life; you just have to find a way to make the best of it.



It took me quite a while but I am now at the stage that I can focus much more on the positive in my life than the betrayal. In addition, I am now much more secure and more self sufficient. I realize what my wife and I are capable of and do not put my whole world in her hands. I am not sure if she is not capable to fulfill all my needs or she just does not want to. It does not matter much anymore as my life is quite full with her level of love for me and the other aspects of my life. Even if she does it again I will be OK. *I am not saying that she is not important, that is not it at all, it is just that with her I am very good and without her I will be OK.*


*Mrs John Adams summed it real nicely as she said*

*



Hang in there....persevere....time and love...remorse and forgiveness.

Click to expand...

*
So you see you are worrying too much because I am close to 67 and I am doing real well. Now I have to go now as I am drooling and need my bib! :rofl:

Don’t worry---be happy! Remember that song?


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

Journey - Don't Stop Believin' (Live in Houston)


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

Mrs. John Adams said:


> oh gus..thats a good one!


I've been listening to Journey and Foreigner all week! :smthumbup:


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## love=pain (Nov 26, 2012)

I thank you for the words of encouragement, I have been closer to divorce the last 2-3 months than since this whole thing began.

It really hasn't been that she has relapsed or done anything wrong per say, it is the apathy and her lack of compassion sometimes that has been a major sticking point.

She has always been a selfish person seeking attention for little things (rashes, allergies etc.) and while I am to blame if the communication or some of the finer aspects of marriage are not exercised to her liking her lack of participation is blamed on her upbringing or that she is scared to say things to me.

It went so far as back in February she told me she used to tell my children to not bother me because I was grumpy or miserable, when really I was just tired (working 70-90 hours a week will do it) I never turned my kids down for anything activities, sports etc but my older 2 seem to have grown up somewhat frightened of the monster that is their dad.

I have been working on fixing that misinformation and the damage it has done, luckily at their age it is easy to talk to them about anything it has just been difficult to not poison their mother in the process.

I say all that to say I still have hope that everything will get better which is the whole point of this thread and while I continue to stay and work.

I will leave you with one of my favorite quotes

“hope is a good thing. maybe the best of good things. and no good thing ever dies”


― the shawshank redemption


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## Mr Blunt (Jul 18, 2012)

> *Reply by Love=pain*
> It really hasn't been that she has relapsed or done anything wrong per say, it is the apathy and her lack of compassion sometimes that has been a major sticking point.


My guess is that in the early years of your R you need LOTS of CONCERN and COMPASSION and that is perfectly understandable and normal. That is one other reason that I have mentioned EI and Mrs. John Adams. They are CHAMPIONS in that area and I think that the WS could learn from them. Not every WS is going to be that attentive as EI and Mrs. Adams for various reasons so take into consideration all factors. 



My previous statements about realizing your situation and making the best of it may help you. My wife does not show as much selfless concern and compassion as I would like but I think it has something to do with her personality and my depth of desire. *In any case, my wife’s other good points out weight this situation so I adjusted.* When I built myself up body, mind, and spirit this situation was not a major sticking point for me anymore; however, it took me years to adjust. 
That is my situation and yours may not be the same; you can better evaluate the reasons for your sticking point.


You are still in the early stages and you probably will be troubled somewhat due to your wife not showing the concern and compassion that you would like but that does not necessarily mean that she is not remorseful or trying to make a good life with you. Anyway that is only my guess and IMO.


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## love=pain (Nov 26, 2012)

Mrs. John Adams said:


> love=pain...you might be amazed how perceptive children are. While she may have told them you were grumpy...i am betting they knew whether you were or not.
> 
> My husband was mostly grumpy in our children's early years...because he was going to school two nights a week and then doing homework. We didn't have internet in those days...and no online classes....so add two hour for driving after work to school...yep...he was a bit cranky. But the kids survived....and today as adults...they remember dad being crabby...but they are very close to him. He was the best dad he could be at the time.
> So don't be hard on yourself ok?
> ...



Once again thanks for the encouragement and I have had conversations with her about where I need her to do better in our reconciliation and how at the mention of any issue I have she gets defensive and her primary response is "well if you want me to go then I will"
An ongoing work in progress that's for sure oh well tomorrow is a new day.


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## drifting on (Nov 22, 2013)

Mrs. John Adams said:


> *When she says well if you want me to go I will...*.. _She wants you to beg her to stay....how do I know this? I did it myself. For years...I would say...I will go if you want me to...now I would have left if he told me to...but what i wanted was for him to tell me he did not want me to leave. So it is fine to assure her you want her to stay._..but when you say..I want you to stay..you need to add this....BUT I need you to be more aware of my pain THAT YOU CAUSED...I need you to help me carry the weight of the pain...I need you to be aware that I am hurting and the only way I can heal is for you to help me.
> 
> She really needs to be made aware of the pain aspect...this is the one thing I was lacking...i didn't know what I was supposed to do. If John would have told me...instead of suffering silently...I would have tried to help him.


This is my WW exactly. Doesn't know what to do. I have to admit this does cause anger and I push her away. I will tell her you know how to destroy me but not how to help me. I don't feel that it is my responsibility to tell her how to fix me. That is her heavy lifting to me. When I push her away WW gets furious. I honestly try not to push away but this rage is very destructive. I'm only six months from d-day and in MC. I will try this quote even though I feel it's her responsibility to know this.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Amplexor (Feb 13, 2008)

Mr Blunt said:


> Hope for overcomimg Adultry
> 
> 
> Sometime ago I posted a thread that asked how many had around 5 years or more in successful recovery and if I remember right there were only two; WAZZA and Amplexor. I have not seen many posts by Amplexor on this “Coping With Infidelity” section but I do see that WAZZA stills posts and I read a lot of his posts.




I recall this thread from last fall and should have posted in it then. 

No I don't post in CWI much. I rarely trigger anymore but when I do, it's in that forum. Also it has been so long since that time in my life I don't have the emotional desire to watch the pain of someone else going through it. There are many others here with better perspective, empathy and advice then I could put out there anymore. To all of you who strive to help on TAM, thank you. The advice I received here from so many who have long ago moved on was critical in the recovery of my marriage. Yours no doubt will help others here and they will look back with the same gratitude.

I will put this out here for those looking for hope. A broken marriage can mend and mine was broken at so many levels. For any who are interested the story is stickied in the Reconciliation forum.

When I began to lurk on TAM in late 2007 I was, as an individual, pretty ****ed up. My marriage was in shambles, I had emotionally collapsed and I was working my way out of my own denial that my wife was in love with another man. At that point, I felt recovery had some very long Vegas odds on it. It was the advice I found here that started me on a better path.

I made all the mistakes of the newly betrayed upon discovering my wife's long term EA. Grovelling, bawling, avowing my undying love, needy, weak and starving for any signs of approval from my retreating wife. Those actions worked against me and in POSOM's favor. Gone was the self assured, confident man my wife had married and it repulsed her. And POSOM was there to act as white knight to console and comfort her. It was a play book for failure.

TAM brought me lots of concepts and strategies. I separated the wheat from the chaff of what would work for us. I didn't shot gun the approach but rather was selective in my tools. Some can be very effective in recovery but if misapplied in the wrong circumstances, can blow up an already struggling marriage. Choose that advice wisely but be aware that to recover the marriage, many of the things you will have to do will be counter intuitive to what your heart tells you.

With time and patience my wife saw me reemerge as her confident husband. I was willing to give her what she was needing in the marriage and she accepted and complied to mine also. When the EA thought dead was rediscovered I stepped through that door I'd kept shut for over a year. I was ready to move on in my life without her, despite how deeply I loved her. The conversation came and went without any emotional break down's by either of us, no harsh words or raised voices. A few hours later I boarded a plane for a conference and we both had time to reflect. While confident I had done the right thing I was still scared ****less that my marriage would be over on my return. She ended the EA but resented the hell out of me for making her do it. I quit pursing any romantic or emotional bonds with her for 6 months to let her anger wane and for her to see, I was just fine.

For a healthy recovery you will have to do things that are hard, that don't make sense and that may risk your marriage even more. But if you can provide great patience and apply steady pressure to smooth the rough edges one corner at a time, in the end you can have success.

Today my wife and I are in a very good place. I suspect POSOM is more in my head than hers. We don't discuss that time in our life often but when we do, we are both thankful we worked it out, no matter how hard the path. It's the ending everyone who comes here in a shattered marriage wants and I will forever be thankful we were one of the lucky ones. TAM had a lot to do with it.


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## hopefulgirl (Feb 12, 2013)

love=pain said:


> It went so far as back in February she told me she used to tell my children to not bother me because I was grumpy or miserable, when really I was just tired (working 70-90 hours a week will do it) I never turned my kids down for anything activities, sports etc but my older 2 seem to have grown up somewhat frightened of the monster that is their dad....
> 
> “hope is a good thing. maybe the best of good things. and no good thing ever dies”
> 
> ― the shawshank redemption


It was not supportive terminology when she called you "grumpy" and especially "miserable" when you were actually "just tired." And if you're able to maintain an even keel and a calm demeanor and NOT be grumpy working such long hours, you are to be commended. (Personally, I found that the longer my work week became, the grumpier I got.) But I wonder, for everyone's sake - the kids, yours, the marriage's - have you found a way to reduce those hours to something closer to 40? Even 50ish would be more sane for someone with a family. I hope you've already reduced those hours - if not, that could be a major problem.

Repairing the marriage, and repairing the "monster" view your kids have held would certainly be better served by having you be more present. Not just at activities or sports - just being present, really spending time with them, is what kids truly want (and need) from their parents. R requires together time too.

Nobody ever said on their deathbed, "My one regret is that I didn't spend more time at the office."

I would continue to have HOPE (a very good thing) for R if you are able to give TIME to your marriage and to your family. They are worth that investment.


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## Mr Blunt (Jul 18, 2012)

> *By Elegirl*
> 
> Mr. Blunt,
> 
> ...




I think you are right Elegirl “There are many success stories. People tend to not stay here and talk about it. They go on with their lives.” In fact there are less than 1% of the people that post that talk about success regarding infidelity.

I do not know why but the forum of “Long term success in Marriage” is the one of the least amount of (356) threads. The one with the most is the “Coping with infidelity” and it has over 300 time more threads (11,969)

I can understand the HUGE amount of threads in the CWI forum, but why so few in the Long Term SUCEESS in Marriage”? *Wouldn’t the people in the CWI forum want to se, learn how to succeed, and comment on the success forum?*


I have listed the people that have been through infidelity and are a success with hopes that the posters on CWI will have good recourses to learn from. The last post by Ample or a seems to have some good information that some can use. I know that doing things that hard and having patience is not attractive but I think the important question to ask in getting this information from e successful is *DOES IT WORK? *The next big question is *ARE YOU GOING TO APPLY THOSE THINGS THAT WILL HELP EVEN IF IT IS NOT ATTRACTIVE?*



> *By Amplexor*
> For a healthy recovery you will *have to do things that are hard*, that don't make sense and that may risk your marriage even more. But if you can provide great *patience* and apply steady pressure to smooth the rough edges one corner at a time, in the end you can have success.
> 
> Today my wife and I are in a very good place




I understand that for some that R is not the best option but I do not understand people that post year after year on CWI but are not improving and in some cases they are worse than when they first posted. *Can someone enlighten ne on that?*


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## Cabsy (Mar 25, 2013)

This forum does have a certain narrative. The BS gets tough love, the WS gets no love (hate), and some other things tend not to get addressed at all. There are dissenting voices and nuanced stances, but the consensus that forms can be pretty overwhelming whether you're a BS or WS.

Not talking about the BS' contribution to the weakness of the marriage is understandable, because ultimately, there are better ways for the WS to deal with problems than to drop trou' and bang the first person outside of the marriage who shows interest. Plus, focusing on those issues before dealing with the betrayal would not be therapeutic in most cases, especially when the BS is already blaming themselves for what the WS has done.

Even a newbie like myself noticed pretty quickly that the other forums, where other sides of issues might be discussed, are a bit dead. The Adams family posted their story in the reconciliation forum and it was a great read, but it got far less attention than it probably would have on this forum. Even if people don't post on other forums, some people (like myself) do browse there on occasion, and still others might read without posting or even creating an account. I actually came here ~2 years before I joined to read on the forums regarding sex in marriage, which is why I knew of this place when I joined the club that no one wants to join.

I left here for ~a year while trying to R. She was pregnant (and I didn't want to hear the chorus of "get DNA test of fetus etc etc"), the stories here can be depressing, and it's hard to work on anything (or support a pregnant lady) when you're triggering constantly from those stories and the advice given in them. I've taken in an equal amount of despair and hope since I've come back, which is about where I was in my R anyway.

My wayward is reading the book recommended by Mrs. JA and has been browsing some threads as well. Hopefully it helps.


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## Laurel (Oct 14, 2013)

EleGirl said:


> Mr Blunt,
> 
> There are many success stories. People tend to not stay here and talk about it. They go on with their lives.
> 
> ...


This is SO true. I am coming up on a year past D-day. I chose to R and it is going very, very well. We are happier than we have ever been. It seems unbelievable, but it is true. 

I didn't know about TAM (unfortunately) before D-Day. I found it after I had already decided to R. So I was desperate for positive information about R, which was few and far between. But there were a couple of threads and a couple of people that really helped me make it through those dark days. And gave me hope that it could work. So I come back every once in awhile to see if I can contribute my own experiences and help others, like I was helped. But it gets very tiresome having to constantly defend myself and my choices against people who insist on calling me "weak," "spineless" or my favorite, a "cheater apologist" because I made a different choice than they did. I find this place very triggering and very depressing. So I don't come back very often. 

I think this is true of most people that successfully R. Who wants to rehash the most painful experience of their life over and over again? You will see an inordinate amount of false R's because those are the people that are going to come back and talk about it because they are looking for support. People who have happily reconciled, by and large, will not be back. If you look at this forum, it seems like R rarely works. But that simply isn't true in real life.


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## hopefulgirl (Feb 12, 2013)

Mr Blunt said:


> I understand that for some that R is not the best option but I do not understand people that post year after year on CWI but are not improving and in some cases they are worse than when they first posted. *Can someone enlighten ne on that?*


I suspect one or more of the following:

Rugsweeping.
No MC or very few sessions.
MC with someone who has little or no experience with infidelity.
IC that is sabotaging couple's progress.
Not having read Linda MacDonald's book (it REALLY makes a difference).
Reading books that suggest women prefer inequality in marriage.
Untreated or under-treated mental illness (includes personality disorders), WS or BS or both.
Substance abuse, WS or BS or both.
Other stress that detracts from working on R: unemployment, financial strain, working long hours, major illness, disability, etc.


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## sammy7111 (Apr 19, 2014)

How about sometime you just can get over being layed to and cheated own.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Mr Blunt (Jul 18, 2012)

> *By Laurel*
> I was desperate for positive information about R, which was few and far between. But there were a couple of threads and a couple of *people that really helped me make it through those dark days. And gave me hope that it could work*.


*
That is one of the reasons that I started this thread!*


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## Philat (Sep 12, 2013)

bestblu1 said:


> I discovered this thread today and realized what a long time it's been since I posted anything. I appreciate that this thread was started and I just wanted to cut in and mention that life is good, as good as I suppose it possibly could be considering the whole story.
> 
> For those who have questioned the authenticity of the story, for what it's worth, I am not a troll and everything I posted is the truth, the whole truth.... (regarding the sequence of events and the process that we went through to reconcile).
> 
> ...


bestblu1, I wasn't aware of your story until seeing this post. You have climbed a very high mountain, and you (and your W, for that matter) have my admiration. Mr Blunt was kind enough to include me among his cadre of successfully reconciled survivors of infidelity. It's been some 8 years since my discovery of an EA (at least--I'm assuming more) that went on for several years (was pretty much over by Dday). We are doing well, but I would not go so far as to say things are better than ever. They are different. Something has been lost. But that which remains is still better than any alternative I can imagine. I do not have unconditional trust, but I do think my fWW is a more than acceptable risk.


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## Mr Blunt (Jul 18, 2012)

> *By Philat*
> We are doing well, but I would not go so far as to say things are better than ever. They are different. Something has been lost. But that which remains is still better than any alternative I can imagine. I do not have unconditional trust, but I do think my fWW is a more than acceptable risk.



Philat’s summary above seems somewhat like my situation
Sometimes it comes down to putting the positive and negative on the scale. In my case the positive outweigh the negative.

I do not have as much passion in our marriage that EI and B1 and Mr. and Mrs. John Adams have but I have a very good life and a very close family connection.

Although I think that most have some permanent loss in some areas, so much can be gained in other areas. *So much depends on the BS and the WS. * I do not believe in once infidelity happens that you will have a life that is so damaged that you cannot recover and have a very good life in most cases.

We have several people that have years of successful R on this CWI forum that have a lot of very good and important information for those that really want to R. In fact you can probably find some people with successful R that is similar to your situation like Philat and I have some things in common. Of course you will not find an exact situation and in some cases your situation maybe quite different than others. *However, there are some helpful things that probably apply to all people in R.*



I think that many couples can have a successful R if they BOTH make up their minds and get the right information and then APPLY that information. I know some cases are hopeless but for some that may have a lot to do with the couples not being able to get on top of the hurt enough to start recovery.* Sometimes you have to work the steps even though you are in great pain.*


For those that are really interested in R we have a good amount on good information right here on TAM but I would also recommend that the couple use every source available. *Infidelity is the mother of all relationship killers but in some cases Mr. Infidelity can be defeated enough to allow for the couple to have a very good life*.
IMO


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## love=pain (Nov 26, 2012)

hopefulgirl said:


> It was not supportive terminology when she called you "grumpy" and especially "miserable" when you were actually "just tired." And if you're able to maintain an even keel and a calm demeanor and NOT be grumpy working such long hours, you are to be commended. (Personally, I found that the longer my work week became, the grumpier I got.) But I wonder, for everyone's sake - the kids, yours, the marriage's - have you found a way to reduce those hours to something closer to 40? Even 50ish would be more sane for someone with a family. I hope you've already reduced those hours - if not, that could be a major problem.
> 
> I certainly did 15-16 years ago, we moved to a bigger house she said she wanted more kids and would like me home more, I worked it out business wise and I am mostly 40 hours or less. I only worked those hours the first 5-6 years of my business start up so I did miss a lot with my older guys but that was a decision that *we* made together I would work she would take care of the kids.
> As for the grumpy well I didn't think so, tired yeah but I don't sleep much anyhow(I didn't then either) so I am never that tired.
> ...


I just wanted to clear this up a bit for the last 16 years of our marriage I have been home more much more and I always spent time with my wife and kids, since the dday stuff her and I have been joined at the hip, lots of activities together or with the kids working on our marriage and family.


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