# lost so very lost



## nappyspexx (Jul 21, 2012)

OK this is my first post but i frequently visit enjoy reading and taking in some advice now i seek some

So a lil bout me.. Im 27 and my wife is 23. the wife and i has been married 1 1/2 yrs together for 2 close to 3yrs She has a daughter who is 3, she had her of course before we got together. We also have a kik boy together who just turnt 1.

Things use to be good now it seems like everything i do is either wrong or not good enough. I clean but im reminded constantly that i dont clean like her. I was told that if I hug and kiss her more she would be turned on more. Meaning more intamcy. When i do quite often at my own will still nothing. I increase my affection still nothing. I do miss the closness but its not an issue to me any more. We argue constantly over something i did or didnt do due which i now tend to agree cuz im over arguin. its sad but i would rather sit in silence not talking to her than having childess arguments with someone who thinks they are right all the time. According to her she doesnt have to be right.

Ive been nothing but open with her from the start. i constantly tell her what on my mind or things i want to do. But every other week same thing we dont like we use which some how the finger gets pointed at me. I listen when she talks, and ask questions to under stand. She listens but has no clue. Now she says ive change im depressed when all im doing is being me

Im just tired of the same merry go round. I want us to work but im tired no matter what i do i cant gain an inch.. need advice need help. sorry tried to keep it short so any qquestions please ask and i would love feed back thank you


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## Uptown (Mar 27, 2010)

Nappy, welcome to the TAM forum. I've read your posts in several different threads and want to respond to your suspicion that your W may have strong bipolar traits. Mood swings attributable to bipolar are often mistaken for the mood changes caused by strong BPD (Borderline Personality Disorder) traits. I suggest you read my description of the differences between these two disorders to see if one or the other sounds very familiar. My description is at http://talkaboutmarriage.com/genera...ve-without-you-fighting-help.html#post1051089. I also suggest you read my post at http://talkaboutmarriage.com/general-relationship-discussion/33734-my-list-hell.html#post473522. If either of those two posts rings a bell, I would be glad to discuss it with you and point you to good online resources. Take care, Nappy.


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## nappyspexx (Jul 21, 2012)

lol wow both of those threads sounds so familiar.. w does throw tantrums slamming car doors or stuff on counter then tells me ive chnaged or different which leaves me dazed and confused felling like the bad guy... she has been depressed off n on but not maniac n not like serously deep dression but i do walk on egg shells choose words carefully and try to pick times to talk to...now she thinks something is wrong with me. she said since i noticed she was different and needed to talk to someone. she claims she notice im different and depressed and need to talk to someone.. i thought it strange out of the blue... that mornig she was pouting having a tantrum 
bt yea i would love to disscuss this further cuz like i said im lost we only been married a short time n im exhausted mentally getting there physically i really love to death but im tired.. so any advice or knowledge you can share will be helpfull
thank you


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## Uptown (Mar 27, 2010)

nappyspexx said:


> i would love to discuss this further.


Nappy, if you have any specific questions, I would be glad to try to answer them or point you to an online resource that can. I caution that, if your W has strong BPD traits, they would not have vanished for a year or two. Such traits are persistent and typically vanish only for 3 to 6 months during the courtship period (when her infatuation holds her fears at bay). Although BPD traits are created during early childhood, they typically start showing themselves the worst at puberty. 

Hence, if you have seen such behavior only during the last six months or so, it more likely is due to a hormone change, not a pattern of BPD traits. Such hormone changes are common following the birth of a child (i.e., PPD) but, since your son is a year old, that does not seem to be a likely explanation.

I also caution that every adult on the planet occasionally exhibits all nine of the BPD traits, albeit at a low level if the person is emotionally healthy. This is why, like all the other PDs, BPD is called a "spectrum disorder." We all exhibit the traits to some degree.

At issue, then, is NOT whether your W has the BPD traits. Of course she does. We all do. At issue is whether she has most of them at a strong level. I don't know the answer to that question. Indeed, I've never even met the young lady. But I am confident you can spot the red flags if you take time to read about them. There is nothing subtle or nuanced about traits such as verbal abuse, distrustfulness, lack of impulse control, and rapid flips between loving you and devaluing you.

Of course, only a professional can determine whether her traits are so severe as to constitute full blown BPD. Yet, even when the traits fall well short of that diagnostic threshold, they can make your life miserable and undermine a marriage. 

Hence, for the purpose of deciding whether to remain married to her, it simply does not matter whether her traits meet 100% of the diagnostic criteria for "having BPD." What matters is whether they are so strong that you are unhappy much of the time and the children are being harmed by the fighting and verbal abuse.

Before you graduated high school, you already could identify girls you didn't want to date because they were too selfish and grandiose -- without knowing whether they met 100% of the criteria for having Narcissistic PD. You could identify the class drama queen -- without knowing whether she met all the criteria for having Histrionic PD. 

Likewise, you could spot the girls having no respect for laws or other peoples' property or feelings -- without knowing whether they had full blown Antisocial PD. And you could recognize the very shy and over-sensitive classmates -- without diagnosing Avoidant PD. Similarly, you will be able to spot strong BPD traits when they occur.


> any advice or knowledge you can share will be helpfull thank you


As an initial matter, if you suspect your W has strong BPD traits, I recommend that you NOT tell her. If she is a BPDer (i.e., has strong traits), she almost certainly will project the accusation right back onto you, believing YOU to be the BPDer. Instead, simply encourage her to see a good psychologist (not a MC) and let the psych decide what to tell her.

Second, I suggest you read _Stop Walking on Eggshells_, the best-selling book targeted to the abused spouses of BPDers. Also good is _I Hate You, Don't Leave Me._

Third, I suggest you start participating (or at least lurking) at BPDfamily.com -- the largest and most active BPD forum I've found that is devoted fully to the spouses and family members of BPDers. This issue is such an enormous problem that that website is growing by 20 new members every day. The result is that it offers eight separate message boards on various BPD issues. The ones that likely will be most helpful to you -- if your believe your W is a BPDer -- are the "Staying" board, "Leaving" board, and "Raising a Child when One Parent Has BPD."

Fourth, while you are at BPDfamily.com, I suggest you read the excellent articles in their resources section. My favorite is "Surviving a Breakup with Someone with BPD" at T9 Surviving a Break-up with Someone Suffering with Borderline Personality Disorder - Columbia University, New York.

Fifth, I suggest you see a clinical psychologist -- for a visit or two _by yourself_ -- to obtain a candid professional opinion on what it is you are dealing with -- and, if it is a personality disorder like BPD, how likely it is she may pass it on to your children. As I've explained in other threads, your best chance of getting a candid opinion regarding a possible BPD diagnosis is to NOT have the BPDer along. Therapists are loath to tell high functioning BPDers the name of the disorder.

Finally, please don't forget those of us on this TAM forum. We want to keep trying to answer your questions and providing emotional support as long as you find our shared experiences helpful.


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## lucy mulholland (May 18, 2010)

I'm not sure how it's helpful for you to label your wife as BPD, of any percentage. No one likes to be labelled, but instead, heard and communicated with as a person. If you can about her enough to look past the easy diagnosis of a mental health disorder (which I agree we all have to a certain degree, as in, things that irk us, that may seem irrational to others, fears and emotions that aren't handled well) -- I suggest you go to see a counsellor who is not bent on diagnosing either one of you, but instead able and ready to help you communicate better with each other.

Have two kids under 4 is a huge stress, and there may be hormonal or plain stress reasons why she is acting the way she is. She needs something form you and is having a hard time communicating it. Seems to be a fair but of resentment there, too. I hope you can get to the bottom of it with compassion rather than with labelling. Best of luck.


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## nappyspexx (Jul 21, 2012)

So Ive been doing some snoopin on diff sites reading n gettin info. n time n tme again it sounds like my wife the unpredictable mood swings the love hate, also tantrums. and right now i believe that shes going thru a clinging phase. she has been overly clingy. 

I alos been thinking maybe its me maybe i have an issue being married. I realized this morning i would rather be friends with her than have her as my w. then i feel horrible for feeling that way. maybe its the constant challenging of my opinions or suggetions we always argue over little stuff then she acts extremely good like nothing happened, physically theres no issue but mentally emotionally i feel theres no connection. 

however she believes im perfect for her i feel diff.. i cant give her what she needs and her me. but she dont see that. even after all the talks we had. she knows i dont like to argue. i even told her i might leave because theres no common ground and im tired of the arguing..

after some intense thinking n trying to figure out what this cloud hanging over me is. thats when i realized it might be me. cuz i no longer see her in my future n have a hard time talking bout our future together w/her cuz i dont see her there. well its like i can at times but its hazy.

im mad at myself cuz i feel we should be friends rather than h n w. it may be hard to believe bt i really do love her. and i know how devasted she gonna be n she not got fully ubderstand so im preppin myself for what may come. I dont know if this all makes sense cuz im still a bit confused bt its how i feel.

maybe im the problem


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## nappyspexx (Jul 21, 2012)

Lucy.... ur right it not ok for me to label her.. its not my place.. there is a communiction problem cuz we dont seem to understand eachother anymore.. we try talking but it gets us no where.. theres no yelling no name calling we just dont understand eachother.. n i am currently looking for a therapist or someone to talk to

Thank you for ur post


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## RDL (Feb 10, 2012)

Read Married Man's Sex life primer by Athol Kay. ASAP.

Come back with feedback once you read it.


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## WalterWhite (Sep 14, 2012)

lucy mulholland said:


> I'm not sure how it's helpful for you to label your wife as BPD, of any percentage. No one likes to be labelled, but instead, heard and communicated with as a person. If you can about her enough to look past the easy diagnosis of a mental health disorder (which I agree we all have to a certain degree, as in, things that irk us, that may seem irrational to others, fears and emotions that aren't handled well) -- I suggest you go to see a counsellor who is not bent on diagnosing either one of you, but instead able and ready to help you communicate better with each other.
> 
> Have two kids under 4 is a huge stress, and there may be hormonal or plain stress reasons why she is acting the way she is. She needs something form you and is having a hard time communicating it. Seems to be a fair but of resentment there, too. I hope you can get to the bottom of it with compassion rather than with labelling. Best of luck.


You can't fix a problem if you don't have a diagnosis...of course nobody likes to be labeled a diagnosis, but that is not the right metric. A better metric is: Do what helps, and what helps is to get diagnosed. Once diagnosis is done, now you can make a plan of treatment, execute it and move forward with a solution.


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