# Does she really want the relationship?



## Jonathan74 (Sep 27, 2012)

My fiancee and I have been in this cycle for most of our relationship where things go good, then I mentally check out for some reason and focus on other things and hobbies. 
When I do this, over time, she will go and do something to get my attention like chat online with ex boyfriends or start online relationships, and when i find out, I get upset and afraid and try to give her everything she wants, and make her feel comfortable again.. 
I do love her, and over time my feelings have changed about how I feel.. she is the mother of my 2 children and we have gone through so much together.
The thought of being without her and my kids destroy me..
Most recently, things have turned for the worse and she wanted me to move out so she could have time without me, to find out if she would miss me.. of course i did not want to do that, and have just been trying to do what i can to comfort her, and re-kindle the relationship.
We have not "made love" for at least a month. She still says she loves me, and we kiss and hug. We have been doing lots of talking and just yesterday we were in bed. She had a fever and was sick, and i was taking care of her..
We were talking about various things and she wanted to lay with me in bed.. she said for me not to get any ideas, that she just wanted to be close and lay together.
She made a hot bath before I went to work yesterday, and while I was in there, i asked her if she still wanted me to leave... she said no, that things have been good, and this is what she has always wanted.
What she is afraid of is, things get good again, and she opens up her feelings to me, i will check out again... she is tired of the hurt, and what she has been doing with me the last month or so, and her actions, i believe is what she percieves of how i was to her.. 
I know there is no such thing as a perfect relationship.
All relationships take work,
There is so much more background history to talk of but dont want to bore anyone yet...
When it comes down to it.. i love my family.. i want a normal life.. i love her.. i just feel like i have been dragged through the coals.. but want to do whatever i can to show her she is the one.

Can anyone chime in? Thanks so much in advance...


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

Her reconnecting with ex's is not good at all. Really no excuse. That is emotional cheating.

I suggest you guys do His Needs Her Needs together. Do not skip the boundary setting. Needs are not being met and her boundaries are weak. She is using emotional blackmail.

Worse than that there may be a thrid party in your relationship.

Never understood people having kids before they were married but it is common these days. To me this shows less than optimal commitment. Maybe she feels that way.

You say she is your fiance. When is the wedding?


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Jonathan74 said:


> When I do this, over time, she will go and do something to get my attention like chat online with ex boyfriends or start online relationships, and when i find out, I get upset and afraid and try to give her everything she wants, and make her feel comfortable again..


WTF?

Don't marry her, dude. 

If she needs to get in touch with her exes each time you guys have a disagreement, cut her loose.

Stop clinging to her like a vine, it's unattractive. You want a different result? Try something different. Don't reward bad behavior.


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## Jonathan74 (Sep 27, 2012)

Entropy3000 said:


> Her reconnecting with ex's is not good at all. Really not excuse. That is emotional cheating.


I agree.. it is..
But I feel she was reaching out for something that she was needing inside from me, things that I was not giving her.. she is very introverted.. she does not talk when she is upset.. she stuffs it inside...




Entropy3000 said:


> I suggest you guys do His Needs Her Needs together. Do not skip the boundary setting.


Where can i find this? 






Entropy3000 said:


> Needs are not being met and her boundaries are week. She is using emotional blackmail.



What do you mean her bounderies are weak? And could you be more specific when you say emotional blackmail? How exactly?




Entropy3000 said:


> Worse than that there may be a thrid party in your relationship.


I think there was to some degree.. as a matter of fact there was.. I do not know how far it went.. but all i can think of is the part that i played in it..




Entropy3000 said:


> Never understood people have kids before they were married but it is common these days. To m this shows less than optimal commitment.
> 
> You say she is your fiance. When is the wedding?


There is no date.. as a matter of fact.. after i found out about the problems.. i took the ring off... now the ring is back on..


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## Jonathan74 (Sep 27, 2012)

Jellybeans said:


> WTF?
> 
> Don't marry her, dude.
> 
> ...


No.. it is not disagreements.. and we have had plenty of those.. i dont want to give the idea that when we have a problem, or a misunderstanding, she waits for me to leave so she can chat up men..

i do agree with the clinging.. but damn.. i feel like i have not been there so many times emotionally, physically.. 

i do agree with the rewarding of bad behavior.. we have children and have built a life.. what do i do? 
i am not trying to cling to her like vine.. but i know i am...

how do i release? and would it be a mistake in the long run?


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## Chelle D (Nov 30, 2011)

my advice, 
tell her you asked if she still wants you to leave. She said no.
Then say... Think about it.. because next time you ask me to leave.. and i find you have an online affair... I WILL leave. You won't have to ask twice.

Then let her figure it all out.


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## Jonathan74 (Sep 27, 2012)

I have children.. and it is simply not that easy... I do not want to abandon them. 

How can i be for sure where she is emotionally. How can i know if there is a current third party telling her things... influencing her...

how do i know if she is struggling in what to do, or if she is indeed hurt, and reluctant to drop the wall again...


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

Jonathan74 said:


> I agree.. it is..
> But I feel she was reaching out for something that she was needing inside from me, things that I was not giving her.. she is very introverted.. she does not talk when she is upset.. she stuffs it inside...
> 
> *Anytime anyone cheats it is because they are wanting to meet a need. Does not make it right.*
> ...


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

Jonathan74 said:


> I have children.. and it is simply not that easy... I do not want to abandon them.
> 
> How can i be for sure where she is emotionally. How can i know if there is a current third party telling her things... influencing her...
> 
> how do i know if she is struggling in what to do, or if she is indeed hurt, and reluctant to drop the wall again...


You are going to have to start snooping. I am not the expert on this. Others can guide you better.


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## Chelle D (Nov 30, 2011)

demand access (passwords.. not just her logging on) to all her email and social networking sites.

Then log on & look through her messages, through her archived.. etc.

If she refuses to give you passwords... that might be a light bulb going off.... Then sit and calmly discuss WHY she doesnt want you to read her emails. (Be prepared for emails you won't like).. Then discuss your future together. Ask who is influencing her decisions to ask you to leave.... is it a mother/ sister/ relative/ friend/ coworker?/ online chat friend???

I think you will be able to judge from your gut feeling whether she is being open or evasive with you. Trust your gut on if she is cheating. Then.. decide if you want counseling to work it out together.. or start deciding what you want to do with your kids.


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## Jonathan74 (Sep 27, 2012)

I have access to all accounts and have found things that i do not like at all... 

Ijust feel so hopeless... she says she doesnt want to go sep ways... but there is no nothing.. we kiss.. layed on the couch to watch a movie.. no sex... no deep kissing...

she says she just knows all of this is an act... she doesnt want to open her self up to hurt anymore... she feels i am putting on a act.. and the way i am acting now is what she fell in love with.. once she opens up to me again.. i will retract like i have done in the past.. several times..

i do not know if i have what it takes to just go.. or keep my disance.. i dont want to play mental games like act like i dont want to be with her...

I DO NOT KNOW WHAT TO DO!! IT IS COMSUMING ME.. IT IS AFFECTING EVERYTHING!! MY JOB!! I FEEL LIKE I AM GOING TO HAVE A NERVOUS BREAKDOWN!!!


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## 360H (Sep 25, 2012)

Jonathan - you have kids and you're jumping into a situation many of here, hundreds, maybe THOUSANDS are suffering to escape from... a partner that is making hers[him]self available to other people?

Are you crazy? 

You are lucky you aren't married yet. You are DOUBLE lucky that she's the one that wants out! Your TRIPLE lucky, you've found this place filled with people that are giving you quite sound advise here.

If you're raising your kids as a single father, this is the last thing you need, man. Imagine being married to her, your kids getting attached to her, and then she betrays all of you? What have you done, but brought betrayal into your kids lives when you already have a chance, and a lot of people strongly advising you to... *RUN *... while you can. 

Good luck.


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## Jonathan74 (Sep 27, 2012)

We have been together for 8 years.. have had 2 children, never married.. why?

I said we needed to get married yesterday.. set a date.. she says we were just thinking of splitting and now we are talking about wedding dates?

She is in the drivers seat.. HOW CAN I FIND THE WAY TO RELEASE... TO BREAK FREE FROM THE FEAR OF LOSS..

i feel like i am holding on way too DAMNED tight.. i know she knows it..

how can i be like i was before when i was confortable.. but, the only other change would be treating her like i feel for her now... 

i heard of the 180, dont know much about it.. but can understand the theory.. i dont want to leave, dont want to be without the kids.. dont want this to be a back and forth thing.. i could only imagine how moving out and in could get easier and easier as time moves on.. i want to put my heels in the sand and WORK THIS OUT!! i can forgive her.. she cant forgive me.. she is scared that i will return to being withdrawn if she "gives me what i want"

I dont know what to do...


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## Chelle D (Nov 30, 2011)

Okay.. I have a question..

This "withdrawling" of yourself, to focus on your own hobbies, and other things (I assume friends. -ie: Not any cheating)

HOW long of a period of withdrawling is it?? Example.. you focus all on her.. all energies spent on making her happy.. Every day something needed to set her into a smile, etc.

Then.. you decide you want to go fishing for a day, or a weekend...etc?? Then when you get back.. you don't "focus only on making her happy" again. Is that how it goes? 

I mean, when you are focusing on your hobbies, is it only a couple days? IF SO, I'd say she is a complete DRAMA QUEEN. If she can't live without being the center of your attention each and every day.. well, She is being completely selfish!. That is no way for a man to show his appreciation for a woman... just because she demands the attention daily. 

Even if it was say a week before you focus back on her.. well, I'd think she is being a little unreasonable. You ARE allowed to have a life without her spoon feeding you what your likes/dislikes & emotions "should" be.

On the other hand...If after giving yourself some slight pleasure in your own hobbies... then is it more like week , two, three weeks, before you focus back on her again.. .Before you remember to tell her you love her.. & you spend some extra time with her. Or do something special for her...

Then yes, I could see that being something that would bother me as a wife. However, I think (Hope) I would be strong enough of a person to gently prompt hubby to start letting me know he still thinks I'm special.

Maybe not. maybe I'm too selfish. 

But anyway... I wonder at how long of a period this is when you are "mentally checked out". Even with that.. .she is still selfish if she decides to start online affairs instead of confronting you that you are ignoring or neglecting some of her emotional needs. You want a wife with a stronger commitment than that!


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## Jonathan74 (Sep 27, 2012)

All in all, things have been on the up and up, very slowly.
She does not want to seperate now, which is good.. we have talked and talked and talked... the thing now is that she does not want to have sex for a couple of weeks... so.. that is what will happen...

We do however still have lots of affection for each other... we still kiss each other, and spend lots of time hugging tight and carrasing each other... a week or so ago, that was a no go.. she wouldnt give me any open mouth kisses.. 

by no means is everything perfect... 

has anyone heard of the Passion Paradox?

She claims i have been the 1up for years.. she feels like i had a way about me that i felt that i was better than her.. and i would always put her down.. and that she always felt that we were just roomates and her job was just to clean and take care of the kids, and i would never show her any effection or attention.. she said she used to always be the one to initiate any type of sex or anything... she would take the time to do herself up and look sexy, only for me to just sigh and say i was not in the mood... this is all true to a degree, although i feel she blows it out of proportion... but if this is what she feels, then i have to accept that..

after i found out about the emotional cheating, even in the past, here i come, i shower her with effection and attention.. things would fall back to good, then for some reason i just check out meaning that now that i have her back physically and emotionally.. i for some reason stop..

now it is different.. i think she enjoys me chasing her.. i am complimenting her, doing things together, and talking alot more as friends.. really focusing on her.. 

i think she feels that sex is the only card she can play or NOT PLAY to see if i really want her i guess...

she wants to wait.. she wants to make love again and feel passionate when we do...

please advise...


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## Emerald (Aug 2, 2012)

Jonathan74 said:


> has anyone heard of the Passion Paradox?


Yes - so who is the one "more in love?"

Here's the thing:

I don't believe in long engagements. If you really want to get married, you get the license & do it. For whatever reasons, you both are not serious about getting married or maybe one of you is......

You've got massive relationship issues. I suggest counseling asap because your children are suffering even if they don't say anything.

Good luck.


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## dmz (Sep 14, 2012)

Jonathan...all the signs are there that she still has a single mind set...the mere fact that she is talking to xs is the deal breaker.... you need to be really strong and have a long long talk with her...before you do ...I suggest you : script your needs on paper and make 2 copies.... find quiet time with her if you can and go over each one on the list..... I am going through a similiar experience and it truly feel awful... if you are committed to marriage as you say.. make all the arrangements and present it to her also.....this will show you her true colors.... 

If you have found emails and texts that make you uncomfortable...then you may not have the right one....she has a fear of committment and if you marry her ...you are in for it....just think about it realistically....you will be her husband and when something goes wrong....she will talking to another dude...emotional cheating is what most women start off with because they see it as being ok to talk to an old boyfriend...that is bs..... its crossing the line...period.... all things being done in the dark always come to the light for you to see... just guard your heart...you deserve more as a man and father to those kids you have together.....


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