# I'm in a bad spot..please respond..



## sacredheart (Sep 14, 2010)

Good afternoon everyone - First of all, I'm a bit paranoid at times and have trust issues because I've been cheated on in the past. I'm in a relationship in where I suspect my live in boyfriend of 2 years has cheated or is cheating or is a serial cheater. There have been signs from him texting his ex girlfriend to me hearing he was out at a bar with another girl to him coming home with lipstick on the bottom of his shirt. Sometimes when I kiss him his face smells of somethig funny..I can't pin point it but sometimes I think it's the smell of another woman..Of course I'm crazy and none of this has happened. I'm in a crazy stage of denial because I love him and I think he will change. Plus, I don't have proof that all I said above means he's been cheating or is it proof? 

He told me when we started dating that he always cheated in his past until he got married and she wound up cheating on him and left him. Talk about Karma huh? You would think if he was cheating on me why wouldn't he have learned his lesson? Is it an addiction? I'm a great woman to him. Took his kids under my arm (every other weekend with him), attractive with a great job. Why do men do these things?

I had started to detach myself from him because of my suspicions, etc. to recently find out that I'm pregnant! I'm so confused as what to do! I don't know if I'm being paranoid? If I do have a baby with him..will he change? Should I terminate? Any advice would be so greatly appreciated...I'm at a loss and having much anxiety about it all...

I'm so in love with him...this is hurting me so badly...


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## JustAGirl (Oct 1, 2010)

When you've talked to him about it, did you "accuse" him or just tell him how you were feeling? If you truely feel it in your gut, approach it another way....appeal to his conscience. Tell him what you're feeling and if he's honest, you guys can work thru it. It could be hormones too...but I've learned one thing...if it doesn't feel/seem right, it probably isn't. But you need to really make sure...I'm sorry you're going thru this, I've been there.

M


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## sacredheart (Sep 14, 2010)

Thanks for the response Just a girl...I've accused and I've tried the mature chat...he comes back with "I'm a good man" but never gives me excuses for say the lipstick on his shirt...just denies everything like I'm nutso...it's making me nutso..

I've always been borderline paranoid so there was something in every relationship that didn't feel right to me...he's the worst feeling I've had though...I've never felt this bad about someone...

I just feel like I'm in a time sensitive area right now and I need to make decisions soon...I don't want to be stuck with and bring a child into this world with a cheater...I can't...

Do you think this would change him though? The baby?


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## JustAGirl (Oct 1, 2010)

sacredheart said:


> Thanks for the response Just a girl...I've accused and I've tried the mature chat...he comes back with "I'm a good man" but never gives me excuses for say the lipstick on his shirt...just denies everything like I'm nutso...it's making me nutso..
> 
> I've always been borderline paranoid so there was something in every relationship that didn't feel right to me...he's the worst feeling I've had though...I've never felt this bad about someone...
> 
> ...



_If_ he's a cheater, he's the only one who can change it.
I think once someone cheats, after the bad/guilty feelings go away.....they do it again and again. Soon, it doesn't bother them as bad.....
Now....if you really wanna know, you need to investigate. I truely believe that the reason people don't catch another person cheating is because deep down, they don't want to know.

I would know, without a shadow of a doubt before I did anything....you might be surprised at what you decide once you know for sure either way.


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## sacredheart (Sep 14, 2010)

Hi guys..thanks for the responses...our cell phone number is under my name so I decided to snoop yesterday..I found that he's been calling and texting his ex and this girl that he was out at the bar with (says he wasn't) he's been texting her as well...on a daily basis they texted..numerous times...when I confronted him he said she's dating his boss...that they chat OCCASIONALLY (10 times a day) about work, his boss, me, places and things to do in Cleveland cause she's new around here...I asked him why he never told me he had a work friend cause he's had no problem telling me about other female friends and he said it's because he knows I'd be upset...he thinks that he's done nothing wrong and he's the innocent one here...he says that he's never touched another woman..that he's been faithful and he's proud of it...that he's in love with me and all he needs is me...he won't apologize cause once again there's nothing to apologize about...it's all innocent..he's betrayed my trust...

Also..if the girl at work was just a work friend, when I called her instead of saying that, she told me that I needed to take it up with him...they're just friends though...all lies...I'm just beyond sick to my stomach righ tnow..


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Ask a friend to follow him with a camera.


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## Workingitout (Sep 27, 2010)

Men & women can't be "just" friends! There's always an attraction by one person or the other (or both). He's cheating (at least an EA)! If it hasn't happened yet (physical), then it will. Get help quickly!


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## Mom6547 (Jul 13, 2010)

Workingitout, that is a load of hooey. Men and women certainly CAN be just friends. Not everyone thinks constantly with their sex organs.


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## Chris Taylor (Jul 22, 2010)

If it were one thing, I'd say you were paranoid. But there are several things here that you will ignore at your own peril. If he is a live-in boyfriend, there's no reason to be texting ex's or lipstick on his shirt.

At a minimum you shouldn't have his child until you are absolutely sure about his fidelity and trust. You aren't and you shouldn't be.


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## sunshine31 (Feb 1, 2010)

If you actually talked to the girl and she said that you needed to take it up with him, I would consider that a complete red flag. I know that if a friends wife or girlfriend called me asking if we were more than friends and we were not, I would totally be reassuring her and telling her that there is absolutely nothing going on.


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## dblkman (Jul 14, 2010)

vthomeschoolmom said:


> Workingitout, that is a load of hooey. Men and women certainly CAN be just friends. Not everyone thinks constantly with their sex organs.


I agree, I am married and I have several very close female friends that are attractive but I would NEVER cross the line. We have been friends for over 10 years now.


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## sacredheart (Sep 14, 2010)

Hi guys...she definitely said I need to take it up with him..until I told her to be a woman about it...then she said "just friends"...

Was does EA stand for guys? sorry..lol

I was thinking of doing the PI thing...just don't know how...I even just did a reverse cell look up and the phone is registered to some guy of course...

Why do you think he's lying? Like why wouldn't he just break up with me? Are men really that dirty?


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## workin' (Jun 3, 2010)

sacredheart said:


> Hi guys...she definitely said I need to take it up with him..until I told her to be a woman about it...then she said "just friends"...


Her first response was her gut response...go with it.



sacredheart said:


> Was does EA stand for guys? sorry..lol


Emotional Affair...just as damaging, if not more so, in some cases. He HAS cheated...on your relationship, at the least.



sacredheart said:


> I was thinking of doing the PI thing...just don't know how...I even just did a reverse cell look up and the phone is registered to some guy of course...


Do you have a close friend, who may be willing to check on him? Any way YOU could follow him? Do some serious digging.



sacredheart said:


> Why do you think he's lying? Like why wouldn't he just break up with me? Are men really that dirty?


#1.He's lying, because he is getting away with it.
#2. He has a roof over his head.
#3. Yes, some are.


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## sacredheart (Sep 14, 2010)

I also want to add that he was married and his wife cheated on him and left him for the other man...don't people learn from these things? You would think that would have humbled him..


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## F-102 (Sep 15, 2010)

Lots of men think that they are entitled to screw around, and none more so that ones that had it done to them. But if your H/BF gets confronted with a question, and they go into coverup mode, then it's obvious that they are up to no good. Don't confront the OW, they will just deny it, and give BF the ammunition to use against you, i.e., "it's all in your head", "you don't trust me", and to anyone who will listen "see the psycho I have to put up with?"


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## Rob774 (Sep 27, 2010)

To the OP, you are in a tight situation. If there wasn't a pregnancy involved, i wouldn't have bothered responding at all because commen sense would tell you to leave. But with a baby on the way, i don't know if i can suggest to terminate it. I don't see kids as an accident or curse. I see it as a blessing. There is no way to tell if you will ever be in a future situation where you will have a baby. That might sound crazy, especially if you are in your are just in your mid 20's. Well i'm in my late 30's and i have plenty of business professionaly lady friends... with no children. 

Keep the baby, who knows, sometimes that is enough to shock the unresponsible person into action.


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## sweet pce (Oct 28, 2010)

truthaboutdeception.com


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## sacredheart (Sep 14, 2010)

Happy Halloween everyone! I want to express my sincere thanks to all of you have taken the time to offer so much input. It means alot. 

As you all know I'm at a loss as what to do. Just recently I found out by looking at the phone logs that he reached out to her and texted her first. She wasn't texting him at first. He would text in the morning and then she'd respond. When I ask him what he was reaching out to her for he said "nothing" that it was really nothing. Work stuff, etc. I told him that he doesn't really even work in her department so why reach out to her. He said it was mindless chatter. That he's never put his hands on anyone else and he's been a good man. He told me that he knows it was wrong but he didn't tell me about her because he knows I'd be upset. Now I admit that I have been the insecure jealous type which would make him want to hide this "friend" but he's told me about other female friends at work so not sure whey she's the exception to the rule. I told him out of all the people he could have had mindless chatter with he chose her and I want to know why he chose her. He didn't have an anser for me. He insists that this person is no one and that it was nothing. He has apologized a ton and promised it'll never happen again. That he'd cut all ties and go to see a counselor with me. I told him that if he deceived me once, he'd do it again.

I'm starting to wonder if any of this is my fault. I've constantly questioned him in the relationship because I don't trust him. There were reasons like this though that got me to that point. You know, questioning his every move. I mean, that's what happens when someone breaks your trust right? How does he expect me to trust him when things like this go down? Do you think that if I changed...started to act like I trust him and don't care that he'll change. Eventually stop seeing/talking to this other person? Is it repairable? Or am I completely just being irrational and silly and just need to tell him to get lost? It's hard because I love him SO much...I know all of you who have gone through or are going through it understand. 

I just want to refresh your memory that this "friend" at work was the one he was seen out with when he was supposed to be at the bar with his friend, not her. Then I find out that he's been texting her (only proof I have) for awhile now...since June or July maybe? The texts I've seen are only for the last two weeks though cause the cell phone records don't go that far back. Do you think that he's fallen in love with someone else? Is it possible to love two people at once? Or he's just developed a friendship with her that he was afraid to tell me cause he knows I'd flip out?

I'm just at a loss as to why? When we're good togther we're SO good together..we get along great, great sex life, my daughter and his daughters get along so great...beautiful home..he's attractive..I'm attractive...it's like we have the whole package..I'm just wondering if my mistrust and constant questioning led him astray...is it fixable? Am I stupid...or is it not me? 

As always I look forward to your responses...you all are helping me tremendously through this hard decision making time...


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Because he's a man and he 'deserves' to have his cake and eat it too. Because he knows women are Givers and he can take advantage of that. He and his friends have been discussing that forever. How to get what he wants and still keep the woman.


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## needsomejoy (Nov 1, 2010)

If he is a cheater having a baby won't change him.

I've never had any experience with a cheater but I would seriously second guess having a child with someone who is being as dishonest as he is being.


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## Beverley (Oct 26, 2010)

I think that your 'gut feelings' in a situation like this are really important. There appear to be too many unanswered questions about his behaviour.

But the question of the baby is a completely different one. I don't know your financial situation but whether to have the baby or not should not solely rest on whether your relationship survives. This is such a difficult time for you and my heart goes out to you, but I really do feel that your decision as to whether to go ahead with your pregnancy should, if at all possible, be independent from your decision about whether or not to continue with your relationship.


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## sacredheart (Sep 14, 2010)

Morning everyone - no I cannot afford this child by myself. It would be difficult. This is why I'm in such a pickle. I mean, I asked some of you if you thought this was my fault? If he can change, etc.? Any advice on that?


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

No and No.


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## sacredheart (Sep 14, 2010)

Turnera thank you! He offered to go to couples counseling...no?


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

You are wasting your time in therapy with him if he is still communicating with another reason. Cheaters LIE. And LIE WELL. If he says he wants to go to therapy with you, and he is not (1) handing over his phone and computer any hour of the day you ask for it (before he gets to delete stuff), (2) writing this woman/these women a No Contact letter that YOU read and send, (3) and apologizing to within an inch of his life, there is only ONE reason he wants to go to therapy:

He wants you to believe he is being good...so he can KEEP you and his lifestyle and continue to cheat.


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## sacredheart (Sep 14, 2010)

Turnera - he told me that she did text him 3 times over the weekend...was honest about that...said that he decided to delete them immediately because it's not that important and he doesn't want to be in trouble more than he is. I have control over the cell phone account and have the capability to block any numbers on our phones. He told me to go ahead and block her. I guess that doesn't mean he can't a hold of her other ways though huh? Although they work in a factory with thousand's of employee's I assume he can still get a hold of her. I told him to tell her that they can't be friends anymore and he said it wouldn't be necessary because when she doesn't hear from him she won't be expecting an explanation. 

As far as counseling goes, I told him that was the only option of us possibly working things out. He was very reluctant at first. He did call and give me his voice mail password today and said that he doesn't even need a cell phone. That I can cancel the account if I want. 

Why isn't he afraid of jeopardizing everythign and losing me? Does any of the stuff that I said make it sound any better or am I doomed? It's hopeless.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

What you're describing is different from what we are advising. 


sacredheart said:


> Turnera - he told me that she did text him 3 times over the weekend...was honest about that...said that he decided to delete them immediately because it's not that important and he doesn't want to be in trouble more than he is.


Here is where YOU have to be forceful in what YOU need - not what HE thinks you should be happy with. He thinks you should be happy that he deletes them, and you have to say "NO! In fact, HELL NO! You cheated and I need you to HONOR me by doing what I NEED."



> I have control over the cell phone account and have the capability to block any numbers on our phones. He told me to go ahead and block her.


Again, this needs to be HIM making the changes to prove to YOU that he cares more about you than himself. Tell him so.



> I told him to tell her that they can't be friends anymore and he said it wouldn't be necessary because when she doesn't hear from him she won't be expecting an explanation.


Again, you are going about this wrong. You need to tell him that he has to write her a No Contact letter, and YOU need to send it to her. This is for psychological reasons - for him to PROVE to you that he is choosing to stop cheating to HONOR your marriage. If he's unwilling to take these bare minimum steps to save his own marriage, than he is still at least foggy and is not committed to you. Do not accept this.

Tell him you need HIM to take action, it is NOT your job to do it FOR him.


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## recursive (Nov 2, 2010)

i dont' know girls. I've been in a relationship like this before and everyone is right. This guy wants to have his cake and eat it too. This girl at work is just the one instance you uncovered. But even if you resolve this particular situation, what about the lipsticks on the color or the weird smells. 

I know you feel like you might be crazy and paranoid, but in my experience, intuition and gut feelings are usually right. If you stay in this relationship you will ALWAYS feel like the crazy paranoid person. Is that who you want to be? I know other than the infidelity (and that is a HUGE factor) everything else seems perfect, but the saying is right. There are other fish in the sea and you will find something even better. And someone that won't make you feel insecure. 

And don't have the child to save the marriage. Guys like this don't change. They do feel remorse, but not in the same ways we do. They feel remorse that they got caught. Totally different from feeling remorse for what they actually did.


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## F-102 (Sep 15, 2010)

Even without a cellphone, he will still find ways to be with her-affairs are older than Alexander Graham Bell! And, not to scare you, but do you think he will be truthful in counseling? The guy is a sweet talker, and he will probably work his magic on the counselor the same way he worked it on you and the OW. Just a few sessions, and it will all be about your jealousy and trust issues, and he will be the poor, misunderstood man who gets off scot free while painting himself as the poor, misunderstood victim of your jealousy issues.


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## sacredheart (Sep 14, 2010)

Thanks guys...I went to see a counselor last night on my own..first session...she definitely recommends couples therapy...that if he is willing to do it, then shoot for it...

As far as the weird smells go...can I be paranoid about that? It's on his face...I can smell it when I kiss him....

He may sweet talk the counselor but the counselor is going to see both sides of the story...I think they know how to detect liars..I'm going to call one who specializes in narcissism cause I believe he has an issue what that...He has trust issues from his wife cheating on him so he's not as confident as he portrays...he almost cries everytime he thinks I'm going to leave him...or when he feels I'm "losing my eyes for him".

As far as the OW goes...can you guys give me some insight on how a woman things...like she knows that he's with me...live together, family, etc. what makes a woman look past these things and not care? How can they be so ruthless? Are they just insecure?


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Some are insecure and some are ruthless.

Are you not going to stand up for yourself and tell him that you need HIM to do these actions?


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## sacredheart (Sep 14, 2010)

Turnera - what actions? I'm sorry..my head is a mess right now. He suggested counseling and blocking her number because he doesn't have access to our account. He also gave me his cell phone voice mail password. 

I did block the numbers and am scheduling an appt. for a therapist today. Couples. There is no hope in your eyes huh?


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

I was referring to my previous post, which I say because you are letting him off too easily. I liken it to this analogy: Your boy steals a candy bar, you get home and realize it. You can either say "Bad thing! Don't do it again!" and go on your way, or you can take him back to the store, tell him to tell the owner what he did and make him apologize, and then make him work at the store to pay for the candy bar he stole.

Which of the two ways is likely to teach him to never steal again?

If you don't give him high hoops to jump through, if you don't RESPECT yourself more and show him that you deserve to be respected (by him having to make this up to you and PROVE he's clean), he has no reason to stop cheating. He'll just think, 'huh, nothing really happened; she's so desparate to keep me I can get away with anything; how pathetic.' And be FAR more likely to cheat again. fwiw, of course there is hope. You just have to show him you deserve to be respected and that you EXPECT him to prove himself. So far, all he's done is words. In fact, he's made YOU do all the work. How is that contrition on his part?

Anyway, this was what I was referring to:

turnera:
What you're describing is different from what we are advising. 

Quote:
Originally Posted by sacredheart 
Turnera - he told me that she did text him 3 times over the weekend...was honest about that...said that he decided to delete them immediately because it's not that important and he doesn't want to be in trouble more than he is. 

turnera:
Here is where YOU have to be forceful in what YOU need - not what HE thinks you should be happy with. He thinks you should be happy that he deletes them, and you have to say "NO! In fact, HELL NO! You cheated and I need you to HONOR me by doing what I NEED."


Quote:
I have control over the cell phone account and have the capability to block any numbers on our phones. He told me to go ahead and block her. 

turnera:
Again, this needs to be HIM making the changes to prove to YOU that he cares more about you than himself. Tell him so.


Quote:
I told him to tell her that they can't be friends anymore and he said it wouldn't be necessary because when she doesn't hear from him she won't be expecting an explanation. 

turnera:
Again, you are going about this wrong. You need to tell him that he has to write her a No Contact letter, and YOU need to send it to her. This is for psychological reasons - for him to PROVE to you that he is choosing to stop cheating to HONOR your marriage. If he's unwilling to take these bare minimum steps to save his own marriage, than he is still at least foggy and is not committed to you. Do not accept this.

Tell him you need HIM to take action, it is NOT your job to do it FOR him.


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## sacredheart (Sep 14, 2010)

I hear ya now Turnera..thanks! How do you advise I "show" him that he's not getting over on me anymore? How do I ask him to prove to me that he's done? As far as the letter goes...that won't happen. Is there any other way to do this? He said that he doesn't need to say anything to her like that because it's not like that. 

I just don't know what to do?


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Do you have his passwords to his phone and computer?


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## Mom6547 (Jul 13, 2010)

sacredheart said:


> I hear ya now Turnera..thanks! How do you advise I "show" him that he's not getting over on me anymore? How do I ask him to prove to me that he's done? As far as the letter goes...that won't happen. Is there any other way to do this? He said that he doesn't need to say anything to her like that because it's not like that.
> 
> I just don't know what to do?


Ask yourself WHY that letter won't happen. Then ask yourself why you are staying.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

It won't happen because he's not willing to humble himself for you. Is that the kind of man you want?


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## sacredheart (Sep 14, 2010)

I just feel that the letter is kind of old fashioned and silly to be honest..sorry...is there another way you suggest?

As far as him being humbled...do you think that him willing to go to a therapist is showing that he's wanting to work on himself and humble and get better for us?

The cell phone records are in my name so I have access to those, our computer at home, his voice mail and his facebook page.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

The humility comes from him telling HER to stay away from him. Let him text her with you reading it and hitting send.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Basically, it would be him saying "I love my wife and I want to recommit to my marriage, so we can no longer have any contact with each other." If he's not willing to say that to her, I'd be worried. Cheaters often buy throwaway phones to keep in contact, which their spouse can't track.

Only you know if he's showing enough remorse over hurting you, enough dedication to you two getting more in love, and willingness to be completely honest and open. What do you think?


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## sacredheart (Sep 14, 2010)

Turnera - I did ask him to send a text..funny that you mention that and he said not necessary. That she wasn't expecting any sort of explanation for not hearing from him so he didn't want to cause any unnecessary drama. Should I tell him again? If he doesn't what do you think that means?

When I told him I was going to see someone yesterday he wanted to know what we talked about and then said "I thought you were setting something for us up"?


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

As the betrayed spouse, you have a right to tell him what you need from him. And he has an obligation to honor you.

You ASKED him to do it. He REFUSED. 

And you let him get away with it. You are setting the stage for him to do anything he wants.

I'm not trying to say he's a bad guy. I'm saying you are teaching him how to treat you - like a doormat. Respect yourself enough to say to him "I asked you to send her a text telling her you are focusing on your family and you can no longer talk to her and you REFUSED. I am not happy. If you want me to stay married to you, I NEED you to take steps to prove to me that you are sincere."

Can you say that? Will you?


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

The drama he wants to avoid is for HIM. He is ignoring what YOU need.


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## sacredheart (Sep 14, 2010)

Turnera - you're right...I will ask him to do so again..


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## Mom6547 (Jul 13, 2010)

sacredheart said:


> I just feel that the letter is kind of old fashioned and silly to be honest..sorry...is there another way you suggest?
> 
> As far as him being humbled...do you think that him willing to go to a therapist is showing that he's wanting to work on himself and humble and get better for us?
> 
> The cell phone records are in my name so I have access to those, our computer at home, his voice mail and his facebook page.


Well if it were me, I would be pretty seriously thinking, especially if he balked at therapy at first, he is going to just as much as needed to continue to string you along. But the LAST thing he is going to do is anything conclusive to end his other relationship. The one he is indicating is more important than the one with you.


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## sacredheart (Sep 14, 2010)

vthomeschoolmom - what is indicating that the other woman is more important than me? How can you come to that conclusion? That really hurts and wasn't thinking that at all.


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## sacredheart (Sep 14, 2010)

I've been his girlfriend and love for over 2 years now. Because he has gone off a bit doesn't mean that she's more important than me, right? I mean, if so he would have left me for her, I would think. I don't know. That comment has me all torn up now. What does everyone else think? Is she more important than me?


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## recursive (Nov 2, 2010)

Sacredheart,

No she's not more important than you. The other woman rarely ever is. The only problem is there the OW is replaceable and will be replaced by another one which will be replaced by another one. And basically this is gonna cycle through until it's driven you crazy enough where you feel like actually want to get out. I totally understand where you are right now though. Sometimes you do have to try everything you can so you feel like you gave it a chance before you can decide to move on for you. But i really wish you luck with this. I remember feeling the same way too. So stressed and full of anxiety. Even my skin was breaking out more. Please take care of yourself.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

sacredheart said:


> vthomeschoolmom - what is indicating that the other woman is more important than me? How can you come to that conclusion? That really hurts and wasn't thinking that at all.


 It's more important than his relationship with you because he cares more about what SHE is going to think if he tells her NC - that's why he won't do it.

That, and he thinks he has you wrapped around his finger and you'll never leave no matter what he does or doesn't do.

He doesn't respect you. 

Because you don't respect yourself enough to demand better treatment.


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## sacredheart (Sep 14, 2010)

Turnera - so you do think that he thinks she's more important? I'm traumatized right now...

So how do I have him respect me? I feel like turning around and cheating on him..that'll crush him...he's always so insecure about what I'm doing, who I'm with, when, etc.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

I have no idea who he thinks is more important. I DO know from what you've said that you have ASKED him to do things to REASSURE YOU - as he SHOULD after cheating. 

And he has REFUSED.

That means that he loves himself more than he loves you.

If he loved you more than himself, he would be begging your forgiveness, giving you everything you asked for and more, and then asking you what ELSE he can do to make it up to you. Instead, he is still in 'protect myself' mode - he gives you JUST ENOUGH to shut you up.

You can't make him respect you. But you CAN set your own boundaries - "I will not stay married to a man who will not do what I ask after he has cheated on me." 

If you're not willing to leave him or kick him out, then you have to find other boundaries within that parameter, to protect yourself. "If you won't write her a NO Contact text, then I don't feel comfortable having sex with you, because I believe you are lying to me and still seeing her. And I don't want to get an STD if you're having sex with her."

See the boundary? He doesn't get sex with you if he won't honor your needs.


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## Mom6547 (Jul 13, 2010)

I am not in his head. I know that if I were his WIFE and he were cheating on me, I would feel his affair was more important than me so long as he was unwilling to give it up and get down with getting right with ME.

Start respecting yourself and stop accepting his nonsense. Or nonsense is all you are going to get. Turnera, do I rightly quote you when I say "We teach people how to treat us." Stop teaching him he can treat you like **** and you will be the accomidating, ***** footing little wifey.


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## sacredheart (Sep 14, 2010)

I hear what all of you are saying. I'm feeling a lot stronger today thanks to all of you. 

I want to point out that we are not married. He's still married to his ex that cheated. Divorce not finalized but in process. I guess, that makes this even worse huh? Shouldn't be a problem for me to move on...you'd think?


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Yeah, you would. But you don't have to, if you want him. Just keep repeating "I am just as important as he is. If I don't get what I want, neither should he."


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## changehappens (Sep 14, 2010)

Chris Taylor said:


> If it were one thing, I'd say you were paranoid. But there are several things here that you will ignore at your own peril. If he is a live-in boyfriend, there's no reason to be texting ex's or lipstick on his shirt.
> 
> At a minimum you shouldn't have his child until you are absolutely sure about his fidelity and trust. You aren't and you shouldn't be.


You had sex with him so you implicitly agreed to have children with him. That's a done-deal at this point. The only decision you have to make at this point is to stay with him or leave him. IMO - you should leave and arrange for an adoption. You made a bad mistake in this guy and you should not make an innocent child pay for your mistake - that is; being born into a situation that can't possibly be good given the painting of your life/relationship you have provided here.

Do the right thing - it's really hard - but do it anyway.


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## changehappens (Sep 14, 2010)

Rob774 said:


> Keep the baby, who knows, sometimes that is enough to shock the unresponsible person into action.


I couldn't disagree with you more even if you said you were going to pay me a million bucks to stay quiet! Children are not a lever to be used to manipulate anyone into doing anything! Your advice is totally off the mark! I guarentee that bringing a child into a sick relationship like this one as a means to cause it to heal will do nothing but make life difficult for all involved. Bad idea from the start - don't do it!


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## changehappens (Sep 14, 2010)

sacredheart said:


> I hear what all of you are saying. I'm feeling a lot stronger today thanks to all of you.
> 
> I want to point out that we are not married. He's still married to his ex that cheated. Divorce not finalized but in process. I guess, that makes this even worse huh? Shouldn't be a problem for me to move on...you'd think?


Well - that makes it all that much more easier to do the right thing; you really have no binding committment with him. Trust your gut on this - if he's doing this kind of crap to you after two years into the relationship, it will most likely be a chronic component of anything you have with him down the road. All the signs are there that it's not good now. He's still married! Get a clue!!!!

If you leave, I guarentee he'll do the "I'll change" routine. He'll promise to be good and never do it again and all that stuff - but based on what you've said here, if it was me in your place, I'd run fast in the direction opposite the one he's going and never look back. Anyway, that's my advice based on being around, observing and learning (hopefully something useful) for 54 years. The best to you!

Mike


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## sacredheart (Sep 14, 2010)

Changehappens – Although I appreciate your advice I don’t appreciate being told “get a clue”. You have NO idea as to what I’m going through right now and how messed up my reality has become. I’m a good woman with a good heart who has deserved none of this and is very in love with him. As far as having a “clue” oh I have one. It’s not that EASY to just get a clue and move on. Especially when I have a 16 year old daughter who’s very attached to him involved, we just moved into a beautiful home TWO months ago and the “special circumstances” I’m under. I live paycheck to paycheck and need to save money for a new place (down payment and first month’s rent). I have a lot on my plate right now. I’m sorry that wanting to try counseling and do the right thing made me clueless. 

As far as his divorce goes…it’s being finalized next week. I’m extremely upset right now because I’m the victim here. I thought this website was to provide advice. Not judgment on others for their situation’s and the decisions they make. I think only ONE person has said something more towards the positive side. Everything has been so negative. I mean, is it really doomed to where there’s no hope at all like most of you say? I didn’t realize there were so many pessimist out there….

I’m sorry for being so upset but I think it’s with due cause….Like I said…it’s just NOT THAT EASY!


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

sacredheart, you are hearing pessimistic answers because this is one of the hardest things to overturn. Why? Because YOU have no control over HIM.

All you can do is become the ONE person he chooses. The best first way to do that is to get rid of the affair partner first, so he at least SEES you. THEN you can work on your Plan A and show him what you have to offer.

But even then, he still will make his own choice. All you can control is what YOU do.


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## sacredheart (Sep 14, 2010)

Turnera he knows me. He's been with me for two years. How am I supposed to get rid of the affair partner? I just don't know what to do...


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Did we already talk about you exposing the affair? Did you?


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## changehappens (Sep 14, 2010)

I'm sorry about the "clue" statement; that was not very helpful. I can appreciate the difficulty of your situation. But...

You are the one who made the choice to get involved with a married man, have sex with him, move in to a "beautiful" house, get pregnant, etc. etc. You've known him 2 years which in your mind is a long time, but in the big scheme, is barely long enough to really get to know anyone. And now that your 'really' getting to know the guy you've given your heart, mind and body to, you are also starting to see the writing as the 'real' guy your involved with comes out. 

I don't know, maybe I'm all wrong about this, but it sounds to me like you’re in love with the 'attractive' (your words) guy who comes with a 'beautiful' house and all the stuff you imagined would have to be just so before you committed your whole self to the relationship. And now that it's becoming apparent that the bill of goods does not represent the actual merchandise you received, your thinking that maybe you can fix it and make things be the way you always thought they should be. I could be all washed-up re this, but IMO your head is telling you something different than your gut and your totally conflicted by the disconnect within yourself. Unfortunately, wishing that something can or should be so, does not make it possible - you really can't make a silk purse out of a sows ear (except in rare and unusual cases). 

SO, if you're ready to do battle to change a person into whatever you think they can or should be via whatever methods you choose; bribery, coercion, psycho-manipulation, violence, self-depreciation, logic, whining, crying, whatever - go for it - if that's the life you really want to live. But also, get ready to accept that it's NEVER going to be the way you dreamed it would be (with this guy) because he’s cut from the wrong stone - you will always have that gnawing feeling in your gut that is the manifestation of the distrust that you know in your head is justified.

You can't change anybody except yourself. If you can make the necessary changes and are willing to do that so you can live with the attractive guy in the beautiful house, then I wish you luck. But if it was me, I'd hate to have to go through life hoping that luck will make it good because luck is fickle and only comes to those of us who are..... lucky. Are you?


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## sacredheart (Sep 14, 2010)

Hi Turnera - not really exposed. Just cell records. How do I expose? For free? lol..

Change happens...I'm agreeing with all that you say...I need to get strong...just don't know how...this relationship has me beat down emotionally...no self esteem, confidence, etc.

Afraid to move on cause he's my best friend, etc.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Go to affaircare.com. Read Affaircare and Tanelorn Pete's advice on the steps of finding an affair. It starts with you having evidence. Then you tell him you know he's cheating and ask him to stop. If he refuses, you expose to ONE person he cares about, ask that person to talk to him and ask him to stop. If THAT doesn't shake him up, you then sit down and contact his parents, his siblings, his best friend, and anyone else he cares about. You let them know what he's doing and ask them to talk to him. 

Once he knows that they know, he has to make a decision - stop cheating and return to the marriage, or go for the affair and alienate everyone. In the meantime YOU are addressing any issues he had with you, to become the person he chooses.

Have you done those steps?


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

btw, taking those steps HELPS YOU. It gives you back your pride, your self confidence, and your sense of control.


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## sacredheart (Sep 14, 2010)

Hello everyone - Just want to update on the stickest part of my situation..I miscarried yesterday. Was in the hospital and they confirmed. Yesterday was a very quiet day for me. Not sure how I really feel about it right now...He was very supportive and nurturing. Very sad. Came home immediately to take care of me. He can be so good and loving most of the time. I'm thinking that not being in this delicate situation anymore will give me some clarity/strength.

Turnera - I did speak with his sisters about what was going on. He's the youngest of 3 sisters and I spoke with two. The one doesn't really want to get involved and the other said she's upset cause she knows her brother can be an ass. The maybe he's been so dishonest and full of b/s with himself that he can't be honest with anyone else. That maybe he does feel guilty because he hasn't mentioned anything to them and they're all pretty close. I don't see how telling them these things will help though. I don't know if they want to get involved.

I mean, we're not married. Should they get involved?


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

I'm so sorry for your loss.

IMO, it never hurts to be honest with everyone. People are people. Let them help you.


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## sacredheart (Sep 14, 2010)

Hello everyone - I haven't been on for a bit as I'm going through a major depression. The loss of the baby on top of everything else has me in a downward spiral. I feel like I've hit rock bottom. Nervous breakdown coming on. I know I'm more of a wreck cause my hormones are out of whack...it certainly doesn't help.

I'm here not to just ask advice from those of you who have been in my situation. What have you done to get past the hurt and heart ache/deception/betrayal/feelings of inadequacy, etc.? I can't stop thinking about everything. I was diagnosed with bouts of OCD years ago which I know doesn't help because I'm obsessing about the whole situation. I know it's not normal. What have any of you done to help move past it all?

Also - is there anything that I can do to make him realize what he has at home? Like I feel that my constant nagging and questioning pushed him away. Should I just be happy go lucky, aloof, sexy, perky and maybe this will bring him back around? 

As you can see I'm just looking for positive info right now as I still picture my life without him. I'm such a mess.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Are you in therapy?


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## sacredheart (Sep 14, 2010)

Hi Turnera - for myself or couples?


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

For yourself. What you're describing is probably tied to low self-esteem, or Toxic Shame, which you really can't tackle all by yourself.


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## sacredheart (Sep 14, 2010)

Turnera - yes I started for myself two weeks ago. Won't be able to see her again until December 15th.

I didn't get a response on this from anyone:

Is there anything that I can do to make him realize what he has at home? Like I feel that my constant nagging and questioning pushed him away. Should I just be happy go lucky, aloof, sexy, perky and maybe this will bring him back around? Draw him back? I just want to know if there's anyway to turn the tables back around?


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Well, the Plan A method states that, if you want him back, you have to learn, understand what makes him tick (Emotional Needs). And also learn what he doesn't like (Love Busters). You can get the questionnaires from Marriage Builders or from Affaircare.com; if you can't get him to fill them out, try to fill them out for him. Once you know what he doesn't like (dirty kitchen countertop, messy bathroom, etc.), make sure any time he sees you, he NEVER experiences those LBs. Then, once you know his ENs, find creative ways to be the one person to meet them. If you know he likes one perfume, always wear it around him. If he likes a meal, make it and invite him. Show him what marriage is like in the way he likes.

At the same time, you SHOULD get a life. Let him see you going out and having fun without him (but not dates). Let him worry a little.


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## sacredheart (Sep 14, 2010)

Turnera - I looked up those tools and we'll use them, thank you.

In regards to getting my own life..I just recently started working out again (big deal before I became pregnant) I will start again. As far as going out, I'm sometimes afraid to. Like I feel if I'm out with friends that will just give him time to go and be with her. The only time he has to see this woman is during work hours and shortly there after. He's home with me every evening from 5:30 on and every day of the weekend. I feel like this would give them a chance to go out and have acutal "fun" like a dinner/drinks, get to know each other better and that would be really bad wouldn't it? I feel better when he's in my sight.

Also, when I attempt to go out with my friends his insecurities come out. The "please be good baby" "don't do anything to hurt me" "this is what my wife did when she was out" and then he'll text and call while I'm out. Not alot but here and there.

Do you think all of the above is completely unreasonable? Like I think that having him in my sight is going to stop anything? And me going out is just giving him more time to have "fun" and "get to know" her more which will make him maybe want to leave me more? I don't know...can you tell I'm wacky. Sorry, it's the hormones I think.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

First, you can't control him. That's not a marriage. 

Second, if he's home, and THEN you go run to the mall for an hour, it's a lot less likely he's going to just sneak out and see OW. 

Third, you are changing who you are (seeing your friends) because of his reaction. All that does is reinforce his bad behavior. If you do what you need to do and show him he has nothing to worry about, it will die down.


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## sacredheart (Sep 14, 2010)

Not trying to control him...trying to make sure he doesn't have time to spend with the other woman. I have no problem running out and doing errands. I'm talking about giving him time to go out and have dinner/drinks...get to know her on that level. I'm pasting what I said before below. I've highlighted my main concern with going out, etc.:

In regards to getting my own life..I just recently started working out again (big deal before I became pregnant) I will start again. As far as going out, I'm sometimes afraid to. Like I feel if I'm out with friends that will just give him time to go and be with her. The only time he has to see this woman is during work hours and shortly there after. He's home with me every evening from 5:30 on and every day of the weekend. I feel like this would give them a chance to go out and have acutal "fun" like a dinner/drinks, get to know each other better and that would be really bad wouldn't it? I feel better when he's in my sight.

Do you think all of the above is completely unreasonable? Like I think that having him in my sight is going to stop anything? And me going out is just giving him more time to have "fun" and "get to know" her more which will make him maybe want to leave me more? I don't know...can you tell I'm wacky. Sorry, it's the hormones I think.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

sacredheart said:


> *Not trying to control* him...*trying to make sure* he doesn't have time to spend with the other woman.


Sorry, but that IS an attempt to control what he does.


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## changehappens (Sep 14, 2010)

Wow sacred - it sure sounds like you have a huge mess on your hands. But it also looks to me like a big part of the mess exists because you are perpetuating the situation. Do you REALLY want to try to make a life with a guy who in your heart you know you can't trust. Are you trying to "fix" what you think you see is a diamond in the rough? 

Here's something you can do for yourself and maybe if you write these things down and post them here, it would be a good exercise that might help you proiritize your thoughts as well as help those here who are trying to help you sort things out.

Make a list of all the reasons you want to stay with this guy. Don't include 'feelings' in the list (e.g. don't list 'I'm in love with him'). Try to come up with all the things that are really good about him - the concrete stuff that details his character. Be forward-looking also, like, try to describ where you are going in the relationship if it lasts. 

Then make another list of all the things that are making the relationship bad and/or causing conflict. The things you list should also look towards issues that relate to the character of the man. 

Once you can clairify these things in your mind, it might become more apparent to you which way is the right way to go. People here can tell you all day long what they think you should do, but until you understand in your heart what that way looks like, you'll never be able to make a decision that goes beyond being a doormat and/or accepting the status quo (e.g. not being able to decide until the process is taken out of your hands). 

The mess that your head is in right now needs to find some order if you are going to be able to navigate out of the chaos. Taking the time to write things down in an honest assessment for yourself may be a good way to start the process towards making the decision on your own, without a bunch of annonomous virtual entities like myself giving advice that never quite seems to fit your needs.


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