# What do think makes people cheat



## xakulax (Feb 9, 2014)

What do think makes people cheat I have been thinking about this for a long time wondering why some are willing to sacrifice so much for an empty fling and why there are some who could never do it what makes them different what make them tick. So i'm asking you all a question which I know is loaded but i'm curious and would like your opinion what do you think makes a cheater cheat and a none cheater stay true.


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## Hurtin_Still (Oct 3, 2011)

.....integrity, self-respect, morals, and compassion keeps the non-cheater from stepping out of a relationship.

...the absence of the above .....can enable the cheater.


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## workindad (May 7, 2011)

Extreme selfishness and a sense of entitlement. Unrealistic and immature expectations Those would be my guesses for my xWW's cheating. 

Why didn't I cheat? I made a commitment and took that vow seriously.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Married but Happy (Aug 13, 2013)

They lack something in themselves and/or the relationship which they do not have the skills or motivation to fix.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Nothing "makes" someone cheat. 

It ultimately comes down to a choice.


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## love=pain (Nov 26, 2012)

The sun coming up in the morning, the wind blowing and whatever else you want to write down just bring a lot of paper.
If I had those answers maybe I wouldn't be here or people here would be quoting my book "Why Stupid People Do Stupid Things" the fine art of cheating.


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## Headspin (May 13, 2012)

Clearly they are missing something in their lives that needs to fill the void 

One thing I've learned on here is that a marriage does not need to be bad or great to succumb none are safe

I s'pose the saying the 7 year itch is an interesting point - people get bored, they take the other for granted, that leads to a dilution of romance, of physical interaction. That then make you notice 'outside' people that you would never have noticed before.

The defining point in relationships is that mentally we all deal with these things differently either stronger or weaker and that imo is a huge indication of who will and will not cheat. Many have historical family issues that lead them to insecurity low self esteem and hence the need to be attracted to others and then sadly to act upon it. 

In any marriage there will be temptation / opportunities to stray , it's how you deal with that when it arises that defines the longevity of the marriage 

I can feel a book coming on ....so I'll stop there


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## trey69 (Dec 29, 2010)

I think there are a number of things that can play a role in cheating. 

For my FIL it was entitlement and a general lack of respect for women period. He truly believed he was entitled to have sex with others, while having very little remorse (if any) for his wife's feelings or anyone elses. Selfishness comes to mind.


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## melw74 (Dec 12, 2013)

Well for me its simple, I have good morals, I like to treat people how i would like to be treated.

Having been cheated on by somebody i loved very dearly, and felt pain like i have never felt before, I promised that i would never want to inflict that sort of pain on someone else..... EVER.

I think cheaters are very very selfish people. There is never a reason to do this really, Plain and simple for me. If your not happy with the person your with i just believe that there are many ways to sort your problems without having to resort to this selfish act, why not tell the person your problems, leave and at least let them have some dignity.

The mere thought of my husband in bed with another woman makes me shiver.

I consider myself lucky, I have had many conversations with my husband about cheating, and the outcome if he ever strays.

I love him like i have never loved anyone, but i am not prepared to give second chances no matter what.... Its not for me.

We have a very happy home. My husband is a great man, He loves me and our children very dearly, he takes care of my other children from a previous relationship too.

He knows what the outcome would be if he cheated, No matter what the excuse/ reason could be, there would be no going back for us.

I try my very dam hardest to be the best wife i can be, All i ask is to be treated with the same respect back.


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## Janky (Nov 26, 2013)

These days TV shows tend to glamourize it, like its "no big deal".


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## hawx20 (Jan 10, 2013)

City Slickers is one of my favorite movies ever. One of the guys asks his friend if the hottest woman he has ever seen came down from a spaceship and wanted to have the hottest sex ever with him, and his wife would never find out, would he do it?

He said no because even though his wife would never know, he would, and he couldnt live with himself. Thats basically the way I feel. I wouldnt be able to live with myself knowing I did that to my wife and kids.

Like Mrs Adams said, its selfishness, pure and simple. My wife was a very selfish person. I put my wife and children ahead of myself. Their happiness is my happiness. 

Guess which one of us cheated? Hint: It wasnt me!


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## ThePheonix (Jan 3, 2013)

This tells it like it is whether you like it or not. Applies to women as well.

Merle Haggard "Carolyn" - YouTube


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## Fenix (Jul 2, 2013)

Hurtin_Still said:


> .....integrity, self-respect, morals, and compassion keeps the non-cheater from stepping out of a relationship.
> 
> ...the absence of the above .....can enable the cheater.


At its most basic, yes. The next level up introduces a lot of variation.


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## Gabriel (May 10, 2011)

workindad said:


> Extreme selfishness and a sense of entitlement. Unrealistic and immature expectations Those would be my guesses for my xWW's cheating.
> 
> 
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Yep. Entitlement is the biggest one, IMO. When a spouse thinks they deserve an affair because they aren't getting something at home. 

Immature expectations are also big. They come from stupid TV shows. This is sometimes what breeds the entitlement.


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## owl6118 (Jan 30, 2014)

Not qualified to have an opinion on why people cheat.

I do have some opinions on why some don't cheat. It's often attributed to character, boundaries, fidelity, self-esteem, and so forth. All those are true.

But that might kind of paint a "heroic" picture of the Strong Spouse Standing Firm Against Temptation, Saying 'NO!' You know, looking kinda life those statues of Lenin they had all over the old USSR.










But I don't think aversion to affairs comes entirely from "strength." I think a very underrated quality is really just empathy. 

It may simply be having the capacity to imagine, not just imagine but actually "feel", in advance, a distant pre-echo of the pain you would cause your spouse and also yourself. And feeling that premonition of pain, you follow your natural reflex not to go there.

Empathy is a capacity men don't talk about. But many have it nonetheless.


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## Healer (Jun 5, 2013)

hawx20 said:


> City Slickers is one of my favorite movies ever. One of the guys asks his friend if the hottest woman he has ever seen came down from a spaceship and wanted to have the hottest sex ever with him, and his wife would never find out, would he do it?
> 
> He said no because even though his wife would never know, he would, and he couldnt live with himself. Thats basically the way I feel. I wouldnt be able to live with myself knowing I did that to my wife and kids.
> 
> ...


Man, the anxiety/guilt/stress would eat me alive...I think it takes a special kind of sociopath to willingly deceive/betray the one they're supposed to be committed to, enjoy it and carry on.

It's downright sadistic. I haven't read the entire thread, but has anyone chimed in with the "anyone is capable of cheating given the right circumstances" drivel?


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## xakulax (Feb 9, 2014)

owl6118 said:


> Empathy is a capacity men don't talk about. But many have it nonetheless.



:iagree:


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

*As Melw74 pointed out, it was "morals" that largely kept her in check. I can readily empathize with that, and I can't thank my folks and my family for the moral upbringing that they so lovingly supplied me with!

And as Mrs.JohnAdams has so heartbreakingly responded, "selfishness" was her self-described downfall. Not ever wanting to slam this dear woman for a most painful mistake in her life that she has so mercifully confessed to, sought forgiveness for, and has subsequently backed away from, and still feeling all of the repercusional pain from, only tells me that she, more likely than not, might have been raised in a quite similar manner to me, but because of some window in her marriage where selfishness, at the time, might have represented itself as a more viable option, she experienced firsthand that it can oftentimes override the best of intentions.

And I can only envision how things might have been had I strayed from my skanky XW and enveloped myself into a multiple affair. What would her actions have been? Would she have been hurt to find out about it, more especially if she had invested herself so emotionally and lovingly into our well being? Or would she have just answered "tit-for-tat," and found herself a reciprocal affair to help extricate herself from our marital union? 

We can continue to speculate until the cows come home! But morals largely determines whether one strays or not. And selfishness undoubtedly, is the factor that lays carnage to the trust and the love that a heartfelt marriage is supposed to contain; and not the resultant mistrust and chaos that just one solitary act of selfishness can come to foster!

*


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## ThePheonix (Jan 3, 2013)

workindad said:


> Extreme selfishness and a sense of entitlement.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_





Mrs. John Adams said:


> Selfishness...period...





Gabriel said:


> Yep. Entitlement is the biggest one, IMO. When a spouse thinks they deserve an affair because they aren't getting something at home.


I'll play the devil's advocate a moment. If a BS previously took the position that I will do what I want, ignore and take my spouse for granted, have the "honeymoon is over" attitude, is that selfishness and entitlement?


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## Gabriel (May 10, 2011)

ThePheonix said:


> I'll play the devil's advocate a moment. If a BS previously took the position that I will do what I want, ignore and take my spouse for granted, have the "honeymoon is over" attitude, is that selfishness and entitlement?


No. It's laziness. That person isn't going out and "taking" something he is entitled to. He is just not putting forth effort. 

But I understand where you are going with that.


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## melw74 (Dec 12, 2013)

Healer said:


> Man, the anxiety/guilt/stress would eat me alive...I think it takes a special kind of sociopath to willingly deceive/betray the one they're supposed to be committed to, enjoy it and carry on.
> 
> It's downright sadistic. I haven't read the entire thread, but has anyone chimed in with the "anyone is capable of cheating given the right circumstances" drivel?


Of course anybody is capable of cheating. Its not hard to climb into bed with somebody else.

Its just some of us do not lower ourselves to a cheaters level, I do not think you can get much lower.

A cheater will always condone and think they have good reasons to cheat, and will always try to find excuses for what they did, but at the end of the day it just comes down to the fact that they're just selfish and just thinking of themselves.

Sorry, but that is my opinion...... Like i have said if your not happy get out, and NO i do not think people should stay just for the children, You hear that a lot, but you can be a good parent and not live in the same house.

In fact i know many people that do.


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## ThePheonix (Jan 3, 2013)

Gabriel said:


> No. It's laziness. That person isn't going out and "taking" something he is entitled to. He is just not putting forth effort.
> 
> But I understand where you are going with that.


Do some BS's feel "entitled", that once married, their wants and needs take precedence over their spouse's. Or, does that only apply to the WS who should just "suck it up" and deal with in a manner more consistent with the BS's expectations.


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## michzz (Jun 6, 2008)

ThePheonix said:


> Do some BS's feel "entitled", that once married, their wants and needs take precedence over their spouse's. Or, does that only apply to the WS who should just "suck it up" and deal with in a manner more consistent with the BS's expectations.


It's not an either or situation.

A WS always has a choice to not cheat. Just fix the marriage or walk away from it.

A BS, of course, has a choice to not act badly short of cheating, no argument there.

However, when someone goes off and has an affair they introduce risk of STDs, theft of time and resources, and disdain for their spouse into the relationship.

Being willing to do that? Says a lot about a person.


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## Healer (Jun 5, 2013)

ThePheonix said:


> Do some BS's feel "entitled", that once married, their wants and needs take precedence over their spouse's. Or, does that only apply to the WS who should just "suck it up" and deal with in a manner more consistent with the BS's expectations.


Oh, the WS's certainly do "suck it up", don't they? Sadly, just not with their spouse.

You are passively aggressively asserting that BS's get what's coming to them. Sell it somewhere else.


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## jorgegene (May 26, 2012)

In my case, I was cheated on twice in long term relationships.

Both cases were similar, although two entirely different personalities.

My first long term, she called herself 'damaged goods'. her father told her she was ugly and would never find a good man. (she was absolutely beautiful by the way). Her long term husband before me was an extreme narcissist abused her physically and emotionally and also told her she was ugly and fat. Before she met me, she would troll for men, make out with them and then when things got hot and heavy she would dissapear.

She needed validation in the extreme. For a long while I was able to validate her. I treated her like a queen. told her she was beautiful often, but she wouldn't believe me. She needed more validation than i could give her. So after a few years, she went back to her trolling ways and cheated on me. I didn't find out for a year.

In the second case I was married to a BPD. She also had a bad upbringing which included a narcisist father and husband and was also sexually abused, and consequently had a HUGE sexual hangup.
But she was manipulative to the extreme and she got her jolly's by flirting and manipulating guys online. I caught her twice deanuts emotional affairs online which ended it all.

So my stories are annecdotal, but the lessons I've learned are be very wary of women damaged by selfish narcisists. It is very very damaging. It's a huge uphill battle. 
Find a woman who was brought up in a good loving environment. That's not always true, I'm sure, there are really good women who've overcome the odds. But the odds will be much greater in your favor with a healthy woman.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

ThePheonix said:


> Do some BS's feel "entitled", that once married, their wants and needs take precedence over their spouse's. Or, does that only apply to the WS who should just "suck it up" and deal with in a manner more consistent with the BS's expectations.


*Entitlement when they're not getting their perceived needs met at home.

Selfishness when they have the burning desire to hook up with someone, either directly or indirectly, to experiment emotionally with to end up seeing if that sexually tingly feeling is just as good, or perhaps even better than with their spouse.

Laziness when they refuse to do anything to save their married relationship, taking on the persona that it's far easier to deceitfully cheat with someone and stay quiet about it, much rather than to try to repair their relationship and stay true to their marital vows!*


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## jorgegene (May 26, 2012)

No matter how much they loved you, they can't help themsleves


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## Fenix (Jul 2, 2013)

Entitlement goes a bit further than not getting needs met at home. In fact, often, that doesn't even play into it. I see it as when someone is successful enough that they feel they deserve the trappings of such success, which in many societies involve women.


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## russell28 (Apr 17, 2013)

They want to.


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## Gabriel (May 10, 2011)

ThePheonix said:


> Do some BS's feel "entitled", that once married, their wants and needs take precedence over their spouse's. Or, does that only apply to the WS who should just "suck it up" and deal with in a manner more consistent with the BS's expectations.


The STBWS can tell the STBBS that they will leave the marriage if things don't change. Or they can just leave the marriage outright. 

Cheating is saying, "hey, I deserve X, but I don't have the balls to leave the marriage".

The BS is entitled to his/her spouse's faithfulness, no matter what. They are not entitled to lay around and not work on the marriage. But if they do decide to not work on the marriage, the consequence should be the end of the marriage, not a cheating spouse.


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## ThePheonix (Jan 3, 2013)

The reality Gab, is that everybody and even most, are initially not just going to throw the baby out with the bath water and leave the marriage. Many will simply take what they believe is the less rocky road of finding someone to fill in the gaps, hoping nobody is the wiser to what's going on. Getting caught is not part of their plan. 

I view it a little more liberally than the gang that put complete responsibility for the affair on the cheating spouse, although I agree the WS is responsible for the action taken. An example would be what I say in my profile. If someone purposely hurts my dogs, I will hurt them. It is my responsibility for the action I take. Nevertheless, it is their responsibility not to put themselves in a position that will cause me to take action. (The good news for me is that Georgia is a "Castle Law" state.


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## Healer (Jun 5, 2013)

ThePheonix said:


> The reality Gab, is that everybody and even most, are initially not just going to throw the baby out with the bath water and leave the marriage. Many will simply take what they believe is the less rocky road of finding someone to fill in the gaps, hoping nobody is the wiser to what's going on. Getting caught is not part of their plan.
> 
> I view it a little more liberally than the gang that put complete responsibility for the affair on the cheating spouse, although I agree the WS is responsible for the action taken. An example would be what I say in my profile. If someone purposely hurts my dogs, I will hurt them. It is my responsibility for the action I take. Nevertheless, it is their responsibility not to put themselves in a position that will cause me to take action. (The good news for me is that Georgia is a "Castle Law" state.


I've read some asinine analogies on this here forum, but you just got the Gold. Congratulations!


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## Gabriel (May 10, 2011)

Yeah, I'm not buying that analogy either. 

Let me repeat slowly. There. Is. No. Reason. To. Cheat.

But,

There. Are. Reasons. To. Leave. A. Marriage.


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## Gonnabealright (Oct 24, 2013)

arbitrator said:


> *Entitlement when they're not getting their perceived needs met at home.
> 
> Selfishness when they have the burning desire to hook up with someone, either directly or indirectly, to experiment emotionally with to end up seeing if that sexually tingly feeling is just as good, or perhaps even better than with their spouse.
> 
> Laziness when they refuse to do anything to save their married relationship, taking on the persona that it's far easier to deceitfully cheat with someone and stay quiet about it, much rather than to try to repair their relationship and stay true to their marital vows!*


I liked this so much I copied it to fb after explaining the context. I mentioned no ones name or even the website. I think you totally nailed it.


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## Gonnabealright (Oct 24, 2013)

ThePheonix said:


> The reality Gab, is that everybody and even most, are initially not just going to throw the baby out with the bath water and leave the marriage. Many will simply take what they believe is the less rocky road of finding someone to fill in the gaps, hoping nobody is the wiser to what's going on. Getting caught is not part of their plan.
> 
> I view it a little more liberally than the gang that put complete responsibility for the affair on the cheating spouse, although I agree the WS is responsible for the action taken. An example would be what I say in my profile. If someone purposely hurts my dogs, I will hurt them. It is my responsibility for the action I take. Nevertheless, it is their responsibility not to put themselves in a position that will cause me to take action. (The good news for me is that Georgia is a "Castle Law" state.


Really??? So you must be assuming the the ws must have not been getting something they wanted or needed and it was the bs fault they weren't getting it. 

That is the biggest lie you have decieved yourself with. Read some more threads here, some of the cheaters were getting everything they needed and still cheated. 
Cheating happens and no one is safe from it, no matter what they do or didn't do. It is never acceptable to cheat on your spouse.


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## MSP (Feb 9, 2012)

I believe that all poor choices are an inappropriate response to pain. 

Even being a spoiled brat is a kind of pain, although from the outside it doesn't appear that way. But inside, you're lacking an ability to deal with difficulty in a disciplined way and eventually that backfires.


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## ThePheonix (Jan 3, 2013)

Healer said:


> I've read some asinine analogies on this here forum, but you just got the Gold. Congratulations!


Thanks H. I've got a couple more I'll try at a later date.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

As a work colleague said when asked why he'd cheated on his wife: "I only wish I knew."

Distorted thinking can help lead to cheating. Thinking distorted by mental illness, drugs, alcohol, for example.


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## ThePheonix (Jan 3, 2013)

Gonnabealright said:


> That is the biggest lie you have decieved yourself with. Read some more threads here, some of the cheaters were getting everything they needed and still cheated.
> Cheating happens and no one is safe from it, no matter what they do or didn't do. It is never acceptable to cheat on your spouse.


So your thesis is that a cheater is going to cheat regardless of the environment?


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## ThePheonix (Jan 3, 2013)

MattMatt said:


> As a work colleague said when asked why he'd cheated on his wife: "I only wish I knew."


MM, this guy is simply not being honest with himself. He is deceiving himself to avoid facing the reality, probably along the lines that he needs to prove to himself he's got it and the only way he feels like a cattle barron is when he's in the saddle. People are not on a quest for truth. They are on a quest for happiness and cling to whatever scenario justifies their choices and reflects them in a favorable light.


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## Healer (Jun 5, 2013)

ThePheonix said:


> Thanks H. I've got a couple more I'll try at a later date.


Our collective breath is bated.


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## jorgegene (May 26, 2012)

We can continue to speculate until the cows come home! But morals largely determines whether one strays or not. And selfishness undoubtedly, is the factor that lays carnage to the trust and the love that a heartfelt marriage is supposed to contain; and not the resultant mistrust and chaos that just one solitary act of selfishness can come to foster!

[/COLOR][/B][/QUOTE]


I confronted my long term gf about cheating on me. I had to pull it out of her. She could tell I was devastated. I asked her 'how was it?' She said 'It was ok' Her mood turned dark and angry. She looked at me and said angrily "It's because of your Catholic upbringing!" At that point I hung my head and she walked out on me.


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## Gonnabealright (Oct 24, 2013)

ThePheonix said:


> So your thesis is that a cheater is going to cheat regardless of the environment?


Yes, that is exactly what I mean. It is a gamble even in the most secure relationship and enviroment. Cheating just happens and I believe there is nothing that justifies doing it. Cheaters will always have a justification to cheat, it never makes it acceptable even though the bs might be convinced by the ws that it was the bs's fault and taking on the responsibility of the affair. 

Many of us put our blinders on because we can't bear the idea of losing the marriage. To me and a lot of others here on TAM we have realized through reading what others suggest and have done is that as a bs if you take on the guilt, shame and acknowledgement of the affair as being your fault for not giving the ws (cheater) what they needed, your then your are not only dealing with just the betrayal of the affair but your also taking on the unwarranted feelings of inadequacies and self demoralization that is in my opionion completely unnecessary. 

Cheating on your spouse is never acceptable.


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## movfrwd (Jan 17, 2014)

I have been pouring over this site for the last few months, reading lots of marriage books, and info from marriage websites. Based on this and my experience with WS there are several reasons IMO:

1) everyone in susceptible/capable of cheating 
2) the majority of people will act on it given the right environment
3) imprinted experiences(childhood) will cause some to act others to not
4) everyone always justifies their actions - justify why you won't cheat or why you did it's how people live with themselves
5) cheating is a self destructive behavior and a sign that the cheater is unhappy with their marriage and subconsciously want it to end they are looking for a way out

The main thing to decide before condemning someone is how chronic is it, can you deal with it, do you want to reconcile. It is 100% a choice of the WS. However 100% of the time if 2 people in a relationship and are 100% satisfied with their spouse and the relationship cheating doesn't happen.

We are all human and we all make mistakes. The question is how do you deal with the mistakes and better yourself.


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## ironman (Feb 6, 2013)

Entitlement and selfishness are certainly two common reasons .. but here's one I didn't see mentioned (maybe it was) ...

... the cheater has little to no fear of losing the relationship they are currently in. That's a tough one, but a lot of times it is true.

In other words, they are not afraid to make an attempt at a perceived "trade up" in their relationship.

PS: Suppose you could classify this as selfishness.


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## ThePheonix (Jan 3, 2013)

Gonnabealright said:


> Cheaters will always have a justification to cheat
> 
> the affair as being your fault for not giving the ws (cheater) what they needed,


People justify every decision they make; both good and bad. The "heart" goes after what it wants and tells the brain to justify it. 

My position is not that cheating is ok, or its the BS's fault per se. My position is, that for what ever reason, the cheating happens after romantic interest is lost or significantly lowered. (I realize not a 100% of all cases but typically; you know the ole, "ILYBINILWY" speech) I have yet to see a post or hear of a situation where the spouse said they are crazy in love with their mate, have the utmost respect for them but just had to cheat anyway.
Therefore, I conclude that although the act of cheating on the back of the cheater, the actions of the BS could have contributed to lowering this romantic interest. Case in point being a alpha vs beta male. How many here argue that beta's get cheated on more than alphas. Hence, is the argument not that the actions of the beta male contributes to the lowering of romantic interest, loss of respect, etc., resulting in a demise of the marriage and/or cheating.


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## ironman (Feb 6, 2013)

ThePheonix said:


> Case in point being a alpha vs beta male. How many here argue that beta's get cheated on more than alphas. Hence, is the argument not that the actions of the beta male contributes to the lowering of romantic interest, loss of respect, etc., resulting in a demise of the marriage and/or cheating.


I think sometimes it doesn't matter. For example, a wife who is happy with her marriage may encounter a guy whom she perceives is several notches higher up in the attractiveness scale and finds that he is suddenly pursuing her adamantly. She may give it a "go" if she feels she won't get caught ... her husband's alpha/beta-ness would be irrelevant in that case.

As to your question, beta behavior can certainly lead to a decline in a spouse's perception of your attractiveness. So I would say it's a factor .. certainly not the only one though. Overall, I'd say beta-dudes get the short-end of the relationship stick more often .. but it can happen to anyone.


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## Healer (Jun 5, 2013)

movfrwd said:


> 1) everyone in susceptible/capable of cheating


Incorrect.


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## Healer (Jun 5, 2013)

ironman said:


> Entitlement and selfishness are certainly two common reasons .. but here's one I didn't see mentioned (maybe it was) ...
> 
> ... the cheater has little to no fear of losing the relationship they are currently in. That's a tough one, but a lot of times it is true.
> 
> ...


My stbxww thought she had found her "soul mate" in the posom, and that it was "fate". Of course she's an idiot, and he's a total ********* player who nails anything that moves, and he dropped her like a hot potato and now they loathe each other. And she wants her old life back. (LOL).

It's almost comical.


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## Pepper123 (Nov 27, 2012)

I would like to also add cowardliness to the equation...


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## Gonnabealright (Oct 24, 2013)

ThePheonix said:


> People justify every decision they make; both good and bad. The "heart" goes after what it wants and tells the brain to justify it.
> 
> My position is not that cheating is ok, or its the BS's fault per se. My position is, that for what ever reason, the cheating happens after romantic interest is lost or significantly lowered. (I realize not a 100% of all cases but typically; you know the ole, "ILYBINILWY" speech) I have yet to see a post or hear of a situation where the spouse said they are crazy in love with their mate, have the utmost respect for them but just had to cheat anyway.
> Therefore, I conclude that although the act of cheating on the back of the cheater, the actions of the BS could have contributed to lowering this romantic interest. Case in point being a alpha vs beta male. How many here argue that beta's get cheated on more than alphas. Hence, is the argument not that the actions of the beta male contributes to the lowering of romantic interest, loss of respect, etc., resulting in a demise of the marriage and/or cheating.


Even if you are a "alpha" or if your male or female, you still have the same risk of being cheated on by your spouse regardless of the couples perception of being happy. 

Cheaters are cowards and selfish and if you want to call that being an alpha or beta, go ahead. 

I don't believe that if your an alpha your spouse won't cheat on you. If you cheat on me, watch how fast I can cut you out my life.


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## DeterminedToThrive (Nov 2, 2013)

Mrs. John Adams said:


> Selfishness...period...


:iagree:


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## russell28 (Apr 17, 2013)

Gonnabealright said:


> Even if you are a "alpha" or if your male or female, you still have the same risk of being cheated on by your spouse regardless of the couples perception of being happy.
> 
> Cheaters are cowards and selfish and if you want to call that being an alpha or beta, go ahead.
> 
> I don't believe that if your an alpha your spouse won't cheat on you. If you cheat on me, watch how fast I can cut you out my life.


The Alpha thing is a crock of bull.. Hillary is Alpha, and Bill still cheated on her...


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## roostr (Oct 20, 2012)

Id sum it up as selfishness and attention.


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## Fenix (Jul 2, 2013)

This says it nicely.
http://chumplady.com/2012/06/untangling-the-skein-of-****upedness/


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## Gonnabealright (Oct 24, 2013)

Fenix said:


> This says it nicely.
> http://chumplady.com/2012/06/untangling-the-skein-of-****upedness/


Id like to read this but the link is broke. Can you copy and paste it please.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

xakulax said:


> What do think makes people cheat I have been thinking about this for a long time wondering why some are willing to sacrifice so much for an empty fling and why there are some who could never do it what makes them different what make them tick. So i'm asking you all a question which I know is loaded but i'm curious and would like your opinion what do you think makes a cheater cheat and a none cheater stay true.


I was a non-cheater. Until I wasn't.


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## SF-FAN (Sep 24, 2013)

My WW told me she knows she's not going to end up with the OM. Which I then replied to by saying "why the f*ck cheat then?!" She didn't have an answer.


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## Pepper123 (Nov 27, 2012)

This may come across as a simplistic answer, but in some cases I think people that are situationally vulnerable are tempted by the thought of doing some wrong, immoral, dangerous. Wrap in emotions and physiological responses and it can become the perfect storm. 

People that are attracted to dangerous situations usually exhibit selfishness as well. Furthermore this certain "draw" can also be exacerbated by poor boundaries, etc.


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## cj9947 (Jul 9, 2011)

In one word...SELFISHNESS...


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

There's also evidence that some victims of sexual assault, including or perhaps especially when a child, can nudge some people toward cheating. Not all, but some.


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## HarryDoyle (Jan 19, 2013)

*What do you think makes people cheat*

Apparently me 




At least that's what was inferred at the time.


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## Gonnabealright (Oct 24, 2013)

HarryDoyle said:


> *What do you think makes people cheat*
> 
> Apparently me
> 
> ...


Blame shifting....THERE IS NO EXCUSE FOR CHEATING. I really hope you don't believe that. Keep reading if you do. You have some two hundred posts so maybe your joking??? Just in case:

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/32002-welcome-tam-cwi-newbies-please-read.html


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## HarryDoyle (Jan 19, 2013)

Gonnabealright said:


> Blame shifting....THERE IS NO EXCUSE FOR CHEATING. I really hope you don't believe that. Keep reading if you do. You have some two hundred posts so maybe your joking??? Just in case:
> 
> http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/32002-welcome-tam-cwi-newbies-please-read.html


Sorry, I was being sarcastic, couldn't help myself. I meant to hit the  button. The question posed by the op is *the question*. Why did my spouse cheat. That's it. It's what I've spent over a year figuring out. It's why I came to this forum, to find out the answers to that question. It's why I've read about fifty books on infidelity. It's why I've read about 5,000 web articles and about 20,000 posts here. It's why I've spent countless hours in MC. It's been 15 months since d-day and I'm pretty sure I have MY answers. Unfortunately this is such a complex issue that there is no set reason why people cheat, it all depends on so many different variables. But there is one thing that most BS' s have in common, it usually starts out as "their fault". When I first asked my WW why she did what she did, it all revolved around me. And from what I've learned, that is a common response from the WS, we made them cheat, somehow. So until you can get your WS out of their fog and past their blame shifting, you'll never get an answer. There are no easy answers to why people cheat.


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## sidney2718 (Nov 2, 2013)

SF-FAN said:


> My WW told me she knows she's not going to end up with the OM. Which I then replied to by saying "why the f*ck cheat then?!" She didn't have an answer.


You mean she didn't have an answer that she was willing to share with you. Perhaps the OM gave her attention, caresses, his attention when she went on about things in her life, and generally acted as if he was thrilled to be with her?


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## sidney2718 (Nov 2, 2013)

Gonnabealright said:


> Blame shifting....THERE IS NO EXCUSE FOR CHEATING. I really hope you don't believe that. Keep reading if you do. You have some two hundred posts so maybe your joking??? Just in case:
> 
> http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/32002-welcome-tam-cwi-newbies-please-read.html


Of course there are excuses for cheating. There just aren't any that the betrayed spouse will accept.


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## sidney2718 (Nov 2, 2013)

HarryDoyle said:


> Sorry, I was being sarcastic, couldn't help myself. I meant to hit the  button. The question posed by the op is *the question*. Why did my spouse cheat. That's it. It's what I've spent over a year figuring out. It's why I came to this forum, to find out the answers to that question. It's why I've read about fifty books on infidelity. It's why I've read about 5,000 web articles and about 20,000 posts here. It's why I've spent countless hours in MC. It's been 15 months since d-day and I'm pretty sure I have MY answers. Unfortunately this is such a complex issue that there is no set reason why people cheat, it all depends on so many different variables. But there is one thing that most BS' s have in common, it usually starts out as "their fault". When I first asked my WW why she did what she did, it all revolved around me. And from what I've learned, that is a common response from the WS, we made them cheat, somehow. So until you can get your WS out of their fog and past their blame shifting, you'll never get an answer. There are no easy answers to why people cheat.


Excellent post. I'd think that the blaming by the victimized spouse is an example of lack of communication on basic issues. Those are often issues that the other spouse does not "get" or think important.

Being an older guy (no, seriously, older than that) I've had a number of women talk to me about their lives. One very common complaint is that they don't get to talk to their spouses very much. Many women seem to need to unwind by relating the events of the day. And no, they don't usually want advice, they only want to vent.

When I was young, back in the early stone age, whenever a woman I was interested in started to talk about what happened to her friend Shirley and how she handled it, I'd get obviously bored. I finally learned that that was a wrong move. My young lady needed to have a male friend that she could talk to. Sadly, she was long gone by the time I figured it out.

There are other forms of lack of communication as well. In fact as any reader of this forum will know, those reconciling usually say that they are now communicating with their spouses far better than before.

Of course communication isn't the only problem. There are, as Harry Doyle says, many others as well. But we'll never hear them if all we say to a WS posting here is "shut up".


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

Pepper123 said:


> This may come across as a simplistic answer, but in some cases I think people that are situationally vulnerable are tempted by the thought of doing some wrong, immoral, dangerous. Wrap in emotions and physiological responses and it can become the perfect storm.
> 
> People that are attracted to dangerous situations usually exhibit selfishness as well. Furthermore this certain "draw" can also be exacerbated by poor boundaries, etc.


Or doing something for yourself? :scratchhead:

I had been cheated on and f**ked over by two previous girlfriends and now by my wife.

So, I think I wanted 'something' with someone who hadn't cheated on me or f**ked me over.

And I decided to do this by cheating on my wife,with an EA that nearly went PA.

Yes. I realise that this was a entirely wrong response, but I wasn't thinking properly.


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## CuddleBug (Nov 26, 2012)

xakulax said:


> What do think makes people cheat I have been thinking about this for a long time wondering why some are willing to sacrifice so much for an empty fling and why there are some who could never do it what makes them different what make them tick. So i'm asking you all a question which I know is loaded but i'm curious and would like your opinion what do you think makes a cheater cheat and a none cheater stay true.



"If I was going to cheat", it would be because my wifee never got over her LD and didn't get in shape. I meet a hot woman, she wants a friendship with crazy sex all the time but no serious relationship. That would be the ultimate temptation for me. Funny thing is, there are many women out there like that. I wouldn't cheat to hurt my wifee. It would be a sexual release that I was never getting in the first place and that most women do take care of themselves, can wear sexy seductive outfits and do fun things in the bedroom.


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## Machiavelli (Feb 25, 2012)

russell28 said:


> The Alpha thing is a crock of bull.. Hillary is Alpha, and Bill still cheated on her...


Yes, Hillary is an Alpha male:


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## EI (Jun 12, 2012)

sidney2718 said:


> There are other forms of lack of communication as well. In fact as any reader of this forum will know, those reconciling usually say that they are now communicating with their spouses far better than before.
> 
> Of course communication isn't the only problem. There are, as Harry Doyle says, many others as well. But we'll never hear them if all we say to a WS posting here is "shut up".


:iagree:

I'd, also, like to add that when a BS asks "why," and a WS responds with their reasons, the WS is told that their reasons are excuses, rationalizations, and justifications. Obviously, that's true. And, while there are no "acceptable" reasons for infidelity, there are still always reasons. If the BS and the WS, both, wish to attempt to reconcile, then the BS is going to need to decide whether or not there is any truth in those "reasons," over and above their WS simply being selfish, immoral, having a sense of entitlement, and generally being flawed. Because, if there is not, then I don't understand the BS's "reasons" for attempting to reconcile. Of course this only applies in those situations where a reconciliation is attempted.


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## xakulax (Feb 9, 2014)

CuddleBug said:


> "If I was going to cheat", it would be because my *wifee never got over her LD and didn't get in shape. *I meet a hot woman, she wants a friendship with crazy sex all the time but no serious relationship. That would be the ultimate temptation for me. Funny thing is, there are many women out there like that. I wouldn't cheat to hurt my wifee. It would be a sexual release that I was never getting in the first place and that most women do take care of themselves, can wear sexy seductive outfits and do fun things in the bedroom.



A common scenario in most marriages where one spouse take the sex and there spouse for granted forcing the other to seek satisfaction else where. If there is one thing I have learned it's never take your SO for granted because there always competition sniffing for chance.


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## CuddleBug (Nov 26, 2012)

xakulax said:


> A common scenario in most marriages where one spouse take the sex and there spouse for granted forcing the other to seek satisfaction else where. If there is one thing I have learned it's never take your SO for granted because there always competition sniffing for chance.



Exactly.:smthumbup::smthumbup:


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## xakulax (Feb 9, 2014)

sidney2718 said:


> But we'll never hear them if all we say to a WS posting here is "shut up".



I think the reason why is because some WS not all but some who post here tend to be knee deep in the fog and rationalize their action with superficial reasons.


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## vellocet (Oct 18, 2013)

> What do think makes people cheat


Lousy character.

For a small handful of them, only on a temporary basis while the cheating is going on however.(speaking of those who snapped out of it and worked on themselves and their marriage)

For others, lousy character period.


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## totallyunexpected (Nov 21, 2012)

I agree with most of the posts, but l'd like to add that life is NOT black and white. There DO exist certain situations in which I personally do not condemn cheating. One example: A woman/man is physically and emotionally abused. The person is scared for their life to exit the relationship but at the same time their needs are not being met. 

I certainly wouldn't condemn cheating in this case. Most people in abusive relationships do not know how to get out. I wouldn't blame them for seeking emotional/physical help from another.

There are a few other cases where I'm not sure what is right or wrong. For example, what about a man/woman who has a wonderful relationship with their spouse except for in the sexual sphere. Say that this person has tried speaking with their partner, counseling, and everything under the sun. He/she still wants to be married and is in love and fulfills his/her partner in all other ways. But the partner refuses to fulfill his/her sexual needs. I think that is a complicated situation, and I don't think that it is comparable to many other incidents of cheating. There are many levels of neglect and abuse that I think should be taken into account. 

Of course, people tend to think they can keep their straying a secret. But people are sloppy and partners have solid intuition (at least females do!)

Thus, I think in our haste to tell potential waywards to EXIT the marriage first, we simplify the situations. 

Then again, it's easy for me to say some cheating is excusable even if it is still a wrong action:

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping...ought-id-cheat-my-husband-who-cheated-me.html

I do think the reasons outlined by others are accurate:
1. Selfishness and lack of empathy
2. Sense of entitlement
3. Cowardice
4. Insecurities, complicate issues (e.g. previous abuse)
5. being in the "right situation" at the "right time" (e.g. when resentful and alone) contributes (though I believe the morally strong are prepared for these moments)
6. Resent in a marriage
7. Less than sound moral upbringing... vicious cycles
8. Poor communication skills
9. Being around other people who condone cheating
10. Patterns of lying and deceit

Oh those are just a few...

All in all, inadequacies on the part of wayward spouses are the chief causes of infidelity. Happy and mentally/emotionally healthy people don't usually cheat. Or so I think...


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## vellocet (Oct 18, 2013)

totallyunexpected said:


> I agree with most of the posts, but l'd like to add that life is NOT black and white. There DO exist certain situations in which I personally do not condemn cheating. One example: A woman/man is physically and emotionally abused. The person is scared for their life to exit the relationship but at the same time their needs are not being met.


I still condemn it, but no more than the physical and emotional abuse.




> There are a few other cases where I'm not sure what is right or wrong. For example, what about a man/woman who has a wonderful relationship with their spouse except for in the sexual sphere. Say that this person has tried speaking with their partner, counseling, and everything under the sun. He/she still wants to be married and is in love and fulfills his/her partner in all other ways. But the partner refuses to fulfill his/her sexual needs. I think that is a complicated situation, and I don't think that it is comparable to many other incidents of cheating. There are many levels of neglect and abuse that I think should be taken into account.


No, it shouldn't. If they aren't getting all their little needs met and think its an excuse to cheat, then they should be finding a more compatible mate and divorce.




> Thus, I think in our haste to tell potential waywards to EXIT the marriage first, we simplify the situations.


No haste about it. If they think they have valid excuses to cheat, then they aren't suited for marriage. I would not tell a wayward to exit the marriage if they are remorseful and commit to stop cheating and never do it again.
But then you have the ones that blame their spouse for their decision to cheat. Those people don't need to be married.

They need to fix their sh*t, own their sh*t, or get out.


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## KeepingUpAppearances (Jul 14, 2013)

They chose to cheat for individual reasons. Most characteristics they share are Greedy, Selfish with no conscience.


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## Squeakr (May 1, 2013)

totallyunexpected said:


> I agree with most of the posts, but l'd like to add that life is NOT black and white. There DO exist certain situations in which I personally do not condemn cheating. One example: A woman/man is physically and emotionally abused. The person is scared for their life to exit the relationship but at the same time their needs are not being met.
> 
> I certainly wouldn't condemn cheating in this case. Most people in abusive relationships do not know how to get out. I wouldn't blame them for seeking emotional/physical help from another.


I don't follow your thought process here. They live in such fear from abuse that they fear the potential/ possible after effects from exiting the marriage, yet they are going to do something that would cause the abuse to escalate when it is discovered? Isn't that basically just adding fuel to the already blazing fire?? Seems to me if they are strong enough to seek an A, then they are strong enough to seek and exit from the M (and their reasoning the A in this way is justification only).


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## totallyunexpected (Nov 21, 2012)

Squeakr said:


> I don't follow your thought process here. They live in such fear from abuse that they fear the potential/ possible after effects from exiting the marriage, yet they are going to do something that would cause the abuse to escalate when it is discovered? Isn't that basically just adding fuel to the already blazing fire?? Seems to me if they are strong enough to seek an A, then they are strong enough to seek and exit from the M (and their reasoning the A in this way is justification only).



Well, my reasoning is based on the assumption that most people cheat with the intention to keep it secret. I would assume that the victim of abuse does not believe their secret "relief" would be found out. Leaving on the other hand is obvious and you can't hide it. I like to think this is a rarity, of course.

And let me add that whatever I say, I don't pretend to be right. I'm just throwing out some thoughts in order to expand our conversation. 

If all people started cheating with the assumption that they would be found out, the whole equation would change. I've learned that human intuition is damn good and it is silly to believe cheating can be kept under wraps. Perhaps a ONS but even that is not as easy to hide as it sounds.

Either way, cheating as an independent act is wrong. My level of understanding regarding a cheater is going to vary based on the circumstances even while I never would condone it. Does that make sense?


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

Other people standing around for them to cheat with.


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## vellocet (Oct 18, 2013)

totallyunexpected said:


> Either way, cheating as an independent act is wrong. My level of understanding regarding a cheater is going to vary based on the circumstances even while I never would condone it. Does that make sense?


Makes sense for you if you want to subscribe to that idea.

For me, no. Let me give you a scenario.

Out with the guys, and lets say the discussion turns to a man or woman suffering emotional abuse from the other. I'd be saying that the perceived damaged party needs to dump the "abuser" on their ass.

Then we find out in the conversation that, even after the fact, that the so-called damaged party went out and F'd someone else. I'd be like, "ok, my sympathy just left for him/her".

Just like a cheater tries to use their "victim's" behavior as an excuse to cheat, who is to say that the person that yells and calls names didn't do so because their partner, who supposedly cheated BECAUSE of the emotional abuse, was untrustworthy all along. Which came first, the chicken or the egg? The question won't ever get answered honestly if you ask either of them.

But to me, you suffer emotional abuse, physical, whatever, then get the hell out of there. You cheat as a response to it, you lost my respect. And as one other person basically said, not a real smart idea to add fuel to the fire by cheating.


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## Healer (Jun 5, 2013)

Squeakr said:


> I don't follow your thought process here. They live in such fear from abuse that they fear the potential/ possible after effects from exiting the marriage, yet they are going to do something that would cause the abuse to escalate when it is discovered? Isn't that basically just adding fuel to the already blazing fire?? Seems to me if they are strong enough to seek an A, then they are strong enough to seek and exit from the M (and their reasoning the A in this way is justification only).


Ohhhhh - nice debunk there, my friend.


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## Healer (Jun 5, 2013)

sidney2718 said:


> Of course there are excuses for cheating. There just aren't any that the betrayed spouse will accept.


I thought old people were supposed to be wise.


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## xakulax (Feb 9, 2014)

oh lord I just realize I forgot the you in what do you think makes people cheat :scratchhead:


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## Gonnabealright (Oct 24, 2013)

> Originally Posted by sidney2718 View Post
> Of course there are excuses for cheating. There just aren't any that the betrayed spouse will accept.





Healer said:


> I thought old people were supposed to be wise.


I get the play on words. It was meant as humor, I think. It just wasn't funny.


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