# how to get comfortable with ex's dating...



## grays (Jun 24, 2014)

My ex and I are in a strange situation. We've been officially split for about six weeks now after 25 years together because he's not sure if he wants to be with me. I was shocked to hear it, came totally out of left field. I thought we were happy. But turns out that he might be in love with OW (they have not had a physical relationship but hanging out for the last three years). Of course I'm devastated.

BUT we are trying to live together for the kids (I know everyone will say that is crazy, but it is what it is and we are really going to try). We are actually able to get along reasonably well. We don't really fight, but are tense sometimes. But I do think that stuff will get better with time. 

The big possibly insurmountable problem that I see is that I have insane awful anxiety attacks and just feel like it's the end of the freaking world if I think he's with OW. So far, he has stayed away from her since the breakup other than one (insanely awful for me) planned meeting with her. I don't think he will probably be hanging out with her any time soon, like say the next couple of months. But there will come a time when he does, or if not her, someone else. 

Does anyone have any thoughts about how I can get through it better? When they aren't together I don't have any illusions that we are somehow getting back together or less separated, but then if I think they are together it's like the world has come crashing down on me. If he's not WITH me, I'm not sure why I should care that he's with her, kwim? But I have some illogical visceral reaction. 

One thing I'm wondering is whether me dating (which I am not doing now, of course) would make this easier, or if it would just be beside the point. I'm not planning on running out and picking up some guy just so I can avoid the nightmare, but I'm just trying to think of how this could resolve someday. But I'm not even sure if me being excited about someone else would even affect my feelings about him. 

Do people who've been treated this way eventually fall out of love? Or is there some way that I can hasten that process? I feel like I might be doomed to love him no matter how crappy he treats me. I would not have thought I could still have feelings for him through all this.


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## Stretch (Dec 12, 2012)

Sorry you are going through this. My WAW dropped the I am not happy bomb after 22 years so I understand the connection that exists from a long marriage.

Look, you should consider stop being treated like a doormat. Be honest with yourself and make sure you are not allowing the in house separation just for the kids but you have some deep hope that you might R.

It might help to get a hold of Divorce Busting and start doing the 180 to get yourself on the road to healing and taking back your life. To be totally honest, living together is going to inhibit your healing indefinitely. You really need to go no contact(NC) on him to prove to yourself that you can make it on your own.

You know in your heart that as long as he is with the OW, you will never do your needed healing and taking back your life.

Since you are technically "marriage separated", you should write out the terms of your separation, i.e. finances, co-parenting and dating. When both agree with the terms start living your life the best you can within those boundaries.

Finally, do not underestimate the ability of your kids to be OK living separately and consider having him move out. You are submitting yourself to a never ending hell with your current arrangement.

Your sitch sucks and you NEED to focus on yourself and move towards a life without your H, who is a d-bag in my opinion.

180 and NC equals healing,

You are stronger than you think, we all are!
Stretch


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

6 weeks separated and he's going to date after 25 years married?

Let this man go. Your children will know the marriage is a joke and they will not like seeing you unhappy. 

Plus, you need love and all those good things too. I mean do you want to live a life wondering where he is or who he's with and when he comes to the house for your fake marriage, wonder who's perfume you smell? Don't torture yourself!

You just need to heal...


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## Arendt (Mar 25, 2013)

The kids might like the separation better anyhow. When they are with you they will get more attention than they will now. When they are with him, likewise. Added bonus would be that you get a few days off from the kids to wind down, date, whatever.

He's been "hanging out" with an OW for three years but no physical contact? Something tells me that may not be all the story. But you can bet that this has changed or will very, very soon.

You are being a doormat, as others have said. The longer you hang on, the harder it will be on you. Kick him out. If he wants to go bang other women, he can do that apart from you and you can initiate divorce.


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## grays (Jun 24, 2014)

Stretch said:


> Sorry you are going through this. My WAW dropped the I am not happy bomb after 22 years so I understand the connection that exists from a long marriage.
> 
> Look, you should consider stop being treated like a doormat. Be honest with yourself and make sure you are not allowing the in house separation just for the kids but you have some deep hope that you might R.
> 
> ...


Thank you, Stretch! I know that I'm strong enough to handle whatever happens. I didn't think so earlier on in this process, and it is shocking to me that I'm still standing, but when I look around now it is pretty obvious that I'm the healthy stable one. 

I found the 180 last night and I think I had been instinctively been doing a lot of it, though with a little bumps. We've only been in separate rooms, no "I love you's" or kisses goodbye for about six weeks, but this has been going on since February. At that point I started learning how to do salsa dancing (so fun!) and have been out several times a week doing that and then there're usually two or three outings with the kids that keep us out all day and sometimes into the evening. Since the official "break" I have hardly been around. Anyway, I am gonna really work on following the 180 to the letter the best I can now that I have it. 

Both of us (though I'd say him more than I, but me too) really want to make it work to live with the kids. We're kinda broke now as I'm not working, but what would be ideal is to sell our house and buy a duplex eventually. But, I think if we can do it, we'd both like to always have access to the kids. So, the plan is, if we're in the house, we're "on" as parents. On our days "off" the other can take the kids out or is responsible for being with them at home. So far, we've been doing pretty well with that and I do like it that there are no days when I just don't get to see my kids. 

As for reconciliation, ugh. I don't know how I will ever get past that idea, especially given that his position is that he "doesn't know if he wants to be with me." Right now we're in marriage counseling and I think the counselor is flummoxed at how much he really does not know which way he wants to go. At any rate, we are really still in the thick of it and of course there are times when I see glimmers of possibly being together again and feel the tug of that. I have really been pushing myself, though, to not hang my hat on that or even hope for it. I am moving forward in a lot of ways and his indecision is not hindering that. If he did have some epiphany about wanting to be with me, I don't even know. I have never been hurt like this in my life and am shocked that he could do all that he's done to me. I had no idea that he was capable of this sh*t before this and I'm not sure how a person can even be in a loving relationship with someone who's acted this way. Feeling secure and comfortable in my life was pretty important to me and I just don't see feeling anything like that with him again, yk?

And then there's the fact that I'm meeting other people! It's exciting!  Sometimes I even feel happy!!! I'm meeting other men, but it's not even only men. I am feeling much more connected to other people in general. I'm closer to some of my old friends and making new friends in a way that I haven't in years. I feel much more social and connected in general. And then there have been a couple of men that have really blown my mind.  They are not people I'm going to have real relationships with, but wow, it is pretty nice to see that I can be excited about someone else. Earlier in this process, I was telling my husband that I needed to go out and feel close to someone else, just to have some good feelings, yk, but that if I was going to have an affair he'd be my first choice. That is really not true now. When I think of the men in my life now, whether it's a roll in the hay or a more serious friendship/relationship I'm fantasizing about, he's not the one I'd choose. 

I'm not saying that the idea of reconciliation is not a problem, it is. But I kinda think it is looming less and less large, yk? I do desperately want someone to wrap their arms around me and make me feel loved and wanted (omg, the rejection is horrible!), but I can plainly see that it should not be him.



that_girl said:


> 6 weeks separated and he's going to date after 25 years married?
> 
> Let this man go. Your children will know the marriage is a joke and they will not like seeing you unhappy.
> 
> ...


Well, not that I want to do any defending of him, but... he isn't seeing her or planning on seeing her soon. He says that he needs to figure out how he feels first. But we are broken up. I am perfectly free to see other people and so is he, so I am not expecting him to go forever. 

It may be impossible for me to be happy not knowing what he's up to, or knowing what he's up to, but I'm hoping that I can get to a point where it doesn't freak me out and upset me. If it turns out that I can't do it, then we will have to talk about a plan B, but I am hoping that I can get on with my life in a way that makes me not care so much what he's doing.



Arendt said:


> The kids might like the separation better anyhow. When they are with you they will get more attention than they will now. When they are with him, likewise. Added bonus would be that you get a few days off from the kids to wind down, date, whatever.
> 
> He's been "hanging out" with an OW for three years but no physical contact? Something tells me that may not be all the story. But you can bet that this has changed or will very, very soon.
> 
> You are being a doormat, as others have said. The longer you hang on, the harder it will be on you. Kick him out. If he wants to go bang other women, he can do that apart from you and you can initiate divorce.


I understand the doormat thing. And I do think it's true to some extent. He would like to be able to have his "freedom" and also the safety of having me here. I don't know how much safety I'm actually providing him, though. I'm not planning on doing all the nurturing crap I used to do and I've been fairly good at watching him cry and not feeling anything about it. Times have changed! I'm hoping that the trade off will be worth it, but I'm not so wedded to this plan that I won't reconsider as time goes on.

Also, I think it's perfectly possible, even probable, that I'll be having an active dating/sex life well before him. I don't know if this is true across the board, but I feel like among the people I'm meeting, it is the left that bounce back and get busy before the leavers. I don't feel any guilt or any need to be careful for his sake or anything like that. I just want to be kind to myself and find comfort/companionship in a safe way. He is a fairly extreme introvert and not very social at all, has no friends really, other than this one OW who he hasn't been in contact with, partly because he's afraid of being around her. He's also completely freaked out (belatedly) about the idea of me having to deal with it. I think he'd like to wait until I'm involved with someone.


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

He's lying. Please. Believe nothing he says. He hid this "being in love with her" from you. He's most likely seen her. And you want to play house with this man...you're better than that. You will, at some point, want more than a man who DOES NOT KNOW who he loves.


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## grays (Jun 24, 2014)

that_girl said:


> He's lying. Please. Believe nothing he says. He hid this "being in love with her" from you. He's most likely seen her. And you want to play house with this man...you're better than that. You will, at some point, want more than a man who DOES NOT KNOW who he loves.


I don't think he is seeing her, but I could be wrong. I'm not counting on him not seeing her at all. We are broken up. It's fair game if he is seeing her and while I'd be upset to learn it and have that kicked in the gut feeling, I would not think that he had done something wrong. He's free as far as I'm concerned. I'm just trying to shore myself up so that I don't get too freaked out about it. Best case scenario for me right now is that he goes out with her, I know about it, and I don't care. I'm not there yet, but I am hoping I can be there before too long.

I actually have some xanex, just in case I can't handle it. The last time that I knew he was with her, I lost four pounds that day, heart palpitations, hyperventilating, diarrhea, the whole nine yards. I can't do that again. I have the xanex in case I need it, but I would like to get to the point that I don't need something like that. I do have a good friend who is dying to get drunk with me. lol The last ten or 15 years I have probably averaged about one drink a year. Every once in a while I like a good margarita. So, that's a possibility, too. And he's got kids that my kids love, so I'm thinking we'd all do a sleepover there, no driving. But I obviously can't do that every time the ex goes out.


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

You are ready to take pills over this?

You are creating your own hell. Let this man go in every sense of the word and create a home for you and your children that is stable and loving and without all of that drama.


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## Arendt (Mar 25, 2013)

Xanax and alcohol are not going to help you cope with this problem. They'll give you an additional problem to deal with.

You can come out of this far healthier and stronger or you can come out of it a total mess. That will be up to you.

Most of us here have dealt with some form of what you are going through. Living together and trying to hold on to something "for the sake of the kids" is 1) not good for the kids to see this broken marriage limp along as mom and dad hurt each other over and over and learn to be little doormats and codependents, 2) is using them to smooth over your own inability to break things off, and 3) not giving your kids credit for being able to deal with pain. You cannot protect them from what is happening. They'll deal with it as healthily as you do. And if you are a doormat, if you and he go back and forth on the screwing other people and such to get back at each other cycle, that is what they'll learn. If you take drugs and alcohol to cope, that is what they will learn.

Or, you can kick that motherf!cker out of the house and stand up for yourself and your kids. You can continue to use your social network to build confidence (but friends who tell you to get drunk over this are not helping). You can rebuild your self-image through working out, get a make-over, etc. Get some new hobbies. Do some volunteer work. Get into therapy (are you in IC?, if not, why not?).


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## grays (Jun 24, 2014)

Arendt said:


> Xanax and alcohol are not going to help you cope with this problem. They'll give you an additional problem to deal with.
> 
> You can come out of this far healthier and stronger or you can come out of it a total mess. That will be up to you.
> 
> ...


I don't think that alcohol and/or xanex are going to help in any real long term way. I'm not some kind of drug addict or something, and like I said, I almost never drink. I think I have been tipsy like twice in the last 15 years and that's only bc I'm such a lightweight. Seriously, though, if hanging out with my friend and having a few (a couple?) of drinks helps get me through one hard night, I don't see any reason not to. I have already been through nearly six months of hell with this and I haven't had a single drink or any sort of pill in that time. 

He and I aren't in any kind of a cycle. So far (and I don't see why it's not going to continue in this vein) we have only been moving in one direction. We have not broken up and gotten back together and nobody has screwed anyone. When I do screw someone it is not going to be about getting back at him. Neither one of us feels like there's any "getting back at" to be done. 

We have actually gotten along quite well here living in separate rooms. I admit it is not perfect, though I do feel as if things are moving in a good direction in terms of me being less angry and more accepting of what's going on, me building a life of my own, me not feeling like I'm trying to find signs that he wants to be with me. The one problem I feel like I really want to get a handle on, though, before it happens is how I'm going to feel when he does see OW or dates someone else. I feel like that's a problem that I should be able to deal with but if it isn't I don't think I'm going to try to make this work if I'm just miserable. 

I understand that the kids have to be feeling some of what's going on, but the reality of our situation is that there is really no fighting going on here. We are generally helpful and friendly to each other and have managed to do a lot of our kid-centered routines without conflict. We have been able to pass them off and kind of take turns without friction. What the kids have now is better for them than only having one parent at a time and potentially being separated from the other for 2, 3, 4 days at a time. And both of us get to see our kids *every* day. That's really important to me. It is not the most important thing, so if it turns out that it's impossible bc I'm so unhappy or if it turns out that it's not good for the kids bc they're seeing too much cr*p or seeing their mother being treated like a doormat, then it will have to change. 

As for new hobbies and all that, I talked quite a bit about how my life has changed up thread, but I'll say again, my lifestyle has changed a lot. I'm going out constantly with and without the kids. I've been going dancing between 3 and 5 nights every week since maybe 3 months ago. I've met a ton of people and become closer to some of my existing friends. I have been practically following the 180 plan even though I didn't know it existed, and doing it honestly, not to reel him back in but because it's good for me to build my own separate life. It makes me feel better in the moment and more hopeful for the future. 

I have also been working out like a maniac and cannot believe how fit and strong I am. I'm 44 years old and so much fitter than I have ever been before. I have been sprinting up giant steep hills and walking for miles on loose sand. It's been great for my body and has helped a ton with the stress and the anger.

And yes, I'm in IC. I had been seeing a therapist up until about a year ago and he and I just didn't gel (even though I'd been seeing him for like three years). I just started seeing a new woman about two months ago and I feel really good about her. For the time being I'm actually going to be seeing her twice a week. Ex is also in therapy and we're going to marriage counseling together, too. There is no more room for therapy in our lives. 

I understand that a lot of what I've said looks like red flags. I knew that the xanex/alcohol ideas were going to raise eyebrows, but as someone who is comfortable drinking but doesn't feel the need to almost ever do it, I'm not worried that one night of drunken self-medicating is going to ruin me. It will just get me through the night... hopefully. 

Also, and I know that eyebrows will be raised over this one, too... but both of us still love the other. I don't have some naive idea of how lovable he is anymore. I know that he can be horribly destructive and hurtful. But he will always be family to me and I think he will always be my friend. I know that friends don't treat each other this way, but ya know sadly, they sometimes do. Even *ssholes have friends. lol


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## Thundarr (Jul 4, 2012)

Grays, you're going to be angry with yourself later on. He sees you the way you see yourself. Fragile and unable to cope. If you're wanting him to want you then this has to change IMO.


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## grays (Jun 24, 2014)

Thundarr said:


> Grays, you're going to be angry with yourself later on. He sees you the way you see yourself. Fragile and unable to cope. If you're wanting him to want you then this has to change IMO.


What about the way I'm talking makes you believe I'm fragile and unable to cope? I feel like I'm coping fairly well. 

I'm not sure about the wanting him to want me thing.... I mean, in some sense, yeah, I think a lot of us probably want our ex's to wake up one day realizing that they seriously f'd up and want nothing more to get us back. It's only been six weeks for f's sake. But I also know that he DOESN'T want me and I'm not feeling like it would be a good thing if he did. I can think of a couple of other guys that I would rather have want me, to tell you the honest truth.

ETA: I don't think I'm going to be angry with myself later. So far, I feel as if he's been pretty rotten in a lot of ways and if I'd known how rotten he would get, I'd have behaved a little differently. BUT I also feel proud of myself for being as honest and straight forward as I've been without doing any game-playing or back stabbing or being mean. I have honestly loved him and done my best by him. He has really f*cked up, but I've conducted myself like the person that I want to be. If it doesn't work out to be living together, I think I will feel happy that I tried it.

ALSO... I really am asking a Q here about how to get through his dating. I understand that the easiest and perhaps the best way is to kick him out so I never see it (until the kids come home and tell me about her or some such -- it's not like there's any real getting away from it). But since neither of us is moving out any time soon, I would like to be thinking about how to handle it before it's on top of me. I guess I was hoping that there would be others here who have confronted that situation and could tell me what helped for them.


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## Thundarr (Jul 4, 2012)

grays said:


> What about the way I'm talking makes you believe I'm fragile and unable to cope? I feel like I'm coping fairly well.


I picked up on the "anxiety" comment. After reading your last few comments though you don't seem helpless at all. So I think the anxiety is caused by intrusive thoughts (don't laugh; it a real term) and there's some medications that supposedly work really well for it.


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## grays (Jun 24, 2014)

Well, yeah, I know about intrusive thoughts. :roll eyes: The ex is OCD and many years of our relationship were ruled by his intrusive thoughts. And I think I do have my own, too, though not normally debilitating. 

The anxiety I have felt while he was with her may be something like intrusive thoughts. It's not as obvious to me, though, bc I don't think the thoughts are very articulate, iykwim. It's more like "omg, he's with her...... it's the end of the woooooorrrrld!!!! F!!!!!!!!!ck!" It feels like the thought itself doesn't even need to happen, like it's a visceral reaction and also like it doesn't feel related/in reference to all that has happened, if that makes sense. Like, when it happens it's almost like I didn't know we were in trouble, like right up until the anxiety hit I thought we were happily married and then I was slammed in the head with it out of the blue. And it's actually been a few weeks since it happened, so I'm not sure if it will still happen next time. It may be that I've progressed enough that I'm not likely to have that same experience of it. But I don't want to count on it. 

I got the xanex from a psychiatrist that my therapist sent me to for this very reason. I told him about the weight loss, heart racing feeling, hyperventilating (I don't think it was real hyperventilating but like almost an out of breath feeling for HOURS) and he thought xanex would help. I have the xanex with me for about three weeks now, carrying it in my purse so I have it if I freak out. But I haven't used any yet and I would not be at all surprised if I don't. 

One thing about my freak-out reaction... is that I'm thinking it may not be that abnormal. There's a guy that I've been spending a fair amount of time with, just really enjoying his attention. He's crazy hot  but sadly not someone that I can imagine having a real *thing* with. But still, it is so nice to hang out with him and he's really fun to dance with. So, a couple of weeks ago he asked for my phone number and I told the ex about it (I have no reason to lie to him and I kinda feel like the more up front we are about these things, the fewer surprises, the better, in both directions). The ex then stomped around for about four days being all grim. I wasn't sure what the problem was. Like, I thought, jeez, is he bothered by the phone number thing? Can't be! I expected that he'd take that sort of thing way better than I would seeing as he's the one looking for his freedom. But he really didn't take it any better. I doubt he sat on the toilet the whole night while I was out with this guy, but still I think we both have a hard time with the other one being with someone else. 

I am not seeing that as a sign that we are somehow supposed to be together, just that it is so ingrained in both of us that we are partners, like it's just deeper in us than the level we normally operate at. It hasn't been as hard to unpartner in some ways (I have no problem going out without him, for instance) -- but there are a couple of things that are hard, this being with someone else thing and also, for me (don't know if he has any trouble w this, I doubt it actually), turning the light out at night. I feel awfully lonely when it's time to turn out the light and that leads me to putting it off and staying up too late. The panic at him dating is near-unbearable, the turning off the light problem is just something I need to work on.

One problem I see with taking the xanex, and maybe this will keep me from doing it, is that I want to get better at it. I want to be a functional happy person no matter where he is or who he is with. And to get there I may have some number of anxiety attacks and miserable evenings I have to get through undrugged. If I'm drugged maybe it won't count, yk?


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

I think in time you'll naturally drift apart. You will want more out of life than living with an ex who is dating. At some point you may even want some serious in your life and you'll want a place where that person can come for dinner, etc.

Give it time, it will sort out.


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## Homemaker_Numero_Uno (Jan 18, 2011)

Look, carrying around a safety drug in order to get yourself through tight situations is not a biggie. It doesn't make you weak. It's a reasonable coping strategy. You are taking care of yourself.

Same as living under same roof. Is a short term thing, but you know it is not going to work long term. For either of you!

And your kids will see everything the other parent is doing and have to censor under the same roof, they will be so confused and having to keep track of details, like one parent or the other breaking the rules and having someone come over, etc. In the short term it would be good so they can see a breakup doesn't have to be full-on reactivity, that people can show restraint and civility and some emotional toughness to ease themselves through the legal, financial and logistical hurdles of divorce/separation and moving on.


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## Arendt (Mar 25, 2013)

I had anxiety attacks when everything first went down. They were awful. Couldn't sleep, lost weight...metallic taste in my mouth. Appetite gone.

I'd wake up in the middle of the night, my heart pounding and breathing heavy.

I got on effexor which is nothing like xanax. My doctor said that xanaxx and those kinds of pills are like booze in a pill. They will work shortterm but run huge risks.

He put me on effexor and it took the edge off. My body was in fight or flight mode and there was nothing I could do to stop it. No amount of happy thoughts could stop the tightness in my stomach at all times. The effexor basically allowed my body to stop responding as if I were in a life and death situation. I was on it for six months and weaned my sefl off over a months time. Glad I took it. It did not alter my moods. SO if you are having panic attacks, get on something that is less prone to addiction and will help your body calm down. Nothing wrong with doing that. But alcohol and xanax are really not he answer here. They won't shut off the fight or flight mechanism except for a few hours and then you need more. Then a cycle can happen.


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## grays (Jun 24, 2014)

that_girl said:


> I think in time you'll naturally drift apart. You will want more out of life than living with an ex who is dating. At some point you may even want some serious in your life and you'll want a place where that person can come for dinner, etc.
> 
> Give it time, it will sort out.





Homemaker_Numero_Uno said:


> Same as living under same roof. Is a short term thing, but you know it is not going to work long term. For either of you!


I do hope it will work long term in some fashion, though I doubt that we can make it work for too long in a 1,000 square foot house like we have now. I think it would be possible in a duplex where we'd each have privacy. We'd of course still see each other and our respective others, but I think it would work ok. 

For now, we have agreed not to bring other people home at all. I don't think that would fly in either direction. He has already said that he doesn't want to meet Ruben (my hot friend, lol) or have to see him picking me up and I think he knows that heads would roll if OW showed up. But even if he and I were ok with it, I don't want our kids to be exposed to that stuff. Ewwww. I was as a child and it felt pretty awful to me. 



Arendt said:


> I had anxiety attacks when everything first went down. They were awful. Couldn't sleep, lost weight...metallic taste in my mouth. Appetite gone.
> 
> I'd wake up in the middle of the night, my heart pounding and breathing heavy.
> 
> ...


I'm sorry! That sounds awful. I was pretty freaked at first and had some more generalized sort of anxiety than I do now. Like sometimes it would just hit me out of the blue and I couldn't shut it down. 

I wanted xanex because I wanted a safety net that I didn't have to take all the time. I don't even know if this anxiety attack will ever happen and if it does, maybe I can get through it without taking the xanex. Like I said, I've had it for three weeks and haven't needed it or taken any. The last thing I wanted was a pill to take every day, kwim? Like, I wasn't having an everyday problem and hopefully it's not something that will even happen again.


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