# At what point do people think/say it's over?



## DualvansMommy (Jul 27, 2014)

could you all tell me, for those who are divorcing/divorced, the tipping point in your marriages?


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

DualvansMommy said:


> could you all tell me, for those who are divorcing/divorced, the tipping point in your marriages?


You feel a SNAP...and you just KNOW that you are done. 

For me, in my second marriage, it was during a road trip. My XH went into a rage when he realized we still had an hour to drive, and screamed and yelled at me as I was driving, with my daughter in the back seat. I can remember him saying the most hateful things to me and I was crying as I was driving...then he aimed one of those nasty comments at my daughter, and thats when I felt it. The SNAP. Right at that moment, I knew I was done. I am just sorry my daughter was witness to all that. 

I read your first post here. Your snap is coming, unless you can get your husband into some serious counseling with you.


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## Wolf1974 (Feb 19, 2014)

Was over when I decided I couldn't get along with her boyfriend


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## Rowan (Apr 3, 2012)

Pretty much the moment I found out that the single EA we'd just spent the last nearly 3 years struggling to recover from had actually been a 14-year history of serial cheating. He was sitting there telling me this in broken bits, crying and shaking and looking all pitiful. I was dry-eyed and calm. In an instant, that switch had flipped for me. I wasn't angry, or sad, or distraught. I was profoundly tired. It was just, suddenly, completely and utterly _over_. 

I was at my attorney's office the next day and was divorced exactly 10 weeks later.


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## salespro (Jan 15, 2014)

We have been going down hill for years, but a couple of months ago she said " I can have sex, I just choose not too". Since we haven't been intimate in 6 years, I knew it was time to start planning my exit strategy. My therapist told me 2 years ago it was over, but I just couldn't make the decision.


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## areyouserious? (Jun 22, 2014)

For me it was the point where my ex husband finally agreed to go to a counseling session with me (I'd been going for two months) and five minutes into it he stood up, said "Get over it" and walked out. Right then and there I knew that he wasn't willing to work on it. It takes two people to make a relationship work (I've said this before) and when one person isn't willing to come to some kind of compromise then it's impossible to go on and actually BE content. You need to have communication - this is sooo important. But you also have to be willing to listen to each others needs and desires without making it all about "you" (this goes for both parties involved).


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## Kerry (Jan 9, 2009)

DualvansMommy said:


> could you all tell me, for those who are divorcing/divorced, the tipping point in your marriages?


I think you'll know; you just won't be capable of taking it one more day.

I suggest you don't wait until that point though. Start strategizing. Just because you have a "plan b" doesn't mean you'll leave or you're not a good person. You're just wise! A plan b will sure remove some future stress if you do decide to leave.

Can you stash some cash? Can you get a PT job. Is there someone you can stay with for a bit if you do leave (realize that's tough with kids)? I'm not suggesting these, but just getting the creative-thinking juices flowing so you don't feel so stuck and that you have some options if you tip.

I read your original post. You are being verbally abused. You need to know what your "deal breaker" is. Is verbal abuse a deal breaker? Or is it when he starts talking to the kids the way he talks to you? Only YOU know your tipping point, and, frankly, you sound close.

Also, if you can, get the book "In Sheep's Clothing" by George Simon. It is on audible, which might help if you're busy. It will open your eyes A LOT, and save you a lot of time b/c he points out the tactics that "covert aggressive" types use--that's the term he uses to describe people who cause trouble (though your husband sounds plain old aggressive to me). Doesn't matter, you just need to open your eyes, recognize his tactics, do some planning and get to know yourself.

The book has some great tips to help you navigate. Here are a few:

1. Most importantly, don't try to explain it to yourself. Your husband's behavior is sh!tty. We don't care that his mother was this or father was that. He's an adult and is using hurtful tactics. He needs to face it or lose a spouse. The author says this is one of the biggest downfalls...spouses try to "figure it out" and the bottom line it that the person is aggressive and they go through life with the intention of "winning".

2. Pick your battles. Don't waste your energy on him. If he accuses you of something, find a simple response that is not defensive such as, "you may be right." He's looking for a fight and getting you to take the bait. Don't worry about right or wrong...save your energy for where it matters.

I sense you have a ton of bottled up anger (who wouldn't!!!). Keep the faith. Keep observing, learning, taking care of yourself, get some support if you can (alanon or coda). Don't get all caught up in him. Do some things for yourself. Spend time with a friend you trust. Get to know what YOU like about YOU. Don't let him be your mirror...he's got a distorted view for whatever reason, so he's like a carnival mirror. That's not a good mirror to use for self discovery. 

Hang tough! I'll be sending positive vibes and hugs!!! 

kerry


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## highwood (Jan 12, 2012)

The lawyer I saw last week said if you are still in the marriage one of the best things to do is to photocopy documents such as bank records, investments, etc. Not to be sneaky but just to have all information just in case.


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## lifeistooshort (Mar 17, 2013)

The tipping point for me was after years of verbal abuse I had just finished entering a job in the computer (I did secret shopping), had two toddlers at home, and was trying to think of more things to clean so he wouldn't come home and start screaming at me about the house being messy. I had just told my older son that we should vacuum the carpets and had forgotten that I'd done dishes and left the sponge in the water, which was one of his many b!tches about things I didn't do right. I hear the front door slam and a minute later he comes into the computer room, looks at me with a nasty look and says "What did I tell you about leaving the sponge in the sink" and continued to scream at me. I decided right then I was done and when I told him I wanted a divorce he was SHOCKED! He told me "I thought we were in this come hell our high water". Translation: I didn't think it mattered how I treated you because I didn't think you were going anywhere. I once asked him to name one thing I did right and his response was that he was trying to fix that. Yeah, you can go to hell. Shocking that he's still single.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Sunburn (Jul 9, 2012)

After she came home from a trip with girlfriends and a pair of jeans with a faded billfold outline on the left back pocket appeared in my jeans drawer. I carry mine in the right.


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## clipclop2 (Aug 16, 2013)

yeah that's how it was for me as well. It was just the switch. yes things had been going downhill over time but there was a moment and revelation and that was it. I called the lawyer and I don't have the land record like Rowan but about 7 months later I was divorced.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## I'llUseMyEars (Jul 27, 2014)

For me and my EW, there was no nastiness or any terrrible wrongdoings. After 18 years of marriage it ended. Of course, the problems started long before. About 10 years in we slowly just grew apart and we couldnt seem to ever right the ship. This went on for far too long and really what it came down to was neither of us were willing to just say the words. Alot of discussion around a table, knowing we werent going to fix it, I just said the words. We went forward, and it wasnt messy or ugly in any sense. It was jusr done. Sad, but true...


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## DualvansMommy (Jul 27, 2014)

Kerry said:


> I think you'll know; you just won't be capable of taking it one more day.
> 
> I suggest you don't wait until that point though. Start strategizing. Just because you have a "plan b" doesn't mean you'll leave or you're not a good person. You're just wise! A plan b will sure remove some future stress if you do decide to leave.
> 
> ...


Thanks, kerry. That is very helpful, i already made note of the book which i'll look up later. It's been ongoing for the past few years, but definately since i became SAHM and birth of my firstborn. I'm at the point where i'm already in IC for myself and already asked hubby for couples counseling, which have yet to begin. 

I think my deal breaker is not wanting the boys to see/grow up in this type of enviornment where it's ok to see their father berating their mother. As it is, my oldest is 3 already and it won't be long before he'll become very aware of it. 

actually, i do have some income of my own every month; approx 1,500 a month and already have few thousands saved in an account of my own. I already decided to earmark 500 of it monthly to that account, since i handle the day to day finances. It's something hubby won't even miss since he only thinks it's 1k i put in towards our joint account. so, i do feel bit secure about that at least. 



highwood said:


> The lawyer I saw last week said if you are still in the marriage one of the best things to do is to photocopy documents such as bank records, investments, etc. Not to be sneaky but just to have all information just in case.


Since i handle all the filing, safe keeping, and put all the receipts and all every year for our tac returns. i do know where and how to access that infomation. i should start scanning those copies to my evernote though, as an extra precaution. we have a lot of joint assests, particularly investiments and savings, and im not sure of the law on that whether i can take half out without hubby's permission. However, he has significant retirement savings in his 401k, easily half a mil in that account whereas i only have just about 50k in my own. But all good info for me to know as i can easily keep track of his annual numbers if i have to. 



lifeistooshort said:


> The tipping point for me was after years of verbal abuse I had just finished entering a job in the computer (I did secret shopping), had two toddlers at home, and was trying to think of more things to clean so he wouldn't come home and start screaming at me about the house being messy. I had just told my older son that we should vacuum the carpets and had forgotten that I'd done dishes and left the sponge in the water, which was one of his many b!tches about things I didn't do right. I hear the front door slam and a minute later he comes into the computer room, looks at me with a nasty look and says "What did I tell you about leaving the sponge in the sink" and continued to scream at me. I decided right then I was done and when I told him I wanted a divorce he was SHOCKED! He told me "I thought we were in this come hell our high water". Translation: I didn't think it mattered how I treated you because I didn't think you were going anywhere. I once asked him to name one thing I did right and his response was that he was trying to fix that. Yeah, you can go to hell. Shocking that he's still single.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


i'm sorry you had to go through that. For a long time, i believed hubby may have had a point about my not keeping up. Back then, i was working 50 hours a week with 2 hour roundtrip commute mon-fridays, whereas he had a 10 min commute. so i told him the fair thing was you do the chores in our condo and i'll do all related groceries, laundry, and book-keeping. That arragement worked well for us, then i quit my job and he started on his **** about my not keeping up, even telling me i didn't do anything while we lived in the condo. 

I would remind him i had a longer commute and you agreed to my shopping errands. didn't matter a thing, then between baby 1 and baby #2, i told him to hire a housekeeper to come out bi monthly. Really thought that would solve our problems as our arguments was mostly about that, but a year and half later. Still the same ****, and that's when i realized it's not about the cleaning or lack thereof! but more of him as a personality disorder. Many people who came here are often surprised it's kept clean and clutter free, even with two kids and a dog! if you hear him, it would honestly sound like a dirty and cluttered home.


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## Rowan (Apr 3, 2012)

clipclop2 said:


> I called the lawyer and I don't have the land record like Rowan but about 7 months later I was divorced.


I was what a friend in real estate would call a "motivated seller".


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

There is usually a moment..after a culmination of things that happen. But generally, you or they do not want to do it anymore.


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## highwood (Jan 12, 2012)

I am struggling as well...about 90% of me wants to end my marriage as I am so unhappy, I wish I had done it two years ago when I caught H having an EA. INstead I went into desperate mode and did what I could to save the marriage however after the BS fog wore off I realized that I was not happy and would never be able to view him the same way again. HOnestly we were heading down this path even before his EA but back then even if the marriage was not great I never thought about leaving, now that is all I think about.

Now I think if we split up because of what he did two years ago people are going to think why now? Why are you doing this two years later and not back then.

I know I am not happy with him. We have no intimacy in our marriage and if I am feeling down or upset about something I would rather talk to other people about it then him. That is a huge red flag in my opinion. 

This guy I worked with who passed away unexpectedly last week has reignited my feelings of wanting to move on...life is short. I cannot stay because my family thinks my spouse is this great guy and why would you leave a nice guy.


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

highwood said:


> I am struggling as well...about 90% of me wants to end my marriage as I am so unhappy, I wish I had done it two years ago when I caught H having an EA. INstead I went into desperate mode and did what I could to save the marriage however after the BS fog wore off I realized that I was not happy and would never be able to view him the same way again. HOnestly we were heading down this path even before his EA but back then even if the marriage was not great I never thought about leaving, now that is all I think about.
> 
> Now I think if we split up because of what he did two years ago people are going to think why now? Why are you doing this two years later and not back then.
> 
> ...


So what is it that is keeping you there, Highwood? You seem very aware of what you want.


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## highwood (Jan 12, 2012)

Fear...fear of being on my own even though there is a huge part of me that is so excited by it as well. I am 46 and have been with him since I was 19. Fear like I said of my family being disappointed because H is a nice guy.

Anytime I have mentioned to my sister that I am not happy she brushes it under the carpet and says well you guys have to work on the marriage and then I think okay is it me? Can I reignite my marriage? Maybe I have to work on being a better spouse, etc. etc. But my desire to work on the marriage is pretty much gone.


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

highwood said:


> Fear...fear of being on my own even though there is a huge part of me that is so excited by it as well. I am 46 and have been with him since I was 19. Fear like I said of my family being disappointed because H is a nice guy.
> 
> Anytime I have mentioned to my sister that I am not happy she brushes it under the carpet and says well you guys have to work on the marriage and then I think okay is it me? Can I reignite my marriage? Maybe I have to work on being a better spouse, etc. etc. But my desire to work on the marriage is pretty much gone.


Ugh, I hate it when family isnt supportive. How is HER marriage??

As for the fear...yes, it can be scary being on your own, for me personally its a little scary because of finances. But overall, being on your own after having been with someone who causes you so much misery...there is no feeling like it! Being free, doing things YOUR way, and no one there to insult you any more...priceless.


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## highwood (Jan 12, 2012)

Sometimes I hope that we have some huge fight and then just end it...yet in the last six months if that happened and we start talking about separation I start to panic and think no maybe I don't want this, then the fear, etc. sets in. That is what confuses me..if you want to end your marriage are you not supposed to be 100% sure about it? Are you supposed to not be scared??


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## highwood (Jan 12, 2012)

I think what happens is the fear and uncertainty overtake me so then I think well better to live with what you have known and is "comfortable" than to do something scary.

Gutless I know...but understand I tend to be very wishy washy about big decisions in my life. I want someone to tell me yes you are making the right decision. 

I remember hearing a woman years ago on a talk show talk about how she left her marriage and how it takes guts to leave a bad marriage and so true. I think honestly that is why so many people stay in unhappy marriages..fear of the unknown..just stay with what you know even if you are not happy. I am willing to bet that right now at least 50% of married couples one or both is unhappy and feels trapped.


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

Being sure about it and being scared are two different things, but you feel them at the same time. The decision to leave does need you to be 100% certain, but that doesnt mean that you arent scared at the same time about it. Ending your marriage, no matter how sure you are about it, is a scary thing. When you are sure about it though, you just suck up that fear and move forward, because you KNOW that it takes you to a better place than where you are now. I have done it twice, and was scared out of my mind both times, but KNEW it was what I needed to do, for myself and for my daughter.


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## highwood (Jan 12, 2012)

Her marriage is not good..they are living separate but still see each other. THeir issues are his son, that is an ongoing problem as the teenage boy caused many problems. I think because H's EA happened two+ years ago her view is our issues are in the past so get over it and work on your marriage. 

But it is more than just the EA, I just don't feel like I did years ago.

This is going to sound strange but this coworker that passed away during my conversations with him prior I found myself thinking that this is the type of guy that appeals to me. He was very smart, had a PHd in Science but yet down to earth, rode motorcycles, knew about fixing cars, etc.

I remember thinking that it is kind of cool that a guy like that can hang out with a bunch of bikers yet has a doctorate in Science. SInce he passed away all I can think of is I would love to meet a guy like that one day, that kind of a guy is appealing to me. So this has been a rough week feeling sad for my coworker as well as making me think about how life is short and do I want to be with this person for the rest of it....

Plus I love it when a guy has a passion for something as H is not like that. He has no hobbies..he did ride a motorbike for a while but in the last year has lost interest in it. 

I just find that him and I have outgrown each other. I have changed from the age of 19 to the age of 46 and what appeals to me in a guy is not him anymore. 

Sorry to hijack the thread but writing out my feelings is very therapeutic for me


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## highwood (Jan 12, 2012)

To the OP there are many threads especially on the "Considering Divorce/Separation" forum pondering exactly what you are wondering


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## clipclop2 (Aug 16, 2013)

So remove the uncertainty by planning your exit and planning your new life.


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## EnjoliWoman (Jul 2, 2012)

Yes, there was a "snap" moment. I had thought about leaving many times - I can even specifically remember sitting in my car at a stop sign on the way to work - remember exactly what I was wearing, what I was feeling... but the "snap" was when my daughter was about 18 months old. 

H decided he wanted to invite all of the family to a beach house. He rented one for a week. My parents/sister(handicapped), his parents, his brother/wife and their toddler were all to come. My parents arrive and he went out to greet/help with luggage and my sister was apparently upset at the number of stairs (most beach houses are on pylons and several stories high) so he said he was going to carry her up (I'd scoped out a room on the main floor with a bathroom that would be easy to access) but I guess she must have been frustrated by it and said something like she didn't want to go in or wouldn't. He cursed her and told her she could sit in the car for the week if she wanted to - he didn't care. My parents interjected and he stormed off back to the house. Mom came in with a casserole she'd made and told me they were going to find a hotel nearby. I walked out to the car where they told me what was said. Inside I think "what an azzhole" but I didn't want to badmouth him to family. I said to let me know where they ended up staying but they didn't find a place and drove 7 hours back home.  

I went inside after they drove off - H was spouting off to his mother and then left the room for something and she turned to me and said "Did he say something to them to cause them to leave?" That was the first 'crackle' - knowing his own mother saw how he was.

Then BIL/SIL/nephew show up and they get settled. After dinner once everyone has gone off to bed and the kids are settled, SIL and I have some quiet girl time just the two of us and some wine. She asked why my parents weren't there and I recount the story based on what H told me and my brief conversation with parents. There must have been a tense moment or two earlier as well (this was 14 years ago - memory off a bit) and she asks "Hon, has he ever hit you?" And I started bawling. I'd kept that side of our marriage so tightly closed up, yet for her to be so perceptive to the relationship dynamics it was like the crack in the dam that finally gave way and it all poured out and by the time I went to bed I knew I had to leave - it has snapped. It took a while to leave as I needed to find a job (SAHM) and get my life in order. I got a job, borrowed $500 from parents to open a checking account and pay for an initial consultation with an attorney.

And the final 'snap' to leave was one final pushy azzhole moment because a narcissist is all about them. I was getting ready for work and he wanted sex. I had already showered and nearly dressed and would be late for work if we did and our daughter, now 4) was up. He got very angry, yelled at our daughter who had meanwhile come into the room asking for oatmeal and told her to leave - her eyes welled up (SHE hadn't done anything wrong! yet was being yelled at) and he told me that if I wouldn't' give it to him he could find someone who would (note that we had sex 4-5 times a week or more - nearly every day because his temper wasn't worth not doing it). At that point I was completely irrevocably done. I told him to go find her, then. And I left the house for work. I called the attorney I'd consulted with before and told her I wanted to proceed, then called parents for a retainer and I went at lunch and got a cell phone of my own in my own name.

A week or so later I was in a battered women's shelter until I could find a place to rent and I never looked back.


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## firebelly1 (Jul 9, 2013)

In my first marriage I was at a counselling appointment. My H and I had seen him twice together and now I was there by myself. I told the counselor about what was really happening in our relationship - the verbal abuse, the iron-fist control he had over my life. I wasn't able to say those things when H was in the room - and I told the counselor that I was hoping he would leave. The counselor said "He is never going to leave you and if you stay with him he will start treating your children the way he treats you." That was the snap for me. I made arrangements to fly back home to my mother. I didn't have a penny to my name. I had two small girls and I was pregnant with my son. 

In my second marriage - he initiated separation in spring of 2012. We tried reconciliation and marriage counselling - the third time we'd been. He flaked out on the counselling and withdrew emotionally. It was his pattern throughout our relationship - he would say he loves me and really wants me back and then completely shut down when he had me. As I was going through counselling this time I started thinking "If this doesn't work out, I just don't think I want to try again because I'm tired of being hurt like this." We had a last conversation in which I told him to man up and tell me what he really feels and he repeated what he'd said two years prior - if he was going to be childless, he wanted to do it as a bachelor. I told him I was done. But I wasn't quite. I made an individual appointment with the counselor and there were two things that she said that really put things in perspective for me. She said "You shouldn't take this personally. He is incapable of being in a relationship. He just doesn't have it in him." And..."He isn't going to change." "Really?" I'd whined to her because throughout my marriage the REASON I put up with his BS was because I was convinced that anyone can change. "How do you know?" I'd asked her. "Because sometimes the ability to be social or not is hardwired into your brain and I think that's the case with H." 

When I decided that I didn't want to give him the chance to hurt me anymore and that this pattern wasn't going to change, that was the "snap" for me and I was truly done emotionally.


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