# Am I Headed for an Affair?



## Kendall

Hello. I’m here trying to determine if I’m headed for an affair.

My husband and I are both 28 years old. We’ve been together for 7 years, married for 5 years, with pretty good jobs and no children (2 dogs).

I love my husband, and I believe he loves me too. We’ve had a good marriage. We argue every now and then, but not much, and our arguments never get ugly.

Like most marriages, ours was blissful for a while, but has become “vanilla” over time.

The problem is, for about the past 2 years, my husband won’t talk to me as much as I need. Things like casual conversation, joking and laughing, and being together just for the sake of being together. We have good sex usually twice per week, but afterwards and until the next time we have sex, we’re kind of like “roommates”. He likes to watch sports, play video games, and read. His doesn’t have the same need for conversation and just being together like I do. This has been the norm for about the past 2 years.

I’ve talked to him several times about this. And every time he just says something like “We’re fine” and blames his quietness on pressures of work and being tired. I mentioned marriage counseling once, but he said no.

I have no reason to believe he’s having an affair. There are none of the classic signs. And I’ve checked his cell phone, email, etc. (I know all his passwords). As far as I can tell, he’s not trying to hide anything. I think he’s just in a lazy, “take me for granted”, contented state. And I’m left feeling incomplete and lonely.

So there’s a nice guy at work (Lee) who’s about my age. And it’s very nice talking to him. He jokes and makes me laugh. He likes to talk about the things I like to talk about. Art, music, dogs, movies. We first met at work in the cafeteria while sitting among mutual friends. We still sit with those friends at lunch, but when the group doesn’t show up, Lee and I still sit together (just the two of us) and talk.

We’ve never met outside of work. We’ve never emailed or texted or talked on the phone. We’ve never touched inappropriately. Our conversations have never crossed the line. I’ve never talked bad about my husband to him. We just talk. But for the sake of honesty and completeness, I should also say he’s very attractive and single, and he doesn’t have a girlfriend right now. And we have so much in common.

So yesterday it was just us two together in the cafeteria at work, and he said the food didn’t look good to him, and he asked me out for lunch at a restaurant. I told him I couldn’t go because I had to make up missed time earlier in the week, and had only 30 minutes for lunch. But that wasn’t true. The truth was, I really wanted to go with him, but I thought better of it. And then he ended up staying with me anyway and we had lunch in the cafeteria.

I feel so confused. I want my husband to be my best friend, but he’s just not interested. And I’ve tried to change his mind. Several times.

Is it safe for me to continue talking to Lee in just an at-work, friendly manner like it’s been so far? Or am I headed for trouble? I’m not naïve. I know that many affairs have begun this way. But I need a friend that I can just talk to. I don’t have any sisters or close girl friends.

Am I already in an emotional affair? I don’t think I am. I’ve never told my husband about Lee, because my husband doesn’t like to talk about much these days. 

Please advise. Thank you.

*** Edited: I'm happy to revise this post and say that, because of the great advice I received here, I did not have an affair.


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## OnTheRocks

If your husband had an analogous relationship with another woman, would you call it an emotional affair? Duh.

Lee is playing you like a fiddle, JFYI.


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## OnTheRocks

If you're serious about saving your marriage, telling your husband about Lee at this point is about the best way to wake his ass up pronto. 

Do you have kids?


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## Kendall

OnTheRocks said:


> If your husband had an analogous relationship with another woman, would you call it an emotional affair? Duh.
> 
> Lee is playing you like a fiddle, JFYI.


But if I keep it just at work conversation at lunch, many times within a group setting, is it wrong to have a guy friend that I like talking to?

If it is, then I'll end it. I don't want an affair.


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## Kendall

OnTheRocks said:


> If you're serious about saving your marriage, telling your husband about Lee at this point is about the best way to wake his ass up pronto.
> 
> Do you have kids?


No kids. I've actually thought of having my husband read this thread, if I can get him away from the TV long enough.


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## MattMatt

Oh, dear. I did something pretty similar. She was just a drinking buddy who shared a hobby interest with me, plus a love of Star Trek Voyager.

She wasn't attractive, certainly nowhere near as pretty as my wife. So I felt safe with her. I mean, it wasn't as if we were having an affair, right?  Wrong.

One night I found myself, in bed with her, both of us naked, seconds away from having unprotected sex with her. At the very last moment I realised what I was doing and stopped.

You can stop now before you get to that stage.

What upset me was when I realised what a POS I had become, without me even realising it was happening to me.


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## adriana

Kendall, considering all circumstances of your situation it's very likely that you'll end up having a full blown affair. And you are already having a light emotional affair.... you just don't know it yet. 

Good luck and be careful.... you're already on slippery slope.


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## PhillyGuy13

It sounds like you are almost there, to an EA. Please, if you love your husband you will back off Lee. Your husband sounds like a good guy, the worst of it is he is quiet and plays lots of video games. Do you try engaging him in topics he is interested in? If you progress with Lee and he finds out it would DESTROY him. You can read my thread "Wife's Texts..." About my wife and her boss exchanging inappropriate texts. Mostly on his part, but my wife contributed. That was almost three months ago and I am still sick about it.

Look at it this way how would u feel if the roles were reveresed.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Allen_A

Kendall said:


> But if I keep it just at work conversation at lunch, many times within a group setting, is it wrong to have a guy friend that I like talking to?
> 
> If it is, then I'll end it. I don't want an affair.


If you are this eager to have a "guy friend" that you can "talk to" that should be speaking volumes to you. You clearly are already fired up to move ahead on this.

Infidelity is like a credit card...

You may find this whole thing entertaining for the short run, but the invoice will show up in your mailbox eventually.. and you won't be able to afford the balance you have racked up.

Just put the item back on the shelf and get out of the department store.


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## Kendall

PhillyGuy13 said:


> It sounds like you are almost there, to an EA. Please, if you love your husband you will back off Lee. Your husband sounds like a good guy, the worst of it is he is quiet and plays lots of video games. Do you try engaging him in topics he is interested in? If you progress with Lee and he finds out it would DESTROY him. You can read my thread "Wife's Texts..." About my wife and her boss exchanging inappropriate texts. Mostly on his part, but my wife contributed. That was almost three months ago and I am still sick about it.
> 
> Look at it this way how would u feel if the roles were reveresed.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


My husband is a very good guy. I love him. And I want him to be my best friend. I've tried talking to him about the fact that we used to talk a lot, but don't any more. He makes excuses.

If the roles were reversed, I would make an honest effort to be to my husband what he needs me to be. The fact that he doesn't do the same hurts me.


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## ReGroup

The comparisons have already begun.

This is an EA already.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## thummper

Kendall, you're playing with fire. This guy isn't interested in a sweet, platonic relationship. If you'll pardon the crudeness, all he's interestined in is how to get in your pants. He made that clear when, after saying the food in the lunchroom looked terrible, how about going to lunch with him, he promptly decided to stay with you anyway. Honey, if that's not a veiled red flag, then you really are naïve. You might mention to your hubby that this guy is acting interested in you and chatting you up at work, making you laugh. Might put a firecracker under his a$$ and make him realize that maybe he'd better start paying more attention to you so you aren't quite so quick to start spending time with this guy at work. I don't know why women don't understand that men *ARE NOT INTERESTED IN YOU FOR JUST FRIENDSHIP! *Unless this guy is really unusual, he's after you sexually. He's playing a little game with you trying to get you to relax your defenses. Being cute, understanding, funny, a good listener etc, etc, and etc. Don't fall for it! If your husband is no longer what you want, ok. Then end your marriage and then you can find all the "friendly" guys you want. Oh, scratch that. They'll find you. Good luck with your choices. A lot is riding on how you choose to act with this guy. Be warned!


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## Thundarr

Kendall said:


> But I need a friend that I can just talk to. I don’t have any sisters *or close girl friends*.
> 
> Am I already in an emotional affair? I don’t think I am. I’ve never told my husband about Lee, because my husband doesn’t like to talk about much these days.
> 
> Please advise. Thank you.


There's your problem. Do you wonder why you can be great friends with a guy but not a girl? It's not because women are mean. It's because they don't want in your pants and therefore require you to actually be a good friend.

Opposite sex friends are okay sometimes unless that's all you have. Make friends with other women first so you know what friendship is. Until then it's probably not friendship at all which means there's sexual tension and motive.


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## ReGroup

Kendall said:


> My husband is a very good guy. I love him. And I want him to be my best friend. I've tried talking to him about the fact that we used to talk a lot, but don't any more. He makes excuses.
> 
> If the roles were reversed, I would make an honest effort to be to my husband what he needs me to be. The fact that he doesn't do the same hurts me.


He can't and shouldn't be your best friend.

He's your Man and Husband.

Find a female friend you can talk to if you want a best friend.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## 3putt

Kendall said:


> But if I keep it just at work conversation at lunch, many times within a group setting, is it wrong to have a guy friend that I like talking to?
> 
> If it is, then I'll end it. I don't want an affair.


Kendall, you already are in an affair....an emotional affair, which is nothing more than a PA that has yet to be consummated. You need to start looking for another job, and in the mean time, keep your distance and boundaries sky freakin' high. You're so close to making the biggest mistake of your life it's not even debatable.

I think you already know this though. Why else would you be here of all places?


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## Acabado

If you didn't think you are at risk you wouldn't consider to start this thread.
You know you are, a huge risk.
And you are bargaining the "rules", not the boundaires, the boundaire was already crossed, in your mind.
It's more than obvious you anticipates eveery encounter.
So yeah...
time to stay away... maybe time to put your foot down with your husband.

Find a female friend to talk about your interests.


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## Philat

Kendall, you are where my W was before she went full-bore into an EA that lasted for several years: feeling a lack of communication, nice guy at work, lots in common, etc. etc. Very red flag: you haven't told your H about him. You are as ready as you can be for an affair unless something happens. You need to do two things: 1) pull away from Lee (not necessarily totally yet, but no alone time); and 2) tell your H about him and what you are feeling. Many of us who have been victimized by their spouse's affair (especially EA) wish we could have had some kind of wake-up call early on. I certainly do.


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## verpin zal

You wrote: "I love my husband"

I wrote: "Try again."

Then:

One of my girlfriend's "friend" has been having an affair with a married man for a few weeks now.

The woman's "excuse" was "but he is unhappy with his marriage!"

I kindly asked my girlfriend to ask her firend if the wife of the man in question knew her husband was "that" unhappy in her marriage, to the extent that he decided to be with someone else while his wife was unaware.

She relayed as much to her friend and reported back with a "complete silence on her friend's part".

I said thanks. My girlfriend said nothing.

I'm past 30 who lives in an ultrapolis, my experience on a woman with at least one skanky BFF dictates that "that" woman tends to be skanky too solely by keeping company with a skank, but just this time I'm resisting + it has nothing to do with your issue at hand. It's just my opinion about womenfolk around me.

I know how this will play out. You'll have an affair and when caught, you'll tell your husband "it meant nothing".

If it meant nothing, why not have your affair in the open? Why hide it? Why seek advice?

PS: "Is it safe for me to continue talking to Lee in just an at-work, friendly manner like it’s been so far?"

This Lee person has enough friends with hairy legs, testicles and watching football with a mug of beer in hand. He is NOT your friend. He will not be.

I actually feel sorry for your husband.


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## yeah_right

Hey Kendall. How would you feel if your husband had a female friend named Lee at work? If she were a cute single gal who liked video games and ate lunch with your hubby every day? And they had sooo much in common. And if truth be known, he had a bit of a crush on her. You'd be fine with that, right?


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## distraughtfromtexas

What do you mean when you say he "asked you out?" Do you just mean he asked you to go with him, or he wanted to pay for your lunch? 

It is a very slippery slope. One day you're joking about innocent things and the next you progress without even thinking twice. It also sounds like you are attracted to him. 

Let me ask you, why not befriend the girls you work with? Why him? Do you want specifically male company? 

If you were getting your needs met at home, I might be inclined to say it could be an innocent friendship. But you aren't getting your needs met. So you need to be careful with men. 

I feel for you. I know what it's like to feel lonely and like you have no one to talk to even when your spouse comes home. I hope your husband wakes up. While you say you have no interest in an affair, you do have an interest in connecting with someone. It's only natural. If your husband won't be that person for you, maybe the time is right for a trial separation? Lord knows that's what I'd have done by now if we had no kids.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## PhillyGuy13

Kendall said:


> My husband is a very good guy. I love him. And I want him to be my best friend. I've tried talking to him about the fact that we used to talk a lot, but don't any more. He makes excuses.
> 
> If the roles were reversed, I would make an honest effort to be to my husband what he needs me to be. The fact that he doesn't do the same hurts me.


If he is a very good guy then don't do this to him.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## clipclop2

Yes, you are heading for an fair.

I understand why.

But please dont do it.

LOL. We should become best buds so we both avoid being stupid but get our need for depth of contact met. If only sex didn't seem to go hand-in-hand with depth of contact... And if only I didn't prefer men.



Look, tell your husband about this. Every detail. It might help him understand your need and the temptation. Plus, you need to be held accountable so you don't mess up. You are in a weak state and it wouldn't take a lot to go down the wrong road.

I had this chat with my husband in November. It helped.


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## 6301

Kendall.

No doubt he is a nice guy and even if he wasn't, he would still present himself as one. He's single. Single= on the prowl. 

Ask any single guy and they'll tell you the same thing and it doesn't matter if this is 2014 or 1014, some things never change.

He's already picked up the fact that you like him and enjoy his company. He knows your married but he also notices you have a vagina too. 

In these cases, he'll say and do anything to shine a light on himself to be just what your looking for and if he's smart, he'll take his time and wait for the right moment and strike and have you in his web with the flattery and sweet talk. 

Only after you went over the line will you get the "Oh $h!t what did I just do" moment and by then it's too late.

Either guilt or carelessness will get you caught and when that happens then you'll see that this guy is tarnished real bad and he will turn his back on you in a heartbeat and it will be you and you alone dancing to the music while your husband plays the fiddle and he could make you dance right out the door and your marriage.

Wake up while you still have your dignity intact and get away from this mess or expect misery.


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## Kendall

Philat said:


> Kendall, you are where my W was before she went full-bore into an EA that lasted for several years: feeling a lack of communication, nice guy at work, lots in common, etc. etc. Very red flag: you haven't told your H about him. You are as ready as you can be for an affair unless something happens. You need to do two things: 1) pull away from Lee (not necessarily totally yet, but no alone time); and 2) tell your H about him and what you are feeling. Many of us who have been victimized by their spouse's affair (especially EA) wish we could have had some kind of wake-up call early on. I certainly do.


Would it maybe be a good idea for me to have my husband (and Lee) read this thread?


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## illwill

Its good that you came here. It speaks well of how you see your marriage. Tell your hubby what you just told us. If he is not taking your concerns seriously then this will help.

Do this asap.

Please listen to us. Its rare we get to help someone before its too late.

You are on thr verge of destroying all that you love. The future will be forever damned. Broken dreams and hopes.

It is that serious. Have one last talk with the other guy and make it clear you will not be talking anymore. Be clear and quick. 

And never talk to him again.

Ill say it another way.

SHUT IT DOWN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

If you think we are being dramatic, take a look around here, at past threads, and you could see your future.

I do not want to see you back here in a year, in pain, wondering why you did not listen to us.


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## 3putt

Kendall, it's extraordinarily rare for someone like you to come here and ask for advice this early in the beginnings of an affair. I truly do hope you understand that what you are hearing is what we've all know to be true, but with the benefit of perfect 20/20 hindsight though. Please listen.

Like someone said above, you're on a VERY slippery slope right now. Back the hell up, girl.

If I were you, I would print your OP, and give it to your husband to read. It will do you both a world of good.


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## the guy

You will not like what you become if you take this any further ....just ask Mrs. the guy....

Tell your old man your done with his bull crap.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Philat

Kendall said:


> Would it maybe be a good idea for me to have my husband (and Lee) read this thread?


Yes, if you cannot get him to understand where you are coming from by talking to him yourself. FWIW, my wife really didn't get how hurt I was by her affair even years later until she read my threads.

ETA: Forget Lee--he doesn't need to know your feelings in this matter. Do not equate Lee with your husband.


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## distraughtfromtexas

clipclop2 said:


> Yes, you are heading for an fair.
> 
> I understand why.
> 
> But please dont do it.
> 
> LOL. We should become best buds so we both avoid being stupid but get our need for depth of contact met. If only sex didn't seem to go hand-in-hand with depth of contact... And if only I didn't prefer men.
> 
> 
> 
> Look, tell your husband about this. Every detail. It might help him understand your need and the temptation. Plus, you need to be held accountable so you don't mess up. You are in a weak state and it wouldn't take a lot to go down the wrong road.
> 
> I had this chat with my husband in November. It helped.


Can I be in on this buddy system, too? 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## ReGroup

Read it and let it sink in.

Dr. Shirley Glass - Psychology Today - NOT "Just Friends"
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## distraughtfromtexas

Kendall said:


> Would it maybe be a good idea for me to have my husband (and Lee) read this thread?


Husband: Yes.
Lee: absolutely not! I wouldn't make a big deal out of this to Lee. That would do more harm than good.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## clipclop2

I disagree about a separation if you are on the edge of a problem. Your H is there to help you stay faithful and, this issue is here to help you talk to your husband.

No separations if this guy is a threat to the relationship.

I separated but the temptation was squashed. It was temporary and situational.


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## Kendall

distraughtfromtexas said:


> What do you mean when you say he "asked you out?" Do you just mean he asked you to go with him, or he wanted to pay for your lunch?
> 
> It is a very slippery slope. One day you're joking about innocent things and the next you progress without even thinking twice. It also sounds like you are attracted to him.
> 
> Let me ask you, why not befriend the girls you work with? Why him? Do you want specifically male company?
> 
> If you were getting your needs met at home, I might be inclined to say it could be an innocent friendship. But you aren't getting your needs met. So you need to be careful with men.
> 
> I feel for you. I know what it's like to feel lonely and like you have no one to talk to even when your spouse comes home. I hope your husband wakes up. While you say you have no interest in an affair, you do have an interest in connecting with someone. It's only natural. If your husband won't be that person for you, maybe the time is right for a trial separation? Lord knows that's what I'd have done by now if we had no kids.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


No, he didn't offer to pay for lunch. My phrase "he asked me out" was just an off-the-cuff choice of words on my part. He just asked if I wanted to go out to Subway since the food in the cafe didn't look good.

Thank you for your insight.


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## huebnem

This is how my wife started her affair. Well, I think she was well on her way to being stocked up on talking buddies before we were even married.

Don't hide anything

Please do not go off and give reasons like "It is getting stale" or "I just needed an outlet" or "We have stuff in common"...if he is any man at all those things will set off red flags unless he tries to ignore it.


And for the love of all that is holy...do not cheat. If you can't be part of the relationship that you are currently in DO NOT just start another one...either get back into it or leave the right way.
Grab your relationship by the horns. Every person is different when it comes to opening up or realizing what is going on. Try different things to get his attention. If you REALLY do love him and you HONESTLY want it to work and last then you should not have any trouble putting effort into it. Where there is a will there is a way...


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## clipclop2

*Re: Re: Am I Headed for an Affair?*



distraughtfromtexas said:


> Can I be in on this buddy system, too?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Sure! More Depth! Less Filling!


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## the guy

Your old man is going to think your already phucking this guy... Telling him will side track this crap towards you and not him... Stay away from Lee and work on letting your old man go.

Maybe he sees a confident women not taking his sh!t instead of chick screwing around on him.

But that's just me... Hell my old lady tried talking to me and it did nothing... She should of bailed instead of screwing all those guys!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## clipclop2

*Re: Re: Am I Headed for an Affair?*



Kendall said:


> Would it maybe be a good idea for me to have my husband (and Lee) read this thread?


Lee is not a part of this discussion.


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## Kendall

huebnem said:


> This is how my wife started her affair. Well, I think she was well on her way to being stocked up on talking buddies before we were even married.
> 
> Don't hide anything
> 
> Please do not go off and give reasons like "It is getting stale" or "I just needed an outlet" or "We have stuff in common"...if he is any man at all those things will set off red flags unless he tries to ignore it.
> 
> 
> And for the love of all that is holy...do not cheat. If you can't be part of the relationship that you are currently in DO NOT just start another one...either get back into it or leave the right way.
> Grab your relationship by the horns. Every person is different when it comes to opening up or realizing what is going on. Try different things to get his attention. If you REALLY do love him and you HONESTLY want it to work and last then you should not have any trouble putting effort into it. Where there is a will there is a way...


I am totally committed to my husband. I will tell him about Lee and maybe have him read this thread. I want marriage counseling and a life-long marriage to my only husband.


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## WyshIknew

Kendall, are you absolutely sure you talked to your husband and told him how you feel?

I mean really properly, in man speak.

This forum is full of distraught men whose wives have had affairs and most/many of them have said something along the lines of "apparently she had told me how she was feeling, how she thought I was neglecting her, etc. etc."

"However I don't remember a thing about it, although I do remember some vague wittering about relationships while I was busy with something."


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## 3putt

Kendall said:


> Would it maybe be a good idea for me to have my husband (and Lee) read this thread?





distraughtfromtexas said:


> Husband: Yes.
> Lee: absolutely not! I wouldn't make a big deal out of this to Lee. That would do more harm than good.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Totally agree. The fact that you would even include Lee in this is quite unsettling. You are proving more and more you're way beyond the slippery slope and headed straight to somewhere you really don't want to be.

Print this off now and give it to your husband. And stay the hell AWAY from Lee.


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## distraughtfromtexas

Philat said:


> Kendall, you are where my W was before she went full-bore into an EA that lasted for several years: feeling a lack of communication, nice guy at work, lots in common, etc. etc. Very red flag: you haven't told your H about him. You are as ready as you can be for an affair unless something happens. You need to do two things: 1) pull away from Lee (not necessarily totally yet, but no alone time); and 2) tell your H about him and what you are feeling. Many of us who have been victimized by their spouse's affair (especially EA) wish we could have had some kind of wake-up call early on. I certainly do.


I totally agree with this.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## the guy

Ya Lee ain't got sh!t to do with the deal you made with your old man in front of friends and family.

This is about saving a marriage and making it healthy... So give your old man a shot... Let him go... He might take you up on the offer or he will fight like hell to keep you around
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## illwill

Kendall, no matter what, you can no longer claim ignorance. 

We are making it very clear for you. 

Oh, and dont send Lee here. If he is flirting with a married woman, he will smell blood in the water. And ill end up getting banned again.

This place is a tool for YOU. And maybe your hubby.


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## distraughtfromtexas

3putt said:


> Totally agree. The fact that you would even include Lee in this is quite unsettling. You are proving more and more you're way beyond the slippery slope and headed straight to somewhere you really don't want to be.
> 
> Print this off now and give it to your husband. And stay the hell AWAY from Lee.


Yes, I thought that, too. Kind of bizarre to want to justify anything to Lee. Why turn this into a soap opera when you don't have to?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## U.E. McGill

Quit work guy now. Men have two types of women friends. Ones they'd screw, and ones they wouldn't. Your work bud did a classic isolation-escalation move. Food sucks, let's go somewhere else. You're in the category of who he'd screw. 

Go to your husband and don't talk like a woman. Tell him bluntly and honestly "I need xxx from you. If you don't provide it this marriage won't survive"

Be assertive. Keep saying it until he agrees. Any objection he offers tell him "I see how you could feel that way" and say what you need again. 

You let your husband manipulate you. Stop. The EA is your 100% but don't sacrifice your needs. It's your job to tell him until he listens and complies or outright refuses. Then if you don't like the result, leave.


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## clipclop2

*Re: Re: Am I Headed for an Affair?*



the guy said:


> Your old man is going to think your already phucking this guy... Telling him will side track this crap towards you and not him... Stay away from Lee and work on letting your old man go.
> 
> Maybe he sees a confident women not taking his sh!t instead of chick screwing around on him.
> 
> But that's just me... Hell my old lady tried talking to me and it did nothing... She should of bailed instead of screwing all those guys!
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Are you saying not to talk to her husband? Your failure would be a lousy reason for her not to go to her life partner with this problem.

You should have listened instead of not. I'm afraid you sound more like a WH than a BH in terms of not getting it.

....

I don't think you, OP, should talk to Lee about why you are pulling back. He will get it.

Also, if you really like him, picture the damage you would do to him by allowing an inappropriate friendship. He would be reduced to a piece of garbage. That isnt nice to do to him.

Glad you are here.


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## Philat

illwill said:


> And ill end up getting banned again.


:rofl:


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## Kendall

3putt said:


> Totally agree. The fact that you would even include Lee in this is quite unsettling. You are proving more and more you're way beyond the slippery slope and headed straight to somewhere you really don't want to be.
> 
> Print this off now and give it to your husband. And stay the hell AWAY from Lee.


3,

I mentioned Lee only as a semi-exaggeration of the willingness on my part to tell Lee in no uncertain terms that our friendship is over.


----------



## illwill

Kendall said:


> I am totally committed to my husband. I will tell him about Lee and maybe have him read this thread. I want marriage counseling and a life-long marriage to my only husband.


Good. Now get to it!


----------



## Philat

Kendall said:


> I am totally committed to my husband. I will tell him about Lee and maybe have him read this thread. I want marriage counseling and a life-long marriage to my only husband.


The mere fact that you felt a need to come to a forum like this ought to tell your H something. You done good.


----------



## clipclop2

YOU ROCK KENDALL! :thumbup::thumbup::thumbup::thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:


----------



## the guy

I bet if you told Lee that your husband talks to much, I bet you to would have. A very quit lunch.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Kendall

clipclop2 said:


> Lee is not a part of this discussion.


OK, I get it. You're right.


----------



## PhillyGuy13

If you are looking to build a stronger marriage, a given is no contact with Lee. Nothing has happened with the guy where you need to quit your job. Be cordial and professional, but no one-on-one. Tell him "I don't want to give you the wrong idea. I'm married, love my husband, and fully committed to my marriage."

I suspect Lee is a player. Most single guys in late 20s are. I was. Some guys even make their mission to bed a married woman, and brag to friends. Will act, do, and say anything to get in your pants.

What do you try to talk to hubby about? Are you engaging him in subjects he is interested in? Tell him you are not satisfied with the attention that you are getting. Look, some guys just don't talk a lot. Can you engage him in other activities? Movies? Games? Tennis? Golf? Running?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## illwill

the guy said:


> Your old man is going to think your already phucking this guy... Telling him will side track this crap towards you and not him... Stay away from Lee and work on letting your old man go.
> 
> Maybe he sees a confident women not taking his sh!t instead of chick screwing around on him.
> 
> But that's just me... Hell my old lady tried talking to me and it did nothing... She should of bailed instead of screwing all those guys!
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Wow. That is awful advice. Just because you did not listen, does not mean he will make the same mistake.

I wish i had this small window to stop my ex wife's affair.


----------



## Philat

U.E. McGill said:


> Your work bud did a classic isolation-escalation move. Food sucks, let's go somewhere else. You're in the category of who he'd screw.


:iagree: Avoid alone time with Lee.


----------



## john1068

Kendall said:


> HI should also say he’s very attractive and single, and he doesn’t have a girlfriend right now.


This is a very interesting thing you've pointed out...you ARE married, Kendall. You've thought about this enough to determine, at least, that he's not attached and therefore wouldn't destroy HIS family if you stepped over the line. However, you MUST know that you'd destroy your own family if you did. Isn't the answer to the rest of your questions below self evident?


----------



## 3putt

Kendall said:


> 3,
> 
> I mentioned Lee only as a semi-exaggeration of the willingness on my part to tell Lee in no uncertain terms that our friendship is over.


Okay, that's awesome to hear. But you do understand where I was coming from, right? Now follow up by actually doing it and telling your husband about it. Oh, and sharpen your pencil and get to work on your resume. If you continue to hang around and work with this guy, it *will* lead to the depths of your own personal hell.

Bank on it.


----------



## thummper

Kendall said:


> No, he didn't offer to pay for lunch. My phrase "he asked me out" was just an off-the-cuff choice of words on my part. He just asked if I wanted to go out to Subway since the food in the cafe didn't look good.
> 
> Thank you for your insight.


So, Kendall, if he wanted to go to Subway, why didn't he just go? Why did he stay with you? Just to chat? Come on! Wake up and try and see what he's building up to. God, I can see what's going to happen and feel totally helpless. You're going to keep this guy as your friend no matter what...no matter who gets hurt. Keep it up. I predict we'll see you back in here later lamenting the end of your marriage and plaintively asking, "Why, oh why did this happen? How could I have been so blind and stupid?! I thought he just wanted to be my friend." Cue the tears. PLEEZE THINK WHAT YOU'RE DOING! I think everyone here can see what you're facing but you. We all just want to save you from some pretty bad consequences.


----------



## Kendall

PhillyGuy13 said:


> If you are looking to build a stronger marriage, a given is no contact with Lee. Nothing has happened with the guy where you need to quit your job. Be cordial and professional, but no one-on-one. Tell him "I don't want to give you the wrong idea. I'm married, love my husband, and fully committed to my marriage."
> 
> I suspect Lee is a player. Most single guys in late 20s are. I was. Some guys even make their mission to bed a married woman, and brag to friends. Will act, do, and say anything to get in your pants.
> 
> What do you try to talk to hubby about? Are you engaging him in subjects he is interested in? Tell him you are not satisfied with the attention that you are getting. Look, some guys just don't talk a lot. Can you engage him in other activities? Movies? Games? Tennis? Golf? Running?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


He reads a lot, which is solitary. He loves tv sports, but when I watch with him, he still doesn't talk much or want to explain what is happening in detail when I ask him.


----------



## 3putt

Kendall said:


> He reads a lot, which is solitary. He loves tv sports, but when I watch with him, he still doesn't talk much or want to explain what is happening in detail when I ask him.


Kendall, buy these books, and read them together after you show him all this. It will open both your eyes.

His Needs, Her Needs

Not "Just Friends": Rebuilding Trust and Recovering Your Sanity After Infidelity: Shirley P. Glass, Jean Coppock Staeheli: 9780743225502: Amazon.com: Books


----------



## Philat

Kendall said:


> He reads a lot, which is solitary. He loves tv sports, but when I watch with him, he still doesn't talk much or want to explain what is happening in detail when I ask him.


You mentioned marriage counseling earlier--sounds like a good idea. Nothing would justify your having an affair, but it sounds like you deserve more out of your marriage.


----------



## illwill

ing said:


> Don't worry about Lee!!
> 
> That is the problem. You are already including him at the same level as your husband elevating this co-worker to the same point.
> 
> It is your mind playing tricks on you. Your loving talking, being listened to and having your jokes laughed at. Your loving admiring gazes and looking forward to telling your stories and listening to his.
> 
> *Your right on the edge of the most horrendous thing you can ever do to your husband. You are right on the edge of the worst thing you can do to yourself. *
> 
> It is brilliant you are here now. This is the best thing you could have done. Honestly I would not tell your husband as even now this will cause him a lot of pain. No, you are not yet in an EA but you are considering it.
> 
> *What to do?*
> 
> *Find excuses not to have lunch together at work
> Don't discuss anything but work
> Do not go out for a coffee, icecream, lunch
> Do not respond to any emails or texts asking if something is wrong.*
> 
> You have already worked out this guy is single. He has nothing to lose by pursuing you. He does not care or is interested about you because if he did he would not be doing this knowing you are married.
> 
> I'll let you into a little secret. Men do not have women "friends"
> They either:
> Have shagged her
> Intend to shag her
> Are shagging her
> 
> Sorry to be so blunt but you seem like a good person. Don't fck that up for nothing.


I agree with most of your post. But, this is not the time for secrets. Her hubby will read this and realize he has to treat her like he is still trying to score.

He may be a little hurt by her words, but it will help him understand what is at risk.

That man will step his game up, and realize she would not have said anything if she truly wanted to cheat.


----------



## Kendall

thummper said:


> So, Kendall, if he wanted to go to Subway, why didn't he just go? Why did he stay with you? Just to chat? Come on! Wake up and try and see what he's building up to. God, I can see what's going to happen and feel totally helpless. You're going to keep this guy as your friend no matter what...no matter who gets hurt. Keep it up. I predict we'll see you back in here later lamenting the end of your marriage and plaintively asking, "Why, oh why did this happen? How could I have been so blind and stupid?! I thought he just wanted to be my friend." Cue the tears. PLEEZE THINK WHAT YOU'RE DOING! I think everyone here can see what you're facing but you. We all just want to save you from some pretty bad consequences.


thummper,

OK, I do get it now. I agree this guy is probably just after me. I appreciate the truthfulness here.

I will 100% no doubt end our friendship on Monday (our off-Friday is tomorrow).


----------



## ing

You need to both connect again. Hubby sounds like an introvert who gains energy from being quiet and alone. He may be overloaded outside the home with "input" of all kinds. 
Do you feel energized when you are with people?


----------



## ing

illwill said:


> I agree with most of your post. But, this is not the time for secrets. Her hubby will read this and realize he has to treat her like he is still trying to score.
> 
> He may be a little hurt by her words, but it will help him understand what is at risk.
> 
> That man will step his game up, and realize she would not have said anything if she truly wanted to cheat.


I have deleted the original post since I think it is not helpful to Wilson or Kendall because by the time I wrote it she had already acted!


----------



## MSP

Kendall said:


> And every time he just says something like “We’re fine” and blames his quietness on pressures of work and being tired.


Stress often leads to escapism and quietness in people. The problem with escapism is that it's a bandaid and the problem is there afterwards. So they escape again and around it goes. 

Your husband absolutely needs to find a solution to his work stress or a better way of coping with the pressure. This is imperative to your relationship. It won't happen overnight, but something has to start the ball rolling.

And both of you need same-sex friends. Good ones, too. Not ones who will pull your marriage apart with girl's nights clubbing or similar.


----------



## clipclop2

I don't tgink you need to paint Lee one way or another. It isn't about him, anyway.

It feels good to have a friend. It feels good that a guy might be interested in you. He is just being a guy.

This is all about you and your H.


----------



## ing

Kendall said:


> thummper,
> 
> OK, I do get it now. I agree this guy is probably just after me. I appreciate the truthfulness here.
> 
> I will 100% no doubt end our friendship on Monday (our off-Friday is tomorrow).


Just so you know.. 
He will attempt to guilt trip you into continuing this.
He will probably email you something slightly inappropriate or offer undying love. 
He will pull hurt faces OR He will act as though it is no big deal at the same time.
This will not end from him until you feel safe in your relationship again. He knows you are vulnerable.


----------



## Decorum

Kendall said:


> thummper,
> 
> OK, I do get it now. I agree this guy is probably just after me. I appreciate the truthfulness here.
> 
> I will 100% no doubt end our friendship on Monday (our off-Friday is tomorrow).


Good for you Kendall!

This may have been mentioned already but this ...


Kendall said:


> So yesterday it was just us two together in the cafeteria at work, and he said the food didn’t look good to him, and he asked me out for lunch at a restaurant. I told him I couldn’t go because I had to make up missed time earlier in the week, and had only 30 minutes for lunch. But that wasn’t true. The truth was, I really wanted to go with him, but I thought better of it. And then he ended up staying with me anyway and we had lunch in the cafeteria.


Is a classical move of seperating, isolating and upping the intamacy of the relationship.

He would continue to push the boundaries until a small kiss was just a small step away. Then his is in like flint.

From that moment on you will have devastated your husband, he just will not know it yet.

The pain in his eyes once he finds out will disturb your quiet moments for the rest of your life, because you have a consciences and you do care.

I am glad you have decided to protect yourself and your marriage.

Take care!


----------



## Philat

Kendall, here's another best-seller from the TAM library that might help you and your husband connect better.

The Five Love Languages: How to Express Heartfelt Commitment to Your Mate by Gary Chapman — Reviews, Discussion, Bookclubs, Lists


----------



## Kendall

3putt said:


> Okay, that's awesome to hear. But you do understand where I was coming from, right? Now follow up by actually doing it and telling your husband about it. Oh, and sharpen your pencil and get to work on your resume. If you continue to hang around and work with this guy, it *will* lead to the depths of your own personal hell.
> 
> Bank on it.


So you think I should pursue a job that would guarantee we would never see one another?


----------



## clipclop2

You would know better than us.

In my case, it wasn't necessary.

How much of a draw is this guy to you?


----------



## 3putt

MSP said:


> Stress often leads to escapism and quietness in people. The problem with escapism is that it's a bandaid and the problem is there afterwards. So they escape again and around it goes.
> 
> Your husband absolutely needs to find a solution to his work stress or a better way of coping with the pressure. This is imperative to your relationship. It won't happen overnight, but something has to start the ball rolling.
> 
> A massage table with soft, instrumental jazz in the background is a good way to make this come about. And a lot of "other" things as well. Trust me on this one.
> 
> *And both of you need same-sex friends. Good ones, too. Not ones who will pull your marriage apart with girl's nights clubbing or similar.*
> 
> This cannot be overstated enough.


----------



## MattMatt

Kendall said:


> No, he didn't offer to pay for lunch. My phrase "he asked me out" was just an off-the-cuff choice of words on my part. He just asked if I wanted to go out to Subway since the food in the cafe didn't look good.
> 
> Thank you for your insight.


If Subway looked better than the cafe to Lee, either he is a player or he is mad. Either way, get shot of him!


----------



## Philat

Kendall said:


> So you think I should pursue a job that would guarantee we would never see one another?


You don't need to think about this now. But if going forward you find yourself unable to control your feelings for Lee, then that would be the thing to do. If Lee were to continue to pursue you against your wishes you would report him for harassment.


----------



## clipclop2

My husband received hundreds of massages. He was still quiet. Escapist.

He has to recognize the issue, the need in her and address it. She can meet all of his needs in new and creative ways but it won't change him unless he wants to change to meet hers.

I hope he reads and tries to .understand .


----------



## illwill

Find other married couples to hang with. And stay away from people who cheat. The company you keep...

Join a book club with him. Marriage is work, but worth it.

And therapy has to be a absolute part of you two finding yourselves again.

You guys can do it!


----------



## 3putt

Kendall said:


> So you think I should pursue a job that would guarantee we would never see one another?


Absofreakin'lutely yes. You've become addicted to the chemicals in your brains being released from having your needs met by someone that isn't your husband. It does feel good, doesn't it? But just not talking to him won't cut it.

It's not at all unlike the addictive high you get from alcohol or drugs. The only way to break the addiction is to totally separate yourself from the source of the addiction. In your case, that is contact with Lee.


----------



## Thundarr

If he was a better player he would be going to subway and other places bringing her back lunch regularly or at the very least one of those big cookies.


----------



## Philat

3putt said:


> Absofreakin'lutely yes. You've become addicted to the chemicals in your brains being released from having your needs met by someone that isn't your husband. It does feel good, doesn't it? But just not talking to him won't cut it.
> 
> It's not at all unlike the addictive high you get from alcohol or drugs. The only way to break the addiction is to totally separate yourself from the source of the addiction. In your case, that is contact with Lee.


Seems kind of drastic at this point, 3putt, especially if Kendall likes her job. She's already determined to end the relationship with Lee. It doesn't seem like Kendall is hooked too deeply into Lee (if she were she'd be making all kinds of excuses to keep the relationship).


----------



## Kendall

clipclop2 said:


> You would know better than us.
> 
> In my case, it wasn't necessary.
> 
> How much of a draw is this guy to you?


He is no draw now that you all have opened my eyes. He's nothing but a threat to my husband's soul and being...which I cherish deeply...and our marriage.


----------



## 3putt

Philat said:


> Seems kind of drastic at this point, 3putt, especially if Kendall likes her job. She's already determined to end the relationship with Lee. It doesn't seem like Kendall is hooked too deeply into Lee (if she were she'd be making all kinds of excuses to keep the relationship).


Sorry, Philat, the fact that she is here asking these questions tells me she's gotten herself in way over her head. And, BTW, she *has* been asking questions about why should have to end it. That alone is enough for me to advise her to just get away from him and start working on what we've suggested. You know the old snowball effect as well as I do.

I say; why take that chance with SO much at stake? It's just not worth it.


----------



## clipclop2

3putt, she is looking at the whole situation.

Don't go over the top.

People who are capable of introspection ask questions. She is a good kid. Not every one who is tempted has zero self-control.


----------



## Philat

3putt said:


> I say; why take that chance with SO much at stake? It's just not worth it.


OK, fair enough. Seems like her eyes are open now, though.


----------



## illwill

Kendall said:


> He is no draw now that you all have opened my eyes. He's nothing but a threat to my husband's soul and being...which I cherish deeply...and our marriage.


Keep the job for now, just ignore him. He now represents He!! on earth. Keep that perspective and you will be fine.

And your hubby should help you with that, after you two talk.

And failing that, we will.


----------



## Decorum

Thundarr said:


> If he was a better player he would be going to subway and other places bringing her back lunch regularly or at the very least one of those big cookies.


He may just be a single guy who knows how to walk a relationship to intimacy, he does not have to be a player, but clearly he is comfortable pushing boundaries with a married woman.

But Thundar I am not disagreeing just supplementing the possibilities.

Take care!

ETA; I might be a bit slow here Thundarr it occures to me that you may have had your tongue firmly implanted in your cheek, good one!


----------



## 3putt

Philat said:


> OK, fair enough. Seems like her eyes are open now, though.


I certainly hope so, and I would much rather be over the top than on the bottom looking up wondering just how the hell this happened.

Boundaries. Keep em high and keep em strong.

That's just me though.


----------



## tom67

illwill said:


> Keep the job for now, just ignore him. He now represents He!! on earth. Keep that perspective and you will be fine.
> 
> And your hubby should help you with that, after you two talk.
> 
> And failing that, we will.


You should if he can, tell hubby to come to your work place for lunch.
Oh that will send a clear message to Lee and give h a chance to "c0ckbl0ck" so to speak.


----------



## thummper

Kendall said:


> He is no draw now that you all have opened my eyes. He's nothing but a threat to my husband's soul and being...which I cherish deeply...and our marriage.


:iagree: Hooray!!! Good girl, Kendall! :smthumbup: I think you just dodged a very large bullet!


----------



## clipclop2

There are a lot of people, young people in particular, that dont see issues with OS friends.

My H and I have had many discussions about this with our older daughter.


----------



## thummper

Decorum said:


> He may just be a single guy who knows how to walk a relationship to intimacy, he does not have to be a player, but *clearly he is comfortable pushing boundaries with a married woman.*
> Just out of curiosity I did a web search and discovered that there are actual sites giving advice on how to score with married women. The advice was very thorough. It went through the procedure of attracting and nailing them step by step. Apparently, married women are prime targets for illicit sex. Very sad!


----------



## Kendall

thummper said:


> :iagree: Hooray!!! Good girl, Kendall! :smthumbup: I think you just dodged a very large bullet!


Yes, thank you thummper. I have a great husband. We need to make changes, I know. And we will. But I know he loves me, and I know I love him.


----------



## Thundarr

Decorum said:


> He may just be a single guy who knows how to walk a relationship to intimacy, he does not have to be a player, but clearly he is comfortable pushing boundaries with a married woman.
> 
> But Thundar I am not disagreeing just supplementing the possibilities.
> 
> Take care!
> 
> ETA; I might be a bit slow here Thundarr it occures to me that you may have had your tongue firmly implanted in your cheek, good one!


It was tongue & cheek but there's a little sarcastic true in there. Cumulative "I'm thinking about you" things seems to be a commonality with successful *********s. As Thummper mentioned, it's kind of sad that married women are such targets. It says a lot about the rates of accomplishment.


----------



## phillybeffandswiss

I like that you came for help.
I like the suggestion of Marriage Counseling.

Personally, speaking from experience, I wouldn't show him the thread until you can lessen the blow. It may create more problems than help right now.


----------



## Plan 9 from OS

Kendall said:


> Yes, thank you thummper. I have a great husband. We need to make changes, I know. And we will. But I know he loves me, and I know I love him.


What makes your husband so great? You describe two very different people in this thread. By recounting actions, your husband sounds like he doesn't care to socialize with you much anymore - so much so that you can't even think of him as a best friend. Odd because most marriages I know of that are considered good are ones where the spouses ARE best friends.

Later on, you make your husband sound like this beautiful, awesome person in your own words. But I haven't seen any examples of how your husband is this beautiful soul. Lots of flowery words though...

I don't mean to put you on the spot or back you into a corner. OK, yes I do. You need to figure out - right now - what you really love about your husband. You two are too young to be already stuck in a rut where one or both of you are avoiding the other. How much time do the two of you actually spend together as real, actual quality time? How much time does he spend watching TV in a day? How much time devoted to playing video games??


----------



## 6301

Kendall said:


> Yes, thank you thummper. I have a great husband. We need to make changes, I know. And we will. But I know he loves me, and I know I love him.


 Then here's what you do. When he's sitting there watching the TV, get up, shut it off, look at your husband and make sure there's no other distraction and let him know in a way that he understands that you have needs that aren't being met and if he tries to change the subject, don't let him.

Make him aware that his way of not giving you the attention is hurting you and you want more from him even if you have to shout in his ear. It's a whole lot better than getting your ass in a sling with another man and if that happens then you can't blame you husbands actions, only yours.


----------



## Kendall

phillybeffandswiss said:


> I like that you came for help.
> I like the suggestion of Marriage Counseling.
> 
> Personally, speaking from experience, I wouldn't show him the thread until you can lessen the blow. It may create more problems than help right now.


Thank you so much.


----------



## phillybeffandswiss

Plan 9 from OS said:


> What makes your husband so great? You describe two very different people in this thread. By recounting actions, your husband sounds like he doesn't care to socialize with you much anymore - so much so that you can't even think of him as a best friend. Odd because most marriages I know of that are considered good are ones where the spouses ARE best friends.
> 
> Later on, you make your husband sound like this beautiful, awesome person in your own words. But I haven't seen any examples of how your husband is this beautiful soul. Lots of flowery words though...
> 
> I don't mean to put you on the spot or back you into a corner. OK, yes I do. You need to figure out - right now - what you really love about your husband. You two are too young to be already stuck in a rut where one or both of you are avoiding the other. How much time do the two of you actually spend together as real, actual quality time? How much time does he spend watching TV in a day? How much time devoted to playing video games??


You read it like I did and it would irk me, I know I am not her husband, to no end. In my situation, my wife cannot take back what I read. She has tried, but there are things that she can't change even with a reasonable explanation. Why? First impression also applies to words not just meeting someone the first time.


----------



## Kendall

Plan 9 from OS said:


> What makes your husband so great? You describe two very different people in this thread. By recounting actions, your husband sounds like he doesn't care to socialize with you much anymore - so much so that you can't even think of him as a best friend. Odd because most marriages I know of that are considered good are ones where the spouses ARE best friends.
> 
> Later on, you make your husband sound like this beautiful, awesome person in your own words. But I haven't seen any examples of how your husband is this beautiful soul. Lots of flowery words though...
> 
> I don't mean to put you on the spot or back you into a corner. OK, yes I do. You need to figure out - right now - what you really love about your husband. You two are too young to be already stuck in a rut where one or both of you are avoiding the other. How much time do the two of you actually spend together as real, actual quality time? How much time does he spend watching TV in a day? How much time devoted to playing video games??


I was referring to the favorable nature of my husband during our first 3 years of marriage...and I know we can be like that again...if he will agree to try.


----------



## Allen_A

thummper said:


> Just out of curiosity I did a web search and discovered that there are actual sites giving advice on how to score with married women. The advice was very thorough. It went through the procedure of attracting and nailing them step by step.


This surprises you? It's all over the www : 

How To Make Her Cheat On Her Boyfriend - YouTube

How to Keep Your Affair a Secret: 6 Steps (with Pictures)

How to Get a Man to Leave His Wife: 11 Steps (with Pictures)

How to Not Get Caught Cheating: 9 Steps (with Pictures) - wikiHow

Sleeping With A Married Woman: How You Can Have Sex With

This guy just wants into your pants Kendall. He's on the make.

Sorry to be crude, but if you want the input of a male, he wants into your pants.

Let's put it this way... if your husband was there, in the room, would he behave the way he's been behaving thus far?

I seriously doubt it.


----------



## illwill

tom67 said:


> you should if he can, tell hubby to come to your work place for lunch.
> Oh that will send a clear message to lee and give h a chance to "c0ckbl0ck" so to speak.


this is great advice.


----------



## Philat

thummper said:


> Decorum said:
> 
> 
> 
> He may just be a single guy who knows how to walk a relationship to intimacy, he does not have to be a player, but *clearly he is comfortable pushing boundaries with a married woman.*
> Just out of curiosity I did a web search and discovered that there are actual sites giving advice on how to score with married women. The advice was very thorough. It went through the procedure of attracting and nailing them step by step. Apparently, married women are prime targets for illicit sex. Very sad!
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah, plenty. here's a good example of the slime these sites produce:
> 
> Step 3 - Capitalize on a married womans deprived sex life. After a period of time all married people stop having sex and this is where we single young men come into play. People have to have sex, it is a necessity of life, so don't feel bad about having sex with a married woman, not only is it our right but it is what we were put on this earth to do. So get your favorite tight black shirt and cologne and lets hit the grocery store to find us some married women and watermelon.
> 
> ETA: married TAM women: doesn't this guy sound like a dream?
Click to expand...


----------



## 3putt

phillybeffandswiss said:


> You read it like I did and it would irk me, I know I am not her husband, to no end. In my situation, my wife cannot take back what I read. She has tried, but there are things that she can't change even with a reasonable explanation. Why? First impression also applies to words not just meeting someone the first time.


I would hope we all read it that way. But first things first, eh? 

Yeah, hubby has a *lot* of cleaning up to do on his side of the street if he wants to stay married to her. A LOT.


----------



## Kendall

Allen_A said:


> This surprises you? It's all over the www :
> 
> How To Make Her Cheat On Her Boyfriend - YouTube
> 
> How to Keep Your Affair a Secret: 6 Steps (with Pictures)
> 
> How to Get a Man to Leave His Wife: 11 Steps (with Pictures)
> 
> How to Not Get Caught Cheating: 9 Steps (with Pictures) - wikiHow
> 
> Sleeping With A Married Woman: How You Can Have Sex With
> 
> This guy just wants into your pants Kendall. He's on the make.
> 
> Sorry to be crude, but if you want the input of a male, he wants into your pants.
> 
> Let's put it this way... if your husband was there, in the room, would he behave the way he's been behaving thus far?
> 
> I seriously doubt it.


I know now that you're right. And I thank you.


----------



## Plan 9 from OS

phillybeffandswiss said:


> You read it like I did and it would irk me, I know I am not her husband, to no end. In my situation, my wife cannot take back what I read. She has tried, but there are things that she can't change even with a reasonable explanation. Why? First impression also applies to words not just meeting someone the first time.


I think most of us believe that your first instincts are normally the most correct/accurate feelings when dealing with an issue. In many cases, try to rationalize their way to the "desired outcome". In the OP's case, her first instinct is that her husband is failing miserably as a husband and lover. Later on, she needs to rationalize her initial instincts away so that her husband looks much better. She clearly has a number of problems with her husband. Better deal with them now.

OP, forget Lee or any other swinging d!ck coming down the pike pretending to be your friend. Deal with your sh!t at home. If your husband isn't pulling his weight in the relationship. Tell him straight up. Take the fvcking remote out of his hand and SHUT THE TV OFF! Wanna talk while he's playing video games? PULL THE FVCKING CORD OUT OF THE OUTLET! Don't you think you let this garbage fester too long already???


----------



## distraughtfromtexas

clipclop2 said:


> I don't tgink you need to paint Lee one way or another. It isn't about him, anyway.
> 
> It feels good to have a friend. It feels good that a guy might be interested in you. He is just being a guy.
> 
> This is all about you and your H.


I agree. He could be harmless. We are all jaded here. The point is that Kendall is too fragile right now. 

Kendall, what do you mean by "end our friendship?"
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## illwill

Kendall said:


> Yes, thank you thummper. I have a great husband. We need to make changes, I know. And we will. But I know he loves me, and I know I love him.


Then you are both indeed lucky. Print out this thread and keep it as a reminder. 

Your original post, your responses, and your conclusions are a great testament to your love.

I envy you.


----------



## Thundarr

Allen_A said:


> This surprises you? It's all over the www :
> 
> <<<<<<<< THE INFAMOUS LINKS >>>>>>>>​This guy just wants into your pants Kendall. He's on the make.
> 
> Sorry to be crude, but if you want the input of a male, he wants into your pants.
> 
> Let's put it this way... if your husband was there, in the room, would he behave the way he's been behaving thus far?
> 
> I seriously doubt it.


Allen_A, if you're married. Better delete you're search history.


----------



## distraughtfromtexas

Thundarr said:


> Allen_A, if you're married. Better delete you're search history.


LOL!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## clipclop2

Is it really necessary to post the links? They were on another thread recently, too. What is the point unless we are in the biz of driving traffic toward them.


----------



## Allen_A

Thundarr said:


> Allen_A, if you're married. Better delete you're search history.


I am good with it there.

But ya, I can certainly understand some spouse's over-reacting to that.

My wife is on the other end of the spectrum, which has it's ups and downs as well.

It's all good. Those who have nothing to hide, hide nothing.


----------



## Thundarr

clipclop2 said:


> Is it really necessary to post the links? They were on another thread recently, too. What is the point unless we are in the biz of driving traffic toward them.


Without links it's just someone saying it on a thread and easy to dismiss.


----------



## phillybeffandswiss

3putt said:


> I would hope we all read it that way. But first things first, eh?


Obviously, people didn't because some were telling her to show him the thread. Nope, I am not saying they were wrong, just that they read it differently than me. Heck, if we broke it down P9 and I may not agree.


----------



## clipclop2

And now they are in our faces on another thread. You can refer to the original post and not promote this kind of trash.


----------



## 3putt

phillybeffandswiss said:


> Obviously, people didn't because some were telling her to show him the thread. Nope, I am not saying they were wrong, just that they read it differently than me. Heck, if we broke it down P9 and I may not agree.


Are we agreeing or disagreeing here? LOL...not sure.



:scratchhead:


----------



## phillybeffandswiss

> She began nitpicking things about her husband...looking for reasons to be mad at him. That professor sure had charm...he was so nice...he thought she was really pretty and so very smart! And one night her husband who was tired and cranky seemed to just shut her out...and she still had that phone number...


Spot on.
You came here for help, but this is what happened to me and this is what I saw in your early posts. My wife never got to the sex point, but the words were dang hurtful. This is why I didn't see 3putt's "new job" post as over the top. 

A spouse cannot, I repeat CANNOT, compete against the "perfect affair partner." I am not absolving your husband of responsibility, but Lee is attractive, talks the amount you want, makes you laugh and he goes home. So, you never see how he fights, how he lives, how dirty he is or even if you actually fit in a relationship together. He is great because you have never encountered his flaws.


----------



## 3putt

phillybeffandswiss said:


> Spot on.
> You came here for help, but this is what happened to me and this is what I saw in your early posts. My wife never got to the sex point, but the words were dang hurtful. This is why I didn't see 3putt's "new job" post as over the top.
> 
> A spouse cannot, I repeat CANNOT, compete against the "perfect affair partner." I am not absolving your husband of responsibility, but Lee is attractive, talks the amount you want, makes you laugh and he goes home. So, you never see how he fights, how he lives, how dirty he is or even if you actually fit in a relationship together. He is great because you have never encountered his flaws.


Bingo.


----------



## OnTheRocks

clipclop2 said:


> And now they are in our faces on another thread. You can refer to the original post and not promote this kind of trash.


Give me break. Don't click the links if it triggers you.


----------



## johnAdams

Kendall, being in your husband's place 30 years ago, I ask you not to do this to him. You may think he does not care, you may think he is absorbed in his own world ignoring you, but you as his wife owe him the honesty of either breaking off your marriage or at least fully disclosing what is going on.

I painfully read my wife's post above. It still hurts more than you can imagine. My wife ask me to read it and offered to delete it if it bothered me.  It very much bothers me, but, if it saves you from making the same mistake it is worth it.


----------



## thummper

Mrs. John Adams said:


> it!
> 
> .
> *
> I told my husband what I had done...and he loved me so much he never let go. It has been 30 years...the scars still remain.* ...but NOTHING he is doing deserves a wife who cheats. It is the worst mistake you could ever make. Once you do it...you can never undo it.
> 
> 
> 
> *If you go to my profile you can read a letter I wrote to my husband this past November..*.yes Kendall...thirty years later we are still trying to overcome what I have done.


He showed true love in its most beautiful form. And the letter you wrote is a true testament to your love for him. I've probably said this before, but you two are an inspiration to a lot of people on this site.


----------



## clipclop2

*Re: Re: Am I Headed for an Affair?*



OnTheRocks said:


> Give me break. Don't click the links if it triggers you.


Duck off.


----------



## happi_g_more2

Its not often on here you get to talk WS prior to the deed. Im gonna say whats probably on most everyones mind. GROW THE **** UP!!!! You married him. So talk to him. You essentially have 2 options
1) Talk to him and try your best to work stuff out
2) Divorce him. 
Affairs should NEVER be an option. I dont really know what other advice you are expecting. Stick to my 2 option outline above and everything will work out for you, the guy you once loved and the guy "think" is so ****ing special because he "plays"....errrrrr...talks to you


----------



## illwill

thummper said:


> He showed true love in its most beautiful form. And the letter you wrote is a true testament to your love for him. I've probably said this before, but you two are an inspiration to a lot of people on this site.


Yep.


----------



## OnTheRocks

clipclop2 said:


> Duck off.


You should stay away from CWI, if you're that fragile. Seriously. There is heavy stuff here.


----------



## clipclop2

I'm not that fragile. I've been around here a long time.

I just question the motives of someone who posts these links in multiple threads.


----------



## happi_g_more2

clipclop2 said:


> I'm not that fragile. I've been around here a long time.
> 
> I just question the motives of someone who posts these links in multiple threads.


take it outside guys


----------



## weightlifter

Did not have time to read the whole thread.

VERY FEW women can detect the friending player.

ONE HALF the men who are nice to you are actively playing you to get into your pants. Emphasis on the word actively. meaning they are doing step 1 of "how to seduce a married woman" Google it!

Once they have you as a friend they will push into more and more inappropriate stuff eventually the goal is bedding you. YES really. These men are tragically common.


----------



## clipclop2

*Re: Re: Am I Headed for an Affair?*



happi_g_more2 said:


> take it outside guys


Wussies.


----------



## clipclop2

*Re: Re: Am I Headed for an Affair?*



weightlifter said:


> Did not have time to read the whole thread.
> 
> VERY FEW women can detect the friending player.


Not so. Naive women don't see it. But most women aren't naive. They may deliberately delude themselves however...


----------



## happi_g_more2

Mrs. John Adams said:


> I was naive...I married at 17.. The only man I had ever dated Was my husband.
> 
> Now..in this day and age you could be right...but thirty years ago many young women were naive...and I was certainly one of them.


Did you cheat on your husband?


----------



## OnTheRocks

clipclop2 said:


> Not so. Naive women don't see it. But most women aren't naive. They may deliberately delude themselves however...


Many (entitled) women accidentally (deliberately) delude themselves. IMO, of course.


----------



## adriana

Mrs. John Adams said:


> Kendall,
> I am going to tell you a story about a young woman, 28 years old, married 11 years, two kids and a dog. She loved her life, but she felt really left out sometimes. She was just a stay at home mom and she began to feel bad about herself. Her husband was working full time and going to school part time and he didn't have much time for her.
> She began to grow a bit resentful.
> Her husband loved her very much...and he knew she was unhappy and he wanted her to feel better. So he suggested she go back to school.
> This young woman enrolled in the local college. She got a scholarship and she excelled! She loved it!
> 
> The second semester she took a class. The professor noticed her when she walked into class. He flashed her a smile and she smiled back. During class, he asked questions...she always had the right answer. She talked about her husband and her kids. They became friendly and the discussions during class lingered after class for a few minutes. One day the professor grabbed her hand as she was leaving and put his phone number in her hand.
> 
> She put the phone number in her purse.
> 
> She told her husband all about the professor ...but she did not tell him about the phone number in her purse.
> 
> She began nitpicking things about her husband...looking for reasons to be mad at him. That professor sure had charm...he was so nice...he thought she was really pretty and so very smart! And one night her husband who was tired and cranky seemed to just shut her out...and she still had that phone number...
> 
> She called that professor...and they set up a lunch date. She lied to her husband. She told him she was going shopping. She met the professor in a parking lot. He of course was late. She could have gone home...but she waited. He showed up, flashed her a smile and said...sorry I am late. I need to run by my house for a minute. Just follow me and then jwe will go to lunch. Her head started spinning...she knew she should not follow him...this was not the plan...but she followed. The professor stopped at the red light and looked back at her in the rear view mirror...he could see the fear on her face. He opened the door and called back to her...it will be ok! She still followed.
> 
> You see Kendall...this changed my life forever. I did not listen to all the warnings my own heart was giving me. I went home with that man...and I gave to him what was a sacred thing only for my husband. And when we finished he said to me...you need to leave...I have to get ready for a date.
> 
> He had nothing to lose...he took another mans wife..a man he did not know.
> 
> I told my husband what I had done...and he loved me so much he never let go. It has been 30 years...the scars still remain. We have had a good life Kendall...but I would give anything...ANYTHING...if I could go back and undo what I have done.
> 
> Kendall...if you have any love and respect for your husband...if you have any self respect at all...please do not do what I did. Listen to the voice in your head that is telling you NO!
> Your husband is not perfect and he may be making big mistakes...but NOTHING he is doing deserves a wife who cheats. It is the worst mistake you could ever make. Once you do it...you can never undo it.
> 
> If you are unhappy in your marriage and you have no hope that it can be repaired...then divorce him. But do not cheat on him...
> 
> If you go to my profile you can read a letter I wrote to my husband this past November...yes Kendall...thirty years later we are still trying to overcome what I have done.



_"Sins cannot be undone, only forgiven."_

Igor Stravinsky


Words fail me to express what I'm feeling now. This is such a heartbreaking story.


----------



## clipclop2

*Re: Re: Am I Headed for an Affair?*



OnTheRocks said:


> Many (entitled) women accidentally (deliberately) delude themselves. IMO, of course.


For sure. People have a way of justifying things they want. Those are people to avoid. Anyone who believes their own bull is capable of anything.


----------



## happi_g_more2

clipclop2 said:


> For sure. People have a way of justifying things they want. Those are people to avoid. Anyone who believes their own bull is capable of anything.


I agree. I just wish people would come out and say it...talk about it like it is. This Mrs John Adams story. Im calling BS. There is 2 ways of telling that story. The way she did, and this way.

I was a stay at home mom/wife and my husband worked his ass off. I lost my self worth staying at home. I talked to my husband and he understood so we worked out a plan for me to go back to school. Yah!!!! My professor was fing hot so I ****ed him. When he dumped me, I went back to my husband. Thank god he didnt leave me. Now I spend the rest of my constantly convincing myself and him of this sob story. THE END!

Women like this should have sticky notes around their house, car and workplace. "Dont forget to not slip and land on another mans penis today"

Reading this **** makes me vomit. Naive?? Yeah, Horny is more like it


----------



## TheFlood117

Yeah, you're gonna cheat soon. Probably both sexually and emotionally. You're checking out. Marriage counseling and perhaps a week long "vacation" AKA- week long bang session is in order. Probably kinda like a second honeymoon. 

No kids. This should be easy. 

You guys are very young and sex and being intimate should be really your number 1 priority right. Now. You guys should be bangin' tell your sore on a daily basis. 

That's the issue here. Passion and lust. You guys had it once, you can have it again. 

Good luck.


----------



## Jasel

First you need to cut Lee out of your life period. The guy is just trying to get into your pants. And as a guy trust me, from what you're saying it's blatantly obvious that's what he is doing.

And I don't care if you have to beat him over the head, you need to drive home how serious this problem is to your husband. Tell him you've been attracted to other men who show you more attention than he does and you feel it's getting out of hand if you must. Hell tell him you're thinking about separating because he's not taking your marriage issues and what you're saying seriously.Whatever it takes to make him understand how serious this problem is.

But ya you're definitely in dangerous territory. Which you must know on some level if you felt the need to post here about it.


----------



## Horizon

Kendall, what do you think?


----------



## 86857

- You got to know a cute guy at work and you clicked. He's now an OM.
- If's he's not at the cafeteria at lunchtime you probably feel a little disappointed. If he is, your heart probably skips a beat. 
- You were secretly glad to hear he is single. 
- If you were single you would date him in an instant. 
- You have been comparing him to your H 
- You haven't told your H about lunching alone with OM. 
- You haven't excused yourself early to go back to work as 'you're so busy' when you and OM are left alone at the cafe. 
- You know that you are strongly attracted to him and are encouraging him. That's why he asked you to go to a restaurant with him & stayed with you anyway after you said no. 
- You knew posters wouldn't say, "It's fine. Go ahead and pursue this friendship."
- You don't like the thought of giving this EA up. It's an EA, you are attracted to him, encouraging him, having lunch alone with him and you haven't talked much if at all about him to your H. How would you feel if you found your H felt the same about an OW woman & was hanging out with her? Shocked? confused? broken-hearted?

It's very clear - to me anyway. Three choices:
(1) File for D and start dating OM. He sounds as if he wants to date you, or well. . . whatever. Maybe you two will end up getting married. Who knows. I wouldn't go for him myself - he's hitting on another man's wife.

(2) NC. Cool off the friendship, lunch at your desk. *It's going to be hard because you are already emotionally connected.* You will feel sad for a while, maybe longer. 
Tell your husband VERY FIRMLY that if he continues to ignore your concerns and doesn't go to MC then your marriage won't survive. If that doesn't work, at least you gave it a shot. You have no kids, you are young. You'll be fine. 

(3)Have an EA/PA. It will break your H's heart. He's not cheating - you checked. If you think your marriage is bad now. . . 

Well done for coming here when you realised it had gone too far.


----------



## Jellybeans

I only read the first post so if anything was added by OP, that could change my answer below but from the first post...

no, to me it does not seem like an EA. Sure, he's attractive and you work together but you aren't discussing your husband with him or loving feelings with him and vice versa. You recognized the attraction and so you told him you didn't want to go out to lunch with him. Good. Keep this way. Keep your relationship professional and that is IT.

I am a stickler for never sh!tting where you eat, i.e. never ever (especially cause you are married, duh), get involved with people at work. It's not good. 

That being said, I don't think your husband is taking you serious as far as your concerns go. You really should have a sit down with him and explain again that you are feeling lonely in the marriage and want more time together and to connect more.

I have seen it so many times, women telling t heir husbands that emotionally they aren't feeling the connection and men sort of brushing it off...until the resentment builds up and the ladies end up leaving. Tale as old as time. 

Idk why that is but it seems to happen that way a lot. 

Anytime a partner is telling their SO that they have concerns and the other brushes them off constantly, it's not a good thing for a relationship (and that isn't gender-specific)


----------



## Jellybeans

Kendall said:


> I mentioned Lee only as a semi-exaggeration of the willingness on my part to tell Lee in no uncertain terms that our friendship is over.


Ok, you have to work with this guy so I really wouldn't make it awkward with him. Why do you have to tell him your "friendship" is over. I sit even a friendship? You guys have a working relationship. Treat him as you would any colleague: cordial, polite, but do not go out of your way to build any sort of relationship outside of that. That is how I do with my colleagues. There is an understanding that we have one goal and it's to finish projects. 

I guess I don't understand this extreme stance. This is a person you work with so why would you want to make it weird? 

You are human. You are going to find people attractive in life. The key is not to act on it and work on your marriage. Together with your husband (he needs to help you work on it as a joint effort).


----------



## Jellybeans

WyshIknew said:


> This forum is full of distraught men whose wives have had affairs and most/many of them have said something along the lines of "apparently she had told me how she was feeling, how she thought I was neglecting her, etc. etc."


And THIS i what I was referring to in my post above. WE hear it over and over and over again: women telling their spouse they are concerned about their marriage and getting blanked/brushed off as if their concern means nothing! And then you hear later a husband say "Well ya know, she did tell me a lot that she was feeling bad and she did mention it a few times and she did mention counselling but I didn't want to go and now she's gone/wants to leave." So many of them never take it seriously until the lady's love bank is depleted.


----------



## Chaparral

There are many ways to wake up a husband that doesn't realize how close to disaster they are.

Tell your husband you are going to counseling to see if you can save your marriage by yourself.

Tell your husband you are going to your parents house for awhile. When he asks for how long say indefinitely. Tell him you may not be coming back. 

Look up the 180 and apply it. When he asks why you are treating him differently, be honest, tell him your marriage is hanging by a thread and he is doing absolutely nothing to fix it.

What we see here constantly is that people do not communicate. Yes you have told your husband things but he did not understand the message. Do not get revenge on him, make him face the fact there is a limit to your patience. Yu need to make things drastic enough that he is wanting to know what is going on and what happened.


----------



## sinnister

I blame your husband for the situation you are in.

Marriage is a two way street and when a spouse repeatedly communicates a need that goes ignored I feel zero sympathy for them.

None.

But OP you have to know Lee is playing you. Men have radar for unhappy women. Please don't think he is your friend. When he's telling you funny jokes, and listening to your every word about your 2 dogs, he's really thinking about whether or not he can get you to do butt secs.

It's true.


----------



## Jellybeans

Chaparral said:


> Tell your husband you are going to counseling to see if you can save your marriage by yourself.


Well, I agree with counselling but I disagree that One person alone can "save" a marriage. Marriage is a joint effort. One person cannot do all the lifting. Resentment is sure to build if it's one person carrying all the weight.

He has got to put in, too. Hopefully he does because if not, this will be another loveless marriage soon. Once a woman starts feeling taken for granted and like her husband doesn't care about her, it's really not good. (And this goes for men, too).


----------



## Philat

happi_g_more2 said:


> I agree. I just wish people would come out and say it...talk about it like it is. This Mrs John Adams story. Im calling BS. There is 2 ways of telling that story. The way she did, and this way.
> 
> I was a stay at home mom/wife and my husband worked his ass off. I lost my self worth staying at home. I talked to my husband and he understood so we worked out a plan for me to go back to school. Yah!!!! My professor was fing hot so I ****ed him. When he dumped me, I went back to my husband. Thank god he didnt leave me. Now I spend the rest of my constantly convincing myself and him of this sob story. THE END!
> 
> Women like this should have sticky notes around their house, car and workplace. "Dont forget to not slip and land on another mans penis today"
> 
> Reading this **** makes me vomit. Naive?? Yeah, Horny is more like it


Holy crap. No post on TAM has ever been more off the mark.


----------



## 86857

Mrs. John Adams said:


> I dont want your pity...I dont want you to agree with me. but give me the common courtesy of respect. Don't rewrite my story your way...you were not there. . .
> I was asked to share here. My intentions were to keep a young woman from ruining her life.


Gee Mrs JA, I guess being a WS sometimes you will get some backlash. But most BS on here appreciate to hear it from the other side. Keep posting. 

Off topic - you & H are STILL doing time? 30 years later? 
I was incredulous but you got me thinking. 
Will I ever forget what my WS did? 
He has been amazing (4 years since D-day) because I made his life hell for a long time - not deliberately - I just couldn't help it. We don't have children together, he's from another country and he's younger so he could have easily left. . . I'm still not sure why he didn't. I guess he must really love me. 
BUT. . . will it ever be the same as what it was before? 
I have to be honest. . . NOPE. I'm not trying to be mean, revengeful, sorry for myself, dramatic or whatever. 

Fact is I will never have that soft place to fall again, with him or anyone else, much as I would like to. . . I will never let myself - though I probably safely could with my xWS. See? Without thinking, I wrote 'probably'. It's automatic. I'm quite sure I would say the same even if I was in a new 'affair-free' marriage.

My point is that I don't feel that way by choice, it's just how it is. Something inside me changed forever. 

I thought 30 years since D-Day was ridiculous when I first read it. But now, having thought about it, I understand perfectly.

OP - take note.


----------



## Philat

Jellybeans said:


> And THIS i what I was referring to in my post above. WE hear it over and over and over again: women telling their spouse they are concerned about their marriage and getting blanked/brushed off as if their concern means nothing! And then you hear later a husband say "Well ya know, she did tell me a lot that she was feeling bad and she did mention it a few times and she did mention counselling but I didn't want to go and now she's gone/wants to leave." So many of them never take it seriously until the lady's love bank is depleted.


A previous poster used the term "man speak" to describe the way in which Kendall needs to express herself to her H. This means in a way that the man will understand and can react properly to. My W was not hesitant about saying that we needed to communicate more, but she did not make clear what kind of communication she meant. I took her at her word and tried to "communicate" more but it turned out not to be about the things she needed. This she found with another man.


----------



## Lostinthought61

Kendall 

you have received a lot of compelling and sound advice as well as some heart wrenching stories of reality...i say reality because what you perceive as real "feelings" about this guy is in fact lust, not love but lust, you are looking for something that is not really there, oh sure you could convince yourself of anything, because your mind is lying to you based on primal urges and sexual desires. So you don't have a perfect marriage, join the club....we will even throw in a t-shirt , but don't throw it away for some one who tells you your pretty and gives you attention because you don't get it at home. I challenge you to make plan and execute on that plan to bring love and communication back into your marriage, put 100% into that plan and when you succeed you can look back and be proud of yourself and the strengthen of your character, and if for some reason it just doesn't work then you leave the marriage knowing you were wiser and better person for staying above the fray.......trust me that other guy and guys like him will always be around...there never seems to be a shortage of them. But there is a shortage of character, of personal strengthen don't damage yours.


----------



## Jellybeans

happi_g_more2 said:


> I agree. I just wish people would come out and say it...talk about it like it is. This Mrs John Adams story. Im calling BS. There is 2 ways of telling that story. The way she did, and this way.
> 
> I was a stay at home mom/wife and my husband worked his ass off. I lost my self worth staying at home. I talked to my husband and he understood so we worked out a plan for me to go back to school. Yah!!!! My professor was fing hot so I ****ed him. When he dumped me, I went back to my husband. Thank god he didnt leave me. Now I spend the rest of my constantly convincing myself and him of this sob story. THE END!
> 
> Women like this should have sticky notes around their house, car and workplace. "Dont forget to not slip and land on another mans penis today"
> 
> Reading this **** makes me vomit. Naive?? Yeah, Horny is more like it


Wow. Angry much? Your post is really mean towards Mrs. John Adams and that is not cool.


----------



## Jellybeans

Philat said:


> A previous poster used the term "man speak" to describe the way in which Kendall needs to express herself to her H. This means in a way that the man will understand and can react properly to. My W was not hesitant about saying that we needed to communicate more, but she did not make clear what kind of communication she meant. I took her at her word and tried to "communicate" more but it turned out not to be about the things she needed. This she found with another man.


Expand on this, please. It will help a lot of womenfolk out to know what the "man speak" is.


----------



## Chaparral

Jellybeans said:


> Well, I agree with counselling but I disagree that One person alone can "save" a marriage. Marriage is a joint effort. One person cannot do all the lifting. Resentment is sure to build if it's one person carrying all the weight.
> 
> He has got to put in, too. Hopefully he does because if not, this will be another loveless marriage soon. Once a woman starts feeling taken for granted and like her husband doesn't care about her, it's really not good. (And this goes for men, too).


My point wasn't to actually do it. My point was to actually get the message across to a blithely unaware husband. The satisfaction needs to be knocked off his face, assuming he is really into the marriage in the first place. All of my suggestions were not to be taken literally but to communicate to her husband. The way she is approaching him is just water on a ducks back.


----------



## Philat

Jellybeans said:


> Expand on this, please. It will help a lot of womenfolk out to know what the "man speak" is.


In my case (probably typical) it was about sharing thoughts and feelings rather than information (I know, guys, cue Morris Albert). You want more communication? OK, here's what I did today and here's what's on our schedule for the rest of the week. What's that? You want me to listen to how your day went and what your joys and frustrations are? Without trying to solve your problems for you? And you want to hear mine? Why didn't you say so?


----------



## Jellybeans

Philat, that is good information. BUT, I tink a lot of women DO do that and still get brushed off. Therein, the problem lies. 

I know with my ex, I told him a million times and he simply did not care. I left. Later, I got the "I know you said it to me so many times.."

Oh you did, huh?


----------



## Philat

********** said:


> I thought 30 years since D-Day was ridiculous when I first read it. But now, having thought about it, I understand perfectly. Something very precious was lost.


This is why the Adams' story is so valuable to this forum.


----------



## Kendall

Mrs. John Adams said:


> Kendall,
> I am going to tell you a story about a young woman, 28 years old, married 11 years, two kids and a dog. She loved her life, but she felt really left out sometimes. She was just a stay at home mom and she began to feel bad about herself. Her husband was working full time and going to school part time and he didn't have much time for her.
> She began to grow a bit resentful.
> Her husband loved her very much...and he knew she was unhappy and he wanted her to feel better. So he suggested she go back to school.
> This young woman enrolled in the local college. She got a scholarship and she excelled! She loved it!
> 
> The second semester she took a class. The professor noticed her when she walked into class. He flashed her a smile and she smiled back. During class, he asked questions...she always had the right answer. She talked about her husband and her kids. They became friendly and the discussions during class lingered after class for a few minutes. One day the professor grabbed her hand as she was leaving and put his phone number in her hand.
> 
> She put the phone number in her purse.
> 
> She told her husband all about the professor ...but she did not tell him about the phone number in her purse.
> 
> She began nitpicking things about her husband...looking for reasons to be mad at him. That professor sure had charm...he was so nice...he thought she was really pretty and so very smart! And one night her husband who was tired and cranky seemed to just shut her out...and she still had that phone number...
> 
> She called that professor...and they set up a lunch date. She lied to her husband. She told him she was going shopping. She met the professor in a parking lot. He of course was late. She could have gone home...but she waited. He showed up, flashed her a smile and said...sorry I am late. I need to run by my house for a minute. Just follow me and then jwe will go to lunch. Her head started spinning...she knew she should not follow him...this was not the plan...but she followed. The professor stopped at the red light and looked back at her in the rear view mirror...he could see the fear on her face. He opened the door and called back to her...it will be ok! She still followed.
> 
> You see Kendall...this changed my life forever. I did not listen to all the warnings my own heart was giving me. I went home with that man...and I gave to him what was a sacred thing only for my husband. And when we finished he said to me...you need to leave...I have to get ready for a date.
> 
> He had nothing to lose...he took another mans wife..a man he did not know.
> 
> I told my husband what I had done...and he loved me so much he never let go. It has been 30 years...the scars still remain. We have had a good life Kendall...but I would give anything...ANYTHING...if I could go back and undo what I have done.
> 
> Kendall...if you have any love and respect for your husband...if you have any self respect at all...please do not do what I did. Listen to the voice in your head that is telling you NO!
> Your husband is not perfect and he may be making big mistakes...but NOTHING he is doing deserves a wife who cheats. It is the worst mistake you could ever make. Once you do it...you can never undo it.
> 
> If you are unhappy in your marriage and you have no hope that it can be repaired...then divorce him. But do not cheat on him...
> 
> If you go to my profile you can read a letter I wrote to my husband this past November...yes Kendall...thirty years later we are still trying to overcome what I have done.


Thank you so much Mrs. John Adams,

Upon advice from several posters here, I spent a lot of time last night reading other threads here. I was up till 3:00am this morning just reading several stories. And I am just so humbled that many of you who have been hurt by affairs are willing to help prevent that for my husband and I.

I'm not super smart, but I'm not dumb either. Yet I didn't see the path I was on. I guess I'm a lot more naive than I thought.

A lot of posts were made in this thread last night while I was reading other threads. I will read the new posts later today. I've got to run out for now. 

And tonight I will tell my husband about Lee. And maybe have him read this thread. I'm nervous. I've got a lot of time today to think of what to tell him.

Please keep me and him too in your thoughts and prayers today.


----------



## adriana

happi_g_more2 said:


> I agree. I just wish people would come out and say it...talk about it like it is. This Mrs John Adams story. Im calling BS. There is 2 ways of telling that story. The way she did, and this way.
> 
> I was a stay at home mom/wife and my husband worked his ass off. I lost my self worth staying at home. I talked to my husband and he understood so we worked out a plan for me to go back to school. Yah!!!! My professor was fing hot so I ****ed him. When he dumped me, I went back to my husband. Thank god he didnt leave me. Now I spend the rest of my constantly convincing myself and him of this sob story. THE END!
> 
> Women like this should have sticky notes around their house, car and workplace. "Dont forget to not slip and land on another mans penis today"
> 
> Reading this **** makes me vomit. Naive?? Yeah, Horny is more like it



You don't know any better than your standoffish ******* attitude, do you?


----------



## Allen_A

Kendall said:


> And tonight I will tell my husband about Lee. And maybe have him read this thread. I'm nervous. I've got a lot of time today to think of what to tell him.
> 
> Please keep me and him too in your thoughts and prayers today.


I think you are personalizing this "Lee" too much.

You just need to let your husband know YOU are in a bad spot and are entertaining male attention in general.

You can mention the guy if you want, but YOU are vulnerable.

My concern is if you go on too much specifically about Lee your husband may just think if he gets Lee out of the way then the problem is solved.

Lee is a problem for marriages in general. But there's nothing you can legally do about Lee looking for vulnerable married women to sexually exploit. It's all perfectly legal for him to act like a predator and to get away with it. Disgusting I know, but that's a fact.

It's best for you to address the problems you can control and get your husband to focus there.

I DO think it would be a good idea for your husband to show up at your workplace to send a message, but just don't let your husband think Lee is the only problem here.


----------



## hawx20

You want to fix your marriage but your husband doesnt seem to care. Tell him you want a divorce because you are unhappy and have THOUGHT about having an affair. If he knows you are serious and still does nothing, then he doesnt love you. Just make sure you go all the way if you have to.

Please do not have an affair. That instantly makes you the bad guy on so many levels. Sometimes people just need a good slap in the face. If you end up divorcing because he is not satisfying your needs, at least you can still walk with your head up high knowing you did all you could.

If you choose the affair, it will end badly for you. You may very end up in divorce with your head held low. Dont do it.


----------



## convert

Kendall, please don't have the affair.
I was like you husband as you describe.
you have to break through to him some how someway.
my wives affair change everything.
i started drinking more, i was suicidal, angry, paranoid. I trust no one now, although that may be somewhat good to a point.
It will change him and you and not for the good


----------



## Allen_A

convert said:


> Kendall, please don't have the affair.
> I was like you husband as you describe.
> you have to break through to him some how someway.
> my wives affair change everything.
> i started drinking more, i was suicidal, angry, paranoid. I trust no one now, although that may be somewhat good to a point.
> It will change him and you and not for the good


Yup. Infidelity does not just change your behavior, it' changes who you are... a permanent alteration.

No doubt about it.


----------



## sinnister

Kendall said:


> Thank you so much Mrs. John Adams,
> 
> I'm not super smart, but I'm not dumb either. Yet I didn't see the path I was on. *I guess I'm a lot more naive than I thought.*
> QUOTE]
> 
> No Kendall not naive. Human.
> 
> You are vulnerable due to neglect and you have the presense of mind to seek other opinions before it reached a point you could not come back from.
> 
> That's not naive. That's actually quite redeeming.


----------



## clipclop2

Allen raises a good point. Lee exists because of an unmet need, but it could be anyone. And if your husband doesn't understand this, there will probably more Lees in your future.

IOW, there is nothing special about Lee. Any guy who provides that kind of attention is a potential temptation. He can be ugly as sin, married and divorced 5 times, living at home with his mommy and at the right time, even that dork can start to look good.

Since your husband used to meet your needs in this area, if he wasn't just doing it to get you to marry him, he can do it again. Hopefully, he doesn't subscribe to the idea that once you get married you don't have to continue trying to win your spouse. Dating should never end.


----------



## clipclop2

hawx20 said:


> You want to fix your marriage but your husband doesnt seem to care. Tell him you want a divorce because you are unhappy and have THOUGHT about having an affair. If he knows you are serious and still does nothing, then he doesnt love you. Just make sure you go all the way if you have to.


Hawx, that isn't necessarily the truth.

Threatening divorce over this is a real breach of trust. Marriages will be tested many times and this is just a test.

If he doesn't address the need, it might not mean that he doesn't love her. It might mean that he doesn't understand or simply cannot appreciate how deeply this void impacts her.

The good news is that if he doesn't understand, we can provide her with information to share with him. But at that point, it is up to him to be willing to accept what she says is a need is truly a need, and to change any underlying belief systems that might prevent him from addressing the issue.


----------



## 86857

Kendall, for what it's worth do NOT tell your husband about Lee. 

I would almost never say don't tell your husband but your case is unusual and exceptional. 

You got tempted. Happens to most spouses at some stage I would say. But you DIDN'T go there. You even came on here.

Remember your husband isn't in YOUR head. He won't see the Lee thing the way you do. As another poster said, he will focus on Lee, the man you might have had an affair with and ironically YOU will be the one who has to start making an effort in the marriage which doesn't address the problem at all. It makes it worse in fact. 

You may sow a seed of doubt in his mind that will taint your marriage forever. He may even start hanging with women at his work and feel he has every right to because no matter how you put it he will be angry that you were tempted, even in a small way by another man. 

Betrayal is a HUGE thing for the BS. Read Mrs John Adams post again. So even the thought that you 'might' have gone there will be hard for him to live with. 

Just tell him VERY firmly as I said before that your marriage needs fixing. 

Telling him about Lee may make that impossible.


----------



## 1812overture

Kendall said:


> This has been the norm for about the past 2 years.
> 
> I’ve talked to him several times about this.


Several times over two years, to me, is insufficient to get through to him that you are unhappy. If you file for divorce, and he says he was blind-sided, I would agree with his take, and I've heard the story from _you_.

For a very minor, but possibly helpful suggestion -- what's he reading? Ask him what he's reading, what he likes about it. Read the same thing. Talk to him abut what you both are reading or have just read. 

I you do that in conjunction with a twice-weekly conversation that you don't like what's missing and you want to get it back, it's both effort on your part, and a demand for effort on his part.


----------



## kristin2349

********** said:


> Kendall, for what it's worth do NOT tell your husband about Lee.
> 
> I would almost never say don't tell your husband but your case is unusual and exceptional.
> 
> You got tempted like many. Happens to most spouses at some stage I would say. But you DIDN'T go there. You even came on here.
> 
> Remember your husband isn't in YOUR head. He won't see this the way you do.
> 
> You may sow a seed of doubt in his mind that will taint your marriage forever. He may even start hanging with women at his work and feel he has every right to because no matter how you put it he will be angry that you were tempted, even in a small way by another man.
> 
> *Betrayal is a HUGE thing for the BS. Read Mrs John Adams post again. So even the thought that you 'might' have gone there will be hard for him to live with. *
> 
> Just tell him VERY firmly as I said before that your marriage needs fixing.
> 
> Telling him about Lee may make that impossible.


You've been warned it all begins with that ego fuel you are getting. The first lie you heard yourself say. You know where you're going is the wrong way or you wouldn't be here. He's in the same house not off to war. Find a way to talk to him. Find out why he's withdrawn (that's loving and constructive ). Dig deep for the man you married. Don't go the wrong way down this one way road. You aren't thinking of the fallout! The gossip, how your family and friends and coworkers will see it... 

You aren't thinking of the collateral damage. It will unravel so quickly. It will scar you both forever.


----------



## southern wife

Kendall, we'll be waiting to hear the outcome of the discussion with your husband. 

Have you thought about printing your original post and taping it to the TV? That will get his attention.


----------



## convert

********** said:


> Kendall, for what it's worth do NOT tell your husband about Lee.
> 
> I would almost never say don't tell your husband but your case is unusual and exceptional.
> 
> You got tempted. Happens to most spouses at some stage I would say. But you DIDN'T go there. You even came on here.
> 
> Remember your husband isn't in YOUR head. He won't see the Lee thing the way you do. As another poster said, he will focus on Lee, the man you might have had an affair with and ironically YOU will be the one who has to start making an effort in the marriage which doesn't address the problem at all. It makes it worse in fact.
> 
> You may sow a seed of doubt in his mind that will taint your marriage forever. He may even start hanging with women at his work and feel he has every right to because no matter how you put it he will be angry that you were tempted, even in a small way by another man.
> 
> Betrayal is a HUGE thing for the BS. Read Mrs John Adams post again. So even the thought that you 'might' have gone there will be hard for him to live with.
> 
> Just tell him VERY firmly as I said before that your marriage needs fixing.
> 
> Telling him about Lee may make that impossible.


I do not know, It maybe the 2x4 he needs to get him on track. Knowing another man is interested in his wife.
I guess being a BS, my prospective - I would at least want to try and put a stop to any affair.
I can see your point he will be concentrating on Lee versus the marriage. but he may start working on the marriage.


----------



## 6301

Allen_A said:


> This surprises you? It's all over the www :
> 
> How To Make Her Cheat On Her Boyfriend - YouTube
> 
> How to Keep Your Affair a Secret: 6 Steps (with Pictures)
> 
> How to Get a Man to Leave His Wife: 11 Steps (with Pictures)
> 
> How to Not Get Caught Cheating: 9 Steps (with Pictures) - wikiHow
> 
> Sleeping With A Married Woman: How You Can Have Sex With
> 
> This guy just wants into your pants Kendall. He's on the make.
> 
> Sorry to be crude, but if you want the input of a male, he wants into your pants.
> 
> Let's put it this way... if your husband was there, in the room, would he behave the way he's been behaving thus far?
> 
> I seriously doubt it.


 Someone should write another book titled "How to remove buckshot from your ass when you get caught messing with a married woman."

Or another titled "How to dodge a oncoming car with a pissed off husband at the wheel." 

Or the best one. "How to live with yourself after you destroyed a family."


----------



## DarkHoly

Tell your husband right now so you can destroy this together. 

Anything less and we'll see you here again after you've made stupid decisions you already know you're going to make.


----------



## clipclop2

Kendall, Would you do me a favor? Would you go back to your first post and add an edit to tell all of the new people to the thread that you have taken the good advice from the board and are not going to continue to talk to Lee because you will use this experience as an opportunity to address the problems in your marriage with your husband?

Maybe we can reduce or eliminate the late-comers advising you not to cheat.

RE telling your husband... if the two of you go to church, discussing this with a church elder might be helpful. Having another guy help him see that this is an opportunity to address an issue before it becomes a crisis, and one that if he handles it correctly, will make him an even greater man in your eyes, might lessen any initial ALPHA response and, increase the chances of him taking you seriously.

If not, there are plenty of men here who can help in this respect.

But someone from home would be best.


----------



## DarkHoly

adriana said:


> You don't know any better than your standoffish ******* attitude, do you?


I disagree with his post too, but why do you use the term "*******"?


----------



## brokeneric

Mrs. John Adams said:


> Telling a story ...writing your story...is a very hard thing to do. It reopens wounds and brings memories of what you have done back to the forefront of your mind. Reading your wifes story makes the whole thing come back to life.
> 
> I don't want your pity...I don't want you to agree with me... but give me the common courtesy of respect. Don't rewrite my story your way...you were not there.
> 
> I was asked to share here. My intentions were to keep a young woman from ruining her life. As I wrote, I wept. I cried for innocence lost...one I can never reclaim. I cried for a man that has suffered by my own actions for thirty years.
> 
> If you came here looking for a fight...you wont get one. I am defeated.
> 
> If you came here looking for entertainment...you have had your fun.
> 
> If you came here looking for help...I hope I was able to give you that.
> 
> If you came here because you are hurting...I have been your punching bag.
> 
> 
> I hope you have a nice day.


People go after WS on a forum coz they couldn't do the same to their wayward spouse. That's the sad truth.


----------



## Gabriel

Allen_A said:


> I think you are personalizing this "Lee" too much.
> 
> You just need to let your husband know YOU are in a bad spot and are entertaining male attention in general.
> 
> You can mention the guy if you want, but YOU are vulnerable.
> 
> My concern is if you go on too much specifically about Lee your husband may just think if he gets Lee out of the way then the problem is solved.
> 
> Lee is a problem for marriages in general. But there's nothing you can legally do about Lee looking for vulnerable married women to sexually exploit. It's all perfectly legal for him to act like a predator and to get away with it. Disgusting I know, but that's a fact.
> 
> It's best for you to address the problems you can control and get your husband to focus there.
> 
> I DO think it would be a good idea for your husband to show up at your workplace to send a message, but just don't let your husband think Lee is the only problem here.


:iagree::iagree:

Don't make this about Lee. This is about you and your husband.


----------



## Philat

I can see both sides of the tell about Lee/don't tell about Lee argument. I fall on the side of tell because it seems Kendall's H needs a real slap in the face to see what's going on, as convert said. A vague reference to non-specific "male attention" might not do the trick. Kendall just has to be sure she makes clear that as yet nothing (too) inappropriate has actually occurred IRL with Lee.


----------



## Fenix

Mrs. John Adams said:


> Yes **********...love your name by the way...one of my favorite Cat stevens songs!..I digress.
> 
> You can move on and life can be wonderful but you can never undo it. I cannot sing my husbands praises enough. He is simply amazing.



Yes, he is.


----------



## Fenix

brokeneric said:


> People go after WS on a forum coz they couldn't do the same to their wayward spouse. That's the sad truth.


A lot of them deserve it. *shrug*

Mrs. JA redeemed herself and is not a serial cheater. People can make mistakes. Owning them and moving forward in an honorable manner without cheating goes a long way toward reaching forgiveness from a BS.


----------



## kristin2349

happi_g_more2 said:


> I agree. I just wish people would come out and say it...talk about it like it is. This Mrs John Adams story. Im calling BS. There is 2 ways of telling that story. The way she did, and this way.
> 
> I was a stay at home mom/wife and my husband worked his ass off. I lost my self worth staying at home. I talked to my husband and he understood so we worked out a plan for me to go back to school. Yah!!!! My professor was fing hot so I ****ed him. When he dumped me, I went back to my husband. Thank god he didnt leave me. Now I spend the rest of my constantly convincing myself and him of this sob story. THE END!
> 
> Women like this should have sticky notes around their house, car and workplace. "Dont forget to not slip and land on another mans penis today"
> 
> Reading this **** makes me vomit. Naive?? Yeah, Horny is more like it


What part of that was not just an attack? She posted something honest showed people an ugly scar she could keep quiet. 

So you attack her for offering the ugly truth of the aftermath. If it makes you sick ignore it. But don't get malicious. It's counterproductive. Her experience has so much value. She could go on about her day and act like it didn't happen. She's here helping someone who CAN stop it NOW!


----------



## sinnister

1812overture said:


> Several times over two years, to me, is insufficient to get through to him that you are unhappy. If you file for divorce, and he says he was blind-sided, I would agree with his take, and I've heard the story from _you_.
> 
> For a very minor, but possibly helpful suggestion -- what's he reading? Ask him what he's reading, what he likes about it. Read the same thing. Talk to him abut what you both are reading or have just read.
> 
> I you do that in conjunction with a twice-weekly conversation that you don't like what's missing and you want to get it back, it's both effort on your part, and a demand for effort on his part.


I disagree. If you love your wife and she tells you she is unhappy about something you probably should have been doing anyways, you shouldn't be blindsided by her willingness to explore someone else who can meet her needs.

The man is not a child. He shouldn't have to be guided through it. Telling him more than once what is wrong and what she needs is plenty. She shouldnt have to speak to him 2 times per week just to get what she wants. 

Quite frankly that would annoy the crap out of any woman and make the man feel like he's being nagged.


----------



## vellocet

Kendall said:


> So yesterday it was just us two together in the cafeteria at work, and he said the food didn’t look good to him, and he asked me out for lunch at a restaurant. I told him I couldn’t go because I had to make up missed time earlier in the week, and had only 30 minutes for lunch.


Wrong answer. The answer should have been, "well as a married woman that probably wouldn't sit well with my husband"




> Is it safe for me to continue talking to Lee in just an at-work, friendly manner like it’s been so far?


No, because you already wanted to go to dinner with him.




> But I need a friend that I can just talk to.



And that is fine, but that friend can NO LONGER be this guy. If you think you can now be this guy's friend when its obvious you want him, then you will be betraying your husband.

This guy can no longer be a friend.



> I’ve never told my husband about Lee, because my husband doesn’t like to talk about much these days.


Oh I think he'd like to talk about this issue. Before you REALLY cross the line you need to sit your husband down and tell him about this Lee guy and that you wanted to go to dinner with him. If that doesn't open his eyes, then you may need to think about divorce if you can't handle the way things are without running to another man.

And if you end up in an affair, then forget being able to lay this on your husband. Once you cheat, the real burden of the state of the marriage is now on you.


----------



## vellocet

Kendall said:


> But if I keep it just at work conversation at lunch, many times within a group setting, is it wrong to have a guy friend that I like talking to?


No, as long as attraction isn't an issue for you. But you can no longer be friends with this guy without disrespecting your husband.


----------



## clipclop2

My experience is that men can be blindsided even when they have been told multiple times of an issue by their wives.

If they don't see/feel the problem themselves, they don't believe there is a problem. If they don't believe it exists, they placate at best, totally ignore at worst, their wife's concern. 

Yeah, in an ideal world a guy would listen and take this stuff seriously. He'd want to. He'd want to have the best marriage he can have.

But if he's happy and can't understand why she'd be unhappy, it is just as likely that he'll pass the request/complaint/need off as something hormonal, transient, or even silly. If he ignores it long enough, it will surely go away.

Walk Away Wives are created by this behavior.

Past that, MOST people, regardless of whether they are meeting their spouse's needs believe that their spouse won't cheat. They promised not to cheat. So while they can kinda possibly see why they might have been tempted, they are still totally blindsided when their spouse actually takes the plunge.

My belief is that the problem is one of education. A man ignoring the issue isn't a sign that he's uncaring or unloving. It is that he just doesn't understand the big picture.

This guy has a real opportunity because she's willing to share this story with him. They can talk about His Needs, Her Needs, 5 love languages, ways to engage and share interests, possibly develop new shared interests, step up the love life a bit, and come to an understanding that a marriage doesn't survive without proper care and feeding.

It also should serve as a reminder that it only takes one vote to dissolve/wreck/total/kill/destroy a marriage. They both have that power. 

Protect what you love.


----------



## johnAdams

clipclop2 said:


> But if he's happy and can't understand why she'd be unhappy, it is just as likely that he'll pass the request/complaint/need off as something hormonal, transient, or even silly. If he ignores it long enough, it will surely go away.
> 
> Protect what you love.


This resonated with me. I was certainly guilty of feeling this way.


----------



## WyshIknew

Philat said:


> In my case (probably typical) it was about sharing thoughts and feelings rather than information (I know, guys, cue Morris Albert). You want more communication? OK, here's what I did today and here's what's on our schedule for the rest of the week. What's that? You want me to listen to how your day went and what your joys and frustrations are? Without trying to solve your problems for you? And you want to hear mine? Why didn't you say so?


This is one of the single best things I have learned in my marriage.

Just listen to her.

I may not always understand what she is saying but she just seems to love unloading on me. Sometimes her idea of communication isn't communication at all, it's just listening, giving her some time and maybe uttering the odd "really", "never" "and then what did he say?" etc.

And for fricks sake don't try and fix it, she just seems to get frustrated when I do that. It is difficult as I am a fixer. I 'fix' electronic and mechanical things as a career. I have to bite my tongue as so often I want to say "Well what I think you should do is xyz."

Perhaps this is all OP is missing?


----------



## johnAdams

Mrs. John Adams said:


> But you are right my friend. Listening is the key.


What did you say?
:scratchhead:


----------



## WyshIknew

johnAdams said:


> What did you say?
> :scratchhead:


:lol:


----------



## daveca

To the OP: I hear a lot about office romances and can't figure that out. Why does a conversation have to lead to bed? My suggestion is get your husband in bed more often. When two people are in bed there are no distractions. Do your talking after sex. He's right there. No TV. No computer. 

You mentioned he's very attractive and single. Obviously you're already thinking about having an affair. One point to remember. If he dumps you later on and your co-workers know you had an affair you'll be the office tramp. Then there will be plenty of conversation and attention, also.


----------



## illwill

I think she gets it, guys. The horse is dead.


----------



## Mrs_Mathias

Kendall, the biggest eye opener for me was to make a list of my emotional needs from Dr. Harley's book and then view them as weaknesses instead. Those are the things I am vulnerable to. I have to look at each one and identify how it would look/feel for someone outside the marriage to try to meet. And for me, that is easily done. My primary needs are not truly "romantic" or sexual in any way. It was incredibly easy for someone else to start filling those a little but at a time and not seem threatening, or anything more than a "friendship".

It is vital that you are self-aware enough to continue to police yourself and your interactions with others. You're very lucky/smart to have caught this already. I wish I had. I hope you and your husband can turn things around and rediscover the joy and special bond in your companionship.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## 3putt

johnAdams said:


> What did you say?
> :scratchhead:


lulz


----------



## WyshIknew

Sorry about that Kendall, I just thought that interaction between the two Adams's was both sweet and funny.

I was probably your husband 20 years ago, I however married quite late.
I was set in my ways, I had been taught that a man deals with his own crap, I was a 'stuffer' a 'bottler upper' and tended to just do what I thought was best.
I worked a lot, and when I came home tired the last thing I wanted to hear was my wife complaining about the children, neighbours, her awful day etc. I used to just brush her off.

It took a lot of learning to get to where I am today.

Advice?

Difficult as every person and situation is different. But I would sit him down, somewhere quiet away from his 'stuff' and just tell him *exactly* what you would like from him.

Spell out word for word what you will do if things don't improve. Insist on more one to one time with him, just talking, taking a walk, cooking together, whatever.

Later, get him to tell you what he would like. It would be fair to give him some time to respond.

When he does something 'good' that you've asked for, reward him. You've always got the obvious reward, but simply telling him how great whatever he did was and how good it made you feel is just as good.


----------



## 1812overture

sinnister said:


> I disagree. If you love your wife and she tells you she is unhappy about something you probably should have been doing anyways, you shouldn't be blindsided by her willingness to explore someone else who can meet her needs.
> 
> The man is not a child. He shouldn't have to be guided through it. Telling him more than once what is wrong and what she needs is plenty. She shouldnt have to speak to him 2 times per week just to get what she wants.
> 
> Quite frankly that would annoy the crap out of any woman and make the man feel like he's being nagged.


Perhaps he has done things differently, but his wife has not noticed. Perhaps he changed after the first talk. Then when he got the second talk he changed -- but in doing so changed right back to what he had been doing originally. Then at the third talk, he changed in a yet different direction, but his wife didn't notice. Then at the fourth talk he changed back to his original behavior. That's four changes in response to "mentions" over two years, but neither change was right. 

I'll bet they've talked more about chores (garage, mowing, shoveling, spring cleaning, pets to the vet, overdrawn on the bank account) more often. 

If it 's a big hairy deal, she should treat it like a big hairy deal.


----------



## happi_g_more2

Boy, Im taking an ass beating here . 

Unlike some others on here (adriana...*******, wha???), I wasn't personally attacking MJA. Im simply stating that Im tired of reading WW stories like they are a chapter out of the Bridges of ******* County. As if it its a story of over coming adversity worthy of a Nora Roberts book. To constantly relay the story in that fashion, IN MY OPINION, disrespects yourself, your husband and your "R".

I only say WW cause that what we are talking about. I feel the same way about WH's. To start your story off with an "excuse", is pitiful. "I was neglected", "he ignored me", "she kept sex from me", "me me me, I I I". 

Again, not trying to pick fights or call out MrsJA. God knows she has been and will continue to live with her shame for the rest of her life. Im just pointing out to Kendell to stop with the wounded bird crap. You got the hots for someone cause he fills a need your husband doesnt. Talk to your husband about it and stop with the "oh my god, i think i might have an affair" crap.


----------



## clipclop2

Kendal hasn't done any wounded bird crap.

Do you really believe the world is flat?

More than one thing can be true at any one time. 

If Mrs JA says she felt alone and felt a void, she felt alone and felt a void. Just because you don't like her reality doesn't deny its truth.

Just because you don't like how the story turned out, doesn't mean it didn't happen that way.

Jesus Christ. There is nothing a cheater can say that will make a damn bit of difference to some people because they don't care about how things happened or why they happened. They are just pissed they happened at all.

Little wonder some cheaters finally say: **** YOU.

I think you are trying to pick a fight. I think you are also denying someone else's humanity. This is HER life story. It isn't yours. You don't get to tell her how she felt or what was going on in her mind. 

Further, there is NOTHING to be learned if all you want to do is deny the vulnerability that someone felt that allowed them to fall into the pit of infidelity. 

That's right. You should never have felt vulnerable in the first place. All of that is your fault. I'm not surprised you cheated. That's just the kind of piece of crap person you are. You never counted before and you count even less now. 

Son/Daughter: I want to talk to you about vulnerability. Voids. Disconnects within marriage. They don't exist. And because they don't exist, you will never fall prey to infidelity. So, you don't have to try to address those things should you mistakenly feel vulnerable. Everything happens in a vacuum. Your relationship does not evoke feelings within you, either good or bad. You are an island. Islands never cry or cheat. 

Cheating=bad.

Denying reality=worse.


----------



## turnera

Kendall said:


> And tonight I will tell my husband about Lee. And maybe have him read this thread. I'm nervous.


Good choice. If things go well, he will take it as a wakeup call and together you will see what to do right moving forward.


----------



## adriana

DarkHoly said:


> I disagree with his post too, but why do you use the term "*******"?


Because this is exactly what it was.


----------



## GusPolinski




----------



## Red Sonja

Chaparral said:


> There are many ways to wake up a husband that doesn't realize how close to disaster they are.
> 
> Tell your husband you are going to counseling to see if you can save your marriage by yourself.
> 
> Tell your husband you are going to your parents house for awhile. When he asks for how long say indefinitely. Tell him you may not be coming back.
> 
> Look up the 180 and apply it.


I have done all of the above and it had no effect whatsoever. I am here to tell you that this will not work for _every _neglectful spouse; perhaps some will wake up but certainly not _all_.

That said, I still do not think my husband deserves the betrayal of an affair on my part. The right thing to do is separate/divorce after having “tried it all”.


----------



## GusPolinski

Red Sonja said:


> I have done all of the above and it had no effect whatsoever. I am here to tell you that this will not work for _every _neglectful spouse; perhaps some will wake up but certainly not _all_.
> 
> *That said, I still do not think my husband deserves the betrayal of an affair on my part. The right thing to do is separate/divorce after having “tried it all”.*


:iagree::iagree::iagree:


----------



## distraughtfromtexas

I suggest focusing more on "wanting to connect with other men because you can't connect with him" rather than "there's a guy at work that..." you could use him as an example after you've explained to your husband it's a problem between the two of you, but I agree with others that making it about Lee will divert your husband's attention from where it needs to be.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## happi_g_more2

adriana said:


> Because this is exactly what it was.


Ive read some of your posts and thought you sounded relatively educated. Derogatory slurs are cheap and for the dim witted. I bet in your little head you dont see the term '*******' for what it is. Another demeaning label to categorize a group of people you feel to be below you. In my opinion it aint much better then using racial slurs. 
If, for some reason, you feel that my views of people padding their stories to soften them up a bit qualifies me as a *******, so bit...but just know that you are wrong.


----------



## WyshIknew




----------



## 3putt

happi_g_more2 said:


> Ive read some of your posts and thought you sounded relatively educated. Derogatory slurs are cheap and for the dim witted. *I bet in your little head* you dont see the term '*******' for what it is. Another demeaning label to categorize a group of people you feel to be below you. In my opinion it aint much better then using racial slurs.
> If, for some reason, you feel that my views of people padding their stories to soften them up a bit qualifies me as a *******, so bit...but just know that you are wrong.


So, you don't believe that the "in your little head" comment is at least equally insulting as *******?

You're right though; derogatory slurs do make you sound dim-witted.


----------



## happi_g_more2

3putt said:


> So, you don't believe that the "in your little head" comment is at least equally insulting as *******?
> 
> You're right though; derogatory slurs do make you sound dim-witted.


No, its not equally as insulting, its equally uninformed. I have no idea how large or small her head is.


----------



## GusPolinski




----------



## 3putt

happi_g_more2 said:


> No, its not equally as insulting, its equally uninformed. I have no idea how large or small her head is.


Sigh


----------



## ing

Just a quick note here to thread skippers. ( yep I do it too) 
She got it!

In the time I have been here I can not remember a person who asked us for help this early on. You very astutely saw something was happening, something was wrong and then came here.
It is not over yet. There will be some tough days but together you will overcome this and make a stronger marriage. 

You have not betrayed your husband or yourself. 

You can hold your head up high at passing this test of character, so many fail. 


For the husband..
Put down the PS3 and rejoin real life. Change your job. 
Do whatever you have to do to stop feeling overloaded.
If your having an online "game"affair. 
Stop it and tell her about it.

Now is the time for radical honesty and kendall has taken the first step in that. You should be damned proud of her and secure in her love for you. Earn it. 




Thank you Kendall for allowing us the opportunity to help


----------



## MattMatt

clipclop2 said:


> Is it really necessary to post the links? They were on another thread recently, too. What is the point unless we are in the biz of driving traffic toward them.


I reported the Youtube video. Other people can do this, too!


----------



## Thorburn

I personally liked the OP's honesty and the fact that she gets it (IMO).

I would suggest some delete their posts, it gets confusing and if the OP's husband comes on here it will muddle the good posts.

If the OP's husband comes on here I would like to say this. You have had a wake up call and are a lucky guy. Most of us don't find out to way after the fact and the deed has been done too many times. 

Give MC a whirl. Find a good counselor and enjoy your marriage.


----------



## GusPolinski

Thorburn said:


> I personally liked the OP's honesty and the fact that she gets it (IMO).
> 
> I would suggest some delete their posts, it gets confusing and if the OP's husband comes on here it will muddle the good posts.
> 
> *If the OP's husband comes on here I would like to say this. You have had a wake up call and (you) are a lucky guy. Most of us don't find out to way after the fact and the deed has been done too many times. *
> 
> *Give MC a whirl. Find a good counselor and enjoy your marriage.*


:iagree::iagree::iagree::iagree::iagree:


----------



## Allen_A

vellocet said:


> Wrong answer. The answer should have been, "well as a married woman that probably wouldn't sit well with my husband"


I don't even know if that's the right answer. I think that just strokes the guy's ego that she's even thinking of the guy that way. I would just say "no" and no explanation needed.

A guy like this you give him an inch and he takes a mile.



vellocet said:


> This guy can no longer be a friend.


Was he ever to begin with?


----------



## Allen_A

MattMatt said:


> I reported the Youtube video. Other people can do this, too!


I did too.. sad to say, but nothing happened. I think they need to get a LOT of complaints before they act on a video.

To be honest i am more shocked at wikihow.com. That has always been a respectable website...

Looks like they are just letting anyone throw anything up there now.


----------



## Remains

I was unhappy with my 'husband' for years (together 11, unhappy for 6. Deeply unhappy for most of that 6). Told him so, repeatedly [- eta: But nothing changed]. I even warned him that I felt close to an affair [- eta: still nothing changed, he barely batted an eyelid]. Similar to you in some ways, however I think I was more forceful in what I wanted and how unhappy I was. Which suggests you haven't been forceful enough. Or elaborate enough. Yet.

He was lazy and didn't give a sh*t. Eventually I am glad he gave me the reason to kick him out. Otherwise I think we would have coasted for much longer. 

My advice to you. Don't let him coast. Make him sort his sh*t out, and make a decision as to what you will do if he doesn't. Do you want a lifetime of this?






eta: I didn't have an affair BTW. I hope that was clear. But I had stopped looking into the relationship. Completely. When we split up, amicably, the driving force was because I didn't want an affair. I hated being in that relationship. He was very aware of the reasons. He still did very little. The final nail in the coffin was his actions that caused me to throw him out there and then. We had only reconciled 3 days earlier! (after 6 month split).

You can split honourably if your H decides to continue ignoring your requests and wake up talks. Or you can go out looking like the POS. And then your husband will be far less likely to look at his side of the marriage problems because yours will have created a spectacular mess of shock, awe and devastation. Your pathetic cries of unhappiness will be lost in his monster of hurt.


----------



## clipclop2

Well, we can either go through and prune out our stuff or, the OP can talk with her husband and see if he needs additional guidance. If he does, perhaps just starting a new thread would be helpful. That thread should point to this one though, so people don't go 'round and 'round on the same old stuff we've covered.

That way the new thread could be pointed just at helping them and not about dealing with other people's angst.


----------



## verpin zal

At this point in space and time, I am somewhat annoyed with the celebration of a person's attitude when that very attitude is in fact the "norm", like it should be.

It almost tends to appear as folks over there need validation for "everything", not just for appearance from the opposite gender. Like 10 year olds needing to hear "tsk-tsk" to comprehend what they're doing is actually wrong.

I'll play along anyway. Yeeeeeeeha, go girl. You're so honest. You get it. Don't let your hubby be unhappy. Yeh.


----------



## clipclop2

I'm not following you. I get that you are full of contempt. For whom? No idea. Maybe you could start a thread to discuss your gripe.


----------



## 3putt

verpin zal said:


> At this point in space and time, I am somewhat annoyed with the celebration of a person's attitude when that very attitude is in fact the "norm", like it should be.
> 
> It almost tends to appear as folks over there need validation for "everything", not just for appearance from the opposite gender. Like 10 year olds needing to hear "tsk-tsk" to comprehend what they're doing is actually wrong.
> 
> I'll play along anyway. Yeeeeeeeha, go girl. You're so honest. You get it. Don't let your hubby be unhappy. Yeh.


Don't you think that's a bit harsh, vz? I see what you're saying, but let's remember that a LOT (I mean a very high percentage) of these situations that we have fall in our laps do indeed start by accident. One smile here, a compliment there, then a little more attention that's not being gotten from home, and it's off to the races. Not saying it's right or the fault of the BS, just that it is.

My point, which I stated last night, is that it's extremely rare for someone like Kendall to recognize early what was going on and come in here, lay herself bare, and get schooled the way she did. On top of that, she didn't one time get defensive (which is NOT what we usually see). She took it to heart, looked at herself and what she was getting into, and is apparently now taking steps to correct things.

Sorry pal, after all the sh!t we see around here on a daily basis, and assuming this plays out the way we all hope it will, she's a welcome breath of fresh air in this cesspool.

That's the way I look at it anyway.


----------



## clipclop2

Ah. I see.

We are not supposed to delight in someone making a good decision because they should never have been tempted to make a bad decision in the first place. Is that it?

Here is my response to that: who cares what you think?

We are helping our brothers and sisters when they falter. And I will delight in good when I see it whether you like it or not.

I know you aren't perfect. And I bet you don't like when you don't get credit for doing well. You may have even erred the first time you tried. But you got it. You didn't accept the first path available and you made a correction.

Well big ducking deal. You must have been a clueless idiot not to have gotten it right in the first place. Loser.

Is that how you would prefer we treat people? Is that the best way to support a young marriage?


----------



## verpin zal

3putt said:


> Don't you think that's a bit harsh, vz? I see what you're saying, but let's remember that a LOT (I mean a very high percentage) of these situations that we have fall in our laps do indeed start by accident. One smile here, a compliment there, then a little more attention that's not being gotten from home, and it's off to the races. Not saying it's right or the fault of the BS, just that it is.
> 
> My point, which I stated last night, is that it's extremely rare for someone like Kendall to recognize early what was going on and come in here, lay herself bare, and get schooled the way she did. On top of that, she didn't one time get defensive (which is NOT what we usually see). She took it to heart, looked at herself and what she was getting into, and is apparently now taking steps to correct things.
> 
> Sorry pal, after all the sh!t we see around here on a daily basis, and assuming this plays out the way we all hope it will, she's a welcome breath of fresh air in this cesspool.
> 
> That's the way I look at it anyway.


My good fella, I think you're right.

But she mentioned bringing her hubby here, until I see that happen, I'm disinclined to revel in her path of righteousness. She may as well inform her hubby on the way to an affair, and see how he will react to THAT. He knows nothing, and that's what concerns me.

And oh, by the way,

Am I hearing a noise? Some name calling?


----------



## clipclop2

I didn't realize she was required to bring him here.

In fact with peeps like you around,I would be concerned about bringing him here myself.

What outcome are you really hoping for? if it doesn't have anything to do with wanting the best for this young couple then shut the f*** up .


----------



## clipclop2

by the way I would love to see the size of the plank you need to pull out of your stupid eye.


----------



## Thundarr

clipclop2 said:


> I didn't realize she was required to bring him here.
> 
> In fact with peeps like you around,I would be concerned about bringing him here myself.
> 
> What outcome are you really hoping for? if it doesn't have anything to do with wanting the best for this young couple then shut the f*** up .


Yep, there are many who come here and successfully separate the wisdom from the baggage but I'd be afraid to point many people to TAM. There's so much baggage driven venom, rage, and anger.


----------



## 3putt

Thundarr said:


> Yep, there are many who come here and successfully separate the wisdom from the baggage but I'd be afraid to point many people to TAM. There's so much baggage driven venom, rage, and anger.


Are you talking about clip clop or vz here? Kinda hard to tell from what I've read so far.


----------



## Philat

Kendall, if you haven't been scared away from your own thread yet please consider giving us an update in the coming days.


----------



## clipclop2

If I get banned for being... Direct, please continue to help these kids.

If the OP is afraid to come back, I hope she will reach out to some folks via PM.

Same if her husband needs some fatherly guidance.


----------



## John Lee

MattMatt said:


> She wasn't attractive, certainly nowhere near as pretty as my wife. So I felt safe with her. I mean, it wasn't as if we were having an affair, right?  Wrong.


Oh man, that's exactly how I fell into an EA -- "She's not even that pretty, and she's not the type I like at all. There's no way I'd be attracted to her."


----------



## 3putt

John Lee said:


> Oh man, that's exactly how I fell into an EA -- "She's not even that pretty, and she's not the type I like at all. There's no way I'd be attracted to her."


Doesn't take much, does it? I've said it a thousand times and I'll say it a thousand more.

Boundaries.


----------



## clipclop2

Not just boundaries.

Realizing why you are tempted to compromise what you have always believed... Facing it. Staring it down.


----------



## 3putt

clipclop2 said:


> Not just boundaries.
> 
> Realizing why you are tempted to compromise what you have always believed... Facing it. Staring it down.


Actually, it is just boundaries. Because if those were properly in place, then the questions you ask would never have to be asked.


----------



## Thundarr

clipclop2 said:


> If I get banned for being... Direct, please continue to help these kids.
> 
> If the OP is afraid to come back, I hope she will reach out to some folks via PM.
> 
> Same if her husband needs some fatherly guidance.


I don't see a banning . Seemed to me you've defended baggage attacks. This thread felt a little hypothetical anyway but if OP is sincere then maybe some comments have helped.


----------



## clipclop2

Dunno. My gut says that isn't all of it but I am getting fatigued so I will not explore it right now.

Regardless we are on the same team so... Night all!


----------



## 86857

Posters, I don't think the thread jack will be helpful to Kendall, especially with the arguing that's going on. It's easy to get off topic, I do it myself. Anyway this is my attempt to reel it back in. Dang, I wish I could do short posts but I can't seem to manage it like Alte Dame. Where are you anyway Alte Dame? You always give great advice in 3 or 4 sentences. 

You may have already talked to him Kendall and you haven't posted. In case you haven't talked to him, I thought I'd put in my 2 cents worth. My first H was like yours for 10 years but we had 3 children and I couldn't walk away easily. I finally left because he never listened. You will leave eventually too if he doesn't hear you. You're young and you don't have children. BTW don't even think of having a child before this is resolved to your satisfaction. Some couples do that when the marriage is in trouble, I've seen it and it doesn't help - it makes things worse. Anyway the reality is that you will end up leaving if he doesn't change. You would have no other choice.

You need to make a big deal out of this because it is. First of all book a weekend away to make him sit up and take notice and get him out of his comfort zone. Tell him:
"_*DH, our marriage is headed for the rocks. I have been telling you for 2 years and I'm not willing to go on like this any longer. I have booked a weekend away for us to sort it out. I don't want to talk about it now. I will when we get there.*_"

Be FIRM and CALM. Keep the tone of your voice low at all times when you talk to him. No shouting or even raising it. Psychologists have proved that when people do this they get listened to.

When you get settled at the hotel, sit him down. Tell him that what you have to say is simple and short. Say, "_*Are you going to LISTEN to me this time? 2 years is way too much to not be heard by my H. It's disrespectful and hurtful. I just need a yes or a no answer.*_"

Hopefully you will get a 'Yes'. Don't let him start protesting about it or defending himself saying how tiring his work is blah, blah.

Then hand him a piece of paper with the below written on it. Tell him that you are so upset about all this that you feared you would get very emotional telling him and it would come out all mixed up. So when you were calm you wrote it all out. It goes something like what you said in your first post. And I have mentioned Lee - not by name, that's too familiar. I said previously not to tell him but really there shouldn't be secrets in a marriage. It might prey on your mind. The way I have said it will help make him sit up. 'Mr Hit-on-Married-Ladies Lee' might come in handy after all heh, heh. Here's what the piece of paper says:



> *DH, our marriage was blissful for a while. Do you remember how it was? But it has become “vanilla” over time.
> 
> For 2 years now, you don’t talk to me much at all. I miss the casual conversation, joking and laughing, and being together just for the sake of being together. I miss it TERRIBLY. I miss YOU, the man I married because he's very different now.
> 
> So we still have good sex a couple of times a week but afterwards and until the next time, we’re kind of like “roommates”. You watch sports, play video games, and read. That's fine except it seems to be all you want to do. Sometimes I feel if I wasn't there, you wouldn't even notice.  You don't have the same need for conversation and just being together like I do. This has been the norm for about the past 2 years.
> 
> I’ve talked to you several times about this. And every time you just say something like “We’re fine” and blame your quietness on pressures of work and being tired. I work too and my job is also demanding. You were working just as hard in our ealry married years but you weren't like this. I mentioned marriage counselling once, but you said no and didn't show the slightest interest. Didn't you realise that if I thought we needed marriage counselling I must be struggling?
> 
> You know there's a guy at work and he's sorta hitting on me. He keeps coming up talking to me when he sees me. The other day at the cafeteria at work when I was waiting in the queue, he came over. He said he was going to a restaurant nearby as the food was much better and would I like to go. Of course I didn't. I don't encourage him at all and he shouldn't be hitting on someone's wife. He knows I'm married and it doesn't say much about him to be hitting on me.
> But after he asked me to lunch I got a little pang. I though gee i wish my darling husband would pay me as much attention as this guy is doing, say surprising me by asking me out for a candlelit dinner one night, or a surprise weekend away.
> 
> I'm SO lonely & I miss you and what we had.*


Kendall, if that doesn't get it through to him, I don't know what will. If you can't go away for a w/e then book a dinner in a nice restaurant at a quiet table. Something tells me that this conversation should take place away from your home, from his comfort zone, and it will show you have put a lot of thought into it and are very concerned.

Depending on his reaction you can take it from there. Ask him is there anything bothering him, is he slowiy buying his way out of the marriage, is he not interested in you the way he used to be. Be direct, no p&ssy-footing around. You don't want this to drag out.

You both may decide you need MC, whatever. The above should be the beginning of a meaningful discussion on this.

If he doesn't come on board then you really have a problem. In that case, the next thing to say is you want to separate for a while, say 2 or 3 months (no less) to give you both time to think and to give you distance apart to see what it would be like if your marriage were to end. Tell him that you would NOT date during this time and you wouldn't expect him to.

These are just MY thoughts and opinions on it. You may not agree and that's fine. I don't know him. If you already talked to him and it didn't go well then you might try and do the above.

You are a great lady, with integrity. You are being terrribly neglected and ignored and you have become a sport and video game wife. Yet you managed not to succumb to Lee's attention and you are sure getting a lot of it from him. You value your marriage and you deserve a good one.

Whatever happens I wouldn't give him any more time than he has already had ignoring you in this way. ENOUGH is ENOUGH and I can tell that's what you feel. So would I. Don't allow it and depending on how it pans out there is always support and advice here on TAM so you can take whatever advice resonates with you.

I wish you all the best with it and do keep us posted. Regardless of the thread jacking, at the end of the day posters are trying to help you out.


----------



## Kendall

I told my husband about Lee today. It didn’t go as well as I had hoped.

He was supposed to be home from work at 5:30, but was delayed due to a chemical spill. He got home at 8:00.

By 9:00 he had showered and eaten dinner. I thought about waiting until tomorrow to have this talk with him, but I went ahead tonight anyway. 

I told him I had something important to talk to him about. He said OK, and then I just began crying. I was talking through tears and shaking all over, and at first he misunderstood me. He thought I was telling him that I had a physical affair. And he hit the roof. And I just cried more and couldn’t communicate. I finally got my message through to him, and he calmed down and listened. But he was still so mad. We talked for a long time. He finally said he realizes that he hasn’t been the attentive husband he should have been, but he isn’t happy at all about Lee. He said he needed to go out for a drive and clear his head. He’s still out.

I told him about this thread and asked if he would read it. He said he would when he gets home.

If some of you good people who’ve given me words of wisdom could offer some to my husband as well, I would be so grateful. His name is Wilson. I don’t know when he’ll be home. I’m just so sick at my stomach I can’t think well. Please help us.


----------



## GusPolinski

Kendall said:


> I told my husband about Lee today. It didn’t go as well as I had hoped.
> 
> He was supposed to be home from work at 5:30, but was delayed due to a chemical spill. He got home at 8:00.
> 
> By 9:00 he had showered and eaten dinner. I thought about waiting until tomorrow to have this talk with him, but I went ahead tonight anyway.
> 
> I told him I had something important to talk to him about. He said OK, and then I just began crying. I was talking through tears and shaking all over, and at first he misunderstood me. He thought I was telling him that I had a physical affair. And he hit the roof. And I just cried more and couldn’t communicate. I finally got my message through to him, and he calmed down and listened. But he was still so mad. We talked for a long time. He finally said he realizes that he hasn’t been the attentive husband he should have been, but he isn’t happy at all about Lee. He said he needed to go out for a drive and clear his head. He’s still out.
> 
> I told him about this thread and asked if he would read it. He said he would when he gets home.
> 
> If some of you good people who’ve given me words of wisdom could offer some to my husband as well, I would be so grateful. His name is Wilson. I don’t know when he’ll be home. I’m just so sick at my stomach I can’t think well. Please help us.


I'd tell Wilson the following...

1. He is BEYOND fortunate to have a wife with such integrity, grace, and emotional wisdom. He may be angry now (and that is understandable and to be expected), but you have spared him from the overwhelming enormity of absolutely soul-crushing pain that is brought about by infidelity.

2. He has an amazing opportunity -- RIGHT NOW -- to turn things around and to do his part in strengthening your marriage. He'd be a fool to let it go to waste.

Kendall, your husband will likely have some requests/demands for you. At the very least, he will ask you to cut off any and all contact w/ Lee, and he will likely ask you to find another job. To be honest, both are reasonable, and the latter would be preferable.

Others will have more advice for the both of you. You'd be wise to read it w/ an open mind, take it to heart, and implement.

Best of luck to both of you going forward.


----------



## Kendall

clipclop2 said:


> Kendall, Would you do me a favor? Would you go back to your first post and add an edit to tell all of the new people to the thread that you have taken the good advice from the board and are not going to continue to talk to Lee because you will use this experience as an opportunity to address the problems in your marriage with your husband?
> 
> Maybe we can reduce or eliminate the late-comers advising you not to cheat.
> 
> RE telling your husband... if the two of you go to church, discussing this with a church elder might be helpful. Having another guy help him see that this is an opportunity to address an issue before it becomes a crisis, and one that if he handles it correctly, will make him an even greater man in your eyes, might lessen any initial ALPHA response and, increase the chances of him taking you seriously.
> 
> If not, there are plenty of men here who can help in this respect.
> 
> But someone from home would be best.


Done.


----------



## illwill

His ego is hurt. He will recover. Send him here and we will help him see how lucky he really is.

Wilson, do you understand how much Kendall loves you, to tell you about this?

My wife did not love me as much. Neither did almost every guy who has been cheated on.

Clear your mind, brother. You are blessed and i envy you.

Talk to your wife and fix this. Your marriage WILL be stronger after this.


----------



## 86857

Wilson, you have an amazing lady and posters have nothing but respect for her. Hers was the most unusual thread I have read on TAM. She came here BEFORE anything happened and was distraught about the state of your marriage. THAT was her issue, not Lee.

Imagine if Kendall for the past 2 years was switched off and distant? And you kept complaining to her? And she didn't take you seriously? And even refused to go to marriage counselling? And then there was a cutsie at work who you got along well with and she started paying you heaps of attention and then invited you to lunch? Would you have gone? You might say you wouldn't. But guess what Kendall did? She REFUSED. She realised she was on dangerous territory and then thought of YOU, her husband and your marriage. She went so far as to then come on here for advice.

At one stage I told her not to tell you about Lee as you would make that the issue which wasn't the issue at all. In a later post, because I believe married couples shouldn't have secrets, I told her to tell you a guy from work was hitting on her and that it made her sad because she wasn't getting such attention from where she wanted it - from YOU.

So what did your wife do? She told you everything. That's why she is an amazing lady - she told you the truth. Truth is the most valuable commodity in a marriage. Now you are focussing on Lee and you are upset. I understand. But Lee is not the problem. He might be anyone. 

I'm sure Kendall will be happy to bring you to her work cafeteria at lunchtime and introduce him to you if you want. Sure, it might be a bit awkward but that way you can see him for yourself, put your arms around Kendall's shoulders and say hello to him and at the same time send the message to lay off your lady. Your behaviour left her vulnerable to guys like him and they have very clever tactics which often women don't even realise - they worm their way in. 

Tackle the Lee thing head on and then forget about him. Kendall isn't interested in Lee. YOU are the one she wants with all her heart. She faltered but is taking full ownership for it. Your behaviour had a big part in it. You need to take ownership too. You also faltered and she had to put up with neglect for a couple of years. That's a LONG time. So work out how you can get back to the lovely life you had before. 

Look after your lady because she will always look after you and will always put you first. She certainly did this time despite the fact that you had been neglected her for a long time. 

Kendall wants YOUR arms around her - nobody elses. 

Peace to you both. Try to stay calm. It's a wake-up call and a chance to treasure each other as you once did and not take each other for granted. There ain't NOTHING more precious than a happy marriage. 

PS Wilson, just remember, this is a site for betrayed spouses (BS) and I can tell you that the world-weary posters on here take no nonsense AT ALL from wandering spouses (WS). Sometimes WS come on here and boy do they get a whipping. Yet Kendall has everyone's respect. Listen to what posters say - especially the guys.


----------



## PhillyGuy13

Kendall you did the right thing. I'm sure it was hard, if I was your husband I would me happy you told me this before anything really happened. The issues with Lee can be worked through.

You and Wilson - work on each other. Each of you should be willing to go 60% of the way for the other. More than half but not all the work on one side. Do things you both enjoy, in and out of the house and the bedroom. Sometimes, especially after the honeymoon wears off, we get stuck in the doldrums. We focus on work, family, kids, money, home improvements, you name it. Keep alone time to a minimum. Nothing wrong with alone time here and there, but the important thing is to spend quality time together.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## ing

To Mr Kendall..
If she had had an affair emotional or otherwise then we would know.

We give tough advise and are very hard on people in EA's As you see from this thread we are good at detecting the signs and reading what is written and how it is written and seeing between the lines.

Sure your upset. Sure your angry but let it go because Kendall came here asked advise, acted on it and then told you everything including this thread. That is gutsy. 

Your a lucky man. >>>No affair of any kind<<. 

That is the first time in over a 1000 posts and over 2 years that I have said that. 

Many of us do this in the slim hope that we can help two people avoid unimaginable pain unless you have lived it.

Lets hope it is you two


----------



## thummper

Kendall, you tackled the situation head on. You stayed strong and didn't permit yourself to be tempted to break faith with Wilson. You honored your vows and stuck by your man, even though you were greatly upset about his distance. You are a MOST unusual, brave, and special lady. Your husband is such a fortunate and lucky man to have such a loving and caring spouse. There are a lot of people on this site who desperately wish they could say that. They blamed their husband or wife for whatever was wrong in their marriage and sought out someone else to fill the void. Your determination to stay loyal to Wilson and avoid the trap Lee was trying to lure you into speaks well your morals and commitment. I can only hope Wilson realizes what a jewel he has in you. Bless you, honey. Ya done good! :smthumbup:


----------



## Philat

Kendall said:


> I told my husband about Lee today. It didn’t go as well as I had hoped.
> 
> He was supposed to be home from work at 5:30, but was delayed due to a chemical spill. He got home at 8:00.
> 
> By 9:00 he had showered and eaten dinner. I thought about waiting until tomorrow to have this talk with him, but I went ahead tonight anyway.
> 
> I told him I had something important to talk to him about. He said OK, and then I just began crying. I was talking through tears and shaking all over, and at first he misunderstood me. He thought I was telling him that I had a physical affair. And he hit the roof. And I just cried more and couldn’t communicate. I finally got my message through to him, and he calmed down and listened. But he was still so mad. We talked for a long time. *He finally said he realizes that he hasn’t been the attentive husband he should have been,* but he isn’t happy at all about Lee. He said he needed to go out for a drive and clear his head. He’s still out.
> 
> I told him about this thread and asked if he would read it. He said he would when he gets home.
> 
> If some of you good people who’ve given me words of wisdom could offer some to my husband as well, I would be so grateful. His name is Wilson. I don’t know when he’ll be home. I’m just so sick at my stomach I can’t think well. Please help us.


This was the right thing to do. You seem to have gotten through to Wilson. Of course he's unhappy about Lee, but he'll get over that if you keep the focus on the two of you. Wilson needs to see that this is not and never will be a competition between him and Lee. As I and others have said, we wish our spouses would have done what you did before things got worse.


----------



## manfromlamancha

Wilson, you have an amazing wife - a lady of real integrity, courage, compassion and inner beauty. And here's the cherry on top of this - she loves you!

Please treat her with the respect and love she deserves from you as many of us has experienced much much worse.

Your marriage has the makings of an awesome relationship if you just let it be so.


----------



## Kendall

Thank you so much people for the nice replies.

Wilson got home at 4:00am today and we talked a bit before he crashed. He seems to believe me that I didn't have a physical affair. But he's still so very upset at me about Lee. He said he's going to confront Lee, but I begged him not to. Wilson isn't violent by nature. But he's not one to sit idly by if he feels threatened. 

He did read my opening post, and said he would read all the responses when he gets up. I could tell he had a few beers and that always puts him to sleep.

I haven't slept in 2 days myself. I took a tylenol pm and finally feel sleepy.


----------



## clipclop2

Hi Kendall. Start a new thread for him. This thread is so crazy, through absolutely no fault of your own, that it will cloud and confuse things. 

Is he willing to start one?

****.

Given that people will still jump all over you for being human, maybe you guys would do better talking with a priest or family member or reading a couple of books together.

This place can take the simplest thing and turn it into a nightmare.

My take on this is that Lee is a tool that God or your higher power or conscience or spirit used to alert you to an inner rumble that could harm you.

You paid attention to the sign and came here instead of just going with what was easiest and felt good.

You turned toward your husband. You shared your burden with him and asked him to help you carry it. You need him. You need his help and his love and he is the only man you want to calm that rumble.

I think we beat you into a lather and that is why you were so hyper emotional when you spoke to him. You didn't do anything wrong. You did everything right. But you felt so guilty and were so afraid what might happen if your beloved would not or could not step up his marriage connection that you couldn't function.

That is all on us.

I'm sorry for how we didn't help. I hope you both will forgive us. I ask your husband's forgiveness because we contributed to his pain.

We caused a lot of it.

If you would both check out the 5 Languages of Love - Go to the website first and take the questionnaire. The only thing you guys need to do is to work together. Love one another and learn more about yourselves. You don't need us.

If you are still crazy enough to want to bring him here consider creating a private group and invite the people who you both feel will help you. 

If he wants to read this thread, ask him to read this post first. 

It'll be ok. You are a good person. And it is cool he was angry. If he didn't care it would have felt a lot worse!


----------



## 3putt

clipclop2 said:


> Hi Kendall. Start a new thread for him. This thread is so crazy, through absolutely no fault of your own, that it will cloud and confuse things.
> 
> Is he willing to start one?
> 
> ****.
> 
> Given that people will still jump all over you for being human, maybe you guys would do better talking with a priest or family member or reading a couple of books together.
> 
> This place can take the simplest thing and turn it into a nightmare.
> 
> My take on this is that Lee is a tool that God or your higher power or conscience or spirit used to alert you to an inner rumble that could harm you.
> 
> You paid attention to the sign and came here instead of just going with what was easiest and felt good.
> 
> You turned toward your husband. You shared your burden with him and asked him to help you carry it. You need him. You need his help and his love and he is the only man you want to calm that rumble.
> 
> I think we beat you into a lather and that is why you were so hyper emotional when you spoke to him. You didn't do anything wrong. You did everything right. But you felt so guilty and were so afraid what might happen if your beloved would not or could not step up his marriage connection that you couldn't function.
> 
> *That is all on us.
> 
> I'm sorry for how we didn't help. I hope you both will forgive us. I ask your husband's forgiveness because we contributed to his pain.
> 
> We caused a lot of it.*
> 
> If you would both check out the 5 Languages of Love - Go to the website first and take the questionnaire. The only thing you guys need to do is to work together. Love one another and learn more about yourselves. You don't need us.
> 
> If you are still crazy enough to want to bring him here consider creating a private group and invite the people who you both feel will help you.
> 
> If he wants to read this thread, ask him to read this post first.
> 
> It'll be ok. You are a good person. And it is cool he was angry. If he didn't care it would have felt a lot worse!


W....T....F....????


----------



## clipclop2

You dont think we contributed to her meltdown in trying to talk to him?

We have a responsibility to people as well.


----------



## 3putt

clipclop2 said:


> You dont think we contributed to her meltdown in trying to talk to him?
> 
> We have a responsibility to people as well.


No, we did NOT! That is the most ridiculous assertion I may have ever seen here. 

We filled our responsibility role by convincing her to do exactly what she did. Now they can get to work on repairing what needs to be repaired, and hopefully have a long, happy life together.


----------



## clipclop2

Not everyone here did that. A lot of people beat on her as though she were a common ***** and also created a lot of fear about talking to him in the first place. 

You didn't do those things. 

But we are all TAM.


----------



## Fenix

clipclop2 said:


> You dont think we contributed to her meltdown in trying to talk to him?
> 
> We have a responsibility to people as well.


We did contribute to her meltdown but I am not sure that was a bad thing. Wilson gets it. He gets the danger that the marriage is in. That is a very, very good thing.

I am not sure he would have gotten it if she hadn't been so emotional.


----------



## clipclop2

No idea. I am glad it will work out. We just need to be careful. These are real people. It could have gotten violent after misunderstanding or who knows what.

She did well. We in general, steered her properly. But there is room for improvement!


----------



## Philat

Kendall said:


> Thank you so much people for the nice replies.
> 
> Wilson got home at 4:00am today and we talked a bit before he crashed. He seems to believe me that I didn't have a physical affair. But he's still so very upset at me about Lee. He said he's going to confront Lee, but I begged him not to. Wilson isn't violent by nature. But he's not one to sit idly by if he feels threatened.
> 
> He did read my opening post, and said he would read all the responses when he gets up. I could tell he had a few beers and that always puts him to sleep.
> 
> I haven't slept in 2 days myself. I took a tylenol pm and finally feel sleepy.


Good night, Kendall. the truth is that you have not had any kind of affair at all: It was staring you in the face and you took steps to head it off *because you value your marriage above all else*. Your H needs to understand this.


----------



## distraughtfromtexas

Kendall said:


> Thank you so much people for the nice replies.
> 
> Wilson got home at 4:00am today and we talked a bit before he crashed. He seems to believe me that I didn't have a physical affair. But he's still so very upset at me about Lee. He said he's going to confront Lee, but I begged him not to. Wilson isn't violent by nature. But he's not one to sit idly by if he feels threatened.
> 
> He did read my opening post, and said he would read all the responses when he gets up. I could tell he had a few beers and that always puts him to sleep.
> 
> I haven't slept in 2 days myself. I took a tylenol pm and finally feel sleepy.


Wilson, 
look. I'm going to give it to you straight. You can be mad all you want, but the fact is your wife did nothing wrong. In fact, she's really doing everything right. She asked you to please help her with the problems in your marriage. You refuse. She has repeatedly tried to work on the problems that she sees and you did not want to fix them. She needs attention. It is only natural. The more you make this about Lee, the worse it is going to be for your marriage. A coward would make this about someone else instead of looking inside themselves and seeing that they created this problem. You are responsible for creating half of this problem. Honestly, in my opinion you are responsible for creating more than half of it but just to be fair, I will say half. This problem is between you and your wife. No one else. Lee did nothing inappropriate. Anything other talk is purely speculation and it isn't fair for you to take this out on anyone except yourself. You need to get over the ego trip and remember that you have a wife who loves you who wants you to be together forever. What are you going to do with that? Are you just going to sit around and watch the problem get worse, or are you going to take the bull by the horns and fix the problem that you created? It's totally up to you. But confronting Lee will only be to the detriment of your marriage. He didn't do anything wrong. He wasn't disrespectful, or out of line. It's the way your wife is feeling that needs to be addressed. She loves you. She wants a future with you. But you have to be present to get that future. Don't mess it up by being too proud.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Allen_A

My guess is that keeping a secret from your spouse for this long is the main cause of the meltdown people.

Secrets make you sick.

The opening of this crisis to her husband is a stressful situation to begin with. She would have had a meltdown whether she was here or not.

That night is never easy to play out for anyone. Cut her some slack.

She did it, give her credit. Most spouse's just keep their secrets and allow the problem to fester into promiscuous behavior.

She didn't. Give her credit and stop the blame games.


----------



## illwill

clipclop2 said:


> Hi Kendall. Start a new thread for him. This thread is so crazy, through absolutely no fault of your own, that it will cloud and confuse things.
> 
> Is he willing to start one?
> 
> ****.
> 
> Given that people will still jump all over you for being human, maybe you guys would do better talking with a priest or family member or reading a couple of books together.
> 
> This place can take the simplest thing and turn it into a nightmare.
> 
> My take on this is that Lee is a tool that God or your higher power or conscience or spirit used to alert you to an inner rumble that could harm you.
> 
> You paid attention to the sign and came here instead of just going with what was easiest and felt good.
> 
> You turned toward your husband. You shared your burden with him and asked him to help you carry it. You need him. You need his help and his love and he is the only man you want to calm that rumble.
> 
> I think we beat you into a lather and that is why you were so hyper emotional when you spoke to him. You didn't do anything wrong. You did everything right. But you felt so guilty and were so afraid what might happen if your beloved would not or could not step up his marriage connection that you couldn't function.
> 
> That is all on us.
> 
> I'm sorry for how we didn't help. I hope you both will forgive us. I ask your husband's forgiveness because we contributed to his pain.
> 
> We caused a lot of it.
> 
> If you would both check out the 5 Languages of Love - Go to the website first and take the questionnaire. The only thing you guys need to do is to work together. Love one another and learn more about yourselves. You don't need us.
> 
> If you are still crazy enough to want to bring him here consider creating a private group and invite the people who you both feel will help you.
> 
> If he wants to read this thread, ask him to read this post first.
> 
> It'll be ok. You are a good person. And it is cool he was angry. If he didn't care it would have felt a lot worse!


Speak for yourself. I gave constructive and fair advice. As did many here.

The fact that she is no longer intesrested in the guy from work and her hubby understands how serious this was are positive signs.

We did our job.


----------



## toolforgrowth

Kendall, you're wonderful. As a BS who divorced his WW, I'm touched by you recognizing the signs, coming here for help, and doing what is right to show your husband you are committed to him and you want the both of you to be happy. I've been coming here off and on for 2 years and this is the first time I've seen a person like you. I give you a lot of credit and kudos for that.

Wilson,

There are countless BS's here who would have gladly given literally anything to have their spouse choose this option than an affair. You are in the position that so many of us wish we would have gotten; our spouses to have said they truly love us, and want only us, even when tempted. That she chose to seek help, and stop it, and share with you everything as sign of her commitment, speaks volumes. I understand what you must be going through right now, I've been there x1000. Believe me when I say that we are sympathetic, and we are in no way minimizing your pain.

But there is a chance, here and now, to keep what you have, to make it better, and to rediscover what brought you together in the first place, and I think it's a darned good one. I strongly urge you both to go to marriage counseling. Find out why you drifted. Talk about what else may be bothering you in your life that is carrying over into your marriage, and what is bothering Kendall that she may be carrying over into your marriage too, and work on fixing them together. Find out what you need from each other. You both obviously love each other very much, and that is a really strong foundation upon which you can build something fantastically awesome.

I wish you both the best of luck. We're rooting for you both.


----------



## Kendall

Well today has been a great day. Thanks to so many of you good people.

Wilson woke up this afternoon and followed through on his promise to read all the responses in this thread. I left him alone to read and think. About 2 hours later I went into the living room and he was just staring at the computer monitor and crying.

We got a call from his work saying there was another chemical spill. And Wilson is the head of safety at his company, so he had to go supervise the cleanup and do paperwork about it. I fixed him sandwiches to take and he came in the kitchen and gave me the biggest hug and most passionate kiss I’ve had in I can’t remember when. He was streaming tears and said he loved me more than ever and that we will work this out. AND HE WANTS MARRIAGE COUNSELING!!!

He will probably be at work all night, but I’m just so happy I can’t explain it. I love him so much.

And I’m so looking forward to Monday and telling Lee to bow out of my life. I don’t ever want to see him again. I’m going to look for a job at another company. And I’ll eat lunch at my desk from now on until I find another job.

Would Wilson be welcome to post here? Should he start his own thread? If so, in which “category” (Reconciliation maybe?). Should he make his own user name? We have only one computer.

Thank you all so much. I was so scared he would just throw me away, but it's just the opposite. He's been awakened. I'm just so happy.


----------



## thummper

God, this is just the greatest news! I'm so happy for you two. :smthumbup: You've got a loving and appreciative husband, and he has an unbelievably loyal and devoted wife. What a combination!!!! Cheers!! :toast:


----------



## thummper

Kendall said:


> Well today has been a great day. Thanks to so many of you good people.
> 
> Wilson woke up this afternoon and followed through on his promise to read all the responses in this thread. I left him alone to read and think. About 2 hours later I went into the living room and he was just staring at the computer monitor and crying.
> 
> We got a call from his work saying there was another chemical spill. And Wilson is the head of safety at his company, so he had to go supervise the cleanup and do paperwork about it. I fixed him sandwiches to take and he came in the kitchen and gave me the biggest hug and most passionate kiss I’ve had in I can’t remember when. He was streaming tears and said he loved me more than ever and that we will work this out. AND HE WANTS MARRIAGE COUNSELING!!!
> 
> He will probably be at work all night, but I’m just so happy I can’t explain it. I love him so much.
> 
> And I’m so looking forward to Monday and telling Lee to bow out of my life. I don’t ever want to see him again. I’m going to look for a job at another company. And I’ll eat lunch at my desk from now on until I find another job.
> 
> *Would Wilson be welcome to post here?* Should he start his own thread? If so, in which “category” (Reconciliation maybe?). Should he make his own user name? We have only one computer.
> 
> Thank you all so much. *I was so scared he would just throw me away,* but it's just the opposite. He's been awakened. I'm just so happy.


Tell him to post away.  And as far as him throwing you away, well, they say that nothing is impossible, but now I can prove they're wrong. THAT would be impossible. Take care, you two, and keep your love shining. I think everyone here is smiling from ear to ear.


----------



## 3putt

Damn right he should post, and he will most certainly be welcomed. Just have him create his own user name so we don't get confused. 

Glad this is turning around in this fashion. Like I said before, we could use some good, before the "deed" threads around here.

And if you read past it before, please still get these 2 books.



3putt said:


> His Needs, Her Needs
> 
> Not "Just Friends": Rebuilding Trust and Recovering Your Sanity After Infidelity: Shirley P. Glass, Jean Coppock Staeheli: 9780743225502: Amazon.com: Books


----------



## Nostromo

That's great Kendall, you did the right thing by telling your husband, now with some hard work on both of your parts you two can work through this and come out stronger on the other end.


----------



## 86857

Kendall & Wilson, I literally got goosebumps when I read your post and a tear slowly made its way down my cheek.

Wilson, I think you are amazing to have reacted in the way you did. You went out for a drive after Kendall told you and took the time to think instead of going into the attack. You then listened to Kendall, respected her wish that you read the posts and so you did. I think many in your situation might not have done so. It was a truly difficult situation to be in. It seems you have the same courage and integrity that your wife has. 

I think you two are going to become favourites on TAM and your story will be retold for a long time to come. I said at the outset that yours was the most unusual story I had come across on TAM. There aren't many stories like it on here. 

Perhaps now is the time for a w/e away that I spoke of previously only this time it will be a mini-honeymoon. 

I couldn't be happier for you both and I have a spring in my step today. 
:smthumbup::smthumbup::smthumbup:


----------



## DeterminedToThrive

Kendall, I would just like to say that I am so proud of you and happy for you and Wilson.

To Wilson, you are a very, very lucky man. I would give a million dollars if only my husband had possessed the courage that Kendall possesses. I would give anything if my husband had talked to me before he got tangled up in his EA.


----------



## clipclop2

Sure he can post! His own account would be easier for us to follow but do what works for you guys.

I'm very, very happy for you both. 

Hope he isn't up all night.


----------



## illwill

Kendall said:


> Well today has been a great day. Thanks to so many of you good people.
> 
> Wilson woke up this afternoon and followed through on his promise to read all the responses in this thread. I left him alone to read and think. About 2 hours later I went into the living room and he was just staring at the computer monitor and crying.
> 
> We got a call from his work saying there was another chemical spill. And Wilson is the head of safety at his company, so he had to go supervise the cleanup and do paperwork about it. I fixed him sandwiches to take and he came in the kitchen and gave me the biggest hug and most passionate kiss I’ve had in I can’t remember when. He was streaming tears and said he loved me more than ever and that we will work this out. AND HE WANTS MARRIAGE COUNSELING!!!
> 
> He will probably be at work all night, but I’m just so happy I can’t explain it. I love him so much.
> 
> And I’m so looking forward to Monday and telling Lee to bow out of my life. I don’t ever want to see him again. I’m going to look for a job at another company. And I’ll eat lunch at my desk from now on until I find another job.
> 
> Would Wilson be welcome to post here? Should he start his own thread? If so, in which “category” (Reconciliation maybe?). Should he make his own user name? We have only one computer.
> 
> Thank you all so much. I was so scared he would just throw me away, but it's just the opposite. He's been awakened. I'm just so happy.


I could not be happier for you. We get so few happy endings here. You got a good man there, and he has a helluva wife.

You guys made my weekend.

Have Wilson post in this section, under a new user name and we will await him with open arms.


----------



## Kendall

illwill said:


> I could not be happier for you. We get so few happy endings here. You got a good man there, and he has a helluva wife.
> 
> You guys made my weekend.
> 
> Have Wilson post in this section, under a new user name and we will await him with open arms.


He wants to participate. He may be at work all night and sleeping all day tomorrow, but he definitely wants to participate soon. Maybe tomorrow night.


----------



## 6301

Boy is good to here good news on this forum for a change and I hope that all of us can give these two people the right advice so they can make their marriage stronger.

If Wilson wants to join in then that's great and it's good to know that he wants to see a MC. Don't know if that's his real name but I like the name Wilson.


----------



## GusPolinski

6301 said:


> *Boy is good to here good news on this forum for a change and I hope that all of us can give these two people the right advice so they can make their marriage stronger.*
> 
> If Wilson wants to join in then that's great and it's good to know that he wants to see a MC. Don't know if that's his real name but I like the name Wilson.


:iagree::iagree::iagree:


----------



## Nostromo

It's good news he wants to see a marriage counselor, but please do plenty of research about the counselor before hand.


----------



## Thorburn

Nostromo said:


> It's good news he wants to see a marriage counselor, but please do plenty of research about the counselor before hand.


:iagree:

Not all are marriage friendly. Make sure they are marriage friendly. This is my world as a professional counselor and it may not make sense to some of you but not all MC are marriage friendly. Marriage friendly counselors are typically listed as marriage friendly.


----------



## clipclop2

*Re: Re: Am I Headed for an Affair?*



********** said:


> Sorry to threadjack momentarily Kendall & Wilson.
> 
> Clipclop, I'm sure you are as happy as the rest of us for Kendall and Wilson.
> However I for one, flinched every time I came across your vitriolic comments and personal attacks peppered throughout this thread. I hope no more occur, *especially on this thread which is the finest example of love I have seen on TAM.* You also used the royal 'we' at times and I question your right to speak for all of us so blithely. It is a forum for discussion.
> 
> I have no doubt you mean well and you present interesting perspectives and insight at times. As far as I can tell from your thread, you are neither a BS nor a WS - rather you feared you might become a BS. I certainly hope you haven't. Despite that, you have every right to offer your thoughts. Those people you attacked are BS - they have enough pain to endure without also enduring personal attacks on the refuge they have come to for support and discussion.
> 
> In all cases where these personal attacks occurred, a simple "I don't agree with you" would have been sufficient.
> 
> I wish you well with whatever difficulties you are going through.


I defended people who were being attacked by BSs. Those BSs are not given a pass to deny other people's life stories just because they were cheated on. Nor is TAM here just for BSs. 

Feel free to ignore my posts.


----------



## illwill

Lets not thread jack.


----------



## Allen_A

Kendall said:


> And I’m so looking forward to Monday and telling Lee to bow out of my life. I don’t ever want to see him again. I’m going to look for a job at another company. And I’ll eat lunch at my desk from now on until I find another job.


I am still not sure if speaking to Lee again is a good idea. I am divided on that one.

Maybe just tell him to stay away from married women in general.


----------



## 86857

Allen_A said:


> I am still not sure if speaking to Lee again is a good idea. I am divided on that one.
> Maybe just tell him to stay away from married women in general.


Yes, a tricky one Allen. 
The only time I saw this 'lunching' going on, there was already an A or it was the start of an A. Bad for morale too as the gossip soon starts. 
Lee knew quite well it was inappropriate. He should be hitting on single girls. He deserves what's coming to him whatever K & W decide.


----------



## illwill

Blunt force. 

Shut it down in a five second conversation. Let Lee know, they will no longer have any contact, so there will be no confusion or questions or excuses. 

Ignoring him could only make him bolder. He will likely keep fishing until he gets answers.

Let it be known her hubby knows, and is NOT happy. And he may very well start being her lunch date.

Any contact after that is on Lee. He deals with the consequences. He knows better, and if not, he will be shown better.


----------



## distraughtfromtexas

Confronting Lee should be done in a very specific, delicate way. People here keep saying he was hitting on you, but technically speaking, that really isn't true. Careful not to be too dramatic about it and turn your relationship with Lee into something it was not. I'm very torn on this issue, too. Part of me thinks you should not divulge information to Lee because he's nobody and not worth it. But I understand why you want to. If it were me, I would just say, "I realized this weekend while talking to my husband that if he was spending alone one on one time with other women, or talking to them all the time, I wouldn't like it. So it's best for me to step back and not hang out anymore. I hope you can respect that." 

At that point, Lee's true colors will show. If he is truly respectful, he will bow out. If he's not, he'll start in on ways to get you to come back around. And THAT would be an appropriate time for your husband to say something, or for you to be more forceful with him. But not until that point. 

Just remember if he DOES have a thing for you (which hasn't been proven, only speculated), and you give him this big dramatic confrontation about how you have to stay away from him because the two of you were inappropriate, it will fuel his fire 100000%. But if you keep it about you and less about him, just about putting yourself in your husband's shoes and hanging with "other men" in general, it gives him less ammunition to think he has a chance with you. Just my two cents.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Kendall

6301 said:


> Boy is good to here good news on this forum for a change and I hope that all of us can give these two people the right advice so they can make their marriage stronger.
> 
> If Wilson wants to join in then that's great and it's good to know that he wants to see a MC. Don't know if that's his real name but I like the name Wilson.


Yes Wilson is his real name and he will almost certainly be able to participate tonight (maybe late). He wants to thank everyone personally.

We had such a great night (morning) when he got home. It hasn't been great like that in a long time. Thank you so much everybody.


----------



## Kendall

distraughtfromtexas said:


> Confronting Lee should be done in a very specific, delicate way. People here keep saying he was hitting on you, but technically speaking, that really isn't true. Careful not to be too dramatic about it and turn your relationship with Lee into something it was not. I'm very torn on this issue, too. Part of me thinks you should not divulge information to Lee because he's nobody and not worth it. But I understand why you want to. If it were me, I would just say, "I realized this weekend while talking to my husband that if he was spending alone one on one time with other women, or talking to them all the time, I wouldn't like it. So it's best for me to step back and not hang out anymore. I hope you can respect that."
> 
> At that point, Lee's true colors will show. If he is truly respectful, he will bow out. If he's not, he'll start in on ways to get you to come back around. And THAT would be an appropriate time for your husband to say something, or for you to be more forceful with him. But not until that point.
> 
> Just remember if he DOES have a thing for you (which hasn't been proven, only speculated), and you give him this big dramatic confrontation about how you have to stay away from him because the two of you were inappropriate, it will fuel his fire 100000%. But if you keep it about you and less about him, just about putting yourself in your husband's shoes and hanging with "other men" in general, it gives him less ammunition to think he has a chance with you. Just my two cents.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I will rethink the way I should approach telling Lee. Thank you.


----------



## Fenix

********** said:


> Kendall & Wilson, I literally got goosebumps when I read your post and a tear slowly made its way down my cheek.
> 
> Wilson, I think you are amazing to have reacted in the way you did. You went out for a drive after Kendall told you and took the time to think instead of going into the attack. You then listened to Kendall, respected her wish that you read the posts and so you did. I think many in your situation might not have done so. It was a truly difficult situation to be in. It seems you have the same courage and integrity that your wife has.
> 
> I think you two are going to become favourites on TAM and your story will be retold for a long time to come. I said at the outset that yours was the most unusual story I had come across on TAM. There aren't many stories like it on here.
> 
> Perhaps now is the time for a w/e away that I spoke of previously only this time it will be a mini-honeymoon.
> 
> I couldn't be happier for you both and I have a spring in my step today.
> :smthumbup::smthumbup::smthumbup:


A big fat AMEN to this! But I had more than one tear! :smthumbup:


----------



## Philat

distraughtfromtexas said:


> Confronting Lee should be done in a very specific, delicate way. People here keep saying he was hitting on you, but technically speaking, that really isn't true. Careful not to be too dramatic about it and turn your relationship with Lee into something it was not. I'm very torn on this issue, too. Part of me thinks you should not divulge information to Lee because he's nobody and not worth it. But I understand why you want to. If it were me, I would just say, "I realized this weekend while talking to my husband that if he was spending alone one on one time with other women, or talking to them all the time, I wouldn't like it. So it's best for me to step back and not hang out anymore. I hope you can respect that."
> 
> At that point, Lee's true colors will show. If he is truly respectful, he will bow out. If he's not, he'll start in on ways to get you to come back around. And THAT would be an appropriate time for your husband to say something, or for you to be more forceful with him. But not until that point.
> 
> Just remember if he DOES have a thing for you (which hasn't been proven, only speculated), and you give him this big dramatic confrontation about how you have to stay away from him because the two of you were inappropriate, it will fuel his fire 100000%. But if you keep it about you and less about him, just about putting yourself in your husband's shoes and hanging with "other men" in general, it gives him less ammunition to think he has a chance with you. Just my two cents.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Excellent post!


----------



## Allen_A

Revealing anything to Lee at this point just creates more intimacy. Lee really has no business knowing why Kendall doesn't want anything to do with him anymore.

That's the problem.
_
If she gives him the cold shoulder no explanation, he's going to press her for an explanation.

If Kendall does explain herself at all, she's just creating more intimacy between them by revealing marital issues.
_


----------



## clipclop2

I agree with Allen_A totally!

None of this is about Lee. He is just a guy. He could be a lonely guy, a guy who is sincerely looking for a friend, a gay guy, a player, asexual, whatever. He is just a person who brought this issue to the fore.

Holding Lee accountable for asking someone if they want to go to Subway is really kind of daft, too. 

This is a home problem. It isn't a work problem. I strongly urge that Lee be left totally out of it.


----------



## thummper

Disagree. He knows she's a married woman, yet he's sought her out. Asking her to go out for lunch and then staying with her when she declined. This looked, to me, like an attempt to "get his foot in the door." He may not be overtly "after her," but I think the intention is definitely there. I think if she acted in the least interested, he'd have made a move. I'm with distraughtfromtexas on this one. Let him know that she knows her husband wouldn't particularly like her friendship, and she agrees with his take on this. Then respectfully distance herself. Lee's reaction to this will show where his intentions really are. He most likely will respect her wishes and bow out....at least I hope that's what he will do.


----------



## Philat

If Lee is on the make he deserves a smackdown. If he is truly just a friend he deserves an explanation why OP won't talk to him anymore. Either way OP needs to address the Lee issue.


----------



## adriana

clipclop2 said:


> None of this is about Lee. He is just a guy. He could be a lonely guy, a guy who is sincerely looking for a friend, a gay guy, a player, asexual, whatever. He is just a person who brought this issue to the fore.
> 
> Holding Lee accountable for asking someone if they want to go to Subway is really kind of daft, too.
> 
> This is a home problem. It isn't a work problem. I strongly urge that Lee be left totally out of it.



:iagree: Kendall, I agree 100% with clipclop2. Don't talk to Lee. 

You don't own him any explanation or apology. If, at some point, he asks you about it, politely tell him that you have been focusing on your work and don't have time for anything else. That's all. You don't need to create any drama at work. Keep in mind that you may not be able to quit your current job anytime soon. After all, finding a new, decent job isn't that easy these days. 

Good luck in patching things up with your husband.


----------



## adriana

thummper said:


> Disagree. He knows she's a married woman, yet he's sought her out. Asking her to go out for lunch and then staying with her when she declined. This looked, to me, like an attempt to "get his foot in the door." He may not be overtly "after her," but I think the intention is definitely there. I think if she acted in the least interested, he'd have made a move. I'm with distraughtfromtexas on this one. Let him know that she knows her husband wouldn't particularly like her friendship, and she agrees with his take on this. Then respectfully distance herself. Lee's reaction to this will show where his intentions really are. He most likely will respect her wishes and bow out....at least I hope that's what he will do.


And what if Lee laughs at her face and starts telling other co-workers that Kendall was just imagining things? Does she really need this kind of drama at work? Talking to him is completely unnecessary at this point.


----------



## thummper

adriana said:


> :iagree: Kendall, I agree 100% with clipclop2. *Don't talk to Lee. *You don't own him any explanation or apology. If, at some point, he asks you about it, politely tell him that you have been focusing on your work and don't have time for anything else. That's all. You don't need to create any drama at work. Keep in mind that you may not be able to quit your current job anytime soon. After all, finding a new, decent job isn't that easy these days.
> 
> Good luck in patching things up with your husband.


Good luck with not talking with Lee. If he's interested, as I believe he is, he's not going to let this drop. Eventually, you'll have to be more upfront with him. Might as well do it right away and get it over with. Make it plain you're not interested in spending any kind of time with him at work. Put a big picture of you and your husband on your desk right in plain sight. I think he'll get the message and back off.


----------



## thummper

adriana said:


> And what if Lee laughs at her face and starts telling other co-workers that Kendall was just imagining things? *Does she really need this kind of drama at work? Talking to him is completely unnecessary at this point*.


Again, disagree. She already feels there IS this kind of drama a work. That's what started this whole thing. And, seriously, do you REALLY think this guy is going to spread this around the job? That would only serve to make him look foolish.


----------



## illwill

Ignoring him is silly. And then you really are making it seem like his very presence is too much attraction for you to bare. And he will start to look for her.

She is a adult. She can just tell him and that is that. 

Keep it moving.


----------



## Philat

It doesn't have to be dramatic, and it doesn't have to involve any reference to OP's feelings about Lee. From OP's description, whatever Lee's intentions or lack thereof, he will be expecting them to have continued friendly interaction. She can't just stop that without explanation.


----------



## adriana

thummper said:


> Again, disagree. She already feels there IS this kind of drama a work. That's what started this whole thing. And, seriously, do you REALLY think this guy is going to spread this around the job? That would only serve to make him look foolish.


Thummper, I might have exaggerated the "laughing at her face" part but the rest is a very likely outcome. I have seen this kind of situations in real life quite a few times. It's impossible to predict how he's going to react so it's better to leave it along unless confronting/talking to him is really necessary.


----------



## Philat

adriana said:


> Thummper, I might have exaggerated the "laughing at her face" part but the rest is a very likely outcome. I have seen this kind of situations in real life quite a few times. It's impossible to predict how he's going to react so it's better to leave it along unless confronting/talking to him is really necessary.


Confronting, no. Talking, yes.


----------



## adriana

Philat said:


> It doesn't have to be dramatic, and it doesn't have to involve any reference to OP's feelings about Lee. From OP's description, whatever Lee's intentions or lack thereof, he will be expecting them to have continued friendly interaction. She can't just stop that without explanation.


Philat, you can bet your all savings that sooner or later Lee's going to mention this conversation to other co-workers and the office gossip will start its snowballing effect. Does she really need it?


----------



## thummper

adriana said:


> Thummper, I might have exaggerated the "laughing at her face" part but the rest is a very likely outcome. I have seen this kind of situations in real life quite a few times. It's impossible to predict how he's going to react so it's better to leave it along unless confronting/talking to him is really necessary.


I enjoy your posts. Your answers are well-thought out, but I just don't think that in this case it's going to have the desired effects. I insist, leaving it alone and basically ignoring the guy isn't going to work. He's most likely NOT going to "leave it alone." I believe he was very desirous of getting something started with this married woman. If he is interested, he's not going to stop so easily. She's going to wind up having to tell him why the closeness at work HAS to stop. Unless he's a total idiot, he's going to get the message that she's not interested and then he'll go off to find more willing females at the job.


----------



## Philat

Thing is, it's going to have to happen sooner or later. If Kendall doesn't do it proactively then as illwill says Lee is going to look her up and ask what gives?


----------



## thummper

adriana said:


> Philat, you can bet your all savings that sooner or later *Lee's going to mention this conversation to other co-workers *and the office gossip will start its snowballing effect. Does she really need it?


Do you really think he'll open himself up to ridicule with others on the job. Now if he does bring this up, it's going to be obvious that he was being a little too friendly, again, to a *married woman,* and she put him in his place. He's not going to want others to see how she shot him down.


----------



## Allen_A

How about Kendall leaves it alone. No explanation, just distance.

_If Lee continues_ to press her, invite her husband to work to smack him down.

Let the husband come in and show him how this works.

If Wilson shows up and Lee continues his nonsense, then you know you have a serious problem.


----------



## thummper

That might work, but I'd be concerned about Wilson's reaction to this guy.


----------



## Philat

I really don't think there needs to be any more to it than "Hi, Lee. I know we've spent a lot of time together recently, but I don't think I'm comfortable continuing in this way. I'll see you around, OK?" 

No big deal.


----------



## Nostromo

I think what you should do in regards to Lee [saying goodbye/ignoring him]is best left up to your husband since he is the party chiefly affected.


----------



## adriana

thummper said:


> Do you really think he'll open himself up to ridicule with others on the job. Now if he does bring this up, it's going to be obvious that he was being a little too friendly, again, to a *married woman,* and she put him in his place. He's not going to want others to see how she shot him down.


Thummper, if Lee is an a$$, he's going to paint himself a completely surprised guy who had absolutely no ill intention toward Kendall. All he was doing was having innocent conversations with her at work and suddenly she is telling him that she cannot talk to him anymore. WTF? Was she thinking that he was hitting on her or something? Is she falling for him? Why would she say something like that?

He isn't going to open himself up for ridicule. He's just an innocent, friendly gay who is trying to understand what happened. But Kendall will look like a delusional, unhappily married woman who was imagining things that were never there.

Are you getting the picture?

Right now, the best option for her is trying to just remove herself from this situation as quietly as possible. He'll likely get the message. If he doesn't then more drastic steps will be necessary. And Kendall definitely needs to carry herself in a more professional manner in the future.

That being said.... I rest my case as I have nothing else to add.


----------



## distraughtfromtexas

adriana said:


> Thummper, if Lee is an a$$, he's going to paint himself a completely surprised guy who had absolutely no ill intention toward Kendall. All he was doing was having innocent conversations with her at work and suddenly she is telling him that she cannot talk to him anymore. WTF? Was she thinking that he was hitting on her or something? Is she falling for him? Why would she say something like that?
> 
> He isn't going to open himself up for ridicule. He's just an innocent, friendly gay who is trying to understand what happened. But Kendall will look like a delusional, unhappily married woman who was imagining things that were never there.
> 
> Are you getting the picture?
> 
> Right now, the best option for her is trying to just remove herself from this situation as quietly as possible. He'll likely get the message. If he doesn't then more drastic steps will be necessary. And Kendall definitely needs to carry herself in a more professional manner in the future.
> 
> That being said.... I rest my case as I have nothing else to add.


That is something I considered when I gave my suggestion to make it more about her and not about him. Then he can't act like she's crazy, because simply saying I probably wouldn't want my husband to hang with other women so I won't do it.. Isn't crazy. JMO.

Think of this situation if they were the same sex. If she just randomly pulled back from a girl friend with no explanation, the girl would want to know what was going on. Anyone would. So I understand why Kendall wants to close the door. But there is a tactful way and non tactful way of doing so.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## thummper

Whatever we suggest, Kendall and Wilson are going to handle this in their own way. It would be nice if she reports back and lets us know what they've decided and how it went. :smthumbup:


----------



## See_Listen_Love

Kendall said:


> I feel so confused. I want my husband to be my best friend, but he’s just not interested. And I’ve tried to change his mind. Several times.


Let him be your best friend/intimate partner again.

If he does not want to, move out, as a sign you are serious.
If he does not get it then, you have a clear choice.

Accept it and get more unhappy, end up in an affair eventually, or see him get in one.
Or 
Divorce and try to find your true soulmate


----------



## thummper

happi_g_more2 said:


> I agree. I just wish people would come out and say it...talk about it like it is. This Mrs John Adams story. Im calling BS. There is 2 ways of telling that story. The way she did, and this way.
> 
> I was a stay at home mom/wife and my husband worked his ass off. I lost my self worth staying at home. I talked to my husband and he understood so we worked out a plan for me to go back to school. Yah!!!! My professor was fing hot so I ****ed him. When he dumped me, I went back to my husband. Thank god he didnt leave me. Now I spend the rest of my constantly convincing myself and him of this sob story. THE END!
> 
> Women like this should have sticky notes around their house, car and workplace. "Dont forget to not slip and land on another mans penis today"
> 
> Reading this **** makes me vomit. Naive?? Yeah, Horny is more like it


You're entitled to your opinion, of course, but I find this post waaaaaaay off the mark. I hope Mrs. Adams wasn't offended by this! If she wasn't, then I think a lot of people here would be. I firmly believe this fine lady sincerely regrets what she did, and is still (after all these years) appalled at her own behavior. Her husband loves and cherishes her and she loves him. Their's is an inspiring love story. Not very many of those on this site. It shows that reconciliation is possible if both partners want it to be.


----------



## illwill

You know nothing about guys if you think he wont look for her.

It does not need to be dramatic. Ive been rejected by women and did not go around talking about it. And neither will he. This aint high school.

Why avoid him when you can just be direct and end it? We are over thinking this. They had no affair. 

It aint that serious.


----------



## clipclop2

Most people will move on if they are being blown off. I don't know why a big deal has to be made about any of this. If she were not married and not interested, she'd probably just avoid him or be polite but not engage in conversation except of the "hi/bye" sort.

Keep it simple.

If he makes her uncomfortable or doesn't get it, THEN do something more direct. But until then, why not just let it go?


----------



## thummper

Mrs. John Adams said:


> Thumper.. Thank you very much. I appreciate your kindness. I responded to the person who said it...and removed all my posts from this thread. This is about Kendall and Wilson...I didn't want the thread tainted by something about me. *It wasn't helpful to them.*
> 
> I will see When you have read this by a "like"please and then I will remove it.


I find that VERY hard to believe! My guess is that Mrs.R would have found your story "instructive" to say the least. Anyone, however tempted, would see in your experience a very pointed warning about what could happen if they are not careful. As I've said before, you and John are inspiring.


----------



## adriana

Mrs. John Adams said:


> Thumper.. Thank you very much. I appreciate your kindness. I responded to the person who said it...and removed all my posts from this thread. This is about Kendall and Wilson...I didn't want the thread tainted by something about me. It wasn't helpful to them.
> 
> I will see When you have read this by a "like"please and then I will remove it.


Mrs. John Adams, I think removing your posts from this thread, particularly the one from page 8, was completely unnecessary. Your story hasn't tainted anything; on the contrary, it delivered a very strong message and Kendall clearly appreciated your effort.


----------



## 3putt

adriana said:


> Mrs. John Adams, I think removing your posts from this thread, particularly the one from page 8, was completely unnecessary. Your story hasn't tainted anything; on the contrary, it delivered a very strong message and Kendall clearly appreciated your effort.


*Could not agree more.*


----------



## 3putt

Mrs. John Adams said:


> My story was quoted so in essence it still remains...*Someone suggested we clean up the thread and take the unnecessary things off. I complied.*.. but I thank you sweet adriana and my dear friend 3putt...you are both so important to me and I would never want you to be upset with me.


Your story is *not* what was being referred to as part of a 'clean up'. I do believe you need to stop undermining your value and contributions to this community.


----------



## Allen_A

thummper said:


> That might work, but I'd be concerned about Wilson's reaction to this guy.


I am not suggesting Wilson show up with a baseball bat. He just shows up, and makes it crystal clear to the guy to back off his wife.

Maybe even bring a couple "yes men" with him if he has to return a second time.

I have seen that work well. If a guy won't lay off, you just show up in numbers and they will often run away tail between legs.

That may make the guy think twice about hitting on married women in general as well.

Not to mention some work embarrassment for him.


----------



## thummper

I'm so sorry she's decided to leave this thread. She's very classy and I've loved her posts. Here's to you, Mrs. Adams!:toast: I will always wish you and John the very best.


----------



## Kendall

adriana said:


> Mrs. John Adams, I think removing your posts from this thread, particularly the one from page 8, was completely unnecessary. Your story hasn't tainted anything; on the contrary, it delivered a very strong message and Kendall clearly appreciated your effort.


I count Mrs. John Adams' story as the one that really opened my eyes. She has a lot of guts to write personally painful things for the sake of helping someone else avoid those pains. I admire her greatly.


----------



## Philat

Kendall said:


> I count Mrs. John Adams' story as the one that really opened my eyes. She has a lot of guts to write personally painful things for the sake of helping someone else avoid those pains. I admire her greatly.


Everything OK, Kendall?


----------



## Kendall

Philat said:


> Everything OK, Kendall?


Yes Philat. Thank you.

Wilson and I had a wonderful day out and about. Just enjoying being together. We're just now getting settled for the night.

Wilson is currently working on his first post in this forum. He will post it soon.


----------



## Kendall

Hello Everyone,

I wanted to introduce my wonderful husband Wilson. He's just signed up for an account here. I'll sign out now and he'll sign in and make his first post.


----------



## Wilson24

Hello everyone. I’m Wilson. Kendall’s husband.

I don’t even know how to begin. Kendall is an absolute queen, but I’ve been neglecting her for a long time. I see that now. And I don’t know how I could have let it happen. But I did. With excuses like work pressures, being tired, my game is on, I need to relax and read, and playing video games.

She has deserved better for a long time. And now I’m going to give her better, in large part due to the help of this web site.

I’m lucky to have seen my shortcomings before they destroyed my marriage. 

First and foremost, thank you Kendall for caring enough to come here and seek advice. 

And thank you people for guiding her, and for giving me the great advice you gave me in reacting to "Lee".

I’ve got so much more to say. But for now, I just want to say thanks.


----------



## See_Listen_Love

Hi Wilson, 

It sounds almost to good to be true, but welcome. Miracles do happen.

A lot of people here were in your situation and came here later, after an EA/PA happened, so you are an invaluable asset to the bunch with your point of view!


----------



## illwill

Wilson, welcome to TAM.


----------



## thummper

Welcome. So glad you two are working together on this.


----------



## phillybeffandswiss

You'll get a ton of good advice, mixed in with a little bickering amongst members. Take what you need and BOTH OF YOU take care of your marriage.


----------



## Kendall

Wilson and I talked long into the night about my approach to handling Lee. We gave heavy consideration to all the people here who gave us advice, on both sides of the issue.

Wilson gave me his opinion but left the final decision to me. I've decided to be proactive, at the risk of maybe over doing it and looking silly. Here's the gist of what I plan to say, in a very nice tone:

Lee, my husband and I attended a marriage workshop this weekend (i.e. this web site ). And one of the topics discussed was the possible dangers of opposite sex friends. And believe me I know you're only interested in me as a friend. But with the advice I received this weekend, and due to the great respect I have for my husband, I've decided to have no opposite sex friends except those that my husband knows very well. 

This has nothing to do with you. It has everything to do with how much I love and respect my wonderful husband. 

So I won't be coming to the lunch room any more, and I won't be seeing you any more. I apologize for being over dramatic. Good luck and goodbye.

Wish me luck. I'm not nervous. I'm actually looking forward to it. It feels good to show Wilson how serious I am about him being my only man.


----------



## john1068

Wilson24 said:


> Hello everyone. I’m Wilson. Kendall’s husband.
> 
> I don’t even know how to begin. Kendall is an absolute queen, but I’ve been neglecting her for a long time. I see that now. And I don’t know how I could have let it happen. But I did. With excuses like work pressures, being tired, my game is on, I need to relax and read, and playing video games.
> 
> She has deserved better for a long time. And now I’m going to give her better, in large part due to the help of this web site.
> 
> I’m lucky to have seen my shortcomings before they destroyed my marriage.
> 
> First and foremost, thank you Kendall for caring enough to come here and seek advice.
> 
> And thank you people for guiding her, and for giving me the great advice you gave me in reacting to "Lee".
> 
> I’ve got so much more to say. But for now, I just want to say thanks.


Welcome, Wilson. I was where you are now back in the beginning of November 2013. I can tell you, through TAM's support, reading several books - No More Mr. Nice Guy, The Married Man Sex Life Primer, His Needs Her Needs, and, of course, IMPLEMENTING what I've learned, my W and I are WELL on our way to complete recovery. It's quite surreal to be where you are right now. And I can tell you how surreal it is to be where we are today given how low the bottom was in November. 

We've been married 22 years and life's stresses can make us forget about how we SHOULD treat our SO's - it does go both ways . And it is absolutely fixable at this point. And where I am today is simply awesome. I still get my work done, but the presence of my wife every day excites me like when we first met. It took a major scare, and a little directed effort afterward. You can get through this, by her sharing this with you, she gave you and your marriage a huge, massive gift.


----------



## turnera

Wilson, thanks for coming. That says a lot about you, we're all in awe of you two. 

Anyway, here's my 2 cents: get the book His Needs Her Needs, and a highlighter, and read through one chapter together every night. Use it as a textbook. Highlight, re-read parts, discuss, and make a game plan.

Once you finish book, download the Love Buster questionnaire from the author's website (but please ignore their forum) and both of you fill it out, and share. Find out what little things you do to each other that hurt, and spend the next few months eliminating those habits.

Focus on spending 15 hours a week together. You can still do your games, just limit it as you would do any other thing, as you would with kids. This will rekindle and/or strengthen your feelings, spending that much time together.

After a few months of eliminating LBs, fill out the Emotional Needs questionnaire, learn how you can best meet each other's ENs. This is important because, if you each have different ways of feeling love, you'll likely try to SHOW love the same way YOU want to be shown. But that might be completely different from what your spouse wants, and they may be feeling unloved without realizing why.


----------



## Plan 9 from OS

Wilson and Kendall, I'll temper my responses some regarding the accolades you two have received. It's great that the two of you have opened your eyes to what was happening in your marriage. Now the two of you will have to spend some time working out how the two of you will recommit to each other and put in the effort needed to keep the relationship strong plus improve it further where possible. 

Wilson, my advice would be the cut out video games completely for one thing. I know a number of people will say it's OK to play them if in moderation. I can't dispute that, but from my personal experience it was a fantastic decision on my part to cut out computer games. That plus excessive internet usage was putting a damper on my marriage the past several years. By taking the time I spent playing computer games and surfing the net and applying it to spending quality time with my wife, I have seen my marriage improve greatly. 

I'd also challenge you to cut back on watching sports, but that may require another thread since this would be an even bigger controversial item to address. 

Please don't think that I'm saying to cut out hobbies. You MUST have some type of activity that is for yourself. My objection to video games, computer use and even vegging out in front of the TV is that each of these activities can easily spill over into quality time alloted for the marriage. These are activities are WAY to easy to abuse IMHO.

PS: Regarding video games, I have yet to see a lady who thought that playing video games was sexy. Weight lifting, biking, running, hiking and activities of the like CAN be considered sexy. Food for thought.


----------



## turnera

Also, those activities don't include your spouse. You got married for a reason - to SHARE life. Find things that both of you can do together. Who knows? Maybe she'll love paintballing, and you two can mix video game/sports into a joint fun thing.


----------



## vellocet

Wilson24 said:


> Hello everyone. I’m Wilson. Kendall’s husband.
> 
> I don’t even know how to begin. Kendall is an absolute queen, but I’ve been neglecting her for a long time. I see that now. And I don’t know how I could have let it happen. But I did. With excuses like work pressures, being tired, my game is on, I need to relax and read, and playing video games.
> 
> She has deserved better for a long time. And now I’m going to give her better, in large part due to the help of this web site.
> 
> I’m lucky to have seen my shortcomings before they destroyed my marriage.
> 
> First and foremost, thank you Kendall for caring enough to come here and seek advice.
> 
> And thank you people for guiding her, and for giving me the great advice you gave me in reacting to "Lee".
> 
> I’ve got so much more to say. But for now, I just want to say thanks.


Yes, its good to see the problems and correct them before one spouse steps over the line.

Let me be clear, you BOTH have a role to play in the health of your marriage and need to address them. And it is good that you will be working on your part of the issues to become a great husband.

However, if she had really stepped over the line, then that would have changed the game. The greater burden on fixing the marriage would then be on her. And some might question, "didn't she already sort of step over the line?"

IMO, yes, she did. But not so much as you can't work on the marriage and move on from it. She still needs to remove herself from the so-called "friend" role with this guy at work.


----------



## Philat

vellocet said:


> And some might question, "didn't she already sort of step over the line?"
> 
> IMO, yes, she did. But not so much as you can't work on the marriage and move on from it. She still needs to remove herself from the so-called "friend" role with this guy at work.


I don't think she did. I think she stepped right up to it, looked down and said "Uh oh, what's going on here?"

Agree on stepping away from the work friend, though.


----------



## vellocet

Philat said:


> I don't think she did. I think she stepped right up to it, looked down and said "Uh oh, what's going on here?"
> 
> Agree on stepping away from the work friend, though.


She developed an attraction to this man, wanted to go to dinner with him, and used her husband's behavior to somewhat justify this.

If she truly stepped over the line or not would depend on how the BS/potential BS would feel about it.

If someone I was involved with developed a crush or interest in another man and admitted that she really wanted to go out with him, then to me, she stepped over the line. I now would have a woman that I would have to wonder about if things don't always go right in the relationship.

She stepped over it, but then jumped back on the her side of it quickly, and that is good. It wouldn't be a stepping over the line at a severity that I wouldn't consider close to being unredeemable. I think this marriage is definitely salvageable. They both recognize what needs to be done.


----------



## vellocet

Plan 9 from OS said:


> Wilson, my advice would be the cut out video games completely for one thing.


Well not completely. A guy has to be able to do some fun things.
Maybe set time limits, or play when she isn't home.




> I know a number of people will say it's OK to play them if in moderation. I can't dispute that, but from my personal experience it was a fantastic decision on my part to cut out computer games.


And that's fine if it worked for you. I like to play myself. But I might play once or twice a week, and I don't spend countless hours on it. But I do love to play. Its a great stress reliever.



> PS: Regarding video games, I have yet to see a lady who thought that playing video games was sexy. Weight lifting, biking, running, hiking and activities of the like CAN be considered sexy. Food for thought.


I find time for games, my gf, working out, and all that. A woman might not find video games sexy, but at least that guy isn't out at bars developing crushes on other women. There are a lot of things women do that, to a man, wouldn't be sexy. But we still love them just the same  Men are from Mars, women from Venus


----------



## spanz

yeah take all that energy spent on video games, and channel it into kinky role play with your wife! Larping, sexual role plays, who knows what, but it would then strengthen the marriage, instead of letting it molder and fall apart


----------



## Gabriel

Regarding the games, I kind of disagree. Everybody has hobbies that don't involve their spouses, plus, Wilson may end up resenting Kendall in the long run for taking away something he loves to do.

My recommendation is to schedule the time, like anything else. Limit it to 4 hours a week or something like that. Or say, 8-10pm on Tues/Thurs - is my gaming time. That way you can look forward to it, Kendall knows when you'll be doing your hobby, and that she'll have your full attention the rest of the time.

Don't want to go so far that you lose yourself completely. Some guys play softball 2-3 nights a week and have beers after. Others work in the garage some nights. Be who you are - just schedule it and keep it a minor part of your life.


----------



## yeah_right

turnera said:


> Anyway, here's my 2 cents: get the book His Needs Her Needs, and a highlighter, and read through one chapter together every night. Use it as a textbook. Highlight, re-read parts, discuss, and make a game plan.


This is very helpful! I also suggest both of you take the 5 Love Languages test. It's eye opening and as much as I'm not into "self-help" stuff, both of these have made a huge, positive difference in our marriage.

And yes, you need "together hobbies" and "individual hobbies". It's all about balance. I think the two of you have a great chance of building a stronger marriage. Good luck!


----------



## PhillyGuy13

No video games. No TV. No sports. No computer. Fine. Wife must give up clothes, shopping and reality TV (sorry to stereotype trying to prove a point)

All things in moderation guys nothing wrong with spouses having alone time for an hour or two a week doing things they like that the other may not.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Wilson24

turnera said:


> Wilson, thanks for coming. That says a lot about you, we're all in awe of you two.
> 
> Anyway, here's my 2 cents: get the book His Needs Her Needs, and a highlighter, and read through one chapter together every night. Use it as a textbook. Highlight, re-read parts, discuss, and make a game plan.
> 
> Once you finish book, download the Love Buster questionnaire from the author's website (but please ignore their forum) and both of you fill it out, and share. Find out what little things you do to each other that hurt, and spend the next few months eliminating those habits.
> 
> Focus on spending 15 hours a week together. You can still do your games, just limit it as you would do any other thing, as you would with kids. This will rekindle and/or strengthen your feelings, spending that much time together.
> 
> After a few months of eliminating LBs, fill out the Emotional Needs questionnaire, learn how you can best meet each other's ENs. This is important because, if you each have different ways of feeling love, you'll likely try to SHOW love the same way YOU want to be shown. But that might be completely different from what your spouse wants, and they may be feeling unloved without realizing why.


Kendall has ordered the books recommended by all the posters here. We're going to start reading them together as soon as they get here.


----------



## Wilson24

PhillyGuy13 said:


> No video games. No TV. No sports. No computer. Fine. Wife must give up clothes, shopping and reality TV (sorry to stereotype trying to prove a point)
> 
> All things in moderation guys nothing wrong with spouses having alone time for an hour or two a week doing things they like that the other may not.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I've got to really cut back on spending time away from Kendall. 

I'll do this by getting more involved in some of her favorite activities. Playing electric guitar is her favorite thing to do, she's really good, and I also play, so we're going to learn new songs together.

I love to read, so we're going to read together, out loud, some of the books recommended here.

I like to watch TV (sports) and she likes to watch funny sitcoms. So I'm going to watch less sports and more sitcoms with her.

And we're getting rid of the TV in our bedroom. No more watching different things on different TVs at the same time.

And I will cut back on time playing games, and see if I can find some games that Kendall and I would like to play together.

* Edited for spelling corrections.


----------



## PhillyGuy13

Wilson24 said:


> I've got to really cut back on spending time away from Kendall.
> 
> I'll do this my getting more involved in some of her favorite activities. Playing electric guitar is her favorite thing to do, she's really good, and I also play, so we're going to learn new songs together.
> 
> I love to read, so we're going to read together, out loud, some of the books recommended here.
> 
> I like to watch TV (sports) and she likes to watch funny sitcoms. So I'm going to watch less sports and more sitcoms with her.
> 
> And we're getting rid of the TV in our bedroom. No more watching different things on different TVs at the same time.
> 
> And I will cut back on time playing games, and see if I can find some games that Kendall and I would like to play together.


Sounds like a good plan. Hopefully Kendall takes an interest in some of your shows and sports viewing too. TV out of the bedroom is a very good idea for many reasons 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## vellocet

Wilson24 said:


> I've got to really cut back on spending time away from Kendall.
> 
> I'll do this by getting more involved in some of her favorite activities. Playing electric guitar is her favorite thing to do, she's really good, and I also play, so we're going to learn new songs together.
> 
> I love to read, so we're going to read together, out loud, some of the books recommended here.
> 
> I like to watch TV (sports) and she likes to watch funny sitcoms. So I'm going to watch less sports and more sitcoms with her.


Sounds fine Wilson. But just one thing. This makes it sound like you will be tailoring time spent based on what she wants. It shouldn't be that way. You both have your tastes and it shouldn't be one sided. Its like having to always go to a chick flick at the movie theater. 
I don't mind a chick flick, but last gf I had wanted to only go see those and never wanted to go to the movies for something I wanted to see. So I quickly grew tired of going to the movies at all. Gotta be some give and take.


----------



## Nostromo

vellocet said:


> Sounds fine Wilson. But just one thing. This makes it sound like you will be tailoring time spent based on what she wants. It shouldn't be that way. You both have your tastes and it shouldn't be one sided. Its like having to always go to a chick flick at the movie theater.
> I don't mind a chick flick, but last gf I had wanted to only go see those and never wanted to go to the movies for something I wanted to see. So I quickly grew tired of going to the movies at all. Gotta be some give and take.


:iagree: Both of you will have to work hard and make concessions, otherwise the one doing "everything" may grow to resent their spouse.


----------



## Nostromo

She told him, he is on TAM now. Edit: was in relation to advice from other posters [which got deleted] to tell husband.


----------



## distraughtfromtexas

What a great game plan, Wilson! You sound like a great guy, and you have a great wife! What a wonderful couple!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Kendall

OK, so I had the talk with Lee today. You all are about to get a good laugh. Just like I did.

OK, so I went to the lunch room today as always. And Lee was there, and it was just he and I. None of our other friends showed up.

I ordered a sandwich to go, and then sat down with Lee. I was nice but got right to the point. I basically told him that out of respect for my wonderful husband, I had decided to have no opposite sex friends. Just like I posted last night. 

OK, get ready to laugh. Many of you warned me he would do this, and you were so right. And I was ready for it.

He said this: “Kendall, please don’t end our friendship. It’s so rare and special when two people connect like we do”.

And I actually laughed! I so did! Out loud! And he looked at me like I was crazy.

By that point I was enjoying it.

I told him that was the cheapest BS line I had ever heard. And that I didn’t want to connect with him. Ever. And that my only connection is my husband. And that it would always be that way. And then “Goodbye forever”. And back to my desk I went.

I feel so free!

But without the help of you people here, a week ago I might have been naïve enough to have believed that BS. In fact, it’s actually quite scary to see just how right you all were. How he was just setting me up all along, setting a trap, and waiting for a chance to pounce. 

Thank you all so much.

BTW, Lee and I work on opposite sides of a huge complex of buildings. We literally have never seen one another at work except in the cafeteria. We even park far away from one another, in different parking lots. So I don’t think I’ll ever see him again. But I’m going to find another job at a different company anyway. I just feel that would be best.


----------



## illwill

Moderation is key. You can have a hobby that does not include eachother. That is healthy. 

Just limit them and find new things to do with eachother. Things you both can enjoy. Something new you can discover together.

You may eventually want to move this thread from CWI. There are better sections for you guys.

I think you guys are fine with the issues of cheating. Its now about rebuilding.

Good luck.


----------



## PhillyGuy13

Just be careful. If he is a player, well players play. He may start parking in your lot, or taking strolls through the building:

Anyway, I think you see through his BS now. So just ignore him. And don't be afraid of the cafeteria, or let him chase you out of the job. If that is what you decide you want to do and that is best - great. But don't let him have that much control over your life.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## illwill

Kendall said:


> OK, so I had the talk with Lee today. You all are about to get a good laugh. Just like I did.
> 
> OK, so I went to the lunch room today as always. And Lee was there, and it was just he and I. None of our other friends showed up.
> 
> I ordered a sandwich to go, and then sat down with Lee. I was nice but got right to the point. I basically told him that out of respect for my wonderful husband, I had decided to have no opposite sex friends. Just like I posted last night.
> 
> OK, get ready to laugh. Many of you warned me he would do this, and you were so right. And I was ready for it.
> 
> He said this: “Kendall, please don’t end our friendship. It’s so rare and special when two people connect like we do”.
> 
> And I actually laughed! I so did! Out loud! And he looked at me like I was crazy.
> 
> By that point I was enjoying it.
> 
> I told him that was the cheapest BS line I had ever heard. And that I didn’t want to connect with him. Ever. And that my only connection is my husband. And that it would always be that way. And then “Goodbye forever”. And back to my desk I went.
> 
> I feel so free!
> 
> But without the help of you people here, a week ago I might have been naïve enough to have believed that BS. In fact, it’s actually quite scary to see just how right you all were. How he was just setting me up all along, setting a trap, and waiting for a chance to pounce.
> 
> Thank you all so much.
> 
> BTW, Lee and I work on opposite sides of a huge complex of buildings. We literally have never seen one another at work except in the cafeteria. We even park far away from one another, in different parking lots. So I don’t think I’ll ever see him again. But I’m going to find another job at a different company anyway. I just feel that would be best.


Kendall, great job! You were blunt and to the point. Thats how you do it.

Congrats. You guys are gonna be fine.


----------



## Nostromo

“Kendall, please don’t end our friendship. It’s so rare and special when two people connect like we do”.

:lol: cringe worthy.


----------



## plasmaguy

I have been away from TAM for too long. I joined after my wife left me.
Anyway, this thread has been so uplifting. Wilson has a great wife and I know that they can and will make their marriage a success.


----------



## paul72

1 - If you need a man to talk to find an old gram-pa whos plumbing is broken or a gay man

2 - What are you trying to "talk" about... and are you interesting to talk to ?

Yes I said it.... maybe your BORING ..... or what you are talking about has zero interest to him....... ask yourself... would you want to talk about football with him for an hour ? Probably not 

Ask him odd questions, talk about something you never talk about and things that he never talks to you about... see if you can find something NEW to talk about


----------



## 6301

Wilson24 said:


> I've got to really cut back on spending time away from Kendall.
> 
> I'll do this by getting more involved in some of her favorite activities. Playing electric guitar is her favorite thing to do, she's really good, and I also play, so we're going to learn new songs together.
> 
> I love to read, so we're going to read together, out loud, some of the books recommended here.
> 
> I like to watch TV (sports) and she likes to watch funny sitcoms. So I'm going to watch less sports and more sitcoms with her.
> 
> And we're getting rid of the TV in our bedroom. No more watching different things on different TVs at the same time.
> 
> And I will cut back on time playing games, and see if I can find some games that Kendall and I would like to play together.
> 
> * Edited for spelling corrections.


 Wilson!! 

Welcome and I hope that you and your wife will find very good advice here and the outcome is nothing but the best for both of you.

Both play guitar huh? You guys know Smoke On The Water?


----------



## Kendall

6301 said:


> Wilson!!
> 
> Welcome and I hope that you and your wife will find very good advice here and the outcome is nothing but the best for both of you.
> 
> Both play guitar huh? You guys know Smoke On The Water?


Wilson is out now walking the dogs. But yes, we know "Smoke on the Water". We're both fans of classic Rock 'n Roll. 

We used to play lots of songs together. I look forward to reconnecting with him in that way. Things we love to do together.


----------



## maleuser1969

Kendall said:


> Hello. I’m here trying to determine if I’m headed for an affair.
> 
> I juat went through this with my wife.. she did have an affair. It destroyed me and our marriage.. do what you want but once its too late its too late.. I will be 100% honest.. I think I would have respected her more had she had the decency to tell me what her problems are number 1 and let me know hiw serious.. or the worst case tell me I need a break I am not happy.. and then go date. I guess that could have permantly hurt us hut still right now I cant even look at her. Tell your husband the truth! Tell him everything even that you dream about the guy what ever.. best case is it hurts for a bit but it scares the **** out of him and you guys fix things.. or he doesnt respond and you got your answer. Leave him.. take the high road you wont regret it.. wish my wife had given it a second thought
> 
> My husband and I are both 28 years old. We’ve been together for 7 years, married for 5 years, with pretty good jobs and no children (2 dogs).
> 
> I love my husband, and I believe he loves me too. We’ve had a good marriage. We argue every now and then, but not much, and our arguments never get ugly.
> 
> Like most marriages, ours was blissful for a while, but has become “vanilla” over time.
> 
> The problem is, for about the past 2 years, my husband won’t talk to me as much as I need. Things like casual conversation, joking and laughing, and being together just for the sake of being together. We have good sex usually twice per week, but afterwards and until the next time we have sex, we’re kind of like “roommates”. He likes to watch sports, play video games, and read. His doesn’t have the same need for conversation and just being together like I do. This has been the norm for about the past 2 years.
> 
> I’ve talked to him several times about this. And every time he just says something like “We’re fine” and blames his quietness on pressures of work and being tired. I mentioned marriage counseling once, but he said no.
> 
> I have no reason to believe he’s having an affair. There are none of the classic signs. And I’ve checked his cell phone, email, etc. (I know all his passwords). As far as I can tell, he’s not trying to hide anything. I think he’s just in a lazy, “take me for granted”, contented state. And I’m left feeling incomplete and lonely.
> 
> So there’s a nice guy at work (Lee) who’s about my age. And it’s very nice talking to him. He jokes and makes me laugh. He likes to talk about the things I like to talk about. Art, music, dogs, movies. We first met at work in the cafeteria while sitting among mutual friends. We still sit with those friends at lunch, but when the group doesn’t show up, Lee and I still sit together (just the two of us) and talk.
> 
> We’ve never met outside of work. We’ve never emailed or texted or talked on the phone. We’ve never touched inappropriately. Our conversations have never crossed the line. I’ve never talked bad about my husband to him. We just talk. But for the sake of honesty and completeness, I should also say he’s very attractive and single, and he doesn’t have a girlfriend right now. And we have so much in common.
> 
> So yesterday it was just us two together in the cafeteria at work, and he said the food didn’t look good to him, and he asked me out for lunch at a restaurant. I told him I couldn’t go because I had to make up missed time earlier in the week, and had only 30 minutes for lunch. But that wasn’t true. The truth was, I really wanted to go with him, but I thought better of it. And then he ended up staying with me anyway and we had lunch in the cafeteria.
> 
> I feel so confused. I want my husband to be my best friend, but he’s just not interested. And I’ve tried to change his mind. Several times.
> 
> Is it safe for me to continue talking to Lee in just an at-work, friendly manner like it’s been so far? Or am I headed for trouble? I’m not naïve. I know that many affairs have begun this way. But I need a friend that I can just talk to. I don’t have any sisters or close girl friends.
> 
> Am I already in an emotional affair? I don’t think I am. I’ve never told my husband about Lee, because my husband doesn’t like to talk about much these days.
> 
> Please advise. Thank you.
> 
> *** Edited: I'm happy to revise this post and say that, because of the great advice I received here, I did not have an affair.


_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Wilson24

I just wanted to say how proud I am of Kendall.

She’s upstairs right now, and when she comes back to read new posts here, I want her to see this:

Kendall, today I requested a week of vacation time from work. My boss promised to accommodate that request as soon as possible (probably 3 weeks from now). And we’re going off for a getaway, wherever you want to go, just the two of us. For our 2nd honeymoon.

Thank you Kendall for saving our marriage. You are the most important thing in the world to me. And I love you more than ever.


----------



## brokeneric

Walter, I went through the threads. You have a long journey ahead. But good baby steps.


----------



## Kendall

Wilson24 said:


> I just wanted to say how proud I am of Kendall.
> 
> She’s upstairs right now, and when she comes back to read new posts here, I want her to see this:
> 
> Kendall, today I requested a week of vacation time from work. My boss promised to accommodate that request as soon as possible (probably 3 weeks from now). And we’re going off for a getaway, wherever you want to go, just the two of us. For our 2nd honeymoon.
> 
> Thank you Kendall for saving our marriage. You are the most important thing in the world to me. And I love you more than ever.


Thank you Wilson. Thank you so much. I love you more than ever too.


----------



## Philat

Kendall said:


> Wilson is out now walking the dogs. But yes, we know "Smoke on the Water". We're both fans of classic Rock 'n Roll.
> 
> We used to play lots of songs together. I look forward to reconnecting with him in that way. Things we love to do together.


Your avatar looks like a Fender Squier, no?


----------



## Kendall

Philat said:


> Your avatar looks like a Fender Squier, no?


Actually I play a Fender American Deluxe Stratocaster. I just found a guitar pic online and used it for my avatar.


----------



## Philat

Kendall said:


> Actually I play a Fender American Deluxe Stratocaster. I just found a guitar pic online and used it for my avatar.


Little bit of a step up from the Squier.


----------



## Kendall

Philat said:


> Little bit of a step up from the Squier.


Yes, my dad insisted on buying it for me a couple of years ago. 

Guitar playing was the only thing we had in common, and he never spared any expense in us connecting that way. He died last year.


----------



## MarriedManInHis40s

Kendall said:


> He said this: “Kendall, please don’t end our friendship. It’s so rare and special when two people connect like we do”.


I'd read over this thread, and I have to admit I felt a lot of people were very much over-reacting to Lee. From what you had written, I thought it was possible that his intentions were entirely innocent, and I was very much in the "you don't need to say anything" camp. You can always make the message stronger if need be, but once you've overdone it, that's that. He's offended and you look delusional. (Some people might not care, but I'm Canadian )

As it was, since you felt you needed to clear the air, I thought your "speech" played it just right, leaving him plenty of room to bow out with grace if his intentions had been innocent, but leaving no ambiguity that you needed him to bow out. 

...and he opened his mouth and ... ick. That was indeed a BS line, the Hail Mary pass from a player who realizes the game is almost lost. The cynics here had him pegged right from the start.


----------



## ing

MarriedManInHis40s said:


> ...and he opened his mouth and ... ick. That was indeed a BS line, the Hail Mary pass from a player who realizes the game is almost lost. The cynics here had him pegged right from the start.


Hard, cynical and suspicious? 
Nah.. happy, joyful and free with strong boundaries. 

When we see these guys around these parts (spit) we put them in the Thunderdome. (spins guns) and then run them in to the Outback only if we think they deserve it. (spits again. Rather self consciously)


----------



## Gabriel

Nostromo said:


> “Kendall, please don’t end our friendship. It’s so rare and special when two people connect like we do”.
> 
> :lol: cringe worthy.


Totally cringe-worthy. Wow. And scary. And temper-triggering.


----------



## illwill

MarriedManInHis40s said:


> I'd read over this thread, and I have to admit I felt a lot of people were very much over-reacting to Lee. From what you had written, I thought it was possible that his intentions were entirely innocent, and I was very much in the "you don't need to say anything" camp. You can always make the message stronger if need be, but once you've overdone it, that's that. He's offended and you look delusional. (Some people might not care, but I'm Canadian )
> 
> As it was, since you felt you needed to clear the air, I thought your "speech" played it just right, leaving him plenty of room to bow out with grace if his intentions had been innocent, but leaving no ambiguity that you needed him to bow out.
> 
> ...and he opened his mouth and ... ick. That was indeed a BS line, the Hail Mary pass from a player who realizes the game is almost lost. The cynics here had him pegged right from the start.


Cynics or realist?


----------



## Granny7

Kendall said:


> Hello. I’m here trying to determine if I’m headed for an affair.
> 
> My husband and I are both 28 years old. We’ve been together for 7 years, married for 5 years, with pretty good jobs and no children (2 dogs).
> 
> I love my husband, and I believe he loves me too. We’ve had a good marriage. We argue every now and then, but not much, and our arguments never get ugly.
> 
> Like most marriages, ours was blissful for a while, but has become “vanilla” over time.
> 
> The problem is, for about the past 2 years, my husband won’t talk to me as much as I need. Things like casual conversation, joking and laughing, and being together just for the sake of being together. We have good sex usually twice per week, but afterwards and until the next time we have sex, we’re kind of like “roommates”. He likes to watch sports, play video games, and read. His doesn’t have the same need for conversation and just being together like I do. This has been the norm for about the past 2 years.
> 
> I’ve talked to him several times about this. And every time he just says something like “We’re fine” and blames his quietness on pressures of work and being tired. I mentioned marriage counseling once, but he said no.
> 
> I have no reason to believe he’s having an affair. There are none of the classic signs. And I’ve checked his cell phone, email, etc. (I know all his passwords). As far as I can tell, he’s not trying to hide anything. I think he’s just in a lazy, “take me for granted”, contented state. And I’m left feeling incomplete and lonely.
> 
> So there’s a nice guy at work (Lee) who’s about my age. And it’s very nice talking to him. He jokes and makes me laugh. He likes to talk about the things I like to talk about. Art, music, dogs, movies. We first met at work in the cafeteria while sitting among mutual friends. We still sit with those friends at lunch, but when the group doesn’t show up, Lee and I still sit together (just the two of us) and talk.
> 
> We’ve never met outside of work. We’ve never emailed or texted or talked on the phone. We’ve never touched inappropriately. Our conversations have never crossed the line. I’ve never talked bad about my husband to him. We just talk. But for the sake of honesty and completeness, I should also say he’s very attractive and single, and he doesn’t have a girlfriend right now. And we have so much in common.
> 
> So yesterday it was just us two together in the cafeteria at work, and he said the food didn’t look good to him, and he asked me out for lunch at a restaurant. I told him I couldn’t go because I had to make up missed time earlier in the week, and had only 30 minutes for lunch. But that wasn’t true. The truth was, I really wanted to go with him, but I thought better of it. And then he ended up staying with me anyway and we had lunch in the cafeteria.
> 
> I feel so confused. I want my husband to be my best friend, but he’s just not interested. And I’ve tried to change his mind. Several times.
> 
> Is it safe for me to continue talking to Lee in just an at-work, friendly manner like it’s been so far? Or am I headed for trouble? I’m not naïve. I know that many affairs have begun this way. But I need a friend that I can just talk to. I don’t have any sisters or close girl friends.
> 
> Am I already in an emotional affair? I don’t think I am. I’ve never told my husband about Lee, because my husband doesn’t like to talk about much these days.
> 
> Please advise. Thank you.
> 
> *** Edited: I'm happy to revise this post and say that, because of the great advice I received here, I did not have an affair.


Kendall,
I'm so glad that you took all the great advice on here. My CH started an A by just having a lunch with a co-worker. It ended 3 yrs. later with 2 weekends together. It basically destroyed our marriage. I stayed with him, wish I hadn't and now it's 25 yrs. later and I'm having PTSD. He didn't give me the emotional support I needed either and I was approached by someone, but I told them, "I can't do that, I'm married." I'm so happy that you didn't let it go any further. If you need someone to talk to and your husband isn't available. He either has to know, you separate and give him a wake up call. I didn't read all the other post as I'm taking care of m 93 yr. old Dad who is very ill in the hospital. Your post just caught my eye. Just know that the lunch and the A that happened ruined a beautiful marriage, at least I thought it was. I loved him so much and now that love isn't the same. Not even sure it's even there anymore. We had been married 23 yrs. and now it's been 52 and we are both very unhappy at 70 yrs. old.
Granny7


----------



## Mstanton

It seems like you crave communication with your Husband and he's not giving it to you. You should talk to him and let you know that communication is an important part of your life.


----------



## Mstanton

He's not Psychic, you know this. Sometimes people must be reminded.


----------



## ballygirl1971

ReGroup said:


> He can't and shouldn't be your best friend.
> 
> He's your Man and Husband.
> 
> Find a female friend you can talk to if you want a best friend.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Fenix

vellocet said:


> Sounds fine Wilson. But just one thing. This makes it sound like you will be tailoring time spent based on what she wants. It shouldn't be that way. You both have your tastes and it shouldn't be one sided. Its like having to always go to a chick flick at the movie theater.
> I don't mind a chick flick, but last gf I had wanted to only go see those and never wanted to go to the movies for something I wanted to see. So I quickly grew tired of going to the movies at all. Gotta be some give and take.


He did mention he is going to look for some video games they both can enjoy.  With women the fastest growing audience, there should be a genre that works. 

Love the no TV in the bedroom.


----------



## Fenix

Gabriel said:


> Totally cringe-worthy. Wow. And scary. And temper-triggering.


Absolutely. The good thing is that there will never ever be any doubt in regards to Lee. Valuable lesson.

Granny7,  Your post broke my heart.


----------



## manfromlamancha

Kendall said:


> Actually I play a Fender American Deluxe Stratocaster. I just found a guitar pic online and used it for my avatar.


Have 2 of them - my favourites - one sunburst with maple neck like yours and the other black (white pick guard) with maple neck. Both greats. Only comparable one would be the Ultra. Have a combination of Marshalls and Fender amps. What kind of music do you play ?


----------



## Kendall

manfromlamancha said:


> Have 2 of them - my favourites - one sunburst with maple neck like yours and the other black (white pick guard) with maple neck. Both greats. Only comparable one would be the Ultra. Have a combination of Marshalls and Fender amps. What kind of music do you play ?


I love classic rock, but I like today's music as well.

Right now I'm trying to learn "Kiss Me Deadly" by Lita Ford. I like just about any classic rock song that has strong electric guitar play.

My strat is gold with a white pick guard and a maple neck. Like the one Pete Townshend used to play (and maybe he still does).

Wilson plays a Gibson Les Paul in Chicago Blue with a rosewood neck and ivory trim. Wow does it have sustain! And it makes the best "dirty sound" I've ever heard. My strat makes the best "clean sound" I've ever heard.


----------



## OnTheRocks

If you like getting laid by women who weigh under 250 lbs and do not have hairy backs, I strongly recommend avoiding LARPing, video games, radio controlled toys, and renaissance fairs.


----------



## turnera

Wilson24 said:


> I like to watch TV (sports) and she likes to watch funny sitcoms. So I'm going to watch less sports and more sitcoms with her.
> 
> And I will cut back on time playing games, and see if I can find some games that Kendall and I would like to play together.


Huh? What about HER watching more sports and less sitcoms? Why do YOU have to turn into HER clone? We're talking moderation here, Wilson - for BOTH of you.

It's good to cut back on the games; I can't imagine more than 5 or 6 hours a week being good for you, when there is so much more out in the real world to experience. What you two need is physical touch, clean air experiences, physical activity together. Hiking, tennis, rollerblading, high school basketball games, pottery class together...use your imagination. But get out of the house!


----------



## OnTheRocks

Stay away from comic book stores, too.


----------



## Bean05

I have totally been in your shoes. Only my husband was extremely distant, he liked to drink and smoke pot (and lie about it), sex only happened MAYBE once every month or so... but I still loved him and he was sensitive and kinda sweet. But I got tired of all the other stuff and ended up talking marriage problems with a co-worker. We ended up getting into a 2 year long relationship that has ripped my marriage completely apart. If you think you're headed for an affair, it's time to either go to relationship bootcamp, or start unraveling the strings so you can each go your separate ways without hurting one another to the core. At least you don't have children in the mix.


----------



## Fenix

OnTheRocks said:


> If you like getting laid by women who weigh under 250 lbs and do not have hairy backs, I strongly recommend avoiding LARPing, video games, radio controlled toys, and renaissance fairs.


Hey now. A friend of mine found her DH through WoW. She doesn't meet any of those requirements. I don't either. I am not a fan of Renaissance fairs or LARPing, but rpgs and radio controlled toys? hell yeah!
:smthumbup:

eta: Oops...kind of a hijack. Sorry, K and W!


----------



## bagdon

Wilson24 said:


> Hello everyone. I’m Wilson. Kendall’s husband.
> 
> I don’t even know how to begin. Kendall is an absolute queen, but I’ve been neglecting her for a long time. I see that now. And I don’t know how I could have let it happen. But I did. With excuses like work pressures, being tired, my game is on, I need to relax and read, and playing video games.
> 
> She has deserved better for a long time. And now I’m going to give her better, in large part due to the help of this web site.
> 
> I’m lucky to have seen my shortcomings before they destroyed my marriage.
> 
> First and foremost, thank you Kendall for caring enough to come here and seek advice.
> 
> And thank you people for guiding her, and for giving me the great advice you gave me in reacting to "Lee".
> 
> I’ve got so much more to say. But for now, I just want to say thanks.


WOW! What a blessing. I'm overwhelmed with joy for you both. I'm just reading this entire thread this morning and I gotta say I let loose a few tears, especially when you responded Wilson. We men can relate to your revelation. 
This has been a great way to start my morning! Back to work for me...:smthumbup:


----------



## Philat

Bean05 said:


> I have totally been in your shoes. Only my husband was extremely distant, he liked to drink and smoke pot (and lie about it), sex only happened MAYBE once every month or so... but I still loved him and he was sensitive and kinda sweet. But I got tired of all the other stuff and ended up talking marriage problems with a co-worker. We ended up getting into a 2 year long relationship that has ripped my marriage completely apart. If you think you're headed for an affair, it's time to either go to relationship bootcamp, or start unraveling the strings so you can each go your separate ways without hurting one another to the core. At least you don't have children in the mix.


Sorry for your difficulty, Bean. The thing about Kendall is that she realized where she might be headed before she started talking about any personal stuff with Lee. That was a very important line that she didn't cross.

Just as an aside (no threadjack intended), do you have any updates for your thread? Your story could be instructive.


----------



## Gabriel

WARNING - WILSON, IT IS WAAAAAY TOO EASY TO BACKSLIDE INTO LAZINESS

This is exactly what happened to me. My wife didn't go onto a forum, instead she came to me with her needs many times. I would fix myself for awhile, but then revert back to the old me. This was a cycle we battled for several years. 

After years of this, she turned to her best male friend, and fell in love with him. This began my close to 2000 posts on this forum starting in 2011. 

We have survived, but barely. And not without an unbelievable amount of pain for me, her loss of her good friend, humiliation, counseling sessions, lasting trust issues, resentment, etc. It's something I wouldn't wish upon an enemy, let alone two fine strangers on TAM.

Be very careful, and do not assume your issues are resolved now. It takes consistent work and breaking of hard-to-break habits to make it work. Be glad you caught this in time before an emotional affair began like my wife's did. But don't stop now.


----------



## 86857

Granny7 said:


> Kendall,
> My CH started an A by just having a lunch with a co-worker. It ended 3 yrs. later with 2 weekends together. It basically destroyed our marriage. I stayed with him, wish I hadn't and now it's 25 yrs. later and I'm having PTSD. He didn't give me the emotional support I needed either and I was approached by someone, but I told them, "I can't do that, I'm married." I loved him so much and now that love isn't the same. Not even sure it's even there anymore. We had been married 23 yrs. and now it's been 52 and we are both very unhappy at 70 yrs. old.
> Granny7


Very sad to hear Granny7. 
Do a 'Kendall'.
A bit of a twist on it, it's not the same scenario but it goes something like this. Start a thread and explain your story. Wait for the advice to come in. Then show your thread to that man of yours and tell him to WAKE UP. From the advice he will know what he has to do. No guarantees but I believe it's worth a shot. Nothing to lose given how sad you are. You guys have been married 52 years. It's time! 
Posters? 



Kendall said:


> OK, so I had the talk with Lee today. You all are about to get a good laugh. Just like I did.
> 
> He said this: “Kendall, please don’t end our friendship. It’s so rare and special when two people connect like we do”.


And you replied, "Oh Lee, it's so true. . . let's get married". :rofl:

The invitation to lunch & staying with you when you said no made me reasonably sure he was a player. But OMG, that answer was the most arrogant one he could have given. He might as well have said, "Never mind your husband, what we have is more important!" 

Great thing is that Lee, the classic wolf in sheep's clothing, was the silver lining in the cloud that just floated past you guys. 

He has affair-proofed your marriage. 

Now that ain't so bad. 

Onward and upward. :smthumbup:


----------



## distraughtfromtexas

Completely disagree, ballygirl 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Bean05

Philat said:


> Sorry for your difficulty, Bean. The thing about Kendall is that she realized where she might be headed before she started talking about any personal stuff with Lee. That was a very important line that she didn't cross.
> 
> Just as an aside (no threadjack intended), do you have any updates for your thread? Your story could be instructive.


I agree...Kendall has been wise in realizing that she is getting close to the line before she crosses it. I was honestly so angry and had so much built up resentment for my husband that I think deep down, I knew I was getting close to that line also, but I didn't care anymore. We had had the same arguments over and over. They always ended in empty promises and a lack of communication. My ordeal started 2 years ago. My husband and I have been separated for most of that time. Divorce papers have been written up...but I just can't bring myself to sign them. I can tell you this much...having an affair teaches you a lot of life lessons. I still don't really know where I stand as far as what I want the outcome of my situation to be. I'm extremely sentimental in all aspects of the word, so letting go of my husband has been very hard for me. But having a relationship with someone else has really opened my eyes to the type of relationship I want and what things I'm willing to tolerate in any relationship I'm in.


----------



## sh987

Been following this thread (without posting) since the beginning, and have a couple of thoughts:

-Good to see that Kendall recognized where this thing with Lee could go and took steps to make sure it didn't happen.
-Glad to hear that Wilson responded well to what Kendall had to say to him, and is doing what he needs to do. Just don't fall back into bad habits.
-Wilson being distant and uninvolved in the marriage was his 50% negative contribution. Each spouse puts in their share.
-Great job by Kendall to shut down Lee, both with your initial "I'll not be having male friends" speech to him, and the follow-up to his preposterous "I don't want to lose our connection" attempt by him afterwards.
-Kendall, have you considered what your negative contribution was to the marriage? You don't have to tell us here, but have you and Wilson talked about this together? No spouse is perfect, after all.
-Also: damned nice to see a positive story around here. It seems like there's not enough of them. Just keep making things positive between you two.


----------



## phillybeffandswiss

paul72 said:


> 1 - If you need a man to talk to find an old gram-pa whos plumbing


 Considering the guy I worked with, who made a pass at a woman 30 years his junior, we will disagree. Better to set boundaries early or not talk to the opposite sex at all, unless it is strictly work related.


----------



## Philat

Bean05 said:


> I agree...Kendall has been wise in realizing that she is getting close to the line before she crosses it. I was honestly so angry and had so much built up resentment for my husband that I think deep down, I knew I was getting close to that line also, but I didn't care anymore. We had had the same arguments over and over. They always ended in empty promises and a lack of communication. My ordeal started 2 years ago. My husband and I have been separated for most of that time. Divorce papers have been written up...but I just can't bring myself to sign them. I can tell you this much...having an affair teaches you a lot of life lessons. I still don't really know where I stand as far as what I want the outcome of my situation to be. I'm extremely sentimental in all aspects of the word, so letting go of my husband has been very hard for me. But having a relationship with someone else has really opened my eyes to the type of relationship I want and what things I'm willing to tolerate in any relationship I'm in.


Bean: Just bumped your thread in Ladies' Lounge.


----------



## helena4u

Kendall it's good to hear that you were able to cut this "impending" affair. It is dangerous to be comfortable with the opposite sex, most importantly if you are married. Even if you say that you are just friends, this is where most illicit affairs start. They talk, they share problems and eventually boom.. they have already fallen to the trap.

The best thing to do is to talk things out with your husband. My husband is similar with you... and after trying some time for him to become his best buddy.. I sort of " gave up" and learned to accept him as he is. I know he loves me so much.. he stays home most of the time to be with the kids and yes watch T.V. I liked it that way than spending his time with his buddies or somebody else right? But I learn to love him this way. I have girl friends as my best buddies and they fill up the need of having somebody to talk about anything under the sun. My husband knows this, and it's fine with him. Sometimes, our partners cannot be our best buddies, but they can be the best person who is capable of loving us the way we are.


----------



## wailea

Hi Kendall...

I have been married 23 years; together 24. One morning about five years ago, an old crush from high school found me on Facebook. He told me he had searched for me through the years, and I was extremely flattered! He told me how pretty I am, and complimented me numerous times. He was witty, smart, intelligent, and something between us just really connected on a level I have never had with my husband! An instant, online friendship began. 

Fast forward five years. He and I rarely go a single day without some form of communication (usually email). I am living a lie. I love my husband, but he is not emotionally vulnerable with me, and I crave someone who can be nurturing, comforting, vulnerable, etc. I have all of that with the other guy, and I have never been so torn. I never would have thought I'd wind up in an EA for five plus years; one that has been SO difficult (ok, impossible) to stop! I have thought of divorcing my husband for this man, but I have not been able to bring myself to do such a thing. 

In a nut shell, if your husband isn't meeting your emotional needs, and after talking, therapy, and all other options have been exhausted and he STILL cannot meet your needs, you need to move on BEFORE you bring children into the picture! I speak from experience. I married my husband when I was almost 28. I fell for him because he was responsible, a hard worker, close with his family, funny, fun, etc., but there were a couple red flags in the beginning that I should have paid attention to. I would hate to see you go through the hell I've gone through! 

I wish you luck with this. The longer you stay in a marriage where your needs are not being met, the more resentful you will become. Believe me. I am now in therapy, trying to sort it all out, and it's just emotionally draining! 

Good luck to you, and listen to your heart! But remember one thing, you might be trading one s*^t storm for another. The grass is not always greener. Whatever you do, don't bring kids into the picture if you're unhappy.

Good luck!


----------



## GusPolinski

wailea said:


> Hi Kendall...
> 
> I have been married 23 years; together 24. One morning about five years ago, an old crush from high school found me on Facebook. He told me he had searched for me through the years, and I was extremely flattered! He told me how pretty I am, and complimented me numerous times. He was witty, smart, intelligent, and something between us just really connected on a level I have never had with my husband! An instant, online friendship began.
> 
> Fast forward five years. He and I rarely go a single day without some form of communication (usually email). I am living a lie. I love my husband, but he is not emotionally vulnerable with me, and I crave someone who can be nurturing, comforting, vulnerable, etc. I have all of that with the other guy, and I have never been so torn. I never would have thought I'd wind up in an EA for five plus years; one that has been SO difficult (ok, impossible) to stop! I have thought of divorcing my husband for this man, but I have not been able to bring myself to do such a thing.
> 
> In a nut shell, if your husband isn't meeting your emotional needs, and after talking, therapy, and all other options have been exhausted and he STILL cannot meet your needs, you need to move on BEFORE you bring children into the picture! I speak from experience. I married my husband when I was almost 28. I fell for him because he was responsible, a hard worker, close with his family, funny, fun, etc., but there were a couple red flags in the beginning that I should have paid attention to. I would hate to see you go through the hell I've gone through!
> 
> I wish you luck with this. The longer you stay in a marriage where your needs are not being met, the more resentful you will become. Believe me. I am now in therapy, trying to sort it all out, and it's just emotionally draining!
> 
> Good luck to you, and listen to your heart! But remember one thing, you might be trading one s*^t storm for another. The grass is not always greener. Whatever you do, don't bring kids into the picture if you're unhappy.
> 
> Good luck!


Not to be overly blunt, but Kendall did what you should have done. In fact, you still have a chance to do it.

She perceived a problem, had the emotional wisdom to realize what could happen if she allowed herself to become too attached to this guy, sought advice, and spoke w/ her husband. Together, they're taking steps to strengthen their marriage.

In the end it might not work out for them. But either way, SHE DID THE RIGHT THING. So can you.

Best of luck to you.


----------



## sh987

This makes me wonder about something...

Scenario: Spouse 1 is in an emotional affair, and says they fell into it because their "needs weren't being met".

Question: since Souse 1 is engaged in an emotional affair, and is directing their energy towards another person, isn't it pretty damned difficult for Spouse 2 to meet the other spouse's emotional needs, even if they're trying quite hard to do so? It strikes me as extremely likely that Spouse 1 isn't open to accepting.


----------



## sh987

*** Sorry ***

Double post, for some reason.


----------



## Corkey88

Kendall said:


> But if I keep it just at work conversation at lunch, many times within a group setting, is it wrong to have a guy friend that I like talking to?
> 
> If it is, then I'll end it. I don't want an affair.


Listen ladies, if you are married and you have a guy "friend" who isn't gay and you find attractive, yes, this is inappropriate. Ask yourself this: If your husband was having lunches with a girl "friend" from work that he found attractive and easy to talk to, what would you think? 

I believe that friends of the opposite sex are trouble if you are in a committed relationship. This ultimately leads to temptation and temptation leads to cheating, especially when real life rears its' ugly head and you just need some excitement! It presents the easy way out.


----------



## Philat

sh987 said:


> This makes me wonder about something...
> 
> Scenario: Spouse 1 is in an emotional affair, and says they fell into it because their "needs weren't being met".
> 
> Question: since Souse 1 is engaged in an emotional affair, and is directing their energy towards another person, isn't it pretty damned difficult for Spouse 2 to meet the other spouse's emotional needs, even if they're trying quite hard to do so? It strikes me as extremely likely that Spouse 1 isn't open to accepting.


Game, set, match. No way the BS can compete. Which is why these affairs need to be ended abruptly and "violently" (not literally, but with exposure, filing for divorce, etc. All the TAM tools).


----------



## Gabriel

Corkey88 said:


> Listen ladies, if you are married and you have a guy "friend" who isn't gay and you find attractive, yes, this is inappropriate. Ask yourself this: If your husband was having lunches with a girl "friend" from work that he found attractive and easy to talk to, what would you think?
> 
> I believe that friends of the opposite sex are trouble if you are in a committed relationship. This ultimately leads to temptation and temptation leads to cheating, especially when real life rears its' ugly head and you just need some excitement! It presents the easy way out.


I wish my wife heard this exact thing from several people she respects. She simply doesn't believe this and never will.


----------



## Philat

Gabriel said:


> I wish my wife heard this exact thing from several people she respects. She simply doesn't believe this and never will.


Despite her own experience, Gabe? As I recall, she had this "friend" for 20 years that she fell in love with.


----------



## vellocet

Kendall said:


> Yes, my dad insisted on buying it for me a couple of years ago.
> 
> Guitar playing was the only thing we had in common, and he never spared any expense in us connecting that way. He died last year.


Ever played a Paul Reed Smith? I swear its the smoothest action on a fretboard ever.


----------



## Gabriel

Philat said:


> Despite her own experience, Gabe? As I recall, she had this "friend" for 20 years that she fell in love with.


My wife thinks opposite sex friends are fine even still. She's only gone NC with her OM because of my demands and boundaries. 

She thinks her EA was a dumb mistake and she "doesn't feel like that for him anymore". And it only happened after her multiple attempts to warn me, like Kendall did to Wilson. Therefore, in general, opposite sex friends should not be a problem.


----------



## Philat

Gabriel said:


> My wife thinks opposite sex friends are fine even still. She's only gone NC with her OM because of my demands and boundaries.
> 
> She thinks her EA was a dumb mistake and she "doesn't feel like that for him anymore". And it only happened after her multiple attempts to warn me, like Kendall did to Wilson. Therefore, in general, opposite sex friends should not be a problem.


Ugh. Exactly the same with me. You always wonder when the next bomb is going to go off.


----------



## Gabriel

Philat said:


> Ugh. Exactly the same with me. You always wonder when the next bomb is going to go off.


Yep. Ugh is right. I have steeled myself very well in case of apocalypse. Unfortunately, I'll never have full 100% faith I won't be hurt again. I miss that feeling. 

But I am probably more aware of my relationship and my wife's needs and shortcomings now. I've grown from it, even if I didn't want to.


----------



## Kendall

vellocet said:


> Ever played a Paul Reed Smith? I swear its the smoothest action on a fretboard ever.


I have not. But I've heard good things about them. Very good things.

My husband's Gibson Les Paul has the 50's neck and fret board. It's a really sweet board. But overall, I like my strat more. But my husband can get some of the most throaty, growling, dirty sounds from his Les Paul.

We both use an Egnater Tweaker 40-watt amp. And do they ever make some great sounds.


----------



## Kendall

Some people have recommended moving this thread to a different "part" of TAM. Should I do this? And if so, how and where?

Thanks.


----------



## Kendall

turnera said:


> Huh? What about HER watching more sports and less sitcoms? Why do YOU have to turn into HER clone? We're talking moderation here, Wilson - for BOTH of you.
> 
> It's good to cut back on the games; I can't imagine more than 5 or 6 hours a week being good for you, when there is so much more out in the real world to experience. What you two need is physical touch, clean air experiences, physical activity together. Hiking, tennis, rollerblading, high school basketball games, pottery class together...use your imagination. But get out of the house!


Yes tunera, we've talked about that. I've always wanted to watch sports with Wilson. I just don't understand much of what is happening during the games (football, basketball, baseball), and I have to ask a lot of questions. And in the past, I felt that I was bothering Wilson with all the questions.

But he's promised to help me understand, and be patient with my questions.

I will enjoy watching sports with him. I really will.


----------



## Kendall

MarriedManInHis40s said:


> I'd read over this thread, and I have to admit I felt a lot of people were very much over-reacting to Lee. From what you had written, I thought it was possible that his intentions were entirely innocent, and I was very much in the "you don't need to say anything" camp. You can always make the message stronger if need be, but once you've overdone it, that's that. He's offended and you look delusional. (Some people might not care, but I'm Canadian )
> 
> As it was, since you felt you needed to clear the air, I thought your "speech" played it just right, leaving him plenty of room to bow out with grace if his intentions had been innocent, but leaving no ambiguity that you needed him to bow out.
> 
> ...and he opened his mouth and ... ick. That was indeed a BS line, the Hail Mary pass from a player who realizes the game is almost lost. The cynics here had him pegged right from the start.


Thank you.

I've learned over the past week or 10 days that the "cynics" here are really very wise prophets. That BS line from Lee was what many here predicted would happen, so I was ready for it.

Those same "cynics" finally convinced me of the truth: that Lee was "playing me like a fiddle", as one poster put it.

The people here are like the best friends you can hope for when there's trouble in your marriage.


----------



## happi_g_more2

Kendall said:


> I've learned over the past week or 10 days that the "cynics" here are really very wise prophets. That BS line from Lee was what many here predicted would happen, so I was ready for it.
> 
> Those same "cynics" finally convinced me of the truth: that Lee was "playing me like a fiddle", as one poster put it.
> 
> The people here are like the best friends you can hope for when there's trouble in your marriage.


And dont forget the gift you got here. Open your eyes, stop being naive and remember that you have room for 1 man in your life. Your husband...period...end of story. Very few mixed sex relationships are truly 100% platonic. At a minimum, there is a mild EA going on. JMHO


----------



## plasmaguy

409 posts WOW!!!

I had breakfast this morning with a friend who's happily married and told him of what has taken place with Kendall and Wilson. 

My marriage failed two years ago and how I wish I'd known about TAM. This site has the potential to help so many couples. This thread being one in particular. 

The point I'm trying to make is I wish this thread couple be read by all the couples having problems with their marriage. The possibilities are amazing.


----------



## itsmyturn01

Kendall, thanks for posting. I feel I am in your exact same situation.


----------



## U.E. McGill

Kendall said:


> Yes tunera, we've talked about that. I've always wanted to watch sports with Wilson. I just don't understand much of what is happening during the games (football, basketball, baseball), and I have to ask a lot of questions. And in the past, I felt that I was bothering Wilson with all the questions.
> 
> 
> 
> But he's promised to help me understand, and be patient with my questions.
> 
> 
> 
> I will enjoy watching sports with him. I really will.



It's good that couples do things together, but I would also implore both of you to find your own thing. Hubby needs time with other men, an you need time with the girls. Men need time where other men make fun of them, carouse and generally behave like 5 year olds. On the other side women need to sit around and kibitz, share feelings etc. 


Women and men communicate differently. Quality time with the same sex reinforces bonds and needs that the opposite sex just can't. I particularly can't emphasize this enough for hubby. Get a hobby that doesn't involve your wife. You'll be better for it.


----------



## clipclop2

Wilson, Kendall mentioned that you don't like explaining what it's going on when you watch sports with her. Could you spend some time turning her into a fan of some sort? You shouldn't give up all of your guy stuff. 

You both need time apart as well. So don't go overboard trying to force closeness. If you try I suspect one of you will feel smothered after a while and all of these plans willlead to disappointment or resentment.

Take it slow. You dint need to change your entire life.


----------



## Kendall

Mrs. John Adams said:


> MY husband and I do EVERYTHING together. He never goes out with the boys..I never go out with the girls. We have been married 41 years...it works for us.


I'm sure Wilson will play some of his favorite shoot-em-up video games that I don't like, and I'm sure I'll play some guitar or bake (I love baking) when he's doing other things. I'm not going to demand 100% of his free time.

But that being said, I hope our lives are like Mr. and Mrs. John Adams in that we'd rather do things with one another than someone else. We've never really done "Nights out" without each other, but Wilson has his buddies over to our house to watch football.


----------



## Kendall

itsmyturn01 said:


> Kendall, thanks for posting. I feel I am in your exact same situation.


Please explain. Act now. Don't wait. If you're in the situation I was just in, then some predator is hoping for a chance to soon ruin your marriage, and possibly the lives of you and your spouse as well.

Start a thread here and get help.


----------



## Wilson24

clipclop2 said:


> Wilson, Kendall mentioned that you don't like explaining what it's going on when you watch sports with her. Could you spend some time turning her into a fan of some sort? You shouldn't give up all of your guy stuff.
> 
> You both need time apart as well. So don't go overboard trying to force closeness. If you try I suspect one of you will feel smothered after a while and all of these plans willlead to disappointment or resentment.
> 
> Take it slow. You dint need to change your entire life.


Thanks cc2.

Several posters have echoed your sentiments, so let me reaffirm that I will be patient and enjoy helping Kendall learn to know what's going on so she can watch and enjoy with me.

We've been distant the past couple years, and right now it feels so good to be close again. We'll work it out step by step, and we'll avoid extreme changes. And we'll modify when needed.


----------



## illwill

itsmyturn01 said:


> Kendall, thanks for posting. I feel I am in your exact same situation.


Dont be shy. We (most of us) wont bite.


----------



## 6301

Kendall said:


> I'm sure Wilson will play some of his favorite shoot-em-up video games that I don't like, and I'm sure I'll play some guitar or bake (I love baking) when he's doing other things. I'm not going to demand 100% of his free time.
> 
> But that being said, I hope our lives are like Mr. and Mrs. John Adams in that we'd rather do things with one another than someone else. We've never really done "Nights out" without each other, but Wilson has his buddies over to our house to watch football.


 Well if you love baking, then he should be like most men and hanging over your shoulder trying to snitch a hot cookie or two. You would have to kick me out of the kitchen although I fancy myself as a good cook and baker.


----------



## Allen_A

Kendall said:


> OK, get ready to laugh. Many of you warned me he would do this, and you were so right. And I was ready for it.


The behavior these guys demonstrate is textbook at this point.



Kendall said:


> He said this: “Kendall, please don’t end our friendship. It’s so rare and special when two people connect like we do”.


Ya, utter pile of nonsensical drivel.



Kendall said:


> And I actually laughed! I so did! Out loud! And he looked at me like I was crazy.
> 
> By that point I was enjoying it.
> 
> ...
> 
> I feel so free!


You are free.. healthy marriages are freeing.. much more than an affair is!



Kendall said:


> But without the help of you people here, a week ago I might have been naïve enough to have believed that BS. In fact, it’s actually quite scary to see just how right you all were. How he was just setting me up all along, setting a trap, and waiting for a chance to pounce.


I am certainly not trying to defend him, but be aware there are many AP that don't really have that detailed a game plan.

He's trouble for sure. No doubt, trouble for any married woman.

But some of these guys just think they are "in love" and just acting on it... and don't feel there's anything wrong with that.

Far too many people just have this ridiculous notion that "if it happens... it was meant to be"... They take a complete no-accountability attitude towards any damage that happens.

"The heart wants what the heart wants..."

It's hard to say if he was deliberately baiting you, or just a single guy doing what single guys do instinctively.

Either way, married women need to steer clear of that crap. And OM is accountable either way as well.


----------



## Kendall

Wilson and I identified a good marriage counselor today. We've got our first session on Friday. 

We were both "stuck" at home today due to bad (*good*) weather.


----------



## Wilson24

Kendall said:


> Wilson and I identified a good marriage counselor today. We've got our first session on Friday.
> 
> We were both "stuck" at home today due to bad (*good*) weather.


A poster earlier asked if Kendall had "owned up" so to speak, in her shortcomings in our marriage.

I just wanted to say that Kendall has never been the problem in our marriage. I've been so much in the wrong in my neglect, and that puts her so much in the right.

I know she's not perfect. And so does she. But compared to my complacency over the past 2 years, she is beyond perfect.

We're just so happy right now. We had a great day just to ourselves today, due to snow/ice closing our work places.


----------



## itsmyturn01

Thanks. I am trying to decide if and how much I want to post here. I am new and trying to figure out how safe I am on this site.

Also, my apologies to Kendall and Wilson... I do not mean to hijack this thread. I am very happy for you both!


----------



## turnera

My advice for a good marriage: watch Raising Hope and pay attention to the parents. Despite all the dysfunction in their lives, they are the most loving couple I've ever seen.


----------



## Kendall

Another day at home with Wilson due to inclement weather. Just what we need  for a second day in a row.

I found 3 want ads today that I'm interested in. One of them is a job at a company that one of my former co-workers now works at. She was a good friend, and we really enjoyed working together. She left my current company about a year ago. She's going to put in a good word for me with her boss. I so hope I get it! I'm qualified. We'll see. I applied online today.


----------



## Kendall

Wilson went back to work today. But my building got a bunch of water damage from frozen busted pipes so I'm at home again today. We have our first marriage counseling session today at 4:00.

Should we continue posting in this thread, or should we start another thread?

Thank You.


----------



## turnera

I'd prefer you stay in the same thread, so that people don't have to search around to find your whole story. You'll get better advice that way.


----------



## Wilson24

Kendall and I had our first marriage counsel session today. We were very pleased with the counselor. She seems like what we need.

Today was mainly a "get to know you" type session, but we did get into some specifics. She challenged Kendall's account and feelings for Lee, and she was pleased to say she doesn't think Kendall has or had any romantic feelings for Lee. And I believe that.

She also challenged my "complete forgiveness" of Kendall having a male friend that I didn't know about. I'm afraid I failed that one. She was able to ask and probe enough to show me that I still have some "Lee feelings/hatred" to overcome.

But the counselor said this is natural, and that she can see us soon putting this thing all behind us.

We feel good tonight.


----------



## ing

Wilson24 said:


> She also challenged my "complete forgiveness" of Kendall having a male friend that I didn't know about. I'm afraid I failed that one. She was able to ask and probe enough to show me that I still have some "Lee feelings/hatred" to overcome.
> 
> But the counselor said this is natural, and that she can see us soon putting this thing all behind us.
> 
> We feel good tonight.


i am glad you found a tough marriage counselor and that she challenged you. It is tough but so many of us would have loved to have the opportunity to have the conversations you are having now before an EA like you are.

Forgiveness is probably not going to be that hard. So kendall gets the hots for some guy. Can you think of a time you got the hots for another girl while married? It happens to all of us and is not really a problem when we are share our lives and are secure in our marriages. The "Us" "We" . Strengthen that and you are secure. Great news


----------



## illwill

She got the hots before she really "saw" him.


----------



## Kendall

Good news. 

As I said in an earlier post, I applied for a job online with a different company. One of my former co-workers now works there, and she and I were good friends and enjoyed working together. She's my age with similar interests.

She put in a good word for me with her boss. And I got a call this afternoon for a preliminary phone interview. It lasted about 10 minutes, and afterward the boss invited me in for a formal interview. It's set for Tuesday at 2:00.

I'm very qualified. And I would really enjoy the job. It involves a lot of computer graphics, but also some hand-drawn art work, which I really enjoy.

I'm excited.


----------



## Decorum

Wow a lot has transpired since I last checked in.

Kendall I was confident that you were going to do the right thing, and I really respect how you have gone about it.

Welcome Wilson24, much respect to you, you have your head on straight, and I am glad for the work you are both willing to do, I hope "better than ever" will be how the two of you will describe your relationship as you continue to work on it.

May I rehash for a bit.

That cheesy textbook line about being so "Connected" reminded me of Annie Ash (you can read her thread here)

She avoided a physical affair (the EA was full bore on) but she could never bring herself to see her AP as a selfish creep. She insisted that he was sincere but he was just not good for HER marriage.

BTW with regard to cheesy lines...
Annies husband is in law enforcement and I suspect is somewhat fearless, against much of our advice (to her) he decided to meet OM with Annie present, and have her tell him she did not want to see him again in person (a letter is better). The Om man looked past her husband and said "Annie I thought we were building something special together" instead of seeing that line for what it was he could tell she was reluctant and thought she was being forced to say it, asking "Annie is that what *YOU* really want" it was a despicable and disrespectable thing to do (this is why we say that NC and indifference is the best way). Annie still posts here but I have lost track of her as of late, as I recall they had two little girls at the time, she was carrying twins recently and as far as I know they have moved on together much better now.

But at the time, I had never watched someone struggle more to get over her AP. (It was also made harder by the fact that her husband was not as "on the ball" with re-focusing on the relationship as early as Wilson was). *I respect her for confessing to her husband and saving her family, but she did not experience the freedom you felt Kendall when you saw OM for who he was.* Good for you. To this day I believe that Annie's Om is still a threat to her marriage, how ever small a threat it may be.
If their relationship stays good I think they will be ok.

I think when someone gains our confidence and then flatters us its hard to believe they are a creep, partly because it says something about us, we want to believe we are the person they say we are or make us feel like, no one would be flattered by a creeps attention, are we creep prey after all?

An old Hebrew proverb says ..."A man who flatters his neighbor is spreading a net for his steps." ...Almost like a magician's misdirection there!

I am sure your creep meter is properly calibrated now.


My wife and I have struggled with some of the same lesions the two of you are facing, the effort pays off. Our youngest (of 4) has gone off to the University and I share a new small house with my friend, lover and the mother of my children. It is so worth whatever it takes to keep it healthy!

I just wanted to add my kudos to both your efforts and wish the two of you well.

Take care!


----------



## Kendall

Decorum said:


> Wow a lot has transpired since I last checked in.
> 
> Kendall I was confident that you were going to do the right thing, and I really respect how you have gone about it.
> 
> Welcome Wilson24, much respect to you, you have your head on straight, and I am glad for the work you are both willing to do, I hope "better than ever" will be how the two of you will describe your relationship as you continue to work on it.
> 
> May I rehash for a bit.
> 
> That cheesy textbook line about being so "Connected" reminded me of Annie Ash (you can read her thread here)
> 
> She avoided a physical affair (the EA was full bore on) but she could never bring herself to see her AP as a selfish creep. She insisted that he was sincere but he was just not good for HER marriage.
> 
> BTW with regard to cheesy lines...
> Annies husband is in law enforcement and I suspect is somewhat fearless, against much of our advice (to her) he decided to meet OM with Annie present, and have her tell him she did not want to see him again in person (a letter is better). The Om man looked past her husband and said "Annie I thought we were building something special together" instead of seeing that line for what it was he could tell she was reluctant and thought she was being forced to say it, asking "Annie is that what *YOU* really want" it was a despicable and disrespectable thing to do (this is why we say that NC and indifference is the best way). Annie still posts here but I have lost track of her as of late, as I recall they had two little girls at the time, she was carrying twins recently and as far as I know they have moved on together much better now.
> 
> But at the time, I had never watched someone struggle more to get over her AP. (It was also made harder by the fact that her husband was not as "on the ball" with re-focusing on the relationship as early as Wilson was). *I respect her for confessing to her husband and saving her family, but she did not experience the freedom you felt Kendall when you saw OM for who he was.* Good for you. To this day I believe that Annie's Om is still a threat to her marriage, how ever small a threat it may be.
> If their relationship stays good I think they will be ok.
> 
> I think when someone gains our confidence and then flatters us its hard to believe they are a creep, partly because it says something about us, we want to believe we are the person they say we are or make us feel like, no one would be flattered by a creeps attention, are we creep prey after all?
> 
> An old Hebrew proverb says ..."A man who flatters his neighbor is spreading a net for his steps." ...Almost like a magician's misdirection there!
> 
> I am sure your creep meter is properly calibrated now.
> 
> 
> My wife and I have struggled with some of the same lesions the two of you are facing, the effort pays off. Our youngest (of 4) has gone off to the University and I share a new small house with my friend, lover and the mother of my children. It is so worth whatever it takes to keep it healthy!
> 
> I just wanted to add my kudos to both your efforts and wish the two of you well.
> 
> Take care!


Thank you so much Decorum!

My failure to see Lee for what he was now makes me sick to my stomach. How could I have been so naive? I'm sort of haunted by how naive I was.

I went through 5 FUN years of college (double major) and I heard every line that any guy could ever say. Yet I was so naive to what Lee wanted. Maybe because he didn't give me any of those lines until our last meeting.

My wonderful husband Wilson has been so great through all of this. He's still not happy that I had Lee as a friend. But Wilson sees that I was committed enough to him to seek advice here once I suspected Lee was "on the prowl". And he certainly was.


----------



## Decorum

You are welcome Kendall. Your love and respect for Wilson were evident from your very first post, no doubt about it.

We cannot take anything for granted in this life, and your respect for your husband was like a protection for you.

One thing my wife has always done is guard herself from anything that would chip away at respect, I have had to learn to step up/man up to, but we are better together than we could have ever been alone.

Good feelings today 

Take care!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Kendall

Decorum said:


> You are welcome Kendall. Your love and respect for Wilson were evident from your very first post, no doubt about it.
> 
> We cannot take anything for granted in this life, and your respect for your husband was like a protection for you.
> 
> One thing my wife has always done is guard herself from anything that would chip away at respect, I have had to learn to step up/man up to, but we are better together than we could have ever been alone.
> 
> Good feelings today
> 
> Take care!
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Good feelings here too Decorum...really good feelings. 

Thank you.


----------



## illwill

Sounds like things are going great. If you decide to move to another section of TAM. Keep this thread here as example of how to do things right.


----------



## Kendall

illwill said:


> Sounds like things are going great. If you decide to move to another section of TAM. Keep this thread here as example of how to do things right.


OK, I'll leave this thread here. I'm so humbled that people want to read this. We feel so fortunate. Thank you.


----------



## Kendall

Well, I had my interview today at the other company I posted about a few days ago. It went well!

The boss talked to me for a long while. I brought in a portfolio of art and graphics work to show him. He reviewed it thoroughly, and then asked me to do some art and graphics images while he watched. He seemed very pleased. Then he introduced me around, and I saw my friend Kesha.

Afterward, the boss discussed salary and benefits. I was pleased with both.

In closing he said I was the last person to interview for the job, and that it will come down to a decision between me and another girl. He said I would know for sure about getting the job by Friday. He asked if I could turn in a 2-week notice on Monday if I’m hired, and I said yes.

I would really enjoy this job. It’s a raise and a 30-minute less commute each day. And there’s an on-site gym that is really well equipped (and free of charge). That’s a big plus for me, since I currently work out at a local gym that charges $45 per month.

I so hope I get it!


----------



## turnera

Yay! Jealous!


----------



## Kendall

Well, I got the job!!! I’m so happy.

The boss called me today and told me that of the candidates that interviewed for the job, it came down to me and one other applicant. And he actually offered her the job first, because she has 3 more years experience than I do. But she declined for some reason. So he offered the job to me and I accepted.

I appreciate him being open and honest and telling me that I was his 2nd choice. But I don’t care. I’m qualified, and I believe I’ll do a good job. And I’ll have a 30-minute less commute each day. And I’ll have an on-site gym that will save us $45 per month. And the best thing: I’ll be working closely with my good friend Kesha!

I’m turning in my notice first thing Monday morning.

Wilson and I are so thankful.


----------



## 6301

Kendall said:


> Well, I got the job!!! I’m so happy.
> 
> The boss called me today and told me that of the candidates that interviewed for the job, it came down to me and one other applicant. And he actually offered her the job first, because she has 3 more years experience than I do. But she declined for some reason. So he offered the job to me and I accepted.


 The boss? Bruce Springsteen? Wow! Seriously. Congrats!


----------



## illwill

Good for you! Bruce Springsteen is cool.


----------



## Carlchurchill

Oh no I also battle to bring up random conversation with my wife...it is actually very difficult to make small talk.

Its like you know everything about the person, so there is very little to add...does this happen to everybody?

Thanks for the heads up Kendall...women do need it more than men!


----------



## turnera

Carlchurchill said:


> Oh no I also battle to bring up random conversation with my wife...it is actually very difficult to make small talk.
> 
> Its like you know everything about the person, so there is very little to add...does this happen to everybody?


How much are you exposing yourself to things outside the tv and the video games and the computer? If you fill your mind with new stuff, you have TONS of things to talk about. Listen to NPR, who gives news about every subject under the sun; subscribe to NASA's Tech Briefs; sign up for a class together; take nature walks; have block parties to meet your neighbors; set up a jigsaw puzzle so you can sit side by side and let the words flow; train your dog...all these types of things give you stuff to talk about.


----------



## Kendall

illwill said:


> Good for you! Bruce Springsteen is cool.


Yes, Wilson and I both like the BOSS.


----------



## See_Listen_Love

Carlchurchill said:


> Oh no I also battle to bring up random conversation with my wife...it is actually very difficult to make small talk.
> 
> Its like you know everything about the person, so there is very little to add...does this happen to everybody?


I don't want to offend you, but when you see couples in hotels eating their breakfast in complete silence, or in restaurants, or on a terrace drinking coffee, where the rest of people have conversation... that is so enormously sad....

They are brain dead towards each other, because they themselves have died in the area of passion, new interests, exploring, experiencing all there is in the world.

You could start developing yourself, take up a class, start a new hobby, and read, read, read.

Close down you TV!


----------



## Kendall

Wilson and I had another session of marriage counseling yesterday. It went very well. Wilson is so into it and that makes all the difference. 

We have long, interesting, productive talks every night about our marriage. We're happier now than ever.


----------



## Wilson24

Kendall said:


> Wilson and I had another session of marriage counseling yesterday. It went very well. Wilson is so into it and that makes all the difference.
> 
> We have long, interesting, productive talks every night about our marriage. We're happier now than ever.


Marriage counseling has been a godsend for us. 

Kendall begged me to go to marriage counseling about a year ago, and I refused. How stupid and blind I was. If I had listened to her then, we would have fixed our marriage a full year ago.

Husbands, when your wife asks you to go to marriage counseling, just go. If she thinks you need it, then you need it. Listen to her and open your eyes.


----------



## Kendall

I turned in my notice today. My boss was so very nice. He's been such a good boss. He asked if there was anything he could do to convince me to stay. I said I just feel like I need a change. He accepted that and he asked me to to work either a one week notice or two weeks notice. I guess since there's not much to do right now due to starting a new project.

I opted for the one week notice. Wilson and I may be able to take a trip somewhere that next week.


----------



## MelodyAnn

Kendall and Wilson: Your story is so inspiring, and has such a great, happy ending on so many points. I have to admit it brought me to tears, reading about how you rejoined hearts after Kendall's confession. That took so much courage on Kendall's part, and awakened the love and compassion in Wilson's heart, after he was able to digest the initial shock. You are both very lucky to have each other. Kendall is honest and treats her husband with respect, and Wilson reciprocates that with his insights into the relationship and willingness to work on it. Congratulations on your finding each other again on a more intimate level, on a successful start to marital counseling, and on Kendall's new job!! So very happy for you two, and only wish every couple could find their way as you have .


----------



## illwill

Keep posting.


----------



## Kendall

One of the girls I used to lunch with came by my desk today. She said all the old crowd misses me at lunch in the cafeteria. I guess Lee has kept his mouth shut. They heard I was leaving for another company, and wanted to give me a little going away lunch in the cafeteria.

I thanked her, but said I was super busy with lunch-time errands the rest of the week. Putting that statement through the BS translator yields “I don’t want to be around Lee”. It makes me sick at my stomach to even think about him.

Then she gave me a “farewell card” from the lunch crowd. Everybody wrote something. Lee wrote “Gonna miss u. Plz keep in touch”. He’s freakin crazy.

I threw the card in the bathroom trash can. Of course I told Wilson about it after work, and he was fine. He’s just about over Lee.

But Friday afternoon can’t come soon enough for me.


----------



## See_Listen_Love

You are amazing!


----------



## Kendall

See_Listen_Love said:


> You are amazing!


Thank you so much. I am forever humbled by the wonderful people here who compliment us and want to read our story. Wilson and I are so thankful. Please know that.

Two more days till my time at my current company is up! 

Wilson and I are planning a trip to Gatlinburg, Tennessee next week. That's where we went for our honeymoon.


----------



## john1068

Kendall said:


> Thank you so much. I am forever humbled by the wonderful people here who compliment us and want to read our story. Wilson and I are so thankful. Please know that.
> 
> Two more days till my time at my current company is up!
> 
> Wilson and I are planning a trip to Gatlinburg, Tennessee next week. That's where we went for our honeymoon.


Cool place. I was camping just up the road last week with my family in Pigeon Forge...Dollywood...Have a great time!


----------



## GusPolinski

Kendall said:


> Thank you so much. I am forever humbled by the wonderful people here who compliment us and want to read our story. Wilson and I are so thankful. Please know that.
> 
> Two more days till my time at my current company is up!
> 
> Wilson and I are planning a trip to Gatlinburg, Tennessee next week. That's where we went for our honeymoon.


Gatlinburg/Sevierville/Pigeon Forge -- great place! Especially around the holidays!


----------



## Kendall

Well, a wakeup tomorrow and a half-day of work (it takes another inefficient half-day to "process out"), and I'm on to a new job away from the baggage here (i.e Lee).

Wilson and I leave for Gatlinburg on Sunday morning. This is a 2nd honeymoon for us! We're so excited!

Cold days walking the Gatlinburg streets and shopping. Good restaurant food for warmth and comfort. And white hot nights in our hotel room.   

This is possible only because of the great advice we received here. We're both eternally and gladly indebted to the great people here who helped us out of the goodness of their hearts. You all deserve the satisfaction of knowing how much you helped a couple who really needed help.

Thank you all so much.


----------



## Kendall

Well, yesterday (my last day) went smoothly. I'll be starting my new job one week from Monday.

Wilson and I spent last night and today shopping and packing for our trip tomorrow. Just being together preparing for a fun 2nd honeymoon has been almost as romantic as the coming week will be.


----------



## turnera

Remember to spend 15 hours a week together.


----------



## Kendall

turnera said:


> Remember to spend 15 hours a week together.


OK, we will.

We're leaving now. I'll post again when we get back.


----------



## U.E. McGill

Remember to spend some time apart too.


----------



## Plan 9 from OS

Just remember that maintaining a healthy balance between togetherness and time apart is what is most important. Each couple will have their own thresholds.


----------



## Healer

Gotta say, I really am sick of all the blame, subtle or otherwise, that gets put on betrayed husbands. There is this underlying sentiment that women cheat because they have sh*tty, neglectful husbands who ignore their wive's needs. Now of course in some cases that's true. But guess what? Just because a woman "feels" neglected or whatever by their husband, it doesn't mean they actually are, or that the husband is doing something wrong. Again, I'll slap the disclaimer on here that there ARE neglectful, sh*tty husbands. 

You know what else there are? People who can't be pleased or made happy, no matter what. People who have unrealistic expectations of other people, or what a marriage is. People who rely entirely on their spouse for all of their happiness - when it's impossible to give it to them.

Marriage is like anything else in this world - the shininess and excitement wears off. People have kids, get jobs, work their asses off and settle into routines. Marriage is not a honeymoon. 

"My needs weren't being met, so I cheated". Well guess what? For every cheating woman out there whose "needs weren't being met", there's a betrayed husband whose needs weren't being met either. They were treated like sh*t, ignored, neglected too. Or that was their perception. 

Grow up. You don't get enough attention from your husband? You're so f*cking miserable that you feel justified in lying, cheating, stabbing in the back, getting some on the side then coming home to your poor sucker of a husband and pretending like all is well? It's selfish, immature, cruel, mean-spirited entitlement. My stbxww made me f*cking miserable. She was mean, untrusting and suffocating. And I SHOULD have left her, but because I took marriage vows, and those vows meant what they were supposed to mean (to me), I kept them. 

Some people, no matter how hard you work to please them, are simply entitled malcontents. 

If your life is SO MISERABLE, and your husband is so intolerable, then f*cking get a divorce. Don't stoop to the lowest possible level, destroy lives, cause unfathomable pain and anguish, because you "have a right to be happy". Be a decent adult human being, talk to your SO, and if sh*t don't change, LEAVE THE MARRIAGE.

Feeling neglected is not justification for turning into complete and utter lowlife POS that destroys spouses and children. Grow the f*ck up and realize that life as an adult isn't always exactly what you want it to be. Life happens. If yours is so unbearable, change it, but without murdering the souls of your spouse and children.


----------



## Healer

kristin2349 said:


> What part of that was not just an attack? She posted something honest showed people an ugly scar she could keep quiet.
> 
> So you attack her for offering the ugly truth of the aftermath. If it makes you sick ignore it. But don't get malicious. It's counterproductive. Her experience has so much value. She could go on about her day and act like it didn't happen. She's here helping someone who CAN stop it NOW!


I think it's great that she has found redemption and is here trying to help others.

By the same token, I see no need to sugarcoat what she did...she offered the Lifetime Network version of what she did, the poster you're calling out gave the Dateline NBC version.


----------



## Healer

sinnister said:


> I disagree. If you love your wife and she tells you she is unhappy about something you probably should have been doing anyways, you shouldn't be blindsided by her willingness to explore someone else who can meet her needs.


Asinine and utterly disgusting.


----------



## Healer

clipclop2 said:


> Kendal hasn't done any wounded bird crap.
> 
> Do you really believe the world is flat?
> 
> More than one thing can be true at any one time.
> 
> If Mrs JA says she felt alone and felt a void, she felt alone and felt a void. Just because you don't like her reality doesn't deny its truth.
> 
> Just because you don't like how the story turned out, doesn't mean it didn't happen that way.
> 
> Jesus Christ. There is nothing a cheater can say that will make a damn bit of difference to some people because they don't care about how things happened or why they happened. They are just pissed they happened at all.
> 
> Little wonder some cheaters finally say: **** YOU.
> 
> I think you are trying to pick a fight. I think you are also denying someone else's humanity. This is HER life story. It isn't yours. You don't get to tell her how she felt or what was going on in her mind.
> 
> Further, there is NOTHING to be learned if all you want to do is deny the vulnerability that someone felt that allowed them to fall into the pit of infidelity.
> 
> That's right. You should never have felt vulnerable in the first place. All of that is your fault. I'm not surprised you cheated. That's just the kind of piece of crap person you are. You never counted before and you count even less now.
> 
> Son/Daughter: I want to talk to you about vulnerability. Voids. Disconnects within marriage. They don't exist. And because they don't exist, you will never fall prey to infidelity. So, you don't have to try to address those things should you mistakenly feel vulnerable. Everything happens in a vacuum. Your relationship does not evoke feelings within you, either good or bad. You are an island. Islands never cry or cheat.
> 
> Cheating=bad.
> 
> Denying reality=worse.


Oh please! "Fall into the pit" of infidelity. It's a conscious choice, ffs. It's not some giant, taloned bird with fangs that drip with the blood of virgins that swoops down and somehow causes you to rub your genitalia on someone other than your spouse.

So going by your philosophy, we should teach children that "well, you better make your spouse happy all the time (even if that's impossible), or they will have sex with someone other than you, and you will have had it coming".


----------



## Healer

clipclop2 said:


> Is that how you would prefer we treat people? Is that the best way to support a young marriage?


No no, keep justifying their cheating. It's obviously very effective.


----------



## Headspin

Healer said:


> Gotta say, I really am sick of all the blame, subtle or otherwise, that gets put on betrayed husbands. There is this underlying sentiment that women cheat because they have sh*tty, neglectful husbands who ignore their wive's needs. Now of course in some cases that's true. But guess what? Just because a woman "feels" neglected or whatever by their husband, it doesn't mean they actually are, or that the husband is doing something wrong. Again, I'll slap the disclaimer on here that there ARE neglectful, sh*tty husbands.
> 
> You know what else there are? People who can't be pleased or made happy, no matter what. People who have unrealistic expectations of other people, or what a marriage is. People who rely entirely on their spouse for all of their happiness - when it's impossible to give it to them.
> 
> Marriage is like anything else in this world - the shininess and excitement wears off. People have kids, get jobs, work their asses off and settle into routines. Marriage is not a honeymoon.
> 
> "My needs weren't being met, so I cheated". Well guess what? For every cheating woman out there whose "needs weren't being met", there's a betrayed husband whose needs weren't being met either. They were treated like sh*t, ignored, neglected too. Or that was their perception.
> 
> Grow up. You don't get enough attention from your husband? You're so f*cking miserable that you feel justified in lying, cheating, stabbing in the back, getting some on the side then coming home to your poor sucker of a husband and pretending like all is well? It's selfish, immature, cruel, mean-spirited entitlement. My stbxww made me f*cking miserable. She was mean, untrusting and suffocating. And I SHOULD have left her, but because I took marriage vows, and those vows meant what they were supposed to mean (to me), I kept them.
> 
> Some people, no matter how hard you work to please them, are simply entitled malcontents.
> 
> If your life is SO MISERABLE, and your husband is so intolerable, then f*cking get a divorce. Don't stoop to the lowest possible level, destroy lives, cause unfathomable pain and anguish, because you "have a right to be happy". Be a decent adult human being, talk to your SO, and if sh*t don't change, LEAVE THE MARRIAGE.
> 
> Feeling neglected is not justification for turning into complete and utter lowlife POS that destroys spouses and children. Grow the f*ck up and realize that life as an adult isn't always exactly what you want it to be. Life happens. If yours is so unbearable, change it, but without murdering the souls of your spouse and children.


Absofkinglutely


----------



## Wilson24

U.E. McGill said:


> Remember to spend some time apart too.


That's hard for us right now.


----------



## Wilson24

Healer and Headspin,

I can't discern from your posts whether you're supporting us or defending us or both or neither...maybe I'm just too tipsy, or just plain too stupid to tell.

Whatever it is, we have benefited from this web site. We are thankful, and more in love than ever. We've been married over 5 years, and can't get enough of one another right now both physically and emotionally.

I count myself very lucky. Hopefully, my inability to discern the meaning of your posts is just my stupidity in trying to understand.

Beyond that, I hope you both are having as much fun as Kendall and I are right now...

Peace.


----------



## Headspin

Wilson24 said:


> Healer and Headspin,
> 
> I can't discern from your posts whether you're supporting us or defending us or both or neither...maybe I'm just too tipsy, or just plain too stupid to tell.
> 
> Whatever it is, we have benefited from this web site. We are thankful, and more in love than ever. We've been married over 5 years, and can't get enough of one another right now both physically and emotionally.
> 
> I count myself very lucky. Hopefully, my inability to discern the meaning of your posts is just my stupidity in trying to understand.
> 
> Beyond that, I hope you both are having as much fun as Kendall and I are right now...
> 
> Peace.


Peace to you too and enjoy that trip !

I support any reconciliation that is done in the true spirit of positivity honesty and if there's any guilt or remorse to be played out then a successful recon will need those in spades. 

For me I hope you can both repair any damage that may have potentially destroyed everything - it looks like you've got to the brink and hopefully can be even closer together than ever before  

It is worth noting that a thread like this will always throw up 'side issues' between forum members that crop up directly and indirectly of the subject in hand. I happen to agree with Healers general perception about blame shifting that goes on with wayward spouses. For me if a marriage has gone beyond the saving for one party then keep trying and if all else fails - finish it. Don't then use spurious resentments to fuel infidelity and completely rip your loved one families and kids to shreds. That is the cowards way through. It's the "Yeah I'm sorry .......but" syndrome. That's his point and I think most of us agree with it

Forget all that, now go and sort out Mrs 'Wilson' and enjoy yourselves !


----------



## Wilson24

Headspin said:


> Peace to you too and enjoy that trip !
> 
> I support any reconciliation that is done in the true spirit of positivity honesty and if there's any guilt or remorse to be played out then a successful recon will need those in spades.
> 
> For me I hope you can both repair any damage that may have potentially destroyed everything - it looks like you've got to the brink and hopefully can be even closer together than ever before
> 
> It is worth noting that a thread like this will always throw up 'side issues' between forum members that crop up directly and indirectly of the subject in hand. I happen to agree with Healers general perception about blame shifting that goes on with wayward spouses. For me if a marriage has gone beyond the saving for one party then keep trying and if all else fails - finish it. Don't then use spurious resentments to fuel infidelity and completely rip your loved one families and kids to shreds. That is the cowards way through. It's the "Yeah I'm sorry .......but" syndrome. That's his point and I think most of us agree with it
> 
> Forget all that, now go and sort out Mrs 'Wilson' and enjoy yourselves !


Thank you.


----------



## Kendall

We're back from our trip. It was wonderful.   

I start my new job on Monday. I'm looking forward to it.

This thread seems to have run its course, but Wilson and I will continue to reply to questions and comments.

Thank you all.


----------



## Philat

Best of luck to you both. Check in now and again.


----------



## Thound

Kendall said:


> We're back from our trip. It was wonderful.
> 
> I start my new job on Monday. I'm looking forward to it.
> 
> This thread seems to have run its course, but Wilson and I will continue to reply to questions and comments.
> 
> Thank you all.


So happy for the both of you.
Love your avatar. Looks just like my strat.


----------



## broder62

Kendall said:


> Hello. I’m here trying to determine if I’m headed for an affair.
> 
> My husband and I are both 28 years old. We’ve been together for 7 years, married for 5 years, with pretty good jobs and no children (2 dogs).
> 
> I love my husband, and I believe he loves me too. We’ve had a good marriage. We argue every now and then, but not much, and our arguments never get ugly.
> 
> Like most marriages, ours was blissful for a while, but has become “vanilla” over time.
> 
> The problem is, for about the past 2 years, my husband won’t talk to me as much as I need. Things like casual conversation, joking and laughing, and being together just for the sake of being together. We have good sex usually twice per week, but afterwards and until the next time we have sex, we’re kind of like “roommates”. He likes to watch sports, play video games, and read. His doesn’t have the same need for conversation and just being together like I do. This has been the norm for about the past 2 years.
> 
> I’ve talked to him several times about this. And every time he just says something like “We’re fine” and blames his quietness on pressures of work and being tired. I mentioned marriage counseling once, but he said no.
> 
> I have no reason to believe he’s having an affair. There are none of the classic signs. And I’ve checked his cell phone, email, etc. (I know all his passwords). As far as I can tell, he’s not trying to hide anything. I think he’s just in a lazy, “take me for granted”, contented state. And I’m left feeling incomplete and lonely.
> 
> So there’s a nice guy at work (Lee) who’s about my age. And it’s very nice talking to him. He jokes and makes me laugh. He likes to talk about the things I like to talk about. Art, music, dogs, movies. We first met at work in the cafeteria while sitting among mutual friends. We still sit with those friends at lunch, but when the group doesn’t show up, Lee and I still sit together (just the two of us) and talk.
> 
> We’ve never met outside of work. We’ve never emailed or texted or talked on the phone. We’ve never touched inappropriately. Our conversations have never crossed the line. I’ve never talked bad about my husband to him. We just talk. But for the sake of honesty and completeness, I should also say he’s very attractive and single, and he doesn’t have a girlfriend right now. And we have so much in common.
> 
> So yesterday it was just us two together in the cafeteria at work, and he said the food didn’t look good to him, and he asked me out for lunch at a restaurant. I told him I couldn’t go because I had to make up missed time earlier in the week, and had only 30 minutes for lunch. But that wasn’t true. The truth was, I really wanted to go with him, but I thought better of it. And then he ended up staying with me anyway and we had lunch in the cafeteria.
> 
> I feel so confused. I want my husband to be my best friend, but he’s just not interested. And I’ve tried to change his mind. Several times.
> 
> Is it safe for me to continue talking to Lee in just an at-work, friendly manner like it’s been so far? Or am I headed for trouble? I’m not naïve. I know that many affairs have begun this way. But I need a friend that I can just talk to. I don’t have any sisters or close girl friends.
> 
> Am I already in an emotional affair? I don’t think I am. I’ve never told my husband about Lee, because my husband doesn’t like to talk about much these days.
> 
> Please advise. Thank you.
> 
> *** Edited: I'm happy to revise this post and say that, because of the great advice I received here, I did not have an affair.


I have not yet read the advice from others because I'm stuck here. But, in my opinion, you're already in an affair. An affair begins in the heart. Some things you said I want to address with you. First, if you feel "incomplete and lonely" - that ultimately is YOUR responsibility. Ultimately, your feelings are YOUR issues. Yes, your husband has a responsibility "to" you and "the marriage", but, the minute you start blaming someone else for your feelings - it's wrong. Those feelings are not a license to do something like an affair - which you need to realize you ARE IN. Second - Lee showing up (you blamed him) or you showing up when the group is not there....that's a date. Sorry, it is. That's crossing the line. Your first responsibility on the totem pole is fidelity, trust, loyalty, protection, etc; You're failing your vows. Own it. Stop it. Your conversations didn't cross the line? Yes they did. If he knows about your personal feelings about anything outside of work or profession - you crossed the line. If you know he doesn't have a girlfriend, the conversation's crossed the line. He's NOT nice. Open your eyes. Anyone who does what he's doing with a married woman is a predator. Also, you're not respected. If he respected you, he'd respect your marriage vows. There's affair all over this. Then, moving on, he asks you out to lunch because of the food. Uh.....yeah.....okay.......so, he'd ask the fat chick or the gay co-worker out because of the food. It's progression of the affair is what that is. And the truth you should have landed him is I love and respect my husband and my eternal vow to him (above crappy food). You are nurturing an affair. You dont need friends to talk to. That's an excuse. Get a dog, call your mom, go to church and join a woman's group, or female meet-up. You're justifying and scapegoating and playing games with TAM and yourself. You didn't mention Lee because your husband doesn't like to talk these days? Really? That's the reason? Not that he would go ballistic on you? I have a strong feeling he's like to talk if you read him what you just wrote. Try it and let us know what happens. Stop cheating on your marriage, vows and husband. He doesn't deserve it and you are becoming a mistress and a cheater and adultress. Is that what you want to be known as? Would you parent's and grandparent's be proud? Is that what you always wanted to be when you grew up?


----------



## broder62

Kendall said:


> But if I keep it just at work conversation at lunch, many times within a group setting, is it wrong to have a guy friend that I like talking to?
> 
> If it is, then I'll end it. I don't want an affair.


Not only is it wrong, you're violating your vow. Your job in marriage is to protect it. You do remember saying for better for worse, right? You KNOW he's not a friend, he's stimulating your heart, your genitals - you know he is - and your mind. Stop it. It's an affair. You're IN an affair!!


----------



## broder62

Allen_A said:


> If you are this eager to have a "guy friend" that you can "talk to" that should be speaking volumes to you. You clearly are already fired up to move ahead on this.
> 
> Infidelity is like a credit card...
> 
> You may find this whole thing entertaining for the short run, but the invoice will show up in your mailbox eventually.. and you won't be able to afford the balance you have racked up.
> 
> Just put the item back on the shelf and get out of the department store.


That's an awesome analogy. True.


----------



## pidge70

broder62 said:


> Not only is it wrong, you're violating your vow. Your job in marriage is to protect it. You do remember saying for better for worse, right? You KNOW he's not a friend, he's stimulating your heart, your genitals - you know he is - and your mind. Stop it. It's an affair. You're IN an affair!!


Holy crap! Read the entire thread....geesh.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## broder62

Kendall said:


> Would it maybe be a good idea for me to have my husband (and Lee) read this thread?


Forgive my realtime posts here, but, did she really ask this? Lee is the husband at this point. Hey, you two read this and fight over me, okay? I sense a narcissist.


----------



## broder62

pidge70 said:


> Holy crap! Read the entire thread....geesh.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Alright, alright, alright. I got it. I will.


----------



## broder62

Okay, read the thread. I'm still concerned about a couple of things. One, is what's being learned by Kendall - rather what is being taught to Kendall - and that's this - "If my husband does his job, then I won't cheat". Kendall should be VERY CONCERNED about the undertones, overtones, sidewaystones as to HER RESPONSIBILITY FOR HER OWN FEELINGS AND ACTIONS. Yes, there is cause and effect, but, affairs, male friends, etc; are off the frigging table. Those are non-negotiable defaults even if your husband was abusive. The place for communication with friends are HEALTHY women who support the value of marriage. The place for bad feelings if your husband ignores you is church or a counselor. I'd feel much better if she took some responsibility here - but she hasn't that I can see. It was "Lee's fault" and her husband's fault. No, it was ALL YOU because you are the CEO of your feelings and actions. They could drop me in the middle of a Miss Universe orgy with everyone of them in heat for me and I would NOT CHEAT on my partner. I'm really happy for all the rainbows and unicorns, but like cancer, where there is one cell remaining can bring it back - I still see cells being ignored here. Kendall, you have to be concerned about your feelings dictating your life. Also, you need to get Wilson off the hook completely and his neglect is a seperate problem. Don't tie it to what you did. That's a cop out. Also, Lee had nothing to do with this. He acted, you responded. And every response to every request was really "YES SIR, MAY I HAVE ANOTHER". Your need for attention, love, affection needs to be within you for yourself, or if you're spiritual, with God. Wilson, you are NOT responsible for this. Your actions had an effect on your wife, but not responsible. I'm not trying to rain on your parade. But, don't let the feelings overcome the reality of the cancer cells. It comes down to personal responsibility, character and integrity. For better or worse till death do us part. Now let me balance this with some praise. I'm glad you had the courage to get help and get out of this thing. I'm glad you came out of this with a better marriage. Now, deal with the cancer cells or it can come back.


----------



## See_Listen_Love

Broder, you are new here, make it please a habit to read at leasts OP's posts, all of them, before doing the thread all over. You waist other peoples time and space on the forum. Good luck with it.


----------



## omoplata

Pretty amazing how some people can have an affair or sabotage a relationship so quickly. Why is it ok for women to have "guy friends" but it's not ok for men to have "girl friends"? Seems to be a universal double standard that women have. Tip for the women out there, as Chris Rock puts simply: "Men don't have platonic friends. We just have women we haven't ****ed yet. As soon as I figure this out, I'm in there." Your "guy friends" want to sleep with you and will sleep with you if given the chance.


----------



## broder62

See_Listen_Love said:


> Broder, you are new here, make it please a habit to read at leasts OP's posts, all of them, before doing the thread all over. You waist other peoples time and space on the forum. Good luck with it.


This is hilarious. First, it's waste, not waist. Second, I stated it, owned it and corrected it. If you read my post you would've known it - and if you did read it but ignored it than it's you "waisting" people's time. Or are you looking for attention. Third, try following your own advice as my last post reflected new and current content. Fourth, I'm not new but almost two years in. Thanks role model. I appreciate your feedback. Pfft.


----------



## kristin2349

Mrs. John Adams said:


> Broder...you do realize you are just talking to yourself...right?
> I mean if that's what you want to do have at it...but this ones a dead horse.


:iagree:


----------



## Maricha75

See_Listen_Love said:


> Broder, you are new here, make it please a habit to read at leasts OP's posts, all of them, before doing the thread all over. You waist other peoples time and space on the forum. Good luck with it.


Oh, no, he's been here for a couple years.

Broder, how's the new wife? Did you ever get that paperwork straightened out so you were legally married? Haven't seen you post much lately...


----------



## Kendall

broder62 said:


> Okay, read the thread. I'm still concerned about a couple of things. One, is what's being learned by Kendall - rather what is being taught to Kendall - and that's this - "If my husband does his job, then I won't cheat". Kendall should be VERY CONCERNED about the undertones, overtones, sidewaystones as to HER RESPONSIBILITY FOR HER OWN FEELINGS AND ACTIONS. Yes, there is cause and effect, but, affairs, male friends, etc; are off the frigging table. Those are non-negotiable defaults even if your husband was abusive. The place for communication with friends are HEALTHY women who support the value of marriage. The place for bad feelings if your husband ignores you is church or a counselor. I'd feel much better if she took some responsibility here - but she hasn't that I can see. It was "Lee's fault" and her husband's fault. No, it was ALL YOU because you are the CEO of your feelings and actions. They could drop me in the middle of a Miss Universe orgy with everyone of them in heat for me and I would NOT CHEAT on my partner. I'm really happy for all the rainbows and unicorns, but like cancer, where there is one cell remaining can bring it back - I still see cells being ignored here. Kendall, you have to be concerned about your feelings dictating your life. Also, you need to get Wilson off the hook completely and his neglect is a seperate problem. Don't tie it to what you did. That's a cop out. Also, Lee had nothing to do with this. He acted, you responded. And every response to every request was really "YES SIR, MAY I HAVE ANOTHER". Your need for attention, love, affection needs to be within you for yourself, or if you're spiritual, with God. Wilson, you are NOT responsible for this. Your actions had an effect on your wife, but not responsible. I'm not trying to rain on your parade. But, don't let the feelings overcome the reality of the cancer cells. It comes down to personal responsibility, character and integrity. For better or worse till death do us part. Now let me balance this with some praise. I'm glad you had the courage to get help and get out of this thing. I'm glad you came out of this with a better marriage. Now, deal with the cancer cells or it can come back.


Thank you broder, but you are so over-reacting. Did you really read the entire thread?

There was no EA, and definitely no PA. I was naive, but I was NOT anywhere near breaking my marriage vows. The "friendship" started to feel weird to me, so I sought help here and got it. My eyes were opened by the wise people here, and I acted to stop things before they got started.

No cancer cells here.


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## Philat

The dangers of bumping a thread that has pretty much run its course (oops, I just did it!).


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## See_Listen_Love

A success story never tires me, I love how this ended.


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## broder62

kristin2349 said:


> :iagree:


Apparently not because I'm talking to you and Kendall liked your post.


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## broder62

Kendall said:


> Thank you broder, but you are so over-reacting. Did you really read the entire thread?
> 
> There was no EA, and definitely no PA. I was naive, but I was NOT anywhere near breaking my marriage vows. The "friendship" started to feel weird to me, so I sought help here and got it. My eyes were opened by the wise people here, and I acted to stop things before they got started.
> 
> No cancer cells here.


If you read my posts, yes. Yes, there was an emotional affair. You're in denial. Naive? Please post your wedding vows. Did it include having lunches with other men, the possibility of affairs? I'd like to know what your vow was. It wasn't a friendship. It was a desire in your heart and friendship was the label used to define "haven't had sex yet". The reality is you stopped things after it got started. Don't deceive yourself. Why? Because if you don't recognize that for what it is, next time this happens (and there will be based on how your attitude and denial is), you're going to permit yourself to go this far and think it's okay. It's not okay what you did. If you tell yourself it was, and that's considered "before it started", you're going to do it again. That's wisdom. You may not like the way I'm talking to you, but the content is wisdom. Pay attention to what I'm saying, not how I'm saying it - which is not important other than you liking me - which is not the point. You betrayed your husband. You betrayed your vows. You should not be having lunch or personal conversations by yourself with men anymore than your husband should be doing that with women. Also, your heart - when you lay down at bed at night and stare at the ceiling in your thoughts - you KNOW what was in your heart - and that was desire and consideration for that other man. If you start fooling yourself, you're in deeper trouble than you think.


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## broder62

Philat said:


> The dangers of bumping a thread that has pretty much run its course (oops, I just did it!).


Ugh...put your reading glasses on - this thread never stopped and the only reason I saw it was because it was at the top. The dangers of saying something completely false. Also, it hasn't run it's course. There is denial all over this and I'm surprised I'm the only brilliant one pointing that out to her. Are you trying to make friends and influence people, or are you trying to help her help her marriage. A rainbow pooping unicorn at the honeymoon of a reconciliation will burn out and if she does not nip that wart, mole cancer cell in the bud, it WILL return. Kendall, you need to go deeper or you are at risk, your husband is at risk and your marriage is at risk. I don't care if you publicize it, but you need to follow the popcorn trail backwards beyond your actions. Before you acted, it passed your mind, judgement, etc; and went through your heart. You ALLOWED and SIGNED-UP for everything that happened. You weren't naive. You made wrong choices. Don't play the naive card. You're deluding yourself.


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## Kendall

broder62 said:


> If you read my posts, yes. Yes, there was an emotional affair. You're in denial. Naive? Please post your wedding vows. Did it include having lunches with other men, the possibility of affairs? I'd like to know what your vow was. It wasn't a friendship. It was a desire in your heart and friendship was the label used to define "haven't had sex yet". The reality is you stopped things after it got started. Don't deceive yourself. Why? Because if you don't recognize that for what it is, next time this happens (and there will be based on how your attitude and denial is), you're going to permit yourself to go this far and think it's okay. It's not okay what you did. If you tell yourself it was, and that's considered "before it started", you're going to do it again. That's wisdom. You may not like the way I'm talking to you, but the content is wisdom. Pay attention to what I'm saying, not how I'm saying it - which is not important other than you liking me - which is not the point. You betrayed your husband. You betrayed your vows. You should not be having lunch or personal conversations by yourself with men anymore than your husband should be doing that with women. Also, your heart - when you lay down at bed at night and stare at the ceiling in your thoughts - you KNOW what was in your heart - and that was desire and consideration for that other man. If you start fooling yourself, you're in deeper trouble than you think.


All I was doing was eating lunch with friends in a public work cafeteria. Many times, there were other people sitting with us.

I had no romantic attraction to Lee. None. I did enjoy talking to him, because he shared the same interests as me, but I think that's natural.

When he asked me to go with him to a restaurant, I sensed something wasn't right. So I came here and got schooled on how naive I was being. Thinking that Lee just wanted to be friends.

You're completely wrong about me and what happened and what my mindset was.

I respect your opinion, you've had your say, etc. Now please but out.


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## lifeistooshort

Kendall said:


> All I was doing was eating lunch with friends in a public work cafeteria. Many times, there were other people sitting with us.
> 
> I had no romantic attraction to Lee. None. I did enjoy talking to him, because he shared the same interests as me, but I think that's natural.
> 
> When he asked me to go with him to a restaurant, I sensed something wasn't right. So I came here and got schooled on how naive I was being. Thinking that Lee just wanted to be friends.
> 
> You're completely wrong about me and what happened and what my mindset was.
> 
> I respect your opinion, you've had your say, etc. Now please but out.



Don't waste any more time trying to explain yourself to someone like this. You and your hb are a fabulous success story and will be fine.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Kendall

lifeistooshort said:


> Don't waste any more time trying to explain yourself to someone like this. You and your hb are a fabulous success story and will be fine.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Thank you. I appreciate your encouragement.

And you're right. I shouldn't be wasting my time trying to reason with unreasonable posters.

Again, thank you.


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## Philat

Kendall said:


> Thank you. I appreciate your encouragement.
> 
> And you're right. I shouldn't be wasting my time trying to reason with unreasonable posters.
> 
> Again, thank you.


Especially if all this ground has already been covered in the thread.


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## broder62

Kendall said:


> All I was doing was eating lunch with friends in a public work cafeteria. Many times, there were other people sitting with us.
> 
> I had no romantic attraction to Lee. None. I did enjoy talking to him, because he shared the same interests as me, but I think that's natural.
> 
> When he asked me to go with him to a restaurant, I sensed something wasn't right. So I came here and got schooled on how naive I was being. Thinking that Lee just wanted to be friends.
> 
> You're completely wrong about me and what happened and what my mindset was.
> 
> I respect your opinion, you've had your say, etc. Now please but out.


"All I was doing" "Many times other people were there". Textbook response from someone in denial. That's all you were doing. No. The other times people weren't there. Kendall - your post reads "AM I HEADED FOR AN AFFAIR". Are you trying to believe your own lies?


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## broder62

Philat said:


> Especially if all this ground has already been covered in the thread.


My point wasn't covered at all (cancer cells and denial). Comprehension wasn't your strong point in school I'm guessing.


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## Philat

broder62 said:


> My point wasn't covered at all (cancer cells and denial). Comprehension wasn't your strong point in school I'm guessing.


Whatever you say, Genius.


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## broder62

Do you, Kendall, take this man to be your lawfully wedded husband? To have lunches with other men? Share intimate details of each other's lives, behind your husband's back? To question whether you are going to have an affair with other men? By the powers invested in me......

No. You didn't break your vows.


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## Maricha75

Broder, what is your problem, man? Did your wife find out about the affair with the married woman before you met her? Yes, I remember your story all too well. Even the parts you deleted from TAM.


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## broder62

Maricha75 said:


> Broder, what is your problem, man? Did your wife find out about the affair with the married woman before you met her? Yes, I remember your story all too well. Even the parts you deleted from TAM.


What makes this funny is that attempt to divert off the content of my posts and the issue Kendall is having. What makes it even funnier is you need to try out that new Alzheimers Blood Test that is about to be put into clinical trials. First, I'm not married. Second, since I'm not married, there can me no affair. Third, since I'm not married I didn't meet her yet. Your memory is phuching stellar. Fourth, you can delete stuff from TAM? 

Now, back to Kendall. Kendall, you can like everyone's opinion of my delivery. However, until you admit and own that you made choices that compromised your vows and you considered entering an affair, you are an at risk partner and your husband is at risk. See you in a couple of months, years when your post reads "I never thought I would have an affair - please help".

There's the problem. But it's not mine. I'll let you all have the last word. Make sure you all "LIKE" the diversions so you have a community of support Kendall and all you consensus lovers.


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## 3putt

broder62 said:


> What makes this funny is that attempt to divert off the content of my posts and the issue Kendall is having. What makes it even funnier is you need to try out that new Alzheimers Blood Test that is about to be put into clinical trials. First, I'm not married. Second, since I'm not married, there can me no affair. Third, since I'm not married I didn't meet her yet. Your memory is phuching stellar. Fourth, you can delete stuff from TAM?
> 
> Now, back to Kendall. Kendall, you can like everyone's opinion of my delivery. However, until you admit and own that you made choices that compromised your vows and you considered entering an affair, you are an at risk partner and your husband is at risk. See you in a couple of months, years when your post reads "I never thought I would have an affair - please help".
> 
> There's the problem. But it's not mine. I'll let you all have the last word. Make sure you all "LIKE" the diversions so you have a community of support Kendall and all you consensus lovers.


Alright, since you seem to have all the answers, just what is it you would like to see from her? Just what would make you believe she is sincere?


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## Philat

broder62 said:


> Now, back to Kendall. Kendall, you can like everyone's opinion of my delivery. However, until you admit and own that you made choices that compromised your vows and you considered entering an affair, you are an at risk partner and your husband is at risk. See you in a couple of months, years when your post reads "I never thought I would have an affair - please help".


This tone sounds eerily familiar, like an avenue that has been traveled before.


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## Maricha75

broder62 said:


> What makes this funny is that attempt to divert off the content of my posts and the issue Kendall is having. What makes it even funnier is you need to try out that new Alzheimers Blood Test that is about to be put into clinical trials. First, I'm not married. Second, since I'm not married, there can me no affair. Third, since I'm not married I didn't meet her yet. Your memory is phuching stellar. Fourth, you can delete stuff from TAM?


Give me a break, broder. You know very well what I am talking about.

1. You came to TAM in the first place because you were the OM in an affair with a married woman...someone you knew a long time ago and reconnected with. You were pining for her, and started a thread about it... and deleted it within a few weeks.

2. Last July, you started a thread about your fiancee, who you called your wife in more than one post... You stated that you were married in the church but the civil marriage had complications, so it wasn't a legal marriage as far as the law was concerned. In that same thread, you were concerned that she might actually prefer women. Ring a bell, now?




broder62 said:


> Now, back to Kendall. Kendall, you can like everyone's opinion of my delivery. However, until you admit and own that you made choices that compromised your vows and you considered entering an affair, you are an at risk partner and your husband is at risk. See you in a couple of months, years when your post reads "I never thought I would have an affair - please help".
> 
> There's the problem. But it's not mine. I'll let you all have the last word. Make sure you all "LIKE" the diversions so you have a community of support Kendall and all you consensus lovers.


Back to Kendall. Coming from someone who HAS had an EA, I will say that she was headed that way, but she AND HER HUSBAND are working together to bring things back to what they SHOULD be... just like my husband and I have done. 

And, you know what? Maybe she will be back here saying as you stated. But if they continue working together, I'd say her chances of that happening are unlikely. So sorry you can't see that.


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## Maricha75

Kendall said:


> We are both working on our marriage. And we are so happy.
> 
> Wilson and I are in a definite EA turned PA...


As it should be. 

Just keep working together. If either of you starts to feel disconnected AT ALL, bring it up. Don't let it fester. Address it and see what can be done to resolve it.... EVEN if that means separation.


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## Headspin

Maricha75 said:


> Give me a break, broder. You know very well what I am talking about.
> 
> 1. You came to TAM in the first place because you were the OM in an affair with a married woman...someone you knew a long time ago and reconnected with. You were pining for her, and started a thread about it... and deleted it within a few weeks.
> 
> 2. Last July, you started a thread about your fiancee, who you called your wife in more than one post... You stated that you were married in the church but the civil marriage had complications, so it wasn't a legal marriage as far as the law was concerned. In that same thread, you were concerned that she might actually prefer women. Ring a bell, now?


hehe 

firmly / wall / arse / nailed / to !! 

Be interested to see the response to that 


.......if there is one!


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## Maricha75

Mrs. John Adams said:


> How the hell did you remember all that m? Good grief...do you take notes? Lol
> 
> Good girl...I am impressed!


Some, I looked at threads. 

Others...IDK, I just remember some of the most bizarre stories, it seems lol. Well, there is at least one other I remember quite well because we have butted heads often. Broder's was one of them I remembered because of why he came on here.


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## See_Listen_Love

Maricha75 said:


> Give me a break, broder. You know very well what I am talking about.
> 
> 1. You came to TAM in the first place because you were the OM in an affair with a married woman...someone you knew a long time ago and reconnected with. You were pining for her, and started a thread about it... and deleted it within a few weeks.


Right there is Broders motivation:

By accusing Kendall he is relieving his own guilt. It was not his fault as OM, because SHE was leading him, the evil temptress... Broder projects all his internal excuses on OP to feel better himself of his own wayward path...


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## Deejo

Thread closed.

I love happy endings ... in all their myriad forms.


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