# Both Messed Up - Spouse won't try...



## Saddad44 (Apr 11, 2017)

Long story… here goes:

Married for 10 years. Have one child (9). About 5 months ago I began to grow extremely unhappy. It seemed no matter how much I was unhappy with my wife she would never change, from her activities (stay at home mom), sex (boring and unfulfilling), and her addiction to pot (I know pot might not be addictive and I don’t have a huge issue with it, but when you smoke it all day every day… it’s a problem).

I decided enough was enough. I was sick of being the only contributor in my house. I moved out right after christmas. About 2.5 weeks after moving out I got drunk one night and had an affair. It lasted a few nights before I couldn’t handle my guilt any longer. I got all my stuff and went back to my house and confessed everything. She was rightfully angry and hurt but we agreed to move forward.

The moving forward was not easy and I struggled with my guilt and depression over the incident. I explained to her that I loved her to death, but wasn’t in love with her and wanted to find that again. It was right about this point she started to go out all night, explaining she was going to her sisters and family’s house just hanging out.

Five weeks later I got home and she had left her Facebook page up, which I discovered extremely lewd sex chat and naked pictures coupled with talk of meet ups and future plans. She was actually over there when I discovered this.

I was devastated. I waited for her for hours to come home and confronted her. She maintained her lie. Until I told her I saw and she finally angrily confessed everything. She blamed me for everything and showed no remorse. After a few hours of talking she finally broke down and was showing sadness. She was extremely nice that day and affectionate. I then caught her in a lie about the details and I got angry about that. After that, she went back into angry and lash out mode. We talked divorce, she was secretly making plans of moving in with her set her etc.

We decided to try one last time. We have so far been to five counseling session, which went okay. We have had small moments of affection and touching here and here and even had sex once. The sex seemed wrong and I feel like she was disconnected.

I take full responsibility for what I did. It was wrong. I have tried to show every effort with her, in fact she told me my affection was weird yesterday because I was being more than normal. I have been cleaning a lot, helping more, volunteering to go above and beyond for her. She has virtually done or shown nothing.

At what point do I/we give up? A true this point, I’m not sure if she’s really into it or if she’s just stalling for monetary reasons.

I am in a downward spiral and extremely depressed. I don’t know what to do or handle myself. Anytime I try to communicate any feelings I have she immediately resorts to anger and shuts down or talks about moving out.

How do I proceed?

We have been to 5 Counseling sessions now. Today she dropped a bombshell and said she wasn't attracted time anymore and lost all respect for me. I don't k ow how to take or deal with this or how to move forward anymore... advise please....


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

Is she still smoking cannabis every day?


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## shrah25 (Mar 22, 2017)

Saddad44 said:


> Long story… here goes:
> 
> Married for 10 years. Have one child (9). About 5 months ago I began to grow extremely unhappy. It seemed no matter how much I was unhappy with my wife she would never change, from her activities (stay at home mom), sex (boring and unfulfilling), and her addiction to pot (I know pot might not be addictive and I don’t have a huge issue with it, but when you smoke it all day every day… it’s a problem).
> 
> ...


Hi Saddad44

Thanks for your post and i'm really sorry for what you're going through. I know it's not easy. 

Firstly, I admire the fact that you've taken full responsibility for your actions. It's very easy to fall into the trap of blaming your partner for your actions and this never gets anywhere in the healing process - so I honor you for that because this intent will lead you to healing yourself in the long run. 

I think to help resolve your situation, it's important to get to the heart of what's real. The short of it is that, IMO, your partners needs weren't being met and that goes both ways. In my work, i've never come across a couple where each partners needs were being met at high levels and then they still felt the need to cheat or engage in EA's. 

So the first question you need to ask yourself if - what does she truly need? It's a slightly tricky one here because of the fact that you have both had flings on the side which means trust is the # 1 issue to resolve here. In addition to this, she's really wounded which means that she's firing all the bullets at you because she believes thats what you deserve. It's sad, because I genuinely believe you regret your behaviour but when we operate from fear, our motivations are always to get back at someone or bring them down, rather than truly serve and love them. 

You mentioned that she gets really angry and then transitions to sadness. This isn't surprising because it's the very nature of human beings to behave like this and go between the two extremes of emotions. This actually works in your favour because it means that she isn't always going to be in that angry and aggressive state all the time so for you, it's about holding your strength and letting the 'storm' pass - which it will. 

I write this virtually all the time but remember, love is about giving, not getting. As long as you are stuck in the mode of "she's not doing this, she's angry all the time" etc, then you're playing the game at a very low level and you are setting the wrong foundations. 

In my personal opinion, given the length of time you have been together and the fact that you have a child, you owe it to all parties involved to give everything you can for the next 60 days minimum. When she's firing those 'bullets', recognise that's her scars and pains that are speaking, not her heart. If you truly want to make this work, you need to serve from the heart. The reason that she questions things when you are nice to her is because she's testing you on some level to see how long because she isn't sure it will last. Hence, you need to stick with it. You need to do it again and again and again and then in time, assuming she still love's you, she will see that you are actually committed to this and will potentially reciprocate at the level you want it. Then, at the end of the 60 days, if things aren't shifting, then you can choose to make plans for the future and by that I mean parting ways. 

Hope that all makes sense.

Good luck my friend


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## Saddad44 (Apr 11, 2017)

MattMatt said:


> Is she still smoking cannabis every day?


Yes. She smokes constantly throughout the day - weekends or week days. Probably 10 times a day.


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## Saddad44 (Apr 11, 2017)

shrah25 said:


> Saddad44 said:
> 
> 
> > Long story? here goes:
> ...


Thank you for your thoughtful reply!

I should note, that post is about a month old from a different forum. I moved it here as this seemed more active.

She is virtually completely disconnected, which is really tough. And it was tough to hear she is no longer attracted to me because of this.

I have been working my ass off to prove it to her. I made a huge mistake. I recognize that and have profusely apologized and spent the last 45-60 days trying to make up for it. I have been doing everything - working, cleaning, taking care of dinners, doing small favors such as getting up early and getting her coffee, etc. nothing works. 

I am not sure I can love like this much longer. It is destroying me emotionally. I cried the majority of the day yesterday, even in bed next to her to her ignoring. I just couldn't stop. It was a very deep cut.

I had an individual session and group session yesterday. The therapist continues to give my wife homework to bridge the gap (show small affection and show interest in my emotions and well being) but she dies not do it. He essentially gave me three options or outcomes:

1. Divorce
2. She snaps out of it and we start to truly work on it
3. Wait it out and see if she comes around

3 is a hard option to swallow and I'm not sure if I can do it nor if it is healthy for me to do it.

She didn't cheat because she was unhappy or unsatisfied. We had a lot of sex, mostly initiated by her. She cheated as revenge and what she says 'the period at the end of our marriage.' 

I just am scared to death to pull the trigger on divorcing and it breaks my hurt to think of my son growing up in a broken home. If she would just show me small signs or anything I could do it. But complete icing out is an impossible situation.


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## Satya (Jun 22, 2012)

Saddad44 said:


> Yes. She smokes constantly throughout the day - weekends or week days. Probably 10 times a day.


You say she's a sahm? 

Are you seriously OK with her smoking so much pot with the kid around? 

I don't want this to turn into a pot debate thread, but there are risks associated with 2nd hand exposure.

You both messed up and it's always possible to repair a relationship, but for you two I would wager is highly improbable unless you are both remorseful and putting in the hard work.

Since you mention the pot, I sense is a point of contention with you. If so, that among other things has clearly killed your love for her. This could be who she is. As much as you are willing to try and work on things, you must also be willing to walk away.


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## Satya (Jun 22, 2012)

Saddad44 said:


> Thank you for your thoughtful reply!
> 
> I should note, that post is about a month old from a different forum. I moved it here as this seemed more active.
> 
> ...


I saw this after I posted. 

Your hard work means nothing unless she is also willing to put in the work. Just because you technically cheated first does not mean that the full responsibility of repairing the entire relationship rests on you. She also messed up and is responsible for sweeping her side of the porch. This is why I say that for reconciliation to work, both parties must be 100% invested in doing the hard work necessary. It takes a lot of effort and she might not be up to the task in the same way that you are. You have to know what your limits are and when you are okay to walk away.


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## MJJEAN (Jun 26, 2015)

Has your wife seen a professional and been evaluated for mental health issues? Using that much pot throughout the day sounds a lot like self medicating.


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## Dr. Stupid (Dec 8, 2016)

Children who grow up from broken homes with parents divorced, healed, and moving on with their lives are far better off than children who grow up in a "broken home" where the parents stay married "for their benefit". 

Remember that. 

Children need examples of healthy, loving relationships. They do not get that when the parents are putting on a grade B show for them. 

You cheated. She cheated. It will be very hard for you two to get back into sync, as both have to be remorseful and selfless 24/7 for the other to heal, while each are suffering greatly. It's always harder on the betrayed spouse, and a betrayed spouse, under ideal circumstances, is allowed by the WS to have bad days. When both are betrayed, both are in great pain, and the other having a bad day can wreck weeks or even months of reconciliation. 

It will take a superhuman effort for you to come together again, but if you both want to try, each of you will have to look at themselves as only human, each equally guilty, and each equally willing to put aside their pain to heal the other. It requires true selflessness, and you crying in the bed only hurts the situation more. It is saying "My pain is more important than yours". 

Can both of you do this? That is the discussion that you must have, not just once, but many times over the course of the next few months. Otherwise, it is not for the sake of the child that you stay together, it is for the sake of the child that you move on.

Oh, and smoking pot all day will generally slow the recovery.


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## Saddad44 (Apr 11, 2017)

I am
Not certain she wants to reconcile. She has put forth zero effort. When I bring that up her response is 'I am trying, I'm here' 

Yes she smiles a lot of pot, not around the kid. She goes outside or hides. And no I don't have a problem with pot, just the level and the laziness it is causing.

I fear she is stringing me along until I can no longer use her affair against her in court. I am not saying that's true but it is a fear of mine. Where I live thats a thing. 

I know she loves me. I just don't know if I can withstand the cold treatment for as long as she will do it to me to get through this.


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## Satya (Jun 22, 2012)

Saddad44 said:


> I am
> Not certain she wants to reconcile. She has put forth zero effort. When I bring that up her response is 'I am trying, I'm here'
> 
> Yes she smiles a lot of pot, not around the kid. She goes outside or hides. And no I don't have a problem with pot, just the level and the laziness it is causing.
> ...


She can love you and still be wrong for you.


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## Saddad44 (Apr 11, 2017)

Satya said:


> She can love you and still be wrong for you.


I definitely agree, but I don't think we're necessarily wrong for each other. We just need to work on some things. We grew up together, that can be a blessing and a curse.

I just can't stand the thought of losing my family or I would have given up already. I also grew up in a broken home, I can't imagine doing that to my little man. He is completely clueless as to what's going on, or that there is any issue. 

I am just really struggling with 'giving her space' and her saying she wasn't attracted to me anymore, and she lost all respect - on top of me trying to prove myself and better myself. It truly is an impossible situation.

I had a private session before our group session yesterday, and didn't really get any answers, other than I need to figure out what will make me happy. But I don't know what that is. I think I suffer from codependency issues.


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## Dr. Stupid (Dec 8, 2016)

If she's asking for space, give her some space. 180. It will be good for you.


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## Saddad44 (Apr 11, 2017)

Dr. Stupid said:


> If she's asking for space, give her some space. 180. It will be good for you.


What is 180?


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## Dr. Stupid (Dec 8, 2016)

Saddad44 said:


> What is 180?


The 180


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## Vinnydee (Jan 4, 2016)

As I always post, most grasp at straws rather than accept the eventual outcome. I have also posted not the cheater will always deny and when you ask for details, they will minimize it. No one is stupid enough to throw fuel on the fire. No matter how sorry they say they are, and most will, the reason for them cheating still exists and adults just don't change their nature. They may try to be this or that but sooner or later, their real nature will appear again.

Then there is the issue that trust it gone and you will have to live the rest of you marriage suspicious of your spouse. The cheating will be mentioned a lot as part of the healing process and sooner or later the cheating spouse will get tired of being accused and reminded. It is a lousy way to live.

I never cared about the sex part because I have been in a non-monogamous marriage. The cheating part for me was the lying and deceit. We tend to view ourselves as half of a couple and sexual pleasure is only for each other because that is what we have been taught. At one time there were good reasons for that, but not anymore. I decided to leaven my ex fiancée after 5 years together. I believe that a person's past behavior is a very good indicator of their future behavior and I certainly was right in the case of my ex fiancée. 

An old marriage counsellor friend of mine, whose own wife cheated and divorced him, said that once you are told by your spouse that they do not love you, it is over and get the heck out of there as soon as possible. Love is a chemical reaction that is genetically induced. It cannot be willed into or out of existence. I cannot look at a girl and will myself to love her. So once the love is gone, it is gone. At best, couples learn to life together as good friends for various reasons like kids, financial, etc..

P.S. has anyone posted about a marriage counsellor saving a marriage long term? I never knew anyone who stayed married for longer than two years after MC. Just wondering because MC and separations seem like moving towards divorce a little at time to reduce the impact of it. The MC provides hope. Separation lets the other know that they will be dating others and finally the divorce. Much less of a shock that way, I guess.


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## Bibi1031 (Sep 14, 2015)

You may be dealing with ant addict here. Pot depresses you. That's probably why she is lazy too. She lives for the weed now . It has taken over. 

The weed needs to go or the marriage is over. 

I'm sorry to say , but I honestly think the marriage is over. Get go a doctor and get yourself on meds or this will depress you even more. Your son deserves at least one parent in their right mind to take care of him until he can take care of himself. 

Your wife needs to get clean first!


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## jb02157 (Apr 16, 2014)

It seems there really isn't any basis for any type of reconciliation. She doesn't seem to want it to nor to show any type of remorse for what she did. Any mom who smokes pot as much as she does while bringing up a child should be put away, regardless if OP has not problems with it, he just becomes an enabler. I see an unfit wife and an unfit mother so I would recommend a divorce. Also, family services should be brought it to assure the child is not brought up by his mother.


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## Saddad44 (Apr 11, 2017)

She has always smoked pot. She only quit when she was pregnant. I used to also, but only at nights to wind down and relax with her. I have not in about 8 months. I gave it up. I was sick of the high cost and how it made me feel lazy. I'm not saying I wouldn't again. I have no issues with someone who does it to relax at night. I relate it to a beer or glass of wine at the end of the evening.

However, at this point, I am too scared to bring up anything to my spouse that is even remotely confrontational as I fear it will just make things worse. My counselor actually asked me why? Why not make her mad? But at the same time, my home work for the week was to back off. So, kind of a catch 22 there.

I don't think pot is the problem, I think it's a band aid for her and it's just making it worse. She has barely left the bedroom or the house in the past few weeks. She has not cleaned or done anything around the house. She is a stay at home mom. I have a very demanding executive job where I work 50+ hours and it's with a Chinese company so I am often on the phone late at night as well. I have been going home and cleaning, taking care of dinner, doing laundry etc. I just don't want my son to suffer because of this, and the way she is being - he is.

It all just feels like she's trying to punish me. And she feels like she has the moral high ground. I also don't think she is remorseful. But yet, still, I have hope she will come around. I love my wife to death and can't imagine my life without her. But, I might have to start imagining that. I just don't know an appropriate amount of time to give. And, at the end of the day, I started all of this because I was unhappy. I ask myself do I really want to stay with her anyway? Such a mess.


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## GuyInColorado (Dec 26, 2015)

Just end it, you know it's the right thing to do. None of you have the courage. You need to man up and give her a divorce that she and you want. Once separated, you are free to date and bang whatever you want. Go have fun and stop living in a sham of a marriage. Your kid will come out just fine.


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## Saddad44 (Apr 11, 2017)

GuyInColorado said:


> Just end it, you know it's the right thing to do. None of you have the courage. You need to man up and give her a divorce that she and you want. Once separated, you are free to date and bang whatever you want. Go have fun and stop living in a sham of a marriage. Your kid will come out just fine.


I understand that, but in reality, I DO want to make it work. I love my wife. We had really good times,like any marriage - ups and downs. More ups, but there certainly were downs. You are right about one thing, I do lack the courage to end it, if that's what it comes to. I am just not convinced it's there yet. I want to give her time that she requested. But it's so difficult, even more so when she won't make any strides or efforts to assure me or help me through this. She doesn't believe that I have similar feelings and doubts and issues like her, because she did it too. 

I find hers to be worse, as we were living together. Playing family. Having dinner etc. Using her family as excuses to go over there on weekends, etc. It's not a contest by any means, but that's some devious ****.


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## Keke24 (Sep 2, 2016)

Saddad44 said:


> I understand that, but in reality, I DO want to make it work. I love my wife. We had really good times,like any marriage - ups and downs. More ups, but there certainly were downs. You are right about one thing, I do lack the courage to end it, if that's what it comes to. I am just not convinced it's there yet. I want to give her time that she requested. But it's so difficult, even more so when she won't make any strides or efforts to assure me or help me through this. She doesn't believe that I have similar feelings and doubts and issues like her, because she did it too.
> 
> I find hers to be worse, as we were living together. Playing family. Having dinner etc. Using her family as excuses to go over there on weekends, etc. It's not a contest by any means, but that's some devious ****.


So what exactly do you want to do OP? You keep going around in circles and avoiding making a decision. It really boils down to 2 main choices:

1. You state your case on what changes you'd like to see in her and what changes you're going to make. Give yourself 6 months (this time frame is for you and not communicated to her) to see concrete changes and decide you'll file otherwise (and stick to it).
2. You state your case and file for divorce now.


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## Dr. Stupid (Dec 8, 2016)

Saddad44 said:


> I understand that, but in reality, I DO want to make it work. I love my wife. We had really good times,like any marriage - ups and downs. More ups, but there certainly were downs. You are right about one thing, I do lack the courage to end it, if that's what it comes to. I am just not convinced it's there yet. I want to give her time that she requested. But it's so difficult, even more so when she won't make any strides or efforts to assure me or help me through this. She doesn't believe that I have similar feelings and doubts and issues like her, because she did it too.
> 
> *I find hers to be worse, as we were living together.* Playing family. Having dinner etc. Using her family as excuses to go over there on weekends, etc. It's not a contest by any means, but that's some devious ****.


There is no "worse". You both did the "worse". This is not a competition to see who is the least disloyal. If one were to truly follow your line of reasoning, you did "worse" because your marriage was a faithful union between two people before you stepped out. 

Anything that happens after that is directly because of that, but she made her choices too, and she has to own them just as much as you will hopefully own yours... completely.

You have to own your infidelity, because there are lessons to be learned, so that you will never do it again, either to your current wife, or whomever else you pledge fidelity to in the future.


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## Saddad44 (Apr 11, 2017)

Dr. Stupid said:


> There is no "worse". You both did the "worse". This is not a competition to see who is the least disloyal. If one were to truly follow your line of reasoning, you did "worse" because your marriage was a faithful union between two people before you stepped out.
> 
> Anything that happens after that is directly because of that, but she made her choices too, and she has to own them just as much as you will hopefully own yours... completely.
> 
> You have to own your infidelity, because there are lessons to be learned, so that you will never do it again, either to your current wife, or whomever else you pledge fidelity to in the future.


I agree. I have owned mine. I haven't fully forgave myself for it yet, but I am working on it. Mine was over 4 months ago. Hers was more recent. I agree it's not a contest, that's why I said that. However, for her not to own hers one bit is a tough pill to swallow.

Thanks for the advise on the 180 page, I am going to try to follow that to the best of my ability.

I am not sure I can make it six months like this. Maybe I can. There are also legal implications as well for waiting that long (as awful as it sounds), but I have to look out for myself as well. Our marriage counselor requested a solo session next week for the wife, so we will see how that goes. I had a solo one and explained a lot of things to him and we had a good talk. I believe he is trying to get her to see how her actions and attitude is causing more harm and disconnection in the marriage. I am not certain she will listen to him or what he will say.

She may come out of it ready to divorce, maybe not. I truly don't think she does. But I am also not going to be a door mat. 

I hope this 180 thing will help me at least feel better, and then at the end of the day I will be okay regardless of the outcome.

I just started freaking out yesterday, no one wants to hear their spouse tell you to your face they are no longer attracted to you. I don't think it's physical, I think it's emotional. Hell, maybe it is physical, ha. Who the hell knows. I can't get her to talk to me the majority of the time, much less about any of this. She has completely shut down and shut me out.

Wee! 

Thanks to all for your advise and time. Any further advise or questions is greatly appreciated. This is the toughest thing I have ever had to deal with in my entire life. I can say that with certainty.


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## OnTheRocks (Sep 26, 2011)

Even if your primary goal is reconciliation, you need to talk with a lawyer to understand the divorce laws in your State. For one thing, it is very unlikely that affairs will be any factor at all. What they will consider, however, is her addiction and its potential effects on the child. The focus of the court is centered around what is best for your child. At 10 years, and with your income difference and her earning potential, you could be facing some amount of alimony as well. You may be able to get 50/50 custody or better if you leverage the pothead thing, which could mean no child support payments. 

Good luck. Most of us have been there and survived, but it is indeed a difficult journey.


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## Saddad44 (Apr 11, 2017)

OnTheRocks said:


> Even if your primary goal is reconciliation, you need to talk with a lawyer to understand the divorce laws in your State. For one thing, it is very unlikely that affairs will be any factor at all. What they will consider, however, is her addiction and its potential effects on the child. The focus of the court is centered around what is best for your child. At 10 years, and with your income difference and her earning potential, you could be facing some amount of alimony as well. You may be able to get 50/50 custody or better if you leverage the pothead thing, which could mean no child support payments.
> 
> Good luck. Most of us have been there and survived, but it is indeed a difficult journey.



The state I live in automatically disqualifies a spouse from alimony or support if infidelity occurs. Hence why I am hesitant to 'wait' around to find out. The longer the wait, the more it appears to the court as condoning the affair. That is selfish, but at some point you have to be a little selfish. I still have a tiny thread of hope, and I have read and gotten advice that if you even have a tiny shroud of hope you should keep trying.

I agree with the maid thing, but my wife is a slob, always has been. She has never held up her end of the stay at home mom duties. A huge issue for all 10 years of the marriage. This is no different. The only difference is I am no longer willing to allow my child to live in filth and think it's okay.


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## Saddad44 (Apr 11, 2017)

Also - I have had 3 lawyer consults already. None in the past 3-4 weeks because I thought we had agreed to work it out, but apparently not.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

Chemical abuse is a perfectly valid reason to dissolve a marriage and separate yourself from that person so they don't drag you down with them.

You were perfectly in your right to separate from her and give serious consideration to divorcing her and moving on with your own life. 

Someone smoking pot all day, every day has no business being alone with minor children. A drug test mandated by the court should have a significant bearing on child custody.

A person who's brain is under the influence of intoxicants does not function right. period. 

That person will not think and reason right. Will not respond to situations right. Will not feel or react emotionally right. And will function or perform to the degree of a sane and sober person who is not under the influence. 

You are completely within your right morally, ethically and legally to separate from your wife, file for divorce and file for sole custody of your child until she can pass serial drug tests and secure full time employment. 

As far as I am concerned, the infidelities that have occurred here are red herrings that mean nothing more than a distraction and drama that is further complicating the root issues here. 

IMHO your guilt is what is holding you back and what is causing you to vacillate and not move forward with what you know needs to be done. 

It's time to pull up your Big-Boy Pants and be the sane, sober adult here. Suck it and do what you know you need to do. Forgive yourself your indiscretion and grab yourself by the sack and do what you need to do. 

You child needs one sane, sober, responsible adult here and it certainly ain't the pothead. Be the man and the father that your child needs and do what gots to be done inspite of the fact that you have your own demons.


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## Mr.Fisty (Nov 4, 2014)

See, you want to make it work where she is not motivated to make it work. As long as she has the power to care less than you do, then her actions will show it. You are currently a doormat that she is stepping on because she has little respect for you. I was raised in a broken home where the parents stayed together and tried committing suicide as a way to escape. At least, if you are separated from her you can create a stable environment. I had no respect for either parent in my case. Keeping together the family came at the expense of all involved including the abuse and constant arguments. It took a lot of therapy to learn to undo all the behavior I have learned from my very own parents. Your child can learn from you is someone that does not respect and stand up for their very own self. If your child loses respect for you, then you have lost at being an authority figure and seen as weak while your wife is also a detrimental, poor parent as a role model as well. Your child will pick up on your traits or her's, possibly a combination of both as children are nearly blank slates learning how to interact and behave in society.

Your home is already broken but you live in denial about it. If your home has a high possibility of producing a broken future adult as this is his home environment, where stability matters, that especially includes the mental and emotional health of the parents involved. You can say what you want to say but children learn by emulating behavior. Actions show more than words can ever teach.

Don't kid yourself that your home is not broken. If we play the odds game, your current situation would likely breeed highly dysfunctional children. If you wre to separate and work on yourself, at least there is a better chance of one good role model and possibly you can find a better mate to show what a loving couple is suppose to look like.

Children do not need both parents, stability plays a much better role and great role models is part of that stability.

Even if your wife never cheated and you were the only one to do so, I would say, fine, feel guilty or whatever, but still detach as your wife is toxic to you and your child. Grow and move on and change how you respond, know your weakness and learn to leave before you reach this level where your spouse is highly removed from your decision. You want her to change and give you the love you want from her and she made the choice to deny you your needs. Chasing her and pleading only shows her she does not have to take your words seriously because you are still there waiting. Why should she change in any way if you will choose to live with the person she is. There is no incentive to change or not enough pain.


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## Cynthia (Jan 31, 2014)

Saddad44 said:


> The state I live in automatically disqualifies a spouse from alimony or support if infidelity occurs. Hence why I am hesitant to 'wait' around to find out. The longer the wait, the more it appears to the court as condoning the affair. That is selfish, but at some point you have to be a little selfish. I still have a tiny thread of hope, and I have read and gotten advice that if you even have a tiny shroud of hope you should keep trying.
> 
> I agree with the maid thing, but my wife is a slob, always has been. She has never held up her end of the stay at home mom duties. A huge issue for all 10 years of the marriage. This is no different. The only difference is I am no longer willing to allow my child to live in filth and think it's okay.


You have got to be kidding. What on earth! You have the nerve to think you can use adultery as a reason to divorce and to get a better deal after you are the one who started all this. You are apparently too blind to realize that you broke your wife's heart and she has not in any way, shape, or form recovered. In fact she had a revenge affair. She didn't do it because she was interested in the man. She did it to get back at you. To punish you for your affair. She is extremely angry with you, which would explain her extreme pot usage. It calms her down. I don't know which would be worse: the constantly stoned wife or the screaming, freaking out, screaming wife that you would get if she weren't stoned. Probably #2 so she could at least get it out and maybe start dealing with her pain. You have made yourself one seriously messed up situation.

I'm not saying your wife isn't responsible for her terrible behavior or that what she did was right. It wasn't, but it is extremely hypocritical and mean for you to try to use her adultery against her. If you do and if your attorney is foolish enough to go that route, all of your adultery would be exposed and it would probably fall right back into your lap.

Again not excusing her, but it seems to me that you must be utterly clueless to be so dense about the severity of your wife's pain. You obviously have not dealt well with the aftermath of the earthquake you caused. Am I saying your wife's adultery was your fault. Hm... I really want to say yes, but nope, that's on her. However you created the storm and she made bad choices on how to deal with it.

Now you should stop thinking about how you can get the best deal in the divorce, but on thinking what you can do to help your wife recover from the terrible shock and pain she went through so she can calm down, heal, and be a good mom to your child.


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## JohnA (Jun 24, 2015)

Bottom line she knew how badly her adultery would hurt you and chose to inflict it on you. That is on her, the adultery and the pot use is for her ti own and fix.

Your adultery is on you to own and fix. 

File


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## Bibi1031 (Sep 14, 2015)

...and I mistakenly thought he was the better, saner parent for their poor kid. 

How more messed up can a couple be? Poor boy. His life has just given a dive towards the worst.


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

You have a dopehead wife that made you so unhappy that you moved out.
You have a mother that is a stay at home "mom"???? How much mothering can one do while high as a kite? She's a danger to herself, and more importantly, your child.

Once a woman falls out of love---forget her..

File and move forward. You can't do much worse. How was she contributing to the marriage again??


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## chillymorn69 (Jun 27, 2016)

Stay clean then file for divorce. Tell her you want custody because of her drug use.

Smoking pot all day as a stay at home wife isn't going to look good in court.


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## Saddad44 (Apr 11, 2017)

Evinrude58 said:


> You have a dopehead wife that made you so unhappy that you moved out.
> You have a mother that is a stay at home "mom"???? How much mothering can one do while high as a kite? She's a danger to herself, and more importantly, your child.
> 
> Once a woman falls out of love---forget her..
> ...


She insist she still loves me. She says she isn't attracted to me 'at the moment.' Whatever that means.


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## Saddad44 (Apr 11, 2017)

CynthiaDe said:


> Saddad44 said:
> 
> 
> > The state I live in automatically disqualifies a spouse from alimony or support if infidelity occurs. Hence why I am hesitant to 'wait' around to find out. The longer the wait, the more it appears to the court as condoning the affair. That is selfish, but at some point you have to be a little selfish. I still have a tiny thread of hope, and I have read and gotten advice that if you even have a tiny shroud of hope you should keep trying.
> ...


I have never used it against her. In fact, I forgave her the day I confronted her about it and have not really brought back it back up.

However, having minimal expectations is frowned upon in a relationship? The flip side, if I was a drunk who stayed perpetually unemployed would that be okay?

As far as the 'using it against her' part. If we get divorced, in my eyes, she doesn't deserve alimony. We were in the process of trying to make it work and she did hers over the course of many weeks and still had relations with me at the same time. We would cook dinner, spend time together, take our son out etc. I'm sorry, but I do not and will not accept blame for her decisions.

I may have started it, but I tried to do my best to make it right and be honest. I may have should kept the finding the spark again stuff to myself, but honestly is important. I read a lot of therapy blogs and books before I said what I did. 

At this point I have very little hope we can fix this. She might come around one day, but how long does one wait and be punished?


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## Saddad44 (Apr 11, 2017)

Bibi1031 said:


> ...and I mistakenly thought he was the better, saner parent for their poor kid.
> 
> How more messed up can a couple be? Poor boy. His life has just given a dive towards the worst.


Our kid is top of his class and in the gifted program. He has no idea we have issues with our marriage. No poor kid here, he is very well looked after.

And while I was gone for the three weeks I came and got him almost every other day. Not an excuse for my leaving like I did, it was surely a mistake, but to assume we were bad parents is unfair in this situation. 

I do think with my wife in her conditioned is not being a great mother at he moment, but historically she has been and hope she return she to at least that. 

If we do file and go that route I do t have the heart to take our son from my wife, it would crush her. I would go after 50/50.

And he pot issue isn't because of the past xx amount of months, it has been going on for years and years.


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## Bibi1031 (Sep 14, 2015)

Saddad44 said:


> She insist she still loves me. She says she isn't attracted to me 'at the moment.' * Whatever that means.*


That she loves you like a brother, uncle, cousin, but most definitely not like a husband. Do you want that new role? She didn't like the role you gave her when you left and couldn't get the spark back. It's the same thing pretty much. 

Did you find the spark by any chance? Why do you want to make this marriage work now that it is more broken than ever?


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## Saddad44 (Apr 11, 2017)

Bibi1031 said:


> Saddad44 said:
> 
> 
> > She insist she still loves me. She says she isn't attracted to me 'at the moment.' * Whatever that means.*
> ...


Going through all of this has made me realize how much I do love my wife. How much we rely on each other as partners. Our lives are so ingrained together it's hard to imagine them apart. I know she feels the same or she would be gone. I know she loves me. 

However my wife is one of the most stubborn people you will ever meet. Once she gets it in her head there is no getting it out. That's where we are now. She has flip flopped a few times.

It's not uncommon for her to block people out of their lives for her. She does it all the time.

However as both a betrayer and a betrayer it's very difficult to deal with and I'm not sure how much longer I can do it. I wish I could snap my fingers and make it go back and slowly work through our issues. Limbo is unacceptable. 

Is it to much to ask for a commitment and a little effort? Maybe it is. Maybe I need a new tactic. My homework from our MCeas for me to back off and hers was to show me affection and pay attention to me physically and emotionally. She has yet to do so, I have, however, backed off.

Just seems one way street so far and I'm getting close to saying f it. But I really don't want to...... I love her to death and knowmy dien falls and have fixed many of them and will continue to work on it. But at what point is it fruitless to continue my efforts? That's really my dilemma. All legal stuff aside, all anger aside. I just don't know what to do.

Calling it quits right in this moment I'm not ready for. Maybe I'm just a chicken.


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## Bibi1031 (Sep 14, 2015)

At least something good came out of this mess. You now value what you lost. The problem is if it is lost forever. 

Sadly, I think it is. Hope for the best and be prepared for the worst. Keep your son close because he will need you.


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## BobSimmons (Mar 2, 2013)

From what I read everything smacks of and I'm being a tad 2x4ish, very nice guy, doing things half ass.

Moving out is no small thing. Fine you're sick of being the only contributor and your concerns may have been valid but what exactly was the point of moving out of the house you're mainly contributing to?

Not saying your reasoning wasn't valid and not excusing her actions but then on top of the I'm the main contributor thing you go and bang someone else...then you come back and tell her you're not in love but want to find those feelings...your wife then cheats on you and suddenly what? You love her again? 

Do you see how weak and undecisive you look. Move out, move back in. Say you're not in love now you're acting as if she's the center of your world.

My guess is you're still the main contributor but now you're running around trying to win her back. You've been punished for your actions and handled well.

Good luck. You'll need it.


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## BobSimmons (Mar 2, 2013)

Saddad44 said:


> Maybe I'm just a chicken.


Spot on.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

*Food for thought:

(1) Cannabis, just like Marlboro's, is definitely addictive! It's a proven fact!

(2) She has relegated you to well beyond "Plan B" status, with likely the pot and her new "Stage Door Johnny" now vying for her "Plan A!"

(3) There's not a family court judge in the land that is going to remand to her, even joint custody of a 9-year-old child in the chosen lifestyle that she has fully and so willingly embraced! In reality, she'll be extremely fortunate to walk out of there with "timed" supervised visitation, meaning monthly for usually no more than an hour, at a courthouse setting! In order to even attain that, at an absolute minimum, she'll have to sign with the court "to swear off pot" and to willingly submit for weekly blood testing that she would have to pay for; and whose results would be reportable to the court! Any violation, and visitation disappears for good!

(4) The residuals of pot stays well within the body for a much longer time than she'd ever anticipate or would like to admit, and is easily found to be traceable in even the simplest of blood testing!

(5) Move on to a far better life for you and your child! You can start by consulting, then employing a good "piranha" family attorney in helping you to extricate yourself, as well as your child, from this sordid, most unsavory situation! You most assuredly deserve a far better "hand of cards" out of life!*


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## VladDracul (Jun 17, 2016)

If she's stoned and lazy as you say, I can only imagine what kind of disheveled and nasty house you come home to every day. Ain't no telling how many hours you have to work just to satisfy her drug habit, notwithstanding her giving it up to other guys, to include maybe her dealer. Face it my man, she loves pot, laying up on her lazy azz, and other guys more than she loves you. Hell, I'll just say it. She doesn't love you at all and the only reason she keeps you around is to underwrite her drug habit, which I'd bet goes well beyond pot. If she's like a lot of druggy women, she's probably trading puzzy for drugs. My advice; give her her walking papers and get custody of the kid. Judges don't like stoned mothers.


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## She'sStillGotIt (Jul 30, 2016)

Saddad44 said:


> Yes. She smokes constantly throughout the day - weekends or week days. Probably 10 times a day.





> Our kid is top of his class and in the gifted program. He has no idea we have issues with our marriage. No poor kid here, he is very well looked after.


Are you really as clueless as you appear to be by your posts? So far, your kid has excelled *DESPITE* his pot head mother. Keep fooling yourself into thinking she's a model mother. Shame on you.


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## Saddad44 (Apr 11, 2017)

She'sStillGotIt said:


> Are you really as clueless as you appear to be by your posts? So far, your kid has excelled *DESPITE* his pot head mother. Keep fooling yourself into thinking she's a model mother. Shame on you.


I spend a lot of time with him on his home work and we make him read books every night etc. We have been good parents, despite all of the bull****.

I don't think she's a 'model' mother. She rarely does laundry, the house is always a disaster, etc. These aren't enormous problems, but over 10 years of feeling like the only contributing spouse, I made a stupid decision and left. I would send her letters, message, talk in person etc. to her at least once a month about it. Never changed. There were a myriad of other issues too. It was almost like we didn't have any big issues, but 10000 small issues that added up into a huge problem. We didn't have the typical marriage fights, like money, parenting, etc. It was other things.


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## Saddad44 (Apr 11, 2017)

VladDracul said:


> If she's stoned and lazy as you say, I can only imagine what kind of disheveled and nasty house you come home to every day. Ain't no telling how many hours you have to work just to satisfy her drug habit, notwithstanding her giving it up to other guys, to include maybe her dealer. Face it my man, she loves pot, laying up on her lazy azz, and other guys more than she loves you. Hell, I'll just say it. She doesn't love you at all and the only reason she keeps you around is to underwrite her drug habit, which I'd bet goes well beyond pot. If she's like a lot of druggy women, she's probably trading puzzy for drugs. My advice; give her her walking papers and get custody of the kid. Judges don't like stoned mothers.


She definitely only smokes pot. I know where she gets it from, it's an older gentlemen friend of mine. I used to get it for her up until a few years ago, when I quit smoking it. I would smoke it at night to relax and it helps with my insomnia, but I saw her sliding and stopped.

She is definitely not doing what you describe above.

You might be right about the 'she doesn't love me at all' part, though. No clue.


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## Saddad44 (Apr 11, 2017)

Bibi1031 said:


> That she loves you like a brother, uncle, cousin, but most definitely not like a husband. Do you want that new role? She didn't like the role you gave her when you left and couldn't get the spark back. It's the same thing pretty much.
> 
> Did you find the spark by any chance? Why do you want to make this marriage work now that it is more broken than ever?


I think it's one of those, you don't know what you want until you don't have it situations.

I want my family back.

I really didn't think that 'spark' talk would ruin everything. The self help book I read suggested I have that exact conversation. It was obvious we had lost our spark, if I knew how she'd react and go find another man because of that, I never would have said it. I was struggling in my own guilt at that time as well to be fully involved and committed as I should have been. 

I never treated her horribly because of it, she just snapped. It was probably too much at that point for her.

I know we're broken, but I will do anything and everything to try to make it work and make us happy again like we have been. However, I also have to realize when enough is enough and it's time to move on. That is what I'm struggling with right now. When is that? I don't know and I don't think anyone can tell me exactly the right answer, but it does feel good to get it oou and discuss it.


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## Lila (May 30, 2014)

Saddad44 said:


> *The state I live in automatically disqualifies a spouse from alimony or support if infidelity occurs. *Hence why I am hesitant to 'wait' around to find out. The longer the wait, the more it appears to the court as condoning the affair. That is selfish, but at some point you have to be a little selfish. I still have a tiny thread of hope, and I have read and gotten advice that if you even have a tiny shroud of hope you should keep trying.


I know you said you visited with 3 lawyers, and they may have shared this with you, but in GA unless you've got undeniable evidence of a physical affair, no judge will rule in your favor based on adultery. 

Undeniable evidence = photographs (e.g. couple entering a hotel or kissing in public) or records between the two people documenting a tryst (e.g. your wife and her om talking about how great the sex was between them). 

In GA, sexting is not considered adultery. 

Food for thought. 

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk


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## Mr.Fisty (Nov 4, 2014)

Did you take into account that her drug habit is also a form of infidelity. It took away a potential source of intimacy and forming that bond. She abandoned you in the relationship long ago unless she needed something. How exactly is she wife material and she is not choosing to change and you want her to so you do not accept the person she has become. So what if she returns back to you. If she returned as who she is currently, you already know you would not be happy. Do you want her to change herself into the person you want her to be for you, for herself? If that change occurs, there is the potential that it can further alienate you away from her.


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## Cynthia (Jan 31, 2014)

Saddad44 said:


> I have never used it against her. In fact, I forgave her the day I confronted her about it and have not really brought back it back up.
> 
> However, having minimal expectations is frowned upon in a relationship? The flip side, if I was a drunk who stayed perpetually unemployed would that be okay?
> 
> ...


You specifically said you would use it against her in a divorce. That is why I posted, because you are the one who started this mess. You sound like such a martyr here, but you are not taking responsibility for the state of your marriage. You did not do everything you could. You could have kept your pants zipped, but you didn't and now you are facing the consequences of that behavior. What is happening right now is consequences. Your wife is a mess, because of what you did. Yes, she made really bad choices in response to what you did and she is responsible for that, but you are the one who threw her off the cliff. Even talking about using adultery against her in the divorce is ridiculous. She can use adultery against you as well.

I agree there is very little hope, but your focus should not be on saving the marriage at this point anyway. It should be on helping your wife get the help she needs to recover from the trauma of what you did, so she can stop relying on pot to cope. I recommend you look into finding a therapist that deals with PTSD from adultery or at least specializes in helping people through the trauma of betrayal. Let her know that you are not going to continue living in the mess you two have made together. It is time to start working towards healing for both of you. If she doesn't want to do that, that is up to her, but at least you have tried. It's also important for you to fully accept that you are the one that started the marriage on this path and you are responsible for doing what you can to stop further trauma for either of you.


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