# Caught my very young kids with porn



## Healer

My daughter is 7, son is 10. Split with the ex in Feb 2013 - I have the kids Fri-Monday am, the ex has them Mon-Tues night, and her folks have them Wed-Thurs night. 3 different ****ing towns. 3 different homes. Kills me writing that. The ex uprooted the kids and forced me to move way north on the promise that the kids would be more stable, less driving, more routine, yadda yadda. Well, now they have 3 homes.

My kids are extremely well behaved - everyone always comments on it. Sweet, polite, smart, just good kids. Anyway, my folks got the kids iPads a few months ago. They love them obviously and spend a lot of time on them. Minecraft, YouTube. One rule for Minecraft is no chatting with other users. I'll insert here that I'm a moron. As dumb and naive as I was with my exww. I have a gut feeling and snag her iPad from her Sunday morning and sure enough she chatting with some people - grabs it and tries to conceal. I bust her and have the talk about predators etc. Send them to the park and decide to check her iPad search history.

I see the history is cleared. Red flag. I figure out how to see it on the back end, and yup, hardcore porn all over the ****ing place. And bad stuff. Bondage, violent, abusive stuff - some generic stuff like youp*rn and redtube, but some nasty girls getting smacked around with c0cks while sodomized and stuff. Like maybe 15+ sites.

I confronted when she got home. "Does anyone else use your iPad?" "No". "You've been looking at some bad stuff". Nope. Lies - then I lost it and yelled to not f*cking lie to me. She broke down in hysterics and copped. "I'm a terrible person!!" I yelled for my son to come down and bring his iPad. I said "anything you want to tell me before I check this?? Cause I'll find it." Nope. Same with him - deleted history and porn on the back end. Not as harsh as my SEVEN YEAR OLD DAUGHTER but bad enough.

I lost my ****. I didn't hit my kids, but I have never, ever been that angry at them before. This was a mistake on some levels I realize - but they also had to know how angry and afraid I was. 

I talked to them both after I calmed down individually. I asked my daughter how she found it - she won't be straight with me. I asked her if that's what she thought sex is - she said yes. Jesus Christ. I spent 30 mins explaining to her that that is NOT sex - trying to reprogram. I asked if it makes her feel bad about herself and, yes, it does. "They're SO MEAN" she says of the guys in the porn. This little girl is so sweet and bubbly and positive and confident when she's around me. And now this. I did the best I could telling her what healthy sex and relationships are and trying to fix it. But obviously this is...

Same with my son - same talk. I told him he broke my trust when he lied to me. The 3 of us are SO close, a trio. I am devastated and so worried. Why would my 7 year old baby look at that stuff??? And then I hear from my ex that she's always emotional and crying and insecure when she's with her. Polar opposite of my baby.

iPads and phones are obviously gone - no access except for school computers. But that's a bandaid.

After my initial blowup, I told them I was angry out of fear - it was the fight or flight response, and I fought. I was terrified. I made sure to tell them that they don't need to feel ashamed about being curious about sex - and sex is not a bad thing. But they are far too young, and the stuff they were looking at isn't real and not a real representation of what sex is. Sex is a loving, tender, respectful, sweet thing shared between 2 people in love. They seemed to get that.

I have almost no contact with my exww - I have shut her out of my life. She has tried to be friends, buddies, whatever. She still expresses love for me, and I have shut her out. I had to. I now realize I can't do that entirely - we need to be communicative co-parents. And since this happened (Sunday), we have. We've talked more in the last few days than the last 3 years combined. We are going together Monday to talk to a child/family psychologist, and if we feel it's a fit, we will take the kids (that's the protocol). She will talk to all of us and the kids one on one.

Yes, I am very stupid and naive to have not put blocking software on their iPads, and for not monitoring more closely. I am naive for thinking I could just ignore my exww without there being consequences for the children. They clearly have issues going on far beyond what they show to me or the ex. My son knows his mom cheated and is very, very angry with her. I don't know if my daughter knows.

Living an unsettled life, having 3 different sets of caretakers (the ex has a live in boyfriend) and the broken home caused by infidelity obviously has messed them up good.

I asked many ways if my daughter has ever been touched, or shown anything inappropriate or been made to feel icky, etc etc. She says no. But after all the lying to my face, I simply can't trust what they tell me (and yes, that's partly my fault).

I need to understand why a seven year old girl would watch that, and go back and watch it over and over. What's wrong with my baby? I asked her why she watched it again and again - "I don't know". My son - it's bad too but less confusing at 10. They are very ashamed and embarrassed - we have told them over and over we are not mad, we are worried about them and love them SO much.

I found out their cousin (whose parents are utter white trash on the ex's side) who is 10 also, showed them how to delete the history and that she looked up "boobies". But that's all I got on that. They were reluctant to rat her out. She admitted the history thing to her folks but said it was my son who looked up boobies. Why is SHE deleting her history? Her folks stuck their head in the sand.

I am beside myself. So is the ex. I don't know what to do. Are they being abused? Is this lashing out? Strictly curiosity? Why THAT material? How did they find it? Why did she keep looking? What am I missing? Is she damaged? Will she be OK? Going to the psychologist is all I can think to do. I pick them up tomorrow and I am SO NERVOUS and don't know what to say or do. I love them more than anything in the world...but I am now lost, and so is their innocence. I'm sick with worry. Please help.


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## SecondTime'Round

Wow. Wow. Wow.

I'm so terrified FOR you. And heartbroken for your kids because, yes, they've lost their innocence.

I'd be looking square at the live-in boyfriend, and the grandfather they are with 2 nights a week. This is NOT normal behavior for a 7 year old girl. Not at ALL. (I'm shocked she even knows how to delete history AND remembers to do it!) 

I recommend a counseling session STAT.


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## brooklynAnn

OK Daddy, take a deep breath. 

They are growing kids and are curious. By some crazy chance, they got into the bad stuff instead of regular porn. With their minds and sexuality now forming, sex ed should not be gained from porn. Kids and porn don't mix.

Look at this as a teaching opportunity. Now you tell them what sex is. Don't make them feel ashamed or guilty. Just have normal conversations and ask them questions and answer their's truthfully. (Even, if you feel mad and want to throw-up)

It's a good thing you and your ex are now coparenting. Taking the kids to therapist is what you should do. You let the therapist know that you are worried they are abused, so she can took for signs or ask questions.

Also, that, little cousin, the kids should spent less time with him/her, for now. 

Also, you need to reconfigure the child custody/sharing. This is way too much on the kids. Are the GP's legally required to have the kids?

For now, Dad just give your kids lots of love and hugs. Let them know how precious they are and that they can come to you with anything. Just keep reinforcing this. Let them know you are their safe place. That you will protect and love them no matter what.

It's really terrible the crap our kids can be exposed to. Good luck.


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## Healer

SecondTime'Round said:


> Wow. Wow. Wow.
> 
> I'm so terrified FOR you. And heartbroken for your kids because, yes, they've lost their innocence.
> 
> I'd be looking square at the live-in boyfriend, and the grandfather they are with 2 nights a week. This is NOT normal behavior for a 7 year old girl. Not at ALL. (I'm shocked she even knows how to delete history AND remembers to do it!)
> 
> I recommend a counseling session STAT.


It's horrifying. Their cousin showed them how to delete history. But yes - her remembering to do it so as to conceal it is very alarming.

Regarding the boyfriend/grandfather - this is where it gets really hairy. I've asked many times about the bf, and they say he's really nice to them.That doesn't necessarily mean anything. The grandfather - I know him well and don't see that - but again - I clearly don't know anything. One thing I did recently find out - and this is bad - is that when they're at their grandfolks, my son sleeps with grandpa and my daughter with the grandma. I put a stop to that. I said "WHY??". Well because of space issues. I said "well YOU sleep with your wife, the kids can share a room". My ex told them I insisted that stop, and it has. That in itself has caused a huge rift between her and her parents. "You're accusing US of abusing the kids??". I don't care if it causes problems - I have to look at everyone.

I'm hoping the shrink can gauge if there is something more sinister going on. If she thinks so, or has concerns, I'll have to call child protective services. Other than the porn (which is obviously huge), they show no other signs (that I've read about).


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## Healer

brooklynAnn said:


> OK Daddy, take a deep breath.
> 
> They are growing kids and are curious. By some crazy chance, they got into the bad stuff instead of regular porn. With their minds and sexuality now forming, sex ed should not be gained from porn. Kids and porn don't mix.
> 
> Look at this as a teaching opportunity. Now you tell them what sex is. Don't make them feel ashamed or guilty. Just have normal conversations and ask them questions and answer their's truthfully. (Even, if you feel mad and want to throw-up)
> 
> It's a good thing you and your ex are now coparenting. Taking the kids to therapist is what you should do. You let the therapist know that you are worried they are abused, so she can took for signs or ask questions.
> 
> Also, that, little cousin, the kids should spent less time with him/her, for now.
> 
> Also, you need to reconfigure the child custody/sharing. This is way too much on the kids. Are the GP's legally required to have the kids?
> 
> For now, Dad just give your kids lots of love and hugs. Let them know how precious they are and that they can come to you with anything. Just keep reinforcing this. Let them know you are their safe place. That you will protect and love them no matter what.
> 
> It's really terrible the crap our kids can be exposed to. Good luck.


Deeeeeeeep breath. Been doing a lot of that. I'm in knots just writing this out.

I hope you're right - just a series of bad clicks brought on by curiosity. But what I don't get is why she would return to it, when she said it made her feel bad and scared her.

I had the sex talk several times - will reiterate.

Custody - they are supposed to be with me 50% and their mom 50%. The gparents came into the picture because my ex works in a bar - so nights. I am NOT happy with this, but I can't do much about it. I simply can't have them 100% of the time - it's not possible logistically with my job and where they live when not with me. I fought this long and hard and it very nearly went to court. I realized if they're not with their mom or gparents, then because I work full time, they'd have to be with strangers and that's even worse. I don't know how to fix that.


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## happy as a clam

It's unclear why they have to be at the grandparents' house at all. Can't they stay with you on those nights? That is WAY to much shuffling around for young kids.

I agree that counseling is in order pronto. Be sure the counselor understands how much these kids are moving around each week.

And I would cut off ALL contact with the cousin for now, "cutting back" is not enough.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## SecondTime'Round

I was just going to google what it could possibly mean, etc. but I can't think of any combination of words I even want in my search history.

I don't really know what you mean about being able to see the history on the "back end" because I don't have Apple products, but can you tell how long and how often they've been doing this? Can you tell which one went first?


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## Healer

happy as a clam said:


> It's unclear why they have to be at the grandparents' house at all. Can't they stay with you on those nights? That is WAY to much shuffling around for young kids.
> 
> I agree that counseling is in order pronto. Be sure the counselor understands how much these kids are moving around each week.
> 
> And I would cut off ALL contact with the cousin for now, "cutting back" is not enough.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Coincidentally, the ex just texted saying she has readjusted her shcedule so they are only with the gparents 1 night a week - Wednesdays. They used to have them for a weekend a month for visits, but with the Wednesdays those are gone. I get every 2nd Friday off - so they're with me the most out of anybody (full days on the weekends as opposed to just nights with their mom/gparents). 

I told the ex no contact with the cousin. She agreed until "we figure out what's going on". I said NO devices and only supervised, if they see her again.


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## brooklynAnn

My son used to download games, and every time he would download porn. It used to drive me nuts. Until, I had to tell him to just buy the stuff from game stop and stop downloading.

Sometimes, it's those stupid free little games they have for kids, that have a porn bug or something. 

Once, my daughter had a porn bug on her computer, that every time, it started up, the moaning would start. I would have to quickly shut it down. The virus was in the start up menu and we could not find it. I had to take it to best buy. Again, she got it trying to download Japanese anime.

We have had the talk of porn sex is not normal sex, so often, when they was young. 

I am also, hyper vigilant when it comes to my kids. Better to be than to have something happen and you did not caught it.


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## Faithful Wife

Healer said:


> But what I don't get is why she would return to it, when she said it made her feel bad and scared her.


She returned to it for the same reasons a boy would return to it. Despite the horrible parts, the naked sex parts make them feel arousal. When I was 7 (and all the way up until I was a teen), I would ransack every house I was left alone in for even a few minutes, looking for any porn I could find. Though of course it was only magazines, I did find very explicit ones (not just Playboy) and had absolutely no frame of reference for knowing what sex was about from any of these BUT what I did know was that it made me feel aroused to look at it. If I had found things similar to what you found on your daughter's ipad, I would have looked at that, too. Any chance I got.

I'm not saying it is a good thing for kids to see porn, of course it isn't. But this is the legacy we've left for this next generation. By making porn available to anyone and everyone, that means it is available to children. 

I think it is a huge mistake for parents to only assume their boys will be looking at it. There is no reason girls will not look at it just as much. In the past when porn had to be purchased in nasty back alley stores that were not safe places for women, it appeared that "only" men wanted porn. That was never true, but that's how it appeared. If men and women are given equal access and opportunity for private porn viewing, they will both do it at the same rate. Some more than others, but neither gender will do it more....and that is exactly what we are finding with our young kids today. People haven't really faced up to this yet, but girls are looking at it as much as boys are. Why wouldn't they, if you think about it.

I know this is raw and scary for you, but I do feel it is a blessing that you found this out and you know what they have seen. Now you can continue to have discussions about how and why porn are not actually what sex is about. If you did not know they had seen this, you would not have had any conversations about it until much later. 

If you can, I would try to do some damage control about the level of anger you showed. The kids were innocent in looking at this stuff, and by showing such a high level of anger you have set up a "not innocent" vibe around them, and now they will feel shame for something that really was just an innocent curiosity to them. This can have far reaching effects on them so as I said, I hope you can do some damage control. Your anger could potentially harm them in the long run more than seeing the porn did.


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## GusPolinski

Damn.
@Healer, I realize that you've taken the iPads, iPhones, etc from them, but let's be honest -- like you said, that's little more than a band-aid.

Look into using a service like OpenDNS to restrict your kids' access to content that they shouldn't be viewing. Ask your ex and her parents to do the same.

About the iPads... are they wifi only or do they have 3G/4G capabilities as well?


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## Healer

SecondTime'Round said:


> I was just going to google what it could possibly mean, etc. but I can't think of any combination of words I even want in my search history.
> 
> I don't really know what you mean about being able to see the history on the "back end" because I don't have Apple products, but can you tell how long and how often they've been doing this? Can you tell which one went first?


Deep in the backend you can see the "web data", which is a list, organized by the size of the site, of all the websites they've hit. You cannot see dates, breadcrumb trail, etc. It's purely a list of sites and that's it. My daughter saw a lot of "teen abuse" stuff. Jesus.

This has been going on since the summer, so they say. So, at least a few months.


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## Pluto2

Wowza. I can't even imagine.

I think you did a lot of things right. You asked how it made her feel, explained it was not reality, and set your standards. These are all really good. You blew your top, but explained why-danger. Also excellent response. I'd probably be very clear that there is danger to her in getting caught up in something or with someone, as well as danger to the women she saw in the videos. You took away the devices. Excellent. And you and your ex are in agreement about counseling. Good united front. Do they have smart phones?

I see the part about deleting the history as a recognition by her that this is not something you approve of. To me, that's good. She has some realization of your standards. Sneaky, absolutely, but there's good stuff there to work with. 

I wish I had some solution to the three home shuffle, but short of you getting your dream job, I got nothing.


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## SecondTime'Round

@Healer, are the kids with the live in boyfriend alone the evenings she has them? Meaning, is she bartending those nights, too, and leaving them in his care?


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## Healer

Faithful Wife said:


> She returned to it for the same reasons a boy would return to it. Despite the horrible parts, the naked sex parts make them feel arousal. When I was 7 (and all the way up until I was a teen), I would ransack every house I was left alone in for even a few minutes, looking for any porn I could find. Though of course it was only magazines, I did find very explicit ones (not just Playboy) and had absolutely no frame of reference for knowing what sex was about from any of these BUT what I did know was that it made me feel aroused to look at it. If I had found things similar to what you found on your daughter's ipad, I would have looked at that, too. Any chance I got.
> 
> I'm not saying it is a good thing for kids to see porn, of course it isn't. But this is the legacy we've left for this next generation. By making porn available to anyone and everyone, that means it is available to children.
> 
> I think it is a huge mistake for parents to only assume their boys will be looking at it. There is no reason girls will not look at it just as much. In the past when porn had to be purchased in nasty back alley stores that were not safe places for women, it appeared that "only" men wanted porn. That was never true, but that's how it appeared. If men and women are given equal access and opportunity for private porn viewing, they will both do it at the same rate. Some more than others, but neither gender will do it more....and that is exactly what we are finding with our young kids today. People haven't really faced up to this yet, but girls are looking at it as much as boys are. Why wouldn't they, if you think about it.
> 
> I know this is raw and scary for you, but I do feel it is a blessing that you found this out and you know what they have seen. Now you can continue to have discussions about how and why porn are not actually what sex is about. If you did not know they had seen this, you would not have had any conversations about it until much later.
> 
> If you can, I would try to do some damage control about the level of anger you showed. The kids were innocent in looking at this stuff, and by showing such a high level of anger you have set up a "not innocent" vibe around them, and now they will feel shame for something that really was just an innocent curiosity to them. This can have far reaching effects on them so as I said, I hope you can do some damage control. Your anger could potentially harm them in the long run more than seeing the porn did.


Wow, this is good to read (well - you know what I mean). So it's not really entirely abnormal for a girl that age...my ex said "I have to remember...I discovered the faucet when I was 8". 

Regarding the anger - I agree. I had a long talk with them and told them the reason I got so angry was because I was very, very scared. And I apologized. I explained flight or fight, and told them I was in fight mode. I told them over and over again not to be afraid to come to me - and that my anger was only because I panicked. I don't know if that worked or not. I guess I'll see. It was total fear and adrenaline, and there was anger there because they kept lying right to my face. But that's what kids do. 

Regarding the "totally innocent" thing - even with the lying, deleting history, hiding it - they obviously knew it was wrong or they wouldn't have concealed...but should I look at it as "innocent"? I'm pretty lost here.


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## Faithful Wife

Healer said:


> Regarding the "totally innocent" thing - even with the lying, deleting history, hiding it - they obviously knew it was wrong or they wouldn't have concealed...but should I look at it as "innocent"? I'm pretty lost here.


The urge to look at it was innocent.

They know that adults would not want them to be looking at it, kids know this even if no adult ever explained what porn is or told them not to look at it. They just have that feeling that they are sneaking something but they aren't even sure why. They know there is something "wrong" about what they are seeing...but again they aren't sure why. All they are really going for is that feeling of arousal, which is totally innocent. They cannot help that their bodies respond to these images, nor can they help that it is very compelling and feels good.

I would equate it to them eating sugar cubes when no one is looking and lying/hiding it (something else I used to do). They can't help that our bodies crave sugar and have a very low threshold for resisting it. The desire to eat it is innocent.


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## Healer

GusPolinski said:


> Damn.
> 
> @Healer, I realize that you've taken the iPads, iPhones, etc from them, but let's be honest -- like you said, that's little more than a band-aid.
> 
> Look into using a service like OpenDNS to restrict your kids' access to content that they shouldn't be viewing. Ask your ex and her parents to do the same.
> 
> About the iPads... are they wifi only or do they have 3G/4G capabilities as well?


You wouldn't think it learning of my total naivety about the big bad www and kids being online - but I'm a computer guy and know all that stuff. I was just stupid and thought "yeah, but not MY kids". When and if they get them back, they will be totally locked down and I will install key loggers to see if they even try to search that stuff out.

They don't have 3g - just wifi at their respective residences.


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## SecondTime'Round

Healer said:


> Regarding the "totally innocent" thing - even with the lying, deleting history, hiding it - they obviously knew it was wrong or they wouldn't have concealed...but should I look at it as "innocent"? I'm pretty lost here.


I don't know. FW has some good points, but I'd be very concerned about where they saw it in the first place to even develop a curiosity.

When I was young, my sis and I took piano lessons at someone's house. I can't remember why my parents would leave us alone in the woman's house during these lessons, but one of us would wait in the den while the other had the lesson. The husband had Playboy magazines in there, and I know I looked at them all the time, and I'm sure my sister did too. Nobody actually showed them to us, but they were out in the open, and I was curious. So, I get that. But with an iPad, unless it's a bug in a downloaded app that initially "hooks" them, I'd really want to know just how they found out about hard core porn. It could be the cousin, but also might not be.


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## Healer

SecondTime'Round said:


> @Healer, are the kids with the live in boyfriend alone the evenings she has them? Meaning, is she bartending those nights, too, and leaving them in his care?


They are with the bf alone on occasion, yes. Just Friday afternoons until I pick them up (on the Fridays I work). So probably a couple times a month, they are with him for a couple hours alone. The ex swears he's a "great guy". Means nothing.


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## Faithful Wife

STR...I don't think kids these days need to be shown porn by a sinister adult in order to know it exists and to find it. I think ALL kids know this now and it is just a matter of time before each one finds it.


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## Healer

Faithful Wife said:


> The urge to look at it was innocent.
> 
> They know that adults would not want them to be looking at it, kids know this even if no adult ever explained what porn is or told them not to look at it. They just have that feeling that they are sneaking something but they aren't even sure why. They know there is something "wrong" about what they are seeing...but again they aren't sure why. All they are really going for is that feeling of arousal, which is totally innocent. They cannot help that their bodies respond to these images, nor can they help that it is very compelling and feels good.
> 
> I would equate it to them eating sugar cubes when no one is looking and lying/hiding it (something else I used to do). They can't help that our bodies crave sugar and have a very low threshold for resisting it. The desire to eat it is innocent.


Thanks FW. You seem normal, so I have hope.


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## ihatethis

Ok first off... I don't even have to read your entire post yet, but, why do your kids ages 7 and 10 have unsupervised iPads? I mean, when i was 7 & 10, I barely got to watch TV, let alone sit on an iPad/computer. Shouldn't they be engaging in other activities?


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## SecondTime'Round

Faithful Wife said:


> STR...I don't think kids these days need to be shown porn by a sinister adult in order to know it exists and to find it. I think ALL kids know this now and it is just a matter of time before each one finds it.


Yes, you're probably right. And it's still possible the 10 year old found it and showed his little sister.

I still would not drop this, though.


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## Healer

SecondTime'Round said:


> I don't know. FW has some good points, but I'd be very concerned about where they saw it in the first place to even develop a curiosity.
> 
> When I was young, my sis and I took piano lessons at someone's house. I can't remember why my parents would leave us alone in the woman's house during these lessons, but one of us would wait in the den while the other had the lesson. The husband had Playboy magazines in there, and I know I looked at them all the time, and I'm sure my sister did too. Nobody actually showed them to us, but they were out in the open, and I was curious. So, I get that. But with an iPad, unless it's a bug in a downloaded app that initially "hooks" them, I'd really want to know just how they found out about hard core porn. It could be the cousin, but also might not be.


Yup. BIG question for me. Maybe the biggest.


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## GusPolinski

Healer said:


> You wouldn't think it learning of my total naivety about the big bad www and kids being online - but I'm a computer guy and know all that stuff. I was just stupid and thought "yeah, but not MY kids". When and if they get them back, they will be totally locked down and I will install key loggers to see if they even try to search that stuff out.
> 
> They don't have 3g - just wifi at their respective residences.


Getting a _quality_ keylogger onto an iPad will be difficult. And expensive. And, quite possibly, a security risk.

Might be easier on Android tablets, though.


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## SecondTime'Round

ihatethis said:


> Ok first off... I don't even have to read your entire post yet, but, why do your kids ages 7 and 10 have unsupervised iPads? I mean, when i was 7 & 10, I barely got to watch TV, let alone sit on an iPad/computer. Shouldn't they be engaging in other activities?


This is not uncommon in this day and age.


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## Healer

Faithful Wife said:


> STR...I don't think kids these days need to be shown porn by a sinister adult in order to know it exists and to find it. I think ALL kids know this now and it is just a matter of time before each one finds it.


My son said he got the idea from "Friends". Joey talks about porn on that show. So I guess "Friends" is off limits too? But in this day and age, they're going to hear about porn everywhere. Cat's outta the bag anyway.


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## Healer

ihatethis said:


> Ok first off... I don't even have to read your entire post yet, but, why do your kids ages 7 and 10 have unsupervised iPads? I mean, when i was 7 & 10, I barely got to watch TV, let alone sit on an iPad/computer. Shouldn't they be engaging in other activities?


Because I made a colossal error in judgement. My mom got them the iPads to have something consistent with them with all their travelling - road time, waiting around, etc. Lesson learned.


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## SecondTime'Round

Healer said:


> My son said he got the idea from "Friends". Joey talks about porn on that show. So I guess "Friends" is off limits too? But in this day and age, they're going to hear about porn everywhere. Cat's outta the bag anyway.


I think Friends should be off limits to that age group, yes, but that's not what this is about.


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## Healer

GusPolinski said:


> Getting a keylogger onto an iPad will be difficult. And expensive. And, quite possibly, a security risk.
> 
> Might be easier on Android tablets, though.


What about something router level?


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## ihatethis

SecondTime'Round said:


> This is not uncommon in this day and age.


I don't care if it's common. It doesn't mean it's ok.


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## GusPolinski

Healer said:


> What about something router level?


You could do that, but there's no telling how much of it would be encrypted.

Talk w/ @ScrambledEggs... he should be able to help w/ that.


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## Healer

ihatethis said:


> I don't care if it's common. It doesn't mean it's ok.


Well, they're gone now. And IF they come back, they're locked down and supervised. Like I said - lesson learned. The hard way.


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## ihatethis

Healer said:


> Because I made a colossal error in judgement. My mom got them the iPads to have something consistent with them with all their travelling - road time, waiting around, etc. Lesson learned.


Honestly, I don't think you're a bad dad, at all. I think the way you reacted is completely normal and it is absolutely necessary to take those devices away.

Have you met the live in boyfriend? I'm not saying it's his fault, but until you meet him, I would tell your ex you are uncomfortable with him alone with the kids (not saying he is responsible for their actions because that is quite the accusation but just to be safe).

Also, with so many parents these days, kids aren't engaged enough in real life activity. It is good you are getting them into counseling but they need to engage doing things with their mom, you, their grandparents (if that's who they are staying with). Kids don't need to use their imagination like before becuase everything is ont eh computer and they can see it first hand. Take them away from the technology and bring them back to reality. I know that as parents, everyone works and gets tired and sometimes gets lazy (not saying you necessarily) but that doesn't mean the child doesn't need better interaction. I helped my sister raise my 6 year old niece and I worked 2 jobs, etc. But we NEVER put her in front of the TV or computer to babysit her. We took her outside to play, went on walks, went to the park, and when it was too cold, we did activities inside that engaged their mind. Your kids need to be brought back to what kids need, imagination and one on one time. Give them books instead of iPads to do something while they are traveling. It could be a color book, activity book, etc. If they get bored, well then (I know shocker) they can talk. 

I'm sorry if any of this seemed harsh, but I just can't handle some parents (again not necessarily aiming at you because you sound like you are a really great dad).


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## SecondTime'Round

ihatethis said:


> I don't care if it's common. It doesn't mean it's ok.


Hindsight. I don't think a thread where a dad is panicking is a place to pick apart parenting choices or debate appropriate use of technology.


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## ihatethis

SecondTime'Round said:


> Hindsight. I don't think a thread where a dad is panicking is a place to pick apart parenting choices or debate appropriate use of technology.


It's a part of the problem. And there are other parents on this site, so it can be a lesson for them as well.


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## SecondTime'Round

ihatethis said:


> Honestly, I don't think you're a bad dad, at all. I think the way you reacted is completely normal and it is absolutely necessary to take those devices away.
> 
> Have you met the live in boyfriend? I'm not saying it's his fault, but until you meet him, I would tell your ex you are uncomfortable with him alone with the kids (not saying he is responsible for their actions because that is quite the accusation but just to be safe).
> 
> Also, with so many parents these days, kids aren't engaged enough in real life activity. It is good you are getting them into counseling but they need to engage doing things with their mom, you, their grandparents (if that's who they are staying with). Kids don't need to use their imagination like before becuase everything is ont eh computer and they can see it first hand. Take them away from the technology and bring them back to reality. I know that as parents, everyone works and gets tired and sometimes gets lazy (not saying you necessarily) but that doesn't mean the child doesn't need better interaction. I helped my sister raise my 6 year old niece and I worked 2 jobs, etc. But we NEVER put her in front of the TV or computer to babysit her. We took her outside to play, went on walks, went to the park, and when it was too cold, we did activities inside that engaged their mind. Your kids need to be brought back to what kids need, imagination and one on one time. Give them books instead of iPads to do something while they are traveling. It could be a color book, activity book, etc. If they get bored, well then (I know shocker) they can talk.
> 
> I'm sorry if any of this seemed harsh, but I just can't handle some parents (again not necessarily aiming at you because you sound like you are a really great dad).


This lecture was not necessary on this thread, at all. Being a single parent to two kids is very difficult and sometimes we do what works at the time. I think every parent on this board knows that kids' tech time should be limited and running around time should be pushed.


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## SecondTime'Round

ihatethis said:


> It's a part of the problem. And there are other parents on this site, so it can be a lesson for them as well.


Not the place. Not your place as someone who is not a parent.


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## ihatethis

When you looked at the history, did it tell you the date of them first looking at it? Like were you able to go back far enough to see the first time it was pulled up? If so, you could look back to see where they were when that took place.


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## ihatethis

SecondTime'Round said:


> Not the place. Not your place as someone who is not a parent.


I don't have to have a baby come out of my vagina or stomach to say if I am a parent or not. You have no clue what my life is.


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## Healer

ihatethis said:


> Honestly, I don't think you're a bad dad, at all. I think the way you reacted is completely normal and it is absolutely necessary to take those devices away.
> 
> Have you met the live in boyfriend? I'm not saying it's his fault, but until you meet him, I would tell your ex you are uncomfortable with him alone with the kids (not saying he is responsible for their actions because that is quite the accusation but just to be safe).
> 
> Also, with so many parents these days, kids aren't engaged enough in real life activity. It is good you are getting them into counseling but they need to engage doing things with their mom, you, their grandparents (if that's who they are staying with). Kids don't need to use their imagination like before becuase everything is ont eh computer and they can see it first hand. Take them away from the technology and bring them back to reality. I know that as parents, everyone works and gets tired and sometimes gets lazy (not saying you necessarily) but that doesn't mean the child doesn't need better interaction. I helped my sister raise my 6 year old niece and I worked 2 jobs, etc. But we NEVER put her in front of the TV or computer to babysit her. We took her outside to play, went on walks, went to the park, and when it was too cold, we did activities inside that engaged their mind. Your kids need to be brought back to what kids need, imagination and one on one time. Give them books instead of iPads to do something while they are traveling. It could be a color book, activity book, etc. If they get bored, well then (I know shocker) they can talk.
> 
> I'm sorry if any of this seemed harsh, but I just can't handle some parents (again not necessarily aiming at you because you sound like you are a really great dad).


Agreed on all points. And thanks.


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## Healer

SecondTime'Round said:


> This lecture was not necessary on this thread, at all. Being a single parent to two kids is very difficult and sometimes we do what works at the time. I think every parent on this board knows that kids' tech time should be limited and running around time should be pushed.


I'll admit I'm overwhelmed being a single dad. I've also been dealing with some mild depression - I work in the oil industry and just survived round 2 of mass layoffs. I've not been in a good state. That coupled with the divorce, and the cheating that caused it...it's been a rough 3 years. Probably even worse for the kids. I'm sure my kids feel that vibe from me. They never speak of their mom, because they know of the pain she caused. That's not good for them either. 

But thank you for the kindness.


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## Healer

ihatethis said:


> When you looked at the history, did it tell you the date of them first looking at it? Like were you able to go back far enough to see the first time it was pulled up? If so, you could look back to see where they were when that took place.


No, that data was permanently deleted.


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## SecondTime'Round

Healer said:


> I'll admit I'm overwhelmed being a single dad. I've also been dealing with some mild depression - I work in the oil industry and just survived round 2 of mass layoffs. I've not been in a good state. That coupled with the divorce, and the cheating that caused it...it's been a rough 3 years. Probably even worse for the kids. I'm sure my kids feel that vibe from me. *They never speak of their mom, because they know of the pain she caused. That's not good for them either. *
> 
> But thank you for the kindness.


No, it isn't good, but it's pretty much the same here, so I get it. I don't bad mouth their dad (to them), but it does suck to see them being careful of what they say about him (and especially his woman) to me. My daughter is even super careful to not show me pics on her phone of her dad or the OW when she's scrolling through photos she wants to show me. I see her stress about it (and yes, I'm sure "that" is what she's hiding, not anything nefarious). On one hand, I appreciate that they are learning to respect the feelings of other people and what might upset them, but on the other hand, I don't want them to have that pressure .


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## Faithful Wife

Healer....your kids will be ok. In fact, they will be better than before. Before, unbeknownst to you, they had seen these images and had confusing and conflicted feelings about them, no doubt. Now they will have your guidance in a way that will help them understand going forward more about themselves, their curiosity, and about you and your values. The images they saw will fade (and they will fade for you too, I'm sure that was a horrible moment for you to see what they had seen). Their curiosity will not fade but can now be understood by them and can become age appropriate. 

Look up some articles about how to talk to your kids about porn now that the cat's out of the bag (ie: they've already seen it). This will be an ongoing conversation over the years anyway, along with sex, relationships, etc. The more you fill up their minds with healthy, appropriate ideas, the more those images will fade for all of you.

Easy access to porn is a reality in the world and many parents are having the same experience you had. It is a sad side effect to where we've found ourselves in relation to porn, as a society. We are somewhat bullied by it now. I don't see how this is going to change anytime soon either, so I'm sure there will be more parents talking about it and finding ways to protect their kids, since there really is no question that every kid who has any internet access will be finding it soon. It has to be discussed, because the problem exists.

Maybe there can be a new internet someday. Sort of the opposite of the dark net....where NO porn exists. We can hope.


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## ihatethis

SecondTime'Round said:


> This lecture was not necessary on this thread, at all. Being a single parent to two kids is very difficult and sometimes we do what works at the time. I think every parent on this board knows that kids' tech time should be limited and running around time should be pushed.


I'm not "lecturing" I'm saying that in the future, by ENGAGING more with the kids, it will help them get past this. That they will see love with their one on one time with their parents, and how that is going to be so beneficial. 

To the OP, when I was young, my neighbors were 2 boys who were 3 and 5 years older than me. They got into their dads "stash" and found playboys and homemade video sex tapes. I was shown these things by them and my mom and dad found out. Now, it wasn't degrading porn, but nonetheless, it was porn. After this happened, (long story short) my parents spent a lot of time with me, and doing activities to get my mind off of it. The only reason why I know about it today, is because my parents told me. I was around 10 or 11 years old I believe. I just want you to know that there is hope for them that they can get back to normal. The best thing to do is just be there for them (you and your ex) and engage with them as much as possible.


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## Healer

Faithful Wife said:


> Healer....your kids will be ok. In fact, they will be better than before. Before, unbeknownst to you, they had seen these images and had confusing and conflicted feelings about them, no doubt. Now they will have your guidance in a way that will help them understand going forward more about themselves, their curiosity, and about you and your values. The images they saw will fade (and they will fade for you too, I'm sure that was a horrible moment for you to see what they had seen). Their curiosity will not fade but can now be understood by them and can become age appropriate.
> 
> Look up some articles about how to talk to your kids about porn now that the cat's out of the bag (ie: they've already seen it). This will be an ongoing conversation over the years anyway, along with sex, relationships, etc. The more you fill up their minds with healthy, appropriate ideas, the more those images will fade for all of you.
> 
> Easy access to porn is a reality in the world and many parents are having the same experience you had. It is a sad side effect to where we've found ourselves in relation to porn, as a society. We are somewhat bullied by it now. I don't see how this is going to change anytime soon either, so I'm sure there will be more parents talking about it and finding ways to protect their kids, since there really is no question that every kid who has any internet access will be finding it soon. It has to be discussed, because the problem exists.
> 
> Maybe there can be a new internet someday. Sort of the opposite of the dark net....where NO porn exists. We can hope.


Thanks FW - I needed the optimism. And that's a great way to look at it.


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## ocotillo

Healer said:


> I see the history is cleared. Red flag. I figure out how to see it on the back end, and yup, hardcore porn all over the ****ing place. And bad stuff. Bondage, violent, abusive stuff - some generic stuff like youp*rn and redtube, but some nasty girls getting smacked around with c0cks while sodomized and stuff. Like maybe 15+ sites.



I've seen this many times on other people's devices. (Which is why I said on the other thread that the average parent borders on clueless when it comes to how much their children know and when they knew it.) 

I wish I had something helpful to add (Other than what Faithful Wife and others have said.) 

I think you did the right thing by confiscating the iPads, but every year it gets a little harder. The innocuous looking Ipod is running the exact same OS and has similar capabilities. Smart TV's, blue-ray players and video gaming consoles often have web-browsers built in and not all parents think to lock them down.


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## turnera

SecondTime'Round said:


> This is not uncommon in this day and age.


Doesn't make it right, and doesn't mean everyone has to do it just because Johnny's parents let him. They're called kids for a reason: we have to think FOR them because they're not capable yet.

OP, let the counselor direct this whole thing - what to ask, when to ask...they're trained to do this right and not traumatize the kids any more than they already are.


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## NoChoice

OP,
I did not ave time to read the entire thread this evening so if I repeat advice I apologize. I was moved to respond after reading the initial post and most of the first page. This is tragic but you must keep perspective on this. As a parent it is your job to protect your children and this instance is a glaring example of just how difficult that job can be, Especially to someone who is naive as to the horrors so easily available to our young.

In any event, the situation has arisen and no amount of self deprecation will change that. Your job now is to minimize the effects and any long term implications that could arise. Think of memories you had as a child. I remember very little of what happened to me at the age of your daughter. The things I do remember are the more memorable events that were impactful due to their severity AND the reactions of those around me. It has been proven that tragic events have this affect on memory because of the event itself and due to the inordinate amount of attention they garner. The mind tends to remember that which "shocks" the memory.

So then, in my opinion, I would play this down. Let me explain. At seven and ten years of age your children have large amounts of sensory input. The things that are emphasized and stressed will have the highest chance of being retained in long term memory. Your initial response may have already taken a large step in securing this incident in their memory so I would attempt to modify your (over)reaction to this incident. As you stated you have already done, they must be cut off from this source of negative influence completely, in all three dwellings. Also, as you have stated you have already done, they need to be made to see that this activity is totally inappropriate for them and that what they saw was not real life but rather a show not unlike the violence in cartoons. This must be done calmly and in an age appropriate manner. They should also be monitored as to their friends and their friends access to this type of material.

I feel that once you emphasize that this was wrong and not to be continued and have put into place more stringent monitoring of their activities that the matter should be allowed to fade into non importance. What is done is done and I feel that the more that is made of it now the more firmly it will be etched into their memories. Let the vast amount of good sensory input that they are experiencing smother out the memories of this incident.

Children are innocent and when your daughter answered that she did not know why she deleted the material or looked at it in the first place by saying "I don't know" she was most likely being honest. I believe the less you make of this now the quicker it will fade from their memories and it may be, quite probably, you who retain more of it than they.

It is important however that you are diligent in your observance of their activity and crucially important that you know what they are looking for and at. I would not return their tablets, or at least limit their time on them and suggest that they find other activities to enhance their creativity and as an outlet for their exuberant energy. If you do return them be very sure that any and all parental blocks are installed which would negate them accessing this kind of material henceforth. I would be willing to bet that Gus can assist you with finding and installing such programs.

Children will be children and you have not forever scarred yours. Take this opportunity to become more involved in their lives and to keep closer tabs on their activities and they will be fine. This may end up impacting you more than it will them if you do not make it too traumatic and give it more importance than it needs. Good fortune to you and those kids.


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## Healer

NoChoice said:


> OP,
> I did not ave time to read the entire thread this evening so if I repeat advice I apologize. I was moved to respond after reading the initial post and most of the first page. This is tragic but you must keep perspective on this. As a parent it is your job to protect your children and this instance is a glaring example of just how difficult that job can be, Especially to someone who is naive as to the horrors so easily available to our young.
> 
> In any event, the situation has arisen and no amount of self deprecation will change that. Your job now is to minimize the effects and any long term implications that could arise. Think of memories you had as a child. I remember very little of what happened to me at the age of your daughter. The things I do remember are the more memorable events that were impactful due to their severity AND the reactions of those around me. It has been proven that tragic events have this affect on memory because of the event itself and due to the inordinate amount of attention they garner. The mind tends to remember that which "shocks" the memory.
> 
> So then, in my opinion, I would play this down. Let me explain. At seven and ten years of age your children have large amounts of sensory input. The things that are emphasized and stressed will have the highest chance of being retained in long term memory. Your initial response may have already taken a large step in securing this incident in their memory so I would attempt to modify your (over)reaction to this incident. As you stated you have already done, they must be cut off from this source of negative influence completely, in all three dwellings. Also, as you have stated you have already done, they need to be made to see that this activity is totally inappropriate for them and that what they saw was not real life but rather a show not unlike the violence in cartoons. This must be done calmly and in an age appropriate manner. They should also be monitored as to their friends and their friends access to this type of material.
> 
> I feel that once you emphasize that this was wrong and not to be continued and have put into place more stringent monitoring of their activities that the matter should be allowed to fade into non importance. What is done is done and I feel that the more that is made of it now the more firmly it will be etched into their memories. Let the vast amount of good sensory input that they are experiencing smother out the memories of this incident.
> 
> Children are innocent and when your daughter answered that she did not know why she deleted the material or looked at it in the first place by saying "I don't know" she was most likely being honest. I believe the less you make of this now the quicker it will fade from their memories and it may be, quite probably, you who retain more of it than they.
> 
> It is important however that you are diligent in your observance of their activity and crucially important that you know what they are looking for and at. I would not return their tablets, or at least limit their time on them and suggest that they find other activities to enhance their creativity and as an outlet for their exuberant energy. If you do return them be very sure that any and all parental blocks are installed which would negate them accessing this kind of material henceforth. I would be willing to bet that Gus can assist you with finding and installing such programs.
> 
> Children will be children and you have not forever scarred yours. Take this opportunity to become more involved in their lives and to keep closer tabs on their activities and they will be fine. This may end up impacting you more than it will them if you do not make it too traumatic and give it more importance than it needs. Good fortune to you and those kids.


Great post, thank you.


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## SecondTime'Round

turnera said:


> Doesn't make it right, and doesn't mean everyone has to do it just because Johnny's parents let him. They're called kids for a reason: we have to think FOR them because they're not capable yet.
> 
> OP, let the counselor direct this whole thing - what to ask, when to ask...they're trained to do this right and not traumatize the kids any more than they already are.


Oh I agree. I just don't think this thread is the place to point it out as if the OP is somehow at fault for "letting" his kids have iPads. He feels bad enough.


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## ScrambledEggs

GusPolinski said:


> You could do that, but there's no telling how much of it would be encrypted.
> 
> Talk w/ @ScrambledEggs... he should be able to help w/ that.


Just saw this. PM me if you have questions.


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