# Single mom and adventures in dating



## visionary

Hi everyone. 

I have been separated from my husband for close to a year. We have been married for a decade and have young children. He, sadly, is a narcissist who verbally and emotionally abused me, and has substance issues. He also physically abused and intimidated me a few times. We have a divorce in process. 

I have decided to start dating. I haven't met anyone I'd like to date in person. So I've been talking to guys online on a couple dating sites. I realize from my failed marriage, and how our relationship began, that I ignored many red flags in the beginning. I also haven't always had good boundaries historically. I'm in a decent place where I'm able to recognize most toxicity because of much time spent in therapy, self-reflection, etc. So far, I like the pace of online dating because I can keep my emotions more distant. I feel like I am better able to assess if someone would be healthy for me or not. 

My goal at this point isn't to have a boyfriend quite yet. My goal is to learn how to relate with men in a healthy way and recognize when a relationship and our behaviors are healthy or unhealthy. I believe the best foundation for a relationship is friendship. So I am really taking it slow. I have some self-improvement to do physically and emotionally before I feel that I'll be ready for an actual relationship. But for now, it's been fun and rewarding taking to guys online and getting to know them in the process. 

I have been chatting with a guy I had come to like a lot. He's not my usual type, and by that I mean he's kind of boring at first glance. That is great for me. I have noticed that if I have an initial strong pull to a man, he is usually bad news for me. We have some shared interests, and we started talking a lot. It became obvious that we are great conversation partners, exciting and challenging each other intellectually. He is far away from me geographically, so it is definitely long-distance. He has young kids and is divorced. 

I wanted to take it off the dating platform, but waited for him to make the first move because I enjoy being pursued. I also don't want to come off as aggressive or desperate. He asked me if he could get my number! Yes! We started texting and the excitement grew. He asked if I'd like to talk on the phone with him and I enthusiastically said yes. 

We had an amazing conversation. It lasted for hours! There were a couple red flags, though. One is that he lived with his ex until very recently. He felt it necessary to "take care" of things like making sure the house was repaired and warm for the winter. So it was just odd to me, because in my state they won't even let you divorce if you're not physically separated. I didn't comment, just asked how he managed that. He said they were on opposite schedules and hardly saw each other. Then I remembered from our chats that he still goes over there to help with the kids sometimes. I have no problem with someone having a recent separation, etc. As I said, I'm not jumping into anything. I just thought his rationalizations were odd. Like, why not just send money for the heat, visit for repairs, etc.?

Then there's another red flag: his aunt. She had been married, but her husband passed away, so she's pretty lonely. She texts him every day and checks in on him. He said he likes it because he doesn't have too many social connections locally. They talk on the phone sometimes too. He said that she asks him very personal questions and sort of laughed nervously. He said he just avoids answering them. Then he said that she's been "obsessed" with him even since he was a baby. All of this struck me as a little odd, but I didn't say anything. But why this obsession with and not his siblings? That's what I wondered. And he seems to get a kick out of it. Also I noticed his lack of boundaries about her invasive questions, avoiding them as a tactic instead of saying that's enough of that. 

Then the weirdness escalated. He sent me a video and I commented on how sexy his voice is. He liked that he piqued my interest. But then he told me in immense detail how his aunt goes completely wild over his voice. She says that he doesn't even know how amazing it is. I was kinda like, huh? He said he just shrugs it off, and that I'd have to know her to understand. 

So, my friends. All this is a little too weird for me. I have an icky feeling about it. I know I'm only talking to this guy from a distance, but I have learned that my time and energy is precious. I had been getting all giddy to talk to him. Now I am feeling stressed, literally anxious in my body about this. 

Please share your unabashedly honest comments, thoughts, and feedback. Thank you!!


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## hubbyintrubby

I was very excited for you, until the aunt stuff. That sounds beyond creepy. Like, borderline incestuous creepy.


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## Livvie

Uh wow yes.

I'm divorced.

Hard no from me regarding the- he needed to make sure her house was "warm and safe for the winter."

It's one thing to coparent wonderfully together. It's another to worry about your ex like she's your girlfriend. 

For me, no no nope.

The aunt thing is pretty wacky and for that alone I'd say no thank you, and move on.


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## visionary

Thanks @Livvie and @hubbyintrubby for sharing. Your perspectives are so helpful for me. You've given me validation that my hesitation is guiding me in the right direction! 

How would you recommend ending this relationship? We had really started to open up to each other. I am so disappointed.


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## Casual Observer

Nice thing is that you have nothing invested but a bit of time. He's far enough away that it shouldn't be an issue disconnecting. On the other hand, he could also show up at your door unannounced just for fun sometime. I would make a hard disconnect right away. Including blocking his number on your phone. Whatever information he may have on you, if it's something where you can cover your tracks, I'd do so.

The "aunt" thing is just a bit too weird. You are right to trust your unease. Follow your instincts here.


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## hubbyintrubby

visionary said:


> Thanks @Livvie and @hubbyintrubby for sharing. Your perspectives are so helpful for me. You've given me validation that my hesitation is guiding me in the right direction!
> 
> How would you recommend ending this relationship? We had really started to open up to each other. I am so disappointed.


End it with compassion, be kind but firm. You can tell him why you're ending contact, but you don't have to if you don't want to also.


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## Arkansas

you are still married?


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## TBT

Welcome @visionary. You might check out the singles of TAM thread.


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## SunCMars

Just so you know...

The aunt is a plant, a gauge to your reaction. He is using your reaction to the Aunt to see if it is something that you can (or will) tolerate.

Likely, the substance of their relationship is true. This aunt is a wild card.
Uh, provided the older lady is even related to him. She may not be.

He is setting the stage for her being in the picture, if you two get.....together.

This may be why his STBXW, split with him. Because, she too, found him weird.

He sounds rather playful and rather playing with marked cards.

A man having a wonderful personality (as this?) may be such a practiced man. 
A chameleon, he. Accordingly, as needed, changing his spots, his personality, whenever he spots a vulnerable lady.

He knows what to say and when.
He may be a player, though not too clever, at least to me, it seems...

If he were clever he would never have brought up this Aunt, not an ant should have been mentioned.

He may still be married, just separated and tom-fooling around.
Maybe, he is not even separated.

The internet, is often that silky web that holds waiting spiders, instead of good men.


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## visionary

Arkansas said:


> you are still married?


Yes, I am. And honest that I am separated in my online dating profiles.


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## Marduk

I'm very close with one of my aunts, especially after my mom died. She texts me almost daily checking up on me, and we talk on the phone a few times a week.

That being said, we don't talk about stuff like that. Follow your gut - bail.


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## visionary

@hubbyintrubby Thanks again. I am thinking I won't mention why, because I don't want to tip him off about how creepy this is. That way, he can unwittingly reveal it to other females in his future... God willing, they will see it as a red flag too. 



TBT said:


> Welcome @visionary. You might check out the singles of TAM thread.


Thank you! Where is that thread located?


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## visionary

Casual Observer said:


> The "aunt" thing is just a bit too weird. You are right to trust your unease. Follow your instincts here.


Wow, thank you. I hadn't thought of going to such extreme measures. You think his situation with the aunt indicates a deeper level of creepiness?
@SunCMars Insightful response. Thank you!


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## visionary

@Marduk Thanks for your input. At first, I thought it was a good thing that he had some support. But then it turned icky...


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## Casual Observer

visionary said:


> Wow, thank you. I hadn't thought of going to such extreme measures. You think his situation with the aunt indicates a deeper level of creepiness?
> @SunCMars Insightful response. Thank you!


You just don't know, and you can't know, without putting yourself at risk. Since there's no real up side to this relationship (aside from "practice") that is no reason to take chances. As @Marduk suggested, bail. Except that I'm suggesting going one step further and blocking. Is there a "nice" way to block someone? Don't know. But again, there is no reason to take chances.


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## wilson

Unfortunately, you'll have to get used to going through a lot of men to find one you want to be with. This won't be the last time you open up with a guy and then later decide you don't want to be with him. It happens with everyone. You can tell him something like you don't think it's working out, you want to date someone closer, you're not in a good place to date right now, or whatever. Hopefully he takes it okay, but if not that's his problem. Don't feel like it's your duty to make him feel better. He's an adult and rejection is a normal part of dating. If he can't handle that, it's his problem to work through.

Keep this experience in mind as you continue in the dating world. Decide how quickly you want to open up with the knowledge that it may take a while to really get to know someone. And then if it's not working out, let him loose. Sometimes dating people try to solve relationship problems as if they were married, but it's a sign it's not going to work out if major problems happen while dating.


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## TBT

visionary said:


> @hubbyintrubby Thanks again. I am thinking I won't mention why, because I don't want to tip him off about how creepy this is. That way, he can unwittingly reveal it to other females in his future... God willing, they will see it as a red flag too.
> 
> 
> Thank you! Where is that thread located?


You're welcome.

https://talkaboutmarriage.com/life-after-divorce/438543-new-singles-tam-2020-edition.html


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## MJJEAN

People online reveal only what they want you to see. The next creep might be savvy enough to not speak of his creepy. There really is no substitute for knowing someone in real life before getting emotionally invested. I'm not saying don't online date, but maybe limit to a geographic area that would allow meeting in person early on and regularly after that if things go well.


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## SunCMars

Here's the thing...

When talking through emails, the cell phone, et'cetera, we all experience that loss of words....situation.

That is when the hidden side of the personality shows through.

It may be innocent as in hobbies, some boring, some uncommon. 

What excites the person bubbles out.

It may be those kinky thoughts that involuntarily pop out and unwind. 
They wash up onto the 'bore', this during those talking, dry swells.


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## Arkansas

visionary

I would say that a good man would see a woman still being married as a red flag. Wait until the divorce is final, that's what I'm doing


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## MJJEAN

Arkansas said:


> visionary
> 
> I would say that a good man would see a woman still being married as a red flag. Wait until the divorce is final, that's what I'm doing


Most people I know dated or even cohabited while awaiting their divorce finalization. I wouldn't consider willingness to date someone in process of divorce a red flag. It's just a different point of view. Some believe once you're married, you're bound for life regardless with the court says. Some believe once you marry, you're bound until a judge signs off. Some believe once you marry, you're bound until the personal relationship is ended and there's no need to refrain while waiting on the paperwork to catch up with reality.


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## visionary

Casual Observer said:


> You just don't know, and you can't know, without putting yourself at risk. Since there's no real up side to this relationship (aside from "practice") that is no reason to take chances. As @Marduk suggested, bail. Except that I'm suggesting going one step further and blocking. Is there a "nice" way to block someone? Don't know. But again, there is no reason to take chances.


I did it. I told him that I'm not interested and that I don't want to be in touch anymore. Thanks everyone here for your input. 

I haven't blocked him. First, he did have a respectful response and it seems like he'll leave me alone. Secondly, I have been stalked in the past. The person would often call to project their actions: I'm in the area, etc. So it gave me time to be on guard. I always like having that warning. Not sure if everyone has the same experience.


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## visionary

@wilson


> try to solve relationship problems as if they were married, but it's a sign it's not going to work out if major problems happen while dating.


So true. So very true. Thank you. 
@TBT
Thanks for the link!
@MJJEAN


> People online reveal only what they want you to see. The next creep might be savvy enough to not speak of his creepy. There really is no substitute for knowing someone in real life before getting emotionally invested. I'm not saying don't online date, but maybe limit to a geographic area that would allow meeting in person early on and regularly after that if things go well.


I agree with that. For now, I'm not necessarily expecting to meet "the one." So I am okay with some distance and feeling it out. Just trying to learn about humans again after a long time with only one. 

I will say, I think photos can be quite revealing. In my younger days, I met a guy and thought he was pretty cool. Then I saw his driver's license photo and gasped. He looked like a serial killer. It ended with a scary situation for me, but thank God I escaped unscathed.


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## visionary

SunCMars said:


> Here's the thing...
> 
> When talking through emails, the cell phone, et'cetera, we all experience that loss of words....situation.
> 
> That is when the hidden side of the personality shows through.
> 
> It may be innocent as in hobbies, some boring, some uncommon.
> 
> What excites the person bubbles out.
> 
> It may be those kinky thoughts that involuntarily pop out and unwind.
> They wash up onto the 'bore', this during those talking, dry swells.


I really like the way you put this. I have found this to be true!


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## visionary

Arkansas said:


> visionary
> 
> I would say that a good man would see a woman still being married as a red flag. Wait until the divorce is final, that's what I'm doing


I appreciate that, and I would also hesitate to seriously date someone who is separated. I am not looking for a committed relationship yet. Not only because the divorce isn't final, but also because I have work to do on myself. I think it will be at least 2 more years until I'm ready to be exclusive with someone. 

I'm trying to re-enter the social world after a decade of being shut off. My husband isolated our family and me. We and our kids were cut off from healthy friendships and normal family relationships. He gaslit me, and I completely believed his version of reality. He also took advantage of me financially. So I'm not in a rush to get involved with someone, at all. 

All this to say, I am looking to date in a casual way. No sex before marriage this time. I'm hoping to learn how to get to know someone fully, develop a deep friendship, read all the cues... Discover what I like and don't like in a partner, and what they like and don't like about me. And have some good clean fun in the process. I have been through heavy stuff in the past decade. I want to keep it light for a long while. 

That being said, I was bummed to cut off contact with Kinky Aunt Guy. But I didn't commit myself to him in any way, so it hurts a lot less.

I also learned from this that, at this stage, I am going to refrain from texting. Not sure if anyone else feels this way, but I find that texts take a lot of my mental energy. I don't like the feeling of waiting for a text, the anticipation and excitement. I know that may be half the fun, but I find it to be draining.


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## attheend02

visionary said:


> All this to say, I am looking to date in a casual way. *No sex before marriage this time. I'm hoping to learn how to get to know someone fully, develop a deep friendship, read all the cues.*.. Discover what I like and don't like in a partner, and what they like and don't like about me. And have some good clean fun in the process. I have been through heavy stuff in the past decade. I want to keep it light for a long while.


While I understand taking it slow, "no sex before marriage" seems like a good way to get into a rushed marriage. JMO


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## OnTheFly

visionary said:


> Now I am feeling stressed, literally anxious in my body about this.


These types of feelings so early on are not good.

Are you willing to invest more time and energy in order to find out his relationship to the Aunt is even weirder than he lets on? Or maybe it's also possible that how he is describing his Aunt is overblown and he's just nervous to be talking to a cool chick (not as likely).

Trust your gut and the things you've recently learned.

Good luck.


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## OnTheFly

visionary said:


> , I am going to refrain from texting.


Wise....it should only be used long enough to get a number. 

Soooo much is lost in text communications. Phone is better, but still not great. Face to face is best, riskiest and most time consuming.


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## inabind

Your story hits home to my situation. The difference being how you seem to blame your your "last decade" as being under control of someone else. It took me a while to realize that all relationships take two and that I can't victimize myself for what has happened in the past. This was very important for me to understand because moving forward I may end up in the same place again. My taking accountability of what I did in my relationship was a way to set me free so I didn't carry the same state of mind into any new relationship whether it was reconsidering working things out with my SO or moving on. For me I had to understand how my behaviors contributed to our problems. Until I could take responsibility for my actions I wasn't able to move forward. Just a thought. It takes two to make it and two to break it. You have to be "whole" again before you can move forward.


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## Faithful Wife

attheend02 said:


> visionary said:
> 
> 
> 
> All this to say, I am looking to date in a casual way. *No sex before marriage this time. I'm hoping to learn how to get to know someone fully, develop a deep friendship, read all the cues.*.. Discover what I like and don't like in a partner, and what they like and don't like about me. And have some good clean fun in the process. I have been through heavy stuff in the past decade. I want to keep it light for a long while.
> 
> 
> 
> While I understand taking it slow, "no sex before marriage" seems like a good way to get into a rushed marriage. JMO
Click to expand...

I would say the opposite. No sex before marriage, if that is communicated upfront (and it should be) will likely equal very few dates. Not many adults who are dating are willing to wait until marriage. Perhaps the OP should stick to only religion based dating sites or meeting only people from church.


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## She'sStillGotIt

He's yet another online freak who seems to have some kind of aunt fetish he gets off on.

I also have my doubts that he's REALLY separated and lives on his own. I mean, if he has his own place, why on earth is he not sharing custody of his kids or at the very least, having them at his place every other weekend? What's this happy horse**** with him "visiting" the kids at his supposed prior house, like he's their uncle or cousin or something?

People can be whoever they WANT to be on the internet, and sadly, you'll never learn that more than you will dealing with the freak parade that is online dating. Just being honest with you.

Lastly, surely your therapist has told you that when your gut is trying to tell you something, you need to LISTEN to it, right? * Never ignore your gut* - and it was speaking loud enough to you that you posted on this message board, so what's _*that*_ telling you?


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## Arkansas

visionary I'm 50, married 24 years, in the relationship for 25 .... re-entering the dating scene I know how it feels


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## MJJEAN

visionary said:


> All this to say, I am looking to date in a casual way. No sex before marriage this time. I'm hoping to learn how to get to know someone fully, develop a deep friendship, read all the cues... Discover what I like and don't like in a partner, and what they like and don't like about me. And have some good clean fun in the process. I have been through heavy stuff in the past decade. I want to keep it light for a long while.


I was actually going to suggest dating casually after reading your replies to this point. Take your time. Have fun. Be social. I know you don't expect to find "the one" any time soon, but "the one" has a way of sneaking up on you in my experience. I was in a dark place, planned to veg in sweats with ice cream and cheesy horror films, a friend came and kidnapped me for my own sanity, we went to our favorite club, and there he was. My best friend found her "the one" playing online games. They talked a bit and realized they lived within a few miles of each other. Another friend met "the one" at a festival. So, expect the unexpected and be open to surprises.

Pre-marital sex is a personal decision, but I think sexual compatibility is very important in a long term romantic relationship. If you're thoroughly vetting potential future spouses, I'd think that sex would be part of that. Everyone has a sexual style, their own preferences and kinks, and level of frequency desired. Couples can discuss likes, dislikes, kinks, boundaries, fantasies, desired frequency, etc, but words are wind and actions are king. No way to know for sure you're sexually compatible without actually doing the deed and waiting out the limerence period to make sure it wasn't just NRE.


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## NextTimeAround

> Pre-marital sex is a personal decision,


I agree, but do want to add a couple of thoughts:

1. Despite advancement in rights for the LGBTQ community, there are still men around who are looking for a beard. You may think that he's a nice guy because he's not trying it on and really respects you, when in fact, he's relieved that you aren't hassling him for sex.

2. there are men who multi date. Yes, reserving intimacy for someone who is special is important; however, your time is important. A guy may be holding off on sex because he's dating someone who takes priority over you. Well, at least he's not using for sex. But he is using your for something else .......


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