# I am frugal, she is the spender.



## DumpedAgain (Feb 14, 2013)

I am frugal, been saving and investing 401k's IRA's since the early 80's and have accumulated a nice retirement in 10 or 15 years

The problem is now. My wife's spending is accelerating. I always pay our investment accounts first, and until a few years ago we had plenty of money left over. My wife developed a lifestyle, Sushi
with the girlfriends, spa treatments, botox, plastic surgery, a certain taste in clothing etc

Then, the recession hit. Income begins to regress, year after year
until it is now half what it was before the recession

This has not stopped my wife, not only has she apparently not
noticed the reduction of income, she has stepped it up

The marriage has deteriorated for many reasons, not the least 
of which is her wild eyed spending

We are now separated, She emptied the cash out of the bank ($61k) and I had to take control of the $. I am paying the bills making sure things get done, she is whining about not having enough money!!!!

I hate the idea of divorce, but financially I would be better off


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## 827Aug (Apr 27, 2008)

I really do feel for you; I was there too. It's best to protect what assets you do have left because your spendthrift wife won't change. I should have done something about my estranged husband's spending years ago. I stayed around and kept hoping things would get better. Things were manageable because we had a very good income. But, like you, the recession hit and he wouldn't give up the extravagant lifestyle. We lost everything. 

Hope things improve for you.


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## Wiltshireman (Jan 23, 2013)

Extravagant speeding when money is in plentiful supply is one thing but spending money you (as a household) do not have is a whole different ball game.

I am sorry to hear so another relationship on the rocks because they did not share the same long term goals. It seems to me that diverse couples can get by in the good times but if the messy stuff hits the fan it helps to be on the same page / heading in the same direction etc.


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## southernsurf (Feb 22, 2013)

does she work?


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

I never understand why the spouse who lets the other spouse spend them into oblivion...doesn't just STOP GIVING THEM MONEY.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

I'm one of those very frugal people......even bought the  Tightwad Gazette years ago.... I knew early on ...although I never cared how much a man earned, I cared deeply how he managed it...

I could NEVER be matched with a frivolous spender... If $$ was tight...I'd want to rip him from limb to limb with every wasteful purchase.....as I seen our dreams slowly die, I would look upon him as my mortal enemy. 

Sounds nasty I suppose... I married a frugal man ...so my horns didn't have to come out.


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## 827Aug (Apr 27, 2008)

SimplyAmorous said:


> I'm one of those very frugal people......even bought the  Tightwad Gazette years ago.... I knew early on ...although I never cared how much a man earned, I cared deeply how he managed it...
> 
> I could NEVER be matched with a frivolous spender... If $$ was tight...I'd want to rip him from limb to limb with every wasteful purchase.....as I seen our dreams slowly die, I would look upon him as my mortal enemy.
> 
> Sounds nasty I suppose... I married a frugal man ...so my horns didn't have to come out.


You have been so blessed.


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## brightlight (Feb 18, 2013)

DumpedAgain said:


> I hate the idea of divorce, but financially I would be better off


She took 61K from you and you would still be better off divorced, you say. Seems like she has laid her cards on the table.

Your options would appear to be divorce and have more money or risk a retirement in penury.


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## totamm (May 1, 2012)

Financial disparity killed my marriage too.

Cut your losses, she won't get any better and even though the divorce is going to cost you half your assets including half of your hard earned 401k, she'll bankrupt both of you if you stay with her.

10 years from now you'll be back to saving and she'll be on welfare.


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## 28down (Feb 26, 2013)

Wow, sorry, sound like sometime is off, have you checked to see if there is someone else?


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## DumpedAgain (Feb 14, 2013)

After an anguished 6 weeks trying to hang on, worrying
about finances, I filed for divorce last week. A great peace
came over me. It is time to move on

She insists on getting the house, it will be the ultimate
revenge, She simply will not be able to afford it. With
her spending habits and the huge cost of a 4000 sf house,
she will slowly go bankrupt

She will get alimony based on reduced recession earnings
and a house that will not sell


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## totamm (May 1, 2012)

DumpedAgain said:


> She insists on getting the house, it will be the ultimate
> revenge, She simply will not be able to afford it. With
> her spending habits and the huge cost of a 4000 sf house,
> she will slowly go bankrupt
> ...


How can you be so certain what the alimony will be based on?

A court might look at your most recent year, the court might look at an average of the past 5 years, a court might award alimony based on what appears to be no logic or common sense.

A court might award support based at least partially on her monthly expenses, which will include the costs of maintaining that large house.

Ideally, the court will order the marital residence to be sold but if there are minor children at home and your exwife gets custody, sometimes the courts will order support so the kids can stay in their home.


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## Toshiba2020 (Mar 1, 2012)

If youre separated why dont you just get a divorce?


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## mdill (Jan 18, 2012)

SimplyAmorous said:


> I'm one of those very frugal people......even bought the  Tightwad Gazette years ago.... I knew early on ...although I never cared how much a man earned, I cared deeply how he managed it...
> 
> I could NEVER be matched with a frivolous spender... If $$ was tight...I'd want to rip him from limb to limb with every wasteful purchase.....as I seen our dreams slowly die, I would look upon him as my mortal enemy.
> 
> Sounds nasty I suppose... I married a frugal man ...so my horns didn't have to come out.


SA your DH is a very lucky man for many reasons. I love your posts. Sadly, many women spend too much. Some men as well, but many more women. I'm a saver, so I can't indentify with spenders. From what I have observed, they are compensating for relatively low self esteem. What do you think?


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## mdill (Jan 18, 2012)

DumpedAgain said:


> After an anguished 6 weeks trying to hang on, worrying
> about finances, I filed for divorce last week. A great peace
> came over me. It is time to move on
> 
> ...


DA I have been where you are at 15 yrs ago. Sadly, several friends as well. Let her have the house and the mortgage. Try to keep the lawyers out the the divorce by negotiating you own agreements. You will both be better off negotiating the asset division without lawyers. You end up with a 50/50 split anyway. It will save you both a lot of $$. She is entitled to 50% of assets in most states (I assume you are in the U.S.). If children are involve you will have to pay support, which was no problem for me as I wanted my kids well cared for. Today, alimony is not a foregone conclusion. It depends on her skills and whether small kids are home. With no kids, the courts will expect her to work and alimony will be limited both in amount and time frame. Trust me you will be better off in long run. I certainly know I am. I'm retire, married and living comfortably in "paradise". My ex is having a difficult time financially. No big surprise there.


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## damsel (Aug 29, 2012)

Maybe this will help with the huge house 

A husband came home one day and told his wife of over ten years that he wanted a divorce at the earliest and that he would like her to move out of that house. He then left to his new girlfriend's house.
Although she was shocked at first she had no choice but to accept the fact. She sat down and analyzed the situation and decided to move out

She spent the first day packing her belongings into boxes, crates and suitcases.

On the second day she had the movers come and collect her things.

On the third day she sat down for the last time at their beautiful dining room table, lit the candle light, put on some soft background music and feasted on a pound of shrimp, a jar of caviar, and a bottle of chardonnay.

When she had finished, she went into each and every room and deposited a few half eaten shrimp shells dipped in caviar, into the hollow of the curtain rods.

She cleaned up the kitchen and left...

When the husband returned with his new girlfriend, all was bliss for the first few days.

Then slowly the house began to smell...........

They tried everything, cleaning, mopping and airing the place out. Vents were checked for dead rodents and the carpets were steam cleaned. Air fresheners were hung everywhere.

Exterminators were brought in to set off gas canisters, during which they had to move out for a few days.

Nothing worked....people stopped coming over to visit.... repair men refused to work in the house and to top it all the maid quit ..

Finally they could not take the stench any longer and decided to move...

A month later, even though they cut their price in half, they could not find a buyer for their stinky house.

Word got out, and eventually the local realtors refused to take their calls...

Finally they had to borrow a huge sum of money from the bank to purchase a new place.

The ex-wife called her ex-husband, and asked how things were going... He told her the saga of the rotting house.....

She listened politely, and said that she missed her old home terribly, and would be willing to reduce her divorce settlement in exchange for getting the house back

Knowing his wife had no idea how bad the smell was, he agreed on a price that was about 1/10 what the house had been worth, but only if she were to sign the papers that very day.

She agreed, and within the hour his lawyers delivered the paper work.

A week later the man and his girlfriend stood smiling as they watched the moving company pack everything to take to their new home, including the curtain rods...


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## DumpedAgain (Feb 14, 2013)

As we are working thru the nuts and bolts of divorce, 
bank records, tax returns etc, her lawyer finally explained
the economic realities 

She now realizes she is going to go from an upper middle
class lifestyle to a much lower standard of living

She is now making reconciliation gestures, which confuses me
The break 2 months ago was nasty and vicious. I went thru
a great deal of pain and suffering accepting Divorce, and once
I did I felt much better

She has done this twice before and reconciled. I am going
to go thru with the divorce... then possibly consider reconciliation


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

mdill said:


> SA your DH is a very lucky man for many reasons. I love your posts. Sadly, many women spend too much. Some men as well, but many more women. I'm a saver, so I can't indentify with spenders. *From what I have observed, they are compensating for relatively low self esteem. What do you think?*


Could be a variety of reasons I think...Could be that Mom & Dad spoiled their children to some degree, giving them whatever they wanted ..and quickly...without having to work for it ...never learning the value of $$....I feel kids NEED some *anticipation* of "waiting" and saving for what you want...this is valuable! 

How many parents buy their kids expensive cell phones as soon as they hit their teens? Some grow up with an "*entitlement mentality*" even...and living on credit, even for little stuff, is acceptable... 

When I was growing up, I had the opposite situation... My step Mom didn't always give me lunch $$ even- as a teen, I never complained to my Dad.. .I had enough friends at school, I just ate what they didn't want, then when I did get lunch $$, I SAVED IT ! They worked me hard and I never had an allowance (that I remember anyway)... so when I got a job, that was like WOW... MONEY of my own... I was very careful with it - cause I had plans for my future. Once you start saving and see it growing, it's kinda exciting, liberating.. you know you could go buy almost anything you wanted - but you wouldn't!

Ever known anyone who lived during "The Depression"... (My Grandfather for one)... these people are very careful with their $$ as they know what it is like to go without... he is 96, was telling me a few months ago.. as a child.....Parents didn't have enough food for their 9 kids... he left home as a young teen...worked on farms for his keep - but he ate good. My Grandfather has accumulated hundreds of thousands over the years, they had 4 kids, Grandmother never worked...he just had a regular job working in a Mill. 










....But yeah... some people will use "Spending" as a way to fill a void..... just as another may take to drinking, or some other addiction.... some other pleasurable vice that is Ok in moderation -but can destruct your way of living..... Do you shop to fill a void?

And to what you are saying... This can be an issue too>>The Psychology of Spending Money



> Studies also show that people with low self-esteem engage in more impulse spending and buying things they don't need.
> 
> Remind yourself daily that money or a lack of it doesn't determine who you are. Your worth as a person has nothing to do with how much money you have. Once you truly believe this, and money is no longer connected to your sense of self-worth, you open up the psychological barriers that were keeping you from wisely handling the money you do have and limiting your ability to make more.
> 
> Right now, your unconscious limiting beliefs may be keeping you from being financially successful, but as you begin to build up your feelings of self-worth and develop a positive attitude about yourself and about money, you'll attract positive things into your life. As you do so, you'll feel less of a need to generate positive feelings by purchasing things, and you'll find it easier to stop buying items you don't really need.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

DumpedAgain said:


> As we are working thru the nuts and bolts of divorce, bank records, tax returns etc, her lawyer finally explained the economic realities. She now realizes she is going to go from an upper middle class lifestyle to a much lower standard of living. She is now making reconciliation gestures, which confuses me


It is VERY common for women to, once they realize they won't get all their stbx's money, to pretend they really want him. To keep his money.

That's why I always tell BHs to NEVER let the WW come home for at least a *year* on her own. She'll have to pay her own way, AND she'll start respecting what he has been providing for her.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

My mom lived through the depression. I grew up learning how to darn socks. You never threw away a sock just because it had a hole. You fixed the damn hole. 

Look at how far we've come.


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## DumpedAgain (Feb 14, 2013)

I can't officially buy another house until the divorce is final
So we are stil co=existing in the house. it is walking on 
eggshells somewhat. Luckily I am very busy with my 
business so I am gone 3-4 days a week

Friday night I got home from a 3 day trip, she was very nice to
me, talking about just officially separating but staying together
for the 15 year old

I demured politely, I am just going to keep going thru the
process, 

It took a lot of pain and introspection, but accepting divorce
had given me peace and serenity


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