# Trust & Faith



## thatbpguy (Dec 24, 2012)

I wanted to say a few words about trust & faith. First, I feel the need to issue a disclaimer- this is only for about 90% of the betrayals. I know there are those 10% that are so extreme as to be considered marginally justified, so for those of you in that position, spare me (stated nicely). Next, I use the terms "marriage" and "spouse" interchangeably for those living together as well. Lastly, I am not someone trained in this, but even better than that I have been around many many years and moved in the real world with all it has to offer- both bad & good. This makes me far more able to speak on such things than polls taken at random by eggheads. This is solely my views and I will speak short and simple (as I am a simple person and not very eloquent).

The first thing to consider is how does faith & trust come about in a marriage? When 2 people marry, trust & faith simply appears out of the necessity and demands of the moment. Almost like magic. It's there because you love each other. Love begets trust & faith.

So how is it defined and what is it? Trust & faith is 100% "knowledge". The knowledge that in ones head (trust) and in ones heart (faith) they know their spouse would never, under any circumstances or disposition, betray them. They keep their eyes on their spouse and in good or bad times ultimately work together for each other's good. 

So what happens to it when one betrays the other? It disappears forever. "Checking up/in" is neither trust nor faith. Nor does it build either. It is simply satisfying ones curiosity as to what their spouse is up to at that very moment in time. It only reflects that moment and can easily be manipulated. This is a fake form of trust/faith and people who accept it as the real thing are always disappointed later.

Can genuine trust & faith return? Sadly, no. That 100% knowledge is now knowledge that your spouse has, can and will betray you. In some cases while they may never actually betray again, the propensity is established as alcohol is to an alcoholic. This new knowledge replaces the old knowledge forever. Many betrayed spouses will claim to have trust, but it is either fake, minimally partial or self delusional. It is also a coping mechanism. 

Why is this so? Many, if not most, of the laws around the earth arise from the Old Testament. Aside from being God's law they are full of general flawless wisdom/principles and have stood the test of time. Granted times have changed and attitudes have also changed, but the principles remain the same. Marital betrayal was a capitol offense. Why? Because betraying a spouse in this way is to, in fact, murder them. Something within a betrayed spouse dies. Be it their spirit, their self worth… a death of sorts occurs. Also, trust & faith are definitively killed forever in a betrayal. So for intentionally creating death(s) within a spouse, the penalty is equally harsh. 

Well, that's it. Sorry it was so hastily put together.


----------



## ScrambledEggs (Jan 14, 2014)

Trust is not just about cheating but it is about to what extent you can expect your spouse to operate in mutual good faith in all matters where they be sexual, personal, or financial or are they self centered and out to get the most for them as possible even if they do not rationalize it in that way.

To refer to it as killing you gives them too much power after you have left them behind in your life.

That said, I wonder how the 2B or so buddhist and Hindus manage to arrive at similar morality yet with some even older texts to draw from.


----------



## thatbpguy (Dec 24, 2012)

ScrambledEggs said:


> To refer to it as killing you gives them too much power after you left them behind in your life.


Well, I can state that I am a different person today than I was back before I was betrayed. I have died in some ways.


----------



## RWB (Feb 6, 2010)

ScrambledEggs said:


> *To refer to it as killing you gives them too much power...*


Whether R or D... agreed. 

In the end, you are responsible for your own (whatever). That being said... Being betrayed by someone you entrusted your life with does change you at the core. I personally will never trust anyone or anything fully again. Changed...


----------



## ScrambledEggs (Jan 14, 2014)

thatbpguy said:


> Well, I can state that I am a different person today than I was back before I was betrayed. I have died in some ways.


But that is just life. The experience of living life, the good and bad, changes you and you can never go back to what you where. And to want to go back to how you where is in fact a sort of denial of the positive things in your life that has grown from all of your experiences. Don't let an act of betrayal own you or define you.


----------



## thatbpguy (Dec 24, 2012)

ScrambledEggs said:


> But that is just life. The experience of living life, the good and bad, changes you and you can never go back to what you where. And to want to go back to how you where is in fact a sort of denial of the positive things in your life that has grown from all of your experiences. Don't let an act of betrayal own you or define you.


Those are good words, but not all betrayals are alike. Some are expected and others are beyond the pale.


----------



## ScrambledEggs (Jan 14, 2014)

thatbpguy said:


> Those are good words, but not all betrayals are alike. Some are expected and others are beyond the pale.



I can't pretend to know what you went or are going through. I can only relate my philosophy on loss and reflect that each of us creates the heaven or hell we live in.


----------



## alte Dame (Aug 7, 2012)

I, too, think that betrayal is a sad fact of life. There are just enough loyal souls in the world to make us want to commit, to take a chance. Most people I know, including myself, go in saying they know what the risks are, but they don't really know until they've felt real betrayal, so they take that chance and hope for the best, not really understanding what exactly they are risking.

I usually find that the old words are the most descriptive for me. Trust and faith are old words. When I say that I have to trust my H, I mean that I trust him to guard my heart. A betrayal would mean that I wasn't important enough for him to do that. I think I go into all of my serious life relationships with that tacit understanding. Without it, the relationships aren't worth it to me. Like so many, I've learned over the years what it means to have my trust betrayed and I've learned to view the risks much differently.


----------



## RWB (Feb 6, 2010)

In regard to Trust...

In 55 years, I still remember what my mom told me as a tot. _"In the end, the only ones you can depend on is Blood."_ I'll add... with an occasional peek over the shoulder.


----------



## gouge_away (Apr 7, 2015)

Trust is the extent of your confidence in another's integrity.

Faith is absolute/full confidence in another's integrity.

Trust can certainly be reestablished after betrayal. You can build up confidence in the integrity of a spouse, even after betrayal.

It would be incredibly hard to develop full confidence and absolute faith in that spouse after they have shown they aren't faithful.


----------



## sammy3 (Jun 5, 2011)

The two people are forever changed, no longer is the relationship balanced. One is trying to forgive, one is trying to be forgiven. One is living in shame, one is living shamed. One no longer 100% trusts, one wants nothing more. 

No longer is the relationship the balance of give and take of love towards each other, now it's rebuilding a new relationship with someone you have to get to know all over again, and hopfully will fall back in love. 

~sammy


----------



## drifting on (Nov 22, 2013)

So much changes when infidelity is thrust into a marriage or relationship, the key components in the marriage or relationship change drastically. The individuals in the marriage or relationship change, their beliefs can change, and BOTH stand lost and confused. It is my belief that most people who cheat never intended nor entered a marriage or relationship wanting to cheat. In my case my WW thought that cheating was horribly wrong, wouldn't talk to anyone she knew had cheated. She despised cheating, and in our fifteenth year of marriage became what she stood against. Something broke within her, whether it be lust or selfish desires, she became a broken person. 

I too became a broken person as a result of her affair. I was living flesh on the outside and dead on the inside. All I felt was pain, as I stood in the ruins of what was once my life. I no longer had trust or faith in anyone. I blamed God for allowing this to happen to me. I became vindictive and vengeful, only wanting to cause pain to others. Nothing mattered, nothing had value, I was alone in the world betrayed by the one person I has trusted fully. The one I gave my heart to, the one I allowed in to know me for what I really am. Now I've changed, my WW has changed, our marriage changed. Many parts of me died, many parts of my WW died, our marriage died. 

Now we rebuild, we hope we fall in love with the changes we both make, we both change for the marriage and ourselves. But is this enough, can these changes last for the rest of our lives? Will we be happy, am I making the correct choice, would I be better taking a chance with someone else? These are just a few of the questions I had, I chose to reconcile, and it has proven to be a very difficult path. When I chose to reconcile I told myself I would be all in, every effort I can put forward I have done. I have been very open and honest in MC and IC, as has my WW. I have been humiliated in therapy talking to a therapist I never wanted to meet or talk to. Overall I believe the therapy will make me a better human, something I never thought therapy could do. I was a bad husband and now I will be a better husband, my wife was a bad wife and will be a better wife.

I have hopes for us to make it, at times I feel we won't, but that is because I am weak from being broken by the affair. I am recovering slowly, as is my WW, I am learning to be vulnerable to build trust. My WW has worked very hard, something I didn't think she had in her, and she is making herself a better person. She will not take any shortcuts and is beat up in therapy, but she has shown strength and tenacity in therapy that impresses our therapist. My faith in God has taken many hits, my trust in God has taken many hits, but I continue to go to church to correct this relationship also. We have much more work to do, we both work hard, and we both want peace and happiness. 

Infidelity in my opinion is the worst betrayal, the single most hurtful moment that lasts a lifetime, and it stays with you for life.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## sammy3 (Jun 5, 2011)

Good luck drifting on, I hope you can finally one day put all behind you and live life like it was before.

Put the experience behind us like we can when we have a broken arm,instead of a broken heart. I'm not meaning this in a nasty way, the opposite in fact, becuause that is where I wish I could be more than anything else in my life. 

What is it that your wife is doing that she is really showing you? I like you are honest and say R is very hard, ... I wonder if it ever gets unhard, ? I guess that is when the experience is behind us like that broken arm. 

Question, and if you dont want to answer its ok, do you make love to her now, or do you just have sex? what about her? what do you think she is thinking during the act? This where it all falls apart for me. 

~sammy


----------



## drifting on (Nov 22, 2013)

sammy3 said:


> Good luck drifting on, I hope you can finally one day put all behind you and live life like it was before.
> 
> Put the experience behind us like we can when we have a broken arm,instead of a broken heart. I'm not meaning this in a nasty way, the opposite in fact, becuause that is where I wish I could be more than anything else in my life.
> 
> ...



sammy3

First no animosity at all regarding the broken arm, in fact sometimes I wish it were just that. But reality is my heart shattered, I feel like I broke tempered glass and I take the thousand shards of glass and try to glue them together, it's impossible. Much like you reconciliation is very difficult for me, but I know it HAS to be this way. If it was easy to reconcile then you have many other components of your marriage that are broke. So I know we are doing it right by the level of difficulty and the communication my wife and I have. 

As for my wife she is truly understanding the consequences and destruction she caused by her affair. For example, yesterday morning she texted me, she was crying and very upset, because she hurt me so bad. Because of all the pain she caused, because she destroyed the marriage, and because she says she failed me, her one true love. The guilt and shame she feels each day is hurting her, no matter what she does she says it's not enough. I read on this site that describing remorse is difficult, but you will absolutely know when you see it. 

Anything I type can be argued as they are words from her, but I see the remorse, I see what it does to her. That's why I'm here, along with the fact that I love her very deeply. And that is my double edged sword, I love her so deeply it causes me pain. I'm sure sammy that you are the same, look at your love for your husband, analyze it, and you have probably never come remotely close to loving anyone like that. This is why we hurt so badly, why we have difficulty moving forward, why we sit in utter astonishment over the betrayal. 

Do I make love to her or just have sex? At first it was awkward , like the first or second time you were ever intimate with someone. How you are clumsy, and not on the same page yet. For me this hurt, I have been intimate with her for sixteen years and now it's like, wait, what? So in the beginning I would say sex. After a year I would say it was special, not making love but special. I guess I'm still at this point as I can't look into her eyes as I did before, it has less value to me, I struggle with this last part of vulnerability to look into her eyes. 

The other part is that intimacy is different, changed forever, and will never be what it was. I'm told I can make it great, but that it will always be different. This is difficult to accept, and I need more time. I think she is close to making love, but like myself needs more time to accept that it's changed. 

What is she thinking about during intimacy? Naturally in the beginning I thought it was anything but me. I know I'm wrong, but you just can't help but think that. Being emasculated fueled these thoughts even more, her being my first was adding gas, and I thought I was worthless. My wife was very patient and understanding, she knew the difficulty I was having. That helped me very much, she wasn't just thinking of herself and helped with my pain and humiliation. Some would argue this is what she should be doing, but she has helped me. So honestly, I think she thinks of me, how special intimacy is now, and is striving to make it making love. 

I want to apologize for talking about this because I really have never described our thoughts while being intimate. To tell the truth I can't believe I posted this as I never really discuss this to anyone other then my wife. I hope you too sammy, find that feeling of peace and happiness again. Best of luck to you.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## cpacan (Jan 2, 2012)

Drifting on, thankyou for putting this into words, this is exactly how sex is these days.


----------



## drifting on (Nov 22, 2013)

cpacan said:


> Drifting on, thankyou for putting this into words, this is exactly how sex is these days.



cpacan,

I'm sorry that this is happening to you also, I honestly wish I never would have had to put this into words. However, this is now how intimacy is for me now, and I hold on to hope that it will get better. Best of luck to you Caplan, I hope you find peace and happiness.


----------



## commonsenseisn't (Aug 13, 2014)

So far most of you in this thread have verbalized exactly what I have endured for 22 years. I don't think I could have worded it as well. 

Some people would think there's something wrong with me for still struggling after so long and maybe so. 

However, as PB pointed out, there are different magnitudes of betrayals and this along with my exquisite comprehension of the horror of my story might explain a lot. 

Though I remarried 16 years ago and have a wonderful wife, something doesn't feel right within myself, I feel defective and empty from old wounds that don't fully heal. I just forge ahead on faith. 

I also struggled with God. I begged and begged to be gifted a premature death to spare me what I was going through. I don't believe in suicide, but it sure was tempting. I know beyond a doubt there are things in this life that are far worse than dying.

Now days I often feel I am defined by my betrayal. Some here on TAM see that as a liability, but I don't. My trial wasn't taken away from me, rather I grew in my ability to endure it. 

As a result I have become strong and resilient and I view these strengths as extraordinary. My wife, family, friends view me as a rock they can count on, and indeed I am, but I don't share with them the emptiness I often feel inside. 

Though I am grateful for my own personal growth afforded me by a most senseless and evil betrayal, I sure wouldn't sign up for it if put in that position again. 

I guess what really hurts even these many years later is I mourn the loss of what was once the love of my life until she lost her way. Not only did I lose her, she lost herself, and I have no hope of her having a happy ending in this life or the hereafter. I've been heartsick over it ever since.


----------



## sammy3 (Jun 5, 2011)

Commonsense, 

I'm a little confused, are you struggling w a first betrayal, but remarried to a new spouse? 

My hubands betrayal change my heart. I was married for over 28 yr when his affair came about. We are still attached, and it haunts me as it's almost 32 yrs now, & we are still connected, but I dont love him like I did. 

When I read Drifting write I deeply love my wife, I do as well my hub, and the remores he has shown me has been non stop for 4 yrs., this guy doesnt give up. We dont know life any other way without each other as we grew up with each other. I ask and I read of others will this be the way the life will be lived from now on out??? Always living with a trauma between us?

Is it better to move on, & close that chapter? I'm finding it very difficult to understand now how one can really share thier own journey in life with another. I'm wondering if our own lives are like a timeline ((The kind we all learned in history elementary school,))and these are bleeps along the way... 

I think it is very true how a ww really deals with the betrayal in the very after math. My hub went kicking & screaming into denial. He protected her for way to long, and became the victim in the whole affair. It was never about me, ((yes we all know that)) It was just him as a flawless human being that made a horrible mistake and loved me unconditional, I could even ask her so, and can not understand why 30 yrs of life together wont forgive and move on with the rest of our life because we are both still unhappy. 

I can learn all the skills of communicating, I can learn all of his love languages, and show him mine, I can spend all the time I need to with him to rebuild our time together, but one thing that cant be done, it can never be undone the betrayal against "us." 

If not living with the guilt and answering to yourself a better way to live or learning to put your own convictions aside and continue with the partner that was choosen so long ago? 

I dunno. 

~sammy


----------



## drifting on (Nov 22, 2013)

sammy3,


I think in many ways we are very similar on our beliefs and what we expected from marriage, what we expected from our spouses. Nobody is perfect and I don't feel you or I expected perfection, but we could also never fathom our spouses having an affair and betraying us as they have. We both thought we had found the perfect spouses, and when they betrayed us, they literally died to us. I know you have suffered as I have, I've written of my feelings, but we also can't imagine a life without them. At least I can't. Accepting what has happened was very difficult, have you done this? Accepting the affair (not agreeing but accepting it happened) will help in moving forward to some degree. Accepting that your spouse is flawed, broken, and in need of help is also difficult. 

I struggled with accepting what has happened, what I've become, but not what I will be in the future. Hopefully I can move to a happier disposition then I currently have. I do know I would be just as unhappy if I were divorced also. So what is the answer? In my case reconciliation, and I say that as I am not completely healed at this time. If I were completely healed and feel as I do now then my choice would be divorce. Healing myself is my primary goal, my marriage second, but I feel coming to this decision before I'm completely healed would be a decision made in haste. I don't think you have completely healed yet either sammy3, and are hesitant on making the same decision as I face. 

I hope you find peace sammy3, just as I hope I find peace.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## commonsenseisn't (Aug 13, 2014)

sammy3 said:


> Commonsense,
> 
> I'm a little confused, are you struggling w a first betrayal, but remarried to a new spouse?
> ~sammy


Yes, this is correct. I'm fortunate to have a wonderful second wife, but somehow my experience with my ex wife still affects me. I try not to let it pollute my current marriage, but I find myself having a hard time trusting and giving myself to this relationship. I realize I would be the same in any relationship regardless who it might be with. 

I feel like I'm ready to walk away at the first sign of trouble. Luckily there's been no real problems, but I'm afraid if my current wife made a mistake I would react in a most ruthless way. I don't like being so hardened and empty inside. I behave to my wife, family and friends in a loving way through service and caring, but I don't allow myself to feel "in love." 

I guard my heart most carefully and it seems that it prevents me from feeling that magic "in love" feeling that I enjoyed so much in my first marriage. It's not fair to my current wife and I try to compensate by being absolutely faithful and true to her. I also try to compensate by totally conquering all the faults I had in my first marriage. I've done very well in this department, but I still don't feel any redemption. 

It's ironic that I've decisively overcome all my faults my ex wife accused me of, though I would not take her back under any circumstances. Yet, I mourn her loss. I hate that my past seems to hold my present hostage.


----------



## allwillbewell (Dec 13, 2012)

I always seem to find these threads after they have petered out..lol.

Lately I have stayed away from TAM because it was taking up way to much time and I felt reading all the horrible stories, the bitter and vengeful replies were hurting my attempts to reconcile with FWH.

Then, I pop back in and find a thread like this and I have to reply to tell all the posters(on this particular thread) how much they help and encourage. I actually copy and paste certain passages to a document I can read over and over! How's that for wasting time on the internet?

I don't mean to seem flippant because I know how much pain and vulnerability you have all had the courage to reveal. I am one of you, too. I am dealing with a reconciliation with the only one I have ever loved who betrayed me not once but twice over 20 years of a 36 year marriage. He kept the first A secret until the second A revealed it. Both were LTAs.

After struggling thru 4 years of R that included denial, TT, continued non-physical contact and rugsweeping, but also much joyous rediscovery and rebuilding allowing us to come to greater depths of intimacy, I can say that I cannot disagree with anything any of you had to say about trust and faith. 

Acceptance is hard; I still question my husband hoping to hear him answer in a way that will change my perception of the past or at least clarify it. That indicates to me, I have still not fully accepted what I know to be true. 

What you all have helped me to see is that the spouse we married, and thought we knew is dead. That marriage along with its vows and expectations is dead. We are damaged in ways we never expected with our trust and faith among the collateral damage. It takes TIME to mourn and fully process what this means to us and our future. I expect it to take the same 20 years to rebuild my new marriage as it took to destroy it by choices my FWH made.

We also have to deal with the knowledge that the spouse we thought we knew so well could have sunk so morally low. We struggle to understand how they could morally justify the cruelty and injustice they perpetrated upon us, especially if we choose to reconcile. How this could have come to be and us not aware of their fall from grace is a true torment for the BS. It makes us take a hard look at the love we professed to have for our WS if we were so blind to their real selves. For those who have reconciled, we must live with the fact that we have chosen to remain with a person who, if we had known what they were capable of, we would never had begun this journey with them in the first place. 

But FWSs are human as BSs are and we ALL are subject to moral collapse, sin and failure. I cannot throw stones any longer and not be a hypocrite. Every single one of us, no matter what the trespass, must be allowed a chance to redeem ourselves. Some won't try, some fail and some succeed. 

So I am looking at this wreckage, trying to reclaim the love out of it to build a new marriage based on honesty and commitment, not claims of fidelity. Fidelity cannot be forced, it will follow naturally from love, honesty and a true desire to protect the partner. I know I cause a lot of my own torment by obsessing over the past and worrying about the future, so I endeavor to move forward, day by day, applying the lessons learned to our daily interactions. Some days are great, others not so much and this is what we BSs must learn to accept. Life IS different after trauma whether it be the tragic death of a child, a disaster we are part of, or a violation of our spirit's integrity like infidelity. 

Time does heal IF the unbalance that existed is corrected by remorse and true attempts to make amends by the FWS, along with a change in personal beliefs and perceptions from those that are destructive to marriage to those that nurture it by both partners. This change in belief must be accompanied by actions that prove it to be real each and every day. 

IMHO, if any of those above factors are missing in a reconciliation, it will fail in healing both partners and it will fail at establishing and nourishing a new marriage.


----------



## altawa (Jan 4, 2015)

thatbpguy said:


> I wanted to say a few words about trust & faith. First, I feel the need to issue a disclaimer- this is only for about 90% of the betrayals. I know there are those 10% that are so extreme as to be considered marginally justified, so for those of you in that position, spare me (stated nicely). Next, I use the terms "marriage" and "spouse" interchangeably for those living together as well. Lastly, I am not someone trained in this, but even better than that I have been around many many years and moved in the real world with all it has to offer- both bad & good. This makes me far more able to speak on such things than polls taken at random by eggheads. This is solely my views and I will speak short and simple (as I am a simple person and not very eloquent).
> 
> The first thing to consider is how does faith & trust come about in a marriage? When 2 people marry, trust & faith simply appears out of the necessity and demands of the moment. Almost like magic. It's there because you love each other. Love begets trust & faith.
> 
> ...


Cheating is never justified. Ever. Not 10%, not 5%, not 1% of the time.....never.


----------



## len51 (May 22, 2015)

You can not make a logical argument based on saying that faith and trust magically appear after marriage. Logic has to follow from fact, not magic.

My wife and I both disagree with your statement. We chose to define marriage and love differently than you and we too are married a long time; over 40 happy years. We know for a fact that you can love more than one person and have faith in each other that you will always put the marriage first. Plus we do not believe in magic even though I used to me a magician.

When I asked my wife why she never got jealous of my long time girlfriend, she replied that she had faith that I would never leave her. It was not a betrayal either because she was the one who set her girlfriend up with me. There are more than one ways to skin a cat, as they say.


----------



## believe in marriage (May 31, 2015)

to thatbpguy...
I just joined and have seen several of your posts. I want to say thank you. It is good to see a man that follows the Lord. I will be reading your posts in hopes that it will help me with my own marriage. Adultery is the worst pain, and when a spouse adds to that ..only lies constantly, the trust does go away, never to return. It is a death that occurs to the loyal spouse that has been betrayed. It's a dying that is slow and bitter.
Thank you for your posts...


----------



## Melvynman (Mar 19, 2014)

thatbpguy said:


> I wanted to say a few words about trust & faith. First, I feel the need to issue a disclaimer- this is only for about 90% of the betrayals. I know there are those 10% that are so extreme as to be considered marginally justified, so for those of you in that position, spare me (stated nicely). Next, I use the terms "marriage" and "spouse" interchangeably for those living together as well. Lastly, I am not someone trained in this, but even better than that I have been around many many years and moved in the real world with all it has to offer- both bad & good. This makes me far more able to speak on such things than polls taken at random by eggheads. This is solely my views and I will speak short and simple (as I am a simple person and not very eloquent).
> 
> The first thing to consider is how does faith & trust come about in a marriage? When 2 people marry, trust & faith simply appears out of the necessity and demands of the moment. Almost like magic. It's there because you love each other. Love begets trust & faith.
> 
> ...





thatbpguy said:


> In biblical time in the old testament women could be brought and sold for slavery and marriage! A father could sell his daughter! Polygamy was acceptable!
> 
> The "old testament" never mentioned or used the word "love" and its your guiding light?... to marriage!


----------



## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

I agree, once you have been betrayed by the one you thought would always have your back, love you till death do you part and always have your
best interests at heart, it is never ever the same. You might reconcile (for a host of reasons) but the complete trust is gone. I will never trust my husband
again the way I used to and to this day there is a part of me that doesn't trust him on any level, a protection mechanism or a part which says you don't deserve 
that level of trust and you do not deserve all of my heart either. It is a horrible place to be but I guess that is the reality of life as we are all less than perfect.
The thing is many WS do not realise that they have lost that right and will never get it back.


----------



## thatbpguy (Dec 24, 2012)

Melvynman said:


> thatbpguy said:
> 
> 
> > In biblical time in the old testament women could be brought and sold for slavery and marriage! A father could sell his daughter! Polygamy was acceptable!
> ...


----------



## gouge_away (Apr 7, 2015)

Yes, I'm trying to recall a single patriarch that purchased his wife, with the exception of the prophet Hosea, who purchased his wife *back out of* slavery.


----------



## Jung_admirer (Jun 26, 2013)

commonsenseisn't said:


> Yes, this is correct. I'm fortunate to have a wonderful second wife, but somehow my experience with my ex wife still affects me. I try not to let it pollute my current marriage, but I find myself having a hard time trusting and giving myself to this relationship. I realize I would be the same in any relationship regardless who it might be with. I absolutely agree.
> 
> I feel like I'm ready to walk away at the first sign of trouble. Luckily there's been no real problems, but I'm afraid if my current wife made a mistake I would react in a most ruthless way. I don't like being so hardened and empty inside. I behave to my wife, family and friends in a loving way through service and caring, but I don't allow myself to feel "in love." I know this plan for ruthless reaction. The truth is... We longer trust ourselves to choose a partner. The cut & run strategy is about the avoidance of a painful future betrayal.
> 
> ...


Hang in there... I am pulling for you (and me)! Kindest Regards-


----------



## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

I went into marriage comparatively naively, seeing it as the font of all happiness. I wanted 100% trust, and I believed it was possible.

My wife's affair destroyed that forever. But I see it as a loss of innocence. I had unrealistic expectations, and they were always going to be reset by something, at sometime. It just happened to be her.

You always wonder what would have been. I reconciled with my wife, and part of my reasoning was that I would have the same trust issues whoever I was with. Others on this thread have written about discovering that truth for real in second marriages, and I thank you for your honesty. It helps me. 

There are two other paths I could have taken. One was to divorce in the aftermath of the affair, and I have no regrets about deciding not to. The other is that, having stayed for the kids, I could leave now they are done. I don't think that is going to happen, but clearly it still could, and I'd be lying if I didn't admit to having thought about it. I find myself pondering why one marries. There are things about that early passion I miss, even though I know my dreams are unrealistic.

Altawa wrote on this thread that cheating is never justified, and of course I agree, but it is sometimes understandable. We are all only human. Nothing is perfect, and we all sometimes want what we don't have. We don't always handle things in the best way. But if you approach marriage as a pure consumer transaction, where you are free to trade in your spouse if a new, better model comes along, I think you ultimately cheat yourself.

Nobody said it was going to be easy.


----------

