# Excluded from life at work



## catdude (Jun 19, 2017)

I have been married to my wife for 16 years and for the most part have had good communication. However, I am growing concerned that she has excluded me almost entirely from her life at work. She is a salaried employee for a large international company and works 50+ hours a week. She has been in her current department for 6 years and in that time I have yet to meet a single coworker. She rarely refers to anyone at work by their name and other than her boss never any of the men. When she goes to work related social events she only discusses what food was there, never who she hung out with, what the conversations were, etc. When I ask anything specific she is always elusive. Her employer is very family oriented and have a number of events where spouses and family are included. We have never been to one in the past 6 years and when I have shown interest in attending she has come up with excuses why we don’t go (did not order tickets in time, etc.). Last week she told me she was planning to go to a retirement party one evening. When I asked who was retiring she only referred to his position ‘one of the program managers’ and gave no details. I am just not certain how to take her continued exclusion of me from such a big section of her life.


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

Show up to one of these functions unannounced.


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## Emerging Buddhist (Apr 7, 2016)

I am a big believer in that honesty saves everybody's time.

Would she be irritated if you asked if spouses are invited to this retirement party and if they are you will happily be accompanying her and she should count on it?

If she is irritated or put off with you, there is a reason but you don't know what you don't know. 

Assess her behavior from there... the more evasive we are with the truth, the more unmindful we react to keep it away from light.

You cannot make her include you but Far is right, at least you would acquire a foundation of beginning to remove doubt or confirm truths with your presence. 

I know your are questioning the motivation of her actions to exclude you, but you are trying to see in the dark... you can't make her hold the light but you can increase the lumens of the one you are holding, and to sort the actual truths from the one's you might cling to in the unknown.


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

farsidejunky said:


> Show up to one of these functions unannounced.


No!!! 

She probably works for the CIA, or the NSA....she's a spy and that is why she is so closed lips on what goes on at work. These work functions are actually times when she is meeting with her controllers.

Or

She is a polyandrist and husband number 1 is the only husband her co-workers know about. If you showed up they would discover she has more than one husband. Obviously, you'd discover that too, but she'd get fired and that would shoot you in the foot.


It's very strange that your wife is so compartmentalized keeping her home life separate from her work life.

Have you told her you can't support this extreme compartmentalism and feel cut out of a significant part of her life? Have you insisted that you accompany her to the next event, meet her co-workers, and allow them to meet you? Have you insisted you come to visit her at work one day and take her out to lunch?

You cannot sit around waiting for her to sense your upset. Ask for what you want and know that what you want, and why you want it, is perfectly reasonable. Unless of course she is a spy and then you must respect the distance she requires you keep from her work life.


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## Emerging Buddhist (Apr 7, 2016)

Anon Pink said:


> No!!!
> 
> She probably works for the CIA, or the NSA....she's a spy and that is why she is so closed lips on what goes on at work. These work functions are actually times when she is meeting with her controllers.
> 
> ...


"Her employer is very family oriented and have a number of events where spouses and family are included."

Really AP? A spy? I cannot tell if you are serious or not.


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## TheTruthHurts (Oct 1, 2015)

If you suspect an affair, keep it quiet and investigate or she will go further underground. There are many here who can advise on how to investigate.

How is your sex life? Are you frequent? Passionate? Are there any changes over the years?

Has she changed hairstyles? Clothing? Do you find sexy underwear in the laundry that she hasn't worn for you? Is she secretive when she comes home or change or clean up? Do you have free access to her devices and have you looked at them? Does she often have work related calls or texts?

Is she an executive and you a SAHD? Is she career oriented and you not so much? Could she not want to expose her personal life at work - many times people who are ambitious don't want their personal side seen - they feel it undermines their authority. Sometime they are just embarrassed of their SO because they lack ambition, say inappropriate things, etc

We need more context


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

catdude said:


> I have been married to my wife for 16 years and for the most part have had good communication. However, I am growing concerned that she has excluded me almost entirely from her life at work. She is a salaried employee for a large international company and works 50+ hours a week. She has been in her current department for 6 years and in that time I have yet to meet a single coworker. She rarely refers to anyone at work by their name and other than her boss never any of the men. When she goes to work related social events she only discusses what food was there, never who she hung out with, what the conversations were, etc. When I ask anything specific she is always elusive. Her employer is very family oriented and have a number of events where spouses and family are included. We have never been to one in the past 6 years and when I have shown interest in attending she has come up with excuses why we don’t go (did not order tickets in time, etc.). Last week she told me she was planning to go to a retirement party one evening. When I asked who was retiring she only referred to his position ‘one of the program managers’ and gave no details. I am just not certain how to take her continued exclusion of me from such a big section of her life.


My ex (son's father) did this. He's a doctor. Turned out that he was having affairs with of the females working at the hospital who would fall for his nonsense.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Emerging Buddhist said:


> "Her employer is very family oriented and have a number of events where spouses and family are included."
> 
> Really AP? A spy? I cannot tell if you are serious or not.


Clearly she was joking.... >


By the way, even the CIA has a lot of family oriented activities for people who work for them. My dad worked for them so that's how I know this.

Probably their super secret, Born types spies might not attend family events since they tend to not have family, but the rest of them do.


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## uhtred (Jun 22, 2016)

It does seem odd. More often people get inundated with comments about people at work: "John Smith's 8 year old daughter Amy, just won 3rd place in the regional calligraphy contest. She wrote.....". When you've never met any of these people so its all meaningless.

I'm not sure why she would be excluding you from everything. If it were an affair, I would expect lots of comments, but just someone not mentioned. 

Are you sure here work is what she says it is? Could she have a much lower status job than she is letting on and is embarrassed for you to find out?


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

Maybe she just likes keeping her work life totally separate. Some people do. 

I went to all my husband's work functions, met all the people in his office and he constantly talked about everyone he worked with. He was completely open about every aspect of his work life -- except for the fact that he was cheating with women who reported to him (just throwing that part out there in case that thought has crossed your mind).


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

How long has she worked for this employer?


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## toblerone (Oct 18, 2016)

If it's bothering you, then try to get more info. If she's evasive, then you can start to worry.

Some people just aren't talkers and don't give a damn about blabbing about what's going on at work.


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

There are some people, men and women, who cannot mix their work life with their personal lives. You shouldn't panic unless her push-back to your inquiries is really violent, and then you probably need to do some sleuthing. I do agree it is weird that she doesn't want you coming to parties that are open to spouses. In and of itself it is not proof she is cheating, but it is cause for concern and you should ask her about her reasons why she doesn't want you there. 

I did know one coworker who hated bringing her husband to office parties, and I never understood why until he did come to one. Simply put: this guy was a jerk. He was an opinionated, pompous boor who managed to insult or irritate just about everyone at the party within the first hour he was there.


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## catdude (Jun 19, 2017)

TheTruthHurts said:


> If you suspect an affair, keep it quiet and investigate or she will go further underground. There are many here who can advise on how to investigate.
> 
> How is your sex life? Are you frequent? Passionate? Are there any changes over the years?
> 
> ...


Thank you for taking time to put some realistic thought into my situation. Sex life does not exist. Until about a year ago we had a reasonable sex life but she now does not allow me to touch her in any sensual or sexual manner. No changes in styles, clothes or things like this but no longer wears her diamond ring, just the plain band. She normally changes right away, rarely keeping her work attire on for even a few minutes after getting home. I have no access to her devices at all and she tends to hide the phone screen from me when typing. 
I doubt her personal life is an issue at work. I worked in middle management for two of the area’s more prestigious local companies before starting my own small management/consulting business. I volunteer a lot of time to local nonprofits serving on boards and committees. Her original boss (now retired) that hired her into this company was an old neighbor of mine who looked to me as a running coach to help him keep in shape. While I no longer run races I do maintain a reasonable physique, wear nice suits and own a tux for the black tie events I/we attend. I am fairly well known in some circles as a ‘go to’ man.
A bit of background not in my original post is that a few years prior to her current position She had a ‘shift in styles’, activities, etc. I suspected an affair at work and while she never admitted to it something ‘blew up’ about her and a male coworker that resulted in his wife contacting the company, getting security involved and my wife taking time off to deal with it. While I don’t know if there was a physical affair, I believe what happened is that she was involved with two men and one exposed the affair to the other’s wife. We worked through this and I thought things were fine until recently when she seemed to become extra secretive about people she works with. Am I fool to think her secretive behavior is anything other than a means to have relationships she does not want me to be aware of?
We are both in positions that for me to ‘just show up’ at an event she is attending (as suggested by another reply) would not be professional or appropriate.


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## catdude (Jun 19, 2017)

EleGirl said:


> How long has she worked for this employer?


10 years


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## catdude (Jun 19, 2017)

uhtred said:


> It does seem odd. More often people get inundated with comments about people at work: "John Smith's 8 year old daughter Amy, just won 3rd place in the regional calligraphy contest. She wrote.....". When you've never met any of these people so its all meaningless.
> 
> I'm not sure why she would be excluding you from everything. If it were an affair, I would expect lots of comments, but just someone not mentioned.
> 
> Are you sure here work is what she says it is? Could she have a much lower status job than she is letting on and is embarrassed for you to find out?


I am certain of her position at work, in part because her pay reflects her responsibility.


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## catdude (Jun 19, 2017)

farsidejunky said:


> Show up to one of these functions unannounced.


Both of us hold positions in companies and organizations that doing so would not be appropriate.


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## catdude (Jun 19, 2017)

bandit.45 said:


> There are some people, men and women, who cannot mix their work life with their personal lives. You shouldn't panic unless her push-back to your inquiries is really violent, and then you probably need to do some sleuthing. I do agree it is weird that she doesn't want you coming to parties that are open to spouses. In and of itself it is not proof she is cheating, but it is cause for concern and you should ask her about her reasons why she doesn't want you there.
> 
> I did know one coworker who hated bringing her husband to office parties, and I never understood why until he did come to one. Simply put: this guy was a jerk. He was an opinionated, pompous boor who managed to insult or irritate just about everyone at the party within the first hour he was there.


We used to go to work functions previously and had normal conversations about her coworkers.


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## TheTruthHurts (Oct 1, 2015)

catdude said:


> Thank you for taking time to put some realistic thought into my situation. Sex life does not exist. Until about a year ago we had a reasonable sex life but she now does not allow me to touch her in any sensual or sexual manner. No changes in styles, clothes or things like this but no longer wears her diamond ring, just the plain band. She normally changes right away, rarely keeping her work attire on for even a few minutes after getting home. I have no access to her devices at all and she tends to hide the phone screen from me when typing.
> 
> I doubt her personal life is an issue at work. I worked in middle management for two of the area’s more prestigious local companies before starting my own small management/consulting business. I volunteer a lot of time to local nonprofits serving on boards and committees. Her original boss (now retired) that hired her into this company was an old neighbor of mine who looked to me as a running coach to help him keep in shape. While I no longer run races I do maintain a reasonable physique, wear nice suits and own a tux for the black tie events I/we attend. I am fairly well known in some circles as a ‘go to’ man.
> 
> ...




I'm sorry but I think you have your answer.

Do you accept being in a sexless marriage while your w disrespects you and basically says you have no right to know who she is sleeping with?

Look up @Lonely husband 42301's thread

He did show up unannounced to his W's company event, watched, and caught a coworker mouthing "what's he doing here".

He went nuclear, confronted and said you can talk to me at home IF you come home, left the state, and blew up the whole A.

Ultimately R but she had to go 180, chase him, and beg forgiveness.

Until then I didn't see these situations as resolvable, but read his thread and see what you need to harness to get your W to come to her senses.

Good luck. btw in case I wasn't clear, at this point she'd have to prove she WASN'T cheating for me to believe it. But I guess you figured that out


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

With the additional info, this is much clearer.

She might be protecting herself from her past affairs by not allowing you access to anyone who could possibly tell you things beyond what she has admitted to you about the past incident.

Adding to that, she might be continuing her previous behavior with other men.

What do you want to do about this?

.


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## catdude (Jun 19, 2017)

Thank you. Was pretty much my conclusion, but wanted to make sure I was not being too harsh.


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## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

catdude said:


> Thank you for taking time to put some realistic thought into my situation. Sex life does not exist. Until about a year ago we had a reasonable sex life but she now does not allow me to touch her in any sensual or sexual manner. No changes in styles, clothes or things like this but no longer wears her diamond ring, just the plain band. She normally changes right away, rarely keeping her work attire on for even a few minutes after getting home. I have no access to her devices at all and she tends to hide the phone screen from me when typing.
> I doubt her personal life is an issue at work. I worked in middle management for two of the area’s more prestigious local companies before starting my own small management/consulting business. I volunteer a lot of time to local nonprofits serving on boards and committees. Her original boss (now retired) that hired her into this company was an old neighbor of mine who looked to me as a running coach to help him keep in shape. While I no longer run races I do maintain a reasonable physique, wear nice suits and own a tux for the black tie events I/we attend. I am fairly well known in some circles as a ‘go to’ man.
> A bit of background not in my original post is that a few years prior to her current position She had a ‘shift in styles’, activities, etc. I suspected an affair at work and while she never admitted to it something ‘blew up’ about her and a male coworker that resulted in his wife contacting the company, getting security involved and my wife taking time off to deal with it. While I don’t know if there was a physical affair, I believe what happened is that she was involved with two men and one exposed the affair to the other’s wife. We worked through this and I thought things were fine until recently when she seemed to become extra secretive about people she works with. Am I fool to think her secretive behavior is anything other than a means to have relationships she does not want me to be aware of?
> We are both in positions that for me to ‘just show up’ at an event she is attending (as suggested by another reply) would not be professional or appropriate.



Whole other ball of wax than your first post. Your W could very well be at it again. Many many red flags.


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## TheTruthHurts (Oct 1, 2015)

Now... do not confront.

First,investigate. Can anyone provide the investigation posts?


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## Chris Taylor (Jul 22, 2010)

This went from a "maybe" to "definitely" pretty quick, didn't it?


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## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

catdude said:


> Thank you for taking time to put some realistic thought into my situation. Sex life does not exist. Until about a year ago we had a reasonable sex life but she now does not allow me to touch her in any sensual or sexual manner. No changes in styles, clothes or things like this but no longer wears her diamond ring, just the plain band. She normally changes right away, rarely keeping her work attire on for even a few minutes after getting home. I have no access to her devices at all and she tends to hide the phone screen from me when typing.
> I doubt her personal life is an issue at work. I worked in middle management for two of the area’s more prestigious local companies before starting my own small management/consulting business. I volunteer a lot of time to local nonprofits serving on boards and committees. Her original boss (now retired) that hired her into this company was an old neighbor of mine who looked to me as a running coach to help him keep in shape. While I no longer run races I do maintain a reasonable physique, wear nice suits and own a tux for the black tie events I/we attend. I am fairly well known in some circles as a ‘go to’ man.
> A bit of background not in my original post is that a few years prior to her current position She had a ‘shift in styles’, activities, etc. I suspected an affair at work and while she never admitted to it something ‘blew up’ about her and a male coworker that resulted in his wife contacting the company, getting security involved and my wife taking time off to deal with it. While I don’t know if there was a physical affair, I believe what happened is that she was involved with two men and one exposed the affair to the other’s wife. We worked through this and I thought things were fine until recently when she seemed to become extra secretive about people she works with. Am I fool to think her secretive behavior is anything other than a means to have relationships she does not want me to be aware of?
> We are both in positions that for me to ‘just show up’ at an event she is attending (as suggested by another reply) would not be professional or appropriate.


What on earth, as her husband you didn't dig deeper on that 'shift in styles' and 'blow up' at work. you just let that slide without asking WTF was going on? You sound like you are dropping the ball big time in your marriage. Maybe your lack of care or concern is a message to her you don't give a damn. YOu should have been on that like a frost in a deep freeze, how could you just gloss over that? YOu should have demanded, transparency, access to all social media, phones, lap tops everything, you have been a fool, she got away with it the first time and probably never stopped. Now it is time to go scorched earth, but first read NMMNG, because you need it.


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## TheTruthHurts (Oct 1, 2015)

Do you know what NMMNG is? No More Mr Nice Guy 


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

TheTruthHurts said:


> Now... do not confront.
> 
> First,investigate. Can anyone provide the investigation posts?


http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/209754-standard-evidence-post.html


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## twoofus (Jun 16, 2017)

Time to do a little detective work.
How about turning up to one of these company dos, grab the attention of someone who might be senior and say you got a call at home saying the wife was taken ill. Sorry, I didn't get the name of the lady who called as I was too busy rushing out. When wife is found and clearly not ill, accept a drink and mingle. Never let on that you invented the call. She will wonder if a co-worker is trying to get her in trouble.


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## No Longer Lonely Husband (Nov 3, 2015)

I can tell you from experience something is amiss sir. Show up unannounced next function. Hiding the phone is a dead give away something is going on. No sex life? Well, she does not want to cheat on other man most likely. You situation closely mirrors mine a few months back. Investigate, investigate, and investigate.


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## Wolf1974 (Feb 19, 2014)

I don't think it's uncommon for some personality types and professionals to keep work and private life separate. I know I keep them as far apart as I possibly can.

That said with her history I would demand to know a lot more about her work. My x's affair started at work and many of these red flags seem the same


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## Taxman (Dec 21, 2016)

Sir, every alarm bell should be going off in your head. Now comes the difficult part, the detective work. The only thing that comes to mind is hiring of a private detective. If your suspicions are correct, a PI can get the info for you. Short of trying to bribe someone at her office to blab.


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## The Middleman (Apr 30, 2012)

catdude said:


> Both of us hold positions in companies and organizations that doing so would not be appropriate.


I just don't get this. If it were me I'd be showing up unannounced, appropriate or not. Unless of course, what's left of the marriage is not worth saving.


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## No Longer Lonely Husband (Nov 3, 2015)

My advice is to start 180 now. Detach and make yourself scarce after work. Tell her you are going out. Is she asks where you are going simply say "out".

She is controlling the dice right now. You must gain the upper hand. 

If something is going on at work you can bet other employees know. Get a PI on her. Var in her car. Hack her phone. The info you need is likely there.


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## Marc878 (Aug 26, 2015)

Voice activated recorder under her car seat 

No sex could very well mean she's getting it elsewhere

You've laid back and not looked way to long.

Start digging

Can you check online phone records?


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## Malaise (Aug 8, 2012)

Lonely husband 42301 said:


> My advice is to start 180 now. Detach and make yourself scarce after work. Tell her you are going out. Is she asks where you are going simply say "out".
> 
> She is controlling the dice right now. You must gain the upper hand.
> 
> *If something is going on at work you can bet other employees know. Get a PI on her*. Var in her car. Hack her phone. The info you need is likely there.


See if the 50+ hours at work is really at work.

Do you know anyone else who works there?


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## ABHale (Jan 3, 2016)

What else can be said. 

You skipped over her past affair with no consequences to her. 

Now it has been a year sense she has allowed any intimacy between the two of you. Do you really have to ask?

180 and talk with a lawyer. Get everything lined up and confront her. If she try's to make it out that you are crazy for thinking the way you do, hand her divorce papers. Then tell her you were not born yesterday and that she can tell her lies to who ever it is she is sleeping with.


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

catdude said:


> We used to go to work functions previously and had normal conversations about her coworkers.


If that is the case then there is indeed something wrong.


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## catdude (Jun 19, 2017)

Unfortunately all the suggestions to show up at an event is not something that is possible in our positions. A public scene would cost me my clients in addition to the wife. Many events are at the company complex which is a secured building and these would not be possible any way.


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## Taxman (Dec 21, 2016)

Then forget about showing up to events where spouses are not invited. Find out about events where spouses are invited, but you have not. That is what will be eye opening. It would serve you to keep an eye on her company's web page. There you can find out about events that she is not telling you. Once again, and I reiterate, hire a private investigator. Short story from another site; the gentleman in question thought that his wife was messing around with a contractor that was renovating his home. He supplied the PI with a key. The PI waited outside, knowing exactly how many workers were in the house. He noted that one remained behind. The PI used a key supplied by his client, entered the home, snapped his pictures as they emerged from the bedroom. The contractor, at first threatened then turned tail and ran for his life. The wife begged and pleaded, until her husband showed up. 

Even in the safety of one's home. An affair can occur. Hire the PI, have her followed, you will at least find out what is going on.


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## TheTruthHurts (Oct 1, 2015)

catdude said:


> Unfortunately all the suggestions to show up at an event is not something that is possible in our positions. A public scene would cost me my clients in addition to the wife. Many events are at the company complex which is a secured building and these would not be possible any way.




I sense that you don't want to find out more. You are absolute in your responses. Well, nothing in life is absolute - an industrious person MAKES things happen. But you don't seem to be that guy. If that's the case I suspect you will just stay at home and wonder 


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## southbound (Oct 31, 2010)

Wolf1974 said:


> I don't think it's uncommon for some personality types and professionals to keep work and private life separate. I know I keep them as far apart as I possibly can.
> 
> That said with her history I would demand to know a lot more about her work. My x's affair started at work and many of these red flags seem the same


Same here. I'm a school teacher,and when I was married, I rarely talked about my work, and I wasn't cheating or have anything weird going g on whatsoever. That was just my personality. 

For me, the most boring thing in the world is to come home and verbally rehash a work day. That's me; I know a lot of people are opppsite. 

I don't think I tried to avoid any questions, but I probably didn't go into any more detail than I had to. 

She thought it a little odd because she liked to come in and tell every detail about her work day.


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

I don't like discussing my work life. When I leave work I leave it. I find it boring to discuss and I can only imagine it would bore any partner I would have to hear about it.


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## happy as a clam (Jan 5, 2014)

I rarely talk about my work life when I'm at home. I doubt my SO could name even one of my coworkers names (other than my boss) and I am certainly not cheating.

I also rarely socialize with people from work. I really have no desire to see them anymore than I already do (40+ hours is plenty) and decline 99% of after-hour social invitations from coworkers. I get along just fine with everyone I work with and they seem pleasant enough, but I prefer to keep work life and private life completely separate.


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

catdude said:


> Unfortunately all the suggestions to show up at an event is not something that is possible in our positions. A public scene would cost me my clients in addition to the wife. Many events are at the company complex which is a secured building and these would not be possible any way.


You're not getting it, you may have already lost your wife. You need to act.

This will not go away if you don't act if she is having an affair eventually it will get to a point where she will leave you for the other guy or break up your marriage. You may be on a sinking ship, you need to act to save yourself.


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## commonsenseisn't (Aug 13, 2014)

catdude said:


> We worked through this and I thought things were fine until recently when she seemed to become extra secretive about people she works with. Am I fool to think her secretive behavior is anything other than a means to have relationships she does not want me to be aware of?.


You two did not work through "this" and things were not fine as you assumed. And yes, you are a fool to think her behavior is such..... Sorry, but that's the truth. I'm pretty sure you are glimpsing only the tip of the iceberg.


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## Roselyn (Sep 19, 2010)

Career woman here and worked in the same office for 27 years. Our work environment is politically charged and one's private information can hurt one's position in the workplace. I give my husband a choice to join in necessary official functions, but remind him constantly to keep private matters confidential. He prefers that I go alone in these work functions as he tends to be defensive when questioned about private matters while in these events. He is not adept to dodging uncomfortable questions. He prefers to drop me off & pick me up after the event.

In your wife's case, she has been involved in affairs in her workplace. I speculate that her past with men has circulated among her co-workers and she does not want you to know more. You have rugswept her affairs. In my workplace, she would be known negatively as a "workplace ho". She might be continuing her behavior in the workplace and she does not want you to know from her co-workers. You need to have a "come to Jesus talk" as to why you are excluded from her office functions when spouses are invited.


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## Talker67 (Apr 7, 2016)

i am thinking a VAR and a GPS tracker in her car might be a good first step. If it IS an office affair, odds are there will be activity in the car, parking the car at noon time in a park or motel parking lot, etc. If nothing seems to be going on there....well maybe then you can do a little more communicating with her to see WHY she does not want you at work functions.


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