# I feel like I'm being manipulated, but maybe it's normal?



## Epic_Dreamer (Jun 12, 2016)

Hi, everyone. My fiancé started picking little fights with me yesterday over little things. He was surprisingly nasty, and each time he would say something, it was to insult me and basically saying I can't do anything right. He's done this a few times over the past 3 years and each time, I had to apologize to him even though I could never figure out what I was doing wrong. 

Yesterday, we were getting ready to go visit a friend and I decided I didn't want to go. Every word I said, every thing I touched, was wrong or annoying to him in some way. 
It was at this point that I told him I was exhausted, and would prefer to go to bed. He said I was being a ***** and being selfish but we went to bed and all night long he was talking in his sleep about how much he hates me. 
This morning, he hasn't spoken to me. 

Should I apologize to him to keep the peace? If I tell him that I didn't like his behavior, he will do what he always does and scream that I'm blaming him when it's my fault. 

I didn't want to do that last night because I didn't do a single thing that i thought was wrong and I'm thinking that maybe he's just manipulating me. But then again, maybe this is a little thing in the big scheme of things and I could just apologize and the fight would basically be over. 

What do you think?


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## BBF (May 21, 2015)

Make him mad enough that he breaks the engagement so you can keep the ring...that's about the only thing I see that's remotely good that can come of this 3 year trial to see if you two are right for eternal marriage. 

Or, just dump him. From what you've said, he's straddling the line regarding abuse. It won't get better. It will get worse.


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## happy as a clam (Jan 5, 2014)

This is way past manipulation... It's ABUSE. Dump this loser. For God's sake don't marry him.

Get far away from him. He sounds unstable and is certainly not marriage material.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## 225985 (Dec 29, 2015)

Epic_Dreamer said:


> *This morning, he hasn't spoken to me. *
> 
> *Should I apologize to him to keep the peace? *If I tell him that I didn't like his behavior, he will do what he always does and scream that I'm blaming him when it's my fault.
> 
> ...


Trust us. This will not get better once you are married. It will get much worse. No, do not apologize. No. No. NO. 

If you apologize now, this fight will end until he does it again and again and again. Each time you apologize you will train him to do this and reinforce this behavior.

Unless HE fixes this, this will be your life until your divorce. 

Unfortunately there are far too many similar stories here on TAM of your exact situation and they almost always involve the unhappy wife and emotionally abusive husband.

Why is he still your fiance? Have not you told him that this is unacceptable behavior?

The best advice I can give you right now is - DON'T GET PREGNANT.

Don't firm up any wedding plans just yet or you will waste your money.


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## FrazzledSadHusband (Jul 3, 2014)

BBF said:


> Make him mad enough that he breaks the engagement so you can keep the ring...that's about the only thing I see that's remotely good that can come of this 3 year trial to see if you two are right for eternal marriage.
> 
> Or, just dump him. From what you've said, he's straddling the line regarding abuse. * It won't get better. It will get worse.*




Quoted for Truth! Thank God above you have seen this side of him before the wedding!


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## Epic_Dreamer (Jun 12, 2016)

Thank you all for the advice. Wow, I'm feeling rather validated, but also a little queasy. :|

I'm still with him because most of the time, we have a great time together and we are compatible in so many ways but when this type of behavior comes out, it's, um...
confusing.


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## tryingtobebetter (Aug 6, 2012)

If you really do not want to end your engagement immediately, then you should put your foot down, tell him this sort of behaviour by him is unacceptable and you will not tolerate it. Stick by that, so if he repeats at all, you walk.

The bit that really worries me is him saying he hates you in his sleep. He sounds like maybe a case for some psychotherapy?


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## Epic_Dreamer (Jun 12, 2016)

The talking in his sleep was concerning and hurtful but he went to bed angry, and I guess it was on his mind. I don't want to make excuses for him, but this was the very first time that I've heard him talk in his sleep that way. 

I'm going to let him know that I won't tolerate this kind of behavior. Maybe he'll apologize to me, maybe this is the beginning of the end. 

Thank you to everyone who commented!


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

Epic_Dreamer said:


> Thank you all for the advice. Wow, I'm feeling rather validated, but also a little queasy. :|
> 
> I'm still with him because most of the time, we have a great time together and we are compatible in so many ways but when this type of behavior comes out, it's, um...
> confusing.


His behavior is not acceptable..*it's emotionally abusive*.. you said all night he was "talking in his sleep" about how much he hates you.. what do you mean by this.. in his dreams he is speaking how much he hates you -out loud ? 

It sounds you are a Peace maker.. which means you are very passive, you want to please & just keep the peace (conflict avoidant) .....anyone with your personality type needs to be sure they are not mistreated... but feel loved & understood by your man.... as someone with a strong more dominate personality type can take advantage of this, add some Anger / impatient nasty tendencies to this.. Look out!.. you can become somewhat of a doormat... 

You need to speak up for yourself.. stand your ground.. if he can't *respect* you when you haven't done anything wrong... if he can't see he's being a D*** and apologize to you for his lousy behavior and mistreatment.. you don't want this man!...He's not reasonable, he also has anger management issues... 

As others said.. it will only GET WORSE ONCE YOU MARRY...


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## Epic_Dreamer (Jun 12, 2016)

SimplyAmorous said:


> His behavior is not acceptable..*it's emotionally abusive*.. you said all night he was "talking in his sleep" about how much he hates you.. what do you mean by this.. in his dreams he is speaking how much he hates you -out loud ?



He was sleeping and I assume dreaming and he would say "I hate you, <mumble, mumble> you suck!" and that basically went on through the night. 

He does sleep-talk often but it's usually just work related or random mumblings. 

We don't live together, and he left this morning for his house without talking to me at all. I'm going to call him tonight. I definitely am a person who likes to avoid conflict and this is going to be very difficult for me to have this conversation with him.


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## chatabox (May 4, 2016)

Hate is a very strong word. Could you honestly marry someone who truly hates you? Could you be happy?

He may dislike you at times, but saying that he hates you, and in his sleep where he is probably the most honest... Doesn't bode well for your relationship. I would get out now while you can. It won't get better when your married. Think what it will be like in the stress of buying a house together. The stress of having a newborn baby. The stress of raising a family. The stress of work, living together 24/7. Life. You have to be strong and work as a team to happily get through a successful life together. There's no team here. He's just hating on you.


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## tryingtobebetter (Aug 6, 2012)

OP

I hope you are ok today and that you found your call/conversation yesterday beneficial to you.

A further thought occurred belatedly to me. Is there any risk of his being violent? If so, you must of course take extreme care. 

Hoping for your welfare.


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## Epic_Dreamer (Jun 12, 2016)

We spoke on the phone and had a good long talk and he apologized for his behavior. 

I'm going to see him this weekend but I'm not sure yet what will happen after that. 

Thank you all for the good advice. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## joannacroc (Dec 17, 2014)

Epic_Dreamer said:


> We spoke on the phone and had a good long talk and *he apologized for his behavior*.
> 
> I'm going to see him this weekend but I'm not sure yet what will happen after that.
> 
> ...


That's nice. But it's also a far cry from actual change. Watch him VERY closely when his guard is down and see how he really treats you before you even consider following through on the marriage.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

I have a book for you to read, to see if you recognize your fiance. Let us know what you think after reading it.

Why Does He Do That?: Inside the Minds of Angry and Controlling Men by Lundy Bancroft, Paperback | Barnes & Noble


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

He is immature and spoiled....probably by his Momma.

If he does not get his way he acts out. Sounds like he goes in and out of depression.

His anger spells seem to last hours, if not days. That is worrisome.

Is he an Alcoholic? Does he use prescription drugs and forget to take them? If so, maybe the dosage is off. 

Get him to a behavioral psychiatrist. No wait...get him a one-way ticket to his New Life, without you.

This is a wonderful life, do not let a misfit twist your Happy-Face, Upside Down.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Have you looked at the book yet?


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

Epic_Dreamer said:


> The talking in his sleep was concerning and hurtful but he went to bed angry, and I guess it was on his mind. I don't want to make excuses for him, but* this was the very first time that I've heard him talk in his sleep that way. *
> 
> I'm going to let him know that I won't tolerate this kind of behavior. Maybe he'll apologize to me, maybe this is the beginning of the end.
> 
> Thank you to everyone who commented!


Then he might have faked being asleep so that when his harsh, unfair words were quoted back to him he could say: "Oh, I must have been talking in my sleep!" (_Yeah, sure you were, buddy..._)

His behaviour is wrong. And it will not get better.


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## Epic_Dreamer (Jun 12, 2016)

turnera2 said:


> Have you looked at the book yet?




Thanks for the book suggestion! I haven't looked yet, but I'm going to check it out this week. 


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## Epic_Dreamer (Jun 12, 2016)

MattMatt said:


> Then he might have faked being asleep so that when his harsh, unfair words were quoted back to him he could say: "Oh, I must have been talking in my sleep!" (_Yeah, sure you were, buddy..._)
> 
> His behaviour is wrong. And it will not get better.




Sadly, that did occur to me. Thanks for the advice. 


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## DellaStreet (Jun 18, 2016)

Epic_Dreamer said:


> My fiancé started picking little fights with me yesterday over little things. He was surprisingly nasty, and each time he would say something, it was to insult me and basically saying I can't do anything right. *He's done this a few times over the past 3 years and each time,* I had to apologize to him even though I could never figure out what I was doing wrong.


If it's not too personal, could you please share with us what has caused these little fights.

A few times (no more than 5) in 3 years isn't very much. So, what sets him off?

It might make more sense if you could be specific.

If you can't, for privacy reasons, I understand.


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## Epic_Dreamer (Jun 12, 2016)

SunCMars said:


> He is immature and spoiled....probably by his Momma.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




He does not use drugs, alcohol, or prescription meds. He does act out and it is worrisome. I'm a little surprised that every single bit of advice that I've received is to end this relationship but it is very telling. It's especially hard because I love him but I'm not going to just ignore his behavior and be a doormat. 


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

I haven't told you to leave him. I just want to know if he falls into the abusive spectrum because, if he does, you have to approach this completely differently.


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

Epic_Dreamer said:


> I'm a little surprised that every single bit of advice that I've received is to end this relationship but it is very telling. It's especially hard because I love him but I'm not going to just ignore his behavior and be a doormat.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Yes, we are outsiders.

We do not have any emotional connection.

Classic application of logic-driven advice with a feel for the poster...the posted background. 

No poster can put a lifetime of thoughts and emotions in 300 words or less.

Tell us his good points, re-direct the flow of this purported river of tears. 

Convince us otherwise......if possible....please.


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## Spotthedeaddog (Sep 27, 2015)

Epic_Dreamer said:


> Hi, everyone. My fiancé started picking little fights with me yesterday over little things. He was surprisingly nasty, and each time he would say something, it was to insult me and basically saying I can't do anything right. He's done this a few times over the past 3 years and each time, I had to apologize to him even though I could never figure out what I was doing wrong.
> 
> Yesterday, we were getting ready to go visit a friend and I decided I didn't want to go. Every word I said, every thing I touched, was wrong or annoying to him in some way.
> It was at this point that I told him I was exhausted, and would prefer to go to bed. He said I was being a ***** and being selfish but we went to bed and all night long he was talking in his sleep about how much he hates me.
> ...


Clearly _something_ is bothering him, something he feels he can't discuss, or that you're refusing to discuss with him.

Bailing when you've agreed and getting read to go is a pretty suck thing to do and DOES undermine him socially, which even if you don't admit it, could be taken as a passive aggressive punishment on him. Especially if you claim something which is about you and validates your control of the situation (eg hard day, I'm tired) means he has to dance to your apron strings - something that he's got to PC agree with even if he is mega annoyed, OR he would have to be the bully and either force or shame you into going for his sake.... but of course, PC rules says he's not allowed to verbalise this, especially if he doesn't have politician level of debate ability. Which leaves him, what? , way of dealing/expressing it?

That you haven't been able to work out wrong means you have a definite communication problem in the relationship. And that is a _two_ person problem. For some reason he can't communicate the problem to you, and for some reason you can't get him to spell it out to him...it's like if you asked him what was wrong and he just said "it's fine". you damn well know it isn't, but unless you can see whats bugging him then chances are you'll not just on different pages, but in different books.

It could be something as generic as no likely how his life is turning out, or that he's used to being noticed when working and he's reached a point where he doesn't shine. It could be worries about finance - or even something as stupid as that you're a real person, and not some fantasy he had about a celebrity/TV person with a perfect life.

But as others have said. Don't get pregnant, and unless you can dig out what's _really_ bugging him, and you can handle that _happily_ it WILL get worse. It will eventually become physical as his frustration continues to mount. so just which solution you want is how much you love the person he is (not what you think you can make of him)


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## Spotthedeaddog (Sep 27, 2015)

Apologies are worthless. they're just empty words, even if they're truly heartfelt, they're just words. As yourself knows when you apologies for things you don't even know what is wrong.

If you care enough, you really have to find out whats getting him so frustrated and uptight - and it's like to be a bunch of annoying whiny crap, which is why he lets it bottle up. And because he's not able to let it go it becomes the poison that is killing him and you. If he doesn't want to say, then ask him how much he cares for you.... but be aware if he shares these things he will no longer be the _man_ you look up to


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Epic_Dreamer View Post

I'm a little surprised that every single bit of advice that I've received is to end this relationship but it is very telling. It's especially hard because I love him but I'm not going to just ignore his behavior and be a doormat. 
_______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

Yes, isn't that the truth.

In life, the emotional, the angry,anxious [opinionated] folks speak first...no, unload first.

Hopefully, some of the more gentle people on this Blog will get you through this. 

You want to save your marriage. Good for you. It is the communication that needs to fine tuned, not to slice the life line, but to re-thread it with stronger fibers.

Tell him, over and over that you love him. You need talk these problems into wispy harmless shadows. I hope he steps up and does the same. 

Note: some people cannot sit down and communicate their problems and needs without exploding or clamming up. That is their nature. Live with it.


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## AngelHeart888 (Jun 21, 2016)

NORMAL?? Hell no, it's not normal.

First of all, DON'T GET MARRIED. At least, not yet.

This kind of behavior is NOT OK. 

When you feel like you constantly have to apologize, just to make peace, for HIS bad behavior, your self-esteem will suffer over time and this will wear away at your relationship. It's suffering already, and perhaps it was not that healthy in the first place if you are with him, and have been putting up with this kind of thing for years.

Think very carefully before you make a lifelong commitment to a person who exercises this type of emotional abuse.


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## Nix2 (Jun 16, 2016)

Epic_Dreamer said:


> Hi, everyone. My fiancé started picking little fights with me yesterday over little things. He was surprisingly nasty, and each time he would say something, it was to insult me and basically saying I can't do anything right. He's done this a few times over the past 3 years and each time, I had to apologize to him even though I could never figure out what I was doing wrong.
> 
> Yesterday, we were getting ready to go visit a friend and I decided I didn't want to go. Every word I said, every thing I touched, was wrong or annoying to him in some way.
> It was at this point that I told him I was exhausted, and would prefer to go to bed. He said I was being a ***** and being selfish but we went to bed and all night long he was talking in his sleep about how much he hates me.
> ...


Once this fight ends, he'll begin another. It's what people like him do.....

Question, is this the first time he's ever acted this way? In three years together, my guess is that he's probably done this before.

You deserve better, his behavior is abusive and will only get worse with time. It always does. Three years is long enough to waste on a jerk like this. Get out!


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## AngelHeart888 (Jun 21, 2016)

"I'm a little surprised that every single bit of advice that I've received is to end this relationship but it is very telling. It's especially hard because I love him but I'm not going to just ignore his behavior and be a doormat. "

I understand that you love him, and therefore you can't just end the relationship without considerable thought.
The fact that you decided that you will not ignore the behavior and will not be a doormat is a good sign, and a step in the right direction.

Maybe a little extra communication, in a calm, loving manner might be productive. Not in the heat of the moment, when you're angry, but at a time when you are more clear thinking and relaxed.

Let him know exactly how his words and actions make you feel. And how it causes you doubts about the relationship.
Then see if he is listening. See if he makes an attempt to change his behavior. Is he hearing you? Does he have any empathy? 

Many/most/all narcissists have little or no empathy.


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