# Unable to create NC w/ OW



## StickyMess (Dec 7, 2012)

Good Evening. I've been lurking for some time, and have been reading posts for hours relating to my situation. I am at a loss how I can proceed.

My husband had an affair for 2 years with a POSOW that he works with. He is her boss and she is not married so exposure can't take place with a spouse. If HR finds out it will be a disaster, as he is a shareowner. He will be around her more than me and I don't know how we can move forward. This was our 2nd Day with the same OW. I've been crying all day. I'm so mad and hurt. I can't believe he told me I could trust him and then hurt me 100x worse.help.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## alte Dame (Aug 7, 2012)

Why can't you divorce him? He's been lying and cheating for 2 years now & it will continue without a doubt without NC.

Is there some reason you won't divorce?


----------



## StickyMess (Dec 7, 2012)

I'm trying to keep my family together. We have 3 boys under 9. And for financial reasons as my income is maybe half of his.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## alte Dame (Aug 7, 2012)

You've boxed yourself in. With them working together, you literally have no chance for an honest reconciliation. You will also never get any peace.

So, you either divorce and deal with single parenthood for your children, as well as some adjustment in finances, or you live with the constant pain of his infidelity, which will probably be ongoing.

(Someone may also come in and suggest an open marriage in which both of you get to have affairs, but these suggestions are usually not serious. They are made more to point out that you are essentially agreeing to live in a one-sided open marriage if you stay.)


----------



## StickyMess (Dec 7, 2012)

alte Dame said:


> You've boxed yourself in. With them working together, you literally have no chance for an honest reconciliation. You will also never get any peace.
> 
> So, you either divorce and deal with single parenthood for your children, as well as some adjustment in finances, or you live with the constant pain of his infidelity, which will probably be ongoing.
> 
> (Someone may also come in and suggest an open marriage in which both of you get to have affairs, but these suggestions are usually not serious. They are made more to point out that you are essentially agreeing to live in a one-sided open marriage if you stay.)


I have read those posts and the thought Alone sickens me. He said that I can trust him, that he chose and our boys and I want to believe him but I already did that once and it got me here again. I can't imagine my life without him. We used to be best friends and now I feel like I am living with a stranger!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## StickyMess (Dec 7, 2012)

Forgot to mention all this has been going on while we went to MC, which pisses me off even more.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## betrayed2013 (Feb 5, 2013)

u have got to put an end to this madness. dont worry about finances. Clean him out! He brought this upon u and didnt care at all. Take him to the cleaners. I too was scared as hell to start over alone, but i had to because as much as they all say "you can trust me", u kno deep down you will never be able to fully trust them ever again. U will live ur life in constant worry and feel beneath them for wat the BS has done to u emotionally. Its gonna be tough but u have to move on and u have to do it for ur children. Look at the money wasted in going to marriage counselling and him still screwing u over behind ur back and telling lie afer lie after lie.


----------



## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

Unfortunately, you know that you can't force him to do the right thing.


----------



## alte Dame (Aug 7, 2012)

You used to be best friends, but now he is like a stranger.

He lied to you over and over again over a span of years & even through MC.

If you think you love this man, it isn't real love. It isn't the kind that is borne of respect and honesty and true intimacy.

I doubt the people here will advise you constructively on how to live with him while he is still working with her and has such a history of cheating and lying. That sort of help isn't really responsible, since it doesn't look out for your best interests.

Try to think past your fear and ask yourself how you can have some self-respect, peace of mind and some happiness. I think if you're honest, you'll know that it isn't in a false reconciliation with your WH.


----------



## StickyMess (Dec 7, 2012)

Openminded said:


> Unfortunately, you know that you can't force him to do the right thing.
> 
> My story is that 30 years ago my husband cheated with someone who worked for him. He claimed they were just friends. I stayed for my son. She left the company and he was eventually transferred several states away.
> 
> ...


I'm incredibly sorry to hear that for so long, or at all for that matter. He has admitted to loving us both but he wants to stay and work it out for our family. That just makes me feel Like second fiddle when he said that. How am I supposed to sleep at night wondering if he is missing her. How can I go to work knowing they could be off together. But how can I tear apart the unity of our family my boys cherish so much. I have prayed to God and seen our Pastor for help, and I still can't find the strength to stick to a decision.

I was hoping someone with a spouse that had to stay working with the Ow would share a success story. But everything seems to point in the same direction. I just don't know if I can live with that. I do love him still very much.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

Have him sell his shares and move to a new company.


----------



## StickyMess (Dec 7, 2012)

Shaggy said:


> Have him sell his shares and move to a new company.


It isn't that easy as it is a family business.

I asked him if he knew if the OW WS only with him and he said she was not. So now I have to have the experience of getting tested for diseases too.the thought alone makes me sick. Thanks to him I am now on sleeping pills and antidepressants. I also considered myself to be strong but this is killing me.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## StickyMess (Dec 7, 2012)

StickyMess said:


> It isn't that easy as it is a family business.
> 
> I asked him if he knew if the OW WS only with him and he said she was not. So now I have to have the experience of getting tested for diseases too.the thought alone makes me sick. Thanks to him I am now on sleeping pills and antidepressants. I also considered myself to be strong but this is killing me.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


The reason the OW is single is because he broke up that family. That is worth mentioning.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## shownjjkb (Sep 22, 2013)

You will also never get any peace.


----------



## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

If you are going to even try to recover your marriage, she has to leave the job. A large severance package would most likely be required. Not sure it's even worth it at this point.

How long have you been married to him? What state are you in? Is it no fault? or fault?


----------



## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

Perhaps you could negotiate a more generous divorce package if you pointed out to your husband and his family how dangerous it is professionally for your husband to be dating staff.

You would certainly want big payouts in the beginning in view of the future liability that comes with your husband behaving recklessly in the workplace.


----------



## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

Even if someone posts saying it worked for them, I don't think this is a path anyone would recommend. You've got two separate (at least two) issues.

First, will he cheat again? Well, he's done it at least twice already. At that point, I'd say that considering his AP is still there, odds are that he'll do it again. Especially as he doesn't seem particularly remorseful.

Second, can you move on while she's still there? I'd say that's not likely, and it's horribly unfair of him to ask you to do that.

Was this exposed to other people, like his family, your family, etc? In particular, I think, if he works with other family members at work, they might do something as far as "keeping an eye on him", but even that really isn't going to help, I don't think. Personally, I think you all should talk to an employment lawyer to see about the best way to clear this up. The company is at risk regardless of YOU exposing this at work. Her ex-husband could decide to ignite the bomb. She and your husband could have a falling out, and she could blow things up. 

And I think both you and your husband are staying together for the wrong reasons. Not because you love each other or respect each other. But for the kids and financial reasons. What kind of relationship are you going to be teaching your kids to develop in their marriages? 

And finally, just because your husband is a shareholder in a family business, it doesn't mean he has to stay working in that business. Lots of people who own shares (even majority shareholders) in a family company don't necessarily work at that business. 

C


----------



## LongWalk (Apr 4, 2013)

StickyMess said:


> The reason the OW is single is because he broke up that family. That is worth mentioning.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


You mean her spouse/partner/boyfriend learned about your husband and left her?

You need not conclude that your marriage is doomed. Your marriage is already gone. What you are in now is limbo with the old legal bond an agreement that has been broken.

1) As much as possible 180 with your husband;
2) Fake being a strong and self sufficient as much as possible;
3) Get the papers for divorce in order so that you can put them in a drawer ready to hand to him if you uncover more betrayal;
4) Get help from Weightligter, TAM VAR geek who can coach you on how to find out what conversations they are having. Can you get into his office and fix a VAR there somewhere that he cannot find it?

Observe your husband's actions. Does he express love and affection convincingly? Is he remorseful?

By taking action, you can at least not end up passively waiting for him to steer your marriage. You can take control by being as independent as possible.


----------



## alte Dame (Aug 7, 2012)

Your H is telling you that he loves both of you. I will bet you the farm that he is telling her that he loves only her and is staying with you because of the children.

Which do you think is the truth?

Do not keep doing this to yourself. Please have some pride and tell him to leave.


----------



## bfree (Sep 30, 2012)

You want to save your marriage and family? He needs to go NC. Period. There is no other way. You (and he) need to decide whether your marriage and family is worth more than his job. You already know this but you're trying to hide your head in the sand hoping it all goes away. It won't.

Understand that he made the choice to cheat on you. If he has to give up the job to keep the family intact, that's on him...not you. You have the choice whether to stay with him or divorce. You have that power. But you also need to understand that if he and this OW continue to work together you'd better get used to sharing him with her because they won't stop. Then again you should also be wondering if he will eventually decide to leave you once his feelings for her surpass his feelings for you.


----------



## Acabado (May 13, 2012)

Your husband is just an ordinary cake eater and the position he chose is basicaly the cake eater's heaven.
You need to stop this state of denial, you are in a "de facto" polyamory relationship. He won't give up. 
No confusions nor grey areas here, just two choices:
- Accepting it as it is. Embracing it. It obviously means you renounce forever to what once were your core values.
- Filing for divorce and start a new life free of the abuser on your life an regaining your self respect as it's obvious, because your denial and rationalizations tell us so, you are living against your core values.

I'm very sorry you are in this almost hopeless positions. If it weren't so tragic it would laugable he still mantain you should trust him.
The only chance to keep your marriage as you wish is he giving up the bussiness which won't happen, ever, as you already know. He doesn't value the marriage that way.
Friend, i wish i could give you a magic receipt. It's futile, accept the reality and act accordingly. Take the red pill.
I'm sorry to put in your face the reality of what's going on. Sugarcoating it would be doing you a huge disservice.

Choose friend, choose for good.


----------



## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

Wow.

But actually the solution has 2 simple solutions to pick from

1. He leaves and gets a new job

2. You divorce him and he pays you support and almony and you get half his shares in the company as his spouse.

I'm not trying to be arrogant. These two solution are valid and do exist, you just don't like them.

But the question is which of these are better than him continuing the affair which is a very high likely hood at this point.


----------



## Acabado (May 13, 2012)

Shaggy said:


> 2. You divorce him and he pays you support and almony and you get half his shares in the company as his spouse.


This is the only realistic choice.
I'd simply get a shark of a lawyer and blinside him.
Nail him to the wall, no mercy, to the yugular.
OP has no marriage, it's a joke. Time to make it official and reap what she earned.

Get angry friend, get angry and channel that anger towards the right goal.

Corrected typos


----------



## bunny23 (May 19, 2011)

You need to get mad and you need to get a lawyer.

Then you need to get alimony and child support, and find someone worth having a normal relationship with.

Once you start making rational decisions things will look better, you are feeling out of control right now. But you have options.

Talk to a lawyer and get some IC


----------



## theroad (Feb 20, 2012)

bunny23 said:


> You need to get mad and you need to get a lawyer.
> 
> Then you need to get alimony and child support, and find someone worth having a normal relationship with.
> 
> ...


There is no way around not having NC. This is why the affair started again.

Your WH leaves the job or OW leaves the job. Work place affairs call for work place exposure.

Time to expose.


----------



## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

What kinds of things does he tell you about the OW? Does he just say good things about her? Or does he put her down? Say he really loves only you? etc?


----------



## StickyMess (Dec 7, 2012)

Thanks to all replies. Sorry for the late reply, I had many church activities which I was engaged in. I will try and answer the questions.. I'm a little better emotionally today. 

We have been married for ten years and are in a no fault state. He talks about her saying, "she understands me" she thinks he walks on water. Little does she know that he is a distant, emotionally draining child at times. I love him, but he is hard to be around sometimes. 
He calls her his best friend, but that is supposed to be me!! Our marriage was stale and troubled before this. I am LD and he is HD, which also doesn't help. 

The first time I forgave him, did all of the wrong things, never snooped etc. I trusted him with my health and future. He said he will not speak to her outside of work, but how am I supposed to deal with him loving another woman while me, the mother of his children waits idly by hoping he will love me again.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## alte Dame (Aug 7, 2012)

StickyMess said:


> He said he will not speak to her outside of work, but how am I supposed to deal with him loving another woman while me, the mother of his children waits idly by hoping he will love me again.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


You deal with it by divorcing him.


----------



## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

StickyMess said:


> Thanks to all replies. Sorry for the late reply, I had many church activities which I was engaged in. I will try and answer the questions.. I'm a little better emotionally today.
> 
> We have been married for ten years and are in a no fault state. He talks about her saying, "she understands me" she thinks he walks on water. Little does she know that he is a distant, emotionally draining child at times. I love him, but he is hard to be around sometimes.
> He calls her his best friend, but that is supposed to be me!! Our marriage was stale and troubled before this. I am LD and he is HD, which also doesn't help.
> ...


So he never says anything negative about her?

It’s ridiculous of him to expect you to put up with him still working with his affair partner. Of course the affair will continue. He’s just feeding you anything crap he thinks will keep you quiet.

You need to see an attorney about your rights. What kind of child support and spousal support will he be liable for? You can start getting paid these within days of filing for a divorce.

In most no-fault states you can still use his infidelity in the divorce. In some you can mention it in the divorce decree and even name her. Then in the settlement you can sue him for all the money he has spent on the affair + punitive damages. A spouse as a legal obligation to not squander/waste marital assets. Spending money on an affair is wasting marital assets.

Can you find receipts of things he’s spent on the affair: presents, hotel rooms, trips, anything else? If you can get the proof and move it to a safe place.


----------



## bfree (Sep 30, 2012)

As long as he sees her you are not THE woman in his life. Talking to her outside of work or not means absolutely nothing so long as they are working together. Each day they see each other strengthens their bond and weakens the one he had with you. This will continue until he rationalizes that she has more in common with him than you do, that she is better for him, that they are soul mates. This is already happening yes? So how long are you going to sit by and allow your marriage to die a slow death?


----------



## Aerith (May 17, 2013)

EleGirl said:


> Of course the affair will continue. He’s just feeding you anything crap he thinks will keep you quiet.


That's exactly my BGF story... Her then H (now XH) already lived with OW, had a child with her but promised my BGF that he would come back and they would live happily ever after... All to keep her quiet while hiding the assets abroad. 

I guess the divorce can seriously damage his family business - so, for him it's preferable to keep the you than to get divorced. 

Find a good lawyer and file for divorce - all his promises are worth nothing.


----------



## Thorburn (Nov 23, 2011)

betrayed2013 said:


> u have got to put an end to this madness. dont worry about finances. Clean him out! He brought this upon u and didnt care at all. Take him to the cleaners. I too was scared as hell to start over alone, but i had to because as much as they all say "you can trust me", u kno deep down you will never be able to fully trust them ever again. U will live ur life in constant worry and feel beneath them for wat the BS has done to u emotionally. Its gonna be tough but u have to move on and u have to do it for ur children. Look at the money wasted in going to marriage counselling and him still screwing u over behind ur back and telling lie afer lie after lie.


What cleaners? In most cases stating that you are going to take the cheating SOB to the cleaners won't happen, rarely does, unless your husband is rich, and even then it does not always happen.

In all too many D's both parties loose a lot financially.

The fact that your husband continues to work with this woman is the problem. The A may have never ended or if it has can be quickly started again. 

The OW has to go or your husband has to leave his job.


----------



## Thorburn (Nov 23, 2011)

*If HR finds out it will be a disaster, as he is a shareowner. *

Why would this be a disaster? 


What is the OW's position?

What is your WS's position?

Just curious. Can your husband fire her? Is he in that position to do so? Frankly if he was, I would ask him to fire her, she will find another job and it would show his true colors.

I remember another post that was similar to this one.


----------



## bfree (Sep 30, 2012)

Thorburn said:


> *If HR finds out it will be a disaster, as he is a shareowner. *
> 
> Why would this be a disaster?
> 
> ...


There was a news story a while ago where a doctor fired a nurse because he said he was too attracted to her and his wife was upset they worked together. The nurse sued the doctor and lost. The courts said that there was no contract and no "right to work."


----------



## StickyMess (Dec 7, 2012)

It would be a disaster because my H already lied to HR when they got suspicious. Said they were "just friends." He is the VP, but it is a relatively small company that is privately held. 

She is his subordinate and works very closely with him on a daily basis. He has refused to fire her, as he said that he cannot punish her and her daughter for his actions. He is also afraid that she will sue the company. He was extremely wreckless in his behaviour, and right now I feel like I am the only one that is being punished. I stupidly thought that me and our boys meant more to him. 

We are not rich by any means. There is no cleaners to take him to. I will be a single mom trying to raise three boys. How in the he** am I supposed to do that. I know that he would take care of his children but the point is he promised to take care of all of us. The only person he has shown any consideration for is himself.


----------



## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

Honestly, I'd be shocked if the affair isn't still going on. He's very nicely arranged it to be entirely one sided for him.

I stand by my advice - he either changes jobs or you file. Either way that is what will break your deadlock.


----------



## alte Dame (Aug 7, 2012)

Many people manage to get up the courage to do what they need to do. Many people. You are not chained down. Your H only has you over a barrel because you elect to stay there. It's your life. You're not just a puppet whose strings are being haplessly pulled.


----------



## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

StickyMess said:


> It would be a disaster because my H already lied to HR when they got suspicious. Said they were "just friends." He is the VP, but it is a relatively small company that is privately held.


Is he a part owner of the business or just working for a privately held company.
Depending on the state you live in, if he owns shares in the company you will either get half of his shares or he will need to buy you out of your half of his share.


StickyMess said:


> She is his subordinate and works very closely with him on a daily basis. He has refused to fire her, as he said that he cannot punish her and her daughter for his actions. He is also afraid that she will sue the company. He was extremely wreckless in his behaviour, and right now I feel like I am the only one that is being punished. I stupidly thought that me and our boys meant more to him.


He can see an attorney and find a way to let her go. It might take a severance package. He is not the only one who behaved badly. So did she. He’s protecting her over you and his children.


StickyMess said:


> We are not rich by any means. There is no cleaners to take him to. I will be a single mom trying to raise three boys. How in the he** am I supposed to do that. I know that he would take care of his children but the point is he promised to take care of all of us. The only person he has shown any consideration for is himself.


The term “single mother” applies to a woman who was not married to the father of the children and she is raising the children on her own. You will be a divorce mother. He will have about 50% legal and physical custody. He’s 50% responsible for raising the children. He will most likely also be paying you child support.

He will also most likely be paying you at least rehabilitative alimony until you get some job skills, education or whatever else you need so you can earn a living that is sufficient to help support yourself and your children.


----------



## StickyMess (Dec 7, 2012)

We are in Southern California, so the laws for this kind of garbage going on are probably some of the most liberal that you are going to find anywhere in the country. 

In regards to his ownership of the company, it is messy that only needs to be explained as he doesn't own them outright. Some day, but not yet. 

I realize that he is protecting her over us, which is another reason why this is so painful. 

I know he will pay alimony. I know he will pay child support. I have a college degree and a job. What I am really hating is the possibility of that POSOW having any part in raising my children. I realize that most A do not end up long term. 3% is the statistic. But even 0.30% is too much for me to stomach over that home wrecking b****


----------



## Pepper123 (Nov 27, 2012)

SM- I can empathize with your situation on a number of levels. But until you find it in yourself to gain the courage to demand better - as in exclusivity, you are nothing more than a door prize. 

Eventually he will tire, and walk on his own. Respect yourself enough to demand more. Until you do, he will continue. Even if he could make good on the promise to not physically be intimate with her, he will see her every.single.day. If he has allowed it to go on this long, he is deeply emotionally invested in her. 

It will not stop, until you demand that it does. 

All the options have been laid out for you. You are the one that has to live with them. Decide which future you want.


----------



## alte Dame (Aug 7, 2012)

Staying in this because it sticks in your craw that the OW might have a hand in raising your children is a Pyrrhic victory at best. You will still lose in the end. He has been having sex with her for 2 years; he says he loves her; he has lied for her; he won't fire her. He has chosen her but is too much of a coward to make the break from you.

You know what to do. We know that you know what to do.


----------



## Wise Fairy (Sep 17, 2013)

Hi SM,
Sorry that you are having to go through this and to have young children makes it so much more difficult I know. 

Your H is in a position of power but he doesn't have all the control, I agree with the others here that he is giving you what you need to hear to keep you in the same position of stale mate. 

Only seeing the OW at work well that's a good 8 hours a day to work on their relationship, where does that leave you and the boys?

Sounds like you are college educated, you have a job that's more than a lot of women have so that's a plus. You are in love with him still and that's the part that hurts because you know that if you leave him you will have to face that pain. 

I don't know your age but if you are relatively young you can start over even with kids. I had two kids when I got out after a 10 year marriage and it wasn't easy there was a lot of crying and had to share custody of the kids, but finally my life did get in order more than his. My ex married 4 times so no-one could satisfy him, and recently he apologized to me and wished we got counseling which he was so against at the time of our relationship ending. 

Sounds like you are doing the counseling what are the suggestions. 

I feel for you with him working with her and she understands him, off course she does she is giving him everything he wants to hear. 

Honestly if I was you and looking back I would be doing things for myself when he is home and tell him to watch the kids while you are going out, you could sit at the local coffee shop it doesn't matter where you go let him wonder where you are. Don't be too available to him, just sitting there waiting for him to come home.

Once he sees you becoming interesting and doing some things perhaps even going to work out at a local gym he might start thinking that you are very interesting and get to wonder what you are up to it's like giving him some of his own medicine. 

With regards to the OW unless that situation changes in the workplace it will always be the same. 

Life is too short to be in an unhappy situation you and your kids deserve more than this. And only you can decide when you have had enough and you will. 

Peace


----------



## mablenc (Feb 26, 2013)

Well he cheats because he sees that you won't leave him, which is why even during MC he still cheated. The whole I want to keep the family together and you worried about income is doing way more harm than good.


----------



## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

StickyMess said:


> We are in Southern California, so the laws for this kind of garbage going on are probably some of the most liberal that you are going to find anywhere in the country.


While CA is very liberal/no fault on the reason for divorce, they are very good on some aspects. For example in CA you can sue him, within the divorce for every penny he spent on the affair.
If you have a good case and a good attorney, the judge can grant you punitive damages as well. For example, let’s say you can find $10,000 in receipts, CC charges, etc. that he spent on the affair. So he had to pay your $10,000 plus another $10,000 in punitive payments for his misuse of community income/assets. There have been cases in which the WS loses their rights to all community property. 
IT’s not the affair that this is about, it’s the misuse of money that he has no right to spend that way.


StickyMess said:


> In regards to his ownership of the company, it is messy that only needs to be explained as he doesn't own them outright. Some day, but not yet.


Well he earned the right to get them someday, while he was married to you. Ask your attorney about this. You might very well be entitled to some share of that.


StickyMess said:


> I realize that he is protecting her over us, which is another reason why this is so painful.


I can understand. Somehow you need to find a way to move on….. 


StickyMess said:


> I know he will pay alimony. I know he will pay child support. I have a college degree and a job. What I am really hating is the possibility of that POSOW having any part in raising my children. I realize that most A do not end up long term. 3% is the statistic. But even 0.30% is too much for me to stomach over that home wrecking b****


And some day they will not be together. When that happens he will wake up from his fog and he just might realize what a huge mistake he’s made.
Either way, living well is your best revenge. Move on. You are young. You can have a very good, full life. Maybe even find a man who will love you in the right way. AT some point you will grow to not care that much about him and his bad choices in life.

I wish there was a way that you could put a huge crack in their relationship. That’s why I was asking about whether or not he said bad things to you about her. Sometimes people in affairs will tell their spouses intimate/personal things about the affair partner. They will say things like she pushed herself on me. I just feel sorry for her because she’s ….. fill in the blank….. Or perhaps him telling you that he would never leave you for her. He love you. Yada yada A recording of such a conversation could be very helpful to you. That’s just where my mind was going.


----------



## theroad (Feb 20, 2012)

Your WH's affair will never end because you will not get him to go NC.

Time to expose this affair at work. Where are your values?

Is your WH's job more important then your family, marriage, kids?

Your WH can always get another job.


----------



## jnj express (Mar 28, 2011)

If this is a family owned business---then he owns a % of the company---in a D settlement---you will get half of what he owns

You get a bulldog for an atty---and find out your options, via a free consult

You tell him, your H., don't ask/suggest/beg---you TELL him---fire her---or you will file for D

You go to HR, and again you do not tell him, you are going,---you tell them, what is going on---she can be fired under a morals clause---she can not come back agst the company---cuz she willingly participated in what went on----if she threatens a lawsuit agst your H---for sexual harassment---you, yourself tell her, you will file a suit agst her for INTENTIONAL INFLICTION OF EMOTIONAL DISTRESS

You have her no matter what---but you need to get in your H's face and tell him WHAT HE WILL DO---or else you will file for D

You need to stop throwing out excuses---you need to put on your big girl shoes---and start acting like a mature woman, who can and will take care of herself-----if it comes to a settlement---you will be fine

I live in So Calif---I know what your options are---and they are good---you just have to do, what you gotta do---and that is jump on your H, with both feet

Whether you have a mge after this is over, is up to you both, but as to the OW----she can be gone, in a flash---she needs to be gone, and that means yesterday---give your H---till the end of the week to fire her---if he doesn't then you go in there next Monday, with a relative or friend---and lay out to HR what YOU WANT DONE---SHE IS TO BE FIRED---SHE IS A HOMEWRECKER---MAKE SURE THEY UNDERSTAND THAT, and act on it.


----------



## bfree (Sep 30, 2012)

*Re: Re: Unable to create NC w/ OW*



StickyMess said:


> We are in Southern California, so the laws for this kind of garbage going on are probably some of the most liberal that you are going to find anywhere in the country.
> 
> In regards to his ownership of the company, it is messy that only needs to be explained as he doesn't own them outright. Some day, but not yet.
> 
> ...



This makes no sense. You said earlier that exposure at work was not a option because your husband already lied to HR about their relationship. So how can she possible have a hand in raising your children when they can't even have a real relationship due to his deception? I think you are afraid to take action which might result in the end of your marriage and using this as a excuse to do nothing.


----------



## Racer (Sep 24, 2009)

EleGirl said:


> Is he a part owner of the business or just working for a privately held company.
> Depending on the state you live in, if he owns shares in the company you will either get half of his shares or he will need to buy you out of your half of his share.


Not necessarily. I own a family business, and at least here 'personal gifts' are not considered part of the marital assets. My Father gifted me and my sister the shares of stock over a few years; No way can it be interpreted for 'my wife and I'. That is actually typical in a family owned business to escape paying for stock and using the gifting loopholes in the tax code. So it's even documented that it is a gift and accepted and verified by the IRS that way. To me, from my father. On both of our personal tax statements during that transition as well as the corporate taxes. My wife is not mentioned anywhere.

Furthermore, if it's incorporated, you are an employee of the firm and the firm is considered like it's own 'person' (a third party). It's set up that way to isolate you from taking personal liability with corporate decisions. That makes things "interesting" because if she goes after it, it moves to civil court as a third party is introduced unless she has some really valid argument why it is a marital asset. My wife knows very little about my firm and would be chewed apart by a attorney for having any input on the development or growth of the firm. Uglier still, my car's are owned by the company, as are our phone plans, various insurance, etc. All outside the marital assets should there be a division. 

Oddly enough, we set up the firm based on my Dad's old experiences with a philandering partner who was always being divorced. So it is purposely setup to keep spouses from having a claim.


----------



## StickyMess (Dec 7, 2012)

Racer said:


> Not necessarily. I own a family business, and at least here 'personal gifts' are not considered part of the marital assets. My Father gifted me and my sister the shares of stock over a few years; No way can it be interpreted for 'my wife and I'. That is actually typical in a family owned business to escape paying for stock and using the gifting loopholes in the tax code. So it's even documented that it is a gift and accepted and verified by the IRS that way. To me, from my father. On both of our personal tax statements during that transition as well as the corporate taxes. My wife is not mentioned anywhere.
> 
> Furthermore, if it's incorporated, you are an employee of the firm and the firm is considered like it's own 'person' (a third party). It's set up that way to isolate you from taking personal liability with corporate decisions. That makes things "interesting" because if she goes after it, it moves to civil court as a third party is introduced unless she has some really valid argument why it is a marital asset. My wife knows very little about my firm and would be chewed apart by a attorney for having any input on the development or growth of the firm. Uglier still, my car's are owned by the company, as are our phone plans, various insurance, etc. All outside the marital assets should there be a division.
> 
> Oddly enough, we set up the firm based on my Dad's old experiences with a philandering partner who was always being divorced. So it is purposely setup to keep spouses from having a claim.



This could have easily been written by my H... the shares, the cars, the phones, all owned by the corporation. 

I called a couple an attorney yesterday and got references to a few others. I am not sure that I can go through with the appointments but I know that I can't live like this either. We have counseling Thursday afternoon before I pick up my youngest. I need to figure out what I am going to do for the rest of my life. I am only 36.


----------



## alte Dame (Aug 7, 2012)

You are still young. This is not the end of your world. Once you stop feeling helpless - when you are anything but - you will realize how many options life offers you. It is your life to live, not your insensitive, cheating, deceitful WH's. Why should he get to decide how your life plays out? As if he really cares - he's got his mistress, whom he says he loves, installed in his office with him. To say that he isn't the best one to be making decisions about your life is the understatement of the century.

So, when you stop making excuses and start to see that you are a strong, independent woman with options, you will realize that you have a lot of good things ahead of you in life. Start taking charge now.


----------



## harrybrown (May 22, 2013)

Do you think he would wake up if you handed him the divorce papers? What if she was fired? If this is a family business, talk to one of the other owners, this is not good for the business.

I am a part owner of a business, and we do not need that kind of publicity, or lack of attention to the business.


----------



## Racer (Sep 24, 2009)

StickyMess said:


> This could have easily been written by my H... the shares, the cars, the phones, all owned by the corporation..


It isn't all bad news. A good attorney looking over financial statements spread out over a longer period of time could argue 'earning potential' if that business has grown. You will get spousal support and probably primary custody as a stay at home. Talk to an attorney and they can help and inform you better than I can. 

It is not a good reason to not divorce though or talk yourself out of or into anything. 

And as a business owner, there are ways to document and get rid of someone problematic; assigning them work you know they hate for instance or being late or ____. She must go.

He does risk a lawsuit against him by the OW, but then again he created that issue... also, remember the attorney fees to defend the firm will come out of the company coffers. That will also cause 'grief' with family members having to 'dish out' because he stepped way over the line. It will also involve 'airing the dirty laundry' through the family and coming out of the OW's testimony instead of you looking like some vindictive wife. You will look like the victim you are in all this mess he made for everyone. He's going to look bad no matter what spin he makes.


----------



## StickyMess (Dec 7, 2012)

I appreciate the support that you have all provided me. It is a blessing to know that strangers that have walked this road before me can guide me. 

He and I got into an argument on the phone earlier. He has just gotten out of a meeting with OW, and I started to trigger quite badly. I was driving at the time and ended up having to pull over because I could barely breathe. My sister came and picked me up, and her friend drove our van home. 

He was calling me over and over leaving messages about how sorry he was. I said if he was he should put me out of my misery and fire her. He should choose between us. And he said that he can't, legally or emotionally. It is as if though he has already made his decision but refuses to be forthright about it and is trying to make me be the one to leave.


----------



## BWBill (Jan 30, 2013)

I also work for a private company in California. It is structured so that spouses can never own company shares, especially as a result of divorce.

However, under state law spouses are entitled to a share of the value of the interest in the company in the event of the divorce. In practice that has meant an idependent valuation of the partner's interest, and then a structured payout from the partner to the spouse over a period of years.


----------



## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

Here's the thing.
There are lots and lots and lots of very great talking lawyers out there who draft up agreements and terms in contracts and company documents that sound great, will either say you win or loose depending on where you sit, and the case will looked shut and closed.

The thing is, it can all unravel in court, all you need is the right guy on your side and the right judge.

So if you want to address this and go for it, then interview and find the right guy, because everything is negotiable, up to the point that there is an actual law that exists to tell you what is what.


----------



## Acabado (May 13, 2012)

StickyMess said:


> I said if he was he should put me out of my misery and fire her. He should choose between us. And he said that he can't, *legally* or *emotionally*. It is as if though he has already made his decision but refuses to be forthright about it and is trying to make me be the one to leave.


Bingo, you have it right. The red piece is the real issue here, not the legal one.
As I told you earlier he won't choose, he won't make a decision, it has to be you the one to make it.
He's a hard core cake eater. They never choose, the two lives status quo it what works for them. It's always the mistress or the BW the one to take charge and change the situation. He will prolong this as long as he can unless you change it.

The Unified Theory of Cake

This is a blog I highly recommend you to visit.


Friend, he's telling you.
Get mad, shark of a lawyer, hard 180, don't waste anymore money on MC, don't waste a minute more in this abuser.
Use every trick, fake you are going bonkers and about to lose it and blow everything with no regards for nothing so he signs whatever you write over the dotted line.


----------



## jnj express (Mar 28, 2011)

It is time for you to stop allowing him to decide your future

She can be fired---she is morally and ethically breaking the morals part of any standard employment K.

Your H, is just spinning you around

You need to do 2 things---do them now while you have access to marital funds----(it wouldn't hurt if you opened your own acct, and move a good sized portion of the marital funds into your own acct.

File suit agst this other woman, for Int. Inf. of Emot. Dist.---I mentioned it in an earlier post----the key element is outrageous conduct on her part---she is causing problems for you, for the business, for any children you might have ( I didn't pay attn. whether the 2 of you had kids)

This cannot be good for company business if a VP, who is married is carrying on an A, with an employee---so the business also has an interest to shut this down

You should think long and hard about staying with this jerk you call a H---cuz if he TRULY LOVED AND WANTED YOU---the A, would never have started, and certainly it should have come to an end---LONG AGO

It is time for you to use the legal system, to at least get the girl out of your H's workplace----after that it is up to your H, whether, he continues to see her---if he does---you have your answer and it is FOR SURE, time to leave

Beyond that---you have to decide, if you are satisfied with the way he is conducting himself should you agree to a R

This is about one person and one person, only,----YOU

It is about what is best for you--- NO ONE ELSE!!!!!!!


----------

