# My Lord, I’m confused…..



## Depth.Inside (Jul 5, 2012)

Married for Many, Many years. Marriage hasn’t been perfect. I was basically ignored for about 12-13 years. Horrible sex life (decent when it happened but rare), no intimacy, etc. I stayed because I love her. Some questionable behavior by her years ago which she swears on her life was innocent, etc. She is a natural born flirt and loves attention so she plays it up but when she is around me she admits she can be comfortable and just get lazy.

Fast forward, I had the clip and snip after kids, she got off BC. Within a few months it was EXTREMLEY different. She would hit ovulation and hump my legs off for a week straight. Literally, at least 2 times a day for 4-5 days. I’m not complaining, I went years with sex every 2-3 weeks and the majority of the time it being awkward. 

Fast forward to today, our relationship is healthy. Even with our kids, I was to the point where if she left I didn’t care. I do love her but it took me many years to realize I need to love myself too and I do have things to offer. We had an all-night conversation about our relationship and I was to the point where I would have just called it quits and figured everything else out later (happier to be alone). It helps that I’m at the point in my life that my Testosterone took a nose dive (pushing 40) and I’m no longer led by my loins. She claimed that I put too much pressure on her over the years (always asking why she never paid attention to me but did everyone else). She could sense my detachment because I’m literally the only one that put the attention in the marriage with full body massages, kisses, hugs, etc. She did NONE of that unless prompted. Not even the hugs…

The crater moment was after a nice date where she sexied up, down to her choice in underwear, I came in our room to her on her phone. She looked very nervous and put the phone up quickly going back to bed. I tried to initiate (keep in mind sex is better now so it isn’t as awkward to initiate) and she turned me down. That was my “F*** it” moment.” There couldn’t have been a better night for sex. I later looked at her phone and noticed she had been watching porn, and who knows what else she tried to hide from me. I told her I felt useless that she would sexy up, lay in bed and watch porn, and I still couldn’t have her. She denied everything including the porn (which was still on her phone). I was steamed. We watch porn all the time so it’s not a big deal. She just feels like she needs to hide stuff from me and it was the perfect night for stuff like this.

I’m pretty sure she has also taken out a few adds on Craiglist personals. I 110% believe she wouldn’t go through with it, she is all talk, but I think she is playing the part for the ego boost. At the same time we are complete freaks in the bedroom. We would make 90% of people blush. We haven even talked about adding a 3rd or having same room sex with another couple. Keep in mind, this is all talk and will never happen but in the heat of the moment it is good. We also do the full on anal, bondage, spanking, choking, etc. It’s rough…… and good.

Here is the problem…. She still hides that she masturbates from me. She still tries to hide that she watches porn when I’m not there to watch it with her, etc. I am almost positive the craiglist add is from her, etc. At the same time we are having good sex several days a month and she is trying to connect.. but it almost feels too late. It almost feels empty. Sex is pretty good but I finally got most of what I have wanted our entire marriage and now it just feels hollow. She loves on me, coos, makes lovey eyes, etc. and I play along but it’s almost as if I just want her to leave me alone now. I do still like to have sex but I’m at the age now where it doesn’t drive me so I’m fine if we just don’t too.

We have always had adventerous sex, but it is now very crazy, I mean CRAZY. She hit her prime stride and it gets insane (for instance, she would love to be gangbanged). This is literally from one extreme to the next in a VERY shot period of time. I have a whole new issue with it. I went from lack of sex and intimacy to keeping up with her expectations. Truly, she would probably be ok with me saying no but it would cause some serious crap because of how it impacted me for all those years and then me saying no. Again, its sex so it’s not like it’s an issue totally but sometimes it just doesn’t feel right, like I’m putting on a show now. We are doing stuff that I physically will never be able to match up to.

For one, low T is very real and while I can still function as normal it’s not exactly what it was when I was 28-30. On her end she is all too happy to have every toy in her drawer crammed in her and kick-started, in addition to my member. So now I have the issue of a waining erection (and concerns that come with that) and not being able to live up to her crazy drive for almost insane penetration (by normal standards).

It’s all VERY confusing. Thank you for letting me rant. I am tired….


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## Plan 9 from OS (Jul 13, 2012)

How old are you now? Are you pushing 40 you said? Prior to that, I thought you were an older guy. If you are in your 40s and you have low T, I don't think that is typical normal stuff for a guy your age. I'm 40 right now and I can still do daily sex or even a couple times a day. 

If you have not had your T levels checked and you're self diagnosing that your T levels are falling, I would venture a guess that you are fighting a combination of resentment at your wife's now sudden interest in sex plus the fact that she's in control of the sex life.

Who initiated all of the exotic sex acts? Did they all come from her and was it all out of the blue? Or did you two explore this together and mutually showed interest? I would not dismiss the notion that she may have cheated on you or is cheating on you. It may be cybersex and all online stuff, but I think it's possible she's stepping out on you.


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## Young at Heart (Jan 6, 2015)

Depth.Inside said:


> Married for Many, Many years. Marriage hasn’t been perfect. I was basically ignored for about 12-13 years.
> 
> ...I do love her but it took me many years to realize I need to love myself too and I do have things to offer.
> 
> ...


OK, I am 66, been married for 43 years, part of which was in a sex starved marriage. I hear you and think I understand you.

The good news is that you understand that you need to provide for your happiness. It is not fair or healthy to expect your wife to be the total source of your happiness or self esteem.

First, don't overthink things too much. Second forgive her for the things she has done to you in the past. If you really look into them they might not have been as terrible as you made them out to be.

For example, the night she got dressed up all sexy for you and then denied you. Could it be that she had read something about being hard to get to make you even more passionate and make her feel more desired? Could it be that had you not expressed anger/frustration she might have given in and had really planned on having sex with you that night or the following morning? Could the porn that you reacted so strongly and she was ashamed of showing to you been about tease and denial? You will probably never know.

Maybe on the otherhand, there are somethings that just are too threatening to her to admit. Maybe she feels that there is a big void in her knowledge about sex (which is obviously important to her) and she uses porn as a way of getting eductated about new things she wants to try (not the best way to get the information, but..). As to masturbation, lots of people are ashamed to admit that they masturbate. While it really isn't a big deal, you never know what her parents said to her about it or what might have happened to her earlier in her life.

The Craig's List thing is troubling, but I would put that to the side for a while.

Now for the bad news. You have a problem! You are emotionally checking out of (withdrawing from) your marriage. Sex is as much about "making love" and bonding two people into a couple is, as it is about getting physical release. Actually more. She seems to enjoy "playing" (with toys) and playful sex is often the best sex. You have a woman that you will find hard to replace, unless you are now looking for someone who will allow you to hide from your fear of future ED problems.

Yes as a 66 year old man it sometimes takes a bit more to get me in the mood, and yes, as one ages you might not be as "hanginf from the ceiling" vigorous as you were in your 20's, but sex and intimacy are still great, especially with the woman who is the mother of your children and the woman you have shared most of your life with.

I suggest that you find a Gottman Couples weekend or some other kind of couples event that will help the two of you better understand each other and each others needs, FEARS, and desires. You appear to have some fears that are impacting how you act with your W.

Count your blessings, as there are many men who will give so much to have a sexually adventurous wife like yours.

Good luck and Enjoy.


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## Depth.Inside (Jul 5, 2012)

Plan 9 from OS said:


> How old are you now? Are you pushing 40 you said? Prior to that, I thought you were an older guy. If you are in your 40s and you have low T, I don't think that is typical normal stuff for a guy your age. I'm 40 right now and I can still do daily sex or even a couple times a day.
> 
> If you have not had your T levels checked and you're self diagnosing that your T levels are falling, I would venture a guess that you are fighting a combination of resentment at your wife's now sudden interest in sex plus the fact that she's in control of the sex life.
> 
> Who initiated all of the exotic sex acts? Did they all come from her and was it all out of the blue? Or did you two explore this together and mutually showed interest? I would not dismiss the notion that she may have cheated on you or is cheating on you. It may be cybersex and all online stuff, but I think it's possible she's stepping out on you.



Actually I have been diagnosed with low T and yes... it is very common for a guy in his late 30's (including you). I did the research and went to the Dr. im on TRT. In your late 20's it starts to drop for every man. The range is huge and runs from say 300 to over 1,000. I can still, and have always been able to have sex 2-3 times a day. Low T impacts way, way more. My energy level died. I was exhausted, had headaches, etc. However, my member still worked fine. In reality its not what it was at say 25 (when you could carve stone) but it has always worked fine.

The exotic sex act is both of us. We do enjoy it. Years and years of having sex and we are both kinky. The thing that really confuses me, and probably shouldnt, is she now has a hunger (which is natural given her age) where she is over the top. I went most of our marriage without that. When we have crazy sex its great but that part of me that was molded over YEARS of having good sex every once in a and forced sex most of the time so it all gets confusing because her sexuality has peaked and when she is ready she wants it non stop and any way possible (like a horny teen).

I have always questioned her cheating. Im about 99% she has never physically cheated but she does have the need to feel important. She is that person that lights up a room and literally, everyone LOVES her. She is also a natural flirt and flirts with every man she talks with. She is a toucher, etc. Ergo, her need to feel important, wanted, etc. could possibly drive her to have an emotional affair and it wouldnt surprise me. I think her biggest factor is she really wants to know she is sexy (like anyone) but to a fault.


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## Depth.Inside (Jul 5, 2012)

*The Problem here is that there are YEARS of layers I cant express in a post online.*

OK, I am 66, been married for 43 years, part of which was in a sex starved marriage. I hear you and think I understand you.

The good news is that you understand that you need to provide for your happiness. It is not fair or healthy to expect your wife to be the total source of your happiness or self esteem.

*This really should have been simple for me all along. I came from nothing and have worked HARD my entire life. I have fought tooth and nail to have a 6-figure management job in Oil and Gas. Im not a bad looking guy, im fit, im very talented and can literally do about anything. Still, the only approval I ever wanted was hers. Keep in mind that a few months ago i ran into an ex girlfriend that told me if I ever wanted to have an affair she would be on board and 100% quiet about it. She was VERY serious. I waived it off because my wife is everything to me. I have had things like this off and on all through my marriage but never considered myself anything other than a workhorse.*

First, don't overthink things too much. Second forgive her for the things she has done to you in the past. If you really look into them they might not have been as terrible as you made them out to be.

*No... they were that terrible. If back then I have the frame of mind I have now, we wouldnt be married. Its not overplayed in my head. 

I would happily forgive a lot of it. The problem I have is she doesnt think she has done anything wrong. If we talk at all she will cry and say she is sorry. Give it a few days and she starts second guessing and telling me I put too much pressure on her. I watched one time... we went a month without her so much as hugging me. Yet the woman will work, dedicate time to things we arent involved in and work her fingers to the bone, and then go out of the way to do something impressive she can put on facebook so she gets a pat on the back. It was, and still is at times, a total lack of respect. It took the hint of my giving up to bring her to attention.* 

For example, the night she got dressed up all sexy for you and then denied you. Could it be that she had read something about being hard to get to make you even more passionate and make her feel more desired? Could it be that had you not expressed anger/frustration she might have given in and had really planned on having sex with you that night or the following morning? Could the porn that you reacted so strongly and she was ashamed of showing to you been about tease and denial? You will probably never know.

*Actually, she is very blunt. She literally just didnt want to have sex. She wasnt withholding. We are far more experienced than that. I got up in the middle of the night (too mad to sleep) and checked her phone. Porn was still on. The next morning at 5:30 I got in the shower. She joined me about 5-minutes later. I checked her phone again while she blow dried her hair. She had gotten up at 5:30 and cleared everything out, erased her browsing history, closed all apps running in the background, etc. She simply did not want me to see what she was doing. I was a little hurt and asked about it. She told me her phone must have done it all by itself. Bull...... This is not the first time she has lied to me to cover something up.*

Maybe on the otherhand, there are somethings that just are too threatening to her to admit. Maybe she feels that there is a big void in her knowledge about sex (which is obviously important to her) and she uses porn as a way of getting eductated about new things she wants to try (not the best way to get the information, but..). As to masturbation, lots of people are ashamed to admit that they masturbate. While it really isn't a big deal, you never know what her parents said to her about it or what might have happened to her earlier in her life.

*I get the masturbation thing and im actually OK with that. On the otherhand, she is a FREAK (in a good way). There is no ignorance about sex. She likes porn as much as I do and for the very same reason. She watches gang bangs, bondage, some BDSM, etc. When she is in the mood the rougher the better. Its not an ignorance thing. 

As far as her parents, they had a HUGE porn collection up until she was a teen. They thought it was hid but she knew where it was at. They also had all the toys, lingerie, etc. She was never sheltered. Her mom actually put her on BC at 14. *

The Craig's List thing is troubling, but I would put that to the side for a while.

*Yeah, im having a hard time with that. I found craigslist open on our laptop. I do use it to buy stuff locally as well as sale. The problem was, I hadnt been home. I checked the casual encounters page and found a description that matched her almost 100%. I probably went too far but I made a fake yahoo profile and contacted her. 

Two days and nothing. Then one day I hear her in the bathroom with the door closed, clicking away. She didnt know I was in the house. She opened the door and I had walked in our bedroom. She came out and immediately hugged me and I knew something was up. I went outside and checked the ghost account on my phone and sure enough.. there was an email. It was the exact same time as she was in the bathroom. The descriptions were literally exact to our sex life (we have been having sex for 20+ years). 

I answered back and mentioned I had been at walmart in a town about 30 miles away the night before. Keep in mind we actually had been in that walmart the night before. She answered back the next morning while I was at work, "OMG! I was at that walmart that night too!" It almost sealed it for me. She asked for a picture so I pulled a random pic of the net and sent it to her. I asked for a shot of her, she wouldnt send one. Again... I am about 85% certain it was her but once I pushed connecting she dodged it. Thats why I think if it is her, she is doing it for an ego boost but wouldnt commit.* 

Now for the bad news. You have a problem! You are emotionally checking out of (withdrawing from) your marriage. Sex is as much about "making love" and bonding two people into a couple is, as it is about getting physical release. Actually more. She seems to enjoy "playing" (with toys) and playful sex is often the best sex. You have a woman that you will find hard to replace, unless you are now looking for someone who will allow you to hide from your fear of future ED problems.

*Youre preaching to the choir. Im actually not worreid about ED problems. I can still have sex 2-3 times a day, 7 days a week. More her appetite and my need to keep up now that she is the horny one, one week a month. And trust me, I understand the connection. Sex was the only connection she gave me for YEARS.

Here is my biggest issue. For many, many years I wasnt realivant as a partner, or so she made it seem. She even flirted with guys when we went on vacation.. with me standing beside her. She would talk to guys on the phone, in our bedroom, while I sat on the other end of the house (I was NOT happy about this). Way, way too much to list and for years it made me feel very small. I should have quit a looooong time ago. We did end up with two beautiful kids though so it made it all worth it.

The thing of it is, in all of the years of marriage I was a paycheck and bragging rights. I fix things for her and her parents, I did EVERYTHING a good husband does. I gave her undivided attention, never have had a guys night out, etc. All I wanted was the occasional commited respect and for years, I NEVER got it. And I mean that.. I never got respect. Im old enough now to kick myself and ask why did I stay through this. Now, fastfoward and overnight, I have family that hit his midlife and started acting like a nut with cheating, running off, etc. It made for a bad situation. Top that with my, in all seriousness, awakening to the point where I will be ther for her and the kids but the extra mile is long gone... and I think she put 2 and 2 together. She does NOT handle change well. If she had to start over at any point she would fall apart. 

I could get fired tomorrow and be busted and would be OK. It wouldnt be fun, it would be hard, but I would mentally be OK. She would fall apart. So this leaves the question. Is all of this empty and her way of retaining what she has? If its not, why does she still feel the need to hide things from me. If we are going to be open and have a relationship we should have had 20 years ago then why all the lies? Some of these are lies that arent very well hidden. I just have a VERY had time believing that all of a sudden a light bulb came on and everything is actually changing. 

To be fair, that light did come on for me so it is possible. However, after so many years of what I strongly consider degrading-neglect, I highly doubt she is actually a contender for wife of the year. I believe a part of this should win her an Oscar for actress of the month. Cynical? Maybe… but I have too many years of crap to offset it with a couple of months of good behavior. *

Yes as a 66 year old man it sometimes takes a bit more to get me in the mood, and yes, as one ages you might not be as "hanginf from the ceiling" vigorous as you were in your 20's, but sex and intimacy are still great, especially with the woman who is the mother of your children and the woman you have shared most of your life with.

I suggest that you find a Gottman Couples weekend or some other kind of couples event that will help the two of you better understand each other and each others needs, FEARS, and desires. You appear to have some fears that are impacting how you act with your W.

Count your blessings, as there are many men who will give so much to have a sexually adventurous wife like yours.

Good luck and Enjoy.

*I dont disagree. The sexual adventures are great but that is the point. I dont want just sexual adventure, I want connection that is real and not prompted. I have considered counceling but in all honesty, she is so slick with people that it would quickly become one sided. Seriously. I know that sounds hard to believe but she has a dynamic personality that everyone, man or woman, is drawn to. Seriouisly... I cant overplay this. She and her dad both will attracth people to them like flies to honey. Its actually incredible and misserable at the same time. We cant go on a weekend getaway without everyone pouring over my wife. In our small town its the same way and it gets annoying.

At the same time, she has never been truthful in our relationship and still hides things. Put us in a room together asking hard questions... the truth will NOT come out on her end. 

She is something to be proud of. She is hard working, truly a classic beauty, and very talented. She is also a tiger in the sheets. However, if the connection isnt there.... then what? Is it worth it? I dont know... Im not worried about greener grass. Ive questionsed whether getting off the grass for a while and clearning my head of too many years of this would be a better offer. *


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## Givernor (Oct 3, 2014)

DI
I'm intrigued by your story. Mine is a bit different but with some very similar attributes. 

It's not easy to find people to talk to when you in a pretty thin minority.

I'm at work so I can't go into much detail, but I'm also in a veeery long term marriage for my age and struggling to process a very high drive wife combined with all that water under the bridge.

Anyway, remember that everything you write (here or in private) will help you sort through your own take on things.

I hope to revisit this post when I have more time.


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## Depth.Inside (Jul 5, 2012)

I couldnt agree more. Part of what finally broke inside of me was when I was sitting here at the office and started typing in word. I actually do novels and novelas as a hobby so it really started flowing. 

After about 20 minutes it turned into the reasons I hurt and feel neglected. It was simply the ways and things she has done to make me feel useless about me, not the way she failed us. It took that for me to realize there is actually a difference in her missing the boat in some ways and her making me feel usless.

It turned into a 2 hour writing session for me and was pretty profound reading back through the instances. It turned into a letter to her and hit me hard. Good therapy.


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## Young at Heart (Jan 6, 2015)

Depth.Inside said:


> *The Problem here is that there are YEARS of layers I cant express in a post online.*
> 
> 
> *This really should have been simple for me all along. I came from nothing and have worked HARD my entire life. I have fought tooth and nail.... Still, the only approval I ever wanted was hers. ...I have had things like this off and on all through my marriage but never considered myself anything other than a workhorse.*
> ...





Depth.Inside said:


> ...Part of what finally broke inside of me was when I was sitting here at the office and started typing in word...
> 
> After about 20 minutes it turned into the reasons I hurt and feel neglected. It was simply the ways and things she has done to make me feel useless about me, not the way she failed us. It took that for me to realize there is actually a difference in her missing the boat in some ways and her making me feel usless.
> 
> It turned into a 2 hour writing session for me and was pretty profound reading back through the instances. It turned into a letter to her and hit me hard. Good therapy.


Thank you for explaining things more and yes writing is great therapy. I would have never made it through the healing from my SSM without writing my thoughts out and reading them. As you say very theraputic.

It is clear that you want emotional intimacy and respect. If you want to read about that I really like Chapmans the 5 LL, and Schnarch's books Crucible, Passionate Marriage (although they are a hard read). You are successful, a good provider and deserve respect.

I felt the same way. My primary and secondary languages of love (Chapman) are touch and words of affirmation. What I didn't understand about myself was that when my wife withdrew from our marriage because I wasn't meeting her love language needs, I turned to work, where I recieved praise from co-workers and clients. I too have a 6 figure managerial position, but in an energy consulting firm. I got my praise at work, not at home. It caused me withdraw from my marriage and focus on being a good provider. Actually that was what I told myself, I was just seeking respect and praise. 

Ultimately, I realized that I had been abandoning my wife's primary language of love (quality time) and throwing her loving gestures back in her face (her secondary language of love was acts of service, especially have a hot dinner ready for me when I came home--especially when I worked late and didn't come home for dinner.) When I finally realized the dynamic, I decided to try to heal things or if I couldn't move on to a loving relationship rather than stick with a sex starved marriage.

I used some of the ideas in MW Davis book to come up with some 180's that forced my wife to interact with me differently. She use to bait me and create arguments just to keep emotional distance. My 180's included not sexually pursuing her, not getting sucked into fighting with her, but just calmly stating my needs, tell her she was free to do whatever she wanted and I was not going to change her, she was the only person who could change herself.

I was able to find a really great marriage conselor and sex therapist who helped us. Don't ASSUME that a good marriage conselor will be snowed by your wife. My W has a doctorate and high powered job and speaks very well. The PHD Sex Therapist was able to ask my wife questions, and when my wife tried to slide by with an answer, change the topic or confront the therapist, my wife got cut down to size immediately. I have never seen anything like it. 

The Therapist basically asked my wife questions about what my wife wanted out of like. Then if staying married was likely to bring her those things. She then told me wife she was free to do as she pleased, but what did my wife think would happen if we never head sex again? (provide you with respect in your case). Ultimately, my wife said we would probably divorce. The therapist asked me if I had ever thought of divorce. I told her yes, and that I had made a promise to myself that I was going to get the love I deserved by my next birthday either in my marriage to my wife or by getting a divorce and finding someone else. The therapist then said to my wife that she has the choice and responsibility for either being divorced or not. It was totally up to my wife and that the therapist could help her or my wife could fight and avoid the help.

Short version, yes go get some therapy/conseling with your wife. If she won't go, get it for yourself. Also let go of your anger, even if it is appropriate and she deserves it.

good luck.


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