# advice needed about an emotional affair



## countryboy

My wife an i have been married 13 years and have two kids. Recently I figured out and confronted her about an emotional affair she was having with a business partner. I know they met in the fall of 2011. Best I can figure by old texts and voicemails is that it turned into an emotional affair around Christmas and continued until March and that is just a guess. Lots of "I love yous" back and forth and that sort of stuff. She swears that nothing physical happened. As a guy, I can't comprehend that kind of dialogue with nothing physical.

Right now I'm lost on whether continuing to support her business and the interaction required. Out of town trips and so on. We have always had an upfront, totally honest, no game playing marriage. Her character has been beyond reproach until recently which has really been the hardest part.

Am I being naive to let this continue with the promise of its over? Am I being a fool to think that nothing physical occurred? I plan on meeting him soon, while traveling with my wife, with a keep your friends close and you enemies closer strategy. 

My wife says she wants to stay married and is so sorry about hurting me. I believe her, but I can't shake the doubt in the back of my head.


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## keko

Which phone does she has?

Out of town trips is a huge red flag. It likely went physical.


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## countryboy

iphone.

do i continue to question her and keep bringing it up? I mean how many times do i have to ask the same question? its like i can't be satisfied until i confirm that the worst case scenario is the one i'm dealing with.


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## keko

No, keep a low profile until you gather enough evidence to determine if it went physical or not. DO NOT CONFRONT HER WITH EVERY LITTLE EVIDENCE YOU GATHER.

Does she sync her phone to a computer? If she does you can get backup of her texts/deleted texts.

Way to retrieve deleted text messages from iphone - Truth About Deception


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## lordmayhem

countryboy said:


> Am I being naive to let this continue with the promise of its over?


Yes. If there is ONE rule you should know about someone who is in or just had an affair: NEVER believe what they are saying about the affair. In fact, if you believe her promise that it's over, then you're being very foolish. 

Trust but verify.

This means you have to start monitoring her, install keyloggers, get VARs.



countryboy said:


> Am I being a fool to think that nothing physical occurred?


It may or may not have gone PA. You will have to investigate. They will almost always Trickle Truth you.



countryboy said:


> I plan on meeting him soon, while traveling with my wife, with a keep your friends close and you enemies closer strategy.


Wrong strategy. The strategy for killing an affair is to establish No Contact (NC). NC must be established forever.



countryboy said:


> My wife says she wants to stay married and is so sorry about hurting me. I believe her, but I can't shake the doubt in the back of my head.


Of course she wants to stay married. She's the typical cake eating type of cheater.


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## countryboy

i've been restoring her backups to monitor. i am already keeping a journal with all the stuff i've found. my plan forward is to keep a low profile, and shower her with love and weekend getaways. also when the next out of town trip comes up, i'm going to insist going to meet her business partner to show no hard feelings. by gauging reactions, i should be able to make my own assessment.

any other advice?


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## lordmayhem

countryboy said:


> iphone.
> 
> do i continue to question her and keep bringing it up? I mean how many times do i have to ask the same question? its like i can't be satisfied until i confirm that the worst case scenario is the one i'm dealing with.


Then you had better check the iPhone backup file. 










iPhone Backup Extractor for Windows and Mac


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## warlock07

The backups turned out nothing? Review the backups first.


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## countryboy

the back ups turned up i love yous back and forth, but no evidence of a phyical relationship.


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## TDSC60

How many woman who respect their marriage and their husband trade "I love yous" with another man? Then hide it from their husband.

It may have gone physical but it may not have. But if a woman is telling a another man "I love you" odds are that it has gone PA given the opportunity.

Cheater lie. Even when confronted with evidence cheaters will lie and try to make it seem not as bad as it really is. That is the nature of the beast.

You have every reason to be concerned. And forget about how honest and open your wife has been in the past. That woman no longer exists. You are dealing with someone who is totally unknown to you.

Continue snooping and be prepared for what you could find. 

No more out of town trips unless you go with her.

Has she agreed to end ALL contact with this man?


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## Entropy3000

countryboy said:


> My wife an i have been married 13 years and have two kids. Recently I figured out and confronted her about an emotional affair she was having with a business partner. I know they met in the fall of 2011. Best I can figure by old texts and voicemails is that it turned into an emotional affair around Christmas and continued until March and that is just a guess. Lots of "I love yous" back and forth and that sort of stuff. She swears that nothing physical happened. As a guy, I can't comprehend that kind of dialogue with nothing physical.
> 
> Right now I'm lost on whether continuing to support her business and the interaction required. Out of town trips and so on. We have always had an upfront, totally honest, no game playing marriage. Her character has been beyond reproach until recently which has really been the hardest part.
> 
> *Am I being naive to let this continue with the promise of its over?* Am I being a fool to think that nothing physical occurred? I plan on meeting him soon, while traveling with my wife, with a keep your friends close and you enemies closer strategy.
> 
> My wife says she wants to stay married and is so sorry about hurting me. I believe her, but I can't shake the doubt in the back of my head.


She needs to go NC with him forever. If this impacts her business then that is a shame but required.

It is very possible it went physical but an EA is plenty serious. If she was alone with him during this time it is a good bet it did go physical. Right now you cannot work on your marriage until he is out of her life.

So realize that even with you there her seeing him continues the affair.


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## Entropy3000

countryboy said:


> iphone.
> 
> do i continue to question her and keep bringing it up? I mean how many times do i have to ask the same question? its like i can't be satisfied until i confirm that the worst case scenario is the one i'm dealing with.


Right now she has to go NC. That is your focus.

There is no solice in NOT finding evidence of the EA continuing. Essentially he is now an ex. He will be forever a threat for her to sleep with the next time she is on a trip with him. Si do not fool yourself that she has this under control. Sge has been unfaithful already. She must go NC with this guy even if you find nothing. I gett the sense you want to believe her so badly that if you do not find anything now you will allow her to see him on trips. Sigh. Good luck. You have a chance to save your marriage. Don't foolishly let this go.


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## keko

countryboy said:


> the back ups turned up i love yous back and forth, but no evidence of a phyical relationship.


How is your sex life?

How is her work schedule? Is she with OM all the time during work?

Does she come late from work? Work on the weekends? Started wearing sexy lingerie?


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## DanF

Absolutely no contact on her part. If this means quitting her job, so be it.
Do not believe anything she says at this point. Of course she's sorry. Sorry that she got caught.
Tell her that you want to know every single detail in chronological order. Commit it to memory. Question her about it later and see if her answers are consistent. Liars need really good memories and usually forget details or make up too many details.


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## countryboy

keko said:


> How is your sex life?
> 
> How is her work schedule? Is she with OM all the time during work?
> 
> Does she come late from work? Work on the weekends? Started wearing sexy lingerie?


sex life has always been good. we are going on a month dry spell which is a new record. she has been ill for about half that time with a bad upper respiratory infection. She is not with OM during work. Only when traveling out of state does she see him.
No late nights and no work on the weekends. no lingerie.

I literally have no one to talk to about this. Should I seek out a counselor or something?


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## countryboy

thanks for all the advice, i'm going to bed now if i can sleep.


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## keko

You have us to speak/vent.

Most of us have been in your shoes and worse before, our advices will greatly help you.

Do you know the wife of the OM? She might be able to gather some evidence you can't.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## TDSC60

Since you have proof that the EA has been going on for several months, put yourself in the shoes of the OM. Why would he be telling a married woman that he is in love with her? You know the answer - he has one goal in mind and that is not friendship.

If they have gotten together on a trip over the last several months it is almost a certainty that he has made some kind of move on her or at least suggested they should take their "love" to the next level. Have you questioned her about that, if he has tried to talk her into bed?

PA or not, she cannot commit to your marriage if she is still in contact with him. She may want to stay married, but why? So she can keep her babysitter at home while she travels and parties? If you do split will that impact her job?

You have a long road ahead. Do not take the "head in the sand" approach.

If you know his name and address find out if he is married, and if he is, contact his wife. You are now in a fight to save your marriage and family. Don't hold back.


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## Kallan Pavithran

Did you exposed the A to his wife?

They are in love and you are allowing them to be alone together.Really......
What will you do if you get your married AP alone for a trip together? will you talk all night and say goodnight and go to sleep in your room?


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## Humble Pie

countryboy said:


> My wife an i have been married 13 years and have two kids. Recently I figured out and confronted her about an emotional affair she was having with a business partner. I know they met in the fall of 2011. Best I can figure by old texts and voicemails is that it turned into an emotional affair around Christmas and continued until March and that is just a guess. Lots of "I love yous" back and forth and that sort of stuff. She swears that nothing physical happened. As a guy, I can't comprehend that kind of dialogue with nothing physical.
> 
> Right now I'm lost on whether continuing to support her business and the interaction required. Out of town trips and so on. We have always had an upfront, totally honest, no game playing marriage. Her character has been beyond reproach until recently which has really been the hardest part.
> 
> Am I being naive to let this continue with the promise of its over? Am I being a fool to think that nothing physical occurred? I plan on meeting him soon, while traveling with my wife, with a keep your friends close and you enemies closer strategy.
> 
> My wife says she wants to stay married and is so sorry about hurting me. I believe her, but I can't shake the doubt in the back of my head.


how many "i love yous" are there? is there anything else that grabbed your attention from the exchange of communication? How did her voice sound on the voice messages- sexual, lustful, etc?

Also, you say they are business partners... has the business been a succesful one? maybe during the whole profiting of the business dealings, they have become very close "as partners" and the I love you's aren't anything sexual but mutual successful business people resulting from their profitable experience. I dont know if that makes sense?? 

Anyhow, yes the I love you is inappropriate, but you need to be sure in what context these words are being used in. In any relationship outside of marriage, no woman or man should express these words, but it might be harmless banter used after closing a big deal (in their business).


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## OldWolf57

you do not owe him a no hard feelings speech. he sent I love you's to your wife. NO, she cannot have anymore dealings with this man. So you need to grow up and lay it down to her. Her business takes her away from home, well its time to hire sales people. can't afford it. to bad. Oh, have you seen the Doc report about the breathing problems, is that what she said ?? Is her medication over the counter, or perscribed.


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## sigma1299

cb, I had an EA very similar to this and if left unchecked it's catastrophic. Your wife thinks she is in love with this guy!! Mine never went physical, we had plenty of sex, but we were never actually in each others presence. Could your wife's have gone PA, absolutely if they had proximity. If they were saying ILY and had the ability it's more likely than not. In reality it doesn't make a whole lot of difference on her end (on yours I understand it's huge) your response and plan are the same. 

If you both want to save your marriage she has to go total no contact, it has to effectively be for her like the OM died. No contact must be that absolute. There is no negotiating or plan B on this. Remember she thinks she's in love with this guy, there isn't room for both of you so you better be damn sure the OM is thoroughly and completely kicked out of her life consequences be damned. 

Don't pay too much attention to what she says, as has been said, cheaters lie (remember I've been there). Pay attention to her actions they will tell you much more. I cannot overly emphasize how serious this is having been neck deep in one. Do not treat it any less seriously or with any less urgency because you currently think it didn't go PA. Your wife has let another man into her heart, that's a big deal. 

For what it's worth, just so you know it is possible to recover from this. Today my wife and I have a better marriage than we did before my EA. it's a long tough road for both of you but don't give up because it is possible. Fight for your marriage!!


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## countryboy

So what if she refuses the nc demand?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Humble Pie

I am puzzled why you have not met this "buisness partner" of your wifes yet... strange


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## countryboy

Humble Pie said:


> then you will have to change the ticket to next week.


I'm not following.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## countryboy

Humble Pie said:


> I am puzzled why you have not met this "buisness partner" of your wifes yet... strange


He lives out of state. They met at a conference and has opened doors into their niche market.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## keko

So she met some random dude over state and started saying I luv u's to each other. Im sure you know how far their relationship is.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## countryboy

keko said:


> So she met some random dude over state and started saying I luv u's to each other. Im sure you know how far their relationship is.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I'm assuming worse yes. 
What is the play when she refuses the NC?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Humble Pie

Is this business profitbable, I mean if you request her to just stop her business would that greatly affect your financial situation?

This is gonna be a tough one if she refuses no contact, and even if she does agree with you, she travels out of town, how can you possible keep tabs on her then. 

One thing I have not read regarding your thread is why you wife started the EA. You said she has stopped since March, but did you get to understand from her why she started?


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## Humble Pie

If she refuses NC, is it possible to travel with her on business trips? How often does she travel?


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## Eli-Zor

It's not a case of if she refuses NC , she will refuse or will take it underground . Shut the business down , the OM thinks he has a draw card by opening new opportunities , that soon dissappears when the affair is make public to their clients.

Choose , your marriage or her business . Any form of rationalising why her business may be important says go to a D lawyer now as your marriage is over.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Will_Kane

Tell her if she refuses NC, you file for divorce. Then do it.

She sounds like she is used to getting her way with you, that she usually wins out and you give in.

She will fight to continue her affair. She will believe she can manipulate you into allowing it. Sometimes, in this type of situation, only the filing for divorce snaps them out of it and makes them realize they have to stop, that you can no longer be manipulated.

In addition to filing for divorce, expose the affair to your family and hers and to the other man's wife/girlfriend/family. Once exposed, the family members help the affair to end. Only after the affair has ended does the cheater start to come out of the fog and begin to want to work on reconciling.

You also must accept the fact that no matter what you do, you may lose your marriage. You have to be willing to lose your marriage in order to save it.


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## countryboy

Humble Pie said:


> Is this business profitbable, I mean if you request her to just stop her business would that greatly affect your financial situation?
> 
> This is gonna be a tough one if she refuses no contact, and even if she does agree with you, she travels out of town, how can you possible keep tabs on her then.
> 
> One thing I have not read regarding your thread is why you wife started the EA. You said she has stopped since March, but did you get to understand from her why she started?


We've been in a romantic rut for a while. I thought everything was fine. Just a downswing in romance that comes with 13 years.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## keko

countryboy said:


> I'm assuming worse yes.
> 
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Can you reconcile if you found out she was having a physical affair or no?


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## countryboy

Business is just getting off the ground so not a big financial hit. How do u file for divorce with no money?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## countryboy

keko said:


> Can you reconcile if you found out she was having a physical affair or no?


I can.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Will_Kane

Cheaters follow a script. It really is amazing how similar they all act. Your wife is following the script to a T. Your wife is at the point in the script where she lies and minimizes what happend so that she can continue the affair.

Betrayed spouses also follow a script. It is to minimize and reason away through any implausible explanation they can get their hands on that their cheating spouse's affair wasn't physical, didn't mean that much, has ended, etc., and the marriage is ready to resume as normal. You seem to be at that point in the script right now. What have been your wife's consequences for having an affair? She had to put up with aruguing with you for a night? That's it? Now she gets to go on her merry way as if nothing has happened, and you are stuck constantly thinking about it, wondering about the details, wondering if it is over.

If you and your wife continue to follow these scripts, the ending will not be a happy one for you.

*"also when the next out of town trip comes up, i'm going to insist going to meet her business partner to show no hard feelings. by gauging reactions, i should be able to make my own assessment. any other advice? "*

This is exactly the wrong thing to do.

Confront your wife. Assume her story about the affair not being physical is a lie. If she exchanged "I love you's" and had the opportunity to have sex with the other man, assume she did.

Cheaters lie. Assume all your wife's words are lies. Believe them only when backed up by her actions. Help her to stop lying. Stop believing her stories that don't make any sense. It does not make sense that two people are exchanging "I love you's," breaking their vows, lying about it, hiding it, but not having sex.

No sex for a month is a red flag, respiratory infection or not. Likely she is being loyal to the other man, saving herself for him.

Tell your wife that you demand the following in order to reconcile: complete honesty about the affair. Tell her that this is her chance to come clean, if you later find out she is not giving you the full truth, you will file for divorce. Tell her she must end all contact with the other man. Tell her she must give you complete access to all her communication devices and accounts and let you know her whereabouts 24/7. Tell her she must not delete any messages going forward. If she refuses these conditions, file for divorce. You can always stop the process later if she agrees to your conditions. 

Dragging these things out just results in more pain for you while your cheating wife tries to make up her mind. What she would like is to have her other man out of town for sex and you at home for finances, stability, housekeeping, and babysitting.


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## Will_Kane

*How do u file for divorce with no money?*

Consult an attorney. Ask about the money situation. You are not unique, others are in your situation regarding lack of money to divorce, but fewer assets make divorce much simpler and less costly.

You can get documents to file on your own from the Internet or from the county courthouse for a very small fee.


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## Almostrecovered

a few things

read the newbie link in my signature please

-she should be writing a NC letter that gets mailed by registered mail

-you should be investigating the OM, if he is married then you find his wife and give her the proof of the affair, she deserves to know. Another possibility is to tell his work place that he used company expenses to conduct in an extramarital affair. (if it gets him canned or taken off of business trips then it could prevent your wife from quitting, but business travel is painful during R of infidelity. It will drive you nuts)

-most initial attorney consultations are free, it doesnt hurt to know your options

- see your doctor as this is the most stressful time of your life and it doesnt hurt to go on meds for a short period of time for the anxiety/depression

-imo she needs to do the following for you to have a successful R

1) No contact with OM whatsoever. If he contacts her then she must ignore it and tell you of it right away. Block him in whatever ways possible like phone and email and facebook.

2) Your wife must be completely transparent. She gives up all passwords, lets you look at her phone and tells you of her whereabouts whenever necessary. In the background you should also snoop with at least a keylogger and other ways to verify her actions.

3) She shows 100% remorse. Accepts full responsibility of the affair, does not blameshift, trickle truth or gaslight. She answers all of your questions and does what we call the heavy lifting to help you heal. 

4) You spend 10-15 hours of one on one time alone a week. (not TV watching)


I believe if you cant fulfill the above requirements you are just spinning your wheels until the marriage dies.


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## keko

countryboy said:


> I can.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Do you want to find out if she has been physical so far?

When you read her text's did you find anything that would suggest they had met? Or if they were talking about something without mentioning it?


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## Shaggy

Sorry but it's gone physical. If they met up in late 2011 and they are exchanging I love yous over text then the no doubt have been hooking up physically when she's travelling. She's got way too easy of opportunity to do that, and that is what you do with someone you love isn't it?

If you left her go on more trips without any checking up you're being naive.

I think you should go back and check her hotel receipts for those previous trips. Look for how many people are listed on the room, also look for missing hotel stays. The would hr her sharung hid room. 

I dont see how the marriage can coexist with her continuing any contact with him.

You might hire a PI to watch her during the trip, as well as turn on find my iPhone on her phone, you'll also need the apple iTunes password for the account she's using for the phone.

Another thing you can do is check the text and call times with him to see if there are texts/calls followed by a dark period in the evening that's unusuall from her usual pattern when she's on a trip. That would likely be when they've been together.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## lordmayhem

TDSC60 said:


> It may have gone physical but it may not have. But if a woman is telling a another man "I love you" odds are that it has gone PA given the opportunity.


:iagree:

Absolutely postively believe this. If my OM was even in the country, much less local, I know for a fact that my fWW would have been banging his brains out from the messages I saw.


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## bandit.45

Does his situation sound familiar to anyone you all know?

Countryboy your story parallels mine. Follow my profile and read my threads. 

You cannot waste any more time. She is having a PA and is stringing you along. This is normal. The lack of sex in the last month indicates you have been replaced. 

Call a lawyer.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## lordmayhem

Shaggy said:


> You might hire a PI to watch her during the trip, as well as turn on find my iPhone on her phone, you'll also need the apple iTunes password for the account she's using for the phone.


:iagree:

If you have the email address and password, then log in to

https://www.icloud.com


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## keko

When is her next trip?


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## iheartlife

countryboy, I'm sorry you're here.
My husband was in a long-term EA with someone who was a co-worker during the beginning of their relationship. You have received good advice and I'm glad you are not burying your head in the sand--sadly this is the first reaction many spouses have because they can't imagine their spouse would do such a hurtful thing.

Here's what I want to emphasize--it's been said already, but still:
Cheaters LIE. In order to do what she has done, she had to create a separate, compartmentalized, secret, fantasy life, far away from you.

You could see the symptoms in the distance between you. That mean she was making HIM her confidant, and obviously the business stuff was just the means of establishing initial commonality. She was turning to him for nearly everything in terms of emotional support and validation.

Here is what often happens in these situations: the loyal spouse confronts. The cheater says nothing happened, it was just I was so lonely and he supported me, I promise to break off all contact. The betrayed spouse isn't thinking about all the time that their spouse has been in the affair, slowly transforming who they are. They are thinking about the best friend who they married. And they don't want the marriage to end.

So what does the loyal spouse do at this very critical juncture?

They believe the cheater.

But what happened in my case, and the case of hundreds, thousands of others, is that the cheater just takes it deeper. They are not ready to end things so abruptly. Remember, they "LOVE" this person. It is a false, immature and shallow kind of love. But they experience it as the powerful sensation of love. Are they going to drop this wonderful thing that they think rescued them from the humdrum of every day life?

You know the answer.

As they float away in their fantasy bubble, only one thing will work to make them come down with a bump. That is cold hard reality. It's seeing their name on official legal documents requesting a court for divorce. It's hearing their "loved one" telling them they are dumping them because their spouse was told (by you) about the EA and the "loved one" isn't about to wreck THEIR marriage over these shenanigans. It's hearing your mom or dad tell you how disappointed they are in you that you would throw away 13 years of marriage for a travelling salesman who in actuality, they barely know.

I am happily reconciling with my husband, but I didn't understand infidelity and the powerful hold it locks onto your spouse. That cost us YEARS of time. Please educate yourself and make careful, thoughtful choices. Emotional reactions will not serve your goals right now.


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## Entropy3000

countryboy said:


> I'm assuming worse yes.
> What is the play when she refuses the NC?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


It means she has chosen him over you. You tell her this is unacceptable and that you will not live in an open marriage. See a lawyer.


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## countryboy

I am going to demand NC. If refused then lawyer will be called.

Next trip is in two weeks. I plan on going...she doesn't know yet.

What is the consensus on just calling OM out of the blue and ask him if he is screwing my wife?


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## keko

countryboy said:


> I am going to demand NC. If refused then lawyer will be called.
> 
> Next trip is in two weeks. I plan on going...she doesn't know yet.
> 
> What is the consensus on just calling OM out of the blue and ask him if he is screwing my wife?


If he is, why would you expect him to be honest with his lover's husband? Dont waste your time and humiliate yourself.

Instead of going you can plant a hidden VAR in her purse and put a PI to follow them around.


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## Onmyway

countryboy said:


> I am going to demand NC. If refused then lawyer will be called.
> 
> Next trip is in two weeks. I plan on going...she doesn't know yet.
> 
> What is the consensus on just calling OM out of the blue and ask him if he is screwing my wife?


My wife's OM still hung around me sometimes, before, during and after the A ended. Granted, he avoided being around me much, particularly without my wife or his friends there as well. Around a month after the A ended he would go out with me alone and let me buy him a beer or two, probably chuckling inside the whole time.

Why do you think a guy that you don't know will tell you the truth? I don't trust anyone now, even guys I do know, women either for that matter.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## iheartlife

countryboy said:


> What is the consensus on just calling OM out of the blue and ask him if he is screwing my wife?


I know you're dying to do this.

There's a thread on the board right now where the OP (i.e., you) just went yesterday and confronted the OM.

The OM lived up to his end of the bargain. Trickle-truthed (i.e., spun a story that had holes, holes were pointed out, so he gave up a little more, and on and on) but would never admit to anything substantial.

So hours later, the OP is still disturbed by the conversation, because he let the OM into his head. And he didn't get any closer to the truth.

This man has been laughing at you behind your back for months and months. How is a conversation with him going to do you ANY good? Help him get his story straight so he can lie to his wife if he has one?

Let it play out as a fantasy in your mind and leave it at that.

Now, talking to his spouse, if he has one, that is something toward which it's worthwhile to direct some energy. What is your thinking about that?


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## Shaggy

Don't waste anytime talking to the OM. He will only lie lie lie and then run to your wife.

You should consider not telling her you are going on the trip, but show up couple of hours later and watch who she is meeting up with. Better yet, hire a PI and drop VARs in her car.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Chaparral

The OM and your wife traded I love yous. Does he have a wife and do you have her contact info yet? This is curcial info.

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/32002-welcome-tam-cwi-newbies-please-read-3.html

Married Man Sex Life | How to have the marriage you thought you were going to have. By which I mean doing it like rabbits.

This is a blog and more improtantly a book you need to order today. You may be able to download the book, not sure though.


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## countryboy

he does not have a wife.

what about pumping her friend for information. i have leverage on her in that i know that she had a brief affair several months ago. i'm pissed now and ready to take down anyone that had knowledge of this.


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## keko

countryboy said:


> he does not have a wife.
> 
> what about pumping her friend for information. i have leverage on her in that i know that she had a brief affair several months ago. i'm pissed now and ready to take down anyone that had knowledge of this.


It is very likely she'll call your wife right after you leave. But if you have enough leverage give it a shot. Did she expose her affair to her husband?


----------



## Chaparral

countryboy said:


> he does not have a wife.
> 
> what about pumping her friend for information. i have leverage on her in that i know that she had a brief affair several months ago. i'm pissed now and ready to take down anyone that had knowledge of this.


I would. Does her husband know about the affair she had? He should be told.


----------



## Chaparral

Anyone that knows about an affair that doesn't out the affair is just supporting the affair. If she had been outed and your wife saw the consequences, she may have chosen a different path.


----------



## countryboy

no she never told him.

i just found the most condemning evidence yet. do i confront over the phone or wait until the ride home from airport tomorrow.


----------



## Eli-Zor

countryboy said:


> no she never told him.
> 
> i just found the most condemning evidence yet. do i confront over the phone or wait until the ride home from airport tomorrow.


Wait till she is with you.

If this is firm evidence first out the OM to his friends, family , significant other then deal with your wife . Do this in a short space of time , you must make the OM's life very uncomfortable and ensure your wife does not have him in a plan that allows her to run to him.

Read the newbie thread it gives you an exposure process to follow
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## warlock07

Did you find out that it was physical? What kind of proof ? There was one WS that deleted all evidence when the H confronted too early. How long till she gets back?


----------



## Eli-Zor

warlock07 said:


> Did you find out that it was physical? What kind of proof ? There was one WS that deleted all evidence when the H confronted too early. How long till she gets back?


Indeed , make sure you have hard copies secured where she can't find them .
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## countryboy

at this point i don't care EA or PA. 3 emails all within the this month professing love. last email was a wedding package inquiry from some fancy inn. they were all from him. i'm giving her one change to NC his ass then I'm done. I can't take this.


----------



## keko

If she loves him, you're hoping for a lost cause.

Cut your loses, expose, move on.


----------



## Chaparral

Send her a text and tell her you heard she was getting married.


----------



## countryboy

chapparal said:


> Send her a text and tell her you heard she was getting married.


i think i'm waiting for the morning ride from the airport to do that


----------



## countryboy

when do i send it to her family and let them know what is going on? do i at least give her the chance to commit to a NC with OM?


----------



## keko

She is currently away with OM? Any emails indicate this time period? Can you check her bank account/credit cards statements?


----------



## keko

countryboy said:


> when do i send it to her family and let them know what is going on? do i at least give her the chance to commit to a NC with OM?


Depends on her reactions when you tell her you know she is cheating and how she responds to stop working with OM. If she gets on her knees and begs, then yes give her another chance. If she ask's for sometime to think it over show her the door.


----------



## countryboy

keko said:


> She is currently away with OM? Any emails indicate this time period? Can you check her bank account/credit cards statements?


yes it is a training seminar. just found the emails.


----------



## Chaparral

countryboy said:


> when do i send it to her family and let them know what is going on? do i at least give her the chance to commit to a NC with OM?


You should probaly wait until right after you talk with her. If you tell them before, they will contact her and she will have a good story lined up. She has no idea you suspect her , right?


----------



## keko

countryboy said:


> yes it is a training seminar. just found the emails.


Can you call their hotel if they have seperate rooms or only one?

For example can you connect me to Mr. X few minutes later, can you connect me to Mrs. Y.


----------



## Eli-Zor

I suggest you spend this time to track down his family and friends, even Facebook. Do what you must do to make this affair very unpleasant. 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## countryboy

chapparal said:


> You should probaly wait until right after you talk with her. If you tell them before, they will contact her and she will have a good story lined up. She has no idea you suspect her , right?


she knows i suspect, but i think she is under the impression that i have forgiven her bc it was just a mistake, EA and they both agreed it was over. obviously that is not the case.


----------



## bryanp

If the roles were reversed do you think she would put up with such humiliation and disrespect from you? If you do not respect yourself then who will?


----------



## Chaparral

countryboy said:


> she knows i suspect, but i think she is under the impression that i have forgiven her bc it was just a mistake, EA and they both agreed it was over. obviously that is not the case.


If you hae that good of proof I would text her and tell her I don't see any point in her coming home.


----------



## countryboy

Eli-Zor said:


> I suggest you spend this time to track down his family and friends, even Facebook. Do what you must do to make this affair very unpleasant.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


he has no family. friends are all cops so they are probably high fiving. only advantage i have is info, the kids and the fact we are 11 hours away and don't have any money.

she isn't allowed to take the kids out of state without my permission is she?


----------



## Eli-Zor

countryboy said:


> yes it is a training seminar. just found the emails.


As it may well be however these seminars are great place to enhance the affair
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## keko

countryboy said:


> he has no family. friends are all cops so they are probably high fiving. only advantage i have is info, the kids and the fact we are 11 hours away and don't have any money.
> 
> she isn't allowed to take the kids out of state without my permission is she?


If he is that far away and doesn't have a spouse, exposing him wont make much difference to him. You have to expose your wife to all of your/her family and friends.

I still believe you should gather some more evidence, but that's just me.


----------



## Eli-Zor

countryboy said:


> he has no family. friends are all cops so they are probably high fiving. only advantage i have is info, the kids and the fact we are 11 hours away and don't have any money.
> 
> she isn't allowed to take the kids out of state without my permission is she?


I think your giving up to easily, he is very likely to have more than cop friends plus he has clients . His friends will not be high fiving when an exposure mail goes out , they may try intimidate you but I assure you he will be a topic of conversation and the more they talk the more people will start disliking him.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## countryboy

Eli-Zor said:


> I think your giving up to easily, he is very likely to have more than cop friends plus he has clients . His friends will not be high fiving when an exposure mail goes out , they may try intimidate you but I assure you he will be a topic of conversation and the more they talk the more people will start disliking him.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


i will do that if she refuses to cut ties with him and that business.


----------



## Eli-Zor

You have a short time to plan, read the newbie thread and get your process right. Exposure to his friends can always be started with "As you may already be aware."

These friends will more than likey have wives , do you seriously think these wives will want their husbands around a man who is in an affair , they would be watching their own spouses.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## warlock07

Plans to wed? It is PA alright...


----------



## keko

Countryboy,

Find out which room they stayed at, if they stayed in one room then upon her returning give her a paper with the hotel room number and have her confess on the drive back.


----------



## Eli-Zor

warlock07 said:


> Plans to wed? It is PA alright...


Another reason to expose this guy far and wide , single OM's are bad news. Cheatersville sounds like a good option.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Eli-Zor

I would also not show her the door , yet . Not until you know the OM is out of the picture . By all means if the confrontation goes bad then file , if she behaves badley at home then ask her to leave . Understand that for most affairs where there is a single OM waiting the wayward wife runs to them so kicking your wife out may backfire . If you understand this and have no option but to have her move out you must go dark and start the D process.

Your remaining silent coupled to the exposures will cause grief in her life and may cause her to refocus on your marriage.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## keko

Another idea, 

Give a call to their room and if ONLY OM picks up the phone, ask to speak to Mrs. X. When she answer's ask her how the wedding is going and when she is planning to come back to you.


----------



## Eli-Zor

countryboy said:


> she isn't allowed to take the kids out of state without my permission is she?


If this is a concern , speak to a lawyer, they may recommend you file simply to lock down any movement of the children. If she leaves home she leaves the children with you, mention you will be filing for full custody. Don't enter into a legal debate with her over this , it is all part of upping the pressure.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Shaggy

keko said:


> Another idea,
> 
> Give a call to their room and if ONLY OM picks up the phone, ask to speak to Mrs. X. When she answer's ask her how the wedding is going and when she is planning to come back to you.


I like this much. It will make her really panic and ruin her big end of trip evening,
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## the guy

Sorry guys ...coming in late....is OP a where of the "just let them go" thread, and the 180?????

Sh!t load of pages here for just a couple of days.....so I imagine OP is up to speed about exposure??


----------



## lordmayhem

countryboy said:


> she isn't allowed to take the kids out of state without my permission is she?


If there is no child custody order signed by a judge, she CAN take them out of state and there's nothing you can do about it. This is why I always recommend that the BS get at least a temporary child custody order/agreement as soon as possible.

I get these types of calls all the time, with the BS asking what the police can do. Nothing unless there's a child custody order in place.


----------



## countryboy

chapparal said:


> If you hae that good of proof I would text her and tell her I don't see any point in her coming home.


I think my two kids r a big point in her coming home.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Chaparral

lordmayhem said:


> If there is no child custody order signed by a judge, she CAN take them out of state and there's nothing you can do about it. This is why I always recommend that the BS get at least a temporary child custody order/agreement as soon as possible.
> 
> I get these types of calls all the time, with the BS asking what the police can do. Nothing unless there's a child custody order in place.


If you can, get this done before she gets back. The most important thing is making sure she knows how serious this/you are.

So sorry you're family is going through this. If you follow the consensus here at TAM you will have a much better chance at saving your family. People that don't, end up with an epic fail almost every single time. I'm not saying you can definitely save the situation but this is pretty much your only shot.

Protect your kids

Cofront your wife if you have proof

Out her to family and close friends

Again sorry you are here. Prayers for your family and good luck.


----------



## Chaparral

lordmayhem said:


> If there is no child custody order signed by a judge, she CAN take them out of state and there's nothing you can do about it. This is why I always recommend that the BS get at least a temporary child custody order/agreement as soon as possible.
> 
> I get these types of calls all the time, with the BS asking what the police can do. Nothing unless there's a child custody order in place.


I tried to find a post you made that I called "detective work" in my favorites. That thread evidently has been pulled. Have you made a list of things to do in order to find proof of cheating?


----------



## countryboy

the guy said:


> ...so I imagine OP is up to speed about exposure??


where is the newbie sticky about exposure.


----------



## TDSC60

countryboy said:


> at this point i don't care EA or PA. 3 emails all within the this month professing love. last email was a wedding package inquiry from some fancy inn. they were all from him. i'm giving her one change to NC his ass then I'm done. I can't take this.


Did she respond to the emails about the wedding package from the fancy Inn?

Even if she did not respond, the fact that she feels she must continue this relationship with a man who is clearly trying to get her to abandon you and your kids is so far across the line of appropriate behavior for a married woman it is unbelievable.

Coupled with everything else - she has checked out of the marriage. You are now her babysitter while she continues her fantasy live with her lover.

One shot a NC and then divorce if she does not agree. By the way, NC must include zero trips out of town for the future unless you can go along.


----------



## keko

Exposure advice:

Exposure targets
Parents of all concerned, family, close friends, children of the BS, workplace [if a workplace affair], spouse of the OP, pastor. Facebook friends of OP.

Exposure Timing
Exposure should be done immediately. The longer you wait, the more entrenched the affair becomes. There is never any “perfect” time to expose, so don’t delay while looking for an imaginary perfect time.

Expose on the SAME DAY – or as close as possible – in order to achieve a tsunami effect. The affairees should be completely taken by surprise. Doing this creates a powerful hit on the affair and prevents the affairees from pre-empting you

Exposure Tactics

Spouse of affair partner- Give your full name, phone # and email address. Tell the other BS all about the affair, offer to share all evidence with him/her. Offer to follow up to ensure that contact is truly ended and ask the other BS to do the same. The other BS will be shocked when you tell him, so be sure and give your email address and phone # for follow up questions. ALWAYS GIVE THE OTHER BS YOUR WS'S PHONE # IN CASE HE/SHE WANTS TO CALL.

Parents, close family, friends – Tell them about the affair, giving them names, general timelines, etc. Explain you are attempting to save your marriage and would be willing to forgive your WS if he/she ended the affair. Ask them to use their influence to persuade the WS to end her affair. A way to save time is to call both sets of parents and send an email to the other close family and friends. Template letter posted below

Parents of OP. Give your full name and explain why you are calling. Ask them to use their influence with their son/daughter to persuade them to leave your spouse alone. It might also help if the PARENT of the WS calls them too.

Workplace exposure: Expose to Director of Human Resources, a key VP and both of the affairee’s supervisors using the template letter posted below.

Facebook exposure: Should be done to the OP’s facebook friends via private message. This is a very, very effective exposure because it is a collection of the OP’s closest friends and family. SPACE THE PM’S OUT 60 SECONDS APART SO FB DOES NOT SHUT YOU DOWN FOR FLOODING. Before you begin, copy and paste all the contacts into a WORD doc. Change your fb picture to a picture of you and your spouse and children. Template letters posted below.

The Fallout
Expect your spouse to be FURIOUS and to make all manner of threats, “I was going to work on the marriage, now I am not!!” “I cannot trust you” “You have to pack and leave!!” “You have ruined any chance you had!!” Do not let this bother you!! Just imagine that you have taken the crackpipe away from the crack head. Of course they are angry. But it will blow over. Don’t laugh, don’t fight, don't attempt to reason with them, and most of all, don’t be SCARED! Your marriage can survive some temporary anger, it cannot survive an ongoing affair! The madder your WS, the harder you hit the target!

The goal is to save your marriage, NOT to avoid your wayward spouse's anger at all costs.

Just say, "I am so sorry you are upset.

Common Exposure Mistakes

Telling the WS that you got the idea to expose on the internet rather than taking ownership of your actions. Then the discussion becomes “who???” When the WS is told it was Marriage Builders, the WS is forever jaundiced against Marriage Builders, which harms future recovery chances. You need to OWN IT. Saying somebody told you to do it does not work for 5 year olds and it won’t work for you!

Keeping exposure a secret. Yes, you read right. But we have had exposure targets say “ok, I will keep this a secret!!” And they never tell the WS they know. That defeats the entire purpose. If that person won’t help you by speaking to your WS, at least TELL the WS that person knows.


Doing trickle exposures. Meaning exposing to just a few people but not to everyone that could have an influence. Trickle exposures are a disaster because they are not enough to kill the affair but just enough to infuriate the WS enough to come after the BS. So the exposure essentially only served to beat down the already beaten BS for no benefit.

Eliminating exposure targets because that person “has no influence over my WS” even though this is a person with long history over the WS. Such as a mother or father. Such targets cannot be dismissed on such a subjective basis because the BS CANNOT PREDICT WHO WILL OR WON’T HAVE AN INFLUENCE OVER THE WS. Sorry, but unless you are psychic and your name is Madame Cleo, you don’t know. Many WS are estranged from a parent, sibling, pastor but that is not a knock out factor.

Threatening to expose. Using exposure as a threat only serves to forewarn the affairees and cause them to go further underground. All you have achieved is to give the enemy your battle plan so they can come back and kick your rear tomorrow. It also gives them an opportunity to pre-empt you and tell others you are “crazy” “jealous”. Then then when you do expose no one will take you seriously. Threatening to expose is the equivalent of giving your battle plan to the enemy. Don't do that!


----------



## morituri

countryboy said:


> where is the newbie sticky about exposure.


Click on this http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping...e-tam-cwi-newbies-please-read.html#post430739.


----------



## lovelygirl

I don't understand how there could be a chance for her to get back with you when she has already said "I love you" to someone else.
If she's really into him then how can "I love you" change into "I don't love him anymore" the next day when you confront her about this.
It doesn't switch from one to another by pressing the button.

She either loves him or she doesn't, but chances are the SHE LOVES HIM.
That's why I think taking her back won't make it work because obviously she will lie to you and pretend like she's sorry.


----------



## lovelygirl

double post.


----------



## iheartlife

My husband told his AP that he loved her, that she was his soulmate, that she was the love of his life, that she was his best friend in the whole world.

But that was in the throes of infatuation. It never went anywhere.

He is fully with me now (he never left, except in spirit), we are entirely recommitted and reconciling. He tells me every day how much he loves me.

I think he sees now that it was a powerful infatuation. But he was able to understand that his relationship with her had never been tested, it was all just empty affirmations, no real world problems that bring incompatibilities to light.

He also realized that if she could cheat on her husband, she could cheat on him too. That he couldn't fully trust her.

It can happen, you can pull it back from the brink.

I realize not everyone WANTS someone after something like this happens with their spouse. The only reason I'm with him is that the person I married is back in a new and improved version.


SAYING "I love you" is a far cry from actually showing true, real-world love to someone.


----------



## Shaggy

Or pick her up and drive to a motel 6 and park, tell her she can stay here until , mention him by name, can pick her up.

But, she can't stay long because the joint credit card has been cancelled,
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## jinba

Don't be duped like I was. My H had an affair with my best friend (ex best friend now of course). They were "just friends", but gifts she'd given him kept showing up, as well as a new bathing suit (they apparently were going to the beach together), wine glasses, a corkscrew, etc. When I discovered all of these things I was told there was no physical relationship - he swore to it ... but I found out otherwise 10 years later.

If there's been no physical contact, it's only a matter of time before there is. You need to nip this in the bud immediately and demand NC. If this impacts her job, so be it - she shouldn't have let their relationship get beyond business to begin with.

Counseling might help - but I think it might be better if you both go. Finding the reasons she's strayed will give you a better chance of working through things.

Best of luck to you!


----------



## turnera

To whom have you exposed?


----------



## Entropy3000

lovelygirl said:


> I don't understand how there could be a chance for her to get back with you when she has already said "I love you" to someone else.
> If she's really into him then how can "I love you" change into "I don't love him anymore" the next day when you confront her about this.
> It doesn't switch from one to another by pressing the button.
> 
> She either loves him or she doesn't, but chances are the SHE LOVES HIM.
> That's why I think taking her back won't make it work because obviously she will lie to you and pretend like she's sorry.


If she were to go NC and then through withdrawal, it can indeed change.
Not sayin this is not serious but this is what the brain chemicals do to you. They put you into the in love mode.


----------



## countryboy

she missed flight. i had a conversation that went something like this. 
me: Tell me what is really going on because i know it is something more serious than you are letting on. after x amount of years i know these things. 
her: i don't want to do this over the phone. 
me: well i need to know what the deal is, i can't wait another 8 hours until next flight. 
her: what do you want me to tell you that i haven't already. me: i know he wants to marry you. i know he wants to spend his life with you. where are you at? are you on board with the fancy wedding packages? 
her: what are you talking about. if i were you i wouldn't want to be looking at that stuff.
me: if roles were reversed what would you be doing?
her: i'd probably ask for a separation.
me not going to happen. 
me: i just need to know where you are. i'm not emotional about any of this right now, i just need some gd answers. i don't want to do this over the phone either but i can't function right now, so i have to get it out. just get ready to discuss further face to face tonight.

I'm saving the NC or D for this evening. My point was to make her sweat and ruin what time they had left. Since then, I've noticed some password changes. Should I hack back in and take control of those or just wait until some more traffic goes through?


----------



## warlock07

I would be skeptical of missed the flight. They might well as have extended the stay. Just realize that your wife is a liar and you shouldn't believe anything unless she can prove it.




> her: i'd probably ask for a separation.


Doesn't look good. She is fully in the affair. Expect a "We need to separate/divorce talk , I haven't loved you for quite some time" talk when she gets back


----------



## countryboy

warlock07 said:


> I would be skeptical of missed the flight. They might well as have extended the stay. Just realize that the wife is a liar


i don't think that makes a difference and yes i realize that now. i still think she is having a tough time with the whole thing. she is not an evil canniving *****. that's not saying i have any sympathy at this point.


----------



## Entropy3000

> her: what are you talking about. if i were you i wouldn't want to be looking at that stuff.


Huh? What does that mean?


----------



## warlock07

> her: i'd probably ask for a separation.


Doesn't look good. She is fully in the affair. Expect a "We need to separate/divorce talk , I haven't loved you for quite some time" talk when she gets back


----------



## iheartlife

She's not evil or conniving. My long-term cheating spouse wasn't either. He truly wasn't.

But what he WAS capable of doing was lying as much as possible for as long as possible to preserve the affair.

Here's the thing:

--they lie to themselves that they are entitled to cheat

--they lie to hang on tight to that fantasy--the fantasy is very precious

--they lie to you so "you don't get hurt" (laughable, I know)

EVERYONE thinks they know their spouse. But why they choose to believe the lies that follow the discovery of the affair, I will never know.

Oh, except that I DID for THREE YEARS. Doh.

Please listen, please learn from our mistakes.

I am happily recommitted / reconciling. I'm not saying you can't. I'm just saying....don't try to reinvent the wheel on how to break up an affair.


----------



## Entropy3000

countryboy said:


> i don't think that makes a difference and yes i realize that now. i still think she is having a tough time with the whole thing. she is not an evil canniving *****. that's not saying i have any sympathy at this point.


People in affairs do not behave like the people you fell in love with. They are deep in that fog and can act out like that evil canniving person you refer to. They feel justified in their disrepsect. There is history re-writing and in general all is fair for them as they are in love. You just do not matter so much. If they can cake eat then great, but the OM is the priority.

Yeah the flight was changed so she could get with the OM before she came home. Getting thier stories straight OR she may feel she has been outed and is checking to see if he is ready to commit to her. She may just be prepping to leave you right now. It is too late now but you probably should have waited for her to come home. I know it was easier to confront her in this was AND give her the flight to get it together. So a trade off. I get it. So the ball is in her court now.


----------



## Entropy3000

> her: i'd probably ask for a separation.


This tells it is a full blown affair. IF she was on the trip with him it was physical at least this time around and it probably has been for some time. But her comment above pretty much seals the deal on this question.

She feels she is trading up BTW.


----------



## Gabriel

Entropy3000 said:


> Huh? What does that mean?


I agree - WTH is that? To me, the "what are you talking about" is denial. Then the "I wouldn't be looking at that stuff" is immediately forgetting the denial and telling him not to look at stuff she knows is there. :scratchhead:

NC or D is the only choice left for her. And her saying she would probably ask for separation confirms she knows what she is doing is bad. It's just unfathomable how people can behave this way!!


----------



## iheartlife

countryboy said:


> Since then, I've noticed some password changes. Should I hack back in and take control of those or just wait until some more traffic goes through?


HAVE YOU SAVED HARD COPIES OF WHAT YOU SAW? She will delete as much as possible. I confronted early, just like you. I never did get to save all the emails. Fortunately I had started to save the most telling ones.


----------



## countryboy

Entropy3000 said:


> People in affairs do not behave like the people you fell in love with. They are deep in that fog and can act out like that evil canniving person you refer to. They feel justified in their disrepsect. There is history re-writing and in general all is fair for them as they are in love. You just do not matter so much. If they can cake eat then great, but the OM is the priority.
> 
> Yeah the flight was changed so she could get with the OM before she came home. Getting thier stories straight OR she may feel she has been outed and is checking to see if he is ready to commit to her. She may just be prepping to leave you right now. It is too late now but you probably should have waited for her to come home. I know it was easier to confront her in this was AND give her the flight to get it together. So a trade off. I get it. So the ball is in her court now.


i know he is ready to commit to her, but we still have two kids that i would find hard to believe she is ready to put them through that. i my be naieve on this point as well, but i have to have faith she still has a little heart for something with so much to lose. my goal is NC and snap her out of this fog.


----------



## keko

Install a keylogger to her computer before she comes.


----------



## countryboy

iheartlife said:


> HAVE YOU SAVED HARD COPIES OF WHAT YOU SAW? She will delete as much as possible. I confronted early, just like you. I never did get to save all the emails. Fortunately I had started to save the most telling ones.


i have forwarded all the incriminating ones to an email she can't possibly get to as well as hard copies.


----------



## TDSC60

countryboy said:


> she missed flight. i had a conversation that went something like this.
> me: Tell me what is really going on because i know it is something more serious than you are letting on. after x amount of years i know these things.
> her: i don't want to do this over the phone.
> me: well i need to know what the deal is, i can't wait another 8 hours until next flight.
> her: what do you want me to tell you that i haven't already. me: i know he wants to marry you. i know he wants to spend his life with you. where are you at? are you on board with the fancy wedding packages?
> her: what are you talking about. if i were you i wouldn't want to be looking at that stuff.
> me: if roles were reversed what would you be doing?
> her: i'd probably ask for a separation.
> me not going to happen.
> me: i just need to know where you are. i'm not emotional about any of this right now, i just need some gd answers. i don't want to do this over the phone either but i can't function right now, so i have to get it out. just get ready to discuss further face to face tonight.
> 
> I'm saving the NC or D for this evening. My point was to make her sweat and ruin what time they had left. Since then, I've noticed some password changes. Should I hack back in and take control of those or just wait until some more traffic goes through?


It is physical now if it was not before. She didn't miss the flight she delayed it to spend more time with him.

If you can crack the new passwords, do it now so you can see what they are talking about. 

Separation is just the wayward spouse way of getting more time to make plans or their way of deflecting the guilt they feel. After all if they are "separated" they are not bound by marriage vows, not that this means anything for them anyway.

Demand NC to work on the marriage. If she refuses and suggests a separation, tell her you do not see that this can help in any way and tell her you will D. If she waffles about NC tell her that you love her enough to let her go and you will start the D. Ask her to leave the home.

If she agrees to NC. Tell her you need the truth about this affair. Is she in love with him? Has she had sex with him? What ever you need answers to to allow you to make a decision. And tell her if there is any more contact with him that divorce will start immediately.


----------



## morituri

Separation is having the benefits of legitimizing the affair while still having the benefits of marriage. The hell with that! It is either R or D.


----------



## sigma1299

countryboy said:


> i know he is ready to commit to her, but we still have two kids that i would find hard to believe she is ready to put them through that. i my be naieve on this point as well, but i have to have faith she still has a little heart for something with so much to lose. my goal is NC and snap her out of this fog.


I've been out of your thread for a while cb so if I'm covering old ground my apologies. 

In regards to your post I quoted above - never underestimate just how far up their own ass a person in an affair can get their head - it's quite alarming actually. My point is that your faith may very well be misguided. Affair fog twist a person's perceptions so badly that they can convince themselves of damn near anything. 

Have you read of what's called "walk away wives" here? It's just what it sounds like, a wife who comes home one day, looks at her husband, and gives him the keys to her whole life - kids, house, marriage, all of it; and walks away to be with her AP. It happens. Hopefully your faith is not misplaced and she'll come out of it, but be prepared for her not to or at least to put up a hell of a fight.


----------



## countryboy

my main focus now is my kids. its up to her whether she wants to work it out now. i will find out tonight. NC or D. no compromises.


----------



## keko

Keep in mind of a possible false R. Some WS's give the impression of wanting to work on the marriage, but secretly keep tabs on the affair partner.


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## countryboy

so this exposure letter goes to anyone and everyone we know. it reads something like this:

WS and AP have opted to start and continue an extramarital affair. I have given her the option to cut ties and come back home to her family. She has chosen her AP. Needless to say this is a sad time in my life and her two children. Please pray for us in this time of hardship.

Also what do you tell the kids? i'm thinking the truth and nothing but the truth. "Mommy chose to live with another man. The road ahead is tough, just know i love you."


----------



## Almostrecovered

the kids need to know it isn't their fault and that they will be loved and cared for


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## keko

But make sure to notify your and her family/friends before she comes back. I would bet she is already planning the lies she will feed to them.


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## countryboy

keko said:


> But make sure to notify your and her family/friends before she comes back. I would bet she is already planning the lies she will feed to them.


i'm prepping the letter now. you don't think i should let her make the NC choice? that seems more logical. once her mind is made up, i press send. she will underestimate me on this. her family is already assuming bad behavior on her part due to these trips.


----------



## the guy

I suggest that you mention in the letter that you have "confirmed" an affair.

I also think that you could wait until you ask to NC, then send it. If she agrees and there is a fake R then send it. If she chooses OM then send it. This may be a card worth playing after you guys talk

I haven't read your thread so I should get caught up. I may come back with different advise.


----------



## countryboy

the guy said:


> I suggest that you mention in the letter that you have "confirmed" an affair.
> 
> I also think that you could wait until you ask to NC, then send it. If she agrees and there is a fake R then send it. If she chooses OM then send it. This may be a card worth playing after you guys talk
> 
> I haven't read your thread so I should get caught up. I may come back with different advise.


so if she does not agree to NC say if thats how it is i will inform everyone that this is over because of your affair. again when do the children find out...is affair even mentioned to them?


----------



## keko

countryboy said:


> i'm prepping the letter now. you don't think i should let her make the NC choice? that seems more logical. once her mind is made up, i press send. she will underestimate me on this. her family is already assuming bad behavior on her part due to these trips.


You have to let everyone know the affair so there will be pressure on her to drop the affair. If she doesn't face consequence's you wont have much chance at true R.

If her family is assuming some bad behavior I would wonder if her siblings/cousins know of the affair already.


----------



## countryboy

keko said:


> You have to let everyone know the affair so there will be pressure on her to drop the affair. If she doesn't face consequence's you wont have much chance at true R.
> 
> If her family is assuming some bad behavior I would wonder if her siblings/cousins know of the affair already.


doubt it. when you say everyone you mean kids included? seems harsh.


----------



## keko

No not the kids. 

Dont you think its harsh she cheated on you and her family? Probably is still doing it right now?


----------



## keko

Everyone as in people that know you and her so family and friends.


----------



## TDSC60

countryboy said:


> so if she does not agree to NC say if thats how it is i will inform everyone that this is over because of your affair. again when do the children find out...is affair even mentioned to them?


No, do not tell her that you are exposing her affair if she refuses no contact. Just do it. Do not give her time to twist the truth. Exposing the affair is to get her out of the affair if possible and if not then it is to help you heal from the divorce.

As for the kids - if they are old enough to understand what an affair is, then the truth is what they get. If they are not old enough, just tell them that Mom will not be in the home any longer but they will be with her when her job allows it. They might accept that because she travels so much now.

Good luck.

Edit: Just noticed. Don't say "her two children" in the letter. Make it "our two children".


----------



## kenmoore14217

It's called going "Nuclear" CB. You expose to EVERYONE fast and furious BEFORE your wife knows what you are doing. You don't negotiate with a WW and say if you don't do this or don't do that I will expose! BS on that, do it now, get it out in the open...........


----------



## iheartlife

My personal opinion on exposure--is to tell the people who have the power to bear on the relationship. I.e., family and friends who the WS respects and loves. People outside of that, at this initial stage, don't need to be informed.

The point of exposure if you're trying to reconcile is to gather forces around you who love the two of you and support the marriage. Not to tar and feather her and run her out on a rail.

sorry if I've misunderstood anyone--


----------



## TDSC60

iheartlife said:


> My personal opinion on exposure--is to tell the people who have the power to bear on the relationship. I.e., family and friends who the WS respects and loves. People outside of that, at this initial stage, don't need to be informed.
> 
> The point of exposure if you're trying to reconcile is to gather forces around you who love the two of you and support the marriage. Not to tar and feather her and run her out on a rail.
> 
> sorry if I've misunderstood anyone--


:iagree:

Even if she rejects no contact at first. The pressure from her family and friends after the exposure might shock her out of her fantasy.

And yes, the exposure should not take place until she has said yes or no to no contact. Again, do not use it as a threat. Do not say if you do not come home I will expose to your family. This is something you are doing to try to protect you and your marriage. Do not tell her you are going to do it.


----------



## keko

TDSC60 said:


> And yes, the exposure should not take place until she has said yes or no to no contact. Again, do not use it as a threat. Do not say if you do not come home I will expose to your family. This is something you are doing to try to protect you and your marriage. Do not tell her you are going to do it.


The problem with this is, she very likely is already planning and feeding twisted truth and lies to her family. Exposure should be done immediately since OP already confronted her and doesn't need to waste anymore valuable time.

Just by her response's its clear she has no intention being back in the family. She needs a hard shock, now.


----------



## Entropy3000

countryboy said:


> i know he is ready to commit to her, but we still have two kids that i would find hard to believe she is ready to put them through that. i my be naieve on this point as well, but i have to have faith she still has a little heart for something with so much to lose. my goal is NC and snap her out of this fog.


Yes, you are naive. This happens ALL the time. Yes men are amazed by this. I would be too but having children does not seem to impact affairs. It is most often the man that has to do the adapting. He is most often the one who has to visit the kids.

You need a lawyer.


----------



## iheartlife

keko said:


> The problem with this is, she very likely is already planning and feeding twisted truth and lies to her family. Exposure should be done immediately since OP already confronted her and doesn't need to waste anymore valuable time.
> 
> Just by her response's its clear she has no intention being back in the family. She needs a hard shock, now.


Yes, unfortunately, the OP jumped the gun.


----------



## Entropy3000

countryboy said:


> doubt it. when you say everyone you mean kids included? seems harsh.


It will be harsh when she tells the children you are the bad guy and that Uncle OM is a great guy and that they love them more than you and so on. Go with the truth.

What you tell the kids depends on thier ages.


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## countryboy

is there a sample exposure letter somewhere? should it be snarky like be sure to congratulate the new couple or just factual and pray for our family in this difficult time.

main points:

affair confirmed with this guy here is his phone number if you would liek to reach him.

my wife can be reached at this number.

it saddens me to announce that...


----------



## the guy

More like; "here are the #'s my wife can be reached at if you would like to give your support for our marriage"

No snarky, don't look like the crazed jealous husband


----------



## keko

Something along the lines of, "I recently confirmed my wife xx has been in an affair with yy. In fact they are currently enjoying a wedding package at zz inn."


----------



## the guy

rule of thumb is do not give away your plans, never tell the WW what your next move is.

In her affair fog, it comes off as vengefull and justifies her A.

You were in the dark long enough, its her turn and now you will be one step ahead of her.


----------



## iheartlife

NO snark. I wouldn't even mention the wedding package.

Here's the thing. It's just the way things work. Her family especially is going to try to see if there's some reason why she would do this to you.

You would be handing them that ammunition on a silver platter with snark or sarcasm.

No!

You are the walking wounded. Speak from your soul. You are appealing to them: one human being to another who loves your wife and loves you and your marriage.

Short and to the point, no extra details, no ammunition that is going to come back and bite you in the butt. No one out there is getting a chance to say you deserved this.


----------



## Gabriel

Can I just say, I am so sorry countryboy. The thought of having your W being gone, away from you with an OM, defiling your marriage, is just so horribly awful.

When the hell is she coming home? You two need to talk.


----------



## Eli-Zor

countryboy said:


> is there a sample exposure letter somewhere? should it be snarky like be sure to congratulate the new couple or just factual and pray for our family in this difficult time.
> 
> main points:
> 
> affair confirmed with this guy here is his phone number if you would liek to reach him.
> 
> my wife can be reached at this number.
> 
> it saddens me to announce that...


Read the newbie thread it has the templates there:

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/32002-welcome-tam-cwi-newbies-please-read.html


_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## jinba

I agree with most of what's been said - R with NC or D in particular. In my opinion she gets no other choices. She didn't give you a choice did she? If she wasn't 100% committed to you and your marriage, shouldn't you have been given the opportunity to work on whatever was wrong? Cheaters never seem to give their spouses that option because they're only thinking of themselves and their happiness. 

You're in a tough situation because of the children, but don't stay together for their sake - kids can spot disfunction in a heartbeat and I'm sure you don't want them growing up in a home without love - meaning love between their parents. That sets the foundation for their future relationships - and if you continue in a disfuctional marriage, they'll likely experience the same when they grow up.


----------



## bandit.45

Don't be snarky. And only expose what you do know and have confirmed. You have confirmed nothing about the wedding suite so don't even go there. Keep the message on point and direct. 

And expose before she gets home. When her plane lands she should have a hundred voice mails from angry family and friends waiting for her. This will take alot of the wind out of her sails and give you the emotional advantage.

Send your recievers deep, stay on the offensive. Do not play a defensive game with her. Keep one step ahead. You should be calling and talking to a lawyer now. Take time off work today if you have to.


----------



## lordmayhem

OMG! A wedding package?


----------



## countryboy

here is the exposure email:
It saddens me to inform everyone that my wife name, has been carrying on an inappropriate relationship with AP of city, state. for several months. Upon discovering of the affair, I have made numerous attempts to turn the marriage around, but I am not having much success. She has made the decision to see him as she pleases. If you support my marriage, and the two children who will be devastated, you may reach her at phone number. Please pray for us.

Thoughts?


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## Eli-Zor

countryboy said:


> here is the exposure email:
> It saddens me to inform everyone that my wife name, has been carrying on an inappropriate relationship with AP of city, state. for several months. Upon discovering of the affair, I have made numerous attempts to turn the marriage around, but I am not having much success. She has made the decision to see him as she pleases. If you support my marriage, and the two children who will be devastated, you may reach her at phone number. Please pray for us.
> 
> Thoughts?


It's good enough but I must ask have you read the newbie thread? There are templates there designed to protect you.

What about the OM , you must target his friends and family, I heard you last time when you said he has no family, I don't buy it. Mail his client base if you have to , if a man predates on your marriage your allowed to expose him far and wide . If you still don't have luck put him on cheatersville, so long as you tell the truth only the law cannot touch you.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## jinba

Take the advice given here - I wish I'd have found this kind of support years ago. I bit my tongue and didn't expose my H or the OW to anyone other than very close friends at the time. Now I wish I'd broadcasted it to the whole county! It would have forced them to make a decision ... one way or the other ... and I could have moved forward with my life much quicker and suffered less damage.


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## Shaggy

Actually I like the idea of naming him and giving out his cellphone. That would be a nice touch.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Eli-Zor

Shaggy said:


> Actually I like the idea of naming him and giving out his cellphone. That would be a nice touch.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_



Agree, However the BS had best get his head around his plan as he is running out of time.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## iheartlife

countryboy said:


> here is the exposure email:
> It saddens me to inform everyone that my wife name, has been carrying on an inappropriate relationship with AP of city, state. for several months. Upon discovering of the affair, I have made numerous attempts to turn the marriage around, but I am not having much success. She has made the decision to see him as she pleases. If you support my marriage, and the two children who will be devastated, you may reach her at phone number. Please pray for us.
> 
> Thoughts?


PLEASE read the templates and use them as a basis for the letter. Modify it accordingly. I would have said:

Since discovering the affair, I have been working hard to turn our marriage around [vs. numerous attempts]


----------



## countryboy

Eli-Zor said:


> Agree, However the BS had best get his head around his plan as he is running out of time.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I have a list of contacts from the emails and his work place website. I will add his phone number. I have read the sticky. It helped a lot. Her calmness during this waiting period is disturbing. 
I also read the let them go thread. I totally agree with it and plan on using the tips in there. No begging. Kindness and smiles.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Eli-Zor

countryboy said:


> I have a list of contacts from the emails and his work place website. I will add his phone number. I have read the sticky. It helped a lot. Her calmness during this waiting period is disturbing.
> I also read the let them go thread. I totally agree with it and plan on using the tips in there. No begging. Kindness and smiles.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


She is calm because she is with the OM and she thinks she has control.

The words are nuclear exposure especialy on his side . The exposure on her side is more measured unless she leaves home and does not commit to the marriage.

I suggest you move monies as well to secure yourself , if you are the primary child carer she will have to pay you and it may include alimony .

For now while she is in transit , expose.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## keko

How are you going to send the letter? text, email, postal?


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## Eli-Zor

I would hope not to hear from countryboy for a while as he is busy exposing.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## keko

Plus he should go dark on his WW till she comes back.


----------



## countryboy

Eli-Zor said:


> She is calml because she is with the OM and she thinks she has control.
> 
> The words are nuclear exposure especialy on his side . The exposure on her side is more measured unless she leaves home and does not commit to the marriage.
> 
> I suggest you move monies as well to secure yourself , if you are the primary child carer she will have to pay you and it may include alimony .
> 
> For now while she is in transit , expose.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


she is with him now for sure. she called me, but i can't make small talk with her. the only thing i want to talk about is the one thing she want discuss over the phone especially in the same car with him. 

whether it is the money or comfort or whatever, i don't care now. i'm in such disbelief we are at this stage. i've been doing fine all day focused on getting my ducks in a row. that one phone call, her nonchalant way of talking when our marriage is crumbling and the thought that she has made up her mind but wont tell me is making me crazy.


----------



## countryboy

keko said:


> How are you going to send the letter? text, email, postal?


email


----------



## countryboy

Eli-Zor said:


> I would hope not to hear from countryboy for a while as he is busy exposing.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


its set up to click and send at this point. i just want to wrap up the discussion tonight. based on the outcome, i will press send or not. i don't want the talk to be about anything else than the topic at hand. i know if i send it it will muddy the waters of our discussion. am i a fool for playing it this way?


----------



## Eli-Zor

Send send send , she is purposefully holding you up so they can do damage control. Go offline from here and from her , no more conversations with her until you pick her up from the airport.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## keko

countryboy said:


> its set up to click and send at this point. i just want to wrap up the discussion tonight. based on the outcome, i will press send or not. i don't want the talk to be about anything else than the topic at hand. i know if i send it it will muddy the waters of our discussion. am i a fool for playing it this way?


Exposing is not about her being interested in R or D, it's to let the truth out before she start's lying and put pressure on her to drop the affair.


----------



## Eli-Zor

countryboy said:


> its set up to click and send at this point. i just want to wrap up the discussion tonight. based on the outcome, i will press send or not. i don't want the talk to be about anything else than the topic at hand. i know if i send it it will muddy the waters of our discussion. am i a fool for playing it this way?


Your modified exposure plan will not work , the reason why you expose now is to throw her off balance, every minute that passes gives her control over you. Your already worried that she is so calm why do you think that is , she and OM have a plan . You have one but won't sorry can't act on it . Your head is going to be in turmoil when she gets back , she knows your desperate ----start leading .
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## iheartlife

I'm going to skip the exposure part and let others advise about that.

As far as confrontation:
Write down what you are going to say and rehearse it. Hold talking points in your hand if you need to when she gets there.

You will experience some powerful emotions when you see her face-to-face. But at this critical point, showing emotion is showing weakness that you don't mean what you say. It suggests to her that she can ask to think about it, separate temporarily, or find some other way to keep you both going so she doesn't have to choose.

Leave no doubt that you love her and will do what it takes to make the marriage right. But you cannot break down and beg and plead and cry. If you think you might, just remember that the first thing that will pop into her head is how much she does not like those qualities and she is glad she found someone who isn't that way.

A marriage only has two people in it.


----------



## the guy

No 
Work the plan
You are correct any action no will muddy the water.
You want your new confrontation to be to the point and effective.

It what I mean is she must see how serious you are in moving on with out her. That and you show of confidence in the fact you know enough and now it about her choice to NC.

After this point welll then it your turn to take the actions that will make her face the reality to which ever choice she makes. Make no mistake, which ever choice she makes there will be consequences.

Be prepared for the "confussed" and the "I need time" those statement alone are her making the choice to be with OM.


Remember stay strong and walk away from the engaement if need be. You can return a few minute or hours to restate the point of complete and total NC.


----------



## the guy

I still think you wait and play the exposure card affter the talk.

This is addictive and she will struggle with NC (IF SHE COMMITES AND AGREES) then play the card after she breaks NC.

If the OM was married then exposure to OMW would over ride this stratagy Have you been able to confirm there is no OMW or GF?
Thsi point is really important and must be followed through ASAP (even before the talk)!!!!!

You mentioned OM is single but is it comfirmed by you?


----------



## Eli-Zor

The reason why many posters remain undecided is they get contradictory advice and then take the path of least resistance.

Here is the deal: 

She did not fly back this morning , why? Was it a genuine business reason or a late morning sex session with OM.
They are in the car together making plans, nothing you say to her today is going to change what they have planned. 
Regardless of what she says to you tonight be assured she is going to go to the OM either today or sometime in the near future unless you dramatically change the balance.
You have a single moment to cause seriouse grief in the affair , that is now.
You cannot hold back exposure as a threat, it does not work.

Send the mails to his contacts be they clients friends or friends 
Caller her mother and ask for help.

Do not say anything to her about the exposure let her find out the hard way.

When you confront you do so knowing her lies are revealed and for her life is about to get a lot worse.

Edited: this is your second confrontation and you yourself mentioned she sounded unconcerned when you confronted her the first time.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## ArmyofJuan

countryboy said:


> her: i'd probably ask for a separation.
> me: not going to happen.


I just want to make a comment about this.

You can’t make her do anything she doesn’t want to do and saying you won’t consider separation shows that you need her more than she needs you. You are going to pressure her to stay and that never works plus it looks weak.

An alpha would say “Screw separation, I’m filing for a D first thing in the morning, I’m not going waste my time with someone that can’t stay committed to me.”

Just tell her end the affair or you will end the marriage. Don’t try to talk her into staying or negotiate or any of that nonsense. The more you personally try to fight to save the marriage and make her stay, the more likely you will fail. She broke the marriage and screwed up; she now has to fix it, not you. 

You will have better luck making her end the A if you try to end the M. That’s what really wakes them up, cold hard reality. Not only that, you get to save your dignity as well. When she sees you take a stand and not allow her to get away with disrespecting you and the marriage she will see you in a new light.

When you talk to people that have already gone through this you’ll find the number 1 regret was not being tougher with the WS. There's a good reason for that.


----------



## Eli-Zor

" An alpha would say “Screw separation, I’m filing for a D first thing in the morning, I’m not going waste my time with someone that can’t stay committed to me."

Agree, a seperation is an excuse to act single and gaslight you, is she seperates you D and go for everything.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Shaggy

Listen eli zor. Right now they are making plans to manipulate you based on what they know you have told her. I would wait until she pulls up, likely with him in the car, and push send. Do not tell her you have done this, but wait for the call from him to her telling her.

I think she maybe won't have the guts to face you. He's is likely going to get a hotel for them tonight and will drive her by to pick up her clothes etc.

Right now while you are waiting go buy a var and carry it with you when you talk to her.

Move money out to an account only you control.

Have a friend on standby tonight to come over after she leaves. I doubt she is going to spend the night. Had she freaked on the phone and ran home it would be different,. Instead they are making plans to stick it to you.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## the guy

Eli- makes a good point In which I aggree. Play the card now makes sense after reading reading Eli- post.

Who knows if she breaking up with OM or coming up with a plan to go underground during these next few hours they are together?

WW could have extened the trip for one last good by "kiss".

If it was me I would want to see how the convo goes this evening, at least it will validate your dicision to blow this out of the water, and/or still have a card to play once she breaks NC.

What ever you deside just remember never disclose you next step, so do not tell her about the exposure, keep WW in the dark.


----------



## the guy

We can see that the convo tonite won't go well for OP, and most likely this is an exit affair and WW is completely gone.

But exposing after the talk will leave out any possiblity of regret from OP.

We all know damb well if he jumps the gun he will get the " I was going to stop but since you told everyone then the M is over".....Thats my thinking here.

There will me a confirmation this evening that will help solidify his next step.


----------



## Gabriel

the guy said:


> We can see that the convo tonite won't go well for OP, and most likely this is an exit affair and WW is completely gone.
> 
> But exposing after the talk will leave out any possiblity of regret from OP.
> 
> We all know damb well if he jumps the gun he will get the " I was going to stop but since you told everyone then the M is over".....Thats my thinking here.
> 
> There will me a confirmation this evening that will help solidify his next step.


I agree. :iagree:

I think you have your hand hovering over the red button while you have the convo tonight. Anything other than complete and total contrition and remorse from your W, and the button gets pressed, sending the scorched earth exposure to all.


----------



## Gabriel

And by the way, DO NOT tell her you are going to do this. No warnings or threats. 

In fact, act very calm during your conversation, assuming the worst already. Believe 10% of what she says. Act like you have swallowed the canary (your impending exposure), like you have the edge, knowing what you are about to do.

The only way you don't hit that red button is if she is literally begging for you, and proves she is done. I highly doubt this is going to happen. But even if she does, then you have to keep your hand over that button while you stay very vigilant.


----------



## the guy

If your WW does go down the road of remorse then it will be her job to expose this affair and ask for support from family and friends.

Hence the reason I'm in the crowd of waiting.

Its not likely but I am hopeful that she pulls her head out of her butt. and if any one pushes the "red botton"it is her.

Just remember, if in some small chance she choose the NC do not tell her about the *your*- "red botton" you will need this later down the road....


----------



## Shaggy

Is her car at home? Drop a VAR under the seat before she gets home.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## turnera

countryboy said:


> so if she does not agree to NC say if thats how it is i will inform everyone that this is over because of your affair. again when do the children find out...is affair even mentioned to them?


No! You don't tell her that you are going to expose. You just do it. Then you sit back and wait for the phone calls to start; once they do (if anyone will help you), she will be furious! Just ignore her and repeat "You chose to cheat on your husband."

Also, you send it only key people who can influence her, people whose respect she craves. THOSE are the people she might stop the affair for.


----------



## keko

Shaggy said:


> Is her car at home? Drop a VAR under the seat before she gets home.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I would advise he carry it on himself for the first moments. I see a possible domestic violence claim by her, if things don't go her way.


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## turnera

countryboy said:


> here is the exposure email:
> It saddens me to inform everyone that my wife name, has been carrying on *an inappropriate relationship* with AP of city, state. for several months. Upon discovering of the affair, I have made numerous attempts to turn the marriage around, but I am not having much success. She has made the decision to see him as she pleases. If you support my marriage, and the two children who will be devastated, you may reach her at phone number. Please pray for us.
> 
> Thoughts?


Huh? 

Call it what it IS. Get the shock value out of it. "My wife is committing adultery with XYZ; in fact, she's at a hotel with him right now."


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## Shaggy

keko said:


> I would advise he carry it on himself for the first moments. I see a possible domestic violence claim by her, if things don't go her way.


He needs both. One for the talk, the other when she drives away, it might be hard to reclaim later, but he can wrk that out.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## TDSC60

Shaggy said:


> He needs both. One for the talk, the other when she drives away, it might be hard to reclaim later, but he can wrk that out.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I think he said he would be picking her up at the airport. If they have two cars they are both at home so the VAR in the car can be done now. I agree he should keep one on his person when he picks her up and on the drive home and during the discussion that follows (if there is one).

This woman is way to calm in my opinion. Calling him while OM is in the car with her is crazy. Something is up. They have worked out a plan.


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## bandit.45

Send the e-mail now. Do not wait. 

Why would you ask all of us who have been down this road before and then go against the consensus? These folks know what they are talking about.


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## Shaggy

Yeah, I think the OP really needs to watch his back, she is about to pull something.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Machiavelli

CB,

The time to hold off on exposure was DDay #1. You did not expose. This is DDay #2, so expose now.

Don't pick her up at the airport. Let her find her own way. Give her a taste of her new life without you.


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## countryboy

Machiavelli said:


> CB,
> 
> The time to hold off on exposure was DDay #1. You did not expose. This is DDay #2, so expose now.
> 
> Don't pick her up at the airport. Let her find her own way. Give her a taste of her new life without you.


I just read the "affair fog" article. Good stuff. U think I should forward it to her for some in flight reading so she knows what I'm talking about when I make reference?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Entropy3000

countryboy said:


> I just read the "affair fog" article. Good stuff. U think I should forward it to her for some in flight reading so she knows what I'm talking about when I make reference?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_



As someone who was in an EA I would say no. I understand you wanting to reach her. She seems further gone than I was frankly. I was not ready for that kind of info until I was coming out of withdrawal. She needs the proverbial 2 x 4. Telling her this is unacceptable. Then if she comes around there will be time for this. You will not reason her out of the OMs bed. I know this is hard to understand.


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## bandit.45

countryboy said:


> I just read the "affair fog" article. Good stuff. U think I should forward it to her for some in flight reading so she knows what I'm talking about when I make reference?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


You are jumping twenty steps ahead. No do not send this to her. 

Quit wasting time and send the exposure notice.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## TDSC60

bandit.45 said:


> You are jumping twenty steps ahead. No do not send this to her.
> 
> Quit wasting time and send the exposure notice.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


:iagree:

She is way farther along the road than we thought. 

Expose now.

GO RIGHT NOW AND GET THAT VAR!!!!! Keep it turned on and with you for the next few days. She and the OM have a plan and nothing they plan is good for you.

You have to protect yourself.

BTW - Did she admit to him being in the car with her when she called? That means they spent the night together and woke up late - thus a missed flight.


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## keko

I didn't see where she admitted they were in the same car let alone same room.

OP should have verified it before they checked out the hotel....


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## Gabriel

Yeah, some stuff isn't adding up here. OP is picking her up at the airport, but she's with him in the car? Missed flights? 

OP, are you talking to her while she's on the way to the airport from the other side, not yet on the plane? What makes you think they are in the car together? That didn't seem obvious given what you wrote.


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## TDSC60

countryboy said:


> *she is with him now for sure. she called me, but i can't make small talk with her. the only thing i want to talk about is the one thing she want discuss over the phone especially in the same car with him. *
> 
> whether it is the money or comfort or whatever, i don't care now. i'm in such disbelief we are at this stage. i've been doing fine all day focused on getting my ducks in a row. that one phone call, her nonchalant way of talking when our marriage is crumbling and the thought that she has made up her mind but wont tell me is making me crazy.


Don't know how he knew OM was in the car but here is where I saw it.


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## keko

It doesn't make much sense. OP can you clarify that part? Is that you guessing or did she admit he was in the car?


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## bandit.45

What happened to OP?


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## Almostrecovered

last logged on at 730pm last night


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## Shaggy

Anyone else worried that she and her bf pulled something on him?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## jinba

Yes - seems something is amiss - hopefully he's okay.


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## TDSC60

Shaggy said:


> Anyone else worried that she and her bf pulled something on him?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Truthfully, I'm a little worried that Countryboy may be in a country jail. He was all over the board with his last few comments.

Not in control of himself as he should be. Considering what was about to happen.

CB - any updates? How did wife's return home go?


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## bandit.45

TDSC60 said:


> Truthfully, I'm a little worried that Countryboy may be in a country jail. He was all over the board with his last few comments.
> 
> Not in control of himself as he should be. Considering what was about to happen.
> 
> CB - any updates? How did wife's return home go?


Hope the OM didn't drive up with wifey in the car. Betcha something went down.


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## Almostrecovered

hooray for speculation!!


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## keko

bandit.45 said:


> Hope the OM didn't drive up with wifey in the car. Betcha something went down.


They're newly weds, how else will they come home?


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## bandit.45

Speculate, speculate speculate.... why the F not? This is a discussion board not a courtroom.


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## jinba

I don't think it's our place to speculate as to what may or may not have happened. We're supposed to be here for him when he needs us, aren't we?

While I'm concerned, I'm not going to try and guess what's happening in his life. I'll simply pray that he's okay.


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## bandit.45

jinba said:


> I don't think it's our place to speculate as to what may or may not have happened. We're supposed to be here for him when he needs us, aren't we?
> 
> While I'm concerned, I'm not going to try and guess what's happening in his life. I'll simply pray that he's okay.


We're here to help, and speculate, and talk, and talk, and chat, and talk some more.

We are not unpaid therapists or priests.


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## TDSC60

Bandit.45

I got the feeling the phone call from his wife was done while OM was driving her to the airport. Still have no idea why CB says OM was with her in the car.

Yesterday most everyone was screaming "VAR before wife gets back" at him time and time again and I don't think it sunk in.

Considering how calm he described his wife as, it is very possible that she got off the plane (maybe with OM in tow) and pushed some button that set him off. Airport security is a *****.


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## Gabriel

As much as we are dying to know where this is headed, in reality, stuff happens away from the computer and he is likely dealing with a bunch of stuff and doesn't have time to tell his internet posse right now.

Hopefully he comes back and fills us in and is open to more advice, and yes, speculation.


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## jinba

bandit.45 said:


> We're here to help, and speculate, and talk, and talk, and chat, and talk some more.
> 
> We are not unpaid therapists or priests.


No - we're not. But there's so much REAL negativity here, why create (or fabricate) more?


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## TDSC60

I think 95% of what goes on here is speculation.

OPs come here FOR speculation. They lay out their case of how their spouse is acting with specific incidents and ask for an opinion from people who have walked this road before them and the opinions provided are pure speculation based on similarities. (They are proven correct more times than not - but still speculation).

Short of a confession by a spouse or catching them in the actual act it is all speculation. I call it playing the odds, call it "if it walks like a duck", call it " my spouse was doing the exact same thing as your spouse and this is what I eventually found out".

So really every one here speculates and when the OP goes silent, it's hard to stop.


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## jinba

You may be right - I just don't feel that his silence should be construed as something so negative - it isn't fair for us to talk behind his back and assume the worst - like he's "in jail". He was upset, yes - but we really know nothing about the type of person he is or whether or not he's capable of any sort of violence toward his wife or the OM. This type of thinking (and posting) could hurt his feelings and further damage his already low self esteem.

Think about it - his life is crumbling and now some of those he felt he could turn for support and encouragement think he's in jail - just not constructive in my opinion. But, like you said we do speculate and offer opinions - so I guess I'm learning that anything goes here - which I have no control over - so I'll just choose not to participate.


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## river rat

Go back and read Shamwow's story. Sounds familiar. You could take some pointers from him.


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## the guy

jinba,
Come on, if you don't particapate, then there is no check and balance to this forum. We count on guys like to keep guys like me in line.

I think OP diserves to see all the different perspectives and advise that is offered, at the end it is OP life to deside on the information in front of him, the hard part is making the choice on whats best b/c of all the different thought and mind sets on this forum. 

Sorry for the threadjack OP


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## iheartlife

jinba said:


> Think about it - his life is crumbling and now some of those he felt he could turn for support and encouragement think he's in jail - just not constructive in my opinion. But, like you said we do speculate and offer opinions - so I guess I'm learning that anything goes here - which I have no control over - so I'll just choose not to participate.


jinba, you have a perspective that others would find very useful--you are reconciled with your husband and in a confident, good place. (Not saying your life is perfect, but then whose is?) You just wrote a kick-a** letter to the OWH telling him his wife probably has an STD (sorry if she slashes your tires BTW). You have plenty to add so don't take offense.

There is a lot of male jostling in the threads started by husbands, but it is a masculine way. If someone called you or me wimps for not manning up we wouldn't take it kindly. But we're not guys, and this does work for many if not most guys. They get these men to focus on concrete steps, and you can see how much it lifts them out of the worst of their depression, gives them something to control when so much of their life is spinning out.

The reference to the OP being in jail is because many men lose it entirely when being confronted with the OM and despite being otherwise good, kind, loving husbands and law-abiding citizens, their emotions overcome them and they beat the you-know-what out of these people. Of course these comments in this thread are wild speculation. But that is all it is.

I don't mind posting in the threads for men despite the locker-room atmosphere, and you shouldn't either. Now if we could just get more of these guys to post in the women's threads now and then, that would be an accomplishment...


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## happyman64

CB,

You out there?

If you can just let everybody know you are ok.....

HM64


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