# Any kudos in 'breaking in' a virgin man?



## WyshIknew (Aug 18, 2012)

Hi ladies, something I've always wondered.

You often hear of, and I've witnessed first hand of certain men 'breaking in' a virgin girl/woman and then bragging about it to all their friends.

Sort of "Har har, I gave it too her good, silly batch cried afterwards."

If there was a guy you fancied when you were younger but you suspected he was a virgin would that make you more or less determined to bed him?

Was there any 'locker room' talk amongst the ladies discussing their conquests when they had taken a mans cherry?

Was it regarded as a 'good' fun thing to do? Or was it a bit of a chore to do as the guy was all fingers and thumbs, not quite sure what went where?

I suppose it is a bit difficult to tell if a guy is a virgin as it is not something most guys would want to confess.
I didn't 'confess' till a few years later and thought I'd done a pretty good job of bluffing as nature took over and everything just seemed to go together easily but I was told when I confessed that she had guessed I was at least very inexperienced as I was a bit fumbly and frankly not very good at it. :rofl:


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

WyshIknew said:


> If there was a guy you fancied when you were younger but you suspected he was a virgin would that make you more or less determined to bed him?


I personally did not want to lose it to a virgin. And I didn't. I have no idea what my reason was but I knew in my heart I wanted it to be to someone who could "teach me." Weird, huh? 

LOL


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

I think there was recently a thread about this...only it was "inexperienced" versus "virgin"...although I think the answers on it were applicable.

Mostly women were saying they would be ok with it, I think.


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## WyshIknew (Aug 18, 2012)

No. I don't think weird at all. While there is merit in mutually finding things out together I think there is benefit in your first being more experienced.

I suppose it can be difficult because everyone is a virgin at some point in their life and if a virgin isn't given a chance they will never have a chance (if you see what I mean.)

Don't wish to pry but did you return the favour later in life as far as you know?


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## WyshIknew (Aug 18, 2012)

Faithful Wife said:


> I think there was recently a thread about this...only it was "inexperienced" versus "virgin"...although I think the answers on it were applicable.
> 
> Mostly women were saying they would be ok with it, I think.


Oh ok must have missed it, not been in this section of TAM for some time as I don't always feel I have much to add.

Question wasn't so much of if they were ok, more was the mans virginity seen as some sort of conquest or prize.

I do remember not long after starting here I read of one guy relating how a certain girl found out he was a virgin and she didn't rest until she had got him alone one evening and 'popped' his cherry.

He never saw her again after that. :scratchhead:


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

Oh yes...I see. Is it a conquest or prize? Hmm...I think it could be for sure, yes. It would depend on how the woman felt about the man in general, I think. I can't remember that long ago for myself to be honest...I am pretty sure it happened a couple of times and I don't remember having any regrets about it.


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## WyshIknew (Aug 18, 2012)

Faithful Wife said:


> Oh yes...I see. Is it a conquest or prize? Hmm...I think it could be for sure, yes. It would depend on how the woman felt about the man in general, I think. I can't remember that long ago for myself to be honest...I am pretty sure it happened a couple of times and I don't remember having any regrets about it.


That in itself is interesting because from your posts, apart from the early days of your sexuality, I wouldn't have figured you as going with a virgin.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

It would have been in high school. That is why I can't remember it.


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## WyshIknew (Aug 18, 2012)

Faithful Wife said:


> It would have been in high school. That is why I can't remember it.


Yes. I figured as much.


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## ladywillow (Oct 31, 2013)

I've done this twice, both when I was in my early college years (maybe the summer between high school and college) and I did it just because I felt like I could. It was a weird time for me and I guess I was experimenting. 

Anyway, I did it with a guy who was a self professed virgin and I did have some locker room talk with my girlfriends about him. But, I would say that I definitely have more pleasure from men that are more experienced. 

I like being taught, as one of the other ladies pointed out. Even though sometimes I do like to pretend that I'm the substitute teacher at school sometimes in the bedroom! :rofl:


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## WyshIknew (Aug 18, 2012)

ladywillow said:


> I've done this twice, both when I was in my early college years (maybe the summer between high school and college) and I did it just because I felt like I could. It was a weird time for me and I guess I was experimenting.
> 
> Anyway, I did it with a guy who was a self professed virgin and I did have some locker room talk with my girlfriends about him. But, I would say that I definitely have more pleasure from men that are more experienced.
> 
> I like being taught, as one of the other ladies pointed out. Even though sometimes I do like to pretend that I'm the substitute teacher at school sometimes in the bedroom! :rofl:


I can understand that, the last thing you probably need when you are in the throes of passion is somebody aimlessly prodding around or asking you "does that fit there?"

That's why for my first I tried to bluff my way through and thought I did a pretty good job of it.

[email protected] your last sentence.


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## COguy (Dec 1, 2011)

I was a virgin until marriage. I played Rugby in college and usually took a lot of sh*t for it, I didn't care though, because it was a choice and not something that was forced on me.

One day the captain tried to make fun of me in the middle of the bar by telling all these girls I was a virgin. I was just like, "Yep, saving it for marriage." By the end of the night after being swarmed by the choicest females, they decided it was a bad idea to try and call me out in front of the ladies.

My assumption is that it was a competition thing. Each girl wanted to be the special one that did something no one else could. Either way, there were women that were very explicit about wanting my virginity. I'm not talking about girlfriends, this is like at the bar and I had never met them before. "OMG you're a virgin? That makes me want you so bad!"

PS, if you're a woman and you hear a guy is a virgin by choice, being a total **** bag is not the route to take to win him over.


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## WyshIknew (Aug 18, 2012)

FrenchFry said:


> ...I was just about to tell the story of the cute guy in my dorm who was waiting for marriage and how there were strategic meetings on who would and how to break him down...
> 
> who if my memory is correct was a rugby player!!!
> 
> hahahaaaa.


And did anybody break him in?


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## WyshIknew (Aug 18, 2012)

COguy said:


> I was a virgin until marriage. I played Rugby in college and usually took a lot of sh*t for it, I didn't care though, because it was a choice and not something that was forced on me.
> 
> One day the captain tried to make fun of me in the middle of the bar by telling all these girls I was a virgin. I was just like, "Yep, saving it for marriage." By the end of the night after being swarmed by the choicest females, they decided it was a bad idea to try and call me out in front of the ladies.
> 
> ...





FrenchFry said:


> ...I was just about to tell the story of the cute guy in my dorm who was waiting for marriage and how there were strategic meetings on who would and how to break him down...
> 
> who if my memory is correct was a rugby player!!!
> 
> hahahaaaa.


This is great and basically as I suspected. As women have become more sexually liberated I think this is probably more commonplace. 

I wonder if PUA's have ever thought of this one. Walk into a bar full of hot women and get your mates to pretend to take the piss about you being a virgin because you are waiting to get married. :rofl:


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## WyshIknew (Aug 18, 2012)

FrenchFry said:


> I want to say no, not that year and I moved soon afterwards so I missed out on the ongoing machinations.
> 
> I just remember the hilarious committees.


I'm intrigued now to find out what some of the plots were.

Get him drunk?

Feed him Viagra and Spanish fly?

Tell him you could suffer physical harm to your lady bits if you don't have sex with him? (You know a reversal of the old guy trick.)


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## GTdad (Aug 15, 2011)

I lost my virginity in high school to a girl who by her own admission was most assuredly not a virgin.

No way in hell was I going to admit to her that she was breaking one in, especially not at that "trying desperately to appear to be Man Of The World" stage.


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## thunderstruck (May 9, 2012)

WyshIknew said:


> I suppose it is a bit difficult to tell if a guy is a vrgin as it is not something most guys would want to confess.


I would think that the vast majority of guys wouldn't confess, so the women wouldn't know. I didn't. We went at it for a few months after that, and the woman who broke me in never mentioned it, so I don't know if she could tell. She was 4 years older and obviously wasn't a vrgin, so the first few times she basically just took control.


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## WyshIknew (Aug 18, 2012)

GTdad said:


> I lost my virginity in high school to a girl who by her own admission was most assuredly not a virgin.
> 
> No way in hell was I going to admit to her that she was breaking one in, especially not at that "trying desperately to appear to be Man Of The World" stage.


And yet she possibly suspected.

Or she won the bet to be the first to break you in. :rofl:


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## WyshIknew (Aug 18, 2012)

FrenchFry said:


> Get him drunk and corner him at a party.
> 
> Throw a underwear only and "accidentally" spill a drink on him.
> 
> ...


:lol:


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## COguy (Dec 1, 2011)

WyshIknew said:


> This is great and basically as I suspected. As women have become more sexually liberated I think this is probably more commonplace.
> 
> I wonder if PUA's have ever thought of this one. Walk into a bar full of hot women and get your mates to pretend to take the piss about you being a virgin because you are waiting to get married. :rofl:


If I didn't have any moral compass, I would totally use that as game. Though to be honest I'm not sure everyone could pull it off. Hardly anyone believes you anyway, and you have to know how to "talk the talk" of virginity so to speak. It's kind of like a secret club.

Like I never looked at a girl's chest when I was talking to her and though I might flirt, I never made sexual advances. A run of the mill player would probably get called out.


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## COguy (Dec 1, 2011)

FrenchFry said:


> Get him drunk and corner him at a party.
> 
> Throw a underwear only and "accidentally" spill a drink on him.
> 
> ...


You don't get to be a virgin for an extended amount of time without being really good at dodging and deflecting tempting situations. The misconception is that you are so rampantly horny all the time you'd have to be masturbating constantly.

It's actually the farthest from the truth. To abstain from sex means you have to constantly be vigilant about containing your hormones. If a girl bent over in front of me with just her underwear, I would have looked the other way. And no amount of ****tiness would have given me up.

If you want to take a v-card from a guy who is abstaining by choice, the easiest way is to tell him you want to wait as well, hook him into a relationship, and ratchet up a makeout session so it looks like an accident.


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

French Fry, the Man Maker.


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## WyshIknew (Aug 18, 2012)

Therealbrighteyes said:


> French Fry, the Man Maker.


:rofl:


Be gentle with me!


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## I Notice The Details (Sep 15, 2012)

As a man, I always fantasized about being taught in the bedroom by an older, experienced woman. I remember the movie, The Graduate, and was very turned on by it. I secretly hoped that my first blow job and first intercourse experience would come from an older woman, but in reality, it was my girlfriends who taught me many things as I went thru puberty and then High School. Great memories.


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## ntamph (Apr 23, 2013)

I lied to my first and told her that I had had previous experience.

I was actually going crazy because I was finally losing my virginity. I don't think she figured it out.

I can't imagine women competing to get a virgin guy. They are usually disgusted by them.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

ntamph...Stop with man-bashing, please? We are not "disgusted" by virgins. French Fry's story is totally real...did you read it?

I know you mean older men who are virgins, not high school boys...but we aren't disgusted by adult virgins either, silly. I just wish you didn't bash them and then project it onto women. Do you actually hear women say things like that? Or are you repeating things the manny-sphere says?


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## ntamph (Apr 23, 2013)

Faithful Wife said:


> Do you actually hear women say things like that?


Yes.


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## WyshIknew (Aug 18, 2012)

ntamph said:


> I lied to my first and told her that I had had previous experience.
> 
> I was actually going crazy because I was finally losing my virginity. I don't think she figured it out.
> 
> I can't imagine women competing to get a virgin guy. They are usually disgusted by them.


Sorry ntamph, I think that's nonsense. Why would a woman be disgusted with a virgin guy? Everyone is a virgin at some point in their life.

So far with the replies I've seen most womens reaction is similar to mens. Either "meh so what he's a virgin."

Or "damn he's hot, and he's a virgin, he's mine!"

Perhaps if the guy was in his 50's or 40's and a virgin there might be some concerns about why he was still a virgin but that's all.


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## ntamph (Apr 23, 2013)

WyshIknew said:


> Sorry ntamph, I think that's nonsense. Why would a woman be disgusted with a virgin guy? Everyone is a virgin at some point in their life.
> 
> So far with the replies I've seen most womens reaction is similar to mens. Either "meh so what he's a virgin."
> 
> ...


"I personally did not want to lose it to a virgin."

"But, I would say that I definitely have more pleasure from men that are more experienced. I like being taught, as one of the other ladies pointed out."


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## AnnieAsh (Aug 22, 2012)

ntamph said:


> I lied to my first and told her that I had had previous experience.
> 
> I was actually going crazy because I was finally losing my virginity. I don't think she figured it out.
> 
> I can't imagine women competing to get a virgin guy. They are usually disgusted by them.


I find that so hard to comprehend. I have been with 2 virgins in my distant past. I never had an ounce of disgust for either one. One was my very first love and the other was a dear good friend. 

I actually found more men were put off by virgin females. One guy told me virgins get too attached. I said "oooook, buddy. See ya!"


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## WyshIknew (Aug 18, 2012)

ntamph said:


> "I personally did not want to lose it to a virgin."
> 
> "But, I would say that I definitely have more pleasure from men that are more experienced. I like being taught, as one of the other ladies pointed out."


But that's just stating a preference, I don't see that as disgust.

I did ask the poster of your original sentence in your quote if she had returned the 'favour' later on and broke a man in but she never replied.

And yes why wouldn't someone find more pleasure from a more experienced man? Although must add that from what I've read on here and elsewhere high numbers do not a good lover make.

Look, if a woman finds you hot and wants to bed you I think she could care less if you were a virgin or a Casanova. She might even enjoy the fact that you are a virgin and get off on taking you in hand and showing you the ropes.
And lets face it, she gets a blank canvas to paint on.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

Exactly, in the examples you gave, it is not disgust, ntamph.

But do you actually hear women IRL say it?


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## ntamph (Apr 23, 2013)

Faithful Wife said:


> Exactly, in the examples you gave, it is not disgust, ntamph.
> 
> But do you actually hear women IRL say it?


I think if you're a guy and still a virgin in college, or, God forbid, make it through college a virgin (like me), you are pretty much screwed.

I was 22 when it finally happened. I had a girl interested in me once then a douche bag friend of my told her my secret and all attraction disappeared when I was 19 I think.

I have heard female friends talk about male virgins in their 20s and they all agree they wouldn't touch them with a ten foot pole. No matter how attracted they might be, they would think he is pathetic and desperate for any action. "Something MUST be wrong with him."

I'm not talking about high school or even college but after it. You won't be taken seriously as a man. I was lucky and avoided this fate but I have friends who have not.


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## WyshIknew (Aug 18, 2012)

ntamph said:


> I think if you're a guy and still a virgin in college, or, God forbid, make it through college a virgin (like me), you are pretty much screwed.
> 
> I was 22 when it finally happened. I had a girl interested in me once then a douche bag friend of my told her my secret and all attraction disappeared when I was 19 I think.
> 
> ...


Are you sure that isn't your own insecurities playing out Ntamph?


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## WyshIknew (Aug 18, 2012)

I was older than you and I never had any trouble being taken seriously as a man.


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## ntamph (Apr 23, 2013)

WyshIknew said:


> I was older than you and I never had any trouble being taken seriously as a man.


I mean seriously as a romantic partner.

I'm I insecure? Maybe. Like I said, failing with women will make you insecure with women.

But I should count myself lucky because I know guys who have it much worse.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

Ok I grant you that this totally sucks.

It must hurt really bad and make you not even want to try sometimes, I am imagining.

I think Wysh has stated similar feelings about being rejected in his youth (not necessarily about being a virgin but just being rejected).

My only offer is this - - people are stupid and say mean things. They are just being jerks sometimes and not thinking through the full story of what they are saying.

I am sorry this is how it is playing out in your life, because it is making it hard for you to believe you deserve love and sex, and that is understandable.

I hope you realize this happens to women who feel like wall flowers, too? There are plenty of virgin women, and women who are not going to be considered for prom, to take home to meet mom, or for any other boy-girl thing. There are women your age who have never had a date.

I actually know two sisters who never had one date in their lives and are still virgins and unmarried at age 55 and 53.

It is sad, for sure. But...you are here trying to overcome some of these limiting ideas, right? I still have full faith that you will find a great girl who is totally into you...

Where do you date now? Online? Or do you try to date at all?


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## ntamph (Apr 23, 2013)

Faithful Wife said:


> Ok I grant you that this totally sucks.
> 
> It must hurt really bad and make you not even want to try sometimes, I am imagining.
> 
> ...


Like I said, it's not as bad now as it used to be.

Of course, I have a moderately high salary, a paid for house and car while Mr. Linebacker or Mr. Aspiring Musician are living in mom's basement.

I always ask myself when a woman shows interest "Would she have given me the time of day if we had gone to high school together?"

I can't stand when discussions among my friends start about how fun and wild college was. I think of myself as someone faithful but what about when I'm middle aged and have a low or non-existent sex life with my wife and don't even have fun memories to look back on? I think I would actually be at high risk of cheating.

I get a lot more attention now but it all seems not genuine to me.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

Oh dear.

Women are showing you interest but you don't trust it, and you assume when you get married you will have a non-existent sex life and then cheat on her.

Do you know what I'm going to suggest next? 

You really need to sort all of that out in counseling, so some great chick can snatch you up.


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## WyshIknew (Aug 18, 2012)

Excellent post FW. ETA. I meant your previous post.

Yes that was me. Couldn't work out what was wrong with me etc.

And yes, as FW says people are jerks. Us guys don't have a monopoly on jerkdom, women, especially young women, can be quite mean and nasty often as a way of showing off.

If they are like that, eff 'em, plenty more fish in the sea that will appreciate a good guy.

I think it is also true that what can make you unattractive for high jinks as a young man can make you super attractive as an older guy, yea sucks a bit, but that's life, it's not meant to be fair.

And as to FW's point about many women being in the same position, I recall when we had our school reunion a couple of the ladies didn't turn up as they had never got married and felt they had 'failed' in life and were too embarrassed to turn up. How sad for them.


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## ntamph (Apr 23, 2013)

WyshIknew said:


> I think it is also true that what can make you unattractive for high jinks as a young man can make you super attractive as an older guy, yea sucks a bit, but that's life, it's not meant to be fair.


I would honestly rather die alone then with a woman whose main reason for being with me is that at least I don't cheat/beat/am chronically unemployed like her ex.

That's not love, it's a marriage of convenience.


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## WyshIknew (Aug 18, 2012)

Ntamph, if it helps, some of the women who once rejected me, even one who laughed at me when I asked her out have made it clear to me that they are available. that's their tough luck, my wife got there first, she won.

Peoples goals, ambitions and preferences change as they get older. A woman who's knickers got wet thinking of one type of guy when she was in her teens may find herself attracted to a totally different kind of man in her late 20's.

Perhaps you were hanging around the wrong women when younger? I have never got that vibe from any women that I know or knew.


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## WyshIknew (Aug 18, 2012)

ntamph said:


> I would honestly rather die alone then with a woman whose main reason for being with me is that at least I don't cheat/beat/am chronically unemployed like her ex.
> 
> That's not love, it's a marriage of convenience.


Where did I say that? :scratchhead:


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## ntamph (Apr 23, 2013)

WyshIknew said:


> A woman who's knickers got wet thinking of one type of guy when she was in her teens may find herself attracted to a totally different kind of man in her late 20's.


That's the thing, I don't think it's real attraction. It's about finding a safe man to raise a family with. Are they glad they found him? Yes. Do they even appreciate him? Yes. But are they really attracted to him, would they do crazy things with him? No. There are many posts from men saying that they have found out their wives were never really into them.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

No one said it, Wysh. ntamph assumes that is how his marriage will turn out.

????


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## ntamph (Apr 23, 2013)

WyshIknew said:


> Where did I say that? :scratchhead:





Faithful Wife said:


> No one said it, Wysh. ntamph assumes that is how his marriage will turn out.
> 
> ????


I don't want my wife telling me "I was crazy over that one guy, did crazy things with him, head over heels in love with him. But, you can keep up with a mortgage so I'll stay with you."


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

Geesh...you might have to stop reading TAM. I'm sorry it is affecting you this way.

There are happy marriages ntamph!!! I swear it!


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## ntamph (Apr 23, 2013)

Faithful Wife said:


> Geesh...you might have to stop reading TAM. I'm sorry it is affecting you this way.
> 
> There are happy marriages ntamph!!! I swear it!


It's not TAM.

I'm the same person I always was. I have always been outgoing and socially confident in mixed groups. Same weight. Same interests. Same everything except I've reached the age when women hear the baby alarm ticking and I've suddenly become a catch.

I can see what's really going on.


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## WyshIknew (Aug 18, 2012)

ntamph said:


> That's the thing, I don't think it's real attraction. It's about finding a safe man to raise a family with. Are they glad they found him? Yes. Do they even appreciate him? Yes. But are they really attracted to him, would they do crazy things with him? No. There are many posts from men saying that they have found out their wives were never really into them.


But this is a site where sometimes people in troubled marriages post.

If you joined a forum that discussed alcohol addiction would you assume that everyone is an alcoholic?

Don't assume the posts here are the norm, they might be, but neither you nor I have the evidence to back that up.

If you go into a relationship with the attitude in your above post then I can't see it ending well.

Often where you see the "I was never into you" posts it is where the wife is in or about to be in an affair and they have to justify this somehow.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

What is wrong with the biological urge to mate and procreate?

Don't you have that urge, too?

Don't you have high standards for who you want to merge with?

Why distrust that you will find a woman who actually IS into you? Based on what? Other people's stories? A woman who wants to marry you and have your babies can ALSO want to F your brains out on the daily. If you don't believe this, you need to find a way to believe it, pronto.


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## WyshIknew (Aug 18, 2012)

ntamph said:


> It's not TAM.
> 
> I'm the same person I always was. I have always been outgoing and socially confident in mixed groups. Same weight. Same interests. Same everything except I've reached the age when women hear the baby alarm ticking and I've suddenly become a catch.
> 
> I can see what's really going on.


Yes. you're a nice handsome stable man who is going to be a great partner, a great dad, rock her world in bed (and out of it )
Fulfill her every fantasy and show her what it's like to be with a real man.

Ok?

You're not going to be all mopey and assume you're just a convenience. You get to win dude. You get the girl!


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

He's also 6'4", hung and has a fat bank account (all by his own account here, and he wasn't even bragging about it). I am still scratching my head as to why he doubts these women are actually into him?


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## ntamph (Apr 23, 2013)

Faithful Wife said:


> What is wrong with the biological urge to mate and procreate?
> 
> Don't you have that urge, too?
> 
> ...





WyshIknew said:


> Yes. you're a nice handsome stable man who is going to be a great partner, a great dad, rock her world in bed (and out of it )
> Fulfill her every fantasy and show her what it's like to be with a real man.
> 
> Ok?
> ...


I don't get these posts.

If I have always been this catch then why was I basically invisible to women from birth until my late 20s?


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

Because neither young women nor young men really want to "catch" each other...they just want to play chase games, have sex, have a lot of drama, and party.

(mostly) Everyone eventually reaches maturity and then seeks out a mate to procreate and bond with.

You need counseling, sweetie. We aren't going to be able to get past your defense logic to what we are saying. You have build an untrue reality in your head....but it will most certainly create a self-fulfilling prophecy if you don't get it outta there.


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## ntamph (Apr 23, 2013)

Faithful Wife said:


> Because neither young women nor young men really want to "catch" each other...they just want to play chase games, have sex, have a lot of drama, and party.
> 
> (mostly) Everyone eventually reaches maturity and then seeks out a mate to procreate and bond with.
> 
> You need counseling, sweetie. We aren't going to be able to get past your defense logic to what we are saying. You have build an untrue reality in your head....but it will most certainly create a self-fulfilling prophecy if you don't get it outta there.


Even if counseling did help me with trusting women more, I can't go back in time to experience the "games, have sex, have a lot of drama, and party" that I would have liked.

I think I've kind of been permanently stunted by that and that it can't ever be fixed.


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

It's not " defense logic."
It's a fact of life.

I've never passed through that what ntamph speaks of but I'm old enough to have seen it happened to a few guys I've known.

When we were much younger, girls always made fun of them and wouldn't be seen dead near them.
Now some of them are very successful in their life and business , even more successful than I ,and guess what?
Yup, women like crazy.

lol, 
One of them always post pics of his travels around the world, and the women he's with on fb. 
Sailing the seas , all over the world , exotic women. He says that he's never going to get married, that this is HIS time now.

I honestly can't judge him or say that he's wrong for feeling that way.


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## WyshIknew (Aug 18, 2012)

ntamph said:


> I don't get these posts.
> 
> If I have always been this catch then why was I basically invisible to women from birth until my late 20s?


I dunno!

Why was I?

Does it matter?

Don't do as I did and over think it, just get out there and have some fun.

It sounds like you have several women interested in you, enjoy them, have fun. I think it will be obvious if any of them just want to use you as a meal ticket.

I repeat, people change, they really do.

I was a swot at school and afterwards as I studied electronics.

Then I wasn't, and I partied. I became much more outgoing, probably more fun.


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## WyshIknew (Aug 18, 2012)

Caribbean Man said:


> It's not " defense logic."
> It's a fact of life.
> 
> I've never passed through that what ntamph speaks of but I'm old enough to have seen it happened to a few guys I've known.
> ...


As I said, people change.

So these people weren't attractive to girls now they are.

So ntamph may or may not have been attractive to women, I don't know.

Now he is, so what? He just needs to get out there and get his tackle used.

I don't see the problem. Make hay while the sun shines.


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## ntamph (Apr 23, 2013)

WyshIknew said:


> I think it will be obvious if any of them just want to use you as a meal ticket.


I agree.

My buddy works in a business that has a relationship with where I work and I sometimes get visit him at work (for work reasons though).

There is a girl there who he told me was noticing and talking about me whenever I visited. He pointed her out. Basically she is very attractive, I would think out of my league.

She kept asking about me and eventually he gave her my info and she contacted me. She actually asked ME out.

We go out for dinner. She works out, owns her own home, has some nerdy interests like me. She's pretty funny to boot. I could tell she was really into me.

Then half way through dinner she asks me if I would be OK dating a woman with a kid. She has a 3 year old girl. The dad didn't want to be a dad. She wanted to tell me now because she knows that most guys don't want to deal with that.

She's basically my dream girl. I don't have a problem with kids, but raising another man's child? Her ex left her, not the other way around.

My gut tells me she just picked a ****ty guy who left her but my brain tells me she's faking it to take me for a ride. Her daughter needs a dad and I'm safe enough to be that guy.

What would you do? Do you see where I'm coming from?


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

WyshIknew said:


> As I said, people change.
> 
> So these people weren't attractive to girls now they are.
> 
> ...


I get what your'e saying.
But why does he need counselling?
To fix what?
That's his view on his history with women and he has every right to analyze it.
In the end he will make his own choices, but I don't think it's fair to judge him and say that he needs counselling to change his view.
If anything, he should use his past experience to guide him in his choice of a woman for a wife _if_ and _when_ he decides to get married.


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## WyshIknew (Aug 18, 2012)

ntamph said:


> I agree.
> 
> My buddy works in a business that has a relationship with where I work and I sometimes get visit him at work (for work reasons though).
> 
> ...


I married her! Well not her of course but you get the picture.

My eldest child was adopted by me. Mrs Wysh got caught and then abandoned when she was nineteen.

My wife and I just basically fell for each other.

What would I do?

Well if she was my dream girl I would date her, get to know her and her family, take it slow and steady. If you get on perhaps introduce a few 'family' outings.

You don't sound like a dumb guy ntamph, in fact you sound pretty intelligent, I'm pretty sure that by taking it slowly you will get a true picture of her intentions.

My favourite quote from my son?

"Any fool can be a father, it takes a man to be a dad."


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## WyshIknew (Aug 18, 2012)

Caribbean Man said:


> I get what your'e saying.
> But why does he need counselling?
> To fix what?
> That's his view on his history with women and he has every right to analyze it.
> ...


I didn't say he needs counselling (I think) that was FW.

I'm not a great fan of counselling to be honest I'd rather sort my own stuff out.


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

WyshIknew said:


> I didn't say he needs counselling (I think) that was FW.
> 
> I'm not a great fan of counselling to be honest I'd rather sort my own stuff out.


Well then we're both saying the same thing!


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

ntamph...I married my first H who already had a child, and then my current H married me and I already had children. Not that everyone could or would get into a blended family, some people just can't. But my family was blended growing up so it just seemed normal in my life. 

If you can't do it, move on and find a new hottie who is into you.


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## ntamph (Apr 23, 2013)

Faithful Wife said:


> ntamph...I married my first H who already had a child, and then my current H married me and I already had children. Not that everyone could or would get into a blended family, some people just can't. But my family was blended growing up so it just seemed normal in my life.
> 
> If you can't do it, move on and find a new hottie who is into you.


I've never had a hottie who was as hot as this one and hot in non-physical ways who is so into me.

I've only kind of met the little girl once and she's as cute as can be. I don't have a problem with kids.

We've only been out together on one date and I would want more but there is always the question "if she didn't have a kid, would she even notice me?"


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

Then go date some others who don't have kids.


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## WyshIknew (Aug 18, 2012)

Caribbean Man said:


> Well then we're both saying the same thing!


Yes, basically.

I just think it is pointless ntamph holding on to resentment as it is going to sour his life and relationships.


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## ntamph (Apr 23, 2013)

Faithful Wife said:


> Then go date some others who don't have kids.


But I want her. I feel like she's special. I don't want to be having these self destructive thoughts but they're there. I wish we could just have an honest talk about where we're coming from in our lives. I think this would go a long way to helping me overcome my insecurities.


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## WyshIknew (Aug 18, 2012)

ntamph said:


> I've never had a hottie who was as hot as this one and hot in non-physical ways who is so into me.
> 
> I've only kind of met the little girl once and she's as cute as can be. I don't have a problem with kids.
> 
> We've only been out together on one date and I would want more but there is always the question "if she didn't have a kid, would she even notice me?"


Well if you ditch her because of an unfortunate incident in her life does that not make you similar to the girls who ignored you when you were younger because of X, Y or Z?


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

ntamph said:


> But I want her. I feel like she's special. I don't want to be having these self destructive thoughts but they're there. *I wish we could just have an honest talk about where we're coming from in our lives. I think this would go a long way to helping me overcome my insecurities.*


:iagree:
It's as simple as that.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

Then have a few more dates with her, scope her out a bit more...and lead her into those conversations. Stop doubting her intentions until you know what they are.


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## ExiledBayStater (Feb 16, 2013)

Ntamph, I have to weigh in here. I was hoping to lose my virginity before 1/1/00, for reasons that only my 17-year-old self would understand. Didn't happen. Not in high school. Not in college. I was getting depressed. Birthdays and New Years Eves came and went. I got much more distracted than you did about it. It's a small wonder that I was able to complete my Master's degree while working full time and being obsessed with finding a relationship, a FWB, anything.

Then it happened. I met a sweet woman, we started a relationship, and eventually had sex. It took a while for the sex to happen because I was so jumpy and ticklish I couldn't respond well to being touched in foreplay. We almost broke up over it. But eventually I overcame my ticklishness (mindfulness and breathing help) and she broke me in. I was 27.

Protip: forget everything you've seen in porn.

As for the woman with the kid, it's understandable if you don't want to raise a child from another man's seed, but I wouldn't read too much into the mother's intentions. You might be right, that she is looking for someone safe enough. On the other hand, she is probably averse to the bad guys after her experiences, and the thought of bringing some d-bag to meet her daughter probably turns her stomach. So it's up to you. Lots of people love their stepchildren, but lots don't. Just be honest with yourself about which category you fall in, and if it's the second, don't get too serious with this woman.


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## WyshIknew (Aug 18, 2012)

Wow Exiled, didn't think there were many of us 'late bloomers' on here.

Wow, what a rush when you finally 'crack it' huh?

I just never realised what it was like, how so effing good it felt, how close you feel to each other. :rofl:


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## ntamph (Apr 23, 2013)

I called her and asked her out to coffee tomorrow morning. The girl will be with her grandparents. I really want to get to know her better. She seemed excited. I shouldn't let what might be a great catch like her get away.


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## WyshIknew (Aug 18, 2012)

Good!

Enjoy yourself, enjoy being with a gorgeous, interesting woman.


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## ExiledBayStater (Feb 16, 2013)

MrAvg said:


> I guess I am not in the majority. I was a virgin twice. First girl was slightly older and some what experienced. Being a young guy with PE can be awkward. She said she enjoyed the experience and was very kind to me.
> 
> So it took me a couple years to get up the courage for a second time thus the skewed logic of being a virgin twice. Both ladies I told them I was a virgin, it was clear to all anyway.


Now I'm thinking of the old Simpson's episode where Principal Skinner professes to be a virgin to refute claims he is having an affair with the teacher.


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## WyshIknew (Aug 18, 2012)

MrAvg said:


> It seemed to be a better way to explain the likely quick draw and also how I was clearly not experienced. The second girl taught be a lot and enjoyed the teaching, she was very well experienced and even helped me with my PE.
> 
> I was told later is was a topic in the ladies gathering. But in general I heard it was positive. So virgins and inexperienced guys have/had PE problems in the past. Second time takes longer, when younger that was about 15 minutes later.


Yea, that was me too. So damn excited and randy that it was over in a few minutes.

And yes, wouldn't it be nice to know what you know now and have that younger body that could go again minutes later!


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## Dollystanford (Mar 14, 2012)

Well there was certainly no breakage involved


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## WyshIknew (Aug 18, 2012)

Dollystanford said:


> Well there was certainly no breakage involved







Well unless you broke his heart.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

Faithful Wife said:


> Because neither young women nor young men really want to "catch" each other...they just want to play chase games, have sex, have a lot of drama, and party.


 this is why being on this forum sometimes makes me feel like *I don't belong*... it seems the vast majority of people, in their youth, has this mindset... I never did...we wanted to be caught.. and fall in love... never had an allure for the partying lifestyle in any way, shape of form...and neither has my husband. 



ntamph said:


> I think if you're a guy and still a virgin in college, or, God forbid, make it through college a virgin (like me), you are pretty much screwed.
> 
> I was 22 when it finally happened. I had a girl interested in me once then a douche bag friend of my told her my secret and all attraction disappeared when I was 19 I think.
> 
> ...


 I hate threads like this...because most would agree with you on what you said here...they are just too damn nice to outright say it... I had 2 posts on this thread, I deleted them... our oldest is still a virgin (by choice) at age 23... you know it's near embarrassing for me to say this... because I know everyone will secretly be thinking ..." What in the hell is wrong with [email protected]#"...

And I don't think there is anything really wrong with him at all... just that...those are his beliefs... and he is geared a Romantic soul...he got a double dose of this from Mom & Dad I suppose... poor thing...

He has no desire to have sex with a variety of women, but damn it.. this makes him a freak of nature....in today's society.


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## ntamph (Apr 23, 2013)

SimplyAmorous said:


> I hate threads like this...because most would agree with you on what you said here...they are just too damn nice to outright say it... I had 2 posts on this thread, I deleted them... our oldest is still a virgin (by choice) at age 23... you know it's near embarrassing for me to say this... because I know everyone will secretly be thinking ..." What in the hell is wrong with [email protected]#"...


This is why the whole "You'll regret not waiting for your husband/wife" religious thing is a steaming pile of you know what to me.

What about going through a significant part of your life without experiencing romantic love and relationships? I didn't experiment not for religious religions but I never really knew what it's like to be young and in love or even just lust.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

MrAvg said:


> I was told later is was a topic in the ladies gathering. But in general I heard it was positive. *So virgins and inexperienced guys have/had PE problems in the past.* Second time takes longer, when younger that was about 15 minutes later.


 My husband didn't stick it in me till he was 25 yrs old... He never had any Premature Ejaculation issues at all... so this is not always true... he was amazing...once we got it in (that is).... I was always satisfied and would tell him what a great lover he was... (not that I had anything to compare).

If he did struggle with PE... I probably would have complained... I know me & I always *wanted mine*....he rarely went before me...and when he did, I would pound on him saying ..."NO ... NO.. I wanted that !"...and tell him he was going to do it again... (back then he could) 

I was so "sex clueless" back then, I used to think we were just "in sync" all those years - climaxing at the same time...(always his aim).... little did I know he was just holding back. .he was a master at this.. and has been as long as we've been together....my dear virgin husband..


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

SimplyAmorous said:


> And I don't think there is anything really wrong with him at all... just that...those are his beliefs... and he is geared a Romantic soul...he got a double dose of this from Mom & Dad I suppose... poor thing...
> 
> He has no desire to have sex with a variety of women, but damn it.. this makes him a freak of nature....in today's society.


There's absolutely nothing wrong with him.

What's wrong is that a small bunch of people in society seem hell bent on dictating to the public, exactly how they should value their sexuality, and they get very angry when people tell them anything about _their _sexual choices.



I believe that what people do in the privacy of their own homes / rooms with their lives, the values they treasure, is their own business .


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## TiggyBlue (Jul 29, 2012)

Caribbean Man said:


> I believe that what people do in the privacy of their own homes / rooms with their lives, the values they treasure, is their own business .


:iagree:


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

ntamph said:


> This is why the whole "*You'll regret not waiting for your husband/wife"* religious thing is a steaming pile of you know what to me.


 Oh Ntamph, you are stomping on my views with this.... I was one of those who felt very very strongly...to wait for 1 man....(never regretted this and would do it all over the same)....I also wanted a man who felt the same as I (very very rare to find in society, I consider him one in a million)....he also has no regrets... part of this may have been what I was taught (of course)... but much was also due to what I have seen / witnessed in others.....messing up their lives - sleeping around too young... 

Something deep within me...was always a ROMANTIC... I was young, I had *time* on my side.. I wanted the Fairy tale...I wanted marriage, kids, a good father, all of it..... so this was never a steaming pile of sh** to me... 

Back in the day...I could have articulated very well the why's I felt as strongly as I did...and I would have to say...probably less than 10% of that had to do with religion at all ....

Below explains the Romantic view of sexuality.... which is a little different from the Covenant View (Religious constraints to ONLY Have sex within marriage -to satisfy some man in the sky)......it was deeper than that for me & him..... 

Read the 6 sexual views/ lenses ...HERE



> *3. ** Romantic View *~
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


> Originally Posted by *ntamph :* What about going through a significant part of your life without experiencing romantic love and relationships? I didn't experiment not for religious religions but I never really knew what it's like to be young and in love or even just lust.


 This would be very difficult... and I can see how this would tumble a young man's self esteem...so you wanted things that were not within your reach...and you struggle with women who now seem to want what you have and you don't feel it is genuine ? 



> *Caribbean Man said*: There's absolutely nothing wrong with him.
> 
> What's wrong is that *a small bunch of people in society* seem hell bent on dictating to the public, exactly how they should value their sexuality, and they get very angry when people tell them anything about their sexual choices.


 Love your take on it ..of course....I am laughing at "the small" though.... it's not small... Our son holds his head up high, he is as outspoken as me....he is not ashamed of his choices... 

I always challenge him to THINK - I have even tried to corrupt him in some ways... it's not the normal scenario by far... I offered him $50 once (hey a college student needs $$).. to write me up his take on WHY Women shun men like him.. the virgins...and run after all the alpha players... who love them & leave them.... He shot me back about 4 paragraphs ... it was very insightful.. he knows exactly what he is doing... wasn't any religion in that piece either...and he even GETS totally why women go after what they go after... (If anyone wants me to post what he wrote , ask me - I have it saved somewhere...just have to find it)...


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

Caribbean Man said:


> I believe that what people do in the privacy of their own homes / rooms with their lives, the values they treasure, is their own business .


Yes, but on forums like this... we love to talk about it - don't we....and why not.. it's FUN....Those who hold these "older fashioned" virtues...we are the weird ones now... it used to be "sl** shaming"... now it's "virgin bashing"....one can google that... as I have ...articles a mile long can be read .....

I guess....depending on what side of the aisle one is on... will determine if we feel trampled some... Today most people prefer EXPERIENCE... test driving... all of it before they marry... would anyone like to argue this with me ??

That's our praised norm...and if you don't ...you will be deemed very foolish.... Romanticism is just about dead... Pleasure , living in the moment has replaced this....and religion, to the majority is nothing more than a JOKE...

This is what I see all around me... well in my smaller town, we are not total freaks, but I do find I have more in common with those who go to church...than those who do not...on the sexuality front anyway.


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## treyvion (Apr 29, 2013)

I just wanted to add, that a female who did get with a virgin or a low mileage dude could brag about making him the lover he is today.


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