# Update jason h



## jasonh

Well I followed the advice that was given to me on here. Last night I confronted my wife and explained to her that I will no longer permit OM to come and go as he pleases as long as my kids and I are in the house. She basically tried to tell me that I don't have much of a choice because my name isn't on the morgatge. WRONG! I know my rights. She then told me "I don't wanna talk about this right now". I told her too bad. Either she call him and tell him that he's not allowed over here or I will call her dad and expose her immediately. She then grabbed the tv remote and turned the volume up super loud to try to drown me out. I calmly walked over to the tv and unplugged it. She then said "get out of my room or ill call the cops on you". At this point I laughed and said calling the cops is a waste of time because I did nothing wrong. She then replied "you are assaulting me". I replied HOW!? So she grabs her phone and walks outside. I slam the door behind her and just go watch tv in the guestroom. I wasn't worried about the cops because I had the VAR on me the whole time!! Like 10 minutes later she comes back inside with a male and a female cop. The guy cop tells me to come into the kitchen with him and answer some questions. He asks me why did I threaten my wife!! I told him that I NEVER threatened her I just told her I'm not going to put up with her cheating ways anymore. I then told him about the VAR and he was cool about. He listened to some of it and told me to hold on a minute and went to talk to the female cop. Then he and the female cop asked me to come outside with them and chat. I already knew this wasn't a good sign because this woman looked like she hated men just because. Anyway once I got outside the guy cop explains that I did nothing to be arrested but he thinks it would be a good idea if I found another place to stay for the night. I try to explain that I pay the bills in the house so why do I have to leave MY home? The female cop then says "sir we aren't asking you to leave, we are TELLING you to leave or else you will be arrested". So I left and ended up paying 80 bucks for a hotel room. Honestly I was too embarassed to call friends or family. This morning I get a call from her dad asking me "why did I assault his daughter"? WTF!!! I told him EVERYTHING. I didn't hold anything back at all. And his response was" well just give her some space and let her clear her head. Just don't go back to the house until she's comfortable with you being there". So here I am. I missed work today because I have been too busy looking for an affordable lawyer. I should have went with my gut and waited it out. Oh well I guess now I know that ***** is not the same woman I married. I think its time for war and now I'm gonna do things my way.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## WorkingOnMe

This is exactly what happens when the BS is the one fighting to stay married. If you really want to fix this you will have to file for divorce. If there's any chance, then that might wake her up. And if there is no chance then at least that will speed up the break up.


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## warlock07

jasonh said:


> Well I followed the advice that was given to me on here. Last night I confronted my wife and explained to her that I will no longer permit OM to come and go as he pleases as long as my kids and I are in the house. She basically tried to tell me that I don't have much of a choice because my name isn't on the morgatge. WRONG! I know my rights. She then told me "I don't wanna talk about this right now". I told her too bad. Either she call him and tell him that he's not allowed over here or I will call her dad and expose her immediately. She then grabbed the tv remote and turned the volume up super loud to try to drown me out. I calmly walked over to the tv and unplugged it. She then said "get out of my room or ill call the cops on you". At this point I laughed and said calling the cops is a waste of time because I did nothing wrong. She then replied "you are assaulting me". I replied HOW!? So she grabs her phone and walks outside. I slam the door behind her and just go watch tv in the guestroom. I wasn't worried about the cops because I had the VAR on me the whole time!! Like 10 minutes later she comes back inside with a male and a female cop. The guy cop tells me to come into the kitchen with him and answer some questions. He asks me why did I threaten my wife!! I told him that I NEVER threatened her I just told her I'm not going to put up with her cheating ways anymore. I then told him about the VAR and he was cool about. He listened to some of it and told me to hold on a minute and went to talk to the female cop. Then he and the female cop asked me to come outside with them and chat. I already knew this wasn't a good sign because this woman looked like she hated men just because. Anyway once I got outside the guy cop explains that I did nothing to be arrested but he thinks it would be a good idea if I found another place to stay for the night. I try to explain that I pay the bills in the house so why do I have to leave MY home? The female cop then says "sir we aren't asking you to leave, we are TELLING you to leave or else you will be arrested". So I left and ended up paying 80 bucks for a hotel room. Honestly I was too embarassed to call friends or family. This morning I get a call from her dad asking me "why did I assault his daughter"? WTF!!! I told him EVERYTHING. I didn't hold anything back at all. And his response was" well just give her some space and let her clear her head. Just don't go back to the house until she's comfortable with you being there". So here I am. I missed work today because I have been too busy looking for an affordable lawyer. I should have went with my gut and waited it out. Oh well I guess now I know that ***** is not the same woman I married. I think its time for war and now I'm gonna do things my way.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


This was going to happen sooner or later. Take care of the kids, get a divorce and move on. There is nothing to save here except making sure that kids are not f*cked up


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## morituri

Keep the VARs recordings and make copies of them. Contact an attorney and have him/her file a complaint on your behalf to the police department internal affairs department or chief of police where the female police officer works. The reason is that since your wife was able to get the police to come to the house and kick you out, she'll again try this tactic in the future. If there is another encounter with the police, and the same female officer arrives at the scene, she may think twice about kicking you out again or trying to falsely arrest you. And this will also protect you in case of divorce where she claims that you were abusing her. You can prove to the judge that she is lying and that the police officer exceeded her authority by showing a copy of the complaint filed against the police officer and any other replies from the internal affairs department or chief of police.


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## Eli-Zor

morituri said:


> Keep the VARs recordings and make copies of them. Contact an attorney and have him/her file a complaint on your behalf to the police department internal affairs department or chief of police where the female police officer works. The reason is that since your wife was able to get the police to come to the house and kick you out, she'll again try this tactic in the future. If there is another encounter with the police, and the same female officer arrives at the scene, she may think twice about kicking you out again or trying to falsely arrest you. And this will also protect you in case of divorce where she claims that you were abusing her. You can prove to the judge that she is lying and that the police officer exceeded her authority by showing a copy of the complaint filed against the police officer and any other replies from the internal affairs department or chief of police.



Agree


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## jnj express

Just make sure you have dead on evidence of what happened, and the report where you were told by the police to leave----this is gonna be an ugly D., and do not put it past your wife, to go after you for ABANDONMENT---now that you have left the home

Keep copies of everything from now on---and stop paying any bills, 

Get all money into an acct. with your name on it, only---stop any insurances you cover her with---you know where her family stands---just get your D., and get away from her.


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## Shaggy

FYI Listen to morituri he knows this stuff cold from the inside.

Good job on the var. play it for the attorney you talk to and tell him your goals.

1. To move back into your home
2. Notify the police dept that your wife is filing false claims with them, that you have her on a var admitting to this
3. You want a RO against the OM, to keep him away from you, the kids, and family home
4. Inform the father in law that he may own the place, but YOU are the person living there. If he wans to make you move out, he must evict you which will include your children.
5. Seek full custody, but be willing to negotiate down to 50%
6. Cut off ALL her access to cash and credit TODAY
7. You buy the food and stuff the kids need, plus keep all receipts.

8. Dump the bed she used with OM in the trash. She can sleep on the floor.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## mahike

File for divorce but get your butt back into the house. They were not going to arrest you. They had nothing to go on. If you are out she can make a case for you not going back in. Take her Dad iwth you and keep the VAR going.

Does the OM have someone you can confront parents ect...... Make sure you do not raise a hand and do not make threats.


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## Kallan Pavithran

So she kicked you out of the house and you luckily escaped from staying in jail. We told you this earlier that your wife is not the Angel you married, you told us we dont know anything. We are seeing a lot of this every day.

Now its you turn to fight for your kids and save them from this POS. See the lawyer and file for D.


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## morituri

jasonh said:


> Oh well I guess now I know that ***** is not the same woman I married. I think its time for war and now I'm gonna do things my way.


So you finally opened your eyes to what we've been telling you as far what your wife truly is: a selfish, cruel, dishonest woman who cares nothing for you nor her kids.


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## crazyconfused

Just a heads up. Being Military law enforcement, I want to clear something up. A lot of departments have mandatory procedures they have to follow when responding to a domestic call, and splitting the couple up for a 24 cool down procedure is the norm. 

That being said, if she was unprofessional then have at her. But I would check with the PD that responded to your house about thief procedures. You can call or go see the watch commander or desk sergant on duty, they can clear that up for you. Having a complaint in against a cop might not help her attitude towards you in the future if you have future dealings with her where you need that good grace... Keep in mind a lot of female cops are harda$$es because they have to be on the job to get respect
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Cosmos

Had you gone to the authorities as we all advised you to, you could have prevented this from happening. Instead, you laid yourself wide open to a false allegation of domestic violence, and it's my guess she will endeavour to use that against you in any divorce proceedings.

Get yourself the best lawyer you can afford as soon as possible.


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## Acabado

Shark lawyer ASAP


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## jasonh

morituri said:


> Keep the VARs recordings and make copies of them. Contact an attorney and have him/her file a complaint on your behalf to the police department internal affairs department or chief of police where the female police officer works. The reason is that since your wife was able to get the police to come to the house and kick you out, she'll again try this tactic in the future. If there is another encounter with the police, and the same female officer arrives at the scene, she may think twice about kicking you out again or trying to falsely arrest you. And this will also protect you in case of divorce where she claims that you were abusing her. You can prove to the judge that she is lying and that the police officer exceeded her authority by showing a copy of the complaint filed against the police officer and any other replies from the internal affairs department or chief of police.


After speaking with a couple of lawyers with all due respect to women, this whole "womens rights" issue has gone way too far. Seriously this country is on its way to hell. I basically have to spend thousands of dollars out of my hard earned money just to PROVE that I'm a worthy father for my kids, but she is already assumed to be a good mother and dosent have to spend a dime. Wtf. I couldn't give a **** about OM right now. Nows its just about my kids and my dignity. God forgive me for saying this but if this woman got hit by a bus right now and died I wouldn't give a ****.I have been the bigger man and have taken the high road all of this time only to be ****ed over by my wife and when I try to get advice from someone who wouldn't judge me I end up being called a "troll" etc. Dude if u don't believe my story then get the **** off of my thread. Seriously you don't have to be here. Go read a book or something. I'm not here for your amusement. And for those who are truley trying to help thank you. Please excuse my language but I am really stressed right now.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Acabado

> Nows its just about my kids and my dignity


Glad to hear it. Go dark on her. Don't engage in any way, shape or form. Protect your self ASAP. Forget about FIL, he will follow her every step. SHARK agressive of lawyer, dad's advocate.


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## JustAnotherGuy

Careful with this kind of woman. I remember when I was married to my first wife, she called the police and said I was abusing her, yet I was the one with black eyes and marks on my throat. The psych of these types of women are unbelievable.


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## Beelzebub

look at positive things

1- everyone in this life has to spend money on his her kids eventually in one way or another. the money you spending are for the kids.
2- you will find a better person
3- have your freedome
4- she will get dumbed after he gets bored from her
5- and she wont find anyone spend money on her
6- have fun.


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## Cosmos

> Please excuse my language but I am really stressed right now.


Well channeled, anger can be a good thing as it helps us act. This is a time for action, OP.


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## Shaggy

Next time she tres to play the calling cops card,you should pull out your phone and be the one to place the call.

Inform the police you have a domestic situation where your wife is attempting to intimidate and force you from your home so she can bring over her bf.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Shaggy

Oh, and the money you spend on this can come from the money you will be denying her access too.

Btw, call the place OM works and inform the boss about the situation, and that you are going to be posting online reviews of his place with the details of the OM screwing married customers.

I'm sure prospective husbands will be a lot less willing to pay for their wives going there after that.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## JustAnotherGuy

Shaggy, you're on a roll!


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## happyman64

And Jason,

When you go back in the house to get your stuff do it while your wife and kids are not there.

Keep the VAR on you and on at all times. Even recording the police.

And lastly, get the gun out of the house and away from your wife.

Or she just might use it on you.

Stranger things have happened.

Start using your head and thinking 2 steps ahead of her.

HM64


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## calif_hope

Every time on TAM as I recall, when a BS spouse has VAR evidence to support non assault and the WW plan to falsely accuse assault - the WW is asked to leave or is arrested for making a knowingly making a false accusation to the police but you are of course the exception.

If your story is true get your ass to the cops and file a complaint against your WW and check and see if the cops followed policy - in my area, lies to the cops in domestic violence will see the lier's a$$ in jail......

Just saying
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## diwali123

She doesn't have to spend a dime? Really? So she gets a free lawyer? 
I don't think you really understand the way the courts work. It varies from state to state but if you are going to have a contested divorce and fight over custody you need to get a lawyer. She has no advantage in court, I wish that were true. I wouldn't have wasted so much money on my divorce. 
One thing I can tell you is when it comes to the law, I know it's hard, but cut through your emotions, what you think the law is or should be, and soak up every little thing your lawyer says and does. Don't waste time making plans or assuming things until you find out the reality from the lawyer or hear the decision of the court on something. I've seen too many people work themselves up, convinced things were a certain way only to find out its the opposite. 
I can't believe her dad didn't get upset about her affair.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## the guy

So let the war begin.

First off stop looking at this a getting screwed over but rather the price you need to pay to get free from cheating wife.

So are you going to file a complaint with the PD?

Have you canceled all the credit cards and cell, and any other services other then utilities?

Are you going to expose this to the OMs work and family?


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## 827Aug

Please stop hijacking this thread with troll accusations. If you have a problem with this thread, please report it.

Thanks!


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## warlock07

Usually in this domestic violence/abuse situations the one who makes the call first will have the advantage. Multiply bt 10 if a woman makes such a call.


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## MattMatt

827Aug said:


> Please stop hijacking this thread with troll accusations. If you have a problem with this thread, please report it.
> 
> Thanks!


:iagree:

As I used to say when helping to moderate a board: "There's a report function for a reason. If you have a concern with a post, report it, don't jump up and down screaming: "troll!!"


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## Kallan Pavithran

Now see a shark lawyer and make a plan to deal with this mess (with the help of your lawyer) and stick to it.


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## jasonh

So I transferred half of my money into another checking account this morning. She has mobile banking so whenever there is any major transactions with the account she gets a text alert on her phone. She calls me and asks if I did it and I tell her yes. She starts yelling and saying that I am selfish and taking food off of the table for my kids. I tell her no I'm just not going to let her dictate what I spend my money on from now on. She hung up on me. Then I get a call from her dad and he starts telling me that I'm immature and I need to grow up. I asked him what he would do if he were in my situation and he replies" I would never be in your situation because I am responsible man and I take full accountability for my own actions". I told him I recognized my mistakes by not being there for her but she won't let me prove that I'm all she needs and more. So he says "well you prove that by not acting like a child and taking money out of the bank account just to be spiteful". I honestly didn't do it to be spiteful. I did it because I wanted to start separating myself from her. So now I look even more evil than before while she's being treated like the damsel in distress. Go figure.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## jasonh

warlock07 said:


> Usually in this domestic violence/abuse situations the one who makes the call first will have the advantage. Multiply bt 10 if a woman makes such a call.


Especially in florida. Men basically are second class citizens in the eyes of law enforcement.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## jasonh

the guy said:


> So let the war begin.
> 
> First off stop looking at this a getting screwed over but rather the price you need to pay to get free from cheating wife.
> 
> So are you going to file a complaint with the PD?
> 
> Have you canceled all the credit cards and cell, and any other services other then utilities?
> 
> Are you going to expose this to the OMs work and family?


I called and spoke to the PD and they said they will look into it but says that the female officer was just "following protocol". Whatever I'm not gonna consume myself with that. I have bigger fish to fry.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## costa200

jasonh said:


> So I transferred half of my money into another checking account this morning. She has mobile banking so whenever there is any major transactions with the account she gets a text alert on her phone. She calls me and asks if I did it and I tell her yes. She starts yelling and saying that I am selfish and taking food off of the table for my kids. I tell her no I'm just not going to let her dictate what I spend my money on from now on. She hung up on me. Then I get a call from her dad and he starts telling me that I'm immature and I need to grow up. I asked him what he would do if he were in my situation and he replies" I would never be in your situation because I am responsible man and I take full accountability for my own actions". I told him I recognized my mistakes by not being there for her but she won't let me prove that I'm all she needs and more. So he says "well you prove that by not acting like a child and taking money out of the bank account just to be spiteful". I honestly didn't do it to be spiteful. I did it because I wanted to start separating myself from her. So now I look even more evil than before while she's being treated like the damsel in distress. Go figure.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Ok, at what point are you going to consider telling her father to STFU and have some shame on having raised a wh.... ??

Seriously dude, it's not bad enough your wife doing this stuff and you still take crap from her daddy? What the hell??!! Time to go to LION MODE:










You seem to aways be on the fence and unsure about everything. That attitude right now isn't really healthy. You need to defend what's yours and do it FOR REAL.



> I called and spoke to the PD and they said they will look into it but says that the female officer was just "following protocol".


Did you asked if the protocol said specifically "if male then guilty"?


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## Lon

I agree with costa, who the fck cares what her daddy thinks of ou, he's already shown you where his loyalty lies, he's part of the other camp. Now that you know this you can tell him to shove it, zip it, etc whatever because it does not involve him. You didn't marry him and his name is not on your marriage certificate, nor will it be on the divorce certificate.

And I would advise that only abusive men are viewed by police officers as second class... so don't appear abusive to them, just keep your cool if you have any more run ins.


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## Shaggy

And what about the lawyer?

so her father is going to stand beside princess no matter what, so realize that and stop taking calls from him. Dude won't give you a fair hearing, so stop wasting time with him.

Get that lawyer working for you.

meanwhile - hit the CC and if you have direct pay from work - stop it going to the joint account.


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## rrrbbbttt

Hey, you are in a battle with your wife because she cheated.

NOTE; SHE CHEATED.

The next time her Dad calls tell him that this would not have happened unless HIS DAUGHTER WENT AND HAD SEX WITH ANOTHER MAN OUTSIDE OF MARRIAGE, WHILE HER CHILDREN, HIS GRANDCHILDREN WERE AT HOME WITH THEIR FATHER.


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## aug

rrrbbbttt said:


> Hey, you are in a battle with your wife because she cheated.
> 
> NOTE; SHE CHEATED.
> 
> The next time her Dad calls tell him that this would not have happened unless HIS DAUGHTER WENT AND HAD SEX WITH ANOTHER MAN OUTSIDE OF MARRIAGE, WHILE HER CHILDREN, HIS GRANDCHILDREN WERE AT HOME WITH THEIR FATHER.



And then asked why he did not teach her morality. You can blameshift this on him too.


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## turnera

Don't move out of your house. Go to Best Buy and buy a handful of video cameras and install them all over your house set to record to a DVR SOMEWHERE ELSE! Go back home today or you'll have set a precedent and you won't get back in. Bring some friends with you; ask them to just hang out at the house for free food for a few days. Let her see you aren't backing down.


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## turnera

jason, who cares what her dad thinks? HE is the reason she's so entitled; would you expect any less?

Just ignore him. Keep a VAR on you at all times and if you have to be in the house alone with her, keep those cameras rolling.


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## SadSamIAm

I agree with the others. 

You need to put this back on the father. Whenever he calls, be direct. Tell him that his daughter is screwing another man. Tell him directly that you won't tolerate cheating, that you are protecting yourself. 

Ask him what he is doing to stop her affair. Tell him that as long as his daughter is screwing another man, their is no point in him calling you.


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## turnera

Yeah, it sounds like you do a lot of sucking up to him; I suspect it's a pattern, and they (wife and father) like it that way.

Time to 'grow up' and stop being HIS doormat. Show some anger, some dedication, and LEAD your family.


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## morituri

BRAVO! You now have implemented a consequence of her cruel and selfish betrayal. Let the OM and her father pay all of her financial needs. She may hate your guts but deep down she knows she deserves what you did.


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## OldWolf57

ok caughtup now. J, you mean to tell us you are letting this pos walk around still without doing anything?? F**k the house, dad owns it. shut down all financials she has access to. then get the ball rolling on exposing his a** and her. you owe this woman nothing now. I live in So. Fl. and know where the big gators lay, so I never worry, cause I am polar cold when crossed. this is something you need now too. your fantasy of R, is just that. her and dad will always look at you like a cucks paycheck from now on. NO, I am not telling you to do anything violent, some just don.t have that in themselves, but you really do need to start playing like you don't give a damn anymore. Some guy tell you he can hit you at 500, an you fold, where did you grow up man ?? you can not be from here.


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## Cosmos

What your W or FIL think is immaterial right now. This is about you and your kids. You didn't abandon her (something you would have been well within your rights to do), she had you removed from the marital home. That her father is taking her side in this mess, knowing what he does, lends wisdom to the saying that "the apple doesn't fall far from the tree..."

Get an interim maintenance order in place for your kids, and don't give her a cent more than you legally have to.

Well done about protecting your financial interests the way you have done!


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## matt82

jasonh said:


> So I transferred half of my money into another checking account this morning. She has mobile banking so whenever there is any major transactions with the account she gets a text alert on her phone. She calls me and asks if I did it and I tell her yes. She starts yelling and saying that I am selfish and taking food off of the table for my kids. I tell her no I'm just not going to let her dictate what I spend my money on from now on. She hung up on me. Then I get a call from her dad and he starts telling me that I'm immature and I need to grow up. I asked him what he would do if he were in my situation and he replies" I would never be in your situation because I am responsible man and I take full accountability for my own actions". I told him I recognized my mistakes by not being there for her but she won't let me prove that I'm all she needs and more. So he says "well you prove that by not acting like a child and taking money out of the bank account just to be spiteful". I honestly didn't do it to be spiteful. I did it because I wanted to start separating myself from her. So now I look even more evil than before while she's being treated like the damsel in distress. Go figure.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Don't take anything seriously that her daddy says. Dads are completely blind to their daughter's faults in these situations. As the old saying goes, "Blood is thicker than water." Just cut off all contact with the guy as he'll side with his daughter no matter what.

You're not doing this just to be spiteful. You're beating her to the punch, because she likely would have cleared out the ENTIRE balance. I would also call all of your credit card companies to put holds on those accounts. My ex tried to rack up huge credit card debt when we separated, but I put a hold on all the accounts and had them mail me new cards with new account numbers.


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## kruppmart

Be careful and ahead of her game, she might get a protection order on you which will not allow you to return to the house (bad) nor contacting her (might be good). That's what my STBXW did to me ... told the police I hit her ==> domestic violence ==> protection order.
She is living since 3 months in the house, together with the OM (!!) which is in my name only, which I am paying mortgage and utilities for .... plus driving a car which is in my name and I am paying for ... while I am staying in cheap hotels and rented basements.

All what it needed was saying "He hit me", without any evidence (well, the OM confirmed what the said ...)!

And in regards to her dad, forget him and the rest of her family ... they will always side with her, she is the daughter. You can't win. My STBXW is a known serial cheater, but her parents are her biggest supporter...


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## badbane

jasonh said:


> So I transferred half of my money into another checking account this morning. She has mobile banking so whenever there is any major transactions with the account she gets a text alert on her phone. She calls me and asks if I did it and I tell her yes. She starts yelling and saying that I am selfish and taking food off of the table for my kids. I tell her no I'm just not going to let her dictate what I spend my money on from now on. She hung up on me. Then I get a call from her dad and he starts telling me that I'm immature and I need to grow up. I asked him what he would do if he were in my situation and he replies" I would never be in your situation because I am responsible man and I take full accountability for my own actions". I told him I recognized my mistakes by not being there for her but she won't let me prove that I'm all she needs and more. So he says "well you prove that by not acting like a child and taking money out of the bank account just to be spiteful". I honestly didn't do it to be spiteful. I did it because I wanted to start separating myself from her. So now I look even more evil than before while she's being treated like the damsel in distress. Go figure.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Why is your wife running to daddy for everything. I think you nailed the reason why your wife is the way she is. She has daddy's little girl syndrome. Anything she ever did was okay cause daddy would take care of it. I am willing to bet her father has never made his little girl suffer. Even now I bet she is spewing bs venom and her father soaks it all up and his perfect daughter is never at fault.

I think your best bet is to stop talking to both of them. When you do, tell them like it is. Stop being nice to either of them. If they are not on your side. They are part of the problem. I hate to say it but you are literally at war now. Don't hold back, don't yield, stand your ground emotionally, and fight back. 
If her dad calls you again just tell him that if his daughter hadn't decided to bang someone other than you we wouldn't be in this mess. Also tell him that this is none of his business and if he wants to complain do so you your wife. Tell him if she can't talk to you and feels like she i going to run to daddy. that she can stay with him and you are done dealing with him this is between you and your wife. Then hang up the phone.


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## lordmayhem

badbane said:


> Why is your wife running to daddy for everything. I think you nailed the reason why your wife is the way she is. She has daddy's little girl syndrome. Anything she ever did was okay cause daddy would take care of it. I am willing to bet her father has never made his little girl suffer. Even now I bet she is spewing bs venom and her father soaks it all up and his perfect daughter is never at fault.
> 
> I think your best bet is to stop talking to both of them. When you do, tell them like it is. Stop being nice to either of them. If they are not on your side. They are part of the problem. I hate to say it but you are literally at war now. Don't hold back, don't yield, stand your ground emotionally, and fight back.
> If her dad calls you again just tell him that if his daughter hadn't decided to bang someone other than you we wouldn't be in this mess. Also tell him that this is none of his business and if he wants to complain do so you your wife. Tell him if she can't talk to you and feels like she i going to run to daddy. that she can stay with him and you are done dealing with him this is between you and your wife. Then hang up the phone.


:iagree:

She's the typical *spoiled, entitled princess*. That's why they're living in a house own by her dad. Of course, daddy is going to defend his little girl, right or wrong, no matter what.

With that sort of entitlement, this marriage was doomed from the start. What the princess wants, the princess gets.


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## jasonh

I have narrowed it down to two lawyers. Honestly I have a hard time trusting lawyers because yes they are sharks but they make a living by capatilizing on others misfortune. Wayward spouses do nothing but help the betrayed spouse to put money in these lawyers pockets. This whole process is so expensive, I'm going to be in serious debt after this. One of the lawyers asked me do I have a PI. How the hell can I afford a PI??? Seriously. I stopped by the house on my lunch break to see the kids and she asked me if I was coming to get my stuff. I told her that technically I still live here and I will come and go as I please. She responded "why don't you just grow up". I told her that I am grown its just so hard to believe I was married to a 5lut after all this time. She then said that its not her fault she fell in love with someone else and as humans we can't help who we do or don't fall in love with. I asked her why would she let herself even go that far if she was married with a family. Her response was "I was hurting". I told her that I would have done anything to help her past the pain if she only would have communicated with me. Now we have two kids who will grow up with split parents. Her response was "who's fault is that". Is she really blaming me for all of this? I think she is so guilty that she can't think straight.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## kruppmart

jasonh said:


> ... I think she is so guilty that she can't think straight.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I don't believe in this. That is blame shifting. My STBXW tries the same (as I heard from friends). She did not show any remorse nor conscience. A cheater has no respect, no loyality, no morals


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## Cosmos

> I stopped by the house on my lunch break to see the kids and she asked me if I was coming to get my stuff. I told her that technically I still live here and I will come and go as I please. She responded "why don't you just grow up". I told her that I am grown its just so hard to believe I was married to a 5lut after all this time. She then said that its not her fault she fell in love with someone else and as humans we can't help who we do or don't fall in love with.


I would have as little to say to her as possible, Jason, and I'd document every single transaction with her.

You really don't need to be hearing her excuses right now because, in reality, she has none. Married people don't place themselves in positions where they can "fall in love" with someone else.


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## akashNil

jasonh said:


> I have narrowed it down to two lawyers. Honestly I have a hard time trusting lawyers because yes they are sharks but they make a living by capatilizing on others misfortune. Wayward spouses do nothing but help the betrayed spouse to put money in these lawyers pockets. This whole process is so expensive, I'm going to be in serious debt after this. One of the lawyers asked me do I have a PI. How the hell can I afford a PI??? Seriously. I stopped by the house on my lunch break to see the kids and she asked me if I was coming to get my stuff. I told her that technically I still live here and I will come and go as I please. She responded "why don't you just grow up". I told her that I am grown its just so hard to believe I was married to a 5lut after all this time. She then said that its not her fault she fell in love with someone else and as humans we can't help who we do or don't fall in love with. I asked her why would she let herself even go that far if she was married with a family. Her response was "I was hurting". I told her that I would have done anything to help her past the pain if she only would have communicated with me. Now we have two kids who will grow up with split parents. Her response was "who's fault is that". Is she really blaming me for all of this? I think she is so guilty that she can't think straight.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


You will never win this WAR by arguments. Only QUICK actions will help you come out of it. Best of luck for that. Its never too late.

And why half the money transferred? Why not full?


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## turnera

Are you telling us you're not going back to live in your own house today?


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## OldWolf57

now that you don't have to pay rent to dad you will have money. your kids needs anything, buy it and keep the sales slips. this will show a judge you took care of your kids. the house is dads, so let him collect rent from her and pos. go to fl. statutes and constitution, civil pactice and procedure. you will find what you want to know on dissolution of marriages. it say in 63.031 no dissolution ofmarriage is from bed and board, but from the bonds of matrimony. but you REALLY want to put yourself in a situtiation where you can be bodily harmed by dad or pos. so get you own place and start moving on


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## OldWolf57

its not his house, her dad own it. yes he is legal there now. but considering her and dads ways, his health may be threaten


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## jasonh

akashNil said:


> You will never win this WAR by arguments. Only QUICK actions will help you come out of it. Best of luck for that. Its never too late.
> 
> And why half the money transferred? Why not full?


I wasn't trying to get into a war of words with her but I just need CLOSURE. Why did she do this? What did I do to deserve this?? Sure I wasn't perfect but why take it this far?? I seriously can't move on mentally until I have complete closure.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## OldWolf57

krupp, why are you paying?? I will sit my a** in jail first.


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## Shaggy

Your WW isn't very smart about who she is cheating with. As a trainer he is likely already cheating on her with other women. The guy is such a looser that the best job he can get is contracting for personal training etc? Don't exect him to have a lot of cash to support her, or even offer her basic things like insurance etc.

Once you dump her onto him, he'll be dumping her for some other idiot married woman.

Post a couple of warnings about the place they met online such as on yelp naming the OM, warn other husbands about this guy. Then send a letter to the club owner notifying him about the reviews.

At this point one of best things you could have happen is the OM or her threatening you, that way you can get an RO against them.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## akashNil

jasonh said:


> Why did she do this? What did I do to deserve this?? Sure I wasn't perfect but why take it this far?? I seriously can't move on mentally until I have complete closure.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


You will never get an answer to "Why did she do this". No one does. Don't be too hard on yourself - you had very little to do in her behavior. Not every unhappy spouse looks for outside sex for happiness. 

Go back to your original thread and reread the advice given by all posters. Now you will read it with different mind-frame.


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## Baffled01

jasonh said:


> After speaking with a couple of lawyers with all due respect to women, this whole "womens rights" issue has gone way too far. Seriously this country is on its way to hell. I basically have to spend thousands of dollars out of my hard earned money just to PROVE that I'm a worthy father for my kids, but she is already assumed to be a good mother and dosent have to spend a dime. Wtf. I couldn't give a **** about OM right now. Nows its just about my kids and my dignity. God forgive me for saying this but if this woman got hit by a bus right now and died I wouldn't give a ****.I have been the bigger man and have taken the high road all of this time only to be ****ed over by my wife and when I try to get advice from someone who wouldn't judge me I end up being called a "troll" etc. Dude if u don't believe my story then get the **** off of my thread. Seriously you don't have to be here. Go read a book or something. I'm not here for your amusement. And for those who are truley trying to help thank you. Please excuse my language but I am really stressed right now.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


 Jason, just read your original post over the weekend. To be honest I had hoped your story was the work of a troll, because it is one of the worst stories I have ever read here and I am sorry you are going through it.

I am about the same size as you and I keep replaying your confrontation with the OM in your bedroom in my mind, thinking of what could have been done. I would be shopping for a pistol if I didn't already have one.

At this point I think your only option is to pursue a speedy divorce and get this over with quickly so you can get on with your life. Your wife has been blatantly disrespectful to you. You need to let her go and NOT take her back. Honestly, the chance of her and this OM living happily ever after is slim to none and their relationship will likely be short-lived, in which case she will be back at your door. PLEASE DON'T TAKE HER BACK.

This will only happen again.

Good Luck to you and your kids.


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## jasonh

I'm not worried about her dad. He's harmless. He has a big mouth and that's about it. The guy she's sleeping with is on my radar just because of his violent tendacies. I'm thinking about putting cameras in the house and go over there while he is there and make him hit me on camera so I can get him arrested.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Tall Average Guy

jasonh said:


> I wasn't trying to get into a war of words with her but I just need CLOSURE. Why did she do this? What did I do to deserve this?? Sure I wasn't perfect but why take it this far?? I seriously can't move on mentally until I have complete closure.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


You are only making things worse. You responding to her comments comes across as weak, immature and lacking control. Don't act like a spoiled nine year old, always having to get the last word. Responding means you are dipping to her level. You need to demonstrate control of yourself and your emotions. Show her that you are a real man and that her silly words don't get to you. Demonstrate to your children how a man acts and holds himself. 

You also need to prepare yourself to never getting closure. You can't make her give you that. You can't make her admit she is wrong. You don't control her, you can only control yourself. Learn to live with that.

_Edit_ - After rereading this, it comes across more harshly than I intended. What I am trying to say is that your responses are not having the intended effect. They are very likely actually turning her off. You are arguing with facts, which she is ignoring. You are also responding to her taunts, which she interprets as you not being in control. Get control of yourself and start ignoring her. Do the 180 for yourself.


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## turnera

Aren't you more mature than that, having to have 'closure?'


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## kruppmart

OldWolf57 said:


> krupp, why are you paying?? I will sit my a** in jail first.


No jail please ... having a good job. 
I will get the house back, latest when the divorce is final, which will be soon. And I love the house and will be sitting on my deck when she has to live in a trailer home ...


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## Jimena

*Stop answering any calls from her father. Consider them harassment. He has no role in your marriage (even if he technically owns the house)
*Keep all your paychecks to yourself. Take her OFF any benefit plans (keep the kids). Transfer all your money ASAP. Cancel ALL joint credit lines and specifically tell them not to reopen a joint acct if your wife calls them and tries to get them to reinstate the acct. She can add to that debt if she wants it all in her name.
*Be the first one to file for custody. find yourself a new place and make sure it has adequate space for the kids.


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## Acabado

Stop talking to them. Let your actions speak for yourself.
She did it because she wanted it and because she could. And, face it, partially becuase your let her. Now change it. Look for your future without this entitled b!tch. Don't engage. No closure. Nothing. Go dark on her.


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## happyman64

jasonh said:


> I have narrowed it down to two lawyers. Honestly I have a hard time trusting lawyers because yes they are sharks but they make a living by capatilizing on others misfortune. Wayward spouses do nothing but help the betrayed spouse to put money in these lawyers pockets. This whole process is so expensive, I'm going to be in serious debt after this. One of the lawyers asked me do I have a PI. How the hell can I afford a PI??? Seriously. I stopped by the house on my lunch break to see the kids and she asked me if I was coming to get my stuff. I told her that technically I still live here and I will come and go as I please. She responded "why don't you just grow up". I told her that I am grown its just so hard to believe I was married to a 5lut after all this time. She then said that its not her fault she fell in love with someone else and as humans we can't help who we do or don't fall in love with. I asked her why would she let herself even go that far if she was married with a family. Her response was "I was hurting". I told her that I would have done anything to help her past the pain if she only would have communicated with me. Now we have two kids who will grow up with split parents. Her response was "who's fault is that". Is she really blaming me for all of this? I think she is so guilty that she can't think straight.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


It is called the fog Jason. You cannot have any reasonable conversation with her while she is in it.

She really thinks she is the grown up and that she is in a normal loving relationship.

You do not want to be around when she wakes up and the OM dumps her.


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## warlock07

I'll be blunt here. You are the only one that were blind to the situation and how your wife is treating you. She considers you less than dirt right now. No one is surprised with this outcome. 

Target number one: Get self respect back.


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## crossbar

jasonh said:


> I wasn't trying to get into a war of words with her but I just need CLOSURE. Why did she do this? What did I do to deserve this?? Sure I wasn't perfect but why take it this far?? I seriously can't move on mentally until I have complete closure.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


And did you get the closure you wanted? Did you get the answers that you've wanted? NOPE!!!! It was more of the same BS.

Okay, you need to look up this OM, find out if he's married or has a girlfriend and expose! If his parents are still around, expose to them! I'm sure his mom would love to hear that her son is sleeping with a married woman and destroying a family! Then, talk to the lawyer about getting a restraining order out on the OM that he can't be around the kids or the house until after the divorce. Because, another man coming into there lives is too confusing. There's a good chance they'll grant that because it really doesn't matter what state you live in, ALL JUDGES say they have the childrens best interest at heart above all else.

So, you blow up his world with exposure and you bring a legal restraining order out on him. There's a chance that the dude is going to throw your wife under the bus and split saying, "This piece of ass isn't worth all of this drama!"


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## OldWolf57

what you don't seem to understand is that he threaten your LIFE !!! that is no joke. You should have gone to the cops as soon as you could walk, while the bruises was still fresh. if he is so concerned for his rep, that was your best protection, because with that on record, he would not have touched you for fear of being a suspect, an losing all those training gigs he get from law enforcement. It is NOT too late, file the damn complaint to get it on record. All you are doing is exposing yourself to his threat. you don't give a damn if they believe you, just get it on record.


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## PHTlump

diwali123 said:


> She doesn't have to spend a dime? Really? So she gets a free lawyer?
> I don't think you really understand the way the courts work. It varies from state to state but if you are going to have a contested divorce and fight over custody you need to get a lawyer. She has no advantage in court, I wish that were true. I wouldn't have wasted so much money on my divorce.


You misunderstood Jason's point. He didn't write that she didn't need to spend any money to get divorced. He wrote that she didn't need to spend any money to be presumed to be the better parent.

The reason that only 1 in 6 custodial parents are fathers is not because only 1 in 6 fathers hired better lawyers than their wives, or because only 1 in 6 fathers are the better parents. It's because family courts are heavily biased towards awarding custody and support to wives.



diwali123 said:


> One thing I can tell you is when it comes to the law, I know it's hard, but cut through your emotions, what you think the law is or should be, and soak up every little thing your lawyer says and does. Don't waste time making plans or assuming things until you find out the reality from the lawyer or hear the decision of the court on something. I've seen too many people work themselves up, convinced things were a certain way only to find out its the opposite.


I agree. I've seen a good many threads on these boards where posters advise others to change locks, stop paying bills, or something else, only to have the original posters say that their lawyers advised to keep things pretty steady until a judge signs an order.


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## PHTlump

jasonh said:


> I have narrowed it down to two lawyers.


That's great. You need to pick one. Go with your gut, flip a coin, whatever it takes, but pick one and get the process started.



jasonh said:


> Honestly I have a hard time trusting lawyers because yes they are sharks but they make a living by capatilizing on others misfortune.


That's understandable. Many people feel the same way about doctors. They make money when you are sick and desperate. But do you know who you need when you are sick? A doctor. Do you know who you need when you are getting divorced? A lawyer.



jasonh said:


> This whole process is so expensive, I'm going to be in serious debt after this. One of the lawyers asked me do I have a PI. How the hell can I afford a PI???


Old joke about divorce.
Do you know why divorce is so expensive?
Because it's worth it.



jasonh said:


> Seriously. I stopped by the house on my lunch break to see the kids and she asked me ... I told her ... She responded ... I told her ... She then said ... I asked her ... Her response was ... I told her ... Her response was ...


That entire exchange was, at best, a waste of time. At worst, your worsening your position by arguing with her. You went to see your kids and spent your time arguing with her.

Do a search for the 180. Basically, ignore her. If she wants to talk about something for the kids, engage her. If she wants to talk about your relationship, ignore her. Just walk out of the room. If her father calls, don't answer the phone. Hand her your lawyer's business card and tell her to communicate with him.

I've read a lot of these threads. So I can give you the gist of every argument you'll have with your wife about her infidelity. See, she wasn't haaapy in your marriage, so she was justified in doing any damn thing she wanted to in search of the bliss that had eluded her. Sure, she broke her marriage vows. But, if you're unhaaapy, you can do that without even feeling bad. And no, she wasn't required to try to fix things in your marriage first. That's your job. You probably knew that she wasn't haaapy. If you did, you should have known why and fixed it. If you didn't know she wasn't haaapy, or why, well that's just further proof that you weren't really soul mates and she shouldn't feel bad for blowing up your family.

That's the mindset of unfaithful spouses in general, and unfaithful wives in particular. Is it correct? No. Is it logical? No. Will she ever realize that? Perhaps. Although it won't be by arguing. Maybe the reality of a divorce will wake her up. Maybe the OM will marry her and cheat on her and that will wake her up. Maybe she will realize it when she has to explain to her kids why she had to blow up their family. Maybe she will realize it on her own in 10 years. Maybe she will never realize how nuts it is.

So, don't waste time on trying to get her side of the story. I just gave it to you. Spend your time in more constructive ways. Work on a plan with your lawyer and then work the plan. Spend as much time with your kids as you can before the divorce.

Good luck.


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## SadSamIAm

When you find out your spouse is cheating, the most attractive thing you can do is to tell them how much you love them, how disappointed you are in them and then good-bye. 

Go dark. Work on yourself. Go out and have fun and try to forget them. 

I know this is much easier said than done, but it is usually the only way to:

1) Get them out of the fog quicker
2) Respect you
3) Not cheat again, should you reconcile.

You don't get to see it, but it drives them crazy. Thinking they made a mistake.


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## donny64

You need to stop pursuing "closure". Your closure should be on this chapter of your life and leaving this evil witch behind.

It is unfortunate these days you can't just beat the hell out of someone who deserves it, as this guy does. But you can't. So, you go about it smart. Destroy him the best you can legally. Once he feels the heat, he's going to figure out pretty quick that she is not worth all this trouble. He's not "in love" with her, he's likely got a half dozen more just like her around town. Once he sees that the benefit of this relationship is far outweighed by the cost, he will be gone. THEN, she will be there alone, to wallow in the pool of chit she made for herself.

You're not alpha in the least. You need to change that. Maybe you could never physically kick this guys azz, but you can do so legally, and as a result, hers as well. Start moving on with your life while showing both of them there are consequences for their actions.

Were it me, I'd be hiring a PI to find out whatever I could about this guy. Then I'd be using that information to destroy him. I know it's not supposed to be about revenge, but in this instance, I'd be so driven by it I couldn't see straight. This wasn't just some affair....this was some guy who has the nerve and ballz to screw another mans wife in that mans home, and then to have the nerve to sit back calmly and tell the husband to "get out" so he can finish getting his nuts off. Uhm, no way. He needs a good hurtin' put on him. I'd have died that day doing my best to beat his azz. Might not have won, but he'd have known at the end of it he made a mistake by screwing with my wife and showing such disrespect to me and the house my children live in. Like I joke with my son sometimes..."you may be younger than me, and stronger than me, but you don't EVER want to tap into THIS anger son!". As you seem to lack the desire or resolve to go "alpha" on his azz face to face, you now do the next best thing....demonstrate how the pen (and brains) are mightier than the sword (and brawn).

Do as another said. Post a review on the gym he works at. Warn other husbands what's going on. Point out the review to the owner.

Post them both on cheaterville, with their true names. Will show up in internet searches.

File charges against him for battery. That ship may have already sailed, but that is YOUR house, and until the day comes that the court tells you that you can no longer stay there, you have every right to do so. Stand your ground. When he hopefully knocks the hell out of you, pick yourself up, dust yourself off, and get your azz to the hospital and police station. Let's see if "personal trainer boy" can find a job with a record for battery. Especially with the people he is reportedly training. And about that...I don't freakin' buy it. 

Expose him to the maximum extent possible. Same with her. Don't be a whiny b!tch about it, just do it.

Stop talking to her father or anyone that speaks on her behalf or challenges you. Screw them. Go 100% cold on all of them. You owe nobody any explanations, and trying to do so makes you appear weak. 

He's going to use his brawn to take what's yours by force? Use your brains to take what's his. Win-win. You stay out of jail, and he starts losing things as a result of his actions, and decides it's not worth it and dumps her for greener pastures and lower hanging fruit. 

And then, you'll get your closure. The day this all spins out of control on her, and her little super man kicks her to the curb, and she realizes she was nothing more than a piece of azz to this guy, she'll likely come crawling back. AND, at that moment, you NEED to be alpha enough to tell her to get phucked, and mean it, and leave her there in her misery. THAT will give you this "closure" you desire.

Make no mistake about it...this woman is a bad wife and a bad mother with no appreciable value as either of those. Unfortunately you're just finding this out now. But now that you KNOW it, what are you going to do about it? Are you gonna puzzy out and take her back when she comes crawling back, if that day comes? Or are you going to be a man that learned his lesson and won't settle for less than what he deserves, and who is well on his way towards obtaining exactly what you feel you deserve?


----------



## jasonh

Thanks for the encouragement guys. I have the lawyer finalized now. These last 24 hours have been a whirlwind. The lawyer advised me that I should keep paying the bills because it helps my custody case. He dosent want me looking like a deadbeat. He also told me I may be able to sue the OM for when he attacked me. One of my front teeth was kinda chipped and two of my teeth are kinda loose now. I can sue him for my dental bills. It really dosent matter because my insurance covers most of it but still I want to damage his wallet as much as possible. He told me that its a long shot because we have no witness other than my wife. But if I can get him on tape admitting to it ill be ok. The war has begun!!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## morituri

Here is the link to *Dads divorce*. Go to their forum and read the *Lessons Learned - Before and During* (the first post has other links that are of extreme value for any dad).


----------



## Cosmos

Remain strong, Jason. It's tough, but with a good lawyer you'll get through this.

Just keep your conversations with her confined to the children and don't let her rattle your cage.


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## kruppmart

Good luck Jason! Stay strong! Eff the b*tches!


----------



## Acabado

Hang tough, man!


----------



## anonim

screw him. its not his wife thats screwing around and gaslighting him to hell. or maybe she is...


----------



## anonim

jasonh said:


> I'm not worried about her dad. He's harmless. He has a big mouth and that's about it. The guy she's sleeping with is on my radar just because of his violent tendacies. I'm thinking about putting cameras in the house and go over there while he is there and make him hit me on camera so I can get him arrested.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


if you do delete this post. in fact delete this post anyways


----------



## crossbar

jasonh said:


> Thanks for the encouragement guys. I have the lawyer finalized now. These last 24 hours have been a whirlwind. The lawyer advised me that I should keep paying the bills because it helps my custody case. He dosent want me looking like a deadbeat. He also told me I may be able to sue the OM for when he attacked me. One of my front teeth was kinda chipped and two of my teeth are kinda loose now. I can sue him for my dental bills. It really dosent matter because my insurance covers most of it but still I want to damage his wallet as much as possible. He told me that its a long shot because we have no witness other than my wife. *But if I can get him on tape admitting to it ill be ok. *The war has begun!!
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


 Will you stop entertaining this asshat!!!!! did you talk to the lawyer about the RO? probably not. Hell, you tried to bring it up with the witch and what did she do? OH YEAH!!! She tried to have you thrown in jail! Did you bring up about possibly suing the gym that employ's this douche bag for sleep with married clients and hopefully getting this d-bag fired? NOPE!!! Suing him for the dental bills where the only witness is the witch? Oh yeah, I see her rolling on Price Charming. 

Dude, you haven't started a war, you full of delusions! MAKE THEIR LIVES UNCOMFORTABLE!!!! Always have a VAR on you at all times when and IF you decide to start making stuff hard on them.


----------



## donny64

crossbar said:


> Will you stop entertaining this asshat!!!!! did you talk to the lawyer about the RO? probably not. Hell, you tried to bring it up with the witch and what did she do? OH YEAH!!! She tried to have you thrown in jail! Did you bring up about possibly suing the gym that employ's this douche bag for sleep with married clients and hopefully getting this d-bag fired? NOPE!!! Suing him for the dental bills where the only witness is the witch? Oh yeah, I see her rolling on Price Charming.
> 
> Dude, you haven't started a war, you full of delusions! MAKE THEIR LIVES UNCOMFORTABLE!!!! Always have a VAR on you at all times when and IF you decide to start making stuff hard on them.


I fear he's trying to win her back. And the bad thing is, until he goes scorched earth and pulls out the nuclear options on her azz, he doesn't have a snowball's chance in hell of doing so. 

Personally, from the sounds of things, there would be no way I'd take her back even if she came crawling through broken glass and razor wire to get to me. I'd put a hurin' on them both the likes they'd not seen before. All of this macho crap on the part of the guy, and all of this evilness on the part of the wife? I'd make it my life's mission until the divorce was finalized to make their lives hell. And when the jocker dumps her for the easier table scraps he can pick up, I'd keep right on walking from her.

Jason, dude, you may not be "alpha" and you may not be a fighter. That's fine. But, and this is a big BUT, until you find self respect and get it back, there is no woman worth a DAMN that will want anything to do with you. It is the worst of "doormat" behavior. And doormats do not attract good women. Doormats attract dirt (as you're discovering now). It took a few years for her true nature to surface, but it has. And that's what you need to understand...this is her TRUE NATURE. A woman getting caught up in and having a fling does not do these things to their children's father. Period. Calling the cops on you when you've done nothing wrong and making false reports. Sleeping with another man in your house. Throwing you out of "her" house (WTF ever happened to marital property?) And this is just the start. You mark my words, this "woman" (and that term is used VERY loosely) will next do her damndest to use your children against you and make your life a living hell. Count on it. The claims of abuse of the children WILL come. The claims of you being an unfit father WILL come. The demanding of supervised visitation and outrageous child support and alimony WILL come from this one.

But back to the self respect issue....I'd personally not sacrafice my self respect over taking an azz beating, but that's me. Like I said, I may lose (and have done so before), but the "winner" will know he was in a fight. That goes for literally and figuratively. 

This dude is a putz. If I've got the right one, he trains law enforcement and military in hand to hand and unarmed defense? And blackwater dudes as well? Yet he has a need to hold a job as a physical trainer?!!! :rofl: Law enforcement have their own trainers...they do not hire outside to do so. Same with military. I've been in both fields. Not ONCE has a source outside of the unit or department EVER been contracted to train someone within. Not once. Unless it was a certified peace officer from an another jurisdiction. They're going to hire a "fitness trainer"? Again, I'm ROFLMAO at that one.

Let me clear his story up for you....he is possibly ex military. Probably didn't do chit in the military. Failed at his attempts of becoming a Ranger, Seal, Special Forces, or whatever bullchit he's trying to sell your wife who doesn't know any better. And then he got out and tried to become a cop. And he failed at that. And now this loser "Bally's fitness coach" :rofl: is running around, proclaiming his "badd assness" to every frustrated, loose legged housewife or girl he can find, not caring that none of it is true, because he doesn't care if he is found out...he's not in it for the long haul. 

My god...let her have her dream and then sit back with a beer and watch the flames when this fantasy all comes crashing down on her. Enjoy the show.


----------



## lordmayhem

donny64 said:


> This dude is a putz. If I've got the right one, he trains law enforcement and military in hand to hand and unarmed defense? And blackwater dudes as well? Yet he has a need to hold a job as a physical trainer?!!! :rofl: Law enforcement have their own trainers...they do not hire outside to do so. Same with military. I've been in both fields. Not ONCE has a source outside of the unit or department EVER been contracted to train someone within. Not once. Unless it was a certified peace officer from an another jurisdiction. They're going to hire a "fitness trainer"? Again, I'm ROFLMAO at that one.
> 
> Let me clear his story up for you....he is possibly ex military. Probably didn't do chit in the military. Failed at his attempts of becoming a Ranger, Seal, Special Forces, or whatever bullchit he's trying to sell your wife who doesn't know any better. And then he got out and tried to become a cop. And he failed at that. And now this loser "Bally's fitness coach" :rofl: is running around, proclaiming his "badd assness" to every frustrated, loose legged housewife or girl he can find, not caring that none of it is true, because he doesn't care if he is found out...he's not in it for the long haul.
> 
> My god...let her have her dream and then sit back with a beer and watch the flames when this fantasy all comes crashing down on her. Enjoy the show.


:iagree:

LEAs and the military have their own trainers. They DO NOT contract out for this training. One of the guys I went to the NCO Academy with was a SERE instructor out of McChord, and the instructors teaching ground fighting when I went thru the academy were active duty officers. Thats what I didn't believe about this story in the first place.


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## larry.gray

My cousin was married to a SERE instructor at McChord for 10 years. I can vouch for what lordmayhem posted. All of those guys are internal, no contractors.

He was rather humble too... all of the guys like this I've ever met don't brag.


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## PHTlump

crossbar said:


> Will you stop entertaining this asshat!!!!! did you talk to the lawyer about the RO? probably not. Hell, you tried to bring it up with the witch and what did she do? OH YEAH!!! She tried to have you thrown in jail! Did you bring up about possibly suing the gym that employ's this douche bag for sleep with married clients and hopefully getting this d-bag fired? NOPE!!! Suing him for the dental bills where the only witness is the witch? Oh yeah, I see her rolling on Price Charming.
> 
> Dude, you haven't started a war, you full of delusions! MAKE THEIR LIVES UNCOMFORTABLE!!!! Always have a VAR on you at all times when and IF you decide to start making stuff hard on them.


So, in your opinion, Jason should ignore the advice of his lawyer, who works in the area and understands the tendencies of the judges who will be hearing the divorce case, in favor of trying to get some revenge of his stbx and her boyfriend?

I'll just say that I disagree. Given the choice between seeing his kids more often and creating some minor mischief (which is all he would be legally able to do) for the other parties, I think Jason is better off trying to see his kids more often.

Sure, he should keep the VAR on him. Other than that, let his lawyer be the jerk. That's what they get paid for. And it's legal.


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## Cosmos

PHTlump said:


> So, in your opinion, Jason should ignore the advice of his lawyer, who works in the area and understands the tendencies of the judges who will be hearing the divorce case, in favor of trying to get some revenge of his stbx and her boyfriend?
> 
> I'll just say that I disagree. Given the choice between seeing his kids more often and creating some minor mischief (which is all he would be legally able to do) for the other parties, I think Jason is better off trying to see his kids more often.
> 
> Sure, he should keep the VAR on him. Other than that, let his lawyer be the jerk. That's what they get paid for. And it's legal.


I agree. Jason is best listening to his lawyer at this point. He needs to remain as squeaky clean as possible, in order to highlight his wife's bad behaviour, and give her absolutely no ammunition to play with when she realizes how badly wrong things have gone for her.


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## danie12

Jason, as hard as it is you *have* to take emotion out of this...think of it as a business contract gone bad that needs to be nullified. Do what is in YOUR children's best interest.


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## jasonh

Guys just because I lost one fight does not mean that I'm not "alpha enough" I am an intelligent man with goals, morals, and self control. IMO that's pretty "alpha". Could you picture our world leaders running around fighting all the time? No. But they seem pretty alpha to me. I have been doing my homework and contacted the gym he works at and talked to the REAL owner. Come to find out this guy dosent even own the gym he just has a small partership in it. Anyway the owner was really nice about it but he brought up a good point. This guy dosent even train the women. They have a female who does the womans courses. So apparently she would wait for her class to be over and hang out with this guy afterwards. Anyway I asked the owner not to say anything to him yet because I want to get my ducks lined up first. He agreed and told me if I need anything else to let him know and good luck. I did mention that he theatened me, and I asked the gym owner should I be concerned. He said that james is a gun fanatic but wouldn't risk his freedom over something that silly. So I then tried the security contractor that he supposedly works for but the guy was an ahole and hung up on me. I got another VAR and when I stopped over to see the kids last night I put it in a safe place in the living room. I then went into my wifes room with another var in my pocket and asked her how could she hate me so much that she allowed a psycho to attack me in my own home. She says "what are you talking about, I practically saved your life" ! Little does she know that she just gave me the evidence I needed to go to the police. I think I'm gonna wait and get her to make a few more incriminating statements before I go to the cops. I want it to be an open and shut case. I'm not rushing into anything. I'm gonna make sure that the charges stick.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## happyman64

Yes. You need the charges to stick.

And your wife is really great for saving you.........


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## morituri

Jason, before you go to the police, visit your attorney and have him listen to the VAR recording so that he can then help you file for a RO against the POSOM.

Oh and try not allowing yourself to get suckered by her into ludicrous conversations that are just attempts to justify her unjustifiable behavior.


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## warlock07

Evidence is not enough. Can be explained away. Keep gathering


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## Cosmos

Jason, this isn't necessarily about you not being alpha enough. It's about your wife and the OM's poor standards. 

Focus, Jason - focus. Your main priority is getting you and your kids out of the mess your W has created in the best possible way.

I wouldn't spend too much time thinking of the OM. There's a Chinese proverb:- "He who seeks revenge should remember to dig two graves."


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## morituri

Get your brother on board as your emotional support and ally against the POSOM for if the RO request is thrown out, there may be a need for self-defensive measures like buying pepper spray (legal in Florida) to use if the POSOM chooses to engage you in another fight again.



> *Florida State (FL) Pepper Spray Laws*
> 
> The state of Florida has many great points of interest, such as Orlando, Miami and Fort Lauderdale. These, and other cities draw thousands of new residents and tourists in every year. Unfortunately, they also attract criminals, predators and law breakers who would not think twice about harming another human being.
> 
> Pepper spray is recognized as a valid and legal method of self defense in FL. As with every other state, it may only be used when absolutely necessary for the protection of any individual. That means it is only lawful to use MACE or any type of defense spray when your safety is being threatened by another person. You may carry the weapon at public venues in Florida, but state regulations do dictate how much each person is allowed to have on them. No canister may contain over two ounces of chemical spray, so only the smaller units are allowed.
> 
> *More Details on Florida State Pepper Spray Laws*
> 
> One of the most important rules to remember about pepper spray in Florida is that it is never permissible to use one against a law enforcement officer for any reason. Even pointing the canister at a police officer may be viewed as an illegal intent to discharge the weapon against them. Any such act is punishable by law.
> 
> Where to buy pepper spray is one of the most commonly asked questions from people who are interested in self defense products. It can be found in every major city in the state, such as Jacksonville, Panama City and Pensacola, or purchased online. Florida does not have any laws against shipping defense sprays in or out of the state, as long as they are within the approved size limit. The weapons may be purchased for use against a human assailant, and even for protection against non human threats.
> 
> Florida features The Everglades and many other outdoor attractions. While these areas are beautiful to see, they are also home to wild animals that are completely unpredictable. An animal spray is the best way to stop an attack that is a danger to you or anyone you are with, and they are also legal to carry within the sunshine state. These sprays are effective against most any sized beast, and you can rest assured that they will not have any long term effects on any animal.


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## danie12

Seriously, focus on your kids and what's best for them. Ask yourself "what GOOD will this action bring into my children's lives?" when you feel the need for revenge on the OM. Let him dig his own grave, let her dig her own grave. YOU start digging your way out of this mess. 

...and the thing that I did to xOW that pissed her off to no freeking end was to smile at her with the *knowing* look everytime I saw her...drove her nuts and she drove my H nuts. People who cheat or help others cheat are very insecure they are such easy targets for mind-f***s.


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## PHTlump

jasonh said:


> Guys just because I lost one fight does not mean that I'm not "alpha enough" I am an intelligent man with goals, morals, and self control. IMO that's pretty "alpha".


Actually, those traits are all beta traits. Alpha traits include power, assertiveness, and social dominance. And, some traits can be either alpha, or beta, depending on your behavior. An intelligent man who uses his intelligence to become the CEO of a multinational conglomerate is alpha. An equally intelligent man who teaches, or looks through a microscope all day is beta.

However, don't let this get you down. Most men are a mix of alpha and beta. Good husbands are a pretty even mix. And I bet that over 90% of the men in this country are too heavily weighted to beta traits.

The good news is that you can change your mix of traits slowly over time. First, you have to understand the dichotomy of the behaviors. Then you need to analyze yourself. And finally, you need to begin increasing your alpha traits.



jasonh said:


> Could you picture our world leaders running around fighting all the time? No. But they seem pretty alpha to me.


Politicians are alpha because of the power. Little else. Washington is not a place of morals, or even intelligence. It's about the powerful grabbing for more power. That's very alpha.



jasonh said:


> I think I'm gonna wait and get her to make a few more incriminating statements before I go to the cops. I want it to be an open and shut case. I'm not rushing into anything. I'm gonna make sure that the charges stick.


Run all of your plans by your lawyer. You don't want to be seen as petty and vindictive by a divorce judge for trying to put your wife's boyfriend in jail. Every action you take should be with the intent of bettering your position in the divorce/custody case.

Good luck.


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## donny64

larry.gray said:


> My cousin was married to a SERE instructor at McChord for 10 years. I can vouch for what lordmayhem posted. All of those guys are internal, no contractors.
> 
> He was rather humble too... all of the guys like this I've ever met don't brag.


I can't believe wide eyed chicks buy into this nonsense, and the complete lack of common sense they have when they're caught up in the fog. Listen, if this guy was even HALF as good or did HALF the things he said he does, he would have such a busy schedule teaching people who would pay him major bucks that not only would he not NEED this crappy job he has :rofl:, he would not have TIME for it.

I would love, just LOVE to hear the conversations with her gal pals right now: "Oh my gawd...he's such a man! He trains Navy Seals, British SAS, Police, and NINJAS!!!! Trains them all! How do I know? He said so! And his trainer's profile at Ballys Total Fitness SAID SO! It MUST be true! Oh my gawd, he's amazing! He says he'd like to tell me more about his dangerous work, but he can't because it's classified! Such mystery and intrigue! And HE wants ME!!!! I'm in love!!!! To think I settled for a nine to fiver type man all these years when there were REAL men like my Rambo just waiting to be discovered!"

And then I would love to hear her gal-pal conversations six months from now: "Oh damn, I am such a moron. Why would I believe some psychotic dork from Bally's was all of these things he claimed to be? Really? What was I thinking? He's a loser! He was kicked out of the army for steroid use, and now can't get a real job. All of these secret training missions he said he was going on? NO! I found out he was with four different women on those nights! I can't believe he cheated on ME! I told him I was not like that and would never allow it! Why did he do this to me? And this loser lives with his MOM because he can't afford a place to live! He was trying to scam me and get me to put my husband out so he could have free room, board, and azz! What a loser! I can't believe I threw away a good man with a good job over some wannabe mall cop."

Then about this time, she'll be ringing up Jason appologizing for everything and begging for him to come back. But no, our guy Jason will be off dating some hottie who worships his manhood by that time. :smthumbup:


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## crossbar

Yeah, I agree with the other posters. I was with the Marines and I was in an instructor billet in Camp Lejeune. Close Combat Instructors in Marine Corps Martial Arts have to go to school in either Quantico or Camp Pendleton for their black belts. Why would the Marine Corps spend the money to send Marines from around the globe to these schools if they contract these services out? By the way, we never had any civilian contractors or instructors.

This guy is full of sh*t. Damn near a case of stolen valor if you ask me.


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## PHTlump

donny64 said:


> I can't believe wide eyed chicks buy into this nonsense, and the complete lack of common sense they have when they're caught up in the fog.


It's a vicious circle. This guy plays the part because it works. He's probably gotten good at it because he's used it so much.

It's like the guys in the movies that shoot machine guns from their hips. Is that the most effective way to shoot a gun? No. Does it look cool? Yes. And that's all that matters in a movie. Stallone is just giving the public what they want.

A badass who tells nobody that he's a badass can't score chicks with his deeds. All the hot girls are gathered around the liar who claims to be a badass. That's the guy who is giving the women what they want.


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## lordmayhem

donny64 said:


> I can't believe wide eyed chicks buy into this nonsense, and the complete lack of common sense they have when they're caught up in the fog. Listen, if this guy was even HALF as good or did HALF the things he said he does, he would have such a busy schedule teaching people who would pay him major bucks that not only would he not NEED this crappy job he has :rofl:, he would not have TIME for it.
> 
> I would love, just LOVE to hear the conversations with her gal pals right now: "Oh my gawd...he's such a man! He trains Navy Seals, British SAS, Police, and NINJAS!!!! Trains them all! How do I know? He said so! And his trainer's profile at Ballys Total Fitness SAID SO! It MUST be true! Oh my gawd, he's amazing! He says he'd like to tell me more about his dangerous work, but he can't because it's classified! Such mystery and intrigue! And HE wants ME!!!! I'm in love!!!! To think I settled for a nine to fiver type man all these years when there were REAL men like my Rambo just waiting to be discovered!"
> 
> And then I would love to hear her gal-pal conversations six months from now: "Oh damn, I am such a moron. Why would I believe some psychotic dork from Bally's was all of these things he claimed to be? Really? What was I thinking? He's a loser! He was kicked out of the army for steroid use, and now can't get a real job. All of these secret training missions he said he was going on? NO! I found out he was with four different women on those nights! I can't believe he cheated on ME! I told him I was not like that and would never allow it! Why did he do this to me? And this loser lives with his MOM because he can't afford a place to live! He was trying to scam me and get me to put my husband out so he could have free room, board, and azz! What a loser! I can't believe I threw away a good man with a good job over some wannabe mall cop."
> 
> Then about this time, she'll be ringing up Jason appologizing for everything and begging for him to come back. But no, our guy Jason will be off dating some hottie who worships his manhood by that time. :smthumbup:


Just like the used car salesman dude (Bill Paxton) on that movie "True Lies".


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## crossbar

Yeah, I mean, guys that serve and was in the sh*t in either Iraq or Afghanistan and REALLY saw the war don't come home and brag about it. Most guys come back and they're heads aren't right with PTSD.

Hell, I was in Iraq and I don't like to talk about it. It's a part of my life I'd like to forget ever happened.


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## jasonh

crossbar said:


> Yeah, I agree with the other posters. I was with the Marines and I was in an instructor billet in Camp Lejeune. Close Combat Instructors in Marine Corps Martial Arts have to go to school in either Quantico or Camp Pendleton for their black belts. Why would the Marine Corps spend the money to send Marines from around the globe to these schools if they contract these services out? By the way, we never had any civilian contractors or instructors.
> 
> This guy is full of sh*t. Damn near a case of stolen valor if you ask me.


Yea he's just a broke down bodyguard who dosent have the credentials to be in the secret service. I bet if he wasn't loaded up with steroids I could kick his butt up and down the street. She's gonna regret this when he goes into a rage and starts beating on her. He just better hope that my kids aren't involved because if he harms my kids he will be a dead man walking. I'm getting sick of my lawyer already. His favorite quote is "let's wait to cross that bridge when we get there". Well what the hell am I paying him for. To wait???
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## turnera

jasonh said:


> I then went into my wifes room with another var in my pocket and asked her how could she hate me so much that she allowed a psycho to attack me in my own home. She says "what are you talking about, I practically saved your life" ! Little does she know that she just gave me the evidence I needed to go to the police. I think I'm gonna wait and get her to make a few more incriminating statements before I go to the cops. I want it to be an open and shut case. I'm not rushing into anything. I'm gonna make sure that the charges stick.


Make sure you have already downloaded the evidence on the VAR before you use it again.

btw, alpha isn't about brawn. It's about what you put up with.


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## turnera

lordmayhem said:


> Just like the used car salesman dude (Bill Paxton) on that movie "True Lies".


 Now THAT guy was smooth! "Here, watch over my briefcase. My life is in danger!"


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## turnera

jasonh said:


> I'm getting sick of my lawyer already. His favorite quote is "let's wait to cross that bridge when we get there". Well what the hell am I paying him for. To wait???
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


 Yeah, really alpha...


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## crossbar

Dude, you really need to find a bulldog lawyer. A real hell hound and set the guy loose on everyone! This, "let's just see what happens" attitude is crap.

Have you even found out about the OM parents or brothers and sisters to expose to?


----------



## warlock07

jasonh said:


> Yea he's just a broke down bodyguard who dosent have the credentials to be in the secret service. I bet if he wasn't loaded up with steroids I could kick his butt up and down the street. She's gonna regret this when he goes into a rage and starts beating on her. He just better hope that my kids aren't involved because if he harms my kids he will be a dead man walking. I'm getting sick of my lawyer already. His favorite quote is "let's wait to cross that bridge when we get there". Well what the hell am I paying him for. To wait???
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Find a reasonable medium between being passive and over aggressive. 

You have friends/family you can talk to? Considering the emotions you are going through, you are going to do something rash.


----------



## the guy

Lawyers are a pain in the butt, but you need to protect your self.
have you talked about a moral clause that will prevent the OM being around your kids? Have you talked about naming the OM in the divorce? When and were will your WW be served? Is adultory mentioned in the filing?


----------



## akashNil

morituri said:


> Get your brother on board as your emotional support .....


Do you mean on this (TAM) board ?

I think that is a very good suggestion - best so far in this thread.


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## Tall Average Guy

jasonh said:


> Yea he's just a broke down bodyguard who dosent have the credentials to be in the secret service. I bet if he wasn't loaded up with steroids I could kick his butt up and down the street. She's gonna regret this when he goes into a rage and starts beating on her. He just better hope that my kids aren't involved because if he harms my kids he will be a dead man walking. I'm getting sick of my lawyer already. His favorite quote is "let's wait to cross that bridge when we get there". Well what the hell am I paying him for. To wait???
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


You are paying him to keep you out of trouble. There is a time to move fast and a time to be patient. If you don't trust your lawyer, get another one. If you do, have him explain, in great detail if necessary, why he wants to wait. Really listen to what he is saying and figure out how it gets you what you want. Remember, his job is not to destroy your wife or the OM, it is to protect you.


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## morituri

jasonh said:


> I bet if he wasn't loaded up with steroids I could kick his butt up and down the street.


First rule when it comes to fighting *THERE ARE NO RULES*. That is what makes street fighting the deadliest kind because unlike in a dojo, anything goes.

Second rule, *THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A FAIR FIGHT.* Clawing, hitting the groin, biting may not sound very manly or sportsmanship like but the goal is to kill or cripple your opponent, not humiliate him.

*Now the best thing to do is avoid a fight altogether* but if you can't then be ready and have your VAR as well as pepper spray with a sharp shooter keychain on you. You don't want to start a fight but you certainly want to be the one who can walk away from it and your enemy lying in pain on the floor.


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## Acabado

Keep taping her, be subtle, force her to admit OM's behavior, her own behavior, the fake complain...
You can always argue you HAD to carry the VAR because you feared you life was treatened by this trained fighter ex-soldier. Keep yourself under the law.


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## RoosterCogburn

This might seem like a self-defeating post in that it advises you to ignore the advice offered in this forum, but that is what you need to do. Your lawyer has an interest in doing the best he can for you, not just because you are paying him, but because every case he wins adds up on stats. For your own peace of mind it might be a good idea to have him explain to you more fully why has advised you to do what he has, but as well intentioned as it may (or in some cases may not) be, you really should ignore the amateur advice that seems to be so copiously strewn across this forum.

Assuming you have found a reasonably good lawyer he or she will have seen this and handled it many times before, and have good working knowledge of how these cases pan-out in your jurasdiction.

I suggest you trust him. Good luck.


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## lordmayhem

RoosterCogburn said:


> This might seem like a self-defeating post in that it advises you to ignore the advice offered in this forum, but that is what you need to do. Your lawyer has an interest in doing the best he can for you, not just because you are paying him, but because every case he wins adds up on stats. For your own peace of mind it might be a good idea to have him explain to you more fully why has advised you to do what he has, but as well intentioned as it may (or in some cases may not) be, you really should ignore the amateur advice that seems to be so copiously strewn across this forum.
> 
> Assuming you have found a reasonably good lawyer he or she will have seen this and handled it many times before, and have good working knowledge of how these cases pan-out in your jurasdiction.
> 
> I suggest you trust him. Good luck.


There are many, many lawyers/attorney's out there that care nothing about their clients and only see them as a paycheck. There are no stats kept. The only stats kept are those attorneys employed by large legal firms, where every victory or satisfactory case makes them look good...if the attorney is interested in a promotion or partnership.

That's why there's a huge difference in service between a bulldog/shark attorney and an attorney that only cares about getting as many clients as he/she can. The crappy ones are the ones who tell you to keep a low profile and just get the divorce over as soon as possible. You see, that's less work for them and they can handle more divorce cases that way. The client is just another number.

Unfortunately, my attorney in my divorce was one of the sh!tty ones, and I didn't know it at the time. Recently, for my buddy, I referred him to a young attorney for a nationally respected law firm that deals specifically with men's rights in divorces. She advised my buddy to do this and that and all the things they could hit his STBXW with.


----------



## the guy

Ok everyone, lets all sign off b/c RC thinks we are all spewing bad advice.
Close the forum lets all go back to work....done deal!!!!

Listen, take our advise and perspective for whats its worth you are closest to your own sitch and can decide the best course of action. I can't even spell so don't listen to me, but like me and many others here, we have had experience with infidelity and there is a script to all of it and its nice to know what will come next if you want to listen.


----------



## River1977

8 pages is way too many to read but based on the first couple ones, you are being misinformed on some of the issues. Such as........



morituri said:


> Keep the VARs recordings and make copies of them. Contact an attorney and have him/her file a complaint on your behalf to the police department internal affairs department or chief of police where the female police officer works. The reason is that since your wife was able to get the police to come to the house and kick you out, she'll again try this tactic in the future. *If there is another encounter with the police, and the same female officer arrives at the scene, she may think twice about kicking you out again or trying to falsely arrest you. And this will also protect you in case of divorce where she claims that you were abusing her. You can prove to the judge that she is lying and that the police officer exceeded her authority by showing a copy of the complaint filed against the police officer and any other replies from the internal affairs department or chief of police.*


........is misinformation. You threatened your wife when you stated........



jasonh said:


> I just told her I'm not going to put up with her cheating ways anymore.


That is an indirect threat. Indirect only because you didn't express what exactly you would do (except tell her father) if she continued. But, she took it as a threat, and the police took it as a threat because it is a threat. Although you left it open and up to interpretation as to what would happen if she continued, it is obvious you are saying something will happen.

The police were right in the way they handled the situation because they could not leave you in the house intimidating and threatening your wife like that. The law in a situation like this is based on *reasonable man* in that a reasonable person would and should leave in refusal of being treated badly. If a person is not going to put up with something, their only option is to leave and not put up with it because you cannot MAKE someone do as you say. You cannot MAKE someone stop doing what they choose to do. Any attempt to MAKE them do it, or TELL them they cannot, or TELL them what they better do, or threaten consequences is impeding their freedom because everyone has a right to do as they please. Yes, you have a right to refuse to put up with it......by walking away. 

You also cannot tell her "too bad" when she said she doesn't want to talk about it because you cannot MAKE her talk about it if she doesn't want to. She asked you to leave her room, but you refused and continued to make her talk about it. Then, you slammed the door behind her. That was aggressive behavior.

I recall your advice here on the forum was to go back home and play it cool and not let her anger you. But, you became aggressive, intimidating, and threatening. The suggestions for the VAR was to catch her in her lies and so forth, it wasn't intended to incriminate yourself because you were advised not to do or say things like this to her. No one has to live under these conditions, but you were trying to force her to do what you wanted. You weren't supposed to tell her to do anything at all. You cannot tell a grown woman what to do. 

Therefore, the police saw what was going on and did what they were supposed to do even though you didn't like it and even though there are some here who do not know the law and disagree with the police. You have no claim against either of the police officers. The female officer can look however she pleases however you interpret the look on her face as hating men. It doesn't matter as long as she makes the right decisions, which she did and was well within the scope of her duties. She not only could have arrested you for assaulting your wife (verbal assault is still assault), trying to impede your wife's freedom to doing whatever she wants to do, and for aggressing toward, intimidating, and threatening your wife, she could also have arrested you for not doing as she told you to do with her being an officer of the law duly sworn to protect the safety of the public - the public being your wife who called the police for protection.

Sorry, Jason. You made a sundry of mistakes. Whether or not you intended to aggress toward her, and whether or not you intended to be intimidating and threatening, you did all of those things. There are areas of the law that are based on intended actions (intentions), and there are areas of law based on the result/effect of your actions despite your intentions.


----------



## Cosmos

Again - listen to your Attorney, Jason...


----------



## tacoma

Jason ask your lawyer exactly what he`d need to get an RO against the OM and then move back into your house.

With the RO in place anytime he came near your home he`d be arrested.

This is the route I`d take right now.

Edit:
I be so on this track I`d take my VAR over to my house when he was there and remain completely innocent.
My mere presence would be enough to cause him to get physical.

I`d take a beating in order to get it on tape without any question of my innocence.

An RO wouldn`t be difficult at all after that.

I`m not saying YOU SHOULD do this.
I`m merely voicing what I`d do.


----------



## Halien

River1977 said:


> 8 pages is way too many to read but based on the first couple ones, you are being misinformed on some of the issues. Such as........
> 
> 
> 
> ........is misinformation. You threatened your wife when you stated........
> 
> I just told her I'm not going to put up with her cheating ways anymore.
> 
> That is an indirect threat. Indirect only because you didn't express what exactly you would do (except tell her father) if she continued.


River,

With respect, what works in the court of public opinion rarely coincides with the interpretation of the law.

I'll refer to the California penal code as an example. 

California Penal Code 422 PC defines the crime of "criminal threats" .

A "criminal threat" is when you threaten to kill or physically harm someone and

1.that person is thereby placed in a state of reasonably sustained fear for his/her safety or for the safety of his/her immediate family,

2.the threat is specific and unequivocal and

3.you communicate the threat verbally, in writing, or via an electronically transmitted device.

-------------

Without specific and unequivocal ramifications being tied to the offense, the OP's comments could not legally imply violence as his preferred option, but the assumption would be his voluntary removal of himself from the marriage if she continued in the affair. Indirect threats perceived by her carry no weight if they are not substantiated by a threat of bodily harm.

An officer is allowed to mediate and follow procedures to the full extent needed before getting legal counself, so this explains her call. But the situational response is in no way interpreted as validation of a legal claim of his action being a threat.

Laws in this country don't require a person to tolerate infidelity in their home. A person has the personal liberty to say that they will not tolerate infidelity in their home without this being legally construed as a threat. It just means that you will not put up with it. Suggesting that this is indirect threatening is pretty extreme, considering that the officer was merely following protocol as she understood it.


----------



## PHTlump

River1977 said:


> You threatened your wife ...


No offense, but that might be the dumbest thing I've ever read on the internet. 

The sad thing about people who try to expand the definition of threat to include literally every disagreement imaginable, is that they have devalued actual threats. If a betrayed husband telling his wife that he won't continue to tolerate her infidelity is a threat, then what do you call a wife who points a gun at her husband and threatens to pull the trigger? You can't call it a threat because those two behaviors are not even in the same ballpark.


----------



## River1977

Halien said:


> River,
> 
> With respect, what works in the court of public opinion rarely coincides with the interpretation of the law.
> 
> I'll refer to the California penal code as an example.
> 
> California Penal Code 422 PC defines the crime of "criminal threats" .
> 
> A "criminal threat" is when you threaten to kill or physically harm someone and
> 
> 1.that person is thereby placed in a state of reasonably sustained fear for his/her safety or for the safety of his/her immediate family,
> 
> 2.the threat is specific and unequivocal and
> 
> 3.you communicate the threat verbally, in writing, or via an electronically transmitted device.
> 
> -------------
> 
> Without specific and unequivocal ramifications being tied to the offense, the OP's comments could not legally imply violence as his preferred option, but the assumption would be his voluntary removal of himself from the marriage if she continued in the affair. Indirect threats perceived by her carry no weight if they are not substantiated by a threat of bodily harm.
> 
> An officer is allowed to mediate and follow procedures to the full extent needed before getting legal counself, so this explains her call. But the situational response is in no way interpreted as validation of a legal claim of his action being a threat.
> 
> Laws in this country don't require a person to tolerate infidelity in their home. A person has the personal liberty to say that they will not tolerate infidelity in their home without this being legally construed as a threat. It just means that you will not put up with it. Suggesting that this is indirect threatening is pretty extreme, considering that the officer was merely following protocol as she understood it.


Halien, I want to laugh so badly but will simply ask if telling you your post makes no sense can be construed by you as attacking?

1. If the officer was following protocol and that protocol procedure is based on the law and executed within the scope of her duties, then why did you think it necessary to correct what I stated since what I stated was correct?

2. This is not a court of law. Jason is not in court defending himself against a charge of being threatening. This is a domestic situation, where the officers saw that his actions - by his own admitting and by what they heard on the recorder - were aggressive, intimidating, and threatening. Every bit of it was left to interpretation because he didn't actually tear the house down, yell and scream at her, or hit her. My point, and the way the officers saw it, was that she had every reason to feel threatened and intimidated by him based on his words and actions. That is the reason he was told to leave and not the wife. Had she been the one doing and saying the things that he did, then they would have told HER to leave. He was not told to leave for having done nothing.

3. Please read to understand tort law. 

4. Please read to understand tort law and how it applies to civil situations and domestic situations (such as domestic abuse, domestic violence, etc). This is not a situation of criminal law. Therefore, your comments, as they are based on criminal law, do not apply.


----------



## jasonh

River1977 said:


> 8 pages is way too many to read but based on the first couple ones, you are being misinformed on some of the issues. Such as........
> 
> 
> 
> ........is misinformation. You threatened your wife when you stated........
> 
> 
> 
> That is an indirect threat. Indirect only because you didn't express what exactly you would do (except tell her father) if she continued. But, she took it as a threat, and the police took it as a threat because it is a threat. Although you left it open and up to interpretation as to what would happen if she continued, it is obvious you are saying something will happen.
> 
> The police were right in the way they handled the situation because they could not leave you in the house intimidating and threatening your wife like that. The law in a situation like this is based on *reasonable man* in that a reasonable person would and should leave in refusal of being treated badly. If a person is not going to put up with something, their only option is to leave and not put up with it because you cannot MAKE someone do as you say. You cannot MAKE someone stop doing what they choose to do. Any attempt to MAKE them do it, or TELL them they cannot, or TELL them what they better do, or threaten consequences is impeding their freedom because everyone has a right to do as they please. Yes, you have a right to refuse to put up with it......by walking away.
> 
> You also cannot tell her "too bad" when she said she doesn't want to talk about it because you cannot MAKE her talk about it if she doesn't want to. She asked you to leave her room, but you refused and continued to make her talk about it. Then, you slammed the door behind her. That was aggressive behavior.
> 
> I recall your advice here on the forum was to go back home and play it cool and not let her anger you. But, you became aggressive, intimidating, and threatening. The suggestions for the VAR was to catch her in her lies and so forth, it wasn't intended to incriminate yourself because you were advised not to do or say things like this to her. No one has to live under these conditions, but you were trying to force her to do what you wanted. You weren't supposed to tell her to do anything at all. You cannot tell a grown woman what to do.
> 
> Therefore, the police saw what was going on and did what they were supposed to do even though you didn't like it and even though there are some here who do not know the law and disagree with the police. You have no claim against either of the police officers. The female officer can look however she pleases however you interpret the look on her face as hating men. It doesn't matter as long as she makes the right decisions, which she did and was well within the scope of her duties. She not only could have arrested you for assaulting your wife (verbal assault is still assault), trying to impede your wife's freedom to doing whatever she wants to do, and for aggressing toward, intimidating, and threatening your wife, she could also have arrested you for not doing as she told you to do with her being an officer of the law duly sworn to protect the safety of the public - the public being your wife who called the police for protection.
> 
> Sorry, Jason. You made a sundry of mistakes. Whether or not you intended to aggress toward her, and whether or not you intended to be intimidating and threatening, you did all of those things. There are areas of the law that are based on intended actions (intentions), and there are areas of law based on the result/effect of your actions despite your intentions.


So basically my point about the womens rights in america being seriously out of control is validated. She gets to cheat on me and have other men in our home but when I tell her I'm not going to put up w it anymore I end up almost arrested and kicked out of my home where I pay the bills. I NEVER threatened anyone w violence. I just told her I won't put up with her cheating and now I'm made out to be a monster??????? Its like no matter what I do I'm always wrong. If I try to be passive that makes me a beta male and too weak. If I try to be assertive then I almost get arrested. I don't get it. This guy threatens me but my lawyer says wait till I can prove it before going to the cops, but this woman makes one phone call and she's given all the credibility in the world. Total bull5hit. I'm so done with the laws in this god forsaken place. Seriously.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## River1977

jasonh said:


> So basically my point about the womens rights in america being seriously out of control is validated. She gets to cheat on me and have other men in our home but when I tell her I'm not going to put up w it anymore I end up almost arrested and kicked out of my home where I pay the bills. I NEVER threatened anyone w violence. I just told her I won't put up with her cheating and now I'm made out to be a monster??????? Its like no matter what I do I'm always wrong. If I try to be passive that makes me a beta male and too weak. If I try to be assertive then I almost get arrested. I don't get it. This guy threatens me but my lawyer says wait till I can prove it before going to the cops, but this woman makes one phone call and she's given all the credibility in the world. Total bull5hit. I'm so done with the laws in this god forsaken place. Seriously.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Jason, this is one reason I said you made so many mistakes. The police did not just take her word for it. The police took your word (those stated by you and recorded by you) as evidence to back up what your wife said. In other words, you were your own proof against yourself.

On the otherhand, you don't have any proof that he threatened you. How can you expect the police can do anything to him for what you cannot prove he said? Don't you see how it goes? Evidence is the only thing that proves the difference between one party's allegations and the other party's exclamations of innocence. The police cannot charge him with anything just because you said he did something because he, of course, will say he didn't. So, how do you expect they will take your word over his. To have some evidence or at least witness is the only thing the police can go by.

I want to add that if you don't like your attorney's advice, then go ahead and file charges against the guy. You can always file. No one can stop you or tell you that you can't. It would be a good idea to file the complaint that he threatened you so as to begin a record, a paper trail of documents if he actually does anything in the future. However, your filing doesn't mean the police will charge him just because you filed the complaint since you don't have any proof or witnesses.


----------



## the guy

So are you giving up on your kids? 
You will need the law!

Dude I know it all sucks but come on and stop letting your chick get the better of you. I mean it sound like your giving up?

We told you to call the cops before you went home, it was even mentioed to have a witness with you. The good thing is you listened and got the VAR...just think of were you would have been if you hadn't listen.

Your so focus on how crappy things are. You made some moves and they didn't go your way does that mean you don't have any rights at all? NO you do have rights and sooner or later things will start to go your way. For now you have some set backs... just don't give up!


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## the guy

I sugggest you reread this whole thread and start to regroup by educating your self. I think the more you read and learn the more you will start to see things go your way.


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## jasonh

the guy said:


> So are you giving up on your kids?
> You will need the law!
> 
> Dude I know it all sucks but come on and stop letting your chick get the better of you. I mean it sound like your giving up?
> 
> We told you to call the cops before you went home, it was even mentioed to have a witness with you. The good thing is you listened and got the VAR...just think of were you would have been if you hadn't listen.
> 
> Your so focus on how crappy things are. You made some moves and they didn't go your way does that mean you don't have any rights at all? NO you do have rights and sooner or later things will start to go your way. For now you have some set backs... just don't give up!


I'm not giving up on my kids. I'm just sick of the double standard.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Cosmos

jasonh said:


> I'm not giving up on my kids. I'm just sick of the double standard.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Forget the double standard, for now at least, and concentrate on yourself, your kids and getting out of this mess. Of course what your wife has pulled on you is outrageously unfair, but focusing on that isn't going to help you right now.


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## the guy

The standards sucks but I think its getting better, I think years ago guys had it alot worse.

Keep up the fight.....get a plan and work the plan.


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## jasonh

Just pulled up to the house and his truck is outside. Not gonna back down from him this time. Wish me luck guys. Not backing down anymore I'm going all in this time. God forbid something happens to me my lawyer has the proof that he did it.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Acabado

Well... good luck.


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## Halien

River1977 said:


> Halien, I want to laugh so badly but will simply ask if telling you your post makes no sense can be construed by you as attacking?
> 
> 1. If the officer was following protocol and that protocol procedure is based on the law and executed within the scope of her duties, then why did you think it necessary to correct what I stated since what I stated was correct?
> 
> 2. This is not a court of law. Jason is not in court defending himself against a charge of being threatening. This is a domestic situation, where the officers saw that his actions - by his own admitting and by what they heard on the recorder - were aggressive, intimidating, and threatening. Every bit of it was left to interpretation because he didn't actually tear the house down, yell and scream at her, or hit her. My point, and the way the officers saw it, was that she had every reason to feel threatened and intimidated by him based on his words and actions. That is the reason he was told to leave and not the wife. Had she been the one doing and saying the things that he did, then they would have told HER to leave. He was not told to leave for having done nothing.
> 
> 3. Please read to understand tort law.
> 
> 4. Please read to understand tort law and how it applies to civil situations and domestic situations (such as domestic abuse, domestic violence, etc). This is not a situation of criminal law. Therefore, your comments, as they are based on criminal law, do not apply.


River, perhaps you are referring to law outside the US, but I was referring to your claim that the OP threatened his wife, and that this somehow justified the actions of the police officers. Tort law is private law in the US, and cases of tort battery are judged and carried out by agents of the court, like sheriffs deputies, and are usually after the fact, as opposed to what happened here with the police. There is still the necessity of showing written or verbal intent to do bodily harm within the threats. When the police are responding, they are acting as agents of the criminal justice system in most states and territories in the US. Under BOTH tort law and criminal law, what the OP said to his wife would not fit the standard of being a legal threat, because it was missing any threat of bodily harm. The only implied threat was that which you brought in through bias. I understand that if his wife felt that she needed an order of protection, some jurisdictions use civil routes of due process, but that still doesn't imply a threat in this case. The implied threats that you mention rarely survive the legal system in both civil and tort law without some linkage to harrassments or specific threat of bodily harm. What I'm saying is that a person will have to add something to his comment along the lines of "I will not tolerate cheating in my house, AND I will hurt you if I have to."

I mentioned in my reply that I posted this with respect to your opinion. I'm not sure of the intent of your personal comments regarding my reply.


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## morituri

Jason should have called the police before entering his house to inform them of the situation and to request that they send an officer as a precautionary measure to help defuse a potentially violent situation. Oh well, I hope it doesn't turn ugly and that he doesn't get the short end of the stick, again.


----------



## Halien

morituri said:


> Jason should have called the police before entering his house to inform them of the situation and to request that they send an officer as a precautionary measure to help defuse a potentially violent situation. Oh well, I hope it doesn't turn ugly and that he doesn't get the short end of the stick, again.


I agree. Especially after his last incident with the police.


----------



## turnera

Eeek! I hope you at LEAST had a recorder on you?!


----------



## crazyconfused

A few different things
1. Where are you in Florida? 
I ask this because I don't buy this crap that this guy is such a billy bada$$ that he is made out to be. He maybe to win a fight because of his martial arts skills, but that's it. I don't buy that he trains all these spec war guys. The reason I ask where you is that are limited areas where he would be employed where he would be training people like that. If it were Hampton roads Virginia or on NC where backwater is it would be different. Don't feed into his inflated self image that he is super dangerous dude. 

2. A lot of posters are wrong about contractors. I have gone to lots of training with civilian companies that use contractors, or military programs that use civilian contractors. It's very common these days. Most of the contractors are prior military that are using the skills the military taught them. 

3 go scorched earth within reason. I would definitely put reviews on the Internet about that gym. Do it in a way that they can't tell it's you. Hell give me the info and I will do it. Make those lives as difficult as possible. Fight back. They have destroyed your life for no reason other than thier own selfish reasons. Just be smart a out it..Expose, expose, expose. 

4. If you are telling yourself that doing "x" is alpha, then your not being alpha. Alpha men just live it. This dude that is wrecking your life, he is a POS, but he's an alpha. Time for you to start living it. Stop over thinking everything, make a decision and go with it. Screw this guys and your wives lives up as badly as they have done to yours
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## ItMatters

Isn't it HER house? And while he pays the bills, the house has her name on the title? So he can't exactly kick her out, right?

Can't weight for the next installment...


----------



## morituri

I believe it is her father's house.


----------



## Shaggy

morituri said:


> I believe it is her father's house.


Father owns it, but Jason lives there.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## happyman64

I just hope he gets out ok and not in jail. His wife is crazy having the OM there with her kids.

This is not a good situation........
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Locard

Good luck with that....


----------



## donny64

jasonh said:


> So basically my point about the womens rights in america being seriously out of control is validated. She gets to cheat on me and have other men in our home but when I tell her I'm not going to put up w it anymore I end up almost arrested and kicked out of my home where I pay the bills. I NEVER threatened anyone w violence. I just told her I won't put up with her cheating and now I'm made out to be a monster??????? Its like no matter what I do I'm always wrong. If I try to be passive that makes me a beta male and too weak. If I try to be assertive then I almost get arrested. I don't get it. This guy threatens me but my lawyer says wait till I can prove it before going to the cops, but this woman makes one phone call and she's given all the credibility in the world. Total bull5hit. I'm so done with the laws in this god forsaken place. Seriously.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Buddy, it's just the way it is. It sucks. BUT, if you do your homework and stay focused, you DO have a fighting chance.

When my ex and I split up, it was because of her drinking. I told her to get out. She took her kids, I kept my son. She returned a few days later with promises of stopping drinking, changing, etc. The next day she absconded with our son and went out of state. I found out about it before she landed. I filed a complaint for child stealing...a felony. The police just missed her when she landed, unfortunately.

Long story short (and to get to the point), when she called that night, asking to work things out, I told her not only "was there no way in hell after she ran off with my child" but that she was going to jail.

The next day she beat feet to a lawyer. Filed for custody and claimed spousal and child abuse, and that she fled to protect herself and our son (of course she did, it was the only defense for doing so that wouldn't land her azz in jail).

I called the DA here, a female, and spoke to her. Asked her what was going to happen. She said they were DROPPING THE CASE against her because she was CLAIMING abuse of her and the kid. I told her it was bullchit, and I could prove it. It DID NOT MATTER. She said the case was closed because there were allegations of abuse. I said "so, what are you telling me? If I commit murder in your sorry azzed state, and flee the state claiming self defense, then it's done? All charges dropped?!!!" She had no comeback for that.

I spent the next 18 months trying to get my son back. Successfully. When she showed up in court the day of our hearing, she continued to claim abuse and said she would only agree to supervised visitation (at this point I had not seen my 3 year old son for 18 months). That was when (and this was her first clue I had done so) my lawyer advised her lawyer that I had recorded every phone call and word spoken between us since she took off with the kid, had all the recordings transcribed, and was ready to present them to the judge that day. If she continued with these b.s. allegations, he was going to bury her azz. Her lawyer left the room to confer with her, and came back and said "we have a deal". I got everything I wanted. And then the shoe was on the other foot. Now suddenly, she was asking for things from me!

Point is, you are a man. You are ALWAYS guilty until proven innocent. The only one that is going to do so is YOU. So, keep your wits, do your research, document everything, record everything, and keep your kids. Start a chronological journal TODAY. Dates, times, places, people, what happened, what was said. Handwritten journal. This can be used as evidence in court. She's going to go in (as my ex did) and think just because she had a vagina she was going to win. Well, she didn't count on me having my crap together. You do the same.


----------



## lordmayhem

crazyconfused said:


> 2. A lot of posters are wrong about contractors. I have gone to lots of training with civilian companies that use contractors, or military programs that use civilian contractors. It's very common these days. Most of the contractors are prior military that are using the skills the military taught them.


Without jacking the thread too much, yes, lots of programs use civilian contractors, everything from support functions, human resources, acquisition programs, to gate guard duty at military bases. But these are all support functions. Companies like Raytheon, Lockheed Martin, L3 Comm, etc, have defense contracts with the military. But they don't contract out for combat training, firearms training, or SERE training. Think back, did you ever remember having civilian contractors conduct your firearms training? Now, I do remember having civlians conducting chemical warfare training, but they weren't contractors, they were prior military, civil service in a GS rating.


----------



## kruppmart

No word from Jason yet ... hope he did not get arrested last night...


----------



## OldWolf57

I hope he has not been watching that TruTV show here in So. Fl. They just finished a case yesterday, of a husband ki**ing the wife and a POS. He got life. I pray J is alright.


----------



## Cosmos

OldWolf57 said:


> I hope he has not been watching that TruTV show here in So. Fl. They just finished a case yesterday, of a husband ki**ing the wife and a POS. He got life. I pray J is alright.


And it's for this reason that I feel the responsible thing for us all to do here is to try keep Jason as calm as possible and urge him to listen to his lawyer.


----------



## crossbar

I think that's what everyone here has been telling him is to let the system fight with him, not take this thing on his own. I mean, really. What advice has he REALLY listened to. Not much. Yeah, he got a lawyer, but didn't ask all the questions that needed anwsers to. He's threatened exposure, but he never went out guns blazing. And at least he's been carrying a VAR on him.


----------



## EleGirl

kruppmart said:


> No word from Jason yet ... hope he did not get arrested last night...


Yea, I've been keeping an eye on the thread as i'm concerned he did something to get himself in trouble. 

It bothers me that he just posted that he as going over there and apparently took off. I wish he had stayed around some and chatted with people who would have talked him out of doing this.


----------



## costa200

jasonh said:


> Just pulled up to the house and his truck is outside. Not gonna back down from him this time. Wish me luck guys. Not backing down anymore I'm going all in this time. God forbid something happens to me my lawyer has the proof that he did it.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Holy crap dude... I hope you're ok...


----------



## CantSitStill

Hoping he finds a way quickly to get restrain.ing order on OM and gets back to his kids...man I wish he woulda called 911 that first night he got beat up
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## morituri

Despite his assertions that he was not a hothead, Jason's actions make him look like one and hotheads, no matter how good they may be as people, usually end up making matters worse. There are women worth fighting for, actively cheating wives are definitelty not. I hope he comes back to the forum unscathed and with good news.


----------



## costa200

Just noticed this last update was yesterday... I wish this guy had run this by the most experienced guys here. This has horrible idea written all over it.


----------



## Paladin

His profile says he was on at 7:49am (1.5 hours ago) to look at this thread. So nice of him to update all of us. Man, he sure gets quite a bit of attention from the forum regulars, hope it's not going to his head.


----------



## morituri

Thanks Paladin. At least it shows that he is still with us, in the land of the living and not in jail. I do hope though that things went his way for a change.


----------



## crossbar

morituri said:


> I hope he comes back to the forum unscathed and with good news.


Wishful thinking, dude. Wishful thinking.


----------



## morituri

crossbar said:


> Wishful thinking, dude. Wishful thinking.


I feel like my avatar just b!tch slapped me


----------



## OldWolf57

J, you have to realize you are in the BS fog, so your thinking is not goint to be completely rational at this time. So plz, listen to the ppl here. Yeah, there was those preaching go home, and confront, but that and the law has put you in a very bad place now. There is a record of the cops coming for a domestic call, so she can say he is there protecting her from you. You have missed stepped some, but Dude, you are not alone. I have watch these ppl here walk BS thru this, they know of what they speak. Going thru this, there is a balance you will have to fight to strike, but you can do it. Forget beta, forget alpha, think FATHER, doing the smart thing for his KIDS !!


----------



## Cosmos

CantSitStill said:


> Hoping he finds a way quickly to get restrain.ing order on OM and gets back to his kids...man I wish he woulda called 911 that first night he got beat up
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I agree. Had he called the police the night he found his W and OM in bed together, he would have had the police batting in his corner from the get go.


----------



## lordmayhem

Well, he's not in jail and he's not dead. 










This particular OM seems to be very attached to this WW with 2 young kids and an angry husband. Even after the previous incident with the police, he's got the balls to go over to the house still. OM is expending a lot of effort on this one woman. This story is certainly dramatic. 

One would figure if this guy is a trainer and a wannabee badass, he would have other women lined up and moved on to the next one. This WW must be awesome in bed or something.


----------



## jasonh

So I walk into the house and he's sitting on couch watching tv and she was in the kitchen witn the kids. As soon as a walk in he says "there's the man of the hour". I ignored him and went into the kitchen w her and the kids. I notice the dog didn't have any water in his bowl so I calmly ask her why the dog dosent have any water. Especially on a hot day like this. She tells me that the kids keep knocking over the bowl and she's sick of cleaning it up off of the floor. She says she decided she will just give the dog water once a day. I told her that's the most stupid and inhumane thing I have ever heard in my life. She says if u are coming over here just to start a fight then I should leave. I told her that I'm not trying to argue w her but I don't want the dog to dehydrate. Its 90 degrees n outside. She storms out of the kitchen and I hear her in the other room talking to james. I stay in the kitchen w the kids and fill up the dogs water bowl and of course he drinks every drop. My son asks me to go out for ice cream, so I figure that actually is a good idea to get out and away from these to losers. As I'm walking out the door james says to me " you are walking on thin ice buddy". I ask him what that supposed to mean and he says "oh you will figure it out". I ask him was he threating me and he says "I warned you already, now keep it up". At this point he realizes that I'm not intimidated by him anymore. So I leave the house and actually I felt really good because I stood up for myself. So the kids and I go out for ice cream and then we stop at a local park to hang out a bit. Like an hour later I get a call from her asking where I am and that I need to bring the kids home because they need a bath. I told her I will bathe them myself, no worries. So apparently james takes the phone from her and starts yelling and cursing at me telling me that I'm an idiot etc and I better come home right now or he will come out and find me himself. That really pissed me off because how the hell is this guy gonna tell me what I can do with MY kids. I told him to go to hell and hung up on him. He calls right back still cursing at me and then he says " I have yet to kill a man on U.S. soil but there's a first time for everything. I hung up again and went to the police station to file a police report. The cops were really nice and asked me do I have any proof of his assault on me the other day. I showed them my chipped tooth and how loose my other teeth are. They said they will definately question him. I then explained to them that they need to have someone escort me to the house to take the kids. They said they already dispatched an officer there and I could go home. When I got back to the house there was a few cop cars there but his truck was gone. When I went inside there were 3 cops inside talking to my wife. One of the officers explained to me that james had left before they arrived but they caught up with him a few minutes later and he was pulled over and questioned. I ask was he arrested and he said no. So whatever I figured that now that law enforcement knows the deal he would be shaking in his boots and he would stay away. I leave the house and go back to my sisters house where I have been staying. As I pull into the driveway I get a phone call fropm a number that I don't recognize. When I answer, the person on the other line says: BOOM! At this point I just figure that its a prank so I hang up. The number calls right back and I answer and its james. He says:" see just like that it would have been over. One shot one kill". Then he starts telling me that he's looking right at me and it takes him less than a second to squeeze the trigger. I tell him if he's looking right at me, what I'm I doing right now? He basically explained exactly where I was standing and he described the layout of my sisters front yard. I look around but I couldn't see him. So I tell him if he's gonna shoot me then just get it over with, but if he were to shoot me it would be noisy and everyone would see that he did it. He then starts laughing and tells me that there are "ways around that". I ask him why is he doing this. He then just hangs up on me. I get back in the my vehicle and speed off as fast as I can. I didn't see any headlights behind me so it felt better. I really didn't want this drama going on at my sisters house and at this point I was more concerned for her safety than mine. I was debating whether if calling the cops would help or hurt the situation. I drove to the nearest police station and just sat in my car. I really was in a daze. My head was spinning. A few minutes later I get a call from him and he says "well aren't you gonna go inside to report me"? Then he starts laughing and says I wouldn't even make it to the front door. I'm like wtf? Does this guy have a GPS on my car??? I ask him what the fvck does he want from me and he just says. "Truce". Keep your mouth shut and leave her alone" I say fine you can have her I don't want her, I only wanna see my kids. He says ok from now on when you come over don't say 1 word to her and she won't say one word to you". I agree. Then he says ok. He hangs up. I sit there for like 30 minutes and I leave. I have not slept one minute since. I have ripped my car apart trying to find a GPS tracker but I can't find it. I truley cannot function right now. Please just bear with me. I can't take this anymore.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## the guy

Sorry your in such pain, I can only suggest you keep an eye on the prize and that prize is your kids so do what you need to do to spend as much time with them as possible.

See, in doing this it will help you stay grounded from all this crap. Trust me, kids have a way of bring out the best in all of us. YOU NEED YOUR KIDS AROUND YOU AS MUCH AS POSSIBLE!!!

The other plus to this, when youR WW sees the father come out in you it will reenforce the idea of you needing to be around the kids and kids need there dad.

So no agreement was made about how much time you spend with your kids...get it?

You need to document these action the other man is doing, so in the case you are gone they will have the suspect. I suggest a letter to the police and your sisters.

And if anyone one needs a lawyer it is you.

This OM is a loose cannon it will be a matter of time you get him in jail. IF it was me I'd screw the truce but I'm just a guy sitting her in the middle of the day typing on a computer.

You almost had him.

Does your wife understand the threat the Om is making towrds there kids father and the possiblity of her new boyfriend going to jail for murder.

For what its worth;

I suggest you check you breaks and your tail lights the wires can be placed in the gas tank so make sure your gas cap doesn't have a wire down it. Move back home he surely won't blow up his girlfriend house.


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## anonymouskitty

:scratchhead::scratchhead::scratchhead:


----------



## CantSitStill

you got no recordings of all this? ? uggg
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Cosmos

Jason, stop letting the OM rattle your cage. Get a restraining order forbidding him any contact with you. Exercise access to your kids away from the house, and keep in close contact with your Attorney and the police.


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## akashNil

Get your car checked by professionals/COPs - immediately. They deal with it all the time.

And wherever you are staying, I don't believe he can kill you in open. Did you record his threats on mobile? This was a golden chance.

Did you check yourself? Any chance of any device on your body/cloths/watch/mobile/shoes/tie?


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## anonymouskitty

And record any and all phone calls that you receive or make


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## Paladin

You ever considered placing the call on the speaker phone option and recording it with your VAR. This sounds like a bad movie. Call the plice, tell them you are willing to take a polygraph test to prove that you are telling the truth about the OM threatening you with a sniper rifle. 

Go to your lawyers office, RIGHT NOW, and have him file a restraining order against the OM. If your wife is capable of letting the man that is threatening to shoot you with a sniper rifle into your house, she is unfit to take care of your kids, because she is obviously mentally ill. 

Ask to be granted sole custody of your kids while you fight for your marriage (or whatever it is you are fighting for)

This is the US, not Egypt or Afghanistan, you have rights as a citizen, which are currently being violated by the OM, get your sht together and go take care of yourself. 

Go back to your house, with your VAR on you, and tell your wife what her affair partner has been telling you on the phone.


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## jasonh

Does anyone know how to wiretap a cell phone?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## the guy

This case sounds perfect for self defence plea.


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## Racer

jasonh said:


> Does anyone know how to wiretap a cell phone?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Download an app... Talk to the police and request they tap your phone voluntarily. Put it on speaker and use that VAR you are carrying. :scratchhead:


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## the guy

I have a sucktion type mic that I used on my hard line it plugged in to my VAR....stuck to the back of the head set
Check radio shack
You might beable to but a exterior mic from the VAR on the voice end of your cell.


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## CantSitStill

I would go back to the station tell them exactly what you just told us..he's not gonna shoot you just do it..tell them you are in fear for your life.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## the guy

Don't for get to pull/print your cell phone statement it will have the date and times the OM called you. 

If you play your cards right you can get this POSOM hes way to easy/dumb


----------



## Halien

827Aug said:


> Please stop hijacking this thread with troll accusations. If you have a problem with this thread, please report it.
> 
> Thanks!


Reiterating the warning near the beginning of the thread.


----------



## Paladin

wiretap who's cellphone? If you mean your own, there are a million ways to record the conversations on your own phone, just use google. If you are talking about wiretapping someone elses phone, you would be talking about committing a crime.

Here is a link to recording a cell phone conversation


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## the guy

Jason I hope you can see the POSOM is playing right into your hand as far as custody goes.


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## jasonh

I had the var on the whole time. I did put the phone on speaker twice but when I replayed it I couldn't really understand what was being said clearly. I need to wiretap my cell so I can prove everything. At this point I really don't think she even wants to be with him. I think she is scared of what will happen to her if she cuts him off. She looked defeated when I was leaving the house the last time. Like she wants no part of him. He is a control freak. She is realizing this and coming out of her fog.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## anonymouskitty

That still doesn't mean you need to play the part of Knight in Shining armour at this point, record any threats, show it to the police, file for D and get full custody


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## akashNil

jasonh said:


> I had the var on the whole time. I did put the phone on speaker twice but when I replayed it I couldn't really understand what was being said clearly. I need to wiretap my cell so I can prove everything. At this point I really don't think she even wants to be with him. I think she is scared of what will happen to her if she cuts him off. She looked defeated when I was leaving the house the last time. Like she wants no part of him. He is a control freak. She is realizing this and coming out of her fog.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Yes - maybe. That's why he doesn't want you to talk to her and her to talk to you. He might be sensing that he is loosing his grip on your wife.

But so what?


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## jasonh

Racer said:


> Download an app... Talk to the police and request they tap your phone voluntarily. Put it on speaker and use that VAR you are carrying. :scratchhead:


What's the name of the app? Can I use it on blackberry? How much is it?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## the guy

I suggest you stay as close to home as possible, hell it sounds like your chick may not invite you but it sound like she will enjoy the company..if you know what I mean.

Again take the time to spend as much time with the kids as possible it summer after all and if your wife is concerned about you stealling them then she can always come along....it you know what I mean.

You told us your not giving up so work your way back in slowly you can get the leverage and get this POSOM out of the way.


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## lordmayhem

Halien said:


> Reiterating the warning near the beginning of the thread.


Done.


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## morituri

I doubt it. It just may be that when she sees you she is reminded of what a lousy POS she truly is for having betrayed you and the kids by allowing herself to become involved with the scumbag.

Follow the other members recommendations to again go to the police station and file another report of harassment and to have your attorney file a RO against him.

Lastly, the police already have a person of interest in case something does happen to you. What he is doing is simply blowing hot air. Until you can wiretap your phone, I'd suggest that you hang up on him.


----------



## the guy

I'm thinking out side the box here so forgive me.

Keep your friends close and your enemies closer. What I mean is now that you have a truce befriend this POSOM and start getting in the way of the affiar...c8ck block if you will. Phsycological war!

Crazy I know but hell I don't think it could get any crazier


----------



## anonymouskitty

the guy said:


> I'm thinking out side the box here so forgive me.
> 
> Keep your friends close and your enemies closer. What I mean is now that you have a truce befriend this POSOM and start getting in the way of the affiar...c8ck block if you will. Phsycological war!
> 
> Crazy I know but hell I don't think it could get any crazier


Don't recommend this, just get audio evidence and file for an RO


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## akashNil

the guy said:


> I'm thinking out side the box here so forgive me.
> 
> Keep your friends close and your enemies closer. What I mean is now that you have a truce befriend this POSOM and start getting in the way of the affiar...c8ck block if you will. Phsycological war!
> 
> Crazy I know but hell I don't think it could get any crazier


Maybe there is some merit in this. Can try different variations of the same.


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## Acabado

Back to the police, report the kills treats, report the stalking, they can trace the calls. Don't back off, ever. Keep the presure. Keep yourself in the side of law. F0ck her, ignore her, keep OM away from your children, get a RO against him, for your house, for your children, for you.
You are clearly breaking this.


----------



## Racer

jasonh said:


> What's the name of the app? Can I use it on blackberry? How much is it?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Search Results for "record calls" - BlackBerry App World


----------



## ArmyofJuan

jasonh said:


> At this point I really don't think she even wants to be with him. I think she is scared of what will happen to her if she cuts him off. She looked defeated when I was leaving the house the last time. Like she wants no part of him. He is a control freak. She is realizing this and coming out of her fog.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


She made her bed....

That being said, don't go jumping to conclusions just yet but do turn your back on her and if anything, let her know you have NO interested in ever R'ing with her. 

The OM is bluffing, he knows if anything happens to you he will be the first person they will go after. He can't do anything to you with any hope of getting away with it. If you can get a restraining order or whatever, do it and don't worry about him.

The best way to act is to not care, look at him as if he is a harmless child that has a loud mouth. Neither the OM or your WS is worth wasting your time on.


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## Shaggy

Wtf? You shoud have walked into the station.

If James says sit, you should stand. If the guy actually could do anything, he would have. Instead he is playing the role of a bully and trying to intimidate you.

Talk to her all you like. And go have your attorney seek an RO against him at this point. Your cellphone should now have a record of. The phone he called you from. Want to the moron used his own phone? 

Talk to your attorney, then arrange with hm or others present to call that number and tell James you thought about it and he can forget any truce. Record the response along with the witnesses hearing it. Should get you the threat evidence you need for the ro.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Shaggy

Oh, and the cops stopping him clearly shook him up. His first act was to try to alpha up on you because he knows you alpha'd him. He was desperate to reestablish dominance over you. You shouldn't have agreed to the truce crap, it just empowers him.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## donny64

Ok, on the off chance this entire thing is not b.s. (my radar is REALLY going off, but will give benefit of the doubt)....

Go to a freakin' radio shack dude. There is a microphone that fits in your ear. You plug it into your VAR, put the mic in your ear, and the phone up to the ear with the mic in it. Easy.

As for the rest of it...stop being a puzzy. You can avoid confrontation without being a puzzy. The correct answer when he told you not to talk to your wife, and she wouldn't talk to you would have been "get bent and mind your own business". The correct thing to do when you walked in the house and he said "there's the man of the hour" would have been to just stop, look at him, smile a knowing smile, wink, and say "you have no idea". You're walking on thin ice? Response of "and you have already crashed through and don't even know it".

He's going to come find you? Tell him to do so. WTF is he going to do? Assault you in front of your children? Witnesses. Take the kids? Child stealing. You are the father, only the court at this point can take the kids from you. NOBODY else without court direction. She cannot direct just anyone to take the kids from you. Phuck, she cannot direct you at this point when to bring them home herself.

Grow a phucking pair for christ sake. You don't have to have a confrontation, but acting like a mouse in your own home is pathetic. Act like a man, and let the circumstances take you where they may. You don't threaten, you don't start a war of words that will end a fight, but you need to CARRY YOURSELF AS A MAN. 



> see just like that it would have been over. One shot one kill". Then he starts telling me that he's looking right at me and it takes him less than a second to squeeze the trigger. I tell him if he's looking right at me, what I'm I doing right now?


My response? "Okay Rambo, you think that lousy piece of azz is worth killing someone over, you're dumber than you look, but have at it".



> I drove to the nearest police station and just sat in my car. I really was in a daze. My head was spinning. A few minutes later I get a call from him and he says "well aren't you gonna go inside to report me"? Then he starts laughing and says I wouldn't even make it to the front door.


Stop running scared. Stop being intimidated by some wannabe badd azz. It's too sad that not only does he have your wife bullchitted, he's got you the same. Be a man and prepare to defend yourself if needed, and let the chips fall where they may. Take legal action where appropriate and at every opportunity. Document everything in a journal. If you're really that scared, document everything in a new email account a relative also has access to so that if anything happens, the police have every last bit of info they need.

This guy, if he's real, is a freakin' joke. Guys who have REALLY been in the chit do not continually profess about being a bad azz and about how they're going to kill you. You know how you know who the real ones are? They won't say a phuckin' thing until it's too late. If they do say anything, it's going to be a look you won't mistake for anything else, and a subdued warning. And anyone with any brains does not go around threatening people. They just act.



> I ask him what the fvck does he want from me and he just says. "Truce". Keep your mouth shut and leave her alone" I say fine you can have her I don't want her, I only wanna see my kids. He says ok from now on when you come over don't say 1 word to her and she won't say one word to you". I agree.


You are rolling up in the fetal position and letting another man dictate to you how you act with your wife and your children in your house. Are you that afraid of an azz beating that you have no shred of pride or self respect? Until the day you are served with a RO or told by a court to leave the house, you have every right to be there and do whatever the hell you please, as long as it's not illegal and / or violent. 

You have MORE than enough to get a restraining order. JUST GROW A PAIR AND DO IT. It is YOUR HOUSE until you are legally thrown out. I don't give a chit who owns it, you have established residency there. You do not have to leave. You have every legal right to be there. And as such, you have every legal right to get a restraining order against him to keep him away from you since he has already assaulted you and continues to threaten to do so.

JUST OUT OF PRINCIPLE, no matter if I was planning on divorcing and moving on, I WOULD MAKE HER LIFE MISERABLE AND NOT FACILITATE HER PHUCKING ANOTHER MAN *IN MY HOUSE WITH MY CHILDREN PRESENT.* Get a restraining order, and have him served. Move back into your house. Make her evict you. Take back your home field advantage. Keep a VAR on you at all times, and the next time she calls the police and makes a false claim of abuse, show it to them, and have her arrested for filing a false report. 

DUDE, this stuff is easy, and you're making it hard. If your lawyer is advising you to continue to act like a puzzy, you need a new lawyer. You're letting another man push you out of your home. KNOCK IT OFF. The point is not that you want her (if you do, you're freakin' insane and a shell of a man), but rather not facilitating them treating you like a puzzy and doormat. You're making it easy for them. What, are you going to light the candles next to the bed and bring them wine in bed next? WTF?

Manning up is not about taking this guy on toe to toe. It is about not acting like a mouse in your home and in front of your children who will look to you to see how a man acts. Do not do anything to provoke, but stand your freakin' ground in all ways. If he assaults you as a result, he goes to jail.

"Truce"?!!!! Good lord....

I'd rather live a day as a lion than a lifetime as a sheep.


----------



## anonymouskitty

Yeah, people who want a fight rarely talk, don't let this pretentious bastard get to you OP


----------



## Complexity

On the chance this isn't BS, Donny's referring to this. Plug it into your VAR and hold your mobile phone to your ear, it would record the convo. Mind you, you need to make sure this is legal.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Olympus-Tel...C8C8/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1342116770&sr=8-1


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## warlock07

He won't do jack sh!t. This guy is big phony!! He is just bluffing

Here is one that might help you 

How to Record a Conversation on a Blackberry | eHow.com


Or even better, switch to an android or iphone. They have million call recording apps


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## Shaggy

Btw the police do not issue RO they only get called to enforce them. Talk to your attorney and go see a judge. Btw, if moron dude's answer to everything is threat, how do you think he will treat your kids if they get put of line?

Get the RO extended to cover them as well.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Acabado

Your children, your home. If dad wants to evict you, let him do it, legaly.


----------



## Cosmos

And let us not forget the main protagonist in this sad state of affairs. A 'woman' who jeopardizes her children's well-being by endangering their father's life by creating a highly dangerous and volatile situation for them all. 

If I were a Family Court Judge, I would have serious concerns about her ability to protect and rear these children.


----------



## Baffled01

CantSitStill said:


> Hoping he finds a way quickly to get restrain.ing order on OM and gets back to his kids...man I wish he woulda called 911 that first night he got beat up
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Yeah, that's really what should have happened with such a formidable and brazen OM. If he had fought back, even if he took a beating, then called 911 afterward, there would be a police/ hospital report, the OM would be exposed. His wife would be exposed to her family.

Confronting a cheating spouse caught in the act with the OM is a very dangerous circumstance that many of us here in this forum need to consider. Emotions at this point are out of control and really anything can happen.


----------



## TBT

crossbar said:


> Yeah, I don't know. This story reminds me of a Vince Vaghn, John Travolta movie called Domestic Disturbance.
> 
> Anyway, I'll play.
> 
> Yes! you should have gone into the police station and reported him! The cops could have looked at your phone and discovered the last three calls were from him AFTER he was confronted by the cops. That, in itself, makes him suspect. Lord Mayhem could shead a little more light on the implications.
> 
> You should have let the calls go to voicemail. Even with anti-recording laws, most state that you can't record anyone without their knowledge. If he would have left a threatening message on your voicemail, then he KNEW he was being recorded, it would have stood up in court. Even if he left a voicemail message just saying "bang" and nothing else, the cops could see that he has registered guns and that voicemail would have gotten him put in jail.
> 
> The more BS you could have on this guy the bigger the RO you could possibly get on this guy to stay away from your entire family! Let's face it, your still married and he has threatened you in your house, in front of your family. That should be totally encompassing.
> 
> But, you're being a p*ssy and letting this guy get away with BS. I speculate the only thing he's killed is a spider. A lot of soldiers and Marines and Sailors don't BRAG about killing people like it was cool.


:iagree:

OM sounds like a "wannabe" that couldn't make the grade.


----------



## Shaggy

Have you had your lawyer do a background check on this guy? He seems like a loose cannon, so he likely has some record of run ins.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## crossbar

Shaggy said:


> Have you had your lawyer do a background check on this guy? He seems like a loose cannon, so he likely has some record of run ins.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I'd love to know what this guy's MOS was. Probably Supply Clerk, or Company Clerk.


----------



## jasonh

I'm about to fire this ****ing lawyer. I tell him everything and even let him hear the var, even though is wasn't really clear. His response was "why are you even going over there" , I told you to stay away from her and instead you go over there and instigate things". I told him that I didn't know james would be there and he says "who cares, you are just making things harder on yourself, I told you to just sit tight". I tell him I will get a restraining order on OM and he tells me not to because that will only prompt my wife to get a RO on me and that will complicate me from seeing my kids. I tell him that makes absolutely no sense and he tells me to do things my way and ill end up behind bars. I really agree with the guys on here who said that I haven't been alpha enough. When I stood up to james in front of my wife she had an odd look on her face. Kinda like "wow" waay to go"! I should have been doing this all along. Not that I want her back, but if we ever did get back together I would definately not be a push over anymore. I'm not scared of this guy. Not one bit. I can see now that he's all talk no action. I'm just going to continue to potray my alpha behavior and let him watch in horror as she starts begging to have me back.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Shaggy

Ok, ditch the current lawyer and hire a new one then.. Your current one sounds like the take your money, but do nothing type.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Jimena

You need to take your kids to stay with you at your sister's house. They do not belong with your wife. Being around a lunatic like him is more damaging to them than moving or staying in a cramped environment. They need to be with the stable parent.
Yes, fire the lawyer. File the restraining order against the OM once you get your kids out of the house.


----------



## donny64

Cosmos said:


> With respect, telling the OP that he's a p*s*y is unhelpful right now. He's already feeling fraught and emasculated by what has happened. The best we can do is keep him calm and encourage him to deal with things legally.


He hasn't taken the hint. Now he needs to be hit between the eyes with the truth. This will haunt him and eat at his self esteem forever if he does not change his ways. He does not need to fight this caveman, but he needs to take all legal steps to fight back, AND stop cowering to the caveman. Could it end badly? Yes. But I'll be damned, myself, if I'm going to cower from anyone ESPECIALLY over things I'M SUPPOSED TO BE PROTECTING! Cameman makes it physical? I'll go freakin' crazy neanderthal on his azz. He may still win, but he WILL walk away thinking "holy chit, I did not see that coming. That is one crazy, angry sumb!tch! This chit hurts!"

This is not going to end the way he hopes (him with his wife back). IF (big IF) she ever took him back at this point, it will only be until next alpha male comes along and makes her all wet and bothered. He's lost any chance of garnering any respect from her whatsoever. That ship has sailed and sunk. But, if he does not change his ways, he'll also never gain the respect of any future GOOD woman. He'll eventually tell her the story of this whole mess, and she will be gone in short order. No good woman wants a man that will not fight for his wife (if they're worth it, and in this case she's far from worth it), or especially his children, or his "castle". He tells this "story of woe" to any prospective future partner, and she'll be running for the hills in short order. A woman wants and needs a man who will protect all of those things...her, her children, and their home. That is what women LOOK for and NEED in a man. He has done NONE of this. 

The truth hurts, but glossing over it to protect his sensitive feelings at the moment will not do HIM a damn bit of good, not now, and not in the future as he pursues a woman worth a damn.


----------



## cabin fever

You seriously don't have a R.O. against this moron?

WTF?


----------



## anonymouskitty

jasonh said:


> . I'm just going to continue to potray my alpha behavior and let him watch in horror as she starts begging to have me back.


This doesn't sound alpha to me at all, more like needy beta. 

Your wife is going to lap that up, two men fighting for her, oh yeah I can almost picture it.

Wake up brother, wake up


----------



## Cosmos

jasonh said:


> I'm about to fire this ****ing lawyer. I tell him everything and even let him hear the var, even though is wasn't really clear. His response was "why are you even going over there" , I told you to stay away from her and instead you go over there and instigate things". I told him that I didn't know james would be there and he says "who cares, you are just making things harder on yourself, I told you to just sit tight". I tell him I will get a restraining order on OM and he tells me not to because that will only prompt my wife to get a RO on me and that will complicate me from seeing my kids. I tell him that makes absolutely no sense and he tells me to do things my way and ill end up behind bars.[/i][/size]


Jason, any lawyer worth his salt would be giving you this very advice. If you don't trust your present lawyer, then hire another, but he's going to give you similar advice...

Do yourself a favour and stop worrying about the alpha stuff right now. Clarity of thought is what's needed most to get through this... You're in an awful situation, and now is not the time to get the testosterone running any higher than it already is, because it's going to get you into trouble.


----------



## OldWolf57

go to the police NOW !!! everytime you do, you are creating a official record. Are you listening now. THAT is your perfect protection. thats why he is threating you to keep it quiet and not in the eyes of the law. Its easy to tail someone with the headlights turned off. thats how he knew. I have done it myself. Go file a complaint with the police NOW. Let them trace the number. Explain just like you did right here, and tell them you want to file a complaint. The sooner you get some official records connecting him and you the better off you will be.


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## jasonh

Shaggy said:


> Ok, ditch the current lawyer and hire a new one then.. Your current one sounds like the take your money, but do nothing type.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


How do I go about getting my money back from him?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## KirkSpock

Could it be that you and your lawyer have completely different goals? It appears that your lawyer’s goal is to get you a good, clean divorce, In which case his advice is probably sound. Your goal appears to be slightly different and more emotionally charged….which isn’t an insult towards you at all, I mean how could you NOT be emotionally charged with all this craziness going on in your life? I’m just saying that your lawyer is completely disconnected emotionally and can think more rationally than you (at this moment) and therefore proceed with what he knows will work within the law. 
HOWEVER, and I’m surprised this hasn’t been mentioned earlier, there’s nothing stopping you from consulting with another attorney and seeing THEIR viewpoint, which may (or may not) be more along the lines of what you are looking for. If a doctor diagnosed you with some strange and bizarre disease, certainly you would seek a second or third opinion on the subject. Assuming an initial consultation is free, what harm could consulting with another lawyer or two do you? If all the others say the same thing as your current attorney, perhaps there is some merit to what he is saying? If you find an attorney that tells you things more along the lines of what is being suggested in this forum, then you can select that attorney. 
In any event, I must agree with everyone else who is encouraging you to report this incident to the police, like, right now. If the guy is a wanna- be, then you’ve lost nothing and gained everything. If he is serious, than in the event that he does something, there is a police record and in the end, you win. In any event, I’d be concerned about an attorney who advised me against getting a RO from someone who, literally, threatened my life. For me, that goes well outside the issue of divorce entirely: the rhetoric has moved from family and divorcing into personal death threats. This is something you, personally, should take very seriously and address with the local authorities as soon as possible. Creating a paper trail NOW documenting this persons violent tendencies might not only save your life, but the lives if your children. I hate to even bring it up, but if he smacks one of your kids around, it’s much more damning for him when the police show up if he has a paper trail of abusive tactics. Without the trail, it’s just his word against yours….again. 
Finally, for the love of all that is holy: stop answering the phone when this guy calls. Stop talking to him. Stop responding to him. Let your phone ring and ring and ring (make sure to document when the calls come in, you can use that later when filing a RO to demonstrate harassing calls). You are completely inflating his machismo ego and playing right into his hands each and every time you waste breath responding to this guy. 


Good luck.


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## turnera

jasonh said:


> I ask him what the fvck does he want from me and he just says. "Truce". Keep your mouth shut and leave her alone" I say fine you can have her I don't want her, I only wanna see my kids. He says ok from now on when you come over don't say 1 word to her and she won't say one word to you". I agree. Then he says ok. He hangs up. I sit there for like 30 minutes and I leave. I have not slept one minute since. I have ripped my car apart trying to find a GPS tracker but I can't find it. I truley cannot function right now. Please just bear with me. I can't take this anymore.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


 I'm sorry to be rude, but come on! Were you the bully victim as a child or something? Good grief. Go camp out at the police station until they arrest the idiot and call your laywer *NOW*!


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## crossbar

Dude, you need a bull dog lawyer. Do the research. Talk to people that had to take legal action and got great results from their lawyer. Drop this guy. You're trying to be and alpha guy with a beta lawyer.


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## turnera

Racer said:


> Download an app... Talk to the police and request they tap your phone voluntarily. Put it on speaker and use that VAR you are carrying. :scratchhead:


 Do this TODAY!

Have you told her parents what just happened?


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## donny64

> I tell him I will get a restraining order on OM and he tells me not to because that will only prompt my wife to get a RO on me and that will complicate me from seeing my kids.


This guy is a putz. Any judge will see this as retaliatory, especially if you have the VAR evidence.

Don't take action to protect yourself and the kids because she may retaliate? Stay away from your home and kids to avoid confrontation? 

No, strike first, and strike hard. Get a lion of a lawyer. File for divorce, full custody, and a restraining order against him. Have the papers served on them both all at once. Get them off balance and reacting to you. You DO NOT want to be reacting to her. Never telegraph your "punches". Let everything come as a shock and suprise to them. Let them constantly wonder what you're going to do next to screw up their little fairy tale fantasy. And continue collecting evidence. You'll need it for the hearings and court.

You need to find out about the laws regarding recording others in your state NOW. Many do not allow it without at least the consent of one party to the conversation. BUT (listen here and see if you can work this) THAT DOES NOT APPLY TO CONVERSATIONS IN A PUBLIC PLACE WITH NO EXPECTATION OF PRIVACY! You need to know this so you can manipulate the conversation as you need to get the evidence you need next time you're in a public place with either one of them. That can be a restaurant, your driveway, the park...you get the idea. Let the lawyers battle in the hearing if it is legal or not...at that point EVERYONE (to include the judge who will be making the decisions) knows the recordings exist, and has a general what is on them. It reflects favorably upon you, no matter if they take them as evidence or not, because NOBODY is going to record themselves doing something wrong. Just the fact you try to get this into evidence will be beneficial to you.

AND, if Rambo threatens you in a public place, assaults you in a public place, and you have it on tape? Buh-Bye G.I. Wife confesses to filing false claims on tape in a public place? Cops would LOVE to have that recording. Cops hate it when a crazy woman abuses the system and wastes their time. Trust me, they do.


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## crossbar

And how does the asshat know your phone number?


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## turnera

If nothing else, jason, report it all to the cops and insist they start a file on him, then go get your kids, take them to someone else's house, and stay there. When she starts steaming from the ears, just say 'your boyfriend threatened to MURDER me yesterday and I will NOT ALLOW my children to be around a man who may kill them, too. You wanna see the kids? Get a lawyer.'


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## donny64

Angel5112 said:


> True. Story. :rofl:
> 
> All of my brothers, a lot of my cousins, my H, and most of his friends are military (mostly Marines, a few Navy). They always talked about the "badasses" who never even had to shoot their guns, but always talked about how awesomely fierce they were. The ones who do experience don't run around talking about it. At least in my experience. It is a trauma that you don't want to relive.
> 
> There was one guy in my H’s unit (which was NBCD or CBRN) who was always saying stupid shat like that. End rant!


I've been close to many a combat vet. The guys who were in the chit did not run around bragging about it. And they were mostly all quiet men, who would give warning but react in a snap if they needed to. In my time in military and LE I've also seen many posers like the OM who were torn to shreds by anyone who knew what they were talking about, or who stood up to their fake bravado.

Don't fear the guy telling you how bad he is...fear the guy who is sitting back quietly and not saying a word about how bad he is.


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## KirkSpock

Must agree with the above posters questioning this guy’s military background. I served in the military for several years and (fortunately) never saw combat, nor did I ever do anything “badass” outside the range of what everyone else gets to do. ALL of my combat vet buddies are extremely sensitive to macho talk when it comes to combat and killing, every single one of them has PTSD or some sort of service related disability, and only my non combatant vet friends brag about being tough guys. I have personally known three separate soldiers who would lie through to their teeth to women about being special ops, military intelligence, etc. when they were really only E-1 or E-2 level radio operators (privates, in other words). Most people who don’t come from a military family or served themselves don’t know one MOS from the other (or even what an MOS is) so it’s easy to make crap up. That all said…none of that information is relevant to death threats being levied against you. I WOUD be interested in a background check on this guy NOT to verify that he served, but to verify that he was not just released from prison or is wanted in another state, or something along those lines. The lies your wife is buying aren’t important: the truth of this guy’s background could be vital to your children’s safety.

Good Luck


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## jasonh

KirkSpock said:


> Must agree with the above posters questioning this guy’s military background. I served in the military for several years and (fortunately) never saw combat, nor did I ever do anything “badass” outside the range of what everyone else gets to do. ALL of my combat vet buddies are extremely sensitive to macho talk when it comes to combat and killing, every single one of them has PTSD or some sort of service related disability, and only my non combatant vet friends brag about being tough guys. I have personally known three separate soldiers who would lie through to their teeth to women about being special ops, military intelligence, etc. when they were really only E-1 or E-2 level radio operators (privates, in other words). Most people who don’t come from a military family or served themselves don’t know one MOS from the other (or even what an MOS is) so it’s easy to make crap up. That all said…none of that information is relevant to death threats being levied against you. I WOUD be interested in a background check on this guy NOT to verify that he served, but to verify that he was not just released from prison or is wanted in another state, or something along those lines. The lies your wife is buying aren’t important: the truth of this guy’s background could be vital to your children’s safety.
> 
> Good Luck


I agree 100 percent.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## jasonh

Can someone please tell me the easiest way I can fire this lawyer and get a full refund????
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Cosmos

jasonh said:


> How do I go about getting my money back from him?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


You can cancel his mandate by simply phoning him and confirming it in writing. As for getting your money back, he's already spent time in consultation with you, so I doubt this is a possibility.

Don't be so quick to fire him, Jason. He's given you good advice, IMO.


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## Shaggy

jasonh said:


> Can someone please tell me the easiest way I can fire this lawyer and get a full refund????
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Actually talk to him. Say you are finding that you are not happy in that you and he disagree on the right priorities here and you'd like to end his counsel. He will bill ou fir the time he has already sent, but should refund the reminder of the retainer.

The fact that he isn't helpmg you get the RO against a man that has assaulted you and nw has threatened to kill you says it all.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Shaggy

Cosmos said:


> You can cancel his mandate by simply phoning him and confirming it in writing. As for getting your money back, he's already spent time in consultation with you, so I doubt this is a possibility.
> 
> Don't be so quick to fire him, Jason. He's given you good advice, IMO.


Cosmos, what is your take on the lawyers refusal to seek an RO against this man ?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Halien

jasonh said:


> Can someone please tell me the easiest way I can fire this lawyer and get a full refund????
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I'm not sure, but it would seem to me that the easiest way is to approach a new, aggressive lawyer and ask him. If he/she wants your business, they will help you get out of the old lawyer. Or, at the very least, you are getting a second opinion. Work through the system, and don't let yourself be thrown out of it by firing a lawyer without a backup plan in place.

Don't underestimate what turnera is saying. Think about the types of issues that make everyone stand up and pay attention, despite their preconceptions. You have a guy who is coming into your home, with your kids, who has threatened murder on multiple occasions. Some people will go on and on about proof, or lack thereof, but any civic official will immediately envision what will happen if this guy actually carried out these threats in the presence of children. It is like storing explosives in the presence of your children. If you camp out at the police station, or a new aggressive lawyer, ask them repeatedly if they are willing to deal with what will happen if this crazy guy hurts your children.

Prioritize, Jason.


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## Cosmos

Shaggy said:


> Cosmos, what is your take on the lawyers refusal to seek an RO against this man ?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Shaggy, that I don't understand. Jason needs to question the lawyer more about this, particularly in light of the phone calls after he'd been to the police.


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## seasalt

This is getting more ridiculous by the post. Forget the refund of the lawyer's fee. It's like the old joke about Jack Benny who when asked by a mugger "your money or your life" asked for a moment to think about it.

It's obvious that your not a husband but what about being a father? Your children are in danger. What are you going to do about it? Your shilly shally postings here doesn't make them safe.


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## the guy

Yes like I said I was just thinking out side the box. As we are all very distant from the emotional pain Jason is going thru, I do admit that we all can se OM walking right into a RO and if any very little cusdoty for his WW while she is with him. I hope OP knows it and its just a matter of time when he gets a team together that will include a good lawyer, district attorny, family and friends.

Just like in past cases we all read about here the AP and the wayward start to make mistakes, the affair is strained, and life goes on with or without the marriage. while the AP go off to find easier pry.


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## crossbar

donny64 said:


> Don't fear the guy telling you how bad he is...fear the guy who is sitting back quietly and not saying a word about how bad he is.


BINGO!! Well put. See, this guy is an asshat and if he such a "badass" then why is he a personal trainer. He should be teaching close combat to law enforcement and military....OH YEAH!! That's right. We proved that he was full of crap. So, why isn't he working working with blackwater as "green zone Badasses" Oh yeah!......Because the douche bag doesn't work for them! He works at a gym....

And didn't he say that he could hit you with a 50cal round at about a half mile? Yeah, with the windage and the weight of the round, I would LOVE to see an accurate shot on that! Scout snipers that have been training and doing that for years could do it......but, did he tell you that he was a scout sniper? Not that I can recall!

I would love to meet this Jackass and blow holes into this guys story.


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## anonymouskitty

During my early 20's I used to train in Chiang Mai, the local boys had a saying for us foreigners who went there to brag about our prowess in the ring

"no matter your pretense, you are what you are and nothing more"

The OM is a phoney baloney OP, you stand your ground, get a new lawyer if need be, and don't go out of your way to confront the OM.


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## the guy

Talk to your lawyer and explain the engency and that if his case load is such that he can't help protect you and the kids then you either get another recommendation for a lawyer or find some one else. 

As as the money goes you might not get it back but you may get some.

Lawyers understand facts and showing him some proof of what you are up against he may take the step to push your case ahead of others.


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## turnera

Good idea. Call CPS. Tell them that the man who is no inhabiting your house (after kicking you out) has threatened on multiple occasions to MURDER you and that your children are now in danger in that home. You want them out NOW - you don't care if it's to put them with you, but out of the house OM is coming to.


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## turnera

And who is paying who? Tell your lawyer you want the RO NOW.


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## turnera

Oh, and from now on, hold your damned VAR in YOUR HAND whenever you are around either one of them. Don't be sneaking it into the vicinity like a scared little 6th grader. Hold it out and make it CLEAR you will be recording everything they do.


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## crossbar

Cosmos said:


> Shaggy, that I don't understand. Jason needs to question the lawyer more about this, particularly in light of the phone calls after he'd been to the police.


 Probably a typical divorce lawyer that wants to do as little as possible and collect a big check at the end.


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## CantSitStill

ohh yeah won't hurt to try and get CPS involved, good idea..you'd think if the police knew he called you like that knowing where you are that they will investigate and get more involved..freaky that he called and aked if you are gonna go in..but why didn't you?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## the guy

b/c OP was worried about getting shot.
Sure it wouldn't have happen but thats the kind of mind war OM is capable of. The same kind of mind games OM uses to take married chicks with kids.


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## crossbar

He wouldn't have gotten shot. I don't think the asshat would have been that stupid. Guy gets questioned by the police and an hour or two later the guy that accuses him that he's threatening to murder him ends up dead on the steps of the police station? Hello prime suspect!!

And plus, this guy wouldn't be stupid enough to shoot out at a police station.

If the OP is using an iphone, then the asshat tracked him through that.


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## turnera

You STILL need to go to the police station and file a report - that he called you WHILE YOU WERE AT THE POLICE STATION - knowing you were there and treatening to shoot you if you got out of your car!


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## turnera

btw, didn't OM say 'why are you sitting in your car?' when he called? That means that he followed him and was watching him.


----------



## the guy

Of course he won't have gotten shot, but at the time Op was and still is in a fragile state.
I think in time OP will move forward it whats best for him and his kids...no matter the risk to his own safety.

becuase he now see the mind f^ck that just happened and won't let it happen again. IMHO the OM has more to worry about and his wife....let hope the POS OM keeps up his crap so that it buries him deeper and realizes the prize is not worth the effort especially now that the affair is getting stressed.


----------



## the guy

What are the stalking laws like in Florida?

another avenue to look at


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## crossbar

But the OP also stated that when he was driving to the police station, no headlights were following him. 

I still say he's tracking him through his phone. He's been at the house enough times to look at a bill, get his number; call the carrier and get the GPS activated on that phone. THAT WAY he would always know where the OP was while he's screwing his wife because he knows that the OP has guns too!


----------



## Thor

Well it is easy enough to get a second cell phone and leave the old one somewhere like his sister's house. Jason could leave it turned on just for giggles or could pull the battery to make sure it is stone cold powered down.

The lawyer sounds like he is giving good basic advice. Avoid confrontations with stbxw and asshat posom. Don't tempt yourself and don't create the opportunity for things to go bad. Stbxw and posom could call 911 and claim Jason hit her etc etc and they can support each other's stories. That is just one example of how Jason could get hosed without doing anything wrong. Or maybe Jason just finally gets pushed to the edge and throws a punch or says something threatening which posom gets recorded on his var or hidden video.

The atty has probably seen all this kind of emotional crap before and knows the simplest and cleanest way for Jason to get through the divorce is for Jason to stay away from stbxw and the house.

I tend to agree. There is no reason to poke the bear with a pointed stick. But I would certainly have the car checked for a VAR and GPS, and I would get a new cell phone asap. Have the old number forwarded to the new number. Only call her when necessary, and only do it from the old phone. Keep documenting asshat's harassment and stalking, and follow up with the police.


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## Cosmos

> The atty has probably seen all this kind of emotional crap before and knows the simplest and cleanest way for Jason to get through the divorce is for Jason to stay away from stbxw and the house.


Agreed. His job is dealing with the legal aspect of things, not playing games with the neanderthal OM.


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## OldWolf57

J why are you sitting there viewing your thread instead of going to the cops ??


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## OldWolf57

you don't need headlights to tail someone. I have done it.


----------



## crossbar

Cosmos said:


> Agreed. His job is dealing with the legal aspect of things, not playing games with the neanderthal OM.


I agree, but if his client has a fear for his life, LEGALLY shouldn't his lawyer seek out an RO for his client that also emcompass his children as well?

I mean, he's got the police reports, hospital statements and the crappy recording. 

I just don't get it.


----------



## costa200

Honestly i don't know how some guys have this much patience. By now, specially with kids on the game i would have this spitting his teeth with severe brain damage... Damn... I may get into serious trouble one of these days 

To the OP, you need to get the police protecting your kids man. This guy can be full of crap or not. Report all his behavior and record every exchange you have with these people.


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## Shaggy

Cosmos said:


> Agreed. His job is dealing with the legal aspect of things, not playing games with the neanderthal OM.


Yes, but getting an RO to protect his client and the children should be a top priority, especially since you would likely preempt a similar attempt to get an RO on him by his wife.

The last thing he should be doing is siting back and waiting, and that is exactly what this lawyer seems to suggest doing: nothing except filing for D.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## crossbar

OldWolf57 said:


> you don't need headlights to tail someone. I have done it.


Driving fast for 30 minutes with the victim aware of his situation and actively looking for a tail?

I respect your opinion, but I think he would have saw someone. Nah, I'm still going with the phone. Seems more viable of an option.


----------



## Paladin

crossbar said:


> Driving fast for 30 minutes with the victim aware of his situation and actively looking for a tail?
> 
> I respect your opinion, but I think he would have saw someone. Nah, I'm still going with the phone. Seems more viable of an option.


“The hardest thing of all is to find a black cat in a dark room, especially if there is no cat.”
― Confucius

The protagonist in this story.. erm.. thread has told us that the OM is a military contractor who trains special forces. The OM probably re-tasked a spy satellite, or is using a UAV to track the OP. The OM is not worried about having his calls traced because he is using burner phones routed through VoIP servers located outside of the US. Or maybe, while the OP was sleeping, the OM surgically implanted a transmitter that is attached to the OP's optic nerve? Tough either way.


----------



## thebuckest

Dude bottom lune you need to protect yourself and ur family at all cost. Jail anything reallg wouldn't matter to me but rhats me I would anihilate this guy in fron of my wife and kids but that's me and I'm no small fry. With that saic here's something that's pretty easy actually when u male it to court have him drug tested and make sure u mention steroids. **** does not come ouf of ur system easily and if he doesn't know the test is coming he wont pass. And sorry you get the bad impression of steripds its actually not true and if u think you could really take hkm if u were strlmger get some urself and give it two months get jacked and have at him.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Paladin

@thebuckest

Why are you advocating violence and drug use? Also, I'm all for demystifying the stigma associated with certain drugs, but that has to be done in a responsible way. If a person has never participated in weight lifting/body building, they wont need to juice for at least 6 months. The body will produce all the extra chems it needs when it is first put through stress.


----------



## Cosmos

crossbar said:


> I agree, but if his client has a fear for his life, LEGALLY shouldn't his lawyer seek out an RO for his client that also emcompass his children as well?
> 
> I mean, he's got the police reports, hospital statements and the crappy recording.
> 
> I just don't get it.


Crossbar, I don't get that either


----------



## EleGirl

ItMatters said:


> Isn't it HER house? And while he pays the bills, the house has her name on the title? So he can't exactly kick her out, right?
> 
> Can't weight for the next installment...


I assume that he gets his mail there and that it's the family residence.. so it's his home as well. Neither of them have the right to kick the other out.

The question is which will chase the other out first.. and we have our answer. She used irrational threats to chase him out... to save himself from false accussations.


----------



## turnera

He should have never left in the first place.

But it's obvious that she and her DAD have been ruling the marriage from the beginning. He was only there at their good graces.


----------



## Complexity

Could it be a respect thing too? like a stay at home dad, could his wife possibly feel less respect for him because he lives in her dad's house?


----------



## EleGirl

jasonh said:


> So I walk into the house and he's sitting on couch watching tv and she was in the kitchen witn the kids. As soon as a walk in he says "there's the man of the hour". I ignored him and went into the kitchen w her and the kids. I notice the dog didn't have any water in his bowl so I calmly ask her why the dog dosent have any water. Especially on a hot day like this. She tells me that the kids keep knocking over the bowl and she's sick of cleaning it up off of the floor. She says she decided she will just give the dog water once a day. I told her that's the most stupid and inhumane thing I have ever heard in my life. She says if u are coming over here just to start a fight then I should leave. I told her that I'm not trying to argue w her but I don't want the dog to dehydrate. Its 90 degrees n outside. She storms out of the kitchen and I hear her in the other room talking to james. I stay in the kitchen w the kids and fill up the dogs water bowl and of course he drinks every drop. My son asks me to go out for ice cream, so I figure that actually is a good idea to get out and away from these to losers. As I'm walking out the door james says to me " you are walking on thin ice buddy". I ask him what that supposed to mean and he says "oh you will figure it out". I ask him was he threating me and he says "I warned you already, now keep it up". At this point he realizes that I'm not intimidated by him anymore. So I leave the house and actually I felt really good because I stood up for myself. So the kids and I go out for ice cream and then we stop at a local park to hang out a bit. Like an hour later I get a call from her asking where I am and that I need to bring the kids home because they need a bath. I told her I will bathe them myself, no worries. So apparently james takes the phone from her and starts yelling and cursing at me telling me that I'm an idiot etc and I better come home right now or he will come out and find me himself. That really pissed me off because how the hell is this guy gonna tell me what I can do with MY kids. I told him to go to hell and hung up on him. He calls right back still cursing at me and then he says " I have yet to kill a man on U.S. soil but there's a first time for everything. I hung up again and went to the police station to file a police report. The cops were really nice and asked me do I have any proof of his assault on me the other day. I showed them my chipped tooth and how loose my other teeth are. They said they will definately question him. I then explained to them that they need to have someone escort me to the house to take the kids. They said they already dispatched an officer there and I could go home. When I got back to the house there was a few cop cars there but his truck was gone. When I went inside there were 3 cops inside talking to my wife. One of the officers explained to me that james had left before they arrived but they caught up with him a few minutes later and he was pulled over and questioned. I ask was he arrested and he said no. So whatever I figured that now that law enforcement knows the deal he would be shaking in his boots and he would stay away. I leave the house and go back to my sisters house where I have been staying. As I pull into the driveway I get a phone call fropm a number that I don't recognize. When I answer, the person on the other line says: BOOM! At this point I just figure that its a prank so I hang up. The number calls right back and I answer and its james. He says:" see just like that it would have been over. One shot one kill". Then he starts telling me that he's looking right at me and it takes him less than a second to squeeze the trigger. I tell him if he's looking right at me, what I'm I doing right now? He basically explained exactly where I was standing and he described the layout of my sisters front yard. I look around but I couldn't see him. So I tell him if he's gonna shoot me then just get it over with, but if he were to shoot me it would be noisy and everyone would see that he did it. He then starts laughing and tells me that there are "ways around that". I ask him why is he doing this. He then just hangs up on me. I get back in the my vehicle and speed off as fast as I can. I didn't see any headlights behind me so it felt better. I really didn't want this drama going on at my sisters house and at this point I was more concerned for her safety than mine. I was debating whether if calling the cops would help or hurt the situation. I drove to the nearest police station and just sat in my car. I really was in a daze. My head was spinning. A few minutes later I get a call from him and he says "well aren't you gonna go inside to report me"? Then he starts laughing and says I wouldn't even make it to the front door. I'm like wtf? Does this guy have a GPS on my car??? I ask him what the fvck does he want from me and he just says. "Truce". Keep your mouth shut and leave her alone" I say fine you can have her I don't want her, I only wanna see my kids. He says ok from now on when you come over don't say 1 word to her and she won't say one word to you". I agree. Then he says ok. He hangs up. I sit there for like 30 minutes and I leave. I have not slept one minute since. I have ripped my car apart trying to find a GPS tracker but I can't find it. I truley cannot function right now. Please just bear with me. I can't take this anymore.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


What kind of phone do you have? You can buy phone apps that record conversations. Buy one and install it. If you don't have an iphone or an android get one so you can record his threats.

Then once you can do this... do something to get him to call you back. Get the recording and go to the police. You are giving into this guy way too easy.

Does your wife know that he is making these threats? She and your children are in danger. this guy is mentally off.


----------



## turnera

Complexity said:


> Could it be a respect thing too? like a stay at home dad, could his wife possibly feel less respect for him because he lives in her dad's house?


Well, given his actions of the past few days, it doesn't sound like he does a lot to appear very alpha, so it probably doesn't help.


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## turnera

jason, what have you decided?


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## EleGirl

jasonh said:


> Does anyone know how to wiretap a cell phone?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


There are apps you can buy for recording cell phone conversations.

My son's now ex wife tired to have him killed in earlier this year. She still calls him and threatens him. She even admits that she had her bother try to shoot my son. 

so i've been trying to get him to put the app on his cell phone. He thinks that she'll leave him alone now 'cause the divorce was final last week and she's living with a knows heroin distributor who wants her all to himself.. so she's to busy to worry about killing my son, her now ex.

I don't know about this.

There are just some crazy people in this world.


----------



## CantSitStill

Jason is her husband so I would think he has more right to be in the home than the OM. The OM is probably reading all of this thread too since he seems to know every move Jason is making. This is the most disturbing creapiest story I ever seen on here.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## EleGirl

jasonh said:


> Can someone please tell me the easiest way I can fire this lawyer and get a full refund????
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


You can fire an attorney at any time for any reason. You should do it in writing. You are entitled to any part of your retainer back that the attorney didn't actually do work on your case.

Before you fire him, interview a few attornies and see how they would handle the situation. If they all say the same thing he does... then don't fire him.

Your attorney has a very valid point. You are stirring things up and it can back fire. So you have to be very careful here.


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## EleGirl

Shaggy said:


> The fact that he isn't helpmg you get the RO against a man that has assaulted you and nw has threatened to kill you says it all.


I don't think that the OP has any hard evidence that the OM has assaulted him or threatened to kill him.

I believe this is a large part of the attorney's point. And to get that evidence the OP keeps putting himself in situations that could back fire on him.


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## turnera

Well, if jason hadn't run in their without a recorder in his hand yesterday, or kept it going when the guy called him, it would be a different story.


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## EleGirl

CantSitStill said:


> ohh yeah won't hurt to try and get CPS involved, good idea..you'd think if the police knew he called you like that knowing where you are that they will investigate and get more involved..freaky that he called and aked if you are gonna go in..but why didn't you?


People seem to have an unrealist view of what the police and courts can do.

There is no proof that the OM threatened to kill him, followed him or anything else. It's Jason's word against the OM's. 

My son's wife had her brother try to kill my son. The first time the brother shot at my son was in the TArget parking lot. About a hour later they drove by my house and took a couple of shots at him on our property in one of the horse fields.

Five police officers were in out driveway and witnessed the shooting at our property. So they chased the car down and arrested the occupants. But there was a big problem... no gun. The brother knows this area very well and so he diched the gun.. probably threw it into one of the acres and acres of fields around here.

The police searched the road side where the brother shot into the horse field. They could not find any brass or shell casings. 

So they cannot prosecute the brother and son's ex-wife who was driving because there is evidence... there is no gun.


A person cannot get a RO either without some proof, other than their own words, that the other person is harassing them or a danger to them.


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## badbane

turnera said:


> Oh, and from now on, hold your damned VAR in YOUR HAND whenever you are around either one of them. Don't be sneaking it into the vicinity like a scared little 6th grader. Hold it out and make it CLEAR you will be recording everything they do.


Have a backup hidden just in case.


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## costa200

> So they cannot prosecute the brother and son's ex-wife who was driving because there is evidence... there is no gun.


If you have police officers as witness and they see and pursue them, apprehend them and can't do nothing because there is no way to find the gun... Your legal system is just not working. Had no idea it was that bad...


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## OldWolf57

ok I'll say this and drop it. I have had tails on me at NIGHT that hung back while I was driving in neighborhoods an I95. dark cars are hard to see even when they pass under street lights when they are 2 to 3 blocks back. I know what you are saying an you could be right. I was just giving examples of things I KNOW !! subject DROPPED.


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## jasonh

GOOD NEWS!!!! I went alpha on my lawyer and told him that either he be aggresive or give me my money back. Turns out that my lawyer is a bulldog after all! He told me that not only will speak to the DA's office about the RO but he will also pursue an AGGRAVATED STALKING charge!! It gets better. Depending on the evidence we can present, the lawyer will request that his bond be revoked! Woooohooooo! I feel like a thousand pounds have been lifted off my shoulders. I love you guys. Thanks for the advice. I seriously could have not done it without you!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## costa200

jasonh said:


> GOOD NEWS!!!! I went alpha on my lawyer and told him that either he be aggresive or give me my money back. Turns out that my lawyer is a bulldog after all! He told me that not only will speak to the DA's office about the RO but he will also pursue an AGGRAVATED STALKING charge!! It gets better. Depending on the evidence we can present, the lawyer will request that his bond be revoked! Woooohooooo! I feel like a thousand pounds have been lifted off my shoulders. I love you guys. Thanks for the advice. I seriously could have not done it without you!
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Now for some real life hardcore scene... You do realize that you may need to defend yourself from assault when this gets in gear? Are you prepared to defend yourself? Are you ready to do that? Do you have friends to rely upon?


----------



## crossbar

jasonh said:


> good news!!!! I went alpha on my lawyer and told him that either he be aggresive or give me my money back. Turns out that my lawyer is a bulldog after all! He told me that not only will speak to the da's office about the ro but he will also pursue an aggravated stalking charge!! It gets better. Depending on the evidence we can present, the lawyer will request that his bond be revoked! Woooohooooo! I feel like a thousand pounds have been lifted off my shoulders. I love you guys. Thanks for the advice. I seriously could have not done it without you!
> _posted via mobile device_


good! Finally!!!!


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## EleGirl

costa200 said:


> If you have police officers as witness and they see and pursue them, apprehend them and can't do nothing because there is no way to find the gun... Your legal system is just not working. Had no idea it was that bad...


Yep it's that bad. I asked why they not do a gun powder residue test on the brother. The police said that those no longer hold up in court. They can show that the person shot a weapon. It does not prove that they shot at my son. He could have been out sports shooting shortly before they drove down our street.


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## EleGirl

jasonh said:


> GOOD NEWS!!!! I went alpha on my lawyer and told him that either he be aggresive or give me my money back. Turns out that my lawyer is a bulldog after all! He told me that not only will speak to the DA's office about the RO but he will also pursue an AGGRAVATED STALKING charge!! It gets better. Depending on the evidence we can present, the lawyer will request that his bond be revoked! Woooohooooo! I feel like a thousand pounds have been lifted off my shoulders. I love you guys. Thanks for the advice. I seriously could have not done it without you!
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Get a recording device for your cell phone or an app for it NOW. You have no idea when he will try his threats again. 

I don't think your wife is aware of how bad this guy is. The recordings will be good for letting her know to... she has to know eventually to protect her and your children.


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## Cosmos

jasonh said:


> I feel like a thousand pounds have been lifted off my shoulders. I love you guys. Thanks for the advice. I seriously could have not done it without you!
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Yes you could, Jason. You're just stressed out right now and needed the occasional nudge.

That's great news about your Attorney. Keep on communicating with him.


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## Chaparral

You are in Fla with great gun laws. Take a concealed carry class.

I knew a guy (business aquaintance) that sounds like OM. He went into a roid rage, attacked his wife, fled the popos, pulled over and killed himself.

BEWARE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## 827Aug

Jason, you may want to ask your attorney about getting a no trespass order instead of a restraining order. That would definitely get him out of your house. I once had a patient threaten to kill me and my family. Law enforcement was called immediately. They said a no trespass order was more effective. Plus, they took him into custody for a psych evaluation for a couple of days.


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## Cosmos

827Aug said:


> Jason, you may want to ask your attorney about getting a no trespass order instead of a restraining order. That would definitely get him out of your house. I once had a patient threaten to kill me and my family. Law enforcement was called immediately. They said a no trespass order was more effective. Plus, they took him into custody for a psych evaluation for a couple of days.


The trouble is, the house belongs to his FIL and his W invited the OM in, so I don't think a no trespass order would be appropriate.


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## 827Aug

Yeah, but that is Jason's residence and that's where his children are. FIL has not evicted Jason from the house. That's why I mentioned that. The deputy I dealt with said the no trespass order was much more effective than a RO--and he filed it on the spot. I also mentioned that because I'm in Florida


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## EleGirl

Cosmos said:


> The trouble is, the house belongs to his FIL and his W invited the OM in, so I don't think a no trespass order would be appropriate.


They will need to sort this out because it's also Jason's legal residence. 

I know that when my son went to pick up these things he had the police come with him. His wife started yelling that it’s her apartment and he has no right to be there. Well he had been living there and he got his mail there… so it’s legally the marital home.
She even went so far as to lock out my son and the police officer when they carried some things to the car. The police officer made her open the door and told her that her husband has as much right to be there as she does since they are married. That is the law. It’s the marital home.
Jason needs to check local laws on this. He’s obviously a legal resident in the house. She or her father, depending on their mortgage/lease/rental agreement would have to give him a 30 day notice. But usually if it’s the martial home he cannot be evicted if she and the children still live there. That takes a court order from family court.

She has the right to invite the OM into the home legally. But if the OM is stalking/threatening Jason, Jason has the right to get a RO and other legal actions to keep the OM away from his home (the family home) and away from him and probably from his children as well. The RO would trump the wife’s right to invite the OM over to her husband’s and children’s home.

If the wife wants to see OM she will then have to go to his place or a hotel.


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## KirkSpock

Jason, that's great news. Hang in there, it sounds liken things might finally start going your way. 

I wanted to disagree with the suggesting that you hold the VAR in your hand. I disagree because, once the OM sees this, there's nothing stopping him from attack him Jason and taking it away from him. When it;s hidden, then he can catch things the moronic OM thinks he can get away with, and Jason will have some sort of tangible evidence. Again, nothing stopping a lunatic from beating down a person they KNOW is recording their bad behavior, then blaming the fight on Jason when the cops show up (and his sobbing wife corroborating whatever the OM says). Hidden and stealthy is certainly the way to go with this lunatic.


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## EleGirl

What audacity his wife and the OM have to do what they are doing. I cannot imagine a man coming into another mans’ home and basically ordering the husband out of his own home. And yet to expect Jason to still pay the mortgage, utilities, etc.

This OM and WS are a piece of work. I’m so glad that Jason is standing up to this SOB and his wife.


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## EleGirl

KirkSpock said:


> Jason, that's great news. Hang in there, it sounds liken things might finally start going your way.
> 
> I wanted to disagree with the suggesting that you hold the VAR in your hand. I disagree because, once the OM sees this, there's nothing stopping him from attack him Jason and taking it away from him. When it;s hidden, then he can catch things the moronic OM thinks he can get away with, and Jason will have some sort of tangible evidence. Again, nothing stopping a lunatic from beating down a person they KNOW is recording their bad behavior, then blaming the fight on Jason when the cops show up (and his sobbing wife corroborating whatever the OM says). Hidden and stealthy is certainly the way to go with this lunatic.


I agree. 

If they know you have it, they can take it away from you.

And even if they do not take it away from you they would just get more crafty... not say anything directly to you can can be recorded... but use hand signs (finger across the throat, etc) to threaten you ... and maybe do things like start attacking you physically when you are way from the house and not expecting them and hence not recording.

Showing them the recorder is giving them warning. Don't do this.


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## 827Aug

EleGirl said:


> What audacity his wife and the OM have to do what they are doing. I cannot imagine a man coming into another mans’ home and basically ordering the husband out of his own home. And yet to expect Jason to still pay the mortgage, utilities, etc.
> 
> This OM and WS are a piece of work. I’m so glad that Jason is standing up to this SOB and his wife.


That's why I wouldn't rule out that he may be on steroids or something else. He doesn't sound right to me. He could be a ticking time bomb.


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## 67flh

jason, florida does have some fantastic gun laws..after ro is in place i would be caring some form of gun.


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## thebuckest

Not advocating violence but self defense. And as far as drug use that was more of a joke and no u can't lift to raise t lvls especially after thirty. Then its actually prescribed to a lot of men. But this just what I thought when I read his post sorry if it offended anyone it is what it is.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## 827Aug

Remember that a restraining order won't necessarily keep the OM out of the house and away from the children while Jason is at work.


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## Cosmos

827Aug said:


> Yeah, but that is Jason's residence and that's where his children are. FIL has not evicted Jason from the house. That's why I mentioned that. The deputy I dealt with said the no trespass order was much more effective than a RO--and he filed it on the spot. I also mentioned that because I'm in Florida


I'm in the UK, so realize the laws will be different, but I do wonder how the OM could be perceived as trespassing _if Jason's wife invited him into the house? _ In your case, neither you nor your W had invited this person in so, yes, he was definitely trespassing.

Jason really needs to check all this out with his Attorney.


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## EleGirl

Cosmos said:


> I'm in the UK, so realize the laws will be different, but I do wonder how the OM could be perceived as trespassing _if Jason's wife invited him into the house? _ In your case, neither you nor your W had invited this person in so, yes, he was definitely trespassing.
> 
> Jason really needs to check all this out with his Attorney.


The question for Jason to ask an attorney is he can unilaterally get a do not trespass order when his wife wants this guy at the house. 

If there is also a RO, that might weigh in his favor to the the do not trespass order.


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## jasonh

He is enjoying his last days of freedom right about now. As far as the steriod use i have DOCUMENTED evidence of this. I have photos of a bottle I saw in the bathroom cabinet. TESTOSTERONE CYPIONATE 200 mg bottle. It dosen't get any clearer than that. This man is a violent animal that is on anabolic steroids and pretty soon will be locked away with NO BOND! I can't wait! I feel like a little kid on christmas eve lol!:smthumbup:


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## CantSitStill

Pretty sad the dude has his stuff in your medicine cabinet..hell I'd take it and throw it away..a picture of a bottle in a cabinet doesn't prove anything..im confused..when are they gonna do anything about this guy? ugg
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## CantSitStill

maybe I just don't understand ..i don't know but I sure hope you are right Jason
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Thor

chapparal said:


> You are in Fla with great gun laws. Take a concealed carry class.


Chap, I disagree.

I am a big 2A proponent. I have been very very active in protecting our 2A rights. I ran a web site and was an activist in the issue of National Park concealed carry. I took my 16 yr old daughter to a nationally renowned gun fighting school. I am a proud NRA Life Member. Both of my daughters received wicked spring assisted pocket knives for their 15th birthday. I say these things to show that I am no stranger to defensive use of firearms, and I am a big believer in armed self defense and the Stand Your Ground laws.

The reason I don't like the idea of Jason being armed right now is that he has told us of numerous times he has provoked confrontations with posom. Jason's posts read to me like his emotions are running high.

I will change my mind if there is a credible threat against him. In that instance though he also needs to dedicate himself to not instigating contact with posom or stbxw.

There is a lot more to armed self defense than taking a class and strapping on a pistol. There are a lot of nuances to the law. A person needs to do some soul searching about the circumstances under which he would reveal his hidden firearm and then use it. Would he for example draw his gun if posom smacked stbxw? It might be legal to do so, but would it be smart? What does his internal moral compass tell him about that situation?

It would be very easy to find oneself being the next big news story given what has transpired already. While Jason might be legally within bounds in a defensive use of a firearm, he might find himself with enormous legal bills and unwanted media spotlight attention.

A person with no prior training who is in an emergency situation should absolutely avail himself of any tool. If posom is a credible threat to Jason he should seek qualified advice and training, and then arm himself. But it must be stressed that he should do everything possible to avoid contact with posom and stbxw if he arms himself. I am not convinced Jason has the emotional calm needed at this time.

edited to add: This is why every mentally competent adult should pre-plan and prepare for unexpected emergencies, including violent attack. Nobody expects to get into a car accident or be in a major natural disaster tomorrow morning, but it will happen to some individuals. Nobody expects to need to defend his/her life from violent attack, but it will happen tomorrow to some individuals. Being pre-trained and pre-equipped for armed self defense is vastly better than trying to figure it all out when unexpectedly facing a situation like Jason's.


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## jasonh

I wonder with all this specialized training that he has if he trained how to "not drop the soap". Lol! He is gonna need it pretty soon! I am so tempted to call him and tell him to enjoy his last day of freedom. But i better not. I'm just having a few beers right now with my brother to celebrate this guys future demise.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## crazyconfused

Yeah carrying a concealed weapon right now would be bad. I'm a big proponent and do carry concealed, but in this situation it would be very bad. If you shot him, it would look like revenge. Peppers pray though, doable. Jason you are on the right track though. But do not back down. Show your kids that you will not back down. I hope you don't care what your WW thinks. As everyone else has said, he isn't some spec ops guy. He was using some trick and he is messing with your head. Don't fall for it. He is getting off on this... I wouldn't provoke him, but I wouldn't not go to your house either. If he's dumb enough to hit you, you got him by the balls. Matter of fact, that's the biggest favor he could do for you right now. Then it jail time/ RO time for him
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## turnera

KirkSpock said:


> Jason, that's great news. Hang in there, it sounds liken things might finally start going your way.
> 
> I wanted to disagree with the suggesting that you hold the VAR in your hand. I disagree because, once the OM sees this, there's nothing stopping him from attack him Jason and taking it away from him. When it;s hidden, then he can catch things the moronic OM thinks he can get away with, and Jason will have some sort of tangible evidence. Again, nothing stopping a lunatic from beating down a person they KNOW is recording their bad behavior, then blaming the fight on Jason when the cops show up (and his sobbing wife corroborating whatever the OM says). Hidden and stealthy is certainly the way to go with this lunatic.


 I agree with you except that he said when he left he found that it recorded nothing intelligible while in his pocket.


----------



## Paladin

jasonh said:


> I wonder with all this specialized training that he has if he trained how to "not drop the soap". Lol! He is gonna need it pretty soon! I am so tempted to call him and tell him to enjoy his last day of freedom. But i better not. I'm just having a few beers right now with my brother to celebrate this guys future demise.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Not to rain on your parade, but arent you a bit premature in your celebration? Has your attorney actually contacted the DA's office? Is the DA willing to get involved? Does you attorney have a good working relationship with the judges in your local area? You said depending on what evidence you can present, will dictate what type of charges your attorney will push for. Have you decided what you will be presenting?


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## EleGirl

jasonh said:


> I wonder with all this specialized training that he has if he trained how to "not drop the soap". Lol! He is gonna need it pretty soon! I am so tempted to call him and tell him to enjoy his last day of freedom. But i better not. I'm just having a few beers right now with my brother to celebrate this guys future demise.


I don't think it's time to celebrate yet. 

What evidence do you have right now? So far is sounds like it's your word against his.


----------



## Juicer

Saw this, and go interested. Anyway, dude, the steroid thing is more dangerous than you think. 

Frst off, make sure that steroid/prohormone is illegal. He may have gotten it through doctor prescription, or magazine, or grey market, wheatever. Just make sure it is illegal befoe you bet all your chips on this.

You think he is bad on steroids? Try him off steroids. 
I have taken steroids and stuff like this so I know what I am talking about. 
Being on steroids just makes you a bigger version of whatever you were before. So he was a big macho prick before, so now he is a huge macho prick. 
Now, let's say he goes to jail. They won't give him any post-cycyle drugs in there. Which is what a user MUST take if they do any cycle of steroids. That is when one gets angry, agitated, and is mostly likely to have the roid rage. Ironic it isn;t on cycle but after the cycle is over. 
So you will have a juiced up, super angry man after you. Better hope he doesn't post bale, because if he does, you are dead. A user doesn't think right on the stuff, and they think horribly wrong off the stuff. So he may actually carry through on his threats if you expose him. 

I am not say9ing don't do it, just make sure you understand everything, and know all the risk.


----------



## turnera

jasonh said:


> I wonder with all this specialized training that he has if he trained how to "not drop the soap". Lol! He is gonna need it pretty soon! I am so tempted to call him and tell him to enjoy his last day of freedom. But i better not. I'm just having a few beers right now with my brother to celebrate this guys future demise.


Warning: 2x4s coming: 

jason, no offense, but you seem really really weak and the gloating...well...it reminds me of a kid who gets the local bullies to beat up his big brother. You could have stood up for yourself at any point along the way...but you didn't. You LET your wife kick you out of your own house. You LET her move her boyfriend in with YOUR CHILDREN. You LET him laugh at you from YOUR COUCH while you went inside, huddled your kids outside, and left him sitting there. You LET him intimidate you from doing what you knew you should do - go inside that police station. Every step of the way, you have acted less alpha than your own wife. Have we mentioned a few times yet how much women DESPISE weak men? And replace them? That's what's going on in your life.

I'm not saying you deserve what's happening. I'm trying to get you to see that YOU have the potential to make NEW choices moving forward. IDK if you want your wife back, but your kids need to see their father LEAD their family. I hope all this will be helping you see that you could reconsider taking a stronger stance in future interactions with them.

JMHO


----------



## Acabado

What about bringing your brother and his friends again to your house?
Tell him to pay more visits. Get a couple of matress.


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## crossbar

IF a warrant gets issued. DO NOT ANSWER YOUR PHONE!!!!!!! LET EVERYTHING GO TO VOICEMAIL!!!!!!!!

ANSWERING PHONE= NO

LETTING EVERYTHING GO TO VOICEMAIL= YES!!!

IF YOU SEE THAT IT'S YOU WIFE CALLING DO YOU ANSWER IT?= NO!!!!!!!

LET IT GO TO VOICEMAIL?= YES!!!!!!

She might threaten you and hurt her case. Then you'll have a record.


Hopefully, that was clear.


----------



## CantSitStill

Juicer said:


> Saw this, and go interested. Anyway, dude, the steroid thing is more dangerous than you think.
> 
> Frst off, make sure that steroid/prohormone is illegal. He may have gotten it through doctor prescription, or magazine, or grey market, wheatever. Just make sure it is illegal befoe you bet all your chips on this.
> 
> You think he is bad on steroids? Try him off steroids.
> I have taken steroids and stuff like this so I know what I am talking about.
> Being on steroids just makes you a bigger version of whatever you were before. So he was a big macho prick before, so now he is a huge macho prick.
> Now, let's say he goes to jail. They won't give him any post-cycyle drugs in there. Which is what a user MUST take if they do any cycle of steroids. That is when one gets angry, agitated, and is mostly likely to have the roid rage. Ironic it isn;t on cycle but after the cycle is over.
> So you will have a juiced up, super angry man after you. Better hope he doesn't post bale, because if he does, you are dead. A user doesn't think right on the stuff, and they think horribly wrong off the stuff. So he may actually carry through on his threats if you expose him.
> 
> I am not say9ing don't do it, just make sure you understand everything, and know all the risk.


That's very good info Juicer..hope Jason reads what you said. This is all so sad..I'll be praying tonight for Jason, hope it doesn't get uglier than it already is
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## TBT

Acabado said:


> Get a couple of matress.


Going to the mattresses already eh,Don Corleone!!


----------



## EleGirl

crossbar said:


> IF a warrant gets issued. DO NOT ANSWER YOUR PHONE!!!!!!! LET EVERYTHING GO TO VOICEMAIL!!!!!!!!
> 
> ANSWERING PHONE= NO
> 
> LETTING EVERYTHING GO TO VOICEMAIL= YES!!!
> 
> IF YOU SEE THAT IT'S YOU WIFE CALLING DO YOU ANSWER IT?= NO!!!!!!!
> 
> LET IT GO TO VOICEMAIL?= YES!!!!!!
> 
> She might threaten you and hurt her case. Then you'll have a record.
> 
> 
> Hopefully, that was clear.


Can you explain why he should not answer the phone is a warrent is issued?

I think that might be the best time to get a recording of the OM making threats. All Jason would have to do is to say "Hello" and then let the OM yell and threaten. Then hang up.

What am I missing?


----------



## golfergirl

EleGirl said:


> Can you explain why he should not answer the phone is a warrent is issued?
> 
> I think that might be the best time to get a recording of the OM making threats. All Jason would have to do is to say "Hello" and then let the OM yell and threaten. Then hang up.
> 
> What am I missing?


Plus he does have children. If wife called it could be regarding children.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Shaggy

EleGirl said:


> Can you explain why he should not answer the phone is a warrent is issued?
> 
> I think that might be the best time to get a recording of the OM making threats. All Jason would have to do is to say "Hello" and then let the OM yell and threaten. Then hang up.
> 
> What am I missing?


I think the idea is to have them leave the threats on voice mail so they are recorded.


----------



## turnera

EleGirl said:


> Can you explain why he should not answer the phone is a warrent is issued?
> 
> I think that might be the best time to get a recording of the OM making threats. All Jason would have to do is to say "Hello" and then let the OM yell and threaten. Then hang up.
> 
> What am I missing?


I think crossbar meant if HE gets an order against OM and possibly his wife, then he can't engage with them, or HE will be in violation of his own RO and it will be thrown out, or he can get in legal trouble.


----------



## crossbar

Shaggy said:


> I think the idea is to have them leave the threats on voice mail so they are recorded.


Yes! And I don't know what state he lives in but, some states have anti-recording laws which state that you cannot record someone without their knowledge. If they leave a voicemail message, THEY KNOW they are being recorded and anything they say could be used in court because it's in the framework of the law.

Plus, if he's not answering the phone, that's going to get under their skin and get them mad enough to blow up on the phone.

So, if his wife leaves a message like, "Okay you chickensh*t, when my boyfriend gets out of jail, he's gonna kill you and I'm not going to stop him. You're living on borrowed time. I would run if I were you." That would probably help his case with custody.


----------



## crossbar

golfergirl said:


> Plus he does have children. If wife called it could be regarding children.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


If it's a call about the kids, then return the call, but the first time she starts talking about things other than the kids. Hang up.

But, I'm banking she's going to say something about the kids. I'm hoping she going to leave a message like, "You just screwed up big time! You're never going to see you kids ever again. I'LL MAKE SURE OF THAT!!!" judges don't like to hear those.

And if she leaves a message like that, he could apply for emergency custody of the kids. I mean, you could go to the cops and your lawyer and tell them. Look, she left me this message. I know the guy she sleeping with is in jail, her world got turned upside down. She's emotionally distraught and she tells me I will never see my kids again. What EXACTLY does she mean by NEVER. Are we talking homicide and suicide? I'm scared for my kids.


----------



## costa200

[B]carpenoctem[/B] said:


> *Jayson:
> 
> In your situation, your immediate concerns are: lawyers, police, ROs, etc.
> 
> Please focus on them, while defocusing a little on the Alpha-Beta dichotomy going on in your mind.*
> 
> 
> 
> But if / when you do get a break from them at any point, do reflect on the points below.
> 
> At the root cause of your problem, as all can see, is your Beta existence. You also realize this. To me, it even seems that at the moment, more than your wife’s betrayal, it is the Other Man’s seemingly Alpha posturing and arrogance that is eating into you.
> 
> *You actually are questioning your very existence as a man, in the light of this extreme Beta classification of you.*
> 
> 
> 
> This story is in my memory. Cannot recollect where it came from.
> 
> *Scene 1:*
> 
> Small town. Bar. Young man sitting in the bar. Local tough buy walks in with a gun, and threatens someone. When questioned, he threatens everyone. The young man blurts out: “Oh sure. It’s easy to be tough with a gun in his hand.”
> 
> The bully hears it. He walks over to the young man, gives him the gun, and tells him: “okay. Now YOU have the gun. Shoot me, tough guy.” Obviously, the young man does not. The bully slaps him across his face, and taunts him. The young man gives back the gun, tells him: “I am not a killer,” and walks out.
> 
> *Poor Beta mongrel.
> 
> 
> Scene 2:*
> 
> Same town. Now, it is ravaged by war. The factories have been bombed out, and there are no jobs left. The only job available locally is: transporting extremely fissile nuclear fuel in trucks. If the truck goes faster than 10 mph, the material will explode. If the truck goes over a ditch or a speed-breaker a little too roughly, boom.
> 
> The young man, and some other men like him, take on the job, because they don’t want their children to go hungry. They willingly risk their lives every second they are on the job, for their family.
> 
> But does the bully take up this job? No. He is now running around, looking for a job that does not involve the risk of his rear being blown to smithereens any moment.
> 
> *NOW, the erstwhile Alpha Dog is the Beta mongrel.*
> 
> 
> 
> Alpha is not really fornicating with other men’s wives in their own home or smashing their teeth in, and reveling in it. Even a thief who broke into your home to steal would / could beat you down. But we wouldn’t see THAT as a Beta shame. *It is all in perspective.
> 
> It is just that your courage lies elsewhere. *Somehow, control your hurt male ego, duck and dodge your way through this chaos *(but stand firm on legal grounds – that’s the only space where you are equipped to be Alpha here), *get out of this in the best way possible, and start a new life.
> 
> *Living well is the best revenge, Jayson. SOMEHOW *get there without getting killed for a woman who is not worth it, and without losing rights on your son.
> 
> *P.S.:
> If your wife was a victim of aggression – If this was an intruder in your home, who is bigger and physically stronger than you, and is used to violence, you MUST fight and die to save your family if you have to. There is no question about it.
> But to do that for someone who operates as an unpaid prostitute under the aegis of your marriage, is downright dumbassery.*
> 
> 
> 
> It is beyond belief that you are still talking in terms of getting your wife back. Really? You want this woman back in your life? Do you think she is going to treat you with dignity ever?
> 
> If, as things evolve, the OM becomes a danger to her too, she might want you back, and seek your help (that seems very likely, the way the OM’s personality is unraveling). In that moment, you might feel THAT is Alpha, and wanting to show the OM who the real man is, you might reclaim her as your woman (wife).
> 
> *THAT, my brother, would be the biggest Beta surrender you have made in your life.*



Love this guy, he just saved me some 20 minutes to write it down. Jason, you read all of this very carefully.


----------



## thebuckest

jasonh said:


> He is enjoying his last days of freedom right about now. As far as the steriod use i have DOCUMENTED evidence of this. I have photos of a bottle I saw in the bathroom cabinet. TESTOSTERONE CYPIONATE 200 mg bottle. It dosen't get any clearer than that. This man is a violent animal that is on anabolic steroids and pretty soon will be locked away with NO BOND! I can't wait! I feel like a little kid on christmas eve lol!:smthumbup:


Yup that's the stuff test cyp is a blend of three test esters one short one long and one med takes about two weeks to leave ur system and even longer for ur bloodwork to pan back out to normal. Hope u didn't find it around ur kids house this **** can tear a kid up, throws off there endocrine system and stunt growth etc. If u want to get funny drain the bottle and fill it with veg oil. After three weeks he will be potent.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## 827Aug

thebuckest said:


> If u want to get funny drain the bottle and fill it with veg oil. After three weeks he will be potent.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Not a good idea. That could be really dangerous, since it's an injectable. If he's on this particular medication, there's a chance he may already have difficulties with his manhood.


----------



## jasonh

Well my lawyer called and gave me an update. He is almost 100 percent certain that the judge will sign the temporary restraining order but the DA is not stating if they have enough proof or not to issue a warrant for his arrest. The only witness I have is my wife who is in a serious fog. I'm sure my lawyer can pull some strings. My lawyer told me that if I file the restraining order then OM may go off the deep and and really try to harm me. That's why he wants the arrest warrant served first so that OM will be behind bars by the time he finds out about RO. If he gets arrested for stalking he's not allowed to carry a firearm anymore as well.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## turnera

What about the safety of the kids?


----------



## Jonesey

[B]carpenoctem[/B] said:


> *Jayson:
> 
> In your situation, your immediate concerns are: lawyers, police, ROs, etc.
> 
> Please focus on them, while defocusing a little on the Alpha-Beta dichotomy going on in your mind.*
> 
> 
> 
> But if / when you do get a break from them at any point, do reflect on the points below.
> 
> At the root cause of your problem, as all can see, is your Beta existence. You also realize this. To me, it even seems that at the moment, more than your wife’s betrayal, it is the Other Man’s seemingly Alpha posturing and arrogance that is eating into you.
> 
> *You actually are questioning your very existence as a man, in the light of this extreme Beta classification of you.*
> 
> 
> 
> This story is in my memory. Cannot recollect where it came from.
> 
> *Scene 1:*
> 
> Small town. Bar. Young man sitting in the bar. Local tough buy walks in with a gun, and threatens someone. When questioned, he threatens everyone. The young man blurts out: “Oh sure. It’s easy to be tough with a gun in his hand.”
> 
> The bully hears it. He walks over to the young man, gives him the gun, and tells him: “okay. Now YOU have the gun. Shoot me, tough guy.” Obviously, the young man does not. The bully slaps him across his face, and taunts him. The young man gives back the gun, tells him: “I am not a killer,” and walks out.
> 
> *Poor Beta mongrel.
> 
> 
> Scene 2:*
> 
> Same town. Now, it is ravaged by war. The factories have been bombed out, and there are no jobs left. The only job available locally is: transporting extremely fissile nuclear fuel in trucks. If the truck goes faster than 10 mph, the material will explode. If the truck goes over a ditch or a speed-breaker a little too roughly, boom.
> 
> The young man, and some other men like him, take on the job, because they don’t want their children to go hungry. They willingly risk their lives every second they are on the job, for their family.
> 
> But does the bully take up this job? No. He is now running around, looking for a job that does not involve the risk of his rear being blown to smithereens any moment.
> 
> *NOW, the erstwhile Alpha Dog is the Beta mongrel.*
> 
> 
> 
> Alpha is not really fornicating with other men’s wives in their own home or smashing their teeth in, and reveling in it. Even a thief who broke into your home to steal would / could beat you down. But we wouldn’t see THAT as a Beta shame. *It is all in perspective.
> 
> It is just that your courage lies elsewhere. *Somehow, control your hurt male ego, duck and dodge your way through this chaos *(but stand firm on legal grounds – that’s the only space where you are equipped to be Alpha here), *get out of this in the best way possible, and start a new life.
> 
> *Living well is the best revenge, Jayson. SOMEHOW *get there without getting killed for a woman who is not worth it, and without losing rights on your son.
> 
> *P.S.:
> If your wife was a victim of aggression – If this was an intruder in your home, who is bigger and physically stronger than you, and is used to violence, you MUST fight and die to save your family if you have to. There is no question about it.
> But to do that for someone who operates as an unpaid prostitute under the aegis of your marriage, is downright dumbassery.*
> 
> 
> 
> It is beyond belief that you are still talking in terms of getting your wife back. Really? You want this woman back in your life? Do you think she is going to treat you with dignity ever?
> 
> If, as things evolve, the OM becomes a danger to her too, she might want you back, and seek your help (that seems very likely, the way the OM’s personality is unraveling). In that moment, you might feel THAT is Alpha, and wanting to show the OM who the real man is, you might reclaim her as your woman (wife).
> 
> *THAT, my brother, would be the biggest Beta surrender you have made in your life.*




I have to say this. This post Jason is the best one that sums it up everything as a whole.

*carpenoctem* you rule man..:allhail:
I will just ad this..

If you get back and reconcile with your so
called "wife". Just remember this.

She can have, and display remorse on a galactic scale and mean it.And literally ass kiss you every morning. Know this!
She will never ever admit this.But she will

always and i really mean always
see you as a huge Pusy ever.
Im sorry man don't mean to beat you down
with this response.. But seriously walk away from this one...


----------



## Posse

You are a total glutton for punshment if you even consider getting back with the piece of work that is your wife.

If you were a close friend of mine, i would beat you if you even thought of it.

And the OM is nowhere as tough and skilled as you think him to be. There are some really good folks, but more than a few of the guys who work for the company formerly known as Blackwater, SOC, Triple Canopy, etc are clowns. If this guy isn't working for them currently, there is likely a good reason.

He sounds like he deserves a good ass-kicking in jail.


----------



## the guy

Thanks for the update and I glad thing are going your way. Sometime thing can look so bleak. Thank god for this site and all the perspectives....and warning that we all share in this community.

Once the OM is no longer effecting the dynamics of the marriage are you going to try to work it out, b/c surely once there is no longer an influence from the OM then your wife will be crawling back......again another warning from a concerned friend here at TAM/CWI


----------



## happyman64

Jason
Good news and I hope the DA stands up in your favor.

And do us all a favor. Let your wife stew in her own juices for a while.

Do not engage her. Just keep recording her. I think you have more to fear from her than the OM.

HM64
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## glitchathon

Any update on the dog? If he is still dehydrated from lack of water, please call the humane society. :-(
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## karole

How in God's name can you allow your children to be around this maniac?


----------



## the guy

Make the call...just another way to stress the affair


----------



## the guy

What about CPS? your kids are in a house with a drug user....again another way to stress the affair.

You might get temp custody of both the kids and the dog.


----------



## EleGirl

Shaggy said:


> I think the idea is to have them leave the threats on voice mail so they are recorded.


This is why we are suggesting that he get either a recording device or a recording app for his cell.

The OM is more likely to be threatening if Jason is on the phone with him. 

Just my thoughts.


----------



## turnera

the guy said:


> What about CPS? your kids are in a house with a drug user....again another way to stress the affair.
> 
> You might get temp custody of both the kids and the dog.


 A drug user whose drugs make him VIOLENT. Who is in an illicit relationship that has gotten him pulled over by cops. With a woman whose kids are in the same house as him. He may not hurt HER, but...


----------



## jasonh

**** this state and the laws of this state. Guess since I'm not a WOMAN I have to show ****ing books and books of documents before they can great me a restraining order. ****ing woman judge won't sign the ****ing order because he dosent have a criminal background and apparently him calling me FOUR TIMES in only 30 minutes is not stalking. I wasted another goddamn day dealing with this **** and this incompetent justice system. If I were a woman that ******* would be UNDER the jail by now. I'm leaving this ****ing state. I'm not going to live my life looking over my shoulder anymore. If its one thing that I have learned in this experience is that while being a "beta" male may get you cheated on, being an "alpha" male gets you **** on by the legal system. I'm done with this ****. Take care guys. I really learned a lot and I appreciate the advice. I have my conceal weapons permit so I can defend myself if need be.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## anonymouskitty

Why do I get the feeling that......??????


----------



## CantSitStill

uggg don't give up Jason don't...breathe go talk to your brother, then make a call to child protective services. I'm praying for ya
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Jibril

anonymouskitty said:


> Why do I get the feeling that......??????


That what? *BANG* Problem solved? 

Maybe. That's all this story needs: more drama.


----------



## thebuckest

Well I would suggest stop paying her bills chances are ur going to loose custody anyway. At least if they want to be together they will have to pay there way and you can move onvwith some money. Make sure u save some in case they hit u with bacj support and also if thers is no custody in place grab ur kids cause they wont force u to vive them back until custody is established don't need them around that house.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## CantSitStill

come on, stay strong, I know you've been thru hel but do not give up. There has to be other options.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## anonymouskitty

jason are you really willing to leave the state and your kids??


----------



## morituri

Fvstringpicker said:


> Jason, Jason, Jason. I still think think you're full of sh**. Your story has got to be a screen play, right?





ItMatters said:


> :iagree::lol::iagree:
> 
> I still agree.


Did you guys read the Mods posts saying NOT to accuse posters of being trolls?


----------



## golfergirl

Might have been a different story had you listened to everyone here and reported it to the police. I used to work for police (in Canada so different laws), but it's a fine line between someone with a grudge trying to cause grief and someone in fear of their life. Someone in fear would have reported the incident to police and request emergency hearing for sole custody of children.
You never talk about your kids. It's all about you. You never answered how you can leave them around this wing nut. You're concerned about being alpha and that your wife looked at you like WOW when you didn't cower. 
Why are your kids still there?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## CantSitStill

Listen, I feel in my gut that this is real..scary ye but real and I have been praying for Jason and his kids..Calling him a troll is not helping, if that's what you think then why come back?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## CantSitStill

I cannot imagine what is going through his head, the way the OM taunts him is scaring the crap outa him and so he may not be thinking clearly
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## morituri

Jason don't let your ego dictate your course of action. Go to your brother and the two of you brainstorm ideas until the two of you find one that is legal and can get rid of the OM for good. Seeking help from those closest to you is not a sign of weakness but of strength.


----------



## costa200

what the hell? You gonna leave your kids man? With roid rage wanker?


----------



## EleGirl

jasonh said:


> **** this state and the laws of this state. Guess since I'm not a WOMAN I have to show ****ing books and books of documents before they can great me a restraining order. ****ing woman judge won't sign the ****ing order because he dosent have a criminal background and apparently him calling me FOUR TIMES in only 30 minutes is not stalking. I wasted another goddamn day dealing with this **** and this incompetent justice system. If I were a woman that ******* would be UNDER the jail by now. I'm leaving this ****ing state. I'm not going to live my life looking over my shoulder anymore. If its one thing that I have learned in this experience is that while being a "beta" male may get you cheated on, being an "alpha" male gets you **** on by the legal system. I'm done with this ****. Take care guys. I really learned a lot and I appreciate the advice. I have my conceal weapons permit so I can defend myself if need be.


You are seriously mistaking if you think that a woman can walk into court and get a restraining order without any proof of anything. You are trying to accuse someone of a very serious crime. You had better have proof. 

Since you have no proof you just look like a husband who is upset that his wife has left him for someone else and YOU are going after the OM.

You have no proof except that he called you 4 times in half an hour. The judge is right, that is not stalking.

Right now it's his word against yours. How can a judge possibly know if you are lying or not? Get real.

Your attorney tried to tell you that you have nothing at this stage. But you insisted so he took your money to do your bidding. He knew going in there that you would not get that restraining order. I believe he even told you that he doubted you could get it at this time.+

Now have you taken the very good advice given here to get either a device to record phone calls or a phone app to record calls. You need real evidence, not word of mouth.


----------



## golfergirl

CantSitStill said:


> I cannot imagine what is going through his head, the way the OM taunts him is scaring the crap outa him and so he may not be thinking clearly
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I agree. I have chills reading this. But 'poor Jason' isn't going to cut it. He has 2 children in a very vulnerable position with a crazy man. He needs to quit worrying about anything other than protecting them and himself.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## EleGirl

thebuckest said:


> Well I would suggest stop paying her bills chances are ur going to loose custody anyway. At least if they want to be together they will have to pay there way and you can move onvwith some money. Make sure u save some in case they hit u with bacj support and also if thers is no custody in place grab ur kids cause they wont force u to vive them back until custody is established don't need them around that house.


Please don't do this.. rile him up with things that are not true.

He most likely will not lose custody unless he does something really stupid. All states want both parents to be active in their children's lives. There are two kinds of custody legal and physical. He will almost 100% sure get 50% legal custody. With physcial custody one of them will be names custodian but it's highly likely that the can get 50/50 custody each.

His attorney gave him advice about paying the bills. He needs to follow his attorney's advice.


----------



## EleGirl

golfergirl said:


> I agree. I have chills reading this. But 'poor Jason' isn't going to cut it. He has 2 children in a very vulnerable position with a crazy man. He needs to quit worrying about anything other than protecting them and himself.


Jason has a real problem here with the kids because he has allowed the OM to stay at his house and Jason moved out. So now it's harder for Jason to get the OM away from his kids.

With no evidence that the OM is a danger, Jason can look very unreasonable going over to the house, getting the children and removing them. If he does not let the kids return to the house with their SAHM he will look like he's withholding the children from their mother. It will not look good in court.


----------



## golfergirl

EleGirl said:


> Jason has a real problem here with the kids because he has allowed the OM to stay at his house and Jason moved out. So now it's harder for Jason to get the OM away from his kids.
> 
> With no evidence that the OM is a danger, Jason can look very unreasonable going over to the house, getting the children and removing them. If he does not let the kids return to the house with their SAHM he will look like he's withholding the children from their mother. It will not look good in court.


It's lose/lose because allowing it to become status quo doesn't look so good either. The night he was followed he should have reported to police and got CPS involved to get children out. Actually after ice cream, he should have started the ball rolling with CPS and not returned the kids with their aid.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## PHTlump

golfergirl said:


> It's lose/lose because allowing it to become status quo doesn't look so good either. The night he was followed he should have reported to police and got CPS involved to get children out. Actually after ice cream, he should have started the ball rolling with CPS and not returned the kids with their aid.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


It is a tough situation, but it's still an issue of proof. He has none.

Whether he involves the police, or CPS, or his lawyer, or the neighborhood watch, it still requires proof. It's just his word against two others. And the courts are biased toward wives in cases of divorce and accusations of domestic violence.

At this point, he should follow his lawyer's advice.


----------



## EleGirl

For Jason....

"Basically, in Florida, the bottom line is phone calls cannot be recorded without the permission of all parties. There are very few limited exceptions with almost no exceptions for the lay public. One exception under the statute, is that police may make recorded phone calls without obtaining the permission of the person called. Often Florida law enforcement officers will have people who are victims or cooperating witnesses make phone calls to suspects to extract confessions or admissions from them, all the while the call is being recorded and the witness is being prompted what to say by the agents. This type of admission is admissible in Court and can be extremely critical evidence to aid the prosecution. "

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/50789-update-jason-h-24.html#post907169

Jason, you cannot use the evidence that you get via a recording in court unless you tell all parties up front that you are recording the calls.. so just say it up front. "This call is being recorded."


----------



## EleGirl

golfergirl said:


> It's lose/lose because allowing it to become status quo doesn't look so good either. The night he was followed he should have reported to police and got CPS involved to get children out. Actually after ice cream, he should have started the ball rolling with CPS and not returned the kids with their aid.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I agree. Jason has made some big mistakes here.

1) he took the kids back home and left them in a house with a guy who had just threatened to kill him. It makes it look like Jason did not take the threats seriously.

2) He did not go to the police and have them kick as squating intruder out of his legal residence to start with. Why Jason allowed this man to basically move into his how I have no clue.


----------



## the guy

I hope jason reads every one of these replies, and see were he can make improvements.
I hope other read this thread and also learn...and isn't that the big picture here? Reading and learning even if your not registered and just need some insight. Reading this tread has to also help some one else, so why not engage it.


----------



## EleGirl

Jason, 

You need to make this about your children. 

Your marriage is over; would you even consider getting back with you wife after this. I doubt it. If it were not for your children you could just file for divorce and let your attorney handle the paperwork. You would never have to talk to your wife or the OM again.

Your children are your concern. This man is dangerous and should not be around your children. You need to establish that you are concerned about this guy being around them. You made a huge mistake taking them back to the house where he was after he threatened to kill you. You should have taken the children to your sisters and called the police. But you can learn from this.. always act immediately.

Have you obtained a recording device/app for your phone yet? You need to get one.

Because of FL laws your use of any kind of recording for evidence against OM are very limited. If you do not say up front that a phone call is being recorded than you cannot use the recording for evidence. So you might want to just say up front on phone calls that you are recording the call. 

Write your wife an email telling her that you do not want the OM around your children because he is violent. He is on (name the drug) and it’s known to make people violent. You saw the drugs in the medicine cabinet at your home. He has called and threatened to kill you several times; he followed you to your sisters and the police station and threatened to shot you with a sniper rifle. Tell her exactly what he told you each time.

After you send the email call her and tell her the same thing. Get a recording of her response to this.

If OM gets on the phone or calls you later say as little as you can, state that you are recording the phone call and let him say whatever he wants. Only respond by telling him to get away from your children and to not call you again.

Hopefully he will reply to the email with all kinds of threats. That can certainly be evidence.

From here on out communicate with your wife via email and not in person. Email her about picking the kids up for the weekend. Make sure you have your VAR on you when you go there to pick them up. Maybe OM will be foolish enough to say something.

Most likely OM is a lot of hot air. If he knows that you are on to him and you are recording everything he will most likely back down. 

This is about your children. Not you. Not your wife. Not the OM.


----------



## donny64

I find it extremely hard to believe that a temporary restraining order could not be issued. This will usually involve the issuance of the restraining order, and a hearing within a reasonable period of time for the subject of the restraining order to come in and state their case on why they should not be subject to it.

A sworn affadavit stating the threats he has made and the assault that occurred should be all that is required to obtain this. I cannot fathom a situation where this is not true. If you have to have concrete proof of your reasons for a restraining order, it would be incredibly difficult to ever get one.

Your lawyer should know this, if I'm not wrong. Maybe Fla is different, but I've gotten a couple of them on my ex with nothing more than a phone call to my lawyer. When she did not dispute or show up at the hearing, they became permanent restraining orders.


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## OldWolf57

J, did you show the pics of the roid in the bathroom to the judge ?? We have given you sane advice, but you won't do anything we say. You missed the chance to report it when he beat you, you never called CPS when you found the roid. When are you going to pay attention to the VETS here. I LIVE in the grey, so legal or not, I do. You are not equipped to handle this your way, listen to the ppl here. As for grabbing the kids, do it. Let the courts come get you, then show them the roids pics. Go to your brother, or just disappear, ppl get lost in this country everyday. I respect the VETS here, but sometime you just have to say F it.


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## EleGirl

OldWolf57 said:


> J, did you show the pics of the roid in the bathroom to the judge ?? We have given you sane advice, but you won't do anything we say. You missed the chance to report it when he beat you, you never called CPS when you found the roid. When are you going to pay attention to the VETS here. I LIVE in the grey, so legal or not, I do. You are not equipped to handle this your way, listen to the ppl here. As for grabbing the kids, do it. Let the courts come get you, then show them the roids pics. Go to your brother, or just disappear, ppl get lost in this country everyday. I respect the VETS here, but sometime you just have to say F it.


I agree with what you say except... a picture of roid does not prove that it belongs to the OM. It's just a picture.

And running with his kids is a very bad idea.


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## donny64

EleGirl said:


> I agree with what you say except... a picture of roid does not prove that it belongs to the OM. It's just a picture.
> 
> And running with his kids is a very bad idea.


I agree, short of seeing actual abuse of the kids (and he's not going to do that until he's completely comforatble with her and has her totally in his clutch), this would be a bad move. Address it legally. CPS, restraining orders, etc. If you suspect mental or physical abuse of the kids, get them to a CPS approved counselor asap to have interviews done. This guy is not going to harm the kids...yet. He's getting a piece of azz, and he isn't going to mess that up. Where he will start "taking things out" on the kids is when she stops putting out or otherwise becomes a pain in his azz. She's far, far too gone in the land of fluffy clouds and unicorns for her to show her true colors just yet.


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## OldWolf57

its a pic in the home, and sometime bad ideas are the only way Ele. I know you ppl, are trying to do things the right way, but J is not listening, so if he is going to continue his way, then maybe I can at least try to be of service in the grey areas.


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## Machiavelli

carpenoctem said:


> Hope he is able to hold up without breaking down mentally, or *taking up arms*.


You can't be serious.


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## carpenoctem

Machiavelli said:


> You can't be serious.


he has already been talking about keeping a firearm.


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## OldWolf57

and whats wrong with that ?? He was beaten and threaten.


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## carpenoctem

OldWolf57 said:


> and whats wrong with that ?? He was beaten and threaten.


absolutely nothing wrong. if anything, he NEEDS to be armed.

only concern is: in his state of mind, whether he would be able to use it with discretion (god forbid, if that situation arises), and in a legally correct way.


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## jasonh

Hi guys. I just wanna say thanks again for the advice and support. You guys are experts in this area so yea there's sort of a learning curve here. I had a wonderful night last night. She dropped the kids off here at my sisters house and I set up a tent in the backyard and went on a pretend camping trip. My kids as well as my sisters kids all slept in the tent overnight. This morning when we woke up my son looked at me and said "daddy when I grow up I wanna be just like you". Hearing that from him almost made me cry. No matter how "alpha" or "beta that people think I am, I still am a hero to the people who mean the most to me. My kids. Its gonna be a great weekend. I have them until tommorow evening. The thing that I love about my kids is that I don't have to spend tons of money on them to have a good time. I am now living in the moment. And at this moment I am surrounded by those that love me the most. And that is the best feling in the world.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## costa200

jasonh said:


> Hi guys. I just wanna say thanks again for the advice and support. You guys are experts in this area so yea there's sort of a learning curve here. I had a wonderful night last night. She dropped the kids off here at my sisters house and I set up a tent in the backyard and went on a pretend camping trip. My kids as well as my sisters kids all slept in the tent overnight. This morning when we woke up my son looked at me and said "daddy when I grow up I wanna be just like you". Hearing that from him almost made me cry. No matter how "alpha" or "beta that people think I am, I still am a hero to the people who mean the most to me. My kids. Its gonna be a great weekend. I have them until tommorow evening. The thing that I love about my kids is that I don't have to spend tons of money on them to have a good time. I am now living in the moment. And at this moment I am surrounded by those that love me the most. And that is the best feling in the world.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I guess that "moving out of state" thing was just emotional venting then... 




> "daddy when I grow up I wanna be just like you". Hearing that from him almost made me cry.


Yeah, i bet that felt really good :smthumbup:


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## Paladin

She dropped off your kids, they are now in your custody, and should remain with you till the issue with the OM is resolved. Call your lawyer, ask his opinion on your options while the kids are with you. When she comes back, with the VAR on you, tell her about the threats from the OM to you. Record her reaction and anything else she might divulge.


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## carpenoctem

Paladin said:


> She dropped off your kids, they are now in your custody, and should remain with you till the issue with the OM is resolved. Call your lawyer, ask his opinion on your options while the kids are with you. When she comes back, with the VAR on you, tell her about the threats from the OM to you. Record her reaction and anything else she might divulge.



yes yes yes yes Jason.

If that lawyer of yours is going to help with the situation in the short term, it is now (when the children are with you physically).

If possible, even a little entrapment (getting the OM to come for you / getting your wife to talk and incriminate herself or something), enabling you to prove the potential danger the children are living in.

(to be conducted with nil risk to the children, of course)


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## carpenoctem

jasonh said:


> Hi guys. I just wanna say thanks again for the advice and support. You guys are experts in this area so yea there's sort of a learning curve here. I had a wonderful night last night. She dropped the kids off here at my sisters house and I set up a tent in the backyard and went on a pretend camping trip. My kids as well as my sisters kids all slept in the tent overnight. This morning when we woke up my son looked at me and said "daddy when I grow up I wanna be just like you". Hearing that from him almost made me cry. No matter how "alpha" or "beta that people think I am, I still am a hero to the people who mean the most to me. My kids. Its gonna be a great weekend. I have them until tommorow evening. The thing that I love about my kids is that I don't have to spend tons of money on them to have a good time. I am now living in the moment. And at this moment I am surrounded by those that love me the most. And that is the best feling in the world.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_



children ARE the great levellers in life.

all children view their fathers as heroes. in your case, the fact that you ARE risking your life for them right now makes you their hero, rightfully, in REAL terms. they just don't know that.

glad to see you on an even keel, jason.

please hold yourself together for a while longer.


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## Cosmos

Good for you, Jason. And stop worrying about this alpha / beta business. You're dealing with unusual circumstances as best you can.

Enjoy your kids and your weekend, and keep listening to and communicating with your attorney.


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## jasonh

I think that I'm gonna follow my lawyers advice at this point. He told me to maintain my composure and be as cordial to her as possible. To think with my brain and not with my emotions. I am not to go back to the house for any reason and she will drop the kids off to me and pick them up. I am to pretend that the other man does not exist. I won't talk to her about him, ask about him, call him etc. He exists no more. I will pay her a set amount of money a month for the bills and her dad will cover the rest. In the meantime I will be looking for an apartment. I will no longer let the hatred of this other man influence any of my decisions. I have accepted the fact that I am in the position that I'm currently in due to the poor choices that I have made in the past as a lousy husband. I'm not mad or sad or happy. I'm just numb. What I am experiencing now is karma. After years of belittling my wife and ignoring her needs I got a dose of my own medicine. And as a responsible man I will learn from this and grow. What does not kill me only makes me stronger.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Shaggy

Ok, all good - except the paying her any $.

this woman has betrayed you and shoved you into the street, and moved another man into your home. 

She shouldn't get a dime.

However, your kids should not suffer - so you should buy then what they need clothes etc. Make sure they are provided for.


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## Fvstringpicker

jasonh said:


> I am to pretend that the other man does not exist. I won't talk to her about him, ask about him, call him etc. He exists no more.


If I haven't made myself clear about how I feel about this story, its not my fault. Nevertheless, from my post at another thread (edited slightly):

"_Actually (Jason), I think you should be buying the OM a nice gift card because he brought out traits in your wife which makes her no good to you for the long term. He did you a favor as you will see when you're rid of her and she cheating on the next guy.
Other than that, she makes a perfect role model to teach your kids about right and wrong._ "


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## happyman64

jasonh said:


> I think that I'm gonna follow my lawyers advice at this point. He told me to maintain my composure and be as cordial to her as possible. To think with my brain and not with my emotions. I am not to go back to the house for any reason and she will drop the kids off to me and pick them up. I am to pretend that the other man does not exist. I won't talk to her about him, ask about him, call him etc. He exists no more. I will pay her a set amount of money a month for the bills and her dad will cover the rest. In the meantime I will be looking for an apartment. I will no longer let the hatred of this other man influence any of my decisions. I have accepted the fact that I am in the position that I'm currently in due to the poor choices that I have made in the past as a lousy husband. I'm not mad or sad or happy. I'm just numb. What I am experiencing now is karma. After years of belittling my wife and ignoring her needs I got a dose of my own medicine. And as a responsible man I will learn from this and grow. What does not kill me only makes me stronger.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Wow Jason,

I guess with that reasoning your wife never had to ask you for a D. She just had to go have an A, screw the OM in your house in front of you and he gets to sleep there with your W like they are now married.

When you are done scraping up your balls off the floor you will realize that even though you were not husband of the year what your wife did to you, your marriage and your family was just plain wrong.

But heal your wounds, love your kids and I guarantee you that the Karma bus never really picked you up. It is just looking for your house and when it does your STBXW will be taking a ride.

It is inevitable Jason.

Peace.
HM64


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## OldWolf57

In respect to your lawdog, I disagree with paying her anything. no court has set a $$ amount. You can buy the kids what they need. I have friends that did this here in FL.


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## PHTlump

OldWolf57 said:


> In respect to your lawdog, I disagree with paying her anything. no court has set a $$ amount. You can buy the kids what they need. I have friends that did this here in FL.


Child support is a foregone conclusion. Better to have jasonh establish an amount of his choosing and show that his wife can get by on that amount, than leave it to a judge to pick a number out of thin air. Jason's lawyer probably knows what he's doing.


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## OldWolf57

Ok got that PhT. I just hate the way he has been treated. I am the protect the weak kind of guy, and that means no limits with me.


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## morituri

Jason, first off NONE of us are perfect spouses - there ain't no such animal. You may have neglected her needs but I'm also certain that she neglected yours, so the marital issues were BOTH your responsibility. If you were a lousy husband, then what does that make your wife? I'm not asking you this to get you angry but to make you see that despite your flaws, hers were much greater - you have the maturity to admit them while she doesn't. Lastly, she is solely responsible for her choice to have an affair and destroying the marriage. She chose a cowardly way to deal with whatever marital issues were present. You can walk away knowing that you were a faithful, though flawed husband, while she will always know that she destroyed both the marriage and her family. Better to be you than her. I agree with the other poster who said that you should feel grateful to the OM for taking her away from your hands, she'll rue the day she brought the OM into her life.


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## Posse

Jason, You very much need IC.


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## EleGirl

Jason,

I glad to see that you are in much better place today. It's all about your children. Every time you get distracted just remind yourself about that.

While I think following your attorny's guidance is a very wise path, I think he is wrong about one thing. 

The OM is a dangerous person and he is around your children. I believe that you have an obligation to tell your wife that you are concerned about the safety of the children based on the OM's drug use, him threatening your life and him following you. I still think that telling her this while you have the VAR on you or via email is a very wise thing for you to do.


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## thebuckest

I don't undedsrand contknuing to pay all the bills. If I were u I would pay none I doubt it helps u any in any part of ur case despite what ur lawyer may think. Yeah they may hit u with back support later but I wouldn't pay one penny of her bills until ordered to cause u and I both know u will not be getting custody if u think the syatem is against u know u wait till that custody hearing comes. U basically have to prove her unfit as a parent go get ur kods now since they have been living with her and u paying the bills isn't going to do that. I woild stop and when asked about it I would simply say I'm getting my life in order so I can take care of my kids when they come over. U got a lot of stuff to buy kids clothes all furniture pretty much a new household.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## KirkSpock

I don’t think I will be posting in this thread again because most of the information being posted is either being flatly ignored or suspiciously bypassed. Before I take my leave, I thought I’d list some items never addressed by this father and husband that really bother me:

1.	An abusive man is taking drugs in his own home and leaving the drugs around in the home (the steroids in the cabinet) completely accessible to said children. As a father, Jason H, should have called CPS or other agencies the instant he found these. He should have taken or destroyed the steroids as soon as he saw the. He did nothing. He continues to do nothing. Does a competent father ignore dangerous drugs accessible to his children in the house? Does a father do NOTHING about it? No father that I know of…..
2.	Jason H. continues to be bullied by this OM. He won’t report the abuses to the police, but rather allows these abuses to occur (in much the same way an abused spouse would allow beatings and what not to occur). Not sure how he believes this will show his wife that he is “alpha”, but besides that point, it encourages the OM bully to continue acting in this manner. All Jason has done, so far, is agree to keep his mouth shut once he was intimidated by the death threats of the OM. 
3.	Jason H. appears to enjoy the drama, I am sorry to day. No sane person would answer the phone when the nut job OM, who has threatened physical violence and murder, calls. He has NOT initiated the 180 and become the cool cucumber that is disturbed by nothing and no one….because that would involve removing said drama from his life. Instead, he is franticly reacting to every situation in the worst way possible. 
4.	Jason has isolated himself amongst the family. Rather than meeting up with his father in law and, oh, I dunno, SHOWING HIM THE DRUGS THAT ARE LOCATED IN HIS HOUSE (which the FIL owns), he has allowed the FIL to control the situation entirely and has kowtowed to him. Rather than call the police and CPS to demonstrate the dangerous living conditions that his children are now in, he does nothing. Absolutely nothing. 
Sorry if your feelings are hurt by this post Jason, and I wish you the best of luck in your endeavors.


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