# Question about issues with "The 180"



## SeparationAnxiety (Mar 24, 2016)

How do you get around the problem that when you communicate only on an as needed basis and as little as possible with your wife who left you, she can just fill her need for communication by chatting with her divorced (toxic) girlfriends to get her communication needs met.

They will of course feed her the usual poison and put you down in the same breath when she tells them that you are not giving her the attention she feels she deserves "under the circumstances." E.g., he's not going to change, all his changes are fake, just divorce him and get it over with, life is much better now that we're divorced - want to join us?

It seems to me like "The 180" can work in isolation (i.e., your wife has only you to lean on), but when you have a wife that has learned to lean on others when you are not there for her, including a possible EA, she always has the fallback of leaning on toxic friends when she feels lonely. They will just feed her desire to divorce ASAP - a vicious circle.


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## northernlights (Sep 23, 2012)

I've always heard that the 180 is for you, not to win your spouse back. Pull back, take care of yourself, and give your wife what she's asking for--all the space she could ever want. Your job now is to provide yourself with the support and care you used to provide for your wife. If she realizes what she's missing, well, then it'll be up to her to try to win you back.

Hugs! It's the worst, but eventually you'll come through the other side.


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## Marduk (Jul 16, 2010)

My 180 had me spending a lot more time with my buddies than I did with her.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

The whole entire point of the 180 is that YOU DON'T CARE what your wife does. Repeat that. YOU DO NOT CARE. 

Your wife will do what she will do, and if she allows her friends to influence her, then so be it. Do you really want to be married to someone who lets others dictate her life decisions?


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## SeparationAnxiety (Mar 24, 2016)

northernlights said:


> I've always heard that the 180 is for you, not to win your spouse back. Pull back, take care of yourself, and give your wife what she's asking for--all the space she could ever want. Your job now is to provide yourself with the support and care you used to provide for your wife. If she realizes what she's missing, well, then it'll be up to her to try to win you back.
> 
> Hugs! It's the worst, but eventually you'll come through the other side.


The problem is that it sounds all well and good if she misses you, because she is isolated and lonely. If she is like many social wives in this situation with a cell phone handy and (divorced) friends who will mix you with dirt at every opportunity (including for actions consistent with doing the 180), I just can't see how this can work, except to help you feel better about yourself for the long term.


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## SeparationAnxiety (Mar 24, 2016)

Hope1964 said:


> The whole entire point of the 180 is that YOU DON'T CARE what your wife does. Repeat that. YOU DO NOT CARE.
> 
> Your wife will do what she will do, and if she allows her friends to influence her, then so be it. Do you really want to be married to someone who lets others dictate her life decisions?


Actually, yes, we have two kids, I love her very much and I want to be there for here and be the one to help her with her life decisions. But, that can only happen if we get back together. Many people have the sort of personality where they are not at all reluctant to ask others for advice/lean on others. During a separation, if the others are toxic (divorced girlfriends) and you're trying to do the 180, how can this work?


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## northernlights (Sep 23, 2012)

SeparationAnxiety said:


> The problem is that it sounds all well and good if she misses you, because she is isolated and lonely. If she is like many soical wives in this situation with a cell phone handy and (divorced) friends who will mix you with dirt at every opportunity (including for actions consistent with doing the 180), I just can't see how this can work, except to help you feel better about yourself for the long term.


Feeling better about yourself in the long term is the most important goal you could have! If people say things about you and she believes it, you telling her it's not true probably won't have an effect. Live your best life, be the best person you can be, and eventually the truth will come out.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

A reminder of some of the points of the 180:

11. Do more than act as if you are moving on with your life; begin moving on with your life!
13. Don’t sit around waiting on your spouse – get busy, do things, go out with friends, enjoy old hobbies, find new ones! But stay busy!
16. Your partner needs to believe that you have awakened to the fact that “they (the wayward partner)” are serious concerning their assertions as to the future (or lack there of) of your marriage. Thus, you are moving on with your life…without them!


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

SeparationAnxiety said:


> Actually, yes, we have two kids, I love her very much and I want to be there for here and be the one to help her with her life decisions. But, that can only happen if we get back together. Many people have the sort of personality where they are not at all reluctant to ask others for advice/lean on others. During a separation, if the others are toxic (divorced girlfriends) and you're trying to do the 180, how can this work?


It won't work. Stop it right now - the 180 is NOT what you need. With that attitude, you don't have a hope of making the 180 do anything for you.

I am not kidding.


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## SeparationAnxiety (Mar 24, 2016)

Hope1964 said:


> A reminder of some of the points of the 180:
> 
> 11. Do more than act as if you are moving on with your life; begin moving on with your life!
> 13. Don’t sit around waiting on your spouse – get busy, do things, go out with friends, enjoy old hobbies, find new ones! But stay busy!
> 16. Your partner needs to believe that you have awakened to the fact that “they (the wayward partner)” are serious concerning their assertions as to the future (or lack there of) of your marriage. Thus, you are moving on with your life…without them!


And the toxic girlfriend replies to the above:

11. We told you he only cares about himself and always will.
13. (See 11)
16. See, he is not changing at all. Why did you even bother separating? "I" divorced, because "I" knew my ex didn't care about me - only himself. Now your husband is just living his own life. He doesn't care about you.

Just being practical here, this is reality!


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

SeparationAnxiety said:


> And the toxic girlfriend replies to the above:
> 
> 11. We told you he only cares about himself and always will.
> 13. (See 11)
> 16. See, he is not changing at all. Why did you even bother separating? "I" divorced, because I knew he didn't care about me - only himself. Now he is just living his own life. He doesn't care about you.


Seriously, dude, the 180 won't work for you. Stop it right now.


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## SeparationAnxiety (Mar 24, 2016)

Hope1964 said:


> Seriously, dude, the 180 won't work for you. Stop it right now.


OK, so the 180 only works with wives (who initiated separation) when they are locked in solitary confinement and barred from all communication with others?

Pardon the cynicism, but I am asking a real world question in this day and age.


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## ButtPunch (Sep 17, 2014)

The 180 is for you to detach and get rid of your wayward wife.

What do you mean won't work?


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## northernlights (Sep 23, 2012)

No, it just only works when your willing to lose her. It's hard, I resisted the idea that I'd have to lose my marriage to get it back for YEARS. And, it cost me my marriage. Or my marriage was doomed no matter what.

Either way, you have to put yourself first. You have to do the 180 for YOU, not her.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

The 180 will ONLY work if you take your wife completely out of the equation.

You have to do the 180 for YOU. not for her or your kid - for YOU and only you. You do not do the 180 to win her back. You do not do the 180 to save your marriage. You do NOT do the 180 because you have a kid together.

Do you have the 180 list handy?


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## SeparationAnxiety (Mar 24, 2016)

ButtPunch said:


> The 180 is for you to detach and get rid of your wayward wife.
> 
> What do you mean won't work?


Seriously, that's what it seems like to me. I mean many wives are not stay at home introverts. They have friends. Those friends can be toxic. Those friends are more than happy to fill in whatever gaps you are introducing in the connection/communication side of the relationship with their own secret recipe for relationship poison. After all, it worked for them - they wound up "divorced and happy" and your wife can, too.

You: Radio Silence
Toxic friends: Look at us, we're partying and enjoying our single life

Who wins, if you want to stay together?


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## Pluto2 (Aug 17, 2011)

The 180 is to help the betrayed spouse learn to disengage from a toxic relationship. Sometimes, the WS notices the difference and agrees to recommit to the relationship. If you are currently in a relationship with an unfaithful spouse, SOMETIMES, they notice the difference, and sometimes they don't. But the primary purpose of the 180 is not to win her back, its to help you gain independence from a relationship. 

It doesn't sound like you want that.
You can't control her. The 180 can help you make peace with that.


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## ButtPunch (Sep 17, 2014)

The 180 is not some tool for you to use in the PICK ME dance.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

ButtPunch said:


> The 180 is for you to detach and get rid of your wayward wife.
> 
> What do you mean won't work?


(I don't think his wife actually cheated on him)


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## Herschel (Mar 27, 2016)

SeparationAnxiety said:


> OK, so the 180 only works with wives (who initiated separation) when they are locked in solitary confinement and barred from all communication with others?
> 
> Pardon the cynicism, but I am asking a real world question in this day and age.


It's not a magic trick dude. The 180 isn't a way to get your spouse back. It's a way to start moving on with your life. That correlates with your spouse coming out of their fog and trying to rekindle more than fawning over them and being pathetic. 

You need to take care of yourself SANS your spouse first. If that ends up making them come back to you and you want that, good. If not, then that's what happens. If you want Love Potion #9, you'll have to contact Sandra Bullock and/or Tate Donovan.


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## ButtPunch (Sep 17, 2014)

Hope1964 said:


> (I don't think his wife actually cheated on him)


Then he should modify the 180 if he doesn't want a divorce.

I thought he mentioned emotional affair.


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## SeparationAnxiety (Mar 24, 2016)

northernlights said:


> No, it just only works when your willing to lose her. It's hard, I resisted the idea that I'd have to lose my marriage to get it back for YEARS. And, it cost me my marriage. Or my marriage was doomed no matter what.
> 
> Either way, you have to put yourself first. You have to do the 180 for YOU, not her.





Hope1964 said:


> The 180 will ONLY work if you take your wife completely out of the equation.
> 
> You have to do the 180 for YOU. not for her or your kid - for YOU and only you. You do not do the 180 to win her back. You do not do the 180 to save your marriage. You do NOT do the 180 because you have a kid together.
> 
> Do you have the 180 list handy?


I did go over the 180 list multiple times. And I get it, the 180 works when you don't give two-craps about whether you will keep her or not. It's a "burn the bridges" attempt at hoping that your emotional absence and indifference will bring her back and that there are no other external influences. It's doubling down on a losing hand in the hopes that you will get that face card. It's playing hard to get, when playing hard to get may have been what caused separation in the first place (i.e., selfishness and indifference to her needs).

I guess it's not for me, at least not at this time. I need to battle the negative external influences head on, by proving them wrong again and again.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

SeparationAnxiety said:


> Seriously, that's what it seems like to me. I mean many wives are not stay at home introverts. They have friends. Those friends can be toxic. Those friends are more than happy to fill in whatever gaps you are introducing in the connection/communication side of the relationship with their own secret recipe for relationship poison. After all, it worked for them - they wound up "divorced and happy" and your wife can, too.
> 
> You: Radio Silence
> Toxic friends: Look at us, we're partying and enjoying our single life
> ...


Again, everything in this is about her or your marriage. None of it's about YOU.

Look, your wife is a big girl. If she wants to hang with people who are poisonous to your marriage, there's nothing you can do about it except detach from her. It sounds like you've spent all of your marriage till now detached from her and suddenly realized oops, I made a big boo boo. Well, the 180 isn't what you should be doing here, dude. Forget about the 180 - it won't help you. You can try acting like a kicked puppy for a while and see if that's what she's looking for, but I highly doubt it. You were told in your other thread that it's probably too late, and it probably is.


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## SeparationAnxiety (Mar 24, 2016)

Hope1964 said:


> (I don't think his wife actually cheated on him)


No, she did not, as far as I know. So, maybe the 180 is not for me because of that alone.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

Oh, and if you want an example of the 180 at work?

Our R


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

SeparationAnxiety said:


> No, she did not, as far as I know. So, maybe the 180 is not for me because of that alone.


Not true - it can be very useful when there's no cheating involved also.


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## SeparationAnxiety (Mar 24, 2016)

Hope1964 said:


> Again, everything in this is about her or your marriage. None of it's about YOU.
> 
> You were told in your other thread that it's probably too late, and it probably is.


Thanks for the encouraging words, but I am still optimistic about saving my marriage. :smile2:


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## SeparationAnxiety (Mar 24, 2016)

Hope1964 said:


> Not true - it can be very useful when there's no cheating involved also.


It can be very useful when your wife doesn't have other people to talk to (than you) when she is lonely. It doesn't have to be an EA, but it can be. Whoever it is, it's not you and they will say bad things about you just to make themselves and the wife feel good (at your expense). 

In any case, I am going the doormat combined with fighting others' negative talk route for now and I'll see where that takes me. If anything, the doormat route is a 180 from my former self, for what it's worth. It seems to me that doormat + setting reasonable boundaries over time might work a heck of a lot better than the 180 under my circumstances.


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## Pluto2 (Aug 17, 2011)

I see.

Well, lock her in a closet so she can't talk to others and convince her to stay in the marriage.

Look, you simply can't control her. You can't stop her from talking to people, or from believing the marriage is done.

She will either see you as someone she wants to be with, or not.


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## SeparationAnxiety (Mar 24, 2016)

Pluto2 said:


> I see.
> 
> Well, lock her in a closet so she can't talk to others and convince her to stay in the marriage.
> 
> ...


Now that there is the truth. But, I don't have to take a passive stance either. I can show her love, affection, and attention, the things she has been lacking for the last two decades. I can counter the poison being fed her with the antidote of doing things with her and for her. I can prove her girlfriends wrong through my actions, instead of a lack of words.

I guess I am almost going about this like we're not even getting separated. I'm pretending we're still living together and I want to improve the marriage. Well, it's worked so far to establish a pretty good connection, so there's hope yet, even if it does sound like I am in some serious denial (and I am!).

It sure isn't a 180, but it's a solid 135 :smile2:.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

SeparationAnxiety said:


> Now that there is the truth. But, I don't have to take a passive stance either. I can show here love and affection, the things she has been lacking for the last two decades. I can counter the poison being fed her with the antidote of doing things with her and for her. I can prove her girlfriends wrong through my actions, instead of a lack of words.
> 
> It's not a 180, but it is a 135 :smile2:.


No it isn't a 135. It's a -180.

You do realize that you can show someone love at the same time you are removed enough from them that who their toxic friends are and what they say doesn't bother you, right?


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## Marduk (Jul 16, 2010)

I knew my 180 was working when my wife said "so... Were there women there?"

When I got back from a boys night out. 

And I knew it worked - not because she was worried which wasn't my intention. 

I knew it worked because there were women there, I wasn't interested in them, and I came home with a smile on my face because I'd rather be out with friends than be with my wife.

and I honestly didn't care that my wife was worried. That was her problem, not mine. 

That's a 180.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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