# My wife cheated now she's confused on what she wants



## jnb150

Hi everyone, and thanks in advance. I'm new here and unfortunately for a bad reason. 

My wife and I have been together for 8 years, married for 4. We've traveled the world, bought homes, survived tragedies, and overcome dealing with her parents divorce 3 days after our honeymoon. We've been through a lot and have always stuck together..... until recently.

I don't believe in infidelity, and I do believe that all marriages will work if both sides put forth an honest effort. My wife's view on these things has been clouded.

After several years of building resentment on her side, she finally crashed at the beginning of June. I have always preached openness and honesty and she has never had an easy time expressing herself. So instead of coming to me or going for help she decided to become vulnerable with a co-worker going through a similar situation. Which culminated with them kissing in his car during lunch a few weeks back. 

I pulled this out of her last week and we have since gone to counseling twice, to choose which counselor we like, and we are going for a 2nd session tonight with the 1 we picked.

I made her leave for several days, but she has since moved back in(because she felt more comfortable at home). She stopped communicating with him but has admitted that she still thinks about him. 

Through the 4 hours of counseling that we have had, we have both begun to understand why our relationship turned sour and how we need to start fixing it. I am committed to do doing so. I admitted my faults and changed philosophies I've had my entire life right in front of her eyes because I realized they were hurting her. 

I'm not sure what her intentions are. She said she still loves me and she's going to counseling because she doesn't want to give up on this. She has seen who I really am and feels bad for ever doubting my intentions. She does now see that I love her unconditionally even though she didn't feel like that before.

As of now, she doesn't know what she wants. That's what I have a hard time with. I've spent more time talking to her this week, than she's spent talking to him in their whole relationship. Yet, our history, love, potential, can't outweigh a meaningless trist. 

I've done my research and I know why she feels the way she does, but when/how does she find out what she wants?

We still live together, we talk everyday, we eat dinner together, we sometimes sleep together, we hug and kiss each day, we still have intimate interactions. Yet, none of that opens her eyes.

I have no doubt what she's experiencing with this other person was to temporarily fill a void that I wasn't. Nothing more. I know what that is now and I'm filling it! I can see the way she looks at me and cries with me. She's just so confused that she can't separate right from wrong. I know that's killing her inside. 

But how long do I wait? At what point does indecision become a decision? How can I help her see what's right?

Who has some good insight? I NEED IT!


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## Suspecting2014

jnb150 said:


> Hi everyone, and thanks in advance. I'm new here and unfortunately for a bad reason.
> 
> My wife and I have been together for 8 years, married for 4. We've traveled the world, bought homes, survived tragedies, and overcome dealing with her parents divorce 3 days after our honeymoon. We've been through a lot and have always stuck together..... until recently.
> 
> I don't believe in infidelity, and I do believe that all marriages will work if both sides put forth an honest effort. My wife's view on these things has been clouded.
> 
> After several years of building resentment on her side, she finally crashed at the beginning of June. I have always preached openness and honesty and she has never had an easy time expressing herself. So instead of coming to me or going for help she decided to become vulnerable with a co-worker going through a similar situation. Which culminated with them kissing in his car during lunch a few weeks back.
> 
> I pulled this out of her last week and we have since gone to counseling twice, to choose which counselor we like, and we are going for a 2nd session tonight with the 1 we picked.
> 
> I made her leave for several days, but she has since moved back in(because she felt more comfortable at home). She stopped communicating with him but has admitted that she still thinks about him.
> 
> Through the 4 hours of counseling that we have had, we have both begun to understand why our relationship turned sour and how we need to start fixing it. I am committed to do doing so. I admitted my faults and changed philosophies I've had my entire life right in front of her eyes because I realized they were hurting her.
> 
> I'm not sure what her intentions are. She said she still loves me and she's going to counseling because she doesn't want to give up on this. She has seen who I really am and feels bad for ever doubting my intentions. She does now see that I love her unconditionally even though she didn't feel like that before.
> 
> As of now, she doesn't know what she wants. That's what I have a hard time with. I've spent more time talking to her this week, than she's spent talking to him in their whole relationship. Yet, our history, love, potential, can't outweigh a meaningless trist.
> 
> I've done my research and I know why she feels the way she does, but when/how does she find out what she wants?
> 
> We still live together, we talk everyday, we eat dinner together, we sometimes sleep together, we hug and kiss each day, we still have intimate interactions. Yet, none of that opens her eyes.
> 
> I have no doubt what she's experiencing with this other person was to temporarily fill a void that I wasn't. Nothing more. I know what that is now and I'm filling it! I can see the way she looks at me and cries with me. She's just so confused that she can't separate right from wrong. I know that's killing her inside.
> 
> But how long do I wait? At what point does indecision become a decision? How can I help her see what's right?
> 
> Who has some good insight? I NEED IT!


Just kissing? R un sure? She seems to be in the fog, ask her about om feeling and last contact.
Sorry to tell but could be much more than you think 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Wolf1974

I see a lot of you waiting around for HER to make a decision. What about you? What do you want? Are you willing to forgive her? You sure his was only kissing or did you dig alittle deeper? Did you out this other guy to his spouse? My point is In the short time stop worrying about her and control what you can which is what you do and how you are going to move forward. If you want to reconcile fine make a plan and tell her what you need her to do.

Be cautious my friend if she makes the decision your not hoping for you may come home to an empty house and 1/2 your accounts emptied best case scenario


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## jnb150

Yes, I'm sure. She's been very honest with me since she told me, and I've asked a lot of questions. I had no idea she was cheating and she came out and told me. I just knew she was having issues and seeing a counselor by herself.


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## jnb150

I want to make it work. The guy she cheated with is most likely headed for a divorce because his wife also knows. That's the last my wife knew of it because she hasn't spoken with him since she fessed up.

So I know what I want, to fix things... but she doesn't know what she wants.


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## Riley_Z

Of course she's confused about what she wants.. that's what affairs do, complicate your life... you mean she's actually surprised she's not as focused as before?


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## Riley_Z

jnb150 said:


> Yes, I'm sure. She's been very honest with me since she told me, and I've asked a lot of questions. I had no idea she was cheating and she came out and told me. I just knew she was having issues and seeing a counselor by herself.


You can't say that a liar is being honest, sorry.

You have to second guess her. Do not be naive.


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## tom67

So this other guy is also married?
You need to contact his wife but do not tell your wife.
You need to get a voice activated recorder and stick it in her car and one for the house.
Just remember you can't "nice" her out of this.
Like what wolf said what do YOU want.
If you have a joint bank account take half out and open one in your name only.
Protect yourself.


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## tom67

Sorry I see his wife knows.
Do you really think she is going to divorce over just a kiss?
Give his w a call you may get more info.


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## jnb150

Riley_Z said:


> You can't say that a liar is being honest, sorry.
> 
> You have to second guess her. Do not be naive.


2nd guessing her makes it impossible to rebuild. I can see the hurt in her eyes when she tells me these things and the hurt in hers eyes because she doesn't know.


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## jnb150

tom67 said:


> Sorry I see is wife knows.
> Do you really think she is going to divorce over just a kiss?
> Give his w a call you may get more info.


how do I get that info? I don't know their last name.


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## Jibril

jnb150 said:


> how do I get that info? I don't know their last name.


You don't. Your wife certainly does.


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## tom67

jnb150 said:


> how do I get that info? I don't know their last name.


Have you checked her phone records you can give a PI the phone number and give you the info.
Your wife should have given you this already and that's a little concerning.


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## jnb150

tom67 said:


> Have you checked her phone records you can give a PI the phone number and give you the info.
> Your wife should have given you this already and that's a little concerning.


I think she was always afraid that I would do something stupid... I was surprised that I didn't.


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## Squeakr

Ask your WW that information. She needs to be open, truthful, and honest from this point forward, in order for your M to even have a chance of coming back from this. 

It also makes it all the worse if she still works with him and he is getting a divorce. He knows they have a connection and now no longer has a reason to stop and hide it. I would be pushing for her to seek other employment, as they seem to have too much tme to meet and confide in each other. If it truly was just a kiss, then something more must have went on with him (meaning this is not his first ride at the rodeo or something along that way) that his wife would be divorcing over a kiss. Some people I realize have such a low breaking point of tolerance, but I think there is more than meets the eye here.


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## ReidWright

jnb150 said:


> how do I get that info? I don't know their last name.


what do you know? his first name and his company? try googling. do you have access to a company directory? to her email? or phone? she might still have it on their.

you definitely need to figure out if it's still going on. If she's 'confused', it probably still is going on. Especially since the OM is getting a divorce (or at least told your wife that!). 

Yep, contact his wife for her side...she might not really know. Cheaters are liars, so assume you've been told some lies.


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## Squeakr

jnb150 said:


> *I think she was always afraid that I would do something stupid*... I was surprised that I didn't.



Typical cheaters line. The question becomes whom are they really protecting in this case, you, the OM, or themselves?

She needs to come forth with this information ASAP. Any further hiding of this sort, pretty much shows you her intentions, which are to not put forth the effort to make a M work and just rug sweep the whole event.


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## naiveonedave

Expect trickle truth. Kiss is typically code for more....


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## Chaparral

Check her cell and text records. Is she an open book? Get his phone number and do a google search and check it on spokeo.com.

If she has told you everything it would probably be a first here. 99% of the time, just a kiss means sex.

Odds are this is the tip of a huge iceberg.

If they are still working together the a attraction won't die. No contact has to be absolute. It sounds like all your info is unreliable.


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## weightlifter

jnb150 said:


> 2nd guessing her makes it impossible to rebuild. I can see the hurt in her eyes when she tells me these things and the hurt in hers eyes because she doesn't know.


#facepalm. Dude. Seriously effing stop this.

1) SHE is guilty, you are not.
2) Do you have proof she didnt blow him or fvck him? Her word is worth zero. You realize cheaters lie.... I hope.
3) You are setting yourself up for a rude awakening when you find out it was much deeper, longer, more involved, and or still going on.
4) The hurt in her eyes is from being caught.

2nd guessing makes it impossible to rebuild... This is one of the top three things said ever on this board that are 100 percent dead absolute WRONG.

standard evidence post below. If you actually want to know the truth.

Your wife is acting funny. Her phone and email suddenly have passwords you don't know. She shuts down phone apps or changes windows on the computer whenever you enter the room. She is suddenly staying out until 2 to 5 in the morning. She has new single friends. She has lost weight and is dressing hotter to boot. Her ex contacted her 3 weeks ago and she wants “to meet to catch up at some public place” “I love you but not in love with you.” or version thereof. Any of this sound familiar? If your wife comes home from an alone time does she immediately change liners, change panties possibly even immediately laundering them?, shower? This can be an after the fact clean up. 

If you are reading this your gut is going crazy. “Relax”, in that there is a high liklihood that you are not crazy at least. “Your gut” is your basic instinct from the caveman period. There is something up with your mate. It is part of your mind built into you and in your DNA. You probably cant sleep. You are losing weight like crazy and are not hungry. Well if you are reading this and that is 90% of you reading this if its your first time... You are embarking on what is probably going to be the worst time of your life.

Chin up, yes I know it is damn near impossible to believe now, but I and the people at TAM here have taken dozens of men through this process. Some reconcile, most dont in the long run so be aware. Most of us hang around this grim grim place for a sense of “pay it forward” and “getting at the truth” Even in divorce, the long run the majority find love again... yes really. Often selecting a far far better future companion. Read poster BFF for a thread of disaster, divorce, recovery, and a new wonderful woman in his life. Younger and hotter, yes, but also one with better boundaries, often a far far better personality match. Oh and they get to go through that first time with her after the first I love you's have been exchanged. Just know, that for the majority, even if the marriage crashes, in six months, a year, maybe two you will wonder how you got so far so fast and how great your new life is. You will also be MUCH MUCH stronger as a person.

So. Here are your instructions. Do this now. I dont mean next week. I mean make something up within the next day and GET IT DONE! Not looking will only prolong your agony.
Rule 1 for this.
SHUT UP. Eyes open. YOUR mouth closed. confronting only makes them better at hiding.
Rule 2 for this.
SHUT UP. Eyes open. YOUR mouth closed. confronting only makes them better at hiding.
Rule 3 for this.
SHUT UP. Eyes open. YOUR mouth closed. confronting only makes them better at hiding.

NO MORE CONFRONTS!! Play dumb husband for a bit. Dont drive her further underground! Soft confronts with little evidence RARELY WORK AND ONLY MAKE GETTING AT THE TRUTH HARDER!!! THIS PROLONGS YOUR AGONY!

Buy 2 sony ICDPX312 or ICDPX333 voice activated recorders. Best Buy sells them for like 50 bucks. DO NOT BUY a cheap VAR. SONY SONY SONY. USE LITHIUM batteries. We have examples of 25 hour recordings using them on these sony recorders. My icon here IS a Sony ICDPX312. No I do not have stock in nor work for Sony.

Setup instructions are on page 19. Also good stuff on page 31.
Use 44K bit rate for balancing file size vs quality DO NOT USE 8K!!!!! Simply put. The higher the quality the better the sound and 8K sucks. ALSO. The higher the quality the more you can manipulate the mp3 in Audacity.
Set VOR "on" see page 38
See page 40 for adding memory if necessary
Play with it yourself to get familiar. TEST IT OUT
Turn off the beep feature. Its on one of the menus. You can even play prevent defense by going to a dollar store, buying uber-cheapie earbuds, cut off the buds but put in the jack which will actually disable the speaker for additional protection.

Go to Walmart and buy heavy duty velcro.
This is one item: Velcro Heavy-Duty Hook and Loop Fastener VEK90117: Office : Walmart.com
also
Purchase VELCRO Hook and Loop Fasteners, Sticky-Back, for less at Walmart.com. Save money. Live better.
The velcro is usually in the fabric section or less often in the aisle with the fasteners like screws. The velcro pack is mostly blue with a yellow top. Clear pack shows the vecro color which is black or white.

Use the velcro to attach the var under her seat UP INSIDE. SECURE IT WELL!!!!!! So well even a big bump wont knock it off. attach one side HD velcro from Walmart to back. USE BIG PIECE
attach other side HD velcro again UP INSIDE car seat. ATTACH THE CRAP out of it. It needs to stay put going over big potholes or railroad tracks.

Put the second VAR in whatever room she uses to talk in when you are not around. If you are a typical man, use your size advantage to put it someplace she cant reach, even on a chair. Beware spring cleaning season if she does it.

I recommend exporting the sound files to your comp. The recorder is very cumbersome for playback.

Amazon has a pen VAR that can be placed in a purse or other small place to get remote conversations. Yes the pen works.

IMPORTANT warning. If you hear another man and perhaps a little kissing or activity... STOP Listening and have a trusted friend listen and tell you what went on. Knowing she is a cheat will kill you. Hearing her moan while another man is inside her will murder you to your very soul!!!!!! You are not strong enough to hear that. Dont try it. I know what I am talking about in this.

If you need clean up the recordings get Audacity. Its free from the internet. I have used it on var work for others here to remove things like engine noise. If needed, I have done var work for four men here. RDMU is the only one who has released some of the confidentiality. 

Lets be very clear about what the VAR is for and is not for. It will not be court admissible evidence. It is not for the confrontation. IT IS TO GET YOU AHEAD OF THE AFFAIR so you can gain other real evidence by knowing the who and when. NEVER MENTION YOUR VAR EVIDENCE. As far as the cheater is concerned, they were seen by a PI or something NOT your VAR!! 

The ezoom GPS has been found to be easy to buy at Radio shack and useful. There is even a locator webpage you can track with. Amazon sells a semen detection kit called checkmate.

Look for a burner phone. This is a second phone from a prepay service just used for cheating communications. That is often why wives let the husband "see their phone" They don't use their main phone for cheating purposes.

There is an app out there called teensafe. Its for both Iphone and Android. It monitors texts, GPS and facebook. Needs no jailbreak. Not perfect and delayed but no jailbreak required.

Look for apps on her phone like words with friends. It has a non traceable texting feature.
Here is a list 25 Apps to Help You Cheat On Your Girlfriend | Complex

If he uses chrome or firefox, there is probably a list of saved passwords you can look at. Even if his email isn't saved there, people usually only use a couple of different passwords, so one from the list might work. 

For firefox it's Tools -> Options -> Security -> Saved Passwords

For Chrome it's the little box with three bars in the top right -> Settings - Show advanced settings -> Managed saved passwords

If paternity is in doubt, (gredit graywolf2) SNP Microarray: Unlike amniocentesis, a non-invasive prenatal paternity test does not require a needle inserted into the mother’s womb. The SNP microarray procedure uses new technology that involves preserving and analyzing the baby’s DNA found naturally in the mother’s bloodstream. The test is accurate, 99.9%, using a tiny quantity of DNA — as little as found in a single cell.

Credit john1068
Is her internet browsers set up to use Google as the default search engine? And does she use a gmail account ? If so, she can delete here browser history all she wants, that only deletes the history that is localbin the browser itself...

On ANY computer, navigate to https://google.com/history. Log in using her gmail credentials and you'll have all history right there. Cant be deleted unless your wife logs in this same way...she'd only be deleting Chrome, IE, or Firefox history, not the Google history when deleting within the browser itself.

There does not appear to be a function within the Android OS that allows the recall of deleted info as is found on IOS. However, even on Android, When a text is deleted, the OS simply "loses" the address to where it is on the memory chip, but it's still there. 

Go to your computer and navigate to Dr. Fone for Android @ Dr.Fone for Android - Android Phone & Tablet Data Recovery SoftwareAndroid Phone Data Recovery.

You can download a trial version if you're operating system is XP/Vista/Win 7/Win 8 all on either 32 or 64 bit.

Download the program to your computer, open it, connect the Android phone to the computer via the micro USB cable and follow the instructions on the Dr. Fone program. You can recover deleted SMS, MMS, photos (yes, this includes SnapChats), vids, and documents.

Not everything is recoverable because the operating system continues to overwrite the data so if you don't recover this data on a regular basis, you may miss some pieces...

But there are also many Android apps that store deleted files and texts, even some that allow you to download and HID the app (ex. ).

They are also in her Spotlight Search...don't even need to connect to a computer. All deleted texts are still held onto. Type in the contact TELEPHONE number and every text, even the deleted ones, will show up in the search.

IOS 7 from any home screen put your finger in the middle of the screen and swipe downward. Enter the telephone number and start reading the hits.

IOS 6 from the first home screen, swipe left, enter the telephone number and start reading the hits.

Credit rodphoto 01162014
After researching the web for countless hours about software to find deleted messages on my wife's iphone I figured out this super easy method.

From the home screen swipe left to right until the spotlight page appears. Its a screen with the key board at bottom and a box at the top that says "search iphone" type your typical search words, anything sexual etc... All past messeges containing the search word will appear on a list, deleted or not. You'll only get the first line but that is usually enough. Just busted my wife again doing this a few days ago!

Rugs: swipe left on your first page of the main menu.

"spotlight search" under settings -> general -> spotlight search has to show "messages" as ticked.

Right here, right now: Taking screenshots on iOS devices -> hold down home button and press sleep button. The screenshot will be placed under your photo album.

Also there is an app to "stitch" messages like a panoramic photo, but only for iPad. go to app store and search "stitch". Damn it's 4 am. i need to go to bed.

Note that this applies only to Spotlight Search in IOS 6 and lower. For IOS 7 running on Iphone 4 and 5, put your finger in the middle of any of the home screens and swipe downward. 

Type in the search string you want (telephone number, contact name, keyword, etc) and it will search every instance in the iPhone where that appears. 

You may FIRST want to go into the Settings>General>Spotlight Search and then check or uncheck the areas that you want to search - make certain that "messages" and "mail" are CHECKED or else your search will not look into these areas. The same info is on the spot light on the ipad too ! If the settings isnt checked off, you can find all the same history!

Credit tacoma 03072014

This Google search history page weightlifter mentioned here doesn't just record the search term it records everything spoken into Google Now by voice command. There is a text read out for everything spoken into the phone through Google Now and since Androids later versions have integrated Google Now right into the OS just about everything spoken into an Android phone is saved at https://google.com/history

Commands to call me, entire voice texts, everything said into the phone is right here. I don't even know how it could be deleted if you wanted to. Considering almost everyone has an Android phone and voice command is becoming more popular this is a nice tool for a BS. It even has every Google Maps/Navigator GPS search saved.


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## jnb150

she comes home straight after work and spends the whole night with me....she has a busy job and while im not blind to the fact she still has time to mess around at work.... her job doesn't facilitate that now that shes been missing days for being "sick"(upset) and coming in late due to little sleep from talking with me


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## Jibril

jnb150 said:


> 2nd guessing her makes it impossible to rebuild. I can see the hurt in her eyes when she tells me these things and the hurt in hers eyes because she doesn't know.


No one _wants_ to lose their marriage, regardless of the circumstances.

You may mot want to second guess your wife, but you shouldn't blindly trust a liar, either. And you admit yourself in your first post that your wife has always had a problem communicating. Why are you taking the words of a cheater who has always had communication issues, at face value? 

It strikes me as odd that your wife is this confused over a "kiss." I don't believe for a second that her cheating was that simple. If she's this confused about her relationship with you, there are two possible reasons:


The affair has gone on for much longer than you imagine. Or

She has consummated her relationship with her lover sexually, and is still seeing him.

Either way, I suspect she is confused because she believes she loves her affair partner. She is not sure whether she wants to throw away her marriage with you to pursue a full-time relationship with her lover, but it is something she is definitely considering. 

Here are a few questions:


Does she still work with the other man? Is she still in contact with him at work? If not, how are you sure?

How long ago did this affair start, exactly? June?

What was your relationship like prior to that date? 

How did you know to grill her about the affair? What made you suspect that she was cheating?

You say you pointed out and are working on your faults during counseling. What does your counselor say about her cheating?

Jnb150, there is more to the story than you know. And it's clear from your posts that your more afraid of losing your marriage than getting to the truth of her affair and being decisive. If you were my friend and told me your situation, I would tell you flat out that, if your wife can't make a a damn decision on whether or not to commit to the marriage, you should make it for her and divorce her. Because if she's sitting on the fence weighing her options, she very _clearly_ is not committed to making things work between you.


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## Growapair

You are handling this entire thing the wrong way! 

You need a plan. I will try to help you out. Wake up in the middle of the night tonight while she is still asleep; make sure she’s in deep sleep. Slowly walk towards her purse, carefully open it up, unzip the side pocket on the inside of the purse and gently remove your testicles from her purse before she wakes up. Sheesh! 

You’re using euphemisms to excuse her cheating. Saying things like “I know she cheated to fill a void” or “it was my fault, I wasn’t a good husband”. The truth is, she cheated because she was probably horny and thought you would not find out.

Oh, she just kissed him huh? This isn’t high school son, Cheating adults in a car in the parking lot, don’t just kiss! Search the threads about trick truth!

The fact that you just found out she has betrayed you and lied to you, yet you’re the one begging to make it work shows her that you are a wimp and that you have no problem being the backup option.

Get this through your head, she cheated on you because you’re probably less desirable to her than the other guy. You need to put your foot down and respect yourself. She is in no position to be dictating to you how this marriage will work. You need to be setting the rules as to how you move forward from here on. Only then will she respect you as a man.


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## Squeakr

jnb150 said:


> she comes home straight after work and spends the whole night with me....she has a busy job and while im not blind to the fact she still has time to mess around at work.... her job doesn't facilitate that now that shes been missing days for being "sick"(upset) and coming in late due to little sleep from talking with me


This means nothing. She still gets lunches and breaks. I thought the same about my WW and not having anytime, as she was always home immediately after work, was an elementary teacher, so she was with her class all day, even lunches and worked with very few men. What I found is that she took vacation a few days to meet the APs, yet left and returned as normal and even said she was going to and at work those days she did this. I also found she was emailing all day long, all night, and talking to them on the phone at every opportunity (heck she would get up in the middle of the night when I was sleeping to talk and text/ chat with the APs). She has never been involved with anyone from her school or profession. All of the APs lived out of state even and she found a way to make it happen. If she had little shame to be "kissing" someone not her spouse in a parking lot in front of her work (where I bet that most know they both were married and not to each other especially) , then she very easily could have no issue taking it further.


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## Chris989

"Just Kissed". I didn't even get that. They were "good friends". She had "fallen for him" but "nothing happened".

Then I got "Just kissed once in the car".

This, apparently, is code for "prolonged sex sessions up to 3 times a week for 2 and a half years".

Get your head out of the sand, OP, they could be doing it in the lunch hour. She could be taking half days off (what my ex-colleague did when she was having an affair).

They are ADULTS. They never, ever, ever, "just kiss".

It's him or you. This is YOUR choice, not hers.


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## helolover

OP, looks like you're on the way to a good ole fashion rug sweeping on this one. I'm doubling down 2 black chips there is more happening here. 

You're ready to be open and honest. You're ready to forget the past and show your wife what a good guy you are and what she is missing out with. If she would only listen and see.....right? You desperately want to believe her story. You desperately want things to be the way they were. You're hurt and feeling so humiliated and emasculated that you're pretty much willing to forgive and forget - just to get back to "normalcy." I know this because I've been in your shoes. It's about to get rough, Hoss. I'm going to suggest some things you probably don't want to hear. Strap in.

I think you're being "trickle truthed." Cheaters only cop to what they think you may already know and then will start giving you the truth in little trickles or batches. You believe she told you out of a guilty conscience. I bet his wife find out and they were threatening to tell you, so she confessed a little bit. 

Watch her actions. Her intent is in her actions. Her words are meaningless now. If she is distant and doesn't want to commit right now, that says a lot about how she views you. You seem to be plan B for her. She will essentially blame you for not meeting her needs and a whole slew of other scripted reasons that she can justify straying. In order to keep the peace, you'll shoulder the blame and start working single handedly on changing yourself and working to improve the marriage. Watch her, though. My guess is she will half-heartedly participate, but at the same time keep her options open to this OM. You will see it and try to compete with him. This is further emasculating and humiliating. 

My recommendation is to have her fully disclose the relationship with OM. I'd ask his wife too to compare notes. You will not want to do this. It is easier to keep your "recovery" on the rails by not creating waves. You will see her flare up if you get to close to the truth. Prepare to be gaslighted. Prepared to be lied to. 

Make sure you read the CWI intro stickie. Lots of information. 

Read a lot of threads here and see how familiar your tale is. 

Here to support, 

HL


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## PhillyGuy13

Sorry you are going through this.

Stop sleeping with her. At least wear a condom. 

I've had sex in a car before. It's not ideal. But it can be done. During a lunch break. Heck I usually only need 5 minutes and that still leave 55 minutes for Ramen noodles. . So when she says they just kissed -- exercise caution. 

You need to get his full name. Now do you know his wife is aware and they are now separating? Because your wife told you? Confirm on your own that other wife knows. If she doesn't know - make her aware.

Follow WEIGHTLIFTER's advise above. What kind of phone does she have?

VAR up under her seat in the car. Check online cell phone bill records.
Grab her phone when she is showering, or asleep, or doing number 2. 

She's head over heels for him but they just kissed? Hmmmm...

Finally, you say she came home because she is more comfortable at home? Her comfort shouldn't be your primary concern at this point. But, easier to watch her at least.


----------



## mahike

I am going for the nuts on this. She is trying to decide on plan A which is the other guy and plan B which is you. She does not have to decide because you have been a nice guy.

Did you expose your WW's PA to her family and yours? Did you expose to the OM's wife?

I am betting no. You cannot be a nice guy and in your case a beta and have a good R.

You have to come to grips that your wife has ended the marriage, trust is gone it is dead, you maybe able to build a new marriage but that will be up to her as well as you

You need to expose the A to all parties, Talk with the OM's wife because I am certain it was more than a kiss. A Kiss usually means they have had sex, 

I am not buying the EA just a kiss thing. That is not what happens with adults that cross the line


----------



## Q tip

jnb150 said:


> she comes home straight after work and spends the whole night with me....she has a busy job and while im not blind to the fact she still has time to mess around at work.... her job doesn't facilitate that now that shes been missing days for being "sick"(upset) and coming in late due to little sleep from talking with me


Yep, no time for a kiss or BJ in a car. None at all. Or even calling in sick and spending a nice day on the beach or hotel bed...


----------



## helolover

PhillyGuy13 said:


> Heck I usually only need 5 minutes and that still leave 55 minutes for Ramen noodles.


nickname: "flash" Ha!


----------



## mahike

:iagree:


Growapair said:


> You are handling this entire thing the wrong way!
> 
> You need a plan. I will try to help you out. Wake up in the middle of the night tonight while she is still asleep; make sure she’s in deep sleep. Slowly walk towards her purse, carefully open it up, unzip the side pocket on the inside of the purse and gently remove your testicles from her purse before she wakes up. Sheesh!
> 
> You’re using euphemisms to excuse her cheating. Saying things like “I know she cheated to fill a void” or “it was my fault, I wasn’t a good husband”. The truth is, she cheated because she was probably horny and thought you would not find out.
> 
> Oh, she just kissed him huh? This isn’t high school son, Cheating adults in a car in the parking lot, don’t just kiss! Search the threads about trick truth!
> 
> The fact that you just found out she has betrayed you and lied to you, yet you’re the one begging to make it work shows her that you are a wimp and that you have no problem being the backup option.
> 
> Get this through your head, she cheated on you because you’re probably less desirable to her than the other guy. You need to put your foot down and respect yourself. She is in no position to be dictating to you how this marriage will work. You need to be setting the rules as to how you move forward from here on. Only then will she respect you as a man.


Can I get an Amen. Please listen to us, this is much deeper than you know :iagree:


----------



## Q tip

OP,

Among many other things, read MMSLP, NMMNG

Get some testosterone and be a man. Take control. Execute the 180 and prepare for battle.

Expose

Contact OMW and meet for coffee and tell her what you know. Break these cheaters up before they break you.


----------



## tom67

Q tip said:


> OP,
> 
> Among many other things, read MMSLP, NMMNG
> 
> Get some testosterone and be a man. Take control. Execute the 180 and prepare for battle.


:iagree::iagree:


----------



## lordmayhem

Who is the one who cheated? You or her? Because it seems you're the one who is forcing R when she isn't even the least bit remorseful.

The Affair is still on, it's underground.


----------



## Q tip

mahike said:


> :iagree:
> 
> Can I get an Amen. Please listen to us, this is much deeper than you know :iagree:


Amen. :iagree:


----------



## Q tip

OP

Your response is the most undesirable thing your wife can want. Wimpy, soggy, unsure with a tad of zero confidence.

Step up to your role as a man. She will respond. Stop already with the Beta traits. 

Get a pair. Take action. See the OMW, 180, 

Get rid of your marbles and start playing chess to her checkers.


----------



## Graywolf2

jnb150 said:


> She does now see that I love her unconditionally even though she didn't feel like that before.


She cheated on you when she thought she might get in trouble for doing it. Now she has been reassured by you that you will always love her no matter what she does.

Why should she stop cheating?



jnb150 said:


> The guy she cheated with is most likely headed for a divorce because his wife also knows.


The OM is getting a divorce because he only “kissed another woman in his car during lunch a few weeks back.” His wife must be very strict. You might want to talk to his wife.



jnb150 said:


> 1.	I pulled this out of her last week and we have since gone to counseling twice.
> 
> 2.	I had no idea she was cheating and she came out and told me.


Which of the two is it? Pick one.



jnb150 said:


> Yes, I'm sure. She's been very honest with me since she told me, and I've asked a lot of questions.


She has been honest with you since she was dishonest with you about the most significant thing in your marriage. Have you gained a new ability to detect her lies that you didn’t have before?


----------



## BetrayedDad

jnb150 said:


> So instead of coming to me or going for help she decided to become vulnerable with a co-worker going through a similar situation. Which culminated with them kissing in his car during lunch a few weeks back.


"Kissing" is cheater speak for sex. 



jnb150 said:


> She stopped communicating with him but has admitted that she still thinks about him.


She WORKS with the guy. She DEFINITELY is still talking to him.



jnb150 said:


> I'm not sure what her intentions are. She said she still loves me and she's going to counseling because she doesn't want to give up on this.


To use you as plan B.



jnb150 said:


> As of now, she doesn't know what she wants. That's what I have a hard time with. I've spent more time talking to her this week, than she's spent talking to him in their whole relationship.


Yes, she does. She wants HIM and is just stalling with you. "Doesn't know what she wants" is cheater speak for "I want him, not you". 



jnb150 said:


> I have no doubt what she's experiencing with this other person was to temporarily fill a void that I wasn't. Nothing more. I know what that is now and I'm filling it!


It's hard to fill a void when another man's penis is already there.



jnb150 said:


> I can see the way she looks at me and cries with me. She's just so confused that she can't separate right from wrong.


Do you REALLY believe she can't tell right from wrong? Have you EVER in your life not known the difference? Why do you think she's so stupid? She knows EXACTLY what she's doing. She cries because she's sorry she GOT CAUGHT. Not because she hurt you.



jnb150 said:


> Who has some good insight? I NEED IT!


Here's the REAL story. She's been f***ing this co-worker for quite sometime. The affair is definitely still going on. She's taken it underground. She still engages him at work, sexually as well. She has every intention of either dumping you for him OR using you as plan b if it doesn't work out. She running the classic "make you feel guilty" gambit cheaters run to keep you on the hook and to keep her unaccountable. You're being played HARD. 

You want to wake her up from her fantasy? Then:

1) Serve her with divorce papers AT WORK.

2) Contact the other guy's wife and tell her everything.

3) Do the 180 on her and kick her out. Make her as UNCOMFORTABLE as possible.

Maybe she will wake up and maybe she won't but that is the ONLY correct course of action. Anything else and you're validating to her that you are the emasculated doormat she believes you to be. She cheats on you because she gets away with it. STOP LETTING HER. YOU are the victim! YOU need to strike back! You did NOTHING wrong, she's just a weak, selfish POS.


----------



## PhillyGuy13

Folks here can be very direct. But want to help you. Read what is posted. We can help you down a path to the truth. 

You are probably like sh!t, these guys are out there. Many of us are. and yes it's possible it was "just a kiss", but the fact that she is now carrying a torch for two men is a huge red flag. Don't you want to know for sure one way or the other?


----------



## PhillyGuy13

Do you have any children? I'm assuming no since it wasn't mentioned.

Thing is, without kids, I'd have zero tolerance for any shenanigans. Not worth the drama and hassle. There are many other fish in the sea. Most of whom don't kiss coworkers or worse.


----------



## Q tip

PhillyGuy13 said:


> Folks here can be very direct. But want to help you. Read what is posted. We can help you down a path to the truth.
> 
> You are probably like sh!t, these guys are out there. Many of us are. and yes it's possible it was "just a kiss", but the fact that she is now carrying a torch for two men is a huge red flag. Don't you want to know for sure one way or the other?


:iagree: :iagree: :iagree:

If it was just a kiss, your overwhelming response would be excellent. If is is (likely) a full-on affair, that overwhelming response is still necessary.


----------



## jnb150

im starting to see what everyone is saying, and I just talked to my sister for an hour about this,.... and she is in the same boat as you guys. im going to demand the names/numbers tonight. then when we get to counseling tonight im going to start the session by saying I think my wife is still lying to me.


----------



## Q tip

jnb150 said:


> 2nd guessing her makes it impossible to rebuild. I can see the hurt in her eyes when she tells me these things and the hurt in hers eyes because she doesn't know.


The hurt you see is that she merely got caught. I do not sense any remorse for her actions. Counseling won't work unless OM is 100% out of the picture. She needs to quit her job yesterday. Go NC permanently. She has a lot of heavy lifting to do to prove herself to you which will take years.


----------



## Squeakr

jnb150 said:


> im starting to see what everyone is saying, and I just talked to my sister for an hour about this,.... and she is in the same boat as you guys. im going to demand the names/numbers tonight. then when *we get to counseling tonight im going to start the session by saying I think my wife is still lying to me.*


i don't recommend this type of direct approach. I would think how you want to do it in advance, but maybe word it along the lines of you have been thinking about this a lot and things don't make sense to you. You feel that something is not right and you don't have and aren't getting the full truth of what is going on and you need this to heal and move on from this event. 

If you go in accusing her of lying, more than likely what will come of your approach is she will shut down, start crying, and the therapist will react to this and try to stop you and your "negative" progression. It may get you labeled as uncooperative, anger driven, and possibly others things in the therapist's mind, will hurt the counseling session, and may enforce all the negative things she has complained about you doing to the therapist.


----------



## lordmayhem

You can't even verify that she is NC with the OM. You haven't even attempted to verify thru keyloggers, VARs, etc. Instead, you've only taken her word for it.

This indicates that she's still in the affair if she doesn't know what she wants. If she was TRULY REMORSEFUL, she would be busting her ass to fix the marriage that she broke. She would be WILLINGLY TRANSPARENT.

Do you have access to her pay stubs? If not, then you do not know if they are meeting during working hours. You do not know if she's been taking off time from work to meet OM.

And don't kid yourself that it was only a kiss. It's much more than that. It's Trickle Truth.


----------



## lordmayhem

Marriage Counseling (MC) is useless if the affair is still on. You have not even verified that she is NC with OM. The red flags indicate that it is underground.


----------



## TRy

jnb150 said:


> she comes home straight after work and spends the whole night with me....she has a busy job and while im not blind to the fact she still has time to mess around at work.... her job doesn't facilitate that now that shes been missing days for being "sick"(upset) and coming in late due to little sleep from talking with me


 If you read many of the other infidelity threads on this site and other sites, almost every person that has been cheated on begins by posts something like you are posting now when they first learn of their spouse cheating. When it comes to cheating it is as if there is a script that the cheaters and the cheated on follow where they say that, it was just a kiss, it happened only once, the affair partner's spouse already knows so you do not need to contact them, they claim to have told you the truth about how long the cheating has really been going on, they are not communicating anymore because there is no time where they would be able to, they were driven to cheat because the cheated on was not perfect in meeting the cheaters needs, the cheater is now being honest, and the cheater is just "confused". Sadly, the cheated on spouse almost always believes the cheater at first, and only later learns that their cheater spouse is not some special exception to the norm, and that much, if not all, of this is not true. 

There is little that we will tell you on this board that you will beleive at first. When a famous con man was asked how he got so many otherwise intelligent people to believe the unbelievable, he answered that you can get anyone to believe almost anything if that is what they already want to beleive. Your wife's story does not make sense, but you beleive it anyways because you want to believe that it is not as bad as you deep down inside know that it really is. 

I am sorry that you are here. If you do not listen to anything else that anyone is saying please believe this, that you both each 50% responsible for the issues in your marraige and that the cheater is 100% responsible for their cheating. Their is never any excuse for cheating. If she was unhappy, then she should have been trying to discuss it with you and not her affair partner, as they both explored with each other excuses for them to cheat. Good luck and be well. Please keep posting.


----------



## CASE_Sensitive

What is the job relationship between WW and co-worker? Is there any chance he is a superior or higher level?


----------



## tom67

Tell her this...
You know I can't control you however I can control what I will or will not put up with.
The key in your situation is you have to be willing to end the marriage in order to save it.


----------



## jnb150

CASE_Sensitive said:


> What is the job relationship between WW and co-worker? Is there any chance he is a superior or higher level?


I think they are same level. they company has over 100 employees and they aren't in the same department from what I know


----------



## ire8179

tom67 said:


> Sorry I see his wife knows.
> Do you really think she is going to divorce over just a kiss?
> Give his w a call you may get more info.


:iagree::iagree::iagree:

This, i think it's rare for wife filing a divorce over a kiss. She knows something more than you do, likely more than a kiss


----------



## Q tip

Look, OP. Best case:

You simply cannot "nice" yourself out of this. You can't "nice" her into staying. You are plan B if plan A (OM) does not work out. You're so nice.... So, nice that she can do this again and again until she leaves with her dream lover. 

She'll regret it someday, but by then, you'll be happily married to a great woman who respects marriage and vows.


----------



## badmemory

jnb,

You are like so many BS's that we see come here. You're so devastated by her cheating that your anger at the betrayal get's buried by the usual thoughts - "what did I do to cause this", "I don't want to lose her", "what can I do to be a better husband". 

Having those thoughts is not untypical, but acting on them the way you have is simply rug sweeping her betrayal; while at the same time, causing her to lose respect for you for not making her accountable for what she did; for not giving her consequences.

If you stay on this path your anger/regret will eventually surface and you will be in a miserable false R, and she'll be more likely to cheat again.

You can't put the cart before the horse. Being a better husband is well and good, but she crossed a line that makes those efforts secondary at the moment. She cheated, it's 100% her fault, and she has to receive and accept consequences before you should consider R and work on the marriage. She has to understand what it's like to lose her husband for cheating on him.

Don't believe her story about just kissing until you know otherwise; even if it was an unsolicited admission. That means very little. Continue to monitor her covertly.

If she is still working with him, she needs to quit her job. The only compromise on that would be to give her a deadline.

She sends him a no contact letter that you read and approve.

She demonstrates complete transparency with her time away from you and her communication devices.

You expose her to his wife, your family and her family.

You accept nothing less than complete remorse and her desperation to save the marriage. No pining for him allowed.

You have to be willing to lose your marriage to have the best chance of saving it. If she doesn't accept every one of those consequences; start the divorce process and don't stop until she turns around.

If she does turn around - consistently; *THEN* you can go forward with R, and work on yourself and the marriage.

You came here for advice. That's the blueprint.


----------



## PhillyGuy13

ire8179 said:


> :iagree::iagree::iagree:
> 
> This, i think it's rare for wife filing a divorce over a kiss. She knows something more than you do, likely more than a kiss


Right. It's either a line of hooey that she (the other man's wife) even knows to begin with. 

Or it's a half truth where they are divorcing. Which means it was much more than a kiss. 

Either way, get ahold of this woman ASAP.


----------



## lordmayhem

ire8179 said:


> :iagree::iagree::iagree:
> 
> This, i think it's rare for wife filing a divorce over a kiss. She knows something more than you do, likely more than a kiss


Exactly. The OMW knows more about this. Contact her. 

This is just the tip of the iceberg.


----------



## 6301

First of all, you don't sit and wait for her to make her mind up. All that does is make matters worse and your the one paying for her poor decisions. 

If she can't make her mind up then make it up for her by telling her that if she can't make the choice between you hand him, then tell her to move out and not to come back until she knows what she wants and make sure you let her know in no uncertain terms that if she decides to come back, she better be a open book and come clean on everything and to make sure, take her to get a polygraph test. 

She's the one who screwed up and you shouldn't have to be the one sitting on pins and needles waiting for her to make her mind up. 

Stand firm with this and do not give her any kind of wiggle room. You already made that mistake by letting her come back. If that's the case then you let her sleep in the spare room and she has to prove to you that she's remorseful and wants the marriage to work, not you. 

Time to take the bull by the horns and regain some control.


----------



## jnb150

my wife says she doesn't have the ow phone number but she gave me the names and his number. I looked over our cell records and messaging. she hasn't talked to him on the phone since like June 3rd and hasn't texted him since around the same time........ well before I was aware of anything. she told me on June 30th.

What's your opinions on that?


----------



## aug

One of your key issues now is that you really dont know the whole truth.

You're currently mired in this cesspool your wife created for you. You're trying to swim to get out of it. I would think your mind is heavy and in a fog of its own. 

I think the key is that you have to look long term. Your wife affair will not disappear from your head. 2, 5, 10, 20 years from now, you'll still think about it. It's a part of you now.

I think the best approach is to get all the info you can from her now. Everything. Some things you can do now is VAR, as posted earlier by weightlifter, monitor using keylogger, and book a lie detector test for her. Get her STD tested. Do things to rule in or rule out stuff.

Once you have lots more info, you can make a firm decision then. And when you are in the process of gathering info, observe her -- is she remorseful (see lordmayhem chart posted earlier).


I note in your first post your wife parents divorce a few years ago. Having seen her parents go through a divorce, she probably somewhat going to be okay with a divorce herself.


----------



## badmemory

jnb150 said:


> my wife says she doesn't have the ow phone number but she gave me the names and his number. I looked over our cell records and messaging. she hasn't talked to him on the phone since like June 3rd and hasn't texted him since around the same time........ well before I was aware of anything. she told me on June 30th.
> 
> What's your opinions on that?


As long as she's working with him they have ample opportunity to make contact. That's my opinion.


----------



## aug

jnb150 said:


> my wife says she doesn't have the ow phone number but she gave me the names and his number. I looked over our cell records and messaging. she hasn't talked to him on the phone since like June 3rd and hasn't texted him since around the same time........ well before I was aware of anything. she told me on June 30th.
> 
> What's your opinions on that?


Dont matter really. She can always contact him during work.


----------



## aug

Before she quits her job, make sure she has another one lined up. Dont know too much about spousal support, but is a factor you should consider.


Perhaps now is the best time to separate finances. Dont have joint credit cards, debts, etc.


----------



## jnb150

aug said:


> Dont matter really. She can always contact him during work.


does it mean anything that she quit on her own a month ago?..... a month before I sniffed anything


----------



## azteca1986

jnb150 said:


> she hasn't talked to him on the phone since like June 3rd and hasn't texted him since around the same time........ well before I was aware of anything. she told me on June 30th.
> 
> What's your opinions on that?


She could use Skype or any number of apps with messaging functions. She could have another phone. And as the others have mentioned she still can meet him every day at work, right?

What were the circumstances of her (most likely partial) confession? What prompted it? I suspect the OM's wife had found out there was more than kissing going on.


----------



## jnb150

azteca1986 said:


> She could use Skype or any number of apps with messaging functions. She could have another phone. And as the others have mentioned she still can meet him every day at work, right?
> 
> What were the circumstances of her (most likely partial) confession? What prompted it? I suspect the OM's wife had found out there was more than kissing going on.


the OM wife apparently found out weeks ago. My wife told me when we were sitting down having a conversation.


----------



## badmemory

jnb150 said:


> does it mean anything that she quit on her own a month ago?..... a month before I sniffed anything


That information would have been helpful for us to know, but yes, that's a good thing. One less consequence for her to have to accept.


----------



## aug

jnb150 said:


> does it mean anything that she quit on her own a month ago?..... a month before I sniffed anything


Yes. What was her reason for quitting?

Is she working now?


----------



## badmemory

jnb150 said:


> the OM wife apparently found out weeks ago. My wife told me when we were sitting down having a conversation.


What your wife tells you can't be accepted as truth. That's just the way it goes with the vast majority of CS's. Don't rely on anything she tells you until you can confirm it.

Contact his wife.


----------



## aug

jnb150 said:


> the OM wife apparently found out weeks ago. My wife told me when we were sitting down having a conversation.


I wonder how the OM wife found out. Your wife and her OM must have left some strong evidence about her affair. Interesting to note both the strong reaction of the OM's wife and your wife leaving her job, given that it was just a "kiss".


----------



## manfromlamancha

jnb, I will echo what the others are saying.


She told you because she was guilty and sounding you out to see what you would do. She is considering him as a viable partner, but wants to keep you on as Plan B. Be very careful here.

She has done a lot more than kiss him and probably over a longer period. That is why she is "confused" and crying etc. His wife would not leave him over a "kiss". She would not leave you because he is a good kisser and listens to her problems.

"She still thinks of him" means that she is in love with him. She still loves you but is not in love with you - you know what that means.

She probably wants you to blow up his marriage so that she can see if he is serious about her. That is when you might see a completely different side to her, yet again.

There are no more calls on her number because she has taken this underground (check for burner phones etc.) - start using VARs in her car and at home and do not reveal what you find till you are ready.

Do not believe anything you hear from your WW unless you have verified it for yourself. Talk to the OMW yourself - do not believe that she is divorcing him until you speak to her.

Prepare yourself for the worst - she may be further gone than you think. As others have said, they are adults. They did not just kiss and this has been going on longer than you think for her to be this confused about it.


----------



## jnb150

aug said:


> Yes. What was her reason for quitting?
> 
> Is she working now?


sorry for the confusion.......

shes still working. I was referring to the fact that she quit contacting him (using her cell phone anyways) a month ago. 1 month before I was aware this was happening. 

if she really didn't stop talking to him from that point on, why stop using her phone?

also, I asked her today, and she said he had texted her a couple days ago o say hi and she didn't respond. phone logs prove that... but I don't know what goes on behind closed doors


----------



## Q tip

jnb150 said:


> my wife says she doesn't have the ow phone number but she gave me the names and his number. I looked over our cell records and messaging. she hasn't talked to him on the phone since like June 3rd and hasn't texted him since around the same time........ well before I was aware of anything. she told me on June 30th.
> 
> What's your opinions on that?


Check the deleted and sent emails, check deleted messages off her phone, check high and low for a burner phone. Does she have any secret email accounts... Get a VAR in her car and another in the home where she spends her time. She use a PC? Get a keylogger on it. 

Why call when they work together and somehow found time in their schedules to be physical. Do you have access to her work phone logs? Work emails? Does she have games on her phone that allows her to message him, there are many phone apps that allow you to message to cheat. Maybe he's a player and has educated her. She may be one of many.

My opinion? You're not looking hard enough to be confident. You should not have told her you wanted to talk to his wife. She may tell him in time to let his wife know you are some crazy insane possessive control freak to be ignored.

Drop your marbles and play chess. If it was only a kiss, you don't have any evidence prove this or otherwise. Why would she confess to a kiss unless to hide something much much more.

Don't use adolescent thinking with an adult matter. Did you order the books yet.


----------



## lenzi

The OMs wife will probably have answers. You have their names, it should be easy enough to get in touch with her.


----------



## tom67

Now you can give a PI his name and he can go from there.
So find one today.
Then when you know where they live I suggest you meet her in person.
How she handles the info you just never know but it is the right thing to do.


----------



## naiveonedave

Don't believe anything she says at face value, the probability of it being a lie, a stretched truth or minimization are very high. You need to get info from someone besides her and the OM. If you can't verify at least be open to things being much worse than you currently know.


----------



## badmemory

jnb150 said:


> sorry for the confusion.......
> 
> shes still working. I was referring to the fact that she quit contacting him (using her cell phone anyways) a month ago. 1 month before I was aware this was happening.


Okay, back to where we were.

You may think her quitting the job is extreme; but you would be making a huge mistake to allow her the opportunity to continue contact. Her agreeing to quit will also be a good test of her remorse.

It's good that she told you he texted her; but on the other hand, she is probably aware that you would find out.

Him texting her at all is a bad sign. If his wife knows about them, why would he risk that? And why hadn't she told him to stop contact?

Have her send him a no contact letter.


----------



## jnb150

badmemory said:


> Okay, back to where we were.
> 
> You may think her quitting the job is extreme; but you would be making a huge mistake to allow her the opportunity to continue contact. Her agreeing to quit will also be a good test of her remorse.
> 
> It's good that she told you he texted her; but on the other hand, she is probably aware that you would find out.
> 
> Him texting her at all is a bad sign. If his wife knows about them, why would he risk that? And why hadn't she told him to stop contact?
> 
> Have her send him a no contact letter.


him and his wife are supposedly getting divorced.... their marriage was ruined a long time ago and this broke the camels back(from what I was told).... so he has nothing to lose. My wife did tell him to stop contacting her last week when she told me she cheated


----------



## italianjob

You need to do some research on your own on this. You only know what she told you, but she could be lying or give you different versions of things because she has a plan.
Nobody on earth opens this kind of crisis over a kiss and some talking, so forget this isn't gone physical.
I would go underground with the above mentioned research and stop relying on your wife for information.
You need to know the truth if you want to protect yourself and make your decisions


----------



## Q tip

aug said:


> I wonder how the OM wife found out. Your wife and her OM must have left some strong evidence about her affair. Interesting to note both the strong reaction of the OM's wife and your wife leaving her job, given that it was just a "kiss".


OMW probably casually noticed he forgot to remove the condom...


----------



## tom67

jnb150 said:


> him and his wife are supposedly getting divorced.... their marriage was ruined a long time ago and this broke the camels back(from what I was told).... so he has nothing to lose. My wife did tell him to stop contacting her last week when she told me she cheated


Please verify anything she says right now.


----------



## Q tip

jnb150 said:


> him and his wife are supposedly getting divorced.... their marriage was ruined a long time ago and this broke the camels back(from what I was told).... so he has nothing to lose. My wife did tell him to stop contacting her last week when she told me she cheated


And you confirmed this to be true by contacting the OMW or are you still believing your WW.


----------



## badmemory

jnb150 said:


> My wife did tell him to stop contacting her last week when she told me she cheated


And you can confirm this? Or is this your wife's story?

Even if she did, sending him the no-contact letter is necessary. It's more of a consequence/test of remorse thing than to ensure there's no further contact. It won't necessarily do that.


----------



## vellocet

jnb150 said:


> Which culminated with them kissing in his car during lunch a few weeks back.
> 
> I pulled this out of her last week


You had to PULL that out of her. I highly doubt she is confused on what she wants based on kissing.




> I have no doubt what she's experiencing with this other person was to temporarily fill a void that I wasn't. Nothing more.


If it was "nothing more" she wouldn't be "confused" as to what she wants. If it truly was "nothing more" than filling a void, then she wouldn't be confused now that you are filling that void.




> But how long do I wait?


I would usually respond to a question like this by asking, "why should you have to wait on her to make up her mind?"

But how long you wait is up to you. Or more accurately, how long you put up with this is up to you.

Perhaps a WS can answer that? How long should a BS put up with a WS not knowing if they want their spouse of the OP?


----------



## ire8179

jnb150 said:


> the OM wife apparently found out weeks ago. My wife told me when we were sitting down having a conversation.


Sorry but this doesn't sound positive, the time they stopped is close to when OMW figured out. That maybe the true reason it's over not because one/both of them want to stop. 
Maybe the OMW know that it's more than a kiss then demanded him to go NC ,if not she'll give you a call. OMW found out he broke NC, he alerted your wife, thus she told you


----------



## jnb150

Q tip said:


> And you confirmed this to be true by contacting the OMW or are you still believing your WW.


im trying to find a way to get in touch with her. my wife doesn't want to contact OM to ask for the number (not that he would offer it anyway) and she doesn't have it..... I'm trying to look through her cell records from when she did get the text from OMW to see if a phone number sticks out


----------



## tom67

jnb150 said:


> im trying to find a way to get in touch with her. my wife doesn't want to contact OM to ask for the number (not that he would offer it anyway) and she doesn't have it..... I'm trying to look through her cell records from when she did get the text from OMW to see if a phone number sticks out


Just contact a PI this shouldn't be too expensive.


----------



## Q tip

jnb150 said:


> im trying to find a way to get in touch with her. my wife doesn't want to contact OM to ask for the number (not that he would offer it anyway) and she doesn't have it..... I'm trying to look through her cell records from when she did get the text from OMW to see if a phone number sticks out


You have his name, address, phone number. Try a product online called GOOGLE or a phone book. Try their home phone. Do not let wife know you want to talk with her... Drive over and knock on the door.


----------



## jnb150

Q tip said:


> You have his name, address, phone number. Try a product online called GOOGLE or a phone book. Try their home phone. Do not let wife know you want to talk with her... Drive over and knock on the door.


I wouldn't do that, I don't need to be in jail over this too.... im already there emotionally


----------



## tom67

jnb150 said:


> I wouldn't do that, I don't need to be in jail over this too.... im already there emotionally


:scratchhead:


----------



## PhillyGuy13

jnb150 said:


> my wife says she doesn't have the ow phone number but she gave me the names and his number. I looked over our cell records and messaging. she hasn't talked to him on the phone since like June 3rd and hasn't texted him since around the same time........ well before I was aware of anything. she told me on June 30th.
> 
> What's your opinions on that?


They work together. Work IMs, emails, phone records, trips to the break room, stair well, parking lot, conference rooms won't show up on your cell bill.


----------



## ire8179

jnb150 said:


> I wouldn't do that, I don't need to be in jail over this too.... im already there emotionally


I don't think you'll be jailed over talking to her, do it when he's in the office


----------



## italianjob

jnb150 said:


> I wouldn't do that, I don't need to be in jail over this too.... im already there emotionally


In jail for what? :scratchhead:


----------



## badmemory

jnb,

You're trying to absorb a lot of advice and you seem to be receptive to it. That's a good thing. I understand that a lot of it may seem to be counter-intuitive at the moment. But trust these members. Most have dealt with our own similar situations. 

Relax. You don't have to do everything in one fell swoop. When you approach your wife, try to stay calm, but resolute. You can do all this without lashing out at her. Tell her you love her and hope the marriage can be saved, but that she needs to do these things if she wants to save her marriage.

Google "the 180". Implement it to detach from her if she doesn't turn around, and go see an attorney. Just because you start the divorce process, doesn't mean you have to finish it.


----------



## intuitionoramiwrong

jnb150 said:


> I wouldn't do that, I don't need to be in jail over this too.... im already there emotionally


People don't go to jail over a conversation. 

It's simple - 

Hi, I'm so and so, my wife has confessed to having an affair with your husband. I need the truth, what do you know.


----------



## PhillyGuy13

jnb150 said:


> does it mean anything that she quit on her own a month ago?..... a month before I sniffed anything


I guess I missed this earlier. Yes it is good that they no longer work together. 

By no means is everything free and clear, but that is good to see.


----------



## warlock07

First post ..3rd para...

This kind of BS are the hardest to deal with.

Over analysing and in denial...

Desperate for R while trying to come off as objective and rational decision maker


----------



## turnera

jnb150 said:


> im trying to find a way to get in touch with her. my wife doesn't want to contact OM to ask for the number (not that he would offer it anyway) and she doesn't have it..... I'm trying to look through her cell records from when she did get the text from OMW to see if a phone number sticks out


Ask your wife what his full name is, and look her up.


----------



## ire8179

PhillyGuy13 said:


> I guess I missed this earlier. Yes it is good that they no longer work together.
> 
> By no means is everything free and clear, but that is good to see.


He said by quit he meant she quit contacting him,they are still working in the same place

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping...es-confused-what-she-wants-5.html#post9551521


----------



## badmemory

PhillyGuy13 said:


> I guess I missed this earlier. Yes it is good that they no longer work together.
> 
> By no means is everything free and clear, but that is good to see.


She hasn't quit the job. He was referring to her quitting contact.


----------



## Riley_Z

ire8179 said:


> He said by quit he meant she quit contacting him,they are still working in the same place
> 
> http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping...es-confused-what-she-wants-5.html#post9551521


And probably still have each other on speed dial.


----------



## jnb150

italianjob said:


> In jail for what? :scratchhead:


.... lets just say,..... if he answered the door


----------



## kenmoore14217

jnd150 says his wife is being good now. He knows this because she told him so.


----------



## jnb150

kenmoore14217 said:


> jnd150 says his wife is being good now. He knows this because she told him so.


All of the support you guys have given has been awesome, and it's starting to open my eyes to what I need to do. But this isn't constructive. I did just find this out 1 week ago. There's no need to twist the knife.


----------



## PhillyGuy13

ire8179 said:


> Sorry but this doesn't sound positive, the time they stopped is close to when OMW figured out. That maybe the true reason it's over not because one/both of them want to stop.
> Maybe the OMW know that it's more than a kiss then demanded him to go NC ,if not she'll give you a call. OMW found out he broke NC, he alerted your wife, thus she told you


And she confessed to a kiss as damage control. In case "crazy wife" calls with some story about the two of them sleeping together.


----------



## Hicks

Exposure to your and her family and friends is only done to kill affairs.
You don't know whether she is still having one or not. Don't take that step if you don't need to. You need evidence first. You see what the purpose of the no contact letter is.. It's so she rejects him flat out and he stops fishing for her. And once you establish contact with the wife, all his contact to your wife gets reported to her... And one of the rules is any contact to your wife gets reported to you by your wife.


----------



## PhillyGuy13

badmemory said:


> She hasn't quit the job. He was referring to her quitting contact.


Thanks should have kept reading.


----------



## Q tip

jnb150 said:


> I wouldn't do that, I don't need to be in jail over this too.... im already there emotionally


Go over when your wife and him are "working". Or call and meet for coffee. If she's working, meet up at lunch. How hard can this be. It's not like you're trying to cheat or something.


----------



## Q tip

jnb150 said:


> .... lets just say,..... if he answered the door


Ask for her. You don't need to speak with him. He's a liar.


----------



## PhillyGuy13

Q tip said:


> Ask for her. You don't need to speak with him. He's a liar.


Eh, if he punches him in the face so be it. If OP doesn't have a criminal record, he probably wouldn't go to jail. May give me some satisfaction. 

Disclaimer - I'm not a lawyer nor do I condone violence.


----------



## Q tip

Hicks said:


> Exposure to your and her family and friends is only done to kill affairs.
> You don't know whether she is still having one or not. Don't take that step if you don't need to. You need evidence first. You see what the purpose of the no contact letter is.. It's so she rejects him flat out and he stops fishing for her. And once you establish contact with the wife, all his contact to your wife gets reported to her... And one of the rules is any contact to your wife gets reported to you by your wife.


Oh it's still on. She's confused (buying time). If it was over, she'd be with one of the two. 

OP, shock her and go get an STD test including herpes. Just a kiss... I've heard that before on TAM... Just can't find it. Oh ya.. every other post that's where..


----------



## warlock07

jnb150 said:


> the OM wife apparently found out weeks ago. My wife told me when we were sitting down having a conversation.



Very bad news!! She confessed when she realized she will be outed by her. So she confessed before to keep the situation in control.

Or his wife threatened to call you if she did not confess to you herself.


----------



## mahike

jnb150 said:


> All of the support you guys have given has been awesome, and it's starting to open my eyes to what I need to do. But this isn't constructive. I did just find this out 1 week ago. There's no need to twist the knife.


We are all trying to be very direct and to get you to take action. Your wife is using the cheaters play book.

Trickle truth, only tell what you have to.

Keep both guys on the hook until she decides on Plan A or Plan B or you force her hand

There is only a very slim chance and I do mean slim that she has not had sex with him.

She lied and crossed the boundaries of right and wrong, so why should you believe her on anything?

No contact letters are very important tell her you want her to write him a no contact letter and she is to give it to you to read and mail. She will get defensive or will make excuses.

We have all been here before so please listen and please put your foot down.


----------



## jnb150

mahike said:


> We are all trying to be very direct and to get you to take action. Your wife is using the cheaters play book.
> 
> Trickle truth, only tell what you have to.
> 
> Keep both guys on the hook until she decides on Plan A or Plan B or you force her hand
> 
> There is only a very slim chance and I do mean slim that she has not had sex with him.
> 
> She lied and crossed the boundaries of right and wrong, so why should you believe her on anything?
> 
> No contact letters are very important tell her you want her to write him a no contact letter and she is to give it to you to read and mail. She will get defensive or will make excuses.
> 
> We have all been here before so please listen and please put your foot down.


I think I'm just about there. I'm starting tonight. I have someone who also works at their office who is trying to get the OMW phone for me. If not, It looks like I can buy a report online for a couple bucks.


----------



## badmemory

jnb150 said:


> All of the support you guys have given has been awesome, and it's starting to open my eyes to what I need to do. But this isn't constructive. I did just find this out 1 week ago. There's no need to twist the knife.


Hang in there jnb,

Sometimes you'll get a 2x4 to the head for clarity. Sometimes those 2x4's are vicariously motivated by our past experiences. I'm guilty of that myself on occasion.

Take the advice as a whole. You can ignore any of it.


----------



## tom67

jnb150 said:


> I think I'm just about there. I'm starting tonight. I have someone who also works at their office who is trying to get the OMW phone for me. If not, It looks like I can buy a report online for a couple bucks.


Good
Stay proactive.
You can do this.


----------



## TRy

jnb150 said:


> if she really didn't stop talking to him from that point on, why stop using her phone?


 She may have stopped using her phone and took it underground, because the other man's wife found out about the affair. BTW, she may have told you about the affair because she was afraid that the other man's wife was going to tell you, and your wife want to put her spin on it first.

By your wife admitting that she is still thinking about the other man, and by her acknowledging that she is confused, she has in fact confirmed that she is in an emotional affair (EA) with the other man. As long as she is in contact with her affair partner, even at work, you have little chance of saving your marriage long term. By working with him she can see him at breaks and over lunch. She can call in sick to spend the day with him. She can leave work early or come in a little late claiming a family issue, when she is really doing it to spend time alone with her affair partner. She can do all this without you ever knowing. Most affairs have periods where they take breaks when things get sticky with their spouses, but then they start up again when the heat is off.

As things stand right now, the game is rigged against you by your wife. She has given the other man the home court advantage that you as the spouse should have. Thanks to your wife, the other man knows everything about you and your wife including your weaknesses, while until just recently you did not even know his name or that your marraige was under attack. Every time that you talked to your wife, she went and told him what you said, so that he could have a chance to discount your point of view, without giving you a chance for rebuttal. You are also playing according to the cheaters script, where the cheater gets to be the judge of right and wrong as you try to help her through her confusion as to who she wants to be with, you or her affair partner. She has lost her moral compass yet you are letting her lead the way out of fear of losing her. Again, this is a game that you cannot win. You must stop playing the cheaters game.

There must be full no contact (NC) which includes her changing jobs. There must be full transpancy which includes full access and passwords without complaint; this includes her agreeing to not deleting anything without showing it to you first. As an FYI one iTunes song takes up that same space as almost 50,000 text messages so she does not have to delete texts because she needs the space on her phone. And finally there must be true remorse for her cheating behind your back with another man without her making excuses. You must demand these things and be willing to back this demand up with ending the marriage. Time is not on your side. The best way to save your marriage if to be really willing to end it if she is not all in. The sooner she is forced to choose, the more likely that she will choose you. If she does choose her affair partner, then you were going to lose her anyways in the long run, and just saved yourself some additional pain.


----------



## Lostinthought61

Let me ask you JNB....what is a deal breaker for you...lets say you find out that she had sex with him...is that a deal breaker? is the marriage worth saving at that point?
knowledge can be a dangerous thing once faced with the truth nothing can be the same again....you will NEVER be able to look at her the same way as you do today....don't get me wrong kissing and EA is bad but once you discover a heavy PA then there is no going back...you will have nightmares


----------



## vellocet

JNB, your wife needs to first start looking for another job.
She needs to pound the pavement every week until she finds one, NO EXCUSES. I don't care how long it takes or how much time she might complain it takes to look for another job, if she is still working with OM its unacceptable.

I wouldn't expect her to up and quit if you need the income, but while she is working she sends out a crap load of resumes/applications.


----------



## mahike

jnb150 said:


> I think I'm just about there. I'm starting tonight. I have someone who also works at their office who is trying to get the OMW phone for me. If not, It looks like I can buy a report online for a couple bucks.


Spend the couple of bucks that is what I did to get the home phone number. 

I would be worried they are still in contact, have you checked the cell phone records? 

Try and be proactive one thing at least a day. Contact the OM's wife today spend the money for the online check. Do not wait on someone else to help you. Waiting is what a beta does (what I did) Be proactive, take charge of your life


----------



## jnb150

mahike said:


> Spend the couple of bucks that is what I did to get the home phone number.
> 
> I would be worried they are still in contact, have you checked the cell phone records?
> 
> Try and be proactive one thing at least a day. Contact the OM's wife today spend the money for the online check. Do not wait on someone else to help you. Waiting is what a beta does (what I did) Be proactive, take charge of your life


my friend was able to contact the OMW and she is going to be messaging me through Facebook soon


----------



## weightlifter

JNB.

Im direct as hell. Ive pizzed tons of people off...

Then they find out how SCARY correct I am. I have been on the inside of many threads talking privately to many cheated husbands here. I have info from some cheated husbands who do not even have threads. Ive done var work for like a dozen people here. I have seen HUNDREDS of stories and received logistical info on them not published on these boards.

Your wife is startlingly similar to hundreds here where this ends bad bad bad as it was a full fvckfest.

Im not mean to you. Im trying to wake you up.
and Im telling you
STEEL YOURSELF. Incoming and its ugly.


----------



## Q tip

jnb150 said:


> my friend was able to contact the OMW and she is going to be messaging me through Facebook soon


Get the phone number and call OMW yourself. MSG is fine, but meet up. You need to see the body laungaue and the person behind the texts. It will make it much more real for you that actual people besides yourself are suffering because of this.


----------



## tom67

Good give her your cell# and meet somewhere for coffee.


----------



## Q tip

When you meet OMW, have a plan, compare notes. When WW tells you something, let OMW know and compare notes.


----------



## azteca1986

jnb150 said:


> my friend was able to contact the OMW and she is going to be messaging me through Facebook soon


It's gratifying to see a recently Betrayed Spouse responding with action. Please excuse some of the seemingly harsh comments as some new posters here needed there eyes opened. We're pro-marriage here (that's easy to forget sometimes if you don't know that we see your sad situation played out day after day).


Gather information for now. DO NOT let your wife know what you are doing. Until you have a better idea of what went on and for how long you won't be in a position to decide anything, so don't.

Good luck


----------



## jnb150

azteca1986 said:


> It's gratifying to see a recently Betrayed Spouse responding with action. Please excuse some of the seemingly harsh comments as some new posters here needed there eyes opened. We're pro-marriage here (that's easy to forget sometimes if you don't know that we see your sad situation played out day after day).
> 
> 
> Gather information for now. DO NOT let your wife know what you are doing. Until you have a better idea of what went on and for how long you won't be in a position to decide anything, so don't.
> 
> Good luck


Should I "threaten" her that I a making contact with the OMW? Does she wanna tell me anything else before someone else does?


----------



## bandit.45

jnb150 said:


> Should I "threaten" her that I a making contact with the OMW? Does she wanna tell me anything else before someone else does?


No! Don't say a word. Just do it.


----------



## tom67

jnb150 said:


> Should I "threaten" her that I a making contact with the OMW? Does she wanna tell me anything else before someone else does?


No,no...
Please go talk to her the omw first.
Do not give your w a heads up that would not help imo.


----------



## Machiavelli

jnb150 said:


> Should I "threaten" her that I a making contact with the OMW? Does she wanna tell me anything else before someone else does?


HELL no. You don't telegraph your next move.


----------



## jnb150

Machiavelli said:


> HELL no. You don't telegraph your next move.


right, got it.


----------



## azteca1986

jnb150 said:


> Should I "threaten" her that I a making contact with the OMW? Does she wanna tell me anything else before someone else does?


No, don't let her in on your strategy. Don't tell her a thing.

If your wife comes to you later because the OM has thrown her under the bus to save himself (Nearly always happens), then you'll also know that your wife and the OM are still in contact.

Play your hand close to your chest for now.


----------



## tom67

Machiavelli said:


> HELL no. You don't telegraph your next move.


"Be extremely subtle,even to the point of formlessness. Be extremely mysterious, even to the point of soundlessness. Thereby you can be the director of the opponent's fate.
Sun Tzu:lol:


----------



## turnera

jnb, I want to save you some time and trouble. I want to tell you what at least 90%-95% of betrayed husbands do when they come here after finding out their wife cheats. It goes like this:
- Come here and say it looks suspicious but they know their wife and she would never do this!
- Upon our urging, checks phone to find contact but still gives excuses for her.
- Despite our urging to get more evidence, confronts wife and she denies, minimizes and/or shifts the blame onto the husband.
- While she's going underground and finding ways to stay in contact that the husband can't find, he starts to investigate in earnest and finds out it's worse than he thought
- Despite our advice, he does NOT expose to his wife's family, friends, and other important people; meanwhile she solidifies her relationship with the OM because now that she knows her husband knows but did NOTHING, she loses even more respect for her husband and wants the OM all the more.
- She starts telling people that her husband has been abusive, immoral, uninterested, whatever...and he has no clue because he hasn't yet contacted any of those people (and people believe the first person who tells them).
- After the wife yanks his chain for days/weeks/months and never gives up the OM, and the husband gets increasingly frustrated at nothing changing (and getting no sex from the wife because women typically only give sex to one man at a time), he comes back and again asks us what to do. We repeat: get evidence, confront, expose if she won't quit immediately, and then push swiftly for legal separation or divorce to wake her up.
- He wrings his hands some more and says 'oh, I can't do that, it'll make me look mean or crazy or spiteful (uh, duh, dude, your wife is BOINKING another man, and you worry about YOU looking bad?); he says he can't threaten divorce because that will just push her away (I hate that phrase, I've heard it so much here) and push her into OM's arms (uh, isn't she already THERE?); so he waits some more, ramps up the Nice Guy to 'prove' to her that she should choose him. She continues cheating and losing more respect for him since he's just becoming 'nicer' and weaker, and becoming more in love with the OM.
- Weeks/months later, he comes back and says nothing changed! We say, are you ready to listen to us? He says yes, I guess I have nothing to lose now.
- He tries the exposure route but by now, she's already told EVERYONE that he is a beast and she was suffering SO MUCH with him and the OM was just a friend who was there when she needed someone. And all her important people are now LOVING the OM who rescued their darling daughter/sister/friend from mean old husband. So it fails.
- She kicks him out of the house, moves OM in, gets her lawyer to get CS and alimony, and replaces him in all her life activities with the OM, while the husband pays for it.

All because he wouldn't listen to us at the beginning.


----------



## jnb150

I am still getting sex...... got a nice BJ this am


----------



## jnb150

Talking to the OMW now on FB


----------



## cool12

i hope you learn your wife has been completely honest with you.
best of luck.


----------



## jnb150

cool12 said:


> i hope you learn your wife has been completely honest with you.
> best of luck.


I need it no matter what OMW tells me


----------



## 3putt

turnera said:


> jnb, I want to save you some time and trouble. I want to tell you what at least 90%-95% of betrayed husbands do when they come here after finding out their wife cheats. It goes like this:
> - Come here and say it looks suspicious but they know their wife and she would never do this!
> - Upon our urging, checks phone to find contact but still gives excuses for her.
> - Despite our urging to get more evidence, confronts wife and she denies, minimizes and/or shifts the blame onto the husband.
> - While she's going underground and finding ways to stay in contact that the husband can't find, he starts to investigate in earnest and finds out it's worse than he thought
> - Despite our advice, he does NOT expose to his wife's family, friends, and other important people; meanwhile she solidifies her relationship with the OM because now that she knows her husband knows but did NOTHING, she loses even more respect for her husband and wants the OM all the more.
> - She starts telling people that her husband has been abusive, immoral, uninterested, whatever...and he has no clue because he hasn't yet contacted any of those people (and people believe the first person who tells them).
> - After the wife yanks his chain for days/weeks/months and never gives up the OM, and the husband gets increasingly frustrated at nothing changing (and getting no sex from the wife because women typically only give sex to one man at a time), he comes back and again asks us what to do. We repeat: get evidence, confront, expose if she won't quit immediately, and then push swiftly for legal separation or divorce to wake her up.
> - He wrings his hands some more and says 'oh, I can't do that, it'll make me look mean or crazy or spiteful (uh, duh, dude, your wife is BOINKING another man, and you worry about YOU looking bad?); he says he can't threaten divorce because that will just push her away (I hate that phrase, I've heard it so much here) and push her into OM's arms (uh, isn't she already THERE?); so he waits some more, ramps up the Nice Guy to 'prove' to her that she should choose him. She continues cheating and losing more respect for him since he's just becoming 'nicer' and weaker, and becoming more in love with the OM.
> - Weeks/months later, he comes back and says nothing changed! We say, are you ready to listen to us? He says yes, I guess I have nothing to lose now.
> - He tries the exposure route but by now, she's already told EVERYONE that he is a beast and she was suffering SO MUCH with him and the OM was just a friend who was there when she needed someone. And all her important people are now LOVING the OM who rescued their darling daughter/sister/friend from mean old husband. So it fails.
> - She kicks him out of the house, moves OM in, gets her lawyer to get CS and alimony, and replaces him in all her life activities with the OM, while the husband pays for it.
> 
> All because he wouldn't listen to us at the beginning.


Turnera, you should just go ahead and bookmark this now to repost in the future. It'll be needed again....and soon.


----------



## SadSamIAm

Just remember that this is Facebook. Could easily be the husband using his wife's account. At the very least, you should give her your cell phone number and then talk on the phone. Best to meet in person to discuss what she knows.


----------



## 3putt

jnb150 said:


> I am still getting sex...... got a nice BJ this am


Okay, this made me laugh.


----------



## jnb150

3putt said:


> Okay, this made me laugh.


It's been pretty good sex too. if it ends, At least I'm going out with a bang!


----------



## Q tip

jnb150 said:


> Should I "threaten" her that I a making contact with the OMW? Does she wanna tell me anything else before someone else does?


You're playing marbles when the game is now chess.


----------



## Q tip

jnb150 said:


> I am still getting sex...... got a nice BJ this am


Yuck, all the while knowing where it's been?


----------



## jnb150

Q tip said:


> Yuck, all the while knowing where it's been?


folks,... can't I enjoy something?


----------



## Q tip

jnb150 said:


> It's been pretty good sex too. if it ends, At least I'm going out with a bang!


Do not get her pregnant. If she does, get a DNA test.


----------



## jnb150

Q tip said:


> Do not get her pregnant. If she does, get a DNA test.


well, I think im 99% sure physical contact is stopping until she makes a choice


----------



## Q tip

If you get excuses not to meet, it's very likely not OMW.

Get a phone number, get off FB and call to meet.


----------



## jnb150

Q tip said:


> If you get excuses not to meet, it's very likely not OMW.


well my friend who contacted her said she told him that she is reluctant to talk about it...... she replied on FB when I asked if she was the correct woman. She's seen my phone # and questions. Waiting for a response.


----------



## 3putt

Q tip said:


> You're playing marbles when the game is now chess.


Let's give the guy a break. He's doing more than most do at this stage of the game.


----------



## badmemory

jnb150 said:


> Should I "threaten" her that I a making contact with the OMW? Does she wanna tell me anything else before someone else does?


No. She'll have a chance to prepare him. The only exception would be if you had perfect monitoring in place so you could catch their conversation; and with them working together that's not possible.


----------



## Q tip

PHP:







jnb150 said:


> well, I think im 99% sure physical contact is stopping until she makes a choice


Beta...

She has no right to choose. Make it for her. Re-read this entire thread. Get a lawyer, take half the money, put it in your own account. Get serious. 

Overwhelming action, not nice guy. Wake the Fvck up


----------



## Riley_Z

3putt said:


> Turnera, you should just go ahead and bookmark this now to repost in the future. It'll be needed again....and soon.


Ditto that post was brilliant.


----------



## Machiavelli

jnb150 said:


> My wife and I have been together for 8 years, married for 4.


Seven year itch is operational here.



jnb150 said:


> We've traveled the world, bought homes, survived tragedies, and overcome dealing with her parents divorce 3 days after our honeymoon. We've been through a lot and have always stuck together..... until recently.
> 
> I don't believe in infidelity, and I do believe that all marriages will work if both sides put forth an honest effort. My wife's view on these things has been clouded.
> 
> After several years of building resentment on her side,


What kind of resentment?

When did it start?

Did the "resentment" start presenting prior to her first work association with this particular AP or was it around the same time?

It is most likely that you have the cart before the horse. Usually, the adultery is getting underway at the same time the "resentment" starts up. This is because adulteresses hate cheaters. Fortunately, they have their rationalization hamster around to spin up some great rationalizations and resentments to justify every illicit climax. 



jnb150 said:


> she finally crashed at the beginning of June. I have always preached openness and honesty and she has never had an easy time expressing herself. So instead of coming to me or going for help she decided to become vulnerable with a co-worker going through a similar situation. Which culminated with them kissing in his car during lunch a few weeks back.


Yeah, well what happened in June is that OM's wife put 2+2 together. Your wife needed to inoculate you with some trickle truth in light of the possibility that OMW might contact you. "Kissing," when adults married to other people are involved, means sex. It's what adults do. It very often means kinky sex, because it's a wife's opportunity to let the slvt she usually keeps chained up in the basement run wild.



jnb150 said:


> I pulled this out of her last week and we have since gone to counseling twice, to choose which counselor we like, and we are going for a 2nd session tonight with the 1 we picked.


Unless, pulling it out of her involved a towel and a bucket of water, you don't have it all. Your counseling is probably a waste of $, unless the counselor has a lot of experience with adultery.



jnb150 said:


> I made her leave for several days, but she has since moved back in(because she felt more comfortable at home). She stopped communicating with him but has admitted that she still thinks about him.


She'll be thinking about him for at least a few more years. Forbidden sex is the best sex, especially if she gets a couple of climaxes out of it. This gives her a huge crack-like high from PEA, dopamine, norepinephrine, etc etc etc. Ordinary married sex can't compete; it's dull and she can't let the father of her children know about the inner slvt. She's like an addict and you're the guy taking away her drugs.



jnb150 said:


> Through the 4 hours of counseling that we have had, we have both begun to understand why our relationship turned sour and how we need to start fixing it. I am committed to do doing so. I admitted my faults and changed philosophies I've had my entire life right in front of her eyes because I realized they were hurting her.


Your faults probably had little to do with her "resentments." That's just the hamster talking. Give me a quick synopsis of what the "reasons" are for her adultery.



jnb150 said:


> I'm not sure what her intentions are. She said she still loves me and she's going to counseling because she doesn't want to give up on this. She has seen who I really am and feels bad for ever doubting my intentions. She does now see that I love her unconditionally even though she didn't feel like that before.


"Unconditional Love" is part of your problem. It's very counterproductive. The real reason she's going to counseling is because she wants to say she tried everything. And she does love you, just not like that. ILYBINILWY; have you heard that?



jnb150 said:


> As of now, she doesn't know what she wants. That's what I have a hard time with. I've spent more time talking to her this week, than she's spent talking to him in their whole relationship. Yet, our history, love, potential, can't outweigh a meaningless trist.


Wrong. Your history, love, and potential have already been trumped by psychobiology and the human female's drive to mate with what her limbic brain perceives to be the highest ranking male available. She has the power to override that with her prefrontal cortex, yet she chose not to. How many times did you have sex with her in the last month? Has the hysterical bonding happened?



jnb150 said:


> I've done my research and I know why she feels the way she does, but when/how does she find out what she wants?


She wants cake. You to be the Beta-Provider, other guys to be the thrill providers. It's chemical at this point.



jnb150 said:


> We still live together, we talk everyday, we eat dinner together, we sometimes sleep together, we hug and kiss each day, we still have intimate interactions. Yet, none of that opens her eyes.


Intimate interactions? How many times did she blow you since DDay without you asking?



jnb150 said:


> I have no doubt what she's experiencing with this other person was to temporarily fill a void that I wasn't. Nothing more. I know what that is now and I'm filling it! I can see the way she looks at me and cries with me. She's just so confused that she can't separate right from wrong. I know that's killing her inside.


She wants to be hot for you like she is for the other guy, but she's not. She doesn't understand why she just has no attraction to you. Why do you think she has no attraction to you?



jnb150 said:


> But how long do I wait? At what point does indecision become a decision? How can I help her see what's right?


You're the man, not her. Does she make all the decisions for your family?


----------



## turnera

jnb, the ONE THING at this point that you need to do more than ANYTHING is this: Make it very clear to her that she does NOT have your unconditional love. It's absolutely THE worst thing you can do at this point. The A#1 best way to get a cheating woman to stop cheating and to get in the right frame of mind to never cheat again is to ABSOLUTELY KNOW that if she contacts OM even ONE more time, you will be GONE GONE GONE.

There is NO PLACE for unconditional love in a relationship that has experienced infidelity. None. And if she doesn't accept that, then you'll know you are just her convenience, and you should leave her anyway.


----------



## Q tip

jnb150 said:


> well my friend who contacted her said she told him that she is reluctant to talk about it...... she replied on FB when I asked if she was the correct woman. She's seen my phone # and questions. Waiting for a response.


So, likely not OMW, just the husband... Ask her to call.


----------



## turnera

Machiavelli said:


> She wants to be hot for you like she is for the other guy, but she's not. She doesn't understand why she just has no attraction to you. Why do you think she has no attraction to you?


I'll answer: because you didn't act like a caveman when you found out and claim your property (figuratively, of course). Subconsciously, women NEED their man to be a caveman and when he isn't, they lose respect AND interest, and find a man who WILL be a caveman.

Women are hot for strong men. Not for weak men. OM was strong because he took a married woman. Read any romance novel.


----------



## Q tip

3putt said:


> Let's give the guy a break. He's doing more than most do at this stage of the game.


Ok, go back to doormat. No need for action... Geesh.


----------



## 3putt

Q tip said:


> Ok, go back to doormat. No need for action... Geesh.


What the hell do you think he's doing, dammit?? Are you even paying attention?


----------



## PhillyGuy13

jnb150 said:


> I am still getting sex...... got a nice BJ this am


do not have unprotected sex with her!! Do not her her pregnant, do not expose yourself to possible STDs

Some wayward wives use an increase in sex to throw their clueless husbands off the scent. Still others skip a birth control pill or two, to entrap a husband who is considering leaving.

Protect yourself. Use your right hand if need be. Bored? Switch to left.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## jnb150

my friend talked to OMW. more than kissing happened and for longer than a month. confront her tonight about it?


----------



## tom67

I hope she calls you back so you are sure it is in fact her and not hubs.
As a precaution you may want to get tested for STDs.


----------



## Q tip

3putt said:


> What the hell do you think he's doing, dammit?? Are you even paying attention?


The message is to give him a break and I disagree. This is a huge jump for the poor guy and needs to understand. 

Tunera says go caveman - pretty sums it up. He's in need of change for the better. MMSLP is a huge recommend for him. 
There is no time to give him a break, He needs to keep the pressure on WW, POSOM which he's never done before, 

He can't nice his way to resolution. It's a huge amount for him to absorb which is why he's here. If at all possible, he needs to meet and work with OmW!. That would be an excellent source of Intel for the both of them. If she's hesitant, he simply cannot nice his way over. He needs to stand up, defend his marriage with the right actions and plans. That's why he's here.


----------



## tom67

jnb150 said:


> my friend talked to OMW. more than kissing happened and for longer than a month. confront her tonight about it?


I suggest no try to meet up with omw and get it from her.
But it's your call.


----------



## turnera

jnb150 said:


> my friend talked to OMW. more than kissing happened and for longer than a month. confront her tonight about it?


What's your goal? Do you want her to stop and be remorseful and commit to you?

If so, you first need evidence, which you are going to offer to send to her parents/siblings if she refuses to quit once you confront. Ask the OMW if she has any evidence. If not, find another way to get evidence.


----------



## jnb150

turnera said:


> What's your goal? Do you want her to stop and be remorseful and commit to you?
> 
> If so, you first need evidence, which you are going to offer to send to her parents/siblings if she refuses to quit once you confront. Ask the OMW if she has any evidence. If not, find another way to get evidence.


I just want something real from her


----------



## Q tip

jnb150 said:


> my friend talked to OMW. more than kissing happened and for longer than a month. confront her tonight about it?


Nope. Meet up with her. This is third party info. Could be a setup and politics at the office. You need to meet for coffee. Trust very little for third parties. If so hesitant, why not hesitant with this friend.


----------



## jnb150

Q tip said:


> Nope. Meet up with her. This is third party info. Could be a setup and politics at the office. You need to meet for coffee. Trust very little for third parties. If so hesitant, why not hesitant with this friend.


he's my brother


----------



## 3putt

Q tip said:


> The message is to give him a break and I disagree. This is a huge jump for the poor guy and needs to understand.
> 
> Tunera says go caveman - pretty sums it up. He's in need of change for the better. MMSLP is a huge recommend for him.
> There is no time to give him a break, He needs to keep the pressure on WW, POSOM which he's never done before,
> 
> He can't nice his way to resolution. It's a huge amount for him to absorb which is why he's here. If at all possible, he needs to meet and work with OmW!. That would be an excellent source of Intel for the both of them. If she's hesitant, he simply cannot nice his way over. He needs to stand up, defend his marriage with the right actions and plans. That's why he's here.


And he's doing it right now. He's already found out more in half a day than most find out in a week. Sheez.


----------



## PhillyGuy13

jnb150 said:


> my friend talked to OMW. more than kissing happened and for longer than a month. confront her tonight about it?


You really need to meet up and get ALL the fact straight before you confront. If it helps ask your friend to come along too.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Machiavelli

jnb150 said:


> folks,... can't I enjoy something?


Sure you can. If you've been getting it a lot, it's probably HB.


----------



## tom67

jnb150 said:


> he's my brother


Well that's a horse of a different color.
Why the heck can't she just meet up with you I don't get it.


----------



## Q tip

She is a liar and a cheater. Plan first. If D or R -- get Half your money I to separate accounts, set your affairs, see a lawyer plan first. Go dark. Don't let her know a thing. Not a hint of a plan.

Have her served to get her attention, you do not need to complete the D. You can cancel anytime. If she shows remorse, your choice to R not hers. Take power back and keep it. 

See a lawyer. Check your options. Go dark. Do the 180.


----------



## 3putt

Machiavelli said:


> Sure you can. If you've been getting it a lot, it's probably HB.


And likely to get a lot more hysterical, if he chooses.


----------



## jnb150

tom67 said:


> Well that's a horse of a different color.
> Why the heck can't she just meet up with you I don't get it.


shes calling me soon. ill approach the subject on the phone


----------



## Q tip

jnb150 said:


> shes calling me soon. ill approach the subject on the phone


Excellent. Let her do most of the talkin. Intel is important. Ask is she has a timeline.


----------



## turnera

jnb150 said:


> I just want something real from her


jnb, it's too late for that. You won't get it, not while she is in the throes of her addiction to OM. Yes, it IS an addiction. To the high she feels by getting forbidden fruit, the high from sneaking and lying, the thrill of the sex that she can't tell anyone about, like living in a spy novel.

Right now, you are THE ENEMY. You are the person who she knows is right but she doesn't want to hear it. So you aren't going to get ANY real from her. Not until you get evidence, confront, then expose when she won't quit or takes it underground, and then wait for the affair fog to wear off if she does end up dumping OM.

Even if she really HAS given him up, he's still filling her head, her thoughts, and her mind. You have a lot of work to do before she'll ever shift her gaze back around to you.


----------



## tom67

Q tip said:


> Excellent. Let her do most of the talkin. Intel is important. Ask is she has a timeline.


And thank your brother for his help.


----------



## tom67

turnera said:


> jnb, it's too late for that. You won't get it, not while she is in the throes of her addiction to OM. Yes, it IS an addiction. To the high she feels by getting forbidden fruit, the high from sneaking and lying, the thrill of the sex that she can't tell anyone about, like living in a spy novel.
> 
> Right now, you are THE ENEMY. You are the person who she knows is right but she doesn't want to hear it. So you aren't going to get ANY real from her. Not until you get evidence, confront, then expose when she won't quit or takes it underground, and then wait for the affair fog to wear off if she does end up dumping OM.
> 
> Even if she really HAS given him up, he's still filling her head, her thoughts, and her mind. You have a lot of work to do before she'll ever shift her gaze back around to you.


When you get the info you then expose to family/friends.
Then confront her.


----------



## bandit.45

Expose first then confront. Sounds bass ackwards but it works better that way.


----------



## 3putt

bandit.45 said:


> Expose first then confront. Sounds bass ackwards but it works better that way.


I _usually_ subscribe to confront, then expose, but since she had her chance to come clean and still lied (minimized)?...................

I agree.


----------



## Machiavelli

JNB, get the timeline from OMW. Blow by blow account. Then remember that OMW still doesn't have the whole story. There will still be more.


----------



## Riley_Z

tom67 said:


> I hope she calls you back so you are sure it is in fact her and not hubs.
> As a precaution you may want to get tested for STDs.


I was just wondering if that was suggested yet.

I guess it hasn't.


----------



## cool12

jnb150 said:


> shes calling me soon. ill approach the subject on the phone



oh man, i'm so sorry. 
that your wife didn't come completely clean when she had the chance is not a good sign. 
try to stay calm when talking to OMW and don't make any snap decisions. there are lots of people here that can help you navigate the world of pain you're about to be in.


----------



## intuitionoramiwrong

Hang in there man..keep posting, you'll get through this.


----------



## Hicks

Just get out of the mode of you are responsible to fix things.

Right now gather facts and think about what you want to do.

Fact: She cheated.
Fact: You will probably find out the extent of it
Fact: You need to find out about continued contact.
Fact: She lied.
Fact: SHe doesn't know what she wants.

Your problem is rushing to solution as if you can fix every situation in life.

Most of the affair marriages recover when the betrayed does not engage at any real level with the wayward, other than to remind them of what they can do to possibly gain their marriage back. All the while moving toward divorce while watching if she ever does any of it.

Example: Wife, whenever you stop lying, I can think about our future.


----------



## tom67

Hicks said:


> Just get out of the mode of you are responsible to fix things.
> 
> Right now gather facts and think about what you want to do.
> 
> Fact: She cheated.
> Fact: You will probably find out the extent of it
> Fact: You need to find out about continued contact.
> Fact: She lied.
> Fact: SHe doesn't know what she wants.
> 
> Your problem is rushing to solution as if you can fix every situation in life.
> 
> Most of the affair marriages recover when the betrayed does not engage at any real level with the wayward, other than to remind them of what they can do to possibly gain their marriage back. All the while moving toward divorce while watching if she ever does any of it.
> 
> Example: Wife, whenever you stop lying, I can think about our future.


She is on your timeline now.
Take your time.


----------



## bandit.45

cool12 said:


> oh man, i'm so sorry.
> that your wife didn't come completely clean when she had the chance is not a good sign.
> try to stay calm when talking to OMW and don't make any snap decisions. there are lots of people here that can help you navigate the world of pain you're about to be in.


Agreed. Do nothing until you talk to us first.


----------



## mahike

jnb150 Sorry you are here my friend and I am sorry there was more then you thought.

Stay calm and check in with us there is more to the playbook and you will need help processing what you find out


----------



## italianjob

Gather all the information you can, but don't confront her now. Don't even let her have a clue about what you're doing.
You need to digest what you learned and plan your next steps.
Protect yourself financially and legally, and be prepared for any outcome.
When you'll be ready, file for D, you can Always stop proceedings if you should decide to try and R (if no children are involved you might want to really think this through).
She must know as little as possible about what you're up to until she gets served.


----------



## Riley_Z

jnb150 said:


> I just want something real from her


You need to get real on your own.

You're dealing with a liar and a cheat.

The last thing you're gonna get is "real" from her.


----------



## Riley_Z

jnb150 said:


> shes calling me soon. ill approach the subject on the phone


You cannot do this on the phone.

You need to be able to see her body language!!!

It's much easier to lie to you over the phone.

Sorry, but you need to get wise fast and stop using the phone to negotiate this.


----------



## Squeakr

Riley_Z said:


> You cannot do this on the phone.
> 
> You need to be able to see her body language!!!
> 
> It's much easier to lie to you over the phone.
> 
> Sorry, but you need to get wise fast and stop using the phone to negotiate this.


He is talking about the OM's wife calling!. I and many have done this call and there is nothing wrong with it. If they want to lie to me, they have no good reason to, as I already have enough proof, just want more pieces of the puzzle.


----------



## TRy

jnb150 said:


> my friend talked to OMW. more than kissing happened and for longer than a month.


 Most posting here were telling you to expect this, so you should not be surprised to learn this. The fact that, contrary to your wife's assurances otherwise, it was more than just kissing, and more than just once, confirms that your wife is lying and is following the cheaters script to a tee. This also confirms that most of the posters here knew what they were talking about and were not saying these things just to be harsh and to hurt you. Really, we were just giving you the bad news to help you.


----------



## tom67

TRy said:


> Most posting here were telling you to expect this, so you should not be surprised to learn this. The fact that, contrary to what your wife's assurance, it was more than just kissing, and more than just once, confirms that your wife is lying and is following the cheaters script to a tee. This also confirms that most of the posters here knew what they were talking about and were not saying these things just to be harsh and to hurt you. Really we were giving you the bad news to help you.


He came around pretty quick after his sister pretty much agreed with most of us.


----------



## Squeakr

TRy said:


> Most posting here were telling you to expect this, so you should not be surprised to learn this. The fact that, contrary to your wife's assurances otherwise, it was more than just kissing, and more than just once, confirms that your wife is lying and is following the cheaters script to a tee. This also confirms that most of the posters here knew what they were talking about and were not saying these things just to be harsh and to hurt you. *Really we were giving you the bad news to help yo*u.



:iagree::iagree::iagree: QFT. The bolded part is what hurts more than anything. You learned it from someone other than her. She is the one that you trusted everything with, and she ripped out your heart and kicked it to the curb. Then when she did release some truths, they were half truths.


----------



## Q tip

tom67 said:


> He came around pretty quick after his sister pretty much agreed with most of us.


OP. I know your entire world is completely spinning. Folks here can help now that you're absolutely focused. 

A plan and strategy is important and most difficult is not telling your WW about your plans. Not a hint. Her mind and heart is elsewhere and she sees you as the issue, not her infidelity. Chemical/hormone highs are the reason.

Hang in there. Keep faith in yourself. Stay cool. Go dark. Review the 180. 

Post your thoughts.


----------



## mahike

Man this is killing me we all know how he is feeling right now. Buddy we are all there for you

His first instinct will be to react. let us know how you are doing


----------



## Plan 9 from OS

turnera said:


> jnb, the ONE THING at this point that you need to do more than ANYTHING is this: Make it very clear to her that she does NOT have your unconditional love. It's absolutely THE worst thing you can do at this point. The A#1 best way to get a cheating woman to stop cheating and to get in the right frame of mind to never cheat again is to ABSOLUTELY KNOW that if she contacts OM even ONE more time, you will be GONE GONE GONE.
> 
> *There is NO PLACE for unconditional love in a relationship that has experienced infidelity. *None. And if she doesn't accept that, then you'll know you are just her convenience, and you should leave her anyway.


IMHO, I'd say that extends to all marriages regardless of the condition it is in. The only relationships that I think can be unconditional is parent-child. All the others will have some boundary that - if crossed - will destroy the relationship.


----------



## TimeHeals

I haven't commented on this thread, but I am going to break my silence long enough to levy one bit of constructive criticism:

The title of this thread is misleading.


First, there is an order of events problem. If your wife is confused (and I am not saying she is), then it obviously happened before the cheating and not afterward. One might (falsely) offer "She must have been confused about whether or not she was MARRIED", for example.

Second, it is infinitely more likely that if your wife was confused about anything it was about how long she could continue to string you along and ignore possible consequences for her behavior without expecting to experience real consequences.

Put yourself in her shoes. Let's say you met some sexy young thing that does swimsuit modeling when she's not training for the Olympic gymnastic team, she comes on to you, you are flattered, and then you do something else: you decide your wife and family aren't as important as you getting what you want from this new woman. How others are affected is unimportant to you. You don't even contemplate consequences beyond that, and if anybody else gets hurt, that's their problem, right?

Now let's say your wife discovers you are having an affair or she badgers you until you admit that you are having an affair. What is likely to follow? Divorce, changing residences, custody arrangements, and so on.

What would be better than these consequences? Oh, just contrinue doing what you are doing, so you tell your wife, "I am confused. I need to think about things". That would be fantastic. You are the center of everybody's universe. Aren't you special?

It's just a lie. The title reveals you buying into a sucker's ruse.


----------



## PhillyGuy13

Sigh.

The guy's doing best he can today. Thread titles are the least of his worries.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## tom67

PhillyGuy13 said:


> Sigh.
> 
> The guy's doing best he can today. Thread titles are the least of his worries.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


:iagree:
If you can hang with your brother or sister tonight do it.
You need some support right now vent to them and vent to us we can take it.


----------



## TRy

TimeHeals said:


> It's just a lie. The title reveals you buying into a sucker's ruse.


 A lot has happened since he started this thread, and he appears to be a quick study.


----------



## MattMatt

Growapair said:


> You are handling this entire thing the wrong way!
> 
> You need a plan. I will try to help you out. Wake up in the middle of the night tonight while she is still asleep; make sure she’s in deep sleep. Slowly walk towards her purse, carefully open it up, unzip the side pocket on the inside of the purse and gently remove your testicles from her purse before she wakes up. Sheesh!
> 
> You’re using euphemisms to excuse her cheating. Saying things like “I know she cheated to fill a void” or “it was my fault, I wasn’t a good husband”. The truth is, she cheated because she was probably horny and thought you would not find out.
> 
> Oh, she just kissed him huh? This isn’t high school son, Cheating adults in a car in the parking lot, don’t just kiss! Search the threads about trick truth!
> 
> The fact that you just found out she has betrayed you and lied to you, yet you’re the one begging to make it work shows her that you are a wimp and that you have no problem being the backup option.
> 
> Get this through your head, she cheated on you because you’re probably less desirable to her than the other guy. You need to put your foot down and respect yourself. She is in no position to be dictating to you how this marriage will work. You need to be setting the rules as to how you move forward from here on. Only then will she respect you as a man.


_"She probably cheated because she was horny?"_

My God! How old are you? 15?

Cheating because people are "horny" is really only a small part of the reasons why people cheat.


----------



## Riley_Z

TimeHeals said:


> First, there is an order of events problem. If your wife is confused (and I am not saying she is), then it obviously happened before the cheating and not afterward. One might (falsely) offer "She must have been confused about whether or not she was MARRIED", for example.
> 
> Second, it is infinitely more likely that if your wife was confused about anything it was about how long she could continue to string you along and ignore possible consequences for her behavior without expecting to experience real consequences.


I would actually argue that infidelity creates confusion in the brain. When you focus your love on only your spouse things are pretty crystal clear. If you allow another man to tresspass into your brain, then confusion sets in... who should you be focussing on... who ought you give your love to, who loves you more... etc

The answer to most educated outsiders is obvoius, but to the cheater, they have a problem.

It's like ordering two meals at a restaurant for yourself at the same time.

Once they are sitting in front of you, you have a conflict of which to enjoy knowing you won't have a place for the other meal.

Inviting a third party into your marriage creates a lot of confusion.

If she's confused, it's on her for cheating in the first place.


----------



## OldWolf57

J, OMW caught them. She did not confess out of guilt. remember that !!
So from here in, anything she say is for her benefit, not yours.

As for the omw, just tell her your ww confessed to kissing in the car, but you feel there is there is much more to this, and want to hear what she knows.
Good Luck my man.


----------



## warlock07

OMW might be scared. 

She might be worried if OP(unknown entity for her)he might get violent with her H or might destroy OM's career and ruin them financially.

So she might be wary about meeting him


----------



## Q tip

warlock07 said:


> OMW might be scared.
> 
> She might be worried if OP(unknown entity for her)he might get violent with her H or might destroy OM's career and ruin them financially.
> 
> So she might be wary about meeting him


All possibly very much true. He needs to sell a plan, collaborate, see where she's at and get her to compare notes for both their sakes. Intel is so important. Coffee in a safe place will help her or she could bring a trusted friend along too.

It's up to him to convince her it is for both their good to compare notes and communicate frequently per their agreement.


----------



## Chaparral

warlock07 said:


> OMW might be scared.
> 
> She might be worried if OP(unknown entity for her)he might get violent with her H or might destroy OM's career and ruin them financially.
> 
> So she might be wary about meeting him


This, the Posom may be lying to your wife about them getting a divorce. Many men use this line to string along a woman and have no intention of breaking up their own home.

Many cheating spouses lie to their mate to keep their spouse from contacting the other betrayed spouse.

The golden rule is everything both cheaters say has to be independently verified. Trust but verify.............every word.

He hasn't posted in a while, looks bad.


----------



## PhillyGuy13

Hopefully he is out, with his brother grabbing dinner and a beer or three.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Riley_Z

PhillyGuy13 said:


> Hopefully he is out, with his brother grabbing dinner and a beer or three.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Maybe they are out moving a very heavy carpet into the river. lol


----------



## weightlifter

More than kissing = full sex?

Yes or no. Don't need a play by play.

Ugh. Same old same old. Believe it or not. I would love to be wrong for once.


----------



## SongoftheSouth

PhillyGuy13 said:


> Hopefully he is out, with his brother grabbing dinner and a beer or three.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Just read this - what a mess. Yeah go down a few and then pummel this scumbag. I really don't understand people anymore


----------



## 3putt

SongoftheSouth said:


> Just read this - what a mess. Yeah go down a few and then pummel this scumbag. I really don't understand people anymore


Look up levity. Happens all the time around here when things are at this stage.


----------



## Riley_Z

SongoftheSouth said:


> Just read this - what a mess. Yeah go down a few and then pummel this scumbag. I really don't understand people anymore


You don't think he has it coming?


----------



## PhillyGuy13

All I meant was I hope he was out with his brother or friend or whoever trying to decompress a bit after a hellish day for him. Wasn't my intent to imply he was going to do anything he'd regret.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## 3putt

SongoftheSouth said:


> Just read this - what a mess. Yeah go down a few and then pummel this scumbag. I really don't understand people anymore





3putt said:


> Look up levity. Happens all the time around here when things are at this stage.


Wait, did I miss sarcasm in SOTS's post? LOL....been a helluva day.


----------



## 6301

jnb150 said:


> I am still getting sex...... got a nice BJ this am


 I'm sure you are. No doubt she's giving everything she has but there's a reason for it. 

The better the sex she gives the better the chance that you'll stop snooping and rug sweep this mess and as far as he feels, all will be well for her.

Boy, the power of the vagina.


----------



## helolover

jnb150 said:


> him and his wife are supposedly getting divorced.... their marriage was ruined a long time ago and this broke the camels back(from what I was told).... so he has nothing to lose. My wife did tell him to stop contacting her last week when she told me she cheated



My adulterous Xwife always said the same thing - That she told him to stop contacting her. They never stopped contact.

Lies.


----------



## weightlifter

6301 said:


> Boy, the power of the vagina.


The most powerful weapon on earth is the well wielded vagina.


----------



## happyman64

Maybe he is just going out with a bang?

Or

He is listening to his WW backpedal as fast as she can and lying her ass off......

Time will tell.


----------



## Riley_Z

6301 said:


> Boy, the power of the vagina.


I didn't realize they had that much power... we women are so naive. lol


----------



## aug

Riley_Z said:


> I didn't realize they had that much power... we women are so naive. lol


Well, only if it's functioning, well lubed and packaged nicely.


----------



## bandit.45

aug said:


> Well, only if it's functioning, well lubed and packaged nicely.


And not smelly.


----------



## the guy

jnb150 said:


> I just want something real from her


Don't we all!!!!!

Our chicks screwed us over...after that kind of crap its really really hard to get something real again......but it does happen...it happened to me and my old lady.

The phucked up thing is your old lady has a hell of a lot of heavy lifting to do, and being around the coworker is not helping.

Your old lady has to get away from the things that got her in this mess...and from were I'm sitting her work is the catilist for screwing around.

With out consequences bad behavior continues!!!!

Your old lady should loss her job for sh1tting were she eats.

But then again she ain't going to do a phucking thing cuz she has your number.

Your old lady will get unconfused really fast when she sees your not plan B...Your old lady needs to see a confident guy that won't share his wife.

Hell, just let her go...it might save your marriage!


----------



## tom67

Hmm...
Spidey sense just wondering


----------



## barbados

bandit.45 said:


> And not smelly.


If it smells like fish, have a dish

If its smells like perfume, leave the room ! LOL


----------



## tom67

barbados said:


> If it smells like fish, have a dish
> 
> If its smells like perfume, leave the room ! LOL


:rofl::rofl:


----------



## CuddleBug

barbados said:


> If it smells like fish, have a dish
> 
> If its smells like perfume, leave the room ! LOL



That's awesome and made my night.:lol::rofl:


----------



## tom67

CuddleBug said:


> That's awesome and made my night.:lol::rofl:


Who has more fun than people.:lol:


----------



## CuddleBug

turnera said:


> jnb, the ONE THING at this point that you need to do more than ANYTHING is this: Make it very clear to her that she does NOT have your unconditional love. It's absolutely THE worst thing you can do at this point. The A#1 best way to get a cheating woman to stop cheating and to get in the right frame of mind to never cheat again is to ABSOLUTELY KNOW that if she contacts OM even ONE more time, you will be GONE GONE GONE.
> 
> There is NO PLACE for unconditional love in a relationship that has experienced infidelity. None. And if she doesn't accept that, then you'll know you are just her convenience, and you should leave her anyway.



Brilliant.:smthumbup::smthumbup:


----------



## TRy

jnb150 said:


> shes calling me soon. ill approach the subject on the phone


 The OP posted 33 times in 6 1/2 hours and then goes dark for over 14 hours and counting after talking to the other man's wife. He must have learned that what started out as they only kissed once, and have since cut off all contact even though they work together, was far worse then he ever expected. I hope that the OP is OK.


----------



## PhillyGuy13

I'm hoping he reports back soon. Short of losing a child, this is probably the worst news someone can receive. His head could be spinning a thousand miles an hour, he may not even be thinking right now to report back in to an anonymous Internet forum.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## bandit.45

barbados said:


> If it smells like fish, have a dish
> 
> If its smells like perfume, leave the room ! LOL


You need help.


----------



## alphaomega

I just went through the stages of wanting to help the OP, down through annoyance right into pity.

Op, I'm going to call you Beta Man. No disrespect, but you seem to have a great knack of coming up with an excuse not to do anything, and toss everyone's advice out the window.

Who can honestly respect a man that has no self respect for himself? That's where your headed. Right past pity to the bottom of the pit where apathy hangs out, usually with the OM.


----------



## Growapair

MattMatt said:


> _"She probably cheated because she was horny?"_
> 
> My God! How old are you? 15?
> 
> *Cheating because people are "horny" is really only a small part of the reasons why people cheat.*


Oh, so it is still a part of the reasons why people cheat? :scratchhead:

So you mock me for presenting a theory, and in the very next sentence, you state that my theory is possible in this case! God I hope you're not an attorney. 

Some people do cheat because they are horny at a time when the opportunity is presented. 

Unless you have evidence that this was not case with OP's wife, you cant refute my statement that "she was PROBABLY horny." emphasis on the "probably".

And, oh I almost forgot, No I'm not 15.


----------



## Hicks

bandit.45 said:


> And not smelly.


I thought that was the power emanating.


----------



## BetrayedDad

Machiavelli said:


> It is most likely that you have the cart before the horse. Usually, the adultery is getting underway at the same time the "resentment" starts up. This is because adulteresses hate cheaters. Fortunately, they have their rationalization hamster around to spin up some great rationalizations and resentments to justify every illicit climax.


Brilliant insight.... A very often overlooked and important point.


----------



## Riley_Z

Growapair said:


> Oh, so it is still a part of the reasons why people cheat? :scratchhead:
> 
> So you mock me for presenting a theory, and in the very next sentence, you state that my theory is possible in this case! God I hope you're not an attorney.
> 
> Some people do cheat because they are horny at a time when the opportunity is presented.
> 
> Unless you have evidence that this was not case with OP's wife, you cant refute my statement that "she was PROBABLY horny." emphasis on the "probably".
> 
> And, oh I almost forgot, No I'm not 15.


I think we are confusing the term "reason" with "motive"

Sexual appetite may be a motive to cheat, but it's not a reason.

A reason has to be reasoned. From the mind, not from between your legs.

Any idea that is derived from between your legs is not a "reason."


----------



## 10th Engineer Harrison

Machiavelli said:


> Ordinary married sex can't compete; it's dull and she can't let the father of her children know about the inner slvt. She's like an addict and you're the guy taking away her drugs.


I don't remember him saying that they had kids. If they don't, I'd run screaming from this marriage and never look back.



> "Unconditional Love" is part of your problem. It's very counterproductive. The real reason she's going to counseling is because she wants to say she tried everything. And she does love you, just not like that. ILYBINILWY; have you heard that?


This is true because most people, especially in the throes of an affair or dealing with one, don't know what it is. Worse, they think they do. It's the misapplication of the concept that's counterproductive, not the concept

-ol' 2long


----------



## PhillyGuy13

2long said:


> I don't remember him saying that they had kids. If they don't, I'd run screaming from this marriage and never look back.
> 
> -ol' 2long


Word.

With no children in the picture, I personally see no reason to ever reconcile where there has been infidelity. 

Perhaps if lotto winnings or 7-figure inheritances were involved. Otherwise no.

for those DINKS on here that have, I'm glad it's worked out for you.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Machiavelli

barbados said:


> If it smells like fish, have a dish
> 
> If its smells like perfume, leave the room ! LOL


I saw a guy wearing a t shirt for a seafood joint that said:

If it smells like fish, eat it!


----------



## Machiavelli

2long said:


> I don't remember him saying that they had kids. If they don't, I'd run screaming from this marriage and never look back.





PhillyGuy13 said:


> Word.
> 
> With no children in the picture, I personally see no reason to ever reconcile where there has been infidelity.


Agreed. I'm sure there is an exception somewhere out there, but you really can't go wrong with a hard and fast rule: no kids, no R.


----------



## tom67

Machiavelli said:


> Agreed. I'm sure there is an exception somewhere out there, but you really can't go wrong with a hard and fast rule: no kids, no R.


:iagree::iagree:


----------



## BetrayedDad

Machiavelli said:


> Agreed. I'm sure there is an exception somewhere out there, but you really can't go wrong with a hard and fast rule: no kids, no R.


Add to that:

Serial cheat, no R.

Knocked up OW or WW, no R.

No remorse, no R.

Those should be pretty much mandatory.


----------



## Graywolf2

Outstanding post Machiavelli but this part made me LOL!



Machiavelli said:


> . Unless, pulling it out of her involved a towel and a bucket of water, you don't have it all.


:rofl::rofl::rofl:


----------



## LongWalk

BetrayedDad said:


> Add to that:
> 
> Serial cheat, no R.
> 
> Knocked up OW or WW, no R.
> 
> No remorse, no R.
> 
> Those should be pretty much mandatory.


Part of the problem is that partial remorse is like slippery eel. The difference between delicious eel for dinner and eel gone back into sea all happens in a moment.

Racer, Harken Banks, HardtoDetach, Road Scholar and other good men are struggling with this eel.


----------



## Clay2013

I personally find it hard to recommend ever staying with a cheater. I know I am biased and its because I am still suffering from things that happened to me in my past but I really feel the success rate of R is like 5%. I also understand as a BS were did not get the same advantage to pull back our feelings our WS's did so it makes it extremely hard just to walk away. 

I feel horrible for the BS's. Its almost sometimes like reliving the same experience all over again. 

Clay


----------



## itom72

What happened to the BS?

Hopefully that acronym doesn't have a twofold meaning.


----------



## tom67

itom72 said:


> What happened to the BS?
> 
> Hopefully that acronym doesn't have a twofold meaning.


Good question.:scratchhead:


----------



## pidge70

I'm thinking it does.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## BetrayedDad

Give him a chance. If he's legit then at this moment his world is being flipped upside down. We're probably the last thing on his mind right now. Hopefully, when things settle down he comes back to update us.


----------



## nuclearnightmare

OP

if you love her "unconditionally" - that may be a big part of the problem. stop that!
there is nothing noble about loving a spouse without conditions (e.g. that it is returned). it only makes you very vulnerable to exploitation, humiliation etc. at their hands. Love for one's children is unconditional. not the spouse. Not ever


----------



## treyvion

helolover said:


> My adulterous Xwife always said the same thing - That she told him to stop contacting her. They never stopped contact.
> 
> Lies.


Wow, she told you what you needed to hear.


----------



## treyvion

Machiavelli said:


> I saw a guy wearing a t shirt for a seafood joint that said:
> 
> If it smells like fish, eat it!


Aww, man, that stinks:iagree:


----------



## 10th Engineer Harrison

nuclearnightmare said:


> OP
> 
> if you love her "unconditionally" - that may be a big part of the problem. stop that!
> there is nothing noble about loving a spouse without conditions (e.g. that it is returned). it only makes you very vulnerable to exploitation, humiliation etc. at their hands. Love for one's children is unconditional. not the spouse. Not ever


This is incorrect. But not why you might think.

Marriage is a contract 2 love one another. Obviously contracts are conditional on the partners holding up their end of the bargain. But there's no reason you can't love your spouse unconditionally at the same time you love them romantically and within the confines of an exclusive marital relationship.

Where people get in2 trouble, of course, is exactly what you describe. One spouse takes advantage of the other's fairyland conception of what unconditional love means and exploit them with it. Obviously (I certainly hope), using people isn't unconditional anything. Nor is allowing one's self 2 be used.

-ol' 2long


----------



## Riley_Z

2long said:


> This is incorrect. But not why you might think.
> 
> Marriage is a contract 2 love one another. Obviously contracts are conditional on the partners holding up their end of the bargain. But there's no reason you can't love your spouse unconditionally at the same time you love them romantically and within the confines of an exclusive marital relationship.
> 
> Where people get in2 trouble, of course, is exactly what you describe. One spouse takes advantage of the other's fairyland conception of what unconditional love means and exploit them with it. Obviously (I certainly hope), using people isn't unconditional anything. Nor is allowing one's self 2 be used.
> 
> -ol' 2long


I am not following...

If you love them unconditionally, then there's no contract, rules, or conditions on it.


----------



## SongoftheSouth

Reading stuff like this makes my blood boil - JNB your situation stinks. I couldn't blame you if you introduced your fists to this guys face. Bet this scumbag has done crap like this before. People like this piss me off


----------



## ariel_angel77

I'm so sorry this is happening jnb, I noticed that the last time you updated you were going to talk to the OMW. I really hope that went well. Worried about ya. Hope you are okay. I can't imagine or grasp the pain you must be going through.


----------



## Dyokemm

I think that OMW revealed that this was A LOT worse than he had been led to believe by his WW.

His world is probably in total chaos right now.

It seems probable on the timeline his WW provided that the A only stopped cause OMW discovered several weeks ago, and OP's WW was hoping to spin a story for her BH to protect both OM and herself from his anger at the betrayal.


----------



## ire8179

This OM sounds like a pathetic coward loser, he said that his married is already in bad condition anyway so instead of fixing it or divorce his solution is to lie to his wife and have an affair with MW ?  (i wish there's a throw up smiley here)


----------



## SongoftheSouth

ire8179 said:


> This OM sounds like a pathetic coward loser, he said that his married is already in bad condition anyway so instead of fixing it or divorce his solution is to lie to his wife and have an affair with MW ?  (i wish there's a throw up smiley here)


100% correct: pathetic; coward; loser - Hope JNB uses this scumbags face as a punching bag


----------



## lordmayhem

BetrayedDad said:


> Give him a chance. If he's legit then at this moment his world is being flipped upside down. We're probably the last thing on his mind right now. Hopefully, when things settle down he comes back to update us.


:iagree:

This long without an update is usually bad news, otherwise, he would have been back right away to confirm that what his WW said was true: that it was only a kiss. 

But we all know what trickle truth is and how much they lie. There are threads and threads on here about WW's who only claimed it was a kiss/kissing. As if they are in high school or something. 

I think the most unbelievable one I've ever read here was the story where the WW told her BH, that she was in a bathroom stall with OM, that he was already inside her, she decided she didn't want to go through with it and told him to pull out and he did. Yeah, right.


----------



## Chaparral

His wife didn't initially tell him who the om was because she was afraid of what he would do. Now he may be missing in action, hope he's ok even if the om is not.


----------



## 10th Engineer Harrison

Riley_Z said:


> I am not following...
> 
> If you love them unconditionally, then there's no contract, rules, or conditions on it.


From Dr Guy Pettit:

"Unconditional love is enlarging the self, and an act of will. It is not a feeling or an emotional reaction. Think of the difference between falling in love, and growing in love through all difficulties and conflicts. Unconditional love is an act of mental and spiritual will, it cannot and does not take place upon the emotional level, which is where the problems first register. Unconditional love is extending oneself in the service of the spiritual growth of oneself and/or another, independently of reward or the behavior of others."

and:

" To truly love in this way could include:

· To call forth a sense of responsibility, and a capacity to make wise choices.

· To point out weaknesses people have, - but very caringly so that the best in the person is drawn forth in response, rather than resistance.

· To challenge people to strive and attain, and discover their true selves..

· To help people work on their habits and weaknesses so that they become stronger. To show them how to use their will correctly.

· To help people learn to cooperate, and thus to overcome their little egos.

· To engage people in working for humanity.

· To teach people how to overcome their prejudices, resentments, separative tendencies, vanities, illusions, and other blocks to their own joy.

To truly love in this way does NOT mean:

· To surrender to weakness.

· To accept things that are harmful.

· To encourage weakness or irresponsibility.

· To accept dirt or ugliness in thought, feeling or action.

· To exploit or use people.

· To put people into sleep.

· To tolerate laziness."

So, no contract 2 love unconditionally, yes. But not incompatible with loving conditionally within a marriage.

Sorry for the T/J, folks.

-ol' 2long


----------



## Riley_Z

Ok, so how is this not conditional if this is the expectation?

Looks like a lot of conditions to me!


----------



## mahike

yep I am really getting worried about this guy. I hope his brother is there for him and his family

We all know that the discussion with this pos om's wife did not go well and she told him things he did not believe or did not want to believe.

I really hope he is safe and not safe like locked up in a cell


----------



## tom67

mahike said:


> yep I am really getting worried about this guy. I hope his brother is there for him and his family
> 
> We all know that the discussion with this pos om's wife did not go well and she told him things he did not believe or did not want to believe.
> 
> I really hope he is safe and not safe like locked up in a cell


:iagree::iagree::iagree::iagree:


----------



## 10th Engineer Harrison

Riley_Z said:


> Ok, so how is this not conditional if this is the expectation?
> 
> Looks like a lot of conditions to me!


What expectation?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## carmen ohio

jnb150 said:


> my friend talked to OMW. more than kissing happened and for longer than a month. confront her tonight about it?


Dear jbn150,

Here's the score:

- Your W is a cheater and a liar.

- Worse, instead of being overcome with remorse and begging for a second chance, shes' stonewalling you because "she doesn't know what she wants."

- This is a crock, of course; she knows what she wants -- the freedom to mess around with other guys _and_ the security of a beta husband to come home when she's done fooling around.

- It is very difficult to repair a marriage tainted by infidelity when the WS is remorseful; it is impossible when the WS is not.

- You have no children and therefore nothing to keep you in this marriage (other than your 8 year "investment" which she has chosen to flush down the toilet, your emotional attachment and your fear of the future -- none of which are good reasons for staying).

- No man who has his wits about him should want to have children with a woman he can't trust to be faithful.

Given these facts, your best course of action is to take PhillyGuy13's advice and divorce her. Despite how painful ending your marriage now and starting over will be, consider how much more difficult a spot you will be in if you patch things up with her, have children and then she cheats again.

Don't fall victim to the sunken cost fallacy, your emotions or your fears. You're still young. Get out now and then look for someone you can trust and build a life with.


----------



## Riley_Z

That was quite nice Carmen!


----------



## bandit.45

Hope the OP's wife didn't off him for the insurance...


----------



## tom67

bandit.45 said:


> Hope the OP's wife didn't off him for the insurance...


This one more or less got away with it
Andrea Sneiderman released from prison | www.ajc.com

She served 10 months of a 5 year sentence what a crock of...


----------



## poida

jnb150 said:


> shes calling me soon. ill approach the subject on the phone


So sorry JNB. 

9 months ago I would have supported R, now I just don't. It's never going to work.

Time to let her go and work on yourself. It's a long road but we are here for you.


----------



## lordmayhem

I must have missed the no children part. I must be getting slow. In that case....


----------



## PhillyGuy13

lordmayhem said:


> I must have missed the no children part. I must be getting slow. In that case....


We asked, but I don't think he ever said one way or the other. But since it was never mentioned I assumed no kids.

Not sure he is coming back at this point anyway... We will see


----------



## lordmayhem

That's because he found out from OMW that it was much, much worse that what WW trickle truthed to him. 

Kissing in the car? Yeah, right. We have to see this over, and over, and over again. Juveniles kiss, adults have sex.


----------



## GROUNDPOUNDER

The OP said that the OM's BS said that it was much more than kissing I believe.

I have to wonder if the OM confessed to every type of sexual act that he did with the OP's WS. OP meets the OM's stbxw and she tells him all the horrid details.

He realizes that his WS did things with the OM that she never had done with him. He may have even asked her, begged her, to do them. But her stance was "I'm not that kind of girl". So he drops it.

Now he finds out that she really is IS "That kind of girl". Just not with him.

It's tough to come back here, even anonymously, and talk about what his WS really did. You just want to crawl into bed and never wake up again.

The waking nightmare begins and your life is forever changed.


----------



## Dyokemm

I just hope the OP didn't find out the true extent of his WW's betrayal and then lose it so bad he ended up in the pokey for smashing the POSOM like a bug.

Not cause I give a da*n about POS, he deserves anything that OP sends his way....but it would be far worse for OP if he has to worry about legal troubles on top of the sh*t sandwich his WW has just crammed down his throat.


----------



## lordmayhem

GROUNDPOUNDER said:


> The OP said that the OM's BS said that it was much more than kissing I believe.
> 
> I have to wonder if the OM confessed to every type of sexual act that he did with the OP's WS. OP meets the OM's stbxw and she tells him all the horrid details.
> 
> He realizes that his WS did things with the OM that she never had done with him. He may have even asked her, begged her, to do them. But her stance was "I'm not that kind of girl". So he drops it.
> 
> Now he finds out that she really is IS "That kind of girl". Just not with him.


The script is so predictable, isn't it?


----------



## barbados

OP made 33 posts to this thread in the same day, then is gone with a tantalizing cliff hanger....

Hmmm..


----------



## BetrayedDad

GROUNDPOUNDER said:


> I have to wonder if the OM confessed to every type of sexual act that he did with the OP's WS. OP meets the OM's stbxw and she tells him all the horrid details.


I'd be surprised if OMW had all the "details" just because typically women don't desire to know that information. They're more concerned about the type of emotional connection involved. It's the betrayed men who want to make comparsions on sexual prowess in a vain attempt to ascertain where they went wrong.




barbados said:


> OP made 33 posts to this thread in the same day, then is gone with a tantalizing cliff hanger....
> 
> Hmmm..


Well I'll bite. Most of the trolls who come on here don't just light a fire then vanish. They like to fan the flames because that's how they get their jollies. So the fact that he hasn't logged in since that day is a good sign. It is conceivable that he's got bigger problems now than giving us the play by play on the trainwreck his life is turning into. 

Then again I've been fooled before so who knows... I'll admit I found his original post to be a little textbook. Either way there's always good advice to be found even on fake threads.


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## jnb150

Haha, I totally forgot about this thread. I hate to open something that's dead, but I thought I would update everyone. Plus I got a good chuckle reading the last few pages!

Yes, they had sex. Lots of it. In my house, calling "off sick". She became a real cum dumpster. Unprotected sex with 2 men simultaneously. Needless to say, I had my share of STD tests and I'm luckily clean. It continued after she told me she was doing it, and I kicked her out and filed for divorce.

It was clean and easy and I moved on and forgave her. I made peace with what she did and why she did it. I made peace with myself and what damage I caused during the marriage. I'm a better person for it and have learned, and keep learning from my mistakes.

I'm now in a very happy and healthy relationship with a woman who is strong and independent, and maintains a higher moral code as I do.

I want to thank everyone (a year later) who posted and supported me in this thread. Without you guys I may have never found out the awful truth. With your help, I found out my way, and was able to take control of the situation and end it on my terms.

Thanks again!


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## GusPolinski

Let every potential BS who still has his or her head in the sand take note of this...



Suspecting2014 said:


> *Just kissing? R un sure? She seems to be in the fog, ask her about om feeling and last contact.
> Sorry to tell but could be much more than you think*





jnb150 said:


> *Yes, I'm sure. She's been very honest with me since she told me, and I've asked a lot of questions. I had no idea she was cheating and she came out and told me.* I just knew she was having issues and seeing a counselor by herself.





jnb150 said:


> *she comes home straight after work and spends the whole night with me....she has a busy job* and while im not blind to the fact she still has time to mess around at work.... her job doesn't facilitate that now that shes been missing days for being "sick"(upset) and coming in late due to little sleep from talking with me





jnb150 said:


> Haha, I totally forgot about this thread. I hate to open something that's dead, but I thought I would update everyone. Plus I got a good chuckle reading the last few pages!
> 
> *Yes, they had sex. Lots of it. In my house, calling "off sick".* She became a real cum dumpster. Unprotected sex with 2 men simultaneously. Needless to say, I had my share of STD tests and I'm luckily clean. It continued after she told me she was doing it, and I kicked her out and filed for divorce.
> 
> It was clean and easy and I moved on and forgave her. I made peace with what she did and why she did it. I made peace with myself and what damage I caused during the marriage. I'm a better person for it and have learned, and keep learning from my mistakes.
> 
> I'm now in a very happy and healthy relationship with a woman who is strong and independent, and maintains a higher moral code as I do.
> 
> I want to thank everyone (a year later) who posted and supported me in this thread. Without you guys I may have never found out the awful truth. With your help, I found out my way, and was able to take control of the situation and end it on my terms.
> 
> Thanks again!


ETA: I was just reading one of Mach's replies from earlier in the thread.

Damn.

It's like reading poetry.


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## G.J.

jnb150 said:


> *I found out my way*, and was able to take control of the situation and end it on my terms.
> !


If you could let us know HOW you found out that would be insightful

thanks


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## jnb150

G.J. said:


> If you could let us know HOW you found out that would be insightful
> 
> thanks


I found out by getting in contact with the other man's wife. She happened to work at the office where my ex wife, the other man, and my brother work. My brother was able to track her down and give her my number.

My ex and her lover corroborated their stories. So what the other woman knew, was what my ex confessed to. The problem was, that was a lie too. Their story was that they had sex 2-3 times since May. In reality, they had sex from May all the way up to August when I caught her again and filed for divorce. The other man's ex wife was a great ally in finding out the truth.

I caught her the 2nd time by calling her in the morning when she was supposed to be at her friends house. I asked to speak to her friend,.... and whoops! She couldn't put her on the phone. Marriage over!


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## BetrayedDad

jnb150 said:


> she decided to become vulnerable with a co-worker going through a similar situation. Which culminated with them kissing in his car during lunch a few weeks back.
> 
> I pulled this out of her last week


So much for just kissing.... 



jnb150 said:


> She became a real cum dumpster. Unprotected sex with 2 men simultaneously.


If you don't mind OP, I'm going to bookmark this thread for future reference so every time a new BS comes on here and says he is "positive" they just kissed, because the wife said so and she would never lie, I can reference this quote.

Thanks for the update.


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## workindad

Some phrases with the word just... make me wonder if that translates into here comes a lie I think you want to believe.

Just kissing
Just friends
Just once
Just give me one more chance.


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## tom67

Like this one wasn't cheating https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FcnK9fnSqt0


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## farsidejunky

GusPolinski said:


> Let every potential BS who still has his or her head in the sand take note of this...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ETA: I was just reading one of Mach's replies from earlier in the thread.
> 
> Damn.
> 
> It's like reading poetry.


Mach's spidey sense was stupid-accurate.


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## sparrow555

How does she act these days ? is her life still in a downward spiral or is she getting better too ?


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## Dyokemm

sparrow555 said:


> How does she act these days ? is her life still in a downward spiral or is she getting better too ?


I know OP said he forgave her....but I hope he has cut all contact with this worthless woman so the only answer he can give is "I don't know."

Frankly, my attitude would be 'who gives a f*ck'.....this woman violated her marital home by having a threesome in it, if I am reading OP's update right.

If there is any justice in the world, she would be living under a bridge with her POSOM right next to her.


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## Be smart

I spend half of my night shift reading your thread,and man I am sorry for you.

You wasted a lot of years with this woman,but finally you found the truth,so now you can RUN from her and enjoy your life.

So glad to see you happy now with new woman. I hope you find love and respect with her or any other woman.

One more thing-I wish you never contact your ex wife,just think about her like a learning experience.

Best wishes to you.


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## jnb150

sparrow555 said:


> How does she act these days ? is her life still in a downward spiral or is she getting better too ?


We still have a mutual friend,... so they trickle information to me as they see fit. I'm completely over it by way of counseling and learning about Buddhism/meditation. Which helped a ton. So I don't get all hurt when they mention her. She's still with the guy she cheated with. They live together, and she kind of obsessively stalks me, my family, and my new girlfriend. So ya, she's completely not over it.

However, I don't wish anything bad on her. I've moved on and I want the same for her. She's going to punish herself enough the rest of her life and she's said as much to me. She told me this when we met over coffee once the divorce was finalized. She's still very hurt over what she did and is kind of keeping herself in prison. I just hope counseling helps her and she can lead a somewhat healthy life.


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## sparrow555

> She's going to punish herself enough the rest of her life and she's said as much to me.


I doubt it. Looks like self pity to win some sympathy points from you and make herself look semi decent..Especially if she is still with the guy she cheated with.

Not that it matters/should matter to you but it might be relevant when or if she tries to insert herself into your life again.


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## jnb150

sparrow555 said:


> I doubt it. Looks like self pity to win some sympathy points from you and make herself look semi decent..Especially if she is still with the guy she cheated with.
> 
> Not that it matters/should matter to you but it might be relevant when or if she tries to insert herself into your life again.


Well nothing will be inserted anywhere near her again :wink2:

I won't talk to her anymore and don't feel the need to. If she tried to, I'm aware enough to know it's not healthy for either of us to speak.


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## happyman64

jnb150 said:


> Well nothing will be inserted anywhere near her again :wink2:
> 
> I won't talk to her anymore and don't feel the need to. If she tried to, *I'm aware enough to know it's not healthy for either of us to speak*.


And that my friend is the key ingredient to moving on in life....

Glad to see you in a new healthy relationship with a woman of the same values.

HM


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## OldWolf57

jnb150 there's a lady here who caught her hubby caming and sext with her bff,, please give her a heads up.

And wishing you all the best.


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