# Now, just hear me out.



## crisis1008 (Mar 9, 2010)

I'm a bit confused today. Have been for a couple of days. I am caving. I think that maybe my husband has really done some serious soul searching and changing. He seems to be so much more giving and understanding. 

It doesn't matter what I do, though. You see, if I don't go back to him, he will not leave me alone and I will miss him. If I do go back to him then my family talks to me like I am stupid, or as if they are angry with me. 

I know that my brother-in-law did tell my husband that I was speaking to another man after I left him. My BIL denies saying anything to my husband, but my gut tells me that he did. I don't want to believe he did, but I know he did. The trouble is he is lying to my sister. He does not want his wife to know that he betrayed her sister. He is afraid of the conflict it may cause between the two of them, which is understandable.

However, in the meantime my sister believes that my husband lied about her husband to cover up the fact that he was following me around town, and checking my phone records. My sister now tells me that he will never be welcome in her home.

What kills me is that he was still welcome in her home after abusing me, but _this _is detrimental to her. 

It's okay if you beat my sister. We still love you. (sarcasm)

Now, don't you talk any sh*t about my husband. You're evil. I hate you. (sarcasm)

For the last two days, my husband has been building tent props for an ACS fund-raising event that I am very involved with, and all because I have been super sick. He was there with me after went into the hospital. He picked me up, took me home, and took care of me for the next couple of days.

Am I being blinded by what my sister calls the honeymoon phase, or could he really be changing?

My father does not believe that my husband can change if I go back to him. He says that the simple fact is that if I do go back to him, then it just tells my husband once more that I will always run back to him, and he will revert back to his old ways again one day. On the other hand, my father tells me that, while seemingly unfortunate for me, my leaving him for good will repair him for the next woman in his life. This does not seem fair at all.

I have very recently been considering moving back in with my husband. Please, tell me what you all think. I don't care if your works are kind or cruel. I just want to make sure that I do not make any wrong moves.

If my husband has truly changed, then doesn't he deserve the opportunity to make me happy? Doesn't our marriage deserve and opportunity? Has anyone else on this forum gone through a similar situation? Has anyone else out there been involved with an abusive partner? Are you, or were you as confused as I am now?


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## cantletgo (Mar 22, 2010)

How long has it been since you've really noticed his transformation? Is he going to counseling or just trying to fix himself? I would say give it more time, maybe not move back in, but "date", let him prove to you and your family that he has changed and can treat you the way he should. I know that family pressure can be hard, but don't let it color your judgement. You know this man better than any of them, so go with your gut. But keep your eyes open for the warning signs, don't be blind to them this time. If he over reacts, yells, or even looks angry and he shouldn't, then you'll know for sure. Just my opinion of course, I was in a verbally abusive relationship, but not physically. However, my best friend is in a physically abusive relationship and I can tell you that despite all his promises, counseling, etc., he still hasn't changed. He has been on "good behavior" for the last few months because his teenage daughter finally called him on his b.s, and told a friend about it. So he's being good because he's scared, not because he's seen the error of his ways. I'm just trying to say be careful, be observant. But yes, if you think you are safe, then your marriage does deserve another chance.


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## crisis1008 (Mar 9, 2010)

Thank you for responding, Cantletgo. I have seen that my husband has been really trying to change for about four months now. I began to realize that he was really trying to curb his temper when I would tell him how I felt about his abusiveness toward me.

However, I am supersensitive to anything he does. He says that I am looking for the negative in him, but I can't help but see what I see. For instance, for the first six months of our separation my husband repeatedly told me that he understood why I left him and took full responsibility for the falling apart of our marriage. When I left, I had printed out all of my posts on the spousal abuse forum I was a member of, along with years of research on spousal abuse. I gave him proof, and definitions for the things he had done to me. I could see that it hurt him deeply to come to the realization that he was an abusive husband. This spawned his therapy treatment. In the beginning I did not have any respect or faith left in me. I meant what I said and was fully prepared when I told him that I wanted a divorce. I told him that I did not believe that he could change after 10 years of marriage, and leaving four times prior. But, for nine months now he has just been trying so hard to make me happy. I feel like a bad person or something. I can't help feeling guilty. I know that I had plenty of reason for leaving and requesting a divorce, but feel like I am wrong for holding on to those reasons as he shows his immense love for me.

Then again, he has recently said more than once that he does not understand why I left when I did. He said that he could understand if I had left directly after one of the times that he had physically abused me, but not two years later. At times, I don't think he recognize the other forms of abuse, or how years of abuse can simply take its toll on you and cause you to snap, forcing you to reach your wits end.

Why did he say that he understood, when he did not?

Furthermore, if you will read my most recent post "I feel guilty and am a bit angry. WTF!?!?!?" you will find that there is more that is concerning me at this particular moment. I really do want to trust him, you know? Maybe I am looking for the negative in him. My therapist tells me that I do not want to let go of all of the things my husband has done to me in the past. He says that I am using them as a protective wall. He says I am very guarded.

I know my posts are always long and winded. I am simply a very detailed person and want to make certain that all who are concerned and helping me are getting the full story. I want all to see what I see, if I can actually manage to describe the way I truly feel and what I truly see in words.

Again, thank you. The opinions of all on this forum mean everything to me in this crucial time in my life. The people on the forum know more about my life than my own family does.


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## Affaircare (Jan 11, 2010)

Crisis1008~

I have something for you from Dr. Irene's website. If you click on that it's a link to her site, and specifically to The Victim's pages. 

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*Signs That He Has Changed*

(This list uses 'he' in the interests of readability, but do apply to either gender. Often, posters want to know how to tell if their partner is really changing versus what constitutes a "hoover" -- attempts to suck you back in and under their control. This list is a good guide and quite helpful in evaluating the changes instituted by an abuser.)


He is willing to wait however long it takes for her trust in him to be rebuilt, and does not pressure her to forgive or reconcile until she is ready.

He does not say or do things that threaten or frighten her.

He listens to and respects her opinion, even if he disagrees.

He can express anger or frustration toward her without being punished or abused.

He respects her “no” in all situations, including physical contact.

He does not prevent her from spending time with friends and family, and does not punish her later.

He is willing to continue counseling as long as necessary.

He takes responsibility for his actions, and does not blame her for his bad behavior.

He is kind and attentive instead of being demanding and controlling.

When he becomes frustrated or angry, he does not take it out on his wife or children.

When he fails, he admits his mistake and takes responsibility for changing abusive behavior.

He admits to his abusive behavior, and stops trying to blame or cover up.

He acknowledges that all the abuse was wrong, and identifies all the ways he used to justify his abusive behavior.

He acknowledges that his abusive behavior was not a loss of control, but a choice on his part.

He recognizes and is able to verbalize the effects of his abuse on his spouse and children.

He identifies attitudes of entitlement or superiority, and talks about the tactics he used in maintaining control. He replaces distorted thinking with a more positive and empathetic view.

He consistently displays respectful behavior toward his wife and children.

He wants to make amends for the harm he has caused.

He is committed to not repeating his past behavior, and realizes it will be a life-long process.

He is willing to hear feedback and criticism, is honest about his failures, and is willing to be held accountable for abusive thinking and behavior.

_“Beware of the temptation to gauge change by means of the perpetrator’s church-going behavior. Going to church is not good enough . . . does not prove that he is no longer going to hurt her.” _—Woman-Battering


*He Has Not Changed If ...*


He blames her or others for his behavior.

He uses guilt to manipulate her into dropping charges or keeping silent.

He does not faithfully attend his treatment program.

He pressures her to let him move back in before she is ready.

He will not admit he was abusive.

He convinces others that she is either abusive or crazy.

He demands to know where his spouse is and whom she is with.

He uses her behavior as an excuse to treat her badly.

He continues to use sarcasm or verbal abuse, talk over his wife, and shows disrespect or superiority.

He does not respond well to complaints or criticism of his behavior when he slips back into abusive behavior.

He continues to undermine her authority as a parent, and her credibility as a person.

His mindset about women has not changed, even though he avoids being abusive.

He criticizes his spouse for not realizing how much he has changed.

_“Completion of a batterer’s intervention program class by a man does not mean his victim is safe or that he has stopped being abusive. While men may learn tools for acting nonviolently, research indicates that many men continue to be abusive, even if they change their tactics.” _—Embracing Justice: A Resource Guide for Rabbis on Domestic Violence

*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*

_If you go back too soon, the abuse will be worse and leaving again will be harder._


*Steps to Change*

1. Admit fully to his history of psychological, sexual and physical abusiveness. Denial and minimizing need to stop, including discrediting your memory of what happened.

2. Acknowledge that the abuse was wrong, unconditionally. He needs to identify the justifications he used, including the ways he blamed you, and talk in detail about why his behaviors were unacceptable, without defending them.

3. Acknowledge that his behavior was a choice, not a loss of control.

4. Recognize the effects his abuse has had on you and on your children, and show empathy for those. He needs to talk IN DETAIL about the impact that his abuse has had, including fear, loss of trust, anger, etc. And he needs to do this without feeling sorry for himself or talking about how hard the experience has been for him.

5. Identify in detail his pattern of controlling behaviors and entitled attitudes. He needs to speak in detail about the day to day tactics of abuse he has used, identify his underlying beliefs and values that drove those behaviors, such as considering himself entitled to constant attention.

6. Develop respectful behaviors and attitudes to replace the abusive ones he is stopping.

7. Reevaluate his distorted image of you, replacing it with a more positive and empathic view. He has to recognize that he's focused on and exaggerated his grievances against you. He needs to compliment you and pay attention to your strengths and abilities.

8. Make amends for the damage he has done. He has to have a sense that he has a debt to you. He can start payment by being consistently kind and supportive, putting his own needs on the back burner for a couple of years, fixing what he has damaged, and cleaning up the emotional and literal messes he has caused.

9. Accept the consequences of his actions. He should stop blaming you for problems that are the result of his abuse.

10. Commit to not repeating his abusive behaviors. He should not place any conditions on his improvement - such as saying he won't call you names as long as you don't raise your voice.

11. Accept the need to give up his privileges and do so. Stop double standards, stop flirting with other women, stop taking off with his friends while you take care of the children. He also is not the only one allowed to express anger.

12. Accept that overcoming abusiveness is likely to be a life-long process. He cannot claim that his work is done by saying, "I've changed, but you haven't." or complain that he is sick of hearing about his abuse.

13. Be willing to be accountable for his actions, both past and future. He must accept feedback and criticism and be answerable for what he does and how it affects you and the children.

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Hope these lists help you to see what we have been trying and trying to show you. You keep asking "doesn't he deserve a chance if he's gone to counseling?" Can you honestly say that you see the Signs That He Has Changed? If not, then he hasn't changed! Can you honestly say that you do not see the very behaviors in "He Has Not Changed if...."? I see them. And finally, what step do you see he is on when you look at the list of "Steps to Change"? Has he fully admitted to his history of abuse in detail, without minimizing it or trying to say you're remembering it wrong? If not, then he's not even on step one!!

So I'll just hear you out if you'll just hear me out. Please think about what I'm showing you. Okay?


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## crisis1008 (Mar 9, 2010)

Affaircare said:


> Crisis1008~
> 
> I have something for you from Dr. Irene's website. If you click on that it's a link to her site, and specifically to The Victim's pages.
> 
> ...




I am definitely hearing you out. Please, tell me if you think you see progress in the responses I have given to the items you have listed for me to think about. My subjectivity prevents me from seeing everything clearly right now. Your objective viewpoint is very needed at this time. I will be showing this reponse to me therapist tomorrow.

Thank you so much, affaircare.


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