# Man Question



## nice777guy (Nov 23, 2009)

Do normal men get tired of sleeping with the same woman after 15, 20 - whatever - years of marriage?

If you had been married to Halle Berry or WHOEVER for 20 years - would you still see her as one of the most attractive women on the planet? 

Or - sometimes - would you think "been there done that - wonder what's on TV tonight?"


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

nice777guy said:


> Do normal men get tired of sleeping with the same woman after 15, 20 - whatever - years of marriage?


 As if I would know, but I think ALL guys crave a little variety, it is testosterone's drive, but this human craving can usually be filled filled with some porn & his own fantasies, so long as everything else in the marraige is healthy & happening. 




nice777guy said:


> If you had been married to Halle Berry or WHOEVER for 20 years - would you still see her as one of the most attractive women on the planet?


 My husband still feels this way about me, makes me the happiest woman alive. So definitely possible. But again, he loves downloading his playboy bunnies too !


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## reachingshore (Jun 10, 2010)

SimplyAmorous said:


> As if I would know, but I think ALL guys crave a little variety, it is testosterone's drive, but this human craving can usually be filled filled with some porn & his own fantasies, so long as everything else in the marraige is healthy & happening.
> 
> 
> My husband still feels this way about me, makes me the happiest woman alive. So definitely possible. But again, he loves downloading his playboy bunnies too !


Let a man be a man within the boundaries of a relationship and let a woman be a woman within the boundaries of a relationship. It's definitely possible then.


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## AFEH (May 18, 2010)

Well I don’t know if this makes me abnormal but I desired my wife for over 40 years.

Bob


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## nice777guy (Nov 23, 2009)

Phrase it a bit differently - do you think Halle Berry ever catches her husband looking at porn on the internet? Do you think he has a Playboy subscription? Or is excited about the new SI Swimsuit Issue?

Do you think he's ever just "not in the mood" - even though its HALLE 'FREAKIN' BERRY?

Do you think he would ever reject her one night, then jerk off to an Angelina Jolie movie the next afternoon while she's at work?

DOES THE SHINE WEAR OFF? AND DO WE JUST START TAKING THINGS FOR GRANTED?


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

AFEH said:


> Well I don’t know if this makes me abnormal but I desired my wife for over 40 years.
> 
> Bob


I spent 20 long years almost completely uninspired by my first wife.

I contrast that with the last five.

I would imagine that at age 65-70 (God willing, with all parts working), that my wife and I will easily exceed what happened in the "best" years of my first marriage.

What I'm telling you NG is that things ebb and flow, but you need to dig deep to figure out the cause of your current funk.


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## nice777guy (Nov 23, 2009)

Conrad said:


> I spent 20 long years almost completely uninspired by my first wife.
> 
> I contrast that with the last five.
> 
> ...


This one isn't entirely about me.

Actually got the Halle Berry idea from Wayne Dyer (yes - new age self-help type stuff - but I like it...).

And just looking at the sex forums - all of the frustrated women. Just puzzles me a bit how a guy can see a pretty girl on the street and have some dirty thoughts about what he'd like to do to her - and then go home and head straight for the TV - ignoring his wife.

And maybe some other guy was checking THAT GUY'S wife out earlier that day - picturing her bent over a desk, or naked on a bear rug - before he went home and grabbed a beer and the remote.

Do you think Halle Berry's husband rejects her one day, then jerks off to the new Playboy the next day, while thousands of other men are jerking off to pics of Halle on the internet?


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## Orion (Jul 17, 2010)

nice777guy said:


> Phrase it a bit differently - do you think Halle Berry ever catches her husband looking at porn on the internet? Do you think he has a Playboy subscription? Or is excited about the new SI Swimsuit Issue?
> 
> Do you think he's ever just "not in the mood" - even though its HALLE 'FREAKIN' BERRY?
> 
> ...


It depends upon a lot of different factors but it is not outside of the realm of possibility that Halle's husband (or any of her ex's) gets excited or lusts after other women.

True story: When Tiger Woods got busted I was on the elevator and some women were talking about it. They mentioned that they could not believe that he cheated on his wife because she was so beautiful. The delivery guy on the elevator looked at me and we both shook our heads. We knew that the women's logic was flawed. It's that a) some guys (and people) take things for granted after a while and b) some guys feel like the only thing better than p***y is "new p***y". I am not advocating but I am stating what I have seen and heard.


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## michzz (Jun 6, 2008)

nice777guy said:


> If you had been married to Halle Berry or WHOEVER for 20 years - would you still see her as one of the most attractive women on the planet?


Give me Halle Berry for 20 years and I'll get back to you.


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## nice777guy (Nov 23, 2009)

Orion said:


> It depends upon a lot of different factors but it is not outside of the realm of possibility that Halle's husband (or any of her ex's) gets excited or lusts after other women.
> 
> True story: When Tiger Woods got busted I was on the elevator and some women were talking about it. They mentioned that they could not believe that he cheated on his wife because she was so beautiful. The delivery guy on the elevator looked at me and we both shook our heads. We knew that the women's logic was flawed. It's that a) some guys (and people) take things for granted after a while and b) some guys feel like the only thing better than p***y is "new p***y". I am not advocating but I am stating what I have seen and heard.


Great example!

I was thinking also about Charlie Sheen using prostitutes while married to Denise Richards! I think he has some other "demons" - but still - he also had (and lost) Denise Richards!


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## nice777guy (Nov 23, 2009)

michzz said:


> Give me Halle Berry for 20 years and I'll get back to you.


I'm thinking the lack of response is because most guys googled pics of Halle and took a few moments to "ponder" before responding!


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## Orion (Jul 17, 2010)

nice777guy said:


> Great example!
> 
> I was thinking also about Charlie Sheen using prostitutes while married to Denise Richards! I think he has some other "demons" - but still - he also had (and lost) Denise Richards!


I think that you also need to realize that Charlie Sheen *LIKES* those kinds of women. I think that he prefers porn stars and hookers. Seems to be is M.O. Apparently, Jesse James likes chicks with tattoos. I think that Sandra Bullock was what he _felt_ like he should be with and Kat Von D is what he desires.


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## reachingshore (Jun 10, 2010)

nice777guy said:


> Do you think Halle Berry's husband rejects her one day, then jerks off to the new Playboy the next day, while thousands of other men are jerking off to pics of Halle on the internet?


Frankly I don't see how that could not be possible. To Halle Berry's husband, Halle Berry is a woman who happens to be the Halle Berry. There is nothing significant in the sense of a successful marriage/relationship just because that woman happens to be a movie star or a celebrity.


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## AFEH (May 18, 2010)

NG if you’re looking for what’s “normal” I don’t think you’re going to find it. I think “sexual compatibility” is the big thing.

Obviously my stbx and I were very compatible in that aspect of our marriage. But even then there were things I needed that just didn’t happen and sure I turned to somewhere else to satisfy them, mainly what I think of as soft porn. My stbx knew about it and said it didn’t bother her, reckon it gave her a bit of a break as her love language is “service”. I can say in over 40 years there were only a few dry moments, I was truly blessed.

Plus my stbx always took good care of her body, she watched her weight religiously and was not too different in her 50s than she was as a teenager, even after two sons. Women friends of the same age just could not understand how she managed to stay so trim.

So all in all it “depends”. To me my stbx oozes sexuality, to some other men she doesn’t.

But there’s a lot that happens in the head NG. These things are totally different in a mature man than they are in the teenager who has a driving need to “see what it’s like” and nothing else. It’s sex for the sake of sex without a bond between the two people.

In a long term marriage, to feel desire for our partner other things as well as a “body” must be there. Mainly respect and appreciation as well as love. Without those things and if contempt and resentment are there it’s very difficult for a man to perform as he feels he’s just using and abusing his wife for release, an orgasm and nothing else.

Bob


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## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

If my wife Halle matches my level of investment in, and enthusiasm for our marriage, then I don't doubt for a moment that although there will certainly be peaks and valleys, I still love and desire her 20 years later ... even despite having made "Cat Woman".

Add mis-match between she and I in the love and sex department, and it doesn't matter who she is and how she looks. If you kill off love, passion, and desire, you will look elsewhere for those things.

I think I just sounded very BigBadWolfish :FIREdevil:


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## 2sick (Nov 5, 2010)

nice777guy said:


> Phrase it a bit differently - do you think Halle Berry ever catches her husband looking at porn on the internet? Do you think he has a Playboy subscription? Or is excited about the new SI Swimsuit Issue?
> 
> Do you think he's ever just "not in the mood" - even though its HALLE 'FREAKIN' BERRY?
> 
> ...


 Nice guy...not a good example...Halle's husband cheated on HER!!!! God help the rest of us!!! Sooo good question would be WTF why do guy get the urge for cheating (rather why do SOME guys)?!?!?!? She too said hubby rejected her so who knows?!?!?!?


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## 2sick (Nov 5, 2010)

BlackMedicine357 said:


> I used to wonder this same thing before I married my W. IMHO it has a lot to do with FOCUS. 1-2 years in my W was the most attractive woman on the planet. 10 years in my focus was fuzzy and dispersed, and I did start looking around, but the reality of my marriage brought my focus back to her. Now, almost 20 years into our life together, she remains my central focus in spite of rough times brought on by my tendency to display beta traits primarily at home, while being alpha prime at work. She could not help but take charge and be the alpha female, which made me not desire her. I am now seeing a positive change in our dynamic since I've started consciously displaying ALPHA bx at home. I'm finding her more attractive because she finds me more attractive..


Black medicine I think you hit the bulls eye!!! By looking at all of these posts on both sides...things just wane during a certain period in marriage....I guess we have to hold out for a few more years until the pendulum sways back in the other direction again!!! 

.[/QUOTE]Now to the 'same sex marriage' thing! Yep, we're all in same-sex marriages, after 5 years. Pretty much the same sex every time! Tried it all and going around the track a second/third time, only now I have arthritis and old battle scars, so it can be challenging.
It gets harder to wield the 55 gallon drum of industrial strength Vaseline and a cattle prod...but I give it my best shot...God knows I give it my best shot....[/QUOTE]
:rofl:


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

2sick said:


> Nice guy...not a good example...Halle's husband cheated on HER!!!! God help the rest of us!!! Sooo good question would be WTF why do guy get the urge for cheating (rather why do SOME guys)?!?!?!? She too said hubby rejected her so who knows?!?!?!?


J. James cheated on S. Bullock


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## nice777guy (Nov 23, 2009)

I DID NOT KNOW that Halle's husband cheated on her. I'm assuming that he didn't upgrade when this happened.

But hey, maybe Halle is only into missionary - or maybe she wanted to use a strap-on every night.

I'm assuming they had similar drives and similar expectations in the bedroom - and that they were both holding up their end of the marriage.


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## nice777guy (Nov 23, 2009)

And I know this shouldn't matter - but to me Halle is much hotter than Sandra!!!

Or maybe it should matter?


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

NG,

How could he possibly upgrade?

Same situation as Tiger Woods.

BTW - do you know what Tigers and Baby Seals have in common?

They both get clubbed by Swedes.


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## 2sick (Nov 5, 2010)

Conrad said:


> J. James cheated on S. Bullock


EXACTLY!!!! WHY!?!?!?!?:scratchhead:


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## 2sick (Nov 5, 2010)

Conrad said:


> NG,
> 
> How could he possibly upgrade?
> 
> ...



:smthumbup::smthumbup:


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## credamdóchasgra (Sep 24, 2010)

Well, obviously these guys didn't cheat because their spouses aren't "hot enough."
j James, t woods, and mr. Berry have their own reasons that have nothing to do with their wives' appearance.
Probably has something to do with entitlement, ego, and narcissism---in their cases.
I'm willing to bet there are men who are faithful to wives who don't look like Sandra, Hallie, or elin.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LonelyNLost (Dec 11, 2010)

credamdóchasgra said:


> Well, obviously these guys didn't cheat because their spouses aren't "hot enough."
> j James, t woods, and mr. Berry have their own reasons that have nothing to do with their wives' appearance.
> Probably has something to do with entitlement, ego, and narcissism---in their cases.
> I'm willing to bet there are men who are faithful to wives who don't look like Sandra, Hallie, or elin.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Isn't it generally true, though, that when men cheat a lot of times the woman they cheat with isn't as attractive as their spouse? I remember reading that somewhere. Same with women, too. Because it has more to do with other needs being met rather than sexual attractiveness. You can stave that off, but if they start fulfilling other needs your spouse has neglected, then you are prone.


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## notaname (Feb 4, 2011)

credamdóchasgra said:


> Well, obviously these guys didn't cheat because their spouses aren't "hot enough."
> j James, t woods, and mr. Berry have their own reasons that have nothing to do with their wives' appearance.
> Probably has something to do with entitlement, ego, and narcissism---in their cases.
> I'm willing to bet there are men who are faithful to wives who don't look like Sandra, Hallie, or elin.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


This. Power can really jack with people's minds.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

nice777guy said:


> Phrase it a bit differently - do you think Halle Berry ever catches her husband looking at porn on the internet?


 Probably



nice777guy said:


> Do you think he's ever just "not in the mood" - even though its HALLE 'FREAKIN' BERRY??


 of coarse, if he is stressed, tired, they had a fight, etc



nice777guy said:


> Do you think he would ever reject her one night, then jerk off to an Angelina Jolie movie the next afternoon while she's at work?


 THIS soley depends on what kind of man he is. 



nice777guy said:


> DOES THE SHINE WEAR OFF? AND DO WE JUST START TAKING THINGS FOR GRANTED?


Many of us are guilty of taking things for granted, hopefully something happens in life to catch our attentions, so we can get back on board & realize what is right in front of us. 


This doesn't even have much to do with attractive looks -for some men/women. I ran into an old friend of mine yesterday, stopped & chatted with him for over an hour , the subject came up about attractiveness, his wife is not so much according to society's standards. He told me how a friend of his had the audacity to ask him before he married how he found her attractive, and he immediately cut him off, it was the last time he ever spoke to the man. There I was , the listening wanna be therapist (unfortunetely they are separated now -more to do with finances & Communication issues). But he went out of his way in describing how HE finds her beautiful and desirable. 

So Beauty is truly in the eye of the beholder. Not all men are the same - Thankfully. 

Some of the more homely women may have better husbands than the most beautiful women, and BE more faithful.


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## nice777guy (Nov 23, 2009)

LonelyNLost said:


> Isn't it generally true, though, that when men cheat a lot of times the woman they cheat with isn't as attractive as their spouse? I remember reading that somewhere. Same with women, too. Because it has more to do with other needs being met rather than sexual attractiveness. You can stave that off, but if they start fulfilling other needs your spouse has neglected, then you are prone.


That does seem to be true...at least the "affairing down" part.

One need that your partner can't meet in some situations is the need for a cheap, exciting thrill. The thrill of sneaking around - tasting forbidden fruit. 

I don't know - but I bet having an affair would be pretty exciting!


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## LonelyNLost (Dec 11, 2010)

nice777guy said:


> That does seem to be true...at least the "affairing down" part.
> 
> One need that your partner can't meet in some situations is the need for a cheap, exciting thrill. The thrill of sneaking around - tasting forbidden fruit.
> 
> I don't know - but I bet having an affair would be pretty exciting!


Oh no, you better watch yourself! 

I think in some marriages the partner can fulfill that. Men have different needs in that way than women. Like, I was informed by my husband, that when a man meets any new woman, he thinks about what it'd be like to screw them. Then the moment is gone and he can go about his life. Women aren't like that. Sometimes we might fantasize if a man catches our eye, but all in all, none of that business. At least most women I know.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

nice777guy said:


> That does seem to be true...at least the "affairing down" part.
> 
> One need that your partner can't meet in some situations is the need for a cheap, exciting thrill. The thrill of sneaking around - tasting forbidden fruit.
> 
> I don't know - but I bet having an affair would be pretty exciting!


Just imagine NiceGuy...

A woman who wants you - while fitness testing her ex's!

That's one reason why affairs are so seductive.

Of course, she'll get around to fitness testing you. But, you do get the first hundred days or so.


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## Draguna (Jan 13, 2011)

Yeah, never understood why someone would cheat with a woman looking like that, but then you think. They were just trophy wives for them. Status, not much more.

And then you have the possibility that like some other nice looking women, they could be empty inside (not saying they are, but everybody knows those kind of people) and boring as ****.

Ever seen Kim Kardashian's tape? Man.... telling you, not a good lover. Classic example that beautiful women suck in bed.


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## JustAGirl (Oct 1, 2010)

Didn't one of Halle Berry's husband's cheat on her???


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

LonelyNLost said:


> I think in some marriages the partner can fulfill that. Men have different needs in that way than women. Like, I was informed by my husband, that when a man meets any new woman, he thinks about what it'd be like to screw them. Then the moment is gone and he can go about his life. Women aren't like that. Sometimes we might fantasize if a man catches our eye, but all in all, none of that business. At least most women I know.


Ha ha , you think so . One thing I learned was I didnt use to be like that, but once I turned into a "cougar" in my 40's -my mind went to those places. I can identify with men quite well. I think the higher your sex drive, the more your mind does these things to you, that is my experience. I was undressing every man I seen out & about for a time. It was quite fun. It is not an assult on your spouse , just being horny. 

Maybe Men are just a little more HONEST about it, kinda like masterbation, men have no problem bragging about it, having competitions with each other in their youth - to how far they can shoot ( I have heard it all), but women, they can't even admit to doing it -let alone mention how good it felt.


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## nice777guy (Nov 23, 2009)

JustAGirl said:


> Didn't one of Halle Berry's husband's cheat on her???


Yep - someone above pointed that out. So maybe not the best example!


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## BlackMedicine357 (Jan 18, 2011)

nice777guy said:


> That does seem to be true...at least the "affairing down" part.
> 
> One need that your partner can't meet in some situations is the need for a cheap, exciting thrill. The thrill of sneaking around - tasting forbidden fruit.
> 
> I don't know - but I bet having an affair would be pretty exciting!


Yeah, and running around outside the green zone in Baghdad is a cheap thrill and can be pretty exciting...but I wouldn't recommend it.

Oh yeah, add Tiger to the 'string 'm up by their hangy-down parts list'.


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## AFEH (May 18, 2010)

I think in the main a man’s sex drive doesn’t vary much as the years go by, it just kind of goes down over the years. George Burns “Sex at age 90 is like trying to shoot pool with a rope”.

But a woman’s sex drive is I think very different. For example, after children have left home and the menopause their drive can go above what it’s ever been in the preceding years. And there in a long term marriage you have an incompatibility, wife’s drive up, husband’s drive going down.

“You know “that look” women get when they want sex? Me neither”. Steve Martin.

Bob


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## AFEH (May 18, 2010)

Conrad said:


> Just imagine NiceGuy...
> 
> A woman who wants you - while fitness testing her ex's!
> 
> ...


Used to be the first seven years.


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## MarriedWifeInLove (May 28, 2010)

Interesting that you used Halle Berry as an example.

I've discovered that real beauty, wealth, etc., has absolutely nothing to do with desire - they don't go hand-in-hand.

Using Halle as an example, she is a beautiful, successful woman, who by all news accounts is also gracious, friendly and well liked.

But NONE OF THAT has kept her as the object of total desire in three of her relationships - two which were marriages that ended.

Her first marriage ended due to abuse and infidelity (on his part).

Her second marriage ended due to infidelity - her second husband was bedding down just about anyone - why, when he had her at home?

Her third relationship, a non-marriage also ended due to jealousy (on her part) and rumors of possible infidelity (on his part).

So - beauty, a great body, money and personality aren't always what they're cracked up to be.

If they were, then WHY in the world would all these men cheat on their beautiful and successful wives - Michael Douglas (first wife), Tiger Woods, Bill Clinton, Jesse James just to name a few...

And who says that variety is just for men? Us women like variety too - I enjoy different men also - they move different, make love differently, kiss different, endowment varies, etc.

It's just not limited to YOU GUYS!


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## MarriedWifeInLove (May 28, 2010)

AFEH said:


> I think in the main a man’s sex drive doesn’t vary much as the years go by, it just kind of goes down over the years. George Burns “Sex at age 90 is like trying to shoot pool with a rope”.
> 
> But a woman’s sex drive is I think very different. For example, after children have left home and the menopause their drive can go above what it’s ever been in the preceding years. And there in a long term marriage you have an incompatibility, wife’s drive up, husband’s drive going down.
> 
> ...


Not all women fall into this trap.

I have the sex drive of a teenage boy and always have. I'm in peri-menopause and it hasn't slowed me down a bit.

My husband's drive has dropped, not sure if it's me or him or both. Still trying to figure that out.

But mine has NEVER BEEN LOW.


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## nice777guy (Nov 23, 2009)

simplyamorous said:


> kinda like masterbation, men have no problem bragging about it, *having competitions with each other in their youth - to how far they can shoot *


what???!!!???


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## AFEH (May 18, 2010)

MarriedWifeInLove said:


> Not all women fall into this trap.
> 
> I have the sex drive of a teenage boy and always have. I'm in peri-menopause and it hasn't slowed me down a bit.
> 
> ...


Well maybe in a few years your drive will go up even more. But you wont know until you experience it!


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

nice777guy said:


> what???!!!???


NiceGuy,

I've been meaning to ask you a few somewhat personal questions.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

AFEH said:


> Used to be the first seven years.


Bob,

Life has a much faster pace now.


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## nice777guy (Nov 23, 2009)

Conrad said:


> NiceGuy,
> 
> I've been meaning to ask you a few somewhat personal questions.


Sorry - I only have my 16 foot tape with me now. Will try again from home tonight using the 20 footer - and a yardstick! My neighbor is a notary - he can be a witness.

Will post back with results tomorrow!

:smthumbup:


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## nice777guy (Nov 23, 2009)

MarriedWifeInLove said:


> Interesting that you used Halle Berry as an example.
> 
> I've discovered that real beauty, wealth, etc., has absolutely nothing to do with desire - they don't go hand-in-hand.
> 
> ...


I didn't realize Halle had been through so much - but I did want to use someone who seemed elegant, classy, successful and hot as hell!!! That's a pretty interesting history.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

nice777guy said:


> I didn't realize Halle had been through so much - but I did want to use someone who seemed elegant, classy, successful and hot as hell!!! That's a pretty interesting history.


You think Halle likes Nice Guys?


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## nice777guy (Nov 23, 2009)

Conrad said:


> You think Halle likes Nice Guys?


Doesn't sound like it!

But I'm wondering if after all she's been through if she wouldn't give it a chance for a change!

Still concerned about SA's husband's past...


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## tobio (Nov 30, 2010)

LonelyNLost said:


> I think in some marriages the partner can fulfill that. Men have different needs in that way than women. *Like, I was informed by my husband, that when a man meets any new woman, he thinks about what it'd be like to screw them. Then the moment is gone and he can go about his life.* Women aren't like that. Sometimes we might fantasize if a man catches our eye, but all in all, none of that business. At least most women I know.


I said something like this to my OH a while ago. He got quite angry about it, said that making generalisations like this about all men was just rubbish, gives decent men a bad name, and is insulting to GFs/wives. I think the men thinkers around here might have something to say about that


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## nice777guy (Nov 23, 2009)

tobio said:


> I said something like this to my OH a while ago. He got quite angry about it, said that making generalisations like this about all men was just rubbish, gives decent men a bad name, and is insulting to GFs/wives. I think the men thinkers around here might have something to say about that


I think he sounds VERY defensive - which usually means GUILT!!!



All I have here are Avatars, and I'm picturing most you girls naked!!!

:rofl:


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## AFEH (May 18, 2010)

Conrad said:


> Bob,
> 
> Life has a much faster pace now.


To right Conrad. And the thing is the older I get the quicker it goes. Mon to Fri seems like a weekend, weekends don’t notice them, and just where did 2000 to 2010 go? Nobody’s been able to explain to me why this is.

Bob


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## michzz (Jun 6, 2008)

tobio said:


> I said something like this to my OH a while ago. He got quite angry about it, said that making generalisations like this about all men was just rubbish, gives decent men a bad name, and is insulting to GFs/wives. I think the men thinkers around here might have something to say about that


I read recently that 62 percent of women admit to fantasizing about sex with someone other than their husband/partner.

I think it is the human condition to notice suitable sex partners. It doesn't mean everyone goes about acting on that noticing. Men or women.


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## AFEH (May 18, 2010)

nice777guy said:


> Sorry - I only have my 16 foot tape with me now. Will try again from home tonight using the 20 footer - and a yardstick! My neighbor is a notary - he can be a witness.
> 
> Will post back with results tomorrow!
> 
> :smthumbup:


Putting them in the fridge doesn't work in spite of Conrad's advice.


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## Mom6547 (Jul 13, 2010)

nice777guy said:


> I think he sounds VERY defensive - which usually means GUILT!!!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Here is the thing. So WHAT? I mean does anyone expect a man to be doing any differently? DH says that the very first thing he thinks about when he sees a woman is what she looks like naked. And it is not even a fully formed thought. It is that noise that goes on while you are thinking about what you are thinking about. For me the noise might be yoga or the kids or... for him it's naked women. It just is.


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## Affaircare (Jan 11, 2010)

> Phrase it a bit differently - do you think Halle Berry ever catches her husband looking at porn on the internet? Do you think he has a Playboy subscription? Or is excited about the new SI Swimsuit Issue?
> 
> Do you think he's ever just "not in the mood" - even though its HALLE 'FREAKIN' BERRY?
> 
> ...


Niceguy, this is a great question and illustrates PERFECTLY that many of the "beliefs" in the USA are just a bit off target and off track. As you know now, in real life Halle Berry has been in 3 long-term relationships (2 marriages, 1 common law with a child), and all three ended due to some sort of infidelity. No I realize that Halle does not look like a red-carpet queen every day, but there is no denying that she is probably the epitome of classic physical beauty! She is in shape, she is curvy in all the right places, she has a pleasing face, she does her hair in a way that complements her natural features, and she wears clothes and accentuates her positives. The woman is a knock out! And yet every one of the loves of her life chose to look elsewhere...why? 

Jennifer Aniston is another great example. For the most part, many men in the USA would look at her and think she's the zenith of physical beauty. She can have that "girl next door" beauty or the red-carpet queen beauty. And yet she lost the loves of her life too--Brad was enticed by Angelina and since then guys like John Mayer have chosen for the drug of their choice rather than being faithful to her...why? 

There are two deep, fundamental reasons. 

1) Affairs just ARE NOT LOVE STORIES!! Here in the USA we've sort of be "programmed" to think that an affair is passionate, sensual and erotic...that those in the affair are star-crossed lovers brought together by Destiny or Fate. More than half of the marriages in the USA end with divorce, and most/many of them have some sort of infidelity involved, so you'd *think* we would all know better!  Yet for some reason that image persists. Men do not leave a pretty woman at home to "move on up" to a gorgeous woman. Women do not leave their successful plumber at home to "move on up" to a lawyer or senator! In real life, affairs are not like romance novels and soap operas--they tear people apart, do irreparable damage, and the problems of step-families and exes MULTIPLES the issues...makes it WORSE!! Yet knowing all this, for some reason we can not shake the false presentation that affairs are love stories. I'm not sure what they *are* but the one thing I can say with absolutely certainty is that it is NOT LOVE!!! 

2) Love in a marriage is not anchored in "attraction" or sex even, but in the decision to honor your vow. My guess is that 9 times out of 10 the twenty year olds who get married do not fully and deeply understand what they are promising, but the fact is that we ALL see others who catch our attention...we are ALL tempted to stray in one way or another...we ALL can get bored, be hurt, or lose interest. But the deep CRUX of the vow at marriage is that you will guard yourself and make the choices that protect you from those temptations...AND that you will make the effort to meet your spouse's needs and not stop until you are dead. 

How many times have we seen examples men who are with knock-out gorgeous women who leave them lonely and neglected at home so they can have an affair with a homely, plain, even sometimes older woman! They have a goddess at home whom they've ignored and they turn to the janitor at work...WHY? It's because the janitor at work is simultaneously *not* doing the things that put out their flame of love and doing the things that emblazon the flame of love! Meanwhile, the gorgeous goddess at home is most definitely doing the things that put out love, and has stopped doing the things that stoke the blaze. 

Think about it--if the goddess at home puts him down, rages at him and screams, just goes off and buys cars without his input, doesn't include him in her life, and constantly turns to others for friendship chatting with them right in front of him--and the janitor at work admires him, builds him up and compliments him, speaks to him with that tone and look that means "I'm interested!", comes to him for advice or includes him in the fun of her day, asks him to do stuff with her...WANTS to do stuff with him, and regularly touches him and acts like she desires him... YOU TELL ME. 

It's not the looks. Looks come and looks go. It's not even being the greatest lover, because again throughout the course of a whole lifetime, sex can be frequent, wane, and be frequent again! The whole thing comes down to YOU being willing to protect yourself against the temptations that do come and choosing to meet your spouse's needs through all the circumstances of life--and being with a spouse who will ALSO resist the temptations that come along and choose to meet your needs through all the circumstances of life. 

It really is a CHOICE to ACT...and then feelings come due to the choice.


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## nice777guy (Nov 23, 2009)

Affaircare said:


> Niceguy, this is a great question and illustrates PERFECTLY that many of the "beliefs" in the USA are just a bit off target and off track. As you know now, in real life Halle Berry has been in 3 long-term relationships (2 marriages, 1 common law with a child), and all three ended due to some sort of infidelity. No I realize that Halle does not look like a red-carpet queen every day, but there is no denying that she is probably the epitome of classic physical beauty! She is in shape, she is curvy in all the right places, she has a pleasing face, she does her hair in a way that complements her natural features, and she wears clothes and accentuates her positives. The woman is a knock out! And yet every one of the loves of her life chose to look elsewhere...why?
> 
> Jennifer Aniston is another great example. For the most part, many men in the USA would look at her and think she's the zenith of physical beauty. She can have that "girl next door" beauty or the red-carpet queen beauty. And yet she lost the loves of her life too--Brad was enticed by Angelina and since then guys like John Mayer have chosen for the drug of their choice rather than being faithful to her...why?
> 
> ...


Thanks AC - very well put. 

Per Steven Covey - Love is a Verb, not a Noun.

Its what you do and how you treat each other - not just some dizzy feeling you get when you lock eyes.

But people CRAVE those dizzy feelings.


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## Affaircare (Jan 11, 2010)

Yes I realize that. The "dizzy feelings" are actually the brain chemistry of love--it's a natural amphetamine (dopamine and serotonin) and people can be just as hooked on that amphetamine as on speed! Often people crave that "affair rush" and will flirt with people at work or turn to an affair, because during the secret part (before your spouse suspects and while it's still starting) it is THRILLING! Sometimes people turn to flirting with numerous people and get that rush off of having several members of the opposite sex flirt with them--say in chat rooms or on Facebook. People WILL seek out what they crave. And the solution is just like any addiction to amphetamine: you have to stop supplying the drug and go through withdrawal.

In a marriage, in real life really, you just can not keep that natural amphetamine going...even if both of you meet each others' needs and avoid doing the things that kill love. What happens is that about 2-3 years after the initial "thrilling" part, your body starts to build up a certain tolerance to that brain chemistry, and something new starts to occur. In this phase of the relationship, your brain produces endorphins, brain opiates more like morphine than speed. They calm the mind, kill pain, and reduce anxiety. And THAT part you can reproduce indefinitely as long as you live--that feeling of security, belonging and deep caring one human to another on an intimate level.


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## nice777guy (Nov 23, 2009)

So - no matter how attractive your spouse is - the thrill and dizziness will not last, but can be replaced by a nice, but not quite so intense, feeling.

So - even Halle Berry becomes "been there, done that..." at some point. (pardon the crudeness)

And at that point, it comes down to personal responsbility.

Halle would need to continue to do things - actively do things - to show her spouse she cares - but its ultimately up to her spouse to control his own need for the short-term rush we get from a new, exciting relationship.


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

Conrad said:


> NG,
> 
> How could he possibly upgrade?
> 
> ...


Ahem, that would be Norway, our evil cousin. Sweden has outlawed this for nearly a century.

Now back on topic,sure some people might get tired of looking at the same person day in and day out and most likely those marriages don't survive namely due to being built on superficial things to begin with. Those that were built on something deeper, well those are the 75 year olds who still look at each other with love in their eyes and don't notice the wrinkles. They just see the beauty. 
My Grandfather had it with his girlfriend of 47 years. He would often ask me "Is Iris not the most beautiful woman in the world?". To him, she looked like Ginger Rodgers. All I saw as an 11 year old were wrinkles but to him, he didn't notice. As I grew up I grew to understand this a bit more. We see people how we want to see them. If we love them enough and get love in return, we see them through our own eyes, our ideal.
On my Grandfather's dying day, Iris was there, as we all were. She stroked his hair and said "Isn't he the most handsome man on the planet?". I was 17 and he looked like a skeleton as colon cancer was taking his life but to her, he looked like Fred Astaire. 
When true love exists, you overlook the other things. You see through it. My husband told me last weekend that I am the most beautiful woman he has ever seen. Me, pushing 40, yeah, well, I know I am not but to him, he sees this. And for me? I see him as the most handsome man I have ever met, him turning 40 next month. 
So, to wrap things up...if you marry for looks/fortune/status or anything else, yeah, looks are always going to be important and you will eventually cheat. If you marry for something else, yeah...true love is possible as well as hot sex, understanding, passion and compatibility. 
Which would you choose?


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## Trenton (Aug 25, 2010)

I think stars face unique circumstances and that infidelity and break up of marriage is even higher than those who aren't famous. I bet they have about an 80% divorce rate so if you were trying to make a correlation between beauty and divorce using the famous you could draw the conclusion that beauty actually works against long-term relationship success rather than for it.


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## greenpearl (Sep 3, 2010)

I think for some men, no matter how beautiful, how gorgeous, how sexy, how caring the wives are, these men will stray away. It is in their genes, they are hungry for power, they are greedy for money, they are thirsty for fame, they are lustful after women. One woman is not enough. 

And those men are surrounded by beautiful young women, how many of them can resist the temptation? If they don't have high moral standards to restrict themselves, it is not surprising that they lust one after another, the wisest thing for a woman to do is to stay away from this type of men. 

That's why I keep on saying nice guys are keepers. If a woman really want to be babied by a man, look for a nice guy, he tends to more faithful, he knows that it is not right if he hurts his wife by fooling around. 

As a human being, we have responsibilities. 

As a husband, the man should know better that there is temptation in this world, a lot of temptation. But his responsibilities tell him that he has to resist all these temptation, he has to focus on his wife and his family. Only a man like this grows old with a happy family around him!


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## Affaircare (Jan 11, 2010)

> So - no matter how attractive your spouse is - the thrill and dizziness will not last, but can be replaced by a nice, but not quite so intense, feeling.
> 
> So - even Halle Berry becomes "been there, done that..." at some point. (pardon the crudeness)
> 
> ...


Well in a summary, yes. 

The thrill and dizziness can not last. People who are junkies of anything have to perpetually chase "more and more" in order to get that same "rush" because eventually, whether you want it to or not...whether it's healthy or not...you body builds up some tolerance. Envision a drug addict who gradually has to do more of the drug and/or more often...or an adrenalin junkie who has to do more and more extreme stuff to get the same "thrill." 

So using your analogy, Halle Berry might not become "been there, done that" because just by existing she meets some needs for physical attractiveness and probably financial support. If she did nothing else, and was just silent and met those needs, what would eventually happen "brain chemistry-wise" is rather than creating speed, your brain creates morphine. On speed, your heart races, your palms sweet, you're obsessed...right? Sounds like that infatuation "thrill" to me! Well on morphine, you're calm, you're happy, nothing really bothers you or hurts you. Okay so this is after the honeymoon and after you've gotten passed the "who puts their things where" and you smile and think to yourself "Cool...I have a family!" and life is good. Halle Berry would not make you yawn at the thought of rolling in the hay, but it would possibly be more like strong happiness throughout 23 hours of the day followed by one hour of extreme pleasure. 

This is truly just a "guess" on my part--I've done no studies and don't know statistics to prove it--but my guess is that some people want the thrill part to be continuous (like an addict), and when that 2-3 year mark kicks in and they don't feel that "thrill" they think that means they aren't "in love" anymore...so they go to the NEXT guy or gal and do it all again. So year 2-3 or is a really dangerous year for affairs. 

Other folks recognize that the "thrill" won't last forever, hit that 2-3 year mark and transition into the "happily content with an hour of extreme pleasure" phase and that goes on probably about 7 more years (thus...about the 10th anniversary). During those 7 years, either they gradually grow somewhat lazy and lax with meeting needs and avoiding the things that kill love...or the love is gradually waning so they begin to grown lax with the meeting needs and avoiding hurtful things (can't tell which comes first, the chicken or the egg )...so right about 10th or 11th anniversary is another really dangerous year for affairs. Much of the content-family feeling is lost and even without meaning to, they can "find" some of that "thrill" with the janitor who admires them and doesn't react like an attack dog. 

Soooo...if a person like Halle Berry were to just exist, she meets two pretty vital needs (physical attractiveness and financial support). By speaking aloud she has the chance to either BUILD the happy connected feeling by meeting more needs (admiration, sharing some joint recreation, emotional support, etc.) or TEAR DOWN the happy connected feeling by engaging in love destroyers (like being judgmental, controlling, or attack-dog angry).

And this part: _"...its ultimately up to her spouse to *control* his own need for the short-term rush we get from a new, exciting relationship."_ That is so right on the money it's not even funny. I don't care if I'm married to Sean Connery (the sexiest, most physically attractive man on the planet)--if he's doing actions that kill the love...*I AM THE ONE RESPONSIBLE* for myself, for my promise to meet his needs, for protecting myself from temptation, and for communicating my needs and boundaries to him. That is absolutely, positively, 100% not his responsibility at all...no way. And if I fail, or if my choice is to not do those things, that is 100% fully and irrevocably on me...not him. 

It's up to me to control the need for 'the rush', recognize it can not last like a 'rush' forever, and do the work to get past the withdrawal of wanting 'the rush'. It's also up to me to be transparent and communicate what I need, and to work to stoke the blaze of love in my own marriage! I'm not saying you have to live without passion--but if you are not feeling much passion, work to build what you want with your spouse.


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

If you are vapid, you attract vapid. That is why Hollywood "marriages" don't work. 
Anybody want to read about a real relationship? I posted it but retracted it to add. Scroll back a tad. THAT is what a real relationship is. A true love relationship and one that I have told our boys about often and will be passed down for generations.


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## Trenton (Aug 25, 2010)

Brennan said:


> If you are vapid, you attract vapid. That is why Hollywood "marriages" don't work.
> Anybody want to read about a real relationship? I posted it but retracted it to add. Scroll back a tad. THAT is what a real relationship is. A true love relationship and one that I have told our boys about often and will be passed down for generations.


Scroll back where? I'm so confused. I want to know what a real relationship looks like!


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

Trenton said:


> Scroll back where? I'm so confused. I want to know what a real relationship looks like!


Page 4. THAT was a real relationship and a breathtaking one.


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## Trenton (Aug 25, 2010)

Brennan said:


> Ahem, that would be Norway, our evil cousin. Sweden has outlawed this for nearly a century.
> 
> Now back on topic,sure some people might get tired of looking at the same person day in and day out and most likely those marriages don't survive namely due to being built on superficial things to begin with. Those that were built on something deeper, well those are the 75 year olds who still look at each other with love in their eyes and don't notice the wrinkles. They just see the beauty.
> My Grandfather had it with his girlfriend of 47 years. He would often ask me "Is Iris not the most beautiful woman in the world?". To him, she looked like Ginger Rodgers. All I saw as an 11 year old were wrinkles but to him, he didn't notice. As I grew up I grew to understand this a bit more. We see people how we want to see them. If we love them enough and get love in return, we see them through our own eyes, our ideal.
> ...


Gotcha! Good on you.


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

Trenton said:


> Gotcha! Good on you.


Nope, good on my husband having met this fine man and understanding what true love is all about. My Grandfather taught me everything about love and my husband got to witness it and embrace it and learn from it. Both amazing men.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

nice777guy said:


> Doesn't sound like it!
> 
> But I'm wondering if after all she's been through if she wouldn't give it a chance for a change!
> 
> Still concerned about SA's husband's past...


I am lost - is the SA me ?? What do you mean?


My comment here "kinda like masterbation, men have no problem bragging about it, having competitions with each other in their youth - to how far they can shoot ". Yeah, I guess this sounds pretty strange, doesn't it? Another poster pmed me & told me this is called a "circle jerk". Never heard that term before. Just someone I know personally telling me he did this in his youth, He is not gay, although maybe supressed Bi, I don’t know, he would never admit it -if so. Not that I think this is common or anything, but I guess , for me, I found it rather amusing, like boys will be boys! They do alot of strange things in their youthful horniness!! I guess this was outside of the box though -ha ha 

NiceGuy -if you was thinking I meant this comment about my husband in his youth/past - Oh No - It was not him!! He would not be caught dead doing something like that. 



nice777guy said:


> So - no matter how attractive your spouse is - the thrill and dizziness will not last, but can be replaced by a nice, but not quite so intense, feeling.


 I know this is really backwards, but for me, I believe I have more intense feelings NOW towards my husband than I did back then when we married. I feel this is related to our more happening exploratory sex lives, how I FINALLY rid myself of that repressiveness I struggled with most of our marriage, it is like coming into the sun somehow. I feel like I just discovered something "new" in our lives that we have been deprivig ourselves of, this has led to an ever deeper connection- emotionally, spiritually, physically, the whole intense package. I have the attitude of a little kid in the candy store, and I don’t want it to stop, it IS addicting. So far, ongoing 2 + yrs in this mid life craze. 

As many things in life that we don’t think to consider -this too IS hormone related - I think I am a little high on the dopamine. From this article -- 

The science of love 

This part describes me well :

*Dopamine* 

Helen Fisher asked newly ‘love struck’ couples to have their brains examined and discovered they have high levels of the neurotransmitter dopamine. This chemical stimulates ‘desire and reward’ by triggering an intense rush of pleasure. It has the same effect on the brain as taking cocaine! 

Fisher suggests “couples often show the signs of surging dopamine: increased energy, less need for sleep or food, focused attention and exquisite delight in smallest details of this novel relationship” .




greenpearl said:


> That's why I keep on saying nice guys are keepers. If a woman really want to be babied by a man, look for a nice guy, he tends to more faithful, he knows that it is not right if he hurts his wife by fooling around.


This has been my total experience with my husband. :iagree:


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## 2sick (Nov 5, 2010)

nice777guy said:


> So - no matter how attractive your spouse is - the thrill and dizziness will not last, but can be replaced by a nice, but not quite so intense, feeling.
> 
> So - even Halle Berry becomes "been there, done that..." at some point. (pardon the crudeness)
> 
> ...


HMMM that seems to go back to the fact you can't base marriage of physical appearance but on (yup gonna say it) emotional connection!!!  Your spouse has to be your friend not just a sex symbol.


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## nice777guy (Nov 23, 2009)

SimplyAmorous said:


> I am lost - is the SA me ?? What do you mean?
> 
> 
> My comment here "kinda like masterbation, men have no problem bragging about it, having competitions with each other in their youth - to how far they can shoot ". Yeah, I guess this sounds pretty strange, doesn't it? Another poster pmed me & told me this is called a "circle jerk". Never heard that term before. Just someone I know personally telling me he did this in his youth, He is not gay, although maybe supressed Bi, I don’t know, he would never admit it -if so. Not that I think this is common or anything, but I guess , for me, I found it rather amusing, like boys will be boys! They do alot of strange things in their youthful horniness!! I guess this was outside of the box though -ha ha
> ...


OK - gotcha now! Thought this was something your H told you!

Just wondering though - how much of that increase in "intense" feeling is the by-product of an increased sex drive? Whatever the reason - its a great thing for you both!


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

nice777guy said:


> OK - gotcha now! Thought this was something your H told you!!


Geeze I am glad I cleared that up! My husband does not even want to see the men in soft porn for goodness sakes, his favorite is solo women, he is the furthest thing from gay/bi. 



nice777guy said:


> Just wondering though - how much of that increase in "intense" feeling is the by-product of an increased sex drive? Whatever the reason - its a great thing for you both!



I would say alot , as it helped us go places that we never went to before, in openness & expression. 

I am not sure which came 1st .... Let me explain... After making a Move Maker Video for my oldest son's Grad party, I decided to make one for Me & hubby, just us- I spent all night scanning pics, from our teen years until now, when I went to play this thing back with this MUSHY romantic song YouTube - Ronan Keating This I Promise You Lyrics , I just started balling , it was overwhelming , like where did all the years go ! looking at our young faces, the memories flooding back, it was like yesterday, but my baby is heading to college!!! I suddenly wanted to Relive our youth, experience the PASSION of youth again, Go back in time, this was VERY VERY strong for me. Why I say this was MY "Mid Life Crisis". It began there, and I guess I kept feeding anything remotely Romantic & sexual since that night/morning of "our video". 

What came 1st, the physical changes of a little increased Test or being ushered into this Mid Life Crisis by my EMOTIONAL response to desiring to be young again & relive what I feel we missed sexually - that fed this "intensity". I dont know, I guess it doesnt really matter ! 

Everyone should make a Video like that! it sure did a # on me !

I made one for a good friend of mine, scanned all thier wedding pics for them, it brought tears to the Husband's eyes when she played it back for him. They were going through a rough spot too, helped bring them a little closer.


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

I think most people get tired of sleeping with the same person for an extended period of time. I don't think Hollywood is a great example though. You don't find too many marriages there that last more than a few years, let alone 20 and even then, it is racked with infidelity. 
The key to a long term marriage is to keep it spicey. Go out, have fun, have a hobby together, go out on dates, do a home project together, go to a comedy club and laugh together, talk about your needs in bed and actually DO them.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

2sick said:


> HMMM that seems to go back to the fact you can't base marriage of physical appearance but on (yup gonna say it) emotional connection!!!  Your spouse has to be your friend not just a sex symbol.


It really helps if she is both


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## ASV (Feb 6, 2011)

I married my sweetheart 39 yrs ago and she looks as beautiful if not better than the day i met her.i would not trade her for anyone else.
Cause i don't think there is a woman this side of life that comes close to equalling her.

And yes, i have gotten hungry on the street at times,but i went always home to eat.


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## JustAGirl (Oct 1, 2010)

ASV said:


> I married my sweetheart 39 yrs ago and she looks as beautiful if not better than the day i met her.i would not trade her for anyone else.
> Cause i don't think there is a woman this side of life that comes close to equalling her.
> 
> And yes, i have gotten hungry on the street at times,but i went always home to eat.


:smthumbup:LOVE THIS!:smthumbup:

I want this!!


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## IanIronwood (Jan 7, 2011)

nice777guy said:


> Phrase it a bit differently - do you think Halle Berry ever catches her husband looking at porn on the internet? Do you think he has a Playboy subscription? Or is excited about the new SI Swimsuit Issue?
> 
> Do you think he's ever just "not in the mood" - even though its HALLE 'FREAKIN' BERRY?
> 
> ...


Oh, mais ouis. Every normal dude, no matter how pretty/sexual his wife is, whacks it on his own. It's an intrinsic part of our sexuality. 

One cannot love a single woman without loving all women, somewhat. 

Would you really like to be married to a woman who hated men . . . but loved you?


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