# Counselling or Diplomacy: when one side has to make all the concessions



## Zhopa

My wife and I have been through 6 or 7 sessions with a professional therapist. She seems really good at intervention in conflicts, but sometimes I think that it's better suited to diplomacy between countries than in couples: the therapist has me (willingly) making many concessions and changes, whereas my wife is making next to no changes, and refuses to work on intimacy 'until the rest of our relationship has improved'. 

To outside observers, things have seemed to 'improve'. My wife likes it because I keep everything to myself now. I feel like I'm dying inside. 

So when we have a row that results from stress rooted in her avoidance of intimacy, she immediately goes back to her mean old self, putting me down in front of others, using the row as a reason to say that I was not serious about the things that I was working on, that I didn't *mean it*. 

Surely counselling is more than the man working on 'things' so that someday the woman might be kind and decent to him again, and maybe even get randy?


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## bs193

Here is my take on this:

1. Compromise needs to come from both parties equally. You need to express to the therapist that you feel this is one sided.

2. I agree that working on intimacy should wait. How can it not with the dynamics you describe? Sounds like you want to work on the sex. That is not intimacy.

3. You should never feel like you are dying inside and nothing should be kept to yourself. All this needs to be discussed in therapy, and not "down the road". It needs to be addressed now.

4. I am not sure what you mean by "row", but a spouse should NEVER put their partner down in any setting but especially in front of others. I can't emphasize that enough. It should NEVER happen. Also consider that she only puts you down because you allow it to happen.

5. Based just on what you are saying (can't ignore we are only hearing your side of it), it sounds like your spouse has a lot to work on. You both do. If you don't feel it is being addressed in therapy, speak up. If you still don't think it is being addressed. Find another therapist.

I can't help to think you are being way too passive, and trying not to "rock the boat", just so she will eventually come around and have sex with you again. I hope I am wrong.


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## Zhopa

Dear BS193,

You have some interesting insights, though I disagree with some of what you said. Thanks for replying, it _*does *_help.

_> 1. Compromise needs to come from both parties equally. You need to express to the therapist that you feel this is one sided._​
When one party holds back on virtually everything in a marriage, yet the other turns himself inside out to make things better, compromise from both parties equally isn't really equal. It's easy for the wife to make some token concessions. And *that *is what I have figured out and have to express to the therapist.

_2. I agree that working on intimacy should wait. How can it not with the dynamics you describe? Sounds like you want to work on the sex. That is not intimacy._​
Now that's a tricky one. Sex and intimacy are two sets that intersect more for some, less for others. In my case they coincide closely. The feminist dogma that says that men are interested in sex whilst women want intimacy, I don't buy. But you're right, it's pointless, and it creates a high-demand, low-supply situation for both sex and intimacy, in which the price can be very very high. So I have decided to remove the demand.

_4. ...a spouse should NEVER put their partner down in any setting but especially in front of others.... consider that she only puts you down because you allow it to happen._​
Try reversing the genders... it would be highly politically incorrect to tell a woman that she's getting emotionally and verbally abused because she allows it to happen. You'd be accused of misogyny and perhaps banned from forums such as this.

But you're right. I have to find a way to refuse her abusive way in a diplomatic way without raising my voice or losing my cool... which would set others against me and it's wrong to show anger in front of a child. Since she does it from her 'safe space', hiding behind our child or other people, I have to take that away from her. Thank you for this insight.

_I can't help to think you are being way too passive, and trying not to "rock the boat", just so she will eventually come around and have sex with you again. I hope I am wrong._​
You're right actually. My trying not to rock the boat is one of the concessions gained by her in therapy. Rather than rock the boat, I'm supposed to bring the matter to a weekly $100 session that I can ill afford. 'Matters' are queuing up and I don't think I'll ever have enough money to address them all.... but it sure does a lot for the marriage counselling business!


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## DTO

A couple of observations:

1) Does the therapist know how you feel? Could it be that the therapist feels you will compromise, it's all you can do to get your wife to show up, and she's working with what she has? 

What if you told your therapist "I do want to work on the marriage, but maintaining the marriage at all costs is not my goal, and my wife needs to get the message that we can come here both ready to give a little, or I can go to the attorney down the street instead of here"?

2) If she expects you to just "suck it up" and not bother her with your needs, what does that say about the value she assigns to you and the marriage?


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## Zhopa

Good points, DTO, I will think about this.


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## EleGirl

DTO said:


> A couple of observations:
> 
> 1) Does the therapist know how you feel? Could it be that the therapist feels you will compromise, it's all you can do to get your wife to show up, and she's working with what she has?
> 
> What if you told your therapist "I do want to work on the marriage, but maintaining the marriage at all costs is not my goal, and my wife needs to get the message that we can come here both ready to give a little, or I can go to the attorney down the street instead of here"?
> 
> 2) If she expects you to just "suck it up" and not bother her with your needs, what does that say about the value she assigns to you and the marriage?


:iagree:


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## EleGirl

What kind of changes does this therapist have you making?

Have you addressed your wife being mean and putting you down in private or in front of others? It’s also unacceptable for you to accuse you constantly not working on improvements. If so what has the therapist said?

You are right that counseling should not be about only one spouse (in your case the man) working on “things” while the other takes an attitude of wait and see. The one thing I can think of is maybe the counselor sees you as the more reasonable person. One person can change a marriage. Because when one person changes the other has to change in response to it. Right now your wife seems to be fighting your attempts to change. She may complain about you. But sometimes a person gets very comfortable with the misery they have sunk into and/or created. And they loath leaving it. After all they are now comfortable in their misery.

It seems to me that the counselor sees you as the one who can lead your marriage out of the funk it’s in.


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