# Strip Clubs/VIP Dances, or, Private Dances



## Soon_To_Be_Mrs (Dec 21, 2011)

Coming from a happy, healthy and committed relationship. I'm soon to be married, in early 2013. I couldn't be HAPPIER, or more in love, and it goes both ways. I often think to myself "I wish everyone could experience this kind of love, devotation, commitment and happiness in their life time; it's truly amazing." 

I previously have had 1 serious relationship that was very controlling and abusive; physically, sexually and emotionally. As you can imagine, it was everything BUT what a real relationship is like, or is about.

I am a confident, secure, honest and a loyal woman. I'm very innocent when it comes to relationships, and other than what i've read, researched myself, or taken elective credits in school, I don't have much "real time" experience with relationships. 


He possesses the same traits, and he has had one relationship also. She was unfaithful (and denied it), and he ended their relationship. He spoke her nearly 6 years later over dinner, to clear the water, which he has never spoken to her again. Not relevant, but show's his level of confidence, honesty and trueness to himself

Niether of us have a lot of relationship experience, but I have had longer experience then him. I have had way less experience with different partners, and he has had more experience with different partners in the bedroom (Not in a bad way, but lived the typical college bachelor life).

We are honest and open with each other. We trust each other. We have good communications skills over all, and every area of our commitment to each other is exceptional. We are two very in love and happy individuals.

His young, 20 something year old (virgin) work buddy is shipping out for the marines in febuary. Some work buddies and him (Fiance) are planning to take the virgin marine out to the strip club for his going away party. I get it. There guys, and he is over the age of 20 and a virgin.

While chatting the other day about the going away event he mentions "..since my birthday is in febuary I thought we would do it all in one celebration weekend." Im also ok with that, but didn't expect him to celebrate his birthday in this kind of way...I thought it was about his Virgin co-worker going not his birthday, BUT..the reality of that is..it's convienent, and I don't care. No questions ask..I like to pick and chose my thoughts/battles..and It does not bother me he goes. Through our conversation, I asked if he thought VIP Dances/Private dances are an ok thing to do during a committed relationship, or in marriage. He personally thinks they are. I do not. He asked me what I thought, and I told him "I don't think they are ok." He said he wouldn't get one then, out of respect for me. I respect that, and that's all I'm looking for..that's EXACTLY what I'm looking for, or ask. Beyond that, I trust him, and there is no doubt in my mind he will hold true to his word.

However, a lot of different emotions and questions seem to popping up in my mind. I don't get it. I don't get men. Maybe it's my pure outlook on relationships and marriage, or my innocensse but a day later, and I feel sad he thinks they are ok. I've thought this out a little more and here are some things that come to mind..


Why does he think this is ok?

Had I not given my viewpoint..and he ever proceeded with one..I would feel like..

This is emotional cheating. You have another woman that you have picked out and paid that you think is sexually attractive to give you a personal, private, sexual dance. You are emotionally thinking about another women sexually, and physically have her there, dancing around you naked, or even on top of you naked. Yeah, he can't touch her, nor would he touch her, but she can touch him. Would he allow her to dance on his lap; grinding, moving, etc. OR put/rub her lady bits on him/in his face-I don't know? Probably..that's truly the point of a VIP dance. How is this not cheating? If this was going on at a bar, it would be cheating, but because he has made advanced plans to go, and is PAYING her for this, it's not considered cheating...only because it's socially acceptable for men to do this?

I understand men are visual creatures, but why is it not satisfying enough to be 3 feet from her watching her dance on stage, rather than having her dance for you, on top of you, alone in a VIP.

How could the thought of wanting another women to sexually arouse him go through his head? He said it wouldn't be arousing to him..BUT..that is the sole intent and purpose of a VIP dance. Granted, a male stripper would not give me the same sexual satisfaction a female one would for a male, but in the same light, even though it doesn't, there is no way I would ever want a VIP dance from a male stripper, or morally feel it would be ok. My feelings are, if you have a dedicated, loyal and spouse at home (he is just as good to me too, folks), that you could do anything you want with, why is the thought of partaking in sexual things with another woman there?

Final verdict for me? 

Strip clubs--PARTY it up (!!) Yes, He is coming home to me at the end of the night. And I have full faith and trust in him and our relationship..

VIP Dances/Private dances- No chance. Not appropriate in my eyes, at all. Would it be the end of the world if he did? No, i'd get over it, because this is what society is like anyway, but I'd be hurt, and we would have some rough terrian to go over. Point is, he wouldn't do it, because he loves and respects me.

ANYWAY,

I prefer responses to be from BOTH men and women, as well as from married people, or from someone whom has been in a devoted, happy and healthy relationship for some time. 

Thoughts/opionions. What do you think?

Thanks!

The Mrs To Be!!


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

My wife is a skilled pole dancer, and I even learnt a few tricks from her (but no one in RL knows that >.<... f--king embarrassing for a man to be on a pole)
But that's her past (and it includes far more then just pole dancing), still it's an effective form of exercise. A close friend of ours who also knew her past told me that others paid almost double the usual escort rate where I get it all for free and without effort.

Still, skill and talent isn't everything. I can be judged as an unappreciative bastard but I'm testiment to the fact that men are not just all about sex.


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## Soon_To_Be_Mrs (Dec 21, 2011)

To funny!!!

Thanks for reading and for your viewpoint. I can agree, to some sense, what your saying, however, the reality of the situation is, is there is a difference between being a skilled pole dance, and being a stripper? Yes. Strippers are there to demonstrate their skills in a sexual way-Why--Because they are naked, and it goes beyond just a pole dance, men are there for the sexual experience, or, for the visual of naked women dancing for them.

As far as pole dancing-- I get that. But going back to the feelings I'm having..why does it have to be naked skilled dancers..if it was about skilled pole dancing..if those were the true intentions and people were that intrigued by the art of pole dancing..there would be much more mainstream ways of viewing it..or even participating in it and it would be directed towards different audiences..and exclude nudity. 

But..it's about VIP dances and private dances..not watching women pole dance. Paying women extra money..for one on one time..for what? What is the true intentions and point of a vip dance. I'd love to hear men's true and honest definitions of what the purpose of a VIP dance is. 

The more I write, the more I feel..well maybe this is something that I need to communicate directly with him on.


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## 2nd_t!me iz_best (Feb 28, 2011)

in my view either party in a relationship going to a strip club, is as you said, emotional cheating.
you are going with the intent of being at least visually satisfied sexually by someone outside of your relationship no matter what excuse you use, ie taking out a virgin going into the military, or anything else.
i view it as disrespecting the SO and the relationship, even if they say it ok with them.


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## CalifGuy (Nov 2, 2011)

*Re: VIP dances for comitted man at the strip club..ok or not?*

Newsflash....VIP lapdances are usually in private rooms and may include a handjob or even blowjob if the tip is right. At a minimum, the guy is probably allowed to finger her...so, if you are ok with your man fingering another woman, then, sure, nothing wrong with a VIP lap dance. 

The most fun I have ever had at a strip club is when my wife (then fiancee) went to a strip club, two very sexy dancers gave us VIP lap dances, encouraged us to finger them, made out with my wife a little and promised us some real fun if we bought 30 minute dances (I think it would have been $100 for each dancer). 

Instead, we declined, went upstairs to a private video booth and had sex with each other...free of charge...hellloooo. 

I seriously doubt that your man will NOT get a dance but ignorance is bliss although it has bothered you enough to start this thread so I think you are more concerned than you say.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

We still have a pole in our garage as it's rather dangerous inside the house.

As for strip clubs and VIP dances meh, if I want art, I have my wife. I may complain about other issues, but I can't deny her talent.


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## 2nd_t!me iz_best (Feb 28, 2011)

RandomDude said:


> As for strip clubs and VIP dances meh, if I want art, I have my wife.


i think a lot of things would be better if more people thought this way.


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## tacoma (May 1, 2011)

I`m going to add some fuel to your fire.



> While chatting the other day about the final touches of his planning for this going away event (It's a surprise) he mentions "yeah, since my birthday is in febuary we thought we would do a all in one celebration weekend."


You speak as if he is just going to the club to "watch" some girls dance.

This party is ...

-For his birthday (as well as the going away for the other guy)
-With a bunch of guys celebrating his birthday (as well as the going away for the other guy)
-You`re getting married...soon??

I`m going to assume you``ve never seen a b-day/bachelor celebration in a strip club with a large group of guys.

Your fiancé' will get "special" attention all night as his friends will be buying girls and the girls will be all over that group looking for the cash.

He may even become part of the stage show as is customary in some clubs.
It`s likely every girl in the club will be on him at some point or other during the night.

Now even if he is totally innocent the pressure will be intense and the situation will probably be drunken.
He will be in a VERY difficult position to say "no".

If the night goes typically he`s going to be in situations you would not approve of.

I tell you this at great risk to myself.
I just publicly broke the "guy code"


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## 2nd_t!me iz_best (Feb 28, 2011)

tacoma said:


> I`m going to add some fuel to your fire.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


SHAME ON YOU!! 
the guy code is sacred. 
but he is right.


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## JJG (Mar 9, 2011)

*Re: VIP dances for comitted man at the strip club..ok or not?*

Hi STBM

I agree with you that VIP/Privte dances are not acceptable when in a serious relationship. I think it is great that you discussed it before it became a problem and that he agreed not to have any. I see no reason why you shouldnt believe him.

I also found out that my fiance (then bf) didnt see a problem with it. We were talking about someones stag party and he mentioned that his brother had one (he was engaged at the time). I went crazy about how awful it was that he did that, my fiance was surprised i reacted that way.

I do think that everyone has completely different ideas about was is and is not acceptable, all we can do is make sure the ones we are with know/respect our boundaries.


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## Beowulf (Dec 7, 2011)

I took my wife to a strip club and she got more attention then I did. Haven't been back since. True story. :banghead:

Seriously though, strip clubs are fun when you're younger and it's all new but eventually it gets to be boring. Last time I went to one we took a couple of friends that had never been. Me and my buddy watched tv most of the time (football playoffs were on). It was kind of a "been there, done that" feeling for us. After the game was over we scraped their chins off the floor (we brought large spatulas) and headed out. No big deal really.


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

It may not seem like a big deal now (the strip club shet) but it will be once you're married. It's funny how things flip.

I am so thankful that my husband doesn't see the point of watching women dance. He's just not into strip clubs...never has been  Lucky me.


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## Soon_To_Be_Mrs (Dec 21, 2011)

Thanks for the replies! After a good nights sleep and some feed back-- I feel better, and have a better idea of how I feel about this. I got caught up in the emotions of why does he feel it's ok to have VIP dance. I feel that it's taking the strip club experience to a whole other level. 

I'm completely fine with him going to the strip club. I could care less if he looked at naked women parading around a stage to make money. I still feel VIP dances are not ok, but I have full faith and confidence in the fact that if anything inappriopriate were to be suggested-- He would not partake, at all. No question in my mind. 

I've been to a strip club once, and yes, I got more attention then anyone in the club. Infact, several strippers tag teamed me, brought me onstage--and tried ripping my pants down. Of course, I didn't let this happen--But I do think most strippers are not stripping to step on a wifes toes. They are there to make money. Of course, there are the select few women who would go above and beyond, or allow more to happen then others, but going back to the trust thing-- I trust that he would not allow this to happen. 

He has said before"It all really is the same thing"--no matter if feelings/love/emotions are involved or not. I feel differently, and I don't agree. It is different for me. My viewpoint isn't going to change his viewpoint OR opinion. I understand. But in light, it's further testoment a stripper means nothing to him. It's useless..he doesn't care..but still..if it's all the same..why is a VIP dance ok?


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

Get ready for heartache.

VIP dances? Wow.


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## nice777guy (Nov 23, 2009)

So - in your other post - I missed where you said that you were only engaged.

Just playing Devil's Advocate here and wondering if that should make a difference...? Anyone?

Part of me thinks that - in this situation (engaged, going out with "buds" - almost like a bachelor party) - that a lap dance or two is actually ok.

But then from there - it can be kind of a slippery slope. 

Overall though - I still think that your feelings about this are the biggest thing to consider - much moreso than the advice you might get from some of these pervs on this board!!!


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## Scannerguard (Jan 26, 2010)

There are two viewpoints to this:

*A. Puritan View*

Sexuality for a male and female in love and committed to each other begins and ends with each other.

*B. Non-puritan View *

Sexuality will extend beyond the confines of a relationship. I am not saying sex does. . .but sexuality. Over the years, there will be flirting, crushes, fantasies, oggling at beaches, male fluffing his feathers at the beach, etc.

You'll have to decide which viewpoint you subscribe to more. . .

I am not trying to bias the answer (because a Puritan kind of conjures up images of a man and woman holding a Bible, dressed in black up to their necks, wearing boots). . .but Europeans, from what I understand, don't hold such Puritan views of sexuality as Americans.

The whole thing with Monica Lewinski left Europeans scratching their heads. Then again, many European woman are resigned that European husbands just, as a matter of coruse, have an affair/lover when in their 30's and 40's. In America, American women would see this as a deal breaker and be looking to convert their marriage into an annuity.

I am just saying 2 filters are being applied when coming to a conclusion.

I say this being a man who has no interest in strip clubs.

I have also never looked at pornography, another woman on the beach, I never fantasized about other women, and I never exercise with the intent of attracting the opposite sex. Also never had a crush on another woman when I was married.

Never in a million years. 

( I also knew when to deny. . .I was married for 14 years after all )


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## Scannerguard (Jan 26, 2010)

LOL. . .I am thinking of a movie. It was a chick flick. . .a chick at work was making me watch it (I like Chick Flicks).

It's about 2 women who switch places. One lives in England and the other in the US.

Anyway, the opening scene for one of the women is her breaking up with her boyfriend, where there hadn't been intimacy for awhile. She is very suspicious he slept with a co-worker.

She screams from the window, "Look. . .I can handle it! Just tell me! I won't get mad. I just want the truth. Did you sleep with her?"

The gardener is clipping the hedges and watching teh whole thing unfold and he's swinging his head back and forth, mouthing the words, "No. . .no. . .no. . .don't fess up."

Of course, he confesses and she flips out.

Comic moment.

The gardener knew what he was talking about. . .


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## Soon_To_Be_Mrs (Dec 21, 2011)

nice777guy said:


> So - in your other post - I missed where you said that you were only engaged.
> 
> Just playing Devil's Advocate here and wondering if that should make a difference...? Anyone?
> 
> ...


We are engaged, yes.

I feel that it should make a difference. Unfortunately, society is what it is, and engagement and marriage is taken pretty lightly. Yes, there is a difference between engagement and marriage, but ultimately, the same intentions and commitment is there. In the same light, why would it be not be ok to do as a married man, rather than an engaged man? I do see you are just looking for different viewpoints and opinions, and don't particularly see it that way. 

My personal viewpoint is that there is a difference between a lap dance out in the open, rather than in a VIP room or as a "Private dance." Still, would I agree if he approached a stripper wanting a lap dance in the open- no. Would I feel differently if one of his buddies bought him a lap dance- yes. He wouldn't be the one provoking having another woman do things to him, I personally feel only a SO, or Wife should do. 


I guess my other nagging feeling and thought would be this. Flipping the tables..if any of the things that happened in/at strip clubs happened in a different setting, it would be considered cheating. However, because a strippers job is to do what strippers do, you pay them, and it's a planned event for a special occassion, it's considered acceptable. Why?


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## nice777guy (Nov 23, 2009)

Soon_To_Be_Mrs said:


> We are engaged, yes.
> 
> I feel that it should make a difference. Unfortunately, society is what it is, and engagement and marriage is taken pretty lightly. Yes, there is a difference between engagement and marriage, but ultimately, the same intentions and commitment is there. In the same light, why would it be not be ok to do as a married man, rather than an engaged man? I do see you are just looking for different viewpoints and opinions, and don't particularly see it that way.
> 
> ...


Because - its their job! If some random girl came up to me and started dancing that way for free I would probably propose to her (almost divorced - not married - would be 'legal'). 

But a dancer - you almost have to use your imagination to really get much out of it. She's only there because you paid her $20 or whatever. And - when the song is over - she'll move on and dance for someone else.

Its not considered acceptable by everyone. Not even close.

I guess I see a bachelor party as a one-time event.

But - after marriage - telling your Husband that he's allowed to get dances opens an entirely different (and potentially ongoing) can of worms.

I don't disagree with you - just kind of thinking out loud!


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## Soon_To_Be_Mrs (Dec 21, 2011)

Scannerguard said:


> There are two viewpoints to this:
> 
> *A. Puritan View*
> 
> ...


I agree with your two definitions. I can see how a Puritan view would remind you of two individuals being church going people, etc. 

And..I know all of what you said. I agree. I have no problem with all of the above. Why? Because they are not naked, performing sexual acts for money. What would be the next closest thing to cheating? PHYSICALLY cheating. It is cheating in my mind. 

To put things in a better..or different perspective..here..

He has made countless comments about other, beautiful women; Both on TV, and in real life. I don't care. It doesn't bother me that he thinks other women are beautiful, hot, or that he is physically attracted to him. Women ARE beautiful. What DOES bother me.. (I'm still teetering whether I mention it or not) is the amount of comments. Sometimes, it's OBVIOUS when another women is pretty. I'm ok with the jokey joke comments like seeing a woman jogging and him saying "Oooo my! Look at those things (Referring to her boobs) do you think she is wearing a underwire or sports bra?" That to me is funny, and he is bringing commical relief into the situation. When he has stated more than once throughout a movie, he thinks the main character is hot, and has ooed and ahhed..to the point I've tried conversing with him..and his soo sucked into the woman on tv he doesn't respond for a minute or two after I say something..that does bother me.


In the same respect..

We've went to the naughty store together, picked out items to use together, or alone..bought movies together..watched them..magazines..read articles together..etc. We are very open with each other. I like it, I think it's great and I really enjoy doing these things together. The porno on tv doesn't bother me...whether it's with me..or alone, by himself. It's different. These are women he'll never meet, never touch, smell..etc. 

Watching a stripper dance on stage- Fine. Having his buddies buy him a lap dance in the audience- Fine. But having another woman, dance provactively for him..on top of him..touching him..kissing his neck..etc. Not ok. Why is her dancing 3 feet away from you on stage..not enough. Why does it need to be private..


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## nice777guy (Nov 23, 2009)

Soon_To_Be_Mrs said:


> Watching a stripper dance on stage- Fine. Having his buddies buy him a lap dance in the audience- Fine. But having another woman, dance provactively for him..on top of him..touching him..kissing his neck..etc. Not ok. Why is her dancing 3 feet away from you on stage..not enough. Why does it need to be private..


Sounds like you have your boundaries - and they are reasonable. Just make sure you have discussed this with him well in advance of his outing!


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## Soon_To_Be_Mrs (Dec 21, 2011)

nice777guy said:


> Because - its their job! If some random girl came up to me and started dancing that way for free I would probably propose to her (almost divorced - not married - would be 'legal').
> 
> But a dancer - you almost have to use your imagination to really get much out of it. She's only there because you paid her $20 or whatever. And - when the song is over - she'll move on and dance for someone else.
> 
> ...


Thinking out loud as well. I don't disagree with you either. I'm getting a better understanding of his viewpoint!! lol! Thank you!


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## Scannerguard (Jan 26, 2010)

Yes, your boundaries are more than reasonable.

And again, I wasn't trying to bash the Puritan viewpoint of sexuality. 

I don't agree with the Liberal viewpoint altogether either of Europeans, where it's commonplace for the man to take a lover when the marriage is advancing in years and quietly accepted by society. I put that in there to contrast the different viewpoints and the consequences:

*Puritan Viewpoint of Marital Sexuality:*

May often end up with unrealistic boundaries of sexuality that are so restrictive, it hurts the marriage. You end up with a henpecked husband with a wife standing next to him with a rolling pin (to borrow another famous image).

*European Viewpoint of Marital Sexuality:*

May end up with such liberal activities that the marriage completely dissolves and the two never achieve the oneness that two people seek (a unification). 

I'm with someone now who seems to be a healthy moderate of the two and you seem to be in a healthy middle with this.


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

*Re: VIP dances for comitted man at the strip club..ok or not?*



CalifGuy said:


> *Newsflash....VIP lapdances are usually in private rooms and may include a handjob or even blowjob if the tip is right. At a minimum, the guy is probably allowed to finger her...so, if you are ok with your man fingering another woman, then, sure, nothing wrong with a VIP lap dance. *
> 
> The most fun I have ever had at a strip club is when my wife (then fiancee) went to a strip club, two very sexy dancers gave us VIP lap dances, encouraged us to finger them, made out with my wife a little and promised us some real fun if we bought 30 minute dances (I think it would have been $100 for each dancer).
> 
> ...


I see lapdances and especially the VIP room as cheating. Same way for the ladys who have the interactive pull toy private strippers. My boundary is look but don't touch. That said, I avoid strip clubs.

It is good that you are talking about these things now. I suggest His Needs Her Needs and for you to discuss, define and implement agreed upon boundaries. If you have trouble agreeing to the boundaries then you have learned you are not compatible. Not saying this is the case with you but have you noticed that abused women and men for that matter often fall into a string of these type of relationships. Don't be afraid to have your own boundaries. The easoest way to deal with a mistake is to avoid it to begin with.

Frankly if he knows it is your boundary and he would be disrespecting you by doing this then he should not do it at all.
I mean seriously in the total scheme of things this is important to him!? I understand why it is important to you. Why he would choose to do this knowing it hurts you is a RED FLAG.


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

nice777guy said:


> So - in your other post - I missed where you said that you were only engaged.
> 
> Just playing Devil's Advocate here and wondering if that should make a difference...? Anyone?
> 
> ...


As far as faithfulness, married, engaged or in a long term relationship is pretty much the same. Pretty much meaning that it is easier just to call of the wedding before the ceremony. In no way do I view the week before a wedding as being single for example. The bachelor / bachelorette party stuff involving unfaithfulness is very old school and has little place in more modern times. Just my opinion. YMMV.

Also I think it is little solice that a partner paid for pseudo sex. A stripper is ok ... they are a professional. LOL. Yes they have their own nuances of why one is bad but c'mon neither is a good idea. let's see a shovel in the face or a kick in the balls ...


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## nice777guy (Nov 23, 2009)

*Re: VIP dances for comitted man at the strip club..ok or not?*



Entropy3000 said:


> Same way for the ladys who have the interactive pull toy private strippers.


:scratchhead:

???


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## tjohnson (Mar 10, 2010)

I consider myself pretty liberal as is my wife. 

My wife is ok for me to go to a strip club (to a point or depending on where she is in her hormonal cycle LOL (but true) She was OK with lap dances for my bachelor party. I used to think lap dances are OK but, not anymore. They are way too personal. I hate to admit this but, if my friends buy me one i will take the dance but, will not let the girl grind, or touch me. I will say that this is an area many man feel it is OK to lie about. It falls into a similar rehlm as porn since it is not cheating in minds of men that feel this way (again) this is not my opinion. I don't think it is cheating or not per se - but, could be a violation of trust. 

For the record I believe most clubs you will not find BJS, hand jobs, figering or the like. I have heard of guys comming in their pant from the grinding. 

I think it is good to establish boundries before marriage. 

MY .02


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

*Re: VIP dances for comitted man at the strip club..ok or not?*



nice777guy said:


> :scratchhead:
> 
> ???


Yeah, idunno. You hear things. Like maybe women have their fun too. But you are right I have never been allowed in to one of those. I was not going to elaborate on this as even I would think it a bit of a tangent. My only point is that women have their VIP room activities available to them as well. How would her fiance feel about that?

Ok so now you make me think I should have gone with boy toy instead. Point taken. LOL.


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

tjohnson said:


> I consider myself pretty liberal as is my wife.
> 
> *My wife is ok for me to go to a strip club (to a point or depending on where she is in her hormonal cycle LOL *(but true) She was OK with lap dances for my bachelor party. I used to think lap dances are OK but, not anymore. They are way too personal. I hate to admit this but, if my friends buy me one i will take the dance but, will not let the girl grind, or touch me. I will say that this is an area many man feel it is OK to lie about. It falls into a similar rehlm as porn since it is not cheating in minds of men that feel this way (again) this is not my opinion. I don't think it is cheating or not per se - but, could be a violation of trust.
> 
> ...


Hormonal cycle. Yes indeed. Much depends on this. Most of us guys just get confused by this but we really should know better.

My policy is that I tell the dancer to keep the money as a gift. If my colleagues / friends want to buy me something then they can buy me a drink.

Before i was married I enjoyed strip clubs. Persoanly I can enjoy the scenery but I am just as likely to be checking out the screen with SportsCenter much of the time. I think this is something between a given couple to decide for themselves.


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

tjohnson said:


> I consider myself pretty liberal as is my wife.
> 
> My wife is ok for me to go to a strip club (to a point or depending on where she is in her hormonal cycle LOL (but true) She was OK with lap dances for my bachelor party. I used to think lap dances are OK but, not anymore. They are way too personal. I hate to admit this but, if my friends buy me one i will take the dance but, will not let the girl grind, or touch me. I will say that this is an area many man feel it is OK to lie about. It falls into a similar rehlm as porn since it is not cheating in minds of men that feel this way (again) this is not my opinion. I don't think it is cheating or not per se - but, could be a violation of trust.
> 
> ...


It's cheating. Would you be cool with your wife getting the same action and lying about it? Think about that.


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## 2nd_t!me iz_best (Feb 28, 2011)

Soon_To_Be_Mrs said:


> However, because a strippers job is to do what strippers do, you pay them, and it's a planned event for a special occassion, it's considered acceptable. Why?


really?
do you accept this?
what about if he saw a prostitute?
if it wasnt in a private setting by himself, he had some buddies with him and maybe a couple prostitutes just to round it out?
would this be ok because 'its her job, shes just going to do what she does then move on to the next customer'?

i dont feel any of this that you are describing is good.
i would consider it cheating and disrespectful.
if a man wants to see a woman stripping for him, he should be into his SO enough that she will be more than enough for him and he should enjoy her.


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## tacoma (May 1, 2011)

*Re: VIP dances for comitted man at the strip club..ok or not?*



Entropy3000 said:


> Yeah, idunno. You hear things. Like maybe women have their fun too. But you are right I have never been allowed in to one of those. I was not going to elaborate on this as even I would think it a bit of a tangent. My only point is that women have their VIP room activities available to them as well. How would her fiance feel about that?
> 
> Ok so now you make me think I should have gone with boy toy instead. Point taken. LOL.


I used to work in a club that had a male review.

A traditional female strip club is like a Sunday morning in church compared to what the most innocent housewives get up to at a male strip show.

It`s so indecent it`s ****ing scary and that statement comes from a guy who is about as non-puritanical as can be.

No way my wife is ever going to one while she`s married to me.


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## Grayson (Oct 28, 2010)

I'm going to skip over most of the responses for a moment and just add my own two pennies.

I think it all depends on what the couple agrees is acceptable.

I'd been to strip clubs maybe half a dozen times before my wife and I first began seeing one another about 11.5 years ago. In that time, I'd only ever gotten a single lapdance and no VIP/private dances. In the past year and a half, my wife and I have started going to a strip club together on the average of once a month. We've still never gotten a VIP or private dance, although at least one of us usually gets one or more lapdances per trip. As often as we go, we HAVE considered joining their VIP program, and we have a favorite dancer or two that we wouldn't mind getting a private dance from, but wouldn't be expecting anything more than what happens in a lapdance...just a longer time period, without any other distractions. We know what the cliches of VIP dances are, but honestly can't say whether there's any truth to them or not.

At any rate, if you're not comfortable with it, that's something for both of you to consider and respect.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Soon_To_Be_Mrs (Dec 21, 2011)

*Re: VIP dances for comitted man at the strip club..ok or not?*



Entropy3000 said:


> I see lapdances and especially the VIP room as cheating. Same way for the ladys who have the interactive pull toy private strippers. My boundary is look but don't touch. That said, I avoid strip clubs.
> 
> It is good that you are talking about these things now. I suggest His Needs Her Needs and for you to discuss, define and implement agreed upon boundaries. If you have trouble agreeing to the boundaries then you have learned you are not compatible. Not saying this is the case with you but have you noticed that abused women and men for that matter often fall into a string of these type of relationships. Don't be afraid to have your own boundaries. The easoest way to deal with a mistake is to avoid it to begin with.
> 
> ...


I agree. I think it's cheating as well. There is in no circumstances, why that should be ok, in my book. 

Look but don't touch- yes. Whether she's touching you, or you are touching them. I agree.

I'm glad we talked about it before hand too, otherwise he would have not known I wasn't ok with VIP dances. He does respect and honor my boundaries, and that's all I can ask. 

I've learned through this, that sometimes you need to leave things off on the note of them respecting you and your thoughts, and leave it at that..not banter further or ask more questions. It ended up causing a mini fight..and I HATE fighting.


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## I Know (Dec 14, 2011)

I have no idea why people think private dances are a big deal if it is a 1 time thing. 

I have actually never been to one. So I am speaking hypothetically. 

But the women are paid to sit on your lap and grind. Maybe they make you come in your pants. You don't know the dancer. you will never know her. She doesn't want to know the johns. She wants the money. 

What's the big deal?


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## ScaredandUnsure (Nov 17, 2011)

This came up in once in my marriage. 
Conversation went something like this:
Ex Hubs: Hey, I'm going to the strip club with the guys
Me: Sweet, have fun
Ex Hubs: We're doing the VIP room
Me: Oh? Well I will tell you what, if it's okay for you to have another woman grinding all over you while naked, it's okay for me to go work in a VIP room and get naked and grind all over other men, right?
Ex Hubs: Um, maybe I won't go...

I was a stripper when I was 18, I know what kind of stuff goes on in those rooms, heck I know what went on in the bathroom, under the tables, etc. It was a very ugly place to work at. Never again.


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## Tall Average Guy (Jul 26, 2011)

Grayson said:


> I'm going to skip over most of the responses for a moment and just add my own two pennies.
> 
> I think it all depends on what the couple agrees is acceptable.
> 
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


:iagree::iagree::iagree:

At the end of the day, what matters is what you are comfortable with. It does not matter what others think, what works for them, or what rational they provide. What matters is what are your boundaries, and will your spouse or significant other respect those boundaries.


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## Nsweet (Mar 3, 2012)

I swear strip clubs are the creepiest places on earth. I mean a shirtless girl in a thong with implants comes up to you and tries to get you to talk to her by asking for your name or where you're from. Meanwhile I'm keeping one hand on my wallet and looking at like "WTF did you say?!... I don't know you.". And why it that every part of this anorexic girl is so soft to the touch except for her titties. 

I haven't been in a strip club for years because I felt so guilty about being aroused by the dancers when I was happily married. I had a gay friend who worked as the make up guy who told me how sad these girls are, and after talking to a few I saw it for what it really was... a degrating way to make quick cash for the sexual assalt victims of incest and rape, enabling opportunity for drug addicts, and only job some of these single mothers could hold down. 

I slept with some of these girls before I married, and every single one was just so sad underneith her stage persona. When they talked about their problems you could pick up on signs of rape or child molestation, and all these problems they were having. Not all of them mind you some really were students, but I could tell they really wrestled with the moral conflicts of exposing themselves and insecurities. No woman likes to feel like a cheap wh*re or a receptacle just for a man's excretions. 

I just hope in the future I do a good enough job as a father to keep my daughter(s) from stripping or experimenting with drugs.


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## diwali123 (Feb 17, 2012)

"But the women are paid to sit on your lap and grind. Maybe they make you come in your pants. You don't know the dancer. you will never know her. She doesn't want to know the johns. She wants the money."

"But the prostitutes are paid to bend over and let you screw them. Maybe you come, maybe you don't. You don't know her, all she wants is the money. What is the big deal?"

To me it's just another form of prostitution. I would be so upset if my H did this. Just like I know he would be upset if I had a guy grinding on me, shoving his crotch in my face.


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## br625 (Jun 27, 2012)

Here is a post I started on another thread a few months ago....

My husband had a client in from out of town and after a night out in the city they ended up at a strip club. My husband has gone a dozen times in the past 30 yrs. i have know him (sometimes with me) and has never lied to me about it. It's usually for a bachelor party or a celebration of some sort. It is not a problem at all, and a rarity. We've been married almost 24 years. This one trip to the strip club ended up costing him and his client a total of $1,800 between them. He doesn't remember what happened, although he swears it was just a drunk lap dance/tease. He has NEVER lied to me before and I think he would know if something more happened (i.e. hj, etc). We did dispute the charges and received copies off all the receipts, none of which were signed by him. I don't question the amount of money because I do know these clubs overcharge and often rip you off from what I've read. Anyway, all i do know is that he got to the strip club by 9PM and took the 12:15 train home. He was there at most for 3 hours and thinks he may have fallen asleep. He doesn't even remember how he got to the train. He remembers bits and pieces from the night....someone asking him if he wanted more, someone handing him a drink, and someone handing him his wallet. He said the actual lap dance seemed like 2 minutes long. He told me the morning after that he went to a strip club but didn't go into details because I immediately freaked out and left the house. Later that day I pulled out the clothes he wore and they were covered with bronzer....his crotch, his lap, and his dress shirt too (must have been untucked as that was covered with bronzer too). I also noticed his bath towel was orange from the night before....either his hands were covered with makeup from touching her, or his face, from her boobs in his face. My husband is an amazing man and loves me dearly. He is still very attracted to me and would have sex with me every day if he could. He feels terrible about what happened and has been apologizing ever since. Whenever we're out together (we have a great social life) I end up bringing it up again hoping for more answers/details. Since he really can't tell me what happened I just keep imagining her all over him and his hands all over her (hence the orange on the towel). He swears to me you can't touch and does not remember touching her. He said maybe the makeup rubbed off on his hands from his jeans or even from tucking in his shirt. It has been 5 months and I still am not over this. His heart is aching from how much he has hurt me, but I still can't get these 3 hours out of my head. I think if I knew what happened I'd feel better, it's the unknown that worries me. Has anyone ever been through this and if so how did you get beyond this? Oh, and by the way, as much as I can't get over this, this event has actually been a blessing to our sex life. I find myself being more sexual and he's loving it, however I constantly have this pit in my stomach and void in my heart for the hurt of him doing this to me. I guess it's more of a trust thing than anything else.

Today's update (9/11/12): If you go to the thread (Private lap dance at strip club) and read the responses most people say I should move on. It has been almost 8 months and it's still eating away at me. I just can't get the image out of my head of stripper(s) rubbing all over my husband. We celebrated our 24th anniversary yesterday and I felt it wasn't the same (although I didn't say anything to him about this)....just knowing I wasn't the only woman to arouse him since our wedding day, and knowing that he may have touched another women (although he swears he doesn't remember touching....but how can he possibly remember he didn't touch if he blacked out??) I bring the night up at least once a week, I tell him how angry I still am, and he assures me it was no big deal...it was just a lap dance!!! I did react very badly and he has been paying for it...literally....since (ie., vacations, clothes, etc.) I know he completely regrets walking in that strip club that night and he wouldn't have been persuaded to do vip if he wasn't so drunk or drugged or with a client. I know he would do ANYTHING for me to get over this. Yes, I have forgiven him, but I haven't forgotten. Please help!


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## kl84 (Jan 26, 2012)

I bartended at a strip club. I didn't bartend at every strip club in the world, but I at least have seen, firsthand, the inner workings of a joint like this.

Because I know what I know, I will not let my husband go to a strip club. Yes, you read that right. i will not *let* him go to a strip club. Kind of in the same way he won't *let* me go on a date with a dude who tells me i'm gorgeous, the best mom in the world, intelligent, funny......just showering me with compliment after compliment, maybe even a back rub..... because yes, men are visual, and women are emotional. I don't think women going to a male strip club is equivalent to a man going to a female strip club. So to even the score, I say a date. That's just my mentality of it, not expecting everyone to agree.

If my husband would go to a strip club to watch women dancing half naked (or naked) on a pole, then what's the difference in him going out cruising looking for hot chicks to scope out? 

Let me tell you a little bit about what went on in *our* VIP room. First of all, they literally hired crack heads off the street as the cleanup crew because the VIP room would be littered with condoms. Not exactly a job for Merry Maids, that's for sure. I NEVER went into the VIP room. Ever. They gave head. The had sex. They let guys run trains on them. They masturbated for men. Threesomes with couples. I've seen so many decent girls turned out by the environment because when you let one thing slide, here comes another thing, and before you know it you are a full blown prostitute stripping for drugs. No, it's not fair to categorize ALL strippers like that, because not all of them are anywhere close to being that bad. But in the club I worked in, only ONE was decent and even she was sketchy. 

If my husband ever paid for a lap dance, we're separating. In my mind, it is cheating. These girls are not "professionals". They don't go to stripper boot camp. They aren't certified dancers. They are random girls off the street who go in the club and make money. Just because you are *in a club* doesn't make it right. You might as well go walking downtown and solicit any random female you see for a dance-for-cash exchange. It just is what it is. 

And for some additional insight...... I worked the bar. I had no training. I was 22. I dressed like any other female in typical night club clothes, not like I was going for an interview but far from tramp apparel. I worked three nights a week and it only got super busy for like three hours, the rest of the time I was shooting pool with customers or chatting with my friends. I did nothing risqué for my money, no boob shots, not flashing, no dancing, not even FLIRTING, yet still averaged out about $1000 a week. Men would come to the bar and literally throw money at me. I'd have my back turned while making drinks one minute, the next minute I turn around and there are one's raining on me. A LOT of married men were in there and they were the HIGHEST paying customers. When I left that job, I vowed that no husband of mine would ever be in that environment, throwing his money away that should be going to a family and wife..... That's just my perspective. If I was making that much money barely even working, could you imagine how much the girls doing VIP's made? 

He even asked about the prospect of going for a bachelor party and I said, no. His friends wouldn't be devastated for life if he showed his support in some other way. A gift, taking him out one on one for a beer at a bar, shooting pool, gun range, ANYTHING. But my rule is NO strippers......PERIOD.


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## br625 (Jun 27, 2012)

I'm not sure if I mentioned in my original post where my husband went, but it was a gentlemen's club in new york city. Does that make the vip a little less sketchy?


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

br625 said:


> I'm not sure if I mentioned in my original post where my husband went, but it was a gentlemen's club in new york city. Does that make the vip a little less sketchy?


NO


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## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

This guy is an adult. You're his fiance' and not his mother, his jailer, his teacher, or his supervisor. He's out of your sight most of every day and he makes adult guy decisions. Either you trust his decisions or you think he's untrustworthy, immoral, stupid, or whatever. If he's not trustworthy, bounce him and find someone you can respect. You really don't want to start a marriage off by telling this guy what he can and can't do. Treat him with respect and he'll be more inclined to give you the same, even when you aren't around but temptation is. Treat him like you're his boss and he'll look for opportunities to break your rules. Your rules might make you feel good but they aren't binding on anyone. The only leash you have on him is the respect and love he feels for you. If he doesn't have that, all the rules, spies, threats, electronic gizmos in the world aren't going to be enough. I don't go to strip clubs and I wouldn't want a lap dance. If my wife forbade me to go to one, I'd be a gold-club member and every pair of my pants would have stripper residue on the lap.


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## Kari (Feb 17, 2012)

Scannerguard said:


> The whole thing with Monica Lewinski left Europeans scratching their heads. Then again, many European woman are resigned that European husbands just, as a matter of coruse, have an affair/lover when in their 30's and 40's. In America, American women would see this as a deal breaker and be looking to convert their marriage into an annuity.


So then are European husbands fine with their wives having lovers as a matter of course too? If a married European woman High ranking politician in her 50s had an affair with a 22 year old male intern in her office, Europeans would yawn and think nothing of it?


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## Kari (Feb 17, 2012)

Soon_To_Be_Mrs said:


> We are engaged, yes.
> 
> My personal viewpoint is that there is a difference between a lap dance out in the open, rather than in a VIP room or as a "Private dance." Still, would I agree if he approached a stripper wanting a lap dance in the open- no. Would I feel differently if one of his buddies bought him a lap dance- yes. He wouldn't be the one provoking having another woman do things to him, I personally feel only a SO, or Wife should do.


Your fiancé knows his buddies will at least offer a lap dance on his birthday. Who cares what 'society' thinks? Why would you even consider saying it OK for him to go to a strip club? Just say no to him going at all. The 20 year old should find a real girlfriend when the time is right, not get his first sexual experiences with strippers. Did you even read tacoma's post since you are still acting as if only watching is involved? Even if there's no VIP room, the girls are still likely to touch your fiancé and stick their parts in his face since he's the birthday boy.

I'm glad my H didn't have a bachelor party that involved a strip club and he doesn't go to them since marriage either.

Do you know how your future H feels about satisfying himself while watching porn after marriage? This habit has ruined many marriages based on what I've read on TAM. Maybe you should have a discussion about such things to see if you two are on the same page BEFORE you get married.

Is your H going to want to still go to bachelor parties at strip clubs AFTER you get married?

I'm concerned that your fiancé is showing signs of not being loyal and thinking ogling at other women on guys night out is no big deal, and his friends who take a virgin to a strip club don't sound so great either. I'm no prude and I think strip clubs have their place for older men not in serious relationships, still I wouldnt like to date or marry a guy who spent a lot of time in those places.


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## *LittleDeer* (Apr 19, 2012)

unbelievable said:


> This guy is an adult. You're his fiance' and not his mother, his jailer, his teacher, or his supervisor. He's out of your sight most of every day and he makes adult guy decisions. Either you trust his decisions or you think he's untrustworthy, immoral, stupid, or whatever. If he's not trustworthy, bounce him and find someone you can respect. You really don't want to start a marriage off by telling this guy what he can and can't do. Treat him with respect and he'll be more inclined to give you the same, even when you aren't around but temptation is. Treat him like you're his boss and he'll look for opportunities to break your rules. Your rules might make you feel good but they aren't binding on anyone. The only leash you have on him is the respect and love he feels for you. If he doesn't have that, all the rules, spies, threats, electronic gizmos in the world aren't going to be enough. I don't go to strip clubs and I wouldn't want a lap dance. If my wife forbade me to go to one, I'd be a gold-club member and every pair of my pants would have stripper residue on the lap.


And if you were my husband I'd leave you. Every single person should have good personal boundaries, if they don't they are probably a doormat. If my husbands boundary was no strip clubs, then I need to decide if it's fair and if I can live with it. 
Behaving like a rebellious teen to reasonable requests will destroy any marraige.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Kari (Feb 17, 2012)

Soon_To_Be_Mrs said:


> He has made countless comments about other, beautiful women; Both on TV, and in real life. I don't care. It doesn't bother me that he thinks other women are beautiful, hot, or that he is physically attracted to him. Women ARE beautiful. What DOES bother me.. (I'm still teetering whether I mention it or not) is the amount of comments. Sometimes, it's OBVIOUS when another women is pretty. I'm ok with the jokey joke comments like seeing a woman jogging and him saying "Oooo my! Look at those things (Referring to her boobs) do you think she is wearing a underwire or sports bra?" That to me is funny, and he is bringing commical relief into the situation. When he has stated more than once throughout a movie, he thinks the main character is hot, and has ooed and ahhed..to the point I've tried conversing with him..and his soo sucked into the woman on tv he doesn't respond for a minute or two after I say something..that does bother me.


This is a huge red flag. If I were you I'd rethink this relationship. It is not 'comic relief' , it is thoughtless, disrespectful and inconsiderate and immature.



> . The porno on tv doesn't bother me...whether it's with me..or alone, by himself. It's different. These are women he'll never meet, never touch, smell..etc.
> ..


You really are OK with your guy watching all this porn solo even though you are engaged and for him to continue it after marriage? seriously? I'd want my H to spend all his sexual energy on me not some porn chick. 

You mention not liking to fight so you avoid saying anything to challenge him. It doesn't sound like you really stand up for yourself and your boundaries sound like very low standards to me. In 10 years you will have a huge fight when he cheats on you. Speak your true feelings, the only guy you'll scare off is your future ex-husband.


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## donny64 (Apr 21, 2012)

> Strip clubs--PARTY it up (!!) Yes, He is coming home to me at the end of the night. And I have full faith and trust in him and our relationship..
> 
> VIP Dances/Private dances- No chance. Not appropriate in my eyes, at all. Would it be the end of the world if he did? No, i'd get over it, because this is what society is like anyway, but I'd be hurt, and we would have some rough terrian to go over. Point is, he wouldn't do it, because he loves and respects me.


Yes, there's a difference. Things happen back in those VIP rooms that do not happen out on the main floor. A little story, a "friend" of mine was at one of these clubs. It was his birthday. Unknown to him, another friend had paid for a private "lap dance" for him in the VIP room that included a little more than a "dance". My friend went willingly (being unfamiliar with strip clubs, and thinking he was going to get a private lap dance) and once in the room, without a lot of notice, her hand was first on his pants. Then in his pants. Then a condom was put on by her, and he was in her mouth just that quickly. Fortunately he was single at the time, and did not at the time, have a need to stay faithful to another. Could have been quite the test.

I'd not allow it any more than I'd allow my W alone in another private room with a naked man. No damn way.


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## Kari (Feb 17, 2012)

unbelievable said:


> This guy is an adult. You're his fiance' and not his mother, his jailer, his teacher, or his supervisor. He's out of your sight most of every day and he makes adult guy decisions. Either you trust his decisions or you think he's untrustworthy, immoral, stupid, or whatever. If he's not trustworthy, bounce him and find someone you can respect. You really don't want to start a marriage off by telling this guy what he can and can't do. Treat him with respect and he'll be more inclined to give you the same, even when you aren't around but temptation is. Treat him like you're his boss and he'll look for opportunities to break your rules. Your rules might make you feel good but they aren't binding on anyone. The only leash you have on him is the respect and love he feels for you. If he doesn't have that, all the rules, spies, threats, electronic gizmos in the world aren't going to be enough. I don't go to strip clubs and I wouldn't want a lap dance. If my wife forbade me to go to one, I'd be a gold-club member and every pair of my pants would have stripper residue on the lap.


If my H brought up the idea of wanting to go with his buddies to a strip club, I wouldn't say 'I forbid it!' but I'd say 'I don't like the thought of you getting aroused by dancers ' and 'I'm not comfortable with you walking into such a place full of temptation.'. Then I'd ask him if he'd be OK with me going out to a meat market bar with my single girlfriends and flirting with some guys who took off their pants and even though i didnt want to touch them, they sat in my lap and I got aroused by them. If he still wanted to go or acted rebellious like you, that would be the beginning of the end.


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