# Not sure what to do...



## Nuon (Jul 30, 2020)

We've been married 11 years, we have three kids who are all in elementary school.

My wife started an affair at least 4-5 years ago with a colleague. At the time, I suspected it. She would turn her face away from me if I tried to kiss her, we had no physical relationship, and she kept treating me like a housemate rather than a partner. I decided to check her Facebook, and found messages on it which didn't confirm a physical affair, but were revealing of an emotional one, at the very least. I confronted her about it (I trusted her fully until this point) and I broke down in tears, she lied to me, comforted me, and said I was just imagining it. I was so naive.

Anyway, she was still distant even after that, but I thought it must have been something I did. Roll onto the beginning of this year, I checked her Facebook again, and found a message which really put things into perspective. It was not proof of an affair, but it was close to it. I found out she had been deleting all of her messages between the two, although she must have missed this one. Anyway, I used her Facebook, and tried to dig out details of the affair with the affair partner (I was pretending to be her), and was able to find out some things. Anyway, I confronted her again; this time a lot more level headed. She admitted it, but wont divulge "truthful" details. She says she had sex twice, but when I said that he told me it was more (he didn't say that, but I could tell she was lying), she said she couldn't remember, because she may have been drunk.

I almost left, but I decided not to and to try and rebuild the relationship for the kids sake. It's so hard! I have been up and down since January. and she doesn't seem to understand. She has been acting a lot more like a spouse should, but it's hard to get everything out of my head. I feel like I can't trust her at all. I would be content to carry on with this, because eventually I imagine I would be able to get over it all somewhat, but last week I found that she tried to FaceTime the same affair partner. She says she doesn't remember because she had been drinking, but I don't buy it.

I moved abroad with my wife to her home country almost 3 years ago, and I work here. Her affair partner lives in my home country. I am paranoid about everything she does, I am constantly trying to find out if she is talking to someone. She is trying to act as she was in the first 6 years of our marriage, but I feel it's been tainted, and it's very hard for me to follow suite. I feel like she may be trying to just keep me around because it's beneficial to her if I stay.

She told me the reason she had the affair, was because I was always working and she was lonely. I told her she can't blame me for the affair, because she was the one who did it, and she should have thought of the kids rather than herself. I'm not taking the blame for the affair.

There's also another element to this relationship. My wife is manipulative. F***, as much as I love my children, I hate my life choices. My wife will self harm to manipulate me. Before we got married, we had an argument over something quite trivial, but it ended with me telling her I was going to spend the night at my parents house. Not 60 seconds after, I found that she had cut her wrist quite deep. I had to forgo my plans of leaving, and rush her to the hospital. She has done it two more times since then for similar reasons. This is the worst part of the manipulation, but she is also manipulative in other more subtle ways too.

I don't know what to do. I can leave and get an apartment in this country, I could go back home to my own country, but I would hate to leave my kids behind. I could try to suck it up, and stay until they are older, but this situation is taking its toll on me. My kids would probably want to stay with me, but I know my wife would fight for them to stay with her. The country I'm living in will normally favour the mothers, and also the natives of the country, so I don't know what kind of chance I stand if I try to leave with my kids.

What should I do? I have no contact with friends anymore, and my family was always unsupportive of the marriage from the offset because I didn't marry someone from my own country.


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## BluesPower (Mar 27, 2018)

What she you do? You should file for divorce. ASAP. 

You have been married for 11 years and you suspect she has been cheating for 6 years. That is more than half your marriage. 

You don't have sex with her, she won't even kiss you, you know she has been lying, what more do you need. 

I don't know your culture, but in mine this is called being a weak man. You know what is going on. She is and has been treating you like crap. 

And hey, guess what... it is not that she does not "get" how you feel. She does not care. You are a paycheck most likely, and a husband appliance. 

Dude, file for divorce and get out...


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## Nuon (Jul 30, 2020)

BluesPower said:


> What she you do? You should file for divorce. ASAP.
> 
> You have been married for 11 years and you suspect she has been cheating for 6 years. That is more than half your marriage.
> 
> ...


Let me be clear on a few points. She was not treating me like a spouse in that time during the affair, but since confronting her about it she has reverted back to the way she was and is now constantly looking for attention from me (something that now makes me feel uncomfortable). I am not a money maker - it's not for the money. If anything it's because she can't imagine looking after the kids alone, nor can she imagine life without them at home.

If you want to use the word weak, then sure, but I'm not staying here out of any weakness, unless you think that staying for your kids is one? My weakness before was that I trusted her too much, my weakness now is that I have no idea what to do.

If you must know, I'm British, she is Japanese. We are the same age. My kids all speak both languages, and have experiences from both countries.


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## Lostinthought61 (Nov 5, 2013)

you could always go back for a visit with the kids to Britain and then stay there with the kids and have her try to fight extradition for the kids that will probable take a long time and in that time file for divorce. Not sure how the legal system works in either country. Also the affair partner were they married? 

the important thing is not allowing your wife to control the narrative of her affair, you need to lay down the law that you will not put up with her transgression and you will expose her shame to the family.


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## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

I used to live in the UK. I remember the news stories how negligent the government was in enforcing men's rights. If your wife is in another country, I'm not sure how that would affect it.

There is or was a group called Fathers for Justice whose antics shone a light on the unfairness that many non custodial dads had to face. I also recall a law firm that exclusively marketed itself as representing the father's interests.

Good luck.


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## Nuon (Jul 30, 2020)

Lostinthought61 said:


> you could always go back for a visit with the kids to Britain and then stay there with the kids and have her try to fight extradition for the kids that will probable take a long time and in that time file for divorce. Not sure how the legal system works in either country. Also the affair partner were they married?
> 
> the important thing is not allowing your wife to control the narrative of her affair, you need to lay down the law that you will not put up with her transgression and you will expose her shame to the family.


If I decide to take the kids to the UK, she will definitely suspect something. I could do it in secret, but I think the laws favour her in that situation.

We have always been very open minded with the kids, they get to make up their own minds on most things. If I did decide to leave, they would make a choice, and I'm certain that my wife would not force them otherwise.

The affair partner had a girlfriend. He was a bit younger than me, but only a few years difference. I'm in my early 30s.


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## BluesPower (Mar 27, 2018)

Nuon said:


> Let me be clear on a few points. She was not treating me like a spouse in that time during the affair, but since confronting her about it she has reverted back to the way she was and is now constantly looking for attention from me (something that now makes me feel uncomfortable). I am not a money maker - it's not for the money. If anything it's because she can't imagine looking after the kids alone, nor can she imagine life without them at home.
> 
> If you want to use the word weak, then sure, but I'm not staying here out of any weakness, unless you think that staying for your kids is one? My weakness before was that I trusted her too much, my weakness now is that I have no idea what to do.
> 
> If you must know, I'm British, she is Japanese. We are the same age. My kids all speak both languages, and have experiences from both countries.


I think staying with a woman that does not love you, whether for the kids or not, is weak. 

Your kids are watching you, they know more than you think. They are seeing their father being mistreated. THEY ALWAYS see more and know more than you think. 

So yeah, I think it is weak. What are the divorce laws in your current country???? Or is you move back to the UK. 

The reason she seems to tolerate you, is that I think her BF is in the other country. And the fact the she knows you are on to her. SHE IS TRYING TO SAVE FACE...

Plus there is the whole thing going on in Japan about the women thinking it is gross to have sex with their husbands and so they sleep around to get their needs met.

If you want to stay with her, well it is your life, I would rather be with a woman that loved me. Hell I raised 3 kids alone, 2 have already graduated collate and one is touring with a national band in the US. Of course touring is slow right now. 

Point is they turned out OK. 

Most of the time, we say that people that are "Staying for the kids" are using their kids as an excuse for moving forward.


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## Andy1001 (Jun 29, 2016)

What makes you think the affair is over?


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## OutofRetirement (Nov 27, 2017)

Affair has been going onn 4-5 years. You don't know if it's over. She admitted the affair but won't give you truthful details. You say you don't know what to do. There is a step by step of how to save a successful marriage. Your posts indicate that you don't care if the marriage is successful or not, just that it survives. However, it is surviving now and you are asking what to do. I must ask, what specifically do you want from your marriage, and what are you willing to accept? Specifically state what is acceptable for you to stay in the marriage. What isn't she doing now would make you divorce?

There is a step by step process to save a marriage successfully, for both spouses to be happy, however, both spouses must both want it. If your wife does not want it, it will not work. The process is this: You write down your dealbreakers, what you need to stay married, and if you do not get it, you divorce. If you cannot divorce, you have no leverage to negotiate getting truth, you have no leverage to get her to end the affair, etc., and so on and on and on. This is not complicated. If you cannot divorce based on your current marriage, without any leverage, you can just plead and beg her and hope she will eventually love you enough again to tell you the truth.


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## VladDracul (Jun 17, 2016)

Nuon, its all a state of mind. Youre no fool and know what is going on. You don't want any of this to impact your lifestyle. Your chick probably got some pretty good nooky albeit, she shared it with another guy (actually not sharing but rather transferring usage rights from you to him) leaving you to go hungry. Now all that's on the table and you know the score. Here's my advice. No longer think of her as a wife but rather a mistress and nanny for the kids. At the top of her responsibilities, should she choose to remain, is booty call, along with all the trimmings and your comfort. If she wants to "see" the other guy, she should notify you ahead of time, and amply clean and dry the equipment upon return. She would repay your generosity with oral sex. Of course you are allowed to see other women of your choosing. BTW, does she have any attractive sisters. (might be worth checking out. I did my ex-wife's sister, her cousin, and her aunt. The aunt was US grade A prime and knew her way around a pecker; wy better than the other three. I kept the chick in reach for a couple of years)
Your old lady's got a lot to make up for. Sounds like I'm kidding. I'm not. It would be that way or the hi-way if it were me.


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## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

What has she done to help you heal from this affair. How has she tried to make it up to you.
Have you considered individual counselling and marriage counselling.
Have you both read books e.g How to help your spouse heal, His needs, her Needs, etc?


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

First thing you need to do is try to form a support group of friends there away from your wife. I suggest you detach and start making new friends.


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## Nuon (Jul 30, 2020)

Andy1001 said:


> What makes you think the affair is over?


Her attitude suggests it is (it would not be physical anymore, because he doesn't live here), but I don't trust her so I'm not sure it is over.


aine said:


> What has she done to help you heal from this affair. How has she tried to make it up to you.
> Have you considered individual counselling and marriage counselling.
> Have you both read books e.g How to help your spouse heal, His needs, her Needs, etc?


She has not done much to help me heal. She keeps trying to give me affection as if nothing happened, she even said "It's like we first met". At first I was receptive, because I wanted to mend things, but my mood was up and down when I kept recalling events or things that happened over the course of her affair. She clearly didn't like that, but what can I do about it? I was moody during one period for a few days, and then I found out she had tried to FaceTime the same partner. The timestamp was a little odd, because it was when I was at home, and when I checked the email address she used, it had been deactivated. I think she may have been trying to contact him, but when the emails wouldn't go through, she tried FaceTiming him. When I confronted her about it, she became aggressive and attacked me, but the next morning denied she could remember the FaceTime incident, or her attack on me.


sokillme said:


> First thing you need to do is try to form a support group of friends there away from your wife. I suggest you detach and start making new friends.


I contacted one of my old friends yesterday, but we have not spoken for 2 years (pretty much because of all of this). I'm still awaiting a reply.


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

You should have her committed when she cuts her wrist. Suicidal mother would be favorable to you in a divirce i would imagine.


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## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

So sorry @Nuon , I know you want to stay for the kids but she is not worth it. You can be a good father to your kids without her in your life, she is not remorseful and is simply using you. Have you told her family? Are you from different cultures? 
look for a divorce lawyer, find out what your options are, she is still in love with the other guy and is treating you with disrespect.
do the 180 on her and tell her you no longer want to be married to her, see her then pull out all the stops. Expose her to family and friends. Go get counselling for yourself and start doing things for you. Go to gym, smarten up, go out, don’t tell her where you are going, join a club take up a hobby and start to take back control.
she is not marriage material.


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## Nuon (Jul 30, 2020)

I've started looking at my expenditure as a single person here in Japan. I work a part-time job, and the rest of my time is split between looking after the kids, and working on my business. It looks as though I have enough to live alone and save some money, or pass it over to my kids. 



Divinely Favored said:


> You should have her committed when she cuts her wrist. Suicidal mother would be favorable to you in a divirce i would imagine.


I couldn't bring myself to do that, but I think if there was a dispute about who gets the kids, it would go in my favour. She does it as a means of controlling me; something I realised a few years ago. She is manipulative, and will do what she thinks is necessary to keep me in place.

Right now I am giving her the cold shoulder, but she keeps on trying to interact with me over every little thing, and trying to give me affection. I'm trying not to give in to it though. My current plan is to work out how I can move out, and then do so when the time is right, without creating too many problems which would affect the kids. I would try to move somewhere that is close enough that I can see the kids, but far enough that I don't bump into her in the street. Once the situation has settled in, I will be looking to file for divorce. There are (as far as I'm aware) 3 types of divorce in Japan. One is kind of a mutual agreement, which doesn't go to court; one is a disagreement, which is resolved outside of court; the other is a court case to decide the terms of the divorce. I think that the first is most likely to occur, but I'm not certain.

I think, as long as I have some kind of plan in place to leave, she will probably just accept it - so long as she doesn't have to take on all of the responsibilities of the kids. She probably thinks if I leave, then I will go back to the UK. I would rather be going back, but I would stay here for the kids, even though my income here is nothing compared to what I could earn back home.



aine said:


> So sorry @Nuon , I know you want to stay for the kids but she is not worth it. You can be a good father to your kids without her in your life, she is not remorseful and is simply using you. Have you told her family? Are you from different cultures?
> look for a divorce lawyer, find out what your options are, she is still in love with the other guy and is treating you with disrespect.
> do the 180 on her and tell her you no longer want to be married to her, see her then pull out all the stops. Expose her to family and friends. Go get counselling for yourself and start doing things for you. Go to gym, smarten up, go out, don’t tell her where you are going, join a club take up a hobby and start to take back control.
> she is not marriage material.


I've told her so many times that I'm leaving, but she somehow convinces me to stay. I also have no idea how I could find a divorce lawyer or counselling here in Japan. It's really hard to go anywhere just now, because of Covid. I started a Gym membership after finding out about the affair, but I only spent a month there and Covid took over.


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## ABHale (Jan 3, 2016)

You need to do what is best for you and your kids, that includes moving back to the UK with them. UK or Japanese citizenship?

Providing for your kids and yourself sounds like it would be easier back in the UK.


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## Nuon (Jul 30, 2020)

I was able to contact her affair partner this evening (evening for me). He said he doesn't remember very much, but their stories don't match. I told my wife I can't live here anymore, and so she said there's no point in living anymore (another way of trying to control me). She took pills out of the cupboard, but it was all for show. She then confronted me and said I needed to delete my correspondence with her affair partner. She also said that she would leave instead (trying to make me feel bad), I told her that I would leave with the kids, but only to the UK, because it's too difficult to manage kids here without fluency of the language. I told her I will stay nearby if I leave alone. She also tried to make it seem as though all of this was my fault, because I didn't give her a chance. Even though she had three chances to end it. I can hear her down the hall sniffling loudly to try and get my attention, but I have already made up my mind. 

She came in as I was writing this, and tried to reconcile by saying she was disappointed with herself, and that I should think of the kids. When was she thinking of the kids when she was having the affair?? She asked me if there was 1% chance that I could stay, and I said no. I've had enough, f*** it. The kids will still have their parents around, just not in the same way. I grew up without a dad, and I didn't end up a delinquent.


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## Nuon (Jul 30, 2020)

She's now put a suitcase together. She's blind drunk and hasn't a clue what she's doing.



ABHale said:


> You need to do what is best for you and your kids, that includes moving back to the UK with them. UK or Japanese citizenship?
> 
> Providing for your kids and yourself sounds like it would be easier back in the UK.


They have both until they are 18, at which point they are allowed to choose whether they want to be identified as British, or Japanese.


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## Robert22205 (Jun 6, 2018)

In the interim, if there's the slightest chance of R, your wife needs to actually do things to make you feel safe from her infidelity vs making empty promises. Have her draw up a plan to make you feel safe and to rebuild trust. 

1 - She should start by reading (it's on amazon): 
"How to Help Your Spouse Heal from Your Affair: A Compact Manual for the Unfaithful"
by Linda MacDonald (Author)

2 - She needs IC with a therapist with experience in infidelity. She needs to identify why she cheated. So far she blamed you and gave superficial excuses that justified to herself why cheating was ok - but she didn't identify why her core values permitted cheating.


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## OutofRetirement (Nov 27, 2017)

She has always been able to manipulate you so easily before, so you better buckle up. It's going to be a helluva ride.

Use your phone to record audio and video when she is about to falsely accuse you of something.


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## Mr.Married (Feb 21, 2018)

The answer is simple ... she must be a witch.

I would try the dunk in water tank to test for drowning or the burn at the stake thing to test her.


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## Kamstel2 (Feb 24, 2020)

Dear God!!!!! File, get custody of the kids and have a good life!!!!


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## Violet28 (Oct 4, 2018)

Sounds like she has Borderline Personality Disorder. The issue with personality disorders is that while people can 'improve', this behavior and way of responding is part of their personality. It will not completely go away as it is ingrained in her. She likely had a trauma at some point in her life and had an unhealthy attachment to her primary caregivers, look up reactive attachment disorder. Many Borderlines have RAD as children. There is no easy out here, especially if you have kids. And yes, she will cheat again and probably never stopped.


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## Nuon (Jul 30, 2020)

So last night, she got blind drunk. Then she tried everything to manipulate me. It was difficult to keep a straight face because she would say one thing, and say something completely different the moment after.

She said that because she is so terrible, that she should leave instead of me, and that I should take the kids to the UK. I told her that I can do that, but it's better if they have both parents near. She was trying to dictate how I should leave. I told her to go to bed and discuss it with me the next day, but she kept going on and on. She asked me to lay with her for a minute, and I said if she goes to sleep then sure, but it was clear she probably just wanted to try and control me through seduction. Problem is, I am not attracted to her anymore in that way. Anyway, she eventually went to bed, and then ignored me this morning.



Violet28 said:


> Sounds like she has Borderline Personality Disorder. The issue with personality disorders is that while people can 'improve', this behavior and way of responding is part of their personality. It will not completely go away as it is ingrained in her. She likely had a trauma at some point in her life and had an unhealthy attachment to her primary caregivers, look up reactive attachment disorder. Many Borderlines have RAD as children. There is no easy out here, especially if you have kids. And yes, she will cheat again and probably never stopped.


Yes, I think you are right. I've considered it for a while now. The problem with that is that there isn't much support for mental health issues in Japan. Something that reinforces the idea that she may have a borderline personality disorder is that her older brother is a complete sociopath.


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## faithfulman (Jun 4, 2018)

Nuon said:


> So last night, she got blind drunk. Then she tried everything to manipulate me. It was difficult to keep a straight face because she would say one thing, and say something completely different the moment after.
> 
> She said that because she is so terrible, that she should leave instead of me, and that I should take the kids to the UK. I told her that I can do that, but it's better if they have both parents near. She was trying to dictate how I should leave. I told her to go to bed and discuss it with me the next day, but she kept going on and on. She asked me to lay with her for a minute, and I said if she goes to sleep then sure, but it was clear she probably just wanted to try and control me through seduction. Problem is, I am not attracted to her anymore in that way. Anyway, she eventually went to bed, and then ignored me this morning.
> 
> ...


This is the kind of behavior you should be documenting in video.

It may not get you full custody, but it may end up with her requiring treatment etc. to maintain custody. And when she ****s that up, maybe you can get full custody.


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## ABHale (Jan 3, 2016)

I hate to be callous, take your kids to the UK. They have no business being around their mother when she is like this.

Tell her that all of you are going home for a visit. Then stay there. Tell her she can go back to Japan when ever she wants too.


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## Nuon (Jul 30, 2020)

faithfulman said:


> This is the kind of behavior you should be documenting in video.
> 
> It may not get you full custody, but it may end up with her requiring treatment etc. to maintain custody. And when she ****s that up, maybe you can get full custody.


I don't think it will come down to any custody battle. She hates complicating things, and she wouldn't want to risk everything. We will come to some agreement.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

@Nuon she might be cheating on you with someone else.


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## Nuon (Jul 30, 2020)

MattMatt said:


> @Nuon she might be cheating on you with someone else.


I've suspected it, but I have no proof of it. I think she has been deleting messages between her and her boss. I also caught her quickly flicking an app off the screen a few times when I came close (it looked like LINE) I confronted her about it, but of course she denied it. She will deny anything unless I have proof that says otherwise. He is married with a baby, so there would be a double layer of secrecy between the messages. She has let slip a few very questionable comments that make me suspect that it's very likely she has been sleeping with him. Currently she is not working there because it's closed due to Covid, but she went "shopping" two weeks ago in a nearby city. I know she didn't visit him, but I found out that she thought he was working in a branch in that city. It turns out he works at completely different branch at the moment.

I have developed a good gut feeling of these things now, and I think it's 70% certain she has had an affair with him. I've been repressing my gut feeling for so long. It's good to finally hear it again.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

You need to see a lawyer to discover what legal options you have.

Also, sorry to raise this point, but are you certain that the children are yours?

If you can, check their DNA, if you establish your parentage this will forestall any wrong claims by her that you are not their father.


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## faithfulman (Jun 4, 2018)

Nuon said:


> I don't think it will come down to any custody battle. She hates complicating things, and she wouldn't want to risk everything. We will come to some agreement.


So many betrayed spouses, particularly men have said the same.

What you're basically saying is "I trust her". 

Isn't that what you thought before? Is it wise to think that way again?


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## Nuon (Jul 30, 2020)

MattMatt said:


> You need to see a lawyer to discover what legal options you have.
> 
> Also, sorry to raise this point, but are you certain that the children are yours?
> 
> If you can, check their DNA, if you establish your parentage this will forestall any wrong claims by her that you are not their father.


That's a good question. I'm quite certain they are all mine. She didn't start working until after they were all born, and so she basically looked after them all the time. I was at University at the time, but I spent most of my time at home doing coursework. We had a great relationship back then! All the kids all also share quite distinct features with me.


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## bobert (Nov 22, 2018)

Your wife needs mental help and to be evaluated. Mentally well people do not act like this. So why are you so hesitant to have her committed when she clearly needs to be? If someone cuts their wrists, threatens to take pills, etc. they need to be hospitalized. It being "just a threat" doesn't mean she's mentally well. She's not! She's just not suicidal.

Your kids cannot grow up hearing that crap, or witnessing that crap. So stand up for them. Next time she does that call the cops and tell them she's threatening or attempting suicide.


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## Nuon (Jul 30, 2020)

faithfulman said:


> So many betrayed spouses, particularly men have said the same.
> 
> What you're basically saying is "I trust her".
> 
> Isn't that what you thought before? Is it wise to think that way again?


Good point. I don't trust her, and she is a selfish b****. I just don't see her trying to juggle work, kids, and everything else. The kids love us both, and we always let them decide what they want to do in important decisions. If she tried to force them to live with her, they would hate her for it, and I think she knows that. I have no assets which are worth anything, we live rented, so I don't really see it happening. 

If it does, I'm quite confident of my chances, but I will try to record all of the future arguments just in case. I did take a photo of bruises she left me a couple of weeks ago.


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## bobert (Nov 22, 2018)

At minimum you need to be keeping a very detailed journal of every incident, fight, etc. Dated and a neutral description what happened. So you have a record of dates and issues when it goes to court and becomes he said, she said.


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## Lostinthought61 (Nov 5, 2013)

Noun, might I suggest you begin recording some of her conversations....not from a custody, but to keep records of her behavior and words they may be useful if you need to seek help


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

NextTimeAround said:


> I used to live in the UK. I remember the news stories how negligent the government was in enforcing men's rights. If your wife is in another country, I'm not sure how that would affect it.
> 
> There is or was a group called Fathers for Justice whose antics shone a light on the unfairness that many non custodial dads had to face. I also recall a law firm that exclusively marketed itself as representing the father's interests.
> 
> Good luck.


Generally they are pretty good here about dads seeing their children. Some men from that organisation were later proved to be dead beat dads who hadnt even bothered to try and see their children or be a good dad to them.


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## Violet28 (Oct 4, 2018)

Nuon said:


> The kids love us both, and we always let them decide what they want to do in important decisions. If she tried to force them to live with her, they would hate her for it, and I think she knows that.


Whoa, Whoa, Whoa, Hoss! You 'always let the kids decide in important decisions', you realize they are kids and you are the parent, correct? Do you realize kids are basically a giant bundle of hormones, who are short sighted, fail to recognize danger, generally after instant gratification, selfishly after their own wants and often unaware or uncaring of what their actual needs are? Wtf is wrong with people nowdays? You are their father, your job is to protect them from everything, including themselves.


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## colingrant (Nov 6, 2017)

Nuon said:


> If anything it's because *she can't imagine looking after the kids alone, nor can she imagine life without them at home*.


No offense, but when you add cheater to her already being a proven manipulator, AND incapable of looking after the kids......... she did you a favor on a massive scale. 

Let's take a second and think here. 

She's unfaithful 
She's manipulative to the point where self harm is her weapon and 911 is your solution.
She can't live without you or your kids. Peace! You have to be saying, what's that?
She's incapable of looking after them alone. Incomprehensible 
Where's the win here? How is your life even remotely enhanced? I'm not trying to be facetious, sarcastic or funny. I'm 100% serious and am confident you'll feel the same within 6 months. This is one of the few (if not only) time I've read where the bs spouse is the beneficiary.


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## Nuon (Jul 30, 2020)

Violet28 said:


> Whoa, Whoa, Whoa, Hoss! You 'always let the kids decide in important decisions', you realize they are kids and you are the parent, correct? Do you realize kids are basically a giant bundle of hormones, who are short sighted, fail to recognize danger, generally after instant gratification, selfishly after their own wants and often unaware or uncaring of what their actual needs are? Wtf is wrong with people nowdays? You are their father, your job is to protect them from everything, including themselves.


I'm so very glad that a world class parenting expert has gifted me with such wonderful insight into their child rearing ingenuity, blessing me with 100 years of wisdom. I'll keep your well placed advice at the forefront of my mind when I let the kids sign the divorce papers. Let me know when you release your Parenting 101 book on Amazon, I will be sure to buy several copies.

Seriously, are you that dense?

Giving your children the responsibility to make their own decisions is key to them being able to look after themselves when they become adults. I'm not asking them whether I should divorce my wife, or asking them if we should pay the electricity bill this month. We asked our kids if they would like to live in Japan, and leave the UK - that's an important decision, and we let them take part in that decision, if you have a problem with that, good for you, write a book about it, or get over yourself.

May I remind you, also, that this is a discussion about infidelity...


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## syhoybenden (Feb 21, 2013)

Your snark at Violet has told me everything I need to know about you.
Poor kids.
You deserve what's coming.
I'm out.


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## ABHale (Jan 3, 2016)

Nuon said:


> I'm so very glad that a world class parenting expert has gifted me with such wonderful insight into their child rearing ingenuity, blessing me with 100 years of wisdom. I'll keep your well placed advice at the forefront of my mind when I let the kids sign the divorce papers. Let me know when you release your Parenting 101 book on Amazon, I will be sure to buy several copies.
> 
> Seriously, are you that dense?
> 
> ...


I believe kids should be able to make age appropriate discussions. They will not know which parent is best suited to take care of them. Depending on their age, they will not see the destructive side of your wife. That is why it is up the the parent that isn’t going off the deep end to watch out for them.

That said, they are your kids and for you to raise the way you want.


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## Nuon (Jul 30, 2020)

syhoybenden said:


> Your snark at Violet has told me everything I need to know about you.
> Poor kids.
> You deserve what's coming.
> I'm out.


Your choice. If someone is going to lecture me on parenting, then let it be known I will do the same.


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## Nuon (Jul 30, 2020)

ABHale said:


> I believe kids should be able to make age appropriate discussions. They will not know which parent is best suited to take care of them. Depending on their age, they will not see the destructive side of your wife. That is why it is up the the parent that isn’t going off the deep end to watch out for them.
> 
> That said, they are your kids and for you to raise the way you want.


I agree to a point, but I don't think it's age dependant, rather it's maturity dependant. I don't actually think I would let them decide who they would live with if the situation arose outside of a courtroom, and perhaps I was a bit stupid to imply that, but if it went to court, I would be more in favour of it.


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## BluesPower (Mar 27, 2018)

syhoybenden said:


> Your snark at Violet has told me everything I need to know about you.
> Poor kids.
> You deserve what's coming.
> I'm out.


Yes yes and yes... 

I thought that I sensed that about him. 

Yeah he is going to get steam rolled... Stiff upper lip and all that rot...


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## Nuon (Jul 30, 2020)

BluesPower said:


> Yes yes and yes...
> 
> I thought that I sensed that about him.
> 
> Yeah he is going to get steam rolled... Stiff upper lip and all that rot...


Clap clap. Nothing like a bit of Brit-sniping eh?


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## ABHale (Jan 3, 2016)

Nuon said:


> I agree to a point, but I don't think it's age dependant, rather it's maturity dependant. I don't actually think I would let them decide who they would live with if the situation arose outside of a courtroom, and perhaps I was a bit stupid to imply that, but if it went to court, I would be more in favour of it.


Age, maturity is just splitting hairs.

Hope everything works out.


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## Nuon (Jul 30, 2020)

Well if some people are just going to be unsupportive and negative towards me on a forum for supporting infidelity recovery, and when I'm going through a world of hurt, what's the point in even posting anything else. Just close the thread.


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## bobert (Nov 22, 2018)

It is important for kids to be involved in decision making, and to learn the consequences of poor decision making. Those skills need to be learned, and it improves their confidence and helps them bond to their parent(s). They learn they are respected and equals, not just along for the ride. All @Nuon said was that the kids are involved in decision making, as they should be, and that they'd be pissed if that was suddenly taken away from them. The key is avoiding overwhelming them with decisions that are too complex or have too many options.


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

syhoybenden said:


> Your snark at Violet has told me everything I need to know about you.
> Poor kids.
> You deserve what's coming.
> I'm out.


Sometimes the truth comes out in waves, sometimes in snippets.
............................................................

OP's wife, is first, very likely an alcoholic, and has some other mental issue, in addition.
Our poster is very thin skinned, and is not receptive to any criticism, actual or (merely) supposed/inferred.
..........................................................
Most on TAM are here to help, *some deliver snark, rarely does a (supposedly needy) Thread Originator, do so.
Violet did not offer up any snark. She stated her opinion.

If you like or agree with someones opinion, good, if not, ignore it.
That is what we do every day in life.
............................................................
Your wife is troubled.
Japan is a patriarchal society and women, in general are not (yet) equal participants in society.
Sexual activity, in Japan, is not the big deal it is in the U.S. or in the U.K.

Japan is also very xenophobic. Foreigners are not readily accepted, and often are looked at as 2d class citizens.
Celebrities, bonafide professionals and scientists, excepted.

It is said that 31% percent of Japanese women cheat on their BF/Husband. With men, it is 38%.
These statistic are seen mostly in the bigger cites, less so in villages and smaller cities.

..........................................................

You sound overbearing yourself.

..........................................................

I too, lived in Japan, for a short period.
I have one close male friend in Japan whom I talk to a few times a year.

*In fairness, I have been know to deliver a bit of (obtuse), offhand snark, myself.


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## Nuon (Jul 30, 2020)

SunCMars said:


> Sometimes the truth comes out in waves, sometimes in snippets.
> ............................................................
> 
> OP's wife, is first, very likely an alcoholic, and has some other mental issue, in addition.
> ...


Good job. I see the keyboard warriors are out in force today. Don't quit your day job though, Sherlock. I'm out.


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## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

Nuon said:


> I've started looking at my expenditure as a single person here in Japan. I work a part-time job, and the rest of my time is split between looking after the kids, and working on my business. It looks as though I have enough to live alone and save some money, or pass it over to my kids.
> 
> 
> 
> ...





Nuon said:


> I've started looking at my expenditure as a single person here in Japan. I work a part-time job, and the rest of my time is split between looking after the kids, and working on my business. It looks as though I have enough to live alone and save some money, or pass it over to my kids.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



As an expat in Japan, isn't there a local expat organisation with other foreigners you could join and get to know others who would be able to advise you and give you support also. I have lived in a smaller city in a few countries this side of the world and they have expat organisations everywhere. I am sure there some in Japan too. it would be worth joining such a group just to get some support.


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## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

syhoybenden said:


> Your snark at Violet has told me everything I need to know about you.
> Poor kids.
> You deserve what's coming.
> I'm out.


In all fairness Violet laid it on a bit much also and needs to tone it down a bit. i don't know how old Violet is (hope it is not 28 yrs old) but enough with the 'Wtf is wrong with people' that was a bit offensive imo. I've moved around the world with my family and we started asking the kids their opinions on moving, etc. Experts will tell you when it comes to moving to new places, schools etc, you involve the kids don't simply leave them out of the decision making, even if they are relatively young. of course the parents have the final say. Getting their opinions makes them feel like they have some control over what is a huge change.


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## OddOne (Sep 27, 2018)

Saying "...we always let them decide what they want to do in important decisions..." is not the same as saying "we always let them express what they would prefer to be done in important decisions." Violet28's response, while preachy and judgmental is understandable. And you did overreact to it. Point is, this appears to have been a misunderstanding that could be put to rest with a bit of clarification and an apology or two.

This doesn't need to become a mountain.

Take a breath. There's a good possibility that at least some of your anger is coming from resentment toward your WW and the situation you find yourself in. Also, please consider if you really think it's worth alienating a bunch of people over things that could be cleared up without much difficulty and with less defensiveness and pride.


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## Violet28 (Oct 4, 2018)

Nuon said:


> I'm so very glad that a world class parenting expert has gifted me with such wonderful insight into their child rearing ingenuity, blessing me with 100 years of wisdom. I'll keep your well placed advice at the forefront of my mind when I let the kids sign the divorce papers. Let me know when you release your Parenting 101 book on Amazon, I will be sure to buy several copies.
> 
> Seriously, are you that dense?
> 
> ...


May I remind you that infidelity impacts the family and kids are part of the family? If all the things you are saying about your wife are true, then there should be red flags popping up all over in that part of your brain called the amygdala. You stated that your wife is manipulative, self harms and has physically attacked you. She also became blind drunk just the other night. What about this behavior makes you think that the kids would be safe with her? 

You are backtracking on your original statement here. You originally stated 'we always let them decide in important decisions' which is a bit different than 'we let them take part in important decisions'. You've been married 11 years so your kids are all under ten years of age, correct? They are also being raised in a chaotic environment and have moved countries in their short time on this earth. If you are not around to serve as buffer between wife and kids, who do you think will start to be more impacted by her behavior? Do you not think she will be manipulating them as well? Do you realize how vulnerable children are to emotional manipulation by a parent? I realize this may be parenting 101 but it seems you have not realized that leaving small children alone with an unstable parent and allowing them to choose to live with her is not the safest decision.

So, no, I do not think a seven, eight or nine year old has capacity to make their own decision on custody matters. Giving them this choice also opens them up to feeling increased guilty about their choice and less likely to seek help if something bad occurs. Also, as we all know, kids find ways to blame themselves about everything, especially divorce.


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## sunsetmist (Jul 12, 2018)

Theses are important decisions. Cultural differences aside, what I notice is your tendency to react to others, maybe instead of acting like you choose to act. We know neither of you really, nor you us. We mostly take your version of perceived truth.

Acting out sexually is often a sign of CSA as is BPD. Many folks who self-cut do that because it is a pain they can control as opposed to the ones they cannot. Five years of infidelity is devastating to you. Drinking seems to be her way of self-medicating. Having a mentally unstable, drinking and untrustworthy wife must be exhausting, stressful. Her mission seems to be to manipulate the world around her in order to control her life. Setting a better example for your kids is paramount to me.

*"What should I do?"*
Ex-pat groups are an excellent support suggestion. _I'd talk to legal folks there to see what my options are. _ She is unlikely to change and may grow worse. A friend of mine's SIL decided to end it all and take the family with him. Act now to avoid something like this. Likely, there are no perfect choices. Takes courage, for sure...


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## Nuon (Jul 30, 2020)

I'll admit that I am overly sensitive - I always have been, I also over-analyse everything. I am always worried about the consequences, or outcomes, and yes, given the situation I'm probably suffering from depression. I'll also admit that giving kids decision making powers in something which could be very damaging to the family is not a good idea at all, and when I suggested I would let them decide who they move with, it was more me thinking of a desperate solution to a difficult problem, I wouldn't put that burden on them though. I will also say that blurting out a comment such as "wtf is wrong with you people", when concerning someone who is trying to break out of a toxic relationship, and largely has his children in mind is not very helpful, and is hurtful. I've spent 4 years thinking that I was doing something wrong, or that there was something wrong with me, and so I thought that was why my wife was so distant towards me. I tried so many things to reconcile with her, thinking that I wasn't giving her attention, so I gave her more, I tried doing more things around the house, I tried buying her gifts, but each time was more disappointing than the previous. I've had people putting me down since I was a kid, so it's nothing new, but yes, it does make me react perhaps in a haphazard way. I imagine that I wouldn't even be on this forum if I didn't care about my kids more than anything else, I would be on a plane back to the UK, alone.

Concerning the separation; it's not as easy as just getting the kids on a plane and moving out. There are finances to think of, I also have work commitments here which I can't just break out of, people rely on me. I can't earn enough money here as a single parent, and I don't know if my wife would pay anything towards their keep if I left with them. There's also the legal element - if I try to leave the country with the kids without having consent from the court (Hague Convention), I can end up in prison, with my kids going to their mother. In Japan, the mother gets more favour than the father in a custody battle, and Japanese nationals will always get more favour over foreign nationals. The kids are also really settled here, and I don't want to take that away from them. Also, with her being the way she is, who is to say she doesn't take the wrist cutting to the next level if I took the kids and left? What kind of father would I be to my kids if they thought that I was responsible for that? I'm not fluent in the language, and with all the red tape in Japan, I would probably spend most of my time filling out forms, and worrying that I misunderstood something. Getting her committed would also screw the family over, the kids would resent me for the rest of my life, we would have our income halved, and who's to say that they would even commit her? I would just be creating an extra layer of tension to the whole family. Sure, I know that any choice I make in this situation is going to have a bad effect on everybody concerned, but the only options which would be feasible in my eyes are either I get court permission to take the kids back to the UK, or my wife leaves of her own accord and provides from outside of the family. I think that both of these, under the current circumstances are impossible though.

If she was an alcoholic, then I probably would have headlined with that; the question would be "what do I do, my wife is an alcoholic, she's cheating, self harms, and wont let me leave". Normally her attitude is a lot worse with alcohol, and so that's why I mention it frequently. We spoke yesterday about separating again (and no, she didn't drink), and her stance on things haven't changed. She wants me to give her another chance (that would be chance 4), and she said if I can't live with her, then she can't live anymore. I also brought up my concerns of a second affair with her boss, but she laughed it off, and denied it flat out. She had the same reaction when I first confronted her about the first affair. I tried sleeping separately, but when I woke up and she had snuck in next to me.


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## ABHale (Jan 3, 2016)

The thing is that you are not responsible for her actions. The kids are not safe with her. There was a mother here in the states that buckled her kids in a car and sent it into the water killing them. Your wife is capable of harming herself, do you think she can’t harm your kids? My concerns are for your kid’s safety. I hate that you are being cheated on but the safety of your kids comes first.


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## Nuon (Jul 30, 2020)

ABHale said:


> The thing is that you are not responsible for her actions. The kids are not safe with her. There was a mother here in the states that buckled her kids in a car and sent it into the water killing them. Your wife is capable of harming herself, do you think she can’t harm your kids? My concerns are for your kid’s safety. I hate that you are being cheated on but the safety of your kids comes first.


No, she would never even consider it. She has some issues, but she would not hurt the kids. Her self harming attitude is mostly posturing to manipulate me to stay, but she would never go that far. I think at the moment, my best chance is to just live with her as a separated spouse until she gets fed up with it. It's the only solution I can come up with right now. That will probably help to mellow out her obsession with me staying, and make the situation easier to resolve. Of course, it does mean I need to stay with her for that duration.


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## Nuon (Jul 30, 2020)

If there was any doubt about it, I would do anything I could to have her committed.


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## Violet28 (Oct 4, 2018)

I admit saying 'wtf is wrong with people' may have been a bit harsh. I am coming from the perspective of working with children and families with abuse and neglect. Or adoptive parents who are considering terminating their rights to adopted children who have been mistreated by birth parents and it continues to impact them years later. Your children will not escape unscathed from what is occurring in your home. You may think that she's fine with the kids or that she'd never hurt them but there is all sorts of emotional damage that can be done, even if she's never raised a hand to them.

Kids are great at picking up on emotions, tension or discord in the home. They are also survivors that learn to navigate situations and how to try and protect themselves. It's like PTSD, imagine a soldier trying to survive in a war zone, they have heightened senses to their surroundings and even if they aren't physically wounded, it still greatly impacts them. Often once they are safe and back home or out of combat, is when the symptoms start to really cause issues with their functioning. 

Kids are constantly watching our actions and learning from them. What if you staying and hoping she will get fed up impacts them by teaching them if your boyfriend wants to break up with you that you threaten to kill yourself or cut your arms up so he stays or that if someone does this things when you want to break up them that you should just stay in the relationship until they say it's ok for you to go?


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

BluesPower said:


> Yes yes and yes...
> 
> I thought that I sensed that about him.
> 
> Yeah he is going to get steam rolled... Stiff upper lip and all that rot...


I get the impression that your view of the British character is based on Hollywood movies made 40+ years ago.

Comments like yours, based on ignorance and prejudice, are remarkably unhelpful and risk causing threadjacks and ill-tempered comments.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

Nuon said:


> No, she would never even consider it. She has some issues, but she would not hurt the kids. Her self harming attitude is mostly posturing to manipulate me to stay, but she would never go that far. I think at the moment, my best chance is to just live with her as a separated spouse until she gets fed up with it. It's the only solution I can come up with right now. That will probably help to mellow out her obsession with me staying, and make the situation easier to resolve. Of course, it does mean I need to stay with her for that duration.


Sadly some people's idea of not doing anything to hurt the kids involves killing themselves and the children due to a warped mindset.

@Nuon you can't trust her, you can't reason with her.

Get the children back to the UK to ensure their safety.


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## Nuon (Jul 30, 2020)

MattMatt said:


> Sadly some people's idea of not doing anything to hurt the kids involves killing themselves and the children due to a warped mindset.
> 
> @Nuon you can't trust her, you can't reason with her.
> 
> Get the children back to the UK to ensure their safety.


I would prefer to just take them back. Though I don't know how long it will take, or how to do it. My wife messaged me and said she wants to talk tonight. I'm going to record the conversation and suggest that I take the kids back to the UK and explain to her why that's the case. It probably wont be pretty, but what else can I do.


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## Nuon (Jul 30, 2020)

According to what I've researched online on the Hague Convention, I need to have consent from my spouse to allow me to take the kids. I just don't know what constitutes consent. I don't think this will fly with her at all. I could get consent from her, and then she could file a court order a week later saying she never gave consent, and I would have to prove she did.


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## Lostinthought61 (Nov 5, 2013)

Can you reach out to a law firm that specializes in international law?


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## Nuon (Jul 30, 2020)

Lostinthought61 said:


> Can you reach out to a law firm that specializes in international law?


There are probably a few, I have seen some places online that specialise in Japanese-international marriage law, but I'm afraid that if I make this a formal matter, that it will take years to resolve.


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## Nuon (Jul 30, 2020)

I don't know fully how it works in Japan though, so perhaps I will consult one.


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## ABHale (Jan 3, 2016)

The thing is that you are not responsible for her actions. The kids are not safe with her. There was a mother here in the states that buckled her kids in a car and sent it into the water killing them. Your wife is capable of harming herself, do you think she can’t harm your kids? My concerns are for your kid’s safety. I hate that you are being cheated on but the safety of your kids comes first


Nuon said:


> No, she would never even consider it. She has some issues, but she would not hurt the kids. Her self harming attitude is mostly posturing to manipulate me to stay, but she would never go that far. I think at the moment, my best chance is to just live with her as a separated spouse until she gets fed up with it. It's the only solution I can come up with right now. That will probably help to mellow out her obsession with me staying, and make the situation easier to resolve. Of course, it does mean I need to stay with her for that duration.



Are you 100% sure about that? 

Are your willing to risk their life on it?

The mother here did it because of relationship issues, can’t remember actually what they were. But she claimed she was car jacked and the guy or guys took off with her kids. All the while knowing they were in the lake.

Mental illness isn’t contained to ones self. She has struck out at you already. What is going to prevent her from harming your kids to get what she wants?

I am no psychiatrist but I have seen to many stories where the kids are harmed or killed by parents that just seem to go off the deep end.


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## skerzoid (Feb 7, 2017)

MattMatt said:


> I get the impression that your view of the British character is based on Hollywood movies made 40+ years ago.
> 
> Comments like yours, based on ignorance and prejudice, are remarkably unhelpful and risk causing threadjacks and ill-tempered comments.


Apparently, my vision of England has been based on Benny Hill, Ab Fab, and Monty Python, and is a bit off. However, I am of English descent, and have visited that wonderful country. I'd move there if I could. Love the pubs, hate the food. But I am a history nut and would love living there. Wales not so much, too much like the USA. Sorry for the thread jack.


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## OutofRetirement (Nov 27, 2017)

You need to consult legal advice from both Japanese and UK. We are talking about your children. I knew a person who had problems with custody with a parent who took a child to Japan. I don't remember the details except the Japanese government did not care or do anything despite U.S. government intervention.

It took me all of a minute to find this. There were many similar. But articles like these only basically show you that you need special INDIVIDUALIZED legal advice. This is too important for anything less.









FEATURE: Japan fails to safeguard parental rights on divorce - Taipei Times


Bringing Taiwan to the World and the World to Taiwan




www.taipeitimes.com





An excerpt:

_Japan is recognized the world over as a major democracy, but when it comes to parents, critics say the country has antiquated laws that deny even basic rights.

Every year in Japan, following a break-up or divorce, 166,000 children are separated, usually definitively, from one of their parents, official statistics demonstrated.

In 80 percent of the cases, it is the father, Japanese or foreign, who loses all his parental rights but is still required to pay financial support to the mother, the statistics show.

In contrast to other developed nations, visitation rights are not enshrined in Japanese law and the abduction of a child by one parent is not considered a crime._


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## Nuon (Jul 30, 2020)

OutofRetirement said:


> You need to consult legal advice from both Japanese and UK. We are talking about your children. I knew a person who had problems with custody with a parent who took a child to Japan. I don't remember the details except the Japanese government did not care or do anything despite U.S. government intervention.
> 
> It took me all of a minute to find this. There were many similar. But articles like these only basically show you that you need special INDIVIDUALIZED legal advice. This is too important for anything less.
> 
> ...


Yes, thanks. I'm going to try and call the British Embassy today, I also contacted a law firm last night. We argued last night, and I caught some of it on camera, including her admitting to self harming and attacking me. I don't know whether it would be useful considering the separation laws/rights in Japan. This morning she was more mellow, I tried to explain to her how her actions are having a bad effect on the kids, but I'm not sure she agreed. I also told her she needs to see somebody about her mental issues, and I want to have a copy of the diagnosis. She said she will do it for the kids, and I think she will go, but what's to say she will tell the doctor or psychiatrist everything?

It is all a bit gloomy when it comes to separation and custody here in Japan, but I have also read that as long as I don't "_kidnap" _my kids out of the country, and I have some good reasons for the spouse not to have custody, then it can go in my favour. I think I need to build up my case now, whilst we are still living together. I think she is quite ignorant of the law when it comes to this. She thinks I can just hop on a plane with the kids tomorrow, if I wanted.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

Keep her in the dark.


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## Nuon (Jul 30, 2020)

So she went to a psychiatrist today. The psychiatrist has not made a formal diagnosis yet, but prescribed her with some antipsychotic medication (Quetiapine). Having researched online, my wife looks to have BPD, and I would be very surprised if the psychiatrist says otherwise. When I read about it, it was almost like reading a book on my wife. I'm kicking myself for having not checked online for mental health issues before. I always thought it was my fault, or that she was going through an early menopause.

I have told my wife that I want her to get the help she needs, for her and the kids, and that I will help in any way that I can, but that we cannot ever go back to the way things used to be. She verbally accepted what I said, but I know she wants things to go back. I'm hoping that she may be able to come to terms with things better once the medication has some time to work. She is going to see the psychiatrist twice a month. I think she has realised and accepted that she has a problem, and I'm really grateful for it. I will try to support and help her where I can, but I cannot stay with her. I want to live by my own rules instead of hers. I know the medication and therapy may help with that, but I cannot forget the past, and it will eat me alive if I try to "make things work".

I will see how things progress over the next few months, but I'm more hopeful than I've ever been!

A huge thanks is in order, because had I not come here, I would not have really looked into BPD. I know I have been a little defensive and reactionary, and I'm sorry for that. I'm not normally that way, but my mind has not been in the right place. Sorry and thanks @Violet28 especially.

I will update the situation if anything changes.

Thanks!


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

I read your thread. Do what is best for you and your kids. You can’t be the best parent you can be if you don’t take care of yourself. Your wife has dug her own hole with her repeated betrayals and manipulative behavior.
I think you are reacting and thinking clearly. Get some legal advice as you’re doing, steel your resolve and don’t look back. You’re rubbing yourself of a relationship with a woman that treats you good as well as gives you her full loyalty, by staying any longer than you have to.
Good luck.


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