# Wife left 3 months ago.... Not sure what to do



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Hi all, I'm new on here and after some advice really. Have been reading some other threads and looks like people can really help each other.

Bit of background - My wife and I have been together 5.5 yrs and married 3.5 yrs. we have a gorgeous 4 yr old daughter and she also has a 12 yr old and 8 yr old daughters from previous relationships (all 3 girls have different fathers). I am 39, she is 35. She is very beautiful. We were friends for a couple of years before getting together. When we did things happened quickly. We lived together after 6 weeks, she was pregnant after 5 months, we had the baby then got married after 20 months. Life was awesome, we had an amazing connection and did everything together. We both felt like we'd found the person to spend our lives with.

Then reality of raising 3 children started to set in, I was at work and she was a stay at home mum (which she was brilliant at). Anyway we got a bit stressed and had the normal arguments etc. we moved to a bigger house and started watching tv in different rooms some nights and started drifting apart. After 3.5 yrs together she asked me to move out as she wasn't happy. I was devastated and shocked, but did for 3 months and we went to MC to work on the marriage.

MC was great, we really worked on it, communicated much better and got back together after 3 long hard months. It was awesome at first after I moved back in and we went to Vegas to celebrate! 

This was 18 months ago. Gradually life returned to normal and we started drifting apart again after christmas last year. 

I was raised in a stable family ( both parents married 40 yrs) but not encouraged to show my feelings much, so I struggle with this even though I'm an emotional man. This has led to me not wanting to talk about feelings etc. with her too much and preferring to sweep issues under the carpet. she was raised by her mum as her dad sadly passed away when she was only 2 yrs old. Her mum is a strong woman but clumsy sometimes with her comments to others. 
She had some weight issues when she was a teenager and her mum used to call her fat etc. this led to an eating disorder which she overcame, but has had an effect on her. One thing she had instilled in her was to just live for today as you don't know what's round the corner tomorrow. She does this big time ( not great with money and NO long term thinking).

We went on a family holiday to florida in late April this year which was brilliant. Her mother came too and we all got on great apart from a silly argument my wife and i had in the airport on the wayhome ( about extra baggage charges). Anyway We went out one night when we came back and I was conscious she wasnt being too affectionate with me and asked her about whether she saw us staying together for life. She said she didn't have a crystal ball, but yes unless one of us Cheated on each other then it probably would ( cheating is her big no no as her 1st husband did this to her and she left him- they were both young). Neither of USA has cheated on the other as this is both of our values.

Fast forward 6 weeks and we had a stupid argument one night. I ask her why she's being distant and not affectionate and she says " I dont know" then she says she thinks we're different people and should be with someone who is more like each of us. We talked for ages but didn't make any progress. The nex t night she said she didn't fancy me anymore because of lots,of little things that i'd done - like being grumpy when we went out sometimes and worrying about things at home when they went wrong. She also said I didn't have her back sometimes as she thought I'd criticised her rather than supported her sometimes.

I tried to talk her round, pleaded etc. as I lover her so much. She is a strong, independent woman ( like her mum who had to bring her and her brother up without a father for 16 yrs+). Nothing worked, she was adamant it was over. This was 3 months ago. She found a place to rent 10 miles from home and moved in 6 wks ago with the children. The day she moved out was the worst of my life ( I had to help her and she was cold and detached the whole time- like a stranger - she didn't even thank me). I let her take everything she wanted from,our house ( now regret this) as she had left the door open for me slightly by saying there were grey areas and she wanted space to think. 

I manned up and didn't contact her much one she moved out apart from when we did handovers for the children. I get to see all 3 girls for 1 night midweek and my daughter every weekend. There's no issue with access and I'm paying generous child maintenance. I also bought her out of our home so that she could afford to move out to this new place.

Since she has moved she has spent £4k on a new car, £2k on new stuff for the house and clothes and paid off her overdrafts for another £2k. I think it's partly to make herself feel better about things. I know she feels bad and is guilty about uprooting the children. She also admitted she still has feelings for me and is guilty about how I'm hurting. I have been struggling to cope because I love her so much and miss her and the children as don't see them every day.

I have good friends and work colleagues who've been brilliant and really supportive. I don't know what I'd have done without them. I can't afford IC at the moment with buying her out but am keen to go ( I found out I have an abandonment issue when we Went to MC last time). Two of my workcolleages are counsellors in their spare time so they have helped me understand better. She has refused to go to MC or IC as she says she knows it won't work this time. She is guarded and detached.

I am getting stronger but not sleeping great and still think about her all the time. Go to the gym and eating well. She has been cold and detached and treats me like her two exs ( fathers of the other daughters) whom she's been split from for 8 and 12 yrs respectively. It's soul destroying and like she's a totally different person who just looks like my wife. 

We do have some deep discussions sometimes, but it's on her terms... When she wants to. She has basically reinvented herself and has admitted to doing this before to cope with relationship breakdown. 

I think she is carrying some real hurt inside as its hard to get close to her. She just gets,defensive and is fantastic at always being right. You can't really argue with her as,you'll end up worse off. She is good at blame shifting. 

I have tried everything I can think of to get her back but she's not having it, so I'm at the point now where I think I just have to move on, as much as it hurts me. I have read about the 180 and am trying to implement, but we have to speak about the children some haven't had massive success so far. 

I dread speaking to h or seeing her when we exchange the children as I still have so many strong feelings for her.

I guess I'm after any advice really, but it's helped just trying this all out. Thanks


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## forumman83 (Aug 12, 2012)

Sounds like 180 is the only way to go. It may be difficult with kids and whatnot but you need to develop a plan and stick with it.


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Thanks. I am trying to just let her initiate contact with me and not contact her at all unless I need to about the children. Is this still 180? 

I am still thinking too much about her rather than just focusing on me. I know I can't control her actions but I needed to try everything so that I can look the children in the eye in future and say I fought for the marriage. I still want her back.

I am angry she is so distant and seemingly not bothered about the effect of all this. I wish I was as good at detaching as her.


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## forumman83 (Aug 12, 2012)

Yeah, it is difficult no doubt. Realize that she has probably been "detaching" for a lot longer than meets the eye. Possibly even for years, that is why it seems easy. 

Don't focus on her words, focus on her actions. If she WANTED to be with you, she would. You need to do whatever it takes to become the type of man she would WANT to be with again. This will be difficult if you are in contact with her. 180 means NO CONTACT other than strictly business. You are not there for her emotionally, mentally, or physically. You need to take care of yourself. 

Buckle up, cuz you're in for a rough ride. Just gotta take it day by day. Keep posting on here, we'll try to help you out as much as possible


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle,

Based on your description of her childhood home, you're dealing with a very angry person.

The people that were supposed to be good to her were not good to her. You are now the stand-in for her anger.

There are ways to deal with this, but the only one who can fix it is her.

Has she been to any sort of therapy - other than your MC?

She needs individual counseling.

It wouldn't hurt you either.


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad, she did used to lash out at me and was very angry sometimes. We used to talk about it but she referred to it as just being frustrated! She had a reputation as being a bit fearsome at work before I met her but in reality most of it is a front, she's not as strong as people think. She has got really angry with me a few times since she left, without much foundation. I am very accommodating of her. I'm aware of the drama triangle and she's been persecutor to my victim a lot lately. I think she wants to fight with me as it will justify her actions. I'm not having it though.

I have tried to get her to go to IC but she says not now, maybe in future. Like you say it's up to her to do it off her own back. I don't think she wants to delve too deep. Even in our MC most of it was about me/my behaviours that needed to change. 

I am planning on IC soon - the MC was my first experience of counselling and it was brilliant.


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

FM, I understand about becoming the man she wants again ( wasn't too long ago I was as she told me earlier this year all she wanted was me). 

I guess even though I will pull back from her she will still have contact from me via our children. This is the bit I don't really get - how do they see the changes if you've pulled back? Maybe through the odd children handover?


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle,

The tough part is, you can see it's a front.

But, she thinks she can keep everyone from detecting that.

The deep seated fear is that she's not worthy of love (because those that were supposed to love her did not).

You actually sound very healthy. I think the counseling will help you work through this, but think of it more as an adjustment than an overhaul.

Here's the thing.

"Accommodating her and giving her room to heal..."

Bad bad idea.

She won't do it unless she bottoms out and has no alternative.

Make of that what you will.

You said she's 35? And really attractive?

That works against you. She likely will find another "buyer" if she convinces herself that you are totally at fault.

Sounds like that's what the MC was all about.

Sad to say, it's usually a waste of time.


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> Bottle,
> 
> The tough part is, you can see it's a front.
> 
> ...


_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

So I've not had a good day today. Found out from my step daughter at school drop off that W went round her dad's on Saturday and was baking cup cakes with him for her and her friends. Probably really innocent but she'd never have done this previously. It's really got my back up and made me angry and jealous. The good thing is I've not texted or called her about it. Just about to go to the gym to get my frustration out. Thing is this guy treated her badly when they split so it seems the worse you treat her the better she treats you? Maybe its just sour grapes on my part.
Still want her back and struggling to let go. Have got in touch with IC and just waiting for a call back to confirm appt. so that's good
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Given her background, she likely has very low self-esteem. Therefore, it makes sense that being treated badly is what she deserves.


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad, It does make sense. The thing is I can't bring myself to treat her poorly. I can be too much of a nice guy sometimes, especially when it comes to her! 

She just takes advantage of it though so iit's got to stop. I don't want to be her doormat.

She just texted me as her car is being fixed in the garage and she left the key to our (my) house in it so couldn't pick up our D's fav cuddly toy for her to take home (D stayed with me last night and couldn't take it to school). Normally I would've offered to take it straight over to hers but just said she could pick it up tomorrow (D will be asleep by now with another cuddly toy anyway).

Been a struggle today not to call her and try to fix it.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

I know the territory.

Your insides tell you to "fix"

Yet, what good has that ever done?


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

I know, I know. I have tried everything already! 

I needed to as not having her and the girls with me is horrendous.

Part of me is just ready to let go as I can see her faults and think do I really want to live with her for the rest of my life? 

The other part is desperate for her back -guess this is the abandonment issue rearing it's ugly head! Maybe the counselling will help me sort this out.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> I know, I know. I have tried everything already!
> 
> I needed to as not having her and the girls with me is horrendous.
> 
> ...


When you search for a counselor, interview them. I think the ones that use Internal Family Systems are good. They help you get in touch with yourself.


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

Love is blinding you to things that are quite obvious to us. You are being used. There might be something going on behind the scenes too. But you are denial.


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

I am getting more angry about it all which shows some progress I suppose. I am still wanting to R though - I am not ready to give in.

Am hoping the counselling will help me let go better. It's hard as my feelings still so strong.

Have exchanged some texts and emails about us with her the last couple of days. She is supposedly calling me Fri eve to discuss them. 

Most of me is desperate to have the discussion, but practically I think she will just reinforce her stance that it's over.

Am thinking I should just suck up the pain and talk about child's arrangements only? 

I am desperate for her to say she feels different and wants to work at it


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Child arrangements only.

All business


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

It makes sense... Although i'll need to put the overwhelming urge to 'fix' back in its box!

So the plan is to just not talk about us, stick to it and see what happens.

Only worry is that because she's stubborn it will just suit her cos she doesn't have to go into it?


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

She won't be able to miss you if you don't go away.


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

True! 

So the same business like approach to children hangovers then?


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Handovers lol


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## pseudonym (Aug 19, 2012)

Conrad said:


> She won't be able to miss you if you don't go away.


You should get t-shirts made with this printed on them. You could make a tidy profit here.


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

So not a good day today. Was walking to the bus stop this morning and W drove past so,stopped and offered to drive me to work. I accepted (mistake) and we started talking about our situation. 

She basically said that deep down she knows she's made the right decision to leave as doesn't have the same feelings for me anymore. She said I deserved to be with someone who did have those feelings for me. She did say it took a lot for her to marry me after 1st marriage ended (1st H cheated on her) but she really wanted to marry me which shows how much she felt for me. 

She said our daughter should stay with me at weekends and with her during the week. I had been having her one night during the week too. I said I wasn't ok with that long term as 5 days of not seeing her is too much, but will go with it for daughters sake for next few weeks. She has been upset leaving one of us to see the other midweek, so this will probably help. She got a bit angry when saying this is how it will be.

She also said she is upset that the marriage didn't work out and whilst she doesn't seem it in front of me, she has spent a lot of time crying etc. 

I told her I had tried to do the right thing by letting her take whatever she wanted from the house and buying her out quickly. She then said that this didn't really matter to her as only material things!!! I was p***** when she said that and felt like saying 'well I'll have them all back then!' i didn't rise to it though.

I said I thought she might come back like she did last time we split (18 mths ago for 3 mths) and she said not this time as she still had those feelings for me then, but not now.

She knows I'm going to counselling next week and said I just need to focus on me now and move on, rather than her. I said that's what I am trying to do but I just can't switch off my feelings. 

She said she wanted to have a good relationship with me in future.

I then said I couldn't see her for a while as I have to move on, she understood and I think was quite relieved. It sets me back when I see her so this is the only way forward for me but will hurt like hell. The arrangements we have for our daughter will enable us to not see each other so that's ok.

She then dropped me off and drove off and I know I won't see her now for a few weeks. Will speak briefly on the phone about daughter but nothing else. I will also not see much of two step daughters as she wants to keep them during week too (they are at their dads at weekends).

So was really low all day afterward as I'd still been hanging onto some hope, especially after she'd left the door open for me when she moved (I think she was playing me to get the money quickly).

I am a bit more philosophical tonight as can see her faults and know she is bad for me. She is like my drug though and it's so hard to break free from her. I will struggle when she gets someone else, but don't think she'll ever have a relationship that lasts as she ends them after a while. 

Trying not to beat myself up too much and focus more on the future. Feel a mug though for spending so much money on her and them she throws it back at me by saying the material things don't matter. Well they seemed to matter when he was moving them out of our home!!! 

Am angry too that she can do this to me then lecture me about our children and doing what's best for them. Well she shouldn't have b***** left!!

Not happy.


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Been an ok weekend with my daughter, but am having to drop her off to school tomorrow then not see her until Friday evening. Really not looking forward to not seeing her for 5 days, but the only positive is I won't have to see stbxw.

Had a bit of a text argument with stbxw over some stuff she took from the house but have sorted it now. She is a totally different person but I still love her and would make it work tomorrow if I had the chance.

I don't understand how she can just throw all we had away and start over. She hasnt mentioned divorce once which is a bit strange.

I guess time will help me heal but I am being forced to sell our home and give her half of everything I worked my life for just because she walked out and I don't think I've done much wrong. 

Am gutted tonight.


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

So a week on and I haven't seen her. Have talked on the phone about child arrangements but nothing else. It has helped as I turn into a disaster when I see her.

Still feel up and down. Had a good weekend with my daughter and did lots of fun activities to keep busy. It was great, but caught myself thinking how much my W should be there too a good few times. 

My daughter even said yesterday 'daddy, why don't you AND mummy spend time with me anymore?' I was heartbroken when she said that. All I could say was well mummy lives elsewhere now but we still both love you very much.

1st prop counselling session this Thurs so looking forward to that. It's been almost 4 months and I'm still struggling, but better than I was for sure.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

This all sounds good.

Stay @50,000 feet and observe.


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Thanks C, I am trying but still in the mindset where I want her back. I would do anything for her to come home right now.

She seems so sure of what she's doing that there seems no chance of that though. Hurts.


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Went to a conference today and had plenty of time during the (boring) presentations for my mind to wander.

Can't understand why she's just throwing everything away we had. The children all want to be here and for us to be together. 

I just want to be able to wake up without a knot in my stomach and not feel like a failure or that part of me is actually missing. 

Last week she said to me'deep down I know I've made the right decision'..... Well thanks for that!!!

I have done so much for her and she said 'well that's what you do when you married'.... Thanks again

I go between feeling total anger towards her then desperation to get her back


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

If your entire focus is on her, you will have no peace.


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

I know, but I am struggling to just move on. It's what I want the counselling to help me with, along with a couple of other things.

I know I can't get in her head and that she's the only one that can fix herself, but I'm mourning the death of our marriage. I can't help but think of the good times and all the positive reasons we had to be together.

She is very good at detaching and it's exactly what I need to do. I hate my life right now, so that's one reason to let go.


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## SCondeck (Oct 5, 2012)

I'm sorry buddy. Just know you're not alone. I'm going through the same thing as are many other guys on here. How these women can look at themselves in the mirror after abandoning their vows, marriages and husbands is beyond me. It hurts alot right now but once we've passed through this trial by fire I know that we will be better, stronger, wiser and more confident men.

This WILL NOT happen to us a second time.


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Thanks mate, keep your chinup. What's your story?


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## how was your day? (Oct 10, 2012)

Hey... I'm going through the same thing... except my wife of 6 years left me 11 days ago...

We met where we are currently living (home town/state). Got married when I was in the Air Force, she came up to Alaska after my Iraq deployment, married 5 months after the deployment... went through a 6 month tour in Saudi Arabia, and 6 month tour in Kuwait while we were married (she stayed home obv). Never knew any of her extended family the entire marriage.... until I came home.

Served my time, and got out 2 years ago... since I have been out I haven't 'done anything' with my life. I was rated 70% PTSD from my service so my only income is disability, it pays the bills and then some.

11 days ago it 'just happened' or how I have come to realize is it has been going on for a LOT longer than I had really known. 

She told me she has a 'crush' on another guy.
She has moved all of her day to day stuff to her moms....
She came back and grabbed some boxes behind the couch (we just moved into the place we are living 4 months ago) and told me she left them there on purpose because she knew she was going to leave.

Now she is gone... 11 days ago she ripped this out of her diary and gave it to me. Told me it was going to hurt.

One of the hardest weeks I’ve had. After 3 years of being unhappy, I’ve decided I don’t want to be with OP anymore. I’m over it, I don’t want to live this way anymore. It’s like I have two lives, a happier life when I’m away from home, and a home life that sucks to the 10th degree. It was hard for me to decide because he hasn’t done anything to me, but it clicked, what hasn’t he done for me and I feel like I could write forever. I need to write this list or I’ll randomly think of it later.

-Very isolated and doesn’t try to see anyone. I hate going places by myself all the time. I want a partner who enjoys being together. 

-The drinking and getting ****ed up all the time gets on my last nerves. A bit of alcoholism there or not dealing with PTSD. It has turned him into a wall. Not many conversations happen. I’m told I ask too many questions, to hold on cause busy with game, to stop talking that he doesn’t want to talk about it, can talk later about it, never really asks me questions like how was your day. I can also sense that what comes out of my mouth is annoying to OP or not even interested because he didn’t even listen.

-In my opinion he’s using PTSD as a way to not work, after the military he felt he deserved the unemployment checks. When he got disability he felt deserving of that too. He quit school after he got a large chunk of $. For 3 years I’ve asked what he wants to do and today he still doesn’t know. There is no motivation to do good in his life because he didn’t get the boat job, he thinks he won’t find a good job like that w/o starting at the bottom. With him being home I think it made him more depressed. I wanted him out of the house so he could feel good about what he’s doing and have a sense of worth. Thinking of CDL but doubt that will happen. 

-He so stuck in his ways and routines, he doesn’t see what he is doing is wrong at all. Everything is fine and nothing needs to change. Was told “never” going to therapy. Never going to change. Well I hate the person you are so no change means I’m getting the ****out. He needs to open UP and talk to someone, anyone, cause he’s not doing that with me. He does talk somewhat with his brothers.

-He sure likes his video games and other online ****. With everything that he does, he doesn’t have time for me. He is always in the Garage and when I’m in there I’m hardly acknowledged. If I were to take his entertainments away. I’m sure he would divorce me. I on the other hand like to live life. Be outside and experience the beauty. Do fun activities, exercise, go out, make memories. 

-I’m continuing to live life and at this point it’s been w/o OP for a long time. I want to live life with someone. Everytime I did something I would invite OP and it would hurt when he would say no. Now I’m happy when he says no. I don’t even want to be around him. I’m perfectly happy being around people that appreciate me and enjoy being around me.

-Someday I want a family and right now there is no way in hell I’m having his baby. I don’t want to be a single mom basically. I take care of the dog way more than OP in my opinion. Babies need lots of attention and since I feel I don’t get enough attention, why the hell would he for a baby. Not a good role model. Teach to be isolated, lazy, drunk, piece of ****. Would like to have kids that see joy in life, not all the wrong doings.

-Right now in my life I’m trying to improve in several areas. Quit smoking, eat healthier, exercise more, be a better person. OP is the opposite of all these. These aren't his goals but I don’t think////end///

I don't hit her, Never cheated on her... just tried to give her the best... I have PTSD and I feel detatched from her extended family... I neglected to do all the things she constantly wanted to bring me along to... I holed up... and now I am getting the biggest wake up call of my life..

I feel destroyed... im sure you do too Bottle... 

i just registered on this site to make this post... see you are going through something similar maybe we can learn from eachothers success/mistakes

something i have read, and will read again
http://www.squidoo.com/how-to-heal-a-broken-heart-now

all the "OP's" in that entry are referring to me, i just edited out my name


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## SCondeck (Oct 5, 2012)

Holy crap OP. I'm so sorry for you. I think that my situation is nothing on yours. What hurtful things to say to the person you're supposed to love. However, at least she made her reasons known unlike my wife. Mine called me horrible names, accused me of disgusgly false lies and then kicked me out of the house. It all happened pretty fast. 

Do you still live in AK? I was in the service myself so I understand what you mean by 70% disability. Are you even allowed to have a fulltime job? Is there anything you ever wanted to do with your life? Maybe now is your chance. I'm trying to think of the positives in my situation now that I'm not crawling around waiting on her and trying to make her happy, I can focus on my own goals and dreams. I've got an exciting life planned out, God willing. Maybe now is you're chance to do the same? 

You're not alone.


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

HWYD, thanks for sharing - I am thinking of you and hoping things will turn out the way you want. Some of the best advice I can see on here is to just concentrate on yourself and do everything you can not to get sucked into begging for them back. 

It's really hard to do but the only way forward. One you are best in yourself, then they will take notice.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> HWYD, thanks for sharing - I am thinking of you and hoping things will turn out the way you want. Some of the best advice I can see on here is to just concentrate on yourself and do everything you can not to get sucked into begging for them back.
> 
> It's really hard to do but the only way forward. One you are best in yourself, then they will take notice.


Then they "may" take notice.

But, make no mistake about it - this is work for YOU, about YOU, and in YOUR best interests.


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> Then they "may" take notice.
> 
> But, make no mistake about it - this is work for YOU, about YOU, and in YOUR best interests.


Bit of a,Freudian slip there with the 'will'! 

The thing that hurts is she didn't give us the opportunity to work at it. Just went and said 'we'd tried for 18 mths'. Bulls***, different issue. Is she going to go through her life just leaving people when the going gets slightly tough?

Maybe. Time to focus more on no. 1.


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Why do I feel like texting her to pour my heart out??!! 

This is insanity, it makes no sense why she left. 

It is so difficult to just try to ignore her. 2 weeks and counting...... Soo hard


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> Bit of a,Freudian slip there with the 'will'!
> 
> The thing that hurts is she didn't give us the opportunity to work at it. Just went and said 'we'd tried for 18 mths'. Bulls***, different issue. Is she going to go through her life just leaving people when the going gets slightly tough?


In a word, "yes".

But, right now, that's so not your problem.

You just need to realize it.


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

I just think its a cop out to say"I don't fancy you anymore". 

Well in a LT relationship these feelings come and go i wouldve thought, Especially with little children dominating your time. 

I didn't meet all her emotional needs I admit that.

Thing is she was the one who pursued me, confessed her undying love to me and (her words) worshipped the groundi walked on..... How things change in a few years eh


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> Thanks C, I am trying but still in the mindset where I want her back. I would do anything for her to come home right now.
> 
> She seems so sure of what she's doing that there seems no chance of that though. Hurts.


Just like she was "so sure" of her undying love for you.

See a pattern here?


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## SCondeck (Oct 5, 2012)

STBXW and I had some aquaintances awhile back. This fellow and his wonderful wife. One day he met a girl and paraded her around town as his new girlfriend, not giving a f**k what his wife thought about it. She made it known that if he would just get rid of the gf and appologize to her, she would be willing to forgive and move on.

STBXW's aunt's husband spent 5 and a half years in a North Vietnamese prison camp "Hanoi Hilton" being horribly tortured day after day. Auntie only heard he had been shot down and didn't know if he was dead or alive so she waited for him. 5.5 years she waited. They are still happily married to this day.

Now my wife abandons me after a year and a half because her emotional needs aren't being met. I've mentioned these situations (and others) to her while telling her we can make this work, we can get through anything. Nope, she peaced out. She's a quitter.

Brother Bottle I don't know why our wives are willing to throw everything away like this. I don't even know if they feel any guilt about it. It's probably all our fault anyway right? She once told me I don't give her flowers as much as I should. Well that sucks darlin, guess I'm a ****ty husband.

It will get better, I know it.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

So I have pretty much ignored her for 2 wks now... Get a text thurs detailing her arrangements for getting her personal number plate back off my car and onto hers (my car used to be hers). All looked fine so I didn't bother responding as she said shed let me know when the date of exchange was.

She texted me again today as the estate agents called her to arrange a viewing of our house that she's moved out of. She said could I call them back to sort it.

I didn't reply as been out with my daughter and left phone in car. 20 mins later she sends the following text:

"I understand you don't want to speak to me but it's getting on my nerves you not replying. Did you get the message about the estate agents"

I replied 2 hrs later (when got back to phone) saying I had been out so not seen her text. Also that I am ok with speaking to her, its just i don't want to see her. I added I hope she understood this.

So now I'm getting grief for ignoring her. I was tired of her ignoring my texts before so had been not contacting her. Can't win.


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> So I have pretty much ignored her for 2 wks now... Get a text thurs detailing her arrangements for getting her personal number plate back off my car and onto hers (my car used to be hers). All looked fine so I didn't bother responding as she said shed let me know when the date of exchange was.
> 
> She texted me again today as the estate agents called her to arrange a viewing of our house that she's moved out of. She said could I call them back to sort it.
> 
> ...


And when you used to bring up the fact that she ignored your correspondence, she got angry with you.

I'll wager she was "too busy" or "caught up in stuff".


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> Just like she was "so sure" of her undying love for you.
> 
> See a pattern here?


On the face of it it looks like she can't make her mind up. 

She does seem dead set on it being over between us though, so I'm thinking she just gets bored after a few years when the excitement wears off and the normality of life kicks in.

Think that's the pattern. Move onto the next guy, excitement, then boredom after x long, then leave.


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> On the face of it it looks like she can't make her mind up.
> 
> She does seem dead set on it being over between us though, so I'm thinking she just gets bored after a few years when the excitement wears off and the normality of life kicks in.
> 
> Think that's the pattern. Move onto the next guy, excitement, then boredom after x long, then leave.


Is it limited to guys?

Observe from 50,000 feet.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> And when you used to bring up the fact that she ignored your correspondence, she got angry with you.
> 
> I'll wager she was "too busy" or "caught up in stuff".


Yep, she said she hadn't had any time to herself, which was 5 wks after she moved out and was spending every weekend on her own doing up her new house!!

She also said she was 'mulling over' her response.... Well she must still be mulling it over as I didn't get a reply to the email she was referring to and it was 2 months ago!


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> Yep, she said she hadn't had any time to herself, which was 5 wks after she moved out and was spending every weekend on her own doing up her new house!!
> 
> She also said she was 'mulling over' her response.... Well she must still be mulling it over as I didn't get a reply to the email she was referring to and it was 2 months ago!


You starting to see where you permitted yourself to be disrespected?

If you don't stand up to that kind of crap, you teach your partner how to treat you.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> Is it limited to guys?
> 
> Observe from 50,000 feet.


Very interesting you mention this as no it isn't.

She fell out with her two best girlfriends in the last few years. They flew all the way to Dominican to be her bridesmaids at our wedding.

One she was previously inseparable from. Both failings out were over minor incidents and all parties were at fault. 

She is the constant in all this though.


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> Very interesting you mention this as no it isn't.
> 
> She fell out with her two best girlfriends in the last few years. They flew all the way to Dominican to be her bridesmaids at our wedding.
> 
> ...


Think about everything.

I guarantee you this rot is systemic in nature.


----------



## spun (Jul 2, 2012)

Bottle said:


> Yep, she said she hadn't had any time to herself, which was 5 wks after she moved out and was spending every weekend on her own doing up her new house!!
> 
> She also said she was 'mulling over' her response.... Well she must still be mulling it over as I didn't get a reply to the email she was referring to and it was 2 months ago!


She makes the rules, and breaks the rules at her convenience.

I know the type.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> You starting to see where you permitted yourself to be disrespected?
> 
> If you don't stand up to that kind of crap, you teach your partner how to treat you.



Should've just stopped contact earlier instead of pursuing too much.

She is now p***** as I was ignoring her last 3 days. 

Own medicine doesn't taste too good!!


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> Think about everything.
> 
> I guarantee you this rot is systemic in nature.


Come to think of it she's had 5 different cars in the 5 years we were together. Never thought of it like that until now.

Owns hundreds of pairs of shoes and handbags.

She has admitted to running away from problems/relationships in the past, so history repeating itself.


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> Come to think of it she's had 5 different cars in the 5 years we were together. Never thought of it like that until now.
> 
> Owns hundreds of pairs of shoes and handbags.
> 
> She has admitted to running away from problems/relationships in the past, so history repeating itself.


She's searching for happiness outside of herself.

How do you think that works?


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> She's searching for happiness outside of herself.
> 
> How do you think that works?


It doesn't. 

It would explain all of the above. She has low self esteem, so perhaps needs someone to constantly tell her how beautiful she is etc.

When I have held the mirror up to her in the past she hasn't taken criticism well and got upset, blamed and become defensive.

This is starting to make more sense. Wish I could fix her though as we have a great family! Had.


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> It doesn't.
> 
> It would explain all of the above. She has low self esteem, so perhaps needs someone to constantly tell her how beautiful she is etc.
> 
> ...


BUT.... once that "someone" reassures her, she starts pushing boundaries to see if that "someone" will take her crap.

When he takes it all... instead of being "happy", she loses respect for the doormat that she's created.

She's careful to wipe her feet on the way out.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> BUT.... once that "someone" reassures her, she starts pushing boundaries to see if that "someone" will take her crap.
> 
> When he takes it all... instead of being "happy", she loses respect for the doormat that she's created.
> 
> She's careful to wipe her feet on the way out.


Yeah that sounds about right. 

When I have stood up to her since she left she has either denied saying the things I know she did, or gets very angry at me.

Usually manages to manipulate the situation (and me) so that she's correct and I'm not.

So the best way to handle her seems to be calmly and assertively, without showing emotion. 

Standing my ground and only responding to her contact rather than initiating it.

Thoughts?


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

What you're describing is blameshifting.

How often did she get angry with you for you being upset with her?

Eventually, you "learn" never to be upset with her (even though your needs are being virtually ignored)

Right?


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> What you're describing is blameshifting.
> 
> How often did she get angry with you for you being upset with her?
> 
> ...


Yep. Spot on.

After our MC last year I gave her what I thought was a bit of constructive criticism. I had been holding it back for months as didn't want her to react angrily.

Well she had a meltdown and cried for ages. I ended up apologising the next day as felt bad for her (ugh!).

I turned into someone without needs towards the end.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

And you wonder why she now considers you uninteresting?


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Yep, i can see the mistakes i made and this was definitely one of them.

She decided to give up though, which as someone who can make her own decisions she is entitled to do (ggrrrrr).

Even after all this crap I would still take her back. Wonder whe the day will be when i don't want her anymore.

Problem is it takes two committed people to make a marriage work.... Not just one.


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> Yep, i can see the mistakes i made and this was definitely one of them.
> 
> She decided to give up though, which as someone who can make her own decisions she is entitled to do (ggrrrrr).
> 
> ...


Of course it does.

When you saw her lack of commitment, you figured you could fix it by filling in the gaps.

You do realize she has set you free.

Once you learn this, you'll never be attracted to someone like her again.


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

I am trying to look at it that way, but have still got a way to go.

She is like a drug to me and the level of attraction was intense.

I used to think it was impossible to keep her happy sometimes, but now know she is the only person responsible for her own happiness. 

Can't see her changing unless something big happens in her life to trigger her to want to. Might never happen tho.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

It's not your problem.

Get your focus off of her and on to you.


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> It's not your problem.
> 
> Get your focus off of her and on to you.


Yes, I am back to normal weight and have been eating well, gym x3 per week, seeing friends etc. Work is busying up so making the time go more quickly.

Had a good weekend last one with my daughter and again today. Find myself obsessing about it all less and don't feel as distraught as I did even a couple of weeks ago. 

Need more time but it helps not seeing her.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> Yes, I am back to normal weight and have been eating well, gym x3 per week, seeing friends etc. Work is busying up so making the time go more quickly.
> 
> Had a good weekend last one with my daughter and again today. Find myself obsessing about it all less and don't feel as distraught as I did even a couple of weeks ago.
> 
> Need more time but it helps not seeing her.


I'm sure this discovery surprised you.


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

I knew it was the only way to heal really, but didn't want to admit it for ages. Hanging onto something that wasn't happening.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> I knew it was the only way to heal really, but didn't want to admit it for ages. Hanging onto something that wasn't happening.


Stay @50,000 feet.

Observe what she truly is - not what you wish her to be.


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Yep, the girl I fell in love with and married is gone or was a facade of the real person underneath.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> Yep, the girl I fell in love with and married is gone or was a facade of the real person underneath.


Part of the process of waking up is separating our delusion from our actual situation.


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> Part of the process of waking up is separating our delusion from our actual situation.


When I look at the whole package from 50,000 feet she's certainly not as attractive as I thought.

Still stunning, but with lots of grief sprinkled all over.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> When I look at the whole package from 50,000 feet she's certainly not as attractive as I thought.
> 
> Still stunning, but with lots of grief sprinkled all over.


5 cars in 5 years?

New man everytime she gets "bored"

Commitments that come with an expiration date?

Sounds like a formula for relationship instability.

Emotional hell on wheels - for any man.


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

She's a turd covered with tinsel. Nothing beautiful about her. Just like my ex....all superficial beauty and nothing else.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> 5 cars in 5 years?
> 
> New man everytime she gets "bored"
> 
> ...


She was definitely high maintenance emotionally. 

Like you said earlier, happiness comes from within. 

She is not happy with herself, which is a shame as she has a lot going for her.


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

On a downer today.... Reality of it all is starting to set in. Also had someone come to view the house I love and don't want to sell.

Beautiful Sunday... We would've gone for a walk or out somewhere with our daughter. 

It's taking all my willpower not to text her and say 'we CAN make it work, just give it another chance'.

I am going to take my daughter out later anyway. She shouldnt be subjected to the pain either. It's a disgrace.


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Am fighting the urge to text her and say how much she means to me.... That I am desperate to get our family back together, to be with her and our girls.

Am hurting tonight. Can't stop thinking just how much potential the marriage has, but she has checked out too early. It feels WRONG. 

Am guessing it won't help if I text her my feelings. Will probably just get ignored. How could I have not seen this coming???


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## jdlash (Jun 18, 2012)

It won't help to text her. It will actually hurt more then you could ever realize. The only way is for her to decide. YOU can't fix this. YOU can only fix YOU.


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

jdlash said:


> It won't help to text her. It will actually hurt more then you could ever realize. The only way is for her to decide. YOU can't fix this. YOU can only fix YOU.


Thanks jd, I know and haven't contacted her. 

Its so hard to just leave it alone. I haven't talked to her or texted her for over 2 weeks now. 

The fact this is the third time she has left someone with a child involved seems to make it easier for her. I don't up know how she can do it to the children (again).


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## LostOneForGood (Jun 4, 2012)

Wow Bottle, 

Reading your post is dead on to mine, minus the children. If you havent read it, my post is "Isnt Getting Better or Worse"
Its horrible how this stuff has to go... hang in there, I am where you are right now. Good days, bad days and a whole lot of questions...


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

I have so many questions that when I ask her I get no real answers to except 'I don't have those feelings for you anymore' and 'I will probably never be able to tell you why properly'.

I just can't move on. I can't face seeing her with another man and I will have to as we have a daughter who we'll need to do Handovers for etc.

One minute I pine for her, the next I am wholly filled with anger and hate towards her for leaving.

It's been 4 months and I thought it would get easier over time. I feel better on a day to day basis, but miss her more than I ever imagined.

Only choice I think I have is to just not see her until I am healed, which I fear will take years. How will I manage that?


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> Thanks jd, I know and haven't contacted her.
> 
> Its so hard to just leave it alone. I haven't talked to her or texted her for over 2 weeks now.
> 
> The fact this is the third time she has left someone with a child involved seems to make it easier for her. I don't up know how she can do it to the children (again).


Nothing about "making it easier"

For an emotional child, this sort of thing is never "difficult"

What gets "difficult" is managing her own life - without someone to blame it on.


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> Nothing about "making it easier"
> 
> For an emotional child, this sort of thing is never "difficult"
> 
> What gets "difficult" is managing her own life - without someone to blame it on.


It looked like it was easy for her when she was doing it. Totally emotionless and detached. 

She is very independent and controlling. Can't trust men.

Might explain why she texted me Saturday saying it was getting on her nerves me not replying to her.

Of course it's fine for her to not reply to my texts/emails!

I thought shed be happy I wasn't contacting her, so confused really.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

LostOneForGood said:


> Wow Bottle,
> 
> Reading your post is dead on to mine, minus the children. If you havent read it, my post is "Isnt Getting Better or Worse"
> Its horrible how this stuff has to go... hang in there, I am where you are right now. Good days, bad days and a whole lot of questions...


Thanks Lost, have read your thread and thinking of you. Sending some hope your way!

I have pretty much lost all mine since she said deep down "she knows she's made the right decision". 

I can't help think that Yes more to it and she's just putting the barriers up and ending the marriage before she thinks she might get too close or hurt in future. 

I have told her how much she means to me, never cheated or hit her (never would), am a good provider, good father, took on two step children whom love me (they were devastated when she told them she was going). 

Apparently though "she couldn't be herself" lately with me and there's a list of my faults that she says are "all the little things as to why I'm leaving".

Insanity.


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

So I am still fighting the urge to contact her. Seems like I can only do this by posting on here. This is what I want to send her:

"S, After 3 dates I told you I loved you, after 6 weeks we moved in together, after 5 months i asked you to marry me, after 6 months we bought our first house, after 13 months our beautiful daughter arrived and after 21 months we became husband and wife.

After 3.5 years we hit problems, you wanted to leave but I won you back after the toughest 3 months of my life. We fought for our love and marriage and won. Then after 5 years you moved out... It was the worst day of my life by far. But I have no intention of giving up on you yet.

We have achieved so much in our time together. I know you still love me. I understand you don't have the same feelings for me that you did before. I havent met your emotional needs as well as I should've, but I'm learning all the time and can be the husband you want.

I remember standing at the altar with you and not being able to hold back the tears when we said our vows. I truly love you more every day. I miss you and our girls more than i can possibly say.

You said you weren't happy with me this last year. I can see that we drifted apart, got stuck in a rut. We also had some good times... Two great holidays.

Our marriage was entering a different phase and we weren't communicating as well as we should've. Our children were happy though so it wasn't all bad. They are great girls.

I believe that feelings will come and go over the course of a LT marriage. You aren't feeling it right now but what's to say those feelings won't turn with a bit of time and work?

I fear you will just move on and then end up facing similar problems with a future partner. The thought of it breaks my heart though. 

I just feel like you've left too soon S, there's unfinished business between us... We can be great again. A family, us and our girls against the world.

S, I want to ask you for three months of your life. To see if we can make it work. We could spend the odd day with our girls and take it from there. See if those feelings come back. What have we got to lose? 

If you still feel the same I promise i will walk away. You are very special. Never forget that. X"

Isn't it sad when you have to write something like this to your estranged wife, then knowing that she probably wouldn't even reply.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Print this and take it to counseling.


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> Print this and take it to counseling.


I will. Next sessions thurs eve.

I can see her faults and think why would I want to live my life with someone who doesn't want to change.

I can't seem to detach from her though. 

Probably the fantasy of what my life could've been with her and the girls, rather than what it was.


----------



## SCondeck (Oct 5, 2012)

"I fear you will just move on and then end up facing similar problems with a future partner. The thought of it breaks my heart though." 

You have a kind heart. The sadness you would feel for your wife after she splits from the next guy shows what a good and decent fellow you are. 

Have you tried getting angry? This might not be the best advice but sometimes when I start to get down and sad and miss her so much, I try to think of how she's treated me and how she abandoned her vows and marriage. If nothing else, it helps me not to email or text her. 

Just a thought.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> I will. Next sessions thurs eve.
> 
> I can see her faults and think why would I want to live my life with someone who doesn't want to change.
> 
> ...


Delusions are amongst the most powerful motivators going.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> Delusions are amongst the most powerful motivators going.


I am still undecided really. 

On the strength of what she's done there's no way she will commit to someone for life.

I did ask her this question 4 wks before she left - "do you think our marriage is for life", she said "unless one of us cheats on the other then yes it probably will".

4 wks later...... Gone.

When I raised this point with her she said "this is why I can't tell you anything because once I do the words are set in stone". "I probably did feel like that when I said it."

I don't want that. I want someone to stand tall with me when the going gets tough (as it inevitably will over a long time).


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

SCondeck said:


> "I fear you will just move on and then end up facing similar problems with a future partner. The thought of it breaks my heart though."
> 
> You have a kind heart. The sadness you would feel for your wife after she splits from the next guy shows what a good and decent fellow you are.
> 
> ...


I am sad at her leaving me, not so much splitting from someone else in future. I would be sad for the girls as they won't have stability in their lives, but can't imagine being sad for her.

I have been angry, sometimes surprising myself at how much. 

She can be very angry though so I try to keep it to myself. 

We have had about 3 rows since she left. All end up with her incensed. She did apologise after one for being so angry.

She talks to me like I'm one of the children when she gets angry. I actually found it funny the last time and laughed. She went nuts.


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> I am still undecided really.
> 
> On the strength of what she's done there's no way she will commit to someone for life.
> 
> ...


Then you're going to have to man up and lead.

Counting on someone's word without daily work to make sure you're as attractive as possible and meeting their needs sets you up for betrayal.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> Then you're going to have to man up and lead.
> 
> Counting on someone's word without daily work to make sure you're as attractive as possible and meeting their needs sets you up for betrayal.


You know what, that has made the most sense out of anything that's been said to me this last few months.

I got complacent. Not badly as I always bought her small gifts and told her I loved her etc. but emotionally. Not opening up enough.

What do you mean by lead... Just get on with my life?


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> You know what, that has made the most sense out of anything that's been said to me this last few months.
> 
> I got complacent. Not badly as I always bought her small gifts and told her I loved her etc. but emotionally. Not opening up enough.
> 
> What do you mean by lead... Just get on with my life?


Leading means less talking and more doing.

And absolutely no approval-seeking.

Give the approval to yourself.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> Leading means less talking and more doing.
> 
> And absolutely no approval-seeking.
> 
> Give the approval to yourself.


Ok that makes sense. 

We only talk about the children and I am avoiding f2f contact with her as will help me move on. I feel better mot having seen her for 3 wks.

Although I still want her back at the minute, I am committed to working on myself. I'm not massively broken, but need to build confidence again after this.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

So I come home tonight and stbxw has organised the new number plates for my car so that she can get her personal plate onto her car from mine.

She texted me to tell me shed done this and the plates were at home.

She kindly left the receipt for said plates on top of them (£48.00). Obvious that she expects me to pay her back!

Well its about her getting her personal plates back, so I am not going to pay and will ignore it until she asks.

Having seen conrads and others advice on how to handle this I am thinking:

"I'm not ok with paying for them as this is about you getting your plates back"

Sound ok?

She will just expect me to cave and will be angry or dismissive when I stand up to her, but enoughs enough.


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> So I come home tonight and stbxw has organised the new number plates for my car so that she can get her personal plate onto her car from mine.
> 
> She texted me to tell me shed done this and the plates were at home.
> 
> ...


"I'm not ok paying for this" will be sufficient.

You don't need to explain "why" you're not ok with it.

You just aren't.

NO APPROVAL SEEKING


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> "I'm not ok paying for this" will be sufficient.
> 
> You don't need to explain "why" you're not ok with it.
> 
> ...


Thanks C, appreciated. 

I guess I can just ignore the "why not" inevitable question?


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> Thanks C, appreciated.
> 
> I guess I can just ignore the "why not" inevitable question?


Because you are "not ok" with paying it.

She wants it, she pays.

That's how it will be going forward.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> Because you are "not ok" with paying it.
> 
> She wants it, she pays.
> 
> That's how it will be going forward.


Agreed! 

Interestingly she can afford to buy the girls (guilt) presents and take them all to the cinema after school today. 

That must've cost more than the number plate bill!!

The money she has had from me was significant and supposed to be a future down payment on a house. She has prob spent a third of it in 3 months. Silly girl.


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> Agreed!
> 
> Interestingly she can afford to buy the girls (guilt) presents and take them all to the cinema after school today.
> 
> ...


Cut off that spigot.

Don't pay her to leave you.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> Cut off that spigot.
> 
> Don't pay her to leave you.


Yep. It was her share of the equity in our house, so unfortunately she's entitled to it.

Don't have to give her any more though, apart from the monthly child maintenance.

For the first time in 4 mths I don't miss her as much.

Not seeing and only talking about children really helps. 

Can't say I don't want her back yet though,so still work to do.


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> Yep. It was her share of the equity in our house, so unfortunately she's entitled to it.
> 
> Don't have to give her any more though, apart from the monthly child maintenance.
> 
> ...


Keep us apprised.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Damn, feel really low today....

Why did she not tell me earlier.... Why has she blamed me for everything.... Whynismshe so stubborn.... Why can't she see that we sorted our previous issues out and then she dumped this bomb shell and refused to work on it.... She gave up.

'I know it won't work' she said. I hate the ***** for what she has done.

The children are hurting and she doesn't care. Aarrrrgggh!!!


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> Damn, feel really low today....
> 
> Why did she not tell me earlier.... Why has she blamed me for everything.... Whynismshe so stubborn.... Why can't she see that we sorted our previous issues out and then she dumped this bomb shell and refused to work on it.... She gave up.
> 
> ...


Where is your focus?


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> Where is your focus?


Her, not me.

I know it but am struggling to let go.

Counselling tonight was hard. Counsellor thinks I should think what my needs are as to whether I send her the letter or not. 

Said I shouldn't have any regrets and talked about endings a fair bit.... How I've handled them in the past not just in relationships.


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> Her, not me.
> 
> I know it but am struggling to let go.
> 
> ...


Codependency is RARELY limited to relationships.

You see it in work.

You see it in parenting.

You see it in friendships.

It's fingerlike projections are likely all over your life.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> Codependency is RARELY limited to relationships.
> 
> You see it in work.
> 
> ...


Probably, all I know is I'm f***** right now.


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> Probably, all I know is I'm f***** right now.


When you work diligently at it, there will be a day where you suddenly sit up and realize you love yourself enough NOT to do these things.

What's really cool about that is that you finally see through yourself.... your motivations... your fear.... your sometimes pathetic weakness.

AND.... drumroll....

You are then able to see through nearly everyone else.

And.... once you can read their motives, it's so much easier to be forgiving, kind, and generous WITHOUT being needy.

It's almost magical.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> When you work diligently at it, there will be a day where you suddenly sit up and realize you love yourself enough NOT to do these things.
> 
> What's really cool about that is that you finally see through yourself.... your motivations... your fear.... your sometimes pathetic weakness.
> 
> ...


I am trying to understand why I want her back so much. 

Is it because I'm codependent (maybe) or that I want my girls more than her (don't think so), or that I want to stay true to my marriage vows (yes).

I am still crazy in love with her that's the problem. I've lived on my own for years before - no problem. She is like my drug.

I just want my family back. I'm not ready to give up, but the force is strong with this one.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

By the way Conrad, thanks for all your advice on here. 

Makes a cr*p time more bearable.


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> I am trying to understand why I want her back so much.
> 
> Is it because I'm codependent (maybe) or that I want my girls more than her (don't think so), or that I want to stay true to my marriage vows (yes).
> 
> ...


There's no "maybe" about your codependency. That's why the feelings are so overwhelming.

Have you read Melanie Beattie's "Codependent No More"?


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> There's no "maybe" about your codependency. That's why the feelings are so overwhelming.
> 
> Have you read Melanie Beattie's "Codependent No More"?


No I haven't, so will get hold of a copy. 

Thanks. I need to do something!


----------



## Too Little Too Late? (Sep 2, 2012)

Bottle said:


> I am trying to understand why I want her back so much.
> 
> Is it because I'm codependent (maybe) or that I want my girls more than her (don't think so), or that I want to stay true to my marriage vows (yes).
> 
> ...


"the force is wrong with this one" I have said the exact same thing Bottle.It like they have a chip in our brains, after we allow the bs for so long we begin to believe the story they tell us. "i am not good enough" We are going thru the exact same struggle, how to get rid of the idea of someone something we had..long ago when nothing mattered when there was no pressure..no "real" commitment.. and look at what they are now and probably always were. We got sold on the illusion and thought that we could love them enough for the illusion to come back someday. In my case I have been killing myself the last 3 months thinking that I can't live without this person, meanwhile I am destroying myself. She has a posOW and yet I have still given in every time I hear a sob story or get even the tiniest crumb. I know how you feel my friend and it just doest make sense. Apparently co dependancy is no bullsh8t. We have way too much of our self worth wrapped up in these women for no good reason. Lets support one another thru this so we can come out better on the other side.


----------



## Too Little Too Late? (Sep 2, 2012)

Bottle said:


> So I am still fighting the urge to contact her. Seems like I can only do this by posting on here. This is what I want to send her:
> 
> "S, After 3 dates I told you I loved you, after 6 weeks we moved in together, after 5 months i asked you to marry me, after 6 months we bought our first house, after 13 months our beautiful daughter arrived and after 21 months we became husband and wife.
> 
> ...


I have said the exact same words time and time again to no avail."I'm too scared" or " I don't know" is all I have ever gotten.


----------



## jdlash (Jun 18, 2012)

Mine would reply. She would say, I'm sorry I don't feel the same about you as you do me.

It makes you feel worse then just leaving it alone.


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

jdlash said:


> Mine would reply. She would say, I'm sorry I don't feel the same about you as you do me.


That's what you say as you're wiping your feet on the doormat.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> That's what you say as you're wiping your feet on the doormat.


So the general consensus is do the 180, work on yourself, no being a doormat and then you get straightened out with a bit of time.

IF they have a change of heart and want to come back, then you have a choice to make. 

If not, who cares as you're well on the way to being a great catch for someone better!!

I'm getting the hang of this....


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Too Little Too Late? said:


> "the force is wrong with this one" I have said the exact same thing Bottle.It like they have a chip in our brains, after we allow the bs for so long we begin to believe the story they tell us. "i am not good enough" We are going thru the exact same struggle, how to get rid of the idea of someone something we had..long ago when nothing mattered when there was no pressure..no "real" commitment.. and look at what they are now and probably always were. We got sold on the illusion and thought that we could love them enough for the illusion to come back someday. In my case I have been killing myself the last 3 months thinking that I can't live without this person, meanwhile I am destroying myself. She has a posOW and yet I have still given in every time I hear a sob story or get even the tiniest crumb. I know how you feel my friend and it just doest make sense. Apparently co dependancy is no bullsh8t. We have way too much of our self worth wrapped up in these women for no good reason. Lets support one another thru this so we can come out better on the other side.


TLTL, I agree. I am getting better but slowly. IC is helping as it not seeing her. I still talk about the children but that's about it.

I can arrange the children so I don't have to see her.... Could you do this too? It's helping me move on.

We WILL come out better for this one way or another. We're the ones doing the work so we can't help but. They are not so will have the same s**t with their next victims.


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> So the general consensus is do the 180, work on yourself, no being a doormat and then you get straightened out with a bit of time.
> 
> IF they have a change of heart and want to come back, then you have a choice to make.
> 
> ...


In a nutshell, that's it.

No reason to not be the best you can be, regardless of outcome.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> In a nutshell, that's it.
> 
> No reason to not be the best you can be, regardless of outcome.


Yep.

The big factor is TIME as well.

I feel better generally now it's been 4 mths, so in another 4 I should feel much better.


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> Yep.
> 
> The big factor is TIME as well.
> 
> I feel better generally now it's been 4 mths, so in another 4 I should feel much better.


Only if you quit doing things that set you back - like contacting her and opening your heart up for further rejection.


----------



## spun (Jul 2, 2012)

Conrad said:


> Only if you quit doing things that set you back - like contacting her and opening your heart up for further rejection.


If you take a good look around this board you will see the folks who have the hardest time moving on share something in common.

They have continued to reach out or try to fix spouses that have walked away from the marriage.

It's a sure way to prolong your stay in emotional hell.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

spun said:


> If you take a good look around this board you will see the folks who have the hardest time moving on share something in common.
> 
> They have continued to reach out or try to fix spouses that have walked away from the marriage.
> 
> ...


Yep it makes sense. I don't want to move on but have no choice.

She isn't interested at all by the looks of it so that helps I guess. She's not throwing me any crumbs or anything.

This is her pattern, I don't see it changing. Feel sorry for the children as they will struggle for stability.


----------



## Too Little Too Late? (Sep 2, 2012)

Bottle said:


> Yep it makes sense. I don't want to move on but have no choice.
> 
> She isn't interested at all by the looks of it so that helps I guess. She's not throwing me any crumbs or anything.
> 
> This is her pattern, I don't see it changing. Feel sorry for the children as they will struggle for stability.


Thats what I miss most. The family unit. It can be recreated in a better more loving relationship. I can't fathom it right now but I know it is possible.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Too Little Too Late? said:


> Thats what I miss most. The family unit. It can be recreated in a better more loving relationship. I can't fathom it right now but I know it is possible.


Yes I think it can too, but right now it's a bridge too far mate.

I've been in shock for 3 months, now the anger is kicking in. 

She has betrayed me.


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

"Losing yourself" and your identity is your part of why this has happened to you.

Have either of you rented the movie Blue Valentine?

You should both see it.


----------



## Too Little Too Late? (Sep 2, 2012)

Conrad said:


> "Losing yourself" and your identity is your part of why this has happened to you.
> 
> Have either of you rented the movie Blue Valentine?
> 
> You should both see it.


Ill look for it..netflix?


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Too Little Too Late? said:


> Ill look for it..netflix?


Blockbuster also has it in stock.

I want to hear what you see in it.

Hollywood rarely tells us the truth. This is one of those golden moments.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

I caved and sent her the letter over the weekend. 

Got the children tonight as she is away working, great to have them around but an in your face reminder of what my life used to be like!


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> I caved and sent her the letter over the weekend.
> 
> Got the children tonight as she is away working, great to have them around but an in your face reminder of what my life used to be like!


Rent the movie.

You'll never be tempted to send another letter like it.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> Rent the movie.
> 
> You'll never be tempted to send another letter like it.


I will, I thought one last try might work. 

Stupid really.


----------



## spun (Jul 2, 2012)

Bottle said:


> I will, I thought one last try might work.
> 
> Stupid really.


Your emotional brain makes most of your decisions. 

It's a big part of the reason you are in this mess to begin with.

The good news is you are finally becoming aware of it.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

spun said:


> Your emotional brain makes most of your decisions.
> 
> It's a big part of the reason you are in this mess to begin with.
> 
> The good news is you are finally becoming aware of it.


Yeah, of I look at this from 50,000 feet she is someone to steer clear of. Trouble with commitment as well as a whole host of other issues.

Will probably never change.

Still love her though and it's this that's still blinding me to these faults. 

It's not like she even left me for another man. Just to be on her own. Not sure whether it's worse.


----------



## spun (Jul 2, 2012)

Bottle said:


> Yeah, of I look at this from 50,000 feet she is someone to steer clear of. Trouble with commitment as well as a whole host of other issues.
> 
> Will probably never change.
> 
> ...


Where is your focus, on you or her?


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

spun said:


> Where is your focus, on you or her?


I know Spun, I know. This is my biggest problem. It's always on her and whilst I try to block her out it just isn't happening.

Its better than it was so I'm hoping it will continue with time. 

Still wake up at 5am every day and am on the sleeping tablets and it's been 4.5 months.

Hoping upon hope it gets better soon.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Had to tell my 4 yr old daughter tonight that daddy is selling the house as people were coming round to view it.

It's the only house she remembers and said "but daddy I love this house and my bedroom." then cried her heart out.

Not sure I can take much more of seeing her hurting too.


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

She'll be excited about the next place.


----------



## pseudonym (Aug 19, 2012)

Conrad - What's Blue Valentine about? I remember my wife watching it a while back (she was a huge Ryan Gosling fan) and I think she said it was pretty intense.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Had a good couple of,days as had all 3 children as stbxw is away with work. School discos last night and everything.

Massive downer today though as they arent here and it's like it was a reminder of what life used to be like. 

MIL came over too and was talking to the eldest about how great I am. She cant understand why her daughter is,doing this and even said she's got a screw loose!

Trying to,focus more on me - ordered blue valentine film from amazon (bit wary about it Conrad!!). 

Not,sure whether I've bottomed out yet. No response from stbxw on my letter.... Why am I not surprised


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

pseudonym said:


> Conrad - What's Blue Valentine about? I remember my wife watching it a while back (she was a huge Ryan Gosling fan) and I think she said it was pretty intense.


It's about codependence


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

So back from counselling tonight... I am not ready to give up on my family just yet and the counsellor seems to think I don't have to give up but focus more on me (I am trying but have had two hard days after having the children for 2 days mon tue).

Spoke to stbxw on the phone after children tonight and she didn't mention the letter I sent her - thought she was going to at one point but she didn't 

She seemed warmer than of late though, even thought the conversation was about business (children). 

I didn't mention it to her as didn't think this was a good move. Wanted to though.

On chapter 5 of codependent no more!


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Have you rented the movie?


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> Have you rented the movie?


Couldn't rent so have ordered from amazon. Should get it tomorrow/Saturday, so will let you know what I think.

Just not ready to give up yet.


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> Couldn't rent so have ordered from amazon. Should get it tomorrow/Saturday, so will let you know what I think.
> 
> Just not ready to give up yet.


You don't have to give up.

Just let go.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> You don't have to give up.
> 
> Just let go.


...and that's the part I'm struggling with.

Still attached. I've never dealt with uncertainty well. 

The thought of us not ending up together doesn't sit well.


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> ...and that's the part I'm struggling with.
> 
> Still attached. I've never dealt with uncertainty well.
> 
> The thought of us not ending up together doesn't sit well.


How about you ending up with you... and being perfectly content with that?


----------



## jpr (Dec 14, 2011)

Hey Bottle...

I understand the feeling of not wanting to give up. I was like that too. My counselor supported me in this too...she understood my need to leave the door open for as long as I did.

But, there is a difference between leaving the door open and standing at the threshold ushering your wife inside. 

It was hard for me to focus on "me". When my counselor would tell me that I needed to focus on myself and my own wants and needs, I just had such a hard time. I had a hard time even identifying what I wanted/needed in life.

It sort of helped me, though, to envision myself opening a door, but then turning my back to the door and just walking away from it...I envisioned myself still in the room, but just busying myself with other tasks...all while leaving the door ajar. ...and just ignoring the fact that the door was open. 

The uncertainty is killer....not being in control is a killer. I was so used to an algorithm of life. I used to think that if I played by the rules, then good things would happen. But, that is not true. Landslides happen. ...and you have no control over them. You only have control over how you weather them....and how much you choose to hurt from them.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> It's about codependence


Just watched it.

Need to think it through more, but saw some familiar stuff in there.

First big impression is how you get from infatuation to complacency.... Then nothing left 

Great film


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> Just watched it.
> 
> Need to think it through more, but saw some familiar stuff in there.
> 
> ...


Think about the questions she was asking him.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> Think about the questions she was asking him.


about dealing with two kids.

"Think about what you're saying rather than what you think"

Wife said that to me a lot.


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> about dealing with two kids.
> 
> "Think about what you're saying rather than what you think"
> 
> Wife said that to me a lot.


"Isn't there something you want to do"


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> "Isn't there something you want to do"


Can't remember that one


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

"how do yo trust your feelings when they can just disappear like that?"


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> "how do yo trust your feelings when they can just disappear like that?"


She was asking him... "what happened to the man I married"?

The one that played the ukelele. The one that made me laugh.

Is her really now this inert object that is content to entertain another (alpha male's) child and "be my husband", (meaning drink on the job and be another child for me to parent.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> She was asking him... "what happened to the man I married"?
> 
> The one that played the ukelele. The one that made me laugh.
> 
> Is her really now this inert object that is content to entertain another (alpha male's) child and "be my husband", (meaning drink on the job and be another child for me to parent.


I can see how I changed from the man she married, but nowhere near as bad as that.

I am trying to show her I can be the husband she wants.

Guess I have to make changes for myself (live more for today, worry less about the future and be more open with feelings) rather than for her.

She is gone now but I still haven't given up hope.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Why do I think texting her will make any difference? 

Haven't btw.

No reply from the letter and I know she got it. She acts like it never happened. 

She didn't flinch when our daughter said on the phone to her tonight she wanted mummy and daddy to live in the same house with her.

Some backbone.


----------



## spun (Jul 2, 2012)

Bottle said:


> Why do I think texting her will make any difference?
> 
> Haven't btw.
> 
> ...


The "letter".almost never elicits a response.

It's needy and unattractive to any wife that has screwed up enought nerve to walk away. Live and learn.

Unfortunately, all you can do is detach and work on bettering yourself now.

Maybe she notices and takes interest, maybe not.

Either way, it's now your path forward.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

spun said:


> The "letter".almost never elicits a response.
> 
> It's needy and unattractive to any wife that has screwed up enought nerve to walk away. Live and learn.
> 
> ...


Thanks Spun, I need the kick up the a$$.

Come to think of it the most reaction I got from her was when I ignored a couple of her texts a few weeks back. She was pi$$ed at me, so shows she still cares.


----------



## spun (Jul 2, 2012)

And when she tries to stir the pot, don't feed her.

Don't ignore her or be rude.

Just adress the issue with no emotion.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Well stbxw came round to pick up our daughter tonight. Was on the off chance as she was coming back from a Halloween party. 

She looked good. She talked to me and was pleasant but only business really.

Just wanted to hold her... Pathetic I know but the first time ive actually seen her in 4 weeks. 

I held it together well and just stuck to business. She hasn't mentioned the letter and guess she never will.

Am shaking now though. Hard to see her in the flesh.

why would it be so hard to spend the odd day together with our daughter and see if anything develops?? Don't understand.


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> I can see how I changed from the man she married, but nowhere near as bad as that.
> 
> I am trying to show her I can be the husband she wants.
> 
> ...


Do not give up hope.

But, what that really means is do not give up on YOU.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> Do not give up hope.
> 
> But, what that really means is do not give up on YOU.


Thanks C, I am beating myself up less about the mistakes I made. She hasn't recognised her mistakes and doubt she will ever change.

IC is going well and I feel slightly stronger today. Detachment is the goal now. Take a leaf out of her book, it comes naturally to her.


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> Well stbxw came round to pick up our daughter tonight. Was on the off chance as she was coming back from a Halloween party.
> 
> She looked good. She talked to me and was pleasant but only business really.
> 
> ...


"Something has to develop" first.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> "Something has to develop" first.


How do you mean?


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> How do you mean?


You need to work on being attractive.

It's not nearly as difficult and vague as it sounds.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> You need to work on being attractive.
> 
> It's not nearly as difficult and vague as it sounds.


Makes sense... Physically I am in better shape than we first met... Going to gym regularly as I have for years.... 

It's the emotional attractiveness I think that's the problem.

I am working on the stuff I need to in IC but do you think 180 is still the way to go? It's def easier not seeing her right now.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Am going to do something for myself tomorrow ... Get my daughters name tattooed on my arm...

Missing the kids tonight as would normally be trick or treating but they're with stbxw. They will have a good time and I am having a relaxing beer!


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle,

Check this out:

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/mens-clubhouse/18181-man-up-nice-guy-reference.html

Read all the links.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> Bottle,
> 
> Check this out:
> 
> ...


I've read half of it and already had an awakening.

When I met her I was a total legend. 100% in control of my life. I had all the best looking girls with me in our workplace. 

She wanted me so badly. I married her and became a *****. Someone who tended to her needs. She then lost respect for me - I would've too.

She has done me the biggest favour of my life. I can now become the man I was on course to be... With or without her.


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> I've read half of it and already had an awakening.
> 
> When I met her I was a total legend. 100% in control of my life. I had all the best looking girls with me in our workplace.
> 
> ...


Welcome Bottle.

You woke up today.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> Welcome Bottle.
> 
> You woke up today.


Thank you my friend.... Nothing great ever came easy eh?


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> Thank you my friend.... Nothing great ever came easy eh?


No it doesn't.

You've been worth the wait.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> No it doesn't.
> 
> You've been worth the wait.


Now I understand..... Focus on yourself and not her.

I am looking forward to the next chapter now!!!!


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> Now I understand..... Focus on yourself and not her.
> 
> I am looking forward to the next chapter now!!!!


Smiling here... very big grin.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> Smiling here... very big grin.


Conrad, I had previously invited stbxw to spend the afternoon with our daughter and I tomorrow.

She just texted me to say she wouldn't be coming as it would give me false hope and she can't live a lie or be unhappy.

This would've sent me into a tail spin last week even, but am ok right now. Disappointed but ok. I didn't expect her to turn up anyway.

Looks like she is done for good now.

I still don't feel like giving up tough - letting go, yes, but not giving up yet.


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> Conrad, I had previously invited stbxw to spend the afternoon with our daughter and I tomorrow.
> 
> She just texted me to say she wouldn't be coming as it would give me false hope and she can't live a lie or be unhappy.
> 
> ...


You just text back, "sorry you feel that way" and let it ride.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> You just text back, "sorry you feel that way" and let it ride.


Job done... Thanks.

Just don't want to see her now. Will help me let go. 

Part of me actually feels sorry for her right now. She will never find the happiness she so deeply craves, but I can do no more to convince her.


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> Job done... Thanks.
> 
> Just don't want to see her now. Will help me let go.
> 
> Part of me actually feels sorry for her right now. She will never find the happiness she so deeply craves, but I can do no more to convince her.


No one finds happiness that looks for it in others.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> No one finds happiness that looks for it in others.


Yep, I am finally realising just how broken a person she is. 

I am angry at myself for falling into her trap.

At least I have a beautiful daughter though. Shame her f***** up mum won't be able to provide her with any stability or a role model. I will have to do that.

I don't want to become a bitter person about this so am just going to avoid her as much as I can until healed!


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Observing her while detached would be healthier.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> Observing her while detached would be healthier.


Yes I get it. I am still attached which is the problem. Less so by the day though and not seeing her helps.

I feel ok but a bit angry now - I just unfriended her from Facebook although I don't really use it. Waste of time.


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> Yes I get it. I am still attached which is the problem. Less so by the day though and not seeing her helps.
> 
> I feel ok but a bit angry now - I just unfriended her from Facebook although I don't really use it. Waste of time.


Left-brain observations of how she "really" is offset the attached right brain that longs for the delusion of what she represents.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> Left-brain observations of how she "really" is offset the attached right brain that longs for the delusion of what she represents.


I can see that. I just wish I didn't have to see her ever again.

It doesn't matter how much potential I think we have if she isn't up for working on it.

The fact is she has bailed at the sight of the second bit of trouble we had I our marriage. Hardly long term success material...


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> I can see that. I just wish I didn't have to see her ever again.
> 
> It doesn't matter how much potential I think we have if she isn't up for working on it.
> 
> The fact is she has bailed at the sight of the second bit of trouble we had I our marriage. Hardly long term success material...


She's really attractive?

How old is she?


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> She's really attractive?
> 
> How old is she?


Yes and 36 in a month.


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> Yes and 36 in a month.


Attractive 36 year old women - literally - rule the western world.

There's usually some rube who will kiss her ass and do it for her.

Demography kicks in about 7-10 years from now.

It becomes "more difficult" to find those same services

But, short term, bailing has always "worked" for her, as it's allowed her to avoid the heavy lifting.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> Attractive 36 year old women - literally - rule the western world.
> 
> There's usually some rube who will kiss her ass and do it for her.
> 
> ...


Youre right she wont be short of offers. They're already lining up to kiss her ass. 

I can see her future Conrad... Same pattern. She will end up alone one day I'm convinced of it.

I thought I could change her but can't. My counsellor said I could've been Brad Pitt and she would've still left me!


----------



## BigMac (Oct 29, 2012)

Bottle said:


> Youre right she wont be short of offers. They're already lining up to kiss her ass.
> 
> I can see her future Conrad... Same pattern. She will end up alone one day I'm convinced of it.


And new male member here


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

BigMac said:


> And new male member here


You bet, it's a certainty.


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> Youre right she wont be short of offers. They're already lining up to kiss her ass.
> 
> I can see her future Conrad... Same pattern. She will end up alone one day I'm convinced of it.
> 
> I thought I could change her but can't. My counsellor said I could've been Brad Pitt and she would've still left me!


With her background, it's a lock.


----------



## BigMac (Oct 29, 2012)

It breaks my heart


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> With her background, it's a lock.


I am getting stronger as would've flipped about her text a few weeks back.

She looked bigger than I remembered when I saw her Sunday. 

I expect to actually thank her for this one day... Probably when she's single again and I am in another relationship applying the learning from this one!


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

BigMac said:


> It breaks my heart


Mine too BM, it's insanity really.

F*ck her... There must be better out there somewhere!


----------



## Beathan914 (Oct 29, 2012)

I just want to know how they can become so distant. Seems it happens so fast sometimes. 180 and stay clear. Everyone here seems to be on the same advise, does it really work?


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Beathan914 said:


> I just want to know how they can become so distant. Seems it happens so fast sometimes. 180 and stay clear. Everyone here seems to be on the same advise, does it really work?


They have been detaching for a long time previous, that's why B914. 

180 is worth a shot I'd say... It's more about healing you though.


----------



## BigMac (Oct 29, 2012)

Bottle said:


> They have been detaching for a long time previous, that's why B914.


Yes , they're detaching for year or two and then you get ILYBINILWY
Those days woman need 100000000000% dedication, attention, affection ... if you don't do it you end up here !


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

BigMac said:


> Yes , they're detaching for year or two and then you get ILYBINILWY
> Those days woman need 100000000000% dedication, attention, affection ... if you don't do it you end up here !


Nope.

Smothering them with that has you ending up here also.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

So just had a long conversation with stbxw - good 45 mins on phone when she rang to say goodnight to our daughter.

I got my tattoo today which is awesome so told her and she was VERY surprised as although I'd talked about it before I don't think she thought I'd go through with it. Said it looked awesome.

Sent her a photo of it and she sent one back of a recent one she had done a few weeks ago (she has about 8 now!).

We talked about the tattoos, then the conversation got onto mutual friends and gossip about our split.

Eventually we got to us and she said she could tell I am a million times better than I was a month or so ago... She said "I'm not sure how it's happened but I can really see you've made a load of progress" (thanks Conrad!). The counselling and a bit more time have helped too.

I did slide a bit and said I was intent on becoming a better version of the man she fell in love with, and if she took notice then great and if not then I'd be ok with that. I said I hadn't given up hope for us yet (bit needy in reflection) and that if we spent some time together maybe that spark might come back.

She said she wasn't going to spend any time with me and our daughter yet as I wasn't ready to not have any strings attached and I would read into it that we would be getting back together etc. but wants us to when she thinks I am ready.

I asked her if she was seeing anyone else and she said she would tell me if she was with someone who she saw some progress with, but not just if she was going out for a drink or something with someone. She said she would expect the same from me too.

Fair enough, so means she has gone for a drink with a bloke or two. To be expected, she is hot and gets attention from men. Why would she had left if she wasn't going to do this... Again bit of a needy question so won't go there again.

All in all it was a good conversation that felt more normal than ones we have had before.

I feel well..... Ok. I don't want her to date other blokes, but can't stop her. Maybe she will enjoy it or maybe she wont and miss me. Whilst I still hope she does it's not a desperate all consuming hope like it was a few weeks ago.


----------



## jdlash (Jun 18, 2012)

Bottle,
All I hear is she told you. She has about as much nerve as my W thinking she can tell you what she will and won't do and realistically expecting that you'll be there when she thinks your ready for a no strings attached relationship. Maybe I'm further along with this, but I don't see how you didn't hang up on her.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

jdlash said:


> Bottle,
> All I hear is she told you. She has about as much nerve as my W thinking she can tell you what she will and won't do and realistically expecting that you'll be there when she thinks your ready for a no strings attached relationship. Maybe I'm further along with this, but I don't see how you didn't hang up on her.


Jd, hadn't seen it like this but it's reminiscent of how our relationship worked out. I guess because she left and knows I want her back she can sit pretty.

Problem is she is very strong minded. There's almost no best way to handle her. She left me and has totally detached since day 1. 

I still want her back right now so am trying to play it cool without being too needy.


----------



## jdlash (Jun 18, 2012)

Give it time bottle. I wanted mine back too, but now I'm not so sure. Actually I'm pretty sure she did me one heck of a favor


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> Jd, hadn't seen it like this but it's reminiscent of how our relationship worked out. I guess because she left and knows I want her back she can sit pretty.
> 
> Problem is she is very strong minded. There's almost no best way to handle her. She left me and has totally detached since day 1.
> 
> I still want her back right now so am trying to play it cool without being too needy.


Bottle,

The stuff about being a better man and hoping she'll be interested kind of gives away the playbook.

When she tells you you're looking better and more attractive, you say "thanks"

The question about whether she is seeing anyone else is a Big Bold Sign on your chest that says "I'm PLAN B"

Never ask that again.


----------



## spun (Jul 2, 2012)

Bottle said:


> Jd, hadn't seen it like this but it's reminiscent of how our relationship worked out. I guess because she left and knows I want her back she can sit pretty.
> 
> Problem is she is very strong minded. There's almost no best way to handle her. She left me and has totally detached since day 1.
> 
> I still want her back right now so am trying to play it cool without being too needy.


Have you read Synthetic's commandments?

Live 'em.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

jdlash said:


> Give it time bottle. I wanted mine back too, but now I'm not so sure. Actually I'm pretty sure she did me one heck of a favor


You could be right jd.

I feel a lot less attached right now than I was a few weeks ago.

Could be a blessing in disguise, but there's something in me still that wants her. More work on me required me thinks.

Maybe it's just the physical attraction that I have for the girl - its always been so strong. Hers was for me, but just waned over the last 12 months.


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> You could be right jd.
> 
> I feel a lot less attached right now than I was a few weeks ago.
> 
> ...


This is a good thread also.

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/mens-clubhouse/59611-becoming-alpha.html

Machiavelli knows his stuff.


----------



## jdlash (Jun 18, 2012)

It's all your perception. It's perfectly normal and will take time, but there is nothing to be attached to with the way she is treating you. You are still attached to the picture you have painted, not reality. It took me a lot of months, but it gets easier. I still have moments that I miss my "family" but now I'm realizing that I wish more then anything that I would have been wiser choosing who I had children with. 

The more progress I make, the more I realize that she hasn't changed it's just that my eyes are opening up and I'm seeing the real person that I married. It's UGLY.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> This is a good thread also.
> 
> http://talkaboutmarriage.com/mens-clubhouse/59611-becoming-alpha.html
> 
> Machiavelli knows his stuff.


I am working on being more alpha like I said to you the other day... I lost my way on this but can get it back. 

What I'm not sure of is my next move. 

I still want her back which is Problem no. 1. I need to get to the place where I don't want her back.

Think I just need to continue to focus on me and my daughter really, but still feel the need to reach out sometimes to stbxw.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

jdlash said:


> It's all your perception. It's perfectly normal and will take time, but there is nothing to be attached to with the way she is treating you. You are still attached to the picture you have painted, not reality. It took me a lot of months, but it gets easier. I still have moments that I miss my "family" but now I'm realizing that I wish more then anything that I would have been wiser choosing who I had children with.
> 
> The more progress I make, the more I realize that she hasn't changed it's just that my eyes are opening up and I'm seeing the real person that I married. It's UGLY.


Thanks jd... I said the other day she might've done me the biggest favour of my life and i hope I'm right.

Need some more time and to focus on her bad points!


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Actually, shouldn't I be saying to her... "You are my wife, you left and if you want to date other blokes then we get divorced."

End of.


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> Actually, shouldn't I be saying to her... "You are my wife, you left and if you want to date other blokes then we get divorced."
> 
> End of.


That's one option.

How about, "I'm not ok with dating while married"


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> That's one option.
> 
> How about, "I'm not ok with dating while married"


Just texted her "I'm not sure whether you are or not, but I'm not ok with you dating while still married S".

Alpha?


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> Just texted her "I'm not sure whether you are or not, but I'm not ok with you dating while still married S".
> 
> Alpha?


"I'm not ok with dating while married"

(Stronger)

You're not concerned with what she's ok with. This is about what YOU are ok with.

KWIM?


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> "I'm not ok with dating while married"
> 
> (Stronger)
> 
> ...


I get it thanks.... What I sent is stronger than what I've shown recently though!


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> I get it thanks.... What I sent is stronger than what I've shown recently though!


One step... one day at a time.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> One step... one day at a time.


Well things escalated today after I stupidly texted her again to try and clarify something from our conversation yesterday. 

Just wanted to say I didn't want her to live a lie or be unhappy as she prob thought I just wanted things to go back to how they were (not true).

Well I got a long angry text back saying how she's done, isn't in love with me and can't be unhappy, sad or stressed again as she is happy now. Lots of other stuff but that was the gist of it.

I got carried away after we had a good conversation last night. She also said I can't control her and she will date other people if she wants! (think she missed the point -I know this and was just saying I wasn't ok with it).

She also said "you know I feel resentful towards you for some of the ways I was made to feel." 

Well I control her feelings by the looks of it.... I wish, if I could then all this would be different.

Now a few weeks ago I would've been crushed by this..... Now, well I'm disappointed as hadn't given up hope of R completely, but am ok really.

Still fighting to not take most of the blame that's coming my way, but I know I was generally a good husband and father so that helps.


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> Well things escalated today after I stupidly texted her again to try and clarify something from our conversation yesterday.
> 
> Just wanted to say I didn't want her to live a lie or be unhappy as she prob thought I just wanted things to go back to how they were (not true).


----------



## spun (Jul 2, 2012)

Bottle said:


> Well things escalated today after I stupidly texted her again to try and clarify something from our conversation yesterday.
> 
> Just wanted to say I didn't want her to live a lie or be unhappy as she prob thought I just wanted things to go back to how they were (not true).
> 
> ...


She is far from happy.

Projected anger.

Deep down inside she can't stand herself.

And, you can't fix it.

Dust yourself off and keep moving forward.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

C, I deserve the bashing and could hit myself as just made it worse!! Oh well, live and learn.

Spun, thanks... I agree and am really ok right now, so shows I'm moving on. She's definitely pinning most of it on me, which is a shame. It does though help me see a side of her she's not shown before.


----------



## spun (Jul 2, 2012)

Bottle said:


> C, I deserve the bashing and could hit myself as just made it worse!! Oh well, live and learn.
> 
> Spun, thanks... I agree and am really ok right now, so shows I'm moving on. She's definitely pinning most of it on me, which is a shame. It does though help me see a side of her she's not shown before.


When people show you who they are, it's best to believe them.

I'm sure you have seen this "side" before.

Now, it is just coming out in spades.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

spun said:


> When people show you who they are, it's best to believe them.
> 
> I'm sure you have seen this "side" before.
> 
> Now, it is just coming out in spades.


Yeah its always been there under the surface. She gets confrontational really easily. I just thought she was feisty, but seems there's real anger there and I'm not sure why.


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> Yeah its always been there under the surface. She gets confrontational really easily. I just thought she was feisty, but seems there's real anger there and I'm not sure why.


It's her childhood.

People who were supposed to love her didn't.

So, she's beyond angry with them.

But, they're not around.

You're their stand-in.


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

And... enabling her (otherwise known as 'giving her space to heal', or 'making life easier' for her) does absolutely no good.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> And... enabling her (otherwise known as 'giving her space to heal', or 'making life easier' for her) does absolutely no good.


I can see that my friend.

I feel ok, fine right now so am making progress on detaching.

Can't help but be sad about the good times we had and the family not being around me but I'm actually looking forward to selling the house and getting a new place soon.

I didn't think I would ever say that!

Strange really only 6 mths ago we were all in Florida at Disney having a great time... How life changes!


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> I can see that my friend.
> 
> I feel ok, fine right now so am making progress on detaching.
> 
> ...


With the passing of time, you will come to see that she has set you free.

And, with this freedom, you will be the man you were born to be.

Armed with the self love you sought and found here.

Straight ahead!


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> With the passing of time, you will come to see that she has set you free.
> 
> And, with this freedom, you will be the man you were born to be.
> 
> ...


Thank you C, I am already on the right path thanks to the support from you guys.

She has blown our issues out of proportion to a) justify her exit and b) not have to change herself. 

She actually said yesterday "I will NOT be made to feel guilty about this in any way at all"

She would've left at some point for some reason, I can see that now.

At least it happened now and not in 10 yrs time!


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Oh and she's been reading my emails too I found out yesterday... because you do that when you really don't care for someone anymore


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> Oh and she's been reading my emails too I found out yesterday... because you do that when you really don't care for someone anymore


Not your problem, but change your password.

Remember, mysterious and edgy is attractive.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> Not your problem, but change your password.
> 
> Remember, mysterious and edgy is attractive.


Will do my friend! 

She came round to pick up our daughter tonight and went straight for my new tattoo...


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> Will do my friend!
> 
> She came round to pick up our daughter tonight and went straight for my new tattoo...


Uh huh.

Keep doing interesting and new things.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> Uh huh.
> 
> Keep doing interesting and new things.


 I know she snooped my emails because in our texting yesterday she mentioned me joining a dating agency "not that I care what you do" she said, "but don't tell me I can't date people".

She could've only known this through looking at my emails. No other way.


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> I know she snooped my emails because in our texting yesterday she mentioned me joining a dating agency "not that I care what you do" she said, "but don't tell me I can't date people".
> 
> She could've only known this through looking at my emails. No other way.


"I'm not ok with dating while married"

"I may have opposite sex friends, but there is a strict boundary on physical affection"

Cool

Firm

Dispassionate


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> "I'm not ok with dating while married"
> 
> "I may have opposite sex friends, but there is a strict boundary on physical affection"
> 
> ...


I think she's done Conrad. She was angry when she said that stuff in the texting yesterday.

I would bet my house on the fact she's had a couple of dates in the last month or so.

She won't bother mentioning it again. There's still something there's somewhere but it's going out fast.

Me.... I'm ok.


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> I think she's done Conrad. She was angry when she said that stuff in the texting yesterday.
> 
> I would bet my house on the fact she's had a couple of dates in the last month or so.
> 
> ...


I'm not concerned with her.

How are you?


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> I'm not concerned with her.
> 
> How are you?


I'm ok.... Still not fully detached but making progress. 

I can definitely see all her faults much more clearly.

She can't hold down a relationship with any human being, male or female. 

She seems ok with that and content to keep reinventing herself every few years.

I'm comfortable with who I am and the things I'm working on, so won't be making the same mistakes again.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

So Conrad, is my next move just to ignore her unless she contacts me about the children, the keep it brief and business like?

I would rather never see her again but of course that's not possible.

I can see her and all her sh*t from 50,000 feet and its not as attractive from up here.

She has no honour or responsibility.


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

That sounds like a plan.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> That sounds like a plan.


Great, thanks.

I have an overwhelming urge to just tell her exactly what a let down she is but won't. The girls will work it out for themselves in future as I definitely won't be the last guy she leaves.


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> Great, thanks.
> 
> I have an overwhelming urge to just tell her exactly what a let down she is but won't. The girls will work it out for themselves in future as I definitely won't be the last guy she leaves.


Your silence says it better than your mouth ever could.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> Your silence says it better than your mouth ever could.


Yep, I've done too much talking already and it's made me look weak.

At least I did EVERYTHING I could to save the marriage, so I can sleep easy in future.

Changed my email password today too, so that'll stop her snooping.


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> Yep, I've done too much talking already and it's made me look weak.
> 
> At least I did EVERYTHING I could to save the marriage, so I can sleep easy in future.
> 
> Changed my email password today too, so that'll stop her snooping.


Good man.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

I'm pretty sure she is now seeing someone else... the girls are with me tonight and they dropped his name accidently. I am not happy she is using other excuses for not trying again but its because she is seeing someone else.

How should I play this? Confront her about it or leave well alone?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> I'm pretty sure she is now seeing someone else... the girls are with me tonight and they dropped his name accidently. I am not happy she is using other excuses for not trying again but its because she is seeing someone else.
> 
> How should I play this? Confront her about it or leave well alone?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


"I'm not ok with introducing our children to men you are dating until we're divorced"


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> "I'm not ok with introducing our children to men you are dating until we're divorced"


She has 'been for a drink with someone'.

I said 'am not ok with him being around the children this early'.

She said 'I appreciate your concern, but you need to trust me on that one. I'm not going to do anything to upset them'.

Gutted.


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> She has 'been for a drink with someone'.
> 
> I said 'am not ok with him being around the children this early'.
> 
> ...


"I'm not ok with it. My trust is not at high levels now, for obvious reasons"

"It's confusing for the kids and I am not ok with it"


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> "I'm not ok with it. My trust is not at high levels now, for obvious reasons"
> 
> "It's confusing for the kids and I am not ok with it"


Thanks, texted that back. No response.

P*sses me off. Gave her half of everything, which she is doing her best to spend on clothes and stuff for her house (which she wouldn't be living in if it wasn't for the money I gave her). 

Now she's acting like she's won the lottery and with a new bloke in tow. Shows what she thinks of our marriage.


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> Thanks, texted that back. No response.
> 
> P*sses me off. Gave her half of everything, which she is doing her best to spend on clothes and stuff for her house (which she wouldn't be living in if it wasn't for the money I gave her).
> 
> Now she's acting like she's won the lottery and with a new bloke in tow. Shows what she thinks of our marriage.


Keep observing.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> Keep observing.


Had to happen at some point, just didn't think it'd be this quick.


----------



## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

Can you get a solicitor and go thru the court to prevent the OM from spending the night when the kids are around her?

Its just so concerning when young girls are around. I mean it wouldn't be the 1st time some guy hooked up with a women with young daughters to prey on.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

the guy said:


> Can you get a solicitor and go thru the court to prevent the OM from spending the night when the kids are around her?
> 
> Its just so concerning when young girls are around. I mean it wouldn't be the 1st time some guy hooked up with a women with young daughters to prey on.


Possibly, I don't know whether he's spent the night there for sure.

I do trust her not to bring that sort of,bloke into her home but it's not the point really.


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> Possibly, I don't know whether he's spent the night there for sure.
> 
> I do trust her not to bring that sort of,bloke into her home but it's not the point really.


She has no idea who he "really" is.


----------



## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

Bottle said:


> Possibly, I don't know whether he's spent the night there for sure.
> 
> I do trust her not to bring that sort of,bloke into her home but it's not the point really.


Bottle

What you are forgetting is that she said she would give you a heads up when she was moving forward with someone.

If the kids know his name then she is moving forward.

So much for the heads up.

And I would trust her as far as you can throw her.

Time for you to really move on but protect your daughter.

That is all you can do.

How long does it take to Divorce where you live?

HM64


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

happyman64 said:


> Bottle
> 
> What you are forgetting is that she said she would give you a heads up when she was moving forward with someone.
> 
> ...


I need to do more investigating as its not certain the guy they were talking about is her new guy. It was at a Halloween party and there were lots of people there.

She says she's only been for a drink with one guy - not sure whether to believe it or not but she knows my stance on introducing the children - not to anyone for a,while yet.

It takes 2 yrs of separation as I livein the UK, but if I can prove she's seeing someone else I can divorce her now based on her adultery.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

I spoke to stbxw tonight on the phone after she spoke to the girls.

Told her I was done now and there's no fight in me left. I have tried hard and theres nothing left in the tank. 

Think she was relieved really but she did say she understood.

I mean it I'm done. I am starting to question whether I even want her back anyway.

Didn't push the other guy at the Halloween party as she is away on business, so will wait until she's home for that conversation.


----------



## DavidWYoung (Feb 3, 2012)

Sorry that you are here, but it looks like you are ready to turn the page and start your life. Your STBXW left and started her new life a long time ago, now that you are finished fighting for the marriage that did not exsist you can start to reenvent yourself. How about you start by writing down were you want to be in 90 days, ten months and three years. Do you sail? or ballroom dance? or travel?There is a whole out there for you to do things in! Why don't you make yourself the SAINT of your life and not her paper devil?


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

DavidWYoung said:


> Sorry that you are here, but it looks like you are ready to turn the page and start your life. Your STBXW left and started her new life a long time ago, now that you are finished fighting for the marriage that did not exsist you can start to reenvent yourself. How about you start by writing down were you want to be in 90 days, ten months and three years. Do you sail? or ballroom dance? or travel?There is a whole out there for you to do things in! Why don't you make yourself the SAINT of your life and not her paper devil?


Thanks... I am 40 next June so aim to have it out of my system by then and in a new house. Plan to celebrate with the guys somewhere hot for a few days!!

That and a nice meal out with my daughters too.


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

So the stbxw has been on a couple of dates with a guy... Didn't tell me I found out by asking her.

She still has a fair bit of stuff at my house which she said she would pick up 'some time'.

I am planning to bag it all up randomly in black bin liners and present it to her without a word when she picks up our daughter tmw.

No more taking the p*ss.


----------



## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

Bottle said:


> So the stbxw has been on a couple of dates with a guy... Didn't tell me I found out by asking her.
> 
> She still has a fair bit of stuff at my house which she said she would pick up 'some time'.
> 
> ...


Bottle

Do just that. Have her crap packed.

And move on.

Because your wife is so broken and you cannot fix her.

She will have a 4 th kid with a new baby daddy. That is all she knows how to do.

So toughen up. Get your head straight, your heart healed and make yourself a better man.

And by the time you do that you can go find a woman who is not only beautiful on the outside but beautiful on the inside.


And stop asking her about the next OM. Stop caring and protect your kid. Because your wife is incapable of doing that herself.

HM64


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

happyman64 said:


> Bottle
> 
> Do just that. Have her crap packed.
> 
> ...


She certainly needs to show me more respect.

She's all about no. 1.


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> She certainly needs to show me more respect.
> 
> She's all about no. 1.


She's showing you who she is.

It's likely always been this way.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> She's showing you who she is.
> 
> It's likely always been this way.


I think it has my friend. I remember her having a proper go at me after I was dating her for only 6 wks or so. I thought at the time it was a bad sign.

She was sweet as sugar most of the time until she didn't get her own way.

Her big issue is control. She is a control freak. She even used to try and control my mood. When I was in a bad mood sometimes, instead of giving me space to sort myself out, she would try and pull me out of it through talking etc. 

She then used to turn it on me and say "well now you ok everyone needs to be ok I suppose", so she'd still punish me for it.

I can't ever remember her owning any of her s*it, so unless you do that no relationship will work.

I own mine and am prepared to change for the better. She will continue to make the same mistakes. Period.


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

So stop looking for respect from her.

Wrap her up legally. Protect your kid.

Do not take her crap. Not one ounce.

And command respect.

Try it, you will like it.

A lot.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> I think it has my friend. I remember her having a proper go at me after I was dating her for only 6 wks or so. I thought at the time it was a bad sign.
> 
> She was sweet as sugar most of the time until she didn't get her own way.
> 
> ...


I'm always amazed at the moms who think it's their job to make sure their teenage daughters are happy (ie: get their way)

God help us.


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

P*ssy txt from stbxw just came in...

"what time am I having (daughter) tomorrow?"

I replied...

"hiya, what time is good for me to pick up (daughter) tomorrow?" would be better... 3pm is good for me

No more taking crap.


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## oncehisangel (Oct 13, 2012)

just read your thread bottle.....you're a good man.. go find yourself honey. 

be an amazing dad-that will never change

peace and to you


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

oncehisangel said:


> just read your thread bottle.....you're a good man.. go find yourself honey.
> 
> be an amazing dad-that will never change
> 
> peace and to you


Thank you! And peace to you too.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

So stbxw and I have had some email contact today. I told her straight about the stuff she'd done that annoyed me since we split. Didn't pull any punches. 

She Said "I'm sorry you feel that way" then turned it round on me saying because I've been emotionally erratic and said hurtful things to her is why she got angry with me.

Said I was looking to mud sling from past events and if I felt the need to air my feelings, then she wouldn't necessarily respond as she didn't want a fight.

Now a few weeks ago I would've just apologised and felt bad.

Not so much now. I replied saying I was just pointing out what had upset me and wasn't after a fight. Said she seemed to have a problem with taking criticism and basically stood behind what I said.

Calmly, dispassionately.

I'm not overly fussed about a response (haven't had one and doubt she will).

Feels good to standup for yourself!

Didn't mention the OM eith, if he definitely exists.


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Now she tells me I didn't open up to her and talk/listen enough...

Ok, so this is something that didn't happen in my family upbringing so I have struggled with it. 

Tried to take the lead after MC by saying lets set aside one Friday eve a month where we just talk about us, she said no lets just talk as and when issues crop up.

Aargh this is doing my head in. Conrad hit me with the 2x4 s!!!!


----------



## legiox (Sep 2, 2012)

I have a question. Some of my STBXW crap is still laying around the house after 4 months of her walking out. What should i do? Bag it all up and throw it on the hood of her car at her work for everybody to see?

Sorry to derail thread..


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

legiox said:


> I have a question. Some of my STBXW crap is still laying around the house after 4 months of her walking out. What should i do? Bag it all up and throw it on the hood of her car at her work for everybody to see?
> 
> Sorry to derail thread..


Depends, do you hate her? If so, then yes.

Better advice,would be to bag it up and just tell her to,collect it ASAP.


----------



## legiox (Sep 2, 2012)

Hate is a strong word. I would say i "strongly dislike" her. Crap she put me through, then walks out and party's it up like nothing happen. I hope she becomes broke and lives off the street.


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Struggled a bit today. Didn't even call the girls tonight as just don't want to speak to stbxw, not even to say hello. Felt bad, but will call them tomorrow.

Focused on detaching... Trying to remember the bad times and not the good.

She wouldn't even acknowledge the crap she's dealt me since she left, tried to blame it on me.... What a ***


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

So I am learning by the day, thanks to the help of IC, this forum and self reflection.

It's 5 months to the day my stbxw told me it was over. I was a broken man and am slowly putting myself back together, piece by piece. it's still hard, but not quite as much as last month.

Here's some things I've learned so far:

Time does make a difference. The tears only come infrequently now, not every day. The pain isn't as raw. Still hurts but i can function ok now. Most days.

I became a doormat to my wife and it drove her away. She didn't help by persecuting me and blaming me at every turn. I didn't lead enough, take responsibility and was too frightened of upsetting her. I needed to man up. Lead from the front, take responsibility, but also be attentive to her needs and calm, assured and confident. 

You must work harder at your relationship than You do your job. I wanted to come home and relax, big mistake. You need to be switched on at home- understand the tests that come your way from your spouse and make things happen. Earn the respect and admiration of your spouse through your actions not words.

A marriage won't work if only one person is committed to it. Seems obvious, but I've spent the last 5 months trying to convince my stbxw to make it work with me. It's not come close to working, but I had to try.

Talking and listening are so simple, but so hard to get right. Two ears and one mouth- use them in that proportion. I didn't listen well enough or talk enough about my feelings. It cost me intimacy with my wife - the very thing I was begging and wishing for.

That you can't change the other person. My stbxw has commitment issues. I thought I could fix her. I can't. No one can but herself..... and she doesn't want to. This has cost me so much energy that I could've put into myself, but I had to learn the lesson.

That my stbxw would've left me whatever I'd have done, at some point. I'm convinced of this. She will keep moving on. I can only see it now I'm detaching and at 50,000 feet. Clear as day from up here. 

Don't beat yourself up too much. I did a lot of this. She left ME so it must be MY fault. It's not, well not entirely. Six of one and half a dozen of the other. 

Own your issues and deal with them. I am becoming a better man because of this. It hurts like hell, but am determined some good will come out of it. You can't get someone else to own their issues if they don't want to. Again, I tried to get her to. Didn't work.

That life goes on. I have been into work every day since d day. Wanted to stay in bed every day but haven't. Am proud I didn't. I would be totally broken if I had.

Focus on you. This has been the hardest task by far. My needs are becoming more relevant now. I need to sell the house, move on physically as well as emotionally. My daughters need me, so I have to be In good shape for them, and me. It gets easier to do this over time. The gym is your best friend.

You have to do what you have to do. I have cried, talked, tried rational discussion, letters, texts, emails, phone calls, cards and god knows what else. It didn't work but I now have no fight left in me for her and can rest knowing I tried ABSOLUTELY EVERYTHING to make it work. I had to hit the wall. She didn't try hard enough- shame on her, and the day will come when our girls will understand this. Not me- I can stand tall.

Love is about two people being equal. Working at it together committed. It's not about being dependent on someone and going through the motions. It's about finding that person who will work on it with you. They out there somewhere and I am confident we will find each other one day.

Our children are the most important people in the world. It's all about them really and even good can come out of bad situations like this. My relationship with my daughter has actually improved this last 5 months. Unbelievably. We have laughed, cried, had fun, been upset and everything else together. She is amazing and I do not know what I would've done without her. She is only 4 years old, but my rock. I am hers too.

I'm sure there are other things I have missed, but it's one hellof a roller-coaster. Thanks to all who have helped me, Especially Conrad. I appreciate your continued support and guidance. 

Here's to keep learning lessons and changing for the better. The clever ones do.


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## oncehisangel (Oct 13, 2012)

now let go bottle



Go find your future.


Get excited daddy


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## Solon (Oct 8, 2012)

Wow! Isn't it amazing? You marry a woman, plan to be with her forever, she leaves, and your life is torn. She seems to not care. How does that happen? How does it really end?

I read a book that said the left behind spouse controls the future of the marriage. That if you wait long enough, the wayward always comes home. Most often reconciliation does not happen because the left behind spouse gets tired of waiting, hurts too much, or just does not want it anymore. Don't know how true that is, but....I guess time will tell for all of us.

Hang in there.


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## spun (Jul 2, 2012)

Bottle said:


> So I am learning by the day, thanks to the help of IC, this forum and self reflection.
> 
> It's 5 months to the day my stbxw told me it was over. I was a broken man and am slowly putting myself back together, piece by piece. it's still hard, but not quite as much as last month.
> 
> ...


Bottle,

You are at edge of a brand new and brighter world now.

Glad to hear that you can now see it.

Now go and make it yours.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

spun said:


> Bottle,
> 
> You are at edge of a brand new and brighter world now.
> 
> ...


Thanks spun, I can see the new world but am not quite there yet.

Today I was thinking I would still take her back if she wanted to come back, so more work on me and time required.

I know I am on the right road though, which wasn't necessarily the case a few weeks ago even.

Be strong.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Solon said:


> Wow! Isn't it amazing? You marry a woman, plan to be with her forever, she leaves, and your life is torn. She seems to not care. How does that happen? How does it really end?
> 
> I read a book that said the left behind spouse controls the future of the marriage. That if you wait long enough, the wayward always comes home. Most often reconciliation does not happen because the left behind spouse gets tired of waiting, hurts too much, or just does not want it anymore. Don't know how true that is, but....I guess time will tell for all of us.
> 
> Hang in there.


Thanks Solon, I am not sure about the book you refer to. Maybe some would come back and others wouldn't, who knows.

We can't keep our lives on hold forever and we'll know the right time to move on. Mine is now as I'm sure she is done. She has told me so a number of times now.

Everything happens for a reason and I'm hoping she will turn up sooner rather than later!


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Had to drop daughter off with stbxw tonight as need to be in work early. Thought I was doing ok, but miss her so much during the week.

Miss stbxw so much too. Having a relapse.

She has now taken all her stuff from the house so there's nothing of her left here. Never, ever, ever thought it would come to this.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> Had to drop daughter off with stbxw tonight as need to be in work early. Thought I was doing ok, but miss her so much during the week.
> 
> Miss stbxw so much too. Having a relapse.
> 
> She has now taken all her stuff from the house so there's nothing of her left here. Never, ever, ever thought it would come to this.


Remember that this is a process.

Be patient with yourself.


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> Remember that this is a process.
> 
> Be patient with yourself.


Thanks C, feel better today.

Can't help,wishing she falls flat on her face soon. She is def seeing someone else as she's good at hiding it, but although I care and it's p*****g me off I haven't mentioned anything to her.


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## spun (Jul 2, 2012)

Bottle said:


> Thanks C, feel better today.
> 
> Can't help,wishing she falls flat on her face soon. She is def seeing someone else as she's good at hiding it, but although I care and it's p*****g me off I haven't mentioned anything to her.


Still focusing on her.


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

spun said:


> Still focusing on her.


Yep, but not EVERY minute, so making progress Spun.

I keep trying to think of her bad points or the children when she pops into my head. Helps a bit


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

Bottle

Focus on you.

What you want out of your life?
What you want for your children?
What you need to do to succeed without her?

And do not concern yourself about who she is dating.

Instead finish your list above and in your own good time you can focus on who you want to date in the future!!!

HM64


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

happyman64 said:


> Bottle
> 
> Focus on you.
> 
> ...


I want to learn the lessons and fine tune myself through IC I am doing.

I want to be with someone else and that they want to be with me.

I want to give the children the stability and love they deserve.

I need to focus on me, my needs and make it happen for the children and myself.


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

Bottle said:


> I want to learn the lessons and fine tune myself through IC I am doing.
> 
> I want to be with someone else and that they want to be with me.
> 
> ...


Print this out and pin it to your bathroom mirror. Repeat the words to yourself every day.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Had a crap day yesterday as got caught up thinking about stbxw birthday on Sunday. First one without us together.

Snapped out of it today and had a much better day. IC was good as well tonight. Am still v. Angry and have resentment towar stbxw for leaving and refusing to work at it more. 

Need to keep getting the anger out and enforce boundaries with her better.

Haven't spoken to her all week and don't want to either, which is good. 

Focus on me,focus on me, focus on me.


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## Too Little Too Late? (Sep 2, 2012)

Bottle said:


> Had a crap day yesterday as got caught up thinking about stbxw birthday on Sunday. First one without us together.
> 
> Snapped out of it today and had a much better day. IC was good as well tonight. Am still v. Angry and have resentment towar stbxw for leaving and refusing to work at it more.
> 
> ...


Keep it up Bottle. Focus on you..I know it is hard. Have you looked into CODA meetings in your area? It is a great way to focus and really work on yourself in a safe environment.


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Too Little Too Late? said:


> Keep it up Bottle. Focus on you..I know it is hard. Have you looked into CODA meetings in your area? It is a great way to focus and really work on yourself in a safe environment.


Thanks TLTL, I haven't but will do. I have been IC for about 2 months which is helping.

It's my stbxw birthday Sunday and I'm only planning to help our daughter make her a small card and give to her. Nothing from me, not even a 'happy birthday' on the phone.


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## Too Little Too Late? (Sep 2, 2012)

CODA is a great way to supplement your IC without the cost. Let me know what you think.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bottle said:


> Thanks TLTL, I haven't but will do. I have been IC for about 2 months which is helping.
> 
> It's my stbxw birthday Sunday and I'm only planning to help our daughter make her a small card and give to her. Nothing from me, not even a 'happy birthday' on the phone.


Good man.

Perfectly appropriate.


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


> Good man.
> 
> Perfectly appropriate.


Thanks C, I am angry with her lack of interest in fixing us and now just trying to avoid her altogether.

Feel pretty good today, slightly more detached. 

Don't want to contact her at all, which is good.


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## 06Daddio08 (Jul 26, 2012)

The birthday thing for your daughter is completely on par for the situation.

The anger.

Needs to be dropped.

Indifference. Not Anger.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

It's a process.

Anger is usually first.

Be patient with yourself Bottle.


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

UpnOver said:


> The birthday thing for your daughter is completely on par for the situation.
> 
> The anger.
> 
> ...


That's the aim but I'm not there yet. I wish she wasn't on the planet at the minute!


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

People always blast me when I say this but there is nothing wrong with hate. As long as you focus it and don't let it consume you it can be a great way to detach. 

Don't be afraid to let yourself hate a little. Its human.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## 06Daddio08 (Jul 26, 2012)

bandit.45 said:


> People always blast me when I say this but there is nothing wrong with hate. As long as you focus it and don't let it consume you it can be a great way to detach.
> 
> Don't be afraid to let yourself hate a little. Its human.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Self regulation is a hard thing for some.


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

All, it's stbxw's birthday today.

I have our daughter and she doesn't have her other daughters either as they are round their fathers.

Is it not strange that she doesn't want to see her daughter on her birthday? She didn't even ask me for her back early or anything.

I saw her mum today as her birthday is today too. She is going round there for a roast dinner this eve, so it's not,like stbxw is away.

Just find it weird. She seems happy not having the children around at weekends, even on her birthday.


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## spun (Jul 2, 2012)

Bottle said:


> All, it's stbxw's birthday today.
> 
> I have our daughter and she doesn't have her other daughters either as they are round their fathers.
> 
> ...


Amazing what you can see at 50,000 ft, isn't it?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Beathan914 (Oct 29, 2012)

That surprises me, I don't know about every one here but when my son stays with his mom I call every night before bedtime to say goodnight and when I have him she never calls. I had him for six days in a row and she didn't call at all. Baffles me how they can seem to forget about the kids when they dont have them


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## 06Daddio08 (Jul 26, 2012)

Beathan914 said:


> That surprises me, I don't know about every one here but when my son stays with his mom I call every night before bedtime to say goodnight and when I have him she never calls. I had him for six days in a row and she didn't call at all. Baffles me how they can seem to forget about the kids when they dont have them


what's your co parenting schedule?


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## Beathan914 (Oct 29, 2012)

Pick him up Tuesday about three and take him home Wednesday at six. Pick him up Thursday about three and take him home Friday at six. Every other week I pick him up Thursday and keep him until Sunday at six. I also pick him up every sunday I do not have him for Church then take him back home.


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

All, massive update

She has been having an affair. He is a guy who I actually work with can you believe.

He left his wife 2 wks after I was dumped by mine. There are lots of tell tale signs I missed but she admitted to me today they were an item now but swore blind it's only happened in the last few weeks. Obviously I don't believe her.

I am gathering evidence and spoke to posOM wife who has known about it for a few months. She didn't want to contact me as we don't know each other and she didn't want to pry. She is convinced about it too.

My stbxw is still adamant she is not coming back and is now with posOM. I am exposing this (even though we are separated) to everyone at work tomorrow, her mum and anyone else I can think of. I have already told one oft heather dads of her children as he knows this guy. He was shocked.

I need some advice on how to see this through please. Exposing first then trying to dig down to the truth. 

I am massively shocked truth be told as he is so not her type.

Thanks


----------



## BigMac (Oct 29, 2012)

> I am massively shocked truth be told as he is so not her type.


Druggie wasn't my stbmxw type but here am I !

Don't be surprised brother , when they're in the fog they may date everything you can think of.

Stay strong and go dark. Expose the affair even if you can think of some BS story and post it on the local paper.


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## Chuck71 (Nov 5, 2012)

Two WSs.....I have a Ben Franklin this will not last through Valentine's Day.


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

Frankly Bottle I am not surprised.

Now you know why she did not want her girls around on weekends nor miss them.

EXPOSÉ, EXPOSÉ, EXPOSÉ!


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## The Cro-Magnon (Sep 30, 2012)

*"I am Jack's complete lack of surprise"*

Yet another story....

21 pages of bullsht, when the answer was obvious on the first page that she was having an affair and LYING.

Lying to herself, lying to OP, lying to her work, lying to her family, lying to the world, lies heaped upon lies heaped upon lies. And then with a final lie draped over the top of it all. Like a cherry on a turd.

After reading this site, the patterns become so obvious you could almost put money on them.

If it was me I would punch the OM's head in, for starters. Then I would just move on, and live an awesome life. If I had to let go of my kids in order to survive, then so be it, I would kiss them goodbye with tears in my eyes. She made the decisions, she gets to live however she wants, but she does not get to own your soul and mind and body for all time like you are her ultimate slave.


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## tokio (Nov 9, 2012)

Yes spurned that's true. Don't let her selfish pity affair hold you down. You deserve better so forget her. I'm going through the same thing almost. I just try everyday to forget and let go. It's not easy but do it for your kid. That's most important now.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

My stbxw is pure evil.

Challenged her about circumstances surrounding the posOM. She denied anything had happened until only a month ago. I'm pretty sure this is crap but only have circumstantial evidence.

She then launched a scathing attack on MY behaviour and that our marriage failed because of me rather than anyone outside it. It went on for ages and slagged me off in every way possible.

She is just a c***. 

Off to crown court tomorrow to pick up divorce pack.


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## Solon (Oct 8, 2012)

Bottle said:


> Had to drop daughter off with stbxw tonight as need to be in work early. Thought I was doing ok, but miss her so much during the week.
> 
> Miss stbxw so much too. Having a relapse.
> 
> She has now taken all her stuff from the house so there's nothing of her left here. Never, ever, ever thought it would come to this.


Did she take her wedding dress?


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## Madman1 (Oct 24, 2012)

Bottle said:


> My stbxw is pure evil.
> 
> . It went on for ages and slagged me off in every way possible.
> QUOTE]
> ...


----------



## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Solon said:


> Did she take her wedding dress?


Not voluntarily, left it in a wardrobe and I bagged it up along with a load of other crap and made her take it all last week.

I no longer miss her,just wish she was dead.


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## Madman1 (Oct 24, 2012)

You will get through this now that you know the truth.
It will hurt like hell, but this too will pass.
They will crash and burn and you will have afront row seat.


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## Solon (Oct 8, 2012)

Bottle said:


> Not voluntarily, left it in a wardrobe and I bagged it up along with a load of other crap and made her take it all last week.
> 
> I no longer miss her,just wish she was dead.


Wow! She left her wedding dress and her $15K engagement ring. She wants nothing to do with me or our wedding.


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## tokio (Nov 9, 2012)

You gotta wonder about the human race sometimes. It's just pathetic how people justify things. Hope all goes well for you. Don't stop grinding to better yours and your child's life.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Dewayne76 (Sep 26, 2012)

Seems like things are getting progressively worse for a lot of us, guys. 

Mine just admitted again that she wants nothing to do with our family being together. When asked what made her feel this way it's another "I don't know. Something changed after the fight and my cheating. But I feel this is the direction I'm suppose to take" 

11 years, a beautiful family, being thrown away. 

Hope everyone finds peace soon.


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## 06Daddio08 (Jul 26, 2012)

I hope you eventually get sick and tired of being sick and tired and start appreciating and loving yourself.

Dewayne.


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## Solon (Oct 8, 2012)

Dewayne76 said:


> Seems like things are getting progressively worse for a lot of us, guys.
> 
> Mine just admitted again that she wants nothing to do with our family being together. When asked what made her feel this way it's another "I don't know. Something changed after the fight and my cheating. But I feel this is the direction I'm suppose to take"
> 
> ...


11 years for me too. Amazing. My wife is not the woman I married. I wonder if she will ever come to her senses again. It is amazing the stories told on the Rejoice Marriage Ministries website. Makes one wonder if they are true. But some of those people on there wait for like 8 years!!! How long will you guys wait on your wife to come back? If you KNEW without a shadow of a doubt that your wife will come back to you in a better state of mind than when she left and be more appreciative of you as a man and husband, how long will you wait? That's the question of the day. I'm going to start a new thread with this.


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## Chuck71 (Nov 5, 2012)

Everyone changes over time. My first honest to God true love whom I met in 1991 was a perfect match. We were both teens. Fast forward five years and we were in completely different directions. No marriage, no kids....keep the memories and move on. It's different with a marriage and kids. More internal factors come into play. I have seen it so many times, the one that leaves, will seek you out eventually. During that time better yourself, discover yourself. That's what I am doing. All throughout the marriage I put her before me. Currently her needs lie somewhere between the wellbeing of a snake and did my 3rd grade teacher really hate me. Guys it's the journey, not the destination. Focus on you.....because when they return, you can think and decide with clarity.


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## HiRoad (Oct 22, 2012)

Chuck71 said:


> I have seen it so many times, the one that leaves, will seek you out eventually. During that time better yourself, discover yourself. That's what I am doing. All throughout the marriage I put her before me....Guys it's the journey, not the destination. Focus on you.....because when they return, you can think and decide with clarity.


could not agree more! Well siad Chuck. Quick story to prove this true, i have a friend married 14 years W had 2nd affair, she left for OM. He let her go, truly worked on himself and focused on his kids. For her the OM did not work out (big suprise) so she went for OM#2 (15yrs older) that is not working out. Fast forward 1.5yrs after she left him and D is final, she showed up at his doorstep asking to come back!! He, being in a better place, told her NO! She has not changed at all, still same antics! 

Crazy but true they all most always come back at some point.


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## Solon (Oct 8, 2012)

Chuck71 said:


> Everyone changes over time. My first honest to God true love whom I met in 1991 was a perfect match. We were both teens. Fast forward five years and we were in completely different directions. No marriage, no kids....keep the memories and move on. It's different with a marriage and kids. More internal factors come into play. I have seen it so many times, the one that leaves, will seek you out eventually. During that time better yourself, discover yourself. That's what I am doing. All throughout the marriage I put her before me. Currently her needs lie somewhere between the wellbeing of a snake and did my 3rd grade teacher really hate me. Guys it's the journey, not the destination. Focus on you.....because when they return, you can think and decide with clarity.


That was beautiful, Chuck. And true. I need to pick up my travel luggage and carry on.


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## Chuck71 (Nov 5, 2012)

HiRoad-It almost always happens. I only was serious with two girls before I met W/STBX/demon seed -whatever- and each time we broke up for a short period. All you want is to get back together. We did but it was never the same. And after the final break up....yes time passed but both tried to reconnect. One I told to get lost, the other we dated a bit off and on but after a short while I told her there's nothing there (we were FWB). I deserved more. Once the ink dries, on the D, I honestly can not see anything for us down the road (see two ex gf's). It's not like you can get a D within an hour. 15 years....what I do know is she will forever know...I loved her 110%. My loss? No, not in the least.......hers.


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## Solon (Oct 8, 2012)

Chuck71 said:


> HiRoad-It almost always happens. I only was serious with two girls before I met W/STBX/demon seed -whatever- and each time we broke up for a short period. All you want is to get back together. We did but it was never the same. And after the final break up....yes time passed but both tried to reconnect. One I told to get lost, the other we dated a bit off and on but after a short while I told her there's nothing there (we were FWB). I deserved more. Once the ink dries, on the D, I honestly can not see anything for us down the road (see two ex gf's). It's not like you can get a D within an hour. 15 years....what I do know is she will forever know...I loved her 110%. My loss? No, not in the least.......hers.


Well it is comforting knowing that they eventually come around. My wife is being totally unnecessarily cruel to me and my kids. But in a way, it is a good thing. Had she just been cruel to me only, I would have thought that there was something wrong with me. When she filed the protection order against me, I stopped and realized, "Hey, I have never even called this woman a name or cursed at her, let alone raise my hand against her." I know I had my faults and was not the perfect husband, but I was good to her, even now I am good to her. So when the fog settles she will see that she made a big mistake. That is comforting. I release her now and I move on.


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## Chuck71 (Nov 5, 2012)

Solon-The truth always comes out. One can pretend for only so long. Trust me.....you may feel like the world has closed in on you but that is temporary. Knowing that (in these cases) she has thrown away a treasure for a trinket, will be a haunting memory. Discarding something that is priceless they will never get over, but they learn to cope. And by that time you will be involved with someone who acknowledges the treasure you are and will fight like he!! to never lose it. I guess what I'm saying is you very well lost the battle but you will win the war.


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## Solon (Oct 8, 2012)

Chuck71 said:


> Solon-The truth always comes out. One can pretend for only so long. Trust me.....you may feel like the world has closed in on you but that is temporary. Knowing that (in these cases) she has thrown away a treasure for a trinket, will be a haunting memory. Discarding something that is priceless they will never get over, but they learn to cope. And by that time you will be involved with someone who acknowledges the treasure you are and will fight like he!! to never lose it. I guess what I'm saying is you very well lost the battle but you will win the war.


Ah, Man. That is assuring. And here it is, I am buying scores of books, hiring more therapists than I can count, reading far too many articles online, but the most assuring truth/factual statement came right here. Thanks, Chuck. You know, I have kept every card my wife has ever given me for the past 11 years. She has given me cards and written how much she appreciates me, how I have helped her grow, how she looks up to me, how blessed she feels that I chose her, how she will never give me up, on and on and on and on. Those were her words. The brain records information and it remains there. For whatever reason she cannot recall these things. But she will. And when she does, it may very well be too late.

Thanks for the post. I'm going to cut and paste it and print it out.


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## spun (Jul 2, 2012)

Solon said:


> Ah, Man. That is assuring. And here it is, I am buying scores of books, hiring more therapists than I can count, reading far too many articles online, but the most assuring truth/factual statement came right here. Thanks, Chuck. You know, I have kept every card my wife has ever given me for the past 11 years. She has given me cards and written how much she appreciates me, how I have helped her grow, how she looks up to me, how blessed she feels that I chose her, how she will never give me up, on and on and on and on. Those were her words. The brain records information and it remains there. For whatever reason she cannot recall these things. But she will. And when she does, it may very well be too late.
> 
> Thanks for the post. I'm going to cut and paste it and print it out.


Everything that Chuck71 wrote won't matter as long as you keep focusing on the failure of your marriage and what is going to happen with her.

You won't win the war until you are "right" with yourself.


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

Solon said:


> Ah, Man. That is assuring. And here it is, I am buying scores of books, hiring more therapists than I can count, reading far too many articles online, but the most assuring truth/factual statement came right here. Thanks, Chuck. You know, I have kept every card my wife has ever given me for the past 11 years. She has given me cards and written how much she appreciates me, how I have helped her grow, how she looks up to me, how blessed she feels that I chose her, how she will never give me up, on and on and on and on. Those were her words. The brain records information and it remains there. For whatever reason she cannot recall these things. But she will. And when she does, it may very well be too late.
> 
> Thanks for the post. I'm going to cut and paste it and print it out.


Solon,

I was in your shoes a long time ago. I received those cards and those very same words.

After I was crushed it took me a few years too heal. When I met my wife and knew where my future rested (and with whom) I returned to my ex those very same cards.

I had never spoken to her since I left.

My last card to her was a condolence card acknowledging her death. I asked her to destroy the cards for me because i found a woman that truly meant what she wrote and said to me.

I wished the Ex a good life.

Someday you will be able to get rid of those cards. You will no longer need them. 

And just maybe you will refresh the Ex's memory.

My Ex passed by my limo on the way to the wedding purposely.

I chuckled inside.

She had received my card for sure. And I knew her conscious had definitely come back. Even if it is was probably for a few minutes.

That was over 20 years ago.

Never look back. Only forward.

And in many cases they will come back to see if you are available. Just chuckle to yourself, shake it off and move on. Because you are way ahead of them and rarely can they ever catch up to you after "finding" themselves.

HM64


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## HiRoad (Oct 22, 2012)

Chuck - we similar situations. I had a few serious GF's before i met my STBX. One GF i bought a house with and was with her for 5 years. I never had that "feeling" for her to marry her. We were on and off our whole realationship. I always broke it off with her, and I would ALWAYS comeback (evenh after a 7 month separation). I finally broke it off and left with nothing, i basically gave her the house too. But i will say if she would have played her cards right, it may have been a different story. At the end she started moving on with her life and i have to say i caught my curiosity, and i started to pursue her (which i never did). She did not see the signs and was frankly uneducated in relationships and i slipped through her fingers. I met my STBXW a year later.

I agree that this is her loss 100%, i did everything for her, including opening a business for her that she loves. I cooked, cleaned, paid the bills, was good to her. But in the end she hosed me. She would have to do some serious self reflections and growing up in order for me to R with her.

Solon - I like, like you, was living at the book store. Bought a dozen books, read them all. Online marriage courses, therapy sessions, etc. I feel like i was back in college, or studying to pass the CPA exam again. I feel like an expert in marriage relationships. But both Chuck and Spun are right, you have focus on YOU! Sounds like a broken record her on TAM, but it is soo true. It wook me a few weeks into my separation (S2.5mths) to realize this. But once you take the focus off the failed marriage and put that energy on you, you essentially see the light. That is why when they come back so many of us here say NO WAY! Because then you see how 1. unhealthy the marriage was, or,2. that your spouse has NOT changed at all and you have and you feel great and free. 

The more you work on you and positive changes you make the better you feel, and you spouse almost always takes notice, that is why they come back.


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## Solon (Oct 8, 2012)

happyman64 said:


> Solon,
> 
> I was in your shoes a long time ago. I received those cards and those very same words.
> 
> ...


My wife is so twisted it will take her a good part of 20 years to find herself. We are both 38 about to be 39. If she hasn't found herself by now....she never will.

Thanks for the post. I can't wait until I get to the point where I can give her back all of her cards. That would be SWEET!


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## Solon (Oct 8, 2012)

HiRoad said:


> Chuck - we similar situations. I had a few serious GF's before i met my STBX. One GF i bought a house with and was with her for 5 years. I never had that "feeling" for her to marry her. We were on and off our whole realationship. I always broke it off with her, and I would ALWAYS comeback (evenh after a 7 month separation). I finally broke it off and left with nothing, i basically gave her the house too. But i will say if she would have played her cards right, it may have been a different story. At the end she started moving on with her life and i have to say i caught my curiosity, and i started to pursue her (which i never did). She did not see the signs and was frankly uneducated in relationships and i slipped through her fingers. I met my STBXW a year later.
> 
> I agree that this is her loss 100%, i did everything for her, including opening a business for her that she loves. I cooked, cleaned, paid the bills, was good to her. But in the end she hosed me. She would have to do some serious self reflections and growing up in order for me to R with her.
> 
> ...


Yes, that is what I hear. Not sure I am 100% clear on what "working on me" means. In January, I am starting classes in Arabic. I'm taking voice lessons. I have a huge real estate gig in Alabama that I started, but stopped when my wife left, so I will restart that (if it is not too late). I will start focusing on building my law firm in 2013. So if that is what "working on me" means, I'm doing that. But it's hard not to think about her, what she is doing, trying to figure out why in the world would she leave all of us behind. I always try to get answers and this one has me stumped. Is she crazy? Did I do something that I am not aware of? I don't know. I'm getting to the point where I do not even care though. The thought of her having sex with someone else is what really kills me, to be honest. We have been together for 11 years!!! The thought of her.....ugh!! let me stop.


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## HiRoad (Oct 22, 2012)

Solon, i share those same feelings, I used to think about that all the time. I have talked to my SIL and mom and i feel that there must be some sort of chemical imbalance in my W, like she has gone crazy. I feel that there is no one else better out there than myself for her and our children, who are the real victims here to be honest. 

As far as working on me, I started to go back to the gym (lost 27lbs) look great, feel great. I make sure my kids have alot of fun with me, and I am focused on my career. I decided to sell my hot rod, to help for a down on a new house, I've got to give my kids some sort of stability even if its w/o her. I

You just have to do what makes YOU happy, not for your STBXW. You need to gain your Alpha male confidence back. For me i think back to when i was single and on the prowl, boy was I confident when it came to attracting women. That is the mind set i am getting to.


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

So it's been 4 days since I found out she is seeing someone else. Se denies its been carrying on for a long time, but I'm not so sure.

Anyway, filed for divorce today on the grounds of her adultery and named the scum bag in the papers.

Have set it up so he is ordered to pay the costs.

She will go crazy when she gets the papers next week as she won't be in control of it.

Well they can slag me off during their pillow talk the sad pair of w******.


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## Solon (Oct 8, 2012)

Bottle said:


> So it's been 4 days since I found out she is seeing someone else. Se denies its been carrying on for a long time, but I'm not so sure.
> 
> Anyway, filed for divorce today on the grounds of her adultery and named the scum bag in the papers.
> 
> ...


LOL! :smthumbup:


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

The best thing is he is going though a divorce and his wife has taken him for everything, so he has no money. 

Stbxw will prob have to lend it to him or pay. 

Total pieces of s***.


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## HiRoad (Oct 22, 2012)

Bottle, give her enough rope to hang her self. Gather all your evidence. Get a good lawyer, and expose, expose, expose! You are a better man than to be treated like this. XX years of marriage commitment on your part and whats you reward, a cheating spouse.


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## Solon (Oct 8, 2012)

HiRoad said:


> Bottle, give her enough rope to hang her self. Gather all your evidence. Get a good lawyer, and expose, expose, expose! You are a better man than to be treated like this. XX years of marriage commitment on your part and whats you reward, a cheating spouse.


If you really want to get her and have her exposed take her deposition and the deposition of her boyfriend. Make up a list of questions you want your attorney to ask each of them, then take copies of the transcript and e-mail them to all of her friends and family. OUCH! No, don't do that. That is cruel and unusual punishment. I once took a deposition of my client's husband's girlfriend---talk about comedy! She was pregnant with his child and was trying to avoid my line of questioning like, "Who is the father of the baby you are carrying?" She didn't know we knew she was pregnant. It doesn't matter if their attorney objects, they still have to answer (unless the question is TOTALLY meant to embarrass them) but you can still have fun with depositions.


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

HiRoad said:


> Bottle, give her enough rope to hang her self. Gather all your evidence. Get a good lawyer, and expose, expose, expose! You are a better man than to be treated like this. XX years of marriage commitment on your part and whats you reward, a cheating spouse.


Thanks HR. I loved her and trustd her 100%. 

you live and learn.

She is too f****d up to dig deep, commit and change.

It's so her loss. She will never admit it though the sad cow.


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## HiRoad (Oct 22, 2012)

Just like my STBXW she is too lost to even think about what she is doing. She is not the woman i married.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

So I have filed for D and she will get papers in 5 days or so.

I am v angry and hurt by this r'ship as there's an indication it's been developing since before we split. 

What I don't want to do is fall out with the stbxw for 2 reasons

1. I married her and not long ago she was my world. Those feelings don't just go quickly, even if I am super mad

2. We have a daughter and 2 step daughters and I don't want any grief over access etc. I even want her and I to spend time with our daughter in the future, for her benefit.

I am thinking I should give her the heads up about the D papers. She will be p****d when she gets them.

On the other hand I am really mad and want her to see I am not her doormat anymore. 

Thoughts?


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## BigMac (Oct 29, 2012)

Don't tell her about the D papers , she'll find out by her self !

She doesn't care about you , why do worry if she get hurt or not !


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## Chuck71 (Nov 5, 2012)

OM-fantasy
D papers-reality
Life's a b!tch ain't it STBXW


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## vi_bride04 (Mar 28, 2012)

Don't tell her! Let her find out on her own. 

I mean would she really let you know if D papers were on the way to you?


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## HiRoad (Oct 22, 2012)

i would not tell her either, mine did tell me, but after she went to court filed and was having me served the next day! 

Mine didnt even have the gull to tell me in person, she told me over the phone at work!!! Outa the blue. She said basically, i quit!

I did not even get the pleasure of an ultimatum! Competely caught off guard!

My advice, move foward on everything! I plan to serve her with mediation papers the same way she served me!


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

Do not give her a heads up. The day she screwed you over she lost that right.

And she needs to know how mad you really are and that your status as a doormat is over......


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## Chuck71 (Nov 5, 2012)

send her half dozens roses and have the papers inside lol


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Theloner said:


> There is a pattern, don't fool yourself. There will be a fourth and fifth man. She might actually hate all men for having been cheated upon by her first. She still has feelings about her broken feelings when the first man cheated. She lost herself in the first relationship. She is devastated, how could he do this to me. She must of thought of herself as high and mighty back then. Now scarred for life, she has promised herself to never let infidelity strike twice. It's mental abuse that she is dealing with.


You could be onto something here! 

She grew up without a father figure, first boyfriend dumped,her when she was an unhappy teenager (she has finished EVERY r'ship of hers since).

First husband cheated, although most of the damage was already done in her upbringing.

I honestly felt on trial for most of,the marriage, like she was keeping a list of my misdemeanours, however small.

She was subconsciously waiting for my mistakes, keeping score then one day it hit the target and she ended it. As she expects all her relationships to some day.

Sad really.


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

happyman64 said:


> Do not give her a heads up. The day she screwed you over she lost that right.
> 
> And she needs to know how mad you really are and that your status as a doormat is over......


Thanks HM, I was thinking along these lines but she has made me doubt myself so much I am still working on believing in myself more.

Im going to ignore any fall out from her as would usually apologise. 

Figured my silence would speak volumes.


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## Chuck71 (Nov 5, 2012)

issues based prior to you
thou shalt not suffer for others sins of the heart
forgive or relive, she chose latter
take high ground, allow her to fall to bottom
passion can last as long as a led zep song
reprocussions can last forever.


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## Chuck71 (Nov 5, 2012)

doubt self is re writing history
history repeats itself is nothing learned
trust in thy self
you were sentenced without a trial nor jury nor judge


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Well she was served with divorce papers today. Was predictably p****d off and has texted me about 5 times since.

I haven't replied.

She is threatening to serve me but I've done nothing wrong so am calm about it. If she does, she does.

At least for the first time in her life she is seeing the consequences of her actions..... And she doesn't like it!


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

Bottle said:


> Well she was served with divorce papers today. Was predictably p****d off and has texted me about 5 times since.
> 
> I haven't replied.
> 
> ...


Awwww So sorry to hear she was pissed off. Not!!!

Ignore her. 

And have a great night.


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

happyman64 said:


> Awwww So sorry to hear she was pissed off. Not!!!
> 
> Ignore her.
> 
> And have a great night.


Thanks HM. Will do!

Feels good to be in control and for her to be facing the consequences for quite possibly the first time in her life!


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## Chuck71 (Nov 5, 2012)

you called a spade a spade. everything we do in life has aftermath. strap youself in, if she is the type who hates to have her hand forced, she may try to "walk back in." Raise BS meter


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

So the stbxw and I have been at war for the last few days.

PosOM has been avoiding our workplace and knows he is in s**t. Told him to stay away from me.

I wanted to just press ahead with the adultery thing but it's clear she will make my life hell if I do. Can't risk her being awkward over the child's either. It won't help them in the long run.

I have agreed to amend the D to unreasonable behaviour which looks bette on her.

Everyone knows what they have done though, so I have made my point.


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## Chuck71 (Nov 5, 2012)

Why is OM even near your workplace? Sounds like he has several brain cells missing.


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

He works in the same office as me. Nice touch from her don't you think?

Piece of s**t.


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

Bottle said:


> He works in the same office as me. Nice touch from her don't you think?
> 
> Piece of s**t.


Oh screw it you came this far keep him in the complaint she is going to make it a living hell anyway!


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## Chuck71 (Nov 5, 2012)

Try this one......we still live in same house.....I run the finances......she joined a dating site......knowing I would see it. Can't pay her bills but spends $ on that. And she wondered why I would get pi$$ed off at her spending habits. I can't wait until she is out of the house and crashes and burns.


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## HiRoad (Oct 22, 2012)

Chuck71 said:


> Try this one......we still live in same house.....I run the finances......she joined a dating site......knowing I would see it. Can't pay her bills but spends $ on that. And she wondered why I would get pi$$ed off at her spending habits. I can't wait until she is out of the house and crashes and burns.


Chuck, how bout this, open a business for wife, wife leaves, then spends all her business $$ on clothes, partying, and going out, and tells me she cant afford, diapers, bills, and daycare.


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## Chuck71 (Nov 5, 2012)

I think our ex's 2B are related LOL


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## HiRoad (Oct 22, 2012)

Alright I appologize if it seems like i am robbing this thread, but since the title says it all I am going to keep it here.

It has been 3months to the day since the STBXW dropped the bomb on me at work, over the phone, and in the middle of a move. She called to tell me she went to court and filed papers for the D, outa the blue.

I was on shakey ground the first month, sent flowers, cards, gifts, letters, and got (of course) no response. I was in LC then, and by the end of the month, we were arranging our assets and debts. Our poor children have been shuffled from MIL's house to mine and back. 

Here i am 3mnths later, like a athlete, training and getting stronger, both physically and emotionally. I am still watching her but from a far distance. I feel much better than i did that first month. I have lost 32lbs, went from a 36" to a 33". I am looking and feeling great. Stopped drinking, and eating bad. 

Xmas around the corner and we have the kids daycare xmas that we are both attending. This will be the 1st time we have been under the same roof for an exteneded period of time. 

I feel that the STBXW is waiting for me to make the first move? I have urges to "chase" her, show her how much better I am than before. But i dont.

We are at the halfway point till the D is final. What should be my game plan for the next 3 months (possibly forever)?

180 & NC?


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## Chuck71 (Nov 5, 2012)

No children here, I have thoughts but I feel you want parents with experience. I understand 10,000%


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

So haven't posted for a few days. Had a massive fall out with stbxw over the divorce, but it's still proceeding albeit on unreasonable behaviour rather than adultery.

I made my point so am not fussed what it is. I am divorcing her, end of story.

She slagged me off on FB which said a lot about her, although didn't mention me by name. I only found out through a friend as had removed her previously.

We ended up having a 2 hr chat the other day to clear the air. She admitted if she's not happy she just leaves and starts all over again. She said its what she does. 

Well you can't be with a woman like that long term as there will always be times in a relationship when things aren't going great.

That coupled with her ability to heap the blame at my door for everything that went wrong between us, shows it would never have worked.

She can now turn her anger and blaming onto posOM and he will have to put up,with it for a while before she eventually leaves him.


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## Chuck71 (Nov 5, 2012)

Decorum-VERY well spoken.


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## Chuck71 (Nov 5, 2012)

Bottle-How are things going in your situation?


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Chuck71 said:


> Bottle-How are things going in your situation?


I am ok. Just trying to go through the process and not get too down.

Have a lot of hate for her and posOM right now. I know they're lying to me about what happened.

Christmas doesn't help but am focusing on my daughter to make it a good one for her. 

Always next year for me.


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## Chuck71 (Nov 5, 2012)

Completely understandable. If you get upset, vent on here. I do, no one reads it I don't think but I know not many post on it anymore But it helps me so....that's all that matters. If you want to cuss her like a dog, just send it to me in a PM lol.......that way no one here would be offended at the high end name calling.


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## Bottle (Sep 12, 2012)

Chuck71 said:


> Completely understandable. If you get upset, vent on here. I do, no one reads it I don't think but I know not many post on it anymore But it helps me so....that's all that matters. If you want to cuss her like a dog, just send it to me in a PM lol.......that way no one here would be offended at the high end name calling.


Haha thanks chuck, might just do that.

She isnt worth it. I deserve better and will find it in time.

Hope you're ok?


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## Chuck71 (Nov 5, 2012)

Bottle-I'm doing really well. Things are looking better. The W's world is unraveling before her eyes. And the sad part is, she can't come to me, the problem solver to fix them. The tone of her voice has changed. I saw this happening from the start. The pain meter has shifted.


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