# Personality Disorder? Even if not what do I do?



## Heather199 (Apr 17, 2012)

Hello,
My name is Heather. I am not married but in a serious relationship with my boyfriend. My story aligns with many here...the beginning of our relationship was blissful and refreshing. I had gotten out of a tumultuous relationship months before and my trust and self-worth were significantly damaged. He seemed to be my savior. However, after approximately 5 months, I discovered he had been unfaithful. Not physically, but had been emotionally involved with a younger girl. I left initially, but found that I wanted to give it another chance, as I had fallen for him. After I decided to forgive, things seemed to improve. We celebrated my birthday with him cooking me a wonderful dinner and spending the night together. We had a great Christmas too. Then, I discovered again that he had been texting and speaking to another girl. This would be two months after the first time. We fought, separated but soon rekindled. This happened two more time with the same girl until it finally reached a dangerous and harassing issue. I did try to leave him for good. We separated for longer than before and I tried to surround myself with friends and family and delete him from my life.
Needless to say, I could not. We stayed up all hours of the night discussing how we would fix us. He agreed to give up his privacy and allow me to look at his phone or whatever I pleased, because he was for real about it. Months later, an anonymous person told me he was pursuing another girl. Which quickly ended.

That is the infidelity issue. I will say, he has never been PHYSICALLY unfaithful, but for some reason I feel emotional infidelity hurts as much if not more. In the beginning of our relationship I saw no rageful fits. He was very kind, spoiled me to dinner and movies and whatever I liked. We would spend multitudes of time together. My mom quickly took him under her wing and now considers him her "second son". We were very loving.

But after five months, his anger and temper surfaced. I had an idea that he was somewhat angry, as he had been briefly arrested for fighting his father. But it began to get much worse. He would get mad about frivolous things. If I happened to re-activate my Facebook or say hi to a male friend, he would go insane. When I accused him of cheating, he punched a glass window out and a hole in a wall. And although I have personally seen all the evidence that he did get emotionally involved with other girls, he will still deny deny deny. If I kid around with him, he will be laughing one second and then if I say something wrong, he snaps immediately and I find myself having to surrender and calm him down.

I do not mean to be arrogant or conceited, but I believe I am a very loving, affectionate, and supportive girlfriend. He is a foster child, who was born with Fetal Alcohol Syndrome. His biological parents are deceased due to drug overdoses. His adoptive family abused he and his two sisters during childhood. He has certainly had a rough life and I have always been there to wipe his tears and give him a place to sleep and feel safe. I almost always put him before myself and will do practically anything to make him happy. I do silly little things to make him smile or feel loved to ensure he knows I am there always and DO love him regardless of his parents. When the infidelity and anger began, I was so confused. I did not think I deserved it. But I quickly became used to what would happen and found myself avoiding any situations where an outburst might occur. I completely gave up my male friends because his jealousy envelops him to a point of black out rage. I almost never go out, just to avoid his outbursts. I cater to him, to make sure things go smoothly because I truly am beginning to believe that if I do not, I will lose him...Because of all of this I began to research the effects of Fetal Alcohol Syndrome. I thought maybe Bipolar Disorder?

I wrote my story here to get some feedback? What are your opinions?


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## pidge70 (Jan 17, 2011)

Heather199 said:


> Hello,
> My name is Heather. I am not married but in a serious relationship with my boyfriend. My story aligns with many here...the beginning of our relationship was blissful and refreshing. I had gotten out of a tumultuous relationship months before and my trust and self-worth were significantly damaged. He seemed to be my savior. However, after approximately 5 months, I discovered he had been unfaithful. Not physically, but had been emotionally involved with a younger girl. I left initially, but found that I wanted to give it another chance, as I had fallen for him. After I decided to forgive, things seemed to improve. We celebrated my birthday with him cooking me a wonderful dinner and spending the night together. We had a great Christmas too. Then, I discovered again that he had been texting and speaking to another girl. This would be two months after the first time. We fought, separated but soon rekindled. This happened two more time with the same girl until it finally reached a dangerous and harassing issue. I did try to leave him for good. We separated for longer than before and I tried to surround myself with friends and family and delete him from my life.
> Needless to say, I could not. We stayed up all hours of the night discussing how we would fix us. He agreed to give up his privacy and allow me to look at his phone or whatever I pleased, because he was for real about it. Months later, an anonymous person told me he was pursuing another girl. Which quickly ended.
> 
> ...


Look up Borderline Personality Disorder.....much better fit.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## KathyBatesel (Apr 26, 2012)

I think that you should avoid trying to diagnose another person and focus instead on what kind of people you will and won't let into your life. 

Many years ago, I made a list of "Boundaries" because I kept getting involved with toxic people. I'd read that in order to uphold good boundaries, I needed to make a list of things that I would not accept- from ANYONE. My list contained things like "I will not tolerate physical, verbal, or sexual abuse. I will not tolerate deceptive acts. I will not tolerate disrespect." It ended with "If someone violates my boundaries, I have an obligation to inform them of my boundary and a responsibility to myself to leave if there is another violation after they've been made aware." 

You're letting a controlling, disrespectful person into your life again and again without seeing evidence that he has changed. Why do you keep putting yourself in that position?


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## Heather199 (Apr 17, 2012)

Kathy,

I think the main reason I do stay is because although there are bad times, when there are good times they are so good and give me true fulfillment. The good memories keep me stuck.

I have also been told I'm trying to "save him from himself." I am not sure, maybe this is true maybe it isn't. It is tough to say when I am the one involved and not on the outside looking in


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## Uptown (Mar 27, 2010)

Heather199 said:


> I began to research the effects of Fetal Alcohol Syndrome. I thought maybe Bipolar Disorder?


Heather, I agee with Pidge that the behaviors you describe are far closer to the traits of BPD (Borderline Personality Disorder). Of course, only a professional can tell you whether your BF's BPD traits are so strong as to satisfy 100% of the diagnostic criteria for having full-blown BPD. This is not to say, however, that you cannot spot the red flags. There is nothing subtle about traits such as verbal and physical abuse, irrational jealousy, and temper tantrums.

I am not a psychologist but I did live with a BPDer exW for 15 years and I've taken care of a bipolar foster son for longer than that. Moreover, I took both of them to a long series of psychologists for 15 years. Based on those experiences, I have found eight clear differences between the two disorders.

*One difference* is that the mood swings are on two very different spectrums having different polar extremes. Whereas a bipolar sufferer swings between _mania_ and _depression_, a BPDer flips back and forth between _loving you_ and _hating you_. Significantly, you've mentioned nothing about observing mania. Instead, you've been describing a BF who intensely loves and adores you and, then in a few seconds, flips to devaluing you -- or even hating you.

*A second difference* is seen in the frequency of mood changes. Bipolar mood swings are very slow because they are caused by gradual changes in body chemistry. They are considered rapid if as many as four occur in a year. In contrast, four BPD mood changes can easily occur in four days. The latter therefore is consistent with your description of numerous temper tantrums.

*A third difference* is seen in duration. Whereas bipolar moods typically last a week or two, BPD rages typically last only a few hours (and rarely as long as 36 hours). Again, these short-duration rages are consistent with with the tantrums you describe. (Although it is possible for a bipolar sufferer to have hyper-rapid cycling, it is very rare and usually is associated with a transition into psychosis.)

*A fourth difference* is seen in the speed with which the mood change develops. Whereas a bipolar change typically will build slowly over two weeks, a BPD change typically occurs in less than a minute -- often in only 10 seconds -- because it is event-triggered by some innocent comment or action. Significantly, the behavior you describe is consistent with these event-triggered outbursts.

*A fifth difference* is that, whereas bipolar can be treated very successfully in at least 80% of victims by swallowing a pill, BPD cannot be managed by medication because it arises from childhood damage to the emotional core -- not from a change in body chemistry. If your BF has strong BPD, the likely source is the abusive childhood you mentioned in another thread.

*A sixth difference* is that, whereas bipolar disorder can cause people to be irritable and obnoxious during the manic and depressive phases, it does not rise to the level of meanness and vindictiveness you see when a BPDer is splitting you black. That difference is HUGE: while a manic person may regard you as an irritation, a BPDer can perceive you as Hitler and will treat you accordingly. This seems consistent with your description of very hateful, spiteful behavior.

*A seventh difference* is that, whereas a bipolar sufferer is not usually angry, a BPDer is filled with anger that has been carried inside since early childhood. You only have to say or do some minor thing to trigger a sudden release of that anger -- which is consistent with your description.
*
Finally, an eighth difference* is that a bipolar sufferer -- whether depressed or manic -- usually is able to trust you if he or she knows you well. Untreated BPDers, however, are unable to trust for an extended period. Before they can trust others, they must first learn how to trust and love themselves. 

I therefore am surprised you make no mention of his inability to trust you. If he has strong BPD traits, he almost certainly cannot trust you and has a great fear you will abandon him. One way this fear will show itself is jealousy -- to the point that he will periodically test your willingness to stay with him by doing something offensive. And, after you past that test, the only thing that will change will be his raising the hoop higher for the next loyalty test.

Yet, despite these eight clear differences between the two disorders, many people confuse the two. One source of this confusion seems to be the fact that a substantial portion of BPD sufferers (about 25%) also have the bipolar disorder. If you would like to read a brief overview on BPD traits, I suggest you look at my description of them in Maybe's thread at http://talkaboutmarriage.com/general-relationship-discussion/33734-my-list-hell.html#post473522. If that description rings a bell, I would be glad to discuss it with you and point you to excellent online resources. Take care, Heather.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Heather,

Do you have a history of tumultuous relationships?


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## yinyangfan (Nov 9, 2011)

Former therapeutic foster parent here. Your boyfriend's history strongly suggest Reactive Attachment Disorder. Also, how familiar are you with FAS? Impulse control is quite impaired in FAS.


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## Heather199 (Apr 17, 2012)

Uptown, THANK YOU so much! Those were so insightful and helpful. You are correct, he has no trust for me and almost always is accusatory about what I am doing in my free time, in spite of the fact that I have never been unfaithful. Do you believe that the possible BPD has an effect as to why he has cheated?

Conrad, I would say yes unfortunately...But none like this. Just infidelity. In this case it is much more intense

Yingyang, I have fervently believed that his FAS has played a major role in his adolescent development. I know the basics of it...anger, difficulty retaining knowledge, bouts of anger..etc. However I have never heard of Reactive Detachment Disorder...what are your experiences with that?


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## endlessgrief (Feb 19, 2012)

Heather, the writing is on the wall in huge letters. GET THE HELL AWAY FROM THIS MAN!!!!! You mentioned he was your savior. We women tend to fall easily for the handsome savior type, how gallant and wonderful they are . . . AT FIRST.

I could really feel your emotion when I read your post because your personality type is like mine. Being kind and trusting and just wanting to love are wonderful qualities. Azzholes like to prey on nice women, use them up, and throw them away. You don't want to end up not trusting men ever again do you? Sometimes people are attracted to drama, it makes life more interesting and makes you feel alive. Once that feeling fades, and it will, you are stuck with a jerk off who doesn't deserve to lick the bottom of your shoes.

Please listen to your heart Heather. You are a kind person and evil people like to use kind people to their advantage. This guy is showing signs of problems with anger, fidelity, and being a real man. This man already has a strangle hold on your heart. You cannot save him and he will bring you down with him. Wanting to rescue someone in pain is a great trait to have, but when it comes to someone who is violent and unfaithful, YOU will be the one who needs rescuing. 

Heather, this man has a lot of issues and problems he needs to deal with. He needs counseling, a priest, rabbi, anything, but he will break you emotionally, I have no doubt about that. I am actually tearing up a bit considering your situation. You just want to help. You just want to love. Why is that so difficult? I can't answer those questions, but you need to save yourself. 

My mother was a nice girl, tried to rescue my father, tried to understand his mood swings and his violence, she tried to love the pain out of him. 43 years later, and she is a broken woman and my father is still the same broken and tormented man she married in 1967. Women do not get merit badges for kindness and love, they get kicked in the head and end up depressed. 

Take care of yourself Heather. It is not selfish to put yourself first. Please get some help so you do not fall for another abused puppy. You deserve so much better. Please love yourself.


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## ShawnD (Apr 2, 2012)

Heather199 said:


> Then, I discovered again that he had been texting and speaking to another girl.
> ..... If I happened to re-activate my Facebook or say hi to a male friend, he would go insane.


He talks to another girl and it's cheating. You talking to another boy is not cheating?





> Fetal Alcohol Syndrome


That causes all kinds of brain problems. Anger for no reason is one of those problems. I don't want to sound like a jerk, but I think you should run from someone who has FAS.


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## yinyangfan (Nov 9, 2011)

Heather199 said:


> Uptown, THANK YOU so much! Those were so insightful and helpful. You are correct, he has no trust for me and almost always is accusatory about what I am doing in my free time, in spite of the fact that I have never been unfaithful. Do you believe that the possible BPD has an effect as to why he has cheated?
> 
> Conrad, I would say yes unfortunately...But none like this. Just infidelity. In this case it is much more intense
> 
> Yingyang, I have fervently believed that his FAS has played a major role in his adolescent development. I know the basics of it...anger, difficulty retaining knowledge, bouts of anger..etc. However I have never heard of Reactive Detachment Disorder...what are your experiences with that?



I raised two kids with RAD a few years ago, and I have adopted a child from Ukraine who also has RAD. 

These are the symptoms og Attachment Disorder in adults:

Adult Attachment Disorder

And this is the RAD info for children. Looking at his childhood history, he is at high risk for RAD. 

http://www.reactiveattachmentdisordertreatment.com/childattachchecklist.pdf

Reactive Attachment Disorder: RAD Signs, Symptoms & Causes | Suite101.com


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## Uptown (Mar 27, 2010)

yinyangfan said:


> Your boyfriend's history strongly suggest Reactive Attachment Disorder.


Hello, Dutch Lady (aka YinYangFan). I believe that you and I are saying the same thing. BPD, like the other personality disorders, generally is not diagnosed until a person is at least 16 and most therapists wait until 18. They do not want to prematurely conclude that a young person has a PD because he might grow out of it and because his personality is not yet fully formed. Hence, when that same set of behavioral symptoms appears in childhood, there are other names used for what would later be called a PD. 

Specifically, when BPD symptoms appear in early childhood (typically before age 5), the pattern of symptoms is called "Reactive Attachment Disorder of _Childhood_" in the diagnostic manual used here in the USA (i.e., DSM-IV). In the new diagnostic manual that will be released next May (DSM-5), it will be called "Reactive Attachment Disorder of _Infancy or Early Childhood_." (In Europe, the ICD-10 manual uses comparable terminology, I believe.) 

As those names suggest, RAD is a diagnosis primarily used for children. As far as I can tell, the list of traits for RAD and BPD are nearly identical except for emotional instability being listed for BPD but not for RAD. Indeed, instability (inability to control one's emotions) is the trait that distinguishes BPD from all of the other PDs. That trait is excluded from RAD because, given that its usage is confined to children, it would be silly to list instability as a dysfunctional trait. That instability is perfectly normal behavior for all young children.

Importantly, this does NOT imply that RAD ends in adolescence. It usually does not end but, rather, continues throughout adulthood. All that changes in adulthood, then, is the name assigned to it. This is why I said we are talking about the same thing.


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## River1977 (Oct 25, 2010)

heather199 said:


> i discovered he had been unfaithful.....i left initially, but found that i wanted to give it another chance
> 
> then, i discovered again that he had been texting and speaking to another girl......we fought, separated but soon rekindled.
> 
> ...


***********************************************​


heather199 said:


> his anger and temper surfaced.....he had been briefly arrested for fighting his father.....it began to get much worse.....he would get mad about frivolous things.....he would go insane.....he punched a glass window out and a hole in a wall.....he will be laughing one second.....he snaps immediately.....his jealousy envelops him to a point of black out rage.


***********************************************​


heather199 said:


> i find myself having to surrender and calm him down.....i have always been there to wipe his tears and give him a place to sleep and feel safe.....i almost always put him before myself and will do practically anything to make him happy.....i do silly little things to make him smile or feel loved to ensure he knows i am there always and do love him.....i quickly became used to what would happen.....found myself avoiding any situations where an outburst might occur.....i cater to him, to make sure things go smoothly because i truly am beginning to believe that if i do not, i will lose him


The first section was written by a woman you does not value herself and has no self esteem. She also enjoys punishment, pain, and drama in her life. She has set no standards to guide her in the way she lives her life, and she has set no boundaries over which other people in her life must never cross.

The middle section was written by a woman who is with a man that no woman should ever want to be with.

The last section was written by a woman who either thinks she is a doctor or she thinks she is God. She thinks she can save him. She thinks she can fix him. She thinks if she can figure out what he has, then she can cure him with her perfectly right kind of love. She thinks if she loves him enough there won't be any problems. She thinks if he knows she loves him, then he won't mistreat her. She fears losing something that is not worth having, and she should have enough self worth to realize that.

Truly, it doesn't matter one bit what his problems are. It doesn't matter one bit what is wrong with him. It does not matter one bit whether he is FAS, BPD, RAD, or XYZ because this thread was written by a woman who needs to seek counseling to get herself diagnosed. She really needs to try and understand why on earth she wrote these words and why she wants to continue being with this type of man. She needs to try to learn why it is she ignores all the danger signs over and over again. She needs to understand that she epitomizes the definition of insanity (doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results) and why. She really needs to learn herself so she doesn't keep repeating the same mistakes in life. It doesn't matter who he is. She needs to learn who she is.


Romeo's Bleeding
When Mr. Right Turns Out To Be Mr. Wrong

Facing The Facts
How To Break Up With A Person Who Is BPD (and any other disorder)


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## KathyBatesel (Apr 26, 2012)

Heather199 said:


> Kathy,
> 
> I think the main reason I do stay is because although there are bad times, when there are good times they are so good and give me true fulfillment. The good memories keep me stuck.
> 
> I have also been told I'm trying to "save him from himself." I am not sure, maybe this is true maybe it isn't. It is tough to say when I am the one involved and not on the outside looking in


This didn't really answer my question: Why do you tolerate the bad? Why don't you deserve to be treated well all the time? 

Every relationship, even the very worst of the worst, has good points and nice times. Bad relationships are like a roller coaster. The highs are REALLY good, but the bads are horrendous. 

Good relationships don't have that roller coaster effect. They're a bit boring, even, by comparison. But you have someone who is a consistent, reliable caregiver in your life. And you have peace as a NORMAL thing.

If you search your heart, I think you'll find that your efforts to "save him from himself" also leave you taking less care of YOUR needs. You're cleaning his doorstep while letting your own get littered. 

It doesn't matter what diagnosis he has. You're not his doctor. Period. You'd find much more peace and better relationships in your life if you addressed your own codependency before trying to fix other people. 

I don't mean to sound harsh, but it's the truth. You're as sick as the people you get involved with, and until you get healthy, you'll always find people at your own level of emotional health. Water seeks its own level.


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## Heather199 (Apr 17, 2012)

Endless grief, thank you for your kind words. I appreciate it and appreciate your opinion. 

ShawnD, I did not go into detail as to what I meant by 'speaking to another girl'. That meant sexting, telling her he had feelings for her etc. I cannot stress that I have never once sought out another man regardless of my loneliness or hurt. I have maintain fidelity throughout our entire relationship. 

Kathy, I guess I am at a loss of words as to why I tolerate it. I've thought about it, and a part of me hates the idea of change. Hates the idea that someone who has been my constant--held my hand through my mom's diagnosis of breast cancer, helped me through my stressful nights of school, and even drove my mother to chemotherapy and radiation while I was working--will no longer be in my life. That I won't share a bed with him anymore. I can't fathom walking past him as strangers when we were once so close. I cry at the thought. Because I truly do love the little pieces of him. I love his laugh, his face when he tells stories, and his little quirks. I never quite thought of it as me thinking I don't deserve good things, strangely. I do know I deserve the world. But my heart clouds the sense in my mind. One person posted here that I am insecure and 'epitomize inaanity'. I don't discount these claims. Maybe I do need help. But the underlying, fundamental issue is my fear. Not necessarily my fear of being alone, but fear that I really won't be okay without him. Fear that I'll regret leaving him. Fear of change. Because in spite of everything I deserve and what he has lacked to give me...I can't help but still love him. 
I certainly have thought about leaving. There will be times where I'll say 'Yes this is it. I'm going to do this this time. I'll be okay, I don't need him'. An realistically I don't. But then I start thinking about everything good everything I love. And it becomes incomparably difficult to leave. And be okay.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Heather199 (Apr 17, 2012)

Endless grief, thank you for your kind words. I appreciate it and appreciate your opinion. 

ShawnD, I did not go into detail as to what I meant by 'speaking to another girl'. That meant sexting, telling her he had feelings for her etc. I cannot stress that I have never once sought out another man regardless of my loneliness or hurt. I have maintain fidelity throughout our entire relationship. 

Kathy, I guess I am at a loss of words as to why I tolerate it. I've thought about it, and a part of me hates the idea of change. Hates the idea that someone who has been my constant--held my hand through my mom's diagnosis of breast cancer, helped me through my stressful nights of school, and even drove my mother to chemotherapy and radiation while I was working--will no longer be in my life. That I won't share a bed with him anymore. I can't fathom walking past him as strangers when we were once so close. I cry at the thought. Because I truly do love the little pieces of him. I love his laugh, his face when he tells stories, and his little quirks. I never quite thought of it as me thinking I don't deserve good things, strangely. I do know I deserve the world. But my heart clouds the sense in my mind. One person posted here that I am insecure and 'epitomize inaanity'. I don't discount these claims. Maybe I do need help. But the underlying, fundamental issue is my fear. Not necessarily my fear of being alone, but fear that I really won't be okay without him. Fear that I'll regret leaving him. Fear of change. Because in spite of everything I deserve and what he has lacked to give me...I can't help but still love him. 
I certainly have thought about leaving. There will be times where I'll say 'Yes this is it. I'm going to do this this time. I'll be okay, I don't need him'. An realistically I don't. But then I start thinking about everything good everything I love. And it becomes incomparably difficult to leave. And be okay.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

_But after five months, his anger and temper surfaced. I had an idea that he was somewhat angry, as he had been briefly arrested for fighting his father. But it began to get much worse. He would get mad about frivolous things. If I happened to re-activate my Facebook or say hi to a male friend, he would go insane. When I accused him of cheating, he punched a glass window out and a hole in a wall. And although I have personally seen all the evidence that he did get emotionally involved with other girls, he will still deny deny deny. If I kid around with him, he will be laughing one second and then if I say something wrong, he snaps immediately and I find myself having to surrender and calm him down._

What do you need advice on? 

He sounds like a cad. A cheating loser a$$hole who got arrested for fighting his father (ew) and gets mad at you and puches windows out and denies the very things he does (gaslighting you).

What else do you need? He's not worth your time. Move on. Unless you want to stay with a man who keeps cheating on your and sounds emotionally abusive.


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## A Bit Much (Sep 14, 2011)

> Maybe I do need help. But the underlying, fundamental issue is my fear. Not necessarily my fear of being alone, but fear that I really won't be okay without him. Fear that I'll regret leaving him. Fear of change. Because in spite of everything I deserve and what he has lacked to give me...I can't help but still love him.


1) you're not married to him (no vows, no promises made)

2) if you're going to give him a pass then don't complain about what he does or says... you ALLOW it to happen to you. 

You can't expect help if you continue to put yourself in the line of fire. You have no dealbreakers. He can do whatever he wants.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

BINGO!!!!! ABitMuch nailed it.


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## A Bit Much (Sep 14, 2011)

Loving a person is in no way an excuse to be their punching bag. You should love yourself more. I would go so far to say it's not love when you accept any and everything, it's something else. Love doesn't hurt.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

... and love doesn't punch windows out, holes in the wall, talk down to you, accuse you, and snap at you.

I'm just saying.


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