# Problems with fantasizing about other people?



## badsanta (Oct 13, 2014)

I did a poll on this topic a while back and it broke the rules of TAM as polling fantasies is not allowed. I completely respect that as querying other people's fantasies will be problematic at best if you are struggling with problems in your own marriage. So I am not going to poll fantasies themselves, but instead ask how many people have a problem with certain types of fantasies.

Psychology research indicates that it is very common to think about other people when we fantasize sexually while being married. This is commonly thought the be a result of couples struggling to communicate in what psychological dimension in which they experience sex (The three categories are: _sexual trance, partner engagement, and role play_ according to researcher Donald Mosher), because one person needs to limit the other person's dimension to avoid distractions. So here is what is going on:

*Person A* wants a sexual trance in which it is a calm and relaxing scenario that allows them to focus on how his/her body feels and is responding to his/her partner. This mode of experience often can not be translated into words and is made up of images, sensations, smells, sounds, and feelings. In order to accomplish this, one need to meditate and place themselves into a sexual trance. This is an "eyes closed" experience for the most part.

*Person B* likes role play is the type of experience in which fantasies need to be externalized, communicated, dramatized, and acted out. This does not mean fantasies of other people, but more so the 'role' that one person will play out to enhance the experience for his/her partner. A stereotype experience would be "playing doctor" together. This is an "eyes open" experience for the most part.

OK, now you can see how these two desired modes of sexual experiences would create a serious conflict in the bedroom. Person *A* needs for person *B* to stop all the drama so that he/she can focus and not be interrupted. Person *B* needs for person *A* to open his/her eyes and be more playful. The result of this conflict results in BOTH partners becoming rather restricted in being able to further develop their desired mode of phycological experience in the sexual relationship. Due to these limitations both partners will likely engage in "partner replacement" fantasies out of their desire to develop upon their desired mode of sexuality. *A* will imagine a partner more quiet and sensual, while *B* will imagine a partner more open, vocal and playful. Odds are *B* tries to share these fantasies, and *A* would be mortified by doing the same. 

The reality is if *A* could be open about his/her fantasies about other people that are more quiet and sensual, then *B* would be more than willing to act these out in the bedroom! Sharing fantasies openly about other people would actually help bring *A&B* closer together and work out ways to develop each other's mode of sexuality in the bedroom.

OK all that is wordy, but honestly speaking how many people have serious problems about a spouse that fantasizes about other people? Research suggests that those that do not have the most confidence in themselves and their relationship. 

The purpose of this thread is to help demilitarize this topic for couples that may be struggling on this topic!

Regards, 
Badsanta


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## ScrambledEggs (Jan 14, 2014)

Not so long as it is not obsession or acted upon.


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## samyeagar (May 14, 2012)

This is not a simple question at all...lots of conditions would yield widely different answers. At it's core though, I think it is just a variant of the old adage about it not mattering where they get their appetite, so long as they eat at home. Some people are perfectly fine with that, others not so much.


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## KJ_Simmons (Jan 12, 2016)

I don't see the problem with it, it's human nature. The lengths people will go to to deny what is in their very nature is what troubles me.


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## Herschel (Mar 27, 2016)

This is one of the very few times it is 100% required to lie in a marriage. Think about whatever you want, tell me that it's just me.


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## Keke24 (Sep 2, 2016)

What about the person who needs to create an image of someone else in their head in order to reach orgasm. I'm not sure where this fits in as it is not quite fantasizing. This seems to be a common practice among my circle of girl friends, myself included. In my case, I don't attach a face or anything physical (beyond the guy having a decent body) but I need to picture some other guy having sex with me and/or other women in order to reach orgasm. My friends however need more detail, face, banging body etc. 

I think this may be the case for some women like myself who are still very much in the process of teaching oneself/learning how to reach different orgasms. I've never explained to my partner that this is what is happening in my head as I don't want him to take it the wrong way. He just knows that I can't orgasm by looking in his eyes, I look away but eyes remain open. Since I've been working on trying to focus more on my body and how I feel in the moment, I have noticed that while I still need the image, its more blurred/ less detailed than before.


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## BetrayedDad (Aug 8, 2013)

If she's fantasizing about Channing Tatum? NO

If she's fantasizing about the neighbor? YES


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## GTdad (Aug 15, 2011)

I'm not sure too many people are threatened by fantasizing about "other people" in general, but doing so about specific people can be a huge problem. If my wife were to discover that I whacked off to our niece, or her best friend, or her mother, or her brother (you get my drift), I suspect she'd have a huge problem with that, and I wouldn't blame her.


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## MarriedDude (Jun 21, 2014)

MrsMarriedDude thinks my Rita Ora thing is funny. Every once in a while she does her braids like fantasy girl....thats always fun.

I havent got any upset vibe about it


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## MrsAldi (Apr 15, 2016)

Fantasising during intercourse? 
Don't know how I feel about this one. 
I would like us to be in the present of acknowledging of both our pleasures. 

Fantasising during masturbatation? 
Yes, that's okay, as long as it's a lady far far away. Like on another continent! 

Sent from my B1-730HD using Tapatalk


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## samyeagar (May 14, 2012)

I also think that much like anything else, both partners need to be on the same page, need to be compatible in this area. Another question this leads to...when it comes to fantasizing about someone who is not ones partner while sexually engaged with that partner...at what point do they simply become a human masturbatory aide?


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## FeministInPink (Sep 13, 2012)

I'm not married, but I do have a partner Who I've been with for about 9 months now. I know he finds other women attractive, and I'm sure he fantasizes about them to a certain extent. As another poster already said, as long as it doesn't become an obsession and he doesn't act on it, I don't mind it. If it was someone he knew in real life, that might bother me a little bit, so I wouldn't want to know about that. But hell, if he had a crush on Kate Winslet and wanted to roleplay a sex scene from one of her movies, I would be down with that. He has his fantasies, I have mine... we want to help each other make as many of those happen as possible, unless it's a fantasy that we want to keep as just a fantasy.


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## Herschel (Mar 27, 2016)

I'll go into a little Herschel exposition here. When I'm by myself, I actually don't like fantasizing about other people (unless it's like a wow, holy crap, I gotta keep that fresh in my mind and get home, to my car, a bathroom stall or a closet ASAP).

Now, with my stbx, when we had standard sex, usually there was never a need or desire to think about someone else. However, there were rare instances where, maybe we had a fight and it was burrowing in my mind, or we had sex like 3 times in 2 days and I'm an old man, or something, that while I was good, I was taking way too long and I needed it to set me over the edge. Maybe once every 20+ times.

However, with BJs, my mind had to wander. And given that she gave them often (so sad when I think about it now), that's when the "remembering" occurred the most. The physical intimacy did it for me with sex, and while BJs felt good, it alone would NEVER have put me over. Could I think about her and it would work? Sometimes...but what's the fun in that?


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

My answer isn't going to be typical at all. My husband took his fantasies much farther and cheated, and is a sex addict. At the height of his acting out, he used to whack off in the shower after interacting with his online 'models', he would get turned on by women out in public and masturbate to them, he indulged in porn frequently in order to feed his mind movies for later consumption either with me or alone. I know he also frequently thought about his fantasy women when having sex with me.

I'm not totally naive, so I do not think that he still never fantasizes. I do know he masturbates far far less than the average male, if at all. We haven't talked about it for a couple of years, so maybe he's started up again, but in his case, if he did, he knows it's what's called a 'yellow behaviour' and how to deal with it if need be. I don't feel the need to know what he's up to with his hand, frankly. I know that if he ever did start acting out again there'd be much more blatant telltale signs than him masturbating.

With things the way they are today between us, I wouldn't mind at all if he was sometimes fantasizing about random non-available people, either during sex or when by himself. And I do trust that if he finds himself taking it farther he knows how to put the brakes on himself. But if he suddenly told me he was struggling with the fantasy aspect of things again, I'd encourage him to get in to see someone about it pronto. And if he kept it a secret and started getting back into what he did before, I'd kick his a$$ to the curb again.


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

I think all of us "suspect" that our SO's have fantasies about other people. It is a given. If you have fantasies then your spouse has them. 

This is not guilt deflection or projection, this is accepting "that which is in our mind" is in others.

The problem is this: "Suspecting and knowing" that these thoughts are present in your spouse is huge. If your spouse said "Yes, I sexually fantasize about others" it opens the door to all sort of mind movies.

There are many people who cannot handle the truth in this regard. I am one of them. I value my wife too much. For her to admit [what I only imagine] is too much for me....... it is torture.

When I value something, I either value it highly or not so much. 

I cannot be passionate with a "Not much" image of a wife. Fuzzy feelings should come from alcohol not from lip-locking your spouse.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

SunCMars said:


> Fuzzy feelings should come from alcohol not from lip-locking your spouse.


:smthumbup:


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## peacem (Oct 25, 2014)

It depends on whether they are younger or better looking than me....just kidding.

It is quite liberating for me to have exorcised those demons that made me so jealous in the past. Recognising that my own fantasies do not fit neatly into respectability has made me accept that my husband's probably do not either. Because I am getting a lot of attention from him and I know he has amazing fantasies about me (that sometimes involve other people), and that he clearly finds me attractive and shows it daily - means I do not get threatened at all about anything that gets him there. It was a different story when I felt ignored and neglected.

This is a huge step in the right direction. It fascinates me more than threatens me.


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## samyeagar (May 14, 2012)

peacem said:


> It depends on whether they are younger or better looking than me....just kidding.
> 
> It is quite liberating for me to have exorcised those demons that made me so jealous in the past. Recognising that my own fantasies do not fit neatly into respectability has made me accept that my husband's probably do not either. B*ecause I am getting a lot of attention from him and I know he has amazing fantasies about me (that sometimes involve other people), and that he clearly finds me attractive and shows it daily - means I do not get threatened at all about anything that gets him there. It was a different story when I felt ignored and neglected*.
> 
> This is a huge step in the right direction. It fascinates me more than threatens me.


These are the caveats, the conditions I was referring to in my original post.


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## rockon (May 18, 2016)

I've never told anyone this before, but........

When I broke up with my ex-fiancé 6 years ago (damn, has it really been that long?) because of cheating, she was irate. She informed me that when we were intimate she would often fantasize about one of her boy friends (yes, plural ). I understand she probably mentioned this out of anger but did that hurt.



(Hope this is not a T/J)


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## badsanta (Oct 13, 2014)

Keke24 said:


> What about the person who needs to create an image of someone else in their head in order to reach orgasm. I'm not sure where this fits in as it is not quite fantasizing. This seems to be a common practice among my circle of girl friends, myself included.


Thanks for sharing!

In my opinion this is more about needing to feel the safety of being emotionally _in full control_ of yourself and your fantasy partner as opposed to being able to let go and actually be with the person you are with. A fantasy partner will behave exactly as you want and feel you need them to, meanwhile your spouse will likely be somewhat unpredictable.

Meanwhile this same circle of girlfriends would likely be the first to hit the roof and become very angry if their husbands revealed that he too was doing the same. I'm not sure exactly why this would be, but it forces each person into a situation where they realize that they are way more emotionally vulnerable than they are capable of handling. 

A prominent social worker during a documentary once exclaimed that "anger is the mask of vulnerability!" 

To actually let go and truly be with someone may require for you to disclose things about yourself that you know may hurt your spouse, but by doing so it actually helps them better learn how to love you. Then sometimes if you reveal that "this is what I need" and they can't do that for you then you know at least this is an area that still needs work. Unfortunately most people will recite the lyrics of the Cheap Trick song (which likely coincides to the fantasy person):



> I want you to want me.
> I need you to need me.
> I'd love you to love me.
> I'm beggin' you to beg me.







...and be completely blind to the fact of how controlling that is and realize that they have not yet learned to love and accept their partner for exactly who he/she actually is. In reality those lyrics should be:



> I want you to feel wanted.
> I need you to feel needed.
> I'd love you to feel loved.
> I'm beggin' you to help me with these things.


As for as love songs go with this topic, I think Nothing but Thieves got it a little better regarding the other person's needs and wants:



> So take from me
> What you want
> What you need
> Take from me
> ...







But what is funny about those lyrics is that they still express "wanting to be wanted" and "needing to be needed," but also giving up and completely surrendering control of those ideas at the same time. So it comes across to me more like, "I can't control what you want or need, but if there is anything I have, it is yours." 

Regards, 
Badsanta


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## jb02157 (Apr 16, 2014)

Again, it all depends on the person that you are married to. Some couldn't care less as long as nothing physical occurs and others would call something like this an emotional affair. This has never been an area of concern for me since anyone twisted enough to want an affair with my wife doesn't exist.


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## BetrayedDad (Aug 8, 2013)

Just to add one point.

IMO - If you are fantasizing about another person, while in the act of sex to maintain arousal, then you are clearly not attracted to who you are sleeping with.

As others have mentioned, you might as well be having sex with a blow up doll. They are nothing more than a wet hole or warm dildo.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

BetrayedDad said:


> IMO - If you are fantasizing about another person, while in the act of sex to maintain arousal, then you are clearly not attracted to who you are sleeping with.


If you do this EVERY TIME then yes, I agree with you. But if once in a while you let your thoughts wander, or purposely guide them somewhere into fantasyland, to get yourself a bit more revved up, I can't see a problem.

All things in moderation


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## BetrayedDad (Aug 8, 2013)

Hope1964 said:


> If you do this EVERY TIME then yes, I agree with you. But if once in a while you let your thoughts wander, or purposely guide them somewhere into fantasyland, to get yourself a bit more revved up, I can't see a problem.
> 
> All things in moderation


Idk, if a naked person having sex with you in the moment isn't enough to rev you up then I kind of think it is a problem.

I've fantasized about other women in the past mainly because the few I did it with at the time were overweight.

After a year of sex with my current girlfriend, I haven't one time. I'm also super attracted to her. I don't think this is a coincidence.


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## badsanta (Oct 13, 2014)

BetrayedDad said:


> Just to add one point.
> 
> IMO - If you are fantasizing about another person, while in the act of sex to maintain arousal, then you are clearly not attracted to who you are sleeping with.
> 
> As others have mentioned, you might as well be having sex with a blow up doll. They are nothing more than a wet hole or warm dildo.


Have you heard the one about the guy who can't stand how needy and controlling his blow up doll is and that he struggles to just "get it over with" each time? The only thing that helps is for him to imagine being with someone who loves him instead of the doll. 

I mean for the love of god, the thing has a leak and he has to stop half way through to put more air in it!


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## Daisy12 (Jul 10, 2016)

BetrayedDad said:


> If she's fantasizing about Channing Tatum? NO
> 
> If she's fantasizing about the neighbor? YES


The above summarizes the way I feel as well.


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## Married but Happy (Aug 13, 2013)

BetrayedDad said:


> After a year of sex with my current girlfriend, I haven't one time. I'm also super attracted to her. I don't think this is a coincidence.


Check in 15 years from now, and let us know if that's still true. I fantasize occasionally, and I know she does, too. Sometimes, it takes a bit more than is there in the moment to push you over the edge. Not always, by any means, but if you're tired, or it's round three, then yeah, maybe.


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## BetrayedDad (Aug 8, 2013)

Married but Happy said:


> Check in 15 years from now, and let us know if that's still true. I fantasize occasionally, and I know she does, too. Sometimes, it takes a bit more than is there in the moment to push you over the edge. Not always, by any means, but if you're tired, or it's round three, then yeah, maybe.


It will be a sad day if I have too...


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## wild jade (Jun 21, 2016)

Interesting. For me personally, fantasizing about other people is very much about lack of attraction for one's spouse. 

That's why, IMHO, it's considered hurtful, and why so many people advise that you should keep such thoughts to yourself, and not tell the spouse. 

I do think it's completely normal though. Especially after years of being together.


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## Spicy (Jun 18, 2016)

I answered "kind of". 

I know I'm not thrilled with the idea of it, but at the same time I know it is pretty common and probably the norm....


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## heartsbeating (May 2, 2011)

He knows I have a thing for Batman. It's a playful nickname I use for him in day-to-day life. When he did the Bale 'Batman voice' during sex ...I couldn't stop laughing. It was wrong and his timing was immaculate for it to be bad. Laughter and playfulness is an aphrodisiac between us. There's a fun place for role play and fantasy. 

But I know he only ever thinks about me when aroused..... ahem. 

His actions in the relationship are what matters. There's no point getting myself twisted inside at the prospect of what's happening in his mind. That's for him to know. If I felt he was detached or disconnected during sex, that's different and would be a turn off.


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## alexm (Nov 29, 2008)

BetrayedDad said:


> If she's fantasizing about Channing Tatum? NO
> 
> If she's fantasizing about the neighbor? YES


Yep, this.

The irony is that somebody like Channing Tatum or (insert hunky Hollywood dude or lady here) are unattainable, thus making it 'okay' to fantasize about them. I'm 99.999% certain my wife will never run away with Channing Tatum (Well. she might, I'm not sure he would, though!)

However, if our neighbour is Channing Tatum and he's just a regular 9-5 Joe, that change things.

Funny how we think about this, isn't it? We arbitrarily decide that so-and-so would never be interested in 'normal' people like us simply because of their profession and we deem it okay to have sexual fantasies about them. I'm sure famous people sleep with regular folks all the time, they just don't date or marry them.

I'll tell you a funny (somewhat related) story. My ex wife and I were at a concert in Seattle one night many years ago, checking out one of our favorite bands. We knew the tour photographer, and he brought us on the bus after the show, where we hung out and drank with them. This wasn't some no-name local band, either, they're extremely well-known internationally in their genre. Anyway, a couple of them were going to hit the dive bar across the road from the club, and they invited us along, so we joined. Didn't take me long before it clicked with me that my ex wife and I were having beers with her "Channing Tatum". Everything was cool, and there were no super awkward moments, but it did make me uncomfortable.

I can tell you, and it wasn't my imagination or self-esteem, but she most definitely forgot I was there... lol. Good thing I was, I guess? And to be fair, he didn't ignore me one bit, he was a gentleman and really very cool. He talked with me more than he did with her, and I'm sure that irked her. But she was being a borderline fan-girl, and I was just a dude talking to another dude about his dog and video games.

Definitely glad I was there for this, though...


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## heartsbeating (May 2, 2011)

Maybe the distance creates the fantasy? When you meet or know someone, they're no longer that illusion... or less of. 

And to contradict that sentiment, the sexy thing about a marriage or relationship, is knowing the ins and outs of one another (pun unintended) and being even more attracted because of the known realities.


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## samyeagar (May 14, 2012)

alexm said:


> Yep, this.
> 
> The irony is that somebody like Channing Tatum or (insert hunky Hollywood dude or lady here) are unattainable, thus making it 'okay' to fantasize about them. I'm 99.999% certain my wife will never run away with Channing Tatum (Well. she might, I'm not sure he would, though!)
> 
> ...


This ties in with what I originally posted, and what peacem expanded upon, and relates directly to my situation with my wife. No doubt, she can get all fan girly about some of her celebs, and honestly, I think her own shyness and insecurities would be what would put a stop to things if she ever found herself in a situation to do something. I am also virtually certain that the brakes wouldn't come on until there had been a healthy amount of touching and gushing first...the problem for me in this...I would be far more entertaining of her fantasy crushes and mind play if I felt the same level expression towards me. I don't, so I'm not.


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## samyeagar (May 14, 2012)

alexm said:


> Yep, this.
> 
> The irony is that somebody like Channing Tatum or (insert hunky Hollywood dude or lady here) are unattainable, thus making it 'okay' to fantasize about them. I'm 99.999% certain my wife will never run away with Channing Tatum (Well. she might, I'm not sure he would, though!)
> 
> ...


Complete side note here...I had the opportunity to spend a while talking to the bass player of a globally popular girl group before a concert, and she was my favorite member of the band...you know what we talked about the whole time? Star Trek.


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## wild jade (Jun 21, 2016)

I've met a few "stars". Turns out they're actually just people, and quite "attainable." 

Not sure that fantasizing about them is so different from fantasizing about the neighbour or co-worker.


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## samyeagar (May 14, 2012)

wild jade said:


> I've met a few "stars". Turns out they're actually just people, and quite "attainable."
> 
> Not sure that fantasizing about them is so different from fantasizing about the neighbour or co-worker.


I have never understood this idea that some people are safe, and others are not, and down the same line, things like celebrity free pass list and things like that. While I can't grasp that, there are a lot of people who do. I think it is the idea that they are unattainable, thus they are safe, and then compartmentalized away from reality. I just can't compartmentalize people like that...a person is a person whether they are on the big screen or taking my order in the drive through. Another very subtle thing often tied in too...Nothing would ever happen because I'll never meet them, and they probably would want to do anything with me anyway...for the celebrity. I would never do anything with them because I love you and want you...for the drive through worker.

While the end result is the same, nothing happening the path taken is very different...one is the person limiting things them selves, the other is putting the limiting factor on the other person.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

BetrayedDad said:


> Idk, if a naked person having sex with you in the moment isn't enough to rev you up then I kind of think it is a problem.
> 
> I've fantasized about other women in the past mainly because the few I did it with at the time were overweight.
> 
> After a year of sex with my current girlfriend, I haven't one time. I'm also super attracted to her. I don't think this is a coincidence.


Sure you're going to fantasize more when there are relationship problems. And what relationship doesn't have problems?? (other than new ones of course  ) If my hubby wants to get frisky when I am not 100% in the mood and I am ok with 'taking one for the team', there have been times that I've used mind movies to get more turned on. I mean, I could just lay there if I wanted to send him a clear message, but why do it then? I would rather him have an enjoyable experience, and part of that for him is me being turned on. When I'm all revved up and rarin to go and he isn't, I'm pretty sure it once in a while takes him thinking of a fantasy (I know a threesome is one of his, me and some other woman, not a specific one) to satisfy me too. The reason might be that he's a bit sick or kinda tired - the older one gets the harder it is to get hard on demand, or so I am told


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## bilbag (Aug 3, 2016)

My W acts like she has low desire for sex. So if she needs to fantasize about having sex then that would contradict her words. And such fantasizing would trouble me. If she was a different creature who craves sex then it wouldn't bother me. I am that creature and it doesn't bother me because fantasizing is better than realizing.


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