# agree or disagree?



## CallaLily (Jan 13, 2011)

Ok a friend was telling me last night what her counselor had told her, actually two different ones, and they both said the same things.

She had seen a counselor a few months ago due to her marital problems. After a few months with that counselor I think she switched to see what that counselor said. That one said the same as the first one. 

It went something like this. They both said, if a person chooses to stay in a unhealthy situation, weather its abuse of any kind, cheating, whatever the case, if that spouse chooses to stay, even though they know its a bad situation, they really have no right to continue on complaining about it. There are other options, and if the other spouse hasn't changed their ways etc, but, if you feel you have changed your ways and behavior, attitudes etc, towards your spouse regardless of what they are doing and you choose to stay, then stop whining about the fact you have chosen to stay in that situation. 

They said, most of the time other people get tired of hearing the same old song and dance from someone who chooses to stay when the same bad things keep on happening. If you're going to keep complaining about it, chances are you probably made the wrong choice to stay and should probably leave to get on with your life.

Agree? Disagree?


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## greeneyeddolphin (May 31, 2010)

I think, if you are aware of why the relationship is bad, and you have done all you can to change it, and your partner refuses to try, or has tried but things are still the same, and you stay in the relationship with that knowledge...yeah, you really shouldn't continue to complain. If you've done all you can to change it, and it still doesn't change and is clear it won't change, complaining about it isn't going to change it. If you choose to stay, then you're choosing to accept it as it is. If you don't want to accept it as it is, then leave.


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## CallaLily (Jan 13, 2011)

atruckersgirl said:


> I think, if you are aware of why the relationship is bad, and you have done all you can to change it, and your partner refuses to try, or has tried but things are still the same, and you stay in the relationship with that knowledge...yeah, you really shouldn't continue to complain. If you've done all you can to change it, and it still doesn't change and is clear it won't change, complaining about it isn't going to change it. If you choose to stay, then you're choosing to accept it as it is. If you don't want to accept it as it is, then leave.


:iagree: I think too, she was saying the counselor was meaning too, that if things are still the same, and you choose to stay but you still complain, then obviously you haven't accepted it. Because if you did, you wouldn't still be whining about the same issues


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## Well_Spouse (Feb 2, 2011)

CallaLily said:


> Ok a friend was telling me last night what her counselor had told her, actually two different ones, and they both said the same things.
> 
> It went something like this. They both said, if a person chooses to stay in a unhealthy situation, weather its abuse of any kind, cheating, whatever the case, if that spouse chooses to stay, even though they know its a bad situation, they really have no right to continue on complaining about it.


:iagree:

Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. Albert Einstein

Someplace between the 1st and 15th time you catch your husband in bed with another woman. You cross the line into insanity to expect that he will change.


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## MarriedWifeInLove (May 28, 2010)

I agree.

But that doesn't mean you still can't vent. Have to get those feelings out somewhere, somehow or you will just explode!

And that is what TAM is for. If people don't want to read about your whinning, then move to another thread.

Freedom of choice here on what you want to read.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Lilly,

It's a bit more complicated than that.

If you simply cite the behavior of your partner as a reason to leave - and do not look inward at your own issues - you "may" go from relationship to relationship and achieve those same "results" on your own.


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## Jamison (Feb 10, 2011)

I agree. It does get old after awhile listening to someone go on and on about their troubles after they have been offered suggestions and solutions, and then choosing to stay in a not so good relationship. 

I agree with being able to vent at times, but maybe to a degree, should be short lived.It pretty much means you haven't accepted the fact things are the way they are by choosing to stay, if so, even the venting would be few and far between. I've been on other forums to, and people would be on there for months and even years, complaining about the same situation they have always been in because nothing changed and they choose to stay. So eventually the ones who offered support and advice will grow tired of the same song and dance too, and slowly begin to back off certain threads because of it. Seen it happen on other forums as I'm sure it does on most.


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## major misfit (Oct 17, 2010)

I agree with what the counselors said...but...I believe that a person can vent away if they like. It might be the only outlet they have. You can always choose to not read. 

I can only imagine if I'd had a message board such as TAM when I was going through my issues in my last marriage. No doubt everyone would have been screaming bloody murder at me. And as hard headed as I am, I would have still hung on to the hope for change. 

It's when the proverbial straw hits the fan (lol) and one has had enough of the situation and themselves that the madness stops.


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## greeneyeddolphin (May 31, 2010)

I think there's a difference between venting and the kind of complaining I think the counselor was referring to. It's one thing to say "omg, he drives me nuts when he X" or "I hate it when she Y," and then feeling better and moving on. But when they are still, months or years later saying "I hate it when he/she does Z, how can I get them to change?" that is the situation in which I feel they need to either deal and stop or get out of the relationship. Accepting the situation and sometimes feeling the need to talk about it is one thing, still expecting the person to change even when you know they won't is a problem.


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## major misfit (Oct 17, 2010)

I totally agree with you, Truckersgirl...there's a "but" here. There are those who hold out hope forever, it seems. And they CAN still be looking for that change years later, b/c nothing has sunk in. They refuse to give up. Like a dog with a bone, kwim? It's that hindsight vision, having left relationships that weren't working that you are able to SEE.


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## trey69 (Dec 29, 2010)

I agree with what they counselors said too. As far as venting goes, sure I can see that, we all need that outlets sometimes. 

However, after months go by etc, the venting can become enmeshed with the complaining and after awhile its hard to tell tell what is what and hard to separate the two, they get rolled up in one.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

major misfit said:


> I totally agree with you, Truckersgirl...there's a "but" here. There are those who hold out hope forever, it seems. And they CAN still be looking for that change years later, b/c nothing has sunk in. They refuse to give up. Like a dog with a bone, kwim? It's that hindsight vision, having left relationships that weren't working that you are able to SEE.


This is why working on yourself is so important.

Yes, we need to vent.

But, if it becomes a "pattern", it's actually a TRAILHEAD back to our own issues.

They're either doing "it" in response to something we allow them to do OR we need to gin up the self-respect to call them on it.

EITHER WAY - working on yourself is the obvious answer.

What saddens me is that there are so so many who simply won't.

Those are the ones that exhaust me.


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## credamdóchasgra (Sep 24, 2010)

Conrad said:


> This is why working on yourself is so important.
> 
> Yes, we need to vent.
> 
> ...


I know for myself, I'm afraid that if I work on myself, it'll be at the expense of my H working on himself too.
And I'm conflicted by that desire to "work *together.*"
but it's not a refusal to work on myself. I want to do both---work on myself AND on the relationship (or I want to know he's working on himself too)

I hope I'm not one of those who exhaust you, Conrad!
Maybe I'm over-personalizing. It would be the right time of the month for hyper-sensitivity.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Let not your heart be troubled.

If people exhaust me, I let them know.

I have good boundaries.


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## credamdóchasgra (Sep 24, 2010)

Conrad said:


> Let not your heart be troubled.
> 
> If people exhaust me, I let them know.
> 
> I have good boundaries.


Honesty + Empathy = Refreshing
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## michzz (Jun 6, 2008)

There can be intervening factors, such as the health of children with serious illnesses, that prevent leaving.


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## AgentD (Dec 27, 2010)

Yep I agree with what they said. It gets old, if no one is going to go any further to make changes and/or they stay. 

Whether in RL or in a forum, its gets old at some point. It happend to be in RL too, love a good friend, was there for her for years through her bad time with her husband. Suggestions were made by family, friends and counselors, she didn't take any advice. Stayed in the harmful situation, so at some point I got so burnt out on listening too it, even though I loved her, I felt emotionally drained.I had to move on, felt she was pulling me down too. Its sad but it does happen, unfortunately some people just never get it.


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## less_disgruntled (Oct 16, 2010)

Conrad said:


> Lilly,
> 
> It's a bit more complicated than that.
> 
> If you simply cite the behavior of your partner as a reason to leave - and do not look inward at your own issues - you "may" go from relationship to relationship and achieve those same "results" on your own.



This. I hate to sound like a sadomasochist but if you've 'fixed' most of your worst issues and you stay in a relationship that drags you down--you haven't fixed those issues.

OTOH, you might be strongly religious, in it for the money, etc., in which case, I can empathize, but I'm pretty sure at some point you're going to find a relief valve (i.e., an affair).


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