# Attorney/Collabortive Divorce or Mediator?



## Stressedandsad (Jan 29, 2014)

I know divorce can be very expensive, especially if you can't agree on terms. From what I read the average divorce costs $10,000. Is that what others have experienced? 

Is mediation really less expensive?  I see most also charge by the hour and it can take many sessions to get everything written and agreed upon.

What have others done here?

P.S. Assets will be quite substantial and somewhat complicated if that makes a difference. Probably will agree on most things though....I think...?


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## Ceegee (Sep 9, 2012)

How are things between you and STBX?

My collaborative D cost me $80k. 

It was a horrible experience because XW was high conflict from the beginning. 

After a year of meetings we scrapped the collaborative D and finished it all in one day of mediation. 

Litigation would have cost even more and been even more stressful.


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## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

Ex and I quite simply couldn't afford separate attorneys trying to fight for more money we didn't have anyway.

We used a mediator. Cost roughly 3500 dollars.

I have a family member that used an online resource. They both simply signed it and submitted the forms they needed to. Couple of hundred bucks tops.

Conversely, I dated a woman who when everything was said and done, involving no fewer than 6 court appearances, estimated her divorce cost 300,000 dollars.


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## evolver (Dec 3, 2013)

STBXW and I already agreed on everything, and no kids are involved, so we're going to try the mediator route. We both consulted attorneys first, just to get an understanding of where we both stood. Going that route would've cost at least 6K, but likely much more.

Some mediators just want to mediate, then the agreement goes to each spouse's attorney. I found one that handles the whole process, with no attorneys. She estimated one or two sessions at $350/pc, plus $750 to handle the divorce paperwork. $1450 total. It seems like a good option for us. Our first mediation appointment is next Thursday. Hopefully it goes well.


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## C3156 (Jun 13, 2012)

How your divorce goes down really depends on the people involved. If you can both sit down and not let greed, anger, or pride get in the way, you may get out easily. If even one person decides to fight, it can get ugly.

First things first, do you have children? If so, have you agreed to custody yet? There is no reason that you should both not be able to have 50% of the time. Don't fall into the mindset that kids need their mom at your expense. Kids need both parents to grow up healthy and balanaced. I would not budge on 50/50.

Everything else are material items. Keep in mind that most stuff is replaceable. You can use that as a bagaining chip if there are things you know that she wants but you could care less about.

You asked what the rest of us did. As much as I wanted my ex to suffer for all the crap I endured, I did swallow my pride to make the divorce go easier. We were of modest means anyway, so there really was not a whole lot to split. 

You have to look at this as a business deal and treat it as such. Once the emotions kind of cleared, we literally took a pad of paper and walked around the house and cataloged everything. Did the same with bank accounts and investments. Divided everything roughly in the middle, done. We both expected 50/50 with our kids, so that was not an issue. The only thing was child support which we had to negotiate. That took some back and forth.

I had a lawyer buddy who gave me the forms to fill out and file with the court. After the waiting period, $165 dollars, and an hour for court, it was over. It worked for us because my ex was pretty matter of fact and reasonable with her demands. In a way I am glad that we did not to fight, because several years down the road at least our kids seem to have made it through pretty well and we can have discussions without the malice that seems to surround contested divorces.


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## Stressedandsad (Jan 29, 2014)

Very early stages but I think we'd be pretty civil for most things. I thought child support was a simple calculator based on income(s)?

Assets divided 50% shouldn't be a problem. Custody would be about 80% me and 20% him since he will be living in a different country and also travels quite a bit for his job. I think we can work this schedule out ourselves though.

The sticking point is going to be alimony. 

Good to hear mediation is an option that could keep costs down but what if our assets are legally complicated. REal estate in two different States and we are also part of an LLC with commercial property.


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## Pluto2 (Aug 17, 2011)

Remember mediation is only as good as the mediator and offers no enforcement powers, so if there is a sticking point it could present a problem to a swift resolution. Just be forewarned.


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## Ceegee (Sep 9, 2012)

Stressedandsad said:


> Very early stages but I think we'd be pretty civil for most things. I thought child support was a simple calculator based on income(s)?
> 
> Assets divided 50% shouldn't be a problem. Custody would be about 80% me and 20% him since he will be living in a different country and also travels quite a bit for his job. I think we can work this schedule out ourselves though.
> 
> ...


Other professionals can be brought in as tools.

As Pluto states, the quality of the mediator figures highly.

Next time I get divorced I'll definitely go with mediation from the get go.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Deejo said:


> Conversely, I dated a woman who when everything was said and done, involving no fewer than 6 court appearances, estimated her divorce cost 300,000 dollars.


That's what I'd call a red flag.


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## lenzi (Apr 10, 2012)

Stressedandsad said:


> I know divorce can be very expensive, especially if you can't agree on terms. From what I read the average divorce costs $10,000. Is that what others have experienced?


My divorce was highly contested and litigated over a 3 year period and went to trial, which is not typical.

Combined costs from both sides were about $250,000.



Stressedandsad said:


> Is mediation really less expensive?


Yes, much faster and you can't even begin to compare the costs between mediation and a litigated divorce. They aren't anywhere near on the same scale.



Stressedandsad said:


> What have others done here?


I tried numerous times during my divorce to settle with my exwife. She refused every single time. Ultimately she got pretty much what I offered from the start. She was led to believe by her "high powered", man hating attorneys that she would get so much more. She bought in, we both lost. 



Stressedandsad said:


> Assets will be quite substantial and somewhat complicated if that makes a difference. Probably will agree on most things though....I think...?


What makes a difference is how reasonable both parties are.

If you're on the same page in regards to asset distribution and any issues of support or custody then you could get it done through mediation, save a ton of money, but also it will be finished much faster and you probably won't be nearly as emotionally traumatized as you would be with a drawn out ugly court process which brings out the worst in people.



Deejo said:


> Conversely, I dated a woman who when everything was said and done, involving no fewer than 6 court appearances, estimated her divorce cost 300,000 dollars.


Is she a good looking hispanic who's really into anal, and her name starts with "M"?

If so, I'd cut her loose. If I knew now what I knew then, we wouldn't have had a second date.


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## Zanne (Dec 7, 2012)

Dang, divorce is more expensive than I thought! I may end up married for another 25 years.


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## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

*Re: Re: Attorney/Collabortive Divorce or Mediator?*



Conrad said:


> That's what I'd call a red flag.


The husband was a diagnosed sociopath. He was prepared to sign over full custody of their kids, until his mother raked him over the coals for even thinking about it.


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## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

*Re: Re: Attorney/Collabortive Divorce or Mediator?*



Stressedandsad said:


> The sticking point is going to be alimony.


I made it crystal clear to my ex and the mediator that I would do time before I paid a dime of alimony.

One of the reasons for our collapse was her refusal to work. I certainly wasnt going to reward that choice in divorce. Much to her credit, she waived it.

Had she not, we would have had a very different set of circumstances.


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## lenzi (Apr 10, 2012)

Deejo said:


> I made it crystal clear to my ex and the mediator that I would do time before I paid a dime of alimony.
> 
> One of the reasons for our collapse was her refusal to work. I certainly wasnt going to reward that choice in divorce. Much to her credit, she waived it.
> 
> Had she not, we would have had a very different set of circumstances.


You probably would have done time.

You played hardball and you won, but truth be told if your marriage was of long enough duration, in most states, her refusal to work would probably not have prevented a court from awarding alimony, and although I don't know you, I'd think that when it all came down, as painful as it might have been, you would have written the check rather than sharing a cell with a guy named Bubba.



Deejo said:


> The husband was a diagnosed sociopath.


Now I'm sure we're talking about my exwife!

**

In this case, it's possible that they can work out most of the issues in mediation and leave alimony up to the courts. Or maybe the OP could request a couple of years of support and her STBX would agree, in order to stay out of court, or else she could offer something up in the joint marital assets in exchange for a few years of support, something like that.

Mediation doesn't have to be all or nothing, although it would be great if all the issues were resolved. Anything that can be worked out is that much less time and money in legal expenses.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

*My goodness! Just hearing all of these woeful stories is quite enough for me to remove the words "I do" from my vocabulary entirely!*


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## honcho (Oct 5, 2013)

If you could get by under 10 grand you are fortunate. Between the my stbx and myself we got over 25 grand invested now and are at the exact point we were the day she filed…..nowhere and we don’t have children involved, nor any significant assets. I haven’t even received an offer to settle yet after a year.

If you two are still civil to each other and you can go the mediation route, its in the best interests. You have been married a long time so you stbx does know already he is going to be on the hook for alimony, its just the number he will cry about. 

You know your financial situation best but another alternative is to maybe take a great share of assets in lieu of alimony or reduced alimony something along those lines if that can work for you financially. From a mind set standpoint, the alimony payment is a constant reminder the divorce and maybe a lump sum payment or an unequal asset division would work better. It also cuts the ties and you have one less reason to think about your former spouse. 

Too many times lawyers make the situation way more complicated by design, its how they make money and while you may have a couple of complicated items asset wise to work out its really as hard or as easy as the two of you make it. If you can keep the emotions in check and focus more on the business end you will be far better off. 

Really it comes down to how reasonable the two of you want to be and as so many will tell you the faster an agreement get worked out the better and mediation usually works much faster, does cost less. Once two lawyers get involved the whole divorce seems to take on a whole expensive life of its own and the only victory is two lawyers made a bunch of money. Whatever budget number you think lawyers will cost, double it, then add some more.


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## Stressedandsad (Jan 29, 2014)

Bringing this back up to the top since it looks like WS and I are officially heading towards divorce. We have sizeable assets and I should also get spousal support. Our finances are pretty complicated. He wants to go through a mediator and try to agree on everything ahead of time so we don't blow through a ton of money. I agree with that but want to make sure I'm not shortchanging myself.

I met with an attorney for a consultation already and I like her. She said she could also provide "coaching" and she will go over the final agreement to make sure I'm not forgetting something or there is a tax liability I'm not aware of. 

Does this sound like a good way to go. I agree with WS that I don't want to give it all away to lawyers. I just want to be sure I'm not getting short changed.

This is a very scary next step. I'm still so devastated that he does not want to work it out.


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## Stressedandsad (Jan 29, 2014)

Deejo said:


> Ex and I quite simply couldn't afford separate attorneys trying to fight for more money we didn't have anyway.
> 
> We used a mediator. Cost roughly 3500 dollars.
> 
> ...


Why do you think the mediator was still 3500? Did you not agree on something or is that for just for meetings?


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## Stressedandsad (Jan 29, 2014)

evolver said:


> STBXW and I already agreed on everything, and no kids are involved, so we're going to try the mediator route. We both consulted attorneys first, just to get an understanding of where we both stood. Going that route would've cost at least 6K, but likely much more.
> 
> Some mediators just want to mediate, then the agreement goes to each spouse's attorney. I found one that handles the whole process, with no attorneys. She estimated one or two sessions at $350/pc, plus $750 to handle the divorce paperwork. $1450 total. It seems like a good option for us. Our first mediation appointment is next Thursday. Hopefully it goes well.


You'll have to update us after a few more meetings and see if it still turns out to be only $1450


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## brokenbythis (Aug 21, 2011)

Mine cost under $1000. We both consulted attorneys to see what our rights and obligations were. We got the family court attorney to do the child support and alimony calculations. We split everything 50% and agreed on child custody/visitation ourselves since we both love our son and we were mature enough to realize there is no fight there.

We had a few bumps along with way but in the end we did everything ourselves.

Thank god... I can't even imagine fighting to the death. What do you achieve? You are flushing your own money down the drain.


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## Stressedandsad (Jan 29, 2014)

brokenbythis said:


> Mine cost under $1000. We both consulted attorneys to see what our rights and obligations were. We got the family court attorney to do the child support and alimony calculations. We split everything 50% and agreed on child custody/visitation ourselves since we both love our son and we were mature enough to realize there is no fight there.
> 
> We had a few bumps along with way but in the end we did everything ourselves.
> 
> Thank god... I can't even imagine fighting to the death. What do you achieve? You are flushing your own money down the drain.


So you both had consults with 2 different attorney's and then the family court attorney? So 3 attorney's all under $1000? Wow! They must not have charged much.

I'm curious as to how they came up with the alimony amount. That's what I'm struggling with.


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## brokenbythis (Aug 21, 2011)

Stressedandsad said:


> So you both had consults with 2 different attorney's and then the family court attorney? So 3 attorney's all under $1000? Wow! They must not have charged much.
> 
> I'm curious as to how they came up with the alimony amount. That's what I'm struggling with.


I paid to see an attorney = 1.5 hrs. He paid to see a different attorney = 1 hr. The family court facilitator/attorney is free.

I paid to file the petition and service fees $500. He paid the same amount to respond. We spent under $1000 each. And we had a lot of assets to divide.

The alimony was a guideline calculated by the family court attorney and we both agreed on it. Thing is, in California... long term marriages, there's is really nothing to fight about. Its all split 50% and you get alimony if you've been a stay at home mom for 10 yrs like I had.


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## evolver (Dec 3, 2013)

Stressedandsad said:


> You'll have to update us after a few more meetings and see if it still turns out to be only $1450


We had our first, and I think only mediation session. It turned out to be a bit more because she charged a separate fee for a property agreement. Also, we went overtime. The mediation part went really fast and smooth. Then the mediator asked if there was any chance of reconciliation, and my STBXW flipped out and took us into OT. I described the scene in my own thread, so I won't repeat it here.

$2260 total.

$350/hr
$175 overtime
$750 property agreement paperwork
$750 divorce paperwork and procedures
$235 misc document fees

We did each consult attorneys when this whole thing started, just to know what our rights and options were. Mine cost $150. I think hers was about the same.

Also, we could've done the divorce paperwork ourselves. We chose to pay the mediator to do it because it was confusing and we didn't want to mess it up.


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## Stressedandsad (Jan 29, 2014)

brokenbythis said:


> I paid to see an attorney = 1.5 hrs. He paid to see a different attorney = 1 hr. The family court facilitator/attorney is free.
> 
> I paid to file the petition and service fees $500. He paid the same amount to respond. We spent under $1000 each. And we had a lot of assets to divide.
> 
> The alimony was a guideline calculated by the family court attorney and we both agreed on it. Thing is, in California... long term marriages, there's is really nothing to fight about. Its all split 50% and you get alimony if you've been a stay at home mom for 10 yrs like I had.


Yes, been home with kids for 15 years. I'll have to look up California. I'm in Oregon and there doesn't seem to be a clear "calculator" It's up to the parties to decide and if they can't a judge will but each judge uses his or her own discretion.

Thanks!


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## Stressedandsad (Jan 29, 2014)

evolver said:


> We had our first, and I think only mediation session. It turned out to be a bit more because she charged a separate fee for a property agreement. Also, we went overtime. The mediation part went really fast and smooth. Then the mediator asked if there was any chance of reconciliation, and my STBXW flipped out and took us into OT. I described the scene in my own thread, so I won't repeat it here.
> 
> $2260 total.
> 
> ...


That seems a little closer to what I've been hearing but I can see how it's so individual depending on the fireworks.


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