# Let's talk about large vaginas



## knobcreek

So much attention is given to small penises that I think the large vagina deserves a discussion. I think the large vag is a much bigger issue contributing to bad sex. After children, lots of sex, over-sized dildo use, general laziness and sloppiness, or pure genetics, the vagina can reach a size and looseness to where even the most well endowed man can't achieve much enjoyment from it.

I've dealt with large vagina a few times in my life, once was in H.S. where the girl just had a massive vagina. I knew from a few friends who slept with her, but I was amazed at the cavernous feel of it, like throwing a hot dog down a hallway (I'm above average length and girth so it's not a penis size issue). Other times I suspect it was from child birth or just getting smashed a lot. My wife's is OK after 4 kids, but nothing like it was.

With all the focus of women on penis size, I think it's time for a discussion about the large vaginas out there ruining sex for men.


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## Blondilocks

LOL. You get what you pay for.


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## Livvie

OP you really think that "lots of sex" results in a huge, oversized, no good vagina? Wow.

Ladies, this is one to share with your LD married friends who need a new valid excuse to not have sex with their husband. Not tonight dear, too much sex will result in a loose useless vagina you won't enjoy anymore.

Men: beware having too much sex with your partner. Too much sex with you and her vagina will become cavernous.


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## arbitrator

*Come on! It's really nothing that a good OB/Gyn can't take care of in minor outpatient surgery!*


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## aine

I guess an over-sized vagina can be rectified as Arb points out but an undersized penis, not much can be done about that.


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## Ynot

knobcreek said:


> So much attention is given to small penises that I think the large vagina deserves a discussion. I think the large vag is a much bigger issue contributing to bad sex. After children, lots of sex, over-sized dildo use, general laziness and sloppiness, or pure genetics, the vagina can reach a size and looseness to where even the most well endowed man can't achieve much enjoyment from it.
> 
> I've dealt with large vagina a few times in my life, once was in H.S. where the girl just had a massive vagina. I knew from a few friends who slept with her, but I was amazed at the cavernous feel of it, like throwing a hot dog down a hallway (I'm above average length and girth so it's not a penis size issue). Other times I suspect it was from child birth or just getting smashed a lot. My wife's is OK after 4 kids, but nothing like it was.
> 
> With all the focus of women on penis size, I think it's time for a discussion about the large vaginas out there ruining sex for men.


I am still trying to figure out who is more concerned about penis size. So far I have yet to see too much focus on it from women but much more from guys who are a little insecure about it.
I think vaginas, like penises come in all shapes and sizes. If you happen upon one that is "too large" perhaps it is just you aren't approaching it the right way. I also think the size of the vagina is somewhat related to being the appropriate weight. My ex was nice and tight when she was weight appropriate but when she dieted she would get more loose due to the lack of fatty tissue.
I am not saying vagina size doesn't fluctuate but I highly doubt it is ruining sex for so many men that it is an issue


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## Don't Panic

Ynot said:


> I am still trying to figure out who is more concerned about penis size. So far I have yet to see too much focus on it from women but much more from guys who are a little insecure about it.
> I think vaginas, like penises come in all shapes and sizes. If you happen upon one that is "too large" perhaps it is just you aren't approaching it the right way. I also think the size of the vagina is somewhat related to being the appropriate weight.* My ex was nice and tight when she was weight appropriate but when she dieted she would get more loose due to the lack of fatty tissue.*
> I am not saying vagina size doesn't fluctuate but I highly doubt it is ruining sex for so many men that it is an issue


Best thing I've learned this weekend! Bring on the coconut gelato >


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## SunCMars

Ynot said:


> My ex was nice and tight when she was weight appropriate but when she dieted she would get more loose *due to the lack of fatty tissue.*


Good technical observation. I have noted this myself.
Before marriage....thank you. :grin2:

You cannot wear the thing out.

Mother Nature takes care of her girls. 

I love Mother Nature, not when she puts on a long red dress. :surprise:

Father Time? He is an *******. :banhim:


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## SunCMars

Blondilocks said:


> LOL. You get what you pay for.


For THIS.

Chump change.

It it the Hidden Costs that bring down the Sperm Bank.


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## SlowlyGoingCrazy

As a woman, there is certainly such a thing as a too small penis. I don't buy into the BS of size doesn't matter and only men care about penis size. 

Vaginas can be tightened with kegals. Doesn't take much. 

My bf enjoys using large dildos on me and stretching, eventually working up to fisting someday. That plus 2 kids and a hell of a lot of sex, everything is just how it should be. 

He has an above average sized penis though. If he had less girth it could eventually be a problem but then I wouldn't be with him if he did anyway.


ETA I ask my bf often how my vagina is doing, the only time it feels bigger is directly after using a large dildo. After an hour or so it goes back to normal.


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## SunCMars

knobcreek said:


> With all the focus of women on penis size, I think it's time for a discussion about the large vaginas out there ruining sex for men.


Ahem!

On your Avatar name....

Does your Knob Creak upon insertion?
Use more lube.....

Or less lube for more Resistance when going head to head with the 'Hole in the Wall' gang. Those outlaw babes make their nest in Johnson County, Wyoming.

As I see it. Less friction equals more loving time on the job. 
I know, I know....women love friction too, three, four...give me more.

I have some other suggestions. I will leave them under your' bed. Not mine.


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## Blondilocks

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> As a woman, there is certainly such a thing as a too small penis. I don't buy into the BS of size doesn't matter and only men care about penis size.
> 
> Vaginas can be tightened with kegals. Doesn't take much.
> 
> My bf enjoys using large dildos on me and stretching, eventually working up to fisting someday. That plus 2 kids and a hell of a lot of sex, everything is just how it should be.
> 
> He has an above average sized penis though. If he had less girth it could eventually be a problem but then I wouldn't be with him if he did anyway.
> 
> 
> ETA I ask my bf often how my vagina is doing, the only time it feels bigger is directly after using a large dildo. After an hour or so it goes back to normal.


If only I had a nickel for every time you make a statement and I wonder 'WTH?'.
Different strokes or, erm, fists.


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## Satya

Well, I guess I must be a wizard's sleeve, then.


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## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Blondilocks said:


> If only I had a nickel for every time you make a statement and I wonder 'WTH?'.
> Different strokes or, erm, fists.


Fisting isn't that much of an out there kink. Pretty common porn search even for vanilla people. I forget sometimes I'm not around my kinky friends, something like that wouldn't even get a blink. 

I had assumed it would be a lot easier though, you watch porn and it looks easy. I've had months of training and I'm not even close so no one should just try to shove a fist in there. It's certainly not like porn. 


Also you can try using a vagina pump to make things feel a lot tighter temporarily. It just swells everything up so things are super snug. Penis pumps can also temporarily increase his size too. She can use the penis pump too but the ones made for the vagina are more comfortable so if you plan on keeping it on for 30 minutes or longer, get one for each. 

It is a dramatic difference.


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## Bibi1031

Just wow. So if I follow OP nonsense, then when my wisdom teeth needed to be pulled out my oral surgeon ruined my mouth forever. He pulled and stretched that sucker real bad that he pretty much should have disfigured my face. Well thatt didn't happen. 

What about the use and abuse I had on my X husband's penis? With that type of treatment his genitals should hit the floor and he probably should have to roll them up like a cigar and never go comando or his penis would cause him to trip and fall. :surprise:

How about those porn stars that get their mouths jammed with thrusting penises for long periods of time during film making? No amount of makeup is going to bring their mouths back to normal, yet I don't see a bunch of porn stars with gigantic mouths stretched way out of proportion.>.

The ignorance of some people is frankly mind boggling

. :scratchhead::scratchhead::scratchhead:

These are just a few examples that aren't so gross yet quite commicall in a twisted sort of way.

Shall I use as an example a porn star's famous anus? Wink wink


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## wild jade

@knobcreek, your OP only shows how little you know about the anatomy and function of a vagina. What you propose is about as silly as suggesting that a guy's penis got smaller from too much sex, banging it against all those cervixes. Or maybe jut wearing too tight pants. 

:lol:


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## Primrose

Satya said:


> Well, I guess I must be a wizard's sleeve, then.


Same. Three kids and a whole hell of a lot of sex. My poor boyfriend 

Random, but I once had a guy friend state that I must have a "small vagina" because my kids have small heads. :scratchhead::rofl:


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## 23cm

Brings to mind the old joke the punch line to which is: 

"'Help me find my flashlight and we can find our way out.' 'Hell, help me find my car keys and we can drive out.'"


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## ConanHub

knobcreek said:


> With all the focus of women on penis size, I think it's time for a discussion about the large vaginas out there ruining sex for men.


Ok. So I love talking about vaginas and penises.

I'm willing to read this whole thread and discuss this very interesting topic.

I will, however, immediately take issue with the part of your post quoted above.

The majority of penis posts have seemed to be male in origin. I very much appreciate the women of TAM that have given female insight into any topic, penis size included, but haven't seen that women have been very focused on the topic.

Seems to be more male driven interest, at least as far as posting goes.


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## ConanHub

OP.

Vaginas are amazing and I am so damn grateful God made them!

Next. They are very adaptable.

Yes, some women naturally have easier access but exercise as well as overall health can keep things snug.

Men come in all sizes and the amazing vagina can adapt to most if not all with the right stimulation.

Mrs. Conan is approaching 60. Had two children, many partners before me and in the 26 years I have been dominating her body, she has had her lady bits smashed to post orgasmic mush far more times than I can remember.

We had sex twice yesterday and even after foreplay and oral sex culminating in her climax, I still had to gently, slowly enter her very well used vagina.
The second time was easier but she was still deliciously snug.

Also. When I get her really aroused, I know she is capable of handling a far larger tool than I am working with. It doesn't mean her vagina is any less snug but it gets more elastic.

Her first husband was simply enormous downstairs and she had to be able to accommodate him, yet she is still extremely satisfying to me.

One of the snuggest women I have been with.

Women are adaptable and it is awesome because men are made to be adapted to, at least as far as intercourse goes.

BTW. I am easily the best lover she has ever had and her first husband doesn't even make the good lover list.

There really is a lot to sex. Relative penis size is actually probably a better topic because men have what they have for the most part and women can and do adapt to different sizes from their first experience to their last, they are stretching to accommodate a penis.


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## NextTimeAround

Ynot said:


> I am still trying to figure out who is more concerned about penis size. So far I have yet to see too much focus on it from women but much more from guys who are a little insecure about it.
> I think vaginas, like penises come in all shapes and sizes. If you happen upon one that is "too large" perhaps it is just you aren't approaching it the right way. I also think the size of the vagina is somewhat related to being the appropriate weight. *My ex was nice and tight when she was weight appropriate but when she dieted she would get more loose due to the lack of fatty tissue.*
> I am not saying vagina size doesn't fluctuate but I highly doubt it is ruining sex for so many men that it is an issue


I have heard that it is very thin women who have larger vaginas.


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## ConanHub

NextTimeAround said:


> I have heard that it is very thin women who have larger vaginas.


I don't think you can really tell. I have been with skinny girls that I could barely fit and girls on the chubby side that were just as tight.

There have been two women who were in moderately good shape and young that took me with ease and room to spare! LOL!

Mrs. Conan is fit and short and has about the same size as a 6'2" amazon I was with except the Amazon might have more easily handled the length. They were both equally tight.


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## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Yes Conan, a woman who is aroused will be more elasticity but will also be more grippy. 

A man having an issue with vagina size should make sure she is actually enjoying so her body is responding. That and when she Os should feel like kegals. The better she Os the harder it gets until she literally pushes you out of her due to the force. 
One reason I am in "training" so I can still accommodate a penis during a good O and keep going.


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## Ynot

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> Yes Conan, a woman who is aroused will be more elasticity but will also be more grippy.
> 
> A man having an issue with vagina size should make sure she is actually enjoying so her body is responding. That and when she Os should feel like kegals. The better she Os the harder it gets until she literally pushes you out of her due to the force.
> One reason I am in "training" so I can still accommodate a penis during a good O and keep going.


Training - I like that. It is always amazing to me that people don't make the effort to strive to enjoy and enhance something they will (hopefully) get to do on a regular basis. Instead, just like in life, we see so many people just settle for whatever life gives them. They usually experience a reciprocal level of effort regardless of what the activity is.


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## Ynot

wild jade said:


> @knobcreek, your OP only shows how little you know about the anatomy and function of a vagina. What you propose is about as silly as suggesting that a guy's penis got smaller from too much sex, banging it against all those cervixes. Or maybe jut wearing too tight pants.
> 
> :lol:


There is an old saying about a woman screwing you down to a nub, so maybe there is some truth to that haha!


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## *Deidre*

This thread takes ''tmi'' to a whole new level.

:surprise::|


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## Ynot

*Deidre* said:


> This thread takes ''tmi'' to a whole new level.
> 
> :surprise::|


You can never have to much information unless you wish to remain ignorant.


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## ThaMatrix

This is a little ridiculous. Im a decent size and after a couple days of no sex my wife seems to tighten back up. Even after she uses a very large dildo she goes right back to normal after a few days. I think both of us would rather her have a loose vagina than for me to have a small penis.


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## Not

Wasn't there a recent thread on the negative impact on vaginas in women who don't have sex often? So we're damned if we do and damned if we don't? I haven't had sex in just under seven years now, maybe I better go grab a mirror and make sure she's still there at all! Gotta make sure she didn't get so tight she disappeared!


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## arbitrator

ConanHub said:


> I don't think you can really tell. I have been with skinny girls that I could barely fit and girls on the chubby side that were just as tight.
> 
> There have been two women who were in moderately good shape and young that took me with ease and room to spare! LOL!
> 
> Mrs. Conan is fit and short and has about the same size as a 6'2" amazon I was with except the Amazon might have more easily handled the length. They were both equally tight.


*Damn! All of this talk about "tightness" is getting this near-celibate old fart severely worked up!

Do any of your wives have any good-looking single girlfriends?*


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## knobcreek

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> Yes Conan, a woman who is aroused will be more elasticity but will also be more grippy.
> 
> A man having an issue with vagina size should make sure she is actually enjoying so her body is responding. .


Always the mans fault, even with massive vaginas lol... Of course.

Seriously though, kegals are great I do them to help with climax control, but they will not transform a large vagina to a small vagina. Large vaginas are real, they are among us.


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## arbitrator

23cm said:


> Brings to mind the old joke the punch line to which is:
> 
> "'Help me find my flashlight and we can find our way out.' 'Hell, help me find my car keys and we can drive out.'"


*Back in my collegiate days, I was busy doing oral on this sorority chick. Now I don't want to say that she was overly large or anything, but when my jaw went to sleep on me while I was doing her, she just looked up at me, smiled and said, "That's OK, honey! If your poor old jaw muscles get tired on you, just take a break and yodel for a while!"*


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## SlowlyGoingCrazy

knobcreek said:


> Always the mans fault, even with massive vaginas lol... Of course.
> 
> Seriously though, kegals are great I do them to help with climax control, but they will not transform a large vagina to a small vagina. Large vaginas are real, they are among us.


Kegals do transform a large vagina into a small one and being aroused and actually making them O also helps with snugness. It's not a blame but a solution. 

For a normal sized penis there shouldn't be any issues. There's enough medical research done to show sex and birth does not cause permanent looseness. Muscles around the vagina can weaken, that's what kegals are for.


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## *Deidre*

Ynot said:


> You can never have to much information unless you wish to remain ignorant.


I'll choose to remain ignorant, then. I don't want to know about large vaginas.


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## ConanHub

*Deidre* said:


> I'll choose to remain ignorant, then. I don't want to know about large vaginas.


Hahaha!! Ok. Made me laugh!:grin2:


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## Evinrude58

Ynot said:


> I am still trying to figure out who is more concerned about penis size. So far I have yet to see too much focus on it from women but much more from guys who are a little insecure about it.
> I think vaginas, like penises come in all shapes and sizes. If you happen upon one that is "too large" perhaps it is just you aren't approaching it the right way. I also think the size of the vagina is somewhat related to being the appropriate weight. My ex was nice and tight when she was weight appropriate but when she dieted she would get more loose due to the lack of fatty tissue.
> I am not saying vagina size doesn't fluctuate but I highly doubt it is ruining sex for so many men that it is an issue


Really? Geez. Is this true?


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## knobcreek

.......


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## knobcreek

Ynot said:


> I am not saying vagina size doesn't fluctuate but I highly doubt it is ruining sex for so many men that it is an issue


I think large and/or stretched out "loose" vaginas are ruining sex much more than men's equipment because men's penises stay the same while vaginas do not. Most middle aged or post 30 women's vaginas are in the same shape as the rest of them (not great generally speaking unless they're actively working on it). Most have never done a kegal, many may just have genetically larger vaginas, and after child-birth and general malaise they become pretty un-fantastic, I think loose vaginas are a major problem no one is talking about. And you're much more likely to encounter a loose vagina that contributes to bad sex than a too small penis.


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## *Deidre*

ConanHub said:


> Hahaha!! Ok. Made me laugh!:grin2:


It's just too much info sometimes


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## Blondilocks

Let me guess - you're balding and the only women interested in you have vaginas that are not to your specs and you want to know why you can't get all the hot, tight, young things.


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## Ikaika

knobcreek said:


> I think large and/or stretched out "loose" vaginas are ruining sex much more than men's equipment because men's penises stay the same while vaginas do not. Most middle aged or post 30 women's vaginas are in the same shape as the rest of them (not great generally speaking unless they're actively working on it). Most have never done a kegal, many may just have genetically larger vaginas, and after child-birth and general malaise they become pretty un-fantastic, *I think loose vaginas are a major problem no one is talking about And you're much more likely to encounter a loose vagina that contributes to bad sex than a too small penis*.



So, I'm trying to figure out the metaphor for the bold statements. 



Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro


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## ConanHub

knobcreek said:


> I think large and/or stretched out "loose" vaginas are ruining sex much more than men's equipment because men's penises stay the same while vaginas do not. Most middle aged or post 30 women's vaginas are in the same shape as the rest of them (not great generally speaking unless they're actively working on it). Most have never done a kegal, many may just have genetically larger vaginas, and after child-birth and general malaise they become pretty un-fantastic, I think loose vaginas are a major problem no one is talking about. And you're much more likely to encounter a loose vagina that contributes to bad sex than a too small penis.


Ummm. Not sure about your data. Did you read my post? I actually haven't encountered what you are talking about and I was with a lot of women before I met my wife who is now 57 and has a still snug vagina despite years of rigorous sex and two children.

Mrs. Conan exercises and eats right but doesn't even do kegels.

I simply haven't encountered the problem you are talking about.

I could be hung like a roll of nickels and still have a good time with Mrs. Conan.


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## Blondilocks

*Deidre* said:


> It's just too much info sometimes


Aw, but, I thought you wanted to learn about the bdsm lifestyle?


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## NextTimeAround

What about the effect of multiple births on a woman?

What must Mrs. Duggar's equipment look like?


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## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Men with an average sized penis won't come across women who are just too large. That's not how the vagina works. It stretches and then goes right back to how it was. 

It's a myth that your vagina will get loose, like making a funny face and your parents saying it'll get stuck that way. 

If a vagina is too big it's much more likely a penis is too small problem.


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## *Deidre*

Blondilocks said:


> Aw, but, I thought you wanted to learn about the bdsm lifestyle?


lol This might be where the learning ends. :surprise:


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## knobcreek

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> Men with an average sized penis won't come across women who are just too large. That's not how the vagina works. It stretches and then goes right back to how it was.
> 
> It's a myth that your vagina will get loose, like making a funny face and your parents saying it'll get stuck that way.
> 
> If a vagina is too big it's much more likely a penis is too small problem.


Coming from someone whose vagina is so stretched she's trying to be fisted with a grown mans fist and forearm, I'm not sure any penis would be big enough for you.

Seriously though, the idea that no vaginas are stretched or too large for enjoyment is of course absolute nonsense. The average penis is ~5.5 inches, mine is a good deal bigger than that and a healthy girth I've put myself into vaginas that were like a wide open canal, like putting my member into a warm KFC bucket.


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## SlowlyGoingCrazy

The point is the vagina can be stretched and then goes right back to how it was. That's how a vagina works. Mine goes right back to normal no matter what is done. Within a few hours, day at most.

If it's too big she is not aroused or her muscles around have gotten weak and she can't squeeze. Making her O will get those muscles to squeeze. It works the same as Kegals. A normal sized penis just won't have issues with having too many big vaginas. Get her aroused and it will naturally get grippy and Oing will squeeze tightly. Play games, have her grip and try to pull out. Get benwa balls to hold them for various amounts of time. Vagina pump for temp swelling. 

There are tons of things you can do for a vagina, there's nothing you can do about a small penis. Vaginas are small enough to wear a tampon all day and large enough to birth a child. They are made to stretch and go back to normal.


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## wild jade

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> Yes Conan, a woman who is aroused will be more elasticity but will also be more grippy.
> 
> A man having an issue with vagina size should make sure she is actually enjoying so her body is responding. That and when she Os should feel like kegals. The better she Os the harder it gets until she literally pushes you out of her due to the force.
> One reason I am in "training" so I can still accommodate a penis during a good O and keep going.


Lots of sex is actually good for building up muscle tone in the vagina. Lots of good sex, with really good strong orgasms that is. 

Even better than kegels!


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## SlowlyGoingCrazy

wild jade said:


> Lots of sex is actually good for building up muscle tone in the vagina. Lots of good sex, with really good strong orgasms that is.
> 
> Even better than kegels!


Yep, a strong O makes my vagina squeeze stronger than a 6'5 strong man can keep himself in. 3 separate men have gotten to that point and all have been squeezed out. Poor guys lol 
Most do not make me O hard enough. 
I could never kegal as hard as naturally happens with a strong O. 

Just give her one of them once a day and her vagina will be able to grip a pencil all day long.


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## Ikaika

knobcreek said:


> Coming from someone whose vagina is so stretched she's trying to be fisted with a grown mans fist and forearm, I'm not sure any penis would be big enough for you.
> 
> Seriously though, the idea that no vaginas are stretched or too large for enjoyment is of course absolute nonsense. The average penis is ~5.5 inches, mine is a good deal bigger than that and a healthy girth I've put myself into vaginas that were like a wide open canal, like putting my member into a warm KFC bucket.




I think spelunking might be a better analogy. Seriously, I've not had the cave exploration issue. 

The histology of the vagina does not quite match what you are suggesting. The epithelium is not classic muscoa because it has to endure physical abrasion during coitus and child-birthing (very thick stratified squamous). However the remainder is very typical of a mucosa that has interlaced elastic fibers with the two layers of muscle tissue that can adjust and accommodate for girth and length. So, this is not a static structure that opens up as a gapping hole and remains as such. It accommodates the penis during coitus and with the hormone relaxin helps to accommodate a fetal head during delivery. But, some tearing can happen often at the distal point. Age of the female and health determines the ability to repair. This would not affect the majority of the vagina. 

However, with age there is a loss of elastic fibers (replaced with some scar tissue) and atrophied muscles. Combine this loss of accommodation with a reduction in mucus production and coitus can be painful for her. There are estrogen creams that can help, but again these don't make huge gapping holes. 

The entry point around the labia has less muscle control and possibly what you are referring to, but proximal regions are not affected. So, the base region of your penis may get less gripped but the remainder (toward the glans) should be secured. 


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## zookeeper

Is this really an issue? Are you getting complaints?


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## chillymorn69

Is there an echo in here..here...here.....here


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## knobcreek

Ikaika said:


> However, with age there is a loss of elastic fibers (replaced with some scar tissue) and atrophied muscles.


I think it's largely atrophied muscles in the area and/or just genetically large vaginas. In light of this topic lol.

https://youtu.be/I-vs8fwgwk0?t=80


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## Slow Hand

I'll just leave this right here..... 😁 🤐

https://www.google.com/amp/mediatakeout.com/new-study-vaggy/amp/


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## ConanHub

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> Yep, a strong O makes my vagina squeeze stronger than a 6'5 strong man can keep himself in. 3 separate men have gotten to that point and all have been squeezed out. Poor guys lol
> Most do not make me O hard enough.
> I could never kegal as hard as naturally happens with a strong O.
> 
> Just give her one of them once a day and her vagina will be able to grip a pencil all day long.


Did not know that. I will have to research but it sounds correct.

It would coincide with why Mrs. Conan is in good shape down there.

She has at least one O during every session and sometimes 2 or 3.

That is great information.


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## knobcreek

Slow Hand said:


> I'll just leave this right here..... &#55357;&#56833; &#55358;&#56592;
> 
> https://www.google.com/amp/mediatakeout.com/new-study-vaggy/amp/


Interesting, if they were included I would've thought Japanese, Chinese, or any other far eastern woman would've been tightest. So black don't crack AND they have the tightest vagina!


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## Personal

knobcreek said:


> I think large and/or stretched out "loose" vaginas are ruining sex much more than men's equipment because men's penises stay the same while vaginas do not. Most middle aged or post 30 women's vaginas are in the same shape as the rest of them (not great generally speaking unless they're actively working on it). Most have never done a kegal, many may just have genetically larger vaginas, and after child-birth and general malaise they become pretty un-fantastic, I think loose vaginas are a major problem no one is talking about. And you're much more likely to encounter a loose vagina that contributes to bad sex than a too small penis.


:rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl:

You do know that as men age their penises lose some sensitivity, droop, curve, shrink and suffer from erectile dysfunction as well?

I've experienced several vaginas that have birthed, children, been fisted and had sex several thousand times, yet I can't recall any of them being particularly loose or large.

My 47 year old wife has had two children through vaginal birth and required two stitches after giving birth to the second one. Plus through the last 21 years I sometimes fist her vagina which is something we only do with preparation. Yet she isn't loose or stretched out, since as expected she tightens up not long after fisting.

Unsurprisingly my wife's vagina, labia and clitoris still feels just as good as it has always done through 21+ years of sex with me.


----------



## Ikaika

knobcreek said:


> I think it's largely atrophied muscles in the area and/or just genetically large vaginas. In light of this topic lol.
> 
> 
> 
> https://youtu.be/I-vs8fwgwk0?t=80




Quite the opposite, atrophied muscle gets replaced with shortened scar tissue. This simply makes the vagina less accommodating. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

It's very likely Personal that your active sex life has helped your wife's vagina stay in such good shape. 
Same with Conan, multiple Os mean lots of vaginal contractions. 

I know since mine works out more often it is in better shape than ever. Even stretching to try fisting or a large toy is working the muscles around it as well.


----------



## knobcreek

Personal said:


> My 47 year old wife has had two children through vaginal birth and required two stitches after giving birth to the second one. Plus through the last 21 years I sometimes fist her vagina which is something we only do with preparation. Yet she isn't loose or stretched out, since as expected she tightens up not long after fisting.


The fact that you're into "fisting" I'll leave your opinion in the not qualified to answer file.

IF you had to concede that you driving your fist into your wife in some form of sadistic torture was doing her real physical harm on top of the mental harm, well that may require you to rethink everything. So you can't exactly give an unbiased opinion here.

So the two people insisting big vaginas aren't real and loose vaginas don't exist are 2 people who enjoy fisting?


----------



## musiclover

don't panic said:


> best thing i've learned this weekend! Bring on the coconut gelato >


😂😂😂😂


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Fisting isn't torture or sadistic. I know plenty of women who love it, even vanilla ones. It's pleasurable and not harmful mentally or physically if done with preparation. 

You don't seem to know a lot about vaginas for someone who wants to complain about them.


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

2 people? So far I haven't seen anyone else agree with your complaint of loose vaginas. And I have absolutely 0 worries about mine. I muscle train and am extremely knowledgeable and in touch with my vagina. 

You seem to know very little about them. 

This is a you problem. Not a vagina problem. There are many ways you can make a vagina have a tighter grip, making sure she is aroused and has good Os are one of them. Start there. You should feel tight kegal like gripping and contractions when she Os.


----------



## Handy

If there are large penis there probably are vaginas with similar dimensions. But I think most P's and V's sort of work out well.

I like V's sort on the slippery and lose side. I last longer.


----------



## chillymorn69

Theres all differennt sizes of penises and viginas


Seems like common scense.

With that said never had one that was to loose but have had some that were almost to tight but with patience and a good licking it was just fine.


----------



## Ynot

Maybe the OP could start a non-profit or something to raise awareness of this horrible issue. Maybe the Loose Internal P**** Society or LIPS. He can have celebrity spokes women like Angelina Jolie and do commercials. Maybe have an annual event for women to do kegals of 24 hours straight and then end it with a contest where they shoot ping pong balls at targets or something.


----------



## Ynot

*Deidre* said:


> I'll choose to remain ignorant, then. I don't want to know about large vaginas.


Then why are you reading and posting on a thread about it?


----------



## NextTimeAround

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> Fisting isn't torture or sadistic. I know plenty of women who love it, even vanilla ones. It's pleasurable and not harmful mentally or physically if done with preparation.
> 
> You don't seem to know a lot about vaginas for someone who wants to complain about them.


I don't get it. IF the vagina is as tight as any inexperienced one, then why wouldn't a slimmed down sex toy bring adequate pleasure.


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

NextTimeAround said:


> I don't get it. IF the vagina is as tight as any inexperienced one, then why wouldn't a slimmed down sex toy bring adequate pleasure.


Because the point is the stretching and largeness. 
A slim toy works just fine, a large toy is a different kind of pleasure. Like oral vs sex, both are their own kind of O and fun.


----------



## Blondilocks

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> Because the point is the stretching and largeness.
> A slim toy works just fine, a large toy is a different kind of pleasure. Like oral vs sex, both are their own kind of O and fun.


Have you ever thought of taking up a hobby that doesn't require periods of recuperation?>


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Blondilocks said:


> Have you ever thought of taking up a hobby that doesn't require periods of recuperation?>


Nope. Never. 
I only live once. I want to try as many things as I can. I haven't gotten to the actual fisting point yet. I'm half way, maybe. It's a working up to it thing. I don't push myself too much. There's no recovery time needed. Yet, at least. It's intense so I figure when I actually get there it'll be even more intense. 

But I already spent too much of my life with bad sex and uptight lovers and no experimenting. I love new things. I love pushing myself beyond my limit and trying things I didn't know I could and I love having a partner who helps me explore everything in a place I can fully trust and feel comfortable. 

Why people wouldn't want to try it all boggles my mind as much as the things I do boggle others.


----------



## knobcreek

The truth is it's socially acceptable to talk about, even malign penises (men in general), ugly because it's uncircumcised, too small, too big, too thin, too wide, too hairy, whatever. But it's not socially acceptable to malign vaginas (that's shaming). There are A LOT of loose/large vaginas out there, that's just a fact, and they do contribute to poor sex, especially post child birth if nothing is done to get back into shape.

Aside from being lectured by the fisting society on the miraculous vagina that can snap a #2 pencil and accommodate a horse **** , I haven't read anything to convince me it's not a contributing factor to bad sex in marriage, likely much moreso than small penises.

I find it hard to believe that some men here have never had a loose woman or a large vagina. Every single friend I've spoken too about it has dealt with it, a couple guys complain about their wives and how loose they are now and they can't even get off from vaginal intercourse and beg for anal for this reason.


----------



## Mr. Nail

Blondilocks said:


> Have you ever thought of taking up a hobby that doesn't require periods of recuperation?>


Nope, I can't think of a hobby I've had that doesn't require a period of recuperation. Even binge watching netflix. I'm not sure you really thought this out that well.


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

If large vaginas were a big, universal problem there would be women walking around with tampons plopping out of them. Just get her turned on and Oing and the vagina snugs up. 

No, I don't think large vaginas are ruining married sex lives. It's just not a problem. If there is muscle loss it can be repaired but good sex is a much more fun treatment. 

But you certainly don't get all the backlash for how they are supposed to look. We are supposed to have perfectly hairless, porn star vaginas with small lips and all a pretty pink. There are dyes women use, surgery to amputate labia. We get all kinds of crap about how our vaginas should look. It's not rainbows over here.


----------



## Blondilocks

Mr. Nail said:


> Nope, I can't think of a hobby I've had that doesn't require a period of recuperation. Even binge watching netflix. I'm not sure you really thought this out that well.


That's ok. You're forgiven.


----------



## Don't Panic

Oh it's real knobcreek...just ask Tina Fey. 

Large vaginas have left many broken marriages strewn upon the rocks of their carnivorous caverns. No doubt it's a silent epidemic. Thank goodness I had c-sections.


----------



## Personal

Blondilocks said:


> Have you ever thought of taking up a hobby that doesn't require periods of recuperation?>


My wife doesn't require a period of recuperation after fisting, since we do it carefully, build up to it and only do it on the occasions when she is more relaxed.

Plus my hands aren't very big which also makes a difference. For example I always found it difficult to reach the slide release, on a Browning 9mm Hi Power pistol with the thumb of my master hand.


----------



## Blondilocks

Personal said:


> My wife doesn't require a period of recuperation after fisting, since we do it carefully, build up to it and only do it on the occasions when she is more relaxed.
> 
> Plus my hands aren't very big which also makes a difference. *For example I always found it difficult to reach the slide release, on a Browning 9mm Hi Power pistol with the thumb of my master hand.*


*

*

That's a little TMI, Personal. lmao


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

My bf has ridiculously large hands but we bought a fist toy to try instead. It's a smaller hand, the size of my own. Still can't quite get it but it's insanely intense and a much, much different sensation than a smaller toy. Like apples and oranges. I love both. I love anything though really.


----------



## Handy

SlowlyGoingCrazy, WTG on all of the experimenting.


* But I already spent too much of my life with bad sex and uptight lovers and no experimenting. *
I used to be one of those uptight lovers because I thought I had to limit my sexual actives to vanilla or be called a deviant. Now that it is almost too late I read about women like you.


----------



## Young at Heart

OK, let's talk about vaginas. My 2 cents. I think that many of the issues have been addressed.

Muscle tone it very important and strong muscles (kegel and PC muscle exercises) can make a huge difference.

There is some variation on the size of all the "lady bits." If you want to see how you measure up, check out the following: The Size of Your Vagina: Is It Normal?


If you prefer the really clinical or scientific approach then the following is for you. https://academic.oup.com/humrep/article/21/6/1618/724374/Baseline-dimensions-of-the-human-vagina

OK, then for many years after child birth some doctors would perform an episiotomy where they actually cut out a portion and sewed it back to make a "tighter" opening in the mistaken thought that it would help with sexual satisfaction on the part of the husband. Scar tissue is not conducive to great sex. This was not a good idea.

Personally, I think that the size of the labia minora can be far more important to male pleasure than it is given credit for. In some porn films, lady porn stars with large labia minora are called "clingers" for the way they "grip" the penis. 

And speaking of size of non-vaginal lady bits, the distance between the urinary tract and the clitoris seems to be an important aspect of female sexual satisfaction that isn't well discussed. 

Shape Of A Woman?s Vagina Can Seriously Impact Her Sex Life, According To A New Study | IFLScience 

All in all, I think that few if any women should be concerned about their vagina being "too big." 

.


----------



## Ikaika

knobcreek said:


> The truth is it's socially acceptable to talk about, even malign penises (men in general), ugly because it's uncircumcised, too small, too big, too thin, too wide, too hairy, whatever. But it's not socially acceptable to malign vaginas (that's shaming). There are A LOT of loose/large vaginas out there, that's just a fact, and they do contribute to poor sex, especially post child birth if nothing is done to get back into shape.


Of course we like talking about our penises. However I'm not sure I find talking about vaginas unacceptable, I'm just happy that they are with us to help "park" my penis from time to time. 





knobcreek said:


> Aside from being lectured by the fisting society on the miraculous vagina that can snap a #2 pencil and accommodate a horse **** , I haven't read anything to convince me it's not a contributing factor to bad sex in marriage, likely much moreso than small penises.
> 
> 
> 
> *I find it hard to believe that some men here have never had a loose woman or a large vagina*. Every single friend I've spoken too about it has dealt with it, a couple guys complain about their wives and how loose they are now and they can't even get off from vaginal intercourse and beg for anal for this reason.



Well, if I were not married, I'd be willing to take up the research of my single years. 



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## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Handy said:


> SlowlyGoingCrazy, WTG on all of the experimenting.
> 
> 
> * But I already spent too much of my life with bad sex and uptight lovers and no experimenting. *
> I used to be one of those uptight lovers because I thought I had to limit my sexual actives to vanilla or be called a deviant. Now that it is almost too late I read about women like you.


It'll still be a while before men and women who want to can fully experiment and try new things without judgement in one way or another 

Clearly some men still think sex and toys makes a woman loose. 
Tons of people think a sexual woman is not "marriage material" 
Lots of men don't say things they want because like you, they didn't want to seem deviant or called a pervert or any other judgement. 

I happen to not care, old me may have let judgements get in my head but I'm having too much fun to let any worries or negativity in. 

And it's never too late. Many of the men in my local group are well into their late 60s-70s and they aren't stopping any time soon.


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## EleGirl

Livvie said:


> OP you really think that "lots of sex" results in a huge, oversized, no good vagina? Wow.
> 
> Ladies, this is one to share with your LD married friends who need a new valid excuse to not have sex with their husband. Not tonight dear, too much sex will result in a loose useless vagina you won't enjoy anymore.
> 
> Men: beware having too much sex with your partner. Too much sex with you and her vagina will become cavernous.


Gee, I wonder is too much sex makes a penis wear down and get small. Makes sense you know.

About as much sense as the idea that a lot of sex and having children make a vagina bigger. >


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## EleGirl

knobcreek said:


> Coming from someone whose vagina is so stretched she's trying to be fisted with a grown mans fist and forearm, I'm not sure any penis would be big enough for you.
> 
> Seriously though, the idea that no vaginas are stretched or too large for enjoyment is of course absolute nonsense. The average penis is ~5.5 inches, mine is a good deal bigger than that and a healthy girth I've put myself into vaginas that were like a wide open canal, like putting my member into a warm KFC bucket.


A woman whose vaginal is a like a warm KFC bucket has probably had that very same large vagina her entire life. Age and a lot of sex probably have nothing to do with it. Just like age and a lot of sex does not change the size of your penis.


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## Elizabeth001

Well his handle is "knob"creek but I highly doubt he got a knob from over usage. 


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## Handy

* SlowllyGoingCrazy
Many of the men in my local group are well into their late 60s-70s and they aren't stopping any time soon. *

I am in the older group and know widows but I am very cautious about how much I say about sexual topics. Old fears and habits are difficult to change but I do what I think will work at the time. I am concerned if I say too much that the friendship will suffer.

One self help group (not related to anything specifically sexual) I attend, several people introduces them self as "Hi my name is ______ and I am a recovering (____________guilt induced fear or behavior as a kid). 

It was amazing how many people have or had self limiting fears.


----------



## GettingIt_2

I think the penis size is representative of male virility and sexual ability in a way that the size of a vagina is not indicative of a woman's. 

For one, you can SEE a penis when you look at a naked man. You can see how hung he is, and, for many people (men and women), the conscious or unconscious judging of that man as a sexual being begins on sight. Even in underwear, swimwear, and sometimes fully clothed, a man's penis is "on display" for judgment. Like it or lump it, that's just how it is. 

A woman's vagina isn't so accessible to "consumption." A naked woman does have attributes on which her sexual "fitness" is judged, but those attributes are those that are more readily visible. Her breasts, her buttocks, her hips, waist and tummy, (her "figure") are all "signifiers" of how good of a lay she'd be. 

That is not to say that these cues are necessarily accurate. A guy with a nice sized penis might be a poor lover, whereas the man with a smaller penis is more skilled at pleasing women. A woman with a "sex appeal" might me a boring lay, etc. 

Still, we all have our prejudices and biases--and male virility and sexual prowess is often linked with penis size. I can admit that I'm biased that way on a "primal level", but that intellectually I know better and wouldn't insist that a bigger penis means what my snap judgment tells me when I look at a naked man. Men can do the same with their visual biases when it comes to judging women as sexual partners. Fulfilling sex and a good sexual relationship go beyond how we judge a book by its cover, but to say that the cover doesn't get our attention isn't accurate, either.


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## chillymorn69

Open honest comunicarion between lovers coupled with an attitude of acceptance and the desire to please your partner is really what it takes to have great sex.

So many people have this idea that it should just be great like in the movies 

Or are closed minded i don't like giving head so I'm not doing it. Or I'm just not a romantic guy so deal with It because if you really truly loved me you would accept that .

But I think if you were open to go outside your comfort zone to give your lover what they like wothout an attitude that exudes your distaste then sex goes to a new level and the bond and love just grows and grows.

Jmho ......but what do I know.


If this is both partners mind set it really don't matter how big your samson is or how tight or loose her kitty is
The goal is to give eachother pleasure.


Ah in a perfect world .......


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## Amplexor

Ummm, how big are we talk'n here?


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## knobcreek

Blondilocks said:


> Let me guess - you're balding and the only women interested in you have vaginas that are not to your specs and you want to know why you can't get all the hot, tight, young things.


39, married and with a nice salt & pepper head of hair, as thick as a teenagers, sorry to disappoint you. I'ma also thin, well built, an executive manager with my MBA. I likely "could" get hot, tight, young things, but I wouldn't have anything in common with them, so if not married would likely date 30-45 age group (no ugly feet or massive vaginas though :wink2.


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## Bibi1031

knobcreek said:


> 39, married and with a nice salt & pepper head of hair, as thick as a teenagers, sorry to disappoint you. I'ma also thin, well built, an executive manager with my MBA. I likely "could" get hot, tight, young things, but I wouldn't have anything in common with them, so if not married would likely date 30-45 age group (no ugly feet or massive vaginas though :wink2.


How long is your dong? Have you had reconstructive surgery after all that sex with multiple vaginas over the years? Inquiring minds wanna know!

How about your mouth and tongue? Are they disfigured with all the use they have had over the years? 

Oh, and LMAO @Amplexor. I wonder if those black thingies on that cavernous place are humans or sperm. LOL


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## Ikaika

I want to if ladies actually do take a sneak peek at the lump under the clothes to make some estimations? 


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro


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## Blondilocks

knobcreek said:


> 39, married and with a nice salt & pepper head of hair, as thick as a teenagers, sorry to disappoint you. I'ma also thin, well built, an executive manager with my MBA. I likely "could" get hot, tight, young things, but I wouldn't have anything in common with them, so if not married would likely date 30-45 age group (no ugly feet or massive vaginas though :wink2.


I knew you were married. Was just teasing. Actually never thought you were serious with this thread. An executive manager with an MBA surely wouldn't be this ignorant. Google is your friend, after-all.


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## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Ikaika said:


> I want to if ladies actually do take a sneak peek at the lump under the clothes to make some estimations?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro


If I can notice I will. I give most the benefit of the doubt as sometimes it can be a way off estimate. Sometimes though you see that things just aren't going to work out. Though I have never minded getting d*ck pics either, if you want to shoe me why I shouldn't waste my time right up front, that's fine with me. I've gotten many, most men seem to be quite proud of ones they really shouldn't be so eager to show off.


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## Ikaika

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> If I can notice I will. I give most the benefit of the doubt as sometimes it can be a way off estimate. Sometimes though you see that things just aren't going to work out. Though I have never minded getting d*ck pics either, if you want to shoe me why I shouldn't waste my time right up front, that's fine with me. I've gotten many, most men seem to be quite proud of ones they really shouldn't be so eager to show off.




Some of us guys are a bit modest, not for what we don't have, but sometimes for what we have. 


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## Blondilocks

There is no point in trying to estimate as it really isn't stationary and varies widely depending on the undergarment and if the garment is tailored or off the rack.


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## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Ikaika said:


> Some of us guys are a bit modest, not for what we don't have, but sometimes for what we have.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


I have noticed that too, I find a modest guy who isn't all bragging about his penis and it's a lovely, amazing penis. I tell him he should have it framed to send to people it's so lovely. But it seems the guys who do send are not the ones that should be framed.


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## Ikaika

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> I have noticed that too, I find a modest guy who isn't all bragging about his penis and it's a lovely, amazing penis. I tell him he should have it framed to send to people it's so lovely. But it seems the guys who do send are not the ones that should be framed.



My wife does want to frame it, but she did tell me "it's mine". 


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## Ikaika

Even though I wear compression shorts to the gym (helps with certain lifts), I will continue to wear the baggy gym shorts over them. For my wife's eyes only. 


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## chillymorn69

Betty goes to the gynecologist 
The nurse says take off you cloths and get on the table with your feet in the stirrups, so betty procedes to undress and jumps on the table feet in stirrups , the nurse turns around and exclaims OH MY hey Kathy take a look at this and kathy say Wow ..Betty says what wrong and the nurse says nothing its just that you have quite the vigina but every thing is normal its just a little on the large size but well with in normal range. Just then the Dr comes in and as he looks down say hmm very interesting .Betty says whats wrong and the Dr say nothing everything is fine your just on the larger size of normal. By this time Betty is feeling really self conscious so when she gets home she undresses put a miror on the floor trying to look and see just how big her vigina is .next the door opens and her husband walks in and says what the heck are you doing. Embarrassed Betty say um um I'm exercising. Then her husband says watch out you don't fall in that big hole on the floor.


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## Faithful Wife

Ikaika said:


> I want to if ladies actually do take a sneak peek at the lump under the clothes to make some estimations?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro


I do. But only with a prospect guy I may actually get sexually involved with. For any random guy, I would never notice or bother looking. However occasionally my eyes will fall on a man's lump by accident and if it seems nice and plump I might let my eyes linger for a moment. Especially if he's also tall and hot.


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## knobcreek

Ikaika said:


> Even though I wear compression shorts to the gym (helps with certain lifts), I will continue to wear the baggy gym shorts over them. For my wife's eyes only.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


LOl WTF is with this humble brag "I have a large penis but too modest to let it be known (except to millions on the Internet)" hijack of my thread? GTFO of here with this nonsense. ANYONE who talks about how big their penis is on the Internet definitely has a tiny penis. let me guess you have a Ford F350, Harley, and will only shoot a .50?


----------



## Faithful Wife

knobcreek said:


> Ikaika said:
> 
> 
> 
> Even though I wear compression shorts to the gym (helps with certain lifts), I will continue to wear the baggy gym shorts over them. For my wife's eyes only.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
> 
> 
> 
> LOl WTF is with this humble brag "I have a large penis but too modest to let it be known (except to millions on the Internet)" hijack of my thread? GTFO of here with this nonsense. ANYONE who talks about how big their penis is on the Internet definitely has a tiny penis. let me guess you have a Ford F350, Harley, and will only shoot a .50?
Click to expand...

Didn't you just talk about being bigger and girthier than average in a post above?


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## knobcreek

Faithful Wife said:


> Didn't you just talk about being bigger and girthier than average in a post above?


But I'm not what I would consider "big", I'm above average, in the 6 to 6.5 inch range, size 11 feet, good size hands, everything in proportion. I like my **** just fine, but it's not a "large ****" I would think size queens lust after or are eyeing in the gym. Just a good ol'American healthy ****.


----------



## Faithful Wife

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> Ikaika said:
> 
> 
> 
> I want to if ladies actually do take a sneak peek at the lump under the clothes to make some estimations?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro
> 
> 
> 
> If I can notice I will. I give most the benefit of the doubt as sometimes it can be a way off estimate. Sometimes though you see that things just aren't going to work out. Though I have never minded getting d*ck pics either, if you want to shoe me why I shouldn't waste my time right up front, that's fine with me. I've gotten many, most men seem to be quite proud of ones they really shouldn't be so eager to show off.
Click to expand...

That's been my experience too. I've gotten **** pics from guys who were so eager to show me their amazing penis...and when I get the pic I'm like, have you not seen any other penises or what, dude?

I get it, some men are obsessed with their own member and think we will be too upon a glance of it. I could be completely in love with a totally average penis if it was attached to a man I had great chemistry with and he was an amazing lover to me. But a guy who I've never been intimate with and sends me an average looking penis pic? I'm just wondering what he thinks I should or would be thinking about it. Usually I'm like, meh.


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## SlowlyGoingCrazy

I question the average size. 5.5 is quite small and I have not seen many below that. Maybe 1 or 2 out of 100? 
Most are quite a bit higher. I wonder how they got their stats. Seems like one of those things to make people feel better. 
I've discussed with friends who have all also said 5.5 is nowhere near the average they have seen either.


----------



## Faithful Wife

knobcreek said:


> Faithful Wife said:
> 
> 
> 
> Didn't you just talk about being bigger and girthier than average in a post above?
> 
> 
> 
> But I'm not what I would consider "big", I'm above average, in the 6 to 6.5 inch range, size 11 feet, good size hands, everything in proportion. I like my **** just fine, but it's not a "large ****" I would think size queens lust after or are eyeing in the gym. Just a good ol'American healthy ****.
Click to expand...

I was remarking that you said any man who talks about how big he is on the internet must have a small penis. I don't think that's true. At TAM anyway, I think men are probably honest about their stats. Including you.


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Faithful Wife said:


> That's been my experience too. I've gotten **** pics from guys who were so eager to show me their amazing penis...and when I get the pic I'm like, have you not seen any other penises or what, dude?
> 
> I get it, some men are obsessed with their own member and think we will be too upon a glance of it. I could be completely in love with a totally average penis if it was attached to a man I had great chemistry with and he was an amazing lover to me. But a guy who I've never been intimate with and sends me an average looking penis pic? I'm just wondering what he thinks I should or would be thinking about it. Usually I'm like, meh.


Yep. If they had something really impressive I could see them wanting to show it off but they are just "meh" 
I made one of those molds of my bfs penis so I can take one home with me. (Super fun couple activity btw, you won't get through it with a straight face) Truly the perfect size and shape and he doesn't see the big deal about it. 

I still get pics constantly cause I'm on a fetlife and even though I have said no messages, people can't read. Or people with "meh" penises can't read. Don't waste my time with your crappy penis.


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## Elizabeth001

I swear to gawd...you'd guys are killing me tonight. Knock it the F off until about 4:30 am Eastern. I need to go to beeeeeed!! 🤣 


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## knobcreek

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> I question the average size. 5.5 is quite small and I have not seen many below that. Maybe 1 or 2 out of 100?
> Most are quite a bit higher. I wonder how they got their stats. Seems like one of those things to make people feel better.
> I've discussed with friends who have all also said 5.5 is nowhere near the average they have seen either.


Women are terrible judges of size. I once slept with my brothers GF's friend visiting from college, she told all her GF's (and it got back to my brother) that I was huge, like 8 inches. I let my legend live in her mind, but the rest of his GF's friend were off limits because they would be expecting something I couldn't deliver.

Again, you're into really intense sexual stuff so you may be warped a bit. Like the guy who thinks everyone does heroin because him and his 3 burnout friends do. If I were working up to taking a full male fist and forearm I would likely be avoiding average size cocks too.


----------



## karole

I never understood the "size doesn't matter". I think size definitely matters.


----------



## Faithful Wife

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> Faithful Wife said:
> 
> 
> 
> That's been my experience too. I've gotten **** pics from guys who were so eager to show me their amazing penis...and when I get the pic I'm like, have you not seen any other penises or what, dude?
> 
> I get it, some men are obsessed with their own member and think we will be too upon a glance of it. I could be completely in love with a totally average penis if it was attached to a man I had great chemistry with and he was an amazing lover to me. But a guy who I've never been intimate with and sends me an average looking penis pic? I'm just wondering what he thinks I should or would be thinking about it. Usually I'm like, meh.
> 
> 
> 
> Yep. If they had something really impressive I could see them wanting to show it off but they are just "meh"
> I made one of those molds of my bfs penis so I can take one home with me. (Super fun couple activity btw, you won't get through it with a straight face) Truly the perfect size and shape and he doesn't see the big deal about it.
> 
> I still get pics constantly cause I'm on a fetlife and even though I have said no messages, people can't read. Or people with "meh" penises can't read. Don't waste my time with your crappy penis.
Click to expand...

I was on Fet too until just recently I disabled my profile. The ones that crack me up are the ones with an average looking penis as their profile pic. My inbox is full of those. What are they thinking?!? Can they not look around and see how average their **** is by comparison?


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

I know size. I have measured many a man. I have also seen many, many penises. Average is just not 5.5. 
But you don't seem to get, still, a woman's vagina so I won't bother trying to explain penises.


----------



## knobcreek

karole said:


> I never understood the "size doesn't matter". I think size definitely matters.


Maybe you have a large vagina? Would make sense.


----------



## knobcreek

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> I know size. I have measured many a man. I have also seen many, many penises. Average is just not 5.5.
> But you don't seem to get, still, a woman's vagina so I won't bother trying to explain penises.


Actually they are, your anecdotal evidence aside. Been actual scientific peer reviewed research on the topic, it's fascinating, turns out, most cocks are ~5.5 inches (think bell curve and high point).

The large vag insecurity is now very strong in this thread.


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Faithful Wife said:


> I was on Fet too until just recently I disabled my profile. The ones that crack me up are the ones with an average looking penis as their profile pic. My inbox is full of those. What are they thinking?!? Can they not look around and see how average their **** is by comparison?


I convinced my bf to put a penis pic on his. He got a lot of attention from gay males and took it down. Oops. I thought he should show it off. Now I just post them on mine. You'd think it would be a sign like, this is what I have so why are you trying to get in here with that thing? I'm happy they are proud anyway.


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

knobcreek said:


> Actually they are, your anecdotal evidence aside. Been actual scientific peer reviewed research on the topic, it's fascinating, turns out, most cocks are ~5.5 inches (think bell curve and high point).
> 
> The large vag insecurity is now very strong in this thread.


Lol my vagina is perfect. I have 0 worries. My bf is in love with it, as am I. I can hold a small Ben wa ball and take a big toy. It's quite fascinating really. Getting more in touch with it since I've opened up to being a more sexual person has been amazing. 
I think every women should get to know their vagina and what it is capable of. 

Just because I haven't seen many small penises doesn't mean I worry about my vagina. Maybe small penis guys just don't show many people or don't sleep around.


----------



## Ikaika

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> I convinced my bf to put a penis pic on his. He got a lot of attention from gay males and took it down. Oops. I thought he should show it off. Now I just post them on mine. You'd think it would be a sign like, this is what I have so why are you trying to get in here with that thing? I'm happy they are proud anyway.




Even if I were single, I just would not have the guts to post a dic pic. I would probably be lame and post a well groomed me (full body shot) in nice duds. 

Likely get very few offers. It's good to be married to someone who thinks I'm passable. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


----------



## Elizabeth001

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> Lol my vagina is perfect. I have 0 worries. My bf is in love with it, as am I. I can hold a small Ben wa ball and take a big toy. It's quite fascinating really. Getting more in touch with it since I've opened up to being a more sexual person has been amazing.
> 
> I think every women should get to know their vagina and what it is capable of.
> 
> 
> 
> Just because I haven't seen many small penises doesn't mean I worry about my vagina. Maybe small penis guys just don't show many people or don't sleep around.




Or have enough self confidence to approach us.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## knobcreek

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> Lol my vagina is perfect. I have 0 worries. My bf is in love with it, as am I. I can hold a small Ben wa ball and take a big toy. It's quite fascinating really. Getting more in touch with it since I've opened up to being a more sexual person has been amazing.
> I think every women should get to know their vagina and what it is capable of.
> 
> Just because I haven't seen many small penises doesn't mean I worry about my vagina. Maybe small penis guys just don't show many people or don't sleep around.


I don't know what the majority of the sexual stuff you talk about is, I have to be honest, I could Google it quick but that would be disingenuous. You say "I can hold a Ben wa ball" like that's a normal thing anyone would understand, proportion-wise, or how that fits into the discussion about large vaginas. I don't know what a ben wa ball is, how large they are, or how holding them in your vagina makes your vagina good or not good. I really think you and a few other ladies are just a little more experienced than the average which is the focus of most online discussions. You're trying to capture the mean in a generalized post, not the statistical outliers that are working to be fisted and into wife-sharing.

I'm not judging you at all, you only live once and have to do what makes you happy, if I were a lady I would be a complete ***** (not saying your are).


----------



## Haiku

Blondilocks said:


> If only I had a nickel for every time you make a statement and I wonder 'WTH?'.
> Different strokes or, erm, fists.


If I had a brick for every time I read something on this site and wondered wtf I could donate them to Trump and build two walls.


----------



## Tiggy!

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> I think every women should get to know their vagina and what it is capable of.
> .













They truly are amazing things.


----------



## EleGirl

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> I question the average size. 5.5 is quite small and I have not seen many below that. Maybe 1 or 2 out of 100?
> Most are quite a bit higher. I wonder how they got their stats. Seems like one of those things to make people feel better.
> I've discussed with friends who have all also said 5.5 is nowhere near the average they have seen either.


Is there an instrument for measuring vaginas? I'm wondering 'cause we all need to measure our vaginas so we can talk about them.... after all how would we know.... . >


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Ikaika said:


> Even if I were single, I just would not have the guts to post a dic pic. I would probably be lame and post a well groomed me (full body shot) in nice duds.
> 
> Likely get very few offers. It's good to be married to someone who thinks I'm passable.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


To her, you are more than passable. One day seeing yourself through her eyes and you'd feel like a king. 

My bf is the hottest man with the best, most amazing penis. He thinks I'm bonkers but I still remind him every chance I get. He's confident but doesn't see what I see. His confidence is very quiet and modest so I'm extra loud about how great he is. 

I do still make him send me pics. I think he's getting more used to it and comfortable now.


----------



## knobcreek

EleGirl said:


> Is there an instrument for measuring vaginas? I'm wondering 'cause we all need to measure our vaginas so we can talk about them.... after all how would we know.... . >


 @Ikaika has a measuring stick apparently. I can measure up to 6.5 deep, after that you'll need Ikaika's humble brag **** or SGC's BFs fist.


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Ben wa balls are outside the norm? I'm way out of the box then. 

Small, usually weighted, balls used to strength train muscles. You hold them in your vagina for various amounts of time to get your muscles working. Like an extended kegal. 

My friends and I are sexual people. We talk about sex a lot. We love sex. People who don't and are rigid in their desires and experiences are outside the norm for us. 

I'm totally fine being a ******. I see nothing wrong with it. I'll wear it proudly. I don't think there is anything negative about being sexual. I think less men would have less problems with women if we could do what we wanted without negativity. 

Even the 'women get loose cause of too much sex' is a negative myth used to hold back a woman's sexuality. We don't. Sex is good for our vaginas.


----------



## Tiggy!

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> Ben wa balls are outside the norm? I'm way out of the box then.
> 
> Small, usually weighted, balls used to strength train muscles. You hold them in your vagina for various amounts of time to get your muscles working. Like an extended kegal.
> .


Yh I'm pretty sure Ben Wa Balls are not that uncommon.


----------



## knobcreek

I love sex, I don't need additional partners, weights, training, buttplugs, ben wa balls, strap ons, fists into orifices, degradation, humiliation, slave/master stuff, toys to achieve pleasure with my partner. Doesn't make me out of touch or "not sexual".

Just me, her, and our minds is all I've ever needed for sexual satisfaction. This idea you need extreme sexual experiences to be contented sexually is not at all in line with the norm, it is a sexual outlier to the nth degree.


----------



## MrsHolland

knobcreek said:


> Actually they are, your anecdotal evidence aside. Been actual scientific peer reviewed research on the topic, it's fascinating, turns out, most cocks are ~5.5 inches (think bell curve and high point).
> 
> *The large vag insecurity is now very strong in this thread.*


Huh? lol not one post indicates women are insecure here. 

I love my vagina, MrH worships it >>>


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

knobcreek said:


> I love sex, I don't need additional partners, weights, training, buttplugs, ben wa balls, strap ons, fists into orifices, degradation, humiliation, slave/master stuff, toys to achieve pleasure with my partner. Doesn't make me out of touch or "not sexual".
> 
> Just me, her, and our minds is all I've ever needed for sexual satisfaction. This idea you need extreme sexual experiences to be contented sexually is not at all in line with the norm, it is a sexual outlier to the nth degree.


No, the idea that these things are wrong in some way is out of touch. There is nothing wrong with enjoying a sex life that includes many different things. The fact that you assume it is things done "to her" as some physical or mental negative and not "with her" as mutually fun and healthy is where your problem is. 

Many people do need variety and kink, nothing wrong with that at all. It's healthy and positive to explore your sexuality. You put negative spins on it showing your close mindedness. 

There are more kinky people than you could ever imagine. They are all kinds. They just don't talk about it because people like you get judgy and negative.


----------



## knobcreek

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> No, the idea that these things are wrong in some way is out of touch. There is nothing wrong with enjoying a sex life that includes many different things. The fact that you assume it is things done "to her" as some physical or mental negative and not "with her" as mutually fun and healthy is where your problem is.
> 
> Many people do need variety and kink, nothing wrong with that at all. It's healthy and positive to explore your sexuality. You put negative spins on it showing your close mindedness.
> 
> There are more kinky people than you could ever imagine. They are all kinds. They just don't talk about it because people like you get judgy and negative.


I'm not judgy, nor do I have any issue with your sexual life. I just want to keep it in proper context, what you are into (cuckolding, fisting, 3-somes, BDSM, etc..) is definitely in the extreme of sexual activity among society at large. So when you say "I've handled hundreds of cocks and maybe 1 our 100 are 5.5 inches (the average)" I want to ensure that guy reading it and impacted by that statement understands that you're into extreme sexual stuff and not just some lady he might encounter on eHarmony who doesn't require the extreme sexual experiences you do for satisfaction. My wife cums within 2 minutes of sex, it's all mental for her, if I brought up fisting there is nothing about it she would be into. Framing the discussion is important, you are not a "normal" woman in terms of what you do sexually, and by normal I mean, the mean average, you would be a statistical outlier, maybe top 1/10th of 1% of women in the USA who are into what you and your BF are. That doesn't mean I'm judging you, or care at all what you do. I've always lived my life saying you only live once and do what makes you happy. But like the guy who tattoos his entire face, don't act like it's the norm when it isn't.


----------



## chillymorn69

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> No, the idea that these things are wrong in some way is out of touch. There is nothing wrong with enjoying a sex life that includes many different things. The fact that you assume it is things done "to her" as some physical or mental negative and not "with her" as mutually fun and healthy is where your problem is.
> 
> Many people do need variety and kink, nothing wrong with that at all. It's healthy and positive to explore your sexuality. You put negative spins on it showing your close mindedness.
> 
> There are more kinky people than you could ever imagine. They are all kinds. They just don't talk about it because people like you get judgy and negative.


Some people like to be pooped on or pi $$ed on how about beastiality ...hey its all just exploring sexuality right?

Its just as wrong for kniky people to sugest that non kinky people are wrong .

Now excuse me while i shove this pencil up my uretha....don't knock it until you tried it my goal is to fit a lug wrench in my uretha



Its all about where you draw the line. But at some point everybody draws a line that just not for them.


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Do you think I've always done those things? This is the past year of my life. I've known and seen many penises before I acted on my kinks. I still see many penises. I go to clubs where peeps are naked, walking around. I get pics daily. I see a lot of penis. 

Being kinky doesn't change anything about the size I see. My friends are mainly vanilla, they experience the same things. 

Many in kink are just your average people. Your neighbor, your police officer, your brother. Nothing unusal or outside the norm penis size wise.


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

chillymorn69 said:


> Some people like to be pooped on or pi $$ed on how about beastiality ...hey its all just exploring sexuality right?
> 
> Its just as wrong for kniky people to sugest that non kinky people are wrong .
> 
> Now excuse me while i shove this pencil up my uretha....don't knock it until you tried it my goal is to fit a lug wrench in my uretha
> 
> 
> 
> Its all about where you draw the line. But at some point everybody draws a line that just not for them.


I don't think non kinky people are wrong. I think they are wrong if they try to judge kinks. I've never said it's for everyone but for those who do it, it's healthy and positive.


----------



## knobcreek

The average woman has been with 3.5 men, average man has been with 5.5 women. If you've been with hundreds of men leading up to your current relationship that incorporates extreme sexual stuff then you are not the norm at all. You are bringing in a lot of bias and anecdotal experiences into the discussion.

The fact is the average penis is 5.5 inches, multiple peer reviewed studies on this which trump your anecdotal experience, which means 50% are ~5.5 inches, so 49% are smaller than that and 49% larger, with a nice bell curve between 4.5 and 6.5 If you're handling large knobs exclusively, and you never come across 5.5 inch cocks, then likely it's due to the lifestyle you lead over anything else.


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

I've not had 100s of men inside me silly. I've seen 100s of penises. 
My friends have seen hundreds of penises. Women see penises. Usually a lot of them. 

I, and my friends, have seen very few under 5.5. Most around 7. Likely under 5.5 don't try to show them off or whip them out very often so no one sees them very often. The average man who goes looking for sex is well above the 5.5 average. 

I've seen one micro penis, about 25% of my friends have come across one in their lives. We had a discussion about it not too long ago.


----------



## knobcreek

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> I've not had 100s of men inside me silly. I've seen 100s of penises.
> My friends have seen hundreds of penises. Women see penises. Usually a lot of them.
> 
> I, and my friends, have seen very few under 5.5. Most around 7. Likely under 5.5 don't try to show them off or whip them out very often so no one sees them very often. The average man who goes looking for sex is well above the 5.5 average.
> 
> I've seen one micro penis, about 25% of my friends have come across one in their lives. We had a discussion about it not too long ago.


7 inch penis is no where near the statistical average at all. Maybe among your trope of fisters and wife ****ers, but not average society. A 7 inch penis is like 8% of men give or take, like being 6'2 or taller. If you're just seeing photos you can't tell at all how large it is due to camera angle etc... You are very wrong on this. I'll have to defer to actual scientific research rather than your anecdotal evidence. I'm fairly certain 6.5 inches I'm not lacking, confident in it actually.

Again, YOU see lots of penises, not most women. Most women have a much more modest count than you and your friends due to your lifestyle and theirs.


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Most of my friends are very vanilla, middle aged married women with 2-4 children. 

Sorry, you can blame my "lifestyle" and try to put it down all you want but it has nothing to do with it at all. 

5.5 is quite small compared to what we typically see. Women from all different backgrounds, areas, religions, sexual preferences.


----------



## Ikaika

Wonder if this urology article referenced in the,general article (below) is how penis size is popularly referenced. I'm not suggesting it is wrong, the averages they quote are probably quite accurate, but the value of erect penises is an interesting range 12 - 16 cm. So the average of is the midpoint. I did not read the urology paper, but I wonder if they (in the research article) instead listed the "average" erect penis as the mode rather than the mean. 

http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/271647.php


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro


----------



## Rocky Mountain Yeti

Remember all those posts where the wise and helpful women on this site convinced men to get over their penis insecurity?

SlowlyGoingCrazy is slowly dismantling that, post by post.


----------



## knobcreek

Ikaika said:


> Wonder if this urology article referenced in the,general article (below) is how penis size is popularly referenced. I'm not suggesting it is wrong, the averages they quote are probably quite accurate, but the value of erect penises is an interesting range 12 - 16 cm. So the average of is the midpoint. I did not read the urology paper, but I wonder if they (in the research article) instead listed the "average" erect penis as the mode rather than the mean.
> 
> What Is The Average Penis Size?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro


4.7 to 6.2 inches making the median 5.45 inches. SGC is wrong on this.


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Rocky Mountain Yeti said:


> Remember all those posts where the wise and helpful women on this site convinced men to get over their penis insecurity?
> 
> SlowlyGoingCrazy is slowly dismantling that, post by post.


Some women are fine with whatever size. Some prefer smaller. Some prefer bigger. Saying a blanket "size doesn't matter" isn't helpful. It does matter. Find a woman who is pleased with your size. People can have preferences. Like body type and height.


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

knobcreek said:


> 4.7 to 6.2 inches making the median 5.45 inches. SGC is wrong on this.


And as I said, those on the low end are likely not showing them to people as often so women typically see bigger penises. 5.5 would be too small for most of my friends. Some don't care at all. There's a penis size out there for everyone. Being average doesn't mean it's desirable for all.


----------



## Diana7

I have had 3 large babies(2 over 9lbs)so not as I was, but we still have good sex.

Also for me size really doesn't matter at all. It's the man that matters to me. I didn't even see my husband's penis till we married, but I loved him to bits and knew he was a really good man, so I would have been happy whether he had been 4 ins or 8 ins. The thought of shopping around, sleeping with lots of men till you find one with the 'right' size for you seems completely bizarre to me. His character, personality, and integrity are far more important.


----------



## Ikaika

knobcreek said:


> 4.7 to 6.2 inches making the median 5.45 inches. SGC is wrong on this.




I think she may have suggested, in her experience, she has not seen that as the average size. This, since most average size males tend not to show their junk. 

But, the article does not suggest the average size penis is too small for the accommodating structure of the vagina. Just like the penis, the vagina can stretch (during coitus) to accommodate the male penis. It too is not a static structure. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


----------



## Rocky Mountain Yeti

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> Some women are fine with whatever size. Some prefer smaller. Some prefer bigger. Saying a blanket "size doesn't matter" isn't helpful. It does matter. Find a woman who is pleased with your size. People can have preferences. Like body type and height.


Understood. But we know that most women do not prefer smaller than average, so suddenly the vast majority of dudes with less than 7" are going to feel quite inadequate, and that feeling would be justified if they honestly believed 7" was average.


"For example, an erect penis of 6.3 inches is in the 95th percentile. That means that out of 100 men, only five would have a penis longer than 6.3 inches. Likewise, an erect penis of 3.94 inches is in the 5th percentile, meaning that only five men out of 100 would have a penis shorter than 3.94 inches."
Average Penis Size: What?s Normal?


----------



## knobcreek

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> Some women are fine with whatever size. Some prefer smaller. Some prefer bigger. Saying a blanket "size doesn't matter" isn't helpful. It does matter. Find a woman who is pleased with your size. People can have preferences. Like body type and height.


Which is fine, but to keep repeating that the larger side of average 5.5 inches is so small that none of your friends have seen it is bound to create a false narrative. It's proven to be average, meaning 50% of all men on the planet have it. The fact that you keep stating in the face of scientific proven evidence falsehoods shows a lot of immaturity on your part. I love my ****, wouldn't add a mm to it so you're not spiting me by doing it, I'm not sure what your motivation is to be honest.


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Average woman dress size is a 16. Does that mean men should all be happy with average and "size doesn't matter"? 

I see a lot more women under size 16 than above it. I'm not sure how they got that average either. But regardless, that's what it is. 

If you think I care about how you feel about your penis size you are as wrong as you were when you thought I was worried about my vagina. 

It is what it is. No one should feel bad about what they have.


----------



## Ikaika

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> It is what it is. No one should feel bad about what they have.




This


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


----------



## Don't Panic

chillymorn69 said:


> Some people like to be pooped on or pi $$ed on how about beastiality ...hey its all just exploring sexuality right?
> 
> Its just as wrong for kniky people to sugest that non kinky people are wrong .
> 
> *Now excuse me while i shove this pencil up my uretha....don't knock it until you tried it my goal is to fit a lug wrench in my uretha*
> 
> 
> 
> Its all about where you draw the line. But at some point everybody draws a line that just not for them.



You go chillymorn69! We all gotta have goals :grin2: Good "stuff" today...


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

And not none. Few. We've seen few men under 5.5 and most closer to 7 and many in between, some bigger and a few micros in the mix. Most of us are goldilocks with our penis preferences. Not too small, not too large but juuuust right. Where that is may be different for all. Most of us were around 7 but girth matters far more. 

Logically the under 5.5s aren't showing them off but just because something is average doesn't mean it's what we see or encounter most often or that we should be happy just because it's average.


----------



## Rocky Mountain Yeti

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> Average woman dress size is a 16. Does that mean men should all be happy with average and "size doesn't matter"?


Apples and oranges. A woman can change her dress size. A man can not change his penis size.



SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> I see a lot more women under size 16 than above it. I'm not sure how they got that average either. But regardless, that's what it is.


You probably don't live in a particularly obese area. Some parts of America really drive up that average relative to others. I live in Colorado, where people are very active, so I don't see anything like that average either. But when I travel to Alabama, I can see how the overall average ends up where it is!



SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> If you think I care about how you feel about your penis size you are as wrong as you were when you thought I was worried about my vagina.


Irrelevant. Nobody here's looking to impress you with their penis, so they don't care if you care. But you and others have said women care, so it's been deemed important to women in general, thus is will necessarily be a concern. 



SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> It is what it is. No one should feel bad about what they have.


Indeed, it is what it is, and there's nothing to be gained by fretting over what you can't control. Make the best of what you've got, accentuate the positive and so on. Make yourself attractive in other ways. Make yourself skilled enough that it won't matter from a mechanical standpoint even if the aesthetics can never be matched. Adapt and overcome. Great advice. Easy to do in theory, a little more challenging in practice ... especially when told 7" is average and women don't like less than average!


----------



## knobcreek

It was inevitable that large/sloppy vagina insecurity would turn this into a small penis thread, apparently anything under 7 inches (or like 96% of all men) is now classified as small. Like I said, it has more to do with the company you keep than reality.


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

You'd think someone who sits around with his guy friends talking about vaginas being so large they beg their wives for anal just so they can get off would be more understanding of women talking about penis size preferences. 

We talk just as much as the boys do. You have vagina preferences just like we have penis preferences. You gossip about large vagina like we gossip about small penis. 
Vaginas can be worked on at least, and women should if for nothing else but health of the muscles to prevent incontenance and other issues down the road. 

But this very thread and your constant references to my bfs "fist and forearm" are just attempts to shame women. Poorly, but still trying. But if you want to have a vagina size preference, go for it. I don't mind and it doesn't insult me one bit. Know though that we have our own ideals and it shouldn't matter to you either.


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

knobcreek said:


> It was inevitable that large/sloppy vagina insecurity would turn this into a small penis thread, apparently anything under 7 inches (or like 96% of all men) is now classified as small. Like I said, it has more to do with the company you keep than reality.


There is 0 difference to you not wanting a "large and sloppy vagina" to us not wanting a smaller penis. 

And since I've never come across any men who had experienced a too large and sloppy vagina, this is likely the kind of company YOU keep rather than reality. 

Your friends apparently all have sloppy vagina experienced. Mine have average of 7ish inch penis experience. Guess we both just have weird company


----------



## Rocky Mountain Yeti

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> There is 0 difference to you not wanting a "large and sloppy vagina" to us not wanting a smaller penis.
> 
> And since I've never come across any men who had experienced a too large and sloppy vagina, this is likely the kind of company YOU keep rather than reality.
> 
> Your friends apparently all have sloppy vagina experienced. Mine have average of 7ish inch penis experience. Guess we both just have weird company


I think all your lovers with the unusually big rods need to meet up with all knobs lovers with the cavernous holes--a perfect fit for everyone!

I'm sure we can make this happen as easily as making sure all the HD women don't end up with LD men!


----------



## MrsHolland

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> There is 0 difference to you not wanting a "large and sloppy vagina" to us not wanting a smaller penis.
> 
> And since I've never come across any men who had experienced a too large and sloppy vagina, this is likely the kind of company YOU keep rather than reality.
> 
> Your friends apparently all have sloppy vagina experienced. Mine have average of 7ish inch penis experience. Guess we both just have weird company


Best post in one of the most bizarre threads ever on TAM >


----------



## Bibi1031

Let's keep TAM weird. Hell yeah!


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Rocky Mountain Yeti said:


> I think all your lovers with the unusually big rods need to meet up with all knobs lovers with the cavernous holes--a perfect fit for everyone!
> 
> I'm sure we can make this happen as easily as making sure all the HD women don't end up with LD men!


Everyone should just find what they like. I am picky, I am ok with that cause I'd rather be picky than unsatisfied. I expect any man I meet to be just as picky with me and only pick me if I am and have what they want. Not settle for, want. Anyone who didn't like my vagina doesn't have to be in it.


----------



## MrsHolland

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> Everyone should just find what they like. I am picky, I am ok with that cause I'd rather be picky than unsatisfied. I expect any man I meet to be just as picky with me and only pick me if I am and have what they want. Not settle for, want. *Anyone who didn't like my vagina doesn't have to be in it.*


Pure gold :grin2:


----------



## Faithful Wife

knobcreek said:


> It was inevitable that large/sloppy vagina insecurity would turn this into a small penis thread, apparently anything under 7 inches (or like 96% of all men) is now classified as small. Like I said, it has more to do with the company you keep than reality.


Oh c'mon knob. It's clear you knew this thread would become a penis thread and laid the bait out there and now you act like you didn't know. I give you much more credit than that, but why deny it? Just tell us why penis threads piss you off so much. Clearly it is stuck in your craw. Why????


----------



## Diana7

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> I've not had 100s of men inside me silly. I've seen 100s of penises.
> My friends have seen hundreds of penises. Women see penises. Usually a lot of them.
> 
> I, and my friends, have seen very few under 5.5. Most around 7. Likely under 5.5 don't try to show them off or whip them out very often so no one sees them very often. The average man who goes looking for sex is well above the 5.5 average.
> 
> I've seen one micro penis, about 25% of my friends have come across one in their lives. We had a discussion about it not too long ago.


Where have you seen 100's of penises?


----------



## Diana7

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> I question the average size. 5.5 is quite small and I have not seen many below that. Maybe 1 or 2 out of 100?
> Most are quite a bit higher. I wonder how they got their stats. Seems like one of those things to make people feel better.
> I've discussed with friends who have all also said 5.5 is nowhere near the average they have seen either.


Its an average for men worldwide.


----------



## manwithnoname

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> I've not had 100s of men inside me silly. I've seen 100s of penises.
> My friends have seen hundreds of penises. Women see penises. Usually a lot of them.
> 
> I, and my friends, have seen very few under 5.5. Most around 7. Likely under 5.5 don't try to show them off or whip them out very often so no one sees them very often. The average man who goes looking for sex is well above the 5.5 average.
> 
> I've seen one micro penis, about 25% of my friends have come across one in their lives. We had a discussion about it not too long ago.


I have to chuckle whenever I hear of women describing penis length. Do you pull out a measuring tape or ruler? Pretty difficult for the average woman to estimate accurately the length of the penis on the guy she's about to have sex with, unless she's a scientist conducting an experiment. My wife would be probably 2" off if I asked her to show me what 7" was.


----------



## alexm

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> I question the average size. 5.5 is quite small and I have not seen many below that. Maybe 1 or 2 out of 100?
> Most are quite a bit higher. I wonder how they got their stats. Seems like one of those things to make people feel better.
> I've discussed with friends who have all also said 5.5 is nowhere near the average they have seen either.


Honest question - have you ever actually measured someone before? Or more than one person?

I ask, because most people can not accurately measure something with their eyes (anything, I don't just mean ****s)

1" isn't really that much, if you're just looking at something, and it's hard to gauge without context. 0.5" is REALLY difficult to gauge accurately.

I'm 5'7", and although short, yes, it's not as apparent until I'm standing next to my 6'4" friend.


----------



## Rocky Mountain Yeti

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> Everyone should just find what they like. I am picky, I am ok with that cause I'd rather be picky than unsatisfied. I expect any man I meet to be just as picky with me and only pick me if I am and have what they want. Not settle for, want. Anyone who didn't like my vagina doesn't have to be in it.


My post was meant for fun, because that's what this ridiculous thread needs at this point (if it even needs to exist at all). I think this whole idea of vaginas being too large, let alone complaining about it is just plain silly if not downright bizarre. Granted, I haven't seen as many Vs as you have Ps, so my limited experience may color my perception, but I've never heard of a guy turning away a chance for sex because a hole was too large. They may talk vulgar and make harsh comments but that doesn't mean the won't sink the pink when given the chance. If a guy rejects a girl because she doesn't meet his preferences, that'll happen long before anybody gets naked.


----------



## alexm

knobcreek said:


> The average woman has been with 3.5 men, average man has been with 5.5 women. If you've been with hundreds of men leading up to your current relationship that incorporates extreme sexual stuff then you are not the norm at all. You are bringing in a lot of bias and anecdotal experiences into the discussion.
> 
> The fact is the average penis is 5.5 inches, multiple peer reviewed studies on this which trump your anecdotal experience, which means 50% are ~5.5 inches, so 49% are smaller than that and 49% larger, with a nice bell curve between 4.5 and 6.5 If you're handling large knobs exclusively, and you never come across 5.5 inch cocks, then likely it's due to the lifestyle you lead over anything else.


I genuinely think that one of the posts earlier in this thread can explain why smaller penises aren't 'seen' as often as larger ones - men with larger penises probably have more sex or at least put themselves out there more.

Whereas, conversely, men with smaller penises do not.

We men learn early on that penis size matters - even if it actually does not to many women. Just amongst ourselves, as youths or teenagers, the "big ****" thing is real. Every male measures at some point while they're young. They want to know where they stack up amongst their peers.

If a woman walks into any club in the country, I can almost guarantee that virtually every man that tries to pick her up will skew higher on the size chart.

Furthermore, in terms of peer reviewed studies, I wouldn't trust those implicitly, either. My size can, and does, easily vary by half an inch at least, depending on time of day, how tired I am, how excited I am, etc. Some days it rages, others not so much.

I would imagine that if I were part of some clinical study such as these, I likely wouldn't be "at my best". I think that in some of these studies an erection is chemically induced, thus resulting in the maximum size, while others are not.

If I recall correctly, one such study that was done by a condom company invited spring breakers into a tent, where you were expected to get an erection and then be measured by a nurse. For whatever reason, this particular study seems to pop up whenever this subject comes up, so it sounds like it was taken quite seriously. I always though that if I were part of that study, I wouldn't have achieved my max erection size, because you know... not exactly a stimulating environment...


----------



## She'sStillGotIt

knobcreek said:


> Women are terrible judges of size. I once slept with my brothers GF's friend visiting from college, she told all her GF's (and it got back to my brother) that I was huge, like 8 inches. I let my legend live in her mind, but the rest of his GF's friend were off limits because they would be expecting something I couldn't deliver.


Let me correct that for you.

Immature college *GIRLS* are 'terrible judges of size.'


----------



## knobcreek

I'll close out with this. 

Large vaginas ARE a problem, and I'm assuming if you require a fist and 10 inch dongs you have one. People can't discuss them because men are inherently conditioned to defend women, even in stupid circumstances where they're completely wrong, this is called being a white knight and the Internets are their domain. I'm outgunned here for sure. Women can mock men, be rude, treat them like **** and it's "man up", a man calls out large vaginas and he's shaming, or apparently everyone pretends large or sloppy vaginas don't exist.

No one cares if someone wants a huge ****, but to insist the average size is 7 inches is nonsensical and not even close to accurate. It's like saying the average height is 6'3. I have my own physical requirements that would likely leave many women who are attractive out from the get go. I don't like blonds at all, pale skin, large or unattractive feet, large/loose vaginas, mens haircuts on women, too petite, too small boobs, etc... I get it, no one cares what ones preference is, but get your facts straight.

My only point is the ones insisting on massive cocks are also into things like fisting, wife sharing (cuckolding), swinging, BDSM, they represent a very small fraction of the female population (but a large vocal minority here). Most women don't want a massive ****, it's painful. SGC is into extreme sexual stuff with her BF, so her statements should be understood in context.

back to your hug boxing.


----------



## Don't Panic

ConanHub said:


> *Ok. So I love talking about vaginas and penises.*
> 
> I'm willing to read this whole thread and discuss this very interesting topic.
> 
> I will, however, immediately take issue with the part of your post quoted above.
> 
> The majority of penis posts have seemed to be male in origin. I very much appreciate the women of TAM that have given female insight into any topic, penis size included, but *haven't seen that women have been very focused on the topic.* *Exactly! Thank you!*
> 
> Seems to be more male driven interest, at least as far as posting goes.


Just look at what you've been missing @ConanHub!!

It's nice to see you posting again. Your contributions are honest and enlightening and I've enjoyed reading your insights. Glad you are doing well!


----------



## NJ2

This is hilarious! I must be very naive- I've only seen 2 penises in my 57 years and have no idea -nor do I care-whether they are bigger or smaller than average. I think that its all about skill rather than size.

I've had 3 kids, a complete hysterectomy, about 40 years of regular sex -and I assume that mine is plenty tight enough or he wouldnt be so interested in it.

I would think that if someone did have a large va jayjay, there would be certain positions/techniques that could accommodate for that? 

I think there was a thread somewhere about overly lubricated vaginas during sex(may feel similar to a large vagina-less friction?)- quite a few solutions were put forth and quite a few guys that said it wouldnt matter to them. They would be the guys that enjoy all vaginas- big and small, tight and loose, young and old,lubed or dry, bushed or bald, once or twice.

They are the guys that love womens bodies because they are women and are turned on by turning on. They will make it work.


----------



## Elizabeth001

FWIW...a dollar bill is 6" long 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Women are mocked constantly for their sexuality. You really have 0 idea. Our vaginas, our sex life, our bodies, our hair. 

Even now you assume that because I don't prefer a small penis that I must have a loose vagina. Or that women who have a lot of sex or like big toys are loose. It just doesn't work that way, it's a defence. One that isn't even logical. It's just a way to try to shame women. 

Women who enjoy sex have rarely been able to truly express it. Some men need to shame women due to their own fear and insecurity. 

It's laughable that you think sitting around with your friends talking about large, sloppy vaginas (that could be fixed if they were Oing and turned on) is acceptable but women talking about size preferences must all be outside the box sl*ts. Just shows what you really think about women and sex in general. 

You know practically nothing about how a vagina works, had have very little experience or knowledge about most sexual activities and just want all the men to agree with you or they are "white knights" 

Why not try to learn something instead of just being stubborn? Because you need women to have flaws and be the enemy. You seem to truly hate them, in all of your posts. It's just sad.


----------



## Elizabeth001

FWIW...a dollar bill is 6" long 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Elizabeth001 said:


> FWIW...a dollar bill is 6" long
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I've measured a few penises and have toys from 5-10" long. I'm a pretty good guesser. I guessed my bf exact before I measured it. 

Length doesn't do much for pleasure but I prefer them for looks. I like looking at a nice sized penis. Same as some guys like big boobs. 

A long, thin man wouldn't be what I wanted. I want both. I haven't had any issues finding ones I like. Some weren't, but sex is extremely important to me so it's a deal breaker issue. Same as if they were bad in bed. Even if their penis was fine, if they weren't good it was a deal breaker issue. 

There's no reason to try to make something work when it doesn't. Sex is too important to me to settle.


----------



## Bibi1031

Is your name a reflection of you and your gals privates?

Are you a "knob" in your "gal's" creek?

Me thinks that may be why you complain too much.

...just sayin


----------



## Diana7

NJ2 said:


> This is hilarious! I must be very naive- I've only seen 2 penises in my 57 years and have no idea -nor do I care-whether they are bigger or smaller than average. I think that its all about skill rather than size.
> 
> I've had 3 kids, a complete hysterectomy, about 40 years of regular sex -and I assume that mine is plenty tight enough or he wouldnt be so interested in it.
> 
> I would think that if someone did have a large va jayjay, there would be certain positions/techniques that could accommodate for that?
> 
> I think there was a thread somewhere about overly lubricated vaginas during sex(may feel similar to a large vagina-less friction?)- quite a few solutions were put forth and quite a few guys that said it wouldnt matter to them. They would be the guys that enjoy all vaginas- big and small, tight and loose, young and old,lubed or dry, bushed or bald, once or twice.
> 
> They are the guys that love womens bodies because they are women and are turned on by turning on. They will make it work.


Great post. I too had 3 babies(large) and have also had a full hysterectomy. I have seen 3 penis's in my life(apart from my sons when he was tiny), 2 of those my 1st and present husbands, and I have no desire to see any new ones or for any particular size at all. If you are in a loving committed caring relationship/marriage, you will use what you have and have a good sex life anyway. Its odd to me that people think they must have a certain size of anything to have a good relationship, and will actually look for the exact criteria. To me that just so weird. 

Relationships, marriages and good loving sex are about SO much more than that. 

Also I have close friends and we never discuss our husband penis length or our sex lives, to me that would be so disrespectful to my husband. Its between the 2 of us.


----------



## GettingIt_2

knobcreek said:


> I'll close out with this.
> 
> Large vaginas ARE a problem, and I'm assuming if you require a fist and 10 inch dongs you have one. People can't discuss them because men are inherently conditioned to defend women, even in stupid circumstances where they're completely wrong, this is called being a white knight and the Internets are their domain. I'm outgunned here for sure. Women can mock men, be rude, treat them like **** and it's "man up", a man calls out large vaginas and he's shaming, or apparently everyone pretends large or sloppy vaginas don't exist.
> 
> No one cares if someone wants a huge ****, but to insist the average size is 7 inches is nonsensical and not even close to accurate. It's like saying the average height is 6'3. I have my own physical requirements that would likely leave many women who are attractive out from the get go. I don't like blonds at all, pale skin, large or unattractive feet, large/loose vaginas, mens haircuts on women, too petite, too small boobs, etc... I get it, no one cares what ones preference is, but get your facts straight.
> 
> My only point is the ones insisting on massive cocks are also into things like fisting, wife sharing (cuckolding), swinging, BDSM, they represent a very small fraction of the female population (but a large vocal minority here). Most women don't want a massive ****, it's painful. SGC is into extreme sexual stuff with her BF, so her statements should be understood in context.
> 
> back to your hug boxing.


Regardless of the size of the vagina, it generally feels good to have it filled and stretched. The degree to which a woman wants her vagina "challenged" in that way may vary, but I'd hazard a guess that *most* women could comfortably take more than what her man has. I'll even hazard a guess that *most* sexual women would--at least on occasion--LIKE something bigger than what her man has. It just feels good. But to move from those assertions to assume that a woman isn't content with her husband's penis size isn't productive, and it can smack of insecurity, especially when coupled with "tit for tat" language about the size of a woman's vagina. 

There are women who would never dream of asking her husband to supplement their sex lives with a dildo that is larger than her husband's **** because she intuits that it would not go over well. But that doesn't mean she doesn't shove bigger things up in there herself, or fantasize about it, or wonder about it. 

I suggest that men who have good sexual communication and rapport with their wives and who have NOT introduced something larger that his own **** into her vagina DO IT (um, I mean introduce the possibility in a positive way and get her consent first, of course). Don't make _her_ ask for it. And if she's receptive, for god's sake don't freak out and start to think that's she's a "size queen" and has been wishing your penis was larger all along. Varying the size of things you put into her vagina is just good old plain FUN. Our vaginas are stretchy and meant to be stretched--what a waste not to play with them to the fullest range that your woman enjoys! 

No one here is saying fisting is mainstream, but I think what is being said is that bigger than what 99% of men have can be fun and pleasurable and even desirable for 99% of women. As for the percentage of women for whom bigger is preferable for as far as _solely physical pleasure_ goes . . . I'm guessing that's a fairly high number, too. As I said, it's generally a really good feeling to have it stretched beyond what the average to even significantly above average guy can do _with his penis_. 

Luckily, ALL men have access to things bigger than their penis. Have some fun helping your lady enjoy some of those things!


----------



## Diana7

knobcreek said:


> I'll close out with this.
> 
> Large vaginas ARE a problem, and I'm assuming if you require a fist and 10 inch dongs you have one. People can't discuss them because men are inherently conditioned to defend women, even in stupid circumstances where they're completely wrong, this is called being a white knight and the Internets are their domain. I'm outgunned here for sure. Women can mock men, be rude, treat them like **** and it's "man up", a man calls out large vaginas and he's shaming, or apparently everyone pretends large or sloppy vaginas don't exist.
> 
> No one cares if someone wants a huge ****, but to insist the average size is 7 inches is nonsensical and not even close to accurate. It's like saying the average height is 6'3. I have my own physical requirements that would likely leave many women who are attractive out from the get go. I don't like blonds at all, pale skin, large or unattractive feet, large/loose vaginas, mens haircuts on women, too petite, too small boobs, etc... I get it, no one cares what ones preference is, but get your facts straight.
> 
> My only point is the ones insisting on massive cocks are also into things like fisting, wife sharing (cuckolding), swinging, BDSM, they represent a very small fraction of the female population (but a large vocal minority here). Most women don't want a massive ****, it's painful. SGC is into extreme sexual stuff with her BF, so her statements should be understood in context.
> 
> back to your hug boxing.


You are right in that they represent a tiny minority of the female population. Same with open marriages, so few have them, but here on tam we have a vocal minority who seem to promote them which is sad.


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Yes. Tons of fun. Sometimes a little pain but this girl likes that sort of thing. For most women be careful not to hurt in any way but stretching is fun and intense and a whole different kind of feeling.


----------



## GettingIt_2

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> Yes. Tons of fun. Sometimes a little pain but this girl likes that sort of thing. For most women be careful not to hurt in any way but stretching is fun and intense and a whole different kind of feeling.


Yes, it's about varying sensation. Similar, perhaps, to the reason men like vaginal sex but ALSO like oral sex and anal sex. I give my husband head all the time because he loves it, and it never occurred to me to wonder what that "says" about the size of my vagina, lol. 

Men who love sexual women shouldn't unilaterally relegate those womens' vaginas to "my penis size and smaller" events!


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

GettingIt_2 said:


> Yes, it's about varying sensation. Similar, perhaps, to the reason men like vaginal sex but ALSO like oral sex and anal sex. I give my husband head all the time because he loves it, and it never occurred to me to wonder what that "says" about the size of my vagina, lol.
> 
> Men who love sexual women shouldn't unilaterally relegate those womens' vaginas to "my penis size and smaller" events!


Yep!! 

One reason I love the sex with my bj. We are 0 judgement, low limits and no ego. There's just no place for them in the kind of sex like I like. He knows I love his penis best of anything, he also knows we like to play with large toys. Apples and oranges.


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Geez with my *bf. Apparently my phone just auto corrects to bj now. It must know me well.


----------



## Blondilocks

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> Geez with my *bf. Apparently my phone just auto corrects to bj now. It must know me well.


Thanks for clearing that up. That was another one of those 'huh?'. lol


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Diana7 said:


> You are right in that they represent a tiny minority of the female population. Same with open marriages, so few have them, but here on tam we have a vocal minority who seem to promote them which is sad.


I would never promote an open marriage and bdsm as something that is right for everyone. 

My stance on it is that it's not wrong for everyone. 

Those who enjoy it are healthy, happy people. 

There is a difference between those against it, who make fun of it and decide it's universally wrong and those who are for it, for their own relationships. We aren't recruiting. We're simply saying that for us, it's right. There's nothing wrong with it. 

I think more people should be open to exploring new things. Even as simple as oral or new positions. But ultimately to each their own. 

There's nothing sad about it.


----------



## Middle of Everything

This thread is one big WTF.

I always thought people were people. 

But if we are going down the number route I guess we need a way to measure Vaginas. Displacement? Guys can relate to that with engines and all.

How many cubic inches is that chick you are banging lately Bob? Little V twin or we talkin a big V 12?


----------



## CharlieParker

We are going to Cornwall next month. I will have to remind my wife, often, that the pronunciation of Cornish pasty rhymes with labiaplasty.


----------



## Rocky Mountain Yeti

CharlieParker said:


> We are going to Cornwall next month. I will have to remind my wife, often, that the pronunciation of Cornish pasty rhymes with labiaplasty.


Indeed. When my wife and I traveled to a part of the US where Pastys are popular, we fell in love with them, but my wife kept ordering the things strippers wear. Couldn't seem to break the habit. I was hoping there was something Freudian behind it, but alas, no... just naivete.


----------



## Blondilocks

I firmly believe that this thread was started for the sole purpose of riling the masses. It did turn out to be educational and I hope the teenagers who read here will pay particular attention to Ikaika's posts as he does have a PhD and is an educator.


----------



## GettingIt_2

Blondilocks said:


> I firmly believe that this thread was started for the sole purpose of riling the masses. It did turn out to be educational and I hope the teenagers who read here will pay particular attention to Ikaika's posts as he does have a PhD and is an educator.


Not to mention he draws the eye in his compression shorts. :smthumbup:


----------



## SunCMars

Blondilocks said:


> I firmly believe that this thread was started for the sole purpose of riling the masses. It did turn out to be educational and I hope the teenagers who read here will pay particular attention to Ikaika's posts as he does have a PhD and is an educator.


Riling the Masses?

Sure. A subject relatively virginal, save in Cosmopolitan Bohemia.
In our Era, in Western Bricklands, surely.

Ah! Certainly not in Former Walled Kingdoms of Yore. Where women were sized and measured. They who were Chattel.

And I note....

Many of the TAMMY Queen Bees smelled something. They arrived in Droves.

Was it Honey or was it Blood?
......................................................................................

Ah, yeah..

Jack bragging about his Bean Stalk.
The Female Giant at the far, upper Vertigo end of it. Sitting on top, bellowing, "You got to be kidding me. What are you going to do with That Thing!"

The poor guy just jumped, no parachute.
Fell down the distance.. Jack broke his crown. His pride left dirt-down.....on that muddy cloud, so High in the Dream.


----------



## Ikaika

I guess if some assume the female anatomy (and her physiological response to sexual arousal) is (are) what they think - ask any woman how she feels about a gynecological visit that requires probing. After all the doc should have no problem probing some caverns (like spelunking), correct?


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro


----------



## Not

Some women, like myself, have issues with vaginal size that can present problems in the bedroom. I have an inverted uterus which has caused me to have a shorter vaginal canal so sex can be painful if the P is to long. It's made it impossible for me to have sex with the man entering from behind if he's to large. In my case P size really does matter. 

For the men reading an inverted ( or tipped ) uterus is a uterus that formed so that it leans backward instead of forward away from the spine.

As for the rest of this topic I can see vaginal canal width varying from women to women. All the rest of our body parts vary in size from one person to the next. I think it would be sort of improbable that all women are the exact same size.


----------



## Diana7

The vagina is designed to stretch to accommodate different penis sizes. After all a large baby comes out. So whether the man is big or small doesn't usually matter.


----------



## Rowan

I'm just mildly fascinated, and a bit appalled, to think that the married OP and his friends have been describing in detail, and complaining about, their wives' vaginas. I mean, is this a conversation that most married men really have over a few beers with their buddies?


----------



## Middle of Everything

Rowan said:


> I'm just mildly fascinated, and a bit appalled, to think that the married OP has been describing in detail, and complaining about, vaginas - even their wives' vaginas - his friends. I mean, is this a conversation that most married men really have over a few beers with their buddies?


No.


----------



## samyeagar

Rowan said:


> I'm just mildly fascinated, and a bit appalled, to think that the married OP and his friends have been describing in detail, and complaining about, their wives' vaginas. I mean, is this a conversation that most married men really have over a few beers with their buddies?


I'd imagine no more than the women who do the same about their husbands.


----------



## Rowan

samyeagar said:


> I'd imagine no more than the women who do the same about their husbands.


I guess that happens in some circles, too. I just can't imagine discussing the intimate personal details of my sex life, or my partner's anatomy, with my girlfriends. While we may share the generalities or the occasional funny story, I guess we're not really the type to get too specific. That level of over-share is just really outside my experience.


----------



## brooklynAnn

I guess that happens in some circles, too. I just can't imagine discussing the intimate personal details of my sex life, or my partner's anatomy, with my girlfriends. While we may share the generalities or the occasional funny story, I guess we're not really the type to get too specific. That level of over-share is just really outside my experience.[/QUOTE]

I am like you, I don't feel comfortable speaking about such intimate details. Both my H and don't talk about our sex life with anyone. We do make jokes with friends but no details. My gfs are the same way. I wouldn't want to know anyway...tmi


----------



## Ikaika

knobcreek said:


> I'll close out with this.
> 
> 
> 
> Large vaginas ARE a problem, and I'm assuming if you require a fist and 10 inch dongs you have one. People can't discuss them because men are inherently conditioned to defend women, even in stupid circumstances where they're completely wrong, this is called being a white knight and the Internets are their domain. I'm outgunned here for sure. Women can mock men, be rude, treat them like **** and it's "man up", a man calls out large vaginas and he's shaming, or apparently everyone pretends large or sloppy vaginas don't exist.
> 
> 
> 
> No one cares if someone wants a huge ****, but to insist the average size is 7 inches is nonsensical and not even close to accurate. It's like saying the average height is 6'3. I have my own physical requirements that would likely leave many women who are attractive out from the get go. I don't like blonds at all, pale skin, large or unattractive feet, large/loose vaginas, mens haircuts on women, too petite, too small boobs, etc... I get it, no one cares what ones preference is, but get your facts straight.
> 
> 
> 
> My only point is the ones insisting on massive cocks are also into things like fisting, wife sharing (cuckolding), swinging, BDSM, they represent a very small fraction of the female population (but a large vocal minority here). Most women don't want a massive ****, it's painful. SGC is into extreme sexual stuff with her BF, so her statements should be understood in context.
> 
> 
> 
> back to your hug boxing.




I think when one starts a discussion suggesting that large sloppy vaginas are a problem, you are undoubtedly going to get pushback that penis size of average or less size is a problem for some women. Then they, women, will tell you size matters. 

It is very likely in the limited studies conducted that the average penis size is around 14 cm. 

However an unstimulated (non sexually aroused) female has average length (looked up two papers) vagina of about 7 cm. When sexually aroused it can more than double (stretchable accommodating organ) and increase in width. So, it's not going to grip the same way a hand or lips will grip around a penis shaft. If it did, it could be painful rather than pleasurable for her. It's not a problem unless one assumes it's a problem. A tighter and dryer vagina is a problem (especially for her - discomfort). 

For me personally, I never felt the large, sloppiness of vagina as some issue. It has always seemed comfortably accommodating. I see hand-jobs, PIV and fellatio as three separate forms of sex each with their unique yet wonderful outcomes. I've never done anal, so I can't attest to any form of pleasure with that act. 

Sex is to be enjoyed, not stressed over and about. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


----------



## Elizabeth001

Ikaika said:


> I think when one starts a discussion suggesting that large sloppy vaginas are a problem, you are undoubtedly going to get pushback that penis size of average or less size is a problem for some women. Then they, women, will tell you size matters.
> 
> It is very likely in the limited studies conducted that the average penis size is around 14 cm.
> 
> However an unstimulated (non sexually aroused) female has average length (looked up two papers) vagina of about 7 cm. When sexually aroused it can more than double (stretchable accommodating organ) and increase in width. So, it's not going to grip the same way a hand or lips will grip around a penis shaft. If it did, it could be painful rather than pleasurable for her. It's not a problem unless one assumes it's a problem. A tighter and dryer vagina is a problem (especially for her - discomfort).
> 
> For me personally, I never felt the large, sloppiness of vagina as some issue. It has always seemed comfortably accommodating. I see hand-jobs, PIV and fellatio as three separate forms of sex each with their unique yet wonderful outcomes. I've never done anal, so I can't attest to any form of pleasure with that act.
> 
> Sex is to be enjoyed, not stressed over and about.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro




Well done!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## ConanHub

Rowan said:


> I'm just mildly fascinated, and a bit appalled, to think that the married OP and his friends have been describing in detail, and complaining about, their wives' vaginas. I mean, is this a conversation that most married men really have over a few beers with their buddies?


Definitely not. Mrs. Conan and I have one couple we talk to about everything and laugh about it as well but they are in their own classification when it comes to us.
We each have unique access to information about each other, basically everything, and it all stays with us.


----------



## Livvie

OP starts a thread that large vaginas are a problem, and a big contributor to bad sex.

Is there any man who has posted to agree with the OP?


----------



## SunCMars

Diana7 said:


> The vagina is designed to stretch to accommodate different penis sizes. After all a large baby comes out. So whether the man is big or small doesn't usually matter.


That is why I like you.

You are so pragmatic. You deal with what is given....within reason. :surprise:
...................................................................................................................

Where it matters is the friction. 

Not mental, but mechanical.

Both sexes enjoy that surface tension. 

The rhythmic pull of the Moon on Magellan's Strait.


----------



## SunCMars

Livvie said:


> OP starts a thread that large vaginas are a problem, and a big contributor to bad sex.
> 
> Is there any man who has posted to agree with the OP?


Yeah, step right up. Lay it on the table.

And he would be:

A brave man.
A fool.
Celibate. 

In the corner, gland in hand.
.................................................................

Man know where bread buttered.

Man not know...where she stuck Mini, heavy-duty Snappin' Rat Trap, Ouch! :grin2:


----------



## SunCMars

Rowan said:


> I'm just mildly fascinated, and a bit appalled, to think that the married OP and his friends have been describing in detail, and complaining about, their wives' vaginas. I mean, is this a conversation that most married men really have over a few beers with their buddies?


Yes, Maam...

Men under 25, more so under 20 make this a frequent topic to be discussed and made fun of.
I suspect few of them were getting any...or not much.
Growing up we heard all the jokes about VJ's.


----------



## sissyphus

I've got a small penis, so all vaginas seem cavernous to me. In fact, I could swear I hear echoing some times.


----------



## She'sStillGotIt

Rowan said:


> I mean, is this a conversation that most married men really have over a few beers with their buddies?


I don't think so. I think the more common conversation they usually have is all about how much action they all got - with runway models, bikini models and playboy bunnies - before they got married.

:grin2:


----------



## Luvher4life

As a man, I can truthfully say I haven't felt a single vagina that didn't feel good. Yes, some weren't the "best" fit for me physically, but the chemistry was just as important.

Unfortunately, it seems to men at least, that the onus of size is with them, even though they can't do anything to substantially increase their size. A woman, on the other hand, has options. The easiest option for both is to do kegels regularly. Pelvic floor muscle tone will increase pleasure for both partners, and I think ALL people should do them.

I think penis size is far down the list of the most important features a woman looks for in a man, unless he falls on either extreme, ie too big or too small. If you fall somewhere within the normal averages of penis size, and *develop other skills that can rock her world*, I don't think it'll ever be an issue with most women. The trick is bolded, whether you are below average, average, above average, or huge.

There's always going to be exceptions to the rule. A small percentage of women are size queens. Some men only like small vaginas, etc. I guess that's just one of the things that makes us all unique.


----------



## Faithful Wife

Luvher4life said:


> I think penis size is far down the list of the most important features a woman looks for in a man, unless he falls on either extreme, ie too big or too small. If you fall somewhere within the normal averages of penis size, and *develop other skills that can rock her world*, I don't think it'll ever be an issue with most women. The trick is bolded, whether you are below average, average, above average, or huge.
> 
> There's always going to be exceptions to the rule. A small percentage of women are size queens. Some men only like small vaginas, etc. I guess that's just one of the things that makes us all unique.


Far down the list? Um, no. Very high on the list for me and the single ladies I know.

It's true that skill can make up for a lack of size, but that doesn't mean lack of size won't be an issue. Sometimes it is.


----------



## ConanHub

Faithful Wife said:


> Far down the list? Um, no. Very high on the list for me and the single ladies I know.
> 
> It's true that skill can make up for a lack of size, but that doesn't mean lack of size won't be an issue. Sometimes it is.


I can't say I've observed this either.

My experience is totally subjective and anecdotal however.

I still seem to have seen enough evidence to conclude that attraction, raw sexuality, humor, looks, personality, confidence, charm, seduction, etc... can and do contribute more towards choice of a mate than penis size.

I have held up my pinky, trying to get rid of unwanted attention, and told women that I'm sorry but that was all I had and seen boldness as well as confidence increase in the woman hunting me.

I will defer to women who are posting, however, because I am not a woman and I can't say that maybe a lot of women are looking for a big one or as close as they can get and it is a high priority for a mate.

I am also not on the smaller end of the spectrum and I may not have the insight that would have given me.

Mrs. Conan climaxes from my tongue or the tip of my finger or combination and my tool is far larger than my tongue or finger yet she doesn't climax from PIV. Yet she still wouldn't like it if my unit was smaller.

It has to be psychological to some extent though she really enjoys PIV even though no climax occurs.

I'm not going to figure this one out so I'm just gonna shut it and be happy with my sex life!😁 :grin2:


----------



## Vinnydee

I am 66 and have had a lot of sex with a lot of women especially since my wife is bi and would not have sex with her girlfriends unless I took part, if only to watch. Complicated thing about making it feel heterosexual if a male was in the room. I think she could pretend that she was giving me a show. 

Without a doubt my best sex was with women who never had kids. For our first wife swap I was with a woman who had 3 kids and was older than me. I could not get enough friction to cum, so I gave her an oral orgasm and then watched my wife with her husband. My wife was not having a good time either. The guy was too rough. My wife is less than 5' tall and weighed 85 lbs. at the time. He was used to pounding away on his wife but when he did that to my wife, he bruised her. That is the last time she ever had sex with another guy.

My wife's longtime girlfriend had one kid and compared to my wife, she was loose and it took me a long time to orgasm. Just no luck with women who had kids. I think out of the 30 or so women I had sex with, only two had kids and they just felt too large for me especially since what I was used to.


----------



## DepressedHusband

I did everything you could do to my wife's vagina for 21 yrs and she had health issues, it was tighter after the baby then before. Maybe OP has smaller then average penis ? I have been with girls I could fist, and still enjoyed my time their, its a muscle, maybe these women aren't that interested,they have a just right tension when a women is very aroused.


----------



## chillymorn69

Karma sutra says women wth big viginas should be with men with big penis

And vice versa.


Seems logical to me.


Its ok to have a lage vigina . Oviously if its important to have a man with a large penis then it seems logical thats its because you have a large vigina.

I think some protest too much...

Hmm


----------



## Satya

I asked Odo for his input on this thread and he went to the barn as if on a mission. He returned with this and said that it should help with the cavernous issue.


----------



## Don't Panic

^^^^^^
:rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl:


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

After kids is super important to do kegals. More drs should talk about them Imo. Age when having kids makes a difference too. 

Being tighter after kids can be due to women doing more kegals to make sure they stay in shape after the baby. I didn't know about them until I had kids so I didn't do them until then. I am likely tighter now than I was before them just because I'm more careful to do kegals. 

Conan - trust that piv can feel amazing even without being able to O from it. Fingers feel nice too but again, apples and oranges. Different sensations. I can O easier with fingers and oral but that alone wouldn't feel like quite enough. I want the feeling of Piv. That said, only non-O piv wouldn't be enough if he didn't also do other things to make me O but I know that isn't an issue for you and your wife so enjoy, she is! 

I never used to be a big piv fan. Didn't make me O and didn't do much for me. Would hurt more often than anything else. Turns out it was just the wrong man/penis. Now I have the right man/penis and I love it. Can't get enough. I've tried ... a few .... and some feel great and some just don't . So for me, penis size - and shape - matter cause I want to have sex that I love and crave and can't get enough of. He can be great at everything else but I want it all. 

The "obviously if a woman likes a big penis she has a large vagina" is well... its own protesting too much. 

Vaginas change shape. They go from super small to super big. The muscles around them grip. The differences in how much gripping and how much stretching changes how it feels. 
I have like 2 dozen toys at least. All different sizes, all different sensations. Getting it made great points about a woman getting to have different sensations and not just ones that are her husband penis size and smaller. Many woman love the full, stretched feeling. 
But if they are with a husband who thinks women who like anything big are loose then they may not get to experiment and try new things. 

Sex for me and my bf = judgement free zone. Neither him or I ever have negative feelings about the others wants and desires and we try to fulfill them in whatever way we can. If he was close minded to the point of "anything large must mean you're loose" then our sex life would stall. 

Men want women into sex and passionate about it and wanting to try new things, then stop trying to shame them.


----------



## Mr The Other

I have been fortunate enough to enjoy intimacy with a number of women which might be considered excessively reasonable.

In that time, I have only encountered one lady who was of such a size that this became an issue. She had actually been a virgin, and it took great patience and then she opened up.

She discussed with me that it did not feel like she had expected and asked whether I was very small perhaps? I was a gentleman as accept that, a white lie that I am happy to justify as it had taken a long time for her to relax enough to have sex. She undertook kegal exercises to overcome the size issue and it was very effective.

At times she would grip me so hard with her vagina that I would have to raise alarm. She also recieved much pleasure.


----------



## Satya

Don't Panic said:


> ^^^^^^
> :rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl:


I was hesitant to post it earlier, but his exact words as he slapped it on the table were, "this should get her tighter in no time."

Yes, he is like this EVERY DAY. :rofl:


----------



## Luvher4life

Faithful Wife said:


> Far down the list? Um, no. Very high on the list for me and the single ladies I know.
> 
> It's true that skill can make up for a lack of size, but that doesn't mean lack of size won't be an issue. Sometimes it is.


Spoken like a true size queen. It's your right to pick and choose what you think you need. I wasn't talking about the extreme cases where it's too small, by the way.

I am a little above average in size, been with over 50 women of all sizes and shapes (something I'm not proud of), and only about 5 or 6 were true size queens. That didn't stop them from having orgasms, and coming back for more.


----------



## Don't Panic

Love it! @Satya

A man with confidence and a risque sense of humor is super sexy > 

Bonus points of course for knowing how to "approach" all those large, insecure vaginas out there. HAHAHAHA


----------



## Diana7

samyeagar said:


> I'd imagine no more than the women who do the same about their husbands.


Many of us would never do that, its totally disrespectful.


----------



## Diana7

Luvher4life said:


> Spoken like a true size queen. It's your right to pick and choose what you think you need. I wasn't talking about the extreme cases where it's too small, by the way.
> 
> I am a little above average in size, been with over 50 women of all sizes and shapes (something I'm not proud of), and only about 5 or 6 were true size queens. That didn't stop them from having orgasms, and coming back for more.


How sad that some women reject or accept men purely due to the size of their penis. How shallow. :frown2:


----------



## karole

Diana7 said:


> How sad that some women reject or accept men purely due to the size of their penis. How shallow. :frown2:


I don't think it's any more shallow than a man that rejects a woman due to her bra size, a flat ass, overweight, etc. Everyone has standards and preferences.


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Diana7 said:


> How sad that some women reject or accept men purely due to the size of their penis. How shallow. :frown2:


It's no different than accepting or rejecting people for any other reason. Attractiveness, religion, financial security. Everyone has different things they want from a partner. 
Good sex happens to be on my list. 

People brushing off important aspects of compatiblity leads to unhappy marriages and sex lives.


----------



## ButtPunch

Large vagina.....Ive never experienced one. 

Didn't even know they existed.

...but my nickname was tripod in college.


----------



## Buddy400

Faithful Wife said:


> Far down the list? Um, no. Very high on the list for me and the single ladies I know.
> 
> It's true that skill can make up for a lack of size, but that doesn't mean lack of size won't be an issue. Sometimes it is.


Having high requirements in this area would be a problem for most women. I'd look at it as almost being a handicap.

Let's say that you require a penis in the top 10% (size- wise) to be sexually satisfied, that knocks out 90% of your options.

From what I understand, you are a very attractive woman with absolutely no problem finding men. So, when you have 100 candidates, knocking 90 of them out still leaves you with plenty of options. 

For a woman with 5 candidates, disqualifying 90% of them right off the bat is a bigger issue. Sure, she might find a "top ten-percenter" to have sex with her once in a while, but obtaining a lifetime partner who satisfies her might be problematic. Of course, she could settle for and marry a man who doesn't meet her penis requirements, but we all know that that isn't likely to end well.

And, of course, if one has strict requirements in one area, one may need to be more forgiving in other areas. 

I'm glad I'm not restricted to only having sex with women who have exceptional breasts. That wouldn't be a problem for Tom Brady but, of course, I'm no Tom Brady.


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Personally I have never had a problem finding a good penis size. For a small % of the population, I've come across them more often than not. Out of say 20 men, 2-3 were too small, 2-3 were too big and the rest were in the right size for me. 

Plenty of options that I can be as picky as needed for all the other qualities he needs to have. 

I've never had friends complain that they couldn't find a good partner with a penis size they wanted. They just veto the ones who don't. 

I don't think it's a big, handicap issue. 

I am, ftr, simply an average looking woman with an average amount of candidates.


----------



## alexm

Diana7 said:


> How sad that some women reject or accept men purely due to the size of their penis. How shallow. :frown2:


Completely disagree. Completely.

One of (many) keys to a happy, healthy and great marriage is compatibility, sexual or otherwise.

For many people, such as @faithfulwife , sexual compatibility is high on the list.

It's every persons right to pick and choose what is important to them in a partner, and if penis size is on that list, so be it. Sex is extremely important to her (and many others), so if an average penis is not adequate to give her proper sexual pleasure, there's absolutely nothing wrong with that.


----------



## Buddy400

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> Personally I have never had a problem finding a good penis size. For a small % of the population, I've come across them more often than not. Out of say 20 men, 2-3 were too small, 2-3 were too big and the rest were in the right size for me.


Finding a 'Good' penis isn't the problem.

Finding a penis whose size is the top 10% means (by definition) that only 10% of men have what you need which (again, by definition) means that 90% of men would be excluded. So, out of 20, only 2 would be the "right size".

If 'Good' for you consisted of 75% of available penises (which reflects the numbers you used above), then you wouldn't be very limited in your choices.

From your previous comments, I would have assumed that you had stricter criteria than that.


----------



## Buddy400

alexm said:


> so if an average penis is not adequate to give her proper sexual pleasure, there's absolutely nothing wrong with that.


As long as she is someone who has ready access to above average penises (which FW apparently does).

If all women required above average penises, that would result in a lot of sexually unfulfilled women.


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Buddy400 said:


> Finding a 'Good' penis isn't the problem.
> 
> Finding a penis whose size is the top 10% means (by definition) that only 10% of men have what you need which (again, by definition) means that 90% of men would be excluded. So, out of 20, only 2 would be the "right size".
> 
> If 'Good' for you consisted of 75% of available penises (which reflects the numbers you used above), then you wouldn't be very limited in your choices.
> 
> From your previous comments, I would have assumed that you had stricter criteria than that.


Good for me is roughly 7" and a good girth. That's supposed to be a very rare amount. I haven't found that to be the case. That has been my average find


----------



## Middle of Everything

Maybe we are trending towards more gender equality. A vag size thread that has reached 16 pages. Not sure what most **** size threads reach but Im guessing its around this length. (pun kind of intended )


----------



## Deperatedwoman

lol


----------



## GettingIt_2

Middle of Everything said:


> Maybe we are trending towards more gender equality. A vag size thread that has reached 16 pages. Not sure what most **** size threads reach but Im guessing its around this length. (pun kind of intended )


Except I feel like this is actually a penis size thread (thinly) disguised as a vag size thread. Might just be me, but . . .


----------



## Diana7

karole said:


> I don't think it's any more shallow than a man that rejects a woman due to her bra size, a flat ass, overweight, etc. Everyone has standards and preferences.


I would never reject a man for anything so shallow.


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Diana7 said:


> I would never reject a man for anything so shallow.


Looks/sex aren't on your list. 
Would you reject a man for not being religious? 

If yes, then that is on your list. 

One list isn't better or worse or more shallow than the other. Everyone has their own needs and preferences.


----------



## Diana7

alexm said:


> Completely disagree. Completely.
> 
> One of (many) keys to a happy, healthy and great marriage is compatibility, sexual or otherwise.
> 
> For many people, such as @faithfulwife , sexual compatibility is high on the list.
> 
> It's every persons right to pick and choose what is important to them in a partner, and if penis size is on that list, so be it. Sex is extremely important to her (and many others), so if an average penis is not adequate to give her proper sexual pleasure, there's absolutely nothing wrong with that.


 iF you love someone you won't care if they have a large/small penis or large/small boobs or whatever else it is. You don't need a certain size anything to have a good happy marriage and great sex life.


----------



## Luvher4life

Diana7 said:


> How sad that some women reject or accept men purely due to the size of their penis. How shallow. :frown2:


I couldn't agree more. That's sad.


----------



## Ikaika

Good men are hard to find, but a big hard man is a good find. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


----------



## Middle of Everything

Ikaika said:


> Good men are hard to find, but a big hard man is a good find.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


Hey dont turn this into a **** thread Ikaika. Now please give us a similar funny for vags.:grin2:


----------



## ConanHub

Diana7 said:


> iF you love someone you won't care if they have a large/small penis or large/small boobs or whatever else it is. You don't need a certain size anything to have a good happy marriage and great sex life.


I pretty much see it like this.

People can have whatever standards they want of course but I have had very good success without placing importance on physical attributes that can't be changed by effort.

Mrs. Conan is short, I dated tall before I met her, she was small everywhere, I dated women built like Jessica Rabbit before her.

Mrs. Conan had my heart on sight, had integrity, sense of humor and the rest was just details.

Rejecting her based on physical characteristics that she could not alter would have been the biggest mistake in my life!

I do think that the way some of these posts come off is painting the women posting them in a bad light.

I don't think men that choose mates on unalterable physical traits come off well either.

I also don't believe for a second that if a beautiful man, physically, mentally and emotionally beautiful, came into these women's lives that they wouldn't give a fig about his penis size unless it was extremely small or large and even then might work through it.

Just my opinion.


----------



## Ikaika

alexm said:


> Completely disagree. Completely.
> 
> 
> 
> One of (many) keys to a happy, healthy and great marriage is compatibility, sexual or otherwise.
> 
> 
> 
> For many people, such as @faithfulwife , sexual compatibility is high on the list.
> 
> 
> 
> It's every persons right to pick and choose what is important to them in a partner, and if penis size is on that list, so be it. Sex is extremely important to her (and many others), so if an average penis is not adequate to give her proper sexual pleasure, there's absolutely nothing wrong with that.




I can agree with most of what is suggested here. No doubt, sexual incompatibility, which could cover more than just size alone, could be a real deterrent in any relationship. I mean we read about these all the time here in TAM (maybe not directly related to size). 

I had asked earlier whether any of the ladies here' "slyly", glanced at a man's package (or at least estimated it) through what ever clothing he was wearing at the time. The responses were interesting. So, is it shallow to judge based on package size (for a potential relationship) while not appear shallow for other characteristics? I don't know. Genetics is obviously something that cannot be changed but other non-physical attributes can possibly change in a person. Should do we only judge the latter but not the former? Again, I don't really know if I have an answer. 

I can say, breast size or trunk size has never been a date killer for me. However, whether some want to assume it is shallow, I have never been attracted to white women. It is not that I'm prejudice against any race, I just am not sexuality attracted to this demographic of females. 

It may also be that women with more melanin and cultural diversity are more common where I live. Sure, I have seen attractive white women and I have approached them in conversation, but I just have never felt a desire to date them. Does this make me judgmental and wrong? I don't know, but I know what my preferences are and I just deal with it that way. So, I do think that one can have preferences without being shallow or wrongheaded in their thinking. But, if it becomes one where one finds it restrictive to other non-romantic relationships based on physical attributes is where I see issues. 


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro


----------



## alexm

Buddy400 said:


> As long as she is someone who has ready access to above average penises (which FW apparently does).
> 
> If all women required above average penises, that would result in a lot of sexually unfulfilled women.


But not all women do, so it's a moot point. Most can make do just fine with a wider range of size. Many don't care. Some prefer on the smaller range.

Like absolutely anything in life, everybody has different wants, needs or requirements.

What I find "necessary" in a woman (physically speaking) is probably not the same as you. Or the next guy, or the guy after that.


----------



## alexm

Diana7 said:


> iF you love someone you won't care if they have a large/small penis or large/small boobs or whatever else it is. You don't need a certain size anything to have a good happy marriage and great sex life.


Some (many?) people disagree.

As @SlowlyGoingCrazy said above, it's not on your list. Something like religious views would be, I imagine. Some might consider that to be shallow.

It's all the same, Diana - we all want what we want, physically, mentally, emotionally and spiritually. Where _you_ rank each thing on your list will be different than someone else's.

And once again, your own specific views on things don't allign with others, therefore you need to comment that they're _wrong_, rather than pull your head out and recognize that everybody is different.


----------



## Rocky Mountain Yeti

alexm said:


> Some (many?) people disagree.
> 
> As @SlowlyGoingCrazy said above, it's not on your list. Something like religious views would be, I imagine. Some might consider that to be shallow.
> 
> It's all the same, Diana - we all want what we want, physically, mentally, emotionally and spiritually. Where _you_ rank each thing on your list will be different than someone else's.
> 
> And once again, your own specific views on things don't allign with others, therefore you need to comment that they're _wrong_, rather than pull your head out and recognize that everybody is different.


I understand the need many feel to keep reminding Diana that we're all different which doesn't necessarily equate to right and wrong.

However, I believe she makes a very good point here. Earlier, I shared a list of my physical preferences ... then noted that my wife shares none of them, yet she attracted me more than anyone before or since, and does so to a greater degree each day, now 31 years later. 

So preferences are not absolute. One can fall in love outside one's basic preference set. To automatically discount anybody outside the preconceived wish list is to sell ourselves short and miss out on some really great opportunities. 

And yes, if you really love someone, superficial aesthetics won't matter. If some superficial trait gets in the way, you probably didn't really love the person anyway...which is also okay...just be willing to admit that rather than go through twisted mental and logical gymnastics to try to prove to the world (or yourself) you don't have superficial needs and that you're really a judgment free person.


----------



## Ikaika

Rocky Mountain Yeti said:


> I understand the need many feel to keep reminding Diana that we're all different which doesn't necessarily equate to right and wrong.
> 
> 
> 
> However, I believe she makes a very good point here. Earlier, I shared a list of my physical preferences ... then noted that my wife shares none of them, yet she attracted me more than anyone before or since, and does so to a greater degree each day, now 31 years later.
> 
> 
> 
> So preferences are not absolute. One can fall in love outside one's basic preference set. To automatically discount anybody outside the preconceived wish list is to sell ourselves short and miss out on some really great opportunities.
> 
> 
> 
> And yes, if you really love someone, superficial aesthetics won't matter. If some superficial trait gets in the way, you probably didn't really love the person anyway...which is also okay...just be willing to admit that rather than go through twisted mental and logical gymnastics to try to prove to the world (or yourself) you don't have superficial needs and that you're really a judgment free person.




And, physical attributes change as we get older, too many anatomical structures head south. 


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro


----------



## alexm

ConanHub said:


> I pretty much see it like this.
> 
> People can have whatever standards they want of course but I have had very good success without placing importance on physical attributes that can't be changed by effort.
> 
> Mrs. Conan is short, I dated tall before I met her, she was small everywhere, I dated women built like Jessica Rabbit before her.
> 
> Mrs. Conan had my heart on sight, had integrity, sense of humor and the rest was just details.
> 
> Rejecting her based on physical characteristics that she could not alter would have been the biggest mistake in my life!
> 
> I do think that the way some of these posts come off is painting the women posting them in a bad light.
> 
> I don't think men that choose mates on unalterable physical traits come off well either.
> 
> I also don't believe for a second that if a beautiful man, physically, mentally and emotionally beautiful, came into these women's lives that they wouldn't give a fig about his penis size unless it was extremely small or large and even then might work through it.
> 
> Just my opinion.


I'm a lot like you. My wife does not fit my quote/unquote "ideal", yet I find her irresistibly sexy, physically.

You're right, it does not paint men or women in a good light, but I'm not sure those who have these requirements particularly care.

To a woman like FW, we know that sex is at (or at least very very near) the top of her "list". It's also not the only thing on her list.

For me, it's not. It's near the top of my list for sure, but it's not nearly as important as many other things. Clearly that is the case, because my wife is LD/ND and my sex life is about 25% of what I'd like it to be... Yet I'm still here, because the other things trump sex. Now if there were NO sex, I'd be gone, I know that much.

For some (like FW), unsatisfying sex is equivalent to no sex for the rest of us. And that's perfectly fine and reasonable. Just like most of us would not willingly marry someone if there was NO sex, she would not want a relationship where the sex was not up to her standards.

Are those standards high? Perhaps. Perhaps not. But really, what does anybody care?

I'm a shorter dude, and although I've never been rejected knowingly because of that, I'm sure it's happened. I've also heard my fair share of women around me say that they prefer taller men (most women seem to!)

Should I be insulted? Maybe. Not really. I don't know. The way I've always looked at it is that if someone wouldn't date me because I'm not to their height specifications, it's no great loss. Not because I thought they were picky, but because - right off the bat - I'm not a match for them. So should I be insulted? If so, why?

Should I pine after someone, saying "just give me a chance?" God no. **** that. You don't like my height, my hair, my looks, my hands, my **** - oh well.


----------



## Ikaika

When I first met my wife, 27 years ago, she looked like Zhang Ziyi, basically my type. In my mind she still looks like Zhang Ziyi, but realistically she is older (not ugly), as am I. 

In the looks department, I married up. But, we are compatible in so many other ways that she has been just fine with my looks. 


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro


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## SlowlyGoingCrazy

I get penis size and ability in bed out of the way pretty quick. Long before "love". 

Before I really began to enjoy and really desire sex I probably would have not cared as much and ended up with just whatever size I ended up with. Now that I've embraced my desires and sex is a priority to me it is something that is needed. 

A good size isn't just how PIV feels. It's how it looks, how bjs go, etc. Part of my kink is a c*ck worshiper so a good one is part of that. Then there is how he feels about it, if he is self conscious about his own size then playing with large toys or other men, or even posting pictures and videos can end up just right off the table to protect his feelings. 

So for many, many reasons it is on my list of must haves. It's not just look or feel (though it is these too), it's my overall sex life and that's not something I'm willing to budge on. 

Looks are further down on my list, I find different things attractive and a man's behavior changes how attractive he is to me dramatically. 

It can be shallow. I'd rather be shallow than unsatisfied.


----------



## alexm

Rocky Mountain Yeti said:


> I understand the need many feel to keep reminding Diana that we're all different which doesn't necessarily equate to right and wrong.
> 
> However, I believe she makes a very good point here. Earlier, I shared a list of my physical preferences ... then noted that my wife shares none of them, yet she attracted me more than anyone before or since, and does so to a greater degree each day, now 31 years later.
> 
> So preferences are not absolute. One can fall in love outside one's basic preference set. To automatically discount anybody outside the preconceived wish list is to sell ourselves short and miss out on some really great opportunities.
> 
> And yes, if you really love someone, superficial aesthetics won't matter. If some superficial trait gets in the way, you probably didn't really love the person anyway...which is also okay...just be willing to admit that rather than go through twisted mental and logical gymnastics to try to prove to the world (or yourself) you don't have superficial needs and that you're really a judgment free person.


Again, I don't disagree. *I* don't have these "shallow" requirements, either, lol. My wife is not my "ideal", but I find her incredibly sexy because I love her. When we met, she was over 200lbs (I was ~150). My ex wife was 4'11, 95lbs. She's since lost a considerable amount, and I actually don't find her any more attractive than when we met (believe it or not, she carried those 200lbs really, really well).

She's hot to me because I love her - which is in agreement with Diana, Conan and your takes on the matter.

But. That's not to say that someone is wrong for requiring x, y or z. To many of us (I hesitate to say "most") things like that are a non-issue. To many/most women, penis size is a (relative) non-issue. It doesn't make one _wrong_ to have a specific preference for something that can not be (reasonably or easily) changed.

FWIW, although I'm a shorter guy, I'm bigger than average down there. If a potential partner were to ask me specifically about it, or want to see it first, or otherwise imply that she requires a larger penis, I'd laugh and tell her this isn't going to work - despite "measuring" up. I'm not interested in having to "make the cut" because of something physically specific.

So although I'm not one of those people, I think they're completely entitled to have their own requirements, no matter what they are. They know exactly what they want, and what will work for them, which really isn't a bad thing. Besides, if you're THAT hard to please, then I'd be happy to take a pass!


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

FTR- I'd never ask to see it to check if it measured up. Just comes along with seeing it during sex. I've never once told a guy his penis size was the reason for no call back. A lot of times I'd get sent pics and I could veto before a date if needed but usually have to see it or feel how it fits to get a good judge of the shape and if it'll work out or not. If it doesn't, we are just "not compatible". I'd never tell a guy his penis wasn't good enough for me. 

NSA sex or anon hookups with my bf don't matter but tend to have a fine size anyway. 
Very rarely has there been any kind of issue in either direction. There is sometimes quite a bit of differences in feels. Some just don't feel as good as others. Long term needs to feel good, short term I don't care.


----------



## Buddy400

karole said:


> I don't think it's any more shallow than a man that rejects a woman due to her bra size, a flat ass, overweight, etc. Everyone has standards and preferences.


I don't think it's shallow for either.

One problem men don't have is that they don't have to wait to have sex until they discover her bra size.

So, if penis size is a requirement you'll waste any time dating prior to having sex. 

Either you'll need to have sex very quickly with every date or solicit dic pics ahead of time.

Otherwise, you run the risk of developing feelings for him, talking yourself into thinking it doesn't matter and spending years being sexually unsatisfied.


----------



## Blondilocks

Satya said:


> I was hesitant to post it earlier, but his exact words as he slapped it on the table were, "this should get her tighter in no time."
> 
> Yes, he is like this EVERY DAY. :rofl:


My late husband would have slapped down a can of wood filler.:surprise:


----------



## Buddy400

alexm said:


> I'm a lot like you. My wife does not fit my quote/unquote "ideal", yet I find her irresistibly sexy, physically.


Does your wife not being "ideal" mean that she can not sexually satisfy you?

Women here aren't talking about "preferences" that can be overcome or offset by other attributes. They're talking about being unable to have a satisfactory sex life if the penis doesn't meet certain criteria (and these criteria exclude at least 60% of men).

I have no problem with women requiring large penises and I'd be very happy if women made their requirements clear ahead of time.

The last thing in the world I'd want is to be in a relationship with someone who requires something that I have no possible way to give her in order to be sexually satisfied.


----------



## Luvher4life

I honestly don't care what penis size a woman wants. It's her prerogative to pick whatever size she thinks she wants. I don't have an issue with that. My question is do they get a tape measure out every time just to see if they fit their requirements? Sorry, boy, I'm not wasting my time with you because you don't measure up. For what it's worth, most women are horrible at guessing measurements. Men don't help by telling them their packing a eight incher when it's really around 6 or so.


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## Luvher4life

Buddy400 said:


> Does your wife not being "ideal" mean that she can not sexually satisfy you?
> 
> Women here aren't talking about "preferences" that can be overcome or offset by other attributes. They're talking about being unable to have a satisfactory sex life if the penis doesn't meet certain criteria (and these criteria exclude at least 60% of men).
> 
> I have no problem with women requiring large penises and I'd be very happy if women made their requirements clear ahead of time.
> 
> The last thing in the world I'd want is to be in a relationship with someone who requires something that I have no possible way to give her in order to be sexually satisfied.


Beware of women with tape measures!:grin2:


----------



## Middle of Everything

alexm said:


> But. That's not to say that someone is wrong for requiring x, y or z. To many of us (I hesitate to say "most") things like that are a non-issue. To many/most women, penis size is a (relative) non-issue. It doesn't make one _wrong_ to have a specific preference for something that can not be (reasonably or easily) changed.


I get what you are saying and agree for the most part as well Alex.

It doesnt make someone WRONG to have certain preferences ,but it can make them shallow or superficial. If my "preference" is more of a requirement for say DDs attached to a size 2 making 100+K I just might be kind of shallow/superficial. Really ****ing lonely and shallow/superficial. :grin2:

To me its how FAR you take that preference. How strict you are in how closely you feel your mate must adhere to said preference. And maybe to a degree what exactly that preference is. 

As with many here my wife isnt really my IDEAL preferred body type. But I love her very much and find her sexy still.


----------



## Middle of Everything

Blondilocks said:


> My late husband would have slapped down a can of wood filler.:surprise:


But that would harden. Then what?

If im thinking here I would just shoot it up with some botox. Swell right up. Grip like a sum ***** then. :grin2:


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Once you know how a size feels and looks it's pretty easy to figure out others. How many hands, how it feels, how it looks. 

The men I have measured were actually bigger than they thought. They also figured they were "about average" when they were quite a bit larger than average.


----------



## alexm

Buddy400 said:


> Does your wife not being "ideal" mean that she can not sexually satisfy you?
> 
> Women here aren't talking about "preferences" that can be overcome or offset by other attributes. They're talking about being unable to have a satisfactory sex life if the penis doesn't meet certain criteria (and these criteria exclude at least 60% of men).
> 
> I have no problem with women requiring large penises and I'd be very happy if women made their requirements clear ahead of time.
> 
> The last thing in the world I'd want is to be in a relationship with someone who requires something that I have no possible way to give her in order to be sexually satisfied.


To be blunt, my wife is bigger down there than I'd prefer, so yes. If I were average or below, I don't think I'd get enough stimulation, TBPH. It's not my ideal. Despite being larger myself, I would hazard a guess and say that I am not my wife's ideal, either. Shrug. I was a bit too large for my ex wife, and another woman I was with, we didn't even get that far. I stress, I am not enormous, either.

One woman I was with looong ago was WAY too loose for me. She definitely preferred larger penises, and (much like FW!) didn't shy away from saying so. I assumed I would have been perfectly adequate for her, because I'm not small myself. Nooooo. Wrong. Very wrong! I think both of us were like "uhhhhh... okay then". Nothing was said afterwards, we just remained friends and went on our way.

But like _most_ women OR men, they can make do and it's definitely workable - just not ideal, or 'perfect'.

Some women (and men) require perfection, or close to it.

Most of us, myself included, do not require this. Would I prefer a better fit (either a tighter vagina for her or a bigger penis for me)? Yes. Is it unsatisfying? Not at all. She probably feels the same way. I don't know, it's not exactly something either of us would admit to the other!


----------



## Blondilocks

Some people are taking this thread entirely too seriously. Reminds me of my late sister who I would tease by saying she would be a lot more comfortable if she yanked that stick out of her butt.


----------



## Luvher4life

If you can make a woman squirt regularly, orgasm regularly, does that make up for the 1/2" difference that some of these women on here require?

Haha......., is there an echo in here? Don't throw that wiener down this hallway!


----------



## Faithful Wife

Luvher4life said:


> *Spoken like a true size queen*. It's your right to pick and choose what you think you need. I wasn't talking about the extreme cases where it's too small, by the way.
> 
> I am a little above average in size, been with over 50 women of all sizes and shapes (something I'm not proud of), and only about 5 or 6 were true size queens. That didn't stop them from having orgasms, and coming back for more.


Notice how just having a preference makes me a "size queen". 

Size queen is a specific kink term and does not apply to me.

But the attempt to shame me about it - - even if I was one - - is quite telling of the person doing the shaming.


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Luvher4life said:


> If you can make a woman squirt regularly, orgasm regularly, does that make up for the 1/2" difference that some of these women on here require?
> 
> Haha......., is there an echo in here? Don't throw that wiener down this hallway!


It all depends on the woman. 

I really doubt it's a half inch that most women would be complaining about. The difference between a 5.5 and under and a 7 is quite a bit. Girth also matters as does general fit and feel. Some just feel better than others. 

Making a woman O is a must anyway. Starting from last year, pretty much every man has been able to make me O. Most squirting Os. Doesn't mean they were all what I prefer or want sexually or that they were great in bed. 

Take a woman who doesn't do oral or anal or any new positions so he's stuck with 1 thing that feels fine and can make him O but it isn't his preference. 
Is just making him O enough to fully satisfy him? 
For some men, yes. For some women, yes. 

Likely most wives are happy with the size of their husbands penis so it's a non-issue what any one else's preferences is as long as your wife likes it.


----------



## Faithful Wife

Rocky Mountain Yeti said:


> So preferences are not absolute. One can fall in love outside one's basic preference set. To automatically discount anybody outside the preconceived wish list is to sell ourselves short and miss out on some really great opportunities.
> 
> And yes, *if you really love someone*, superficial aesthetics won't matter. If some superficial trait gets in the way, you probably didn't really love the person anyway...which is also okay...just be willing to admit that rather than go through twisted mental and logical gymnastics to try to prove to the world (or yourself) you don't have superficial needs and that you're really a judgment free person.


Loooooong before knowing someone at all, not even CLOSE to being in love with them, I would have sussed out my preferences or lack thereof and not continued dating someone if they didn't meet them.

What you or anyone else considers "superficial aesthetics" is whatever your ideas of that term are. For me, basic strong mutual sexual and physical attraction is not "superficial".

You know how all these guys on TAM post about how they wish so much that their wives simply desired them, sexually wanted them, and showed interest and pleasure and enthusiasm in having sex with them? Well here's me....without that strong mutual physical and sexual attraction, I'm not going to be enthusiastic about having sex with someone. Think of it as in I am not going to waste any man's time or put him in that position, EVER. Nor put myself in that position.

I need and want sex and it has to be good (which for me includes things like size, skill, physical attraction, chemistry). I will not ever enter a relationship where it is clear from the onset that these things aren't there. Is it superficial of me to want to have a mutually satisfying sex life in any relationship I have? 

I have been with men who I did not have strong enough attraction to to sustain a good long term sex life, and I will never go through that again nor put any man through it. It is exactly what the horror stories at SIM are always about and no man deserves that - - I just happen to be self-aware enough to know what I'm going to need in order to continue having good sex with a man over time and will not short change either of us by overlooking any of it.


----------



## ConanHub

alexm said:


> I'm a lot like you. My wife does not fit my quote/unquote "ideal", yet I find her irresistibly sexy, physically.
> 
> You're right, it does not paint men or women in a good light, but I'm not sure those who have these requirements particularly care.
> 
> To a woman like FW, we know that sex is at (or at least very very near) the top of her "list". It's also not the only thing on her list.
> 
> For me, it's not. It's near the top of my list for sure, but it's not nearly as important as many other things. Clearly that is the case, because my wife is LD/ND and my sex life is about 25% of what I'd like it to be... Yet I'm still here, because the other things trump sex. Now if there were NO sex, I'd be gone, I know that much.
> 
> For some (like FW), unsatisfying sex is equivalent to no sex for the rest of us. And that's perfectly fine and reasonable. Just like most of us would not willingly marry someone if there was NO sex, she would not want a relationship where the sex was not up to her standards.
> 
> Are those standards high? Perhaps. Perhaps not. But really, what does anybody care?
> 
> I'm a shorter dude, and although I've never been rejected knowingly because of that, I'm sure it's happened. I've also heard my fair share of women around me say that they prefer taller men (most women seem to!)
> 
> Should I be insulted? Maybe. Not really. I don't know. The way I've always looked at it is that if someone wouldn't date me because I'm not to their height specifications, it's no great loss. Not because I thought they were picky, but because - right off the bat - I'm not a match for them. So should I be insulted? If so, why?
> 
> Should I pine after someone, saying "just give me a chance?" God no. **** that. You don't like my height, my hair, my looks, my hands, my **** - oh well.


The sex can and should be worked on with every couple in my opinion.

Frequency and even quality are products of choice.

Height, penis size, etc.. are not chosen characteristics.

I would have missed out on a damn good wife if I had eliminated Mrs. C because her breasts weren't big enough or because she wasn't a tall woman.

She doesn't have the sex drive I do, low percentage does, but has worked hard to improve both frequency and talent.

Sex is VERY important to me but without some key character traits, sex is empty.

I have had mind blowing sex with some very unworthy women. One had a character that would make a weasel ashamed but she made me climax two times during the same PIV session. She was a belly dancer and had amazing muscle control.

No one else has been able to do that to me but I would sooner jump into the abyss than be with her again.


----------



## Faithful Wife

Luvher4life said:


> If you can make a woman squirt regularly, orgasm regularly, does that make up for the 1/2" difference that some of these women on here require?


No. Though I did have a FWB once who was on the smaller side (length and girth), and I did not want to have PIV with him for that very reason, but we played all kinds of other games and he got me off and made me squirt quite well.

Didn't change my mind about not wanting PIV with him one bit.


----------



## Faithful Wife

Luvher4life said:


> I honestly don't care what penis size a woman wants. It's her prerogative to pick whatever size she thinks she wants. I don't have an issue with that. My question is do they get a tape measure out every time just to see if they fit their requirements? Sorry, boy, I'm not wasting my time with you because you don't measure up. For what it's worth, most women are horrible at guessing measurements. Men don't help by telling them their packing a eight incher when it's really around 6 or so.


Any guy who actually thinks you will end up in bed with him will not say he has an 8 if it's only a 6 because he won't want to disappoint her or make himself look like a fool.

I don't actually care what the precise measurements are...I can tell by a glance (or a pic, if erect) if it is going to do the job for me or not.


----------



## Faithful Wife

Buddy400 said:


> Does your wife not being "ideal" mean that she can not sexually satisfy you?
> 
> Women here aren't talking about "preferences" that can be overcome or offset by other attributes. They're talking about being unable to have a satisfactory sex life if the penis doesn't meet certain criteria (and these criteria exclude at least 60% of men).
> 
> I have no problem with women requiring large penises and I'd be very happy if women made their requirements clear ahead of time.
> 
> The last thing in the world I'd want is to be in a relationship with someone who requires something that I have no possible way to give her in order to be sexually satisfied.


And the last thing I'd want would be to give a guy the thought that we could have great long term sex together if I knew we wouldn't be able to. I wouldn't even go on one more date the moment I knew for sure. 

For me though it isn't just the penis it is also some other things, physical attraction, skill, and chemistry. I know what I want and need in order to have sustained attraction and desire. I will always want sex - - whether single or not. But I will not want sex at all with any particular man without the high priority items on my list.


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Faithful Wife said:


> Loooooong before knowing someone at all, not even CLOSE to being in love with them, I would have sussed out my preferences or lack thereof and not continued dating someone if they didn't meet them.
> 
> What you or anyone else considers "superficial aesthetics" is whatever your ideas of that term are. For me, basic strong mutual sexual and physical attraction is not "superficial".
> 
> You know how all these guys on TAM post about how they wish so much that their wives simply desired them, sexually wanted them, and showed interest and pleasure and enthusiasm in having sex with them? Well here's me....without that strong mutual physical and sexual attraction, I'm not going to be enthusiastic about having sex with someone. Think of it as in I am not going to waste any man's time or put him in that position, EVER. Nor put myself in that position.
> 
> I need and want sex and it has to be good (which for me includes things like size, skill, physical attraction, chemistry). I will not ever enter a relationship where it is clear from the onset that these things aren't there. Is it superficial of me to want to have a mutually satisfying sex life in any relationship I have?
> 
> I have been with men who I did not have strong enough attraction to to sustain a good long term sex life, and I will never go through that again nor put any man through it. It is exactly what the horror stories at SIM are always about and no man deserves that - - I just happen to be self-aware enough to know what I'm going to need in order to continue having good sex with a man over time and will not short change either of us by overlooking any of it.


Exactly all this. I'd lose interest if the sex wasn't what I wanted or I didn't enjoy the look or feel of his penis. That isn't fair to a man. I'm sure they would rather be next-ed at the dating stage than 5 years down the road when you realize you just can't make it work. 

Now that I know what I want and what makes me happy and satisfied I will never again go back to trying to make something work when it just doesn't. 

Maybe I'm just spoiled now but I'm ok with that too.


----------



## Buddy400

Faithful Wife said:


> And the last thing I'd want would be to give a guy the thought that we could have great long term sex together if I knew we wouldn't be able to. I wouldn't even go on one more date the moment I knew for sure.
> 
> For me though it isn't just the penis it is also some other things, physical attraction, skill, and chemistry. I know what I want and need in order to have sustained attraction and desire. I will always want sex - - whether single or not. But I will not want sex at all with any particular man without the high priority items on my list.


It's the penis* plus* other attributes, right?

Not the penis *or* other attributes.


----------



## Faithful Wife

Buddy400 said:


> It's the penis* plus* other attributes, right?
> 
> Not the penis *or* other attributes.


Yes, there's a list, and penis is on it, as well as other attributes.


----------



## Buddy400

Faithful Wife said:


> Yes, there's a list, and penis is on it, as well as other attributes.


You're fortunate that you are in a position to have so many 'and's and still find what you need. 

Most don't have that luxury. Stringing too many and's together can leave many people with an empty net.

For me, wanting great boobs *or* a nice smile gives me a bigger pond to fish in.


----------



## Faithful Wife

Buddy400 said:


> You're fortunate that you are in a position to have so many 'and's and still find what you need.
> 
> Most don't have that luxury. Stringing too many and's together can leave many people with an empty net.
> 
> For me, wanting great boobs *or* a nice smile gives me a bigger pond to fish in.


I think if more women were more self-aware when they began a relationship, they would know who to proceed with and who not to, and therefore would not proceed with men who they would end up not being attracted to in the long term. 

I don't see it as a luxury to have specific preferences and then be able to find them. At my age, most men are like me....divorced, and know what they want now after having experienced what they don't want. It hasn't been that hard to find men I match up with (which doesn't mean they are falling out of trees, it just means I have dated successfully and found the gems I was looking for among the dating masses that I've met....which leaves thousands of others I didn't meet, some of them potentially also men I'd match well with). At this stage in life, you better have your picker tuned pretty well.

Having said all of that....even if we match well on the attraction/sexual/chemistry stuff, this is no guarantee that other issues may not exist in the relationship. It's just that for me, no relationship can develop at all unless those things are there first. Then if other issues are a problem, I know it is time to move on.


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## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Depends on how long you're willing to look. I was perfectly happy alone so I had a ton of time to find all my "ands"

I am not beautiful or thin or anything out of the ordinary and I found many who had enough "ands" to be fully satisfying both sexually and on a base relationship level. 

Compatibility is not just for the lucky or the very attractive, top 10% of desirable people types. 

Everyone has the luxury if it's a priority to you and you won't settle for less. It's not about how many fish are in your pond but how many of them you'd want to build something with. If my pond is too full it just gets muddled anyway. I'd rather have a pond with 5 great options, heck just 1 great option, than one with 100 ok ones.


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## Ikaika

Either I have lacked experience in my journey through sexual encounters or I'm not paying attention, but I've not run into the "wow, she is huge down there". 

When my wife and I first started having sex, it was the opposite, it was hard to get in. I actually think it was painful for her in the first month or so. But, I attribute this to her inability to completely relax (not as aroused as she gets now) and thus harder to accommodate my penis. Rather than me being hung like a horse. I may be bigger than average, but not necessarily porn star size.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


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## Faithful Wife

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> Depends on how long you're willing to look. I was perfectly happy alone so I had a ton of time to find all my "ands"
> 
> I am not beautiful or thin or anything out of the ordinary and I found many who had enough "ands" to be fully satisfying both sexually and on a base relationship level.
> 
> Compatibility is not just for the lucky or the very attractive, top 10% of desirable people types.
> 
> Everyone has the luxury if it's a priority to you and you won't settle for less. It's not about how many fish are in your pond but how many of them you'd want to build something with. If my pond is too full it just gets muddled anyway. I'd rather have a pond with 5 great options, heck just 1 great option, than one with 100 ok ones.


It is interesting to me too that it seems as if some of the posters on this thread are projecting that these men we find who do match up with us pretty well must not be quality men, somehow. Seems like the assumption is that we are chasing bad boys who will ultimately behave badly...because somehow men who are attractive (to us) and meet our other criteria must not be anything but a good lay.

But for me, not only does the guy have to meet my sexual/physical criteria, he also has to be sweet, kind, loving, a good person, share my same values, dignified, respectable, and so on. He won't get a second date and no chance at all to find out if there is sexual compatibility if these things aren't present.

Yet us having sexual/physical/chemistry preferences at all makes some men quickly toss out the "superficial" card on us and warn us with things like "hope the sex is good enough to make up for lack of character". I mean, do we really ALSO have to plainly state that we require a man's character to be acceptable if we mention we have sexual/physical preferences? Because if we don't it will be assumed that we don't have any character ourselves and just want mad sex with a man who has literally nothing good about him except his looks/penis/sexual skill? There are still men who want to shame us for the very mention of having sexual preferences, because you know, that means we are clearly skanky and have no other standards.


----------



## Ikaika

I still think the premise to this thread is unfortunate as if to shame some females into, "your large vagina is the cause for bad sex". So, it should not surprise any males if some women suggest "your average or below average size penis is too small for my preference in men". 

If your SO/wife is great with sex you two share, who cares what some anonymous female thinks. She has her needs and preferences, and you have yours. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Yep! I had a laundry list of things I needed from a partner. Sexual compatibility was just one of them. An important one but still just one. 

I needed an introvert, someone caring and loving who also happened to have a naturally dominant side. No baggage, no bff girlfriends or boundary crossing issues. Can be sweet and funny and just hang out and watch tv with. I like a little bit nerdy. Enough to get my nerd jokes and references and want to watch Star Wars with me. Not a player. Responsible, can care for himself and has financial independence and can show he cares for his home, children, animals, whatever he may have. 

He also has to have a penis that I like, be good in bed, and have the same kinks as I do

Sex is one part of our night, I have to enjoy him the other parts and I need to build a solid relationship so the sex stays as good as it is. 

There would be a lot less problems on tam if everyone was picky about what they needed in the first place.


----------



## Rocky Mountain Yeti

Faithful Wife said:


> Loooooong before knowing someone at all, not even CLOSE to being in love with them, I would have sussed out my preferences or lack thereof and not continued dating someone if they didn't meet them.


What you and I are saying is not necessarily in contradiction. As you say, you'll not fall in love with someone in the first place if they don't have your preferences for attraction. I'm saying that if you have fallen in love, than the superficialities, if they exist no longer matter. Those two statements can coexist without conflict. 

My statement is admittedly colored by my personal experience in which my wife does not meet many of my superficial preferences, but somehow the complete package turned out to be the most attractive I'd ever encountered.


----------



## Faithful Wife

Rocky Mountain Yeti said:


> What you and I are saying is not necessarily in contradiction. As you say, you'll not fall in love with someone in the first place if they don't have your preferences for attraction. *I'm saying that if you have fallen in love*, than the superficialities, if they exist no longer matter. Those two statements can coexist without conflict.
> 
> My statement is admittedly colored by my personal experience in which my wife does not meet many of my superficial preferences, but somehow the complete package turned out to be the most attractive I'd ever encountered.


How is the falling in love part supposed to happen when I don't go on a third date with them? :scratchhead:


----------



## Rocky Mountain Yeti

Faithful Wife said:


> How is the falling in love part supposed to happen when I don't go on a third date with them? :scratchhead:


Again, just speaking from my own experience--I found myself quite quickly attracted to the woman who would be my wife, despite her not bearing my usual preferences. It just happened. 

I loved, and used to go looking for dark brunettes. Dark brown eyes were alluring and green eyes even better. I was also a sucker for an attractive redhead. I also liked women with some meat on their bones. I liked very 'up', energetic and outgoing women. But somehow, this very slender, light brown hair, blue eyed, quiet and subdued woman captivated me. The attraction was undeniable despite the fact that she possessed few of the features that would usually turn my head. It happened hard and it happened relatively fast. There's a whole, very amusing and unique story behind that. But the bottom line is that I ended up with someone who had very few checkmarks on my spec sheet. I'm thrilled I didn't write her off because she didn't possess the collection of features I usually look for.

And it can also happen with someone you don't even date. You may actually spend more time with someone you are not actively dating--a coworker, church member, fellow volunteer, fellow gym rat, member of a mutual club, etc. With time, it is possible to become attracted to someone who's outward features don't match your usual spec sheet. Less likely? Sure. But not all that unusual. I know many people who had wonderful relationships with someone they weren't initially attracted to.


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

I have a looks type that I typically prefer but have come across men who weren't in that and I still was very attracted to them as a whole. 

Penis size and how they are in bed just isn't the same thing to me. 

It's more like men falling in love with a woman who doesn't meet their sexual needs, star fish sex and no experimenting, and finds out years later that it is an issue that isn't going to get better. 

Had they made sure they had sexual compatibility first they are less likely to end up with problems down the road. 

Penis size isn't just looks, isn't just how it feels. There's a lot about it that can impact sex and sexual attraction and desire.


----------



## Faithful Wife

Rocky Mountain Yeti said:


> Again, just speaking from my own experience--I found myself quite quickly attracted to the woman who would be my wife, despite her not bearing my usual preferences. It just happened.
> 
> I loved, and used to go looking for dark brunettes. Dark brown eyes were alluring and green eyes even better. I was also a sucker for an attractive redhead. I also liked women with some meat on their bones. I liked very 'up', energetic and outgoing women. But somehow, this very slender, light brown hair, blue eyed, quiet and subdued woman captivated me. The attraction was undeniable despite the fact that she possessed few of the features that would usually turn my head. It happened hard and it happened relatively fast. There's a whole, very amusing and unique story behind that. But the bottom line is that I ended up with someone who had very few checkmarks on my spec sheet. I'm thrilled I didn't write her off because she didn't possess the collection of features I usually look for.
> 
> And it can also happen with someone you don't even date. You may actually spend more time with someone you are not actively dating--a coworker, church member, fellow volunteer, fellow gym rat, member of a mutual club, etc. With time, it is possible to become attracted to someone who's outward features don't match your usual spec sheet. Less likely? Sure. But not all that unusual. I know many people who had wonderful relationships with someone they weren't initially attracted to.


Ok I get ya. Yes, this could happen. Not that likely but definitely could happen.

The quality of sex would still apply in all cases, however. It's a deal breaker for me.


----------



## Diana7

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> FTR- I'd never ask to see it to check if it measured up. Just comes along with seeing it during sex. I've never once told a guy his penis size was the reason for no call back. A lot of times I'd get sent pics and I could veto before a date if needed but usually have to see it or feel how it fits to get a good judge of the shape and if it'll work out or not. If it doesn't, we are just "not compatible". I'd never tell a guy his penis wasn't good enough for me.
> 
> NSA sex or anon hookups with my bf don't matter but tend to have a fine size anyway.
> Very rarely has there been any kind of issue in either direction. There is sometimes quite a bit of differences in feels. Some just don't feel as good as others. Long term needs to feel good, short term I don't care.


You are I are in such different worlds. I didn't even see my husband's penis till we married and I didn't care what size he was because I knew he was a really good man of integrity and would be faithful and committed. I knew he was the one for me within a week. I knew we were on the same page sexually and would have a good sex life.
I do wonder what would happen if your man had a bad accident and could no longer have sex, presumably he would be out on his ear.


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Diana7 said:


> You are I are in such different worlds. I didn't even see my husband's penis till we married and I didn't care what size he was because I knew he was a really good man of integrity and would be faithful and committed. I knew he was the one for me within a week. I knew we were on the same page sexually and would have a good sex life.
> I do wonder what would happen if your man had a bad accident and could no longer have sex, presumably he would be out on his ear.


There would be plenty of other ways to keep someone pleased sexually if something horrible happened. I would expect he continue to meet my needs in other ways. 

Sexual compatibility is just too important to me to leave it to chance or settle on. 

Sex isn't an important part of a relationship for you so you don't put it high on your list. I presume you asked your husband about religious preferences, household distributions, financial compatiblity questions? 

Why is sex such a different compatibility area? 

People who have low sexual needs aren't going to put a high priority on it, that's fine if they meet someone who suits them. 
Problems happen when someone with high sexual needs end up with someone who can't fill them, or has low sexual needs. They will either lose interest in sex completely or be frustrated. Sometimes both. 

My hard limit list is just as important a compatibility area as my needs list. 
If I won't do X and my partner needs to do X, we aren't compatible. 

Imo too many people think love will fix bad sex or it'll get better in time, a wife will get more adventurous or a husband will learn to please her and do more foreplay or vice versa. 
For the most part sexual compatibility is either there or it isn't. I'm not wasting my time on men who don't suit me in that way any more than I'd waste time with someone who was incompatible in other ways


----------



## Personal

Faithful Wife said:


> Rocky Mountain Yeti said:
> 
> 
> 
> So preferences are not absolute. One can fall in love outside one's basic preference set. To automatically discount anybody outside the preconceived wish list is to sell ourselves short and miss out on some really great opportunities.
> 
> And yes, *if you really love someone*, superficial aesthetics won't matter. If some superficial trait gets in the way, you probably didn't really love the person anyway...which is also okay...just be willing to admit that rather than go through twisted mental and logical gymnastics to try to prove to the world (or yourself) you don't have superficial needs and that you're really a judgment free person.
> 
> 
> 
> Loooooong before knowing someone at all, not even CLOSE to being in love with them, I would have sussed out my preferences or lack thereof and not continued dating someone if they didn't meet them.
> 
> What you or anyone else considers "superficial aesthetics" is whatever your ideas of that term are. For me, basic strong mutual sexual and physical attraction is not "superficial".
> 
> You know how all these guys on TAM post about how they wish so much that their wives simply desired them, sexually wanted them, and showed interest and pleasure and enthusiasm in having sex with them? Well here's me....without that strong mutual physical and sexual attraction, I'm not going to be enthusiastic about having sex with someone. Think of it as in I am not going to waste any man's time or put him in that position, EVER. Nor put myself in that position.
> 
> I need and want sex and it has to be good (which for me includes things like size, skill, physical attraction, chemistry). I will not ever enter a relationship where it is clear from the onset that these things aren't there. Is it superficial of me to want to have a mutually satisfying sex life in any relationship I have?
> 
> I have been with men who I did not have strong enough attraction to to sustain a good long term sex life, and I will never go through that again nor put any man through it. It is exactly what the horror stories at SIM are always about and no man deserves that - - I just happen to be self-aware enough to know what I'm going to need in order to continue having good sex with a man over time and will not short change either of us by overlooking any of it.
Click to expand...

 @Rocky Mountain Yeti, of course preferences can be absolute in practice, if one chooses to settle for nothing less.

I actually think compromising on what one feels matters is selling oneself short, and does not lead to missing out on any great opportunities.

If aesthetics matters to someone, one can't help how they feel. Aesthetics and all the rest are not superficial, when one has a visceral reaction to such things.

This idea that if you love someone aesthetics won't matter is something that I cannot relate to at all Rocky Mountain Yeti. You dismiss aesthetics as something that is superficial, yet I can't help but feel it is tremendously important.

Plus size, shape and all the rest to do with genitalia matters (which means vaginas and penises) a lot to some of us, especially when it comes to how our minds see them and how our genitalia bodies and mouths fit and work together.

For myself and others sexual compatibility and attraction are essential and non-negotiable criteria that must be met. As a consequence of the fact we can't help but feel through our whole core, that sexual connection is so important and essential to our very being. Which is what drives a desire to rule out sexual disappointment at the very beginning of relationship, by ruling out some before anything happens and by having sex early with others before one falls in love. Since all the talk and emotional appeal in the world, is no measure of how it feels in actual practice to have sex with someone.

Likewise once a highly sexual person who is in touch with themselves has had sex with different people, they become very aware of what works for them and what doesn't. So they tend not to be inclined to waste their own time, and generously choose not to waste other peoples time either.

So there is no mental gymnastics at all in knowing oneself and acting accordingly.

As to being judgement free, I like using my judgement and judging others, I can't imagine ever not being judgemental and would hate to be a person who was judgement free.



Faithful Wife said:


> I need and want sex and it has to be good (which for me includes things like size, skill, physical attraction, chemistry). I will not ever enter a relationship where it is clear from the onset that these things aren't there.


I feel exactly the same way and am glad we are far from alone in feeling this way.



Faithful Wife said:


> Is it superficial of me to want to have a mutually satisfying sex life in any relationship I have?


No it isn't superficial at all, in fact I think it is heartfelt, honest and absolutely essential.


----------



## Personal

Rocky Mountain Yeti said:


> What you and I are saying is not necessarily in contradiction. As you say, you'll not fall in love with someone in the first place if they don't have your preferences for attraction. I'm saying that if you have fallen in love, than the superficialities, if they exist no longer matter. Those two statements can coexist without conflict.


My read is there are significant differences in both of your outlooks.

Your approach seems to be that you will accept sexual and attraction limitations to see if love will find a way? Whereas Faithful Wife will not accept such limitations and will rule them out before love camouflages reality.

Personally I will not accept such limitations either and have always ruled out sexual limitations at the very beginning long before love and walked if it wasn't there. Which also includes nexting a woman who I shared mutual lust at first sight with, because sex with her for several reasons turned out to be so very uggggh.


----------



## Personal

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> Exactly all this. I'd lose interest if the sex wasn't what I wanted or I didn't enjoy the look or feel of his penis. That isn't fair to a man. I'm sure they would rather be next-ed at the dating stage than 5 years down the road when you realize you just can't make it work.


Of course it's fair.

I don't see any sense in carrying on any sexual relationship sans sexual compatibility. I also feel it is better to rule out sexual compatibility, before investing in someone emotionally to no end (which would include their vagina or penis size).


----------



## Middle of Everything

Personal said:


> My read is there are significant differences in both of your outlooks.
> 
> Your approach seems to be that you will accept sexual and attraction limitations to see if love will find a way? Whereas Faithful Wife will not accept such limitations and will rule them out before love camouflages reality.
> 
> Personally I will not accept such limitations either and have always ruled out sexual limitations at the very beginning long before love and walked if it wasn't there. Which also includes nexting a woman who I shared mutual lust at first sight with, because sex with her for several reasons turned out to be so very uggggh.


Before love camouflages reality? Like if Im normally a DD guy and I fall for a B cup?

If Im reading @rocky mountain yeti right Im thinking hes saying that he realizes said difference between "preferred" and reality. He just doesnt care.

I may have misunderstood your point here. Not sure.


----------



## Rocky Mountain Yeti

Personal said:


> @Rocky Mountain Yeti, of course preferences can be absolute in practice, if one chooses to settle for nothing less.
> 
> I actually think compromising on what one feels matters is selling oneself short, and does not lead to missing out on any great opportunities.
> 
> If aesthetics matters to someone, one can't help how they feel. Aesthetics and all the rest are not superficial, when one has a visceral reaction to such things.
> 
> This idea that if you love someone aesthetics won't matter is something that I cannot relate to at all Rocky Mountain Yeti. You dismiss aesthetics as something that is superficial, yet I can't help but feel it is tremendously important.
> 
> Plus size, shape and all the rest to do with genitalia matters (which means vaginas and penises) a lot to some of us, especially when it comes to how our minds see them and how our genitalia bodies and mouths fit and work together.
> 
> For myself and others sexual compatibility and attraction are essential and non-negotiable criteria that must be met. As a consequence of the fact we can't help but feel through our whole core, that sexual connection is so important and essential to our very being. Which is what drives a desire to rule out sexual disappointment at the very beginning of relationship, by ruling out some before anything happens and by having sex early with others before one falls in love. Since all the talk and emotional appeal in the world, is no measure of how it feels in actual practice to have sex with someone.
> 
> Likewise once a highly sexual person who is in touch with themselves has had sex with different people, they become very aware of what works for them and what doesn't. So they tend not to be inclined to waste their own time, and generously choose not to waste other peoples time either.
> 
> So there is no mental gymnastics at all in knowing oneself and acting accordingly.
> 
> As to being judgement free, I like using my judgement and judging others, I can't imagine ever not being judgemental and would hate to be a person who was judgement free.
> 
> 
> 
> I feel exactly the same way and am glad we are far from alone in feeling this way.
> 
> 
> 
> No it isn't superficial at all, in fact I think it is heartfelt, honest and absolutely essential.


Whoa, there! I never said aesthetics are not, or should not be important.

And as you say, preference CAN be absolute IF you choose to make them so. They are not inherently so purely of their own accord.

I agree that "settling" is bad. If you're settling, yes, you're selling yourself short. But please read my full posts. It's entirely possible to develop an attraction to someone who doesn't meet your usual preferences. My wife didn't... and yet she is the hottest, most gorgeous woman on the planet. I didn't "settle" one damn bit!


----------



## knobcreek

Holy **** this is still going lol...

Anyway, SGC your boyfriend pimps you out to F his buddies for his own sexual satisfaction, he sounds awesome, real gem of a fella... 

Practice your kegals ladies keeps those holes tight, SGC can't feel less than 10 inches and a beer can around if she "slacks off".

I feel like there's a ton of closure here, solid discussion I think we all learned a lot. We learned SGC is a sexual deviant, we learned FW is a post wall sexual deviant, we learned Diana is the most sexually naive and likely super cute Jesus lover of the board (yet not happy in her marriage), we learned I'm likely a man tired of his wife's vagina post child-birth (they're not the same ladies no matter what the WK's tell ya), we learned that personal and several others are so devoid of female recognition that they'll say anything on an online message board for their approval.

Good talk, overall 7/10.


----------



## Rocky Mountain Yeti

Personal said:


> My read is there are significant differences in both of your outlooks.
> 
> Your approach seems to be that you will accept sexual and attraction limitations to see if love will find a way? Whereas Faithful Wife will not accept such limitations and will rule them out before love camouflages reality.
> 
> Personally I will not accept such limitations either and have always ruled out sexual limitations at the very beginning long before love and walked if it wasn't there. Which also includes nexting a woman who I shared mutual lust at first sight with, because sex with her for several reasons turned out to be so very uggggh.


Good thing you put the question mark after your misunderstanding of my take. Please see my subsequent posts where I hope I have added clarity.


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

knobcreek said:


> Holy **** this is still going lol...
> 
> Anyway, SGC your boyfriend pimps you out to F his buddies for his own sexual satisfaction, he sounds awesome, real gem of a fella...
> 
> Practice your kegals ladies keeps those holes tight, SGC can't feel less than 10 inches and a beer can around if she "slacks off".
> 
> I feel like there's a ton of closure here, solid discussion I think we all learned a lot. We learned SGC is a sexual deviant, we learned FW is a post wall sexual deviant, we learned Diana is the most sexually naive and likely super cute Jesus lover of the board (yet not happy in her marriage), we learned I'm likely a man tired of his wife's vagina post child-birth (they're not the same ladies no matter what the WK's tell ya), we learned that personal and several others are so devoid of female recognition that they'll say anything on an online message board for their approval.
> 
> Good talk, overall 7/10.


Wow. Talk about a threatened male. What a sad and weak rant. This is why bitter men who's wives didnt like them are a deal breaker for me. They are just unattractive and unmanly. 

Knob, you just hate women. Your wife doesn't treat you right but you're too scared to leave so you get pissed off at all women and try to blame us for ruining your world. 
If a woman enjoys sex, she has to be a horrible person because you can't be at fault for your wife not liking you.


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Ps- where exactly did you get that I have sex with his "buddies"? 

I've specifically said that men are anon only. I don't get "pimped" out or made to do anything. Amazingly he cares about MY satisfaction and lets me explore it. He's not threatened, doesn't need his ego stroked and is confident enough in himself that he knows his penis is perfect for me and I can still enjoy large toys and other men. 

He is a gem, the most amazing man I know. I tell him daily how great he is. How handsome. How much I love him, his penis and his open mind. I tell him how lucky I am every day. Many men would love to have the praise he earns from me and to be wanted and desired as much as I do him. 

People can think whatever they want of him, he wouldn't care anyway and he has everything he wants and needs. 

I don't care wtf you say about me or my vagina, you're just a little man. But I will defend my bf even if he wouldn't give a crap. He's amazing and wonderful and I couldn't ask for anything more. 

And you still don't understand how a vagina works or seem to even care to learn. Maybe that is why you're having some of your issues with women?


----------



## DepressedHusband

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> Ps- where exactly did you get that I have sex with his "buddies"?
> 
> I've specifically said that men are anon only. I don't get "pimped" out or made to do anything. Amazingly he cares about MY satisfaction and lets me explore it. He's not threatened, doesn't need his ego stroked and is confident enough in himself that he knows his penis is perfect for me and I can still enjoy large toys and other men.
> 
> He is a gem, the most amazing man I know. I tell him daily how great he is. How handsome. How much I love him, his penis and his open mind. I tell him how lucky I am every day. Many men would love to have the praise he earns from me and to be wanted and desired as much as I do him.
> 
> People can think whatever they want of him, he wouldn't care anyway and he has everything he wants and needs.
> 
> I don't care wtf you say about me or my vagina, you're just a little man. But I will defend my bf even if he wouldn't give a crap. He's amazing and wonderful and I couldn't ask for anything more.
> 
> And you still don't understand how a vagina works or seem to even care to learn. Maybe that is why you're having some of your issues with women?


your husband is a cuckold, and I find that truly offensive as a man. But if he digs it, I guess its his game.


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

DepressedHusband said:


> your husband is a cuckold, and I find that truly offensive as a man. But if he digs it, I guess its his game.


Not exactly, I'm a "sl*twife". There's a difference. 

Cuckholds are typically submissive, typically are having it done as humiliation or degrading. He can't please her so she needs another man to do the job. 

"Sl*twives" or "hotwife" are sex positive. He likes watching her enjoy herself. He wants her to feel hot and attractive and wanted. Her sexuality and exploring is what turns him on. He gets a porn show, can join in. 

My bf is Dom and there is no humiliation involved.


----------



## Faithful Wife

knobcreek said:


> Holy **** this is still going lol...
> 
> Anyway, SGC your boyfriend pimps you out to F his buddies for his own sexual satisfaction, he sounds awesome, real gem of a fella...
> 
> Practice your kegals ladies keeps those holes tight, SGC can't feel less than 10 inches and a beer can around if she "slacks off".
> 
> I feel like there's a ton of closure here, solid discussion I think we all learned a lot. We learned SGC is a sexual deviant, we learned FW is a post wall sexual deviant, we learned Diana is the most sexually naive and likely super cute Jesus lover of the board (yet not happy in her marriage), we learned I'm likely a man tired of his wife's vagina post child-birth (they're not the same ladies no matter what the WK's tell ya), we learned that personal and several others are so devoid of female recognition that they'll say anything on an online message board for their approval.
> 
> Good talk, overall 7/10.


Once again....c'mon knob. You know you wanted to stir the pot with this post. You wanted to grumble about women who have size preferences and also wanted to insult those women by insinuating they have cavernous vaginas. You literally said that was the reason for this thread in your first post.

I asked you before and you didn't answer...why is this stuck in your craw?


----------



## DepressedHusband

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> Not exactly, I'm a "sl*twife". There's a difference.
> 
> Cuckholds are typically submissive, typically are having it done as humiliation or degrading. He can't please her so she needs another man to do the job.
> 
> "Sl*twives" or "hotwife" are sex positive. He likes watching her enjoy herself. He wants her to feel hot and attractive and wanted. Her sexuality and exploring is what turns him on. He gets a porn show, can join in.
> 
> My bf is Dom and there is no humiliation involved.


Another dude banging your wife, thats a cuckold, unless the dictionary recently revised the term, the reason it is a cuckold is simply, you may end up with bastard children that are not of your lineage as a man. I am a Dom, and it never once occured to me in 21 yrs to let my friends bone my wife, nor would I ever think it acceptable. getting off on other men dominating your wife and getting her off, that is the top of submission. Hate to say it, but your BF ain't no dom


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

DepressedHusband said:


> Another dude banging your wife, thats a cuckold, unless the dictionary recently revised the term, the reason it is a cuckold is simply, you may end up with bastard children that are not of your lineage as a man. I am a Dom, and it never once occured to me in 21 yrs to let my friends bone my wife, nor would I ever think it acceptable. getting off on other men dominating your wife and getting her off, that is the top of submission. Hate to say it, but your BF ain't no dom


It's not up to you to decide what he is. You don't hold the definition and it isn't based off of your preferences. 
Many Doms take their subs out to places to preform and serve for others. In my area alone there is several and outings and camping trip activities devoted to just that. Many others are open in other ways. We're an active bdsm couple that goes to events and meets, we meet all kinds. Just saying you're a Dom doesn't make you the only kind there is. 

Kids not of the lineage of my man... I'm not having any children. There is a difference between cuckholding as a kink and a hot/sl*twife kink. If you aren't into either, don't do them. Lots of couples are into things I have no interest in but they are having fun and it's not up to me to decide what is right and wrong for them.


----------



## sokillme

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> Not exactly, I'm a "sl*twife". There's a difference.
> 
> Cuckholds are typically submissive, typically are having it done as humiliation or degrading. He can't please her so she needs another man to do the job.
> 
> "Sl*twives" or "hotwife" are sex positive. He likes watching her enjoy herself. He wants her to feel hot and attractive and wanted. Her sexuality and exploring is what turns him on. He gets a porn show, can join in.
> 
> My bf is Dom and there is no humiliation involved.


My take on the **** wife thing it twofold. One I think lots of men now a days grew up with porn as their primary example of sex. They developed more of and attraction to seeing women like pornstars. So there great desire is to have their wife act like a pornstar, meaning they get off more on the thought of their wives having sex then they do having sex with them. To me that doesn't seem healthy in the long run mostly because the lifestyle usually gets played out and I am of the opinion that most healthy people are still going to eventually want that one on one intimacy. So I think the hot wife will eventually move on. I am of the belief that no matter how progressive these women say they are they really want a man who covets them, and if they find that they will jump ship pretty quick, especially once the understand that their husband is getting off by objectifying them. No one can convince me otherwise. 

The second and more nefarious take is the the husband gets off on the power. After all what greater power can you have over someone then to get them to sleep with someone else whom the would never even think of if not for your direction. It's a great power trip, it's like pimping your wife. Again doesn't seem healthy in the long run. 

Just my two cents. Frankly when it comes to that lifestyle I would much rather be the guy sleeping with the other guys wife. Not that I would do it.


----------



## Diana7

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> There would be plenty of other ways to keep someone pleased sexually if something horrible happened. I would expect he continue to meet my needs in other ways.
> 
> Sexual compatibility is just too important to me to leave it to chance or settle on.
> 
> Sex isn't an important part of a relationship for you so you don't put it high on your list. I presume you asked your husband about religious preferences, household distributions, financial compatiblity questions?
> 
> Why is sex such a different compatibility area?
> 
> People who have low sexual needs aren't going to put a high priority on it, that's fine if they meet someone who suits them.
> Problems happen when someone with high sexual needs end up with someone who can't fill them, or has low sexual needs. They will either lose interest in sex completely or be frustrated. Sometimes both.
> 
> My hard limit list is just as important a compatibility area as my needs list.
> If I won't do X and my partner needs to do X, we aren't compatible.
> 
> Imo too many people think love will fix bad sex or it'll get better in time, a wife will get more adventurous or a husband will learn to please her and do more foreplay or vice versa.
> For the most part sexual compatibility is either there or it isn't. I'm not wasting my time on men who don't suit me in that way any more than I'd waste time with someone who was incompatible in other ways


Sexual compatibility is what you work on with your partner over time. If you have that solid strong marriage with deep love, then you will want to please the other and have regular sex with them. Sex can and does get much better over time if you are both unselfish and committed to the relationship no matter what.Its certainly our experience. 

We talked about all areas of our lives before we married, including sex, and yes, sex is important for me because I know that a marriage is so much stronger and better with good sex. It's also a very important area for my husband as well. I knew that before we married. 

There are many illnesses or accidents where the partner isn't in a position to please you sexually, and if they are very ill it would be selfish to expect them to anyway. What then? Are they thrown out like yesterdays paper?

For me its the caliber of a man that matters more than the size of his genitals. His character, morality, the way he treats me, his fairness, kindness, unselfishness, These things last, they add to a good strong marriage, faithfulness, and commitment. Yes, sex can stop later in life for all sorts of reasons, a good character will last for life.


----------



## Diana7

sokillme said:


> My take on the **** wife thing it twofold. One I think lots of men now a days grew up with porn as their primary example of sex. They developed more of and attraction to seeing women like pornstars. So there great desire is to have their wife act like a pornstar, meaning they get off more on the thought of their wives having sex then they do having sex with them. To me that doesn't seem healthy in the long run mostly because the lifestyle usually gets played out and I am of the opinion that most healthy people are still going to eventually want that one on one intimacy. So I think the hot wife will eventually move on. I am of the belief that no matter how progressive these women say they are they really want a man who covets them, and if they find that they will jump ship pretty quick, especially once the understand that their husband is getting off by objectifying them. No one can convince me otherwise.
> 
> The second and more nefarious take is the the husband gets off on the power. After all what greater power can you have over someone then to get them to sleep with someone else whom the would never even think of if not for your direction. It's a great power trip, it's like pimping your wife. Again doesn't seem healthy in the long run.
> 
> Just my two cents. Frankly when it comes to that lifestyle I would much rather be the guy sleeping with the other guys wife. Not that I would do it.


Some great points. I also am also sure that widespread porn use has greatly distorted and damaged the point of sex. It's become selfish, skewed and been separated from its purpose of joining 2 people in love and commitment, strengthening their marriage emotionally and physically. I think it's really sad. :frown2::frown2:


----------



## ConanHub

Faithful Wife said:


> How is the falling in love part supposed to happen when I don't go on a third date with them? :scratchhead:


RMY is not playing the same game as you. He isn't even in the same arena or maybe even in the stands.

I am closer to being in his arena but have been a temporary player and observer to the life you are living.

We are sort of comparing apples to oranges in the sense that Yeti and I both fell for a woman very rapidly without making sure our hearts felt nothing until we let them.

I was struck by lightning ⚡ when I first saw my future wife. I knew from the moment I saw her that it was seriously life changing.

Our first sex session was terrible but I was in love with her already. We worked on the sex and it got way better.

From the way you and SGC are talking, this hasn't happened to you. 

It was like discovering you had never breathed air but after your first breath, you can't go back to what you were.

Mrs. Conan was life altering.

I am looking at things from a different position than you and that is why your posts and SGC's appeared to me to be tinged with frost and a light mercenary flavor.

If I hadn't meet my wife, I might be in similar circumstances.

Regardless, appreciate the input as always.:smile2:


----------



## ConanHub

Holy ****!!! This thread got really weird!!!


----------



## Blondilocks

ConanHub said:


> Holy ****!!! This thread got really weird!!!


LMAO! Have another cup of coffee.


----------



## Tiggy!

Faithful Wife said:


> Once again....c'mon knob. You know you wanted to stir the pot with this post. You wanted to grumble about women who have size preferences and also wanted to insult those women by insinuating they have cavernous vaginas. You literally said that was the reason for this thread in your first post.
> 
> I asked you before and you didn't answer...why is this stuck in your craw?


I don't think this thread has had the desired effect, it's more amusing than insulting.


----------



## Blondilocks

Tiggy! said:


> I don't think this thread has had the desired effect, it's more amusing than insulting.


It's hard to tell who the bigger ****-stirrer is. Still very entertaining.


----------



## Livvie

Well I think the final takeaway of the thread (from what has been discussed only in this thread) is that large vaginas really AREN'T leading to an epidemic of bad sex but that small penises could be.


----------



## Rocky Mountain Yeti

Livvie said:


> Well I think the final takeaway of the thread (from what has been discussed only in this thread) is that large vaginas really AREN'T leading to an epidemic of bad sex but that small penises could be.


Which reinforces the notion that this thread won't have the effect the OP was looking for.

Instead of being a forum to bash loose women, it has only served to reinforce penis insecurity 

Shoulda' seen that one coming. The natural counter to "you're to big" is "no, you're too small." And of the two, we know who's insecure enough to actually take that to heart...


----------



## Bibi1031

ConanHub said:


> Holy ****!!! This thread got really weird!!!



Hell yeah it sure did. The OP wants it to die, but it has taken a life of its own and his purpose got lost in translation so to speak. 

So the moral of this thread is don't stir the pot if your stick is too small and narrow minded for such a multitude of flavors and mixes thrown into it. :grin2:


----------



## Bibi1031

I'm with @Diana7 on this one because it makes more sense to me and not weird at all. I know she is very happy and fulfilled in her marriage and choice of mate. I also like it because I can identify with her list of priorities for choosing a long term mate as well.


----------



## ConanHub

Blondilocks said:


> LMAO! Have another cup of coffee.


Very astute.

When I was posting, Starbucks had my order screwed up and I hadn't even had a drink of my brain fuel ⛽ yet!:grin2:


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Conan- I've had that lightning strike, it's the chemistry and attraction that I look for. But you also need compatibility. There's a woman here who felt that with a married man and now thinks they are meant to be. 

Sometimes the intense chemistry and those "love at first sight" feelings can make you ignore serious incompatibilities. 

You need that chemistry. The feeling of omg this is the one, I can feel it and everything just hits you. But you also need to be compatible. And you do get that feeling with more than 1 person.


----------



## sokillme

Diana7 said:


> Some great points. I also am also sure that widespread porn use has greatly distorted and damaged the point of sex. It's become selfish, skewed and been separated from its purpose of joining 2 people in love and commitment, strengthening their marriage emotionally and physically. I think it's really sad. :frown2::frown2:


I am wonder if for some of these wives who seemingly go off the rails and have these wild sexual affairs, if porn wasn't the gateway for that. 

I am all for wild sex though, and I want all these alternative lifestyles out in the open without the stigma so there can be no excuse to keep it hidden and blindside you potential partner with it years later down the road. People who think they are not monogamous should be open to say that right away, to that the ones who know they are can snot end up getting burned by them.


----------



## sokillme

ConanHub said:


> Holy ****!!! This thread got really weird!!!


It wasn't weird to begin with?:slap:


----------



## Chaparral

Ynot said:


> I am still trying to figure out who is more concerned about penis size. So far I have yet to see too much focus on it from women but much more from guys who are a little insecure about it.
> I think vaginas, like penises come in all shapes and sizes. If you happen upon one that is "too large" perhaps it is just you aren't approaching it the right way. I also think the size of the vagina is somewhat related to being the appropriate weight. My ex was nice and tight when she was weight appropriate but when she dieted she would get more loose due to the lack of fatty tissue.
> I am not saying vagina size doesn't fluctuate but I highly doubt it is ruining sex for so many men that it is an issue


I read an article about kegel exercises that said weight gain also caused a loosening of the vagina.


----------



## ConanHub

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> Conan- I've had that lightning strike, it's the chemistry and attraction that I look for. But you also need compatibility. There's a woman here who felt that with a married man and now thinks they are meant to be.
> 
> Sometimes the intense chemistry and those "love at first sight" feelings can make you ignore serious incompatibilities.
> 
> You need that chemistry. The feeling of omg this is the one, I can feel it and everything just hits you. But you also need to be compatible. And you do get that feeling with more than 1 person.


I've felt serious electricity with other women but this was beyond that.

It was life altering love. We have had our work cut out for us but the amazing love we have beats the $**! out of any shortcoming either of us have.

We had to work a lot,(fun work), at sex to get it good.

It started terrible. The love was there however and overpowered everything.

I'm playing in a different arena than you for sure.

I really appreciate your willingness to share information, I always love insight gained.

I could not disregard a women if we had too loose of a fit.

If Mrs. Conan was use to enormous tools and we started out having bad sex because of that one issue, we still would have worked it out.

The love is worth it and the sex would improve especially with the adaptability of vaginas.

I'm just not on the same page as you and probably not in the same book.

Sex is uber important to me as well, I can go several times an hour. I have a very high drive and Mrs. C does not but the love is worth it and she works hard to get closer to my level.

I guess I can't see you turning down an absolutely beautiful man that causes gravity to shift every time you look at him because his penis is less than 7" long.

If you would, I simply have no reference to be able to relate.


----------



## Chaparral

knobcreek said:


> The average woman has been with 3.5 men, average man has been with 5.5 women. If you've been with hundreds of men leading up to your current relationship that incorporates extreme sexual stuff then you are not the norm at all. You are bringing in a lot of bias and anecdotal experiences into the discussion.
> 
> The fact is the average penis is 5.5 inches, multiple peer reviewed studies on this which trump your anecdotal experience, which means 50% are ~5.5 inches, so 49% are smaller than that and 49% larger, with a nice bell curve between 4.5 and 6.5 If you're handling large knobs exclusively, and you never come across 5.5 inch cocks, then likely it's due to the lifestyle you lead over anything else.


This seems like the statistic that more men cheat than women but even worse. Slightly more men can cheat because of prostitutes. But as far as # of partners? How can men have that many more partners without partners to have sex with? The # of men going to pros is not that great. haha Even if many women go way over the 3.5 men mark, the averages have to be equal. No?

Or do women lie more about numbers like men exagerate about numbers?


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

I would turn down a man who was wonderful in every other way if we didn't match in bed. It's far more than an exact size. Sex has to feel good, he has to look good so I can feel the desire, that includes a nice looking penis. He has to be good in bed, not eventually he can learn to be. I'm not interested in wasting my time on a maybe. 

That chemistry feeling comes and goes and it's the compatibility that gets you through. I would eventually lose interest in sex with a man who didn't have those needed things.


----------



## Ikaika

Livvie said:


> Well I think the final takeaway of the thread (from what has been discussed only in this thread) is that large vaginas really AREN'T leading to an epidemic of bad sex but that small penises could be.






Blondilocks said:


> It's hard to tell who the bigger ****-stirrer is. Still very entertaining.




And here I thought this thread was about bass players, whose instrument has a longer neck and can go deeper, vs strummy strummy guitar players (that small cute instrument). 


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## DepressedHusband

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> It's not up to you to decide what he is. You don't hold the definition and it isn't based off of your preferences.
> Many Doms take their subs out to places to preform and serve for others. In my area alone there is several and outings and camping trip activities devoted to just that. Many others are open in other ways. We're an active bdsm couple that goes to events and meets, we meet all kinds. Just saying you're a Dom doesn't make you the only kind there is.


He is absolutely a submissive, and you are the dominant, that much is abundantly clear, and likelyt because you manipulate him into submission. A dominant a real true dominant, owns his piece of ass, like in a safe. Anything less is just posturing. I'd beat a man to death for touching my wife, and I ain't playing about that. 



> Kids not of the lineage of my man... I'm not having any children. There is a difference between cuckholding as a kink and a hot/sl*twife kink. If you aren't into either, don't do them. Lots of couples are into things I have no interest in but they are having fun and it's not up to me to decide what is right and wrong for them.


I never decided to state the morality of your choice, but your rush to defend yourself from the term cuckhold speak volumes as to your narrative and motives.


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## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Lol he's in no way submissive to me. I'm explaining the difference because there is one. You can read up on the differences between the kinks but there's not really a point since you're not into them. 

Your bdsm isn't my bdsm. Your kink isn't my kink. These are parts of the first things you learn when you get into this lifestyle. Everyone is different and it's ok. There is not 1 way for a Dom or sub to act. Each couple creates their own relationship and rules. 

Many Doms are in open relationships. Sorry but you just don't hold the definition for how all Doms work. He owns me, he gets to choose who I service and play for. There are several venues to go to in my area for Doms taking their subs for shows and service. It's just not something out of the ordinary in my world of kink. I'm in a fairly small area and there is 4 open, non member places. More that you need membership and someone to vouch for you. 

We've met and are friends with many bdsm couples into various forms of open relationships. Ours is a rather strict and closed relationship compared to our circle as we don't play without each other. When I do it's a show for him, the other man is simply a sex toy. No names, no emotions, half the time I don't even see them. He likes watching me enjoy my sexuality and being his sl*t. May be out of the ordinary to many but it's a world I enjoy exploring in and have made amazing friendships and experiences. We both have mentors and learn a lot.


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## Rocky Mountain Yeti

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> I would turn down a man who was wonderful in every other way if we didn't match in bed. It's far more than an exact size. Sex has to feel good, he has to look good so I can feel the desire, that includes a nice looking penis. He has to be good in bed, not eventually he can learn to be. I'm not interested in wasting my time on a maybe.
> 
> That chemistry feeling comes and goes and it's the compatibility that gets you through. I would eventually lose interest in sex with a man who didn't have those needed things.


So are women supposed to find men who were just born good in bed, or are selfish women jut letting other women get us Neanderthals trained up and then stealing away?

Few, if any, are born good. And you can't learn everything from the net or a book. There's no substitute for practical experience. 

Where are guys going to get that experience if women only accept the finished product? 

You owe it to your sisters to bring them along!


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## Elizabeth001

You're forgetting about potential. We can tell. 


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## Rocky Mountain Yeti

Elizabeth001 said:


> You're forgetting about potential. We can tell.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


This is good, but SGC specifically said that someone who "could be" would also summarily removed from contention. Apparently, she's not willing to expend any time or effort developing potential.

As a mountain biker, I spend a lot of time riding. I know someone had to build those trails I enjoy so much. So when there are calls for new trails, or needs to maintain existing ones, I'm there, tools in hand, ready to give back to the sport I enjoy.

I think we should all endeavor to give back to whatever enterprise gives us pleasure--especially experienced sexual women >


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## SlowlyGoingCrazy

I'm not 18. I'm not being with men who are fresh and new into sex. If by 40-50 these men haven't figured it out, they aren't going to. 

Selfish, lazy, impatient lovers just don't get much better. Even less so when they are still that way at 40. 

How many times have men and women married someone hoping sex would get better - and it doesn't? Not worth the risk to me. 

I factor in first time nerves and whatnot but you can tell good lovers from bad ones pretty easy.


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## Elizabeth001

For me personally, first time sex is rarely great. It takes time for me to become comfortable, to find out exactly what they like and for them to figure out what I like. However, I can tell from the first time if there's potential. 


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## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Yep, first time is a lot about how they go about it. 

There's a lot of signs that someone is selfish or lazy that can be spotted quickly even ignoring that the sex overall is awkward sometimes, there are signs. 

First time with my bf blew my mind, he showed he was a giver and put my pleasure first and enjoyed it. Wasn't just something he was doing cause he was supposed to. There was never a rush, never wanting to get to "his part". 

I could tell the guys who were going through the motions of boobs, vagina, oral, sex. Cause that's what they "should" do. Mechanical and technical. Wanting to get the job done to get to the sex part vs enjoying every part of the experience as a whole. 

Then of course the bad ones who didn't bother with anything. 

I spent 10 years in a no sex/bad sex relationship. That was enough for me. I just wouldn't risk hoping he could get better and getting invested in something that will ultimately fail if he didn't.


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## Diana7

Rocky Mountain Yeti said:


> So are women supposed to find men who were just born good in bed, or are selfish women jut letting other women get us Neanderthals trained up and then stealing away?
> 
> Few, if any, are born good. And you can't learn everything from the net or a book. There's no substitute for practical experience.
> 
> Where are guys going to get that experience if women only accept the finished product?
> 
> You owe it to your sisters to bring them along!


These thoughts are sort of my thoughts. No one starts off experienced in bed, and even those who have loads of sex with loads of partners can often still be very selfish weak lovers, only out for what they can get, caring little about the people they have sex with or whether they even know their name sometimes.Just using them for themselves. It's often only when they are are in a loving committed relationship/marriage, that love is part of it and that it becomes so much more than just a physical selfish act to get whatever they can out of it. 
This is why for me its so important to be with a man who hasn't slept around, and who sees sex as being very much part of a loving committed relationship. I couldn't care less if a man hasn't had much/any sexual experience, in fact, the thought of sleeping with a man who has treated sex so casually and who has many sexual partners is a complete turn off to me. It's something you can grow and develop together over the years. I always think it's odd when people use the term 'good' or 'bad' in bed, when it's nothing of the sort.


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## SlowlyGoingCrazy

And that works out great for people who happen to end up with someone who has the same sexual needs and desires and sex drive as they do. 

Say a man or woman just goes for the cross your fingers and hope it turns out route is someone with a high sex drive, loves oral, wants to try new things and their partner is a low drive, one position star fish who thinks oral is gross and has no desire to change a thing. 

It happens. A lot. Or you start with a star fish, no oral sexual relationship and then wonder why 30 years later your wife/husband is still starfish, no oral. That's who they were when you met them. It usually stays about the same. 

Maybe rarely a man or woman who is selfish and lazy and LD becomes an adventurous, HD, giving partner but I doubt it happens enough to be worth committing to.


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## Elizabeth001

Yep...I married my husband because I loved him so much and the sex would come around. It didn't. He had so many issues and refused to do anything about them. I divorced him after 10 years of total frustration. It won't happen again. 


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## ConanHub

Elizabeth001 said:


> Yep...I married my husband because I loved him so much and the sex would come around. It didn't. He had so many issues and refused to do anything about them. I divorced him after 10 years of total frustration. It won't happen again.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Ouch! Doesn't sound like he loved you back very much.


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## Buddy400

Faithful Wife said:


> It is interesting to me too that it* seems as if some of the posters on this thread* are projecting that these men we find who do match up with us pretty well must not be quality men, somehow. Seems like the assumption is that we are chasing bad boys who will ultimately behave badly...because somehow men who are attractive (to us) and meet our other criteria must not be anything but a good lay.
> 
> But for me, not only does the guy have to meet my sexual/physical criteria, he also has to be sweet, kind, loving, a good person, share my same values, dignified, respectable, and so on. He won't get a second date and no chance at all to find out if there is sexual compatibility if these things aren't present.
> 
> Yet us having sexual/physical/chemistry preferences at all makes some men quickly toss out the "superficial" card on us and warn us with things like "hope the sex is good enough to make up for lack of character". I mean, do we really ALSO have to plainly state that we require a man's character to be acceptable if we mention we have sexual/physical preferences? Because if we don't it will be assumed that we don't have any character ourselves and just want mad sex with a man who has literally nothing good about him except his looks/penis/sexual skill? There are still men who want to shame us for the very mention of having sexual preferences, because you know, that means we are clearly skanky and have no other standards.


Not me. I'm not shaming anybody for having sexual experiences or desires.

I have consistently focused on the possibility that if one's list consist of being sweet, kind, loving, a good person, share my same values, dignified, respectable while also tall, attractive and hung is generally going to restrict one's options.

It may not be a problem for a Playboy model, a Rock Star or a Movie Star, but it will for most others.

I guess the upside is that, if one ever does have a relationship, it'll probably be really good (well, unless the fact that he's sweet, kind, loving, a good person, shares my same values, dignified, respectable, tall, attractive and hung means that he has a lot of options and doesn't stick around).


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## Diana7

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> And that works out great for people who happen to end up with someone who has the same sexual needs and desires and sex drive as they do.
> 
> Say a man or woman just goes for the cross your fingers and hope it turns out route is someone with a high sex drive, loves oral, wants to try new things and their partner is a low drive, one position star fish who thinks oral is gross and has no desire to change a thing.
> 
> It happens. A lot. Or you start with a star fish, no oral sexual relationship and then wonder why 30 years later your wife/husband is still starfish, no oral. That's who they were when you met them. It usually stays about the same.
> 
> Maybe rarely a man or woman who is selfish and lazy and LD becomes an adventurous, HD, giving partner but I doubt it happens enough to be worth committing to.


The sex life in a long term committed relationship/marriage changes drastically over the years, as you communicate, as you learn to put the other first, be unselfish, compromise, remember that your whole life together not just the sex is vitally important and needs to be worked on, are faithful, committed, love unconditionally and respect each other.
Whether people like oral, anal or anything else is between them, there are so many things you can do in a good sexual relationship with or without those things. My aim always is to please my husband sexually, to put him first, and by doing that(which he also does), I get so much out of it and never ever refuse him sex nor anything he has requested. It's so much about our love, our commitment, faithfulness, without those things it would be empty, pointless and meaningless.


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## CharlieParker

Rocky Mountain Yeti said:


> This is good, but SGC specifically said that someone who "could be" would also summarily removed from contention. Apparently, she's not willing to expend any time or effort developing potential.


Had my now wife known I was a virgin she says she wouldn't have given me a chance. According to TAM logic we did it all wrong, sex on the first date (technically it wasn't even a date), she was my first, she had a huge number. But I think we did ok, 25 years next month, never sexless and no attempted homicide.


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## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Diana- that's great but not all partners will never refuse or be unselfish. Both me and my bf are the same, it's why I picked him. That's why I made sure that's how he was before I decided to commit. 

You need both to be. You have that, not everyone gets so lucky. 

If you only have 1 unselfish partner and 1 selfish, lazy partner then you have an issue. 

Every man I'd talk to would tell me how giving he was in bed, how great he was and loved to make it all about her. Very few actually were. 
Talking to them didn't tell me if they were a selfish lover or an unselfish lover. Sleeping with them did. 

You can be as unselfish and giving as you can be but if you have a bad partner it isn't going to do crap. There are many men and women on this forum who are like you, want to give and be unselfish and want unselfish, loving sex. 

They don't have it because of their partner.


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## Elizabeth001

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> Diana- that's great but not all partners will never refuse or be unselfish. Both me and my bf are the same, it's why I picked him. That's why I made sure that's how he was before I decided to commit.
> 
> 
> 
> You need both to be. You have that, not everyone gets so lucky.
> 
> 
> 
> If you only have 1 unselfish partner and 1 selfish, lazy partner then you have an issue.
> 
> 
> 
> Every man I'd talk to would tell me how giving he was in bed, how great he was and loved to make it all about her. Very few actually were.
> 
> Talking to them didn't tell me if they were a selfish lover or an unselfish lover. Sleeping with them did.
> 
> 
> 
> You can be as unselfish and giving as you can be but if you have a bad partner it isn't going to do crap. There are many men and women on this forum who are like you, want to give and be unselfish and want unselfish, loving sex.
> 
> 
> 
> They don't have it because of their partner.




That was my situation. 


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## Diana7

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> Diana- that's great but not all partners will never refuse or be unselfish. Both me and my bf are the same, it's why I picked him. That's why I made sure that's how he was before I decided to commit.
> 
> You need both to be. You have that, not everyone gets so lucky.
> 
> If you only have 1 unselfish partner and 1 selfish, lazy partner then you have an issue.
> 
> Every man I'd talk to would tell me how giving he was in bed, how great he was and loved to make it all about her. Very few actually were.
> Talking to them didn't tell me if they were a selfish lover or an unselfish lover. Sleeping with them did.
> 
> You can be as unselfish and giving as you can be but if you have a bad partner it isn't going to do crap. There are many men and women on this forum who are like you, want to give and be unselfish and want unselfish, loving sex.
> 
> They don't have it because of their partner.


That's why you don't marry a selfish self-centered person.


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## Elizabeth001

Diana7 said:


> That's why you don't marry a selfish self-centered person.




You don't always figure that out until after the fact. 


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## Diana7

Elizabeth001 said:


> You don't always figure that out until after the fact.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


You can be pretty sure.


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## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Diana7 said:


> That's why you don't marry a selfish self-centered person.


Which is why I make sure before I make a commitment. 

They all say how unselfish they are in bed. They all tell you they love pleasing and are unselfish. It's simply not something I'm leaving to chance. I don't want someone who pleases me because I want them to and he wants to make me happy. I want someone who enjoys pleasing me for him. That's harder to find so I have to be more careful in when I'm looking. 
I would eventually lose interest in sex if it wasn't giving me what I needed. 

Many people ended up not realizing it would be a problem until later. They hoped it would grow and get better. It didn't. So you end up with one or the other being frustrated, one of the other losing interest because the sex isn't pleasing, one or the other wanting more. 

But you have to understand too that your sexual needs are low, your husband's sexual needs are low. Together it works perfectly and for both of you it's ok to put that lower on your needs list. 

You both put things like religion much higher. 

If your sexual needs were higher it would be more important to put on the top of your list. 

My sexual needs are at the top of my list.


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## Bibi1031

Sadly that has not been my experience. 



Diana7 said:


> You can be pretty sure.


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## Elizabeth001

Diana7 said:


> You can be pretty sure.




I don't know why I even bother responding to you. 


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## Diana7

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> Which is why I make sure before I make a commitment.
> 
> They all say how unselfish they are in bed. They all tell you they love pleasing and are unselfish. It's simply not something I'm leaving to chance. I don't want someone who pleases me because I want them to and he wants to make me happy. I want someone who enjoys pleasing me for him. That's harder to find so I have to be more careful in when I'm looking.
> I would eventually lose interest in sex if it wasn't giving me what I needed.
> 
> Many people ended up not realizing it would be a problem until later. They hoped it would grow and get better. It didn't. So you end up with one or the other being frustrated, one of the other losing interest because the sex isn't pleasing, one or the other wanting more.
> 
> But you have to understand too that your sexual needs are low, your husband's sexual needs are low. Together it works perfectly and for both of you it's ok to put that lower on your needs list.
> 
> You both put things like religion much higher.
> 
> If your sexual needs were higher it would be more important to put on the top of your list.
> 
> My sexual needs are at the top of my list.


You are wrong, we both place sex in marriage very highly, and we know how very important it is, which is why we never refuse the other sex. 
Yes of course for us God comes first, but being that He invented sex and made us this way, that's not at all contradictory.There is a whole book in the Bible all about sex. However, if sex is your main criteria, your life will be shattered if for some reason you can no longer have sex, or the man you love can't.


----------



## Diana7

Elizabeth001 said:


> I don't know why I even bother responding to you.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


IF you spend time communicating, seeing how he treats others, observing his values and character over time, you can be pretty sure.


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Low sexual needs being that you don't need or want to experiment or even do oral or anal sex or have any needs or kinks that require compatibility. 

You are both ok with your quality and quantity of sex and would both be fine if something happened and you'd never have sex again. 

Many people want more and that is fine too. People should make sure their partner can meet their needs. Or they end up sexless and frustrated. 

Some partners want just the bare basics and still can't get that from their partner. 

I expect my sexual needs be cared for even if something happened physically. As I would his. There are plenty of ways to stay sexual. I will always be a sexual person and want a sexual relationship.


----------



## Livvie

Diana7 said:


> Elizabeth001 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I don't know why I even bother responding to you.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
> 
> 
> 
> IF you spend time communicating, seeing how he treats others, observing his values and character over time, you can be pretty sure.
Click to expand...

Wow wow wow. Seeing how a man treats others, observing his values and character, ultimately has nothing to do with his sexuality and what kind of a sexual partner he may be. Just ask a lot of the men here. How many times do we read that a man is married to the most wonderful woman!! but she won't participate as a loving sex partner. Go read the sex starved wife thread. Read about all of the wonderful men, but they are unable to provide a connected full sex life. 

You don't always know. One trait does not always equal another.


----------



## Personal

Diana7 said:


> You can be pretty sure.


If that were true you would have never been cheated on, nor would you have gotten divorced.


----------



## BetrayedDad

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> My bf enjoys using large dildos on me and stretching, eventually working up to fisting someday.


Well.... please do keep us posted on that.


----------



## Diana7

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> Low sexual needs being that you don't need or want to experiment or even do oral or anal sex or have any needs or kinks that require compatibility.
> 
> You are both ok with your quality and quantity of sex and would both be fine if something happened and you'd never have sex again.
> 
> Many people want more and that is fine too. People should make sure their partner can meet their needs. Or they end up sexless and frustrated.
> 
> Some partners want just the bare basics and still can't get that from their partner.
> 
> I expect my sexual needs be cared for even if something happened physically. As I would his. There are plenty of ways to stay sexual. I will always be a sexual person and want a sexual relationship.


It's not about being fine if something happened and we couldn't have sex again, its about the fact that if you love someone and are committed to them, you don't just bail out or cheat if your partner gets ill/injured or whatever and can no longer have sex(and yes that happens a lot as you age and sometimes when you are younger). It's not all about me me me. 
No we don't have low sexual needs, we have a good varied regular sex life. Great quality as well. Full of love and giving.


----------



## Diana7

Personal said:


> If that were true you would have never been cheated on, nor would you have gotten divorced.


I wasn't cheated on, my divorce was for a different reason.


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Me and my bf both would expect to fulfill each other sexually even if the penis or vagina stopped working. Still other things that can be done. 

That's one of the reasons I look for a highly sexual partner, so sex is always a priority. No matter what else is going on, sexual fulfillment is a high priority. 

It's totally ok for it to be lower on the priority list for others. There's no right and wrong. 

Both my drive and my kinks require a specific compatibility so it's more important to me to make sure it's good and it works. So I'll test it out to make sure.


----------



## Personal

Diana7 said:


> I wasn't cheated on, my divorce was for a different reason.


Well if that's the case as a Christian you shouldn't have left your first husband.

And my point still stands you evidently weren't sure.


----------



## alexm

Diana7 said:


> It's not about being fine if something happened and we couldn't have sex again, its about the fact that if you love someone and are committed to them, you don't just bail out or cheat if your partner gets ill/injured or whatever and can no longer have sex(and yes that happens a lot as you age and sometimes when you are younger). It's not all about me me me.
> No we don't have low sexual needs, we have a good varied regular sex life. Great quality as well. Full of love and giving.


Honest question, and I apologize if you find it a stupid one. It's not a trap question, either.

IF something happened to you, and you would not be able to take care of your husbands needs at all, would you, religiously speaking, be 'allowed' to give him permission to seek sexual satisfaction elsewhere?

I'm not insinuating you would (I don't think you would, TBH), but just hypothetically speaking - is that breaking the marriage vows?


----------



## Haiku

knobcreek said:


> Let's talk about large vaginas.


He won the election fair and square. Get over it. 😬


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Haiku said:


> He won the election fair and square. Get over it. 😬


 :grin2:


----------



## GusPolinski

This thread is getting a bit worn out.




:smthumbup:


----------



## Personal

That's a bit of a stretch Gus.


----------



## sokillme

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> Me and my bf both would expect to fulfill each other sexually even if the penis or vagina stopped working. Still other things that can be done.
> 
> That's one of the reasons I look for a highly sexual partner, so sex is always a priority. No matter what else is going on, sexual fulfillment is a high priority.
> 
> It's totally ok for it to be lower on the priority list for others. There's no right and wrong.
> 
> Both my drive and my kinks require a specific compatibility so it's more important to me to make sure it's good and it works. So I'll test it out to make sure.


Not to change the subject but since this IS the subject matter of the thread more so then HD or LD, I have been wanting to ask what it the appeal of fisting? It doesn't seem like it would be any more pleasurable then other things you could do, is it just seeing his reaction? Like the stretching stuff I think I get wanting to be filled up, but once you are what does the stretching add to it? Like if size increases the pleasure why are not more women shoving traffic cones up there?


----------



## Mr The Other

Diana7 said:


> Many of us would never do that, its totally disrespectful.


I read your quote and thought, fair enough. Not everywhere is like the UK. Then I read you are in the UK. The UK has, in my experience more chivilarous/sexist elements than most of the western world. I would find that behaviour normal amongst women and less common amongst men.


----------



## GusPolinski

GusPolinski said:


> This thread is getting a bit worn out.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> :smthumbup:





Personal said:


> That's a bit of a stretch Gus.


Yeah, I guess that one wasn't very fresh.


----------



## Personal

Yeah I guess bridging that gap is getting a bit old.


----------



## doobie

I really can't understand the obsession with size - whether it's penis or vagina. Personally, I find a big penis will make sex uncomfortable and sometimes painful. The last guy I had sex with had a relatively large penis (compared with others I've experienced) and he didn't even manage to fit it into me until the third time we had sex. It took a lot of foreplay and patience before I could manage it and, due to the size more than anything, I found the sex less satisfying than I was hoping. I found it difficult to relax enough to be able to come during PIV sex and there were several positions that were really a no-no because it became painful. 

I had a date on the weekend with a guy who wants to see me again and, when we embraced, I found it difficult to get close enough to kiss him as his belly was in the way! I think this means that if the relationship were to develop to the point where we have sex, we wouldn't be able to have face-to-face sex because the logistics would just make it impossible!


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

sokillme said:


> Not to change the subject but since this IS the subject matter of the thread more so then HD or LD, I have been wanting to ask what it the appeal of fisting? It doesn't seem like it would be any more pleasurable then other things you could do, is it just seeing his reaction? Like the stretching stuff I think I get wanting to be filled up, but once you are what does the stretching add to it? Like if size increases the pleasure why are not more women shoving traffic cones up there?


I'll answer, hoping it's a real question and not more shaming. 

Fisting isn't that uncommon, neither are large toys. There are tons of insertion and fisting categories in porn, I've always enjoyed watching them. It's also a common fetish on places like fetlife. It's just not weird to me. 

What's the appeal? It's on my list of things I want to try. I have many on it. 

The trick is the point where it's not painful or damaging but pleasurable. I haven't reached the fist portion of things yet, I'm assuming most women would not be able to get much larger than that without a ridiculous amount of practice and training so traffic cones would be out of the question. Double fisting I have seen though I doubt I'll ever get to that point. 

The point I can get to now feels like pure intensity. Almost pass out from the O and your ears ring and can't move after. I enjoy pushing myself to new limits, trying new things, feeling every kind of sensation we can come up with. 

It was also on his list. Luckily our lists matched almost exactly. We also have a rule that we don't judge. If he or I want to try something we listen without negativity and typically we would try it. At least once, even if it doesn't work out it's ok. 
If it was an absolute no (and our no lists match as well so I don't see it coming up) we would make an attempt to meet halfway and compromise to figure out something we'd both be happy with. 

Regardless of how people feel about fisting or other sexual things people are into, I think a no judgement and open minded "try it once" sexual relationship with your partner is essential. 
This also means making sure your base compatibility is there so there isn't much that comes up as a no. 

I'm not ashamed of anything I have done or want to do and the biggest part of that is having a loving and open minded partner who wouldn't judge me, shame me or look at me negatively for anything we do or I want to do.


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Also ftr 

F is for FISTING

^ If anyone does try, do it safely. This is one site but there are many others. 
I can't recommend enough to read and research any new thing you and your partner do. Don't just go trying to shove a hand in your wife. 
Communication, understanding safety measures, and patience are critical of anything out of the normal.


----------



## Middle of Everything

I think this thread is big enough. You could definitely get a fist up in here.


----------



## MrsHolland

OP is very quiet. I think old knobby got sucked into the vortex and can't get out again, that must be one hell of a cavernous vagina his wife has.


----------



## Middle of Everything

MrsHolland said:


> OP is very quiet. I think old knobby got sucked into the vortex and can't get out again, that must be one hell of a cavernous vagina his wife has.


Maybe he is one of the Duggers. You know according to his Vagina theory having 19 or so kids would pretty much make her Vag as big as a sleeping bag. Maybe Knob is "camping".


----------



## chillymorn69

like throwing a hot dog down a hallway


----------



## chillymorn69

strap a board to your a$$ so you don't fall in


----------



## Faithful Wife

sokillme said:


> SlowlyGoingCrazy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Me and my bf both would expect to fulfill each other sexually even if the penis or vagina stopped working. Still other things that can be done.
> 
> That's one of the reasons I look for a highly sexual partner, so sex is always a priority. No matter what else is going on, sexual fulfillment is a high priority.
> 
> It's totally ok for it to be lower on the priority list for others. There's no right and wrong.
> 
> Both my drive and my kinks require a specific compatibility so it's more important to me to make sure it's good and it works. So I'll test it out to make sure.
> 
> 
> 
> Not to change the subject but since this IS the subject matter of the thread more so then HD or LD, I have been wanting to ask what it the appeal of fisting? It doesn't seem like it would be any more pleasurable then other things you could do, is it just seeing his reaction? Like the stretching stuff I think I get wanting to be filled up, but once you are what does the stretching add to it? Like if size increases the pleasure why are not more women shoving traffic cones up there?
Click to expand...

If a particular sex act or activity doesn't appeal to you, I don't think it's possible to understand why it is appealing to others. That's just how we are. There are people who want to be asphyxiated during sex, who want painful heavy clamps hung on their nipples or balls or penis or labia or clit, who want to be verbally degraded or beaten to the point of bruising and bleeding.

I have no interest in any of these so I can't personally understand what the appeal is. However, it doesn't matter in any way shape or form what kind of adult consensual sex other people have. Therefore there is also no need to understand the appeal these things have for others. No judgement because, who gives a flying F what other people do in the bedroom or why they like it? 

It's fair to ask out of curiosity as you did. I know you aren't judging just because you asked the question. I'm just pointing out that you will still not be able to understand the appeal. 

As for stretching, this holds no appeal for me. But once in awhile my bf talks dirty to me about filling me up with gigantic objects and that turns me on just because he's being naughty when he's saying it.


----------



## Luvher4life

Wow! I just measured my fist, and it is 12" in circumference...:surprise:

Hmmm..., I think I need a beer, or two, or three...:grin2:..., and I don't even drink anymore.


----------



## Rocky Mountain Yeti

Luvher4life said:


> Wow! I just measured my fist, and it is 12" in circumference...:surprise:
> 
> Hmmm..., I think I need a beer, or two, or three...:grin2:..., and I don't even drink anymore.


Next time I measure myself, I'm measuring in centimeters but reporting it in inches. who says American's can't make good use of the metric system:nerd:!


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

12 inch circumference seems about right. Mine is 9 and I'm a girl, obviously. This is why we got the toy (9", same size as mine) vs his which is more like 12" and way too big. 

And FW is right that if you're not into something it just won't be something someone can explain. I don't get animal roleplay but I know a girl who plays like a kitty and she loves it. I see no appeal. I'm also not into age play or being a little but many people are, or diaper wearing is another I just don't get. I don't think anyone should be judged or shamed for whatever they are into. 
Let your freak flag fly and do whatever you enjoy. 

Imo also, less shaming and judging would lead to a lot less "why isn't my wife a sexual person"
Cause we grow up being shamed and pressured in both ways. 

Being told we have to be the exact right amount of sexual to get and please a man but not too much to be a sl*t and not too little to be a prude. 

There's very little focus on what she wants or the ability to explore things without judgement and shame. 

So as funny or weird or different as some kinks are, I don't think anyone should judge or be negative about them.


----------



## Rocky Mountain Yeti

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> Being told we have to be the exact right amount of sexual to get and please a man but not too much to be a sl*t and not too little to be a prude.


And, oh, by the way, the exact location of that precariously narrow ledge is different for every man, so it's usually an impossible standard to aim for at any given time.


----------



## Rocky Mountain Yeti

Rocky Mountain Yeti said:


> And, oh, by the way, the exact location of that precariously narrow ledge is different for every man, so it's usually an impossible standard to aim for at any given time.



This also reminds me of another old double standard. That men expected women to be perfectly chaste before marriage, but somehow morph into insatiable nymphomaniacs on the wedding night and remain that way through all of life's changes. As if she could just flip a switch and become a completely different person.

I think that one is fading these days, at least in the culture in which I live.


----------



## Luvher4life

Rocky Mountain Yeti said:


> Next time I measure myself, I'm measuring in centimeters but reporting it in inches. who says American's can't make good use of the metric system:nerd:!


At the very least that'll confuse 'em.:grin2:

2.54 cm = ?


----------



## Rocky Mountain Yeti

I am reminded of yet another joke, which, unfortunately for our internet conversation, is partly visual.

Q. Why are women so bad at understanding distance?
A. Because we keep telling them this (holds thumb and forefinger about 3" apart) is 6"!


----------



## Elizabeth001

You guys seriously need to come up with some new material. lol 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Handy

* SGC
The point I can get to now feels like pure intensity. Almost pass out from the O and your ears ring and can't move after.*

WOW! That sounds like the most pleasant Le petite mort (mini-death) I have heard about in a long time.

You are correct about shame (self raises hand) so I was usually concerned about doing anything outside of vanilla. Now that I am almost too old, I have a better understanding that what I was told (all very conservative) is mostly BS and people vary in what is OK or not OK. I think a lot of the HD vs LD is more about what someone considers acceptable or not because of shame based beliefs and so called rules.


----------



## MrsHolland

SGC I just wanted to say bravo to you, gorgeous woman. You have held your own here, in a dignified way, in the face of some very insulting and demeaning language thrown at you (by OP mainly and some others). I like your posts because of the way you stand up for yourself in such a mature way.

There is plenty that I don't understand or want to try but hold no judgement on those that do. The only criteria I have in my sex life is that it is respectful and mutually so. The world would be a better place if more people had the self esteem and conviction you do without having to put other people down.

Rock on.


----------



## Elizabeth001

MrsHolland said:


> SGC I just wanted to say bravo to you, gorgeous woman. You have held your own here, in a dignified way, in the face of some very insulting and demeaning language thrown at you (by OP mainly and some others). I like your posts because of the way you stand up for yourself in such a mature way.
> 
> There is plenty that I don't understand or want to try but hold no judgement on those that do. The only criteria I have in my sex life is that it is respectful and mutually so. The world would be a better place if more people had the self esteem and conviction you do without having to put other people down.
> 
> Rock on.



Agreed!!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## sokillme

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> I'll answer, hoping it's a real question and not more shaming.
> 
> Fisting isn't that uncommon, neither are large toys. There are tons of insertion and fisting categories in porn, I've always enjoyed watching them. It's also a common fetish on places like fetlife. It's just not weird to me.
> 
> What's the appeal? It's on my list of things I want to try. I have many on it.
> 
> The trick is the point where it's not painful or damaging but pleasurable. I haven't reached the fist portion of things yet, I'm assuming most women would not be able to get much larger than that without a ridiculous amount of practice and training so traffic cones would be out of the question. Double fisting I have seen though I doubt I'll ever get to that point.
> 
> The point I can get to now feels like pure intensity. Almost pass out from the O and your ears ring and can't move after. I enjoy pushing myself to new limits, trying new things, feeling every kind of sensation we can come up with.
> 
> It was also on his list. Luckily our lists matched almost exactly. We also have a rule that we don't judge. If he or I want to try something we listen without negativity and typically we would try it. At least once, even if it doesn't work out it's ok.
> If it was an absolute no (and our no lists match as well so I don't see it coming up) we would make an attempt to meet halfway and compromise to figure out something we'd both be happy with.
> 
> Regardless of how people feel about fisting or other sexual things people are into, I think a no judgement and open minded "try it once" sexual relationship with your partner is essential.
> This also means making sure your base compatibility is there so there isn't much that comes up as a no.
> 
> I'm not ashamed of anything I have done or want to do and the biggest part of that is having a loving and open minded partner who wouldn't judge me, shame me or look at me negatively for anything we do or I want to do.


I'm not shaming, I just don't really see anything sexy about it, just wondering why some people do. The way you describe it, it's more like a bucket list thing. Climb Kilimanjaro, shove a fist in there, scuba dive, sing in the rain, you know the usual. The other thing is the water works, I don't get that one either. I mean I get the hot wife, I think it is about power or being more attracted to having a porn star as a wife then having a wife wanting have sex with you. Not for me but at least I can make sense of it. The way you describe the fisting I could see the novelty of it, kind of silly in a fun kind of way, but whatever it probably would be funny. I think I could get into it as a kind of crazy fun thing to do if she really wanted to. Don't think I would be turned on though. The pee thing, nah that is just gross.


----------



## Faithful Wife

sokillme said:


> SlowlyGoingCrazy said:
> 
> 
> 
> I'll answer, hoping it's a real question and not more shaming.
> 
> Fisting isn't that uncommon, neither are large toys. There are tons of insertion and fisting categories in porn, I've always enjoyed watching them. It's also a common fetish on places like fetlife. It's just not weird to me.
> 
> What's the appeal? It's on my list of things I want to try. I have many on it.
> 
> The trick is the point where it's not painful or damaging but pleasurable. I haven't reached the fist portion of things yet, I'm assuming most women would not be able to get much larger than that without a ridiculous amount of practice and training so traffic cones would be out of the question. Double fisting I have seen though I doubt I'll ever get to that point.
> 
> The point I can get to now feels like pure intensity. Almost pass out from the O and your ears ring and can't move after. I enjoy pushing myself to new limits, trying new things, feeling every kind of sensation we can come up with.
> 
> It was also on his list. Luckily our lists matched almost exactly. We also have a rule that we don't judge. If he or I want to try something we listen without negativity and typically we would try it. At least once, even if it doesn't work out it's ok.
> If it was an absolute no (and our no lists match as well so I don't see it coming up) we would make an attempt to meet halfway and compromise to figure out something we'd both be happy with.
> 
> Regardless of how people feel about fisting or other sexual things people are into, I think a no judgement and open minded "try it once" sexual relationship with your partner is essential.
> This also means making sure your base compatibility is there so there isn't much that comes up as a no.
> 
> I'm not ashamed of anything I have done or want to do and the biggest part of that is having a loving and open minded partner who wouldn't judge me, shame me or look at me negatively for anything we do or I want to do.
> 
> 
> 
> I'm not shaming, I just don't really see anything sexy about it, just wondering why some people do. The way you describe it, it's more like a bucket list thing. Climb Kilimanjaro, shove a fist in there, scuba dive, sing in the rain, you know the usual. The other thing is the water works, I don't get that one either. I mean I get the hot wife, I think it is about power or being more attracted to having a porn star as a wife then having a wife wanting have sex with you. Not for me but at least I can make sense of it. The way you describe the fisting I could see the novelty of it, kind of silly in a fun kind of way, but whatever it probably would be funny. I think I could get into it as a kind of crazy fun thing to do if she really wanted to. Don't think I would be turned on though. The pee thing, nah that is just gross.
Click to expand...

It's been my experience that men are mainly the ones who want to do the giant toys and fisting or to see it in porn. Not saying that women don't want to try it, as SCG has explained that it was on her list too. But basically, many men are obsessed with doing anything they can think of to a vagina and shoving huge objects or fists up there is one of those things that thrills them. At least in fantasy which is why they want to watch porn of it.

My ex husband and I used to watch porn together once in awhile and huge toy porn was one genre he was occasionally interested in seeing. I asked him what the appeal was and he simply said it was the novelty and extremeness of it. I watched some of this type of porn with him and one of them was literally the size of a traffic cone. I was transfixed while watching because I couldn't believe what was happening before my eyes. I wanted to see how much of it she could get up in there! It was not necessarily a turn on but it did make me horny after watching as I felt like I was witnessing some kind of celestial event!


----------



## chillymorn69

I see the shaming of men in this post.

And an attitude the my lady bits are better than any man bits because i can shove a fist up there and snap a pencil if I want then to top it off saying I wouldn"t even date a man with an averaged sized penis.

Over and over again.

To me I don't care if its big or small I care that I have a natural attraction to the person I'm with and she have a mutual desire to please me as much as I want to please her.inside and outside the bed room.

But thats just me.and I don't expect anyone else to really give a $hit.


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Having a penis size preference isn't shaming men. 

If a man preferred a size 4 woman over a size 14 woman I wouldn't assume he's shaming women. 

But my lady bits are awesome and can do all kinds of cool things. My bfs penis is awesome too. We'd tie on an awesome genital contest. He'd say I was the clear winner. 

Again, not shaming men just cause our vaginas rock. I'm damn proud of mine. Used to hate it cause it wasn't very porn star like. My ex made fun of it. At one point he said he wanted to chop some bits off with a blade. 
After I left I wouldn't even let guys go down on me because I didn't want them to see it too much. 
My bf helped me get over it. 
Then I got some vagina confidence and I adore it. I post pics of it, my bf gets to stare at it all he wants. He shows us (me and my vagina) off proudly. 

Women should be proud and think their vaginas are awesome. 

And like "black lives matter" it doesn't mean penises aren't also awesome. We can celebrate vaginas without it being a dig at men. I love penises. I make my bf send me pics of his all the time. I made a mold duplicate of it to bring home. 


And thank you to those with the kind words  it's been an interesting journey from sexless with my ex to where I am now. Quite a fun one.


----------



## Diana7

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> Me and my bf both would expect to fulfill each other sexually even if the penis or vagina stopped working. Still other things that can be done.
> 
> That's one of the reasons I look for a highly sexual partner, so sex is always a priority. No matter what else is going on, sexual fulfillment is a high priority.
> 
> It's totally ok for it to be lower on the priority list for others. There's no right and wrong.
> 
> Both my drive and my kinks require a specific compatibility so it's more important to me to make sure it's good and it works. So I'll test it out to make sure.


Its not about the penis and vagina stopping working, its about if someone is very ill or disabled and is not able to do anything sexually. It would be selfish to even ask or expect them to do anything if they are that bad.


----------



## Diana7

Handy said:


> * SGC
> The point I can get to now feels like pure intensity. Almost pass out from the O and your ears ring and can't move after.*
> 
> WOW! That sounds like the most pleasant Le petite mort (mini-death) I have heard about in a long time.
> 
> You are correct about shame (self raises hand) so I was usually concerned about doing anything outside of vanilla. Now that I am almost too old, I have a better understanding that what I was told (all very conservative) is mostly BS and people vary in what is OK or not OK. I think a lot of the HD vs LD is more about what someone considers acceptable or not because of shame based beliefs and so called rules.


It would be sad if people didn't do things they wanted to through shame, but is that very common? I don't think that most people think that way now do they? It seems to me that anything goes now.


----------



## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Diana7 said:


> It would be sad if people didn't do things they wanted to through shame, but is that very common? I don't think that most people think that way now do they? It seems to me that anything goes now.


It's ridiculously common for people to not explore their sexuality due to shame. Yes even now. 

I would have been there myself. Scared of what people would think of me, scared to ask a man to try things I was interested in because of what his reaction may be. 

Shamed to not be a "sl*t" or men won't want to marry you. Some men shaming their wives over their past. Even still today. 

Tons of shame going around. Even the op thinks women who have a lot of sex are loose. There are plenty of men here who think a woman with a past isn't wife material. Lots who think any kinks are gross or weird or something wrong with you. 

All this is still today, and a lot just in this thread.


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## MrsHolland

Diana7 said:


> It would be sad if people didn't do things they wanted to through shame, but is that very common? I don't think that most people think that way now do they? It seems to me that anything goes now.


Hang on, just two minutes ago you said gays were that way because they had been sexually abused and they need deep healing. Yep that is shaming at it's worst, that is the sort of shaming that causes people to take their own lives. You should be ASHAMED of yourself.


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## Blondilocks

All I know is that my perception of my neighbors to the north has been altered forever.:surprise::surprise::grin2::rofl::>


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## Diana7

MrsHolland said:


> Hang on, just two minutes ago you said gays were that way because they had been sexually abused and they need deep healing. Yep that is shaming at it's worst, that is the sort of shaming that causes people to take their own lives. You should be ASHAMED of yourself.


I have such compassion for those who were abused as children, and long to see them healed and helped and FREE from shame,(and many have been). We have several gay friends and they were all sexually abused as children by men. Its so sad. :frown2:
I recently read a book by a man who had lived in the gay scene for 10 years and eventually left because he said that almost all of the many hundreds of men he got to know had had sad and damaging childhoods, often involving poor father son relationships and abuse. I would love to see these men helped and whole.


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## Diana7

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> It's ridiculously common for people to not explore their sexuality due to shame. Yes even now.
> 
> I would have been there myself. Scared of what people would think of me, scared to ask a man to try things I was interested in because of what his reaction may be.
> 
> Shamed to not be a "sl*t" or men won't want to marry you. Some men shaming their wives over their past. Even still today.
> 
> Tons of shame going around. Even the op thinks women who have a lot of sex are loose. There are plenty of men here who think a woman with a past isn't wife material. Lots who think any kinks are gross or weird or something wrong with you.
> 
> All this is still today, and a lot just in this thread.


I can understand that many don't want partners who have slept around, especially if they haven't themselves. What is wrong with that?I love the fact that my husband has never had sex outside marriage. Its partly what attracted me to him, his high moral values. I would have no interest in a guy who saw sex merely as a recreational activity and had slept with many women. Thats not shaming anyone. 
I thought we were talking about shame stopping us from doing certain things with our partners in sex?


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## alexm

doobie said:


> I really can't understand the obsession with size - whether it's penis or vagina. Personally, I find a big penis will make sex uncomfortable and sometimes painful. The last guy I had sex with had a relatively large penis (compared with others I've experienced) and he didn't even manage to fit it into me until the third time we had sex. It took a lot of foreplay and patience before I could manage it and, due to the size more than anything, I found the sex less satisfying than I was hoping. I found it difficult to relax enough to be able to come during PIV sex and there were several positions that were really a no-no because it became painful.
> 
> I had a date on the weekend with a guy who wants to see me again and, when we embraced, I found it difficult to get close enough to kiss him as his belly was in the way! I think this means that if the relationship were to develop to the point where we have sex, we wouldn't be able to have face-to-face sex because the logistics would just make it impossible!


Not completely serious about this, but you realize your first paragraph was about not understanding the obsession with size, followed up by recognizing you might not be able to have face-to-face sex with this gentleman due to his belly... size!

If face-to-face sex is important to you, as it is to many people I think, then he would not be a good "fit", no?

Likewise for many people in regards to penis/vagina size. You want what you want, and certain things are important to certain people. Is it any more shallow to not date someone because their belly might get in the way of sex positions that you crave?

Frankly, OP's original point was fair (however immaturely he came across). All kinds of things matter, including size of genitalia. Not to all people, no, but to many.

What I can't understand is why some people can't understand that other people have preferences, when we ALL have our own. So person A has different preferences than person B. But maybe A's don't match B's.

Ironically, OP's preferences are much the same as @faithfulwife, just that he's somehow threatened by it all, whereas FW could care less.


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## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Diana7 said:


> I can understand that many don't want partners who have slept around, especially if they haven't themselves. What is wrong with that?I love the fact that my husband has never had sex outside marriage. Its partly what attracted me to him, his high moral values. I would have no interest in a guy who saw sex merely as a recreational activity and had slept with many women. Thats not shaming anyone.
> I thought we were talking about shame stopping us from doing certain things with our partners in sex?


It all connects. A woman who is told not to be sexual isn't going to magically become sexual in marriage. 
If you're shamed out of experimenting and exploring your sexuality and finding out what you like and don't like then you're just not as likely to be a sexual person in general. 

You and I have different meanings of being a sexual person and making sex important so in your life and marriage it's fine. In mine it wouldn't be.


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## NobodySpecial

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> Fisting isn't that much of an out there kink. Pretty common porn search even for vanilla people. I forget sometimes I'm not around my kinky friends, something like that wouldn't even get a blink.


God, I so hear that.


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## MrsHolland

alexm said:


> Not completely serious about this, but you realize your first paragraph was about not understanding the obsession with size, followed up by recognizing you might not be able to have face-to-face sex with this gentleman due to his belly... size!
> 
> If face-to-face sex is important to you, as it is to many people I think, then he would not be a good "fit", no?
> 
> Likewise for many people in regards to penis/vagina size. You want what you want, and certain things are important to certain people. Is it any more shallow to not date someone because their belly might get in the way of sex positions that you crave?
> 
> Frankly, OP's original point was fair (however immaturely he came across). All kinds of things matter, including size of genitalia. Not to all people, no, but to many.
> 
> *What I can't understand is why some people can't understand that other people have preferences, when we ALL have our own. So person A has different preferences than person B. But maybe A's don't match B's.*
> 
> Ironically, OP's preferences are much the same as @faithfulwife, just that he's somehow threatened by it all, whereas FW could care less.


Agree with what you have said except the point about the OP. It wasn't so much about preferences, it was a rant about how he and his mates have wives with cavernous vaginas and that large vaginas are ruining sex for so many men. It wasn't about preferences at all. But yes I agree with your sentiments on preferences.


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## alexm

MrsHolland said:


> Agree with what you have said except the point about the OP. It wasn't so much about preferences, it was a rant about how he and his mates have wives with cavernous vaginas and that large vaginas are ruining sex for so many men. It wasn't about preferences at all. But yes I agree with your sentiments on preferences.


Right. He (OP) stated it the way he did because he's threatened somehow. I'm sure he'd disagree vehemently, but we all know that he is. The underlying message he was (clumsily and rudely) trying to convey was that size matters for either gender - which is not wrong.

Vagina size matters to me - not the way it seems to to him, and not the way penis size matters to some women, but nonetheless.


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## doobie

alexm said:


> Not completely serious about this, but you realize your first paragraph was about not understanding the obsession with size, followed up by recognizing you might not be able to have face-to-face sex with this gentleman due to his belly... size!
> 
> If face-to-face sex is important to you, as it is to many people I think, then he would not be a good "fit", no?
> 
> Likewise for many people in regards to penis/vagina size. You want what you want, and certain things are important to certain people. Is it any more shallow to not date someone because their belly might get in the way of sex positions that you crave?
> 
> Frankly, OP's original point was fair (however immaturely he came across). All kinds of things matter, including size of genitalia. Not to all people, no, but to many.
> 
> What I can't understand is why some people can't understand that other people have preferences, when we ALL have our own. So person A has different preferences than person B. But maybe A's don't match B's.
> 
> Ironically, OP's preferences are much the same as @faithfulwife, just that he's somehow threatened by it all, whereas FW could care less.


I had realised when I was writing it that it would probably come across that way. The point is that if I'm having sex with a guy, I've already got past the point of whether or not I fancy him enough for sex. The guy with the belly seems a really nice guy and I'm having another date tomorrow. At this point, I feel no sexual attraction towards him at all because I hardly know him. Sexual attraction for me happens as a result of getting to know somebody really well, it goes way beyond looks. I know this is the case as I currently have a 26-year old male model type persuing me and asking for a date. He's absolutely gorgeous looking, really fit body, etc, but I'm not in the slightest interested as he's too young for me. Yes, I could have casual sex with him if I wanted but I don't want that and don't really feel any attraction towards him other than the fact that I recognise he's an extremely good looking young man. Back to the guy with the belly, I'm sure that if the friendship were to develop to the point where I wanted to have a sexual relationship with him, then the size of his belly wouldn't stop me - I'd just need to be creative. Sadly, I can't see this happening as he's showing too much interest in me physically too soon which I find really off-putting, being rushed is a turn-off. I have agreed to a date tomorrow evening as I'd like to get to know him a little better as a friend. We're going to see a band play and there will be plenty of other people there so I'm hoping that the atmosphere will allow us to have some fun together as friends, rather than it being a romantic evening that puts me under pressure to be romantic when I don't feel that. 

If it ever does come to the point where we have a sexual relationship, my real hope is that his penis isn't a really big one as that makes sex difficult (and sometimes painful) for me.


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## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Doobie- there should be some level of sexual attraction at the start. It does grow as you get to know them but I wouldn't continue if I didn't have the base feelings there. 

Hot, model guy would mean nothing to me. I actually don't like that type. Anyone younger than me I feel like a mom, totally unsexual. 
I see a guy and I either have an attraction or I don't. Can be all kinds of men but I need that initial "ooooh" many are not the typical attractive man but just something made me attracted to them. 

His attractive level can raise and fall dramatically from that point on but I don't think I could work from 0. 

Have you ever come across men you just are attracted to or has it only ever come in once you know them?


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## Middle of Everything

Blondilocks said:


> All I know is that my perception of my neighbors to the north has been altered forever.:surprise::surprise::grin2::rofl::>


So people from San Fransico or Fresno or something? Or like all the way up in Oregon?


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## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Canada for sure, we need ways to keep warm here. it's cold. Haven't you watched GOT? Best ways to keep warm north of the wall are fighting and f*cking.


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## Ikaika

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> Canada for sure, we need ways to keep warm here. it's cold. Haven't you watched GOT? Best ways to keep warm north of the wall are fighting and f*cking.




Cold here is 15 - 16 C. 


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro


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## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Ikaika said:


> Cold here is 15 - 16 C.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro


Ouch. I can talk a big game about being able to stand -40 temps and winter but I would die in heat. I don't like anything about 26C. I'd rather freeze any day.


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## Ikaika

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> Ouch. I can talk a big game about being able to stand -40 temps and winter but I would die in heat. I don't like anything about 26C. I'd rather freeze any day.




I'm just the opposite, I'd rather strip clothing off than add on. 


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## Rocky Mountain Yeti

Ikaika said:


> Cold here is 15 - 16 C.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro


Heat is the ONE thing that diminishes my sex drive. My wife would love to live in Hawaii. Not only would she be in "paradise," I wouldn't be trying to increase sexual frequency. Win-win for her!


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## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Heat kills my sex drive too. Don't touch me, I'm sweaty and gross. Cold, come cuddle. Warm me up.


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## Ikaika

Totally the opposite for me, when it comes to the cold. I prefer tropical weather for all kinds of activity. The gym I workout at does not have AC, and for some it is a deterrent, but if it were cold, it would tighten up my joints. The same applies to bedroom workouts. 


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## TX-SC

There are differences in tightness in vaginas. My first GF was rather large and sex wasn't as good as it could have been. That was partly me and partly her. My wife was too tight until she had our first child, then it loosened up just a bit and is more comfortable for both of us.

With all that being said, I have never met a vulva I didn't like. Granted, my preference is for average to above average lip size. I like a good sized labia minora. One GF had really small lips and a small clit. I still enjoyed sex with her, but it didn't do as much for me a esthetically. I played around with one girl that had a really red colored vagina. Again, not my overall preference, but again, I would not turn her down.

I can understand how some women, and men too, may have a preference. The trick is finding someone as into you as you are them.


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## arbitrator

Rocky Mountain Yeti said:


> Heat is the ONE thing that diminishes my sex drive. My wife would love to live in Hawaii. Not only would she be in "paradise," I wouldn't be trying to increase sexual frequency. Win-win for her!


*Just conveniently turn down the air-conditioning long before you turn down the covers!

And then turn up the body heat!*


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## Luvher4life

68 degrees in our house year 'round, so heat is not really a problem. After a good sweat, take a shower, then you're good to go.

Vaginas come in different sizes just like penises, and everybody has a preference. It is what it is, although I've never felt a vagina that didn't feel good even when it wasn't a good fit. Do some feel better than others? Yes, but I don't rule out the rest of the package the person brings into the equation unless it's an obvious physical mismatch. I've been with women with huge vaginas that were good in bed. I've been with women I had trouble getting lubed up enough for entry that were good in bed. And everything in between. Good sex is definitely high on my list, too, so there's no double standard on my part here. It's okay to have a preference, and I think there's a match for everybody somewhere no matter the size of their bits.


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