# I am not sure I still love him or not....



## dragonlady2314 (Feb 26, 2018)

My husband and I have been together for 15yrs (married when I was 19yr) and we now have 3 children. As you can imagine we have been through a lot during that time. My husband always had a hard time keeping a job and being reliable in that sense. About 9yrs ago he was diagnosed with a auto-immune disease which we have went through together. He was not working at the time at diagnosis and has not worked since (about 10yrs). There are many ppl that work with his dx and he probably cannot do 40hr/week but he can do something..he doesnt even take care of himself like he should (forget to take meds, doesnt order them on-time..so goes without) He has not taken steps to receive disability or a part-time job to build his credits so eventually he could get SSD. I see no end in sight of me to solely keep supporting our family of 5. We did not make a conscience choice for him to be a SAHD...he made the choice to not work and although we had MANY fights....he never even tried to work. It has always been a touchy subject as I am never sure how much I can push and not sure what expectations were realistic. However 10yrs later I am consumed with resentment and anger towards him for allowing this to go on. We both suffer from depression but the pressure and stress of all the finances have definitely taken their toll on me and my depression and anxiety have been overwhelming.

I had to pick up a 2nd job to make ends meet...which we still aren't doing. I am extremely stressed out about money and it is taking a real toll on me. I am having anxiety attacks and go through big swings with my mood since the situation is so depressing. However, he is such a GREAT guy, GREAT dad, and for the most part supportive of me emotionally since I am usually a wreck because of stress. We get along for the most part (as long as I dont bring up my major issues w him) and we have fun together. I know he loves me beyond anything. I have tried talking to him about my feelings and he doesn't get it. It always get turned around into something I am not doing and its my fault. I was aware that I lost a lot of my respect and deep love for him a while ago due to resentfulness about how much stress he puts on me and fights with me while at work or when I get home. I just feel like how that I am mentally healthy, I am becoming more aware of the person I am and what I want in life and what I value in a partner. 

The last 4 months have been rough as due to some bad choices I made, it became clear to my husband how close to being done I was (despite numerous conversations) and on the brink of leaving. Since DH has found out how bad things are for me...he has been trying. He is doing more around the house (as close to nothing was getting done before...the whole 8-10hr I was at work), he has started driving for UBER and Lyft...and will work partial days a couple days a week. Despite our significant money issues I made a choice to get myself into therapy and since we have no insurance I am paying out of pocket.

I am noticing certain tendencies in my 14yrs son that are issues I have with my husband (lack of motivation, no drive to accomplish anything, defensive---outside of normal teenage things) also my 2 girls are starting to show habits that I do. My 1 daughter will continuously not do something she really wants just to please others and make them happy. I am very worried for the example I am setting for our kids...as I want more for them.

Despite all my DH efforts....it doesn't feel like enough. He still is not serious about getting a typical (9-5p) type of job...I know all he could do is part time and that's fine. He is a great dad, great friend to me as he is very supportive emotionally. It almost feels like emotionally and mentally I have checked out of this marriage....

I don't know what to do....has anyone else been in this situation? I am at the point that I am ready to live my life for me and therefore my kids would be happier.


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

What kind of choices did you make?


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## dragonlady2314 (Feb 26, 2018)

Unfortunately the classic text book....my 1st love reached out on FB out of nowhere...I have been looking for him on/off for past 11yrs..nothing physical happened but definitely emotional affair for sure.....everything I always thought would NEVER happen to me....so cliche. I have completely ended the EA at this point but obvi my feelings are not completely done for him...but I have and will not continue communication any further. I know I need to focus on my marriage and myself above everything. But there is this part of me that just wants to be done...i've given 15yrs of my life to hubby, kids and everyone else. I want to start to make my happiness a priority again. 
Due to the stress/pressure I am under...the running "joke" is always how crabby and snappy mom is....usually after having a stressful day at work or dealing with life situations where $ unexpectedly has to be spent...and I have to figure out how to rob Paul to pay Peter....:frown2:.....it just gets so incredibly draining and lonely.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Are you sure that your husband does not have the work credits to get disability? Has he seen a lawyer about this? If not, you need to push him to do it.

You say that your husband is a good father and husband otherwise. I disagree. Good husbands do not put all the breadwinning, house keeping, etc on thier wife when they are capable of earning an income.

I don't know what your husband's illness is, but if he can drive for uber now, he could have had a job all this time. And he most likely would not have qualified for SSD. It's acutally very hard to get SSD.

A good father does not do this to the mother of his chidlren. He does not set a bad example for his children either.

You say that your husband only now started to do housework? What has he been doing with his time all these years? Does he spend a lot of time online?

I was married to a man who did what your husband is doing. I divorced him after 12 years of that nonsense.


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## Edo Edo (Feb 21, 2017)

It seems to me that your husband is so supportive of you emotionally because he is primarily responsible for your situation in the first place. Your husband can work, but he is choosing not you and it's severely impacting your health and happiness. Now this poor example is impacting your children's behavior? I truly fail to see how this man is a great dad or even a great guy (Penis size, maybe...?) I'm sorry for your situation.


My advice is that it's ultimatum time. Going forward, you should deposit ALL of your earnings into an account that's only in your name. Next, tell him that he has X time to start making X amount per week or you are leaving him. Period. 


PS: You did the right thing by stopping all communication with your ex. People tend to remember only the good things about ex-partners, especially when their current partner is so bad...


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

Well, you both have some issues. I assume he knows about your affair? No women wants to be married to a man who won't work, but no man wants to be married to a wife who is not loyal. I wouldn't call either one of you great, I call you even at this point. I suggest you both decide, are you going to really work on the marriage, which means work, changing yourselves and getting counseling. If you either one of you can't do that then you should divorce. NO Excuse for him not working when he could, but in the same respect you reacted to this in the worst way and in a way that says you have some work to do too. 

Whatever you do don't waste any more time. Time to have the come to Jesus moment.


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## dragonlady2314 (Feb 26, 2018)

EleGirl-Do you mind if I ask...did you guys have kids? What was your first couple steps you did when you finally decided to leave? 
As far as bank account....yes I have always had the account solely in my name, the house is in my name, car in my name...everything...since he never qualified due to no income. 
As far as SSD...we applied about 7-8yrs ago and got denied and now since he hasn't been working he does not have the work credits....catch-22. That was exactly my argument....WHY all of a sudden can you work (uber)? He was not doing this prior to 3 months ago. Prior to 3 months ago...he was sometimes pitching in at my job (2-3xmonth)...since I have been completely overwhelmed and running everything by myself since we are short staff. It has ONLY been within the last 3 months he started bring in some income. Even then...he works a couple hours a day...4-5 days a week...maybe 10-12:30p..if I am lucky. He would pretty much spend all his time on the computer, video games, bs-ing...honestly I have no idea. But it has ONLY been since he thought I was going to leave him and then when he found out of the EA...he stepped his game up. Makes me feel like crap that the only time he is willing to help me out is when he thinks I am going to leave..uughh. 
Its hard when you have been with someone for so long and your identify is so enmeshed...all I have known as a adult woman is being married...so incredibly scary....somehow less scary then thinking this will be my life permanently. 
Totally agree when it comes to the "ex's" they look like Knights in Shining Armor..to save me...I need to save my damn self...


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## Edo Edo (Feb 21, 2017)

dragonlady2314 said:


> But it has ONLY been since he thought I was going to leave him and then when he found out of the EA...he stepped his game up. Makes me feel like crap that the only time he is willing to help me out is when he thinks I am going to leave..uughh.
> 
> Its hard when you have been with someone for so long and your identify is so enmeshed...all I have known as a adult woman is being married...so incredibly scary....somehow less scary then thinking this will be my life permanently.
> 
> ...I need to save my damn self...




I took these three statements from your last post. They speak volumes to someone on the outside looking in. I'm truly sorry, but I think you know what you need to so for your sake and the sake of your children's future happiness & well being...


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## As'laDain (Nov 27, 2011)

dragonlady2314 said:


> EleGirl-Do you mind if I ask...did you guys have kids? What was your first couple steps you did when you finally decided to leave?
> As far as bank account....yes I have always had the account solely in my name, the house is in my name, car in my name...everything...since he never qualified due to no income.
> As far as SSD...we applied about 7-8yrs ago and got denied and now since he hasn't been working he does not have the work credits....catch-22. That was exactly my argument....WHY all of a sudden can you work (uber)? He was not doing this prior to 3 months ago. Prior to 3 months ago...he was sometimes pitching in at my job (2-3xmonth)...since I have been completely overwhelmed and running everything by myself since we are short staff. It has ONLY been within the last 3 months he started bring in some income. Even then...he works a couple hours a day...4-5 days a week...maybe 10-12:30p..if I am lucky. He would pretty much spend all his time on the computer, video games, bs-ing...honestly I have no idea. But it has ONLY been since he thought I was going to leave him and then when he found out of the EA...he stepped his game up. Makes me feel like crap that the only time he is willing to help me out is when he thinks I am going to leave..uughh.
> Its hard when you have been with someone for so long and your identify is so enmeshed...all I have known as a adult woman is being married...so incredibly scary....somehow less scary then thinking this will be my life permanently.
> Totally agree when it comes to the "ex's" they look like Knights in Shining Armor..to save me...I need to save my damn self...


i would suggest removing internet access during normal working hours. if he doesnt step up the uber and lyft hours after that, then cut the data from his phone(if you are the one paying for it). 

it could be that he needs that kind of motivation to start acting like a man again. either way, sitting at home with no internet access would hopefully get boring enough to get him to start doing SOMETHING...


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## dragonlady2314 (Feb 26, 2018)

Edo Edo said:


> I took these three statements from your last post. They speak volumes to someone on the outside looking in. I'm truly sorry, but I think you know what you need to so for your sake and the sake of your children's future happiness & well being...


Its like an out-of-body experience when I hear myself telling people or my girlfriends (thats super new..since I hardly had any friend..isolated myself...and then I would never open up since I felt like it was a betrayal of my hubs) its sounds so incredibly CRAZY. If I heard someone else say some of this I would tell them to run! But then my response is again the classics.."i made vows, I dont want to be responsible for breaking up my family, he really IS a good guy, blah blah blah". Then to complicate things he has medical issues...so I never know how hard to push. I stopped even talking to him about him working since all it would be is us fighting and making me feel bad. So this weekend since he is "turning over a new left" I figured let me give it a shot....same thing...I dont care about his health, his MD told him not to work (not true...even so...there are variety of options from home) and I felt like a horrible person for even asking him to work outside of the UBER/Lyft....

It is so incredibly humbling to hear other peoples opinion on it.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

dragonlady2314 said:


> EleGirl-Do you mind if I ask...did you guys have kids? What was your first couple steps you did when you finally decided to leave?


We married in 2000. He had 100% custody of his two children (daughter 10 & son 12). I had custody of my son, 10 years old. I waited until the children were out of high school to file for divorce because I did not want to disrupt their lives while they were in school with yet another divorce.
The first step was to make a plan. Make sure that I had copies of all financial and legal papers in a safe place. Made sure I knew the divorce laws. IN your case you probably need to talk to an attorney because you could get stuck with paying him alimony and child support.

I also made sure that he had a way to support himself. I put in the money for him to start a business and made sure he was working it. That way he was earning enough for the last few months so that he had no claim to alimony.



dragonlady2314 said:


> As far as bank account....yes I have always had the account solely in my name, the house is in my name, car in my name...everything...since he never qualified due to no income.


Depending on where you life, this might or might not protect you. In a community property state, it’s not a protection. Anything you acquired during marriage belongs to both of you. It does not matter whose name is on it. Do you know if your state is a community property state?


dragonlady2314 said:


> As far as SSD...we applied about 7-8yrs ago and got denied and now since he hasn't been working he does not have the work credits....catch-22. That was exactly my argument....WHY all of a sudden can you work (uber)? He was not doing this prior to 3 months ago. Prior to 3 months ago...he was sometimes pitching in at my job (2-3xmonth)...since I have been completely overwhelmed and running everything by myself since we are short staff. It has ONLY been within the last 3 months he started bring in some income. Even then...he works a couple hours a day...4-5 days a week...maybe 10-12:30p..if I am lucky. He would pretty much spend all his time on the computer, video games, bs-ing...honestly I have no idea. But it has ONLY been since he thought I was going to leave him and then when he found out of the EA...he stepped his game up. Makes me feel like crap that the only time he is willing to help me out is when he thinks I am going to leave..uughh.


I figured that you were going to say that he spent most of his time with computer games and online. Have you ever looked to see if he’s been having on-line affairs? My bet is that he’s been doing that all along. It’s a pretty common thing with guys who do what your husband (and my ex) has been doing.

One thing that you need to face is that you enabled all this, just as I did. Now you are going to have to put your foot down so that you can ensure that he can support himself.

If he’s working 2-3 hours a day, he can work full time. If he can sit at a computer all day and play games and play on the internet, he can work a job full time. There are tons of jobs that require only that. Shoot, driving for uber does not require much more than sitting at a computer all day.

At one point I took my husband to a psychiatrist. I made sure that both of us talked at the first appointment because I knew that my husband would paint a pretty picture. After we got done talking, the physiatrist told us that he could understand why my husband was married to me. But he had no clue a to why I was still married to my husband. He also told my husband that his actions are a form of serious emotional abuse. To disregard one’s spouse to the point of dumping all responsibility for a financial support and the family on them is abuse.

The psychiatrist also diagnosed him with AD/HD and OCD which were part of the damage that all those years of computer game playing and living on the internet. This is actually becoming a problem and is now a recognized form of mental illness. 

What you need to do is to tell him that you refuse to support him anymore. That either he starts working full time or he’s got to move out. That way, whether your stay with him or divorce him, it relieves you of the financial burden.

Does he spend money on anything? About how much a month does he spend? And what is he spending it on?

Have you considered making so that your husband has no access to the internet? How about his computer. He does not need a computer, does he? Not really.


dragonlady2314 said:


> Its hard when you have been with someone for so long and your identify is so enmeshed...all I have known as a adult woman is being married...so incredibly scary....somehow less scary then thinking this will be my life permanently.


Yea, its’ scary. But I you are a strong woman… clearly since you have been carrying the load of your family for years basically on your own.

Instead of focusing on the time when you will be divorced, focus on your todo list… build a todo list and work it one day at a time. By the time to you to the very last thing… sign final divorce… you will be ready for it.



dragonlady2314 said:


> Totally agree when it comes to the "ex's" they look like Knights in Shining Armor..to save me...I need to save my damn self...


Yep, you need to save yourself. Your ex is not going to that. So far interacting with him has only made things worse… well except that it got you husband off is ass… a little bit at least.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

dragonlady2314 said:


> Its like an out-of-body experience when I hear myself telling people or my girlfriends (thats super new..since I hardly had any friend..isolated myself...and then I would never open up since I felt like it was a betrayal of my hubs) its sounds so incredibly CRAZY. If I heard someone else say some of this I would tell them to run! But then my response is again the classics.."i made vows, I dont want to be responsible for breaking up my family, he really IS a good guy, blah blah blah". Then to complicate things he has medical issues...so I never know how hard to push. I stopped even talking to him about him working since all it would be is us fighting and making me feel bad. So this weekend since he is "turning over a new left" I figured let me give it a shot....same thing...I dont care about his health, his MD told him not to work (not true...even so...there are variety of options from home) and I felt like a horrible person for even asking him to work outside of the UBER/Lyft....
> 
> It is so incredibly humbling to hear other peoples opinion on it.


If he did not have you to support him, he would have to work. That's the bottom line. He has to work. 

That's what you tell him and then refuse to listen to his nonsense. Maybe write him a letter and state it very clearly. If you want we could help you write a letter that addresses that you are not buying his excuse.

If he's not disabled enough to get SSD, then he can work full time.

If he's not disabled enough to get SSI, then he can work full time. Has he ever tried to get SSI?


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

Are you ready to pay spousal support to your soon-to-be-ex-husband?


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## dragonlady2314 (Feb 26, 2018)

EleGirl said:


> The first step was to make a plan. Make sure that I had copies of all financial and legal papers in a safe place. Made sure I knew the divorce laws. IN your case you probably need to talk to an attorney because you could get stuck with paying him alimony and child support.
> 
> I figured that you were going to say that he spent most of his time with computer games and online. Have you ever looked to see if he’s been having on-line affairs? My bet is that he’s been doing that all along. It’s a pretty common thing with guys who do what your husband (and my ex) has been doing.
> 
> ...


I think the to-do list is a great idea. I will start working on that ASAP. I have already started applying for new jobs so that is the 1st step. 

As far as if he has been having an EA online...Ive actually thought about it...I wouldn't be totally surprised...and tbh...I would be upset but not devasted...maybe would look at it as a total nail in the coffin and then I really could leave. 

As far as his spending habits...yes prior to 3 months ago...it was a HUGE issue with us...he was spending anywhere between $100-150+/mon...on video games, computer stuff, comics, etc. We would fight alllll the time as it was putting such a major stress on me as we are not able to make the monthly bills. Of course since he found out about the EA and me almost being done...it's gotten better but still $50-70ish+....when I literally spend no money on myself since I'm always worried about paying bills. 

You are completely right...I'm definitely taking time to reflect on my major contribution to this issue as I hold the majority of the responsibility for allowing it to get here and not communicating how burnt out I was. I just feel like it's so hard to talk with him and communicate clearly as I am more emotional and he is logical...so he talks circles around me and I end up feeling worse than before and I either get so worked up that I get an anxiety attack OR I get so down and crying non-stop. I honestly cannot afford to spend my energy that way as I have to be present for my kids and get up the next day and go to work...it's unbelievably draining and defeating. 

Most of the time it simply isn't worth the trouble of bringing it up since it puts more on me. It's just so confusing since him and I get along so well (as long as I avoid issues) and we laugh and have a good time yet there is always this elephant in the room and a huge part of our relationship that I feel so abanoned and betrayed about.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

dragonlady2314 said:


> I think the to-do list is a great idea. I will start working on that ASAP. I have already started applying for new jobs so that is the 1st step.
> 
> As far as if he has been having an EA online...Ive actually thought about it...I wouldn't be totally surprised...and tbh...I would be upset but not devasted...maybe would look at it as a total nail in the coffin and then I really could leave.


I would bet money on this. What I did was to put a key logger on my ex's computer. And what I found out was shocking. You know what they say about idle hands and the devil. :surprise:




dragonlady2314 said:


> As far as his spending habits...yes prior to 3 months ago...it was a HUGE issue with us...he was spending anywhere between $100-150+/mon...on video games, computer stuff, comics, etc. We would fight alllll the time as it was putting such a major stress on me as we are not able to make the monthly bills. Of course since he found out about the EA and me almost being done...it's gotten better but still $50-70ish+....when I literally spend no money on myself since I'm always worried about paying bills.


Yea my ex did the same thing and it took me far too long to pay attention to it. I was so busy with a full time job, raising all 3 children (his included) and doing 100% of everything inside and outside our home that I did not have the energy to deal with this at all. Actually, what's when I came here to TAM... to help me find the will to stand up to what was going on. As you can see, I've never left.... >

One of the ways that you can stop contributing to his nonsense is to cut him off financially. Do not allow him any money to spend on things like games, etc. If he wants to play, then let him earn the money to do that.

If you can cut off the internet completely so he had no access to the internet that would be great too. For example if I were to cut off the internet here at my home, I could use my cell phone as an internet hotspot.

Do you pay for a cell phone for him? Of course he might need a cell phone if he's going to work. So maybe cutting this one thing out might not be good.



dragonlady2314 said:


> You are completely right...I'm definitely taking time to reflect on my major contribution to this issue as I hold the majority of the responsibility for allowing it to get here and not communicating how burnt out I was. I just feel like it's so hard to talk with him and communicate clearly as I am more emotional and he is logical...so he talks circles around me and I end up feeling worse than before and I either get so worked up that I get an anxiety attack OR I get so down and crying non-stop. I honestly cannot afford to spend my energy that way as I have to be present for my kids and get up the next day and go to work...it's unbelievably draining and defeating.


Here is a link to a book that I think would help you a lot. Codependency is when you make the needs of another person your priority to your own detriment. This is often seen with spouses of alcoholics, drug addicts and people with mental health problems. 

It's a natural reaction to a bad situation. It's like the Dutch boy who stands there with his finger in the dam trying to plug the hole so that the water does not rush through and destroy the town. You spend all your energy running around trying to contain the damage being done by your spouse, trying to hide it from the world, trying to make it ok for your children. And all the while you are destroying yourself. 

The book helps to give you ways/tools to handle this and stop the co-dependent behavior. It's not your job to hold it all together so that he can live in his little self made insanity (not that he's insane... but what he's created for himself is not very healthy.)

*Codependent No More & Beyond Codependency*



dragonlady2314 said:


> Most of the time it simply isn't worth the trouble of bringing it up since it puts more on me. It's just so confusing since him and I get along so well (as long as I avoid issues) and we laugh and have a good time yet there is always this elephant in the room and a huge part of our relationship that I feel so abanoned and betrayed about.


Of course you to get along well as long as you play the game his way. He makes the rules. And if you break a rule he has figured out how to push your buttons to get you back to living within his rules. (More codependent stuff)

You might want to not talk to him about it now because he will go into his act to get you back in line. Instead just start acting differently. Actions always speak louder than words anyway.

For example do not allow him access to money to buy games, etc. When he complains just say something like "I in over my head with the bills. I have no money to give you. Maybe you could work a few more hours a week." and walk away. If he trying to go into his tirade just refuse to engage. Tell him that you are not talking out it. Walk away. He will be unhappy. But it's ok for him to be unhappy because that just make get his ass in gear, he might just go work more to have his toys.


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## FalCod (Dec 6, 2017)

This is eerily similar to a situation playing out with a friend. Her husband was laid off from his job many years ago. He was a "SAHD" after that, but the reality was that he stayed home and played video games and watched the kids and that was it. His wife earned the income, washed the clothes, made the meals, cleaned the house, paid the bills, etc, etc. 

For years, she encouraged him to find work but he wouldn't do it. She slowly lost respect for him. Then she begged and demanded and nothing changed. Then she did a trial separation and almost nothing changed. He found a job and lost it within one week. She finally filed for divorce. It'll be final soon.

I hated to watch it all play out. I kept thinking that he just needed a wake-up call. I have no idea what he's going to do when he stops getting her income. I'm baffled.

I don't understand people that won't work.


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## dragonlady2314 (Feb 26, 2018)

So I feel like I total assh****....OR am I blowing this out of proportion? When you mentioned that my hubby could be having EA's over the years....I thought "oh no...not my hubby...he would NEVER". Well I chose to prove myself right and went looking around on his computer. 
So keep in mind this is out how things have played out the last cpl months. I have solely been supporting my family of 5 for 10yrs and have been begging my hub to work as we cannot make bills. 
1. In Sept. I was contacted by 1st love on FB...we had an EA for about 3-4months. Hubby found out...LOST it...."I'm a cheater, how could I do this, etc" He has always made it clear he wanted to work this out and was so scared that I was going to leave. Prior to Sept I have never stepped out of my marriage. 
2. I looked yesterday at hubby's computer and found the following: a) In Jan '18 he was msg'ing this woman on Twitter...nothing sexual but offering to buy her things. I saw msg for 2 weeks but they were referring to things prior....last msg on Twitter was Jan. 28th, 2018. So they still may be talking but just not on Twitter....IDK. 
3. Then I saw on FB that he has been searching for this old girlfriend for at LEAST 1yr...and found msg's with her from back in 2009 & 2010...nothing sexual but offering to help her with her mortgage. 
I have not confronted him yet as I know he will some how twist this and either make it seem like no big deal, he did it as a reaction to my EA or some how my fault. I don't know what to do???


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## BeautyBeast (Feb 3, 2015)

this is financial affair since he is not working, he was going to spend YOUR money on other women

because you "don't know what to do", you won't be able to confront him, so better just separate for a while
I am not saying divorce him, but the distance heals and really helps to sort things out

for some reason you are dependent on him emotionally. I would work to repair this part.


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## [email protected] (Mar 1, 2018)

dragonlady2314 said:


> . I don't know what to do???


First thing is to get your mind right.

Your husband is a bum. He's not just a bad husband and father - he is cruel. 

To see your spouse suffer and to choke her off when she tries to express it: that's the bum's way of never having to face responsibility and accountability. 


Get your mind right first. Nail it down. He's a bum and an *******. It will be easier to start taking steps forward once you've got your head clear on that.


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## dragonlady2314 (Feb 26, 2018)

[email protected] said:


> First thing is to get your mind right.
> 
> Your husband is a bum. He's not just a bad husband and father - he is cruel.
> 
> ...


I agree that my eye's are finally starting to open and I am becoming more aware of his manipulation of me and making me feel guilty all the time. I just struggle with knowing how reasonable/unreasonable I am being about him working. All he ever says is how he cant since he is sick...he has basically arthritis of the back. But like I told him...people in wheelchairs work! His response is always "this is what you're (me) suppose to do, you are suppose to support your family if I cannot work". I don't even know what to say to that. I feel like I need to honor my vows of "sickness and in health" but I also want to feel like I have a partner and someone who is willing TO DO ANYTHING to help with money.


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## [email protected] (Mar 1, 2018)

dragonlady2314 said:


> I agree that my eye's are finally starting to open and I am becoming more aware of his manipulation of me and making me feel guilty all the time. I just struggle with knowing how reasonable/unreasonable I am being about him working. All he ever says is how he cant since he is sick...he has basically arthritis of the back. But like I told him...people in wheelchairs work! His response is always "this is what you're (me) suppose to do, you are suppose to support your family if I cannot work". I don't even know what to say to that. I feel like I need to honor my vows of "sickness and in health" but I also want to feel like I have a partner and someone who is willing TO DO ANYTHING to help with money.


You don't engage with manipulative people. They have an answer for everything because that's what they spend their time thinking about.

You give them choices, along with the consequences. Not empty threats, but things you are prepared to fully act upon. For example: work, or I leave. The only answer you give to questioning that matter is "because that is my decision".


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## survivorwife (May 15, 2012)

dragonlady2314 said:


> I agree that my eye's are finally starting to open and I am becoming more aware of his manipulation of me and making me feel guilty all the time. I just struggle with knowing how reasonable/unreasonable I am being about him working. All he ever says is how he cant since he is sick...he has basically arthritis of the back. But like I told him...people in wheelchairs work! His response is always "this is what you're (me) suppose to do, you are suppose to support your family if I cannot work". I don't even know what to say to that. I feel like I need to honor my vows of "sickness and in health" *but I also want to feel like I have a partner and someone who is willing TO DO ANYTHING to help with money*.


You have every right to expect that your spouse be willing to do anything possible to help financial. There are many disabled people who are gainfully employed, even from home. Willingness is the key, and having access to a computer from home makes for a good tool to do that, "if" one is willing to try.

Maybe "tough love" would help? Cut off his "allowance" for any extra funds - if it ain't food, clothing (for the kids) or shelter, then the short answer is "no, can't afford it".

I do feel for you in your situation. Fortunately you have gotten good advise and support here. And you are a strong woman, stronger than you realize.


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## StarFires (Feb 27, 2018)

Now that other people have been supportive and telling you what you need to do, I'm going to tell you the real deal:

There is nothing you can do that will not cause you even more financial hardship than you already have. If you think you are stressed out right now, just imagine what your finances will look like after having to pay him spousal support and child support. And both are what the court will order.

1. Because he is, and has been, the SAHD, he will get full custody of the kids if he asks for full custody, and his attorney will definitely ask for it since he is a SAHD and, therefore, the primary caregiver (doesn't matter if this is true or not). You will get visitation every other weekend at the least. At most, you will get 50/50, which will be less likely since you work full time and can't always be available, but is still possible. Either way, you will have to pay child support. You will also be ordered to provide medical insurance for them, all copays, all school costs, and all extracurricular activities. Some states require child support be paid to age 18 or until graduation from high school, whichever comes first. Some states require child support be paid to age 21 (or until a child emancipates him/herself by getting a job and not going to school or otherwise moves out of the home). And some states require child support be paid through college up to age 26 (or until a child emancipates him/herself by getting a job and not going to school or otherwise moves out of the home). And know that living on campus is not considered moving out of the home.

2. Because you have allowed him to be a SAHD with no income, you will be ordered to pay him alimony. Some states permit that alimony be paid over a period of time, like a few years, or until he remarries, or until he gets sufficient education to maintain himself or something like that, but in your case, you will probably have to pay indefinitely/permanently due to his illness. And his attorney will play up his illness to the max and convince the court that he is disabled and will never be able to work due to the pain. Whether it's true or not, his lawyer's job is to work the diagnosis in his client's favor to take you to the cleaners. This is not just done for women.

3. Because he is, and has been a SAHD, and because he has a diagnosis and claiming he cannot work, and because he will get custody of the kids, and because he will be awarded child support and alimony, he will also be awarded the family home. If you didn't purchase the house and are renting it (or living in an apartment), you will still be ordered to maintain the family home until the divorce is settled. Due to all of the above-mentioned circumstances, the court will require that the he and the kids stay in the family home and you will have to maintain the bills. Once the divorce is settled, his spousal support and child support will be enough to maintain the family home without you.

The above will be the result whether you file for divorce or whether he is the one who files. And don't discount the possibility of him being the one who files. Just like you, there are a multitude of women who have no standards for the men they meet and date and marry. They just want a man, so he will just as easily convince other women and guilt other women into being with him and allowing him to use them. The only difference is he will have the divorce decree of all your support money to look forward to arriving in the mail every month. If you push him too hard to get a job or if you threaten him with ultimatums like people have told you to do, then he might start looking into getting rid of you and discover how easy it will be to take you take you to the cleaners and live off you for the rest of his life, or until he gets married again, which he won't do since remarrying will mean he again has no income. And why should he when he can continue living off your support payments?

So, whether you still love him or not is beside the point. You have to accept that you married a ne'er do well who was never a responsible man. His diagnosis only gave him what he turned into an excuse not to work. He found the perfect woman he could live off of and allowed him to do whatever he wanted to do. Now, you either have to continue your marriage as it is, or you can leave him and pay him half or much more than half of your paycheck in alimony, child support and other costs, which will obviously add to your existing financial woes. And goodness forbid that he should leave you because the outcome of the court order will be the same. So it's probably cheaper to keep him.


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## BeautyBeast (Feb 3, 2015)

the scenario above is the worst case. There may be options. Instead of keeping the husband, she can "lose" her work, stay home for a year or so, so he will have to work. Then no alimony for him.


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## dragonlady2314 (Feb 26, 2018)

StarFires said:


> Now that other people have been supportive and telling you what you need to do, I'm going to tell you the real deal:
> 
> There is nothing you can do that will not cause you even more financial hardship than you already have. If you think you are stressed out right now, just imagine what your finances will look like after having to pay him spousal support and child support. And both are what the court will order.
> 
> So, whether you still love him or not is beside the point. You have to accept that you married a ne'er do well who was never a responsible man. His diagnosis only gave him what he turned into an excuse not to work. He found the perfect woman he could live off of and allowed him to do whatever he wanted to do. Now, you either have to continue your marriage as it is, or you can leave him and pay him half or much more than half of your paycheck in alimony, child support and other costs, which will obviously add to your existing financial woes. And goodness forbid that he should leave you because the outcome of the court order will be the same. So it's probably cheaper to keep him.


OMG so you've totally freaked me out! I do honestly appreciate all the information but OMG this makes me want to jump off a bridge! Smh....TBH the money thing would be AWFUL and quite shocking but when/if I get to the point of divorce...the money I would pay out would be my least concerns as that is the cost of me living a better life. Obliviously my kids would be my primary concern. It is so hard to accept this is where I am in life and my potential path to go down. It makes me feel so empty and hopeless that this is my life for the foreseeable future.


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## dragonlady2314 (Feb 26, 2018)

BeautyBeast said:


> the scenario above is the worst case. There may be options. Instead of keeping the husband, she can "lose" her work, stay home for a year or so, so he will have to work. Then no alimony for him.


It is abundantly clear to me that when/if I get to the point of considering to file I need to contact a lawyer ASAP. Some of the things mentioned I never even thought about. This whole thing is so heartbreaking and defeating. I've been battling for 10yrs and to imagine I could lose my house, time with my kids, more money....I am speechless. 

Am I just suppose to accept this as my life and keep my head down? Completely depressing.


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## StarFires (Feb 27, 2018)

BeautyBeast said:


> the scenario above is the worst case. There may be options. Instead of keeping the husband, she can "lose" her work, stay home for a year or so, so he will have to work. Then no alimony for him.


Yes, it makes so much sense to tell a woman to make herself and her children destitute, homeless, and hungry to give her useless husband a chance to fail them like he always has. I declare, this board sometimes.


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## StarFires (Feb 27, 2018)

dragonlady2314 said:


> OMG so you've totally freaked me out! I do honestly appreciate all the information but OMG this makes me want to jump off a bridge! Smh....TBH the money thing would be AWFUL and quite shocking but when/if I get to the point of divorce...the money I would pay out would be my least concerns as that is the cost of me living a better life. Obliviously my kids would be my primary concern. It is so hard to accept this is where I am in life and my potential path to go down. It makes me feel so empty and hopeless that this is my life for the foreseeable future.


I don't understand the contradiction here. Your complaint is the financial stress and not being able to make ends meet, but paying him alimony would be the least of your worries?

It wasn't my intention to freak you out but to give you divorce facts of how this will turn out. Sorry that it scares you, but it's what you have come to by allowing him to use you all these years. That wasn't to beat you up but just to point out there are no divorce gods to blame.


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## dragonlady2314 (Feb 26, 2018)

[email protected] said:


> You don't engage with manipulative people. They have an answer for everything because that's what they spend their time thinking about.
> 
> You give them choices, along with the consequences. Not empty threats, but things you are prepared to fully act upon. For example: work, or I leave. The only answer you give to questioning that matter is "because that is my decision".


You are completely right! I have to be more direct and simply state things verses "mentioning" them and see how he reacts.


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## dragonlady2314 (Feb 26, 2018)

StarFires said:


> I don't understand the contradiction here. Your complaint is the financial stress and not being able to make ends meet, but paying him alimony would be the least of your worries?
> 
> It wasn't my intention to freak you out but to give you divorce facts of how this will turn out. Sorry that it scares you, but it's what you have come to by allowing him to use you all these years. That wasn't to beat you up but just to point out there are no divorce gods to blame.


I was just stating that I would be willing to suffer (even more) financially to be able to be alone, happy and live at home peacefully then what I am dealing with now. Its too much to bare some days to be stressed at work, worry about paying bills and then come home and either fight or be steaming with resentment.


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## BeautyBeast (Feb 3, 2015)

dragonlady2314 said:


> It is abundantly clear to me that when/if I get to the point of considering to file I need to contact a lawyer ASAP. Some of the things mentioned I never even thought about. This whole thing is so heartbreaking and defeating. I've been battling for 10yrs and to imagine I could lose my house, time with my kids, more money....I am speechless.


no you won't lose your kids
50/50 parenting is the most common scenario these days
yes, he was SHD, but you can argue that he did not raise kids and did not do housework. When my ex lied in the court about his parenting, I asked to name kids' family physician and he could not. Lied about him doing chores, I presented photos of his incredibly messy house after I moved out and clean house (lots of them dated with different years) before.
It can be a long and expensive battle, therefore it's easier just lose your job, get him work.
Or keep him for the rest of your life, whatever is best for you.


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## dragonlady2314 (Feb 26, 2018)

BeautyBeast said:


> no you won't lose your kids
> 50/50 parenting is the most common scenario these days
> yes, he was SHD, but you can argue that he did not raise kids and did not do housework. When my ex lied in the court about his parenting, I asked to name kids' family physician and he could not. Lied about him doing chores, I presented photos of his incredibly messy house after I moved out and clean house (lots of them dated with different years) before.
> It can be a long and expensive battle, therefore it's easier just lose your job, get him work.
> Or keep him for the rest of your life, whatever is best for you.



Ugh....I cannot imagine this being the rest of my life. I totally get it why people go crazy and get so turned off by marriage. The commitment and sacrifices are more than one could ever imagine. I am so worried about my own emotional and mental health and having a quality life. I know I keep saying this but it just more and more hopeless and I cannot even describe how depressing it is. 

I swear sometimes I either want to run away (which I would never leave my babies) or have an open relationship and at least have some joy that I can call my own.


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## sa58 (Feb 26, 2018)

First you got married to young.
You probably have matured/grown
a lot since then. Maybe he has not.
See a lawyer and find out what your
options are. Child custody, spousal
support etc. If you file for divorce
and he understands you will go through
with it unless he changes then maybe he 
will wake up. You can all ways stop divorce
proceedings. You have had an EA he has had
an EA all so. If you both are unhappy then
you understand that your kids are seeing this
and growing up around this. Since he may not want
to change then you need to fix this. Divorce or 
stay and try to fix it. My sons wife cheated
and he divorced her. 50/50 custody of their 
child, Everybody is happier except for his ex.
She is now very lonely and unhappy. I think
she knows what she let go. Sometimes it takes
strong action even thou it might be hard to do.
He maybe a great dad and everything else but
you and your kids might be better off.


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