# I hate my new job.



## kag123 (Feb 6, 2012)

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## tech-novelist (May 15, 2014)

Ugh. I have been there, although I didn't get the big salary.

Anyway, if I were you I would start looking for a new job immediately. When a potential employer asks you why you want to change jobs so quickly, admit you made a mistake.

But first, get Rites of Passage at $100, 000 to $1 Million+: Your Insider's Lifetime Guide to Executive Job-changing and Faster Career Progress in the 21st Century: John Lucht: 9780942785333: Amazon.com: Books. This is absolutely the best explanation of how to look for a high-paying job even if you have a few black marks such as a very short tenure job.


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## EnigmaGirl (Feb 7, 2015)

> I am actively looking for other jobs but I feel it is a bad mark on my resume that I have a job for a month and then I'm looking for another one right away. My previous jobs were all 5+ years in duration. In my head I've convinced myself that no one will take a look at me seriously now because of this.


I've done a lot of hiring and I don't think you need to worry about this at all if its only one job and you can explain it. You're fine to change positions.

There's almost no one that I know in the working world that can't tell you a story about taking a job or position that turned out to be in the wrong place for them and they had to leave. Its really not a big deal for you to move on...its very normal stuff.

What employers are looking for is the overall consistency of your resume. If you quit 1/2 of the jobs on your resume in under a year, that would be different.

I'm sorry you're dealing with this. I once took a promotion early in my career and ended up working for this racist dbag you wouldn't even believe. I ended up quitting 6 months in and for a position that was less money initially but that had good perks and I quickly moved up once I was happier. Funny enough, the dbag got fired shortly after I left. 

Please don't compromise your health, sleep and family life to stay at a position you hate...its so not worth it. With the amount of time you spend at work, you deserve to be content and feel like you're contributing. There's no way you're going to be able to keep this up long-term without some very serious collateral damage that you don't want. Good luck and best wishes!


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## kag123 (Feb 6, 2012)

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## EnigmaGirl (Feb 7, 2015)

I know its tough but sometimes you have to take a step back to take 2 steps forward. I've been where you are so I totally get it.

But you have to consider how long you can keep this up and what the damage is going to be to try. 

There are jobs that sometimes you can just suck it up and deal with but what you're describing doesn't sound like that and you'll feel better if you start looking anyway to give yourself some options. Reach out to previous coworkers too and see if they know of anything available. Don't underestimate your ability to negotiate and don't underestimate your worth either. If these people wanted you, so will someone else. 

You didn't get this position because of a fluke...you got it because you were qualified and worth it and you'll find that again.

Talk to your husband and tell him what's going on and what your plans are. I'm sure he loves you more than he loves the money and start making a plan. Even if you have to stay at this job for another few months, making a plan will help you focus on the future and leaving and give you a much needed distraction.

Mostly take care of yourself...don't let this job make you sick. Its unbelievable how the effects of a bad job can affect your health.

Hang in there and start the process. I know it looks daunting but you can do it.


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## AliceA (Jul 29, 2010)

It's not worth it. I know someone who stuck it out at a job where she was constantly stressed and she ended up having a heart attack.


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## kag123 (Feb 6, 2012)

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## brooklynAnn (Jun 29, 2015)

You are getting stress hives. Try compartmentalizing and leave the job at the job. On the ride home listen to music or get some uplifting audio books/speech. Also, if you don't exercise start doing so. Just to help relief the stress. 

I once read somewhere that women tend to stay in unhappy jobs more than men. So, keep looking for a new position.

Your husband sounds like he is enjoying the raise and that's all he is seeing now. So don't expect any support there for now. If you are waiting for him to tell you to quit, don't hold your breathe. Guys mentally are different from us, they will press on while looking for a new position. 

What I would do at work, is to see how the other executive handles their position. Try to learn how the owner thinks and see things. Try making this a learning experience so when you leave, you have some new tools in your bag. This way in the future you have an understanding.


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## VermisciousKnid (Dec 27, 2011)

Is your old job still open or has it been filled? If you went back then there would be no gap in your résumé. I wouldn't even list your current job in that case. But I think even a one month stint at this company can be explained just by saying "bait and switch". 

I think a one year stint would be harder to overcome on your résumé. In some jobs you don't learn the ropes and the knowledge for a year. It's a big investment of time and resources. So leaving at that point is a big setback for the company because they need to spend another year getting a new person and training them up to the point where they're productive. A one month stint is better in that situation. Less time and resources wasted.


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## Ynot (Aug 26, 2014)

I don't know what your H does but it sounds like he is more concerned about the money than your sanity. I know how that feels very well. You can't put your life, health or happiness at risk for the sake of a pay check. And I certainly wouldn't do it for the sake employment history. 
After my divorce I took a job with my biggest client and I hated it. I worked for six months and it did not get any better. I finally left and started my own business back up and haven't looked back. 
If you are good, your former employer may agree to take you back at higher pay, I would check into that and I would keep looking for another job. In the meantime you need to make it very clear to your H that your current employment and paycheck is very temporary and he shouldn't change his life style based on it. 
But then again I have never been a fan of being a corporate drone, I have been self employed for 20 years and at this point I could not even think about letting someone else be in control of my life.


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## Pluto2 (Aug 17, 2011)

Please start talking to your H about this. I bet he wants to know you are unhappy and I doubt he would think the money is worth your happiness and health. 

Start looking around. So maybe you can't get the same benefits/salary, but could you get a bit more than you had at your old job?


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## GA HEART (Oct 18, 2011)

I will ditto everyone else that jumping ship won't look as bad as you think it will.......provided you have another ship to jump to. Just quitting without another job lined up looks awful. 

I stuck through a soul crushing job for two years one time and was so relieved to finally QUIT. Looking back, I realize that I lacked a bit of self confidence. I would chew that job up and spit it out now. And that was only about 6 years ago.

Work on getting out when you can, but try to gain peace while you are there. It's easier said than done, but leave work at work. My hell job followed me home via phone calls and such, which I did eventually learn how to put a stop to. If that is happening now to you, put your foot down. There is ZERO need for anyone in a professional, non-life threatening, non-"on call" position to be harassed at home. It can wait.


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## richardsharpe (Jul 8, 2014)

Good evening
Its completely reasonable to change jobs if you are unhappy. One thing though - a month isn't really all that long. I'd suggest spending some time really understanding the dynamics at the new job. Understand why people are acting the way that they are and see if you can maneuver things to be in your favor. 

Is the president micromanaging because he is afraid of failure, or because he wants everything to be *his* idea. Sometimes there is nothing that can be done to make things better. Sometimes though once you understand what is motivating people you can figure out how to manipulate the situation to work in your favor.


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## ButtPunch (Sep 17, 2014)

In all my years, I have learned the more money I make the more stress I have to endure.

I question if it's worth it myself.


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## MarriedTex (Sep 24, 2010)

It certainly is no fun to be in a caustic work environment. I feel your pain.

However, our ability to survive / thrive in a work environment can be impacted positively or negatively by our approach to the situation. You appear to have made up your mind to hate the place. This type of outlook becomes a type of self-fulfilling prophecy.

To advice seekers that come to me in your situation, I offer up just one phrase: "It's all about attitude." Your ability to navigate through a less than stellar situation depends on how you view things.

This is a learning experience. Face it, you took a leap up the career ladder because you were able to snag a higher-level role at an organization that probably has a reputation in your industry as a bad place to work.

One attitude that you could embrace is that your boss is a micro-managing bozo who makes your skin crawl. That is fair & accurate, but it doesn't help you get through the day. An alternative attitude is to use new boss as a reverse role-model - an example of what leaders should not do in everyday business management. By using him as a case study of what not to do, you are teaching yourself how you can be a better boss yourself down the line. As you become mindful of this dude's pitfalls, you can vow not to embrace his tactics when you get into an even bigger chair somewhere.

If you're like most offices, the next two weeks should be relatively light given the holidays. You also have five weeks of vacation next year. If you can pay your dues for a year, you may be able to make a much better jump for your next position. If you leave now, chances are that you will retreat to your prior career station.

In the meantime, lay it on the line with husband that you don't like job & don't know how long you can last. Instead of spending your raise, try to sock it away in a nest egg. This will give you some cushion if you ever need / want to say "Take this job & shove it." The more you build options into your financial life, the more freedom you will feel. You will not feel chained to a job.

Also, use your five weeks of vacation intelligently. Wrap them around existing three day weekends to extend five weeks away from the office into six weeks away. That's a week off every two months, if you play your cards right. 

In summary, hang in there for a bit more, but start planning on ways that you can pull the rip cord without sabotaging yourself. Everyone sometimes finds themselves where they have to "pay their dues" in order to advance. How you survive this stage depends not upon the bozos who are around you. It depends on you. Remember, it's "all about attitude."


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## VermisciousKnid (Dec 27, 2011)

I think you have to find something good about a person to be able to work with them in the long term. And obviously they have to see something good in you. That's where mutual respect comes from. It would be hard to work with someone if that didn't exist. 

So is there any good in this organization? Have you asked your manager why you were hired if all of the feedback you have received has been negative?


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## norajane (Feb 7, 2012)

Every time I've taken a leap of faith with a new job, I tell myself, "you can do anything for a year." My parents are immigrants and always had challenging blue collar jobs; I look at what they did for decades in order to support the family and I compare to my measly office job and smack myself back into reality - if my mom can stand on her feet 8-12 hours a day in a freezing warehouse packing lunchmeat for 30 years, I can handle waste-of-time meetings and micro-managing boss who wants me to change stupid red, yellow, green indicators on PowerPoint charts....for a year.

My first month or two, I'm not trying to provide all kinds of input and ideas and suggestions right away. I take my time in just taking it all in, learning the ins and outs of who's who, what the REAL expectations are, what people really need, and what the processes are. I ask a lot of questions, get to know a lot of people from the assistants and other support staff on up, and figure out how things are accomplished.

Only after that do I try to contribute. By that time, I know where the some of the bigger landmines are, and how to gain support for an idea before I start rocking the boat with new ideas. Because I'm not just jumping in from the start and, in their view, telling them what they have been doing isn't good enough or is wrong, and because I've learned how to gain the support I need to change things, my ideas are more likely to be considered and accepted.

It may be that these people need to trust you more, and they don't yet. Any time a new person is hired for a more senior job, that means change and people are generally not fond of change, especially if they think the change you are promoting somehow reflects badly on them.

And I've been in your shoes, hating on a job at first, but once I have the lay of the land, things got better. Don't give up yet. Change is sometimes awkward.

However, if you've given it a reasonable amount of time, then by all means, start looking elsewhere. Life is too short to be miserable all day long for a job.


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

I'm the last person to give job changing advise - same company for 31 years, 3 managers... 

But keep in mind work is called work for a reason, and this great salary and title means more responsibility.

If you approach the job from the start as hating it that's the quickest way to fail. 

Start by writing down what you find vs what you expect. Chances are if things don't look good to you either you're overreacting or something is wrong with how things happen. In this case your higher ups will want to know. 

Can you provide more details about this?


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## chillymorn (Aug 11, 2010)

give the job more time. it might turn out better after awhile. but keep an eye opened for a new job. instead of spending the extra income save the extra or invest it. stick to your old life style and save a big nest egg. every time you feel like you hate your job look at your bank statement and say I can retire early.


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## chillymorn (Aug 11, 2010)

why is your husband spending your extra income he sound like an a$$hat


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## EnigmaGirl (Feb 7, 2015)

> Well. I don't have a heart attack yet but I have had hives for the last two days. Never had them in my life before this.
> 
> I talked to my H a bit last night. He kind of blew off my concerns and said that it's only been a month and I need to give it more time. He was not supportive of me trying to jump ship right now and said I am over reacting. He said there is no way I can possibly know how a company is run and what the future of the job is going to be like in only one month. He wants me to stay put.


Ugh I got those too in my bad job and developed a very, very annoying eye twitch. I also went to the doctor because I thought I had an ear infection and found out that I had a stress problem that was causing me to clench my jaw so hard in my sleep that it was causing extreme soreness in my jaw and ear. 

I'm telling you...do not screw around with this stuff...listen to your body, you need to get out of there.

Look...without trying to be an ass...your husband is dead wrong. You've been working a long time and you know when a job isn't right. I'm very sorry your husband isn't supporting you. I had the same problem with my first husband...he didn't care about me, he cared about $...another reason I divorced him. My second husband is totally different. If he had his way, I'd never work another day in my life. 

You need to trust yourself on a number of issues. One, you will find another job and you need to have the confidence to know that not only will you find a job, you have the skills to negotiate a good deal. And two, you're not whining...this place is wrong for you and your body knows it. 

I can also tell you this. You may have to take a step back but I guarantee that you'll make more money being somewhere you love to be and are committed to than somewhere that you hate being.

Please don't get sick over this...start looking. I'm very sorry your husband isn't supporting you.


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## kag123 (Feb 6, 2012)

VermisciousKnid said:


> I think you have to find something good about a person to be able to work with them in the long term. And obviously they have to see something good in you. That's where mutual respect comes from. It would be hard to work with someone if that didn't exist.
> 
> So is there any good in this organization? Have you asked your manager why you were hired if all of the feedback you have received has been negative?


I have not asked this yet, but I have come close. 

He has a temper and I feel that this direct question may end in me losing my job. I hate the job but don't want to be fired. 

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## kag123 (Feb 6, 2012)

john117 said:


> I'm the last person to give job changing advise - same company for 31 years, 3 managers...
> 
> But keep in mind work is called work for a reason, and this great salary and title means more responsibility.
> 
> ...


I want to remain as anonymous as possible so it's hard to provide details. But at a high level here it is -

I am in a niche field and I am known in my general area as one of the gurus in this field. It's not as prestigious as it sounds. I have great relationships with my specific (public government) clients. At previous company I managed several large contracts and a department supporting those contracts for 5 years. Had a staff of 20. Was extremely underpaid for what I did there but loved my staff and peers and even my immediate boss. Hated the way the company was run by the president, and never saw proper compensation for what I did, and it was one of the reasons I left. Unfortunately sexism is still alive and well, and I am NOT a feminazi at all. I was underpaid and discriminated against several times by the president and could probably have grounds for a law suit if I wanted to pursue it. I never will though. 

New company found me because they won the same contracts I have managed and they are new to the game. Needed someone with experience to open a new department and run this side of the business. It's the same work I've done for 5 years. I received the official offer from new company after the first interview. I then initiated five additional meetings over the course of 2 weeks with the highest ranking staff in the company to discuss my thoughts, plans and goals for the job if I were to come on board. I explained to them what will be needed immediately to be successful at the new contracts (lots of staff, lots of equipment, lots of training, etc.) I wrote them a business plan with goals to achieve this. 2 weeks, 2 months, 6 months and 1 year from my date of hire all of the things that need to happen. I explained the nature of these contracts as they are unlike anything else the company has dealt with before. Fast paced (work f]rom birth to grave occurs in a single week), on-call in nature where we are given new work requests 4-6 per day, and that high level business processes need to be set up immediately to handle this type of operation. This was the bulk of my 20 hours of meetings prior to accepting. Honestly I gave them so much information that they could have taken the product I delivered to them (business plan made on my own time) and retracted my offer, and ran with it for a lot cheaper than hiring me to do it. After the 20 hours of meetings and me asking very hard questions to find out if they would support this type of work or be a hindrance (afraid to spend money, hand holding me, not providing staff needed, etc) I was assured many times over that would not be the case. 

Well guess what. Here I am and it was a total bait an switch.

My relationship with my clients are suffering. We are not meeting deadlines. Not enough staff, not enough equipment or resources. The president refuses to follow the rules laid out in the contracts that he signed regarding invoicing and top level work flow management. The client calls me and asks me why we are fecking up. I am stuck between trying to save face for the company and trying not to throw anyone in upper management under the bus. 

My boss yells at me multiple times per day. He gets in my business and goes behind me to my staff and gives them instructions that are different than what I just told them. My staff don't understand who is in charge and are confused. Plans are made and then broken a thousand times. Part of my department are field staff who work on various changing field assignments. I have an admin that does things like make their hotel arrangements and schedule vehicle maintenance and all of the details that are needed to run the crews. Boss took credit card away from her and made hotel arrangements himself. Why would a senior VP be doing such minutia level work? When I ask for reasons why he is doing this - I am pretty much given the run around and told to eff off. 

The nature of my job is that I am on call Mon-Fri bc I have field crews working day shifts and graveyard shifts. I knew this when I took the job and it is fine, when I am permitted to put the appropriate processes in place to allow the machine to run effectively. Then I only get calls in cases of emergency. Right now I get calls 24-7 because the boss changes everyone's schedules each day and they don't know what they are doing or where to go. He has tied my hands so that even i cannot make decisions to fix things without his permission and he does not give permission ever. Then he gets angry that I call him or need to contact him so much to find out what he wants to do. He's designed it that way. Expressly told me I cannot do anything without his permission. 

I do know that other people have much worse jobs. It's not a sweat shop and I do feel awful for complaining. I feel responsible for my own situation and part of the reason I don't want to talk about it too much outside of this forum is that I am deeply ashamed to be complaining. I am fortunate to have a job and be paid decently for it. I feel like some of this is my doing. 

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## EnigmaGirl (Feb 7, 2015)

> My relationship with my clients are suffering. We are not meeting deadlines. Not enough staff, not enough equipment or resources. The president refuses to follow the rules laid out in the contracts that he signed regarding invoicing and top level work flow management. The client calls me and asks me why we are fecking up. I am stuck between trying to save face for the company and trying not to throw anyone in upper management under the bus.


So the company is also ruining your professional reputation in a niche industry.

Yea, time to go.


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

I only read your last post. But with just that info, I think you should give notice.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## kag123 (Feb 6, 2012)

chillymorn said:


> why is your husband spending your extra income he sound like an a$$hat


To be fair he's not spending like that. It was just the first weekend of the new job, we were celebrating what we thought was a giant victory and turning point for us. 

The celebration was premature. Obviously.

We haven't spent any large amounts of money since then and we are still living the same lifestyle as before. 

Money has always been the most contentious issue in my marriage. I am the spender and my husband is the saver. I grew up in an upper middle class family where money was never a huge issue and we could buy ourselves nice things when we wanted. Nothing outrageous but I never had to worry about having the little extras here and there. I started working early and used my money to fund my own things as a teen. My H grew up in a very poor family where there was constant threat of losing the house, having electric turned off, etc. He is the oldest and from the moment he was legally able he worked and gave all of that money to his parents to help the family income. He tells me stories of working full time at McDonalds in high school - graveyard shifts - and then going to school on 2 hours of sleep each day. And he still got straight A's and scholarships to college and has a great advanced degree. You can see how this colored his idea of money. He saves and never feels secure. 

Unfortunately we did go through a year in early marriage where I lost my job (laid off when pregnant so found it very hard to get another job ) and that was an awful time. He has a bit of PTSD from his upbringing and that stressful experience which makes him very upset with me when I spend money. I am the type of person who can nickle-and-dime you to death. Coffees, a new piece of clothing here and there, a trinket for the kids, going out for drinks. Its never anything big but it adds up. That stuff kills him. It's been a constant source of friction between us. 

Neither of us make enough money to be a sole provider. And I have never desired to stay at home, neither has he. But there's a mental threshold of extra income he's always wanted for us (cushion between bills vs. expendable income) and this new job of mine was the first time I think he saw us getting to that goal. So he got excited and it's like years of stress has finally melted away a bit. I am happy to see him happy. 

Another reason I am ashamed of my feelings for the new job. It obviously improved his quality of life (not materially but mentally) and I don't want to take that away from him. 

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## kag123 (Feb 6, 2012)

Someone asked me about going back to the old job. 

That's not an option. 

The new company I work for is a direct competitor to the old place. When the old place found out where I was going, bridges were burned and it was pretty much scorched earth. I didn't want it to be that way and it upset me greatly, but I understood that I was seen as a traitor. It's really unfortunate. I lost my relationships with most of my previous coworkers and I have not reached out because I don't want to stir up drama at all. It actually breaks my heart. 

I don't even want my old place to know how I feel right now. It would be a lot of told-you-so and nastiness that I can't stomach right now. There were reasons it was the right time for me to leave there and I can't go back. 

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## EnigmaGirl (Feb 7, 2015)

> Neither of us make enough money to be a sole provider. And I have never desired to stay at home, neither has he. But there's a mental threshold of extra income he's always wanted for us (cushion between bills vs. expendable income) and this new job of mine was the first time I think he saw us getting to that goal. So he got excited and it's like years of stress has finally melted away a bit. I am happy to see him happy.
> 
> Another reason I am ashamed of my feelings for the new job. It obviously improved his quality of life (not materially but mentally) and I don't want to take that away from him.


Weird but that whole post sounded really close to my first marriage. My husband had a very similar upbringing and money mentality as yours does. And I had a very similar self-sacrificing attitude.

Question: How reciprocal is your husband on sacrificing himself for you and putting your needs before his own? 

You sound like an incredibly responsible and thoughtful wife. The problem is...how long do you think you can keep this up and what damage will be done to you and your family's emotional and physical health while you try? Why doesn't your husband trust you when you explain to him how unhappy you are?

There is always more than one way to skin a cat. I know when you're in the middle of these situations, it seems like there's limited options but its never true. At least, start looking...there's no harm in that.

Just to tell you also...another thing I did at one point during my divorce was to do additional contract work. I had my regular job but because I had a lot of people who wanted my services, I also contracted some additional projects. I ended up making more money than I expected and it led into me realizing that I really capable of starting my own business. 

This situation might require you to think outside of the box a little. Is there a way you can market what you do differently to earn additional income or to gain more independence once you change jobs?


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

Kag, you are a really nice person. I am concerned that both your company and your husband are taking advantage of your good nature. 

I am sure you could find some other job somewhere.

And I think you need to think about what is best for you rather than what will make your husband happy. Your happiness is a priority. 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## kag123 (Feb 6, 2012)

EnigmaGirl said:


> Weird but that whole post sounded really close to my first marriage. My husband had a very similar upbringing and money mentality as yours does. And I had a very similar self-sacrificing attitude.
> 
> Question: How reciprocal is your husband on sacrificing himself for you and putting your needs before his own?
> 
> ...


To try to give my H a bit of credit - he really does sacrifice a lot for me and my happiness. Too much probably. We are both "givers" and we are both adverse to standing up to each other to demand things. It's a strange dynamic, but it is a loving one. But we are both guilty of doing things that we think the other person wants and sacrificing our own happiness in the process. 

A funny example - we were married for 3 years when one day we were having dinner. We ordered an appetizer that I don't particularly like. I had ordered it for years because we had it on one of our first dates and I thought he liked it. From that day forward whenever apps were ordered we would pick that item. I don't remember why it came up but as we were eating that app that day I spilled to him that I really wasn't that fond of it. He stopped and said "What? I've never liked this either. I always ordered it because I thought you loved it!" Well, that was the same reason I did it. Because I thought it was his favorite. 3 years of marriage and 4 years of dating...7 total years of eating that appetizer that neither of us really liked because we both thought we were making the other person happy. 

That is my marriage in a nutshell. 



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## kag123 (Feb 6, 2012)

Also - given my H's history - he is the type who would do any job needed to make money. He has a degree and does an office job, but if he ever lost his job and needed to get money he'd do anything. Doesn't consider anything beneath him. He sees the money and bills being paid as more important than any other quality of the job. He could be scrubbing toilets, as long as the paycheck keeps coming, he feels it's worth it. 

I've never had to face what it would be like to seriously be so grateful for a paycheck that I'd overlook the types of things I'm complaining about here. So I believe he sees me as a bit spoiled to complain about a job after only one month and especially when "it could be worse".

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## EnigmaGirl (Feb 7, 2015)

> I've never had to face what it would be like to seriously be so grateful for a paycheck that I'd overlook the types of things I'm complaining about here. So I believe he sees me as a bit spoiled to complain about a job after only one month and especially when "it could be worse".


Understood. I get what your husband's saying...kind of. However, he has to realize that long-term you need to seek other employment because you're different from him and you can't keep this up without severe risk to your health.

My advice...just start looking to see if you can find something that meets both your husband's needs and yours. And maybe, you can offer something up to him also...like a budget that keeps you more on track with miscellaneous spending until you can work your way up to a higher salary.

Personally, I think once you start looking you'll end up realizing that there's more out there than you know.


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## norajane (Feb 7, 2012)

kag123 said:


> Someone asked me about going back to the old job.
> 
> That's not an option.
> 
> ...


Then the next step is to go work for a client.


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## tech-novelist (May 15, 2014)

kag123 said:


> I explained to them what will be needed immediately to be successful at the new contracts (lots of staff, lots of equipment, lots of training, etc.) I wrote them a business plan with goals to achieve this. 2 weeks, 2 months, 6 months and 1 year from my date of hire all of the things that need to happen. I explained the nature of these contracts as they are unlike anything else the company has dealt with before. Fast paced (work f]rom birth to grave occurs in a single week), on-call in nature where we are given new work requests 4-6 per day, and that high level business processes need to be set up immediately to handle this type of operation. This was the bulk of my 20 hours of meetings prior to accepting. *Honestly I gave them so much information that they could have taken the product I delivered to them (business plan made on my own time) and retracted my offer, and ran with it for a lot cheaper than hiring me to do it.*


Has it occurred to you that this is may be (in effect) exactly what they are doing, by making you so miserable you will quit?


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## tech-novelist (May 15, 2014)

kag123 said:


> 3 years of marriage and 4 years of dating...7 total years of eating that appetizer that neither of us really liked because we both thought we were making the other person happy.
> 
> That is my marriage in a nutshell.


It sounds like you need better communication... and maybe not just about appetizers.


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## kag123 (Feb 6, 2012)

technovelist said:


> It sounds like you need better communication... and maybe not just about appetizers.


I know right. 

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## kag123 (Feb 6, 2012)

technovelist said:


> Has it occurred to you that this is may be (in effect) exactly what they are doing, by making you so miserable you will quit?


Ha. Actually that would make me feel better, but I'm pretty sure the guy is just a douche.

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## tech-novelist (May 15, 2014)

kag123 said:


> Ha. Actually that would make me feel better, but I'm pretty sure the guy is just a douche.


Either way it's not a good situation to be in.


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## synthetic (Jan 5, 2012)

Honestly, you need to start looking at your job as "a job". I've known too many career-driven people in my life whose lives revolve around their work and I absolutely feel sorry for every single one of them.

Don't get me wrong, I know exactly what it means to be career driven. I am by nature just like you, but I learned my lessons early on. 

The day you realize a job "is just a job", you'll hear a switch click in your brain and you will never go back to being the way you are right now. Life suddenly becomes much more satisfying and easier. You'll even notice details about your loved ones and yourself that you had missed all along!

Management positions in mid-to-large corporations are among the worst positions to care about. It's alright to hold them and get the paychecks, but it's never a good idea to invest more than 3-4 hours of your day on them. You will regret it, just like most other people. Just put up a good show and make the numbers look okay. Trying to excel can be very costly and often reward-less in management. Channel your ambitions and energy into some other worthy cause. Keep your job "A JOB" and you will never be able to hate or love it. A job is not lovable or despicable because, well, it's just a job!

I wish you luck.


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## Satya (Jun 22, 2012)

There is a lot I agree with in this thread. I'm similar in feeling to synthetic. I once put too much importance on my responsibilities. My employer doesn't give a rats what I sacrifice. You are providing your time and expertise for a bag of money and benefits. That is all. If you love what you do, that's a bonus. You are only as valuable as you lead people to believe. That's the sad reality. 

If you're truly miserable, of course do not stay. Your health is more important. If you can learn to stop taking responsibility for your boss' crap, that will remove a millstone from your neck. 

Your boss is the one throat to choke here, not you. Document everything he does to overrule you. Document your disagreement but also your compliance with his wishes. You didn't agree, but you did what he asked. 

You should feel that you can go to HR, with proof in hand, and not fear for your job security. I'd consider doing this. If your employer has won many of your old clients, likely you will not be able to associate with them directly as a consultant were you to leave or be fired. That's a lot of networking and effort to go down the drain. 

Yelling at you is NOT OK. Shaming you in front of colleagues is NOT OK. I got called the c-word loudly in an open office once, for doing nothing but what I was asked to do. Unfortunately the place was small and had no HR to speak of.

You have to look out for you. No one else can!


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## Spotthedeaddog (Sep 27, 2015)

kag123 said:


> I want to remain as anonymous as possible so it's hard to provide details. But at a high level here it is -
> 
> I am in a niche field and I am known in my general area as one of the gurus in this field. It's not as prestigious as it sounds. I have great relationships with my specific (public government) clients. At previous company I managed several large contracts and a department supporting those contracts for 5 years. Had a staff of 20. Was extremely underpaid for what I did there but loved my staff and peers and even my immediate boss. Hated the way the company was run by the president, and never saw proper compensation for what I did, and it was one of the reasons I left. Unfortunately sexism is still alive and well, and I am NOT a feminazi at all. I was underpaid and discriminated against several times by the president and could probably have grounds for a law suit if I wanted to pursue it. I never will though.
> 
> ...


Move on, even back to the previous one (with payrise) if they haven't filled the position.

You aren't going to produce the results your employer wants with that kind of support and environment, and no reason for you for go head-to-head with the boss, just to make everyone's life difficult.
As an ex-employer better to know now - you told them what would be required, and if they can't provide that you can't help them.

Old adage, pay good consultants and listen to what they say.

And yes, many guys will hire consultants/expert employees to make up their shortfalls (good thing) then can't handle things because their business isn't being run the way they like/expect (which is why they hired an expert), but unless they can manage through the difference in opinion the boss will always, knee jerk undermine you to run it his way (bad thing). If you haven't got anything to learn from this guy , move on.

Worst case is they can't meet the requirements and you get scapegoated. hubby won't be able to enjoy that income. Also you are more likely to excel and be happy marriage person, in a job you enjoy; does he want a grumpy stressed out (no sex I'm not in the mood) wife ?


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## kag123 (Feb 6, 2012)

Can I add one more layer that's got me upset since you guys are so kind to listen?

I took one of my best employees with me from the old company over to the new place. I negotiated for both of us as a package deal. She hates the new place as much as I do (although she does not actually know how I feel about it. I coach her through her own complaints but she's echoing everything I'm saying here without knowing it). 

I feel partially responsible because I convinced her to join me here on a promise of something better than what we had before at the old company. Now she's stuck in a bad situation along with me. 

Two days ago she told me she is pregnant. I am happy for her, but now feel double responsibility for getting her into this mess because being pregnant she has now lost her mobility to easily move to another place and get out of here quickly. I hate that she has to be in a stressful situation while she is expecting. 

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## Satya (Jun 22, 2012)

kag123 said:


> Can I add one more layer that's got me upset since you guys are so kind to listen?
> 
> I took one of my best employees with me from the old company over to the new place. I negotiated for both of us as a package deal. She hates the new place as much as I do (although she does not actually know how I feel about it. I coach her through her own complaints but she's echoing everything I'm saying here without knowing it).
> 
> ...


I can understand why you feel bad, but she agreed to go with you. You didn't force her. She owns that decision, not you. 

Again, you're taking too much upon yourself in the responsibility department. You are responsible for you. Only you. And any dependent children that needs raising. Everyone else is a grown arse adult and capable of footing their own problems. 

Sorry if that sounds cold, but you do yourself and them a disservice by assuming responsibility for things not your own. People need to assume their own responsibility. You are not being paid to be a white Knight. 

Now being a kind hearted, thoughtful person, AWARE of hardships of others, that's wonderful. Don't let that awareness turn into added responsibility on YOU. See the difference?


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## Hicks (Jan 14, 2011)

You need to confide in your husband.
I do agree with him that one month is not enough time to really judge anything.
But between you and your husband you need to strategize about what you can do to make things better and how long to give it and be in agreement.
You guys have to get to a point where you jointly agree that the purpose of work is to benefit the family, and in this case a stressed out miserable wife and mother is could outweigh the money. Your husband is resopnsible for protecting your emotional well being and you need to reveal things in order for him to do that.

I also note that you seem to suppose how your husband will react or how your boss will react... Maybe testing some of these assumptions would be good for you.


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## heartsbeating (May 2, 2011)

First, major kudos to you for lining up meetings/interviews before accepting the role, attempting to determine if this would be a good fit, and expressing what you needed and expected in order to be successful which they encouraged and reassured. Once you were in, it was a different story. Knowing that you'd had good dealings with the contract won, is there a chance getting you on board was a sweeter? Regardless, there wasn't anything more you could have done. 

I once took a role that I was excited about, to get home after the first day and hesitantly say the words to my husband, 'I think I've made a mistake...' His advice was to call it out sooner rather than later which at the time, I wasn't prepared to do. Instead I opted to stick it out, considered my attitude and all that jazz. The beauty of that experience though, was what I learned. I'm not who I was then. I had the hard conversation when I resigned. The CEO wanted to know why I was leaving. After I'd left, he implemented major changes that was largely based on my feedback. He offered to help me find another role through his network and when something opened up there again, he invited me back. I didn't return but I learned a lot from that experience. If you know the saying, I now 'Eat the frog' ...and have those hard conversations as they occur. I have greater trust in myself. And I'm learning without assumption, to have greater trust in others too. It can only occur when there is communication. 

Now may be the time to have those hard conversations with your boss, with your colleague, with your husband. I agree that testing some of these assumptions would be good for you. Have the conversation with your boss about the discussed agreed expectations, giving and receiving fast feedback, including that his shouting is unacceptable. The responses will help you to determine the wisest decision for you. 

With your colleague, yes she made her own decision. You are not responsible for that. However there is opportunity for you to share in your experiences with her. She may feel supported and have greater clarity to know that you are experiencing much of what she is. You can actually be a support to one another. Keep communicating to your husband what you are going through and what your strategy will be, which he may be able to help with. Ask for his help! 

I think with this situation, it's better to go one extreme or the other. What I mean is, if you're going to leave, call it sooner rather than later. If you decide to 'stick it out' then accept it for what it is, have those conversations, and prepare yourself to stay for a couple of years. I hope this helps!


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## Spotthedeaddog (Sep 27, 2015)

kag123 said:


> spilled to him that I really wasn't that fond of it. He stopped and said "What? I've never liked this either. I always ordered it because I thought you loved it!" Well, that was the same reason I did it.


Welcome to THE reason I speak up.

My opinions may be unpopular, and outspoken, and there are even unsubstantiated rumors that I might even have been wrong once....but if we don't speak out, communicate, then how can we learn things and overcoming the obstacles we keep hitting.
If it is in the open, it can be discussed and improved - to not put things in the open is a power play, and brings down everyone concerned. Yes, it takes a lot of work to get to respond appropriately, and sometimes I deliberate speak hard because I find people liked to just ignore things if they could (or twist them).

My pet peeves are "agree to disagree" (..how can you ever find common ground or a difference in perspective if the communication is shutdown for convenience sakes)
and "it's important to be happy" (...well yes, but at whose cost?)

It's like whenever I hear that old cliche about men not understanding women/their wives ... well have you ever actually tried _talking_ to her? (really...now how about "with" her...)


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## Thundarr (Jul 4, 2012)

kag123 said:


> I've been at the new job for one month.
> 
> I am desperately unhappy there. I do not like the corporate culture there at all and I am frustrated the majority of the time I am at the office.


I read your whole post kag but this snippit in the middle really stands out. One month is not a lot of time and a lot of what you labelled as frustrating is related to your lack of enfluence in your new position. Personally I think it takes more than a month to build a sphere of enfluence so I suggest to not bail after just one month. Be true to yourself but also be patient before bailing.

You might be the perfect person to bring about positive change in your position. People resist change though so many jobs are more than making decisions. They are also about selling decisions.


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## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

You want some help trying to make this work - where you are?

Not saying it's possible. Might be worth giving it a shot. 

The first step would be getting the client to demand periodic (monthly?) face to day status meetings. And more frequent (weekly?) status meetings. 

You give them an escalation process - watch what happens. Your boss wants to control everything. Fine. But then they are going to be talking directly to him a LOT more than he wants. 

First status meeting they focus in on that. On roles and responsibilities. And limits of authority. He wants to micro manage, he will find out very fast how quickly they go over him to the President when it's obvious he isn't on top of things. 

Also lets THEM directly grill the execs about staffing and equipment: current status and forecast 

Truth is, they may have to threaten to cancel the contracts for 'cause' if they get stonewalled. 

Did your employer underbid the work? Is that why they are under resourcing it? Or are they simply being greedy and trying to increase their margins at the clients expense? 

P.S. If they underbid the contracts, this is a no win situation. Get out. If however, the pricing was proper, and this is a simple case of greed or stupidity, might be fixable. 




kag123 said:


> Can I add one more layer that's got me upset since you guys are so kind to listen?
> 
> I took one of my best employees with me from the old company over to the new place. I negotiated for both of us as a package deal. She hates the new place as much as I do (although she does not actually know how I feel about it. I coach her through her own complaints but she's echoing everything I'm saying here without knowing it).
> 
> ...


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

My wife's current client is the same type of boss. From the endless conference calls I've listened over speakerphone (she works from home 80%) he's a bozo.

Bozos will be bozos. Learn to tune the guy out and not take it personally. It took my wife nearly a year to do so. And - I am not kidding - use some female charm here and there. My wife decided to switch outfits from suits to more fashionable outfits and it seems to have helped a bit  

More 1 on 1 meetings and such help - also written communications and status updates where you tell him what you do and not let him micromanage.


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## kag123 (Feb 6, 2012)

I spent the entire weekend applying to new jobs and sending out feelers for anything out there in space that might get out of this current job. Not feeling good about it...not a lot out there that I feel I have a good shot at and not a lot going on with my various contacts right now. I am really feeling hopeless about this situation. 

I don't know if the current place is salvageable. Right now I am shutting down and staying quiet. I have a strong personality and I'm never soft spoken or afraid to tackle things head on. That is NOT a good quality in the eyes of my current boss. I've been disciplined (verbally) twice so far about being too forward and too pushy. So I am sitting quietly and not speaking unless spoken to. I can't deal with the constant friction. It's Christmas and this is supposed to be a happy time of year. 

I will never understand the male ego. 

Meanwhile he's about to implode from all of the self imposed work he's refusing to let anyone help with. 

He's taken a project away from me completely and assigned it to someone else to manage. Because late on Friday he asked me for some assistance on trouble shooting a method to conduct the work. I gave him my opinion (mistake) that we needed 2 weeks of field testing before we could deploy a new technology. Wrong answer. He sent the team out anyway with the equipment and they are on the road now calling because nothing is working. He's got some other manager in the officer acting as tech support. I guess that guy doesn't question things so he's more suitable for the job. 

I've tried serious conversation with this guy twice to come to a consensus on a better way for us to communicate. I've come up empty handed. 

I'm so done. 

I'm so sick over the fact that it's not going to be easy for me to get out. 

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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

Do you feel your strong personality and not being quiet is an issue at your current job?

My wife is like that and she rarely makes friends with anyone. Everything is wrong, people are stoopid, etc. I share the sentiment - she's overqualified for what she does - but work is 50% political and 50% technical. 

You may be in a situation where the next position is like this because in your industry that's how it is. Maybe the industry sector is like that.

Make sure that your side is 100% clean behavior wise. People misinterpret cues all the time. Commit to play nice for a month or two and see if he responds.

I'm low key and have lasted 31 years as a non engineer among a sea of engineers. Why? Because I play politics as well as I do my real job (design & analysis).


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## kag123 (Feb 6, 2012)

To be honest I am so deep into this mess that I've lost my ability to be objective. I tend to assume a lot of things that go wrong are my fault and it's adding to my stress level, I feel powerless to change things (because my boss has taken that authority from me) and we are making mistakes left and right. It's utter chaos and I've got no way to stop the bleeding. I am not used to this type of environment and I can't see my way out of it. 

Personally - I think I am firm but fair. 

I absolutely in no way misrepresented myself during the interview process. If anything, I laid on my personality even more so than usual. I wanted them to know as much about me up front as I wanted to know about them, to make sure that we both knew what we were getting into. My boss was in two of the meetings I had prior to accepting the position and in neither of them did he seem put off by my personality. 

I'm not a finger pointer and I'm not a "told you so" type of person. If you ask for my opinion you are going to get an honest, educated opinion even if it is not the answer you want to hear. If I am NOT educated on the subject I will immediately tell you that I do not have the knowledge base to give the feedback you are looking for. 

My opinions on how and what decisions should be made are based on my direct experience and research. I cannot say I always make the right decision, because I dont, but I believe in measured analysis and that if someone else's research tells me that there might be a problem in our road ahead, I am going to investigate it before blindly moving forward. I believe that ALL of the problems I've seen in this job so far with the mistakes that are being made are due to lack of research and testing of ideas prior to work being conducted. 

My boss is extremely averse to any input of mine no matter how I try to phrase it. I am always polite and well mannered even when I am upset. 

I don't really understand his way of thinking. I've tried to understand and get him to explain what his ideal method of communication and decision making would be. He refuses to answer that question and was angry that I even attempted to have that conversation with him. 

I'm not sure who all of these mistakes are going to fall on when there comes a time when someone has to answer for them - but I am guessing it will be me. I can document everything to the Nth degree to try to protect myself but I don't even want to work in a place where I have to be my own lawyer, judge and jury all of the time against my boss. That's a no win situation. 

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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

If this is the case how did he hire you? And how you didn't catch on the dynamics of the place?


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## kag123 (Feb 6, 2012)

john117 said:


> If this is the case how did he hire you? And how you didn't catch on the dynamics of the place?


That is what I can't figure out. 

I thought I did my due diligence in finding out a lot about the company before working here and it turns out pretty much everything that was said in the meetings was not true.

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## ILoveSparkles (Oct 28, 2013)

kag123 said:


> To be honest I am so deep into this mess that I've lost my ability to be objective. I tend to assume a lot of things that go wrong are my fault and it's adding to my stress level, I feel powerless to change things (because my boss has taken that authority from me) and we are making mistakes left and right. It's utter chaos and I've got no way to stop the bleeding. I am not used to this type of environment and I can't see my way out of it.
> 
> Personally - I think I am firm but fair.


Do you think this might be part of the problem? Perhaps your boss sees you as not being able to be objective, place blame on yourself and you don't appear to feel like you cannot make changes? Those are all negative feelings and whether you realize it or not, you could be portraying that so your boss doesn't have complete confidence in you?

I'm not saying you are a bad employee, but just another angle to think about.


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

Again I'm projecting from my wife's experience and behavior so I'm not implying its applicable to you. The lovely Dr. J2 seems to think that (a) everyone and anyone should cherish the cubicle she sits at (b) trusts nobody (c) because of her substantial education and experience everyone should just let her run the place.

There's some truth to that - after all, she's overqualified and over experienced but at some point the PhD and experience get to her head and she constantly argues. Over trivial things. Plus, her exceptional work record is largely due to the fact that she works 60 - 70 hour weeks and quadruple checks everything. 

The thing is how she projects to other people. She is not enthusiastic about her work, acting like she's doing everyone a favor. All in all, she's a pain to work with. Like, if it weren't for her specific skills and dedication she would be gone in a hurry.

I'm not saying keg is any of those. I'm asking if her colleagues think she is. Because the dynamic wasn't obvious during the interview I have to assume somehow the two sides misread each other and what we are seeing now is simply the result.

Again, I'm using my projecting as an example...


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## kag123 (Feb 6, 2012)

I'm sure some of this is my fault. There's always two sides in every problem. So I'm not saying I am innocent and the boss is just a big meanie out to get me. 

I don't know. 

I was hired and told a very specific set of items that would be under my direct supervision. I came in and started doing the job and giving my boss items to react to. Every single thing I've put in front of him he's said stop doing that. Stop doing what? My job? Stop speaking to the client. Stop writing proposals. Stop giving your staff assignments. Stop working with vendors on equipment. Etc.

He doesn't just do this with me. He does it with my staff. The example of his taking away the hotel responsibility and credit card from my admin was part of that. He goes to all of us individually and tells us to stop doing our jobs. 

I am just baffled. 

When I try to ask for what I CAN do, I am told to get out of his office because he's too busy. I even phrase it kindly like "I can see your busy, what can I do to help you?"

I forced a meeting on his calendar for just the two of us last week. It took three days to get him to open 30 mins of time for me. Finally he did. We sat down and I asked him to explain his vision for the department to me, including my role and my staff roles and then asked him to go over his comfort level with various tasks - from minutia up to high level management (i.e., what he feels comfortable giving autonomy over vs what he needs to be directly involved in). I even stated that my goal is synergy between us and I want to respect his authority here and run things WITH his input. He refused to answer most of the questions and shooed me out of his office including making me feel stupid for calling the meeting in the first place. All I got out of him was essentially I am allowed to make copies and forward emails without his input. Everything else must wait for him to give his blessing or for him to do it himself. 

As a result we are all coming to a grinding halt. The nature of my department is to run things on a dime and things change rapidly. Without the ability to address things as rapidly as they occur we have no choice but to stop work and wait for his instruction. Which he doesn't have time for. (Duh, that's why my job is supposed to exist...)

On top of this he's very religious. I met his wife and his children at our company holiday party. Talking to some other colleagues apparently he and his family are a version of the Duggars. (Very religious, conservative, traditional, homeschooling, dad is the patriarch and everyone bows to him) There is absolutely NOTHING wrong with any of that except that I Wonder If I am offensive to him in some way. That culture is very foreign to me. And I can't help but wonder if those values are spilling over into the work place. (The idea of the women do what I say and don't ask questions. Seen but not heard.) I could be way off base. I just think maybe it explains a lot? I don't know. Pulling at straws here. 

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## heartsbeating (May 2, 2011)

With this further information, I see my post doesn't apply. You're already calling the meetings with him, attempting to give and receive fast feedback. If he has an issue with your style, that's his opportunity to raise it with you. Micro-managers won't see that's what they are. How many people have been in this role prior to you? Or is it newly created? 

It's great that you are considering how your personality is within all of this. And that you seemingly challenged with this during the interview process to discover whether it's an agreeable fit. My husband does this. He's a disruptive thinker... and purposely calls this out in interviews so there's no surprises when he's in the role. Your boss was in two of your meetings. Was there someone else there advocating for you instead of the boss? Based on what you have written, you're working with someone who isn't workable with, as experienced from various roles within the organization. We can already establish that he isn't a leader. A leader trusts and supports their team. Perhaps someone else can chime in with advice as to how to work with a micro-manager. I know from past experience that I can't. I've done the regular meetings, the visible work-flow, as a way to work with/around them. With every decision questioned, it did begin to affect my confidence - and I'm a reasonably confident and assertive person. Personally I work best when having autonomy and support as/when needed. 

What you are describing doesn't sound sustainable for your personality or work-style. As much as possible, make your exit work to your advantage; timing and otherwise. If it remains a short stint there, either don't put it on the resume or chalk it up as a consulting gig.


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## heartsbeating (May 2, 2011)

kag123 said:


> I came in and started doing the job and giving my boss items to react to.


He requested this from you?


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## heartsbeating (May 2, 2011)

kag123 said:


> That is what I can't figure out.
> 
> I thought I did my due diligence in finding out a lot about the company before working here and it turns out pretty much everything that was said in the meetings was not true.
> 
> Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk


It happens. And it happens with the other side of the coin too.

Have confidence that you did all that you could given the information and responses at the time. Does the boss want you there or was it for intel? Another way to gain insight for future employment, may be through speaking with others who have dealt with the organization or checking sites such as Glassdoor.


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## norajane (Feb 7, 2012)

heartsbeating said:


> Perhaps someone else can chime in with advice as to how to work with a micro-manager. I know from past experience that I can't. I've done the regular meetings, the visible work-flow, as a way to work with/around them. With every decision questioned, it did begin to affect my confidence - and I'm a reasonably confident and assertive person. Personally I work best when having autonomy and support as/when needed.


Micro-managers are painful to work for. Your entire life ends up consumed by their neurosis. I've had some success with getting other stakeholders to help change the micro-managers process - in this case, that would be the clients. Unhappy clients can influence change. I'm surprised they haven't already gone to the boss to complain that they aren't getting the services they contracted for.


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## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

Feels threatened by you. Kind of sad. 

Were the contracts underbid? 




kag123 said:


> I'm sure some of this is my fault. There's always two sides in every problem. So I'm not saying I am innocent and the boss is just a big meanie out to get me.
> 
> I don't know.
> 
> ...


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

Captain Obvious here with the obvious segway...

1. Did your position exist and the last person doing it fled to teach calculus to the local pet shelter?

2. If the position did not exist before you, how did the place survive?

3. Anyone in other departments know about him? Is this a new behavior pattern??


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## kag123 (Feb 6, 2012)

Answering questions...

I do not think it was under bid. Prices look comparable to my previous company.

My position did not exist before. My entire department did not exist. I was hired to start the department. They won the contracts (how I do not know, have zero experience) and once they were officially notified of the award of the contracts panic ensued because they realized they had no idea what to do. So they came after me because I am known in this field and they coaxed me over to their company. I used that situation to my own benefit to negotiate a high salary and benefits. It was also one of the reasons I went through so many meetings before accepting. I knew it was going to be a challenge to walk into a place that has no idea about this type of work and build something from the ground up. Impossible without the proper support and autonomy. 

Now I'm here and turns out they are not doing what they said they would in regards to providing me with the resources to do my job. I'm trying to build a department with my hands tied and a blind fold on because of my boss. 


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

In this case I think your boss is simply playing his personal beliefs at work... And he feels threatened by your position. 

Can you demonstrate in simple steps and very small projects that you can do what needs to be done without freaking him out? 

Can you involve people across the company that may not be so adversarial?


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## kag123 (Feb 6, 2012)

I keep thinking that there has to be something within my power to make this situation better. Every day it gets worse. 

This is a small company and my boss has been here since it opened. (~20 years?) He's second in line to the president so I don't really have a good feel on how others view him. It seems to me that he is regarded as God-like, as in no one dares speak his name in vain. So it's not easy to find out if he's like this with everyone or just with me. 

My latest tactic is self preservation. I do nothing and say nothing unless directly spoken to by him. I sit quietly at my desk and hope to go unnoticed. This means I am literally doing nothing. Every suggestion I have made as to a task for myself is immediately shot down. He seems happy though. He is much more cordial with me and polite as long as I sit quietly and don't say too much. Meanwhile I can literally feel my brain withering. I've never had a job in my life where I am doing nothing. I feel on edge like I could be cut at any minute because why am I here if I have nothing to do? I don't have any reason to suspect they would fire me beyond having no work to do. (Rather...no work I am permitted to do. Every move I make I am chastised for and that task is taken away.)

I am desperately applying for other jobs but need to find a way to get through my current situation in case it is a long time before I can find something else. I haven't mastered that yet. 

My employees ask me questions about their work or expectations. I've stopped answering them because anything I say is superseded by my boss. Instead I send them directly to his office to ask him the questions themselves. They come back to me and report what he said...and every day it's a new layer of BS. Making terrible operational decisions that will cripple the department and I don't know what else to do but to watch it fail. I feel powerless. Even my employees know that some of the directions he's giving are awful. They complain to me. I want to do battle for them but instead I shrug and say nothing. Trying to remain as neutral as possible so I don't appear to be criticizing him and also don't appear to be directly defying his orders. I suspect that when things do fail it will be pinned on me. I document everything that shows his decisions but what good is that going to do when the reckoning comes? 

I sincerely don't know what to do. 

My H knows I am unhappy and looking for another job. I feel uneasy talking to him on a regular basis though as it feels like constant b!tching, and his attitude has always been "you get a paycheck don't you?". It is really creating a rift in my home life to be this miserable at work. I desperately try to turn it off and leave the problems at the door but I can't fake happiness and cheer when I feel like I've made a terrible mistake by taking this job. I dunno. I'm just not good at the whole split personality thing. I do try to be calm and cool and polite to everyone but I can't stretch it to cheerfulness. 

BTW someone mentioned exercise. I go to the gym, I "meditate", I have a 1.5 hour commute both ways that I use to switch gears as much as possible. I see a doctor and I take SSRI meds (which I find helpful). I recently went down on the dosage to the bare minimum I feel like I can function on - back at my old job when life was stable - in an attempt to get my sex drive back. Now I am strongly considering going back up on the dose but trying desperately to avoid that. 

Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk


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## Thundarr (Jul 4, 2012)

It sounds miserable kag. You're doing what I would try to do in the same situation. Work frantically to find a more suited job and in the mean time just try to make it through today.


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## heartsbeating (May 2, 2011)

kag123 said:


> My latest tactic is self preservation. I do nothing and say nothing unless directly spoken to by him. I sit quietly at my desk and hope to go unnoticed. This means I am literally doing nothing. Every suggestion I have made as to a task for myself is immediately shot down. He seems happy though. He is much more cordial with me and polite as long as I sit quietly and don't say too much. Meanwhile I can literally feel my brain withering.


That was the obvious next step - to check your thoughts and opinions at the door and become a 'yes' man. A cult-like or fearful following from other employees tells me there's not much objectivity or critical thinking occurring or encouraged. 

You know this isn't about you. 

Despite the paycheck, this stuff can be stressful. Let yourself off the hook. While I wouldn't suggest going home to complain to your husband, what I will ask is what do you really need from him at the moment? 

Keeping your head down at work might be the easiest option right now but in my opinion, you are absolutely doing the right thing to find something else. The sooner the better.


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## AliceA (Jul 29, 2010)

I hope you find something else very soon Kag. Will cross my fingers for you.


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## kag123 (Feb 6, 2012)

heartsbeating said:


> That was the obvious next step - to check your thoughts and opinions at the door and become a 'yes' man. A cult-like or fearful following from other employees tells me there's not much objectivity or critical thinking occurring or encouraged.
> 
> You know this isn't about you.
> 
> ...


I guess my experience working with someone of his personality has been so limited that it took me off guard. 

I am having a lot of trouble personally getting over how stupid and naive I feel to have not seen this coming despite doing all of my homework before accepting the job. What bothers me the most is that I don't see a true lesson to learn here. What could I have done differently? What do I do next time to make sure this doesn't happen again? 

For my H - I don't know what to ask him to do. I feel like I have no right to come home in a bad mood and let my family suffer from it. I just don't seem to have the skill yet to switch gears and let things go as quickly as I would like. We had a four day weekend for Christmas and after one day I felt like I was able to relax and enjoy. But switching rapidly over from the work me to the home me in an hour is hard. 

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## heartsbeating (May 2, 2011)

kag123 said:


> I guess my experience working with someone of his personality has been so limited that it took me off guard.
> 
> I am having a lot of trouble personally getting over how stupid and naive I feel to have not seen this coming despite doing all of my homework before accepting the job. What bothers me the most is that I don't see a true lesson to learn here. What could I have done differently? What do I do next time to make sure this doesn't happen again?


For what it's worth, I see this so differently to you. I'm offering my perspective in the hopes that it brings you some kind of reassurance. With your posts, I read of an intelligent, assertive woman who not only negotiated a great package for herself but also initiated meetings as part of due diligence. I'm not sure how you could have seen this for what it is until you were in it. Sometimes, that just happens. But we move on and keep hustling. 

My take on life lessons is that they may not be obvious at the time. It could be years before you recognize what the lesson is... if there is one. And it may be completely left-field to what current your focus is. I also theorize the lesson may be for someone else and you happen to be part of the experience. 



kag123 said:


> For my H - I don't know what to ask him to do. I feel like I have no right to come home in a bad mood and let my family suffer from it. I just don't seem to have the skill yet to switch gears and let things go as quickly as I would like. We had a four day weekend for Christmas and after one day I felt like I was able to relax and enjoy. But switching rapidly over from the work me to the home me in an hour is hard.


Maybe the answer isn't to switch over rapidly. How about implementing one small thing that can assist you? It could be as simple as changing from your work clothes when you arrive home. Find what will work for you. Another suggestion is to take more of that 'home' mindset with you to work. What I mean is, cultivating a more relaxed state of being during your day - it's the reverse. I know that can be easier said than done. 

All the best with the search for your next opportunity.


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## kag123 (Feb 6, 2012)

Man. I am feeling like such a Rollercoaster. 

I've been sending out resumes like crazy. Too early to get a feel for whether it will lead to anything. I feel like it's a stretch though to put in a resume cold without knowing anyone at the company and get a call back. Guess we will see. 

I've been sticking with my new mantra of sit quietly and try to go unnoticed. This serves its intended purpose of avoiding conflict. In fact I can go an entire day without my boss saying a word to me. It also means nothing of substance gets done. No decisions or moving forward on big issues. 

But it seems as though the culture at my company promotes that? Lack of work and lack of taking anything seriously? I don't know. 

I have very little work that I am permitted to do independently (or at all) and therefore spend a lot of time doing nothing. 

This terrifies me as I feel like I could be fired at any minute. Why keep me around when I am not pulling my true weight?

However I look around and it seems this is what everyone else is doing too. Nothing? Chatting away to each other and playing on their phones? So it appears normal? I don't know. 

Over NYE, H and I had a very nice date night where we discussed all the things we have planned for 2016. It occurred to me during that conversation that a lot of what I am looking forward to is hinged upon this salary and this amount of leave. I am getting paid an awful lot of money, in my opinion, to do so little. 

It's hard to think about taking a step back when I really think about the money.  

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## heartsbeating (May 2, 2011)

kag, I hope you don't mind me chiming in again. I actually thought of your situation the other day when speaking with a friend. She lasted 6 months at a job and left because of her manager. She attempted different things before finally reaching her breaking point. With a good reputation in her field, she is grounded, assertive and well respected... From her terrible experience, she said the lesson she took from it was that she knows she deserves better and next time she'd leave within days rather than months.

Only you can determine if the salary and benefits are worth what you are risking. Maybe it becomes about options. I would suggest to be mindful of keeping both your skills/learning and network relevant. If you become a shell of your abilities, what does that achieve for you in the long run? It doesn't sound sustainable, desirable or progressive - salary aside. It's great that you are at least getting paid while looking for options. 

Perhaps your family goals can still be achieved but with a new organisation. Or maybe the goals are shifted. Only you can prioritise that. I understand how a network and warm introductions can assist with your search. Although I can't relate, as I've personally always been hired 'cold'. Good luck with it all. Please keep us posted. I hope others chime in.


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## norajane (Feb 7, 2012)

kag, are you on LinkedIn? Lots of headhunters use it to find candidates for jobs they are trying to fill. I get emails from them every so often, from all over. It might be a good way to expand your network, too, because your contacts have contacts. You can also search for jobs, and read blogs from people in the industry, whom you can then contact.


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## kag123 (Feb 6, 2012)

I just posted an update on the first post of this thread.


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

If you get the job, take it. It sounds perfect. 

Your husband will adjust.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## anonmd (Oct 23, 2014)

Not telling you what to do here so don't take this the wrong way .

The new job you are in sounded like a promotion and a career move, even though it didn't work out? 

The new county job sounds like a real mommy track move. 

So, which track do you want. If you are more career track oriented you may want to stick it out some more until something else that is more of a lateral move at the higher level comes up.


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## Buddy400 (Aug 30, 2014)

kag123 said:


> *UPDATE -*
> 
> I didn't want to make a new thread on the same topic, but also didn't want people to read only the opening post here and miss that I am adding to it. Hope this is OK to post an update here in Post #1:
> 
> ...


I could not be on Cloud 9 while knowing that my wife was miserable in her job. You are right to be angry with him.

Is the pay you'd make at the county less than you made at your previous job?


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

A year ago I was in a job that I hated. I started in January 2015 and within a month I knew it wasn't for me. The owner was involved day to day, and he was a complete and utter twit. I don't even really know how to describe him. He was a huge misogynist for sure, but only towards certain women. It was just bizarre. The pay was pretty good and I stuck it out till April, but by the end of April I knew I had to quit, so I started job hunting. Things just kept getting worse, culminating with the owner of the company berating me for not filling up the water in the coffee machine - I hadn't even used the coffee machine. (Note - my position was in accounts payable and NOT gopher for the boss) I wasn't allowed to actually do things I'd been doing for years in my previous job. Not as badly as you're experiencing, but it was pretty bad. Anyway, I didn't have something new to go to, but I left one Friday not intending to go back, so I sent them an email on Sunday that I would not be returning and why. I don't know for sure, but I figured if I gave a weeks notice the owner would probably go off the deep end on me.

My husband didn't want me to quit without another job, but I was seriously depressed, crying on Monday mornings on the way to work (hubby and I carpooled), I started smoking after quitting the summer before, he could tell it was turning me into a basket case. After I quit it took me a month to find another position. Not quite as much pay, but holy man!!! AM I ever WAY WAY happier 

Your state of mind is the most important consideration here. Not the money. I also think you need to let your hubby see how this is affecting you.


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## soccermom2three (Jan 4, 2013)

How are the benefits with the government job? Are they better than your current job?


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## Buddy400 (Aug 30, 2014)

jld said:


> If you get the job, take it. It sounds perfect.
> 
> Your husband will adjust.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


If my wife took a job paying half of what she currently made without getting my agreement, I can guarantee that I wouldn't "adjust".


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## kag123 (Feb 6, 2012)

Money is a big deal to my H. He needs a good chunk of it to feel secure. We have debt at the moment that we are still paying off from our college days and a period where I was unemployed for a year. We have been making progress on chipping away at it ever since I started working again, but this new job I just took changed our pay off plan from taking a few more years to being completely debt free in one year. That is a big deal to him and I don't necessarily take it lightly either, but I'm the one who is trading a large chunk of sanity to provide this money. The tug between knowing how much the money means to him (and our family) and actually living the day to day. It's hard. I'm very conflicted. 

He's not happy that the atmosphere sucks, but he feels that money is the be all and end all. When there are debts to pay and money to be saved, you do whatever you have to do to make that goal and don't complain about it. So I feel that he thinks I am a drama queen for complaining about my job.

The advertised starting salary for this job would put me right back to where I was in the old job. The job I have now currently doubled my previous salary. We could live off the old salary just fine it's just that it would not give the perks of all the extra money, obviously. 

He thinks I should keep giving the current job more time, keeps saying I'll adjust to it. I tell myself that on the way to work each day and seriously by clock out time I am just mentally done. I can compartmentalize my life pretty well so I just shut down from work and don't talk about work at all. Actually H and I don't talk much period during the week. We are both so exhausted and juggling too much. So he knows I don't like the job but kind of treats it as - don't ask about it so it doesn't come up. And I let that slide because I don't need to be reminded during my off hours how much I hate it. 

As for mommy move - I will have to keep my mouth shut about that.


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## kag123 (Feb 6, 2012)

soccermom2three said:


> How are the benefits with the government job? Are they better than your current job?


Re: benefits, I don't know yet. It would be something to find out in the interview. 

Heck they might not even make me an offer after the interview so who knows if this will pan out, but I'm just irritated that my husband is displeased that I'm even willing to look into it. 

I only applied in the first place because it's close to home and in my field. After almost 10 years of a 1.5 hr + commute each way it is super tempting to jump at a one mile commute!


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## knobcreek (Nov 18, 2015)

I hate my current and old jobs, welcome to adulthood, everyone hates their job unless you're a professional athlete or a rock star. It's why they call it "going to work", not "going to unwind and have fun".


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## kag123 (Feb 6, 2012)

knobcreek said:


> I hate my current and old jobs, welcome to adulthood, everyone hates their job unless you're a professional athlete or a rock star. It's why they call it "going to work", not "going to unwind and have fun".


I guess. 

I really liked the people I worked with at my old job and my department. There just wasn't any more room for upward mobility in salary, so I jumped at the offer to double my salary thinking I could rebuild the same dynamics and just make a ton more money doing it. 

I didn't count on my boss being so awful or the atmosphere being so awful. 

If I could go back in time I would not have taken the job and would have stayed at the old place, salary be damned. My husband wouldn't have had a taste of the new money then.


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## Prodigal (Feb 5, 2011)

Welcome to the working world in the economy of 2016. Sure, there are some folks out there in super-rewarding jobs with great benefits and perfect schedules.

I had two of those. They were both in the 90's.

Sure, my job sucks. But I'm not one of the upper management folks who has to take the heat for f^ck ups. I also find SOMETHING to be grateful every single day regardless of my job.

I work for a government official. During certain times of the year we do repetitive, paper-pushing, skull-numbing tasks. Then, like this year with FOUR elections, it's total insanity. Lots of overtime - weekends, holidays, you name it. Micro-managed? Heck, the only thing I can do without having a supervisor tell me what to do is go to the bathroom. 

You hate your job. I understand. I sympathize. 

But you want to complain enough that your husband will sympathize with your plight and tell you to quit. Ain't going to happen. So work the job until the debt is paid off. Then go look for another job. He still won't like it, but he might be more empathetic. OTOH if he's totally into money, maybe you should question if your values actually mesh with his.

So now you resent your job. You resent your commute. You resent your husband for not being sympathetic.

Hate the job and drive yourself nuts or find something that gives you pleasure to counter the dislike you have for the current the job.

Like I said, I hate my job, but I don't care. I just learned to not let the supervisors/management that want to control every little thing I do bother me. Hey, if I don't have to make decisions or have opinions, let them take the heat when they screw the pooch.


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## heartsbeating (May 2, 2011)

What can you learn in the govt role?

In addition to money, I'd be considering your well-being, self-esteem and what you can learn / are learning. If you do decide to stay in the current role, are there at least options for professional development or even certain 'wins' you can achieve so that you continue progressing in some way over the next year (in addition to the title)? 

An interview my husband once had, he hadn't qualified salary expectations over the phone. Within minutes of the interview, he suspected the number wouldn't be aligned. As the meeting came to a close, they basically offered him the role and the discussion around salary occurred ...his expectation was triple what they were offering (based on previous earnings and market value). He didn't share his true number with them as he didn't want to be insulting but enough for them to realize it wasn't going to happen. He apologized for not qualifying more details with the initial conversation. They in turn apologized and hoped he hadn't felt it was a waste of his time. Although the salary wasn't close, they did ask if he'd be interested in contracting for a particular piece of work at his 'daily rate' and based on their budget. While time is valuable, sometimes different options or connections may arise from going out and speaking with people. Know your priorities with what you are looking for next. Good luck with the interview and your continued search.


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## Grogmiester (Nov 23, 2015)

The new job pays half as much as the position you have now. Besides the commuting time you would be able to recoup from the new position, how much in commuting costs would be saved if you took the new job that's closer to home?

If you're commuting by car there's gas, maintenance etc etc. you can rack up a lot of miles with the commute you have now which will necessitate the purchase of a new vehicle sooner rather than later. 

So I guess I'm saying what is the true cost of new job vs present job? What's the salary - commuting costs? Maybe the new job isn't half as much.

btw ,,,, you can't quantify the cost of "your time" spent on such a long commute. 

I commuted an hour back and forth to my job for 25 years. When it snowed or there was an accident I could double or triple that day's commute. I understand how the commute can wear you down.


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## kag123 (Feb 6, 2012)

I don't want my husband to tell me to quit my present job. 

What I actually want from him is trust. Trust that I am a responsible adult with a career that I would not intentionally sabotage. Trust that I understand our finances (I have just as much of a hand in it as he does), that I work towards the same future goals that he does to mutually benefit us as a family. 

I don't expect him to be head over heels about any potential pay cut. 

I do want him to support me as I interview _*with the intention of gathering more information about the position *_ not leaping head first into a job without considering consequences. 

What makes me angry with him is that prior to my taking the new job, there was no indication that I was going to get a big raise or anything in the near future. We weren't expecting a windfall of money. We were fine living off of what I made previously (and what we both make is not chump change either...both career oriented professionals). Then we came into this "good luck" that doubled my salary and now he's got $$$ signs in his eyes and can't imagine losing it. 

It feels a bit as though you won the lottery, then all of a sudden the lottery commission called you and said whoops we made a mistake and you aren't really the winner, you won't be getting any more checks now. You were fine before financially but the lottery win was like omg...look at all the money! 

When the thought of the money potentially going back down to past levels hits me, I think man that sucks...but I also look at all the intangible items AND keep in mind we were doing just fine before. 

He just gets p!ssed that his dreams got squashed. Then he turns that disappointment onto me because I am the one potentially taking his money away.


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## Hicks (Jan 14, 2011)

First of all you have to get the job in order to take the job. I feel bad watching your husband be so stupid, but as they say youth is wasted on the young.

Earlier in the thread you state that you are a spender and he is a saver. I would lay out a budget for him showing your ability to reduce spending, maintain a reasonably close track of paying down the debt, and look for ways to meet in the middle.

If your sanity and personal happiness is at stake, realize you are not really going to get his blessing but sometimes you have to do what's right for yourself and by extension your family.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

How he feels is HIS problem, not yours. He sounds quite immature actually, to have that attitude about this.


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## soccermom2three (Jan 4, 2013)

I think once you go in for the interview and find out more about the pay and benefits, you can sit down and do the numbers to see if the cut in pay is not that bad. By changing jobs, you may save more money on the shorter commute and daycare. The government benefits might be way better.


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## Celes (Apr 28, 2015)

You paint your husband as money hungry. I call him being financially responsible. You mention a debt that would have taken years to pay on your previous salary. That's pretty alarming to me. I think at the core you and your husband are vastly different when it comes to money. Your husband isn't all about money, he's about security. If we had a debt hanging over our heads that would take years to pay, you can bet my husband would be a stress case. I'm sure your husband is feeling incredible pressure from that weight. 

A job is a job. Most people hate their jobs. You might leave this job and take a pay cut only to land in an even worse environment. I say, at least suck it up until the debt is paid. If you find something else in the meantime that pays just as well, sure take it. If not stay put. But it would probably do you better to grow some thicker skin at work and try to understand where your husband is coming from. Or both of you will build resentment towards each other.


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## BetrayedDad (Aug 8, 2013)

soccermom2three said:


> I think once you go in for the interview and find out more about the pay and benefits, you can sit down and do the numbers to see if the cut in pay is not that bad. By changing jobs, you may save more money on the shorter commute and daycare. The government benefits might be way better.


How damaging half is, is also a matter of perspective...

I mean if your going from $50k to $25k meh, who cares? Quit.

The gov't benefits alone are probably worth the $25k difference.

If you're going from $150k to $75k then that's a consideration.


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## *Deidre* (Feb 7, 2016)

I'm sorry you're in this situation ...it can suck to have such tension at the workplace.  I had the same situation last year, with my boss, and thought it would never get any better. For me, I returned to my faith...and what took place, changed everything. I became focused on just being kind to my boss, no matter how he addressed or treated me. I will say that I totally stopped asking anything personal like 'how was your weekend,' and just kept to my job. But, when I'd see him, I would smile and just be kind. Eventually, he asked me what made me so happy. I told him that it was my faith, and he just looked at me like a bert-stare lol. My job performance soared and his demeanor towards me changed like 180. He still can be tough, but I started viewing him in a different light. Now, your situation might be entirely different, but for your own sense of well being...maybe try this. No matter what is going on, just be kind and carry on with your day. When I stopped looking for others' attitudes towards me to dictate my day, things changed. 

I'd definitely look for work elsewhere though as a precaution, and as far as your husband goes, your happiness and well being should be paramount to him, over money. Stress like this can take a toll on one's health, before long. 

Prayers for you that it all works out.


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## kag123 (Feb 6, 2012)

Thanks for continuing to provide feedback. It seems like there are two main camps - those that feel that you put up with the job no matter what for the money, and those that feel the intangibles of the job (atmosphere, satisfaction) are given a bit more weight. 

I do not think my husband is "money hungry" and I apologize if it came across that way. 

I DO think there is more to life's happiness than money. 

ASSUMING you have enough money to do all of the things you need to do...keep yourself clothed, fed and roof over your head...and pay all of your bills on time with the appropriate amount leftover. Assuming those core conditions are met, and will continue to be met, then I feel that the "intangibles" of a job are given weight when it comes to assessing that jobs worth. 

My husband would disagree with me. He feels that a job is a job, who cares what happens there, all measures of success and happiness come from the paycheck you get out of it. This is what he actually SAYS.

I do not think that makes him "money hungry", I just think it makes him very different from me. 

Ironically - my husband has always held a career that he finds personally rewarding and that he chooses to keep despite the fact that he COULD make more money. If he put his efforts into climbing the corporate ladder and ruthlessly pursuing a leg up (as he expects me to do) he would be making A LOT more. He's been offered a chance for promotions several times and has not followed through with the steps necessary to get them. 

I have said NOTHING to him about his career choices, his choice not to pursue the promotions, or any of it. You know why? Because I understand that he enjoys the job he has right.this.minute and that he is probably not ready to leave it behind. He has a great atmosphere and group of coworkers, gets along fabulously with his boss, and has been given a lot of freedom with his projects in his current job. He has a lot of voice in his department in how decisions are made and feels part of a team where his contributions matter. and that makes him happy! I am happy for him!

But when it's MY turn to seek job satisfaction, none of that matters. Just the money. 

And on those 1-2x a year conversations where it comes up that he's only getting a cost of living raise again because he turned down the promotion again, he turns around and blames me for it. He would have to get his license to move to the next position at this point, and it is a series of exams that he can schedule at any time. He's taken 4 of the 7 already. Just needs to finish them out. It's always my fault that he's not done. He tells me I: always have plans for us so he has no time to schedule an exam. (Schedule your exam whenever you want! Plans can be changed) , work too much so he feels guilty about taking time away to study because I would have to cut back on my work time to be with the kids (again, I've never once told him he cannot take time to himself whenever he wants it), don't have enough money to take them (not true at all, and I've even saved the cash for them and handed it to him in a card several times and said this is for an exam...he spends it elsewhere).

I say nothing about any of that. For whatever personal reasons he has determined now is not his time to move up the ladder. I believe he is avoiding the exams so he can have an excuse to stay where he is. That is fine with me. We are comfortable and can afford to meet our needs. I don't LOVE that he chooses to heap the blame of his exam situation onto me, but I accept it and move on because I don't see any shame in his choosing to stay in the job he's got for reasons that are not money related. 

I don't know why he's so stubborn about me wanting those same qualities out of a job that he has. When it comes to me and my job it's about money.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

Every time I read another of your posts in this thread, I like your husband less and less issed:

Life is WAY WAY WAY too short to a) work at a job you hate, and b) put up with that kind of crap from your husband


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## kag123 (Feb 6, 2012)

One more thing that I feel is relevant to the money discussion. 

Our debt is from school. Hundreds of thousands of dollars of debt combined when we married from school. 1/4 of it was mine, 3/4 his. But we heap it into the same pot and combine our money to pay it. We've been paying it for years...even before we were together. A decade at least at this point. My husband went to school for 8 years, I went for 6 years. 4 of his were a graduate program at a prestigious private university that cost a ridiculous amount of money.

Anyway - We've got everything down to a strict payment plan, I've spent tons of time refinancing the debt and consolidating and ever searching for ways to pay off faster. We make our payments on time, always have, and we've got it under a great interest rate. To me it is "stable". It's just THERE. A part of my life. Not something I stress over. 

When we got married and have thus made big financial purchases together, every single time I have chosen the cheapest alternative that we could to limit our increase of debt. The biggest example I can think of is our house. We were approved to purchase a house twice the cost of what we actually bought. I narrowed our search down to keeping our monthly mortgage payment to the equivalent of what our apartment cost us when we got married. As a result we have a house payment that is only 2% of our monthly income. Would I like a house that is a little bigger? Yes. But to only pay an apartment rent price for my house is something I've never regretted. We could keep our house if one of us lost our job and that is a big deal to me. 

We've done the same with cars. When my car finally died I could have bought myself something brand new, and afforded the payment. And I did drool over some of the new cars on the lot. I didn't though. I picked the most sensible choice I could...something used in good condition with a low payment. 

I think we do well. We have enough cushion that I feel comfortable. He does not agree and wants a lot more cushion before he feels comfortable. 

We've been through the finances together hundreds of times. Everything is kept up to date to the minute on a macro I built and we both have constant access to all accounts. So no one is in the dark here. We are just fundamentally different. 

I don't need as much cushion as he does to feel secure. If he could sleep with gold bars under his pillow he'd be happy. He is just extremely anxious about money.


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## Prodigal (Feb 5, 2011)

Can you list everything you hate about your job? I'm serious and I'm not being judgmental here. Are there any positives, or is everyone out for themselves? I mean some jobs are absolute snake pits, others do have some redeeming value.

With the huge student loan debt you have, it might be beneficial to figure out if there is anything you like about the job for the time being. After all, getting out of debt is a wonderfully freeing experience.

I speak as someone who has zero debt. And I had a sh!tload of debt most of my life.


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## Celes (Apr 28, 2015)

Lots of people are anxious about debt. You think of your debt as just being there, oh well. Your husband does not. There's a lot of resentment on both sides. I'd suggest counseling to get to the bottom of it. 

By the way, you may feel like the debt is just "there" now, when you both have jobs. But no one can tell the future. One or even both of you could get laid off or fired. Or tragedy could strike when you least expect it. And then you will wish you had more of a cushion.


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## tech-novelist (May 15, 2014)

kag123 said:


> One more thing that I feel is relevant to the money discussion.
> 
> Our debt is from school. Hundreds of thousands of dollars of debt combined when we married from school. 1/4 of it was mine, 3/4 his. But we heap it into the same pot and combine our money to pay it. We've been paying it for years...even before we were together. A decade at least at this point. My husband went to school for 8 years, I went for 6 years. 4 of his were a graduate program at a prestigious private university that cost a ridiculous amount of money.
> 
> ...


Is your net investible worth (not including "home equity") positive or negative? If it is positive, then you could (and probably should) pay off that student loan bedt.

But if it is negative, which is what it sounds like, then you have *no *cushion; instead, you have a pit that you are slowly filling in.

However, the fact that your husband isn't even trying to make more money means that he isn't very serious about the debt either, so it's not all on you.

I should note that I know what it is like to go to a job I hate. I have done that, for lengthy periods of time in some cases, because I needed the money.


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## heartsbeating (May 2, 2011)

kag123 said:


> He wants me to stay at the current job until I find something equal to or higher than the current salary.
> 
> I am now a bit angry with him for being so unsupportive.


I commend that you got to what this was really about for you - trust. You want him to trust you. That seems to be the theme with the new boss too. You want him to trust you to do what you were hired for.


Now that you and your husband have discovered the 'number' that will get you out of debt sooner, how about also discussing together a way for you to achieve that number as a couple, if that has become the new priority? Surely there's a balance to be found with you taking another job of similar, or if needed, slightly lower salary (and with consideration to factors such as commute, job satisfaction, culture, autonomy, leading a team... what ever is important to you) combined with him contributing to any potential salary 'gap' that may occur. 

Rather than it be on your shoulders to continue this new salary, how about it becomes a shared effort to reach that number together? Yes, he may need to get out of his comfort zone in order to make that happen if it's really important to him. And if he's not willing to do so, his actions demonstrate it's not that much of a priority to him after all.


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## kag123 (Feb 6, 2012)

Update...

I went on the job interview a couple of weeks ago. I knew immediately once conversation started in the interview that it wasn't going to be a good fit for me. I asked some tough questions and got some honest answers which further reinforced that. I couldn't take that kind of a pay cut without feeling like it would be a big pay off in other ways. 

I have not seen any other suitable job openings in the last several weeks. 

My current job is getting worse by the day. I cry on the drive home probably 2-3 days a week. That is really pathetic. 

I've recently taken some volunteer positions with some extra curricular activities that my kids are involved in, and all I hear from everyone outside of my current job is praise. Sadly at work all I hear is about everything I do wrong. It is so draining to deal with every.single.thing being a big drag out fight. 

I don't know how much longer I can deal with it.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

That is horrible  It really is. Is it really worth it? Your health is bound to be affected by this. I know - I went through it. Doing something you hate for that many hours every day, week in and week out, with no end in sight? Nope. I wouldn't. I wouldn't care what my husband said.


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## kag123 (Feb 6, 2012)

Thanks Hope1964. 

I can't really just quit. We need me to make SOME money in order to pay the bills. I don't necessarily need to make the exact salary I am making right now but I can't quit without having something else lined up. 

Thanks for letting me vent. 

The hardest part is that I suffer from anxiety already (being treated for it) and this job makes me feel like I'm regressing in my treatment by a few years. 

It's easy for me to begin to take my bosses criticisms and nastiness to heart and truly think I must be doing something wrong. I go through periods when I'm in too deep into the week at work when I start to believe I deserve the treatment. Maybe I'm developing Stockholm Syndrome? I don't know. It feels like psychological warfare.


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## brooklynAnn (Jun 29, 2015)

I think they are waiting for you to quit. Keep looking for something. What happen to the muni job application?


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## kag123 (Feb 6, 2012)

Man. Today was really terrible. Every day I tell myself - you got this. There's no way it can get worse. Then, yea...it's worse. I cycle between fury and feeling like it's gotta be me. I left the office for 3 hours today. Just could not physically be there because I was going to flip my desk if I stayed. I seriously don't remember being this angry before. 

I need to find some zen or something. I am seriously losing it. 

I don't tell H any of this. So thanks for letting me vent. 

Still looking for something. The county job didn't work out.


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## heartsbeating (May 2, 2011)

sorry to hear that, sweetheart. Sometimes you just want to say 'eh, go fvck yourself..' but then the rational mind kicks in. It's good you were able to leave the office.


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## heartsbeating (May 2, 2011)

Why aren't you sharing this with your husband?


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## heartsbeating (May 2, 2011)

kag123 said:


> and feeling like it's gotta be me.


It's not.

You need to leave.


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## Mia Clarkson (Apr 6, 2016)

almost everyone hate own job but it does not have to be so stressful


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## kag123 (Feb 6, 2012)

Thank you guys. 

I just feel very defeated right now. 

I don't talk to my husband about this because there really isn't anything he can DO. When I try to vent to him or share something that doesn't result in an action item, we both end up frustrated and I get more upset. I've got enough on my plate at the moment without having to deal with marital strife on top of everything else. Easier to just deal with my own sh!t on my own and let the marriage be peaceful.


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## misslonelyheart (Apr 3, 2016)

You mentioned in your update that you found out why you were hired and that it makes you want to quit even more. Can you share a little more detail? Because honestly to me it sounds like someone is trying to sabotage these new contracts and you're being set up to take the fall for it.


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## kag123 (Feb 6, 2012)

misslonelyheart said:


> You mentioned in your update that you found out why you were hired and that it makes you want to quit even more. Can you share a little more detail? Because honestly to me it sounds like someone is trying to sabotage these new contracts and you're being set up to take the fall for it.


I think the company is trying to build a case against either firing or denoting my current boss. He's one of the first employees of this company when it was founded and has 30 years in. But he's a terrible piece of sh!t and everyone knows it. 

Every time I go over his head to voice my concerns or discuss how to handle a situation, I'm told by the president to be more forceful with my boss. They know how he is. I think that's terrible advice. 

My bosses behavior apparently isn't news to anyone else. Unfortunately I am the one who has to work closest with him so I get to bear the brunt of his behavior. 

I just don't want to be part of the drama. I have work to do and have zero interest in being dragged into a scheme to plot against him. I have zero interest in knock down drag out fights every day. I am tired of receiving nasty emails and being made to feel stupid and worthless. 

I don't play those games. I'm not the type of person who will roll over and stay quiet. So my boss and I are the worst match for each other. If I know something isn't right, I'm not going to blindly follow along. 

I think my personality came across loud and clear in my interviews and that I was paired with my boss for that reason. It makes me physically sick to deal with constant fighting and tension.


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## kag123 (Feb 6, 2012)

kag123 said:


> Thank you guys.
> 
> I just feel very defeated right now.
> 
> I don't talk to my husband about this because there really isn't anything he can DO. When I try to vent to him or share something that doesn't result in an action item, we both end up frustrated and I get more upset. I've got enough on my plate at the moment without having to deal with marital strife on top of everything else. Easier to just deal with my own sh!t on my own and let the marriage be peaceful.


I wanted to expand on this. 

Hardest part for me is that I have a tough time shaking off certain things. An especially bad day is one of them. I cried for 1.5 hours on my drive home yesterday out of sheer exhaustion and frustration. Dried my tears before I got in the door. Try to put on a happy face for the family. My kids bought it but my H knows when something is wrong under the surface. 

I chose not to talk to him about it because past history has shown that certain conversations don't go well. And I don't have the capacity to handle another bad situation gracefully at this moment. 

So he avoids me, and I let him avoid me and don't say anything. He'll come around again when I'm back to being normal and have gotten over this latest issue. 

I think he means well and wants to help. But unless I can tell him "Please do X" and know that the problem will be magically solved, talking to him just makes things worse. 

So I waited until he went to sleep and then cried some more to myself. 

In a few days I'll find my resolve again and shove this behind me and keep going on. I always do. I just know it's on my shoulders to make myself feel better and find a path forward.


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## jorgegene (May 26, 2012)

"My husband is NOT HAPPY that I even applied for the job and is NOT HAPPY that I am going on the interview. Because of the money. It will take away any of the gains we thought we were making with my new salary. He wants me to stay at the current job until I find something equal to or higher than the current salary."

this is terrible.

no job is worth this. no money is worth this. we spend a third of our lives at work. what do we get ourselves into for the sake of what exactly????

if i was your husband i'd insist you find another job.


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## UMP (Dec 23, 2014)

kag123 said:


> Man. Today was really terrible. Every day I tell myself - you got this. There's no way it can get worse. Then, yea...it's worse. I cycle between fury and feeling like it's gotta be me. I left the office for 3 hours today. Just could not physically be there because I was going to flip my desk if I stayed. I seriously don't remember being this angry before.
> 
> I need to find some zen or something. I am seriously losing it.
> 
> ...


You really must find a way to relax. Take some Ativan during work or something. I was under so much stress at work that I had a heart attack. Find a way to not take it so personally. Your boss is an idiot and you should not let him get to you. Your health is more important than this job. Even if you have to go to work a little buzzed, if it helps, I think you should do it.


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## kag123 (Feb 6, 2012)

UMP said:


> You really must find a way to relax. Take some Ativan during work or something. I was under so much stress at work that I had a heart attack. Find a way to not take it so personally. Your boss is an idiot and you should not let him get to you. Your health is more important than this job. Even if you have to go to work a little buzzed, if it helps, I think you should do it.


I take SSRIs for anxiety and depression and have for years, before this job was ever in the picture. It was prompted by a complete breakdown. I really should have been medicated earlier in life though. 

That was about 6 years ago. I've experimented since then with different brands and types as well as different dosages. I've found something that works. There are side effects. But when your baseline is worse than the side effects you take the meds. 

I was proud of myself. I had tapered down in dosage a lot over the last two years and felt like I was doing really well. Recently with this job I feel myself sliding back again. I've been fighting going back up in dosage again. I mean, I could be a zombie again and feel nothing at all. The work situation would be more bearable then. But I would be a zombie in all other parts of my life too. 

The biggest side effects I have is zero emotion and zero sex drive. Zero sex drive hurts my marriage and drives my H nuts. I've been on a path with my doctor over the last 18 months or so to figure out how to get my drive back. Seems like the only answer is to stop the meds (I will not do that) or take the lowest dose that you can manage. There's no additional meds to take that give the sex drive back. 

I constantly am weighing sacrifices. I really don't want to go back up in dose but I may have to.


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## UMP (Dec 23, 2014)

kag123
Yes, been on the same road. I took Paxil for years and quit cold turkey which almost killed me. Now I take a low dose of Citalapram which I like very much. 
I would suggest .5 mg of Ativan or .25mg Aprazalam when you get to work. You might feel a bit sleepy but it will take the edge off and you might be able to depersonalize your bosses rants.
This would be a temporary stop gap. Just my opinion. Ask your doctor.

Or, you could do what many of the fast food workers do in my area. They go out and smoke a joint during their breaks


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## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

Kag,

Do you want some navigational assistance? This type situation is sort of a specialty area. 

And I won't suggest that you do anything you wouldn't be ok with having done to you.





kag123 said:


> I think the company is trying to build a case against either firing or denoting my current boss. He's one of the first employees of this company when it was founded and has 30 years in. But he's a terrible piece of sh!t and everyone knows it.
> 
> Every time I go over his head to voice my concerns or discuss how to handle a situation, I'm told by the president to be more forceful with my boss. They know how he is. I think that's terrible advice.
> 
> ...


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## kag123 (Feb 6, 2012)

MEM11363 said:


> Kag,
> 
> Do you want some navigational assistance? This type situation is sort of a specialty area.
> 
> And I won't suggest that you do anything you wouldn't be ok with having done to you.


I'm all ears.


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## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

Kag,

This is what I learned to do in these type situations:
1. Remove myself from the equation as much as humanly possible. 
2. Describe the business impact in a clear and concise manner.

For example, the strongest (and typically the only) emotional statement I ever make:
- Is placed at the end of a written communication
- Looks something like this: Based on the staff and client feedback above I'm concerned that the following outcomes are becoming likely: 
- Client delaying payment/refusing payment/cancelling contract
- Client choosing not to renew contract at end of term
- Loss of key staff (with specialized skills that are hard to replace)

So the sequence looks like this. 

To your boss and in writing: unless you object I intend to do XYZ
When he stops you/interferes: based on our conversation I won't do XYZ, I would however like to reiterate the concerns I voiced in our discussion:
- Client has already said XYZ to me (direct quotes are powerful)
- Based on that I believe our risk of (bad outcome) is continuing to increase. 

And then:
While I respect your right to make these decisions, I need your help explaining them to the client. 

Would you be willing to meet with them to explain our plan to improve the state of the project? 

Or if you prefer, I would be ok with a written set of talking points.

I don't discuss staff morale, but I do mention the risk or if it is already happening the actuality of staff attrition. 






kag123 said:


> I'm all ears.


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## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

If you've already done all that - then........

You have a client meeting consisting of you, your counterpart and their boss. And you tell them the purpose of the meeting is to get feedback for an executive status report on the project. 

And then you ask them the questions you want answered - in a manner that makes it painful for the President to read. 

You ask if you can quote them directly and if they are open to a meeting with the president if he requests it. 

And you let them know your goal is simply to make the project status as 'visible as possible' within the organization. 

That makes this simpler in a sense. The report is short. Less than a page. Tell the prez they want to meet with him to discuss the following issues. 

Because the president (sadly) doesn't care how you feel. But he didn't succeed by feeling indifferent to customer pain....

Maybe he will shoot your boss when he directly feels their pain. 

Yes - this - has - risk. But if the client believes YOU are doing the best you can for them, they won't throw you under the bus. They will instead throw the company / your boss under the bus...




MEM11363 said:


> Kag,
> 
> This is what I learned to do in these type situations:
> 1. Remove myself from the equation as much as humanly possible.
> ...


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## Buddy400 (Aug 30, 2014)

MEM11363 said:


> Kag,
> 
> This is what I learned to do in these type situations:


I was looking to write something similar but couldn't quite figure out how to state it.

I worked for a consulting company. Before my engagement, my company sold the client's Exec VP on a new methodology that the rest of the client staff hated. I was brought in to run the first project using the hated methodology. The staff and line management were actively trying to sabotage the project to prove that the methodology was stupid. 

I finished the project on schedule and on budget. It was the business achievement that I am most proud of.

The keys were:

1) Seek and hold the moral high ground.

2) Never take it personally 

3) If what they wanted to do was stupid, I would politely and without emotion point out things that could go wrong. I would happily do exactly what they wanted as long as they provided me instructions in writing. I followed the rules religiously in EVERY detail. I never did anything to make their decisions less damaging. It was obvious that they were the one's responsible for the carnage that resulted. If they didn't like some element of the methodology, I would point out that it was approved by senior management but that I would be happy to do it their way as long as they would put it in writing.


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## Buddy400 (Aug 30, 2014)

kag123 said:


> I was proud of myself. I had tapered down in dosage a lot over the last two years and felt like I was doing really well. Recently with this job I feel myself sliding back again. I've been fighting going back up in dosage again. I mean, I could be a zombie again and feel nothing at all. The work situation would be more bearable then. But I would be a zombie in all other parts of my life too.


You wouldn't be going back to the higher dose long term. It would only be until your boss gets canned or you find another job. 6-12 months.



kag123 said:


> The biggest side effects I have is zero emotion and zero sex drive. Zero sex drive hurts my marriage and drives my H nuts. I've been on a path with my doctor over the last 18 months or so to figure out how to get my drive back. Seems like the only answer is to stop the meds (I will not do that) or take the lowest dose that you can manage. There's no additional meds to take that give the sex drive back.


Perhaps this would help your husband be a little more empathetic to your situation!


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## kag123 (Feb 6, 2012)

Thank you for those thoughtful replies! I very much appreciate it! 

My mind has been elsewhere for the past three days. I found out that a very close friend from my past died unexpectedly. I hadn't talked to her in about 5 years, entirely my fault. It has really hit me hard. I don't know why. I am a total mess about it. 

It kind of makes the work situation seem petty in comparison. My boss is a total prick. I just haven't had the energy to pay attention to him for the last three days. I've been in a fog. 

I'm just utterly exhausted and now, heart broken over the sudden loss.


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## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

Buddy,

That's a great story. And I was careful in these situations. 

For instance the phrase 'maximize project visibility' is a tone neutral statement. 

If the client response was: you mean tell them how fvcked up things are....

My reply was: It's my job to make sure they have a clear picture of where we are, and where you as the client wants us to be. 

That way - I avoided having them say things like: even your own PM says the project is fvcked up. 

The other thing I did was provide the client a 'draft' of their feedback the day after the meeting - making sure I 'got it right'. This ensured there was no distortion of the message. They also appreciated that I was prioritizing the message delivery. 

When it's obvious to the client that you are doing your best for them they try hard to keep you around....




Buddy400 said:


> I was looking to write something similar but couldn't quite figure out how to state it.
> 
> I worked for a consulting company. Before my engagement, my company sold the client's Exec VP on a new methodology that the rest of the client staff hated. I was brought in to run the first project using the hated methodology. The staff and line management were actively trying to sabotage the project to prove that the methodology was stupid.
> 
> ...


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## Buddy400 (Aug 30, 2014)

kag123 said:


> Thank you for those thoughtful replies! I very much appreciate it!
> 
> My mind has been elsewhere for the past three days. I found out that a very close friend from my past died unexpectedly. I hadn't talked to her in about 5 years, entirely my fault. It has really hit me hard. I don't know why. I am a total mess about it.
> 
> ...


I'm sorry for your loss. But no, your work situation is not petty, You are in a very tough spot.

I know this is silly, but I occasionally find myself thinking "I sure hope kag123's situation is getting better".

One of these days I'm going to check this thread and find out that everything's going well for you.


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## Buddy400 (Aug 30, 2014)

MEM11363 said:


> Buddy,
> 
> That's a great story. And I was careful in these situations.
> 
> ...


And status reports! There was a design approval committee made up entirely of those trying to sabotage the project. They'd sit on specs or reject them for silly reasons like punctuation. I'd immediately correct the punctuation and resubmit them 15 minutes after receiving the rejection..

It didn't take very many status reports saying that two designs had been approved, 2 designs were completed and 43 were waiting for committee approval to break that logjam! 

I never complained, I just wrote status reports.


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## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

Yes

Clear, concise status reports and the phrases:
- I need your help
- Thanks for pushing that through

Tended to get folks on board. Or at least reduced their desire to sink the ship. 

Once in a while - I'd break some glass. These folks flat out refused to give us one hour on the phone to define an agenda and goals for a training session. A session they demanded we give on short notice. 

Called their boss and said: sorry to bother you, need your help to do a good quality job on this training. My folks are available any time between 8:00 AM and 10:00 PM tomorrow to do that prep call. 

He asked me for an hour, said he was sorry his folks were being difficult. And magically they became available. And cooperative. 

BTW: he understood what his team was doing by refusing to agree to an agenda - and he did not like it




Buddy400 said:


> And status reports! There was a design approval committee made up entirely of those trying to sabotage the project. They'd sit on specs or reject them for silly reasons like punctuation. I'd immediately correct the punctuation and resubmit them 15 minutes after receiving the rejection..
> 
> It didn't take very many status reports saying that two designs had been approved, 2 designs were completed and 43 were waiting for committee approval to break that logjam!
> 
> I never complained, I just wrote status reports.


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

Y'all need Agile! Jira! Scrum!

https://www.atlassian.com/landing/jirajr/


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## kag123 (Feb 6, 2012)

I've officially been in this job for a year now. I am absolutely amazed that I made it this far, at the start of the job I couldn't even see myself getting through each week and a whole year seemed insurmountable. I am proud of myself for sticking it out. 

There have been so many times in the last year where I've been on the edge of my seat expecting to be fired. Always because of my boss who fecks everything up, and blames everyone else below him for the issues. I decided around the time of my last update on this thread that I was just going to keep my head down, do my job to the best of my ability, and ignore my boss as much as possible. I made my job work so that I only had to see him maybe once a week and that was perfectly fine with me. Countless other people under him have come and went in the year I've been with the company. Some fired for things I am not entirely sure were their fault, some quit. I was so sure I'd be on that firing list by now. So many times I was called into meetings unexpectedly with my heart in my throat thinking I was being let go. I actually keep only a handful of personal items on my desk that can be quickly grabbed and put into my purse in a moments notice so I don't have to face the drawn out embarrassment of packing up my desk. 

Today - I got the shock of my lifetime. I got a new boss!! I don't know all of the details yet, only that my department is being transferred to new management. The old boss must have done something extreme and is either being demoted or forced into early retirement, I don't know which yet. I am meeting my new boss tomorrow. The fact that someone, somewhere up the chain finally figured out what a piece of ****e he is, feels to me like I've won the lottery. I mean he's been with the company for 25 years and has been in upper management that entire duration so I assumed he was one of the "untouchables".

I don't know all of the details yet and I am hesitant to celebrate - but, could it be? Is this hell. finally lifting?


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## Buddy400 (Aug 30, 2014)

kag123 said:


> Today - I got the shock of my lifetime. I got a new boss!! I don't know all of the details yet, only that my department is being transferred to new management. The old boss must have done something extreme and is either being demoted or forced into early retirement, I don't know which yet. I am meeting my new boss tomorrow. The fact that someone, somewhere up the chain finally figured out what a piece of ****e he is, feels to me like I've won the lottery. I mean he's been with the company for 25 years and has been in upper management that entire duration so I assumed he was one of the "untouchables".
> 
> I don't know all of the details yet and I am hesitant to celebrate - but, could it be? Is this hell. finally lifting?


Great News!

I noticed an update on this thread and scrolled rapidly to the bottom thinking "please, let it be good news".

And it was :smile2:


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

As of Jan 1 I'm getting a new boss too. We are moving completely under R&D with no production stuff. After 19 years under Bob it's hard. I know everyone in the new group and they are doing some good stuff but even then it's normal to be weary...

What happened to the old boss? Any details?

Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk


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## kag123 (Feb 6, 2012)

I should know more tomorrow when I meet my new boss. I'm wary about the change, but I figure it can't be worse....right?

Right?!

All I know is that it had something to do with either losing, or almost losing, one of our biggest clients. 

Consequently I was simultaneously writing a proposal to that same client to try to win a new 5 year contract with them when all of that blew up. I spent 40 solid hours writing that freaking proposal and the day we submitted it I found out how bad our company name was to that client. Now I expect it will be thrown right into their trash unread. That's time I will never get back. :/

I have my end of year review (gag) this week with the president, too. Instead of the new boss or the old boss. I hate reviews.

ETA: I went back and read my first post from this time last year, I still miss my old job even a year later. I still grieve for it sometimes. The pain isn't as fresh anymore but it's still there. My husband is very happy that I kept my current job and didn't just jump ship like I wanted to.


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## tropicalbeachiwish (Jun 1, 2016)

kag123 said:


> I was just going to keep my head down, do my job to the best of my ability, and ignore my boss as much as possible.


That's my strategy as well!! Lol

Glad things are changing for you. Go in with a "change is good" attitude! 😉

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## kag123 (Feb 6, 2012)

So I still haven't had my formal sit down meeting with my new boss yet. He's taking over the entire division, and all of the other departments under my division have major issues at the moment. Mine doesn't... I just run things quietly. So, he's been stopping by every 4 hours or so saying I'm so sorry I need to push our meeting out again. I finally told him no big deal, I don't have any fires burning over here and I've got things under control. Feel free to circle back when you've gotten the others put out. 

In the meantime, I had my first annual review with the president a couple of days ago. I normally would not do my review directly with him, but the boss situation has made things wierd, so I guess he decided he'd take care of it rather than let it slide. I hate.hate.hate reviews, and honestly my heart has been in my throat most of the last year feeling like I am keeping us from the edge of a cliff by the skin of my teeth so this review was even more nerve wracking. Not sure how it was going to go. 

It went very well, to my pleasant surprise. He was very kind and generous in his praise and honestly, I couldn't believe it! I really thought the review would be mediocre to terrible so truly I was shocked. I remember last spring just thinking there was a time limit on my head and that I definitely needed to jump ship before my annual review came because it was going to be terrible. 

He did not offer any insight as to what was going on with my old boss. I am dying to know what happened!! He was very PC and did not let out a single detail. The not knowing is killing me!


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