# Never been so conflicted in my life...



## Mr. Unsure (Jul 21, 2020)

I've been to married to my wife for close to 14 years. We have 2 kids 10 & 12. We've built a solid life together, we're financially stable, own our own home, toys, etc. She's a wonderful woman, very logical, very stable, great career, trust her implicitly. From the outside looking in, it should be just about perfect and I should appreciate more things about her than I do. Yet I am considering asking for a divorce after the last few years of on and off separation. 

The main issues I have is with communication and her lack of self esteem. She is essentially emotionless and I don't know how to cope with it. I've tried talking to her about our problems and she has a hard time communicating anything about her feelings. She generally just shuts down and wont' talk to me about what she needs from me. I've tried talking to her about how I'm feeling and how we can get through it, but she just takes all responsibility for everything and says that she needs to make the changes, yet the changes don't seem to come. We have a great partnership, but there's NO emotional connection. She said in the past she's a control freak and her way of controlling a situation is to shut down and that gives her some type of control, I cannot wrap my head around that level of thinking. 

This has also hit the bedroom as well as she has never really initiated sex, but on the flip side would almost always engage when I asked her. It's left me feeling completed unwanted and unattractive. I've talked to her about it multiple times and she always says she'll work on it, but yet we're still in pretty much the same spot. 

I think this has a lot to do with her self esteem and her not feeling attractive. As I mentioned, her "go to" in any sort of argument is that everything is her fault. She's a beautiful woman and I'm still very physically attracted to her, but again, there is no mental attraction. I'd love for her to realise how great of a woman she is, but I've been disappointed so many times, I've lost hope. 

I like the life we've built, I love my children, I love my wife, but still feel empty with no emotional connection. Should I stay or should I go?


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## jlg07 (Feb 24, 2017)

So, have you considered going to Marriage Counseling (and indeed even Individual counseling)? They have many techniques to try and improve these types of communication.
You want to make sure you have exhausted all ways of improving your marriage before you D so that you have no regrets. SHE may benefit from the IC so that she can understand WHY she takes all fault upon herself.


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## Mr. Unsure (Jul 21, 2020)

We've done couple counseling, but tbh neither of us were in the right mindset when we went. We've also done individual counseling as well, she still currently is. I've tried to explain what I need from her in as much detail as I possibly can, but things don't really seem to change. She has a lot of issues with self motivation, even when it comes to our kids. I would like to think she's trying to change, but after 5 years, I just don't have much hope. 

Her mother is pretty emotionless as well and they have a poor relationship at best. I think a lot of the issues stem from that, but she still hasn't been able to explain to her own mom how she feels.


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## TJW (Mar 20, 2012)

Mr. Unsure said:


> she has never really initiated sex, but on the flip side would almost always engage when I asked her. It's left me feeling completed unwanted and unattractive.


I would feel the same. In fact, I do feel the same, in my own marriage.



Mr. Unsure said:


> there is no mental attraction


Please define "mental attraction"....


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## TomNebraska (Jun 14, 2016)

Mr. Unsure said:


> ...
> 
> This has also hit the bedroom as well as she has never really initiated sex, but on the flip side would almost always engage when I asked her. ...
> 
> I think this has a lot to do with her self esteem and her not feeling attractive. ...


Honestly... after reading the two sentences together makes me think these are more your issues, not hers; this has more to do with your lack of self esteem (wanting her to initiate sex), or show more vulnerability or emotion & being afraid of what it means that she doesn't. 

Just a thought...

And JEEZ, man, having been in the opposite situation, with an XW that was constantly provoking conflict, who openly told me she couldn't deal with me being calm, couldn't deal with a happy conflict-free marriage, picking fights at 2 AM on a Tuesday night to scream at me over things like "I didn't tell her I had a new female coworker, so I must be having an affair," picking fights via text message with my mom, my aunt, my brother, etc., because they didn't accept her friend request on facebook when she thought they should have or didn't respond to her other text message for 6 hours...YIKES... be careful what you wish for...


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## marcy* (Feb 27, 2010)

I don’t think she has problems with self esteem. That’s how she is. You are the one complaing not her. She is happy with the way she is, with her life. She is a strong woman who never complains. I wished my hubby was like that and not always playing the victim and complaining. Big turn off. She says OK just to go along with you, but it’s you who is not happy, not her. You want her to be who she can’t be, she can’t.


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## Mr. Unsure (Jul 21, 2020)

TJW said:


> I would feel the same. In fact, I do feel the same, in my own marriage.
> 
> 
> 
> Please define "mental attraction"....


I guess mental connection is probably a better way to put it. Outside of work/kids, I have no idea what she likes, enjoys, or wants out of life.


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## Mr. Unsure (Jul 21, 2020)

TomNebraska said:


> Honestly... after reading the two sentences together makes me think these are more your issues, not hers; this has more to do with your lack of self esteem (wanting her to initiate sex), or show more vulnerability or emotion & being afraid of what it means that she doesn't.
> 
> Just a thought...
> 
> And JEEZ, man, having been in the opposite situation, with an XW that was constantly provoking conflict, who openly told me she couldn't deal with me being calm, couldn't deal with a happy conflict-free marriage, picking fights at 2 AM on a Tuesday night to scream at me over things like "I didn't tell her I had a new female coworker, so I must be having an affair," picking fights via text message with my mom, my aunt, my brother, etc., because they didn't accept her friend request on facebook when she thought they should have or didn't respond to her other text message for 6 hours...YIKES... be careful what you wish for...


You're correct, it has taken a blow to my self esteem. She does suffer from depression and is on medication for it, there has been some change since the meds, but minimal at best. She's stated she doesn't feel attractive in the past, whether or not it was just to placate me is another story. 

I have been in those relationships too, they're a nightmare.


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## Mr. Unsure (Jul 21, 2020)

marcy* said:


> I don’t think she has problems with self esteem. That’s how she is. You are the one complaing not her. She is happy with the way she is, with her life. She is a strong woman who never complains. I wished my hubby was like that and not always playing the victim and complaining. Big turn off. She says OK just to go along with you, but it’s you who is not happy, not her. You want her to be who she can’t be, she can’t.


If she's just placating me to shut me up, I'm not really sure I feel any better about that. I'm not constantly on her about everything, I'll let her know when something bothers me and give her a chance to work on it, it just seems like she'll put a little effort for a few days and then things go back to normal until I bring something up again. I'm willing to work on my end as well, but she won't ever let me know where I'm lacking.


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## BluesPower (Mar 27, 2018)

I really cannot believe that you are being blamed for her lack of anything. No emotion, no affection, no sexual inhiation, no connection, it almost sounds like you two don't talk. And of course it is all your fault, and SHE a strong women.

Yeah right, no dude if half of what you said is true, she is just existing. Maybe she is tired of you, and is just existing because of the financial benefits. Maybe she is depressed. Maybe maybe maybe…

You guys could try MC again if you think it might help.

But sorry, if nothing has changed in 5 years, I don't really think anything will.

One thing that will fix it is filing for divorce and moving on.

I am sure that you are not perfect but neither is she, and if she is not really wanting to try and fix it, then get out...


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## Heart Break (Jul 6, 2015)

From my personal experience I can tell you that the only thing that has changed me is that my ex husband left the house and we got divorced. I'm completely different than I was when we were married. I believe you can still save your marriage. You need to insist her to go to IC. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe you are a very strong and dominant person. She might feel a little in the background and maybe she cannot express herself very openly. I also believe she was the same when you got married and now you are expecting her to change. She cannot do it by herself. She needs to get help. She needs to solve her own issues. You pushing her will not help. She is doing her best to change and be more of what you ask her to be, but she honestly cannot do it. She simply don't know how to do it. This is why she needs to get a professional help . I truly believe your marriage can be a lot better for both of you. Good luck


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## Mr. Unsure (Jul 21, 2020)

BluesPower said:


> I really cannot believe that you are being blamed for her lack of anything. No emotion, no affection, no sexual inhiation, no connection, it almost sounds like you two don't talk. And of course it is all your fault, and SHE a strong women.
> 
> Yeah right, no dude if half of what you said is true, she is just existing. Maybe she is tired of you, and is just existing because of the financial benefits. Maybe she is depressed. Maybe maybe maybe…
> 
> ...



It was a little offensive, but hey, I put myself out there, gotta take the good with the bad.

Just existing is a good way to put it. She had no hobbies, interests, I don't know even what makes her happy and neither does she when I inquire. Anything we do as a family or couple is because I got it going, we've been remodeling our home, all she's done is pick out some curtains and I had to remind her multiple times just to get her to do that tiny piece done.

The only thing I see her passionate about is her work, sadly even more than our kids a lot of times. We do talk, but it's always very business like, it's work, kids, etc.


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## Mr. Unsure (Jul 21, 2020)

Heart Break said:


> From my personal experience I can tell you that the only thing that has changed me is that my ex husband left the house and we got divorced. I'm completely different than I was when we were married. I believe you can still save your marriage. You need to insist her to go to IC. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe you are a very strong and dominant person. She might feel a little in the background and maybe she cannot express herself very openly. I also believe she was the same when you got married and now you are expecting her to change. She cannot do it by herself. She needs to get help. She needs to solve her own issues. You pushing her will not help. She is doing her best to change and be more of what you ask her to be, but she honestly cannot do it. She simply don't know how to do it. This is why she needs to get a professional help . I truly believe your marriage can be a lot better for both of you. Good luck


She's been through multiple counselors over the last few years and is currently seeing one for the past 6 months or so. You are correct across the board, I am the dominant one and she has been this way as long as I've known her. The depression set in hard after our first child was born, but that was 13 years ago. 

I really want to find a way to be happy here, but I'm running out of ideas.


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## Prodigal (Feb 5, 2011)

Mr. Unsure said:


> She's been through multiple counselors over the last few years and is currently seeing one for the past 6 months or so.


Has she ever discussed with you what she shares with the counselors? The fact that she is seeing one makes me think she must have something to talk about besides work and kids. Counseling requires an emotional investment, so it seems to me like she might be more emotional than you think.


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## jlg07 (Feb 24, 2017)

Could she be on the spectrum at all perhaps? Has she ever been evaluated for this?


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## Mr. Unsure (Jul 21, 2020)

Prodigal said:


> Has she ever discussed with you what she shares with the counselors? The fact that she is seeing one makes me think she must have something to talk about besides work and kids. Counseling requires an emotional investment, so it seems to me like she might be more emotional than you think.


She tells me a little, but not much. Most recently that her counselor was telling her to find out what makes her happy. Find a hobby, find something she enjoys to do, be more social. It's strange, we can pretty much talk about anything, but when it comes to "us" she completely shuts down. We've talked about divorce before and even though she says it's the last thing she wants, she doesn't really act like it. The last time I got upset and in anger said "I just want a divorce" her response was "when should we tell the kids". 

She seems to get emotional about her work, but again that's it. 




jlg07 said:


> Could she be on the spectrum at all perhaps? Has she ever been evaluated for this?


I'm sorry, I'm not sure what this means.


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## jlg07 (Feb 24, 2017)

I mean, could she have Aspergers (autistic spectrum)?


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## Mr. Unsure (Jul 21, 2020)

jlg07 said:


> I mean, could she have Aspergers (autistic spectrum)?


I did a little reading on it and I don't think so, other than the lack of friends and empathy, nothing else really applies.


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

Her response to your saying you wanted a divorce was a telling comment. My guess is that she wants out but doesn’t wish to be seen as the bad guy so she’s hoping you’ll do it.


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## Prodigal (Feb 5, 2011)

jlg07 said:


> I mean, could she have Aspergers (autistic spectrum)?


From what OP has told us thus far, this seems to be a real possibility. It definitely is worth investigating further.


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

May be way off but some thoughts come to mind.
1. You mentioned she had low self esteem starting a ways back.
2. You stated there were several periods of seperation
3. She keeps stating it is her fault for the way things are. Taking blame.I 
4. She does not want to talk about the relationship and shuts down.
5. She isn't emotionally receptive to you.
6. She is emotional about work. Dont know her job.Co-workers?

Question? How sure are you that she was not with someone else during these seperation times. Co-worker? If she was having self esteem issues/depression she could have allowed another guy to give her compliments and feeling better about self and end up sleeping with him. Since she is emotional abiut work? May be reason she takes the blame for everything being messed up. Could be self loathing for allowing something to happen and the continued emotional issue may be her holding it in and hiding it and feels guilty for cheating. If she had something with co-worker and he since rejected her her depression and feeling inadequied is in her face constantly with interaction with this person who now rejects her. 
This is just what come to mind.

Has she had her hormones checked? My wife was diagnosed bi-polar then the Chief Oncologist at Baylor's Women's Cancer Center in Dallas told us many women are missdiagnosed with mental illness when it is nothing more than a hormone inbalance. Got hormones regulated and now smooth sailing.


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## Heart Break (Jul 6, 2015)

Mr. Unsure said:


> She's been through multiple counselors over the last few years and is currently seeing one for the past 6 months or so. You are correct across the board, I am the dominant one and she has been this way as long as I've known her. The depression set in hard after our first child was born, but that was 13 years ago.
> 
> I really want to find a way to be happy here, but I'm running out of ideas.


If you ask me 6 months of counseling is not enough. It took me almost 2 years to accept the change and to start to understand myself, to understand what I love to do. To understand what makes ME happy. Because before that I was doing all the things that make other people around me happy. And I think this is what your wife is doing now. Talk with her about the counseling. Ask her what they are focusing on in the counseling. I honestly don't think she wants a divorce or she's doing it on purpose. I understand you are frustrated, but maybe some more time and patience will make things better. Go again to counseling together. Talk again regarding all the issues. Do your best and then if you see it is still not working you will be able to come together to a conclusion regarding your marriage.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

jlg07 said:


> I mean, could she have Aspergers (autistic spectrum)?


I was going to raise that issue myself.


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## WandaJ (Aug 5, 2014)

The


TomNebraska said:


> Honestly... after reading the two sentences together makes me think these are more your issues, not hers; this has more to do with your lack of self esteem (wanting her to initiate sex), or show more vulnerability or emotion & being afraid of what it means that she doesn't.
> 
> Just a thought...
> 
> And JEEZ, man, having been in the opposite situation, with an XW that was constantly provoking conflict, who openly told me she couldn't deal with me being calm, couldn't deal with a happy conflict-free marriage, picking fights at 2 AM on a Tuesday night to scream at me over things like "I didn't tell her I had a new female coworker, so I must be having an affair," picking fights via text message with my mom, my aunt, my brother, etc., because they didn't accept her friend request on facebook when she thought they should have or didn't respond to her other text message for 6 hours...YIKES... be careful what you wish for...


se are two extremes. I do not think OP asks for too much: partner with emotions who can show enthusiasm in tge bedroom too.


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## MacMc (Jun 21, 2021)

jlg07 said:


> So, have you considered going to Marriage Counseling (and indeed even Individual counseling)? They have many techniques to try and improve these types of communication.
> You want to make sure you have exhausted all ways of improving your marriage before you D so that you have no regrets. SHE may benefit from the IC so that she can understand WHY she takes all fault upon herself.


What do you do if your BF refuses to talk to someone?


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## BigDaddyNY (May 19, 2021)

MacMc said:


> What do you do if your BF refuses to talk to someone?


You should probably start your own thread with more detail rather than in an 11 month old dead post.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

Zombie Cat has determined that this zombie thread must be closed down.


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