# On different pages



## ExhaustedLFH (Jul 30, 2012)

My wife and I have been together almost 10 years, 8 of them living together and 4+ married.

Recently we have had some blow outs, mainly revolved around my wifes writing on online RP forums.

My wife is a writer, and an amazing one, and she started using these forums as a mean to write. Well actually it started with fan fiction where she would post sexual based fan fiction, and someone took a liking to her stories (another writer, teacher, and a female) who introduced her to the forums she now uses.

At first, it was just a hobby, now my wife spends 8-12 hours on these forums a day from the second she wakes up until she goes to bed.

So, a big complaint of my wifes was that I do not do enough of the chores around the house. We had a big talk about that and how it didnt make her happy. So I started doing everything, and I kept it up for quite some time, getting dinner cooking dinner, the trash, the litters, walking the dog, you name it I did it. Then these forums came, and I found I really was doing everything, and she got into this whacky sleep schedule and I barely saw her.

I confronted her, and that is when she summed up the last three months (where she had been calling me super husband) as me not doing anything. And that the real issue was that I was controlling her.

I will admit, I am a very persuasive person, it is not something I activate or do on purpose, I am just naturally silver tongued. My wife hates it about me because she isnt immune too it, and that is where the me not doing anything came into play, I was always able to convince her of it.

So the controlling argument came up alot. She would be on consecutive hour 8 on her forums, and Id ask for some of her time, and she would claim it was me trying to get her off the forums because I am jealous of those people. Several moments like this transpired. It got to the point where I couldnt do anything without it being swept under the general topic of me being controlling.

Some of it Im sure is legit, but some of it is just stuff that if we get in an argument about something and I end up being right, she finds a handful of topics she will just toss that moment at, and the main one lately has been controlling.

For example, my wife said I dont take her out enough and that more specifically I dont do it spontaenously. So apparently the other day she had made plans to clean the house, I offered we go out to the restaurant I proposed to her in, and she claimed I did it on purpose to ruin her plans.
I get set up in these situations where no matter what I do, I fail.

So I started to work on that as best I could.

Then it became I was angry all the time. This I will admit too, somewhere along the line I became one of those people who just gets mad at everything. A lot of the time it was my wife. She is not innocent in this either, she does alot of things around the house that after a while just stack up and get on your nerves. She is very wasteful in every way imaginable. Lets food go to waste, lights on, water on etc... And I am sick of always having to follow behind her and take care of this stuff. So after ten years of it, yes I got a little irrate, and I guess from there it took off.

But its beyond that, I am simply angry. Im not a wall punching item throwing whack job. I just get irrate, and ill complain about stuff, or things will get on my nerves like how loud she eats (really loud). Things that a normal person lets pass by them.

But she also takes things to heart that are beyond her control, and says everything about her annoys me. But what she mistakes is these things bother me in general, and she takes it as a slight against her. Like the filing of nails drives me up a wall, and when she does it I ask her to leave the room. Somehow she takes that as a personal slight against herself.

I could go on all day, let me try to stick to the recent stuff.

So we have a huge fight, where she finally admits to me for the last two years she feels like she has been in an abusive relationship, and I control everything she does, and she tells me she wants to move out and take time apart.

I tell her I am willing to work on alot of things, and In the course of the discussion I had alot of revelations about myself, I realized alot of it was me and things that I should let pass by I should.

But she wasnt willing to yield on any of the stuff she does. She constantly breaks promises and when I call her to task for them she finds someway out of it. She essentially demeans what I wanted into not being important thus redeeming her of breaking the promise.

And naturally when I say anything, its me trying to control her, not a husband upset a promise was broken to him by his wife. The fact I held up my end of the bargain is completely swept under the rug.

Or what she tends to do is over exaggerate my wrongs, and under exaggerate the good that I do. So when we do try to discuss things it becomes impossible because she sticks to a version of the story that isnt true.

So the time she spent on these forums was really bringing things to a head, because anytime I asked her to depart from them for any reason, she got amazingly angry at me, started shouting, yelling etc...

She likes to shout, and yell at me whenever we talk, and when I try to keep calm tones she tells me I am being condescending or I am just being that way because I am trying to "win" by being the better person. 

So after this one big argument where she said she wanted to move out, and that was her line in the sand, I said I wasnt willing to cross it. But that I had alot of good ideas, some plans, things I could do on my own, but also getting therapy.

We came to several agreements. Over the last week, I fulfilled my entire end of the bargain. I gave her time alone by either going into a separate room or leaving the house to go places or to hang out with friends when I didnt want too. I did a lot of her chores to relieve her stress etc...

Her recount of the last week boggled my mind. Essentially, she discounted completely all the effort I made. But the worst part is, she completely keeps exonerating herself from any wrong doing, or coming up with an excuse for it. She also keeps defining minor amounts of time we spend together in sweeping statements like "all day" or "lots" we spend 3 hours running chores and than she was on the forums for 8 hours. Before she got on them she promised we would "hang out" before bed. When I brought this back up again I got the controlling thing, but she defined the day as "We spent all day together" and "I barely was on the forums"

So after giving her a couple days to herself I suggested taking her out like I was supposed to before being accused of some ulterior motive. She agreed. Well the night before she stayed up until like 6 or 7 am, and slept until like 4pm, at which point the day we had planned was shot. So in trying to be super husband instead of getting pissy about it I went out that night to give her the house to herself. I get home, she barely says to words to me, completely absorbed in her forums.
We plan to do it not the next day, but the day after. The next day comes, she sleeps till 4pm again, I was on my way out for the night as I promised her more time to herself. If i had left 4 minutes earlier I wouldnt have seen her all day.

I stay out until 2am, she lets me in the house barely says two words sits right back down to her forums. I was peeved, so I went to bed without even saying anything. We were suppossed to get up and go early. She went to bed and 745 am, she was up RPing a relationship with a man via a collaborative story. Something I had told her I wasnt comfortable with but demanded was going to happen because it didnt mean anything and it was just writing.

She again slept until 4pm, and had nothing to say to me when she woke up.

So we swore all these things up and downt o each other, and she just screwed me over again and again, and when I pointed out she chose to be on those forums instead, she said that wasnt it. She claimed it was her to afraid to go out with me, so she slept all day to avoid it.

To me that seemed like a BS answer, but who knows.

Right now I feel like we are on completely different pages.
-She thinks RPing a relationship online is ok, I dont
-She thinks living apart is ok as a married couple, I dont
-She thinks its ok do wrong to me because ive wronged in the past-I dont agree with this
-I think we should spend more time together, she doesnt

We are in this paradigm where I have to constantly walk on eggshells and she can do whatever she wants without repercussion and she keeps claiming its because I am controlling and abusive. 

When we spoke a week ago, we made promises, and one of her promises was to have faith that I would make the changes I said I would. And I feel ive kept my end of the bargain, but she doesnt.

And I am starting to feel like she wants out of the relationship so she is sabotaging it, and I just do not know what to do.

I am not saying I am not controlling, and I guess from her point of view I can accept the fact she describes it as abusive.

But my problem is, she isnt giving me a chance to change. She kept all this bottled up for years instead of telling me denying me the chance all that time. Now she finally tells me and I start administering change right away giving her everything she wants, and its not enough. She doesnt want to be around me, she wants her own place, and she justifies every promise she breaks to me and chooses online forums before me every time, but she claims she loves me and wants the relationship to work.

Comments that if I made a year ago she would have thought were cute she makes horrible remarks too. Or just takes a bad way. I said something about how hugging her instantly calms me down, and she said something like "I cant be your drug" or crutch or something. So its the point where apparently its wrong for a married man to hug his wife and find solace in that contact.

I have no idea what to do.

I dont even have any specific questions, I just stumbled onto this site and figured id let it all out.

Right now the biggest problem is, she says she is afraid of me because of how I act. So act the way she wants, and I am genuinely trying to get rid of this anger, but even when I treat her the right way, she says the fear still exists.

She says things always have to be my way, but she says the only way she will stay in the marriage is if we live apart. I just don't want that.

Is living apart crazy when you have been together this long and are married?

How do you convince your wife you are changing when she wont let you, or refuses to see it?


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## alton (Jul 18, 2012)

I'm pretty sure she knows her RP'ing this isn't normal and she's just trying to deflect the blame onto you. I'm guessing she's addicted to it, you need to find a way to break her off it. 

Thought about going away on holiday?


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## ExhaustedLFH (Jul 30, 2012)

I suggested it because vacations are something we talk about not doing anymore.

She wants to take one alone.

She think the remedy is not spending time together. I think she just wants out of the relationship and is slowly bleeding it instead of doing it quick. That being said, im not even positive she knows that about herself.


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## alton (Jul 18, 2012)

The thing is I'm not sure she knows what she want's. Her life probably revolves around her online activities. Her sleeping paterns probably don't help either.

A good two week vacation (if you can manage that somehow) will do two things. It will get her away from the forums for a significant period of time and hopefully remind her there is more to life. The second is it will show both of you whether whether there is still anything there. 

Was the relationship good before she found these forums?


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## EynaraWolf (Aug 26, 2010)

There is a lot to absorb here. I am a writer. So I might be able to shed some light as to what I feel is normal and abnormal for that part of her personality.

When writing a novel I can stay awake until crazy times of the morning and sleep late. This of course MUST be balanced with real life responsibilities. I have always had difficulties maintaining a "Normal" sleep schedule. I tend to write better at night when the rest of the house is sleeping. But as a married person I feel it is important to make sure my husband and I are both on board for the crazy schedule flip I do when I am actively writing a novel.

My husband can some times have difficulty getting me to come up for air when in "Active writing mode" but we've established kind of a code between us so that I know when he NEEDS my attention to keep our marriage happy and healthy. We also have children, and their needs take priority over my writing as well.

It doesn't seem natural to me that if she is writing that she is spending all this time on a forum. Writing is a very solo activity. I do have an online writing partner. We do have some story ideas in the works to write together BUT she and I both understand that husbands, children, and household responsibilities take priority over our writing.

To me it would seem she is using this forum as an excuse. I am just not sure what she is excusing.


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## ExhaustedLFH (Jul 30, 2012)

She says she is using to to escape me because I am abusive and controlling.

Which I yielded to and I am trying to work on, but her patterns arent changing to reflect that, which in turn is making it impossible for me, or which leads me too ask her to get off and which point she accuses me of being controlling.

She says I require too much attention, which could be true no way for me to really know what about myself. But I love my wife and to me it isnt a crime to want to spend a lot of time with her. She cant accept that, but I have to accept the time she wants alone (which I do understand).

The problem is, reciprocity. She demands time alone because she needs time alone (well its not alone, its online with a bunch of other people who arent me) but when I ask for time she says its me being needy.

In the past I understand this was true. But I am trying to change. I do not think wanting more then 3 hours in 3 days is asking for to much, she seems to think it is.

Its like because we spent so much time together the last two years she needs to make up for that by spending no time with me at all.

I will try to recommend the vacation, but considering she doesnt want to live with me claiming we are on top of each other too much, I highly doubt she would want to go on vacation with me where that is even worse. 

Whether or not the relationship was "fine" is a loaded question. She says this stuff was happening for a long time but she had herself convinced it was ok and is just realizing now hwo controlling and abusive I was. So I guess yes technically it was fine, but at the same time it wasnt.

The thing is, she sweeps everything under the rug as me being controlling. But doesnt recognize at all that after so long on the forums it isnt bad for me to want her attention some. That it isnt that she just uses these forums, they consume her and I cant even have a side conversation with her about something WHILE she does it.

The friend she mad online has a husband as well, who is completely accepting of all this, But to be honest I doubt she goes about this the way my wife does. If he were to say "hey lets go spend some time together" she probably would as opposed to saying something like "Stop trying to control everything I do, stop trying to get me off the forums and away from my friends."


I should also mention she is about to enroll in a doctoral program for literature, and even though it is only 45 minutes away she is insistent she lives on campus.


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## ExhaustedLFH (Jul 30, 2012)

Here is another thing, but it could just be me being paranoid.

Her behavior was not reflective of any of this over the last two years, well I cant say that but the last 6 months aside from a few arguments have been good for us. Our dog just passed away and it was awful, and it hit us both hard. But after that we rallied and things were going great. Sex was great, and constant. We spent time together, but we both went back to school so we were busy. I felt like things were good.

Then she got absorbed in these forums, and that is when I had to ask for her attention to actually get any of it, and that is when the "you demand and control" me stuff really started pouring in.

Maybe its more these forums then I thought. I dont know that could just be my perception and may not be correct. Memory is a fickle thing.

I know things were over all good aside from her claim that I didnt do enough, then i really started to pick it up and things got great, and with every chore i did our sex life got better and I realized the stress of all that bull**** she had to take care of really weighed her down and when I removed it things got awesome.

Then, somewhere I dont know things took a turn.


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## MrK (Sep 2, 2010)

OK. Two hours and two posters and nobody has yet said "she's cheating. Install keyloggers. VAR under the car seat. Hire a PI". That's good, so far.

Hmmm. Let me think. What could it be? Together 10 years. Your wife doesn't love you any more. Makes it obvious without saying it. Hmmm. If i didn't know any better I'd say you've been together with the same woman for 10 years and you're not perfect. Is that it? Did I get it?

10's of thousands of posts on this site alone and we still don't tackle the problem of wives falling out of love with their husbands after 5-10 years the way we should be talking about it. As soon as I was two paragraphs into your novel I knew what it was. She's gone.

And she's probably not coming back. Thousands of walk-away wives every year and very few come back. The ones that do, give a slightly better indication that they want to try than your wife does. Even my wife makes it look like she wants to make me happy, but she's gone for good. Let her go. Improve yourself for you and get on with your life. Let her rot behind her computer screen RPing (whatever that is).

I almost laughed out loud when you wondered why she doesn't see your improvements. I'll tell you why. That man she hates is still under all of those improvements. Six months of being the perfect husband and ONE SLIP on my part and it's back to square one. I'll never change. It doesn't even have to be a slip. One misunderstood comment and I'm that controlling "abusive" husband again. She's always looking for it so she'll find it.

That's my rant. Read up on the 180 and live your life. You don't mention your age or if you have kids. If you're young and don't have any, I envy you. You're my hero. I'm stuck in my hell for the rest of my life (although by comparison, I'll admit I live in paradise).

So go ahead. Start getting paranoid about all of the "she's cheating. SPY" posts that are going to start right about now. Or start spinning your wheels listening to all of the "here's how to fix it" posts you're going to get. I'm sure it's hard to listen to one idiot say "leave, it's over". Unfortunately, everyone needs to learn the hard way. Feel like they at least tried before they let their wife go. I'm guilty. You will be too. And so will thousands of other clueless husbands until we start dealing with the walk-away-wives problem the way it should be dealt with. Not the Oprah "Walk-Away wives: a huge problem" that is a huge problem only until Brangelina adopts another African kid or Fergie gets pregnant.

We need to deal with it as the epedemic that it is and start talking about it. Fix it. Until then, my friend, you are just another casualty.

Let her go. 180. That's what you need. Not spying and counseling.


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## ExhaustedLFH (Jul 30, 2012)

I dont need someones advice to tell me walking away or letting her go is an option, its pretty easy to figure out on your own.

If that was an option I intended to take I wouldnt have bothered coming to these forums.

I left out our age on the off chance someone we know runs into this, the less details the better. We are young-ish, and do not have kids.


I understand its quite possible my wife will never see past any of this and leave me never to return.

And you said the main she hates is still under there.

Well so is the man she loves. And while I am trying to dig that guy out, I came here to get some perspective on some stuff that I want too see other opinions on because just because its my opinion doesnt make it right.

Marriage isnt easy, anyone who tells you otherwise is lying to you or lying to themselves. I came here to advice on how to fight for my marriage, not on how to cut ties and run. Any moron can figure that out on their own.


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## alton (Jul 18, 2012)

ExhaustedLFH said:


> Here is another thing, but it could just be me being paranoid.
> 
> Her behavior was not reflective of any of this over the last two years, well I cant say that but the last 6 months aside from a few arguments have been good for us. Our dog just passed away and it was awful, and it hit us both hard. But after that we rallied and things were going great. Sex was great, and constant. We spent time together, but we both went back to school so we were busy. I felt like things were good.
> 
> ...


It's the forums, trust me. I've been there as a teen. I got quite distant from my family. Whenever my brothers would come around I would hope they would go so I could get back to chatting with my 'mates' online. My older brother would have a go at me now and then for spending so much time on the computer and it used to infuriate me, not for one min did I stop and think he's got a point even though deep down I knew it to be true. Thankfully I met a girl who made me realise real life is far more interesting, and things went back to normal with my family too.

It's hard, but you need to get her off the computer somehow.


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## anchorwatch (Mar 5, 2012)

Exhausted, wake up! She is involved in an emotional affair (EA) with someone on the forums. Your an educated person, research it. Then rule it out if not so.


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## ExhaustedLFH (Jul 30, 2012)

My wife is not a great liar.

I am deeply paranoid about being cheated on, and it has led me to do and say some pretty ****ty things. Recently I went through her email, and those forums and her phone and found nothing. We share a car and are with each other alot, it would be virtually impossible for her to be cheating on me without me knowing it.

I confronted her about that, the EA. Ive been playing online games since their invention, and I got her into them as well. Currently we are not playing any, and she turned to this as another activity.

My wife has a documented social disorder (again I will leave it out to leave out details of an intimate nature) and communicating online is easier for her then face to face.

I dont find it abnormal that she does this in general, I find it going to far.

This happened once before, but it was with an actual game not just forums. And our computers are side by side, really fi their was any severe wrong doing I would have caught it.

I am very socially apt, and very observant, she is socially awkward, kind of oblivious and not very good at hiding stuff. We have each others passwords to everything and we dont hide our phones from each other or **** like that.

And the worst part is, beyond all that I still get paranoid. My wife is hot, its hard to deny. Ive been cheated on by everyone else I dated other than her, its a hard thing to shake.

The EA as your referred to it was a concern of mine. I was very afraid her writing was a reflection of what she wanted out of life, and she assures me that as a writer that is not the case. Which makes sense because people who write about murderers are not all murderers, or even sociopaths, they are just writers with an interest in crime based stories.

And its not like these forums invented collaborative writing where a writer takes on a role. Some of my favorite novels were written where two writers split the characters in half and wrote the novel that way. Its not that I think their is something wrong with it, its that I dont like it, but she insisted on it anyway because she says nothing is going on.

I also am not scott clean here. I ****ed alot of stuff up. I did become controlling albeit not on purpose. Well I guess that is debatable because things like my trust issues probably caused me to do dumb **** ( like check her email) and I never realized I was being abusive but in the broad sense of the term I was because I had her convinced that she had to do **** my way, or so she says.

That being said, she is blowing it out of proportion in the sense she is applying it at times it isnt applicable. Its like a catch all argument or snake oil remedy. Uh oh husband is winning a fight, better call him controlling.

It has gotten increasingly worse with these forums.

So I suppose an EA is a possibility, but I trust me wife and it doesnt seem likely.

To me something more likely is that she is completely addicted to these forums so when I try to get her off them she redirects by placing **** on me.

And I know my wife, once she gets entrenched in an argument she sticks to it regardless of hwo badly she is losing or people are proving her wrong.

Its quite possible this is just that but gone way to far.


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## Toffer (Jan 31, 2012)

anchorwatch said:


> Exhausted, wake up! She is involved in an emotional affair (EA) with someone on the forums. Your an educated person, research it. Then rule it out if not so.


:iagree:

You need to rule out this possibility


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## anchorwatch (Mar 5, 2012)

If you can rule out an EA (witch I think is likely), than she is using the addiction (RP forums) to run away from the problems of the marriage. Your right on about her diverting everything on you and away from her destructive activity. If she is socially inept or has low self esteem, she likely has an addictive personalty traits. Have you done any reserch on the suject of on line addictions or sought out a counselor familiar with such addictions. It isn't much different form cigarettes, alcohol or drugs addictions. It will only stop if the addict wants it to, no one else can do it for them. You can only change yourself.

Which ever it is, your constant harping is driving her away. Even though you are distressed, you need to stop that type of behavior, as it is only hammering at the wedge between both of you. It makes her resent you more and lose respect for you. Then she will use that as a reason to move on from you. You need to look better in her eyes, she needs to feel attracted to you, not repulsed by your behaviors. There are many books recommended by the members here. Give them a read, see if you can replace any of your angry behaviors and displace some of the resentment. That might work for you, Hope its not to late.

"Divorce Busters"
"His Needs, Her Needs"
"Married Man Sex Life" (not a book about sex)
"The Five Love Languages"


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## wiigirl (Jun 14, 2012)

anchorwatch said:


> Exhausted, wake up! She is involved in an emotional affair (EA) with someone on the forums. Your an educated person, research it. Then rule it out if not so.


Never hurts to get more info.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## ExhaustedLFH (Jul 30, 2012)

I agree with you.

The problem is, she isnt communicating with me, so I am constantly phishing from her.

For example. I thought the last week I was giving her everything she wanted and more, and beyond that she screwed me over three times and my reactions werent that bad (until the third one) and her recount of those days are NOTHING like mine, nothing at all.

I am the sinner, she is the saint.

So its hard to play it cool and laid back and let her fall in love with me again when I am constantly worried I am doing the wrong thing because she never tells me the right thing.

Also, if I do that, and stop trying to draw her away from the forums at all I might just completely lose her to them.


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## anchorwatch (Mar 5, 2012)

ExhaustedLFH said:


> Also, if I do that, and stop trying to draw her away from the forums at all I might just completely lose her to them.


That's it, you have already lost her to the forums. It seems counter intuitive, but you must accept that you lost her in order to change you behavior toward her. That's why you were so against MrK's advice. It may have been too drastic (the 180)), but it pointed out that she is gone already. She has already told you she is going to separate, by moving to school.

Now you must win her back. You must be more attractive to turn her head from the screen she sits in front of. Right now something in that screen fills her emotional needs. You need to replace what the screen is giving her. 

Do the reads. Take a look at those theories and methods. I believe you will find something there. What do you have to lose at this point.


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## MrK (Sep 2, 2010)

ExhaustedLFH said:


> I dont need someones advice to tell me walking away or letting her go is an option, its pretty easy to figure out on your own.


Sorry dude. I thought you wanted other peoples opinions. My bad. I've lived a lot of what you are living and have spent 3+ years on these forums researching it. I thought you might like that perspective. 

But of course you need to freak about potential infidelity first. Then fight for a woman who will almost surely not come back. You need to do all of that first BEFORE you take my advice.

Sorry, and good luck to you. You're in for a long, hard ride.


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