# Wow...I'm not alone...less passionate sex in marriage.



## Avalanche (Mar 14, 2012)

I found this site in search of some information on what to do or how to perceive my current situation with my wife. 

What's different here is we don't exactly have 'less' sex, we have less passionate sex. 

Yes....two kids, 5 years and 10 months. 
Yes, her focus is mostly on the family. 
No, "manning up" isn't the issue. 

We talk about and our roles are fair for both. Of course sometimes they go out of balance, but our lines of communication are open so we balance them again. 

She likes to cook more than I do, so my role is to prep the food and feed the 10 month old and entertain the 5 year old before meals while she cooks. I do the clean up while she does baths. I'm active around the house renovating our turn of century home. Vehicles and making our home run are my responsibility. I also bought a fixer upper cabin that I work on weekends. (4 years later I'm almost done)

I buy her flowers probably once a month. 

I'm completely open and encouraging her to 'go out' whenever. I have no problem with staying at home and hanging with my boys as I love it.

I take the 5 year to all his extra curricular activities as its a pain for her to take both.

I usually pick the 5 year old from school and take the 10 month old with me to give her a break from him.

She puts the laundry in, I take it out and fold, she puts it away. 

As in, I feel I do not only my share, but I actively think about what would make her life easier. In fact, she's on mat leave and I'm working full time....at the moment I'd say the balance is more on my plate than hers.

This sounds like I'm complaining....I'm not, I'm content and happy with how our home is run....so is she.

BUT....

As she gets older, (we're in our 40's) she is becoming more and more....ummm, prudish, conservative, sexually uninterested.

I admit, many would be happy with my sex life, once a week minimum, but its becoming robotic. She is in a rut and I can't seem to talk her out of it. Wednesday at 10PM. Done by 10:30. We both orgasm, she's already thinking about the 'to do' list by the time I 'finish', sometimes talking about what's going on the next day within 30 seconds of my climax. (I always finish after her)

I've talked to her about this rut, and she says that its her hormones and I should be happy that she's willing to do sex because she loves me. 

I write her love letters, I've never received one from her that wasn't first instigated by me.

Is that the way it is? I can do all the right things, I get regular sex, but asking for passion and interest is too much?? 

I would love to talk about anything but the 'to do' list!! 

I ask her about ANY (ok not ANY....ANY within the confines of a monogamous marriage) fantasy and I'll go along....NOPE - NOTHING, she says she's not interested. (she apologetic about this....she isn't a *****)

Are there situations where the womans hormones have completely wiped out interest in passion? Is there a chance it will come back? 

Ultimately, I feel like she loves me, loves our life, but is unwilling to put forth some 'true' effort to regain some passion. 

If I didn't bring this up and push our marriage she could contently life without a sexual connection. 


....that was somewhat cathartic writing that out....sorry for the long post...congrats if you made it to the end.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

When was the last time you took your wife on a romantic date?

Last time for a romantic weekend or vacation?

How many hours a week do the two of you spend doing date-like things together.. just the two of you?


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## descarado (Mar 13, 2012)

> I should be happy that she's willing to do sex because she loves me.


my wife says the same thing too.

i HATE it when she says that. it makes it seem like sex is a chore, or a favor that she's doing for me, or some horrible sacrifice that had to be done.

dammit, it's supposed to be FUN for the both of us, and it galls me given my own experience and reading some of the entries here how many women think this way.

that's not to say us males get off scot-free, obviously.


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## Mistys dad (Dec 2, 2011)

Well, after reading your "I'm a nice guy" post, i am struck by the number of covert contracts you listed off.

Lots of approval seeking behavior, even in so very few words.

Might want to rethink the Man Up position. Try the Men's Clubhouse Man up and Nice Guy post.

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/mens-clubhouse/18181-man-up-nice-guy-reference.html


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## Avalanche (Mar 14, 2012)

EleGirl said:


> When was the last time you took your wife on a romantic date?
> 
> Last time for a romantic weekend or vacation?
> 
> How many hours a week do the two of you spend doing date-like things together.. just the two of you?



Oh man I hear you....we are both acutely aware of this. 

I'll be honest that I bristle a bit when asked when "I've" taken her out. Our relationship is very much 'we'. 

To answer that, it's been a while. We plan to go out for my birthday coming up this month. 

She is is mat leave and is drawing 1/2 of her wage, I work extra to make up for it. We don't have family support to 'dump' the kids onto. A weekend away without kids is simply impossible at this time. A night out isn't easy either. 

We're 'both' busy....WE would both love a break, but that isn't really in cards for us at the moment. 

Our 'together' time is after kids go to bed at 8 - 10. We race to reassemble the house so we can chill in front of the TV. Play crib or read the paper together once a month or so.


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## phantomfan (Mar 7, 2012)

Anything is possible. Hormones play a role and so does your attitude. Getting the wife who tells you your lucky for what you do get doesn't have the right attitude towards sex in marriage. She wouldn't dream of telling her children the are lucky what they get and refuse to do what they need. Too many women and some men use sex as a tool for manipulation or punishes by withholding. When you do that, ultimately the marriage suffers so it's a self defeating cycle that needs to be addressed. I've heard the same thing from my wife plenty of times. She doesn't get it at allot that would never be said. Just like I'm never going to tell her she's fat when she asks. My job is to make her feel good about herself and give her reassurance instead of rejection. If you can't make headway in the understanding dept, then it will be time to decide if you can live with it or need to take steps to shake things up. 

There are lots of ideas floating around here that may help. The one I'm trying is the 180. I'm working on me and being less available to her. I've been chasing my wife like a lost puppy. Thats not gotten me anywhere. Grand and small romantic gestures and affection, nada. I've eliminated the complaints on her side, still starving. What I haven't done until now is refuse to accept things as they are anymore or settle for week old oatmeal when I need a steak. If its hormones, there are creams that supposedly do help keep the lady parts working. For perspective, she has to change that on her own. You can do things to help give her perspective that also are good for you. Cleaning up yourself, losing 10 lbs, dong things that you enjoy, being a better person, etc never hurts a relationship. In my own case, I'm willing to admit that I'm not the man she married, ultimately I'm responsible for my own actions even though I do feel that I didn't become the present me all by myself. My wife didn't become the sex nazi completely on her own either. Don't give up, man up. Be the best you can be and don't settle for unhappiness.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Avalanche (Mar 14, 2012)

Mistys dad said:


> Well, after reading your "I'm a nice guy" post, i am struck by the number of covert contracts you listed off.
> 
> Lots of approval seeking behavior, even in so very few words.
> 
> ...



Interesting observation.....approval seeking behaviour really?? Sure, I do things that encourage our relationship...don't you? 

You imply, manipulation with that comment....not appreciated. 

I'll read through your list of links.


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## Jeff74 (Feb 11, 2012)

Glad the wriing was cathartic for you! I am sure you will get a bunch of suggestions and it is worth trying everything you can. Ultimately though there is a chance that things might not change but I hope they do. Wish there was a magic answer.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Mistys dad (Dec 2, 2011)

Didn't mean to imply manipulation.

I mean to make it a direct observation.

Read the links, be honest with yourself.

Read Glover's book (No more Mr. Nice Guy)

Go to Athol's site ( Marriedmansexlife.com )


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## diwali123 (Feb 17, 2012)

Is she nursing? Does she show any signs of post partum depression? Nursing makes your libido really low. I hated that part of it but I knew it was good for my child. 
She's probably exhausted and stuck in mommy mode. If you don't have any time away from your kids it gets to be really draining. I stayed home with my d for two years and it was just really hard. I felt like I wasn't part of the real world anymore. Changing diapers all day is such a turn off too. 
I hope that you are able to work this out. It sounds like she's trying to tell you her hormones are off, maybe if she's not nursing she needs to talk to her doctor. 
After my daughter was born it was a long time until I had fantasies or even thought about sex or men being attractive. Like I said I hated it but I couldn't change it.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## reddog1910 (Mar 8, 2012)

My guess is you guys need to sit down and talk about it. You don't need to get a professional involved in discussing what you two can do to spice things up a bit. I am on the other end where my wife has about a 1/10 of my sexual aplite. Sitting down and discussing what you can do always helped us. Here are a few suggestions of what you could do after you talk (would word for me); (1.) I love the hotel idea and you never know if you don't try (2.) video tape a sex session (3.) find a couple you don't know and play e-mail truth or dare. Each e-mail to that couple has a dare which involves sometime with nude pictures and a truth question which usually is asking for a story of some of your most intimate times. This game is fun and pretty harmless since you will never meet or even see that other couples face.


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## anotherguy (Dec 14, 2011)

Avalanche said:


> Oh man I hear you....we are both acutely aware of this.
> 
> I'll be honest that I bristle a bit when asked when "I've" taken her out. Our relationship is very much 'we'.
> 
> ...



You guys are fine. Welcome to the wonderful world of a busy life, maternity leave, working extra, and multiple kids. It was similar for us for a while... the damands of a new little one piled up with everything else just makes things....different. It will bounce back. Really.

Same as us - wo do not have much family nearby, so simply getting out of the freakin house once in a while was difficult. We eventually found a couple of ladies at daycare who fit the bill and we did that a few times. Of course... now your paying almost double sincce they have to watch 2...rolleyes.

My stance is.. be patient, try and enjoy it. Yeah the passion may wane a bit now... but it can rebound once the little one is out of diapers and isnt waking up in the night and you all start getting into a more 'normal' schedule. I think you are trying too hard. Part of the problem is that the stress of it can make you want to have more sex - and it may not be the case with her...which is fine.

Dont forget - it is a really, really precious time with the baby around. A few years from now you will be looking back on it as a blur and trying to remember some of it... (and sighing in relief at parts of it..)

I really hate the 'man up' and 'no more mr nice guy' crap so frequently pontificated around here - and so quickly. Assuming obnoxious stances and playing headgames to try and manipulate your spouse through emotional pressure to change the conditions of the 'game'. I think it is total BS. (and I will probably get skewered for saying so, by its afficionados.. shrug).

Maybe ok of your relationship is already totally dysfunctional... I think it more likely that your situation is that you have a 10 month old and you are simply going through growing pains as a family. If you are like us, or some of our friends that had similar relationship trajectories... you will come out the far side even better than before. Keep up the good work you seem to be doing.... and by the time your littlest one is 2 or 3, the 2 of you will get more chances to really focus on each other. Thats not 'throwing in the towel' for several years... thats just keeping things in perspective and as they should be. Sounds like you might be an aweome dad.. and believe me, wives find awesome dads irresistably sexy. Go ahead - take a mental poll of people and happy couples you know with kids.

'to do' list. So funny. My wife is a list maker.. and I know several others. Its like they take comfort in ordering their lives with lists. You are not alone, and dont sweat it too much.


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## anotherguy (Dec 14, 2011)

p.s..

I do think finding time together is important... especially if simply getting out once in a while seems difficullt or infrequent. We have been doing the anniversary thing for a long time... nothing big, just a weekend at a Bed and Breakfast somewhere. Couple dinners out. Walk or a hike in the woods. You may find several threads about that sort of thing around here... I think in the long term success forum.

I think we missed a year or 2 when we had infants... but otherwise we have stuck to it, and I kid you not... it is maybe the best thing we have ever done. Think about it. And the sex is always very, very good when we get the chance to just go away by ourselves. We even flew grandma in from out of state so she could watch the kids one time. 

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/long-term-success-marriage/36832-getting-away.html

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/long-t...you-celebrate-your-wedding-anniversaries.html


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## Enchantment (May 11, 2011)

Avalanche said:


> As she gets older, (we're in our 40's) she is becoming more and more....ummm, prudish, conservative, sexually uninterested.
> 
> I admit, many would be happy with my sex life, once a week minimum, but its becoming robotic. She is in a rut and I can't seem to talk her out of it. Wednesday at 10PM. Done by 10:30. We both orgasm, she's already thinking about the 'to do' list by the time I 'finish', sometimes talking about what's going on the next day within 30 seconds of my climax. (I always finish after her)
> 
> I've talked to her about this rut, and she says that its her hormones and I should be happy that she's willing to do sex because she loves me.


Hi Avalanche ~

Well, let's see. Your wife is in her 40's and your youngest is 10 months old. Yuk. I was there a few years ago - it's tough. Things do start changing in women in their 40's (their hormonal balance starts to fluctuate in the 40's making way for the wonderful change of life which typically hits in the early 50's) and when you're saddled with young kids and babies at that age, it can be rough on you physically and mentally. As such, you should encourage your wife to go to the doctor and make sure everything is medically okay - make sure her thyroid is okay, her frame of mind is okay (i.e., no depression), etc.

The next thing is that yes, you should communicate with your wife and try and express it to her in a way she may understand. But realize that communication does not need to involve just words. It involves your whole demeanour - your body language, your actions. And that could be where you may be falling flat.

Talking is of great importance, but in talking only what happens is that you hand over responsibility and control for what you would like to happen to your wife. You aren't assuming responsibility for the desired outcome that you would like.

I know you're saying - "but I can't make her DO it!" No, you can't. But you can control what you are doing and what you are willing to live with. You can LEAD her out of the parched wilderness.

MMSL - Married Man Sex Life (blog and book) is one method of doing so. So is NMMNG - No More Mr Nice Guy (which also has a book, forum, and an assessment test to see if you fit the parameters.) Heck, if you are religious, even the Bible gives you instructions on how to effectively lead. 

Best wishes.


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## Sawney Beane (May 1, 2011)

Enchantment said:


> I know you're saying - "but I can't make her DO it!" No, you can't. But you can control what you are doing and what you are willing to live with. You can LEAD her out of the parched wilderness.
> 
> MMSL - Married Man Sex Life (blog and book) is one method of doing so. So is NMMNG - No More Mr Nice Guy (which also has a book, forum, and an assessment test to see if you fit the parameters.) Heck, if you are religious, even the Bible gives you instructions on how to effectively lead.
> 
> Best wishes.


And if she doesn't want to be led?


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Avalanche said:


> I'll be honest that I bristle a bit when asked when "I've" taken her out. Our relationship is very much 'we'.


My question was to determine how much time the two of you actually spend together.. just the two of you. You are the one here asking so I worded it question the way I did. It was not to imply that you are responsible for all dates.
On the other hand.. most women love it when their husband comes up with a great date idea, makes all of the arrangements to include the baby sitter. This shows us that our husband really wants to do things with us.
I like to take turns.. like he asks me out and sets it all up. Then later I ask him out and I treat him (even though it’s our joint money.) The idea is that each of us took the time to do something special. 



Avalanche said:


> To answer that, it's been a while. We plan to go out for my birthday coming up this month.


What you are talking about Is that you want more passion in your marriage. To have a passionate marriage, the two of you need to spend about 15 hours a week doing couples only things. Put the children to bed early and spend 1-2 hours a night talking, snuggling, so forth. Plan a weekly date.
I know it’s hard to find the time together with your work and young children. But you have to if you want your marriage to remain a good marriage. All these marriages that you see that are dying… lack of couples time is one of the largest factors. And if you want your wife to be more passionate this is a HUGE factor.
You might not be able to get 15 hours a week every week with our children and you working extra. But you need to try to get it as close to that as possible.
There are ways to do this if you get creative. 



Avalanche said:


> She is is mat leave and is drawing 1/2 of her wage, I work extra to make up for it. We don't have family support to 'dump' the kids onto. A weekend away without kids is simply impossible at this time. A night out isn't easy either.


So a weekend away is not possible. But a weekly date it. One thing you can do is to get a baby sitter to watch the children while the two of you have an in-home date. This way you do not have to leave the children with someone you do not know well enough.
Many day care centers have evening and weekend hours for ‘date’ night. Many churches do this as well.
Your wife could join a play group with your children. She will meet other women there who are in the same boat as the two of you. This could grow into friendships in which you and the other couples trade off watching each other’s children to give each other time to get out.



Avalanche said:


> We're 'both' busy....WE would both love a break, but that isn't really in cards for us at the moment.


On an airplane they always say that if you are traveling with children, put your oxygen mask on first. Then put the mask on the child(ren) you are traveling with. Why? Because if you pass out the children have no one to take care of them and they will pass out and could die.
Marriage and family is like this. Today most parents put their children above their own relationship as you both seem to be doing. Your children need for you to put our marital relationship as the first priority. If you and your wife do not do this, our chance of either ending up in a very unhappy marriage, or in a divorce is very high. And then your children will suffer.
You can find ways to spend quite a bit of time together if you make that your priority.



Avalanche said:


> Our 'together' time is after kids go to bed at 8 - 10. We race to reassemble the house so we can chill in front of the TV. Play crib or read the paper together once a month or so.


So you spend 2 hours a night together after the kids go to sleep?


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## Trickster (Nov 19, 2011)

I think my wife and I are in the same place. Both of us usually put our daughter first. That is just the way it is. We have friends with a daughter the same age and we do a trade-out playdates. They don’t get out much either.

Like you, sex is routine and usually lacks passion. We even have to schedule sex. (which is working out)That is a recent development. I was passive in the past and I had to make a little change. For us we schedule in the morning after our daughter goes off to school. We are not as rushed then and my wife isn’t tired. It is slowly getting better.

I help out around the house like you do and that never turned on my wife...ever. I think you are doing all the right stuff already. Playing games may not be the answer like some have mentioned. Eventually the passion will come back. Keep doing what you are doing.

Sex in the morning before work is the best. I am happy all day!


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## confusedinlife (Mar 9, 2012)

if I got it once a week I would not care if it was robotic.....


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## Zatol Ugot? (Mar 5, 2012)

Avalanche,
Your title post says it...you're not alone. I too feel as though my marriage (especially the sex part) has fallen into the doldrums. I sometimes feel guilty for having the feelings that I do because I know that compared to others, I have it pretty good. My wife and I average sex maybe once every 8-10 days. We go through what I call the feast and famine cycle. We can have sex for 2 or even three days in a row and then nothing for 2 weeks. 

But its not even really the frequency as opposed to the lack of passion. We are also in our 40's. We only have one child that is basically an adult (20). We married young and had our son just a couple of years later. So we don't even have the excuse of a young one running around getting underfoot. It seems that life just gets in the way. I used get very upset about the lack of frequency and then the lack of passion/variety/fun/zing, whatever you want to call it. Lately, I've been too tired to worry about it. And THAT worries me. I don't want to be one of those couples that just slows down to the point where neither of us care about putting an effort into having passion in our marriage. But it seems like that is where we are headed if we don't make some changes.

We have both discussed this and agree that we need to focus a bit more on "us" and not let the normal wear and tear and stresses of life interfere but it is much easier said than done. Again, I sometimes feel guilty knowing that I don't have it that bad but I think it's just human nature to always want more.


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## Mr B (Feb 6, 2009)

It's normal, marriage is always a passion-killer sex-wise. Single people always have more passionate exciting sex than married people do. Especially people who have been married a long time.


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## Havesomethingtosay (Nov 1, 2011)

Two young kids, busy life, later parenting....... 1X/wk with a 10 month old...... Count your blessings, take a deep breath and ride out the lull...... 

Check back in 3-4 years....... 

Oh and stop writing love letters, how wimp, especially if not reciprocated......


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## shy_guy (Jan 25, 2012)

Mr B said:


> It's normal, marriage is always a passion-killer sex-wise. Single people always have more passionate exciting sex than married people do. Especially people who have been married a long time.


After the first two words, this is just simply not true. I will agree with the OP that they are not alone. However; even on a site like this where so many people with problems come, you don't have to look very far to see the rest of this post is simply not true.


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## Catherine602 (Oct 14, 2010)

Passion means what? It is difficult to give a good suggestion without specifics. What are you talking about when you say passion? I'll ask how you show passion and what are your expectations from your wife? Does she have the same definition of passion as you? Is love letter writing passion to you? Is it to her? 

My feeling is that you both have a lot on your plates. You just had a child 10 months ago and she has just been through a period of pregnancy and childbirth at a late stage in her life. How much more time does she have on maternity leave? When she starts up working full time again, it will probably effect you both even more with time and kids and work. . 

Perhaps if you review your expectations and look at what you both have on your plate right now, you may discover that you are both functioning at your maximum. You are depending on your wife to display passion. Is the passion for you to feel good about yourself? It sounds like you feel that you are giving more than she gives. 

Is that because you want more from her or is it true?. She may think that staying home to take care of a baby, giving up time in her career, and drawing 1/2 pay is a substacial contribution to the family. Equal to what you are doing. 

Woman are much less focused when they have sex than men. Many things intrude on the mind. My sugesstions is to read about female sexuality and strategies to decrease distracting thoughts and share that with her. Instead of trying to extract passion, why not help her focus for the sake of you both. You emphatically expressed your belief in the "we" of your relationship. If you reframe the passion you expect from her to make you feel good that is not we. 

You identified a problem - her inability to focus but the "we" somehow gets muddled. Think about it she needs your support to help her refocus.that benifits both of you. To ask her to make you feel good now when you both have not addressed the basic problem of her focus may be asking too much, don't you think? 

If it is about "we" make it so. When a problem comes up that effects you both, make it a team effort to solve. Don't count beans and decide you are on top, you will always feel you deserve more when you want something from someone. If you want something for both of you, you would not count beans and you would be in problem solving mode for you both.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## phantomfan (Mar 7, 2012)

Enchantment said:


> Hi Avalanche ~
> 
> Well, let's see. Your wife is in her 40's and your youngest is 10 months old. Yuk. I was there a few years ago - it's tough. Things do start changing in women in their 40's (their hormonal balance starts to fluctuate in the 40's making way for the wonderful change of life which typically hits in the early 50's) and when you're saddled with young kids and babies at that age, it can be rough on you physically and mentally. As such, you should encourage your wife to go to the doctor and make sure everything is medically okay - make sure her thyroid is okay, her frame of mind is okay (i.e., no depression), etc.
> 
> ...


The advantage for the man is if he leads the relationship out of the desert, its going to be a natural turn-on and she will have a lot of respect for you. Not to be sexist, but we are supposed to be the head of the household, not hiding behind our wives skirts and not taking care of business. I know I've been guilty of being that guy. Its part of what I'm changing about myself. I didn't tell her "dear, I'm going to be a man from now on". I'm just doing what I know a man would do. I'm wearing a virtual WWMD bracelet. I already notice a difference in my wife's attitude towards me. It doesn't matter if I'm right and she's wrong or vice versa. Once the relationship has gotten to that point, everyone is losing. My thoughts were, someone has to be the "man", mise well be "you".


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## DTO (Dec 18, 2011)

Avalanche said:


> Interesting observation.....approval seeking behaviour really?? Sure, I do things that encourage our relationship...don't you?
> 
> You imply, manipulation with that comment....not appreciated.
> 
> I'll read through your list of links.


Agree with you Avalanche. I don't think you are doing the approval-seeking behavior thing, and I don't perceive any covert contracts (where you do nice stuff for her hoping she will respond in kind).

My take is that you have told your wife what is lacking and what you would like to see happpen. Thus, your push for change is "overt" not "covert", and that makes all the difference.


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