# Now this really hurt and i asked for it



## beninneedofhelp (Nov 24, 2009)

This is a email i got from me and my wifes mutual friend that she dont no is still talking to me as much , now i asked her to call and talk to her to find out where she stands on things and it was short but also not something i wanted to hear maybe i am reading to much into it or something im not entirely sure , cause a week ago she was telling this same person she missed me didnt really want a divorce , wasnt sure on things and even wished i was there sometimes to hold her and comfort her , and after spending time with her step father and mother who by the way are both in there 3rd and 4th marriages (they like to run so she has seen that all her life and i dont think she is really thinking like this since everytime in our relationship something has gone wrong being her mistake or mine she runs and i chase and fight to work things out at all costs and i just wish for once she would stop running like this but anyways here is the email i got tonight it was short but i would love to hear lots of replies on this since im really considering taking different steps then i was and not just give her space but much more then just that.

i did speak to your wife, and we spoke, about life and stuff, she said at this time she could not get back with you, she wants to belive that things are diffrent but you guys seem to get along better just as friend,s that she could not say what would happen in 2 years but as of right know she could not, so ben i do not know what to say, an the kids started in and she had to go, i will talk to her again in about 2 days god be with you.

Now that is the email i got from the mutual friend. How should i take this ? Is there still hope to change that and stop her from filing still and work things out or atleast try to ? Or is there a message in there that i dont want to see or am not seeing or what ???Please for the moment bare with me and give me all the insight you can give from every aspect , i need it today so i can start making choices , or maybe i shouldnt make choices at all i dont no. 

One day things are looking up the next day she says something like this and its really driving me freaking mad and just tearing me up inside , right now im living at my parents house which is just a mess when i could have moved to a nice place a while ago and had my kids more often then i do now all because the wife said to this mutual friend """please tell him not to move that far cause its to far for the kids and then him and i wouldnt have that chance to work things out and i dont want that to happen """ so now im stuck here for a while atleast..... 
But please give me your thoughts on this and what you may think that means or if there is hope at still changeing that or what ....Im in desperate need of the advise tonight ......


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## beninneedofhelp (Nov 24, 2009)

Some one please respond im dieing to hear some advise exspecially from those that no my story and have been here for a while


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## nice777guy (Nov 23, 2009)

I don't think I'd read too much into it. It just sounds like she's really confused - not sure if that's really anything new or not.

But she hasn't filed yet? I think I'd read more into that than into the e-mail from your friend.

Not sure if I've helped, but I know how you feel when dying to get a response. Sure feels lonely "out here" sometimes.


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## beninneedofhelp (Nov 24, 2009)

sure does but on the hole not filing thing she says its cause of money now i will add this in that is what she says but i no for a fact due to a bank error where they sent her seperate account with our joint account statement she has had the money to do so plus i leave full access to my money in the bank to her as well and she uses that as well atleast suddenly she has been but i dont no she has her family believing there isnt no chance and then this after she said a lot different things the other week to the same person im trying not to read into things but i am doing what i shouldnt be probably right now and writing a very blunt letter to give to her about her always running in tough times instead of working through things and its always been that way , i really believe its do to what she has seen through her parents and there almost combined 10 marriages already......But yes please any thoughts on this stuff is great right now since im losing my mind and it does always seem lonely out here most the time to be honest


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## scarletblue (May 20, 2009)

Ben, 

I know how much you want this to work out between you and your wife. You have done so much to improve yourself and (hopefully) your marriage. I think there is always hope, but how long are you going to live in limbo?

I don't know your wife, but in ways it seems to me like she wants to keep you just hanging on until she makes up her mind. She's noticed the changes you've made and likes them, but says she isn't sure they'd be long term changes in your relationship? How is she going to see it in a relationship if she just keeps you hanging on the side?

I think you should start working on getting your own place. That would be good for you, your kids, and also show her how you are taking on responsibilities. Look for a short term lease if you want. Not to mention that she seems to really take notice when you look like you're starting to move on with your life.

Let her know that you still want your marriage to work, but you can't live in limbo, at your brother's, and the "friend zone" forever.


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## swedish (Mar 6, 2008)

I agree with scarletblue that you should start looking around for a place of your own. Don't use it as a 'threat' to your wife that you are moving on, but a sincere effort to start making some decsions on your own so she realizes if she chooses not to work on your marriage, you will need to make some choices for your future, too.

And, I do believe that she may have a real fear of you going back to your old ways if you should get back together. It is obvious you will be on your best behavior if you are trying to get her back...so that fear may be very real for her. Maybe seeing you get your own place and moving on yet still a man changed for the better will get her thinking about her decision.


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## scarletblue (May 20, 2009)

Squirsh2000 put it really well!


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## beninneedofhelp (Nov 24, 2009)

It is and i am for the most part but i do send a little reminder her and there that i still care and such , i will not cut her totally out but im really thinking of doing some other things and maybe unconventional methods , im not sure yet on that but i do no she is like night and day sometimes but mostly just like night , and i have a feeling she may need to find herself truely struggling or in need of my help more then she is now but we shall see , i guess ill try to hang in there and just wait it all out so far she still hasnt filed and im not entirely sure why not.
But the advise was sound and i am working on it just so much to do when i was kicked out with nothing but clothes and at the time we both were struggling on bills since then her father reduced her rent from a 1000 to 300 a month and that has helped her but it left me while i was there with nothing in the bank im now just getting to a point of having things again , and im presently waiting for her father to fall on his face cause he has way more on his plate then he can pay and that will force things even on my wife to look at which she isnt right now cause she still thinks she can pay for it all when in all reality its only cause she has gotten so much outside help which will not be able to last for ever .


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## Blanca (Jul 25, 2008)

squirsh2000 said:


> The only way to knock down that wall is to stop trying. I am working on myself mentlly and emotionally, taking care of myself physically, and making my little world the best world it can be. AND IT IS HARD TO DO ALL OF THE TIME!


:iagree:

squirsh has great advice. You've lost yourself in this, Ben. you are making decisions off of her emotions. that's not healthy, nor is it love. you cannot make her love you. you cannot mold your life into a flexible love trap. You have to find you again, and just be you and let the rest take care of itself. 

that doesnt mean you are giving up on her or your marriage. it means you are giving up on controlling her. take care of yourself, and let the rest take care of itself.


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## Atholk (Jul 25, 2009)

I think you have to stop talking to each other through this mutual friend. That's just not going to work.

As I had said on another thread before, I think you have to give her an ultimatum to allow you to an oppotunity to try and prove yourself a better man than when you had your earlier issues. Right now things are just going along in limbo, and don't appear to be getting any better or any worse. It's just dragging along in limbo, and will continue until someone puts a stop to it.

Ask for marriage counseling, ideally getting to live in the same house as her (though as I suggested before, offer not to be sleeping in the same bed unless she wants you back permanently), and generally get a shot at proving you're a better man. Own up to her that you think you screwed up big time before, but she's tying your hands now, and you think she is screwing up as badly now, as you were then.

If she won't even let you have a shot at repairing the damage.... just thank her for her time with you, wish her happiness, and leave. Cut the money off. Start the paperwork. 

That final snap of the wet towel as the money vanishes from the joint account may have an effect. But just as likely won't have any effect either.


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## lj2000 (Nov 24, 2009)

I don't know what you should do about the money. Especially with children involved. If you can afford to move to a small place close, I think you should do so and sign a short term, three month lease. You will feel more in control of your life. Feeling more in control of your life will help you make better decisions. Getting a short term place does not imply that you are not available to work on the marriage. I would not read too much into your wife's flip flopping. My husband has been flip flopping for almost six months. It's a nightmare, but it's a fact sometimes. Know that you do not have to live that way forever. You can set a time limit in your own mind on waiting and trying and you don't have to tell her what that time limit is.


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## lj2000 (Nov 24, 2009)

I think what a lot of people on here are trying to point out is try to be available and willing to work on it without going on her roller coaster ride. Let her go on that alone if at all possible. I'm having trouble making that happen too, so I know it's easier said than done.


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## lj2000 (Nov 24, 2009)

The "friend zone" thing seems weird. You might need to be available to the kids and less available to her. Seems she might not be getting to miss you enough right now. Is she the type to treat people like doormats if she is angry enough?


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## beninneedofhelp (Nov 24, 2009)

Hmm this is all good advise but at the same time i dont want her to think i am giving up on her either , i want her to see im still there and like you said the mutual friend thing sucks and it does and doesnt help it dont help cause she isnt talking to me , problem is when i try to talk she gets upset or mad and doesnt say the same things to me as she does the mutual friend she opens up to her for some reason and this friend is someone neither of us have met in life its a friend without a face kinda thing . But the friend does get her to open up and sometimes even manages to get her to take a step here and there problem is i sometimes stick to much of my foot in when she does and the wife slams the door again.

So the ultimatum idea is appealing exspecially after reading books like stop your divorce by homer mcdonald and divorce busters ebooks and a few others.. The one thing a lot say to do is spend the time with the kids take care of there needs act nice to the wife but dont give her anything dont give her gifts or let her no your thinking about her and let her think you moved on and most even say to date to show her you can but im scared that will back fire with mine , right now she doesnt want a relationship with anyone her mother made that clear unknowingly today when we were talking ,

yes i spend a lot of time with her family each week so i hear a lot of what she is doing and right now she dont seem to want any type of relationship since she has been in one for 10 years and since she was 16 and she tells the mutual friend she dont want to start till she is 100% sure about me either , but i am not sure how to take the last part due to the fact verbally she is done when speaking to me and stays closed off from me yet she still likes the fact i help and give her help and doesnt seem to be rushing to file or anything either some days with her are good some are really bad others are back and forth and yesterday with that email all though she spent a lot of time with her step dad and im sure that played a roll in it seem to be worse .

but the mutual friend seems to be the only one she talks to openly and only line i have right now on how she is feeling about things sadly enough. but i am starting to think i should still try but act as if it dont matter to me no more or something , not sure i will make that choice soon though i do no the friend will talk to her tomorrow since they made arrangements to talk , also on a side note the friend is a christian councelor that my wife dont no i am actually paying a bit too


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## lj2000 (Nov 24, 2009)

Do not date or make her think you are dating. I think it will definitely backfire. You can spend time with kids and give her only brief, positive attention in passing. I agree that gifts can be read as pressure and also cause her to treat you poorly and take you for granted if she's angry. I also think you are correct that if she comes from a family that divorces so many times that could put you at risk. Divorce is a normal solution in her family; she may not know or even be able to picture how to fix things because they never taught her. She may get over living "single" for awhile without going on to date too if you do not pressure her. I don't know if ultimatums work on people who are very angry. I doubt they do. Especially if it is true that you did mess up in some real way. They need time to see that you have fixed yourself and to get over it.


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## lj2000 (Nov 24, 2009)

Maybe spend less time with her family if possible and stop telling them all your business and being a totally open book. They are reporting back on you. It is like she knows every last thing you are doing and you know very little about her life. This is not a fair situation. It makes her very comfortable being your "friend" when her family is keeping tabs on you.


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## scarletblue (May 20, 2009)

As far as her financial situation crumbling. You don't want her back because she HAS to or NEEDS to. You want her to come back because she WANTS to.


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## beninneedofhelp (Nov 24, 2009)

this is interesting advise do you really think her family is tabbing me up for her and that makes it easy for her to be a friend ? And im sure right now she is not so happy my letter to her that i left and with a message on the answering machine was kinda a challenge to her in a odd way , i told her she ran from things always which is true no matter if it was my fault or hers , i told her she was ruining things now and i told her i stand ready , i was blunt about it all i even told her she thinks we get along better in her mind as friends only cause that is all she allows when it would be no different together i told her she was the one stopping things from being better and then i also let her no i wasnt mad just disapointed in her that i appreciated the things she has done and does for me and that i was and will always still be there and pointed out the fact we have kids together and that will always keep us as a family in reality , but i told her she wouldnt listen or read any of this cause her pride and fears and stubborness will not let her do it or see any of the truth i put in there cause her pride will blind her.. I wounder if she will read it or not i really do or if that was the totally wrong thing to do , but i do wounder if you are right on her family keeping tabs on me for her and such.... i will have to sit here and think on that for a few minutes


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## beninneedofhelp (Nov 24, 2009)

scarletblue said:


> As far as her financial situation crumbling. You don't want her back because she HAS to or NEEDS to. You want her to come back because she WANTS to.


Id agree with that but i no she wants to but is scared to that much i no for certain , she thinks she cant afford to get hurt again and dont want to be hurt again , she just doesnt see that im truthful and truely sincere in this and that she wouldnt if she opened that door , but financially right now she dont think she needs me and that is big on her mind her need of me is something she dont see yet but if it lets me get close ill take what it is as it is and build from there for that is closer then it is now and my kids alone are worth building a foundation even if i am the only one doing it to start with. So if its a in that maybe she dont like at first she will soon see with time she may just like it more then she thought . You see or understand what i mean there and is it wrong or shameful ???


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## scarletblue (May 20, 2009)

Yes, I see what you mean and understand it. Not the ideal outcome, but a start I guess.

What if you keep putting the money in the bank, let her know you have it if she needs it, but take her name off the account. If she can dip into it whenever she wants, she may not see it as you helping her out as much as if she had to ask for it.

Call her and tell her that you're getting this or that for the kids, and ask if there is anything she needs. At least she would have to talk to you and shut you out a little less? Just a thought.


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## scarletblue (May 20, 2009)

Be weary of the family too. They may have good intentions, but if they are telling you stuff about her, then you know they are telling her stuff about you.


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## beninneedofhelp (Nov 24, 2009)

Good points and i will take that advise for sure seems logical i may even play the family to get her to think im having more fun then i really am cause honestly i dont have to much without my family i miss my kids so much its unreal to be honest , im perfectly content rolling around on the floor with my son and daughter i have not just grown into a better man and father but have also grow so close to my kids from this it hurts more now then it did to start , i sometimes wounder if i wouldnt have woke up and actually tried if i would be this emotionally attached to them now i no i was growing closer with the son as he got older and was able to do more but now i find i spend just as much time with my younger daughter something i didnt do with my son as a baby and i enjoy it so much but get so little time with them to do it and when i started this new job it was great that i got one exspecially one that pays so well but it took more of my time from them and i have so little as is , still no court deals with anything for the kids as of yet so im still playing that card on her rules all though im going to force that to change due to circumstances she has to get use to it anyways im just scared it will push her to act faster without thinking about things so im hesitant on pulling that trigger


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## Atholk (Jul 25, 2009)

beninneedofhelp said:


> also on a side note the friend is a christian councelor that my wife dont no i am actually paying a bit too


Oh seriously stop that nonsense. Your _professional _counselor just shouldn't be a real life friend to both of you and running backwards and forwards between the two of you spilling the beans. Your wife is going to be pissed beyond all reason once she finds out that you have been getting information from this counselor. If a licensed Marriage and Family Therapist did that they would quite possibly get in trouble with their license to practice if that was ever caught. Stop that right away.

I know this sounds unfun and you want her back, but just accept that you can't force her to take you back. What you can do though, is force her to come to a decision on whether or not she's going to allow you to have a chance at earning your way back.

Find a new marriage counselor as well. One where you both go.


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## beninneedofhelp (Nov 24, 2009)

No i was just pointing out that she is a councelor in real life the wife knows that part of it just dont no the other part of it and will at some point since i will tell her exspecially if she asks but at the moment she is acting as a friend to both of us and slowly trying to help her with my wifes pains and hurts yet give her strength to try one more time, not trying to force trying to work things out of a hole sadly i have to play this card right now and it does go back and forth . But your right she could but the wife knows she tells me these things which is odd i no , and that is were it gets twisted cause the wife cant or wont tell me these things but will cry on her shoulder and talk openly with her not me but this person is also a old friend of mine and now a friend of hers , its complicated to explain but its the only card i have right now on getting through to her so yes i am useing it that way and i have tried the counceling thing with the wife she refused so she has it now but dont even no it really , kinda messed up i no huh? But it does help with her emotions and her actually doing things if not for this person Xmas would have been done so differently with only one parent present as it turned out we both were and both had a good time doing it also including Xmas shopping which she was bound and determined to do it by herself then this person got her to try it not once but twice and both times was also good so in a way there small steps but they give us time together i just got to make sure that its good time together , so again its not forced its challenging her to try she still can say no and she knows this


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## beninneedofhelp (Nov 24, 2009)

sorry by the way just incase if you were upset almost seemed like it , we all find the help were we can and right now that mutual friend who happens to be a councelor is helping in ways i cant get through to her with , and in the end its my wifes choice i can only provide what i can to help and hope that it gets better instead of worse


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## beninneedofhelp (Nov 24, 2009)

Well its the new year now and i woke up to my wife calling to wish me a happy new year and have another one of them good talks. Even talked about what to do tomorrow on my Bday.. For a women who says were done she sure dont seem like it at times , i mean why call me first thing in the morning ???

I mean last night she decided not to stay at home or do anything with me , she went out with her girlfriend and was home by 1230 at night which really surprized me cause she told my sister and im sure she knew my sister would tell me she was already home , then she calls me in the morning after i found out she changed her plans and more or less blew me off for the night i broke down like a emotional punk or something and asked her are we still holding to our vows and of course she started off defensive and mad that i would ask that , and said cant i go out with my friends and not do nothing like that ? Yes she says im living to my vows and will continue to do so and went on for a minute about me asking her something like that.. 

So i really figured i pushed my luck last night and thought for sure she would not call or anything either but low and behold she calls this morning happy at that and was really friendly my father just laughed at me and said it wont be long son it wont be long ... Yet i still feel like there is hope yet i just dont see it , can my own feelings and fears be blinding me to the fact she really dont want this to be over and she is waiting for me to do something or show something or is she just trying to be nice at the same time as the situation goes on or what ??? 

I mean i really figured as mad as she got when i asked that last night she wouldnt want to talk for days and here she is waking me up in the wee hours of the morning to call and say happy new year and talk friendly and such.. Is that really someone who is done or is there more to this then i understand ??
This man is one confused person right now and dont no which way to lean or think starting to wonder if i should be thinking at all anymore or what. And really wondering why she called is she just not sure what she wants and is keeping me around or leading me around is she wanting her space and independance and still want me there too like she wants her cake and eat it too type of thing or what in the world should i think ?? Bah so frustrated with this i just try and try and do and do and keep on being a better person but is it effecting her at all i mean she says she sees the changes and likes them even what does it take to get through that wall she has up ? i can only hope for some thoughts on this and hope maybe others see what i am not seeing for i feel like i am missing something or maybe i dont realize something in all of this , i just cant figure things out and it drives me crazy , ive always been a person that once i discover what is wrong i look for solutions and relentlessly i feel i found them and done everything i can but i dont understand her right now and what she is doing it just seems like she goes back and forth without ever saying anything one way or the other .... Maybe i am not seeing it or realizing the truth of things maybe im reading to far into things . I just dont see why she contacted me today after last night and my big mouth having to ask questions like that that i knew would upset her and did .


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## beninneedofhelp (Nov 24, 2009)

lj2000 said:


> The "friend zone" thing seems weird. You might need to be available to the kids and less available to her. Seems she might not be getting to miss you enough right now. Is she the type to treat people like doormats if she is angry enough?




Yea she is that type but i have never been on the receiving end of it not once in my entire life now i sit here right now on my Bday reading a thread i started wondering what im to do to get my family back as a hole and patch things up before its to late sadly i also realize i have no control in it right now..


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## beninneedofhelp (Nov 24, 2009)

Thing is i made the changes cause i knew they were needed but i didnt make them till she hit me with the anvil , sadly it took that for me to see what was wrong so the changes i made are for me but also for my family friends and her , but she sees them likes them yet isnt willing to try so far it seems i really dont no , but i do no i sent her flowers and a love you miss you hard to be apart card , and she did put them in a vase and has the card sitting out on her stove she had me go let the dog out just a little while ago so i seen that sitting out and on her computer which is right by the stove she left that on and had my myspace pic up on it for some reason , its things like this that make me wonder what is going on in her head if she is done with me why is she searching me on her computer and why is she keeping my flowers and cards ?? And no i didnt have to snoop to find this out i gave up doing that long time ago , but being asked to let the dogs out and being there at the house and seeing them things makes me wonder if its a good sign or bad sign?


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## beninneedofhelp (Nov 24, 2009)

what a Bday im sitting around here hoping to hear from her and wishing she said something good to me today, yet i doubt i will and im letting myself think on what i seen this morning while letting the dog out at the house.....And cant help but to wonder is what i seen good or bad


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## beninneedofhelp (Nov 24, 2009)

why am i still sitting here


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## beninneedofhelp (Nov 24, 2009)

Thanks for the advise and its sound advise i just cant seem to not wonder for some reason i dont understand if she is so done with me why she keeps the flowers and displays them keeps the cards reads my letters still and is searching me on myspace like she did it makes me think there is hope i guess and if it is why dont she say it why does she act so cut off and stuff it drives me crazy. Or i guess in this im driving myself crazy.


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## lj2000 (Nov 24, 2009)

Be less available for her every whim and see if that helps. Do the work, errands, financial, and childcare stuff you agreed to and want to do. Stop visiting her family and telling them what you do with your free time. Stop posting what you do with your freetime on Myspace. Don't even log in to Myspace for a week. Be respsonsible, don't date, but do not be on a leash for a woman who won't commit to working on your relationship at this time even though you ARE working on it. Spend time with male friends doing constructive things and this will help you stop obsessing. She will also then get to experience what it is like not to have you drop everything to run over there any second just to check up on you. This doesn't seem fair for you to be an open book for months when you are not allowed the same peek into her life. It might be allowing her to enjoy dragging her feet, especially if she has been known to treat people she is angry with like a doormat.


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