# Maybe I’m just paranoid...



## MDYankee70 (Oct 25, 2020)

I have been married since 2018 and I love my wife very much. This is my second marriage and I was upfront about the cheating (on both sides) that went on in my first marriage. I was clear that I wanted to do it right this time.

Last year, I started to become slightly suspicious that she may have been up to some shenanigans. Whenever I would bring up the subject she would say things like “the cheater always assumes he/she is being cheated on...” So, I would let it go.

One night, she was out and I got onto her laptop as I often did since I didn’t own a laptop of my own. First, I found pictures of her in lingerie that she sent to an ex-bf after we got married. She was not naked, but she was in a very sexy negligee and I was disappointed to say the least.

I kept going and discovered more. Before we got married, this same ex-bf came to her apartment to hang out. She was honest and told me it was happening. I wasn’t thrilled, but she kept telling me that I had no reason not to trust her. So, I discovered a conversation they had that night after he left. What grabbed my attention first was him saying “now I smell like you.” I kept going and I came to the following conclusion. He came over and, at some point, started to masturbate in front of her. He smelled like her because he used her lotion on his member. He did not go to completion however. He said, next time I hope to cum for you. She replace that what they did was “way to close” because “things with my boyfriend are going really well right now.” My logical conclusion was that, in her mind, if things hadn’t been going well, she thought it was ok to do what they did.

Besides this ex, there is another guy who I discovered was more than just a longtime family friend which was how she initially described him to me. He is 10 years my junior, and, before we even met, she gave him a blowjob to completion in her bed. She talked about it while messaging with him after it happened and, the way she described it, was material of XXX rating. Now that was before we met, but the only thing that bothers me is that she would always just say that “there’s nothing to worry about with G, he’s just a longtime family friend!” After we were together, I found some messages that described some questionable behavior. On a trip to Florida after we were married, she had a conversation with him and asked him how he seemed to really enjoy looking at her tan lines. Earlier this same night, her and I were on FaceTime and we masturbated for each other. It would seem that right after this, she got on FaceTime with G. Another conversation talked about how they saw each other at an event and he asked her if she felt his hard on pressing up against her when they hugged. He also mentioned that he was so horny just sitting next to her that he was tempted to go to the men’s room and relieve himself by masturbating.

There were other odd things that I found. For example, the first time we dated, we broke up after a few months because I was going through a hard time with depression and I didn’t want to drag her down with me. She would constantly text me and try to make me jealous and also show that she was still being faithful to me. For instance, one time she claimed that her Ex had said that he wanted to come over for one of her amazing blowjobs in her hot tub. She told me she totally blew him off and said “how dare he!” make such a request. Well, come to find out, he actually DID come over that night and she gave him an amazing blowjob in the hot tub.

She also dated a couple of guys while we were broken up. I didn’t have a problem with this because, well, we were broken up. One such guy was a musician. Shortly after we got back together, she was telling me how she gets really angry at men when they treat her like a *****. For example, this musician fellow wanted a blowjob in his car after a show that he had performed in. She said to me that she got very angry with him and left him in his car, saying “I may be a lot of things, but I’m not your *****.” That was the version she gave to me...during my “investigation” however, I found that the truth was she did give him a blowjob in his car AND that she allowed him to go down on her and give her oral as well. Why would she lie about something like this? If anything, had she told me, I would have thought it was hot. After all, we weren’t together so I was not jealous at all. To me it shows she was deceitful even when there was absolutely no reason for her to lie.

Another discovery was another tall tale that she told me. When we first started dating, we would tell each other salacious stories to turn each other on. I was completely open and told her how I was a swinger for a time and had threesomes and moresomes a few times. She offered that one night, a black guy with a huge c—- came to her house and while her Dad was away on a trip and she proceeded to give him a blowjob even though she could hardly fit all of him into her mouth. She also said that he had her in the doggy style position at one point and started hitting her ass with his belt. I was turned on. A few days later I mentioned to her how hot that story was and she responded that “I totally made it up honey, because I saw how hot it made you.” Well, guess what? It was not a myth it was true. In fact, he wasn’t some random hookup. He was a guy she had a relationship with and she would send him tons of nude pictures almost every day. Again, this all happened BEFORE we got together so why lie??

I know I am being extremely verbose, but there is so much to unpack. Currently, she has more guy “friends” then girl friends and they are all, according to her, totally platonic. She does not think of them in a sexual way at all. There is one such guy that she considers the older brother she never had. Well, one day, out of the blue, she admitted that years ago, her and this platonic brother went skinny dipping one night and, since they were already naked, they decided to have sex. She told this to me directly, so it wasn’t about deceiving me. It did make me question what these platonic relationships with guys actually entail. Another small thing I found was a message she sent to this same guy on Fat Tuesday while her and I were broken up. She sent him a picture of her naked breasts with the caption “Happy Fat Tuesday.” He replied that her breasts were still amazing and he misses them. Again, not platonic under me definition.

So, we come to the end of this Odyssey. I think I need to confront her about all of these things. I love her, but they bother me way too much. Especially since, when I do ask her what she is doing when she is secretly typing away on her phone she always says “Have I ever ever given you a reason to think I have been unfaithful?! Just because you are probably messing around, doesn’t mean I am!” I can understand her being annoyed that I don’t trust her, but the projection that I must be cheating on her seems odd. I want to bring this all up to her, but I’m afraid it’s almost guaranteed it will end in divorce. I did bring up the pictures she sent to her ex (the red lingerie ones) and she flipped out. She forced me to drive to my parents’ house over 90 minutes away because she was so mad that I had snooped. The big sin was not her doing what she did, but me snooping. This was after she first tried to convince me that I did not actually see what I think I saw. That she never did it and that I needed “mental help.” Not very cool when I do actually suffer from depression. The next morning I actually sent her a copy of one of the pictures that I had forwarded to myself and asked “now am I just delusional?” She immediately apologized and asked me to come home and begged me to forgive her. She seemed genuinely remorseful. To me, it completely made it a non-issue once she apologized the way she did. But, whenever we get in an argument and I bring it up, she always responds with “I did ONE bad thing and you are STILL bringing that up after all this time?!?!” Uh, just to be clear, this confrontation occurred a mere month or two ago.

I do love her so very much. I think she is beautiful and intelligent and kind and many good things. But, I can’t help but think after discovering what I did, that she also has another side to her. A dark side. A side that cheats and has no remorse about doing so. I want to confront her so badly and I feel like I need to for my own piece of mind. What scares me is that I can almost guarantee that it will lead to a huge fight and divorce. I don’t want that. But, does that mean I have to accept and bury all of reactions to what happened above? I am in a very difficult spot and I just need some advice. Am I wrong for snooping in the first place and, therefore, anything I found does not matter because my original sin was snooping in the first place? Are any of the events described above not as bad as I have made them out to be? I didn’t find any messages that made it clear that she had sex with someone after we had been together. The closest to naked she ever got was when she watched her ex-BF masturbate on her couch. So, should I just assume she hasn’t ever actually cheated and just move on? I am so torn emotionally. When we get along, I love her to death. I would do anything for her. But, when we argue and she starts attacking me because she has never given me a reason to think she has been anything but totally faithful and that I am the one that probably cheated on her at some point. For the record, on the lives of my children, I never cheated on her. In fact, since we met in May 2017, I have never been with another woman. Never. When women have presented the opportunity to me, I decline.

So, can anyone help? Do I confront her with all of this and risk losing her? Or do I let it slide?

One last note that always sticks with me. When we first met, we fell head over heels for each other. We spent as much time together (and usually naked) as we could. One night that we were not together, it seems that her Ex came over and they had sex. When she was talking to him about it afterwards she said “R said I was glowing when he saw me in a picture this morning. Little does he know why I’m glowing! But, what he doesn’t know won’t hurt him and we can get away with this stuff. After all we have been through in life, we deserve to do whatever makes us feel good.” Discovering that, is just more proof to me that she has been unfaithful to me since the very early days of our relationship. We DESERVE to get away with this kind of stuff is an absolutely sociopathic way of thinking.

Ok, story over. What do I do? Thank you for your time everyone.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

Sadly it sounds to me as if she has no moral values, no boundaries with men, and she cheats and lies. Is this the woman you want to spend the rest of you life with?


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## C.C. says ... (Aug 1, 2020)

This is just a curious question, but why would you use your first post ever to drag her while simultaneously posting her picture as your avatar? What if someone recognizes you guys? I bet she’d be seriously pissed off. I’d be more paranoid about that than anything else.


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## MDYankee70 (Oct 25, 2020)

C.C. says ... said:


> This is just a curious question, but why would you use your first post ever to drag her while simultaneously posting her picture as your avatar? What if someone recognizes you guys? I bet she’d be seriously pissed off. I’d be more paranoid about that than anything else.


Thank you. Changed.


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## C.C. says ... (Aug 1, 2020)

It’s probably best you know? You just never know who might know you guys. Could get embarrassing and into slander territory.

As far as your wife, wow.

Why did you marry her in the first place? Was she _that_ good in bed? What else could it be? And I ask myself why did she marry you when she knows that this is how she is. Do you have a lot of money, perhaps? 

This is really sad.  I’m sorry this has happened. I see guys all the time falling into a mess like this and I just don’t get it. Were you so extremely lonely that you thought she was just going to change her leopard spots?

Why does she say to her side piece that she “deserved” to have him? Have you done anything that could be seen as deserving of retaliation?

She sounds like a user and very in need of a man’s validation to feel ok. Sorry to be badmouthing her like that but usually when someone calls to light what they see in a partner like this in one of these posts, they are told that they don’t know her. “She’s fantastic” and all that. So it’s hard to give advice because you know and I know, you probably don’t really want to hear it.

You’ve been married for 2 years only? Is that right? My advice is to leave her. Don’t you think that _you’re_ deserving of someone that will love you back with the same kind of loyal intensity that you show her?


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## TheDudeLebowski (Oct 10, 2017)

"One night, she was out and I got onto her laptop as I often did since I didn’t own a laptop of my own"

Horse spit! You got on there to snoop around and dig up something. Now, you followed a gut feeling, but I think by the time the snooping starts, the relationship is already toast. Regardless of what is found or not found. 

You want to live the rest of your life like that? Even if you found nothing, you want to live your life snooping around and in constant distrust of your partner? Sounds like a **** life.


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## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

Get out now. You haven't been married that long.

This is her nature.


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## manfromlamancha (Jul 4, 2013)

I think you already know what to do but don't want to face doing it without someone here nudging you in the right direction. I think you know that there is no doubt that she has cheated and will continue to do so. Lets be clear as to what she is like (and I would not start with kind and nice etc.

She is

a (serial) cheater
a liar
amoral
unfaithful
disloyal
disrespectful
ugly on the inside
narcissistic
self-entitled

etc etc

This is not a list of qualities that you would want in a friend leave alone a wife!!!

She seems to have the ability to manipulate you into doubting yourself. That is what you really need to work on and probably need help on. The rest is easy - dump her asap. You haven't been married that long. And you do not need to give her any reason. Just like she didn't keep you informed as to why she was screwing around.


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## Oldtimer (May 25, 2018)

Platonic, I don’t think so. Many of the previous posters said it best. GTFO. Married a short time, no kids, obviously you lack trust. Personally and I only speak for myself, reading all that **** you just went through would be the dealbreaker for me.
I do understand a little turn on for some of the things she talked about, but I also have an inkling of retroactive jealousy. Unfortunately I believe it’s more than retroactive jealousy.

Heed the warnings of some of those who have been here before.

I do wish you the best


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## Lostinthought61 (Nov 5, 2013)

You know deep down that you really can’t trust her, and rightly so based on historical data...honestly you don’t need to put your faith in some who is expert at deception


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## MDYankee70 (Oct 25, 2020)

Diana7 said:


> Sadly it sounds to me as if she has no moral values, no boundaries with men, and she cheats and lies. Is this the woman you want to spend the rest of you life with?





Diana7 said:


> Sadly it sounds to me as if she has no moral values, no boundaries with men, and she cheats and lies. Is this the woman you want to spend the rest of you life with?


I begrudgingly agree with you and that’s another huge part of the problem. I hate hypocrisy and when she gets on her high horse and talks about how moral and honest she is, it drives me crazy because I know what I know. I just have to rip off the band aid and let her go, as they say.


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## MDYankee70 (Oct 25, 2020)

C.C. says ... said:


> It’s probably best you know? You just never know who might know you guys. Could get embarrassing and into slander territory.
> 
> As far as your wife, wow.
> 
> ...


Agreed, it would be a nightmare and thank you for pointing it out to me. As for slander, it would be libel (written), but it must be a false statement. Truth is an absolute defense to a libel claim.
Well, she actually is fantastic in bed (in hindsight, that should have been a hint. 

I make a decent living, but, honestly, she needed health insurance. Let me explain. She has physical limitations that have made it impossible for her to work. She is on SSDI from the government. When Trump got elected, one of the things he did was raise the premiums for the ACA. I stated, because I did truly love her, that we should get married.This was in June or July of 2018. At first she blew it off as a joke, which was fine with me since I have always had all this background noise about her in my head. Anyway, her premiums were due to go up in January 2019, and in November 2018, she asked me to marry her. I was shocked because of her original reaction back when I asked in July, but I said yes and we got married in December 2018. So, it’s not that I have money, it’s that I provide something she so desperately needs. Which, I’m happy to do and I believe a husband should do, but for all this other stuff.

I was never clear about the “deserving” part, other than her mentioning all the things they had been through. I had only been with her for maybe a few weeks, so, I’m not saying I’m a saint, but I hadn’t even had time to f- anything up that would cause her to retaliate. One thing I forgot to mention was that this side piece was actually dating a good friend of hers when they first met. She claims they waited to get together a full year after they broke up, but I’m not sure that’s entirely truthful. Especially since she told me he was after her from the minute he saw her. I know that they were together when her mother died and she has always said that he was there for her during such an awful time. While I can appreciate that, it’s what a boyfriend is supposed to do during a difficult time. He’s been given way too much credit for just doing what he was supposed to do. One last thing about SP is that he has an extremely large member. I know because she brought it up when we first started dating (warning sign) and because I’ve seen pictures of it on her phone. Which reminds me, she still has naked pictures of other men on her phone. The one time I saw them, I asked why she would still have pictures of other naked men on her phone and she was just annoyed that I was making it an issue. “Why don’t you trust me?”

This is all hard to read, but, I am extremely grateful that you and everyone else took time to respond to me with thoughtful responses. I am so glad to have found such a community. What does upset me very much is that I cannot say “You just don’t know her..” to anyone who may question us being together. Especially not when I’m the one who is doing the questioning as well. I feel guilt and obligation whenever I do think about leaving her, but I have to decide if that guilt of leaving her alone and sense of obligation to my wife means that I can handle her indiscretions and maybe even condone them. If that’s the case, that’s all on me and I better stop complaining about it and do something.


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## MDYankee70 (Oct 25, 2020)

TheDudeLebowski said:


> "One night, she was out and I got onto her laptop as I often did since I didn’t own a laptop of my own"
> 
> Horse spit! You got on there to snoop around and dig up something. Now, you followed a gut feeling, but I think by the time the snooping starts, the relationship is already toast. Regardless of what is found or not found.
> 
> You want to live the rest of your life like that? Even if you found nothing, you want to live your life snooping around and in constant distrust of your partner? Sounds like a **** life.


While it is true that I did use her laptop often, it is probably more than likely true that I did what I did because I suspected something. There was just something that was off. I had seen, and heard, enough to make me suspicious. One thing I also forgot to mention in my above version of War and Peace was that we were together one night and her phone went off. I glanced and it was a text from the infamous “family friend.” It read “OMG! That looks so beautiful. Thank you!” or something like this. I was intrigued to say the least so I clicked on it to see what he was responding to and, much to my horror, he was responding to a picture I had taken on her phone of her most private...uh, how can I put this without being vulgar...her pink flower. At the time I took the picture, it was obviously a private moment to show her how swollen her flower was from being so used and...well, you get the picture. So, from early on, I knew something was off but, I suffer from both depression and hypomania (BP2) and I was definitely in the midst of a hypomanic episode. I wanted so badly to confront her right away about it, but I didn’t. When I did finally mention something about it over a year or so later, her response was that I was remembering it all wrong. That we were broken up at the time (I’m pretty sure we had only been dating for a few weeks, and, while highly doubtful, I could be off on the time line) and that once we were broken up, she could show whatever she wanted to whomever she wanted. That seemed very slutty to me. I can’t think of a better word for it. So, just because we were broken up (probably not the case), you can show a guy your most intimate parts? If she was right and we were broken up, we spent the night together so we were clearly trying to get back together. Her timeline doesn’t make sense. It doesn’t pass the smell test. Again, even if it did, am I puritanical and a controlling person to think that she really shouldn’t be sending pictures like that to anyone other than a boyfriend? I’m no prude, but it does seem like a bridge too far.

You have all been very kind to me, so I must be very honest with you. Yes, you are right, I wasn’t just innocently using her laptop, I suspected something. I also think you have a valid point that, once you decide you need to snoop, the relationship is over. The trust is already gone. As sad as it my sound, I have snooped on every woman I have ever been with at some point since I separated from my wife 11 long years ago (including my wife while we were married) except for two. One was the woman I first started seeing when I first got separated. I met her on a dating site and she was honest from the get. She made it clear that she just thought I was a funny guy with a great personality, but she would probably never meet my parents or my kids. I was totally ok with that. We dated for only about 6 months and we had an absolute blast. Ironically, she ended up taking me with her to meet her family and friends from her hometown after she bought us tickets to a Steelers game. It was fun, but I never snooped. Mostly because she made it clear what she was looking for from the beginning. Looking back, I probably should have tried to work it out with her. I never felt a reason to snoop and I always felt confident around her. One night she called me around 2 am to ask me to come and pick her up at a bar in Baltimore and take her home because she had gone out to dinner with a friend and her friend had hooked up with this guy who was also with a buddy of his. Anyway, her friend kept trying to get my girlfriend and this other guy to get together so that she could go hook up with her guy. She called me and I still remember what she said “Please come get me. A is trying to set me up with this guy and I don’t want to be with him, I want YOU!” She always acted tough in front of me, but I could tell she was scared and just wanted to get out of an awful situation. Looking back, maybe her “tough guy” act was really just a shield because she had also just gotten separated from her husband also. Anyway, I went and got her and she was so grateful that I was her knight in shining armor. But I digress.

The other woman I never snooped on was actually a devout Christian who was a Sunday School Teacher. She would take me to her church every Sunday. I’m not a very religious guy, but I was raised RC and this church was not that. It was one of those speaking in tongues kind of places. Anyway, I never felt the need to snoop because it was as clear as they day is long that she would never do anything disrespectful towards me or our relationship. Even if the reason was that she was afraid God would punish her for doing so, I didn’t care. I just knew deep down she would never ever do anything disrespectful to me behind my back. We just ended up breaking up because she was way too religious for me and she wouldn’t have sex until we were married or, at least, engaged. I was not looking to marry anyone at that time.

Anyway, I’m just trying to be transparent. I am a snoop. As soon as I get an inkling of something going on, I investigate and, unfortunately, I’ve been right every single time. I’m sure some people would think I’m an a-hole for snooping in the first place (I would especially be interested about what women think of the whole “he snooped and caught me cheating, but he should have never snooped in the first place!” argument. Anyway, I’m rambling again. Sorry.

The point is that I need to remember that I can be in a loving, comfortable relationship where I can be completely confident that my partner is not doing anything untoward. She would never disrespect me like that. I’ve had it before and I don’t think I can have it with my wife. I just think too much has happened.


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## MDYankee70 (Oct 25, 2020)

Livvie said:


> Get out now. You haven't been married that long.
> 
> This is her nature.


Good advice for sure. Thank you.


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## MDYankee70 (Oct 25, 2020)

manfromlamancha said:


> I think you already know what to do but don't want to face doing it without someone here nudging you in the right direction. I think you know that there is no doubt that she has cheated and will continue to do so. Lets be clear as to what she is like (and I would not start with kind and nice etc.
> 
> She is
> 
> ...


You’re absolutely right. I know exactly what I should and need to do for my own self respect. I’ve always had a problem with allowing people (especially women I was with) to mistreat me. It’s something I need to start therapy for and immediately.

I also did want a “push” from all of you, but, as insane as it my sound, I wanted to see if anyone on this planet (or at least) in this group, would read my story and say “What she did was not a big deal at all. You should be ashamed for snooping and you have absolutely no right to judge her.” I think if even one person thought that, I would reconsider where I am leaning on this whole catastrophe of a relationship. It’s mainly because, when I do bring up the pictures she sent to the ex, one of her explanations is that “I am so sorry I did it, but how long are you going to hold it against me and, if that’s the worst thing I’ve done, can’t you see you still really don’t have a reason not to trust me?” It’s this whole manipulation that I’m the crazy one making up fantasies about what she’s up to all day while I’m at work. She keeps asking if I think she’s “****ing some dude during the day. Do you have CAMERAS in here?!” These reactions are way too overboard for me. All I was trying to do with confronting her about the pictures is to let he know that we do clearly BOTH have issues with trust and relationships, but if we want to make ours work, we can’t be up to absolutely anything that might seem questionable or disrespectful towards the other. Is that too much to ask in a relationship in the age of social media and technology that makes it possible for us to talk to anyone from anywhere in the world? Maybe it is and I’m just a 50 year old dreamer who still believes in true love and respect and honor and completely cherishing the person you are with, even despite their faults. If I am, I know someone here would tell me.


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## MDYankee70 (Oct 25, 2020)

Lostinthought61 said:


> You know deep down that you really can’t trust her, and rightly so based on historical data...honestly you don’t need to put your faith in some who is expert at deception


You’re right. My gut says she cannot be trusted and I need to go with my gut on this one. Medical science refers to our stomach as our “second brain” and I’ve come to agree with that.

I still love, adore, and cherish her, but I clearly don’t love myself if I allow this marriage to go on any longer. I’m not sure why it is so hard for me to just simply admit I was all wrong about her from the beginning and I need to end it and just be single again for a while. I’ve done it before after a difficult relationship and break up. I was single for years at a time in my life. She’s constantly saying that we are soulmates. That the universe brought us together and wants and needs us to stay together. I may be stupid, but I think there is a part of her that truly believes that. But, I also think that she has this other part that she cannot control that, despite her soulmate, she acts upon over and over and over again. Unfortunately, this part always seems to win out. At this point, the universe will have to just get used to the fact that I need to leave. I don’t think therapy could fix this.


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## MDYankee70 (Oct 25, 2020)

Oldtimer said:


> Platonic, I don’t think so. Many of the previous posters said it best. GTFO. Married a short time, no kids, obviously you lack trust. Personally and I only speak for myself, reading all that **** you just went through would be the dealbreaker for me.
> I do understand a little turn on for some of the things she talked about, but I also have an inkling of retroactive jealousy. Unfortunately I believe it’s more than retroactive jealousy.
> 
> Heed the warnings of some of those who have been here before.
> ...


Thank you, kindly. Yes, her definition of Platonic and my definition of Platonic vary greatly. I have plenty of female friends that I would never sleep with. It is not that I am not attracted to them, it’s that I don’t want to ruin a long time friendship. This “older brother” guy, I thought, was one of the same ilk, but, clearly I was wrong about him too. When the chance presented itself, he said damn the friendship, let’s get naked and party!

Can you explain your idea of “retroactive jealousy.” I’m not sure I follow what you meant and the idea fascinates me. Are you saying I have retroactive jealousy because I’m jealous over things she did in the past? I just want to understand the concept before I can agree with it. I like it, don’t get me wrong. I just want to understand it more.


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## Oldtimer (May 25, 2018)

Good morning, I apologize to all regarding the babble in my post, thought I got rid of it.
MD, in answer to your question, yes it’s the jealousy born of previous relationships. In my case and my wife’s, we know that there have been others, but we really don’t care about details. We have accepted that as fact and for the last 19 years have lived and loved life in as much bliss as is affordable.
Point is, is that it can be a dealbreaker for some especially if in some cases the stories and numbers change.


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## lifeistooshort (Mar 17, 2013)

OP, your wife isn't ready to be a committed partner. Women like her who have more male friends then female do so because they require a lot of male attention. She's still at the point in her life where she's sniffing around for more attention.....it strokes her ego.

Such people are poor partner material. She may outgrow this, but it is a character trait related to her own insecurity, and some people never outgrow it. My ex hb is in his 60's and still like this.....it can get worse with age as looks start to fade and the person gets more and more insecure. 

You can confront her all you want but all she's going to do it lie, gaslight, and ********. She's a poor risk.

Guess what my ex did when confronted? Lied, gaslit, and bullshitted.

I suspect your only real option is to
decide if you can live with it. My father used to tell me that people show you who they are.....we just don't want to believe it.


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## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

What is interesting is that she has physical limitations that make it impossible for her to work and, yet, she is fantastic in bed. How does that play out?


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## Oldtimer (May 25, 2018)

Blondilocks said:


> Would you clean up this mess, please? Thank you.


Blondilocks, I apologized for the mess in a previous post. Unfortunately I tried, but unsure of how to do it. 
On another note, I find your comment very rude.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

Get out now, while you can do so with your money and sanity intact. 

She's shown you how the future of your married life will be.

Having to feel you must continually check up on her to see if she's cheating is a horrible way to live.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

The more I read (you have some long posts 🙂)

If you don't tell her to move out today, you've waited too long.


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## MDYankee70 (Oct 25, 2020)

Blondilocks said:


> What is interesting is that she has physical limitations that make it impossible for her to work and, yet, she is fantastic in bed. How does that play out?


That is a good point. She is legitimately disabled. She had scoliosis when she was a teenager and they put steel rods (or something like this) on each side of her spine to straighten it. She also injured both knees and has had surgery on both. Between her back and her knees, there are days that she is in so much pain, she cannot get out of bed. On days like that, this weekend was rough for example, I cannot even think about having sex with her. She is in way too much pain.

When we do make love, or whatever you want to call it, she is an amazing lover. Honestly, the best I’ve ever had in my 50 years. We do have some limitations as far as positions, but it’s still very satisfying.

Now, has she ever faked being in pain on a day she did not want to have sex? That is absolutely possible.


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## MDYankee70 (Oct 25, 2020)

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> The more I read (you have some long posts 🙂)
> 
> If you don't tell her to move out today, you've waited too long.


LOL I am sorry. I can be extremely verbose. Thank you for your input. 😀


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## MDYankee70 (Oct 25, 2020)

Oldtimer said:


> Good morning, I apologize to all regarding the babble in my post, thought I got rid of it.
> MD, in answer to your question, yes it’s the jealousy born of previous relationships. In my case and my wife’s, we know that there have been others, but we really don’t care about details. We have accepted that as fact and for the last 19 years have lived and loved life in as much bliss as is affordable.
> Point is, is that it can be a dealbreaker for some especially if in some cases the stories and numbers change.


No apologies needed. You are absolutely on point about prior relationships. In the beginning of every relationship, I give my partner a clean slate. No matter what other women have done to me as far as cheating, etc., I know it’s wrong to make someone pay for another’s sins.

That being said, I think I have, unfortunately, established an instinct for sniffing out when that blank slate has been soiled. Her slate has been more than soiled, at this point. It’s in tatters.


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## lifeistooshort (Mar 17, 2013)

MDYankee70 said:


> That is a good point. She is legitimately disabled. She had scoliosis when she was a teenager and they put steel rods (or something like this) on each side of her spine to straighten it. She also injured both knees and has had surgery on both. Between her back and her knees, there are days that she is in so much pain, she cannot get out of bed. On days like that, this weekend was rough for example, I cannot even think about having sex with her. She is in way too much pain.
> 
> When we do make love, or whatever you want to call it, she is an amazing lover. Honestly, the best I’ve ever had in my 50 years. We do have some limitations as far as positions, but it’s still very satisfying.
> 
> Now, has she ever faked being in pain on a day she did not want to have sex? That is absolutely possible.


Now I see. Your wife has extreme insecurities related to her disabilities and requires male attention to reassure her that she's desirable.

This isn't going to change.

How old is she?


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## Lostinthought61 (Nov 5, 2013)

MDYankee70 said:


> You’re right. My gut says she cannot be trusted and I need to go with my gut on this one. Medical science refers to our stomach as our “second brain” and I’ve come to agree with that.
> 
> I still love, adore, and cherish her, but I clearly don’t love myself if I allow this marriage to go on any longer. I’m not sure why it is so hard for me to just simply admit I was all wrong about her from the beginning and I need to end it and just be single again for a while. I’ve done it before after a difficult relationship and break up. I was single for years at a time in my life. She’s constantly saying that we are soulmates. That the universe brought us together and wants and needs us to stay together. I may be stupid, but I think there is a part of her that truly believes that. But, I also think that she has this other part that she cannot control that, despite her soulmate, she acts upon over and over and over again. Unfortunately, this part always seems to win out. At this point, the universe will have to just get used to the fact that I need to leave. I don’t think therapy could fix this.


I know this is very difficult decision for you, and certainly not an easy one to make. You can not blame yourself when you first got involved with her, the energy we put forth in a new relationship is intents at times and our heads are doped up on *dopamine* and Oxytocin, which creates a fog in which we can not think clearly to see little red flags we would normally see, it was only after this wore off that you started putting things together.


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

You wonder about cheating...i have no doubt she could not pass a poly. She is gaslighting? You when you question you and she turns it back on you, to shut you down and derail you.

She still friends with her old fukbuddies and has **** photos on her phone....totally inapproptiate and disrespectful to you. If there are not children involved i do not believe a spouse/gf/bf should still be contacting old fukbuddies.

She has no respect for you what so ever. I would hit eject asap.

Question? When she has these bad days...is it after a round of sex the night before. Has these bad days occurred after she had been out with friends late or overnight staying with a girlfriend? May be good if that is the case so you did not have to partake of some other..or one of her fukbuddies sloppy seconds the next day.


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## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

Oldtimer said:


> Blondilocks, I apologized for the mess in a previous post. Unfortunately I tried, but unsure of how to do it.
> On another note, I find your comment very rude.


What did you find to be rude - the please or the thank you?

Just click the edit button (the three vertical dots in the upper right corner of your post) and highlight the portions you want gone and then select delete on the right clicker. Or, you could pm a mod and ask them to clean it up.


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## Oldtimer (May 25, 2018)

Blondilocks said:


> What did you find to be rude - the please or the thank you?
> 
> Just click the edit button (the three vertical dots in the upper right corner of your post) and highlight the portions you want gone and then select delete on the right clicker. Or, you could pm a mod and ask them to clean it up.


At 5 am to see someone post “ would you clean up this mess, please “.
I found it a bit snarky. Unfortunately we don’t know what others feel and I had apologized explaining that I didn’t know how to fix it after trying.
on the other hand, I do appreciate your assistance and I believe it’s been cleared.

thank you


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## MDYankee70 (Oct 25, 2020)

Divinely Favored said:


> You wonder about cheating...i have no doubt she could not pass a poly. She is gaslighting? You when you question you and she turns it back on you, to shut you down and derail you.
> 
> She still friends with her old fukbuddies and has **** photos on her phone....totally inapproptiate and disrespectful to you. If there are not children involved i do not believe a spouse/gf/bf should still be contacting old fukbuddies.
> 
> ...


Good question. Neither. She hardly ever goes out at all because the pain can be so bad. Especially now during Covid, she really cannot go anywhere because she also has autoimmune issues. The poor girl is a mess.

She has one or two female friends that I know about. One of them I do not trust at all to encourage her to be faithful and that’s the one she spends time with the most. They went to a bar one night and she told me how two guys proceeded to ask her out even though they saw her wedding ring. Trying to make me jealous, I guess. Or trying to make it sound like she was being totally honest about everything she does.


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

MDYankee70 said:


> Good question. Neither. She hardly ever goes out at all because the pain can be so bad. Especially now during Covid, she really cannot go anywhere because she also has autoimmune issues. The poor girl is a mess.
> 
> She has one or two female friends that I know about. One of them I do not trust at all to encourage her to be faithful and that’s the one she spends time with the most. They went to a bar one night and she told me how two guys proceeded to ask her out even though they saw her wedding ring. Trying to make me jealous, I guess. Or trying to make it sound like she was being totally honest about everything she does.


Question remains...is she down and in pain next day after sex? After she goes to "visit" this "girlfriend" has she been down and in paid the next day?


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## MDYankee70 (Oct 25, 2020)

Divinely Favored said:


> Question remains...is she down and in pain next day after sex? After she goes to "visit" this "girlfriend" has she been down and in paid the next day?


After we have sex? Sometimes, but not always. Depends on if it was a marathon session or a quickie. I have not seen any indication that she is more in pain after hanging out with her friend. The night she went to the bar with her and told me about the two guys asking her out, we had a marathon session when she got home. Thanks for the idea. When she does go out, I will watch to see how bad her pain is. If it’s ALWAYS an issue, you have a good explanation. So far, nothing I have noticed. Thank you for your insight.


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## MDYankee70 (Oct 25, 2020)

Divinely Favored said:


> You wonder about cheating...i have no doubt she could not pass a poly. She is gaslighting? You when you question you and she turns it back on you, to shut you down and derail you.
> 
> She still friends with her old fukbuddies and has **** photos on her phone....totally inapproptiate and disrespectful to you. If there are not children involved i do not believe a spouse/gf/bf should still be contacting old fukbuddies.
> 
> ...


Truth be told, I had to look up gaslighting. Honestly, it fits perfectly I think. I called it projection but gaslighting is more apropos. Thank you.


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## jlg07 (Feb 24, 2017)

MDYankee70 said:


> Or trying to make it sound like she was being totally honest about everything she does.


and yet you now KNOW that she isn't truthful with you at all! She says a "little" truth while the overall story is a lie.
She could have said they hit on her even with her ring (and not tell you she went out to their car to have sex).

Also, you should make sure you have copies of this stuff you found -- send it to multiple places -- phone, email, etc..
She seems to be great at gaslighting and getting you to doubt yourself -- if you have this proof, she can't succeed in doing that.

Sorry you are going through this, but yeah, she is completely inappropriate as a wife.


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## SpinyNorman (Jan 24, 2018)

As someone who thinks married people can have platonic OS friends, the idea of that a spouse may masturbate in front of them is crazy.


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## sunsetmist (Jul 12, 2018)

@MDYankee70, I'm wondering if you are taking your meds? Have you had check-ups lately? (If she is/has been sexually promiscuous, make sure you are healthy.) And your BPII may be the reason for your long posts of the details/thoughts with which you are dealing. It is difficult to make decisions when your mind is tired.


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## MDYankee70 (Oct 25, 2020)

sunsetmist said:


> @MDYankee70, I'm wondering if you are taking your meds? Have you had check-ups lately? (If she is/has been sexually promiscuous, make sure you are healthy.) And your BPII may be the reason for your long posts of the details/thoughts with which you are dealing. It is difficult to make decisions when your mind is tired.


Thank you. I really do think that she is just texting and/or doing FaceTime with other men (perhaps and probably showing much more than just her face). I could be way off, so I agree, I will get tested. If I do end up having anything, God forbid, there’s only one place it could come from.


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## MDYankee70 (Oct 25, 2020)

SpinyNorman said:


> As someone who thinks married people can have platonic OS friends, the idea of that a spouse may masturbate in front of them is crazy.


I absolutely agree that married people can, and should, have platonic OS friends. Don’t get me wrong. All indications point to the fact that these men are probably more than my definition of platonic.


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## SpinyNorman (Jan 24, 2018)

MDYankee70 said:


> I absolutely agree that married people can, and should, have platonic OS friends. Don’t get me wrong. All indications point to the fact that these men are probably more than my definition of platonic.


I think we agree on all points.


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## jlg07 (Feb 24, 2017)

Yeah, platonic does NOT include getting naked with them and having sex, or sending pics of her boobs.


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## MDYankee70 (Oct 25, 2020)

jlg07 said:


> Yeah, platonic does NOT include getting naked with them and having sex, or sending pics of her boobs.


Agreed. I think I should have really thought about what she was doing after we broke up the first time. She was going out night after night. Meeting random guys at bars and getting phone numbers. She was way too wild for a 23 year old, much less a 43 year old. She just needs validation from EVERY guy. My validation is obviously not enough. I guess it never will be.


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## jlg07 (Feb 24, 2017)

Get the proof you need for yourself (she doesn't need it, she knows she's cheating), get your plans together with a lawyer, and then execute your plan. It's only been TWO years, and she is already doing this? Ugh. I would gather she's actually done this for your entire relationship.


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## MDYankee70 (Oct 25, 2020)

jlg07 said:


> Get the proof you need for yourself (she doesn't need it, she knows she's cheating), get your plans together with a lawyer, and then execute your plan. It's only been TWO years, and she is already doing this? Ugh. I would gather she's actually done this for your entire relationship.


I really need access to her phone and computer again to really get everything. I wonder if I can do something to her iPhone that would allow text messages to be emailed to me. She’s very open in her text conversations. Doesn’t really try to hide anything. Speak in code, or something.


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## jlg07 (Feb 24, 2017)

There is software you can use to get messages (even deleted).
DO you have access to her phone? Does she have it password protected that you know the password? Sometimes if you have an ipad that is synched to her apple account you can get copies of messages that way (but not 100% sure as I don't have an iPhone -- others may be able to help with that).


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## MDYankee70 (Oct 25, 2020)

jlg07 said:


> There is software you can use to get messages (even deleted).
> DO you have access to her phone? Does she have it password protected that you know the password? Sometimes if you have an ipad that is synched to her apple account you can get copies of messages that way (but not 100% sure as I don't have an iPhone -- others may be able to help with that).


I’ve heard of this message forwarding possibility as well. I need to add my email account or maybe phone number to her iMessage settings or something like this. I can get into her phone because I know her lock code. The problem is, I need time alone with it and her phone is always with her. The other thing is that if I do add my email to the iMessages setting, it’s possible she will see it before I can get anything of value.


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## jlg07 (Feb 24, 2017)

MDYankee70 said:


> I’ve heard of this message forwarding possibility as well. I need to add my email account or maybe phone number to her iMessage settings or something like this. I can get into her phone because I know her lock code. The problem is, I need time alone with it and her phone is always with her. The other thing is that if I do add my email to the iMessages setting, it’s possible she will see it before I can get anything of value.


Can you get it while she is asleep? May be worth the effort, but make sure that you know what to do before you try it to minimize the time. IF it sends messages to her phone, well, you have it in hand, no? Delete them.


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## MDYankee70 (Oct 25, 2020)

jlg07 said:


> Can you get it while she is asleep? May be worth the effort, but make sure that you know what to do before you try it to minimize the time. IF it sends messages to her phone, well, you have it in hand, no? Delete them.


I was thinking I should do it while she showers. Unless she is in a really deep sleep, she could wake up. I just looked at my phone and figured out the setting. I add my phone number or email address to her send & receive list. I would obviously never send, but I would receive all. I can make a new email address that she would never recognize if she does ever happen to check her settings. I can make it similar to her current email and just change one tiny thing.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

If one feels all this effort is necessary and already knows spouse is cheating, it's all moot.

If this level of sneaking has been rationalized and considered one is best served by cutting ties and moving on, saving one's sanity.


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## MDYankee70 (Oct 25, 2020)

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> If one feels all this effort is necessary and already knows spouse is cheating, it's all moot.
> 
> If this level of sneaking has been rationalized and considered one is best served by cutting ties and moving on, saving one's sanity.


All valid points. Thank you. I’ve mad a decision. More later. Thanks to all for your feedback. You are all great.


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## manowar (Oct 3, 2020)

its obvious. she doesn't care about you. I bet there's more that your not sharing. The only thing that will wake her up will be when she receives your divorce complaint Why would you want to keep wasting your resources on this predator. Let her pay her own way in life. First you have to l learn how to man up and not fall back into your needy behavior. Who cares about her validation issues. Tell her what she really is. this is a disaster. get out of there.


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## MDYankee70 (Oct 25, 2020)

manowar said:


> its obvious. she doesn't care about you. I bet there's more that your not sharing. The only thing that will wake her up will be when she receives your divorce complaint Why would you want to keep wasting your resources on this predator. Let her pay her own way in life. First you have to l learn how to man up and not fall back into your needy behavior. Who cares about her validation issues. Tell her what she really is. this is a disaster. get out of there.


Man up? Seriously dude? Are you a keyboard warrior?


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## snerg (Apr 10, 2013)

I really wish we could have a paradigm change in raising kids.

We should start from a young age to instill a higher sense of self worth.
We should start from a young age to teach it's okay to walk away from things that hurt/damage.

You wouldn't be in this spot if you stood your ground on your worth.

I didn't even get half way through your first post and wondered why you are still with this person.

I suggest the following:
1) Ask yourself why do you allow her to treat you like this.
2) Understand this - We allow people to treat us the way they do
3) Therapy - figure out why you allow her to treat you like this and why you keep allowing it.
4) Start the standard divorce process

Not sure how much you need to investigate here. Just scanning through your posts, all her behavior is already divorce worthy.
I would just start the divorce process and be free of her


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

She simply isn’t a monogamous person. 

You mentioned you have a background in swinging. If you were cool with not having a sexually exclusive marriage, you could open the marriage up so you could at least play together and you could be scoring with other chicks as well.

But if you want a traditional, monogamous marriage, you waaaay missed the mark with this chick. It’s simply not in her nature to not be getting down with a bunch of guys at any given time.

Frankly, you would have been better off marrying a stripper or even an actual escort or something. At least then she would have been bringing home money for it.


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## manowar (Oct 3, 2020)

Wife has no respect for you and believes she can do whatever she wants.. Forget counseling. Won't work. Here is a hail mary pass that might work for you. Watch the movie swept away. the 1974 version (italian subtitles) not the madona remake. you have to get her full attention and respect to knock off her wretched behavior before she responds to you.


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