# Are most people really, truly SEXUALLY attracted to their spouses?



## jaquen (Mar 1, 2012)

With all the problems plaguing sex in marriage, I wonder if this is the obese pink elephant sitting in the room that few have the desire, or the guts, to acknowledge.

Let us be brutally honest for just a moment; most people are not hot. Or sexy. Or extremely attractive. The truly exceptionally beautiful, handsome, and sexy are lauded partly because they are less typical. 

If most people are pretty average looking, and are likely married to equally as average looking spouses, could one of the major issues facing low, and no, sex marriages be an inherent lack of sexual attraction.

I'm talking pure sexual desire. Not love. Not gratitude. Not companionship. Not friendship. But pure, unadulterated, I want to rip-you-clothes-off-because-I-find-you-so-hot sexual passion. _The kind of attraction, and desire, that would make you want to bed this person even if they were not your spouse, and you didn't have a history of love, and non-physical connection._

If you remove all of the vitally important other aspects of a successful marriage, and focus momentarily on just the sexual attraction, the degree to which spouses actually find each other to be sexy, and beautiful/handsome, do you think it is possible that millions upon millions of people just do not find their spouses sexually attractive beings?


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## librarydragon (Aug 20, 2011)

I am completely attracted to my husband sexually, and he is not likely what most people would call handsome or attractive.

I hear his truck driving into our yard, and the butterflies start. I think about him during the day, and love to be touch by him, but also to satisfy him.


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## Elk87 (Oct 8, 2012)

I am very attracted to my wife, and even her features that she is self-conscious about I find attractive. It is partly what has made me think we are "soul mates." You might even say I have a fetish or draw to those physical characteristics. Unfortunately, she is so self-conscious about some of those things that she doesn't believe me & sort of recoils in disbelief & shame when I mention my love for them.


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## DayDream (May 25, 2011)

Same here. My husband does not have what others would call a hot body, he would be considered average looking in his best day, less than now-a-days, except for to me. But I had always been very sexually attracted to him.


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## DayDream (May 25, 2011)

monkeyboy said:


> I am very attracted to my wife, and even her features that she is self-conscious about I find attractive. It is partly what has made me think we are "soul mates." You might even say I have a fetish or draw to those physical characteristics. Unfortunately, she is so self-conscious about some of those things that she doesn't believe me & sort of recoils in disbelief & shame when I mention my love for them.


Exactly!!! Isn't this frustrating and kinda hurtful?


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## Lon (Jun 6, 2011)

jaquen, I find this is a very relevant, and difficult subject.

To answer your question, in regards to my ex spouse, no. But then I've never once been able to even date someone I find that hot and sexy (not in person anyway). I feel like I've always had to settle... I don't need a "10" but a good woman who I view as a "9" or even an "8" sure seems like it would be smoking hot (under which circumstances I think the multiple times a day sex people are talking about on the ladies thread would be very attainable), but then those who understand about sex rank would say I would then need to make myself an 8 or a 9, but decades of wanting to be haven't gotten me closer to that mark, and so the relationships I've made work (for awhile atleast) I settled, if you call it that, for women that are beautiful as an overall package, and whom were approachable enough for me to feel like I had a chance.

Lately I've begun to discern that what it would would take for me to be, and remain, attracted to a woman in a general physical sense is a pretty face, and as shallow as it will sound in the sexual way (not accounting for personality which is the utmost importance), but physically, a small waist-hip ratio (combination of a great derriere and/or a slim waistline). Maybe my perception is skewed by the media, porn, the women I see walking past my window at work every day, or other external factors... but looking at my sexual relationships I'm all about the hands-on, and the visual, and when I was with my ex I could barely get my hands around her waist and it was all I could think of during sex sometimes. I don't like to think of myself as a shallow person, but I don't know perhaps it is biological, or just preference, I could "overlook" that for a time (it wasn't her body that made me fall in love with her, or that I came to love and respect) but over and over, that little shred of repulsion amplified in time. I couldn't even just close my eyes and make it go away, I was always aware of it. And when she cheated she told me how good it felt to be with someone who found her so sexy despite her "curves" (of course a little strange is always hot despite the looks).

This hangup is probably a huge reason why I've been afraid to get into a relationship again, and why I feel I'm lusting so badly for sex with someone that appeals to me in this way. I have a lot of shame about this and don't know why this should be something so important to me. Perhaps I became aware of it because of a lady I was sexual with after my separation, who was petite compared to the other women I've been with, felt so incredibly different, just as I imagined it would - but of course the "Strange" factor was at play too.

I believe I understand exactly the question you are asking, and yes I think it is certainly at play, and while I focussed on women's appearances, sexual attraction obviously has to do with many different factors for everyone.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

My H and I are completely sexually attracted to each other, have been since day one, but it does actually get stronger and stronger as the years pass...because as we add our sexual experiences together to our memory banks, we now also have those moments pulling us toward each other. Mmmmm.


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## Starstarfish (Apr 19, 2012)

Sexual attraction is complex. And what turns each individual on and what makes them sexually attractive is different. I mean - if you have a hardcore foot fetish, what your partner looks like otherwise (AKA not being "hot" in the traditional sense) you might not care about at all. And yet for you - they might be the most sexually attractive personal imaginable. 

I mean case in point - Rasputin supposedly had all the ladies going wild, and have you looked at a picture of the guy? Because his attractive power for those women wasn't about his looks, it was about his elusive power or his way with words. This is what got them hot and bothered. 

Sure - you can have a wham-bam that is stunningly hot if you are ferociously attracted to your partner, but - what is going to keep fueling that fire after the initial attraction. Man does indeed, not live on sex alone. When your sexy Brazilian model doesn't want to do the dishes, and squanders all the money - are you still going to feel driven and attracted to her? Will her being "hot" be enough to overcome that?

Which isn't to say people don't, on some level maintain the fantasy of having sex with a stunningly attractive mate - and hence porn and romance novels. But it stays there - a fantasy, a relationship based purely on sex and looks isn't going to last the long haul. (As much as 50 Shades of Grey might try and convince anyone otherwise.) 

Also - what each society considers "hot" differs. I mean - people overall are more attractive than they used to be - due to a better diet and the availability of corrective surgery and orthodontia. But - people being better looking, and then the change of a "hot" hookup - doesn't seem to have improved marriage statistics.


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## curlysue321 (Jul 30, 2012)

I don't see how one can separate out the personality from pure physical attraction. I have met some really good-looking people and after talking with them a while they become less attractive because they don't have much going on upstairs. Attraction is more than purely physical. Even in hollywood there are some less than perfect actors who because of their charisma have a lot of sex appeal. Nicholas Cage comes to mind.


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## aribabe (Aug 9, 2012)

I have never seen a man and thought "wow he's hot! I just need to peel right out of these panties". That type of sexual attraction doesn't exist in my life. HOWEVER, I have seen men do things that have me thinking "damn, why the hell am I wearing panties right now?!? *%^&", namely Idris Elba licking his lips in the movie Obsessed. I could literaly feel my body going into a state of arousal, nipples suddenly erect, inner thighs moist from sweat, clitoral swelling, flushed face. I was there and if he had been there in that moment, I would have been all over him in a second and would've sucked him dry and f*cked him raw. Just hotness. And my husband absolutely does things that can just put me there.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## MrsOldNews (Feb 22, 2012)

curlysue321 said:


> I don't see how one can separate out the personality from pure physical attraction. I have met some really good-looking people and after talking with them a while they become less attractive because they don't have much going on upstairs. Attraction is more than purely physical. Even in hollywood there are some less than perfect actors who because of their charisma have a lot of sex appeal. Nicholas Cage comes to mind.



I completely agree. I've dated few men in my day who were as gorgeous as they were dumb. I can't deal with that. Or a man who takes longer than me to get ready lol. I value intelligence first and foremost when looking for a potential life partner. However I could never date someone I'm not physically attracted to.


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## SpinDaddy (Nov 12, 2012)

Absolutely, 100%. And yup I mean to include the stretch marks, the post baby tummy, the cellulite and everything because there is more to the book than just the dust jacket.


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## YinPrincess (Jul 31, 2011)

On a purely physical level, yes, I find my husband extremely attractive. He has a thin build, well defined arms, back, chest and abs (6 pack)! I love his dark curly hair and intense blue eyes. Yes, he is definitely physically attractive!

Do I want to have sex with him? That's all in the mind and our exchanges. Lately it's been NO.

Would he say the same thing about me? Maybe, maybe not. I have no clue, honestly.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## tryingtobebetter (Aug 6, 2012)

In my case, without a doubt.

It has been over 35 years now and she still has 'it' as far as I am concerned. She is still gorgeous, just older.

It is only recently, though, that I have realised how very blessed I am to be married to her.


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## Ten_year_hubby (Jun 24, 2010)

jaquen said:


> If you remove all of the vitally important other aspects of a successful marriage, and focus momentarily on just the sexual attraction, the degree to which spouses actually find each other to be sexy, and beautiful/handsome, do you think it is possible that millions upon millions of people just do not find their spouses sexually attractive beings?


I'm sure it is, but I think it says a lot more about the people who are not finding the attraction than it does about their partners.


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

Starstarfish said:


> I mean case in point - Rasputin supposedly had all the ladies going wild, and have you looked at a picture of the guy? Because his attractive power for those women wasn't about his looks, it was about his elusive power or his way with words. This is what got them hot and bothered.


_You forgot one thing about Gregoire Rasputin.
He was " THE MAN" and he had a BIG d!ck._




As for the OP's question,
Initially I wasn't heads over heels sexually attracted to my wife. That's how I knew I was in love with her. Odd , I know, but before her I only dated hotties.
She is pretty, but at that time, in my mind ,she didn't ooze much sex appeal , so I knew what I felt must be love.

Fast forward to today.
We've been married for quite a while and that sexual attraction grew, the more sexually intimate we became.
Sex was never boring.
This his morning , she,just came out from the shower naked 
[ she usually walks around half naked ], I was on the couch on my laptop.
She looked at me, blew a kiss before heading into the bedroom and immediately ,the blood started flowing to my penis!

I smiled at myself,
I never thought that after all these years, it would still be like this.


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## Lon (Jun 6, 2011)

Ten_year_hubby said:


> I'm sure it is, but I think it says a lot more about the people who are not finding the attraction than it does about their partners.


this is definitely true. As for my example, I am separating the physical from the non-physical, but in reality you can't do that, and also in reality there can be exceptions. What I find "attractive" vs what I think an attractive sex symbol looks like are two entirely different things, but just sometimes, often, overlap. In fact there is someone I'm setting my sights on who is absolutely beautiful, who I've even know for a long time and still find just as beautiful (ie sexually attractive), who doesn't even really fit into the description in my earlier post.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

As for me, yes, there is an element of a woman's physiological beauty that I deem to be extremely sexy. But I could only think that that would be greatly defined as biological lust and quite frankly be deemed as only a natural comprehension of most men.

But what makes a woman, by far, sexier than anything in the world is her intelligence level, her empathy, and her attitude about life in general. 

And while that greatly helps to permeate her aforementioned physical attributes along with these psychological ones, at least in my eyes, it simply helps to transcend her into the totally desirable woman that I would want to spend every waking day of my life with!


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## Red Sonja (Sep 8, 2012)

The first time I laid eyes on my H he had just walked in late to a college class and I experienced my very first “want-to-rip-your-clothes-off-because-I-find-you-so-hot” moment. I have always been a very sexual person and, sure I had seen/dated some good-looking guys in my time, however that moment was my first truly instant and visceral sexual reaction to a man. I will always remember that moment. I discovered, years later, that H had the same reaction upon seeing me. After we became a couple, friends would joke that we were like Malibu Ken and Barbie. So yeah, H is *hot*.

Today, at 53 years old, he is the same hot guy in my eyes. He was and still is a competitive cyclist; a 6’ 3”, 190 lb man (then and now). I was also an athlete (long-distance runner and baseball) and still run 50-55 miles per week; a 5’ 9”, 150 lb woman (then and now).

However, none of this helped our sex life in the long-term because were “like rabbits” for 5 years prior to and 3 years after marriage and then, it just stopped.  By his choice our frequency went down to 4-6 times per year and stayed there for the next 23 years. And no, nothing significant happened at year 3 (as far as I can discern) … no children, no fighting, no health changes, no financial or career changes, etc. My point here is that you can have the sexual attraction and physical beauty and still not get laid. This is a complex subject and there is much more involved.


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

I disagree with the notion that there are "very few" really, truly, hot people in this world. What you find really hot and sexy is not going to be the same as what I would. I happen to think there are a lot of very sexually appealing people in this world. (Josh Holloway...*melt* Henry Cavil....*double melt*) My husband is one...*triple melt* And I am very sexually attracted to him. 

We've been hitting the gym a lot lately and watching him workout is one of the single most sexy things he could ever do, right up there with growing a goatee and watching Downton Abbey with me. There isn't another man on this earth that I could be more sexually attracted to.

I remember before we dated and knew each other very well, I would see him in church and feel my heart and stomach flutter like crazy. I was attracted to everything about him; his smile, his green eyes, the way he walked and carried himself, his voice, his laugh, his talent on the drums, his talent on the piano(probably one of the most intoxicatingly sexy things ever), his shoulders...all of those things made me wild with something utterly new. He is the first, and only, man I have ever felt sexual attraction for.

And in the last two weeks, it's been even stronger. Our relationship has increased by leaps and bounds.


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## Lyris (Mar 29, 2012)

I am definitely sexually attracted to my husband, and he is objectively sexually attractive. But the biggest turn on is not the way he looks, which is great, but how he smells and what he does, as well as how he looks when he does it.

I can imagine though, if he put on a lot of weight or something, I wouldn't like watching him while we had sex or whatever. It would be a distraction. 

He seems to be able to find something in me to be attracted to generally, but it ramps way up when I am at his preferred weight, which is about 125-130 pounds and toned. That's where I am right now, yay me. But he also loves my general enthusiasm level and attitude, so that has carried us through the other times.


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## Anabel (Dec 21, 2012)

jaquen said:


> If most people are pretty average looking, and are likely married to equally as average looking spouses, could one of the major issues facing low, and no, sex marriages be an inherent lack of sexual attraction.


I believe everyone has a unique sexiness about them. To me, conventional good looks are boring. Spending too much time on physical appearance is also not a trait I personally find attractive. Other people may think working out for example is super hot, but for various reasons though: For the strength, for the confidence, for the work ethic, not necessarily just because of the build it gives you. To each his own. Sexual attraction is important but it doesn't have so much to do with conventional looks for many many people is what I'm trying to say.


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## janefw (Jun 26, 2012)

jaquen said:


> With all the problems plaguing sex in marriage, I wonder if this is the obese pink elephant sitting in the room that few have the desire, or the guts, to acknowledge.
> 
> Let us be brutally honest for just a moment; most people are not hot. Or sexy. Or extremely attractive. The truly exceptionally beautiful, handsome, and sexy are lauded partly because they are less typical.
> 
> ...


i have always been sexually attracted to my husband. He still has my total fidelity and the attraction could be resurrected, but his behavior has ruined a lot of my desire for him. 

It's a fact that most relationships are formed between people of the same social class, level of education, level of attractiveness etc. Someone else's wife or gf may not be 'hot' to you, and she may not have a 'Baywatch' body, but obviously she is hot in his opinion. Same thing with guys. My husband isn't Daniel Craig (a man i chose randomly) but then looks aren't the main issue when it comes to choosing the person you will spend your life with. What are looks without kindness, humor, intelligence, steadfastness, honor or honesty? Those attributes are more attractive than a 6 pack to me, and yes, a decent, honest man is sexually attractive, and thinking about my husband tending gently to our kids when they were babies, or putting himself on the line to get things done for me/our family is a turn on. And although you want to remove these aspects of personality and behavior from the attractiveness equation, it doesn't work that way - not unless a person is totally shallow and he or she lives in a total vacuum where all the focus on is 'looks'.


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

janefw said:


> What are looks without kindness, humor, intelligence, steadfastness, honor or honesty? Those attributes are more attractive than a 6 pack to me, and yes, a decent, honest man is sexually attractive, and thinking about my husband tending gently to our kids when they were babies, or putting himself on the line to get things done for me/our family is a turn on.


:iagree:

IMO, when two people live together for a long period in a good relationship , sexual attraction moves to a different 
[ higher?] level.
Not saying the basics don't still apply, but there is something different than what initially existed.


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

I think that jacquen's question is still valid. I will say that my husband's most attractive qualities are his honesty, intelligence, his incredibly caring heart, his willingness to do whatever he can to provide for us, his willingness to learn how to meet my needs, his sense of humor, his physical strength to defend me if ever the situation called for it, etc. 

However, one of his other most sexy qualities is the pride he takes in taking care of his body. He is constantly trying to eat better, build his strength and improve his abilities in other physical activities. Health is vitally important to both of us. Type two diabetes runs in my family. My dad's mom had it, and I'm determined not to get it. My husband's dad and grandfather are both unhealthy and I respect his desire to remain healthy and alive as long as possible. If he were to suddenly not care about that, and stop trying to take care of himself, my respect for him and attraction would decrease. While he may the same intelligent, funny, hard working man, those positive attributes would be tainted by the loss of his care for his health. 

So I think jacquen's question is valid, though there are a lot of things that constitute someone's attractiveness.


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## jaquen (Mar 1, 2012)

Created2Write said:


> I disagree with the notion that there are "very few" really, truly, hot people in this world. What you find really hot and sexy is not going to be the same as what I would. I happen to think there are a lot of very sexually appealing people in this world. (Josh Holloway...*melt* Henry Cavil....*double melt*)


Of course we all have different criteria. I wouldn't ever suggest otherwise. Not even everyone finds the Halle Berry, Kerry Washington, and George Clooney's of the world to be hot.

But I do find your assertion interesting. You would say that when you walk out onto the streets, at any given time the majority of the people surrounding you out in the world you would consider to be hot/beautiful/handsome/etc?



Created2Write said:


> My husband is one...*triple melt* And I am very sexually attracted to him.
> 
> We've been hitting the gym a lot lately and watching him workout is one of the single most sexy things he could ever do, right up there with growing a goatee and watching Downton Abbey with me. There isn't another man on this earth that I could be more sexually attracted to.


Thank you for answering the question, honestly (and for those others who did too). This is exactly what I find so interesting to read; yes people are attracted to their spouses on many dimensions, but how you describe your husband here highlights that part of that attraction is purely physical, and sexual. You would, indeed, be attracted to him likely even if he was the same guy, randomly on a bike at the gym. You find him hot for himself, not only because he's your hubby, and you have a lot of other layers to your attraction.


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## janefw (Jun 26, 2012)

Caribbean Man said:


> :iagree:
> 
> IMO, when two people live together for a long period in a good relationship , sexual attraction moves to a different
> [ higher?] level.
> Not saying the basics don't still apply, but there is something different than what initially existed.


Absolutely. And you know why? Looks fade. I know that's not an earth shattering announcement to most of us, but I think it's something many will not understand until they and their partner begin to age. If it's based only on looks, then what do they do as the wrinkles creep in, the hair gets thinner and loses luster, and no matter how fit and healthy a person is - unless they have the cash for plastic surgery - certain body parts do start heading south? Without genuine love and respect for the PERSON within the skin, I don't see how a marriage would last through middle and old age.


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

jaquen said:


> Of course we all have different criteria. I wouldn't ever suggest otherwise. Not even everyone finds the Halle Berry, Kerry Washington, and George Clooney's of the world to be hot.
> 
> But I do find your assertion interesting. You would say that when you walk out onto the streets, at any given time the majority of the people surrounding you out in the world you would consider to be hot/beautiful/handsome/etc?


Yes. Maybe this state is just a hub for attractive people, but the majority of people I see when I go out and about are what I would consider beautiful/handsome/hot. I haven't been to a lot of places, mind you. But the majority of men and women that I see are very good looking in my opinion.


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

jacquen said:


> Thank you for answering the question, honestly (and for those others who did too). This is exactly what I find so interesting to read; yes people are attracted to their spouses on many dimensions, but how you describe your husband here highlights that part of that attraction is purely physical, and sexual. You would, indeed, be attracted to him likely even if he was the same guy, randomly on a bike at the gym. You find him hot for himself, not only because he's your hubby, and you have a lot of other layers to your attraction.


There are many, many layers to my attraction. Many of them are physical. Neither my husband and I have been the type to only be attracted to the inside of a person. Even as a teen I knew I needed a man that I would find absolutely gorgeous. Didn't matter if anyone else that he was attractive, so long as I did. And yes, if he was a random guy at the gym, I likely would have chosen the bike next to him intentionally, to see if he would notice me the same way.


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## jaquen (Mar 1, 2012)

janefw said:


> And although you want to remove these aspects of personality and behavior from the attractiveness equation, it doesn't work that way - not unless a person is totally shallow and he or she lives in a total vacuum where all the focus on is 'looks'.


I knew some would totally miss the point.

I am well aware that attraction is complex, and multifaceted. It is the multifaceted aspects of attraction that allow us to connect with one another beyond looks.

However for the purposes of this thread, I asked people to separate the other equally, if not more important, aspects of attraction and pare it down to purely the visceral sexual and/or physical. 

As in, would you read a romance novel where the lead is modeled after your spouse?

Would you swoon over an actor in a movie who looked like you spouse?

Would your spouse turn your head if they walked by you on the streets?

It was an attempt to discuss something that is often just not talked about. 

Could one of the many reasons people lose sexual attraction in marriage, if they even had a lot to be begin with, be tied to a lack of base line, "I'd jump your bones even if I didn't know you" attraction.

There is no right, or wrong answer to that inquiry. I appreciate all the response. They have been_ very_ enlightening.

I wasn't sure how this thread would be taken, but I have to say that I am very impressed with the overall answers.


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

And as for aging, my husband is more like his uncle physically than his father. When comparing pictures of his uncle at 25 to my husband, who is almost 25, the resemblance is almost indistinguishable. And I hope that continues because my husband's uncle is one of the single most sexy older men that I have ever known. He's not in great shape(in fact he's probably a bit overweight), his hair is thinning and greying, and yet he is still very sexy. 

"Aging" doesn't mean that the sexual allure decreases, even when the body changes. And, despite exercise, my husband has a bit of a pugy tummy. He's still very muscular, but we didn't work out for about a year and a half, and we didn't eat healthy either, and it took a bit of a toll. He's still sexy as hell to me.


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## jaquen (Mar 1, 2012)

Created2Write said:


> Yes. Maybe this state is just a hub for attractive people, but the majority of people I see when I go out and about are what I would consider beautiful/handsome/hot. I haven't been to a lot of places, mind you. But the majority of men and women that I see are very good looking in my opinion.


I feel that way about where I live.

But I live in NYC. So that's not fair to use as a sample market.

I can say I note a distinct difference between where I live, and many other places I go in this county, and around the world.


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

jaquen said:


> I knew some would totally miss the point.
> 
> I am well aware that attraction is complex, and multifaceted. It is the multifaceted aspects of attraction that allow us to connect with one another beyond looks.
> 
> ...


A romance novel? Not likely. Hate them. But a novel in general, yes.



> Would you swoon over an actor in a movie who looked like you spouse?


Definitely.



> Would your spouse turn your head if they walked by you on the streets?


Another definitely.



> It was an attempt to discuss something that is often just not talked about.
> 
> Could one of the many reasons people lose sexual attraction in marriage, if they even had a lot to be begin with, be tied to a lack of base line, "I'd jump your bones even if I didn't know you" attraction.


I think it's safe for me to say....YES. And my husband is the only man I have felt this way about. 



> There is no right, or wrong answer to that inquiry. I appreciate all the response. They have been very enlightening.


Thanks for posing the question. You always have great insight, even if we disagree at times.


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## janefw (Jun 26, 2012)

Created2Write said:


> "Aging" doesn't mean that the sexual allure decreases


I didn't say it did.


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

janefw said:


> I didn't say it did.


I didn't think you meant that, either. My only point is that even with aging, it's entirely possible to keep the physical aspects of sexual attraction.


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## jaquen (Mar 1, 2012)

Created2Write said:


> There are many, many layers to my attraction. Many of them are physical. Neither my husband and I have been the type to only be attracted to the inside of a person. Even as a teen I knew I needed a man that I would find absolutely gorgeous. Didn't matter if anyone else that he was attractive, so long as I did. And yes, if he was a random guy at the gym, I likely would have chosen the bike next to him intentionally, to see if he would notice me the same way.


It's a great moment if you ever can recapture it, if only briefly.

A few months ago my wife and I had a particularly amazing morning, intimately. She kept saying that there was just "something" on me. Now mind you I know she finds me physically and sexually attractive, but on this day I guess there was just a greater swag in my being (and to be honest I noticed/felt it too). She could barely leave the house, but she had to study, and felt staying in was a big distraction. Not long after leaving she texts me and tells me she forgot to bring her highlighters, and asks if I'll stop down the street to give them to her. I never responded, but got to going shortly after.

I remember when I walked in the door, she looked at me, but her expression was different. As if she didn't recognize me at first. When we got closer she looked all tongue tied, and dreamy eyed. I asked her what's up, and she said "when you first walked in, for a split second, I didn't recognize you. And I thought to myself, 'wow, that is a _really_ attractive man'. " 

Now THAT was a great moment. To know that your spouse would still pick you out in the street. :smthumbup:


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## janefw (Jun 26, 2012)

Created2Write said:


> I didn't think you meant that, either. My only point is that even with aging, it's entirely possible to keep the physical aspects of sexual attraction.


I never said you couldn't keep the physical aspects of sexual attraction - I said that the physicality changes, and if a husband only wants perky, upward pointing boobs, then he's in for a shock when they start heading south, which will happen and which happens to every women who doesn't have access to plastic surgery. That's where the love comes in, in accepting those changes and continuing to desire the wife and her breasts, even though they changed. Same thing for a wife continuing to love her husband even though he starts to suffer from impotence, and his pubic hair turns grey and his testicles and penis get scrawny and old. You continue to take joy and pleasure because you love that person.


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

janefw said:


> I never said you couldn't keep the physical aspects of sexual attraction - I said that the physicality changes, and if a husband only wants perky, upward pointing boobs, then he's in for a shock when they start heading south, which will happen and which happens to every women who doesn't have access to plastic surgery. That's where the love comes in, in accepting those changes and continuing to desire the wife and her breasts, even though they changed. Same thing for a wife continuing to love her husband even though he starts to suffer from impotence, and his pubic hair turns grey and his testicles and penis get scrawny and old. You continue to take joy and pleasure because you love that person.


...No one here has advocated wanting their spouse to look forty when they're sixty-five, and no one here has undermined the importance of love and respect over the physical appearance...so I'm not sure where this is coming from.


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## janefw (Jun 26, 2012)

Created2Write said:


> ...No one here has advocated wanting their spouse to look forty when they're sixty-five, and no one here has undermined the importance of love and respect over the physical appearance...so I'm not sure where this is coming from.


And I didn't say that either Janel, but enjoy your baseless accusations. :sleeping:


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## jaquen (Mar 1, 2012)

Created2Write said:


> ...No one here has advocated wanting their spouse to look forty when they're sixty-five, and no one here has undermined the importance of love and respect over the physical appearance...so I'm not sure where this is coming from.


Thank you. You saved me having to write the exact same post.

Jane makes excellent points, that I'm sure almost all of us here agree with, but I'm just not sure what they have to do with the line of discussion.


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

janefw said:


> And I didn't say that either Janel, but enjoy your baseless accusations. :sleeping:


:scratchhead:

You were talking about perky breasts and six packs, and then went on about old age, sagging boobs, sagging testicles and impotence...where exactly was I wrong?


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

Created2Write said:


> ...No one here has advocated wanting their spouse to look forty when they're sixty-five, and no one here has undermined the importance of love and respect over the physical appearance...so I'm not sure where this is coming from.


I think what jane is saying is that people's body go through changes as we age.
Women's bodies especially transforms drastically after childbirth. She may look the same with her clothes on , but most times its different.
A man's body too tends to get old when faced with stress. His muscles are no longer tight and toned as before,. His erections are no longer rock hard , and his hairline starts to recede, he begins to grey. In the bedroom, his sex drive may sometimes fall.

When that stage reaches, we are humans , and would still find other , younger people sexually attractive to us.
But the attraction we feel to our spouses goes way beyond the physical because a special bond exists.
Little things can trigger that sexual attraction like a wink, a special smile , a hug etc.
Memories can be very powerful.


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

jaquen said:


> Thank you. You saved me having to write the exact same post.
> 
> Jane makes excellent points, that I'm sure almost all of us here agree with, but I'm just not sure what they have to do with the line of discussion.


Right. I fully understand that there will come a time when my husband and I won't look the way we do now, won't have the energy we do now, won't have the sex we do now, etc. But, as far as I could tell, the topic wasn't about sexual attraction in the future, but rather sexual attraction _now_. Obviously when my husband and I are in our eighties(God willing), our sexual attractions will be drastically different. The physical attractions will be different, even if we are fit and healthy.


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## janefw (Jun 26, 2012)

Created2Write said:


> :scratchhead:
> 
> You were talking about perky breasts and six packs, and then went on about old age, sagging boobs, sagging testicles and impotence...where exactly was I wrong?


Given past history, I'd just prefer you didn't address me at all so that i don't have to waste time explaining things to you. Thank you.


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## janefw (Jun 26, 2012)

Caribbean Man said:


> I think what jane is saying is that people's body go through changes as we age.
> Women's bodies especially transforms drastically after childbirth. She may look the same with her clothes on , but most times its different.
> A man's body too tends to get old when faced with stress. His muscles are no longer tight and toned as before,. His erections are no longer rock hard , and his hairline starts to recede, he begins to grey. In the bedroom, his sex drive may sometimes fall.
> 
> ...


Thank you. I would have thought my posts were quite easy to understand but oh well. 'Pearls before swine' leaps to mind. I'm done here anyway. :smthumbup:


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

Caribbean Man said:


> I think what jane is saying is that people's body go through changes as we age.
> Women's bodies especially transforms drastically after childbirth. She may look the same with her clothes on , but most times its different.
> A man's body too tends to get old when faced with stress. His muscles are no longer tight and toned as before,. His erections are no longer rock hard , and his hairline starts to recede, he begins to grey. In the bedroom, his sex drive may sometimes fall.
> 
> ...


Right. I agree. No one was arguing against this. But she seemed to think my so called "accusations" were baseless, which they weren't. And, from what I could see, her posts weren't really relevant to the topic as I think we'd all agree that we age, our bodies change, and love and respect are far more important than physical looks.


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

LOL. No problem Jane. I was only asking for clarification. Your choice not to offer it.


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## janefw (Jun 26, 2012)

Created2Write said:


> Right. I agree. No one was arguing against this. But she seemed to think my so called "accusations" were baseless, which they weren't. And, from what I could see, her posts weren't really relevant to the topic as I think we'd all agree that we age, our bodies change, and love and respect are far more important than physical looks.


It's not up to you to decide whether my posts are 'relevant'. If someone posts a thread it's up to others whether they post and what they write - not you.


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## janefw (Jun 26, 2012)

Lol. Yes. Thank you. Lol. Lol.


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

jaquen said:


> Thank you. You saved me having to write the exact same post.
> 
> Jane makes excellent points, that I'm sure almost all of us here agree with, but I'm just not sure what they have to do with the line of discussion.


The thread starter seemed to agree, I think. He will have to clarify.


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

Ok guys,
Its Saturday night no need to fight .

Its an interesting topic and there are many different perspectives. 

Soooo,

Shall we proceed?


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## janefw (Jun 26, 2012)

Created2Write said:


> The thread starter seemed to agree, I think. He will have to clarify.


I couldn't care less because, again, it's up to me whether I think it's relevant, not anyone else. That's why the Internet is called 'public' and a person who asks a question can't control the answers they receive. So sad, right, but that's the Internet for you.


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

My intention wasn't to fight. I only asked her for clarification, and jacquen seemed to agree that her trail of thought wasn't relevant to the line of discussion he was going for. I welcome his clarification as well, and apologize if I misunderstood his post.


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

I think the thread starter should be the one to decide that, but that is also off topic so I will leave that thought there.


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

jaquen said:


> With all the problems plaguing sex in marriage, I wonder if this is the obese pink elephant sitting in the room that few have the desire, or the guts, to acknowledge.
> 
> Let us be brutally honest for just a moment; most people are not hot. Or sexy. Or extremely attractive. The truly exceptionally beautiful, handsome, and sexy are lauded partly because they are less typical.
> 
> ...


To answer the last question, yes, I think this could be possible. Obviously only individuals can answer what is attractive to them, but I can say for certainty that there are things my husband could do physically that would lessen his sexual allure. While respect and friendship and humor and honesty and trust are wonderful qualities, they don't necessarily make me want to rip his clothes off. They make me safe to express that sexual passion, but they don't create my sexual passion for him. When we make out, I'm not thinking, "Oh he's so funny, or honest or wonderful". I'm thinking, "Dang he looks so hot in jeans with no shirt".


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## *LittleDeer* (Apr 19, 2012)

jaquen said:


> With all the problems plaguing sex in marriage, I wonder if this is the obese pink elephant sitting in the room that few have the desire, or the guts, to acknowledge.
> 
> Let us be brutally honest for just a moment; most people are not hot. Or sexy. Or extremely attractive. The truly exceptionally beautiful, handsome, and sexy are lauded partly because they are less typical.
> 
> ...


For me this is a problem exhasberated by social media and porn, and has many men and women believing that unless their spouse is perfect that they aren't worthy.

I think that's pretty sad.

I don't think I nor my fiance is perfect, but I still can't wait to get into bed with him. And he seems to love to rip my clothes off.

I think people need to stop reading magazines and watching lots of shallow television, particularly reality television with very shallow people in it, and definitely switch off the porn.

Studies show the more that a person watches those types of things, the less satisfied they are with their spouses looks, particularly men. 

For some reason many people hold everyone to impossibly high standards, yet fail to see the that they have things that are unattractive about themselves. 

The happiest couples I have ever seen are ones that focus on each other, that notice the beautiful things about each other. This does not mean overlooking major issues, but it means not holding the person you love under a microscope.

I also once saw a study on couples who had the longest and happiest marriages, they had positive things to say about each other, they complimented each other daily, and I guess bought out the best in each other so each spouse felt attractive and lucky and loved so they strived to please each other too.

That's what it's about to me. Deep personal connection and an ability to allow the other person to be human.

If he doesn't hold a magnifying glass to my c section scars and tummy, I won't hold one to his balding head and his tummy. 
Neither of us is a porn star either but we are very satisfied.


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## janefw (Jun 26, 2012)

*LittleDeer* said:


> For me this is a problem exhasberated by social media and porn, and has many men and women believing that unless their spouse is perfect that they aren't worthy.
> 
> I think that's pretty sad.
> 
> ...


Awesome. ITA.


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## jaquen (Mar 1, 2012)

Caribbean Man said:


> I think what jane is saying is that people's body go through changes as we age.


I do not believe a single person in this discussion had a problem comprehending what Jane said. 



janefw said:


> 'Pearls before swine' leaps to mind. I'm done here anyway. :smthumbup:


And you felt the need to resort to petty, passive aggressive insults why exactly? The conversation was clipping along quite well, with maturity abounding, even in the face of disagreement.

Until this.


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## Anabel (Dec 21, 2012)

jaquen said:


> I knew some would totally miss the point.
> 
> I am well aware that attraction is complex, and multifaceted. It is the multifaceted aspects of attraction that allow us to connect with one another beyond looks.
> 
> However for the purposes of this thread, I asked people to separate the other equally, if not more important, aspects of attraction and pare it down to purely the visceral sexual and/or physical.


What Jane wrote seemed perfectly relevant to me.. The question as I understood it was, "could lack of physical attraction between a husband and wife be a cause for sexual problems?" But this was based on the assumption that Hollywood actors/actresses are the model for physical attractiveness, and therefore there aren't that many attractive people out there. That's how I understood it.. So replying that _purely physical_ attraction isn't necessarily based on movie star looks for everyone does not seem to have missed the point, it is just bringing into question some assumptions. Tell me if I missed something...


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

Another poster earlier mentioned that he loved the way his wife looked after having kids, baby weight and all. For him, seeing her body different reminded him of how lucky he was to have kids, a family, and that made her even more sexually alluring. (I'm not quoting verbatim, of course.) So scars, grey hair, weight gain don't necessarily make a person less sexually attractive. For some it increases their sexual allure.


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## jaquen (Mar 1, 2012)

Caribbean Man said:


> I think what jane is saying is that people's body go through changes as we age.
> Women's bodies especially transforms drastically after childbirth. She may look the same with her clothes on , but most times its different.
> A man's body too tends to get old when faced with stress. His muscles are no longer tight and toned as before,. His erections are no longer rock hard , and his hairline starts to recede, he begins to grey. In the bedroom, his sex drive may sometimes fall.


And note that along with this general decline in appearance, and physical ability, comes a huge decline in sex for married couples over 50, and especially over 60. 

This is why I, quite temporarily, attempted to remove the other strong bonds between spouses, like love, affection, respect, etc. I wanted to boil this down to one element, for the purposes of this discussion.

This is why tangents on inner beauty, while extremely important, are of little relevance to the topic of this specific thread. In many cases those lost in that tangent are preaching to the choir.

Bringing up age is a very important point here. Does the sharp decline in sex among older couples directly correlate with the sharp decline in looks, and sexual attractiveness, that most people experience?

It's a question worth exploring.


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

jaquen said:


> And note that along with this general decline in appearance, and physical ability, comes a huge decline in sex for married couples over 50, and especially over 60.
> 
> This is why I, quite temporarily, attempted to remove the other strong bounds between spouses, like love, affection, respect, etc. I wanted to boil this down to one element, for the purposes of this discussion.
> 
> ...


Ok then,
Maybe I got it wrong,
Sorry about the hijack.


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## jaquen (Mar 1, 2012)

Anabel said:


> What Jane wrote seemed perfectly relevant to me.. The question as I understood it was, "could lack of physical attraction between a husband and wife be a cause for sexual problems?" But this was based on the assumption that Hollywood actors/actresses are the model for physical attractiveness, and therefore there aren't that many attractive people out there. That's how I understood it.. So replying that _purely physical_ attraction isn't necessarily based on movie star looks for everyone does not seem to have missed the point, it is just bringing into question some assumptions. Tell me if I missed something...


Let me clarify this confusion.

Yes I suggested that most people are "average". If others disagree, like C2W did, I respect that. My point wasn't to magnify "Hollywood" looks, and I'm sorry if that came across as my intention.

The core remains the same. Does your husband, or wife, qualify for your individual perspective of what constitutes "sexy", "hot", "attractive", "beautiful", however you want to label it. Are you now, and have you ever been, attracted to your spouse on a purely sexual/physical level, regardless of what your standards are.

We tend to underplay looks in a marriage, because it's the PC thing to do. I am wondering how truly, honestly important are looks to other couples, and if a lack of pure, visceral, physical and sexual attraction is a potential, unspoken of cause of the decline in sex in some marriages.


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

I would answer that question, jacquen, but I'm not old, nor do I know any "older" couples well enough to say. My parents wouldn't qualify. My father has some serious back problems, so I wonder if he can even have sex anymore. I will say that, from what I know of my parent's past, my father's physical appearance didn't effect my mother's sexual passion for him, though hers did effect his.


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## TrustInUs (Sep 9, 2012)

jaquen said:


> With all the problems plaguing sex in marriage, I wonder if this is the obese pink elephant sitting in the room that few have the desire, or the guts, to acknowledge.
> 
> Let us be brutally honest for just a moment; most people are not hot. Or sexy. Or extremely attractive. The truly exceptionally beautiful, handsome, and sexy are lauded partly because they are less typical.
> 
> ...



I disagree that *most* people are not hot, or sexy or extremely attractive. I think its too broad of a statement to make, and I wonder who's looks are we basing this statement off of?

I do think it's possible that many people do not find their spouse attractive to a degree. I think that is why some end up in sexless marriages, when other needs are not met, however, I do realize that those needs are important in order to maintain a sexual relationship.

I find my husband extremely sexy, physically. When I first met him at 19 I was very attracted to him, although we never dated until years later. I admit that i had sexy dreams about him even back then. He did "it" for me. When we reconnected, its one of the reasons it was very hard for me to keep my promise to remain celibate until marriage.

However I have dated someone who I was not physically attracted to in the beginning, and that's where all the other attributes came in. As time went on I became sexually attracted to him, but I do think on some level there would've have been problems sexually if I had married him.


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

Zanne said:


> I'm wondering about this though...
> Would C2W still find her husband, hot in jeans with no shirt, with an extra 100 lbs around his middle?


That's a good question. My husband has put on weight since we first starting dating...maybe forty to fifty pounds or so...and I still find him incredibly hot. An extra one hundred pounds from here would be unhealthy. I can say that, as a person, he would still be very attractive. But going strictly off of the physical? No. I wouldn't find him hot.



> C2W and her husband, although young, appear to have a very close relationship and a better beginning to their marriage then most people I know. They seem like a cute couple.


Thank you.  It's been rocky at times, but the last few weeks have been improving substantially. It's too bad I'm fertile right now, or else I'd be taking advantage of his bare chest and jeans hotness....lol.



> But honestly, if he was considered obese, would it be a turn off? I'm not judging people who are overweight, but from her descriptions, they were not overweight or obese at the time of their marriage.


No, we were not obese then. Aren't obese now, though neither of us is where we know we should be. I've gained too much weight for my height and can't seem to fit into my jeans very well, so we're working on getting ourselves back to healthy weight.



> Also, I would think that most people dated someone they were physically attracted to in the first place, so continuing feelings of attraction in marriage is not hard to achieve. But, I guess they could always get "distracted."


Our situation is a bit different. I don't know how many people talk about health and physical appearance before getting married, but we both have come from families who've struggled with obesity and don't want to go through the same physical issues. We discussed our physical expectations before we married and agreed that we would not let ourselves go. We would work out relatively frequently and eat healthy, for the most part. It's been difficult to keep to, to be honest, and we've both dropped the ball but neither of us wants to be pre-diabetic so we fight to keep ourselves healthy. If either of us changed our minds and decided not to keep to that priority, it would be a turn off for both of us.


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

Actually...I think sexual attraction is all we had.  Random thought. hah.


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## Starstarfish (Apr 19, 2012)

For my personally, I loved my husband before I ever saw him (we met online) - so, I suppose I could be labeled as sapiosexual. While I think my husband is very sexy, my attraction to his looks, is ultimately, secondary.

As for me, well - he always tells me I'm sexy and that I turn him on. Though, I know I certainly don't fit into what a lot of posters (or even wider society) would call "hot" (given all the threads about chubby wives, I know where I'd stand, though to clarify I'm currently sitting here wearing the same pair of pants I wore when we first met, so that isn't post-marriage weight gain, I'm just plump.  )

So - I guess our situation works for us, even though neither of us are likely to be labeled as "hot" by others.


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## Thundarr (Jul 4, 2012)

I think my wife has a rockin body and I'm attracted to her but maybe I married up. Now if she had low character or was just mean then *I would still know she's attactive* but *I would not find her attractive* it that makes sense.

Jaq, to your question though, since over 50% of marriages include infidelity I suspect the answer is no MOST people are not attracted enough.


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## Starstarfish (Apr 19, 2012)

That assumes that cheating is purely about sexual attraction though, which - it always isn't. A lot of times it begins as EA because of a lack of emotional connection or verbal communication at home (especially for women).


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## jaquen (Mar 1, 2012)

TrustInUs said:


> I disagree that *most* people are not hot, or sexy or extremely attractive. I think its too broad of a statement to make, and I wonder who's looks are we basing this statement off of?


This is a point that could be debated all day long. Again, of course we all have individual criteria.

But there is a pretty wide margin for consistency on what is generally considered "hot". We laud the looks, and sex appeal, of people like Angelina Jolie, Brad Pitt, Denzel Washington, Olivia Wilde, Halle Berry, Channing Tatum, Naomi Campbell, Beyonce, or back in the day Bridget Bardot, because they are, generally speaking, considered above average attractive, sexually appealing people. I am not suggesting all people, find all those people attractive. But those people, and the like, aren't noted because they have "average" looks. Iman didn't become a supermodel because she looked like a typical woman; Paul Newman didn't become a star because he blends in.

I think most people would gather what I mean by saying that the average person has "average looks".

The only reason I set this aside as a distinction was to level the playing field a little, and recognize that a lot of people might have settled, in the looks department, below what can be, generally speaking, considered "hot".

I recognize that everyone has different tastes, as well as acknowledge that there are plenty of attractive people out in the world at large who are not on billboards, in TV advertisements, or on the silver screen.


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

Thundarr said:


> I think my wife has a rockin body and I'm attracted to her but maybe I married up. Now if she had low character or was just mean then *I would still know she's attactive* but *I would not find her attractive* it that makes sense.


^^^^^
This is what I've been thinking myself.
What I'v been trying to say.
Its kind of hard to separate sexual attraction from the other qualities in your spouse, especially when you've been with that person for a while.
So you may see other people who are sexually attractive or " hot" but you are not sexually attracted to them like you are to your spouse.


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## Red Sonja (Sep 8, 2012)

jaquen said:


> Not even everyone finds the Halle Berry, Kerry Washington, and George Clooney's of the world to be hot.


Yeah, none of my girlfriends understand my aversion to Brad Pitt ... they drool while I grimace, because he looks too much like my younger brother ... ick.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

I would consider my husband & myself of "average" looks... for our age, in good shape ....target weight.....but no model material... In our youth.... neither of us had Braces... our sights were never set on perfection though.... we were both very attracted to each others bodies & faces... Though looking back, I found him way more attractive without his glasses on. 

I've always considered myself a VISUAL woman....when I see a guy, I can tell immediately... "Yes, NO, or hmmm maybe"... no amount of $$, status, presence can influence that for me.... I want a little hotness going on...feeling .... "OH YEAH....mmmm I want THAT"... 

My type does not need a 6 pack, big muscles...he doesn't have to be in sports, or working out even...just a good looking mug & a thin body.....and I'm good to go....when you got the personality to go with all of that & compatibility, you have it all. 

He's still got that FLAT stomach going on nearing 50, this keeps me happy, still got his hair & not much graying ...yet. 

I know as the time goes on.... because of our tremendous bond ...this will allow me to *forever *see him "young" . When I look at him now, I can see the gorgeous man I married in his white Tux standing before me. 

I know....if I was single.... I would notice him & be checking him out, I've told him this out & about -happy to be on his arm.....it makes him feel really good because ...well... he thinks he is nothing special at all...he tells me I am "warped"... very humble man.


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## jaquen (Mar 1, 2012)

Red Sonja said:


> Yeah, none of my girlfriends understand my aversion to Brad Pitt ... *they drool while I grimace, because he looks too much like my younger brother ... ick.*


:rofl:

Awkward. 

Hey, I've never gotten the Megan Fox appeal, so.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

My wife and I are still young both in age and marital experience so I don't think we're qualified to comment but...

Yes

Unfortunately it has resulted in "problems? let's have sex"-type rug-sweeping over the last 4 years causing us tons of escalating growing issues.


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

May I ask a question?

Does someone have sexual attraction for another based only on looks?
Or are they also attracted to an attitude which they find "sexy"?

Can a man find a woman sexy because of how she looks , but be sexually attracted to her because of how she is?


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

My husband has told me before that, as harsh as it may have sounded, he knew from the time he was a teen that he could never marry an unattractive girl. He tells me that, out of his other sexual partners, I'm the only girl he couldn't resist. And he tried resisting me for quite a while, but the sexual attraction was just too strong. 

I like it when he says those things.


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## Thundarr (Jul 4, 2012)

Starstarfish said:


> That assumes that cheating is purely about sexual attraction though, which - it always isn't. A lot of times it begins as EA because of a lack of emotional connection or verbal communication at home (especially for women).


No I'm not assuming cheating is always about being sexually attracted to the OM/OW and not to spouse.

I do think however that statistically being sexually attracted to your partner is an indicator of contentment with said partner and therefore attracted partners likely cheat less often.


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## jaquen (Mar 1, 2012)

Caribbean Man said:


> May I ask a question?
> 
> Does someone have sexual attraction for another based only on looks?
> Or are they also attracted to some attitude which they find "sexy"?


I've been attracted to women who I actually didn't find particularly appealing visually. I've mentioned this story once before, but in university we had a young teacher who was, physically speaking, not particularly attractive. But there was just something incredibly sexy about her presence, her being. Later on in the semester a few of us guys were talking, and she came up. I was surprised to find out that a couple of the other guys felt exactly the same way I did.

I also have seem people I find to be drop dead gorgeous, but don't have any sexual draw to me.

That's why I've tried to remember to put and/or when talking about physical and sexual attraction. There can be a difference. 

But I also recognize that this might not be typical. I've had this conversation with people before, and almost always people seem puzzled when I declare that I believe a person can be very attractive, even beautiful, and yet still hold no sexual appeal to me.


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

Caribbean Man said:


> May I ask a question?
> 
> Does someone have sexual attraction for another based only on looks?
> Or are they also attracted to some attitude which they find "sexy"?


Attitudes play a big part for me. Confidence is a major turn on. Arrogance? Bleh. Arrogance is why I've never been attracted to Brad Pitt, Tom Cruise or Russel Crowe. C*ockiness can be attractive. But arrogance is an absolute no for me.


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

jaquen said:


> I've been attracted to women who I actually didn't find particularly appealing visually. I've mentioned this story once before, but in university we had a young teacher who was, physically speaking, not particularly attractive. But there was just something incredibly sexy about her presence, her being. Later on in the semester a few of us guys were talking, and she came up. I was surprised to find out that a couple of the other guys felt exactly the same way I did.
> 
> I also have seem people I find to be drop dead gorgeous, but don't have any sexual draw to me.
> 
> ...


I agree.


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## jaquen (Mar 1, 2012)

Thundarr said:


> No I'm not assuming cheating is always about being sexually attracted to the OM/OW and not to spouse.
> 
> I do think however that statistically being sexually attracted to your partner is an indicator of contentment with said partner and therefore attracted partners likely cheat less often.


That's part of why I called this the obese elephant in the room.

It's become standard to say "looks don't matter, it's the inside that counts". If you suggest otherwise, here comes the "shallow" label.

Well maybe that's a problem. It's enabled some people to let them selves go completely, on every level, and never have to deal with an honest conversation where a spouse can say "Look, unfortunately I'm just not as attracted to you anymore".

And that doesn't even deal with the people who never really found their spouses appealing in these respects. How many people, like Lon so honestly outlined, "settled" for who they could get, vs who they really craved? I imagine that can become a huge problem down the line when the lovely dovey feelings begin to fade, and reality sets in...


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## Thundarr (Jul 4, 2012)

Caribbean Man said:


> May I ask a question?
> 
> Does someone have sexual attraction for another based only on looks?
> Or are they also attracted to an attitude which they find "sexy"?
> ...


Yea I think it's connected. Case in point? I find my *wife attractive* yet I find my *ex unattractive*. They would both be considered good looking by most people.


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

Like I said in my first post,
I was not sexually attracted to my wife at first. We were
" just friends."
But the closer we came I began to discover little things about her.
On the surface she looked quiet , but underneath she was a hot, bubbling sexpot , just waiting for the right person to open up to.

Because she thought I was that person my interest and sexual attraction grew.
I know my story is not typical. But she's now in her 40's and I'm very sexually attracted to her . 

She's standing next to me earlier this afternoon after coming home from hanging out with her friends, she rubbing on me. I ask her half jokingly if she wants to go inside, she says yes and her eyes light up.
She takes off her clothes and lies on top of me naked, looks in my eyes and smiles. Windows wide open, curtains pulled aside with a mischievous look in her eyes.

I would have NEVER guessed years ago , that this woman was so sexy, or that I would have looked at her in this way.
She was just a plain girl, before we got married.


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## jaquen (Mar 1, 2012)

Zanne said:


> Otherwise, speaking to the OP, how would you find yourself with a person who you are not sexually attracted to on a physical level - and why would you marry that person in the first place?? Are there that many couples who married out of convenience? Or does the feeling of attraction ebb and flow like the "feeling of love" in some marriages?


I truly believe people do...all the time.

One of the most common, largely unspoken of byproducts of people going through huge physical transformations (losing a ton of weight, gaining a lot of muscle, improving the overall look, a quality plastic surgery make over) is the negative impact it can have on a relationship.

There are people, how many we will never know, who might have made very different choices in a spouse if they felt they _could_. I mean really, how many people marry somebody because, physically speaking, they are in their "league"? And would they have made the same choice if they looked the way they truly wanted to, and had more choices?

Let me mention a friend of mine. She is now in her 60's, decades older than I am, but when she was a younger woman, in her 20's or early 30's I believe, she lost a lot of weight. Now she was always overweight to obese, her entire life. This was the very first time she was at a normal weight. She suddenly started being approached far more by men, and men she once considered to be pretty much out of her league. She ended up having an affair, and causing a ton of damage to her marriage. Psychologically she was not ready at all for the sudden change in how she looked, and how she was perceived, and she quickly put the weight back on. Here we are now, over 30 years later, and she's only now really facing trying to seriously shed that weight, and all the baggage that came with it.

How many people were like my friend? How many people, in their heart of hearts, settled for what they could have, instead of what they truly wanted? Especially considering that we're now in the middle of an obesity epidemic, which is really reeking havoc on self image, self esteem, and healthy sex lives.

These are tough questions, with no easy answers. But they sure do make for interesting discourse.


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

You are a blessed man, CM. It really feels good to know someone has found something so good, so right, so satisfying.


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## Gaia (Apr 27, 2012)

Strange as it sounds... I was always and still am very sexually attracted to my man. I dont know what others would consider him but to me he is the... "Oh my god I want to rip your clothes off and take you here and now" type. Hell his voice makes me shiver, I get weak in the knees when he glances my way.... Hell he doesnt even have to look at me to get me all hot and bothered. 

He can piss me off, irritate me, ect and I still find him irresistable. Now.... I dont know if he feels that way about me or not but he can answer that himself.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

jaquen said:


> I truly believe people do...all the time.
> 
> One of the most common, largely unspoken of byproducts of people going through huge physical transformations (losing a ton of weight, gaining a lot of muscle, improving the overall look, a quality plastic surgery make over) is the negative impact it can have on a relationship.
> 
> ...


This is a great post. I don't have any answers to the questions, but I like the thoughts you've posed. 

I know a couple years ago, after my mom finally started losing weight and changing her attire to be more attractive, my dad was initially uncomfortable. He was in the middle of all of his back issues before his surgeries, and he broke down and asked her if she was making changes so she could find a new man once he died. She cried because he'd asked her to lose the weight and get healthy and dress better for years and she ignored him.

That's why my husband and I are making the effort now, while we're young.


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

Thundarr said:


> Yea I think it's connected. Case in point? I find my *wife attractive* yet I find my *ex unattractive*. They would both be considered good looking by most people.


Well, most of our clients are female. Good looking, successful , attractive women.
But they don't appeal _to me_ sexually. Maybe if we spent excessive time together , I would become sexually attracted to them.
But I know that my wiring is a bit different.[ lol ]
I always see and admire beautiful women, but I don't get that 
" gosh I wanna fcuk you " right now feeling like I used to before , when I was single.
Maybe I'm getting old?
But i do get that " wanna fcuk you now" feeling with my wife,
Very often!
_Maybe all of this is just psychological._


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## Starstarfish (Apr 19, 2012)

I didn't mean "you" specifically, Thundarr, that was more of a hypothetical turn of phrase, sorry if I offended. What I had in mind were the cases you see where the cheating partner's lover is actually -less- attractive than their spouse?

I mean - think about the women Tiger Woods cheated with - who all mysteriously seemed to be slightly less attractive versions of what he already had at home. Or - Halle Barry's husband who indeed, cheated on her, with someone who was far less attractive. 
So - in those cases, the person being "hot" - even award winning hot, the stuff of other men's fantasies, indeed didn't stop their marriage having issues - including sexual problems. 

Also on a totally different idea- here's an interesting read:

Why Women Don't Want Macho Men - WSJ.com

Which isn't the first time I've read that idea - that as a society our perception of what is attractive has changed, partly due to long-term use of hormonal birth control so women aren't as internally driven to find an ubermench to propogate with (and hence why surly chest-haired Sean Connery was the sex pot of his day but we have Robert Pattinson or Bieber.)


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

Starstarfish said:


> I mean - think about the women Tiger Woods cheated with - who all mysteriously seemed to be slightly less attractive versions of what he already had at home. Or - Halle Barry's husband who indeed, cheated on her, with someone who was far less attractive.
> So - in those cases, the person being "hot" - even award winning hot, the stuff of other men's fantasies, indeed didn't stop their marriage having issues - including sexual problems.


I have also noticed what you posted, and it has led me to wonder if cheating isn't really about sexual attraction alone , but other emotional/ psychological issues that when combined with circumstances and opportunities creates " the perfect storm."

So maybe tis " sexual attraction " we speak of is partly mental and part physical?


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## Cosmos (May 4, 2012)

Although I find my partner physically attractive, it's more the mental attraction that turns me on.


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## heartsbeating (May 2, 2011)

I am sexually attracted to him. It's a sum of things that keeps that spark lit. I find the physical quirks about him the sexiest of all. His bowlegs and the way he walks... mrow.

I can't say I've been the type who's truly felt "I-want-to-rip-your-clothes-off.." and it be _purely_ physical. I've had moments of that feeling, to then go on a date and recognize there's nothing else there and that attraction quickly fizzled as a result. 

The sexual attraction I feel for Batman is definitely a sum of the things that make him who he is, including the physical.


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## heartsbeating (May 2, 2011)

jaquen said:


> Would you swoon over an actor in a movie who looked like you spouse?


As my husband has matured, he looks like Dave Grohl. I crush on Dave Grohl because he looks like my husband lol. It wasn't the other way around. 



jaquen said:


> Would your spouse turn your head if they walked by you on the streets?


I still get that feeling when we're meeting somewhere, and I spot him in a crowd, or he's walking towards me, that my heart gets a flutter. I still feel that. And when he spots me in a crowd at the same time and gives me that smile, holy smokes Batman!


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## Lon (Jun 6, 2011)

SimplyAmorous said:


> I know....if I was single.... I would notice him & be checking him out, I've told him this out & about -happy to be on his arm.....it makes him feel really good because ...well... he thinks he is nothing special at all...he tells me I am "warped"... very humble man.


This is one thing that is tough for me, and I'm sure a lot of other divorcees, with our ex spouse we met them at a time when we were younger and there were more single people, and looks played a large part of the initial attraction, and then as certain things go with age, stretch marks from kids, laugh lines and all those things that have meaning still. But with someone new, at a later point in life, those wrinkles, stretchmarks, flaws and acquired defects don't carry any personal meaning. I find (especially when I was first looking to start dating again) that I was only really noticing younger women, not because older ones aren't attractive, but just because I reverted to old habits about looking at women. It was kind of confusing, looking at the market that I would be in if I were a decade younger, honestly couldn't tell if some of those ladies were early 20's or late 30's. My perception is starting to become a little more refined in this aspect.


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## Dulciean (Nov 18, 2012)

I am really enjoying this thread....the issue is a contentious one, and sure to provoke emotion. I met my husband online and his profile pic was terrible, could hardly see him! The meeting of minds was was turned me on ( in a huge way!). Interestingly, I wasn't looking my best at the time, I had cut my hair very very short, and was carrying another 20 kilos. When we met, I was so relieved to realise I was very physically attracted to him, and the deal was sealed!
Three, nearly four, years in I love him so deeply and find it difficult to separate my love for him from physical attraction. He and I tend to gain and lose weight in cycles- at the moment we are heavier and this reduces my ( our? ) desire... I am keenly aware that he loves looking at hot young things through porn and the media. But I take my cues from the fact when I'm naked- he's hard, so something must be right. 
The OP makes many excellent points, and it is a sensitive issue. 
Separating love and lust is a sticky topic!


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

Created2Write said:


> My husband has told me before that, as harsh as it may have sounded, he knew from the time he was a teen that he could never marry an unattractive girl.


 Every one of our older sons says the same thing, they will do anything to get away from an unattractive girl so she does not get the wrong idea... I hear how they talk about girls on a daily basis. 

3rd son has a few girls he's not interested in after him .......Then we have his beautiful ex GF of 7 months who has broken his heart twice....(they are only 14 mind you).....Here we go again....she wants him back!! I know he is going to take her back.... Looks are killer....she has him wrapped around her fingers. 



Thundarr said:


> I do think however that statistically being sexually attracted to your partner is an indicator of contentment with said partner and therefore attracted partners likely cheat less often.










I often call it the "glue".

IN the book ...."*His Needs- Her Needs*" .... it is listed as 1 of the 10 "*emotional needs*", and for some this could be on the bottom, if Not...it is a very BIG Deal, like CreatedtoWrites husband... it is nearing the top.

Mentioned this subject to my husband & he brings up a recent FB posting on his wall....he's thinking it was a Joke... but he wasn't sure >>


> I'm reaching out on behalf of a friend of mine who needs some help! His wife told him to go out and get some of those pills that would help him get an erection.
> When he came back he handed her some diet pills. Anyway, he's looking for a place to live. Can you help him?





Red Sonja said:


> Yeah, none of my girlfriends understand my aversion to Brad Pitt ... they drool while I grimace, because he looks too much like my younger brother ... ick.


Brad Pitt doesn't do it for me either, neither does any of the James Bonds... or Johnny Depp...

In Fight Club, I'd be drooling over Ed Norton 20 times more than Brad Pitt.



Caribbean Man said:


> I would have NEVER guessed years ago , that this woman was so sexy, or that I would have looked at her in this way.
> She was just a plain girl, before we got married.


Makes me think of this song  You Belong With Me - Taylor Swift

... He was after all the girls in short skirts/ cheerleader types...... but she wore t-shirts & was on the bleachers... sometimes those* Plain* girls - just aren't showing it off... but they GOT it and a lot more....men need a little imagination & to help her bring it out.


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

2ntnuf said:


> You are a blessed man, CM. It really feels good to know someone has found something so good, so right, so satisfying.


Thank You 2ntnuf.
She is a _good_ woman.


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## Emerald (Aug 2, 2012)

Hi Jaquen!

...slowly tiptoes out of thread.........


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## jaquen (Mar 1, 2012)

Caribbean Man said:


> I have also noticed what you posted, and it has led me to wonder if cheating isn't really about sexual attraction alone , but other emotional/ psychological issues that when combined with circumstances and opportunities creates " the perfect storm."
> 
> So maybe tis " sexual attraction " we speak of is partly mental and part physical?


I absolutely do believe cheating can be about more than aiming for a more attractive affair partner.

But I do believe the General Petraeus situation maybe more typical, than not.


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## Starstarfish (Apr 19, 2012)

To get back to the "settling" question:

I brought that up on another thread, when another poster mentioned that people didn't have to have it "all together" to start a relationship, as the relationship (and their partner) might help them "get it all together." But unfortunately, if that is the case - that leaves the scenario that Jaquen lines out as a possibility. 

You marry someone with low self-esteem, a moderate-paying job, who has "average" looks. They gets a promotion, which increases their self-esteem and spending power to improve their "look" with how they dress, or more expensive haircuts/hairdos. Or - in the scenario that Jaquen points out - they lose a big amount of weight. 

In either case, at a certain point, they decide they have "settled" and that you no longer match their new "sex rank" - that they deserve a better looking partner. They decide they settled for you. They retroactively begin to negatively look at your relationship - you two never really got along, you never really fit in with them, you have nothing in common. 

Or alternatively, you were never really sexually attracted to your partner, but married them for other reasons (there's a few of those threads to.) At some point, the other reason has been fulfilled (for one poster it was apparently her paying for him to go to grad school) and thus there's no reason to keep them around.

Which comes to two choices - they can try and get you to become the partner they desire - from the light option - new clothes/haircuts/diet to the extreme - cosmetic surgery. You see threads following both of these trends on the forums. Or - they can decide that you no longer fit into their improved lifestyle and leave to find a "hotter" partner. 

Is that "shallow" - perhaps not, sexual attraction as it relates to a partner's looks is indeed, critical to some people, and is a factor to a happy relationship. However, if you tell a partner that you love them unconditionally and always will, and the reality is that you only want them within certain parameters (until you are hot or rich enough to get someone else), you formed your relationship kind of dishonestly. Especially if your partner had no idea they never really turned you on, or only turned you on because you thought you couldn't get anyone better. 

I think the same thing about the weight gain question - some people on this thread have been very honest and open - they told their partner up front that weight gain will be a big turn off and might affect their relationship, and thus everyone is fully aware going into it. But, I don't think a lot of people are, whether they believe or not, they themselves profess the "it's what inside that counts" to their partner, and some partner's take that to the extreme and abuse the statement. But - if it wasn't true to begin with - you kind of set yourself up for trouble. 

In the end, I think people can have whatever qualifications they want in a partner - but they should be honest and up front to themselves and their partner about what those qualifications are - otherwise, in the long term, it's asking for problems.


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

jaquen said:


> I absolutely do believe cheating can be about more than aiming for a more attractive affair partner.
> 
> But I do believe the General Petraeus situation maybe more typical, than not.


:iagree:

But all these things are relative.


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

Starstarfish said:


> You marry someone with low self-esteem, a moderate-paying job, who has "average" looks. They gets a promotion, which increases their self-esteem and spending power to improve their "look" with how they dress, or more expensive haircuts/hairdos. Or - in the scenario that Jaquen points out - they lose a big amount of weight.
> 
> In either case, at a certain point, they decide they have "settled" and that you no longer match their new "sex rank" - that they deserve a better looking partner. They decide they settled for you. They retroactively begin to negatively look at your relationship - you two never really got along, you never really fit in with them, you have nothing in common.
> 
> ...


This is quite an interesting analysis, and I'm sure such scenarios do exist among many married couples. The evidence is clear.
However,
I think that generally people get married for all the wrong reasons, and when they are married they either unable to or fail to develop_ real_ intimacy.
Instead of growing _together_, they grow apart, and live separate lives.
Added to that , some people are just plain selfish and ungreatful.

How could anyone, after their spouse sacrificed for them to finish college and attend university ,then turn around and scorn their spouse?
How could they think of themselves as in a higher
" sex rank " so their partner need to either improve themselves or they would divorce her and get an upgrade?

Truth be told,in many cases, were it not for their spouse, the would still be in that low " sex rank."
Maybe they should have worked on themselves, get that promotion, improve their self esteem, _before they got married_ , instead of being an ungreatful , pernicious parasite , thriving off an unsuspecting generous host.
I don't understand that line of thinking.
I'm not saying it doesn't exist, and I'm sure it does in an whole lot of cases , but I think its just plain selfish.
There's a saying that goes like this;

"..._An ungrateful man is like a hog under a tree eating acorns, but never looking up to see where they come from_..." 

When a couple have real intimacy, they share their goals and help each other develop
If Johnny wants to become a doctor,and Jane is 100% behind him, she sacrifices for him to attend med school etc. 
When Johnny graduates , he now makes enough money to help Jane achieve _her_ dream. If he really appreciates Jane's sacrifice , he doesn't need her to get a makeover. If Jane wants a make over, he willingly encourages her.
Again, it depends on the level of intimacy between the two of them.

But the main goal in marriage is not just self improvement at the expense on another, but interdependence benefiting each other.


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## Rags (Aug 2, 2010)

First off, yes, I'm truely sexually attracted to my wife, of (so far) 16.75 years. 
She's pretty, she's got a good figure (it was more curvy a few months back, then she decided to lose some weight - she was sexy before, and she she's sexy now, although in a slightly different way - satisfies my built-in lust for variety!)

When she was pregnant, she was sexy. When she was nursing, she was sexy. When she was a little heavier, she was sexy.

I think she's georgeous, and I struggle to keep my hands off her (ok, frequently I don't bother struggling, and just put my hands on her ...)

And that's before we get to the aspects of her being intelligent, interesting, a good conversationalist, educated and spirited.
Did I mention that she was was hot, too? And nicely adventurous in bed?

Is she perfect? No. But she's as close as I've ever seen, and for me, certainly the best likely to find. (Not that I see any point in looking - what a waste of time that would be! It could be much better spent dragging her off to the bedroom - she doesn't resist all that much....)


So whilst I can't answer for 'most', for me, in a nutshell - YES!


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## Starstarfish (Apr 19, 2012)

Those epitets are pulled from posts here on TAM, as much as this forum can be seen and representative of wider society. And I agree, CM - I'm sure that selfishness has a lot to do with a lot of problems. 

As for how people can do those types of things - I'd imagine they are narcissists, and thus, they might never develop real intimacy with someone else, as that would require them to think of someone besides themselves.


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## Thundarr (Jul 4, 2012)

heartsbeating said:


> It's a sum of things that keeps that spark lit.


This kind of sums it up for me. I can recognize beauty and have no spark. There has to be more than surface attraction for it to grow into anything meaningful.


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

jaquen said:


> Let us be brutally honest for just a moment; most people are not hot. Or sexy. Or extremely attractive. The truly exceptionally beautiful, handsome, and sexy are lauded partly because they are less typical.
> 
> If most people are pretty average looking, and are likely married to equally as average looking spouses, could one of the major issues facing low, and no, sex marriages be an inherent lack of sexual attraction.


Ok,

Sorry for resurrecting this touchy subject, but since Sunday it has been on my mind.

I think I misunderstood or failed to look at the OP's argument objectively, as most of us sometimes do when faced with questions like these.
We view them through our own experiences and values.

I think logic behind Jacquen's original post is in fact a reality in _most_ marriages.

Marriage is work, but great sex makes it fun. 
Sexual attraction is like the glue or the
_electromagnetic magnetic force _[ current ] that runs through the circuits keeping the light on, the AC working, the dvd playing and everything working.
Without that current running through , nothing works and we have to revert to manual.

When marriages lack that raw sexual attraction , everything simply becomes harder, little problems seem bigger than they really are.

I'm not saying that the other views on this thread are wrong. What I'm saying is that whilst some of us may be still sexually attracted to our spouses, anecdotal evidence shows that most people aren't for some reason or the other.
So for some of us that attraction grew and changed in meaning over time to something better.
But for the majority of unfortunate couples, it simply changed into something " non existent."

Yes,
I can see it now.
I believe that it is the " _invisible_ " Obese pink elephant in the room.


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

Caribbean Man said:


> Ok,
> 
> Sorry for resurrecting this touchy subject, but since Sunday it has been on my mind.
> 
> ...


I agree. I've been thinking too(and I know I'm going to get flack for this, but oh well), and one reason I think this occurs is the amount of focus we put on the inner person. Now, before there's too much confusion, I want to clarify that I do believe the inner person to be the most important. I think who we are on the inside is the most important part of every facet of life, ever relationship. It's our goodness, selflessness, mercy and moral compass that lead us to do the right things. Who we are on the outside does not define who we are on the inside. 

That said, our society has largely been one that pushes the idea that valuing physical appearance is somehow shallow or weak minded or immature. Men are made to feel guilty when they make their relationship choices on who they find attractive on the outside. Women are made to feel like their outer appearance shouldn't matter one bit when it comes to finding romance; that it doesn't matter how unhealthy they are, they should be accepted for who they are. And I agree, but to a point. 

How many marriages on this forum alone struggle with losing that sexual bond? And yet we're the heaviest country in the world(USA), statistically speaking, and we wonder why this occurs. 

Now, I am not an advocate for judging a persons worth on whether or not they're attractive. Attractiveness is a matter of individual opinion anyway. _But_, men and women in this country seem to suffer from a lack of confidence and self-worth, and it's no wonder. We are SUCH an unhealthy country, and that effects who we are inside as well. I have a male friend who is absolutely one of the sweetest most caring guys I have ever known. He puts everything he has into his friendships. He wants to marry and have a family so badly, but he has absolutely no confidence in himself whatsoever. He's not ugly, and in fact would be so much more attractive if he was just confident in himself. Like Dwight from The Office; strangest guy ever, and not physically attractive, but he is so confident and co*cky that he exudes sexual appeal. It's hard to feel really good about yourself when you look in the mirror and your outer shell doesn't accurately reflect who you are as a person. 

I seriously wonder how much stronger these marriages would be if men and women really spent time bettering themselves physically. And not trying to look like models or anything, but based on their individual bodies, getting healthy.


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## Thundarr (Jul 4, 2012)

You'll get no flack from me C2W. Seems spot on to me. In the end though, political correctness is like telling water it actually runs up hill. You can say it and believe it but it doesn't change what water does .


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

Thundarr said:


> You'll get no flack from me C2W. Seems spot on to me. In the end though, political correctness is like telling water it actually runs up hill. You can say it and believe it but it doesn't change what water does .


Exactly. It's why I despise political correctness.


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## 2ofus (Dec 25, 2012)

Rags said:


> First off, yes, I'm truely sexually attracted to my wife, of (so far) 16.75 years.
> She's pretty, she's got a good figure (it was more curvy a few months back, then she decided to lose some weight - she was sexy before, and she she's sexy now, although in a slightly different way - satisfies my built-in lust for variety!)
> 
> When she was pregnant, she was sexy. When she was nursing, she was sexy. When she was a little heavier, she was sexy.
> ...



I think this is really beautiful, your wife is very lucky and it sounds like you are too!


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