# At my wits end with my husband



## hoosierlady

For starters, I feel quite embarrassed that I am even considering divorce, as my husband and I have only been married for 6 months, but I'm beyond frustrated and at my wits end. Our arguments about finances and our future are never-ending. I'll try not to write a book, but here's our quick background:

I am 27 and he is 32. He has a 5 year old daughter from a previous relationship, whom I absolutely love and think of her as my own. He makes about $2,000 more than I do a year, but he also pays $5,000 in child support. We agreed on a budget when we opened up a joint account, but he has yet to follow it. I was working full time 40 hours a week, a second job consisting of about 10 hours a week, and also 2-3 meal plans a month on the side (I'm a dietitian) to help increase our income so we can save up to start a family and get a new vehicle. My husband used to always talk about how he wanted us to have a child sooner than later, so my logic is to work hard so we can live comfortably and pay our bills; not luxuriously by any means. No sooner than I save it, he spends it. He love to compete in marathons and while it's a healthy hobby, it gets quite expensive. And it's no biggie for him to spend $200+ on the weekends eating out and going to the movies.

Lately, all we do is argue about money, and he won't agree to see a financial planner. My hours were cut at my full time job and it was changed from a salary position to hourly, so I have been stressed trying to find another full time job while I am still working my additional jobs in the meantime. I've expressed to my husband that him coming home every night telling me about a new race he wants to do in Disneyland or across the country does not help, as I am trying to save while he just wants to spend. His response to me: "It's not my fault that your hours got cut." I know it's not fun to budget, but someone has to keep an eye on the finances because we are not wealthy people by any means. I feel like he's a selfish man; it's all about his hobbies and his wants in life, and I'm just along for the ride to help pay bills.

In addition, when we fight and I try to express my emotions, he acts like a child by being defensive and twisting/manipulating the conversation to make me feel like I'm a terrible person for bringing up my feelings. Right after I tell him how I feel and he blows up, he will come back in the room acting like nothing has happened and say "are you done being mad?," putting the blame all on me. His daughter even said the other day "Daddy, she's your wife and you need to treat her right."--Wow, from a 5 year old that broke my heart. Not to mention, he has only sincerely apologized maybe two or three times in our relationship of five years; the other times are when I ask him if he is even sorry for the things he said/did, and he will reply "I'm sorry if I offended you." I seriously feel that he is bipolar and a child for that matter. And lately, when I say "when we have a child we will need to cut back on (x)," he replies with "IF we have a child; there are not guarantees in life." 

I used to cry a lot but now I just feel numb. I truly feel like I'm in this alone. He refuses to go to marriage counseling because he feels like he is doing nothing wrong. And while he is older than me, I feel his maturity level is comparable to that of a 16 year old boy. He won't swallow his pride to admit that he's ever wrong, and he won't give up his toys, hobbies, or football tickets, but he'll sit back and let me work to fund it all; and when I ask for appreciation for my efforts, it turns into a fight. I am not trying to demean him or rub in his face that I make more money, but I feel that he should respect me for wanting to work more to help save for OUR future.

My friends tell me that I am a young, pretty, smart girl who deserves better and can easily find a man who will treat me well because what I am experiencing is not a normal, healthy relationship. I've met with our pastor who married us and did our pre-martial counseling because I was desperate for help and my husband refused to attend counseling. She honestly stated that there is not much more I can offer because he is acting like little boy. I just don't know what to do. I'm scared to cut ties because I will lose my relationship with my stepdaughter, and the thought of having to sell my house and start fresh terrifies me. I know I can make it on my own, but being alone scares me to death because he is all I've ever known. In my heart I feel that he is never going to recognize his faults (and trust me, I have my own), but I just hope and pray every night that he will wake up so he doesn't lose me.

Any advice is greatly appreciated. I'm at my wits end.


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## VermisciousKnid

He sounds like a selfish jerk. The bottom line is that someone who is that selfish and so sure that he's "doing nothing wrong" may never change. You certainly haven't been able to change him through reason. He won't listen to a counselor. To me this means that he doesn't respect you or your marriage. 

Why did his previous relationship end? How long was it between the end of that one and the start of yours?

I think that you have to set some boundaries with serious consequences. No more pleading or trying to reason with him. He won't listen to you until he feels the result of violating your boundaries.


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## Observer

hoosierlady said:


> For starters, I feel quite embarrassed that I am even considering divorce, as my husband and I have only been married for 6 months, but I'm beyond frustrated and at my wits end. Our arguments about finances and our future are never-ending. I'll try not to write a book, but here's our quick background:
> 
> I am 27 and he is 32. He has a 5 year old daughter from a previous relationship, whom I absolutely love and think of her as my own. He makes about $2,000 more than I do a year, but he also pays $5,000 in child support. We agreed on a budget when we opened up a joint account, but he has yet to follow it. I was working full time 40 hours a week, a second job consisting of about 10 hours a week, and also 2-3 meal plans a month on the side (I'm a dietitian) to help increase our income so we can save up to start a family and get a new vehicle. My husband used to always talk about how he wanted us to have a child sooner than later, so my logic is to work hard so we can live comfortably and pay our bills; not luxuriously by any means. No sooner than I save it, he spends it. He love to compete in marathons and while it's a healthy hobby, it gets quite expensive. And it's no biggie for him to spend $200+ on the weekends eating out and going to the movies.
> 
> Lately, all we do is argue about money, and he won't agree to see a financial planner. My hours were cut at my full time job and it was changed from a salary position to hourly, so I have been stressed trying to find another full time job while I am still working my additional jobs in the meantime. I've expressed to my husband that him coming home every night telling me about a new race he wants to do in Disneyland or across the country does not help, as I am trying to save while he just wants to spend. His response to me: "It's not my fault that your hours got cut." I know it's not fun to budget, but someone has to keep an eye on the finances because we are not wealthy people by any means. I feel like he's a selfish man; it's all about his hobbies and his wants in life, and I'm just along for the ride to help pay bills.
> 
> In addition, when we fight and I try to express my emotions, he acts like a child by being defensive and twisting/manipulating the conversation to make me feel like I'm a terrible person for bringing up my feelings. Right after I tell him how I feel and he blows up, he will come back in the room acting like nothing has happened and say "are you done being mad?," putting the blame all on me. His daughter even said the other day "Daddy, she's your wife and you need to treat her right."--Wow, from a 5 year old that broke my heart. Not to mention, he has only sincerely apologized maybe two or three times in our relationship of five years; the other times are when I ask him if he is even sorry for the things he said/did, and he will reply "I'm sorry if I offended you." I seriously feel that he is bipolar and a child for that matter. And lately, when I say "when we have a child we will need to cut back on (x)," he replies with "IF we have a child; there are not guarantees in life."
> 
> I used to cry a lot but now I just feel numb. I truly feel like I'm in this alone. He refuses to go to marriage counseling because he feels like he is doing nothing wrong. And while he is older than me, I feel his maturity level is comparable to that of a 16 year old boy. He won't swallow his pride to admit that he's ever wrong, and he won't give up his toys, hobbies, or football tickets, but he'll sit back and let me work to fund it all; and when I ask for appreciation for my efforts, it turns into a fight. I am not trying to demean him or rub in his face that I make more money, but I feel that he should respect me for wanting to work more to help save for OUR future.
> 
> My friends tell me that I am a young, pretty, smart girl who deserves better and can easily find a man who will treat me well because what I am experiencing is not a normal, healthy relationship. I've met with our pastor who married us and did our pre-martial counseling because I was desperate for help and my husband refused to attend counseling. She honestly stated that there is not much more I can offer because he is acting like little boy. I just don't know what to do. I'm scared to cut ties because I will lose my relationship with my stepdaughter, and the thought of having to sell my house and start fresh terrifies me. I know I can make it on my own, but being alone scares me to death because he is all I've ever known. In my heart I feel that he is never going to recognize his faults (and trust me, I have my own), but I just hope and pray every night that he will wake up so he doesn't lose me.
> 
> Any advice is greatly appreciated. I'm at my wits end.


I understand your frustration, it does not sound like he has adapted to married life yet. You are correct, those actions you portrayed are very selfish and those of one not fully commited to the marriage. Problem is, you cannot make him do anything, he has to want to do it. 

Have you tried making him do the bills or insist you do them together? That way he can see debt to income first hand.

Have you told him the things you wrote? It's powerful and may provoke him to question his actions.

Let him know where you are. You are on the verge of divorce because he is not listening to you nor acting like a husband. Make him fully get it. It's great he has healthy hobbies, but he also has a family he is responsible for. That reality has to click with him...he is not single anymore.


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## hoosierlady

Thank you both for your replies; I really appreciate it.

His previous relationship was only 5 months long, as his girlfriend broke up with him soon after she became pregnant. I've never really known the real reason behind her decision (she has quite a bit of issues herself), but from what I've heard she felt that he could not provide for her and their unborn child, and well for lack of better words, she was just over him. But I have stumbled across old letters and based on what his friends have told me, he treated her like a queen--something else that I am very bitter about, as I feel that he is indeed capable of treating me better but he is just not willing to do so.

I've asked him if we could sit down once a week to go over our budget to ensure that we are all on the same page, but this has yet to happen. We do all of our bills online with automatic withdrawals, so it sounds like to I need to discontinue those and physically have him sit down and mail in the bills each month along with balancing a check book. Hopefully this will open his eyes to the world of financial responsibilities, but I can't help but feel that it's probably my own fault for taking over the finances because he feels that I will just "take care of us." 

You are correct that he has not yet adjusted to married life. I've had many tearful conversations with him to remind him that he cannot continue to live his bachelor lifestyle, as he has a wife and child to provide for. I have tried to open his eyes to the severity of the situation and my feelings about being alone, but this has not seemed to affect him. In his eyes, he feels that he can have a family without sacrificing all of his favorite past times. 

Maybe I have not presented the situation in an effective manner? Maybe I need to wipe my tears and be more stern with my feelings? He is the type of person who if you tell him to do something, he will deliberately not do it to remind you that no one makes him do anything unless he wants to. I'm on my last leg to convince him to want to save our relationship. I've mentioned this before and he responded with "don't threaten me with an ultimatum." He forgets that I am on his side and we are a team. I am not rooting against us, but I fear that his pride is more important that keeping his family together. 

I think he is too comfortable in our relationship and doesn't think that I will leave; or his pride and poor attitude makes him think "fine, leave, I don't need you." I know you cannot change someone, but it's a terrible feeling knowing that you have given your spouse the all the tools to save your marriage and they don't care enough to use them.


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## PBear

Perhaps you should look into financial counselling? How did he support himself before you got married? 

C


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## hoosierlady

He has said no to financial counseling; he doesn't feel that we need it. Prior to us being married I paid the bills and he wrote me a check for his portion. He began to resent me and got so angry at me for asking, even though the bills were due at the same time of the month. Again, I probably set myself up for this by enabling our financial situation from the beginning. 

He wants all these things, but he keeps forgetting that without me, he cannot afford our house or his excursions. Which is another reason why I thought he would put forth the effort to make our marriage work.


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## Observer

hoosierlady said:


> He has said no to financial counseling; he doesn't feel that we need it. Prior to us being married I paid the bills and he wrote me a check for his portion. He began to resent me and got so angry at me for asking, even though the bills were due at the same time of the month. *Again, I probably set myself up for this by enabling our financial situation from the beginning. *
> He wants all these things, but he keeps forgetting that without me, he cannot afford our house or his excursions. Which is another reason why I thought he would put forth the effort to make our marriage work.


Sorry to say but probably. He is another child to you at this point, not a partner. He has to understand this is how you view him and you have to accept that is the reality. If he refuses to change...I would seriously look into getting out now since it's only been a few months. I am pro marriage and encourage people to work things out, but when one person is unwilling to work, I do not fault the other from leaving. You are each others partners, not parents.


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## PBear

It's time for some boundaries. If he doesn't like them, the expression "tough nuggies" seems appropriate. 

C


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## Openminded

Don't bring a child into this until you feel comfortable your marriage has a good chance of working long-term. That's obviously not now and may not be any time soon. So be careful.


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## hoosierlady

Yes, I've definitely come to the realization that now is not a good time to have a child. Having a child will only exacerbate our marital and financial problems.


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## tacoma

OP, 

Seperate your finances, open a new account in your name only.
Do not give him access to this account.

Once a month get the check for his half of the bills and deposit it in this account.

Do not give him money, do not pay daily expenses for his child.

You have talked to him, offered counselling, and been quite patient only to be ignored and disrespected.

It's time to draw some boundaries


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## VermisciousKnid

OP,

He had a five month relationship that ended when his girlfriend got pregnant and he has a five year old daughter with a different woman?

You knew this when you two got together? He's an irresponsible POS. the fact that he's no good with money is just icing on the cake. He pays $5000 in child support for the five year old and he will soon have to pay more child support to the other woman? Or is this the same woman?

The fact that he spends on himself and you pay most of the rest means that you are paying some of the child support in a way. 

This guy must be all kinds of charming for you to think that he was a good catch.


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## cdbaker

I agree that he has probably become far too comfortable in the relationship as it is now and just isn't interested in seeing it change. I'd say if you are at the point of not being able to get through to him and make him understand how serious an issue this has become, then you'll have to start making some decisions on your own to give him some consequences for his actions.

One thing that he needs to understand is that there are things he can make a case/argument for or against, agree or disagree with, and then there are things that just are what they are. For instance, you might feel like it's important to have $500 left in the bank every month to put into savings, but he may feel that $250 per month is plenty. You can both make arguments and disagree on something like that. If however you are saying, "Our marriage is in trouble," then that isn't something he can simply disagree with or argue away. I say this because I know I used to be guilty of this very simple misunderstanding. My wife would tell me how she feels, and what I was hearing was that I had done something wrong. Whether I had done something wrong or not, whether my wife's feelings were "justified" or not, was completely irrelevant. If you feel that the marriage is in trouble, then the marriage IS in trouble, whether he agrees that it is or not. That's a tough thing for some of us guys to understand. He seems to be responding to you as if these matters can be argued away, and they can't. In my case, I even managed to convince my wife that I was right, that her feelings weren't justified, but all that did was make her feel dumb for feeling them or that something was wrong with her or that maybe I just didn't care.

Assuming he can't figure this out, since he hasn't so far, you might need to give him some consequences. I'd suggest that before you do, you give him one last chance to understand the situation by sitting him down directly and very plainly saying that the marriage is in trouble, you are unhappy within the marriage as it is now, and if something doesn't change soon then you will ultimately make the difficult decision to move on. The idea is you are saying things that can't be disputed. (He can't say that you aren't unhappy, or that you won't make this decision after all) It's ok to express that you don't WANT to make that decision, and you are willing to work with him on a plan for solving these problems, but the bottom line is that they must be solved one way or the other, soon.

If he still doesn't get it, or nothing changes, or he doesn't express a willingness to make an effort, then I'd say you need to step it up. You could ask him to move out of the house, or you can file for divorce. Please remember that the divorce process takes a very long time to complete, so you would have plenty of time to reconsider the situation, you don't have to decide that the marriage is actually over until many months later with the final papers in your hand. Ultimately what he needs at that point is a wake up call, a clear message that cannot be misunderstood, which says to him, "I have exactly two choices, she isn't letting this go, there are no discussions left to be had, I can accept that this is a major issue for her and make a genuine commitment to fixing some of our issues, or I can accept a divorce. That's it. Decision time." Often times the person has just never believed that his/her spouse would ever leave, or that they could get away with whatever behaviors it is indefinitely, or even if they still think nothing is really wrong, that it might just all go away on it's own. A message like being presented with divorce papers or being asked to move out, or both, can quickly dispel any misunderstanding.

From there, it's not at all uncommon for a wayward spouse to jolt into action and start taking positive steps in the marriage, having had the fear of losing their marriage put into them for the first time. It's really a last resort, but it can certainly work. Heck, it did for me!


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## cdbaker

VermisciousKnid said:


> OP,
> 
> He had a five month relationship that ended when his girlfriend got pregnant and he has a five year old daughter with a different woman?
> 
> You knew this when you two got together? He's an irresponsible POS. the fact that he's no good with money is just icing on the cake. He pays $5000 in child support for the five year old and he will soon have to pay more child support to the other woman? Or is this the same woman?
> 
> The fact that he spends on himself and you pay most of the rest means that you are paying some of the child support in a way.
> 
> This guy must be all kinds of charming for you to think that he was a good catch.


I think you are confused, there is no other woman, no other child. He has a 5-year old daughter from a prior relationship for which he pays $5K in child support annually, and the OP was just describing what she knew about that prior relationship. "Prior" as in it was completely before she and her husband started seeing each other.


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## Uptown

hoosierlady said:


> I seriously feel that he is bipolar and a child for that matter.


Perhaps he is exhibiting bipolar behavior, HL. That is not what you're describing, however. Childish behavior usually is far more characteristic of people having strong traits of BPD (Borderline Personality Disorder) because a BPDer's emotional development typically is frozen at about age four. I therefore suggest you take a look at my list of 12 Bipolar/BPD Differences, which is based on my experiences with my bipolar-1 foster son and my BPDer exW. 

If most of the BPD traits in that post sound applicable, I would suggest you take a quick look at my list of red flags at _*18 BPD Warning Signs*_. If most of those signs sound very familiar, I would suggest you read my more detailed description of them at my posts in _*Maybe's Thread*_. If that description rings any bells, I would be glad to join the other respondents in discussing them with you. Take care, HL.


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## Fleur de Cactus

Sorry to see you here but her are good people with good experiences who will give you advice. I am thinking that Your husband my have a type of personality disorder. Maybe BPD like someone says here or Narcissism. He is acting like a kid and his inability to respond to your concerns will drain emotionally. He is supposed to be there for you, to support you in everything, instead it sounds like you are always concerned, just like you can be around a kid. 
My concern is that you indicated that he is the only one you have. He may know this and that is the reason he does not make any effort to change or listening to you. There is something that is not right in his personality; something women discover after a couple of months living with him, after that he starts feeling comfortable with relationship. Try to read the symptoms of BPD or N and see if you can make connection. Did he ever receive any sort of treatment?


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## hoosierlady

Thank you all for your advice, I really appreciate it!

Yes, VermisciousKnid, I think I confused you with the way that I phrased my description. He only has one child, which was born prior to our relationship 5 years ago. Believe it or not; he is quite the charmer and swept me away with his initial chivalrous personality. 

I have to admit though that he does single handedly pay for his child support and his half of the mortgage, but I think I need to remove my portion of money that is not being used for the bills and place it into my personal account (which I never closed and I only have access to for this reason).

You have all given me so much insight. I think my next step is to have one last serious talk about how unhappy I am in this marriage, and as you mentioned, my unhappiness cannot be argued away. I will need to set borders and have serious consequences if he cannot follow them. If he still refuses to comply, I have realized that at the end of the day I am only one person and responsible for only my actions. We may be able to bend in some areas, but if he truly wants to save this marriage, the ball will be in his court and the decision will be left up to him.

And Uptown, that is interesting that you mention BPD. As much as I love him, the more childish behavior that he exhibits, the more I wonder if this is not just a selfish man but something more severe. I will look into that and I appreciate your posting.


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## Orange_Pekoe

hoosierlady said:


> Thank you both for your replies; I really appreciate it.
> 
> His previous relationship was only 5 months long, as his girlfriend broke up with him soon after she became pregnant. I've never really known the real reason behind her decision (she has quite a bit of issues herself), but from what I've heard she felt that he could not provide for her and their unborn child, and well for lack of better words, she was just over him. But I have stumbled across old letters and based on what his friends have told me, he treated her like a queen--something else that I am very bitter about, as I feel that he is indeed capable of treating me better but he is just not willing to do so.
> 
> I've asked him if we could sit down once a week to go over our budget to ensure that we are all on the same page, but this has yet to happen. We do all of our bills online with automatic withdrawals, so it sounds like to I need to discontinue those and physically have him sit down and mail in the bills each month along with balancing a check book. Hopefully this will open his eyes to the world of financial responsibilities, but I can't help but feel that it's probably my own fault for taking over the finances because he feels that I will just "take care of us."
> 
> You are correct that he has not yet adjusted to married life. I've had many tearful conversations with him to remind him that he cannot continue to live his bachelor lifestyle, as he has a wife and child to provide for. I have tried to open his eyes to the severity of the situation and my feelings about being alone, but this has not seemed to affect him. In his eyes, he feels that he can have a family without sacrificing all of his favorite past times.
> 
> Maybe I have not presented the situation in an effective manner? Maybe I need to wipe my tears and be more stern with my feelings? He is the type of person who if you tell him to do something, he will deliberately not do it to remind you that no one makes him do anything unless he wants to. I'm on my last leg to convince him to want to save our relationship. I've mentioned this before and he responded with "don't threaten me with an ultimatum." He forgets that I am on his side and we are a team. I am not rooting against us, but I fear that his pride is more important that keeping his family together.
> 
> I think he is too comfortable in our relationship and doesn't think that I will leave; or his pride and poor attitude makes him think "fine, leave, I don't need you." I know you cannot change someone, but it's a terrible feeling knowing that you have given your spouse the all the tools to save your marriage and they don't care enough to use them.


I feel for you. So much of your concerns, and the replies in this thread, remind me of my own situation. Although the reasons for my marital problems are different from yours (mine involved a completely messed-up living situation because we lived as a pack with his family) I also felt like I had done all I could to get my husband to open his eyes to our very dire situation, and change. But he didn’t. Things kept getting worse, he kept thinking and saying that he was right and I was wrong. And was very full of pride. I’m very sad that he had all the tools to protect our marriage, but did just the opposite by making very poor (and avoidable) choices. It was painful because I loved him very much, and he loved me too.

Eventually, I had had enough. My only option was to either stay and tolerate the way things were, or leave. So I packed up all of my belongings, put my 1 and half year old in her car-seat and drove away. 7 months later (after a lot of insecurities, anger, hurt, confusion, trying to reconcile, giving him many opportunities and chances and requesting from him to make things right), I’m finally at a place where I feel peaceful and confident that I CAN MOVE ON and take care of myself. I work full-time, take care of my daughter (my parents babysit her during the day) and am moving in to a new condo. It was not easy getting to this point, but I did it.

I’m writing this because you said he’s all you’ve known, and you’re afraid of the future and of being alone. We all are. But fear is not an excuse to continue living miserably. We all know, deep down, that the other side of fear is freedom. 

I think that you should try your best to express your concerns to your husband, ask him to go to a financial advisor, ask him to attend marriage counselling with you. But if he refuses, if he clearly isn’t changing, and you’re miserable – then you will eventually make a decision. To tolerate, or leave. It all depends on how unhappy you are, and nobody else can gauge that for you. Only you know how serious your problems are, and if they warrant separation.

Best of luck – everything will be OK. Always remember that you deserve to be healthy and peaceful. Do not let anyone or anything beat you down, including your own fears.


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## CarlaRose

I hope you will come to your senses soon and stop making excuses not to leave him and stop being afraid to leave him. In the meantime, or if you never come to your sense, all you have to do is separate your finances. If you don't want him spending up your money, then stop giving him your money to spend. How is that difficult to think on your own? You don't want to leave him, and you don't want him spending your savings, so then don't leave and cut off access to the bank account. Get your own individual account with only your own name on it. There now. Problem solved.

As for building a future, clearly he doesn't want to build a future. Well, you don't want to leave him, so what do you do? You stop building a future with him, especially since whatever future you are building he either wants no part of it, or you will just be financing his future. He's living off you now and will continue to live off you in that future you are building. Build your future for yourself so you don't have to wait for man to give you flowers.

I can't even imagine why you want a child with this guy. You are here complaining about him being a terrible husband to you, but you want his children. Okay. Whatever you say. But I hope you realize how this makes you look.

About being along for the ride? You are. Clearly, you are. You KNOW you are. And, there is something else you.....you are the one paying for that ride he is taking you on.

You are a hard-working, principled woman, who has standards, plans, hopes, and dreams. You and your husband are very unevenly yoked. You don't share in those things, and you both want very different things. You met this guy and fell in love with him without scrutinizing the kind of person he was. He's not a terrible person, certainly not the worst guy you could find, but he's not the guy for you. You should have noticed that before you married him. I know how some people dupe their mates and hide their true selves until after marriage, but there is always plenty to see because it isn't possible to hide everything. You just ignored all the signs because your in fantasy marriage, he will be the perfect husband.

So, since he isn't the worst type of guy on earth and you don't want to leave him, then just make the best of things. Plan for your own future, stop letting him spend your money, hope that he will agree to children one day (pleeeease don't), and keep praying he will change. Stop expecting him to agree with you. You don't agree with him, do you? Are you willing to become capricious and care free like him? You can't expect him to be willing to become someone other than who he is. This is the kind of stuff you have to make decisions about. When you discover you are not compatible; when you discover you want very different things out of life; when you discover you are married to an insensitive, inconsiderate, selfish jerk, then you make the decision on what to do about it. Either accept it and make the best of it, or leave. Those are your options.

I will tell you also that you are making the same mistake that most women make. We get married and then start applying what we think we want marriage to be. We have an idea in our heads of what marriage is, what marriage means, how our husband will treat us, the kind of person our husband will be, and our beautiful 2.5 children. We begin dreaming of our wedding and our marriage somewhere around 12 years old. But, I've read or heard from a lot of men like Steve Harvey and others (including articles on the internet) that men don't do that. As prepubescent boys, they think about getting the girls and pretty much continue that same pursuit until...... You have to understand that what men want is the girl. Steve Harvey and others say, "All we want is you." Some (probably most) men marry for regular and convenient coochie (a term I learned from men on this board) and according to some guys "We just go along with the rest so we can have you." That doesn't mean they don't want family and a good home life, but it does explain the nitty gritty differences between men and women.

All of this boils down to one very important thing, which is that men have no idea what marriage means. They don't know what it means to have a wife or so many wouldn't disrespect their wife, minimize and ignore her feelings like yours does. Those are lessons some of them might learn at some point in life, but generally they don't know it off the bat. They haven't spent their lives dreaming about it like you and I did, and nobody tells them at any point along the way. What I have learned from this board and many other similar boards is how often men mistreat their wives and really don't know and don't care at the time they are doing it. When they begin to care; when it starts to matter to them; when they realize the mistakes they made is when she finally gets fed up and leaves. THEN, they want to start acting like a husband. They beg us not to leave and make a zillion promises to change and declare to high heaven they won't do it again, all to get us to stay. Usually, the good behavior lasts about 3 weeks (if that long), and they go right back to the same old inconsiderate and disrespectful (if not down right abusive) crap.

You're going to have to accept that your husband is not the man in your head. The man in your head doesn't exist because nobody is perfect and the ideal man will never be born. Accept that this is the man you are married to, and you have to either tolerate him or leave him. If he were a worse kind of guy, I wouldn't even suggest that you tolerate him or try to make the best of the situation. I would beg you to leave him. Although, nobody ever does. Just like men have the flaws, we women do too. We stay. We don't leave. We put up with all manner of disrespect and abuse and make all kinds of excuses not to leave. So, I know you would not leave even if I told you your life depended on it and if you ever did leave, it wouldn't be for many years down the line when you finally get sick of him. 

Nevertheless, I'm not begging you to leave him because I've known, heard of, and read on these boards and many others just how much worse your guy COULD be. He's inconsiderate. He's selfish. He's disrespectful. He's a jerk. And, yes, he could be infinitely worse. So, you don't want to leave him, then don't. But since you don't, then stop complaining and make the best of what you have. You didn't need anyone here to tell you to stop giving him your money to spend. You're a big girl now. Handle your business. Handle your business in spite of him.


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## CarlaRose

After I posted above, I went and read some of the responses, and I see you're making another common mistake. You're comparing your relationship with his previous. But, you don't know anything about their relationship. His friends didn't know either, so they had nothing concrete to tell you. Nobody except her can give you real insight to their relationship or tell you why she left him.

Think about it:

1. She obviously left for a reason, and that reason obviously was NOT that he treated her like a queen.

2. Outside appearances are ALWAYS deceiving. You said yourself that he charmed you. That's what happens. He's a charmer, and charmers are charming outside of their intimate relationships. They are charming to the world to make everyone think they are so great. They are charming to the new love interest to make sure she falls in love with him. But, within the relationship? They are awful, and it always comes as a shocking and hurtful surprise to the love interest because by then, she all in love and all that jazz with great expectations. She gets thrown for total loop. It's very common.

3. As I mentioned before, many people dupe their mates into marriage. You were duped. He made you think he wanted more children, for example. Look at what the message is that he's sending now. He doesn't have to keep up the pretense anymore. You've already been duped, so what would be the point? After they get you is the time for the great reveal, where he shows his true self and all the lies come to the surface.

The thing is, you are comparing and resenting he was so much MORE to her, when he was exactly the same to her. He wasn't Mr. Wonderful in their relationship. He was only Mr. Wonderful to the outside world who were looking. He was only Mr. Wonderful to her when he was trying to get her. She became pregnant, which is just as good or better than duping her into marriage because it still makes the charmer feel the woman is his and tied to him forever. Yes, the may have had a whirlwind romance (because that's the charmer's MO), but then you may be certain that Dr. Jekyl surely did turn into Mr. Hyde on HER too. You have nothing to be jealous or resentful about their relationship. She left him didn't she??? And you said yourself she felt he could not provide for her their child. Why doesn't that sound familiar to you? Why doesn't that tell you he has ALWAYS squandered money? How is that being so much better to her than to you? Now just imagine her with a baby to take care of by herself now. 

Stop comparing. You're just making yourself sick with self pity and loathing for nothing. You and no one else know anything about it. And, you notice I said that only she can tell you how it was, but I didn't HE can tell you. Well, the reason is that he will forever be the charmer in that respect. He'll never tell you exactly what happened. He will tell you only enough to make her the blame and the villain and make himself the innocent victim. If you really want to know, ask her. In meanwhile, stop comparing.


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## EleGirl

hoosierlady said:


> Thank you all for your advice, I really appreciate it!
> 
> Yes, VermisciousKnid, I think I confused you with the way that I phrased my description. He only has one child, which was born prior to our relationship 5 years ago. Believe it or not; he is quite the charmer and swept me away with his initial chivalrous personality.
> 
> I have to admit though that he does single handedly pay for his child support and his half of the mortgage, but I think I need to remove my portion of money that is not being used for the bills and place it into my personal account (which I never closed and I only have access to for this reason).
> 
> You have all given me so much insight. I think my next step is to have one last serious talk about how unhappy I am in this marriage, and as you mentioned, my unhappiness cannot be argued away. I will need to set borders and have serious consequences if he cannot follow them. If he still refuses to comply, I have realized that at the end of the day I am only one person and responsible for only my actions. We may be able to bend in some areas, but if he truly wants to save this marriage, the ball will be in his court and the decision will be left up to him.
> 
> And Uptown, that is interesting that you mention BPD. As much as I love him, the more childish behavior that he exhibits, the more I wonder if this is not just a selfish man but something more severe. I will look into that and I appreciate your posting.


How old are you and how old is he?

Before you have that last talk with him about how unhappy you are with the marriage and him, I suggest that you read the books "Love Busters" and "His Needs, Her Needs". I think that they will help you more clearly tell him how you feel and things about all that has been going on.

The way your husband gets defensive when you bring up issues is not unusual. People often feel attacked in these sorts of conversations. So they don't really hear what other person is saying. All they hear is that they are being blamed and attacked. So they go into defense mode. Once that happens it's all down hill.

Plus, in your husband's case, he might additionally go into defense mode to shut you down. That way he never has to even listen to you, much less address your issues. 

Because will not actually listen to you and gets defensive immediately, I think it would be wise to write out what you want to say to him. Let him read it. He cannot interrupt the written word. 

Now he might not read it. He might react badly. But at least you got to say what you needed to say.

In the letter let him know that if he will not address these issues with you, you will file from divorce. Give him a clear list of what you need in order to continue in the marriage: 

•	You want him to go to marriage and financial counseling with you
•	You want him to read the books mentioned above and to then work through them with you.
•	You want him to work with you on your finances.
•	And so forth


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## The Mysterious One

My sympathies. I can relate to your situation as I'm in a similar one myself...

My wife is horrible with money. I've had to somewhat put a stranglehold on the money to where I have a checking and a savings account she doesn't have access to - I HATE doing this, it does NOT feel right but I feel I've no other choice. All of our savings resides in my account and my paychecks go to my checking account. I transfer into our joint checking every payday for expenses, etc. and then additional transfers thereafter for additional expenses. Unfortunately, it only partially mitigated the problem as it doesn't address the underlying issue. She is someone who gets defensive, plays the victim, and becomes angry when I try to talk about serious issues like finances. Not an easy person to talk to... needless to say hence why the situation has yet to be resolved 

I'm not sure what advice I can provide since I have yet to resolve my own situation so feel free to ignore me . I hope it helps to know you are not alone in the type of situation you are in. I feel your pain. If your husband is unwilling to work it out with you then it may be best to move on. That may seem scary but you will be ok. Your friends and family are your support network and can play a big part in helping your transition if you choose to get out of your current situation.

Reading other comments here, I tend to agree it sounds as if he's suffering from some kind of personality disorder. Without proper treatment, there's no hope of improvement. If he truly believes he's done nothing wrong and turns it around on you like it's you that's the problem, then there's nothing you can possibly do but get out now before it continues to get worse. There will be no convincing him otherwise. The first step to problem resolution is to admit you have a problem - something it sounds like he may never do.

Keep positive, look out for yourself, surround yourself with supportive people, and do what you feel is right. Life isn't easy but situations are only temporary. No matter which path you find yourself on, I wish you the best.


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## Dollystanford

Money problems can be devastating to a marriage

The signs are not good. Separate your finances until you are comfortable with his attitude. If things go south make sure you can support yourself, don't find yourself saddled with debt because he gets angry when you try to curb him. I lived it, I'm now out of it. It's blissful not to have to worry


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