# can separation save us?



## emoSlow (May 3, 2009)

I found out about my wife's cheating a week ago, which had been going on for a month. She's stopped it at my request - for now. She wants to separate indefinitely (though not divorce), and she wants complete, 100% freedom, to disconnect from me, see others, etc... 

In talking with her, I've learned that she has emotionally checked out of our 8 year marriage almost completely - slowly, but surely over the last year or so.

I'm not judging her at all for this affair - I know her actions don't define her, they were a result of her not feeling that I have been giving her enough in our marriage - and she's right. In many ways, this affair is more my fault than hers (this is not victim syndrome - she's been a better wife than I have husband).

She's given me a list of the ways that I've fallen short that in her mind has added up to a consistent theme of me not caring enough about her, which eventually drained all of her ability to care about me: I had a 1-week affair at year3 (yes, devastated us both - first her - and as a consequence, me), I spent too much time at school/work, don't seek out quality time enough with her & 2 young kids, some of our fights have been loud and not always entirely respectful, etc...

It sounds like a horrible list I know. I also know it's not her fault that she can't see the positives of who I am and what great things we've done, let alone the potential of us as we learn to understand how to connect better and better over time (I had already made significant changes in recent years, and am always looking to be a better man for her).

I'm so shocked that this drain happened right under my nose as I was doing my best - in the ways that I knew how - to show her how she means everything to me. I love her beyond words, always have, and always will. Aside from a couple of loud fights, I have always been respectful, reasonably thoughtful (though not in a few ways she had expected), affectionate, caring husband - the problem is that I've matured too slowly to be able to demonstrate this to her in enough of the right ways, and now I think it's too late.

What I've learned this past week is that I've been an emotional idiot - pure and simple. It all seems so obvious in retrospect- I don't blame her brain for one second in doubting my love - no matter all of the positive things that I had thought was a reasonably strong foundation to a loving, respectful marriage.

She's hopeful that our kids lives will be better with her happy - even if that means divorce - though she doesn't know as well as I do that there's no such thing as a divorce that doesn't severely affect the kids lives and their perceptions of peace and comfort. I guess I can't blame her for thinking of her own peace & sanity first - the tragic thing is I know I can give her the peace and sanity that she truly deserves. I have been growing into a better person slowly, but surely, over the years, and this recent paradigm shift I've had in seeing how some of my shortfalls meant so much pain to her has revolutionized my thinking.

She's said she's ok with counseling, but it's clear to see she has given up virtually all hope of us being able to reconcile. Her doubts are spreading to me slowly but surely.

Either she doesn't believe that my paradigm shift of learning about just how badly I have been falling short will be sufficient in changing me, or she is so shut down from me that she doesn't even care. Actually, I think it's both - she's told me as much.

Does separation / counseling really and truly hold hope in the desperate situations - the ones where the wife has already checked out? 

Half of me thinks she's suggesting separation/counseling instead of divorce so she won't have to feel bad to say she divorced me, like she'd rather have me do it. Man oh man when love leaves the building, where does the faith in humanity - in my one true love ever - go?

Am I an idiot to hope? Or should I start moving on and check my own brain out of the whole thing?

I assume I need to give her 100% space like she's asked for - how on earth will that result in her ever getting positive perspective and faith in my potential that she'd even consider opening her mind to me again?


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## martino (May 12, 2008)

Too much time at work and school? give yourself a break and throw some blame back on her now. It's not like you sat around playing video games and looking internet porn right? that's a lame excuse on her end. Your school and working is obviously for the better of the the family.


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## emoSlow (May 3, 2009)

i'm not really interested in placing blame at this point

The school degree that I did came right after my affair, and it was completely idiotic of me to have gone ahead with it when i should have been staying at home with my wife and helping her through things

the main thing i'm interested in is how to give her the space she needs right now - can i really help her heal, or is stopping email/talking altogether with her the best? 

some of her perspectives on me and on the good parts of our marriage are really skewed right now, which in part i think she used to justify and rationalize her affair - some of her claims are way outside of reality

if i were to give her 2 months of space without any balance to this lopsided voice in her head - i can't see how she'll ever consider that we could be good together again? right now in her head, she's made us out to be terrible and incompatible in every way, which is so far from the truth (not only in my opinion, but in countless wonderful times and moments we've shared together)

on the other hand, if i pester her with too many words/promises of what we could be, she'll probably keep tuning me out and not really believe most of what i'm saying


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## martino (May 12, 2008)

I think it all comes down to if you really want to fight to save it or not. Is she still seeing this other person? if she really has cut ties I think you have a chance. Can seperation save you? no, should you start moving on? only you know.


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## emoSlow (May 3, 2009)

ok, so the last day or so has been really positive.

Not in terms of 'winning her back' - in fact my whole brain has shifted dramatically in terms of that being the right thing for us anyway

I don't think of this thing as a 'fighting for her' thing anymore. That was certainly my first reaction of how to approach this - to fight/win/insert male cliche, but now I've shifted to a deeper view of what we need to do - it's not about winning anything, it's about connecting and attaining a truer form of living and loving - whether that means we stay married or not

we've decided we're going to be friends, and only friends for now (separation, but no divorce), and just see how we feel about what direction to go in the coming weeks and months. We'll keep raising kids together and trying to get to know each other - in many ways, for the first time ever! 

I feel like I have a new me that she needs to get to know, and I feel like she's a girl that I never really and truly dug deep enough to connect with her in much of a real way (though the old me thought that I did). 

I can hardly believe that after 8 years of marriage I had never REALLY gotten to know her, nor had we really built much of a bond other than a bit of surface romantic love, holy smokes. Part of me wishes I could have had this epiphany 7 or 8 years ago, but I'm not a person to ever regret things, just am thankful I figured it out now, because I can already sense the huge benefits it's going to bring to my life - and to all around me, including kids, parents, friends - for my remaining many years. 

If my wife and I decide that we're not right for each other after spending a few months thinking about it, the next girl I connect with is going to reap some huge benefits!

I don't really know what will happen with my wife & our love for each other in the next few weeks and months - i do know it will be different - I don't know if/how romantic it will be, but I do know it will be a deeper, more honest love than we've ever had, and that actually makes me feel even better about the whole thing.

i'll keep writing in the coming days - maybe my search for a better life and love will benefit other lost souls


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## wonder (Jun 30, 2008)

don't give excuses for either affairs. there's absolutely no reason for people to cheat. if someone wants someone else, they should get out of the relationship they're in.

it takes 2 for a marriage to go bad, so don't for 1 second you're completely to blame


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## Sprite (Nov 3, 2008)

It sounds to me like you have a pretty level head on your shoulders. Being friends right now is the best thing you can do. But the key is for you to be total honest with her. Communication goes a long long way in patching things up. At least you learned this 8 years in and not 20 years later  There is still hope, don't give up. Don't get totally discouraged when she shuts down from you, this IS going to happen. Take it one day at a time and do not expect anything from her.

I wish you the best of luck and pray for you to have patience, you will need it more than you ever thought you were capable of.


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## emoSlow (May 3, 2009)

Sprite, I think that's pretty good advice - not really sure how well I'm going to do with the patience thing. I'm a bit worried that with us not spending much time with each other, my doubts will grow about her ever wanting us to form something real again, and I'll feel like running even farther away from her, or into the arms of the nearest person who can provide me comfort (nobody like that now - and I hope I don't meet them).

I'm so torn about separation being a healthy thing - I know it is when the couple can't get along, and things are unbearable, but this isn't our problem - my wife having fallen out of love - being separated doesn't seem to get to the root of that problem, and may only increase the distance and the focus we'll be able to devote to learning about the 'new us'... Sometimes it doesn't feel like she really wants to work on things, just wants to move on.

This is by far the scariest thing I have ever had to live through.

Crazy how life seems so normal one day, and the next you're hit with a sledgehammer to your chest. Sometimes I don't blame my wife for helping with the sledgehammer, but Wonder, you're right - it does take two to allow things to get so bad that separation is the only remaining option... 

Wherever I am in 1 year, I'm going to be thankful it's not in my present situation.

thanks all


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## seibert253 (Apr 29, 2009)

I hate to sound negative, because you've had enough negativity lately, but I want to give you a dose of reality.
Has your wife really ended her affair? Are you 100% certain, or has she just told you this. I'm sorry, but she sounds selfish and unremorseful.

I don't know you or your wife, but after reading your posts several times, sounds to me like she's in the affair fog. Often when an affair is brought to light, and the person says the affair has ended, the WP will continue, or "reconnect" with their affair partner. The betrayed spouse becomes the "fall back on", if things don't work out. The BS is strung along, waiting and hoping the WS will snap out of it and come home. All while, the WS "finds themselves" by corraling around with their affair partner.

I don't know if you fall into this catagory and I hope you don't. You deserve better. You deserve to be someones' first choice, not someones second if things don't work out.

You are not going to "love" a spouse who's in the affair fog out of it. Loving, clinging, "being there" at their becon call will only reinforce their negative actions and push them further away. A WS wants to remain "friends" because they feel guilty about what they're doing, and don't want to feel bad about the pain they've inflicted on the person they "used" to love.

There's only one thing that snaps a WS out of the fog, a 2X4 of reality upside the head. That 2X4 starts with the 180. If your not familar with the 180, look it up.

I suggest if you do seperate, she leaves, you don't. You are not the one checking out of your marriage, she is, therefore she leaves.

Distance makes the heart grow fonder. Doesn't sound like it does, but it DOES, and it does work.

Limit your contact with the WS, as a matter of fact if you have children, limit your contact with the WS to matters about the children, nothing else. She calls you, you do not call her. If she calls wanting to talk about anything else, like how's your day, or today I did this, this, and this, tell her that your sorry, but you don't feel like talking about this right now. As a matter of fact, you're better off not answering her calls. Make her call you several times before you answer her. If she calls wanting you to come over, or she wants to come over, tell her your sorry but your not available. If she emails or texts, do not answer them, or at least do not answer them right away. Give them a couple of days.

Do not be her "crutch", do not "be there for her". She needs to experience what life will be like without you, and she needs to see that you do not need her, and you are moving forward, not living in the sorrow that she caused. This is the only thing that will snap her out of it, and she will regain respect for you for standing up for yourself.

Some will tell you these will only push the WS closer to the affair partner. They are missing the point, the WS already prefers their affair partner because they are living in a fantasy. Well as you know, fantasies are not reality, and they have a tendency to crash and burn when reality shows up. The 180 shows the WS the reality of life without their "true love", not their fantasy.

If you decide to pursue this course of action, it will be the hardest thing you've ever done. You need to stay strong, and stay the course. It will work. It may take weeks, it may take months, but remember this is about YOU. If your marriage is ment to be, she will come back. If she doesn't, then trust me, you are better off without someone who will betray the ultimate trust. There is someone who will treat you the way you deserve to be treated, it may be your renewed wife, it may be someone else, but they're out there.
Good Luck and God Bless.


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## seibert253 (Apr 29, 2009)

Sprite said:


> It sounds to me like you have a pretty level head on your shoulders. Being friends right now is the best thing you can do. But the key is for you to be total honest with her. Communication goes a long long way in patching things up. At least you learned this 8 years in and not 20 years later  There is still hope, don't give up. Don't get totally discouraged when she shuts down from you, this IS going to happen. Take it one day at a time and do not expect anything from her.
> 
> I wish you the best of luck and pray for you to have patience, you will need it more than you ever thought you were capable of.


I have to respectfully disagree that being friends is the best thing you can do. This will only give her negative reinforcement and make her feel better about treating you like crap.

The only thing that will bring her back and make her see the light is distance. She wants a seperation, fine, she needs to experience life without you and see if this is what she truly wants. This is about YOU not her. Distance from her will help you see that you can live without her, and help you to heal. It will also not allow her to string you on. If it's over, it's better to know sooner to allow you to heal quicker and move on. Not stay in limboland.


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## emoSlow (May 3, 2009)

Seibert,

Wow, a lot of what you have said rings true... You've shown me that I'm going to need to think a lot more deeply about this stuff.

Really appreciate the perspective.


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## emoSlow (May 3, 2009)

Ok, so I've had a hard day. I found out that she did go back and resume contact with the guy, and slept with him a few days ago. She denied it until I had the smoking gun.

Now she's ready for a REAL effort to stay away from this guy... Hmm deja vu.

This is pretty bad isn't it...

Her head is stuck in fantasy land with this guy. I found an internet chat between them, and it's pretty sad - tittering kind of fluffly love land - Ooh let's go to vegas together, that was bad that we kissed tonight hee hee.. Sweet jesus, it reminds me of being 17 again.

The problem is that once someone's brain is in the fantasy world, they feel REAL feelings for the other person. I know for a fact that a significant part of my wife actually BELIEVES that he does have potential to be this magical person who would fulfill the missing pieces of her marriage. She thinks it would be a viable thing for us to separate and she continues this relationship to FIND HERSELF.

I don't blame her too much - in her head she's on the puppy love crack. She can't really see 6 months ahead, where the vacation in vegas with new guy and the 2 kids being towed along is not exactly as romantic as it had seemed. She can't see the negatives of new guy because she's so enthralled with all of the great things about that other person that seems so much better than the uncaring husband of 8 years whose warts have been on plain display for so many years. And of COURSE the relationship with new guy seems great in the first 3-6 months - what new relationship isn't fun, new, exciting, emotionally and physically rewarding, etc... etc..

He's even managed to dupe her into thinking that he'd be the kind of guy who would be willing and able to commit to her and be that person that she deserves. What a load of crap. The guy didn't put up a fight for her at all when he got busted again - he says he's going to make an effort to REALLY stay away this time. What a coward, and what a cheap personality he has that he will never be able to live up to this false dream that he's been feeding my wife.

I've been out with this guy (before the affair started), and he was talking about other women in a very typical conquest fashion, extremely typically shallow guy. It's so obvious to me coming from guy world that the conquest thing is what is driving him to be the preferred choice of my wife. Not to suggest he doesn't have SOME feelings for my wife - he also does in fantasy land, but he obviously knows that once you leave fantasy land for the real world, the costs of those feelings are too high for him.

There's got to be another 2x4 method of injecting reality into her brain rather than us walking away from each other, which in my head seems to increase the chances of killing any chance we have - or am I wrong about that?

Ok I'm done my venting.

Have more thinking to do.


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