# no more mr nice guy questions



## jarhead (Feb 19, 2014)

so i am about half way through the book now. I started reading because i have lost all power in my life, strength to stand up for myself and needs, and because my wife has had an ongoing affair for two years + now and im seeing more of the pain and damage it has done that somehow i have repressed.

My question is that in the book it states how Nice Guys ...

"They genuinely believe their commitment to being "good" and doing it "right" is what makes them valuable and compensates for their internalized belief that they are bad."

"Nice Guys interpret a woman's approval as the ultimate validation of their worth. Signs of a woman's approval can take the form of her desire to have sex, flirtatious behavior, a smile, a touch, or attentiveness."

"Nice Guys have told me that they feel guilty if they are in a good
mood when their partner is not."


Above i have pulled just a few things i read and noticed, these are all things i do see myself doing or feeling but.. here is what blew me away i know before my wife and i got together back when i was 19 and her 16 almost 17 i had some traits of "nice guy" but i also was one F what people think of me im me and if you dont like it so be it but i still cared helped and compromised with people just definetly was more about me. 

Over the years io have been worked more and more into the above statments but they were worked into me by my Wife. 

she wants me to do or feel these things. If i dont change my ways or be what she wants why should she end the affair. 

If i dont meet her needs or wants she will be distant not want to flirt or attentive this is not huge but enough to notice. She had done alot of the giving even though i was distant and withdrawn (she says this but i do not think it was as bad as she made it) before when we were first married right before i found out she was still talking to this guy ( she had cheated on me with him before when we were dating) But she gave up on trying because i didnt change my ways.

Lasty she get upset or atleast through actions and words makes me feel as if she is upset because she is down and depressed about our broken marriage or her having two abortions (pregnant from OM) to try and save our marriage and show she wanted to save us and i am in a good o atleast upbeat mood.

Is it possible to have someone push you to be that "Nice guy" that is not really me atleast not to the point i am now.


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## Applejuice (Feb 21, 2014)

jarhead said:


> Above i have pulled just a few things i read and noticed, these are all things i do see myself doing or feeling but.. here is what blew me away i know before my wife and i got together back when i was 19 and her 16 almost 17 i had some traits of "nice guy" but i also was one F what people think of me im me and if you dont like it so be it but i still cared helped and compromised with people just definetly was more about me.
> 
> Over the years io have been worked more and more into the above statments but they were worked into me by my Wife.
> 
> she wants me to do or feel these things. If i dont change my ways or be what she wants why should she end the affair.


I think I understand Jarhead. You have to familiarise yourself with the concept of 'sh*t tests'.

'Sh*t tests' are periodic reliability checks that insecure partners perform on their 'beloved' to assess a) their commitment and b) their security.

If you fail the 'sh*t test', your laydee will deduct respect points from you because you're not living up to her preconceived notion of the masculine ideal. That is, you should be a c*ck swinging neanderthal with all the innate interpersonal skills of a deaf leper.

Either you were too apologetic, submissive or accommodating. She wanted you to assert yourself and prove that next time a streaker flashed her in the park, you'd be able and willing to punch his lights out or at least, talk at him really assertively!

...and with every successive failure, you're now in respect debt! She sees it as her doing you a favour by sticking around. Hell, she killed two foetuses just for you. It's all your fault and she's completely in the clear because if you'd only passed her 'sh*t tests', she'd never have had to console herself in the arms of another man.

Now you must be able to see how absurd your situation is Jarhead. You're not the first and you certainly won't be the last. You'll find plenty of moral support and encouragement here but for the love of God, assert yourself - not for her sake, for your sake and for the sake of your kids.



jarhead said:


> ..Lasty she get upset or atleast through actions and words makes me feel as if she is upset because she is down and depressed about our broken marriage or her having two abortions (pregnant from OM) to try and save our marriage and show she wanted to save us and i am in a good o atleast upbeat mood.


There, stop doing that for the love of God! So she throws you a bone by uttering a few words that she picks at random out of her '1000 insincere gestures' phrasebook and you immediately start beaming your tipex teeth and give her a rub down and slap up meal. You're just hemorrhaging respect points.

Stand firm, tell her how it's going to be from now on. Lay down ground rules - not draconian but strict and perfectly in line with most married couples expectations. (hint: it doesn't include infidelities). If she moans or dribbles or burps or stomps out, let her go. Don't chase after her, don't beg and don't compromise - the ball is firmly in her court and her answer should determine your next move, even if you have to take it all the way.



jarhead said:


> Is it possible to have someone push you to be that "Nice guy" that is not really me atleast not to the point i am now.


Yes... see above!  Chin up Jarhead, this is all good stuff. I felt so liberated when I found this site and when I realised I wasn't the only one who'd been there. If you really embrace the 'man up' philosophy, you'll never go back.


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## jarhead (Feb 19, 2014)

Her- Scared of not having u..ur distancing urself a lot
Her- Ya know i'm scared most of doing this alone and with Addy I knew u were there!
Me-
I'm on **** list? With Sean. I'm very sorry your so scared and that i am distant. A lot in my head and I'm filtering a lot but for the bettef
Her- Idk what's even going on
Me- Idk fully either but I know I've tried before but for anything to change in our lives I need to fix my way of thinking and handling life so I am focused on that right now. That doesn't mean no one else matters or I won't be there just more focus on self first. I also know we do need time apart still. Simply to reflect and not cause more fights or hurt not that we intend to do this but I keeps happening 
her- Doesn't mean u bail like u are..its not all about u. 
Me- Im sorry you feel that I am bailing and that its all about me. I am not bailing and know its not all about me. 
Her- It is cuz "I needd to focus on me and get my head straight" then ur not here or don't come home when there's a lot going on at home..when do I get to a break or to breathe or get my **** straitght if it takes doing what ur doing..its bull
her- When can I begin to trust u....
me- I agree when I have stayed at my parents the last few times I didn't come to house before work and that will not be a continuing thing (part of me figuring things out). And yes you need a break to. But you have also had weekends away. We do need the time apart for both of us to clear our heads and get things figured out. Idk best way to have the time apart but in same house unless we do separate things in morning. I'm open for ideas. 
Me+ Trust has to be proven and earned back in the marriage
Her- Whatever jared...u have had weekends too addy is rarely with u so whatever idk why I try or even want u here sometimes...gahhh I give up!! U don't control this situation and that's what u are doing u are not "in" this!!
me- Tell me what you want me to do then? 
I know this
I need to better myself
I need more time with Addy
I need time apart from us
I need to feel better about myself and get back my self esteem

I know you need time for yourself
you need to be able to ride your horse
You need time away from us 
You need to feel better about yourself
You need to enjoy life

Now I know I'm far from perfect and that I have failed big and small many times but I'm not a horrible person and for me to change my perception on life and to be able to love myself again so I can love others I need to do those things I said above. Time apart isn't about me and you its about mW being able to meet my own needs so I don't have to keep feeling like others have to meet those needs so i can be happy. And your needs also are important but each if us need to be happy with ourselves first to be happy in with other relationships

Her responces
Whatever..u miss the point constantly. U go to work and do **** for u........u never even begin to do anything to be apart of this family and ur responsibilities and guess what I'm gonna be working again on top of it!!
So go ahead and stay gone and "figure urself out" and see if I'm here when u get back
Well see if I can deal with it being about u...this is, ur nor taking care of us ur not here for us!! It goes beyond going to work, its feeling wanted and loved!
U shrug off my attempts
Gahhh u just don't get how much I want u

_Posted via *Topify* on Android_


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## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

Going to tell you the exact same thing I tell every guy that posts on these boards about No More Mr. Nice Guy.

If you decide to do the work in order to please your wife, or have in the back of your mind that if you do this, you will save your marriage ... then you will fail.

The work isn't about your wife. It isn't about your marriage. It's about you.

Your wife has made it clear that if you want to make it about you, she's not going to stick around.

Let me help you with your decision. She's already gone. She's been gone. Respect yourself. Because your wife most certainly doesn't.


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## jarhead (Feb 19, 2014)

So I'm reading the book to better myself because I can't get through a day without feeling like complete sh** about myself and I don't like it and I don't want to feel this way 

Do I think it will save our marriage no could it give a better chance at being able to save it maybe. I honestly don't know if I can handle the emotional pain of what she has already done. I am starting tk feel that pain more and more as I work through all this and it kills. 

I do believe she is gone honestly but she has this "want" or some better word for it. But simply she needs someone to take care of her because she can't take care of herself for very long. And since I am pushing away even if just to fix me she is loosing control and that comfort in me there even if "I'm so horrible" I'm there and she knows that no matter what I've been there even if she tells me I'm not she knows I am. 
And now that she's pregnant she needs it even more and since the om is not there because he is jobless and to me worthless and a child even though older than I am. She has no one friends have faded away for the most part and she has the dogs and our daughter. 

My daughter in all of this I die thinking about her being hurt by this and that drives me to want to go home and I can't seem to out words on the fear I have for my daughter but I fear for her. 

I'm trying to find that strength that's why I'm here and pour out all I can to honestly yes get light on it all but more because I can't well more like feel o can't to anyone else fully.

_Posted via *Topify* on Android_


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

Oh My GOD. Give me a break. All those words, all your little texts or whatever they were and never once do you bother to tell her that you're not willing to be with her if she is with another man!!!! STOP IT! Your 'wife' is pregnant with another man's baby. She's having an affair apparently with your full blessing. Going on dates right under your nose. You've been told before, she will NEVER respect you if you don't start respecting yourself.


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

jarhead said:


> So I'm reading the book to better myself because I can't get through a day without feeling like complete sh** about myself and I don't like it and I don't want to feel this way
> 
> Do I think it will save our marriage no could it give a better chance at being able to save it maybe. I honestly don't know if I can handle the emotional pain of what she has already done. I am starting tk feel that pain more and more as I work through all this and it kills.
> 
> ...


Kick her to the curb. That baby is the other man's problem. She wants to be supported by you? Then get an abortion and go 100% no contact with the other man. Anything less is a non-starter. Honestly I think she wants you to step up and be a man. She want's you to force her to do the right thing. She treats you the way she does because you're acting the way you are.


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## jarhead (Feb 19, 2014)

OK i can't do this anymore until you can commit to not talking to Steven and seeing him and willing to work on us I can't go on. You want me to see your attempts and show you affection but still have him in the picture I can't do it. 

GOD PLEASE TELL ME I DID THE RIGHT THING


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## jarhead (Feb 19, 2014)

Im scared i did the wrong thing. whats going to hapen next. i am recieving messages of blindsiding her, she gave up and did everything for me, im selfish, she gave up two babys for me and i didnt respect her. 

i told her i asked her for one thing to be faithful and you couldnt. and i cant be the support you want and need while your pregnant with his baby. i cant im dieing insdie. you chose him ebcause i could be enough when i was devistated and i still am. 

i told you i needed to better myself and you met that with im being selfish. 

i cant be that strong support you need with him in the picture. ive been trying tor ever to be that and its obvious i cant do it.


she responded f you.. i cannot belive you right now. i killed my babys for you and you didnt even respect me at all!!!

see you did make me do that and no u were never going to let it be ok.. i did not fing choose anone i chose you time and time again but i needed to be loved too and wanted to be reminded im cared about too... when do you ever let me sleep or take care of me! i take care of everyone one always.
ur asking me to give 100% when you cant give me 2%


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

Stay on the same path Jared. You're in the right. It's not right to share your woman and it's not right to raise another mans child. She made her choices to have a losers baby. That's on her.


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## jarhead (Feb 19, 2014)

u don't even bother to stop chewing!!!! I wanted to fix everything and I killed my baby to. Show you that I would but steven saved my ****ing life and he has saved me when u have not been there and ur telling me to kick someone out of my life, I wouldn't be here without him!!!
Who the hell u been talking to cuz ya know what jared this is bull****...what did I ****ing do to save out marrige!!! What!!! You selfish ass. I kicked steven out of my life and what did u do in return, **** me over time and time again!!


I suggest u ****ing talk to me


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

If this Steven is so great then she can be with him. But the time has come to make a choice. Him or you.


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## jarhead (Feb 19, 2014)

Her- I had no one absolutely no one and u were supposed to be there u were supposed to protect me and u didn't...what ask I supposed to do!!!!!!!.how do I give everything to someone who doesn't bother with our relationship...I did for forever and look tried to kill myself when u weren't there and abandoned me!!! Why cuz u are my world but u do this everything its about u...

Me-I don't think you see the pain and hurt the affair has caused.

Me-My fault for hiding it but you saw my pain and sadness as not trying or not caring or not enough


Her- So ****ing what does me trying to kill myself not ****ing matter or killing my babies!! U don't know what pain even is...ur parents screaming how horrible of a person I am and u just standing there

Her- I hate you burn in hell!! How could you, seriosuly get the **** over it I killed my child for you and to save us and you say this hurts more **** off

Her- You have me and am here and trying every day to get thru this life that u have put me thru and continue a relationship with one of the most ungrateful and selfish person I know

Her- the other issue is your mother!!!


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

Send that and then go dark. No more texts for tonight. Turn your phone off.


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## jarhead (Feb 19, 2014)

I am affraid to because of what she might do. im at work she is at home


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## Applejuice (Feb 21, 2014)

jarhead said:


> I am affraid to because of what she might do. im at work she is at home


Okay, I'll write a longer reply in a second Jared.. some of the stuff she's said has been very revealing and I think you need to open your eyes but since you're probably waiting for a reply now, I'll just say, "keep it up!"

Oh and, as I'll explain in a second, don't give in to emotional blackmail. She's had it easy so far because you've been neutered. Now that you've found a solid platform from which to gather your senses, she's acutely aware that you're starting to resist the current and she can see that if she doesn't put a stop to it now, you might well throw the towel in.

Incidentally, I remember what it was like when I had to do what you're doing. It felt alien and pretty terrifying actually. I had sweaty palms and shaky hands when I was replying to my ex's texts. I was afraid she'd say something really horrible, threaten me or, ironically, finish it. Your head is probably populated by demons and you can't focus because you're consumed by self doubt.

I suggest you try to focus on your work, stop texting and when the times comes for you to return home, put your game face on. I know its scary Jared but it had to be done.. something had to give and ironically, you're actually being the merciful one by doing what she can't or won't!


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## Applejuice (Feb 21, 2014)

Okay Jared, I've broken down the various elements of your previous few posts.

*What you've been saying*



jarhead said:


> i told her i asked her for one thing to be faithful and you couldnt. and i cant be the support you want and need while your pregnant with his baby. i cant im dieing insdie. you chose him ebcause i could be enough when i was devistated and i still am.
> 
> i told you i needed to better myself and you met that with im being selfish.
> 
> ...


You've expressed all the right (read: legitimate) concerns but you're expressing them too much. I find that the power of silence can speak volumes. If you want to assert yourself, don't bite. Turn your phone off or at the very least, put it on silent.

Whenever you jump at the chance to defend yourself, you immediately advertise your sense of guilt and unwittingly fall in to her trap. While you're in a defensive posture, she knows that all she has to do is keep lobbing metaphorical stones at you and you'll never get a chance to plant your feet in the ground.

*What she's been saying*



jarhead said:


> i am recieving messages of blindsiding her, she gave up and did everything for me, im selfish, she gave up two babys for me and i didnt respect her.
> 
> she responded f you.. i cannot belive you right now. i killed my babys for you and you didnt even respect me at all!!!
> 
> ...


Count the number of times she mentioned 'killing HER babies' in those few texts - 5 out of 7 texts!! She's obviously zeroed in on all your weak spots, she knows you feel guilty about the abortions and she uses it constantly to keep you on the defensive.

Then she raises the issue of 'killing herself'; This is one of the lowest tricks of all, my ex used to do this. If she really wanted to kill herself, she would have done it by now, but, and I know this may seem cold, if she did, it would still not be your fault. You can control most things in your life, but you can't control another persons free will. Ignore these threats for what they are.. emotional blackmail.

*Revealing Faux-pas*



jarhead said:


> *Who the hell u been talking to cuz ya know what jared this is bull*****
> 
> *I suggest u ****ing talk to me*
> 
> ...


I picked these out because they're of particular significance to me. When my ex foresaw the imminent conclusion of our relationship, she knew it couldn't have been initiated by me because she'd done such an effective job at undermining my confidence. So she immediately started (desperately) trying to ascertain who was providing me with the psychological muscle. Who was pushing me to assert myself? Who was undoing all her good work? For me it was a combination of my parents and my best friend.

..but she knew I'm a Mummy's boy, she just miscalculated. She thought I would be too ashamed to admit it and start distancing myself from them.

Note how desperate she seems with "I suggest you ****ing talk to me", that tells me she was surprised by your sudden change in character and went into damage control mode.



jarhead said:


> Im scared i did the wrong thing. whats going to hapen next..


You did just fine, but stop biting, she wants to keep you engaged because it keeps you from thinking about asserting yourself. As long as she is constantly distracting you by lobbing sh*tballs at you, you'll remain on the defensive and doubt yourself.


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## sinnister (Dec 5, 2010)

This is crazy. OP this women didnt have abortions for you. She had them because she was FING ANOTHER DUDE!!!!!

Just end this hell. Your life can only get better without her. I couldn't possibly imagine living a day in her selfish, intitled, all about her world.


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## Racer (Sep 24, 2009)

She’s crazy... 
Start ripping her. Start with the fact that she’s a weak person who needs someone to feel whole. You are learning to be whole without needing anyone else. Therefore, when you reach it, people you have in your life add value to it like the wonderful gifts that they are.

Her way is a way of misery. No one will ever truly fill her empty soul forever. Just temporary highs until she burdens them down with more and more needs of what she requires of them to feel complete.


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## Applejuice (Feb 21, 2014)

Hi Racer, I just read your 'story' and I have to say, I haven't read such an articulate or evocative statement in a long time.

You have an exceptional grasp of psychology and an almost singular capacity for forgiveness. You must have a titanium constitution.

I think Jarhead would do well to read your story as it seems you share much in common. I'm not sure Jarhead has the wear with all to adopt your solution though.

Interesting observation re: your wife's sexual torment, I just wonder if Jarhead's wife isn't concealing a similar spectre. Was your wife known to self-harm too?


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## jarhead (Feb 19, 2014)

So after a long talk with her last night (she was at my work when I got off) I found out a couple things her abandonment issues run very very deep. As deep for her openly say when "I left her" any time I am jot there when she needs or wants me or in case of lastnight I "left her" because I told her we had to leave my work and couldn't talk there anymore and I got in my truck and left to the place I told her to meet down the road. Secondly she only goes to OM because he hasn't "left her" and she uses sex with him as a means of keeping him around. 

Now o don't full understand what is all going on in that thinking and mind set. But I know that she needs help I can not give. 

Last night I made huge steps forward and made the point known I no longer can go on with this all happening. I will say I did give in and now down during our talk all night and into morning. But I must say for once in Idk how long I did stand my ground on 90% of what was said or simple agjolidged her feelings and moved on. There is a whole lot more that was said and that I am so lost in but I do not have time yet to out that on here.

I know I did not do all I should and gave in to some as I always do but I will say even spending the morning with her shopping picking up daughter from grandmas and even her getting me a lunch ready for work. I was posative in myself, happy as can be, felt like a human again, I finally am gaining some part of me back. It also may somewhat come from her final addmitence of what she had done and that it was very very wrong with pain in every word and I saw it on her fave all day. It helped to see she felt at least somewhat remorseful. I know that little bit changes nothing but it is good to see.

Also she over and over again said her affair in very very minimal to all the pain I have caused her over the years and that I need to just get over it like she has gotten over all I have done. 
I did hold true on the fact of no matter what I still didn't deserve it and she agreed and but I did play a part in her doing it by pushing her away and making her feel she had to turn to someone else


i think what has made the biggest impact on my more posative and happy mood today...

I faced my biggest fear and did not die, did not crawl in bed and never get up, the world did not end. If it all comes down to divorce or her leaving i am no longer afraid.


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## jarhead (Feb 19, 2014)

So I do not believed in played a part on her choosing the affair. Not at all her choice not mine. I made it clear to her many times. 
I also in an angry outburst finally expressed some if the basic things like have him at house or sleep in our bed and so on. That were disrespect and complete bullish** . That those made me feel unwanted in my own home and feel like she didn't give two sh**s about me. 

And when she would point things out that mad no logical sense at all I would say nothing just let her rant. 

Her big thing also was since I "so called loved her so much" I should see when she needs me and I should comfort her and just hug her. This would then follow with a moment of long crying and to me attempts to make me hug and comfort her. I did do it twice while we were away from the house to calm her and get her to go to house so we could talk there, and in my head to see where my daughter was because was not with my wife and so the drive she had to take would at least distract her some to come out of her angry some. My daughter had gotten dropped off earlier in the day at grandmas. 

When we got home things were fishy about not wanting to go inside or when almost home she suggested stopping at store for bread for my lunch the next day. It was about 5am at the time and jot going inside was to not wake the roommate that had to be up at 7. So I made a reason to go inside and I quickly searched and found no one (thought maybe OM was there) and also told me on a text on way to house that I didnt need to come home our daugyher wasn't there. 

So yes I'm seeing a lot clearer now and can pull out the truth in her words a lot better. 
This I feel is because I'm learning and since I fast my worse fear of loosing her I now am a lot more at peace with the fact of I'll do what I need and no longer fear loosing her. 

The reason I cave in is because 
1- I know I have done wrongs like letting her get beat down by my parents using things they didn't know about and pasts of my wife's life they didn't know (my wife was raped when she was in highschool by a boyfriend) I'm jot sure if me standing by doing nothing to stop the yelling and verbal attack from my parents when I saw my wife was being hurt by it and not being able to handle it was wrong for me to do, I know I felt bad after it all happened 

2- she explains in detail her feelings, my actions that hurt her, examples and its so much I can't keep the train of thought in my head gong to understand let alone filter the truth out and I get angry and don't want to lash out or loose control so I say fine your right or fall silent and beat myself up inside for not being able to understand why I did what she said or why I can't find the way to see I didn't do that to her.

3- I simple reach a point of f-it I don't care anymore and tune out and zone out. To the point I block out my pain, guilt, feelings and simple give in to stop the topic 

Last night I did my best to stay calm listen and filter truth. So I could respond only what I needed to and to attempt to show the flaw in what she said

Last thing back to the simple hug me and assure .e its a going to be OK. When she did this while we were in our room on our bed this was because roommate was now up. She got upset and started crying and shaking her foot from anxiety normal for her to do and that to her should trigger me to hug and hold her at the least. 
Here is where I felt bad for doing this sort of and don't know if it was right. When she started to cry and put the trigger of now come hold me I rolled my head onto my pillow on the other side of bed and started to "cry" enough to know she heard it. And continued to ask her to come hug me and hold me. This was all to see if what she wanted me to do when I was hurting was something she could do for me when She was hurting. Kind of OK shoe on other foot. No responce form her at all at this point I had actually broken Dow. From everything but pulled together and rolled over to see if she was still awake and push harder to get her to hug me. When I rolled over she had her ears covered and I tapped her shoulder and told her I had been "begging her to hug me" and she then said she had her ears plugged so she didn't her me anymore I believe she said because I was angry and being mean. 

I don't know what to make of that because rest of day even after " time to go get our daughter and get stating I didn't need to go with but I did so I could see my daughter" nothing I did or said would grant a hug started by her. She even once said she couldn't because I scared her. She had moved to sitting on floor against wall and said something to spark anger And hurt that I sat up in anger and started to shake my finger saying don't you dare.. the. Caught myself half way to sitting up and I laid back down and collected myself back to calm and in control. When she then said " what are you going to do hit me" 

I then stood up to grab pants and leave. She responded what going to leave me again.
I told her if she goes to that and saying I might hit her I was gone won't play that game. 

All was fine and I'm still in good place tonight. Had to get some off my chest. I can't understand people not wanting to continue writing and helping because I go back or fall down and I get it. Stop if you feel the need I am strong and can get through all this just need some help if I can get it and clarity of things from others to keep me strong and believing.


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## Applejuice (Feb 21, 2014)

Don't be so sensitive Jarhead, the boards have been quiet for a couple of days.. I've just been glued to the TV watching the whole Ukraine situation unfold.. crazy stuff!

I'll have a re-read of your latest developments shortly but judging by my preliminary glance, it looks as though you're making real progress!


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## jarhead (Feb 19, 2014)

So I need to correct I meant can understand. Autocorrect

_Posted via *Topify* on Android_


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## Applejuice (Feb 21, 2014)

Okay Jarhead, I've sectioned your last two posts to highlight patterns and make it more digestible.



jarhead said:


> ..Last night I made huge steps forward and made the point known I no longer can go on with this all happening..
> 
> ..I did hold true on the fact of no matter what I still didn't deserve it and she agreed..
> 
> ...


All this is good Jarhead, take pride from your assertive displays. Like driving a car, the learning curve is steep but persist and the rituals become habitual and instinctive.



jarhead said:


> I faced my biggest fear and did not die, did not crawl in bed and never get up, the world did not end. If it all comes down to divorce or her leaving i am no longer afraid.
> 
> This I feel is because I'm learning and since I fast my worse fear of loosing her I now am a lot more at peace with the fact of I'll do what I need and no longer fear loosing her.


These are good signs Jarhead, if you reconcile yourself with the possibility or even likelihood of separation, you sterilise the fear thus rendering it impotent. When you no longer fear a thing, you no longer run from it.



jarhead said:


> So yes I'm seeing a lot clearer now and can pull out the truth in her words a lot better.
> 
> ..don't fully understand what is all going on in that thinking and mind set, but I know that she needs help I can not give.


Again, great news, clarity is emancipatory. There's nothing wrong with a healthy dose of cynicism if it's empowering. I'm sorry to say that your wife has zero credibility so the onus is on you to extract/discern the truth for yourself. 



jarhead said:


> ..I was positive in myself, happy as can be, felt like a human again, I finally am gaining some part of me back.
> 
> I think what has made the biggest impact on my more positive and happy mood today..


Again, great stuff Jarhead! I felt the same way when I experienced my first revelation. It's like losing your wallet after a heavy night of drinking then finding it the following day in your jacket pocket. The good news is, the more you assert control over your life, the more you're going to feel that.



jarhead said:


> ..I must say for once in Idk how long I did stand my ground on 90% of what was said or simple acknowledged her feelings and moved on.
> 
> And when she would point things out that mad no logical sense at all I would say nothing just let her rant.
> 
> Last night I did my best to stay calm listen and filter truth. So I could respond only what I needed to and to attempt to show the flaw in what she said


Good, restraint is essential. I know you must often feel an almost overwhelming compulsion to respond to stimulus/provocation but there is nothing more powerful than a timely pause.. it speaks volumes. Observe any good orator delivering a speech and you'll see how effective pauses can be. A passive sneer coupled with rolled eyes or a sarcastic smirk/grin/smile is cold, cerebral and eminently satisfying.



jarhead said:


> ..my wife was raped when she was in high school by a boyfriend..


..Yeah, I had wondered if that was the case (see Racer's post above and read his 'story' link). It's still no justification for treating you like sh*t. You're a compassionate man and hyper-empathetic but don't take ownership of her emotional trauma, only she can fix it, with support from a professional psychiatrist. Good luck getting her to volunteer for that though. 



jarhead said:


> ..her abandonment issues run very very deep. As deep for her openly say when "I left her" any time I am jot there when she needs or wants me or in case of last night I "left her" because I told her we had to leave my work and couldn't talk there any more and I got in my truck and left to the place I told her to meet down the road.
> 
> Secondly she only goes to OM because he hasn't "left her" and she uses sex with him as a means of keeping him around.


Yes, she clearly has a lot of profound psychological issues but you're not the guy to fix them Jarhead. She needs a professional psychiatrist who is familiar with such cases. I hate to say it but she should never have married period, let alone produced children.. until she had resolved her issues. You're not to blame here, neither is she ironically but she IS responsible for dealing with it. You can lead her to water but she has to drink.



jarhead said:


> ..but I did play a part in her doing it by pushing her away and making her feel she had to turn to someone else..
> 
> 1- I know I have done wrongs like letting her get beat down by my parents using things they didn't know about and pasts of my wife's life they didn't know. I'm jot sure if me standing by doing nothing to stop the yelling and verbal attack from my parents when I saw my wife was being hurt by it and not being able to handle it was wrong for me to do, I know I felt bad after it all happened
> 
> ...


No, no, no and no. We've already established that her definition of 'pushing away' is subjectively dubious. The fact that you can't even leave her to go to work (to support her and your family financially), makes that a moot point. As for your parents, they're the only people who cared about you enough to intervene on your behalf. They love you and they worry about you. Your wife would just love it if you made the unforgivable error of betraying their altruistic motives. I can't emphasise that enough.. SUPPORT YOUR PARENTS BECAUSE THEY'RE THE ONLY SUPPORT YOU HAVE!

As for 2 and 3, she's just obfuscating.. carpet bombing your brain so you recede into your shell - call it shock and awe! Butt in, assert yourself. Cut her off. In a firm, assertive manner whilst looking into her eyes, address her by name, pause, tell her to 'shut the f*ck up and listen". Don't lecture her, don't guilt trip her.. just tell her what SHE needs to do to earn your trust/respect. See a psychiatrist (you can help her there), dump the bit on the side (you'll need proof - read 'Racer's' story above) and stop trying to provoke you "because it won't work any more!".



jarhead said:


> ..her final admittance of what she had done and that it was very very wrong with pain in every word and I saw it on her face all day. It helped to see she felt at least somewhat remorseful. I know that little bit changes nothing but it is good to see.


Don't take her at her word, she's proved time and time again that her word has no credibility. If there was pain in her expression, it was probably because she resented you. Honestly, your wife deserves an oscar.



jarhead said:


> Also she over and over again said her affair in very very minimal to all the pain I have caused her over the years and that I need to just get over it like she has gotten over all I have done.


Says her! Imagine how rosy her life must be. You go to work each day, 'abandoning' her whilst she sneaks off to shag the bit-on-the-side and you're the guilty party.. but hey, get over it, it's no big thing, it's just karma!



jarhead said:


> Her big thing also was since I "so called loved her so much" I should see when she needs me and I should comfort her and just hug her. This would then follow with a moment of long crying and to me attempts to make me hug and comfort her. I did do it twice while we were away from the house to calm her and get her to go to house so we could talk there, and in my head to see where my daughter was because was not with my wife and so the drive she had to take would at least distract her some to come out of her angry some. My daughter had gotten dropped off earlier in the day at grandmas.


Just read that paragraph to yourself Jarhead - that's your daughter ffs! You have to console your wife just to find out where the f*ck your daughter is! I submit that your wife is an irresponsible absentee mother who is so self-absorbed, she would willingly sacrifice both you and your daughter's well being for personal attention.



jarhead said:


> When we got home things were fishy about not wanting to go inside or when almost home she suggested stopping at store for bread for my lunch the next day. It was about 5am at the time and jot going inside was to not wake the room mate that had to be up at 7. So I made a reason to go inside and I quickly searched and found no one (thought maybe OM was there) and also told me on a text on way to house that I didn't need to come home our daughter wasn't there.


See.. trust deficit. As I explained in an earlier post, even if you do salvage the marriage, you will never be able to trust her again. Unless you're a complete masochist, you have no choice but to 'set the bird free'. Also, she will always resent you, either for making her sacrifice her extramarital affair or for 'forcing' her to conform to your ideal.



jarhead said:


> Last thing back to the simple hug me and assure .e its a going to be OK. When she did this while we were in our room on our bed this was because room mate was now up. She got upset and started crying and shaking her foot from anxiety normal for her to do and that to her should trigger me to hug and hold her at the least.
> 
> Here is where I felt bad for doing this sort of and don't know if it was right. When she started to cry and put the trigger of now come hold me I rolled my head onto my pillow on the other side of bed and started to "cry" enough to know she heard it. And continued to ask her to come hug me and hold me. This was all to see if what she wanted me to do when I was hurting was something she could do for me when She was hurting. Kind of OK shoe on other foot. No response form her at all at this point I had actually broken Dow. From everything but pulled together and rolled over to see if she was still awake and push harder to get her to hug me. When I rolled over she had her ears covered and I tapped her shoulder and told her I had been "begging her to hug me" and she then said she had her ears plugged so she didn't her me any more I believe she said because I was angry and being mean.
> 
> I don't know what to make of that because rest of day even after " time to go get our daughter and get stating I didn't need to go with but I did so I could see my daughter" nothing I did or said would grant a hug started by her. She even once said she couldn't because I scared her. She had moved to sitting on floor against wall and said something to spark anger And hurt that I sat up in anger and started to shake my finger saying don't you dare.. the. Caught myself half way to sitting up and I laid back down and collected myself back to calm and in control. When she then said " what are you going to do hit me"


Very resourceful, I like your thinking. In essence, you performed your own little sh*t test on her and she failed. If it's good enough for you, it should be good enough for her. Never mind sleeping with you, if your wife can't even summon up sufficient love for you to hug you when you need it, she's really not worth saving.



jarhead said:


> I can't understand people not wanting to continue writing and helping because I go back or fall down and I get it. Stop if you feel the need I am strong and can get through all this just need some help if I can get it and clarity of things from others to keep me strong and believing.


Again, chill buddie, we're here for you and we care but most of us (except me possibly) have busy lives so if your posts don;t get an immediate response, don't assume we're ignoring you!


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