# Advice



## photek (Jun 22, 2013)

Hi There,

Long time lurker, first time poster here  I work in Afghanistan, and my wife works and lives with our 3 children in another country - not either of our home countries. I'm home for 2-3 weeks every 6-8 weeks.

Her job is demanding, and of course looking after 3 small children is demanding - although she has a nanny who helps a great deal and does cleaning. This job in Afghanistan was only supposed to be temporary, but has now been 18 months. When we are together things are good, nice chats, good sex etc

When I was home recently, she left her computer logged into a forum - where I found that she had been posting...a bit like this forum but in her language.

The is just the first post, the whole thing goes on for 7 pages...but it gives you an idea.

I have confronted her about, but her reaction was defensive and basically blamed it on me, the leaving her. She says it was a one off, but reading the post it doesn't seem like that was her desire.

I'm interested to hear how other people would have handled/dealt with this...

Thanks!

Below is the transcript of the original post, translated as best I could : 

Good evening, I'm new here and I have to turn to you for advice times asking to you with my situation. To me, I'm 40, with children, married, but my husband is away on business most of the time, only every few weeks with us. 

For a few months I am working in a new location. I get along with my boss very well for some time. We regularly go lunch together, laugh a lot and are on a wave length. Now a few weeks ago, we had a seminar that he and I have organized and managed together. On the last night we physically came a little closer together, which emanated from him. We have not kissed, have only danced closely (with no audience) and held in each others arms. When we then went to our rooms (it was in a hotel), he asked whether I wanted to come in for a drink. I have refused and we are in our respective rooms. On the next morning, everything was as usual, after a short initial uncertainty we were both friendly and well-acted, as before.

Until last Wednesday. We were at a farewell ceremony of a colleague and drank quite a bit. When changing the location, we have separated us from the others and are driven to his home (honestly, I know now no longer exactly why??). Now, he has asked me what I want to do and I kissed him – and he has reciprocated. Then we went back and joined the others at the other party (also here I don't remember exactly why. Somehow everything just happened). We danced and grinning looks and I have said, I would now have to go home, my children were with the babysitter and we both had to work the next day. It was now 1.30 then we gone up to the taxi stand and, he said that he so very much likes me, and finds me very attractive, but he was so in love with someone else. I know that he has a girlfriend, but is also married. He said something about me and whether I’m in an unhappy marriage (which I do not have answered) and that he wants no family. I drove home. Phew! The last few days everything was back as before, friendly, informal, and professional. I thought 'well, that I tick off, he is in love with another.' 

Now I have planned a 2 day office outing for next week. He heard it and called me and said that he really wanted to come, but cannot and if I could move the appointment so that he could come along. This could have a purely professional reasons, but his presence is also not mandatory. 

I don't even know what I should think. He tells me that he is in love with another but why then he kisses me at all. He is somebody who is very loose and is relaxed, possibly he simply takes what goes. Or my children put off him (he does not know them)? He is certainly no one who is keen to take over 'foreign' children, but I do not want this also at all.

Ooh, and I do not know what’s up and down anymore. I am not insanely in love, but a bit of fun/entertainment for a change would be nice, but I am not willing to be run over or made a mockery of, none the least of my boss. 

Is this a clearly relayed message that I am too much for him?


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## photek (Jun 22, 2013)

Oh, one more thing - when I confronted her and also later when discussing this - her reaction has always been to say "Oh come on, it was just one kiss"

And no real apology has been given.

Both of which hurt


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## torani (May 6, 2013)

ouch...I am so sorry this is happening to you.. I cant imagine how hurtful that must be to read her somewhat confession...

My partner is military. Deployed to where you are now twice... Let me start off by saying, I can relate to some of your situation.

It sounds as if your wife is starved for affection, attention and intimacy to the point where she has convinced herself its a good idea to have an affair. 

Cheating on you is wrong. It takes a very strong woman to hold it together in a long distance relationship. This other man is also clearly praying on your wifes weakness. He knows she is struggling with your absence and taking advantage of her. 

He already has a wife and another girlfriend... sounds like a user and scum bag. He will use your wife to but she cant see that because of her desperate attempts to fill the void she has about you being gone so much. 

Is her love language physical touch? The way she described the dancing and kiss sounds like this may be one of her top needs.
Please understand, I am in no way condoning her behavior, I disagree with it 100% but just trying to share some insight from a womans perspective. 

I did not cheat on my partner while he was deployed but I can tell 
you, when another man paid attention to me while he was gone... it made me feel pretty good to have a mans attention. This also happened to my partner with another woman he encountered while deployed and we shared these things with each other. I figured the reason I enjoyed another mans attention was because I wasn't getting this from my partner because of our long distance relationship. 

After I was paid attention to, I would go home cry, feel guilty that I enjoyed the attention and realize how very much I missed my guy and wanted him to be home with me... It made me realize I am vunerable but it was easy for me to be faithful. The dealing with the missing him was the hard part. 

It does sound like your wife does love you, she is just vunerable and not able to deal with your absence and her need for your affections. She downplayed the severeness of the kiss she shared with her boss. It is cheating physically and she is also having an Emotional Affair with him.

The way I see it is you have a couple of options. If you love her and want to continue to be married to her after her betrayal then you will have to take some serious actions. I would be getting in touch with the Other man and putting him in his place... he needs a good lesson learned from an angry spouse. Your wife needs to end it completely and get a new job. She is going to have a long way to go in earning your trust back. You should go to marriage counseling. Have you also considered changing your occupation? is that an option for you?

Or you can simply end the marriage if that's where you are at. 

I do hope things get better for you... I really feel your pain on this...


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

Your wife , based on what you posted seems to be very attracted or infatuated with this philanderer even though he's married , and has another lover.
She appears to have loose boundaries, formed a relationship, and was actively seeking advice on that illicit relationship.
Also , she has downplayed her actions , and basically shifted the blame on you ,when you confronted her.
She appears not to be sorry and is blaming you for her actions.

Obviously, you love your wife , and want to understand ,hence your posting here.

But you cannot " nice " your way out of this, or else it would only get worse.

Firstly, you must not accept any blame for her actions.
Secondly , if she is sorry , like the above poster said, she must be willing to take responsibility for her actions and both of you can begin to rebuild the relationship.


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## COguy (Dec 1, 2011)

What advice would you give a complete stranger in the same situation if you stumbled upon their post on the internet?

Because I can guarantee it will be the same as what I'm about to say.

Your wife is cheating on you, emotionally and physically. You can stay and try to work things out, but from what I've learned, you're better off just cutting the cord.

You've got a lot of hurdles to overcome to have any shot at this lasting, distance, jobs not being the least. Your biggest problem is that she's completely unremorseful so there's no point even trying to reconcile when she still is infatuated with this guy.


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## thatbpguy (Dec 24, 2012)

COguy said:


> Your wife is cheating on you, emotionally and physically. You can stay and try to work things out, but from what I've learned, you're better off just cutting the cord.


I agree with this.

Making matters worse she is adamant that she not only doesn't care but places the blame on you.

Your marriage has ended. I think your downfall was a job that placed such separations that you had no ability to care for her needs emotionally and physically and she a desire to have them met elsewhere.


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## lenzi (Apr 10, 2012)

What is with these women who are attracted to guys who are married and have a girlfriend?

Seems like the more women a guy is cheating on, the more attractive he is.

If I posted anything more, it would not be to say nice things about your wife, who is having an EA and considering having sex with a guy who is married with a girlfriend. The only thing preventing it is her boundaries. She won't stop at screwing a married guy with a girlfriend, but she wants to make sure he loves her first. Nice.

You confronted, she downplayed and denied. You can put up with this disrespect and wait for her to cheat or you can dump her. I don't see any other options for you.


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## Air Texas (May 30, 2013)

One thing is clear... This is your warning shot. Whatever you decide to do, do it 100%. Do not be passive.


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

You put your wife through a hell of a test: how long can I abandon my wife before she'll cheat? And you got your answer. 18 months. Now, what are you going to do with this information?


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## photek (Jun 22, 2013)

Wow, thanks for the responses. I'll start working my way through the points brought up.


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## photek (Jun 22, 2013)

torani said:


> ouch...I am so sorry this is happening to you.. I cant imagine how hurtful that must be to read her somewhat confession...
> 
> My partner is military. Deployed to where you are now twice... Let me start off by saying, I can relate to some of your situation.
> 
> ...


Hi Torani, many thanks for taking the time to give such a heart felt response, I appreciate greatly a woman's response - even more so from someone who has been through a similar situation and faced the same challenges and temptations.


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## photek (Jun 22, 2013)

Caribbean Man said:


> Your wife , based on what you posted seems to be very attracted or infatuated with this philanderer even though he's married , and has another lover.
> She appears to have loose boundaries, formed a relationship, and was actively seeking advice on that illicit relationship.
> Also , she has downplayed her actions , and basically shifted the blame on you ,when you confronted her.
> 
> ...


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## TBT (Dec 20, 2011)

What type of forum did she post this on? Just seems odd to me that after the first couple of lines she doesn't mention you at all.


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## photek (Jun 22, 2013)

COguy said:


> What advice would you give a complete stranger in the same situation if you stumbled upon their post on the internet?
> 
> Because I can guarantee it will be the same as what I'm about to say.
> 
> ...


If it wasn't for our kids, I would certainly be inclined to agree with you on this. I do love my wife, like I've loved no other woman, we've been together for 12 years and this is certainly the biggest trial we've been through.

What hurts most is her attitude towards the incident, of course the EA & PA hurt....but actually not as much as her refusal to accept that what she's done is wrong and how it hurts me.

As I mentioned above, we are now "moving on" and most of the time we are happy...just so long as I don't mention what happened. I have zero trust in her anymore, which makes the distance very hard to deal with as I'm very paranoid about her activities....I have really no idea what she's up too 

I'm off home on leave again in a week, which should be interesting.


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## photek (Jun 22, 2013)

TBT said:


> What type of forum did she post this on? Just seems odd to me that after the first couple of lines she doesn't mention you at all.


You make a very good point  I basically don't feature at all in her thread. The whole thing is more about whether she should cheat with her boss. The forum is a womans forum, the responses were quite interesting.

At post number 29 someone says "The option is to try and reactivate the relationship with your husband or quit and start new"

to which her response is : Yes, this is probably the only reasonable option. (crying smily face) I wish it would be easy all times, adventurous, exciting.


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## lenzi (Apr 10, 2012)

TBT said:


> What type of forum did she post this on? Just seems odd to me that after the first couple of lines she doesn't mention you at all.


It's not odd, it's very telling, and very sad.

She's asking for advice about her potential affair partner and how to avoid getting hurt. She's got her priorities lined up.


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## photek (Jun 22, 2013)

Air Texas said:


> One thing is clear... This is your warning shot. Whatever you decide to do, do it 100%. Do not be passive.


That's for sure, it really is a warning of what could happen. On a certain level I think that she also got concerned about what she's done and what might have happened it the PA had gone further - ok, she doesn't verbally acknowledge anything. But her actions afterwards, the way she treats me, are in a strange way apologetic...she's quite nice to me, and says nice things to me about. 

As I mentioned in another reply, she just wants to put what's happened behind us - I think she's maybe embarrassed about it...but that doesn't really help me to deal with it


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## photek (Jun 22, 2013)

lenzi said:


> It's not odd, it's very telling, and very sad.
> 
> She's asking for advice about her potential affair partner and how to avoid getting hurt. She's got her priorities lined up.


Yep  She doesn't seem concerned about her marriage, just about whether she should have some fun with her boss - because that might have some problems in the office...

Towards the end of the thread, she said that she'll stop the thing with her boss before it goes further - she doesn't want to be made a fool of in the office.....

The replies in the thread were very interesting, it was a womans forum, no one was concerned about the husband & marriage. Only about whether she should sleep with the boss


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

You may be moving on, but if she still works for him I can pretty much guarantee that she's still with him. And it's likely escalating.


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## photek (Jun 22, 2013)

WorkingOnMe said:


> You put your wife through a hell of a test: how long can I abandon my wife before she'll cheat? And you got your answer. 18 months. Now, what are you going to do with this information?


Interesting point of view, I think going to do a well paid job a ****ty dangerous place to put my kids through school and put food on the table is hardly abandoning. 

Thanks anyway.


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## photek (Jun 22, 2013)

WorkingOnMe said:


> You may be moving on, but if she still works for him I can pretty much guarantee that she's still with him. And it's likely escalating.


That is of course my biggest concern, I have no way for certain of knowing what's going on. As I mentioned in another reply, I do have a very good friend working in the same office who knows what happened and keeps and eye on things.....but after work I have no idea.

Maybe now she just becomes more discrete...


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## TBT (Dec 20, 2011)

lenzi said:


> It's not odd, it's very telling, and very sad.
> 
> She's asking for advice about her potential affair partner and how to avoid getting hurt. She's got her priorities lined up.


That's why I was curious about the forum.Her post wouldn't seem odd to me if she had posted on a site like dc.


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## photek (Jun 22, 2013)

TBT said:


> That's why I was curious about the forum.Her post wouldn't seem odd to me if she had posted on a site like dc.


What's DC?


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## TBT (Dec 20, 2011)

photek said:


> What's DC?


It was one of many sites supporting those who actively cheat.It's no longer in business.


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## photek (Jun 22, 2013)

TBT said:


> It was one of many sites supporting those who actively cheat.It's no longer in business.


Supporting those who cheat....nice. Yeah, the forum she posted on was not like - but the comments were all quite supportive of her need (and right!) for attention and sex while I'm away. Just not with the boss :scratchhead:

In the end she posted that she was happy that she had the chance to sleep with him, but didn't - it gave her a nice ego boost. 

At the moment I'm trying to continue, but I just don't trust her - we need to be back together...so I can actually try to build up some trust again.....and to check her phone


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## torani (May 6, 2013)

s her love language physical touch? The way she described the dancing and kiss sounds like this may be one of her top needs.
Please understand, I am in no way condoning her behavior, I disagree with it 100% but just trying to share some insight from a womans perspective. 

I'm not sure I understand this part, can you explain a bit more - I'd love to understand 

hi photek, I am referring to "the 5 love languages" I have copied a link for you here if you want some information on it.

Home | The 5 Love Languages®


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## photek (Jun 22, 2013)

torani said:


> hi photek, I am referring to "the 5 love languages" I have copied a link for you here if you want some information on it.
> 
> Home | The 5 Love Languages®


Thanks for that, interesting website. I would actually say her love language is gifts, but probably with physical touch a close second. 

I'd be interested in her taking the test, but I think she would be against doing it. She's very against over analysing our relationship at the moment, I think as a mechanism to avoid her own failings recently..


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## COguy (Dec 1, 2011)

photek said:


> If it wasn't for our kids, I would certainly be inclined to agree with you on this. I do love my wife, like I've loved no other woman, we've been together for 12 years and this is certainly the biggest trial we've been through.
> 
> What hurts most is her attitude towards the incident, of course the EA & PA hurt....but actually not as much as her refusal to accept that what she's done is wrong and how it hurts me.
> 
> ...


Well my friend, you committed the biggest post-affair sin you can commit. There's no point in "moving on" when she's still infatuated with the guy and doesn't even think she's done anything wrong.

You're just wasting your own time and money sticking around. Marriage is like a poker game. Every round you calculate pot odds based on your next decision. If you put in $10,000 in chips the round before, and the guy bets $1 on the next street, you don't think about your $10,000 you already bet, your choice is do you spend another $1 on the pot or not?

Your marriage length is irrelevant, you have to decide if you spend one more second of time and energy in this relationship, and in your current situation, you are pissing away your resources because the cards are up and you've already lost the hand.


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## weightlifter (Dec 14, 2012)

Dude you have been given a rare gift. You think the pain now is rough it is a shadow of what it would be had she given herself fully. Your wife stopped the first time. Usually we get the full act.

She is in regular contact with a fairly talented player. You dont think he wont win within the next 6 months? Think again.

Her fault but you are playing with fire.

If you keylog her comp with one that has remote access. Be ready to read in say 2 months. She completed the deed.

Btw. Could you pm me the name of the forum?

Honest advice. Do whatever you need to to get out of sand hell and get back with her. Her barriers may be sufficient to hold out if she knows there is an end date. If you dont get back soon, we will see you over in cwi in much much more pain.


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## Starstarfish (Apr 19, 2012)

> to put my kids through school


Does that mean you are paying private school tuition for all three kids? If you reconsidered that could you take a different job?


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## photek (Jun 22, 2013)

Starstarfish said:


> Does that mean you are paying private school tuition for all three kids? If you reconsidered that could you take a different job?


Thanks for the considerate suggestion, but where we live all the schools in English are private - and our kids don't speak the local language.


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## photek (Jun 22, 2013)

weightlifter said:


> Dude you have been given a rare gift. You think the pain now is rough it is a shadow of what it would be had she given herself fully. Your wife stopped the first time. Usually we get the full act.
> 
> She is in regular contact with a fairly talented player. You dont think he wont win within the next 6 months? Think again.
> 
> ...


I know, reading some of the other posts on her makes me realise how "fortunate" I've been that it was only a kiss and a lot of thinking about more...of course it still hurts, but nothing like it would have if it had been the full deed.

Yep, I'm also very concerned about the continuing contact with this guy - but sharing an office with him and working closely....it's going to be difficult to block.

Getting back home full time is my top priority at the moment, I had 1 interview 1 week ago and another 2 coming up soon - this has also made her much more positive towards me.

As I mentioned elsewhere, I'm home in one week - staying for three weeks...I have a lot to get done in that time!


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## weightlifter (Dec 14, 2012)

I know how it is. My wife had an email ea with an ex. I got it early into the inappropriate stage. My pain is fractional of what others here go thru.

Yet. It fvcking kills me i will never have that implicit 100% trust again. Gone. Forever. I hate being james bond. I hate it. i hate it. Yet. Now that is my job.

Make it your highest priority to het back. Sounds like her hope that you will be with her more may help her hold out.

Get your intel sources going. Keep us in the loop.

WL


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## COguy (Dec 1, 2011)

weightlifter said:


> I know how it is. My wife had an email ea with an ex. I got it early into the inappropriate stage. My pain is fractional of what others here go thru.
> 
> Yet. It fvcking kills me i will never have that implicit 100% trust again. Gone. Forever. I hate being james bond. I hate it. i hate it. Yet. Now that is my job.
> 
> ...


This is just bad advice, sorry.

Your wife is still cheating on you, so don't even attempt to reconcile, it will be 100% fruitless.

There is a million things that need to happen for true reconciliation to happen, yours doesn't have any of them, short of your willingness to forgive, but that is probably the least important.


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## Wiserforit (Dec 27, 2012)

The total lack of empathy, minimization of what she did, and expectation for you to just eat it - is unacceptable. 

If you shot her in the leg and told her to shut up, put it behind her, and it was "only" a leg wound anyway... same thing. No "I'm sorry", no hospital, no acknowledgement of wrongdoing.

You don't argue with her about it. You impose consequences. Otherwise be prepared for more of it.


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## weightlifter (Dec 14, 2012)

COguy said:


> This is just bad advice, sorry.
> 
> Your wife is still cheating on you, so don't even attempt to reconcile, it will be 100% fruitless.
> 
> There is a million things that need to happen for true reconciliation to happen, yours doesn't have any of them, short of your willingness to forgive, but that is probably the least important.


??

You mean me or OP?


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## COguy (Dec 1, 2011)

weightlifter said:


> ??
> 
> You mean me or OP?


Bad advice from you, though I was directing comments about cheating wife to OP.

I don't know your story so I can't comment on your wife still cheating, but given your take on the whole thing, I wouldn't rule it out.

I think most people that try to reconcile find the same thing, that cheating isn't a mistake but a character flaw. The people on TAM that just say ditch the cheater do it for a reason, the odds aren't good and the vast majority of people that try it wind up back here with the same story.

In the OPs case, she's clearly STILL cheating and they have no chance for reconciliation at this point because she hasn't even admitted to doing anything wrong. There's no point expending any energy in that relationship because it has a 0% chance of success at this point. Now if he proceeded to go the route of divorce and she changed her tune, at that point it could be discussed, but that hasn't happened yet. He's enabling her to cheat by staying together and not addressing the problem.


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

There's more than one reason to gather evidence.


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## photek (Jun 22, 2013)

Wiserforit said:


> The total lack of empathy, minimization of what she did, and expectation for you to just eat it - is unacceptable.
> 
> If you shot her in the leg and told her to shut up, put it behind her, and it was "only" a leg wound anyway... same thing. No "I'm sorry", no hospital, no acknowledgement of wrongdoing.
> 
> You don't argue with her about it. You impose consequences. Otherwise be prepared for more of it.


I completely agree, it is unacceptable - she is now being very nice to me at the moment...which, combined with her refusal to discuss the topic, actually makes me more suspicious that something is on going. 

Of course it also also be that she knows she ****ed up, is too embarrassed to discuss it and is trying to make amends by being nice......or that could just be wishful thinking!! 

Definitely sticking a keylogger on her laptop when I get home soon. Working on getting her mobile phone records.


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## photek (Jun 22, 2013)

2ntnuf said:


> There's more than one reason to gather evidence.


The reason to gather evidence is to establish the truth....whatever that maybe ;-)


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## photek (Jun 22, 2013)

weightlifter said:


> I know how it is. My wife had an email ea with an ex. I got it early into the inappropriate stage. My pain is fractional of what others here go thru.
> 
> Yet. It fvcking kills me i will never have that implicit 100% trust again. Gone. Forever. I hate being james bond. I hate it. i hate it. Yet. Now that is my job.
> 
> ...


That basically sums my situation at the moment, it hurts that the trust is completely gone. I'm nervous about any night out with the office, is she really going out with the office or heading back to someone else place - or even lunchtime for a quickie somewhere....I hate it.

I need to move back home again soon, then I can get a better feel for what the hell is really going on. I the meantime get some monitoring setup!


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## weightlifter (Dec 14, 2012)

Also add 

VARs

Buy 2 sony ICDPX312 voice activated recorders. Best Buy sells them for like 50 bucks. DO NOT BUY THE cheapies. USE LITHIUM batteries. We have examples of 25 hour recordings using them on these sony recorders. Set bit rate to 44K or higher and sensitivity to very high or better Turn off the beep feature. Its on one of the menus.

We have examples of 25 hour recordings using Lithium batteries with these little gems.

Go to Walmart and buy heavy duty velcro.

Use the velcro to attach the var under her seat UP INSIDE. SECURE IT WELL!!!!!!

Put the second in whatever room she uses to talk in when you are not around.

Usual warning. If you hear another man get in her car STOP Listening and have a trusted friend tell you what went on. Knowing she is a cheat will kill you. Hearing her moan while another man is inside her will murder you to your very soul!!!!!! You are not strong enough to hear that. Dont try it. I know what I am talking about in this.

Play dumb husband for a bit. Dont drive her further underground! NO MORE CONFRONTS!! 

Steel yourself for the ugly possibility of a full PA. Odds are about 35% IMHO but rising by the day you are gone.

If you need clean up the recordings get Audacity. Its free from the internet. I have used it on var work for others here to remove things like engine noise.


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