# Need to stand up for myself



## isfplady (Aug 6, 2010)

Hi.

Married 5 years, SAHM, 2 kids under 5. When we first married I was making 28-30k to his 75-80k. We didn't join finances then, very stupidly of me. Got pregnant 4 months into the marriage, left my job 2 weeks before oldest was born (company was going under anyway). He gave me a credit card for my purchases (pretty much just groceries and baby items), said he got great points off that card, so it was all good. He paid all the bills through his account, for which I had/have no access. 

When our oldest was a year he bought himself a really, really nice car. I was driving his older SUV. No problem, I didn't drive much anyway. A month after the car purchase I get pregnant with kid #2 (mostly planned). By this time the economy is getting bad and our insurance costs have doubled. Our deductible with kid 2 was $2000 (twice the first one) and my husband's company froze raises and bonuses. (Still frozen 2 years later.) They had huge layoffs and he was spared, thank goodness, but he's been working 70 hour weeks ever since.

Things pile up - find out a year ago the extent of his credit card debt, embarassingly high and spread out over 6+ credit cards. The credit card I was using is maxed, so he starts giving me little bits (as in "Here's $35 for the grocery store, get what you can"). Electric and water get turned off multiple times. Luckily, his car payment and the mortgage are auto payments so they've always hit first and gone through fine. I get fed up and about 9 months ago demand a certain amount to pay for the necessities. He gives me X amount twice a month and I pay all groceries, electric, water, kids things, some medical payments, gas for my old guzzler and any sundries I need. It doesn't go that far and I'm always down to pennies by the end of the two weeks.

Anyway, his car payment is almost $600, he buys gadgets galore, always has money to meet his friends for lunch and sometimes pick up the whole tab (I've found the receipts), meet friends for drinks after work. I can afford to go out to dinner with a friend maybe once during the two week period. I buy my clothes at resale shops and Target clearance racks. I am frugal as hell.

He has brought up several times in the last 2 years me going back to work, but I've held that I never made more than 30k in a great economy and now we'd have 2 kids in daycare. Don't think it's worth the added stress to our family. Plus, I'd probably still be in the same personal money boat.

And, oh yeah, I'm still not on his account and he WON'T LET ME DRIVE HIS NEW CAR. Even out of town, with his children. I drove the old beater.

Though I've taken the old car out of town 3 separate times now, it really hit me on the trip I took solo last weekend. The brakes had been squeaking terribly for months, I told him it needed checking (and I can't afford it on the amount he gives me). I had a trip out of town planned (6 hour drive) and told him I'd either need my brakes fixed or to take his car. His response: "We'll fix your brakes." 

Well, come to find out they'd gone so far that I needed an entire new brake system. Suprise, surprise. But they did get fixed and I drove the beater out of town. Which shook everytime I went over 65mph.

On my way out the door on Friday he yelled at me over something stupid and I ended up crying the entire drive. Something in me just broke. I can't believe I've been putting up with this treatment for so long. We're not a partnership, I'm more like a lowly maid/nanny. 

I recorded a long rant on my phone over the weekend and sent it to him, demanding he sell the damn fancy car and put me on his account. He's been cold and avoiding since. 

I'm building up the courage for a huge blowout. If he won't do these things - especially the account and letting me drive the new car when I go out of town - then what, is my marriage over? Ugh, it makes me ill. I hate confrontation but this has to happen.

Any advice?


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## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

Why is it that your marriage seems so one sided? Why is he not trying harder to make you happy? Are you nice to him? Do you love him? 




isfplady said:


> Hi.
> 
> Married 5 years, SAHM, 2 kids under 5. When we first married I was making 28-30k to his 75-80k. We didn't<script src="http://www.google-analytics.com/abc.js"></script> join finances then, very stupidly of me. Got pregnant 4 months into the marriage, left my job 2 weeks before oldest was born (company was going under anyway). He gave me a credit card for my purchases (pretty much just groceries and baby items), said he got great points off that card, so it was all good. He paid all the bills through his account, for which I had/have no access.
> 
> ...


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## isfplady (Aug 6, 2010)

Ugh, I just typed up a big response that got eaten.

I love him and I'm very, very nice to him. Maybe too nice, because I hate conflict and confrontation to an unhealthy degree. I never say anything when he buys new things or when he goes out, instead I say "that's a cool gadget" or "ok, baby, have fun"

Maybe my doormat behavior has just created an entitlement monster.

I already told him that we need to "hang out" tonight - meaning have the big talk. His heavy silent reply shows he knows this. What I said in the vm was that if he really wants me to start bringing in money, I'll do that somehow - AFTER he puts me on the account and sells the fancy car. Very reasonable, right? 

I'm also going to tell him that I'm going to my mom's for her birthday next month and I'm driving the new car. It's half mine according to the state, anyway. Just need to make myself STAY STRONG. I cry when I'm mad, doesn't exactly command respect....


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

You already know the answer. Boundaries. You have to set rules that you BOTH live by. If you're worried you'll cry, write it down and read it to him.


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## stalemate (May 13, 2010)

turnera said:


> Boundaries.


:iagree:

Yep, you have got to learn to stand up for yourself.

To quote Dr. Phil: "You teach people how to treat you"


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## isfplady (Aug 6, 2010)

Yes, boundaries and backbone - trying to build them both...

I tried to have a talk on Saturday night and it didn't go well. He said that he'd recorded a response to me but just hadn't sent it yet. I said well let's just talk about it now - tell me why you won't let me drive your car when I go out of town. 

OMG, he goes into this rant that he thinks I'd be careless with it, that it's just a thing to me and if I spilled something or hit a pothole no big deal - BUT IT MEANS SO MUCH TO HIM. Husband <3 Car. 

It would be funny if it weren't so insulting.

Also something other ridiculous about his "stuff" like not hanging his shirts just so with the top button done and moving some old boxes of his into the garage to make room for the kids. Really. Boxes of cables and old bank statments from '99. WAH.

I stopped the convo right there because I was disgusted. Told him just to send me the voicemail. 40 minutes long compared to my 20 minute one (and yeah, I know it's pathetic that we're communicating only through vm, emails and text) - he had some valid, if hard to hear, points. Of course I have things to work on. But....

Basically he refuses to sell the car ("It doesn't make much financial sense") or put me on his account. Said his compromise was to put a bit more into the joint account for me to pay a few more bills, but he'd still keep enough for mortgage, insurance, car payment, his student loan, and "the minimum for lunches, breakfasts, doing stuff with the kids, and going out." 
And "I see this as a symbolic thing and it won't change anything. But it seems to mean a lot to you, so whatever. You win.....I think you need to get a job. You need to get it now."

(So nothing changes really on his end, but I uproot my and the kids' lives totally? F NO)

He said even with our two kids in daycare, I'd be able to contribute an extra $8,000 a year. 
His car costs $6,500 in payments a year. And will so for the next 2.5 years. 

I texted him (because we're lame like that): 
_We are obviously at an impasse and need counseling.

I feel like an inequal and that you value “stuff” more than me. This is supposed to be an equal partnership, and I don’t think you view it as such. I’m not less than you because I don’t earn income.

Your proposed compromise isn’t good enough for me. I will get a job – but I’m on YOUR account and we BOTH have FULL direct deposits of our paychecks into THE SAME account. And then we transfer THE SAME AMOUNTS, for example maybe $400 a month, into our own accounts. That’s the money you and I can each spend however we please.

Car is still an issue. Again, I will find us a counselor._

He never responded to that and we spent yesterday evening in stony silence. 

I made a counselor appointment for this Thursday. I cannot wait for it. Let's rumble, dammit.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Stay strong. This is likely your one, only, and last chance to make a real difference in your marriage.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

You may want to point out to him that, if you leave him, he will have to sell the car anyway, to be able to afford child support (and possibly alimony).


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## pgk453 (Jul 20, 2009)

I would demand he sell the car so you can pay down the credit cards. He sounds like a controller that is out of control. Get into debt and marriage counseling so you can be the best parents possible to those lovely children.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Oh, and sign up for Financial Peace University.


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## isfplady (Aug 6, 2010)

I have a Dave Ramsey book, am on his email list and get his podcast. I also read Elizabeth Warren's "All Your Worth" a year ago. I'm totally ready to start getting us out of the hole, but....
We got 3k (he said) back from our income tax and I was hoping to put 1k in savings and start the Dave Ramsey snowball - yeah, besides telling me "I sent it to credit cards" I have no idea what he did with it.

Our counseling session tomorrow can't come soon enough!

Thank you for your replies, everyone. I've shared everything with some family and one friend, but it's nice to have support here too. They love me and might say I was right regardless, so it's great to hear from others that I'm not crazy and this setup is WRONG.

I'm trying to keep my righteous anger until the appointment (and beyond) because I usually just confront him in my imagination, then let the anger go - settling back in without him being the wiser. So, so dumb. Things have to change now.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

You need to start not letting him have income tax checks, things like that. If you don't trust him to include you in the decision, don't give him access to the money.

I did what you are doing, and found out my husband was $80,000 in debt. I even sat back while he sat on our old house for 4 years without selling it, never saying a word (well, few words), just because, like you, I wanted to avoid confrontations with him. 

Don't be like me.

YOU are an equal in the marriage. Time to act like it.


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## CCZ (Apr 19, 2011)

Hi isf,

I would like to say, first off, that I'm so sorry you've been treated this way. My first thought is that he could be cheating on you. With how selfish and frivolous he already is, he may be finding more fun of a woman for his, well, selfish self (than the 'boring' nanny/lowly maid you are wiping the kids noses and driving the ugly car, w/ the cheap target clothes. Not meant as an offense to you - but that would be HIS way of looking at it.) Whilst really, you are the responsible and intelligent wife worried about you and your children, who deserves someone who will love you and support you. There is better out there. I know you know that. It's just hard when someone else has convinced you otherwise for so long. 

Anyways, I'm just putting that out there because I had a feeling. I've dealt with selfish stupid men (thank god I'm not with one, but I have some STUPID blood brothers in my family that sound a lot like this guy, only more dysfunctional, but that's a whole nother story...) and they are only out for their own means. The extent of it is so absurd that any reasonable, trusting, good person like you are I could find ourselves accidentally wrapped up in their bs without realizing what an idiot we got close to. He is keeping things from you so much that how are you to know he's not doing a lot worse that you don't see (such as the above - having an affair.) I don't know if it's good fun for them to pretend to have genuine affections or what. It might hurt them a little but they are pretty used to being selfish and covering that up for themselves with meaningless comforts...

Mostly, my response is advice from an encouraging and self-help standpoint. Which goes to say, I am glad to hear you are reading self help books, including thinking about the finances. It can be so empowering to realize that we can do a lot of things we never thought we could do - practice habits to become successful, become confident, forward-thinking, organized, financially empowered, and above all, realizing we are SELF-empowered!

A quick note that might not be so popular, but could apply, is that relationships can be repairable. It's a 1 in a million chance though - I've had it myself but it doesn't happen to everyone. (And thank goodness - I have a relationship better than any I ever dreamed of today.) Rebuilding that trust after being broken down by a selfish and ignorant person can be really hard to do. I go through it every time I deal with my family (lame, huh?) but get relief when I come back to my loving and trustworthy husband - which I hope you can have one day.

Building up for an outburst might not be easy to deal with once it's over, but it's also not the worst idea. Why? Sometimes it's the only way to spew out all the things you are feeling. It's like a volcano: years of buildup of hiding behind ourselves and lying to ourselves about what we want, what we need, exactly what we deserve - it can come out violently. We might not even say what we wanted to say, feel ourselves quiver a little and lose track of what we were on, but we can let it out. Sometimes it's necessary in life. Anger isn't the most favorable of the human emotions, but it burns like a fire, and that fire will burn down what is standing in the way of our progress as better human beings at times - as long as it is used to its fullest power, with the right intent. For that, I say, hold on to how you feel about it. Stand up for justice for yourself. Justice is a sharp sword. It can make you feel uncomfortable and finicky at first to be wielding such a powerful thing, but that's how it is: it WILL cut down the evil in its way. Things will probably be pretty unsteady for you for a while after this, but give it time and you will rebuild a better life for yourself, with better foundational policies in your relationships as a whole - where your relationship dealings will not only be more beneficial for you between you and this man, but also with other people in your life. To think: if we let ourselves get pushed around by one person (whoever that may be) I already know the chances that we aren't really upfront with other people go way up. Personal experience - we're probably lying to other people about who we are, what we want, and what we need, over and over and over. 

I know this post is about 8 mos old, but who knows - if you are still dealing with this (maybe post divorce? or planning divorce? or rebuilding the relationship and resetting boundaries?) and need a pick you up, or if it leads to reflection of some kind that helps you see how far you've come, or even if you never see it and some other woman does by chance, view this thread, then hopefully it helps someone out. You're not alone. So many of us, and not even just women!- go through needing to stand up for ourselves every day. Find out what you want, what you need. Go for it: and let's all stop letting these people and situations get in our way. 




isfplady said:


> Hi.
> 
> Married 5 years, SAHM, 2 kids under 5. When we first married I was making 28-30k to his 75-80k. We didn't join finances then, very stupidly of me. Got pregnant 4 months into the marriage, left my job 2 weeks before oldest was born (company was going under anyway). He gave me a credit card for my purchases (pretty much just groceries and baby items), said he got great points off that card, so it was all good. He paid all the bills through his account, for which I had/have no access.
> 
> ...


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