# A New Lease on Life?



## Jalapeno520 (Apr 19, 2017)

Hello Everyone,

This is my first posting here, and I suppose like just about everyone else, the reason is that I am considering divorcing my wife.

A bit of context so that everyone can give their two cents: We married fairly young, I was 23 and she was 24 and we are now 37 and 38 respectively. About 18 months after our marriage, we decided that I should join the military and I served for 12 years on active duty; doing multiple combat tours overseas. During that time, I had quite a few "life or death" experiences that certainly change one's perspective on life. I digress, but I suppose this part of the situation is important, because none of the "typical" military marriage things happened. I.E. - she never cheated (to my knowledge), she never emptied our bank account on frivolous things and she was absolutely there for me 110%. That being said, I have this nagging feeling of marital emptiness. At the end of every day, it feels like I have a really reliable roommate or sister instead of a wife.

As I said previously, she has never cheated to my knowledge. In fact, I'd be surprised if she ever did as her sex drive is about as close to absolute zero as one can get. We've gone six months or more in the past without having sex. On my R&R from combat, you would think two people in love with each other would want to share themselves with one another, correct? Well, not so here. I can recall multiple times where we hadn't seen one another for almost a year, and I return home hoping for a passionate reunion...and...nothing. Perhaps a few days before I was scheduled to go back to combat we would have sex. Almost like it was an obligation due to contract. Completely one-sided.

Now, before everyone says I'm just a sex-crazed husband who refuses to accept reality, I have repeatedly expressed my desire for us to seek marriage counseling. "Sure, I suppose we could do that..." is the response, usually followed up with an expression communicating how embarrassing that would be. I've communicated my need for a more passionate and frequent sexual relationship. I've communicated what "turns me on" and tried to see if there was something I could change that would "turn her on" as well. I'm in relatively good shape and am rather confident in my appearance as well. However, I've always wondered if there was something she was ashamed to say was her turn-on. Never been able to get anything out of her in that regard. The lack of intimacy is almost mind-numbing. Once, about two years ago, after yet another argument about our sex life, I broached the topic of divorce and it utterly destroyed her. She turned on the waterworks and I was so heartbroken that I mentioned it that I've never spoken of it since. I don't expect "sex on demand" but I suppose it would be nice to feel like I'm remotely desired in some respect. I love her...but it feels like I'm married to a sister. 

Anyhow, I also stated that she's a dead-reliable roommate. She is. She has a fantastic job that brings in more than I make (I have a great job too although I'm considering going back to school for a career change - which she does not support). We pay our bills on time. Both have excellent credit. We own two homes together. NO KIDS. One dog. Binge watch Netflix and Amazon Fire TV. Outwardly, we look like the perfect couple in many ways. We go wine tasting. We go to church (she has her faith, I've lost mine recently - she knows this too). We save for the rainy day. Etc. etc.

My ramblings lead me to this question: Do we as individuals deserve affection and deserve to be desired? 

Deep down I want to leave. I know it will result in destroying her self-image. I know it will result in financial hardship - more for me than her (I'll have nowhere to go and our bank account is joint). I know it will result in a large amount of soul-searching on my part. I just know that I've gone 14 years thus far, and that I don't want to go another 14 with the same feelings. At this point they are just building and turning into resentment. I've stopped all the requests for counseling, stopped all the "lets communicate our needs" conversations, stopped all the "how can I change" conversations and I've stopped all the other random B.S. that I've thought would help. 

To relate this back to my military service...after seeing the things I've seen, experiencing the things I've experienced and been to the places I've been to - I almost feel like I have been granted second and third chances at life. Almost like I'm entitled to live my life the way I want to regardless of what anyone else says or suggests - to include my wife. Is that selfish?

I suppose I honestly don't even know what I'm asking of everyone here except to be a sounding board for me. These are thoughts that have gone from once every now and then to an almost daily thought in the back of my mind.

I welcome any and all thoughtful perspectives. Thank you in advance.


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

First off, from a retired Soldier, thank you for your service.

Second, what did she say when you told her you were strongly considering ending the marriage over lack of intimacy? Rhetorical, isn't it...

Third, she is using a soft version of emotional blackmail by guilting you out of counseling. I think you see that, but I want to make sure.

Fourth, if after discussing how dire the situation is, if she is not willing to step up intimacy to a reasonable level, you would be justified in leaving.

She displays aversion to intimacy similar to those with a history of sexual trauma. Do you know if she does?


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

Jalapeno520 said:


> Hello Everyone,
> 
> This is my first posting here, and I suppose like just about everyone else, the reason is that I am considering divorcing my wife.
> 
> ...


As a last ditch effort you might want to send her to this site It actually fits in with her faith. 

You don't sound unreasonable by the way. 14 years in a sexless marriage if a long time.


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## GuyInColorado (Dec 26, 2015)

How lonely. Yes, marriage isn't a prison sentence. You should divorce and find another woman that desires you. Life is short. Been there, done that. 

No kids? Easy decision. Split your crap up 50/50, divorce, then go buy new crap. It's really simple.


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## Jalapeno520 (Apr 19, 2017)

sokillme said:


> As a last ditch effort you might want to send her to this site It actually fits in with her faith.
> 
> You don't sound unreasonable by the way. 14 years in a sexless marriage if a long time.


Thanks for the vote of confidence and thanks for the suggestion on the link. Not sure if/when I would send it to her. Probably after all is said-and-done I suppose. 14 years is a looong time to be "fighting" for sex I suppose.



GuyInColorado said:


> How lonely. Yes, marriage isn't a prison sentence. You should divorce and find another woman that desires you. Life is short. Been there, done that.
> 
> No kids? Easy decision. Split your crap up 50/50, divorce, then go buy new crap. It's really simple.


Thanks for your posting Colorado. It actually made me laugh out loud. Sometimes you need someone to put things into perspective, right?


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## Jalapeno520 (Apr 19, 2017)

farsidejunky said:


> First off, from a retired Soldier, thank you for your service.
> 
> Second, what did she say when you told her you were strongly considering ending the marriage over lack of intimacy? Rhetorical, isn't it...
> 
> ...


Farside,

Thank you for your service as well. Soldier here that has "been there, done that" and is still serving in the reserves. To answer your question:

1. She always says, "I'll try" and has this puppy-dog look on her face. She does state that sometimes sex "just hurts" or that she just doesn't have the libido that I have and doesn't understand why it has to be such a "big part" of a marriage.

2. Roger on the emotional blackmail. I'm a bit of a traditional guy when it comes to not making women cry...

3. Regarding sexual trauma; I know that she had an experience with a "peeping Tom" when she was in high school. She confided to me that it made her feel objectified as a female. Now, I know that individuals react in different ways to stressful situations, but I would hope that after 14 years of marriage (I've known her for 20 and this happened about 25 years ago) that she would understand that I'm not trying to objectify her. :scratchhead:

To be honest...I'm rather terrified of taking this step. After a few recent experiences that have reinforced the "don't live with regrets" mentality, I'm still like a deer-in-headlights when it comes to moving forward with this.

Thank you for your insight.

BTW - I was a huge Farside fan as a kid. Great comic strips.


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## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

Jalapeno520,

I think now is the time to sit her down and tell her exactly what you told us.
Tell her you understand she held the fort while you were away but you want more than a room mate. If she cannot see that a marriage is meant to be more then you do not have a future.

Lay out what you want to be done
1. MC
2. Openness and honesty about her feelings
3. Openness and honesty about your feelings

I am wondering what do you do for her to make her feel loved, cared for, sexy etc. We are only hearing what it is you want. 

I have a H who works away and travels alot and tbh, I've become very self sufficient because of this. I don't want to rip his clothes off when he comes home, in fact it takes time to adjust to having him around and to work on the connection. For you it may be a matter of jumping in the sack, but her needs for time together, conversation, etc needs to be met too. A woman can feel a bit used if that is the only thing. Sure sex is important for the connection but so are many other things, maybe you are not doing it for her either?

The fact that you have brought up divorce many years ago has already cracked the marriage, you have broken her trust. How to be connected to someone who breaks your trust? It's very hard, she probably has built up a wall.
Have you read His Needs Her Needs, it might help both of you before you go ahead with divorce.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

GuyInColorado said:


> How lonely. Yes, marriage isn't a prison sentence. You should divorce and find another woman that desires you. Life is short. Been there, done that.
> 
> No kids? Easy decision. Split your crap up 50/50, divorce, then go buy new crap. It's really simple.


Every day is a new day.

You don't have minor children. You are both in the prime of life. You are both gainfully employed and able to be self supporting. 

Split stuff down the middle and you are each free to pursue your own interests. 

She can find some guy to watch Netflix and not have sex and you can find some gal that has a sexdrive.

Don't over estimate her "devastation" or lack of coping.

Yes you will both shed a few tears into your pillows the first few nights on your own. But assuming she's under 250 lbs and isn't disfigured or deformed, have you ever known a reasonably attractive and self supporting woman that didn't have a line of guys wanting to hook up with her the moment she announces her divorce?


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## Jalapeno520 (Apr 19, 2017)

aine said:


> Jalapeno520,
> 
> I think now is the time to sit her down and tell her exactly what you told us.
> Tell her you understand she held the fort while you were away but you want more than a room mate. If she cannot see that a marriage is meant to be more then you do not have a future.
> ...


Thank you for your insight. I have already laid out the desire for marriage counseling, however, she seems to see it as a "mark of shame" of sorts. She basically has refused to go. I have been very open about my feelings in many regards, by she does not seem to return the candor. It's almost like an assault on the "perfect marriage." 

As for what I do for her? Well, I know that I am very willing to do all the little things throughout the day that many men expect their wives to do; just because they're women. I usually wake up first - so I get coffee and breakfast read. I feed the dog. Etc. etc. I'm usually the first one home, so I have no problem figuring out what to have for dinner - then I make it. I take care of the yard, the garden, etc. etc. I try to do little things like put out rose cuttings from our garden for her. As for sexiness - I certainly let her know that I find her physically attractive. The lack of sex has nothing to do with a lack of attempts on my part. Although I am basically at the point of no longer asking for it because I'm tired of hearing "no, not today, I have a headache." I feel like replying, "if you have a headache everyday or one that lasts for a month - we need to take you to a neurologist." 

And of course you're only going to get my side of the story. :laugh: Any attempt at me trying to speak for her would be inaccurate. Again, to be honest, the fact that I had the courage to bring up the topic of divorce a while back gives me more confidence to do it again. If I cracked the trust of the marriage, I would say she forgot about the give-and-take of marriage long before that. Lastly, no I have not read the book you've recommended. I'm very wary of self-help books. Generally speaking I view them as quackery that allow psychologists and easy way to make a buck on people without giving them any real help. Just my opinion.


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## Jalapeno520 (Apr 19, 2017)

oldshirt said:


> Every day is a new day.
> 
> You don't have minor children. You are both in the prime of life. You are both gainfully employed and able to be self supporting.
> 
> ...


You're basically on-point here. That is how I envision this happening. 50/50 split. But, I do see myself having to "plan ahead" in terms of putting some money aside for myself or researching an apartment/condo to move into (or a friend's couch). If I were to go ahead with this I really wouldn't want to be around for the waterworks or any other drama. I would want to pack up my stuff and just leave. Perhaps have the divorce papers prepped prior to leaving? I don't know.

For those of you that have gone through this before, what are the realistic logistical concerns you encountered? Basically, if you had to plan it out again, what would you do differently knowing what you know now?


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## Lostme (Nov 14, 2014)

Couldn't you both live in one of the two houses you own? that will keep you from having to find a condo etc.


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## shrah25 (Mar 22, 2017)

Jalapeno520 said:


> Hello Everyone,
> 
> This is my first posting here, and I suppose like just about everyone else, the reason is that I am considering divorcing my wife.
> 
> ...


Hi @Jalapeno520

Thanks for your post and your honesty. I echo the comments on your service - I honour you for your efforts. It must not have been easy.

Firstly, you are well within your rights to feel the way you do in terms of being granted 2nd and 3rd lives. You're the one that has been through those experiences and it's important to honour what you feel here without judgement. Thats what true authentic living is about. 

In terms of lack of passion in your life, it's a really important part of a relationship and hence, does need to be addressed. You definitely aren't coming across as a sex-crazed husband IMO. 

Now you mentioned in one of your replies the things that you do for her and a lot of them seemed like chores and things around the house. I totally hear what you're saying and as a guy, it's easy to think that what we would want, is what they want. Whilst it's great what you are doing all these things and helping out, i'm wondering whether it's actually giving her what she needs at her core. Personally, I had to learn this the hard way with my ex-wife. We were in a 'dead' relationship and even when I thought I was doing all these wonderful things, the truth was that I wasn't giving her what she needed at her core. I only truly grasped this idea a couple of years later when we had a good chat about everything. Needless to say, it was a huge light bulb moment for me and has ensured that my current marriage is operating at a completely different level. 

In short, you have to really make a commitment to it and demonstrate that you're prepared to put the effort in again and again and again so that she feels at the deepest level that you are willing to cherish, adore, love and be present for her in ways that she's never experienced before. As one of the others said, continue to show appreciation for her and work on breaking down the wall that she would have built after the previous divorce talk. Attempt to create an environment for her to speak her truth to you about her needs. If you just go in there to have a 'talk' without the right environment being created, then it might be tricky to get the answers that you are looking for. However, if you can serve her in the ways that she needs regularly, as each emotional layer is peeled, she will become more and more open to talking to you. Listen with love. Listen with presence and truly connect with her. Lots of guys end up taking the comments they hear so personally and the defensiveness sets in which further exacerbates the issues. Not sure if this happens for you but just be mindful of this and avoid this. 

If you can then truly say to yourself that you've done everything possible to turn it around and it's not working, then you can then exercise the separation path. Having said that, whichever path you take is your decision and you need to trust in that. 

Hope that makes sense. 

Thanks


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## Jalapeno520 (Apr 19, 2017)

Lostme said:


> Couldn't you both live in one of the two houses you own? that will keep you from having to find a condo etc.


The other house is about 1,500 miles away unfortunately.


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## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

Jalapeno520 said:


> Thank you for your insight. I have already laid out the desire for marriage counseling, however, she seems to see it as a "mark of shame" of sorts. She basically has refused to go. I have been very open about my feelings in many regards, by she does not seem to return the candor. It's almost like an assault on the "perfect marriage."
> 
> As for what I do for her? Well, I know that I am very willing to do all the little things throughout the day that many men expect their wives to do; just because they're women. I usually wake up first - so I get coffee and breakfast read. I feed the dog. Etc. etc. I'm usually the first one home, so I have no problem figuring out what to have for dinner - then I make it. I take care of the yard, the garden, etc. etc. I try to do little things like put out rose cuttings from our garden for her. As for sexiness - I certainly let her know that I find her physically attractive. The lack of sex has nothing to do with a lack of attempts on my part. Although I am basically at the point of no longer asking for it because I'm tired of hearing "no, not today, I have a headache." I feel like replying, "if you have a headache everyday or one that lasts for a month - we need to take you to a neurologist."
> 
> And of course you're only going to get my side of the story. :laugh: Any attempt at me trying to speak for her would be inaccurate. Again, to be honest, the fact that I had the courage to bring up the topic of divorce a while back gives me more confidence to do it again. If I cracked the trust of the marriage, I would say she forgot about the give-and-take of marriage long before that. Lastly, no I have not read the book you've recommended. I'm very wary of self-help books. *Generally speaking I view them as quackery that allow psychologists and easy way to make a buck on people without giving them any real help. Just my opinion.*




I get what you mean about the psychological quackery but this book only highlights the needs of both men and women in a marriage and might give you added insight. You will see that sex is a high need for men. It might be useful if you read it together.


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## Jalapeno520 (Apr 19, 2017)

shrah25 said:


> Hi @Jalapeno520
> 
> Thanks for your post and your honesty. I echo the comments on your service - I honour you for your efforts. It must not have been easy.
> 
> ...


Hi shrah25,

Thank you for your kind words regarding my service and thank you for your posting. I think I know what you're saying about the serving and adoration. In a way I feel like I've gone beyond that phase because the serving and adoration are not returned. But, as you stated if I want to make this work then I have to make a commitment to making an environment conducive to getting her to open up in some form or other. I try not to take things personally and get overly defensive, but of course I'm just a human being. All I can do is try my best.

I think what hurts me the most is the lack of passion overall. I'm a firm believer that a kiss reveals quite a bit about the spark between two people. For quite some time the spark has been absent. I don't expect a make-out session every morning or whatever...but...something is missing. That's all.

Again, thanks to everyone for their perspectives. I truly appreciate all opinions.


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## Satya (Jun 22, 2012)

You could ask her if she'd rather have the "mark of shame" from MC or from divorce. There really is no shame in either, but it's clearly how she sees it. She'd rather pretend everything is rosy... Maybe for her. 

You're kind of tiptoe-ing around the issue with her rather than facing it head-on. An expectation of sex and intimacy from marriage is not unreasonable. Many here would consider your current arrangement one of roommates, not marriage.


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## bankshot1993 (Feb 10, 2014)

@Jalapeno520

Been with my spouse for over 30 years and my greatest complaint is our bedroom. I'm sure that you will find it to be a fairly common problem. I have felt a lot of guilt over the last couple years for wanting the same thing as you. I want to be released. My issue is that while I say I have a dead bedroom issue, it could be somewhat misleading. My wife doesn't ever really refuse me when it comes to sex, she is always willing to accommodate my needs. My issue is that I don't want duty sex, I want to be wanted, I want my wife to have desire for me like I desire her.

Instead my sex life basically consists of once or sometimes twice a month she will lay there and let me do things to her. I want an active participant to join me in my sex life not simply have a warm body just lay there while I get exercise.

My point here is that I understand what you are saying and it goes well beyond the sex. It is about feeling desired and normal and complete. For the longest time I just felt like some kind of hideous troll that was so undesirable that even my own spouse couldn't bring herself to initiating sex with me. It played a huge role in destroying my confidence.

All I can say is that in my experience, it doesn't get any better. If it is as bad as it is now, at an age that you should be in the prime of your sexual life than there is only a downhill slide to go.


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## WorkingWife (May 15, 2015)

Jalapeno520 said:


> Thank you for your insight. I have already laid out the desire for marriage counseling, however, she seems to see it as a "mark of shame" of sorts. She basically has refused to go. I have been very open about my feelings in many regards, by she does not seem to return the candor. It's almost like an assault on the "perfect marriage."


She knows you are unhappy but refuses marriage counseling, or, apparently, to do anything about it. That right there is reason for divorce if she won't even try.



Jalapeno520 said:


> As for what I do for her? Well, I know that I am very willing to do all the little things throughout the day that many men expect their wives to do; just because they're women. I usually wake up first - so I get coffee and breakfast read. I feed the dog. Etc. etc. I'm usually the first one home, so I have no problem figuring out what to have for dinner - then I make it. I take care of the yard, the garden, etc. etc. I try to do little things like put out rose cuttings from our garden for her. As for sexiness - I certainly let her know that I find her physically attractive. The lack of sex has nothing to do with a lack of attempts on my part. Although I am basically at the point of no longer asking for it because I'm tired of hearing "no, not today, I have a headache." I feel like replying, "if you have a headache everyday or one that lasts for a month - we need to take you to a neurologist."
> 
> ...
> 
> Lastly, no I have not read the book you've recommended. I'm very wary of self-help books. Generally speaking I view them as quackery that allow psychologists and easy way to make a buck on people without giving them any real help. Just my opinion.


If you want to save your marriage and get laid, you really might want to check out that book "His Needs Her Needs." You can even get the audio version. What do you have to lose? It's just a book. If you don't agree with it, you can discard the information. It's not like what you've been doing has been working... . 

In it you'll learn that:
1. When you have long separations like you did in the military, women lose their feeling of connection. Without that feeling of connection, most women have very little to zero sexual desire. (Sorry, but it's true.)
2. All these really nice things you're putting energy into doing for your wife? You sound like a GREAT guy, and that's a lot of work, but your energy would be much more productive put into other things. I'm sure she appreciates those things, but they are NOT the key to creating the feeling of romantic love women need to desire sex. 

Here is a short article by the author of His Needs Her Needs that will give you an idea: The question of the ages: How can a husband receive the sex he needs in marriage? by Dr. Willard F. Harley, Jr.


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