# Wife's Affair



## toddbas (Feb 13, 2015)

Will keep this as simple as possible while still providing enough info. My wife works remotely from home but travels from time to time to company HQ for a few days to up to a week. We'd been having problems for a while and were working on things and they were/are progressing nicely. I think we're going to be just fine in the end. Her last trip to HQ about 2 months ago, I found out she had sex with someone, which wasn't shocking because I just about gave her a "hall pass" so she could figure out some stuff. I'm not even so angry about what she did. Here's the problem. It was someone she works with and has to have frequent contact with. She also lied about who it was because she knew I would have a problem with who she chose to do this with. They'd both been having problems in their marriages and had planned it for a while. While not so angry about the act itself (hurt yes, but angry no), I think her choice of who was a bit reckless. Now, she says that they agreed it would be a one time thing, that she learned a lot and one of those things she learned is that she is committed to me and our marriage. I believe her. But, deep down, I'm worried that she still has contact with this person frequently....and...she'll be travelling to HQ again in a few weeks relating to a big project she's leading. I know for sure this man will be there and that work related contact will have to continue as long as she is in this role.

Now, I'm not saying I've made a decision but I'm looking for the thoughts of others. She has a great career, is top-notch in every way and a very high achiever (she actually out-earns me greatly). My question is: What are everyone's thoughts on telling her that I would like her to either leave the company, or change jobs within the company that would preclude any further work-related contact with this man??


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## bryanp (Aug 25, 2011)

Sorry for what you are going through.
1. You both need to get tested for STD's.
2. If the OM is married then you need to contact his wife or otherwise there is no reason for him not to try again.

Why would you give your wife a free pass?
She deliberately screwed a man that you strongly disliked. What does that tell you?

She had to screw another employee to realize that she was committed to you and the marriage? What is wrong with this picture? 

There is something not right about this. Something is missing to understand this.


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## jb02157 (Apr 16, 2014)

Since she outearns you, she has much more to lose that you do and now you have the advantage. I would go right at her and tell her it's over. Let her come to you with reasons why she wants to keep the marriage. If she doesn't, leave. You will fair far better in a divorce than she would and I don't think you could ever trust her.


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## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

bryanp said:


> Sorry for what you are going through.
> 1. You both need to get tested for STD's.
> 2. If the OM is married then you need to contact his wife or otherwise there is no reason for him not to try again.
> 
> ...


:iagree:

Free pass? Really? It appears you are now working/living in a open marriage.


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## convert (Oct 4, 2013)

It is not unreasonable to want her or OM to change jobs so they are not in contact, actually it is standard protocol for a good R.
Trust is shot to he!! so you are going to worry every time she goes there.
It would be to easy to start the affair again or them to say lets do it one more time.

the one thing I am all for is exposure, It helps kill the affair or helps keeps it from coming back.

Tell the OM's wife (part of the exposure)


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## italianjob (May 7, 2014)

Why did you give her a "hall pass"? Are you trying an open marriage?

This kind of things, if you're not into the "swinger" lifestyle almost never end well, IMO (and often they do not end well even if you ARE into the lifestyle).


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## 5Creed (May 29, 2011)

Not sure why she was practically given a hall pass, but my thoughts on telling her to not have contact with the man she had sex with is yes tell her just that. You probably know that if you stay together she shouldn't be working with him. As long as it can be done financially.


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## 5Creed (May 29, 2011)

Wanted to add that a spouse giving the other a hall pass to "figure things out" is not a good idea.


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## chillymorn (Aug 11, 2010)

she's got you wrapped around her finger.
you practically gave her a hall pass?????? what the heck dose that mean? either you did or you didn't.

and you did this because she wanted to find herself??????? 

did she come home and say thanks baby I tried out someone elses c0ck and I now know that your the one for me. 


shes most likely a serial cheater and will always be. and now that you seem to be ok with it she will continue.

cut your losses and move on


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## toddbas (Feb 13, 2015)

In regards to the "hall pass". I'm not a stupid person. There are reasons for it that I have not mentioned and quite frankly, they are irrelevant to the discussion at hand. I know why my wife did it (and it has nothing to do with infidelity on my part) and what those reasons are and that's going to have to suffice. We are not in an open marriage, someone mentioned not liking the guy...I don't even know him, and telling his wife, who I also don't know is not an option, and I am not interested in fleecing her in a divorce. 

I'm not looking for thoughts or opinions on all of that. My question was about what you would do or not do in regards to her job.


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## Q tip (Apr 15, 2014)

a hall pass is the ultimate act of a beta. unsure of himself. 

you can recover and take a leadership role in your marriage.

but, major damage has been done. you need to regain your position as top dog. mentally, she has attached somewhat to a new guy. doesn't matter her words. her mind is out there now.

read up on Married Man Sex Life Primer 2011 by Athol Kay. read and reread the book, bro. then execute a plan.

work out. lose all fat, gain muscle. achieve this within 3 months.

and she transfers away from him, never sees or works with him and total NC. let the OMW know. she deserves to know. stop the coward act. own your marriage.

head over to chump lady too.


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## convert (Oct 4, 2013)

toddbas said:


> In regards to the "hall pass". I'm not a stupid person. There are reasons for it that I have not mentioned and quite frankly, they are irrelevant to the discussion at hand. I know why my wife did it (and it has nothing to do with infidelity on my part) and what those reasons are and that's going to have to suffice. We are not in an open marriage, someone mentioned not liking the guy...I don't even know him, and telling his wife, who I also don't know is not an option, and I am not interested in fleecing her in a divorce.
> 
> I'm not looking for thoughts or opinions on all of that. *My question was about what you would do or not do in regards to her job.*


NC (NO CONTACT) ----If that means her leaving the job or OM leaving the job one or the other.
and if she will not leave or OM will not leave then the next best thing is exposure to OM'S wife.

It give you a second set of eyes on the matter.
it helps keep the affair dead


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## Q tip (Apr 15, 2014)

expose yourself too . a hall pass? for real???

anyone out there who knows a hall pass fixes anything, please raise your hand...


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## bryanp (Aug 25, 2011)

You tell the OM's wife because:
1. She has a right to know. Would you want this if the roles were reversed?
2. She provides another set of eyes on her husband from ever doing this to your wife again.
3. There must be consequences to their actions.
4. By not informing his wife you are sending a clear message to the OM that there are no consequences to him screwing your wife and humiliating and disrespecting you and your marriage.
5. What were the consequences to your wife? No consequences to your wife actions equals no motivation to change.
6. Your wife clearly disrespect and humiliated you. If you do not respect yourself then who will?


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## KingwoodKev (Jan 15, 2015)

You opened Pandora's box. Good luck trying to close it.


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## italianjob (May 7, 2014)

bryanp said:


> 6. Your wife clearly disrespect and humiliated you. If you do not respect yourself then who will?


Looks like for whatever reason he was OK with it and gave her permission, so he disrespected himself.


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## KingwoodKev (Jan 15, 2015)

italianjob said:


> Looks like for whatever reason he was OK with it and gave her permission, so he disrespected himself.


...and set a horrible precedent. Why shouldn't she do it again whenever she sees some man-meat she likes the look of? She knows he's ok with it. The whole thing was a recipe for disaster from the start, IMO. I wish him well in putting out the fires that he started.


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## chillymorn (Aug 11, 2010)

toddbas said:


> In regards to the "hall pass". I'm not a stupid person. There are reasons for it that I have not mentioned and quite frankly, they are irrelevant to the discussion at hand. I know why my wife did it (and it has nothing to do with infidelity on my part) and what those reasons are and that's going to have to suffice. We are not in an open marriage, someone mentioned not liking the guy...I don't even know him, and telling his wife, who I also don't know is not an option, and I am not interested in fleecing her in a divorce.
> 
> I'm not looking for thoughts or opinions on all of that. My question was about what you would do or not do in regards to her job.


hey, I would let her do whatever she wants that's been working for this long why change now.:scratchhead:


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## lucy999 (Sep 28, 2014)

Sorry, but you should've attached strings to the hall pass-did you discuss who she could and could not sleep with?

If those rules aren't discussed ahead of time, then it's on you to suck it up. Awkward, sure, but you should've set up some parameters of that hall pass. Not fair now to ask her to leave her job.


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## KingwoodKev (Jan 15, 2015)

lucy999 said:


> Sorry, but you should've attached strings to the hall pass-did you discuss who she could and could not sleep with?
> 
> If those rules aren't discussed ahead of time, then it's on you to suck it up. Awkward, sure, but you should've set up some parameters of that hall pass. Not fair now to ask her to leave her job.


For me personally the very concept of a "hall pass" is 100% ridiculous in a marriage.


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## syhoybenden (Feb 21, 2013)

According to the OP's duplicate post in General Relationship all the advice he's received here has been silly and immature.

Good luck to ya then.


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## lucy999 (Sep 28, 2014)

KingwoodKev said:


> For me personally the very concept of a "hall pass" is 100% ridiculous in a marriage.


I agree but I was merely answering OP's question.


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## KingwoodKev (Jan 15, 2015)

syhoybenden said:


> According to the OP's duplicate post in General Relationship all the advice he's received here has been silly and immature.
> 
> Good luck to ya then.


Said the guy(OP) who gave his wife a "hall pass" to screw other guys. That's one of the most ridiculous things I've ever heard.


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## KingwoodKev (Jan 15, 2015)

lucy999 said:


> I agree but I was merely answering OP's question.


I know. I just can't believe someone would give their spouse a "hall pass" (permission) to screw other people and then be bothered by the outcome.


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## NoChoice (Feb 12, 2012)

OP,
There are two insurmountable problems with your scenario. One, you offered your wife a "hall pass" and two, she took you up on it. Her job is irrelevant at this point and the least of your worries. Good luck.


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## Lostinthought61 (Nov 5, 2013)

i have to say that i am with lucy on this one, you gave her a hall pass, you obviously did not tell her who she could or could not sleep with, regardless of her decision she made, you really have no grounds to be hurt or angry. As to the second part of the question, if she told you it was a one time thing, then you need to trust her or not trust her, if it is the latter then to be honest the question is moot and you need to re-look at your marriage, if the former then you have hope she does the right thing and is honest with you. and as a side note, you can't call it an affair if you know about it and gave her permission. It becomes an affair is she does not tell you about it.


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## italianjob (May 7, 2014)

The problem with discussing this is that the concept of agreeing to your wife's screwing someone else is quite alien to a vast majority of people (except those who are in an open marriage, but you said it wasn't the case here), so the advice you can get is purely hypothetical and based on a scenario very few people would find themselves in and find acceptable.

I guess if you gave permission and didn't put any kind of condition you need to suck it up, and have no right to ask her to do anything about it. You should have known better.


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

toddbas said:


> In regards to the "hall pass". I'm not a stupid person. There are reasons for it that I have not mentioned and quite frankly, they are irrelevant to the discussion at hand. I know why my wife did it (and it has nothing to do with infidelity on my part) and what those reasons are and that's going to have to suffice. We are not in an open marriage, someone mentioned not liking the guy...I don't even know him, and telling his wife, who I also don't know is not an option, and I am not interested in fleecing her in a divorce.
> 
> I'm not looking for thoughts or opinions on all of that. My question was about what you would do or not do in regards to her job.


Hmm. It's interesting that you'd choose to post this in the "Coping With _Infidelity_" sub-forum. But OK...

Captain Hindsight says, "Acceptable parameters for said 'hall pass' should have been discussed well in advance of said business trip." Derp.

Having said that, if she's as intelligent as you've described, I have to believe that she'd have been able to figure it out for herself that initiating sexual relations w/ a co-worker (even under the guise of a "one-time" thing) would have been / is essentially tantamount to playing w/ fire.

Respectfully, if you want constructive feedback here, the conditions under which the "hall pass" was granted should be opened for discussion. I say that because, in absence of said discussion, her choice of AP/ONS/FWB/FB -- in addition to the fact that _she *lied* about his identity_ -- just *screams* emotional affair to me.

And if that's the case, you've got a much bigger problem on your hands than you currently realize.


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## BetrayedDad (Aug 8, 2013)

toddbas said:


> While not so angry about the act itself (hurt yes, but angry no)


Step 1) Get angry....

Step 2) Go back to step one.

You basically wh0red out your wife and now your mad at her choice of clients... I'm far from an expert on women but I know this much. Woman WANT to feel protected by their man. Instead you gave her a "hall pass" and told her to go play with the wolves. 

This unconsciously planted the notion in her head that you don't care about her and you have no respect for yourself because you allow you wife to fvck whomever she wants. And since you don't respect yourself to stop your wife from sleeping with other men why is she going to respect you?

You made yourself a cuckold and compounded with the fact that she out earns, she's pegged you in her mind as a beta doormat. Read MMSLP as soon as possible. You've got a proverbial mountain to climb if you want to win her respect back.


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## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

GusPolinski said:


> Hmm. It's interesting that you'd choose to post this in the "Coping With _Infidelity_" sub-forum. But OK...
> 
> Captain Hindsight says, "Acceptable parameters for said 'hall pass' should have been discussed well in advance of said business trip." Derp.
> 
> ...


Nailed it.


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## Hardtohandle (Jan 10, 2013)

OP, I get what you're saying.. 

But I think you are missing the underlying problem here.. The issue is you do not see that you actually made this worse for yourself and your marriage.. 

It equates to you saying I let her smoke crack but I didn't want her to smoke crack in the car with the baby.. So do I call child services on her ?

As was mentioned, Pandora's Box has been opened here. You didn't mention children together.. So gonna assume you don't have any.. 

What if she needs another hall pass ? What if she realizes or decides that this other man is just as good as you in bed and financially they would be better off ?.

She is trading up isn't she ?.. 

Regardless of your reason why to give her the "hall pass", you were very short sighted here.. 

Now you think you are going to hold weight over her and tell her to quit this job ? In this day and age when people are struggling to get a good job ?.. Start new in a new company ? 

What if she sits down and weighs this out and thinks you're not worth her quitting her job.. What if she challenges you on it.. 

Are you willing to leave ? The hall pass seems like you are not.. 

I'm just gonna say how can you be okay with someone fvcking your wife even if you cheated and as you said you didn't.. So that being said..Them working together just seems very minuscule compared to them fvcking.. 

How do you know now she doesn't want another taste with someone else ? 

The best you can do is just express your concerns about them working together.. But please do use words like poor judgment with her because I can see that being tossed back in your face..


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## wmn1 (Aug 27, 2014)

Hall pass ? Really ? Who does that ??

Regardless, you gave the Hall Pass, you have every right to revoke it. Sounds like you started doing that however you seem to be somewhat non-chalant about it so I know there are other things at play here. 

I am very big here for saying that the WW's cheating is not on you and this one case seems to defy that to an extent although she decided to do the disgusting act when she could have told you to pound it and stay loyal to you. So I think blame is shared here. 

I have a big problem with now wanting her to change jobs. Really ? Why ? Is this a blown out affair now ? if there is limited contact based on your invitation to open your marriage, why do you care ?? Now, you not only damaged your marriage but now your livelihood too.

Monitor and if she doesn't stop cheating, divorce. But you need to fix yourself first. 

this is why I hate open relationships, they fail for this reason and are nasty. I garee with Italianjob's assessment on this.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

Q tip said:


> expose yourself too . a hall pass? for real???
> 
> anyone out there who knows a hall pass fixes anything, please raise your hand...


Yep. My hand is up. And it did work in our case.


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## KingwoodKev (Jan 15, 2015)

NoChoice said:


> OP,
> There are two insurmountable problems with your scenario. One, you offered your wife a "hall pass" and two, she took you up on it. Her job is irrelevant at this point and the least of your worries. Good luck.


I have been thinking the same thing. Who offers their spouse a hall pass? What kind of person would take their spouse up on such an offer? If my wife said "hey, I want you to have a hall pass to screw other women" we'd be done with the marriage at that point. I wouldn't want a spouse who would offer such a thing and on the flip side I wouldn't want a spouse who would take someone up on such an offer. The problems with this marriage are much deeper than hall passes and who she slept with or where she works.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

MattMatt said:


> Yep. My hand is up. And it did work in our case.


*Matt: Not trying to be argumentative here, but just how did a "hall pass" work out in your case?*


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## thummper (Dec 19, 2013)

bryanp said:


> Sorry for what you are going through.
> 1. You both need to get tested for STD's.
> 2. If the OM is married then you need to contact his wife or otherwise there is no reason for him not to try again.
> 
> ...


*I've NEVER understood this behavior! Why would ANY husband countenance a sexual liason between his wife and another man for any reason?* :scratchhead: It makes no sense at all, and now you're dealing with the aftermath. I'd divorce my wife before I would EVER agree to her screwing some other guy. If she wanted to do that, fine. Give her her freedom and let her go on her merry way.


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## thummper (Dec 19, 2013)

toddbas said:


> In regards to the "hall pass". I'm not a stupid person. There are reasons for it that I have not mentioned and quite frankly, they are irrelevant to the discussion at hand. I know why my wife did it (and it has nothing to do with infidelity on my part) and what those reasons are and that's going to have to suffice. We are not in an open marriage, someone mentioned not liking the guy...I don't even know him, and telling his wife, who I also don't know is not an option, and I am not interested in fleecing her in a divorce.
> 
> I'm not looking for thoughts or opinions on all of that. *My question was about what you would do or not do in regards to her job.*




Sorry, I didn't notice that question. My answer is that she should be out of that job immediately...yesterday would not be soon enough. She's tasted the "forbidden fruit" with this guy, why do you (or she) think she wouldn't like to go back for a second helping? Because she *SAYS* she wouldn't???


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## Dogbert (Jan 10, 2015)

toddbas said:


> I posted this question on the infidelity thread but all i'm getting is silly and immature responses that aren't even answering my question.


Then I guess it's pointless to offer you anymore advice in the face of such disrespectful attitude towards people who only want to help you. Good luck though, you'll need it.


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

Dogbert said:


> Then I guess it's pointless to offer you anymore advice in the face of such disrespectful attitude towards people who only want to help you. Good luck though, you'll need it.


:iagree::scratchhead::scratchhead:
Oh well.


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## tacoma (May 1, 2011)

Your wife ****ed up by taking your "hall pass" but truthfully you ****ed up tenfold more by giving it to her.

You think her choice of an affair partner was reckless?
Your hall pass was the epitomy of idiotic recklessness.

The way fix this situation is to go No Contact but you've essentially taken that off the table by giving her a hall pass so you're screwed there.

Another way to fix this thing is by informing the affair partners wife of the affair but again, you've all but taken this off the table with your "Hall Pass".

The only ethical thing I can see that you can do is swallow down your paranoia and mistrust about whether or not she's screwing this guy while on business trip and rugsweep the whole thing.

That should give you somewhere between 1-5 years before the resentment and paranoia screw your head up so badly you're forced into divorce.

I got nothing else.


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## BradWesley (May 24, 2013)

My only comment.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ytCEuuW2_A


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## Decorum (Sep 7, 2012)

The op thinks you are all silly and immature.
http://talkaboutmarriage.com/general-relationship-discussion/251329-wifes-affair.html

He is just worried she may sleep with him again, he said it was reckless, presumably because it could affect her career, so he wants to know if it is reasonable for him to ask her to change jobs. In itself a career change.

She earns "much" more than him.

He is akin to a "kept" man. What to do?

She is on a much needed journey of self-exploration trying to "figure out some stuff".

So while she mounts the poop deck of her carnal journey should she "Changes Ships" and find a different Helmsman?

Or if she does changes jobs maybe her current love interest will seem less reckless? How about that?

This seems like a skit for Captain obvious or SNL.


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## Dogbert (Jan 10, 2015)

There is simply no way for a WW to avoid contact with the OM if she still has to travel and deal work related issues with him. Even if she tries her best, the temptation is too great - far away from home and no way anybody could find out - and the OM is more than likely to pursue her because he wants to continue the extra-marital sex. That's akin to a reforming alcoholic having to go to bars for work related matters. Totally idiotic.


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## Q tip (Apr 15, 2014)

arbitrator said:


> *Matt: Not trying to be argumentative here, but just how did a "hall pass" work out in your case?*


she cheated, he suffered, theyre still together.


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## carolinadreams (Nov 30, 2012)

toddbas said:


> In regards to the "hall pass". I'm not a stupid person. There are reasons for it that I have not mentioned and quite frankly, they are irrelevant to the discussion at hand. I know why my wife did it (and it has nothing to do with infidelity on my part) and what those reasons are and that's going to have to suffice. We are not in an open marriage, someone mentioned not liking the guy...I don't even know him, and telling his wife, who I also don't know is not an option, and I am not interested in fleecing her in a divorce.
> 
> I'm not looking for thoughts or opinions on all of that. My question was about what you would do or not do in regards to her job.


You are worried about the color of your drapes when your house is burning down. 

Barring you wanting to be in an open marriage, giving your partner a "free pass" to figure some things out - is poorly reasoned at best. Sex with another person never strengthens the primary bond it only weakens it. You should re-examine why you are trying to save something (your marriage), if you don't have the conviction to protect it (by setting appropriate boundaries).

You giving your wife a pass has likely diminished what respect she has for you and replaced it with contempt. Unless you can understand that to some degree there's nothing anyone here can help you with that isn't cosmetic.


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## wmn1 (Aug 27, 2014)

I agree Carolina


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

MattMatt said:


> Yep. My hand is up. And it did work in our case.





arbitrator said:


> *Matt: Not trying to be argumentative here, but just how did a "hall pass" work out in your case?*


With all due respect to Matt, any reasonable interpretation of what he's provided w/ respect to his "story" would lead pretty much anyone to come to the conclusion that his wife _*took*_ a hall pass.

He didn't offer it. She just took it.

But hey... at least she had the decency to tell him up front!


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## Q tip (Apr 15, 2014)

OPs strategy might very well be that of a walk away BS.


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## tacoma (May 1, 2011)

It doesn't matter.

OP has not an iota of leverage to get her to change jobs.

He's in a seriously beta position.

Allows wife to **** other man
Is house husband.

These two alone will keep her from agreeing to any request/demand he makes especially one concerning the loss of her job since it's the source of her strength/control.

He's screwed but doesn't seem to know it.


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## carolinadreams (Nov 30, 2012)

There's a point in every person's life, particularly if they find them-self in a state of abject misery, where they should ask the questions:
1. Are my assumptions about people, about relationships, about my expectations correct?
2. Have the choices I have made up this point rendered me the results I wanted?
3. If I do more of the same (with a bigger smile and more enthusiasm) will I get different results, or just more pain?

I think when a lot of people first come to CWI, they don't even know the questions they should be asking.


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## tacoma (May 1, 2011)

He's probably not going to reply here again but I'm not bouncing between two threads.

OP, what makes you think this is over between her and her boyfriend?
This is where you might be able to regain some leverage so listen.

You say they had been planning this for awhile, this is an emotional affair probably before you gave your hall pass otherwise the need for a hall pass wouldn't have come up at all.

An emotional affair isn't something you just shut down like flicking a switch.

She sees him daily, is out of town with him frequently.
Odds are she's still ****ing him.

Why do you believe she is no longer physical with him?

She probably has more respect for him that you, I mean you just handed her to him without a fight, he makes more than you, you're beta, he's alpha...this is biology 101.

How's your sex life OP?
Do you have access to your wifes communication devices?
Phone bills?


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## PhillyGuy13 (Nov 29, 2013)

To answer your question, you have a decision to make. You have to give her an ultimatum - you or the career. You don't want her around this guy. That's how you feel. So that's where you are at.

It seems like you would have preferred her to pick up some random stranger in a bar and have a ONS. She chose a work acquaintance. 

Whatever the reasoning for you giving her the hall pass, she doesn't respect you. You won't get into the why's and that's fine. Infidelity, gambled away the mortgage payment, forgot to pick up the dry cleaning. Most faithful spouses would laugh away that offer. She took you up on it right quick.


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## carolinadreams (Nov 30, 2012)

tacoma said:


> It doesn't matter.
> 
> OP has not an iota of leverage to get her to change jobs.
> 
> ...


Likely some of this. I notice the OP kept mentioning how fantastic her career is - has that translated to more or less quality time together, or more enjoyable material wealth? Just because one partner has significant career success doesn't mean that translate into advantages for the relationship.


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## Zouz (May 28, 2014)

sorry op ,

:rofl::rofl::rofl:

sorry but some people are attacking me to go to open marriage when I am in a sexless marriage for 15 years ....


:lol:

he gave her a free pass..

:scratchhead:

then doesn't licked that she fuVed the wrong guy ...:rofl:


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## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

GusPolinski said:


> With all due respect to Matt, any reasonable interpretation of what he's provided w/ respect to his "story" would lead pretty much anyone to come to the conclusion that his wife _*took*_ a hall pass.
> 
> He didn't offer it. She just took it.
> 
> But hey... at least she had the decency to tell him up front!


I guess there is a wee bit of silver lining.


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## BobSimmons (Mar 2, 2013)

toddbas said:


> In regards to the "hall pass". I'm not a stupid person. *There are reasons for it that I have not mentioned and quite frankly, they are irrelevant to the discussion at hand.* I know why my wife did it (and it has nothing to do with infidelity on my part) and what those reasons are and that's going to have to suffice. We are not in an open marriage, someone mentioned not liking the guy...I don't even know him, and telling his wife, who I also don't know is not an option, and I am not interested in fleecing her in a divorce.
> 
> I'm not looking for thoughts or opinions on all of that. My question was about what you would do or not do in regards to her job.


I think you'll find they are quite relevant.

I don't see what the problem is..you gave her a pass and she took it, just with someone you don't like.

Why make her quit her job for a pass you gave? Suck it up and quit giving out passes. Life works out better that way.


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## tacoma (May 1, 2011)

carolinadreams said:


> Likely some of this. I notice the OP kept mentioning how fantastic her career is - has that translated to more or less quality time together, or more enjoyable material wealth? Just because one partner has significant career success doesn't mean that translate into advantages for the relationship.


Actually it does.

How many women come in here wanting to leave their husbands but the only thing stopping them is the fact that they've been married for 10 years, have no money of their own and no career skills?

It's also a cultural/gender imperitive.
Women respect strong, confident, independent men, women fall for men they respect.
Men in western culture without a good income let alone any income generally lose the respect of their partners to a degree.
Over time if the staus quo never changes more and more respect is lost.

Combine that with OP's willingness to simply physically "give his wife" to another man ( A man who is at least her economic and cultural equal) and you have a relationship crisis of epic proportions.

From the very little info OP has posted here I'd bet much money his wife's level of respect for him is quite a bit power than her level of respect for her husband whether his or her modern mindsets will admit it or not.


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## PhillyGuy13 (Nov 29, 2013)

Don't know why he is so afraid to give the complete picture. It's not like we haven't heard it all. He cheated first, he has ED issues, or a long term illness? Doesn't matter it's an anonymous Internet forum. 

Todd if you come back online, these folks want to help you. You may not like what you hear, but know that the wisdom is wise.


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## carolinadreams (Nov 30, 2012)

Tacoma in a traditional relationship, if he were earning more it would probably benefit him, I haven't seen that he's presented evidence that his wife's successful career has helped him to any degree.

I've always earned more money than my wife, when we were dating even though she was very successful at what she did, and had high status from it, it meant she was too exhausted most of the week to spend quality time with me, and because of her spending habits and debt she brought into the relationship - her career "success" wasn't actually a net positive to our relationship.


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## tacoma (May 1, 2011)

carolinadreams said:


> Tacoma in a traditional relationship, if he were earning more it would probably benefit him, I haven't seen that he's presented evidence that his wife's successful career has helped him to any degree.


Good point and while it may sound quite neanderthal of me I don't think a wife permanently being the sole breadwinner ever helps a man in any relationship beyond the financial security it provides him during the good times...at least in this day and age.

With the increase of women in high paying managerial positions this is changing but like anything it'll take awhile to make a meaningful impact culturally.

Many women still look to a man for security even those who don't necessarily need it.
Those still tend to want a man who is at the very least their economic/societal equal.


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## G.J. (Nov 4, 2014)

toddbas said:


> In regards to the "hall pass". I'm not a stupid person. There are reasons for it that I have not mentioned and quite frankly, they are irrelevant to the discussion at hand. I know why my wife did it (and it has nothing to do with infidelity on my part) and what those reasons are and that's going to have to suffice. We are not in an open marriage, someone mentioned not liking the guy...I don't even know him, and telling his wife, who I also don't know is not an option, and I am not interested in fleecing her in a divorce.
> 
> I'm not looking for thoughts or opinions on all of that. My question was about what you would do or not do in regards to her job.


Not knowing enough how can anyone advise what they would do in your situation !!!!

Oh hang on let me get my crystal ball


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

tacoma said:


> Good point and while it may sound quite neanderthal of me I don't think a wife permanently being the sole breadwinner ever helps a man in any relationship beyond the financial security it provides him during the good times...at least in this day and age.
> 
> With the increase of women in high paying managerial positions this is changing but like anything it'll take awhile to make a meaningful impact culturally.
> 
> ...


Sucks... but it's the truth.


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## thummper (Dec 19, 2013)

toddbas said:


> Will keep this as simple as possibleNow, I'm not saying I've made a decision but I'm looking for the thoughts of others. *She has a great career, is top-notch in every way and a very high achiever (she actually out-earns me greatly). *My question is: What are everyone's thoughts on telling her that I would like her to either leave the company, or change jobs within the company that would preclude any further work-related contact with this man??



This is GREAT news for you!! :smthumbup: If she's absolutely unwilling to switch jobs or move to a different firm, divorce her and let HER pay YOU alimony. Lay that little consequence on the table and see how she reacts. If that doesn't appeal to you and you're determined to stay with her NO MATTER WHAT, then you'll just have to stand back, let her do whatever she wants, and spend your time when she's off on one of these "work" trips wondering who she might be diddling with. 'Sup to you.


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

toddbas said:


> In regards to the "hall pass". I'm not a stupid person. There are reasons for it that I have not mentioned and quite frankly, they are irrelevant to the discussion at hand. I know why my wife did it (and it has nothing to do with infidelity on my part) and what those reasons are and that's going to have to suffice. We are not in an open marriage, someone mentioned not liking the guy...I don't even know him, and telling his wife, who I also don't know is not an option, and I am not interested in fleecing her in a divorce.
> 
> I'm not looking for thoughts or opinions on all of that. My question was about what you would do or not do in regards to her job.



You realize that you are not paying anyone here, right ?


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## ThePheonix (Jan 3, 2013)

toddbas said:


> I'm not looking for thoughts or opinions on all of that. My question was about what you would do or not do in regards to her job.





carolinadreams said:


> You are worried about the color of your drapes when your house is burning down.
> You giving your wife a pass has likely diminished what respect she has for you and replaced it with contempt. Unless you can understand that to some degree there's nothing anyone here can help you with that isn't cosmetic.


Todd my man, this ain't Burger King. You don't get your way. You take it the way we give it. But lets focus on her job; or more specifically, who she's around at her job. Its really simple Dawg. If she didn't have the hots for this dude, she wouldn't have slept with him in the first place. So unless he was a total dud in the sack, the girl's going back or has went back for seconds. Take my word for it. Once the guy had her in the sack, its easier for him the next time.
What worse, its like CarolinaD said. Your whimpy actions begging her to stay by offering to let her sample a strange pecker, diminished her respect for you. Once a woman loses respect for her man, it never returns. And a woman's respect for you is directly proportional to her romantic interest. 
Based on your inept handling of the situation, this week the award goes to you.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

arbitrator said:


> *Matt: Not trying to be argumentative here, but just how did a "hall pass" work out in your case?*


She had her fling. We are still together.

Had I not felt like death due to having fallen ill with a very bad case of glandular fever which turned to CFS, I might have reacted differently. But we'll never know.


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## NoChoice (Feb 12, 2012)

OP,
As per your statement, you are not a stupid person so why do you need the advice of immature strangers, who would attempt to help you if you weren't so brilliant as to discount their advice and then insult them.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

Yeswecan said:


> I guess there is a wee bit of silver lining.


More than that, to be honest.

The heartbreaking stories of good men and women I have seen on TAM who caught the love of their life with a lover, or who found out when someone came to them with the evidence, or were sent a video of their spouse's infidelity... I don't know if I'd have been able to have got through that.

I take my hat off to anyone who has been through that.

But I'll tell you something, I will be here for them to help them make the right decision for them, divorce or reconcile, also I'll be here for the WS who wants to know how they can help their BS.


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## tacoma (May 1, 2011)

MattMatt said:


> She had her fling. We are still together.
> 
> Had I not felt like death due to having fallen ill with a very bad case of glandular fever which turned to CFS, I might have reacted differently. But we'll never know.


I may have your history wrong Matt but I don't think her hall pass "worked for you".

You'r revenge EA nearly going PA and the recovery time y'all had invested in repairing the relationship doesn't sound like a benefit to your marriage.

I think you're still together "in spite of" the hall pass, not because of it.

Again correct me if I have the history wrong because it's been awhile since I became aware of it.


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## 10th Engineer Harrison (Dec 11, 2013)

Okay, let's make this what to do in regards to her job:



toddbas said:


> In regards to the "hall pass". I'm not a stupid person. There are reasons for it that I have not mentioned and quite frankly, they are irrelevant to the discussion at hand. I know why my wife did it (and it has nothing to do with infidelity on my part) and what those reasons are and that's going to have to suffice.


Then why mention it? We can't advise you without some inkling why you feel the way you appear to about what happened. 



> We are not in an open marriage, someone mentioned not liking the guy...I don't even know him, and telling his wife, who I also don't know is not an option, and I am not interested in fleecing her in a divorce.


Why isn't telling his wife an option? I can understand not wanting to fleece someone in a divorce. Divorces after infidelity are rarely truly amicable, though.



> I'm not looking for thoughts or opinions on all of that. My question was about what you would do or not do in regards to her job.


I would insist they no longer work together or have any contact with one another for life. Or, let them carry on and remove yourself from the triangle.

-10th Engineer Harrison.


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## NotLikeYou (Aug 30, 2011)

toddbas said:


> Now, I'm not saying I've made a decision but I'm looking for the thoughts of others. She has a great career, is top-notch in every way and a very high achiever (she actually out-earns me greatly). My question is: What are everyone's thoughts on telling her that I would like her to either leave the company, or change jobs within the company that would preclude any further work-related contact with this man??


toddbas- please excuse the commentariat, here.They have lots of trouble focusing on the questions posed when the story is vivid.

They read your post and start asking questions like "WTF is wrong with this guy,"

and forget that you're not asking them WTF is wrong with you.

My thoughts are that talking to her about this is a bad idea. As a househusband, you have no leverage in the relationship. Asking her to stop having sex with this other guy is going to make her ask herself what she likes more- a successful, accomplished man in the same field as her with lots of similar interests, or, well, you.

You don't want her asking that question, because you won't like the answer she chooses.

Instead, I suggest that you emphasize the positive things you bring to the marriage, like cleaning the toilets, cooking, dusting, and having a stiff drink and slippers ready for her when she gets home.

And DO NOT let her take "getting the dry cleaning" for granted- it takes time, effort, and planning. Plus, you have to dispose of the protective plastic sleeves they put over the blouses.

You can also work on being more romantic. I suggest a scrumptious Friday night dinner, a bottle of wine by the fireplace, and some mood music.

Start off with Crystal Gayle's "I can love you like Nobody can, even better," and see what develops. You can sing along for added emotional impact.

Unfortunately for you, you put yourself in this position through a series of day to day choices that eradicated your authority in the marriage. There are no easy fixes, but I have to admit you're being consistent, here. You're trying to avoid the problem as hard as you can.

So.

Zipped lips, and lots of tissues to wipe your eyes with.


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## Plan 9 from OS (Jul 13, 2012)

OP, treat the disease not the symptoms. You messed up by condoning the fact that she took a hall pass from the marriage. Now you make her choose you or the current job. When she refuses to switch jobs, you nuke the marriage and enjoy the alimony.


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## wmn1 (Aug 27, 2014)

ok, here is my final opinion on this thread as it seems to be mind numbing;

1) Most here want fidelity. Most here couldn't get fidelity because someone 'stepped out'. Yet, what we couldn't get but deserved, Toddbas gave up freely and voluntarily. That's why we can't associate with you because none of us would have done that

2) Had Toddbas come on here and said "man, I screwed up' we could sympathize with a dumb decision once and help him rebuild it if he wanted or put it out of business. But he seems focused on a job more than his wife's fidelity. That leads many to believe he wanted an open relationship. But hence is the reason why I am opposed to these relationships, because they fail over a set of 'rules' which were created after the initial set of rules were abandoned in the first place. Yes you can eat cupcakes but how dare you eat the ones with chocolate sprinkles as opposed to multi-colored ones

3) Toddbas is self destructive. He first gives his wife a 'hall pass', then he wants her to quit a job that pays very well because of his 'hall pass'. He then ignores her 'wanting to work on it' and rather than revoking the 'hall pass' he wants her to help him destroy their financial well being

4) He then comes on this board, asks for advice on a topic that seems 'off' to most of the people here and then trashes them when he gets some opinions, goes on to another thread in the same website and gets the same comments and doesn't respond. Yet, we are immature.

5) It is very telling that she chose this guy after an EA. What doesn't he understand about this ??

My advice for Toddbas.


1) Stop the 'hall pass' BS. He has the ability to stop it. Enough is enough.

2) Decide if you want to reconcile or divorce

3) Don't do it again

4) Get some help because " who gives hall passes ?" Maybe some IC action

5) Take what you read and self reflect and move on. Stop being an egotistical cuckold because it is an oxymoron

I don't get people like this but to each their own but really ....... WTF


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## helolover (Aug 24, 2012)

OP, you have a major relationship power imbalance going on here:
-Your wife has no respect for you. 
-She has cuckold'd you (with your permission). 
-She makes more than you. 
-She sleeps with who she wants. 
-She's in charge. 

What's the benefit of this relationship for you?
Why are you okay with her hall pass BS? Says a lot about both of you. 
If you're into a sex 3.0 relationship (each openly has sexual relationships with others) you cannot ruin it with jealousy of her lover(s). Seems like you are. 

Just because you started out being "okay" with this, you don't have to be. Your truth changed. If you're not okay with this, set a boundary and defend it. I think you need some individual counseling. You have some boundary setting issues - maybe some co-dependency. I don't know you and don't pretend that I do. Your story is the same as many, though and these are the usual outcomes of such things. 

Best, 

HL


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

tacoma said:


> I may have your history wrong Matt but I don't think her hall pass "worked for you".
> 
> You'r revenge EA nearly going PA and the recovery time y'all had invested in repairing the relationship doesn't sound like a benefit to your marriage.
> 
> ...


You could be right.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Decorum (Sep 7, 2012)

Since this is the silly and immature thread (I can be silly and immature), I am going to throw this out there.

The Op is not telling us the whole story I think, he might have less leverage then we could suppose because she may have cheated with him and is now cheating on him. (Or he "owes" her one)

IDK but there is more here then meets the eye, in fact its leaves you feeling like you got a welding flash.


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## GROUNDPOUNDER (Mar 8, 2013)

Well, if this guy is for real(and I have my doubts), who exactly did he think his wife was going to scew?

Is he disapointed because she didn't lay down with a Doctor, or an Olympic gold medalist?...

Regardless, this is ONLY THE BEGINNING. Dr. Frankenstien had good intensions also, then his creation started tarea$$in' through the local villages.

There's no putting this gene back in it's bottle now. You'll reap what you've sowed.


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## Dyokemm (Apr 24, 2013)

Wow....there really is just nothing that can be said here when the OP absolutely refuses to accept any advice or suggestions that imply that he:

1) screwed up his M royally by giving her a license to have an A

2) is still screwing up his chances for R by not killing the A totally by giving out real consequences to his ridiculously selfish WW (who would take a 'hall pass' from a spouse they loved and respected?) or the POSOM who not only f*cked up OP's M but ruthlessly betrayed his own family as well.

In fact, by endorsing his WW's behavior, OP played a role himself in f*cking up her M.

This guy has got himself into such a M state that agreeing to an open M would actually be a major step up in dignity....at least there he would be afforded the same opportunities.

I can't even begin to understand what complaints his WW had that he finds acceptable to justify what she did....unless he is just not coming clean about an A on his part previously.

Total humiliation here.


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## malagacoast (Feb 2, 2015)

Well, the OP dissipated .... he did not tell us very much about him , his wife age, but for some reason, it feels really freaky close to the situation I am dealing with now.
Who knows, maybe she is the Manager of my spouse ... and the One having her free pass with ....


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## malagacoast (Feb 2, 2015)

So, OP, if you are reading this, please feel free to inbox me and let's compare notes.


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## wmn1 (Aug 27, 2014)

tacoma said:


> I may have your history wrong Matt but I don't think her hall pass "worked for you".
> 
> You'r revenge EA nearly going PA and the recovery time y'all had invested in repairing the relationship doesn't sound like a benefit to your marriage.
> 
> ...


:iagree:

sorry Matt. My thoughts exactly


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

malagacoast said:


> So, OP, if you are reading this, please feel free to inbox me and let's compare notes.


Hit and run.


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## Suspecting2014 (Jun 11, 2014)

In one hand, if you tell her that she needs to quit her job, or at least get transferred, the hall pass seems to have consequences, so it would not seem like a hall pass at all.

In other hand, I believe you didn't set ground rules about it (non related person, one time thing, brutal truth), you can tell her that this is affecting you more than you though and you needs thuis changes in other to heal.

Explain to her that every time she lies, like not telling who was the AP, you get hurt more and more.

Notice that NC is a must to heal from an affair, this is not exactly your case but NOT between them will give you some peace.

IMO the most destructive part about Affairs are the lies told, be careful.

Conclusion, let her know how your feel and that you trust her but you need this changes, explain that you are not concerned about the hall pass but the effects you are experiencing.

One question: If she refuses to chenge the job or get tranfered, it is a deal breaker?

If yes let her know about it.

Good luck


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## ThePheonix (Jan 3, 2013)

Suspecting2014 said:


> Conclusion, let her know how your feel and that you trust her but you need this changes, explain that you are not concerned about the hall pass but the effects you are experiencing.


When men start handing out "hall passes" to their wives, it means they know she's wanting something on the side and they don't have what it takes to stop it, so they pretend to sanction it. In respect to the wife, it all goes back to what I've said all along; if she is wild about you, she doesn't want another man. His chances of getting her to give up her upscale job for the likes of him is nil. Why should she? She can always keep him around for shids and giggles while sampling the buffet. My guess however is our man Todd is soon her ex anyway whether he likes it or not. He may need to start planning on lower standard of living rather than a way of keeping her from the dessert table.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

Decorum said:


> Since this is the silly and immature thread (I can be silly and immature), I am going to throw this out there.
> 
> The Op is not telling us the whole story I think, he might have less leverage then we could suppose because she may have cheated with him and is now cheating on him. (Or he "owes" her one)
> 
> IDK but there is more here then meets the eye, in fact its leaves you feeling like you got a welding flash.


In part that is my story. Though it's much more complex than that as it involves a solomn vow that there is no way I could ever break.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Kallan Pavithran (Jan 17, 2012)

You gave her permission to **** around, she foked someone she knows. May be it felt safe for her.

But if my assumption is correct, you expected her to stop the sex in the middle and run through the balcony screaming my husband is the best ***er all other ****ers are just ****ers.

You opened a flood gate, now you have to accommodate/deal what ever ugliness the flood water brought to your marriage.


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## wmn1 (Aug 27, 2014)

I love Phoenix's donkey post of the week. Great post too


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## Kallan Pavithran (Jan 17, 2012)

GROUNDPOUNDER said:


> Well, if this guy is for real(and I have my doubts),* who exactly did he think his wife was going to scew?*
> 
> Is he disapointed because she didn't lay down *with a Doctor, or an Olympic gold medalist?...*
> 
> ...


May be one with 2inch dik with an ED, who came before entering. just my guss.......


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## thummper (Dec 19, 2013)

I think Todd has been scared off by all the criticism he's been given.


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## Q tip (Apr 15, 2014)

He came for affirmation but got advice instead.


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## xakulax (Feb 9, 2014)

toddbas said:


> *In regards to the hall pass. "I'm not a stupid person." There are reasons for it that I have not mentioned and quite frankly, they are irrelevant to the discussion at hand. *



That's all I need to know Ill just move along


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

I have done some stupid shyt in my marriage, but if my old lady banged a coworker there is no way in hell I would keep her around if she continued to work with the POS.

In my case, my old lady had to get rid of her cell number and her phuck mobile if she wanted to stick around.

Most of you guys know I'm wired different then most...but if my old lady phucked around in my house and in my bed that would have been a dealbreaker.

For whats it's worth ..I kind of relate to OP...if his old lady would have stuck to picking up strange like mine did it would have been better...but his old lady made the choice to shyt were she eats and now things *more* screwed up.with her, her work, and her marriage.


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## PhillyGuy13 (Nov 29, 2013)

She made the choice-- after he gave his blessing. I assume you didn't give her your blessing to go screw another dude.

In any event Elvis has left the building.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## xakulax (Feb 9, 2014)

PhillyGuy13 said:


> She made the choice-- after he gave his blessing. I assume you didn't give her your blessing to go screw another dude.
> 
> In any event Elvis has left the building.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_




I think he left upon the realization that we can quickly solve the problem to which he created himself......... Or he's off to another ****old fantasy website before school who knows


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## jim123 (Sep 29, 2012)

Originally Posted by toddbas View Post 
In regards to the hall pass. "I'm not a stupid person." There are reasons for it that I have not mentioned and quite frankly, they are irrelevant to the discussion at hand. 

I wonder how valid these reasons are now? I also wonder why these reasons are not as valid on the next trip?

Maybe you are not a stupid person but if you are concerned about your wife cheating and do not want to have her cheat in the future, it is not a smart thing.

The hardest time to cheat is the first time and you told her to do it. Why stop?


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## Sports Fan (Aug 21, 2014)

The topic of her leaving the company and ceasing all contact with the other man should not be up for discussion. It should be a given.

Unfortunately you have probably been way to soft on her and the lack of consequences you have given her.

It sounds like you are a bit in awe of her cause she has a succesful career and out earns you.

Well guess what? It doesn't mean she gets to treat you like garbage becuase of it.

Quitting her job and ceasing contact with the other man should be the very least of consequences she has to face regarding her foul behavour.


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## Q tip (Apr 15, 2014)

"In regards to the hall pass. "I'm not a stupid person." There are reasons for it that I have not mentioned and quite frankly, they are irrelevant to the discussion at hand. "


*OP, no one is saying you're stupid, Im just saying you've got bad luck when it comes to thinking...*


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## just got it 55 (Mar 2, 2013)

toddbas said:


> In regards to the "hall pass". I'm not a stupid person. There are reasons for it that I have not mentioned and quite frankly, they are irrelevant to the discussion at hand. I know why my wife did it (and it has nothing to do with infidelity on my part) and what those reasons are and that's going to have to suffice. We are not in an open marriage, someone mentioned not liking the guy...*I don't even know him, and telling his wife, who I also don't know is not an option, and I am not interested in fleecing her in a divorce*.
> 
> I'm not looking for thoughts or opinions on all of that. My question was about what you would do or not do in regards to her job.


toddbas from 2 or3 posts IMO your marriage is over.

If you are not going to see the mistakes that are going to be pointed out to you one after the other then just pull the plug now.

First of did you actually give your wife permission to fvck another man?? In those words ??

That would tell your wife how little you care for your marriage.

The fact that she took you up on that pure horse sh!t is on her.

You say things have not been great in your M for some time ?

Why do you suppose that is ?

Very very likely the OM has been in the picture far a while

Think hard on that Bud

Start listening to the posters here You are going to get all you need.

Get ready for it.

55


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## bfree (Sep 30, 2012)

Q tip said:


> "In regards to the hall pass. "I'm not a stupid person." There are reasons for it that I have not mentioned and quite frankly, they are irrelevant to the discussion at hand. "
> 
> 
> *OP, no one is saying you're stupid, Im just saying you've got bad luck when it comes to thinking...*


:rofl:


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## wmn1 (Aug 27, 2014)

strange dudes or people you know, cheating is cheating and it's devastating. Hall pass or no hall pass. If Todd, who has checked out of this thread after catching a case of attitude, really wanted to make things better, revoke the hall pass and do a NC.

But what do I know ? or anyone else here... I am sure he has it under control. yeah whatever


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## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

xakulax said:


> I think he left upon the realization that we can quickly solve the problem to which he created himself......... Or he's off to another ****old fantasy website before school who knows


I never understood that particular fetish. There's actually some guys who get turned on by their wife banging another man. It's incomprehensible to me.


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## Dyokemm (Apr 24, 2013)

"I never understood that particular fetish. There's actually some guys who get turned on by their wife banging another man. It's incomprehensible to me."

When it comes to personal lifestyle choices, I am very much a libertarian...if you aren't inflicting injuries on others, then it's your life to live IMO.

But that has little to do with what OP described...this wasn't a mutually agreed upon lifestyle choice that he and his WW both were into.

His WW is nothing but a self-centered cheat and he made about the stupidest choice a man who wants a monogamous relationship can make when he gave her a 'hall pass'....and I don't care what her justifications were for being unhappy....the only situation where I can see there being ANY point to her desire for a hall pass was if he had cheated and was threatening an RA, and he desperately told her to do what she needed to do but he wanted to fix the M.

At that point, one could argue the pros and cons of RA's, but at least it would make sense. 

But as he described the situation (if he was honest), that's not what was going on here...in which case he totally f*cked up not only his own M but also essentially greenlighted destroying the OMW's life and M.

This is either a massive case of being a doormat or the most illogical approach to dealing with M problems that I have heard of.


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

Dyokemm said:


> "I never understood that particular fetish. There's actually some guys who get turned on by their wife banging another man. It's incomprehensible to me."
> 
> When it comes to personal lifestyle choices, I am very much a libertarian...if you aren't inflicting injuries on others, then it's your life to live IMO.
> 
> ...


I know:iagree::iagree:
American men are so emasculated through the public fool (school) system and tv it doesn't surprise me.


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## Dyokemm (Apr 24, 2013)

tom67,

I've been a teacher for over 20 years, and I can honestly say I don't believe its the education system.

Nor do I necessarily place the blame on media.

I think the emasculation of males is a case of over compensation to news reports, egged on by politicians and public personalities that like to jump on bandwagons to score 'points'.

What I mean is this.

Lets face the truth, there ARE indeed some guys who are just narcissistic pr*cks and fit all the stereotypical a**hat behaviors that women have vocally complained about since Second Wave feminism hit in the late 60s/early 70s.....and it was much more prevalent before this time.

But in the years since, these behaviors have been publicly and vociferously vilified (and rightfully so, they are despicable) on an increasing basis.

This has created a situation of OVERCOMPENSATION amongst many males , however.

In an attempt to distance themselves from the actions of these jerks, many men have abandoned ANY action or personality trait that might be associated with it...as a result, large numbers of men have essentially fallen into a pattern of denying their own basic pride and dignity...ie being a doormat.

Unlike many men, I DO NOT believe the goal of women fighting for better treatment had the INTENTIONAL goal of emasculating large numbers of men.

But as any person who has studied any of the social sciences will tell you (personally, I was a political science major at the Naval Academy, and have taught Government, Economics, and U.S./World History during my career), there is a concept called the law of unintended consequences that any policy maker or activist seeking change must be aware of and take into consideration.

Often times, our desired goals, even if good in themselves, can result in outcomes we did not expect or want...and often they have their own negative aspects that cause other pressing problems.

Personally, I think the problem today is of this nature.

Men today are too often weak and afraid to stand up for their own dignity....and NOT just with the issue of infidelity or gender relations in general.

I think the massive passivity of the population to things like the revelation of the NSA spying apparatus or the massive banking fraud and bailout....something that would have enraged the populace even 60 years ago....is another aspect of this problem.

The men of this country are becoming sheep IMO, sad to say.


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## ricky15100 (Oct 23, 2013)

Dyokemm said:


> tom67,
> 
> I've been a teacher for over 20 years, and I can honestly say I don't believe its the education system.
> 
> ...


I agree with this mostly , however I don't agree with your point about it not being the medias fault, its crammed down our throats from birth via the media, and the message is a woman's happiness comes at all other costs. Don't forget the old saying a happy wife is a happy life!


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## wmn1 (Aug 27, 2014)

Dyokemm said:


> tom67,
> 
> I've been a teacher for over 20 years, and I can honestly say I don't believe its the education system.
> 
> ...



I agree. very well written !!! 

I will disagree about it not being the media's fault as they jump in and push this agenda as well.

Otherwise, well done


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## wmn1 (Aug 27, 2014)

lordmayhem said:


> I never understood that particular fetish. There's actually some guys who get turned on by their wife banging another man. It's incomprehensible to me.



:iagree:

The concept disgusts me. I can't stop them nor would I try. I want to watch them crash and burn.

The best I can do is make sure I leave the types out of my life completely and I do an effective job at that


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## wmn1 (Aug 27, 2014)

Dyokemm said:


> "I never understood that particular fetish. There's actually some guys who get turned on by their wife banging another man. It's incomprehensible to me."
> 
> When it comes to personal lifestyle choices, I am very much a libertarian...if you aren't inflicting injuries on others, then it's your life to live IMO.
> 
> ...


:iagree:

with both you and Mayhem. 

I also notice this thread has continued for over 90 posts since Todd has been back. It's still interesting though


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## jim123 (Sep 29, 2012)

wmn1 said:


> :iagree:
> 
> with both you and Mayhem.
> 
> I also notice this thread has continued for over 90 posts since Todd has been back. It's still interesting though


He did log in three days ago. His wife should be going back to see OM this week or next. He just let his marriage get away and does not yet realize it.

The problems they had just got bigger and now he added a much larger one.

I am sure it is hard for him because he did it to himself.


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

I just don't understand how a man could stand aside and allow his wife to do that. I just don't get what she was holding over his head that would coerce him into allowing this. 

I just don't get it folks.


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## jim123 (Sep 29, 2012)

bandit.45 said:


> I just don't understand how a man could stand aside and allow his wife to do that. I just don't get what she was holding over his head that would coerce him into allowing this.
> 
> I just don't get it folks.


The fact he is here says he does realize it was (is) a mistake. He thinks that he can put everything back, he will see the power of the affair. He told her she can cheat on him, wait until he see's how hard it will be for her to stop. Wait until he sees how easy it will be for her to do it again.

She cheated with his approval, what is another time? What is another man?


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## Q tip (Apr 15, 2014)

as stated many times before

"The beta is stong in this one..."

He's merely following the beta script in managing his marriage. it is a false narrative. thats why he feels powerless to do anything. nothing in his upbringing has instructed him how to be a man.

his chumpness is his comfort. he needs to realize it is his discomfort he's fighting - should be the other way around.

...never mind


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## PhillyGuy13 (Nov 29, 2013)

bandit.45 said:


> I just don't understand how a man could stand aside and allow his wife to do that. I just don't get what she was holding over his head that would coerce him into allowing this.
> 
> I just don't get it folks.


Well, whatever it was it wasn't pertinent to his current situation.

<eyreroll>
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Dyokemm (Apr 24, 2013)

What I meant with the media was this:

This wasn't some media conspiracy per se...but rather the media, following its usual practice of hyping a scandal or turning molehills into mountains.

All it takes is some celebrity, activist, or politician to publicly jump into a story, usually for their own agenda to score political points or garner public attention, and the media will be off and running.

These public figures already engage in hyperbole in their grandstanding, and then the media gets involved and REALLY makes the issue seem like a pandemic.

Remember the giant panics in the 80s about Satanic lyrics on records played backwards?....or the nationwide panic and witch hunt that would have had us believe that child molestation and pornography at daycare centers was a national epidemic?

H*ll, the media would have us believe that nearly 70 percent of women are victims of rape at some point in their lives.

Now rape and child molestation ARE serious issues and crimes that need to be addressed by government and society (the Satanic lyrics is, and always was a stupid media bogeyman)....however, they were never on the frightening scale the media was blathering about.

I think something similar happened with male behavior towards women....yes there was a problem with narcissistic jacka**es, and women had a justified cause to complain about these behaviors.

But I don't think the problems were ever on the scale the media portrayed....but the constant hyping in search of ratings and publication volume has led to a correspondingly over sized overreaction on the part of American society in general, and men in particular.


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## xakulax (Feb 9, 2014)

bandit.45 said:


> I just don't understand how a man could stand aside and allow his wife to do that. *I just don't get what she was holding over his head* that would coerce him into allowing this.
> 
> I just don't get it folks.




ah his balls ?????


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

So you let your wife f another man and now you have problems with it? Open marriage dude. Have fun cleaning up.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Q tip (Apr 15, 2014)

ConanHub said:


> So you let your wife f another man and now you have problems with it? Open marriage dude. Have fun cleaning up.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Yah. Its what happens to a guy after he has no one to raise him from boyhood to be a man.


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