# Am I uptight?is it normal?



## Honey21 (Jun 8, 2013)

Ok, I have been reading different posts on this forum and I think compare to most people here, I am more conservative and now I am concerned if it causes a problem n my marriage later.

I have been with my husband for 6 years, married for 5, we have a 2 year old. I have never experienced oral sex, my husband has insisted on giving it to me but I never let him because I believe its dirty and I have never done it to him except for two occasions when he begged me for hours and I just wanted to shut him up and did it for two minutes and then got tired. We have never done anything other than simple missionary and I do not feel comfortable trying other positions. Lately our sex life has been reduced to once a week if he is lucky even though I am 30 years old and he is 32. I prefer to spend my time reading and watching movies before sleeping and sex just seems like too much work. Mostly I do it so he would leave me alone and I can go back to my book. I realise it is not normal and thought something must be wrong with my hormones but my doctor just brushed it off as normal. 

Lately I have noticed that my husband does not even kiss me anymore and we have drifted apart. I want to fix the problem but I do not know how.


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## LdyVenus (Dec 1, 2012)

Have you ever had an orgasm?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## richie33 (Jul 20, 2012)

Normal for you. Your husband may have vastly different answer.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## FemBot (May 1, 2013)

If you've never experienced an orgasm then your view seems normal but if you have then, no, I don't feel it's normal.

Your husband needs sex to feel close to you emotionally. Shutting him off is the same as if he took all your books away and you were no longer allowed to read. Make an effort here to find out why you don't like sex with your husband and really work on it.


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## Honey21 (Jun 8, 2013)

LdyVenus said:


> Have you ever had an orgasm?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I have orgasm if I want to, but it is too much work as I said, I need to concentrate and I only get it if my husband spends enough time on foreplay which he usually does, but I prefer to finish it quickly so I fake it so we can get it over with


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

You should bookmark this site so you can find it sometime over the next 5 years. If you're lucky, it will be the "Going through a separation or divorce" forum. If you're unlucky, it will be the "Coping With Infidelity" forum.

An unsatisfactory sex life is no excuse for an affair, but it sure sets up a marriage ripe for a breakdown. Your husband is drifting away from you, and the lack of intimacy (not just sex) is likely a heavy contributor to the issue. 

The problem isn't just on you, but the two of you need to open communication on your issues. It may involve counselling if the two of you are open to it.but sooner rather than later. The resentments that build make it much harder to fix as time goes on.

C


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## Red2 (Apr 28, 2013)

I would say not normal for your age. Please, explore sex a bit more before you give up on it. Let your husband perform oral on you, take a shower first so you don't feel embarrassed. Let him go until you get an orgasm. Try at least one new position, too, doggie style feels so amazing for women.


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## Red2 (Apr 28, 2013)

Honey21 said:


> I have orgasm if I want to, but it is too much work as I said, I need to concentrate and I only get it if my husband spends enough time on foreplay which he usually does, but I prefer to finish it quickly so I fake it so we can get it over with


WHY????????? Don't you like how sex makes you feel so much closer to him? You'd rather spend your time with a book instead of the man you married? :scratchhead:


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## Thound (Jan 20, 2013)

Man this thread really rankles me.


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## norajane (Feb 7, 2012)

I think you're missing out on a lot of really, really great sex with your husband by limiting it to missionary and by faking. 

I think you're missing out on the kind of sex that can make orgasms easier to achieve - oral sex. Many, many women can only have orgasms via clitoral stimulation and oral is a fantastic way to get that. 

You're also missing out on a deep and satisfying emotional intimacy with your husband. There is so much more to sex than just physical sensations and orgasm.

Wherever you got your beliefs about sex, it would be in your best interests to try exploring and challenging those beliefs, and in the best interests of your marriage and husband. 

You have many years of life ahead of you...refusing to be open to sex is going to create a lot of unhappiness for both of you. Opening up to sex can add a lot of fun and emotional intimacy to your life. I've found that the more I put into my sex life and sexual relationship, the more I get out of it.


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## Honey21 (Jun 8, 2013)

Red2 said:


> I would say not normal for your age. Please, explore sex a bit more before you give up on it. Let your husband perform oral on you, take a shower first so you don't feel embarrassed. Let him go until you get an orgasm. Try at least one new position, too, doggie style feels so amazing for women.


You see thats what I don get. People say you need to relax to enjoy sex but if I relax I don have an orgasm at all. I need to concentrate and fanasize ( not about other men but about a romance novel for example) to get off, and I don enjoy being touched down there at all, so I always assumed apart from hygiene issues I would not enjoy it. Every time my husband touches me down there its uncomfortable and painful and I cant get relaxed.


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## norajane (Feb 7, 2012)

Honey21 said:


> Every time my husband touches me down there its uncomfortable and painful and I cant get relaxed.


Do you mean when he touches you with his hand or penis it's painful? Painful in what way?


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

Yes, you are limiting yourself from fully enjoying a wonderful fabulous sex life! Is it a hang up, is it body image, is it lack of knowledge? Frankly, it doesn't matter. What does matter is that you make the decision to open yourself up to being the responsive sexually exciting woman that is hiding behind knee length skirts and baggy jeans!

have you made that choice yet? Bravo if the answer is yes!

Here are some great web sites for learning about your sexuality, your body, what's normal, and also learning about men's bodies. Read, study, learn. Take note of things that make you tingle, take note of things that don't, and take note of things that make you feel ill or grossed out. As you go through the learning stages, you'll find that you are slowly becoming more and more comfortable with what you are learning. Something that grossed you out before, may make you tingle after learning more. Dont shut the door on anything. Make up your mind to learn about everything.

Scarleteen | Sex Education For The Real World

Christian Nymphos | Married Sex: Spicy, the way God intended it to be!

I was going to include others but I really think these two sites are the very best for helping women open themselves to being sexually expressive and explorative. Get busy reading!

Tell your husband you WANT to learn to be more sexually open.Tell him you have difficulty orgasming and tell him you'd like to learn to orgasm easier. Share these web sites with him. As your sexual confidence grows, start sending him copy paste selections of thing you think he should know, things you'd like to discuss with him, or maybe just something to warn him to save some energy for you.

Go get em girl!


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## treyvion (Apr 29, 2013)

Red2 said:


> I would say not normal for your age. Please, explore sex a bit more before you give up on it. Let your husband perform oral on you, take a shower first so you don't feel embarrassed. Let him go until you get an orgasm. Try at least one new position, too, doggie style feels so amazing for women.


It doesn't have to be normal for any age.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Honey21 (Jun 8, 2013)

norajane said:


> Do you mean when he touches you with his hand or penis it's painful? Painful in what way?


Well its more uncomfortable. He tries to play with my clitoris to get me aroused with his hand but it is not enjoyable for me, when he does I just push him away or guide his hand up because I don like it. I don have a problem with intercourse thats not painful if I am ready but if I am not it can also become irritating.

I don think it is the way he touches me, I never masturbated when I was single and one time I tried, I found out that I don enjoy touches down there


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## Stonewall (Jul 5, 2011)

I wouldn't touch this one with a ten foot pole.........oh wait ....that didn't sound right!


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

Honey21 said:


> Well its more uncomfortable. He tries to play with my clitoris to get me aroused with his hand but it is not enjoyable for me, when he does I just push him away or guide his hand up because I don like it. I don have a problem with intercourse thats not painful if I am ready but if I am not it can also become irritating.
> 
> I don think it is the way he touches me, I never masturbated when I was single and one time I tried, I found out that I don enjoy touches down there


Everyone is different. Some women have an extremely sensitive clitoris and they must be super charged aroused before it feels good having their clitoris touched. Perhaps you husband should spend more time on your breasts before he moves down to your clitoris?

Another potential issue is anxiety, body image type anxiety. If your mind is telling you that your vulva is a dirty place, your not going to be able to relax and enjoy being touched.

Which do you think it is?


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

Your post reads like it was written from the sexless handbook. Like you're trying to come off as naive but somehow hitting all the hot button issues.


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## Honey21 (Jun 8, 2013)

WorkingOnMe said:


> Your post reads like it was written from the sexless handbook. Like you're trying to come off as naive but somehow hitting all the hot button issues.


Perhaps this is how it sounds but the reality is we have sex, its just not as it is in movies and books, but this website is full of real people, and normally I do not talk about my sex life to anyone, so this is the first time I am actually talking about it. At the moment sex seems like a chore I do not like much ( when I am half way into it, I kind of enjoy it) but its not something I choose to do because there are other things I prefer to do instead like reading. I assumed it was kind of normal considering every one is different and we have a 2 year old and at night I am tired and prefer to relax,but I see people on this forum who believe otherwise. I want to know what I can do to change this


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## RFguy (Feb 17, 2013)

WHy did you take the effort and time to make an account here and post? Do you think your behavior is detrimental to your marriage?


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

Cut her some slack guys, please. Dont take your anger out on her. This is a chance for a woman to come into her sexuality and find a thrilling sex life. Do you really think it's best to put her on the defensive and chas her away?


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## somethingelse (Jun 20, 2012)

Are you a lazy type of person? Un-imaginiative? 

Achieving great intimacy requires an open mentality and sometimes a creative one. And..are you physically in shape?


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## Red2 (Apr 28, 2013)

Anon Pink said:


> Cut her some slack guys, please. Dont take your anger out on her. This is a chance for a woman to come into her sexuality and find a thrilling sex life. Do you really think it's best to put her on the defensive and chas her away?


You are right. I apologize. I am just dumbfounded by OP's frank admission of her view of sex, that it is a chore for her. I wonder how many more women feel the same way about sex?


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## RFguy (Feb 17, 2013)

Red2 said:


> I wonder how many more women feel the same way about sex?


My ex, for one :rofl:


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## Honey21 (Jun 8, 2013)

Anon Pink said:


> Everyone is different. Some women have an extremely sensitive clitoris and they must be super charged aroused before it feels good having their clitoris touched. Perhaps you husband should spend more time on your breasts before he moves down to your clitoris?
> 
> Another potential issue is anxiety, body image type anxiety. If your mind is telling you that your vulva is a dirty place, your not going to be able to relax and enjoy being touched.
> 
> Which do you think it is?


I think after 6 years he knows what he should do and I do not have a problem telling him that I don want him to touch me there and where he should touch instead, but he still thinks because most women enjoy a touch and play with their clitoris he needs to do it for me. As your question, I do not know. I have always been over weight and I don like it but my weight was not a problem when we first started our relationship, at least he said he was ok and even though I did not really believe him, I think now after 6 years it should be ok.


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

You're right. Prudishness is a much bigger problem than weight.


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

It sounds like you need to get into therapy to get to the bottom of why you view sex in such a terrible light. His touch is uncomfortable to you because you flat out dont want to do it. Why did you get married if you were so offended by sex? Sex is part of marriage, plain and simple. You have robbed your husband of years where he could have been with someone who would actually be willing to show him affection. 

You want to know how to fix it...get into therapy, that is your first necessary step.


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## norajane (Feb 7, 2012)

Honey21 said:


> I don think it is the way he touches me, I never masturbated when I was single and one time I tried, I found out that I don enjoy touches down there


If you are uncomfortable even touching your own body, then that's what is at the root of your issues with sex. You aren't going to be comfortable with someone else touching you if you can't even do it yourself without feeling uncomfortable.

This is probably something to explore in therapy. It would be worthwhile to figure out what is making you so uncomfortable with touch.


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

Red2 said:


> You are right. I apologize. I am just dumbfounded by OP's frank admission of her view of sex, that it is a chore for her. I wonder how many more women feel the same way about sex?


Count me in on that! I used to view sex as a chore! I didn't orgasm so I didn't enjoy it. It was something I did for him, not for us or for me. Then after other things began to happen to drive a wedge between us I HATED sex. I took care of the house and the kids and him but who took care of me? At the time I felt like his mommy during the day time and the available orifice at night. If you don't orgasm and you can't find a way to open up about it, you begin to hate sex! Once you hate sex your husband pulls away because he's not getting HIS need met. Now NO ONE is getting their needs met and everyone is miserable and blaming the other. A nasty circle that only gets fixed once SHE learns to orgasm and HE learns to help her.

I honestly don't think there are nearly as many wives who are LD as wife who aren't enjoying sex and can't figure out how to fix it. Not that it is the husband's fault! I personally think more women hide their sexual hang ups than actually deal with them.

Thats why it is one of the first questions a I will ask another woman who admits she views sex as a chore is, DO YOU ORGASM REGULARLY DURING SEX!

A woman's weight has very little to do with body image. She can be a size 2 and not be comfortable with her body, she could be a size 32 and love her body. She could think she has a great figure but has developed a hang up about her neither regions and believe them to be dirty, yucky, not something delightful, wonderful and amazing!

rarely do men have a body image that has them thinking their penis is smelly, dirty and disgusting. But LOTS of women feel like that and until they learn otherwise, sex if not enjoyable.


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## MissScarlett (May 22, 2013)

I think its great that you are thinking about this issue and are curious about changing things.

When a persons sexual needs are met every area of their life improves. In truth, you are the only person that can do this for your husband. You have the opportunity to be his dream and his fantasy. 

Ive been married 18 years and, until a couple of weeks ago, my H had never touched me there or given me oral. Great husband and provider. We get along great. I cant tell you how much it has hurt to be rejected by him inthis way. I'm fine to do his laundry and care for him, but something must be inherintly repulsive about me - that this man who could hold my hand while I was giving birth couldn't bother to do something - anything - different in bed or so much as touch me there.

Its just - its sad. Do you care to be the woman who your H is staying with for your child? Do you care to be the woman he likely fantasizes about while you are reading your books? Thinking of you taking the lead for once, getting on top, going down on him? 

Its Fathers Day today - go down on the poor guy! Make his whole year.


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## MrsDraper (May 27, 2013)

WorkingOnMe said:


> Your post reads like it was written from the sexless handbook. Like you're trying to come off as naive but somehow hitting all the hot button issues.


Because it's a troll.


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## Red2 (Apr 28, 2013)

jeepgirl29 said:


> Because it's a troll.


 Are you sure?


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## Theseus (Feb 22, 2013)

jeepgirl29 said:


> Because it's a troll.


I see no evidence of that. And I don't think it's appropriate to make that accusation unless you can state some reasons why you think she is a troll.


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## Theseus (Feb 22, 2013)

Honey21 said:


> I realise it is not normal and thought something must be wrong with my hormones but my doctor just brushed it off as normal.


Actually, you are normal in the sense that there might not be anything wrong with you. There are different definitions of normal. You are certainly not statistically normal, since most women enjoy sex and don't see it as a "chore". 

But if you don't enjoy sex, you don't enjoy it, and that is perfectly fine. It doesn't mean you are ill, or crazy, or anything else. You have no obligation to the world to be a sexpot if you don't want to.

HOWEVER, I think what rankles people here is that they don't understand why you would marry a man who does enjoy sex. Didn't you know that would cause problems? If you don't want to change, you either shouldn't have married, or you should have married another asexual person.



> Lately I have noticed that my husband does not even kiss me anymore and we have drifted apart. I want to fix the problem but I do not know how.


Not a big surprise. Certainly he's tired of living with someone who sees sex as a "chore" and is thinking of finding someone he is more compatible with. I hate to sound so negative, but the only real way to fix the problem is either to become more sexually compatible with him, or let him go to find happiness with someone else. If you stay with the status quo, I don't see any future for you two as a married couple.


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## SunnyT (Jun 22, 2011)

Read "how-to" books about sex.


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

Red2 said:


> You are right. I apologize. I am just dumbfounded by OP's frank admission of her view of sex, that it is a chore for her. I wonder how many more women feel the same way about sex?


My wife?


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

Anon Pink said:


> I honestly don't think there are nearly as many wives who are LD as wife who aren't enjoying sex and can't figure out how to fix it. Not that it is the husband's fault! I personally think more women hide their sexual hang ups than actually deal with them.


Can't figure out how to fix it or won't bother to take the time to fix it? Big difference.

Right on the money about hang-ups...


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## Honey21 (Jun 8, 2013)

Theseus said:


> .
> 
> HOWEVER, I think what rankles people here is that they don't understand why you would marry a man who does enjoy sex. Didn't you know that would cause problems? If you don't want to change, you either shouldn't have married, or you should have married another asexual person.


Ok, maybe I should have cleared the fact that I was a virgin when I got into a relationship ( yes I was a virgin till I was 24) and after loosing my virginity, which was an uncomfortable experience, my doctor assured me that it was going to be better. I was not saving myself, but I just wanted to have the sexual experience when I was deeply in love and I could be sure about my partner. 

The reality was that my standard by then had become so high that it was a dissapointment. I got married because I did not see anything wrong then, we were having sex every other day, and it was ok for me, like having a meal that you enjoy. It was not mind blowing and frankly sex for both of us, was not the first element of choosing a spouse, he is caring, kind and honest and loved me passionately and I loved him.

No one can deny that passion wears off by time and I had my daughter two years ago, so between work, household chores and taking care of my daughter, I assumed it was normal not to be willing to have sex all the time. We tried to experiment a little with positions and sex t oys when we first started going out, but I did not enjoy them so we stopped.


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## Honey21 (Jun 8, 2013)

jeepgirl29 said:


> Because it's a troll.


It is hard enough for people like me to talk about their problem without judgement and silly accusations of people like you. I don have time for trolling on the internet, I am an educated person and I actually joined this forum because I thought it could help me.


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

And it can.

What did you think of the web sites?


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## Rags (Aug 2, 2010)

Like most things, it gets better with practice. My wife a virgin on our wedding night, but despite that was greatly looking forward to sex. No, we weren't great at it the first (or second) time - not to say we didn't greatly enjoy it, but we weren't very good at it.

However we did it a lot, and it got better - and we keep doing it and it keeps getting better. But, even when we weren't that good at it, we still did it, because we love each other and this is one of the expressions of that love.

Most men need sex in a romantic relationship to feel connected and loved - and will become unhappy without it. Faking orgasm will not make him happy, if he finds out (and he probably will at some point - after which he'll wonder about every previous and subsequent time.) And it doesn't help you to enjoy it either. So, really, in the long term, it's a lose/lose situation. I advise you to stop doing it.

What I believe you should do is talk to him about what you do want - men aren't nearly a psychic as women seem to think. He may keep trying things because they seem to get somewhere - talk to him. show him, and while you're showing him, tell him what you're doing. Tell him what you like.

If, on the other hand, you really don't like sex ... well, that is a real problem (for your relationship.) There might be physical factors involved, in which a visit to the doctors might help.
However, it's more likely to be psychological. Have you thought about any underlying reasons why you don't like sex? Any incidents, or things you were told during your upbringing that might have lead you to wall off this normal, enjoyable part of being human?

btw, you don't have to orgasm every time, or even fake it - sometimes it's ok to enjoy the closeness and intimacy, and just enjoy the pleasant aspects with climaxing. Take the pressure of yourself, and just learn to enjoy the special bond that comes from being with him that way.

Women can enjoy sex at least as much as men (some would argue more - greater number of nerves, ability to stay aroused after orgasm to become multi-orgasmic, etc) - so it would seem that you're missing out on a lot of positive things for you and your husband, if you don't change the situation.

Good luck


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

john117 said:


> Can't figure out how to fix it or won't bother to take the time to fix it? Big difference.
> 
> Right on the money about hang-ups...


A HUGE difference!

just like men try to avoid dealing with ED issues, pretending it is something else or avoiding sex altogether, women pretend their "lack of desire" is purely hormonal, or purely a result of his boorish behavior.

Men can't hide their sexual dysfunction as easily as a woman can. Sooner, they end up dealing with it in some form. Women can hide behind all sort of reasons and excuses, so it can go on for years and years and years....

If your sex life sucks, DEAL WITH IT! Don't excuse it, don't minimize it, don't rationalize it, don't hide it, don't blame it away... Deal With IT!!!


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## johnnycomelately (Oct 30, 2010)

You are sexually dysfunctional and therefore you are not fulfilling your marital obligations. 

You need to get proper professional help. Forget the doctor who brushed you off and find someone who will take this seriously. Don't stop until you do because this is going to destroy your marriage.


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## FemBot (May 1, 2013)

I agree with Anon Pink! I would also add that female sexuality is not like male sexuality. Boys are taught that sex is your birthright, women are taught that it's wrong and dirty. It's definitely changing thankfully but some women have a long way to go.

Touching a clitoris when you are not in the mood and not aroused is not fun. The brain is the biggest sex organ. You need to be turned on to touch before touch can happen. I won't ask you about past sexual trauma or shame but it's something you should look into. At the very least you should crave touch from your husband over reading a book.

When I was in a sexless marriage (my H's choice not mine BTW) I craved intimate touch even more than orgasms.


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

Anon Pink said:


> If your sex life sucks, DEAL WITH IT! Don't excuse it, don't minimize it, don't rationalize it, don't hide it, don't blame it away... Deal With IT!!!


Deal with it by changing the channel on DirecTV in case provocative material shows up on the tube... I was doing something in my office and all of a sudden hear some well timed moans and 70's "patent soft core pourn music" from the family room TV. Casually strolled by to catch some HBO skin-feat before Mrs. LD changed it. Sat down to channel surf to "Showgirls" at the topless dance audition scene. She Hurriedly changed the channel to "Madagascar 3". 

Beyond funny


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

Unfortunately also pretty indicative of serious sexual dysfunction... Not talking hardcore or even soft core stuff here, just HBO for crying out loud...


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## nogutsnoglory (Jan 17, 2013)

Men gain validation in their marriage through contact with their spouse. Your inability to find what is "good for you" sexually means you have not communicated anything to your husband. If we spend all of our time talking about what we do not like but not what we do like then others will not know how to please us. 
Your husband needs sex to be fulfilled. He will not be happy in your marriage with out it. You need to get some therapy immediately to help you find out what is holding you back. Something clearly is. 
You should be experimenting with him, enjoying the pleasure you and only you can give him, and you are not doing any of that. It makes him feel unwanted and unloved. He will eventually stop trying and either leave you or cheat on you. 
I am sorry but get help and make him aware you see it as a big issue and you want to be better for him and I am sure he will be so happy to hear there is a chance for him to be happy in the future that he will support anything you need to do.


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## Hicks (Jan 14, 2011)

The first thing you have to realize is that lack of sexual interest is incredibly damaging to your husband. It harms him in his very soul. His feeling of lonliness and desperation over being sexually unfulfilled is hard to put into words.

So the first thing you should think about is does your husband deserve to hurt by you his wife? This is a serious question in that many wives hate their husbands and want to hurt them.

The question really is ?

Are you aware of what sexual fulfllment means to your man, but just don't feel like you should meet his needs?

Or are you unaware of what this means to him?

Do you beleve that the child you are putting all your energy into's main need in life is to be raised in a happy, thriving, fulfilling, functioning and intact marriage?


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## MissScarlett (May 22, 2013)

Its possible your desire may return when your child gets a bit older. When my kids were vey young like that I was not feeling sexual at all. 

Any chance of you going away with H for a weekend? You might remember how much you like him.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

Why do you read romance novels?

Do you masturbate after reading them?

Does your husband watch porn and masturbate? (And if you think he doesn't, you might want to double check that by asking him directly).

Here is the reality: you will end up divorced if you remain sexless.

How do you change this?

You have made a good start by asking for help here.


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## CuddleBug (Nov 26, 2012)

Honey21 said:


> Ok, I have been reading different posts on this forum and I think compare to most people here, I am more conservative and now I am concerned if it causes a problem n my marriage later.
> 
> I have been with my husband for 6 years, married for 5, we have a 2 year old. I have never experienced oral sex, my husband has insisted on giving it to me but I never let him because I believe its dirty and I have never done it to him except for two occasions when he begged me for hours and I just wanted to shut him up and did it for two minutes and then got tired. We have never done anything other than simple missionary and I do not feel comfortable trying other positions. Lately our sex life has been reduced to once a week if he is lucky even though I am 30 years old and he is 32. I prefer to spend my time reading and watching movies before sleeping and sex just seems like too much work. Mostly I do it so he would leave me alone and I can go back to my book. I realise it is not normal and thought something must be wrong with my hormones but my doctor just brushed it off as normal.
> 
> Lately I have noticed that my husband does not even kiss me anymore and we have drifted apart. I want to fix the problem but I do not know how.



Your hubby has a normal sex drive and you are LD (low drive).

Yes, having the child could alter your hormones, and kill your sex drive and meds might be required.

When you get married, you are not your own anymore. The needs of your hubby are now just as important as your own. and you are to take care of his needs, like he is not his own anymore and he takes care of your needs.

You need to spice it up in the bedroom big time. Sex isn't dirty, its a beautiful way hubby and wifee connect physically and emotionally. 

No sex, no closeness, no intimacy and why did you get married in the first place?

Get outside your comfort zone and buy yourself a small vibrator. and learn to give yourself orgasms.

Try doggie style. 69, cow girl, reverse cow girl, foot jobs, breasts, anal, blow jobs, talk dirty and dress up for him. These are the things men would love from their wives. When that need is met, everything else just flows, like the cuddling, talking, romance, listening, you name it. But little to no sex will kill any marriage and you will be friends and room mates.

Would you marry a friend or room mate with little to no sex? No.

Men are visual and physical. What we see turns us on and what we physically experience is divine.

He only wants to be with you , so be with him.


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## badmemory (Jul 31, 2012)

Honey21,

Spouses must meet each others needs to have a fulfilling marriage. If one partner's need is not being met, a downward spiral of resentment starts and the offended spouse often looses motivation to do the same for their partner. Thus the spiral continues until one spouse shuts down completely. Then infidelity or divorce becomes a real possibility.

What is your most important need from your husband? Affection, communication, being a family man? If he is still meeting that need, consider yourself lucky for the moment. 

Because for the overwhelming majority of men, sex is the number one need from their spouse. Not 100 percent, but close.

My advice would to be take action before it's too late. Whether it's "fake it till you make it", combined sexual counseling, individual counseling, marital counseling - do something, so that your husband knows you care enough about his needs to try.


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## Honey21 (Jun 8, 2013)

Faithful Wife said:


> Why do you read romance novels?
> 
> Do you masturbate after reading them?
> 
> ...


I mostly read them to keep me entertain but no, I do not masturbate with them although sometimes, if I dream about them, I get off in my sleep. My husband does not watch porn, I have asked him before and he just does not enjoy it although I don have a problem if he does, as long as he does not expect me to do what he sees on those films. 

As some people recommended, I asked him today if he thinks we should se therapy but he flipped out and told me he is fine and I am the one who should go to a therapist, because he is normal


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## Honey21 (Jun 8, 2013)

Anon Pink said:


> And it can.
> 
> What did you think of the web sites?


Thanks so much for the websites, the first one is actually really helpful. I am reading articles that I think can solve the problem


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## *LittleDeer* (Apr 19, 2012)

john117 said:


> Unfortunately also pretty indicative of serious sexual dysfunction... Not talking hardcore or even soft core stuff here, just HBO for crying out loud...


I disagree, I love sex, but I don't watch porn.


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

Honey21 said:


> As some people recommended, I asked him today if he thinks we should se therapy but he flipped out and told me he is fine and I am the one who should go to a therapist, because he is normal


I'm really glad you are finding some helpful info reading some of the articles and Q&As. 

Please take my miserable experience to heart...let your husband know you are doing some work to learn to open up sexually with him. Ask him for his support as you go through this learning process by returning to the affectionate guy he used to be ...the guy who felt secure in his manhood and secure that he could please his wife. let him know you are trying and his help would make things so much better for both of you. 

But even if he withholds, continue your journey, because this is FOR YOU. It will also benefit him, but it is for you and your happiness that you undertake this transformation from inhibited and repressed to explorative and passionate!


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

*LittleDeer* said:


> I disagree, I love sex, but I don't watch porn.


A movie on HBO is not even worthy of the classification. But my amusement was not that she did not watch it (lifetime movie network has a loooot of steam and she watches it all the time) but hat she was instantly on guard to make sure we don't watch it together or me on my own.


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## MissScarlett (May 22, 2013)

I hope your H will come around in considering therapy. I have been seeing a therapist on my own and it has been helpful. Ive been on a 3 month (so far) transition with my H where sex is concerned. What Ive learned is that I started out thinking this was 100% his problem that he could easily fix. Ive realized its a problem we shared /share. Now that he is acting more like I always hoped he would sexually I am having my own issues adjusting to it. 

I think it is great you want things to be better.


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

Honey21 said:


> I mostly read them to keep me entertain but no, I do not masturbate with them although sometimes, if I dream about them, I get off in my sleep. My husband does not watch porn, I have asked him before and he just does not enjoy it although I don have a problem if he does, as long as he does not expect me to do what he sees on those films.
> 
> As some people recommended, I asked him today if he thinks we should se therapy but he flipped out and told me he is fine and I am the one who should go to a therapist, because he is normal


No offense intended, and I think it's great that you seem to be actively looking to change the situation. But given what you've said of the situation (and speaking as a guy who came from an "intimacy challenged marriage"), I can't say that I think his response is incorrect. And after years of him making an effort to improve things, you might have to slug things out on your own to show him that you're serious about changing things. I'm not saying his response is right or even the most productive way of going about it, but it would be a pretty natural reaction.

I really do wish both of you well in your relationship!

C


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

Honey21 said:


> I have been with my husband for 6 years, married for 5, we have a 2 year old. I have never experienced oral sex, my husband has insisted on giving it to me but I never let him *because I believe its dirty* and I have never done it to him except for two occasions when he begged me for hours and I just wanted to shut him up and did it for two minutes and then got tired. We have never done anything other than simple missionary and I do not feel comfortable trying other positions.


 OH Honey, I've been where you are..with the feeling certain acts are "dirty"... I would consider myself in our early marriage to be somewhat *sexually repressed*....although I loved Pleasure, Romance...and never missed an orgasm...

But I had hang ups with oral... I used to push him away when he tried to go down on me... I was not comfortable doing him... this is a mindset.....I overcame all of this...

Too much religious indoctrination...plus the stuff I seen in the world ... I just associated it with Porn or strippers or something...I was a Romantic & I just didn't "get it" - I never got my hands on any books that Praised Marital sex.. ya know..it just seemed the Unmarrieds were doing the DIRTY.. it messed with my head....

Had I ONLY done my homework earlier in life.. we could have experienced so much more. We are NOW in mid life.. don't make the same mistakes as I....

TALK Openly about Sex... explore...Check this website out -- Sex Positions Guide

UNDERSTAND  is an emotional need for your dear husband... do NOT brush him off...if you care anything about how he feels-and deeply... your intimacy, your marriage..

 Sex is an Emotional NEED...Male sexuality is a central part of who he is as both a man and a husband



> Lately I have noticed that my husband does not even kiss me anymore and we have drifted apart. I want to fix the problem but I do not know how.


Your husband is hurting here....he is backing away, *he is building a slow growing resentment*...once a week sex is not enough for him, he feels rejected , pushed aside... I used to love reading books too, my husband told me yrs later when we opened up the sex dialog, he used to HATE MY BOOKS... Your husband wants to feel your desire for him...that he is able to pleasure you and bring you to the heights... You faking orgasms ....not good... this will cause resentment to build in YOU ! 

The majority of women orgasm through oral sex.. so I hope you can openly allow him to explore here, it can open the Heavens unto you both. 

This was a post I put on here to another woman who seemed Repressed -with book suggestions below>>


> *SimplyAmorous said:* Ist I want to say... Welcome to TAM....I want to appeal to you ..If I can.......it is GOOD you can acknowlege that you have a very PURITAN view on sex... this is a starting point... How badly do you want to change your mindset ? It is a mindset that steals your freedom to embrace this pleasure that your husband gives...and desires so desperately for you to feel ...his passion and yours. When it is one sided, it is near hurtful.
> 
> Are you on any meds to inhibit your libido? Are you on birth control - this can mess with your hormones so you feel low drive also....
> 
> ...


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## john_lord_b3 (Jan 11, 2013)

Honey21 said:


> Ok, I have been reading different posts on this forum and I think compare to most people here, I am more conservative and now I am concerned if it causes a problem n my marriage later.
> 
> I have been with my husband for 6 years, married for 5, we have a 2 year old. I have never experienced oral sex, my husband has insisted on giving it to me but I never let him because I believe its dirty and I have never done it to him except for two occasions when he begged me for hours and I just wanted to shut him up and did it for two minutes and then got tired. We have never done anything other than simple missionary and I do not feel comfortable trying other positions. Lately our sex life has been reduced to once a week if he is lucky even though I am 30 years old and he is 32. I prefer to spend my time reading and watching movies before sleeping and sex just seems like too much work. Mostly I do it so he would leave me alone and I can go back to my book. I realise it is not normal and thought something must be wrong with my hormones but my doctor just brushed it off as normal.
> 
> Lately I have noticed that my husband does not even kiss me anymore and we have drifted apart. I want to fix the problem but I do not know how.


Mrs. OP,

Don't lose hope, and you come to a right place! You see, TAM is a treasure trove of pertinent information, especially in regards to sex in marriage. I would recommend you to _read_ these thread carefully (yes, each and every post, especially the OP's) to gain further insight about "sexless marriage" syndrome from both sides.

This is a success story, required readings for both men and women (thank you Mrs. GettingIt!)
http://talkaboutmarriage.com/sex-ma...-now-how-i-get-my-husband-trust-me-again.html

There are some more good advice in this thread below:
http://talkaboutmarriage.com/sex-marriage/83665-how-happy-you.html

This below is a story of a man who finally had enough and file for divorce. But not before making very very serious efforts for years. 
http://talkaboutmarriage.com/sex-marriage/67022-ld-wife-has-turned-me-off.html

This one is a sad story, required readings for men who can't let go.
http://talkaboutmarriage.com/sex-marriage/67027-cruel-unfeeling-wife.html

Well, surely these are enough reading materials for a weekend or three. Happy reading and good luck!


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

john117 said:


> A movie on HBO is not even worthy of the classification. But my amusement was not that she did not watch it (lifetime movie network has a loooot of steam and she watches it all the time) but hat she was instantly on guard to make sure we don't watch it together or me on my own.


I stand corrected, tonight there was a pretty, ehem, intense soft pourn film on Cinemax straight out of the 80's California sex movie industry, bad music, bad plot, real bad acting, and more silicon than a supercomputer. She watched the entire 90 minutes commenting on breast sizes and all that and promptly fell asleep 5 min after the end. 

Some people should donate their reproductive organs to an organ bank...


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## Red2 (Apr 28, 2013)

john117 said:


> I stand corrected, tonight there was a pretty, ehem, intense soft pourn film on Cinemax straight out of the 80's California sex movie industry, bad music, bad plot, real bad acting, and more silicon than a supercomputer. She watched the entire 90 minutes commenting on breast sizes and all that and promptly fell asleep 5 min after the end.
> 
> Some people should donate their reproductive organs to an organ bank...


Would that movie be 'Boogie Nights' ? :lol:


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## whitecat (May 17, 2013)

Honey21 said:


> Ok, I have been reading different posts on this forum and I think compare to most people here, I am more conservative and now I am concerned if it causes a problem n my marriage later.
> 
> I have been with my husband for 6 years, married for 5, we have a 2 year old. I have never experienced oral sex, my husband has insisted on giving it to me but I never let him because I believe its dirty and I have never done it to him except for two occasions when he begged me for hours and I just wanted to shut him up and did it for two minutes and then got tired. We have never done anything other than simple missionary and I do not feel comfortable trying other positions. Lately our sex life has been reduced to once a week if he is lucky even though I am 30 years old and he is 32. I prefer to spend my time reading and watching movies before sleeping and sex just seems like too much work. Mostly I do it so he would leave me alone and I can go back to my book. I realise it is not normal and thought something must be wrong with my hormones but my doctor just brushed it off as normal.
> 
> Lately I have noticed that my husband does not even kiss me anymore and we have drifted apart. I want to fix the problem but I do not know how.


My husband and I are not very adventurous in bed either. We have pretty much vanilla sex, as they say. But I love it. Every time we make love (and we have been together almost 15 years), I get tingly all over and I just can't get enough of him. We do french kiss almost the whole time, which I really love. He kisses my neck and my ears and sucks on my nipples, which I also love. On rare occasion I don't orgasm, and sometimes he doesn't either. But that's okay. Afterwards we cuddle and fall asleep in each other's arms. It's not really the big O I'm after when we make love. It's not about sex adventures. It's the connection. I feel much closer to him afterwards and makes me dream about the next time! Maybe if he made love to you, rather than just sex, you would want to do it more?


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

Aw whitecat, that was such a sweet message!


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## 4thand11 (May 20, 2013)

> Am I uptight?


Yes.



> is it normal?


No. 



> Lately I have noticed that my husband does not even kiss me anymore and we have drifted apart.


Can you blame him? All you talk about is "doing it to shut him up", "I'd rather read a book", and "just getting it over with". Not exactly romantic or sexy, is it?

Honestly this seems like a case for a sex therapist. You clearly have hangups about sex that (I assume) likely go back to something in your upbringing, perhaps what you were taught by parents etc. (about sex being "dirty", not for "good girls", etc.) A good therapist might help you.

I think the discomfort you are feeling is likely 100% related to your inability to think of sex as normal, pleasurable, and fun. I doubt it is anything physical (if it was, you'd likely experience similar discomfort when you have regular intercourse, which you say you don't).

A lot of women with sex hangups are uptight about receiving oral sex in particular. It seems "dirtier" to them than regular intercourse, for whatever reason.

See a therapist and try to lighten up,.. or sad to say but before long your marriage will be over.


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

Red2 said:


> Would that movie be 'Boogie Nights' ? :lol:


"Sexy wives sinsations". Misspelling as per title


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## ScarletBegonias (Jun 26, 2012)

whitecat said:


> My husband and I are not very adventurous in bed either. We have pretty much vanilla sex, as they say. But I love it. Every time we make love (and we have been together almost 15 years), I get tingly all over and I just can't get enough of him. We do french kiss almost the whole time, which I really love. He kisses my neck and my ears and sucks on my nipples, which I also love. On rare occasion I don't orgasm, and sometimes he doesn't either. But that's okay. Afterwards we cuddle and fall asleep in each other's arms. It's not really the big O I'm after when we make love. It's not about sex adventures. It's the connection. I feel much closer to him afterwards and makes me dream about the next time! Maybe if he made love to you, rather than just sex, you would want to do it more?


Quoted because I enjoyed reading it so much  What a healthy viewpoint about sex!!


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## Theseus (Feb 22, 2013)

Honey21 said:


> As some people recommended, I asked him today if he thinks we should se therapy but he flipped out and told me he is fine and I am the one who should go to a therapist, because he is normal


I will disagree with at least one other person on here. 

Your husband's attitude toward therapy is wrong. I guess he thinks of therapy as going to a mental hospital. That's not the point. Even if you (the wife) are the one with all the problems, he should still go to therapy too. The point is more to find a solution that you both can be happy with, not to "cure" one person and make them "normal".

Of course, it's possible that he doesn't want to go because he's already checked out of this marriage and planning on serving you with divorce papers at some moment in the near future.


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## ScarletBegonias (Jun 26, 2012)

It always raises a red flag to me when a spouse refuses to attend counseling.


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## johnnycomelately (Oct 30, 2010)

ScarletBegonias said:


> It always raises a red flag to me when a spouse refuses to attend counseling.


I think he is right. She is the one with the problem, she has to do the legwork to get it sorted out. She is also more likely to be open and there is less likely to be resentment if she goes alone.


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## 4thand11 (May 20, 2013)

whitecat said:


> Maybe if he made love to you, rather than just sex, you would want to do it more?


This is a very lovely sentiment however it seems like in the OP's case the issue is 100% on her.

This reads as if the husband isn't doing something that would make her want to have sex... the issues she has about sex are clearly her own. This can make it seem like the problems are due to her husband not being romantic enough... and based on her post it seems obvious that her hangups are completely due to her own feelings about sex.

Again I am not belittling the sentiment, which is very nice. Not that there's anything wrong with "just sex" now and then, it doesn't always have to be rose petals and candles, a little hard, fast sex now and then is fun too!


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## norajane (Feb 7, 2012)

johnnycomelately said:


> I think he is right. She is the one with the problem, she has to do the legwork to get it sorted out. She is also more likely to be open and there is less likely to be resentment if she goes alone.


It might do their marriage some good, though, if they go to MC and learn to communicate and to understand each other.

I think she would benefit from some individual counseling, but to say their marriage couldn't benefit from some marriage counseling and it's all on her to do the legwork seems counter-productive. A good sex life requires trust and communication, and developing that needs both of them to participate.

Shutting her down about MC doesn't contribute to either building trust or communication.


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## johnnycomelately (Oct 30, 2010)

norajane said:


> It might do their marriage some good, though, if they go to MC and learn to communicate and to understand each other.
> 
> I think she would benefit from some individual counseling, but to say their marriage couldn't benefit from some marriage counseling and it's all on her to do the legwork seems counter-productive. A good sex life requires trust and communication, and developing that needs both of them to participate.
> 
> Shutting her down about MC doesn't contribute to either building trust or communication.


I disagree. She obviously has some deep-seated issues and he is understandebly resentful. She is likely to be inhibited with him there and he is likely to get angry. 

If the issue was with the marriage or the relationship, fine, MC would be the way forward. But as the issue is one-sided IC is the answer. She needs to be open and honest with the IC and this poor guy doesn't deserve any more blows to his self-esteem.


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## ScarletBegonias (Jun 26, 2012)

johnnycomelately said:


> I think he is right. She is the one with the problem, she has to do the legwork to get it sorted out. She is also more likely to be open and there is less likely to be resentment if she goes alone.


I don't know them so I don't feel justified saying it's all her fault but I think he should attend with her if for no other reason than for help understanding each other and learning how to communicate properly about issues.


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## johnnycomelately (Oct 30, 2010)

ScarletBegonias said:


> I don't know them so I don't feel justified saying it's all her fault but I think he should attend with her if for no other reason than for help understanding each other and learning how to communicate properly about issues.


She never said she had any issues with him. Her issue seems to be with sex itself. She is much more likely to get to the bottom of it if she is uninhibited with the counsellor.


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## norajane (Feb 7, 2012)

johnnycomelately said:


> She never said she had any issues with him. Her issue seems to be with sex itself. She is much more likely to get to the bottom of it if she is uninhibited with the counsellor.


It's not necessarily about whether she has issues with him. Even if she zero issues with him, it might be helpful TO HIM to better understand his wife and where's she's coming from on this topic. It also will give him an opportunity to express how he is feeling so she can better understand him and his needs.


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## ScarletBegonias (Jun 26, 2012)

norajane said:


> It's not necessarily about whether she has issues with him. Even if she zero issues with him, it might be helpful TO HIM to better understand his wife and where's she's coming from on this topic. It also will give him an opportunity to express how he is feeling so she can better understand him and his needs.


:iagree:

Counseling isn't just for the person with the issues.I think if more people realized that many more people would be enjoying the benefits of good solid therapy sessions.


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## johnnycomelately (Oct 30, 2010)

norajane said:


> It's not necessarily about whether she has issues with him. Even if she zero issues with him, it might be helpful TO HIM to better understand his wife and where's she's coming from on this topic. It also will give him an opportunity to express how he is feeling so she can better understand him and his needs.


Clearly he feels differently and I think he deserves some understanding here.


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## ScarletBegonias (Jun 26, 2012)

johnnycomelately said:


> Clearly he feels differently and I think he deserves some understanding here.


All the more reason for him to attend the counseling.For her to gain a better understanding of his feelings in a safe controlled environment.For him to have the freedom to express himself fully in a safe controlled environment where she has to listen without interrupting,storming off,or deflecting.


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## Tall Average Guy (Jul 26, 2011)

ScarletBegonias said:


> :iagree:
> 
> Counseling isn't just for the person with the issues.I think if more people realized that many more people would be enjoying the benefits of good solid therapy sessions.


I agree if this is how she phrased it. 

I suspect based on her earlier posts that her suggestion came across as him being to blame. I don't think putting the blame on him is the way to get him to go to counseling. 

Rather, phrasing it that she recognizes that this is a problem, she needs to get help, and having him participate will help her to work on this with him.


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## ScarletBegonias (Jun 26, 2012)

Tall Average Guy said:


> I agree if this is how she phrased it.
> 
> I suspect based on her earlier posts that her suggestion came across as him being to blame. I don't think putting the blame on him is the way to get him to go to counseling.
> 
> Rather, phrasing it that she recognizes that this is a problem, she needs to get help, and having him participate will help her to work on this with him.


:iagree:

but,there's always a but,if you talk to other people who don't particularly enjoy sex they will feel differently on who exactly is to blame for the marital issues being sex related.

Maybe she can present it as something she wants them to do as a couple to gain better understanding about their dynamic and to learn how to improve on their weaknesses together? I just don't know what's the best way.It's a tough subject with lots of finger pointing.


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

I don't think your husband is going about things in the right way, I'm just saying what he might be thinking or feeling. And he's not here looking for advice. If he was, I'd tell him to get his ass into counselling with his wife, because he's got nothing to lose and lots to gain.

But he's not here... So the best thing I can suggest to her is to show him through her long term actions that she's serious and committed to making things better. Then you have a chance at him buying into it.

C


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## Tall Average Guy (Jul 26, 2011)

ScarletBegonias said:


> :iagree:
> 
> but,there's always a but,if you talk to other people who don't particularly enjoy sex they will feel differently on who exactly is to blame for the marital issues being sex related.
> 
> Maybe she can present it as something she wants them to do as a couple to gain better understanding about their dynamic and to learn how to improve on their weaknesses together? I just don't know what's the best way.It's a tough subject with lots of finger pointing.


She may very well feel like that. But she is the one here posting, not him. So she can tell him he is to blame, suggest counseling and watching him refuse, or she can soft sell it (note my phrasing did not suggest she had the problem, but rather that there was an issue that she wanted to address) in an effort to get him there. I think the later is more productive.


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

This is what makes me crazy with "some"men. They hear the words but they take a totally different meaning.

No where in this thread has ANYONE blamed the husband for ANYTHING! Going into therapy with the wife is NOT synonymous with accepting BLAME. Getting rid of resentment is HIS problem though and as long as he holds onto it this marriage isn't going to improve!

Being supportive doesn't mean you get the short end of the stick. Being supportive doesn't mean you take the blame. Being supportive does mean you listen wi both ears, you gain an understanding of her deepest fears and anxieties, you get a chance to give reassurance AND get reassurance. Counseling isn't intended to blame but to seek understanding and through understanding one another the connection becomes more meaningful.

Good golly if your wife had a problem for which IC would be helpful, then YES it would be doubly helpful if the husband also attended!


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

I think a lot of men believe that the purpose of therapy is to somehow make them more accepting of bad behavior or a bad situation just to shut them up, rather than fixing the problem. He hears the word "compromise" and figures he's already compromised so much.


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## ScarletBegonias (Jun 26, 2012)

WorkingOnMe said:


> I think a lot of men believe that the purpose of therapy is to somehow make them more accepting of bad behavior or a bad situation just to shut them up, rather than fixing the problem. He hears the word "compromise" and figures he's already compromised so much.


I can see how they'd feel this way since I've felt that way myself in counseling before.Hopefully they're shown that's not the purpose of therapy and they get a positive experience out of it.


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

Good point! 

Once again I am reminded how much my husband has had to put up with over the years and why he "hears" what is said.


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

When I hear the phrase "mutually agreeable solution" I just cringe. My mind translates that into she gets what she wants and I get nothing....and I'm supposed to be happy about it.


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## ScarletBegonias (Jun 26, 2012)

WorkingOnMe said:


> When I hear the phrase "mutually agreeable solution" I just cringe. My mind translates that into she gets what she wants and I get nothing....and I'm supposed to be happy about it.


 It's so NOT supposed to be that way. Why is it that more people don't understand the concept of FAIR?


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

ScarletBegonias said:


> It's so NOT supposed to be that way. Why is it that more people don't understand the concept of FAIR?


Fair as in halfway? How fair is to average twice a week with four times a year, ummm, 100 average with 4 that's 104 / 2... Once a week. Not many LD's would view going from 4 times a year to once a week as FAIR. Yet numerically it is


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## TCSRedhead (Oct 17, 2012)

Honey21 said:


> It is hard enough for people like me to talk about their problem without judgement and silly accusations of people like you. I don have time for trolling on the internet, I am an educated person and I actually joined this forum because I thought it could help me.


What type of help are you seeking? To answer your original questions, you are uptight and this is not normal.

What is it you want from here? Help on establishing intimacy or help in justifying remaining celibate in a marriage?


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

Honey21 said:


> I have orgasm if I want to, but it is too much work as I said, I need to concentrate and I only get it if my husband spends enough time on foreplay which he usually does, but I prefer to finish it quickly so I fake it so we can get it over with


This makes me sad because, for me, there is absolutely nothing in this world that compared to making love with my husband. Not even my books, and my husband will attest that I love to read. 

Do you feel passion for your husband? Would you say that you are in love with him?


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## Tall Average Guy (Jul 26, 2011)

Anon Pink said:


> This is what makes me crazy with "some"men. They hear the words but they take a totally different meaning.
> 
> No where in this thread has ANYONE blamed the husband for ANYTHING! Going into therapy with the wife is NOT synonymous with accepting BLAME. Getting rid of resentment is HIS problem though and as long as he holds onto it this marriage isn't going to improve!
> 
> Being supportive doesn't mean you get the short end of the stick. Being supportive doesn't mean you take the blame. Being supportive does mean you listen wi both ears, you gain an understanding of her deepest fears and anxieties, you get a chance to give reassurance AND get reassurance. Counseling isn't intended to blame but to seek understanding and through understanding one another the connection becomes more meaningful.


When arguing about the frequency of sex, it is not uncommon for many men to be told that they are at fault, and that if they were just not so demanding and horny, and could control themselves, there would not be a problem. With those sorts of words ringing in their ears, the suggestion to go to counseling can be easily interpreted as an effort to get him to fix his problem, as opposed to working together.

That is why I suggested that she be crystal clear that this is not about him being blamed, but about the two of them addressing this issue together.



> Good golly if your wife had a problem for which IC would be helpful, then YES it would be doubly helpful if the husband also attended!


Actually, not always, or at least not right away. Sometimes, a person needs to figure out what their issue really is before they can involve the spouse. I don't know if that is the case here, but I don't think I can dismiss the possibility.


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

Arguing about frequency of sex likely results in even less sex if the root cause of the issue is not addressed. As my Indian friend said 30 years ago it is like the Indian passport office. If you make the mistake to ask if your passport is ready it automatically gets moved to the bottom of the pile


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## treyvion (Apr 29, 2013)

john117 said:


> Arguing about frequency of sex likely results in even less sex if the root cause of the issue is not addressed. As my Indian friend said 30 years ago it is like the Indian passport office. If you make the mistake to ask if your passport is ready it automatically gets moved to the bottom of the pile


HaHa, that sounds about right.


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## salamander (Apr 2, 2013)

*LittleDeer* said:


> I disagree, I love sex, but I don't watch porn.


I'm with LittleDeer here. Watching porn for sex ed is like watching cereal ads for nutrition advice.


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

But it has 12 vitamins and minerals!!!!


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

salamander said:


> I'm with LittleDeer here. Watching porn for sex ed is like watching cereal ads for nutrition advice.


I don't know. Yesterday's borderline decent Cinemax flick did include copious amounts of Hershey's chocolate syrup, which had been put to similar use by us in the past Before Children 

If you can make the distinction between movies and reality vis a vis an action film and know you can't be run over by a bus and live to tell about it, then it can also be assumed one can tell sexual reality from sexual fantasy...


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## missus (Jun 19, 2013)

Honey 21, 

Lubricant! - delicious flavoured lubricant solves soooo many problems!!! 

1) removes friction on your clitoris so that should be less uncomfortable when you get started
2) Gives you the confidence that when he performs oral sex it isn't an unpleasant experience for him (I swear by passion fruit!) 
3) Gives you an added incentive (and a nice sensory experience) when you try oral sex with him. 

As a general point... if you're struggling with sex, willing to admit it and suggest counselling; keep trying to discuss the 'why' with your partner. If he understands that and signs up for it his support will help you so much!!! 

Good luck!


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## Honey21 (Jun 8, 2013)

I think what adds to problem and makes me not want to even be close to him is that he asks for sex all the time, and I mean all the time! We cant watch a movie together without him starting to make a move! I do underestand that maybe if he gets it more he would not want it all the time, but still its good if h e backs off and let me go to him.

Also I was wondering if anyone else has this problem, when we have sex, he insists on me having an orgasm before he gets off himself, I fake it because if I orgasm, I become dry quickly and the rest of sex is painful and long. He sometimes wants to stop when he sees I am in pain but I know if he does not come, he wants to do it again later so I let him finish. Does anyone else have this problem? We used to try lubricants but I was allergic and afterwards would become really itchy


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## johnnycomelately (Oct 30, 2010)

Honey21 said:


> I think what adds to problem and makes me not want to even be close to him is that he asks for sex all the time, and I mean all the time!


Humans need sex. You can't really condemn him for wanting a normal, loving relationship.



Honey21 said:


> he insists on me having an orgasm before he gets off himself


Most people would see this as considerate.


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## RFguy (Feb 17, 2013)

john117 said:


> Arguing about frequency of sex likely results in even less sex if the root cause of the issue is not addressed. As my Indian friend said 30 years ago it is like the Indian passport office. If you make the mistake to ask if your passport is ready it automatically gets moved to the bottom of the pile


And if you never say something, the other party will think (or at least have plausible deniability) that everything is fine and dandy.

Lose-lose situation.


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## RFguy (Feb 17, 2013)

Honey21 said:


> We used to try lubricants but I was allergic and afterwards would become really itchy



There are hundreds of brands, each with a different formulation. You can't be allergic to all types of lubricant. Try another brand/type.


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## ScarletBegonias (Jun 26, 2012)

john117 said:


> Fair as in halfway? How fair is to average twice a week with four times a year, ummm, 100 average with 4 that's 104 / 2... Once a week. Not many LD's would view going from 4 times a year to once a week as FAIR. Yet numerically it is


Fair as in one person doesn't get to put their physical or emotional needs above their partner but accepts the physical and emotional needs of BOTH partners are equally important.


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## ScarletBegonias (Jun 26, 2012)

Honey21 said:


> I think what adds to problem and makes me not want to even be close to him is that he asks for sex all the time, and I mean all the time! We cant watch a movie together without him starting to make a move! I do underestand that maybe if he gets it more he would not want it all the time, but still its good if h e backs off and let me go to him.This used to make me feel so used and cheap when my ex would behave in this way.No hugs without grabbing my butt or breasts.No kisses without rubbing his erection against me with that lascivious grin.It was sickening and made me feel as though I was nothing more than a toy.Taken out only when he needed to get off or when he needed some p***y so he could feel like a man. Perhaps if he had taken the time to show affection and love without the sexual innuendo constantly I would have responded better. Currently,my SO and I make love nearly every day bc he never behaves the way my ex did. If this is how your H is being,you MUST communicate with him about it or you will grow to resent and hate sex as well as hating your husband.
> 
> Also I was wondering if anyone else has this problem, when we have sex, he insists on me having an orgasm before he gets off himself, I fake it because if I orgasm, I become dry quickly and the rest of sex is painful and long. He sometimes wants to stop when he sees I am in pain but I know if he does not come, he wants to do it again later so I let him finish. Does anyone else have this problem? We used to try lubricants but I was allergic and afterwards would become really itchy.This can happen to me as well.It always happened with my ex.The pressure on me to orgasm was insane.I hated it so much that I'd fake it just to get it over with then later give myself an orgasm while I was alone.I didn't communicate with him bc his ego was so darn fragile.I tried talking to him once or twice but he became so angry and sullen.  SO always brings me to orgasm with oral before PIV and never before a LOT of foreplay with his fingers...I don't need all that but he does it bc he enjoys it.I've found I stay lubricated longer after having an orgasm from oral. perhaps you could learn to enjoy oral or at least having him stimulate you with his fingers if you don't currently enjoy it? You have to teach the man what you like and how to do it sometimes. It also helps to stop mid-intercourse and have him do oral again for a minute or two. Another thing that seems to work is when SO stops moving and is just still inside and we just kiss and push against each other.When he starts moving again ever thing is instantly wet and comfortable. I hope you can try these things and have it help you.


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

ScarletBegonias said:


> Fair as in one person doesn't get to put their physical or emotional needs above their partner but accepts the physical and emotional needs of BOTH partners are equally important.


Whoooa, pardner. Using this logic the 4x a year partner gets to stay at 4x a year because the more ND partner has to accept that as part of the LD's overall physical and emotional needs?

That is so "all animals are equal but some animals are more equal than others"-esque.


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## john_lord_b3 (Jan 11, 2013)

john117 said:


> Whoooa, pardner. Using this logic the 4x a year partner gets to stay at 4x a year because the more ND partner has to accept that as part of the LD's overall physical and emotional needs?
> 
> That is so "all animals are equal but some animals are more equal than others"-esque.


:iagree:


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## ScarletBegonias (Jun 26, 2012)

john117 said:


> Whoooa, pardner. Using this logic the 4x a year partner gets to stay at 4x a year because the more ND partner has to accept that as part of the LD's overall physical and emotional needs?
> 
> That is so "all animals are equal but some animals are more equal than others"-esque.


You're trying to make every thing into a math problem or equal numbers problem. I'm not talking about numbers I'm talking about a state of mind for fairness. everyone has to give and it starts by realizing your needs aren't more important than the needs of your partner...then each relationship has to work out their own little number problem keeping that in mind.
Currently, the way people talk,no one gives even an inch. It's either the HD partner is doing all the compromising for the LD partner or the LD does all the compromising for the HD. There is no give and take.


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

RFguy said:


> There are hundreds of brands, each with a different formulation. You can't be allergic to all types of lubricant. Try another brand/type.


+1 on this. There's natural ones like coconut oil, artificial ones based on silicone, water, etc.

C
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## ScarletBegonias (Jun 26, 2012)

PBear said:


> +1 on this. There's natural ones like coconut oil, artificial ones based on silicone, water, etc.
> 
> C
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


coconut oil is really great for your skin too :smthumbup:


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

ScarletBegonias said:


> You're trying to make every thing into a math problem or equal numbers problem. I'm not talking about numbers I'm talking about a state of mind for fairness. everyone has to give and it starts by realizing your needs aren't more important than the needs of your partner...then each relationship has to work out their own little number problem keeping that in mind.
> Currently, the way people talk,no one gives even an inch. It's either the HD partner is doing all the compromising for the LD partner or the LD does all the compromising for the HD. There is no give and take.


Of course it is a numbers game. Sex within the context of a married couple is not like climbing Mt. Everest (where climb means climbing once and that's it)

The very idea of compromising is to lay down two quantitative sets of expectations and arrive at a mutually agreed upon third set somewhere between A and B. 

In the process both sides have a max and min value in their mind. If there is common ground then we are moving along and resolve the issue. If not...

Numbers keep people honest. Throw numbers away and start depending on nefarious 'feeling' type benchmarks and soon it's hello TAM, hello counseling, or hello all kinds of other outcomes.


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## ScarletBegonias (Jun 26, 2012)

john117 said:


> Of course it is a numbers game. Sex within the context of a married couple is not like climbing Mt. Everest (where climb means climbing once and that's it)For you,it might be a numbers game.For others it isn't so black and white.
> 
> The very idea of compromising is to lay down two quantitative sets of expectations and arrive at a mutually agreed upon third set somewhere between A and B.
> 
> ...


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## johnnycomelately (Oct 30, 2010)

ScarletBegonias said:


> You're trying to make every thing into a math problem or equal numbers problem. I'm not talking about numbers I'm talking about a state of mind for fairness. everyone has to give and it starts by realizing your needs aren't more important than the needs of your partner...then each relationship has to work out their own little number problem keeping that in mind.
> Currently, the way people talk,no one gives even an inch. It's either the HD partner is doing all the compromising for the LD partner or the LD does all the compromising for the HD. There is no give and take.


You are treating this as though this is a drive issue, it is not. She doesn't like sex and finds normal sex acts repugnant. She is sexually dysfunctional and needs to get help before her marriage is destroyed. Justification on false grounds of drive difference and blaming her partner is not going to help.


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## ScarletBegonias (Jun 26, 2012)

johnnycomelately said:


> You are treating this as though this is a drive issue, it is not. She doesn't like sex and finds normal sex acts repugnant. She is sexually dysfunctional and needs to get help before her marriage is destroyed. Justification on false grounds of drive difference and blaming her partner is not going to help.


Guilty of a threadjack I actually wasn't referring to her situation. I posted a response to WOM's post then the scientific/math minded guy further derailed the thread from there.


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## Tall Average Guy (Jul 26, 2011)

Honey21 said:


> I think what adds to problem and makes me not want to even be close to him is that he asks for sex all the time, and I mean all the time! We cant watch a movie together without him starting to make a move! I do underestand that maybe if he gets it more he would not want it all the time, but still its good if h e backs off and let me go to him.


He may be trying for quantity, rather than quality in approaching you. If he thinks you are rejecting him frequently, then approaching you more will lead to more sex, even if the percentages stay the same.

Consider scheduling some intimacy based on what each partner wants. For example, two nights a week you two cuddle, and you get to decide what, if anything, you two do. If a particular night is not working for one of you, then you agree to a rain-check the very next night. He gets two nights for him. You both know you will each get some of the quality time you need with less pressure.



> Also I was wondering if anyone else has this problem, when we have sex, he insists on me having an orgasm before he gets off himself, I fake it because if I orgasm, I become dry quickly and the rest of sex is painful and long. He sometimes wants to stop when he sees I am in pain but I know if he does not come, he wants to do it again later so I let him finish. Does anyone else have this problem? We used to try lubricants but I was allergic and afterwards would become really itchy


Likely because that is what he has been taught. The stereo type of the guy that gets off then roles over is a bad one, so he is trying to avoid it. Since men are out of commission for at least awhile after orgasm, he may not know what to do. Have you communicated what he can do in that scenario that would work for you?


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

No real thread jacking. The OP was concerned about "drifting apart" and numbers are a pretty good way to assess objectively whether drifting occurs or not. The OP also expressed concern about her partner asking all the time etc...

A lot of times without looking at hard evidence it is difficult to come up with a "yes we're drifting", "maybe we're drifting" and "all is well". We simply continue to believe what we want to believe. If we believe we're drifting and numbers (among other evidence) say we aren't, it's quite different than if we actually are. 

It's hard to get a representative and objective picture of the relationship without shutting out the "what have you done for me lately" voice...

People either carry a grudge or an issue without looking at the overall picture or just look at the last streak of flowers and dinners again without looking at the overall picture.


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## Trying2figureitout (Feb 3, 2011)

WorkingOnMe said:


> I think a lot of men believe that the purpose of therapy is to somehow make them more accepting of bad behavior or a bad situation just to shut them up, rather than fixing the problem. He hears the word "compromise" and figures he's already compromised so much.



Not necessarily.....

While I see counseling as a venue to have someone else tell my wife she is off-base on several things.

In the end it is simply between her and I...

Counseling is a third party and of little use... IMO


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

Counseling, like numbers, is a good start towards getting a more objective view of the relationship. 

Assuming one is willing to listen - as a minimum - it could be a good starting point. The alternative is the status quo.


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## RFguy (Feb 17, 2013)

john117 said:


> Numbers keep people honest. Throw numbers away and start depending on nefarious 'feeling' type benchmarks and soon it's hello TAM, hello counseling, or hello all kinds of other outcomes.


I couldn't agree more with this.

Early in my relationship, I casually mentioned that my ideal would be 3-4 times per week. My ex responded that we already do that.

I knew that this wasn't true so I started logging everything on a spreadsheet. Dates and times, rejections, who initiated, etc.

After a while the hard cold numbers revealed a different truth. We had on average just 1-2 times per week and I wasn't asking for it "all the time" as she usually complained, quite the opposite.


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

Honey21 said:


> I think what adds to problem and makes me not want to even be close to him is that he asks for sex all the time, and I mean all the time! We cant watch a movie together without him starting to make a move! I do underestand that maybe if he gets it more he would not want it all the time, but still its good if h e backs off and let me go to him.


He _desires_ you. Why do you see his desire as a bad thing? See, in my opinion, much of the issues here are entirely in your head. As long as you see his desire and pursuit of you as a bad thing, a negative thing, this issue will only get worse. There are a good number of women who would give anything to have their husbands desire them sexually. 

I suggest you get into counseling or therapy. Having a low sex drive is one thing. Seeing your spouses very natural, and very healthy, sexual desires as a negative is NOT good. 



> Also I was wondering if anyone else has this problem, when we have sex, he insists on me having an orgasm before he gets off himself, I fake it because if I orgasm, I become dry quickly and the rest of sex is painful and long. He sometimes wants to stop when he sees I am in pain but I know if he does not come, he wants to do it again later so I let him finish. Does anyone else have this problem? We used to try lubricants but I was allergic and afterwards would become really itchy


Have you tried coconut oil? Organic and all natural. I use it. It works better for us than other lubricants anyway. The tingling ones always made me feel strange...the heat ones burned. So we switched to coconut oil, and it works wonders. I really like it because, unlike other lubricants, you don't need to keep reapplying to keep it moist.


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## Trying2figureitout (Feb 3, 2011)

RFguy said:


> I couldn't agree more with this.
> 
> Early in my relationship, I casually mentioned that my ideal would be 3-4 times per week. My ex responded that we already do that.
> 
> ...


Yes, keeping track of EVERYTHING is beneficial, sex, talks, promises... because your spouse WILL distort the truth to satisfy their position and their twisted reality. Numbers or notes don't lie.


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## FemBot (May 1, 2013)

Sounds like you've created a very needy husband and now that neediness is becoming a turnoff. You really need to get some help. A lot of women would love to have their husbands desire them so much. I agree with Created2write in that you are viewing everything negatively. His desire is a gift, not a curse. He wants YOU!

Please get some sex therapy on your own first and then maybe with your hubby. You need to know that sexuality is a gift between two loving people.


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## salamander (Apr 2, 2013)

Trying2figureitout said:


> Yes, keeping track of EVERYTHING is beneficial, sex, talks, promises... because your spouse WILL distort the truth to satisfy their position and their twisted reality. Numbers or notes don't lie.


This attitude makes me shake my head in sadness. If your spouse is so twisted and conniving, why do you even want to be with them, much less attempt physical intimacy with them? When I meet someone who purposefully distorts the truth to satisfy their twisted reality, I RUN!


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## Tall Average Guy (Jul 26, 2011)

salamander said:


> This attitude makes me shake my head in sadness. If your spouse is so twisted and conniving, why do you even want to be with them, much less attempt physical intimacy with them? When I meet someone who purposefully distorts the truth to satisfy their twisted reality, I RUN!


I don't know that it is always twisting and conniving (though Trying portrays his that way). Rather, I think it is often just human nature. Just as gamblers remember the wins and forget the losses, LD and HD tend to remember the events that reinforce their point of view. 

So I do think counting, particularly in the beginning, can be a great way to provide some objective evidence on where things are. I also think it is helpful to try and give your spouse the benefit of the doubt when their perception is different than yours.


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

salamander said:


> This attitude makes me shake my head in sadness. If your spouse is so twisted and conniving, why do you even want to be with them, much less attempt physical intimacy with them? When I meet someone who purposefully distorts the truth to satisfy their twisted reality, I RUN!


People are not always as good as they need to be in terms of recalling events, frequencies, etc. 

I'm not talking about an orgasm database here (interesting thought tho) but some way to keep track of the score... You should have seen my wife's face when she gave me the "we have sex all the time" Acme LD Press Kit Standard Response #275 and I simply told her our cumulative count for the year... And the year before. 

I guess counting is not part of the curriculum for math majors, even PhD's


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## mrbambino (Jun 18, 2013)

Reading your post I wish I would never have a SO who would think the same way! I could easily tell you don't really love him otherwise you would have cared much more!!!


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## RClawson (Sep 19, 2011)

I have just read through all of this and I have a strong impression you and your husband do not even really know how to touch one another. I know your husband believes he is Casanova but I know he isn't. 

Has he ever given you a long sensuous massage with no expectations to learn more about your body? Would you even entertain that idea? What about the opposite. There does not seem to be any intimacy in your sexual relationship from what I can tell. Is this a fair assessment?


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## ScarletBegonias (Jun 26, 2012)

mrbambino said:


> Reading your post I wish I would never have a SO who would think the same way! I could easily tell you don't really love him otherwise you would have cared much more!!!


:scratchhead:
If she didn't care she wouldn't be here posting her business to strangers.She'd be on her merry way living her life and not thinking about it at all.


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## Bluecollar (May 23, 2013)

Honey21, you are indeed far from normal, and to a certain point remind me of my wife lately. Romance novels are the woman's equivalent of porn for a man, regarding un-realistic expectations. The job, kids, commute to work, housework, *****y co-worker, etc etc, aren't going to disappear and leave you on a tropical island beach entwined with Juan bodybuilder. 
The good news is, your here, so that means you do at least recognize there is a problem instead of blaming your husband for your issues.
That is half the battle right there.
He should attend counseling with you, but I understand there is surely some resentment on his part and he refused because he doesn't believe anything will actually change.


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## tryingtoenjoylife (Mar 30, 2012)

I am going to add my 2 cents in because I hope it will help you out, and in turn help out your marriage. I tried to read through all of the posts but after awhile some of the snide remarks got old so I started to limit to reading your posts. I first would like to point out that some of the posts here are spot on - if you can get around the snide comments. Unfortunately, as you have learned, even medical professionals can give you snide comments.

I see a couple of problems from your comments and unfortunately, they are your problems. This is not to say that your husband shouldn't be understanding or have some patience, but they are your problems. 

You stated the following: 1) You were a virgin until you got married and 2) You have masturbated only one time

You have also indicated some low self esteem about your body (your husband says he is fine with your weight, but you think otherwise) and that you are in your early 30s. These are important points - all of them.

Somewhere along the lines you learned that sex was "dirty" (your words). Maybe it was religion, maybe it was a female role model that said "good girls don't do those things." Only you would know the answer. Breaking that feeling is, unfortunately, something that will take counseling. I say unfortunately because sex is a subject you don't seem to want to talk about. After all, you have not indicated talking about it with friends and you came to this anonymous site. What is good is that you seem to want to fix the issue. For that I am glad because it means there is hope.

I think healthy masturbation is as important to sexuality as anything. I say "healthy" masturbation because if you choose masturbation over sex (and the contact) it isn't healthy. If you find a counselor worth their weight they may encourage this because you are going to need to find out what feels good to you and what doesn't. 

It may be low sex drive that kept you from masturbating young, but given some of you comments I am guessing that you were taught it was dirty or wrong. Both boys and girls learn at a young age things that feel good and things that don't. I am talking even preteen. I could be something like climbing a pole, sitting on a washing machine or a riding lawn mower, or humping something. It may even be a shower massage. I am not talking about masturbation to orgasm. Most people don't masturbate to orgasm the first time or even for awhile. I am talking first about things that feel good.

From this you start to learn about your body. Why does it feel good. What can make it feel better. What can get you over the edge. This exploration can be with or without a partner or better yet, both. I personally never masturbated using my hands until I was dating and the girl I was dating would give me a hand job. She herself had hang ups about sex (BJs and HJs ok, premarital sex was against God.) She also learned herself what felt good and what didn't. She had vaginal orgasms but not clitoral ones. It was ok if I went down on her and used my tongue on her vagina, but if I went north a bit and put my tongue on her clit she hated it. Over time, her body changed just as yours will.

The point of the above is to find out what feels good to you and then start to share it with your husband. He is not fixated on playing with your clit, he is fixated on you achieving orgasm. Why? 1) Because he feels better about himself when you do and 2) Because it strengthens the bond you have. But you can only find out what feels good if you do some research on your own. If you find that dirty or disgusting then you will need to talk with someone. It isn't dirty. It is normal. There is nothing mentioned in the bible saying it is bad (though there is misguided belief that there is). If you find something that works for you I think your husband will be more than willing to accommodate you. This will bring you much closer together spiritually.

The beauty of your situation is that you can do this and not deprive your husband. A guy in his 30s can masturbate at 6:00 and not be in the mood to perform for several hours. The refractory period gets longer as men age. Women really don't have one.

You mentioned another issue. That when you orgasm you dry up. This is not uncommon, either. I have been with women who were extremely multi-orgasmic and some that can't have any stimulation after they cum. This too may change over time. 

The final thing is something you are not going to like but it is necessary to save your marriage. You need to find ways to please your husband sexually beyond missionary sex. Somehow someway you have to get it out of your mind that oral sex is dirty. You mentioned getting tired doing it, I presume you meant your mouth. Well, you don't have to make your mouth do all the work. A well lubricated hand (I am talking saliva here) along with a little mouth play can go a long way. 

I am suggesting this for MANY reasons. 1) If you reach orgasm you dry up so you will need to find other ways to please your man. 2) Shocker - MEN LIKE ORAL SEX. They LOVE it. They feel a bond from it. To paraphrase Titanic they feel like they are King of the World. 3) At some point you are going to need to work through these issues and they will involve patience on the part of your husband. This is a reward, a compromise, whatever you want to call it. "Honey, I have to find somethings out about myself and I know it is going to be tough on you. There are going to be times that I wont feel like having sex. I am going to try to make it up to you. I know how much you like/need oral sex and I am going to try to give that to you more often and to completion." I GUARANTEE that if you say those words to him you will get him to comply. Especially since he has been without for so long. 4) This is not a threat. This is not to put fear in your mind. This is a fact. A guy who doesn't have a wife who performs oral sex will find someone who does. There are reasons why there are so many porn sights and escort sights that cater to this. There are a lot of things that men do and do not like. Some like anal, some don't. Some have fetishes, some don't. I have yet to meet a guy who doesn't like to receive oral sex and I have met very few who don't enjoy giving it.

In time I hope you find a lot of things that you enjoy in the bedroom. Touches a certain way, penetration a certain way. I hope you and your husband find ways of having orgasms together and I hope you find ways of taking turns pleasing each other. The bond you get from this will be HUGE. The old saying that the couple that plays together - stays together is very fitting her. 

Please make the effort - for both of you.


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## justtryin (Apr 22, 2013)

Trying2figureitout said:


> Yes, keeping track of EVERYTHING is beneficial, sex, talks, promises... because your spouse WILL distort the truth to satisfy their position and their twisted reality. Numbers or notes don't lie.


I had a talk with my wife the other night about this. She suggested I keep a calendar of it because she insists it's more frequent than I think. I told her I don't care about the numbers, it's how I feel that matters. And that I don't want to put that pressure on her of keeping track because I'm afraid the pressure inhibits her. She did not agree or disagree, she was too focused on thinking that "it's plenty often enough what are you complaining about". I did not push or pursue this line of thinking because I did NOT want her to think of me as complaining. It's definitely not as much as she thinks it is, more like half.

We've been together 20 years. It's been an issue the whole time. Seems like we had sex a lot more when we were teenagers first together but honestly it could have been once a week or 7 times a week, I can't remember. For the last 15 years though all I know is I've never felt it was enough, sometimes not even close to enough but at best just barely enough. She understands my needs and does her best to accomodate me, but what she doesn't seem to get is that even though we have sex a couple times a week, I'm not just after the "sex". I want the intimacy, the desire from her. I need to feel wanted. I've learned in all this time how to get her off, big time, every time, but even that doesn't light her fire. The very next time we have sex it's starting at square one again. A lot of work and guessing, what is going to turn her on this time. It's been getting worse lately ironically as our communication together has been skyrocketing.

I finally stated this to her, very carefully and with the idea that I'm trying to help her out, make her feel open enough to experience this wonderful enjoyment more fully (which is true, I want that for her. I also want to benefit from it!) She said she doesn't know what turns her on from day to day and that usually nothing does, and knowing she will reach a screaming orgasm doesn't even get her in the mood. It's just not something she thinks about much, and is not a very high priority. She said she'll have fleeting moments thinking about us making love on occasion, but usually when I'm not around and it goes away quickly anyways. I suggested I could plant the seed in her mind earlier in the day, or hours before we do it, but she said that wouldn't help.

I have been very, very attentive and affectionate the last few months and that hasn't had any affect in this area. Once in a while she's in the mood, but mostly she's not and we just struggle and work until I finally get her there. She said she has no fantasies, she's sorry she is so boring, I've always been the only one she thinks about or wants to think about, but she simply doesn't have that drive. When I kept digging at her to be open and honest, that I will do anything to understand and listen to her for her sake, even giving it up myself for a while and only pleasing her if that takes the pressure off her, she was becoming annoyed. She said it just isn't a high priority for her and why wasn't I taking her word for it. I said I want pure open and honest, and said I know she sometimes sees it as a chore. She said, no, not really, and I said BS. I stated again I want OPEN and HONEST. She said ok, well a little bit sometimes, but she wants to meet my needs.

Problem is I read all these things everywhere about "women's secret desires" and "all women have high sex drives too" and "the husband just needs to act a certain way to draw it out of her" and so on. So I have been feeling the pressure to hold up my end, that I need to change my ways and do things differently and behave certain ways, and so far all it is doing is backfiring or having no change at all.

I'm nearly convinced that my wife is one of the exceptions, that there is no "hidden desire" within her. She never masturbates and forbids me to as well (which just meant I got really good at hiding it, and honestly I'd rather not, I want HER, but I saw it as a way of letting the pressure off her. Now I hate masturbating and refuse to live my life that way, I want HER). She is not religious and was not abused or traumatized, she is not on birth control. She can get turned on and does have orgasms. It's just not as much as I need (she'd probabaly be fine with once every week or two, who knows maybe even less) so instead she's a cold fish half the time, kind of in to it a quarter of the time, and actually into it a quarter of the time. I practically insist on giving her an orgasm every time, because I was tired of feeling like she was just having sex for me. That was probably like a year ago I started doing that. However it hasn't had much of an impact, maybe she's into it a little more often now, but still not enough. She doesn't really like me to give her oral, which I LOVE to do, says she's too self conscious and prefers me touching her anyways, her favorite (which I love that too so ok). If I insist however she usually will let me. But it's not the same when you feel like you have to insist to give someone pleasure. 

She has also said she feels nothing we do together is "dirty" and she loves the way I can make her feel, sexually. So that throws that theory out the window. I thought of that one years ago, figuring she must just not be comfortable with sex, doesn't masturbate, is sketchy about oral, anal, etc. But that isn't it. She actually used to let me do more of that stuff with her, but then finally started telling me she wasn't that into it and just did it for me. That pretty much killed it for me, so we're pretty plain vanilla these days. Which is fine with me, so long as she actually DESIRES me and it's frequent enough, that's all I really want.

She did read 50 shades of gray and was turned on by those books but she said she's thought and thought and honestly cannot figure out why it turned her on. And as soon as she was done with the book, it was over. She read one per day for three days, I remember it because she went pretty wild those three days, then it stopped just as suddenly as it started. She doesn't read romance novels, that was a rarity. So it's not like she is hooked on these romantic fantasy novels. But obviously something woke her up, and I said as much. I said that tells me there IS something inside of you that enjoys and wants it, let's explore that and figure it out together. She said she truly doesn't know what it was, and again back to the "I just have a low drive, it just isn't much of a priority for me".

I bought MMSLP and it did not apply to my situation. I'm considering those zorro books now but I'm skeptical there too. I'm confused as hell. Is it me? Is it her? Is she that much in denial about her sexuality, or is she truly just low drive like she acts and says she is? I go back and forth. When I feel it is because of me, I know I've acted one way and it works, and i've acted the opposite way and that worked too. And then neither way will work. It's a moving target. And even when it works, it's still too few and far between for my needs.

I love her dearly and cannot imagine my life without her. But I'm so afraid of going more years like this and don't know if I can mentally handle it. I could tell her we need to get this figured out or else, but what good would that do - that isn't exactly a turn on. And essentially I did tell her that years ago, not as harshly but she got the message, which is why she does try to put out as much as she can. She hates telling me no and says she feels pressure sometimes to get in the mood when she isn't, because she wants to please me. I think that's a big part of the problem but I don't know. And why can't I get her in the mood all the time or even most of the time? Does anyone really know, who isn't trying to sell something?

Sorry for the super long post and thread hijacking. This has been on my mind a lot lately.


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## norajane (Feb 7, 2012)

Some people are constantly hungry, no matter how much they've had to eat, and others are rarely hungry even though they eat less.

You want her to be hungry more often, and she's telling you she feels full already and doesn't want more, and can't comfortably eat more. You are never full so you end up constantly hungry.

People are different. 

Stop thinking it's you and she doesn't want you. When she does want sex, she wants YOU, not anyone or anything else. It's just she doesn't want sex as often as you do. There's nothing wrong with you OR her.


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## dontKnowMe2 (Apr 2, 2013)

Nice. So she's satisfied and he suffers.


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## norajane (Feb 7, 2012)

dontKnowMe2 said:


> Nice. So she's satisfied and he suffers.


Not in the least. She's not AT ALL satisfied with constantly being hounded to eat more often. She's already expressed irritation at his questioning because he won't believe what she's telling him. Keep that up and the resentment will grow as big as a boulder between them.

Neither one of them is satisfied.


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## tryingtoenjoylife (Mar 30, 2012)

Hold the phone. She "FORBIDS you to masturbate?????"

What kind of controlling woman is she? I know you are hiding it, but if she is not going to take care of you and you then you have EVERY RIGHT to masturbate. 
:scratchhead:


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## ScarletBegonias (Jun 26, 2012)

You have every right to masturbate even if she is taking care of you.it's your body and if you feel the urge to make yourself orgasm one morning in the shower then no one on this Earth can tell you that you can't or shouldn't.That's ridiculous.


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

The difference between sex and food is the full spouse doesn't care if the hungry spouse picks up a snack downtown. So, does she want to be your exclusive meal or not? That right comes with a responsibility. Can't have one without the other. Not long term. Starving person will eat eventually if there's food available.


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

Honey21 said:


> Ok, I have been reading different posts on this forum and I think compare to most people here, I am more conservative and now I am concerned if it causes a problem n my marriage later.
> 
> I have been with my husband for 6 years, married for 5, we have a 2 year old. I have never experienced oral sex, my husband has insisted on giving it to me but I never let him because I believe its dirty and I have never done it to him except for two occasions when he begged me for hours and I just wanted to shut him up and did it for two minutes and then got tired. We have never done anything other than simple missionary and I do not feel comfortable trying other positions. Lately our sex life has been reduced to once a week if he is lucky even though I am 30 years old and he is 32. I prefer to spend my time reading and watching movies before sleeping and sex just seems like too much work. Mostly I do it so he would leave me alone and I can go back to my book. I realise it is not normal and thought something must be wrong with my hormones but my doctor just brushed it off as normal.
> 
> Lately I have noticed that my husband does not even kiss me anymore and we have drifted apart. I want to fix the problem but I do not know how.


You are right he is detaching he is hurt and protecting himself from more hurt. He will tire of you rejecting him and may just move on. I have to ask a serious question was there any sexual abuse that you can think of? This is really not normal and if you don't change or get help soon you will be a single mother.


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## Tall Average Guy (Jul 26, 2011)

tryingtoenjoylife said:


> Hold the phone. She "FORBIDS you to masturbate?????"
> 
> What kind of controlling woman is she? I know you are hiding it, but if she is not going to take care of you and you then you have EVERY RIGHT to masturbate.
> :scratchhead:


That she would do that suggests some real control issues (or religious ones). Explore that.


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

Tall Average Guy said:


> That she would do that suggests some real control issues (or religious ones). Explore that.


Either way after a period of time I would be hasta la bye bye.


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## justtryin (Apr 22, 2013)

tryingtoenjoylife said:


> Hold the phone. She "FORBIDS you to masturbate?????"
> 
> What kind of controlling woman is she? I know you are hiding it, but if she is not going to take care of you and you then you have EVERY RIGHT to masturbate.
> :scratchhead:


I felt the same way for years which is why I put up with it. I figured she just had LD so I'll just secretly masturbate in between. Seemed to work for her.

But the last year or two her affection for me was starting to wane in other areas too. I was feeling taken for granted, since I provide a very comfortable life for her. She pulls her weight too, but I still felt taken for granted. Instead of my old M.O. of firing back and being a distant jerk, I tried a new approach (probably due to my maturity and my sobriety for the last several years). I began being more attentive to trying to meet HER needs better. It was hit and miss for a while. But then a combination of things happened. Won't go into everything, but I got very insecure and realized I had to REALLY step it up. So I did and here we are now.

She still thinks I blew it all out of proportion, and everything was "fine". But she wasn't the one feeling neglected and lonely anymore, I was. She doesn't know I was masturbating. She didn't see the impact it had on me when my LD wife suddenly got horny as hell when reading romance novels and started thinking I wouldn't care if she expressed how hot someone else was (even though it was a celebrity) when she had NEVER done that in the past. Meanwhile I'm feeling neglected and secretly masturbating because I think she has little sex drive. It hurt me big time.

Speaking of masturbation, when we first married she knew I did it. I tried watching porn with her, she was willing to give it a shot, and she cried. So I threw it all out. So a while later when our sex life was "meh" I started buying it again secretly. She caught me and threw a fit, saying how demeaning it was to women and how badly it hurt her. I told her I have needs and like it or not I will find a way to get it out, although my preference was her of course. But if she doesn't do it, I have to find another way. It's a curse but it's nature. That's when she started trying to be more accomodating. I gave it up again for a while, but eventually we settled back into old ways. By then the internet was here, and we all know how easy porn is now. 

I mentioned it about 2 years ago, I was fed up again and told her something needed to change. I was very sensitive to her and very careful and tender in my conversation. I said it's just the way I feel intimacy and closeness with her. I threw out a "I could just buy some porn to take the pressure off once in a while, but I know how you feel about that so it's probably not a good idea...right?" She said hell no, that would create more problems than anything else. So that was that. She said she was sorry she was LD and that she just needs more emotional connection and would try harder.

She also said once she thought masturbation was nearly as bad as cheating. I know she didn't mean it that harshly, but was trying to pound it in my head how against it she is.

My fear is that if I say I'm going to do it to take off the pressure, it will turn her even more off from me but will feel obligated to try to have more "turned off" sex with me. I don't want that. I want her to desire me because she wants to make love to me, not because she doesn't want me to masturbate.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

You think mmslp doesn't apply to your situation? You're wrong. Listening to you I hear complete beta no alpha at all. Contrary to some opinions mmslp doesn't advocate total alpha but a healthy mix. You really need to man up. Read mmslp with a bit more open mind.


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## justtryin (Apr 22, 2013)

WorkingOnMe said:


> You think mmslp doesn't apply to your situation? You're wrong. Listening to you I hear complete beta no alpha at all. Contrary to some opinions mmslp doesn't advocate total alpha but a healthy mix. You really need to man up. Read mmslp with a bit more open mind.



I read it all and understand it completely. My mix of alpha and beta is fine in my particular relationship. Many of the concepts of MMSLP I agree with and was already doing a great job of. The only areas that were "new territory" to me I tried, and it was a disaster for me and for her. I also thought initially my alpha was not enough, but it was. She likes a certain type of alpha and I already fit that bill. And over the years I've bounced from too alpha and too beta and everywhere in between. None of it changed what is going on in the bedroom, it only changes other aspects of our relationship. 

The only tactic I could see that would "work" would be to spend way less time with her and out doing things with other people, to make her uneasy. I could easily do that since my "sex rank" is much higher than hers. She actually suggested I get out more, find something interesting to do once in a while, but she was also reluctant and trailed off as she suggested it. She knows it would make her uneasy. The only reason she suggested it is she knows I'm hyper focused on our relationship right now and that's why she wants to me to find a distraction because it's making her uncomfortable to know I was unhappy and I'm changing what she was "fine" with.

And I have considered it. But honestly I'm not comfortable with that and I have to believe there is a better and healthier way than trying to make her uneasy. I enjoy being with her. Why would I force myself to go do something when I'd rather be with her?

So there ultimately was nothing new to apply that would work.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Trying2figureitout (Feb 3, 2011)

dontKnowMe2 said:


> Nice. So she's satisfied and he suffers.


Yes that's the thinking women don't understand how critical sex is to a Mans well-being. Yet we put up with it as to not be a total jerk to our wives.

I think wife understanding of sex its roughly something along the lines to Muslims having to pray to Mecca.

I may not understand it at all.. yet if that was taken away it would deeply hurt one of that faith.


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## justtryin (Apr 22, 2013)

And thinking on it more, years ago I was out a lot more often with other people and other interests. Our sex life was a little worse than now.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Catherine602 (Oct 14, 2010)

OP Glad you decided to post and hope you will try some of the suggestions and let us know how things are going. 

I have a little different take on your situation. Sex should be mutually satisfying first and foremost and you need to work at learning how to make that happen. 

Most women are complex and need more time and work to have consistently satisfying sex. How did you and your husband learn about sex? Have you both read any books on sex? What is your husbands sexual history? Is he open to learning along with you?

Are you and your husband open to working slowly on leaning your bodies and what kind of touch feels good? Did you and your husband know that the sensitivity of the clitoris changes as you become aroused. 

If you touch too early, too hard, too soft or in the wrong place, it hurts. Did you and your husband know that each woman is different? 

One thing that you might work is to start over again. Read a few books about male and female sexuality. Start slowly to learn each others body and how to touch each other. 

Maybe start with sensual messages. Have open and optimistic minds and change what does not work. 

Most of all, be willing to communicate with your husband about what feels good and help him learn how to touch you.

Make your goal mutual satisfaction. Get the basics right first and then add on variety that is satisfying to both of you.


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## PieceOfSky (Apr 7, 2013)

Honey21 said:


> Ok, I have been reading different posts on this forum and I think compare to most people here, I am more conservative and now I am concerned if it causes a problem n my marriage later.
> 
> I have been with my husband for 6 years, married for 5, we have a 2 year old. I have never experienced oral sex, my husband has insisted on giving it to me but I never let him because I believe its dirty and I have never done it to him except for two occasions when he begged me for hours and I just wanted to shut him up and did it for two minutes and then got tired. We have never done anything other than simple missionary and I do not feel comfortable trying other positions. Lately our sex life has been reduced to once a week if he is lucky even though I am 30 years old and he is 32. I prefer to spend my time reading and watching movies before sleeping and sex just seems like too much work. Mostly I do it so he would leave me alone and I can go back to my book. I realise it is not normal and thought something must be wrong with my hormones but my doctor just brushed it off as normal.
> 
> Lately I have noticed that my husband does not even kiss me anymore and we have drifted apart. I want to fix the problem but I do not know how.



Your story sounds somewhat like my wife's and mine. But, you two have something going for you we did not: You are interested in fixing the problem. Don't let anyone here, or elsewhere, derail your interest and efforts.

I don't mean to scare you, but I think the risk in your marriage is more than you can imagine right now. If he seems withdrawn or avoiding non-sexual intimacy, consider yourself lucky that you notice and want to fix it. Years go by fast, and the distance grows to the point you can no longer see the other as a source for joy, only pain, and awareness of how it all started (if anyone ever had it) is replaced with rationalizations based on now well-worn patterns of dysfunctional behavior.

That's what happened in my marriage. I don't think mine can be saved. But, maybe yours can.

Here are my thoughts and advice, fwiw:

1) Your husband is a fool for not going to therapy. It's not a lifetime commitment. Not even a two-visit commitment. My guess is he is pouting, or, like my wife, is afraid he'll have to face the fact there is something about himself would not feel comfortable about. He doesn't understand what his life is going to become like.

2) You should go to IC (Individual Counseling), probably with a Sex Therapist. If the "Sex" part bothers you, find a female therapist that is good with relationships and communication. Even if she does not help you with the "sex" part specifically, she can help you keep from your growth get derailed by any number of things, including your husband poo-pooing the idea.

There are lots of books about female sexuality. If you're shy about reading them, try anyways.

3) Chances are, your husband is hurt, emotionally, more than you have imagined, by the lack of sex. I don't say that to make you feel bad -- it is, what it is, but it probably IS hurting him very much. It can be such a powerful hurt, and dealt with in such a lonely fashion, that it can be really devastating, especially over a long period of time. I feel like a broken man.

4) It must be hard for your too. I know my wife, back when we both saw it as a "sexual" sort of problem, struggled with self-doubt as a woman, with physical pain from the act itself, stress over the fact that it all used to happen much more easily for her (pleasure, orgasm, drive). And she tried, at times, to find solutions. I shouldn't forget that.

But, her trying, my trying, her suffering, my suffering, and even (my) awareness of the dynamic that was working to drive us apart -- well, it all added up to not enough, I'm afraid.

But I want to emphasize, you have some control over one big troubling aspect of what you both face: your body, your sexuality, your pleasure -- however you want to say it. Whether he drags his feet or not, you can work on you -- so that sexual pleasure comes more naturally to you, and so you know better how to communicate to him and not get stymied by his un-cooperativeness or whatever it is. If you can get your ability to enjoy sex to increase, to where you'd be able to enjoy it more frequently, and then if you offered it to him more frequently, you'd probably melt his heart. (I hear some stories from ladies here on TAM who did manage to somehow change their level of interest and enjoyment, and I think their husbands are the luckiest men in the world.)

I don't know what to tell you about his pestering/horny-guy behavior. From my own (embarassing) experience, I would guess at this point it's a bit of a compulsion for him, one of which he may vaguely be aware of and causes him to dislike himself more each time. (No excuse, especially if you have expressed your displeasure.) If you have it in your power to (privately) look upon those behaviors with pity and compassion, then maybe you two could get beyond them. When he's being a pest requesting sex, consider saying "No, not if you express your interest/horny-ness that way  But, if you want to give me time to take a shower put on something nice, and if you go find some candles and pour us each a glass of wine, I'll give you something you something worth your while." Yes, he's interested in having sex. And, perhaps to you, it is "ALL" he is ever interested from you. But, I assure that's not all. He is interested in having sex with YOU -- and it means something deeper and less "cheap" and "seedy" than you might imagine, if you are only seeing his sophomoric pestering. When you give it to him, lovingly, he feels loved and worthy. When you reject him, especially when your annoyance or disgust is clear, he feels like a loser, not much of a man, and it wears him down.

Things like lubrication, him being set on who finishes first, you faking orgasm, his potential angst over you not reaching orgasm, him touching the clitoris too soon or too much or to often, etc. -- all those seem like relatively straightforward issues to solve, and, please work to solve them -- don't let his discomfort with change or accepting that if he were doing it differently it would work better for you stop you from making progress.

Be kind to yourself. Give him compassion about this, but accept nothing less but compassion from him, as long as you are both working to find solutions to this.

It's a much bigger problem than you could both possibly know. Make it a priority.

That's my opinion anyway. Good luck!


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

Great post but OP is gone I think. Didn't like hearing she's abnormal I guess.


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## Catherine602 (Oct 14, 2010)

WorkingOnMe said:


> Great post but OP is gone I think. Didn't like hearing she's abnormal I guess.


Too bad. It is so counterproductive to chase posters like this lady away. She is doing exactly what many of the men wish their LD wives would do. Recognized her husbands unhappiness and that they need to fix things. 

I don't think she is abnormal. It is not abnormal for a woman not to know her body. It is quite common for men not to know either. Like tis couple, it appears that many couples fail to recognize the possibility of this problem in a woman's disinterest. She may not be LD at all.

It's the elephant in the room. Many studies show that 30 - 40% of married woman are not sexually satisfied and would rather read a book. 

Let's assume she is normal, wants to avoid pain and frustration and has the same need for sexual satisfaction to feel connected as her husband. What harm is there in giving her advice how to attain sexual satisfaction?


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

The problem is if you tell her she's perfectly normal then in her mind its all his problem. He's just a horn dog who expects too much. She doesn't have to try and is justified and indignant. That's why men don't like to give an inch. We know how slippery the slope it and have the rejections and sexlessness memories to prove it to ourselves.


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## Catherine602 (Oct 14, 2010)

WorkingOnMe said:


> The problem is if you tell her she's perfectly normal then in her mind its all his problem. He's just a horn dog who expects too much. She doesn't have to try and is justified and indignant. That's why men don't like to give an inch. We know how slippery the slope it and have the rejections and sexlessness memories to prove it to ourselves.


I dont think that is true. Telling someone that they are abnormal makes them shut down and go away. 

There is no reason to think that every woman who loses interest in sex is abnormal. That's where the trouble often starts. What if the problem is her sexual frustration? 

Is she abnormal for losing interest in something that brings her no pleasure? If exploring female sexual satisfaction in no or low interest in sex solved the problem in 20 - 30% of cases, would giving an inch be worth the investment?


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## PieceOfSky (Apr 7, 2013)

Catherine602 said:


> Telling someone that they are abnormal makes them shut down and go away.


QFT. If more of us saw the truth in that, TAM would help more people.


The last thing someone struggling with an issue needs to hear, when they finally summon the courage or energy or wisdom to reach out, is: YOU ARE BAD AND IT IS ALL YOUR FAULT.

It does not matter whether the one reaching out has any culpability in the situation or not. Hearing one's "badness" is hard for anyone to hear and not lose all momentum towards change.


Blame, shame, guilt -- these all lead to paralysis, even when self-imposed. Especially when still trying to take those first steps towards change.

Seeking to defuse those paralyzing emotions, and focusing attention on what can be changed by someone, regardless of who is to "blame", does not necessarily result in "blameshifting", or vilification of the other. I suppose it can, but in this case OP came here looking for help, and did not seem inclined to think its up to her H to fix this; quite the contrary. Being sensitive to her discomfort in trying to change could only have helped, IMHO.

Btw, I have no idea whether what she described is normal or abnormal, statistically speaking or using common notions of what normal sexuality means. But clearly, their relationship is in danger, and there are some changes they can each try to make, and some here have found ways out of similar situations. That's what I think she needs to hear.


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## Catherine602 (Oct 14, 2010)

I have to add that considering a man a sex maniac or horn dog for loving his wife is calling him abnormal. That is as wrong as calling a woman who is disinterested in sex abnormal.

Starting down that road is just the worst journey to take. We trade insults and where does that lead?


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## johnnycomelately (Oct 30, 2010)

Catherine602 said:


> Too bad. It is so counterproductive to chase posters like this lady away. She is doing exactly what many of the men wish their LD wives would do. Recognized her husbands unhappiness and that they need to fix things.


I felt the same way at the beginning and then she lost me when she started to blame the husband and criticise him for wanting her to have an orgasm etc. 

At the end I felt like she wanted her distaste for sex to be validated as normal, it wasn't so she left.


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## TCSRedhead (Oct 17, 2012)

She asked two direct questions in the title: Am I uptight? Is this normal?

Posters answered. 

It's like asking if these pants make my ass look big and getting upset if someone answers yes. 

Don't ask the question if you're not prepared for positive AND negative responses.


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## ReformedHubby (Jan 9, 2013)

I can't conjure up sympathy for men in her husbands shoes. She has always been uptight about sex. This isn't a bait and switch scenario. Generally speaking the sex fairy doesn't wave a magic wand and change people. It can happen if they are willing, but most people with significant sexual hang ups aren't.


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## techmom (Oct 22, 2012)

ReformedHubby said:


> I can't conjure up sympathy for men in her husbands shoes. She has always been uptight about sex. This isn't a bait and switch scenario. Generally speaking the sex fairy doesn't wave a magic wand and change people. It can happen if they are willing, but most people with significant sexual hang ups aren't.


Maybe the sex fairy appears at the wedding reception ton counteract the effects of the dreaded wedding cake. Right in time for the honeymoon? Maybe that's what these husbands are thinking. Or maybe the word obligation or vows at the wedding?

Maybe the sex fairy would appear at the foot of the bed when the evil refusing LD wife rejects sex for the umpteenth time to hit the wife over the head with her wand and say, "HAVE SEX DAMMIT, FOR YOUR HUBBY'S SAKE!"

- Thus concludes this redition of "What goes through a man's mind when he thinks that sex will be better after marriage with and LD woman who never gave it up with any satisfactory frequency from the beginning."
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## norajane (Feb 7, 2012)

Catherine602 said:


> I don't think she is abnormal. *It is not abnormal for a woman not to know her body.* It is quite common for men not to know either. Like tis couple, it appears that many couples fail to recognize the possibility of this problem in a woman's disinterest. She may not be LD at all.
> 
> It's the elephant in the room. Many studies show that 30 - 40% of married woman are not sexually satisfied and would rather read a book.
> 
> Let's assume she is normal, wants to avoid pain and frustration and has the same need for sexual satisfaction to feel connected as her husband. What harm is there in giving her advice how to attain sexual satisfaction?


I read a statistic somewhere that said only 25% of women have ever looked at their own vaginas, like with a mirror between their legs to really _see _all of it. Even fewer have seen their own vagina in an aroused state.

If that's the case, it seems clear why a lot of women are not feeling true sexual pleasure. Vaginas are almost as mysterious to women as to the men in their lives. 

Contrast that with men whose penises are front and center and within easy reach, both visually and manually. It's a very different mentality to start with.

Add any social or religious influence that makes a girl/woman think her vagina is off-limits and/or "dirty" or that sex is "dirty" and it's a recipe for repression and inhibition.


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## PieceOfSky (Apr 7, 2013)

TCSRedhead said:


> She asked two direct questions in the title: Am I uptight? Is this normal?
> 
> Posters answered.
> 
> ...


*It's not like that at all.* 

I guess you see our purpose here quite differently than me. The goal to me is to help people change for the better, not to insist that they endure my judgement, even when my judgement has been directly asked for.

She asked here two questions, she heard the "negative" answers from some that said "Yes. No.", and very clearly was prepared for hearing those responses. Then as folks started questioning her honesty and intentions, she stayed focused on wanting to learn more -- accepting that the "negative" was accurate -- yet, you do not seem to give her any credit for that:




Honey21 said:


> Perhaps this is how it sounds but the reality is we have sex, its just not as it is in movies and books, but this website is full of real people, and normally I do not talk about my sex life to anyone, so this is the first time I am actually talking about it. At the moment sex seems like a chore I do not like much ( when I am half way into it, I kind of enjoy it) but its not something I choose to do because there are other things I prefer to do instead like reading. *I assumed it was kind of normal* considering every one is different and we have a 2 year old and at night I am tired and prefer to relax,*but I see people on this forum who believe otherwise. I want to know what I can do to change this*


But, you seemed to miss that (how or why I do not understand) because you went on to say:



TCSRedhead said:


> What type of help are you seeking? To answer your original questions, you are uptight and this is not normal.
> 
> What is it you want from here? Help on establishing intimacy *or help in justifying remaining celibate in a marriage*?


Maybe you simply posted before you got to see her intervening responses? In any case, kind of a destructive put down, since she had just said, basically "I see that my assumptions might have been wrong. How can I change?"

The post asking if she was wanting help in justifying remaining celibate in a marriage was in response to this:



Honey21 said:


> It is hard enough for people like me to talk about their problem without judgement and silly accusations of people like you. I don have time for trolling on the internet, I am an educated person and I actually joined this forum because I thought it could help me.


Yet, in that post of hers she quite obviously was responding to this (obvious, since she quoted it):



jeepgirl29 said:


> Because it's a troll.



So, I think she was more open-minded and willing to own whatever she needed to own in her situation than many people here -- and more than you give her credit for. If she left this thread, we don't know why, but I wouldn't be surprised if it was the noise and negativity inappropriately thrown at her.


Btw, if someone asks if that someone's pants make their ass look fat, folks should be free to say yes or no. But, it might help to refocus the inquiry on something more helpful. 

But, what about something like this -- is it helpful?:

"Yes.", and "It's not just your pants that make your ass look fat, it is your ass that makes your ass look fat."
"Your ass looks fat because you've been doing it all wrong -- you eat too much and you don't excercise. Maybe you just don't care enough."
Btw, your spouse probably really hates the fatness of your ass, and you know what, don't be surprised if he hates you for it." 
 "Maybe you are just lazy. That's why you're so fat."
"Why did you marry him if you knew you were going to let your ass get fat after you had kids -- that was VERY selfish of you! 

That would seem a bit uncalled for. And, not helpful for the one asking about the pants. And, perhaps, designed to make the responder feel better about the responder's spouse's pants situation -- dunno. Wish it wouldn't happen though.


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## PieceOfSky (Apr 7, 2013)

norajane said:


> I read a statistic somewhere that said only 25% of women have ever looked at their own vaginas, like with a mirror between their legs to really _see _all of it. Even fewer have seen their own vagina in an aroused state.
> 
> If that's the case, it seems clear why a lot of women are not feeling true sexual pleasure. Vaginas are almost as mysterious to women as to the men in their lives.
> 
> ...



Reminds me of a scene from the movie Fried Green Tomatoes, the "Women's Strength Class". I can't find a clip that will play, but here's a bit of a description from one I found that fails to play:


Uploaded on October 29, 2011 by AnyClip 
The clip women's strenth class from Fried Green Tomatoes (1991) with Kathy Bates

During these next few weeks,
we will be learning to reclaim our own power as women!
Hallelujah!
And tonight, we're gonna begin to explore...
our own femaleness...
by examining the source of our strength...
and our separateness.
Our vaginas.
So if y'all will just slip off your panties...
and straddle your mirrors.
Ms. Couch!
Ms. Couch!
Um, I need to be excused for a minute.
Um, Missy, could you come with me to the ladies' room?
Do you find this threatening?
Uh, well, um...
do you have a problem with your sexuality? No, ma'am.
But I do have a problem with my girdle.

Tags:Fried Green Tomatoes, Women's Strenth Class, Kathy Bates, AnyClip, Entertainment​


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## TCSRedhead (Oct 17, 2012)

PieceOfSky said:


> *It's not like that at all.*
> 
> I guess you see our purpose here quite differently than me. The goal to me is to help people change for the better, not to insist that they endure my judgement, even when my judgement has been directly asked for.
> 
> ...


What part of the post you quotes did you see as a put down? I am asking questions to gain clarity on what the OP is looking for? 

Do you always project this much?


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## PieceOfSky (Apr 7, 2013)

TCSRedhead said:


> What part of the post you quotes did you see as a put down? I am asking questions to gain clarity on what the OP is looking for?


The part I bolded when I quoted, 



TCSRedhead said:


> What type of help are you seeking? To answer your original questions, you are uptight and this is not normal.
> 
> What is it you want from here? Help on establishing intimacy *or help in justifying remaining celibate in a marriage?*


To be clear, I said "_*kind of* a destructive_ put down", and acknowledged that you might have simply missed some intervening posts (where she had clearly stated that she was looking for help to change):



PieceOfSky said:


> Maybe you simply posted before you got to see her intervening responses? In any case, kind of a destructive put down, since she had just said, basically "I see that my assumptions might have been wrong. How can I change?"


But, in fairness to you, I should have explicitly stated that your question was not necessarily meant as a put down. (For that matter, perhaps she did not hear it as a put down.) What I should have said was:

_I think that asking if she was seeking help in "justifying remaining celibate in a marriage" could be seen, by her, as denying the truthfulness of her statement that she was indeed seeking to change.​_
I will take you at your word that you did not mean that as a put down. I apologize for not making it clear that you might have simply been "looking for clarity on what the OP is looking for."




TCSRedhead said:


> Do you always project this much?


I do not see projection here. But of course, if I am projecting, then it might be hard for me to see it. If you or anyone cares to clarify how I might be projecting, please send me a PM or start a thread to discuss my projections. As far as "always" -- feel free to read my old posts and let me know.



All that said, I still believe the OP came here for help, had the courage to listen to those who told her she was not "normal" and then ask for help to change herself, but was treated poorly by some in a way that might have chased her away. If so, her and her husband's marriage missed a chance for help.


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## johnnycomelately (Oct 30, 2010)

PieceOfSky said:


> All that said, I still believe the OP came here for help, had the courage to listen to those who told her she was not "normal" and then ask for help to change herself, but was treated poorly by some in a way that might have chased her away. If so, her and her husband's marriage missed a chance for help.


The OP needed to be told the truth. It is not normal and it is not acceptable to destroy the self-esteem of your partner and then imply that it is his fault. 

She got the truth and that is not what she wanted.


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## Catherine602 (Oct 14, 2010)

johnnycomelately said:


> The OP needed to be told the truth. It is not normal and it is not acceptable to destroy the self-esteem of your partner and then imply that it is his fault.
> 
> She got the truth and that is not what she wanted.


She was asking much more than that. Did you not read it in her questions and responses? Read the thread again and see if you can see the underlying questions. 

I remember the first time I read "To Kill a Mockingbird" It was in the summer that I turned 9 yo. Loved the book. reread it many times. 

Each time I read it, cant believe it is the same book. Where did the new imagery and meaning come from I wonder. The subtle nearly transparent colors I missed, how did it happen. 

I think communication is like that, especially written communication. There are many layers, some are not worth peeling away but others are worth many read throughs and thoughtful considerations. 

This thread has the elements of a good book. not a great one but good. It has all the players - a veritable Tales of Hoffmann with a villain or two, damsels, a couple of vixens, teachers and students and heroes too. But who is who????


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## johnnycomelately (Oct 30, 2010)

Catherine602 said:


> She was asking much more than that. Did you not read it in her questions and responses? Read the thread again and see if you can see the underlying questions.
> 
> I remember the first time I read "To Kill a Mockingbird" It was in the summer that I turned 9 yo. Loved the book. reread it many times.
> 
> ...


I find it hard to see her posts as great literature, especially considering she doesn't know the difference between 'lose' and 'loose'. 

I see a woman determined to blame her problems on her long suffering partner, looking to find validation on TAM and flouncing out when she didn't get it.


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## PieceOfSky (Apr 7, 2013)

johnnycomelately said:


> The OP needed to be told the truth. It is not normal and it is not acceptable to destroy the self-esteem of your partner and then imply that it is his fault.
> 
> She got the truth and that is not what she wanted.


Where did she imply it was his fault?


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## Catherine602 (Oct 14, 2010)

johnnycomelately said:


> I find it hard to see her posts as great literature, especially considering she doesn't know the difference between 'lose' and 'loose'.
> 
> I see a woman determined to blame her problems on her long suffering partner, looking to find validation on TAM and flouncing out when she didn't get it.


You misread my post. It was not meant to be taken literally as literature. I was alluding to the thread in it's entirety not just her post. The creative writing remark was hyperbolic to make a point. Not too effectively as it happens. 

What I meant was that the thread in its entirety took a classic and predictable TAM turn. Like formula pulp fiction - the struggle between good and evil. 

She is a blood sucking she-devil with a taste for good men. He is the tragic hero, a bright star in the firmament. He sounds like a good man so he may be just that. She does not sound quite so bad. Let us suspend our disbelief for the sake of art. 

Besides I said it was good not great literature. I see you are a stickler for exactitude so I thought I'd point that out. 

I inadvertently make many of the same errors in spelling and word usage, I won't comment about that.


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## johnnycomelately (Oct 30, 2010)

PieceOfSky said:


> Where did she imply it was his fault?


Here are two examples:


Honey21 said:


> I think what adds to problem and makes me not want to even be close to him is that he asks for sex all the time





Honey21 said:


> Also I was wondering if anyone else has this problem, when we have sex, he insists on me having an orgasm before he gets off himself


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## PieceOfSky (Apr 7, 2013)

johnnycomelately said:


> Here are two examples:


Can you provide any more? I am not trying to be dense, but am honestly wondering if you see any more.


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## johnnycomelately (Oct 30, 2010)

PieceOfSky said:


> Can you provide any more? I am not trying to be dense, but am honestly wondering if you see any more.


No.


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## techmom (Oct 22, 2012)

PieceOfSky said:


> Can you provide any more? I am not trying to be dense, but am honestly wondering if you see any more.


If those are the only 2 examples you got, then they are not clearly showing her blaming him for her lack of libido. Those are shown as examples of where he could have ccontributed to the problem. Trying to bring someone to orgasm when they are not in the mood is seen as pressure to an LD. She is having sex for his benefit, and would rather not reject him. 

She did, however, seek advice to her problem and got blasted as all other LDs do when they come on these boards. Then we are put in a position of having to defend ourselves while trying to take the good advice and separate them from the all out rants. She was chased off the board.

Then some HDs say "See, she just wasn't validated for her LD so she left". If she wanted to be validated she would have never come on here seeking advice in the first place.

Some of you need to save that rage and use it in a constructive manner.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## johnnycomelately (Oct 30, 2010)

techmom said:


> If those are the only 2 examples you got, then they are not clearly showing her blaming him for her lack of libido. Those are shown as examples of where he could have ccontributed to the problem. Trying to bring someone to orgasm when they are not in the mood is seen as pressure to an LD. She is having sex for his benefit, and would rather not reject him.
> 
> She did, however, seek advice to her problem and got blasted as all other LDs do when they come on these boards. Then we are put in a position of having to defend ourselves while trying to take the good advice and separate them from the all out rants. She was chased off the board.
> 
> ...


The two examples she gave of him 'contributing' to the problem are examples of normal behaviour among loving partners.



techmom said:


> Then some HDs say "See, she just wasn't validated for her LD so she left". If she wanted to be validated she would have never come on here seeking advice in the first place.


You know as well as I do that there are those that come here looking for validation, whether it is for infidelity or as in this case looking for justification to avoid seeking real professional help for a problem that will eventually destroy her marriage. You can't blame people for telling it how it is. Telling her she is normal is unfair on her.



techmom said:


> Some of you need to save that rage and use it in a constructive manner.


You must be talking about other posters. I showed no rage, I gave honest advice.


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## techmom (Oct 22, 2012)

She came here for advice, not to be critized for having low desire. 2 different things. When you go to the doctor for a backache, you go there to get help and healing, you wouldn't want him to be like "Your fault now get out of my office". What you see as advice may sound like outright bashing.

Although this is a public internet forum, it is a place where people can vent and get advice from people in similar situations. Evidently there are way more HDs than LDs, so I take exception to the harsh treatment. You may feel that she deserves it because she is a refuser, which is the lowest form of life on these boards. You may be projecting or not. My point is, in order to see where your refusing spouse is coming from it may be constructive to listen to those LD posts without the automatic knee-jerk reaction. 

Rants sometimes get passed as "honesty" on these threads, but the ranters may not like it if the tables were turned and LDs ranted as well.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## john_lord_b3 (Jan 11, 2013)

johnnycomelately said:


> The OP needed to be told the truth. It is not normal and it is not acceptable to destroy the self-esteem of your partner and then imply that it is his fault.
> 
> She got the truth and that is not what she wanted.


After done reading the entire thread, I understand what you meant. 

But, I need to defend fellow LDs a bit  You see, sometimes us LDs need to be told the opposing point of view in a way we could understand. Or came to the realization by ourselves. So this is not necessarily because LDs are all selfish or all evil. It's the matter of whether they love their partners enough to make serious efforts to understand, OR to seek for answers by themselves. 

Some, like Mrs. GettingIt, has been successful in seeking the answers and now reaping the rewards. But not all of us succeeded to seek a mutually acceptable solution. Sometimes an LD are very successful in building a fortification of justification that no opposing views could breach through. Undoubtedly, for these LDs it is much easier to find fault on their partners or on HDs than to find answers from within. But I am certain that this kind of LD does not exceed even 50% of all LD population (that's another way to say "not all of us are like that).


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## johnnycomelately (Oct 30, 2010)

techmom said:


> She came here for advice, not to be critized for having low desire.


She shouldn't be criticised for low desire, but she should for her response. Shifting the blame and avoiding getting real help is bad for everyone involved.



techmom said:


> you wouldn't want him to be like "Your fault now get out of my office".


Nor would you want him to say 'it's perfectly normal, go home and it will all be fine'.

Besides you are talking about the OP being LD, she's not. She doesn't like sex. My wife is relatively LD but she likes sex and we don't have a problem. The OP is sexually dysfunctional and telling her she is normal is irresponsible. No need to attack her, that is just cruel...but so is lying to her.


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## MarriedManInHis40s (Mar 28, 2013)

I'm not even sure what the OP meant by "normal".

"Normal" as in "common"? Yes, it might be.
"Normal" as in "innate and unchangeable?" Perhaps.
"Normal" as in, "something I don't need to do anything about"? You should at least try to do something about it via counselling or otherwise, if you want a happy marriage.
"Normal" as in "my husband should just learn to live with it?". That's up to your husband and nobody else when all is said and done, but he'll probably be miserable,and if that's your attitude don't be surprised if he leaves you (and it sounds like the the thought has already crossed his mind... he's already wondering if he could have a happier marriage with someone else.) There's a reason that 50% of marriages end in divorce.

I thought some of the responses to the OP were a bit harsh, but if you come to a forum like this you need to be ready to hear helpful advice delivered in a constructive manner, even if it's not what you wanted to hear.


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## nogutsnoglory (Jan 17, 2013)

ScarletBegonias said:


> You're trying to make every thing into a math problem or equal numbers problem. I'm not talking about numbers I'm talking about a state of mind for fairness. everyone has to give and it starts by realizing your needs aren't more important than the needs of your partner...then each relationship has to work out their own little number problem keeping that in mind.
> Currently, the way people talk,no one gives even an inch. It's either the HD partner is doing all the compromising for the LD partner or the LD does all the compromising for the HD. There is no give and take.


the need to have sex is just that "a need" the need to not have sex is not "a need" it is "an Issue". She has to work on the issue she has and that will lead her to meeting more of his needs. They are married and he deserves sexual relations frequently. The term frequent is defined differently for all, but if the one you are married to is not happy in this area, eventually they will "get happy" elsewhere. Work hard on your issue, is my recommendation. Stop lying to him and yes faking is lying to him. If he learned you are faking it would devastate him, so cut it out. Go talk to professionals and get the needed help, but stop lying. You are not doing it for his benefit, only your own, do not kid your self. Good Luck


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## bewilderness (Jun 11, 2013)

Would he be willing to read erotic/romantic stories to you or with you? Would watching a romantic or sexy movie together help? I think it is interesting that you have an active fantasy life but have trouble with reality because it is not "like the books/movies." It never will be unless you invite a film crew and a director into your bedroom.  Fantasy is okay, but there's nothing like the real thing.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## ScarletBegonias (Jun 26, 2012)

OP hasn't logged on since 6/30 and she hasn't commented here in over 3 pages I believe.


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## TCSRedhead (Oct 17, 2012)

ScarletBegonias said:


> OP hasn't logged on since 6/30 and she hasn't commented here in over 3 pages I believe.


Yes but we must continue to debate this dead thread!!!!! :rofl:


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## nogutsnoglory (Jan 17, 2013)

johnnycomelately said:


> I felt the same way at the beginning and then she lost me when she started to blame the husband and criticise him for wanting her to have an orgasm etc.
> 
> At the end I felt like she wanted her distaste for sex to be validated as normal, it wasn't so she left.


I agree


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## nogutsnoglory (Jan 17, 2013)

techmom said:


> If those are the only 2 examples you got, then they are not clearly showing her blaming him for her lack of libido. Those are shown as examples of where he could have ccontributed to the problem. Trying to bring someone to orgasm when they are not in the mood is seen as pressure to an LD. She is having sex for his benefit, and would rather not reject him.
> 
> She did, however, seek advice to her problem and got blasted as all other LDs do when they come on these boards. Then we are put in a position of having to defend ourselves while trying to take the good advice and separate them from the all out rants. She was chased off the board.
> 
> ...


I agree with parts of both sides. Let me say this though. Woman need to be relaxed and typically emotionally connected to want sex. Men need sex for validation which relaxes them. So men ask for sex, and the woman says she is not in the mood or what ever the rejection. Man loses opportunity to feel his need fulfilled and there fore will not wish to engage emotionally which will not allow the woman to relax and work up to the mood. 
Women- please hear me - talk to your husbands, they do not understand this concept of a need to relax and be emotionally connected. You need this in order to be open sexually and they need you to be open sexually. Since woman are the emotional initiators in a relationship, why do you get a free pass when the topic is sex. Speak up to your man. If I had known 14 years ago that coming home and doing laundry and starting her a bath was the key to unlocking her pants I would have done 2 million loads of laundry and started a bath every night for 14 years. She never told me a thing about the key to her needs being met. Every time I asked for sex I was telling her my need. She just thought I just wanted to get laid. No, I wanted to feel wanted, needed, I wanted my ego stroked. Sex does that for men. You know what he needs to do for you to relax you and you know you need to be relaxed to be in the mood. All you need to know about him is he needs sex from you so help him out with a key to the panties please.


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## john_lord_b3 (Jan 11, 2013)

TCSRedhead said:


> Yes but we must continue to debate this dead thread!!!!! :rofl:


Most of the posters here, including you Mrs. RedHead, has good posts, so to continue reading good posts, I think the discussion could be diverted to other, more general threads about, such as this one:

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/sex-marriage/93290-what-hard-working-husband-worth.html


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