# Their cheating is NOT your fault!



## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

I have said this before, but it does bear repeating. 

No matter what problems are/were happening in your marriage, they are 100% responsible for their decision to cheat.


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## kristin2349 (Sep 12, 2013)

I think some things bear repeating MattMatt!


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

*I hear you, Matt. And I believe you!

But what tears my guts up, even to this very day, is to have been so totally in love and committed to someone, seeing that in being so heartlessly blindsided from the resulting betrayal is so much akin to a death sentence, and it so resolutely destroys, not only your trust in your former partner, but largely with any other potential partner that might perhaps try to come into my heart later!

It just seems to be sheer disaster for all involved!

Their cheating may well not be our fault, but it sure as hell seems that we're the one's destined to pay for it!*


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## Hurtin_Still (Oct 3, 2011)

arbitrator said:


> I hear you, Matt. And I believe you!
> 
> But what tears my guts up even to this day, is to be so totally in love and committed to someone, that the resulting betrayal is much akin to a death sentence, and it so resolutely destroys not only your trust in your former partner, but largely with any other potential partner that might perhaps try to come into my heart later!
> 
> It just seems to be sheer disaster for all involved!


.....I'll even go as far as to say that your ability to put ANY kind of trust in ANYONE ...goes in the trash ....regardless if they are a romantic interest ...or business interest. It's like you are perpetually looking over your shoulder, around corners, and behind doors.


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## sammy3 (Jun 5, 2011)

My husband keeps telling me I had nothing to do with it, but when he adds, "You((me)) just didnt give me ((him)) the closeness I ((he)) ask for," sure makes you feel like it was all your fault.

~sammy


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## Philat (Sep 12, 2013)

sammy3 said:


> My husband keeps telling me I had nothing to do with it, but when he adds, "You((me)) just didnt give me ((him)) the closeness I ((he)) ask for," sure makes you feel like it was all your fault.
> 
> ~sammy


It's the rare WS who doesn't have some kind of "but..." attached to their remorse.


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## Vega (Jan 8, 2013)

MattMatt said:


> I have said this before, but it does bear repeating.
> 
> No matter what problems are/were happening in your marriage, they are 100% responsible for their decision to cheat.


Yes, and I think the major reason WHY it's not the BS's fault is because the WS always-- *ALWAYS*-- had OTHER OPTIONS besides cheating. 

Vega


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## hopefulgirl (Feb 12, 2013)

Philat said:


> It's the rare WS who doesn't have some kind of "but..." attached to their remorse.


There's ALWAYS a big but, isn't there? 

My take on it is no matter where on the continuum of how perfect a marriage there might have been going on prior to the A (and of course, there is no perfect marriage), most WS's will find it wanting prior, during, and especially after the A. And while many of us BS's will agree that there WERE problems, there is often a significant disconnect in terms of how WE saw what was going on.

Shirley Glass in her book NOT Just Friends notes that many WS's were actually "overbenefited" in their marriages - they were in unbalanced relationships and were the ones who were not giving ENOUGH. But WS's whose view of things is that they want more, more, more just aren't satisfied - THEY have "issues" and seek attention, flattery, ego boost, blah, blah, blah from someone who hasn't had to deal with all their foibles and less than admirable qualities. (Such as: she never had him start a debate with her about why he shouldn't necessarily be the one to take out the garbage.)

I think it's very hard for people who have strayed to see things through our eyes. They told themselves things so many times that it became "real" and it distorts history. I've had to show him text messages to remind my husband about the lovey-dovey things he was saying to me during his affair; he remembers pulling away from me, and yes that was going on, but he was sending mixed messages too, and he forgets about that. Not to mention having sex! Unprotected, just like he was having it with the OW! Grrr....


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## helpandadvice (Sep 13, 2013)

It is never anyone else's fault for someone cheating. The marriage could have been bad or in my case the normal everyday issues couples have. It is only there fault because they could have handled it a million different ways and it was their choice to do what they did. It is not a disease they have no control over, but is a choice.

It is that simple and I have learned that over months of counseling that I did alone. The ex wife stopped after 3 sessions.


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## bartendersfriend (Oct 14, 2013)

Agreed... 100 percent choice. Sometimes it can be hard to know if the marriage was lacking or got worse because of the cheating. That's the choice they make... to drive you away (or further away) for their own selfish desires. Cheating is a choice, that's why I can be 100 percent sure I will never do it.


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## Rugs (Apr 12, 2013)

Thank goodness I never felt responsible. Never did and never will.

I was most defiantly surprised. I really felt I chose a very moral person who shared my feelings and beliefs. I will never overcome what was hidden from me. I know I will never fully trust anyone again in any type of relationship. 

People are very strange indeed.


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## heartbroken0426 (Dec 4, 2013)

hopefulgirl said:


> Shirley Glass in her book NOT Just Friends notes that many WS's were actually "overbenefited" in their marriages - they were in unbalanced relationships and were the ones who were not giving ENOUGH. But WS's whose view of things is that they want more, more, more just aren't satisfied - THEY have "issues" and seek attention, flattery, ego boost, blah, blah, blah from someone who hasn't had to deal with all their foibles and less than admirable qualities.


This fits my STBXH to a tee. I always supported him, encouraged him, boosted his ego, did everything. What did he do? Go have an affair with a woman in another state that boosts his ego and makes him feel good. He did nothing for me but took everything from me.


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## Married but Happy (Aug 13, 2013)

Agreed. But that doesn't mean the BS doesn't often have their own faults. It may not be "politically correct" to point this out, but truth knows no politics.


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## Allen_A (Nov 18, 2013)

I find it interesting that most people with other kinds of individually destructive behaviors are asked to own them. It's convention for the individual to own it and resolve that.

But for some reason infidelity is conventionally touted as a marital issue.

Infidelity is not a marital issue, it's an impulse control issue and a maturity issue.

Consuming Alcohol to excess
Drug Use
Shopping to excess (financial bankruptcy and credit card maxing)
Online gambling the family finances away
Porn addiction
Anger mismanagement and Violence

THESE types of things conventionally are accounted as owned by an individual, but for some ridiculous reason if you have an AFFAIR it's a marital issue?

Sorry, I am not buying it.

I think this is why people try to blame the marital problems for the affair, it's conventional to do so!

What i don't get is why an affair is a marital issue rather than an individual issue to begin with. The betrayed spouse does not even know it's happening!

How can you blame someone for something they dont' even know is going on??? lol


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## Allen_A (Nov 18, 2013)

They should have not called it an affair or infidelity, it should be called

Sexual/Romantic impulse control issues.

THAT is an individually phrased problem and might clean the confusion up!

You didn't have an affair, you have sexual impulse control issues! That has nothing to do with your betrayed spouse.


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## browneyes74 (Sep 1, 2013)

Shirley Glass in her book NOT Just Friends notes that many WS's were actually "overbenefited" in their marriages - they were in unbalanced relationships and were the ones who were not giving ENOUGH. But WS's whose view of things is that they want more, more, more just aren't satisfied - THEY have "issues" and seek attention, flattery, ego boost, blah, blah, blah from someone who hasn't had to deal with all their foibles and less than admirable qualities. 

I think this "over benefited" idea has some truth to it..I do, in some ways, believe that I let my H think he could do ANYTHING and I would love him forever.. 

Imagine his horror and betrayal when I found out he was fooling around and *gasp* didn't believe his lies.. AND, I said, that's it, I want a divorce.. 

*I* promised to love him forever. *I* promised to always be there for him. *I* never told him that I would stop trusting him if he kept lying to me.. 

It's all *MY* fault.. 


And, in some ways, he's right. I always did say I loved him unconditionally.. But, I thought that "don't put your d*ck in other people" was kind of a given.. 

My bad...


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## illwill (Feb 21, 2013)

My ex said "I thought you loved me enough to forgive me." I told her " I thought you loved me enough not to cheat, and knew id divorce you if you did. I guess we were both wrong."


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## Mr Blunt (Jul 18, 2012)

> *By Browneyes*
> And, in some ways, he's right. I always did say I loved him unconditionally.. But, I thought that "don't put your d*ck in other people" was kind of a given..
> 
> My bad...


Browneyes, You are buying into a false guilt.

If your husband cheated and is using the excuse that you said that you would love him unconditionally, then he is a huge cop-out and he is a punk!
Even a junior high student has better lame excuses


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## Mr Blunt (Jul 18, 2012)

> *By Arbitrator*
> I hear you, Matt. And I believe you!
> 
> But what tears my guts up, even to this very day, is to have been so totally in love and committed to someone, seeing that in being so heartlessly blindsided from the resulting betrayal is so much *akin to a death *sentence, and it so resolutely *destroys,* not only your trust in your former partner, but largely with any other potential partner that might perhaps try to come into my heart later!
> ...


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## Oldrandwisr (Jun 22, 2013)

Definitely worth repeating. We get caught off guard sometimes with the WS incriminating us for a damaged relationship as though we played a part in the ultimate betrayal. No WS has given a good enough reason yet when the other option was to fix it or end it if they are not happy.

Most reconciliations require the realization that the marriage has changed forever. The BS understands this right away, but why is it the WS seems to think everything can go back to normal with expectations the marriage will be like it was before the affair after a short while?


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## disconnected (May 30, 2013)

So far I have "liked" everything on this thread.

WH said that it was my fault that he became 'emotionally connected' to OW. For her part, OW was always/always 'flattering' WH, and she had even made 'flattering' comments to me on occasions ... for example "You are so beautiful and young looking - you look like you are in your 20s" ... YEAH RIGHT!! (OW made this comment when I was 63 !! how ridiculous is that .... )

WH just couldn't withstand such flattery ... with the end result that he is now desperately in love with OW.

And he still says that it is my fault ... 

Reading this thread has made me feel much better ... it is ALWAYS good to know what others are enduring ... it always helps to be able to identify with others on TAM/CWI.

THANK YOU everyone for making your comments.

I have finally realised that WH has had too much influence over me over the past few years. But now, I feel I am getting stronger each day, and the 'plunging' moods aren't as prevalent, though they still come from nowhere some days.

Of course I am at fault in some respects, but it was mainly through working long hours, and some stress at work (ie bullying in the workplace). Added to that, I could sense a distance between WH and me - but whenever I asked him whether we were "ok", he would just brush it off, say that all was fine, and not to ask that question again.

Most of my strength is coming from TAM/CWI.


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## hopefulgirl (Feb 12, 2013)

Married but Happy said:


> Agreed. But that doesn't mean the BS doesn't often have their own faults. It may not be "politically correct" to point this out, but truth knows no politics.


Political correctness has nothing to do with it.

I don't see any point in posting this here. :scratchhead:

You've stated elsewhere on TAM that you have an open marriage. The title of this thread is "Their cheating is NOT your fault!" so the purpose is obviously to give SUPPORT to BS's. So why do you feel this is the place for you, someone who's OK with the idea of your spouse having sex with other people, to post about the faults of BETRAYED Spouses - people who are NOT OK with the idea of their spouses having sex with other people?

Nobody's going to say that there's a BS who has no faults. Just doesn't make any sense - why would someone like you, who's neither a BS or WS, feel the need to make a point about our faults here, on this particular thread? The one titled, "Their cheating is NOT your fault!"


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## disconnected (May 30, 2013)

Married but Happy said:


> Agreed. But that doesn't mean the BS doesn't often have their own faults. It may not be "politically correct" to point this out, but truth knows no politics.


Of course the BS has faults ... but in my situation, WH was quite happy to be "unhappy" for over 20 years, apparently ... 

Reason for such a lengthy term of unhappiness is that I was working for an organisation where I would be transferred overseas every two or three years for a three year term. WH would accompany me as a 'trailing spouse'. WH really enjoyed living in other countries, and being able to pursue his own interests during those times.

As soon as I became the trailing spouse two years ago, I sensed a change ... and BINGO, I was right!! (unfortunately ...)


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

disconnected said:


> So far I have "liked" everything on this thread.
> 
> WH said that it was my fault that he became 'emotionally connected' to OW. For her part, OW was always/always 'flattering' WH, and she had even made 'flattering' comments to me on occasions ... for example "You are so beautiful and young looking - you look like you are in your 20s" ... YEAH RIGHT!! (OW made this comment when I was 63 !! how ridiculous is that .... )
> 
> ...


She was over egging the pudding just a little. You looked 45, tops.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## OhGeesh (Jan 5, 2010)

MattMatt said:


> I have said this before, but it does bear repeating.
> 
> No matter what problems are/were happening in your marriage, they are 100% responsible for their decision to cheat.


While I agree in the most legal free will definition of that I think it's stupid to think of it that way.

If you are a sucky spouse, got fat, lazy, drink alot, not fun, grumpy, selfish, etc etc and don't change don't assume everything is honky dorry!!

That goes both ways 

I'm always trying to spoil, love, build up, put the freak down, and make my wife happy! Not only because I love her, but because she is beautiful and guys hit on her like every other pretty woman and I don't want to give her a reason to go look around temptation alone is strong enough already.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

Allen_A said:


> They should have not called it an affair or infidelity, it should be called
> 
> Sexual/Romantic impulse control issues.
> 
> ...


*So wouldn't it just be far easier if we, as a society, just had the verbiage of modern day wedding vows changed from, "forsaking all others, keeping yourself only unto them, for as long as you both shall live" to "only until sexual-romantic impulse overtakes you."

It would make far few liars out of those who choose to go down the wayward path!*


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## melw74 (Dec 12, 2013)

A cheater is 100% responsible, It is their thought, and nobody else's either.

I really cant understand why people do it. I mean if your not happy with the one your with, then leave simple as that and do them a favour, Why do people feel the need to stay with somebody **** all over them, come back sleep with them, while sneaking off behind their back when they feel like it to the other person.... Leaving the BS thinking everything is hunky dory, sorry, but it gets me so angry.

Nobody deserves it.... Ever. People always have an excuse to why they do it, but there really is none, apart from them being a very selfish, uncaring..........( swear words).

A man does not accidentally put his Penis in another, and a woman does not lay down, and accidentally let a man put his penis in her.

You know what your doing, everybody has a choice, Its up to them to make the right ones.

I mean, My older 3 boys dad cheated on me, I found out it blew my world apart, and i threw him out, he was probably doing it a lot longer, Maybe all the way through our 7 year relationship. I made a promise to myself i would never put another through what i went through, I never felt pain like it, why would i want to inflict that on someone else.???.

Sorry, but i have no sympathy for a cheater at all. No matter what the BS may have done, they do not deserve that, I believe that there are other ways to sort your problems out, cheating is never the answer.

If you feel your being treated badly, your not getting enough sex, you feel lonely, then tell the person, do something about it, work out the issues...... you do not have to make the CHOICE to cheat.

Of course i do have something to be thankful to my ex for My 3 handsome, loving boys, that i have brought up, and my husband for the last 10 years.

Also i now have my wonderful hubby, who would never cheat on me, People say you cant say you know a 100% your spouse wont cheat, well i DO i can assure you of that......

Hes the most nicest man i have ever met, I would rather die than cheat on him too.

I also want to say, and sorry if i offend, but I cant stand open marriages, I mean why would you want to be in one, why the hell do you marry for????

The thought of my husband having sex with another makes me feel physically sick!!!!

Its just a way of being able to sleep around, and get away with it, and not have to feel bad, nor worry about having a guilty conscious.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

bartendersfriend said:


> Agreed... 100 percent choice. Sometimes it can be hard to know if the marriage was lacking or got worse because of the cheating. That's the choice they make... to drive you away (or further away) for their own selfish desires. *Cheating is a choice, that's why I can be 100 percent sure I will never do it.*


Exactly what I thought. Until I did.


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## Stonewall (Jul 5, 2011)

OhGeesh said:


> While I agree in the most legal free will definition of that I think it's stupid to think of it that way.
> 
> If you are a sucky spouse, got fat, lazy, drink alot, not fun, grumpy, selfish, etc etc and don't change don't assume everything is honky dorry!!
> 
> ...


Incoming!!!!!!!!


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## Married but Happy (Aug 13, 2013)

hopefulgirl said:


> Political correctness has nothing to do with it.
> 
> I don't see any point in posting this here. :scratchhead:
> 
> ...


My open marriage is irrelevant to this discussion. It is still possible to cheat in an open relationship, because there are still boundaries we've agreed to respect. You also forget that I was in a 25 year monogamous relationship where I didn't cheat, despite my ex having broken her vows, including an EA near the end. I left her. I wasn't perfect, of course, but I honestly tried. If she had tried too, it might have been different, or I could have figured out what to do better. That's still not the point. I have known couples where one cheated, and often, the BS has created some of the conditions that made the temptation to cheat easier to succumb to.

Cheating is the ultimate betrayal in a relationship. Most also see it as breaking vows. I am pointing out that often (by no means always) the BS has already broken vows (or at least the normal expectations of marriage) as well - just not to this level.


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## OhGeesh (Jan 5, 2010)

Regarding the open marriage it is hard to do no doubt about it. I've known a few that travelled that realm well for many years, but all have since broken up or gotten divorced.

What happens usually is someone get's hooked. The last married couple the "wife" got hooked. So, fun time became too frequent she was sneaking off to meet him breaking the rules that made it work for so many years.

The husband started to feel very secondary. It's one thing to have a "fun date" once a month. It's something else to be having fun dates 2-3 times a week.

Best of luck to the poster in a open marriage btw


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## Married but Happy (Aug 13, 2013)

2ntnuf said:


> Did an open marriage help you cope with the pain of physical infidelity from your previous marriage?
> 
> I'm not going to lie. I have contemplated this for a while. I personally don't believe I could do it, but it seems that the less important the physical part of a relationship is, the less it would hurt when it is discovered.


My first marriage was completely monogamous, not open, and she had an EA, not PA. By that time the marriage was dead, IMO, just waiting for a good time to bury it. I wasn't very upset by the EA - I had no feelings left for her by that time.

New marriage, new person, shared attitudes, new mutually agreeable rules - this time, everything far exceeds my hopes and expectations for a great marriage with a wonderful partner. We have to communicate extremely well to make this work, and have to be aware of and in tune with each other's feelings, wants, and desires. IMO, the most harmful attitude in any marriage is to take each other for granted. My ex did.

I would still be as hurt as anyone if she cheated - the boundaries are much less confining, but when trust is broken, the same issues and pain that everyone else experiences would happen to me as well.


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## sammy3 (Jun 5, 2011)

hopefulgirl said:


> There's ALWAYS a big but, isn't there?
> 
> My take on it is no matter where on the continuum of how perfect a marriage there might have been going on prior to the A (and of course, there is no perfect marriage), most WS's will find it wanting prior, during, and especially after the A. And while many of us BS's will agree that there WERE problems, there is often a significant disconnect in terms of how WE saw what was going on.
> 
> Shirley Glass in her book NOT Just Friends notes that many WS's were actually "overbenefited" in their marriages - they were in unbalanced relationships and were the ones who were not giving ENOUGH. But WS's whose view of things is that they want more, more, more just aren't satisfied - THEY have "issues" and seek attention, flattery, ego boost, blah, blah, blah from someone who hasn't had to deal with all their foibles and less than admirable qualities.


:iagree:

But yet if I were to even suggest such a thing, he'd be furious.

~sammy


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## bartendersfriend (Oct 14, 2013)

hopefulgirl said:


> I think it's very hard for people who have strayed to see things through our eyes. They told themselves things so many times that it became "real" and it distorts history. I've had to show him text messages to remind my husband about the lovey-dovey things he was saying to me during his affair; he remembers pulling away from me, and yes that was going on, but he was sending mixed messages too, and he forgets about that.


That's been one of my struggles during the MC sessions. I knew that things were not perfect in our marriage (communication, some of the same "fights", intimacy, etc). It is clear that those mixed messages during the EA/PA made me think our marriage was "good" (probably not "great"), but looking back I see all the other signs of how she was pushing me away.

Their choice to cheat initially is not the BS's fault and neither is their choice to continue to cheat. I take some responsibility for the conditions (including blind trust) that lead her to the EA. After the EA started, I certainly can't fault anyone but her. If she ever said that in MC I would seriously consider if this R can work.


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## Allen_A (Nov 18, 2013)

A person's choice to do anything

a. in secret
b. destructive
c. self-indulgent
d. instantly gratifying

Is an individual problem. If that's the recipie for the behavior, it's individual, not marital.

Marital issues are done

a. as a dynamic/interactively
b. destructive
c. self-indulgent
d. instantly gratifying

The difference is who you are with when you're doing it.

If it's you and your spouse doing it, and it's contaminating, then its a marital issue.

If it's you, doing this in secret from your spouse, it's an individual issue.

If you have an affair, yes, you have an affair partner, and they are doing it too. What this means is you have found someone else who is just as dishonest, destructive, self-indulgent, and gratification seeking as yourself. Congratulations.. partners in crime. Soul mates of sin. Good luck with that!


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