# Asking for advice or input



## Abel402 (Jan 26, 2015)

Hello,

The topic of a trial separation has been brought up in my marriage. Me and my wife are 34 and 35 and have been married for 13 years. We have had a good marriage and have gotten along really well for most of the marriage

We have two children that we both love dearly. The separation has just been brought up because lately things have changed...I have suffered from depression and been on meds for the last 4 years, I own my own business and sometimes that can be very stressful.

Our finances have always been up and down because of my line of work and can take a toll on things, My wife works and has slowly moved up the chain over the years and now is at a small family company making good money. That has created one of our problems... she used to have so much respect for me but now I feel she thinks of me as a failure...

On to our problem.... Right after Christmas I finally came out and asked her what is wrong with us and what is going on. I have recently suspected her of cheating. She has started taking better care of herself, dressing different and so on. 
In our talk she told me she hasn't been happy for the last 2 years and I have changed... I have let myself go, gained some wait and never want to do anything. We haven't had sex but twice in the last two years and I have never pressed her on it because I thought it was something she was going through physically.

Another topic during this conversation was my job and how I don't provide.... I made a promise to her that I would make changes. She never has asked me to go out (bars etc) other than when we see movies together or whatever, were always busy with our kids. After all of this went down I had made effort and began to change but still had a feeling something wasn't right.

Her phone has went from being charged out in the open to now is charged next to her in bed... She now has a passcode and carries the phone with her wherever she is in the house.

One day I paid attention to her passcode and later that night grabbed her phone and checked it out.... finding conversations with a guy at work that had been going on for the last 3 months... I have no problem with her having friends at work but these texts went over the line.

I kept this to myself and on our second discussion I asked if there was someone else and all I wanted was her honesty... she denied, finally after 2 weeks of my sleepless nights and nerves I asked her about it. She finally admitted and said it was nothing, it made her feel good about herself.... She said she loved me but wasn't in love with me anymore.

When reading the texts, the way I took it was nothing had happened yet outside of texting.... but she wanted more, the guy was either playing stupid, or was not interested.


After all of this we finally have sorted it out and now she thinks the beast thing to do is me to move out and work on me....She said basically like we would go back to dating and I would get an apartment close to home so I was still involved.

So now in my mind.... one side tells me this is her easy way out, and the other is she want me back the way I was before my depression and that I need to work on myself.


What do I do????


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## Happilymarried25 (Mar 19, 2014)

Can't you work on yourself living in the house with her? Start going on dates now with her. I wouldn't leave if I were you. If she wants to separate then she needs to move out. I think she wants you to move out so she can have a physical relationship with this guy. I think it would be more tramatic for your children if you left and you would look like the bad guy who was deserting your family.


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## naiveonedave (Jan 9, 2014)

Happilymarried25 said:


> Can't you work on yourself living in the house with her? Start going on dates now with her. I wouldn't leave if I were you. If she wants to separate then she needs to move out. I think she wants you to move out so she can have a physical relationship with this guy. I think it would be more tramatic for your children if you left and you would look like the bad guy who was deserting your family.


too much of that is mutually exclusive. You need to know she is in an EA at least. You can't nice her back. She wants you out so she won't feel guilty about banging the OM.

Don't move out (legal reasons), consult a lawyer, spy on her and expose if she is cheating, etc.


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## Abel402 (Jan 26, 2015)

It has really hurt me... I think the world of her. I asked her why she wasn't honest and she told me because she was scared of what I would do.

To make things worse, the guy she has been texting is the son of owner of where she works. She said she has been talking to my sister in law about our issues and one of her friends fixed their marriage by separating.

I am a very easy going guy but get very violent about infidelity and these types of problems, I have a problem with trusting other people and usually have cut ties in the past with people that have been dishonest.


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## Abel402 (Jan 26, 2015)

After me getting on here phone and confronting her, I told her there are no reasons to have her phone locked. Ive tried looking again and of course everything was deleted.

She now also has the thumb print lock on it (iPhone) so now I really know I blew my chances.

Is there anything else I should be doing to see what else is going on or has gotten further than the texting?


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## Vulcan2013 (Sep 25, 2013)

Pass code will still work. Unless she changed it. You should ask a mod to move this to CWI.


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## Abel402 (Jan 26, 2015)

Passcode has changed....where would I find a list of moderators who could move this to the appropriate spot?


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## Voltaire2013 (Sep 22, 2013)

Abel402 said:


> Passcode has changed....where would I find a list of moderators who could move this to the appropriate spot?


Abel,

Don't move out, instead let her know you are committed to the marriage and willing to change the dynamic if she is as well. If not she can move out. Do a search on the site for the following:
Married Mans Sex Life Primer (silly name. Great advice)
No More Mister Nice Guy
His Needs, Her Needs
the Five Love Languages.

Start there, start with MMSLP. Buy it if you can ,but free PDFs are available to crafty searchers. 

Short version is be a man and lead. There's a lot of tough medicine in all of these books but you need them, you should never tolerate a spouse who thinks its ok to introduce a third party to the marriage. 

Read and nut up, it's not easy, but it's worth it (if that's what you decide)

I wish you well, others will come in with more info on the intelligence gathering, and by all means listen, but work on a better you first.

I wish you well,

Cheers,
V(13)


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## Abel402 (Jan 26, 2015)

Can this thread be moved to CWI please? Thanks


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## naiveonedave (Jan 9, 2014)

Abel402 said:


> Is there anything else I should be doing to see what else is going on or has gotten further than the texting?


Search for weightlifters standard evidence post on the CWI forum. Follow that and you will know pretty quickly. My guess is that if they see each other in person, you should assume deep EA and likely PA, until you have proof otherwise. Especially if this has gone on for months.


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## razgor (May 8, 2014)

Abel, sorry you are going through this. First do NOT move out. That will be the end of your marriage for sure. Second, read the books the other people have posted. Third, definitely follow the earlier advice and read weight lifters thread. 

Her changing her passcode after you looked at is a sure sign of something going on. Personally, I would not spend a lot of time trying to dig up evidence. You already know who she is talking too. You already know that she is looking elsewhere. It is time for action.

After you read those books, schedule an appointment with a marriage counselor. Begin working on yourself and your happiness. Join a gym, dress better. Put your children and yourself first. Do not try to win her back by being nice. Win her back by taking pride in yourself and leading your family. Be the person she fell in love with years ago.

Also, demand that she gives you the pass code to her phone. She will be angry, but so be it. One thing I have learned, you must be willing to lose your marriage in order to save it.


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## manfromlamancha (Jul 4, 2013)

Abel, I am sorry to have you here. However, here are my thoughts on your situation:


It is very clear to me that you have gone down in your wife's estimation and that she is not in love with you, does not love you and more importantly, has no respect for you.

Also she is definitely pursuing the owners son who is probably wealthier than you and hence higher up in her estimation. The lack of sex for two years says that she is getting it somewhere else and this may not be her first rodeo.

If she hasn't already taken it PA, she is pushing for it to happen and if not with the current OM then she will soon target another.

There is also no doubt that she wants you out of the house to make it easier for her to have a physical relationship (with this guy and/or other guys).

She is following the cheater's script to the tee so far.

What you need to do now is batten down the hatches, and prepare yourself for what is coming.


First of all consult an attorney and see what your rights are and how to protect yourself and your kids. 

Next, start gathering evidence. You confronted half-****ed and now she has deleted everything and taken it underground. You need to get a key logger on her computer and VARs in her car and around the house.

Under no circumstances do you move out of the house. As others have advised, if she wants a separation, she needs to move.

When you have sufficient evidence, confront and blow this wide open. Expose to family and at work. You can legally threaten her work for "alienation of affection" and promoting the affair and breakdown of your marriage and family. If they are wealthy, you should get a payment from them (settlement).

Then file for divorce and be prepared to lose her (even if you want to R further down the line).

Do the 180 immediately (now) - for your own healing and self-esteem. You need to also build yourself up physically. New clothes, new haircut, new attractive you. No begging her for anything, and engage only when it is to do with the kids or forthcoming divorce.

She has lost respect, love and her direction - she is not the person you married and you cannot believe a word that comes out of her mouth for now.

Good luck.


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## vellocet (Oct 18, 2013)

Abel402 said:


> When reading the texts, the way I took it was nothing had happened yet outside of texting.... but she wanted more, the guy was either playing stupid, or was not interested.
> 
> 
> After all of this we finally have sorted it out and now she thinks the beast thing to do is me to move out and work on me....She said basically like we would go back to dating and I would get an apartment close to home so I was still involved.


Uh no, F that! She wants to screw around, SHE needs to be the one to leave.



> What do I do????


Tell her she is the one that wants to screw around, tell her she needs to move out and work on her.


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## wmn1 (Aug 27, 2014)

manfromlamancha said:


> Abel, I am sorry to have you here. However, here are my thoughts on your situation:
> 
> 
> It is very clear to me that you have gone down in your wife's estimation and that she is not in love with you, does not love you and more importantly, has no respect for you.
> ...


:iagree:

This !!!!


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## wmn1 (Aug 27, 2014)

vellocet said:


> Uh no, F that! She wants to screw around, SHE needs to be the one to leave.
> 
> 
> 
> Tell her she is the one that wants to screw around, tell her she needs to move out and work on her.


I agree Vel


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## vellocet (Oct 18, 2013)

Well I couldn't imagine myself cheating or wanting to cheat and try to tell my spouse that they should be the one to leave.

This show OP's wife to be even more selfish than the cheating itself. And yes, she is cheating, emotionally, and making plans to have sex with another man while still married.

Here is yet another circumstance where the BS needs to show the other what they have found and suggest it is them that need to move out.


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## cdbaker (Nov 5, 2010)

manfromlamancha said:


> Abel, I am sorry to have you here. However, here are my thoughts on your situation:
> 
> 
> It is very clear to me that you have gone down in your wife's estimation and that she is not in love with you, does not love you and more importantly, has no respect for you.
> ...


:iagree::iagree::iagree:

Reposting Manfromlamancha's post again to reinforce what he is saying.

Remember, you don't have to decide right now that your marriage is over when you choose to file for divorce. Filing is a long process that will give you both time to think about what you want, rebuild yourselves, reconsider your choices, etc. If the marriage really is doomed, it's best that you get the process started, but if there is a chance for reconciliation, then it becomes a tool that could affect positive change in your wife and yourself. Hopefully understanding this will help you with your decision.

Otherwise as said above, DO NOT move out, DO start investigating and digging up whatever you can about her activities, and do not confront her with what you find or even show a willingness to argue with her regarding her blatant disrespect of your marriage. Show her that you can stand up to her by make it clear that you find her behavior and choices to be unacceptable, period.


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## Abel402 (Jan 26, 2015)

I really think she does not look at what she has done as cheating... 
When I saw all of the texts on her phone that night I actually copied them and sent them to my phone. Unfortunately later my phone then broke and took it to Apple to have them fix finding out I would lose all of what I had.

She for the last few months had quit wearing her beautiful wedding ring that I spent a fortune on because of her finger all of the sudden breaking out, and hasn't worn it since. I plan on showing up this week un announced to take her to lunch to try and see what the vibe is around her place of work.

After reading some of your guys replies I am slowly opening my eyes even further and will continue to be aware... also plan on getting the recorder for her car to see what goes on for lunch etc...


I previously did not get too far into the texts on here, but feel it may be beneficial now. In these texts I found out that they had gone Christmas shopping together and had talked a bit about that.... Then she went on to give advice on what he should get his parents for gifts...

It was also mentioned that she had bought him cologne and how nice it smelt, and he said that she definitely didn't need to buy him a gift. After that she started hinting around for him to see why she is so nice to him and no one else at their job was....

Previously she has told me how everyone there complains about the bosses sons.... after this she kept telling him how he was so smart and should figure out why she was so nice to him.... after going back and forth with this and him playing dumb, she said figure it out, its two words.... after that he said he was too tired to think that hard.

There were other things that were said and when I can remember the rest I will put those on here as well.... but the last stuff about her wanting to have him figure it out is when I found the texts....

after that there were no texts for a week or two and then I tried to look and the passcode was changed


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## harrybrown (May 22, 2013)

Have her leave, she is cheating and having an A.

Hope you get some info on her , but take the phone. 

She needs to change her job, and go NC with her lover.

when you get more info, be sure and expose.


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## Tasorundo (Apr 1, 2012)

Did you ask her what the two words were?


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## convert (Oct 4, 2013)

Abel402 said:


> I really think she does not look at what she has done as cheating...
> When I saw all of the texts on her phone that night I actually copied them and sent them to my phone. Unfortunately later my phone then broke and took it to Apple to have them fix finding out I would lose all of what I had.
> 
> She for the last few months had quit wearing her beautiful *wedding ring that I spent a fortune on* because of her finger all of the sudden breaking out, and hasn't worn it since. I plan on showing up this week un announced to take her to lunch to try and see what the vibe is around her place of work.
> ...


go get the ring and keep it in a safe place. don't tell her...see how long it takes her to notice...

you might need the money from the ring in divorce.

she is looking to have a PA and wants you out. she is already in a EA.


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## cdbaker (Nov 5, 2010)

Bookmark what manfromlamancha said above. Seriously. Everything you are saying makes that more clear.

Yes, VAR the car, or maybe if she spends a lot of her time alone in a particular area of the house, you might VAR that area as well.

I'm not sure if I see a lot of benefit from you going to her workplace, but it probably couldn't hurt either. If you do go, you might find the other man and give him a good hard look. If you're meeting him for the first time, stand up straight and shake his hand FIRMLY while looking him in the eye. If your wife acts angry shocked, frustrated, quick to make up an excuse/reason for you to leave or why she can't go to lunch, don't get angry/defensive right back. She may have been slowly presenting an image to her co-workers that your marriage is crumbling or over, so you don't want to reinforce that image by you causing an angry scene at the front door. Instead, be positive, speak loud enough for others to hear, make it look like everything is well. If she has been misrepresenting your marriage to those co-workers/friends/other man, that might put a dent in that imagine which will probably frustrate your wife to no end. (Don't assume that her affair, be it EA or PA, has gone completely unnoticed by her co-workers)

Also, yes, what Convert said above. Go get the ring. You might even secretly start moving other potential valuables, or even funds in savings accounts or investments. I'm not saying cashing anything out and opening new accounts just yet, but at least moving them so that when her D-Day does come she doesn't have quick access to cleaning you out, and will be forced to tip you off that she's trying to do so, giving you time to then lock them away securely at that point in time.


Aside from that, a few additional thoughts:

How did your confronting her last time play out? 
When you confronted, did you ask for access to her phone? 
Was she angry and defensive at your checking her phone, or did she sound ashamed?


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## badmemory (Jul 31, 2012)

If your wife isn't physically cheating, she's getting close to it. But you can't rule that out. For everything that you have discovered, there is likely ten times that amount that you haven't. Guarding her phone and putting pass codes on it? That should be unacceptable to you. 

You need to start discreetly monitoring her yesterday. You'll get all the help you need here with that.

In regards to the "trial" separation. Here is the rule. When the spouse that is cheating (or likely cheating) asks for a trial separation; you can take it to the bank, that the "trial" is for testing the waters with someone else - without the worry of your questions or surveillance. 

Do not agree to a trial separation if you want a chance to save your marriage.


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## shalom_82 (Nov 23, 2014)

I can only imagine how harsh it is to hear the words that your wife is cheating on you, as it hit hard for me just reading them as an outsider. But, I tend to agree with everyone. 

From what you've recapped after your wife's explanation, it sounds to me that she views things as though your relationship and love is gone and over with. She is optimistic of a future between you two, which is great, and she wants to end things amicably. That's really great. 

It's horrible that she's having an emotional affair and wanting to end things. I get how painful that must be for you. On the other hand, she's looking for a way to get through this process together. 

I'm not so sure that holding onto your relationship and hoping for reconciliation will serve you. I get that it may be too painful to face the alternative, but if you don't face it, I fear that you will experience so much drama between you and your wife. 

I gather that you aren't ready to let go, that the relationship isn't over for you. Over time, though, the EA is going to eat at you. You're going to build up resentment and anger. 

The process of mourning the death of your relationship is just beginning. I don't know that this process ever ends but if there is an end... At the end of it, you may build another relationship with your wife, or you may move on to another relationship or stay single. What you had with your wife is now in the past.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

Look at your phone bill and see if she is still sending texts to the other man.

You might be able to clean the screen off of her phone and then see what numbers she is using to get back into the phone. 

Do not leave your house. 

Are you being treated for depression, if not go to your doctor and start treatment.

Work out, get some new clothes, new hair cut, stay well dressed, get counseling for yourself. Marriage counseling is useless while she is in an affair.
Is the om married?

Act like everything is fine while you wait for the bars to work. Look up the 180, just talk to her about kids and finances. Do not whine or act needy.


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## Abel402 (Jan 26, 2015)

Thanks for the input.... the last time we talked and I brought up the texting, that is when I was very clear about honesty and that she had broke my heart. The conversation started in text form and then she called me.

On the phone I broke down.... I never show my emotions, but I was a wreck, so much that she left work and came home because she thought I was going to do something stupid.

I will be definitely be putting a device in her car....other than that all of the other stuff is going on elsewhere whether its work or whatever. In our conversation about this and the guy (which I had met the year before at the Christmas party) She played it off as it was nothing and he was just a kid (25 yrs old)

Another thing that I haven't brought up because I didn't know if its relevant to her character or not... I originally met her through a mutual friend (girl) and my wife had actually dated a good friend off mine way before then.

During this time we all hung out at my buddies house because his mom was a divorced parent and let us do whatever. I guess Ive always been a jealous person (ill admit) but way back then she would hang out with others at his house while we were dating.

This bothered me but I never made a big deal about it.... time went by and she continued to do this and then I was having mutual friends telling me (Matt) my friend was acting off and they expected something was going on between my now wife and matt.

I let it go but continued hearing it as time went on... I didn't know if it was true or because my friends knew how I was would blow up and do something stupid. I finally confronted him and he denied it and my wife said it was ridiculous. It was said a few more times and I couldn't take it anymore, confronted him one more time and I didn't like his tone in the conversation so I knocked him out.


To this day I don't know if anything ever happened or if I was just a young kid out of highschool that blew up and did something stupid over nothing. Or was my marriage started on a lie and cheating way back then.


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## OldWolf57 (Mar 20, 2012)

A, sorry you are here. And as said, DO NOT LEAVE YOUR HOUSE !!!

Tell her he may not have figured it out yet, but you sure have.
Pay no attention to anything she says, for as of now, she is a lying cheater, and the way you know she is lying, her lips are moving.

Look at it this way. Most women hit their sexual peak in their 30's, and she is already searching.
How do you know? Heck you read it in her own words. Believe her.

Now go to work on you like said, because after you refuse to leave, she is going to get angry, and things are going to be said. But let her know you are not leaving your home to make it easy on her to spread her legs.

Hopefully you caught it in time, but she is primed my man.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

"On to our problem.... Right after Christmas I finally came out and asked her what is wrong with us and what is going on. I have recently suspected her of cheating. She has started taking better care of herself, dressing different and so on. 
In our talk she told me she hasn't been happy for the last 2 years and I have changed... I have let myself go, gained some wait and never want to do anything. We haven't had sex but twice in the last two years and I have never pressed her on it because I thought it was something she was going through physically."



This sounds like the trouble started when the sex stopped. People here ofte say anti depressants lower sex drive. Are you sure the reason sex stopped is not your lack of desire. At your ages the two of you should be going at eac other like rabbits. Your wife has entered her peak sexual desire years.

Work on your diet and start lifting weights hard. She's looking around because she doesn't think you find her attractive. Get to work tonight on improving your self.

If the meds aren't working have the doctor change them. Tell him what's going on.


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## naiveonedave (Jan 9, 2014)

Sorry man, but your W sounds like a serial cheater. At the very least is way to willing to have inappropriate relationships with other men while supposedly committed to you. If you think that this is the case, time to lawyer up and bail.


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## Abel402 (Jan 26, 2015)

No, its exactly the opposite.... it is her that has had the problems.
In our talk she basically blamed on of this on our finances and me not providing. Like I explained way earlier...in my line of work summer months are always best and winter can be tough. 

I am on Prozac and I think it has caused a lot of my issues.... prior to getting on it or the reason for taking it was me being such a nervous person.... but on the meds I basically don't care about anything


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## MarriedDude (Jun 21, 2014)

Abel402 said:


> Thanks for the input.... the last time we talked and I brought up the texting, that is when I was very clear about honesty and that she had broke my heart. The conversation started in text form and then she called me.
> 
> *On the phone I broke down.... I never show my emotions, but I was a wreck, so much that she left work and came home because she thought I was going to do something stupid.*
> 
> ...


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## OldWolf57 (Mar 20, 2012)

Was these friends the type to just stir up stuff, or could you really trust what they was saying.
If you trusted them, then you know she maybe could do this to you again.
Believe me, her running home was to protect her job, not you.
Him and the job is her focus now. So keep your own council, by coming here. These ppl really really know what they are talking about.


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## Abel402 (Jan 26, 2015)

Yes, on the phone when I was in rage...(she knows how I was in highschool) I told her im going to come to her work and clean [email protected]%$#%% house and let the whole place know what was going on.

I am really glad I have found this site, so far it really has help me control my anger, when o still had my phone with the copied texts I would constantly read them and just boil with anger and hate.


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## Abel402 (Jan 26, 2015)

OldWolf57 said:


> Was these friends the type to just stir up stuff, or could you really trust what they was saying.
> If you trusted them, then you know she maybe could do this to you again.
> Believe me, her running home was to protect her job, not you.
> Him and the job is her focus now. So keep your own council, by coming here. These ppl really really know what they are talking about.


The two friends that continued to bait me with her and him always being together were know to be %$&^ stirrers. So after me hitting him I felt really bad later on.... since then, I am in contact with him and still talk to him from time to time.

I have been so tempted to get an opinion from him or another friend but have held my tongue.
The other point I have made earlier is that she is close to my sister in-law (wifes brother's wife) and has been texting her about all of this... I don't know if she knows about the part of my wife texting this guy or not though.


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## OldWolf57 (Mar 20, 2012)

Plz don't let the anger show. Don't give her any reason to have you kicked out of your home.
In fact, as of now, don't mention anything else to her. she knows you are watching, but she still hasn't stopped hugging that phone.
So just quietly go about the monitoring.


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## Q tip (Apr 15, 2014)

She's looking for alone time to taste the OM - that is, if she already isn't. A few minutes in a parking lot with OM works 

Read Weightlifters sig for evidence gathering. Gather evidence as fast as you can. 

You must act, man up. With evidence, expose her to family and friends. Do not warn her you'll do this, she will just preempt you and lie to rewrite marital history to gain their support.

Action. Not reactions, this is chess not checkers. See a lawyer about your options. Get a PI on her too if you can. 

Maybe expose to the owner what a rat the brat kid is. Shock and awe to bring her out of her dream land of unicorns and rainbows. Her feelings are like a drug to her. She'll be pissed, then understand what's been happening.


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## Age (Jan 11, 2015)

That isn't fair that you loose your home because of her unhappiness. Definitely no matter what you decide on yes work on your self find happiness again. This is going to sound so strange I highly recommend you looking into changing your diet. People don't realize the HUGE effect that DIET has on the mental & overall health. Try the Raw vegan foods just adding them OMG such a difference. Also adding working out is a huge huge factor in your mental & overall health. Exercise helps anxiety, depression, etc... not to mention you will feel as good as you look.  Try a NATUROPATHIC doctor they can get to the root cause of your depression/health problems & offer you natural alternatives. When you fix yourself you can have a better perspective on life and what you want to do. here is a video on someone who cured depression with diet https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E-NrQ6D9wTM

If you begin & focus on changing yourself just by getting rid of your depression & becoming a better you then maybe your wife will see you as a new man & fall back in love with you. Either way that kind of stuff will only improve your life. Please consult a doctor before any diet/exercise changes. Definitely worth looking into.


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## MarriedDude (Jun 21, 2014)

Q tip said:


> She's looking for alone time to taste the OM - that is, if she already isn't. A few minutes in a parking lot with OM works
> 
> Read Weightlifters sig for evidence gathering. Gather evidence as fast as you can.
> 
> ...


Don't expose this to the owner...at least not yet. I run a family business...have a few sons that work here. The reality is...the kid won't get anything but maybe a stern talking to (I would dock my sons pay and send him to another state to work at worst jobsite I could find)....The office girl... HOWEVER...would be gone...*fast*. Regardless of which way this goes....your wife should continue working. You need to find work enough to support your family. While all this is going on you all still need to eat and have a home. 

It is chess. Think through all your moves and determine the potential fallout from all of them before doing anything


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## OldWolf57 (Mar 20, 2012)

Remember, who told her about the separating, sis/inlaw is suspect in my eyes. 
What you do is back off and watch.

The old ILYBANILWY is always a red flag.
from the sound of it, she is looking to trade up but can't reel him in ,and knows you won't just walk away.
With you out of the house, she can invite him over, and work her magic,,, you see.
So shut down the leaving talk as soon as she bring it up again in no uncertain terms.


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## Abel402 (Jan 26, 2015)

Thank you all for the help.... As all of this unfolded I did see where she was coming from (I didn't let her know that) I told her I wish she would have came to me 2 years ago and we could have fixed it then.

I know a lot of it falls on my depression... and she doesn't know what to do about it or handle it. She has never asked how I feel or anything and she looks at it as I have become a lazy p.o.s that doesn't do anything right and she doesn't need me around. She thinks because I am on meds I should be normal again.

I really don't have any close friends since highschool so I don't have anyone to vent or talk to.... so like I said before, im really glad I found this site.

In our conversation, she came out and said, at this point she has nothing to lose.... and me moving out and working on me and getting back to the man she fell in love with is what needs to happen. As her career has slowly blossomed I kind of let her take over... Now she has used that to her advantage and looks at my like im nothing.


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## Locke.Stratos (Sep 27, 2014)

I thought that this would be worth repeating: Under no circumstances do you even consider moving out.

The only reason she wants a separation and for you to move out is so that she can pursue and escalate her relationship with her boss' son unhindered by you and guilt free. 

She is having an affair if that isn't clear to you, definitely emotional and probably physical as well. This is the reality, accept it. You do not need to analyse, reason or think it through. It is simple, she is involved with her boss' son. It is a fact, repeat it to yourself until it sinks in. You are not paranoid or insecure, your wife is involved in affair.

She will no longer behave like the wife that you think that you know. She will not be kind, reasonable, caring or particularly logical.

Your words or actions will not reach her. In her mind she is done with you and is maintaining the best possible position for herself.

Her affair is her top priority and all her efforts will center on protecting and nurturing that relationship. In terms of priority, you're like seventeen to the power of a multiple of nine. You do not matter to her, your feelings are of no concern to her and honestly your continued presence is a bother.

You have recieved plenty of golden advice, please please PLEASE follow it. Ignore every instinct you have on what you think you know is best, you are wrong. Your story has been recounted numerous times. It may be new to you but it is not unique. Your wife's behaviour is typical of an adulterer.

Now, whether you decide to save your marriage or to divorce, follow through on what others have written.

You do not beg or plead with her and no crying, breaking down or getting emotional ibefore her. Never approach her from a position of weakness. Stop asking her questions or talking about your relationship and stuff that's happened in the past. If you need to vent please feel free to do it on this forum.

Her blaming you, your depression and work is wrong but it is extremely typical and common of cheating spouses (blame shifting, rewriting of marital history) and you should not take it to heart and internalize it. She is your wife so you would expect her to be honest in what she says but she is lying. She is full of s***. She will lie and will do it often and effortlessly. Limit your conversations with her to children, households and finances.


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## OldWolf57 (Mar 20, 2012)

The about from Locke Stratos is putting it better than I could ever say.
Especially concerning the "nothing to lose". Hell if that was so, she would not have come running home. See the lie??
If it wasn't, she would have waited for you to come and called the cops. BUT, that would have aired her business.
Locke Stratos said it, she is a lying cheater. And her focus is to get you gone.

Oh, if you want, iphones backup to the cloud auto, so some will tell you what you need to do to get at the txt's.


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## Abel402 (Jan 26, 2015)

Thanks again guys.... I will make sure to follow up on how things are going.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

Is her phone synched to itunes on the computer? Deleted texts can be fiund there.

Talk to your doctor, do not change any meds without his approval. If you're not happy with his take on things get a second opinion. Usually, there are steps that can be taken in addition to meds. Does anyone else in your family have any depression problems?

Can you talk to your brother?

Get started on diet and working out as soon as possible. Lifting weights is an instant mood elevator and confidence builder.


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## cdbaker (Nov 5, 2010)

I don't feel like the old high school stories are relevant here. Kids are d*cks in high school, and whether it was true or not, I just don't think it matters anymore.

Don't break down crying in front of her again. You can do that in a closet on your own time, but don't show that kind of weakness to her while she is already trying to level up to what she may believe is a superior male.

Just my gut feeling, but I'm immediately distrustful of the sister-in-law. For starters, she's married to your wife's brother, so that automatically means she will lean more towards your wife's side because regardless of what happens to your marriage, she'll be stuck with her for the long haul, not you. Second, as she has only gotten your wife's side, and your wife is engaged in an affair if not worse, you already know that she had only presented her affair fog based view of your marriage to her and the husband/brother. (You can bet the bro-in-law knows whatever the sis-in-law knows) Don't trust them.

I'd say that the OM being ~10 years younger than your wife probably means he isn't a long term prospect for her, but more of an exciting sexual conquest/prey. I bet he'd slink away real quick if you were to confront him at some point (but not now). Oddly, I have some experience with this, as when I was 25 I had somewhat of an EA with a married co-worker who was about 34. Incidentally, ours was not physical (obviously, as an EA) but it also wasn't really romantic or anything either. It was just a really close friendship where we were waaay too comfortable with discussing topics, interests, details of our lives, etc. that are inappropriate for a non-married man and woman. So... it's _possible_ that this is the case with your wife and the OW. Incidentally, my "EA partner" did go on to get a divorce from her husband. He too didn't engage with her sexually or much emotionally either, and struggled with depression. I do think that if I had wanted our friendship to become sexual (but not romantic) that it would have been very easy to do.

Regarding the sex. You mentioned you've had sex twice in the last two years but you didn't "press her on it" because you thought she was going through something physically. I can say without a doubt that it is very abnormal, especially for a man, to be willing to go two years without having an enormous problem over having only had sex twice. This tells me that your depression and/or meds have likely dramatically impacted your sex drive. If you'll allow me to venture further in my guesswork, I could imagine this too being a contributor to the marriage problems and to her affair. As I mentioned, a person should absolutely want and desire a healthy sex life from his/her spouse, especially if you're the man. If that's not the case, in time that will absolutely cause the spouse (especially if the spouse is the woman) to question a lot of other things, like is he attracted to her anymore, is she desirable at all, does he value her anymore, and her self esteem can easily nosedive. I could also see her keeping those feelings to herself if she knows that you are struggling with depression, that the low sex drive might be related to that, and doesn't want to add to your struggles with feelings of guilt.

I'm certainly not trying to blame you by pointing all of that out, but I definitely think it's something that should be addressed regardless of the marital issues. I've got to ask, how do you feel about sex? (In general, not just the prospect of sex with your wife right now) Do you feel like your sex drive has dropped dramatically in the last few years? Has the lack of sex been a source of frustration or resentment for you in recent years?

Another question, you mention that you had issues with being nervous a lot and that is what led to the prozac. Did you and a therapist spend time digging into what may have been the cause of the nervousness? Could it be related to your business and the level of success you were having? (Like if the business wasn't doing well, or barely making ends meat, or if you were constantly feeling pressured by your wife to be more successful, etc.?


Aside from that, keep listening to the advice you're finding here. *DO NOT* leave home, no matter what she says. Start working out, change your diet, get things done around the house, and dig dig dig to find out more about what she is up to.


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## vellocet (Oct 18, 2013)

Lets see what we have so far 

-She engages in cheating, yes cheating, by texting this other guy about what she intends to do with him and wants to do with him

-She wants you to move out for a while so you can work on yourself? Why? So she can have some freedom to spread 'em for the other man.

-She has engaged in shady behavior in the past.

I think you need to double down and tell her you are ready to divorce her over all this, but only if you think you just might.

Because I'm going to tell you something right now. She doesn't think she is doing anything wrong, she wants you to move out so she can explore sex with the other man, she blames you because of finances......basically you have a worthless wife IMO. 

So you have to ask yourself, do you deserve better than this? I think its time to start getting angry.


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## Q tip (Apr 15, 2014)

Depression...????

It could very well be just a magnesium deficiency. Dontcha just love doctors...


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## Abel402 (Jan 26, 2015)

quote:"Just my gut feeling, but I'm immediately distrustful of the sister-in-law. For starters, she's married to your wife's brother, so that automatically means she will lean more towards your wife's side because regardless of what happens to your marriage, she'll be stuck with her for the long haul, not you. Second, as she has only gotten your wife's side, and your wife is engaged in an affair if not worse, you already know that she had only presented her affair fog based view of your marriage to her and the husband/brother. (You can bet the bro-in-law knows whatever the sis-in-law knows) Don't trust them.

I'd say that the OM being ~10 years younger than your wife probably means he isn't a long term prospect for her, but more of an exciting sexual conquest/prey. I bet he'd slink away real quick if you were to confront him at some point (but not now). Oddly, I have some experience with this, as when I was 25 I had somewhat of an EA with a married co-worker who was about 34. Incidentally, ours was not physical (obviously, as an EA) but it also wasn't really romantic or anything either. It was just a really close friendship where we were waaay too comfortable with discussing topics, interests, details of our lives, etc. that are inappropriate for a non-married man and woman. So... it's _possible_ that this is the case with your wife and the OW. Incidentally, my "EA partner" did go on to get a divorce from her husband. He too didn't engage with her sexually or much emotionally either, and struggled with depression. I do think that if I had wanted our friendship to become sexual (but not romantic) that it would have been very easy to do.

Regarding the sex. You mentioned you've had sex twice in the last two years but you didn't "press her on it" because you thought she was going through something physically. I can say without a doubt that it is very abnormal, especially for a man, to be willing to go two years without having an enormous problem over having only had sex twice. This tells me that your depression and/or meds have likely dramatically impacted your sex drive. If you'll allow me to venture further in my guesswork, I could imagine this too being a contributor to the marriage problems and to her affair. As I mentioned, a person should absolutely want and desire a healthy sex life from his/her spouse, especially if you're the man. If that's not the case, in time that will absolutely cause the spouse (especially if the spouse is the woman) to question a lot of other things, like is he attracted to her anymore, is she desirable at all, does he value her anymore, and her self esteem can easily nosedive. I could also see her keeping those feelings to herself if she knows that you are struggling with depression, that the low sex drive might be related to that, and doesn't want to add to your struggles with feelings of guilt.

I'm certainly not trying to blame you by pointing all of that out, but I definitely think it's something that should be addressed regardless of the marital issues. I've got to ask, how do you feel about sex? (In general, not just the prospect of sex with your wife right now) Do you feel like your sex drive has dropped dramatically in the last few years? Has the lack of sex been a source of frustration or resentment for you in recent years?

Another question, you mention that you had issues with being nervous a lot and that is what led to the prozac. Did you and a therapist spend time digging into what may have been the cause of the nervousness? Could it be related to your business and the level of success you were having? (Like if the business wasn't doing well, or barely making ends meat, or if you were constantly feeling pressured by your wife to be more successful, etc.?


Aside from that, keep listening to the advice you're finding here. *DO NOT* leave home, no matter what she says. Start working out, change your diet, get things done around the house, and dig dig dig to find out more about what she is up to.[/QUOTE]


On the sex deal, I have definitely resented her for this and it has really bothered me.... I have brought it up early on in our marriage even before having children. She has never been super sexual. I guess I kind of got use to that and it slowly had gotten worse. I definitely haven't lost my sex drive.... for God sakes, that is all I think about.

On my job issue, it has always been an issue... ive usually always made enough for us to live and have nice things but got comfortable and never went above and beyond. A lot of the money thing is, that her brother basically fell into a VERY successful business and makes a ton of money, as the wife spends it like its going out of style. I know she sees that and thinks that is the way her life should be.

As far as me talking to family.... I really don't have anyone to talk to on that side of things. I come from a family of drug addicts and my poor mother works multiple jobs while raising my sisters 5 children. I never burden her with my problems.

I just recently reached out to a good friend that has a good solid marriage and life, we are going to meet up tomorrow for lunch just to catch up and talk about whats going on. Other than him, all of my other friends are either divorced, still partying, or too dumb to carry a normal conversation with.


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## Abel402 (Jan 26, 2015)

As far as my diet, ive always been in decent shape, just from the labor of my work.... I now work less and eat the same fast food crap for lunch everyday.

Since I started taking Prozac I have gained 50 pounds in the last 4 years.


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## Q tip (Apr 15, 2014)

Abel402 said:


> As far as my diet, ive always been in decent shape, just from the labor of my work.... I now work less and eat the same fast food crap for lunch everyday.
> 
> Since I started taking Prozac I have gained 50 pounds in the last 4 years.


Do some research on LEF.ORG. Life extension Foundation. Tons of research there on health issues.

Drop the fat by lifting weights. Not on machines, but free weights. 3 or 4 times a week.

The vast majority of folks in the US are deficient in Magnesium. Could be the root cause. Bloody doctors....

You're better off hungry than eating junk.


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## Sports Fan (Aug 21, 2014)

Abel i am really sorry you find yourself here.

Do not move out under any circumstances. Her wanting you to move out is cheaters code for i want you out of the way so i can carry on my affair without interferance from you.

You will have to ask yourself some hard questions and be prepared to face some harsh realities. You wife is in an Affair. Whether it is an EA or Physical you need to act and be strong. You cannot rug sweep this or nice her out of it.

If you have a joint banck account clear it out now to an account in your name. Do a 180 on her and expose the affair including to her boss.

Look after yourself and your children to the best of your abilities and as hard as it is have very little to do with your wife.

Visit a Divorce Lawyer and start proceedings. Do not negotiate with her or try to settle it between yourselves as a good will gestures. Insist that all her correspondence with you be sent to your lawyer.

If you really want a shot at reconciliation doing the above is the way to go. It is the only way to snap her out of the fog. That said she might not snap out of it but the realisation that her cosy little world is about to come crashing down is your only hope to fix this.


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## ThePheonix (Jan 3, 2013)

I'd bet 2:1 she's sleeping with this guy. You may as well accept it my man.


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## Dogbert (Jan 10, 2015)

Read:

*The 180*
*What I've Learned in the Past Year - A good news story*
*No More Mr Nice Guy*


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

> she came out and said, at this point she has nothing to lose....


Your wife thinks she is so smart, you think she is moving ahead in her career and so smart.

But in reality which I think you are beginning to see your wife is a selfish biotch.

She has a lot to lose. You.

I understand depression. I understand the pressures of owning your own business.

You are getting some really good advice. And your wife is using your depression and her fear of your possible reactions as an excuse to lie to you. As an excuse to have a relationship (EA for sure) with another man.

So stop giving her excuses and take back control.

A. never move out. If she wants a separation show her where the door is.
B. Lose the 50 pounds. have lost over 100 over 16 months.
C. Get your depression under control. Prozac can be an emotion killer so consult a Dr.
D. Go see an attorney to understand your rights in the state you live in. See if Infidelity helps you in any way.
E. Get the evidence on your wifes wayward actions. Do not lose your temper. Do not give her any reason to lock you up or force you out of your home.

Most importantly, think about a plan. That will ensure your future with or without your wife.

When you can envision a future like that then you are in control of your destiny.

Now get to work, stay calm and good luck. 

Get a var in her car and wherever else she talks when you are around and she wants privacy.

HM
PS
Do not discuss your plan or steps with your wife. Let her see you taking back control without her.

The 180 is your friend.


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## convert (Oct 4, 2013)

I know some here say not to expose at work but if he wants the marriage and he finds out she is in a PA (it sounds like it is already an EA). She would have to find another job so do not take exposure at work off the table, unless you want a D and it sounds like you might get alimony if she would stay in that job.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

Are you sure its the twenty five year old brother?


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## Abel402 (Jan 26, 2015)

You mean the 25 year old owners son?


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

Yes, didn't you say there was more than one brother working there?


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## Abel402 (Jan 26, 2015)

Yes, there are two brothers, the other is engaged (not that it matters)


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## Tasorundo (Apr 1, 2012)

Did you ever ask what the two words were? I think that could tell you a lot if you knew them.


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## cdbaker (Nov 5, 2010)

I know time can tend to feel like it's moving faster than it really is here on TAM, but have you ordered a VAR or two yet?

After all of the advice you've received here, what is your current overall plan now?


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## Abel402 (Jan 26, 2015)

I have ordered a var for her car to see if that helps with anything. I am going to take all of the advice from here and kind of step back with my emotions and anger and keep our conversation minute. 

I am planning on stopping at the gym after work and getting signed up and go there regularly to work on myself. I have already started on changing what I eat and looking forward to some weight loss and to get back to my old self and gain a little confidence.

It is kind of weird because after all of this I feel a little weight has been lifted off my shoulders and realize if I take care of myself like I used to, it will benefit me on my whole outlook on life and feel better both physically and mentally. Whether the marriage works or not, I will be a better person because of this!


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## vellocet (Oct 18, 2013)

Abel402 said:


> I am planning on stopping at the gym after work and getting signed up and go there regularly to work on myself. I have already started on changing what I eat and looking forward to some weight loss and to get back to my old self and gain a little confidence.


Good for you!!

Best thing you can do, and for yourself. And I'll tell you what else, any anger you might feel, or hurt by what your wife has done, its a GREAT motivator to push the weights.


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## Abel402 (Jan 26, 2015)

I am also a second degree black belt which I quit doing when I got my drivers license, Karate (Aam-Ka-Jutsu) took up my entire childhood, from 4 years old till I was 16... I was then ready to chase girls.

I have been thinking of getting back into some form of Martial Arts as well! Like everyone has said....its time to take care of me, and that is what I am going to do. I did not ask her what the two words were...Although the texts really hurt and hope to find out with the var that was all it was. But all in all im over it.

I have spent too much time being miserable over this and am ready to move on, either with her and my kids... or myself and a nice young lady that treats my right and vice versa.

I know my kids will always be a huge part in my love because I love them dearly... so that I am not worried about. If things work out....great, I think life is always better with two parents together rather than in a broken marriage.

I know I will run into more pain in this experience and I will be ready for it and be a strong person and be a man about it.... no more of the tears in front of her. I think that is one thing that affects our relationship.

I used to be such a mans man before the depression with a ton of confidence... I will strive to get back to that.


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## scatty (Mar 15, 2013)

I know how depression can be. It does not, however, mean you are somehow defective. If you need to be on an AD, ask your doc aobut wellbutrin, it doesn't have the horrible weight gain (usually) and doesn't affect sex (for future reference, please do not frook your wife again...who knows who's been there!)

You've been given good advice- take it and not leave your home and if she takes your kids somewhere else file for divorce and immediate return of your children to the marital home. Good luck!


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## G.J. (Nov 4, 2014)

Your taking the first steps of taking control of your life again Abel

We are all behind you


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## wmn1 (Aug 27, 2014)

Abel402 said:


> I have ordered a var for her car to see if that helps with anything. I am going to take all of the advice from here and kind of step back with my emotions and anger and keep our conversation minute.
> 
> I am planning on stopping at the gym after work and getting signed up and go there regularly to work on myself. I have already started on changing what I eat and looking forward to some weight loss and to get back to my old self and gain a little confidence.
> 
> It is kind of weird because after all of this I feel a little weight has been lifted off my shoulders and realize if I take care of myself like I used to, it will benefit me on my whole outlook on life and feel better both physically and mentally. Whether the marriage works or not, I will be a better person because of this!


good. Now whatever you do, don't move out !!!


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## just got it 55 (Mar 2, 2013)

Abel402 said:


> I have ordered a var for her car to see if that helps with anything. I am going to take all of the advice from here and kind of step back with my emotions and anger and keep our conversation minute.
> 
> I am planning on stopping at the gym after work and getting signed up and go there regularly to work on myself. I have already started on changing what I eat and looking forward to some weight loss and to get back to my old self and gain a little confidence.
> 
> It is kind of weird because after all of this I feel a little weight has been lifted off my shoulders and realize if I take care of myself like I used to, it will benefit me on my whole outlook on life and feel better both physically and mentally. Whether the marriage works or not, I will be a better person because of this!


 Abel first of all sorry you are here

Please listen to your own advice here It's a great start

Please do not leave the home You have been advised that several times.

HM64 's post is dead on.

Take control of your life and marriage.

55


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

DO NOT MOVE OUT.

Hire a PI to follow her and get proof. 

Tell her to stop. When she refuses, call her parents and siblings and expose the affair to them. Call her boss and let him know what she's doing with his son, and let him know that you're looking at your legal options.

Sit back and wait for her to get done blowing up at you.

THEN get started on ending the affair and fixing the marriage.


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## Abel402 (Jan 26, 2015)

Guys and Gals, I am not moving out... I don't think that would help anything in the first place. Since getting on here and talking to you...I have decided to make changes like I said above. I feel great in just the little time I have spent on here and it has truly help me realize what is going on, and with me not taking care of myself.... has really just dropped my self esteem. Just today for example, I honestly felt as if I had taken a happy pill... I feel better mentally and physically.

I know the journey ahead will be long and hard, but if the way I feel today is just a sample of what to come.....then GAME ON!


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

Abel402 said:


> Guys and Gals, I am not moving out... I don't think that would help anything in the first place. Since getting on here and talking to you...I have decided to make changes like I said above. I feel great in just the little time I have spent on here and it has truly help me realize what is going on, and with me not taking care of myself.... has really just dropped my self esteem. Just today for example, I honestly felt as if I had taken a happy pill... I feel better mentally and physically.
> 
> I know the journey ahead will be long and hard, but if the way I feel today is just a sample of what to come.....then GAME ON!


It's about time you pulled your head out of your @ss and started acting like that highschool kid that wasn't affraid to go to blows with anyone.

Chicks like confident guys!

Your old lady is phucking around with some punk and its time to show her the new reality if it continues!

No more crying at least not in front of your old lady....go to the garage like the rest of us. Again your old lady must see a confident guy and can and will replace her.

Phuck the seperation bullcrap...tell your old lady it's all or nothing and divorce will be the course of action if she wants to continue to screw around with punk POS 2aa whole.




All this crap has one thing and one thing only and that's your old lady has eyes for someone else and she is in a fantasy that is going to break up the family unit.

So brother having been there I can tell you one thing and that is raise your attraction level by having the confidence to let your chick go if she wants to continue with this bull shyt.


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

You guys got to kids and your old lady doesn't think she needs you????/What the phuck make her so selfish????

Your old lady needs to check her shyt and think about keeping those kids in a healthy two parent home. 

Separation just means you share your wife with other penises so make it clear there will be no separation if she leaves then it is on her for breaking up the family cuz you'll divorce her @ss cuz sharing her is out of the phucking question!


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

Start collecting boxes.....but instead of packing your shyt...start packing her crap.....

That will show her you are confident enough to replace her cheating @ss.


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

Next time she goes out to the bar with the "girls"...move all her crap to the spare room or put it in the living room.

And when she comes home and want to know WTF...tell her you don't want the stink of other guys near you!

If you think she behave this way at the work place, just imagine how she behave when she is at a bar drinking!!!!!!!


All this crap you are dealing with is just not you...it's not all your fault...your old lady lost her moral compass a long time ago.


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## Dogbert (Jan 10, 2015)

Separation is code for "I want the benefits of acting single while still having the benefits of being married"

Can you say the word "cake eater" boys and girls? I knew you could.


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

"cake eater"


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## vellocet (Oct 18, 2013)

turnera said:


> DO NOT MOVE OUT.
> 
> Hire a PI to follow her and get proof.
> 
> ...


If he were to have gone through all of that......then why would you suggest ending the affair and fixing anything? After all that, especially if she refuses, there is nothing to fix.

If the situation played out like you said above then what we have is:

-she refuses to stop
-he blows up her world with widespread exposure
-instead of coming around...she blows up at him, showing no remorse.

.......and he is to keep her after that? why?

I know, this hasn't happened, just commenting on the possibility if the scenario played out in your example.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

meh, it happens both ways. Some women are mortified and vow never to go through it again and come back to the fold and become model wives because of what they've learned from exposure.

Of course in YOUR world view, NO woman is ever worthy of redemption once they've cheated, so it's understandable you'd see only the worst case.


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## cdbaker (Nov 5, 2010)

vellocet said:


> If he were to have gone through all of that......then why would you suggest ending the affair and fixing anything? After all that, especially if she refuses, there is nothing to fix.
> 
> If the situation played out like you said above then what we have is:
> 
> ...


It all depends on what the OP ultimately wants to have happen here. If he indeed loves her and would like to give the marriage every effort to survive, then I think Turnera's advice is sound, in fact I think it's pretty standard procedure. 

Problem: Spouse refuses to end or maybe acknowledge affair. 
Solution: Remove their ability to hide/deny it by exposing it to the world. Offer a simple explanation to friends, family members (the Cheating spouses family especially) and if the affair partner is a co-worker, and depending on your willingness to take on risks, her boss/co-workers as well. Even if he/she was effectively fooling themselves into believing that they weren't doing anything wrong, the new found spotlight and non-affair fog inflicted friends and family will be able to clear that confusion right up.
Cheating Spouses Natural Gut Reaction: Get angry. He/she were naturally enjoying their selfish little fantasy world in which they were living and feeling entitled to. The BS's action of blowing that up to the scrutiny and judgement of their friends/family, and the feelings of guilt/shame that brings with it, naturally makes them lash out at the person who caused it, the BS. They aren't thinking about how what they were doing was wrong, especially if they deluded themselves into believing they weren't doing anything wrong (common with EA's). Add in the fact that the marriage was probably in a rough place anyway and now that is maybe all they have left, and it makes sense why they might be initially angry.

Ultimately, the affair usually goes in one of two directions. 1. They break up. The guilt/shame/humiliation is too much and their relationship isn't strong enough to bear it. 2. The relationship goes public, the cheating spouse and affair partner make it official that they are in a relationship and willing to deal with the ramifications of that. Honestly, I think the 1st direction is most common though. With the affair over (at least for a moment, there is always the chance that it re-ignites after the dust settles a bit) the cheating spouse can then have some time to wake up and realize what they've done and think about what they really want. For some, they decide that they wanted out of the marriage anyway and they go the divorce route. For others, they choose to give the marriage another chance, recommit, and since the betrayed spouse has also probably had their own "wake up call" from discovering the affair, they can both work together to better themselves and the marriage.

I think we're just saying that if the betrayed spouse still wants to save the marriage in this type of situation, is willing to forgive and rebuild, then this is usually the best bet.


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## vellocet (Oct 18, 2013)

turnera said:


> Of course in YOUR world view, NO woman is ever worthy of redemption once they've cheated, so it's understandable you'd see only the worst case.


Oh geez, just stop. You clearly didn't read what I said. I was referring to the situation YOU put out there, *YOUR EXAMPLE*. Not a situation in which he exposes and she actually acts remorseful and not angry defensiveness. I personally, yes, would never take back a cheating woman. But other people are not me and it depends on the situation of what I advise.

If you want to play that game though, in YOUR world view, a cheating woman should be understood and given the benefit of the doubt, and if the woman cheats, it must be because something the man did or didn't do.


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## vellocet (Oct 18, 2013)

cdbaker said:


> It all depends on what the OP ultimately wants to have happen here. If he indeed loves her and would like to give the marriage every effort to survive, then I think Turnera's advice is sound, in fact I think it's pretty standard procedure.


If turnera's *example* was one of a wife that was remorseful and wanted to work on the marriage, then I absolutely agree.

But that wasn't what her *example* was about. Her example was a man that pulls out all the stops to expose, etc, only to have a wife that blows up at him, rather than being remorseful.

So basically her *example* is of a man that goes through all this crap, only to have the cheating wife further indicate she has no remorse, and still he should take her back.

She would never suggest a wife do this with a cheating husband.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

In my example, I never discussed what happens after the blowup after the exposure - AFTER the realization that she's been exposed and has no way to hide it any more, and then realizes she has to either give up the affair or accept it full on and move in with the AP. 

Almost NO cheater has remorse the same day or even week they are exposed. It's the build up of comments from people, looks from people, UN-invitations, etc., that has the effect on the cheater and gets them to decide their course.

And yes, I tell women expose, sit back, let the sh*t hit the fan, wait it out, and see if the cheater comes back hat in hand. And move on as if you're divorcing in the meantime.


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## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

Abel402 said:


> In our conversation, she came out and said, at this point she has nothing to lose.... and me moving out and working on me and getting back to the man she fell in love with is what needs to happen. As her career has slowly blossomed I kind of let her take over... Now she has used that to her advantage and looks at my like im nothing.


Abel...moving out will do anything but help improving you. Is clinical depression going to be helped in a lonesome apartment? Where is the support from the W to get you out of this funk and into a good spot in life/marriage? It sure the heck is not down the street in an apartment. 

Do not move out.


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

Abel

I think going back to some form of martial arts will be good for you.

A safe place to vent your anger.

Take it one step at a time.

Diet, exercise and get your depression under control by putting your self esteem above it.

Walk tall, look good all the time, work hard and play more with your kids.

HM


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## helolover (Aug 24, 2012)

Abel402 said:


> I have ordered a var for her car to see if that helps with anything. I am going to take all of the advice from here and kind of step back with my emotions and anger and keep our conversation minute.
> 
> I am planning on stopping at the gym after work and getting signed up and go there regularly to work on myself. I have already started on changing what I eat and looking forward to some weight loss and to get back to my old self and gain a little confidence.
> 
> It is kind of weird because after all of this I feel a little weight has been lifted off my shoulders and realize if I take care of myself like I used to, it will benefit me on my whole outlook on life and feel better both physically and mentally. Whether the marriage works or not, I will be a better person because of this!


Good path. Taking care of yourself will be key in your salvation. 

1. stop eating crap. Remove processed foods from your diet. Get rid of sugars. Watch the weight melt off. Do this today. It's going to be uncomfortable for a few days, but your body will adjust. 
2. Lift weights. So many programs out there. If you need a good starter, drop me a line.
3. Invest good time in yourself. Read, hike, walk, run. Take a road trip all by yourself. 
4. Meet your own needs - from physical to emotional. Do not rely on your WW to do this. 
5. Get individual counseling for yourself.
6. Don't move out of your house. This will only give her massive freedoms to date her boyfriend on your dime. DO NOT DO THIS. At the very least, separate bedrooms - she can go to the spare room.
7. Get legal counseling. Open your eyes to the reality you may be divorcing over this. It will give you an idea of what the process is so you can think about it. Keep your legal counseling to yourself. 
8. Stop engaging in arguments with your wife. Less is more. Stop broadcasting your intentions. Stop emotional engagement and manipulation. Live your own life. If you don't have one, re-read steps 1-7 and get a life. 
9. Figure out and accept your participation in how your marriage landed here. You played a part. You allowed it to get here. Accept responsibility for your portion, fix yourself and move forward. Your goal is to be a better man - for you. You cannot fix, rescue or save your wife. She's going to do what she is going to do. Get some strong boundaries with her. Research what you will into her infidelity. You have enough evidence something is going on. There are definitely some red flags, but don't let it become your goal in life to become super spy. If she's stepping out, let her OM at work have her. She's not a prize. High value men (like yourself) don't allow themselves to be cuckolded. 
10. Read. I suggest Mark Manson for overall good articles on life. I also suggest reading the rational male by Rollo Tomassi. Actually, that's a must-read in my opinion for all men. 

Here to support. 

HL


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## Q tip (Apr 15, 2014)

turnera said:


> meh, it happens both ways. Some women are mortified and vow never to go through it again and come back to the fold and become model wives because of what they've learned from exposure.
> 
> Of course in YOUR world view, NO woman is ever worthy of redemption once they've cheated, so it's understandable you'd see only the worst case.


You are right, Turnera. And you are right about world views...

I think of Tears every time I hear of a cheating W. I think about Tears and her sad, detailed story. And I would be that H who rejects her absolutely. Without question.

If I were to cheat, I would expect the same from my W. No less. 

It hurts... everyone.


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## Q tip (Apr 15, 2014)

OP,

Depression can be brought about by a magnesium deficiency. Check into it. Like I mentioned earlier, LEF.ORG


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## bigfoot (Jan 22, 2014)

I saw where she said that you were not the man she married. This is bs. People change as they get older. The short sighted hot head of 21 matures into a reflective 30-year-old. Life happens to us all. She is deceiving you with that statement. Besides, she is not who you married. I don't think that you intentionally married a lying cheating manipulating deceitful woman. My point is you're fine she's not.

If I were you I would respond to her by telling her that she is not who you married. She is not the type of woman that you would have considered marrying. Tell her she needs to leave and fix herself but that she needs to understand once she leaves, she does not get to come back, fixed or not. If you for some reason you want her, and goodness knows I don't know why you would, then you can tell her she needs to start fixing herself now and she can stay andown you all work it out. Otherwise, she can leave but she can't come back. 

By the way I would tell her employer that his son is involved in an improper relationship with your wife.

It is never the job of the betrayed to win back the cheater. You can't please crazy, you can't meet the standards set by liar.


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## Abel402 (Jan 26, 2015)

I have started this week on working on me.... I already can feel the difference physically and mentally. I know I will be better off ,now taking care of myself whether it is with or without her.


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## Abel402 (Jan 26, 2015)

Havent replied in a bit but thought I would give an update! I have continued to work on myself with dieting and exercise and feel much better. I do need to set a dr. appointment and get the depression meds all figured out but everything has been pretty good.

As far as me and the wives relationship, I have kept cordial and have just been taking it easy. I plan on putting the var in the car tonight for the big valentines day tomorrow.... I figured if there was going to be anything caught it would probably be the perfect time.

Me moving out has never been brought back up again so I don't know if that's a good thing or bad thing.... but as of now, I feel good and get to be with my kids instead of the bull**** apartment idea.
My only other thing that I have dealt with for a long time is the sexual frustration... (not having sex) I dint know what to do about that part of the situation.


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## Lostinthought61 (Nov 5, 2013)

IF you have any chance in saving this marriage you need to STAY PUT...it is your home too and you need to be there...you also need to pull 180 on her.


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

Don't move out.

Are you both sleeping in the same bed?


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

Get that VAR in her car. You should have done it weeks ago.

Stay cool no matter what you hear.
Use the information to your advantage.


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

I am all for rubbing one out, but I suggest you go and get your self out there....volunteers, join a club, and just hang out.

Play it cool and wait for that one person that wants all that sexual frustration and enjoy the new relationship.

Good things come to those who wait.


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## Abel402 (Jan 26, 2015)

happyman64 said:


> Don't move out.
> 
> Are you both sleeping in the same bed?



Yes we sleep in the same bed.


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## Abel402 (Jan 26, 2015)

happyman64 said:


> Get that VAR in her car. You should have done it weeks ago.
> 
> Stay cool no matter what you hear.
> Use the information to your advantage.



I should have done it weeks ago, I just wanted things to calm down I guess if there is still something going on, they will probably be more comfortable now things have calmed down a bit at home.


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## Abel402 (Jan 26, 2015)

I did recently have a chance to get back on her phone and there was no evidence.... so im guessing if they still text or chat its deleted right away.

I put the var in her car and will wait and see if it works.... was kind of tricky finding a spot to put it.


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## Dogbert (Jan 10, 2015)

You may want to read *The List* in case you are ready to D.


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## just got it 55 (Mar 2, 2013)

Abel anything good to update ?

55


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## OldWolf57 (Mar 20, 2012)

Checking on you A, hoping the VAR didn't pick up anything too bad.


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## MovingAhead (Dec 27, 2012)

Abel,

You are doing good with the gym etc... Diet is more important... Lots of chicken, lots of eggs and beans, little bread...

Cut out the sodas, regular tea if you must, water is best.

As for your kids, actively make them lunch, dinner, and breakfast, help them with their homework, do cool projects with them. (I just built a rocket with mine)

Male sure you do these things with your kids. You are their dad so you definitely should. Show you are the primary care giver and if your wife ends of cheating and you catch her, you can win primary custody and have her pay CS.

If she is not having sex with you that is a problem. As you lose the weight take care of your self in all ways. Dress nice, get a nice hair cut. trim nice... Start doing those things. If you catch her attention and she decides to be a good wife good. If you don't, well you will benefit by taking care of yourself anyway.


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## Abel402 (Jan 26, 2015)

Nothing new really, The var hasn't caught anything out of the ordinary.... I did find out something kind of cool though, for some reason my sons Ipad is showing all of her text messages that she makes on her phone.

I don't know how, but this will be great help for me... there has been no contact between the two via text other than work related stuff and that has been very minimal. But I will definitely see now if anything changes.

As far as my diet goes I have gotten a bit off track because of not seeing much change.... I do know that change takes time and will continue to work on myself. My old doctor had left the practice so I am seeing a new one this Friday. I will let you all know how that goes.

I really appreciate you guys being interested in what I have going, its nice to have someone in your corner... Thank you all


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

Abel402 said:


> Nothing new really, The var hasn't caught anything out of the ordinary.... I did find out something kind of cool though, for some reason *my sons Ipad is showing all of her text messages that she makes on her phone.*
> 
> *I don't know how*, but this will be great help for me... there has been no contact between the two via text other than work related stuff and that has been very minimal. But I will definitely see now if anything changes.
> 
> ...


That's because both devices (your wife's iPhone and your son's iPad) are logged into Apple's iMessage service using the same iCloud/iTunes account.

How old is your son?

Do you have the e-mail address and password associated w/ the iCloud/iTunes account?

What kind of phone do *you* use?


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## Abel402 (Jan 26, 2015)

Me, my wife and daughter all have iphones... and the kids have ipads as well.


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

Abel402 said:


> Me, my wife and daughter all have iphones... and the kids have ipads as well.


Do you use the same iCloud/iTunes account on all of them?

If not, what's the breakdown (i.e. my account on my phone, wife's account on the rest, etc)? And PLEEEAAAAASE don't make any changes to any of them before providing feedback on this.


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## Roselyn (Sep 19, 2010)

Expose the affair to the owner of the company. If this relationship sours, they know that they will be liable for a lawsuit; it can turn into a sexual harassment issue. No one wants an affair in the workplace, especially if it involves the owner and his/her offspring to a married woman with a child. I'm sure that your wife is resented in the workplace. Favoritism is always frowned upon by co-workers especially if the favored one earned their merits by laying on their backs.

In addition, who wants to welcome a would be family member who is married and a cheater? Entrepreneurs are proud people. If you don't mind having your wife sacked from her workplace, expose her. You have your reasons to remain in your marriage. Your choice.


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## Abel402 (Jan 26, 2015)

We all use the same iTunes and apple id, I am the only person that uses the icloud service.

I did figure it out though, when I went into the text settings on his ipad, you have a choice which numbers and email addresses you want to have on there and my wifes number is checked. I checked my phone and guess I could do the same.... but I think I will leave it the way it is so she doesn't get suspicious.

Once I confronted her a while back, the texting has stopped between the two of them, So I don't know if they have moved on to another way of communicating outside of the workplace or not.
This day and age it seems easier and easier to hide your transgressions.

I am just going to keep taking care of myself and playing it cool and see if anything shows up on the ipad. Things have been going better, but I don't plan on leaving my guard down with her, that's for sure. We were talking today and she brought up work and I carefully brought up lunch without raising suspicion... She had said that Her, The owner, owners son, and another older guy always go out to lunch together... so I don't think anything is happening then.

I will just play the waiting game I guess until I find out it really didn't get past the texts I saw, or its way pass that and I will get concrete evidence....


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## Plan 9 from OS (Jul 13, 2012)

All 4 go out every day? So, it would be out of bounds if you wanted to take your wife out to lunch? Unless she punches a time clock, that makes zero sense.


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

VAR in the car.

And no, don't make any changes to the iMessage config on your phone, because every other device using that account will instantly receive a notification once you do. Plus it will be way too difficult to keep track of who sent what to who.

Next question... do you have the password associated w/ the Apple iTunes/iCloud account? If you think you do, but aren't sure, try downloading something from the App Store on your device.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

VAR in the car.


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## Abel402 (Jan 26, 2015)

Plan 9 from OS said:


> All 4 go out every day? So, it would be out of bounds if you wanted to take your wife out to lunch? Unless she punches a time clock, that makes zero sense.



What I meant by this is, we were talking about her day to day and work stuff and her lunch activities were brought up and who all goes to lunch together. We can go to lunch any day.... that isn't a problem


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## Abel402 (Jan 26, 2015)

turnera said:


> VAR in the car.



I do have a var in the car.


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## Abel402 (Jan 26, 2015)

GusPolinski said:


> VAR in the car.
> 
> And no, don't make any changes to the iMessage config on your phone, because every other device using that account will instantly receive a notification once you do. Plus it will be way too difficult to keep track of who sent what to who.
> 
> Next question... do you have the password associated w/ the Apple iTunes/iCloud account? If you think you do, but aren't sure, try downloading something from the App Store on your device.


I do have the password for the iTunes account, I buy all my music off of there. The only thing I do have to be careful of is my daughter seeing anything weird I buy. I downloaded a gps app and she asked what it was in front of my wife.


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

Abel402 said:


> I do have the password for the iTunes account, I buy all my music off of there. The only thing I do have to be careful of is my daughter seeing anything weird I buy. I downloaded a gps app and she asked what it was in front of my wife.


What did you download... "Find My iPhone" or "Find My Friends"?


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## Abel402 (Jan 26, 2015)

I don't remember what it was honestly, I tried using it and it didn't work right anyway. It was a gps of some sort. Other than the var in her car... from now on that's all I will use. I think if anymore is done I will back to the point I was when I first found the texts.

I don't want to be there again, I don't want it to consume my life by worrying about what she is doing at all times. If I here something on the var or have another gut feeling im missing something and it surfaces, I will be done and file papers.... I have better things to do.


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## poida (Jan 17, 2014)

razgor said:


> Abel, sorry you are going through this. First do NOT move out. That will be the end of your marriage for sure. Second, read the books the other people have posted. Third, definitely follow the earlier advice and read weight lifters thread.
> 
> Her changing her passcode after you looked at is a sure sign of something going on. Personally, I would not spend a lot of time trying to dig up evidence. You already know who she is talking too. You already know that she is looking elsewhere. It is time for action.
> 
> ...


I agree, pass-code is a deal breaker. It is her commitment to giving you an opening back into her heart.

No pass-code = no marriage.

Everything seems like it is in flux at the moment. She is preparing to leave you. This has been going on for some time.

The unfortunate reality is that this is how some women operate. They don't see it as their responsibility to clearly and intimately tell their partner that they are not happy. I'm of the opinion that this is because a) They are self centred, b) They have difficulty communicating very deep, personal issues (as my wife did), c) You never had a deep trust connection with your wife, d) Sense of general entitlement as a woman.


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

Abel402 said:


> I don't remember what it was honestly, I tried using it and it didn't work right anyway. It was a gps of some sort. Other than the var in her car... from now on that's all I will use. I think if anymore is done I will back to the point I was when I first found the texts.
> 
> I don't want to be there again, I don't want it to consume my life by worrying about what she is doing at all times. If I here something on the var or have another gut feeling im missing something and it surfaces, I will be done and file papers.... I have better things to do.


Alllllrighty. Best of luck to you.


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## Abel402 (Jan 26, 2015)

Sorry, I didn't mean to come off as rude.... if I did, I apologize.
It just seems all of the stuff going on in my life is a bit overwhelming as far as my marriage goes. What I was trying to say is its very easy for me to let this affair consume me and im trying to keep a grip on everything.

All of you have done nothing but help and I really appreciate that, just trying not to lose any sleep on this deal like I did at the beginning. I will be vigilante as far as things go and need to realize I will probably have to keep tabs on her I guess until all of this is figured out.


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

Abel402 said:


> Sorry, I didn't mean to come off as rude.... if I did, I apologize.
> It just seems all of the stuff going on in my life is a bit overwhelming as far as my marriage goes. What I was trying to say is its very easy for me to let this affair consume me and im trying to keep a grip on everything.
> 
> All of you have done nothing but help and I really appreciate that, just trying not to lose any sleep on this deal like I did at the beginning. I will be vigilante as far as things go and need to realize I will probably have to keep tabs on her I guess until all of this is figured out.


You didn't come off as rude. Not in the least.

If anything, you sound like you're exhausted w/ all of this. And i get it.

Some red flags have been thrown your way, and you've been sort of rolling w/ the punches and spinning your wheels w/ the threat of separation/divorce looming over your head ever since. You've been looking, but you've not been able to find anything definitive. Again, I get it.

You're doing the VAR, and that's good. But the phone, man... she changed the passcode on the phone. Based on that alone, it's a pretty good bet that there's something on the phone that she doesn't want you to see.

Tell you what... check your PM inbox here in a few.


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## Abel402 (Jan 26, 2015)

I have been able to get back on her phone and looked at the texts.... all texts between them to have basically came to a halt. If anything, I think they have just moved on to another way of communicating, like snapchat or something. That's kind of why I got overwhelmed a few posts ago. 

I caught her In the ea, and things changed for the better... but then came to the conclusion that in this day an age, there are so many ways of cheating and not getting caught...its exhausting. I didn't even know what snapchat was until I asked my daughter. 

What a brilliant way to use technology, now she can just use snapchat and be undetected. And in her mind as long as she isn't texting, I will never be able to see whats going on. In my previous post I said I didn't have time to go through this, but what I guess I meant is, I am going to harden up with her and show her I am the strong person I once was and not worry about how she feels anymore.

She is the one that cheated.... not me, and it seems that I am the only one that is suffering for what she has done.


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## G.J. (Nov 4, 2014)

I see earlier in the post that you still share the same bed, have you been intimate with her since the 'I love you but I'm not in love you talk'
If not when was the last time ?

Do you think you will go back into Karate or keep to the gym?
Both are good uplighters to your self


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## Abel402 (Jan 26, 2015)

G.J. said:


> I see earlier in the post that you still share the same bed, have you been intimate with her since the 'I love you but I'm not in love you talk'
> If not when was the last time ?
> 
> Do you think you will go back into Karate or keep to the gym?
> Both are good uplighters to your self



We still have not been intimate, last time was probably 8+ months ago. It really drives me insane that it has been this way for this long as far a sex goes. I stated before, our sex life has pretty much been non existent for the last 2 years. before all of this, my wife had brought this issue up on a visit to the lady doctor. The doctor prescribed a cream but it didn't change anything.

Honestly our sex life hasn't been the same since our last child, and he is 8 years old... ive never really said anything but every since then her lady parts have never been the same. I think she had gotten way lazy on the exercise that a women is supposed to do to tighten everything back up... which in turn could be one of the problems in our sex life.

If I can feel the difference, im sure she can as well. We have always been pretty reserved about talking about sex in that way so ive never brought it up thinking I would hurt her feelings.


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## Plan 9 from OS (Jul 13, 2012)

Abel402 said:


> I have been able to get back on her phone and looked at the texts.... all texts between them to have basically came to a halt. If anything, I think they have just moved on to another way of communicating, like snapchat or something. That's kind of why I got overwhelmed a few posts ago.
> 
> *I caught her In the ea*, and things changed for the better... but then came to the conclusion that in this day an age, there are so many ways of cheating and not getting caught...its exhausting. I didn't even know what snapchat was until I asked my daughter.
> 
> ...


You only hope that's all it was. The guy's local, right? You going to tell me that you're confident that this is just an EA? NFW.


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## Plan 9 from OS (Jul 13, 2012)

Abel402 said:


> We still have not been intimate, last time was probably 8+ months ago. It really drives me insane that it has been this way for this long as far a sex goes. I stated before, our sex life has pretty much been non existent for the last 2 years. before all of this, my wife had brought this issue up on a visit to the lady doctor. The doctor prescribed a cream but it didn't change anything.
> 
> Honestly our sex life hasn't been the same since our last child, and he is 8 years old... ive never really said anything but every since then her lady parts have never been the same. I think she had gotten way lazy on the exercise that a women is supposed to do to tighten everything back up... which in turn could be one of the problems in our sex life.
> 
> If I can feel the difference, im sure she can as well. We have always been pretty reserved about talking about sex in that way so ive never brought it up thinking I would hurt her feelings.


Most likely, you two got sucked into the parent trap. You put too much effort into the kids and not enough into the marriage. As such, you both lost your marital connection hence the sex life dwindled. She found someone not associated with the trudgery of her daily life - kids probably well off being the son of the owner. Her loins are on fire for this OM, and most likely they have had a physical affair due to proximity to each other. Her libido drop was most likely due to what I described above. I have no doubts her libido is just fine. 

All my opinion. I can't prove it. But that's the most likely explanation to all this based on what I know in this thread.


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## MarriedDude (Jun 21, 2014)

Abel402 said:


> *As far as my diet goes I have gotten a bit off track because of not seeing much change.... I do know that change takes time and will continue to work on myself.*



It is hard for the person that is doing the work to get healthy to actually see the changes. Trust me...half the time when I see myself I still see the guy that had an extra 100#'s on him. I lost the majority of the weight almost 2 years ago...still hardly notice changes myself. Even though I now wear size 34 pants and 2 years ago was wearing size 44. 

Something that can help is to pick a day of the week...any day. And take a picture of yourself -full front and a full side shot. Do this once per week. after a month, review the pics. The photos don't lie. You will see the changes. It is very helpful. That is what kept and keeps me motivated. It will also help significantly with confidence in your program. 

Lift heavy weights...Squat, bench, Barbell Rows, Dead-lift. That will give you the biggest bang for the buck and the pounds will really start to melt. 

Your wife will notice the changes way way way before you do. As well as those around you.


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## Abel402 (Jan 26, 2015)

Plan 9 from OS said:


> You only hope that's all it was. The guy's local, right? You going to tell me that you're confident that this is just an EA? NFW.


No not saying that at all.... for all I know they could be having a PA the whole time she has worked at this company. This has been the first job that she has actually had people to talk to whether it be male or female. Every other job she has had, she was miserable at. In my opinion and from the texts I saw.... she now has someone who she can talk to and will give her compliments and whatever else she is getting from this 25 year old guy that she thinks she is not getting at home....

I have changed since I have first saw the texting, I went from being beside myself moping and feeling sorry for myself, to now feeling like she is the one with everything to lose... whether we stay together or not, I know I will feel better after sorting this out. Things will have to change regardless... im not going to stick around and let her do what she wants, even if we have two kids.


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## Abel402 (Jan 26, 2015)

Plan 9 from OS said:


> Most likely, you two got sucked into the parent trap. You put too much effort into the kids and not enough into the marriage. As such, you both lost your marital connection hence the sex life dwindled. She found someone not associated with the trudgery of her daily life - kids probably well off being the son of the owner. Her loins are on fire for this OM, and most likely they have had a physical affair due to proximity to each other. Her libido drop was most likely due to what I described above. I have no doubts her libido is just fine.
> 
> All my opinion. I can't prove it. But that's the most likely explanation to all this based on what I know in this thread.


Totally agree on the parent trap deal.... As far as the other guy, he is 25, two years out of school.. him and his brother bought a little house that they live together in. As far as a high paying job, that isn't the case.... but disposable income is always far greater when you are single, no kids and spitting a small mortgage with your brother. When we first had the talk after finding the text, her reasons for not being happy with me was, not wanting to go out and do things..... well she is seeing this guy going to the bars, going out all of the time and living the 25 year old single life. That is attractive to anyone with 2 kids playing 3 sports each and our lives being consumed with everything to do with our kids.


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## Plan 9 from OS (Jul 13, 2012)

Abel402 said:


> Totally agree on the parent trap deal.... As far as the other guy, he is 25, two years out of school.. him and his brother bought a little house that they live together in. As far as a high paying job, that isn't the case.... but disposable income is always far greater when you are single, no kids and spitting a small mortgage with your brother. When we first had the talk after finding the text, her reasons for not being happy with me was, not wanting to go out and do things..... well she is seeing this guy going to the bars, going out all of the time and living the 25 year old single life. That is attractive to anyone with 2 kids playing 3 sports each and our lives being consumed with everything to do with our kids.


JMHO, but 2 sports max. Any kids on travel teams? Those are huge time sinks on a more grand scale than playing sports locally. Your kids have no business being on travel teams unless there is a real chance that one or both may end up getting an athletic scholarship for college. Otherwise, waste of time. No doubt there are activities on top of the sports.


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

> I am going to harden up with her and show her I am the strong person I once was and not worry about how she feels anymore.


That is the best self advice and the correct attitude to take. It is the essence of the 180.

To focus on yourself and become strong.

But do yourself a favor. Talk to her about the sex. You have nothing to lose.

My sex life dropped off. The issues were mine (diabetes). But my wife thought I was no longer attracted to her. That was not the case but because we never discussed sex in a serious manner her thoughts picked the worst scenarios. I felt horrible.....

So do not use a lack of communication as an excuse on either of your sides.

Deal with it. Or at least try to.

Keep us posted.

HM


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## Abel402 (Jan 26, 2015)

My daughter is on a select soccer and basketball team, and both of those travel. My son just plays ydp soccer (local) and the same with basketball and football.

My daughter is on the u12 elite team and they travel all over, next year there planning a trip to England. It crazy all of the stuff you do for your kids.... but I am sure that is a lot of the problem.


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

All that running around can kill a relationship.

Unless you can do it together.


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## Abel402 (Jan 26, 2015)

Agreed, seems as there is no time for us anymore... we also had kids young (married at 21 and first child at 23).


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

Abel402 said:


> ...now she can just use snapchat and be undetected.


Not quite.

Stay tuned...


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## Abel402 (Jan 26, 2015)

Also, I haven't been able to get into the doctor.... and my normal doctor is no longer around. I have an appointment with a new doctor and will go over some things with him. I ran out of my meds (Prozac) a while back and can definitely tell the difference.

My mind is clearer, and im not as easy going as I was on my meds. 
My wife continues to ask me if there is something wrong, she always says I seem agitated.


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## cdbaker (Nov 5, 2010)

As it relates to snapchat, the app is forbidden in our house and I whenever I hear it mentioned by friends/co-workers I always immediately share my opinion that it is an app that really serves no other purpose aside from deceitful communication. That's really all it exists for. It's one single defining feature is text/photo/video communication with absolutely no "paper trail", no way to track or save the communication. There are plenty of other equally popular services available, but this is the only one that enables a user to conceal all of their activity. So I see absolutely no innocent purpose behind having this app on a device.

I'm assuming you've seen this app on her phone? Honestly, I'd confront her about that immediately and insist that she delete it. She can try to defend it any way she wants to, like she has a few friends that use it that prefer that method. Well I guarantee that those friends use other means of digital communications that they use as well, means that aren't SPECIFICALLY DESIGNED for deceit. Hopefully that will deliver the point clearly.


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## Abel402 (Jan 26, 2015)

Me, my wife and daughter were setting on the couch watching tv and my daughter was on snapchat.... I brought it up how the app is terrible and that anyone above the age of 10 uses it for nothing but to hide what they are doing from others.... I left it at that because of my daughter setting there.

Not to long ago she had asked me a question about me being on her phone because when she had looked at her phone her texts window was open. I told her no I hadn't and if I did I would have told her...

She again said she has nothing to hide and I know the passcode. She hadn't given it to me, but I do the now the passcode. Last time I looked it is as if she doesn't text him anymore...lol I guess she thinks of me being ignorant thinking that if she wants to text him, she just cant delete the complete line of texts?

I really don't think much has changed since we had our talk when I found the original texts.... im sure she is more carefull now, the var hasn't picked anything up at all, the " lunch group" go to lunch together.... (Owner, Dave the old guy, Owners son and my wife) so im sure the owner and the old guy ride together and my wife is riding with the owners son which is who the EA is with.


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## G.J. (Nov 4, 2014)

Abel402 said:


> the " lunch group" go to lunch together.... (Owner, Dave the old guy, Owners son and my wife) so im sure the owner and the old guy ride together *and my wife is riding with the owners son which is who the EA is with.*




ermm
May I suggest you take a couple of dinner times off and monitor the .............err.......lunch's...............


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## Abel402 (Jan 26, 2015)

It would be hard for me to really monitor what happens at lunch without being seen, My truck doesn't blend in well... When this first began, I drove down by her work and as soon as I drove by she called me to see what was going on. The truck is a diesel and can be heard for blocks.


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## G.J. (Nov 4, 2014)

Abel402 said:


> It would be hard for me to really monitor what happens at lunch without being seen, My truck doesn't blend in well... When this first began, I drove down by her work and as soon as I drove by she called me to see what was going on. The truck is a diesel and can be heard for blocks.


Hire a car for 1/2 a day, ask a friend, hire P.I. just for a couple of lunch's, find out where they go and get there before and see if the two show up with the other two
Find out where he lives and monitor his house at lunch


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Good grief, man, *I'll* come up there and follow her for you if you don't have the fortitude to get it done SOMEHOW.


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## G.J. (Nov 4, 2014)

One other thing would be to get a mini GPS traker and put it in the hem of her coat or some thing she tends to take with her if possible

Add
you would break the law if you got a small magnetic one to put on his car (cough)


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## Abel402 (Jan 26, 2015)

I should probably just get off my arse and get it done


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## NosborCrop (Feb 25, 2015)

Abel402 said:


> I should probably just get off my arse and get it done


:iagree::iagree::iagree:


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

If you have a bar in her car and the boyfriend is in the car, why isn't it picking up the convrstions between them? This has me puzzled.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

Can't you put find my phone on her phone?


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

So you assume all of them are going to lunch together because she told you that? That's a stretch.

How has your sex life changed I the last couple of years? Better worse the same?


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## z_man (Nov 1, 2013)

Chaparral said:


> If you have a bar in her car and the boyfriend is in the car, why isn't it picking up the convrstions between them? This has me puzzled.



Unless she is riding in his car?


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

I miss Read his post.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

Put a pen var in her purse


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## Suspecting2014 (Jun 11, 2014)

Take a look at Devastatedad, he got her wife cheating by an app that made her mobile a VAR


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## Abel402 (Jan 26, 2015)

Suspecting2014 said:


> Take a look at Devastatedad, he got her wife cheating by an app that made her mobile a VAR


I cant find anything under that username?


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

Abel402 said:


> I cant find anything under that username?


Talk About Marriage - View Profile: DevastatedDad


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Abel402 said:


> My daughter is on a select soccer and basketball team, and both of those travel. My son just plays ydp soccer (local) and the same with basketball and football.
> 
> My daughter is on the u12 elite team and they travel all over, next year there planning a trip to England. It crazy all of the stuff you do for your kids.... but I am sure that is a lot of the problem.


Abel, If you do manage to pull out of this mess, know one thing: you have to keep dating your wife. Harley recommends that couples spend 15 hours a week together apart from kid stuff, work stuff, chore stuff. She picked you years ago because of how you treated her, how you swept her off her feet, how you took control, showed her you were the man - those are the kinds of things that get women wet for their man (and keep them from looking at other men, hopefully).

If it's her, or if it's your next woman - don't neglect those 15 hours, ok?

Whether it's just having a cup of coffee together in the morning or taking a day trip or sheltering away for a whole weekend, you MUST make time to continue to woo your woman.


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## Abel402 (Jan 26, 2015)

I just thought I would check in, nothing new to report on.... I have went down to her workplace and she has been staying in an bringing her lunch. I didn't know if she was just saying that so I went and checked it out anyway. I basically have been leading on that there isn't nothing wrong, the nice thing about it is I have been able to actually enjoy going to my kids sports stuff.

I was just reading another thread about baiting her with saying something before her commute to work, maybe then I can get some info that I haven't been able to get with the var in the car.

I haven't been staying on my diet though and really need to get back on that. Isnt going to do any good for me to continue to gain weight and get more out of shape whether my marriage works or I move on.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

You will be shocked at the attention you get by losing weight and lifting weights. Shocked!


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## Abel402 (Jan 26, 2015)

I know, I really need to get back on it. I was taking the Prozac for the last 4 years.... and in those 4 years I gained 60 pounds. Its time to get to work on it.


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## G.J. (Nov 4, 2014)

Abel402 said:


> I know, I really need to get back on it. I was taking the Prozac for the last 4 years.... and in those 4 years I gained 60 pounds. Its time to get to work on it.


Stand in front of a mirror and turn side ways and then remember that's what your wife's sees

*Hit the gym and stay on the diet*

Good to hear no news on the wife front


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## Abel402 (Jan 26, 2015)

G.J. said:


> Stand in front of a mirror and turn side ways and then remember that's what your wife's sees
> 
> *Hit the gym and stay on the diet*
> 
> Good to hear no news on the wife front


Gj: You definitely are right about what you said.


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## Abel402 (Jan 26, 2015)

A little update, I figure I owe you guys these from time to time because of all of the advise I have received. I still haven't turned up anything with the var and have not seen the 2 of them going to lunch or anything.... A. its either a good sign things have changed b. She hasn't just gotten more careful since me confronting the issue.

Since I have made changes in life in the past month, we have had sex fairly regularly (Thank God) and our relationship and time with the kids have been a ton better. I know all of the these changes are nice.... but I know I have more work to do and will not let up my guard until I know for a fact things have ended with her and the other guy. 

It is really amazing to feel the clarity in my head since I have quit taking my Prozac cold turkey, I am pretty much over all of the side affects now and have felt much better.... I just wish I would have stopped taking it years ago. I am sure me feeling better is a combination of eating better, off the meds and hitting the gym.

I do know now that I guess I am ready for whatever does happen in the future, whether it be finding out the ea isn't over and getting a divorce... or having a healthy marriage with my wife. I will continue on the updates whether good or bad because this site and all of you have really helped me in the time of need. I continue to read on here about what others are going through... I tend not to give advise because, I am far from the guy ti give advise on these topics as of now! Maybe in due time, my experience, no matter which way it goes can help someone else going through something similar.


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## Abel402 (Jan 26, 2015)

I was just reading another thread on here and saw a few red flags that were pointed out on cheating... (Change of the music he or she is listening to) never thought anything of it until now.

My wife, since this has happened as been listening to country and she has never listened to country. The guy she had or having this relationship is kind of a country boy, he hunts and fishes... for God sakes the owner of the company takes the entire company on a fishing trip, but spouses aren't invited


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## carmen ohio (Sep 24, 2012)

Abel402 said:


> . . . Since I have made changes in life in the past month, we have had sex fairly regularly





Abel402 said:


> I was just reading another thread on here and saw a few red flags that were pointed out on cheating... (Change of the music he or she is listening to) never thought anything of it until now.
> 
> My wife, since this has happened as been listening to country and she has never listened to country. The guy she had or having this relationship is kind of a country boy, he hunts and fishes. . .


Abel402,

Maybe he did introduce her to country music, so what. If your marriage -- and especially your sex life -- is improving, who cares what kind of music she listens to?

If it still bothers you, make it your own. The next time you do her, put on some classic country. I suggest Willie's _"To All the Girls I've Loved Before"_ or Merle's _"__It's Not Love (But It's Not Bad)."_

She'll get the message.


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