# Should I Be Worried?



## HappilyMarriedGuy (Nov 16, 2014)

Thanks for reading my thread. 

So yesterday, I went shopping. I thought I'd treat my wife. I picked up some flowers, bottle of bubbly, bottle of red wine and everything I needed to cook a special 3 course meal.

I prepared everything nice and early and before meal time we went to watch the towns xmas lights be switched on.

On our return I got the kids to bed, laid the table, lit a candle, dimmed the lights, started cooking, gave her the flowers and switched the TV over to a music channel.

I believe that all 3 courses of the meal were absolutely perfect in taste and presentation - she didn't have to lift a finger.

So what went wrong?

Conversation was dry. In fact apart from discussing the food the only other conversation we had was about her work. Between courses, she turned the TV over. The bottle of bubbly didn't even get opened. After we'd done the dishes we went to bed, still nice and early. Not a kiss, not a cuddle, not even a "Good night darling" - Just absolute silence.

I got back up after an hour and slept on the sofa.

Should I be worried?


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

You need to ask your wife why she did not seem to be into your surprise romantic night.

Maybe she was just tired. 

Do you do this type of thing often? Or was this a one-off event?

Do the two of you have date nights fairly often?

what kind of things do you two normally do together, just the two of you?


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

I would be worried and angry. Find out where the $%&#* her head was at and let her know it was unacceptable.

Has something else been going on? What other issues?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Coco2014 (May 8, 2014)

This reminds me of one episode of "Everybody loves Raymond". Ray and his wife went out dinner celebrating their anniversary. All they could talk about was bread and butter. I guess this must be common among middle age couples.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

We are middle aged and if I did what O.P. did, my wife would have loved the whole evening and put me to bed sore in a good way. She would have made me breakfast the next day and continued the mood.

Middle aged......
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## HappilyMarriedGuy (Nov 16, 2014)

EleGirl said:


> You need to ask your wife why she did not seem to be into your surprise romantic night.
> 
> Maybe she was just tired.
> 
> ...


Thanks for replying so quickly.

We started having date nights a couple of years ago with Rule #1 being we didn't do the same thing twice. The effort was always from me. If I never sorted date night out then the probability would be that we never had date night.

TBH I ran out of things to do and after about 9 months I gave up trying. Date night just turned into an excuse for her to drink heavily and me to be her chauffeur. So date night stopped.

Last week I surprised her at work with a bouquet of flowers which she was thrilled with - She loves it when her work colleagues complain their husbands aren't romantic! On the evening we partied hard and had a fantastic night. We rarely go out drinking now-a-days - if we do go out, it's usually for a meal.

I thought we'd do the same this week because we had such a good night out last week, but she didn't want to - which is really out of character. I've never known her turn down an excuse to party!

I thought what I'd done was a really nice romantic gesture. We spend a lot of time watching programs like MasterChef etc and I thought I'd try and put into practice what I'd learned.

I just feel like it's one-way traffic all the time lately. I know she truly loves me - and she does - but last night just destroyed me inside. I feel like I'm wasting my time and should just stop trying all together.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

You need to tell her how you feel about last night. And she needs to tell you why she reacted that way.

You might want to get the book "His Needs, Her Needs", read it. Then see if you can get her to read it and work through it with you. She needs to learn that she has to be present in your relationship.


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## HappilyMarriedGuy (Nov 16, 2014)

ConanHub said:


> I would be worried and angry. Find out where the $%&#* her head was at and let her know it was unacceptable.
> 
> Has something else been going on? What other issues?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Thanks for your input.

I'm not sure whether I'm worried or angry but I am certainly a little upset by it all. 

I've said a couple of things to her this week that perhaps I shouldn't have, but we normally don't hold grudges and our disagreements usually don't last more than a few hours.


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## HappilyMarriedGuy (Nov 16, 2014)

ConanHub said:


> We are middle aged and if I did what O.P. did, my wife would have loved the whole evening and put me to bed sore in a good way. She would have made me breakfast the next day and continued the mood.
> 
> Middle aged......
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Well that's exactly how I would imagine every other couple to behave. Fact is though - She gets breakfast in bed frequently. I can't recall the last time she brought me a cup of coffee. However, that may be my fault - I set my alarm to make sure I'm up before her so that she gets her coffee before her alarm goes off - I feel really guilty if I oversleep and she's left for work having made her own coffee. LOL


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## HappilyMarriedGuy (Nov 16, 2014)

EleGirl said:


> You need to tell her how you feel about last night. And she needs to tell you why she reacted that way.
> 
> You might want to get the book "His Needs, Her Needs", read it. Then see if you can get her to read it and work through it with you. She needs to learn that she has to be present in your relationship.


I really don't want to discuss this with her - It will only end in an argument and I could do without any conflict.

I've lost count of how many times I've read articles to help various situations. I know that even if she read a book/article she wouldn't act upon it. 

I'm due to have a life-changing operation after Christmas. One doctor told me I must have it, another told me not to have it because of the problems it may cause. I asked my wife to decide whether I should or not. She said she would do the research and make a decision. That was weeks ago - She hasn't bothered!


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

HappilyMarriedGuy said:


> I really don't want to discuss this with her - It will only end in an argument and I could do without any conflict.
> 
> I've lost count of how many times I've read articles to help various situations. I know that even if she read a book/article she wouldn't act upon it.
> 
> I'm due to have a life-changing operation after Christmas. One doctor told me I must have it, another told me not to have it because of the problems it may cause. I asked my wife to decide whether I should or not. She said she would do the research and make a decision. That was weeks ago - She hasn't bothered!


Then you need to shake things up. Stop doing all the nice stuff for her. You have spoiled her and she's acting like that's just boring.


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## Coco2014 (May 8, 2014)

HappilyMarriedGuy said:


> Well that's exactly how I would imagine every other couple to behave. Fact is though - She gets breakfast in bed frequently. I can't recall the last time she brought me a cup of coffee. However, that may be my fault - I set my alarm to make sure I'm up before her so that she gets her coffee before her alarm goes off - I feel really guilty if I oversleep and she's left for work having made her own coffee. LOL


Sounds like you are the giver in this marriage. Your marriage is all about You Taking Care Of Her. You are too nice. She must took it for granted since long time ago. 

This world is so unfair. Why some people were born givers and some were born takers?


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

You could be too "nice" of a guy. How demanding or selfish are you? Have you laid any expectations on her to satisfy you?

She might be getting bored and losing her attraction for you.

Does she initiate sex?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## HappilyMarriedGuy (Nov 16, 2014)

EleGirl said:


> Then you need to shake things up. Stop doing all the nice stuff for her. Start acting like you don't care. You have spoiled her and she's acting like that's just boring.


Funny you should say that - The only time I get any attention from her is when I simply don't bother. Trouble is, it will take a couple of months before she realises I've stopped trying.:scratchhead:

I also found that when I stop trying, I stop caring too. In this situation, we drift in our relationship. If neither of us try to bond there is a distinct possibility we may drift too far. This almost happened earlier this year - it took me to bring the conversation up so that it could be resolved.


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## HappilyMarriedGuy (Nov 16, 2014)

ConanHub said:


> You could be too "nice" of a guy. How demanding or selfish are you? Have you laid any expectations on her to satisfy you?
> 
> She might be getting bored and losing her attraction for you.
> 
> ...


Perhaps she doesn't fancy me any more - sure, it's a possibility. After all, I ain't no spring chicken any more, am I?

I've given that plenty of thought over the past couple of years and took steps to put right what I could.

I lost weight, I stayed trim and gained muscle. I make sure I'm clean and tidy, keeping on top of my facial and body hair and I ensure my dental hygiene is as good as it could be. I updated my wardrobe so I look as good as I can for her all of the time.

As for sex, I went out of my way to learn as much as I possibly could to make it better for her. She may initiate once a month if I'm lucky but usually only if I've not bothered for a couple of weeks.

If she doesn't fancy me, then there's not a lot I can do about it.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Being in shape is good but I am looking more at your attitude.

You can be the best looking man in the world and too nice. Many women love their husbands but lose sexual attraction for them over time.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## HappilyMarriedGuy (Nov 16, 2014)

So you think I should not be nice? But that's where my own personal happiness is gained - making her happy.


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## Jasel (Jan 8, 2013)

Ya you sound like youre a little TOO nice. Which women tend to not respect, get bored with, or outright sick of. Ive noticed a pattern of men who bend over backwards to make their wives happy and then cant figure it out when their wives start running cold. So then they try even harder and get the same results or worse and cant figure out why.

Back off. Start focusing on yourself. Id stop date night and the romantic gestures since its obviously not getting you anywhere and might even be detrimental. Like you said you got more of a response from her when you backed off.


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## Zouz (May 28, 2014)

happilymarried :

im sorry to come on TAM with such pain...

how long have you been married ?

-was she a giver at any point of time ?
by giver i dont mean any materialstic issue ;i mean choose anything she hates a little (sexual ,behavorial, or as simple as bringing you a cup of water); would she do somthing for u without you ask for it ?


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## wmn1 (Aug 27, 2014)

good question by Zouz. Was she a 'giver' at any point ?

What does she do at home at night ? Is she going out more often, like with friends or shopping ?


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## MachoMcCoy (Oct 20, 2014)

HappilyMarriedGuy said:


> I know she truly loves me


Yeah. So did I. 

If she truly loved you, you wouldn't have spent the entire morning describing my wife. 

YOU: Should I Be Worried?
ME: Yes, very much so.


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

I get the impression you guys don't spend much time talking about things. I mean just spending time together discussing whatever comes up and supporting each other's feelings. 

Maybe she felt like this was somehow payment for something? Maybe she didn't warm up to you because she looked at it as something odd instead of a nice surprise? 

You two need time to talk and hear each other. Hopefully you can meet each other's everyday simple needs first and then these kinds of nice things will be taken how they are meant? 

Hope this makes sense.


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## WalterWhite (Sep 14, 2012)

Happily married guy, it seems it is 100% your job to build the romantic event. It's work! It's all you giving, and she taking.

That is mostly ok for dating between unmarried people in COUTSHIP.

But you two are married!

She put it ALL on you, and you foolishly accepted the job, and THAT set the tone going forward.

Why do something only once?!? If it feels good, do the SAME THING often!

Romance in a marriage is not, and should not be the same way as in courtship. That means your wife needs to engage and be at 50% part of the planning, the giving, the contribution of.

She has you trained wrongly to think romance is all about her taking and you giving. Nope, wrong, stop this!

It seems your wife has lost respect for you, and every time you create a date night, your stock drops lower.


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## Zouz (May 28, 2014)

I hope she is not like my wife ...
She loves me when i am giving and giving and giving .

If I just need a bit of rest , she would punish me hard .

really hard to an extent that one time She intended to skip my birthday just because I inquired politely about spending ;she refused to even to bring a cake until kids collapsed begging her ...


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## HappilyMarriedGuy (Nov 16, 2014)

Zouz said:


> happilymarried :
> 
> 
> how long have you been married ?
> ...


Been married for 10 years. and no, not really - I often feel neglected because she doesn't do anything to surprise me.


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## HappilyMarriedGuy (Nov 16, 2014)

2ntnuf said:


> I get the impression you guys don't spend much time talking about things. I mean just spending time together discussing whatever comes up and supporting each other's feelings.
> 
> Maybe she felt like this was somehow payment for something? Maybe she didn't warm up to you because she looked at it as something odd instead of a nice surprise?
> 
> ...


I talk - she doesn't! I'm quite happy to discuss how I feel about matters, especially concerning our marriage. Trying to get anything out of her is like trying to get blood out of a stone. I frequently feel like something is being hidden from me - especially her opinion and thoughts.


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## HappilyMarriedGuy (Nov 16, 2014)

Zouz said:


> I hope she is not like my wife ...
> She loves me when i am giving and giving and giving .
> 
> If I just need a bit of rest , she would punish me hard .
> ...


No, thank God, our marriage is not like that. If yours was, I am truly sorry for you. That sounds like bordering on mental abuse to me and you'd be better off without it. I hope you can find a better beginning for you!


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## HappilyMarriedGuy (Nov 16, 2014)

wmn1 said:


> good question by Zouz. Was she a 'giver' at any point ?
> 
> What does she do at home at night ? Is she going out more often, like with friends or shopping ?


We both have to be up for work at 5am so our evenings generally consist of bed soon after tea time. She hardly ever goes out and doesn't want to. She likes Candy Crush & Pet Saga - I guess that explains a lot. LOL


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

HappilyMarriedGuy said:


> Been married for 10 years. and no, not really - I often feel neglected because she doesn't do anything to surprise me.



This is sad. Reads like she has no goals. She's unhappy. She feels like she has no means of doing anything or control over her own life. Her decisions don't matter.

I don't think giving more to her will help.


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## HappilyMarriedGuy (Nov 16, 2014)

2ntnuf said:


> I get the impression you guys don't spend much time talking about things. I mean just spending time together discussing whatever comes up and supporting each other's feelings.
> 
> Maybe she felt like this was somehow payment for something? Maybe she didn't warm up to you because she looked at it as something odd instead of a nice surprise?
> 
> ...


We do talk - well I certainly do, she doesn't much - but when she does I listen. I don't think she'd have seen this as something odd. She knows exactly what I'm like. 

She finished work today, came home, hardly spoke a word to me. Declared she was getting in the bath - that was TWO hours ago and she hasn't come downstairs yet. 

Well I'm very upset by all of this. I haven't said anything to her as of yet but she'll figure it out when she does come downstairs and find the empty bottle of bubbly on the kitchen surface that I've just drank on my own - well if she can't be bothered to join me for a glass on date night, it would be a waste not to drink it myself the following day!:rofl:


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## Mr.Fisty (Nov 4, 2014)

Somewhere in your relationship, the communication has been broken down. How well does she do expressing her emotions? When you argue, is it combative? How well does she do with processing her emotions? How is your communication skills as well?


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

> We do talk - well I certainly do, she doesn't much - but when she does I listen. I don't think she'd have seen this as something odd. She knows exactly what I'm like.
> 
> She finished work today, came home, hardly spoke a word to me. Declared she was getting in the bath - that was TWO hours ago and she hasn't come downstairs yet.
> 
> Well I'm very upset by all of this. I haven't said anything to her as of yet but she'll figure it out when she does come downstairs and find the empty bottle of bubbly on the kitchen surface that I've just drank on my own - well if she can't be bothered to join me for a glass on date night, it would be a waste not to drink it myself the following day!


Sorry. That sucks.


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## Tabitha (Jun 17, 2014)

The two of you obviously don’t have the same needs or the same “love language”, and your communications have gone in different directions. If what you’re doing for her isn’t working, it’s because it isn’t “speaking” to her—OR, maybe she’s hearing it, but it’s carrying a different tune than you intended that makes her mad….like she knows you’re doing it “on purpose” to try and get a lovey-dovey reaction out of her. You are doing it because YOU think she should like it—you’re doing what YOU want to do. You need to find out what it is that SHE thinks is special. 

My husband would bring me flowers or boxes of candy for all the “holidays”, but guess what—I don’t like it and never have!!! I’ve never been one to care for money being wasted on expensive flowers that will die in days. I DO enjoy a single red rose, but he’ll go overboard and get a dozen plus (and we know how expensive that is). He’ll buy not one box of chocolates, but several (I do not like nor eat filled chocolate candies--they're gross to me. He's never seen me eat any, and I've told him so--I like my chocolate dark and "pure"). It’s how HE sees it, not bothering to care about my likes or dislikes. It’s always to excess, and I don’t get it. We’ve had a calm talk about it MANY times over the years, and that’s 25+ yrs of marriage! He knows (or should by now) I prefer balloons to flowers and stuffed animals to candy but I’ve NEVER gotten that. I’m not ungrateful when he gets the flowers and candy, I simply don’t swoon and make a fuss over it. Why? Maybe you guys will think it’s because I’m a b*tch? Well, I see it as this—he’s been told numerous times what I like and what I don’t care for yet he continues to do what HE wants and thinks is romantic, so therefore he’s doing it for himself and NOT me. Why should I make a fuss over something he’s giving me when he’s totally disregarding what it is I actually want? Last Valentine’s Day he went out to “wash the car” and came home with 2 bouquets of flowers, 3 different kinds of chocolates, and a card he forgot to sign. 

Sometimes I feel that maybe subconsciously, he does it knowing I won’t be thrilled and therefore can get a little bit of mileage out of being a “victim”—that his wife just doesn’t appreciate him or his efforts. It’s a theme played out since his dysfunctional childhood. He’s a really good guy otherwise, though. So, he doesn’t really do b’days or Christmas or anniversaries—but he will ask me if there’s anything I want, and if I say it, he’ll suggest I go buy it. He doesn’t want to be involved, though. Maybe he’s afraid he’ll bring home the wrong thing, and I can understand that, given our flowers & candy discussions, etc. In the end, though, I’d rather have a good guy ALL the days of the year (and there’s nothing I lack for anyway) than being able to gush about what hubby gave/did for me on V’day, etc. 

I remember giving him gifts I thought he should like receiving, but I’m hit-or-miss on them through the years. Now I pay attention to the things that make his eyes light up even if it makes me groan. For this Christmas (which we don’t really “do”—we have no kids, and our parents have all passed, and we don’t live anywhere near family), I took him yesterday (to beat the shopping crowds that start after next weekend) to Bass Pro and turned him loose without hovering and saying he didn’t need that or that it was a waste of money. Now this guy works in the corporate world and lives in a well-off subdivision, but he seems to want to be a Duck Dynasty dude, and he turned into a 10-yr-old at that store: he bought camo EVERYTHING—overalls, jacket, shirts, pants, boots, hat, duck and turkey calls (to mess with the wildlife that sometime come around the nearby woods/pond)—and I managed to keep my mouth shut. He was so happy all day, grinning from ear-to-ear, and saying how happy he was. This is not what I would have chosen to buy for him or how I wanted to spend the day, but it was what made him happy—he was very loving all evening. 

So, find out what your wife really cares about receiving and keep yourself out of it. In the end, it’s not your job to make her happy, nor is it her job to make you happy. There’s something else at work underneath all that which you need to figure out—what is it about YOU that you need to do these things that she doesn’t appreciate?


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

^^----I agree with Tabitha.


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## Zouz (May 28, 2014)

Thanks man for your warm wishes...
The way I see it , and to answer your question :
yes you should worry .

It is the begining of the fall i beleieve , so you should do something about it ...

Start with having more time together , not intimate time , rather time together ...

that's were I failed , because we only at the decline start met for making love , we never really spent quality time together .
good luck


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## Mr.Fisty (Nov 4, 2014)

She sounds like an emotional wall, and you keep being vulnerable to her is hurting you. Unfortunately, she gives you enough crumbs to keep you coming back. Only way to ignore this is to disengage, thus breaking down communication further. But at the same time your protecting yourself from disappointment. Until the walls are lowered, your not going to get anywhere. The wall she has erected is something she has to work on herself, and you can bet there is an underlying factor.

Are you doing nice things for validation, or you do it because it makes you feel good? If you keep trying to please her, and you can't detach from her, see how much codependent tendencies you have. When people treat me poorly, even family, I detach away from them.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

Get the mmslp book linked to below. Go there or amazon and read the reviews.

Also google free download of NO MORE MISTER NICE GUY. This may or may not be relevant. It may not be a truly nice guy thing.

HIS NEEDS HER NEEDS is also eye opening.


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

@Tabitha, will you marry me?:lol:

In fact...OP, will you marry me?

Seriously, I would be worried. 

I mean why in the hell would your wife not reciprocate such a nice thing.....well I guess she expects them and takes them for granted. But what if?????

See my wife would be in shock, but at least it's a response. Dam...You got nothing!

I suggest you take her into the basement and have your way with her cuz the other side of the coin isn't getting you sh1t.

I bet she has someone else and she spent the rest of the night in the bathtub texting her boyfriend.


Somethings up with your old lady, I'd spy on her to find out why she ain't into you. Ya I'll get some crap for saying it but at least you will know its her and not you. Hell if I'm wrong then you at least know she isn't in love with someone else and you guys can work on whats really bothering her.


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

I'm just saying her being so distant is a huge red flag for infidelity. Its worth protecting your self by do some investigating on your own.

Your wife could be emotionally attached to someone...or GETTING emotionally attached to someone else.....just saying!


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## scatty (Mar 15, 2013)

There is something not right about your marriage. Another man maybe? Does she hold onto her phone like it provides life giving oxygen? If you can't talk to your wife about why she acted like that, no wonder you find it hard to have any conversation with her. And to answer your question, yes, you should have been worried months (if not years) ago.


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## Samayouchan (Jun 1, 2012)

OP can you come train my husband on how to be romantic! LOL (j/k) But seriously, I would have to sit her down and tell her how that made you feel even if it does end in an argument. MY husband and I have had our fights and differences, but we try to talk things out and let each other know how we feel. Some times it doesnt always work the way I want it. But you are seriously romantic. I'm super jealous right now. Wish my hubby could take some tips lol


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## WandaJ (Aug 5, 2014)

You have started date nights a year or so ago? Why? People usually start doing it because the marriage starts slipping away from them and this is the first advise. So what were ( are) your problems?

I would be like your wife if my husband did something like this - because we have huge issues. Being romantic and one on one with him would terrified me because I cannot find much positive feelings about him in me.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

The guy beat me to it. Along with the other advice I gave, you want to rule out another man.

She does show signs of infidelity as well. Might not be but worth ruling out.

Either way, you becoming a little more of a bad boy stud would not hurt.


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## nuclearnightmare (May 15, 2013)

OP:

Lila and others bring to mind something I'm wondering about. do you think your wife is depressed? have you ever wondered about that? a lot of what you describe about her sounds like that. how serious is her drinking problem?


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## Methuselah (Nov 24, 2014)

I would agree with the other posters on infidelity. It sounds as if the once-in-a-while sex is a bone she throws at you when she feels it absolutely necessary to shut you up for a while.

I would install spyware on the home computers, logware on her cell phone, and a GPS tracker in her car. All set up to communicate with a disposable email address you absolutely never access from home, but only from a public internet kiosk or public library, so she cannot likewise look in your log files to check to see if you're monitoring her.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Methuselah said:


> I would agree with the other posters on infidelity. It sounds as if the once-in-a-while sex is a bone she throws at you when she feels it absolutely necessary to shut you up for a while.
> 
> I would install spyware on the home computers, logware on her cell phone, and a GPS tracker in her car. All set up to communicate with a disposable email address you absolutely never access from home, but only from a public internet kiosk or public library, so she cannot likewise look in your log files to check to see if you're monitoring her.


Nice avatar and name.


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## Janis (Nov 21, 2014)

Suppose she had a headache or something and was just hanging in there because she cared. You didn't find out. You got mad and went to the couch. You should communicate more


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## MarriedDude (Jun 21, 2014)

Janis said:


> Suppose she had a headache or something and was just hanging in there because she cared. You didn't find out. You got mad and went to the couch. You should communicate more


He isn't talking about a one off here....

He is describing a consistent pattern...Once communication breaks down in a marriage- it takes something to kick start it again and sitting down to talk about "feelings" is the WRONG WAY. 

Talking is the wrong thing for him to do. He should start DOING things for himself. 

MMSLP - - - - - - -Written for OP


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

HappilyMarriedGuy said:


> So you think I should not be nice? But that's where my own personal happiness is gained - making her happy.



I thought so too. Now my personal happiness is tied to things like my camera gear, my cycling gear, work stuff, or the success of my kids.

I had my epiphany in the summer of 2012 when wife and I were on the top deck of a cruise ship in Alaska having drinks. She stayed silent the entire time. Since then that date has been etched in my mind as the official checkout date for me.

To the OP, try to address systemic issues in your marriage then worry about date nights.


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## Me'N'My'Girl (Jan 10, 2010)

HappilyMarriedGuy said:


> Thanks for reading my thread.
> 
> So yesterday, I went shopping. I thought I'd treat my wife. I picked up some flowers, bottle of bubbly, bottle of red wine and everything I needed to cook a special 3 course meal.
> 
> ...


*sigh*
I won't even begin to tell you what I'd do if my husband EVER surprised me with a night like this! Wow!


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## Me'N'My'Girl (Jan 10, 2010)

HappilyMarriedGuy said:


> Well that's exactly how I would imagine every other couple to behave. Fact is though - She gets breakfast in bed frequently. I can't recall the last time she brought me a cup of coffee. However, that may be my fault - I set my alarm to make sure I'm up before her so that she gets her coffee before her alarm goes off - I feel really guilty if I oversleep and she's left for work having made her own coffee. LOL


Do you men really exist?? :scratchhead:
Wow! Just wow!


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## Flying_Dutchman (Oct 29, 2014)

Me'N'My'Girl said:


> Do you men really exist?? :scratchhead:
> Wow! Just wow!


lol - my SO would get woken up with coffee every day and breakfast in bed if she wanted it. I was up anyway due to my work shift, which made it relatively easy, but I'd still do it weekends and holidays usually.

I got appreciation for it though. Had I not done I'm sure Id've quit doing it after a while. I'm a giver,, but I'm not a mug.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Me'N'My'Girl (Jan 10, 2010)

Flying_Dutchman said:


> lol - my SO would get woken up with coffee every day and breakfast in bed if she wanted it. I was up anyway due to my work shift, which made it relatively easy, but I'd still do it weekends and holidays usually.
> 
> I got appreciation for it though. Had I not done I'm sure Id've quit doing it after a while. I'm a giver,, but I'm not a mug.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


She's so lucky. Make sure she knows that.


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## hubbydude (May 15, 2014)

OP, your story is EXACTLY what my marriage was like a few months ago (although it is much better now, long may it continue).

Long story short, you're doing all the right things, you're simply missing one crucial thing........your wife NEEDS to know what you expect of her. And you need to be blunt about it. And by blunt I mean an unambiguous, straight forward list of expectations, e.g.

- Flowers sent to your office = sex tonight
- Romantic home cooked meal = sex tonight with matching lingerie
- Surprise, expensive gift during Christmas shopping = bj in the car on the way home

Single people who are familiar with the dating scene understand these kinds of expectations but us married folks have absolutely no idea. If I'm single, and I'm bringing her out for a meal and she orders steak and dessert, she likely knows that I'm expecting some nookie later. If she goes for a salad and no dessert then I'm probably looking at a doorstep kiss at best. But when you've been out of the dating game for so long you completely cease to pick up on dating cues and fail to consider what someone is hoping to get from you.

If your wife was single and she turns up at a date's house, he's made her a lovely meal, has a bottle of bubbly on the table, some mood lighting and music, she KNOWS what he expects for her. But fast forward ten years of her husband doing all these things for her with no expectations of anything in return, and voila, welcome to your marriage.

For me, it took a while to get this idea through to my wife but once she got it EVERYTHING improved.


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## heartsbeating (May 2, 2011)

Seems a lot of great suggestions your way so far.

I still think there's communication lacking on your part. It may well be a confrontation initially. Can you be open to listening to her side too? I think it's best just to get it out though - how you felt after the last date night and ask what it meant to her. Or what about approaching it from the perspective that you need her to arrange date night _with_ you.

It's not really about date night though at the end of the day though, is it? All I can suggest it to be clear about your expectations (such as getting back to you with the research) and then change up what you are doing.


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## heartsbeating (May 2, 2011)

hubbydude said:


> If your wife was single and she turns up at a date's house, he's made her a lovely meal, has a bottle of bubbly on the table, some mood lighting and music, she KNOWS what he expects for her.


To do the dishes? 


My husband can be really thoughtful and romantic. I've never felt that Action A = Expectation of Sex. In marriage, I consider romantic gestures to be an expression of consideration, perhaps meeting a need (this depends on what speaks to us), and can build intimacy. Sure, those things can attribute to sexy times together but it would rub me the wrong way if I was told, 'Hey if I make you a meal, my expectation is sex.' 

It's one thing to communicate needs and expectations - but I personally wouldn't consider sex a bartering option. It most certainly ought to be a part of a healthy relationship though, to me at least.

And let me tell you, I desire the pants off my husband. He also cooks a lot in our home. In part, it's the passion he has for cooking that is sexy in its own right. If you're feeling unappreciated and she isn't demonstrating consideration to you - that needs to be brought out in the open and dealt with from both sides.


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

Methuselah said:


> I would agree with the other posters on infidelity. It sounds as if the once-in-a-while sex is a bone she throws at you when she feels it absolutely necessary to shut you up for a while.
> 
> I would install spyware on the home computers, logware on her cell phone, and a GPS tracker in her car. All set up to communicate with a disposable email address you absolutely never access from home, but only from a public internet kiosk or public library, so she cannot likewise look in your log files to check to see if you're monitoring her.


Not every woman will be cheating just because she gives you the cold shoulder. That being said, I think it would be a good idea just to check. You need to rule some things out so you have a better idea of what direction you want to proceed. 

I really think reading something like, "His Needs, Her Needs", would do you some good. It may, at least help you eliminate another possibility or two besides infidelity. It may bring back some communication and you many find it helpful. 

Like Hearts was saying, she may feel pressured to have sex and really need some build up to sex. She may feel like she is only important to meet your sexual needs. That would certainly make her feel like she isn't worth much. I'm not accusing you here. I think what you did for date night is wonderful. We aren't talking about how we would feel, just reading your posts. We are wondering how she feels and what is going on with her.

ETA: I'm not replyiing to the post I quoted. I just wanted to quote it to show that someone else believes it is a good idea to check up on her, too. I don't think you need to go all out crazy making with espionage. I just think some simple checks would be a good start. You may want to delve deeper depending on what you find out. I think this is something within her and it well may be changed by how you interact with her. Who knows for sure, though?


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

You are the only one putting forth any effort in your marriage. So STOP.


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## hubbydude (May 15, 2014)

heartsbeating said:


> ...I've never felt that Action A = Expectation of Sex.


That's because you're a girl 

For us guys, sex is how we are made to feel loved, wanted, desired. The same feeling you get when your husband prepares a lovely romantic meal and washes the dishes afterwards, that's the feeling guys get when you rip our clothes off and jump on us. If you don't care about your husband feeling wanted, loved and appreciated then there's no need to respond to his romantic gestures with sex. However, if you care about making him feel good about himself, and want him to feel like a man, then Action A = Expectation of Sex, whether he tells you this or not.


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## heartsbeating (May 2, 2011)

hubbydude said:


> That's because you're a girl
> 
> For us guys, sex is how we are made to feel loved, wanted, desired. The same feeling you get when your husband prepares a lovely romantic meal and washes the dishes afterwards, that's the feeling guys get when you rip our clothes off and jump on us. If you don't care about your husband feeling wanted, loved and appreciated then there's no need to respond to his romantic gestures with sex. However, if you care about making him feel good about himself, and want him to feel like a man, then Action A = Expectation of Sex, whether he tells you this or not.


A few assumptions you have wrong.

I'm not a girl, I'm a woman. 

I feel loved, wanted and desired through sex too - along with other things that speak to me. 

My husband doesn't need me to feel good about himself. Are there things I can do to meet his needs? Absolutely. Intimacy being a large component yet experienced in various ways, as well as sex.


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## hubbydude (May 15, 2014)

heartsbeating said:


> ...
> My husband doesn't need me to feel good about himself. ...


Stop having sex with him and see how good he feels about himself. This is the OP's position.


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## HappilyMarriedGuy (Nov 16, 2014)

I'm really sorry that I haven't posted back in a couple of weeks. 

I am truly grateful for everyone's responses and input which I have taken on board.

I'm also sorry if I have caused riffs between any married couples because one party wants the other to be more romantic LOL.

Quite a few suggested that she may be showing signs of infidelity and once it had been suggested, it really rattled my cage - SO.... I went against everything I knew was right and I hacked my wife's phone and computer.

I am 99.99% certain that she is NOT having an affair. I found nothing in her phone book, logs, call history and messages on her phone to suggest that she was. I also found nothing what-so-ever in her internet history, social media accounts, phone apps etc.

I even installed a tracker on her phone which backs up her call logs, location and even lets me know if the phone has been switched off. 

I feel like I have violated her privacy but tbh it has put my mind at ease and that helps our relationship.

I discussed various things with her including the evening in question and plenty more. It didn't really get us anywhere.

HOWEVER!!!!!! - I think I found our problem yesterday.

1) I know she suffers terribly from depression. She never tells me because she knows it makes me feel even more awful. She knows her happiness is a direct link to my own happiness and as such, she is not forthcoming with any information that she thinks will upset me.

2) I found evidence to suggest she has returned to alcohol abuse. If she was trying to conceal the fact she was under the influence on that particular night, then she wouldn't want to talk too much and the last thing she'd want is another bottle of bubbly!

Alcohol abuse has always been a major issue on and off within our marriage and it truly is the ONLY thing we ever row about. She will scream blue murder that she hasn't touched a drop and I had to resort to using breath testing kits to prove to myself I wasn't going insane and I was always right when I thought she had been drinking. 

At least I'm safe in the knowledge that she does love me and she isn't cheating, but I'm in for yet another long battle to try and get her to counselling again!

..... But I guess that will have to be posted under a different thread.

Thanks again for all your input. It really does help to talkaboutmarriage - even if I was none the wiser at least it's off my chest.


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## MachoMcCoy (Oct 20, 2014)

You still don't get it that she doesn't love you, do you?


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

Did you ever read, "Codependent No More", by Melodie Beatty? I'm not saying you are codependent. I'm just suggesting that you check it out to make sure you are doing things that will help her. I think you need to get into MC. It may help to get her into IC. She may need Alcoholics Anonymous and you could go to Al Anon.  Hey, it's just food for thought.


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## wise (Sep 1, 2013)

Never really understood why someone would want to be married to someone who doesn't (1) appreciate them or (2) give a flying f*ck about them because they are depressed, alcoholics, liars, etc. We only live once, am I correct? 

The communication is GONE. Completely. Your wife does not tell you she is depressed because she doesn't want you to feel awful? Uh, no. That is not how a healthy marriage works so stop making excuses for her. This remark is a HUGE BOLD RED FLAG because it implies that she does not tell you things, PERIOD. 

You justify everything she does wrong instead of actually holding her accountable for her actions. She's got it made. She comes home from work, eats a three course meal, then goes to bed. You are her personal slave. But yet, instead of expressing yourself to her, you won't because you already know it will lead to an argument. And this is where you lost your touch, your dignity, and your own self-respect. You are literally afraid to express your feelings because your are afraid of your wife's reactions. She knows what she did. She knows exactly how bad that could make someone feel. She wasn't born yesterday.

And yet, you won't say anything. Somewhere along the line, your wife became your daughter.


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## Zouz (May 28, 2014)

HappilyMarried guy ,

we don't have her opinion here ; and guess what , it is you who is trying to resolve all issues ...

You might be convinced that she is not cheating ; which could be true .

but wise pointed an important factor : 
"your wife became your daughter "

I was in that trap for few years ...

So now , for you , if she becomes drunk or depressed and does soemthing very bad ; like sleeping with someone without intending to do it , or hit soemone while driving or crash you favorite car or things ; what will be your approach ?

"It is not her fault"! ? she was depressed or drunk or disconnected !

She is getting a free pass to do mistakes .

She has to see professional help ; and you need to see an IC / MC to limit the damage she caused and causing ...

I am married to A wife who has some PD some may argue if it was BPD or not ; I don't care about the name .

I said it few times and will say it again :

"I survived a harsh civil War ; conquered a brain tumor ,won the financial battle and bankruptcy " yet dealing with a person with personnel disorder alone is much , much more difficult than above .

Get professional help ; and make it a deal breaker .


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