# Short Story of McDean....



## McDean (Jun 13, 2015)

Hello TAM peeps, first a quick recap to bring us up to speed....

In May of this year my wife and I had a fight, a minor one really, because it seemed like she was avoiding me....she promptly told me she wanted to separate and it was because in our 9 year marriage(11years together) I was too angry and she and our daughter (4yrs old) don't deserve it anymore. Add to the mix that the fight happened at a party with people I have never much cared for because all they do is drink and gossip.

Of course, I was 'shocked' by the separation and it took me a lot of time to figure out what/why this happened. True enough I can have an explosive temper but it had been getting better and I was working on it. I am in IC and feeling a lot better about my anger control etc. But like I said, it wasn't an every day thing, more of a sometimes thing....

3 days after this event my wife - who has Fibromyalgia and is on several drugs for depression and anxiety as well as pain had a tachycardia event that shot her heart rate to 210BPM for close to 40 minutes, she passed out and we had to call 911 etc. I was with her the entire time at the emergency room and told her how much it scared me to have almost lost her since the paramedics said she could have had a heart attack at any moment.

3 days later we were talking about our relationship and it came out that she was in love with someone else, he didn't know it and it was a mutual friend. She was emotionally attached to him and I found out sent him pictures of her in a bikini which he did not respond to. I told her to tell him how she felt (I knew with 100% certainty he would not reciprocate, hard to explain but I know him well and what he is attracted to and while my wife is beautiful she is not his type) she followed my advice and was shot down in flames as expected...of course that only slightly reduced her feelings for him....her so called friends (the sames ones at the party) started to spread rumors about her having slept with him even though both denied it, I believed them both because some of the times they supposedly hooked up she was with me so duh....they are straight up stupid people plain and simple.....

Regardless in our state you have to be separated for a year before you can D. She wanted to get a formal separation agreement together to discuss finances and custody, I agreed. Long before all of this we had a family trip to her families ranch in another state and my parents were coming out to join in the fun for 4th of july, our families are extremely close. It was early June and I kept the separation agreement discussion going and she printed out the forms etc....we maintained a cordial but honest conversation, all the while I was dying inside...for some reason her 'separation agreement' was never given to me?...

One day about a week before our family trip she call me in tears because the rumors had gotten really extreme and graphic and she couldn't believe her 'friends' would do this to her...I was not surprised but again, their stories (which some were sent to me direct by them) did not jive with timing, because I knew she liked this OM and he and I talked direct I stood by her on the allegations....again no separation agreement ever came.

During the long drive out for the family trip we talked, she told me the usual -lost attraction for me due to anger beating her down, loved me but not in love with me, wants me to be a huge part of our daughter's life but not sure she can come back from what happened etc....

Quick umbrella to this first month of the story - she had a terrible Spring health wise - was heavily medicated and half the time high as a kite - during some of our conversations she was slurring her words etc. So my inclination was to think that some of what happened was related to her meds and disease (she is understandably unhappy)...besides the EA the near death experience really kicked her off into an Mid-Life Crisis, even my IC agrees with this description...

The trip actually went surprisingly well and we cuddled a lot, prompted by her not me. I made plans to have her stay at her inlaws for close to a month while I returned to work and moved into corporate housing.

Because we were in the midst of relocating I moved into corporate housing early and had my daughter on weekends. During her time with family she was going to tell them we separated, as well her friends etc. and let me know when she did so I could tell my family. We had several late night discussions about our marriage and about a week before she came home I asked if she had talked to anyone yet and she said no - that for now she did not want to through everything we had together away just yet. However, when she got back she wanted to see tangible differences between myself and my daughter, my anger etc. and that she did not want to work on us (MC) until she felt she saw these changes - I said I understood. Note- during the trip she started a new med that has really improved her day to day health as well as her mind- much more cogent when we speak now.

Her and our daughter came back and really it started off pretty good. We agreed to do date nights and almost treat it as us starting over with each other. While I still harbored resentment for the EA and how things went down, I knew from reading about MLC that talking too much about it would not help. The date nights went well but she kept telling me she wished I had cheated almost because we had gone so long without sex - which was in my mind due to her disease. Then one of the date nights we had marathon sex as I call it. The next day she passed it off to being 'pent up and a bit drunk' ...I didn't think the sex was going to lead to an R but the comments cheapened it all for me.....


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## McDean (Jun 13, 2015)

Final part of the story: she has been back for over a month now, since the separation it has been 90 days. No separation agreement, no talking to family or friends about it etc...she frequently references 'when we build our house next year' or 'maybe we should buy land' etc....but, still no commitment to MC but told me when we he the one month mark we were off to a great start. Still, I have heard no remorse, no apologies, no anything about what she did to me at the beginning of the summer. I had started 180 back in late June and it's on pause but still not back to where I was before...this last weekend she had a 'flare in Fibro' that was devastating and I had to take her to the emergency room to get help. I stood by her as usual. Then last night she went to bed first and came to give me a kiss but it was flat and unemotional - given her weekend I can kind of understand that but for some reason I woke up this morning pissed off....and I can't shake it.

I am sick of her, tired of her acting like it was all me, angry I have never gotten an apology etc....I have an MC session in a few days and will bring it up but want to hear any and all thoughts from everyone??? To be honest, I really enjoyed it when she was not around during that month she was at the in-laws but I do lover her fully, or who she was maybe before this disease destroyed her....


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## SecondTime'Round (Jan 15, 2015)

I'm not sure you can actually call it an emotional affair since it was one sided. It's such a strange story with her friends spreading rumors about her and this man who from what you say wanting nothing to do with her? I'm not even really following all of that. It sounds like a weird infatuation and not an EA. Still, she should apologize.


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## McDean (Jun 13, 2015)

SecondTime'Round said:


> I'm not sure you can actually call it an emotional affair since it was one sided. It's such a strange story with her friends spreading rumors about her and this man who from what you say wanting nothing to do with her? I'm not even really following all of that. It sounds like a weird infatuation and not an EA. Still, she should apologize.


You hit the nail on the head Round, infatuation is probably the best description. I do believe had he reciprocated we would be talking about a PA though she is adamant she has never and would never cheat, that she would leave first and pursue D. The story is weird because I think she is medically overwhelmed leading to her being mentally compromised.

I feel a sense of obligation to her, especially because my daughter watches our every move, but am sick of feeling it is always one sided...I am sick of feeling beta and weak, its not in my nature to typically accept a role like this but struggle because she is truly going through something horrible medically...that before it's onset we were fine (or at least we seemed to be)....


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## SecondTime'Round (Jan 15, 2015)

McDean said:


> You hit the nail on the head Round, infatuation is probably the best description. I do believe had he reciprocated we would be talking about a PA though she is adamant she has never and would never cheat, that she would leave first and pursue D. The story is weird because *I think she is medically overwhelmed leading to her being mentally compromised.*
> 
> I feel a sense of obligation to her, especially because my daughter watches our every move, but am sick of feeling it is always one sided...I am sick of feeling beta and weak, its not in my nature to typically accept a role like this but struggle because she is truly going through something horrible medically...that before it's onset we were fine (or at least we seemed to be)....


What you bolded is what I was thinking based on your summary.

In sickness and in health.........although I'm sure that is hard.....


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## meson (May 19, 2011)

SecondTime'Round said:


> I'm not sure you can actually call it an emotional affair since it was one sided. It's such a strange story with her friends spreading rumors about her and this man who from what you say wanting nothing to do with her? I'm not even really following all of that. It sounds like a weird infatuation and not an EA. Still, she should apologize.


It is still an EA even if it was one sided. An EA is a significant emotional investment in someone other than your spouse. The negative effects for the marriage still happen regardless if the investment was returned by the other or not.

McDean, somehow I don't think you have the full story.


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## Mr. Nail (Apr 26, 2011)

I like that Second TR thinks that the one sided EA could not be counted, but only because I am guilty of the same thing. On the other hand I know from her side how much guilt there really is. I did not initiate contact, and I did not send pictures. Most of the effects of an EA were present for me and are for your wife. The emotional attachment to another person especially. 

That is not the only issue. The health issue is huge here. In fact I believe it has more to do with your enjoying the separation than the EA. You needed the break, and you will continue to need breaks. I don't want to excuse her actions, but to leave her now is harsh. If she will leave her feelings for the other behind, and do away with the toxic friends who were cheering for your loss, I see healing for you.


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## Mr.Fisty (Nov 4, 2014)

You have taken on the caretaker role more than a partner, neglecting yourself. Expectations my man. You want some validation from an unstable person, odds are you are not, and what you are doing will go unnoticed.

You are looking for some reward for doing something good.

You should be working on detachment. If she wants you back, she will have to seek counseling on her own end and show you over a period of time that she can keep up with this new behavior.

You took her back too soon, and she reverts again.

How about you go on vacation alone or with the kids, being your own separate entity.

Go to a bar and dance or have fun, throw water balloons at coeds(kidding on that last one), or learn to fly a plane.


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## McDean (Jun 13, 2015)

Meson- the thought has crossed my mind that there may be more to the story, but I have had complete access to her phone etc. and never found anything compromising besides those one set of pictures in the bikini - even 90 days later no evidence. 

Nail- she has broken completely free of the toxic friends but not sure if she is over the guy she has emotions for.

Overall I agree with the perception that leaving her now would be harsh, its not in my nature to abandon people when they are down on their luck but there is a chance she could push me away and not sure there is much I can do there. I have remained by her side, took her side and believed her during the rumors, supported some of her MLC whims when I could and in general stepped things up at home with our daughter to compensate for her sick down time....all of which I feel fine about....what is making me angry is the feeling that she almost expects it from me and still hasn't shown remorse....

Lastly, because I don't think she is over the OM I don't trust her, I trust him more than her because I know he would tell her to take a hike as he did it before.....


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## SecondTime'Round (Jan 15, 2015)

meson said:


> It is still an EA even if it was one sided. An EA is a significant emotional investment in someone other than your spouse. The negative effects for the marriage still happen regardless if the investment was returned by the other or not.
> 
> McDean, somehow I don't think you have the full story.


I'm not down-playing the significance of it, but I don't think it should be called an affair since that implies two people. If someone developed an emotional attachment to me, without my knowledge, and it as a cause of marital problems and then I heard that that person was in an "emotional affair" with me, I'd be like, "Whoa, whoa! Wait a minute!" 

I think we can use the acronym EA to mean both emotional affair and/or emotional attachment, and both are damaging to a marriage.

Semantics.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

Have you read the two books linked to below and downloaded the free edition of NO MORE MISTER NICE GUY?

Your wife definitely fell out of love with you. The question can she get it back and can you get over her being in love, though unrequited, with someone else.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

I really don't see much difference in this situation and an EA/PA.


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## Absurdist (Oct 10, 2014)

McDean, I've read almost all of your posts. Your wife is in a mid life crisis which is exacerbated by the drugs she takes to manage her condition.

There's not much you can do. You can't fix her. She will have to fix herself.

Do you have a drop dead date? How much longer will you wait for her life axis to correct itself?

I would have serious reservations about a wife that has passionate sex one day only to tell me it was meaningless the next.


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

McDean said:


> You hit the nail on the head Round, infatuation is probably the best description. I do believe had he reciprocated we would be talking about a PA *though she is adamant she has never and would never cheat, that she would leave first and pursue D. * The story is weird because I think she is medically overwhelmed leading to her being mentally compromised.
> 
> I feel a sense of obligation to her, especially because my daughter watches our every move, but am sick of feeling it is always one sided...I am sick of feeling beta and weak, its not in my nature to typically accept a role like this but struggle because she is truly going through something horrible medically...that before it's onset we were fine (or at least we seemed to be)....


This just struck me wrong. What she's saying is that were she to find someone that she liked AND liked her, she would divorce your arse and run off with them. She also has said she no longer loves you? Heck, truth is, even though with health like hers she SHOULD be VERY thankful that she has a husband that cares about her---- She is not. TO tell you that great sex with you was because she was drunk and it meant nothing??? Let me just say--- as bad as it hurts, you might as well divorce her because she will eventually divorce you, anyway. She holds nothing but pain in the future for you. I loved my ex, and never wanted to get a divorce. She told me a lot of textbook b.s. as yours has told you. NOW, I'm glad that I did. She has/had no character and who would want a woman like that? Well, not me, anyway. You may find that your "anger" is not the same with another person as it is with her, but either way, it's got to stop one way or another or you'll mess up your next relationship as well.
JMO....


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## Dude007 (Jun 22, 2015)

SecondTime'Round said:


> What you bolded is what I was thinking based on your summary.
> 
> In sickness and in health.........although I'm sure that is hard.....


I agree, its probably the meds...Can she taper I find the root cause of depression/anxiety?


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## BetrayedDad (Aug 8, 2013)

McDean said:


> she was in love with someone else, he didn't know it and it was a mutual friend. She was emotionally attached to him and I found out sent him pictures of her in a bikini which he did not respond to. I told her to tell him how she felt.....
> 
> she followed my advice and was shot down in flames as expected... of course that only slightly reduced her feelings for him....


Is this woman stupid? I mean, she's ready to END YOUR MARRIAGE because she's infatuated with some guy whose not even into her? There has to be more to the story between these two unless he's Channing Tatum or something. What happens when she finds a guy who's willing to reciprocate? Friends like yours who WOULDN'T take advantage of a love sick foolish woman like your wife are in the minority. 

OP she's remorseless and has already made it very clear she is not into you anymore. If you continue to have a one sided relationship with this woman the ONLY person whose going to get hurt is YOU. It's your choice but she's too dangerous to keep around, imo. She got the knife in hand and she's just itching to plunge it through your heart. STRONGLY consider cutting your losses.


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## McDean (Jun 13, 2015)

Yep, definitely working on myself and my anger, started running again, dressing better etc....from an anger perspective I have made some big progress, even my little girl has noticed and I love her to death of course! Hard to separate what happened at the beginning of the Summer and her health issues, if a few weeks we have an appointment with a premier pain clinic in the company so we can hopefully find alternatives and ways to make her life easier, reduce the meds etc...

I guess in response to 'how long can I last - do I have a drop dead date' I don't have a timeline but would like to see what the new doctors can do to help her and how, possibly, that might change things for her and us by default.

Interesting point that my anger might be different with someone else, I have had the same thought and actually believe it might be.....things like the marathon sex followed by denial of it's meaning are so far removed from the lady I have know and loved it leaves me confused and angry.

I won't walk until we see how some things move forward with the new clinic.

That being said, I went home early today and basically told her I'm not going to play second fiddle to some other guy and while she has my support right now regarding her health and my respect as the mother of our child (she at least is a truly wonderful mom as long as she is not completely wiped out), I am getting to a breaking point on some items that are not negotiable for me.....oh, and like was suggested I actually have already booked a solo trip to play some poker in vegas and clear my head....


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## Dude007 (Jun 22, 2015)

McDean said:


> Yep, definitely working on myself and my anger, started running again, dressing better etc....from an anger perspective I have made some big progress, even my little girl has noticed and I love her to death of course! Hard to separate what happened at the beginning of the Summer and her health issues, if a few weeks we have an appointment with a premier pain clinic in the company so we can hopefully find alternatives and ways to make her life easier, reduce the meds etc...
> 
> I guess in response to 'how long can I last - do I have a drop dead date' I don't have a timeline but would like to see what the new doctors can do to help her and how, possibly, that might change things for her and us by default.
> 
> ...


I've had friend's wives Gawk over me before and I just ignored it and it eventually went away. I think that's the path here and get control of the meds too if possible. It does sound like maybe you two are not suited well. JMHO DUDE


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## McDean (Jun 13, 2015)

Betrayed - I know exactly what you are saying, it is part of the conundrum because obviously to think/feel the way she did was borderline 15 year HS girl stuff and I truly believe the meds had a major part to play in it...sometimes I couldn't talk to her because she was borderline incoherent in her speech, the guy she liked that didn't like her back even said something was wrong with her, different about her from six months ago....however, the other point of what happens if she finds someone who reciprocates (meds or no meds exerting influence) is a major concern for me still....

Dude- definitely hoping my IC will help me figure out the suited to each other portion, we truly were once...not entirely sure what changed and the only thing I see when I search for it is the Fibro and meds constantly being changed....now for course we get to work through an MLC together and that has added to her issues imo......

I have a IC later this week.....and I am looking at living situations (she is aware)....she asked me today when I got home what was wrong and so in keeping to our honesty policy I told her how what I was considering and without any bravado made it clear I am no one's plan B......surprisingly she reacted well in that she didn't fire back but I think may have been a little stunned and I detected a hint of sorrow but not sure if it is because she feels remorse for what has happened or because in her eyes I am plan B.....time will tell...


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## Absurdist (Oct 10, 2014)

McDean said:


> Betrayed - I know exactly what you are saying, it is part of the conundrum because obviously to think/feel the way she did was borderline 15 year HS girl stuff and I truly believe the meds had a major part to play in it...sometimes I couldn't talk to her because she was borderline incoherent in her speech, the guy she liked that didn't like her back even said something was wrong with her, different about her from six months ago....however, the other point of what happens if she finds someone who reciprocates (meds or no meds exerting influence) is a major concern for me still....
> 
> Dude- definitely hoping my IC will help me figure out the suited to each other portion, we truly were once...not entirely sure what changed and the only thing I see when I search for it is the Fibro and meds constantly being changed....now for course we get to work through an MLC together and that has added to her issues imo......
> 
> I have a IC later this week.....and I am looking at living situations (she is aware)....she asked me today when I got home what was wrong and so in keeping to our honesty policy I told her how what I was considering and without any bravado made it clear I am no one's plan B......surprisingly she reacted well in that she didn't fire back but I think may have been a little stunned and I detected a hint of sorrow but not sure if it is because she feels remorse for what has happened or because in her eyes I am plan B.....time will tell...



I'm glad you didn't use any false bravado... that's in no one's best interest. Telling the truth however, is the right thing to do no matter how much it hurts (both of you).

McDean I'm fairly convinced that many of your wife's problems stem from taking things like Mirapex and Gabapentin at the same time. That's a strange brew ****tail that make some act out in unexpected and bizarre ways. All you have to do is google those two drugs and see what I mean. Normal people with typical mid life angst can go to places they never envisioned while taking this stuff.

Nevertheless, that person is responsible for their own behavior. And you are responsible for looking at this at 50,000 feet using your wide angle lens. I think you have it in you to do this.


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## McDean (Jun 13, 2015)

Example of how twisted these meds have made her, yesterday I brought her and my daughter to where I work (I transferred 4 months ago so had never seen my office), had her meet some of my people etc....later in the night, when the pain in her arm got a bit too heavy she took a muscle relaxer - nothing too strong but to take the edge off. Out of the blue she tells me how sorry she is that she doesn't do more to keep our home clean and organized, that she really wants to go back to work if she ever can, appreciates how strong I've been for her and proceeds to cry....I told her that it's ok and the house is not important to me, her health is...of course I consoled her since I'm not willing to walk away yet....she said she also realized that had she been able to continue to work (she too was a professional before Fibro) she believes she might have realized the people she fell in with were 'bad friends' much sooner, even the guy she thought she loved at the beginning of the Summer were 'dip $hits'....on this I agree because she would be spending the majority of her day with professionals who don't have the time nor the inclination to spend every night drunk and stupid.....


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## McDean (Jun 13, 2015)

Update: just took the family on a final short vacation before school starts for our daughter. Along for the trip was my wife's best friend from childhood. All in all I give the baca 2 thumbs up but one of the nights my wife slipped backwards, definitely appeared to be med induced but she told me she doesn't want to talk about the EA any more, just move forward. That she can see us growing old together but not the time I between now and then??? 

Thank goodness her friend was there, it was my hope that she would see my wife in this state so she could confirm for me all that I had been thinking. She told my wife she was seriously in outer space and not behaving maturely or rationally and was very concerned for her. 

I took her the friend to the airport the next morning alone and she was in tears, she had no idea my wife had slipped so far off the planet, that she couldn't believe how alone I must have felt all summer. That my wife told her about the other guy she started falling for and she was like what the hell. She agrees my wife is in an MLC and these Fibro mess are compounding everything. 

Because she has been friends with my wife and her family since their dads served together she has even called my MIL with her observations and concerns. Things could get very interesting soon...

So, to summarize, i have some confidence that my wife will be forced at some point to see the realities of her situation and we can begin working through them together....but both my wife's friend and I are now worried she will walk away from our marriage before then, and will regret it. My wife's friend even told me that if that happens she wants me to have my daughter, my wife is in no position to care for her on a full time basis and even possibly part time. 

Anothe counseling session for me Tue, should be interesting.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

*Meds or not, you need to go ahead and extricate yourself from that situation! You deserve a far better hand of cards than what you've been dealt!

It appears that the best part of your marriage with her was your daughter!*
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

Sounds to me you'd be far better without her.


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## McDean (Jun 13, 2015)

On some level I wonder if I couldn't be more supportive if I was not her husband - as a friend instead of target number one. However, with us having a daughter I feel the need to stick by her for now, with no illusions that it will work out or work out before I can't handle it any longer. My MIL just called me and sharing the very basics with her broke her into tears, they had noticed some things when my wife and daughter stayed with them in July but did not realize the level to which it went.....guess it will be an interesting Fall...


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## Absurdist (Oct 10, 2014)

McDean said:


> On some level I wonder if I couldn't be more supportive if I was not her husband - as a friend instead of target number one. However, with us having a daughter I feel the need to stick by her for now, with no illusions that it will work out or work out before I can't handle it any longer. My MIL just called me and sharing the very basics with her broke her into tears, they had noticed some things when my wife and daughter stayed with them in July but did not realize the level to which it went.....guess it will be an interesting Fall...



McDean, you're a good man. I know you love your wife... it comes out in every post you make. Unfortunately, sometimes love does not conquer all.

I'm glad that her friend understands and that your MIL is beginning to gain an understanding that something is wrong. You need allies.

You say you have anger issues. What exactly do you mean by that? Anyone, me included, can be taken to a place where our temper gets the best of us and we fly off the handle. That's not an anger issue... that's being a human being.

I really don't know what to tell you but I will tell you this. Having been a confidant of a man in your position, I have seen limbo suck the life out of him. He was turning into one of the zombies in The Walking Dead. Not really alive. He only got his life back when he cut the cord and totally detached. It was a painful experience for him but he came out the other end being a whole human being. 

McDean, don't stay in limbo for an extended period of time. It will destroy you. Don't throw your life away being a caretaker. You need a line in sand, a plan and the fortitude to execute the plan.

Keep posting.


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## McDean (Jun 13, 2015)

Thanks Absurdist, it is definitely a pickle and living in limbo s*cks to your point! Now that some others are involved I am feeling a little more supported and truly hope that all them can help reach her so that she understands the erratic behavior she has displayed....because of this I have a little time left in me to hang in there and support her. 

My anger issues are really normal to just above normal I'm finding out, I am working on it none the less with my IC but it is interesting that she picked that issue from our past above any to get fixated on, but it was actually also my first clue to something being off.....

That being said, if we didn't have any kids I would probably not have lasted the Summer...since some things have gotten better and we do in fact have child, it has given me more strength to hold on awhile longer....

Thank you to all of you for the insight and advice, truly appreciated!


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## Mr.Fisty (Nov 4, 2014)

Have you tried lowering your expectation. You see her as your wife, partner, which she is legally, but not in practice. You want her to love, respect, and be a sane adult, and at the moment she cannot . So you live knowing that you will not get what you want from her and operating your life like you will not have those things.

When you make plans with your children, you ask her if she wants to join, but expecting her not to, that way, the level of disappointment will be down. Basically you start expecting things from who she is, instead of what you want and her to be.

Also, put yourself if possible less in those frustrating situation. You are more of a tenacious person than me, I would have separated. From her behavior, she would cross too many boundaries for me.


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## McDean (Jun 13, 2015)

Thanks Mr Fisty, I think it's sound advice to lower my expectations, I have been working on 180 too but a light version...it definitely helps. And I am preparing for it to just end one day out of the blue or if I finally run out of steam!


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## McDean (Jun 13, 2015)

Quick update: we will call this two steps forward one step back...

My Wife's best friend called her today, the one that met us for vaca the last weekend. "She told my wife (my wife told me about the call after it ended) that she had seen some very odd behavior from her one of the nights and the next morning. It had her worried etc.". My wife said it made her really upset and so asked me about it, confirmed for her what her friend had witnessed which made my wife tears eyed. While it pains me to see her go through this the upside is she can no longer ignore what I have been pointing out. She has agreed to start counseling adapt, still just for her but it is a start. 

My counsellor r told me this week I was handling things we'll all of it considered. Told me my plan sounds reasonable but to keep a check on my personal feelings, which ebb and flow between hoping for a full R and calling it quits. It is odd, since we started to have issues more women seem to be interested in me, while I couldn't be too bothered right now it does make the prospect of walking easier. 

While we were talking I simply asked how she felt we were doing to which she said " so much better than this summer and even 6-8 months ago. That she felt better about us but still felt we were more best friends than husband/ wife but going right direction. For the most part given her personal struggles this seemed good. But I did mention I was not looking for a lifelong best friend, she asked if I thought we would be best friends if we ended it and I said no. Which hurt her, when she asked why I simply said my friends are loyal....I wasn't trying to hurt her but realizing she was in a state of openness because of what her friend had told her I felt honesty, though painful, may be the order of the day. At one point she asked me if I was intentionally sticking around because of our daughter, I said no that if I ever feel this will not improve beyond what it is now I will end it so my daughter, hopefully one day will see what a normal relationship looks like. This surprised her I think. Gave her hope that I can hang in there longer but also showed her I have thought about walking. All in all, not too bad a day but sure hope we can get her better soon as it does get old being a best friend only husband......


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

Brutal honesty will continue to serve you well in these conversations.


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

Many women have this need to friend zone their ex-husbands. It's just another form of control and keeping that safety net. If the two of you were to divorce, I guarantee you sha has no intention of being best friends with you. As soon as she hooks a new man you will be yesterday's news....just another guy she used to know. 

But you know this. Good for you not letting her entertain that notion.


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## Absurdist (Oct 10, 2014)

How goes it McDean?

Just talked to my friends today who are representing a woman who had taken a grab bag of Mirapex, Gabapentin and Lyrica and went completely off the rails.

It made me think of your thread.


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## McDean (Jun 13, 2015)

Howdy Absurdist! Yep, it's a mess and to boot half the time she doesn't even feel any better.

I have had some steps forward with her and some setbacks. I know in my heart her Fibro and the meds unduly influenced her and lead to the semi-EA as I am calling it now since the OM had no interest in her and did not reciprocate. Showing how messed up it made her. 

That being said, something in me has broken. I spend most days wishing it was over and the other half hoping we have a full on R.


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## happy as a clam (Jan 5, 2014)

If it's not too personal, do you mind sharing which meds she is taking? I'm just curious to know what "wicked c0cktail" is making her so out of it.


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## McDean (Jun 13, 2015)

happy as a clam said:


> If it's not too personal, do you mind sharing which meds she is taking? I'm just curious to know what "wicked c0cktail" is making her so out of it.


Doing my best to remember but in full disclosure know that I am missing one or two: Cymbalta, Lyrica, Mirapex, Flexriol, Tramadol....valium, Midol and vicadin when needed....

It's potent, back in the Spring when everything went sideways she had been extremely doped up, drinking more due to her terrible friend group and was coming out of a 6 week flare....punctuated with a near death experience when she had tachycardia at 210 BPM heart rate for 40 minutes which put her in the emergency room (this is the event I suspect kicked off the MLC).....

Compared to April-May-June where I would argue that only 20% of my wife (the one I married) showed up each day, she is back around 60% now which is the only reason we survived the Summer I believe....at 20% I basically got a taste of what parenting a teenager will be like....


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## happy as a clam (Jan 5, 2014)

McDean said:


> Doing my best to remember but in full disclosure know that I am missing one or two: C*ymbalta, Lyrica, Mirapex, Flexriol, Tramadol....valium, Midol and vicadin when needed....*


McDean... please don't view my comments as HARSH... but your wife is on a WICKED C*CKTAIL of Big Pharma drugs... yeah, yeah, the docs all say, "Take this, take that!" Or how about this... "NO! The meds CAN'T POSSIBLY be causing her symptoms!"

I was married to a world-renowned neurologist for two decades. ALL of his major research was regarding the DESTRUCTVIENESS of the class of drugs known as "benzodiazepines" (Ativan, Xanax, Valium, Klonopin, Ambiem (yes, Ambien!! All you folks who think you are taking a "harmless" sleep aid). These drugs f*ck up your GABA receptors (look it up) and have ruined more lives than alcohol, marijuana, pain killers (opiates), LSD, cocaine, crystal meth, heroin, uppers, downers, COMBINED. *Worst part... it's all "legal"*. Because "my doc prescribed it!"

Yep. And the doctors just keep handing those scripts out like candy. "Here, take this. You need to INCREASE your dose!"

Yeah, right. Zombie nation.


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## McDean (Jun 13, 2015)

happy as a clam said:


> McDean... please don't view my comments as HARSH... but your wife is on a WICKED C*CKTAIL of Big Pharma drugs... yeah, yeah, the docs all say, "Take this, take that!" Or how about this... "NO! The meds CAN'T POSSIBLY be causing her symptoms!"
> 
> I was married to a world-renowned neurologist for two decades. ALL of his major research was regarding the DESRUCTVIENESS of the class of drugs known as "benzodiazepines". These drugs have ruined more lives than alcohol, marijuana, pain killers (opiates), heroin, uppers, downers, COMBINED.


Yep, I have grave concerns for her long term health given the current ****tail. Part of the problem is we have had terrible physicians the past few years but in the past 45 days have finally landed with more sensible and 'determined to help' types....they just haven't found something that works enough on it's own, with therapy etc., to feel they should take her off anything.

It's one reason I have been steadfast in attempting to work on our relationship because I honestly don't know if at the time she really understood what she was thinking or doing....as a loyal guy how can I leave her and one day if she gets better she 'wakes up' and wonders what happened...

Sadly, I've read enough to know that she still has accountability for her actions even if we all agree she has an additional influence that may have contributed....so at 60% my wife I can tell you it won't be enough in the long-term but I can hang and work on it together with her for now....hoping it keeps improving however....


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## Chris Taylor (Jul 22, 2010)

Seems to me that...

-OP's wife had enough of OP's anger problems.
-OP's wife had an affair. Probably physical. (what guy doesn't like ANY type of girl???)
-Wife's friends started talking.
-OP's wife panicked and realized she had been caught.
-OP's wife decided separation wasn't good since her physical problems.
-OP's wife decides to try to make things better.
-OP's wife refused counseling because she was afraid the truth of the affair would come out.
-She now realizes she has to go to counseling in order to hold on to her caregiver.

Just my two cents.


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## McDean (Jun 13, 2015)

Chris Taylor said:


> Seems to me that...
> 
> -OP's wife had enough of OP's anger problems.
> -OP's wife had an affair. Probably physical. (what guy doesn't like ANY type of girl???)
> ...


Not too far off Chris...
-OP's wife had enough of OP's anger problems - yes though probably compounded by drug fog given rarity of anger outbursts (I am not minimizing impacts however)
-OP's wife had an affair. Probably physical. (what guy doesn't like ANY type of girl???) - nope, never had the chance - the OM reached out to me and most of the time it could have happened I was around, she was in the drug stupor full on and thought she loved him but he did not reciprocate and others saw the blow off happen
-Wife's friends started talking.- they did but they are all drunks with extreme jealousy issues and pulled [email protected] on others as well, it's just the low lifes they are
-OP's wife panicked and realized she had been caught.- with the EA (which I call semi EA because he didn't reciprocate) she told me straight up how she felt and did not panic for 60 days until after the drug stupor passed
-OP's wife decided separation wasn't good since her physical problems.- I have to wonder about this one and still do, discussing with my therapist
-OP's wife decides to try to make things better.- somewhat but not full on and not sure of motivation behind it
-OP's wife refused counseling because she was afraid the truth of the affair would come out.- absolutely 100% true, she knows the world will kick her in the teeth for this one, despite my anger there were too many other things that made the extremeness of her actions (truly out of the blue too) justifiable unless you have some kind of issue (which she does honestly with the Fibro/drugs)
-She now realizes she has to go to counseling in order to hold on to her caregiver.- her best friend and mom upon seeing her erratic behavior told her she needed to and then the pain dr. did too, all in the space of a few weeks which I can tell struck home with her that she has problems that need to be fixed....true, I may be one of the problems, trying to work all of that out.....


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## bigfoot (Jan 22, 2014)

Maybe you posted it, but I would like an answer to the following:

YOU seem to be blaming everything on her medication and fibro condition. Has a doctor or other clinician who has been fully informed of the story confirmed that to be the case? 

The reason I ask is that too often I see folks attributing something to BPD, NPD, Meds, etc., because of something they read online or heard about. Absent a clinical opinion on the issue, they are just pulling stuff out of their butt. Get an official opinion. Usually, there are other symptoms that have to be present for a clinical attribution of aberrant behavior to medication or medical or mental issues.

Once you know, then you can figure out how to cope or quit or whatever. I am no friend of waywards, BUT if wayward type behavior has a medical or mental health basis, then its different. A truly un-diagnosed or misdiagnosed BPD sufferer who sleeps with 10 people is different than a perfectly stable person who does the same. MC, may help the serial cheater, but it will be useless to the one with mental problems. 

Get that sorted out first and then maybe you can find some peace or make peace with how to proceed. A one sided EA sounds like it was mental health or pharmacologically based, but you need a diagnosis.


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## McDean (Jun 13, 2015)

Good point Bigfoot, all I have so far is that the pain psychologist verified she is suffering from depression and my therapist based on my description of behaviors and the sudden onset right after a near death experience she had believe it caused a 'break' and MLC which in turn was all compounded by drinking while on a potent ****tail of meds. I believe she is accountable for the behaviors regardless but what I attribute to the meds and MLC is a diminished capacity for adult reasoning.....in the end, I won't stay with her if we don't go to MC and I see some remorse for what she has done....but given we can't even get the pain to diminish so she can function semi-normally it's hard to make this the first priority right now.....

It's a mess but not using the meds and fibro/MLC as complete scapegoat just a contributor....


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

My wife was told she might have fibro. What is the prognosis in your wife's situation? Does she have pain all over? Has she felt normal pain more than other would?

I can't imagine a person having a single lucide thought taking the meds she does. Back in the day I couldn't stand being around people taking Valium to get high on. Many people used to take it but I have no clue what goes on currently. I know a Valium and a drink or two made a person as interesting as a bag of rocks.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

BTW, does she remember calling your friend and confessing her love for him?


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## McDean (Jun 13, 2015)

She has general pain all over with localized extreme pain in her right arm and shoulder and hips. She remembers most of what happened based on our discussions but is adamant she did not 'love' him but admits to liking him. She doesn't remember some of the nights very well where she drank, fortunately I was around for those so I know nothing happened but in telling her what I observed she believed me but was shocked as she truly had no idea...even if someone tells me it was 100% driven by the Fibro and meds I would still hold her accountable and I don't know if I will ever trust her again because who's to say another bad episode and some [email protected] friends won't push her into doing something stupid again....

My anger is much more under control, in fact it's been a great summer of working on me - lost weight, new clothes, calm and quite frankly 180'd so while I want to work on it and still hope it works out another part of me wants to kick the can on down the road....


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## McDean (Jun 13, 2015)

Quick update - found out a little bit ago that my wife booked us a 3 day weekend at the beach, has our daughter covered so it will just be us on the vaca. Nice gesture, not reading into it too much however but appreciated....


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## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

Enjoy, take it easy and live in the moment. You both need serious MC. 
A man's anger/temper can do major and irreparable damage to a marriage, do not discount that.
Like any woman, your W is not going to let it go so easily and you have to really make major amends, hence the digs at you about the sex, the OM, etc
I wouldn't label what she did as an EA but it was wrong non the less. She must apologise and take responsibility, you hurt her, she wanted to hurt you back.

I think you both have a chance as there is love there (regardless of what she says, some women just mouth off) 

Get professional help ASAP, do not let that slide any more.

Enjoy your 3 days!


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## McDean (Jun 13, 2015)

aine said:


> Enjoy, take it easy and live in the moment. You both need serious MC.
> A man's anger/temper can do major and irreparable damage to a marriage, do not discount that.
> Like any woman, your W is not going to let it go so easily and you have to really make major amends, hence the digs at you about the sex, the OM, etc
> I wouldn't label what she did as an EA but it was wrong non the less. She must apologise and take responsibility, you hurt her, she wanted to hurt you back.
> ...


Thank you aine! I take this as sound advice. I really have come to realize how much my anger hurt her and deeply regret it, even feel stupid about it now in hindsight. Should I be concerned that she won't go to MC yet - she says when she is ready she will let me know but thinks we both need to work on ourselves for now - me for my anger (already going into month 3 of IC for that) and her for her medical issues and general (which she starts next week)???


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## Absurdist (Oct 10, 2014)

McDean said:


> Quick update - found out a little bit ago that my wife booked us a 3 day weekend at the beach, has our daughter covered so it will just be us on the vaca. Nice gesture, not reading into it too much however but appreciated....


McDean - if your wife was truly done with you, there is no way she would schedule a vacation with you alone. I take this as a very positive sign. Deep down in that addled brain of hers she's coming to the realization that you still love her. And even though you say you may be ready to "kick the can down the road" you still love this person and she can feel that love. She may not know what to do with it today but she can still feel it. Patience my friend.


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## ButtPunch (Sep 17, 2014)

Absurdist said:


> McDean - if your wife was truly done with you, there is no way she would schedule a vacation with you alone. I take this as a very positive sign. Deep down in that addled brain of hers she's coming to the realization that you still love her. And even though you say you may be ready to "kick the can down the road" you still love this person and she can feel that love. She may not know what to do with it today but she can still feel it. Patience my friend.


I disagree.....All women are different. She may go on the trip marathon sex him the whole time and pack her bags and leave him when she gets home.

I wouldn't read to much into this.

I also notice a lot of FOCUS on her. Your posts send my CODEPENDENCY radar sky high. You might want to look into a few books on the topic.


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## McDean (Jun 13, 2015)

Absurdist - I agree it has a positive lining to it, the trip I mean. Patience (or lack of it rather) is my greatest weakness actually lol...but I am hanging in there!

BP - The thought that this might not mean anything or could even be the nicest 'dumping' I've ever received has crossed my mind. On the Codependent piece, I appreciate you reading the threads and sharing. Just yesterday I started to wonder if to some extent I'm not an enabler with her. If I am I think it is partly the result of me doing everything I possibly can to help her with her Fibro but then, another friend of mine that has Fibro as well and for longer said my W's issues in this do not mean I should be a slave to it. Supporting her and coddling her are two different things. Open to any books/articles you recommend...I'm a voracious reader!


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

I also think the booking of the trip is a good sign. I think that being the most fun, happy, best version of yourself is the only way to possibly change a woman's mind. That would also be the most fun way for you to spend time with her. Give it a try! What can it hurt???
Have a good time, and we will all be pulling for you if things get better. 
There is no reason for a trip with you if she doesn't still have some kind of feelings for you. Then again, she may just be trying to keep her bird's nest handy.


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## Absurdist (Oct 10, 2014)

How goes it McDean?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## McDean (Jun 13, 2015)

Interesting weekend - my birthday was Friday and she blew it off but took me to dinner in the end, told me it creeped up on her...she has had a rough go with the doctors trying some new meds - her affect is so flat the best way to describe her is like a psychopath, thus my birthday.....she started to come out of it a little bit yesterday from what I could tell but right now the ****tail of meds has her sleeping about 12-14hrs/day so from a health perspective not good. On the relationship side of things I would say it's on hold, not worse but not really able to work on it to make it better....

I go to Vegas this weekend, alone....I have no interest in doing anything by sleeping, pondering and playing poker - it's a trip to clear my head and reflect on life in general.....I won't cheat, I've decided this whole fiasco of a Summer reconfirmed for me it is the absolute lowest thing you can do to someone else regardless of the scenario, I have to power to end things if I want to and so no reason to cheat when I can just end it and move on....

On a scale of 1-10 with 10 being great and making progress and 1 terrible and moving backwards we're stuck at a 6 for now I would say.....

One last note for anyone with insight, my wife's condition is impacting my daughter's behavior and view of life I believe...more and more often my daughter (who is about to turn 5) points out all of her ailments (imagined) and I think it is for attention....two concerns, 1 - is whether I am doing enough to pay attention to her but based on feedback from everyone I am a really good dad, but my doubts linger and 2 - could it ever be that my wifes condition, should it not improve, be enough of a reason to divorce and ask for 100% custody (I would never keep my daughter and wife apart but my daughter has already missed two days of school because my wife couldn't "get up in time")...my daughter is in TK so it's not ultimately a huge issue but sets a precedent I fear.....?


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## sidney2718 (Nov 2, 2013)

McDean: I'd like to stress one thing that you've already mentioned. That is your temper. Anger and raging can cause more damage than unrequited love, which is what your wife is going through.

If you want to move this along I think you need to put in heavy work on yourself. If you can do that and if your wife sees it, it may help her.

As far as your wife goes, I think you are a stand-up guy for not abandoning her when her mental situation got rough. I'm positive that her "affair" came from a need to get away from the anger that you spewed on her from time to time. And then for her to be rebuffed really must have torn her up.

There are enough psychological problems in your relationship to go around. But I think you should try to work it out. You understand each other far better then any one else would understand either of you. It is tough, but she seems in her own way to not only be helping, but wanting you back.

You also need some professional advice on your daughter. Get your wife's buy in on this. It is important.


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## McDean (Jun 13, 2015)

Had another session with my Counselor today - he has seen great progress, likes what he is hearing from me and when I got home my wife told me the same thing!!! So, anger not gone but much better controlled and dealt with than 4 months ago....and, my wife has agreed to start seeing a counselor as well IC for now, not MC, but it's a step in the right direction and she goes for her first session this Monday....

I can't quite describe my feelings right now but they seem to be a strange blend of optimism and hope but without attachment to outcome. I mean to say, if the process my wife and I are going through ends up showing us both to be healthier and better off as 'co-parents' and friendly rather than husband and wife I think I am really ok with it and support it and if in this process we end up in a full on R for the rest of our lives then yippee skipee for that as well....it's strange but very peaceful....will keep you posted since I leave for Vegas day after tomorrow.....


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## Absurdist (Oct 10, 2014)

McDean said:


> Had another session with my Counselor today - he has seen great progress, likes what he is hearing from me and when I got home my wife told me the same thing!!! So, anger not gone but much better controlled and dealt with than 4 months ago....and, my wife has agreed to start seeing a counselor as well IC for now, not MC, but it's a step in the right direction and she goes for her first session this Monday....
> 
> I can't quite describe my feelings right now but they seem to be a strange blend of optimism and hope but without attachment to outcome. I mean to say, if the process my wife and I are going through ends up showing us both to be healthier and better off as 'co-parents' and friendly rather than husband and wife I think I am really ok with it and support it and if in this process we end up in a full on R for the rest of our lives then yippee skipee for that as well....it's strange but very peaceful....will keep you posted since I leave for Vegas day after tomorrow.....



I think you are handling this well. When do you go on the beach vacation?

I don't want a bunch of TMI but are you guys intimate at all? I think it would help her as much as you.


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## McDean (Jun 13, 2015)

Beach trip is in 3 weeks, very excited about that trip! Intimacy is low, last time about 3 weeks ago but some if the infrequency is due to her mess being played with right now and one night we started I could tell she was into it mentally but stopped and told me point blank (which I appreciated) that she could barely feel my hands - we think maybe the combo of mess made her numb. I definitely did not feel rejected and could her frustration with it. Just one of those things as we work through it all.


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## McDean (Jun 13, 2015)

Quick update but hoping for some insight and/or advice. I am on my solo trip to Vegas and as planned have done a lot of pondering and soul searching in between getting my @ss handed to me at poker lol. 

My first full day here I felt uneasy. My wife and I used to come here with some friends a couple of times per year and I realized that we fought here a lot. It dawns on me that we almost always fought about sex, and reading the sex section on TAM I know for sure she is LD. 

In fact I would say 60% of our fights have been over this category. 30% around her choice of friends and the rest just garbage fights. 

I assume some of her LD may be health related. But I find myself hurt and irritated all over again? We have a beach trip together in 3weeks and I would bet money(a safer bet than I have found here) that she won't even consider it. She only has ever really been into when she drinks which she can't do much now. I would say I am more on the HD side. 

All weekend long I have been pondering how quick we can get divorced, I have strong negative feelings toward her for the mere fact that my last memories of here are of strife. 

Is this something to worry about or what?


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

McDean said:


> Quick update but hoping for some insight and/or advice. I am on my solo trip to Vegas and as planned have done a lot of pondering and soul searching in between getting my @ss handed to me at poker lol.
> 
> My first full day here I felt uneasy. My wife and I used to come here with some friends a couple of times per year and I realized that we fought here a lot. It dawns on me that we almost always fought about sex, and reading the sex section on TAM I know for sure she is LD.
> 
> ...


Do you think you might be trying to force a square peg into a round whole in trying to save the marriage?

And the other question I have had is that once you save it (assuming you will), will you realize it was not really worth it?


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## McDean (Jun 13, 2015)

I am starting to fear the answers to both of those questions. On the first one I am not completely sure yet but I think if I answer no then the second questions answer is a lot more dangerous.


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

Don't decide in Vegas...that is for sure.

But you do need to figure out if the prize is worth it.


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## McDean (Jun 13, 2015)

Yep, this is not the best place to determine a relationships direction lol.


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

Have fun, brother.

You have earned it.


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## Absurdist (Oct 10, 2014)

Absurdist said:


> McDean, you're a good man. I know you love your wife... it comes out in every post you make. Unfortunately, sometimes love does not conquer all.
> 
> I'm glad that her friend understands and that your MIL is beginning to gain an understanding that something is wrong. You need allies.
> 
> ...



McDean - what I wrote in August above still stands true today. Either fully commit to your wife (with all her warts) or separate and divorce. Living half a life will ultimately destroy you.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Absurdist (Oct 10, 2014)

How goes it McDean? You've been as quiet as a church mouse. I can't tell if that is good or bad.


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## McDean (Jun 13, 2015)

Hello everyone - quick update, we leave day after tomorrow for our trip to the beach that she set up so will have more to share on that next week. Since my trip to Vegas not much has occurred, we have had a few discussions and she started IC (which she really liked) but while things are not caustic they aren't really progressing yet either. I am hopeful this coming weekend my rekindle some fire but would be lying if I didn't admit that everything that has happened the past 4-5 months has left me emotionally burned out.....if she told me tomorrow she wanted the D I, with all honestly, can tell you I would hardly have a response....weird...thanks for reaching out Absurdist!


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

Good luck! Sounds like there may be to kuch wTer under the bridge though.


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## McDean (Jun 13, 2015)

So just got back yesterday from our 'getaway weekend' that the wife set up for us. The weekend was a huge success. We spent a lot of time exploring the location but in doing so had plenty of time to talk as well. Interesting outcome is that we both reaffirmed that we want to work on the marriage and hope it works but are pragmatic and neither of us wants to remain in the marriage if it isn't completely healthy for both of us. I think I am accurate/honest in saying that both of us reached a stage in this process where if it works out we're happy it did and will never 'neglect' it again the way we have in the past but if it doesn't we will remain friends and do the utmost to co-parent our daughter in a way that keeps her self-esteem and happiness intact. Very successful weekend and first step but still a long road to travel before I think either of us would acknowledge a full R had occurred.....


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

Sounds good on the surface man.
So others are informed here are the side effects Fibromyalgia Symptoms - Symptoms of Fibromyalgia - from WebMD
This is why the sex in part will not be that often BUT she has to commit emotionally at least to you to have a healthy relationship.
Good luck to the both of you.:smile2:


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## McDean (Jun 13, 2015)

Yep Tom67 - she has most of those symptoms sadly. It definitely plays havoc with her SD but it puts her sometimes into LD mode and then all of a sudden it might flip flop to HD. To your point however, the emotional commitment from both of us will be the most critical if anything long-term is to flourish....but off to a decent start at this point at least...


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## Absurdist (Oct 10, 2014)

McDean said:


> So just got back yesterday from our 'getaway weekend' that the wife set up for us. The weekend was a huge success. We spent a lot of time exploring the location but in doing so had plenty of time to talk as well. Interesting outcome is that we both reaffirmed that we want to work on the marriage and hope it works but are pragmatic and neither of us wants to remain in the marriage if it isn't completely healthy for both of us. I think I am accurate/honest in saying that both of us reached a stage in this process where if it works out we're happy it did and will never 'neglect' it again the way we have in the past but if it doesn't we will remain friends and do the utmost to co-parent our daughter in a way that keeps her self-esteem and happiness intact. Very successful weekend and first step but still a long road to travel before I think either of us would acknowledge a full R had occurred.....



Pragmatic Sanction.

I hope this works for you McDean. You've got a lot of folks rooting for you. I'm waving my pom poms right now.


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## McDean (Jun 13, 2015)

Quick update: had a chat with the wife last night about 'our future'....she feels things have only been improving between us the past few months and after our recent trip has had the spark partially rekindled. She thinks, and I agree, that the individual work we are doing to improve ourselves is still critical to any long term success we share together. We both agreed to read the 'love languages' book together which I am going to pick up today on the way home from work. She said it is hard to imagine anymore me not being in her life and she realizes the deep depression her physical ailments caused her earlier in the Summer and she's sorry for the pain she caused me. I didn't bring up the borderline EA she had but she did and told me looking back it is the best evidence she has of how loopy she was. In the end we have road still to travel to get to a full R but we are moving in the right direction. Hope this helps anyone looking for hope. Of course, it would be a mistake for me not to mention that her health has greatly improved and we finally have some doctors making an effort to help her...as I said in my very first posts on TAM I truly felt her health and the meds had as much to do with the near D as anything. Lastly, she told me she spent some time reading MLC symptoms and while she can see that she still feels it was more just straight up deep depression - her logic being she wasn't really unhappy with her past or past with me but was in a dark place in general....


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

That's great, McDean. Hope you a full and happy life. It does sound like progress has been made!


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## Absurdist (Oct 10, 2014)

McDean said:


> Quick update: had a chat with the wife last night about 'our future'....she feels things have only been improving between us the past few months and after our recent trip has had the spark partially rekindled. She thinks, and I agree, that the individual work we are doing to improve ourselves is still critical to any long term success we share together. We both agreed to read the 'love languages' book together which I am going to pick up today on the way home from work. She said it is hard to imagine anymore me not being in her life and she realizes the deep depression her physical ailments caused her earlier in the Summer and she's sorry for the pain she caused me. I didn't bring up the borderline EA she had but she did and told me looking back it is the best evidence she has of how loopy she was. In the end we have road still to travel to get to a full R but we are moving in the right direction. Hope this helps anyone looking for hope. Of course, it would be a mistake for me not to mention that her health has greatly improved and we finally have some doctors making an effort to help her...as I said in my very first posts on TAM I truly felt her health and the meds had as much to do with the near D as anything. Lastly, she told me she spent some time reading MLC symptoms and while she can see that she still feels it was more just straight up deep depression - her logic being she wasn't really unhappy with her past or past with me but was in a dark place in general....



This is a good report McDean.

Let me tell you a story. I have survived cancer. My wife has survived cancer. We both held each other when we were puking our guts up from the chemo. Now, thanks be to God, we are cancer free. We have sat for many nights in ICU with a young daughter we thought was going to die (she's now married with three kids ). We survived the crash of the savings & loan industry in the 80s when most of our hard earned assets floated down the toilet.

Like ****ens says in the opening line of A Tale of Two Cities "It was the best of times, it was the worst of times". Through all this the love, support, encouragement, and mutual respect we have for each other never waned.

McDean, you are on a long road and guess what? The road has no final destination in this life. It's simply a road you travel. Learn to enjoy the ride. The ride is all we have.

Keep posting.


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## McDean (Jun 13, 2015)

It's been a little while since I posted an update to my story. Things in the R are going fairly well, it takes work and effort and I think the old saying of two steps forward, one step back is appropriate I describing what it is like. But it's progress none the less. The wife is still working through her medical issues but for the past 75 days it has been stable which I think was necessary to any work on us beginning. She has stuck to her personal counseling, as have I, and we are both the better for it. Our daughter is none the wiser it would seem and thinks the world is 'perfect' which is great considering she is only 5. My wife and I still fight occasionally but with far less vitriol and insult than previously which allows us to get past it. In getting to know myself and her better, there are simply some differences that naturally lead to some caustic moments. Some might say they make us incompatible, it's probably true to some extent but to us it does not appear to be enough to throw in the towel. For anyone hoping for or pursuing the big R, it is a tough road. I still get angry at her, and some times I can't help but wonder if I wouldn't still be happier without her....then, other times I see her working with our daughter or even how she looks at me and I feel the exact opposite....know that it will be as much work as keeping a healthy marriage going and so keep the faith!


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

Overall it sounds positive, brother.

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk


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## Absurdist (Oct 10, 2014)

It's hard work McDean. Only time will tell if it's worth the effort. You will be a better man for this no matter what the ultimate outcome might be.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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