# BPD Questions - not sure where to put this.



## mattyjman (Jun 6, 2012)

So I'm nearly out of my first marriage, papers are all that's needed left to seal the deal. We've been separated now for almost 6 months or so.

In any case, I've met a girl that is intriguing to me. She has had some drama in her past, and has admitted that she has been treated for BPD. 

I've read a few things on here about it, but never really paid much attention, as it didn't really deal with my own marital issues. 

So, I guess I'm asking for some info on BPD and what could I expect from someone that has recovered from it, as well as signs that an individual has not recovered from it. 

I'm certainly not attached to this girl, but I would like to see where things go. However, if deciding to discover each other is like opening pandora's box for her BPD, I'd just as soon run away and find someone new. 

What info can you give me. Perhaps some real world scenarios and situations? 

Thanks in advance.


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## KathyBatesel (Apr 26, 2012)

I just wrote an article on this topic: Borderline Personality Disorder and Relationships


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## Mavash. (Jan 26, 2012)

First off you never recover from BPD it's only managed. Secondly I'd want to know what she's actually done to treat it. 

I manage my BPD VERY well. My resume is I've had almost 4 years of therapy, read 300 hundred self help books, I exercise, eat right, my life is stress free and downsized. I'll never be normal but I'm emotionally healthy and my symptoms are easy to work around. My family is aware of what I can and can't handle.

My therapist says it's like a disability. There are limits to what I can do. That annoys me but I see where she's coming from and have learned to live with that.


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## mattyjman (Jun 6, 2012)

Mavash. said:


> First off you never recover from BPD it's only managed. Secondly I'd want to know what she's actually done to treat it.
> 
> I manage my BPD VERY well. My resume is I've had almost 4 years of therapy, read 300 hundred self help books, I exercise, eat right, my life is stress free and downsized. I'll never be normal but I'm emotionally healthy and my symptoms are easy to work around. My family is aware of what I can and can't handle.
> 
> My therapist says it's like a disability. There are limits to what I can do. That annoys me but I see where she's coming from and have learned to live with that.


wow... well she hasn't done anything nearly to that extent, I can assure you. she did do intense therapy, for 2 or 3 year, a couple of hours each session, multiple times per week. 

do you feel like people have to "dance" around you to not set you off... now that they know you have bpd? (hopefully that doesn't come off as offensive)


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## mattyjman (Jun 6, 2012)

KathyBatesel said:


> I just wrote an article on this topic: Borderline Personality Disorder and Relationships


thanks Kathy, I'll look into it.


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## KathyBatesel (Apr 26, 2012)

mattyjman said:


> wow... well she hasn't done anything nearly to that extent, I can assure you. she did do intense therapy, for 2 or 3 year, a couple of hours each session, multiple times per week.
> 
> do you feel like people have to "dance" around you to not set you off... now that they know you have bpd? (hopefully that doesn't come off as offensive)


This is a question that would best be answered by the dancers! 

It may be hard for a BPD person to perceive what their partners experience just like it's hard for a partner to understand what it's like to have BPD.


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## Mavash. (Jan 26, 2012)

mattyjman said:


> wow... well she hasn't done anything nearly to that extent, I can assure you. she did do intense therapy, for 2 or 3 year, a couple of hours each session, multiple times per week.
> 
> do you feel like people have to "dance" around you to not set you off... now that they know you have bpd? (hopefully that doesn't come off as offensive)


I was better by year 2-3 no doubt. I went back because I'm an overachiever and I wanted to go ALL THE WAY. I had a few loose ends that I felt needed to be dealt with so I went back.

Technically no nobody has to "dance" around me anymore but that doesn't mean it doesn't happen from time to time. I think my kids still do this a little but my husband swears he doesn't anymore. I do a good job of reassuring him that I'm 'okay' when my mood drops. 

And no you didn't offend me at all. I'm over it.


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## Mavash. (Jan 26, 2012)

LadyFrogFlyAway said:


> "No nobody has to "dance" around me anymore. Those days are long over."


I edited this after I saw Kathy's post. She's right it's hard for the BPD'er to know for sure if someone is dancing around them or not. I try now to watch my family, to check in with them, to see how they react to me and if I see evidence of them "dancing" I reassure them. I hug them, tell them I'm fine, that I love them, that I've fixed this, I reassure them that I'm better now, etc. That works well.


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## KathyBatesel (Apr 26, 2012)

Hey, Mavash, I'd love your feedback on that article if you have time and are willing... ?


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## mattyjman (Jun 6, 2012)

i'll admit, reading through the article and seeing how hard mavash. has worked to overcome it, it hardly seems worth the effort to put into a new relationship knowing that bpd exists... that's like a recipe for disaster, isn't it? 

she seems to control it fine when we're together, but they are not for extended periods, and i haven't pissed her off yet by being a dumbass... but rest assured, i will at some point unknowingly do something stupid, i am a guy after all. i wonder what the storm would look like...


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## Mavash. (Jan 26, 2012)

KathyBatesel said:


> Hey, Mavash, I'd love your feedback on that article if you have time and are willing... ?


I read it and it's spot on. 

The craziness you describe is still in my head I just now how to manage it now without exploding in rage or falling into depression. I am able to regulate my emotions now.


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## KathyBatesel (Apr 26, 2012)

Thank you for your feedback, Mavash. I appreciate you taking the time! 

Matty, I would tend to agree with you, although if she got very good treatment for three years, she may have learned to manage it to some degree. I guess you'll have to decide if the risk is worth the benefit! 

Of course, with your divorce still pending, it's also a bit early to be too worried about finding something long-term! I would encourage you to have fun, but give yourself some time to recover, too.


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## Mavash. (Jan 26, 2012)

Eh I changed my mind and deleted my post. A BPD woman is a risk and I know I'm the exception not the norm. Most never get to where I'm at I know that.

After 2-3 years of therapy the only time I had 'storms' was when I was under extreme stress. Moving, traveling with kids, husband out of town (fear of abandonment), overbooking, etc. Day to day stuff I was fine with.


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## Uptown (Mar 27, 2010)

mattyjman said:


> She seems to control it fine when we're together.


Matty, her ability to _"control it fine"_ now doesn't mean much. The vast majority of BPDers (i.e., those with strong traits) do fine during the courtship period, which typically lasts 3 to 6 months. A BPDer's infatuation over you during that period holds her two great fears (abandonment and engulfment) at bay. This is why, as long as the infatuation holds up, a BPDer can be so loving, passionate, and caring on a consistent basis.

As soon as the infatuation evaporates, however, her two fears will return. This means that her anger will be released every time you trigger one fear or the other. Moreover, you will be unable to avoid triggering them. The reason is that the two fears lie at the opposite ends of the very same spectrum. Hence, as you back away from her to avoid triggering her engulfment fear, you will necessarily draw closer to triggering her abandonment fear. 

Importantly, there is no midpoint position where you are "not too far" and "not too close." That Goldilocks position simply does not exist. I know because I foolishly spent 15 years hunting for it with my exW. If you are interested, I explain this process in greater detail at the link provided below.


> I haven't pissed her off yet by being a dumbass... but rest assured, i will at some point.


If she is a BPDer, you will piss her off by simply being in the same room -- being a "dumbass" is not necessary at all. BPDers are filled with so much self loathing and shame that, when they make a mistake, it would be far too painful for them to be willing to recognize it at the conscious level. Their subconscious therefore shelters them from most of that pain by projecting the mistake -- and any guilty thoughts they have about it -- onto their partners. 

Because the projection occurs entirely at the subconscious level (as a primitive ego defense), a BPDer like your GF would be totally unaware of it at the conscious level. She therefore will believe that the bad thoughts and mistakes are originating from YOU. The result is that, with all that projection going on, it likely won't matter much whether you actually behave like a dumbass. Either way, you are going to blamed for every mistake and misfortune that befalls her.


> I wonder what the storm would look like.


Well, if you don't want to wait a few more months to find out, I suggest you read my post describing the storm in Maybe's threat at http://talkaboutmarriage.com/general-relationship-discussion/33734-my-list-hell.html#post473522. Like Kathy's excellent article about BPD, my post describes what it is like to live with a BPDer. I caution, however, that my post describes the behaviors of an untreated BPDer. Given that your GF has had 2 or 3 years of weekly treatments, she may be much more skilled at managing her BPD traits. Take care, Matty.


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## mattyjman (Jun 6, 2012)

Thanks for all your feedback everyone. I was hoping I could look past this, both because I like her, and maybe for some moral/ethical reason - I don't want to decide against her based on one of life's challenges... I'm not sure if that makes sense or not... but I'm thinking I'm going to take the low road on this one. I don't want to put myself in an intentionally explosive situation. 

Thanks!


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## Mavash. (Jan 26, 2012)

The more I thought about this thread I wondered why oh why would she even tell you this? If I were dating and it was serious I'd be upfront about my ptsd but BPD? Oh hell no. Too much stigma attached to it and I know I'd be judged just like this woman is right now.

Oh before you think I'd be lying or withholding the truth I wouldn't be because technically I haven't been officially diagnosed with BPD. My official diagnosis is PTSD with anxiety. That's what she put on the form for insurance purposes anyway.


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## KathyBatesel (Apr 26, 2012)

^ Ditto.


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## mattyjman (Jun 6, 2012)

Mavash. said:


> The more I thought about this thread I wondered why oh why would she even tell you this? If I were dating and it was serious I'd be upfront about my ptsd but BPD? Oh hell no. Too much stigma attached to it and I know I'd be judged just like this woman is right now.
> 
> Oh before you think I'd be lying or withholding the truth I wouldn't be because technically I haven't been officially diagnosed with BPD. My official diagnosis is PTSD with anxiety. That's what she put on the form for insurance purposes anyway.


I'm not sure either, but glad she did.


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## pidge70 (Jan 17, 2011)

As a BPD'er myself....diagnosed. I think she did the right thing by telling you.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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