# Mixed messages



## justman (Jul 1, 2017)

Hello everyone
Have been reading this forum for awhile now and decided to post my story and get some valuable advises here.
Have been married for 12 years and together for 14 years. I am 36 and she is 34. We have a 5 yo kid too.
Wife dropped a bomb in October 2016. Have been told I am nice guy but she doesn't love me anymore and she hasn't been happy for a while now. She doesn't have any feelings for me. She also said can't live with me without any feelings. One day she was saying its me that ruined the marriage. Next day its not me it was her because she has changed. She said she needs time on her own to figure out what she wants and that I should leave the house. I said I am not leaving and if she wants some space she should look for a place not me. She rented her own place and moved out in February 2017.
At the same time while she was still living with me I noticed that shes been on the phone a lot, texting and calling her co-worker. First thing in the morning she would check her messages and text him while we were having breakfast and at night too why I was putting kid to bed. I got somewhat suspicious but didnt want to believe that she was having an affair. On a day she moved out I asked her if she has something for OM but she replied saying it was a stupid question. Everyone she talked to, including her parents, she refereed to him as a friend. This "friend" would help her move and set up her new place things like cable etc. 3 months after she moved out, sometime in April, I asked her whether she had a chance to think about what happened and if she is ready to talk about us. She replied it wouldn't be fair to me and she said no. I asked her if she had feelings for OM and she said she has sympathy for him. She also admitted to her mom that there was something between them, that she felt a spark. Then we sat down and talked for about 20 minutes as I tried to picture her what her life with him will be like from now on. A couple of words about her co-worker. He is divorced with 2 children. Right around the time she moved out this OM (or Affair Partner) quit his job and he has been out of job since. Basically I told her that her life will be full-time caring about his kids. If this is kind of life you want the sure go ahead. I also told her that I will move on and take care of my own life too then. I could see that she was a bit shocked because I think she was expecting me to beg and whine like I did in the beginning which I should not have done. I also asked her if she was happy and she mumbled something in return and said as long as kid is happy she is happy too. After that conversation I did complete 180. Fast forward to the end of April/beginning of May and I am getting some mixed messages from her. After complete silence on my part here is whats been going on.
- One night when kid was with me and I was putting him to bed she called me and after brief conversation said I kiss you both good night.
- Same week on a weekend I told her I am going to the park with the kid and she said if thats ok if she comes with us. I said yes
- Couple of days when she was picking up the kid I could tell that she was crying a lot
- Last week I went to the park with the kid and she was there walking by herself. While I was playing with the kid she sat down and cried, I could see tears in her eyes.
- She doesnt have too many friends of her own and all of our common friends turned against her and noone invites her to any birthday parties etc. She spends most of the nights/weekends alone
- Her car needed some maintenance like brakes and new tires so she called AP and he said he doesn't know anything about that. Then she called me and asked for my advice
- In the past couple of weeks she called me for absolutely no reason and talked about anything. 2 days ago she called and we talked for about 20 mins about evertyhing really
- When she is picking up the kid she always wants to start the conversation I can see that. I just say bye and turn around but she seems like she wants to talk for some more

As of today her affair partner hasn't moved in with her yet, its been 5 months now. I also heard from someone that he told her that she has to go back to her husband, that he is a loser who is out of job. I don't know how that conversation ended though.

However, they booked vacation together couple of months ago and they left with all 3 kids, 2 of his own and our kid, yesterday. As I am writing this they are on vacation together.

Now the questions I keep asking myself
- Is he really an affair partner or just really good friend. If he is an AP then why he hasn't moved in with her yet. I believe she was expecting him to move in with her right away had I moved out of our house or her rental place.
- Why is she always friendly and talkative when she meets me
- Why she is calling me every now and then even if she said its all over and she is in love with other person
- Could it be that their vacation together will decide whether or not they will be together or not. I am sure in last 5 months they also had plenty of opportunity to discuss this.
- Should I continue my 180 or should I start trying to reconnect with her by asking her to go with us to the park together etc.
- Should I ask her to reconcile one more time or she should be the one to initiate that
- Knowing that she is on vacation with other man right now hurts a lot and makes me want to call her and tell her everything she deserves, while my other part still wants to reconcile with her.

As for me, I have been complete train wreck in the beginning. After sometime I resumed working out, jogging and playing soccer. Trying to eat healthy too. However every once in awhile I feel like I am losing it. Its really been an emotional roller coaster.

I would really appreciate some advises from people who have completed that journey. 

Thank you.


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## Stang197 (Aug 31, 2015)

No contact and file for divorce. That's about all you can do. Oh and expose her affair to her family and yours.


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## honcho (Oct 5, 2013)

She is stringing you along as plan B. She can probably see the relationship with the new guy isn't going to work and she doesn't want to lose her fallback position.


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

She told you ILYBANILWY. Short for, "I love you but am not in love with you". She is/was not lying.

She had already cheated with the other man, the co-worker. You can bet they slept together many times prior to D Day. No women is going to leave a long term marriage having a child and husband for a man she does not know intimately. She is a grown women. She planned this down to a tee. 

Think about it, she slept with another man and then told you to move out. Boy, that is cutthroat. No love there.

The OM only wanted her for sex. That is why he quit his job, just prior to her moving out of your house. He did not have the guts to tell her that he only wants her body......for a few hours a week. Not full time.

By quitting his job he made himself unfit for marriage. He is a coward. 

It is also possible something happened at work; word got out that he caused the breakup of your marriage. They told him to resign...or be terminated.

She sounds like she is coming out of the affair fog. She realizes she messed up badly.

Now, she likely wants to come back to you. You were Plan B. You are still Plan B. Coworker affair partner was Plan A...... I suspect, not for long. She is not going to want to support his lazy ass and kids for long.

Do not reconcile with her. Do not let her move back in with you.

File for divorce, get a divorce. If she still wants to get back with you, let her compete with other women....women who do not cheat.

Do not believe a word she says about her arrangement with OM. Either before she moved out or afterwards.


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## Vinnydee (Jan 4, 2016)

Wow. When they want a separation it usually means that they have a new boyfriend and want to spend a lot of time with him. However, she wants to first know it will work out before she divorces you. You are her safety net in case things go wrong. She can always come back to you and start looking for the next Mr. Right. A psychologist friend of mine who specialized in marital problems, despite his own divorce and feeling most couples he saw ended up divorced in a few years anyway, told me that once a woman tells you that they do not love you, get out. There is no changing minds or not really meaning it. Love cannot be willed into or out of existence. Just try to do it. It has to happen organically. She has you right where she wants you, as her safety net and what sounds like a handy friend without benefits. 

Personally I would never let a woman use me like that and no matter if I still loved her or not, let her suffer the consequences of her own actions rather than use me as her safety net.


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## Satya (Jun 22, 2012)

This is not complicated. You are making it complicated.

1. Of course he is her affair partner. They are adults, not 8 year-olds. You don't spend all that time together unless there's something there, whether emotional or physical but I'd highly suspect it's gone physical. She's crossed a VERY serious boundary by including your child in their life. 

2. She is nice to you because she wants you to remain plan B. She is uncertain of everything and she's not yet out of the fog enough to know what she wants. 

You are not doing the 180 at all by talking to her all the time. You are just building the foundation by which she can come back to you without fear of rejection. 

Sorry, but she's not sending mixed messages. You are being played.


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## Herschel (Mar 27, 2016)

Cmon man, don't let this guilt blind you. She did this. She chose this path. She didn't think twice about the affect on you. They are in vacation together!!!!

Get your head together. Stop talking to her. It damages you. Every time you talk about something personal, it rewinds you a set amount. You then have to spend that time more to get through this. Way down the road, you can be cordial. You can have chit chat. Years from now. You have to just rip the band aid off. Even if she wanted to get back with you, is that what you want? To be second best until a better option comes along?


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## Warrior73 (Jun 25, 2017)

Keep up the 180...I think she wants to have her cake and eat it too and is learning that the grass is not greener on the other side.


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## hylton7 (Jan 24, 2017)

expose and divorce.


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## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

justman said:


> Hello everyone
> Have been reading this forum for awhile now and decided to post my story and get some valuable advises here.
> Have been married for 12 years and together for 14 years. I am 36 and she is 34. We have a 5 yo kid too.
> Wife dropped a bomb in October 2016. Have been told I am nice guy but she doesn't love me anymore and she hasn't been happy for a while now. She doesn't have any feelings for me. She also said can't live with me without any feelings. One day she was saying its me that ruined the marriage. Next day its not me it was her because she has changed. She said she needs time on her own to figure out what she wants and that I should leave the house. I said I am not leaving and if she wants some space she should look for a place not me. She rented her own place and moved out in February 2017.
> ...



She wants you to be her plan B. Once someone does this there is no guarantee that she will not do this to you again. File for divorce..

She has probably found out that the OM is not as committed as before, he is divorced, probably wanted to use her for a bit of fun but now doesn't want to commit so she is trying to hang on to you - this is the wrong reason for staying and not divorcing.
Of course there will be moments when you feel the emotion, the nostalgia, etc but those are wrong reasons for staying too. Continue to do what you are doing, keeping fit etc. Do not date till you are divorced. 
Try to have as little contact with her as possible, communicate about your child only, no phone calls, request she contact you via email only. You need to create that distance, keep at the 180. You need to move on.


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## Malaise (Aug 8, 2012)

Satya said:


> This is not complicated. You are making it complicated.
> 
> 1. Of course he is her affair partner. They are adults, not 8 year-olds. You don't spend all that time together unless there's something there, whether emotional or physical but I'd highly suspect it's gone physical. She's crossed a VERY serious boundary by including your child in their life.
> 
> ...


OP, this is all you need to know. Ignore @Satya at you peril.

Seriously, she' right. Don't be a chump.


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## justman (Jul 1, 2017)

Thanks a lot guys. Really appreciate your time.



SunCMars said:


> It is also possible something happened at work; word got out that he caused the breakup of your marriage. They told him to resign...or be terminated.


As far as I know he's been working in the warehouse doing lot of physical labor and that's how he messed up his back and he may have quit because he wasn't able to do that anymore. However them being exposed being the reason why he quit was the 1st thing that came on my mind. I asked her that and she said there were other reasons, yeah right.

I did expose them to everyone I know. May be I should expose them at her work too unless they already know.

Thanks again.


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## Emerging Buddhist (Apr 7, 2016)

I would not expose at work... she needs to stay working especially if you file for divorce.


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## ReturntoZero (Aug 31, 2015)

Now, we know all about her.

What about you?


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## justman (Jul 1, 2017)

ReturntoZero said:


> Now, we know all about her.
> 
> What about you?


What exactly do you want to know?


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## ReturntoZero (Aug 31, 2015)

justman said:


> What exactly do you want to know?


What are you doing for you?

Working out?

Therapy?

Anything?


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## Herschel (Mar 27, 2016)

hylton7 said:


> expose and divorce.


I read his as expose and dispose. It wasn't, but I like that now.


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

She sure talks a lot.

What do her actions tell you?


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## Mizzbak (Sep 10, 2016)

justman

I am very sorry that you are in this situation. 
Well done on your commitment to the 180 and in holding to it. Especially given that your wife is sending you such mixed messages. 

As much as it may be about demonstrating things to your spouse, the 180 is about you realising something for yourself. Which is that, whilst you may still have feelings for your wife, you don't actually NEED her to be happy. That you are able to be a very happy, contented and fulfilled human being without her by your side. Perhaps even more so than you were before. If the 180 is working well, perhaps some of the confusion that you are feeling could be coming from you? Maybe at some level you have conditioned yourself to think of the current situation as temporary. That once your wife sorts out whatever is going on in her cheating heart and is ready to be a grown-up again, you are supposed take her back. Could some of the conflict you feel be because you are busy realising that you don't need her, and that you might not actually even want her? Even if she wanted to come back. 

That aside - I agree with farsidejunky: look at what she is actually doing. Not what she is saying. Going on a holiday, 5 months into a separation, with your AP, with all your children? This is not pro-reconciliation with your husband. Even it was already booked, she could have said no. Your wife may be beginning to feel some regret and a sense that she made the wrong choice, but is that really enough for you?


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

*Lose her like the scourge she is!

So things over in "Shangri-la" are obviously not going as well as they once were, and she's now reverting to your presence as her "Plan B!"

I would say that you're far better suited in moving straight ahead to "Plan D" ~ Divorce!*


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

The thing that bound you to her were these:

Her soul.
Her heart.
Her skinny hard body. That body that 'so' satisfied your primitive urges.
Her laugh.
Her support.
Her's and your child that you brought into this world....together.
Her gratitude for your effort and work in the marriage. All those years that 'each' gave 'each' other.
Her hard work in joining a new culture, learning a new language, and your' large part in that effort. She worked side by side with you in your effort to make her successful.
Her loyalty. 

What is left of these bullet points now? How many bind you to her now?

NONE. Not one. She gave them away to a Neer-to-Well. Someone who put in NO effort all those years. And HE gets the prize. WTF!

She took all those sacred 'ties' and pitched them in the trash can.

For a nobody.....a nobody who is unemployed.

For the life of me, I cannot fathom THIS. Either there is MORE to the story or she flipped her lid. Flipped her lid, her common sense spilled out into the gutter...where she copulated with a FOOL of a man.

The WINNER in all of this? POSOM. He put in a Poisha, a Luma and bought himself a 1913 Liberty Head Nickel....He has a fortune in his arms [relative to his investiture].
Or so he thinks....she is a counterfeit plug nickel. Really good looking, has all the correct markings in all the right places.
But her mint mark is off....off kilter. She was made in rural Vietnam...not in Japan.

I spent a year in Vietnam. I met women like her.

My apologies to the many of the great Asian women in the world. She is not a good example.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

justman said:


> - Should I continue my 180 or should I start trying to reconnect with her by asking her to go with us to the park together etc.


You mean kiss her ass and beg her to choose you?

Yeah, no. 

Divorce her. IF she ever gets her head out of her butt and realizes the massive mistake she has made, she can try to make it up to you through at least a year of meeting your terms. If you accept her back with anything less than that, she'll be cheating on you again in another few years.


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## justman (Jul 1, 2017)

ReturntoZero said:


> What are you doing for you?
> 
> Working out?
> 
> ...


Therapy - only had 2 sessions and thought it was waste of time.
Working out 3-4 times a week, jogging and soccer 1-2 times a week. Pool with kid 2 times a week.


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## justman (Jul 1, 2017)

SunCMars said:


> Her hard work in joining a new culture, learning a new language, and your' large part in that effort. She worked side by side with you in your effort to make her successful.
> 
> What is left of these bullet points now? How many bind you to her now?
> 
> ...


That is true. So much time and effort invested into our future...


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## justman (Jul 1, 2017)

Mizzbak said:


> justman
> 
> I am very sorry that you are in this situation.
> Well done on your commitment to the 180 and in holding to it. Especially given that your wife is sending you such mixed messages.
> ...


That's what may be going on with me without even me realizing it...


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## justman (Jul 1, 2017)

As for 180 and her trying to chit chat with me every now and then - next time I will just say not interested, bye.


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

justman said:


> Therapy - only had 2 sessions and thought it was waste of time.
> Working out 3-4 times a week, jogging and soccer 1-2 times a week. Pool with kid 2 times a week.


Yeah, therapy.

Waste of time for the brave of heart, those with steel for a spine.

Problems? Just deal with them. Play the cards dealt.

Now, if you misspell therapy into thera-pie.

Give me Cherry today and Apple tomorrow.

That would see me through the Spitz Storm and the lacka-nooky to come. Uh, not cum. Sorry, I forgot.

I like your workout schedule. Uh, huh!


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## ReturntoZero (Aug 31, 2015)

justman said:


> As for 180 and her trying to chit chat with me every now and then - next time I will just say not interested, bye.


Bad way to go.

Tell her you've got something else to attend to and quickly hang up.

Even if it's not true.

Practice being mysterious.


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## justman (Jul 1, 2017)

ReturntoZero said:


> Bad way to go.
> 
> Tell her you've got something else to attend to and quickly hang up.
> 
> ...


Will do just that, than you


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## Marc878 (Aug 26, 2015)

justman said:


> Hello everyone
> Have been reading this forum for awhile now and decided to post my story and get some valuable advises here.
> Have been married for 12 years and together for 14 years. I am 36 and she is 34. We have a 5 yo kid too.
> Wife dropped a bomb in October 2016. Have been told I am nice guy but she doesn't love me anymore and she hasn't been happy for a while now. She doesn't have any feelings for me. She also said can't live with me without any feelings. One day she was saying its me that ruined the marriage. Next day its not me it was her because she has changed. She said she needs time on her own to figure out what she wants and that I should leave the house. I said I am not leaving and if she wants some space she should look for a place not me. She rented her own place and moved out in February 2017.
> ...


You're a typical Mr Nice Guy letting yourself be disrespectful and walked on.

Read up 
https://7chan.org/lit/src/Robert_Glover_-_No_More_Mr_Nice_Guy.pdf

You are playing her game. Waiting like a puppy to be petted. File for divorce and get some self respect back if you're smart


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## Marc878 (Aug 26, 2015)

In order to save a marriage if that's what you seek you'd better be willing to end it. All you've done is let her call the shots. Weakness is very unnattractive. How do you think she views your passivity and lack of any actions while the other man has taken your place in the marital bed?

Do not make meaningless threats that'll just put you in worse shape.

We're just friends is the biggest lie told. You look very foolish for wanting to believe this.

Get strong and stay there it's you're only way out of this no matter what happens.

There are way better women out there who don't do this. You have value use it.


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## justman (Jul 1, 2017)

Marc878 said:


> She's deep in an affair if you go online and check your phone records you'll know how long. She's separating to make herself available for her other man


Calls and messages started in May 2016. Why they aren't moved in together yet ?


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## Marc878 (Aug 26, 2015)

justman said:


> Calls and messages started in May 2016. Why they aren't moved in together yet ?


Hard to say but it could be that she thinks you can still be played and believe her lies.

It's worked in the past. You're still in limbo doing nothing aren't you?


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

justman said:


> Calls and messages started in May 2016. Why they aren't moved in together yet ?


Because he's playing her just like she's playing you.


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

GusPolinski said:


> Because he's playing her just like she's playing you.


QFT.

Then when it does not work out with him, she will start fishing you for reconciliation.


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## justman (Jul 1, 2017)

I will enforce 180 more - absolutely NC this time. Will see how it goes this time. I've heard from her family members that she was complaining that they don't have enough money to cover all expenses should they all move in together. However I am not buying that - its been more then a year since the affair started. I wonder if they both don't really want it - none of them want to commit and enjoying their freedom and independence living separately for now.


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## Marc878 (Aug 26, 2015)

No contact is good for you if you can apply but you'll just spend more time in limbo.

It's been a year now. How much more time are going to spend on this?

You're young now but that doesn't last forever.


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## justman (Jul 1, 2017)

Marc878 said:


> No contact is good for you if you can apply but you'll just spend more time in limbo.
> 
> It's been a year now. How much more time are going to spend on this?
> 
> You're young now but that doesn't last forever.


Honestly I am not ready to start dating at the moment....This will probably change when I meet someone special. But for now I am not there yet...


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## ReturntoZero (Aug 31, 2015)

justman said:


> Honestly I am not ready to start dating at the moment....This will probably change when I meet someone special. But for now I am not there yet...


Then don't.

Busy yourself with other things - and improve yourself.

We come in alone - we go out alone. How "happy" we are depends almost exclusively on us.


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## Marc878 (Aug 26, 2015)

justman said:


> Honestly I am not ready to start dating at the moment....This will probably change when I meet someone special. But for now I am not there yet...


As long as you live in this limbo you're going to feel bad. 

Your wife is a lying cheater. She's told you and shown you who she is but you refuse to believe it. Make no mistake that is who she is.

You are letting her have total control over you and your life.

You not standing up and taking charge of your life is a bigger problem than having a cheating wife.

Your weakness and passive Mr Nice Guy may very well be why your are where you are at this time.

Everyone is seeing the same thing but you.

*WAKE UP* File for divorce without warning!!!!


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## Marc878 (Aug 26, 2015)

Read your posts and pretend it's your brother or a close friend. What would you think? Advise them?

You are acting as weak as a kitten.


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## Broken_in_Brooklyn (Feb 21, 2013)

justman said:


> Calls and messages started in May 2016. Why they aren't moved in together yet ?


The betrayed spouse is usually the last to know. Now you know how long it is going on. The question is not why she has not moved out. Why should she? She gets to string you along like a chump. The real question is what are you going to do about it. File tomorrow. get her out of your life as your wife. Nurse you wounds then you are ready meet someone loyal who you deserve. You deserve better than this.


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## Broken_in_Brooklyn (Feb 21, 2013)

justman said:


> I will enforce 180 more - absolutely NC this time. Will see how it goes this time. I've heard from her family members that she was complaining that they don't have enough money to cover all expenses should they all move in together. However I am not buying that - its been more then a year since the affair started. I wonder if they both don't really want it - none of them want to commit and enjoying their freedom and independence living separately for now.


Separate your finances now. File file file . Let he POS lover support her. Cover your ass now!


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