# Do I want the details???



## canttrustu (Feb 22, 2012)

So last night I learned that the EA my husband had that I thought was a few months at best lasted well over a year! Holy God. Does it ever end? Today I am deciding rather or not I want the details. The real details. Not just when or how long or why but what they said to each other, What is special about her etc..... I want to know but I can never un hear it. What to do?


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## ilovechocolate (Jan 16, 2012)

I pushed for details , did he ever buy the condoms, when did they meet , what positons, was there oral involved? At the time I needed to know but when we did start having sex again all I could think of was them, as a result I banned certain positions as I could nt face it and now even climbing over him to get out of bed in the mornings is a trigger cos I know she loved going on top - so maybe ask for a few details - take time to absorb them then go back for more info if you need to?


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## Thorburn (Nov 23, 2011)

ilovechocolate said:


> I pushed for details , did he ever buy the condoms, when did they meet , what positons, was there oral involved? At the time I needed to know but when we did start having sex again all I could think of was them, as a result I banned certain positions as I could nt face it and now even climbing over him to get out of bed in the mornings is a trigger cos I know she loved going on top - so maybe ask for a few details - take time to absorb them then go back for more info if you need to?


Forget what she liked. Get on top and reclaim the territory. My WS told me she got on top once with the OM (yea right). At the beginning of R when ever she did this I had to tell her to stop. For some reason this was something new, in that my WS wanted to do this right away (get on top). Maybe TMI, but in the past it was something we did along the way, but now it has started out as her primary first move. Still makes me question it and starts some mind movies but I am trying to get over it. 

Don't know if this helps you but I do not want to live the rest of my life making my decisions on what they did or did not do. I am dealing with enough stuff that I am avoiding due to they did this or that and I had to suck up some things. They had sex in my car. I wanted to burn it. But I got over it by calling it the **** mobile and I will get rid of it sometime this year. Heck the dude made my wife moan so what do I do there?

It sucks but try to work through it the best you can.


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## Pit-of-my-stomach (Nov 2, 2010)

Is a PA a deal breaker in your mind?


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## Ingalls (Mar 7, 2012)

Canttrustu this is one of my Q's on the list I have for my MC this Monday! (he/she will die when I walk in with a list-ha) I want "think" I want to know because it may help to make me really KNOW if he is done or not. 

Kissing is what my H was caught doing and I recall me so freaking angry because we used to always kiss-lots-then the last few years we just stopped. I did, however, say over and over I missed kissing and wanted to kiss and his excuse was that he dips (I didn't realize he was checked out already). BUT now when we kiss I give in BC I refuse to let the OW win...


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## canttrustu (Feb 22, 2012)

Pit-of-my-stomach said:


> Is a PA a deal breaker in your mind?


yes.


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## ilovechocolate (Jan 16, 2012)

Forget what she liked. Get on top and reclaim the territory. My WS told me she got on top once with the OM (yea right). At the beginning of R when ever she did this I had to tell her to stop. For some reason this was something new, in that my WS wanted to do this right away (get on top). Maybe TMI, but in the past it was something we did along the way, but now it has started out as her primary first move. Still makes me question it and starts some mind movies but I am trying to get over it. 




Thanks for that - you re right ! Why shouls I let that b!tch control my sex life . I think some times you re so close to the situation you can t see outside the box! So glad I found this site


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## canttrustu (Feb 22, 2012)

Thorburn said:


> Forget what she liked. Get on top and reclaim the territory. My WS told me she got on top once with the OM (yea right). At the beginning of R when ever she did this I had to tell her to stop. For some reason this was something new, in that my WS wanted to do this right away (get on top). Maybe TMI, but in the past it was something we did along the way, but now it has started out as her primary first move. Still makes me question it and starts some mind movies but I am trying to get over it.
> 
> Don't know if this helps you but I do not want to live the rest of my life making my decisions on what they did or did not do. I am dealing with enough stuff that I am avoiding due to they did this or that and I had to suck up some things. They had sex in my car. I wanted to burn it. But I got over it by calling it the **** mobile and I will get rid of it sometime this year. Heck the dude made my wife moan so what do I do there?
> 
> It sucks but try to work through it the best you can.


Thorn! Did she tell you that he made her moan????OMG!!


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## Pit-of-my-stomach (Nov 2, 2010)

canttrustu said:


> yes.


this year long affair was with a co-worker, or someone he had direct access to on a daily basis?

Don't know how long or how many drips of trickle truth it will take... But, it happened. 2 adults with daily access to one another having an emotional affair for over a year but not going physical?... No, Sorry. 

It would take an incredible amount of convincing for me to even consider the possiblity it didnt happen. Honestly. I just can't fathom enough evidence existing to convince me of that. No chance in my mind, zero. zip.

I'm really sorry.


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## cabin fever (Feb 9, 2012)

Thorburn said:


> Heck the dude made my wife moan so what do I do there?


UMMMMMM you make her moan louder! :smthumbup:

When were together, I make sure she is REALLY REALLY satisfied! I figure (at least in my mind) that I'll be dammed if someone else is gonna get the pleasure of being the best!.


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## canttrustu (Feb 22, 2012)

Pit-of-my-stomach said:


> this year long affair was with a co-worker, or someone he had direct access to on a daily basis?
> 
> Don't know how long or how many drips of trickle truth it will take... But, it happened. 2 adults with daily access to one another having an emotional affair for over a year but not going physical?... No, Sorry.
> 
> ...


I know where youre comin from pit. I wouldnt either but I do know someone they work with and she pretty much verifies my husbands story. Believe me when I say my head is not up my a$$ and my eyes are wide open here. I have eyes on him at work and if he leaves that building w/her I will know.


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## Thorburn (Nov 23, 2011)

canttrustu said:


> Thorn! Did she tell you that he made her moan????OMG!!


She did not have to tell me. She did tell me that he said she had a nice wet pus** and she said to him fuc* me oh please fuc* me and it turned her on. maybe TMI but if my wife said that to me I wouldn't last 10 seconds.

On December the 13th I told her to tell me everything or I was leaving her. I got most of her story that night and ended up in the E.R. because I drank a bottle or more of bourbon. I remember having two bottles and one was empty and the other one was hit pretty good. I can't remember the last time I was that drunk but I remember everything she said. I remember in the E. R. I could not even speak I was in such pain, curled up in a ball and my WS had to do all the talking as I was passing out. Funny how they treat a drunk. You feel like you are dying and they are not in a hurry because they know you are not dying, they deal with it all the time.

Yea, I wanted the details.


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## canttrustu (Feb 22, 2012)

Thor I am sooo sorry you had to hear that crap. I couldnt handle it. Not that much detail. I dont want that much. IF he had sex with her( he says no, I think I believe him) I would throw up hearing that stuff about him with her. Just knowing he shared his personal thoughts is killin' me.


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## canttrustu (Feb 22, 2012)

Pit-of-my-stomach said:


> this year long affair was with a co-worker, or someone he had direct access to on a daily basis?
> 
> Don't know how long or how many drips of trickle truth it will take... But, it happened. 2 adults with daily access to one another having an emotional affair for over a year but not going physical?... No, Sorry.
> 
> ...


BTW, thanks for being gentle. lol


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## Ingalls (Mar 7, 2012)

when I say "details" I want to know if they had sex! Not the details of the sex itself...I too would be in the hospital after bottles of liquor.

I don't have time for TT nor do I want to be blind-sided again.


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## Pit-of-my-stomach (Nov 2, 2010)

canttrustu said:


> BTW, thanks for being gentle. lol


Please take my replies in the right context. I do care, a great deal.

I see being gentle is cruel. I bet your husband rationalizes his trickle truth as being gentle with your feelings. 

If your anything like me, the truth is something you can deal with. you've probably had enough lies and deceit in your world to last a lifetime.

I only want to help.


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## canttrustu (Feb 22, 2012)

Pit-of-my-stomach said:


> Please take my replies in the right context. I do care, a great deal.
> 
> I see being gentle is cruel. I bet your husband rationalizes his trickle truth as being gentle with your feelings.
> 
> ...


I appreciate your candor. And you are right I have had enough lies and deceit for a lifetime. I have lost people to death and its nowhere near as painful as this has been.


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## dmdream (Feb 14, 2012)

I have no idea how you people are dealing with infidelities, you must love a person very much to forgive such a things and be ready for a next one. I don't think it is a one time deal, if they did it, they will so again. My friend is cheating on his "dream marriage" girl, disappointing at first, but long-distance relationship could be a somewhat excuse.


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## mestalla guy (Mar 20, 2012)

some very strong people on this site that can forgive some of the stuff that has been done to them, there would no going back for me


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## Beowulf (Dec 7, 2011)

Thorburn said:


> Forget what she liked. Get on top and reclaim the territory. My WS told me she got on top once with the OM (yea right). At the beginning of R when ever she did this I had to tell her to stop. For some reason this was something new, in that my WS wanted to do this right away (get on top). Maybe TMI, but in the past it was something we did along the way, but now it has started out as her primary first move. Still makes me question it and starts some mind movies but I am trying to get over it.
> 
> Don't know if this helps you but I do not want to live the rest of my life making my decisions on what they did or did not do. I am dealing with enough stuff that I am avoiding due to they did this or that and I had to suck up some things. They had sex in my car. I wanted to burn it. But I got over it by calling it the **** mobile and I will get rid of it sometime this year. Heck the dude made my wife moan so what do I do there?
> 
> It sucks but try to work through it the best you can.


I did the same thing. The only way I could deal with the mind movies and whatnot was to know it all and steamroll over them. Whatever they did we did together and I made sure it was over the top (no pun intended).


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## Beowulf (Dec 7, 2011)

canttrustu said:


> I appreciate your candor. And you are right I have had enough lies and deceit for a lifetime. I have lost people to death and its nowhere near as painful as this has been.


You're right. I remember on D-Day thinking I wish I could die.


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## canttrustu (Feb 22, 2012)

Beowulf said:


> You're right. I remember on D-Day thinking I wish I could die.


yep, Had that wish just this morning.Took me til 4:30 am to get to sleep alarm went off at 6:30. Sleep is the only peace there is. The minute I opened my eyes it hit me like a freight train. My first thought this morning was "please just shoot me"


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## brokenbloke (Feb 21, 2012)

canttrustu said:


> yep, Had that wish just this morning.Took me til 4:30 am to get to sleep alarm went off at 6:30. Sleep is the only peace there is. The minute I opened my eyes it hit me like a freight train. My first thought this morning was "please just shoot me"


The last two nights I dreamt about their A. One was more explicit in nature. Brutal feeling...


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## Affaircare (Jan 11, 2010)

Beowulf said:


> You're right. I remember on D-Day thinking I wish I could die.


Same here. The first day I only lived 15 minutes at a time so the kids didn't have to come home to a dead mom....so I'd delay 15 minutes and say I'd think about it again in 15 more minutes...then 15 more. The first three days I stayed up 24 hours a day and cried. By day three, my eyes were swollen shut and my face looked like I was stung by a bee and very allergic. 

NOT my finest hours. 

****
Canttrustu~

I want to ask you something in all honesty. How would knowing or not knowing any details change anything? If you are aware now that he was unfaithful to you, and you are aware now that he has NO INTENTION of ending his affair, and you are aware now that he has lied to you about the length of the affair and the ...intensity shall we say--how would you or your life change if you knew details? 

Would knowing details save your marriage? Or make him want to come back to the marriage? 

Would knowing details make you feel better? Or make you feel smarter, funnier, or more desirable?

Considering he has lied to you over and over and over again for a year or more, if you did ask him, is it likely that he would now revert to the honest man he once was and tell you the truth? OR would he likely lie some more and put you through more torture...as he has already done?

Would you divorce him if it was oral sex but not if it was masturbation? Or would you divorce him if they kissed but not if they held hands?

Is the infidelity less unfaithful if his genitalia didn't touch her genitalia? Or is adultery ... adultery?

The reason I ask these questions is not to decide for you if you should or should not get details. Everyone is different--some need lots of details...some need some details but not all... and some need very few details. But the fact remains that he has committed adultery, intends to continue to commit adultery, and also very clearly does not intend to bring you any kind of relief by telling you everything that has happened. I would personally suggest that rather than torturing yourself, that you look at these facts and decide to act accordingly. Then if he ever DOES decide to stop committing adultery and offer you relief by telling you the whole truth--he can do the heavy lifting and repair the damage he's done.


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## ilovechocolate (Jan 16, 2012)

"Forget what she liked. Get on top and reclaim the territory."


All done!


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## canttrustu (Feb 22, 2012)

Affaircare said:


> Same here. The first day I only lived 15 minutes at a time so the kids didn't have to come home to a dead mom....so I'd delay 15 minutes and say I'd think about it again in 15 more minutes...then 15 more. The first three days I stayed up 24 hours a day and cried. By day three, my eyes were swollen shut and my face looked like I was stung by a bee and very allergic.
> 
> NOT my finest hours.
> 
> ...


AC, Thanks for your input. I think you have a few facts wrong though. To my knowledge(I have spyware on his phone, he has given full access to his email accts, gps and VAR in the car) he is no longer involved with her. Yes he does still have to work with her but he has recently taken an emergency leave and been granted permission to work from home from this boss(not the OW but her boss) for at least the next 4 weeks. He is in IC as of Monday and came clean with our adult children. Now with that said, he still has alot of work to do and I mean alot. But I do not believe anything is happening between them now(I have that pretty much verified thru a third party as well). 

Yes I do think he is downplaying the intensity of it. I am hoping he will learn in IC how to get his head around it and move forward. I have access to the emails between the two of them, I have read them. They are ridiculously flirtatious. No doubt over the line. Nothing that to me is acceptable from my husband to OW. There was no discussion of PA(in email anyway). He does NOT get the full blow of this for sure. But I do think he is only holding back b/c he fears telling me hurtful things. When I do confront him on an issue or have pointed questions he does answer(and it is sometimes not what I wanna hear) but he does it. 

I am not in anyway saying he is in the clear here. Couldnt be further from true. But I dont see any evidence of continued involvement(and I am looking).

Also he is looking really hard for a new job. One in the pipeline. Hoping to hear next week or the week after. So withANY luck he wont have to go back and sit next to her and I wont lose my mind more than I already have.


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## canttrustu (Feb 22, 2012)

canttrustu said:


> I know where youre comin from pit. I wouldnt either but I do know someone they work with and she pretty much verifies my husbands story. Believe me when I say my head is not up my a$$ and my eyes are wide open here. I have eyes on him at work and if he leaves that building w/her I will know.


update: he is on leave(as in he works from home ) for the next 4 weeks then it will be revisited as to when he needs to go back. He is looking HARD for a different job.


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## segj048 (Mar 22, 2012)

I was the primary person who cheated on my husband, but after we were in the midst of seperating he was seeing someone else. So, I don't know if I'd technically call that cheating but it definitely felt that way.
Anyhow, I was just like you...I wanted to know everything. The details, why he was attracted to her, etc. 
I will say that some of the answers soothed me. I always thought, "well he must have thought she was so hot and couldn't resist her" but in reality he told me she was someone to talk to about all the issues he and I were having (the affair basically). It wasn't even physical until a looong while after getting to know each other, etc. So, that answer definitely helped. 
BUT...overall, I'm just going to suggest that you don't ask him for the details. It will only hurt you....you won't gain anything from it. Sure, some answers could help you get a clear understanding but altogether it's just not worth it. You're mind will be plagued by images of them together and sex with him will be very hard. 
I know all the details of his relationship with her and learned that he 'did it' doggy style. Everytime we did it after getting back together, all I could think about was him giving it to her. 
I also stumbled across pages of Google chats on his gmail account (by accident) and they were pretty graphic. He even called her the same pet names he called me! 
It took a while to get over and honestly I'm prefectly okay now...but it was SOOO not worth it! You've already suffered enough


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## OhGeesh (Jan 5, 2010)

Hell no!!! Less is more always imo, but then I'm in the I wouldn't want to know anyway category!!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## mestalla guy (Mar 20, 2012)

it would just makes things worse for you, im sure your imagination has taken care of alot of the details already


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## canttrustu (Feb 22, 2012)

mestalla guy said:


> it would just makes things worse for you, im sure your imagination has taken care of alot of the details already


unfortunately, yes. But another part of me thinks staying in the dark allows him to more easily operate the 'next time'.


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## Vanton68 (Feb 5, 2012)

I had to know the details and guess what, she also had a terrible time remembering (sounds like a recurring theme with WS?). What did trickle out through repeated interrogations actually made me feel better. Because the A happened years ago, while I was deployed (and I found out rather recently) I had never met the OM. In my mind movies he 6'8", a face like Brad Pitt, built like a chippendales dancer, hung like a mule, with the stamina of 20 men. In reality he was 5'7", skinny, boyish looking, stoner, with 20 odd hairs growing on his face that he refused to shave. 

When I finally found out that I wasn't competing with a sex robot built by God himself, it made things easier to digest. Of course the info about positions and oral are going to hurt you, but would you really want her secretly longing to do that one thing she didn't even know she liked (until she did it with the other man)? Your triggers will fade, but not knowing is forever.

And it is better to know exactly what happened, so that when you make your decision (R or D), you are actually able to make the 1st INFORMED DECISION in your relationship since the A started.


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## snap (Oct 3, 2011)

I didn't *want* to know, but I had to know.


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## river rat (Jan 20, 2012)

Cant, we are all different, as you can see from these posts. Not everyone wants the details. Just knowing that you have been betrayed may be enough. My WW had no idea that I even knew about her affair until she realized that I had made plans for my permanent exit. That's when things started to change. That's what the 180 is about. You have to be a new you, prepared to be on your own if you need to be. You already have the details you need- he was unfaithful, and you can't trust him, at least not for a long time. He needs to know that detail about you. Where you go from here depends on what he does with that information.


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## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

As much as it hurts to physically type this due to tendinitis, I felt I should get this out. I've talked about how some people need to know the details so they know what to forgive.

Well....last week I "obtained" info about the affair, and it's pretty much the whole story, but not the chat logs or any of their actual phone conversations. What I've found out was so damn hurtful, that R is is serious jeopardy. There's nothing new, but these PMs were from the height of the affair almost 2 years ago. I'm absolutely devastated, and it was worse than I imagined. I hadn't realized how deeply she was in the fog with this OM. 

It's my fault for re-opening an old wound, when she has done everything that I've asked for and then some. She damn near had a break down and the local cops were involved. I wasnt in trouble or anything, but she was crying and begging and pleading for me not to leave, etc. I was already packing my things and ready to hit the road for a couple of days to clear my head, but changed my mind. 

To actually read the words, the love, the yearning to be together, to sleep together, how life is cruel that they're married to someone else, etc, etc,. To know that they were making plans to meet up physically and be together. Wow. The fog has been gone a while now, but she mentioned to me that it was a good thing that I caught her when I did before she made it even worse than she had. She can't believe the things that she wrote to him about, some of it when we were really having some great times. Yes, I had her body, but her heart and mind were his. That was a tough pill to swallow.

Now I wish I didn't know the details. The pain is damn near as great as another DDay.


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## canttrustu (Feb 22, 2012)

lordmayhem said:


> As much as it hurts to physically type this due to tendinitis, I felt I should get this out. I've talked about how some people need to know the details so they know what to forgive.
> 
> Well....last week I "obtained" info about the affair, and it's pretty much the whole story, but not the chat logs or any of their actual phone conversations. What I've found out was so damn hurtful, that R is is serious jeopardy. There's nothing new, but these PMs were from the height of the affair almost 2 years ago. I'm absolutely devastated, and it was worse than I imagined. I hadn't realized how deeply she was in the fog with this OM.
> 
> ...


Lord, How long have you been in R? See the trouble is I have read alot of their emails and the ones I havent read I still have access to. I still am tempted to read the rest but have resisted b/c when I do it sets me back weeks. Like you said "like another Dday." 

I havent read any mention of love or yearning to be together yet... thats what I fear is there. I only read to a certain point and that was far enough. I stopped. Couldnt handle it. Like I said I still could..


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## Lon (Jun 6, 2011)

LM, learning those details sure is heartbreaking. What should make you wonder, if you had that level of detail when you first discovered this would you have still been able to offer R? For me, when I saw the texts and the photo of her with him, just the candidness and intimate way she wrote and the sparkle in her eye, were things I thought were always reserved for me... as soon as I saw that I felt absolutely nothing special for her in my heart, nor have I felt anything special for her since. As your W has been willing to do everything you have asked since dday, and seems genuinely remorseful, do you recognize anything special in that, because going forward in time your whole relationship will now be based on the time since - like losing all your old photos in a fire, all you have is the new photos you make, kind of like a clean slate if the remorse is true.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

I asked for & got a lot of gory details. 

Yes, it will piss you off to learn what happened. But at the same time, it cheapens the affair. Because the affair once exposed isn't clandestine anymore and it loses a certain appeal, if that makes sense. Also, your partner will feel foolish when he spills the beans. 

It's a personal choice--whetherto know or not. 

I am happy I asked for details though. It made it more real for me...so I knew what I was facing/up against/how to move from that point onward.


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## canttrustu (Feb 22, 2012)

Jellybeans said:


> I asked for & got a lot of gory details.
> 
> Yes, it will piss you off to learn what happened. But at the same time, it cheapens the affair. Because the affair once exposed isn't clandestine anymore and it loses a certain appeal, if that makes sense. Also, your partner will feel foolish when he spills the beans.
> 
> ...


See Jelly thats kinda how I am. 'Know the enemy' . especially since he still works w/her. Yeah the more I know about how they operated the better to ****block him. Ya know? Doesnt mean I necessarily want to read every little smiley face she/he ever sent. But someday I might. Right now he is doing all the right things so I think knowing more would only derail me. I know way alot right now.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

It would be very good for your marriage if he got a new job or relocated or if they did not work together.

Anycontact with a previous affair partner is not good and isn't conducive to restoring your marriage.

I totally understand you wanting to know. I never thought I would and then it hit me and I am glad for the end result.


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## canttrustu (Feb 22, 2012)

Jellybeans said:


> It would be very good for your marriage if he got a new job or relocated or if they did not work together.
> 
> Anycontact with a previous affair partner is not good and isn't conducive to restoring your marriage.
> 
> I totally understand you wanting to know. I never thought I would and then it hit me and I am glad for the end result.


Yes. He is working really hard to get a new job ASAP. It totally pisses me that he put us in this position but it is what it is and we gotta get thru it. He is working from home for now to be away from her. 

I do want to know. I just dont think I can know everything while he is still there and have any hope of R. Its a process. He is doing all he can for NC or as little as possible. Thats all he can do for now. He shows me all emails from her(work related always on his part, she has started to fish). Its hard and I never thought we'd be here. I have lost some respect for him but I love him and I'm trying.


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## LeslieH (Apr 3, 2012)

mestalla guy said:


> it would just makes things worse for you, im sure your imagination has taken care of alot of the details already


:iagree:

As the WS you may not credit my opinion, but I really don't think you should ask. 
I talked to my IC about this, she suggested to avoid gruesome details at all costs...why?
1. It creates more triggers for you, the BS, taking longer to heal
2. It'll create more anger, making it more difficult to R
3. The WS is forced to relive the event with you, which for some people can be painful... it could also trigger them to start think again about AP
4. Since I am female, she warned me especially not to reveal anything sexually specific. You don't want to be put in a position where your spouse demands sex in a certain way that you don't want to do. It can make WS resent the BS and sex altogether. 
5. If you have already forgiven your spouse, it is a step backwards. 

Yes, knowledge is power, but what kind of power do you get form knowing how often someone came or a certain position was used. 

I definitely think the BS is more than entitled to ask anything he/she wants, but is it really going to make you feel better?


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## canttrustu (Feb 22, 2012)

LeslieH said:


> :iagree:
> 
> As the WS you may not credit my opinion, but I really don't think you should ask.
> I talked to my IC about this, she suggested to avoid gruesome details at all costs...why?
> ...


It was an EA not a PA. But I do believe the more triggers part. I read a certain part about what she had for lunch once when they went, now I cant even think about Tomato-Basil soup w/o raising my blood pressure. So yeah, little things, big triggers.


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## snap (Oct 3, 2011)

So your IC suggests you to rugsweep and trickle-truth your husband. How cute.

No.

F*ck no. Let us betrayed decide how much we should know. We are grown ups and can deal with it. Don't pretend that non-disclosure is for anything but your own comfort. 

Thank you.


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## canttrustu (Feb 22, 2012)

LeslieH said:


> :iagree:
> 
> As the WS you may not credit my opinion, but I really don't think you should ask.
> I talked to my IC about this, she suggested to avoid gruesome details at all costs...why?
> ...


AT ALL COST????


actually the ONLY thing that would have made me feel better is for him to have honored his vows. Now if I ask a question-I expect an answer. See he's been lying to me for far too long so lying now is out of the question. And for your IC to basically recommend dodging the question or being evasive is ridiculous and I hope he/she doesnt cause you a D.


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## Coffee Amore (Dec 15, 2011)

LeslieH said:


> :iagree:
> 
> As the WS you may not credit my opinion, but I really don't think you should ask.
> I talked to my IC about this, she suggested to avoid gruesome details at all costs...why?
> ...



I normally don't post on CWI but your post made me come out of lurking. 

You have it all wrong. If the betrayed spouse wants the details, the wayward spouse should give it. Maybe ask first "are you sure you want to know?" and if the answer is "yes" then the wayward spouse is obligated to tell the truth. There's telling the truth and there's telling in a way that will maximize the hurt. "Did you have a chocolate chip cookie" can be answered with "yes, we had a chocolate chip cookie about three times", but you don't have to say "yes, it was the most moist, tastiest chocolate chip cookie I ever had in my life." Obviously ya'll know I'm talking about cookies...

I don't know if you've read Not "Just Friends" by Shirley Glass. In her section of the book about "walls and windows", she talks about how during the affair the cheating spouse and the affair partner put up a wall to keep the betrayed spouse out. What happens between the WS and AP is between them. They create a fantasy. They compartmentalize what they're doing. By giving details about the affair during reconciliation, the betrayed spouse has a window into the affair. It breaks down the wall that once existed. The BS is no longer staring at the wall wondering what went on. The BS is obviously going to still feel left out to a certain degree, but isn't completely in the dark as before.


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## snap (Oct 3, 2011)

Lying about or omitting affair details will be picked up by BS. If you still lie, you are making reconciliation impossible.

Lies and double life hurt as much (if not more) than the actual intercourse you had with AP. If you won't come clean, he'll be left forever wondering and there is zero chance at rebuilding any semblance of trust.


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## LeslieH (Apr 3, 2012)

My IC did not tell me to lie. She simply suggested that I say I don't feel comfortable or don't want to answer the question. 

I think the idea behind it is to not add further to whatever imagined affair the BS is thinking. Yes, what I did destroyed a person, but what I do moving forward can either help the person heal or add to the wreckage. 

Just because I messed up doesn't mean that my husband is the wisest person in the world. He is deservedly angry...and when emotions take over, we don't think clearly. 

I ordered the Shirley Glass book, so I haven't read it yet. 

Please don't take this as me being haughty. I'm very resigned to the fact that my husband accepting me is completely at his mercy. My biggest concern in all this is to help my husband heal, it's not to R. Yes, I would LOVE to R, but his priorities, his healing comes first. If not having me in his life helps him, that's something I have to accept. That is how my sessions are conducted. They are not based on what will make me feel better, they are all focused on how I can help him.


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## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

canttrustu said:


> Lord, How long have you been in R? See the trouble is I have read alot of their emails and the ones I havent read I still have access to. I still am tempted to read the rest but have resisted b/c when I do it sets me back weeks. Like you said "like another Dday."
> 
> I havent read any mention of love or yearning to be together yet... thats what I fear is there. I only read to a certain point and that was far enough. I stopped. Couldnt handle it. Like I said I still could..


If you cant handle it then dont. Like others have said in this forum in the past, very often the reality is worse then you have imagined.

Oh yes, June 10 is going to be the 2nd Antiversary of DDay
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

I'm a firm believer in facing the truth, it's much easier to face than what I myself am capable of creating.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

Lon said:


> LM, learning those details sure is heartbreaking. What should make you wonder, if you had that level of detail when you first discovered this would you have still been able to offer R? For me, when I saw the texts and the photo of her with him, just the candidness and intimate way she wrote and the sparkle in her eye, were things I thought were always reserved for me... as soon as I saw that I felt absolutely nothing special for her in my heart, nor have I felt anything special for her since. As your W has been willing to do everything you have asked since dday, and seems genuinely remorseful, do you recognize anything special in that, because going forward in time your whole relationship will now be based on the time since - like losing all your old photos in a fire, all you have is the new photos you make, kind of like a clean slate if the remorse is true.


I would rather have found this out in the beginning, on DDay. Instead its like trickle truth but of my own making. The "love of my life" (her words) definitely set me back. I know exactly where you're coming from about the special feelings you thought belonged to you that she gave to him. Its like everything is tainted and now there are additional triggers.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## lenzi (Apr 10, 2012)

Thorburn said:


> My WS told me she got on top once with the OM .. They had sex in my car. I wanted to burn it. But I got over it by calling it the **** mobile and I will get rid of it sometime this year. Heck the dude made my wife moan so what do I do there?


OMG how can you (or anyone else in your situation) EVER get past something like this?

I sure couldn't.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

Leslie, I am sorry, but this is classic WS-speak. "What they don't know won't hurt them." !!! Yea right.

I guess you don't need to volunteer unrequested tidbits. But if your BS asks a question, you damn well answer it truthfully.

Do you understand what a BS is robbed of in an affair? Truth and reality. Many never recover from this, and denying it is just a further betrayal of a weak and vulnerable marriage.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

I want to toss out the laptop and webcam since those were her main tools. But its mine. I'll get rid of it when I upgrade. Already got rid of her blackberry after finding out why she really wanted one for.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## sigma1299 (May 26, 2011)

Another excellent post inheartlife. That's exactly the position I adopted. I made sure my wife had enough info that she knew the truth but details I left for her to ask. If she asked I told her the truth, no matter how unpleasant. To really reconcile there can be no lies or half truths. There is nothing wrong with letting your betrayed spouse decide what they want to know, but if they want to know you have to give them the truth.


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## SprucHub (Jan 13, 2012)

LeslieH said:


> My biggest concern in all this is to help my husband heal, it's not to R. Yes, I would LOVE to R, but his priorities, his healing comes first. If not having me in his life helps him, that's something I have to accept. That is how my sessions are conducted. They are not based on what will make me feel better, they are all focused on how I can help him.


Leslie - this is the absolute right answer. It shows love and compassion. I think what many are trying to relate is that it may be impossible for him to heal without answers. The uncertainty of not knowing all the facts and the answers can be what lingers longest. Sometimes, people need to peel back the bandaid. One question that will likely haunt him is "why?" "He was very hot and the sex was amazing" will end that question. We all know we are not the best at anything, the most attractive, the smartest, richest, kindest, biggest . . . Confirmation of that is not the end of the world (maybe confirmation that he is not enough is the end of the marriage, but not the end of the world). Answered questions can only linger for so long.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

Ugh, and I just recalled what my WS withheld from me post DD#2: the fact that he cheated right thru 6 mos of MC. It was like a DD#3 when I found out. But a funny thing happened: my WS suddenly stopped being defensive and answered all my other questions. There were no more secrets to keep. 

Don't discount the sense of relief and healing YOU can get from sharing the truth.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Lon (Jun 6, 2011)

lordmayhem said:


> I want to toss out the laptop and webcam since those were her main tools. But its mine. I'll get rid of it when I upgrade. Already got rid of her blackberry after finding out why she really wanted one for.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


yeah its strange how the specific tools they used to conduct their affairs seem to be strong triggers - I found out about my W's indiscretions while looking on her netbook and blackberry - and anytime I've seen those specific models I involuntarily turn my head and clench my jaw. Other laptops and cellphones no prob, but seeing the identical ones its like the image has been etched into my eyes.


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## OhGeesh (Jan 5, 2010)

All this proves is everyone is different. I for one have no urge to know not even the slightest then again I don't want to know about the affair in the first place........call me loco

To this day after 15 years of marriage she still brings up my exes. Like "I had a dream you left me for XXXX" or "That I caught ya'll" and it's been so so long.

Before my wife and I got married we got drunk and had a 1 on 1 telling each other everyone we slept with and some gory detail. Hearing her say names of some of my best friends and threesomes still can twinge me and its been 17 years since they happened.

So, for me HELL NO I don't want to know would never want to know I agree 10000% with Lord Mayhem.


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## canttrustu (Feb 22, 2012)

Lon said:


> yeah its strange how the specific tools they used to conduct their affairs seem to be strong triggers - I found out about my W's indiscretions while looking on her netbook and blackberry - and anytime I've seen those specific models I involuntarily turn my head and clench my jaw. Other laptops and cellphones no prob, but seeing the identical ones its like the image has been etched into my eyes.


Yes. My H's laptop and blacberry. Both are company owned and I want to BURN THEM!!! When I see him working on them its a definate trigger(but better than him being in the office w/her). So Im kinda screwed either way.


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