# Where to begin?



## jandres6 (May 24, 2013)

I am not perfect. I know that. I do try hard, though, and have done my best to be a good husband, father (3 ages 14/13/9). have never been the best communicator though. 

Things got extra rough when I lost a very good job (thru no fault of my own) and went into a career nosedive five years ago. Got another promising job that didn't work out, lasted a year. Went back to school for Nursing, graduate May 2014. I have a great job that I love but pay sucks (30K + medical for family).

She works hard and has shouldered a heavy burden which has hung over our marriage since this started 5 yrs ago. Whats mine was hers unconditionally, but not the other way around. One more year, though and I am back on track, looking forward, thinking long term, golden years, etc... (I am 45, she is 41).

Well she couldn't wait. She lied, has been lying. Told me ten days ago and we finally layed it out last night. 3 guys in total (that I know of), 2 one nighters going way back and 1 current relationship (he is thrice divorced, 65+ and understands what she is going thru). We had planned to go out and talk tonight. I went to work last night for a four hour extra shift. She called him and went to dinner, making sure to be home when I got back. WTF? Left the kids there. Lord help me, its hard to control my rage.

Anyway, this is where I begin, There is soooooooooo much more that factors into this. I think I know what everyone will say. I am scared, though, of the future and I don't what next steps to take. I feel completely alone. Help me, please.


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

Step 1. Pick up the phone an exposé the affair with the of guy to every friend and family member you can.

Step 2. Post the OM up on cheaterville.com and send the link to his fb friends list.

Step 3. Go talk to an attorney about filing for D from her.


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

I'd also move all money you can into a bank account only you control,


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

See step 1 is to drive off the old man, make being with her costly and humiliating for him.

Step 2 is to show her you won't accept her being a cheater.


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## BK23 (Apr 17, 2013)

Shaggy said:


> Step 1. Pick up the phone an exposé the affair with the of guy to every friend and family member you can.
> 
> Step 2. Post the OM up on cheaterville.com and send the link to his fb friends list.
> 
> Step 3. Go talk to an attorney about filing for D from her.


Do this immediately. Like now. You will be saving yourself a ton of pain.


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## mablenc (Feb 26, 2013)

Your first mistake is to start blaming yourself. Life is not perfect, things happen but, that's why vows contain for better or worse. 

You haven't been laying on the bed doing nothing, you were working on your future. 

My husband did the same, I had no trouble providing for us as I know what is best for my family.
Sorry you are here, I just couldn't allow to see how you started your post.

Get mad, stand up for yourself and your kids, what kind of mother does this, and the fact that she left them alone  is rediculous.
Document this, if you fight for custody it will be helpful.


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## BjornFree (Aug 16, 2012)

Shaggy said:


> Step 1. Pick up the phone an exposé the affair with the of guy to every friend and family member you can.
> 
> Step 2. Post the OM up on cheaterville.com and send the link to his fb friends list.
> 
> Step 3. Go talk to an attorney about filing for D from her.


Step 4: Pack her bagx and drive her over to the OM's place and leave her there. She's having sex and dinner with him, might as well cook and clean his house, load his dishes and wash his undies.


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## jandres6 (May 24, 2013)

This is brutal. I am afraid for the kids.


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## walkonmars (Aug 21, 2012)

You won't last long swimming against the current. That's what you're doing. You'll eventually tire and leave the troubled waters behind. Do as the posters above recommend. The "4-step" method outlined is solid. 

Oh, start the 180 for your own sanity.


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## ScrewedEverything (May 14, 2013)

Actually, Step One is to take some time and figure out what YOU want. Don't let anyone else tell you what you should want or do in this circumstance. You need to do what's right for you. This is a very big decision that will effect you and many others, so don't make it hastily or let it be driven by the emotions of the moment.


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## Acabado (May 13, 2012)

jandres6 said:


> This is brutal. I am afraid for the kids.


Understandable.
Don't hesisate to take the hard steps tough.
Lawyer, bags, exposure


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## mablenc (Feb 26, 2013)

jandres6 said:


> This is brutal. I am afraid for the kids.


Be more afraid that she left them alone. God, knows how many times she has done it and what she has exposed them too. 

I know its hard to see clearly but you need to be strong.


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## Acabado (May 13, 2012)

Its hard but simple:

NC letter.
Complete transparence in comunication divices and whewreabouts.
Full confession
STD test
___ (insert here whatever reasonable conditions you need; getting rid of enablers/toxic people, IC, MC...)

..... or divorce.

No time to think, no trial separations, no bargaining.

You need to blow this ASAP.


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

Jandres

It is ok to be afraid.

It is not ok to do nothing.

Why not expose the affair. 

Take control of the finances.

Find out who the OM is.

Then pack a bag for your wife, throw her extra stuff in some black trash bags and drop all her stuff offf at his front door.

Then send her a text. "I have thrown you out like trash. Because you have treated our marriage and family like trash. Enjoy your life with the senior citizen. As we go through the divorce process I expect you to pay for your half of the bills. I also expect you to fulfill your responsibilities as a Mother!"

That is how you handle this situation.

You show her consequences for her lousy actions.

Be strong. Be fearless. THat is how you get respect.

HM64


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

jandres6 said:


> This is brutal. I am afraid for the kids.


In what sense are you afraid for the kids?


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## jandres6 (May 24, 2013)

EleGirl said:


> In what sense are you afraid for the kids?


Emotionally and adequate care. Perhaps afraid is the wrong word. My worry is the upheaval. There has to be some some stability for them. I cannot do it alone either. I work nights, and have school for another year (40+ hrs/wk at night and school 4x/wk). 

We (she and I) have at the very least done everything for the kids. Her family (mother and father, also divorced, happily remarried) also are a huge help.

There is no good time for this but it could not have happened at a worse time.


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## walkonmars (Aug 21, 2012)

jandres6 said:


> We (she and I) have at the very least done everything for the kids.


And yet she left them to fend for themselves while she went out for a good time?


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## mablenc (Feb 26, 2013)

walkonmars said:


> And yet she left them to fend for themselves while she went out for a good time?


Yeah more like I did not we. 

Look you will be ok, trust me. If you listen to the posters here, get yourself into IC too. If you act out of fear you will be feeling worse and in a terrible situation. 

Here I go with my lecture:

See a doctor if you need to, if it is offered by your work/school take FMLA leave have your doctor write you a note. IF you have short term disability take it for pay. Look to see if your employer or hers has a Employee assistance program. You can get some free counseling sessions, a free layer visit and discounts on lawyer fees.

Please make sure you sleep even if you have to take something like melantonin or tylenol sleep/

eat make sure you eat and take breaks.


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## jandres6 (May 24, 2013)

walkonmars said:


> And yet she left them to fend for themselves while she went out for a good time?


I am not defending her but we have left them alone in the past. Our oldest is 14 and capable of sitting. Never for long, never far away. Still, you make a good point.

Did I tell everyone she is an alcoholic. I refuse to give her the time when shes drinking. This has caused me "t be distant and closed off."

Ugh.


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## jandres6 (May 24, 2013)

mablenc said:


> Yeah more like I did not we.
> 
> Look you will be ok, trust me. If you listen to the posters here, get yourself into IC too. If you act out of fear you will be feeling worse and in a terrible situation.
> 
> ...


Sorry - what does I in IC stand for?


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## Acabado (May 13, 2012)

When you pack her bags add a bottle and and pack of adult diapers, just to mess with her mind.
Shock her out of this nonsense.


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## BjornFree (Aug 16, 2012)

jandres6 said:


> Emotionally and adequate care. Perhaps afraid is the wrong word. My worry is the upheaval. There has to be some some stability for them. I cannot do it alone either. I work nights, and have school for another year (40+ hrs/wk at night and school 4x/wk).
> 
> We (she and I) have at the very least done everything for the


What about your parents? 

As hard as all the advice may seem to be, remember that hard times call for hard decisions. You have one of three options:-

1. Sit back and do nothing. The result being you will be prolonging your agony and she'll still neglect the children and eventually leave you all.

2. Break the affair, expose it. Make sure the OM gets the message. If this doesn't change the status quo nothing ever will and you will be left with no choice but to take option 3.

3. Go to your lawyer have everything drawn up, look after your finances. Make alternate arrangements for your kids so that they're adequately taken care of and yes that means you'll have to make sacrifices on your part and be the stable one, the rock that they can lean on.


Weighing all the factors in before making the decision might take a few days. But don't delay it further. Making no decision is worse than making the wrong decision. Its called living in limbo. We've seen loads of guys go through it here, nothing pretty about it trust me.


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## Acabado (May 13, 2012)

jandres6 said:


> Sorry - what does I in IC stand for?


IC = individual counseling (versus MC marriage counseling)


Take a look to this thread, lost of helpul info there.

Welcome TAM CWI newbies- please read this


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## walkonmars (Aug 21, 2012)

Acabado said:


> When you pack her bags add a bottle and and pack of adult diapers, just to mess with her mind.
> Shock her out of this nonsense.


:rofl:

That's rich. Do it!


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## StillSearching (Feb 8, 2013)

Take it from an 49 year old BS. I'm a man that was in your shoes 12 years ago. I would have done everything these posters are saying for you to do. I stayed with my wife. It was fricking brutal. You don't want to do what I did. I promise you things will be fine. Don't worry so much about the kids. They will be ok. These posters are dead on. This is not YOUR fault.


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## TRy (Sep 14, 2011)

jandres6 said:


> We had planned to go out and talk tonight. I went to work last night for a four hour extra shift. She called him and went to dinner, making sure to be home when I got back.


 When they openly in your face cheat on you like this, it means that it is over. She has no respect for you or your feelings, and without respect she can not be in love with you. For your own dignity, you must just move forward to divorce. You can always stop the divorce later, but only if she gives you very good reason to. 

Remember that you are both 50%-50% responsible for your marriage, but that the cheater is always 100% responsible for the cheating. Do not let her try to sell you on believing otherwise. Cheaters always try to blame-shift their cheating onto their spouse, it right out of the cheater's handbook. Do not let her even get started with this line of thinking. I am sorry that you are here. Good luck.


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

Who is the OM?? Is he married?


What are you teaching your kids when you take such abuse? That when they get walked over, they should do nothing and take it?


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## DavidWYoung (Feb 3, 2012)

I understand your fear BUT, do not do that! Look, your wife is not a GOD, she is just a female. You are having a "Tree and Forest moment" Pretend that you can fly a little bit and hover over your life at 200 meters, them 1000 meters and then whatever to see your whole life.

The point here is this is your life, your whole life, one that God has blessed you with. It's not your wife's life , its your life. You need not fear anything in this life, you do need to UNDERSTAND that your life and her life are separate. You walk near each other and share some things, but in the end, it's your life.

I want you to be HAPPY and ENJOY each day as a GIFT! I know now that I was like you, but now I am different and happy. I want you to be happy. Just my 2 cents David


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## jandres6 (May 24, 2013)

warlock07 said:


> Who is the OM?? Is he married?
> 
> 
> What are you teaching your kids when you take such abuse? That when they get walked over, they should do nothing and take it?


He is not married, divorced x3
No facebook that I can find
Not a lot to lose except his soul
Makes me sick

I agree about the kids.


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## DavidWYoung (Feb 3, 2012)

P.S. If Bjorn Free or Acabado or Shaggy tell you to do something. DO IT!


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## jandres6 (May 24, 2013)

DavidWYoung said:


> I understand your fear BUT, do not do that! Look, your wife is not a GOD, she is just a female. You are having a "Tree and Forest moment" Pretend that you can fly a little bit and hover over your life at 200 meters, them 1000 meters and then whatever to see your whole life.
> 
> The point here is this is your life, your whole life, one that God has blessed you with. It's not your wife's life , its your life. You need not fear anything in this life, you do need to UNDERSTAND that your life and her life are separate. You walk near each other and share some things, but in the end, it's your life.
> 
> I want you to be HAPPY and ENJOY each day as a GIFT! I know now that I was like you, but now I am different and happy. I want you to be happy. Just my 2 cents David


Thank you David. I want that too.


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## Wideopn Dave (Apr 11, 2013)

Buddy I am exactly where you are but 4mths ahead. My WW has had 5 EA's and one PA which was the most recent. I am in MC trying to reconcile and my 17yr old daughter asked me the same question Warlock posted......in her words, "Dad you're demeaning yourself by letting Mom get away with this."

I had the same reservations (only 1 child) about the effect it may have on her but she has out and said if things don't work out, she will stay with me because I will be booting WW out.

Unfortunately, WW is very manipulative and has decided that the whole reason for her behaviour is an emotional disconnect from me 17yrs ago when our daughter was born.

I have done everything I can to forgive her; have taken on board some of the things the MC has said and implemented them initially without much payback but now, I have lost 15kgs (I would put 10kg's of that down to sheer stress and emotional breakdown) and am back in the gym, riding my offroad bike and mountain bike as much as i can and have started to regain some of my confidence which was shattered. The clincher, the PA partner is 60yrs old and she is 41 while I'm 42! That stung so I get where you're coming from.

The interesting thing is that i implemented some parts of the 180 and I can tell you it works. The WW is suddenly trying much harder and while a part of me wants to accept that, since I have moved into a better head space, I'm not sure I want her anymore.

SA law is a little different iro of divorce and "grandad" ran for the hills when I confronted him and told him he'd be sued along with the WW and cited in the divorce papers.

Good luck and dont be afraid. If you do get divorced it must be as far as possible ON YOUR TERMS. Don't ever take responsibility for your WW's actions. She took a conscious decision to have the affair(s). She is entirely responsible for her actions irrespective of what you may or may not have done! 

There is NEVER an excuse for going outside the marriage. 

All wayward spouses in my view are the same; the want to test the water before jumping ship. Stuff that!! Jump and swim or drown....either way, don't use my "boat" as a safety net while you decide.

Good luck mate.


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## DavidWYoung (Feb 3, 2012)

The crazy thing is that you go from 80 mph to 0 mph, in a second and the wife that you thought you had, just does not care one little bit.

I held it in for 25 years. The pain never goes away. I think of it from the moment I wake up until I go to sleep. Thank God for TAM! Even if they do ban me spometimres.


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## TRy (Sep 14, 2011)

Wideopn Dave said:


> All wayward spouses in my view are the same; the want to test the water before jumping ship. Stuff that!! Jump and swim or drown....either way, don't use my "boat" as a safety net while you decide.


 :iagree::iagree::iagree:
Well said.


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

how did your wife meet this guy? What does he do? Find about it.


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## thatbpguy (Dec 24, 2012)

jandres6 said:


> I am not perfect. I know that. I do try hard, though, and have done my best to be a good husband, father (3 ages 14/13/9). have never been the best communicator though.
> 
> Things got extra rough when I lost a very good job (thru no fault of my own) and went into a career nosedive five years ago. Got another promising job that didn't work out, lasted a year. Went back to school for Nursing, graduate May 2014. I have a great job that I love but pay sucks (30K + medical for family).
> 
> ...


I haven't read any of the previous posts so I apologize if this is redundant.

Anyone who had has 3 betrayals is clearly an addict with no true intent on slowing down and one who, when the going gets tough, goes into the bed of another. 

So I have only 1 question.....

Is this the life you want? 

I mean is it _really_?

Do you want someone to support the marriage? To know that tough times is a call to shoulder arms? 

Because if you do, it's time to walk away from this serial betrayer. 

Is it hard? Damn hard!

Is it the best to maintain self respect and actually have a better relationship with the kids? Absolutely!

Staying married to a person addicted to betraying is not healthy for anyone- you, them, the kids, friends, family... anyone.


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## jandres6 (May 24, 2013)

Thanks to all. So much valuable experience, lessons and insight (sad that its here but ...). 

Definitely going to work on the 180. With the abuse I have absorbed over the last few years I have a good start on it already. But now it will be much harder to remain composed. 

I know its over. She insists she wants to work it out. I don't see the remorse yet. Having another talk tonight. Any further advice is more than appreciated.


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## jandres6 (May 24, 2013)

warlock07 said:


> how did your wife meet this guy? What does he do? Find about it.


I plan to but why does it really matter other my own curiosity?


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

jandres6 said:


> Thanks to all. So much valuable experience, lessons and insight (sad that its here but ...).
> 
> Definitely going to work on the 180. With the abuse I have absorbed over the last few years I have a good start on it already. But now it will be much harder to remain composed.
> 
> I know its over. *She insists she wants to work it out*. I don't see the remorse yet. Having another talk tonight. Any further advice is more than appreciated.


Next time she says this laugh in her face. 

No wife who would want to work it out with her husband would blatantly go to dinner with her boyfriend. 

Jeeesh sh!t like this pisses me off!


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

Get yourself tested for HIV/STDs. More older people (40+) are tending to contract STDs rather than kids, these days.

Get your children's DNA tested. This is not so much to check their DNA, but it serves as a line in the sand: "Look, wife! Your behaviour has caused me to doubt everything about our relationship. *Everything...*"


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## LostViking (Mar 26, 2013)

jandres6 said:


> I am not perfect. I know that. I do try hard, though, and have done my best to be a good husband, father (3 ages 14/13/9). have never been the best communicator though.
> 
> Things got extra rough when I lost a very good job (thru no fault of my own) and went into a career nosedive five years ago. Got another promising job that didn't work out, lasted a year. Went back to school for Nursing, graduate May 2014. I have a great job that I love but pay sucks (30K + medical for family).
> 
> ...


You are kidding are you not? 

She actually did this to you?


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## jandres6 (May 24, 2013)

LostViking said:


> You are kidding are you not?
> 
> She actually did this to you?


I could tell she was going to. "So you will be home at 11, right?" as I am walking out the door.

Then I came home and we had our "talk".

I think when I tell her she has to end it or get out, she is going to ask me if this means we are reconciling. When I say I don't know, I think she is going to say no to ending it. Then she is going to beg to reconcile. Its been a rollercoaster for some time.

She just got a new job and went to happy hour with the co-worker that got her the job (I know, I know) and after we are going to dinner to talk. So she will be half in the bag. She is always amorous half in the bag. Did I say she is an alcoholic. She is always amorous.


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## LostViking (Mar 26, 2013)

My god.


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## bryanp (Aug 25, 2011)

If the roles were reversed do you think your wife would be acting like you? How much humiliation and disrespect are you willing to endure? How many more times are you willing to have her put your health at risk for STD's? Her actions show she has absolutely no respect for you as a husband or a man. If you do not respect yourself then who will? Good luck to you.


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## walkonmars (Aug 21, 2012)

jandres6 said:


> I plan to but why does it really matter other my own curiosity?


At least two reasons:
1. There can't be a reconciliation as long as the OM is in the picture. Find out about the OM and see if he's married, has a LTGF, find out if his parents are around, siblings, who his friends are etc. You can expose the affair to them and see if that breaks the affair. 

2. He's eventually going to be around your kids - you'll want to know what kind of scum he is. 

You should not talk to her about anything except: "Do you want to work on this marriage? If so you need to break it off with OM, that's the only chance" If she refuses or "doesn't know" then don't talk to her about anything at all except the kids and finances. Don't make any promises at all - except that you promise it's over if she doesn't break it off. 

Don't leave your home. If she wants "space" tell her to take a hike. She can sleep in the basement or on the couch. You ain't leavin' - no way - no how. 

See an atty immediately. Protect your assets if you can. Don't go to MC unless the OM is completely out of the picture. 

You need be strong for yourself and your kids. If it means divorce then so be it. You'll only become weaker in spirit hanging around while she humiliates you. Her words have no meaning - only her actions.


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

Speaking of actions....start showing her how confident you are by letting her go.

what i mean is, she is just as scared of the future as you are, so please stop showing her this fact. Hell now is the time to show her how certian you really are with not tolorating this and no matter how confused she is show her that you are not in the least confussed with this and the bottom line is you will not control her, but will take control of this and stop the emotional torture by letting her go!

See, your old lady thinks you will stick around until she "figures" this out....prove her wrong and start giving her a taste in what she is about to lose.

The sooner you get her to second guess and think twice about her choices the sooner she will come out of this fog.

Granted I could be wrong and she coukd choose the OM, but at the end of the day she will respect you for no longer tolorating her bull crap...cuz she knows its bull crap and is waiting for you to make the move......one way or another.

Stop phucing around and *show* her were this is heading if she continues by disingaging her and cutting her off.

She needs to see you letting go of her!

Again chicks dig confident guys! Smile, wish her the best and make your boundries loud and clear with regards to what you want out of a emotionally healthy relationship.....something she is incapable to offer you when she continues to stay incontact with OM.

This is no longer about her and the marriage, its time to show her that you do diserve good thing and it is now up to her to keep up or get out. This betrayal is hers to deal with now, you will be moving on, away from this crap, its up to her to either come along and put her big girl pants on or let it go and take her chances with this OM....and that prospect is not that good from were I'm sitting.


Just in case you missed it, I'll say it again " chick dig confident men"


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## jnj express (Mar 28, 2011)

What can a 41 yr old woman, see in a 65 yr old man---

There can be little to no future, with him physically---unless she likes hanging/sagging/marked up skin, due to age----unless she likes a guy, who has trouble moving freely, unless she likes a guy wno WILL BECOME short tempered, and grouchy, for that's what old age brings to the table. How much longer do you think he will be able to perform, physically---Lets get serious----age onset, means just that---and the physical body, does not perform at a real high level----so at the most what benefit physically does she get with this guy---maybe 5 yrs

Do not get me wrong---many 70 yr olds do just fine----but as a partner for a 46 yr old----Doesn't work very well, for very long

But there is one thing that could make her stick around---good old greenback dollars---MONEY----otherwise, give me a good reason for her being with a 65 yr old---his maturity, is no better than yours, and actually, he is probably beginning to lose the use of some of his faculties-----SO WHAT THE HE*L IS SHE DOING WITH A 65 YR OLD MAN

Other deal is the alcohol------she isn't helping herself here, either, and her liver, one of these days, is gonna tell her "F" you lady, we are done

If you are gonna R with her than do it right---not only does she do all the proper things to R, the mge, along with showing accountability/contriteness/remorse, and doing ALL the heavy lifting----she also gets rid of the ALCOHOL

She is 41 can an old dog, learn new tricks---who knows---maybe she is to far down the road, to make the proper changes, and become a viable candidate for R---only you and her can decide this---and actually it all MUST COME FROM HER

Your kids, are old enuff to get thru this, hopefully, some never do, and FOO scars them for life---but you can't live in misery due to the kids-----this relationship is slowly collapsing, and fueled by alcohol, and infidelity, it may never make it

You need to keep your eyes wide open, and do what is right for you---in that you must at least try to have a somewhat happy finish to your life----you got maybe 20 good yrs left, before, age does start to control what you do, and how you do it----make the next 20 yrs the best they can be, and if it is to be w/out this woman who calls herself your wife, then so be it---if you need to let her go, then let her go-----as I said before---there isn't much left of your journey thru life---do what you need to do, to make it a happy journey.


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## thatbpguy (Dec 24, 2012)

jnj express said:


> What can a 41 yr old woman, see in a 65 yr old man--.


$$$$$$

Next question.


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

Make sure OM is up on cheaterville.com , then see where you could send the link.

How did she meet grandpa?


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## dusty4 (May 8, 2013)

jandres6 said:


> This is brutal. I am afraid for the kids.


And that is an understandable fear. But just remember, whatever happens to destroy their world, its on her, not you.


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## dusty4 (May 8, 2013)

jandres6 said:


> I am not defending her but we have left them alone in the past. Our oldest is 14 and capable of sitting. Never for long, never far away.


There is a big difference between leaving the kids alone to have a good time, and one spouse leaving the residence to go out and do something that will hurt them. BIG difference.


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## dusty4 (May 8, 2013)

Shaggy said:


> Make sure OM is up on cheaterville.com


Exactly.

But wife needs to be up there too.


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