# Infidelity and respect



## cpacan (Jan 2, 2012)

I have been wondering about this for a while. It is said that a relationship can't last if there is a lack of respect from one or the other spouse - or both.

I tend to agree, but then you need to define respect - and being cheated on, I wonder if that equals lack of respect. Or can you actually cheat on your spouse while at the same time maintain your respect for him/her?

If not, where does that leave reconsiliation attempts?

What's your take on this?


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## Headspin (May 13, 2012)

cpacan said:


> I have been wondering about this for a while. It is said that a relationship can't last if there is a lack of respect from one or the other spouse - or both.
> 
> I tend to agree, but then you need to define respect - and being cheated on, I wonder if that equals lack of respect. Or can you actually cheat on your spouse while at the same time maintain your respect for him/her?
> 
> ...



Pretty clear - cheating is part based on a lack of respect imo.


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## snap (Oct 3, 2011)

It is hard to imagine a better way to show disrespect than cheating.

The aftermath of that, well, it's an uncomfortable question.

You know, I had a decent upbringing, went to an OK school, and was taught that one should talk to settle disputes and that force doesn't solve anything. Then, one day, I witnessed a guy who was doing bad things towards others getting thoroughly beaten. From that point on, he stopped doing those bad things and got more into talking first to resolve his issues. My takeaway from that situation was that sometimes a punch in the nose gets a point across in the shortest way.

I'm convinced that if not the tough love approach promoted here, my wife would not have gotten a iota of respect back to me (and no I didn't punch her). That I had to fight for that respect though still leaves bad aftertaste.


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## cpacan (Jan 2, 2012)

snap said:


> *It is hard to imagine a better way to show disrespect than cheating.*
> 
> The aftermath of that, well, it's an uncomfortable question.
> 
> ...


That's exactly why I ask the question. I tend to think that infidelity is as disrespectfull as it gets, but the again, I don't carry the mindset of a cheater.

So I am just wondering if I can regain respect if it was there in the first place, that is.

I have read some statements saying, that if a woman looses respect for her husband, he can't possibly win it back.

So I just have my doubts... she has not told me that she doesn't respect me, hmmm.... but IDK. Guess I am just fumbling around trying to decide if it is worth it.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

What I've read on the forum is more the idea that without respect, there is no love. That's obviously not strictly true, you can love a relative or friend without respecting them.

But it's tremendously hard to recover *romantic* love for a life partner without respect. And that is why BSs often find they've fallen out of romantic love with their cheating spouse after the flurry of winning them back.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## cpacan (Jan 2, 2012)

iheartlife said:


> What I've read on the forum is more the idea that without respect, there is no love. That's obviously not strictly true, you can love a relative or friend without respecting them.
> 
> But it's tremendously hard to recover *romantic* love for a life partner without respect. *And that is why BSs often find they've fallen out of romatic love with their cheating spouse after the flurry of winning them back.*
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Well, I must admit that my feelings have changed - I don't see her on her pedestral being supernatural anymore. More out of the ordinary in fact - that's sad. So maybe I have lost some respect for her as well, i guess.


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## canttrustu (Feb 22, 2012)

I believe that a cheater lacks respect for ANYONE-themselves included- AP included. If the cheater respected his/her spouse, they wouldnt do such a disrespectful thing as dishonoring their vows. If they respected the AP-they wouldnt string them along as they always do or misrepresent themselves as they always do. If they respected themselves they wouldnt allow themselves to sink so low.

So no- I dont believe he had respect for me. He cheated and thought me too dumb to find out. Thats not respect. 

Now we're in R(dday in February, NC in May) and its ME who lacks respect for HIM. I dont view him as the man I married. Its like being married to a stranger. Ive learned so much about him that makes respecting him a challenge. I hope thats temporary. And rather or not he respects me now I guess remains to be seen.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

In my case, I richly theorize that my my STBXW looked for ways to "lose respect" for me, even while we were domiciled together, so that it might present her with some element of satisfaction in her looking at other possible suitors, all without my knowledge~ greatly to the point of EA and PA.

Then when she was actively involved in her affair(s), it gave her the needed impetus to order the "trial separation"; pretentious of trying to work some form of reconciliation out strictly as a PR ploy to deceive me, family, and friends; but knowing full-well in her heart of hearts that it would never ever come to that, but was only implemented as a unilateral precursor to the dank stairwell of divorce!


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

I cheated (it was a 'revenge' affair) yet I still respected my wife, very much. I think what broke my heart about my behaviour was that I could hurt someone who I loved and respected so much.


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## Harken Banks (Jun 12, 2012)

iheartlife said:


> What I've read on the forum is more the idea that without respect, there is no love. That's obviously not strictly true, you can love a relative or friend without respecting them.
> 
> But it's tremendously hard to recover *romantic* love for a life partner without respect. And that is why BSs often find they've fallen out of romantic love with their cheating spouse after the flurry of winning them back.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Well that's an interesting take. Say it ain't so.


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## Harken Banks (Jun 12, 2012)

This thread took an interesting turn with comments from iheartlife and canttrustu. We share the same struggle.


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## morituri (Apr 1, 2011)

How can a person claim to love, let alone respect, their spouse if they are involved in a morally illicit relationship that can physically, emotionally and financially destroy their spouse and family?:scratchhead:


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## canttrustu (Feb 22, 2012)

Harken Banks said:


> This thread took an interesting turn with comments from iheartlife and canttrustu. We share the same struggle.


How far past dday are you?


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## nice777guy (Nov 23, 2009)

People do make mistakes sometimes.

Part of issue - to me - is in how you handle your mistakes.

Sadly most of the stories here - where the affairs are more than drunken one night stands - lack of respect is likely a core issue.

And agree with the poster who said its a lack of respect for both yourself and your partner.


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## canttrustu (Feb 22, 2012)

nice777guy said:


> People do make mistakes sometimes.
> 
> Part of issue - to me - is in how you handle your mistakes.
> 
> ...


An affair is a choice.


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## Numb in Ohio (Oct 31, 2011)

iheartlife said:


> What I've read on the forum is more the idea that without respect, there is no love. That's obviously not strictly true, you can love a relative or friend without respecting them.
> 
> But it's tremendously hard to recover *romantic* love for a life partner without respect. And that is why BSs often find they've fallen out of romantic love with their cheating spouse after the flurry of winning them back.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_



I totally agree with this. I can talk to my H as a friend, just general convo.. But when we he wants to know where I stand on our marriage because of his emotional abuse and cheating, it ends up turning into an argument, and it puts us all the way back to day 1. 

I don't feel the attraction to him as my H. It's so sad. When I try to "really" look at him, I feel like I have no idea who he is. I look at him with an empty heart... and I think " how can this man, who I believed to be MY best friend, choose other best friends (women) over me? 

So, as they lose their respect for us before they cheat, we lose our respect for them afterwards.... Game over?


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

morituri said:


> How can a person claim to love, let alone respect, their spouse if they are involved in a morally illicit relationship that can physically, emotionally and financially destroy their spouse and family?:scratchhead:


Because we rugswept my wife's affair. 

I think what made it worse was that, outwardly, we looked like the perfect couple. People would comment on how lucky we were to be together, how perfect we were. Only thing was, I knew differently. 

I started drinking, met someone -the OW- who had a mutual interest in a hobby, who also liked drinking and it went from bad to worse.

But I still loved and respected my wife. I think my problem was that I harboured resentment against my wife for her affair.


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## Numb in Ohio (Oct 31, 2011)

MattMatt said:


> But I still loved and respected my wife. I think my problem was that I harboured resentment against my wife for her affair.



Would resentment coincide with loss of respect?


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## snap (Oct 3, 2011)

It would be hard to resent a person you respect indeed.


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## Harken Banks (Jun 12, 2012)

canttrustu said:


> How far past dday are you?


First was March 29, 2012. A few since, some recent. http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/50217-initial-foray.html#post875301

Lying and heartless indiferrence are also among the obstacles.


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## morituri (Apr 1, 2011)

canttrustu said:


> An affair is a choice.


Indeed. A bad one at that.


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## canttrustu (Feb 22, 2012)

morituri said:


> Indeed. A bad one at that.


The worst choice possible IMO.. B/c an A covers so much ground when it comes to the damage it does to the marriage. Kills the trust. Makes the person youre married to an enigma, really. I always knew an A would be hard to overcome but I really had NO idea just how hard. It has made me question *everything* I've ever known about my H and our life together. I used to think "wow. An Affair would be the end for me. I'd put him out on his a$$ and that would be that." Man, I just wish it were that easy. But it has so many layers. It effects so much in my everyday life. How I look at the world, really. And certainly, how I look at my H. 

I love him still but it has changed. I respect him but not as much as I used to. I need him but not like I did a year ago. I am hoping with all my heart that this changes with time and with proof of remorse and his showing that he really has changed. But- how do we ever really know?


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## Harken Banks (Jun 12, 2012)

morituri said:


> Indeed. A bad one at that.


A series of consistent and purposeful decisions.


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## Acabado (May 13, 2012)

I certainly lost a great deal of respect for my wife. 1) Even being remorseful in most aspects she's stuck (except she won't admit it) with the soulmate-fate thing. It's simply the last line of self protection. I find that last bit very sad.
2) Her choice for AP. POSOM was a real loser, irredeemable serial cheater, smooth talker with no future, supported by his harworking wife... If mutual friends find out they will drop to the ground as shocked as me. Unthinkable. This make me doubt her power of discernment.


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## Harken Banks (Jun 12, 2012)

Acabado said:


> This make me doubt her power of discernment.


Right! "I thought you had good taste; you chose me."


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## canttrustu (Feb 22, 2012)

Acabado said:


> I certainly lost a great deal of respect for my wife. 1) Even being remorseful in most aspects she's stuck (except she won't admit it) with the soulmate-fate thing. It's simply the last line of self protection. I find that last bit very sad.
> 2) Her choice for AP. POSOM was a real loser, irredeemable serial cheater, smooth talker with no future, supported by his harworking wife... If mutual friends find out they will drop to the ground as shocked as me. Unthinkable. This make me doubt her power of discernment.


with regards to # 2- IT didnt matter to her WHO he was or WHAT he was- she made him what she wanted him to be in her own fantasy. They ALL do it. My H's OW is a real piece of work as a person- she is professionally accomplished- but as a human being she's a POS. BUT in his mind SHE was special. SHE made him feel like he was special......easy to do when youre not dealing with reality and your spouse's ego is so fragile.

Affairs are selfish. They dont pick AP's according to their resume, they pick according to proximity and availability. Doesnt matter what kind of A$$whole that person is, what they are doing to their spouses and kids, only thing that matters is rainbows and puppy dogs. BARF!!!


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

cpacan said:


> I have been wondering about this for a while. It is said that a relationship can't last if there is a lack of respect from one or the other spouse - or both.
> 
> I tend to agree, but then you need to define respect - and being cheated on, I wonder if that equals lack of respect. Or can you actually cheat on your spouse while at the same time maintain your respect for him/her?
> 
> ...


Cheating is a total lack of respect. No question.

Lying is a total lack of respect. No question.

Doing inappropriate things when you know it is bad for your marriage is a total lack of respect. No question.

Doing unfaithful things of any kind are a total lack of respect. No question.

The only gray areas I see are those situations where a spouse is in an EA where they are in denial over what they are really into. Most folks do not realize they are being unfaithful until things get way out of hand. i.e. they tell themselves that they are just friends. I think this works exactly once. Also once they realize that they are in over thier heads there is not excuse for them not to stop disrespecting their spouse.

This if course does not cover it all. Others will define a change of heart and truthful remorse no doubt. I defer to their experiences. 

But I agree if one spouse is purposely disrespecting their spouse I think it puts great doubts as to how they can make up for this. There ahs to be a complete change of heart and mind.


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## Numb in Ohio (Oct 31, 2011)

EA's can be gray areas. My H's EA's in our marriage were with 2 women that he had PA's with in his previous marriage. 

Were they PA's during our M??,, I may never know. He doesn't even admit to sexual interest with them now. It was "just friends" since years since PA.

I lose respect when he tells me this, knowing there is more to the story, and he is begging for a second chance.


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## Falene (Dec 31, 2011)

cpacan said:


> I have been wondering about this for a while. It is said that a relationship can't last if there is a lack of respect from one or the other spouse - or both.
> 
> I tend to agree, but then you need to define respect - and being cheated on, I wonder if that equals lack of respect. Or can you actually cheat on your spouse while at the same time maintain your respect for him/her?
> 
> ...


Respect is one of those words that can mean different things to different people. Merriam-Webster defines it as the quality or act of being esteemed or being held in special regard. I know when my husband chose to have an affair I was not feeling esteemed or being held in a special regard.

Sometimes I feel like I am part of a movie where a wife wakes up in the hospital with a husband she doesn't know and tries to make a go of it.

I know that while I lost respect for my husband after his affair, I do respect, quite a bit, his continued attempt at better communication and to show me that he wants me as his wife.

Does he respect me? He says he does and that his affair had little to do with me and had everything to do with him. I feel disrespected but I also believe his affair was about him and not me...it is his reflection I see, not mine, when I look into that mirror.

Where does that leave reconciliation? I honestly don't know. I have a hard time believing this is going to work out for me and an even harder time believing it won't. I guess I am just going to have to see how it all turns out.

I would like to add that, at least for me, I feel I have nothing to lose and everything to gain by giving it my best. Either way, I will be better off for trying.


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## AngryandUsed (Jun 23, 2011)

With love, there is always respect.
With lieing and cheating, where is love?
In infidelity, love is absent.


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## cpacan (Jan 2, 2012)

Falene said:


> Respect is one of those words that can mean different things to different people. Merriam-Webster defines it as the quality or act of being esteemed or being held in special regard. I know when my husband chose to have an affair I was not feeling esteemed or being held in a special regard.
> 
> Sometimes I feel like I am part of a movie where a wife wakes up in the hospital with a husband she doesn't know and tries to make a go of it.
> 
> ...


Your post tells me that others have struggles too when looking for signs of respect, and evaluating the consequences of lack of respect. Thanks Falene


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## Son of Kong (Jul 12, 2012)

An affair is a complete lack of respect and caring, people talk about the "fog" all the time but I couldn't see myself ever holding my wife in such a low place to do anything like that to her (well before D day now my respect for her is very low). The actual physical aspect of an affair while very painful is secondary (in my opinion) to the hurt from knowing that your spouse has very little respect or caring for you. The hardest part of the "R" so far is trying to get past this very issue.


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## Sara8 (May 2, 2012)

iheartlife said:


> BSs often find they've fallen out of romantic love with their cheating spouse after the flurry of winning them back.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I think Iheart has an excellent point here cpacan. 

After my false reconciliation, I realized that I had not really won the prize even though my STBEH was no longer interested in the OW. 

I maybe got the booby prize.


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## Sara8 (May 2, 2012)

snap said:


> It would be hard to resent a person you respect indeed.


Is this really true. 

I resented some Profs in college, but I respected them. 

I remember thinking some had huge egos and were annoy, and I resented them for acting so high and mighty. Still I respected them. 

I think you can respect someone you resent.

But, can you respect someone who disrespected you so personally and in such a harmful deceitful way. 

I resented a handful of my profs, but they had not hurt me in such a very personal way, as did my STBEH.


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## mrbiggz (Dec 21, 2011)

iheartlife said:


> What I've read on the forum is more the idea that without respect, there is no love. That's obviously not strictly true, you can love a relative or friend without respecting them.
> 
> But it's tremendously hard to recover *romantic* love for a life partner without respect. And that is why BSs often find they've fallen out of romantic love with their cheating spouse after the flurry of winning them back.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I agree with Iheart's statement to the utmost. My wifey cheated on me with an alcoholic weed smoking thug and was in the process of leaving me for him. Since then, I have tried to forgive but am in the process of leaving her early next year when our lease is up.

The problem for me is that if I could look at myself and say I deserved what she did then I could forgive her. I was not at all all the way perfect and we had some things going against us like working two separate shifts allowing us only two days at home together and a newborn baby, but she still did all the manipulation techniques with the lies and deception to cover her tracks and to justify her actions. I'm simply to a point where I feel I have tried to regain respect for her but simply can't.


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## cpacan (Jan 2, 2012)

mrbiggz said:


> I agree with Iheart's statement to the utmost. My wifey cheated on me with an alcoholic weed smoking thug and was in the process of leaving me for him. Since then, I have tried to forgive but am in the process of leaving her early next year when our lease is up.
> 
> The problem for me is that if I could look at myself and say I deserved what she did then I could forgive her. I was not at all all the way perfect and we had some things going against us like working two separate shifts allowing us only two days at home together and a newborn baby, but she still did all the manipulation techniques with the lies and deception to cover her tracks and to justify her actions. I'm simply to a point where I feel I have tried to regain respect for her but simply can't.


So you are actually saying that it is _your _lack of respect that ends the marriage, if I understand it correct?


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## Sara8 (May 2, 2012)

arbitrator said:


> In my case, I richly theorize that my my STBXW looked for ways to "lose respect" for me, even while we were domiciled together, so that it might present her with some element of satisfaction in her looking at other possible suitors, all without my knowledge~ greatly to the point of EA and PA.


This is true. The shrinks call it is a way for the cheater to salve the cognitive dissonance they experience while cheating. 

A cheater still may see themselves as a good and honest person despite being a deceitful deceptive cheater....so, they suddenly have to attribute the affair to flaws in the spouse and cracks in the marriage. 

Some of the latest research, however, suggests that it is the affair that causes the problems not the other way around. 

Indeed I felt this in my own marriage. I was happy and unsuspecting. 

My STBEH never complained about me until he met the OW.

He used to brag about what a good wife I was. 

So I was confused by the turn around. 

Sadly, I later remembered other occasions over the 20 years of our marriage in which he did something similar for brief periods of time. 

He became edgy argumentative and withdrew. 

I chalked it up to work stress'

But now I think otherwise. I thing he is likely a serial cheater given that I once found condoms that we didn't use in his possession. 

So, I do agree that it is the affair that causes the problems in the marriage rather than the other way around in many many cases.


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## mrbiggz (Dec 21, 2011)

cpacan said:


> So you are actually saying that it is _your _lack of respect that ends the marriage, if I understand it correct?


Yes, that's correct. Not to say that I was perfect but for her to dispose of me like a piece of junk mail. I'm sorry, call it my pride or maybe i'm letting my ego get in the way, but like I told her back in June, "it's a wrap".


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## cpacan (Jan 2, 2012)

Well then, back to my OP - assuming the WS lost respect for the BS, is it possible to regaing respect?


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## SomedayDig (Jul 17, 2012)

cpacan said:


> Well then, back to my OP - assuming the WS lost respect for the BS, is it possible to regaing respect?


Oh. We might get it back?!?!!


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## Sara8 (May 2, 2012)

cpacan said:


> Well then, back to my OP - assuming the WS lost respect for the BS, is it possible to regaing respect?


If the Cheater lost respect for the faithful spouse, the only way to get it back, IMO, is to file for divorce and mean it. That shows that the bS in turn lost respect for the cheater.

I personally don't think that a marriage can ever be a happy one after someone cheats. 

There will always be a feeling of inequality in the relationship. The BS will always feel discarded and deceived.

Counselors are very opposed to revenge affairs as a way to show the cheater what it feels like to be replaced by another lover. 

I think a revenge affair would work to equalize the marriage.

The problem with a revenge affair is that it will likely hurt the faithful spouse in the end and it also may hurt the OP in the BS's affair. Why destroy your own code of morality for revenge?

Ask Matt Matt, he feels badly about it,and badly about hurting the OW, however it did allow his wife to experience the hurt Matt Matt felt when she cheated.


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## Count of Monte Cristo (Mar 21, 2012)

arbitrator said:


> In my case, I richly theorize that my my STBXW looked for ways to "lose respect" for me, even while we were domiciled together, so that it might present her with some element of satisfaction in her looking at other possible suitors, all without my knowledge~ greatly to the point of EA and PA.
> 
> *Then when she was actively involved in her affair(s), it gave her the needed impetus to order the "trial separation"; pretentious of trying to work some form of reconciliation out strictly as a PR ploy to deceive me, family, and friends; but knowing full-well in her heart of hearts that it would never ever come to that, but was only implemented as a unilateral precursor to the dank stairwell of divorce!*


Damm, Arbitrator, that's some really good prose. Do you write for a living?


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

Count of Monte Cristo said:


> Damm, Arbitrator, that's some really good prose. Do you write for a living?


With a BA in Business Administration; Minor's in both English and History, I worked in the Fed for the U.S. Treasury and did writing and speaking there. Also do writing and speaking for statewide sports officials association here in Texas.

So I try to take just a little bit of pride in my writing. But thank you for asking, kind sir!


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## Harken Banks (Jun 12, 2012)

Sara8 said:


> If the Cheater lost respect for the faithful spouse, the only way to get it back, IMO, is to file for divorce and mean it. That shows that the bS in turn lost respect for the cheater.
> 
> I personally don't think that a marriage can ever be a happy one after someone cheats.
> 
> ...


Pretty sure I am not the only one here who does not "get" the revenge affair. NTTAWWT, just don't get it -revenge as motive for affair or any relationship.


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## Harken Banks (Jun 12, 2012)

And how good can the affair be if it's about someone who is not a party to it?


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## Sara8 (May 2, 2012)

Harken Banks said:


> Pretty sure I am not the only one here who does not "get" the revenge affair. NTTAWWT, just don't get it -revenge as motive for affair or any relationship.


A revenge affair is meant to hurt the cheating spouse. 

I don't think it means that there is no basis for attraction to the affair partner sexually or emotionally. 

I agree it is no way to start a relationship, but an affair is not really a relationship, it is an affair. 

Personally I think a loooong break from all relationships for a BS is required after divorcing a spouse who had an affair. 

Still, I do think if a BS has an affair it will show the cheating spouse how much pain such actions cause. 

I am have actually read this on other support forums. 

Some claim having the affair prevented the cheating spouse from cheating again and leveled the playing field so both could move forward.

Unless the original cheating spouse is a narcissist. In that case, they will not be hurt by their spouses revenge affair or any affair, they will just move on to the next victim.


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## notreadytoquit (Jan 11, 2010)

Count of Monte Cristo said:


> Damm, Arbitrator, that's some really good prose. Do you write for a living?


That's exactly what my ex h did. Before i had a prove of his affair we went to IC but he had no intention to work on the marriage. So now he can tell friends: " yes we tried counselling and it did not work" . Still to this day he does not admit his affair and he pretty much lives with the OW. We have been now divorced for 2 years.

As for respect i have none left and i really cant imagine ever getting it back.


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## canttrustu (Feb 22, 2012)

Harken Banks said:


> First was March 29, 2012. A few since, some recent. http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/50217-initial-foray.html#post875301
> 
> Lying and heartless indiferrence are also among the obstacles.


I so understand EVERYTHING you say here. And NOW suddenly they love you SO much????? I cant comprehend it.


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## Sara8 (May 2, 2012)

canttrustu said:


> I so understand EVERYTHING you say here. And NOW suddenly they love you SO much????? I cant comprehend it.


I agree

That's the part that really upsets me. 

After initially blaming me for his affair and rewriting the marital history. Now he insists I am the best wife a guy could have and now he is lamenting that some other guy is going to get his nice wife. 

WTF. Where was that line of thinking when he was boffing the OW and complaining to her about me by email as he lay right next to me in bed. 

It is definitely shows a lack of respect. 

And, now, quite honestly knowing that he is a Liar and a cheat who only admitted the truth because I already had proof positive of the truth, I have totally lost respect for him. 

IMO, without respect and trust, there can be no serious relationship, lover, friend or otherwise. 

:rant:


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## Lovemytruck (Jul 3, 2012)

Canttrustu and Sara8, thanks for your last posts! Your thoughts continue to provide sanity and clarity by validating my experience. 

This forum has been a godsend to me for the past two years.

Sorry for the brief hhijacking of this thread.


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## underwater2010 (Jun 27, 2012)

While the cheating showed a definte lack of respect....I believe the respect was gained back by willingness to try the big R. What a huge gift we have bestowed upon ouw WSs. To me the ulimate act of disrespect would be a second affair.


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## Sara8 (May 2, 2012)

underwater2010 said:


> While the cheating showed a definte lack of respect....I believe the respect was gained back by willingness to try the big R. What a huge gift we have bestowed upon ouw WSs. To me the ulimate act of disrespect would be a second affair.


Good point.

I did try R. I thought all was well. 

The problem is, at least in my case, that had I not received anonymous letters outing my STBEH's continued contact with the OW, just to talk, and other negative activities, not with her, he was engaging in, I would have gone on believing he was behaving and would have regained trust. An undeserved trust.


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## Miss Taken (Aug 18, 2012)

iheartlife said:


> But it's tremendously hard to recover *romantic* love for a life partner without respect. And that is why BSs often find they've fallen out of romantic love with their cheating spouse after the flurry of winning them back.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Boy do I wish I found this thread earlier. The above rings so true to the way I feel right now. I recently realized, that I have lost all respect for my WS - not only for his cheating but for the way he acted after being caught. Actually the way he acted (with cowardice and denial) is what did me in, in terms of losing respect. 

Before that, I always took for granted how important MY NEED to respect my partner is. Now that it's gone, I'm not sure if I can get it back - or if he is even capable of earning it back. It was an integral part of the foundation of our relationship and I don't think I can rebuild on sand.


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## akashNil (May 20, 2012)

Miss Taken said:


> I recently realized, that I have lost all respect for my WS - not only for his cheating *but for the way he acted after being caught.* Actually the way he acted (with cowardice and denial) is what did me in, in terms of losing respect.
> 
> Before that, I always took for granted how important MY NEED to respect my partner is. Now that it's gone, I'm not sure if I can get it back - or if he is even capable of earning it back. *It was an integral part of the foundation of our relationship and I don't think I can rebuild on sand.*


Exactly. Same sentiments as mine. The last sentence says it all.


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

So CPA

Where are you now?

I reread all your threads today and was wondering since most of your threads are over a year old where you are in your head, heart and marriage?

HM64


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## cpacan (Jan 2, 2012)

happyman64 said:


> So CPA
> 
> Where are you now?
> 
> ...


Well, I don't post much about myself anymore, but when I do, it's mostly in the Reconciliation thread. But I'll try to write a short update - thanks for asking


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## Vega (Jan 8, 2013)

Chiming in late...

I think the foundation, if not, _the_ definition of respect is:

*Treating others the way you would want to be treated.*
That's 'respect', in a nutshell. 

I don't think there's a single cheater who would want to be cheated on. The only way they could cheat on us is if they put themselves--that is, their _OWN_ 'happiness' *ABOVE* _ours_. 

If they respected us, they would put OUR happiness on the same 'plane' as their own. They would recognize that they would not want US to conduct secret conversations with anyone...wouldn't want us to find someone more attractive than THEM...would feel sad and angry if WE allowed someone else to 'cut ahead' of them in OUR lives. 

To me, the Golden Rule is THE epitome of respect.

Vega


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## calvin (Jan 7, 2012)

During the A ther is zero respect for the bs,I dont think they have much for their children either
If they are willing to break up for the family for a scumbag loser.
My wifes AP was cheating on his long time girlfriend.
I dont think they even respected themselves.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Lovemytruck (Jul 3, 2012)

Vega said:


> Chiming in late...
> 
> I think the foundation, if not, _the_ definition of respect is:
> 
> ...


:iagree::iagree::iagree:


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## Truthseeker1 (Jul 17, 2013)

Sara8 said:


> A revenge affair is meant to hurt the cheating spouse.
> 
> I don't think it means that there is no basis for attraction to the affair partner sexually or emotionally.
> 
> ...


:iagree: The older I get the more agnostic I am about RAs..I do think in some cases they have the desired effect. some cheaters need to get a nice healthy dose of their own medicine. They need the same mind movies you have....


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## TryingToRecover (Dec 19, 2012)

Truthseeker1 said:


> :iagree: The older I get the more agnostic I am about RAs..I do think in some cases they have the desired effect. some cheaters need to get a nice healthy dose of their own medicine. They need the same mind movies you have....


I tend to agree too. When I was at a point where I was angrier about the affair I entertained the idea of an RA. I didn't act on the idea whatsoever but for those moments when I felt/feel like the playing field should be more level...in theory it wouldn't have hurt me too much to see him coping with those mind movies himself. Just can't see myself 'going there.'
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Healer (Jun 5, 2013)

I can't think of anything more disrespectful than cheating on your spouse.


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## calvin (Jan 7, 2012)

An RA solves nothing.
Yes I would want her to get a taste of the pain but a RA just hurts more people.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Truthseeker1 (Jul 17, 2013)

TryingToRecover said:


> I tend to agree too. When I was at a point where I was angrier about the affair I entertained the idea of an RA. I didn't act on the idea whatsoever but for those moments when I felt/feel like the playing field should be more level...in theory it wouldn't have hurt me too much to see him coping with those mind movies himself. *Just can't see myself 'going there.'*
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I totally understand. But I am also skeptical of an RA damaging all BS further. It might to some but not necessarily all BS. I guess my point has always been there is no one road to take....some WS have an ego so big that the thought of their partner cheating on them is just what is needed to deflate their egos.


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## cpacan (Jan 2, 2012)

Agreeing on an open marriage - just for a short while, is probably enough to shake many WS and make them wish they had not gone there in the first place.

Often the openness and lack of secrecy isn't as appealing as the affair fantacy. But it would require respect on both sides.


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## carmen ohio (Sep 24, 2012)

cpacan said:


> I have been wondering about this for a while. It is said that a relationship can't last if there is a lack of respect from one or the other spouse - or both.
> 
> I tend to agree, but then you need to define respect - and being cheated on, I wonder if that equals lack of respect. Or can you actually cheat on your spouse while at the same time maintain your respect for him/her?
> 
> ...





cpacan said:


> That's exactly why I ask the question. I tend to think that infidelity is as disrespectfull as it gets, but the again, I don't carry the mindset of a cheater.
> 
> So I am just wondering if I can regain respect if it was there in the first place, that is.
> 
> ...


Dear cpacan,

Great thread. Thanks for starting it.

It seems to me that there are a couple of discussions going on here (and maybe more than just a couple). One involves the question of whether the act of adultery means that the WS respects (or necessarily disrespects) the BS. Another is whether respect, once lost, can be regained (and this one has two threads -- regained by a WS for the BS and regained by a BS for a FWS).

There is no right answer, of course, because, as Falene pointed out, "respect" means different things to different people. That said, I believe there is a basis for approaching the question analytically. What is that?

First, it requires recognition of the fact that "respect," like "love," is a multifaceted concept. If involves both "feelings" and and "actions" (or the lack of action). So one can ask if the WS has feelings of respect for the BS (or vice versa in the case of the BS and the FWS) as well as whether the WS acts respectfully towards the BS.

Second, it needs to be recognized that their are degrees of respect, both with regard to the feelings and actions aspects of the condition. One can feel little or great respect for another and one's actions can demonstrate more or less respect. I would point out that, while the two are related (generally, we act with respect towards the people we have respect for), there is not necessarily a one-to-one correlation. We sometimes act disrespectfully toward those who we respect greatly. But, if measured over time, the degree of correlation will be strong.

Third, given that each of us displays a large number of strengths and weaknesses, it is important to recognize the one can have respect for one aspect of another person but not respect other aspects. I happen to respect greatly Woody Allen's talents as a film maker. I disrespect some of his lifestyle choices.

So, putting this all together, let's ask the first question: can a WS still respect the BS while an affair is on-going or does the act of infidelity necessarily mean that the WS disrespect the BS?

Looking at the question from the feelings vs. action standpoint, and based upon the accumulated wisdom of TAM/CWI, I think most would agree that, in most cases, the WS has lost a large measure of his/her feelings of respect for the BS. Indeed, it seems that a necessary precursor for an affair is a loss of respect for the BS (consider that, in the standard cheating script, the AP and WS usually discuss the state of the WS's marriage and the BS's supposed failings before anything physical happens). Moreover, as this loss of feelings of respect progresses, the affair often heats up, going from inappropriate conversations to exchanging pictures or gifts (including the gift of time spent with the AP) and finally culminating in sexual infidelity. I would go so far as to say that, unless and until a WS loses most of his/her feelings of respect for the BS, the affair cannot happen. Indeed, in my opinion, what sets an EA apart from a healthy relationship between a married person and a person other than his/her spouse is the lack of respect for the spouse. I have relationships with a large number of woman other than my W -- woman I work with, women at church, women my W and I socialize with, etc. -- but I have the utmost respect for my W and therefore maintains appropriate relationships with these women. If I were ever to start to lose my feelings of respect for my W, it is conceivable that one of these relationships could develop into something involving disrespectful actions, but not until then.

One of the implications of this -- and we see this all the time on TAM/CWI -- is that it is important for the health of a marriage that both partners maintain the respect of the other partner. It's often said here that an affair is totally the fault of the WS but, in truth, in many if not most cases the BS overlooked warning signs, failed to take action, went along with things that should have been stopped and generally displayed a lack of respect for him/herself that in all likelihood led to the WS losing respect for the BS and thereby contributed or even opened the door to the affair.

Likewise, we've seen over and over again that, in order for a marriage to be saved, a WS must first regain the feeling of respect for the BS. Generally, this requires the BS to stand up for him/herself, for example, by filing for divorce. In the case of BHs, we often urge him to "man up" on the basis that, until he does, his WW cannot regain her feeling of respect for him and reconciliation cannot commence.

Interestingly, while either of these processes is taking place (the WS beginning to lose respect at the beginning of an affair or beginning to regain respect at its end), the WS's actions may or may not be disrespectful. At the begining, the WS may not engage in any inappropriate behavior or conversations until the loss of respect is considerable and, at the end, the WS may continue to engage in disrespectful behavior while he/she is beginning to regain respect. So, from the POV of a BS's who is attempting reconciliation, it is important to distinguish between the WS's apparent feelings of respect for the BS (or lack thereof) and the WS's actions (which may be more or less respectful).

This also implies the need for constant vigilance in order to protect the marriage. Just because your S is not yet doing anything disrespectful, if he/she is displaying behavior that could lead to a loss of the feeling of respect if left unchecked (e.g., spending a lot of time chatting on line with another man/woman), the other S should put an end to it precisely in order to retain the first S's respect. Likewise, while one cannot say that a WS is acting respectfully toward the BS as long as an affair continues, a BS who wants to save his/her marriage is well advised to act in a way the increases the likelihood of the WS regaining the feeling of respect for the BS.

Sorry for posting such a long response but I think it important that the issue of respect be separately analyzed and understood in every infidelity situation. IMO, healthy marriages are based as much on respect as on love, maybe even more on respect because love is an even more slippery concept and changeable emotion. And, in this regard, each S must both have feelings of respect for the other and must act with respect toward the other. While the two (feelings and action) are different, they are inexorably connected such that, each S would be well-advised to consider from time-to-time both the degree of their feelings of respect for the other S and whether the other S's actions indicate that respect for them is being maintained.

Finally, I'll just add that, IMO, the most common contributor to marital breakdown that I've observed on TAM/CWI is the BS's lack of self-respect. If you do not respect yourself, you cannot expect others (including your spouse) to respect you. Maybe this issue deserves its own thread.

Again, thanks for starting this thread. I look forward to learning more posters' views and opinions.


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## hopefulgirl (Feb 12, 2013)

In the case of some WS's, such as mine, there was also a serious lack of self-respect (in feelings and actions) at the time of the affair. He was at a very low point in terms of his mental health. 

He had had a panic attack earlier in the year, and got on medication that the doc said would hopefully be short term if he got into therapy. After doing some counseling that gave him skills to help with his anxiety symptoms, he was given a lower dose of medication. Unfortunately, he was also having some depressive symptoms that the medication had been helping, so lowering the dose made those more prominent. To make matters worse he then decided on his own to wean off the medication before the doc gave the go ahead, and he started cutting the pills in half, then taking half a pill every other day. That amount of medication was like being on no medication at all. (I found this out after I found out about the affair.)

The "opportunity" to be a knight in shining armor for a woman who was looking for a man presented itself. And when his self-respect was as low as it was, crossing the line was a lot easier. He has said he wasn't in his "right mind." I think that's true. He wasn't acting like the person he thinks he should be, the person I thought he was - it was so unlike him. At such a low point, he didn't respect himself enough to care.

Yes, he didn't have much respect for me at the time either, but in his mildly depressed mental state (and still dealing with his anxiety issues) he didn't have much respect for himself, me, the OW, or much of the rest of the human race (though he went through the motions of everyday life, trying to keep up a front - his disappearing for hours at a time into his hobbies was one way he "hid" his problems). 

When the affair was discovered, he dropped her like a hot potato. At least I didn't have to worry about his having been "in love" with the affair partner, like some people do.

So respect is a big issue in infidelity, but it may start with a serious lack of self-respect in the WS, which may mean their mental state is such that they are also incapable of respecting (or caring much about) anybody else either.


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## TimesOfChange (Mar 20, 2013)

Either there hasn't been any respect to begin with or following the 0815 cheater script, they simply downgrade their respect level for you...so from their point of view it's ok.

Love you but not in love with you = i respect you like a brother/sister and therefor it's ok to screw around with someone else.

Cheaters and Rating Agencies, they know how to make s hit look shiny.


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## TryingToRecover (Dec 19, 2012)

Truthseeker1 said:


> I totally understand. But I am also skeptical of an RA damaging all BS further. It might to some but not necessarily all BS. I guess my point has always been there is no one road to take....some WS have an ego so big that the thought of their partner cheating on them is just what is needed to deflate their egos.


I just don't think I would do it, an RA. I believe the vast majority of WS's are drama queens/kings - not all but likely most - and I'm too old/tired/over it to mess with drama anymore, especially of the affair type. More importantly, I also would want no part in ruining anyone else's life, be it my husband's or the wife of a OM. 

Funny thing is about the affair that did take place, if I had been the WS and my husband the BS, I'm not so sure we'd be 
reconciling post affair. It probably would have been too much of a hit to his ego. I've asked him about that theoretically and he claims he'd be willing to R if I had been the cheater but I don't believe it for a second. I think it would deflate his ego beyond relationship repair to be cheated on. WS is in his early 50's but every so often he still mentions a GF from his college days who cheated on him and ran off and married the other guy. I'm in my late 40's and I dated the same guy all through HS and some after. He cheated on me at some point but I rarely think about the BF or the cheating at this point....don't care and haven't in a long time.


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## calvin (Jan 7, 2012)

TryingToRecover said:


> I just don't think I would do it, an RA. I believe the vast majority of WS's are drama queens/kings - not all but likely most - and I'm too old/tired/over it to mess with drama anymore, especially of the affair type. More importantly, I also would want no part in ruining anyone else's life, be it my husband's or the wife of a OM.
> 
> Funny thing is about the affair that did take place, if I had been the WS and my husband the BS, I'm not so sure we'd be
> reconciling post affair. It probably would have been too much of a hit to his ego. I've asked him about that theoretically and he claims he'd be willing to R if I had been the cheater but I don't believe it for a second. I think it would deflate his ego beyond relationship repair to be cheated on. WS is in his early 50's but every so often he still mentions a GF from his college days who cheated on him and ran off and married the other guy. I'm in my late 40's and I dated the same guy all through HS and some after. He cheated on me at some point but I rarely think about the BF or the cheating at this point....don't care and haven't in a long time.


Thats kind of sad,I feel for you.
My wife spent years looking up her old hs bf,brought him up a cople times a year.
She found him 18 months ago,he's a loser and a ex-con but she still wanted him.
Meetings happend a few times but no physical stuff besides the kisses,I know this for a fact.
The I love yous broke my fvcking heart.
18 months into R,she is doing all the right things and is truely sorry.
I just dont think I want to try anymore,hurts too much.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## librarydragon (Aug 20, 2011)

Choosing not to have sex with your husband/wife is a bad choice.

Choosing to verbally/emotionally/physically abuse your husband/wife is a bad choice.

Choosing to give your sexual self to porn over your husband/wife is a bad choice.

Choosing to neglect your husband/wife over TV, golf with your buddies, work, or FOO is a bad choice.

One bad choice is often the starting point for another bad choice. I'm sorry, but I'm so tired of the threads that start, "I was addicted to porn, but..." OR "I had anger issues, but..." OR "I spent all my free time playing video games, but..."

Arg. Nevermind.


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## hookares (Dec 7, 2011)

It would depend on the definition used for "last".
If you mean"forever", then it would take a lot of respect by both.
If "last" means for 20 years, then respect isn't necessarily required 
since one party may not be aware that he or she isn't respected.


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## cpacan (Jan 2, 2012)

carmen ohio said:


> Again, thanks for starting this thread. I look forward to learning more posters' views and opinions.


And thanks for a well written and thoughtfull post - it was something like this I was looking for at the time I started the thread.

I've seen another thread somewhere, where a poster made the same distinction regarding "Love" - love as a feeling and love as an action.

I have learned a lot since this thread started, and I tend to believe that nothing is that black and white, really. 
As for respect... well my wife tells me that she probably didn't respect me before, but that she does respect me now, since I've changed so much. I don't know if I can or should believe that, but I really don't think much about it either - she can stay if she wants to, if not, she can leave. I'll be just fine in any case - I don't think I realized this during the first many months past D-day.

For myself, I can recognize the distinction between respecting her as a person, which I do, but not respecting her choices and ways of mending broken connections and trust.

All in all, I'm at a much better place now, no blinders, seeing real life for what it is, which is not the fairy tale. Very good at taking care of my own business and letting others take care of their own. Personal growth I'd like to believe.


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## DoneIn (Aug 1, 2017)

I am new here. D Day was June 15 and my partner of 20 years favored Korean massage parlor prostitutes for three years, and apparently porn throughout our relationship. A real prize, don't you think? I had a lot of respect and did many significant things to show him that during our relationship. I don't respect him now. I think of him as weak minded, low character, and a low life. Its hard to hold all these new impressions in my head with what I thought of him in the past. Lots of counseling. Still very confused. He wants to work it out and is trying SO hard to do so, but I believe, even if we get back together, that I will always think I got the booby prize. Comments welcome from those who are further advanced through all of this.


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## DoneIn (Aug 1, 2017)

canttrustu said:


> I believe that a cheater lacks respect for ANYONE-themselves included- AP included. If the cheater respected his/her spouse, they wouldnt do such a disrespectful thing as dishonoring their vows. If they respected the AP-they wouldnt string them along as they always do or misrepresent themselves as they always do. If they respected themselves they wouldnt allow themselves to sink so low.
> 
> So no- I dont believe he had respect for me. He cheated and thought me too dumb to find out. Thats not respect.
> 
> Now we're in R(dday in February, NC in May) and its ME who lacks respect for HIM. I dont view him as the man I married. Its like being married to a stranger. Ive learned so much about him that makes respecting him a challenge. I hope thats temporary. And rather or not he respects me now I guess remains to be seen.



Canttrustu , Thanks for posting. I am attempting recovery and wondering, at the end of recovery, what do I really have? I thought I had a man of integrity and fidelity, and now I know I have a man with an insensitive conscious, capable of using prostitutes for three years, and capable of taking all the good I had to offer, both emotionally and physically, while sneaking, lying and cheating on me. Oh joy! So I am working through recovery for what? To get to a pieced back together, VERY damaged, relationship? Is it worth it? There's the big question. Do I really truly believe I cannot find someone out there who has integrity, values and morals? There's another big question for all of us. Does someone who has proven they can cheat, lie and disrespect you at this level even deserve a chance back into the life of a person who would never do that to them? Maybe they should all find each other, and hook up, instead of polluting the hearts and lives of those who hold them dear.


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## DoneIn (Aug 1, 2017)

Harken Banks said:


> Well that's an interesting take. Say it ain't so.


I have to say it is so, unfortunately. That doesn't mean you don't have sex with them - we all have needs. But, romantically, wow you are so right. That entire spark is gone for me, at 5 months out. I think romantic love would just make me too vulnerable, unless it was with someone who hadn't done so much damage. Romance is a very special place reserved for those who deserve it together.


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## DoneIn (Aug 1, 2017)

MattMatt said:


> I cheated (it was a 'revenge' affair) yet I still respected my wife, very much. I think what broke my heart about my behaviour was that I could hurt someone who I loved and respected so much.


Believe me, being on the other side of a man who professed love and respect while deceiving, lying and cheating...its the most confusing and mind boggling experience of my life. I do believe
my SO loved and respected me. I also believe he was passive aggressive and harbored years of resentment going all the way back to his childhood. Picked his best friend to take it out on - precious! I also believe he wanted the indulgence of Korean massage parlor prostitutes and never even attempted to express his needs or concerns to me. You gave up SO MUCH and you took SO MUCH from your loved partner. I have no idea how either side ever comes to peace about it.


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## TBT (Dec 20, 2011)

@DoneIn You do know that you're replying to a 4 year old thread,right? Don't know if you'll get any interaction.


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## DoneIn (Aug 1, 2017)

MattMatt said:


> I cheated (it was a 'revenge' affair) yet I still respected my wife, very much. I think what broke my heart about my behaviour was that I could hurt someone who I loved and respected so much.


Believe me, being on the other side of a man who professed love and respect while deceiving, lying and cheating...its the most confusing and mind boggling experience of my life. I do believe
my SO loved and respected me. I also believe he was passive aggressive and harbored years of resentment going all the way back to his childhood. Picked his best friend to take it out on - precious! I also believe he wanted the indulgence of Korean massage parlor prostitutes and never even attempted to express his needs or concerns to me. You gave up SO MUCH and you took SO MUCH from your loved partner. I have no idea how either side ever comes to peace about it.


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## DoneIn (Aug 1, 2017)

TBT said:


> @DoneIn You do know that you're replying to a 4 year old thread,right? Don't know if you'll get any interaction.


People like me come aboard to read these threads and see how others cope and feel. So, that its four years old means nothing to someone coming in and researching to learn more about how others feel and handle this very difficult topic.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

TBT said:


> @DoneIn You do know that you're replying to a 4 year old thread,right? Don't know if you'll get any interaction.


Well, I'm still here! 

Still married, too, so there is that!


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## blahfridge (Dec 6, 2014)

I'll jump in too. 

I honestly don't believe that you can profess to love someone and do something that is so profoundly disrespectful. To his credit, when my H first admitted to an affair, he didn't follow it up with any "I love you" declarations. It wasn't until I had an EA that he suddenly decided he couldn't live without me. Funny how that happens. I think a lot of the times what a spouse thinks of as love is actually ownership, the comfort of home. We are still together, but I don't know that I'll ever trust that my H truly loves me. I think he simply saw what he was in danger of losing.


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

cpacan said:


> I have been wondering about this for a while. It is said that a relationship can't last if there is a lack of respect from one or the other spouse - or both.
> 
> I tend to agree, but then you need to define respect - and being cheated on, I wonder if that equals lack of respect. Or can you actually cheat on your spouse while at the same time maintain your respect for him/her?
> 
> ...


If you cheat on people who love you how can you even respect yourself. I don't think people who cheat even get the concept of respect in the way the people who would never cheat do. And you didn't even get into the loyalty aspect. 

My advice is don't waste time trying to understand him. Let me ask you could you do this? I am assuming you are one of these humans like me who couldn't do it firstly just because of the guilt, let alone respect. 

Your husband is a phony. There are many who are not. 

The truth is it's like two types of humans, the ones who can cheat and the ones who would never cheat. It sucks for the latter when they get tricked into marrying the former, but you don't need to compound the problem with sticking around.

Instead of wondering and agonizing about this it's better to come to terms with the fact that in life everything ends. Your marriage was eventually going to end, it just happened sooner then you thought. By all means grieve the loss but move on. Life is too short to have a husband who goes to prostitutes. Time is finite. 

However your life is not over.


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

blahfridge said:


> I'll jump in too.
> 
> I honestly don't believe that you can profess to love someone and do something that is so profoundly disrespectful. To his credit, when my H first admitted to an affair, he didn't follow it up with any "I love you" declarations. It wasn't until I had an EA that he suddenly decided he couldn't live without me. Funny how that happens. I think a lot of the times what a spouse thinks of as love is actually ownership, the comfort of home. We are still together, but I don't know that I'll ever trust that my H truly loves me. I think he simply saw what he was in danger of losing.


Love to them is "you make me feel good." That is not love, love is an action, a gift, a choice, it really has nothing to do with the person giving the love in the sense that it should not be about what that person gets from it. It should always be a giving action.


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## fotf17 (Sep 25, 2017)

DoneIn said:


> People like me come aboard to read these threads and see how others cope and feel. So, that its four years old means nothing to someone coming in and researching to learn more about how others feel and handle this very difficult topic.


He's just saying that the people you're tagging and responding to might not actually be around anymore, so you might not get any reactions or feedback from them. From others, you surely will.


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## TBT (Dec 20, 2011)

DoneIn said:


> People like me come aboard to read these threads and see how others cope and feel. So, that its four years old means nothing to someone coming in and researching to learn more about how others feel and handle this very difficult topic.


Just thought I was giving you a heads up. Some posters are unaware at times.


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## DoneIn (Aug 1, 2017)

Such good points here and well taken. Are you still with your cheating husband?


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## SpicyGinger (Nov 18, 2017)

This is just my opinion, but cheating has nothing to do with respect. I am pretty sure that Bill Clinton had a ton of respect for Hillary. Enter: Monica Lewinsky. I think it is more of a man/ woman thing. Men cheat usually because of the lack of sexual intimacy. They're not getting it at home, they get it somewhere else. There's also the aspect of super successful men cheating because they think they won't get caught, will get away with it, or have "earned" the right to do so. Men like Clinton, Tiger Woods, Anthony Weiner... all men who thought they were "entitled" and wouldn't get caught. Men will cheat on their wives whether they are a successful attorney or a stay at home mom. Respect has nothing to do with it. Women cheat because their emotional needs aren't being met. Either way you slice it, in the actual moment of having sex outside your marriage, most people aren't thinking about their spouse to begin with.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

SpicyGinger said:


> This is just my opinion, but cheating has nothing to do with respect. I am pretty sure that Bill Clinton had a ton of respect for Hillary. Enter: Monica Lewinsky. I think it is more of a man/ woman thing. Men cheat usually because of the lack of sexual intimacy. They're not getting it at home, they get it somewhere else. There's also the aspect of super successful men cheating because they think they won't get caught, will get away with it, or have "earned" the right to do so. Men like Clinton, Tiger Woods, Anthony Weiner... all men who thought they were "entitled" and wouldn't get caught. Men will cheat on their wives whether they are a successful attorney or a stay at home mom. Respect has nothing to do with it. Women cheat because their emotional needs aren't being met. Either way you slice it, in the actual moment of having sex outside your marriage, most people aren't thinking about their spouse to begin with.


That's very simplistic. 

People, men, women, cheat for a variety of reasons.

There's no single reason all male cheaters cheat. Nor is there a single reason why all female cheaters cheat.


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## RWB (Feb 6, 2010)

TBT said:


> @DoneIn You do know that you're replying to a 4 year old thread,right? Don't know if you'll get any interaction.


Hard to keep a *"good" Zombie down*. :grin2:

BTW... In regard to Love and Respect. How many of us at DD+ heard this one from the cheater's mouth?

_"You have to believe me, I never stopped loving you!"
_


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## Rocky Mountain Yeti (Apr 23, 2017)

cpacan said:


> I have been wondering about this for a while. It is said that a relationship can't last if there is a lack of respect from one or the other spouse - or both.
> 
> I tend to agree, but then you need to define respect - and being cheated on, *I wonder if that equals lack of respect. *Or can you actually cheat on your spouse while at the same time maintain your respect for him/her?
> 
> ...


'Infidelity' and 'respect' are words which should never be used in the same sentence.


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## DoneIn (Aug 1, 2017)

RWB said:


> Hard to keep a *"good" Zombie down*. :grin2:
> 
> BTW... In regard to Love and Respect. How many of us at DD+ heard this one from the cheater's mouth?
> 
> ...


Yes, I heard that. Why do they want you to believe that? No one who loves (love being a verb) another would hurt them and the relationship in that way. They must be confused about what love actually is....


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## DoneIn (Aug 1, 2017)

I found this very helpful in my own issue of infidelity 

Overcoming Infidelity | National Marriage Seminars


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

DoneIn said:


> Yes, I heard that. Why do they want you to believe that? No one who loves (love being a verb) another would hurt them and the relationship in that way. They must be confused about what love actually is....


That is it. For them love has not loyalty component to it. It's a kind of superficial love that revolves around self. This is why I would never advise on taking them back. There love is defective. When it comes to long term relationships they are a lemon.


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## DoneIn (Aug 1, 2017)

Overcoming Infidelity | National Marriage Seminars


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