# Trying things out



## Ynot

So since my divorce I have been trying to figure out what it is that I want. So far I have been in several longer term relationships and a few shorter ones. 
The first relationship I got into was with a 55 year old woman who really liked to party. Way too much for me. She was petite and she smoked. She also liked to have sex which was great and the more she drank the hornier and kinkier she got. She had been married for a long time (20+years) and had grown children and was self employed. This one did not end well, although I escaped getting arrested. This lasted about 3 months.
Second up was a 54 year old woman I had a 6 month relationship with. She had been married twice before but could not have children. She was average build about 5'7". She enjoyed sex but was rather limited in what she would try. I really wasn't ready to be in a relationship and I sort of went thru the motions. We ended this one mutually and remain friends to this day.
Third up was a younger woman (mid 40's). She was taller at 5'11". She had two younger kids at home. I never met them. She would give me BJs but never let me have intercourse with her. We went out for over a month. She finally ended it when I got back from a vacation.
Next up was a totally BSC 56 year old woman. She was very petite as well as being extremely high maintenance. She enjoyed sex, and was willing to do almost anything, but some of those things came with strings attached. It started off OK but then she started trying to control me and tried to tell me what I should do and how I should think. I broke up with her early on, but then I allowed her to "explain" that it was all a mistake. Needless to say the "reconciliation" did not last long. When I finally broke up with her for good, she stalked me for weeks. 
Then I dated a shorter heavier woman (mainly because she had big tits to be honest). She was 58 and as I got to know she started looking a lot older than that. She enjoyed sex but she was overly aggressive and wanted to dominate me (which I did not like). We broke up. 
Then I had a FWB, who is still a friend and would probably have sex with me if I were to ask. I didn't enjoy the purely physical sex we had as much as I thought I would. She would do anything, even asking me to do things I wasn't into like some heavier BDSM.
After that I dated a woman with 4 kids. Two of them were minors. All of them lived at her house. She truly enjoyed sex and practically nothing was off limits. Eventually time constraints lead us to call it off. I met her kids although I never spent much time them. So there was no attachment. We had a lot in common, She was very tall (6') and well educated. We shared many similar outlooks on life. We dated for about 4 months.

So now I am embarking on another adventure. I have been texting and chatting with a woman that lives about 90 miles away. We have discussed a long distance relationship. She visits this area regularly as she has family here. I visit her area fairly often for work and because I have family there. My only experience with a long distance relationship was when I was very young and with my first GF. It didn't go well then. Too many distractions. Now, most of those distractions are gone and I am much more at peace with my life, more protective of my freedoms and space and can see how this might work.

So I continue to experiment in hopes of finding something that I can be truly comfortable with.


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## Herschel

YNot?


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## jlcrome

Damn man you seem to test drive them all don't you. Are you somehow related to Ron Jeremy? that was a joke hey I like sex too man but geez if you want a commited relationship you gotta start things at a slower pace.


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## chillymorn69

Hmm,

Looking for perfection?

Mayge your not really up for a long term relationship.

Which is cool.


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## Evinrude58

Just wanted to wish you luck. It's hard to find the one. Still looking as well.


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## sokillme

What happened to your ex and kids?


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## Elizabeth001

Man...I got tired just reading that. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## happy as a clam

Honestly, that all sounds exhausting.

Maybe it’s time to drop out of the dating scene for awhile. Spend some time alone and find out what really brings you peace and joy.


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## Satya

I'm not trying to dissuade you, but long distance isn't going to be easy. In your circumstance I'd say, don't date anyone who isn't less than a 30 minute drive from you. That way, your brain has less chance to paint the picture you want, and you can clearly see and experience the reality.

How long were you living alone, divorced, before you started dating? If you didn't live alone for a time, you might have shortchanged your ability to reflect on what you want.

You do not seem too choosy, and for some of those women, you knew they were throwing red flags and yet remained.

So what DO you want? Hypothetical question to consider in your own time.

No one is perfect, but you can define the MOST important qualities you need in a partner.


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## Married but Happy

Ynot said:


> So now I am embarking on another adventure. I have been texting and chatting with a woman that lives about 90 miles away. We have discussed a long distance relationship. She visits this area regularly as she has family here. I visit her area fairly often for work and because I have family there. My only experience with a long distance relationship was when I was very young and with my first GF. It didn't go well then. Too many distractions. Now, most of those distractions are gone and I am much more at peace with my life, more protective of my freedoms and space and can see how this might work.
> 
> So I continue to experiment in hopes of finding something that I can be truly comfortable with.


I was a kid in a candy store when I left my ex, and enjoyed a variety to women - but, none that didn't actually have potential (as far as I could tell that early on).

My three best prospects were all long distance (100 mi., 170 mi., and 8000 mi.). The farthest wasn't sustainable, and there were other legal and logistical issues that couldn't be solved. The other two could have worked - and one did. A 100 mile drive isn't really that bad on good highways, so we saw each other every weekend, and occasionally during the week. When it got serious, I telecommuted from her place, and then we got a place together. After a massive layoff where I worked, we picked up and moved far away. Anyway, the point is that moderate distance isn't necessarily an issue, but eventually one of you must relocate. If that isn't possible, then seek someone closer.


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## Ynot

sokillme said:


> What happened to your ex and kids?


I just spent the holidays with my kids. Haven't spoken with or about my ex since she tried the Charlie Brown with the football thing on me two years ago.


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## Ynot

Satya said:


> I'm not trying to dissuade you, but long distance isn't going to be easy. In your circumstance I'd say, don't date anyone who isn't less than a 30 minute drive from you. That way, your brain has less chance to paint the picture you want, and you can clearly see and experience the reality.
> 
> How long were you living alone, divorced, before you started dating? If you didn't live alone for a time, you might have shortchanged your ability to reflect on what you want.
> 
> You do not seem too choosy, and for some of those women, you knew they were throwing red flags and yet remained.
> 
> So what DO you want? Hypothetical question to consider in your own time.
> 
> No one is perfect, but you can define the MOST important qualities you need in a partner.


I am not looking for perfection. But I spent 25 years giving myself away to the point of not knowing who I am or what I want. I didn't date as much as I should have before I got married. I had expectations I was living up to and never explored to find out whether those expectations were mine or someone else's. Heck I wasn't even aware I was doing it. Now I am exploring. I am trying things out to see what I like and what I don't like. Some of those red flags were visible only in hind sight, some of them only became visible over time. I readily admit I am a work in progress. I try to live day by day. I guess I am hoping that some day I might wake up and realize I am happy.


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## Ynot

happy as a clam said:


> Honestly, that all sounds exhausting.
> 
> Maybe it’s time to drop out of the dating scene for awhile. Spend some time alone and find out what really brings you peace and joy.


I have spent plenty of time alone. I have traveled across much of the country by myself. I work in near absolute solitude. One thing I realize that brings me peace and joy is being social, which is something very lacking in my day to day existence. This part of my journey is how I am finding out what I really want. I never understood the idea that you must be cloistered from the world to discover what you want from the world. In my mind you must be engaged in the world to discover its opportunities.


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## Ynot

Elizabeth001 said:


> Man...I got tired just reading that.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I am sorry. I have been to most of the home improvement stores in my area but haven't bumped into that special someone yet!


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## Diana7

Sounds to me as if you are just wanting to have lots of sex with lots of women rather than seeking a good woman to have a healthy long term relationship/marriage with. While you may think that what you are doing will make you happy, it wont, and you may well end up alone in the end.


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## Ynot

jlcrome said:


> Damn man you seem to test drive them all don't you. Are you somehow related to Ron Jeremy? that was a joke hey I like sex too man but geez if you want a commited relationship you gotta start things at a slower pace.


I would love to have a committed relationship but every relationship has to start somewhere. The way I look at it, is I am doing the things I should have done when I was young. I don't understand the idea that you need to take things slow. Ultimately, the reason any of us date is to have sex with that person. Given how it is a most basic aspect of any romantic relationship, I don't see how postponing finding out compatibility is a good thing. I guess I could date a woman for 90 days and then have sex a few times and discover we aren't compatible or I can go out with her a few times and realize it sooner before all the other entanglements get thrown into the mix. Also I have found the idea of "saving your self" for the right partner tends to limit opportunities. In fact most women my age are past that point, know what they want and are willing to be active sooner to find out.


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## Evinrude58

I think you are a pretty straightforward person. It's easy for people that are in long term relationships already to tell you how poorly you're going about finding your own.

I've had similar experiences as you.

Finding the right one isn't easy. Looking for that person somehow makes it seem even harder.

If I find the magic method, I'll let you know.

Lots of judgement here on YNOT. He's just looking for a woman that he likes enough to marry. Nothing wrong with that. I do think both he, and myself probably need to stick to waiting until we d someone that checks most of the needs boxes, or not date.

I met a woman that was outrageously gorgeous, and liked me a lot..... but she is bipolar, drinks like a fish, smokes like a chimney.... had to go out with her to find these things out....


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## Ynot

Evinrude58 said:


> I met a woman that was outrageously gorgeous, and liked me a lot..... but she is bipolar, drinks like a fish, smokes like a chimney.... had to go out with her to find these things out....


That's the thing. This isn't high school or college anymore. So the chances that you know someone who knows them is pretty slim. In order to find out, you have explore, otherwise you never know.

The first woman I dated, smoked. I did not know that before I went out with her. In fact it never was an issue when we were dating because she didn't allow it to be. She never smelled or tasted like an ash tray. I don't smoke so normally this is something that would have bothered me. At the time she checked off some other boxes that took precedence over that.


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## Emerging Buddhist

Perhaps you are looking too hard?

Easy to miss things when we do that...

I would never shy away from something long distance if the connection was there, too many ways to know if a foundation is possible in todays modern world of pictures, messaging, VC, and phone calls.

If you connect... you are not too far away for those intensely bonding moments and have many means to express it.

Quality, not quantity, right?

If it's quality, quantity will eventually catch up...


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## minimalME

Ynot said:


> I would love to have a committed relationship but every relationship has to start somewhere. The way I look at it, is I am doing the things I should have done when I was young. I don't understand the idea that you need to take things slow. *Ultimately, the reason any of us date is to have sex with that person.* Given how it is a most basic aspect of any romantic relationship, I don't see how postponing finding out compatibility is a good thing. I guess I could date a woman for 90 days and then have sex a few times and discover we aren't compatible or I can go out with her a few times and realize it sooner before all the other entanglements get thrown into the mix. Also I have found the idea of "saving your self" for the right partner tends to limit opportunities. In fact most women my age are past that point, know what they want and are willing to be active sooner to find out.


Uh...no.

The reason I date someone is to see if we even like one another as people. It's a period of flushing out character, which takes quite a while.

I've actually stopped dating for now, because the majority of men I come in contact with seem to view dating as you do. They want frequent, convenient access to my body with absolutely no responsibility, commitment, or obligation.

Sorry, but that's not happening. I'm not having sex with every guy who asks me out. Just the fact that that's the norm now is bizarre.

And the expectations and attitudes of entitlement surrounding sex have gotten so out of whack that it's outrageous. I had one guy break a second date, and he admitted that it was because he knew I wasn't going to have sex with him.

Even if I end up on my own for the rest of my life, that will be better than being treated like less than a prostitute. Which is exactly what modern dating has become.


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## Ynot

minimalME said:


> Uh...no.
> 
> The reason I date someone is to see if we even like one another as people. It's a period of flushing out character, which takes quite a while.
> 
> I've actually stopped dating for now, because the majority of men I come in contact with seem to view dating as you do. They want frequent, convenient access to my body with absolutely no responsibility, commitment, or obligation.
> 
> Sorry, but that's not happening. I'm not having sex with every guy who asks me out. Just the fact that that's the norm now is bizarre.
> 
> And the expectations and attitudes of entitlement surrounding sex have gotten so out of whack that it's outrageous. I had one guy break a second date, and he admitted that it was because he knew I wasn't going to have sex with him.
> 
> Even if I end up on my own for the rest of my life, that will be better than being treated like less than a prostitute. Which is exactly what modern dating has become.


Wow, talk about being judgmental. I never said anything about having sex with some one just because you are dating them. Perhaps you different than most, but I date people to whom I am attracted to. I ask them out to see if I would like to pursue this further. A second date confirms the mutual attraction. I meet people who might engage me intellectually, but unless there is an attraction I do not date them. Perhaps you are different. 
Nor do I expect sex, some women are like you and expect something in return. I prefer to engage with people who understand, that we both have what the other wants and is not willing to use it as a tool to dominate or control some one else.
As for modern dating, again, you are highly judgmental. So women who enjoy sex are being treated like less than a prostitute. I do not know about you, but every woman I have been with has enjoyed and wanted it as much as I have.
You need to leave the cloister and live in the real world, where both men and women enjoy sex and actually look for it. But if you intend to save your self forever that is your choice. You are wise to not date. No sense in wasting another persons time.
But for the record, when a guy breaks a date because he expected sex that you are not willing to engage in, he did you a favor. Rather than being so bitter about it, perhaps you should stop and realize that. Maybe your experience is a result of how you are going about it. Maybe you need to change your tactics if you expect to attract someone who is willing to wait until you deem fit to bestow your self on. They are out there.


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## Married but Happy

Diana7 said:


> Sounds to me as if you are just wanting to have lots of sex with lots of women rather than seeking a good woman to have a healthy long term relationship/marriage with. While you may think that what you are doing will make you happy, it wont, and you may well end up alone in the end.


In the short term, it's plenty of fun, and if the women are on the same page (and believe me, most really are), then no harm, no foul. By experiencing different women, with different personalities, and different attitudes and beliefs, you DO figure out what works for you when you choose to be a couple. This is how you learn what you need to have a healthy, long term relationship. It worked for me and my wife. We are happy, and happy that we played the field and figured out what truly mattered - to us.


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## NobodySpecial

Ynot said:


> Wow, talk about being judgmental. I never said anything about having sex with some one just because you are dating them. Perhaps you different than most, but I date people to whom I am attracted to. I ask them out to see if I would like to pursue this further. A second date confirms the mutual attraction. I meet people who might engage me intellectually, but unless there is an attraction I do not date them. Perhaps you are different.
> Nor do I expect sex, some women are like you and expect something in return. I prefer to engage with people who understand, that we both have what the other wants and is not willing to use it as a tool to dominate or control some one else.
> As for modern dating, again, you are highly judgmental. So women who enjoy sex are being treated like less than a prostitute. I do not know about you, but every woman I have been with has enjoyed and wanted it as much as I have.
> You need to leave the cloister and live in the real world, where both men and women enjoy sex and actually look for it. But if you intend to save your self forever that is your choice. You are wise to not date. No sense in wasting another persons time


Meh. Different strokes for different folks. There ARE some guys out there who want to "date" to pump and dump. But they are impossibly easy to ID. For myself, I would not play some kind of game of ... ok now he said I love you, I can give him tongue. Nor do I want obligation and commitment from everyone! Be yourself. You are fine.


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## Evinrude58

minimalME said:


> Uh...no.
> 
> The reason I date someone is to see if we even like one another as people. It's a period of flushing out character, which takes quite a while.
> 
> I've actually stopped dating for now, because the majority of men I come in contact with seem to view dating as you do. They want frequent, convenient access to my body with absolutely no responsibility, commitment, or obligation.
> 
> Sorry, but that's not happening. I'm not having sex with every guy who asks me out. Just the fact that that's the norm now is bizarre.
> 
> And the expectations and attitudes of entitlement surrounding sex have gotten so out of whack that it's outrageous. I had one guy break a second date, and he admitted that it was because he knew I wasn't going to have sex with him.
> 
> Even if I end up on my own for the rest of my life, that will be better than being treated like less than a prostitute. Which is exactly what modern dating has become.


So if a person has sex with you, they should feel obligated to you? Is that what you're saying? It sounds like you don't like sex, or feel it's some kind kind of of bargains chip. 
If you're saying you don't WANT sex with a man unless you're attracted to them, they've told your u they wanted to be exclusive with just you, and you want a long term relationship with you..... I think you'll find that myself and most other men, admire that and it would be a huge factor in whether we wantedca Ltr with you.

But if sex is something you don't really care for, and only give to a man that satisfies your other needs, that would be a deal breaker for most.

Lots of women like sex and that's who most healthy men want....


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## Ynot

Diana7 said:


> Sounds to me as if you are just wanting to have lots of sex with lots of women rather than seeking a good woman to have a healthy long term relationship/marriage with. While you may think that what you are doing will make you happy, it wont, and you may well end up alone in the end.


I never said anything about wanting a long term relationship/marriage. I do not know what I want. Hence that is why I am trying things out. I lack the ability to fore go reason in order to subscribe to what others tell me I should want (ie religion), Therefore I must find out for myself. Seeking truth with an open mind is far more satisfying than blind faith.


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## Ynot

Married but Happy said:


> In the short term, it's plenty of fun, and if the women are on the same page (and believe me, most really are), then no harm, no foul. By experiencing different women, with different personalities, and different attitudes and beliefs, you DO figure out what works for you when you choose to be a couple. This is how you learn what you need to have a healthy, long term relationship. It worked for me and my wife. We are happy, and happy that we played the field and figured out what truly mattered - to us.


Not having played the field is probably why many marriages fail in the first place. How do you know what you want unless you have narrowed the list of potential opportunities. And how do you do that without exploring them?
It seems as though those most opposed to that idea are the ones who are now entangled in just one. It is almost as if they must keep convincing themselves they made the right choice.


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## Evinrude58

I think most people want to find that one person that they look forward to seeing every day. Not just about sex. I've found that few women are going to satisfy me as far as sex. The last gf was so impossibly perfect for me in that category, I doubt anyone else will be able to make me happy there. So I'm shooting for the other things that make me happy. ****, those are even harder to find than good sex....

Dating is not for the faint of heart... it's difficult. But hopefully worth it..


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## Married but Happy

Evinrude58 said:


> I think most people want to find that one person that they look forward to seeing every day. Not just about sex. I've found that few women are going to satisfy me as far as sex. The last gf was so impossibly perfect for me in that category, I doubt anyone else will be able to make me happy there. So I'm shooting for the other things that make me happy. ****, those are even harder to find than good sex....
> 
> Dating is not for the faint of heart... it's difficult. But hopefully worth it..


Oh, definitely worth it, if you hold out for a really good match (there are no _perfect _matches). After a sexless first marriage, _great, frequent_ sex was definitely a high priority in any new relationship. Of course, that alone is not _nearly_ enough for the long run, so there have to be enough shared attitudes, beliefs, goals, and interests to fill the rest of the day - and _decades_. I truly _like_ - as well as love and respect - my second wife. We have a great deal in common (more than most, I think), and we've hit the sexual jackpot.


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## Wolf1974

Living life uncompromised is the best thing about being divorced. Do what you want when you want. This is your time so enjoy it! no right or wrong answers just what’s right for you and that can change daily.


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## chillymorn69

I think if I was dating later in life any woman who was guarded about sex would be sent down the road.

I don't care about waiting. As a matter of fact waiting would be great but there would have to be honest comunication about likes and preferences.

Sexual compatibility is important and I would not want to waste time with someone who was a princess pillow or did not reciprocate sexuay.

I like giving and recieving not just giving and giving and giving.


I tend to think a woman who is guarder about sex is most likley a poor lay or at the very least selfish as in not doing oral etc. And well I guess that makes them a lazy crappy lover in my opinion.


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## minimalME

Ynot said:


> I never said anything about having sex with some one just because you are dating them.


Really?



> Ultimately, the reason any of us date is to have sex with that person.


That's _exactly_ what you said. 



> Nor do I expect sex, some women are like you and expect something in return. I prefer to engage with people who understand, that we both have what the other wants and is not willing to use it as a tool to dominate or control some one else.


That's nonsense. If you want to treat sex like it's a recreational sport, then that's certainly your choice - and it's very male. But I'm not a guy. I bond from sex. For me, it's more than satisfying lust. And saying that it's manipulative to expect commitment, responsibility, and obligation alongside an intimate relationship comes across as an immature, bullyish ploy to shame someone who disagrees with you and isn't willing to give you want you want.



> So women who enjoy sex are being treated like less than a prostitute. I do not know about you, but every woman I have been with has enjoyed and wanted it as much as I have.


I didn't say that women who enjoy sex are less than prostitutes, but that's a very interesting spin. What I said was, that in the dating arena, being expected to have sex with stranger after stranger is a behavior that I view as being more degrading than prostitution.



> You need to leave the cloister and live in the real world, where both men and women enjoy sex and actually look for it.


Wow. 



> You are wise to not date. No sense in wasting another persons time.


Just so I understand what you're saying - dating is a waste of a man's time if he's not getting sex? That comes across as extremely entitled. So in order to date successfully, your recommendation is that I start having sex? Which of course isn't a surprise at all. What man is going to turn down easy sex?

But I'm a little confused. Above you mentioned that you don't expect sex? There seems to be a conflict here. You don't expect it, but you really do. And if someone isn't willing to give it to you, then you'll move on because they're wasting your time. How silly of a woman - to refuse being your temporary play thing.



> But for the record, when a guy breaks a date because he expected sex that you are not willing to engage in, he did you a favor.


Agreed.



> Maybe your experience is a result of how you are going about it. Maybe you need to change your tactics if you expect to attract *someone who is willing to wait until you deem fit to bestow your self on *They are out there.


It's fascinating to me that you view what I wrote as judgmental, but you seem totally blind when it comes to seeing it in yourself. 

Your entire response comes across as _soooo_ self-righteous - and defensive. It's kind of sad that you view yourself as superior and enlightened, but, again, not a surprise. Of course you want to protect an arrangement where you're free to go from woman to woman, using them like objects in order to stroke your _very large_ ego.

Like a kid in a candy store - that's how another male poster described dating and having sex. That about sums up the mentality perfectly.

And for all those men who agree with you, I suppose you're also the ones who want transparency with a girlfriend/wife? You want to be assured that all these women you've been bedding haven't been with TOO many guys - certainly not more than you, not people you know, not doing things you object to. What an interesting paradox.


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## Evinrude58

I don't mind waiting, especially if the person is meeting the Checklist for being worth waiting for. Honest, not looking to be offended, fun, has a steady job, is interesting....

Thing is, I'm not waiting too long, because ifitsnot right in the sexual category, it's not likely she's going to be fun and interesting enough to overcome that. Sex is important. 

Ive had ladies tell me they won't have sex before marriage. They don't get a second date. Not because I think that's wrong, it's just that I'm not marrying someone unless I know them a couple of years, and I'm not waiting that damn long.

I don't believe YNOT is just looking for sex, but he's not letting a woman use that as a means of leverage.
I think that's smart.

I think some women DO use "access to their body" as a source of leverage to hold over the head of their partner. I'd never go for that crap. My cruel ex didn't use that as leverage, but would withdraw all affection in the event if any perceived offense.
I won't tolerate a woman like that again, either... 
ok, I'm rambling now..


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## Ynot

minimalME said:


> Really?
> 
> 
> 
> That's _exactly_ what you said.
> 
> No it is not. I didn't discuss the dozens of other dates I went on. I absolutely do not think any woman is obligated to have sex with me just because we went on a date. And my reference to the ultimate purpose of dating being sex? Well I have an experiment I want you to try. See how long YOU will remain in a relationship without it. You can lie to yourself and say it is bout this that or the other thing, but all you are doing is lying to cover the fact that you are a prude.
> 
> That's nonsense. If you want to treat sex like it's a recreational sport, then that's certainly your choice - and it's very male. But I'm not a guy. I bond from sex. For me, it's more than satisfying lust. And saying that it's manipulative to expect commitment, responsibility, and obligation alongside an intimate relationship comes across as an immature, bullyish ploy to shame someone who disagrees with you and isn't willing to give you want you want.
> 
> I also never said it was a recreational sport and it is very manipulative for you to put the cart in front of the horse and expect commitment and obligation BEFORE they even have a chance to discover whether the two of you are even compatible sexually
> 
> I didn't say that women who enjoy sex are less than prostitutes, but that's a very interesting spin. What I said was, that in the dating arena, being expected to have sex with stranger after stranger is a behavior that I view as being more degrading than prostitution.
> 
> No, that is exactly what you said: "Even if I end up on my own for the rest of my life, that will be better than being treated like less than a prostitute. Which is exactly what modern dating has become." so modern dating (which is really no different than dating ever was simply treats women as less than prostitutes, in your mind. Perhaps you need to actually take the time to read what I wrote instead of having a knee jerk reaction. Because I have clearly said that I do not expect sex in return for anything. But we could say that you absolutely expect some dude to engage in a transaction with you before you will even think about.
> 
> Wow.
> 
> 
> 
> Just so I understand what you're saying - dating is a waste of a man's time if he's not getting sex? That comes across as extremely entitled. So in order to date successfully, your recommendation is that I start having sex? Which of course isn't a surprise at all. What man is going to turn down easy sex?
> 
> Your comprehension skills appear somewhat lacking, because no one (other than you) has even suggested that. People date because they are attracted to each other. Well most people apparently you don't need attraction only commitment and obligation.
> 
> But I'm a little confused. Above you mentioned that you don't expect sex? There seems to be a conflict here. You don't expect it, but you really do. And if someone isn't willing to give it to you, then you'll move on because they're wasting your time. How silly of a woman - to refuse being your temporary play thing.
> 
> I don't expect sex. I never have. But I am not going to waste my time on someone who does not desire the same things I do. I am not going to make a commitment or obligate myself to them in order to get sex from them. IOW I am doing them favor by not wasting their time either. You might also rethink your position about sex, because as I said EVERY woman I have been with has wanted it as much or in some cases more than I do. They do not think of it as being a "plaything" they think of it as enjoying their sexuality. I am sorry you are so ashamed of yours.
> 
> Agreed.
> 
> 
> 
> It's fascinating to me that you view what I wrote as judgmental, but you seem totally blind when it comes to seeing it in yourself.
> 
> Your entire response comes across as _soooo_ self-righteous - and defensive. It's kind of sad that you view yourself as superior and enlightened, but, again, not a surprise. Of course you want to protect an arrangement where you're free to go from woman to woman, using them like objects in order to stroke your _very large_ ego.
> 
> Like a kid in a candy store - that's how another male poster described dating and having sex. That about sums up the mentality perfectly.
> 
> And for all those men who agree with you, I suppose you're also the ones who want transparency with a girlfriend/wife? You want to be assured that all these women you've been bedding haven't been with TOO many guys - certainly not more than you, not people you know, not doing things you object to. What an interesting paradox.


Wow, projection at its finest. Personally I could care less how many people they were with before me. I am just glad that they gained some experience. But thanks for thinking you know more than anybody else.


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## Bananapeel

@Ynot - where are you meeting these women? If none have met your expectations yet it might be time to try a different avenue. BTW, I'm in the same boat as you. I've found women that are a lot of fun to date but just haven't met my standards yet for a committed long term relationship. There's nothing wrong with being picky and enjoying life in the process, while you wait to see if someone that is perfect for you enters your life. It sure beats committing to someone that you know isn't right for you and dealing with the fallout later.


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## Ynot

Bananapeel said:


> @Ynot - where are you meeting these women? If none have met your expectations yet it might be time to try a different avenue. BTW, I'm in the same boat as you. I've found women that are a lot of fun to date but just haven't met my standards yet for a committed long term relationship. There's nothing wrong with being picky and enjoying life in the process, while you wait to see if someone that is perfect for you enters your life. It sure beats committing to someone that you know isn't right for you and dealing with the fallout later.


I have met them here and there. A few on line. A few at various place IRL. One at a bar, a few at various Meet Ups. That is in addition to the women who have reached out to me along the way. And those who I only dated a few times and nothing came of it. I am past the point of settling. One of my criteria for a relationship is sexual compatibility. It is important to me, but by no means the only thing I am looking for. Hence the reason relationships fail.


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## Bananapeel

I actually have a list of qualities I want in a woman that I have written down. If the women I date don't meet the vast majority of those qualities then I just date them casually and enjoy the dating process for as long as it plays out. I think not settling and wanting sexual compatibility are great and it takes a lot of patience and confidence to be willing to walk away from women that don't possess those and other traits you find necessary. IMO you have a very healthy outlook on dating and relationships.


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## toblerone

Never do long distance relationships.


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## MovingForward

Ynot said:


> So since my divorce I have been trying to figure out what it is that I want. So far I have been in several longer term relationships and a few shorter ones.
> The first relationship I got into was with a 55 year old woman who really liked to party. Way too much for me. She was petite and she smoked. She also liked to have sex which was great and the more she drank the hornier and kinkier she got. She had been married for a long time (20+years) and had grown children and was self employed. This one did not end well, although I escaped getting arrested. This lasted about 3 months.
> Second up was a 54 year old woman I had a 6 month relationship with. She had been married twice before but could not have children. She was average build about 5'7". She enjoyed sex but was rather limited in what she would try. I really wasn't ready to be in a relationship and I sort of went thru the motions. We ended this one mutually and remain friends to this day.
> Third up was a younger woman (mid 40's). She was taller at 5'11". She had two younger kids at home. I never met them. She would give me BJs but never let me have intercourse with her. We went out for over a month. She finally ended it when I got back from a vacation.
> Next up was a totally BSC 56 year old woman. She was very petite as well as being extremely high maintenance. She enjoyed sex, and was willing to do almost anything, but some of those things came with strings attached. It started off OK but then she started trying to control me and tried to tell me what I should do and how I should think. I broke up with her early on, but then I allowed her to "explain" that it was all a mistake. Needless to say the "reconciliation" did not last long. When I finally broke up with her for good, she stalked me for weeks.
> Then I dated a shorter heavier woman (mainly because she had big tits to be honest). She was 58 and as I got to know she started looking a lot older than that. She enjoyed sex but she was overly aggressive and wanted to dominate me (which I did not like). We broke up.
> Then I had a FWB, who is still a friend and would probably have sex with me if I were to ask. I didn't enjoy the purely physical sex we had as much as I thought I would. She would do anything, even asking me to do things I wasn't into like some heavier BDSM.
> After that I dated a woman with 4 kids. Two of them were minors. All of them lived at her house. She truly enjoyed sex and practically nothing was off limits. Eventually time constraints lead us to call it off. I met her kids although I never spent much time them. So there was no attachment. We had a lot in common, She was very tall (6') and well educated. We shared many similar outlooks on life. We dated for about 4 months.
> 
> So now I am embarking on another adventure. I have been texting and chatting with a woman that lives about 90 miles away. We have discussed a long distance relationship. She visits this area regularly as she has family here. I visit her area fairly often for work and because I have family there. My only experience with a long distance relationship was when I was very young and with my first GF. It didn't go well then. Too many distractions. Now, most of those distractions are gone and I am much more at peace with my life, more protective of my freedoms and space and can see how this might work.
> 
> So I continue to experiment in hopes of finding something that I can be truly comfortable with.


I was same just shorter term, thought I would go have sex with a bunch of woman and feel great but I have never particularly enjoyed one night stands they dont 'fulfill' me if that is the right word to use? I need connection and intimacy with someone.

It is hard to figure out who you are and what you want after such a long marriage, maybe we never know and it changes and evolves depending on what and who we are exposed to.

I wish you good luck in finding your happiness @Ynot.


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## Ynot

MovingForward said:


> I was same just shorter term, thought I would go have sex with a bunch of woman and feel great but I have never particularly enjoyed one night stands they dont 'fulfill' me if that is the right word to use? I need connection and intimacy with someone.
> 
> It is hard to figure out who you are and what you want after such a long marriage, maybe we never know and it changes and evolves depending on what and who we are exposed to.
> 
> I wish you good luck in finding your happiness @Ynot.


No one night stands here. Not one of the relationships mentioned above consisted of a pump and dump. All developed over several weeks or months. And I should add that many of the initial sexual encounters came as a surprise to me as I was not expecting them to happen as soon as they did.

I do agree that it is very difficult to know what you want after a long term marriage. I had given of myself over a quarter of a century to the point of not knowing who I even was. 

There were many things I enjoyed about being married, and there were quite a few I did not enjoy. Finding the balance that would make me happy is not as simple as many here like to imagine. 

Most times, people just say they don't want what made them unhappy before. Which is fine to a degree. But it is a far cry from saying what they actually want. 

And as another poster said, the great thing about divorce is that now you have the opportunity (and experience) to really pursue what makes you happy as opposed to trying to live up to the expectations of family, society or religion.

I also continue to be amazed at the amount of shaming some people engage in resulting from their expectations. As I said in my OP I am trying things out.


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## MovingForward

Ynot said:


> No one night stands here. Not one of the relationships mentioned above consisted of a pump and dump. All developed over several weeks or months. And I should add that many of the initial sexual encounters came as a surprise to me as I was not expecting them to happen as soon as they did.
> 
> I do agree that it is very difficult to know what you want after a long term marriage. I had given of myself over a quarter of a century to the point of not knowing who I even was.
> 
> There were many things I enjoyed about being married, and there were quite a few I did not enjoy. Finding the balance that would make me happy is not as simple as many here like to imagine.
> 
> Most times, people just say they don't want what made them unhappy before. Which is fine to a degree. But it is a far cry from saying what they actually want.
> 
> And as another poster said, the great thing about divorce is that now you have the opportunity (and experience) to really pursue what makes you happy as opposed to trying to live up to the expectations of family, society or religion.
> 
> I also continue to be amazed at the amount of shaming some people engage in resulting from their expectations. As I said in my OP I am trying things out.


I understand, I was not criticizing so probably should have worded better, I was just sharing my experience as I was navigating. 

Yes Divorce gives you a second chance to find the right balance on what you want for the person you are today.

Oh and your point about sexual compatibility, that is huge for me also


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## Ynot

MovingForward said:


> I understand, I was not criticizing so probably should have worded better, I was just sharing my experience as I was navigating.
> 
> Yes Divorce gives you a second chance to find the right balance on what you want for the person you are today.
> 
> Oh and your point about sexual compatibility, that is huge for me also


I didn't take it as criticism, we are good there. Thanks for sharing. I guess I was refsponding to the **** shaming that others have felt the need to engage in.


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## Hoosier

Are you sure we are not the same guy? 

My xwife used sex as a weapon, I am determined to NEVER be in that position again. Interesting to have dated and the different responses from different people. I dated one woman 4 times and never even kissed her. Itook her out a few timesMainly because she interested me in what made her tick. Very pretty woman, great conversationalist, but she was touch heisitant. She remarked to me that she had many one or two dates but never any follow up dates......

Interesting that you are getting flack for being up front about your desires, at least you are honest. Rally on!


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