# Revenge Affair/ My Needs



## slater (Feb 3, 2012)

BS here. 13 months post DDAY. I have been weak. I have not done anything yet but I need support. I have always been the high sex drive one in our marriage. So the fact that she cheated (for 3 years off and on) with a co-worker kills me. She gave him what I was missing. By missing I mean we had sex 6 times in 2010.

I cannot and probably will never forgive her. But like DevastatedDad, I am staying for our young kids. Someone has to be the grown up. I coach the kids etc.

But I feel gyped. Since DDay, sex has gotten a bit more infrequent, but not what I would like- which would be 2-4 times/wk. At first it was a little better, but the whole time she has not been there mentally. She struggles with guilt, self image issues and maybe she misses him. IDK, but she admits for her the passion is not there. I think years of her convincing herself I was the bad one has done too much damage for her to just undo. She agrees and is trying, but still our sex life sucks.

[She is totally transparent, changed jobs, many other things to support me FYI.]

So I am left pissed and hurt and angry. I want my fun! I told her I wanted to "have an affair with her", but she doesn't get it or won't. 

Lately I have considered getting an online profile and hooking up. I know it is wrong, but part of me feels I "deserve" it. Part of me also feels "what damage can I do, she has already ruined the marriage". But morally I know it is wrong. And, I don't want to surrender the high ground.

But there are days I figure "F" it. I am not getting younger. Maybe I just have to divorce? Any ideas on better ways to approach her on how important it is?

When I told her about a month ago I was almost ready to file. She was astonished and said "You would divorce me over sex?". I wanted to slap her (footnote- have never hit a women, never would...but wanted to).

I wanted to say, "No you stupid B, I would divorce you b/c you are an unfaithful, lying, cheating, wh0re...but yeah the lack of sex could be the last straw." I didn't. I just said yes.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Well, I think that a person is justified to divorce for lack of a sex life in their marriage. An affair is another valid reason.

If you want a sex life it sounds like divorce is your only good choice here. You can still coach your children.


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## hookares (Dec 7, 2011)

You're doing your kids no favors if you are staying in a marriage with a cheater and are in perpetual anger about it.
You can be a good dad without being married if you choose to do so.


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## CleanJerkSnatch (Jul 18, 2012)

Has anyone realized they seem to be on the path of R?
Ignore the temptation for a revenge affair. It will not fix you and it is not a magical antidote for your urges, it may agitate you and make it worse. Your ego was severely damaged so your reaction is completely expected. Kill your ego and have healthy pride in the fact that you took your wife back for love of her and the children.

You have to persevere and keep carrying her while rebuilding the new marriage from scratch. Marriage after infidelity is never the same, the original relationship dies and it restarts anew completely different. Reconciliation is an extremely difficult path that so few tread on.

Be honest with yourself and with your wife about your feelings.


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## walkonmars (Aug 21, 2012)

I think I can safely say that if CM wasn't doing everything right since Dday2 devastateddad wouldn't even give R a second thought. (and he's barely considering it now)

Comparing your wife's behavior since Dday to CM is an insult to CM. Don't degrade yourself with an affair - I think you know it will not be satisfying. If seek sexual release - not provided by your wife for whatever reason - then two options:

1. divorce and find a meaningful relationship that includes sex
2. an open marriage where you both can do as you please. 

Which sounds better to you?


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## bryanp (Aug 25, 2011)

Her comment shows you what a totally broken moral compass she has. She betray your marriage and humiliated and disrespected her husband. I cannot believe after that statement you did not see a lawyer.

By the way if she has been screwing this guy for over 3 and a half years and your have young children then you need to:
1. Check for paternity tests.
2. Get the both of you tested for STD's.
3. See a lawyer to just understand your options.

She seems to indicate that she felt she did nothing wrong by screwing this guy behind your back for over 3 years. How in the world can you stay with her? This is a woman who will be teaching morals to your children? She clearly has no respect for you. If you do not respect yourself then who will?


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## Chris989 (Jul 3, 2012)

Slater, please don't cheat. God knows it's tempting but in a strange way you might end up worse than your wayward spouse; after all, you *know* the pain betrayal can cause in the way only a betrayed spouse can.

My mother works(ed) in helping children from broken homes (in some cases, very broken) and despite being very moral and committed to marriage, always said that you are better off with 2 happy parents apart than 2 unhappy ones together. 

This has been repeated to me many times since my ex wife's infidelity - mostly by friends who grew up in an unhappy home and wished their parents had split when they were young instead of waiting until they grew up.


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## Waking up to life (Nov 29, 2012)

Call your own bluff and serve her with divorce papers. Then she'll see how serious this problem is for you.


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## slater (Feb 3, 2012)

I know what I should do, and I keep doing it. But these thoughts enter my mind and take days to sttle down. We are working towards R. And like I said, she does almost all that I ask, but she doesn't want to fake her passion for me.

She knows she spent years making me the bad guy and that she was wrong, but it isn't something she has been able to just turn around. She is grateful for the second chance, but she has never been an emotional person. I had sort of gotten used to it, and felt that that was just her. The A changed that though for me. I saw a different side to her. She claims it "was not her", she was playing a role. The problem is that "charachter is who I want sometimes". See what i mean? She never wants to be that person again.


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## walkonmars (Aug 21, 2012)

She was willing to play a role for another man. What did he do to earn that right? He supported her? Helped with the kids when they were sick? Paid her insurance? Helped around the house? 

No, what he did to earn the right see her in a starring role was pull down his pants. 

And now she won't even consider playing a role for you? It's sickening.


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## The-Deceived (Jan 8, 2013)

I would leave her, file and move on. Find someone who wants to have sex with you, not some other pos. She clearly has a high sex drive too, but no interest in sharing it with you.

Cut your losses and run.

PS

Staying for the kids is a mistake. They will not be better off because of it.


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## BobSimmons (Mar 2, 2013)

slater said:


> BS here. 13 months post DDAY. I have been weak. I have not done anything yet but I need support. I have always been the high sex drive one in our marriage. So the fact that she cheated (for 3 years off and on) with a co-worker kills me. She gave him what I was missing. By missing I mean we had sex 6 times in 2010.
> 
> I cannot and probably will never forgive her. But like DevastatedDad, I am staying for our young kids. *Someone has to be the grown up*. I coach the kids etc.
> 
> ...


Having a revenge affair is not very grown up is it?

Sorry for your pain, but have you both gone for MC/IC? It seems you *think* she's missing him, have you asked her? A lot of resentment is building, sooner or later you'll say screw it and surrender that higher ground.


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## CleanJerkSnatch (Jul 18, 2012)

walkonmars said:


> I think I can safely say that if CM wasn't doing everything right since Dday2 devastateddad wouldn't even give R a second thought. (and he's barely considering it now)
> 
> Comparing your wife's behavior since Dday to CM is an insult to CM. Don't degrade yourself with an affair - I think you know it will not be satisfying. If seek sexual release - not provided by your wife for whatever reason - then two options:
> 
> ...




I must say that if the marriage gets to the 2nd option there really is no point to be married unless you want to contract an STD from your wife because we all know it is easier for the women to get the men. Does every man enjoy a free lay?


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## BjornFree (Aug 16, 2012)

slater said:


> I wanted to say, "No you stupid B, I would divorce you b/c you are an unfaithful, lying, cheating, wh0re...but yeah the lack of sex could be the last straw." I didn't. I just said yes.


So file. You think that children can't pick up on the fact that you're miserable? Most children especially younger ones and teenagers somehow think that they are the reason for your unhappiness and they grow scared and depressed, their performance suffers and they fill their innocent heads with a lot of BS they shouldn't have to worry about. 

Do them a favor and realize that you're responsible for your own happiness and file. You don't need this woman in your life, you can still coach your kids and be a great father.


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## CleanJerkSnatch (Jul 18, 2012)

slater said:


> I know what I should do, and I keep doing it. But these thoughts enter my mind and take days to sttle down. We are working towards R. And like I said, she does almost all that I ask, but she doesn't want to fake her passion for me.
> 
> She knows she spent years making me the bad guy and that she was wrong, but it isn't something she has been able to just turn around. She is grateful for the second chance, but she has never been an emotional person. I had sort of gotten used to it, and felt that that was just her. The A changed that though for me. I saw a different side to her. She claims it "was not her", she was playing a role. The problem is that "charachter is who I want sometimes". See what i mean? She never wants to be that person again.



Slater, you need to understand she cannot have that "passion". The mind is wired to enjoy novelty, new passions, new excitement and pleasures. The OM could be trash and it will still be more exciting than OLD you because she's "been there done that". It is like getting a new toy, or a new car etc.

Keep communicating honestly with your wife. Be strong, act strong and, clean yourself up to be more attractive so that when you get the urge you demand it and you are settled.


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## badmemory (Jul 31, 2012)

You know slater, if you're like most BS's, the lack of interest in sex by your otherwise remorseful spouse can be a double whammy.

Not only does this make you sexually frustrated, but the lack of interest can also be a significant trigger; reminding you of that period where she was withholding sex from you during her PA.

If that's the case with you, I would recommend you should discuss that with her. Let her know how you feel about it. 

Yes, you should do things to improve your sexual attractiveness to her. But IMHO, sometimes a remorseful spouse needs "to take one for the team" if they want to save their marriage.


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## Love2326 (Oct 31, 2012)

Let's weigh the outcomes, shall we? 

If you go ahead and hook-up, how do you think that would make you feel in the long run? Perhaps you might feel satisfied... at first. But as time passes, how would you feel later? If you have a moral compass (which I suppose you do, since you have never cheated before), I suspect you would probably feel horrible over the extreme guilt. You would probably want to hide it from your WW initially, but perhaps your guilt would eat you alive and you might feel that you need to tell her. What would her reaction be if you told her? There would probably be a lot of screaming and shouting in the children's house. She might feel like she should go ahead and cheat again to get back at you. She might check out of the marriage, just as you have. Your children would grow up in an unhappy household where they are surrounded by a mother and a father that hate each other (don't misjudge children.. they are very perceptive). You would probably hate yourself forever (or for a very very long time) for stooping to her level. You would probably feel like crap afterwards. You will probabloy feel that the one night of sex with a strange woman was not worth the years of tormet that you will suffer later... just as how your WW should be feeling now. 

On the other hand, if you maintain your integrity and stay true to your vows, you can live with the fact that you have been a faithful and true husband in your marriage. You will have proven yourself to be loyal and true to your family. Your parents would be proud. Your kids would be proud. You could always be able to say that you have never cheated on your wife before. Your children can grow up knowing that dad was a loyal father and husband and they will know that their mother was neither loyal nor was she trustworthy. They will look at your with respect, when they look at her with distaste. 

You have to THINK THIS THROUGH. What are the consequences??? I suspect that if you think about the repercussions, you will decide that cheating is certainly not the way to go. Two wrongs don't make a right. 

Let's think about you for a second (since she certainly didn't). If you'd like to live with her unfaithfulness forever, then you should stay. You can always divorce after the kids grow up and move out, but then you'll have wasted all of your good years with a cheater and dating might be really difficult at an older age. On the other hand, if you'd like to be with a loving wife, who will never ever be disloyal to you, if you'd like to live the dream that you thought you had when you got married, then you should seriously think about divorce and starting over. Yes, starting over is scary as hell. But you will survive. It will not kill you. Yes, your children will need some time to adapt, but if they see dad is happier, then they will be happy too. My therapist said that many betrayed spouses make the mistake of staying in the marriage for the sake of the kids, but the fact of the matter is... more often than not, the kids know that mom and dad are unhappy with each other and they pick up on it. 

I know you think its best to stay with her for the kids, but what if its not? What if the best thing is to divorce and start over?


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## slater (Feb 3, 2012)

badmemory said:


> You know slater, if you're like most BS's, the lack of interest in sex by your otherwise remorseful spouse can be a double whammy.
> 
> Not only does this make you sexually frustrated, but the lack of interest can also be a significant trigger; reminding you of that period where she was withholding sex from you during her PA.
> 
> ...


you sound like my IC. I appreciate all of the advice here as always. I hadn't thought of it as a trigger, but I see your point. I think that that is occurring.


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## Hardtohandle (Jan 10, 2013)

Slater 

All these posters will tell you that I love my wife. They all have helped me through my upcoming divorce. It kills me I am loosing her but I love her. Even though I love her I will NEVER take her back because of what she did to me during the break up. 

They have to come to honestly and painfully show me what is true. Over the past few weeks I have been coming to the painful term that my wife never really loved me over the 19 years we were together. Hearing my Therapist say it to me was even more painful but just another slap of reality. 

My point.. 

You think your just sticking around for the kids ? Well guess what so is she.. Then when *SHE* thinks they are old enough she will do this again and leave you. It might not be when *YOU* think they are old enough though. 

End result she will Trump you again when you least expect it. You will have wasted years of your life being mad over this. I know I have been nothing but mad and angry for the past few months. 

Slate do some soul searching. I can honestly say you probably do more with your kids then I do. But over the last few months I can tell you I have been getting closer with my kids and my wife has getting more distant. 

You will be there for your kids. Always.. 

But don't destroy the rest of your life. Everyone deserves someone. 

You either fix this or move on. 

Have you done marriage counseling ? I didn't read if you did. If your trying to do this on your own, forget it. You need help with this. 

If you are or have tried and she doesn't seem to be budging then find another therapist. If that don't work then make your move and get on with your life. Again I know its hard. It is the LAST THING I wanted to do in my life, but sadly it just needs to be done. 

Do everything you can to fix this. Never walk away wondering if you only tried. I did everything I could down to begging. Now I am done. I tried. 

Oddly enough you will find yourself there more for the kids now. 

Good luck, I hope you find your happiness one way or another. But don't fall into your wife's category. We are better then that and our kids need someone to show them what is the right thing to do in a relationship. 

Again Good luck


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## CleanJerkSnatch (Jul 18, 2012)

Ephemeral pleasures are not worth it. Keep persevering with R and do not have a RA.


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## notmarriedyet (Nov 10, 2012)

I think you should stick to the idea of "having an affair" with your wife. 

It's a GREAT role playing idea! Lots of people do it. 

Maybe approach her with it as a role play, fun type thing. I realize your issues are deeper than just infrequent sex, but it could help a bit.


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## CleanJerkSnatch (Jul 18, 2012)

Love2326 said:


> I know you think its best to stay with her for the kdis, but what if its not? What if the best thing is to divorce and start over?



The fact of the matter is that slater stated that his wife is transparent, remorseful etc. By no means does that mean the marriage will be perfect from then forward. R requires a lot of work. Just as forgiving is an everyday task, waking up every morning and saying "I forgive you because I love you" is just as necessary as reinforcing the reconciliation every day "I love you and thank you for forgiving me and taking me back".


Most wayward spouses do not change and that may be a "valid" reason to split (D) but slater has had his love betrayed, his ego shattered, his needs unmet and he is working through R. For any advice I suggest you read threads of those who have reconciled.


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## Robsia (Mar 11, 2013)

CleanJerkSnatch said:


> Slater, you need to understand she cannot have that "passion". The mind is wired to enjoy novelty, new passions, new excitement and pleasures. The OM could be trash and it will still be more exciting than OLD you because she's "been there done that". It is like getting a new toy, or a new car etc.


Is this a male point of view? Or just a cheater's?

I have as much passion for my husband as I did when we first met. I would hate to be with anyone else. I have zero desire for someone new. I finally found someone I felt comfortable with.


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## Love2326 (Oct 31, 2012)

CleanJerkSnatch said:


> The fact of the matter is that slater stated that his wife is transparent, remorseful etc. By no means does that mean the marriage will be perfect from then forward. R requires a lot of work. Just as forgiving is an everyday task, waking up every morning and saying "I forgive you because I love you" is just as necessary as reinforcing the reconciliation every day "I love you and thank you for forgiving me and taking me back".
> 
> 
> Most wayward spouses do not change and that may be a "valid" reason to split (D) but slater has had his love betrayed, his ego shattered, his needs unmet and he is working through R. For any advice I suggest you read threads of those who have reconciled.


Clean, You're right. I just reread through his original post and he did say that she was transparant. We don't know much more than that, but if she's exhibiting actions that a WW should exhibit in order to R, then I digress. 

Perhaps Slater should look into himself a bit more to find out WHY he is finding himself considering a ONS? Aside from her betrayal, what does HE need to make him happy in this marriage (aside from faithfulness)? Additionally, her statements indicate that she still does not understand the gravity of what her betrayal has done to the marriage. I hope she is getting some IC as well as MC for the couple...


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## joe kidd (Feb 8, 2011)

I've done the revenge A thing and it's not worth it. Looking back I see that. At the time I just thought she deserved it.


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## Toffer (Jan 31, 2012)

So she's not passionate for you?

Was she "passionate" for the OM? Something tellse she was

Look, by trying to R, you're laying a wonderful gift at her feet, one for here to fully embrace and for her to do EVERYTHING in her power to make you feel loved and respected. This just doesn't mean following the "rules" of transparency. She should be making every effort to rediscover the passion for you that she shared with the OM.

This means loads of IC and even "faking it until she's making it" if she has to.

This doesn't seem to be the case with her

One last thing I'll add is to remember that kids would rather be from a broken home than to live in one
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

b.blue said:


> Do you have a brain to think? To think that she is a cheap P********te


This is not helpful at all. :scratchhead:


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## Jonesey (Jul 11, 2011)

Hi!

Sorry to see you post,again with no real improvement.
But Slater ,you really need to realise that LTA´s odd´s
is not in anyone's favour.The success rate is actually very low.. You NEED to understand that..Sorry to sound harsh..

Take a look at the data you are providing us 





slater said:


> BS here. 13 months post DDAY. I have been weak. I have not done anything yet but I need support. I have always been the high sex drive one in our marriage. So the fact that she cheated (for 3 years off and on) with a co-worker kills me. She gave him what I was missing. By missing I mean we had sex 6 times in 2010.
> 
> *I cannot and probably will never forgive her.*Don´t you think she perhaps´s feel´s that? But like DevastatedDad, I am staying for our young kids. Someone has to be the grown up. I coach the kids etc.
> 
> ...


And finally what makes you think she is not just waiting for you to have enough.And start the divorce proceeding´s.

This way she could tell the kid´s family, friend´s.Yes i effed it up,but i triad and the damage was to much...


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Slater, how much time a week to you and your wife spend doing thing together, just the two of you?


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

Yikes! Yes, you deserve it. But should you do it? No. It'll probably make you feel worse.

At present your child has one parent who has been loyal, true and moral. Let's keep that 1 out of 2 ratio and not let it degenerate into 0 out of 2, OK?:smthumbup:


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## cledus_snow (Feb 19, 2012)

your initial post speaks of tremendous resentment. 

obviously, you will never forgive her- as you said it yourself -yet divorce is not an option. i understand you are there for your children, but that alone should not be a reason to stay. i mean seriously..... you're miserable..... you both are. stop the charade, already.


do not lower yourself to her standards(as in cheating). just get a divorce and find someone else. 


and F*CK yes, you can divorce someone for a lack in sex. if that's how you express your intimacy, it's an integral part of the whole relationship. i dare ask her if it was important for her to f*ck OM for her to feel closer to him. i guess she's all tired out from giving it to him all those years

that was such an insensitive response from her.


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## slater (Feb 3, 2012)

EleGirl said:


> Slater, how much time a week to you and your wife spend doing thing together, just the two of you?


Not much. Busy with all the kid stuff. Some nights watching TV.


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## StillLife (Jan 19, 2013)

I lean on the reconciliation side of the fence where possible usually, but this situation sounds pretty tough. My wife and I always had issues with sex, in fact it was our main issue. She could be very low desire...talking months, and I am higher desire. What sucks horribly now is twice during periods where she was having some desire, it was given to affair partners. That has always burned me up. The thing I wanted so desperately to have with her, freely given to someone else.

That said, we have to look at our part in the issue. Is your anger and resentment over her affair helping her feel more trusting and secure to be intimate with you? Are you still the man she initially started dating and married? Meaning, do you still have the same passions for things, the same sex appeal? 

Maybe you can answer yes to those questions, but it sounds like you're doing a lot of going through the motions...for the kids, and looking back that's a marriage and sex killer in itself. You have to be you, at your best or she's never going to want you. And I would highly advise against giving in to half hearted duty sex. Got into that habit after my wife's first affair with terrible consequences. She needs to want it, or she will resent it and seek somehow else out where there isn't all that resentment built up.

Or...you could call it a day and give up. Whatever you do, work on yourself though! It will be to your benefit, in this relationship or the next. And try to let go of the anger and resentment...way easier said than done, but it's not going to help anyone at this point.


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## ChangingMe (Oct 3, 2012)

Slater, I thought I would chime in since you mention DD, and later WOM discusses me (thank you for the kind words, WOM; you can't know how much positive feedback means to me). 

I am sorry you are here. I am sorry you are in a similar situation where you hurt but you love your kids so much that you are trying to tough it out. I have read some of your story, but not recently, so I can't respond to all of what your wife has done or is doing currently.

I will say though that I hope you don't choose an RA. Don't sink to this level. Maybe it's not the exact same, since you wouldn't be the one to cheat first, but it's a disgusting way to feel knowing you have sunk that low. DD has considered it too, and it pains me equally thinking about how I don't want him to cheat on me (yes, I know, then I shouldn't have done it to him -damn right), but also how, with all the pain he feels, I don't want him to feel this pain too, of knowing he has committed adultery, been unfaithful, is a cheater, etc. All the terms and ugly thoughts that go through your head every day as you realize what you've done. And even worse than that (at least for me): knowing that your actions have negatively impacted your children. I look at my kids daily and think, "My God, what did I do? How could I be so selfish that I would jeopardize their security and lives?" I don't have an answer to that. It knocks the wind out of me on a daily basis. (For the record, I have the same thoughts about what I did to DD, but I imagine your concern over hurting your wife is not as high on the priority list, so I'm going to just focus on the kids.)

So that's one thing. Don't cheat. It's awful. I could never do it again. Never. People may say otherwise. DD may say otherwise. But I KNOW I would NEVER choose this path again. The damage, pain, and aftermath is beyond comprehension -even for the wayward. 

But there's another thing: Your wife has issues. From your post here, it doesn't sound like she "gets it." Honestly, I can't imagine turning DD down at this point. Things are different with us though; he knows I am willing, wanting, and able whenever he is open to it. He is the one keeping himself distant. Not blaming him, I get where having sex with me would be a struggle. But when he wants it, I am thrilled for the closeness of it all. Prior to the A, there were times I'd turn him down -mostly because he seemed to want it about half a second before I fell asleep. Now though, he's welcome to shake me awake, and I'd go drink some coffee just to make sure I was able to give it my all. I'm not joking either. I screwed up, worse than I ever would have imagined I could. I don't take for granted the fact that (most nights) he's still in bed with me. If he wants to be close to me, then I am appreciative for all I get. I am not perfect (clearly, right?), but I do feel like I understand how horrible what I did was and how I have to own that and work my ass off if I want to keep the husband that I love and have hurt. 

So, Slater, based on your initial post in this thread, I see where you have 2 options too. 

1) Divorce. This is of course an option. I probably don't want to know how often DD considers it. It's a reality of the hell I put him through, just as it is for your wife. The kids will hurt. That's undeniable. But they will survive. So will you. 

2) Work hard with your wife. Don't just exist. Explain in very clear language that you are doing your damnedest to give her 1 more chance, but she has to recognize that this gift won't come again. She needs to do a lot of work, on herself and on the relationship. You don't get to demand sex, but you do get to say that it is very important to you and she needs to be willing to participate in it. I honestly love the idea of "having an affair" with her. It shocks me that she doesn't find this hot. If you two are not in MC, get in it. If you are, process this stuff in depth in there. She's not getting it and not pulling her weight, and she needs to. Hopefully, for the kids' sake and yours, she will. If not, then I think you have to see choice #1. 

Take care, Slater. Stay strong and be the good dad that you are. Try to fix what you have or make the choice to bow out. Don't cheat. You will continue to be respected with either of the other two choices.


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

ChangingMe said:


> Slater, I thought I would chime in since you mention DD, and later WOM discusses me (thank you for the kind words, WOM; you can't know how much positive feedback means to me).
> 
> I am sorry you are here. I am sorry you are in a similar situation where you hurt but you love your kids so much that you are trying to tough it out. I have read some of your story, but not recently, so I can't respond to all of what your wife has done or is doing currently.
> 
> ...


:iagree:I can't really add to this.


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## Hardtohandle (Jan 10, 2013)

slater said:


> Not much. Busy with all the kid stuff. Some nights watching TV.


Hate to say this but your kids are going to have to take a back seat if you BOTH want to fix your marriage. 

I'm getting the impression your using your kids activity to limit your involvement with your wife because you resent her. End result your causing some of your own problems.

Again you never mentioned marriage counseling and /or therapy. Are you going ? Have you gone ?

Look this issue has nothing to do with your kids. You need to fix this with your WIFE, not your WIFE and KIDS.

If your kids miss a season of sports and your marriage is on track, isn't that better then being divorced and having your kids not miss a season ?


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

Slater she maybe transparent but if she isn't working on her own passion toward the marriage I would say to end it and file because right now is when she's likely putting the most effort into R that she ever will. Do if her best isn't enough move on.

Her comment about sex was amazing since obviously she happily choose to repeatedly throw you and her children away for sex. 

As for her playing a role, well part of doing that was because she valued the other man and put real effort into pleasing him. Ask yourself, is she putting effort into you?

A lot of cheating wife's stop having sex with the OM and say they have stopped cheating. The thing is, until they return to the marriage and to putting effort and energy into their husband, they are still cheating on the marriage, they just aren't having sex outside of it.


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## slater (Feb 3, 2012)

I found value in both CM and DD's comments. Thanks guys. I will say to DD - you have a better shot than I do based on CMs comments. 

We are in MC btw. In fact heading there today. I am not going to have a RA. Thanks guys for helping me see clearly. The WW and I had a talk last night. It did not go so well. She is basically saying I am not helping create an environment where she feels safe and want to please me. I am not ugly at home. I do not call her names - I am respectful. At most some days I get depressed and distant which seems to almost piss her off??
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## SadandAngry (Aug 24, 2012)

Just file, give her the ****ing shock of her life. Don't tell her, just do it. Let the fact that you won't just always be there no matter what hit her like a ton of bricks. Like it hit you when you found out she was cheating. If that doesn't wake her up and motivate her to get in the game, do everyone in your family a big favour and carry through with it. You deserve to be happy, don't put up with a miserable existence for your kids, you won't be doing much good for them if you do.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

joe kidd said:


> I've done the revenge A thing and it's not worth it. Looking back I see that. At the time I just thought she deserved it.


I did this, too. I agree with Joe. Hurt myself more than my wife's affair did.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

Slater, beware of your wife creating excuses about your behavior preventing her from doing the right thing. It's called blame shifting and is BS and is a classic WW action.

She did it during the affair too. She would blame you for why she was cheating otherwise she would have been a bad person. But of course she wasn't bad, she was just doing something that not taken in the current context would be bad, but if a person had witnessed all the bad you had done, they would realize she was just doing what she had too,

I'm guessing your wife isn't a person to take responsibility for her choices, nor does she take consequences.

So right now she's putting in a half effort into the R, and it's your fault.

Is that the bottom line of it?

And let me guess, what would make her feel safe would be the following :

1. Stop bring up the affair and just let it die,
2. Stop pushing for her to act with passion and interest towards you. She acted a certain way during the affair, but that was the affair talking and not her.
3. You need to get back to accepting the state of things preaffair. She's getting older and she's just not interested in all that stuff anymore.

How am I doing?


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

File and see if that new reality shocks her into putting more effort into this. I wouldn't go to mc after today sounds like a waste of money. Life is just too short for this crap. You can always stop the d if she comes around.


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## naga75 (Jul 5, 2012)

In one of my wifes emails to OM during our false R, she told him there was "no passion" between us. 
The main reason for that was she was still in contact with OM and therefore he was the focus of that (as he had been for almost 2 years).
After he was removed from the picture permanently, that slowly began to change. And now (one year later), it is COMPLETELY different. Lots of passion. Lots. 
If my wife told me or i found out she had "no passion", after all i have dealt with...id be out the door in a second. Id still be a good dad. 
But i wont be second fiddle anymore, and i wont settle for less than i know i deserve. 
You shouldnt either.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## naga75 (Jul 5, 2012)

And i think shaggy hit the nail right on the head.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## toonaive (Dec 13, 2012)

Shaggy said:


> Slater, beware of your wife creating excuses about your behavior preventing her from doing the right thing. It's called blame shifting and is BS and is a classic WW action.
> 
> She did it during the affair too. She would blame you for why she was cheating otherwise she would have been a bad person. But of course she wasn't bad, she was just doing something that not taken in the current context would be bad, but if a person had witnessed all the bad you had done, they would realize she was just doing what she had too,
> 
> ...


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## ChangingMe (Oct 3, 2012)

slater said:


> She is basically saying I am not helping create an environment where she feels safe and want to please me.


This is not your job right now. Hopefully, eventually, the marriage can be worked on by both partners and grow, but right now, as you are still reeling from her affair, it is not your responsibility to "create an environment where she wants to please you." I don't really even want to think what DD's reaction would be if I said that to him. Pretty sure he would either laugh in my face or point me to the door. 

I don't feel safe in my marriage. DD has one foot out the door. I caused that. I have to deal with it. I want to please him, even when he is distant or angry or says hurtful things. I have hurt him, changed him, and I have to accept that. It's not easy. It hurts. But I want HIM, and I am doing all I can to show that to him. He really doesn't care about that right now, but I am going to do the work and make the effort because I choose to do so -not because of how he acts or his reaction to what I do. 

I still feel like your wife does not get what she's put you through and how precarious her situation is. Is your MC helping? If you are a year past DDay and your wife is still acting entitled, then, at the very least, I think it's time for a new counselor. Your wife needs a wake-up call.


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## BjornFree (Aug 16, 2012)

DevastatedDad said:


> Saw my name. thought I would chime in.
> 
> If you do it, don't get caught.
> If you get caught just start talking about "the fog"
> ...


:iagree:
Its funny how everybody talks about this great "fog" that simply seems to envelope a WS. They get the fog word out and they're deemed remorseful, just caught up in the moment is all. Well all I know is that it takes a hell of a lot of maturity and courage to own your actions and most cheaters can't do that so they find the convenient fog and dopamine or some other addict excuse. Imagine killing the OM or your cheating spouse in a fit of anger and blaming it on the "fog" and hear the judge pronounce you not guilty because you were in the "fog". I bet a lot of betrayed spouses would be more than happy to load up their rifles then.

If you want to have revenge, go have your revenge. In fact declare your intentions up front. That way they can't play the "don't stoop down to my level" card. It doesn't matter that your partner gives your or doesn't give you a free pass, IMO they lost that right when they went ahead and gave themselves permission behind your back. Honestly, if you think that the only way you can stay in your marriage is to have sex with someone else, do it. 

Or you could divorce and say you tried and then bag a winner.


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## btdt (Nov 19, 2012)

BjornFree said:


> :iagree:
> Its funny how everybody talks about this great "fog" that simply seems to envelope a WS. They get the fog word out and they're deemed remorseful, just caught up in the moment is all. Well all I know is that it takes a hell of a lot of maturity and courage to own your actions and most cheaters can't do that so they find the convenient fog and dopamine or some other addict excuse. Imagine killing the OM or your cheating spouse in a fit of anger and blaming it on the "fog" and hear the judge pronounce you not guilty because you were in the "fog". I bet a lot of betrayed spouses would be more than happy to load up their rifles then.
> 
> If you want to have revenge, go have your revenge. In fact declare your intentions up front. That way they can't play the "don't stoop down to my level" card. It doesn't matter that your partner gives your or doesn't give you a free pass, IMO they lost that right when they went ahead and gave themselves permission behind your back. Honestly, if you think that the only way you can stay in your marriage is to have sex with someone else, do it.
> ...


Maybe he should give her three option: 1) She can stay married and have sex with him, 2) She can stay married but he's going to have sex with other women, 3) They can divorce and he will have sex with other women. I wonder which of those options she would find least objectionable.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## btdt (Nov 19, 2012)

BjornFree said:


> :iagree:
> Its funny how everybody talks about this great "fog" that simply seems to envelope a WS. They get the fog word out and they're deemed remorseful, just caught up in the moment is all. Well all I know is that it takes a hell of a lot of maturity and courage to own your actions and most cheaters can't do that so they find the convenient fog and dopamine or some other addict excuse. Imagine killing the OM or your cheating spouse in a fit of anger and blaming it on the "fog" and hear the judge pronounce you not guilty because you were in the "fog". I bet a lot of betrayed spouses would be more than happy to load up their rifles then.
> 
> If you want to have revenge, go have your revenge. In fact declare your intentions up front. That way they can't play the "don't stoop down to my level" card. It doesn't matter that your partner gives your or doesn't give you a free pass, IMO they lost that right when they went ahead and gave themselves permission behind your back. Honestly, if you think that the only way you can stay in your marriage is to have sex with someone else, do it.
> ...


Maybe he should give her three options: 1) She can stay married and have sex with him, 2) She can stay married but he's going to have sex with other women, 3) They can divorce and he will have sex with other women. I wonder which of those options she would find least objectionable.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## skip76 (Aug 30, 2011)

DevastatedDad said:


> Saw my name. thought I would chime in.
> 
> If you do it, don't get caught.
> If you get caught just start talking about "the fog"
> ...




Love it, i have said this numerous times on here and been scolded for such views but it makes sense to me. I see two options

1. do what you want but tell her, no need for secrets when there is no shame, this is now a sham marriage because of her anyway. 

2. work hard at getting her into you, it can happen and i wil write a post after i get back from lunch just how to do it but it takes time, patience, indifference and a big bottle of lotion.


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## akashNil (May 20, 2012)

Sorry you are here.

I think it is not only the lack of sex that is bothering you - you want "THAT" pleasure, "THAT" fun - that she has showered on the OM (Whatever extras she gave to him).

Until you get that from her, you won't get peace - No matter how much sex you get from her or from someone else.

and she owes it to you. Probably she knows that.


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## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

notmarriedyet said:


> I think you should stick to the idea of "having an affair" with your wife.
> 
> It's a GREAT role playing idea! Lots of people do it.
> 
> Maybe approach her with it as a role play, fun type thing. I realize your issues are deeper than just infrequent sex, but it could help a bit.


I don't know about him, but that would trigger me big time. In fact, it would enrage me. I would constantly be thinking "Were you like that with HIM?". Way too many triggers.


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## Robsia (Mar 11, 2013)

^Pretty much what I was thinking too. I remember when our sex life was dwindling (back when he was having his affair) I suggested we pretend we were having an affair.

He argued, saying that surely the whole point of having an affair was the excitement, the possibiility of getting caught.

When he did get caught I reminded him of this conversation, asking him if it was as exciting as he though it would be


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

slater said:


> I know what I should do, and I keep doing it. But these thoughts enter my mind and take days to sttle down. We are working towards R. And like I said, she does almost all that I ask, but she doesn't want to fake her passion for me.
> 
> She knows she spent years making me the bad guy and that she was wrong, but it isn't something she has been able to just turn around. She is grateful for the second chance, but she has never been an emotional person. I had sort of gotten used to it, and felt that that was just her. The A changed that though for me. I saw a different side to her. She claims it "was not her", she was playing a role. The problem is that "charachter is who I want sometimes". See what i mean? She never wants to be that person again.


"Playing a role?" Now, that's often something people who are suffering from depression do. Not offering that as an excuse, just an avenue to explore.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

Robsia said:


> ^Pretty much what I was thinking too. I remember when our sex life was dwindling (back when he was having his affair) I suggested we pretend we were having an affair.
> 
> He argued, saying that surely the whole point of having an affair was the excitement, the possibiility of getting caught.
> 
> When he did get caught I reminded him of this conversation, asking him if it was as exciting as he though it would be


Oh, dear! 

What was his answer? (Oh, right! He was sorry but you weren't supposed to find out, huh?)


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## slater (Feb 3, 2012)

MattMatt said:


> "Playing a role?" Now, that's often something people who are suffering from depression do. Not offering that as an excuse, just an avenue to explore.


oh no doubt. On full meds for it. She is kinda a mess. Has been for a while.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

BjornFree said:


> :iagree:
> Its funny how everybody talks about this great "fog" that simply seems to envelope a WS. They get the fog word out and they're deemed remorseful, just caught up in the moment is all. Well all I know is that it takes a hell of a lot of maturity and courage to own your actions and most cheaters can't do that so they find the convenient fog and dopamine or some other addict excuse. Imagine killing the OM or your cheating spouse in a fit of anger and blaming it on the "fog" and hear the judge pronounce you not guilty because you were in the "fog". I bet a lot of betrayed spouses would be more than happy to load up their rifles then.
> 
> If you want to have revenge, go have your revenge. In fact declare your intentions up front. That way they can't play the "don't stoop down to my level" card. It doesn't matter that your partner gives your or doesn't give you a free pass, IMO they lost that right when they went ahead and gave themselves permission behind your back. Honestly, if you think that the only way you can stay in your marriage is to have sex with someone else, do it.
> ...


I have to disagree. As someone who went through a period of "foggy thinking" I know that this exists. It doesn't make it right, however, what people do in the fog, but experience on TAM as well as personal experience tells me the fog is real.

But this revenge affair stuff. Who is being cheated on? The person having the revenge affair is cheating on themselves, on who they are.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

slater said:


> oh no doubt. On full meds for it. She is kinda a mess. Has been for a while.


Oh, damn. Well, might explain it in part, then.

Side effects of any of the meds? Some of them can really mess with people's ability to think properly. Check them out.


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## Robsia (Mar 11, 2013)

MattMatt said:


> Oh, dear!
> 
> What was his answer? (Oh, right! He was sorry but you weren't supposed to find out, huh?)


He said it was horrible. He had no idea how badly I would be affected. And no, he never thought I would find out. To quote _The Tall Guy_, "You said you liked me because I was clever!"


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## snap (Oct 3, 2011)

It seems she'd always have an excuse in avoiding sex with you. The whole "not feeling safe" is irrelevant, even if you went out of your way to pacify her (which is totally not your job as a BS) there would be something else. Depression, fatigue, problems at work, your choice of TV shows, sun flares, you name it. If one wants to avoid something, rationalization is never a problem.

She's been caught and not going about it in your face way, but she's not putting in effort. I think she doesn't realize, other than on some detached intellectual level, that she really could lose you.


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## BjornFree (Aug 16, 2012)

MattMatt said:


> I have to disagree. As someone who went through a period of "foggy thinking" I know that this exists. It doesn't make it right, however, what people do in the fog, but experience on TAM as well as personal experience tells me the fog is real.
> 
> But this revenge affair stuff. Who is being cheated on? The person having the revenge affair is cheating on themselves, on who they are.


Fog is just you giving into weakness and playing the part of an indecisive helpless victim. That is what the fog is all about, having your cake and eating it when you know you shouldn't but you're too weak to resist.

There's a lot of difference between someone overcome with so much grief that their judgement becomes clouded and someone who's judgement is clouded by temptation and that's why you have them blaming the environment and circumstances for what they did. They're grasping for straws because they don't want to look at themselves as genuinely selfish individuals Cue, I made a mistake, you weren't affectionate enough, I had a connection etc.

No one's asking slater to take the revenge affair route, all anybody's saying is that it is an option if he wants it to be. Slater, by the looks of it, doesn't want to divorce because he wants to shield his kids, you're opposing the idea of him having sex with someone else to stay in a sexless relationship, this after he was cheated on by his wife who doesn't "get it". So what you're asking is that he suffer silently and all I'm suggesting is that if he wants to tolerate this marriage long enough for the kids to grow up, he needn't cut himself off from having sex with a willing partner.


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## Jonesey (Jul 11, 2011)

MattMatt said:


> Oh, damn. Well, might explain it in part, then.
> 
> Side effects of any of the meds? *Some of them can really mess with people's ability to think properly. *Strange dont´t you think? And when busted AD is convenient excuse for low libido.For not having sex with thier BS A win ,win situation...
> 
> ...


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## Jonesey (Jul 11, 2011)

slater said:


> I found value in both CM and DD's comments. Thanks guys. I will say to DD - you have a better shot than I do based on CMs comments.
> 
> We are in MC btw. In fact heading there today. I am not going to have a RA. Thanks guys for helping me see clearly. The WW and I had a talk last night. It did not go so well.* She is basically saying I am not helping create an environment where she feels safe and want to please me.* I am not ugly at home. I do not call her names - I am respectful. At most some days I get depressed and distant which seems to almost piss her off??
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


This is one of the reason´s i wrote this. I´m copy and paste
now..
And finally what makes you think she is not just waiting for you to have enough.And start the divorce proceeding´s.

This way she could tell the kid´s family, friend´s.Yes i effed it up,but i triad and the damage was to much...

I mean what safe environment is she talking about? Especiallay what she did,and treated you and your kid´s..

And take in SNAP´S post... I´m asking you to be carefull.Just be carefull(see above). 13 month´s later ,i will bet 12 month´s salary
she has done nothing to adreess the "passion" for you..

I´m sorry .I know i´m sounding harsh.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

notmarriedyet said:


> I think you should stick to the idea of "having an affair" with your wife.
> 
> It's a GREAT role playing idea! Lots of people do it.
> 
> Maybe approach her with it as a role play, fun type thing. I realize your issues are deeper than just infrequent sex, but it could help a bit.


No! Sorry, but it is *NOT* a great idea!  As a formerly BS if my wife suggested that idea, even now, 15/16 years later, that would just trigger me so bad, I doubt I'd even get an erection.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

Not at all. I was thinking of someone I knew who did some weird stuff. Apparently it was down to the meds they were on.


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## SadandAngry (Aug 24, 2012)

No, he should not suffer silently, he should take action, action that preserves his self worth and dignity. Serve her, make it her last chance, she shapes up and starts trying, or she doesn't, and Slater drops her and moves on without giving her a second thought.


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## somethingelse (Jun 20, 2012)

Whatever you do...just don't have a revenge affair. It won't do you any favors. That 'justified' feeling you have now will fade if you do, and you'll just give her more reason to justify herself if she ever chooses to cheat on you again


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## slater (Feb 3, 2012)

I know that if I leave I will do fine. I am 42, in the best shape I have been in in 15 years and work is going well. She on the other hand is in a slow decline. Almost 40, still in good shape but a mental basket case. I will admit I fear divorce, not for me but for my kids. I believe a man takes care of his children and while D certainly is not abandoning them I would prefer to spare them that. So this is my motivation to make this work. I once loved this woman. She has some good qualities, but if she does not " get it" soon enough I think filing is my only alternative. Maybe it will wake her up, maybe it won't. Either way if I file I will be prepared to go all the way. 

In MC today, our MC asked us to list how we hurt each other. It was sort of funny comparing the two. I don't listen well or take her for granted around the house. She lies to me and had an affair and bad moutheed me. I mean you want to stand up and shout "Really!!"

Our MC gets it but is too gentle on my wife. I have worked with her to basically say move her along or I have to go. With all that is on here that I have learned I feel I am almost as qualified as our MC. Today she hit the WW pretty hard about taking responcibility. I want to think this is her last chance.


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## Jonesey (Jul 11, 2011)

*Sv: Re: Revenge Affair/ My Needs*



MattMatt said:


> Not at all. I was thinking of someone I knew who did some weird stuff. Apparently it was down to the meds they were on.


Thanks for outing me  what kinda meds are we talking about?


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## ChangingMe (Oct 3, 2012)

MattMatt said:


> No! Sorry, but it is *NOT* a great idea!  As a formerly BS* if my wife suggested that idea*, even now, 15/16 years later, that would just trigger me so bad, I doubt I'd even get an erection.


Just want to point out, it was slater that suggested this, not his wife. I totally get where it would be a horrible thing for a WS to suggest.


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## notmarriedyet (Nov 10, 2012)

MattMatt said:


> No! Sorry, but it is *NOT* a great idea!  As a formerly BS if my wife suggested that idea, even now, 15/16 years later, that would just trigger me so bad, I doubt I'd even get an erection.


That night have been a dumb suggestion given the situation. I apologize!

Maybe for people who want to spice it up who haven't been betrayed or been a cheater, yes. 

Gawd! Smacking myself in the head. Doh.


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## slater (Feb 3, 2012)

By saying I wanted her to have an affair with me I simply meant having a more fun sex life and really focus on each other.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

slater said:


> By saying I wanted her to have an affair with me I simply meant having a more fun sex life and really focus on each other.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


You are asking essentially for her to put in effort focused on you, and for you to put in effort focused on her, which is btw entirely reasonable.


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## Summer4744 (Oct 15, 2012)

Slater. How do you think she would react to a divorce?


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## slater (Feb 3, 2012)

Summer4744 said:


> Slater. How do you think she would react to a divorce?


I know this woman very well - or so I thought. But honestly I have no clue. When I confronted her she was ready to file. In fact in the recordings I had she had told her mother she was going to file. Of course after exposure things changed. During the past year we have had out ups and downs and about a month ago I was frustrated and suggested we consider D. She said then that she did not want that- that she wanted to keep working. But as you have read, her overall attitutude leaves much to be desired. 

So I guess I just don't know. She doesn't have any friends really so I think it would be tough on her. I also think knowing it was her fault and seeing the kids suffer would devastate her.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## walkonmars (Aug 21, 2012)

Have you addressed the lack of intimacy with the MC? 

Maybe arrange a consultation with a sex therapist before you make any life-changing decisions would be in order.


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## DaddyLongShanks (Nov 6, 2012)

slater said:


> BS here. 13 months post DDAY. I have been weak. I have not done anything yet but I need support. I have always been the high sex drive one in our marriage. So the fact that she cheated (for 3 years off and on) with a co-worker kills me. She gave him what I was missing. By missing I mean we had sex 6 times in 2010.
> 
> I cannot and probably will never forgive her. But like DevastatedDad, I am staying for our young kids. Someone has to be the grown up. I coach the kids etc.
> 
> ...


You wuss! 

Well, if this is going to be a situation where something inside of her just won't allow hewr to be sexual with you, your going to have to do something. I'm not one to prescribe cheating, but if after some set period of time the relationship partner is not meeting the need, and a basic need which is not greed-based. Which sex and intimacy with you partner is not, I would try to discuss it, and after a reasonable amount of time of it not being responded to leave or cheat.

Usually cheating on the one you care about will make you feel even worse. Don't do it to rub it in her face, do it to get your basic needs met. What's funny is once you are doing the same thing, it takes alot of the "heat" and "excitement" out of what she is doing, she might not be too happy some other babe is screwing "her mans" brains out and come to take what's hers. 

The thing us men think about in this situation ( i've been down the road ), do we really want her back after she's exchanged DNA and bodily fluids with the other guy?


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## calmwinds (Dec 10, 2012)

Just a quick question. I know she's the WS and all, but if someone has no passion for whoopie, my first thought wouldn't be to get it elsewhere, rather, I would ask, "What do YOU think you need to feel more passionate?". Toys? Dinner and a show, followed by a night in a nice hotel away from kids/housework/distractions? The possibilities are endless. I know she was in the wrong by having an A in the first place, but if she's struggling with passion, there are MANY remedies available, sometimes just shaking things up a bit can be arousing.


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## BobSimmons (Mar 2, 2013)

I don't get it? 

So woman lacks passion for husband. 

Has passionate sex with another man. 

Then doesn't have passion for husband.

I'd say she doesn't have passion for husband.

He wants sex from her, she doesn't want it. He feels robbed because she put it out for OM and not him. Even to the point of him saying "Have an affair with me"

You cant force passion. So if you stay for the kids then you might have to do without so much sex.


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## CleanJerkSnatch (Jul 18, 2012)

BobSimmons said:


> You cant force passion. So if you stay for the kids then you might have to do without so much sex.




Or resort to your first option RA. 


I think you have to communicate with your wife in different ways so that she may be more receptive to one communication pathway or another. 

She may feel as if you would not want her after the fact because of X reasons, or she may feel completely unmotivated and unattractive after the fact for Y reasons.

Try it anew, from the start, you're doing all the heavy lifting because she's broken and she cannot lift, the marriage has died and you must rebuild anew. Romance her again, for whatever love, selfish, noble, other reasonable reasons, etc etc etc


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## StillLife (Jan 19, 2013)

Have to second calmwinds and Cleanjerksnatch's comments. Didn't see where it has been addressed, but is your wife a sexual abuse/trauma survivor?

Your wife screwed up royally and yes, in theory she owes you frequent wild sex and anything you could ask for to repair the damage she caused you, but unfortunately, she's a flawed human being, an animal and not a machine. Most of us don't work that way. We operate on feelings as often as we do logic.

That your wife hit the brakes on the divorce shows if she doesn't already love you, then she at least really wants to again. You could be a self gratifying hard ass and go bang some other women to get your needs met and teach her a lesson, or you could really consider what I said above. She made the decision to try and save this marriage, but it sounds like she might need you to take the reigns and guide the both of you in a healthy and dignified way to get there. Does she deserve it? That's up to you to decide, but she is the mother of your children and has chosen to keep you as her husband. That's not always just a given, it's a choice.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## StillLife (Jan 19, 2013)

Should note, I'm saying these things as much to myself as you slater as we're in the exact same boat and it's only been recently and with therapy I've started to figure out where I fit into and can shape things.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## somethingelse (Jun 20, 2012)

slater said:


> I know this woman very well - or so I thought. But honestly I have no clue. When I confronted her she was ready to file. In fact in the recordings I had she had told her mother she was going to file. Of course after exposure things changed. During the past year we have had out ups and downs and about a month ago I was frustrated and suggested we consider D. She said then that she did not want that- that she wanted to keep working. But as you have read, her overall attitutude leaves much to be desired.
> 
> So I guess I just don't know. She doesn't have any friends really so I think it would be tough on her. I also think knowing it was her fault and seeing the kids suffer would devastate her.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


It doesn't sound like either one of you want to D. So I would not suggest doing that. I have been in your situation except my husband was the one who fooled around on me. Unfortunately I made the mistake of going ahead with revenge, because I wasn't sure if I would ever divorce him. Let me tell you... it did not do us any good. 

My advice is to try and forgive your W, even though she is not giving you what you feel you deserve from her. It's seems like the hard route to take, and the easiest one for her, but trust me, revenge and D can be just as grueling. 

As far as getting her to put out more....I have to be honest, I'm not sure how to deal with that. I've never really experienced that sort of thing.


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## slater (Feb 3, 2012)

Had a really rough day today. I asked her a question and got a response I suspected but feared. I am really pissed that after 13 months I am getting new info that I have to directly ask for. I suggested a timeline and our MC agreed it would be a good idea. The fact I learned went exactly to our topic of her giving him more than me.

I am near the end of my rope. I really want to just get away for a couple weeks alone somewhere to clear my head. Gotta go..she just caught a plane out of town and I have a Tball game to coach.


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## DaddyLongShanks (Nov 6, 2012)

The question is:

1. Is your need a selfish unreasonable need?
2. Is your need important?


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## CH (May 18, 2010)

Originally Posted by slater View Post
She is basically saying I am not helping create an environment where she feels safe and want to please me.

It's still about her, you're still the white knight. She's happy being the princess in need of being rescued.

Might be time to let the dragon eat this little princess.

How to get revenge on your cheating girlfriend/fiance - YouTube

This is truly what you should do to a cheater who's so self centered all they can see is only their little world even after they just destroyed yours. BTW, this is what my wife should have done to me with what I put her through.

If you do choose to watch the link, it's got cursing in it at the end of the clip.


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## Chris989 (Jul 3, 2012)

slater said:


> Had a really rough day today. I asked her a question and got a response I suspected but feared. I am really pissed that after 13 months I am getting new info that I have to directly ask for. I suggested a timeline and our MC agreed it would be a good idea. The fact I learned went exactly to our topic of her giving him more than me.
> 
> I am near the end of my rope. I really want to just get away for a couple weeks alone somewhere to clear my head. Gotta go..she just caught a plane out of town and I have a Tball game to coach.


I'll be honest and direct:

This is a lost cause. Your wife has no respect for you. Indeed, she holds you in contempt.

_*I apologise for sounding harsh, but I do not believe you are currently emotionally strong enough to do what you must: divorce her and move on.*_


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## DaddyLongShanks (Nov 6, 2012)

Chris989 said:


> I'll be honest and direct:
> 
> This is a lost cause. Your wife has no respect for you. Indeed, she holds you in contempt.
> 
> _*I apologise for sounding harsh, but I do not believe you are currently emotionally strong enough to do what you must: divorce her and move on.*_


I'm your significant other. I don't need sex and affection. By the way, I don't care. If you don't like it you can leave... Go get it somewhere else, I know there's somebody who will take you on, if your woman/man enough go do it. Your not going to convince me to want to have sex and affection with you. I don't know why you are wearing different clothes, colognes or perfumes, why you have a gym membership. Be honest with yourself, I'm the best you can do and you need to thank me for staying with you. ( The thought process of the WAYWARD or Non-participating or Bully spouse )


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

Any updates slater ? 

One more thing, are you sure the cheating stopped (or hasn't resumed at some level)? if she is not attracted to you even after her affairs stopped, it is obvious what the issue here is.


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## slater (Feb 3, 2012)

Update-

We had a very rough week last week. I was pretty sure I was going to be filing this week. I dug up the name of an attorney I spoke with last year. We were headed down a dark road.

Then I spoke with her Friday am. I did not threaten to file, but rather said I was doubtful I could forgive her. It was almost like a light went on in her. For the first time She started talking about the damage she had done and never mentioned her needs or my mistakes. She finally seemed to get it. I understand, maybe it was her seeing she could lose me and that i was finally willing to let her go. But it clicked.

She went way out of her way over the weekend to show me she understood. She was kind, understanding and perhaps the most fun passionate towards me. She made it clear that she can't undo what has been done but she wants to be with me and understands what that will take. I could see her really trying to put her fears and concerns aside. She made a point to make a new memory for us- something only we have shared.

She opened up about the affair as well and today gave me list of all the things she was sorry for. She said it was incomplete.
She truly wants to make this last. Today in MC, she said she finally gets it, and sees that everyday she will have to work to try to rebuild what she destroyed.

I am going into this cautiously optomistic. I am guarded still but trying to embrace it and let go of some of my fears.

Time will tell. I do know that if I get back to where I was last week I will pull the plug. I want to get off this rollercoaster.

Oh- and she finally agreed to put together a comprehensive timeline for me.

It's like people say on hee a lot, you have to be willing to let them go. I had to finally get there myself. Been working out and working on me. Business is going great too.

Perhaps going to a new church helped and us renewing our committment to our faith. The Easter sermon hit home too. Time for rebirth and Renewal. Not forgetting- but a new better way maybe.


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## somethingelse (Jun 20, 2012)

Way to go slater, this could be the beginning to a really good thing.


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## slater (Feb 3, 2012)

Update-

Things were going well for about 2 weeks, then she started to slack off. It was a slow decline until she was not making any daily effort anymore. I asked for a detailed timeline from her in MC. She took 2 weeks and would only show me in MC. Yesterday she gave me a list of cities she had travelled to during the duration of the affair. No stories, no feelings. She even said she was not sure which cities he was with her in. She had a few notes of when they sort of stopped for a month or so, like after he told her his wife was pregnant, but it always picked up again.

The weirdest part was that she claimed their first kiss, even flirtation was the first night they had sex. She said there was nothing between them prior. I said either that was untrue or she had serious issues f-ing a guy out of the blue. I freaked out and walked on the session.

Last night I told her I felt we were done. At first she was very upset, mad at me. Then later she came in and begged me to stay, but just so the kids would not have to deal with it. It was pretty apparent they were her primary concern. She even suggested I get an apartment "to takes dates to" but we remain married. I was shocked by this suggestion. doesn't this show her lack of undestanding and respect for me and our vows. And her ability to set those vows aside to meet her own wants/ needs? Plus, if she loved me this would be off the table wouldn't it? 

I said these things to her and she said she thought we were done and she was just looking for an alternative to protect the kids. I reminded her convenient it was for her to think about them NOW!

I am still undecided on what to do. Damm her.


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## BK23 (Apr 17, 2013)

Ugh. So sorry you are going through this dude. Sounds like she just doesn't get and never will. You deserve someone decent.


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## vi_bride04 (Mar 28, 2012)

slater said:


> Last night I told her I felt we were done. At first she was very upset, mad at me. Then later she came in and begged me to stay, but just so the kids would not have to deal with it. It was pretty apparent they were her primary concern. *She even suggested I get an apartment "to takes dates to" but we remain married.* I was shocked by this suggestion. doesn't this show her lack of undestanding and respect for me and our vows. And her ability to set those vows aside to meet her own wants/ needs? Plus, if she loved me this would be off the table wouldn't it?


Just sounds like a typical cake eaters response. 

Good luck with everything. And don't have the RA. I had a ONS after my ex said we are divorcing to get back at him. (I did not know he was already in a 6+ month affair) I regret that decision so much. I cheated and did it with all the intention in the world of being a malicious b!tch and hurting him on purpose. And yes, I did tell him right after it happened JUST to see the pain on his face. Its been almost 6 years....and I will carry that around with me the rest of my life of always being a cheater.


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## slater (Feb 3, 2012)

I am not going to have an RA. My thinking has cleared. I will not stoop to her level and violate my own values. She wants us to suffer for the kids. She knew what she was doing. I asked her if she thought about the damage she was doing to them during the affair and her reply was, "That's why i never told you". Again, showing it wasn't about respect for me or guilt, just protecting herself and her kids, but really herself.


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## SomedayDig (Jul 17, 2012)

Sucks to hear you going through this, man. As for her sex the first night thing...yeah, I don't buy it either. Why? Because we ALL know there is usually a "ramp up" before banging someone else. Hell, there's a ramp up before KISSING someone else.

Trickle truther. That's what she is. It sucks when any wayward just doesn't take a deep breath and let all of the sh-t out in one fell swoop. They really think this is a better way.

All of them.


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## Acabado (May 13, 2012)

SomedayDig said:


> Sucks to hear you going through this, man. As for her sex the first night thing...yeah, I don't buy it either. Why? Because we ALL know there is usually a "ramp up" before banging someone else. Hell, there's a ramp up before KISSING someone else.
> 
> Trickle truther. That's what she is. It sucks when any wayward just doesn't take a deep breath and let all of the sh-t out in one fell swoop. They really think this is a better way.
> 
> All of them.


I disagree.
There's ussualy a ramp up but not necessarily in real life. She could be entertaining the idea for a while, more or less subconsciously, giving herself the well known justifications and excuses till the point of being "ready" for it. Then the opportunity arises, the right man in the right place in the right moment and she just went for it.
I've read so many similar stories last years, many affairs start this way, an ONS which becomes full blown affair or at least an on-off thing.


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## SomedayDig (Jul 17, 2012)

Acabado said:


> I disagree.
> There's ussualy a ramp up but not necessarily in real life. She could be entertaining the idea for a while, more or less subconsciously, giving herself the well known justifications and excuses till the point of being "ready" for it. Then the opportunity arises, the right man in the right place in the right moment and she just went for it.
> I've read so many similar stories last years, many affairs start this way, an ONS which becomes full blown affair or at least an on-off thing.


While I don't disagree with anything you said, I guess I should restate my idea of ramping up. My idea is more in line with your comment "She could be entertaining the idea for a while". It's not like just out of the blue she decided to go flirt, kiss and have sex with a guy. That just sounds crazy.


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

I mentioned it in your older thread. She does not want to be known as that "woman that cheated and got divorced". You are not the only one staying together for kids. She cannot be more obvious than this.

You really tried hard but this isn't working. Every time you threaten her, she will do the minimum to keep your hopes up and drag you back in. This time, the act is up and she won't even do that


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

You exposed, right ? Maybe she is worried about what the kids will think of her.


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

> She even suggested I get an apartment "to takes dates to" but we remain married.


What the flying f*ck ?? You were/are in a false R. Does she come from a very religious family ? The reconciliation was never about you/your happiness or making up to you.


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

SomedayDig said:


> While I don't disagree with anything you said, I guess I should restate my idea of ramping up. My idea is more in line with your comment "She could be entertaining the idea for a while". It's not like just out of the blue she decided to go flirt, kiss and have sex with a guy. That just sounds crazy.


And it was 3 years of the same guy, right ?


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## slater (Feb 3, 2012)

warlock07 said:


> I mentioned it in your older thread. She does not want to be known as that "woman that cheated and got divorced". You are not the only one staying together for kids. She cannot be more obvious than this.
> 
> You really tried hard but this isn't working. Every time you threaten her, she will do the minimum to keep your hopes up and drag you back in. This time, the act is up and she won't even do that


I fear you are right...but yes



warlock07 said:


> You exposed, right ? Maybe she is worried about what the kids will think of her.


By far this seems to be her biggest fear- the kids knowing. They are young 9 and 6. But I did expose to her family and mine and a few of her friends. on DDay



warlock07 said:


> What the flying f*ck ?? You were/are in a false R. Does she come from a very religious family ? The reconciliation was never about you/your happiness or making up to you.


no- not very, but her brother is religious.



warlock07 said:


> And it was 3 years of the same guy, right ?


yup. same guy, full EA/PA, I love you's the whole bit.


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## cledus_snow (Feb 19, 2012)

you're living in a sham of a marriage, amigo.

maybe time to say "hasta la vista."


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## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

slater said:


> She even suggested I get an apartment "to takes dates to" but we remain married. I was shocked by this suggestion. doesn't this show her lack of undestanding and respect for me and our vows. And her ability to set those vows aside to meet her own wants/ needs? Plus, if she loved me this would be off the table wouldn't it?


She just said that to alleviate her own guilt. If you actually did it, she would hit the roof.


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## SadandAngry (Aug 24, 2012)

She may be having difficulty owning up to the reality of what she did. Of no longer caring whether what she did hurt you. Of losing all compassion or empathy for you.


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## domah (May 18, 2012)

slater said:


> BS here. 13 months post DDAY. I have been weak. I have not done anything yet but I need support. I have always been the high sex drive one in our marriage. So the fact that she cheated (for 3 years off and on) with a co-worker kills me. She gave him what I was missing. By missing I mean we had sex 6 times in 2010.
> 
> I cannot and probably will never forgive her. But like DevastatedDad, I am staying for our young kids. Someone has to be the grown up. I coach the kids etc.
> 
> ...


Two wrongs don't make a right. I feel you though.

With children, its more difficult. Otherwise, I'd say take a trip to thailand and have as much sex as you want.


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## barbados (Aug 30, 2012)

slater said:


> Update-
> 
> Things were going well for about 2 weeks, then she started to slack off. It was a slow decline until she was not making any daily effort anymore. I asked for a detailed timeline from her in MC. She took 2 weeks and would only show me in MC. Yesterday she gave me a list of cities she had travelled to during the duration of the affair. No stories, no feelings. She even said she was not sure which cities he was with her in. She had a few notes of when they sort of stopped for a month or so, like after he told her his wife was pregnant, but it always picked up again.
> 
> ...


She cheated on you for over *3 YEARS*, she has been in *False R* with you since D-Day, and now she is holding you hostage with the kids ?

NOW SHE CARES ABOUT THE KIDS ? REALLY ?

What are you undecided about ?


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## slater (Feb 3, 2012)

why do you say false R? I have no proof, and really don'y suspect her of violating NC or pursuing anyone else. I have kept up my vigilance. She has been trying, though as I mentioned not to level I would like. I am not defending her, just curious why you use that term. I thought it applied to someone with false intentions. Maybe her intentions are false, only trying to protect her image and the kids. Hell I am pretty much here for the kids. What sane person stays after a 3yr affair unless there are kids involved?

It is a $hit situation, no doubt. I have looked and looked for proof she is just playing me. I see some things that point to that and then I see her really trying some. That's why I am on here. You guys keep me grounded. It is easy to lose perspective when you are in the midst of it all. I do know I have not done my part to the fullest in R. It is so hard. So many days I don't want to be nice to her.


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## scorp79 (Apr 25, 2013)

Revenge cheating really does help with mental health when dealing with what has occurred and if/when it occurs again.

It helps prevent the obsessing and thoughts that fly through your head.

It is a personal thing that no one needs to know about.


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