# Is this just a harmless fantasy?



## Pixie222 (Feb 26, 2013)

My husband just told me that he gets off on the idea of having sex with me when I'm clearly saying 'no' and don't want it to happen. He was very clear that he was not talking about role play.

Given that a couple of months ago he did have sex with me after I very clearly and repeatedly told him 'no', is this just a harmless fantasy or something more? 

Could it be a coincidence that this is a massive turn on for him, ie a misunderstanding leading to a one off incident?

I just don't know what to make of it.


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## richie33 (Jul 20, 2012)

Seems pretty creepy.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## PHTlump (Jun 2, 2010)

Dominance/rape fantasies are common for both men and women. If you're into it, or you stick with role playing, then its fine. If he actually starts forcing you, not so much.

Good luck.


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## LoriC (Feb 18, 2013)

The fact that he is acting out this fantasy without your blessing is disturbing. Lets call it what it is, a rape fantasy. 

Look at the creep who was just convicted for what he called "Just a fantasy" of killing and eating women. 

I think you better have a sit down with him. It is not cool for him to force himself on you when you have verbally said "NO".


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

keeping it fantasy and role playing- "normal and harmless"

implementing it for real- NOT HARMLESS


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## YinPrincess (Jul 31, 2011)

If he had sex with you after you clearly said "no" then that is rape.

I think a lot of men (and women) have rape fantasies... But it is not okay to actually rape someone!  Rape is about power and control. It's almost never about the actual sex...
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

This is an instance when you and your H need to agree whether to indulge in this fantasy. It's a normal fantasy for both men and woman. The trouble is, when the man has the fantasy to over power and not stop with a no.

If you both agree that this can be indulged at times, you need a safe work because ignoring the NO is a turn on for him. You use the safe word when you absolutely will leave the bed if he continues. The safe word alerts him that this role play is OVER. I would suggest, if you are comfortable indulging, that you arrange a time for him to force you and you play into his fantasy. Remind him during the fantasy that you're NOT safewording.

Personally, I LOVE this role play.


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## Happyquest (Apr 21, 2009)

Pixie222 said:


> My husband just told me that he gets off on the idea of having sex with me when I'm clearly saying 'no' and don't want it to happen. He was very clear that he was not talking about role play.
> 
> Given that a couple of months ago he did have sex with me after I very clearly and repeatedly told him 'no', is this just a harmless fantasy or something more?
> 
> ...


If your NO was a true no and not part of any fantasy play then its very very wrong. If this is not part of play then he needs some help.


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## IsGirl3 (Nov 13, 2012)

your husband is a dirty dog for having sex with you after you clearly said no. what a selfish man. he really didn't care about you at all when he had sex with you after saying no. it's really disgusting what he did and unacceptable.

even though it was a few months ago, since it is obviously still very troubling to you, as it should be, you should tell him that it better never happen again or you will leave. how dare he.


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## ScarletBegonias (Jun 26, 2012)

I will have to agree with the rest.Roleplaying is great and can be very convincing if you're up to snuff on your acting skills.But if he actually needs it to be real,he should get counseling asap.
Rape fantasies,as others have said,are common and not at all harmful if BOTH parties are interested and enjoying it.


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## nevergveup (Feb 18, 2013)

Well,your husband needs to respect your wishes when you say no.
Your husband has already told you partially what excites him.

I think this is his way of getting you both two talk about it.
If you both can work on an agreement that pleases both of you.
Like most posters have role playing,safe word he knows and 
making certain sex role playing days.

This way hes happy,your happy and your marriage wins.I would
imagine it was a big scary step for him to tell you how he feels
and he knows that what he did was wrong.


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## MaritimeGuy (Jul 28, 2012)

It's not my cup of tea. What turns me on is the idea my partner is eager to have sex with me...not the opposite.

I've heard it said though when you're into this kind of role playing you should have a safe word. So in this instance 'No' may mean 'Yes' but 'insert safe word here' means stop...immediately and no questions asked.


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## MaritimeGuy (Jul 28, 2012)

After re-reading your original question I want to add wanting to have sex with you against your will (no role playing) is a sick fantasy. Rape is not a sex crime...it's a crime of violence and domination. It a person wants to commit violence against a woman the most hurtful thing you can do to her is rape her. It's the ultimate humiliation. In my mind men who do this actually hate women.


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## Lionlady (Sep 12, 2012)

No! That is not harmless. That's rape. 

Lots of people have rape fantasies, and it would be fine if you acted out a scenario that you had previously agreed to. But doing it when you said no and meant no. Rape.


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## inarut (Feb 9, 2013)

Pixie222 said:


> My husband just told me that he gets off on the idea of having sex with me when I'm clearly saying 'no' and don't want it to happen. * He was very clear that he was not talking about role play.*
> Given that a couple of months ago he did have sex with me after I very clearly and repeatedly told him 'no', is this just a harmless fantasy or something more?
> 
> Could it be a coincidence that this is a massive turn on for him, ie a misunderstanding leading to a one off incident?
> ...


The bolded part concerns me. What exactly did he say? This type of fantasy, nothing wrong with it, can *only* be role played or it is rape.

Are you sure he wasnt just trying to tell you to really play it up to the hilt....that he wants it to feel very realistic?


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## notperfectanymore (Mar 1, 2012)

Based on this AND your other thread..you are in a very sexually ABUSIVE relationship. It concerns me that you don't see it for what it is...your husband is a monster...and you can do better...PLEASE take care of yourself....you really DO deserve better....you don't deserve to be raped by him...yes, he is a rapist...I'm so sorry....


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## Pixie222 (Feb 26, 2013)

inarut said:


> The bolded part concerns me. What exactly did he say? This type of fantasy, nothing wrong with it, can *only* be role played or it is rape.
> 
> Are you sure he wasnt just trying to tell you to really play it up to the hilt....that he wants it to feel very realistic?


I asked him outright if he meant role play and he said no. I obviously want it to be nothing more than a harmless fantasy, but if its not role play it is real...

I'm just so confused as in the 10 years that I have been with him, nothing 'bad' happened until a couple of months ago. And now this revelation.


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## CuddleBug (Nov 26, 2012)

Sometimes "no" means "yes". 

If I said no to sex and my wifee had sex with me anyway, would I say its rape? No. In my mind as a male that isn't but if he forced himself into his wife after she strongly said "NO", then not cool and that is rape.

But if her "no" was casual and not firm, he might take it as a maybe and its okay.

If she wore a strap on and had anal sex with him while he slept, rape, right?

You both have to talk about your fetishes and fantasies and work out limits to what's okay.


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## inarut (Feb 9, 2013)

I think you need to get more info from him about this. What exactly does he want/what specifically about it turns him on. If not role play then what? How does he characterize it? Ask lots of questions first. Try not to sound judgemental or he may close up. 

You say nothing "bad" has happened after being together 10 yrs? I think there would be signs, behaviors, character flaws, etc. if he were a man capable of actual rape. After 10 yrs. you know him. Are there?


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## notperfectanymore (Mar 1, 2012)

CuddleBug said:


> Sometimes "no" means "yes".
> 
> If I said no to sex and my wifee had sex with me anyway, would I say its rape? No. In my mind as a male that isn't but if he forced himself into his wife after she strongly said "NO", then not cool and that is rape.
> 
> ...


I am HORRIFIED by this post...you really need to read her other thread...she IS married to a monster...


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## Pixie222 (Feb 26, 2013)

inarut said:


> I think you need to get more info from him about this. What exactly does he want/what specifically about it turns him on. If not role play then what? How does he characterize it? Ask lots of questions first. Try not to sound judgemental or he may close up.
> 
> You say nothing "bad" has happened after being together 10 yrs? I think there would be signs, behaviors, character flaws, etc. if he were a man capable of actual rape. After 10 yrs. you know him. Are there?


Maybe I don't know him as well as I thought. I was totally shocked by what happened a couple of months ago but told myself it would just be a one off, even though at the back of my mind there was a nagging voice telling me I shouldn't be so sure of that. The 'rape fantasy' was his justification for not stopping when I told him 'no'. (Previously he said it was because he thought really meant yes, which I never believed for various reasons)


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## PHTlump (Jun 2, 2010)

notperfectanymore said:


> I am HORRIFIED by this post...you really need to read her other thread...she IS married to a monster...


You seriously think that a mewling, giggling "no" is the same as a stern and forceful "NO!!"? It seems horrific to assert that those two scenarios are equivalent.

And I did check out her first thread. She said her husband didn't use a condom. What a monster. She then said that rape counselors had convinced her that he raped her once. But that was the only problem in 10 years. She didn't give any specifics of the alleged rape. I assume it wasn't particularly violent, if it took third parties to convince her that it was rape. Perhaps it was rape. Perhaps it wasn't.


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## inarut (Feb 9, 2013)

I just read your other thread. I think you need to really listen to that nagging voice inside you. Trust it. No matter what anyone says here only you know what truly happened a few months ago, what you felt and experienced. The fact that he is your husband can make the incident so much more confusing, maybe unclear to you. I think you know there is something seriously wrong with your husband but are having trouble really facing and accepting it. You used the word rape. You were not unsure about it. You dont want it to be true. I think you are here hoping for someone to say it wasnt so you can let it go. But you cant let it go can you? Because if it really were nothing but "play" or "miscommunication" you wouldnt be so conflicted. It would not be effecting you like this.


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## PHTlump (Jun 2, 2010)

Catherine602 said:


> Since when is the violation of one human by another have anything to do with how many times it has taken place? If there is no violence just force, should she just brush off her clothing and begin lifting so she is ready the next time he uses force?


Of course not. I'm saying that, if there was one instance of her husband acting like a jerk, over a 10-year marriage, does that mean he's a monster? Probably not. Maybe he was just a jerk one time. Maybe he was beyond a jerk. I don't know.



> She may have been smart enough to stop resisting when he got more forceful fearing more harm. Does that make it ok that she was forced?


You think that her husband was a meek and mild guy for 10 years, then got out of hand one time, and her survival instinct kicked in so that she stopped fighting so that he wouldn't maim or kill her? That doesn't sound plausible.



> Sex without consent is rape. she does not have to fight till she is murdered or injured. I believe that is reasonable.


Sure. But how consent is communicated is what I am questioning. I think there are several ways to do it.



> There is no ambiguity in interpretation or in action. No means no, period. Some of the things you are confused about are taken completely out of the equation.


That's just ridiculous. Sometimes, no means no. Sometimes, no means maybe. Sometimes, no means I want you to talk me into it.



> As for being convinced that she was raped. Her doubts are to her credit. She could not believe that a man she has loved and trusted for so many years would rape her.


As you say, she is to be credited for that. I think 10 years of good behavior should buy a man the benefit of the doubt.



> The councilors had no vested interest in convincing her that she was raped they looked at the facts. They used a simple criteria, did she say no and did he hear.


You must not know many counselors. I do. Many drug and alcohol counselors see addiction behind every corner. Did you drink more than 2 drinks at any time in the last year? If so, you're an alcoholic. Many abuse counselors see abuse behind every corner. Have you ever hesitated to disagree with your husband? If so, you're a battered wife. Many rape counselors see rape behind every corner. Have you ever had sex where you didn't provide a notarized consent form beforehand, or perhaps you giggled out a little non-serious objection before you let go and enjoyed yourself? If so, you were raped.



> Sexual assult is one of the most undereported crimes. Women blame themselves and/or are blamed by others or/and are called liers more often than not.


And that is unfortunate. But that doesn't mean that we should expand the definition of rape to an unreasonable degree. If a woman strenuously objects and a man continues, then it's a crime. If a woman doesn't, then it's gets much more gray than you care to admit.


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## Pixie222 (Feb 26, 2013)

Inarut, I think you are right about why I am feeling conflicted. I hadn't thought about it like that.

Catherine602 - 'She could not believe that a man she has loved and trusted for so many years would rape her'. This is exactly how I feel, thank you.

PHTlump, I'm not going to go into any more detail about what happened. I think the only important information is that i said a 'stern and forceful no', as you put it. Repeatedly, if that makes a difference. And the rape counsellors didn't convince me of anything. As Catherine602 says, they simply listened to the facts, and then explained to me what I really already knew.


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## Wiserforit (Dec 27, 2012)

So long as the husband sees this through to the end I don't see a problem with it. That would be him in jail with bubba and his boys doing the same thing to him.


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## Woodchuck (Nov 1, 2012)

LoriC said:


> The fact that he is acting out this fantasy without your blessing is disturbing. Lets call it what it is, a rape fantasy.
> 
> Look at the creep who was just convicted for what he called "Just a fantasy" of killing and eating women.
> 
> I think you better have a sit down with him. It is not cool for him to force himself on you when you have verbally said "NO".


YES, in some context it might be seen as a little "creepy"However, don't rule it out too quickly.....this dosn't mean you *can't participate *in these fantasies with him *IF you are OK with it*......

In fact I'm sure he would love it, and YES *if it go's no farther *it is HARMLESS....*BUT "YOU" MUST BUY IN BEFOREHAND*....

I'll bet most pubescent boys have a fantasy of riding with mongol hordes(or vikings) to pillage the countryside....

I think people into that sort of thing set up a code word......Like "NO" really means ravish me you big hairy viking! And *HELL NO *means *HELL NO*.... 

Only you know if you can be "into" this sort of play with your partner, and You probably have a sense of how "playful" your partner is being....I hope you two can communicate and find a solution both of you will enjoy:smthumbup:


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## PHTlump (Jun 2, 2010)

Catherine602 said:


> Strenuous, really. How about just no? Your interpretation of strenuous is different than mine I am sure.


Perhaps. Perhaps your definition of premeditated is different than mine. But it is a required component for many crimes. Your definition of intent is certainly different than mine. Because of these differences, it's a good thing that we use juries to determine whether the elements of a crime were met.



> The lack of acceptence of the simple word no is precisely why there are rape laws and why they are expanded. The stipulation is that the word no means stop, don't go ahead, don't interpret. No matter how it is said or what your interpretation is.


So, in your opinion, intent always follows language? In other words, if your husband throws you a surprise party, and you laugh and say that you're going to kill him, he should call 911 because you threatened his life? You said the words. Are you saying that he should know, because of your jovial attitude, that you didn't mean them literally? Surely not. Given your insistence on the clarity of language as being sufficient evidence for a crime, you would never speak with anything other than absolute, literal meaning and intent. Right? 



> To proceed because a particular type of no does not meet your particular definition is dangerous, for you and any woman you may want sex from.


That is true. The safest course of action is to obtain a notarized consent form before any session of sex. And the form should list exactly what sex acts will be performed, and in what order. And the couple should never deviate from that list. Anything less leaves one vulnerable to an accusation of rape.

The OP has expanded on her original statements. She said that her husband coerced her over her repeated, and strenuous, objections. I was assuming more of a miscommunication than that appears to be. She also clarified her claim of rape. In her other thread, she said she only used the word after the counselors assured her she was raped. I interpreted that to mean that she didn't think she was raped until after they convinced her. She now said that she did think she was raped, but didn't want to say it until after she had independent confirmation. So, our debate on whether a giggling, mewling, non-serious objection should necessarily shut down a sexual encounter is moot. That's not what occurred with the OP. And we're obviously not going to agree on the general principle.


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## Catherine602 (Oct 14, 2010)

PH None of this has anything to do with consent in sexual encounters. 

However, this is a masterpiece of logic or lack thereof. I think i could use this post in a course on logic. One hundred faults of logic in less than 2,000 words. It would take a semester to recount them all. 

The debate is about consent by a woman for a sexual encounter. You dont need a judge and jury to accept a no, even when an orgasm is at stake. 

It is a code of behavior that is commonly required in all civilized societies. Although, i can see from the above that there is a lot of mental gymnastics to justify not accepting a simple no. 

Have at lest a little empathy for women. I am certain you know some women that you care about and want to protect, right? How would you like them to be treated? 

There is nothing wrong with being cautious in sexual encounters. Getting sex is not that important.


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## Plan 9 from OS (Jul 13, 2012)

I looked at your other thread, and you marriage is not normal. You are married to a ticking time bomb. He's already raped you once - maybe more times than you mentioned here?

You need to get away from him before you seriously get hurt.


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## Pixie222 (Feb 26, 2013)

Thank you for all the replies, I'm still as confused as ever. Especially as he has since denied ever saying it and is now claiming the complete opposite - that he would be totally turned off if I didn't want to have sex. But past events do not bear witness to this. This means that he has now given me 3 completely different justifications/reasons as to why he continued after I said no.

He changes his mind continuously about everything, or claims the conversation never took place. I can't keep up with where he is at and feel that I have no ability to know when he is giving me his true opinion on something. I'm not even sure that he knows himself some of the time. It's confusing and exhausting. And I feel stupid for ever thinking badly of him. 95% of the time he is a perfectly lovely husband and excellent father. So why do i feel that I can't trust him completely any more?


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## forevermemorable (Oct 19, 2012)

My first thought is...the turn on is, is that you are playing hard to get and that sounds like a fascination to me (I don't mean me personally). Maybe your husband had a prior relationship like this and it is just playing itself out in your marriage. Communication is the key!

I really want to focus on why you are withholding yourself from your husband? It seems like by your very questioning of these endeavors of his, you view sex as a tool and or a chore. Sex is NOT a vice in which you can withhold any time you want as a weapon or incentive. Sex is a gift and should be freely given at all opportunities (which are convenient and appropriate).

I think a women does a big disservice to a husband by refraining him in fulfilling his fantasies and vice versa. Granted that these fantasies are not way out there (i.e. hooks in the backs, whipping, sex in public, etc.).

It seems like there are many others in this thread who have some very obscure and tainted views on sex. I pity you. Sex is not a tool and it should not be leverage to use against the other. My wife and I have implemented (not perfectly practiced) our own special days. My wife will have sex one way and the next time, I will have it my way...its a give and take relationship. And its not like we don't enjoy it no matter which way it is...there are just preferences about it...that's all.

Yes, I am a man and I do have fantasies...I have imagination and I think most men do. And because I have these fantasies, do I have to suppress them, because my wife thinks their strange? That would not be a loving relationship now, would it? I am thankful that my wife partakes in fulfilling my fantasies, because SHE LOVES ME! "Its a good thing she loves you, because I could never do a thing like that to my husband" you would say. And I think that is sad. A marriage is NOT about you, but the two of you. And I think that is what is missing in most marriages today. THEY ARE JUST ONE SIDED!!!

Above all else...communicated with each other! Love each other! Fulfill each other! Cherish each other! Grow together as a couple! Learn from one another. By this, you will do excellent.


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## Pixie222 (Feb 26, 2013)

I'm sorry if I have given the impression that I with hold sex from my husband. I have never done this. The one and only time I have ever said a firm 'no' he continued anyway. I'm certainly not into game playing.

I try my hardest to communicate with him, but due to his constant change of opinion on pretty much everything we talk about, it is not easy.

I don't understand how I am making the marriage about me?


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## forevermemorable (Oct 19, 2012)

Pixie222 said:


> I'm certainly not into game playing.
> 
> ...but due to his constant change of opinion on pretty much everything we talk about, it is not easy.
> 
> I don't understand how I am making the marriage about me?


I didn't mean to infer anything. And I am glad to hear the two of you have an active sex life...wonderful! Change of opinion on everything!? Sounds like your husband is lost and confused...hasn't found his place in this world. Does he jump from one job to the next? How are his commitments? Does he fulfill them or does he procrastinate? Does your husband keep friends? Is your husband bi-polar?

In regards to game playing...why not? Not your style?

I want to be totally upfront with you from a husband's prospective. If I asked my wife for sex or made advances for sex and then my wife would say "no" or ignore me...I would consider this rejection and I would be hurt. Of course, I totally understand valid excuses (i.e. being on her period, headache, aches and pains, and the like).

I don't agree with how others have responded in this thread claiming that your husband is raping you, or trying to rape you, or trying to fulfill some sick sex fantasy...I utterly disagree with this. Does your husband get turned on when you tell him no or he just trying to be persistent?

Maybe its the way you say no? Do you say "no" with a strong demonstrative voice or do you say "no" with a soft tender "cute" voice...BIG difference.


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## Pixie222 (Feb 26, 2013)

It's interesting that you ask if he is bi-polar. He has often wondered if he might be and up until a couple of years before we met he was on all sorts of medication and seeing a psychiatrist, but this all seems to have been long forgotten but I'm starting to wonder if there is an issue after all for various reasons.

I have had sex with my husband when I didn't want to purely to not hurt his feelings. well, that and the fact I can't bear the guilt if i don't.

When I did try to refuse sex I was very clear, I was not being cute or playful. I said it over and over. 

And he told me that he was turned on by the idea of having sex with me when I was telling him no, which is I guess why people have responded in the way that they have.


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## forevermemorable (Oct 19, 2012)

I have known two people really well over many years who have been diagnosed with bi-polar disease. It is definitely a chemical imbalance in the brain. Very hard to live with someone. Its takes lots of patience!

Your husband probably is passionate and dead on about one thing one moment and than the next moment he is arguing arguably against it the next moment.

I am curious though (if you are willing to be transparent), what are the reasons and times for you to tell your husband no to sex? Bad mood, you both are upset at each other?


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## Pixie222 (Feb 26, 2013)

There have only Been a handful of times and it's been because I was sleeping - he went through a phase of initiating in the middle of the night or very early morning, when I had been up for hours in the night with the children. I would tell him I was sleeping and brush his hands off me but this didn't put him off so I would go along with it so I didn't upset him. On the one occasion he did stop after I brushed him away he started sulking and told me I obviously didn't love him or find him attractive any more so of course I felt guilty and went with it. 

Can I ask why you don't think he raped me? I don't mean what I have described above, but the time I said a very clear no.


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## forevermemorable (Oct 19, 2012)

Pixie222 said:


> Can I ask why you don't think he raped me? I don't mean what I have described above, but the time I said a very clear no.


I don't consider it rape when you go along with it. Yes, you said the words "no" but you still allowed your husband access, in order to appease him and keep the peace. "Rape" does not need to be redefined in these TAM forums.

The legal definition of rape is, "A criminal offense defined in most states as forcible sexual relations with a person against that person's will." It might have been against your will, but it was not "forced." Did you fight against your husband or resist him as he tried to penetrate you? Both the elements of "forcible" and "against your will" need to be in place in order for it to be constituted as rape.

Never the less, there are some issues in your marriage that have to be addressed, which I highly recommend the both of you seeing a counselor about, if you the two of you cannot effectively communicate with each other (which sounds like you can't).

I think you two are at a stale mate in your marriage. Your husband does not love you the way he should be loving you and you are not giving him the respect he deserves. One thing I can tell you about love is that it does NOT demand! For your husband to throw out the line, "If you love me, you would..." That is the big no, no phrase for anyone to throw out, which obviously shows that the person who says it, is very selfish in his way of thinking and obviously does not care about the person to which the phrase is said. And for your husband to wake you up for sex, is absolutely one of the most selfish acts in a marriage I have heard of. It would be better for him to go whack off, then to obscure a sleeping mother. It sounds like you are in a very much one sided relationship and the love is lacking or non-existent.

But, I am sure that there is a lack of respect towards your husband...and I do not blame you. Its very hard to give your husband respect when he doesn't love you the way a husband should. And now the classic stalemate question is before the both of you, "Why should I be the first one to change?" Every marriage before divorce is presented with this phrase for years before someone can't take it anymore. You see, no one wants to change! We are all stubborn and selfish in nature. But the truth of the matter is, if you gave your husband the respect he needs, he might start loving you the way you need. And vice versa, if your husband gave you the true love you needed, you would start respecting him more. BUT, someone has to give in and initiate!

The fact that your husband is bi-polar does not help any, which I believe counseling is in order. Remember, love is patient, love is kind, and love does not seek its own, nor is it puffed up. Love also does not take into account the wrongs that have been suffered. One of the greatest weapons for a man in marriage is to tell his wife, "I am sorry for the way I treated you" or "I am sorry for doing..." If a man swallows his pride and arrogance and humbles himself before his wife, there can be restoration, forgiveness, and genuine intimacy once again. I have been in this place before many times and vice versa. My wife and I learn to ask for forgiveness and forgive each other, so we can make a marriage work. Ultimately, this is where you two need to be...getting their is the battle.

I hope the best for the two of you and I want to see you work...for your own sake and for your kid's sake. There is nothing like a marriage that is built on unselfish love for each other; where one person puts the other's need before their own needs; where one cherishes, encourages, and leads by example towards the other.

Don't give up on your marriage just yet. Fight to keep it...not in the sense of with your fists and bad words...but with love, humility, respect, patience. You can do it.


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## Pixie222 (Feb 26, 2013)

Thank you for your detailed response, you make some very interesting points.

I have no desire to redefine rape, but saying I allowed my husband access is somewhat of an assumption as I never gave any details other than the fact I had repeatedly told him no. What about the fact there should be trust in marriage? Is it not reasonable for a wife to expect her husband to stop if she asks him to? Or does that constitute showing him a lack of respect?

Am I also showing my husband a lack of respect because I do not wish to indulge his rape fantasy? He told me very clearly that he was not talking about role play, he is turned on by the idea of having sex me against my will. In order to show her husband respect, does a wife have to submit to all her husbands desires?

Just curious


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## forevermemorable (Oct 19, 2012)

The fact that your husband does not respect your "no" wishes is an indicator that he is selfish and not loving and respecting you the way a husband should. Love does not demand! What kind of love would demand something from another? That is not love.

Let me offer some sound wisdom in regards to your husband's rape fantasies. I firmly believe that your husband has been indulging in porn online. Porn online is filled with every type of perversion known to man. Anything and everything can be seen online in combinations you never thought possible. I mean, people are getting sexually stimulated by others defecating in other's mouths. And unfortunately, there is "so-called" rape porn. Although, its not actually rape, but actors acting out "so-called" rape scenes. I believe this is where your husband gets his fantasies from. He sees one thing online and he wants to act out those fantasies with you.

There is a demonic hold on your husband's life. Let me explain...I believe in the the forces of good and evil at work in our world today. We hear a still small voice talking to us at times telling us that what we are doing is either right or wrong. No one has to tell you that it is wrong to steal or kill, the rightful desire to do good is in us. In the same regards, the wrongful desires to do bad is also in us. These two wage war within our own minds daily and we either fight the impulses to do wrong with making right decisions or we give in to those negative and evil forces to do evil. I am really not trying to be religious here, but talking about a basic fundamental prospective.

We all have done wrong in one form or fashion...that is truth. But it is always our choice to decide if we want to continually do wrong or pursue what is right and noble. You are either aspiring for good in life or aspiring towards wickedness. You reap what you sow. If you sow to a dark way of thinking...things that are distorted, immoral, wicked, than you will reap that in which you sow to. You become what you seek and desire. However, if you sow to what is good and morally sound, you will reap a character that is gentle, kind, caring, unselfish, and loving. The choice is up to each of us.

It sounds to me that your husband is wrapped up in these rape fantasies that he has indulged with online. There is hope though. I like the 12 step program AA has to offer. You see, the first step is admitting you have a problem. That is the biggest and hardest step. No one wants to believe he or she has a problem. In fact, people project that everyone else is to blame or everyone else is the problem. The first step is confession! The second step is believing that you cannot overcome that problem by your own effort or strength. The third step is believing in a high power to help you overcome that problem.

I don't want to go through all the steps, but to give you a basic understanding of where your husband needs to go from here. First things first...your husband needs to believe that he has a problem. A very very difficult thing for any person to come to grips with and especially someone who is bi-polar.

I want to turn now to specifically address some very profound and thought provoking questions you asked:



Pixie222 said:


> What about the fact there should be trust in marriage? Is it not reasonable for a wife to expect her husband to stop if she asks him to? Or does that constitute showing him a lack of respect?
> 
> Am I also showing my husband a lack of respect because I do not wish to indulge his rape fantasy? He told me very clearly that he was not talking about role play, he is turned on by the idea of having sex me against my will. In order to show her husband respect, does a wife have to submit to all her husbands desires?


You are not showing a lack of respect when you tell your husband "no" when he persists on trying to fulfill his rape fantasies. When your husband goes against morality and tries to make you conform to that standard of living or way of life, it is not love and it is in your right to take a stance and tell him "No. You do not have the right to act out immoral impulses with me."

I asked my wife for her thoughts in terms of your posed question here of and she told me that you need to have a talk with your husband and tell him what is and is not acceptable in your marriage. Your husband should be told that your desire to respect him, but he makes it hard to when he tries and forces you to do things that are against your nature and against morality. Your husband needs help in regards to these sick perverted fantasies he has. Your husband needs accountability against going to online porn or wherever he is getting these distorted perceptions of what love making is. Love making is both parties doing something in agreement with each other to fulfill each other.

My wife does not like to give oral sex, but every once in a great while she will go down on me, because she knows its something I like and she sacrifices herself for me...not because I demand her to or even implore her to, but because she loves me and does it on her own accord. That is true love. Love does not demand! Love does not force! Love does not seek its own!

The two of you need to sit down and have a heart-to-heart filled conversation where everything can be laid out on the table without fear. You need to convey all your feelings about his indulgences and maybe even where these indulges come from. Your husband needs to know where you stand on your desires not to participate in his rape fantasies and that they will not be tolerated or accepted, because they go against your nature and against morality. It is not right to rape another being...it has never been right in any culture (except Islam...and that is a whole different sick and twisted perverted understanding).

Your husband may very well be upset of the fact that he cannot fulfill his sick desires anymore, but that is tough and that is life. He needs help with those desires, so that the wickedness within him can be changed to a positive way of thinking...a moral way of thinking...a right loving way of thinking. In fact, if your husband has any type of Christian beliefs, I would recommend a awesome book called, "Every Man's Battle." Its a book about helping me fight their impulses with lust and every form of it. He might not be religious, but I know that the book would still do him good, because the principals therein are right on.

In fact, it just so happens I have an extra copy of this book...brand new, that I would be more than happy to send to you. I have an extra to give out to someone who might benefit from it. It challenges men to a different moral standard of living instead of being carried away by their own lust and entice.


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## Pixie222 (Feb 26, 2013)

Thank you, I will find out about the book, though I think we are a long way off him reading it! Before I attempt another conversation I would like us to find out one way or the other about the bi polar.

And I really don't think he looks at porn - however naive this may sound.


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## forevermemorable (Oct 19, 2012)

Pixie222 said:


> And I really don't think he looks at porn - however naive this may sound.


Well, he is getting these desires from somewhere. Maybe he was molested as a child, maybe he rape someone in his past, or what I think is, online pornography. I am not trying to infer anything and I really do not know...I just want you to be aware and open to the possibility that it might be one of these reasons.

How Can I Tell If A Friend Or Family Member Has Bipolar Disorder And Needs Help? - ABC News

How to Tell if Someone Is Bipolar: 7 Steps (with Pictures)


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## Suspecting (Jan 8, 2013)

forevermemorable said:


> The legal definition of rape is, "A criminal offense defined in most states as forcible sexual relations with a person against that person's will." It might have been against your will, but it was not "forced." Did you fight against your husband or resist him as he tried to penetrate you? Both the elements of "forcible" and "against your will" need to be in place in order for it to be constituted as rape.


I don't think this is correct. There is no requirement for it to be forced or to have to fight back to be rape. It is enough that there is no given *consent *which the OP clearly states she did not give.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

Suspecting said:


> I don't think this is correct. There is no requirement for it to be forced or to have to fight back to be rape. It is enough that there is no given *consent *which the OP clearly states she did not give.


I agree. OP was raped by her husband. OP, you are married to a rapist.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## couple (Nov 6, 2010)

Many men and women have rape fantasies. However he told you that he REALLY wants to rape you.

Many people also like to play video games where killing people is part of the fantasy world of the game. But if someone said that they want to kill someone outside of this fantasy/role play context then it should throw up red flags.


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## PHTlump (Jun 2, 2010)

Suspecting said:


> I don't think this is correct. There is no requirement for it to be forced or to have to fight back to be rape. It is enough that there is no given *consent *which the OP clearly states she did not give.


It varies by state. In my state, force is a required element of the crime. Traditionally, I think force was a requirement in all 50 states. However, some states have recently removed force as a required element.


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## couple (Nov 6, 2010)

I don't really understand this post very well. You say that you 'don't know what to make of it' and that he's already done it. Were you 'playing along' with something or did he really rape you? Did you feel that you were involved in a game/fantasy that you were not comfortable with or did you feel like you were really forced to have sex against your will? It's one thing to be uncomfortable with rape 'play' and it's entirely another to be really raped.


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## Pixie222 (Feb 26, 2013)

I'm sorry I have been confusing. I am very confused abut it all so that probably doesn't help.

There was an incident a few months ago when my husband had sex with me after I had said no. The first time I tried to speak to him about this he got angry, saying I was accusing him of rape, even though I had never mentioned the 'r' word. The second time it came up he said that he thought I really meant yes, the third time it came up was when he said he was turned on by the idea of having sex with me while I was saying no and he was very clear that he did not mean role play (a few days later he then denied this saying it would be a turn off if I wasn't into it) and then the fourth time it came up he said he didn't hear me say no.

So I don't know what to make of the four completely different responses and the fact that he said he is turned on by the idea of raping me, even though he has now denied this (which hadn't happened when I started this thread).

I feel that I can't ever get a straight answer out of him about anything as he nearly always changes his opinion or answer a few hours or days later.

I"m not sure that it really matters whether what happened was rape or not, but whatever people want to call it I'm wondering if it will happen again.


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## couple (Nov 6, 2010)

Pixie222 said:


> I'm sorry I have been confusing. I am very confused abut it all so that probably doesn't help.
> 
> There was an incident a few months ago when my husband had sex with me after I had said no. The first time I tried to speak to him about this he got angry, saying I was accusing him of rape, even though I had never mentioned the 'r' word. The second time it came up he said that he thought I really meant yes, the third time it came up was when he said he was turned on by the idea of having sex with me while I was saying no and he was very clear that he did not mean role play (a few days later he then denied this saying it would be a turn off if I wasn't into it) and then the fourth time it came up he said he didn't hear me say no.
> 
> ...


I agree that trying to determine if this fits a definition of rape is not a fruitful exercise. I was not primarily trying to test if this was rape but rather trying to make the point that there is a difference between being uncomfortable playing along with his rape fantasies and truly being forced to have sex. In order to look forward and not backward, why don't you talk to him about how YOU feel about this fantasy. Perhaps we are misunderstanding what he meant by 'not role play'. Are you OK to play along provided that you have a safe word? Perhaps he's confused about how you feel about all of this and being clear with him as to where you stand on it can help you move forward.


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