# Suspicious feelings, (legitimate vs reading into)



## Hall33 (Dec 18, 2012)

Hi all,

I've been wondering when suspicious feelings can cross the line from legitimate to seeing patterns that aren't there or are irrational, or allowing the suspicious feelings to create a false narrative.

Let me set up the situation. 

Just over 5 yrs ago when my wife and I met and started dating she was still seeing her ex boyfriend of along time. This continued into our engagement, anyway it stopped we were then married and became pregnant with our son. (my wife admits that through her teens and 20's fidelity in relationships was a problem for, stemming from a father who paid her no mind growing up, and bounced from woman to woman to woman after her parents divorced) 

She's acknowledged that her insecurities from this relationship with her father made her insecure and the way she'd feel secure and have self worth, is from the attention from men in general; to the point of being annoyed that the a$$hole at work is being an a$$hole to her, then concerned and upset that the a$$hole at work is now ignoring her, instead of thinking "thank god that a$$hole has stopped being awful to me."

Since then, many years ago, my wifes done a LOT of work on herself, self acknowledgement, self-change, (no drinking or drugs) and has really changed these things to a large degree, yet they are still somewhat with her.

Recently she started going to group weight training classes, and began to develop a friendship with one of the guys, but I began to feel uncomfortable with how much they were IMing each other (her IMs were not hidden, she was not trying to hide them) and I knew she' been craving friendship (she doesn't have many friends), any way i told her my concerns and she understood, and wanted to make sure I knew that nothing was going on. We went to a party the class was throwing and the guy would only come up to her when I was not around, he made no attempt at talking to me or even all three of us together.

I was upset at this, as I saw it as a red flag. I said, exclusive opposite sex friendships, isn't cool, and that forming a friendship with a single guy that you've got a lot in common with and such, is exactly how relationships start in general, and is a danger zone.

She assured me he was not inappropriate with her, and that they weren't always talking or anything. And she was not thinking of cheating or anything like that.

She said she would tone things down, and that if he and I were friends it wouldn't be exclusive, just like I am friends with a female friend who I then became friends with her husband.

We had an argument one night where I asked her why she would now delete his messages, when she wasn't before. And she said, well you got upset over time, even though nothing was going on, and didn't want you to freak out about something thats totally not going on, because it seemed to become that just the fact of him texting me was an issue. (I have seen their texts, and they really are void of anything intimate)

Then the holiday party comes around a month later, and we go, and she tries to bring him over to talk, but he shows zero interest in engaging in conversation, and then, he pays my wife no attention.....until I go to the bathroom or go get a drink,etc, every time I leave my wife, I turn around and he's talking to her, or sitting with her! (she even notices this)

So I start feeling really really disrespected, I mean guys are telling my wife to her face that she's hot, when I'm standing right there, and it doesn't bother me, because they acknowledge me, "your wifes beautiful man", they being respectful to me as the husband. 

I'm still not freaking out... Then I'm sitting down and I see him walk by her while she's talking to her friends and touch her arm as he passes her, and glanes over at me to see if I was looking!

I start arguing with my wife (because I'm now drunk), that this is BS, this guy only goes up to talk to her when I'm not around!

So later he comes up to her and asks him if the argument is because of him, and she tells him, look "Jon" you can't just come up and talk to me only when my husband goes to the bathroom or go gets a drink or is not around, it's disrespectful and just looks bad. (he gets upset at this, says he has done anything wrong)

Anyway, after this, I tell her he's not her friend, true friends don't ignore the people most important those they want friendship from.

My wife the next day, calls up and asks to cancel her contract two months early, and says she won't engage with him anymore over IM. She pretty does exactly what you should do, she makes sure I know I'm the most important thing to her, and this has been backed up by actions (our marriage has actually been in a great place, we're more connected than ever.)

***OK so on to the real question....

I obviously have had some trust issues from the past, but this whole new scenario, has brought them back up, I've checked our phone records and for the past over a month since all this, there's been no contact, until the other day I noticed 3 texts, two sent to her from him, and one reply back, and thats it.

She's also going out with her two new girlfriends for a dinner and night out soon, which was planned weeks ago, and the school that the guy is a trainer at just the other day posted on FB that they are having a party the same night. 

So when can suspicion deliver a false perception of something thats really not happening, I don't want to create a whole false narrative based on my insecurity, and I found myself thinking, what if she's going out that night with her gfs, so she can go to this party without me! 

This is happening in a marriage thats really better than it's ever been, we always hang out together and do stuff, and we enjoy doing so.

How do I know when suspicions are warranted and when they are irrational insecurities?


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## staystrong (Sep 15, 2012)

You probably have a desire to ask her if the other guy has contacted her. It's possible he tried and she rebuffed him, but she didn't want to alarm you. However, even if she's innocent and she suspects you of snooping, she may be offended. And if she's going to party to see him, it may just make her be more secretive. 

To me, the party and the GNO seem like too much of a coincidence. I do believe in righteous snooping, so I would put a locator app on her phone to see where goes that night. If she goes to the party, you drive there but don't go inside. Then you call her and ask her how her night is going. If she says she's at the restaurant, then you have the choice to bust her right then by asking her to come outside. I would do it right then and there because otherwise she may hook up with the OM. 

That's just the way I'd do it.


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## ThreeStrikes (Aug 11, 2012)

Married women should not attend GNO. It's a slippery slope. Add the fact that your wife is attractive, and gets attention from men, and you've got a recipe for disaster.

Dinner with her girlfriends? No problem. Clubbing and parties without you? No way.

Your wife needs to unfriend the trainer guy on FB. She needs to go no-contact with him.


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## Chris Taylor (Jul 22, 2010)

Here's the thing... guys will pursue women. Your wife really didn't do anything wrong. SHE was approached when you walked away. She didn't go looking for the trainer when you walked away.

She cut off contact and, with the exception of one text, has stayed that way.

I would be careful as coming off as controlling. You say the relationship has never been better? Don't jeopardize it by pushing it with her. If you need to, do the call or find the phone app that night.


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## CH (May 18, 2010)

Chris Taylor said:


> Here's the thing... guys will pursue women. Your wife really didn't do anything wrong. SHE was approached when you walked away. She didn't go looking for the trainer when you walked away.
> 
> She cut off contact and, with the exception of one text, has stayed that way.
> 
> I would be careful as coming off as controlling. You say the relationship has never been better? Don't jeopardize it by pushing it with her. If you need to, do the call or find the phone app that night.


I totally agree with you until OP stated she broke NC and sent the 2 text to him recently.


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## Hall33 (Dec 18, 2012)

"You probably have a desire to ask her if the other guy has contacted her. It's possible he tried and she rebuffed him"

It's possible, but honestly of every text I have seen between them, it's always completely platonic. "Did you finish under 20 mins this morning?" "Almost, I think I had too much weight to go fast enough" "Yeah def drop down a bit next time" 

Seriously, that kind of dialogue. She knows how I feel, it's possible she gave him a short response and that was it. I mean I'm really *not* seeing any behavioral signs at all, in fact we've been really connected and feeling in love with each other a lot lately, even talking about getting remarried. 

"To me, the party and the GNO seem like too much of a coincidence. "

Thats really what stands out to me. Wait your night out with your two GF's just happens to be the same night this school is having a party?? That seems a little TOO coincidental. But then I think well, she made the date with her friends before the school announced they were having the party, but it still seems oddly coincidental. But she's the one that told ME they were having a party, if she was being deceptive, why offer that information? She's not stupid, she could easily not mention it at all and I'd never know. 

"Married women should not attend GNO. It's a slippery slope. Add the fact that your wife is attractive, and gets attention from men, and you've got a recipe for disaster."

Well I've done guys nights out, and I've got married female friends that do girls nights out without issue. My wife gets hit on right in front of me, (not knowing I'm her husband obviously), I can deal with my wife being hit on. I can't control other men, it's about how my wife behaves, and she's never been in appropriate in those settings.......but I do understand where you're coming from.


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## Aunt Ava (Jan 24, 2013)

Trust but verify.


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

Trust but verify.

Use the GPS and if it is warrented then confront her.

In the mean time set your boundries with the GNO w/new friends. who are they and whats there status M or S. What part of town do they live in...you knwo just small talk about her new friends.

I wouldn't want my wife to spend the night, come home when the resturant closes, and no bars or clubs.

Remember ughly chick love to hang with hot chicks, it makes them look hotter and it brings the guys around. Don't let her new friends use her as bait. So no clubs or bars after dinner. Another option is if after dinner they want to go out then have her call you and you meet her at the club/bar they are going to.

I mean dinners is nice with a couple of new friends but most resturant stop serving after 10 or 11. So avoid the 10PM call that "they are going out for a while" discuss before hand, and let her know your boundries and the options she has.


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

BTW, this happened before so I say you are legitamte with your feelings.


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## Hall33 (Dec 18, 2012)

Chris Taylor said:


> Here's the thing... guys will pursue women. Your wife really didn't do anything wrong. SHE was approached when you walked away. She didn't go looking for the trainer when you walked away.
> 
> She cut off contact and, with the exception of one text, has stayed that way.
> 
> I would be careful as coming off as controlling. You say the relationship has never been better? Don't jeopardize it by pushing it with her. If you need to, do the call or find the phone app that night.



Totally agree, my wife gets a good deal of attention, and I was clear that I was not angry at her during those parties, I was saying that this guy you're calling your "friend" is being really disrespectful to your husband, and she called him out on it.

I was only upset with her for not seeing the signs that this guy is flirtatious with her and seems to want an exclusive friendship.

I don't want to come off controlling, and if my suspicions are unwarranted or "reading more than there really is" and she did completely stop going to the class and ended her contract two months early, and so far, no contact that I know of except the two texts he sent her the other day.

But with todays technology, they could be talking while she's at work on a computer I have no access too, on messengers I have no clue about.......and I don't want to start my brain on conspiracy theories.


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## Hall33 (Dec 18, 2012)

CH said:


> I totally agree with you until OP stated she broke NC and sent the 2 text to him recently.


We never had a "no contact rule" she never actually did anything wrong, never had an affair, I just felt their relationship getting inappropriate and his behavior during gatherings disrespectful.

HE sent HER texts, she just responded.


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## Toffer (Jan 31, 2012)

Hall,

I think she's done the rights things so far. Hopefully the text exchange involved her telling him to stop. You could get in front of this by asking her to tell you if he ever texts her again and you can then continue to monitor.

However, I can see being a little concerned about the GNO thing. Is there anyway you could check up on her? Say see if she's really at the bar or club she says she's going to with her friends? Where is the guy having his party? Can you check and see if your wife's car (or her friend's) is there?


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## Machiavelli (Feb 25, 2012)

Install "find my iphone" on her phone. then track it at the appropriate times.


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

Machiavelli said:


> Install "find my iphone" on her phone. then track it at the appropriate times.


Maybe a VAR in the car and house also.


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## Plan 9 from OS (Jul 13, 2012)

Hall33 said:


> We never had a "no contact rule" she never actually did anything wrong, never had an affair, I just felt their relationship getting inappropriate and his behavior during gatherings disrespectful.
> 
> HE sent HER texts, she just responded.


Well, then don't you think a no contact rule should be enforced right now? Since your wife clearly saw the "friend" for what he truly was, then it's clear to both of you that he does not have the best of intentions towards your wife. This is the best time to enforce a no contact rule - before this little issue grows into something huge.


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## Hall33 (Dec 18, 2012)

the guy said:


> Trust but verify.
> 
> Use the GPS and if it is warrented then confront her.
> 
> ...


I don't think i can get a gps on her phone. I'm not sure she's done anything to warrant that, and if busted, she'd be hurt and upset.

(My wife can't lie well, when I caught her many many many years ago, it was because of how glaringly obvious she was, because she knows she's doing something wrong and can't hide it reflecting in her behavior) and I'm not getting that at the moment from her.

Her new friend is actually the mother of our 3.5yr old sons school friend, she's married, she's been to our house for play dates, and all three of us have worked out at the gym together, she lives close. The catch is she is not "friends" with her husband, they don't hang out, she complains about him, and she goes out without him....the exact opposite of us, we're best friends, and always like being together, in fact, when her friend talked about coming over on a weekday evening my wife told her, "well, me and chris like to just be together in the evenings"

And yes, as well, her friend is quite physically different than my wife.

The only thing is that telling my wife she can't go the lounge thats part of the restaurant after dinner and to come home after the restaurant closes, is totally counter to our relationship, I've gone out with her to lounges and such, and I've got a bunch of female model friends! So from her perspective it'd be, "wait, you can go out sometimes without me to Clubs/Bars where there's gorgeous models your'e talking to everywhere, but I can't go out with my one GF to a club and have to come right home?!"

You know what I mean, we're mostly out together though, and I'd be at home with our son anyway.


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## kenmoore14217 (Apr 8, 2010)

"The only thing is that telling my wife she can't go the lounge thats part of the restaurant after dinner and to come home after the restaurant closes, is totally counter to our relationship, I've gone out with her to lounges and such, and I've got a bunch of female model friends!"

you reap what you sow


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## Hall33 (Dec 18, 2012)

kenmoore14217 said:


> "The only thing is that telling my wife she can't go the lounge thats part of the restaurant after dinner and to come home after the restaurant closes, is totally counter to our relationship, I've gone out with her to lounges and such, and I've got a bunch of female model friends!"
> 
> you reap what you sow


I don't think a guys night out, or a girls night out, is asking for trouble.

As well, I work in a social environment, our work events are typically at lounges/clubs, most of the time, she comes with me, if we can't finda babysitter and I still need to show my face, I go without her.

I if there's solid trust, people should be able to go out and have fun without their spouses in tow as some infidelity force field.


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## ThreeStrikes (Aug 11, 2012)

You're here. You don't have solid trust.


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## Hall33 (Dec 18, 2012)

Toffer said:


> Hall,
> 
> I think she's done the rights things so far. Hopefully the text exchange involved her telling him to stop. You could get in front of this by asking her to tell you if he ever texts her again and you can then continue to monitor.
> 
> However, I can see being a little concerned about the GNO thing. Is there anyway you could check up on her? Say see if she's really at the bar or club she says she's going to with her friends? Where is the guy having his party? Can you check and see if your wife's car (or her friend's) is there?



I'm almost 100% the she doesn't initiate contact, from what I've seen I think he only texts her once a couple of weeks and only one or two texts, it's not like a stream. (granted they could be chatting all day on her work computer and I'd never know....but she's crazy busy at work and can barely talk to me, so it's doubtful)

So if I say listen, I would be more comfortable if the contact stopped all together. 

I feel like she's got a platform to say, Look I have stopped going to the classes all together, which I loved, cancelled the contract two months early, I said I would dramatically reduce the relationship so it goes no further than acquaintances and limit my contact, what else do you want? I feel like I've been respectful and caring of your feelings and I'm totally in love with you and our marriage, I don't think it's unfair to make me tell him I've gotta cut off all contact because you're feeling insecure"

You know?


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

VAR under the driver's seat for starters jmo.


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## Hall33 (Dec 18, 2012)

Plan 9 from OS said:


> Well, then don't you think a no contact rule should be enforced right now? Since your wife clearly saw the "friend" for what he truly was, then it's clear to both of you that he does not have the best of intentions towards your wife. This is the best time to enforce a no contact rule - before this little issue grows into something huge.


We don't see it the same way. I it as OBVIOUSLY the dude thinks your hot and is flirtatious with you, I mean the guy won't even come up to you and talk to you unless I'm not around! 

She sees it as, yeah maybe he thinks i'm cute, but he's not been inappropriate, or hitting on me or saying inappropriate things, so who cares if he thinks I'm cute.

My wife has trouble seeing "the nice guy" who's not overt, as someone who's making a play, finding openings.

I said, I've hit on a lot of women in my life, and I can't think of a single one where I wasn't anything but appropriate or kind. you come onto people with your eyes, and behavior, not words.


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

I think you have more trust for then you think. All these replies show me that you have a lot of trust.

As long as your aware of the red flags of infedelity you can do your best in keeping an eye on things as they progress.

Good luck to you and yours.


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## Remains (Jan 24, 2012)

Does she have an Android or Iphone? I think your best bet, to put your mind at rest is to get something on it that will show her whereabouts. A gps thing. You can even do it without having to download anything on her phone if she has the right things on it. Let me know if you want more info on that and I may be able to help. But I think you are going to have to do something like that if you are going to put your mind at rest. 

Either that or just sit it out and see. And as you say, you will know by her behaviour once she returns. Though don't count on it, even the worst liars become expert once cheating is part of the equation, if indeed she is or has any plans to do so. And also, sitting it out, if there is anything going on, it will be too late once it has happened. The damage will be done. 

It sounds to me like you are probably wrong and it is coincidence. But on the other hand, you could be very right. The circumstances are big. I would verify if I were you so you can stop worrying. And if she catches you snooping or such like, with her having done nothing? Don't feel bad or be sorry. Be adamant and righteous and I have done absolutely nothing wrong kind of attitude, and explain why you did what you did. And she should 'get it'. If you behave sorry and guilty, then it will just put you on the back foot and allow her to be more angry at you. And that is how the damage will be created by your snooping. Never be sorry when there is legitimate reason to snoop!


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## Toffer (Jan 31, 2012)

Sorry but I still say she should go NC with this guy and she should tell you if he rea he's out to her again

You should tell her that you're very happen for the actions she's taken so far but that this guy makes you uncomfortable and you feel he s a threat to your marriage and you'd appreciate it if she'd let you know if he ever calls, texts, emails etc ever again
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## phillybeffandswiss (Jan 20, 2013)

Hall33 said:


> you come onto people with your eyes, and behavior, not words.


As someone that has used WORDS, I scoff at your assertion. All three work in concert. I think your wife did everything correctly, I also think you should look at her phone records.


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## walkonmars (Aug 21, 2012)

ATM I think she has done all the right things, with the exception of not telling you about the two texts - but that doesn't indicate deception as much as an aversion to discuss an unsavory topic. 

Still this gym guy is full on the hunt. He was grooming her with innocent texts early on. So all he needs is for her to let her guard down a bit, relax her inhibitions and bingo! 

That's why boozing it up is going to be problematic. 

Why don't you say something like this:
"Hey hon, I understand the gym is holding a party at "denny's" isn't that where your GNO is?, have you heard anything about that? just curious"

See what she says. At the very least she will know you're not totally in the dark. It might also give her the opportunity to reveal the texts the guy sent.


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## AlphaHalf (Aug 5, 2012)

I guess I'm a conspiracy theorist. What if your wife knew in advanced about the school party because of some inside information by whoever is organizing it. Is this party an annual event? Whats the occasion? 

I realize your on your toes about this considering how your wife cheated on her exBF to date you. How does it make you feel that you where the OM at the time??????. This all could be Karma knocking.


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## Ever-Man (Jan 25, 2013)

Your feelings are legitimate, this guy is pursuing your wife. What jumps out at me is the way he touched her at the party when he thought you were not looking. That would set my imagination racing. 

How did she look when he touched her? Did she notice at all, smile and acknowledge him?

If she goes to his party when she is supposed to be with her girlfriends, BIG RED FLAG that their pursuit is mutual. 

You describe yourselves as "best friends"? Not good to be your wife 's best friend, clouds your judgement. You already believe you can detect her lies, you accepted her stories regarding her "issues". Is she too comfortable with you? 

Follow-up, investigate....


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## barbados (Aug 30, 2012)

Hall33 said:


> I don't think a guys night out, or a girls night out, is asking for trouble.


Well actually Hall, it all too often is asking for trouble.


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## Will_Kane (Feb 26, 2012)

Here's the thing - the thought of the infidelity never goes away, it's always there somewhere rattling around in your head. Because of your history with your wife, your suspicions always will be legitimate. She HAS dones things to give you reason to doubt her, you know it for a fact. No matter how much she changes, you can't un-remember it.

About gym buddy: When I was younger I knew A LOT of women who said they didn't know some guy who was orbiting them was interested in them. Yeah, they'd have these guys constantly calling them, wanting to hang out with them, meet up with them, just like your wife's gym buddy, nothing inappropriate, but OBVIOUS to any MAN that they wanted more than just friendship. By the way, the girls this happened to were always HOT. Never saw it happen to a woman who was physically unattractive. I couldn't believe that these girls and young women wouldn't realize what really was going on. The only time they would admit to it was when the guy actually made a pass at them, then they would say something like, "I can't believe it, I never thought he was attracted to me." To this day, I don't know if these girls and young women were being honest about not realizing these guys were after them.

Anyway, I would say that I noticed that by the time a woman got into her late 20s, she was not so naive about guys who were orbiting and hitting on her.

I'm trying to give your wife the benefit of the doubt here. That she's completely naive and actually doesn't know that gym buddy wants to get in her pants, not to talk to her about how much weight she lifted or how fast she finished her workout. Because if she does know he's interested in her, even if she's not interested in him, it's disrespectful to you to be friendly with a guy who would like to disrespect you by having sex with your wife.

Also, you seem a little naive, too, if you think there's nothing wrong with girls nights out. I guess it depends on where the girls night out takes place. If it's in a bar or club where liquor is served and single people go to meet, dance, and hook up, then it is disrespectful to you. What is the point of going to such a place, to have guys hit on you? If she wants to talk to her girlfriends, they can go out to dinner. Even when I was much younger, I knew of many horror stories and relationships ruined from girls nights out (and boys' nights out, too, if they were in "meat market" type clubs). Strong morals, character, ethics, and love for your spouse may keep you from cheating - you may have no desire to cheat - but I maintain that it's disrespectful to your spouse to even go into that type of "hook-up" environment. How does it feel when one of your friends comes up to you and says, "hey, dude, everything OK with you and wife? I saw her last night (all ****ted up) in the meat market bar with guys orbiting all about her." It doesn't give the appearance of a faithful spouse.

Got off on a little bit of a tangent there, sorry. Anyway, your feelings are genuine. You ARE suspicious. It is based on her distant past and on her more recent past with gym buddy. Deleting messages, hiding her relationship, to protect you. You have a legitimate reason to be suspicious.

What should you do about it? I don't think an honest talk with your wife about how you feel and why you feel that way would be out of line. Keep it calm and non-accusatory, don't blame her, but let her know how you feel and why.


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## alte Dame (Aug 7, 2012)

Will_Kane said:


> About gym buddy: When I was younger I knew A LOT of women who said they didn't know some guy who was orbiting them was interested in them. Yeah, they'd have these guys constantly calling them, wanting to hang out with them, meet up with them, just like your wife's gym buddy, nothing inappropriate, but OBVIOUS to any MAN that they wanted more than just friendship. By the way, the girls this happened to were always HOT. Never saw it happen to a woman who was physically unattractive. I couldn't believe that these girls and young women wouldn't realize what really was going on. The only time they would admit to it was when the guy actually made a pass at them, then they would say something like, "I can't believe it, I never thought he was attracted to me." To this day, I don't know if these girls and young women were being honest about not realizing these guys were after them.


Those hot girls really were clueless. Women that age are much more insecure than men think, especially the really attractive ones. Men assume their looks translate to confidence, but that's often not the case. And young women really often don't understand the signals.

That being said, I think your suspicions are legitimate. I would not blindly trust that the GNO and gym party dates are just a coincidence. Verify.


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## Aunt Ava (Jan 24, 2013)

Too true Alte Dame. When I was in my early twenties I didn't have a clue. I just thought guys were being friendly and wanted to get to know me. 

Here's a clue: Single (straight) guys don't invest time and energy into women they don't want to have sex with.


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## old_soldier (Jul 17, 2012)

A long time ago a band called Dr. Hook and the Medicine Show sang a song called "When You're In Love With A Beautiful Woman". Ever heard of it? "When you're in love with a beautiful woman, you go it alone."

Now today, there are far more dirtbags out there that have no respect for the ring on the third finger of a woman's left hand or for her husband. The wedding ring means nothing. They are dishonourable dirtbags. A man named "Tucker Max" comes to mind here. These egotistical, dirtbag bas_ards think nothing of corrupting married women. Now enter ecstacy, rohypnol, THP and a host of other mood altering substances that are easily dissolved into the unsuspecting married woman's drink on her GNO, the better looking the woman, the higher possibility of an attempted score. So therin lies the problem, you trust your wife but she may not be the untrustworthy one. When you're in love with a beautiful woman, you go it alone.


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