# Struggling and need help!



## struggling.again (Jul 5, 2012)

I have been dating this guy for almost 4 years now. I have known him pretty much all my life. We have both been married before and each have children. My youngest just graduated high school, his youngest still has a few more years. My problem is the first 2 years we dated we had a great time. We were falling in love with each other but then I messed things up. I listened to people who told me that he should be telling me he loved me and not just showing me. I started wanting more and more out of the relationship. I took a good relationship and made it bad. I tried making him jealous with a male friend but all it did was push him away. He told me that he needed space and that we were over. That he may call me in 5 days, 30 days or whatever but right then he needed space. 

Well, we talked within a couple days and were back seeing each other again. The thing he didn't tell me was he was also seeing someone else. (This didn't happen right away) I started figuring little things out and confronted him but he denied it. Finally after 7 months of going thru this we had a talk and he admitted to seeing someone else. He said he had feelings for me but wanted to go out with her without dating me too so he could see if he was ready for a committed relationship with me. We both teared up and realized it was what we needed as I'd rather him find out then than be with him and go thru this again. 

This didn't last but for a few days before we were back in contact with each other. So, for the next 3 months, I dated him while he dated her. I finally snapped one night and told him I couldn't do it anymore. I sent him multiple texts and phone calls (which went to vm) and told him that I was done. This was all because he was with her that night and I freaked. I guess I had just had as much as I could take. 

Anyway, he sent me a text that night and we texted back and forth for about 3 hours. Then the next day he told me he would see me only and we started dating (just us). He had given her up. I know for a fact that he did because I was wrong and snooped on his phone and read texts from her and him. It was over. 

We had a great first couple months but we were spending all our time together and that hurt us. He felt smothered. So now he has asked for space. I understand him wanting space. I texted him and hounded him when we were apart. I don't know how to deal with my jealousy issues. I'm also afraid that I messed up and he won't want me now. We have done this a few times before. We say we need space but then within a few days we are back together. 

His thing is he tells me he doesn't have feelings but I know he does. He has told me he does. He gets this way when we start getting close. It is like he is afraid of his feelings. He pushes away when we get close. I wonder if it is because he has been hurt a couple times before and he puts up this wall to keep from getting hurt again? He knows I love him and would do anything for him. I just don't know what to do anymore. 

Before all this happened recently, he had mentioned some things about the future. About us being together. It was always "we" or "us". How can he just do a 180 and be like that? I am giving him the space he asked for. I did text him yesterday but he didn't respond. I won't text him again. I will wait for him to contact me. He will as he always does. There is something that connects us. He tells me that I am the best thing that has ever happened to him. He tells his friends that I am wonderful. If he feels this way then why is he doing this? 

I need any help I can get on this. What do I need to do? I don't want to lose this man as I love him with all my heart even after what he has put me through. I know we can work through this. He said we just need some time apart and that it'll be ok. 

HELP!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## Acorn (Dec 16, 2010)

I am thinking originally he had strong feelings for you, and when you brought in the other guy, it hurt him quite a bit. He may be associating loving you with that painful feeling he got when he saw you with the other guy.

The jealousy issues, the snooping... big turn-offs.

If he is giving you time, my suggestion would be to work on yourself and let him see the changes. It might give him the confidence he needs to get close again.


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## struggling.again (Jul 5, 2012)

He never saw me with the other guy. I never went out with the other guy on dates. So it wasn't something he had to see. I know I hurt him back then and regret it. 

When he was dating the other woman, he told me to go out with others but I stood my ground and didnt. I finally asked him if he really wanted me to go out with other guys and he said no. I think he felt guilty because he was doing it and figured if I did then the guilt wouldn't be there. 

I know I need to work on the jealousy issues. He doesn't know I snooped on his phone. 

He is giving himself time. He is the one who said he needed it. It just drives me crazy when we are apart. You know, the funny thing is I know he will contact me again, it is just hard not knowing when. Just a simple "hi" would make me feel better. I just need to know that he is thinking about me.

Is it a good sign that he didn't ask me to take my stuff from his house the other day?


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## A Bit Much (Sep 14, 2011)

Acorn said:


> *I am thinking originally he had strong feelings for you, and when you brought in the other guy, it hurt him quite a bit. * He may be associating loving you with that painful feeling he got when he saw you with the other guy.
> 
> The jealousy issues, the snooping... big turn-offs.
> 
> If he is giving you time, my suggestion would be to work on yourself and let him see the changes. It might give him the confidence he needs to get close again.


:iagree::iagree::iagree:


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## A Bit Much (Sep 14, 2011)

struggling.again said:


> *He never saw me with the other guy. I never went out with the other guy on dates. So it wasn't something he had to see. I know I hurt him back then and regret it. *
> 
> When he was dating the other woman, he told me to go out with others but I stood my ground and didnt. I finally asked him if he really wanted me to go out with other guys and he said no. I think he felt guilty because he was doing it and figured if I did then the guilt wouldn't be there.
> 
> ...


I really think the gameplaying you did is why he's distant from you now. He doesn't know if he can trust you with his heart. He did once, and you pretended to date someone else.


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## struggling.again (Jul 5, 2012)

A Bit Much said:


> I really think the gameplaying you did is why he's distant from you now. He doesn't know if he can trust you with his heart. He did once, and you pretended to date someone else.


I have decided to just wait and see what happens. For 9 months we were back and forth with each other. He was dating another but in the end, he chose me. He never gave up on me the whole time he was with her. 

Whenever I pulled away he tended to step up faster. I even avoided him for 3days because I was tired of him pulling me in and pushing me out. It made him want to talk to me more. He would text me and call many times. When I didn't respond, he finally called my daughter and asked if I was ok.

I won't give up. I've put too much into this and I love him so I will be patient. He wants space because I was smothering him, then I will give space. I am optimistic that he will call me again. The more I look at it, if he thought we were done then after he got mad at me for asking 500 questions, he would have just let me go when I got in my car. He didn't. He came over and apologized for it. Then he finally talked to me. We left on good terms. It is the waiting that kills me.


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## KathyBatesel (Apr 26, 2012)

This is going to sound harsh, but bear with me. It'll make sense by the end, I think.... 

Regardless of what has happened in the past, when you are getting conflicting messages, believe the worst. When he says he doesn't have feelings for you, believe it, because that is what he will back up with action eventually. It's not easy for a person to say something like that, and if he says it, he's telling you the truth. He may feel obligated, guilty, or like knowing that you're available when he wants it, but he's not going to commit to you now or later. 

You've made a lot of mistakes with this guy. You surrendered your own boundaries by letting him date someone else for even a little while. You tried to threaten his comfort, safety, and how he feels about himself by enlisting another man to "make him jealous." You've ignored what he has told you about needing space and sent text after text and made call after phone call. When you pull away and he shows interest, you should be asking yourself why you'd want to be with a guy who only wants you when you're not around.

All of this has taught him about you, and the lessons he learned aren't good ones. You've got enough good that you kept him around and coming back, but you keep proving these traits are still in you, and he doesn't want them in his life. He might tolerate them temporarily, but he's never going to marry them. 

Meanwhile, you're feeling anxious and hurt, and it's making you act even more intense than normal. I think you need to seriously change how you do things if you want to stand a chance with this guy. You HAVE to get the drama gone. 

1. Stand up for your values. Don't tolerate what isn't ok in your relationships. Other women. Telling you he needs space. When something like that happens, with him or anyone, it's time to move on and find your inner joy without him. Once you find that inner joy and you demonstrate that you can be ok on your own, you'll have much more appeal to the opposite sex. It might or might not bring him back to you, but if it doesn't, it still makes you more appealing for someone that'll capture your heart later.

2. You have to stop trying to control him and his time. Yes, you do this. 

3. You could benefit from seeing an individual counselor about your anxiety and codependency issues. If you aren't willing to see a counselor, consider seeking out a CoDA group in your area. You haven't learned yet where your rights and obligations end and where another's begin. This probably doesn't even make sense to you when you read it, and it'd take a book to explain it.


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## struggling.again (Jul 5, 2012)

Kathy...you make perfect sense to me. I know I have to stop trying to control him and his time. That is exactly what he told me. I know I can do this as I have in the past. It is just that sometimes something triggers my anxiousness and I tend to fall back into old patterns. I'm trying really hard not to. 

I agree I have to work on myself. I need to be a "me" again before I can be an "us" with anyone. 

He doesn't only want me when I'm not around. He is so nice and kind to me when we are together. It is just that I have overstepped and he wasn't getting any time to himself. When he and I got back together he would invite me to be with him every day. I was getting tired of being with him so much and I know he was feeling the same way so when I started staying home more, I started feeling insecure about things. I don't know why as I pretty much know where he is or what he is doing. I know he is not longer with any other women. 

He knows that I will not put up with that again. He has female friends and I am ok with that. He has a daughter that he sees every other weekend. This past weekend I kept texting him while he was trying to spend time with her. I was wrong. I see what I did wrong. 

I don't think he means what he says. No one can change their feelings and emotions over night. I have learned with him not to listen to his words as much as follow his actions. His actions say different than his words.


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## A Bit Much (Sep 14, 2011)

struggling.again said:


> I have decided to just wait and see what happens. For 9 months we were back and forth with each other. He was dating another but in the end, he chose me. He never gave up on me the whole time he was with her.
> 
> Whenever I pulled away he tended to step up faster. I even avoided him for 3days because I was tired of him pulling me in and pushing me out. It made him want to talk to me more. He would text me and call many times. When I didn't respond, he finally called my daughter and asked if I was ok.
> 
> I won't give up. I've put too much into this and I love him so I will be patient. He wants space because I was smothering him, then I will give space. I am optimistic that he will call me again. The more I look at it, if he thought we were done then after he got mad at me for asking 500 questions, he would have just let me go when I got in my car. He didn't. He came over and apologized for it. Then he finally talked to me. We left on good terms. It is the waiting that kills me.


You shouldn't want someone that doesn't want you in their life all the time, every day. 

Why not be someones priority instead of just an option? Try it and things could change for the better.


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## struggling.again (Jul 5, 2012)

A Bit Much said:


> You shouldn't want someone that doesn't want you in their life all the time, every day.
> 
> Why not be someones priority instead of just an option? Try it and things could change for the better.


I agree but disagree with this. Being in someones life everyday is one thing but up their butt every day is something different. He needs his space and time to himself too. Just because we don't see each other doesn't mean we don't talk. My ex husband and I were together all the time and I think that is what messed up the marriage. We didn't have lives outside of each other. I don't want to do that again. 

I was his priority before and I believe I can be again. He told me from day one when we started dating that he wasn't going to get serious with anyone until his daughter graduated or decided she wasn't going to come spend weekends with him anymore. That she came first. He said he lived with a woman who had a child and it is hard dealing with someone elses kid. He said when it came time to disciplining them it caused problems and he didn't want that with his daughter. I can understand that. 

This is why I feel he pulls away everytime we get close. It is like he is afraid of the committment. He has built a wall up around his feelings. He told me before that he had no feelings for anyone. But then in the next sentence he told me he knows I love him and he knew how he felt about me but he wouldn't say. He said I know how he feels about him. He said his feelings have never changed for me from long ago. (this was when all was good) He said he doesn't tell me he loves me because it always messes things up. He said once the word "love" is brought into a relationship then things change. 

His daughter is 12 and he asked me if I was willing to wait for him until she graduates. The answer to that is yes. I know right now he is just pulling away so that he can have some peace and quiet from my nagging. I am working on that. I can honestly say, if (or I should say WHEN) we get back together then I know I can't do the things I have done before. 

We have a connection that we can't let go of. No matter what we have been through, we have always found our way back to each other. Actually, we have never really let go. Maybe that is the problem. We need to let go of the "bad" relationship so we can start a new one.


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## KathyBatesel (Apr 26, 2012)

You aren't going to like what I'm about to say, but I'm telling you this from my heart to yours because I've been there....



struggling.again said:


> Kathy...you make perfect sense to me. I know I have to stop trying to control him and his time. That is exactly what he told me. I know I can do this as I have in the past.
> 
> *This cannot be something you "do." It has to become who you are if you want to succeed. You have to simply REFUSE to be any other way, BEFORE it happens. You have to picture it in your mind and maybe even find a consequence that you impose on yourself if you cross the boundary even a tiny bit, and even if others don't notice that you did. You have to let your anxiety become your biggest secret, one so important that you cannot let it be seen by others.*
> 
> ...


*You're making the same mistake so many people make. I hope you'll browse some of my relationship articles, especially the ones about mistakes women make in relationships and what to do about mixed messages.*


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## A Bit Much (Sep 14, 2011)

I'm married myself and I'm not up my husbands butt. I think you know what I meant when I said you should be someone he should want all the time. 4 years of yo-yoing back and forth IMO isn't a relationship. It's a rollercoaster ride. Amusement park stuff. I prefer consistency in my relationships. I think that's what you should look for too... and neither of you sound very consistent with one another. Drama drama drama.



> He told me from day one when we started dating that he wasn't going to get serious with anyone until his daughter graduated or decided she wasn't going to come spend weekends with him anymore. That she came first


.

Why on earth would you pursue a serious relationship with a man that told you this? While theres nothing wrong with his way of thinking, he gave you an out. You fell in deep anyway. This turmoil you keep going in and out of really is of your own making IMO, since he made it clear what he wanted from the get go.


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## A Bit Much (Sep 14, 2011)

This is no different than going after a married man. He's emotionally unavailable, and always has been... but somehow that's attractive to you.


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## struggling.again (Jul 5, 2012)

KathyBatesel said:


> You aren't going to like what I'm about to say, but I'm telling you this from my heart to yours because I've been there....
> 
> 
> 
> *You're making the same mistake so many people make. I hope you'll browse some of my relationship articles, especially the ones about mistakes women make in relationships and what to do about mixed messages.*


Thanks for all you have said. You said that it would take years and not months to get where I need to be...that is ok as I have all the time in the world. If I work on myself and it takes a couple years and he isn't around at that time then I haven't lost anything. I do believe that I can work on me and have him too though. Relationships don't fix themselves over night. It takes time. When he and I got back together (well, actually we were never apart), lets say when he stopped seeing other woman, we jumped back into things too fast. We didn't step back and work through our issues. We brought them into the relationship before fixing them. I now know that the issues have to be fixed before we can be an "us". 

I won't jump this time. I will take the time to fix myself and let him fix himself. He has issues he is dealing with too. He told me recently that he could picture us together in the future. He has issues with couples in general. His 2 main relationships were tarnished when his exes cheated. Then when I did what I did I'm sure it brought back all the bad memories. He also has a couple friends who have wives that control them. I think he is afraid I will be the same way because of the way I do things. He has told me as much. I need to prove to him that I am not like that. 

Things will work out in the end. I have hope and faith.


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## struggling.again (Jul 5, 2012)

A Bit Much said:


> This is no different than going after a married man. He's emotionally unavailable, and always has been... but somehow that's attractive to you.


He wasn't always like this. The first couple years we went out we didn't have any problems. We NEVER argued or anything. I stayed at his house sometimes and he stayed at mine. Some days we didn't see each other as I had my girls to tend to. It worked out good. Then I started listening to people telling me that things should be going faster. I started wanting more and more. When he wouldn't budge, I did the jealousy thing. It backfired. 

So, he hasn't always been that way. We were in love once and he even said that. He told me that he loved me before and he wished we could get back to that place. But so much has gone on in between that we haven't dealt with.


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## A Bit Much (Sep 14, 2011)

struggling.again said:


> He wasn't always like this. The first couple years we went out we didn't have any problems. We NEVER argued or anything. I stayed at his house sometimes and he stayed at mine. Some days we didn't see each other as I had my girls to tend to. It worked out good. Then I started listening to people telling me that things should be going faster. I started wanting more and more. When he wouldn't budge, I did the jealousy thing. It backfired.
> 
> So, he hasn't always been that way. We were in love once and he even said that. He told me that he loved me before and he wished we could get back to that place. But so much has gone on in between that we haven't dealt with.


But you fail to see what he made clear to you from the first date.

He doesn't want a serious relationship until his daughter is grown. So anything that was going on with you was for his benefit with the premise that he had no intention of getting TRULY serious with you... at least not the way you wanted or want now.

If he honestly felt that strongly about you, you'd be together right now. When a man knows what he wants, he lets nothing keep him from it. Nothing. If he truly wanted to be with you, he wouldn't have been dating anyone else. It just doesn't happen and you're kidding yourself about how he really feels about you. 

You can play the yo-yo like you have for the past 4 years or you can move on and get yourself together. If it was meant to be for the two if you, it would be right now. Hanging onto some hope that he'll come around later and realize he wants you is a fantasy... fairytale stuff. The reality is he wants space. He wants what he wanted from the beginning, 4 years ago. That hasn't changed. He hasn't changed.

This reminds me of a man I was deeply in love with once... he knew I wanted to get married... I'm the marrying kind. While I'm sure he had some feelings for me, I had to really think about what he told me one day. He told me "I'll marry you when I'm old". I thought about that. Why am I not good enough to marry right now? What kind of crap is that to say?

I dumped him. I chose not to wait. I chose not to be his option.


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## struggling.again (Jul 5, 2012)

One day maybe I will decide to move on but right now I don't want to. I want him.


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## A Bit Much (Sep 14, 2011)

struggling.again said:


> One day maybe I will decide to move on but right now I don't want to. I want him.


Well, good luck with that.


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