# I think my wife has BPD



## mattmurdock (Mar 11, 2013)

So here lately I've been thinking that I'm at the end of my rope with my marriage. I actually posted a thread on here yesterday, detailing all the stuff that's going on--it was titled: Who is crazy here? While waiting for responses I started googling "wife won't work" "wife always angry" "wing throws tantrums." Eventually I stumbled across an article about BPD. My blood ran cold as I read the diagnostics. And guess what? Apparently the spouses of people with BPD feel like they're going crazy. It's actually a very specific thing that typifies BPD. After I read that article at work and went home I was haunted all night. I couldn't stop thinking that my wife is very sick and I don't even know where to begin solving this issue. I love my wife, and I know she loves me--but things have been getting so hard lately. A lot of people say that there is very little hope that she can cope with her condition, and as much as I'd like to stay with her, I just can't do this to myself anymore. I can't keep worrying about every little thing I say or do or don't do, I can't keep going around in circles with her and taking the blame for everything that's wrong in her life. Anyway, I thought I'd list a few of her symptoms and hopefully anyone here that has experience with this can give me their opinion on her, on me, or what I should do. I don't usually ask for advice, but I'm getting desperate.

1. Fear of Abandonment
If I'm writing (my one great passion), playing a video game, reading, going to bed, at work too early or too late, she gets angry and accuses me of avoiding her. I'd understand if I was constantly preoccupying myself, but I feel like I'm just--I don't know, doing what I've always done. I feel like she wants me to always be in close physical proximity to her, sometimes like I'm supposed to be entertaining her or something. Anytime we get into an argument, she accuses me of wanting to end the relationship, which believe me, is the last thing I want. It's always me who is distant, uncommunicative and sad, but I don't feel like I'm any of those things, even though sometimes she convinces me that I am, which is confusing.

2. Volatile Relationship ("Unstable and Intense relationships, alternates with devaluing and idealization")
Uh, yeah. That's us. Before and while we fight, I'm some troll that's keeping her down and making her feel worthless, but afterwards she squeezes my hand and tells me it's all her fault and that she's crazy and that I'm the best guy anybody could ask for for putting up with her. Now, I'll admit, when we fight I do get upset. Usually because she's hurling all kinds of ridiculous accusations at me, but it seems like when I admit everything is my fault and I'll try to change, she pulls the "no, no it's me" routine and we go back to being a happy couple for the rest of the day (sometimes we fight again). But it always happens again, usually the next day. There doesn't seem to be any gray area in how she views our relationship: it's either great, or on the verge of collapse. I never know which at any given time.

3. Inability to Know Who They Really Are ("Sense of self-image is chronically unstable")
She's been in college for ten years--she's flunked about four or five of those semesters (I've lost count by now). She's wanted to be a small business owner, a police officer, an actress, a director, a photographer, a writer, a counselor (I know, right?). I don't know if that counts or not, but it seems like she can't really decide what she's passionate about, and she's 31 years old.

4. Suicidal Tendencies, Self Injury, Threats
I don't know if she mutilates herself or anything, but I've seen her punch walls, and while she's never threatened suicide, she alludes to it, like "I can't do this anymore. I give up," referring to, apparently, life itself (that's what she tells me when I ask her what's she can't do anymore.) She tells me I'm the only reason she doesn't just kill herself. I'm sorry, but I can't be that reason. I'm not strong enough, I don't think anyone is. This one really gets to me--it makes me feel sick even writing about it.

5. Impulsive Acts
If we don't have money to get something she wants, she'll write a bad check. She's been fired from her past five jobs for missing work, one of them for stealing, and once she smoked pot the night before a drug test. Common sense be damned, it's all about what she wants to do at the moment. 

6. Mood Rollercoaster 
Suffice it to say, "Uh, yeah."

7. Feelings of Meaninglessness 
She's actually described herself as feeling empty on several occasions--this one is a little nebulous. I don't know exactly how to determine if someone has feelings of meaninglessness.

8. Shows Rages
The other day, she was complaining sort of loudly about the neighbors' kids (who, admittedly, are heathens), but their whole family was outside in the adjacent yard, so I went, "shhh". Jesus Christ did I regret that one. That was just the most recent explosion. The one before that--we were shopping in another town and I suggested a couple of times moving about $20 around in our budget, just a little bookkeeping thing, and she started weeping furiously and threatened to turn the car around and go back home because I was a little pr**k and couldn't make up my mind about anything. That was the day before I think. The morning before that I didn't feel like having "relations" (our sex life is usually pretty good, though), and I was treated to an hour long breakdown in which she basically threatened to leave me because I didn't love her anymore.

9. Paranoid and loss of awareness
I'll just paste something from a website I was reading, because it describes her perfectly:
Under normal stress, a Borderline will feel very distressed. A Borderline will accuse their loved one of causing her pain and grief. Sometimes, she seems distant and unaware of what really transpired. It is similar to memory lapses. It is for this reason that it seems they are abusing drugs or intoxicated. They actually feel like they are having a nervous breakdown and cannot mentally figure out what they are experiencing.

We've tried anti-depressents and anxiety medication, and it helps a little, but she won't stay on them and we usually can't afford them because if we don't spend our money on what she wants she throws a fit and I just don't feel like fighting about it anymore. She always wins. She's always telling me that I'm the one that has to change, that I've fallen into a funk and have become distant and that's why she acts the way she does. 

I know this was a REALLY long post, but I need some real advice here. Where do I even start with this? If I tell her I think she has BPD, I'm afraid she flip out on me. Please help.


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## dallasapple (Jun 20, 2012)

I wouldn't tell her you think she has BPD.I would get into counseling for your self.Explain all this to a counselor and get some advice and ways to cope with someone like that.Maybe they can give you pointers how to convince her she needs some help too.


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

Is this you? 

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/general-relationship-discussion/62747-my-story-bpd-wife.html


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## soulpotato (Jan 22, 2013)

I agree with dallasapple. Do _not_ tell her you think she has BPD and that she needs help. You both definitely need to be in IC, but getting her there might be tricky. You'll have to be careful. There IS hope, especially since you still love her and want things to work out, but she is going to have to get into therapy. It's the only way she can start to recover. Meds don't affect BPD directly, so they're not going to solve the problem (though they can possibly be of some assistance with comorbid conditions).
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## mattmurdock (Mar 11, 2013)

@3XNOCHARM
I read your thread. This caught my interest especially:

"I'm not kidding when I say we had two or three arguments last week (of that I am sure) but I cannot recall what the topic was for any of them."

I was actually racking my brain to think of what we'd fought about recently. So weird. I mean, I really feel like my own sanity has been compromised.

"I just felt like I was always starting over every day."

You're reading my mind.

"She has always blamed me for "taking everything away from her" when we first got married. When all else fails this is her standbye accusation for why things are the way they are."

My wife does the same exact thing. She always talks about what she sacrificed for me. She had to sell a vehicle, which we replaced within a couple weeks with a newer, almost identical one, and she still harps on and on about--she also had to sell a laptop. I know it sucks to have to do that stuff sometimes, but it's like she's never forgiven me for it. We own a house together, but she acts like its just my house or something and she was forced to move there by my selfish actions.

You mentioned something about your wife lieing--I hate to have to say this, but my wife lies to me all the time. Anything to get her way. Little white lies, lies about why she lost a job or where she got some money from or her reasons for doing X, Y or Z. Those are just the ones that I figured out. I have no idea what else she might be fibbing about.

I'm actually jealous of your clear mindedness--I had such a hard time explaining what was going on, even though I live it nearly every day. Thanks for the link.


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

Matt that actually is not my thread.  I thought maybe that was your post...I'm glad it helped you though!


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## mattmurdock (Mar 11, 2013)

HA! Well, it was still pretty helpful, lol. I actually read your post, though just afterward, baout mental/personality issues--if my wife IS BPD, then she is BPD with a substance abuse problem. We (wy wife and I) both actually have the same problem, sort of. It's complicated. But yes, I at least believe it's possible. People dealing with a lot of anguish self medicate pretty regularly.


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## KathyBatesel (Apr 26, 2012)

Uptown is more or less the resident expert on BPD. Although I have never been diagnosed with it, I would not be surprised if I had been, because I have met quite a few of the traits, though without the risk of abandonment necessarily. This post hits particularly close to the mark of my early relationships, so I will quote and share my experiences as the person who was acting as your wife.



mattmurdock said:


> Anyway, I thought I'd list a few of her symptoms and hopefully anyone here that has experience with this can give me their opinion on her, on me, or what I should do. I don't usually ask for advice, but I'm getting desperate.
> 
> 1. Fear of Abandonment
> I feel like I'm just--I don't know, doing what I've always done. I feel like she wants me to always be in close physical proximity to her, sometimes like I'm supposed to be entertaining her or something. Anytime we get into an argument, she accuses me of wanting to end the relationship, which believe me, is the last thing I want. It's always me who is distant, uncommunicative and sad, but I don't feel like I'm any of those things, even though sometimes she convinces me that I am, which is confusing.
> ...


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## Nix (Jan 23, 2012)

Head on over to bpdfamily.org, register and prepare to join a wonderful support group. Whether or not your wife really does have BPD, it's a wonderful board and you WILL find support for yourself, regardless of what your wife chooses to do. Luck to you!


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## Shoto1984 (Apr 11, 2009)

Welcome to the (growing) club. Counseling is a great idea IF you can get her to go. In my experience when everything is your fault it can be tough to get them to agree that you both need to work on things. Best of luck.


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## Uptown (Mar 27, 2010)

Matt, welcome to the TAM forum. I agree with you that you are describing many of the classic traits of BPD. I therefore offer several suggestions:

*As an initial matter,* I agree with Dallas and Soulpotato that it is best that you NOT tell your W that you suspect strong BPD traits. If she is a BPDer (i.e., has strong traits), she almost certainly will project the accusation right back onto you, believing YOU to be the BPDer. Instead, simply encourage her to see a good psychologist (not a MC) and let the psych decide what to tell her.

*Second,* I suggest you read _Stop Walking on Eggshells_, the best-selling BPD book targeted to abused spouses like you. Another good book is _I Hate You, Don't Leave Me._

*Third,* I second Nix's suggestion that you start participating (or at least lurking) at BPDfamily.com -- the largest and most active BPD forum I've found that is devoted fully to the spouses and family members of BPDers. This issue is such an enormous problem that that website is growing by 20 new members every day. The result is that it offers eight separate message boards on various BPD issues. The ones that likely will be most helpful to you are the "Staying" board and "Leaving" board.

*Fourth,* while you are at BPDfamily.com, I suggest you read the excellent articles in their resources section. My favorite is article #9 at T9 Surviving a Break-up with Someone Suffering with Borderline Personality Disorder - Columbia University, New York. I also recommend Kathy Batesel's excellent article at the link she provided above.

*Fifth,* I suggest you see a clinical psychologist -- for a visit or two _by yourself_ -- to obtain a candid professional opinion on what it is you are dealing with. As I've explained in other threads, Matt, your best chance of getting a candid opinion regarding a possible BPD diagnosis is to NOT have the BPDer along. Therapists are loath to tell high functioning BPDers the name of their disorder (for the BPDers' own protection).

*Finally*, I recommend that you read my description of what it's like to live with a high-functioning BPDer at http://talkaboutmarriage.com/general-relationship-discussion/33734-my-list-hell.html#post473522. Meanwhile, please don't forget those of us on this TAM forum. We want to keep trying to answer your questions and providing emotional support as long as you find our shared experiences helpful. Moreover, by sharing your own experiences here, you likely are helping many other members and lurkers. Take care, Matt.


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## elizabethdennis (Jan 16, 2013)

dallasapple said:


> I wouldn't tell her you think she has BPD.I would get into counseling for your self.Explain all this to a counselor and get some advice and ways to cope with someone like that.Maybe they can give you pointers how to convince her she needs some help too.


I agree with dallasapple. Seeking professional help is the best that you can do. You should be very careful in dealing with your wife. Don't tell her anything yet until you've talked to a professional.


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## dallasapple (Jun 20, 2012)

> Fifth, I suggest you see a clinical psychologist -- for a visit or two by yourself -- to obtain a candid professional opinion on what it is you are dealing with. As I've explained in other threads, Matt, your best chance of getting a candid opinion regarding a possible BPD diagnosis is to NOT have the BPDer along. Therapists are loath to tell high functioning BPDers the name of their disorder (for the BPDers' own protection).


I was thinking the same thing.I dont think even a trained professional just springs that on a person.I read with narcasism(which has similarities to BPD) I don't think they EVER reveal that diagnosis to the patient.It can cause massive internal turmoil and bring out enormous rage.It doesn't help the patient including complete rejection of the notion.I don't think its exactly the same with BPD obviously several members here have acknowledged they have/had this disorder.But I would think only someone qualified should tamper in that area and I would think a very gradual or easing into revealing it to them.

That's why its you that needs to go to a psychologist and explain to them how she operates and they could help YOU by confirming IF that sounds most likely the case and give you the tools you need to cope and advise on how to get her some help.Besides the fact I highly doubt 99.99 % that she would "take your word for it" more likely be infuriated you are trying to "diagnose" her with some serious personality disorder.Like who the hell do you think you are?


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## vahlaria (Jan 31, 2013)

mattmurdock said:


> 1. Fear of Abandonment
> _If I'm writing (my one great passion), playing a video game, reading, going to bed, at work too early or too late, she gets angry and accuses me of avoiding her.
> _
> *My husband and I are gamers and we do game together. (some of the time) However, when one or the other gets caught up doing other things too long, either he or I will express the same thing. We end up feeling lonely. Does she have friends? Does she work? How much time do the two of you spend per week actively doing something. (Movies & tv don't really count imo, but that could just be me)*
> ...


My opinions are bolded.

Honestly, I applaud you for trying to figure out what is going on with your wife. However, reading on the internet and trying to gauge if someone is mentally ill does not work. 

It's takes countless college hours to get close enough to be able to do that. With internet diagnosis I could probably find something mentally wrong with everyone here, myself included.

My mother had bpd, and ppd, and all I can say, is after reading your descriptions she doesn't even come close. 

Your wife sounds depressed, insecure, and at the end of her rope. Perhaps she is putting too much responsibility on your shoulders for her happiness, or perhaps you are not pulling your weight. (Im not in your house, so I don't want to blame either her or you.)

As far as the anti-depressants, not every one works for every person. There are many chemicals that regulate depression. Serotonin is the most common one, therefor many antidepressants regulate that. Cymbalta works with both serotonin and norepinephrine, and can work with other people. I'd suggest reading the wiki on it.

I'd also recommend having her take a thyroid panel due to the fact a lot of how she is responding could be due to hyper/hypo. Read those symptoms and see if that fits.

*Im not in the medical field and all of this should be taken with a Grand Cayon does of salt. These are just what I've learned from life experience. **


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## dallasapple (Jun 20, 2012)

Good post Vahlaria. She could have several things going on.But indeed not have BPD.

Even the professionals can misdiagnose too.I went through most my life from 15 to mid late 30's believing I was bi-polar and the different doctors I went to basically just went with the original diagnosis until finally I got one doctor to admit that instead I very well could have just had severe depression(including post partum) and PTSD .I was a troubled teen living in a dysfunctional family and I had a baby at 14.Then later on he suspects I had again post partum depression /still struggling with PTSD and by that time I was in a troubled marriage and had never gotten closure from childhood events.I had been given dozens of meds all made me feel worse or didnt help.But 2 which one was just a regular antidepressent another anti/panic/anxiety pill.But that wasnt until I was about 40.

Anyway if even the doctors can get that mixed up than yeah.You cant just go down a list of symptoms and pick a few behaviors that match and determine something like that.I actually had a friend that was NO doubt bi/polar.And yeah I was messed up ..but this woman was litterally delusional by her 40's including at one point she was hearing things(every day) and extremely paranoid believed she was being followed and drove her car through someone house convinced they were part of this big conspiracy.


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## Cletus (Apr 27, 2012)

I imagine the psychiatric community has come to love the internet as much as the medical community.

Knowing that a person may have a mental illness or need professional help is good and empowering. Diagnosing the exact nature of the problem is best left to the professionals, who have a hard enough time even with training in coming to a certain diagnosis. 

Don't let anyone here who's been through this convince you that your wife is or is not in any given state of mental dysfunction. Leave that to the folks who spent years of their life training for that purpose. Only then does she have a chance of getting good, effective care.


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## vahlaria (Jan 31, 2013)

Cletus said:


> Only then does she have a chance of getting good, effective care.


No one has the right to say she has a problem but a trained medical professional. Not you, not him, heck, not even her. 

You're not helping their marriage by implying the quoted above.


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## Cletus (Apr 27, 2012)

vahlaria said:


> No one has the right to say she has a problem but a trained medical professional. Not you, not him, heck, not even her.
> 
> You're not helping their marriage by implying the quoted above.


That is exactly what I'm saying. Only a trained professional can make that determination. 

Too many amateurs run around this place trying to label other's behavior as if they have the knowledge necessary to make mental health diagnoses. 

For the most part, they do not. Their stories are useful in framing the conversation and supplying others with data to prod them one way or another. 

The help their marriage needs, if it's as bad as the OP suggests, won't be found here. It will be found in the care of a professional, if at all.


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## vahlaria (Jan 31, 2013)

Cletus said:


> That is exactly what I'm saying. Only a trained professional can make that determination.
> 
> Too many amateurs run around this place trying to label other's behavior as if they have the knowledge necessary to make mental health diagnoses.
> 
> ...


You're right. I didn't realize I was projecting until your reply. Seriously, thank you for helping me realize that.

I agree with you completely.


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## Uptown (Mar 27, 2010)

Cletus said:


> Too many amateurs run around this place trying to label other's behavior as if they have the knowledge necessary to make mental health diagnoses.


Cletus, exactly who are these amateurs who are trying "to make mental health diagnoses"? I ask because, in the 3 years I've been a TAM member, I've never seen any member claim to make a diagnosis or to be capable of doing so.


> I imagine the psychiatric community has come to love the internet as much as the medical community.


You imagine correctly. Both the medical and psychiatric communities now rely heavily on the Internet to educate the lay public about the symptoms for various diseases and disorders. They have learned that, when the public knows what symptoms (i.e., red flags) to look for, they are far more likely to recognize a potentially serious problem and to seek professional treatment for it. 

Moreover, when laymen are more educated about symptoms, they are far more likely to seek treatment much earlier, when the disease or disorder is easier to treat. This is why hundreds of the very best medical centers, psychiatric clinics, and hospitals teach people the red flags for BPD and other mental disorders -- as well as those for diseases -- on their websites. As you correctly observe, _"Knowing that a person may have a mental illness or need professional help is good and empowering."_


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