# Wife goes to parents without me every weekend



## Bobgel (Mar 1, 2016)

My wife and I have 3 daughters. She does not work and our house is filthy. She goes to her parents house with our 3 children every weekend to get her "break" from this house and the stress. Our children are never disciplined because they are always with grandma. She expects me to go over every weekend to sleep there and spend time with "our family."

I work one full-time job and one part-time job. She is after me to contribute every day even after working and coming home to her doing nothing. I have asked her to try to help out by keeping the house clean, as two of the three kids are in school full time. I have asked her to stay home and she refuses. She basically treats me like I am stupid and tells me to man up, but when I tell her to stay home she says she can't stand the mess and the unruly kids. 

What should I do?


----------



## happy as a clam (Jan 5, 2014)

Marriage counseling, pronto. Or divorce. 

Your wife is lazy and is using you (and your paycheck) to support her slothenly ways. And she is also using her parents for free childcare, and freeloading in general.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Peaf (Feb 8, 2016)

I'm shocked at the amount of posts I see where SAHM isn't doing her part and needs a "break".
If she doesn't want to be home, and doesn't do her part when she is, suggest she start working and at least helping out financially.


----------



## mcquestion (Jan 8, 2016)

keeping track of three kids would be a handful, but every weekend is excessive.

does the MIL expect this? or is it all your wife's idea?


----------



## Bobgel (Mar 1, 2016)

Her mother is an enabler and expects it. Her older sister of 40 lives there as well.


----------



## GuyInColorado (Dec 26, 2015)

Man up. Tell her to clean the house or get a job. And no more going to parents every weekend. 

How's the rest of the marriage treating you? Getting laid? Are you happy? Is this B.S. worth it?

My boss told me you just need to ask yourself this question for almost everything.... "Is the fcking I'm getting worth the fcking I'm taking?"


----------



## badsanta (Oct 13, 2014)

Bobgel said:


> What should I do?


Bring her mom over to your house for the weekend. OR pile up all their mess and send it with them.

Badsanta


----------



## mjgh06 (Feb 27, 2016)

My 1st question would be - How old are the kids?

The mental picture I got from reading this - a sahm with 3 small children overrun and overwrought doesn't really have time keep the house perfect. What is your definition of filthy? 

For some it could laundry not always done, toys on the floor, not really "filthy" just lived in...other filthy could be trash all over, dirty dishes everywhere, dirty diapers, laundry everywhere, food not eaten on tables, etc... there are many viewpoints of filthy.

I agree going over to her parents every weekend just to get away is a little extreme. My question from your post would is she also trying to escape from you? Are you on her case constantly and not helping out at home at all? They are your kids to and you have to remember her mom business doesn't stop ever... You get to leave work at work while her work is 24/7 and with 3 kids she needs a break.

I see the issue here as you both are not on the same page as to priorities. Your expectations vs. her expectations regarding how the children are raised, responsibilities of the home, etc... Are you willing to sacrifice your children being sent to daycare or somewhere instead of sahm raising them so she can go to work... If so, are you then going to take up half of the home responsibilities when you both get home - including taking care of the kids and not leaving it just to her at nighttime? 

These are things that should have been discussed before marriage. I think it is time you both sit down calmly together and discuss the issues and what you both are wanting.


----------



## Bobgel (Mar 1, 2016)

The house is the latter...trails in 3 rooms. I do dishes. I do laundry. I sweep. When I try to tell the kids to help she tells me to stop yelling at them. I am a fairly quiet guy but I have expressed my frustrations with her leaving every weekend while I come home on Saturday night after day 6 of work and sit alone. Two are in school already. There's only one at home during the day. She has worked, but loses her job because every time the kids sniffle she calls in sick. We had lice terribly last year. She insists on giving our kids Benadryl so she can get some decent rest. She was a very spoiled little girl and never learned how to care for a household. Should I tell her parents they need to back me up? We are almost 40 years old.


----------



## PhillyGuy13 (Nov 29, 2013)

Some people have trouble with reading comprehension. 

He said two of the three kids are in school full time. So daycare cost isn't an issue.

He said he works one full time job and one part time job. It is then reasonable to come home and clean the house? 

She's a slob and a free loader. House doesn't need to be **** and span, but the basics darn well better get done. No time during the week? Then her lazy azz can stay home on weekends instead of bolting to MIL's house so she can watch the kids because god forbid she has to watch three kids on the weekends.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## PhillyGuy13 (Nov 29, 2013)

You don't get her parents to fight your battles for you. 

You put your foot down as to what your expectations are. She keeps the house clean or she gets a full time job and you guys can hire a maid. Stop making babies with her. They are her excuse not to work and stay home.

How old is the youngest? Still in diapers? Has this been an issue throughout marriage?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Bobgel (Mar 1, 2016)

The youngest will be 4 and potty trained. She's always been messy.


----------



## PhillyGuy13 (Nov 29, 2013)

So no diapers and will be starting school/pre K at a minimum part time in the fall. What is your wife's plan at that point?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Bobgel (Mar 1, 2016)

I haven't really asked. It's hard because basic questions like- can you maybe try to get some things organized today or have dinner ready light her fuse. I am a little concerned as well that my 8 year old can barely read and my wife complains that she just doesn't have enough time to help her.


----------



## mjgh06 (Feb 27, 2016)

@PhillyGuy13

I believe I asked how old the kids were. Daycare meaning before/afterschool care and full daycare for the youngest. The age of the children matters because they could be helping out if they are old enough.

@Bobgel

If the house is the latter, you have bigger issues than just a lazy wife. She's not a good mom either. You shouldn't be pulling all the weight. 

Is this how it was after the first child from the beginning? If so, why did you keep having kids... thinking that would make your relationship better?

Don't get the parents involved as it is not their relationship - it is yours. It's time to sit her down calmly and lay some ground rules. 

My suggestions:

Maybe you could hire a part-time nanny/housekeeper to take the burden off both of you. I would suggest that as a start just to help your wife learn how to do it if the real reason here is she doesn't know how. That really maybe the only issue here. She is afraid to fail because she doesn't know what to do. As you said she was spoiled. 

Grandparents house is limited to 1x month as a group visit; if they want to see their grandkids more they can pick them up so you and your wife have alone time.

Your wife start taking on more responsibility at home. With one child home she has plenty of time to keep the house relatively clean. and have supper ready for you when you get home. but see above - she may need help learning. Maybe suggest grandparents take the kids one weekend so she can do chores with you so she sees it done right.

If she can't do that, then she needs to go to work. 

As for lice - in public school it will always be an issue and they say if your hair is clean meaning shampoo more than once a week, you are going to get it more often. So that is a good sign that your kids are kept clean. Oily, unclean hair doesn't get lice often because they can't stick to it.

edited posted at same time:
At 8yrs old that is old enough to start learning basics of cleaning and picking up their own stuff. Man you need to get the kids out of the house for a little while so you two can really talk and see what is at the root of her issues.


----------



## PhillyGuy13 (Nov 29, 2013)

She seems awful from the picture you paint. How is the rest of your marriage? do you ever get one on one time in and out of the bedroom?

Could she be depressed? I don't understand her complaining about basic household chores when she is home all day. What is she doing? Watching TV? Shopping?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## PhillyGuy13 (Nov 29, 2013)

He's already working two jobs. Why? Because he loves to work? No he's trying to make ends meet. They are scraping by. DO NOT hire a housekeeper or nanny without her going back to work.

So you haven't discussed at all what her plans are in 5-6 months when all three children are in school?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## mjgh06 (Feb 27, 2016)

I don't read it as her being depressed. He said


> She was a very spoiled little girl and never learned how to care for a household.


and that would be the reason to talk to her and find out would A) him showing her how to do it help or B) getting someone else to show her.


----------



## Peaf (Feb 8, 2016)

^^^^ agreed! It's her JOB to take care of those things. He shouldn't have to come home and lift a finger accept to spend time with the kids, especially working 2 jobs.


----------



## Peaf (Feb 8, 2016)

I was agreeing with Philly. 
Who doesn't know HOW to clean? That's a cop out.


----------



## mjgh06 (Feb 27, 2016)

Peaf said:


> I was agreeing with Philly.
> Who doesn't know HOW to clean? That's a cop out.


 You would be surprised at how many women didn't know how - especially nowadays with two parent households where they were never expected to do anything a children.

My brother just went through this with his wife. They would get into huge arguments over it. He had to literally show her how to wash dishes, laundry everything. For years he just expected it to be done and it never got done. He would bring it up and she would get enraged. They went to counseling and that when it came out that she had never done any of it before and was afraid she wouldn't do it right so she just didn't do because she didn't want to get yelled at for doing it wrong and feeling like a failure.

That why I suggested talking to her first. If it is really just a knowledge issue that can be fixed and marriage saved. If it is just her wanted someone to take care of her then he can give her the option to go to work or move out.


----------



## PhillyGuy13 (Nov 29, 2013)

When he brings it up she bites his head off. 

Surely she has watched him do the dishes, vacuum, laundry, over the course of their many years of marriage. They aren't splitting the atom- she knows how to do these things. She chooses not to. 

I speculate depression because no reasonable person can think this is acceptable behavior. But just as likely she is just plain lazy.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## SoulCrushed16 (Feb 15, 2016)

Wow. She just sounds straight up lazy. I mean, she has only one child during the day so how can she possibly allow her home to be that unorganized?? She can send the child to the grandma's house, come home, cook and clean and go pick him/her up when she's ready. You taking on 2 jobs and her responsibilities is just plain wrong. What does think a SAHM does??? They take care of the kids and the home while their husbands are at work. Make her lazy @ss get a damn job.


----------



## Lila (May 30, 2014)

@Bobgel, how long have the visits to the MIL's house been going on? Is this a relatively recent change or something, like her messiness, that has been happening your entire marriage?

Based on your posts, you chose to enter into a marriage, and procreate, with a messy woman. This is who she is, who she's been, your entire marriage but now it's a problem for you. My guess is that your unhappiness has very little to do with the lack of cleanliness. It's just a symptom of other, deeper issues. 

From the sounds of it, you two spend very little time together as a couple. Do you and your wife still do stuff together (dates, recreation, movie night, etc)? Do you feel an emotional connection to your wife? Does your wife feel an emotional connection to you? These are all questions to ask yourself.


----------



## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

GuyInColorado said:


> My boss told me you just need to ask yourself this question for almost everything.... "Is the fcking I'm getting worth the fcking I'm taking?"


Had to laugh at this. 

Bob, you and most of the people who commented on this thread are probably strong Js on the MBTI. You like organization, cleanliness, punctuality. Your wife may be a strong P, which is pretty much the opposite of a J. The world benefits from both types.

I used to know some moms like your wife when I was younger. I have to admit, I was taken aback by the lax standards of their households. But they were basically nice people, loved their kids, were honest and close to their families. 

I think you should follow lila's advice and try to reconnect emotionally with your wife. Try to remember why you married her. Help her remember why she was drawn to you, too.

About the 8 year old not reading well . . . I have had several kids either not reading at eight, or just barely start . . . and all my older kids (teens, early twenties) are very good students. Please do not worry. A happy, loving atmosphere in the home, which you have a great influence in setting, should be a bigger priority than any academic concern right now.

Bob, just very honestly, does your wife feel that her parents provide more love and acceptance for her and the kids than you do right now?


----------



## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

Bobgel said:


> I haven't really asked. It's hard because basic questions like- can you maybe try to get some things organized today or have dinner ready light her fuse. I am a little concerned as well that my 8 year old can barely read and my wife complains that she just doesn't have enough time to help her.


Yes, your wife is a lazy, entitled, spoiled, brat.
You can't stand up to her and are in fear of divorcing her because you are as scared of change as much as you're scared of her.
You have to decide what you want and make it happen. Nobody can help you, least of all her parents. If she isn't already cheating on you, she will be eventually.
It's your fault as much as hers, for letting this happen.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## NobodySpecial (Nov 22, 2013)

mjgh06 said:


> Maybe you could hire a part-time nanny/housekeeper to take the burden off both of you.


No. No. No. No. No. This is just going to continue to set the expectation that SHE does not have to do anything. This is a BAD idea.


----------



## NobodySpecial (Nov 22, 2013)

Gents of TAM, is this a good recommendation?

http://www.amazon.com/Hold-Your-NUTs-Relationship-Manual/dp/0979054400


----------



## 225985 (Dec 29, 2015)

jld said:


> most of the people who commented on this thread are probably strong Js on the MBTI.


Comments from another "J" :smile2:

OP, you are (a big) part of the problem. You have let this situation continue for at least 8 years. You have enabled your wife to do what she does. She has no respect for you. You are essentially a paycheck. I am not saying these harsh things to hurt you but to point out that you are part of the problem.

Why after all this time are you complaining? You put up with it for this long. Well, this is very common for someone years later to feel/think that the situation they helped create and accepted all these years is no longer acceptable. (I am in situation feeling the same way)

The FIRST thing you need to do is to change YOURSELF. How can you expect your wife to change if you are not able to change yourself?? Not going to happen!! When you bring up your issues to your wife, she yells and then you cower. She is either purposely doing that or has learned all her life that that is how she can get what she wants.

First change yourself. Need No More Mr Nice Guy. Google "no more mister nice guy pdf" as it is a free download. Also read Married Man's Sex Life Primer by Athol Kay. You need to get your confidence up and learn how to stand up for yourself and stand up to your wife. Once you do that, you can decide either to stay in the marriage or leave, but until your fix yourself you will never make this situation better. (FWIW I read the books and they helped me much. I have much more confidence now to fix my problems and marriage rather than just continuing my complaints that I am unhappy)


----------



## Wolf1974 (Feb 19, 2014)

Sounds like she isn't really cut out to be a SAHM. I don't know why people assume everyone could do it, I don't think everyone could do it well. Some people need more structure than they can impose on themselves. So she zones out at home then by the end of the week is so frustrated by what she hasn't gotten done that she feels she a need for a break/escape.

What I would do is tell her this SAHM thing hasn't worked out and she needs to get a job. Then use some of that income for a cleaning service. My bet is once she is working 40+ hours a weeks she won't be so willing to commit to leaving for the weekend every weekend.


----------



## PhillyGuy13 (Nov 29, 2013)

Wolf1974 said:


> Sounds like she isn't really cut out to be a SAHM. I don't know why people assume everyone could do it, I don't think everyone could do it well. Some people need more structure than they can impose on themselves. So she zones out at home then by the end of the week is so frustrated by what she hasn't gotten done that she feels she a need for a break/escape.
> 
> What I would do is tell her this SAHM thing hasn't worked out and she needs to get a job. Then use some of that income for a cleaning service. My bet is once she is working 40+ hours a weeks she won't be so willing to commit to leaving for the weekend every weekend.


I know it's not quite what you are saying, but I think it's funny that she needs a break from not doing a damn thing all week.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Wolf1974 (Feb 19, 2014)

PhillyGuy13 said:


> I know it's not quite what you are saying, but I think it's funny that she needs a break from not doing a damn thing all week.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I think it really can be frustrating for people who want to get things done but can't self motivate themselves to actually do it. I know that when I was a SAHD for a brief period I had to make weekly task sheets to keep organized and on track with what needed to be done. If I had no plan then nothing really would get done. Overall I don't think I would be great at it full time, I'm a great worker not so great at self motivating. I'm impressed when someone can pull that off, just not for everyone.


----------



## imperfectworld (Jan 18, 2015)

Similar situation here. After years of encouraging in law visits (since my wife has so few social contacts), I finally figured out that not only were they enabling her behavior - but they were saying crap about me!

I am now making some headway with the regular use of an individual therapist for her who is also our marriage counselor. (If it seems crazy to mix these roles, it is actually great because the counselor really does get it)

Over the past six months I've also been strategically eliminating all housework cop-outs in terms of organization. The toddler's bedroom is now brimming with IKEA and if there's a mess there's no excuse. The counsellor has now offered to make a house call...and boy she didn't like that idea! 

I don't ever see being hands-off on this situation and it sucks. But I'm trying to do the best with the cards I've been dealt. If I left, the financial stun would be so crippling it would suck far worse.


----------



## 225985 (Dec 29, 2015)

Wolf1974 said:


> What I would do is tell her this SAHM thing hasn't worked out and she needs to get a job.


The wife is going to yell. issed: :cussing:


----------



## Imovedforthis (Dec 18, 2015)

I think when she says she needs a break at the end of the week- it's from the kids. 
Just bc kids go to school doesn't mean they aren't home by 3 or whenever. They come back you know lol 
Being a sahm is HARD! And j agree it's not for everyone. I honestly admit it's not for ME. But I do it and work hard and am usually exhausted by the end of the day and that's physically and mentally. Kids will wear you down- especially being around them 24/7. I have 2 under 3 and I never knew how hard it would be and it is. 

Can't the family watch the kids for you all and let her have her break at home with you? You all would get alone time and maybe she would get motivated to do some cleaning. 

I don't suggest hiring a nanny. Those are expensive and you are already working 2 jobs.... 

Sounds like your wife just needs to get a PT job or something and that can be her "break". And earn some money while at it.


----------



## 225985 (Dec 29, 2015)

Bobgel said:


> She insists on giving our kids Benadryl so she can get some decent rest.


Sedating (drugging) the kids is so so wrong. The problem here not just the wife doing this (who drugs their kids?) but that OP knows it and permits it.

Yes, benadryl is OTC, is readily available, and the active ingredient is found in allergy meds, sleeping meds and nighttime formulas, but it is a drug nevertheless. They are not jelly beans. No drug is without risk and without side effects.


----------



## Marduk (Jul 16, 2010)

Help me understand what she spends her time doing during the day while you're working.

Especially when two kids are in school and she is taking care of one.


----------



## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

happy as a clam said:


> Marriage counseling, pronto. Or divorce.
> 
> Your wife is lazy and is using you (and your paycheck) to support her slothenly ways. And she is also using her parents for free childcare, and freeloading in general.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Nailed it!


----------



## KJ_Simmons (Jan 12, 2016)

Bobgel said:


> She basically treats me like I am stupid and tells me to man up,


She is right and neither of you know it. She has basically betatized you, and you think the solution is to do even more beta stuff. Stop. Man up. Put your foot down and make it clear that she needs to pull her weight and let her know what the consequences will be. Go be a man, not a househusband. She might start to view you with a healthier respect and admiration.


----------



## Tron (Jan 31, 2013)

You guys pushing him to force her to get a job probably missed that she has worked part time jobs before but can't hold one for any length of time because she has a problem with absenteeism, and has excuses for everything.

OP, you've got a woman who is lazy, has entitlement issues, drugs her kids and doesn't understand the meaning of responsibility. She is the product of bad parenting from parents who enabled her from day one...and continue to do it now. And who puts you down so you won't call her out on her $hit. This won't just go away, she isn't just going to magically change. And if she or you don't get this straightened out your kids are going to turn out just like her. 

You need to read the books the other posters have recommended and have a serious sit down with her. 

Tell her that this is not the way you want to live your life. You are breaking your back trying to make ends meet and do the right thing for the family, but that she is not holding up her end of the bargain. You are unhappy, resentful and feel taken advantage of. And the marriage is now at risk because of her consistently poor behavior. 

If she wants to stay married to you, you guys are going to have to share the responsibilities more evenly, and that means she is going to have to take care of things, she is going to have to treat you better AND that she is going to need to get into some counseling to reprogram all the bad $hit she learned as a kid. Make MC and IC mandatory. Hold her feet to the fire. 

And if she doesn't grow up then eventually you will have a decision to make.


----------



## Lila (May 30, 2014)

SAHM is a mentally demanding, catch all, never ending job. Sadly, in today's world, nothing short of perfect homemaker is acceptable. A SAHM could be an excellent mother but still be considered a complete failure if the house is a mess. C'est la vie.

Reading threads like this makes me really happy that I chose career woman over SAHM. My house can look like a hurricane came through and H would never say a dang word to me about it. Why? Because my response would be "if you feel the house is such a mess...here's the duster and the broom is in the closet. ...get to work".


----------



## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

Doesn't he do that already?

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk


----------



## Marduk (Jul 16, 2010)

Lila said:


> SAHM is a mentally demanding, catch all, never ending job. Sadly, in today's world, nothing short of perfect homemaker is acceptable. A SAHM could be an excellent mother but still be considered a complete failure if the house is a mess. C'est la vie.
> 
> Reading threads like this makes me really happy that I chose career woman over SAHM. My house can look like a hurricane came through and H would never say a dang word to me about it. Why? Because my response would be "if you feel the house is such a mess...here's the duster and the broom is in the closet. ...get to work".


I don't think his core issue is the house. 

I think his core issue is that he works two jobs during the week and his only time to see his wife and kids has been taken away from him. 

I think she's escaping. Into something. Or from something.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## 225985 (Dec 29, 2015)

Tron said:


> OP, *you've got a woman who is lazy, has entitlement issues, drugs her kids and doesn't understand the meaning of responsibility.* She is the product of bad parenting from parents who enabled her from day one...and continue to do it now. And who puts you down so you won't call her out on her $hit. This won't just go away, she isn't just going to magically change. And *if* she or *you don't get this straightened out your kids are going to turn out just like her. *


A very powerful post. If that does not motivate OP, nothing will. 



Lila said:


> Sadly, in today's world, nothing short of perfect homemaker is acceptable.


^^^ That is an over generalization without any reference or data to support it. OP is not asking for or expecting perfection. For start, he is just asking the bare minimum SAHM requirements be met.


----------



## Lila (May 30, 2014)

farsidejunky said:


> Doesn't he do that already?
> 
> Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk


I'm not sure.....Does he? He says he sweeps, does the dishes, and the laundry. OP mentioned in his 2nd post of being asked to "do more" when he gets home but doesn't specify what "more" is exactly. 

Op, could you clarify exactly what your wife is asking you to do and what exactly you want from her?


----------



## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

blueinbr said:


> For start, he is just asking the bare minimum SAHM requirements be met.


Who gets to decide those?


----------



## Lila (May 30, 2014)

marduk said:


> I don't think his core issue is the house.
> 
> I think his core issue is that he works two jobs during the week and his only time to see his wife and kids has been taken away from him.
> 
> ...


I agree the house keeping is not the core issue, far from it. It's a symptom of bigger problems in their marriage. The advice to him should be stop focusing on the symptoms and treat the source.


----------



## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

Lila said:


> I agree the house keeping is not the core issue, far from it. It's a symptom of bigger problems in their marriage. The advice to him should be stop focusing on the symptoms and treat the source.


The emotional connection, as you stated earlier?


----------



## Marduk (Jul 16, 2010)

Lila said:


> I agree the house keeping is not the core issue, far from it. It's a symptom of bigger problems in their marriage. The advice to him should be stop focusing on the symptoms and treat the source.


Agreed. But I don't think he'll find that out until he finds out what she's doing with her time.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Lila (May 30, 2014)

blueinbr said:


> ^^^ That is an over generalization without any reference or data to support it. OP is not asking for or expecting perfection. For start, he is just asking the bare minimum SAHM requirements be met.


There is also no reference or data to support calling ops wife a "lazy", "selfish", "cake eating", user based on minimal information but I've read those words used on this thread. I'm just going along with the wide brush approach being followed here.


----------



## 225985 (Dec 29, 2015)

jld said:


> Who gets to decide those?


We do. :smile2: Not drugging the kids would be considered a minimum requirement.

But your point is well taken. Must be agreed by wife and OP and they can be at opposite ends. The task here is how to get them to agree or move towards the middle, assuming wife really wants to be a SAHM.

My estranged, dead beat, no-job, thieving SIL would take my niece to the doctor constantly every time she had the sniffles. Doctor would always give meds because mom demanded them. The kid survived. And guess what? The little, very smart, talented niece that I knew from birth and who had so much potential turned out to be just like her mom. Surprise, surprise.


----------



## Tron (Jan 31, 2013)

Lila said:


> Reading threads like this makes me really happy that I chose career woman over SAHM. My house can look like a hurricane came through and H would never say a dang word to me about it. Why? Because my response would be "if you feel the house is such a mess...here's the duster and the broom is in the closet. ...get to work".


I am not going to knock the SAHM thing, my W is one.

But this is what the OP's W has already done, except that she gets angry if he says anything about it, says I am taking off for the weekend so you are free to take care of it all...and calls him stupid to boot.

I'd have a problem with that.


----------



## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

blueinbr said:


> We do. :smile2: Not drugging the kids would be considered a minimum requirement.
> 
> But your point is well taken. Must be agreed by wife and OP and they can be at opposite ends. The task here is how to get them to agree or move towards the middle, assuming wife really wants to be a SAHM.
> 
> My estranged, dead beat, no-job, thieving SIL would take my niece to the doctor constantly every time she had the sniffles. Doctor would always give meds because mom demanded them. The kid survived. And guess what? The little, very smart, talented niece that I knew from birth and who had so much potential turned out to be just like her mom. Surprise, surprise.


We definitely have to mate carefully.


----------



## Lila (May 30, 2014)

jld said:


> Lila said:
> 
> 
> > I agree the house keeping is not the core issue, far from it. It's a symptom of bigger problems in their marriage. The advice to him should be stop focusing on the symptoms and treat the source.
> ...


I think emotional connection is the primary issue. I also get the feeling from OP (specifically his comment about his wife getting fired because she takes off from work at the first sign of a kid sniffle and the kids being undisciplined) that he doesn't really respect her mothering skills. Maybe it's just the way he wrote it. I think they both need to focus on their own page for a while.


----------



## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

Lila said:


> I think emotional connection is the primary issue. I also get the feeling from OP (specifically his comment about his wife getting fired because she takes off from work at the first sign of a kid sniffle and the kids being undisciplined) that he doesn't really respect her mothering skills. Maybe it's just the way he wrote it. I think they both need to focus on their own page for a while.


If I felt disrespected and unappreciated by my husband, I might find myself running to people who were helpful and supportive, too.


----------



## Marduk (Jul 16, 2010)

jld said:


> If I felt disrespected and unappreciated by my husband, I might find myself running to people who were helpful and supportive, too.


Jumping to the conclusion that he's at fault with so little information is as faulty reasoning as jumping to the conclusion that she is.


----------



## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

marduk said:


> Jumping to the conclusion that he's at fault with so little information is as faulty reasoning as jumping to the conclusion that she is.


And yet it was just fine with nearly every poster on the thread.

It is not about "fault," OP. It is about needs and how to meet them. Take the right and wrong out of it, and focus on meeting needs, and you are likely to make more headway with your wife.


----------



## Marduk (Jul 16, 2010)

jld said:


> And yet it was just fine with nearly every poster on the thread.


Two wrongs make a right now?


----------



## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

marduk said:


> Two wrongs make a right now?


I don't know that they are even "wrongs." Two different perspectives, for sure.


----------



## Lila (May 30, 2014)

Tron said:


> I am not going to knock the SAHM thing, my W is one.
> 
> But this is what the OP's W has already done, except that she gets angry if he says anything about it, says I am taking off for the weekend so you are free to take care of it all...and calls him stupid to boot.
> 
> I'd have a problem with that.


I get what your saying Tron, but what I see is that SAHM don't get a whole lot of leeway like say career women (me). I get a pass for having a career and bringing home the bacon. SAHM don't get a pass. I can tell my husband to kiss what a twist if he complains about the house but a SAHM can't. I can complain about being stressed with work, and get a by. ...SAHM can't. Again, just calling it like it is. 

Makes me happy to have chosen career over SAHM. In all honesty, doesn't make me a better wife than OPs but I get away with a lot more simply because I bring home a paycheck.


----------



## lucy999 (Sep 28, 2014)

Bobgel said:


> I am a little concerned as well that my 8 year old can barely read and my wife complains that she just doesn't have enough time to help her.


:surprise:You should more than a 'little' concerned. I hope you are being proactive with this issue-messy house and lazy, entitled, slob wife be damned.


----------



## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

Lila said:


> I get what your saying Tron, but what I see is that SAHM don't get a whole lot of leeway like say career women (me). I get a pass for having a career and bringing home the bacon. SAHM don't get a pass. I can tell my husband to kiss what a twist if he complains about the house but a SAHM can't. I can complain about being stressed with work, and get a by. ...SAHM can't. Again, just calling it like it is.
> 
> Makes me happy to have chosen career over SAHM. In all honesty, doesn't make me a better wife than OPs but I get away with a lot more simply because I bring home a paycheck.


They seem to be judged strictly on TAM, that's for sure.

But ultimately each couple negotiates their own deal. A sahm needs to know and make clear her own limits. She also needs a backup plan if those limits are not respected.


----------



## 225985 (Dec 29, 2015)

Lila said:


> I get what your saying Tron, but what I see is that SAHM don't get a whole lot of leeway like say career women (me). I get a pass for having a career and bringing home the bacon. SAHM don't get a pass. I can tell my husband to kiss what a twist if he complains about the house but a SAHM can't. I can complain about being stressed with work, and get a by. ...SAHM can't. Again, just calling it like it is.
> .


If a career woman does not do her job or at least the minimum requirements, she gets FIRED. Maybe OP's SAHM needs to be fired. Or at least change jobs. 

I will concede that if OP's wife posted HER story instead, the version of events would be very much different and we would be attacking the ungrateful controlling husband.


----------



## straightshooter (Dec 27, 2015)

OP,

i think you might want to stop worrying about the housework right now and focus on what is causing your wife to be "checked out" to the point where she needs away from you every week end.

And while you are at it, I might start wondering if her sympathetic parents are not enabling her to have a boyfriend up there because their baby is so stressed out with her ****ty husband.

Something is really fishy here.


----------



## Peaf (Feb 8, 2016)

Jld said "If I felt disrespected and unappreciated by my husband, I might find myself running to people who were helpful and supportive, too."

Maybe she should act and participate in marriage and child rearing as someone who deserves to be respected and appreciated. It doesn't sound as she is doing that. 

I disagree that SAHMs are held to such a high standard. I'm a SAHM right now awaiting background checks for my new job. I hate it. But, the house is spotless, the kids are cared for, the errands are done, the finances are handled, breakfast and dinner are served hot and on time, and I even get dressed and put on makeup every day. It's not THAT hard. 
I was a stay at home mom when my girls were little (had a 2 year old and twin infants) and I still managed to get it done. I'm no one special, if I can do it, anyone can. She just doesn't want to. 

This isn't about her needing a break, or not knowing how to do things, it's that she doesn't WANT to do it because she doesn't HAVE to. It sounds like she's always gotten her way and managed to find a man who would do the same. OP, put your foot down. 

And yeah, giving the kids benedryl, not cool.


----------



## jb02157 (Apr 16, 2014)

If she doesn't want to stay home with the kids then she should go back to work. If the kids are being unruley, that her fault and her bad parenting skills at work. She should not be going "home" to her parents house every weekend, her home is with you. She DOES NOT need a break from being at home with the kids. This is an exuse because she basically wants to do nothing and make you do everthing. She needs to start doing her share or be divorced.


----------



## 225985 (Dec 29, 2015)

straightshooter said:


> OP,
> 
> i think you might want to stop worrying about the housework right now and focus on what is causing your wife to be "checked out" to the point where she needs away from you every week end.
> 
> ...


I have to re-read the thread to confirm, but it took about 60 posts before someone suggested (or KNOWS!!) that the wife is cheating. Normally we see that mentioned by the 3rd or 4th post, in almost any thread.

OP says his wife expects him to go with the family to the in-laws and sleep there every weekend. He is not only invited but expected to go. 

Jeez, there are just so many issues here, including the in-laws that expect/allow etc the kids to come EVERY weekend for two days. Don't THEY have a life too?? They are not helping the situation. 

Don't see any deal breakers. This marriage and family is fixable if both OP and wife want it to work.


----------



## NobodySpecial (Nov 22, 2013)

Lila said:


> SAHM is a mentally demanding, catch all, never ending job. Sadly, in today's world, nothing short of perfect homemaker is acceptable.


I am sorry. But this is a load of crap in this instance. She has ONE kid at home during the day, and he does all the housework.



> A SAHM could be an excellent mother


Except she isn't. She drugs her kids to get them out of her hair. 


The truth is that the transition to SAHP can be difficult but someone home with one toddler should be doing the lion's share of the housework and learning how to cope with the kids.


----------



## mjgh06 (Feb 27, 2016)

jb02157 said:


> If the kids are being unruley, that her fault and her bad parenting skills at work.



This really got my goat. Would you say that if she was working? SAHM are moms, but there is a dad here as well in the home. Not all her fault, shared joint responsibility on that. Dad needs to step up to the plate and set some boundaries here. He is not just an innocent bystander.

To me it seems OP is allowing his life be done to him instead of running his own life. She will continue to be this way and he will continue to feel the way he does until HE does something about it. Talk with spouse and come up with a plan instead of allowing himself to be walked over and then feeling like it is all her fault.


----------



## MachoMcCoy (Oct 20, 2014)

Sorry, I skimmed.

Did we determine what she actually DOES all day? I mean, does she sleep? Read? Hang out with friends? Smoke pot and eat?

I just can't imagine what she does.


----------



## BetrayedDad (Aug 8, 2013)

jld said:


> Who gets to decide those?


Even if this slob wife of his "feels" unappreciated and unsupported (poor baby), she should be keeping the house clean FOR HER KIDS.

OP tell your wife to get a job that will pay her at least $200 a week and take the money and hire a housekeeper.

If she refuses threaten divorce. You must of known she was lazy beforehand but that doesn't mean you have to be stuck with her.


----------



## BetrayedDad (Aug 8, 2013)

MachoMcCoy said:


> Sorry, I skimmed.
> 
> Did we determine what she actually DOES all day? I mean, does she sleep? Read? Hang out with friends? Smoke pot and eat?
> 
> I just can't imagine what she does.


My guess...

Candy Crush, Facebook, Maury Povich, and a whole lotta Doritos...


----------



## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

BetrayedDad said:


> *If she refuses threaten divorce.* You must of known she was lazy beforehand but that doesn't mean you have to be stuck with her.


THIS needs to be done regardless! She needs to be shaken up, to be told either things start to change, or there will be divorce...and then BACK UP THOSE WORDS. Lazy wife isn't the only one who needs to change, codependent, doormat husband does too! 

Doormat husband seems to be a very prevalent, scary trend here in TAM-land!


----------



## Lila (May 30, 2014)

blueinbr said:


> If a career woman does not do her job or at least the minimum requirements, she gets FIRED. Maybe OP's SAHM needs to be fired. Or at least change jobs.


This is true but the difference between a career woman and SAHM is that when the SAHM gets 'fired' she gets severance whether the one doing the firing wants to pay it or not. Not so with career women. 

In OP'S case, the kids + stay at home mom = big time child sup port and alimony. It might be cheaper to keep her. 



blueinbr said:


> I will concede that if OP's wife posted HER story instead, the version of events would be very much different and we would be attacking the ungrateful controlling husband.


Ain't that the truth !


----------



## 225985 (Dec 29, 2015)

BetrayedDad said:


> If she refuses threaten divorce.


No offense meant to OP, but IMO he does not have that in him. That is part of the problem.

I never actually fully threatened divorce with my wife, so I might be wrong, but doesn't that threat only work once/twice and you really have to mean it to work?

I don't think he can bluff this threat.


----------



## bankshot1993 (Feb 10, 2014)

When my wife and I first moved in together I had very much a similar situation on my hands. no kids involved but I came home to a very dirty house after working two jobs while she sat on the couch watching soaps all day.

Came home from work one day and looked at the mess and then at her. I decided right then and there that my line had been crossed so I drew my line in the sand and told here I was going out for a bite to eat and that she wasn't invited. I went on to tell her that I wouldn't be coming home that night because I didn't feel like sitting in filth. Lastly I told her I would be home after work the next day and either the mess should be gone or she should because I didn't have room in my life for both.

Came home the next day to a clean house. I told her that as long as she wasn't working and contributing financially that her contribution was to be focused on domestic efforts. If there came a time that she was working and contributing financially than we could sit down and talk about how the domestic duties would be divided fairly but as long as she was a stay at home person her job was that of a housekeeper and if she didn't want to get fired it better never look like it did the day before ever again.


----------



## BetrayedDad (Aug 8, 2013)

blueinbr said:


> I never actually fully threatened divorce with my wife, so I might be wrong, but doesn't that threat only work once/twice and you really have to mean it to work?
> 
> I don't think he can bluff this threat.


I don't advice people to play games.

If he threatens divorce and she doesn't comply then he MUST follow through.

To the other poster's point, there certainly is a doormat epidemic running rampant on TAM.


----------



## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

bankshot1993 said:


> When my wife and I first moved in together I had very much a similar situation on my hands. no kids involved but I came home to a very dirty house after working two jobs while she sat on the couch watching soaps all day.
> 
> Came home from work one day and looked at the mess and then at her. I decided right then and there that my line had been crossed so I drew my line in the sand and told here I was going out for a bite to eat and that she wasn't invited. I went on to tell her that I wouldn't be coming home that night because I didn't feel like sitting in filth. Lastly I told her I would be home after work the next day and either the mess should be gone or she should because I didn't have room in my life for both.
> 
> Came home the next day to a clean house. I told her that as long as she wasn't working and contributing financially that her contribution was to be focused on domestic efforts. If there came a time that she was working and contributing financially than we could sit down and talk about how the domestic duties would be divided fairly but as long as she was a stay at home person her job was that of a housekeeper and if she didn't want to get fired it better never look like it did the day before ever again.


I wonder if she ever spat in your food . . .


----------



## Lila (May 30, 2014)

NobodySpecial said:


> I am sorry. But this is a load of crap in this instance. She has ONE kid at home during the day, and he does all the housework.


{Sigh} I've said it before and I'll say it again. ... Opinions are like butt holes. Every one has one and they all stink.


----------



## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

blueinbr said:


> Sedating (drugging) the kids is so so wrong. The problem here not just the wife doing this (who drugs their kids?) but that OP knows it and permits it.
> 
> Yes, benadryl is OTC, is readily available, and the active ingredient is found in allergy meds, sleeping meds and nighttime formulas, but it is a drug nevertheless. They are not jelly beans. No drug is without risk and without side effects.


Wait............... What????????? You can drug the little varmints????

Geez, I've been going about this parenting thing all wrong!!!!>


----------



## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

Evinrude58 said:


> Wait............... What????????? You can drug the little varmints????
> 
> Geez, I've been going about this parenting thing all wrong!!!!>


What is TV? What are video games?


----------



## NobodySpecial (Nov 22, 2013)

mjgh06 said:


> This really got my goat. Would you say that if she was working? SAHM are moms, but there is a dad here as well in the home. Not all her fault, shared joint responsibility on that. Dad needs to step up to the plate and set some boundaries here. He is not just an innocent bystander.
> 
> To me it seems OP is allowing his life be done to him instead of running his own life. She will continue to be this way and he will continue to feel the way he does until HE does something about it. Talk with spouse and come up with a plan instead of allowing himself to be walked over and then feeling like it is all her fault.


In response to this, Dad you can lead the charge on improving parenting in your house. If she objects, ignore her.

How old are your kids again?

Discipline for Life: Getting it Right with Children: Madelyn Swift: 9781887069069: Amazon.com: Books

Setting Limits: How to Raise Responsible, Independent Children by Providing Clear Boundaries (Revised and Expanded Second Edition): Robert J. Mackenzie: 0086874512122: Amazon.com: Books

How to Talk So Kids Will Listen & Listen So Kids Will Talk: Adele Faber, Elaine Mazlish: 9781451663884: Amazon.com: Books


----------



## bankshot1993 (Feb 10, 2014)

jld said:


> I wonder if she ever spat in your food . . .


nope, I do all the cooking, always have. She couldn't cook at the time. She does now but I still prefer to do all the cooking. That was a long time ago and she has since developed her own career and as promised the household duties were split up more fairly to reflect her change in situation.


----------



## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

bankshot1993 said:


> nope, I do all the cooking, always have. She couldn't cook at the time. She does now but I still prefer to do all the cooking. That was a long time ago and she has since developed her own career and as promised the household duties were split up more fairly to reflect her change in situation.


Sounds like you're safe then.


----------



## NobodySpecial (Nov 22, 2013)

Lila said:


> {Sigh} I've said it before and I'll say it again. ... Opinions are like butt holes. Every one has one and they all stink.


I get pretty sick of the how haaaaarrrrdd being a stay at home mom is. Waaaaaaah. And as it relates to the standards you were highlighting, SHE is the one who is so grossed out by the mess that she needs to leave every weekend. 

A guy comes on here with a legitimate complaint and some of the women on this board want to moan about how Haaard being a SAHM is when it just isn't.


----------



## 225985 (Dec 29, 2015)

bankshot1993 said:


> When my wife and I first moved in together I had very much a similar situation on my hands. no kids involved but I came home to a very dirty house after working two jobs while she sat on the couch watching soaps all day.
> 
> .


So OP Where do you want to go from here? You got some good advice, some bad. You can figure out for yourself which is which. Some jokes too, but not at your expense.

You probably love you wife but want things to change. She probably does too. 

What is the next step?

Edited to add: Sent to wrong OP.


----------



## PhillyGuy13 (Nov 29, 2013)

Lila said:


> There is also no reference or data to support calling ops wife a "lazy", "selfish", "cake eating", user based on minimal information but I've read those words used on this thread. I'm just going along with the wide brush approach being followed here.


Going by what OP has described I WOULD use those words to describe his wife.

Please note by no means am I disparaging all SAHM. Just this one. It is a full time job, 24/7, never off the clock. But there is a serous disconnect here. His wife does no house work, demands he do more, gives the kids cough medicine to knock them out. Meanwhile OP works two jobs and is then expected to come home and clean house. Short of an illness -- physical or mental -- there is no defending her actions.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Wolf1974 (Feb 19, 2014)

blueinbr said:


> The wife is going to yell. issed: :cussing:


That's fine yell then




But get a job after :wink2:


----------



## As'laDain (Nov 27, 2011)

I had a similar situation with my wife. She didn't clean at all, didn't cook, went to her parents every chance she got, etc. 

I quickly realized that she was depressed, and doing nothing just made her more depressed. She would wake up without any energy and spend all day escaping in Internet games, random surfing, etc. Then she would look around at the mess she made and feel even worse about herself, which made the depression worse. Every time she thought about cleaning it, she would be so overwhelmed by the mess that she would get incredibly anxious. It didn't help that I usually went to work Monday morning and didn't come back till Friday or saturday. She would start the week thinking to herself "I have all week to clean up this mess, I can do it little by little." She would do one load of laundry, realize how far behind she was, and escape in the internet to avoid the crushing anxiety. When I finally came home, the mess was worse, not better.

Then as I started to clean on the weekends, she would immediately feel guilty and start attacking me. It was like I was confirming all the negative things she had spent all week telling herself. She would leave for her parents house to "get away from it all".

In the end, I basically told her that I will not resent her for being depressed. I will simply take her escape method (internet router) with me when I go to work, if she didn't clean one room per day. 

I didn't ask her to like it at all. I told her that I fully accept that she is going to feel completely overwhelmed. I asked her to get one room cleaned a day. And I made a checklist of steps she could follow so that she is not feeling like she is attacking the whole room all at once. Just pick up the dirty laundry. Check. Next, pick up the dirty dishes. Check. Sweep up all the trash in a pile. Check. Take out trash. Check. Load and run dishwasher. Check. Etc.

She didn't have to clean the whole house. Just complete some really short and simple tasks. Short and simple tasks are easy to do, and aren't likely to overwhelm anyone. 

She liked her escape, so she did the tasks and kept the internet. As time went by, she needed her escape less and less. She could look around her and see that she had gotten a lot accomplished. And even though the house still gets messy from time to time, she is not afraid of the anxiety. It's not paralysis. 

Despite what might make sense at first thought, my wife was not raised by slobs. She was raised by a perfectionist mother. The house was impeccable, but my wife could never do good enough in her mother's eyes.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Lila (May 30, 2014)

PhillyGuy13 said:


> Going by what OP has described I WOULD use those words to describe his wife.
> 
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Does labeling the wife as 'lazy' , 'selfish', 'bad mother', etc help the OP? He has probably judged her as such without our help so No, I don't think it helps. 

By no means am I suggesting he put up with a situation where he's not happy. If the running joke is true, he can divorce and enjoy living by himself in an mmaculate van parked by the river. 

However, my observation is that she's been like this their whole marriage. He married her knowing she's a slob. So what's changed now to make this the hill he wants to die on? Rather than focusing on the symptom, which seems to be the general advice he's getting, he might be better served to focus on the core problem.


----------



## PhillyGuy13 (Nov 29, 2013)

Well I've asked a few times about her emotional state. Is she depressed? How is the rest of their marriage.

I hope he comes back and lets us know in between his shifts.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## threelittlestars (Feb 18, 2016)

Hey, 

I think your wife is escaping. Maybe she likes FarmVille or one of those Facebook games. I don't know but she is obviously not cleaning the house. 

Right now, I'm escaping my own responsibilities by posting on here. i just mopped the kitchen however so i think i earned a little sit down. 

She must be depressed to have the house be the state you explain here. I have been there... Though not that far or that bad. You are just a paycheck to her. But maybe there is a reason for it. Maybe her depression has her so far detactched that she just doesn't care about anything. Including disciplining the kids. One rule in my house is NEVER EVER question the other parents authority in front of the child. Its the ole divide and conquer tactic. If a kid knows they can divide the parent.... that is recipe for BAD! Parents must ALWAYS be united (Except when violence is in play). 

No wonder the kids are brats. They are not being parented at all.... It takes a great amount of energy to teach a kid responsibility and respect, etc. If the kids are in school and are of an age they are more than capable of helping out around the house. If you want it done and your wife protests just state...No, these kids don't respect you, they should be helping you DEAR WIFE. She might not tell you to get off their case in that instance. 

She needs help...she has been terribly enabled and she is in deep denial about her responsibility and role in the house and that of your kids. 

Time to make some changes.


----------



## NobodySpecial (Nov 22, 2013)

PhillyGuy13 said:


> Well I've asked a few times about her emotional state. Is she depressed? How is the rest of their marriage.
> 
> I hope he comes back and lets us know in between his shifts.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Yes. I did not say anything because you already had.


----------



## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

Lila said:


> SAHM is a mentally demanding, catch all, never ending job. *Sadly, in today's world, nothing short of perfect homemaker is acceptable. * A SAHM could be an excellent mother but still be considered a complete failure if the house is a mess. C'est la vie.
> 
> Reading threads like this makes me really happy that I chose career woman over SAHM. My house can look like a hurricane came through and H would never say a dang word to me about it. Why? Because my response would be "if you feel the house is such a mess...here's the duster and the broom is in the closet. ...get to work".


I call BS. Grouping everyone up on this? My W is a SAHM. The house is hers to run as she pleases. My W does not tell me how to do my job. I do not tell my W how to do her job. My W is an excellent mother and by some standards the house could be better kept. But you know what, I did not marry my W for her cleaning skills. I married my W for who she is. 

Do you think SAHM responses would be the same if H said house was a mess? I'm certain the do. I have been handed cleaning supplies.


----------



## ihatethis (Oct 17, 2013)

This is a prime example as to why parents need to teach their kids lessons and teach them how to do chores, and not raise lazy kids. 

Take the lesson from your wife and what she is NOT doing, and show them how to take care of themselves and have responsibilities. 

I'm sorry you are here.


----------



## Lila (May 30, 2014)

Yeswecan said:


> I call BS. Grouping everyone up on this? My W is a SAHM. The house is hers to run as she pleases. My W does not tell me how to do my job. I do not tell my W how to do her job. My W is an excellent mother and by some standards the house could be better kept. But you know what, I did not marry my W for her cleaning skills. I married my W for who she is.


You are the outlier on this thread so to that I say "Preach it brother and do it loud! 




Yeswecan said:


> Do you think SAHM responses would be the same if H said house was a mess? I'm certain the do. I have been handed cleaning supplies.


I can only speak from my experience but based on some of the responses here, I would say No.


----------



## SoulCrushed16 (Feb 15, 2016)

jld said:


> Lila said:
> 
> 
> > I think emotional connection is the primary issue. I also get the feeling from OP (specifically his comment about his wife getting fired because she takes off from work at the first sign of a kid sniffle and the kids being undisciplined) that he doesn't really respect her mothering skills. Maybe it's just the way he wrote it. I think they both need to focus on their own page for a while.
> ...


What the fvuck??? So him working two jobs and wanting the house cleaned is him being disrespectfuland being unappreciative??? Did you read the same post as the rest of us? If not you should probably re-read it. What a sad thing to say.


----------



## wringo123 (Mar 8, 2015)

Have you considered adult attention deficit disorder? Also, if she is feeling overwhelmed or honestly does not know how to basic cleaning / organization, check out flylady.net. it is a great resource for the motivationally challenged.

Sent from my QMV7A using Tapatalk


----------



## mjgh06 (Feb 27, 2016)

I think we lost the OP somewhere.

But after reading some more of the posts I wonder?

If W is doing nothing all day and kids are at school, how is the house getting so filthy? Just saying....

There are days I spend hours online and look around and omg how much do I have to clean up... start cleaning and very quickly realize not a piece of any of it is my mess. Just everyone else's that decided they were to lazy to pick up after themselves. Now that drives me nuts!


----------



## wmn1 (Aug 27, 2014)

marduk said:


> Jumping to the conclusion that he's at fault with so little information is as faulty reasoning as jumping to the conclusion that she is.


I agree. JLD is spinning this to it being the OP man's fault again. 

The point is simple.

He breaks his ass and she does nothing. There doesn't need to be a contract in place for her to get off her arse and at least take care of the household functions while he's supporting the family. 

It shouldn't have to eb said, it should be done period.

if I wa s a SAHD and my wife was working two jobs, the front lawn would look like a ChemLawn commercial and food would be on the table every night when she came home.

How she gets that it is his fault is really BS


----------



## wmn1 (Aug 27, 2014)

jld said:


> And yet it was just fine with nearly every poster on the thread.
> 
> It is not about "fault," OP. It is about needs and how to meet them. Take the right and wrong out of it, and focus on meeting needs, and you are likely to make more headway with your wife.


he's meeting a need. he's supporting the family and taking care of the house.

Exactly what is she doing ???


----------



## happy as a clam (Jan 5, 2014)

jld said:


> And yet it was just fine with nearly every poster on the thread.


Yes, because HE is the one posting, and he presented HIS take on the situation. Only fair for us to call it as we see it, as it is presented by the OP. If (and that's a big "if") she were to come here and present an entirely different perspective, other advice might be forthcoming.

As it stands we are offering advice to the OP, not supporting his as-of-yet absentee (from this thread) wife...
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## wmn1 (Aug 27, 2014)

Peaf said:


> Jld said "If I felt disrespected and unappreciated by my husband, I might find myself running to people who were helpful and supportive, too."
> 
> Maybe she should act and participate in marriage and child rearing as someone who deserves to be respected and appreciated. It doesn't sound as she is doing that.
> 
> ...



agreed


----------



## *Deidre* (Feb 7, 2016)

Sounds like her parents enabled your wife...and were too permissive in her upbringing, so now...that torch has been passed on to you, OP. Sorry you're going through this. But, it will be hard to break a pattern of behavior (where she can do whatever she wishes with no consequences) that most likely has been going on since she was a kid.  Her parents should think it's odd frankly, that their daughter doesn't want to spend time with her husband at their own home, but that she retreats to their house every single weekend. Once per month, or every other week, ok. But, every weekend...when do you have quality time just you and her?

But, that's all part of their permissive/rescuing parenting that has probably gone on since she was a child. Hope things get better.


----------



## wmn1 (Aug 27, 2014)

Lila said:


> {Sigh} I've said it before and I'll say it again. ... Opinions are like butt holes. Every one has one and they all stink.


Nobody Special hit the nail on the head. What is wrong with what she wrote ? And again, you and JLD fail to properly articulate how this is the OP's fault. The only thing I have seen that he's doing wrong is that he's tolerating being a doormat. That needs to stop. Outside of that, he has expectations of her since she doesn't work and has one child at home all day. There is nothing wrong with that. Maybe she needs to get two jobs and he can stay at home all day and throw bottles and pizza boxes all over the floor and expect her to clean it up at night. What would you say than, Lila ?


----------



## wmn1 (Aug 27, 2014)

What does she do during the day ?

What does she do on the weekends ?

What is her justification for going away to her parents all the time ?

Many missing things here. 


And Bobgel, don't be scared off by the people who somehow find a way to blame you. You are doing everything you can for your family.

However, you have to get her on the program .

Exactly what does she do and further what are her excuses for not doing anything ?


----------



## happy as a clam (Jan 5, 2014)

*Deidre* said:


> *Herparents should think it's odd frankly,* that their daughter doesn't want to spend time with her husband at their own home, but that she retreats to their house every single weekend.


Yes, NORMAL people would feel this way. But as our resident psych expert @john117 would point out, Not Normal (tm) people would find her behavior ENTIRELY acceptable because they are feeding right into the dysfunction that THEY helped create in the first place.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## happy as a clam (Jan 5, 2014)

Lila said:


> {Sigh} I've said it before and I'll say it again. ... Opinions are like butt holes. Every one has one and they all stink.


Ok, besides this being a really off-putting comment ("stinking butt holes"?? Really??) if you really believe everyone's opinions stink, why bother to post on a forum at all? 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## SoulCrushed16 (Feb 15, 2016)

wmn1 said:


> What does she do during the day ?
> 
> What does she do on the weekends ?
> 
> ...


These are great questions. Frankly, I don't understand why anyone would sit around at home and do nothing while their husband works. If she can't get anything done during the way then there's always the weekend or she can drop off the youngest at her parent's house and go back home and clean. She may have some underlying issues but the fact of the matter is is that she's lazy.


----------



## Lila (May 30, 2014)

wmn1 said:


> Nobody Special hit the nail on the head. What is wrong with what she wrote ? And again, you and JLD fail to properly articulate how this is the OP's fault. The only thing I have seen that he's doing wrong is that he's tolerating being a doormat. That needs to stop. Outside of that, he has expectations of her since she doesn't work and has one child at home all day. There is nothing wrong with that. Maybe she needs to get two jobs and he can stay at home all day and throw bottles and pizza boxes all over the floor and expect her to clean it up at night. What would you say than, Lila ?


OP'S problem has NOTHING to do with housekeeping. If it was about the messy house, he wouldn't have married a slob of a woman or, at the very least, the dirty house would have been an issue throughout their marriage (he posted that she's been a slob the whole time). 

Surprisingly (or maybe not) the general gist of the posts on this thread involve calling OP's wife names and telling OP to make her clean the house or else. That's not going to help because the mess is not the problem. It's only a symptom. 

He can force her to keep an immaculate house, he can force her to get a job, he can even force her to stop spending weekends at the in laws but none of that resolves the source of the problem. So what's really going on in that relationship? 

So yeah, I stand my posts.


----------



## New_Beginnings (Nov 16, 2015)

Sounds like possible depression, the fact of you always being gone (working two jobs) and her wanting to be around other adults. She goes to her parents to have adult interaction and probably sick of being stuck in your house alone.

Can your wife possibly find some kind of hobby during the week? Possibly get a part time job, so you can quit your part time? I think lack of cleaning is only a small fraction of what's really going on.


----------



## Lila (May 30, 2014)

happy as a clam said:


> Ok, besides this being a really off-putting comment ("stinking butt holes"?? Really??) if you really believe everyone's opinions stink, why bother to post on a forum at all?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


NS gave me her opinion of my post when she said "I think this is total crap advice". I'm just reminding folks to get a grip. None of us are degreed psychologist or trained marriage counselors. Our advice is simply opinions based on our experiences, and opinions are subjective. I post to this forum to give advice to OP (share my ideas/experiences) not to give my opinion on other people's posts. I leave that to the pros.


----------



## NobodySpecial (Nov 22, 2013)

Lila said:


> NS gave me her opinion of my post when she said "I think this is total crap advice". I'm just reminding folks to get a grip. None of us are degreed psychologist or trained marriage counselors. Our advice is simply opinions based on our experiences, and opinions are subjective. I post to this forum to give advice to OP (share my ideas/experiences) not to give my opinion on other people's posts. I leave that to the pros.


Let me rephrase with happier nonsense. I disagree with your opinion. As counter point, I will offer my own.

Does that make you happy?


----------



## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

Lila said:


> OP'S problem has NOTHING to do with housekeeping. If it was about the messy house, he wouldn't have married a slob of a woman or, at the very least, the dirty house would have been an issue throughout their marriage (he posted that she's been a slob the whole time).
> 
> Surprisingly (or maybe not) the general gist of the posts on this thread involve calling OP's wife names and telling OP to make her clean the house or else. That's not going to help because the mess is not the problem. It's only a symptom.
> 
> ...


So what go you suggest as a solution?

I would suggest an ultimatum. Which probably won't work, and a divorce as a result. However, the law will give her half of everything because she "earned it", and then he'll have to work 2 jobs + 2 more to make a living for his wife as well.
So basically, we have a situation here where the husband has put himself in the worst possible situation.
Apparently the days of SAHM are over, unless you want a high chance of working extra hard to pay an ex wife to sit around and have sex with other men. I think my suggestion sucks.

Do you have another?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Lila (May 30, 2014)

Evinrude58 said:


> So what go you suggest as a solution?
> 
> I would suggest an ultimatum. Which probably won't work, and a divorce as a result. However, the law will give her half of everything because she "earned it", and then he'll have to work 2 jobs + 2 more to make a living for his wife as well.
> So basically, we have a situation here where the husband has put himself in the worst possible situation.
> ...


I need more information from OP before I can make suggestions. Primarily, how long the in law escape have been going on? How he feels about his wife in general? How much time they spend together? How badly are they in debt (assumption based on the two jobs)? What was their relationship like early on?


----------



## 225985 (Dec 29, 2015)

mjgh06 said:


> I think we lost the OP somewhere.


OP is probably too busy working two jobs and cleaning the house to post here. Maybe he will come back on the weekend when wife takes the kids to her parents for the weekly overnight trip.


----------



## BetrayedDad (Aug 8, 2013)

Lila said:


> If the running joke is true, he can divorce and enjoy living by himself in an immaculate van parked by the river.


Why does HE have to live in the van?!?

Oh yeah because after he dumps this worthless excuse of a woman she will most likely get a fat alimony check and child support for three kids (easily totaling in the thousands of dollars a month) so she can continue to sit on her ass and be worthless excuse of a woman.

That's justice.


----------



## NobodySpecial (Nov 22, 2013)

Evinrude58 said:


> So what go you suggest as a solution?
> 
> I would suggest an ultimatum. Which probably won't work, and a divorce as a result. However, the law will give her half of everything because she "earned it", and then he'll have to work 2 jobs + 2 more to make a living for his wife as well.
> So basically, we have a situation here where the husband has put himself in the worst possible situation.
> ...


My suggestion would be several fold:

1. *MC*. If she does not want to go, he should go himself. If necessary, IC to understand setting effective limits and holding onto his NUTS.

2. Learn about setting boundaries with her AND the kids. One small example would be to stop doing what housework he can stand to not do. For example, do only his own laundry and the laundry of those kids too small to do it for themselves. Toss everyone else' in a different basket in the laundry area. This change will yield response, mostly negative. Reaction to negative response is at least calm, at best cheerful. Oh, your clothes are dirty?! Hey look, the washing machine is over there!

3. Learn extensively about positive, effective discipline with and for the kids. Since effective, positive discipline does not involve yelling or anything negative of that sort, that will lessen her objection When she does object, he reacts calmly that since he is a father, it is his responsibility to be a father.

4. Learn about active listening. Listen to what is going on from HER point of view. He cannot understand how to respond to her reality until he really knows what it is. Do not make all conversations about understanding her PoV as a means to solutions to his but also as support and affirmation where he can. Let her talk about her feelings and echo them back to show attempt at understanding. If it is anything like my marriage, actual understanding is harder than the effort to understand. Develop mutual trust if possible.

That is where I would start if I were him.


----------



## wmn1 (Aug 27, 2014)

Lila said:


> OP'S problem has NOTHING to do with housekeeping. If it was about the messy house, he wouldn't have married a slob of a woman or, at the very least, the dirty house would have been an issue throughout their marriage (he posted that she's been a slob the whole time).
> 
> Surprisingly (or maybe not) the general gist of the posts on this thread involve calling OP's wife names and telling OP to make her clean the house or else. That's not going to help because the mess is not the problem. It's only a symptom.
> 
> ...


and I stand by mine. She needs to pick up the slack


----------



## Chuck71 (Nov 5, 2012)

The irony of it all..... TAM is here for people to give advice. What we end up seeing here MORE is when 

said posters give advice end up having to defend their analysis with others who are NOT the OP.

If you light a fire and put a fan beside it and blow air at the flame.... wah happunz?

Now if the OP directly asks a poster who gave feedback.... all well and good. 

IOW.... people STOP TAKING THE BAIT


----------



## Adelais (Oct 23, 2013)

Lila said:


> I can tell my husband to kiss what a twist if he complains about the house but a SAHM can't. I can complain about being stressed with work, and get a by. ...SAHM can't. Again, just calling it like it is.
> 
> Makes me happy to have chosen career over SAHM. In all honesty, doesn't make me a better wife than OPs but I get away with a lot more simply because I bring home a paycheck.


Who gets to decide whether a SAHM is allowed to complain about being stressed about having a bad day at work? A SAHM who takes her job seriously and who has high standards for herself, can become discouraged and feel like she is behind the 8 ball. She might not have dinner ready, have the laundry done, or have washed the ink off the wall from when she was changing a baby diaper in one room while the toddler was drawing on the wall in the other room. Those "failures" can add up and drag her down, and if she asks for help when the husband comes home she is not asking too much, because her job is a 24 hour job, not an 8 hour one. Taking good care of my children has been a more demanding job than any professional job I ever had. I have a right to complain after I've had a bad day. If my husbad were home, I could ask him for help after he came home from work.

In OP's case, however his wife does not seem to have any personal standards to live up to, while OP is doing 3 jobs. She doesn't complain because she does absolutely nothing!

OP may I suggest that you take two or three weekends to do the following: send the children to grandparents, but ask your wife to stay at home. You and she clean the house together. You are cleaning it already, so doing it with her should not be a problem. Tell her that you expect her to keep the house clean from now on, during the week, because she and the children will be expected to stay home, with you, from now on, since you miss them during the week while you are working, and you have a right to spend quality time with them. 

In addition, tell her that once she understands what it takes to keep a home clean and liveable, you expect her to train the children to clean up after themselves, and she should begin to assign specific chores to them, according to their ages. You can help her come up with a schedule, or list of little chores the can do. There are all kinds of tips on the internet on how to organize household chores, at the adult level, and for teaching children.

This is what I used when our children were young. 

Choreganizers Review: Getting Kids To Do More Around the House | Alpha Mom

Here is where you can purchase it.

Choreganizers: Jennifer Steward: 9781568570029 - Christianbook.com

Our children are great workers around the home now. Even our son, who is 20, and who lives on his own, knows how to clean his apartment. (It is not clean according to my standards, but it is not my place! LOL He knows how to clean it when he does. He complains that his roommate doesn't know how to clean or cook and he is glad we taught him how to do the basics when growing up.)

When I asked my oldest daughter the name of what we used to teach them how to do chores, so I could find you a link to it for you, her response was "I loved the Chore Store when I was little!"

This will also help your wife get an idea of what the different chores are...that she should be doing. Of course she should do all the chores until the children are old enough to start doing age appropriate jobs.

I think your wife is wrong in not taking her job as a SAHM seriously. However I am thinking that she has no idea how to organize her days and discipline herself, much less the children on how to do it. She doesn't value her job. The Choreganizer (link provided) will help her understand and decide what chores need to be done on a regular basis.

You have a hard road ahead of you. A negative attern has been set, and reinforced for years. It will be difficult to break. The hard job of introducing and enforcing a new pattern is going to be yours until your wife learns what a relief it is to have a job that actually matters, and to enjoy the rewards of doing it well.


----------



## Mark72 (May 26, 2012)

Bob?


----------



## Chuck71 (Nov 5, 2012)

Ey yo Bobbah's lefts da bilden'

Last post 3/1 right after midnight.

After reading the drama.... would you come back?


----------



## BetrayedDad (Aug 8, 2013)

Chuck71 said:


> After reading the drama.... would you come back?


Fvck yeah... YOLO dog!


----------



## PhillyGuy13 (Nov 29, 2013)

I'm holding out hope for his return. But when you work two jobs, cook, clean and take care of three kids, quality internet time can be limited.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## New_Beginnings (Nov 16, 2015)

Be on stand by, tomorrow is weekend at the parents... Is it too soon, to make light of the situation?


----------



## New_Beginnings (Nov 16, 2015)

Honestly though if your wife truly doesn't do anything and leaves on weekend. I sure wouldn't be sitting at home cleaning. Id pop up at her parents home and tell her it's time to do things as a family, go home.


----------



## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

marduk said:


> Agreed. But I don't think he'll find that out until he finds out what she's doing with her time.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Yea, what is she doing while he is at work? Time for VARS and Nanny cams. Maybe the neighbor, who does shift-work and is at home during the day is entertaining her. Just planting a germ, a seedling of doubt. Check this out thread-starter.


----------



## 225985 (Dec 29, 2015)

OP last seen on post 15. 110 posts ago.


----------



## Bobgel (Mar 1, 2016)

Hi, I am still around. I have learned a learned a lot from these posts. I think it's obvious she is depressed. Her other problem is that she is constantly in the doctor or ER for some medical issue and she always needs rest. She cheated on me right after we were married, but I do not think she is doing it now.


----------



## Bobgel (Mar 1, 2016)

Yes, her parents are complete enablers and they admit it.


----------



## Bobgel (Mar 1, 2016)

Everything everyone is telling me on here is 100% correct and I know it. I still have no idea how to go about getting this through to her as our relationship has crumbled to her basically hating me for not being home. How can I get her to understand that after almost 40 years of being a big baby, she needs to stop immediately and grow up?


----------



## Blossom Leigh (Mar 27, 2014)

How much codependency work have you done?


----------



## SoulCrushed16 (Feb 15, 2016)

Bobgel said:


> Hi, I am still around. I have learned a learned a lot from these posts. I think it's obvious she is depressed. Her other problem is that she is constantly in the doctor or ER for some medical issue and she always needs rest. She cheated on me right after we were married, but I do not think she is doing it now.


She's a hypochondriac. Straight up. Have they actually found anything wrong with her? Why does she need the rest when you're the one that works 2 jobs, cooks, cleans, and takes care of the kiddos? Also how are you so sure that she isn't cheating on you now??


----------



## Blossom Leigh (Mar 27, 2014)

SoulCrushed16 said:


> She's a hypochondriac. Straight up. Have they actually found anything wrong with her? Why does she need the rest when you're the one that works 2 jobs, cooks, cleans, and takes care of the kiddos? Also how are you so sure that she isn't cheating on you now??


There are many conditions that can cause this.


----------



## 225985 (Dec 29, 2015)

SoulCrushed16 said:


> *She's a hypochondriac.*


Maybe, maybe not. I used to think my wife was a hypochondriac. Took 4 specialists to diagnosis her life threatening illness. 120 doctor visits later we still are dealing with illness. It will only get worse from here. Wish we had caught this earlier when something could have been done. 

OP, Never be quick to make that conclusion.


----------



## Chuck71 (Nov 5, 2012)

blueinbr said:


> Maybe, maybe not. I used to think my wife was a hypochondriac. Took 4 specialists to diagnosis her life threatening illness. 120 doctor visits later we still are dealing with illness. It will only get worse from here. Wish we had caught this earlier when something could have been done.
> 
> OP, Never be quick to make that conclusion.


Mom had a bout with lupus right after HS (early 60s). Her mom thought she was lazy. She had another

bout with it in 1988-89. Was still not much known about it. I'm not a Dr. but feel her miscarriage (prior to

first bout) and my botched brain surgery and her mother's death, each in '88... had a great deal to

do with these flare ups. Lupus gained attention when baseball star Tim Raines was diagnosed. 67-75% inflicted are females. 

She also had vasculitis in the early 70s. Again... not much known about it. She eventually

went to Emory. When the Drs took the sores off.... pop said 'you could see her ##$%^^ bones'

Granted.... mom did work until she retired... minus being SAHM back in the 70s.... which... I made sure, wasn't easy.


----------



## Blossom Leigh (Mar 27, 2014)

Chuck71 said:


> Mom had a bout with lupus right after HS (early 60s). Her mom thought she was lazy. She had another
> 
> bout with it in 1988-89. Was still not much known about it. I'm not a Dr. but feel her miscarriage (prior to
> 
> ...



I've been dealing with wide spread body pain and deep fatigue since at least 1999. After seeing doctors who finally took it serious they are working on a Lupus diagnosis, possibly Sjorgrens and ruling out lyme. I have other symptoms I had no idea that are part of Lupus criteria. Another pattern Lupus patients are at risk for is HELLP syndrome with child birth, which I had with our son. Had I been diagnosed prior to giving birth my doctors would have been better equipped to recognize HELLP sooner. It almost cost me my life. Its been hard to accept that all this time I struggled in my body and just pushed through anyway was a very serious underlying condition. There is no telling how much damage has been done with such a late diagnosis. I hope your wife finds the help she needs OP.


----------



## Chuck71 (Nov 5, 2012)

Blossom Leigh said:


> I've been dealing with wide spread body pain and deep fatigue since at least 1999. After seeing doctors who finally took it serious they are working on a Lupus diagnosis, possibly Sjorgrens and ruling out lyme. I have other symptoms I had no idea that are part of Lupus criteria. Another pattern Lupus patients are at risk for is HELLP syndrome with child birth, which I had with our son. Had I been diagnosed prior to giving birth my doctors would have been better equipped to recognize HELLP sooner. It almost cost me my life. Its been hard to accept that all this time I struggled in my body and just pushed through anyway was a very serious underlying condition. There is no telling how much damage has been done with such a late diagnosis. I hope your wife finds the help she needs OP.


I "was told" her 60s bout lasted about 4-6 months. The 1988-89 one lasted almost an entire year.

The last one.... she was off work for around a year. I feared another outbreak a couple years ago

after her sister and brother died. Something worse happened non-related to lupus though.

I recall she would stay in bed for days, sleep, was task just to go to bathroom.... near lifeless.


----------



## Blossom Leigh (Mar 27, 2014)

Chuck71 said:


> I "was told" her 60s bout lasted about 4-6 months. The 1988-89 one lasted almost an entire year.
> 
> The last one.... she was off work for around a year. I feared another outbreak a couple years ago
> 
> ...


Gracious. 

I have a baseline pain that will flare into intense pain from neck to ankles when under high stress. Unexplained fevers, flu like ache that moves around during a flare and will hit walls of fatigue. I'm so stubborn about staying active that up to this last year most people never knew there was anything wrong with me especially since I laugh and cut up all the time, but this past year really got to me. Thats when I headed to the docs for help. So far though the meds make me worse. I haven't experienced a remission.


----------

