# But I thought it wouldn't last....



## 52flower (Mar 4, 2011)

I just got back from the gym. I go there when I feel strong, positive, happy but also when I’m sad, alone, mad, depressed. Today, after working out, I had a stomachache which I have not had for a while. I had to put it in high gear & didn't have time to get angry. I think some of the anger is coming out now, in between the gamut of all the other emotions.

I read that only 3% of men who have affairs go on to making it a permanent relationship. I thought it wouldn’t last. I thought he would see the shakiness of a relationship that started with deceit. I thought he would realize he was losing someone who devoted her heart and soul to him and that the OW was selfish and shallow. He is still with her, 2 years later and seems at least content & maybe happy. How foolish I was to hope he wasn’t in the 3%. I thought he would come out of the fog, have a change of heart, & regret what he lost. I thought wrong.

I know I should probably be writing in the “divorced” section as our divorce became final January this year. Actually, I have written threads in both sections about my situation. I don’t respond often (although I read & care), mostly because I read and think and reflect and reflect more. I spend a lot of time in this section because I have learned so much of what happened to me, what I did or didn’t do, and who I am. I empathize with the stories of men and women agonizing over betrayal and cruel emotional abuse. 

A quick skim of why I’m here:
1)	2006 decided he wanted to be free & “retire” in our vacation home (in another state) & bring me over later. “No it’s not about another woman”. Of course it was – moved her in for 8 months. Flew back and forth every 2 weeks, duping both of us. Flew her over & put her up in a hotel near our home (we paid for it) 3 times, a week each. 
2)	After I realized it was an affair, I told him to stay there with her. He decided to stop the affair & fix us.
3)	The next 2 years had it’s ups and downs but he did not have contact with her. I told him if he betrayed again, I wouldn’t stay in the marriage. There were several incidences of lies…mostly spending money without me knowing.
4)	2009, I found he cashed several thousands of dollars & he wouldn’t tell me what he spent it on. The feeling of being lied to was more than I could handle. I stayed away a few nights. In the meantime, he planned a trip across the country to meet up with the massage girl he met locally (she was working/visiting here). He came back and within a week, he found an apartment, told me he was moving out (again “it’s not about another woman”), flew back to get her and moved her in.
5)	I checked his cell phone & saw the “love you, miss you” texts & pictures. I knew it was affair #2. He moved them into an apartment (8 miles from our home) for 6 months. She went back to Miami to set up the purchase of their massage business. By Jan 2010, he moved (from Oregon) there with her and they own the business together. He doesn't have to work...just run ads & do the books.
6)	Jan, 2010 our divorce was final. We have a few financial (large) bills to pay as a result of a tax audit stemming from his investments.
7)	When I met him, he had no money. I had and still have 2 jobs. He had a good job & together we made good money and had a nice life. But that wasn’t enough for him. He always wanted to “make it big” through risky investments and though I was opposed, he invested & lost over a million dollars. We lost a vacation town home and I had to short sale our beautiful new house, sell another vacation home, 3 weeks timeshare as well as losing 100K he spent on his affairs.
8)	And yes, this is the one who told me he had cancer & had 6 months to live….another one of his many lies.

I read the heart breaking stories from those (men & women) in the process of the same agony & torment I went through. I understand the hope, the hurt of loss, the pain of emptiness. I took my vows seriously & worked hard every day to keep him happy. I wanted him to know how loved he was & how important he & our marriage was to me. He has a very fun, affectionate, seemingly genuine side of his personality but I now see that he also has strong traits of a narcissistic personality (not an expert but it seems this way). He needs to be important, entitled, and grandiose. He liked attention & was jealous of my kids. 2 characteristics stand out in his personality that seems to match many betrayers: selfishness and the ability to turn off empathy. He can be empathetic but not when it prevents him from getting what he wants. Then he can be very calloused and the only empathy he has is for him. I think a lot of what drives him is money. Just before the 1st affair, the investments crashed & bills started piling up. The 1st OW said she had $ contacts. He left me with creditors calling & only my income to pay the bills. Same timing with the 2d OW although this one actually makes good money (albeit unethically). So again, he took off & left me with the financial mess. I think it started off with the excitement & newness of sex but what keeps him there now is money. I think they pull in 200-300K a year (mostly tax free). I would almost guess if I made that much, he would be here in a nanosecond.

He knows I have strong values & the man he has become (cheater, liar, owner of prostitution) is not a person I respect. I thought he would finally hate who he was & want to go back to the simple life we had. Why am I foolish to think that - I hope it’s not that deep down I miss him still (but I have to admit I do miss our closeness or is it just false security?). I put on the best show and move forward trying to be optimistic & positive. But I have very tough moments still. I know I have to get there but sometimes I get caught up in a weak moment and I literally buckle.

He had been writing that he still wants to come back to me, remarry, & live together forever “the way it’s supposed to be” but has stopped saying this. He went on a 3 week vacation with her & all of the emails stopped except 3 times he sent a 1 liner that informed me his money has not come in to pay the tax bill. I think they returned. He sent an email this afternoon (to our joint email) saying “haven’t received a dime. Sorry Munchkin”. Then when I checked again tonight, he deleted that email. I think he’s mad I have not responded to his last 4 email updates on the money. I didn't even send a “thanks for the updates”. I was upset because he couldn’t even tell me he was on vacation & after a week he merely said he was "out of town on business and yes she came along". I think it’s a sensitive issue of being lied to. We aren’t married, why couldn’t he just tell the truth? I realize that if you stand up to him, he comes out with vindictiveness. All through our relationship, I had to play up to his ego & things were fine.

Sorry for the long thread. I don’t know what to do. I can continue not communicating but I sort of need to find out if he is going to pay the bills or not. I don’t want it to go on my credit report as he already made a mess that I am trying to work my way out of. Or I can be business-like & just ask for a financial commitment. Or I can use the “Just say goodbye” which makes a lot of sense for me right now. As much as I still have a hole in my heart & still get sad, I know he is not a safe person for me. I think he wants me to be angry so he can blame it on me & so he doesn’t feel as guilty. I think he would feel worse if I tell him I did my best to keep our marriage together but I his choices are evident they are probably good choices for him. He finally is the man he wants to be and I am getting on with my life & I have a lot of new experiences I want to enjoy. So I want to tell him good luck, I’ll be fine.

The reality: He abandoned me, left me in a financial mess without a home, and took off to fend for his new family. My stomach ache is probably from having to admit he didn’t really love me. If you love someone, you couldn’t hurt them. And if you “accidentally” did, you would fix it right after realizing what you did. I have to face that he took off & never did anything to fix it. He wants to be there. Some days I know I’ll be fine & some days I’m embarrassed & frustrated that I still struggle. I come to this site because although I am older (late 50’s) and most of you are quite a bit younger, I feel that you are empathetic & genuinely caring people who understand betrayal while many cannot. And you are caring enough to reach out and give strength – so needed in weak moments. Thank you for that.


----------



## The 13th_Floor (Mar 7, 2011)

52flower said:


> 2 characteristics stand out in his personality that seems to match many betrayers: selfishness and the ability to turn off empathy.


If someone asked me to honestly describe my wife 2 months ago, this is exactly how I would have done it. 

52flower, I read another thread where a poster took back his unfaithful wife. 12 years later, she cheated on him again. He advised that if one were to take back a DS, be sure their morals are proven and worth the risk of taking back. I'm sorry your situation didn't work out. 

You may in your late 50's, but I would have never guessed while reading your post. All I thought the entire time reading was man, I wish my wife loved me the same way you tried to love your husband. I wish my wife spoke this genuinly about me, our life, our family and our future. 

My situation is different thus far, but I am in the early stages of the affair, which she doesn't even have the courage to admit yet. 

My wife sent me a text message this morning telling me she ran up a mountain in her bootcamp class (we live in separate countries at the moment.) I told her, "nice." She's somehow able to live life a cheater without empathy while I'm here being torn apart; however, she has no clue that I'm torn apart. 

I, too, was at the gym this morning like yourself. When I work out, it makes me feel confident, like I don't need her, even though we may reconcile. It's like I'm trying to better myself, for myself, just in case things don't work out between us. I can't give you financial advice, but I will tell you that you have a good head on your shoulders and you know that your ex is playing you (munchkin, really?) Keep your head up. You're so not alone.


----------



## 52flower (Mar 4, 2011)

I wish it could be that all the selfish people couldn't have relationships with unselfish caring people. My post was too long but I've been struggling with the realization that for all the years I tried, I was and am cast aside so easily. Just like you feel, he is not hurting, not feeling remorse, and is fine and dandy. I suppose the wisest and healthiest choice is to keep struggling until we regain our self-esteem and confidence and not let them hurt us anymore. I'm impressed by those who write and seem so strong standing up and moving on. Or maybe they have the strong "workout" moments we have but also have the weak moments we have. Keep working out...at least it's helping our health! Thanks for your helpful words. I am appreciative of all the words and hope all of you know how they give a pivotal boost.


----------



## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

He's going to drown you in debt. Get a forensic accountant to unravel the money and dump him before he sends you to the poor house.


----------



## Lilyana (Apr 12, 2011)

I think we all have our strong "not going to take this sh*t anymore" moments.. 

And we all also have those "if he/she would just open their eyes and LOVE ME again we could work this out"

It also doesn't help if your WS is still telling you they want to work things out and they suck you back in for a day or two, then go back to their old ways.

Theres a varying amount of emotions we all go through. Believe me we are not all strong all the time


----------



## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

52: can you see a laywer to untangle yourself from his debt.

Are you guys divorced yet?I can't remember.

If not, FILE FOR DIVORCE TODAY. 

Don't worry about him anymore. He is a jerk. He left his marriage and family to be with a woman who works at a sex massage parlor. What does that say about them?

Please untangle yourself from this man as soon as possible. Find your elf-esteem. He is not worth it and hasn't been for awhile.


----------



## 52flower (Mar 4, 2011)

13th, I am sorry you are facing such pain. I wish she did not act selfishly & cared about your feelings instead of her ego. You are giving her a generous and more than fair opportunity to make your marriage important enough to save. If she is unwilling to put her energy and motivation into you, you have a huge uphill battle and I think you deserve much better.

I took my vows seriously and spent every day trying to make sure he knew how loved he was. Probably to my demise, I was loyal and showed him love and adoration no matter how he treated me. At least I have no regrets of how I treated him. I still hope I find someone to love with loyalty &respect and to pamper. And if I find him, I hope he is going to do the same for me. I hope that doesn’t sound selfish. I want to be in a healthy relationship this time. I am hoping the same for you, 13th.


----------



## 52flower (Mar 4, 2011)

Yes, divorced. He moved out 2 years ago and our divorce was final 5 months ago. He has created a tragic financial mess from choices I was opposed to and am suffering from more than he is. I have consulted with several attorneys and in a nutshell, they advised me to separate myself financially from him asap. A huge amount of money is still to be paid back but this supposed asset was put on his side. It seems that when he digs a deep hole, he runs from the problems & escapes where he can be admired and given attention. He ran to his first & 2d OW when things got bad and left me to do with the financial mess myself. The current situation is lucrative for him; I think it’s a big part in why he is still there.

Yes, he is a selfish jerk and I am angry that he abandoned me with the mess he created so that he could make a better life for himself. He didn’t tell me he returned from his “business trip” with her. During the trip, he sent 4 short emails telling me the money wasn’t in yet. I did not respond to any (yeahhh!). When he returned, I sent an email asking him to clarify exactly what his plan (concerning the tax bill) was since he did not receive the lump sun investment money yet. Can you believe this response? He said that “his plans are the same” but since I had an “oppositional attitude” he has decided to tentatively stay away. Wow… I think he thought I mean to clarify his plans to return back here (for the past 3 months he said when the money came in he was going to come back). I think he is saying he is still planning to come back but I had a bad attitude when he was on vacation. Bad attitude? I never even wrote to him. Or is that the bad attitude – my no response? I didn’t see it then but now I see how throughout the marriage, he always tried to put the blame on me. I’m not sure if I should answer “what are you referring to?” or not answer (which may cause him to 

His vacation must have been a fun time for them. He has progressively distanced himself from me and seems quite fine with his new life. He has treated me like this before…I’m only important when he is bored and needs attention. His new life is rolling along fine & right now I am in the way & not needed. When I stopped answering his emails, I knew he would probably become cold & vindictive, as he likes control & patronizing. I realize I need to sever the ties as I explained in the “Divorced” forum. But I’m not sure if I should answer “what are you referring to?” or not answer (which may cause him to become uncooperative with the tax payment). I'm not afraid of him, just want to be smart on this last financial hurdle.


----------



## reindeer (Mar 24, 2011)

52 i am in my mid 50's also, but am told I look about 43. My husband who I have been un a relationship with for 19 yrs is 15 yrs younger. I hate being in the situation I am in now as well.

I can empathise with your feelings of embarrassment, and see it a lot on here. You sound like you are doing well most of the time. Yes sometimes you 'literally buckle', but look how much you have managed to cope with. You can't finally 'let go' with this financial problem over your head. I don't feel able to advise on that, but I really hope it sorts out soon for you. Maybe then you can look forward to creating a really positive future. 

I read somewhere recently, in one of my desperate google searches to make me feel better. 
*
Not to view the emptiness in your life as a void after a relationship break up . But to think of it as a beautiful empty room, which you are going to decorate and furnish exactly the way you want to. *


----------



## 52flower (Mar 4, 2011)

Well I did it. He returned from his 3 week vacation with her. He emailed & said I had an oppositional attitude so he "tentatively was staying away". ??? I never returned an email. I wrote him & said I didn't understand what he was saying & kept it short. Yesterday he wrote & said still waiting on the money but he missed me a lot and believe it or not, he put his wedding ring back on. Again...???!!! is he nuts?? The 3 week no contact was good. I reread your responses to me and responses to each other, contemplated, reasoned, & looked at the big picture. 

I like Morituri's Just Let Them Go and finally decided to do just that. Or maybe it was Just Let Me Go. I told him tonight that he made a choice for himself and we are not together anymore. I told him it wasn't right for us to communicate anymore and that I wish him well. I think he was surprised and tried to turn it around by saying we have a lot to work on & where should we move together. I wonder if he really thinks in such odd ways.

I have been having a hard time deciding whether to tell him how pissed I am at what he did & who he is. Recently my son said "Mom, he isn't going to get it if you point the finger at him. I think it's better to go out by saying you realize it's better for both, that you accept his choice and that you're doing fine & good luck. Whether it was the better choice or not, I feel great...like a big weight is off of me. 

I realize it might not be as clean cut as it sounds; it was an enormous step for me. I hope I stay strong if he tries to turn it back on me. It's amazing what subtle abuse can do to someone over the years. And it's hard to believe it took me 2 years to even get those words out of my mouth. I just want to say thank you to all of you who helped me start moving out of my 2 year rut. You're all wise people who care about the well being of others.


----------



## reindeer (Mar 24, 2011)

It's good to hear that you have done that 52flower and ives me hope. You will still get up and down days, but you have been able now to make yourself feel more in control. I have saved the letting go thread as a favourite.

My circumstances different, no OW as far as I am aware, but husband moving out to a place nearby. Although I have not given up all hope on us getting back together one day, I want to live for myself, and try not to think about that side of it. However it will be hard if he is close by. I shall certainly have to distance myself from him as itwil be painful to begin with. he has issues he needs to sort through for himself. At present very resentful towards me. A relationship killer I know, but also shows some emotion.

We speak civilly at the moment, but no phone calls txts or friendly banter. 

Let us know how it goes for you. These postings really help, just seeing other people's experiences and ways they cope (or not). Have a good day.


----------



## 52flower (Mar 4, 2011)

Reindeer, I'm sorry you are going through hard times. I haven't figured out what's up with your guy. I don't understand his cold standoffish ways. Is there someone else in his life or a midlife crisis? You have a good attitude & I hope it goes well for you

You're right about the up & down days but I'm disappointed the downs happened again so quickly. I was so hopeful that I would be like others who post - absolute about my actions, intent, and feelings. Instead, I feel somewhat guilty & worried about what he is thinking. Why do I do that? Someone asked me, why do you worry about what he feels? He didn't worry about your feelings when he was so cruel to you. It's true. I don't like when I do that. 

He tried to keep information about his vacation from me. He said it was because I get hurt. It's strange...why should it matter, we are divorced. Maybe it stemmed from this but I abruptly sent an email saying he chose start a new family with another woman and we shouldn't talk or communicate anymore. I never said anything so upfront to him before concerning his betrayal. I think it caught him off guard and he has not responded to my email, not his usual choice. I think I'm afraid he will think of anything vindictive to show me he is strong and wins in the end. Part of that is showing me he doesn't need me by going dark.

So I tried to stand up to him and say "no more madness", I genuinely hope you have a nice life. It is true, he likes to have the last say. I've always attended to his feelings, often walked on egg-shells, and it's hard to break away from the role I'm used to. I actually wanted to email him and re explain to make sure he was OK but I thought of what all of you might say. I resisted but wonder how long he will not speak.


----------



## reindeer (Mar 24, 2011)

52flower, thanks for your kind words. No I have not really posted all of my story on here, as it is too complex. I had an assesment for counselling yesterday and was advised that I would need some long term counselling to put to rest some things. I am getting information on charities that offer this fairly cheaply (it will have to be).
My husband is not a cold person towards me usually, although he can be towards many other people. I know where this has come from in his past, but he is an ostrich and does not address things, and usually copes well. Until this last October when one too many things went wrong in his life, and he did I think have a mid life crisis. Wh have both done some upsetting things towards each other. When I speak to him no he is close to tears I know.
I use this website to try to focus on the future, as I can only look after myself, and am unable to help him. We cannot change the past so have to try and create a fuure however bleak it seems.
We had the financial discussion last night. I told him I hate it that we don't hug anymore, that there will be no home with him in it for our kids to come back to. I know he was sad, but I also know that at this time there is no going back for him.
Try not to anylise what he is doing, thinking or why. This will all be coming from your own percetion of things, which will not be his. 
In my own relationship it turns out that my husband was unhappy periodically, for quite long times, but I never noticed. So we can be wrong. So just remember and remind yourself that agonising over why he is acting serves no purpose, as it your own perception of things. Your thoughts are only your thoughts and not facts. 

I hope what you have done gives you some peace now.


----------



## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

You have GOT to stop living in the past. He is gone. Stop torturing yourself. He made his choic eand it did nto include youl. 

STOP ENGAGING HIM. You will NEVER move on if you keep living in the past. 

He is scum.


----------



## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

Jellybeans said:


> You have GOT to stop living in the past. He is gone. Stop torturing yourself. He made his choic eand it did nto include youl.
> 
> STOP ENGAGING HIM. You will NEVER move on if you keep living in the past.
> 
> He is scum.


Listen to this great advice 52flower. Whether his new relationship lasts or goes south, should not matter to you anymore. The first step in your recovery should be not to care what happens to him


----------



## 52flower (Mar 4, 2011)

Is this the 180 post divorce style? My words were direct & basically told him I was dealing with moments of anger but that I realized it was time for both of us to let go. I wished him well. He did not respond for a few days so I thought he understood that our emotional bond was dead & after completing our financial bonds we just would't know each other anymore. 

He wrote back & said everything I listed about what happened was true and that my thoughts were correct on why he ran off with another (X2). He admitted he was the low down creep who killed our terrific friendship & marriage. This is about the most remorse I've heard from him. He said he totally respected any decision I made but that he wished he had the chance to show me how seriously devoted he was to trying to fix all he destroyed.

I told him his choices were his to decide & do but that I didn't respect the man he has become. It's been 2 years & he is still with the OW I didn't point the finger, I wasn't sentimental & wish things were different, & I came across that I had let him go & was moving on. A little too late but he seems remorseful (although quite possibly just for the duration of his email). Wish his remorse & commitment happened earlier before the turmoil, destruction of our marriage, & ripping out of chunks of my heart.


----------



## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Please stop talking to him.


----------



## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

Change your phone numbers and do not give it to him. If you have to communicate with him, do it via email only, since you still have tax liabilities together. After those are paid off, then you have to cut off all communications and go NC with him.

As crazy as it sounds, since you are divorced and he is with her, now you are the OW believe it or not. Get back into the social scene and reconnect with friends and family. You can't spend the rest of your life pining away for him. It really seems that you are waiting for them to break up so you can be with him again. Please stop for your own good.


----------



## 52flower (Mar 4, 2011)

I've been thinking a lot about this craziness and here is where I am. I've never been a confrontational person and I can't remember when I have ever been really made at anyone to act that way around. So when I told him I would not emotionally handle another betrayal, I knew I would have to somehow go through with it. I eventually got the divorce finalized and felt a big relief that I made a big step for me. I thought it would be final for our relationship although I wondered if we could be divorced friends. 

As I learned from reading threads of others in the midst of struggling to hang on or let go, I realized he might hang on to keep me on as the backup team. Never did I believe he would be unfair, unkind, and continue to be selfish. OK - still naive trusting me. So I go through more steps trying to stand up & protect me. I dropped the cell phone we got while together and got my own. I have not given him the number. We only email now. Next step - I'm not communicating much, only to talk about the financial bonds. Saturday was his last email to convey that he still wanted to come back & fix us & be together again. I told him that he made a big decision, one that he wanted, and I accepted it, wished him well, and have moved on. Small step for many of you but it took a lot of courage for me & it's hard to admit that I'm still shaking.

I'm doing things that I read are right and that I know I would tell any one of you to do. I know it is not a good situation to care for & love someone who does not love you back. I know the right thing to do but it's hard for me. I'm trying to understand this madness & wonder if there's something wrong with me. I should be smart, logical, and a do-er as it's a waste of time & energy and hurtful to me & those around me to still have a hard time completely letting go. I really so envy those of you who write of how you are done and don't waste anymore emotion on the past. Now I realize his abuse affected my self esteem more than I realized but I think I am a lot stronger than when I was with him. I have really good days & mostly believe it will get better. But standing up to him & to be consistent in my resolve to move on without him (without sadness) is something I wish I was better at. 

You're right -it does seem like I am hoping he comes back. Yikes how pathetic - I hope not. He isn't a good person for me to be with-I do know that. He moved out 2 years ago but we communicated quite often (mostly tied into finances) & he has always still acted like we were still close. Our divorce was final in January & I just started pulling away about a month ago by not responding to any emotional talk from him. Hopefully I will now be able to detach. Actually, I think my standoffish responses has made him mad & he won't reach out to me anymore. It makes sense that if I don't respond to his gestures, he will be angry with me & treat me with a "f-it" attitude (he's good at that). I'm hoping I can get over this last big mountain. I hope I am not damaged beyond repair & slip back - it would be disastrous for me. 

I go to the gym a lot. I moved to a new city to live although I still work at the same job (an hour commute). I've made some friends here & spend most of my time in the gym. It's great therapy & I love it. I guess it just takes time.....I'm hoping.


----------

