# When on a Date -Explaining Why You're Divorced



## bravenewworld

Have a question I can only ask fellow wise TAM'ers. Picture this:

You're on a first date. The wine and conversation are flowing, you're talking about everything and nothing in a way that feels totally natural - where you went to school, your favorite movies, how you're stuck pet-sitting your best friends turtle....

Then - the dreaded question.....

"So why exactly ARE you getting a divorce?"

The record screeches to a halt. You take a sip, no, a GULP of red wine. The clock ticks. Your date's eyebrows raise....

This has happened to me a few times and it is always and totally horrible. I understand why people ask - it's a qualifier. Did you cheat or steal? Launder money? Eff your spouses best friend? 

What I want to say - "I got married young and was basically a door mat. My spouse used my talents to build a successful company, then took all of our money and ran off with an 18 year old girl from the Ukraine. Currently we have no contact and speak solely through our attorneys. Should we share the clams casino?"

What I do say - "We got married young and grew apart. Should we share the cesar salad?"

The first one makes me sound bitter and slightly nuts. At least it's the truth! The second one is more sane but feels like such bs to me - one of those insincere platitudes like "today is the first day of the rest of your life." Bleh. 

I am fairly young to be divorced (got married practically before I could drink) so I understand why people are curious. I'm not embarrassed of my past but my divorce was/is not amicable. 

What do y'all say on those 1st/2nd/3rd dates when this topic comes up??


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## ne9907

> What I do say - "We got married young and grew apart. Should we share the cesar salad?"


I haven't gone out on any dates but my response would be very similar to yours.

If in the event that the relationship progresses to the point in which we will be comfortable with each other, then I would probably disclose more.

I think being classy about a divorce is better (eventhough we might want to spill the beans on the relationship) because it shows we have successfully moved on and are not bitter.

I would not want to date a man who trashes his ex wife or constantly laments the end of the relationship


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## Luvinwife

bravenewworld said:


> Have a question I can only ask fellow wise TAM'ers. Picture this:
> 
> You're on a first date. The wine and conversation are flowing, you're talking about everything and nothing in a way that feels totally natural - where you went to school, your favorite movies, how you're stuck pet-sitting your best friends turtle....
> 
> Then - the dreaded question.....
> 
> "So why exactly ARE you getting a divorce?"
> 
> The record screeches to a halt. You take a sip, no, a GULP of red wine. The clock ticks. Your date's eyebrows raise....
> 
> This has happened to me a few times and it is always and totally horrible. I understand why people ask - it's a qualifier. Did you cheat or steal? Launder money? Eff your spouses best friend?
> 
> What I want to say - "I got married young and was basically a door mat. My spouse used my talents to build a successful company, then took all of our money and ran off with an 18 year old girl from the Ukraine. Currently we have no contact and speak solely through our attorneys. Should we share the clams casino?"
> 
> What I do say - "We got married young and grew apart. Should we share the cesar salad?"
> 
> The first one makes me sound bitter and slightly nuts. At least it's the truth! The second one is more sane but feels like such bs to me - one of those insincere platitudes like "today is the first day of the rest of your life." Bleh.
> 
> I am fairly young to be divorced (got married practically before I could drink) so I understand why people are curious. I'm not embarrassed of my past but my divorce was/is not amicable.
> 
> What do y'all say on those 1st/2nd/3rd dates when this topic comes up??


I would say that's an inappropriate question for a first date. I would say "you know you aren't supposed to talk about exes on a first date!" And maybe say "it's just really over, we only talk through our attorneys."
Maybe dated are seeing if you are really going to get divorced or if you pine for him.


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## Pbartender

"Too many number threes."


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## Mavash.

bravenewworld said:


> What I do say - "We got married young and grew apart. Should we share the cesar salad?"


Disclaimer I'm not divorced but if I were dating now I'm with 2gals I would not ask this question until things got serious.

Anyone silly enough to ask this question shouldn't get any more information than the line you give them. My guess is they are young right?

Married TOO young will suffice.


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## Jellybeans

Also... "why are you getting divorced"... meaning you're still married...Oy...this is why I wasn't into dating before my big D. 

Nonetheless, I find it odd someone is asking that on a first date.


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## Gonnabealright

Your dreaming...wake up. I do a lot of that lately myself. I catch myself feeling better when I think about going on a date with a women I probably had a shot with but was married at the time. Isn't it obvious? Your still married not divorced and your date would want to know why your sitting next to them still married. When I was single I would never date a women who was not divorced but still married. First off, He or she has really got to be kinda nuts to be seeing you since your still married. Secondly, I know you obviously think your single in the fantasy because your thread is titled "When on a Date -Explaining Why You're Divorced" but after reading your still married I think you are confused and are probably shouldn't be dating. Sorry your here and when your divorce is final Im sure youll get plenty of dates. Good luck.


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## LoveSci

I had many possible dates run away screaming, only figuratively, when I tried to explain that I was getting divorced, by still living with her. Yes, that was odd. But my current wife didn't have too big of an issue with it. I did make my then stbx move out a couple weeks later. It takes a special person to look beyond the surface story and really understand. Maybe thus is the universe's way of clearing the wrong ones out of your way. Just be honest and try not to sound too bitter out offer too much info. It'll work out eventually.


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## arbitrator

*I wouldn't be dating until after the courtroom gavel hits the Judge's bench!

That being said, I would have no problem giving her a thumbnail version of the D; only that I wouldn't get into any of those gory details until such time that she had actually shown some genuine interest in hearing all about it!

The truth speaks absolute volumes! But it's far better to do it sans any bitterness on your part!*


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## samyeagar

Many times, especially when getting back out into the dating world, people are a bit older, have some life experience, and are going to end up dating others who are divorced. For me, the question didn't bother me a bit. It showed that the person I was with was straight forward, no nonsense, not beating around the bush.

I also find that to be a GREAT question to learn about a person. Not so much interested in the details, but rather HOW they answer. Do they put all the blame on their ex or stbx? Do they take responsibility for their part in it? If they put the blame soley on their ex...red flag.


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## Jellybeans

I was reading online and someone was saying "Don't ever date a divorced man/woman...because they always blame their ex for everything and they obviousy couldn't make their relationship work."

Lame.

I mean, yeah divorce sucks, but it's actually just a break up--on a bigger/more adult scale. 

Oh and I also read somewhere else that divorced people have less commitment issues than those who have never been married because at least if you married and divorced, you actually believed in commitment.

I mean I don't knock anyone for never marrying, because it truly isn't for everyone, but I kinda liked that whole concept about believing in commitment if you actually got/were married.

Men: what do you think of men who have never been married? Say, a man in his...40s?


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## samyeagar

Jellybeans said:


> I was reading online and someone was saying "Don't ever date a divorced man/woman...because they always blame their ex for everything and they obviousy couldn't make their relationship work."
> 
> Lame.
> 
> I mean, yeah divorce sucks, but it's actually just a break up--on a bigger/more adult scale.
> 
> Oh and I also read somewhere else that divorced people have less commitment issues than those who have never been married because at least if you married and divorced, you actually believed in commitment.
> 
> I mean I don't knock anyone for never marrying, because it truly isn't for everyone, but I kinda liked that whole concept about believing in commitment if you actually got/were married.
> 
> Men: what do you think of men who have never been married? Say, a man in his...40s?


Along these lines, after my divorce and reentering the dating world, I was specifically looking for a divorced mother of older children. Preferably from a long term marriage. Demonstrated two important things to me...commitment and parenting.


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## Jellybeans

2galsmom said:


> I was told not to marry a person whose parents were divorced that I would get divorced and well I did.* But then again, my parents are still married so then why didn't I stay married?* My father told me children of divorced parents do not work or fight as hard to fix or keep a marriage going.


Oh I can so relate. My parents are still married. So are my ex husband's parents. It's a real mindfvck.



2galsmom said:


> Find someone who wants to be with you and puts up with your flaws and you put up with theirs, end of story.


This is the key.


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## IndyTMI

2galsmom said:


> "Well we are from a generation were you don't throw things away! You fix them!"
> 
> Barf, barf, and double barf.
> 
> You had my respect married couple until you had to explain your so called "success" (who really knows how their marriage is) by taking a cheap shot at people who are divorced. Notice married fixer couple didn't say, we both love each other.
> 
> I could not "fix" my husband or my "marriage" and it the type of advice that promoted my plunge into codependency when my husband cheated and refused to buy a family home and I thought I had to "fight" to "fix" it.
> 
> Find someone who wants to be with you and puts up with your flaws and you put up with theirs, end of story.


Yeah...I couldn't fix the fact my STBXW emotionally and physically abused me. Some situations are not fixable and those that haven't dealt with intolerable actions from their spouse have no right to blame divorce on the lack of trying.


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## ThreeStrikes

I guess I'm a jerk, because I would ask that question on a first date 

Actually, I ask that before I go on a first date  

Because if you're a fvckin cheater, or seem like one, then the date isn't happening.

To OP, honesty is your best policy. Be brief, but honest. If you continue to date the guy, then you can give more details and specifics as your relationship deepens.


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## RandomDude

Scott Stapp - Justify [The Great Divide 2005] - YouTube

Anyway my answers to this question was very similar this year on all my dates; "We grew apart"

Screw the details mate!


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## lenzi

The title of the thread is way different than what is asked in the first post.

BIG difference between being on a first date with a person who is divorced versus a person who is getting divorced.


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## Ceegee

Pbartender said:


> "Too many number threes."


I prefer "it's complicated". 

If they ask for more ,follow up with, "too many number threes".


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## RandomDude

2galsmom said:


> I would not date a person about to get divorced or going through one, sorry. No way.


I wouldn't advise it either, especially if you consider what happened to my recent date. But OP seems genuine.


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## Homemaker_Numero_Uno

I'd be honest and tell my "date" the truth: "Talking about my ex is a real turn-off. I'm out with you, why spoil it?" If they insisted, I'd settle my share of the dinner check and leave, because well, given the huge turn-off, what's there to hang around for?


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## Homemaker_Numero_Uno

ThreeStrikes said:


> I guess I'm a jerk, because I would ask that question on a first date
> 
> Actually, I ask that before I go on a first date
> 
> Because if you're a fvckin cheater, or seem like one, then the date isn't happening.
> 
> To OP, honesty is your best policy. Be brief, but honest. If you continue to date the guy, then you can give more details and specifics as your relationship deepens.


You might not be a jerk, but you need to understand there are some people who might not want to date you after you ask that question. Some people have moved on from very bad situations and don't want to go around having to let someone know about what happened, especially to some person they don't know or trust very well. You might think you're trustworthy and honest and caring and there is no reason why someone shouldn't be able to give you an honest answer. But it doesn't mean that you're entitled, or that there's necessarily anything wrong with someone who doesn't want to disclose...just that you will not be able to date these people who have established good boundaries for themselves, and tend to date people who either don't give a f*ck about who knows about their personal life, or are over-eager to have someone who will agree with them, that they were a victim. As you seem to be weeding out people who had anything to do with the cause of the divorce, you'll be exclusively dating the victim types, and good luck with that!


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## Cooper

I personally wouldn't ask that question on a first date but it always comes up early on. I usually try to joke it off with something like 'I just couldn't get along with her boyfriend". I am sure people ask because they don't want to end up with a cheater or abuser, but do you think those types would tell the truth? Fat chance. 

And I agree with Numero_Uno, what a turn off to talk about your ex spouse with someone you're trying to get to know, but some people love to wallow in misery, if not their own then some one else's. I steer the conversation in another direction, and if I keep getting pressed for dirty little details I lose interest pretty quickly. I come to TAM to air out those ex spouse issues, dating is about moving forward.


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## Gonnabealright

Cooper said:


> 'I just couldn't get along with her boyfriend".


Love that!


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## FeministInPink

I haven't started going on any dates yet, but I expect my response would be somewhat similar to 2galsmom. 

"Remember that scene in Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade, when one of the Nazi soldiers chooses the bright gold cup, and he turns to ash? Well, I chose poorly. Luckily, modern divorce laws allowed me to rectify that mistake and move on. Would you like to get some mussels to start?"


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## Homemaker_Numero_Uno

Yah, why did I get divorced? Because I could!
In all three cases it was within a year of marriage, because the guys changed their behavior and became complete losers - the first was a gold digger and completely lied about his education and job training, the second was a wife-beating immature alcoholic who sometimes took to crying and couldn't be trusted to watch his own son without an accident happening, and the third was a manipulative cheater and abuser who used me for his psycho-pathological gratification and a military housing allowance while deployed, as well as someone to b*tch about to his girlfriends so they felt sorry for them (if I'm frigid then he's the King of Norway.) So I did what was the right thing to do, cut my losses and moved on. What, I'm not supposed to get divorced? Give me a break. Divorce is a right, and it should be exercised so that deadbeats learn that they can't trap someone into their sh*tty paradigms with a piece of legal paper and a few promises. 

In the past when someone has pressed me to disclose details and then got on my case about poor choices, I've just sat back, sized up the a**hole and say, yup, and looks like my skills haven't changed much, have they? I mean, come on, both middle aged and single, after failed relationships, nothing like the pot calling the kettle black! 

Of course, nobody ever asks about the guys you adored and loved and got along with great but couldn't or didn't marry for one reason or another (usually having to do with career, education, growing apart as happens when young, issues with their kids, comas and brain damage, etc.) I guess they don't want to hear about that, because then they'd have to MEASURE UP. And that would hurt their egos.


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## badcompany

2galsmom said:


> So Homemaker #1, in my efforts to swim without a bicycle (it is a quote from a feminist I referenced in another thread) I found resources and a book called Women Who Love Psychopaths. Not saying you loved psychopaths but I am exploring why I made such horrible choices in an attempt merely to have less to explain when someone asks me out to dinner. I encourage you to do the same.
> 
> It will give you indigestion on the date as well. Who needs that if clams casino are involved? And as it turns out that is just a bunch of glorified cohogs.
> 
> Thank goodness we could and that we have rights in this county. Looking at the positive, let us welcome such questions, they tell us more about the person on the date with us. Another positive about divorce? You get an ready out. Do you want me to set you up with my out of shape male friend who can't walk up a hill without huffing and puffing?
> 
> Ready-out: No thank you, it is too soon.


As long as the psychopaths look like Clooney they'll line up anyway.

As for the why, I just get it out there so they know the short version and that is the end of it. If they walk, oh well.


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## Jellybeans

FeministInPink said:


> I haven't started going on any dates yet, but I expect my response would be somewhat similar to 2galsmom.
> 
> "Remember that scene in Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade, when one of the Nazi soldiers chooses the bright gold cup, and he turns to ash? Well, I chose poorly. Luckily, modern divorce laws allowed me to rectify that mistake and move on. Would you like to get some mussels to start?"


Lmao!!! :rofl:
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## badcompany

"Remember that scene in Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade, when one of the Nazi soldiers chooses the bright gold cup, and he turns to ash? Well, I chose poorly."

I have the captioned screenshots from this to pop them into posts when someone has "chosen wisely or poorly"...always good for a laugh


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## Homemaker_Numero_Uno

I don't think I chose poorly. It all depends on perspective.  My kids are good looking and their dads are loaded. Not the way I planned it, but whatever, BIOLOGY AND NATURE does its own dam*ed thing and twists our perceptions around to follow the basics of procreation for maximizing best chances at survival. The best part, my kids said they'll take care of me when I'm an old lady.
No kids out of the latest 'mistake' fortunately as I didn't want any with him but got some substantial benefits I've enjoyed in return for not dragging rape into the divorce proceedings.

Of course, I don't think one could really say this on a date. 
It's probably not very PC.


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## FeministInPink

2galsmom said:


> I know Jellybeans, I am still :rofl:.
> 
> Alas, none of my psychopaths had Clooney's charm or villa on Lake Como. Don't be so sure badcompany, it is way deeper than that and at least with moisturizer and some trips to the spa we all will fare better than this guy . . .
> 
> He chose... poorly - YouTube
> 
> :rofl: I am in a silly mood, I am working on my blog that I am releasing next month.


One of my favorite-ever movie scenes. Thanks for posting the link!


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## Jellybeans

2galsmom said:


> I would not date a person about to get divorced or going through one, sorry. No way.


Same here. Not interested. 

My response: _I don't date married men. You are still married. _


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## IndyTMI

Jellybeans said:


> Same here. Not interested.
> 
> My response: _I don't date married men. You are still married. _


The thing I think some of you put too much weight in is the legal aspect of this. 
Seeing as how disconnected my STBXW and I have been for the past couple of years, she was emotionally and mostly physically divorced from me for quite some time.

Since we separated the first part of the year, there has been zero connection and there never will be again.
I know I certainly am not going to allow the lack of a signature from a government employee keep me from pursuing love with someone that is still technically married...


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## Jellybeans

IndyTMI said:


> The thing I think some of you put too much weight in is the legal aspect of this.
> Seeing as how disconnected my STBXW and I have been for the past couple of years, she was emotionally and mostly physically divorced from me for quite some time.
> 
> Since we separated the first part of the year, there has been zero connection and there never will be again.
> I know I certainly am not going to allow the lack of a signature from a government employee keep me from pursuing love with someone that is still technically married...


That works for you but it doesn't for me. I would not at all want to be involved with someone who is still married, legally/emotionally, etc. It doesn't work for me so I don't date them. I hear you though. I just don't do it.


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## Unique Username

I don't like clams or mussels.


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## RandomDude

IndyTMI said:


> The thing I think some of you put too much weight in is the legal aspect of this.
> Seeing as how disconnected my STBXW and I have been for the past couple of years, she was emotionally and mostly physically divorced from me for quite some time.
> 
> Since we separated the first part of the year, there has been zero connection and there never will be again.
> I know I certainly am not going to allow the lack of a signature from a government employee keep me from pursuing love with someone that is still technically married...


It's because of people like ME!


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## RandomDude

I've ruined it for IndyTMI


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## lifeistooshort

They weren't from a generation that "fixed" problems. They were from a generation that pretended said problems didn't exist and simply lived in misery with the elephant permanently in the room. We all know how thay benefited everyone.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## JustSomeGuyWho

When I separated, I wasn't dating but I got a similar question a lot ... 'what happened?' or 'why did you separate?' It was usually preceded by 'I'm sorry'. I was also asked if I was divorcing. These questions came up quickly both from people I knew and people I had just met. I honestly didn't know how to respond. I was honest without going into too much detail. I refrained from badmouthing my wife. In fact, one friend of mine remarked that he knew it wasn't a good situation but he never heard me say one bad thing about her.

I have a difficult time reading people's intentions. It's interesting though that a couple of times I was asked this by women I had just met. It was after I explained what was going on ... and they subsequently walked away ... that I realized 'hey, they were interested in me.' Sometimes those things need to be spelled out for me. I was very alone ... and lonely ... during the bulk of my year long separation ... so those moments were bittersweet.

_Posted via *Topify* on Android_


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## IndyTMI

2galsmom said:


> The cat in your avatar is so cute. My opinions are not based on your love and issues with your wife.
> 
> I deserve better than someone who is caught up in someone else. I do not want to be anyone's rebound. I do not want to do things that are not in accordance with my genuine self. I do not want to date someone and have them mistake their feelings for me as genuine when I am only a crutch while they learn to cope yada yada yada.
> 
> Pure and simple. I know what I want, and what I do not want. The Universe may surprise me with something else, but I am comfortable in buy choices. Happy. Look at it this way RandomDude, you helped me get stronger.


That's the thing though...I'm not caught up with my STBXW, nor is the relationship I am currently in any form of a rebound one. I don't need a crutch because I am already walking on both feet and have been resolved about my marriage and where it ended up.
The connection between myself and my STBXW was broken long ago and I realized that I wasn't going to rebound because there wasn't anything to rebound from, as there was actually a lack of everything necessary to have a relationship to begin with.

I can now see and feel what true love is, as I am finally receiving it on a level I have never experienced before. It was something I had always hoped to feel while married, but it was never there. 
I suppose I should consider myself fortunate that my new love can look past the lack of a signature, which is the only formality tying me to my past, so we can enjoy what we both have to offer one another.


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## ne9907

> The connection between myself and my STBXW was broken long ago and I realized that I wasn't going to rebound because there wasn't anything to rebound from, as there was actually a lack of everything necessary to have a relationship to begin with.


I like this very much, good luck IndyTMI. Glad things are looking great for you


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## vi_bride04

samyeagar said:


> Many times, especially when getting back out into the dating world, people are a bit older, have some life experience, and are going to end up dating others who are divorced. For me, the question didn't bother me a bit. *It showed that the person I was with was straight forward, no nonsense, not beating around the bush.*
> 
> I also find that to be a GREAT question to learn about a person. Not so much interested in the details, *but rather HOW they answer. Do they put all the blame on their ex or stbx? Do they take responsibility for their part in it? If they put the blame soley on their ex...red flag.*


:iagree:

I don't see any point beating around the bush, first date or not. Why waste anyone's time? Alot can be gathered on how a person talks about their ex/divorce. 

I would hate to fall for someone, then find out the true circumstances of the divorce. Say something like, serial cheating.


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## Homemaker_Numero_Uno

I'd just prefer it if any prospects of mine hired a private detective and did a background check and skipped the Q&A. Sooooo much easier if they MUST have info I'd rather not regurgitate. 

Kind of like if you want to give someone a blow job, and then they want to know which ex you perfected it on. Phhhhhhht. Don't ask about ex's - EVER. It shows a very large degree of insecurity and you know what, there is NEVER a right answer. 

I'm an open book. Learn Braille buddy.


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## vi_bride04

*Re: Re: When on a Date -Explaining Why You're Divorced*



2galsmom said:


> Note: Serial cheaters do not tell you they are serial cheaters.


No they will not...that's why asking questions about the divorce will help clue in on red flags....

I know my ex would never disclose why I left (he is a serial cheater)


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## whitehawk

l'm dreading this one too but then really l dunno why.
Brcause the one girl l've been close to since our sep' , hell it was easy , no biggie at all.
We'd both made a fkg mess of our lives.

Hope it never is a biggie too you know because anyone and anything , can just fk up , it's so easy :rofl:


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## Jellybeans

Homemaker_Numero_Uno said:


> Kind of like if you want to give someone a blow job, and then they want to know which ex you perfected it on. Phhhhhhht.


Oh my.


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## Homemaker_Numero_Uno

Jellybeans said:


> Oh my.


And that, my dear, is a big red flag.


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## Jellybeans

Ya think?

Did that really happen to you?


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## Homemaker_Numero_Uno

Jellybeans said:


> Ya think?
> 
> Did that really happen to you?


My ex - the one who was abusive, manipulative and cheating and lying - yes, whenever I would get particularly active in the sex department - and why not as we were married and as far as I knew exclusive - would ask me "where I learned that", who I had done it with, etc. And would more or less accuse me of cheating and if not cheating then thinking of someone else. It was ridiculous. 

Now it's like, if a guy asks me about other guys in my past, regarding problems or regarding sex with other guys, he's history.

The issue is, when you have been abused, and you disclose that to someone, eventually it will be used against you in some way. And if a guy is really really really sweet and non-abusive and therefore worthy of one's time, he is going to understand and be okay if you don't want to talk about the past and to enjoy the present and "future of two." People do know what's healthy and right for themselves and if someone cannot respect that and needs to pry, then they are just not worthy or appropriate, and repeated attempts to justify why they need to know are, well, RED FLAGS. 

My life speaks for itself. I'm organized, coherent, take exceptionally good care of myself and my kids, am enjoying my return to school, travel, work, etc. Have a three year contract lined up and long standing work with the same clients, fiscally responsible, high credit score and all bills paid on time, sufficient free time for self and worthy other, and devoid and cleared of any mental health diagnoses, on top of which am physically healthy and have a decent sex drive and don't, most definitely don't sleep around. Right now, it's all talk. 

But much as I would like to be in a relationship that involved physical intimacy and sex, sex, sex it's not going to happen if a guy wants to bring up my past or question the source of my skills and knowledge. If someone isn't going to be respectful of MY need to protect MY mental health and sexual drive in a relationship, then there is no relationship, period. Boundaries are boundaries. You don't get to decide on someone else's boundaries. You respect them or not. Need to keep things to oneself that one chose only to share with a therapist/social worker trumps need-to-know of some guy who thinks Q&A is going to tell him what he needs to know. I prefer a guy who can judge from his own experience. And there's no way I'm going to tell a guy what happened in my past relationships. All it does is give manipulative cheaters the keys to getting in through the door, which is a Trojan Horse kind of setup. Why hand over your psychological blueprints to an unknown person for fear of rejection? Anyone who does that is exhibiting a HUGE RED FLAG. i.e. you're letting them know how you got fooled in the past...so they will be sure not to use those tactics, they will strive to be different. In order to break a cycle, you need to stop doing what it was you were doing. Don't be so eager to share what should be private or privileged on a first date, with a total stranger.


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## Jellybeans

Homemaker_Numero_Uno said:


> My ex - the one who was abusive, manipulative and cheating and lying - yes, whenever I would get particularly active in the sex department - and why not as we were married and as far as I knew exclusive - would ask me "where I learned that", who I had done it with, etc. And would more or less accuse me of cheating and if not cheating then thinking of someone else. It was ridiculous.


Gross.


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## vi_bride04

My ex was very insecure about his manhood and people I have been with in the past. For the entire 10 yrs we were together he would ask at least once a month about it. Always after sex. By the time the conversation was over I would feel like a completely horrible person for having relationships with guys before marrying him. Ugh. I finally quit engaging him when he would ask, but then he would get p!ssed off and say things like my silence just shows where my loyalties lie.....wow...really?! 

That red flag was always there, from the beginning, I think even after the very first time we had sex he asked. I just kept pushing it off as "silly" or "not important". It was important b/c it clued in on just how insecure he was in other areas of his life and self. 

So yeah, I'm with ya HNU - any guy who is too nosy or insecure about the guys in my past are out.


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## Jellybeans

Omg. WTH???


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## vi_bride04

Jellybeans said:


> Omg. WTH???


Yup that's pretty much what went through my head every time it happened...

Ahhh well live and learn I guess

I do have to say, I never ask or even care about the girls before me. Long term relationships and how they ended are good facts to know but other than that, I don't care about sexual details at all.

So men - red flag when dating - a woman that is competing with your exs in the bedroom or who gets extremely jealous of exs that you have no contact with


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## FeministInPink

vi_bride04 said:


> Yup that's pretty much what went through my head every time it happened...
> 
> Ahhh well live and learn I guess
> 
> I do have to say, I never ask or even care about the girls before me. Long term relationships and how they ended are good facts to know but other than that, I don't care about sexual details at all.
> 
> So men - red flag when dating - a woman that is competing with your exs in the bedroom or who gets extremely jealous of exs that you have no contact with


Yeah, that's seriously crazy.

If my man did something fantastic to me, in my bed, my response would be, "I want to thank the girl who taught you that!" -- not insane jealousy. If he wanted to be with someone else, he would be with someone else, right?

(Unless, of course, if that man is my STBXH, but that's another story...)


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## Homemaker_Numero_Uno

Gordon, Shawn? Why yes, I do miss them.
Thanks for bringing them up!
Oh wait, you want sex? Sorry babes, I'm lost down memory lane.
Please excuse me while I go shower and play with the settings on the spray wand. HAHAHAHAHA.


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## Homemaker_Numero_Uno

FeministInPink said:


> Yeah, that's seriously crazy.
> 
> If my man did something fantastic to me, in my bed, my response would be, "I want to thank the girl who taught you that!" -- not insane jealousy. If he wanted to be with someone else, he would be with someone else, right?
> 
> (Unless, of course, if that man is my STBXH, but that's another story...)


I wouldn't even bring up ex's, favorably or not. 
The only people that belong in a relationship are the ones that are present and accounted for.


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## arbitrator

*Let's just say that my XW exclaimed how wonderful that my oral skills were once before we got married asking who taught me that move.

I lightly told her that it was by a long-distance girlfriend of mine from MN from a few years earlier.

She seemed to greatly resent it and never commented positively on it again. But, then again, she asked for it and I just answered her as honestly as I could!*


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## samyeagar

Homemaker_Numero_Uno said:


> My ex - the one who was abusive, manipulative and cheating and lying - yes, whenever I would get particularly active in the sex department - and why not as we were married and as far as I knew exclusive - would ask me "where I learned that", who I had done it with, etc. And would more or less accuse me of cheating and if not cheating then thinking of someone else. It was ridiculous.
> 
> Now it's like, if a guy asks me about other guys in my past, regarding problems or regarding sex with other guys, he's history.
> 
> The issue is, when you have been abused, and you disclose that to someone, eventually it will be used against you in some way. And if a guy is really really really sweet and non-abusive and therefore worthy of one's time, he is going to understand and be okay if you don't want to talk about the past and to enjoy the present and "future of two." People do know what's healthy and right for themselves and if someone cannot respect that and needs to pry, then they are just not worthy or appropriate, and repeated attempts to justify why they need to know are, well, RED FLAGS.
> 
> My life speaks for itself. I'm organized, coherent, take exceptionally good care of myself and my kids, am enjoying my return to school, travel, work, etc. Have a three year contract lined up and long standing work with the same clients, fiscally responsible, high credit score and all bills paid on time, sufficient free time for self and worthy other, and devoid and cleared of any mental health diagnoses, on top of which am physically healthy and have a decent sex drive and don't, most definitely don't sleep around. Right now, it's all talk.
> 
> But much as I would like to be in a relationship that involved physical intimacy and sex, sex, sex it's not going to happen if a guy wants to bring up my past or question the source of my skills and knowledge. If someone isn't going to be respectful of MY need to protect MY mental health and sexual drive in a relationship, then there is no relationship, period. Boundaries are boundaries. You don't get to decide on someone else's boundaries. You respect them or not. Need to keep things to oneself that one chose only to share with a therapist/social worker trumps need-to-know of some guy who thinks Q&A is going to tell him what he needs to know. I prefer a guy who can judge from his own experience. And there's no way I'm going to tell a guy what happened in my past relationships. All it does is give manipulative cheaters the keys to getting in through the door, which is a Trojan Horse kind of setup. Why hand over your psychological blueprints to an unknown person for fear of rejection? Anyone who does that is exhibiting a HUGE RED FLAG. i.e. you're letting them know how you got fooled in the past...so they will be sure not to use those tactics, they will strive to be different. In order to break a cycle, you need to stop doing what it was you were doing. Don't be so eager to share what should be private or privileged on a first date, with a total stranger.


For sure going deep into details is bad, and pressing for them in the way you describe is awful, and indeed a huge red flag. I also think it can be pretty destructive for any real details that are not critical to be brought up ever, but that is a fine line as the relationship gets deeper and deeper, because I would see somene who is closed tighter than Fort Knox as a red flag as well.


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## Homemaker_Numero_Uno

samyeagar said:


> For sure going deep into details is bad, and pressing for them in the way you describe is awful, and indeed a huge red flag. I also think it can be pretty destructive for any real details that are not critical to be brought up ever, but that is a fine line as the relationship gets deeper and deeper, because I would see somene who is closed tighter than Fort Knox as a red flag as well.


Yah, with a lifelong partner they might get some details after a few years of established relationship and trust built up.

I do end up having to share stuff with poetry professor (woman, not relationship, just professor who deals with teaching writing) due to nature of some of the assignments, but she is usually horrified by some of the content whereas some stuff, especially when it comes to family of origin, I think are funny not in a humorous way but just as caricatures of how ridiculous sociopaths can be. And then there are people who when I tell the truth, don't believe me. Now if I need to drive the point home, I can go to certain news items that are still floating around on-line, and say that it's just the tip of the iceberg... When it comes to my ex, it just took a while when I moved to my new home town that's a town where he used to go on his coffee breaks, for the guys in town who work for various companies (lumber, concrete, fuel delivery, road crew etc.) to get to know me and to know that whatever he was saying about me wasn't true. Stiff upper lip... 

In all honesty, people irl do NOT want to hear about my past, because it's too much for them to deal with, and it ruins the fun of being with friends watching a movie or dancing or going out to eat, working together, etc. I don't want people looking at me feeling sorry for me (I don't even feel sorry for myself!) I want them to enjoy my company. I was never deprived of love except when I made myself tolerate stuff I shouldn't of, for longer than was necessary. Which was not very often. 

But as far as relationships go, I like to protect what I value, and talking about past abusive relationships is a huge turnoff and I don't want to give the abusers any control over my life that they don't deserve. In my mind, if someone is wanting me to talk about my past when I don't want to, then they are perpetuating the abuse, not helping in any way, and if someone doesn't want to be helpful and to even proceed in a manner that revives and perpetuates stuff that's been put to rest, then they have a problem, in that they don't mind hurting someone else to get what they need. Because I've moved on, I would also move on in the sense that I wouldn't get involved with someone like that. I also wouldn't want to get involved in someone who thinks they are going to make reparations or to "help me" in any way. I'm a grown woman, if I need any kind of specific help, I'll ask for it. If I need therapy, there are people who provide that professionally. I wouldn't ruin a relationship by making it therapeutic. That's for foster kids and abused animals, not fully grown adults!


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## RandomDude

> So yeah, I'm with ya HNU - any guy who is too nosy or insecure about the guys in my past are out.


It's ironic really... my wife/STBX was an escort before she met me, most guys shunned her when they found out, shunned her still when she didn't put out fast enough due to her new found convictions.

Yet she was, and always has been, a woman of quality despite our problems. Diamond in the rough. Shame really, that I can't match her quality. People need to really get over the whole 'used goods' thing but that's just my opinion.


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## aston

2galsmom said:


> As a divorced person, I would never ask that question. Who is asking this so fast? It is a loaded question, the answer is longer than War and Peace, it is a trigger and one you will never get the whole truth about in most likelihood. So why not find out over time?
> 
> It makes the person who asks look both naive and like one quick to rush to judgement.


I agree, thats a question I never ask being divorced myself. If anything I wait until the other person is comfortable delving into more personal areas....usually after a few dates with the same person.


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## LoveSci

It seems to me that too many people get hung up on the whole who did you sleep with before me thing. As long as they aren't going around looking for another partner, what does it matter? Seems like it's just a way to try to place blame. Just my 2 cents.


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## bravenewworld

*Re: When on a Date -Explaining Why You're Divorcing*

Sorry, I definitely should have made the title of this thread "divorcing" and not "divorced" past tense. I understand why people may find it confusing.

I need the court/government to grant me a divorce for legal reasons but those legalities don't pertain to my personal life/morals. Kind of like I don't need the government threatening me with jail not to steal, murder or drunk drive - I don't want to do those things because I personally think they are morally wrong. When I told my ex his infidelity had ended our marriage, I meant it. In my heart, mind, and soul - it was over at that moment. 

That said, I do always inform someone before we go out that I am not legally divorced yet, but the paperwork has been filed and we are just waiting on the court. No one has had a problem with it but I would respect their decision if they did. 

I can understand people needing the paperwork finalized to feel closure/move on, but for me my closure came through 6 months of alone time, meditating, and therapy. Different strokes for different folks. I will totally admit I might have judged someone for doing this prior to getting a divorce, but now that I've experienced it I understand both sides of the dating and waiting coin. We all have to do what's best for us as long as we are honest and respectful of others. 

Total unrelated side note: Happy Thanksgiving TAM! Been a flurry of activity, and now the bird is in the oven. I am enjoying a much needed glass of wine and TAM time.


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## bravenewworld

Homemaker_Numero_Uno said:


> But much as I would like to be in a relationship that involved physical intimacy and sex, sex, sex it's not going to happen if a guy wants to bring up my past or question the source of my skills and knowledge. If someone isn't going to be respectful of MY need to protect MY mental health and sexual drive in a relationship, then there is no relationship, period. *Boundaries are boundaries. You don't get to decide on someone else's boundaries. You respect them or not. *


Bolded because it's so true. I had pretty much zero boundaries with my ex (I take full responsibility for that btw) and I NEVER want to go down that road again! I constantly have to remind my co-dependent self that it's ok to put myself, my needs, and my boundaries first.


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## RandomDude

I'm currently thinking of a witty line to get out of this question, without the use of sarcasm cause that may still give the wrong impression.


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## RandomDude

Hey now! lol
Both my wife and laundry lady are out of my reach now...

So this is for my next victim... *ahem* I mean lucky lady


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## LoveAtDaisys

Here's a slightly different question, related to our topic question, then:

Say the intended date does not ask your history. When, then, is it appropriate to mention a divorce/kids?

To me, I wouldn't mention until at least the second date. Sometimes there isn't a second date, after all, and I'm of the opinion that airing one's dirty laundry immediately is a bit of a turn off. I'd rather wait until I have a better idea of how serious the relationship will be.

How about you guys?


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## Freak On a Leash

Went on two dates with a guy. Most of the time he talked about his wackjob ex wives (yes, he had TWO) and his ex GF he lived with for two years. At the end of the second date he was showing me pics of the trailer home he'd bought his ex GF and all the yardwork he'd done around it. 

By the end of that night I was done and the next time he called I said "No, thankyou." 

I don't want to hear anyone's life story and I assume they don't want to hear mine. When I date someone it's a time to get to know them and move forward, not look backward. 

So I just tell them the truth.."Unhappily married most of the 23 years I was with him and in the last 3 years he was an alcoholic so I ended it." Anyone who doesn't get that is an idiot.


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## LVF

Did you guys ever find dates who have prejudice against divorced people? Maybe I am being paranoid. I don't have any divorced people in my family and I am very very young to be divorced. When do you tell your dates that you are divorced, even if you don't tell why? 

I never had casual dates. So far, I only feel comfortable dating someone if it is serious from the beginning. But how would I turn to a guy (imagine, under 30. maybe just got out of university) and say I am divorced? Won't he think I'm crazy and run away? I also don't want to make it my presentation card "oh, I really like you, let's date, but let me warn you that I have been married before". Won't it sound weird? What reactions did you guys face so far?


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## 3Xnocharm

Personally, I dont see what the big deal is about this. Someone you are dating is perfectly within their right to ask. I have no qualms about answering the WHY, for me the embarrassing part is the HOW MANY! LOL!! You dont have to go into details, its seriously not a big deal, your divorce is a huge part of your life story and who you are now as a person. 

When someone asks me this question, WHY did I get divorced, I resist the urge to ask "which time??" and say that my husband dumped me to get back with his first wife. Its honest, its to the point, and lets them know exactly what happened without a lengthy discussion. They are usually to stunned to ask many questions after that anyway, lol!


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## southbound

I wouldn't be offended at all if a woman asked why I'm divorced. I wouldn't mind discussing it in great detail, and i would like to know why she is divorced as well. If she says something like, "Oh, I just wasn't happy anymore, or we just grew apart," I would probably get nervous.


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## southbound

2galsmom said:


> I don't want to talk about it anymore, that became official today. Sick of it, all of it, I am done with the blah blah blah divorce blah blah blah. Thank you TAM.
> 
> I think if you find a person at the "I want to talk about it" stage you are in luck southbound but for some of us, enough is enough. I no longer want to have my divorce define me. It's not that I don't want to talk about it to hide things, it is just I want to move on. So, I suspect that there are others in this camp and they may give you a quick response like "We just grew apart, are you allergic to shellfish? I would indeed like the clams casino if it is not a bother," just to change the subject. I want to go out and find life, not relive my past one.


But i would want to know why the person was divorced. Not necessarily on the first date, but if desired to get serious, I would want to know. 

Maybe i just see it from a different perspective. My x had what i call a mid-life crisis and divorced for lame reasons. I wouldn't want someone else with that mindset.


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## DDDCanada

I agree with 2galsmom for the most part. I won't allow my past to define me and my relationships going forward. Yes, someone will know that I am divorced but the success of the new relationships will be determined by our connection and not the past. I was with the "love of my life" for 13 years when I found out she was unfaithful several times. After we split up, I met another women who I feel very hard for and thought was the women I was meant to be with all along. She moved in with me and we decided to get married very quickly. Unfortunately, she has bipolar disorder and refuses any treatment. Within two years, we had separated. This is not something I feel the need to share with someone UNLESS the new relationship becomes very serious. My failed relationships don't define who I am. On the flip side, I often hear how people believe someone who has never married by age 40 has a fear of commitment or some other problem. While it may be true in some circumstances, it won't be true in all. People who judge others based on their past are likely not mature enough to be in a relationship.


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## bravenewworld

Homemaker_Numero_Uno said:


> Gordon, Shawn? Why yes, I do miss them.
> Thanks for bringing them up!
> Oh wait, you want sex? Sorry babes, I'm lost down memory lane.
> Please excuse me while I go shower and play with the settings on the spray wand. HAHAHAHAHA.


Ok this made me spit coffee out all over my monitor. :rofl:


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## bravenewworld

Been journaling about this topic recently - I think moving forward I'm going to stick with a more generic answer like, "We got married young and grew apart. His values changed." Which is a very condensed/vague version - but is also 100% true. Seems like a good balance. 

If pressed for more details I'm going to say something like "Thanks for asking but I'm lucky enough to have you sitting here right here in front me and I'd rather focus on getting to know you better. You mentioned you like playing tennis? Where do you play?" Or something similar to deflect. I haven't been on very many dates but I have noticed the younger guys tend to ask these questions or press on this issue while the older ones seem content to change subjects. Interesting. 

If and when I decide to get serious with someone I know we are going to have to have "the talk" about my experience being married and why I feel the way I do about certain topics. I'm kind of already dreading it! But that's a LONG way down the road - I can't even see myself dating someone exclusively unless we've been seeing each other for at least 6 months. I figure why bring it up sooner and let my ex sour what could be a very nice evening - even if it doesn't turn into a romance. 

LVF - I'm young as well (and according to other people) look younger than my actual age. I mentioned to one gentleman flirting with me at happy hour that I was getting a divorce and he almost dropped his drink. That was fun. But he had to be in his early twenties. At the time it made me feel really badly but now I can totally laugh about it. As I get older, I'm finding a lot of experiences in life are like that. 

Another guy assumed the divorce had something to do with infidelity (truth be told - an accurate assumption) and started telling me how he's not necessarily an advocate for polyamory - BUT - he did have a lovely threesome experience with a good friend and her husband and he still cares for them very much. Mind you, this is on a FIRST date. This time - I almost dropped my drink! 

Was discussing divorce/stigma with some older friends who have been divorced and they all said the same thing - because we're younger people maybe be surprised but at the end of the day it's not a negative because someone chose you and was willing to marry you. Especially if your spouse was successful or interesting in some way. 

As time goes on it's actually harder for men/women who have never been married because they have to combat the "old maid" or "peter pan playboy" stereotypes.


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## SlowlyGettingWiser

bravenewworld said:


> You're on a first date.
> 
> Then - the dreaded question.....
> 
> "So why exactly ARE you getting a divorce?"
> 
> The record screeches to a halt. You take a sip, no, a GULP of red wine. The clock ticks. Your date's eyebrows raise....


1) This is SERIOUSLY RUDE! I think this would be rude any time before the 3-4 MONTH mark of serious dating!

2) I guess it would depend on how well the date is going:

a) Not that interested in him I might say (with raised eyebrow), "You did NOT just ask me that!" And then let it sit there, unanswered.

b) Interested in him, "He cheated. I don't tolerate cheating." At least he knows where you stand; you've let him know one of your inviolate boundaries.​


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## arbitrator

*I would think that irregardless of the dating timeline, when both partners are more than fully comfortable with hearing each others divorce stories, then that disclosure would be most acceptable.

That being said, if someone that I dated, and even began to have mild feelings for, ever divulged or confessed that they were the one's who actually cheated in their prior relationship, then I would be most afraid that that confession of theirs, in and of itself, would be a probable "deal-breaker" for me!

In my minds eye, a confirmed cheater should only and rationally try to find solace with yet another confirmed cheater!*


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## Jellybeans

LVF said:


> Did you guys ever find dates who have prejudice against divorced people?


I am sure there are people who do not want to be with a divorcee. I do not think I have met/dated one yet but maybe they did not mention it? Everyone has their own preference.



LVF said:


> I never had casual dates. So far, I only feel comfortable dating someone if it is serious from the beginning.


But how do you know if something will go from first date to serious immediately? You don't. That is the whole point of dating...to figure it out. 

As for telling people...just say if it they ask or when you feel comfortable. It's a part of your...no need to hide it. If you are still worried about how it comes across, then try to find a way that you do feel comfy mentioning it and in what context.

*LVR and Bravenewworld*: How old are you ladies? I ask because you both mentioned being young and I was separated at 28 an divorced by 30 so I am curious about your experiences with this and being a "young" divorcee.



bravenewworld said:


> I think moving forward I'm going to stick with a more generic answer like, "We got married young and grew apart. His values changed." Which is a very condensed/vague version - but is also 100% true. Seems like a good balance.


This was true for me, too.



bravenewworld said:


> Was discussing divorce/stigma with some older friends who have been divorced and they all said the same thing - because we're younger people maybe be surprised but at the end of the day it's not a negative because someone chose you and was willing to marry you. Especially if your spouse was successful or interesting in some way.
> 
> As time goes on it's actually harder for men/women who have never been married because they have to combat the "old maid" or "peter pan playboy" stereotypes.


This is an interesting way to think of it and I have heard of this before. I think really, marriage isn't for everyone. And especially with our generation... divorce is becoming more and more common. The older we get, t he harder it will be to find people who have never been divorced, or rather, meet people who have never had an experience or been married.


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## southbound

So, it appears from reading this thread that talking about one's divorce in a current relationship is not common. That surprises me. I would have assumed it was talked about in great detail at some point.

As I said, I would certainly want to know why someone was divorced, as I would assume they would want to know why i was divorced. To be honest, I would probably volunteer the information about myself if i thought the relationship might go somewhere.

I would feel rather weird going on and on and not telling someone why i was divorced. I'm sure she would be wondering if I cheated, if i had a mid-life and went nuts, or if it was out of my control.


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## 3Xnocharm

southbound said:


> So, it appears from reading this thread that talking about one's divorce in a current relationship is not common. That surprises me. I would have assumed it was talked about in great detail at some point.
> 
> As I said, I would certainly want to know why someone was divorced, as I would assume they would want to know why i was divorced. To be honest, I would probably volunteer the information about myself if i thought the relationship might go somewhere.
> 
> I would feel rather weird going on and on and not telling someone why i was divorced. I'm sure she would be wondering if I cheated, if i had a mid-life and went nuts, or if it was out of my control.


I agree with you. I think its nuts to NOT talk about it. Its part of the life story of YOU. If you dont want to talk about your life, then you probably should not be dating.


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## Morgiana

Yes and no. Would I talk about it yes, would I be willing to rehash everything, no. Sometimes, some things are best left in the past; especially when one is looking to the future. Same as the I dont kiss and tell principle. 

-M


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## FeministInPink

3Xnocharm said:


> I agree with you. I think its nuts to NOT talk about it. Its part of the life story of YOU. If you dont want to talk about your life, then you probably should not be dating.


Agreed. Personally, I would want to know if the person I'm dating (if he's divorced) has learned from that past and has grown from it - or if he's just going to make the same mistakes with me. In which case I would run far, far away.

I feel like this has been (and continues to be) a very profound experience for me. It's a huge part of me - over a decade, a full third of my life. You can't just sweep that under the rug and pretend it doesn't exist. But you do need to learn when it's OK to mention and when those thoughts are better left unsaid, and any potential partner worth having will understand that I have a past. I didn't just hatch out of an egg yesterday. 

Saying that you will NEVER discuss your past relationships is overly cautious and fearful, as if you can't tell the difference between when it is and is not OK to divulge, so better than to just err on the side of caution. But I feel that perhaps erects an unnecessary wall and limits emotional intimacy between you and your partner. Why do that? Why keep him at arm's distance? Because you were hurt before? Because you were vulnerable before, the Ex took advantage of that, and because you don't want to open yourself up to that kind of pain again?

That just makes no sense to me. That's the exact opposite of a healthy relationship. My future partner will know exactly why my previous marriage broke up, because I'll be damned if I'm going to let that happen to me again. I won't tell him immediately (considering the OP was taking about when the question comes up on a first or second date), but if it starts to get serious and I trust him (and for me, it won't get serious without the trust), I'm gonna lay it all out for him. This is what happened to me. Don't do what he did. These are my boundaries, and this is what I need.


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## whitehawk

To me this seems soooo weird , l just couldn't even imagine how you could get past a few wks max without talking about stuff , few days even .
l've only hooked up with one girl since my sep so far but it was all out there for both of us . Matter of fact we spent most of our whole first night talking about all sorts of things from both our lives , her even more than me .
l really can't see what the big deal is it just happens if you get along.

Personally l reckon if your having trouble with that stuff your with the wrong person because it should comfortably just take care of itself .


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