# Very big dilemma



## thatsme123 (Aug 12, 2014)

Hello everyone, so I'm hoping to get some input into my situation. I pretty much know what most of you will say, but I'm hoping there's something new I can take out of this..

Here's my situation..I've been with my fiance for 5 years now. I've never been in a serious relationship before her. I should mention I'm 28, and she's 27. I was also a fling type of person, while she was the opposite. I know when I met her 5 years ago, I was definitely infatuated and ready for a relationship. We've had some ups and downs, but remained a great couple. Well, about a year ago I met this girl, and when I met her I felt a sudden connection. A strong one..if not stronger than I had when I first met my fiance. However, it was okay because this woman was married, and with 2 children. I didn't know her too well anyway, but I still felt very drawn to her.

Fast forward the last 3 months..I find myself getting closer to this woman. I also find out that she's getting a divorce. So now..this changes everything. I feel completely different talking to her, and meanwhile I'm feeling more detached from my fiance. So I open up to this woman, and share with her that I'm not sure if I should be getting married. I tell her I'm questioning it, and I don't know if it's because it's such a huge part of my life or what. I notice that her and I get closer as time draws on. She ends up getting drunk at a wedding and calls me. I actually end up calling her drunk on my bachelor party. Meanwhile, I feel like a complete zombie towards everything, and everyone else. My last 2 months has consisted of working, the gym, and walking..then going home and going to sleep. I feel as if I've been on cruise control.

So this past Saturday I go this girls house for a fire. I should also mention that my fiance knows this woman. And I was going to the fire because other people were going to be there. My fiance was busy, and honestly, I've kind of kept them apart from interacting. Well as the night wears on, it's just the girl, her friend, and me having wine and sitting on the patio. The girl I'm into goes inside and her friend tells me basically...that I need to figure out my ****..and not to hurt her friend. She also says that her friend is worth it..and that we are both a great catch...which is also the first time that I've "officially" been told she's actually into me. So as the night goes on, it's just me and the girl. She's drinking all kinds of wine, while I remain sober. She asks me what am I gonna do with everything...and I explain how it's such a hard decision. She looks so sad, and I feel terrible. So eventually I help her inside..she keeps leaning on me and hugging me. I want nothing but to kiss her, but I know how wrong it would be. Eventually I get her to the couch, and tell her goodnight, and she kisses me..and yes..I kissed her back. Was very brief, but still..

So here I am a few days later, and it's all I keep thinking about...and my wedding is less than a month away. I don't know what the hell to do. What makes everything more complicated is the apartment I'm getting with my fiance..all the money..the families...everything.

So that all being said..my thoughts on this..and what I would like to really do..

I'd like to talk to this new girl, and tell her how I feel. That yes, I'm into her..but I also love my fiance. I'd like to tell her that the fact that she's telling me she has feelings for me now..is messed up, and that I'd like to remain friends with her, and give my marriage a try, because I really do..and maybe these feelings are just a phase. I guess my plan is to give this a year, and by then..hope this all works itself out.

I guess the one thing I won't budge on is bringing this up to my fiance. I know I'm a jerk for that, but she is so into this wedding, that I can't possibly ruin it for her now. I'm really hoping that this all blows over, and everything is back to normal.


I'd appreciate anyones thoughts, or comments.


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## samyeagar (May 14, 2012)

Since being open and honest is off the table...why not go the whole hog and just nail the other chick and try to keep it from your fiance for as long as possible. Hell, try and date them both, even after the wedding.


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

Either drop the marriage or drop the friend. Keeping them both isn't going to work. 

C
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## thatsme123 (Aug 12, 2014)

samyeagar said:


> Since being open and honest is off the table...why not go the whole hog and just nail the other chick and try to keep it from your fiance for as long as possible. Hell, try and date them both, even after the wedding.


Little harsh. What if I'm just nervous about making a big decision, and after my wedding, all this other crap goes away, and I'm happy. I don't think telling my fiance any of my own issues is going to make anything better. It's only going to ruin this for her, which could be completely unnecessary.


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

thatsme123 said:


> Little harsh. What if I'm just nervous about making a big decision, and after my wedding, all this other crap goes away, and I'm happy. I don't think telling my fiance any of my own issues is going to make anything better. It's only going to ruin this for her, which could be completely unnecessary.


Getting married to her isn't going to fix anything. It will just make things worse, especially if you keep this other woman in your life. 

Sorry, dude... But I doubt anyone is going to tell you what you want to hear. That you can have your cake and eat it too. If that's the only answer you'll listen to, you might as well delete your account now. 

C
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## cons (Aug 13, 2013)

Ugh!!!

Sam was rather kind IMO. 

Your fiance is under the impression that you have chosen her. Yet you have this girl on the side (who, BTW, isn't all that if she's willing to be available to a engaged man).

You do have a big decision to make. But it must be made BEFORE the wedding...otherwise the "I do" means absolutely nothing, and in the end you'll cause more hurt and damage to you and both of the women involved...all because you want to save your @$$ today.


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## thatsme123 (Aug 12, 2014)

PBear said:


> Getting married to her isn't going to fix anything. It will just make things worse, especially if you keep this other woman in your life.
> 
> Sorry, dude... But I doubt anyone is going to tell you what you want to hear. That you can have your cake and eat it too. If that's the only answer you'll listen to, you might as well delete your account now.
> 
> ...


Nope, I want to hear what is right. Unfortunately I'm unable to talk about this with anyone else.

In all honesty, I do want to remain friends with this girl. She is going through a divorce, and I feel she is maybe dealing with her own problems. The free spirit in me feels like..life is too short to just subtract people from your life because of complications. I do feel this girl and I have a connection. I'm not looking to get married, and fool around.

I want to do what is right...this isn't a picnic for me..believe me. I've been a huge mess because of everything.


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## samyeagar (May 14, 2012)

thatsme123 said:


> Nope, I want to hear what is right. Unfortunately I'm unable to talk about this with anyone else.
> 
> *In all honesty, I do want to remain friends with this girl. She is going through a divorce, and I feel she is maybe dealing with her own problems. The free spirit in me feels like..life is too short to just subtract people from your life because of complications. I do feel this girl and I have a connection*. I'm not looking to get married, and fool around.
> 
> I want to do what is right...this isn't a picnic for me..believe me. I've been a huge mess because of everything.


Good lord dude, this isn't some romantic comedy...life is too short, free spirit...puke. The other woman has friends other than you to lean on. SHE DOES NOT NEED YOU, and you really should ask yourself if your fiance, the women you are growing distant from, the woman you are second guessing because of your free spirit...does she need you? The man who doesn't have to balls to be open and honest?


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## DoF (Mar 27, 2014)

Welcome to the forum

First let's focus on this "girl".

Red flag #1 - she is MARRIED and pursing OTHER man like you. HUGE HUGE red flag. This speaks very low about her commitment/maturity etc.

Red flag #2 - she not only engages in the relationship/friendship with another man, she is already emotionally cheating on her husband.

Red flag #3 - Regardless how bad their marriage is, smart/mature person resolves that FIRST before getting involved with others. This means, settling divorce, taking time to heal (6months to a year) and being ready for next relationship. She hasn't even started that process and this should tell you A LOT about her and her character and TRUST towards her husband.

Put yourself in HIS shoes. Would her actions be acceptable to you? Assuming you get involved with this woman, ACCEPT THEM NOW!!!

Red flag #4 - her friend's little talk. Not cool and yes that was set up/put you on the spot. 

I hope above helps you recognize/realize and ACCEPT how ****ty this girl is and confirm that you DO NOT want her. EVEN if you were single, no joke!

Now onto the REAL issue. The CORE of the issue is on YOUR end.

Look man, if you decide to be in a relationship with someone, it's your responsibility to deflect "man" thoughts as they come up on REGULAR basis. Trust me, I have a great marriage and love my wife to DEATH, just yesterday I walked by some lady in my office building and things I felt......I don't even want to talk about/write about it. Thoughts have come up last night....today....but I continue to do my best to deflect those thoughts.

AS a man, it's your responsibility to do so while in LTR. 

What happened to you is simply lack of Mental Control. You need to learn to think about other things and deflect thoughts that are inappropriate as they come. FOR LONG TIME TO COME. I suggest you start NOW.

You created this issue by talking to this girl and hanging out with her. 

I DO NOT recommend ANY opposite sex relationships while in a relationship. EVER. Nothing to do with TRUST, EVERYTHING to do with HUMAN NATURE. I don't care where people are in life, if you put them in the room and they talk/spend time together/hang out....in time, NATURE will kick in and feelings will come up.

Now it's your responsibility to stay committed to your SO and cut this girl off COMPLETELY. 

Notice I said GIRL not a woman. Everything you told us does NOT say "woman" to me.

I would also suggest that after you cut ties, learn from it and not share this with your girlfriend. 

Its YOUR choice to be in a relationship. With that comes obligation and commitment. If you don't want that, you have to be honest and fair with your current girlfriend and break things off prior to getting involved with anyone. And even if and when you do, you will still need to to recover from current relationship as well (just like this girl should after marriage). 

Healing takes time, and getting involved while still not completely healed is setting yourself up for failure (as well as your future partner). You wouldn't want someone you are dating to still have feelings for their ex, don't do it for others.

Remember, YOU are your worst enemy!!! Longer I live, more I accept this. Deflecting certain thoughts, mental control is a HUGE part of maturity and makes life so much easier.

Good luck


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## devotion (Oct 8, 2012)

I'm hearing too much of a white knight vibe in this post 'I want to be friends with the other girl' like you're doing her a favor. You're not. You're into her AND you're into your fiance because you allow yourself to be. It's natural to sometimes be attracted to other people. Monogamy is tough. But once you make the commitment to get married you COMMIT to fighting that urge. To seeking that sort of validation only from your partner. 

I had another good friend of mine call off their wedding a month in advance. it was tough but we all agree -- including the two people who split up - that it was better to stop it BEFORE they got married. They had all the signs that they weren't right together and also stupidly was going to go through with it and hope it gets better after marriage. 

As someone who has been married (and now divorced) I'm telling you if you can't figure out how to manage your attraction to other women BEFORE marriage it will only get worse AFTER. Everything is harder after marriage!

So I agree with Pbear - you can't have both the marriage and the 'friendship'. Your feelings are too strong to be just friends (and she might have those feelings too). It's the same reason why I am no contact with my ex and expect my fiance/wife to be the same way. There was something there and if you continue to expose yourself to temptation you will eventually give in.


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## cons (Aug 13, 2013)

So you've CHOSEN to take care of this other woman at the expense of your fiance...

you said it right....you're not looking to get married....so call it off


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## DoF (Mar 27, 2014)

devotion said:


> I'm hearing too much of a white knight vibe in this post 'I want to be friends with the other girl' like you're doing her a favor. You're not. You're into her AND you're into your fiance because you allow yourself to be. It's natural to sometimes be attracted to other people. Monogamy is tough. But once you make the commitment to get married you COMMIT to fighting that urge. To seeking that sort of validation only from your partner.
> 
> I had another good friend of mine call off their wedding a month in advance. it was tough but we all agree -- including the two people who split up - that it was better to stop it BEFORE they got married. They had all the signs that they weren't right together and also stupidly was going to go through with it and hope it gets better after marriage. ]
> 
> ...


Above + what's in bold x 1 million.

Once married, expect more woman attention than EVER before. Ring is a magnet to women as MANY always want what they can't have.


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## thatsme123 (Aug 12, 2014)

samyeagar said:


> Good lord dude, this isn't some romantic comedy...life is too short, free spirit...puke. The other woman has friends other than you to lean on. SHE DOES NOT NEED YOU, and you really should ask yourself if your fiance, the women you are growing distant from, the woman you are second guessing because of your free spirit...does she need you? The man who doesn't have to balls to be open and honest?


Great "tough guy" attitude. It has nothing to do with having balls. Yeah, I can tell my fiance all of this..and what will that accomplish? She will be hurt, maybe even call of the marriage..which isn't what I want to happen at all. Am I not allowed to have doubts? Or should I just "man up" and ignore those.


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## Rowan (Apr 3, 2012)

thatsme123 said:


> I'd appreciate anyones thoughts, or comments.


I'm pretty sure you really wouldn't appreciate mine.....

That said, I'll try to moderate myself and be brief. You are engaged, your girlfriend is still married. Your big plan is to go ahead and get married, keep the girlfriend, and give it a year to see if you still want to be married or go with door number 2. 

In my opinion, that you think so little of your fiancé that you're regarding marriage to her as a test drive with the option to return is nearly as good a reason to call off the wedding as the fact that you're seeing someone else. What that indicates is that while you are marrying her, you're also still fully willing to be on the lookout for her replacement. That's something she deserves to know - that she's basically the fallback position, and is fully expendable in the case you get a better offer. That you're already in an emotional affair is a huge problem, but it's not even close to being the only enormous red flag you're waiving.

You are not ready to be married.


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## naiveonedave (Jan 9, 2014)

do the honorable thing: pick one and stick with her and let the other woman no that know what you chose. Not that complicated.


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## thatsme123 (Aug 12, 2014)

I would like to add that I'm a man..of course there are other woman that I'm attracted too..and I've had woman come onto me, and I didn't think twice about them. This has to do with more than a physical attraction..this is way more than that. I've only felt this way about 2 woman in my life now.


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## samyeagar (May 14, 2012)

thatsme123 said:


> Great "tough guy" attitude. It has nothing to do with having balls. Yeah, I can tell my fiance all of this..*and what will that accomplish?* She will be hurt, maybe even call of the marriage..which isn't what I want to happen at all. Am I not allowed to have doubts? Or should I just "man up" and ignore those.


She'll be allowed the respect and integrity of being able to make an informed decision about the mental and emotional state of the man she is thinking she is going to marry?

Don't you think you owe her at least that?


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## DoF (Mar 27, 2014)

thatsme123 said:


> I would like to add that I'm a man..of course there are other woman that I'm attracted too..and I've had woman come onto me, and I didn't think twice about them. This has to do with more than a physical attraction..this is way more than that. I've only felt this way about 2 woman in my life now.


And expect MANY more like that in the future.

Chemistry will sneak up on you. The big question is what will you do with it WHILE in a relationship.

What you do with it when single is completely irrelevant as other people are not effected.


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## thatsme123 (Aug 12, 2014)

This other girl is separated..she is NOT my girlfriend. She is a close friend. Just want to clear that up.

So, is there so such thing as pre marital jitters? Is it not possible that the stress of everything of planning this whole wedding is messing with me?


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## U.E. McGill (Nov 27, 2013)

thatsme123 said:


> Nope, I want to hear what is right. Unfortunately I'm unable to talk about this with anyone else.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Ok. Here comes some hard 2x4 advise. 

You're a weasel. A slimy weasel. You're a cake eater. You want the best of all worlds. 

Men and women can't be friends. There's only women you can screw, and women you can't. Period. This woman, she's wanting you because you have another woman. Preselection. It's a dirtbag move on her part. She's not a woman you can screw so send her to the sideline. You don't get other women as long as you're in a LTR. 

You want to wife up your fiancé, but mess around? Just stay single! It's perfectly acceptable to have multiple women in your life, you just can't lie about it. 

Do your fiancé a favor. Cut your losses, and save this woman embarrassment. At least you'll save yourself from divorce because that's where your headed. Be a stand up guy. Real men deal with life and consequences.


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## devotion (Oct 8, 2012)

thatsme123 said:


> Great "tough guy" attitude. It has nothing to do with having balls. Yeah, I can tell my fiance all of this..and what will that accomplish? She will be hurt, maybe even call of the marriage..which isn't what I want to happen at all. Am I not allowed to have doubts? Or should I just "man up" and ignore those.


You're thinking you're doing her a favor by marrying someone who isn't into her 100%? Come on, guy! You even said it yourself, life is too short. If you can't offer commitment to her then YOU should want to break it off because you're not ready. 

As others have said, its natural for eyes and hearts to wander. But this other girl has already had an emotional affair with you (and I would submit that you've also had one, since you're engaged). You've already gone too far IMHO and your fiance has every right to be devastated if she found out. 

You just want to keep going down this road of EA? I'll look for your post a few months down the road in 'Considering Divorce or Separation' then.


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## DoF (Mar 27, 2014)

thatsme123 said:


> This other girl is separated..she is NOT my girlfriend. She is a close friend. Just want to clear that up.


She shouldn't be. No Female friends while in LTR.

Would you want your future wife doing EVERYTHING you have done? 

If you allow her to have relationships/friendships with man...it WILL happen in time.



thatsme123 said:


> So, is there so such thing as pre marital jitters? Is it not possible that the stress of everything of planning this whole wedding is messing with me?


Of course there are.

I think you are simply messing with yourself.

You created this problem YOURSELF. Accept it and learn from it.

I think your biggest issue is mostly likely due to thinking with your private part, not your heart or Brain. I would suggest you start using your BRAIN only when thinking.



Don't worry, most man have this issue.


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## thatsme123 (Aug 12, 2014)

samyeagar said:


> She'll be allowed the respect and integrity of being able to make an informed decision about the mental and emotional state of the man she is thinking she is going to marry?
> 
> Don't you think you owe her at least that?



But what if I'm overreacting? What if I'm not thinking straight about this..I could potentially ruin what I have for nothing. I'm not looking to date both either.


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## samyeagar (May 14, 2012)

thatsme123 said:


> This other girl is separated..she is NOT my girlfriend. She is a close friend. Just want to clear that up.
> 
> So, is there so such thing as pre marital jitters? Is it not possible that the stress of everything of planning this whole wedding is messing with me?


Ok...maybe not girlfriend but she is the woman that is causing you to be emotionally unavailable with your fiance, the woman you drink with, the woman you kiss, the woman you want to save.


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## manfromlamancha (Jul 4, 2013)

OK I'm going to be brutally honest here:

You do not really know this new woman that well. She doesn't sound like a "nice" person if she is pursuing somebody she knows to be engaged. I think once the rose tinted glasses effect wears off you will see that and be on to your next pursuit.

Your fiancé on the other hand is someone you know to be a good and loving person and you know much better than the new woman.

However, neither of the above is the main consideration here - the main consideration here is you. You don't appear to be a nice person at all and not good for either woman. You really need to work on yourself and become a better person before you marry or settle down with anyone. You seem to be shallow and selfish and I would strongly advise you to take a good look at yourself before pursuing anyone. You need to come clean with your fiancé asap. Sure it will hurt her but nowhere near as much as she is going to get hurt further down the line if she marries you. You would be doing her a huge favour and that might be the first step on the road to becoming a better person.


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## DoF (Mar 27, 2014)

samyeagar said:


> Ok...maybe not girlfriend but she is the woman that is causing you to be emotionally unavailable with your fiance, the woman you drink with, the woman you kiss, the woman you want to save.


I don't understand man sometime. Many can't even get their primary relationship right or healthy yet they engage with other women and end up with even MORE problems/drama etc.

No thanks, 1 is all I can and want to handle.

OP, what I think you might want to ask YOURSELF is "am I a person for long term relationship?"

It may be that you are simply not. There is nothing wrong with that at all. But knowing yourself and knowing exactly what you want etc is an important part of maturity.

For example, since I was VERY YOUNG (like 6-7) I knew I wanted to be married/have someone special and have couple of kids.

YOu said you liked to play up until this current relationship. Can it be that you simply want no long term commitment and just want to play around?

You have to figure things out for yourself long term. Whatever you decide, stick with it.

MAN is defined by their word!!! If your word is worthless, you are a boy. Remember that.


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## samyeagar (May 14, 2012)

Ok thatsme123...sort of a side question for you...

Why is the other woman getting divorced?


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## thatsme123 (Aug 12, 2014)

samyeagar said:


> Ok...maybe not girlfriend but she is the woman that is causing you to be emotionally unavailable with your fiance, the woman you drink with, the woman you kiss, the woman you want to save.


She isn't causing it. I've been feeling a lot of this for a couple of months. I've mentioned it to a couple of my married friends who've told me this is all normal. It's jitters. I hope to God that it is..I hope I can enjoy the rest of the process of planning..be married..and be happy.

Apparently having female friends is frowned upon while married around here. I'm sorry, but I have female friends, and my fiance has male friends.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Don't get married.

You're not ready. 

With that said, there is absolutely no guarantee it will work out with this other chick. She is in the throes of a separation/divorce and has children to care for. This is an extremely emotionally traumatizing time in her life. Not only is it the end of her marriage, she now has to group and figure out what direction she wants to take as her own person (not as a couple--identity crisis for anyone getting divorced); and how to raise her kids as a single woman.

You guys have been having an emotional affair for awhile it seems and that is not good. 

Worse, it seems your fiance knwos her/is friends with her. That is a double betrayal.

Always remember the golden rule: Do unto others...

Be honest when you ask yourself this: How would you feel if this was your girlfriend doing this to you with her male friend a month before the wedding? Calling him during her bachelorette party....? Hanging out drinking with her into the late wee hours of the morning kissing him? Set to marry you in a month while he is getting divorced...


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## DoF (Mar 27, 2014)

Personal said:


> Whereas marrying a man who is dishonest, unfaithful and lusts after another woman is a far better outcome.


I totally forgot about "red flags" related to OP.


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## thatsme123 (Aug 12, 2014)

samyeagar said:


> Ok thatsme123...sort of a side question for you...
> 
> Why is the other woman getting divorced?


Her husband cheated on her..way before I even knew her.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

thatsme123 said:


> She isn't causing it. I've been feeling a lot of this for a couple of months. I've mentioned it to a couple of my married friends who've told me this is all normal. It's jitters.


Jitters, cold feet is one thing.

Actively carrying on an emotional affair with a married woman who is recently separated, who you were calling up during your bachelor party, staying up late at her house drinking wine and kissing her is a whole 'nother thing.

Don't kid yourself. You are smarter than that.


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## DoF (Mar 27, 2014)

thatsme123 said:


> She isn't causing it. I've been feeling a lot of this for a couple of months. I've mentioned it to a couple of my married friends who've told me this is all normal. It's jitters. I hope to God that it is..I hope I can enjoy the rest of the process of planning..be married..and be happy.
> 
> Apparently having female friends is frowned upon while married around here. I'm sorry, but I have female friends, and my fiance has male friends.


Good luck to both of you. You will need it.

There is a GOOD reason why MOST here would not recommend it. I fyou stick around and read people stories you will quickly learn why.

Heck YOUR story is my evidence!!!

Some will give you 1 million reasons, and I can too. I will just summarize by showing you this video.

I hope your future wife knows this too.......

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T_lh5fR4DMA

Let me ask you, if this girl you are after right now was UGLY and you would never EVER have ANY attraction towards her. Would you EVER pursue this "friendship".

NOW, I want you to take a close look at your future wife's "friends" and think about that for a min......


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## devotion (Oct 8, 2012)

DoF said:


> I don't understand man sometime. Many can't even get their primary relationship right or healthy yet they engage with other women and end up with even MORE problems/drama etc.
> 
> No thanks, 1 is all I can and want to handle.


It reminds me of a scene from Everybody Loves Raymond where Raymond's father think's he's having an affair. I paraphrase. 

"Didn't I teach you anything? You're having a problem with your woman, you don't get another woman! Then all you do is have two problems!"

My ex-wife cheated on me because she felt marriage was 'sacred' and I was always about 'lifelong commitment' blah blah no matter what. My attitude hasn't changed on the commitment but I repeat over and over to my GF that if the choice is to break up/divorce or cheat, then do the former. I will NOT accept the latter. I just hope we work towards reconciliation before it ever gets to that decision.


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## murphy5 (May 1, 2014)

ALL GUYS get cold feet before a wedding! It is in their DNA. This is probably just all in your head. Dump the new girl, re-commit to your fiancé, and have a fruitful life with her.


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## DoF (Mar 27, 2014)

thatsme123 said:


> Her husband cheated on her..way before I even knew her.


And she is perfect? You are not answering the REAL question.

WHY did she cheat on her? Chances are high she wouldn't be able to tell you that or simply say "cause he did".

Usually, there is ALWAYS a good reason.

Trust me when I say this, she has faults and is FAR FAR from perfect. You simply don't know her well enough to know YET.

I don't care hot great of a woman you might find, there is ALWAYS a man out there on this planet that is sick of her ****!!!

That's the way you need to look at this entire situation.


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## samyeagar (May 14, 2012)

thatsme123 said:


> Her husband cheated on her..way before I even knew her.


Am I the only one seeing the irony here...on so many levels?


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## DoF (Mar 27, 2014)

murphy5 said:


> ALL GUYS get cold feet before a wedding! It is in their DNA. This is probably just all in your head. Dump the new girl, re-commit to your fiancé, and have a fruitful life with her.


Not all, I didn't


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## calamityjim (Jul 18, 2014)

thatsme123 said:


> But what if I'm overreacting? What if I'm not thinking straight about this..I could potentially ruin what I have for nothing. I'm not looking to date both either.


You could potentially ruin it? Sounds to me like you already have. You've already gone too far.

I had three emotional affairs in my marriage. Every time, I was not wanting to forsake my wife for this other woman. I just wanted to hang out/have fun. Never was it on the verge of becoming physical, two of them lived in other states. I thought I loved them. At the time, I genuinely did feel that way. Fast forward several years and I now realize that I didn't. I was just caught up in hormones. I never would have believed that at the time.

My wife knows about all three. If your future marriage is worthwhile, there will be a time when you release all your secrets. She was immensely hurt. Especially about one, because She KNEW something was up and I was denying it incessantly.

Bottom line, drop this other woman. Tell the woman you love. If she calls off the wedding, so be it.

I'm with these other guys. Men cannot have close female friends. I've had a few, and there's not one of them I wouldn't have bedded if given the opportunity. (opportunity meaning me being single of course)


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## samyeagar (May 14, 2012)

murphy5 said:


> *ALL GUYS get cold feet before a wedding!* It is in their DNA. This is probably just all in your head. Dump the new girl, re-commit to your fiancé, and have a fruitful life with her.


I didn't...just sayin.


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## JustTired (Jan 22, 2012)

You have already cheated on your fiancee with this other chick. Kissing is cheating. Involving yourself in an emotional affair (like you have with this chick) is cheating. If your fiancee did everything you have done with some other man, would you be OK with it? I highly doubt it. It was extremely inapprpriate for you to have gone over that other chick's house without your fiancee, doesn't matter if others were there.

If I was your fiancee & I found out all of htis, it would be grounds for calling off the wedding. Don't blame it on jitters or free spirit, you allowed all of this to happen.

The real question is: what's the right thing to do? And do it.


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## DoF (Mar 27, 2014)

calamityjim said:


> You could potentially ruin it? Sounds to me like you already have. You've already gone too far.
> 
> I had three emotional affairs in my marriage. Every time, I was not wanting to forsake my wife for this other woman. I just wanted to hang out/have fun. Never was it on the verge of becoming physical, two of them lived in other states. I thought I loved them. At the time, I genuinely did feel that way. Fast forward several years and I now realize that I didn't. I was just caught up in hormones. I never would have believed that at the time.
> 
> ...


Yep

OP needs to read up on 80/20 relationship rule AND honeymoon phase. LEARN ABOUT IT PRONTO!!!


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## thatsme123 (Aug 12, 2014)

JustTired said:


> You have already cheated on your fiancee with this other chick. Kissing is cheating. Involving yourself in an emotional affair (like you have with this chick) is cheating. If your fiancee did everything you have done with some other man, would you be OK with it? I highly doubt it. It was extremely inapprpriate for you to have gone over that other chick's house without your fiancee, doesn't matter if others were there.
> 
> If I was your fiancee & I found out all of htis, it would be grounds for calling off the wedding. Don't blame it on jitters or free spirit, you allowed all of this to happen.
> 
> The real question is: what's the right thing to do? And do it.


So what you're saying at this point is..tell my fiance what happened..she calls off the wedding..and let the chips fall where they may?

Maybe that is the right thing to do..but..I don't think many people who do that. I'm a realist..I wish I did have the balls to do that..be open..and accept the consequences..but I'm also willing to believe that..I made a mistake..maybe I'm stressed out..and this will pass.


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## DoF (Mar 27, 2014)

devotion said:


> It reminds me of a scene from Everybody Loves Raymond where Raymond's father think's he's having an affair. I paraphrase.


:smthumbup:

We love Raymond, have been watching it for years.....heck we watched some last night.


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## TheCuriousWife (Jan 28, 2013)

DoF said:


> :smthumbup:
> 
> We love Raymond, have been watching it for years.....heck we watched some last night.


:iagree:


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## devotion (Oct 8, 2012)

thatsme123 said:


> So what you're saying at this point is..tell my fiance what happened..she calls off the wedding..and let the chips fall where they may?
> 
> Maybe that is the right thing to do..but..I don't think many people who do that. I'm a realist..I wish I did have the balls to do that..be open..and accept the consequences..but I'm also willing to believe that..I made a mistake..maybe I'm stressed out..and this will pass.


If the situation was reversed would you want to know? 
Wouldn't you want to know if your fiance was having strong feelings for another man, and kissed him? 

And isn't it possible you'd call off the wedding, then? 

I think the answer is YES to all and then the path forward is clear if you want to have any chance of the marriage working. If you can't handle that, just call of the wedding without telling her. Be fair to your fiancee.


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## Finder (Aug 12, 2014)

thatsme123 said:


> Great "tough guy" attitude. It has nothing to do with having balls. Yeah, I can tell my fiance all of this..and what will that accomplish? She will be hurt, maybe even call of the marriage..which isn't what I want to happen at all. Am I not allowed to have doubts? Or should I just "man up" and ignore those.


You're lying to her because you don't want her to know that you're chasing this other girl behind her back. So yeah, you don't have balls.


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## JustTired (Jan 22, 2012)

thatsme123 said:


> So what you're saying at this point is..tell my fiance what happened..she calls off the wedding..and let the chips fall where they may?
> 
> Maybe that is the right thing to do..but..I don't think many people who do that. I'm a realist..*I wish I did have the balls to do that*..be open..and accept the consequences..but I'm also willing to believe that..I made a mistake..maybe I'm stressed out..and this will pass.


The problem lies in the fact that you don't have the balls to do what a real man would do. You just said it. Being a "realist" is going to your fiancee & actually being REAL with her. You are not a "realist", you are an opportunist.


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## scatty (Mar 15, 2013)

So you are willing to give your marriage a year and see if it works out? Wow. 

Here are your options, as I see them:

-If you get married, cut this low morale woman out of your life FOREVER. To go after an engaged man is a character/boundary flaw and what she does WITH you, she will do TO YOU. Also, read some relationship books such as "His Needs, Her Needs", Lovebusters, and 7 Steps to an Effective Marriage (not sure that is the exact title, but it's similar.)

-If you break the engagement to be with this low life, say bye bye to your "Free spirit" and enjoy babysitting her kids, and renting redbox movies that may depict a loveable, free spirited man who does not exist in real life.

-Realize that you jumped into your first serious relationship too soon, break it off with both woman and get counseling.

You will not like the answers here, but they come from folks married a long time, divorced people, single people who called off their engagements, people who have cheated or been cheated on, people who have been where you are, or have seen this same scenario play out. 

Whatever you decide, tell your fiance. She deserves to make an informed decision that may effect, you know, just THE REST OF HER LIFE!


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## thatsme123 (Aug 12, 2014)

scatty said:


> So you are willing to give your marriage a year and see if it works out? Wow.
> 
> Here are your options, as I see them:
> 
> ...


That may be true, but that doesn't mean what the advice they have to offer is right. Having friends of the opposite sex is frowned upon? Really? Marriage shouldn't be anything like that. Regardless of what I say about how I feel..I know I'll be looked at like an *******. That's fine. There are have been some good opinions..but the whole "real man" thing is a little overboard.


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## samyeagar (May 14, 2012)

thatsme123 said:


> So what you're saying at this point is..tell my fiance what happened..she calls off the wedding..and let the chips fall where they may?
> 
> Maybe that is the right thing to do..but..I don't think many people who do that. I'm a realist..I wish I did have the balls to do that..be open..and accept the consequences..but I'm also willing to believe that..I made a mistake..maybe I'm stressed out..and this will pass.


You seem afraid she might call off the wedding. Why is that?

You keep referring back to what most people would do, what your friends have told you to rationalize your behavior in this. Have you stopped and looked around? The number of divorces, unhappy marriages...you seem to be wanting to go with the flow, go with the conventional wisdom, most likely because it is easier...but have you stopped to think that maybe going the direction everybody else has is the wrong direction?


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

Read this book ASAP

Dr. Shirley Glass - NOT "Just Friends"

I mean it. You are a cheater, and you do not recognize it. You are setting your fiance up for a world of hurt here - DON'T DO IT. DO NOT get married until you understand what you have already done, and what you are capable of because of it.


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## thatsme123 (Aug 12, 2014)

samyeagar said:


> You seem afraid she might call off the wedding. Why is that?
> 
> You keep referring back to what most people would do, what your friends have told you to rationalize your behavior in this. Have you stopped and looked around? The number of divorces, unhappy marriages...you seem to be wanting to go with the flow, go with the conventional wisdom, most likely because it is easier...but have you stopped to think that maybe going the direction everybody else has is the wrong direction?


Why? Because as I've said..maybe I'm overreacting..it's just not the idea of being married that has me feeling like this. It's the entire wedding/house process..a lot of financial stuff too. I'm hoping that that's what's got me all messed up.

That's exactly my point..I look at people who shouldn't be married..who stay together out of convenience..and don't even work on saving their relationship. This is the first time I'm actually having doubts about my relationship..so do I tell her all this, and give up? I want to ride this out..and yes, go with the flow. I hope that when I'm married..I look back at this, and think I was nuts. At that point, I would tell her everything too...but the point is, I do want to try and make this work..and hopes this works.


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## DoF (Mar 27, 2014)

TheCuriousWife said:


> :iagree:


My only beef with Raymond is that it's based on that typical male/female marriage stigma within our sociaty (read: not a healthy one).

But we overlook it all and just laugh at the comedy. Funny as hell.

And of course, if it WAS to be healthy, it wouldn't be funny so....


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

I never said that you need to cut all female friends out of your life, although I know others here have. I did say you need to cut THIS female friend out of your life. 

Most likely scenario I see... Within 6 months, you and her end up drunk and alone together again, and this time it doesn't stop with a kiss. 

C
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## thatsme123 (Aug 12, 2014)

Hope1964 said:


> Read this book ASAP
> 
> Dr. Shirley Glass - NOT "Just Friends"
> 
> I mean it. You are a cheater, and you do not recognize it. You are setting your fiance up for a world of hurt here - DON'T DO IT. DO NOT get married until you understand what you have already done, and what you are capable of because of it.


I love how easy people jump to conclusions like that..

Seriously? I'm sorry, but I'm not going to read some ridiculous book that makes you feel guilty for having female friends. Nonsense.


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## samyeagar (May 14, 2012)

thatsme123 said:


> That may be true, but that doesn't mean what the advice they have to offer is right. Having friends of the opposite sex is frowned upon? Really? Marriage shouldn't be anything like that. Regardless of what I say about how I feel..I know I'll be looked at like an *******. That's fine. There are have been some good opinions..*but the whole "real man" thing is a little overboard*.


Perhaps saying "real man" was a bit overboard, but "honest and good man" is absolutely spot on.

And yeah, opposite sex friends are frowned upon, and the fact that you are disputing that, WHILE IN A FREAKING EMOTIONAL AFFAIR shows just how immature you are. Seriously dude, you can't see the danger in it? You are LIVING the danger in it, and your fiance is going to end up collateral damage.


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## DoF (Mar 27, 2014)

thatsme123 said:


> Why? Because as I've said..maybe I'm overreacting..it's just not the idea of being married that has me feeling like this. It's the entire wedding/house process..a lot of financial stuff too. I'm hoping that that's what's got me all messed up.


Please tell me you guys are not getting into debt for the wedding.

You have cash on hand/budget correct?



thatsme123 said:


> That's exactly my point..I look at people who shouldn't be married..who stay together out of convenience..and don't even work on saving their relationship. This is the first time I'm actually having doubts about my relationship..so do I tell her all this, and give up? I want to ride this out..and yes, go with the flow. I hope that when I'm married..I look back at this, and think I was nuts. At that point, I would tell her everything too...but the point is, I do want to try and make this work..and hopes this works.


Other people's relationship is none of your worries, your own is.

It will be what YOU and YOUR WIFE will make it.

Right now, you are WELL on the way of making it crappy.....for sure


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## DoF (Mar 27, 2014)

samyeagar said:


> Perhaps saying "real man" was a bit overboard, but "honest and good man" is absolutely spot on.
> 
> And yeah, opposite sex friends are frowned upon, and the fact that you are disputing that, WHILE IN A FREAKING EMOTIONAL AFFAIR shows just how immature you are. Seriously dude, you can't see the danger in it? You are LIVING the danger in it, and your fiance is going to end up collateral damage.


There is at least 5-10 "are you Fin kidding me" moments in this thread. This is one of them.

Seriously OP, you seem way too selfish, ignorant and immature for a marriage or long term relationship. 

Your entire attitude and outlook needs to change 360.

Everyone here gave you great advice. It's just a matter of learning/accepting it and applying for the future.

It's all right in front of you, just a matter of doing it at this point.

I guarantee you within 10 years you will read this thread and look back on all this and say to yourself "I can't believe I was that big of an idiot".

Sorry for being so harsh, but trust me, you will.


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## EnjoliWoman (Jul 2, 2012)

thatsme123 said:


> So what you're saying at this point is..tell my fiance what happened..she calls off the wedding..and let the chips fall where they may?
> 
> Maybe that is the right thing to do..but..I don't think many people who do that. I'm a realist..I wish I did have the balls to do that..be open..and accept the consequences..but I'm also willing to believe that..I made a mistake..maybe I'm stressed out..and this will pass.


So you know that's the right thing to do but you won't do it because you don't have the guts? Yet you think you are ready to get married?

You are making a choice yet you are taking your fiancee's choice away. She chose to commit to you without having all of the facts. You really owe it to her to make a choice based on FACT. 

If you can't take the heat, get out of the kitchen. In other words, if you can't sit down and have this conversation like adults no matter how painful or uncomfortable this may be, then you really are NOT ready for marriage. There will be other times you two will have to communicate openly and discuss things that are important to your marriage that may be painful or hurtful or otherwise difficult to address but it has to be done. This is part of being a true adult and a real partner in life. Regardless of your lapse in judgement and infidelity, your marriage is doomed to failure already if you can't do that.


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## Hicks (Jan 14, 2011)

Please don't get married.

Your fiance does not have your whole heart.
You are not ready to get married because a person ready to get married will have willingly discarded this temptation from his life.
Please, if you get married the next thing is a child and then you are ruining many peoples lives.


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## thatsme123 (Aug 12, 2014)

DoF said:


> Please tell me you guys are not getting into debt for the wedding.
> 
> You have cash on hand/budget correct?
> 
> ...



No we will not be in debt..however I've been paying for the majority of a lot of this wedding.


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## JustTired (Jan 22, 2012)

OP, you keep mentioning "stress" as a reason why you haven't been as honest as you should be. Man, if stress makes you have emotional affairs with other women - What will you do when real life $hit happens?

Wedding planning & everything that goes with it is a walk in the park compared to real life $hit. You are looking outside yourself for gratification. In your case, being Captain Save-a-Ho makes you feel good. But the real problem with that is that it certainly won't make your fiancee feel good.

I still stand by what I said previously: Do the right thing. Your fiancee deserves that.


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## samyeagar (May 14, 2012)

thatsme123 said:


> Why? Because as I've said..maybe I'm overreacting..it's just not the idea of being married that has me feeling like this. It's the entire wedding/house process..a lot of financial stuff too. I'm hoping that that's what's got me all messed up.
> 
> That's exactly my point..I look at people who shouldn't be married..who stay together out of convenience..and don't even work on saving their relationship. This is the first time I'm actually having doubts about my relationship..so do I tell her all this, and give up? I want to ride this out..and yes, go with the flow. I hope that when I'm married..I look back at this, and think I was nuts. *At that point, I would tell her everything too...*but the point is, I do want to try and make this work..and hopes this works.


Oh yeah, that would be a GREAT idea...

Yeah, lots of people have cold feet, jitters going into it, and many people ignore it, push it off as normal because everybody says that it's normal...I have a different take on it...

Those jitters, second thoughts...that is myself warning me that I'm not ready. As I said, when I married my wife, I had absolutely no second thoughts at all.

I think a lot of the second thoughts you are having is because you are in the fog of an affair, and you're right, you're not thinking clearly, but you are setting yourself up to be the husband of a wife who comes here and tells us all the story of how her husband had an affair when they had only been married a short time...or the wife who comes here in ten years after she just learned she was her husbands plan b...


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## cons (Aug 13, 2013)

thatsme123 said:


> That may be true, but that doesn't mean what the advice they have to offer is right. *Having friends of the opposite sex is frowned upon? Really? Marriage shouldn't be anything like that.* Regardless of what I say about how I feel..I know I'll be looked at like an *******. That's fine. There are have been some good opinions..but the whole "real man" thing is a little overboard.


Not having opposite sex friends is exactly what marriage should be like.

Sure- as a coupleship, we have friends. Our best man at our wedding is considered OUR best man...but I would never foster an individual friendship with this friend because it is not honoring to my marriage.

Honor your fiance and remove this other girl from your life. This "friendship" is disrespectful to your coupleship.


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## DoF (Mar 27, 2014)

thatsme123 said:


> No we will not be in debt..however I've been paying for the majority of a lot of this wedding.


If you can and want to, more power to you.

But the fact that you say "I have been" does not sounds like "partnership" to me. 

Your money is HER money, and other way around. 

So to rephrase it, you might want to start using words like "we" more often. You are in a long term relationship, there is no ME.


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## DoF (Mar 27, 2014)

cons said:


> Not having opposite sex friends is exactly what marriage should be like.
> 
> Sure- as a coupleship, we have friends. Our best man at our wedding is considered OUR best man...but I would never foster an individual friendship with this friend because it is not honoring to my marriage.
> 
> Honor your fiance and remove this other girl from your life. This "friendship" is disrespectful to your coupleship.


And when you do, expect to see this "girls" REAL side. You said they are all friends right? 

Expect this **** to come back around to your girl.

Another reason to be honest to your future wife BEFORE the news gets to her.........


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

thatsme123 said:


> I want to ride this out..and yes, go with the flow.


Marriage isn't something you do to "just ride out" and "go with the flow." You want to be SURE as FCK when yo uget married that you are marrying the right person and that you are ready for it. It's not like picking out a song on a karaoke machine to play. This involves another human being with feelings.



thatsme123 said:


> I love how easy people jump to conclusions like that..
> 
> Seriously? I'm sorry, but I'm not going to read some ridiculous book that makes you feel guilty for having female friends. Nonsense.


You are so naive, thatsme. And you are getting defensive because you know people here are right. You did wrong. You are set to marry your fiance when you are carrying on emotionally with someone else, kissing her and calling her during your own BACHELOR party. That book isn't just about "female friends." It's not gender-specific at all. It has insanely good information for the exact kind of situation you are in right now. You don't have to read it at all. That's your choice. But Hope wasn't recommending that book to you to be a jerk. She is recommending a good piece of literature to you that speaks to your exact situation and the many situations people fine themselves in when they are not careful and have ZERO boundaries which spell disaster for any romantic relationship.

Play with fire and you will get burned. Play with another human's feelings and you will burn them, you and everyone else involved.

You can't see it now but we can. Many of us have lived this very thing and are speaking from experience.

You are holding a grenade in your hand and it WILL go off. It has already started spouting.

Tick tick tick.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Also, you never answered this:



Jellybeans said:


> Be honest when you ask yourself this: *How would you feel if this was your girlfriend *doing this to you with her male friend a month before the wedding? Calling him during her bachelorette party....? Hanging out drinking with her into the late wee hours of the morning kissing him? Set to marry you in a month while he is getting divorced...


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## samyeagar (May 14, 2012)

Jellybeans said:


> Also, you never answered this:


Expect the typical answer to this...

He wouldn't mind at all. He would want her to make sure...to see where the feelings would go, and hopefully die out...you know the drill...he'd be fine with her doing exactly what he is wanting to do...he'd want that...until he actually had to face it. The thing is, she very well might be having the same issues he is right now...she may be having second thoughts and not telling him, maybe looking at other guys and wondering, but not telling him, but he's probably too arrogant to even consider that...


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Let him answer, Sam. That's why I asked.


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## devotion (Oct 8, 2012)

I lean towards the no opposite sex friends rule but I think that can be relaxed in cases where clear boundaries are there. This girl is interested in you and has her friends telling you so - the boundaries are not there. Come on, you kissed her! That's not a casual friend. 

This girl is obviously into you and is a bad influence. You should stay away in respect to your fiance.


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## JustTired (Jan 22, 2012)

Jellybeans said:


> Let him answer, Sam. That's why I asked.


Maybe he's already mad at us & won't answer anything else. LOL


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## thatsme123 (Aug 12, 2014)

Okay let me just say this.

One of the main reasons I even posted here..is because I needed to get it off my chest. I actually feel better now. I knew if I were to get any sort of replies, they would be bashing me. However, I think it's absolutely ridiculous the amount of judging that is going on too. Whether any of you have been in a similar situation or not, doesn't give you any right to look down and pass judgment. What you may or may not have done to save your relationship isn't going to work for everyone. I have 15 posts here, trying to explain it better, and everyone has pegged me as the scum of the earth.


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## samyeagar (May 14, 2012)

thatsme123 said:


> Okay let me just say this.
> 
> *One of the main reasons I even posted here..is because I needed to get it off my chest. I actually feel better now*. I knew if I were to get any sort of replies, they would be bashing me. However, I think it's absolutely ridiculous the amount of judging that is going on too. Whether any of you have been in a similar situation or not, doesn't give you any right to look down and pass judgment. What you may or may not have done to save your relationship isn't going to work for everyone. I have 15 posts here, trying to explain it better, and everyone has pegged me as the scum of the earth.


So what are you going to do?


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

I won't judge if you'd be more open to suggestion


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

thatsme123 said:


> I love how easy people jump to conclusions like that..
> 
> Seriously? I'm sorry, but I'm not going to read some ridiculous book that makes you feel guilty for having female friends. Nonsense.


Do you even have a clue what the book is about?? Obviously not.

You also don't have a clue about marriage, or being faithful, or being honest.

The best thing for you to do is exactly what SamY said at the beginning: screw the OW, don't tell your fiance, get married, and continue to cheat. 

I have kids your age, and if they were acting like you, I would slap them upside the head.


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## DoF (Mar 27, 2014)

thatsme123 said:


> Okay let me just say this.
> 
> One of the main reasons I even posted here..is because I needed to get it off my chest. I actually feel better now. I knew if I were to get any sort of replies, they would be bashing me. However, I think it's absolutely ridiculous the amount of judging that is going on too. Whether any of you have been in a similar situation or not, doesn't give you any right to look down and pass judgment. What you may or may not have done to save your relationship isn't going to work for everyone. I have 15 posts here, trying to explain it better, and everyone has pegged me as the scum of the earth.


We didn't, BUT since you are hearing things that you DON'T want to hear, it comes off as "I'm the biggest scum on earth"

It's as bad as you want to make it. It's not THAT bad.

Also, I haven't been here very long but I will tell you that I don't think I have EVER seen a thread on this forum where EVERYONE was on the same page and gave great advice.

I have not found ONE bad advice in this thread yet.....

I suggest you put your defensiveness aside and start learning/listening. 

We are trying to help you. But it's no different than a drug addict friend. You cannot help them unless they want to help themselves.

Good luck

PS. Whenever you enter the world of internet, there is absolutely NO rules on "passing judgement". We are all free to say and do whatever we want. MANY of us here apply "tough love" to people and don't beat around the bush or fluff their post. I have been trying to more lately, if it was month or 2 ago you would've seen more "tough love" types of posts from me as well.

We will ONLY tell you what you NEED to hear. Not what you want to hear.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

thatsme123 said:


> Okay let me just say this.
> 
> One of the main reasons I even posted here..is because I needed to get it off my chest. I actually feel better now. I knew if I were to get any sort of replies, they would be bashing me. However, I think it's absolutely ridiculous the amount of judging that is going on too. Whether any of you have been in a similar situation or not, doesn't give you any right to look down and pass judgment. What you may or may not have done to save your relationship isn't going to work for everyone. I have 15 posts here, trying to explain it better, and everyone has pegged me as the scum of the earth.


Thatsme,

It is good you are getting this off your chest. I imagine it's been weighing heavily on you heavily (and rightly so). 

You posted on an open forum, and how that works it that you are going to hear ALL kinds of things, opinions and advice. While some things may be unsavory to hear and not to your liking, most of the advice here is the same: you done wrong. We don't agree on a lot of stuff at TAM but this kind of situation is pretty universal to hear the same advice:

This woman is NOT your friend. Not at all. You said it yourself from your very initial post when you said that there are only two women you have ever experience this deep feeling for.

She is BAD news for any relationship you try to have with your fiance.

I don't think you are evil or some demon. I just think you aren't ready for marriage if you are pining away over someone else.


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## thatsme123 (Aug 12, 2014)

samyeagar said:


> So what are you going to do?


At this point, it's irrelevant to share what I will do, or plan to do..I'll be in the divorce section soon, right?


----------



## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

thatsme123 said:


> Okay let me just say this.
> 
> One of the main reasons I even posted here..is because I needed to get it off my chest. I actually feel better now. I knew if I were to get any sort of replies, they would be bashing me. However, I think it's absolutely ridiculous the amount of judging that is going on too. Whether any of you have been in a similar situation or not, doesn't give you any right to look down and pass judgment. What you may or may not have done to save your relationship isn't going to work for everyone. I have 15 posts here, trying to explain it better, and everyone has pegged me as the scum of the earth.


You aren't even reading what people are posting. I suggested that book because it is EXACTLY what you need to hear right now. The reason you feel judged is because you know you're doing something wrong.


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## Finder (Aug 12, 2014)

thatsme123 said:


> Okay let me just say this.
> 
> One of the main reasons I even posted here..is because I needed to get it off my chest. I actually feel better now. I knew if I were to get any sort of replies, they would be bashing me. However, I think it's absolutely ridiculous the amount of judging that is going on too. Whether any of you have been in a similar situation or not, doesn't give you any right to look down and pass judgment. What you may or may not have done to save your relationship isn't going to work for everyone. I have 15 posts here, trying to explain it better, and everyone has pegged me as the scum of the earth.


That's because you're trying to make it seem like you weren't wrong when everyone knows you are.

If you think it's not so bad go tell your fiance, lets see what she thinks. I'm expecting more excuses now...


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Hope1964 said:


> I have kids your age, and if they were acting like you, I would slap them upside the head.


Ok, now you sound like MY mom. 

LOL.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

thatsme123 said:


> At this point, it's irrelevant to share what I will do, or plan to do..I'll be in the divorce section soon, right?


You have to get married first to get a divorce.

But you could avoid all that by not getting married at all. 



You can't have a divorce without a marriage..........


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## DoF (Mar 27, 2014)

thatsme123 said:


> At this point, it's irrelevant to share what I will do, or plan to do..I'll be in the divorce section soon, right?


You are ****ting on people that are trying to help you.

Just like you are ****ting on a person that is willing to commit their LIFE TO YOU.

You still have SO much to learn........and I hope you learn it. Many NEVER do.


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## DoF (Mar 27, 2014)

Jellybeans said:


> Ok, now you sound like MY mom.
> 
> LOL.


Sounds like you have a great mom (no sarcasm)


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

I don't view Hope as a Mom figure but as a MUCH older sister


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

DoF said:


> Sounds like you have a great mom (no sarcasm)


Oh I do.

She will happily slap anyone upside the head. She is a no-nonsense kind of woman. I spent most of my childhood running away from her and her big bad spatula for fear of her wrath when I did something wrong. The kitchen was her warfield. Every pot, pan, and spoon was liable to get chucked at my head. She rarely missed.

I have a great respect for her. And I'm an adult now and she still scares me. 

:rofl:


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## ILoveSparkles (Oct 28, 2013)

thatsme123 said:


> Nope, I want to hear what is right. Unfortunately I'm unable to talk about this with anyone else.
> 
> In all honesty, I do want to remain friends with this girl. She is going through a divorce, and I feel she is maybe dealing with her own problems. The free spirit in me feels like..life is too short to just subtract people from your life because of complications. I do feel this girl and I have a connection. I'm not looking to get married, and fool around.
> 
> I want to do what is right...this isn't a picnic for me..believe me. I've been a huge mess because of everything.


How would you feel if it was your fiancee that had a connection with another guy? My guess is that you wouldn't be okay with that.

You absolutely can not be friends with this other woman if you get married. You clearly have boundary issues, and since you two kissed, you've already cheated on your fiancee. The right thing to do is to let your fiancee go so she can find someone who will love and cherish her - not cheat.

You are not ready for marriage if you are this conflicted.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

Almostrecovered said:


> I don't view Hope as a Mom figure but as a MUCH older sister


You just HAD to put that word 'much' in there, didn't you.


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## samyeagar (May 14, 2012)

I am interested in hearing your answer to the question Jellybeans has asked a couple of times now...a serious answer, truly thought out and answered honestly...how would you HONESTLY feel if you found out your fiance was having these torn feelings between you and another man she had gotten drunk with and kissed? When thinking about your answer, take away your current safety net, fall back woman in the wings...how would you feel if you were entirely devoted to your fiance, and she was behaving as you are?


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## Jung_admirer (Jun 26, 2013)

thatsme123 said:


> So what you're saying at this point is..tell my fiance what happened..she calls off the wedding..and let the chips fall where they may?
> 
> Maybe that is the right thing to do..but..I don't think many people who do that. I'm a realist..I wish I did have the balls to do that..be open..and accept the consequences..but I'm also willing to believe that..I made a mistake..maybe I'm stressed out..and this will pass.


Many people already know about your involvement with the OW. You are going to drop an emotionally fragile OW ... no way this doesn't come back to you. Talk to your fiance honestly, apologize profusely, and let her make her decision.


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## DoF (Mar 27, 2014)

Jellybeans said:


> Oh I do.
> 
> She will happily slap anyone upside the head. She is a no-nonsense kind of woman. I spent most of my childhood running away from her and her big bad spatula for fear of her wrath when I did something wrong. The kitchen was her warfield. Every pot, pan, and spoon was liable to get chucked at my head. She rarely missed.
> 
> ...


Sounds awesome.

My mom/father.....often teachers back in Europe used to whoop my ass with the belt. Often right in front of EVERYONE....with pants down.

# of times my mom gave me a whooping in front of all my friends as well (when I was idiot and decided to run away from her onto a balcony overlooking the playground...big mistake).

Regardless, I think my parents for that. I needed it and a little bit of discipline only did good. Sure I hated it at the time, but now I appreciate it.

I like to smack my kids upside of their heads too BTW. 

I think every kid needs a bit of discipline at times.....but not abuse (there is a FINE line).


I also believe that each and EVERY man needs a good ass whooping every couple of years or so (including me). Just to keep in check and to get us back to reality.

 

Unfortunately most don't get any.....hehe


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## DoF (Mar 27, 2014)

samyeagar said:


> I am interested in hearing your answer to the question Jellybeans has asked a couple of times now...a serious answer, truly thought out and answered honestly...how would you HONESTLY feel if you found out your fiance was having these torn feelings between you and another man she had gotten drunk with and kissed? When thinking about your answer, take away your current safety net, fall back woman in the wings...how would you feel if you were entirely devoted to your fiance, and she was behaving as you are?


He knows EXACTLY what he would do. We know it as well.

He would go insane and dump her. He would also assume she banged him.

Why do you think he won't tell her the truth, he is afraid of what "he would do" would apply to him.


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## thatsme123 (Aug 12, 2014)

DoF said:


> He knows EXACTLY what he would do. We know it as well.
> 
> He would go insane and dump her. He would also assume she banged him.
> 
> Why do you think he won't tell her the truth, he is afraid of what "he would do" would apply to him.


You seem to be quite a guru here. I'll just let you answer for me from now on. When is your book coming out?


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

honestly if you came here just to start a flame war you'll be banned pretty quickly


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## jaharthur (May 25, 2012)

thatsme123 said:


> Hello everyone, so I'm hoping to get some input into my situation. I pretty much know what most of you will say, but I'm hoping there's something new I can take out of this..
> 
> * * * * *
> 
> I'd appreciate anyones thoughts, or comments.


You asked for anyone's thoughts and you knew what they were going to be. That says to me that you know that everyone's advice here is correct and just don't want to face the truth.

You aren't done being a fling person and you aren't ready for marriage. You would be doing an incredible disservice to your fiancee to proceed with a marriage that you see as a one-year trial run.

I feel very sorry for your fiancee.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

Unfortunately, with that attitude, you'll be banned pretty quickly. Kind of a shame, because you really need to hear what people are saying to you.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Your original post



thatsme123 said:


> I guess the one thing I won't budge on is bringing this up to my fiance. I know I'm a jerk for that, but she is so into this wedding, that I can't possibly ruin it for her now. I'm really hoping that this all blows over, and everything is back to normal.
> 
> 
> *I'd appreciate anyones thoughts, or comments*.


Well, you said it yourself. You won't budge on telling her.

Ok. 

Good luck then. You are going to need it. Because it sounds like your fiance knows the woman you have been carrying on with. And the separated woman's friend also knows (the one who told you to "be nice or kind" or whatever to her friend and not to hurt her). Seems everyone in this situation is concerned about protecting their own feelings but your fiance's feelings matter not. 

You are on dangerous ground, OP.

These things have a way of getting out when you least expect it. Especially when multiple know/are involved/and start talking.


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## sinnister (Dec 5, 2010)

samyeagar said:


> Since being open and honest is off the table...why not go the whole hog and just nail the other chick and try to keep it from your fiance for as long as possible. Hell, try and date them both, even after the wedding.


You beat me to the smart azz response. I was about to type: just bang her...you're not married yet. Not cheating.

But seriously, you're not marriage material OP. You should break it off.


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## samyeagar (May 14, 2012)

samyeagar said:


> I am interested in hearing your answer to the question Jellybeans has asked a couple of times now...a serious answer, truly thought out and answered honestly...how would you HONESTLY feel if you found out your fiance was having these torn feelings between you and another man she had gotten drunk with and kissed? When thinking about your answer, take away your current safety net, fall back woman in the wings...how would you feel if you were entirely devoted to your fiance, and she was behaving as you are?


Thatsme...ignore everyone else for a minute, drop the defensiveness for a moment and answer this question honestly please.


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## ILoveSparkles (Oct 28, 2013)

thatsme123 said:


> I love how easy people jump to conclusions like that..
> 
> Seriously? I'm sorry, but I'm not going to read some ridiculous book that makes you feel guilty for having female friends. Nonsense.



YOU are a male that should not have female friends. You clearly do not where to draw the line. You SHOULD feel guilty about have female friends because you don't know where to draw the line. You have cheated on your fiancee emotionally and physically.

All you are doing is making excuses about why you feel it's acceptable to continue your "friendship" - and being defensive when others call you out on your immature behaviors.


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## DoF (Mar 27, 2014)

When this thread first started I felt bad for his girl, now I feel REALLY bad for his girl. Man, here we are, bunch of strangers that know more about her boyfriend than she does. 

And she still has to find out for herself in coming years.

OP doesn't deserve ANY advice that was given to him either......way too arrogant, defensive, selfish and inconsiderate. 

All of the things that make up a poor marriage partner.


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## DoF (Mar 27, 2014)

samyeagar said:


> Thatsme...ignore everyone else for a minute, drop the defensiveness for a moment and answer this question honestly please.


It's really hard to ask someone for honesty when they can't even be honest with themselves or their loved ones.

:scratchhead:


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## Rowan (Apr 3, 2012)

You know that banging your head against a wall feeling you all seem to have in response to the OP? That's a little taste of what it's like to try and R with someone who isn't remorseful and/or really doesn't think they've done anything wrong. They don't seem to budge. You imagine that it's because they simply don't _understand_, and that if you can only explain it properly, they'll suddenly get it. Eventually, though, you have to suck it up and face the fact that they _do_ understand. They just aren't going to stop because they don't want to.

And, you know that "fog" people talk about regarding wayward spouses? It isn't some magical influence that keeps cheaters from thinking clearly. Rather, it's exactly the complete obliviousness to all forms of empathy and self-awareness that the OP seems to have going on. It's called a fog because it's impenetrable and covers every facet of their psyche. You could call it psychopathy, but that seems to set people on edge, so the web seems to have defaulted to "fog". 

If I didn't know better, I'd swear this OP was my ex-husband.


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## devotion (Oct 8, 2012)

OP, first of all I'd like to actually thank you for staying engaged on this thread. A lot of people post and then don't respond, at least you're actually talking to us. 

Now that said, the fact that all of us pretty much agree doesn't mean we're ganging up on you. It just means that it seems pretty evident to us. Whether or not you, anonymous internet guy, agree or do -- is nothing we can affect. But you asked our opinion and we gave it to you. 

I tell my GF that often I don't read happy endings to stories on these forums. Unfortunately I'm pretty sure this won't be a happy ending, for your fiance, for the other woman, or for you. No matter what you do, because you ALREADY cheated on your fiance so you are going to pay the consequences, whether you tell her or not.


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## thatsme123 (Aug 12, 2014)

Rowan reads my many many posts on here, and compares me to her ex husband? lol..who do you people think you are?

It's hard for me NOT to get defensive when you people are taking such a gang mentality, and passing judgment. I could sit back and judge all of you..what the hell are you all doing here with thousands of posts? Do you still have issues? If not, then are you just here to pass along all the valuable lessons you've learned? Half of you sound like clowns just looking to spew how bad you think I am. Only a couple of you actually took interest in knowing more about the situation before you started attacking. 

You all just assume I'm trying to "have my cake and eat it too"..I guess that's the issue with posting on boards like these. You jump to conclusions without actually finding out more. Even to attack and make judgment on my "friend"..wow! 

As for questions I didn't answer..you want to ask me one, send me a message. Any answer I give I will be ridiculed and attacked for in this post.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

*sigh*


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## samyeagar (May 14, 2012)

thatsme123 said:


> Rowan reads my many many posts on here, and compares me to her ex husband? lol..who do you people think you are?
> 
> It's hard for me NOT to get defensive when you people are taking such a gang mentality, and passing judgment. I could sit back and judge all of you..what the hell are you all doing here with thousands of posts? Do you still have issues? If not, then are you just here to pass along all the valuable lessons you've learned? Half of you sound like clowns just looking to spew how bad you think I am. Only a couple of you actually took interest in knowing more about the situation before you started attacking.
> 
> ...


Typical passive aggressive response.

About your friend...she does know you are engaged right? Yet she is engaging you. Her actions are very disrespectful towards your fiance. I am curious as to why you would stand to let your fiance be disrespected like that.


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## DoF (Mar 27, 2014)

thatsme123 said:


> Rowan reads my many many posts on here, and compares me to her ex husband? lol..who do you people think you are?
> 
> It's hard for me NOT to get defensive when you people are taking such a gang mentality, and passing judgment. I could sit back and judge all of you..what the hell are you all doing here with thousands of posts? Do you still have issues? If not, then are you just here to pass along all the valuable lessons you've learned? Half of you sound like clowns just looking to spew how bad you think I am. Only a couple of you actually took interest in knowing more about the situation before you started attacking.
> 
> ...


I can tell you are COMPLETELY new at this internet/forum thing, aren't you?

We are here to HELP you BASED on what you give us/tell us. We are not going to guess and ask you questions unless that is needed (clearly it wasn't). Only questions that were asked are the ones that YOU need to ask YOURSELF.

I'm pretty sure I can speak for everyone here and say that we are all wasting our time here. 

I wish you luck


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## DoF (Mar 27, 2014)

samyeagar said:


> Typical passive aggressive response.
> 
> About your friend...she does know you are engaged right? Yet she is engaging you. Her actions are very disrespectful towards your fiance. I am curious as to why you would stand to let your fiance be disrespected like that.


Not to mention that she is COMPLETELY disrespectful towards HIM "as a friend" as well. 

For those that do manage to have opposite sex friends, one rule they do follow is "if they are not a friend of my marriage, they are NOT my friend."


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## Finder (Aug 12, 2014)

thatsme123 said:


> As for questions I didn't answer..you want to ask me one, send me a message. Any answer I give I will be ridiculed and attacked for in this post.


Everybody knew you weren't going to answer that question... Probably because you'll realize how much of a hypocrite you are.


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## samyeagar (May 14, 2012)

thatsme123 said:


> Rowan reads my many many posts on here, and compares me to her ex husband? lol..who do you people think you are?
> 
> It's hard for me NOT to get defensive when you people are taking such a gang mentality, and passing judgment. I could sit back and judge all of you..what the hell are you all doing here with thousands of posts? Do you still have issues? If not, then are you just here to pass along all the valuable lessons you've learned? Half of you sound like clowns just looking to spew how bad you think I am. Only a couple of you actually took interest in knowing more about the situation before you started attacking.
> 
> ...





Finder said:


> Everybody knew you weren't going to answer that question... P*robably because you'll realize how much of a hypocrite you are*.


And that my friends is the very definition of cake eating.


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## sidney2718 (Nov 2, 2013)

thatsme123 said:


> Nope, I want to hear what is right. Unfortunately I'm unable to talk about this with anyone else.
> 
> In all honesty, I do want to remain friends with this girl. She is going through a divorce, and I feel she is maybe dealing with her own problems. The free spirit in me feels like..life is too short to just subtract people from your life because of complications. I do feel this girl and I have a connection. I'm not looking to get married, and fool around.
> 
> I want to do what is right...this isn't a picnic for me..believe me. I've been a huge mess because of everything.


From what you've said, the only thing that is right is to drop both women. You are not into long-term relationships. You've said that yourself. If you go ahead with the marriage you'll just hurt your wife (and badly at that) and you won't drop the other woman and worse, there will be still other women that you "connect to".

If you don't go ahead with the marriage and hook up with the other woman, she won't be able to trust you and she'll either drop you or again, you'll find still another woman.

As I said, drop both, play the field for another couple of years until you feel really ready to settle down.


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## inquizitivemind (Jul 16, 2013)

Nobody is ganging up on you. Everyone is right. You are disrespecting your fiance by doing this stuff. You said it yourself. If you tell your fiance what happened, she will be hurt. Why did you put yourself in the position to hurt her? If you love somebody, you don't do that. And if you mess up, you are honest and admit it to them. You owe her that. You owe her to tell her and let her decide if she still wants to marry you knowing you have had feelings for someone else!


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## samyeagar (May 14, 2012)

Thatsme, every decision I make, every conversation I have, everything I do is run through the filter of my wife. I ask myself would she be ok with this, would it hurt her, it is respectful to her and my marriage, and if the answer is no, I don't say it, I don't do it. I vowed to love her, to honor and respect her, to cherish her, to place her above all others, and I take that very seriously.


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## Cubby (Mar 28, 2012)

thatsme123, you don't seem to be very receptive to advice, but I'll throw it out there anyway. I'm 20 plus years older than you, so I do have some experience...

First of all, you're making a big mistake dismissing the "Not Just Friends" book by Shirley Glass. You're avoiding what you don't want to hear. It's a classic book, and you'll learn a lot. But whatever....

All of your life you're going to meet women you "connect" with and feel like you might want to get to know better. We all do. But when you treasure your marriage and your wife, you learn to cut off the interactions, or keep them light and brief, so you don't develop emotional attachments. It's called maintaining proper boundaries.

So while this current woman might seem unique and "the one," she's really not. There will always be a "the one." Once you decide to commit to one person, which you have, you simply don't pursue others. Trust me, the effect your special girlfriend has on you will fade with time.

You've been with your fiance for 5 years now. So you don't have the "first date feelings" anymore, like you have with your new interest. After awhile, the new girl won't be new anymore and those exciting butterfly feelings will fade. So then what? Another girl to connect with?

You have to educate yourself on boundaries. A married or engaged man doesn't pursue friendships with women. That's just asking for trouble.


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## Cubby (Mar 28, 2012)

samyeagar said:


> Thatsme, every decision I make, every conversation I have, everything I do is run through the filter of my wife. I ask myself would she be ok with this, would it hurt her, it is respectful to her and my marriage, and if the answer is no, I don't say it, I don't do it. I vowed to love her, to honor and respect her, to cherish her, to place her above all others, and I take that very seriously.


thatsme123, the words above are how you keep a long and fulfilling marriage. Any conversation you have with another woman, you should ask yourself, "would I feel comfortable with my wife (or in this case, your fiance) eavesdropping on this conversation?"


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## jaharthur (May 25, 2012)

OK, I haven't been around here as long as many, but I've never seen such unanimity of opinion.

And it's not ganging up, it's everyone coming to the same conclusion on their own.

Hmmmmmmmm.


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## commonsenseisn't (Aug 13, 2014)

Your post is a clear indicator, at least in my mind, that you are not ready for an exclusive relationship (marriage). I suggest you cancel the wedding. It will break her heart, but not near as badly as what will happen if you go through with it. It behooves you to do some soul searching and try to learn the value of loyalty, maturity, and other skill sets that boost marriage success. You remind me of my nephew 14 years ago who was easily infatuated by almost any girl who paid him attention. He is still paying for making the same mistake you appear to want. 
Sorry for being blunt, but I've seen this story play out before and it does not end well. Best of luck.


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## lovelost2soon (Aug 9, 2014)

If you want to do what is right like you say then you should break it off with your fiancé. You aren't even married yet and you can't remain faithful. You owe it to her to break her heart now (although if she knew of the cheating with her friend she may not be so heart broken) rather than later. Believe me it will be easier now then after a marriage, it can take a very long time to get a divorce and will cost lots of money. Save yourselves now.


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## RClawson (Sep 19, 2011)

thatsme123 said:


> Okay let me just say this.
> 
> One of the main reasons I even posted here..is because I needed to get it off my chest. I actually feel better now. I knew if I were to get any sort of replies, they would be bashing me. However, I think it's absolutely ridiculous the amount of judging that is going on too. Whether any of you have been in a similar situation or not, doesn't give you any right to look down and pass judgment. What you may or may not have done to save your relationship isn't going to work for everyone. I have 15 posts here, trying to explain it better, and everyone has pegged me as the scum of the earth.


I do not think you are scum of the earth but I do seem to remember you talking about how you are trying to keep your fiancé at an arms length from this woman. That my friend is why this woman cannot be your friend.

I have women that have been friends for the past twenty plus years. We chat every once and awhile, I lean on them when I need professional advice because I trust them, I care about their families and the progression they are making in life, every once and awhile (a great while) we will do the lunch thing. One thing I have never done with any of my female friends is get drunk with them, cross the boundaries of our relationship or get physical with them. Oh I guess I get a goodbye or hello hug but I have never kissed one of them. They are a friend and THAT is inappropriate. DO YOU GET THAT? Because it does not seem like it. You seem to be a tool looking for validation in spite of your boorish behavior. 

Listen and listen well young man. You do not get it! You have no clue and you are about to do something very dishonest with your fiancé if you do not come clean to her. Something tells me that this is going to go over your head. I hope your fiancé gets tipped off to who you truly are.


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## RClawson (Sep 19, 2011)

thatsme123 said:


> You seem to be quite a guru here. I'll just let you answer for me from now on. When is your book coming out?


And here is another reason why you should not be getting married. You have zero humility. Completely resistant to consider any wisdom that does fit within the parameters of your narrow scope.

The folks here, the ones who you believe to be fools, many of them have been betrayed. They have come out the other side. They have lived what you are thinking about putting your fiancé through possibly. Forgive them if they cannot get on board with your foolish vision. 

Some that have responded to you are former cheaters and they also see the destruction you are setting yourself up for.

I advise you to quit being so smug and start considering the reasons why you are getting your head handed to you here.


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## GA HEART (Oct 18, 2011)

PLEASE marry your fiance! It will all get better if you put a ring on it! Better yet, knock her up in the first year! And keep that friend too! She needs someone to dry her tears, poor baby and all that she's been through. And everything will be fairy farts and roses and perfection in it's purest essence!

There, is that good advice?

It's times like this I wish I could find this poor woman and tell her myself. SMH....


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