# Why do we stay?



## onthefence16 (Aug 21, 2011)

Just wanting to vent. I have come to the conclusion that all cheating spouses and boy/girlfriends and fiances are LOSERS to the 100th degree. Nothing but slime and scum. Why do we the BS stick and stay with these losers. Are we the real losers, I wonder.:scratchhead:
So I guess I must ask those who choose to stay, why do you stay? And if you are in R how is it going? Mine isn't so good right now. My H is a maniac to say the least. Defensive as all get out when I trigger, I am the loser in this marriage for sure.
But why stay? Why do we not just walk away with our pride? Instead we stay and go through the agony that is ours and ours alone caused by these losers that we continue to love. Is there something wrong with us? I wonder to myself, has my self esteem been crushed to the point that I will put up with this sh^t? I am beginning to question everything, even my own sanity....


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## DubeGechi (Dec 12, 2010)

Because I am not gonna quit on my son 10 and daughter 3. Screw everything else.


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## DawnD (Sep 23, 2009)

I think it all has to do with the DS. My H cheated, but when Dday came around, he did everything he could and should have done to keep me. Took responsibility, got counseling for himself and his PTSD, invited me to his counseling a few times, set me up my own savings account that he can not check for "escape money" so to speak hahaha. In case I decided I wanted out it has enough money in it to file and we did a post nup. Whether or not it is legal I don't know, but just the fact he would sign it and agree to the terms that I wanted made me think it was worth a shot.

Two years and some change later, and things are great. Still have a moment every now and again, but nothing like it was. But I still have that account just in case


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

My hubby also has done an absolute TON of changing and helping me, otherwise there's no way I COULD stay. We are far happier now than we were for at least 2 if not 5 years prior to D day. I have bad days sometimes, triggers, maybe drink a couple too many and get maudlin, but we deal with all that crap together. Marriage counseling has helped tremendously, as has IC and hubby's SA group. He is in a head space now that he has never been before - he is calmer, happier, more fun and easier to get along with. I am really glad we are together


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## I'mInLoveWithMyHubby (Nov 7, 2011)

I couldn't. My ex was a serial cheater. He was very verbally abusive and put the blame on me for everything. I would sit back and cry, he took pictures and laughed at me. He was and is very cruel. I left after a year, I was smarter then that and I wondered why I put up with it for so long. He panicked and threatened to kill himself if I left, he's still alive today. One of his mistresses moved in 3 days after I left. They are now married and he's cheated on her. He also abuses her, but for some reason has put up with it for the last 17 years. He hates women. My ex tore my daughter apart emotionally and is proud. I guess he does the same with their daughter who is only 2. He refuses to have anything to do with her. Man, he is sick. Marrying him was the biggest mistake in my life, but I learned a valuable lesson. I know what to look for and I can warn my daughters. 

I think serial cheaters are much different then a one time affair. A one time affair can be healed. Cheating time after time is a big problem and is not physically healthy to anyone. STD's are easily contracted by serial cheaters. They usually don't take the time to put a condom on.

I'm soooooooo much happier now. I found true love. Someone who always puts my needs before his own. He works very hard for our family. I'm such a lucky woman to have such an awesome husband. I fully trust him. He doesn't even look at porn. He has great desire for me and the passion is still there 12 years later. He is a fabulous father to all 3 girls. My husband now does so much for me. I thank him often and let him know that I appreciate everything.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Kurosity (Dec 22, 2011)

I think running away would make me a loser. It may be tough ahead of me but a true looser does not even try. As long as my H is trying I will stay. It is what it is and we can deal with it face to face or run away like a real loser would.

Knowing the trying times a head and squaring my shoulders to face it. I am brave for risking it all on someone who once let me down. I am proud of me and the amount of love I have for my WS because he does not deserve an ounce of it but it is my choice to give it.

No we are not losers. Just really brave people even when it seems stupid to the rest of the world we do it.


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## DawnD (Sep 23, 2009)

Kurosity said:


> I think running away would make me a loser. It may be tough ahead of me but a true looser does not even try. As long as my H is trying I will stay. It is what it is and we can deal with it face to face or run away like a real loser would.
> 
> Knowing the trying times a head and squaring my shoulders to face it. I am brave for risking it all on someone who once let me down. I am proud of me and the amount of love I have for my WS because he does not deserve an ounce of it but it is my choice to give it.
> 
> No we are not losers. Just really brave people even when it seems stupid to the rest of the world we do it.


 I agree in some cases. I also agree in certain cases that it would be dumb for the LS to stay. There are certain DS that aren't worth staying married to, especially ones that show no remorse or don't put any effort into saving the relationship. Then it isn't worth saving to me.


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## Beowulf (Dec 7, 2011)

onthefence16 said:


> Just wanting to vent. I have come to the conclusion that all cheating spouses and boy/girlfriends and fiances are LOSERS to the 100th degree. Nothing but slime and scum. Why do we the BS stick and stay with these losers. Are we the real losers, I wonder.:scratchhead:
> So I guess I must ask those who choose to stay, why do you stay? And if you are in R how is it going? Mine isn't so good right now. My H is a maniac to say the least. Defensive as all get out when I trigger, I am the loser in this marriage for sure.
> But why stay? Why do we not just walk away with our pride? Instead we stay and go through the agony that is ours and ours alone caused by these losers that we continue to love. Is there something wrong with us? I wonder to myself, has my self esteem been crushed to the point that I will put up with this sh^t? I am beginning to question everything, even my own sanity....


It was a boring Saturday and I had nothing better to do.


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## Beowulf (Dec 7, 2011)

onthefence16 said:


> Just wanting to vent. I have come to the conclusion that all cheating spouses and boy/girlfriends and fiances are LOSERS to the 100th degree. Nothing but slime and scum. Why do we the BS stick and stay with these losers. Are we the real losers, I wonder.:scratchhead:
> So I guess I must ask those who choose to stay, why do you stay? And if you are in R how is it going? Mine isn't so good right now. My H is a maniac to say the least. Defensive as all get out when I trigger, I am the loser in this marriage for sure.
> But why stay? Why do we not just walk away with our pride? Instead we stay and go through the agony that is ours and ours alone caused by these losers that we continue to love. Is there something wrong with us? I wonder to myself, has my self esteem been crushed to the point that I will put up with this sh^t? I am beginning to question everything, even my own sanity....


Seriously though. My wife ended the affair before I even knew she was having one and then did everything to prove to me that she was truly remorseful. If I had found out while she was still in the affair or if she had lied to me at all during R we would not have stayed married.


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## NatashaYurino (Jan 2, 2012)

DawnD said:


> I think it all has to do with the DS. My H cheated, but when Dday came around, he did everything he could and should have done to keep me. Took responsibility, got counseling for himself and his PTSD, invited me to his counseling a few times, set me up my own savings account that he can not check for "escape money" so to speak hahaha. In case I decided I wanted out it has enough money in it to file and we did a post nup. Whether or not it is legal I don't know, but just the fact he would sign it and agree to the terms that I wanted made me think it was worth a shot.
> 
> Two years and some change later, and things are great. Still have a moment every now and again, but nothing like it was. But I still have that account just in case


Stories like yours put a smile on my face. Thanks!:bunny:


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## NatashaYurino (Jan 2, 2012)

Beowulf said:


> It was a boring Saturday and I had nothing better to do.


:rofl:


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## jnj express (Mar 28, 2011)

Hey onthefence---it sounds very much like you are living in misery, and every day, is another day, of dread for you---Why are you still in your mge.

You do realize that once you leave---all that misery, and dread drop off, and there is actually a life out there, where the sun comes up, and there is happiness in the world, and you don't have to look misery and dread in the face everyday----life as a divorcee is not that terrible, especially if staying married is as you describe it.


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## onthefence16 (Aug 21, 2011)

I am starting to think that I don't want to stay married anymore. Whenever I trigger and I mean whenever he flips out. I had a long talk with him the other day telling him he shows no remorse. He didn't say anything that day. I also told him he needed to respect me and treat me right that the next time he flips that would be the last. He would have to leave. As a matter of fact I told him to leave this last time... I am going to bring the whole thing up in MC which isn't helping. She's only been handing us papers and reading from them. This time we are going to talk. He claims to have felt really bad the whole day (WELL GOOD) he should feel bad. I have been through an awful time yes this is true. But I seem to be mustering up the strength to let it go finally. I am still married and if he doesn't start showing real change I will not be and I will be fine with it. I have done all I can.


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## Thorburn (Nov 23, 2011)

onthefence16 said:


> I am starting to think that I don't want to stay married anymore. Whenever I trigger and I mean whenever he flips out. I had a long talk with him the other day telling him he shows no remorse. He didn't say anything that day. I also told him he needed to respect me and treat me right that the next time he flips that would be the last. He would have to leave. As a matter of fact I told him to leave this last time... I am going to bring the whole thing up in MC which isn't helping. She's only been handing us papers and reading from them. This time we are going to talk. He claims to have felt really bad the whole day (WELL GOOD) he should feel bad. I have been through an awful time yes this is true. But I seem to be mustering up the strength to let it go finally. I am still married and if he doesn't start showing real change I will not be and I will be fine with it. I have done all I can.


You need to move on. I have read your story. I am only about a month removed from D-day and my wife has done most things right so I am giving R a good try.

To tell you the truth I look for a reason not to stay and my WS senses that and keeps focused on doing things right.

Your WS is not trying or not capable of trying. Either way you are free to move forward and out of this marriage.

If I was in your shoes I would use the next MC session to say you are done. Say it at the beginning of the session, get up and walk out. IMO you have done enough.

If I was your MC at this stage and time I would ask you, "why are you staying in this marriage?" I would like your WS to hear your responce. I believe you would lay it all on the line and it would be a safe place to say it all. Perhaps if you wrote your responce out as a prepared speech you might be able to present it the next time you have MC. Tell the MC that you have something to say. Start with, if I was a MC I would ask the following question, "Why are you still in this marriage?" and read your responce. Just a thought.


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## Dexter Morgan (Dec 8, 2011)

DubeGechi said:


> Because I am not gonna quit on my son 10 and daughter 3. Screw everything else.


I understand this thought process above. However, I came to ther realization that it wasn't me that quit on them. The cheater already did that.

If you can make it work, and you can be happy, somehow, I wish you the best.

But nobody should live a miserable life because you have kids(not saying you, just in general). Kids will pick up on it. Unhappy parent, unhappy kids.


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## Dexter Morgan (Dec 8, 2011)

Kurosity said:


> I think running away would make me a loser.


So those who could not stomach looking at their cheating spouse any longer and didn't want to be married to them any longer are losers? I don't think so.


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## Kurosity (Dec 22, 2011)

@Dextor Morgan~Not at all. I am saying that for me it would make ME feel like a looser not to give it a try. 
But everyone is different and everyone's experiances are different for some getting out of a bad marriage, for what ever reason that makes it bad, it the best thing they can do.

I simply do not believe that satying and trying makes you a looser because you were betrayed it takes gutts to stay and in the same way it takes gutts to leave a marriage too. Both avenues are not easy ones


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## frustrated3 (Jan 30, 2012)

for me its 5 months past d-day and he has shown no signs of wanting to come back or makng it work but i want to. i miss the friendship more then anything we were together for 10yrs and have 3 kids. but since he doesn't want to R i filled for divorice i'm not happy about doing it but i don't want to stay in a separated status with him hopeing one day he may want to R


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## dingerdad (Nov 23, 2011)

If your husband isn't doing what you need to heal then get out. You need to lay out the terms for your marriage to continue to him and the MC. He's a man and sometimes we need to be told exactly what our wives need from us in any situation not just in R. If he knows what you want/need to heal and won't help then get out.

My fWW is doing everything and more than I could ask from her and it is still incredible hard somedays. There are times I can't look at her, lots of bad triggers, days when my brain won't shutdown, and like someone else mentioning there are days when I am waiting for her to screw up again so I can get out. I love my wife and I am glad we are in R but it's tough. I would not be able to do it if she wasn't holding us together at this point. I was the strong one after her affair who fought to keep my family together but now we are sharing that responsibility as it should be. At this point she is carrying a lot more of the load because somedays I feel like giving up but she won't let me. I'm glad she dosent.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## twenty8 (Jan 31, 2010)

I'mInLoveWithMyHubby said:


> I couldn't. My ex was a serial cheater. He was very verbally abusive and put the blame on me for everything. I would sit back and cry, he took pictures and laughed at me. He was and is very cruel. I left after a year, I was smarter then that and I wondered why I put up with it for so long. He panicked and threatened to kill himself if I left, he's still alive today. One of his mistresses moved in 3 days after I left. They are now married and he's cheated on her. He also abuses her, but for some reason has put up with it for the last 17 years. He hates women. My ex tore my daughter apart emotionally and is proud. I guess he does the same with their daughter who is only 2. He refuses to have anything to do with her. Man, he is sick. Marrying him was the biggest mistake in my life, but I learned a valuable lesson. I know what to look for and I can warn my daughters.
> 
> I think serial cheaters are much different then a one time affair. A one time affair can be healed. Cheating time after time is a big problem and is not physically healthy to anyone. STD's are easily contracted by serial cheaters. They usually don't take the time to put a condom on.
> 
> I'm soooooooo much happier now. I found true love. Someone who always puts my needs before his own. He works very hard for our family. I'm such a lucky woman to have such an awesome husband. I fully trust him. He doesn't even look at porn. He has great desire for me and the passion is still there 12 years later. He is a fabulous father to all 3 girls. My husband now does so much for me. I thank him often and let him know that I appreciate everything._Posted via Mobile Device_


That is so very appreciated.. It's funny how good men are taken for granted and are the ones usually kicked to the curb for such a meaningless, selfish adventure.. All because she was "bored". You tell your hubby how much you appreciate him. I sure would love that...


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## NPDfaceplant (Feb 6, 2012)

I have a two part question for those of you that stay. Why do you question the BS & OW with the assumption that one or both are lying even when it doesn't matter because you won't file for divorce anyway? The BS came home, the OW is out of your life so why rub salt on the wounds and never really know the truth?


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

NPDfaceplant said:


> I have a two part question for those of you that stay. Why do you question the BS & OW with the assumption that one or both are lying even when it doesn't matter because you won't file for divorce anyway? The BS came home, the OW is out of your life so why rub salt on the wounds and never really know the truth?


huh??


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## NPDfaceplant (Feb 6, 2012)

I'm just trying to wrap my head around why we stay if we ask for details but won't believe anything they say and still don't want a divorce.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

Well, I asked for details because I needed to hear the same answers over and over, and when the answers didn't change it helped me start to build trust again. I waffle back and forth - not so much now, but in the early days I did it a LOT - between believing him and not believing him, and between wanting to stay together and wanting to tell him to get the fvck out of my life.


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## NPDfaceplant (Feb 6, 2012)

Thank you for your reply, I'm struggling because I have two different stories (one from WH and one from OW). I don't know who to believe. My WH insists it was just a friendship but the OW gave me details when I asked. She had broken off the relationship (I found the email she sent to my husband) and when I confronted her she really pressed about me wanting the information. I love him but I don't know if I will ever trust him again enough to stay married.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

NPDfaceplant said:


> Thank you for your reply, I'm struggling because I have two different stories (one from WH and one from OW). I don't know who to believe. My WH insists it was just a friendship but the OW gave me details when I asked. She had broken off the relationship (I found the email she sent to my husband) and when I confronted her she really pressed about me wanting the information. I love him but I don't know if I will ever trust him again enough to stay married.


I can pretty much guarantee neither is telling the truth. Have you looked around the CWI forum, particularly the newbie thread?

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping...e-tam-cwi-newbies-please-read.html#post430739


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## frazaled (Jan 20, 2012)

I think our need to know is understandable and yes i think we ask the questions over and over again just to see if they always give us the same answer, because as yiou say we will never really know what happend we have to see for ourselves if they are telling the truth...and if i found he was lying to me again i would make him leave ,he knows for me this is a 1 shot deal i will not allow him to do this to me again.
as to the reason i stayed simple i love him i know he loves me we have been together for 22 years this is the first major issue we have had he was an idiot i am very hurt that i didnt matter enough at the time for him or my so called friend not to think about what this would do to me but they didnt.
it is what it is i cant change it and if i want my marriage to work i have to beleave in us ...he must continue to do as he is (very remorsefull,will talk about it when i need to ,he is now an open book and knows this is his fault not mine ).
I think for my hubby the biggest shock was i told him to leave and i ment it and he knew it ,i can and will do this on my own if need be i dont need to be betrayed by the man i love i wont accept it ever again and i think this scares him.
I must say my mum has always said it takes so mach more to stay and work on a marrage then to walk away ....sometimes i think thats true (funny as she is devorced 3 times lol).
If you beleave its worth it and your other half is prepered to but in the work then do it if not seriously walk away you deserve to not be misrable for the rest of your life.


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## slater (Feb 3, 2012)

For me, her affair lasted so long (3 years). I want to stay for the kids, but how do you get over THAT! Seems pointless to try.


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## rrrbbbttt (Apr 6, 2011)

slater said:


> For me, her affair lasted so long (3 years). I want to stay for the kids, but how do you get over THAT! Seems pointless to try.


Dealt with a short term cheating and it still is tough to get my arms around it. For something that occured over this period of time ( 3 years) to deal with I can understand your thought patterns.

Two questions you have the answer; Will the children be better off and are you willing to pay the price emotionally this will cost you?


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## NPDfaceplant (Feb 6, 2012)

My son & daughter are the primary reason I haven't thrown in the towel but if I'm honest I'm also afraid of being alone and the social humiliation. Between all the fighting, trying to keep the peace, the forced attempts at intimacy, putting on a show for friends, family and for each other; I'm not sure we are setting a good example or providing them with a healthy representation of a loving marriage. 

I desperately want to believe my husband and not the pathetic wench but I hate to admit her version seems more plausible. There was just too much information in the breakup letter she sent to him before I found out. 

I alternate between feeling weak & spineless to feeling like I will not compromise & live the rest of my life hidden behind lies, without dignity or self-respect. I feel like I would become a cheater by betraying myself.


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## Complexity (Dec 31, 2011)

It depends on the betrayal. If it was an emotional affair I would maybe stay, if it was a physical affair then hell to the no, I could never stay. Kids or no kids you can't live your life like this, the kids won't die or be irreparably traumatized if they don't see both of their parents constantly.


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## Numb in Ohio (Oct 31, 2011)

Complexity said:


> It depends on the betrayal. If it was an emotional affair I would maybe stay, if it was a physical affair then hell to the no, I could never stay. Kids or no kids you can't live your life like this, the kids won't die or be irreparably traumatized if they don't see both of their parents constantly.



Emotional affairs are not easier to "get over"......... when you know your SO gave their heart, feelings, thoughts, dreams, hopes, time, compassion, affection, attention, laughs, smiles, tenderness,,,, etc. ( all the good sides of them) to the OP,,,,,, and we get what's left, which isn't always pleasant since they are counting the minutes till they can contact the OP again.

And if the BS had to find out about the EA on their own, confront and make them stop contact with the OP unwillingly,,,, can that make for a successful R??? 

My H and I are 7 months out and I am still not sure what to do. I have had a bad trigger week, so sorry for not sounding too positive today....


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## Complexity (Dec 31, 2011)

Numb in Ohio said:


> Emotional affairs are not easier to "get over"......... when you know your SO gave their heart, feelings, thoughts, dreams, hopes, time, compassion, affection, attention, laughs, smiles, tenderness,,,, etc. ( all the good sides of them) to the OP,,,,,, and we get what's left, which isn't always pleasant since they are counting the minutes till they can contact the OP again.
> 
> And if the BS had to find out about the EA on their own, confront and make them stop contact with the OP unwillingly,,,, can that make for a successful R???
> 
> My H and I are 7 months out and I am still not sure what to do. I have had a bad trigger week, so sorry for not sounding too positive today....


First of all I'd like to say I'm sorry for what you're going through. 

The reason I say an EA is easier to get over is because I can personally deal with my partner telling the OM all of those things _much_ easier than I could get over picturing her having sex with him. That doesn't mean I can get over an EA though.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

i know it's been said a million times, but it depends on the WS and what they do after D day. It really really does. If you have a WS who is truly remorseful and does everything in their power to save the marriage and offers to lay down in front of a bus and apologizes over and over times ten million and does everything right and then some - after a couple of years of this, you really do start to believe they've changed and that they truly do love you and won't ever cheat again. 

And living with someone who so obviously wants to make things work like that and is a totally open book about everything is a far better option than starting all over again with someone you don't know and who doesn't know you. And whom you can't trust because you have no history.


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## Numb in Ohio (Oct 31, 2011)

Yet one of his EA's was with his old high school sweetheart and they slept together 12 years ago,,,( right before we met),, and then I am told that now they are "just friends"............so, just going through a rough time, and not meaning to " attack" anybody here for their own decisions. 

Just know I can vent here and know that most everyone here has been through it and will not take me too personal... and pass judgement for me being negative.


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## onthefence16 (Aug 21, 2011)

We did go to marriage counceling....I did lay it all out.....the marriage coucelor sucks and stared asking me if I forgave him....!!! I told her about the knife in the counter (she calls it bad behavior)....Picking up a large very large so called pocket knife which is sharp as a razor, in anger is not bad behavior. So that session did not go well as the MC was giving my WS excuses on his so called bad behavior. We have not gone back to her.....and I still quesiton myself and am still uncomfortable because he my WS needs to be kissing my butt......


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## Go Time (Feb 26, 2012)

I confronted my WW about 1 month ago. I got nothing but blameshifting, rewriting of marital history and rug sweeping. The problem that I see is that the person that's wrecking the mariage (WS) isn't the one that wants to end the marriage. I 'm pretty sure my WW will continue to cake eat until I end it.


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## ilovechocolate (Jan 16, 2012)

Been married foe 24 years and apart from the 13 months he was having the affair , he was a good husband and my best friend - we were a good team and had a lot of good times . 24 years v 13 months? It s hard and we have a lot of work but I m hoping we ll get through


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## sunshinetoday (Mar 7, 2012)

Complexity said:


> The reason I say an EA is easier to get over is because I can personally deal with my partner telling the OM all of those things _much_ easier than I could get over picturing her having sex with him. That doesn't mean I can get over an EA though.


I think a short term anything is easier to get over. It's just that most EA's I read about here have gone on so long....months...years! That is a hard thing. Maybe I am just looking at the glass half full, as my WS had a 4 week PA after 2 weeks of phone/texts. I was lucky I got proof early on into it and I think it was so much easier for my WS to come out of the fog as there wasn't a huge emotional attachment. Plus I kicked him out...that helped. Ha! The mind pictures just plain suck either way.



_-- Sent from my Palm Pixi using Forums_


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## snap (Oct 3, 2011)

sunshinetoday said:


> I think a short term anything is easier to get over. It's just that most EA's I read about here have gone on so long....months...years!


It's a good chance that many (most?) of such EAs are really PAs, but the BS has no evidence or just in denial. I don't believe in two adults exchanging iloveyous for years and not ever going for it.


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## Paladin (Oct 15, 2011)

We stay because we believe in love, compassion, and forgiveness. We stay because we understand that what one human can do, all humans can do. We stay because we choose to stay.


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## RWB (Feb 6, 2010)

I stayed after finding out (caught) that my wife had serially PA cheated on me for years. Why? mostly her regret, remorse, her willingness to tell me all, a recommittment to me. On my side, it was a one-time chance at forgiveness, mostly mercy. After 30 years of marriage, it was hard to just close the door and walk away. 

In R almost 3 years now. All that being said the rules are without debate. She knows for certain that there are no more chances. NONE. One secret text, one phone call, a secret meeting, it doesn't matter, I am through.


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