# Dont't want my grandchild to go hungry



## Caterpillar

My son and his ex-girlfriend have a two year old child. The ex-girlfriend has asked me to talk to my son to get him to pay the child benefit money direct into her bank account rather than his, as she says he gives her the money late and also keeps some of it for himself. She has been laid off at work and she and the baby are back living with her mother in cramped conditions. Following her phone call my husband called on her to give her some cash which I imagine should tide her over for perhaps a week. I know my son loves my grandchild but there are issues in that he felt trapped by his ex into becoming a father and so there’s lots of resentment. Currently he’s still in full time education and in rented accommodation. 

My son would definitely not take kindly to my telling him what to do and I don’t want to take sides, or be seen as taking sides (he feels I have sided with her in the past which caused a lengthy rift between my son and I, and which has only recently been smoothed over). However I do believe the money should go straight to the person the child is living with because the money is deemed to be for the child. Most importantly, there seems to be a genuine risk my grandchild could go hungry. I feel I could and should do more to help each of them out financially but would also like to feel reasonably certain that the money is mainly spent to benefit my grandchild. My feeling is that they are both somewhat immature and not great with money at times. That said, they are quite “proud” individuals and would not like to feel indebted or beholden to me and my husband and hence I worry that they don’t ask for help when they genuinely need it.

I welcome your suggestions on how to deal with this.


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## artieb

Could you suggest to your son that he give the money to you, on the argument that you'll deliver it in person so as to ensure it's being spent properly? (Don't just say this, actually do it.)

That keeps you involved with your grandchild, but instead of being on somebody's side against your son it puts you in the position of acting as his agent.


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## Lyn

Take groceries over.


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## Blanca

Lyn said:


> Take groceries over.


:iagree: Buy what the kid needs but dont give money.


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## Caterpillar

artieb said:


> Could you suggest to your son that he give the money to you, on the argument that you'll deliver it in person so as to ensure it's being spent properly? (Don't just say this, actually do it.)
> 
> Thanks for this suggestion Artieb but I doubt he would agree to this - in the past there were issues over my son actually getting to see the baby and I suggested she could bring the baby to my house and he could see the baby here but he was against me acting as a "middle man" preferring to make his own arrangements.
> 
> Thanks for the groceries suggestion. We have done this very occasionally in the past but as she is now out of work we probably need to do it on a regular basis - I've had a look on-line and some supermarkets do gift cards/vouchers so perhaps a combination of actual groceries plus a supermarket gift card would give some choice over which groceries.
> 
> Now if we can regularly give some groceries/vouchers, do you think I STILL need to actually ask/tell my son to make arrangements for the child benefit money to go direct into her bank account instead of his, which is what the ex-girlfriend asked me to do when she phoned. This money comes from the state and she has said that she herself can apply to have it paid direct into her bank account but that it would take several weeks to make the changeover - however she says that if HE applies to make the change to her bank account it would happen straightaway.
> 
> I'm REALLY uncomfortable with raising the subject with him.


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## TNgirl232

Yes you should tell him - he is your son and he needs a good dose of reality - it is not a time to be worrying about his feelings when the child is suffering. I understand your son felt trapped - but he needs to grow up - he had sex with a girl - one of the potential outcomes of that is a baby - one that is dependent upon him. If he wasn't ready for that then his pants should of stayed on. The money should be going to the child - which lives with her. 

Other than that, buying groceries is a good idea.


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## Caterpillar

Yes you're right. I DO have to speak to him about changing over the bank account. 

I suspect he fears that if she gets the money direct she may feel independent of him and not let him see the child - she has made threats along these lines in the past when he has wanted to split with her. They're in their very early twenties and they've been together 6 years on and off. At the moment they're "off" and frankly I think it should stay that way and for them to learn to parent responsibly apart and to realise that by supporting each other they support the child - my son is well aware of my view on this but it's difficult for me to convey this to the ex, not being her mother). I've also told him that for the sake of the baby, even if he believes she deliberately became pregnant, he needs to forgive her for this in the best interests of the baby's present and future needs and feelings.

(Whatever happens with the bank account, my husband and myself plan to help out with groceries on a regular basis for the ex/baby as well as for my son, separetely.) 

Any idea's please on how to convey to him that he needs to change the bank account, but without it turning ugly and seeming like I'm interfering. I want to keep the door open for communicating with him in the future.


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## Scannerguard

She is correct - she does have the right to garnish his wages if he's habitually late on making child support payments.

Catepillar, are you a grandmother or grandfather? You sound like a grandmother. . .not sure. . .just get a feeling.

I think he needs a male figure to approach him about everything. 

Is there anyone like that in his life?


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## Mommybean

If he does not have custody of the child, he has no business getting that money and metering it out to the mother. It should be going directly to her. If he will not handle it, then she needs to take care of it, even if it means a bit of a wait. If he is using the money as leverage, then he needs to contact the courts and get his visitiation rights in writing, rather than withold money as a bargaining chip. It sounds like both parents really need to grow up and quit behaving like children. They are parents now, and the only one that has a right to act so childish is the baby!


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## Caterpillar

Thanks for posting - I could ask my husband(i.e. his dad) to talk to him and maybe I'll have to talk to her too about the potential damage to the baby if their childish attitudes continue. 

If there are any men reading who have been in a similar position to my son I would appreciate input on how you put any resentment behind you and the ins and outs of parenting in these circumstances.


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## Scannerguard

Well, I am in the middle of a divorce with 3 kids and there is a lot of parenting disputes I won't bore you with.

Here's how the law seems to view it. In a way the law is "Pro-Mothers" and "Pro-Fathers."

The mothers, as the custodian of the child, is entitled to the child support in good faith. That can be arranged different ways but if the father is habitually late, than his income can and should be garnished.  I am on "household support" right now, which is actually more than child support and I write my stb-x wife post-dated checks that she can cash when the date becomes current. That way I know she and the kids are never without support. I plan to link this to my line of credit as I see this as a primary obligation of mine in the future.

I do this because I am self-employed. I do have a second job though but the paychecks are sporadic and it's possible that a garnished wage could exceed a paycheck on any given paycheck so I think it works better this way.

However, the father's visitation rights should be independent of any of this stuff.

In other words, a mother should not and I believe is not, by law entitled to deny access of the kids to their father whether he's late on child support or not.

I guess the safe way to portray it is the law is "Pro-Children." (in most states).

The kids are entitled to financial support from the biological father.
The kids are entitled to visit with their father and develop a relationship.

Neither person is to play with the other person's rights. So, he could be behind $10,000 on child support (and be in serious trouble) but nonetheless the mother shouldnt' be able to say to the father, "Oh, you can't see him! He's a bad Daddy!" and thwart his ability to father (I hate the term "parent").

This is my understanding but anyone feel free to refute me as I am not a family law attorney.


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## TNgirl232

Scannerguard is correct. My friends ex tried that in court when they went to discuss non-payment of child support - that she wouldn't let him see the kids (which wasn't true anyway). The judge told him that if he had issue with visitation to get a lawyer and bring it to court - it had nothing to do with him not paying his child support. Neither person can withold visitation or money just because the other has - you just both end up getting in trouble.


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## Scannerguard

Yes, I think the courts take both sides seriously too.

If the father is able to prove to a judge that a woman is vindictively thwarting her children access to their father, they will sympathesize and I did see I beleive Judge Judy or Judge Milian (People's Court) award the father emotional damages for doing this on one episode (was home a lot on Tuesdays, lol with baby).

Of course, it's "court TV" and you can only extrapolate so much but these forums on TV do tend to be educational with real court judge views (I do like to listen to Judge Judy's Larry King interviews) on simulated court appearances.

I do think women do often withhold children from their father based on non-payment of child support. I think it is common. Not saying the mother is doing this but it does happen.

I know of one case where the mother actually moved to the farthest place away she could in the state just out of vindictiveness against her ex-husband. Luckily, the father was able to maintain a decent relationship as the kids got older.

Anyway, to flip it back to your son. . .the repercussions of not paying child support are serious - the most serious being jail. If he can't make it, he should get familiar with the courts and how to petition to lower it if he's strapped, not just avoid it altogether.


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## TNgirl232

His employer will also find out if his wages are garnished. This doesn't look good to an employer - if his employ doesn't take responsibility for things in his life, what makes the employer think he will take responsibility for his job?

His only choices are - follow the court order, fight to get the court order changes (which would mean him having more custody and less child support to pay) or sign over all parental rights.


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## turnera

TNgirl232 said:


> Yes you should tell him - he is your son and he needs a good dose of reality - it is not a time to be worrying about his feelings when the child is suffering. I understand your son felt trapped - but he needs to grow up - he had sex with a girl - one of the potential outcomes of that is a baby - one that is dependent upon him. If he wasn't ready for that then his pants should of stayed on. The money should be going to the child - which lives with her.
> 
> Other than that, buying groceries is a good idea.


This is my advice as well. You are his mother. The only person on earth who has the right to tell him what for, for the rest of his life. Teach him what's right, ok? He needs to hear it from you. And if he pulls away and acts like a spoiled child for hearing it...well, maybe that's a life lesson for him, too.


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## swedish

Mommybean said:


> If he does not have custody of the child, he has no business getting that money and metering it out to the mother. It should be going directly to her. If he will not handle it, then she needs to take care of it, even if it means a bit of a wait. If he is using the money as leverage, then he needs to contact the courts and get his visitiation rights in writing, rather than withold money as a bargaining chip. It sounds like both parents really need to grow up and quit behaving like children. They are parents now, and the only one that has a right to act so childish is the baby!


:iagree:

The baby's mother needs to file the necessary paperwork to get this changed.

In the meantime, giving her a grocery voucher to tide them over would be very generous of you and I'm sure appreciated.


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