# Why is my sin greater than his?



## Skyscrapper (Jul 3, 2018)

We have been married for 12 years. I am 34 and he is 40.

He cheated first with several people (several times), no remorse or explanation even up today 8 -10 years later.

I felt trapped and I was a woman scorned. Had an EA for 2 years with his married bf that turned into a PA and ended it immediately after we slept together.

He found out about it a year later and 7 years later it's still the "highlight" of our "relationship".

Everything, I mean everything comes down to the fact that I cheated on him. What I am failing to understand is why my horrible choices are greater than his. I have told him we should go our separate ways but he does not want to. He thinks that I want to leave because there is someone else yet that's not the case.

Can someone explain to me why he believes his indiscretions are better than mine. I want to help him heal but I get pissed off when I think of his cheating which he has never owned up to.


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## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

You need to sit him down, write down all his infidelity, write down yours and tell him that the mind and blame game stops now or there is nothing left to save. tell him for someone who cheated, did he stop to think of the impact on you. Yours was probably a revenge affair. If he is not willing to go to counseling with you to work through it, then it is over.
I suspect he holds this over you because you allow him to and because of your guilt he gets away with it. You have to fight your corner.

it also appears he cheated much earlier in the relationship. When did you cheat? he might have difficulty dealing with that because he decided to mend his ways and settle into a committed monogamous relationship this has now put a spanner in the works so to speak. He needs to know that his cheating and the rug sweeping did irreparable damage and these are the consequences.


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## Wolf1974 (Feb 19, 2014)

Cheater is cheater in my book. You are both the same but you did it with his BF? Just wow 😮


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## Skyscrapper (Jul 3, 2018)

@aine, I cheated when he was still cheating. That's doesn't justify what I did I should just have walked away instead to resorting to that.

He blames his cheating days to being young and clueless. wWhen I try to find out more he brings up my cheating and I just back off.

He is refusing to go for counselling. He calls me names and weirdly it doesn't hurt me anymore. I actually feel sorry for him because he sounds so angry and bitter. It tears me apart to know that its beacause of what i did. I just don't know how to help him heal yet I am also tired of it all.

We have a multi million business and I have offered him my shares, resign from my position....and just walk away with nothing. He refused that, told me that I want to embarass him further by leaving him. 

We have a 5 year old who is now asking why his dad is always mad at me all the time. I am at my wits end....


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## Skyscrapper (Jul 3, 2018)

@Wolf1974, I know. The fact that it was his by drives him insane.


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## BluesPower (Mar 27, 2018)

Skyscrapper said:


> We have been married for 12 years. I am 34 and he is 40.
> 
> He cheated first with several people (several times), no remorse or explanation even up today 8 -10 years later.
> 
> ...


This is really complicated for a lot of reasons. 

1) I was his friend.
2) He got what he deserved and he does not like it. 
3) He still does not want to own what he did.

The friend thing is obvious. It is a double betrayal. 

But overall, it has more to do with how you and he handled his cheating from the start. 

You guys rug swept what happened in the past. And, if you dealt with it at all, neither of you were successful in the long run or you would not have had the revenge affair. 

But understand this, you don't need his permission to divorce him. What you did was wrong, but IMHO def not worse. Some will disagree, but for me it is payback. And lots of cheaters HATE when it happens to them, it is just the way that it is.

Here is the thing... YOU need to man up so to speak. You need to get mean basically. 

You tell him to back the F*** of and take his medicine. He cheated and now he knows what it feels like. So if he wants to deal with his cheating and your cheating then you guys can do that, but if not then you are filing for divorce. 

Now, if you decide to stay together the you are both going to have to deal with what you have done. 

Don't get men wrong, I don't condone what you did, but it is different in some why because of his cheating. Some will disagree and that is fine, but it is different. 

Frankly, if you want to divorce the just do it. But he and the way that he handled his cheating is wrong. 

You both have to own, for real, what you have done. You can't allow yourself to feel like your sin is better than his and he sure cannot this his is better. 

Both of you have to get real with each other, and if you cant it is better to end the marriage....


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## Lostinthought61 (Nov 5, 2013)

Would you describe your relationship as healthy? Even outside of cheating?


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## Skyscrapper (Jul 3, 2018)

@BluesPower I hear you but divorcing him when he is soo broken and hurting...it feels so cold. I feel like I am leaving a man down. What I already feel is unexplainable. It seems as if he is walking around with a knife in his back and divorcing him now will be taking out that knife and stabbing him again.


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## Skyscrapper (Jul 3, 2018)

To be honest no.


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## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

Skyscrapper said:


> @BluesPower I hear you but divorcing him when he is soo broken and hurting...it feels so cold. I feel like I am leaving a man down. What I already feel is unexplainable. It seems as if he is walking around with a knife in his back and divorcing him now will be taking out that knife and stabbing him again.



He is able to cheat, treat you like **** and then when you give him some of his own medicine he is a whining *****. Tell him he needs to shape or or out. Go see a lawyer to see how you would deal with the business and then have him served, if that doesn't wake him up then nothing will.

He is wallowing in resentment which is poisonous to the marriage, he needs to clean up that ****. you have to take a much tougher stance instead of treating him like a little boy when he has a tantrum. He knifed you in the back, you gave him back what he deserved, so follow through. If he isn't going to be a man and take charge of his family, then you are better off without him. 

You need to go and see an IC to get some perspective on how you are handling things too. Why would you act like a mother to a man who has treated you like **** and is still treating you like ****. I would hand you the knife from his back.
He can obviously dish it out but not take it.
Ask him to come here and we will give him some perspective.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

*Both of your infidelity discretions are equally bad! One does not outrank the other! You're both deemed to be guilty as charged!

Having said that, if neither of you submit to try some hard, "in-your-face" joint marriage counseling with a hard-a$$ counselor, then I see nothing even vaguely on the horizon that would begin to save this union!

Just saying!!*


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## BigToe (Jun 2, 2011)

If we isolate the issue to comparison of affairs, I think the fact that you had an affair with his best friend does qualify as a "greater sin" than his. Not only did two people close to him betray him, there's some ego involved with knowing his best friend now knows you sexually and has had your body. As well, there's no anonymity protection to buffer knowledge of your affair between common friends should his former best friend decide to talk to them about the experience he had with you.

Not saying this justifies any behaviors he now exhibits, just answering your question.


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## dreamer2017 (Nov 7, 2017)

Dear Skyscrapper,

I’m sorry you found yourself in this terrible situation. I believe that you have engaged in a non-productive activity as a woman scorned. I agree with Wolf, you chose to commit adultery but went a step further by using his best friend as a tool for revenge.

Your husband is not innocent; he started this division by having multiple affairs. I recommend IC for the both of you and following with MC. You must determine what is it that you want and then pursue it. If you want to save your marriage, you must NOT have any contact with your AF. Also, find someone who can mediate a conversation between (maybe your pastor) you and your husband. The mediator must be a person you both respect and trust who can help the both of you navigate through these tumultuous times. 

You and your husband must own up and take responsibility of each of your actions if you want the marriage to survive. It can be saved if the desire to invest the time and commitment toward the healing of oneself and the marriage. Both must be fully invested.

Best 
Dreamer


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## personofinterest (Apr 6, 2018)

No your sin isn't greater than his. Nor is it really lesser. But while YOU seem to have been willing to be honest and take the brunt of his "behaviors," he refuses to own HIS stuff.

THAT makes him pretty crappy, IMO.


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## karole (Jun 30, 2010)

Skyscrapper said:


> @aine, I cheated when he was still cheating. That's doesn't justify what I did I should just have walked away instead to resorting to that.
> 
> He blames his cheating days to being young and clueless. wWhen I try to find out more he brings up my cheating and I just back off.
> 
> ...


If you do that, you will regret it (walk away with nothing).


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## michzz (Jun 6, 2008)

Disengage from the drama and look at your situation.

You need to protect your kid from your toxic relationship.

I recommend individual counselling for yourself.

Testing for STDs.

Consult with a lawyer. Consider a divorce

Protect yourself financially for the sake of your child

Move out

At this point, who cares if he tells you how awful he feels. You do too, so there are no winners or losers here.

Protect your kid. Live well.

Do no more harm.


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## BluesPower (Mar 27, 2018)

Skyscrapper said:


> @BluesPower I hear you but divorcing him when he is soo broken and hurting...it feels so cold. I feel like I am leaving a man down. What I already feel is unexplainable. It seems as if he is walking around with a knife in his back and divorcing him now will be taking out that knife and stabbing him again.


Listen, I have been on both sides of this issue. I understand his feelings to an extent. 

But here is the problem, while what you did is hurtful, and very wrong, what he did is just as wrong and since it was multiple times i guess that his may be worse, whatever. 

But here is the deal, he is a puss, and he is not a man. If you do the crime the you better be prepared to do the time. 

He cheated, he got some frequent good strange and he loved it. He got caught and both of you swept it under the rug. But we all know that THAT is what he wanted. 

You go out and get laid, and confess and he is butt hurt? Put him on this forum, i will give him an earful. 

Now if both of you, especially him, can pull your **** together, and start some conseling with a good counseler fine. 

I know he is hurting, but you don't have to put up with this crap. He needs to man up, that is the deal...


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## BarbedFenceRider (Mar 30, 2018)

Skyscrapper said:


> @aine, I cheated when he was still cheating. That's doesn't justify what I did I should just have walked away instead to resorting to that.
> 
> He blames his cheating days to being young and clueless. wWhen I try to find out more he brings up my cheating and I just back off.
> 
> ...


Co-dependancy nightmare!!! You need IC like right away. And then you need to get away from each other. For the kids sake. What a disaster. Never in any of the posts did you mention love. Nope. Its done. You are just living together and ruining a small kids life while at it. nice.


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## Broken_in_Brooklyn (Feb 21, 2013)

He was a jerk to you and now you have paid him back with a memory he will never forget. You don't need his permission to remove the knife from his back, it's not like you asked him to stand still when you stabbed him.

Just end it. You don't need his permission to divorce. Just do it.


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## Ynot (Aug 26, 2014)

Skyscrapper said:


> @aine, I cheated when he was still cheating. That's doesn't justify what I did I should just have walked away instead to resorting to that.
> 
> He blames his cheating days to being young and clueless. wWhen I try to find out more he brings up my cheating and I just back off.
> 
> ...


He blames his cheating on his being young and clueless. But you are younger than he is and was younger still when you cheated? Wow. just wow.

Here is an idea, if he won't go to counseling, you need to go by your self. 

While there was no good excuse for you to cheat, the fact that he won't or can't come to terms with it speaks volumes about your marriage. Your son deserves to see at least one happy parent. If you can't resolve this matter, you owe it to your son to divorce his father. There is NOTHING to stop you from legally surrendering your shares in the company, resigning your position and starting a new and hopefully better life (free of cheating of course, regardless of the reason)


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## Skyscrapper (Jul 3, 2018)

I am reading all your comments and it helps to see things from all different angles.

For starters I am going to look for a counsellor and get into IC. Reading this thread has shown me I have some serious issues to deal with. It's like I am reading someone's story. What kind of person sleeps with their husband's, married best friend? Did I mention that I actually knew his wife very well. We would actually do some stuff together. Who the heck does such? 

I am not in touch with the affair partner and I got rid of the male friends I had many years ago.

Someone mentioned that I never said that I love my husband in my post, I do love him and I believe he does love me too. 

He started our business, it was his dream and I worked with him. Initially it was 100% his and then he gave me 90% of his shares. That's why I wanted to give them back. He gave me those shares 2 years after his D Day. Hence I just don't feel comfortable taking that away from him. Sleep with his friend, and take away his company as well? I cannot do that.


I will get in IC, start putting my financial affairs in order. I will speak to him again about attending MC and if that fails.... I file. I don't believe in filing in order to wake him up. When I file, it means we are done, no turning back.


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## tech-novelist (May 15, 2014)

Skyscrapper said:


> I am reading all your comments and it helps to see things from all different angles.
> 
> For starters I am going to look for a counsellor and get into IC. Reading this thread has shown me I have some serious issues to deal with. It's like I am reading someone's story. What kind of person sleeps with their husband's, married best friend? Did I mention that I actually knew his wife very well. We would actually do some stuff together. Who the heck does such?
> 
> ...


I think you should keep some of the shares even if you divorce. Not 90%, but maybe 25%? You will need something to live on if you divorce.

But it would be better to reconcile if each of you can forgive the other. I don't see that either of you is entirely to blame.


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## colingrant (Nov 6, 2017)

Skyscrapper said:


> We have been married for 12 years. I am 34 and he is 40.
> 
> He cheated first with several people (several times), no remorse or explanation even up today 8 -10 years later.
> 
> ...


It's not. Refuse his words, reduce his influence on you immediately and do what you have to do.


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## TAMAT (Jun 20, 2015)

skyscraper,

Your sin is not worse than his, except that cheaters hate being cheated on, possibly because he lost rather than you.

Your H sound like a serial cheater who has a hard time handling blame, being married to a serial cheater is hell so I understand why you did what you did. 

A few things you can do.

You will not recover as long as your H is still keeping detail of the affairs secret from you, I suggest you make your H take a polygraph, before that have him write out a timeline for the affairs. Do the same for your affair. 

Contact the Hs or SOs of your Hs affair partners, the exposure will make him less likely to have an affair in the future. Also apologize to your affair partners W. 

Tamat


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

Skyscrapper said:


> We have been married for 12 years. I am 34 and he is 40.
> 
> He cheated first with several people (several times), no remorse or explanation even up today 8 -10 years later.
> 
> ...


How about your sin's against that man's wife? I guess you never thought of her at all, looks like you still don't. Like she was gum on the bottom or your shoe or something huh? Gross.



> What kind of person sleeps with their husband's, married best friend? Did I mention that I actually knew his wife very well. We would actually do some stuff together. Who the heck does such?


Not a good one. You took all the hurt you had and just vomited it on some innocent women. If they had kids they will suffer too. Let me tell you something, when my Dad cheated on my Mom for next 3 years my Mom spent most nights on the phone crying to her girlfriend. That was between the ages of 7-10 for me. I practically raised myself. My Dad's other women secretary helped contribute to that fact. It affected my whole entire life, I'm sure. That's what you did.

I don't think you cheated on your marriage because you vows were broken but how you could contribute to the same damage to another human being that was done to you is just plain inexplicable. You let your husband's evil taint you. So in some ways you sin is greater because you had no excuse you know how it feels. It's at least just as bad, not because you did the same thing to him, but because you did the same thing to an innocent person, her.


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## Skyscrapper (Jul 3, 2018)

How about your sin's against that man's wife? I guess you never thought of her at all, looks like you still don't. Like she was gum on the bottom or your shoe or something huh? Gross.



> What kind of person sleeps with their husband's, married best friend? Did I mention that I actually knew his wife very well. We would actually do some stuff together. Who the heck does such?


Not a good one. You took all the hurt you had and just vomited it on some innocent women. If they had kids they will suffer too. Let me tell you something, when my Dad cheated on my Mom for next 3 years my Mom spent most nights on the phone crying to her girlfriend. That was between the ages of 7-10 for me. I practically raised myself. My Dad's other women secretary helped contribute to that fact. It affected my whole entire life, I'm sure. That's what you did.

I don't think you cheated on your marriage because you vows were broken but how you could contribute to the same damage to another human being that was done to you is just plain inexplicable. You let your husband's evil taint you. So in some ways you sin is greater because you had no excuse you know how it feels. It's at least just as bad, not because you did the same thing to him, but because you did the same thing to an innocent person, her.[/QUOTE]


Sokillme thank you, thank you for bringing this up. You are right, I never really thought about her. Yet she is the innocent party in all this.

I read your comment 3hrs ago i have cried several times and my hands are still shaking. I never gave her much thought in all these years. I justified that her husband was responsible for her not me. Wow, it was a double betrayal for her.

My dad cheated on my Mum and I know first hand what it did to her, to us. Yet here I am, the OW....

The thought of contacting her to be honest is scaring the hell out of me. What would I say to her?


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## TAMAT (Jun 20, 2015)

Just give her the truth you were lucky enough to get.

Do her that favor, don't be the bystander who turns a blind eye.

Don't minimize or omit just do it.

And do the same favor for your Hs OWHs or SOs.

It's like returning stolen money.

Tamat


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## oldtruck (Feb 15, 2018)

Broken_in_Brooklyn said:


> He was a jerk to you and now you have paid him back with a memory he will never forget. You don't need his permission to remove the knife from his back, it's not like you asked him to stand still when you stabbed him.
> 
> Just end it. You don't need his permission to divorce. Just do it.


Not to say any affair is worse than another.
Though when a wife has RA with her husbands friend.
That is not getting even that is getting one better.
Having an RA is getting even.

Anyway this WH/BH needs IC.


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## Ursula (Dec 2, 2016)

Skyscrapper said:


> @aine, I cheated when he was still cheating. That's doesn't justify what I did I should just have walked away instead to resorting to that.
> 
> He blames his cheating days to being young and clueless. wWhen I try to find out more he brings up my cheating and I just back off.
> 
> ...


There is so much wrong here, I don't even know where to start. His cheating was wrong and so was yours. It's wrong of him to hold it over your head and manipulate you that way though, especially if he refuses to acknowledge what he did. If he's 40 and cheated 8-10 years ago, that would put him at 30-32 when he cheated. Hardly young and clueless; more like old enough to know better. And yes, you were too, but you seem willing and able to acknowledge your part in things.

Rug sweeping causes irreparable damage in relationships. He refuses to go with you to talk to someone to help save the relationship. This isn't good because it shows that he has no interest in trying to save the marriage. You guys will need help with this; it's not something that you can fix yourself. 

He calls you names, which doesn't bother you anymore. This tells me that you also are starting to not care about the marriage. How do I know this? Been there, gone through that, and getting back to giving a damn is really hard if not impossible.

If you take one thing only from my post, let it be this: this is in NO WAY, all your fault. Partly, yes, but he has 50% ownership in it too.

As for your multi-million dollar business, did you help to build it to where it is today? If so, you deserve and are legally entitled to half of that business. You're also legally entitled to half of the life that you guys have built over the years. DO NOT walk away with nothing. Fight for what is yours, otherwise he wins, and will laugh all the way to the bank. He needs to be held accountable for the things that he did, too.

As for your child, make sure that your disagreements with your H aren't within your son's earshot. He doesn't need to hear it, and kids have a way of internalizing and thinking that things are all their fault. You don't want him to have to deal with that. I don't have kids myself, but if I did, they wouldn't have been brought into the demise of my marriage.


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## Ursula (Dec 2, 2016)

Skyscrapper said:


> @BluesPower I hear you but divorcing him when he is soo broken and hurting...it feels so cold. I feel like I am leaving a man down. What I already feel is unexplainable. It seems as if he is walking around with a knife in his back and divorcing him now will be taking out that knife and stabbing him again.


Because he's acting like the only thing he is, is a victim. That's not the case; you're both victims of cheating, and you've both cheated. @BluesPower had a good post: you both need to own up to your faults, and if that doesn't happen, it's probably better to separate.


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

Skyscrapper said:


> How about your sin's against that man's wife? I guess you never thought of her at all, looks like you still don't. Like she was gum on the bottom or your shoe or something huh? Gross.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


If you are contacting her to make your self feel better. DON'T. Frankly part of your punishment is living with it. I doubt anything you say will make her feel better. Dude you never thought of her in all this time huh? Something is wrong don't you think? It shouldn't take some harsh words from a stranger on the internet to actually think of how your actions affect innocent people. 

Your relationship is toxic and it's made you toxic. If he is still cheating you need to divorce him and work on becoming a better person away from this person who helped turn off your empathy. Your kids are watching you.


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## hoblob (Mar 28, 2018)

Did he cheat or have affairs? Like one night stands vs long term relationship.
I mean a 2 year affair is a damn long time. Why are you guys still married.
I can tell you that she cheated (1 week long) and I had a couple of encounters. I would say neither of us were emotionally invested and both young (also not married) and 8 years later, her betrayal, because it was longer, still annoys me. Also, she had sex with another man and I think us lizard brain men get annoyed at that..honestly also all the lies. I think double cheating relationships are hard. You have to recommit. You both know you can’t trust them 100%.


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## Decorum (Sep 7, 2012)

If you both cannot forgive then staying together is foolish.

You are not trapped, but do not walk away with nothing.

If you want to make an equtable split I think that is enough.

You say if you file you are done.

Thats your call.

It seems unlikely he will have any personal epiphany before divorce.

What are you waiting for?


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## ABHale (Jan 3, 2016)

It’s just in the way guys view their SO cheating on them. 

It’s a hit at the core of who we are as a man. 

Right or wrong men and women view being cheated on differently.


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## hoblob (Mar 28, 2018)

ABHale said:


> It’s just in the way guys view their SO cheating on them.
> 
> It’s a hit at the core of who we are as a man.
> 
> Right or wrong men and women view being cheated on differently.


That may be true, but especially when it’s your friend. It’s an insane betrayal because you know everything about them. Also 2?years meant she had real feelings for him. This is gonna be tough to get over.


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## personofinterest (Apr 6, 2018)

Lol at the men who think one affair trumps serial cheating.


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## ABHale (Jan 3, 2016)

personofinterest said:


> Lol at the men who think one affair trumps serial cheating.


No it doesn’t. It’s wrong on both sides the same. 

Revenge affair is no answer either. 

Like op said, she should have left when she caught him.


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## Mrs. John Adams (Nov 23, 2013)

The thing that glares at me from this thread is this one. If you are truly sorry for what you have done...you would not be worrying about who committed the worst infidelity. It is all wrong...and in this story...neither of you has taken responsibility for the choices you made. 

You only have control of one person...you. If you are sorry for what you have done...if you hold yourself accountable...then you will do everything in your power to explore how you made the choice to cheat...and try to become a better person. The same thing goes for your husband. I realize he cheated first...but he did not MAKE you cheat. You cheated because you wanted to. So this is reality...you both cheated...you are both broken....and you both need to hold yourselves accountable for what you have done and not worry about justifying your behavior by measuring one against the other. 

You both need to read the book how to help your spouse heal from your infidelity by Linda McDonald....and not just friends by Shirley glass. You both need to go to therapy...separately...and together....and you both need to stop lying to yourselves and to each other and hold yourselves accountable for your choices to cheat.

You cannot repair a broken marriage until you both are willing to be accountable and honest ...and to stop blame shifting. Reconciliation begins with transparency....and the first step in transparency is truth. You cannot reconcile a broken relationship alone. You both have be willing to do whatever is necessary to help the other one feel safe in the relationship again....and step one is self accountability...no excuses, no reasons, no blame shifting....looking in the mirror and being completely honest with yourself....


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## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

Skyscrapper said:


> I am reading all your comments and it helps to see things from all different angles.
> 
> For starters I am going to look for a counsellor and get into IC. Reading this thread has shown me I have some serious issues to deal with. It's like I am reading someone's story. What kind of person sleeps with their husband's, married best friend? Did I mention that I actually knew his wife very well. We would actually do some stuff together. Who the heck does such?
> 
> ...


1. I guess you also put some work into the company or at least supported him domestically while he was working those long days, so you are entitled to something, maybe not 90%
2. Good you are getting IC, it will give you clarity
3. You cannot change your WH, you can only change yourself, maybe when he sees your changes he will change and want to step up and be a leader in your home
4. It was very low to sleep with his friend and more so stab his wife in the back, that shows alot about your character. I hope his wife knows what a lowlife her H is too?
5. Get your financial affairs in order, protect your kid and see how it goes but get your ducks in a row


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## Vinnydee (Jan 4, 2016)

There is no sin. Both of you went against your marriage vows and the degree does not matter at all. I is like saying I killed someone with one shot and it took you three. End result the same. There was a good article in Psychology today that explained how to tell if someone will not cheat again. The prime thing was that the cheater acknowledge full responsibility and not say he or she was driven to it. Without that the odds of handling future problems by cheating is greater than normal. Revenge cheating always makes things worse and I would be surprised if you two are married for much longer, sad to say. Marriage is difficult enough without the things you two are doing.

This is coming from a moral person who is an Atheist and lived most of his 46 years of marriage in a poly triad with a woman my wife and I both loved since we were teens. So we are not prudes or against sex with others. We are against deception and lying which we never did in our marriage. And people said we were immoral but those people all divorced due to cheating, some more than once or twice.


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## Wolfman1968 (Jun 9, 2011)

Cheating is wrong either way. Equally wrong on either side, so neither is "the worse sin". 

However, there are circumstances in which one type of cheating may be more damaging to the marriage than a different one. You say you had two years of an EA, followed by a PA (and you don't say how long), with his married best friend. However, you don't give any details about his cheating. 

Some people are more willing to try to reconcile over a One Night Stand cheat than over a long-term affair which involves a lot of lying, deception, and often mistreatment or denigration of the spouse or marriage. So, without additional details, we can't say if there are additional circumstances that are particularly damaging to the marriage. 

If his cheats were One Night Stands of some women he picked up in a bar and never contacted again, it could be argued that although the cheating is equally wrong on both sides, a prolonged EA and then a PA which I assume would be of some duration would be more damaging to the relationship and his psyche. To top it off, the destruction of his relationship with his friend is an additional level of betrayal. Furthermore, was there some level of disparagement of your husband or marriage with your affair partner ("my husband treats me badly", "he's no good in bed", "he's a loser", "his manhood is tiny", etc.)? If so, this could add another layer of destruction that is hard to recover from. Or did you treat your husband badly, deny him sex, etc. while you were involved with your affair partner (a situation commonly seen in such situations). 

*So, unless his cheating was with YOUR best friend and of similar or longer duration, or unless he treated you badly or denied you sex during his cheating, your husband's and your cheating may be equally "wrong", but NOT equally damaging to the marriage or your partner's self-esteem/sense of identity/social worth.*


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## Adelais (Oct 23, 2013)

Adultery is adultery. There is no "greater" sin once both of you do it. It is done. 

Stick a fork in it, get a divorce and next time divorce a man who cheats on you instead of becoming just like him.

However, my opinion as a human, and not God, I would say that your cheating with his BF is worse than his cheating. At least he didn't do it with your BF.


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## oldtruck (Feb 15, 2018)

ABHale said:


> It’s just in the way guys view their SO cheating on them.
> 
> It’s a hit at the core of who we are as a man.
> 
> Right or wrong men and women view being cheated on differently.


Add to that a man cannot get pregnant. A WW can. No man wants to raise the
OM's OC.

So add to the fear of a WW cheating, then add to the fact that the RA was a
double betrayal, she did her husbands best friend.

Though all that must be put aside for all they have done for seven years is
to rug sweep. Rug sweeping is allowing the wound to never get cleaned so
it will heal.

They both need IC do deal with the original PA and the RA. Otherwise they
will stay where they are forever.


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## Skyscrapper (Jul 3, 2018)

Thank you for all your responses. I have found a counsellor and made my first appointment. Unfortunately I am currently away on business otherwise I would have gone today. I have discussed how broken I am. I will be keeping you posted....


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## personofinterest (Apr 6, 2018)

ABHale said:


> It’s just in the way guys view their SO cheating on them.
> 
> It’s a hit at the core of who we are as a man.
> 
> Right or wrong men and women view being cheated on differently.


They may view it differently. That does NOT mean they are different morally.

No, it doesn't.


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## bluelily (Jul 10, 2018)

Have told OM's wife ? She deserves to know, BS got gaslighted all the time and this truth will be painful but gives her some clarity. Again, she DESERVES to know. Are you still friends with her ?


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## ABHale (Jan 3, 2016)

personofinterest said:


> They may view it differently. That does NOT mean they are different morally.
> 
> No, it doesn't.


It’s wrong no matter who it is. Gender doesn’t make any difference.


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## x598 (Nov 14, 2012)

OP

ever look up the term sociopath? they are people unable to have any empathy or feelings for the people around them (one of the traits anyway).

in other words.....your husband can **** all over you....but when it happens to him.....its the end of the world.

it gets worse, they are so self righteous, even when they do crappy things to people they lack a conscience and their behavior wont bother them a bit (explains why your sins are bigger than his).

I dated one...huge mistake on my part........ there is no fixing this on your end. your very successful business may make it worse stoking his ego and entrenching his views.

i wish i had good advice for you...i dont.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

arbitrator said:


> *Both of your infidelity discretions are equally bad! One does not outrank the other! You're both deemed to be guilty as charged!
> 
> Having said that, if neither of you submit to try some hard, "in-your-face" joint marriage counseling with a hard-a$$ counselor, then I see nothing even vaguely on the horizon that would begin to save this union!
> 
> Just saying!!*


I think on simple math alone, he is leading with a score of 3 to 1.

Of course, his BF might skew the final score, but no more than 3 goals to 2.

In an ideal world, they both shouldn't have cheated, but I have sympathy for a revenge cheater. My own perspective, you see, tends to colour my judgement somewhat.


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## MaiChi (Jun 20, 2018)

Your marriage died a while back and you both attended the funeral and put closure to it. If you do want to carry on, you really need to start again from scratch and look at yourselves with as much honesty as you can get between you. You may actually conclude that it cannot work. If he gets someone else he knows its hard to find anyone who is as carefree about his cheating as you have been. Examine his parents and you may find you are very similar to his mother and he is similar to his dad. 

If they cheated on each other and stayed together, he is expecting you to stay. He will always cheat and you will most likely cheat too.


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## jsmart (Mar 14, 2015)

Something doesn't seem right with this story. You said your husband cheated multiple times but you don't elaborate on this. Were these ONS with some skank he met at a bar and never spoke with again? Were these and EA or PA that last months/years with I Love U's exchanged and sex involved. Were they just woman that he was rapping to and maybe took it kissing petting but didn't go sexual but you assume he closed the deal with?

The reason I feel it doesn't sound logical is because for your husband to be so afraid to lose you but supposedly be some serial cheating ladies man doesn't jive. A player type of guy would've replaced you quickly and to be honest wouldn't really care after dumping you because they never really get attached to any woman.

As for you, the affair lasting years with his friend, is really jacked up. Takes a lot of plotting to sneak around for 2 years on not only your husband but your supposed friend, the BW. 

Which is worse? Hard to tell but the fact that you've emotionally detached from your husband after you gave your heart to OM should be taken into account. You say you love your husband but your actions of being wiling to walk away instead of wanting to fight for the family is telling.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Skyscrapper said:


> We have been married for 12 years. I am 34 and he is 40.
> 
> He cheated first with several people (several times), no remorse or explanation even up today 8 -10 years later.
> 
> ...


The problem you have is that you have an uneven relationship. Somewhere along the way you became the person to let yourself be walked all over and he became the person who ran things.

This translated into the affair issue as well. That's up to you to deal with. My first suggestion is get into therapy and take a deep hard look at yourself and why you accept what I suspect is mental abuse.


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## Shipwrecked (Jul 9, 2018)

In research study after research study, over many years and many countries, it has been shown that men find it extremely hard to forgive a partner’s physical (sexual) affair. 
Men were much more likely than women to forgive an emotional affair but a partner’s sexual infidelity ended in divorce almost 3/4 of the time. 

Which is one good reason why he can’t forgive or forget that you and his bf had sex.


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## Shipwrecked (Jul 9, 2018)

Men don’t view emotional affairs the same way women do. 
A husband tells a wife he’s been having an affair and she will always ask “Do you love her?”
A woman telling her husband she’s been seeing another man, his first words “Did you sleep with him?” 

Anthropologists’ believe this is because the only way ancient man could be certain a child was his was to keep other men away from his companion. 
Men however appear to have always had the desire for variety and to ‘spread their DNA’. 
Females, on the other hand, have always tended to seek an emotional connection with sexual partners. Assumption being if there is that connection the male is more likely to stay around after a child is born and help protect and care for it. 

Hence - modern day - (generalization) Men don’t feel sexual infidelity is that huge a crime if they don’t care about their partner, just did it for the sex etc. 
Also why a woman can be extremely close with a male friend but as long as it isn’t sexual and doesn’t appear physical to spouse, many husbands don’t care too much.


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## Shipwrecked (Jul 9, 2018)

Your emotional affair - can you give an idea of what you did - did you go on dates? Go on vacations together? Take a lot of time away from spouses to be with each other? Spend a lot of money on gifts for each other? 
How long did the physical affair continue?

I agree with whoever earlier here said your husband’s behavior sounds very odd. Sociopathic was suggested. I definitely think Narcissistic.


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## Skyscrapper (Jul 3, 2018)

I will address some of the questions that are being continually asked.

The OM wife knows, two days after my husband found out, he forced the OM to tell his wife. I don't know what the OM told her. We have never been in contact with the OM or his wife since then.

As I said on my initial post, I don't know if he had one night stands or relationships. The evidence I found lean towards hit and run. He never talks about it except to cite that he was young and stupid. 

I was on friendly terms with the OM and my husband knew that. I said it was a 2 year old EA because I don't know exactly at what point did we stop being just friends and when the flirting kicked in. I slept with him once and the day after I cut off ties with him. I would still see him at functions or when he came over to our house and just acted as if nothing ever happened.

My husband found out a year later after i had ended it when he was setting up my emails on my phone. He retrieved some of my deleted chats and the cat was out of the bag.

I did not withhold sex.

I did not tell the OM that I loved him.

I never went for a date, vacation or buy gifts for the OM.

I don't think that my husband still cheats. I think he stopped around 7 years ago. If he is not at work, he is at home. He only goes out when he is meeting clients. He does not have friends or a social life.

Someone said my story said
doesn't add up. A serial player would have replaced me by now and I get that. To be honest, he would move heaven and earth for me and at the same time do what he does....and also do not get it. 

We are currently out of the country and will attend my first IC session when we come back in a month's time.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Skyscrapper said:


> @BluesPower I hear you but divorcing him when he is soo broken and hurting...it feels so cold. I feel like I am leaving a man down. What I already feel is unexplainable. It seems as if he is walking around with a knife in his back and divorcing him now will be taking out that knife and stabbing him again.


Keep in mind that he has had no problem stabbing you in the back over and over again cheating. And now he's using the blaming you as another way to stab you. He knows that you feel guilt and is using your guilt against you.

Note that he feels not guilt. That's why he can use your guilt as a weapon against you. He feels entitled. You are giving him all the power.

It's your guilt that is trapping you with the idea that you are doing something horrible to him by looking out for yourself. Do you really think that treating him like some poor victim is helping him? The best thing you could do for him is to teach him that there are strong consequences for his cheating and for him using your guilt to hide behind.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Skyscrapper said:


> Someone said my story said doesn't add up. A serial player would have replaced me by now and I get that. To be honest, he would move heaven and earth for me and at the same time do what he does....and also do not get it.


Why do you think that if he was a serial player/cheater he would have replaced you by now? That's not true at all. A lot of serial players do not want to lose their spouse. They just want to play on the side.

I've been married to both men, both of whom turned out to be serial players, neither of them wanted a divorce and tried to get me to not divorce them.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Shipwrecked said:


> Men don’t view emotional affairs the same way women do.
> A husband tells a wife he’s been having an affair and she will always ask “Do you love her?”
> A woman telling her husband she’s been seeing another man, his first words “Did you sleep with him?”


Men pretend to care, to get sex.

Women pretend to want to have sex, to get the emotion.


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## Adelais (Oct 23, 2013)

EleGirl said:


> Keep in mind that he has had no problem stabbing you in the back over and over again cheating. And now he's using the blaming you as another way to stab you. He knows that you feel guilt and is using your guilt against you.
> 
> Note that he feels not guilt. That's why he can use your guilt as a weapon against you. He feels entitled. You are giving him all the power.
> 
> It's your guilt that is trapping you with the idea that you are doing something horrible to him by looking out for yourself. Do you really think that treating him like some poor victim is helping him? The best thing you could do for him is to teach him that there are strong consequences for his cheating and for him using your guilt to hide behind.


Like x 1,000. Op. Read this post over and over until you have internalized it.


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## Shipwrecked (Jul 9, 2018)

@turnera so true.

I can give a reason why a woman would be more likely to have an affair with someone she already knows - Women seek am emotional attachment before moving to physical relationship. (Again - study results, your results may vary). 
Men prefer to have sexual relationship before they form an emotional attachment.
Hence her escalation of what began as two social friends/acquaintances chatting, becoming more comfortable with one another. Even if her husband knew, at least in the beginning, he probably wouldn’t have cared. As I mentioned, men tend to ignore emotional connections. 

Her husband was neither young nor clueless. That excuse is reserved for those under 22 (25 if we’re being generous).
Husband was actively seeking new exciting sexual experiences with women other than his wife. For whatever reason, he didn’t want to lose his marriage but he wanted to sample what was out there. 

They had their D-Day when he unloaded his guilt on her, felt he had cleaned his conscience and everything was over and done. In the past. Let’s move on. But they never discussed his betrayal, she never got to grieve or expend her anger. She never got details or the why or who? 
I’ve been there. You bury it. Ignore it. Pretend it doesn’t bother you as time passes. But in your subconscious it lingers, festers. Eats at your confidence, self-esteem, security, trust. Relationships lose intimacy, feelings aren’t shared. Distance can grow. Resentment grows tho you may not realize it. A general dissatisfaction. A bit of loneliness even when together. 
Infidelity needs to be brought into the open and discussed. 
Sounds as if OPs husband was trying everything to show her he was a great husband, a reformed cheater. A subtle reminder daily of his betrayals.
I don’t believe OP ever meant to have an affair. I think she still had unresolved emotional pain that was unconsciously impacting her marriage. 
She never said who made the first move to begin the emotional affair. Who invited whom for coffee, or emailed first.

Whatever it was - what she did is no way as damaging or hurtful as her husband’s infidelities. 
He actively sought out ‘strange’ over an extended period of time with an unknown number of women and kept this secret from his wife. That is if one is to believe his ‘confession’, which gave no real details nor was it discussed. He might have had longer relationships with women; might have told them I love you’; if he travelled they could have been a travelling companion. 
OR if they were ONS, he was having sex with strangers and coming home and having sex with his wife, exposing her to all sorts of diseases (even if he used a condom), which shows no respect for his wife. 
His wife was seeking emotional support in the beginning (I am guessing, and it escalated).
Husband was looking to get laid. 
Now his masculinity has suffered a mortal blow. And she is suffering now because he acts as if he’s been stabbed in the back? Did he care how many knives he shoved into her back? 
His refusal with his infidelity and now sounds like a narcissism.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Shipwrecked said:


> [MENTION=10436]His wife was seeking emotional support in the beginning (I am guessing, and it escalated).


From her description of the EA, it did not escalate beyond that.


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

Skyscrapper said:


> We have been married for 12 years. I am 34 and he is 40.
> 
> He cheated first with several people (several times), no remorse or explanation even up today 8 -10 years later.
> 
> ...


I think they are pretty much the same at this point with the few facts here. One thing I see is, you think he should feel as you do about the cheating. Two different people will feel differently about the same thing. It apparently hurt him more than his cheating hurt you. I guess he didn't think about that before he cheated. 

I'd say that in and of itself, makes you two incompatible. Consequences suck, but they are always there.


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## Skyscrapper (Jul 3, 2018)

Hi All,

This is going to be a long one...

All of the posters here poinded that I needed to start IC which I did. Funny how most of you hit the nail at the head esp @turnera and Ursula even without knowing the fully story. Unless if one of you is my therapist 🤣🤣🤣.

I told my counsellor that I posted here and you guys advised me to attend IC. After a few sessions she read my post and she liked the fact that the posters here were frank since this would allow me to see everything from different angles. However, she also noted that I had not been completely honest when I posted. I just gave you a sneakview of what transpired but not all of it. She encouraged me to start from the beginning so that you guys can have the full picture. I will try to summarise as much as I can.....

My dad was a walkway and my mum struggled to fend for us. In my teenage years I was taken in by relatives, family friends and at some point by my pastor since my mum could not even afford to stay with me and pay for my education.

I met my spouse when I was 19. When I was 22, a month after we got married I got pregnant. It wasn't part of the plan and to say that I was petrified would be an understatement. I told my spouse and the first thing he uttered was how having a child would ruin my body. He went on about how I always said I didn't want kids, that I would not be able to provide for a child and so on. He used my fears which were based on my childhood exeperiances which I had shared with him against me.

I had just lost my Mum and I felt so alone. I made an appointment for an abortion and he paid for it. The first time I did not go through with it and he told me that I should be prepared to raise that child on my own. I could not bear to put a child what I went through so I made another appointment and went through with the abortion.

He never spoke about it or asked how I was doing. To him it was as if something had never occurred.... he just moved on. I was a wreck, a part of me was lost that day. I didn't tell the few friends I had since it's something that is not acceptable in our circles.

His BF whom I also got along with, picked up something was wrong. He was the only person I told about the abortion and he was supportive.

I realised my spouse was cheating with different people a few months later including escorts as well. When I confronted him he would tell me that I should be grateful that he is "taking care of me". He was verbally abusive and soon it progressed to physical abuse and I just crawled to my little corner. Guess whose shoulder was available for me to cry on...his BF.

That's how the EA started and I slept with him once. One day, after my spouse had punched me in the face I invited the OM to our house. I wanted to humiliate my spouse, take away his pride, hurt his esteem the way he had destroyed mine. Even if he had not found out that I slept with his friend. Looking at my spouse and knowing that I had sex with his friend made me feel like I had gotten even. However, that feeling or way of thought only lasted a 2 years at most. 

The physical abuse stopped but he is still verbally abusive and he now uses my affair as a reason for it.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Good lord! Leave him please!!!


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

P.S. Infidelity is the least of your concerns. You are a victim of continual abuse and need to get out.

Ask your counselor for help to get away from the waste of skin posing as a husband.


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## Taxman (Dec 21, 2016)

I have had one gentleman say it succinctly. He basically told his wife, you have been letting every guy stick it into you for the past ten years. So, why do you begrudge me my one little fling. Oh you were stupid and young? Well I got laid because you were stupid and young. NO other reason. I wanted you to feel the exact same feelings I got. I doubt you can feel anything like that, so just know, usually infidelity is 100% on the cheater. In this case, it is 10000% on you. By the way, the divorce is written up, want to sign?


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## happyhusband0005 (May 4, 2018)

You need to prepare yourself to be on your own and get out and far away. There is no predicting how a boy who would punch his wife in the face will react to losing all power by being served with divorce papers. Find a way to support yourself, surround yourself with a support system of friends and family have your lawyer ready to get a restraining order the second he starts threatening you if possible. If you look for abuse victim support groups you may be directed to resources for abuse victims including attorneys willing to help people in your position for a greatly reduced cost, worth a look. 

Once you get out you will need to continue with counseling to rebuild yourself as an independent person.


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## TJW (Mar 20, 2012)

Skyscrapper said:


> One day, after my spouse had punched me in the face I invited the OM to our house. I wanted to humiliate my spouse, take away his pride, hurt his esteem the way he had destroyed mine. Even if he had not found out that I slept with his friend. Looking at my spouse and knowing that I had sex with his friend made me feel like I had gotten even


To answer your question about "worse", in God's eyes, no one's sin is "worse" than another's. But, a corollary can be found in how the crime of murder is prosecuted.

If someone walks in on his/her spouse cheating, and kills them, it's called a "crime of passion".

If he/she walks away with the knowledge, rehearses it in his/her mind for a week, then goes and kills them, the judgement "malice aforethought" is then applied to the crime description. It was an act of revenge, prompted by vengeance, and not by the emotions of the moment.

Murder as a crime of passion is sometimes reduced in charge to manslaughter, and, in almost every case, a crime of passion will carry a lighter sentence than a "1st degree - malice aforethought" crime.

On the "other side".... violence escalates with time, if nothing is done to intervene. That your husband has "stopped", for now, is meaningless. The most likely future you will have is that he will not only continue his aggression, it will get worse. 

Get out, now. That's my advice.


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## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

Skyscrapper said:


> Hi All,
> 
> This is going to be a long one...
> 
> ...


You WH is a POS, you don't owe him nothing, he did not ever love you. The things he has done to you are vile. He forced you to have an abortion, abused you emotionally and physically, cheated on you, etc. Get rid of him. Divorce him and find a man who will treat you with love and respect. Who cares about his multi million dollar business. He will now have to pay you off anyhow. Is he much older than you? Perhaps he still wants you around as he doesn't want to have to do things for himself and needs a housemaid. Dump him, he deserves it.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

TAMAT said:


> Just give her the truth you were lucky enough to get.
> 
> Do her that favor, don't be the bystander who turns a blind eye.
> 
> ...


Yeah, because transferring her guilt onto that other woman would be really helpful to all concerned, right?

Well, actually, no. Perhaps it wouldn't.

Confession is great under some circumstances.

Perhaps not these circumstances?


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

personofinterest said:


> Lol at the men who think one affair trumps serial cheating.


I am not laughing at them. But I am shaking my head at them.


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## personofinterest (Apr 6, 2018)

Taxman said:


> I have had one gentleman say it succinctly. He basically told his wife, you have been letting every guy stick it into you for the past ten years. So, why do you begrudge me my one little fling. Oh you were stupid and young? Well I got laid because you were stupid and young. NO other reason. I wanted you to feel the exact same feelings I got. I doubt you can feel anything like that, so just know, usually infidelity is 100% on the cheater. In this case, it is 10000% on you. By the way, the divorce is written up, want to sign?


Have you read the OP's thread?


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## TDSC60 (Dec 8, 2011)

You are feeling guilty when thinking about divorcing a husband who has cheated on you and is physically and emotionally abusive? OMG!
Emergency session with the IC....now. Then straight to a good divorce lawyer.
Get the divorce. 
Your husband does not have to agree nor approve.

Affairs aside, his treatment of you call for divorce.


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## threelittlestars (Feb 18, 2016)

personofinterest said:


> Have you read the OP's thread?



He is not talking bad about her. He is telling her what to say to her husband.


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## threelittlestars (Feb 18, 2016)

Skyscrapper said:


> Hi All,
> 
> This is going to be a long one...
> 
> ...


I don't think your husband EVER loved you. You are a possession. When you got pregnant he did not want to a baby with you. He treated you horribly forced you to think you HAD to get an abortion which by the looks and sound of things you never got over it. And why should you? You didnt want the abortion...but i think you may have been too young or needy and wanted to please him so you did it 

You got some personal worth issues. You don't really value yourself. You need to divorce him. If he tomorrow changed into a decent human I think you still would suffer. I think your concept of love is wrapped up in need. 

YOU NEED to get out of your marriage. Dont let him make you think you need to walk away and not take (your) half of the business. You are not screwing him...you are UNSCREWING yourself from the screw job he did on you!

Get out, and get HALF of the assets. YOU SIMPLY MUST.


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

I hope the point of your therapy is to give you the strength to leave him because your marriage will never work.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

@Skyscrapper 

I just read your post from earlier today. 

You need to get away from your husband. He's physically violent and clearly does not love you, he does not even care about you. You are not safe with him.

Nothing you have done justifies any of his actions.


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## Adelais (Oct 23, 2013)

@Skyscrapper, when reading your last post, I felt such sadness for you. You had no one to turn to when your new husband was mistreating you. 

I suspect that his "friend" had other things in mind than just being a shoulder to lean on, or he wouldn't have allowed it go get to the point of a ONS. Most likely, you used each other for your own reasons. What you did was wrong, and shouldn't have been done. Had you been older and with more life experience, I would have expected more from you, but being so young, and with the painful background you had, you made the best decision you thought you could with the limited tools you had.

Shouldering an unwanted abortion alone would be so heavy a burden that would not go away until you had found self forgiveness and dealt with your deep grief over the child. The way the father of your child behaved would have made it even more lonely.

I hope and pray that you can get healing, and that you get away from your husband soon. I am not usually one to call names, but given all you have said about him, IMO he is a monster, not deserving to be in any relationship with any woman.


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## Skyscrapper (Jul 3, 2018)

I now get that this is not love and neither do I love him anymore. To him, I am just a possession. I play an important part of being the wife so that to the outside world it seems as if he has everything going on for him. 

Counselling has helped me to see things differently. I now know that it will never work, there is a lot that has transpired. I now recognise that I detached years ago but he has been using my guilt as a way to control me hence why I stayed.

I am not going to just walk away. I have worked so hard and I even went into labour whilst I was talking to a client.... so nope I will claim my share. I have a plan in place which I am working on. The wheel is in motion and there is no turning back.

We normally go overseas in December and this time I am not going to be part of this charade. If he throws a fit, I will get him served then and if he doesn't he will get served end of February the latest when I have finished putting everything in place. I honestly don't know how he will react so I am aiming to put all my affairs in order before I sink this ship.


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## Adelais (Oct 23, 2013)

Skyscrapper said:


> I have told him we should go our separate ways but he does not want to. He thinks that I want to leave because there is someone else yet that's not the case.


I am not a psychiatrist, but here is my take on what you wrote:

He is trying to mess with your head so that you equate leaving him with your cheating. 

If you leave, then you are cheating (in his mind.) So if you stay, you are not cheating.

Stay in your angry zone. No pity for him. No listening to his twisted reasoning. 

No listening to anything at all that comes from his mouth unless he says, "I know I am messed up and need some serious counseling." 

"I don't deserve for you to stay with me after all I have done to you." 

"I'm a monster, and am sorry for what I've done to you all these years." 

"I think you need to get away from me for your own mental and physical well being."

And you need to tell yourself that your husband does not have your best interest at heart...he only thinks about himself. Tell yourself over and over until you believe it.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Skyscrapper said:


> I now get that this is not love and neither do I love him anymore. To him, I am just a possession. I play an important part of being the wife so that to the outside world it seems as if he has everything going on for him.
> 
> Counselling has helped me to see things differently. I now know that it will never work, there is a lot that has transpired. I now recognise that I detached years ago but he has been using my guilt as a way to control me hence why I stayed.
> 
> ...


You have come a long way since your first post. The plan is a good one.

Is there any way that he can find your posts on this forum?


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## Skyscrapper (Jul 3, 2018)

If I could turn the hands of time I would have done things differently. It's been 12 years and I honestly wonder if there is healing after such an exeperiance. I hate myself for being manipulated to that extend of thinking that there was no way out. As for him, I actually feel sorry for him because he has to be one hell of a broken person to do that to me.

I have forgiven myself for the affair but the abortion that's another story all together. It's something that I struggle with continuosly.

As for the OM, I bet he smelled the blood a million miles away. Or just like me, he might have used me for his own reasons.

It's such a sad, sad story that claimed innocent victims as well (OM wife and kids).


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

You can heal from this and go on to have a better life. There are lessons to learn. It sounds like you are starting to figure out what those lessons are. Let the knowledge make you a stronger, wiser person.

After your divorce, give yourself time to heal before getting into another relationship so that you don't end up with another similar man.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

Skyscrapper said:


> If I could turn the hands of time I would have done things differently. It's been 12 years and I honestly wonder if there is healing after such an exeperiance. I hate myself for being manipulated to that extend of thinking that there was no way out. As for him, I actually feel sorry for him because he has to be one hell of a broken person to do that to me.
> 
> I have forgiven myself for the affair but the abortion that's another story all together. It's something that I struggle with continuosly.
> 
> ...


My mom always used to say that old "birds of a feather flock together" saying. .... And it is very true.

Your H is an awful excuse for a human. A complete and total waste of oxygen.

There for any "friend" of his is going to be a crud as well. 

Best advice anyone can offer is to get away from him and anyone related to or associated with him as soon and as far as possible.


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## Skyscrapper (Jul 3, 2018)

I don't think so, he does not snoop.


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## Adelais (Oct 23, 2013)

Skyscrapper said:


> He started our business, it was his dream and I worked with him. Initially it was 100% his and then he gave me 90% of his shares. That's why I wanted to give them back. He gave me those shares 2 years after his D Day. Hence I just don't feel comfortable taking that away from him. Sleep with his friend, and take away his company as well? I cannot do that.


Don't give him any shares yet. Wait until you speak with a lawyer. The court will make sure the two of you end up with 50% of your business or buyout, etc.

You need enough $ to live comfortably and provide for your child. 

With his track record of being manipulative, if he has to pay you anything after the divorce, he won't do it in an attempt to hold you and your child hostage to him.

Your having to pay him will put you in a better position to not have to get on his crazy-mean carousel, since you are not mean spirited, and you will pay him what is required when the time comes.


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## Adelais (Oct 23, 2013)

@Skyscrapper He hasn't snooped until now. However he might start snooping when he is convinced you are really going to divorce him. 

Once you get your post count up to 30 you can ask for this thread to be moved to the Private Members section. Then only people who are members of TAM who also have at least 30 posts can see it. As it is, anyone searching on the internet can find this thread.

You can get it up to 30 pretty quickly by posting short things in threads in the "Social" forum.


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## [email protected] (Dec 23, 2017)

Skyscrapper, you know you both did wrong, but it reads like only you are accountable for the A. Others have told you the relationship is toxic. It is.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Skyscrapper said:


> If I could turn the hands of time I would have done things differently. It's been 12 years and I honestly wonder if there is healing after such an exeperiance.


Oh Skyscrapper, you have SUCH a wonderful life ahead of you, you just can't see it yet. Nobody wants you to just walk away. We want you to do exactly what you're doing - getting your legal and financial ducks in a row so that you can walk away with every penny you are owed. You DESERVE that money and whatever possessions you want, after all the horrible things he's done to you and for the terrible sacrifice you were forced to make.

I'm really glad to hear this update. I just know you'll have wonderful decades to come once you're free of him. 

Meanwhile, I have a book for you to read. Not to teach you much, since you already understand you're being abused, but to reinforce the knowledge that you're being abused and that it can't be fixed. Because I fully expect him to fight this and go full force on the guilt trip. Reading this book will help you in those hard times when he's pushing, to know this will never improve and you have to leave. It's called Why Does He Do That? Inside the Minds of Angry and Controlling Men. Please read it, ok?

Overall, great job!


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

JFC.

Please get away from this POS ******* now.


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## Herschel (Mar 27, 2016)

Sounds like you were living such a great life, why did you cheat on him? You clearly were ok with him cheating on you. 

Omg, why even ask this question. Why continue this? Gtfo


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## threelittlestars (Feb 18, 2016)

You can get your ducks in a row MUCH faster than February. I think that is your fear talking. trying to give you more time. You need to see a lawyer this week, or next week and roll this ball before the new years... Otherwise you could be filing taxes TOGETHER for 2019 in 2020.... Start sooner so to try to get unconnected FASTER. 

Summon the courage. Ger er dun.


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