# Five days seperated...



## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

and I feel ill. My wife and I have been together since 01', and in May of this year, she told me she has been unhappy for years. So, this week she found a seasonal cabin (9months) and is trying to "figure herself out". 

A little back story. We very rarely argue. But, she/we doesn't communicate all that well. We never really had any plans or dreams for our family (2 daughters), life was about "getting by" for my family growing up. We've both dealt with depression our entire lives. The last 5 years, I have been in a deep hole, unhealthy, detached, reclusive. She's finally had enough of this, and is ready to move on. In May when she told me of her unhappiness, I changed dramatically. I lost 70 lbs, started a new job, gave up video games. Focused on us as a family. But, it hasn't helped. She started seeing a friend (in May) from her childhood almost every week day for coffee, and has been having somewhat of an EA since. I understand this is, for the most part, my fault. I'm also seeing a therapist to try and deal with my "baggage". She has done nothing to try and repair our marriage. We saw a MC for a few weeks, but in the wife's mind, it was just for help in handling our kids through this separation. 

I am so sad, it fills the air of my little apartment. Two nights ago she came over and we we're working on the logistics of our separation. We had some wine, and stayed up most of the night, lots of laughs and hugs. Today, she's a totally different person; cold, disconnected. I read some of her texts to her guy "friend", we share a phone currently. Last night he said "I've never seen you look so happy", and she replied "that made me glow". Which made me super angry/sad. She came in and I denied her a hug for the first time ever, and had to leave the room. I don't know what to do.

Am I at the point where I should be protecting myself? I've read all about the 180, but I'm all for reconciliation, so that's not a real option. All I want to do is hug her, but is that kind of stuff just prolonging the inevitable? I kind of feel she's hugging me because she feels bad about what she has done. How do you folks handle your affection with the separated partner? 

My kids are doing very well through all of this. We've always had a very open and honest relationship with them. They are super sad, but coping better than I could have hoped. They have a new place to spend some nights at, and they love it.


The silence when they are all gone is deafening.


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## angstire (Jun 4, 2013)

Hey Jeff, it sounds like you've done part of the 180, which is to work on your health, lose weight, essentially focus on yourself. Continue that. Work out, the athletics will help with getting stress out of your body. Continue the rest of the 180 to focus on you and take the focus off of trying to persuade her to stay. You can't. You can't control anyone but you and trying to get her to stay is a futile exercise in control.

Yes, she is hugging you to make herself feel like she's still a good person and concerned about you. It's almost entirely for her.

I know about the silence, but fill that with a hobby or being out with friends. Until it stops bothering you to be alone, be out. Run, bike, swim. Be with friends. Read in the park. Choose what you want to do and do that. Being alone in the silence will drag you down and make it harder to deal with what's going on because you will think about it obsessively to fill the silence.

Since she has an EA, which may have become a PA, she is excited about her new life and she sees only possbilities there, because there is no baggage yet. She sees reality with you and the dream is much more fascinating to her.

She may have been unhappy, but she is rewriting history now to justify leaving. She's viewing the past as mostly or all bad and blaming you for that. You can't change this by reminding her of the good times. Don't beg, cry, remind, ask, say I love you. Don't be plan B to the EA guy.

Focus on you. Be strong, attractive and decisive about moving on without her. She may decide she likes that and wants an R. After I did the 180 and worked on me, I decided I didn't an R with my WAW. You may too. Either way, focusing on you will get you healthy for the rest of your life and whichever woman you choose to have in it with you.

Lastly, find threads similar to yours in this section and read them. It really helps to read other peoples' stories and see the similarities. A lot.

Good luck and write back here as often as you need. Vent, ask for advice, admit backslides, tell stories of your daughters. TAMmers will help you. You will be a better Jeff when this is done.


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## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

thanks for the response! I recently told her if she intended to "test the waters" with her EA guy, then it's over, and I won't be second to anyone. She told me that my stance impressed her, and she was proud of me. What that means, I don't really know, or care to know at this point.


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## angstire (Jun 4, 2013)

jeffthechef said:


> thanks for the response! I recently told her if she intended to "test the waters" with her EA guy, then it's over, and I won't be second to anyone. She told me that my stance impressed her, and she was proud of me. What that means, I don't really know, or care to know at this point.


Watch her actions. The words don't mean much, the actions mean everything.

Don't care, that's good. Be who you want to be and if you still want her and she tries to win you back; be together. 

Watch what she does. That's what she really thinks.


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## ThreeStrikes (Aug 11, 2012)

She's screwing the PosOM at the cabin. You do realize that, right?

First order of business is consulting with an attorney to learn the divorce laws in your state.

Next, isolate your finances. Do not pay for her cabin/love shack.

Start protecting yourself. Prepare for the worst. 

This is not an easy process. It helps to get mad. Anger can give you the fuel to get through this.

I mean, come on, the woman who promised to be loyal to you, through thick and thin, has bailed on you and her family. She's selfish, a liar, a cheater, and lousy mother.

Hard 180. Don't wuss out and beg her to come back. 

You might ask the mods to move this thread to the Coping with Infidelity subforum, where you will get plenty of good advice.

Be strong.


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## Twistedheart (May 17, 2010)

Time to start reading up on why your wife is acting like she is. She's got herself a little love affair goin on and you are letting it happen.

Good luck. It sucks.


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## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

Thanks to everyone for the comments and your time. The months of info I've gathered, and the fact that she hasn't been in the cabin more than a week, and when she has, she was with the kids tells me they haven't graduated to PA yet. I've been paranoid for awhile, and I used to do investigations for a large security firm.


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## Stretch (Dec 12, 2012)

Chef,

These miserable tramps suck the life out of you for decades taking advantage of your good nature and then start spreading their legs around town because their mothers were not happy with their fathers but would not leave aka THEIR BAGGAGE.

Head up man, you got a lot of good livin' ahead of you and the faster you kick that garbage to the curb the better.

I got a six foot tall, blond gf who should be a supermodel at 53. I have not even filed yet and I met my gf the day I told my WAW we should see other people. So I got a gf and a W at the same time. It's wild out here man, come have some damn fun!

Go live your life,
Stretch


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## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

Good for you Stretch, and thanks for the words of encouragement! You're right, I've got a lot of good living ahead, just got to get my head straight.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

jeffthechef said:


> thanks for the response! I recently told her if she intended to "test the waters" with her EA guy, then it's over, and I won't be second to anyone. She told me that my stance impressed her, and she was proud of me. What that means, I don't really know, or care to know at this point.


Make it stick.

I can tell you what's happened.

She's lost her attraction to you. It's that simple.

Your strength in the "test the waters" comment has the potential to light a spark that sends this in the opposite direction.


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## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

Well that's the thing. She says she doesn't know if we'll get back together, and a big part of her decision to do so is based on how I live my life for the next 9 months or so. I can't base my progression on the need to please her though, it has to be for me. Also, I told her that she needs to work on herself too, because I'm not sure how I'm gonna feel in a year about our relationship. She made and appointment to see a therapist today. I've gotta say though, I don't have much hope. She still sees her EA guy, and texts him daily. There's not much I can do about that (this is what I've been told by our MC).


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## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

Reading my last post to myself out loud, lord do I seem desperate. Gross.


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## angstire (Jun 4, 2013)

You're doing better than many already. Keep on. Focus on you. You don't NEED her. You may WANT her, but you don't need her.

Work on you. Focus on your daughters. Get happy with who you are.

You can always reasses your relationship with her, depending on what she does and what you want after you do some work.

Read No More Mr Nice Guy, if you haven't already.

http://7chan.org/lit/src/Robert_Glover_-_No_More_Mr_Nice_Guy.pdf


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

jeffthechef said:


> Well that's the thing. She says she doesn't know if we'll get back together, and a big part of her decision to do so is based on how I live my life for the next 9 months or so. I can't base my progression on the need to please her though, it has to be for me. Also, I told her that she needs to work on herself too, because I'm not sure how I'm gonna feel in a year about our relationship. She made and appointment to see a therapist today. I've gotta say though, I don't have much hope. She still sees her EA guy, and texts him daily. There's not much I can do about that (this is what I've been told by our MC).


Jeff,

You can state your boundary.

What she does with that is up to her.


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## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

started reading No more Mr. Nice guy today, and wow.  This book was written with me in mind I'm sure of it, lol. 

Angstire, Conrad, I am extremely grateful for your posts, they help tremendously. Thank you.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

jeffthechef said:


> started reading No more Mr. Nice guy today, and wow. This book was written with me in mind I'm sure of it, lol.
> 
> Angstire, Conrad, I am extremely grateful for your posts, they help tremendously. Thank you.


Jeff,

You're just getting started.

Glad to have you on board.


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## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

Saw her today. It was around lunch time, so I stopped for a snack at a cafe in our town, she showed up not long after. I live in a small town, and thought this may be a possibility. I smiled a lot, was cordial and didn't ask her any questions about anything really, just chit chat. She told me how lonely she's been in the cabin. Which I responded "yeah, it's tough". When she got her food I told her to take care, and then I road off on my bike. She sent me a text an hour later that said "please tell me if you're okay, and safe at home". I didn't respond. Another hour passed and she sent me another text, asking about what kind of cat food our cat likes. Now two more random question texts. What is this, asking me if I'm safe? No more Mr. Nice guy is a great read, I'll probably have to read it 10 more times to really know it.


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## angstire (Jun 4, 2013)

You are a rockstar, bro. Great responses to her attempts to draw you in.


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## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

I have great teachers! A week ago, I would have said what ever I thought would make her happy, even if it wasn't true. Thanks, you guys rock


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

jeffthechef said:


> I have great teachers! A week ago, I would have said what ever I thought would make her happy, even if it wasn't true. Thanks, you guys rock


Here's a link for you

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/mens-clubhouse/18347-fitness-tests.html


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## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

The ups and downs are ridiculous. I think I'm starting to understand the cake eater profile. She wants to cuddle, hug me because she loves me (so she says). But, bye bye at the end of the day. So, I just stopped it. It was one of the hardest things I've ever done. I told her, if we're working towards reconciliation a hug is welcomed. She's still in the "I don't know about us" phase though, so I told her no more touching, at all. How can I work towards healing when I'm just re-entering this emotional sh!t storm every time I see her. I'm working on boundaries, and trying to not be so nice. She texted me last night that she wanted to go over Gottmans's 'The Seven Principles for Making Marriage Work' again, and to "See where we stand". No, idea what that means. We're meeting tonight to talk. Insert sarcastic "Yay"


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

jeffthechef said:


> The ups and downs are ridiculous. I think I'm starting to understand the cake eater profile. She wants to cuddle, hug me because she loves me (so she says). But, bye bye at the end of the day. So, I just stopped it. It was one of the hardest things I've ever done. I told her, if we're working towards reconciliation a hug is welcomed. She's still in the "I don't know about us" phase though, so I told her no more touching, at all. How can I work towards healing when I'm just re-entering this emotional sh!t storm every time I see her. I'm working on boundaries, and trying to not be so nice. She texted me last night that she wanted to go over Gottmans's 'The Seven Principles for Making Marriage Work' again, and to "See where we stand". No, idea what that means. We're meeting tonight to talk. Insert sarcastic "Yay"


Have you read the link?


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## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

I have Conrad, and it hit me between the eyes. We haven't been separated 2 weeks yet, and I'm primarily focused on my future.


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## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

It took all my will not to text her last night that I missed her.


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## angstire (Jun 4, 2013)

jeffthechef said:


> It took all my will not to text her last night that I missed her.


Good job. She said she was leaving; she'll let you know if she's coming back. Don't be plan B.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

jeffthechef said:


> It took all my will not to text her last night that I missed her.


Good man.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Yep, keep doing the 180. It's the best thing you can do right now. Protect yourself. There is a chance that it is getting her attention as well.


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## Tron (Jan 31, 2013)

How is it going Jeff?


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## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

it's been really difficult moving on at all, I see her almost every day for various kid related things. We only have one vehicle at the moment too. Financially I'm drowning, so that adds to the emotional sh!t storm that's circling my head most of the time. 

I desire closure. Feel like I'm stuck in limbo. I used to enjoy going home to see my best friend. Now, going home is a torture. I believe it will get better. But, for now; she still has too much power over me. ugh....


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

jeffthechef said:


> it's been really difficult moving on at all, I see her almost every day for various kid related things. We only have one vehicle at the moment too. Financially I'm drowning, so that adds to the emotional sh!t storm that's circling my head most of the time.
> 
> Am I not supposed to spy (read her email/facebook) on her anymore, per the 180 technique? That's been near impossible to stop doing. I desire closure. Feel like I'm stuck in limbo. I used to enjoy going home to see my best friend. Now, going home is a torture. I believe it will get better. But, for now; she still has too much power over me. ugh....


Are you trying to observe the situation @50,000 feet?


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## FC Dynamite (Sep 23, 2013)

Jeff,

The advice you have been given is top notch. I'm going to add my 2 cents as well.

I've been lurking these forums for the last two months but this will be my first, hopefully not my last post.

Your story struck a chord with me, as I remember how I felt when my wife left me two months ago. She had always been the best person I knew, since the moment I met her. Well, until she cheated on me. I worked hard to get past it, but 7 months later she left me anyway stating she was unhappy.

I spent the first week not eating or sleeping. I literally ate a slice of bread a day for 7 days. I was a zombie. I confided in some family and friends I could trust. This helped a bit.

The thing is, for us guys, is that we become "Jeff the married guy", instead of "Jeff the main man, who loves fitness, poker and hiking in the woods, who also happens to be married". This is what happened to me. I was a husband and a father. This was my identity, and I probably would have been happy living the rest of my life that way, or atleast I would have convinced myself I was happy. I was afraid to be alone. I was afraid nobody would want me, even though I'm only 30. I begged my wife to stay, and guess what, she didn't. I allowed myself to be a doormat for some time as well. Catering to her, spending time with her, kissing and having sex. I thought this would bring her back to me.

When she left I started back at the gym. I was a bodybuilder back in my early 20's (not the huge type), so I jumped back in feet first. I've gained about 10 lbs of muscle. It was then that I realized that the absolute key to surviving this whole mess was to get my self confidence back. Self confidence and self respect. I'm the man, I'm a catch and I'm going to be happy no matter what.

You say the emptiness in your place is hard for you. I can relate. I spent more than my share of time with my kids due to my wife's hectic work schedule. I was Mr. Mom. It was really difficult at first. However, look at it this way: when you have the kids, do it to the max. Don't just sit around and watch TV, go to the park. Go see a movie. The nights I don't have the kids, I do whatever the hell I want. I eat what I want. I watch what I want. I hit the iron. I go for a beer at a buddy's place. Look at this time as Jeff's time.

I've basically gone no contact with my wife. We talk about the kids and that's about it. I'm friendly and amicable with her. We sit together at kids sporting events. I refuse to talk about the marriage. If I'm being honest, I'm not even sure if I want her back anymore.

So Jeff, if your overweight, lose weight. If your underweight, gain some muscle. Buy some new clothes that make you feel good. Smile at chicks as your walking by them, and they will smile back. Get your self confidence back. There are millions of chicks our there, surely one of them will be interested in you. Learn from your mistakes so you don't make them again. If getting back with your wife remains your ultimate goal, you still need to implement these changes. Your wife will eat it up, trust me. Just yesterday my wife sent me a text that said " omg when I saw you today you looked so unbelievably sexy". My response: NOTHING. Not a word. Eat your heart out dumbass.

I hope I'm not coming across as doing these things for her. Do them for you. Become Jeff the man. Jeff the stud. We're all gonna make it man.


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## Zomb (Aug 12, 2013)

Hi Jeff, keep working on the 180... It is important you understand that even if you want to reconcile in the future you will not be able to do it if you are still emotionally vulnerable to her... I know what you are going through because I am going the same path... My STBXW and I have being physically separated for the last 4 months... She had an EA/PA with a guy and she is still having it... We need to be strong now and keep the 180 as much as possible... In other forums I have read about people going to an emotional rollercoaster (what you are felling right now) during 10 or 12 months because they didnt keep the 180... We dont want that for us, do we?? Good luck and keep venting in here mate...


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## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

Conrad, yes; as close to 50000 feet as possible. FC and Zomb, thank you for your words. I've been defined as a husband and father for so long, I really don't know who I am anymore. Time to wake the f!ck up. I've had a really hard week. Venting commencing in 3....2....1... This last weekend she hands me a book "the 7 principles of successful marriage" or something. She says to me "I was up all night writing about us, and I really want to put all my effort to figure us out". The next day, not 24 hours later she says "I know you've been dreading to hear this but, there's no hope for us". I actually lol'd, then left the room. She went to her first therapist meeting yesterday, and things are looking toward she's manic depressive. I came home from work about 9 pm. She was at my house, a depressed wreck, tells me she was wondering if we could cuddle. "No". No delay. Just "NO". She was stunned, and started to cry. We hugged before she left, but I wasn't there for it, if you get my meaning. I saw her today and she was trying to make plans for us to do stuff together, and I stopped her. "We aren't going to be buddies, we are not going to hang out" She said that she didn't want another relationship, and thought it was fine that we had fun together, because she wasn't seeking anyone else. I reminded her that our relationship isn't just her, and if it's over, then I'm moving on. Now, I'm feeling a little bit of guilt, she stayed with me throughout my really depressed years, and now she's entering a world of hurt. Do I owe her something?


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

jeffthechef said:


> Conrad, yes; as close to 50000 feet as possible. FC and Zomb, thank you for your words. I've been defined as a husband and father for so long, I really don't know who I am anymore. Time to wake the f!ck up. I've had a really hard week. Venting commencing in 3....2....1... This last weekend she hands me a book "the 7 principles of successful marriage" or something. She says to me "I was up all night writing about us, and I really want to put all my effort to figure us out". The next day, not 24 hours later she says "I know you've been dreading to hear this but, there's no hope for us". I actually lol'd, then left the room. She went to her first therapist meeting yesterday, and things are looking toward she's manic depressive. I came home from work about 9 pm. She was at my house, a depressed wreck, tells me she was wondering if we could cuddle. "No". No delay. Just "NO". She was stunned, and started to cry. We hugged before she left, but I wasn't there for it, if you get my meaning. I saw her today and she was trying to make plans for us to do stuff together, and I stopped her. "We aren't going to be buddies, we are not going to hang out" She said that she didn't want another relationship, and thought it was fine that we had fun together, because she wasn't seeking anyone else. I reminded her that our relationship isn't just her, and if it's over, then I'm moving on. Now, I'm feeling a little bit of guilt, she stayed with me throughout my really depressed years, and now she's entering a world of hurt. Do I owe her something?


Not a thing - until she says she's ready to commit to the marriage.

And, then... only if you're ok with it.


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## samyeagar (May 14, 2012)

jeffthechef said:


> Conrad, yes; as close to 50000 feet as possible. FC and Zomb, thank you for your words. I've been defined as a husband and father for so long, I really don't know who I am anymore. Time to wake the f!ck up. I've had a really hard week. Venting commencing in 3....2....1... This last weekend she hands me a book "the 7 principles of successful marriage" or something. She says to me "I was up all night writing about us, and I really want to put all my effort to figure us out". The next day, not 24 hours later she says "I know you've been dreading to hear this but, there's no hope for us". I actually lol'd, then left the room. She went to her first therapist meeting yesterday, and things are looking toward she's manic depressive. I came home from work about 9 pm. She was at my house, a depressed wreck, tells me she was wondering if we could cuddle. "No". No delay. Just "NO". She was stunned, and started to cry. We hugged before she left, but I wasn't there for it, if you get my meaning. I saw her today and she was trying to make plans for us to do stuff together, and I stopped her. "We aren't going to be buddies, we are not going to hang out" She said that she didn't want another relationship, and thought it was fine that we had fun together, because she wasn't seeking anyone else. I reminded her that our relationship isn't just her, and if it's over, then I'm moving on. *Now, I'm feeling a little bit of guilt, she stayed with me throughout my really depressed years, and now she's entering a world of hurt. Do I owe her something*?


No. She did that as your wife. She no longer wants to be your wife. She no longer gets to have the benefits of being your wife. Full. Stop.


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## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

Thank you. I felt great last night, went to my therapist and had a great session. This morning I'm sad, lol. Probably because my daughters are leaving for their 3 days with mama.

_"Jeff the main man, who loves fitness, poker and hiking in the woods, who also happens to be married"_

This statement was really accurate. Just before I got with my wife, I had just come back from a month long solo hike in the highlands of Scotland, and had supported myself through online poker for years after. Everything pretty much stopped. Sad really.


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## FC Dynamite (Sep 23, 2013)

jeffthechef said:


> Thank you. I felt great last night, went to my therapist and had a great session. This morning I'm sad, lol. Probably because my daughters are leaving for their 3 days with mama.
> 
> _"Jeff the main man, who loves fitness, poker and hiking in the woods, who also happens to be married"_
> 
> This statement was really accurate. Just before I got with my wife, I had just come back from a month long solo hike in the highlands of Scotland, and had supported myself through online poker for years after. Everything pretty much stopped. Sad really.


I took a stab in the dark at those interests, turns out I'm a psychic.

In all seriousness, instead of getting really upset about your kids leaving for 3 days, look at it as, a chance for Jeff time. I know your pain man, I spent every single day with my kids. My wife would actually tell me to get out of the house and do stuff, but it turns out I was so far removed from all the things I used to enjoy, that I didn't know where to start to get back into it. Just before she left, I started back at the gym though and that was going really well. It took me 6 months after getting that membership to go the first time. Now I go 4-5 days per week. You really just need to take the first big leap of faith and fall in love with the old Jeff again. I realize now that my wife probably lost attraction for me. Not necessarily physical attraction, but what happened to the guy who loved to be outdoors, play sports, hang with his buddies? Who is this guy who goes to work, comes home and does housework and spends the rest of the night on the couch?

For these next 3 days you do whatever you want, but atleast take one big plunge. Something you might not feel entirely comfortable with like calling a buddy you've lost touch with and going for a beer. Drive to your closest nature trail and go for a hike. 

Your gonna be ok man.


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## daisygirl 41 (Aug 5, 2011)

Well done Jeff you are doing great.
Stay strong, you don't owe her anything.
Regards,
DG
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

You ever have weak days? Today was a good example of a weak day. I had to pick her up from work because we still only have one vehicle. She asked if we could talk a little about the renovations we'll be doing this weekend. She came in my house and lost it. I had a little fire going in the wood stove, burning some really nice incense; this is how I like my place to be, cozy, clean and comfortable. She starts crying as soon as we're in the door. Says she misses me, and all the good we had, but still doesn't understand her own emotions and what she really feels she needs. I caved. She got me talking about a lot of our issues and, and she was trying to get in my personal space, real close talking, so much eye contact. I fought really hard to not be moved by what she was saying. Reminding myself that she will probably think the opposite of everything she is saying today, tomorrow. Now, she's gone, with the kids for the night, and I feel so hollow. Ugh. Damn it, damn it.


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## angstire (Jun 4, 2013)

Yes, we all have weak days. Don't worry about them. Let them pass, recognize what you want to do better, forgive your weak moments, resolve to do better and move on.

She's reaching out, which could be a good sign.

Ask her if this happens again, "what's changed?"

If you get the, "I don't know, I'm not sure, my emotions are confused, etc.". Tell her that you're not confused and she said she doesn't want to be married anymore and that you're moving on.

She told you she wants to be done, if she wants to unsay that, she has to be the one to do that. To recommit to you.

Be open to it and ready to do the HARD work to repair the marriage. If that's truly what you want. 

But she has to say it. She's the one who wanted to leave.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

jeffthechef said:


> You ever have weak days? Today was a good example of a weak day. I had to pick her up from work because we still only have one vehicle. She asked if we could talk a little about the renovations we'll be doing this weekend. She came in my house and lost it. I had a little fire going in the wood stove, burning some really nice incense; this is how I like my place to be, cozy, clean and comfortable. She starts crying as soon as we're in the door. Says she misses me, and all the good we had, but still doesn't understand her own emotions and what she really feels she needs. I caved. She got me talking about a lot of our issues and, and she was trying to get in my personal space, real close talking, so much eye contact. I fought really hard to not be moved by what she was saying. Reminding myself that she will probably think the opposite of everything she is saying today, tomorrow. Now, she's gone, with the kids for the night, and I feel so hollow. Ugh. Damn it, damn it.


Jeff,

She's an emotional vampire.

She was working to make sure you were still Plan B so she'll be "safe" while she "figures things out"

If you engage in that sort of nonsense, it will hurt incredibly every single time and set you back.

Put up a boundary.

When she starts going there, you say, "I'm not ok with this sort of talk if it doesn't lead anywhere"

If she asks what you mean by it "leading anywhere", just stay silent.

Emotionally, she knows what you mean and is plenty content to just string you along, without any consideration for your emotional well-being.


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## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

She's telling me she's making progress with her IC, which is good for her. I asked her "what's changed"?. She said she's been working on realizing her tendencies towards fantasy, and genuinely feels more positive towards me than she has in a long time. She still hasn't figured out who she is, or who she is going to be. I see some good change in her. There's electricity between us, she mentioned it. Attraction, and not from the need for old comfort (her words). She said she needs a strong man, and I said I want a strong woman. I'm being pulled back in, and I fear I'm being set up. I've got to get back to the 180.


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## angstire (Jun 4, 2013)

Yep, back into the 180. This sounds like a trap. And if it isn't, the 180 will still work for you until you have seen enough of her earnest actions to trust what she's saying.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

jeffthechef said:


> She's telling me she's making progress with her IC, which is good for her. I asked her "what's changed"?. She said she's been working on realizing her tendencies towards fantasy, and genuinely feels more positive towards me than she has in a long time. She still hasn't figured out who she is, or who she is going to be. I see some good change in her. There's electricity between us, she mentioned it. Attraction, and not from the need for old comfort (her words). She said she needs a strong man, and I said I want a strong woman. I'm being pulled back in, and I fear I'm being set up. I've got to get back to the 180.


http://talkaboutmarriage.com/mens-clubhouse/18181-man-up-nice-guy-reference.html


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## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

WOW. That's quite the reference section! Bookmarked, Thank you Conrad.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

jeffthechef said:


> WOW. That's quite the reference section! Bookmarked, Thank you Conrad.


Much accumulated wisdom.

Read all the links.

I'm sure you'll see yourself there.


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## LongWalk (Apr 4, 2013)

Don't know where you are but in the UK there are hiking groups all over. You can join up and find companions to walk for hours. Snowdonia National Park, pure beauty especially at this time of year. An 8 hour walk will get you a great appetite and you can even eat the sh!tty British food, a huge pile of it... actually my cousin has B&B in park. She does make good soup.

I need to get my kids over there again.


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## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

I'm in New England, US. Hiking has been my solace for the past few weeks. When I start to feel sad and alone, I put on my weighted pack and just start walking. I always feel better once I'm out and moving. Even, dare I say, happy.


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## FC Dynamite (Sep 23, 2013)

jeffthechef said:


> I'm in New England, US. Hiking has been my solace for the past few weeks. When I start to feel sad and alone, I put on my weighted pack and just start walking. I always feel better once I'm out and moving. Even, dare I say, happy.


That's awesome man, I'm really happy to hear it. Keep up the good work.


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## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

Mr. Plan B here. I had some quality alone time with stbxw's cell phone last night. Now, to be honest, I tried to ignore my craving for the information hidden on that thing. I tried to be "whatever". In the end, I couldn't pass up the opportunity for some truth. It turns out she told her EA friend from high school that she was interested in him, and wanted more in their relationship. He politely rejected her. Said he had thought about it, but it's best if they're just friends. The date says this happened the day she told me there was no hope for us. That's it. No other dirt. She's an honest person for the most part, has always been. I'm happy I got to read her messages though, moving on feels a little easier today.


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

jeffthechef said:


> Mr. Plan B here. I had some quality alone time with stbxw's cell phone last night. Now, to be honest, I tried to ignore my craving for the information hidden on that thing. I tried to be "whatever". In the end, I couldn't pass up the opportunity for some truth. It turns out she told her EA friend from high school that she was interested in him, and wanted more in their relationship. He politely rejected her. Said he had thought about it, but it's best if they're just friends. The date says this happened the day she told me there was no hope for us. That's it. No other dirt. She's an honest person for the most part, has always been. I'm happy I got to read her messages though, moving on feels a little easier today.


You are only Plan B if you let yourself be Plan B.

Your wife was testing the waters and lost.....

Now you know the truth.

Your wife was not focused on you, the marriage or herself.

Point that out to her. Then walk away and her ignore her.

Focus on you and what you want out of life.

It might not include her. At least the her she is today.

Go be your own Plan A!!!

HM


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## LongWalk (Apr 4, 2013)

jeffthechef said:


> Mr. Plan B here. I had some quality alone time with stbxw's cell phone last night. Now, to be honest, I tried to ignore my craving for the information hidden on that thing. I tried to be "whatever". In the end, I couldn't pass up the opportunity for some truth. It turns out she told her EA friend from high school that she was interested in him, and wanted more in their relationship. *He politely rejected her. Said he had thought about it, but it's best if they're just friends. The date says this happened the day she told me there was no hope for us. * That's it. No other dirt. She's an honest person for the most part, has always been. I'm happy I got to read her messages though, moving on feels a little easier today.


Sounds like her ego is so frail that she had to give you a kick of rejection just like the one she had gotten. She's emotionally a mess.

The stronger you become the more likely she is to want you back, but will you want her? Another man rejected her. He didn't even want to bang her. Women hate that worse than being fat.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

LongWalk said:


> Sounds like her ego is so frail that she had to give you a kick of rejection just like the one she had gotten. She's emotionally a mess.


That's some fantastic insight Walk.


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## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

I slept for 14 hours today, off and on, just didn't want to get up. Every time I woke up, my mind would go into why I want my wife back, and the comfort and false security she provides. I'm addicted to comfort. 

We talked yesterday for 2 hours about us, lots of tears. She hasn't been with anyone else, but has started phone relationships with guys she used to know. She called these guys band aids for the loneliness she feels in her little cabin. I repeated to her that I wouldn't be her plan b. She was crying and told me I've always been Plan A, but Plan A doesn't work for her anymore. That hurt to hear. She keeps repeating that she wants someone who is into the same things that she is into. Is that even a realistic want?

She left me, yes. No affair, just genuinely tired of my overweight, lazy, depressed ass. She asks me to go for hikes with her now, to garden with her. Is she reaching out? Or, cake eating? I miss my best friend.

I've read so many f!cking books, from Krishanmurti to Glover, DeMello etc. My mind is awash with the ideas and philosophies of other people and I feel like I'm going insane.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

jeffthechef said:


> I slept for 14 hours today, off and on, just didn't want to get up. Every time I woke up, my mind would go into why I want my wife back, and the comfort and false security she provides. I'm addicted to comfort.
> 
> We talked yesterday for 2 hours about us, lots of tears. She hasn't been with anyone else, but has started phone relationships with guys she used to know. She called these guys band aids for the loneliness she feels in her little cabin. I repeated to her that I wouldn't be her plan b. She was crying and told me I've always been Plan A, but Plan A doesn't work for her anymore. That hurt to hear. She keeps repeating that she wants someone who is into the same things that she is into. Is that even a realistic want?
> 
> ...


You still overweight and lazy?


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## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

I've lost 91 pounds since mid may. Besides the occasional post break up bed session I had today, my laziness is not around so much anymore. My house is clean, the dishes are clean, I'm not a fan of procrastination anymore, I sense it, I kill it.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

jeffthechef said:


> I've lost 91 pounds since mid may. Besides the occasional post break up bed session I had today, my laziness is not around so much anymore. My house is clean, the dishes are clean, I'm not a fan of procrastination anymore, I sense it, I kill it.


In other words, you self-regulate your pos tendencies.

I wonder how attractive you'd be to her now?


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## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

Conrad said:


> In other words, you self-regulate your pos tendencies.
> 
> I wonder how attractive you'd be to her now?


Oh, to know the mind of this woman!


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

jeffthechef said:


> Oh, to know the mind of this woman!


There really only is one way to find out.

Part of the "work" relationships require is to be "your" best everyday.

That doesn't mean being what they want you to be.

But, it does mean being your best... energetic, physically, emotionally, and be comfortable in your own shoes.

You're much better positioned for that now than before.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Now.... let me give you the formula.

You give defiant people what they want. And, with women like your wife, you never chase. When she pours out some slop like this:

>>She was crying and told me I've always been Plan A, but Plan A doesn't work for her anymore. That hurt to hear. She keeps repeating that she wants someone who is into the same things that she is into. Is that even a realistic want?<<

Say the following:

"I realize it doesn't work for you. And, while it's not what I want, I would never dream of standing in your way"

And, then go blissfully silent

(You'll actually hear the hornets buzzing in her ears)


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## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

My life at 50,000 feet. I went to a festival with the wife and kids over the weekend. My wife was working at one of the booths all day, and I spent my time with the kids walking around. I was somewhat hesitant about going for FEAR of sliding backwards. But, I feel I'm a resilient SOB, and was up to the challenge. After a long day, my oldest became ill from too much fair food, low grade fever, vomiting. We decided to stay in a hotel, slept in separate beds, my wife made flirty contact a couple times, but nothing else.

Now, after spending the entire weekend with my probable stbxw I look back at what I've gleaned. 

When I decided to go, I made a conscious decision to journal all my feelings through out the trip, mentally. All my feelings of neediness I felt, came from my desire for her sexually. She's beautiful, doesn't wear makeup. Physically, she's my idea of a perfect woman. 

Not once did I feel sad for our ending relationship. Not once did I hope she would want to cuddle in the hotel. All I wanted was that sweet T & A. 

Now, I don't know what any of this means, but I feel pretty damn confident in myself. Sexual attraction is pretty easy to deal with.

I looked in the mirror a couple times, and said "50,000 feet dumb ass."

Thanks to everyone for being with me in the hardest transition of my life.


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

It means you are in charge of your self Jeff.

Your brain, your heart and your balls.

While physically she is what you are attracted to you no longer are attracted to "her".

The crappy part of "her".

The part that does not want to do the hard work.

Congratulations on recognizing the difference.

In time you will understand. 

Understand what you like. What you love. Who you love including yourself. And who you truly want to be with.

And by then you will know if they truly want to be with you for better or for worse.

HM


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## LongWalk (Apr 4, 2013)

Machiavelli, a very tough minded poster on TAM, would tell you to lift weights and make sure you have a V shaped torso. It might reignite your wife's attraction for you. Attraction is based on a man's confidence and appearance.

You need to overcome the needy beta guy. Read Bagdon's thread.

If you have HappyMan, Conrad and Angstire on your team, you can change your situation. It's up to you.


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## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

_
If you have HappyMan, Conrad and Angstire on your team_

Where would I be, without these guys?!! I read their stuff every day. Then I re-read it, then re-re-read it.

A literal "well spring" of knowledge and experience.


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## ThreeStrikes (Aug 11, 2012)

jeffthechef said:


> All my feelings of neediness I felt, came from my desire for her sexually. She's beautiful, doesn't wear makeup. Physically, she's my idea of a perfect woman.
> All I wanted was that sweet T & A.


You are not alone. I came to the same conclusion about myself and my ex. I've read other guys post similar sentiments. It came down to something as shallow as sex. Only, I guess sex isn't that shallow for some of us. Heh.

It's an enlightening thought, especially when you realize that there are tons of women out there just as hot as your STBX. Only nice, and non-disordered.

Happy hunting


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## ThreeStrikes (Aug 11, 2012)

I'v read a ton about high-conflict wives. Personality-disordered women. BPDers, histrionics, blah blah.

One thing that seems to be universal is that the sex, especially in the beginning, is off the charts excellent. So I guess it's understandable for the poor souls, who find themselves attached to these women, to have difficulty saying goodbye to the sexual aspect of the relationship.

Everything else about the relationship stinks, but the sex is good and you sure feel like a stud parading her around on your arm in public.


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## TexDad034 (Oct 9, 2013)

FC Dynamite said:


> Jeff,
> 
> The advice you have been given is top notch. I'm going to add my 2 cents as well.
> 
> ...


Well put.


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## angstire (Jun 4, 2013)

jeffthechef said:


> _
> If you have HappyMan, Conrad and Angstire on your team_
> 
> Where would I be, without these guys?!! I read their stuff every day. Then I re-read it, then re-re-read it.
> ...


Thanks for the nod from both of you.

I'm happy to help out where I can. I was lost when I got to TAM and what the members have given me in knowledge cannot be measured. I don't know if I ever would have gotten to where I am now, but I do know it happened rapidly because of the TAM advice and stories.

I help out where and when I can and it's only applying what I was given, acted on and have seen.

My thanks to TAM is to give a push where I can. The rest of my time I date and work and bike and parent and geek out to sci fi. Which is why I say to all: focus on you, be active, be selfish, be happy; the rest will sort itself out. :smthumbup:


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## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

"I'd like to think there's a hope"

I got that one last night when she tried to hug me when picking up the kids. I refused her hug, said "No hope, no hug", and walked away.

Not "I think there's a hope" but "I'd like to think". What a joke.

They left, I drank some really nice wine, played a half hour of video games, then read "The Four Agreements" as I went to sleep.


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## GotLifeBack (Sep 12, 2013)

jeffthechef said:


> All my feelings of neediness I felt, came from my desire for her sexually. She's beautiful. Physically, she's my idea of a perfect woman.


I'm pretty much at this point with my STBXW. It's a huge realisation that actually, there are other women out there that I find attractive, and that find me attractive. If it's a sex thing, when you're ready, you can find that again with someone else.


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## LongWalk (Apr 4, 2013)

There is a really good piece of writing floating around on TAM. It has to deal with letting go of the other person. It is brilliant. The basic idea is you tell the cheater:

"Hey, I love you and so I want what is best for you. If he makes you happy, then I have to let you go because I love you. But that doesn't mean we can just be friends. I have to protect myself while the feelings I have for you die out. I have to stand up for my rights in divorce. I have to be a good parent, which means being a leader. So yes, I love you but goodbye."


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## Stretch (Dec 12, 2012)

Hey Chef,

From one New Englander to another,

WE WIN!

Life is pretty damn good,
Stretch


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## Stretch (Dec 12, 2012)

OK gents,

In response to the comments about how these women are the greatest thing since sliced bread and they are so hot and they are so great in bed.

Bullsh!t

When the time is right for you, you will not believe the fun, excitement and eros of being with another women. It will send chills up and down your spine how much fun it can be!

You are going to be more than pleasantly surprised,
Stretch


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## sammy3 (Jun 5, 2011)

...As in starting over? Or just ONS, or casual dating?Or what's out there? Care to elaborate? ((incase I missed something in the thread, lolol))

~ sammy




Stretch said:


> OK gents,
> 
> In response to the comments about how these women are the greatest thing since sliced bread and they are so hot and they are so great in bed.
> 
> ...


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## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

That was a great series.

I'm no where near that point of another relationship, of any kind with another woman. I'm completely invested in myself, and although, I most certainly could hook up. I need to suffer through this loneliness. A distraction would only hamper my progression.

My wife is a big enough distraction. She's continually reminding me via text, that she's lonely, and so sad at what we've become. Then, the following morning proceeds to text me complaints about how I'm the cause of her misery. I was a depressed overweight lump for a few years and she intends to remind me when ever possible. Can't even enjoy the world series without her pulling me into her f'd up triangle. 

And yet, I miss her tremendously! Well, some parts of her anyways. I could do without the scatterbrained underdeveloped emotionally manic blame shifter parts.

We're getting together with the kids tonight for Halloween, wish me luck.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

jeffthechef said:


> That was a great series.
> 
> I'm no where near that point of another relationship, of any kind with another woman. I'm completely invested in myself, and although, I most certainly could hook up. I need to suffer through this loneliness. A distraction would only hamper my progression.
> 
> ...


Learn to Be Still Jeff

Rock Steady


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## angstire (Jun 4, 2013)

Luck, it was fun for me to do that to see the kids, but it has a taint to it from having X1 come along.


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## Stretch (Dec 12, 2012)

All I am saying is this.

We have all been in a comfort zone for some period of time and we have developed expectations of what a relationship an intimacy is. When you decide the time is right for you to start dating, I think you will be surprised with how those expectations might be changed. I was with one woman for 24 years. When I started socializing, I caught a break because I was approached and it turned into something exciting and fun and very different from my 24 years.

My GF is radically different from my WAW, she is tall, thin and blonde with two kids and two grandkids vs my WAW short, very mediterranean and we never wanted kids. Intimacy with my GF is different, had to struggle with ED, unexpectedly, she likes toys, doesn't O as easily as WAW. You can imagine it is totally different and has more than its fair share of new and exciting experiences.

You will decide if your experiences are long term, serious, short term, ONS, cautious, reckless, etc, that's you making decisions about your life.

My comment is to not get caught up in what your experiences have been with your spouse. Your new experiences might be not as good, hopefully better but no doubt different.

The excitement alone will put a smile on your face from ear to ear!

Life will be great if you let it,
Stretch


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## nogutsnoglory (Jan 17, 2013)

you say that many of these conversations with her are texts. So print them out for her and her therapist and let her know you wish to attend one therapy session with her. She may deny it, and fine if she does. Either way the mission is the same. show her the stark contrast between her 2 personalities, the obvious changes you have made both physically and emotionally and then let her know that due to her being the one person in your life that appears to be most willing to hurt you at every chance she gets and you have realized that you do not miss her mind, her conversation, you only miss her T & A.
You used to love the rest of her, but since she has decided to try to hurt you weekly emotionally, has done all she can to get other men to be with her, that all you miss is the ghost of the person you thought you married and her body.
Time to finish this mess off.
She needs proper help and you need to move on.


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

Jeff

Do not let her drag you down.

Tell her when she blames you " I am sorry you feel that way".

When a spouse runs away from the issues, runs away from the marriage and seeks a new romantic substitute it does not bring peace or happiness.

She is feeling that unhappiness and directing it towards you.

Call her out on it.

Tell her until she stops running away from you and the marriage that you do not want you hear about it.

It is that simple Chef.

HM


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## LongWalk (Apr 4, 2013)

Welcome to CrossFit: Forging Elite Fitness

Rebuild your confidence


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## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

Thanks for the link LongWalk. I hike with a back pack filled with a medicine ball, and cord wood, about 60 pounds. Great work out. 

She apologized for all the texts she sent me today, and we talked a great deal about our past and present. She admitted the marriage failing was just as much her fault as mine. We laughed mostly. The idea of going on a date together in the near future was brought up. I have mixed feelings about such a thing of course. She has so much baggage that she has yet to even look at. We have a MC session coming up on the 4th of Nov.

My IC and I will be venturing into EMDR, and the first step is to find your safe happy place. I found mine at the last session and have been using it to help find the stillness you've talked about Conrad. 

While sitting next to her I start to feel old emotions and desires growing. I notice this, and start to drum lightly, left right left right, on my knees. Then I focus on my quiet place, and within a few seconds feel serene, and in control. It's a great technique.

Hopefully next week my IC and I can get into some deep repressed memories, try and hammer them out.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

jeffthechef said:


> Thanks for the link LongWalk. I hike with a back pack filled with a medicine ball, and cord wood, about 60 pounds. Great work out.
> 
> She apologized for all the texts she sent me today, and we talked a great deal about our past and present. She admitted the marriage failing was just as much her fault as mine. We laughed mostly. The idea of going on a date together in the near future was brought up. I have mixed feelings about such a thing of course. She has so much baggage that she has yet to even look at. We have a MC session coming up on the 4th of Nov.
> 
> ...


When she pressures you, tell her that she's done you a great favor by waking you up and you are now determined to finish the job by going deep within yourself.

And, you will not be rushed in this process.


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## FC Dynamite (Sep 23, 2013)

Stretch said:


> All I am saying is this.
> 
> We have all been in a comfort zone for some period of time and we have developed expectations of what a relationship an intimacy is. When you decide the time is right for you to start dating, I think you will be surprised with how those expectations might be changed. I was with one woman for 24 years. When I started socializing, I caught a break because I was approached and it turned into something exciting and fun and very different from my 24 years.
> 
> ...


I know these feels bro. Whenever I get around chicks, and they are obviously interested, my penis goes numb... like it's not even there. However, when the stbe comes around, and we share a hug, boom goes the dynamite. It's like I landed on the moon for the first time and have to erect my countries flag.

The way I see it is, I'm just not ready after 11 years with my wife. I knew her inside and out, and I was extremely comfortable around her. Now, I'm 29 and can't get wood with chicks despite having the libido of a ram in mating season.

Whatever, can spend time worrying about it, or just do my thing... so that's what I do.


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## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

Separation has been nothing but a windfall for me. Sure, a ton of pain and so called suffering. But, I feel more awake now than I have in a decade. I believe that my wife and I have the potential to achieve balance and calm. The amount of work to be done is daunting. She may not be able to do it. I know this. 

My thoughts are awash with the words of Krishnamurti, De Mello, Ruiz and more. Lord knows having a wife like mine, gives me plenty of opportunity to apply their wisdom. So much practice is turning what were mere thoughts, into applied reality.

She has done me a great favor, and I have thanked her for leaving recently, much to her chagrin.


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## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

Had a great MC session with the wife, went out to eat after. Really nice talk. Talked more about dating.

Two days later, while talking in our car she says "I think its time". Time for what? I asked. "Time for divorce"

I felt a little ball drop in my stomach but that was about it. I just said "okay", no emotions, "lets do it".

Papers are being gathered, I'm more excited than I thought I would be. 

Thanks to everyone for the words through out this entire ordeal.

I'll be rocking steady.


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

Jeff

Give her what she wants.

You will be all the better for it.

Tell her to go file

HM


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## LongWalk (Apr 4, 2013)

Tough times are still ahead but you doing well. 180 her to protect yourself


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## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

She was cake eating, and I let it happen. I wanted to believe she was reaching out.

I was still protecting myself quite a bit, and how I felt when she dropped the divorce bomb showed me where I was emotionally.

180 is in absolute full effect. I gave a good fight for my kids and myself, but in the end, it was not enough.

So be it. I'm having a hard time finding full time work around my area, I may be moving somewhat far away from my kids. That sucks, but I must realize I can't save them from this experience. When I have my sh!t together, then we will discuss who lives where.

I can only do what's best for me, and show them how a strong balanced man lives his life. My youngest is ready to go with me, she has already told my stbxw. 

There is freedom in losing everything you hold dear.

I can finally be my best, every day.

Awareness, Awareness, Awareness.


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## LongWalk (Apr 4, 2013)

Don't move from your kids.

_Posted via *Topify* using iPhone/iPad_


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## angstire (Jun 4, 2013)

Good for you Jeff. You've got this. You were ready emotionally and even with a left turn like this, it didn't wreck you.

Sorry to hear this is where it's at, I was hopeful for another outcome. But, give defiant people what they want and you're correct, it gives you freedom to find your happiness.

Take care.


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## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

Louis CK: Divorced and Best Dad - Oh My God (HD) - YouTube


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## Kerosene Hat (Nov 12, 2013)

angstire said:


> Hey Jeff, it sounds like you've done part of the 180, which is to work on your health, lose weight, essentially focus on yourself. Continue that. Work out, the athletics will help with getting stress out of your body. Continue the rest of the 180 to focus on you and take the focus off of trying to persuade her to stay. You can't. You can't control anyone but you and trying to get her to stay is a futile exercise in control.
> 
> Yes, she is hugging you to make herself feel like she's still a good person and concerned about you. It's almost entirely for her.
> 
> ...


^^^TRUTH! :iagree:

This sounds like what maybe I should have done, not that it would have helped. I think my wife decided she'd rather hang out with the single "girls" at the age of 33 (and the "girls" are 37-40, with nothing but failed relationships to show for it; great influences there) than work on and/or be dedicated to her marriage. As my buddy told me, after 2 years her shiny wedding lost its luster, her shiny new house lost its novelty and her shiny new husband did, too. As hard as it is (and it seems impossible), the advice above is spot-on for me. Good stuff.


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## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

My stbx was just at my house. Trying to make physical contact with me whenever she could. Really close talking, loving looks and stares. 

She's an impulsive woman/child who has no idea what to do with herself. She actually believes that we will be good friends after all this. "You'll always be a big part of my life Jeff". Her words like 2 days ago. 

We're surrounded by toxic relationships Kerosene. The desire for their acceptance, their bodies, and the pleasure that comes with all that, blinds us to the truth.

Do I love my wife? Sh!t man, I don't know. I miss the company, I miss the sex, I miss the feeling of being part of unit. But, is that love? 

My wife is seriously lacking in a lot of departments that I feel are important. But, I ignored that for over a decade. I was lulled to sleep by a domestic comfortable existence. I got weak.

You have to be the best You that is possible. The 180 is a great first step towards that. My stbx is also 33, and has a slew of older woman telling her she is doing the right thing. But, who cares? It's not about her anymore. Our life is about us. No more focus on them. They don't deserve the attention.


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

Jeff

Your getting there.

Keep detaching. You are starting to see her, you and your marriage clearer.

Never settle Jeff.

HM


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## LongWalk (Apr 4, 2013)

jeffthechef said:


> Had a great MC session with the wife, went out to eat after. Really nice talk. Talked more about dating.
> 
> Two days later, while talking in our car she says "I think its time". Time for what? I asked. "Time for divorce"
> 
> ...


After the in car speech you'd think she be avoiding you.


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

It is called guilt.


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## angstire (Jun 4, 2013)

Yep, they (men or women) rush forward into the breach and do the dirty work. They're able to do this with the work they've done with the rationalization hamster. Then they retreat and play nice. 

"Dirty work done, time to make sure everyone knows I am a good person."

It's an appalling lack of consistency of message.


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## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

I would prefer she avoid me. Today she shows up crying. A close relative told her she's being immature, and needs to get her sh!t together, and work on fixing our relationship. So she's crying in my kitchen and starts in on all our (my) problems in the past. I'm so tired of this victim/persecutor crap. 

She wants a divorce, I'm not fighting it. Why is she in my kitchen crying? Damn it. 

I'm one job away from getting my life together. Her parents own the apt I'm living in, very uncool. Until then I'll be suffering this b.s on a somewhat daily basis. 

Patience and awareness.

I think of George Costannza's father on Seinfeld, "Serenity Now, Serenity Now"!!


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

Her relative is right.

But she has already made up her mind.

Do yourself a favor.

Throw her out.

When she gets mad tell her this:

"I no longer want to hear you crying over a divorce you and a marriage you don't want.

Get out. And don't come back until you grow up and deal with your issues.

I am too busy dealing with life and our children. "

Cut her off. All she is doing is rehashing the crap to convince herself she is making the right decision.

Leave her alone to deal with her guilt.


----------



## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

Her relative is right.

But she has already made up her mind.

Do yourself a favor.

Throw her out.

When she gets mad tell her this:

"I no longer want to hear you crying over a divorce you want and a marriage you don't want.

Get out. And don't come back until you grow up and deal with your issues.

I am too busy dealing with life and our children. "

Cut her off. All she is doing is rehashing the crap to convince herself she is making the right decision.

Leave her alone to deal with her guilt.


----------



## LongWalk (Apr 4, 2013)

If she had found a plan A guy she would have moved on even faster, nobody wanted her, a 33-year-old mother of two who doesn't know why she is so restless.

At the animal level her biological clock is ticking loudly now. So, she has lost attraction for you. She didn't fight hard to figure out how to overcome the problem. Why should you right the universe for her?

Keep working out. You must have lost a lot of weight by now and that could be a reason she is conflicted. You're looking better and along with that you don't want her. That sends her mind into a spin, but then she discovers that she doesn't love you enough.

Angstire's observation about wanting to be nice once the marriage has been condemned is on the mark Before they put down the dogs in the humane shelter, do they give them one last bowl of dog food?

Is your wife trying to give you a little emotional sustenance before she is goes for good? I think Angstire is right on. Tell her you don't need a last bowl of dog food from her. Of course, you should put in different words. How about:

"You promised me a divorce. Are you trying to back out now. What good reason is there for you to mess up our divorce?"


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## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

You guys are great! I'm so lucky for your words. They are exactly what I needed to read.


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## Chuck71 (Nov 5, 2012)

giving defiant people what they want is best medicine

for it rarely, if ever, turns out as they had planned

Jeff you are getting there


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## angstire (Jun 4, 2013)

Jeff, update? How are things?


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## outNabout (Mar 2, 2013)

@ Jeffthechef 
You posted this a while ago and I've not yet read through the thread so I'll try to catch up. But FWIW here's my thoughts on your original post.

I can relate to quite a bit of what you're talking about. Much of it sounds rather familiar. You're not alone and you can find strength and support from knowing that. 

Whats sounds familiar to me: 

1 bad communication in the relationship
2 together since 2001
3 shes "unhappy for years" while you keep trying to keep on 
4 mostly without and plans or dreams for the family 
5 depression affecting the relationship (her/yours/both)
6 realizing you're being detached, reclusive. 
7 Noticing she has done nothing to try and repair our marriage. 



You're entitled to take some time to 'figure yourself out' just like she has done. It might do you good. You talk of realizing that for 5 years you've been "in a deep hole, unhealthy, detached, reclusive. " Continue to work on transforming from this into who you wish to truely become, regardless of who she was/is and is acting like these days. Good for you for seeing a therapist and consciously making an effort to work on yourself. 

When she chooses to have an EA and says shes unhappy... does she also keep telling you it's your fault? Who says its your fault? A marriage is shared and you each contribute to making it work. Be sure you are not putting it all on yourself all the time. Yes you make choices but so does she. 

It sounds like you've put effort towards improvement. Look honestly at her apparent lack of effort to be sure this is the case. If she's in fact done almost nothing to fix the relationship, note that her energy is focused elsewhere to fulfill her own wants and needs. This is telling.

I find it interesting that you say when you two saw a MC, that "in the wife's mind, it was just for help in handling our kids". Did she express this or are you concluding that yourself? If she says that kind of thing and blames you often... this is also telling. 

Maybe try meeting with her in a neutral place rather than your apartment or her place. Avoid the wine. Were you hoping that she's suddenly change her tune after a glass and you'd be back together? 

You say "Today, she's a totally different person; cold, disconnected." But when you look back... how much was she really any different in the past? I'm just guessing here, but when you fed her ego 100% of your energy she was super ready to absorb it? What about the times you didn't have that to give... was she giving and returning that same energy back to you?

Now that you're separated... don't go looking at her phone, and DON'T be sharing a phone. She probably wants to rub those kind of text messages in your face. You don't need or want that kind of hurt! She is likely using it to abuse & control you and has been perhaps doing this for a long time now. 

You say you don't know what to do... but you do!! You need to continue to stop feeding her ego, and let her take on her share.

When you say that this is the first time you've denied her a hug... this is telling. She knows this super kind and loving trait of yours well and has very likely been exploiting it. She might feel/ believe that she can be having an affair and have you. You need to show her your boundaries. Yes you should protect yourself! Although you might sometimes feel like you want reconciliation, I think it's ok to set it aside for a bit and figure it out later if and when it looks like it's a good idea.

You say " All I want to do is hug her, but is that kind of stuff just prolonging the inevitable? " hell yes it is!
Notice your neediness for hugs and physical contact. What if you were able to become more resilient, strong, and stoic? What if you were able to feel more complete and whole as a person regardless of what she does or doesn't do? I'm not saying it's easy, or it doesn't hurt like hell. But like going to the gym and working out... sometimes theres some sweat involved when we need to 'man up' and get stronger.


Your kids need you. And they need you to be that symbol of strength, coping and resilience, in their lives. 

Rather than being afraid of "the silence when they are all gone", and filling this space with mindless distraction, you can find a kind of restful comfort with all the quiet space. Think of it like developing any new skill. There's of course the emotional pain that hurts, and so many of us are going through that too. But having some quiet time to sit, relax and rest your mind is a healthy thing. When the all the thoughts and emotions keep coming up, just let them come and go. Relax and keep breathing.


And here's some big man hugs for you brother... I feel your pain. Stay in touch.


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## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

*We know them by their actions....*

Thanks for the words outNabout. Since she dropped the D bomb on me, I've been focused. I am emotionally stable, and as far as the wife is concerned; emotionally detached would describe my relationship with her now. I see her every day, sometimes for a couple hours. Kid stuff.

We went to the MC again a few days ago. We see the MC once a month to make sure we're doing co-parenting the right way. This was my wife's main reason for going to the MC. I've been okay with that until she told me divorce is happening. 

I told the MC, "since I already see an IC, and with divorce looming I don't feel the need to continue attending these couples sessions." We're doing a fantastic job co-parenting by the way.

My wife speaks up to the MC, and says that she doesn't want divorce. HUH? double take HUH?? The wife wants to double our MC sessions to work on us more. Even the MC did a HUH? 

There was no pleasure in hearing her say she doesn't want divorce. They are just words. 

I have changed in many ways. I have lost over 120 pounds (yes I was a fatty), now I'm starting weight training/muscle building routines. Loose skin sucks.

I have employment, and a much better relationship with my kids. When my wife left, I woke up on many levels; my girls happen to be benefiting from the new chef more than anyone else.

I ran into a woman I used to work with a few years back the other day. She ran up and hugged me in the middle of the market. She said I had a healthy glow about me, and wanted to get together. Not really into that though.

I will continue on this path, and I will continue to rock.

I'm not too concerned with my marriage. I am willing to work with the wife, and the MC; and what happens, happens. At this point I'm not available to any woman, my wife included.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

*Re: We know them by their actions....*



jeffthechef said:


> Thanks for the words outNabout. Since she dropped the D bomb on me, I've been focused. I am emotionally stable, and as far as the wife is concerned; emotionally detached would describe my relationship with her now. I see her every day, sometimes for a couple hours. Kid stuff.
> 
> We went to the MC again a few days ago. We see the MC once a month to make sure we're doing co-parenting the right way. This was my wife's main reason for going to the MC. I've been okay with that until she told me divorce is happening.
> 
> ...


Jeff,

Congrats brother.

Sounds like you're made of tungsten.

Men being men is a beautiful thing.

I wouldn't write your nutso wife off yet. She may surprise you.


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

:iagree:

With everything Conrad said above.

Jeff the "Lite" Chef is doing great. Stay tough.


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## angstire (Jun 4, 2013)

*Re: We know them by their actions....*



jeffthechef said:


> I will continue on this path, and I will continue to rock.
> 
> I'm not too concerned with my marriage. I am willing to work with the wife, and the MC; and what happens, happens. At this point I'm not available to any woman, my wife included.


Nice, good headspace to be in. Congrats.


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## Tron (Jan 31, 2013)

Nice going Jeff!

This one may not be done.

Keep it up brother.


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## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

This is a message board, in a sub forum on the internet. Thus, my gratitude is limited to such things as :smthumbup:

I will say, my emotional progression, and general outlook has been vastly influenced by you good people. Your personal stories, words of wisdom and encouragement, have helped me cut through these weeds of despair. They helped me quickly realize that my life was in fact, not over. And, more importantly, those words helped me realize that I wasn't alone in this experience. 


Thank you


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## Chuck71 (Nov 5, 2012)

Your reaction to her wanting a D

was much like the one you had when she wanted

to save the M

that right there, says it ALL

you are in the driver's seat

I foresee her having to prove 

quite a few things to you


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## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

This past weekend she slept over so we may "feel each other out" a bit. We were supposed to talk about how we're going to try and fix our marriage. She was asleep in my bed before the kids were asleep and was pretty much unresponsive after that. 

Her action, or lack there of, was noted.

I worked the next day, and after work she tells me she can't sleep over again because "we're not going in that direction".

That's fine. Last night she tells me she wants to sleep over and is feeling very affectionate towards me. I say no. I've seen this movie before, the characters aren't developed and the plot sucks. She doesn't share my sense of humor. 

MC session tonight. Since were doing double sessions now, so we can work on our marriage (lol). 

The MC asked what Mrs. Chef wanted to focus on. She says she doesn't know, and is not sure of how she feels about us going forth.

Okay. My turn. I said, I have a great idea, I will discontinue the MC sessions, and Mrs. Chef can see you, the MC, full time one on one. At this time, I do not want to reconcile with Mrs. Chef, and feel everyone's time would be better used if this were in effect asap. The MC said this was an outstanding idea, if Mrs. Chef was okay with it, and was very impressed by my overall outlook and attitude. 

I could feel Mrs. Chef's stare. I could hear the hornets in her head. I could feel the fire of confidence in my chest. 

The ride home was great. I felt great, was whistling. Mrs. Chef was bouncing every where from subject to subject, from us, to stocking stuffing, apologizing for the hell she put me through. To which I replied, it really wasn't that bad. No reply....

Silence is golden.


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## Honorbound (Nov 19, 2013)

jeffthechef said:


> This past weekend she slept over so we may "feel each other out" a bit. We were supposed to talk about how we're going to try and fix our marriage. She was asleep in my bed before the kids were asleep and was pretty much unresponsive after that.
> 
> Her action, or lack there of, was noted.
> 
> ...


If mine slept over she'd likely wake up minus one eyebrow and her hand in a bowl of water....

Way to go, Jeff - you rock!


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## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

I was thinking about pushing my bed out onto the pond in front of my house, but didn't want to sacrifice my mattress.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

jeffthechef said:


> This past weekend she slept over so we may "feel each other out" a bit. We were supposed to talk about how we're going to try and fix our marriage. She was asleep in my bed before the kids were asleep and was pretty much unresponsive after that.
> 
> Her action, or lack there of, was noted.
> 
> ...


I would have advised you "not" to have her sleep over, but you actually managed this better than anyone thought possible.

It may dawn on her that she needs to win you back.

MAY..

Don't count on it.

But, don't count that out either.

Just be you - turn towards stillness.


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## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

In hindsight her sleeping over was a terrible idea. I had a selfish moment, sexual desire has that effect some time. My kids felt the brunt of the mistake, no doubt.

I'll own it. It won't happen again. I didn't even get laid for fugg sake! 

I feel like Neo at the end of Matrix 1. She fires her bullets at me and I see the code of her thought and intention. The bullets just fall away.


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## LongWalk (Apr 4, 2013)

So she wants to stay married because of what? She likes the challenge of rejection, but she is not sure that you are brave enough. 

Are you still losing weight? Another TAM poster is in a sexless marriage with a woman who weight... I hope memory is not betraying me... 330lbs. He says she has accepted herself as an obese person and thus has not drive to change.

Your getting in shape has her wondering about your character and determination, don't you think?


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## Chuck71 (Nov 5, 2012)

She was hoping if you sniffed the snatch

you would do cartwheels for the snatch, you did not

it may have been her last resort

but after all the slideshows you have seen recently

has compelled you to question the validity of the film

some have happy ending, but not many

you are doing what is right for you....5 stars


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## terrence4159 (Feb 3, 2013)

i just joined your thread you are a rock star, the only thing i would say to do different only talk to her about the kids and the divorce. she tries talking to you about anything else dont. she asks how your day is say none of your business you fired me as a husband and friend please keep our interaction to the kids and divorce. if she shows up to your house for anything but the kids ask her to go back to her place.


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## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

As much as I love the idea of being so cold. Currently we share a vehicle, and I see her almost every day. I agree about not talking about the relationship anymore.

I can be nice, not much effort from me, I'm at 50,000.

She wants to stay married because I'm the best friend she's ever had. She told me she's terrified of losing that. 

The last thing she said to me last night.

"You're the most awesome father, our girls are lucky. I'm an okay mom, right"?

Chef: "year, you're okay"


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

jeffthechef said:


> As much as I love the idea of being so cold. Currently we share a vehicle, and I see her almost every day. I agree about not talking about the relationship anymore.
> 
> I can be nice, not much effort from me, I'm at 50,000.
> 
> ...


"I'll stay married as long as I'm ok staying married"


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## angstire (Jun 4, 2013)

jeffthechef said:


> Chef: "year, you're okay"


Brilliant! That's great Jeff. :smthumbup:


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## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

Conrad said:


> "I'll stay married as long as I'm ok staying married"



Exactly Conrad. Sad thing was, I was okay with that, as long as there was a glimmer of hope. That damn hopium. 

She had to borrow money from me for gas. That really peaked my interest since she makes more money than me, and has very little expenses besides rent. 

I checked her bank account. She spent half her salary at a restaurant over the month. What restaurant you ask? The one owned and operated by the EA guy that helped kick start this entire separation. The one who rejected her. 

He doesn't even comp her drinks.:rofl: What a silly woman/child.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

jeffthechef said:


> Exactly Conrad. Sad thing was, I was okay with that, as long as there was a glimmer of hope. That damn hopium.
> 
> She had to borrow money from me for gas. That really peaked my interest since she makes more money than me, and has very little expenses besides rent.
> 
> ...


How does THAT look from 50k?

I would consider printing that out and next time you hear some sob story about how great you are, hand her an envelope with that inside.


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

jeffthechef said:


> He doesn't even comp her drinks.:rofl: What a silly *child*.


Let me correct this for you Jeff.

I hope you agree she has a real weird way of showing her best friend (you) just how special you are.

Glad you are at 50,000 feet.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

happyman64 said:


> Let me correct this for you Jeff.
> 
> I hope you agree she has a real weird way of showing her best friend (you) just how special you are.
> 
> Glad you are at 50,000 feet.


The guy who doesn't comp her drinks takes care of himself.

Jeff should learn from it.


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## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

Her actions betray her words. I don't find this surprising. Nor do I find it unsettling. 

In her world (where the universe revolves around her) she see's absolutely no problem with these scenarios she's creating. 

What will she do when there's no one of value left to validate her "kind, unselfish" nature? 

Who knows? I don't care, and that feels good.


That's enough focusing on her for tonight. 

Thursday nights we each have one daughter, and we alternate every Thurs. Tonight I had D10, and took her to see The Hobbit part 2. It was okay, a little too far from the book, but it was entertaining. 6/10


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## Chuck71 (Nov 5, 2012)

But.....but Chef Jeff you married me

y'know....better (but) worse

how else can I gauge my selfishness and inconsideration

HELP ME! SAVE ME!

YOU'RE NOT LISTENING TO ME ARE YOU!



:rofl:


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## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

The fact that she's completely unaware of any of her selfishness boggles my mind. I watch her parents bend over backwards helping her. She needs money? They give it, even though they have very little. 

I'm focusing on my wife, not because it's the holidays, and I miss her. I'm focusing on her because in her I see me. I see an adult child without the ability to stand alone. I see someone who thinks if they wait long enough, they will get what they want without too much effort. 

I see in her all the things I didn't like about myself. She is a walking reminder of my downfall. 

I am grateful for her.

I am 39 years old and starting over like a teenager leaving the nest.

Five months ago, she mentioned the possibility of separation and I lost it. Depression, sadness, thoughts of suicide. Alone. The thought of having to start over in some sh!tty little apartment at some sh!tty job was too much.

Now, with the help of you good folks, a little IC, and some exercise, I've gotta say I'm pretty f!cking pumped.

I dare to say, I think I'm falling in love with myself. 

I'm Good enough
I'm Smart enough
and Doggone it, people like me.

A little affirmation never hurts


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## ReGroup (Dec 6, 2012)

jeffthechef said:


> The fact that she's completely unaware of any of her selfishness boggles my mind. I watch her parents bend over backwards helping her. She needs money? They give it, even though they have very little.
> 
> I'm focusing on my wife, not because it's the holidays, and I miss her. I'm focusing on her because in her I see me. I see an adult child without the ability to stand alone. I see someone who thinks if they wait long enough, they will get what they want without too much effort.
> 
> ...


Smiling Here.

She came to your life to teach you about you.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

> I dare to say, I think I'm falling in love with myself.
> 
> I'm Good enough
> I'm Smart enough
> and Doggone it, people like me.


Wait till your so darn happy that it overflows to others.

People will want to be around you, associate with you and in time love you.

Keep being you Jeff.

A little self love can go a very long way.

So says the Happyman.

HM


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## Chuck71 (Nov 5, 2012)

jeffthechef said:


> The fact that she's completely unaware of any of her selfishness boggles my mind. I watch her parents bend over backwards helping her. She needs money? They give it, even though they have very little.
> 
> I'm focusing on my wife, not because it's the holidays, and I miss her. I'm focusing on her because in her I see me. I see an adult child without the ability to stand alone. I see someone who thinks if they wait long enough, they will get what they want without too much effort.
> 
> ...


You don't always get what you want

but sometimes, you simply get.....what you need


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## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

I ruined Mrs. Chefs Christmas. 

She asked if she could sleep in my bed with me on Christmas eve. I almost lost my cool. I did ask her how she lives with herself. Spending hundreds of dollars at her EA's restaurant, just to be near him. Then to have the f!cking nerve to ask to sleep in my bed. 

She got really upset with me. Because I looked at her bank account without her permission. I've been the biggest a-hole in the world since then. She's told everyone who'll listen, about how I violated her privacy. 

She of course, has absolutely no fault in any of this.

Funny thing though. Earlier, we were talking about my D12, who is very much like my wife, she has adhd and the cognitive capacity of a 7 year old. I was trying to explain to D12 why she was being disciplined for hitting her sister. An exercise in futility mind you. I had to take a break, and my wife says to me quietly "poor kid, I'm glad I'm not disordered". WHO THE HELL SAYS THAT? Where does it even come from?

Mrs. Chef has now gathered all the necessary paperwork for dissolution. Guess my "privacy violation" lit a match under her butt.

I know for certain she's fully in love with another man, a man who has already rejected her. I must admit, it hurts. It hurts a lot.

For now.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Perfect execution.

Of course she did it.

Of course, she blames you.

Let her think about it.

She wants dissolution - let her drive it.

Stay the course.


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## LongWalk (Apr 4, 2013)

She has to make plan B plan A. Unfortunately the love bank for plan B is overdrawn. If she had spent all those lunches wooing you, haha.


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## Chuck71 (Nov 5, 2012)

you embarrassed her and now she will "show you"

by speeding up the D.....

she is lost, in every aspect

her actions sound like what my X would do (and did)

do you ever kick yourself in the a$$

wondering why you did not leave years earlier?

but hindsight is always 20 / 20


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Chuck71 said:


> you embarrassed her and now she will "show you"
> 
> by speeding up the D.....
> 
> ...


That sound you hear is the popping of window corks.


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## Chuck71 (Nov 5, 2012)

Conrad said:


> That sound you hear is the popping of window corks.


:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:


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## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

I hope everyone at TAM is doing well. 

May 23 is the official divorce date.

I still see her often, and she still talks about how much she misses me, and wants to have fun together. She still wants hugs. She still goes and sees the OM and pines for him, though he's not interested in her in that way.

Ah well, I've got my own car now, and I'm steadily moving on.

Thanks to everyone for their words through out this sh!t.


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

Good for you.

And when she wants a hug bend over and tell her to kiss you right there!


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

happyman64 said:


> Good for you.
> 
> And when she wants a hug bend over and tell her to kiss you right there!


----------



## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

Conrad said:


>


Perfect
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Chuck71 (Nov 5, 2012)

notify her your hugs are taken.....by the grad student

the 28 y/o hottie who has multiple fetishes in bed


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## DiamondsandRust (Jan 21, 2014)

good thread, found some strength while reading. My stbxw cheated on me and i was willing to let it go, but her ego was too big to accept that she messed up and kept blaming me. now i'm moving on, i used to spend all day with my kids and her and it was painful at first but now i'm ok. 

when i drop them off home every nite, it's me time.  

stay strong and keep moving forward, the better you look the more chicks that will look at you. 

went to walmart last nite and got some chicks looking at me. lol


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## Stretch (Dec 12, 2012)

DiamondsandRust said:


> stay strong and keep moving forward, the better you look the more chicks that will look at you.
> 
> went to walmart last nite and got some chicks looking at me. lol


Love it! Huge self-esteem booster. I love to hit the supermarket for a little eye contact even if I do not have anything to buy!

Living life,
Stretch


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## Chuck71 (Nov 5, 2012)

act as if you are "lost" in a store

buying something for your mom

on this cold windy day

you didn't want her to get out in the cold

excellent convo starter.......


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## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

It's been a long time folks. I was divorced on May 23rd. I cannot find a single complaint about my life, and it's getting better.

Finally, thanks to everyone for support and wisdom throughout this ordeal. I'm sorry to see Conrad permabanned. His worth on this forum dwarfed any kind of drama on the political sub forum.

Rock on


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

Happy 4th Jeff. 

Glad you are doing well. 

And you are right about Conrad. 

HM
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LongWalk (Apr 4, 2013)

How do you work custody?

Is she still with the same OM?


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## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

We are doing 50/50 co parenting. She continued going to his restaurant, trying to get closer to him. He wanted none of that. My ex is in a near constant state of sadness, she's financially screwed, and looks quite unhealthy. She's realizing what life is like when you don't have a nice guy to do most of the work for you.


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## LongWalk (Apr 4, 2013)

She was on again off again for months. She thought she was too good for you even when you were losing weight and taking control of yourself.

_Posted via *Topify* using iPhone/iPad_


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## hesitationmarks (Jan 30, 2014)

JTC - Your winning and I bet it feels damn good. Man I wish I was you right now. LOL


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## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

Even at 10 months Hesitation, there are moments that I feel down from this failed relationship. Moments, instead of days, or hours. You just need time, and a modicum of discipline. She sent me a text today. Basically saying that my youngest daughter (11) has a problem(s) with her new guy friend. She sent me the text, not out of concern for our daughter, but to tell me she's seeing someone. Something deep inside me didn't like knowing this. But, it was a tiny fleeting emotion. 

Fake it til you make it.


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

jeffthechef said:


> Even at 10 months Hesitation, there are moments that I feel down from this failed relationship. Moments, instead of days, or hours. You just need time, and a modicum of discipline. She sent me a text today. Basically saying that my youngest daughter (11) has a problem(s) with her new guy friend. She sent me the text, not out of concern for our daughter, but to tell me she's seeing someone. Something deep inside me didn't like knowing this. But, it was a tiny fleeting emotion.
> 
> Fake it til you make it.


Just curious Jeff. 

How did you respond?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## hesitationmarks (Jan 30, 2014)

jeffthechef said:


> Even at 10 months Hesitation, there are moments that I feel down from this failed relationship. Moments, instead of days, or hours. You just need time, and a modicum of discipline. She sent me a text today. Basically saying that my youngest daughter (11) has a problem(s) with her new guy friend. She sent me the text, not out of concern for our daughter, but to tell me she's seeing someone. Something deep inside me didn't like knowing this. But, it was a tiny fleeting emotion.
> 
> Fake it til you make it.


We all know why she sent said it, to get a reaction out of you and drag you down. You will be just fine and indeed healthier without that skank.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

I didn't Happyman. I decided at that point, if my daughter is concerned about something; she knows she can call me. She comes to my house tomorrow for a few days, we can address the subject, if she feels the need to. It's funny, my daughter understands that her mom is disordered; she came to these conclusions without a single negative word from me. I'm very proud of her.


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

Good for you.

Your wife is disordered.

Now do everything in your power to keep your daughter on an even keel.

Enjoy the time with her.

HM


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## jeffthechef (Sep 10, 2013)

My little girls concerns, are now my concerns. This guy "friend" is on methadone, so he can kick his heroine habit. And, as a bonus concern, he also thinks he has been chosen by god to fulfill some quest or something.

What 

The 

F


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

Well your EXW is consistent.

The crazy train keeps on a rollin!

She sure can pick em.


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