# Newbie here - need advice!



## Gladys (Jun 20, 2011)

About a month ago my husband (15 years) sat me down for a heart-to-heart and told me he was unhappy. He thought I was unhappy too, and he had felt this way for years. I didn't think either of us were unhappy. I just felt we were going through a rough patch, due to the stress of raising two kids while holding down full-time jobs. I told him I knew we could work it out. He said he was willing to try - but he didn't think it would work.

He said he loves me, he loves our kids, and he loves our life. But we've both been unhappy - and that most of all, I act like I hate his guts half the time. (And I knew what he was talking about - although I didn't realize it was that bad.)

This episode scared me to death! I started reflecting on how I probably had let the stress of daily life get to me and affect my relationships. What I was feeling was like I had a brush with death - and I instantly felt a new lease on life. I wanted to make the most of everything! Be positive and fun again!

A couple of weeks later, one week ago, he sat me down again. He admitted there was someone else. He'd developed a friendship with her and a fondness for her. But the two of them had decided they needed to cut it off before anything went too far. (She's married too.) But then he also said that over that weekend (one week ago, a couple weeks after we had our talk), that they'd gotten together and "something happened." He maintains that they only developed this "friendship" (which I new realize is an emotional affair) over the last couple of months, they've only gotten together to talk a few times, and they only were "together" (that way) once. (How do you get that close? Is it some fantasy he's feeling - a spark that awakened his desires and now clouds his judgment?)

Again, I told him it was a wake-up call to me and that I had a new lease on life. He said again that he is willing to stay - and try - but he still doesn't think it will work. A couple of days later, he said he was still in contact with her - talking about how her marriage was going, etc - and I hadn't really asked him to cut her off. (I thought he said it was over.)

Well, I started snooping around and found some emails they've been exchanging in the last week. Now it really hurts because they talk about how much they care about each other (even love) - but that they know they need to end it. I know it was wrong of me to snoop - and it hurts so much - but at the same time, I really needed to know. In a way, I'm glad I know what I am up against.

Last night I asked him to talk to me about what was happening. He admitted that they both agreed the only thing to do is end *it* - and work on their respective marriages. He said that his plan is to talk to her or meet with her one last time - hopefully this week. (And only talk.) He wants to make sure everything is OK with her (so it doesn't nag at him forever, wondering). But then once that happens, he can put it behind him (cut off contact) and work with me on moving forward. 

Now, I feel so good knowing that he is willing to end it and move forward. I know that we now have a real chance of being happier than we've been in a while. But I have such nagging doubts - because of some of the things I read in the emails. I guess my questions are this:

1) What are the chances that "the fog" will clear and he will be able to forget about her?

2) Is there any advice on what I should or shouldn't do? (I've been keeping my cool and being strong - and trying to adopt some of the 180.)

Thanks so much for listening.


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## 2xloser (May 8, 2011)

First off, good for you - both of you - for getting this far.
Second, if he's not re-committed to the marriage ("I don't think this will work" doesn't sound committed), then work at getting that far.

In no way does he need to go 'see' her to end it. An email that you have seen and 'approved' will suffice. His need to not having a nagging future thought about her styate of mind is immaterial, as is the OW's feelings here. This is where you stand up, take accountability for getting to this place, but stand firm on how things will be moving forward -- remember, HE is the one who strayed, HE is the one responsible for the A. Now, it is a partnership, and your feelings, views, and actions count. 

If he truly commits, no need for full 180 here, except that he needs to be "all in" on your marriage so that you can be equally "all in". You've shouldered the accountability for your role. But the affair he's had (which I strongly doubt you know all about nor is it 'over') is NOT your fault; do not accept blame here, nor take the role of letting him do what he wants regarding the OW because he might then be unhappy and leave... if that's going to be the case, then you won't stop him by begging or accomodating him.


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## Gladys (Jun 20, 2011)

Thank you so much for your response. It feels so good to get feedback, as I haven't talked about this with anyone. I appreciate the reassurance that we're doing well to get this far. And I also appreciate the reality check. 

I hear what you are saying about the "last meeting." However I believe it is something he needs to do in order to get past it in his head. (I agree that my feelings should count more than hers. But I think this will help him move forward.)

Thanks again. I really appreciate it.


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## 2xloser (May 8, 2011)

A mistake in my opinion, backed by the patterns of countless others before you (and I) ever explored these situations. 

Your trust in him to do the right thing - and be honest with you as he does so -- is what got you to this point. Bad move, and an equally bad precedent to set in letting him drive the agenda as you move forward. Good luck.


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## Gladys (Jun 20, 2011)

Yikes! Point taken. Can you tell me if there is hope that "the fog" will actually clear? Reading others talk about it, it seems a classic case of fantasy clouding reality. Will he ever see sense? (Thanks!)


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## 2xloser (May 8, 2011)

Hope, yes. But I'd suggest the fog doesn't lift all by itself, and it won't lift because he decides to lift it. It will lift because he opens his eyes wide and sees the reality of what's going to happen if it doesn't, and makes a choice for himself. The key question is (or needs to be), "Will the fog lift BEFORE or AFTER your marriage ends?" That is what edging toward a 180 is about, drawing a line with consequences and meaning it; re-defining boundaries and enforcing them. That takes two people to make happen (and it cannot include three!)


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## Gladys (Jun 20, 2011)

Got it. I've read and re-read your post. I can't thank you enough for taking the time to respond.


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## 2xloser (May 8, 2011)

No worries! That's what we're all here for. I'd add you shouldn't take one person's advice as gospel; keep reading & learning, most especially about what you as a BS are 'entitled to' in a marriage working towards R. You've got a lot of work to do, no matter what ultimately happens. Educating yourself from the experience of others is very empowering, so use it to your advantage.

You need to also immediately get full transparency into his email, chat, facebook, and cellphone. If he's got nothing to hide, this isn't an issue. If he does, you've still got a deeper problem and are not working toward reconciliation. You will need to obviously provide him with the same.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Gladys said:


> He admitted there was someone else. He'd developed a friendship with her and a fondness for her. But the two of them had decided they needed to cut it off before anything went too far. (She's married too.)
> 
> *He said that his plan is to talk to her or meet with her one last time - hopefully this week. (And only talk.) *He wants to make sure everything is OK with her (so it doesn't nag at him forever, wondering). But then once that happens, he can put it behind him (cut off contact) and work with me on moving forward. .


Nope. Committing to his marriage means ZERO contact with her at all. NONE. No meeting wtih her, no talking wtih her, no texting/emailing, having sex, etc. 

You NEED to find out who her husband is and TELL HIM TODAY that they are having an affair. You need to do this w/o telling your husband before you do it.

The reason you need to tell is because 1. OW's husband deserves to knwo the TRUTH and 2. It exposes the affair. When an affair is exposed, it's no longer a secret, meeting the dynamic cannot at all ever be the same again after it comes to light. 



Gladys said:


> 1) What are the chances that "the fog" will clear and he will be able to forget about her?.


The fog will clear in 2 ways:
1. He wakes up to how f-cked up what he is doing is and decides to end all contact with OW and commit to his marriage. This generally happens when he realizes and owns this was all his doing and when the betrayed spouse puts a HARD boundary in place. Ex. "If you do not cut off all contact with OW immediately, I will take appropriate actions up to and including filing for divorce. I will not live in an open marriage." And you have to MEAN it. 
2. The disloyal leaves for the OW/OM and with time, the shiny/new wear off and the "real" relationship starts. That is when they realize how "high" they were from the affair... when it's not an affair anymore and the honeymoon phase has worn off. And it will. Because it does in every single relationship.




Gladys said:


> 2) Is there any advice on what I should or shouldn't do? (I've been keeping my cool and being strong - and trying to adopt some of the 180.)
> .


Do not chase after him. You have to make it seem like to him you aren't going to die if he leaves you. DO state you won't tolerate his affair--implement No Contact. Do not make it easy for him. He has to earn his way back to you. Do not just "forgive him" w/o him doing anything in order to earn your trust back. Make a list of things you need him to do in order foryou to even consider taking him back after such a betrayal. DO treat yourself to something nice, pamper yourself, let him know you are a strong woman through your actions. No crying, begging or pleading for him to be with you. Zero, ok?


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

OW being married works in your favor. Because of the fact OW wants to work on her marriage (per your hub) means if you k8ick him out (and remember, you WILL if he doesn't stop all the BS with her), then he will REALLY feel the loss. He won't have her to fall back on and especially not you--his safety net. 

I would also tell him, if we separate because of this, "I will not lie to our children about what happened to lead us to this. And neither will you. You will tell them yourself."


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## Gladys (Jun 20, 2011)

Wow - more good advice. Thanks. I can tell you that her husband knows. Ironically, he was the one who told her that as long as she was in contact with my husband, then there was nothing for them to talk about. Thank goodness! (And why can't I, right?!) And she has told my husband that they both owe it to us - for them to end it and for us to work on our respective marriages. 

Thanks for the advice about not chasing him. I am really working hard on that. I told him I have a new lease on life - and I'm starting to show him that I mean it. Just yesterday I took a nice long bath - as a treat to myself. And I told him that it had been far too long since I did that sort of thing. And I told him the next thing I was going to do is go for a massage/spa day. Because the truth is that I am learning a lot about me through this. I am being positive and everything like that. I haven't begged - I've discussed things in a calm matter. But the truth is deep down I feel like begging him. I want this so much. 

I know we can be happy - happier than we have been in a long time. He said the only thing that was missing was unhappiness that came from years of bickering - and my acting like I didn't like him. He doesn't believe I can just flip a switch - like I appear to have done. 

It seems like there are two issues - the way he feels about her. And the issues in our marriage. I feel like if he will just stick with me, he will see that the issues will get better. But I know I can't control how he feels about her.

I'm hearing from both of you that I need to be stricter right now. I find that scary - which I understand says a lot. Thanks again!


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## Eli-Zor (Nov 14, 2010)

How do you know her husband knows, did she tell you, did your husband tell you. Call the OW 's husband and speak to him yourself , you cannot trust a wayward and your husband is a wayward.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Gladys (Jun 20, 2011)

I know because I read the emails.


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## Eli-Zor (Nov 14, 2010)

Regardless call the husband yourself the OW could be lying. All bridges of the affair must be burnt down permanently.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Gladys said:


> Wow - more good advice. Thanks.


Yeah. We're kind of like Infidelity All-Stars. 



Gladys said:


> I can tell you that her husband knows. Ironically, he was the one who told her that as long as she was in contact with my husband, then there was nothing for them to talk about.


You don't know that. believe half of what you hear and half of what you see. He could just be telling you that. You need to speak with the OW's husband for yourself to confirm. 



Gladys said:


> He doesn't believe I can just flip a switch - like I appear to have done.


Infidelity, as much as it sucks, does make you sort of see how you were acting around thet ime it went down. So it's good you see hwo you were bickering and fighting him a lot. The way you show him you are not going to repeat old behaviors is through ACTIONS. Doing 180s. If you are used to telling him, "I am sick and tired of picking up after you!!!" then switch it to say "I'm doing laundry Tues so if anyone needs washing, pick it up and leave it in the hamper."

If you are used to greeting him at the door when he comes home, be busy when he gets home. Be drinking a glass of wine and talking to a girlfriend on the phone, laughing. 

If you don't meetup with girlfrends often, do it. He'll ask "Where are you going?" (Look cute) and you can say "Oh I"m meeting Velma for a bite to eat." and slip out the door.

(Off topic but the old Scooby Doo cartoons have been stuck in my head all morning.)

If you don't exercise, start walking/running, etc. 

Yep, 180s will make him think WTF but 180 sare mostly for you.

*DO NOT
DO NOT
DO NOT*
beg him at all, oK????



Gladys said:


> It seems like there are two issues - the way he feels about her. And the issues in our marriage. I feel like if he will just stick with me, he will see that the issues will get better. But I know I can't control how he feels about her.
> 
> I'm hearing from both of you that I need to be stricter right now. I find that scary - which I understand says a lot. Thanks again!


Remember, you can't control what he does/says/feels--you are only in control of yourself and how you react. If it was an emotional affair, there will be lingering thoughts there for him BUUUUT if you make it painfully aware to him that you will NOT be around as a back up for him if he doesn't cut that sh-t off STAT...if you do that and he realizes what he's done & how important you and the marriage are, he will wake up really fast.

.


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## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

Maybe I should just copy and paste. :rofl:

It's all so textbook and following the script now.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Gladys... read this thread... this is what happens when you let the wayward back into your life too easily w/o earning their way back:

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping...-leave-me-feeling-frustrated-resentful-2.html


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

lordmayhem said:


> Maybe I should just copy and paste. :rofl:
> 
> It's all so textbook and following the script now.


Yeah seriously. We need to archive our advice.

1. For the BS who come on here and
2. For the DS who come on here


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## 2xloser (May 8, 2011)

Jellybeans said:


> Yeah seriously. We need to archive our advice.
> 
> 1. For the BS who come on here and
> 2. For the DS who come on here


:iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree:
So sad, so true


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## Gladys (Jun 20, 2011)

It's been exactly one week since I registered here and asked for your help, so I thought I would post an update. I honestly believe things are back on track. If it were not for the advice you all gave me - and the reality check - I would not have had the courage to do what I needed to do. The situation would have been drawn out longer and it would have only gotten worse. 

He cut off contact and has taken responsibility and assured me through words and actions (so far!) that he is 100% all-in and committed to our marriage, to making it better, and to building our future together again. He definitely stated that he no longer feels "it won't work." He honestly believes it will - and that we are in a great place now.

(I take the point about still only believing half of what he says.)

The only negative is the fact that I know he still cares for her and even pines for her a bit. (I feel like part of him still wonders what might have been.) But I have to believe that will ease in time - the longer he goes without contact and the longer our new sense of dedication goes on. 

So many things you all told me last week made an impression - even the comments about how this was all so text book. Here are the things that stuck in my head though, every time I though about what I knew I needed to do:

_He needs to be "all in" on your marriage so that you can be equally "all in". Don’t take the role of letting him do what he wants regarding the OW just because he might then be unhappy and leave.

Your trust in him to do the right thing - and be honest with you as he does so -- is what got you to this point. 

He needs to wake up to how f-cked up what he is doing is and decide to end all contact and commit to his marriage. This generally happens when he realizes and owns this was all his doing and when the betrayed spouse puts a HARD boundary in place. Make it painfully aware to him that you will NOT be around as a backup for him if he doesn't cut that sh-t off STAT...if you do that and he realizes what he's done & how important you and the marriage are, he will wake up really fast_

So fingers crossed that this keeps going well - and that we really are back on track. Thanks again for your help. I don't believe I would be at this place today if it weren't for your words of encouragement.


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## 2xloser (May 8, 2011)

Hoooray!!!  :smthumbup:


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