# Am I being silly?



## Sawyer (Oct 31, 2012)

Hello everyone. Like many others, I want to know if I'm being ridiculous or not! If anyone has time to read through this story, I'd so appreciate your thoughts. I tried to keep it short, but it ended up being longer than intended. 

My husband, X has a friend named G. They have been friends for 10 years, though not quite in the traditional sense. They did initially meet in college (in Singapore, where they are from). They weren’t particularly close but did swap emails before they graduated. He then came to finish his education in England & ended up working here. 5 years later he met me & we got married. G went to Australia & moved in with a boyfriend soon after. They broke up a few months ago after being together for a decade. 

Over these 10 years, X & G became like pen pals. They discovered they have quite a lot of other things in common, so would chat online openly. I was always aware of this friendship & it was never something that bothered me. 

2 years ago, I discovered that they had started keeping a private online journal together. In it, they talk about the “what ifs” & their hopes for the future. Although I’ll confess I did feel a little jealous, the things they were talking about weren’t anything to make me worry, so I didn’t mention I knew. 

About a year ago, I got bored one day & decided to have a peek at it. (I know I really shouldn’t have started doing this). Again mostly harmless chat, but one entry played on my mind. G was writing that she had feelings for a male friend. This man confessed he did have feelings for her too, so didn’t feel right about being friends with her anymore. X commented he could see how this could happen as she is “very easy to fall in love with”. I was pretty upset about this, but I gave myself a talking to & decided that it was ridiculous to feel so insecure about one line amongst months of innocent communication. However, I started reading a little more regularly after this. 

Anyway, G broke up with her partner over the summer. She took it very badly & started leaning on X for support. Lots of long messages exchanged. He talked about how devastated he had been to lose his ex before me & said “I like to think, that in another universe, I ended up with her” & how he still felt sad when he sees this ex with her husband. Again, I found this a little upsetting. But I understand, he has a past, I can’t expect him to forget that girl ever happened. 

Finally, last night I saw he had messaged her & told her that “if we were both in different circumstances, I would totally ask you out”. I haven’t read her reply yet, but I’m actually more than just a little upset this time that he feels this way about her. I mean, is this not admitting he has feelings for her? I have been trying to talk myself round, but I can’t let go of it this time. It feels like he isn’t completely happy with me if he is imagining different lives with these other girls. I honestly don’t want to be with anyone except him, so I guess I don’t understand? Is it natural for him to feel this way?

P.S. They haven’t met in person for 10 years. They always planned to one day & included me in these plans. G has moved back to Singapore, so we could have actually met her on our last trip there in May. I thought it strange they didn’t take the opportunity. I later noticed X wrote in the journal he didn’t think it would have been a “good idea” to meet. Well, now I’m reading all kinds of things into this!


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## Mavash. (Jan 26, 2012)

Sawyer said:


> 2 years ago, I discovered that they had started keeping a *private* online journal together.


I was all good till I got to this sentence and it just got worse from there.

No you aren't being silly. This wouldn't be okay with me at all. Keeping secrets isn't okay with me and some of his comments were out of line in my opinion.


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## strugglinghusband (Nov 9, 2011)

you are not being silly....
check this link out..Not just Friends.

Dr. Shirley Glass - NOT "Just Friends"


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## Pault (Aug 15, 2012)

BANG.....
They are testing the waters between eachother.
Why is your H having a secret communication process unless its not for your eyes.
He has made a very hard statement he would ask her out if (you) things were different.
They are starting the emotional getting together process by your description.

You have been amazingly understanding thus far as may wives would have been jumping all over this. The pen-pal connection is no longer just that and you have noted a change in language, terminology and see a wish list being compiled. 
If the role was reversed would your H be ok with a male pen pal, whould be he happy with a secret conversation going on and would he like to see that if things were different youd be wanting to go out emotionally with another guy?

I dont think he'd be clapiping his hands about it. 

I think you need to start the gentle boundry laying process as he seems to have crossed it (from your comments above) - if he denies anythings going on then why the secret discussion, copy this off and hide it away for no as I suspect the etxt content of his secret journal may suddenlyy either disappear of become corrupted and then he confront you with a nothing content document.


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## Sawyer (Oct 31, 2012)

Thank you for the quick responses, guys!

Mavash, I'm not really a secrets person myself (when it comes to my marriage) but my husband thinks everyone needs their privacy, so that's why I tried not to interfere with their journal. I think this is the argument he would use against me if I asked him about this. 

strugglinghusband - I will check out this link right now, thank you very much!

Pault - great advice about keeping records, that's something I hadn't even thought of. You also made me feel better saying I was being understanding so far. Its nice to hear I'm not being overly insecure about this. How to move forward after taking records though, that's something I need to think about very carefully.


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## wiigirl (Jun 14, 2012)

strugglinghusband said:


> you are not being silly....
> check this link out..Not just Friends.
> 
> Dr. Shirley Glass - NOT "Just Friends"


Good link! 








_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Pault (Aug 15, 2012)

There are many of the guys here who an offer huge amounts of very good advice.
Many will refer to a key logger for the computer so you can see whats going on even if your partner is hiding. UK laws and availabilities of software and devices is different to the UK and therefore youll have to sift through the advice for what you can logically do and affordably do.
It may be wise in this stage to keep a cool head, do a little snooping as much as this is against your nature and see what else is there. Your H is not being fair or reasonable so it falls to you to defend your marridge against invaders. 
Please dont feel that you are being dishonest. IN a marridge there IS NO PRIVATE LIFE. That is where the "forsaking all others" comes in the day you marry.
If the actions of one partner make the other feel threatened the you have the right to seek out that threat and do what is legal to remove it. I will commend you on your outlook. Many (and I include me here) would be in a state of heightened awareness long ago with the pen-pal scenario. Big question, why is the female (G) now on her own, what cause her relationship to break up? Did here partner see something of her his side that he didnt like? Dis he see a pen-pal exceed the boundries...
Sorry just a thought after my post, but made me do a double take on G's circumstanes....


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## Sawyer (Oct 31, 2012)

Thanks Pault, I had actually thought about keyloggers before! However, my Husband's design career revolves specifically around computers, so I think he might know if I messed around with his laptop (we don't have a shared one). Also, if I could find a way to get him to be honest with me, I think that would be ideal. 

About G's breakup with her partner, I believe he found out that she had feelings for that male friend mentioned in the journal. Because it had gone no further, they did try to patch things up. But she later discovered he had an affair of his own in April (by reading his chat logs! I guess I'm not the only curious one then) & I think too much damage had been done on both sides.

I don't think the partner was ever aware of this journal, but then I've never said anything myself, so maybe he didn't either. At one point I had considered contacting him & asking if he knew, but decided not to rock the boat.


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## DayDream (May 25, 2011)

I'm willing to bet they were more than friends when they were in school. 

This would be totally unacceptable to me.


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## Sawyer (Oct 31, 2012)

DayDream, I wondered the same! But I did some digging & I'm pretty sure they never dated. I have met all his other school friends from the same circle quite a few times, including one who is a confirmed ex girlfriend. They all say G was never part of their group, she was more a friend of friends. 

Also, on further thought I think he would have told me if there had been anything between them. He has remained friends with all his exes & was open about his past with all of them. 

Actually, I just remembered one line she wrote to him in the journal recently. She said something like "its 2am! I need to stop writing to you like this, you are not my type". I get the feeling any physical attraction isn't mutual, but I do think she really loves all the attention she is getting from him. Based on everyone's advice, I do plan to read her answer to his confession last night & I guess then I might see if she has any bad intentions? 

I don't know, I mean she is going through a tough time, I don't want to be a ***** & take away her support system...
She does seem to put alot of stock in their conversations. She previously commented that she tried reading the bible, but she felt bad because she found more comfort in my husband than she does from God (nice ego boost for him there, eh). Also once went on about how she didn't know what she would do if anything happened to him. She's made suicide attempts before & I couldn't forgive myself if anything happened over my insecurities.


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## DayDream (May 25, 2011)

Sawyer said:


> DayDream, I wondered the same! But I did some digging & I'm pretty sure they never dated. I have met all his other school friends from the same circle quite a few times, including one who is a confirmed ex girlfriend. They all say G was never part of their group, she was more a friend of friends.
> 
> Also, on further thought I think he would have told me if there had been anything between them. He has remained friends with all his exes & was open about his past with all of them.
> 
> ...


She is depending on another woman's man for a support system when she should be finding her own man to use as a support system. 

Everything I've highlighted in bold reads big red flag to me. It crosses a line that shouldn't be crossed when talking to another woman's husband. I'm seeing this totally, if not already in an emotional affair, headed there quick. Especially since your husband has responded by crossing a line himself. Listen to your instincts. They're spot on.


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## DayDream (May 25, 2011)

She is making grandoise ploys for your husband's attention, right down to the suicide attempts...all for attention. When people mean to commit suicide they do. Like my brother. 

She seem like an attention wh*re?


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## strugglinghusband (Nov 9, 2011)

You can look at the Q&A section and also the quizzes, its an eye opener for sure... the book will also help you set boundaries in your marriage....

One of them, below... I took it for my wife, (had E/A with a co-worker that she clamied was just a "Good Friend")


In the new crisis of infidelity, platonic friendships and workplace relationships are turning into emotional affairs, usually gradually, often without premeditation. Parties cross boundaries of emotional intimacy, sharing intimate information with a friend that is usually appropriately the exclusive territory of a husband or wife. When emotional boundaries are overstepped, the partner has taken the first step onto the slippery slope leading to emotional and eventually sexual infidelity. Even if the infidelity is "only" emotional, it often leads to a double life of deception and sexuality, threatening once secure marriages.

If you recognize that your friendship or your partner's friendship may be in the danger zone of too much emotional intimacy, use this awareness to address concerns about your marriage. This quiz will help you see where you stand.

Quiz: Has Your Friendship Become an Emotional Affair?*

Directions: Check Yes or No to the left of each statement.


Yes No


1. Do you confide more to your friend than to your partner about how your day went?


Yes No


2. Do you discuss negative feelings or intimate details about your marriage with your friend but not with your partner?

Yes No

3. Are you open with your partner about the extent of your involvement with your friend?

Yes No

4. Would you feel comfortable if your partner heard your conversation with your friend?

Yes No

5. Would you feel comfortable if your partner saw a videotape of your meetings?

Yes No

6. Are you aware of sexual tensions in this friendship?

Yes No


7. Do you and your friend touch differently when you're alone than in front of others?

Yes No

8. Are you in love with your friend?
Scoring Key:

You get one point each for yes to questions 1, 2, 6, 7, 8, and one point each for no to 3, 4, 5.

If you scored near 0, this is just a friendship.
If you scored 3 or more, you may not be "just friends."
If you scored 7-8, you are definitely involved in an emotional affair.





Good luck, please keep us updated....


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## Sawyer (Oct 31, 2012)

Thank you again for everyone's support yesterday. I do have an update & if anyone has any further advice about how I should handle things after last night's events, I would appreciate it so much.

I didn't have a chance to check G's reply until just before going to sleep. Sadly (considering how I feel now) it was actually our anniversary yesterday & we were celebrating during the evening. It was as lovely as it has been in previous years & I was beginning to wonder if it was really worth causing an upset over possibly nothing. However, I had to know her response. 

Remember how I thought she didn't actually have feelings for him & was just enjoying the attention, despite what a few of you seemed to think? Well, it turns out I'm stupid. 

Her response was pretty much as follows: "Its 4am & I can't even take in the rest of your message, as I keep re-reading that paragraph. I would date you too in a heartbeat, if circumstances were different. There's so much I want to say but I will take this to my grave".

My husband response was something like:"I'm happy that you hold me in high regard, but I'm starting to feel we are overstepping a boundary here & I'm wondering if I shouldn't have made that comment to you. Lets just leave this subject at that, knowing that we care for each other". He then went on to talk about other things. 

I really wanted to keep calm & just wait it out, but unfortunately, I'm not a very good actress & as over the top as this may sound, I felt so horrible & ended up crying. He then asked what was wrong & in the end I had to tell him I read the messages. 

As I knew he would be, he kept saying how disappointed he was that I would read something private. He said I misinterpreted what they were saying & that he was just trying to make her feel better, as she had very low self esteem at the moment. He claimed her response was just referring that if they had both been single 10 years ago, they may have ended up together. He said she was not saying that she had feelings for him now. He said I didn’t understand what she was going through, as I’ve never had a serious breakup (I met him when I was 20, he was 25, so I didn’t really have the same romantic history that he did). 

After he got over his initial defensiveness, he said he did think they were wrong to make those comments to each other. He admitted that (at least on her part) this wasn’t imagining a 10 years ago scenario. He said he didn’t think she would say something so serious sounding in response & he thought that he made it clear in his answer that he didn’t want to talk further about this. He said I really had nothing to worry about & he wouldn’t even consider leaving me for her. 

Although, the way he handled it did make me feel a little better, I can’t help thinking that he is staying with me out of a sense of commitment & honour, not because he thinks I’m any “better” than her. 

It was late last night & we were both off to work early, so I won’t be able to talk further with him until this evening. Any advice on what more I should say or do, if anything? I feel terrible & am finding it hard to think logically. 

(As a final note, he only knows I read a few Facebook messages, he doesn’t realize I know about the journal. I was thinking I should get him to be honest with me about it tonight. The journal is referenced (by a code name) in the FB message, so I can easily ask what the code means, since he knows I read everything anyway & then I can see if he tells the truth?)


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Sounds like a long-term emotional affair based on fantasy. 

She has no reason to be leaning on him for support when he is a married man. Him referencing his ex and saying he wished he ended up with her and whatnot is enough to make anyone feel bad.

He needs to cut off contact with her. Because their relationship is STEALING from your marriage. She was way out of line to tell him that and he knows it. It's not surprising he is mad you saw the messages--he knows he is wrong and got caught out.

I would ask him how he'd feel if you were writing messages to a man from your past and keeping private journals and conversations, telling him that you wished you ended up together "if circumstances were different." Yeah. He wouldn't like it ONE bit.


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## Sawyer (Oct 31, 2012)

Hi Jellybeans - thank you for the response. I have indeed confronted him now, at least partially (just detailed in the post before yours, we must have been typing at the same time!). Not sure where to go from here, but I guess it is now out in the open...


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

I would get the book Not Just Friends and give it to him.

Tell him a marriage needs *BOUNDARIES* and because of the things they have told eachother, you feel it's inappropriate and unfair to your marriage that he continue any kind of relationship with her, when it's clear she has feelings for him and he also went against your marriage by telling her these things. It's totally inappropriate and he knows it. 

Ask him how he would feel if you did the same thing. 

This chick wants your husband. That's plain to see.


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## Soifon (Oct 5, 2012)

Sawyer said:


> Her response was pretty much as follows: "Its 4am & I can't even take in the rest of your message, as I keep re-reading that paragraph. I would date you too in a heartbeat, if circumstances were different. There's so much I want to say but I will take this to my grave".


Obviously she wants him but she is also actively trying to lure him away from you. That response is completely inappropriate to a married man and she was baiting him with it. Testing the waters to see if he would try getting her to tell him what it is she wants to say but "won't" (which is bs she will). Her wording is to pique his interest and draw him in and if he did that she would see a green light to go ahead and push this to the next level.

His argument for privacy is no longer valid because when you gave him privacy this is what he did with it. You should explain to him how this may not have gone bad yet but it was going there and definitely ask him to turn the table and see how he would feel if this were you doing it.

Also, she is definitely an attention ***** and I am fairly certain her suicide threats are all talk. Even if they weren't though, you are not responsible for her emotional well being and neither is your husband. He needs to cut contact with her and she needs to find people that she is physically near and that are not married to have relationships with.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Haha you could copy/paste her amorous message back to her in an email saying "This is completely inappropriate. You need to find your own man and stay out of our marriage. You would not like it one bit if you were married and someone was doing this to you." 

This woman is a cad. And she is NO friend of your marriage.


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## CandieGirl (Apr 27, 2011)

Jellybeans said:


> *Haha you could copy/paste her amorous message back to her in an email saying "This is completely inappropriate. You need to find your own man and stay out of our marriage. You would not like it one bit if you were married and someone was doing this to you." *
> 
> This woman is a cad. And she is NO friend of your marriage.


Oh, please, do this...:iagree: That is so my style!


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## DayDream (May 25, 2011)

Jellybeans said:


> This chick wants your husband. That's plain to see.


THIS!!!! :iagree:


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## DayDream (May 25, 2011)

Jellybeans said:


> Haha you could copy/paste her amorous message back to her in an email saying "This is completely inappropriate. You need to find your own man and stay out of our marriage. You would not like it one bit if you were married and someone was doing this to you."
> 
> This woman is a cad. And she is NO friend of your marriage.


:iagree::iagree:


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## Alpha2012 (Nov 24, 2012)

This was an interesting post and I admire you for all the patience you have demonstrated over time. G is totally wrong but it will all catch up to her and although I don't agree with your husband's privacy theory, I do like his reply that things between them were getting more serious than they should. As far as your fear of him being with you solely due to commitment goes, I don't think that's really the case. Maybe, the messages with G made him go back in time when he was younger and free and in college. He remembered the good old times - it's ok. HOWEVER, what I would really pay attention to now is whether he continues to talk to her now that you know about their relationship. Whether he had different intentions with her or not, now that he knows that you are upset and that their relationship is causing you pain, he should really cut any contact with her, or at least for a little bit until you gain your confidence and trust in him.


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