# Back after 7+ years



## tryingtogetover (Feb 7, 2015)

I originally posted here in September of 2009: 
http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/8146-how-deal-wifes-ea.html

My wife and I are still together and doing well, but there are a few lessons that I learned in dealing with this that will hopefully help those new to infidelity. I did not return here after my initial post, but I eventually became active on another forum. I continued to visit this site and read the posts here for insight and information.

As I said, my wife and I are still together and our marriage is in a good place, but when first confronted with her infidelity I made some huge mistakes that cost me years of unhappiness. I hope that the information below will help you avoid the mistakes I made. Think of this as a "what I wish I would have known" post.

1. When you discover your spouse has been unfaithful, act immediately and decisively.
I know this is a difficult time for you, and that your emotions are all over the place, but you need to overcome those emotions and act. Now. If you are unsure of what to do, listen to the posters here. Trust me. They know what they are talking about. The best course of action will be dependent upon the specifics of your situation, but sitting around in confusion and pain will not serve you well. You must act now to get yourself out of infidelity. Do it for you and your future happiness.

2. Do not trust anything that your unfaithful spouse is telling you.
Yes, you have trusted them unconditionally up to D-day. Yes, you cannot believe that they are capable of lying to you and hurting you more. Surely when confronted, they will see the light and immediately correct their behavior in order to help you. This is not the case in most situations. You now know they are a liar. They have proven that to you by their affair. They will continue to lie to you to protect themselves at this point. Your feelings do not matter to them at all right now. They are going to lie to you to avoid consequences. They are going to try and manage the situation to their benefit. With rare exception, what they are telling you right now is what they think you need to hear. Trust your gut, not your spouse.

3. You only see the tip of the iceberg. There is much more.
Barring extraordinary circumstances (extraordinary to the point of vanishing, really), this is not new behavior. Your spouse is a cheater, and they have been crossing the line in some way for a long time. Most likely their entire lives. Just because you have been blind to their behavior up to now, don't think that this is a one-off. You just managed to catch them this time. Your spouse has something within them that desires sexual attention from others. This is why IC is recommended for cheaters. They need to figure out what is at the root of this need for attention and address it. If you rug sweep and trust them right now, they will be unfaithful again, just more careful in doing so. Do not fall for their proclamations that this was a one-time "mistake." It never is.

4. Unless your spouse is immediately contrite and willing to do whatever it takes to repair the marriage and give you all the information you request, detach from them emotionally.
Your spouse will probably follow up their lies with some form of "it is your fault that this happened" when they realize they cannot lie about what you know. Know that right now, if you try and push them towards reconciliation, they will resent you and become angry and defensive. Your pleas for information and love will fail. They don't care. Start doing things for you. Engage with your friends and family. Move on with your life, and devote time to improving yourself. This is one thing I did correctly. I went back to school and am in the process of finishing my PhD, something I had thought about for years. Do not waste time trying to fix your marriage with an unrepentant, unremorseful spouse. It will not work.

5. You cannot nice them back into caring for you.
Your spouse has already detached from you emotionally, and poured their emotions into another person. Right now they are probably disgusted with you and wish that you would just leave them alone. Your letters expressing love for them and telling them how much you love them will be met by eye-rolls. Again, right now you do not matter to them. They may not want to divorce, but they are not staying in the marriage for you. They are staying in it for themselves, the children, their reputation. Stop trying to get through to their heart. Right now, you will fail and your weakness will only increase their disrespect for you.

6. Decide what you want, and take control of your life.
If you start dancing to their tune and letting their behavior drive your own emotions and actions, you are going to lose all respect for yourself. Take charge of you. They are going to do what they are going to do, and there is nothing you can do to change that. Move forward for yourself. It may take some time to figure out what you ultimately want for the relationship, but start putting your focus on that instead of your spouse. Speak with attorneys, talk to trusted family and friends, get into counseling. Take these steps to find advice and understanding of what is best for you going forward, not as a way to try and save your marriage. You cannot save your marriage alone, no matter how badly you want to. Your marriage has been destroyed by your spouse's actions. Take control of your own life, right now, and start moving forward for your own happiness. Maybe your spouse will follow. Maybe they won't. Right now that should not be the determining factor in doing what you need to do for you.

7. Your marriage is dead. Mourn it, but don't think that you can or will ever have the old marriage back.
Don't fall into the trap of trying to get back to normal, trying to get back to the way it was. This will not happen. Your spouse has destroyed the marriage, and you need to move forward. You can build a new marriage if your spouse does a ton of difficult work on their own towards that end, but don't expect that to happen. You may need to divorce and get your spouse out of your life, no matter how much they insist they love you. If you figure out that their affair is a deal breaker, don't waste the precious time you have left on this earth trying to overcome what you cannot overcome. Your spouse will probably tell you many times, in some fashion, that they just want your lives to be normal again. This is them expressing their desire to have you get over the affair. This new reality is now normal, and will always be. Even if you reconcile, their affair will be part of the "normal life" that you build going forward.

8. Trust and forgiveness.
Put these words out of your mind for the time being. Probably for several years. As much as you hope to get over this in a few weeks/months, you will not be able to do so. Yes, you are a strong person and different from everyone else, and you think you will be able to deal with this and forgive your spouse by next Thursday. You aren't the exception. You will not be able to put this behind you in a short amount of time. Even when your spouse is doing everything in their power to help you, this journey is going to be years in length. Accept that now if you are willing to reconcile. No matter how religious you are, no matter how forgiving and loving you are, this emotional roller coaster is going to persist for a long time. Unearned trust and forgiveness are recipes for disaster. Rug sweeping this will only torment you. Your spouse's affairs must be dealt with, head on, and your emotions need to be felt and expressed. Dealing with this is the only way to move forward.

Some betrayed spouses will immediately file for divorce. Good for them. I assume that you are here as a newly betrayed spouse because you hope to save your marriage. That can be a good attitude and goal. Just keep your eyes open at all times, and don't fall into the many pitfalls that are awaiting you on your journey. Get and stay strong. You will be okay ultimately, but only if you take the decisive steps necessary to get yourself out of and away from infidelity. For now, listen to the advice you get here from people who know what they are talking about. They have been going down this path much longer than you, and their advice is priceless. It may be hard to hear and take, but they know what they are talking about.


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## browser (Oct 26, 2016)

Seems like way too much work just to get to a place that isn't anywhere close to where you were in the very beginning and in a place where you'll always be looking over your shoulder. It's not like your wayward spouse is the only available woman on the planet, there are in fact countless others with whom you could have the sort of relationship that your cheating spouse can never, ever have with you.


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## tryingtogetover (Feb 7, 2015)

I hear you and agree browser. It is a ton of work, and it isn't for everyone. I am not a reconcile at any cost person by any means. My marriage is never going to be where it was in the beginning, and for that I am glad. It really wan't that great in the beginning. It can be a good marriage going forward, however.

I agree with you though. People need to understand exactly what you are saying before they make any decisions about reconciling. Anyone who chooses to divorce over this is not making a bad choice.


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## Pixel (Jan 10, 2017)

Thank you so much for writing this.


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## barbados (Aug 30, 2012)

tryingtogetover said:


> I hear you and agree browser. It is a ton of work, and it isn't for everyone. I am not a reconcile at any cost person by any means.* My marriage is never going to be where it was in the beginning, and for that I am glad. It really wan't that great in the beginning*. It can be a good marriage going forward, however.
> 
> I agree with you though. People need to understand exactly what you are saying before they make any decisions about reconciling. Anyone who chooses to divorce over this is not making a bad choice.


So I am curious then as to why you stayed.


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## browser (Oct 26, 2016)

tryingtogetover said:


> It is a ton of work.. My marriage is never going to be where it was in the beginning, and for that I am glad. It really wan't that great in the beginning. It can be a good marriage going forward, however.


Wait, if your marriage wasn't that great to begin with, and it won't ever be even "that" good ever again, then what's the point?

Unless you're with the only potential partner within a 200 mile radius, what's keeping you in a situation where you are destined for 'less than satisfied" in addition to all the residual post affair crap that you'll always be dealing with to some extent?

That 'ton of work' isn't going to give you a reciprical payoff.


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## tryingtogetover (Feb 7, 2015)

barbados said:


> So I am curious then as to why you stayed.


Originally? Because I was weak and too afraid to do anything else. Having four young kids was also a big factor. I ultimately detached from my wife emotionally and went to work on myself. She saw this and it scared her into finally dealing with her issues, and has done a ton of work on herself in the past couple of years. I was planning on staying until the youngest was 18 and then divorcing. I don't think that was a great decision, but it was the least-bad one in my estimation at the time.

Her changing and truly dealing with everything convinced me to give her and the marriage a chance. So I guess you could say that ultimately "**** happened," and here I am. 

I'm glad to be here.


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## tryingtogetover (Feb 7, 2015)

browser said:


> Wait, if your marriage wasn't that great to begin with, and it won't ever be even "that" good ever again, then what's the point?


It was not a great marriage to begin with, but it can be a good one now.

I'm not sure what you mean by "reciprocal payoff."

I am satisfied now. My original post was intended to help newly betrayed spouses to understand what exactly is going on right now. I am not encouraging anyone to take my path. It sucked. I would have done things differently if I knew then what I know now. I would most likely be divorced and happy. It has worked out that I am not divorced and happy.


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

Here is what I have learned. You always have better options than to stay with someone who abused you. The part of the brain that controls empathy is defective in most cheaters excluding the drunken one night stand kind. Some people have it in them to lie over and over and deceive the ones they say they love, and some people can't. You are better off removing the former from every aspect of your life, let alone as your spouse. I really don't think many people who have been cheating on have a good basis of comparison to understand what a raw deal they are getting by staying. It's better to talk to people who left and moved on, ask them if they compare the difference after they left. Most if not all will say they wish they had left sooner. 

(Since I am getting so much abuse in my other thread I thought I'd just pile on.) >


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## TheTruthHurts (Oct 1, 2015)

Good post. I doubt the newly betrayed can hear it but it would be great printed out and folded up in their pocket 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## browser (Oct 26, 2016)

tryingtogetover said:


> It was not a great marriage to begin with, but it can be a good one now.
> 
> I'm not sure what you mean by "reciprocal payoff.".


I don't either. Sometimes I just like to throw a large multisyllabic word in there to make my posts seem smarter. 

Actually I was suggesting that the ton of work you put in won't reap the benefits that that same ton of work might have garnered if it was directed towards a person who didn't screw you over.


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## Danny4133 (Jul 24, 2016)

Thank you Trying
I'm 7 months in now, dealing with a liar and unremorseful WW, still won't admit she's in A despite all the proof. Taking all the advice from people in TAM CWI pushed me to do what I would've done and promised to do should this ever happen and filed very quickly. 

The UK D process is slow but no regrets, 180 and no contact was launched 2 days in to seperation and I'm getting there. All the stuff you've described about letting go and moving on just backs up that yes I made the right choice, acted upon the advice and rediscovered the inner me pre relationship. Escaping and shutting down away from the manipulation and abuse is an absolute must for any newly BS to prevent the gasligting. 

Acting swift and detaching, playing catch up emotionally and putting ducks in said row pretty quick has helped me immensely in this process of healing.

Thanks again.


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

Danny4133 said:


> Thank you Trying
> I'm 7 months in now, dealing with a liar and unremorseful WW, still won't admit she's in A despite all the proof. Taking all the advice from people in TAM CWI pushed me to do what I would've done and promised to do should this ever happen and filed very quickly.
> 
> The UK D process is slow but no regrets, 180 and no contact was launched 2 days in to seperation and I'm getting there. All the stuff you've described about letting go and moving on just backs up that yes I made the right choice, acted upon the advice and rediscovered the inner me pre relationship. Escaping and shutting down away from the manipulation and abuse is an absolute must for any newly BS to prevent the gasligting.
> ...


Congrats. Your bravery (and what you are doing is brave and very hard) is going to pay off in your life. Think of it as emotional boot camp. I remember it well when I had to move on. My Dad cheated on my Mom, so when I was going through it, she told me something that changed my life. Once you go through this you will never allow anyone to emotionally abuse you again, because you know that if you could get through this, you can get through anything. If you think of it that way the fear will be gone. There is tremendous strength in that. I never fear getting cheated the same way I once did, I know it would hurt like hell but eventually, I would be fine. Now even if my wife cheated on me, we would be done. You will know that too one day. 

Buck up my friend, this too will pass.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

@tryingtogetover, please forgive sokillme and browser. They have their own agenda here on TAM, which includes berating any BS who chooses to even attempt reconciliation.

I found your post to be excellent - it should be added to this thread I think

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/32002-welcome-tam-cwi-newbies-please-read.html


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## browser (Oct 26, 2016)

Hope1964 said:


> @tryingtogetover, please forgive sokillme and browser. They have their own agenda here on TAM, which includes berating any BS who chooses to even attempt reconciliation.


 @Hope1964 and I obviously have vastly differing definitions of "berating".

In fact yours doesn't even resemble the generally accepted definition of berate which is _"scold or criticize (someone) angrily."_

_synonyms:	scold, rebuke, reprimand, reproach, reprove, admonish, chide, criticize, upbraid, take to task, read someone the riot act, haul over the coals_

Not seeing that anywhere in my posts which are nothing more than a different or even opposing opinion.


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## tryingtogetover (Feb 7, 2015)

Hey Hope, it's all good. I understand that for some, infidelity is an absolute deal breaker. That is their decision to make, and I don't fault them one bit for doing so. I think that perspective is needed for people who are learning to deal with this. They will certainly hear someone in their life tell them to forgive and forget, and that they shouldn't divorce. Both pieces of advice are legitimate and I believe given with the best of intentions.

I'm not in either camp. I think it is up to each individual to determine how they react to being cheated on. We all have a tendency to think that what has worked out best for us is best for everyone. In my experience that's seldom the case with anything.


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## Lostinthought61 (Nov 5, 2013)

Trying, do you feel that you got the complete truth from her? And does she demonstrate to you that she is happy you stayed n this marriage? Thanks for sharing.


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## tryingtogetover (Feb 7, 2015)

Xenote said:


> Trying, do you feel that you got the complete truth from her? And does she demonstrate to you that she is happy you stayed n this marriage? Thanks for sharing.


Yes, I have gotten the complete truth from her. She passed a polygraph to confirm that fact.

She is constantly demonstrating by her actions that she is happy I stayed in the marriage. She realized during IC and reading on her own how destructive her actions and thinking were, and she has addressed those issues. It has been a real eye-opener for both of us.


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## drifter777 (Nov 25, 2013)

tryingtogetover said:


> Originally? *Because I was weak and too afraid to do anything else.* Having four young *kids was also a big factor*. I ultimately *detached from my wife emotionally* and went to work on myself. She saw this and it scared her into finally dealing with her issues, and has done a ton of work on herself in the past couple of years. I was planning on staying until the youngest was 18 and then divorcing. I don't think that was a great decision, but it was the least-bad one in my estimation at the time.
> 
> Her changing and truly dealing with everything convinced me to give her and the marriage a chance. So I guess you could say that ultimately "**** happened," and here I am.
> 
> I'm glad to be here.


The bolded was me - exactly. I stayed and have regretted it ever since. Like you, I gradually detached from my WW but after stuffing everything into an emotional box and burying it in my mind it continued to be easier to stay than to go. 

I often give pretty much exactly the same advise as you but I do it in this form: 1) go no-contact immediately 2) one of you move out ASAP 3) see a lawyer and start divorce proceedings. If at some point your WS comes crying and begging on their knees for another chance - you have a decision to make, but keep marching toward divorce-day until you either decide to try reconciliation or it's time to sign the papers. Some call this the 180 - I don't because it is in no way a strategy to "save" your marriage. This is the best path to follow in order to begin healing. 

I am a BH and stay out of the thread's of BW's because I don't feel qualified in any way to provide them with advice. My strong underlying belief is that all betrayed husbands should divorce. I say this because the chances that they will ever "successfully" reconcile are so small as to simply not be worth the risk of even trying. There are way, way to many BH's who have stayed married to her but are anything but reconciled. Like me, they accept an unhappy marriage because I guess it's better than the nothing they think they'd have if they divorced. I'll include you in this group - you clearly have accepted staying because it's easier than not staying.


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

drifter777 said:


> The bolded was me - exactly. I stayed and have regretted it ever since. Like you, I gradually detached from my WW but after stuffing everything into an emotional box and burying it in my mind it continued to be easier to stay than to go.
> 
> I often give pretty much exactly the same advise as you but I do it in this form: 1) go no-contact immediately 2) one of you move out ASAP 3) see a lawyer and start divorce proceedings. If at some point your WS comes crying and begging on their knees for another chance - you have a decision to make, but keep marching toward divorce-day until you either decide to try reconciliation or it's time to sign the papers. Some call this the 180 - I don't because it is in no way a strategy to "save" your marriage. This is the best path to follow in order to begin healing.
> 
> I am a BH and stay out of the thread's of BW's because I don't feel qualified in any way to provide them with advice. My strong underlying belief is that all betrayed husbands should divorce. I say this because the chances that they will ever "successfully" reconcile are so small as to simply not be worth the risk of even trying. There are way, way to many BH's who have stayed married to her but are anything but reconciled. Like me, they accept an unhappy marriage because I guess it's better than the nothing they think they'd have if they divorced. I'll include you in this group - you clearly have accepted staying because it's easier than not staying.


Dude you can still leave it's not too late. Your post is so depressing. Nothing great in life is easy.


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

tryingtogetover said:


> I originally posted here in September of 2009:
> http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/8146-how-deal-wifes-ea.html
> 
> My wife and I are still together and doing well, but there are a few lessons that I learned in dealing with this that will hopefully help those new to infidelity. I did not return here after my initial post, but I eventually became active on another forum. I continued to visit this site and read the posts here for insight and information.
> ...


Ever wonder that if you followed these steps you probably wouldn't have stayed because you would have sufficiently detached quickly enough to be able to move forward without her. My contention is part of why you stayed is because you were not strong enough (your words) to establish control of your life, and the motion life as it is wont to do flowed in this the reconciliation direction.


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## AVR1962 (May 30, 2012)

Sometimes it takes us years to stop the denial in our heads but once we see the light and truly have felt that brick lodged between our eyes we can finally make the steps to move on. I have been on here for years trying to get help to try and understand my husband (now ex), thinking something was not right but not ready to leave. I finally had my gut full and left. I felt so free wrapping up all my belongings and driving away but there is a process to go thru especially when you have been married 20+ years. It was far from perfect but I adjusted, somewhat, to the way we were living. I didn't like much of what was happening but yet there was a security....this was a life we had built together. When you leave it, you leave all of what you built together behind and that can tug at the heart. Life might not have been perfect, may infact have been far from it but as you venture into a world of your own you realize too that life is not perfect there either.....you just do not have to put up with your ex partner's imperfections or the decisions he/she made that hurt you. 

It makes me wonder if there really is such a thing as true love or finding love at all.


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

AVR1962 said:


> Sometimes it takes us years to stop the denial in our heads but once we see the light and truly have felt that brick lodged between our eyes we can finally make the steps to move on. I have been on here for years trying to get help to try and understand my husband (now ex), thinking something was not right but not ready to leave. I finally had my gut full and left. I felt so free wrapping up all my belongings and driving away but there is a process to go thru especially when you have been married 20+ years. It was far from perfect but I adjusted, somewhat, to the way we were living. I didn't like much of what was happening but yet there was a security....this was a life we had built together. When you leave it, you leave all of what you built together behind and that can tug at the heart. Life might not have been perfect, may infact have been far from it but as you venture into a world of your own you realize too that life is not perfect there either.....you just do not have to put up with your ex partner's imperfections or the decisions he/she made that hurt you.
> 
> It makes me wonder if there really is such a thing as true love or finding love at all.


You just haven't gotten there yet. No relationship is perfect, but you will be surprised how much easier it is when your trust is rewarded, not taken advantage of. This is the foundation, so when you don't have that it is almost impossible to have success. Have hope, it can be found.


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## AVR1962 (May 30, 2012)

sokillme said:


> You just haven't gotten there yet. No relationship is perfect, but you will be surprised how much easier it is when your trust is rewarded, not taken advantage of. This is the foundation, so when you don't have that it is almost impossible to have success. Have hope, it can be found.


Thank you! Your words are very encouraging. You are so right in that my marriage was based on mistrust and I was still trying to make it work. Relationships have to be mutual in all ways.


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## JayOwen (Oct 26, 2016)

drifter777 said:


> 2) one of you move out ASAP


 @drifter777 It should be noted that if you have kids you should NOT do this, as it becomes the basis for the "normal" household that the judge will consider during divorce, at least this was the advice of my own lawyer. In other words, you'll be at a sever disadvantage when hashing out child support and how much time you get with the kids. My lawyer advised me to stay in the house until such time as the papers are filed.


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## JohnA (Jun 24, 2015)

@JayOwen, 

Your right grabbing the phone will always turn into a wrestling match, boom BS is in jail. 

How are you doing?


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## drifter777 (Nov 25, 2013)

JayOwen said:


> @drifter777 It should be noted that if you have kids you should NOT do this, as it becomes the basis for the "normal" household that the judge will consider during divorce, at least this was the advice of my own lawyer. In other words, you'll be at a sever disadvantage when hashing out child support and how much time you get with the kids. My lawyer advised me to stay in the house until such time as the papers are filed.


Yes, you are absolutely correct. When I wrote it I wasn't able to figure out how to put the "see a lawyer & start divorce" with the "move out" properly. What I really mean is see a lawyer and tell him/her that you do NOT want to cohabitate with WW one second longer than you have to and you want him/her to advise you as to the legal ramifications. 

I am really adamant about the need for BH to put physical distance between himself and WW. He needs to stay away from her manipulation & gaslighting as well as begin the detachment process. It's just so important.


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## JayOwen (Oct 26, 2016)

drifter777 said:


> Yes, you are absolutely correct. When I wrote it I wasn't able to figure out how to put the "see a lawyer & start divorce" with the "move out" properly. What I really mean is see a lawyer and tell him/her that you do NOT want to cohabitate with WW one second longer than you have to and you want him/her to advise you as to the legal ramifications.
> 
> I am really adamant about the need for BH to put physical distance between himself and WW. He needs to stay away from her manipulation & gaslighting as well as begin the detachment process. It's just so important.


 @drifter777 Sorry, didn't mean to convey a sense of "that's bad advice!" just adding detail similar to what you note above


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