# Husband Doesn't Want to Talk- Told me to post on a Forum So Here I am



## shivat (Jan 23, 2015)

It's taken some time for me to decide to post on a forum about my problems. Mostly, I felt like people that don't know my husband or might not be able to give helpful advice specific to us. But with some thinking, I decided that maybe I can give enough details that someone out there can give some tips, feedback, advice, etc that will help. 

To begin with, my husband I have been married since April 2013- so almost two years. I have two daughters from a previous relationship- they are 14 and 17. My daughters are homeschooled and have been since they were in 2nd and 4th grade. My husband I probably didn't meet in the most conventional way- we were co-workers, who also worked from home so we spent a lot of time talking to each other via Yahoo Messenger , Skype, and Facebook before deciding to date. He moved 11 hours away from another state to be with me-which to me, has always said a lot about him because he moved away from the family and friends he had to be here with me allowing me to still be near my family.
In our talks, and there were so many of them before we moved in together, we discussed everything. We talked about what each of us expected of the other one and everything seemed perfectly normal. We both wanted someone to spend time with, someone to do things with that we enjoyed, to buy a house, to save money, etc. He told me how much he loved playing video games and going to the beach to sit and think(which was nearby for him before he moved). I told him how much I loved working outside in my yard, planting flowers, spending time with my kids, and that I wanted to buy a house on the beach. To make a long story short, there wasn't much, if anything, we disagreed on.
So now on to the bad part, I guess... I noticed within the first few months of being with him that he's not an OCD cleaning freak like I am. Even though he doesn't realize it so much, I changed a lot about that part of me due to him. When I say due to him, I want to be clear- it was because I'd rather spend time with him and/or the kids than work on meaningless tasks around the house. He taught me how to let some things go without even realizing it. However, because he wasn't around for the "before" stages of the OCD cleaning that I frequently displayed, he thinks I'm still a bit obsessive in the cleaning department. I usually spend about an hour to an hour and a half each day doing normal household things such as dishes, laundry, picking up things are left laying around, making beds, etc. Then when I am off on the weekends, I choose one of those days to "really" clean the house(around 5-6 hrs)- scrub toilets, showers, clean out the fridge, vacuum, etc. (and to be fair, if we didn't have four small dogs who drive me insane, I could maybe do a little less however they are the kids parents and I don't want to be the satanic parent who gives away the dogs). I feel like this is a huge improvement over my pre-marriage cleaning that would take 4-5 hours a day and and both days off work.. In the summertime, I cut the grass, weedeat, blow leaves and dirt from the driveway, try to keep things neat outside basically.. In the winter months, there's not as much to do outside so maybe rake/blow leaves once a month at most. 
My husbands argument with the above is that I spend too much time cleaning and this is time that I could be spending one on one with him. While I would soooo much love to be able to do that-seriously, I would.. I have reminded him that these are just part of the responsibilities of having a home, me having kids, etc. He disagrees. Now in his defense, he bought me the absolute best gift ever this year- a Bravva floor sweeping/mopping robot. I can use this downstairs on our hardwoods and that immediately saves me 30 mins a day. While that thing is cleaning the floor I can be doing laundry so it's like there's two of me. 
My argument with him though is that if he wants more time with me then he could help me out a little.. Now, don't get me wrong.. My kids are my kids and my pets are my pets. He didn't want the pets and the kids are technically old enough to be doing somethings themselves. The things I'm asking him to do to help out are clean our bedroom (make the bed each day and pick up random little things that get left around to put them away), clean our upstairs bathroom that he and I use- mainly help me keep these two rooms clean during the week and then on the weekend when we're off he can clean these two rooms that only he and I really use on his own while I work on the other stuff. That only leaves me with the living room, dining room, kitchen, and downstairs bath. It leaves me with the laundry of course but I'm alright with that.. I've asked him to help keep the dishwasher loaded/unloaded with me throughout the week, and maybe cook dinner a night or two a week. 
Now to tell you a bit about my husband- he really loves video games and he's dang good at them. I don't want him to stop playing them- not at all. I even play them with him once I get all of the housework out of the way and I enjoy them. Really, what I enjoy is spending the time with him and seeing him happy. If me spending a few hours playing a game can make him happy then I'm all for it. I just wish he felt the same about me. Him helping me out would make me feel equally as happy. Honestly, I almost feel like this would make our life "close" to perfect. However, when he wakes up in the mornings (if he's not working) he goes straight to the computer, plays a game for a while.. Gets bored with that, moves to the bed, plays another game, maybe watches a movie. I get off work, he's ready to play more games, watch more movies, or do something with me but he doesn't understand or I haven't said it in a way yet that makes sense I have a house to take care of, kids to take care of and talk to, and at the same time with those things I "WANT" to spend time with him too doing anything but cleaning or talking about bills. He and I both still work from home so we're here all day. We don't go out much except for our one night out together each week, usually on Fridays since we're off on the weekends. After sitting at my desk for 8-10 hours a day working, I am not at all thrilled about spending another 3-4 hours at it immediately after work. I want to get up and move around. I am also more than happy to spend that time moving around with him! When I get off work at 730 each night the first thing I have to do is cook dinner- which he thinks is crazy... I cook meals for my kids for dinner.. While I'm working during the day, they handle their lunch and breakfast but I feel the least I can do is cook them dinner- it's not something fancy.. We're talking Spaghetti, Tacos, Pizza, Grilled Chicken.. And while my husband feels that it's ridiculous, I cook for him too. Not because he asks me to but because I am cooking a meal and he's my husband- I'm definitely not going to cook and leave him out. Once dinner is done, I eat with the kids at the dinner table (my husband does not join us for dinner- instead he eats upstairs alone although I have asked many times that he join us because I want him to be a part of our lives- he has told me his mom made him sit at the table and he doesn't like it so I try to understand although I've also told him we can eat at the couch- just as long as we're all together). Once the kids and I eat, I clean up the kitchen, finish up any laundry, talk/listen to the kids, and I try my best to be back upstairs with him or doing something with him by 10-1030 pm. I do have to work the next morning so usually I'm going to bed or at least laying in bed watching TV with him by 12:30 am- 2 am. To him, this isn't enough (and some nights I might not make it up by 10-1030 because I'm trying to be as fair as possible here). 

So here are our main arguments-
He doesn't feel like I spend enough time with him- just me and him. I want to be able to do this for him but I don't know how if I'm the only one taking care of the house and the outside of the house. I also do all of the grocery shopping as well. 
I would like for him to help out more around the house- just with the small things like cleaning our bedroom and bathroom, taking out trash , and helping with dishes. Besides that just clean up after himself. I'd like for the kids to do the same- clean up after themselves more and their pets.
I would like for him to spend less time playing video games- LESS does not equal NONE. I don't want to change who my husband is. He loves gaming. I don't want to take that away from him. In fact, I just want to be able to enjoy it with him without being resentful of it. 
I would like for him to spend some time doing the things I enjoy (the things we talked about when we were dating)- cooking together, painting the house together, re-dcorating the house or outside together).. Sometimes instead of video games, choose a board game instead because he knows how much I love them.

Today though was another argument-While I was working, I was also playing a game with him because work was slow. When my lunch time came, I told him I was stepping away from the computer for a while because I still had a few hours left to work and wanted to move around. I also said that I didn't like sitting at the cmputer as much as I do. When I said this, the way I said it, he took it as me sayig I didn't want to spend time with him.. That was not the case at all. I do want to spend time with him- the rest of my life with him actually but I just don't want to spend it all in front of a computer screen or for that matter even sitting down. So this moved to a whole argument.... Tonight when I asked him to talk he told me no and shut me down saying tha talking to me is only drama. I can understand why he'd say that.. We seem to talk all the time.. The problem is that once we talk, no one is applying it. So then he continues to tell me to find someone else to talk to.. Naturally, being told this (because I am a female) I automatically think he just doesn't care about how I feel and he doesn't want to fix things or be with me. However, being a woman, I still want to talk and my husband is my best friend so yes I want to talk to him. 
In another conversation tonight he told me that he's starting to hate everything in his life- which of course I directly translate to hating me because there was nothing clarified to tell me what he hates.
I want to fix my marriage. I want my husband to want to help me out. I want my husband to want to spend time doing things that interest both of us equally. Above all, I want him and myself to be happy. 
I'm not looking for anyone telling me that my marriage is doomed for failure, that I should just leave him, that I should ignore him, etc. I would like honest advice for me and him on how to fix things for both of us so we can be happy. So surely there's someone out there who's been through something similar that can help. 

I might not have posted enough details.. If not, please feel free to ask questions. I am just looking for some advice.


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## happy as a clam (Jan 5, 2014)

Way too much cleaning going on. He must be a nervous wreck, never feeling like he (or you) can truly relax.

I think you should hire a cleaning service to come to the house once a week. Also consider hiring a lawn mowing/yard cleanup service.

Since the hyper-cleaning clearly is rooted in your OCD issues, it might help you stop obsessing over it if _someone else_ was doing it -- then you could redirect your thoughts and behavior to something more productive, like spending quality time with your husband.

Also, get a piece of poster board and make a chore chart for everyone in the family. Everyone spends 20-30 minutes daily doing their assigned tasks. I agree the household tasks should not be solely your responsibility. And at ages 14 and 17, your daughters should be doing A LOT of the tasks. And they shouldn't need much direction from you.


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## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

The daily time spent on housework is in line with 4 people & 4 pets. I spend that much time and it's just myself in the house. Your kids need to be making their own beds and cleaning their own rooms. They can pitch in on the weekend cleaning, too. 

Frankly, your husband is addicted to the computer. When he isn't on it, he expects *you* to entertain him. He lives there & he needs to be stepping up. You're not running a hotel.

Did you know that you were just taking on another child before you married? It's ridiculous that he thinks you don't need to cook!


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## SecondTime'Round (Jan 15, 2015)

I agree it is ridiculous that he thinks you don't need to cook dinner. Or that someone doesn't need to cook dinner. That is very odd.

You're spending way too much time cleaning on the weekends. Can you just do that deep cleaning every other weekend and on the "off" weekend just use Clorox wipes on the sinks, toilets, run the vacuum only in high traffic areas? Gosh, I wish I enjoyed cleaning as much as you seem to!

Your husband needs to budge a bit here. You go out once a week, which is great, I think! You don't think it's much, but lots of us would love that. If he would just take a break while you make dinner, eat, and clean up, you'd be spending time together then, right? I'm not a night person, so to me it seems like you stay up sooo late! What time do you start work in the morning?

I work from home, too. I have a treadmill desk. Yesterday I walked 10 miles WHILE I worked. They are expensive, but if you have the space for one and can afford it, I highly, highly recommend this to you if your job is the type where you think this would work. I only walk 2.2 mph. It would be a way for you to avoid sitting all day and get the wiggles out. 

Household duties are also an issue for us. My SO has a hard time NOT thinking that because I work from home, I should have the time to do all internal household chores. But I work full time! I do take time every day to do some stuff, but not any deep cleaning. We also have a lot of pets. We hired someone to come and deep clean once a month. My husband is pretty anal, but even he (and I) is not quite as OCD as you. I do the in between cleaning, clean toilets every other week, but the cleaning girls do the deep stuff. We have a large house and they don't clean everything (i.e. my office), but they do some. They do NOT clean my kids' rooms (ages 12 and 13). They clean their own rooms on principle.

During the summers when the kids are home with me all day, they do more to help around the house. Every morning when they wake up, I've written their daily chores on a white board. I'm very detailed. They do things like load/unload the dishes, vacuum, wipe down bathrooms with Clorox wipes, play with the dogs, Windex windows and mirrors, dust, read one chapter in your summer reading book, etc. They also have each been doing their own laundry for at least 4 years. In this house, we all do our own laundry. I usually do sheets and towels. Your kids are home schooled so you could really do this all year long.

Just sharing some things that I see from you sharing your story that could maybe help lighten your load, but your husband really needs to compromise some here, too. 

If HE is the one saying he wants to spend more time with you (btw, lucky you!), then he's going to have to make himself available for you to do that!


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## Observer (Aug 23, 2011)

First off, I envy all of you that can work from home. I always wonder what kind of jobs these are but I digress.

Yes, good God that is a lot of cleaning. The fridge is like a once a twice a year thing, why on Earth you cleaning it every weekend? In any case, it would be really annoying to me if my wife could not sit still and constantly want to clean. You need to work on that. Yes, he needs to help you, have you cmmunicated what you wrote here to him? Ask him to read this thread, it may help him understand you better.


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## DoF (Mar 27, 2014)

Your cleaning habit is obsessive and enabled people around you to rely on you to clean (rather than learn to pick up/clean after themselves.

You have KIDS and they SHOULD have responsibilities.

Our kids do most of the cleaning (we have 4). They do their laundry, rooms and clean around the house. They also do the dishes and help out with other "around house" tasks you described. They also assist my wife with cooking (each one has a day).

Lesson is: EVERYONE int he family contributes in some way, shape or form.

TODAY, your lesson is "do what you please, mommie will be there to pick things up and do EVERYTHING for you".

This is REALLY BAD not just for you, your relationship but also for your children. You are enabling them to become spoiled/ungrateful and worthless.

Your husband is right AND wrong. He should assist you to get the kids to do more work and assist you with work as well. But he is completely right about your obsession with cleaning and the time it takes away from you 2.

My advice: 
Sit down with your husband and make a responsibility list for your kids. Put it on the calendar and initially assist them with these tasks. EACH DAY SHOULD HAVE 1 or 2 tasks. Whatever you have left, you divide EQUALLY with your husband.

EVERYONE should be involved.

You also have to learn to let go. It won't be done to your "high" standards. And that's ok. 

Time with your loved one IS and SHOULD be your priority....right now, WITH YOUR ACTIONS you are telling your husband that you love your house more than him? 

Think about that, kind of absurd isn't it? 

You already recognized that you have an obsessive cleaning disorder of some kind. Work towards changing that, FAST.

This video should help too!!!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X29lF43mUlo

Good luck


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## John Lee (Mar 16, 2013)

If you can afford to go out once a week (let alone more, which you'd like) you can probably afford a cleaning service. I highly recommend it -- I'm also the less clean one in my marriage, and I didn't grow up with a cleaning lady/service so I thought it was some ridiculous luxury, but now that we do it once every two weeks I see it makes a huge difference to my wife's mood and our marriage. 

Your husband should also step up and do more, but my guess is that if you're truly OCD and he's not a neat freak he will never do things "up to your standards." Kids chores is also a good idea, maybe one of your kids even inherited your neat-freak genes.


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## John Lee (Mar 16, 2013)

And by the way, yes, once a week is pretty good for a couple with kids. My wife and I don't manage that, probably closer to twice a month.


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## EnjoliWoman (Jul 2, 2012)

Did he have any sort of family before? Or a LTR/live with a woman?

Yes, cleaning is over the top, but mostly because you do it all. The kids should keep their own rooms clean and their own bath adn should unload/load the dishwasher; after all you cook dinner.

I think you have lowered your expectations somewhat and that is good. Cooking meals is NOT strange - what does he think is normal? Obviously he had to sit at a dinner table with his family growing up so I don't know why he finds it odd you prepare meals for your kids.

He doesn't seem to be prepared to meet you half way, though. He even puts the work on fixing the marital issues on you. It takes two to ruin AND fix a marriage/keep it happy.

Also if you do all of the inside work, he should mow, etc. Did he not live in a home that required maintenance? I do know a guy who always lived in apartments and he was sort of lost when it came to home repair and yard maintenance. 

It seems you two express your feelings differently as well. I suggest you both read the 5 languages of love. You may feel that doing all of these things shows you love him. When really he doesn't care that you cook him dinner - he is not perceiving that as 'love'. He prefers time with you as a way for you to express your feelings. So you both need to meet in the middle and understand that he wants love demonstrated in time together while you want love demonstrated by acts of service.

Another issue - it seems he doesn't care much for human interaction. Some introverts really need that time away to recharge. Or he could just be acting like an ass. He's not making it easy for you to spend time with him [aka showing your love] when he goes to hibernate and play games. 

Personally I don't sit around, either. I would find it difficult to just sit every evening. I cook, clean, pick up stuff, etc for a big portion of my evening. How do the kids feel about him? Dinner is prime opportunity for bonding and seems a bit insulting he refuses to interact.

So I suggest getting 5 languages of love as well as his needs/her needs and reading them and discussing them. Unfortunately I think you are going to find he is so set in his ways he has no intention of changing - it seems he thinks YOU need to do all of the changing - maybe because he was the one to move? After reading and discussing, both propose compromises to the other.

But my gut tells me he will tell you to read the books, he will ask you why he has to change, he will tell you what he doesn't like and still expect you to accommodate him with no concessions in return.

He sounds like an adult who never had a meaningful relationship, doesn't know how to compromise, who is rebellious and small minded (refusing to eat at the table because he had to as a kid? really?) and might as well live in his Mom's basement for all of his social development.

Yes, the cleaning is a bit OCD and you recognize it and changed how much; and yes you need to involve the kids in doing more. But really it seems like he has more compromising to do than you.


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

How long did you two date before you got married? 

C


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## happy as a clam (Jan 5, 2014)

PBear said:


> How long did you two *date* before you got married?





shivat said:


> My husband I probably didn't meet in the most conventional way- we were co-workers, who also worked from home so we spent a lot of time talking to each other via *Yahoo Messenger , Skype, and Facebook* before deciding to date.


Good question PB...

I'm not sure Yahoo Messenger, Skype, and Facebook qualify as actual "dating."

We need more info from OP....

But alas, she has not yet returned to check her own thread. She must be very busy working from home.


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## shivat (Jan 23, 2015)

I've been reading the thread all morning  and yes I am very busy working from home. Regardless of what one may think, a ten hour work day at home is no less stressful than a 10 hr work day at an office besides the commute. 

The two of us had been friends for a few years, spent 6 months actually in a relationship together, and then got married. 

The kids do like him, although they don't like that I get upset about him not helping however the posts here that the kids and him should help more make a lot of sense. 

Once I get a break from work, I will post more because the feedback here has been great! Thank you all so much for your input!


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## shivat (Jan 23, 2015)

and yes, he was in several LTR before me and they had children as well. 
I don't want to make anything sound like this is "all him" or "all me". It does take two to make or break a relationship. I think both of our "habits" are causing the problem.
When things are good, they are in fact "really good". When they're bad though they're also really bad.
He does work, help pay bills, he will spend time with my kids and me together- just doesn't like to sit at the table for dinner. He cares about our future as much as I do when it comes to spending/saving money, maintaining credit scores, etc.
Also, I'm not cleaning just because I like to clean. The fact is in a house of four people and four small dogs there's messes every day. I am one of those people that htink if the mess is left alone then the mess just gets bigger and takes more time later. I prefer to daily chores- laundry, dishes , making the bed instead of letting things pile up. I am not however alphabetizing our pantry or straightening hand towels at a certain length all night long.


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## shivat (Jan 23, 2015)

Observer said:


> First off, I envy all of you that can work from home. I always wonder what kind of jobs these are but I digress.
> 
> Yes, good God that is a lot of cleaning. The fridge is like a once a twice a year thing, why on Earth you cleaning it every weekend? In any case, it would be really annoying to me if my wife could not sit still and constantly want to clean. You need to work on that. Yes, he needs to help you, have you cmmunicated what you wrote here to him? Ask him to read this thread, it may help him understand you better.


When I say "clean" the fridge, I just mean dumping out any leftovers that weren't used and putting those dishes in to wash once a week.. I don't mean scrubbing the fridge down.


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## SecondTime'Round (Jan 15, 2015)

shivat said:


> and yes, he was in several LTR before me and they had children as well.
> I don't want to make anything sound like this is "all him" or "all me". It does take two to make or break a relationship. I think both of our "habits" are causing the problem.
> When things are good, they are in fact "really good". When they're bad though they're also really bad.
> He does work, help pay bills, he will spend time with my kids and me together- just doesn't like to sit at the table for dinner. He cares about our future as much as I do when it comes to spending/saving money, maintaining credit scores, etc.
> Also, I'm not cleaning just because I like to clean. The fact is in a house of four people and four small dogs there's messes every day. I am one of those people that htink if the mess is left alone then the mess just gets bigger and takes more time later. I prefer to daily chores- laundry, dishes , making the bed instead of letting things pile up. I am not however alphabetizing our pantry or straightening hand towels at a certain length all night long.


LOL thanks for clarifying that your husband is not sleeping with the enemy .

I don't think you made it sound like it's all your fault or all his fault. I think you represented the issues fairly and it's easy to see where both of you are at fault.

I still think you spend way too much time cleaning on the weekends!!!


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## shivat (Jan 23, 2015)

happy as a clam said:


> Good question PB...
> 
> I'm not sure Yahoo Messenger, Skype, and Facebook qualify as actual "dating."
> 
> ...


We didn't only talk via messenger  
He moved here first, we dated 6 months and then got married. Prior to that, he and I were friends for several years. 

As a side note, I was with my childrens dad for 15 years and never married him. It wasn't until I met my current husband that I ever thought marriage. 
I guess my husband I talked about cleaning/helping/spending time with each other but we just didn't find the best ways to implement it together.


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## shivat (Jan 23, 2015)

SecondTime'Round said:


> LOL thanks for clarifying that your husband is not sleeping with the enemy .
> 
> I don't think you made it sound like it's all your fault or all his fault. I think you represented the issues fairly and it's easy to see where both of you are at fault.
> 
> I still think you spend way too much time cleaning on the weekends!!!


lol, I was beginning to wonder if I'd made myself sound a bit psychotic with the cleaning.. 
I just want things to be somewhat neat most of the time.. But I also understand that people live in a home and it's going to look lived in. 
I probably do spend too much time cleaning and the kids should help out more as well as him. 
Today, he and I have talked a bit and I've told him some of the responses I've gotten and he has said "Yes I should help out more". But he also agrees that the kids should help too. It shouldn't be all up to one person.
He also thinks a cleaning service may be a good idea bi-weekly or monthly depending on the cost. 
The bottom line for both of us is- Yes we both get mad. Yes we get irritated but at the end of the day we got married for a reason and we just need to find a way to make this work so it's happily ever after for both of us.


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## Givernor (Oct 3, 2014)

people often use "OCD" as a joking way to describe a relation something they feel strongly about. 

There is true OCD , and it's a mental illness. Only a doctor could say for sure, but I'm wondering if you aren't there.

Left on your own it sounds like you would clean/chore for around 30-40 hrs a week. Or as some would put it, enough time to work another full time job.

Another possibility is "home making" is your hobby/passion. If you're willing to acknowledge that then you must also must realize that puts you in a tiny minority and aren't going to find many people to share in this passion.

I would also venture to say that one of the reasons you do not demand others help more is that they simply are not going to do a job you deem acceptable. So it's easier to just do it yourself. 
This to will turn any willing volunteer sour in a hurry.

While I do think your hubby is a bit lazy and selfish. I've seen this "homemaker/martyr" thing enough to know it is often a different kind of selfishness..

Makes me wonder about your relationship with the father and why it ended.


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## happy as a clam (Jan 5, 2014)

shivat said:


> lol, I was beginning to wonder if I'd made myself sound a bit psychotic with the cleaning..


Honestly, you did.




shivat said:


> *I probably do spend too much time cleaning and the kids should help out more as well as him. *


Without a doubt.



shivat said:


> He also thinks a cleaning service may be a good idea bi-weekly or monthly depending on the cost.


BRAVO!!!!!! You've solved MORE THAN HALF of your problem!!! 



shivat said:


> at the end of the day we got married for a reason and *we just need to find a way to make this work so it's happily ever* after for both of us.


Based on everything you've posted, I* have HIGH hopes for your marriage!!!* :smthumbup: I don't think your husband is a "video game junkie." He disclosed to you (before marriage) that he loved playing video games and sitting on the beach. You did NOT disclose to him that you had a serious OCD cleaning problem.

Good for you for letting some of it go (and GREAT for him for helping you -- because you wanted to be with him rather than being a slave to your OCD cleaning ritual -- although unbeknownst to him!) and cutting back on the obsessive cleaning.

OP, Cognitive Behavioral Therapy (CBT) can work WONDERS when both partners are on board and you realize what is at stake if you DON'T change.

You need to get those lazy teenage girls up off their *lazy arses!!!!* Holy smokes -- Why, in heaven's name are YOU making their beds for NEARLY GROWN young women?!?! Sheesh....STOP making their beds -- if they don't do it, severe consequences will follow (loss of internet, cell phone, parties, dances, extracurricular activities, TV, etc.)

Your girls are WAY too old for YOU to be making their beds. My kids were making their beds -- every day, by the time they were 5 yo -- WITHOUT FAIL.

You can solve this, but you need the right tools. Don't push your husband away in some ridiculous power struggle over CLEANING THE HOUSE.

OP, stop scrubbing toilets and go b*ng your husband's brains out. Join him in a video game as an "alter-ego." Strip-tease him online. Then make it a reality.

Your situaton is not nearly so dire as some posters here (myself included when I first joined TAM.)

Be smart. Save your marriage. Don't be a statistic.


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## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

OP, you do not appear to have an OCD cleaning problem to me. Honestly, some people are just not accustomed to living in a relatively clean house. They have a higher tolerance for clutter & such than those people who like to see hardwood floors free of dog hair & dust bunnies.

Mrs. Barbara Bush once commented in a ladies mag that "a clever woman can do her housework in 20 minutes a day". Huh? Totally ticked me off. Of course, she may have just been referring to the necessaries before her cleaning crew arrived. 

Besides, a relatively clean home is a lot more calming than another game of warcraft or whatever. I don't understand how your husband can just sit or lie down all day long every day. That's a heart attack waiting to happen.


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## NoChoice (Feb 12, 2012)

OP,
Have you tried finding something you like to do other than cleaning that your H might like to do with you? Perhaps a hobby or some other activity other than housework.

I can appreciate your wanting to keep a nice house but with two teenage daughters you should be receiving significant help from them thereby freeing up more of your time. Try finding something you really enjoy outside of housework and see if your H will share in the activity with you. As someone has already posted if you do not teach your girls responsibility then they will expect to go through life without any.

I have never cared much for video games and computer games but maybe if you find an activity that you and your H enjoy he may pitch in to help with chores so you two can have more time to enjoy the activity together.


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## Nynaeve (Jun 19, 2013)

I think most of the responses are being too hard on the OP.

Some people like cleaning. Some people like their living space to be tidy. Some people can't relax until the house is clean.

That's okay.

Personally, I think a cleaning service would be a waste of money. You have four people perfectly capable of cleaning their own home. Hubby needs to take on some chores if he wants more time spent together. Chores are part of life. He needs to give a little.

Also, I don't think he has any room at all to complain about not spending enough time together if he won't eat dinner with the family. That's bizarre, IMO. Eating together is one of the essential social bonding experiences. Families eat together. Spouses eat together. Roommates go to their separate rooms to eat.

OP, I think your hubby needs to show some effort and respect. The chore chart others have suggested is a good idea.

I think you just need to tell him that you need a clean house to feel comfortable and at home and he can either help you get it clean so you can relax with him or he can stop complaining about you not spending as much time with him. 

I think you also need to be a little bit pushier about planning other activities. If you want to play a board game - say "It's my turn to choose, let's play Monopoly (or whatever game you like). 

Have you ever tried saying something like "I'm going to work in the garden, can you come outside with me and mow the lawn?"


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## SecondTime'Round (Jan 15, 2015)

NoChoice said:


> OP,
> Have you tried finding something you like to do other than cleaning that your H might like to do with you? Perhaps a hobby or some other activity other than housework.
> 
> I can appreciate your wanting to keep a nice house but with two teenage daughters you should be receiving significant help from them thereby freeing up more of your time. Try finding something you really enjoy outside of housework and see if your H will share in the activity with you. As someone has already posted if you do not teach your girls responsibility then they will expect to go through life without any.
> ...


Totally agree about the teens....they need to step up. Give them chores you're not as anal about being done perfectly. For example, even though I'm sure my almost 14 year old daughter is perfectly capable of scooping the litter box, I still want to do it because I know she just won't "get it all" and clean up around the box etc. I also would not let my kids clean a toilet except for wiping the seat with a Clorox wipe. Your girls are more than old enough to be helping with day to day cleaning/cleaning up and doing their own laundry. 

I think you're probably gonna have to let go of some stuff, which might be hard. But, if the kids' dresser drawers are not perfectly tidy, of there's a dust ball in the corner of the living room that is waiting for tomorrow, what's the worst that will happen? I get the feeling of not being able to relax unless things are not cluttered, etc. I've gotten soooo much better than I used to be with being able to relax a little. (What's helped me? Zoloft, but that is a whole 'nother issue).

I'm curious about your cleaning tendencies before you were married. You said you cleaned 4-5 hours a day and then all day every day on both days of the weekends?? You don't think that is excessive? Just how big is your house? I get you have 4 dogs, but that really only explains running a vacuum cleaner once a day, not 4-5 hours of cleaning unless they are constantly throwing up and going to the bathroom in the house!


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## shivat (Jan 23, 2015)

NoChoice said:


> OP,
> Have you tried finding something you like to do other than cleaning that your H might like to do with you? Perhaps a hobby or some other activity other than housework.
> 
> I can appreciate your wanting to keep a nice house but with two teenage daughters you should be receiving significant help from them thereby freeing up more of your time. Try finding something you really enjoy outside of housework and see if your H will share in the activity with you. As someone has already posted if you do not teach your girls responsibility then they will expect to go through life without any.
> ...


I like to do things other than clean.. Cleaning is not a hobby. I like gardening, board games, movies, really anything.. I'm not picky but I also like to do this without sitting down on the couch in a plate that's been left there by someone else.


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## shivat (Jan 23, 2015)

Nynaeve said:


> I think most of the responses are being too hard on the OP.
> 
> Some people like cleaning. Some people like their living space to be tidy. Some people can't relax until the house is clean.
> 
> ...


I have tried that and for a while it will work.. He will come with me. He's not an outdoors person so I try to understand..
Really, I don't mind playing games with him, watching movies with him, or anything else.. I am not picky about what we're doing.. My only issue has been that all i asked for was some help around the house instead of me having to clean up after everyone and then I have more time to spend with everyone-- maybe even just a little time to spend with myself


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## shivat (Jan 23, 2015)

SecondTime'Round said:


> Totally agree about the teens....they need to step up. Give them chores you're not as anal about being done perfectly. For example, even though I'm sure my almost 14 year old daughter is perfectly capable of scooping the litter box, I still want to do it because I know she just won't "get it all" and clean up around the box etc. I also would not let my kids clean a toilet except for wiping the seat with a Clorox wipe. Your girls are more than old enough to be helping with day to day cleaning/cleaning up and doing their own laundry.
> 
> I think you're probably gonna have to let go of some stuff, which might be hard. But, if the kids' dresser drawers are not perfectly tidy, of there's a dust ball in the corner of the living room that is waiting for tomorrow, what's the worst that will happen? I get the feeling of not being able to relax unless things are not cluttered, etc. I've gotten soooo much better than I used to be with being able to relax a little. (What's helped me? Zoloft, but that is a whole 'nother issue).
> 
> I'm curious about your cleaning tendencies before you were married. You said you cleaned 4-5 hours a day and then all day every day on both days of the weekends?? You don't think that is excessive? Just how big is your house? I get you have 4 dogs, but that really only explains running a vacuum cleaner once a day, not 4-5 hours of cleaning unless they are constantly throwing up and going to the bathroom in the house!


My cleaning habits before only came from having a husband who enjoyed being out at bars several nights a week, painting because that was his hobby-which he could only do alone, and then later being with other women... He and I were together for our kids and realized that after many years together. Cleaning and organizing things happened primarily out of being bored.. However, I would also read, swim, walk, run, exercise, etc. 

When I talk about cleaning folks, Im talking about someone who doesn't put their laundry in the hamper- leaves it on the floor in the closet, under their desk, etc or has bowls, cups, plates etc and just leaves them where they are for days at a time. I'm not talking about having him help out it's having him clean up after himself more than once every couple of days and just to do random things like help with dishes, take out trash or make the bed.. I'm not wanting him categorizing my wardrobe or color coding my shoes..  
Also the kids do keep their own rooms clean, beds made, and things like that.. It's the other household chores no ones helping with like laundry, cleaning bathrooms, floors, windows, etc.


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## Cynthia (Jan 31, 2014)

Asking someone to help you clean up after them doesn't make any sense. If he is using the toilet, eating the food, walking on the carpet, etc. and etc., he is making a mess and you are cleaning up after him. Him doing his share is not helping. It is taking responsibility for himself. The same goes for your children. I have a chore chart on the refrigerator that lists kitchen responsibilities and who does them when.
The kids take turns cleaning the bathroom.
They should also be doing their own laundry. Even my husband does his own laundry and I'm a homemaker.
From what you have described, you do spend a lot of time cleaning, but the chores that you are describing are not excessive. I wonder if you are doing too careful of a job. It shouldn't take forever to clean the bathroom.
What were your husband's living arrangements before you two married? Did he live in an apartment or a house? Did he have a yard? What and where did he eat? Was his house clean or a mess?
It seems odd to me that he doesn't get that someone has to clean the house and it shouldn't be all on you.
I also think it's odd that he doesn't think you should cook. What does he think you should do to feed yourself and your children?
If he has a problem thinking that you should spend all your time on the computer with him, it is probably stemming from the fact that you spent time on the computer with him before you were married, but for him that should be the same. You obviously thought you would be doing things with him or sitting on the couch or taking a walk. He thinks you will still be on the computer with him.


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## shivat (Jan 23, 2015)

CynthiaDe said:


> Asking someone to help you clean up after them doesn't make any sense. If he is using the toilet, eating the food, walking on the carpet, etc. and etc., he is making a mess and you are cleaning up after him. Him doing his share is not helping. It is taking responsibility for himself. The same goes for your children. I have a chore chart on the refrigerator that lists kitchen responsibilities and who does them when.
> The kids take turns cleaning the bathroom.
> They should also be doing their own laundry. Even my husband does his own laundry and I'm a homemaker.
> From what you have described, you do spend a lot of time cleaning, but the chores that you are describing are not excessive. I wonder if you are doing too careful of a job. It shouldn't take forever to clean the bathroom.
> ...


I've never had the kids do their own laundry although I have taught them how. I am easy on them, I'll admit. They do keep their own rooms clean though, help load dishes as they dirty them in the dishwasher, and take out trash when it's full.. 

Before marrying me, he lived in a townhouse for a while with roommates and for a while with his father. In both places, they had lawn maintenance companies that took care of the outside and I can imagine with roommates, it probably wasn't super clean.. With his dad, I think he did clean up after himself though. 

As far as eating, his eating habits were very simple- frozen turkey burgers, eggs, and if he felt like it he'd pick something up to eat somewhere or order delivery. He thinks that the kids should be helping with the cooking and I shouldn't be standing in the kitchen cooking a meal every night.. The thing is, I don't mind cooking.. It's not horrible. I'm just asking for help so I can have more time with him and the kids.


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## shivat (Jan 23, 2015)

CynthiaDe said:


> If he has a problem thinking that you should spend all your time on the computer with him, it is probably stemming from the fact that you spent time on the computer with him before you were married, but for him that should be the same. You obviously thought you would be doing things with him or sitting on the couch or taking a walk. He thinks you will still be on the computer with him.


Also, we didn't spend all of our time on the computer. I just think maybe I wasn't clear that I didn't want to be a maid. He's all for hiring someone to clean the house or take care of the outside... However that does take money and I have two kids that I don't receive any child support on because their dad is basically non existent now.


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## Cynthia (Jan 31, 2014)

Did he move into your house with you or did you get a new place together?
Are things easier financially for you since he moved in, as in, is he contributing to the household expenses?


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## SecondTime'Round (Jan 15, 2015)

shivat said:


> Also, we didn't spend all of our time on the computer. I just think maybe I wasn't clear that I didn't want to be a maid. He's all for hiring someone to clean the house or take care of the outside... However that does take money and I have two kids that I don't receive any child support on because their dad is basically non existent now.


Then the solution is clear here. Hire a cleaning lady and get your kids to do their own laundry. Your husband HAS to agree to clean up after himself, too...dirty dishes, etc. like you described. 

Honestly, you seem like such a lovely woman. I think you over explained the cleaning so we all did think you were kinda crazy OCD about it, but the more you explain, I think you just need some household help. 

If you can't afford it, don't do it. If you can, just do it! You will be happier (as long as it doesn't let your family members off the hook of pitching in!)


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## Cynthia (Jan 31, 2014)

I do not think it is doing kids any favors to go easy on them. If you do it for them, they will expect someone to do for them what they ought to be doing themselves. It is a necessary skill to know how to take care of yourself. If they see you doing everything not only for them, but for him also, that will give them an impression that is not going to do them any good in life.


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## SecondTime'Round (Jan 15, 2015)

Oh, and P.S. Yes, it would be great if the girls can learn to cook. I don't think that's the priority at this point, especially since you don't consider cooking dinner a burden (as most of us don't). Start them on laundry, then maybe over the summer get them to each make one meal a month!


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## happy as a clam (Jan 5, 2014)

Blondilocks said:


> OP, you do not appear to have an OCD cleaning problem to me. *Honestly, some people are just not accustomed to living in a relatively clean house.* They have a higher tolerance for clutter & such than those people who like to see hardwood floors free of dog hair & dust bunnies.


Sorry Blondilocks, but I disagree. My house is nearly spotless, but I do not spend hours per day cleaning it. 

I simply do not accumulate clutter. A place for everything, everything in it's place. If I take it out, I put it back as I go. I leave shoes at the door so dirt is not tracked in. I Swiffer the hardwood floors daily (takes 5 minutes) to pick up pet hair and dust bunnies, and deep cleaning (scrubbing bathrooms, mopping floors, baseboards, etc.) gets split up and divided amongst all family members. We knock it out on the weekends and the tasks are done. Laundry is done daily, folded and put away by all family members who want clean clothes. No overflowing baskets to trip over. We split up vacuuming our own bedrooms once a week.

All other cleaning and household chores are on a "tickler" system. When the task comes up in the tickler, it gets done (things like deep cleaning the fridge and freezer, changing smoke alarm batteries, sweeping out the garage, washing curtains and blinds, etc.)

I think she is spending too much time cleaning. Just my opinion.

Don't be a slave to housecleaning. When you're on your death bed, are you really going to say to yourself "Gee, I wish my baseboards had been cleaner!!!"

H*ll to the no...


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## shivat (Jan 23, 2015)

CynthiaDe said:


> Did he move into your house with you or did you get a new place together?
> Are things easier financially for you since he moved in, as in, is he contributing to the household expenses?


He moved in to the house that I was already living in. Yes, he does contribute financially. All of our money goes in to the same bank account and bills, necessities are taken from that.


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## Cynthia (Jan 31, 2014)

shivat said:


> He moved in to the house that I was already living in. Yes, he does contribute financially. All of our money goes in to the same bank account and bills, necessities are taken from that.


If you are running one household on two incomes when it used to take two, you should have money to at least pay for help in your yard. However, if that is something you enjoy and is a hobby, you should stick to it. 
How much time would you estimate that you spend with your husband per week, just the two of you?


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

Why aren't you pursuing your children's father for support? It's unfair to you and your kids, and college is likely coming up quicker than you realize. Once you get a support plan through the courts, there's options as far as enforcing it.

C


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## Hicks (Jan 14, 2011)

A marriage is a blending of 2 people.
However, your lifestyle is greatly dominating your marriage and therefore your marriage cannot work.

How can you have a happy husband if you are working, homeschooling children, cleaning incessantly and taking care of four dogs? You can't. No one has enough energy or time to do that much.

So if you want to have a happy husband you have to put your marriage to him as a priority. It's pretty straighforward.

Now, if you feel guilt over deprioritizing your kids... That's normal. And you should not deprioritize them in any way. Your kids who did not ask for all this deserve primary consideration. But there is such a thing as overgiving to them... And by homeshcooling them and giving 2 kids four dogs, it seems like you are trying to give them too much.


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## Cynthia (Jan 31, 2014)

Homeschooling is a lifestyle choice that has many advantages for the family. It can be easier to homeschool than use a public or private school, depending on the circumstances. Personally, I have homeschooled three children and am finishing up with the last one for high school now. Due to various factors, it would have been more difficult for us if we had used the public school for more than the couple of classes that we have. Unless you know the individual family situation, you cannot know if putting the kids in school would be a better choice or not. For us, it would not have been.


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## Deep Down (Jun 21, 2014)

Why does your H not eat with you and the girls? Why does he stay out of the way playing games? Does he not like your company? Does he not get on with the girls? Making a stepfamily work can be a very difficult process and I'm hearing signs that he's keeping out of it? What's his interaction with the girls?

As for spending your life cleaning, my Grandma (who had a job as a maid before she married) told me in her later years that she SO regretted worrying about if the table legs had dust on them, instead of playing and interacting with her own children. I know my Mum suffered from her mothers priorities, and I suffered from my mum's behaviour. But when raising my daughter, I made of point of cooking dinner together, and loading the dishwasher together etc. So chores are done quickly by everyone together. It's spending time together doing the things that need to be done.


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## Cynthia (Jan 31, 2014)

Deep Down said:


> But when raising my daughter, I made of point of cooking dinner together, and loading the dishwasher together etc. So chores are done quickly by everyone together. It's spending time together doing the things that need to be done.


There is a saying, "Many hands make light work." Not only that, but when you are working together, you are communicating and building relationships.


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## Deep Down (Jun 21, 2014)

CynthiaDe said:


> There is a saying, "Many hands make light work." Not only that, but when you are working together, you are communicating and building relationships.


And over time your children are learning how to be self-sufficient.

My daughter cooked our dinner for the first time when she was 7 . Tuna mornay. With my help, but her idea and she did the hard bits. Insert *smug Mum smile* here.


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## Cynthia (Jan 31, 2014)

My goal for my children is that when they leave the nest they will eat as well as they did while here and that their homes will be clean enough that I will not be afraid to eat or use the bathroom when visiting them. They should know what clean is and how to keep their home that way without spending an inordinate time at it. So far with #1, she is doing great. She is quite the little gourmet. She didn't feel lost or confused about what she was supposed to do. She just stepped right into it, because she was already used to being a part of the system at home.
I think it's really important that each person feel valued for their contribution to the household. If they don't get their job done, other people are relying on them, and they hear about it, not just from me. They know what they are doing matters to everyone. I like it that way.


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## wise (Sep 1, 2013)

I highly disagree with many posters.

My mother did just about everything for me. Made my bed, picked up clothes, etc. In fact, she did everything in the household while my dad busted his a** at work. She worked full time herself; however, her job was a joke compared to my fathers. 33 years later, they remain happily married. The older generation of women didn't expect everything to follow on THEIR plan like the women today. 

Yes, I was clueless when I left their home; however, I f*cking learned how to take care of myself within months. It is not hard nor is it confusing. Google is a prime example of an easier way to learn things rather than being ordered to do something against your own will by some stupid blackboard operation your mother posted on the wall. I feel bad for any child that has to have a drill sergeant for a mother. I had roommates who came from operation cleanhome as children and they were some of laziest guys I knew. They couldn't wait to get out of their mothers command so they could just never make their bed and NOT get yelled at. All they ever talked about what how crazy their mother was. Like seriously, its 2015, people do not care about beds being made.

On a side note, my girl HATES cleaning, THANK YOU LORD. Coming from a male perspective, women who want to wear gloves all day is not a woman to brag about. A woman who works out and has a sex drive is a women to brag about. No man wants to be ignored because his wife has become his mother, no man whether they claim it or not. Deep down inside, they want their woman to just throw the damn dishes against the wall and jump on them.

I have a cleaning lady whom spot cleans the whole house twice a week. They are not expensive and are completely reasonable. It's a triple positive. (1) My girl isn't stressed out, instead she is all over me due to the amount of time we spend together; (2) I am helping the economy by giving this amazing woman a job; and (3) the house stays clean, perfectly. Whoever wants to waste their life ordering people around about chores, have at it. Go ahead and Give yourself high blood pressure.


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## shivat (Jan 23, 2015)

Thank you all for your advice! It's been very helpful!

We've decided to make a chore chart for everyone, split the cooking between the four of us, eat dinner together, continue going out once a week- sometimes just the two of us, sometimes all four, hire someone to clean twice a month to do the heavy cleaning, and my husband is going to make sure he's downstairs for dinner as well. 

I think the key was communication.. without being irritated and ready to throw things at one another.  Honestly, if you're both arguing about not having enough time to spend together " I think" that might mean you both really want the marriage to work otherwise who would care about spending time together.. Also though, when we weren't communicating he just assumed I'd rather be cleaning the house and I just assumed he'd rather be playing video games. Now that we've talked we both realize that we'd be doing less of both if we just help each other out more. 

So yesterday started it- we all did our chores, we played Scrabble, went out for dinner, and came home to watch a movie.. House is still all together today- no one died because the last load of laundry wasn't finished and there's a few dishes in the sink but I think we'll all survive and the best part is we all had a great time. 
-


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## SecondTime'Round (Jan 15, 2015)

shivat said:


> Thank you all for your advice! It's been very helpful!
> 
> We've decided to make a chore chart for everyone, split the cooking between the four of us, eat dinner together, continue going out once a week- sometimes just the two of us, sometimes all four, hire someone to clean twice a month to do the heavy cleaning, and my husband is going to make sure he's downstairs for dinner as well.
> 
> ...


This is such an awesome update!!


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## SecondTime'Round (Jan 15, 2015)

wise said:


> I highly disagree with many posters.
> 
> My mother did just about everything for me. Made my bed, picked up clothes, etc. In fact, she did everything in the household while my dad busted his a** at work. She worked full time herself; however, her job was a joke compared to my fathers. 33 years later, they remain happily married. The older generation of women didn't expect everything to follow on THEIR plan like the women today.
> 
> ...


You are hilarious.

Stereotype much? If I threw plates against the wall and "jumped on" my SO he'd be so distracted by the mess that needed to be cleaned up he probably would not enjoy sex. I'd like him to do that to me, though!


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## EnjoliWoman (Jul 2, 2012)

Different things work for different people and each family is comprised of a different blend so all of the dynamics are different.

Growing up there was a chart on the fridge of M/T/W/Th/F and what had to be done each day. Mom cooked every night, Dad did most of the yard work, Weekends were both fun and productive depending on what needed to be done.

I don't mind doing laundry because it's just me and my daughter. If we only washed our own stuff, the loads would be small and wasteful. Instead I only insist that all clothing is in the hamper and stuff is off the floor. I won't wash it if it isn't in the hamper and I won't vacuum if stuff is on the floor (or when she was little I'd throw it away - didn't take many times for that to sink in). I cook meals and kiddo can only do a few things in the kitchen but she'll figure it out. I did. 

I know several kids who cook, clean, do homework, do their own laundry - but it seems they have no time to be kids.  I value free time for kids to allow them to get the important things done (like schoolwork) but also have time for friends and socializing AND time to just ponder, daydream, explore, etc. Neither way is right or wrong. I only know what is right for US. We can make helpful suggestions that give others another idea or viewpoint to consider but only they know what is right for them/their family.

Good luck!

The OP did seem like there was little communication, he played games 24/7, she cleaned 24/7 and the kids did nothing.  But I see that is not the case and I'm glad you have come to a happy resolution that works.


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