# Holy cow, I married a deviant.



## Mal74 (Dec 24, 2009)

Last weekend I discovered that H had visited a dominatrix. I freaked out, not because of the perversion, but because he went outside of our marriage for sex. I know I've shared my feelings about masturbation and I never considered that "outside of the marriage," but this... episode involved another woman. I booted him out of the house. He's traveling now so I haven't seen him in a few days.

I told him I needed to know everything about sex he has had outside of our marriage, and he told me he would share it all. You know that saying about not asking questions if you think you might not like the answer? Right. It's true... but I had to know.

It turns out he has visited this person 4 times since we've been married. He gave me her phone number and said I could talk to her to verify. I have not done that. He saw her "and others" before we were married. He has had phone sex "occasionally, I don't really know how many times but maybe once every few months." He gave me the password to his computer and told me how to find his pornography, which I looked at only long enough to see that it is... well, let's just say thematically aligned with his interests. 

I think that he has probably told me everything I need to know. It was hard to have these conversations over the phone, and I have spent a LOT of the last few days in tears. I told him that if he ever goes outside of our marriage for sex again I will walk out the door and never look back, and I mean it.

He and I have played around with his fantasies and with mine in the bedroom. He knows I am not shy and he knows I am willing to experiment, explore, be creative, and he knows I don't judge him for his kink. I don't understand how I could have left him wanting more, or feeling unsafe to share everything with me, or whatever... and now, I am so turned off and so upset I am not sure if I will be able to play in the way I used to.

So, what now?


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## voivod (Aug 7, 2008)

maybe he doesn't want YOU to be the dominatrix...what if he sees the woman he married (you) as a pristine woman, not to be dragged into his fantasy world of s&m, bondage, discipline and the like...maybe he wants to maintain you in this status...kinda sweet, i think...


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## Mal74 (Dec 24, 2009)

voivod said:


> maybe he doesn't want YOU to be the dominatrix...what if he sees the woman he married (you) as a pristine woman, not to be dragged into his fantasy world of s&m, bondage, discipline and the like...maybe he wants to maintain you in this status...kinda sweet, i think...


Interesting; I hadn't thought about it that way. When we first started talking about fantasies it was hard for him to share his submissive side. He was embarrassed and worried I would see him as less of a man.

I have always seen him as a truly great man, a "gentle giant." He has given me an amazing, privileged, joy-filled marriage. And now this wrinkle, which I think because I have seen him as such a wonderful man seems to hurt all the more.

Thanks for giving me another way to look at it.


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## cantletgo (Mar 22, 2010)

My H is also extremely over the top in his sexual appetites, which has now destroyed our marriage. He slept with a skank he met on a porn site, one of those "talk to local slu%$ and [email protected]# them tonight". And he did. It's never going to stop, it's never going to be enough. It's like a drug to some men, and they are always going to chase that high. I have finally found my resolve and my self respect and he will be moving out this weekend. I feel for you, and know what it's like to love your H and your marriage so much that you are willing to sacrifice yourself to keep it, but it's not going to end well.


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## jitterbug (Feb 13, 2010)

It sounds to me like your H may have "the Madonna-Wh*re" 
complex.(basically what Voivod was describing).

If you Google that specific term, there are several articles about the psychology behind the "M_W" complex. It's actually fairly commonplace, from what I learned.

I'm beginning to suspect the same type of thinking is at work with my SO, so I started to read up.

I can understand your resentment, especially since your H stepped out of the boundaries, and acted out his fantasy IRL.
.........especially when you've shown a willingness to share his fantasies, without judgement.It's really not fair to you.

It sounds like your H is being open now, offering transparancy by giving you his password..which is a positive sign.You may be able to work through this, although I feel that he's going to have to do an awful lot of self-examination.

It seems to be a form of compartmentalization on his part---you're in Box "A" and his sexual fantasies are in Box "B"---and he's keeping the two separated.....(which is unfair to you). IC and MC may be helpful.........I don't know what else I can offer you, aside from suggesting that you read up on the Madonna-Wh*re complex. If you can get your H to read a few articles as well, he may have a light-bulb moment.

I wish you my best, and sorry for the pain you're going through
........keep your H's willingness to be transparent in mind as a good sign that you may be able to resolve this.


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## Mal74 (Dec 24, 2009)

Thanks for the replies. I have been feeling very much alone and it is good to see these. 

H came home early from his business trip and is taking the rest of the week off. We spent hours talking last night and actually talked a bit about the "M_W" thing. 

I asked him about why he went outside of our marriage for this. We've had a good, active, consistent sex life as far as I'm concerned. Obviously everyone has ups and downs and we're not special, but this has always been a pretty healthy part of our relationship. He said that mostly he was ashamed and embarrassed by his fantasies and didn't feel like he could share them all with me.

I was floored by that at first. I couldn't understand it. I feel like I've welcomed everything he's shared with me, even when I was uncomfortable at first I have at least tried to find ways to make it work for us. 

This whole "I don't want to be less of a man in your eyes" thing that he has about his sexually submissive fantasies really started to resonate. So I told him, "the only way I am ever going to see you as less of a man is if you DON'T share yourself with me because you are scared of how I'm going to react. When you go outside our marriage for something as intimate as this, that is disloyalty to me. It's all driven by fear and cowardice. And it doesn't make sense that you would be cowardly given everything else you do in your life."

It seemed like this opened up the conversation a little. I think we both have a ways to go but it's apparent that he knows he really hurt me and he's obviously making an effort.

I feel like I fell from a very high place. I thought things were so amazingly great, like I had a near-perfect marriage. I listened to my girlfriends' complaints about their husbands and boyfriends and just shook my head. I feel like I have been very arrogant about it and frankly I just feel like an idiot now.

He has promised me that this doesn't go deeper, he doesn't have some "addiction" and he's not obsessing or focusing all the time on this sex stuff. I'm inclined to believe it because I've looked through his computer, his address book, his web history (which it seems like he's never cleaned out so I saw weeks of stuff) and there's hardly anything sexually-oriented in it except for his small collection of stuff I knew he had despite not knowing the...um, specifics.

So, I don't really know. Right now I just feel lousy. On the one hand I want to laugh it all off, forgive and forget, and move on. On the other hand, I feel like I've been kicked in the stomach and can't catch my breath. I hate this.


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## piqued (Mar 25, 2010)

Mal,
He seems like an honest man, to be frank. It's probably a load off of his mind that you finally know. Somewhere in his brain he has probably always wanted you to know but was too fearful of what might happen if you did.

The other thing to consider is since he is a submissive maybe he would welcome you being a "dominatrix". I don't know your feelings on the fetish, personally I'm not attracted to it, but if you're not negatively predisposed to it perhaps you can have some fun with it and he'd bask in being able to be your slave


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

Mal74 said:


> Right now I just feel lousy. On the one hand I want to laugh it all off, forgive and forget, and move on. On the other hand, I feel like I've been kicked in the stomach and can't catch my breath. I hate this.


 Choose laughter . 

He feared something he should not have, that you would not accept that side of him. He did some things that were very stupid out of fear, thankfully now he knows you do not disrespect him, even with these kinds of fantasies. 

Sounds like you still have a great marraige, the communication is even better now, just try to concentrate on all the new things to explore with him. 

You will go through a time of greiving what was lost, no way to escape this part, but this will not last forever. 

As long as he is truly remorseful, real forgiveness and total healing is within your grasp. Keep the communication alive & strive for as much intimacy as possible. 

You'll surpass what you thought you had before.


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## Saya (Mar 25, 2010)

About a year ago I discovered that my husband had a sexually submissive streak in him. We have been married almost 3 years now.

Even before that we had been exploring D/s and some bondage so it was a surprise to me. But he has never stepped out on me. It was really an accidental thing to find out.

Hubs works in a kinda mans mans world so admitting that he had a desire to be taken and dominated by a girl is real hard for him. even now he hardly ever asks for it. But I am learning to pick up on his cues. I'd say he needs the switch once a month at least. So I take the initiative and do it. Its like when I play with his bum. He never askes but when I start it he wants me to keep going.

Ive been thinking that a lot of guy may have a little of this in them. Society had trained them to think they need to be all macho. But sometimes a person just needs to give in emotionally and physically to feel that deep comfort.

Look at how much guys like reach around HJs. That strikes me a real submissive.

Mal. I'd say try and explore it with him. After I take my hubs in a switch he is like a lamb for a few days. I just have to be careful not to take too much advantage of him. In that mood he'd take me shoe shopping!


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## sisters359 (Apr 9, 2009)

I think you need to punish him 

Seriously, though, you will grieve some--but if you can look at this as a learning experience and not as some type of "fall," you'll feel better about it. Yep, it was "foolish" of you to think you had something so much better than everyone else--but it sounds like you didn't act all snooty about it, so that shows wisdom. Lots of people go a long way in life before they meet their "downfall," and the more one thinks s/he "made" it happen (and didn't take into account the amount of luck there is, because we only have control over ourselves), the harder it falls. You sound like you were mostly grateful for what you had, and that's a great attitude. 

Now, here's the real secret: You actually STILL have a better relationship than a lot of people. The conversations you've had with your dh are unimaginable for most people. Celebrate the honesty you both share. Forgive him for going outside the marriage when you can--and it may take time. In the meantime, try not to punish him with emotional distance just for the sake of punishing him. If he's the decent man you describe, his conscience will punish him and you'll need emotional distance enough just for yourself (to grieve). Adding to that artificially would be counterproductive. 

Good luck.


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## Mal74 (Dec 24, 2009)

Thanks all for your posts. It has been an interesting several days with a lot of highs and lows. I do feel that I am enormously blessed to have a strong marriage with great communication. We are not going to get divorced over this, I know that... but you are all right that I am experiencing a kind of grief. 

At the same time I am relieved to have this sort of poorly-hidden secret on the table. At times I have been thinking, "well, I'll give him exactly what he wants, I'll turn myself into a dominatrix for him," and in the same breath I find myself really turned on by that idea and really disgusted by it. The kink is fine but I wrestle with the idea that I would somehow be "rewarding" him for going outside our marriage. That, of course, is a completely silly thought.

So there you have it - like I said I feel like I fell from a high place. He has been pretty great about all of this since "the incident." I'm confident we'll get through it.

Although we have played around with these fantasies in the past I am really not sure how to "be a dominatrix" in any really practical sense. I've googled a little here and there but would really appreciate having anyone else's point of view or suggestions about easing in to learning more about this stuff.


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## artieb (Nov 11, 2009)

_The Mistress Manual_, by Mistress Lorelei

_SM 101: A Realistic Introduction_, by Jay Wiseman

The latter includes a chapter specifically for a woman whose man wants to be dominated but she isn't sure what to do, in the form of a list.

Make him massage your feet while you read.


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## nice777guy (Nov 23, 2009)

Silly question - that maybe doesn't even matter - but I seem to recall hearing that not all trips to a dom involve actualy sex. 

That doesn't make it OK or right. 

Have you asked him specifically if there was sex involved, or would that not make a difference to you?


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## Eraz2010 (Apr 1, 2010)

Wow Mal, you sound like an amazing couple! I 100% agree with above comments about your communication. Thats special and right now I wish I had it! Infact much of this thread is answering my own post! LOL!

My thoughts were, if he has this submissive thing it's probably been a deep secret of his for years. He says he visited the Dom before your marriage. There's a theme of secrecy and when you couple that with perhaps his guilt at having his "kink" and also putting you on a pedestal (and you sound like an amazing women to be married to) I can perhaps understand why he would seek relief on his fetish elsewhere as it's already a secret place in the shadows that he can slip in and away from easily... does that make sense? It easy for him to do it, much easier than say having an overt affair? I do hope I am making sense.

My prob seems to be the reverse! My wife seems to be displaying dominant tendencies, I seem to be accepting them, yet we can't seem to talk about it! I also saw today some stuff on the internet in this "genre" and can't say it did anything for me. Too much of a bouncy boobies and cute panties kina guy that way I guess.

Stick with you man, you guys sound good together.

I wish you both good luck and I would assume some mind blowing intimacy!


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## zaaam (Apr 1, 2010)

Ufff, that's a tough one.
You married someone you don't really or truly know everything about. Just try to talk it over


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## Eraz2010 (Apr 1, 2010)

Mal74 said:


> Although we have played around with these fantasies in the past I am really not sure how to "be a dominatrix" in any really practical sense. I've googled a little here and there but would really appreciate having anyone else's point of view or suggestions about easing in to learning more about this stuff.


Well lets see how my rather embarrassing chat goes tonight with my wife... maybe I'll let you PM her for some advise! She's never displayed any sort of dominant tendancies before though...unless I have just been clueless! There might be something in what my wife described as "catharsis" when she belted me a couple days ago, actually, I've grown past that and let me rephrase... she spanked me. You might get the same by "punishing" him that way rather than "rewarding"? You'd have to be thorough tho if he likes that kinda stuff. Again maybe my wifes new found talents could benefit you there too! LOL!

On a serious note, just an observation, try not to use the word "deviant" outloud or in your mind. Anyones view of anything is totally determined by where they are viewing it from. Until just a few days ago I was completely unaware (other than via Bree on Desperate Housewives) of this sort of thing and here I sit typing with a sore butt but improved attitude towards my wife. I think.


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## sisters359 (Apr 9, 2009)

Be sure to get at LEAST a good-sized diamond out of this before you let him off the hook! 

I almost didn't make that joke b/c so many men think that all women just want them for the $$$$$. But hey, like the word "queer," I want to embrace this notion and milk it 'til it's meaningless.


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