# for those who have an LD wife



## NJ2 (Mar 22, 2017)

I have spoke about this a few times on specific threads but figured I'd say it once rather than reposting it here and there.

Anatomy of a woman's (mine) drive. H was always HD -I was average -High D

dating 5 years- fairly HD- anytime we saw each other

first 3 years of marriage- HD 3-4 times a week

As we had children...drive becomes lower and lower with each child (3).- work, child rearing responsibilities, fatigue, body not as hot, cleaning chores etc
so we still had regular sex 2x a week then later on 1-2x a week. I wasnt particularly interested but could become interested after we started

menopause-LD then NO D....and I mean NO D. I thought it was from the change in horomones and there wasnt much I could do about it. Also a funny thing happens - if you have no drive you dont really care if you ever have sex again- Selfish but true. I went to IC over it- she suggested I watch the TED video "marriage/sex in captivity"
I did. She also suggested that I may be depressed.

I start to think H is becoming close to a co worker.... I up my game. Buy some clothes, lose some weight , do my hair different.

I go on Wellbutrin for depression. Heres the IMPORTANT part. Wellbutrin is like a viagra for women. It works by raising the dopamine chemicals in your brain. They are responsible for your ability to feel pleasure in life- that includes physical pleasure. After I started taking it I became average to HD again. Just like that. It was a fair miracle. I could have an orgasm again, I wanted sex again, I even began initiating.
It is not prescribed for LD but rather it is a great bonus if it is prescribed for depression.

I am not a dr. I am just stating my own experience.......if you look on line you can find lots of references where it 's had that effect on other women as well. 

If you are one of those husbands in a sexless marriage I would never advocate cheating but..

1. It may help if your wife thinks there "could" be someone else interested in you. 

2.Have her watch the TED "mating in captivity"

3. Suggest that she see the dr to evaluate whether or not she is depressed. Has she gained weight, stopped taking care of herself, lost interest in hobbies and going out, low self esteem...

4. If the dr. thinks she may be and she is open to taking medication for it, suggest she ask to be prescribed-
Wellbutrin- as it is one of the medications with very low side effects.

Just saying ....this could be the issue and the solution for what its worth


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## alexm (Nov 29, 2008)

NJ2 said:


> I go on Wellbutrin for depression. Heres the IMPORTANT part. Wellbutrin is like a viagra for women. It works by raising the dopamine chemicals in your brain. They are responsible for your ability to feel pleasure in life- that includes physical pleasure. After I started taking it I became average to HD again. Just like that. It was a fair miracle. I could have an orgasm again, I wanted sex again, I even began initiating.
> It is not prescribed for LD but rather it is a great bonus if it is prescribed for depression.


Thank you for that! While meds may not be the solution to this for everybody, I can corroborate your experience.

My ex wife went on them for depression about mid-way through our marriage. We went from 1-3x per week to every day. Every. Day. Sometimes more, if time allowed. And she was the one initiating. I suspect she was masturbating daily, too.

It lasted less than a month before she got off them. I recall her saying it had the opposite effect on her, in regards to her depression, and she was actually having suicidal thoughts and got scared. So it was obviously not the right medication for her, unfortunately. At this point in her life, it was anxiety, and pretty heavy OCD that she was dealing with, as well as an eating disorder borne out of those. I suspect the depression was DUE to those other mental issues and the exhaustion associated with them, rather than being the sole, or first, imbalance. Thus, that med was obviously not the right one for her.

But holy hell, for that short time period, she was insatiable!


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## Rocky Mountain Yeti (Apr 23, 2017)

My wife never suffered from depression, but she did go through some hormone therapy, rotating through a few different hormone cocktails to find the one that best affected her, as a result of a combination of hypothyroidism and perimenopause/menopause.

The one that included a little testosterone worked like a charm ... with regard to really ratcheting up the sex drive... even to a rather aggressive level, which was shocking for someone normally lukewarm to cool about sex most of the time.

It was great fun while it lasted. The FemRing and other medication has her female function and her thyroid under control now, without any T. Damn shame. (not really, as I honestly believe taking fewest pills is best, but if there are no other side effects to a little T ....)


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## NJ2 (Mar 22, 2017)

alexm said:


> Thank you for that! While meds may not be the solution to this for everybody, I can corroborate your experience.
> 
> My ex wife went on them for depression about mid-way through our marriage. We went from 1-3x per week to every day. Every. Day. Sometimes more, if time allowed. And she was the one initiating. I suspect she was masturbating daily, too.
> 
> ...


LOL your post made me smile. I'm sure thats how surprised and happy my H was as well. 
Funny at this point in my life I too suffer from anxiety and a debilitating OCD. I went on medication for the OCD. It worked- but nullified the sexual side effect the wellbutrin had. They want me to take it for a year at least...heavy sigh....H would never admit it but I'm sure he'd like to flush them down the toilet some days


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## badsanta (Oct 13, 2014)

NJ2 said:


> menopause-LD then NO D....and I mean NO D. I thought it was from the change in horomones and there wasnt much I could do about it. Also a funny thing happens - if you have no drive you dont really care if you ever have sex again- Selfish but true. I went to IC over it- she suggested I watch the TED video "marriage/sex in captivity"
> I did. She also suggested that I may be depressed.


For what it is worth, I think there are a lot of things that can take someone that is LD and shift them into NO D. I don't think menopause is required.

What is important is that when one spouse has NO D, that a couple needs to be able to talk about it openly and with care for one another. Expectations on how to work through NO D have to be adjusted in such a way that each person understands what is needed in the relationship in order to still feel loved and accepted. 














































...and then before you know it, things get better!

Badsanta


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## Young at Heart (Jan 6, 2015)

badsanta said:


> For what it is worth, I think there are a lot of things that can take someone that is LD and shift them into NO D. I don't think menopause is required.
> 
> What is important is that when one spouse has NO D, that a couple needs to be able to talk about it openly and with care for one another. Expectations on how to work through NO D have to be adjusted in such a way that each person understands what is needed in the relationship in order to still feel loved and accepted.
> 
> ...


slight correction: "...and then before you know it, things get better or you both agree to divorce."

I do agree that when things get to No D, that there does need to be real communication and discussion about boundaries. I remember telling my wife that I took vows of marriage, not vows of celibacy; that I was and hoped to always be a sexual being and would be in a sexual relationship with a woman I cared about. I told her that I wanted it to be her, but if she couldn't, I would end the marriage and find someone else who could.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Thanks sweetheart.

Good advice.

Haven't tried prescription meds but did sit Mrs. C down a few years ago when she was really cooling in the bedroom.

I basically told her I was an alpha male with a high sex drive and that many women would love to have me pour my passion into them. I also told her that I had chosen her and wanted to pour all my passion into her but I was not the type of man to be denied for long.

She got a tear in her eye, took my hand, led me to the bedroom and absolutely knocked my socks off!

Been better and growing, sexually, between us ever since.


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## Buddy400 (Aug 30, 2014)

NJ2 said:


> I have spoke about this a few times on specific threads but figured I'd say it once rather than reposting it here and there.
> 
> Anatomy of a woman's (mine) drive. H was always HD -I was average -High D
> 
> ...


Thanks for that. We hardly ever hear from a genuine woman who was LD or (No D).

In this forum, the women we get are usually HD (LD's generally don't see themselves as having a problem, so they don't post) and therefore, the general advice is that the men must be doing something wrong (often not doing enough housework or not caring enough to give women orgasms).

Advice men are given is generally one or more of the following; I'd appreciate your feedback on which you think would have worked for you.

Get in better shape, dress better, let your wife see that other women are attracted to you. _It looks like this may have worked with you as it was the thought that your husband might be interested in another woman that initially motivated you._

You're not making sex good enough for her to want it; be a better lover; give her more orgasms.

Do more to help your wife around the house. Ease her burdens.

Spend more quality time with your wife; at least 15 hours a week. 

Take her on date nights and be more romantic.

Stop doing anything for your wife that you are doing only for her benefit; if you put her on a pedestal, take her off of it. Emotionally withdraw.

Be more independent. Hang out more with other guys. Do "manly" stuff.

Have a talk with her pointing out that the lack of sex is a serious issue for you (him). Let her know that if the situation doesn't improve, you don't see how the marriage can last.

While you may think some of these things are good, which ones (if any) do you think might have made a difference for you?

The thing you did right was recognize that there was a problem and you looked for solutions. You are to be highly commended for that. Your husband is lucky to have you.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Wellbutrin is known for increasing sex drive in both men and women.


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## David51 (Sep 12, 2017)

Young at Heart said:


> slight correction: "...and then before you know it, things get better or you both agree to divorce."
> 
> 
> 
> I do agree that when things get to No D, that there does need to be real communication and discussion about boundaries. I remember telling my wife that I took vows of marriage, not vows of celibacy; that I was and hoped to always be a sexual being and would be in a sexual relationship with a woman I cared about. I told her that I wanted it to be her, but if she couldn't, I would end the marriage and find someone else who could.




And how did that work out for you?



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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

Better question would be why it worked, not whether it worked or how it worked.


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## Young at Heart (Jan 6, 2015)

David51 said:


> And how did that work out for you?
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


Actually, what saved my sex starved marriage was changes I made in the way I treated my wife combined with sessions with a great sex therapist. The pivotal moment came when the ST asked my wife what she thought would happen if we never had sex again. After a lot of trying to avoid answering my wife finally said we would probably divorce. The Sex Therapist then asked me if I had ever thought about divorce. I told the ST and my wife that yes I had, I had looked up the divorce laws in our state and had promised myself that by a certain birthday of mine that I would be in a loving sexual relationship with a woman and while I would prefer it to be with my wife of 40+ years, I would divorce her before that birthday so I could keep my promise to myself if things didn't change.

My wife was a deer in the headlights. The ST was surprised but said that was a reasonable approach that gave my wife time to figure out what she really wanted. It was no up to my wife to either provide the loving sexual relationship I had promised myself or to choose not to have sex and know that she would have no one to blame for divorce but herself.

The ST then helped us start having sex again and negotiated the frequency of sex that we could both live with.

So to answer your question how did the that work out for me? Well I didn't need to divorce my wife, but I sure came very close.


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## NJ2 (Mar 22, 2017)

Buddy400 said:


> Thanks for that. We hardly ever hear from a genuine woman who was LD or (No D).
> 
> In this forum, the women we get are usually HD (LD's generally don't see themselves as having a problem, so they don't post) and therefore, the general advice is that the men must be doing something wrong (often not doing enough housework or not caring enough to give women orgasms).
> 
> ...


 @Buddy400 - thank you- I try to be honest even when it puts me in an unflattering light- I've learned so much on here from other people!

to answer your questions
1. I've always thought my H was/is very handsome and fit for his age-actually for any age...so improving looks wasnt necessary nor would it have helped.

2.The fact that I thought someone was interested in him and he may be reciprocating that interest was a huge wake up call. I think I'd gotten complacent in the marriage and took it for granted that he would always be there no matter what I did or didnt do. I think @MAJDEATH has a quote something like look after your partner or someone else will - this now rings true for me

3. H was/is a very unselfish lover and quite skilled at giving orgasms so improvement in this area would not have made any difference-I also think much of a womans sexual pleasure is in the mind- she is just as responsible for her enjoyment as he is. Watching the TED "mating in captivity" made this point.

4. Doing more around the house would have maybe helped during the lower D times when the kids were little as that would have reduced some of the fatigue and resentment felt from real or perceived inequality of responsibilities. During the no D phase he could have become my slave and it wouldnt have made a difference.

5. Spending more quality time with me may have made a difference. This is where he fell sadly short. He was always out working, took stand-by frequently, worked overtime and did a side business- add to this his sporting activities and time spent with his mom and our kids....not much time left for his wife. We did go on date nights but without other quality time it felt like it was solely for the purpose of extracting sex at the end of it. I dreaded the expectation of sex at the end of it.

6. I wasnt on a pedestal and he was already emotionally withdrawn

7. He was already doing manly stuff and hanging out with the guys

8. Letting me know that he was willing to walk away from the marriage if things didnt change....that would have been a wake up call- I think it would have given me pause and motivation to find a solution we could both live with. What happened instead is I had a talk with him- I told him that I was no longer interested in sex for both physical and hormonal reasons. I drew pictures to explaing and took the approach that we were lucky to go forward with a new phase of our marriage even if it is a platonic phase. 

He never made it clear to me that it was important to him emotionally or physically. What I mean is that I never realized that my rejection made him feel sad or unattractive, that he blamed himself, that the rejections emasculated him. I didnt know that he eventually gave up and it wasnt worth the effort to get duty sex anymore. I didnt know that he needed it to feel bonded. I hated how he would grab my bits and "playfully" throw me on the bed- he thought this was foreplay. It made me feel like a piece of meat. When that attention is unwanted -it feels aggressive and immature.

When it IS wanted -it could feel playful and flirty. Now that we have sex pretty much whenever he wants to he no longer does that. A backscratch, holding my hand, pouring me a glass of wine, kissing my back- spending the evening together looking at the stars or watching episodes of a favorite series- these are the more subtle approaches that work on me. 


Quick recap-
with very LD or ND it is MY experience that- looks, sexual expertise, # of orgasms, amount of burdens lessened,
date nights, none of these would make a difference.

with LD or ND -more quality time would have led to communication/intimacy on an emotional level that would open up an honest conversation. Explaining the importance of physical intimacy to the continued marriage and the fact that there are plenty (or even one ) woman who would be eager and willing to step up to this role would be a wake up call. Watching the TED video helps explain responsibility for desire in the marriage. 
For me most importantly that wake up call led me to look for solutions- what changes could I make that would help the situation. Medication (wellbutrin-no substitutes) for lack of motivation and depression was the impetus. It brought about the physical changes that were sooooooo important to the rest of the changes. 

If you cant feel pleasure there is no drive. If you have no drive all advances are met with avoidance, excuses, resentment and guilt. I couldnt stand to be touched in non sexual ways either. I didnt want my hand held or a backscratch - i would have found it beyond irritating. I likened it to being burned. My instinct was to recoil from his touch. It was not either partners fault. We were ignorant or unempathetic to each others needs. I was physically compromised and needed to fix that. I didnt know it was even possible. 

After I began taking the wellbutrin- for the first time in our decades long marriage we started to sleep in the nude. We fell asleep spooning or holding hands. We looked for opportunities to be alone and naked. Sometimes leading to sex and sometimes not. We began to feel increasingly bonded to each other in a way we have never felt. I remember being out to dinner at a fancy restaurant with friends- after we got home we both admitted that we had spent the whole evening thinking we just wanted to go home together and get naked. It was such a feeling of comfort and warmth.

Obviously it wasnt as easy a transition as it sounds- we went to MC/IC, weekend marital courses, he went to church courses.....There were other issues besides menopause and depression involved- his percieved EA/PA, my disclosure of an A 25 years ago, I developed OCD thinking-- requiring additional medication which made it rare for me to have an orgasm.....It did not nullify my ability to feel physical pleasure though. So we still sleep naked and we still have willing sex.... It has been a lot of work. Soooo worth it. If you had asked me 5 years ago if I ever thought I would have the marriage I have now I would have laughed. It is everything I never even knew I wanted.

Hope this gives you some hope and helps. Wishing you all the best.


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## NJ2 (Mar 22, 2017)

Buddy400 said:


> Thanks for that. We hardly ever hear from a genuine woman who was LD or (No D).
> 
> In this forum, the women we get are usually HD (LD's generally don't see themselves as having a problem, so they don't post) and therefore, the general advice is that the men must be doing something wrong (often not doing enough housework or not caring enough to give women orgasms).
> 
> ...


 @Buddy400 - thank you- I try to be honest even when it puts me in an unflattering light- I've learned so much on here from other people!

to answer your questions
1. I've always thought my H was/is very handsome and fit for his age-actually for any age...so improving looks wasnt necessary nor would it have helped.

2.The fact that I thought someone was interested in him and he may be reciprocating that interest was a huge wake up call. I think I'd gotten complacent in the marriage and took it for granted that he would always be there no matter what I did or didnt do. I think @MAJDEATH has a quote something like look after your partner or someone else will - this now rings true for me

3. H was/is a very unselfish lover and quite skilled at giving orgasms so improvement in this area would not have made any difference-I also think much of a womans sexual pleasure is in the mind- she is just as responsible for her enjoyment as he is. Watching the TED "mating in captivity" made this point.

4. Doing more around the house would have maybe helped during the lower D times when the kids were little as that would have reduced some of the fatigue and resentment felt from real or perceived inequality of responsibilities. During the no D phase he could have become my slave and it wouldnt have made a difference.

5. Spending more quality time with me may have made a difference. This is where he fell sadly short. He was always out working, took stand-by frequently, worked overtime and did a side business- add to this his sporting activities and time spent with his mom and our kids....not much time left for his wife. We did go on date nights but without other quality time it felt like it was solely for the purpose of extracting sex at the end of it. I dreaded the expectation of sex at the end of it.

6. I wasnt on a pedestal and he was already emotionally withdrawn

7. He was already doing manly stuff and hanging out with the guys

8. Letting me know that he was willing to walk away from the marriage if things didnt change....that would have been a wake up call- I think it would have given me pause and motivation to find a solution we could both live with. What happened instead is I had a talk with him- I told him that I was no longer interested in sex for both physical and hormonal reasons. I drew pictures to explaing and took the approach that we were lucky to go forward with a new phase of our marriage even if it is a platonic phase. 

He never made it clear to me that it was important to him emotionally or physically. What I mean is that I never realized that my rejection made him feel sad or unattractive, that he blamed himself, that the rejections emasculated him. I didnt know that he eventually gave up and it wasnt worth the effort to get duty sex anymore. I didnt know that he needed it to feel bonded. I hated how he would grab my bits and "playfully" throw me on the bed- he thought this was foreplay. It made me feel like a piece of meat. When that attention is unwanted -it feels aggressive and immature.

When it IS wanted -it could feel playful and flirty. Now that we have sex pretty much whenever he wants to he no longer does that. A backscratch, holding my hand, pouring me a glass of wine, kissing my back- spending the evening together looking at the stars or watching episodes of a favorite series- these are the more subtle approaches that work on me. 


Quick recap-
with very LD or ND it is MY experience that- looks, sexual expertise, # of orgasms, amount of burdens lessened,
date nights, none of these would make a difference.

with LD or ND -more quality time would have led to communication/intimacy on an emotional level that would open up an honest conversation. Explaining the importance of physical intimacy to the continued marriage and the fact that there are plenty (or even one ) woman who would be eager and willing to step up to this role would be a wake up call. Watching the TED video helps explain responsibility for desire in the marriage. 
For me most importantly that wake up call led me to look for solutions- what changes could I make that would help the situation. Medication (wellbutrin-no substitutes) for lack of motivation and depression was the impetus. It brought about the physical changes that were sooooooo important to the rest of the changes. 

If you cant feel pleasure there is no drive. If you have no drive all advances are met with avoidance, excuses, resentment and guilt. I couldnt stand to be touched in non sexual ways either. I didnt want my hand held or a backscratch - i would have found it beyond irritating. I likened it to being burned. My instinct was to recoil from his touch. It was not either partners fault. We were ignorant or unempathetic to each others needs. I was physically compromised and needed to fix that. I didnt know it was even possible. 

After I began taking the wellbutrin- for the first time in our decades long marriage we started to sleep in the nude. We fell asleep spooning or holding hands. We looked for opportunities to be alone and naked. Sometimes leading to sex and sometimes not. We began to feel increasingly bonded to each other in a way we have never felt. I remember being out to dinner at a fancy restaurant with friends- after we got home we both admitted that we had spent the whole evening thinking we just wanted to go home together and get naked. It was such a feeling of comfort and warmth.

Obviously it wasnt as easy a transition as it sounds- we went to MC/IC, weekend marital courses, he went to church courses.....There were other issues besides menopause and depression involved- his percieved EA/PA, my disclosure of an A 25 years ago, I developed OCD thinking-- requiring additional medication which made it rare for me to have an orgasm.....It did not nullify my ability to feel physical pleasure though. So we still sleep naked and we still have willing sex.... It has been a lot of work. Soooo worth it. If you had asked me 5 years ago if I ever thought I would have the marriage I have now I would have laughed. It is everything I never even knew I wanted.

Hope this gives you some hope and helps. Wishing you all the best.


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## Young at Heart (Jan 6, 2015)

It is worth reading it twice. 

While I am an HD male, I feel that I and my wife have walked a similar path. Everything that NJ2 said I agree with as it is my experience as well from the other side.


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## Buddy400 (Aug 30, 2014)

NJ2 said:


> @Buddy400 - thank you- I try to be honest even when it puts me in an unflattering light- I've learned so much on here from other people! ............


Thank you for the thought, effort and time you put in responding so thoroughly.


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## NJ2 (Mar 22, 2017)

Also..... smoking a little weed helps for some people.


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## PieceOfSky (Apr 7, 2013)

I'm very glad Wellbutrin worked for you, NJ2. Truly. And thanks for sharing your story.

Wellbutrin has not led to a repair of anything in my marriage (wife has taken it at least five years, and, yes, the SSRIs before that had the common side effect of reducing her libido). Wellbutrin may have helped her move past her inability to orgasm, though, a condition that appeared after child birth and went on a few years or more. Now, a decade and a half since our first kid, she apparently has a satisfying solo sex life, which she recently noted she prefers over being with me. So maybe the Wellbutrin helped her but not us. (I honestly think if a pill would increase her libido, she would choose not to take it. She is not open to fixing anything affecting us.)

Do you think weed played a role in your turn-around story? (Not trying to be overly nosy, but if it did play a role, that would be useful to know.)

It's clear my wife's sex life was better before she met me. Her use of weed stopped when we met, essentially.


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## David51 (Sep 12, 2017)

PieceOfSky said:


> I'm very glad Wellbutrin worked for you, NJ2. Truly. And thanks for sharing your story.
> 
> Wellbutrin has not led to a repair of anything in my marriage (wife has taken it at least five years, and, yes, the SSRIs before that had the common side effect of reducing her libido). Wellbutrin may have helped her move past her inability to orgasm, though, a condition that appeared after child birth and went on a few years or more. Now, a decade and a half since our first kid, she apparently has a satisfying solo sex life, which she recently noted she prefers over being with me. So maybe the Wellbutrin helped her but not us. (I honestly think if a pill would increase her libido, she would choose not to take it. She is not open to fixing anything affecting us.)
> 
> ...




Not trying to be an ass here but it I was in my early to mid 40's or younger And you, I would find another woman. I commend you for sticking with her ....I just couldn't do it.


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## NJ2 (Mar 22, 2017)

PieceOfSky said:


> I'm very glad Wellbutrin worked for you, NJ2. Truly. And thanks for sharing your story.
> 
> Wellbutrin has not led to a repair of anything in my marriage (wife has taken it at least five years, and, yes, the SSRIs before that had the common side effect of reducing her libido). Wellbutrin may have helped her move past her inability to orgasm, though, a condition that appeared after child birth and went on a few years or more. Now, a decade and a half since our first kid, she apparently has a satisfying solo sex life, which she recently noted she prefers over being with me. So maybe the Wellbutrin helped her but not us. (I honestly think if a pill would increase her libido, she would choose not to take it. She is not open to fixing anything affecting us.)
> 
> ...


I understand how your wife feels i think.....i also chose the solo route during the LD phase- i preferred it to having sex with H at that time. Its very hard to describe how invasive and unwanted sex was with him. It really is a complicated problem. Resentments build up within each partner, you grow apart because of past hurts, throw in some depression and horomones - suddenly there is a sexual wall between you.

He's the same guy although much more caring, empathetic and just plain interested now. It is a real circular thing- we are more intimate emotionally because we are more intimate physically and vice versa. The changes in him couldnt have come about if we hadnt gone to MC and I hadnt become a willing physical partner. I dont think I could have become that partner without the MC/IC and Wellbutrin. 

We started smoking pot because I found some in our garage- he had sworn he would give it up when we got married (decades ago) so I was pissed and flushed it down the toilet. My assitant at work was appalled that i did that when i told her and said i needed to replace it. I was very stressed (parents dieing, thinking H was having an A, disclosing my A) She also recommended that I try some to help take the edge off. So I bought some to replace the stuff I flushed and suggested we smoke together instead of him doing it behind my back. I found it took me from 360 to 0 on the stress meter with very little needed. The side benefit was it made me very touchy feely, loving and in the mood. Even if I was furious with him if i smoked I'd want to head up to the bedroom. We were already having sex again but it definately increased the libido and gave a more intense orgasm.

We rarely smoke anymore- its not needed. If your wife used to smoke she would probably love it if you both smoked together sometime. Try it- you have nothing to lose. Ask her - my H was not in favour at first but after i brought some home and did it on my own a few times he said he wanted to. Let me know if it works.


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