# This is real



## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

*This is real...guess this is my journal now*

Things haven't been good for a while. Maybe we expected too much of each other, maybe there just never was enough. He changed jobs a few years ago and we ended up paying a mortgage and rent at the same time when we had to move because the house was not selling. We lost the house, and then he lost that job. We moved to start new with a cheaper rental. I got pregnant even though he said he didn't want more kids and I told him he needed a vasectomy if so. He never really did take responsibility for birth control, it was always me. So I was pregnant and it was a rough pregnancy and I said no more. He had to have the surgery before the baby was born. He is five, and I have had surgery instead. I know I resent that, but I tried to let it go.

2 of our 3 kids have behavioral health issues. One may have a high functions spectrum disorder, the other has a massive rage disorder at just five years, so parenting has not been easy. However H has OCD. Our arguments revolve around I never do anything and he has to do it all with house cleaning. My son has started calling me lazy because he thinks it is normal. 

Recently I got sick. A cold for two weeks or so I thought. Then the flu before recovering from that but things got worse health wise and I ended up with mono. The entire time he worked long hours, the kids were all sick with me and I cared for them while he worked. He'd come home, keep working and then hold the kids. I begged for a hug. He said he didn't want what I had...even though he has had mono before. I begged for a break from the kids. He said "I never get a break when you work. Deal with it". I confronted him on how aloof he was. He had nothing to say. I felt abandoned in my weakest state. As I was one bed rest I picked up a spindle I had ordered earlier and began to play with drop spinning to make yarn, in the moments I was awake, partially to keep my hands busy so they wouldn't scratch my legs all up due to the mono rash (which is rare, lucky me). His response was "why can't you have normal hobbies, I don't even like talking to my friends about what you do because it embarrasses me". 

I was crushed, and cried all night. We haven't really slept in th same room in ages because he normally lays down with the kids to get them to sleep and ends up falling asleep, so he never saw me cry.

I began to realize all the looks he gave me while I was sick was of disgust. And I couldn't talk to him for days. He finally got angry and asked me what was wrong. I tried to explain, and he said "so what do you want a separation"? 

And that was that. I felt like I could breathe. It was liberating thinking about it.

However, now I'm having a hard time finding housing I can afford, since I have a ton of hospital debt and not a very good job. He is offering to pay support, but still, it is not enough with my bills. He has stopped helping with the kids mostly and left me to do all their care. He sleeps in another room. I have been fine, and just trying to plan. Tonight he wanted to go through bills. We did. He handed me my debit card and insurance cards and it hit me.

This is for real. He said he loved me, but doesn't act it. I wish he would. I keep thinking it didn't have to be this way. He could have gotten help for his OCD. He is medicated but refuses therapy. We could have gone to marriage counseling. I've been begging for years. But he wouldn't have that either. 

I'm terrified of surviving alone. Terrified of being alone. His family has rallied around him, providing housing and furniture (neither of us can afford to stay in this house we rent). My parents said "suck it up if he's not hitting you". They are five states away anyway, so I really will have no one and I'm absolutely scared now. Since he handed me my debit card, I walked into my room and haven't stopped crying. 
I feel bipolar with how good I felt abut this just a few hours ago. And now I'm a blithering mess.

He was my one and only. The thought of intimacy with another man grosses me out. So I fear I will be alone forever. And now I'm rambling and can't see the keypad on my iPad through the tears anyway, so I will stop now. I just needed. To talk to someone who understands.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Hi, BFG. I’m so sorry you are going through this. You need some support and you need it now. Are you able to see a counsellor? Your H needs help too, but you have no control over that. You have both been extremely stressed for quite some time.

The fact that you felt relief when he asked if you wanted a separation says a lot. It sounds like he has not been very supportive and, in fact, has been so critical the your son has begun to adopt the same attitude.

Do you have any support with the children? Raising two with behavioral challenges can be so hard on a marriage. I would talk to your family doctor. The fact that your H has OCD is a red flag. OCD, and related disorders, can be hereditary. Find out what help is available for you.

It seems hopeless right now, and that is normal. there will be ups and downs before it gets better, but it will get better. Keep posting. We’re here for you.

Hug.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I don't have a counselor right now, and can't afford One anyway. The boys' therapist is too expensive. I just wish...I don't know. I guess that things could be different. I have ADHD and do have my messy moments, but not to the point of laziness. These statements come after a long bout of illness when he thinks I should be better or after extremely difficult times with my full time job and school. 

He is a good dad.

We are just angry with each other all the time and turning into our parents. 

I think I would be o.k if my parents took it better, but they are fundamental Christians and since I walked away from Christianity I have been constantly reminded how my life would magically get better if I came back to god. I'm sure that conversation will come. I've already seen my mothers Facebook statuses of "just pray. I am just sickened for a situation". Thankfully she has not posted WHAT but, I don't need prayer. I need help. 

I just start to wonder, where my contacts are. It seems unfair...as childish as that seems. But I just, feel alone and scared tonight.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

It is unfair. You need support and your parents are unable to give it.

You will need to find the strength within yourself to deal with this. But tonight is not the time. Tonight it hurts so much all you can do is cry. And, odd as it sounds, that’s okay.

Tomorrow do something just for you, be it a long bubble bath a brisk walk, a good book......whatever. Be good to yourself. By doing so you will begin to build the strength you need to get through this.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

You can get by without a counsellor BFGuru. Talk to people here. You will find support from others who have been through what you are going through, and will understand. 

In any case it is anonymous.

Write it how you feel it. Let it out and lean on this community.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I've been to therapy before. I have picked up some cooing mechanisms that help. I just wish he didn't feel so superior to them because of his psych masters.


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## Stella Moon (Nov 22, 2012)

Come here come here come here...

Every day...post...talk...vent...ask...

Thee best free couseling out there...check out different forums here too...keep reading...even forums that you feel don't pertain to your situation...you will pick stuff up and apply it to yourself.. you have no idea... 

You have to find resources...they are out there...make calls...be proactive as much as possible...food shelves...help lines...clinics...etc...groups...any close friends? Do you have any brothers or sisters? Would your family be there for you if you did leave and go back to their location? Would they be supportive? Would it help you to heal? 

Yanno some things might 'hit' your husband too during this separation etc...he's going to be smacked with reality as well.. 

I know telling you to 'be strong' may be generic... but you have to be...hold your ground...take control...and take every single thing one minute at a time...don't dwell on the next day...just minute by minute for now...get through the day...you will build your strength...and you will realize your going to get through this...

you will...


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

My mother would convince my children they were horrible people for not praying. She has given my daughter nightmares, so we...love her from a distance. I did spend a lot of time talking to her tonight though. Longer than I have in almost ten years. 

I would never separate the kids for their dad that way and I could not survive without them anyway. I'm having a hard enough time knowing I said he could keep one if the cats! 

My other brother has schizoaffective disorder, and although he lived with us for a while, he moved five states away to be back with his friends six months ago. The kids do miss him, but I know no one else there and his disorder makes him a hermit. 

My other brother is an evangelical Christian and stopped talking to me more than once a year when I stopped doing the god thing. I have no real relationship with him. In fact, his kids don't know who I am, and my kids keep forgetting he exists. I have to keep reminding them. My five year old was 11 months old last time he saw him so he doesn't even remember him. 

I made H's family my family. I invested in them because mine wasn't there. And now I'm losing them too. They SAY I'm still welcome, but after watching his sister get a divorce and how uncomfortable the X felt at family gatherings...it just won't be the same.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> My mother would convince my children they were horrible people for not praying. She has given my daughter nightmares, so we...love her from a distance. I did spend a lot of time talking to her tonight though. Longer than I have in almost ten years.
> 
> I would never separate the kids for their dad that way and I could not survive without them anyway. I'm having a hard enough time knowing I said he could keep one if the cats!
> 
> ...


You might find the crisis brings out the best in your family. Might build a few bridges.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

They have have already told me to suck it up. If he's not hitting me I need to stay. That I need t do more for my marriage. In their eyes, this is my fault.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I think I have cried myself to dehydration. He has stopped getting the kids up for school (I normally sleep in the am because I work overnight, but have been home with mono for the past month) and it is 3 a.m. So I need to force myself to sleep some. He says he has meetings early in the morning so it's not like he can help it, but I still have to be a parent in less than four hours.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Does he want to separate or be together?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

He brought it up. Not to say I haven't thought it, but he is the one who has brought it up in the past and I finally said yes. I was fine with all of it. Nervous financially, but fine. Until tonight, that is. 

The couple times I did bring it up was always "do you want me to leave? Do I make you that unhappy?" 

I can't please him. I guess it's been from the beginning of our marriage, but he doesn't make an effort to connect with me either. It's like I'm an afterthought. If I didn't scour all his email accounts I would think there was another woman. 

His dad died in May. 

I hate this is happening less than a year later. I loved his dad like a father and more. He understood me. It was hard on all of us.

But loving husbands don't stand there and stare at you when you are crying, begging for some positive touch, because you are that sick. I know this. 

I'm just more upset that we were not worth fighting for.


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## Stella Moon (Nov 22, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> He brought it up. Not to say I haven't thought it, but he is the one who has brought it up in the past and I finally said yes. I was fine with all of it. Nervous financially, but fine. Until tonight, that is.
> 
> The couple times I did bring it up was always "do you want me to leave? Do I make you that unhappy?"
> 
> ...


He did that huh? Hmph....yeap. Sounds like my guy. 

Google something for me unless your aware of this already...I show this to some people it helps them relate a little bit to their situation....google 'passive aggressive personality disorder...then google it and add 'in marriage or relationship'....read some of those links...see if you see your husband in there. 

It helped me realize that 'it wasn't me' (all me)....my stbxh had a serious problem. I looked at things differently...a couple counselors told me my husband had this and I researched it....wow...the links even had a picture of him...lol


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## Stella Moon (Nov 22, 2012)

And by no means am I 'diagnosing' your husband...only you can determine if you can relate at all. I just want to reiterate that  only a professional can 'diagnose' ...we can however relate or assume...haha..


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

There's not much passive about his aggression verbally, but he can also give the silent treatment like a pmsing pissed off woman. I've been awake all night. I keep trying to sleep and can't. 

Doctor says i should be sleeping 10-12 hours a day because of mono. It must be resolving because I couldn't stay awake more than an hour a week ago. 

I have massive stomach pains from it. So much that I'd rather be anorexic most days and deal with the hunger pains than the pain that comes with eating. However, as I lay here with my stomach I. Knots once more, knowing it probably is hunger, I can't help but think how much of it is stress.

I'm fine for 15 minute increments thinking...gawd he's been an ass since we planned our. Honeymoon, and then I start crying all over again.

All that to say...let me try...attempt to sleep a little. Then I will google. I want so bad to tell him all he has done to show disdain for me. However, when my mom went nuts on me years ago, my therapist said something profound. "What if you do and she doesn't care?" It keeps me from wanting to talk now. I don't think I could handle the rejection.

Yet, he is doing everything to make this amicable. He says he worries how I will survive. I don't know what to believe in my head tonight. And why was I so fine with it all week, planning my newfound freedom, and now I'm so upset I can't even sleep? 

I told my doctor at my mono follow up if I didn't start feeling healthy soon I was going to get depressed. He offered me meds. I wish I would have taken them now, but they make me so tired, I didn't want to exacerbate my recovery.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

If he was prepared to go to counselling woud you try it?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

In a heartbeat. I've begged him to go. Two years ago we had three sessions and he determined he didn't like him and that it was useless. I said we can find another one. He says no. He feels that he knows what they will say and that he would be a better therapist than them. Maybe he would. He is excellent at his job as a therapist for kids, but I wish he would be humble enough to accept help.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Could your mother and brother help you get him into counselling?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

How? He can't stand either of them and would just get angry if they tried to talk to him about it.


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## Goldfinch (Jan 22, 2013)

I'm so sorry for your situation, and being sick is just compounding everything. Is there a women's support center where you live? They often can provide legal advice, counseling, child welfare support, etc. How about a hotline? I used to work on a crisis hotline and we referred people to free and reduced cost services all the time.

I have spindles and used to spin also, and I don't think it is weird. Even if it was weird - that is his problem, not yours, although I know it is so hard not to take it personally.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I don't know if there are hotlines or what I would even say to them. I'm just a little lost right now.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

I second the idea of looking for a women’s support group. They will know the resources out there for you and can also offer the support of women who are going through or have been through the same thing. Google (isn’t it a wonderful thing!) women’s support groups in your area. 

Like Stellamoon, I’m not diagnosing, but some of your H’s behavior ,for example thinking he could do better at counselling than a professional, sounds like personality disorder. Try googling that and see what you think. It won’t change anything, but gaining insight may help you deal with his behavior. 

I find it interesting that he has always left the decision to separate up to you. This way he can blame you for it. I would give that back to him. Tell him you’ve changed your mind and want to work on things, but that if he wants out he needs to make the move. 

Just a thought.

Remember to take care of yourself. I know its hard to think of that now, but its so important. You need to be well and strong, not only for yourself, but for your children too.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

He IS a counselor...of children, but a counselor none the less.

He already has a place and keeps pushing for me to find a place so we can get out from under this huge house. His family has run to his rescue. I have the luck of a dysfunctional family that runs from each other, so no help for me. I will google and see what I can find...it's a snow day so I'm stuck with the kids all day, who don't know yet, and can't drive out looking for places again.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Interesting. I realize its different when its your own life, but as a counsellor, one would think he could handle things in a more humane way.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I must be googling wrong, because I can't find anything. Even with town names the only places showing up are three hours away.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I have a viewing for a 2 bedroom apartment tomorrow in the same town that I work. I wish I could afford 3 so my daughter had a room of her own. We will have to share a room, unfortunately. But it is 200 more than I was prepared to spend plus utilities and its the cheapest I have found.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I feel a little more in control since landing an apartment viewing tomorrow. My friend is moving and has offered to let me take over her lease as well, which is about 100 cheaper than this other place. Just not sure of the school district.

However, I'm still feeling bipolar because now I'm just pissed. Pissed that he felt he was justified in treating me like $h1t when I was sicker than I've ever been in my life. Pissed that he never wanted to go to counseling, and all the crap he has said to me through the years that has stuck me to the core keeps coming back up in my brain. He claims he loves me, but truthfully I don't think he ever was IN LOVE with me. Maybe ore pity at some point but not love. I just want to yell at him today, but we've yelled so much that I know it won't help. I just want to pull out every hateful thing he has said to me and tell him he was and is a d*** with emotional problems and will always struggle with relationships if he doesn't seek out help. And I don't want him influencing my kids, teaching my daughter it is ok for a man to treat her that way or my boys that it is ok to treat a woman that way. I think I'm done crying for the moment. I'm am just so incredibly angry. And I know this will interfere with nursing school...perhaps that's part of his plan. He has never liked me being in school. But I just want to hit something right now.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Stella Moon said:


> He did that huh? Hmph....yeap. Sounds like my guy.
> 
> Google something for me unless your aware of this already...I show this to some people it helps them relate a little bit to their situation....google 'passive aggressive personality disorder...then google it and add 'in marriage or relationship'....read some of those links...see if you see your husband in there.
> 
> It helped me realize that 'it wasn't me' (all me)....my stbxh had a serious problem. I looked at things differently...a couple counselors told me my husband had this and I researched it....wow...the links even had a picture of him...lol


This doesn't sound like him. He is very organized and on top of things. I'm more chaotic and forgetful, but not deliberately.

We talked a little tonight and he said some things that made me realize that he hasn't checked out on the kids completely, and I acknowledged that. But ugh. I am so conflicted. I bounce back and forth between wanting to work on this and wanting to run now.


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## Stella Moon (Nov 22, 2012)

You can want to work on things all you want but if he doesn't want to..your screwed. 
You need to watch out for yourself and the kids daily and move forward.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> How? He can't stand either of them and would just get angry if they tried to talk to him about it.


Being a little more strategic though, your family want you to work on the marriage. You can ask for their help to get him to counselling so the marriage can be saved. That might get them on your side.

I don't know you at all obviously, but I do get the impression you are very angry. Am I wrong?

If I am right, I wonder if you should delay making any huge decisions since you will feel different when you calm down. Just a thought.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Maybe I need to learn to survive on my own. Maybe I'm the passive aggressive one. He said I never make eye contact with him, and he's right. But he normally talks to me when I'm in the middle of reading something...given I read a lot.

I don't take a lot of initiative in the house because I'm always distracted by something or another, but he also doesn't acknowledge what I do around the house. 

He brought up our anniversary this year when I became really hard in him. I plan all our vacations. And when the place it thought he'd want to go was booked, I just got upset and frustrated and told him if he wants to go anywhere he has to plan it. He then planned something that would have been nice, except he was angry at a friend of mine, who was getting married the next day. We were due at the wedding, but he did not want to be at all in the same area as her the night before lest she pull me away for pre wedding drama. I told him her rehearsal dinner was there. And then I was still hurt because it seemed like he had just thrown it together because it was free. I made it real hard on him, and I didn't know all he had planned until later. He was very hurt by it he admitted tonight. I couldn't bring myself to apologize. I don't know why. And now I feel like I should have.

I feel like if he wants to work at it we should. He said he did. But there is so much past hurt. And what if I do need to learn to take care of myself? I went straight from home to the dorm to marriage before graduating college. Maybe 20 was too young to become a mature member of a marriage.

However, I also think, I can't stay here and go to school and he is established at his job and wasn't able to find new employment when he was looking last year. I know the long commutes between school and work caused my immune system crash, and if I continue to live this far north it will continue if I go back next semester because one cannot live off of three hours of sleep mon-Friday and lose an entire 28 hours every Friday from leaving school and going straight to work all night. 

He said he got used to me not being around all semester. I think if we lived closer I would have been around more.

He thinks I am angry he got involved on Facebook and has friends now he said tonight. I'm still scratching my head there as I set up his account and encouraged him to get involved for a few years before I gave up and realized it wasn't his thing. 

I feel stupid for holding on to the hurt that for 16 years he has never taken me dancing, because he doesn't like to dance. I don't like football and I would watch it just to be with him. He doesn't see it the same way.

We have a lot of built up hurts. I shouldn't be holding into things he said 8 years ago, but I do. Maybe I do need therapy, but there is no money for that right now. 

I just keep on rambling. I think this thread is going to become my journal. It's been a week and I've been fine until last night and since then I have fluctuated back and forth. And somehow, I feel like I let him convince me it is mostly my fault again and I'm angry about that.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Wazza said:


> Being a little more strategic though, your family want you to work on the marriage. You can ask for their help to get him to counselling so the marriage can be saved. That might get them on your side.
> 
> I don't know you at all obviously, but I do get the impression you are very angry. Am I wrong?
> 
> If I am right, I wonder if you should delay making any huge decisions since you will feel different when you calm down. Just a thought.


I'm not sure how they could help get him to counseling though. He has no respect for them. 

And you are right. I am angry, and hurt, and confused and heck...I'll probably blink and be convinced everything is going to be fine if I just do xyz. 

Can we just...say I'm a cluster f*** of emotions right now?


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

How much is his fault and how much is yours? I don't know the answer of course, but I am interested in how you see it.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Honestly...I don't know, right now. 

No one really wants to say I effed up. But I'm trying to. So much has happened in our 16 years of marriage, that its hard to tell anymore.

I think I've never forgiven a few things and although I think I have something happens and I'm back to feeling hurt all over again over those original issues because I see similarities with the current issue. 

Maybe school has made me emotionally distant. Maybe I was before. I don't even know anymore. I know he has OCD and I have ADD and my chaotic sense of organization drives him insane. I realize I hurt him in our anniversary this year. 

I know he thinks saying "I love you" is enough, and it has always felt awkward and empty to me. Show me. Write it, hold me with out wanting sex each time you touch me. I am not very sexual but have had many many years of painful intercourse so it took a toll on our marriage. Doctors told me it was in my head, and I felt like having sex was like giving birth. That's how bad it hurt. He felt I was rejecting him. He said some pretty spiteful things back then and they haunt me to this day. He is angry I don't let it go. I finally found a doctor that took me seriously and the pain is now gone, but it takes a lot to get me aroused. Things were ok there for a few years and then he stopped initiating. I even made a conscious decision not to turn him down no matte how I felt to fix it, but he still accuses me of holding out on him. Well, not in the past year or two. Any sex we have had has been because I initiated it. So I guess we are even as pathetic as that sounds. 

I am just a mess of confusion, trying to take responsibility for my part. But so incredibly hurt over what he has done. And I feel like these discussions always end with me trying for two weeks to clean like he wants and do things the way he wants and I get tired and there's not any romance...and why does a wife have to ask for flowers anyway? (Those occasions can be counted on my fingers in the past 16 years anyway). And then I quit, again until the next blow up argument.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Thing is you get into these traps where both of you are hurt. And it is hard to let go and move forward. 

I know my wife's affair, all those years ago, coincided with her going back to school. It unleashed a torrent of emotions, and all sorts of stuff. We got through, and are still together and very happy, but along the way we had some dark times. I am recognising a lot of our struggles in some of the things you are listing.

OK, he is such a good counsellor, what would he advise professionally?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

He's not a marriage counselor. That's it and why his attitude is so crazy. We talked some more tonight, and I am just confused. I want it to work out, and at one point he seemed open to therapy, but then he didn't. Like he expects us to work it out ourselves? Or maybe I am misunderstanding his cues. 

Part of me is afraid if I look at this apartment tomorrow we will never work out. Part if me knows if I don't get closer to school I will never finish because the physical toll on my body is too much and why I had total immune system shut down. I feel like on one hand if he wants us to work he should follow me so I can pursue it. After all school was to help out our family in the long run. I followed him around, uprooting the family fir his goals. Why can't he for me? Then I realize he has an established job, and could never commute that far. And his particular specialty is hard tot find jobs for. 

I feel like if he could just show me that he appreciates me and cares without me resorting to begging for affection, I could be happy. I fear that will never happen. And I knew he wasn't romantic going into this marriage. What was I expecting?

I can't make sense out if my thoughts longer than two sentences. I wish it wasn't like this.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

You said that you have ADHD. Are you on meds? I ask because a friend of mine ended up divorced because, after 24 years of marriage, her H couldn’t handle her ADHD anymore. It drove him crazy that she could not finish things, such as cleaning, because she was constantly distracted. That is exactly what you described. My friend is on meds for ADHD now and, although it was too late for her marriage, her life has improved considerably. Might be worth talking to your doctor about.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I've tried medications, but adderal made me violent. Like kick started massive anxiety and although I was focused, if anyone got in the way of that focus, I would freak on them. Him included. 

Ritalin made me pass out cold. I was a zombie. Couldn't move .

They wanted me to try concerta but at 250 bucks a month, it is not doable. I have been discussing other medical issues with the doctor so the ADD has fallen to the wayside and it didn't make sense to be on meds when I wasn't in school.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Today's apartment hunt was...ugh. 

I showed up for a viewing of a place out of my budget, but everything is with my salary and bills. I was on the second floor, which I knew was a possibility, but the idea of not taking my piano just...ugh. He refuses to hold it for me until I find a better place or for just in case we get back together. I was a music major in college. The idea of being without my piano is about as devastating as losing my marriage at this point. The rooms are dark paneling and the idea of bringing my children into this dark and age weary home just had me envisioning the kids refusing to stay with me and hating it there. My son stepped in dog poo as soon as we walked up to the house. There is no laundry in site. i would have to drive across a busy highway to the laundry mat. Benefits are, one mile from work. One of the nation's top school districts. Sons' psychiatrists are 2 miles away. Full use of the attic, which is huge, but not legally allowed to be a room. And a private balcony. 

The second place was not much cheaper, but it is in the capital city about ten miles from my job, but five from school. Some of the roughest school districts in the state though. I'm not even considering this one.

The third one is in subsidized housing. Though, our county no longer has section 8 because we bankrupt it. However, these "apartments" are actually tiny little town houses, with 2 stories. It is a new development and on the outskirts on the city I work in. About 15 miles from school, 2 from work and 1 from the psychiatrists. Washer and dryer in each unit. It is 5 dollars cheaper per month plus gas and electric, which I'm told averages between 95 and 115 a month. The homes form a semi circle around the leasing office / community building and playground. The playground can be seen from almost any home. And it is clean. And nicely kept up. It does not look like subsidized housing at all. Honestly, it seems perfect. There is a dining room and living room, which, if I need to I can turn one into a bedroom for me. HOWEVER there is a waiting list. This is the big problem. H is talking to his sister about timeframe she expects him to make tonight. I will know more tonight if getting on a wait list is even an option. Part of me thinks, if we have to wait for this place to open up we can take that time to work on things. Another part of me knows I'm moving regardless.

He flip flops just as much as I do. The problem is neither of us want to work on it at the same time. We are both confused.

My dad wants me to go after him for money. I think if I go after more he will be strapped financially and it will be the kids that suffer when they are with him. He will have them at least 3 days a week. I told him he can have them more in the summer if he wants. I may want the free time by then anyway.

Well, that's what I have accomplished so far today...basically not much.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Not much? You’ve looked at three apartments, contemplating a life in each one. And you had at least one of your children with you. Having trekked around with children, it sounds like a fair amount to me!

The last place seems best, but 15 miles is a long way from school. Is there a school bus? Would you be able to take your piano?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Sorry, I wasn't being clear which school. The kids schools are close. Bus close, but within a few miles. MY school, aka college is 15 miles away from those places. Haha. Where we live now I commuted an hour to work and an hour to class. 1.5 hours on clinical days to get to the hospitals we were assigned. My job is a 20-30 minute drive from my college though and that's only because its city traffic. 

The last place, since it is a town house, has a first and second floor just for me and my family. So the piano could be brought. I would put it on the first floor, of course. I just don't know how long the wait list is. And they can't give a definitive, since it is dependent upon when people decide to move out.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

The biggest thing with the kids schooling is here there is an elementary and high school. They stay in elementary until 7th then to the small high school. This district is a smaller city district. Not state Capitol city, but it's probably got enough population to count as a city. There is elem. middle and high school. My daughter will be thrust into the middle of the school year at middle school with no orientation or prep. I think that will be difficult for her, even though I think the school is an excellent school.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Your Dad is supporting you in this?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Shocking huh? I called my mom today and she was all "your dad wants to talk to you" and I told her I didn't want to talk to him if I had to listen to him tell me to suck it up again. 

He kept pushing me to put the boys on disability. I don't even know their official diagnoses yet. And they are brilliant. Why would I want to stick them on SSI and ruin their chances of getting a job when they are older. I have a brother on disability. He is kept in destitute poverty lest he lost his benefits. Those benies pay for meds that cost 3k a month. He is not allowed to work more than 20 hours a week. Sure he gets food stamps, but the system is so jacked. If they'd let him keep his benefits if he made more money, he could theoretically get employment that would eventually pay for his meds. He could make a life for himself. But if he goes off his meds, he could die. So yay for SSI. I have disdain for how broken it is. 

My boys are smart enough to be able to push through and thrive with the proper intervention. They have their intelligence going for them, and I don't want them to have to worry about such things when they reach adulthood. 

So after that long speech I made to my dad, he was all, then take more money. But I can't. He will go bankrupt if I do and I simply don't hate him enough to do that.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> Shocking huh? I called my mom today and she was all "your dad wants to talk to you" and I told her I didn't want to talk to him if I had to listen to him tell me to suck it up again.
> 
> He kept pushing me to put the boys on disability. I don't even know their official diagnoses yet. And they are brilliant. Why would I want to stick them on SSI and ruin their chances of getting a job when they are older. I have a brother on disability. He is kept in destitute poverty lest he lost his benefits. Those benies pay for meds that cost 3k a month. He is not allowed to work more than 20 hours a week. Sure he gets food stamps, but the system is so jacked. If they'd let him keep his benefits if he made more money, he could theoretically get employment that would eventually pay for his meds. He could make a life for himself. But if he goes off his meds, he could die. So yay for SSI. I have disdain for how broken it is.
> 
> ...


But at least you are getting support!


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

True. Even if it is just emotional. It's just weird. They are known for buying furniture if they think your stuff looks too worn out. So I am just kind of shocked at the lack of monetary support. I'm not mad at them just...hmmm...out of context for them. Which kind of confirms for me that they are disappointed in me.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Financial support isn’t based on hating your H and wanting him to go bankrupt. Support for both you and the children is based on a formula that takes into account the wages of both parents. Child support comes off first. If there is enough left, according to the formula, you are entitled to spousal support.. Your H would not be put into bankruptcy. That would not enable him to support his children and that support is the main goal of the courts. Find out what you are entitled to and make sure you get it. This is not just for you. The goal should be to maintain, as nearly as possible, the children’s standard of living.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

It would be so much easier without all of our debt. 

Son number one finally got neuropsych testing done today. H had originally planned to go and somehow said he never knew about it. It has been an 8 month wait for this appointment. Not sure how he didn't know, but none the less went to work. So I had son one and son two with me. S9 was in testing for four hours.

S5 has something going on as well, we have been fighting to get a Dx for him too, but his age makes it difficult to obtain evaluations. he basically started to rage toward the end of it because he was tired of waiting, hungry and wanted to go home. Would have been easier with their dad there, but oh well. 

Son one has a very high IQ, compounded with a serious learning disability in writing, which explains a lot. I was also told he has dysgraphia. And she is not ready to pin point which one exactly, as she wants to look over his charts and past tests one more time and discuss with the psychiatrist, but it's something in the autism spectrum. I suspect I will be told the same about the younger one, and here I go doing it without their dad.

A little overwhelmed with it all and amazed at how well my little guy has compensated for his disabilities. I kind of fell in love with him all over again, if its possible for a mom to do that. 

I'm also nervous of when we break it to him now. How is the news going to affect him and how do I properly present this information to a child on the spectrum? 

Part of me believes the stress of the kids neurological problems has a lot to do with our demise. I hate feeling like that. But it felt like he was running away from this today. And it's odd, because he is the autism specialist at work.

Now I need to figure out how to get him medical assistance because that test was 2k. And figure out the rest of this low income housing development paperwork. I don't know if I put a monetary figure in the alimony/support section yet or not. We are still in the planning stages of this separation, and living in the same house paying the bills together.there is no support to be given right now. Once we go our separate ways though, he will be giving it. So I don't know if I count it now or not.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

I’m just guessing, but as you are applying for housing post-separation, I would think you need to put an amount in now. That is what they will base your rent on.

I’m glad you are close to a specific diagnosis for your older boy. As to how to discuss it with him, who did the testing? If it was a psychologist, ask her for advice. Or ask where you can get that advice. I came across a story online today that might be of some help. I didn’t bookmark it as it is too advanced for the children I was thinking of, but if I can find it again, I’ll post a link.

Believe me, I know how stress around children’s challenges can contribute to the end of a marriage! That is what almost did my marriage in. My H and I are back together, but I see the same issues with the families of my students. Children with disabilities can place an incredible strain on a marriage.

Perhaps your H is not ready to face your son’s diagnosis.

I loved your paragraph about falling in love with your son again!


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

He is amazing. His IQ is exceptionally high I. Almost every area, with spatial reasoning being almost genius level if not genius. However his delays are below average. They are in writing, which includes putting thoughts to paper. He also has dysgraphia. I've known something was off for a while. I avoided it because I didn't want him to be labeled. I finally consented to ADHD meds last year, and it's helped, but his ADHD is severe. They are torn between PDD NOS or Aspergers. If it is the latter he loses the ADhD diagnosis because it is actually a symptom of the Aspergers and fall under that category. But he is so midline for both she wants to take more time with his chart before definitely diagnosing him. But I think, with how extreme his learning disability is, his IQ in other areas has enabled him to compensate so well, the school argues with me that he needs help. And honestly he usually gets Bs a few Cs, the occasional A and D. But for what he is dealing with and how extreme the writing disorder is on top of most class and homework is written...well, he is simply amazing to get the grades that he does.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Its always amazing to me how well some kids cope despite major challenges.

Find out if he can have access a to voice-to-text program at school. That way he can speak hi thoughts and the program translates them into print. This can be such a huge help for kids with dysgraphia.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I heard about that today, I'm just concerned that it will cause him to not want to try to write. I'm not sure how I feel about that.

Tomorrow son 2 goes to an IU pre k for the 2nd and 3rd evaluation. They want to see how he interacts with other kids and an OT evaluation. 

I'm kind of feeling glad mono forced me to sit out this semester. This doctor appointment schedule, on top of house hunting would be impossible if I were in class. Fri I have a mono follow up and find out if I'm allowed back at work that night. I have had 2-3 doctor appointments a week since December because of how sick the kids and I were.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

My second son had his IU evaluation today and they managed to induce a tantrum, which is what was needed to see what I am talking about. Listening to it was difficult. I am overwhelmed with these boys. I love them with a fierce passion, that wil kill anyone that intends to harm them, but I am overwhelmed. I've been to so many doctor appointments this past month with the children. And these last two were so intense. Why am I doing this alone? I know his job is hard, and busy, but their father should be at these evaluations. I don't really want to answer his texts when he texts about them.

I started crying after the eval today. I was just shaky with having to work him through the tantrum and calm him down off of an empty stomach (I barely eat anymore with the mono induced gastritis, so my glucose levels get kind of low). I kept thinking, if things were ok between their dad and me he would be here helping me and I would not be shaking with hypoglycemia trying to work this little boy down off his tantrum. And so I started crying, right in front of them. I hate crying, and here I am crying in front of strangers.

I am just down today. It all feels insurmountable right now, and I feel like kids like my boys need both parents in order to get through this thing called life.

I contemplated calling the doctor for an anti depressant today for the first time since my illness started or bomb dropping. Not sure it will help me think straight and focus enough to do what needs done for the boys though.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Got home at 5:00 pm, and s9 (newly diagnosed spectrum disorder) obviously hadn't started his homework. He was impossible to motivate and took 5 hours to write definitions to 15 words. I normally don't start dinner until homework is done so it doesn't get lost in the shuffle, but barring a soda I had consumed nothing today, so I had to start dinner. H wasn't home from work yet. He texted saying he was going to the bar with work friends. 

Last we had communicated son5 was at his eval tantruming. He hadn't even contacted me after the eval to find out what happened. I was angry to say the least. It took another hour for s9 to review his spelling words. The kids asked why they never see daddy anymore. He's is always gone they said. We haven't told them we are separating, and I didn't know what to say. I just said, you can ask daddy if it bothers you.

He did finally call on the way home and I told him I was having a rough night with the children. He was all "ill take over when I get home" to which I replied "it's fine I already did it all and I'm going to have to do this by myself anyway soon, whatever." It's fine was not said in an it's fine tone of voice though. He finally got home and I explained the day. He said wow you really did have a rough day. To which I replied, I get THIS is not working with us, but we have two sons with special needs and I understand I'm doing most of this alone, but you are their dad and there are some appointments that are major and you need to prioritize them. He said o.k. Offered to give the boys their baths and put them to bed. I haven't had the stomach to speak to him since. 

I don't understand how you can be the autism specialist at work and not bother showing up to your own child's evaluation. 

And I'm just terrified of caring for these precious boys alone. And their awesome sister who's world is getting ready to implode. It's just not fair to them and tonight it is hard to hold the tears back. 

I still haven't fund an apartment. I just don't know what to do at this point. I keep looking, to no avail. Things are just too expensive even with his financial support.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I'm coming back to this thread, so my posts are all together. I still haven't found a place to live. I'm waiting on this one place to tell me if I qualify for the wait list, and how long it is. It is low income housing. 

Is it strange that I just wish I had a place to go before valentines day? We live in the same house still. I don't even know how to handle this holiday. Either be together or be separate, but this limbo thing is confusing. Do I buy a gift for him? Do I ignore it? He told me he felt like I didn't love him for the past ten years. I think he's just being an idiot, because ten years and since then I have done MAJOR things I didn't want to do, but because it was for him, I did it. I call bull **** on that one.

I even told him the other day over the jeep, that I didn't care about what he bought, but if he defaults on his credit, he better make sure the children are ok. But that this was one hell of a midlife crisis and he was going to ruin a lot at the rate he was going.

He said "maybe you're right" but still does not want to discuss his role in this mess. It is like all other arguments and my fault. I don't clean well enough. I don't let him know I love him (in spite of the fact that I have written multiple letters this year and bought him gifts for no reason at all but to say hi, I think you're great). He wants to have dinner on the table when he gets home, blah blah blah. 

I want to get through homework with our autistic son before 9:00 but you don't see me blaming him for that. Someone has to help the kid. Dinner gets pushed off often because of it. He does not do homework, and forgets often I've I have to go to work before they get done.

I wonder if we will be able to remain cordial after all of this. I just find myself angry with him most days for putting our family through this. And for never taking the initiative to actually treat me like the love of his life.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

About the homework. No 9-year old should be spending that much time on homework, but especially one with special needs. He doesn’t need the stress and neither do you. Talk to his teacher. If your son is turning up each day with the work done, the teacher has no idea that it is taking him that long to do it. Explain how long it is taking him. If he/she doesn’t right away agree to adjust things, let him know that spending this much time on schoolwork is inappropriate, especially given your son’s needs and clearly state that you want it changed. If you still don’t get anywhere, talk to the principal. This is not right. It must be causing your son major anxiety and if you continue to drag him through it, it will damage your relationship with him. 

Look into having your son officially identified within the school system. He is entitled to an Individual Education Plan and the issue of homework can be addressed it it, ensure that this does not happen again as he moves through the grades.

Now, as to crying in front of the assessors for your other son....perfectly normal. And it is a good thing that they see the stress that you are under with your boy. They may be able to get some help for you.

Don’t buy your H a Valentine’s gift. He doesn’t deserve it.

Hang in there.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

We have been pushing for an IEP for 4 years, but the official diagnosis will help us push harder. I have been in contact with his teacher and we are working together. He is very brilliant, but the ADHD aspect of his diagnosis and the writing disability causes major distraction. OT is supposed to be working on the writing to alleviate that stress. The homework is not a lot. He took 5 hours one day to write 15 vocabulary definitions. It took him an hour to focus long enough to write one. So homework time is constant redirecting, and if I stop for something like dinner, he won't get done.

All of the interventions have been recent though, because he only qualified for a 504 before and the school has refused to act. The special Ed director still rolled his eyes when I told him his Dx. 

His doctor wants him in the school district where I work. I'm trying to find housing there. The problem is, that we have a major trauma center, med school and rehab hospital there. It's Doctorville and expensive to live there. 

The low income housing development is there though, so cross your fingers.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

The homework may not be much, but if it is taking him that long to do it, it is too much. If he cannot concentrate and only gets it done because you are prodding him on for that long, something has to give. Writing 15 vocabulary definitions is an awful lot for someone with a writing disability. The object of the exercise is to learn the meanings of the words. The act of writing is not the object. Could he not dictate them to you? Or tape them and hand the tape in?

To comment on your earlier concern that text-to-print software might cause him not to want to write, it is important to look at why he is writing. Except for actual handwriting lessons, we write to relay information or to express ideas. If the act of writing is difficult, who would want to write? The software frees the student from the difficult physical act of writing and allows him to give information and express his ideas. Generally, students using the software produce more, not less.

If the school refuses to act on your son’s diagnosis, go to the superintendent, or whatever the head of the school district is called there. You will need to be your son’s advocate as he moves through school.

Hopefully you will get into the housing in the area where you work. I had a special ed teacher roll his eyes when he was given my son’s diagnosis of learning disabilities and ADHD. He even went so far as to say that my son’s difficulties were my fault because I did part-time child care! What a jerk! I could have hit the man. In the end I refused to have him work with my son. Fortunately, he retired that year.

Good luck. Hope you find out about the housing soon.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Thanks. I am going to give this some serious thought. 

In other news, I got a letter, stating I qualify for the wait list. So now we just have to hope a unit opens up quickly. It's one step closer to getting out of here.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

That’s great news! Any idea how long the wait is?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

No. I meant to call today, but after my weekend at work, I just pass out cold. I woke up to S5 in a rage so, I've been in deal with kid mode. 

FBI called today about the online preditor. They want to speak to my daughter. I told them yes. She is pissed off, and has locked herself in her room. Oye. Going to have to figure out how to convince her it will be o.k.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

FBI meeting today. D refused to talk other than to scream "I'm terrified! They are strangers!". I judge a vocal competition in February every year and the judges had a meeting with the contestants that I ended up missing for the FBI meeting. We still weren't done, but the competition was going to start and I finally had to excuse myself. I hated to do it. They want the girls to go to speak with a special victims investigator. She is freaking out. STBX said she was punching walls and screaming. She does NOT want to talk to anyone else about this. The other girls involved have agreed. I feel like her world is going to explode when we tell her that dad and mom Are separating. Can I really push this in her too? 

The competition went well tonight. It put me in a good mood. I actually wanted to just sit and chat with STBX tonight. I told him I wished we could each go to therapy and work on our individual disorders. That maybe all of this is OCD and ADD are just incomparable disorders. He said "if only it were that easy". I replied with "but finding a therapist is easy". He just mumbled "I guess". 

Damn it. I love the guy. Contrary to his accusations. I love him and don't want to lose him, but then I think, I can't continue to live like this either. I know he makes me feel horrible about myself. And I know he won't get help. But he has been my best friend for 18 years, and now he isn't. 

Sigh.

Just one of those confusing days. Why can't my emotions be more consistent?


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

What would happen if you found a therapist and invited him to go with you?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I don't know. 

Today I'm not entirely hating him but setting up taxes for next year with the accountant was rough. I think, though, until he can come to grips with his OCD, and I my ADD we will forever be at odds. I also know I will still feel unloved if he doesn't learn to be even slightly romantic. His idea of love is financially taking care of us...but that means we never see him, and it's just...ugh. He is not willing to move with us anyway. And there is no help for the boys where he is moving. So we are at an impasse. 

Today we both said maybe in six months. Regardless, I intend to figure out a way to get therapy. For me. If he does not, there will be no future for us. As much as I care and am afraid, I know it has to be done. Our children's well being depends on it.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Maybe in six months what?

I think you are making tough, but right decisions for you and your kids. Good for you for seeking help with your ADD. Hopefully he will wise up and do the same for his issues. But you can’t sit around waiting, for your kids’ sakes and for your own.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Maybe in six months we can reexamine our marriage. 

Thanks for the vote of confidence though. It helps.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Kids just asked what we got each other for v day. He got himself a night out to the bar without even consulting me to see if I had plans. Said after the competition was over if I wanted to go out with my friends I could. Not sure if I want to say that's or F off. 

I'm home with kids, while they ask if their friends can spend the night so their parents can go out. I have to work tomorrow night and cannot be up all night with giggling girls. It is hard enough with a little guy who wakes every hour due to bad dreams while daddy sleeps serenely in the other room. I had to tell them no. But how the heck do I answer that question right in front of her friend? We ha vent even told them yet, because I still can't find a place I can afford. 3.5 weeks since the announcement and I still can't find housing. This sucks.


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## Bullwinkle (Feb 4, 2013)

Wow, BF, V Day and he's out at the bar with his buds? WTF? 

I'd give anything to be home with my family. 

Hang tough, kid.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Yup. And that should read "thanks or F off" lol. Stupid autocorrect. 

He has since asking for a separation gone out every week. He seems to think the competition I judge every February is me going out with my friends because we discuss the competitors over drinks afterward to make sure things are in order for the next week. I get paid to do this. It is my job. And although I like my fellow judges, it is not hanging out at the bar.

I am either home with the kids or working. I am exhausted most of the time though. My energy levels are not fully back after mono so I would rather sleep right now lol. But no rest for the weary with a kiddo that never sleeps and tantrums all day long.

Today I don't care. I just want out. I have no desire to work on it today. Jebuz, I am bipolar with my emotions.


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## Bullwinkle (Feb 4, 2013)

I hear you. Just rest as best you can.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Mr. PDD sat on my iPad until abut 11:00 today after waking every hour until 6:30, so I did get some rest. He's all snugly under my covers with the iPad volume turned low. Such a sweetie when he isn't tantrumming. The only problem is, since his sister saw the movie Mama, she hasn't shut up about it and is now afraid to be anywhere alone in the house. (Face palm)


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## Bullwinkle (Feb 4, 2013)

Sounds like you're doing the best you can. I know, kids will just suck the like out of you, as much as you love them.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I'm doing ok I think. I don't like him in technology that much as he becomes dependent on it, then tantrums when he can't have it. I'm going to have to deal with breaking the dependence again, but he's going to need that coping mechanism as soon as we tell the kids so I'm not fighting it.

I find all the images of V day gifts on Facebook annoying though. Maybe I should have pulled out the credit card and bought myself some chocolate covered strawberries. Then I wouldn't be sitting here drooling even though I know my stomach will revolt if I eat them anyway lol.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

So husbeast came home and did paperwork, and S5 begged to cuddle in the couch with him. D12 had a friend ove and mom called telling her it was time to come home. He hadn't done any childcare all day, I was dressed for bed, but because he had laid down in the couch with S5 (who would have loved the walk), he refused to walk the girl home.

I came home from taking her home and let the kids stay up an hour before saying it was 2 hours past bedtime (no school tomorrow). They BEGGED him to lay down with them. BEGGED. He said no. That he was tired. I told them they could climb in my bed with me and they insisted they hadn't seen daddy all day. 

He still did not budge.

My heart breaks for them when he does this. We have always fought over who gets more sleep, but he has always lain down with the boys. Our youngest still does not fall asleep alone. I just don't understand this stuff.

He claims he is pulling back so that I have more control when we are finally separated? I claim it is confusing them and making them think he doesn't care about them. They don't know what is going on. How are they supposed to understand his actions?

So, here I sit, in bed with all three of them and a cat. They don't make beds big enough for this nonsense.


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## Bullwinkle (Feb 4, 2013)

God. Pretty crowded. How can he even think about abandoning his family?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Because he doesn't think he has?

I can't wait to find my own place. I keep hoping today is the day the low income housing development calls.

As scary as being alone is, I think I will be better off. His family has rallied around him, and they should. Mine keeps telling me to fight for my marriage...um...hmmm... Thought that was what I did all those years begging for MC. My parents are finally coming around, but no one lives in the same state as me, so it will be me and the kids. Terrifying when I think about it, but it has to hurt less than sharing a house with this indifference. 

He likes to bring up that this is mutual, because I agreed and am trying to make this amicable. But he has been bringing it up every argument for the past 6 months at least. Just because I stopped fighting it, does not really make it mutual. I just wanted to stop feeling like I was the cause for all our problems every argument. That I was special, and that I mattered.

I doubt I'll ever get involved again. But if I do, the list of expectations will be long.


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## Bullwinkle (Feb 4, 2013)

It just sounds really sad. 

No chance at reconciliation?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

It's been 3 weeks. I guess anything is possible, but not unless we each seek counseling for our individual issues, and each time I've brought it up he shrugs off the idea. Marriage counseling is no ,longer enou I realize that now. Regardless, I will get help for my issues. If nothing else it will help me be a better mother.


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## Bullwinkle (Feb 4, 2013)

BFGuru

All I can tell you is do absolutely everything you can to work things out, despite your anger and frustration.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

The ball is in his court. I cannot live like we were, and cannot follow him to BFN when my kids need help that is specifically available elsewhere. They are my priority, and have to be right now. He is welcome to join us, but won't. He has made that clear. He is making strange choices just to get away from us. 

Sometimes I think there is another woman, other times I think it is a midlife crisis. Either is selfish considering our kids and their needs, but neither can I control.

What I can control is no longer accepting all the. Blame for our difficulties. I cannot make him take responsibility for his end, but I can control if he has me in tears all night feeling like a failure as a wife and human. 

Last year I became convinced even the kids would be better off without me. I swore I'd never let him make me feel that way again. 

I was suicidal once before. He forced me to get help. He admitted the same feelings a few months ago and became angry when I suggested he go to the doctor. He does not want help. He is a therapist and thinks he has everything under control.

I can no longer live like that. I know that now. As tough as it is to hear him ask out, I know it is the opportunity I need to better myself. 

That is where I am today...in this moment. 

I may cry later asking why he doesn't care, but for now, I know this has to be done.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

As much as I find it hard to believe that this man works with children, I may understand some of his behavior. Our family life was a mess. One son into drugs, sucking us dry financially. A daughter who had no respect for her father. A job he hated. A wife who was distant and detaching due to all the stress around her. He left when he found someone else who was not part of our mess. The peace and quiet with her was his way of coping and trying to protect himself. We almost lost our marriage (we are back together now).

I see similarities in your situation. You have two kids who are very challenging. Raising special needs children has destroyed many marriages. Your husband has the skills to deal with them, but its hard to do when you’re emotionally invested. He may actually feel quite helpless.

I’m not excusing his behavior, and he may even be just a not-nice, self-centerd person. I’m just shining a different light on it. 

And so it all falls on you. 

I want to tell you that I think you are doing a good job. If you separate, once the peace and quiet grows old, he will examine what he has done. And find it is too late.


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## ReGroup (Dec 6, 2012)

Great Post Frost Flower.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

ReGroup said:


> Great Post Frost Flower.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Thanks, Regroup.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I think that is a lot of it Frost...y...can I call you that too, since now I crave Wendy's. 

I think it's compounded. OCD, me not a very good house cleaner (but never lazy, I can run circles around the hours he keeps at work and do it while taking care of the kids). His dad died in May of last year. It was hard on all of us, but even in his grief he lashed out horrifically on our daughter and I had to remind him that he couldn't do that to her. 

He was shooed from the room when his father passed. I was there counting breaths, his twin sisters and the hospice aide. He saw his sister shoo him and has forever stated she stole his last minute with his dad. He was already gone, but we were trying to focus and see if he would breathe again. Part of me wonders if he blames me as well. I and the aide were the only ones touching him at that last breath. He died in my hands, and I wonder if he resents it, though he will never admit it.

He works with autistic children all day. I used to do the same job (well, he is at a higher level than I was, but still a lot of face to face time with clientele). I quit it, knowing I could not put all my time and energy into other people's children and come home with enough energy to deal with my own kids. He chose to stay with the job, get his masters and climb in the company. I get he is exhausted of dealing with autism by the end of the day, it just doesn't make it easier.

He was a pastor for many years. I followed him, helping as I thought a good pastors wife would do. We eventually had one too many traumatic events (pastoral abuse is rampant among churches in that denomination, and the non denom church we finally took had pushed a former pastor to suicide, but we thought we could change it ha!). Neither of us believe in a higher power anymore, and he claims that is where the problem is. That we no longer have anything in common anymore. 

He is changing rapidly in front of my eyes. Not that it has ever been good. He has had violent tendencies and taken it out on furniture or walls, but never me or the kids. I sucked it up because I felt that was what a good Christian wife did. But he is changing. I used to beg for him to take me out places, to come hang out with me, my friends and their spouses. He refused. He started to do small things with his friends at work. I figured, he likes that activity, I should join. I went a few times, but he never really wanted me there. Now mister homebody, who rarely left the house is accusing me of the reason we never did anything. That I was boring and that I was agoraphobic.

It was a low ball. I had been agoraphobic about 8 years ago. A victim of sexual abuse and at a church with a known pedophile in it had me afraid to leave the house, lest my children get hurt. I sought out help. I went to counseling and now I work full time and go to School. I fight against staying home to this day, but with the right person watching my children I never felt uncomfortable going places with him, and always wanted to do such. I got help for it. He simply used it as an argument point.

His parents never seemed happy. He claims his mother pushed his father away and he didn't believe she loved his dad until he died. I keep explaining that his dad was an alcoholic. A mean drunk. Any woman would out a wall up. 

Perhaps he is afraid we will end up like them.

I don't know. I'm just tired of the fighting, and the hidden tears that come when I close the door. I am not a cryer, and yet he pushes me to tears. I do not let him see me cry though. Screwy maybe, but between growing up thinking my dad hit me to see me cry and seeing too many women use tears to manipulate...I do not feel he is safe to shed tears in front of. 

I don't hate him. I do not have to put up with his behavior though. 

I just wish he hadn't given me a freaking new wedding band for my birthday so I could still look married at clinical (not allowed to wear gemstones to the hospitals). If he felt I didn't care about him for the past ten years, what was the point of claiming me as your wife for my clinical rotation?


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

I hear the fatigue in your words. 

You are right. You don’t have to put up with his behavior. You are working on your issues as well as working to get help for your children. He has a lot of issues. Until he decides that he doesn’t want to live under their pressures anymore, he will not change. Its a shame that he may lose a family in the meantime. But that is his issue, not yours. Continue to do what is right for you and the children. Be proud of what you do and hold your head high. You are a good person and a good Mom.


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## Bullwinkle (Feb 4, 2013)

Hi, BF., just checking on you 

FrostFlower is right, you're doing a great job trying to hold it all together.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Bull winkle we can thank the almighty Zoloft for that...which coincidentally is a little blue pill haha.

I started taking it last week when S5 was tantrumming in the doctors office, right before I had to call 911 on him, well, I asked for the prescription then. I couldn't pick it up for a few days though. They said to start with half a pill and move up to a whole pill, but so far it is helping me stay sane without feeling like a zombie. I want to be able to feel. Just need to be able to think straight with the anxiety.

Still looking for apartments. So far this is the toughest part of the equation.


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## Bullwinkle (Feb 4, 2013)

Don't take this the wrong way but you're making me feel better about my life.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Haha. Bull winkle, there are a few threads around here that do that for me. Also work. I tend to work with spinal cord injuries, but after sending my son to the ER for a behavioral emergency, I was sent to Peds to work. It was probably the best thing for me as sick as it sounds. I was having a royal pity party and suddenly was thrust into a ward full of kids with brain tumors (some of which were inoperable) and premises on vents, one that almost starts seizing if you touch him and his heart rate jumped to almost 300 bpm. And I thought, yeah, this is rough what I'm going through, but it could be soooooo much worse. 

As sad as it sounds, there is always someone with a worse story. At least he never hit me. Ya know? At least I work with the most phenomenal coworkers ever. We are like family and I know they have my back...every last one of them. 

It could always be worse, and for that I am thankful.


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## Bullwinkle (Feb 4, 2013)

Hell, yes, there's always some poor schmuck around that's worse off. 

You'll get through this. You'll look back someday. You may not laugh but you'll realize how in fact you were able to gather the strength.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Why is he in my bed? I just got off work and want to seep. He hasn't slept in the same room since he asked for a separation. Get out of my bed.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

What happened?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I got home from work and was exhausted and came home to him still sleeping, in my bed. I wasn't leaving though. It just feels awkward sharing sleeping space with him. So laid on my side nearly off the edge and passed out cold. LOL. I woke up and he was gone, so I went back to sleep in comfort again. 

He can stay on the couch for all I'm concerned. This is my bed now. Muwahaha.


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## Bullwinkle (Feb 4, 2013)

BF

You showed great restraint. You could have poured Drano down his gullet while he was sleeping there.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Haha. No. I was just too tired to pick a fight, but I wasn't changing my clothes in front of him. Don't know why. He's seen me naked plenty of times, but I just don't feel comfortable anymore. Took my clothes to the bathroom, out the most dowdy PJs I could find on and climbed in bed. 12.5 hour work shifts overnight tend to do that to a girl. Speaking of which, time to pull out some more scrubs and head back to the hospital.


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## DumpedAgain (Feb 14, 2013)

Wow BF, in following your story (entertaining if it wasn't so sad)
I gotta say you guys picked a bad time to go through all this

Medical bills, debt compounding ,struggling to find a place
that will be good for your kids. You may think you are falling 
apart at times, but you are pretty strong. stronger than you think

I have just been introduced to the sad world of divorce. Yes my wife cleaned out the bank account, but I can get more. My biggest problem is just self pity, I wallow in it. I can get over it

If I had a looming divorce with all the pressure you are under I would go berserk


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Well, HE picked a good time. I have my berserk moments. Actually lashed out at some friends a couple weeks ago for daring feel awkward over me sharing my confusion. I was thinking...dude, you have no clue how intense life is so stfu. 

Oh well, they aren't in a place they can be supportive and I don't really talk much about the kids to them so they have no clue. 

Right now I'm just at...do what you gotta do. 

And my coworkers are awesome. Really. They are pulling me through this.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

And dumped, I would be lawyering up if he dared clean out the account. I think he knows that. He would lose everything for pulling a shxt faced move like that. 

I think I did tell you to get evidence of her cleaning out the account and go after her, in your thread. If not, I'm telling you now. Start new accounts that she cannot access. Get your assets separated from her ASAP.


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## Bullwinkle (Feb 4, 2013)

Ah, yes, the dowdy clothes, I am familiar with them. 

My wife would only get undressed in the pitch dark and then put on some nightgown thing that was like a horse blanket.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Exactly! Given he always complained when I bought PJs so...I guess that's what he gets (most of mine are hand me downs lol) but I'm not getting naked in front of him anymore. That was a husband privilege. He lost it when he wanted out.

And maybe when I get out, I will treat myself to some nice girlie sexy pjs. But, um...I might wait until summer, because I'm freaking freezing right now. Or maybe I will buy some nice silk ones lined in flannel to keep me warm but get the girl appeal on. 

I'm making plans here.

Haha.

Ok. I have to jet. The patients call, and I promised a quadriplegic a shower if I had to buy him a new collar for his neck to do so. (He is in a plastic collar to immobilize his neck but doctors don't seem to understand how nasty those get when worn form months on end) he hasn't had his hair washed since December. It is time for me to work some magic...at least for this guy. 

This one is cute...in a not lustful way. He's a year younger than my dad, and has no family here so last night every time I checked on him it was "you don't have to hurry. I kind of like the company". Poor guy. 

Most of my quads are like that though. Lying in bed staring at the ceiling tends to do that to you.


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## Bullwinkle (Feb 4, 2013)

See, this is what always happens. Husband sees the flannel nightgown or the giant PJs night after night. . Wife gets pissed off, starts losing weight, buys the sexy stuff. Husband thinks, WTF? 

Per your going to woark with the quads - god love you, BF. and once again, you've made me feel better about my own life.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

When we lived up north where the air was so dry, once a week I would slather myself in Vasoline, put on my old flannel nightgown and crawl into bed next to him. Always got a good night’s sleep on those nights!


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## Bullwinkle (Feb 4, 2013)

Wow, Vasoline and flannel. Doesn't get any better than that. 

And if your husband was like me, he was content to pass out drunk in a pair of stained boxers.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Bullwinkle said:


> Wow, Vasoline and flannel. Doesn't get any better than that.
> 
> And if your husband was like me, he was content to pass out drunk in a pair of stained boxers.


Ooooh, the mental imagery!


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## Bullwinkle (Feb 4, 2013)

I know. Sorry.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Bullwinkle said:


> I know. Sorry.


I will never again be able to read your posts without shuddering!


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## Bullwinkle (Feb 4, 2013)

Hey, FrostFlower, sorry. 

I know, I've been there, the guy in the boxers, lying on the duvet, skin so pasty white it's like the underbelly of a trout. 

What the hell is a Frost Flower anyways, is that some freezing cold Canadian thing?


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## Stella Moon (Nov 22, 2012)

Bullwinkle said:


> And if your husband was like me, he was content to pass out drunk in a pair of stained boxers.


I think I just threw up in my mouth a little :scratchhead:








:rofl:


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Bullwinkle said:


> Hey, FrostFlower, sorry.
> 
> I know, I've been there, the guy in the boxers, lying on the duvet, skin so pasty white it's like the underbelly of a trout.
> 
> What the hell is a Frost Flower anyways, is that some freezing cold Canadian thing?


And the mental image keeps getting better and better!

LOL!

A frostflower is a beautiful freezing cold Canadian thing! its the design that forms in frost on windows. We don’t see it nearly enough since the dawn of double-and triple-glazed windows, but when I was a kid..... There now I’ve given away my age. First the boxer thing, then the underbelly of a trout skin, now you’ve made me my youthful image.

Hope you’re proud of yourself, Bullwinkle!


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Bullwinkle said:


> Wow, Vasoline and flannel. Doesn't get any better than that.
> 
> And if your husband was like me, he was content to pass out drunk in a pair of stained boxers.


I'm liking you more all the time.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

See what happens when I stop supervising this thread? 

BTW, my dude with the shower has not stopped grinning and is afraid to sleep lest he stop feeling clean hahaha. I think I made his night.

I absolutely love this job. Lots of happy endings.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> See what happens when I stop supervising this thread?
> 
> BTW, my dude with the shower has not stopped grinning and is afraid to sleep lest he stop feeling clean hahaha. I think I made his night.
> 
> I absolutely love this job. Lots of happy endings.


What a great job you have. BFG! That’s how I feel when I see a student who’s been struggling finally get it.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Dear mister other spinal cord patient...getting mad at your girlfriend and attempting to storm out does not get you anywhere, but flat on your a$$ on the floor. Thank you for the incident report. I was going to go on break. 

I am trying to wrap my head around why you think you could walk out just because you were pissed. 

Some turd told us to have a quiet night. I may beat that person now.


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## Stella Moon (Nov 22, 2012)

Wow...bummer...all the way around...


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## DumpedAgain (Feb 14, 2013)

BFGuru said:


> And dumped, I would be lawyering up if he dared clean out the account. I think he knows that. He would lose everything for pulling a shxt faced move like that.
> 
> I think I did tell you to get evidence of her cleaning out the account and go after her, in your thread. If not, I'm telling you now. Start new accounts that she cannot access. Get your assets separated from her ASAP.


I have locked down the finances, doesn't really matter at this 
point, she took $61k out of checking and savings, that should
get her by for awhile, she is a big spender though, probably won't
last all that long

Last night she left, took a couple of bottles of wine, went to her
toxic manhating (recently divorce) friend, probably for a strategy session. It is always worse when she gets home, renewed hatred


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Oh yeah. I have to fight the man hating after talking with some of my friends. I try to avoid those friends so I can keep a clear head.


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## DumpedAgain (Feb 14, 2013)

I have a friend, he went through a bad divorce and is bitter
He is giving me crazy advice on how to be nasty, how to hide
money etc

He's crazy, a lot of that is illegal

I am new to this, and as much as I dread divorce, it is reality

What I have learned is that there is a predictable ending in 
Divorce, If we are civil about it, it can go relatively easy

Or.. we can spend 10's of thousands of dollars and still end up
in the predictable ending


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## Bullwinkle (Feb 4, 2013)

I agree about civility but the problem is that often one of the people involved acts so irresponsibly or is so mean-spirited that it poisons the well.

I am so angry at my WS that I can honestly tell you that u would gladly spend every cent I have, end up living in my car, whatever, solely for the sheer vindictiveness of it.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Oh I feel that way a lot Bullwinkle, but if I don't keep it in check, my kids will suffer for it.he is checking out on them too often anymore. If I don't stay clear headed for them, who will? 

Though I do somedays wish I could kick him in the testicles. 

Everyone at work yesterday, when I told them how things were kept asking me"are you sure there isn't another woman"? 

No I'm not sure, but I don't know how to prove it without spending money I don't have.i can't get ahold if his cell phone, I've managed to get into his email and Facebook accounts in his tablet, but he's changed all his passwords so I can't access them on the laptop which is where I can get to archived messages. 

And would it change anything anyway? 

Ugh. I dunno.


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## DumpedAgain (Feb 14, 2013)

Bullwinkle

I would love to make her suffer, I really really do
but, I would probably suffer just as much.

If D is inevitable, I just want to get it over with


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Frostflower said:


> And the mental image keeps getting better and better!
> 
> LOL!
> 
> ...


Having your exact age in your profile was a subtle clue too


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Wazza said:


> Having your exact age in your profile was a subtle clue too


I don’t think I like you anymore, Smarty-Pants Wazza!


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## Bullwinkle (Feb 4, 2013)

I admire your restraint, BF. 

Right now I'm going on pure rage. People keep telling me, let it go, move on, she's phsycho. But I just can't. 

I would never do anything to hurt my relationship with my daughter so that figures into all of it. 

But I don't lie awake nights thinking of taking a language class or starting yoga, I dream about ways to make WS's life a living hell.


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## Bullwinkle (Feb 4, 2013)

FrostFlower 

Thanks for the tutorial on windows and frost. Yes, I remember them too. 

When I was little, we used to get into my parents' liquor cabinet and guzzle some awful vodka and then breathe on the frozen windoW glass. Made beautiful images, I think once I saw the Virgin Mary in ice. 

My mother is Canadian and had me on skates when I just turned two. One of the best things she ever did for me.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I sleep and miss good fun. Working nights sucks for my social life. LOL. Last night was rough enough for me to stand in the hallway and go people, I come here to get away from stress, stop your shenanigans". I don't know why my coworkers laughed at me lol. 

Tonight my nurse and I are refusing that set on the grounds of sanity. Hahaha.


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## Stella Moon (Nov 22, 2012)

I work 12hr night shifts too...been doing it for 25+ years...do it by choice...but...in may I've chosen a rotating team...3wks days...then nights ...something like that...

so i can possibly add a second job... I dunno how well I will do on a day shift...lol...If I don't like it I can pretty much be assured I will be able to find someone to switch with me to get on straight nights again...but I'm going to give it a shot... I need a change...

we will see...


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I prefer working nights, especially with the kiddos. Maybe I'll change when they are all in school full time, but this place gets crazy when they are all awake haha.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

So tonight, I pulled out dinner, but figured it was going to be a quick fix and would wait until he got home to start it. I was pulling a splinter from D12 foot when he arrived and he offered to make dinner. He then sat in the couch with all if them and is offering to lay down with them, like old times. 

Should this move me more? I find it merely confuses me. Like be a nice guy or be a d!ck. I don't like this combination. Yes, I am crazy. I know.

I still want out. I still avoid conversations with him. I still am looking for an apartment.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

BFGuru said:


> So tonight, I pulled out dinner, but figured it was going to be a quick fix and would wait until he got home to start it. I was pulling a splinter from D12 foot when he arrived and he offered to make dinner. He then sat in the couch with all if them and is offering to lay down with them, like old times.
> 
> Should this move me more? I find it merely confuses me. Like be a nice guy or be a d!ck. I don't like this combination. Yes, I am crazy. I know.
> 
> I still want out. I still avoid conversations with him. I still am looking for an apartment.


Stay at 50,000 feet and observe.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I keep seeing this phrase about 50,000 feet and don't understand what it means. I feel so totally stupid to all of this. After all, who gets married at 20 years old thinking they will need to know how to go through a separation 16 years later?


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

BFGuru said:


> I keep seeing this phrase about 50,000 feet and don't understand what it means. I feel so totally stupid to all of this. After all, who gets married at 20 years old thinking they will need to know how to go through a separation 16 years later?


Thanks for asking.

50,000 feet means drain your emotion from your observations and observe like you are meeting him for the first time.

What would you think of someone who talks this way to you?

What would you think of someone who behaves this way?

Would you want to date them?

Would you even want to know them?


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## ReGroup (Dec 6, 2012)

Then you'll see that person for who they really are.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Hmm. That's kind of hard when they send out mixed signals isn't it?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

So, he left his laptop at home and of course I snooped. I didn't find any concrete evidence of an affair, but did find strong support that he is looking for a lawyer.

How the heck am I going to afford a lawyer? I was out of work for over a month. I have to come up with a security deposit for this apartment I'm looking for and the boys are starting an expensive diet which I can't afford. 

I decided to look online for lawyers today and became VERY disillusioned. 

Now I'm afraid he is going to go after my kids and try and take everything from me. I've been thinking rationally until now...and ugh...bring in the terror.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Well, I wish I never called the housing corporation today. They said there were 5 people in front of me and the wait was probably 6 months. I'm back to no where to go...again.


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## Bullwinkle (Feb 4, 2013)

Thanks too bad about the housing wait, BF.

I've lost the bubble on what happened - tell us again why you can't just stay in the house you're in....


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

It is an hour from my job and costs 2k a month to heat in the winter. I bring home 1k a month, not counting whatever support he will give, but he only makes 2500 a month. We can do it together. Neither of us can afford it apart. Compound that with there are no services for my boys here. I need to get where they can get help. The doctor wants us in a specific school district. My job is also close to the city, which I don't want my kids in. The schools are brutal there, so I'm stuck looking in a very expensive area, because we have a med school and major trauma center and rehab hospital there.


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## Bullwinkle (Feb 4, 2013)

Wow. Got it.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Just overwhelmed and angry now. Not that I even want to be with him anymore, but how dare he put this stress on us. All other places I've looked at today start at over 1k a month plus utilities, except one place, which has no washer/dryer facilities at the location at all. I cannot be driving across town with three kids to wash clothes. 

Lawyers want over 100 dollars just for a consult and I don't even have all the answers to the questions they ask. I don't know all our debt. I know it is a lot. He has handled all of that, and even though I have offered to learn, he has only sat down with me once or twice to show me anything, then determines he might as well handle it himself. I do not even know exactly how much he makes each month officially. 

I'm just so frustrated with this process. It feels like I will forever be stuck here. I can't stand it. I want out. I want to be able to breathe. To not have to deal with his mood swings or knowing he wants out. I want my boys to have the help they need. I want my daughter in therapy. And none of that can be done without a place to live closer to my job and their doctor. 

F it all.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

BFGuru said:


> Hmm. That's kind of hard when they send out mixed signals isn't it?


Are they really mixed?

Or are they consistent and you are intent on grabbing crumbs of love and building a fairy tale out of it?

Be honest.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

I’m so sorry about the housing, BFG.

Can I ask what diet the boys will be on?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Conrad said:


> Are they really mixed?
> 
> Or are they consistent and you are intent on grabbing crumbs of love and building a fairy tale out of it?
> 
> Be honest.


Good question. 

Hmmm. I think it's more, SHOULD I respond with feeling like it is love and fairy tales, when I don't feel that way? More like...should I want to work on it just because he is being nice right now? And I can't bring myself to want to right now.

It's more my internal conflict of "what is appropriate in this case?"

That and 16 years is just hard to walk away from even if it was crappy. It's familiar. But that can't be a reason to stay.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Frostflower said:


> I’m so sorry about the housing, BFG.
> 
> Can I ask what diet the boys will be on?


Gluten and casein free. It may not work and I'm prepared for that, with my youngest sons's rages, but I have to give him a shot at not using antipsychotics. His brain is still developing and I don't want to hinder that if at all possible.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> Gluten and casein free. It may not work and I'm prepared for that, with my youngest sons's rages, but I have to give him a shot at not using antipsychotics. His brain is still developing and I don't want to hinder that if at all possible.


Good luck. Its a hard diet to follow.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I know. It would be easier if I had access to a dietician. I had to work with multiple food allergies when my older son was little, though. I'm hoping I can key into that for the know how to do it. I was able to work with a nutritionist then. I don't have the money this time though.

His allergies were milk, soy, peanuts, tree nuts, chicken, pork, seafood and annatto. Luckily he has outgrown all but seafood and peanuts. But I managed quite well with him. I just can't get STBX to stop buying wheat products...which is a pretty easy one to tell.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> I know. It would be easier if I had access to a dietician. I had to work with multiple food allergies when my older son was little, though. I'm hoping I can key into that for the know how to do it. I was able to work with a nutritionist then. I don't have the money this time though.
> 
> His allergies were milk, soy, peanuts, tree nuts, chicken, pork, seafood and annatto. Luckily he has outgrown all but seafood and peanuts. But I managed quite well with him. I just can't get STBX to stop buying wheat products...which is a pretty easy one to tell.


The gluten-free stuff is so expensive. My Mum is celiac, so I’ve seen the bills!

What is annatto?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Annatto is a seed I think? In any case, it is that ingredient that turns cheese orange or gives French vanilla that yellow tint. It is in a lot of cheese sauces.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Told him last night about the apartment issues. He got upset sayin g it was going to ruin things with his sisters rental if I had to wait six months. I said, well maybe we have to consider more child support. He got quiet, which made me mad. I told him "look, I'm not living extravagantly, I'm looking at 2 bedroom apartments and am willing to give up every personal comfort to make sure these kids are ok. I can not help that this is the status of housing, but I am NOT moving my boys to the middle of nowhere, where they cannot get the help they need. I am not after your money, but I am out to make sure these kids are o.k." He was all...I know. But said nothing more until left for the competition I judge. 

Sent a text today to me saying we need to discuss options tonight.

Ya think?

However, not in a mood to try marriage counseling. He needs a sh!t ton of personal counseling before I would even consider it. 

Not sure how this conversation is going to go.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Ok, just found a lawyer that does a 30 minute free consult. What do I need to make the most of this? He will be calling me back soon, to discuss, and set up the appointment.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

BFGuru said:


> Told him last night about the apartment issues. He got upset sayin g it was going to ruin things with his sisters rental if I had to wait six months. I said, well maybe we have to consider more child support. He got quiet, which made me mad. I told him "look, I'm not living extravagantly, I'm looking at 2 bedroom apartments and am willing to give up every personal comfort to make sure these kids are ok. I can not help that this is the status of housing, but I am NOT moving my boys to the middle of nowhere, where they cannot get the help they need. I am not after your money, but I am out to make sure these kids are o.k." He was all...I know. But said nothing more until left for the competition I judge.
> 
> Sent a text today to me saying we need to discuss options tonight.
> 
> ...


Just go to 50,000 feet and tell us what you see.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Thanks Conrad. I just did a child support calculator (not counting any alimony because I'm still trying to take the high road for some dumb reason) and if I calculated bills properly, he would owe a little over 1k a month as opposed to 700.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> Ok, just found a lawyer that does a 30 minute free consult. What do I need to make the most of this? He will be calling me back soon, to discuss, and set up the appointment.


Get a total cost if you proceed. Seen another poster bitten by that.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

BFGuru said:


> Thanks Conrad. I just did a child support calculator (not counting any alimony because I'm still trying to take the high road for some dumb reason) and if I calculated bills properly, he would owe a little over 1k a month as opposed to 700.


How long have you been married?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Wazza, that will be my first question. Right now I'm seeing 100-170 consult fees plus 900-5500 retainer fees plus 150ish. Per hour. It seems like I absolutely cannot afford to hire at costs like that. Will see what this guy has to say.

Conrad, 16.5 years.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> Wazza, that will be my first question. Right now I'm seeing 100-170 consult fees plus 900-5500 retainer fees plus 150ish. Per hour. It seems like I absolutely cannot afford to hire at costs like that. Will see what this guy has to say.
> 
> Conrad, 16.5 years.


This is the thread that triggered the comment, in case it gives you more ideas.

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/going-through-divorce-separation/53773-feeling-like-hostage.html


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

BFGuru said:


> Wazza, that will be my first question. Right now I'm seeing 100-170 consult fees plus 900-5500 retainer fees plus 150ish. Per hour. It seems like I absolutely cannot afford to hire at costs like that. Will see what this guy has to say.
> 
> Conrad, 16.5 years.


At 16.5 years - with 2 dependent children, your to get between 35-40% of his take home pay.

If you live in a state with lifetime alimony, he "really" should want to avoid court with you.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

We have three children, 2 of which have an autism spectrum disorder. 

I don't know if we have lifetime alimony or not here. I guess I should look that up. I did find out we are a no fault state.

I don't even care about alimony. I just want to make sure the kids are taken care of.

Wazza, that post scares me. Most of my debt is mine, and I have made some foolish choices but some is his that I will have to cover. My van is in his name. It makes no sense to have him pay mine and his car loan when he does not drive it.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Ok, just looked it up. We are not officially a lifetime alimony state, and those are rewarded very rarely. 

However, if there has been infidelity, it weighs heavily in favor of the wronged spouse. 

Wish I could find evidence one way or another to these nagging suspicions that keep creeping up.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

1st question for attorney:

"Are we in a lifetime alimony state?"

If you are, you could easily be looking at (combined alimony and child support north of $2500/month.

Child support is also tax free.

Alimony is not.





BFGuru said:


> We have three children, 2 of which have an autism spectrum disorder.
> 
> I don't know if we have lifetime alimony or not here. I guess I should look that up. I did find out we are a no fault state.
> 
> ...


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Keep in mind - just the threat of alimony will make him more than reasonable on all issues.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I'm not playing that card yet. I'm holding it, still playing nice. "I just want child support" is all I keep telling him. It may come to it that I need more to support these kids, but not sure how that will affect their care when they are with him three days a week.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

BFGuru said:


> I'm not playing that card yet. I'm holding it, still playing nice. "I just want child support" is all I keep telling him. It may come to it that I need more to support these kids, but not sure how that will affect their care when they are with him three days a week.


The 35-40% calculation is based on the "typical" visit schedule of every other weekend and one rotating weeknight.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Well, we will be sharing pretty evenly. I will have them during the week while he works and he will have them very weekend when I work.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

BFGuru said:


> Well, we will be sharing pretty evenly. I will have them during the week while he works and he will have them very weekend when I work.


Believe it or not, it still sounds like you could get more than 2 grand a month.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Hmmm. I guess we will see what this lawyer has to say.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Just remember that lawyers get business when yiu pay them to fight. They have an incentive to convince you that you are being wronged and legal action is necessary. Keep a cool head. Do not be thougtlessly blinded by dollar signs.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I am a soon to be single mom making 1k a month...I am not going to do anything unless it is frugally. If this guy can tell me what I am entitled, I can draft something I feel is fair and tell him to meet me at the notary.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Depending on how much is left of his paycheck after child support is taken off, you may be entitled to alimony. I understand that the children are your first concern, but don’t give up alimony just to be ‘fair’. If you are entitled to it, it is fair. The court will not leave your husband destitute. Take it and use it to ensure that the kids’s standard of living doesn’t drop any more than it has to. They will have enough to deal with. And you will have moving expenses. If you really don’t need it, put it away for the kids’ education. 

I’m not suggesting you do this out of vindictiveness. Sadly, in too many cases, it is the women and the kids whose lifestyle drops the most, often to almost dire straits.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Frostflower said:


> Depending on how much is left of his paycheck after child support is taken off, you may be entitled to alimony. I understand that the children are your first concern, but don’t give up alimony just to be ‘fair’. If you are entitled to it, it is fair. The court will not leave your husband destitute. Take it and use it to ensure that the kids’s standard of living doesn’t drop any more than it has to. They will have enough to deal with. And you will have moving expenses. If you really don’t need it, put it away for the kids’ education.
> 
> I’m not suggesting you do this out of vindictiveness. Sadly, in too many cases, it is the women and the kids whose lifestyle drops the most, often to almost dire straits.


BF,

What is the delta between what you make and what he makes?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

We talked some tonight, and I was actually slightly mistaken in my take home. I've been surviving off of PTO and extended illness day which do not account for my shift differential working weekend nights.

I net 1200
He nets 3000

We have accumulated quite a bit of debt, me especially with school, and some stupid purchases I made while in a hurry (a lot of stops at Mc Donald's for breakfast at 5:00 a.m. Which I know is stupid). Plus books, supplies and childcare costs once my student loans ran out which runs into 3k. His 40th birthday present I financed a motorcycle because he has begged for one for the past 16 years. It was only 3500, and comes right out of my bank account automatically.

I have a 700 medical bill, a 500 medical bill, and my daughter has a 300 medical bill. I am not sure what their dental bills are and am looking at having to out the stops on her braces which we have already paid for the initial consult on.

There is a joint 7k credit card we have from when he lost his job and we were paying rent and trying to short sale our house back where we used to live before he took that stupid job. His car and my van are in his name, at 15k and 8k (mine is the smaller loan). 

I still need to figure out car insurance and life insurance payments not to mention utilities. I am keeping Internet for school, but ditching cable.

It's the debt that is killing both of us.

I kind of detached most of the conversation as he tried to show me apartments I should be able to afford, but he did not pay attention to the monthly fees and the utilities involved. 

He also asked "so is there nothing we can do to fix this?" And I had to resist the urge to punch him. I just sat there silent and let him mull his question over for a while until he pestered me for what I was thinking. I told him then that his question irritated me because I should be asking that, but I've told him what needs done for both of us. I've not requested anything I wouldn't do myself, and that he is simply not interested, so what does that mean, in answer to his question?

He got mad and said it was always about me moving to (insert place I'm trying to move). Because I'd always wanted to go there. I sat there silent before answering and finally responded with, remember, YOU asked for this. At which point he snapped "but you were looking at apartments that night you told me"... Which is true that I was looking but I never told him such. I told him I would start looking but let him live in his delusion. I don't care. I responded to his accusation with the fact that I did not start looking for apartments until he had repeatedly asked for a separation. To which he denied all but one. I said it has been almost every argument for at least the last six months.

He refused to look at a child support calculator, which indicated about 1220 a month. I held it out to show him that I was not asking for that much. He claimed it was for parents who only saw their kid every other week so it didn't speak for us. I explained I would be buying all their food as I can't trust him to stick with the diet. That I would still be paying all their copays (even though he is handling braces for my daughter) because when they are sick I won't be able to wait on him to get there, and that once a month I pay 50 dollars just for the boys psych check ups. Add D12 and I will be paying 75. I pulled all of this out to explain that custody was not 50/50. 

He asked "what if they don't want to go with you"

I got quiet.

Real quiet. Because I realized he is contemplating taking me for custody. I had to think before I responded.

I finally spoke and told him that we would have to be unified. It is for their best interest. And that he can't afford child support. How is he going to afford daycare? He works all week. 

He then was hemming and hawing about moving the kids from their school. WTF you are moving 40 minutes away. They are changing schools regardless. At least they can get the help they need in this district. He started complaining that D is going to get depressed at the school districts I am looking at because we can't afford name brands. (What?) since the kids here are already picking on her. I told him I had already considered giving her the option of finishing this year in a charter cyber school and starting the new year fresh. 

His body language was so tense. He looked like he was ready to punch something the entire conversation and although he has never hit me, there is something about this particular facial expression that has always scared me. Stupid I know. But it made me anxious. He started to raise his voice, and I had to tell him there was no reason for him to get mean about things. It is obvious I am not trying to swindle him.

The end of the conversation ended with me settling for 800 a month and distributing debt a little more evenly. He is planning on paying off his motorcycle with his tax return. He was supposed to make a down payment on D braces. I am tempted to sell the damn thing. I hold the title. 

He refused to type anything up with me. I feel like I shouldn't waste my time looking at this 875/mos apartment tomorrow. I can't get him to commit to a dollar amount anyway. 

I am taking part of my paycheck this week and buying a VAR. I'm still not convinced he is chaste. I cannot prove it though.


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## ReGroup (Dec 6, 2012)

This is pissing me off.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Please, for the kids’ sakes if not yours, speak to a lawyer before agreeing to/signing anything. The debts will eventually be paid off, he will get increases in salary, but the child support will remain the same. $800 is not much for three children. I was receiving over $700 for one 19-year old child and our combined salaries do not equal a not a huge amount.

Please seek legal advice.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I am going to frost. I am afraid of coming off looking like a b!7ch and him slandering me to the kids or worse yet going for full custody. He is the autism specialist as disconnected as he is and that could be seen as beneficial for the boys.


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## ReGroup (Dec 6, 2012)

"Going for full custody" doesn't mean he's going to get it.

I pay what you agreed to get - only I have 1 child.

Lawyer up! Its his duty to pay a healthier amount. 3 kids? This guy is a piece of work.

I'm sorry - I know he's your husband.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Meh. Regroup, he stopped being my husband two days before I made this thread. No offense taken. I just feel nothing towards him lately. Random anger but mostly indifference. My kids are my importance...and mister little raging ball of angst I was able to predict would tantrum. It was later than I expected, but I got him under control without yelling. I did pop his leg for kicking me once...I hate when I do that because it is a knee jerk reaction and I know it doesn't help. He just rages harder. But after that, I just worked him through it. And when he was done I offered to let him watch a movie in bed with me (he wanted to play video games in the media room) as I knew he would fall asleep fast. Yay me! Autism? I got this sh!t.


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## ReGroup (Dec 6, 2012)

My wife is a school psych - these people can be as disconnected as anyone... Don't underestimate people - no matter what "title" they carry.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> I am going to frost. I am afraid of coming off looking like a b!7ch and him slandering me to the kids or worse yet going for full custody. He is the autism specialist as disconnected as he is and that could be seen as beneficial for the boys.


Document every meeting with specialists or at the schools about the kids. List who was there, the purpose and the date. You can use this as part of your counter-claim should he go for full custody.

If you feel he is slandering you to the kids, the court can appoint a social worker to interview the children. It is done in a non-threatening way and will hopefully uncover any slander. This is for the children’s sakes. It is awful for kids when one parent bad-mouths the other and can lead to all kinds of emotional and behavioral problems. We’ve had a case at our school this year where the father’s access has been severely limited because of just this. He still doesn’t get it and is looking at supervised visits if he doesn’t smarten up soon. His son is a mess.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I know. Most psychs are more fvcked up than their clients lol.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I think I found an apartment.

It's up a flight and a half of stairs which makes it difficult to get my piano up there. If I can't it will be a deal breaker. He is taking my dream house as it is so, he does not get my only source of therapy.

If I could afford a decent keyboard, I would get rid of the piano, but I was a music major. And although I don't need a Swedish keyboard, I am pretty picky about what I play and it feeling as real as possible.

It's more than I could afford,it if he ups the support to 800 like he said he would I can swing it.

It's all new carpets, tiling and looks nice. It also has a balcony and there is a park nearby. 10 minutes from work and 10 from school. Hope the hill toward the main route is not too bad in winter.

It is a little closer to the city than I wanted, but I hear good things about this district. 

Only problem is that I will not be approved for rent if it is more than 40% of my income.

I think STBX is actually willing to foot the extra cost to get this over with though.

Oh, and for either 20 more a month per cat or an up front extra 200 per cat security deposit I can have up to 2. Original security deposit is dropped to 500 for this month making paying the first pet deposit still less than usual and for both cats a little more than usual. 

I really like this place. The living room is large enough to sleep in, but it has a laundry room I can use with a Murphy bed as my own room if I want. I will need a new washer and dryer though as mine won't fit in the cubby designed for washers and dryers. 

I am dropping off the check tomorrow before work. I hope I qualify. This would get things over with.

My dad has offered financial help as well. And my tax return should cover move in costs, though I will need to buy some furniture.

Things seemed amicable today. I told him about the apartment because he called asking how it went. 

And it is close to Aldi. This makes me giddy. It is flashbacks to my childhood in Germany and I go there for the chocolate. LOL

Cross your fingers. I hope this works out.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Fingers crossed. Toes crossed. Eyes crossed.


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## Stella Moon (Nov 22, 2012)

I'm crossed with you as well....


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## Bullwinkle (Feb 4, 2013)

Evening, BF. sounding kinda feisty today, despite the misery. 

You sound like one tough braud. I think you're gonna be just fine.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I feel feisty today! This place may be 2 bedrooms but it has a laundry room big enough to slip a bed into if I eventually want my own space. I'm looking at a quality daybed that looks more like a couch for the living room in the meantime. 

I also saw a washer dryer combination that actually dries well. I may look into that later to open up the laundry room further. My washer/dryer is huge and I won't be able to fit it all nice and neat under the cubby made by the cabinets. 

Contacted the guy that tuned my piano, figuring he would have ideas of who could move the piano. I think he will offer his services as he remodels and delivers pianos. Not sure his price yet though.

Little dude and I played at the playground there. We lasted 5 minute due to the cold and came home to make play dough ... Which was funny because at some point husbeast must have tossed all my food coloring...so we used kool aide instead. He sniffed it, more than he played with it. Haha.

Kids miss dad tonight. It is 10:00 and he is still not home. He is at his sister's, no doubt telling her how I am trying to take all his money, lol, but I don't care. I feel like I am almost out of here. Even if I don't get this apt and cry about it later, it was good to find a place I could picture my kids living.


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## Bullwinkle (Feb 4, 2013)

Wow, BF, this all sounds great, upbeat. 

A week ago you sounded much more despondent, you have chosen to fight back and give your kids the best home you can. Bravo. 

Kool Aid on play dough, doesn't get any better than that.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I'm a little annoyed over my missing cake decorating supplies, but not enough to let it ruin my mood. He has a tendency to throw things away if they are left out...dishes included. I think we are down to three bowls. Can I say how excited I am not to lose anymore dishes over deciding to wait to clean them? 

I may have to convince the parents to buy me a new pier one set lol. Meh...not too worried about it though. Thrift store dishes are probably smarter with these psychos that call me mom. Now to figure out what to do with my pink and gray china. Definitely does not go with the color scheme of the kitchen...nor does my pink kitchen aide...


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Bullwinkle is right it doesn’t get any better! The kids at school love Kool-Aid play dough. I should make some this weekend.

I hope ou can figure out the piano. I know it means a lot.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I will. Even if I have to pay for it. Sucks ill have to wait a year to afford to tune it again lol, but it's moved multiple times without tuning. It won't kill it.


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## DumpedAgain (Feb 14, 2013)

You inspire me, getting out, getting an apartment moving forward
resolutely

This gives strength to those of us that are still clinging to
unrealistic hope of reconciliation


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I have the benefit of knowing things have sucked for a while. Plus the fact that he has repeatedly asked for a separation. I think it has helped me disconnect easier than those who had this question dropped in them out of the blue. I'm not saying I won't still have those "why me" emotions, but they tend to just make me angry lol. I am also not saying I won't still want to cry, but the past few days I've been ok emotionally, and knowing the only reason he wanted to discuss reconciliation was so he could avoid an increase in child support. It helps detach, really it does. 

I haven't been able to change him in 16 years. He has always had two other mistresses, his house and his wallet have always been more important than me. I'm not going to change that now.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Am I in the wrong here? 

I'm rather livid at the moment.

I told him two days ago I had a viewing with an apartment at 4:30. It is an hour from where we live and in the city. I told him that if he got home at 3:30 I would be late. 3:00 he was not home. Still not at 3:15. No phone call, nothing. I bathed S5 and got him dressed and decided he could pick him up in the city later. He walked in right as we were leaving.

"Why is he dressed to go?"
"Because I told you I would be late if you got here at 3:30 so I was taking him with me"

I was planning on dropping off the application for the place I saw the day before. I needed that extra time. Of course I got stuck in rush hour traffic that was grid locked. Of course I got off the interstate to take a back road and got lost. The application had to be in by 5:00 and it was already 4:40 and my appointment with the other land lord was 4:30. 

I realized I didn't have the phone number for our current landlord so I called and said I'm lost on a back road I need you to text me his number. He starts telling me the number. I repeated "I Need you to TEXT me the number"

He snapped "fine!" And hung up.

I got the number, was an hour late to the next appointment and had to call the application people and beg them to stay open for me.

He then texted me "I got home as soon as I could...my tire needed air and I didn't realize I needed gas...I am tired of the bull****...I am tired of trying to be polite..."

It is taking every ounce of restraint not to call him and ream him out. He could have cost me BOTH apartments. So I didn't pacify him and say oh that's ok when he was late. How dare he even suggest I am not being polite. He refused to listen that I was driving and could not write down the number. I repeated myself. He got pissed about it. WTF. 

He makes me incredibly late and thinks that is polite? Can I please call him back and tell him what an ******* he is being? I know I know 180 but I'm pissed as hell right now.


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## ReGroup (Dec 6, 2012)

Jerk. But we shouldn't be surprised.

Don't give him the satisfaction. Just be as aloof when he asks for something that is time sensitive. And he will.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## DumpedAgain (Feb 14, 2013)

I'd be pissed too. 

Apparently still trying to maintain control, or at least
assuaging his ego with the feeling of being in control


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I didn't respond. I suspect an argument will ensue when I get home tomorrow. 

God I hope I get this place.


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## 06Daddio08 (Jul 26, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> I didn't respond. I suspect an argument will ensue when I get home tomorrow.
> 
> God I hope I get this place.


Do not play into the Triangle. He will Persecute you until he is comfortably back in the Victim Chair, that chair is so warm and cozy, why would he want to get out of it?

Assuming he is anything other than what he shows you will lead you no where but to more inner turmoil. You did right by dressing S5 up and getting ready to head out, it was what was best for you.

Tough sh!t if he had a problem with it.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

I agree with everyone. Don’t get into it. Use one of Conrad’s lines, “I’m sorry you feel that way”, and let him blow his gasket into the vacuum of your detachment.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

And predictable as condensed soup.

Walked in the door. Said hi. He blocked the stairs and demanded I speak with him. Accusing me of yelling at him. I kept my voice quiet and said "I did not yell at you. I did, however answer your question and repeated myself." He kept ranting about me being rude and that he is getting sick of it. I did it...I said " I'm sorry you feel that way", and he flipped out. "Of course, you're not wrong" he snapped.

Still blocking the stairs so I can't get up to bed. 

I explained that I was an hour late for my appointment because he arrived home late. That I had told him I would be late if he got home at that time. He insisted I said that I would be strapped. I repeated that I had told him I needed him home close to 3. WHATEVER! He snapped. Then went on about how rude I was to him on the phone. So I explained again, I was lost, I was driving, there was no way I was going to be able to write a number down which is why I asked you to text it to me originally, so I had to repeat myself. "No you didn't say that at first." 

"Yes, I did and the fact that I was driving should have clued you in to the fact that I couldn't write a number down."

"I refuse to live like this, I'm going to get the key." He stamped. I stood there saying nothing, but thinking you better not stick me with this house.

Finally he calmed down enough for me to pass him. But then he followed me into the bedroom. Telling me how I've not even been cordial to him and that I can't even be polite when discussing things EVER.

I didn't yell, but I was getting tired of the drivel. I probably shouldn't have engaged, but there really was no getting out of it.

My response..."you say I'm rude, and yet the first thing I said to you when I walked in the door was hi, like I say every day when you come home. (" I guess you did was his reply"). The other day when you called about the apartment viewing, I was kind, and I told you. I was excited. So this always rude thing you say is not true. Just like its not true that I haven't shown you I loved you in the past year, just like its not true that I have been detached for the past ten years. You are rewriting our history. To what end I don't know, but it does not make it true".

I did not yell. I kept my voice soft. 

He snapped that I always have to be right and that I'm never going to apologize.

I said, "I will not aplogize for you making me an hour late. You did not even have the courtesy to call. This is important. The most important thing I have had to do in a long time. And I am allowed to be angry about the fact that I almost missed my opportunity."

He huffed and said he realized it was important. 

Then decided it was time to discuss child support and when we are telling the kids. And any number of other nonsense because I haven't been awake all night or anything. 

I gave him ten more minutes and said "I have to go to sleep" and suddenly he was fine. All "I will try to take the kids out so you can sleep". 

Very weird. 

But I predicted this sh!t storm.

I probably didn't do the 180 perfectly. It's hard when they are in your face and you cannot go anywhere, because you still live in the same house and all you want is your pillow and to punch him in the face so he will just STFU.

But I remained calm. I did not raise my voice at all. And in that I feel good.

I am going to sleep now. I'm exhausted after working all night and have to do another 12.5 hour shift tonight.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

I am so proud of you, BFG. You handled it beautifully. The quiet, voice and the refusal to accept responsibility for his behavior.....good job! You did engage, but you did it in a calm way and did not rise when he escalated. Giving him ten minutes at the end was perfect. It gave him a chance to calm down completely and to exit with dignity.

You rock!


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## 06Daddio08 (Jul 26, 2012)

*Re: Re: This is real*



Frostflower said:


> I am so proud of you, BFG. You handled it beautifully. The quiet, voice and the refusal to accept responsibility for his behavior.....good job! You did engage, but you did it in a calm way and did not rise when he escalated. Giving him ten minutes at the end was perfect. It gave him a chance to calm down completely and to exit with dignity.
> 
> You rock!


Agree. A step in the right direction!


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## Bullwinkle (Feb 4, 2013)

Yes, BF, you're doing great, particularly when you're so tired. 

Maybe you're really on to something as to how best to deal with H.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

It just annoys me that he refuses to acknowledge he was in the wrong, but demands I admit fault.

And it irritates me that he has so little respect for my sleep needs. Once he picked a fight after I had been up for 38 hours. He then started demanding the kids do things they had never done for themselves before, and they kept coming in asking for help. After two hours of this, knowing I had to be back at work that night I grabbed a set of scrubs, and change of undies, my pillow and left. "Where are you going?!" He demanded. "Somewhere I can get some sleep." And I went to a hotel. Only I woke up to realize I didn't have a bra, and I had two scrub tops so I went to the store and bought a new unifor and bra and thought...well won't he be surprised when he checks the bank account later. Hope that fight was worth it.

My patients kept remarking that night that I looked well rested hahaha.


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## staystrong (Sep 15, 2012)

Well handled, BF. You never lost your cool and look at the end result: "I will try to take the kids out so you can sleep".


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## DumpedAgain (Feb 14, 2013)

BF

I recall from a much earlier post that your H was a Pastor
at one time?

Real Christian behavior!!!!


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Operative word is WAS. We are both atheists now. So I can't blame that on Christendom. LOL

I cannot wait to move. Willing to take on a little debt to get it done.


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## Stella Moon (Nov 22, 2012)

did you hear back from the apt people? you get it??


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Not yet. I dropped it off Friday right before they closed though. Will probably wait until Tuesday morning. Checking out another place tomorrow hopefully as well, 2 miles from work.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I GOT THE APARTMENT!

Then promptly went and spent 1200 dollars in furniture and new mattresses.

Bed for me, and the boys, new dresser for daughter. Gotta figure out clothes storage for me now, but I think I've over spend my limit. Will also need to buy stock in twin sheets. Ugh. 

Breaking it to kids tonight. D just saw an email notification for a "someone has responded to a post" here. She waled in, held it up to me and said "divorce?" Um... "Don't mess with my email" and I grabbed it from her. LOL

I also bought a VAR. will be slapping that bad boy in the car when he is asleep tonight.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Make that 1500. Just bought new mattresses for the boys and a new set of MATCHING dishes.


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## Bullwinkle (Feb 4, 2013)

BF, I'm beginning to wonder why you're even on TAM, you seem to have it so together. 

Keep it up!


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Bullwinkle, I don't. It's only because of the support and seeing people here that I've realized I am strong enough.

Just broke it to the kids. It was horrible. My daughter started screaming she was going to kill herself and that she hated both of us. My middle son just wept and wept (he is not finishing his homework tonight), and my youngest well, he fared the best. He has been with me through this process so he just sat playing his video game. 

D ran away to the kitchen scratching her arm over and over again. I was afraid she was going to grab something to really cut herself. I tried to hold her and she screamed and ran to her room where she proceeded to throw things at STBX and I. He reprimanded her for being disrespectful and she crawled under a table and basically started rocking. I was afraid I was going to have to take her to the ER. She is refusing to go to the new school, refusing to homeschool. And poor middle son just cries and cries. 

I just started crying. Not because I want us to work anymore. I'm beyond that. But because again, it didn't have to be this way. I feel like, yes we have both broken their hearts, but if he would have just agreed to help my children would not be destitute right now. 

Finally she blurted that she wanted her best friend. So I texted her mom (who had surgery today or I would have called) and her mom called back right away. It is a school night and I basically have a 12 year old babysitting my 12 year old so that she doesn't hurt herself. This part sucks.

I really hope they like this place. I know it will be hard, but I hope they can find peace there. 

My daughter made me promise to go to family gatherings. She finally calmed enough to talk instead of scream and just wept. I said initially I didn't know. It will be awkward. But she just sobbed and begged me. "They are family gatherings and you are my mom. You have to be there with me". God that kills. 

Found out STBX has a jacuzzi tub at his new place. I get a two bedroom apartment. That sucks too. But in two years I will be able to afford a nicer place and they will get more say in the process. I hate that my children's hearts are broken. This has been the toughest part of all of this.


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## Bullwinkle (Feb 4, 2013)

Jesus God, BF, that just sounds awful. So sad. 

I hope STBX tries to get a really fat woman in the jacuzzi with him and, well, you know, water displacement. 

I really hope your kids are okay.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Thank you for making me snort soda out of my nose at the mental image.

She is doing ok right now. Feigning hilarity and making over the top jokes. But her friend is here so she has a distraction.

STBX just walked up to me and said "well that went better than I thought."

What? 

I don't understand this man.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

If that was better than he expected, one has to wonder what he was expecting.

Hard as it is now for the kids, they will be all right. It will take time and lots of love, which I know they will get, but they will be all right.

Happy news about the apartment!


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## Bullwinkle (Feb 4, 2013)

BF

I normally always take the man's side, but this guy really does sound like a hopeless numbnuts.


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## eldubya (Aug 23, 2012)

Hi BFG:
Just wanted to say a few words of encouragement.
First of all..there is nothing abnormal about spinning yarn and don't be embarassed by this hobby.
Second..don't be terrified of being alone because you aren't. If the spouse leaves you and your folks aren't supportive it doesn't say that much about you as a person. You are a lovable human being...period. You have a purpose and meaning for your life and with billions of people and animals on this planet NO WAY are you gonna stay alone!

Third..work on that fear. Its natural to feel it so let it come. But also realize fear of the unknown is what holds most of us back from true meaning in life.

I just finished reading your 15 pages...
you are an amazing mother!

I had panic attacks for a few months after the divorce was announced to me. I got through and am less alone than I was in the marriage.


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## soca70 (Oct 30, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> Bullwinkle, I don't. It's only because of the support and seeing people here that I've realized I am strong enough.
> 
> Just broke it to the kids. It was horrible. My daughter started screaming she was going to kill herself and that she hated both of us. My middle son just wept and wept (he is not finishing his homework tonight), and my youngest well, he fared the best. He has been with me through this process so he just sat playing his video game.
> 
> ...


It's hard not to hate the WS when you see the anguish and pain they are causing. Really I wonder how will I get past this? It makes me want to hurt them the way they've hurt my kids. My heart goes out to you.


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## soca70 (Oct 30, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> STBX just walked up to me and said "well that went better than I thought."
> 
> What?
> 
> I don't understand this man.


The WS has to deny the reality to be able to live with their own actions. We just told our kids this weekend and STBX says "I think that went pretty well" as one of our kids was sobbing and goes into an emotional shut-down for 2 days and the other one is hurling invectives at her. In in an awful way, it's almost interesting to see their warped perception of events.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Just checking, BFG. How are you today?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Sorry I haven't checked in. It's been kind of busy today. First my daughter's friend spent the night. They were up late and then D was up multiple times during the night asking me please don't separate until the end of the school year. Then I had to get them up earlier to get all kids, including the extra kid on the bus. I'm grateful her mother allowed it. 

I was exhausted and had to judge the final round of the vocal competition tonight so I took a nap and then D texted begging to be picked up. Again the tears and the begging and the "don't you love daddy?" Questions. S9 was just quiet and moody. 

Every time she asks the question about love, STBX just looks to the floor. I always repeat, "I will always love your dad, because he gave me you". 

In these moments I really just want to scream "Look, I wanted to work at this, it is your dad that wanted out and did not want us to get help". But I won't. I told her we would go to family therapy. She wants her dad to join us. I had to tell her daddy would probably not be with us, but that she could ask him if he would do family therapy where he lives.

Tonight after the competition the judges went out to dinner. Afterward I told them I was not going home straight away and that I was waiting for him to fall into a deep sleep so I could install the VAR. me and one of the judges went to a diner and sat for a while. I got home around 2:00 a.m. It is duct taped under his seat, toward the front because that is the only place I could reach. I'm terrified he is going to find it. 

I'm not sure how long I should leave it there either. 

D texted me at dinner begging me not to separate from her dad and "our family is dead". I texted back we are not dead, but this is going to be hard, and we will get through this. 

She is asking not to go to school tomorrow. I am torn.

On one level I think she needs to be with her friends. 

On another, I want to hold her forever. 

I also thought, I could take her with me earlier in the day than intended to sign the lease, and show her the apartment. I'm scared she won't like it though because it is not as cool as her dads place.

Then I remembered I have to set up a new bank account and get a bank check for my portion of the tax return.

I've discovered all bills in my name that I thought he was paying with our joint funds, have not been paid in at least a month. 

I have no idea how I am going to dig out from all of this debt. I have many medical bills I thought were getting paid down. Only one was paid and only 150 of that 500 dollar bill was paid.On top of 4k in credit card debt and the van payment that is still behind. Though I am almost caught up with it. Next paycheck that bill should be caught up. The financial aspect has me overwhelmed right now. I need to figure out how to consolidate this debt and get it paid off so I'm not under it anymore. It's bad enough I will graduate 30k in debt. I'd rather that be the only thing I am dealing with then.

I have to decide about school tomorrow. She is going to want an answer. I am too wound up to sleep. And I think I am still losing weight. I saw myself in the mirror. I know my appetite is slowly returning, but I still rarely eat. I'm not sure how much of that is nerves or residual mono.


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## Bullwinkle (Feb 4, 2013)

BF

It's funny about this weight loss thing, isn't it. I know people deal with stress differently. 

Since my divorce stuff started, I've lost over 20 pounds and my jeans are hanging off my skinny azz. But I have a friend going through a divorce and when I saw him the other day, I was shocked, what a fat sack of shyt he'd become. 

You're doing great.


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## Stella Moon (Nov 22, 2012)

Bullwinkle said:


> BF
> 
> It's funny about this weight loss thing, isn't it. I know people deal with stress differently.
> 
> ...



Is it bad that I hope my stbxh turns into this? :scratchhead: He was sportin' a pot belly toward the end of our marriage and at court...when I met him...he had an 8pk...


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

So, how long should I leave the VAR in the car?

Also, if he doesn't stop answering her questions with "that's not a fair question" I will rip his tongue out. It is killing her to hear that.

She asked why he kept going out to his sister's house (his story for many evenings he is gone) when he isn't going to see them all week soon. And if I would text him and tell him to come home early so she could be with him. I think I messed up. Because I replied with "he isn't going to listen to me" and that was followed up with the requisite why and I blurted out "because in his mind we are already separated" well that just set her into a fit of convulsing sobs.

I don't know how to handle this mother thing when I just want to be like "look he sucks and is the reason why we aren't together anymore!"


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## Bullwinkle (Feb 4, 2013)

What a numbnuts.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Well lookie there. 3:00 a.m. And he is still not home from his "night out with my sister".

Also found some odd charges on the bank account.


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## Bullwinkle (Feb 4, 2013)

Come on, BF, I'm sure he and his sister are having a nice game of Parcheesy right now. Perfectly innocent. 

Odd charges? Don't say Victoria's Secret.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

90 dollars to PayPal and yet there is no purchases at all for months in his Paypal acct.

Nights out for a drink...not sure how a beer or two equates to a 47 dollar tab. Sounds more like dinner for 2 especially at this Irish Pub I looked up online after seeing multiple charges.


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## Bullwinkle (Feb 4, 2013)

Not conclusive but does raise questions.....

But BF! Like my WS says, marriage is based on 100 percent trust!


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

So, he just came home at 7:30...to take a shower. 

Um. Do I confront this? In his mind we are separated enough to make it Facebook public. But neither if us have moved out. The kids are upset. They were up often last night looking for him.


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## DumpedAgain (Feb 14, 2013)

I was so relieved when I filed, I posted the news on facebook

pissed her off


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

That's different. He hasn't filed, and we aren't even officially separated. I am burning to confront in where he was all night. It's taking every ounce of restraint.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

What in the fvck? 

My mother called his brothers wife under the pretense of getting her to freaking pray? The **** has hit the ceiling. He is flipping out. It has caused me to look like the fool with his family. And D saw something that looked like a dating site on my twitter account (which I haven't been on in months) so he is accusing me of cheating. I just want to crawl in a hole and die now.


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## Bullwinkle (Feb 4, 2013)

Wait a minute, isn't he the one who stayed out all night?


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## Voltaire (Feb 5, 2013)

Bullwinkle said:


> Wait a minute, isn't he the one who stayed out all night?


Exactly. 

Standard tactics for a guilty party - try to make the other one look/feel bad or guilty to divert attention away from their own shameful behaviour.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

BFGuru said:


> What in the fvck?
> 
> My mother called his brothers wife under the pretense of getting her to freaking pray? The **** has hit the ceiling. He is flipping out. It has caused me to look like the fool with his family. And D saw something that looked like a dating site on my twitter account (which I haven't been on in months) so he is accusing me of cheating. I just want to crawl in a hole and die now.


Blameshifting at its finest.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I'm so angry with my mom though. What on earth was she thinking. The two of them are gossiping manipulators and I don't know who is saying what, but apparently I am telling everyone he is not doing anything with the kids (here yes, and to my mother, but mom claims she did not say that. I've not said it to anyone else though). That I'm documenting things to go after full custody...there's no way I could do full custody right now even if I wanted to be a douche. His entire family thinks I'm being underhanded and an *******.

I broke the 180. I yelled at him and at my mother. He accused me of knowing she was calling his sil and lying about it. I snapped and replied with "coming from the man that takes pride in lying to everyone?"

It was ugly. 

I told him I hadn't been on twitter in a month and I think it shows how long ago you logged in, so to go on D's twitter, look up whatever this site is and check it to see if I made a profile. I have nothing to hide.

I was literally shaking by the time I got to work. My coworkers were wonderful at letting me vent and I felt I could drive home today. But then he met me outside as he was taking trash out and we talked some more. I feel stupid for having cried. I sobbed. Right in front of him. He has everyone. All the support in the world. Now his family hates me, and my own family is insane. I feel like I am so completely alone in all of this and have to remind myself my friends are supporting me, but I don't want to drag them down talking about it non stop.

I blurted out I'm afraid he has someone and has given me a freaking std. He denied it. 

I'm just. Ugh. I have failed miserably in the 180 but apparently it has pissed him off even more.

I can't hear anything but the hum of the car and the radio clearly on the VAR. I can tell he is talking, but can't make out what he is saying. 

Today is just a ****ty day. I don't even want to accept his help tonight with moving some of my stuff. But I am going to need it. 

Why do I care so much anymore?


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

>>I yelled at him and at my mother. He accused me of knowing she was calling his sil and lying about it. I snapped and replied with "coming from the man that takes pride in lying to everyone?<<


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I know Conrad. I was doing so well, and fell completely off the wagon the past 48 hours. He kept texting me accusing me of things over and over again and I had no clue what he was talking about. So after yelling at my mom for interfering I called him back and told him I dealt with it and he said "I don't know if I believe you" which is a trigger for me. I hate lying. I always have. He knows this. However, he loves saying "haha! I lie to everyone...not you of course, but everyone else."

So I took it as a direct attack against my integrity and I thought he couldn't get to me anymore. But apparently he can.

And why do I keep crying? Because I can't get an answer to my question"why weren't we ever worth fighting for?" Not because I see reconciliation. But because he never tried for us.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

BFGuru said:


> I know Conrad. I was doing so well, and fell completely off the wagon the past 48 hours. He kept texting me accusing me of things over and over again and I had no clue what he was talking about. So after yelling at my mom for interfering I called him back and told him I dealt with it and he said "I don't know if I believe you" which is a trigger for me. I hate lying. I always have. He knows this. However, he loves saying "haha! I lie to everyone...not you of course, but everyone else."


BFGuru,

Here's the thing.

Broken people actually DESIRE the distraction associated with getting others flummoxed, so they can dump their anger.

That's why the "aftermath" of you getting emotional and defensive is so wretched. That's what he wants.

Don't give it to him.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I know. You are right. My own mother does not see where she went wrong. And now my dad is posting on Facebook on my wall that they were only trying to help and I chewed them out. 

Thank you drama *****s. I'm surrounded by them.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

BFGuru said:


> I know. You are right. My own mother does not see where she went wrong. And now my dad is posting on Facebook on my wall that they were only trying to help and I chewed them out.
> 
> Thank you drama *****s. I'm surrounded by them.


Good observations.

What are you going to do about it?

P.S. "Setting them straight" is not the answer. That's likely an impossible dream


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I don't know at the moment. Go to sleep? I've been working all night. Can't sleep for being so upset and have to work tonight though.

I don't even know what to do about it. She thinks she was helping. What? She asked her to pray with her...I hate prayer requests. It is glorified gossip nine times out of ten. And this one just made it so I can never show my face to his family members again.

So, she did this five years ago making it to where her family won't talk to me. Actually told me to piss off. Literally. Now she is destroying the only other family I had. I should have never trusted her.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

BFGuru said:


> I don't know at the moment. Go to sleep? I've been working all night. Can't sleep for being so upset and have to work tonight though.
> 
> I don't even know what to do about it. She thinks she was helping. What? She asked her to pray with her...I hate prayer requests. It is glorified gossip nine times out of ten. And this one just made it so I can never show my face to his family members again.
> 
> So, she did this five years ago making it to where her family won't talk to me. Actually told me to piss off. Literally. Now she is destroying the only other family I had. I should have never trusted her.


"I'm not ok with this"

(Practice saying it)


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I don't understand. Given brain is a mess right now.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

BFGuru said:


> I don't understand. Given brain is a mess right now.


Tell them you're not ok with their interference.

They will give you a hundred reasons why it's in your best interests. How much they care, etc.

You politely agree with all of that - however long it takes.

When they then say "Do you understand? You say, of course"

But, I'm still not ok with it.

Stick with that course and you'll have them out of your business in no time.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I will try that next time.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

BFGuru said:


> I will try that next time.


No one can argue and convince you that you are ok with things you are not ok with.

Round these parts, we call those things "#3's"


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

#3s?


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

BFGuru said:


> #3s?


Haven't posted this in awhile:

In his book "Awareness", Anthony DeMello summarizes ways we behave that provide pleasure.

1) We give pleasure to ourselves. New hobbies, activities, clothes, motorcycles, etc. Just for us.

2) We give pleasure to others in ways that make us feel good about ourselves. Mother Theresa is a stellar example. A lifetime of selfless giving, but in the end, it was something she got something from. It made her feel good about her to do it.

3) We give pleasure to others in ways that makes us feel BAD about ourselves. One example would be letting your mother interfere in your personal life because SHE wants to. This is doormat behavior and you end up feeling squished due to her behavior. What's needed here is a boundary.

You're not ok with her input. You're just not - no matter how good it makes her feel to "help"

So, tell her you're not ok with it - and feel your personal power start to return, one transaction at a time.

In summary, a life filled with #3's is a life of misery.

A life that eliminates #3's is a happy one, where you cheefully give WHEN it makes you feel good about you.


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## eldubya (Aug 23, 2012)

Thanks Conrad. I didnt know what a #3 was either...probably a lot of us on TAM doing #3s. Its hard to stop cause you think someone will get violently angry if you do. Kind of a conditioned response for us souls who were conditioned by abuse and hard for others to understand why any human would choose to be a doormat!


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Your parents are after the outcome they want, not what is best for you. Listen to Conrad.

As for your H, he is indeed blameshifting, trying to move the focus from his behavior to yours. Don’t allow this. Don’t give him the satisfaction of bringing you down. Next time he says he doesn’t believe you or anything else that hurst or angers you, use Conrad’s phrase “i’m sorry you feel that way” and walk away.

As for his family, if they think you are a fool because of what your mother did, are they worth the grief? Seems to me, if they really cared about you, the misguided attempts by your mother would be seen as such and would not affect their relationship with you.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Thanks guys. I am doing ok today. The closer it gets to moving day (he called the landlord saying we would be out a week after I signed the lease), the more reflective I get. It's truly depressing that we have come to this place. 

My wedding gown sits in my closet. I don't know what to do with it. I designed it. My mother made it. We beaded it by hand for a year before the wedding. No one wants a wedding dress from a marriage gone bad, but getting rid of it seems both wrong and yet right. I'm really torn on what to do.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

We have been storing some furniture for my god daughter until she finds a place of her own. Her family came to pick it up to move it into other storage today. They were kind, but she hugged me and it took very ounce of restraint not to burst into tears. She asked if I was ok. I don't remember what I said, but I didn't say what I wanted to which was "I didn't want this, why does your brother not love me anymore?" I held it together and said "kiss the baby for me" (my goddaughter just had a baby). I had to stop talking then, I was too choked up. I will never see them again I fear. No one will visit me down there. 

They drove away with her things and I stood on the porch smiling, waving and with tears streaming down my face. They froze half way down my chin and I couldn't stop them from pouring. Everything I have known for 16 years has walked away today and I stood there alone realizing how lonely this will be.

My father called, informing me my mother was talking suicide after I yelled at her. I told him I still loved her, but she was way Out of line and I am entitled to be angry. He told me I needed to tell her that. I replied with, she needs to apologize and accept responsibility for her actions. That what she did was stupid and has ruined things between me and his family. 

I felt he was trying to pin her suicidal tendencies in me and I am not to blame for that instability. She needs help. But it's not an argument worth fighting.

I am grateful SIL was not strange with me, but tonight it all just seems so unfair. Why does he get to walk away from everything leaving me with no one? Why is there no familial support for me? Why do I feel so completely and utterly alone right now? And damnit, why do I keep crying?

The reality of all of this is too real today. Is it too much to ask for just a little more time?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Today has been hard. It was bad enough that he gave us a week to get out of here when I worked all weekend faring 3 hours of sleep a day. It meant Monday was lost to sleep and homework with the kids. I did not get to pack or clean at all. 

My friend gave me a recliner, which is good, and my furniture came in at the store so I had to pick them up today. He had agreed to come home early and help me take a load down then help get the furniture I was getting today. He was pretty good about it ... Until he got here. Started demanding to know why I didn't have more done. My sleep excuse wasn't good enough. Neither was the fact that I was chasing my son around with Lysol and a rag because he was spewing fluid out each end today. He started yelling and our landlord was here holding office hours in his clinic. I had to keep telling him to stop yelling because of it. Well, it was more like a whispered yell of "stop ****ing yelling, D is here!" 

We left late as a result. Arrived at the apt, he complained and huffed and carried on. Hurt his neck pulling the washer up the stairs. Of course that was another source of contention. 

I finally looked at him and said "look, i know you cant stand me, but suck it up just a little longer and I will be out of your hair for good."

We went to pick up the recliner and he was miserable the entire time. It was so embarrassing. I actually told my friend that I loathed him today.

Got back to the apartment he is miserable and demanding to leave. I told him he couldn't because I had to go to the furniture store to get my stuff that came in today because that was why we went today to the apt. He was angry. I grabbed Motrin and handed him the dosed out pills and a drink. Told him to stay at the apt with the kids and that I would pick up the stuff and bring it back so he only had to help unload. Told him to hook up the washer then relax while I was gone.

Got back, he is still huffing. I keep thinking "only a man with a mistress he is running to wants away this fast" but didn't say it. I finally told him in the way to grab things out of the van that I wish he'd just be honest with me. 

Nothing more. Just that. As soon as he was done he stormed out saying "that's the second time you've accused me like that and I'm tired if it!" I did not respond.

He hugged the kids and left. Right after he left D ran out crying that she left her iPod in his car (she was keeping notes for her research project in it). I texted him and he did not respond. I called and he didn't pick up. She is devastated, thinking he is mad at her. I keep assuring her he is not mad at her, but mad at me. And that I am a big girl and can handle it. She would insist he didn't love her anymore and I'd say the same that he does love her. During one of these banters I said "look, I can assure you your dad loves you and is not mad at you" when I heard him walking up my stairs. He handed her the iPod and told hr goodbye and left again. I stood there thinking, it's a good thing I wasn't trash talking him but who does he think he is walking into my house like that? It will not happen again, that's for sure.

She bawled the entire way home. Swearing he did not love her anymore and that he is lying when he says he loves her. I kept assuring her that he does. She wanted to know what would happen if I found another guy. I said I wasn't promising, but that the way I felt right now I am not interested in it ever. I might change my mind, but the idea disgusts me right now. She wanted to know about her dad and what if he finds someone else. I thought...he probably has....but instead said "I can't tell you about your dad.Just about me" that wasn't good enough and she cried harder. I finally told her to text him. He of course said he loved her, but was frustrated with how messy the house was. She kept crying and I suggested maybe she see if she could stay with him. I offered to drive her.

He said no.

I called and tried to talk him into it. She needed her dad tonight. He refused saying he would sleep her tomorrow. "We are separated." 

"No," I said. "We are separating. And according to your date that does not happen until Friday, so in her mind we are very much still a family". I offered to meet him halfway to pick her up tomorrow. He said no because it would be a snow day probably tomorrow. I said even still she could go into the office with him.

No. No. No.

He is crushing her. He claims she is tired. It does not excuse the fact that he is crushing her.

I had half the mind to drive over there anyway. But with three kids in the car, if my suspicions are correct, I did not want to confront a marriage wrecking w4ore in front of my children. So I drove home to the house I am packing up instead.

I have three twin mattresses side by side in my room. They have all clammoured onto two and are inching their way into mine now. Poor kiddos.

S9 gave didactic reasons why dad still loved his kids even if mom and dad can't be together. Sometimes, autism and all, he amazes me with the wisdom if his youth.


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## Bullwinkle (Feb 4, 2013)

Once again, BF, you've made me feel better about my life. No offense. And best word of the day so far on TAM, didactic.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I haven't seen my older cat in three days. She hasn't touched her food either. The doors have been open a lot due to people moving stuff out, but she is normally terrified of the outdoors. She has only ever gone as far as the porch and I can count on one hand the amount of times she has done that. I am moving on Saturday entirely.

I'm terrified she has sought out a place to die. She is 16. She didn't seem sick, but she is old. Why now?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I was starting to feel strong again. But the longer she is gone and the more I hear my daughter wail over the cat the weaker I become. What if she isn't found before we move? Sometimes life just seems to avalanche and you can't get out of the way.


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## Bullwinkle (Feb 4, 2013)

I hear you, BF. don't take this the wrong way but let's hope she's not walking by some Chinese restaurant....


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

There are none for at least five miles.


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## Bullwinkle (Feb 4, 2013)

Sorry for that. 

You okay?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Not really.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

BFGuru said:


> I was starting to feel strong again. But the longer she is gone and the more I hear my daughter wail over the cat the weaker I become. What if she isn't found before we move? Sometimes life just seems to avalanche and you can't get out of the way.


I'm really sorry.

One of the neighbor kids left our gate open and my Sheltie escaped. He loved to chase cars.

A thousand dollars later, we got him back... but I remember the wrenching internal turmoil of looking at that open gate.


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## Bullwinkle (Feb 4, 2013)

Sorry to hear it, BF. 

Kids okay? You getting any sleep?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I just give up for tonight. Nothing is packed. When I finally gave up on looking for the cat I went to my daughters room to find garbage and clothing all over the floor. I spent the rest of the night in there and still can't find the floor.

I am out of boxes. I am out of trash bags. I am out of anything to pack with and cannot seem to make her understand her life will not fit into the apartment, let alone her new room. My bedroom is a dsiaster, my craft things aren't packed. The kitchen needs packed, and my china. He never fixed the drawers he said he would fix so now I have to buy another dresser. And my cat is probably dead somewhere, frozen to death. I can't possibly do this alone and yet here I sit alone. He helped bring a load over yesterday. He is refusing to come help when my brother comes to help and my friend from high school 20 years ago...her DAD is coming to help transport things. I am mortified for him to see this mess, and he won't come home long enough to help me organize. I am so overwhelmed tonight. I am exhausted. 

My rheumatologist ran X-rays today due to swelling and my legs do not feel like they can carry me, let alone boxes up another flight of stairs. I left the apartment with a van full because I just simply could not lift another box up those stairs. Everything hurts.

I just want to run away from it all tonight. None of this is fair. And I feel so juvenile saying that. But it isn't. We fight non stop right now. I have no emotional resources to bite my tongue and figure fvck it. Come Saturday it won't matter anyway so I am telling him exactly how I feel. 

It's still all my fault though. Had the audacity to say he didn't know where he was t fault for this. That he was just tired of ME never changing. I informed him that he was far from perfect and said..."I guess I am perfect"

Whatever.

180 doesn't work, neither does fighting back. He is delusional and seems to think he is innocent in all of this so whatever. Nothing I say will change that. Nothing I don't say will either. 

I just need more time. More time to organize. More time to pack. More time to get things in some semblance of order. And alone to do it with three kids. 

I am grateful for the two people offering to help in Saturday, but one is not able to lift. And I am never going to be ready for them when they get here.
FML
Going to go cry myself to sleep now.


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## Stella Moon (Nov 22, 2012)

Is it your stbxh that's hurrying you out so much? Screw him...if you need a few extra days and can't get it all right away so what. What's he gonna do? 

You need rest. 

Keep calling for your kitty...have the kids go out and call too...open the door if u wake up and call...he/she could be right outside the door at any moment...don't give up...do some really loud "here kitty kitties"... Keep trying...


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## Stella Moon (Nov 22, 2012)

Is it your stbxh that's hurrying you out so much? Screw him...if you need a few extra days and can't get it all right away so what. What's he gonna do? 

You need rest. 

Keep calling for your kitty...have the kids go out and call too...open the door if u wake up and call...he/she could be right outside the door at any moment...don't give up...do some really loud "here kitty kitties"... Keep trying...


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## Bullwinkle (Feb 4, 2013)

Hey, Stella, that, "Here, kitty kitty" reminds of a really inappropriate joke but now is neither the time nor the place for it.

BF, what is FML? I think I know what the F and the M stand for....


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

FML = fvck my life


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## Bullwinkle (Feb 4, 2013)

That's what I thought. 

Has the cat turned up?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

No. Went to try and get more boxes all morning. Was told no even though I could see empty boxes in their aisles. Went to my old house and left a note for current residents with her description but no cat yet. Overwhelmed does not begin to describe things.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

SHE JUST SHOWED UP ON THE BACK PORCH! 

Her eye is a mess. She weighs about 3 lbs and she just looks so frail. I'm afraid she caught someone from a feral animal and cannot afford the vet bill right now. Ugh.

Can't find any companies to give me boxes. **** heads have them right in the idle of their aisles and told me no. 

Off to the liquor store. I'm told they have great boxes. Wish me luck.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> SHE JUST SHOWED UP ON THE BACK PORCH!
> 
> Her eye is a mess. She weighs about 3 lbs and she just looks so frail. I'm afraid she caught someone from a feral animal and cannot afford the vet bill right now. Ugh.
> 
> ...


Glad the cat showed up.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Big move was Saturday with no help from him. He is being a sanctimonious as$hole today. I just don't have the mental stamina to explain the weekend right now.just trying to adjust.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> Big move was Saturday with no help from him. He is being a sanctimonious as$hole today. I just don't have the mental stamina to explain the weekend right now.just trying to adjust.


Sorry it has been so very hard for you. At least you are away from him now. 

I know its hard, having just moved and having three kids, but try to find some time for yourself, even if its just to take a nice bubble bath. 

Hope the cat is okay.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

At the bestie's right now. 

Last night was veryhard. He pitched a fit over bringing the kids all the way to me because he was running late, so i met him half way. I hadn't gotten to sleep after work yet since I just had clocked out. As soon as I picked them up they were all excited "Mommy, mommy! Daddy's new friend is sooooooooo cool! She let us borrow her Wii, and did my nails and played with us and everything".

Yes, they said "friend".

Yes, I know it's more.

I haven't cleaned up the VAR yet. But damnit. Week one he introduced his wh0re to my children. 

I kept it together until I realized parts were missing from the bunk beds I was putting together. I opted to take kids out to dinner because I couldn't get to the counters through the boxes and realized my phone was dying, I couldn't find the charger and my car battery was dead. 

I locked myself in the bathroom and cried, quietly, but my tiny little guy seems to know even if I'm silent, the difference between allergy sniffles and crying sniffles and kept calling through the door "I hear you crying, why you crying".

I called a friend and told her about the car. She showed up ith food and her husband who jumped my car, moved my heavy furniture out of the middle of the floor and thre all my dishes in a cabinet with instructions to put things where I want them later, but that I had to get things off this counter now. I almost cried again. 

Left to get my birth certificate today (a 3 hour drive) only to realize my tires were bald and it was now raining too hard. I slowed down on the turnpike and finally made it 2.5 hours to my best friend's house who drove me to the office. We are drinking wine and making chili now. 

He texted asking for DS pants size four hours ago. I refuse to text him back.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Be strong for your kids, and yourself. That is what matters right now.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

He is saying things that scare me now. Accused me of putting the kids lives in danger driving in the rain. This "friend" is a behavior specialist too. Between them they make 100k. With his support I make 25k. 

I am very afraid he is compiling a case to take my kids away and I don't have even five dollars to my name. How do I find a lawyer that can help me protect myself now? All the pro bono lawyers are at least a five month wait list. 

I can't stand talking to him anymore. It erupts into an argument everything time. Normally about the kids. 

He is insisting on bathing my son every day. He has echzimah and it is out of control after being there over a weekend. Even applying lotion has him screaming in pain. He is not to be bathed every day unless he is soiled because of it. If he is bathed he is not to use soap. Poor kiddo is in pain. But bathing is cleanliness in his eyes. So forget what the doctor said.

I am terrified he will take my kids from me right now. Absolutely terrified.


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## 06Daddio08 (Jul 26, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> He is saying things that scare me now. Accused me of putting the kids lives in danger driving in the rain. This "friend" is a behavior specialist too. Between them they make 100k. With his support I make 25k.
> 
> I am very afraid he is compiling a case to take my kids away and I don't have even five dollars to my name. How do I find a lawyer that can help me protect myself now? All the pro bono lawyers are at least a five month wait list.
> 
> ...


Try to slow down that heart rate and take a few deep breaths. Does your son have a pediatrician he sees normally? I suggest taking him to the doctor and explain the situation, all you have to say is that your ex is insisting on bathing your son everyday and that it appears to be doing more harm than good. Get the doctor to check your boy out and if anything a pediatrician (someone licensed to say so) can back up your claim. I'd even suggest getting the doctor to give it to you in writing if he / she agrees to it.

As for him compiling a case against you. Start compiling one yourself. Document everything and do your best to avoid the rest between you two.

Do you have Legal Aid where you live?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

There is a five month wait list for legal aides.

Good idea about the pediatrician.

I gave him cetaphil and told him that if he insists on bathing him daily, he must use it instead of soap.

I suck at documentation. I'm not sure even what counts as documentation and when I finally do have a moment to sit and type in my iPad journal days have gone by. 

I don't even know if journaling counts.

I'm fine sharing custody. I'm not fine losing them entirely. Or even only seeing them every other week. It will devastate me.


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## 06Daddio08 (Jul 26, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> There is a five month wait list for legal aides.
> 
> Good idea about the pediatrician.
> 
> ...


Are you on the waiting list for Legal Aid? 

As for documenting, anything helps to keep you reminded of certain things. I never 'wrote' anything down but I kept every text we sent to each other, I have them all from the last year on my phone with a backup sent to my e-mail, on my PC and on a flash drive. Now, they may not be useable in court as 'documentation' but when it came time to answer certain things I was able to go back and just reread what was said. This wasn't about 'getting her', just protecting myself.

Get one of those 200+ page lined books and start writing things down, use different colored pens for you and him. I once heard that some judges take it more serious when you look organized. I've never had personal experience with that though.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

What do you mean by "you and him" I'm not sure I have written any actual dialogue in my journal.

ETA: I have the paperwork to fill out for legal aide here, but I do not know all of our debt and to ask him about it, shows I am looking for a lawyer. I also have not had time to sit down and fill it out because of the move. 

I would just like SOMETHING to go my way. I feel like he is destroying my very existence right now and relishing in his mistress.


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## 06Daddio08 (Jul 26, 2012)

He's not doing anything but talk, so the feelings you are having are caused by yourself. Don't give him that power over you.

Have you signed up for the Legal Aid?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I'm working on the paperwork now.

I don't know how I went from feeling in control of my emotions to feeling like I can't regain control. It is a very self defeating feeling and it leaves me filled with fear.


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## 06Daddio08 (Jul 26, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> I'm working on the paperwork now.
> 
> I don't know how I went from feeling in control of my emotions to feeling like I can't regain control. It is a very self defeating feeling and it leaves me filled with fear.


The one thing you don't want to get into the habit of doing, is not doing something because the results do not happen right away. Saying "it will take 'x' amount of time for this to happen anyways" is by no means a reason NOT to do it. Empower yourself to get the ball rolling on the things you want to go for and do not allow fear to stop you.

Be aware and proud of what you have gone through and going through, you deserve to give yourself that love but know that at times a step forward may actually end up being a step backwards. That doesn't mean you will not take another one forward, allowing fear to prevent you from moving forward only digs a hole downward. It's a lot harder to climb out of said hole then it is to stagger back for a bit and move forward again.

Most of the 'damage' comes from allowing yourself to play games in your head with the 'what ifs', it paralyzes you from taking the actions you really want to but end up talking yourself out of because of the 20+ scenarios you make up, yet will most likely never happen.

Been there, done that. Stressed out about a lot of things but it's quite amazing how in the end, the deep rooted gut feeling was almost always right. 

You got this, believe in yourself BFGuru. :bunny:


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Updaddy is right (great post BTW). Document everything with dates. It doesn’t need to be a lengthy essay. Just the date and one or two bullets to describe what happened. For example:

15/03/13

- DS eczema bad
- screaming as lotion applied
- said dad bathes him everyday and uses soap

(That by the way, considering Your stbx knows his condition, is abuse.)

Get on that waiting list for legal help.

Some lawyers will give you a half-hour free. Find one and find out what your rights are. S/he will also be able to tell you how much support you and the kids are entitled to legally.

Up is also right when he says don’t play mind games with yourself. Take action.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I'm trying not to play the mind games. I'm just failing this week. I think once I get unpacked and organized it will be better,but for not I can't think straight.

ETA: so my personal journal is not documentation enough? Should I transcribe it all into a notebook more clear and concise?


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## eldubya (Aug 23, 2012)

Of gosh BFGURU:
I went through this stuff so recently my heart pounds just reading your posts. The emotional confusion, dealing with paperwork, the leaving, the spouse messing with your head. And I didn't have kids and the cats were safe! Primal scream time.
A couple things I learned about lawyers and the divorce process. Check into whoever you are thinking for your lawyer...they aren't all equal. Make sure whoever you get can be your advocate in a custody battle since that sounds like your main concern. The only way to find out about the lawyers is by word of mouth. Talk to local folks who recently went through divorce and ask them about their lawyers. Yeah probably not something you want to think about now but you got to bring your head and logic into the mess 
right now.
The second thing I learned about the legal system is try to work it out outside of court. Don't cave in but there has to be some compromising between you. The legal system cares nothing about who did or said what to whom. 
This is sorta vague advice but I think what I'm trying to get across is you gotta fight logic with logic. And that's so blinkin hard when you feel like you are goin nuts!


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## eldubya (Aug 23, 2012)

PS my dear sister is a divorce lawyer and she says the best documentation is pictures. In your case I'm not sure what pictures would be of. But you need objective evidence to prove your side that also appeals to emotions.
Your diary may not be very strong evidence of anything cause it is all your perspective. Judges see both parties in a divorce as being emotional wrecks and pointing fingers at each other.
As I understand you are worried about custody of your kids. Your spouse currently is making more 
money and the kids are bonding with his "other woman". If I were a judge I would see this as a more favorable situation for the kids...so what you gotta do is make a case that the kids are gonna be fine with you. Get your place looking in order and take some pictures. Get pictures of your kids in their rooms, doing their homework around the kitchen table, petting the cat etc. Judges see stability for the kids as paramount so if you can gather anything about the schools they will go to...that can help.


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## eldubya (Aug 23, 2012)

PPS Gosh BFGURU
I seem to be keying in on this legal stuff. But as I understand it emotional claims by either party are gonna be weak. So for example if your spouse claims: "She is unfit as a mom cause she drove them in the rain"...the judge would probably roll his/ her eyes. 
However pictures of your little guys' eczema and receipts showing you took him to the doctor...that will go a LONG way to showing the judge how you are a great mom! Keep the journal for yourself and note down things that happen that CAN be backed up objectively...like the doctor visits etc. Remember that the best evidence is objective and from a party not emotionally wrapped up. Pictures of your kids smiling and happy can speak volumes too!
Oh...but do something for YOURSELF every day. Your favorite music at full blast...a bubblebath...healthydelicious food. I'm so glad your friends brought over food and helped unpack.. That made me cry cause I wish I was there doing that stuff right now. Please ask for the help you want...many goodhearted folks want to help but they don't know how or are afraid to interfere. So you gotta ask!


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Thanks for the information. I feel like a fish out of water right now, but as soon as I get them back on Monday, I will be making doctor appointments.

And the idea that they are bonding with her after one day sickens me.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Ok, filling out this form for legal aide and I don't know his current address, I don't know what his net or gross is (I have a general idea) and I don't know what all of our debts are. What kind of idiot have I been all these years that I don't know this information?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

So, do I get to confront him now? My son just said "Two days ago daddy's friend slept over". What in the flying fvck do I do with this information?

We have been separated two weeks now. I just ugh.


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## Bullwinkle (Feb 4, 2013)

Of course you confront him. Just don't do it in front of the kids.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I always have the children. That's the problem.


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## Bullwinkle (Feb 4, 2013)

Can you wait till they're at school or sleeping?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I always have my five year old. He is not in school.


ETA: their behavior problems made it difficult where I lived to find child care. I have not found it here.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> So, do I get to confront him now? My son just said "Two days ago daddy's friend slept over". What in the flying fvck do I do with this information?
> 
> We have been separated two weeks now. I just ugh.


There is nothing you can do with that information. Unfortunately, that is reality now. Be prepared to answer the kids’ questions in a nonemotional way. Hold your head high. Its his loss.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

He keeps twisting every answer I say into "you are trashing me to the kids"


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> He keeps twisting every answer I say into "you are trashing me to the kids"


If you are handling it respectfully, I wouldn’t worry what he thinks. 

The kids will eventually figure things out on their own.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I hope you are right. They hate it here with me already. I hate being so broke, I can't do anything with them, while he showers them with gifts.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> I hope you are right. They hate it here with me already. I hate being so broke, I can't do anything with them, while he showers them with gifts.


Refresh my memory. Do you have a separation agreement? Are you getting the correct amount of child support (not what he decides is correct, but the amount according to the proper formula)? 

I am seeing the exact thing with a family at school. Mom was working two minimum wage jobs at one point, getting no support and Dad was taking trips and giving the kids expensive gifts. My advice to her ( sheesh, they don’t teach counselling in teacher training....these days maybe they should!), was to document the trips she knew of and the gifts. They are in court and this is information the court should have. You may need it at some point.

The kids will figure out that love and attention are more important than gifts. It may take a while, but they will.

By the way, I as a rule, I avoid getting involved in people’s marriages at school. I’ve been approached by three desperate mothers who have poured everything out to me. The most advice I gave was to see lawyer in one case, and to document in all three. 

Just don’t want people her thinking I overstep my boundaries as a teacher.

Oh, and I gave hugs!


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I can't take hugs right now. I will cry.

All we have is the notarized distribution of debt. But I didn't know exactly what the dollar amount for his debts are and I haven't sat down to go through my stuff. It also has listed what his child support was going to be (865/mos). 

I am not kidding you when I say I have no money for legal assistance. Between rent, utilities, and debt...it is legal aide or feed the kids. I am feeling rather powerless at the moment.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> I can't take hugs right now. I will cry.
> 
> All we have is the notarized distribution of debt. But I didn't know exactly what the dollar amount for his debts are and I haven't sat down to go through my stuff. It also has listed what his child support was going to be (865/mos).
> 
> I am not kidding you when I say I have no money for legal assistance. Between rent, utilities, and debt...it is legal aide or feed the kids. I am feeling rather powerless at the moment.


So, he’s not paying the child support?

You should be eligible for free legal aid. If need be, his wages can be garnished. 

As for the debt, you can’t get money from a stone. Arrange with whomever you are paying to either put it off until you are on your feet or to greatly reduce the payments. If you have to declare bankruptcy, they won’t get anything anyway.

Don’t be ashamed to use local resources like food banks to help out in the meantime. That is what they are there for.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I have no clue where my response went.

I replied that his child support is due to begin at the end of the month since that is when the rent is due and it covers all but 20 dollars of the rent. He has offered it early, but I have food right now and gas in the car. I will survive until pay day even with nothing in my wallet. If I take it early, I am afraid it will just get picked at until I don't have enough for rent and I am trying to figure out how to balance everything properly. 

As soon as I clear a space to sit with all the bills I will be doing that with the debtors. I am just overwhelmed with boxes everywhere at the moment.

Regarding assistance, I am looking for food banks. Hopefully they have something that the boys can eat if I run out of what I have here, as it is not a ton. County assistance is at least a month for approval. Hopefully not longer. They are sending the application out to me, and I just got the child support application legal aide form in the mail today. 

Ok, writing that out does look like I have accomplished something, however small it is. I still feel overwhelmed, but at least I feel a bit productive.

I still want to puke that he, a child behavior specialist thinks it is perfectly fine to flaunt his girlfriend around his children a week after leaving their mom, and I'm not sure I will be able to hold that in. But at least I don't feel like a complete waste today. :/


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## Tron (Jan 31, 2013)

BF,

I understand that you have already applied for legal aid through the county/state. 

I don't know what state you live in, but are there any law schools nearby? Most offer legal aid clinics where people like you can come and talk to a real lawyer. It is free. And if they cannot provide someone to help you right then and there then they may be able to refer you to someone in private practice who would be willing to do some pro bono work for you.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

The closest law college that I am aware of is in the next county. I called them today and they only service that county. 

My mom is coming up tomorrow from AL, weather permitting. Hopefully she can help me get organized and out from under the big house we were renting together. It is still not clean. But I haven't been up there since running it of gas.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> The closest law college that I am aware of is in the next county. I called them today and they only service that county.
> 
> My mom is coming up tomorrow from AL, weather permitting. Hopefully she can help me get organized and out from under the big house we were renting together. It is still not clean. But I haven't been up there since running it of gas.


Sounds like you have been very productive.

Are you getting stuck with all the cleaning at the old house? If so, its your cleaning supplies and your time, time which you could be spending with you children who are going through a major life change. Find out what housecleaners get paid in your area and send him a bill for half.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

No. He actually got stuck with most of it because I ran out of money for gas to get there. I don't know if I have enough gas to get there now actually, but mom will be here and can boost the gas tank if need be.

She is bringing me potato starch so I can try some new gluten free bread recipes.

Waiting to hear back from a few attorneys, even if I can't afford them. Hopefully they can point me in the right direction.

I confronted him on the girlfriend last night. He claims she slept in the couch and he stayed in the boys room all night (plausible but I don't buy it). I said it was inappropriate. He claimed she was just a friend. I told him to quit lying and that I have known him long enough to know when he likes a girl. That he was confusing our kids. He tried to accuse me of saying they were confused because it bothere me. I flat out told him I could care less where he parks his p3nis, but that he was a child psychologist and he knows the ramifications of his actions on his kids. I also said that he had all week to play house with his girlfriend so weekends he did not need to be playing house with her too. That the weekend time was for him and the kids not for dating. It has only been a week. They still think we are getting back together.

He told me I gave ridiculous expectations on him for reconciliation. I laughed. Because all I said was therapy for me, him and marriage counseling, nothing more. It is just laughable. And I despise him. But I'm stuck interacting with him on account of the kids. 

I also reminded him that until there were divorce papers in my hand that we were still legally married in the eyes of the law. And that his girlfriend knows he is a married man. Not sure why I said that, but the rest was cathartic, especially the part about the p3nis parking. 

He still denied it all, and painted me out to be crazy, but I don't care.

I did not say it to reclaim or make him run back to me, but clearly define my expectations for our children. If he does not honor it, well, hopefully legal aide will help.

I am not blind enough to believe he will be single forever. But it is way too soon in our separation to be introducing girlfriends. And you do not introduce them to your kids until it is serious enough to consider commitment.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> He told me I gave ridiculous expectations on him for reconciliation.


What did he mean by that?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

He meant he refused to go to counseling. The only stipulations I gave were therapy for me, him, and marriage counseling.

His stipulations were moving up where he was moving 2 hours from my job, 2.5 from school and 2 hours from the boys therapist.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Does he need therapy? Or just a swift boot to the trousers?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Yes. He has never dealt with the fact that the last church he pastured destroyed his faith, nor the fact that his dad died. He claims he blames his sister for ruining his last moment with his dad, when I was also in the room when he passed, so I know he blames me also. His father actually passed in my hands, after a rapid and brutal fight with cancer. He also gets angry enough to punch walls and put holes in them and has been medicated for anxiety for years, but has never gone to therapy.

If the marriage is dissolving, even healthy people can benefit from therapy. However, he is not healthy. Not saying that I am, but I have spent years working in those issues with therapists. I am not adverse to seeking help when needed. 

He, however, feels he knows more than the therapists...or anyone who would give him advice.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

BFGuru said:


> Yes. He has never dealt with the fact that the last church he pastured destroyed his faith, nor the fact that his dad died. He claims he blames his sister for ruining his last moment with his dad, when I was also in the room when he passed, so I know he blames me also. His father actually passed in my hands, after a rapid and brutal fight with cancer. He also gets angry enough to punch walls and put holes in them and has been medicated for anxiety for years, but has never gone to therapy.
> 
> If the marriage is dissolving, even healthy people can benefit from therapy. However, he is not healthy. Not saying that I am, but I have spent years working in those issues with therapists. I am not adverse to seeking help when needed.
> 
> He, however, feels he knows more than the therapists...or anyone who would give him advice.


Once people go the medication route, they often rationalize that they are "doing something", so "that's enough"


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

That is probably true for most, but his rationale is "I am a therapist so I know more than the rest of them and could do a better job anyway". He is very egocentric and stuck on his self worth.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

BFGuru said:


> That is probably true for most, but his rationale is "I am a therapist so I know more than the rest of them and could do a better job anyway". He is very egocentric and stuck on his self worth.


Yes, but the view in the mirror is distorted.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

I’m confused. He’s a psychologist and you don't have money to put gas in the car? Something’s wrong here.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I spent all my money in the move. Pay day is Friday and I will have money again. And psychologists do not make money. Psychiatrists do. Human services sucks for pay, but he still makes three times the amount I do. He is also giving half of his support tomorrow as well, so it will be split instead of one lump sum. 

This is month one and I am trying to work out the kinks.

But the real problem is we both have wracked up a ton of debt, and now have to figure out how to pay it down with one salary instead of two, even though the debt is divided.

The closer to payday I get the better I feel, but I also get nervous about doing my own finances. 


I will figure it out. It has just been an emotional week. I think I was in that black pit of despair. Not sure how far out I am, but at least I'm not drowning at the moment.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

You’re right, you will figure it out. My H had always done all of the finances. When he left, I was terrified that I would end up ‘going under’. But I did manage. I made an appointment with an advisor at the bank and he helped me make decisions about managing bank accounts and my half of our line of credit debt. My insurance agent helped lower insurance expenses while maintaining coverage. I was fortunate in that my H continued paying some of the house bills, but I knew that was temporary. By the time he came back, I was on my feet financially and had even paid down some of the debt. It was an incredibly liberating feeling. You will get there too. One step at a time. You’ll be fine.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Ugh. Horrible day. Non stop tantruming five year old. Phone left at the old house so I can't work on nine year olds school enrollment. Ran out of gas to get to house to clean it and retrieve said phone, and just want to curl up in a ball right now. 

I woke up feeling so in control of my emotions today, and lost all of that the moment I got home from the gynecologist. 

He told me about how he felt when his first wife left, and I felt he could relate. He also told me he always regarded me as strong and one that just rolls with whatever life throws at me. I felt empowered by our conversation and arrived home to pandemonium. And now I keep thinking "what on earth did he see in me because I am a basket case right now!"


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I guess I just screwed up. D12 has been screaming at me, telling me how much she hates it here and her life. She keeps telling me its my fault and that we (her dad and I) didn't have to separate. She follows up with its both of our faults her life sucks. She refuses to befriend any of the kids at school and refuses to do her homework. She hates the school and just wants to go to (insert school district where her dad lives). I have already locked myself in the bathroom once today trying to avoid them seeing me cry ov the hateful things she is saying. I know she is 12, and this is rough, but it has been a horrible day and I just couldn't keep it together anymore. So she drops this line about going to school where her dad lives and I just sigh and tell her to do her homework. 

She then mumbles "I love you" and I am so worn down today all I could respond with was "I'm beginning to wonder". She ran off. So great, I just upset her further.

I can't please anyone today.

I don't know how to fix it.

I want to scream "this is your dads fault!"

I want to scream "she is his freaking girlfriend and he has been eyeing her this entire time!"

I want him to stop making it so god damn fun at his place that they hate coming home because I have to deal with school work and the mundane aspects of life.

I want my kids to be happy and there is not a damn thing I can do about it right now. And I have no idea how to deal with the disrespect without them hating me more. It is just pecking away at my self esteem and making me feel like the horrible person he has claimed that I am.


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## ReGroup (Dec 6, 2012)

I think this is why Chip suggest that we tell our kids the truth as opposed to covering up the lies. BFG, you need to tell your daughter what's going on.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

ReGroup said:


> I think this is why Chip suggest that we tell our kids the truth as opposed to covering up the lies. BFG, you need to tell your daughter what's going on.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Do not be a silent co-conspirator.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Begin by going and hugging your daughter and telling her you love her.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

My therapist said to take the high road. And because I agreed to the separation he claims it was mutual. So by me explaining things he claims I am trash talking him to the kids.

My five year old is tantruming...yet again. It is 10:30 at night and I have neighbors under me. I can't do this anymore. I'm rapidly losing it.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> My therapist said to take the high road. And because I agreed to the separation he claims it was mutual. So by me explaining things he claims I am trash talking him to the kids.
> 
> My five year old is tantruming...yet again. It is 10:30 at night and I have neighbors under me. I can't do this anymore. I'm rapidly losing it.


You CAN do it. You are strong.

And I agree with not trash talking to the kids. Do not make your fight theirs.


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## DumpedAgain (Feb 14, 2013)

My Wife has totaly alienated me from my son in college
I haven't spoken to him since I filed 5 weeks ago, he won't
return calls, texts or emails. 

I keep trying tho, sending texts, emails and voice mails
that I love him. Gotta keep trying


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## ReGroup (Dec 6, 2012)

BFG, the truth will eventually come out - better it come from you. 

Your daughter is blaming you for the separation. That's unfair. You can tell her in a age appropriate way... No bashing, no dissing, etc. Go to PBartenders Thread... zillard explains it well and demonstrates how to approach this situation with your daughter.

The onus is on your husband; it shouldn't be on you. You are simply stating a fact.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

What does his doctor say about your 5-year old's tantrums? What have you tried?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Tantrums are from his PDD and the fact that he is not in a routine at all. It is a catch 22. The house is not in order and everything is different and he has no structure, so he tantrums. But the tantrums stop me from putting the house in order and giving him structure lol.

We are going gluten fre and dairy free on top of all of this, but my mom has been out. Last night she took him and laid on him (for some reason the pressure helps him calm quicker) gently during the last tantrum. I walked outside and around the block at a fast pace to get myself calmed down. He had five rages yesterday so I was at my wits end on top of dealing with big brother and his impulses that keep hurting his brother. I just couldn't deal with the last one.

I sat on the step thinking I was glad my mom was there and yet afraid if what would happen if he has another day like that when she is gone. 

Husbeast gave me half of the child support today. Not that I can use it as it goes toward rent, but at least it's there. He will give the rest next paycheck.

I also got paid today. Which is good, but I think it is all spent and then some.

Part of my wishes my mom would move up here.

Part of me doesn't want her that close all the time.

Trying to focus in positives today. As such, good things that happened, I was in,y able to clean at the old house an hour, but in that hour discovered a mother load of hangers and some giant pillow forms both if which I won't have to buy now. D12 came home and said one of the popular girls complimented her shirt. She was also listed advanced in reading. Made bread they all ate that was gluten free. Made three meals they liked this week. Mom is here and although our relationship has been strained in the past, I appreciate having someone here to talk to.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Is your son being seen by an Occupational Therapist? 

Pressure can indeed be helpful. We use weight blankets, weighted vests, weighted laps and shoulder pads, but they are used in a prescribed way. (No child should ever be left alone with a weighted blanket as their use needs to be carefully monitored. Misuse has resulted in death.) Properly used, many kids with autism and PDD find them calming. 

Joint pressure also helps some kids.

OT’s can assess a child’s needs and can also suggest sensory strategies. One of our most aggressive students loved playing in a sink full of water, for example. It calmed him. Sensory breaks can easily be built into a child’s day. 

I can give you some more ideas if you like., but I would strongly recommend an oR assessment if he hasn’t had one.

Glad to hear things are looking up for your daughter!


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Frost, not yet. They were going to be implementing OT into my older boys day before the school change. We are in the wait list for the official PDD diagnosis. Who knows, it could be a personality disorder with how bright he is, but I have learned laying in him normally cuts a rage in half time wise. His psychiatrist suggested taking him to Under Armor for a compression shirt. He said to try it on and in five seconds we would know if it would work or not. I tried a few days ago, but it was already too late and he was tired and too far gone. He actually eloped from the store. Will be trying again today.

I'm all for any ideas to hell this little ******. I also know once he is in school there is access to OT as needed.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

How are things going, BFG?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Hey, thanks for asking. I'm extremely busy and tired of the fights and am not sure why I let him get me as angry as he does, but I do lately. He keeps saying he won't let "her" come over when the kids are there (as per the kids' request now) and every weekend I get them back, she has been there. I don't even ask. They just tell me. 

Today I went to the old house to pick up a final load of things. I left my piano locked in the house as much as I hated to do it. He told me there was just a little bit in the foyer and it would fit in my van. It wouldn't. He mis calculated so I had to go through things and throw things away and pack and repack all while the boys were fighting and the neighbors were stopping by asking questions. 

I was supposed to meet him to pick up S9's new epipen that I told him to purchase. I was an hour and a half late, due to all the stuff that I had to wade through at the house and kept in contact with him during that time. He however became royally pissed off. Telling me he had things he "wanted to do tonight". He yelled at me and told me no one is going to help me and that this pattern of being late has been going on for 16 years and it's why we aren't together (always a new reason, even if I do tend to run late often, but he completely miscalculated how long it would take for me to get the last load and would not listen to anything I said explaining it what happened.

I had to tell him we agreed not to have these arguments in front of the children so please stop. He just doesn't care when he is mad, who he upsets. 

I was not invited to family Easter at the inlaws. My family is across the country. He had the children as weekends are his, and I worked instead. I just ran myself ragged so I didn't have to think about them not being there.

I cleaned the entire apartment right before they left on Friday. He brought them back and did not make D12 go to school due to a "sore throat and fever". The kids unlocked the door and went in the apartment to wait for me to get home (about 5 to 10 minutes after they got there). In that time he sat and let them trash the apartment. I was annoyed, but more happy to see the kids than annoyed. 

I stayed up too late giving them the Easter baskets a friend of my mother's bought for the kids (who told me to tell them they were from me) and talking about their weekend with dad after work. So I only had about 3 hours of sleep before having to get up to get things done, and there was candy and Easter grass everwhere in addition to the mess they made before LOL. 

My apartment is finally set straigh almost. I think a quick vaccuum in the morning will solve the rest. 

I need to get back to therapy. I need to stop being so angry. I can't get over his lies and his refusal to acknowledge how aweful he has been to me during our marriage. I'm tired of taking all the blame even with the kids and finally told my daughter that he was the one that asked for a separation, and that he has asked before. I finally stopped telling him no. 

I don't know if it was right or wrong, but my nerves can't take being blamed for this by everyone I ever held dear. She became livid with her father and insisted he didn't love her anymore and it took hours to convince her that although I could not make her dad happy anymore, he still loved her very much. 

She refused to even speak to him on the phone the rest of the night. I feel bad about it in some ways, but her attitude toward me has taken a complete 180 and she is my sweet darling little girl again. So I don't know if what I did was right or wrong anymore. I just know she seems a little more at peace here for the moment.

This has turned into a novel. I need to stop rambling. I have therapy on Thursday to talk through some of this. And I finally filled out the county assistance forms. Just have to figure out how to get copies of everything to send in to the office for verification.

Thanks for asking.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Thanks for the update. 

Don’t explain yourself to him. You had already done him the courtesy of letting him know you were going to be late. You don’t owe him more than that. Trying to explain, I’m sure, was an exercise in bashing your head against a wall. Spare yourself the headache in future. And if he keeps harping, just say, “I am not okay with where this conversation is going” and walk away if needed. He’s not listening anyway.

I’m glad things are better between you and your daughter. Don’t second-guess yourself. As long as you didn’t ‘bash’ her father and simply told her that he was the one who wanted the split, I don’t think you have anything to feel guilty about.

Take care.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> Hey, thanks for asking. I'm extremely busy and tired of the fights and am not sure why I let him get me as angry as he does, but I do lately. He keeps saying he won't let "her" come over when the kids are there (as per the kids' request now) and every weekend I get them back, she has been there. I don't even ask. They just tell me.
> 
> Today I went to the old house to pick up a final load of things. I left my piano locked in the house as much as I hated to do it. He told me there was just a little bit in the foyer and it would fit in my van. It wouldn't. He mis calculated so I had to go through things and throw things away and pack and repack all while the boys were fighting and the neighbors were stopping by asking questions.
> 
> ...



Hey BFG, you don't need to stop rambling on our account. If you need to talk we are here.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Thanks both of you. I have no idea why he makes me rage so bad lately. It's primal. I just can't stand any discussion with him when he starts picking fights and want to lash out. Some times I'm o.k. and make it through without, other times I do lash out. 

Pretty sure calling him a lying fvcking a$$hole was not the best approach, but it sure did feel good at the time LOL.

Meeting with S9's school tomorrow over his allergy meds. Have dual copies of his psych eval and hopefully picking up a copy of the autism diet prescribed by the psychiatrist on the way in.

As a compromise, I have scheduled another appointment with the allergist. He is due for retesting anyway. If he can calm my nerves, great. If not...me and the lawyer will be dealing with this...who I have already called. Thank you mom for that Legal Shield membership.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Today was spent with me bending and trying to compromise with a school district while they did not. I feel depressed about it. Like I could not protect my marriage and now I cannot protect my son. I hate the mind games I play with myself.

My daughter told me today that "Daddy said you make more money than him".

I said "Your dad makes 28 dollars an hour and I make 11. You do the math. Who do you think makes more?"

She actually said that I did because I worked 12 hour shifts.

I explained that I worked 36 hours a week while her dad worked 40 or more. 

"Why do you need child support though mom? Why do you have to take dad's money?"

"Because he is your dad, and you are his child and as such he has to support you. I don't spend that money on me at all. It all goes directly to rent and it's not even enough for that. Without it, not only would we not live here, but I would not be able to feed you either, which is still very difficult".

Seriously? What on earth is he up to trying to tell these kids I make more money than him?

Secondly, I'm sick of hearing A's name. I hate that they asked him not to have her over, and yet, all he did was decrease the amount of time she was over. She still is there at least one day every weekend. Can he not simply be their dad? Must he have his w4ore over as well? It's going to be a month separated NEXT week. Seriously, are there any legal ramifications I can have to stop this idiocy? 

I don't pretend to believe he will stay single forever. But damn. Give these kids some time to get used to the idea of us no longer together.

D asked him if we would reconcile. He told her probably not. Again, I knew as much, but quick fvcking with her head this early in the game. She has tried to harm herself in her depression. 

Oh, but A is just a friend. Nothing more he claims. 

Why is her laundry detergent at your house giving our daughter an allergic reaction? Seriously, both you and I know you would never spend that kind of money on soap for a name brand. 

My mother today seems to think all our problems stemmed from him walking away from pastoring. I had to inform her things have been bad from the beginning. That while he was a pastor he flipped out, punched holes in our kitchen cabinets and screamed at me so much it scared our kids and I grabbed them without shoes on. Simply them and a diaperbag sitting by the door and left unsure if I would return. 

No. He never hit me. But that day I was afraid he would. Why did I come back then? Because some unseen deity would deem me unfit to enter pardise if I left the man I took vows to? Really? WHy did I allow this mental anguish for all these years? 

And why did I cry when it was over?

Tonight I fear I will never trust another man again. That I have been doomed to a life of solitude. It's not even about sex. I could go the rest of my life without that. The idea of swapping body fluids with someone else honestly grosses me out. He took my virginity on our honeymoon and I've never slept with anyone else. But companionship. Never coming home to tell someone about my day. A life of therapies for my boys and appointments with teachers. A life with no one to share joys or trials with. That has me depressed tonight. 

It has for a few days.

But who would I ever trust with my children again? 

It's just a blah sort of week as the reality of the bills sets in and how much I have to do in order to take care of these kids by myself, even if he does see them every weekend. 

And I'm just...lonely. Very much so lonely.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Sorry for what you are going through. If there is anything we can do to support, just ask.

This stuff sucks. 

Trust...well it never totally returned for me after Mrs W had her affair. How could it? And sometimes I miss it so much, but overall, I feel I am stronger, and take a much more realistic approach to life.

You will meet someone. Knowing the risks you will manage them and there will be good things in your future.

If you need to talk, to share, do it here. Just while you sort it out.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

I’m so sorry for everything you are going through. I know it sounds like just words, but things will get better. Take care of yourself. Do little things just for you, even if its just a bubble bath or a scented candle in your room, a walk. Take time for yourself whenever you can.

I started a grateful journal when my H left and I was feeling so overwhelmed. Every night I wrote three things that I was grateful for that day. At first I really had to work at it, and my entries were things like ’the sunshine’, 'the cool breeze’, as time went on, I was able to write things like ‘I am grateful that I was able to clean the outside top floor windows by myself’ (H always did that) 'I am grateful that my daughter gave me a hug’. ‘I’m grateful I got the flat tire fixed by myself’. When I look back, some of the entries now seem so trivial, but at the time they reminded me that even in my pain, there were things to be grateful for. And putting things I accomplished that H always did gave me a feeling of accomplishment. 

BFG, you are strong. You can do this. The loneliness is normal, but it will ease. It will.

Hang in there.

Hug.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Thanks. I don't have a journal persae but I refuse to type negativity on facebook, in case he sees it. There is where I share the "good" in my days.

Like when my son woke up a couple hours ago just to give me a hug. And with his head coming to my chin now and him feeling too big for hugs, and never really being a huggy baby, he wrapped those skinny nine year old arms around me, said nothing but hugged me. Sometimes I think he still needs to be reminded he is still my baby and not just the forgotten middle child. And as I sniffed his head, a flood of infant memories came back to me. He held on for a good two minutes. And then asked me a question about Phineas and Ferb as though it was the most serious question in the world, and went back to bed. 

I have always lived for those kids. They are now my world.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

And they are lucky to have you.

As well as being ok for you, you will be ok for them.

The crap you are going through now gives you strength beyond what you can imagine.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Wen to IC today. Extremely stressed over bills, but had boys with me and could only focus on that as I didn't want to talk about how I really feel about their dad in front of them.

It dawned on me there, although I've wanted to gouge his eyes out and got into an argument with him on the phone Monday, I have not locked myself in the bathroom to cry this week. I'd say that is a small plus.

I still feel rather blah about everything, and it angers me that I have fought so hard and so long to do the right thing and I am the one struggling while he lives it up free. I just don't know if I'll ever get over that. But at least I went a week without tears.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> Wen to IC today. Extremely stressed over bills, but had boys with me and could only focus on that as I didn't want to talk about how I really feel about their dad in front of them.
> 
> It dawned on me there, although I've wanted to gouge his eyes out and got into an argument with him on the phone Monday, I have not locked myself in the bathroom to cry this week. I'd say that is a small plus.
> 
> I still feel rather blah about everything, and it angers me that I have fought so hard and so long to do the right thing and I am the one struggling while he lives it up free. I just don't know if I'll ever get over that. But at least I went a week without tears.


Small victories add up. Here’s to lots more small victories!


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## Stella Moon (Nov 22, 2012)

(((BFGuru Hugs!!!)))


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## Bullwinkle (Feb 4, 2013)

Baby stepf, BF.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Hey BFG, if you get a chance drop us a line in your thread. Tell us what's going on. Big stuff little stuff. Just want to know how you are doing.

I'd love to know what music you like too. Music is an interest of mine as well I have an old uprigh piano I play a bit. What do you play?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Meh. Not a good day. I look forward to Mondays because I get the kids back. I'm so excited to see them, only to have them tell me SHE was there. My husband was told by our daughter that she did not want her around as much. She is till there every weekend at least once. She spends the night. She left her dogs there all weekend. Wow, what a foggy mess. The boy refused to ever have dogs in our home. SHE TOOK MY DAUGHTER SHOPPING ALONE.

My daughter is confused. She likes her, but hates the time she infringes on her dad time. Why can he not respect that? I don't even know what the right thing to do is. I don't know if I should push for a morality clause in the custody agreement or not. They are already bonding with this woman and yet as much as they want her around, they don't. He would simply lie about it anyway.

I just don't know what the right thing to do is. 

Regarding music, I'm into learning Bach right now since finding out he is in the geneology (mine) last year, albeit not directly, but there none the less.

I am a classically trained vocalist but cannot play the accompaniment to be able to sing along haha. I'd love to hire a pianist just so I can sing, but that's not an option right now.

I play more broadway showtunes to sing along with normally. I am also learning guitar...well...not this year I haven't worked on it, but I started lessons last year. And every now and then I tinker with my violin but again, time has not permitted that in a while.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> Meh. Not a good day. I look forward to Mondays because I get the kids back. I'm so excited to see them, only to have them tell me SHE was there. My husband was told by our daughter that she did not want her around as much. She is till there every weekend at least once. She spends the night. She left her dogs there all weekend. Wow, what a foggy mess. The boy refused to ever have dogs in our home. SHE TOOK MY DAUGHTER SHOPPING ALONE.
> 
> My daughter is confused. She likes her, but hates the time she infringes on her dad time. Why can he not respect that? I don't even know what the right thing to do is. I don't know if I should push for a morality clause in the custody agreement or not. They are already bonding with this woman and yet as much as they want her around, they don't. He would simply lie about it anyway.
> 
> ...


Hey BFG. Glad you are holding up. Sorry it continues to be emotionally rough.

Question for you....where do you think / hope this is all going? Do you think it is over with your husband, or do you hope for reconciliation at some future stage? If you could wave a magic wand and he would be willing to come back, would you do it? Do you have any sort of thoughts about where you will be in a year?

Musically, Bach is good. I love the precision of his work. Show tunes are good too, but Bach is more me. I'm impressed to be able to say I have communicated with a relative, however distant 

Have you considered putting an ad on Craiglist to find a piano player you can sing with? Or notices up at local music schools? Or find a local amateur music group? I guess time is one impediment to that, but you have to have some you time.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Where do I think this is going? There is no reconciliation. He has refused my only stipulation which was therapy. I also recognize now that I allowed him to be emotionally abusive. No he did not call me ugly or fat, but told me multiple times that "any other man would have had an affair on me" and has convinced me at points that I am so worthless as a wife and mother that my kids would be better off if I were dead. He did not say that directly, but the end result of his insistent mind games really got to me after a while. 

I KNOW I will eventually be better off without him. I know he will not wait long to find another woman. He has never been without a woman in his life. He hopped from girl to girl to girl before we met and never even went two weeks before dating again. 

HOWEVER, it is my kids I am concerned with. How does his games affect them? How long until he finally admits this woman having sleepovers with their dad is an actual girlfriend? He should not have her around them yet. It's that simple. He is a child psychologist and should know better. 

He also needs to get up and start reading labels. I am getting tired of him showing me things he bought for the boys and me barely turning the box over to read the back before saying "This is not allowed acording to their diet" and him yelling at me about it. Take some responsibility and actually do this diet right. I cannot afford to buy food for them when they are with him or I would, but we are failing with this diet royally because he refuses to lable read. All he looks for is "gluten free" on the front of the box. But the diet is gluten, dairy, aspartame and red dye # 40 as well. Does it take some getting used to? Yes, but he has had just as long as I have to get used to this and yet, he keeps yelling at me for not giving him actual brands he could buy, when I do.

These are the things that make me want to try for full custody. But I am not sure that is in the children's best interest either. 


Regarding communicated with a relative? I do not understand what you are saying there LOL.

Regarding Craigslist? No. Not yet. I could pay my piano teacher I studied with a year and a half ago when I wanted to refresh my fingers, but I don't have the money yet. I also studied guitar with her so I have an excellent rapport with her and she has offered to do a modified lesson just so I can sing classical again. 

Right now I am too busy trying to get the kids established in school and obtain food stamps (which looks like I may not qualify at the moment and that sucks) and medical assistance. There are therapies I need to establish (one of which may be music therapy for the boys, which would be awesome). I'm just delving into this world of autism spectrum disorders for the first time. I thought I knew a lot about it, but I don't. So once all that calms down I will be ready to jump back into nursing clinical...not seeing any "me" time in the near future. LOL.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Wow, you certainly have your hands full! I don’t understand how a child psychologist could make some of the decisions that your H is making. Guess it takes all kinds

How are the boys doing with going between houses?

Not that I would presume to speak for Wazza, but I think he meant that he is impressed that he knows you and that you are descended from Bach. (He seems to communicate more clearly when wet t-shirts and mud fights are involved.......Wazza that is, not Bach!).


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Frostflower said:


> Wow, you certainly have your hands full! I don’t understand how a child psychologist could make some of the decisions that your H is making. Guess it takes all kinds
> 
> How are the boys doing with going between houses?
> 
> Not that I would presume to speak for Wazza, but I think he meant that he is impressed that he knows you and that you are descended from Bach. (He seems to communicate more clearly when wet t-shirts and mud fights are involved.......Wazza that is, not Bach!).


Hey, I understood what I meant!!!!! You guys need to keep up!

BFG, you need some you time, however small. No one wins if you crack.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Bach preferred wet tshirts probably as well. He was quite the womanizer. 

Today is starting horrid. Both kids nervous about state testing, S with allergies informed me that the cafeteria monitors did not follow his allergy plan so I had to go have a conversation with the principal already this a.m. 

HDMI cord stopped working with the audio last night so the fact that I got rid of cable seemed like a moot point until I plugged my keyboard speakers into the computer and then we had t.v. again.

That part was well until my stupid cat went crawling through the cords this a.m. knocking the speakers onto the laptop, which now has a shattered screen and cannot be read. I am giving myself a kink in my neck trying to look up from the floor (the only place the cord reaches) in order to see what I'm typing on the t.v. and now I look forward to August and realize, that I have no P.C. to take to school with me. This sucks ten ways from Sunday. I am so angry right now it's not even funny. 

Cat will be lucky to survive the next 24 hours. It was a 1k dollar laptop and I will never be able to afford to replace it. Ugh.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

You are sure not having a good run right now. It has to get better!


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Yeah nope. Today has been one sh!t storm after another. I have some major yelling to do at my college. I may not be able to return at this rate. 

I just ugh. 

Multiple issues with food at my son's school.

Bills going to collections. 

Can I crawl under a rock now and pretend I don't exist?


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> Yeah nope. Today has been one sh!t storm after another. I have some major yelling to do at my college. I may not be able to return at this rate.
> 
> I just ugh.
> 
> ...


Rock...no you can't. Your kids need you to get through this.

College....what is the issue?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

What isn't the issue? Because of mono I had to take a semester off. I have been trying to register again and re-enroll and no one has been calling back. Finally they contact me, I drive down to figure things out. They charged me for the entire semester last year even though I didn't attend a single class. So I have to appeal that. Then the nursing department gives me my re-enrollment packet. I have only missed ONE semester. Only 3 months. They are not only saying I have to retake an exam I took in December, but telling me I have to resubmit my child abuse clearance ($10), State criminal check ($15), FBI check ($45), And drug test ($45). I also have to get another TB test and ANOTHER physical. I just had all of these done less than 6 months ago. I am STILL paying off the medical portions of the bills. I do not have a single dime to put towards these things, and my insurance is not going to pay for a repeat of the physical/TB test. 

None of these can be paid for with financial aid because it has to be done before classes start. Financial aid doesn't kick in until you have been in class a month. 

Oh, and the fun part is, because nobody bothered to communicate anything to me so that I could at least prepare, all of it is due April 15th. The clearances take WEEKS to come back. 2-4 weeks depending on the agency. 

After all of that I could barely hold myself together. Somehow I managed to, just because kids were clinging to me, but I'm not guaranteeing I won't burst into tears when the kids are all in bed.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

I’m sorry all of this is on your shoulders, BFG. Hang in there. Hug.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

How are you doing? Do things look any better in the morning?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Hi, all. This is BF's, well, BFF, in real life. She asked me to post on her behalf. Her computer died completely and quick horrifying demise.....she has canceled internet and wanted to let you all know that it will be a while before she posts again. Good thoughts will be appreciated for her and her children as she processes through everything. Peace out, K


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> Hi, all. This is BF's, well, BFF, in real life. She asked me to post on her behalf. Her computer died completely and quick horrifying demise.....she has canceled internet and wanted to let you all know that it will be a while before she posts again. Good thoughts will be appreciated for her and her children as she processes through everything. Peace out, K


Please pass on our best wishes. I will leave her thread on my watch list in case she comes back. Glad she has real life support there!


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Hi guys, it is a quiet moment at work so I am sneaking on. Work is the only likely place I can get online anymore. The boys diets prohibit me from going to a restaurant to get wifi.

It has been a horrible week culminating with the computer dying and my father yelling t me accusing me of cussing him out because I simply said the word sh!t instead of "stuff" in a sentence. I was driving and became so upset I almost lost control of the car. It was the straw that broke the camel's back for me. I was having mild panic attacks for a few days but after that I couldn't breathe. I screamed "goodbye!" And hung up after yelling back at him.

The fact is, him accusing me of disrespecting him at that moment was ludicrous and a double standard. He cusses as well. Just doesn't like people to know he does.

The major stress is money. The special diet the kids are on is expensive. I have only been nibbling as to make sure the kids have enough food to eat before I eat, and sometimes we run out before I get to eat. I don't have a huge appetite anyway, and figure, I have some really cheap crap food stored at work and can catch up on calories then. Apparently it isn't enough because by the time he came to pick up the kids on Friday I was shaking handing out their dinner. He asked why I was shaking. I nonchalantly said, because I haven't eaten enough today. He asked why.i said because there isn't enough money for food so I am making sure they eat first. He actually told me he "understands what I mean because he has no money either". Um...he just got paid that day. I did not confront it. It was pointless. 

I know he is giving a little more than half of what he should be paying in child support. I spoke with a lawyer last week. I cannot afford to retain one so I am afraid to approach this legally. 

I may or may not qualify for food stamps. They told me with what he is providing in child support, I am on the border. So if I do qualify, it won't be much at all. They are also telling me I have to retain the kids health insurance and that medical assistance will only be a secondary insurance for them since they already have insurance. My job won't let me drop them until they are covered by another insurance. So basically I am stuck with laying 350-400 a month for their health insurance, on top of their copays.

I am afraid to file for more support. Not only do I not know how, but I am afraid of the backlash.

I convinced myself I would lose everything soon and,in my desperation felt like I would end up homeless on top of everything. I blurted out to my best friend (who posted for me a few days ago), I might as well just give them to their dad and drive off a bridge at this rate. Of course she wasn't happy and now has me calling her every day to make sure I don't do anything stupid. 

I feel a little more in control of myself now. And I would not have done it anyway. i was in crisis mode. With nursing school not working out, and the money just being gone, losing access to any form of outlet with disconnecting the Internet, (I can't afford the monthly fee) I just lost it. I am not sure how the schools will contact me now either because I don't have email access anymore. They do not mail things or call. I was just overwhelmed with it all and snapped. I spent the day hyperventilating and sobbing. I was a horrible mother that day and could not get over it. No matter how hard I tried.

I know I have to push for more support. I just have so many fears. And if, with all the bills, he really is strapped, will the kids suffer when they are with him? Should our debt really be split evenly with me making less anyway? Does the fact that his student loans from his masters degree are due even matter? Will he sue for full custody and win if I pursue this further? Will it just get unbearably nasty if I do? So many fears paralyzing me to action. And yet,I wish something would just come easily for me. 

I didn't ask for any of this. I tried to save my marriage. When it looked irreparable, I told him to suck it up long enough for me to get through school and we could discuss again then if he still felt that way. Instead he found another woman that he still denies exists as his woman and walked, leaving me holding the mess. 

He walks, and I lose control of everything in my life as he enjoys the easy life, while making me look like the b!tch to everyone.

At least my son piped up when I was shaking at dinner and told him I didn't eat often anymore with "yeah she never eats", so the kids are backing up what I say.

That is the week, in a nutshell. Hoping next week is better.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Thinking if you BFG. It sucks.

Is nursing school gone forever or just for now?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I don't know. I have contested the charges, and am trying to figure out how to afford to get all of my clearances redone. The clearances and drug tests cannot be taken care of with financial aid because they must be done before classes start. 

I can't afford them though, so I don't know how to handle it.

It will be two weeks before I find out if the charges from last semester will be dropped. I have paper work showing I did not intend to attend last semester. They are claiming I did not withdraw properly, but I could not have withdrawn the way they wanted because it mandated handing things in personally when I was on bed rest and quarantined basically. I have doctors notes to prove it and my application for re enrollment dated the week after classes started for the intention of returning the following semester. I am hoping that is enough. Even if it doesn't take care of the clearances yet.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Fingers crossed. Hopefully they will show some compassion. But if not, I hope you can see it as a delay, not a permanent blockage.

Not eating is not good. Can you compromise the kid's diet a bit to still get the benefit and look after yourself. You are no good to them if you get sick!

Diets were for ASD, right?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Yeah, it is for ASD, but I can't compromise because it takes up to a month to flush their systems from it anyway and it was severely compromised over Easter. I have food at work. It's cheap stuff like 33 cent burritos LOL. I can't keep it in the house, but I tend to eat all night when I work so it doesn't feel so bad normally. I was just running all day Friday and overspent my calories. Good for him to see it though, so when I do get the guts to file for more custody he can't say I'm doing it to be a b!tch.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

At the library today. I got a library card yesterday. This should help a little when I can get here. My has life been busy, and hectic and a little bit of ugh.

Where to start...um...everything filed for medical assistance for the kids, just waiting to hear back about them. I filed for case management to help organize all the entities the boys will be involved with. 

Pushed through and begged for help at the hospital and they wiped clean my surgical bill. 

I DO NOT HAVE AN STD! He can keep the marriage wrecking w4ore now.

I threated to go into prostitution in order to pay all the school bills they insist I have to pay, and suddenly there was an application for an emergency aid fund given to me. I now have to do a ton of leg work but they may cover all my clearances. I just need to find out if the school can pay directly for the clearances. I am not sure where to start looking there.

I did my first set of re-entrance tests and passed. I have my dosage calc to do and the clearances and that will be o.k.

I need to find childcare for school though.

HE is filing for bankruptcy. Going to a lawyer tonight. Not sure how that will affect things. Or if it will inhibit me going to school or not. They are repoing my van in spite of me paying extra every month to get it caught up. It is in his name anyway. But apparently everything I am doing is not enough. I am not sure what I will do about a vehicle, but hoping i can find something cheaper, regardless since they are taking the van anyway.

Um...she sleeps over all weekend every weekend now. 

He asked if I minded if she babysat my son while I took my tests today. I said "absolutely not". My friend from work watched him instead. 

I have more stable days than not lately, so that's good. My main stressors are money. It's always money.

I filed with domestic relations. We will see what that reveals.

And um...hmm...I think that may be it?

One positive, I finally found a flour and recipe for bread my kids will eat that is safe for their diets. The down side...they've devoured two loaves in 48 hours haha. That's a good problem to have. At least it won't go stale. 

Well, that's it for now. Hopefully I can hop on more now that i have a library card. Hope to see you all a bit more often.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> At the library today. I got a library card yesterday. This should help a little when I can get here. My has life been busy, and hectic and a little bit of ugh.
> 
> Where to start...um...everything filed for medical assistance for the kids, just waiting to hear back about them. I filed for case management to help organize all the entities the boys will be involved with.
> 
> ...


Glad you have access again and glad there is progress. Keep plugging, you will get through.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Good to hear from you, BFG. 

Can he be so financially strapped that he has to file for bankruptcy? He makes more than you do. The reason I am asking is because the same thing is happening to a separated mom at school. Her husband is filing, but as she has always done the books for his company, she knows that he has more than he is declaring. 

Are you finding a difference since you changed the kids’s diets?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Hey all, scratch the library for now. Apparently there is 60 dollars worth of overdue fines for me at another library in the county. I remember it now, but this happened back in 2009. They um...took my library card away haha. I promised my daughter I would try to figure it out though. 

Thank goodness work has wifi for the patients.

Today has been hard. Tomorrow will be one year since his father died...in my arms. I was heavily involved in his care when on hospice. And although I wouldn't trade that experience because I loved him dearly, it is causing me emotional pain thinking about the family get together they are having tomorrow. SHE was personally invited. I was not. I feel pretty outcast by his family and he still denies any actions he took that caused this or that he was involved with her before the separation. 

I pretty much gave him the fourth degree today. I told him she had no business being at a family function, that his sisters are enabling his behavior because they are nothing more than a bunch of cheats themselves, and that he walked and I lost an entire family, but that he was messing with MY kids. I told him that he was rebounding and that no, I do not want him back anymore because I do not trust him anymore, but he had no business bringing her around them, that they have bonded with her and now when she does something to piss her off or vice versa and they break up, MY kids are going to be grief stricken again. (I never once called them his kids as horrible as that sounds). 

He doesn't understand why our middle child ishaving outbursts at school (got in school suspension for making what was considered a racial slur). I told him, kids do these things when their families break up.

I told him his mistress will never do the things I did for his family. And that she will never care for his mother and take care of her like I did. He said "I know" haha. 

I even told him "you do realize your dad regretted until the day he died what he did to your mom?" (He had an affair on his mom when STBX was a kid). He said no he didn't. I informed him that he most definitely did and told me in the hospital. I know his father would be disappointed in him. He would not judge him, but he would be the one family member that reached out to me. And he would have told him to fix his marriage.

I'm am just angry that once again his actions cause me loss. That I will grieve alone tomorrow. That my daughter has cried over me not being at this gathering. And he couldn't care less. Actually, I expected it from him. I guess it's his sisters and the refusal to invite me that has me more upset.


Regarding the boys, I think the diet is starting to make some positive changes. Most tantrums now happen at what I call the bewitching hour. I can predict it to be when I am making dinner every day lol. But predictability is half the key. My youngest had three unprompted bowel movements and no accidents this week and even tried to potty yesterday by himself and told me later nothing happened, but he tried, alone and this is huge. I didnot even give him his laxative very day because he was going often enough to pull back.

Things are normalizing some. Finances are still overwhelming most days, and I'm still trying to figure out county assistance, but I don't feel like driving my car off the bridge anymore. I can breathe in spite of the anxiety and I'm starting to enjoy my kids more.

We found a bread recipe they like. We made fake grilled cheese. S5 loved it.

I try not to stop...ever...when I do I get depressed. As long as I keep moving even if it is reading a book I am fine. The moment I have nothing to do is when I start the pity parties. 

I really miss easy Internet access. REALLY. 


Regarding his finances, yes I believe he is strapped. Do I care? No. He caused this mess. We could have weathered bankruptcy together and maybe even avoided it, but we were never worth working on. Oh well. I filed for child and spousal support with the county. I may not take the spousal just because I know he has 50k in student loans as well, but I will show him what I am entitled to and tell him if he does not start honoring my wishes with who comes I contact with the kids and (he actually allowed her to babysit them which is a huge no for me). Also if he does anything at all that can even slightly be misinterpreted as getting between me and my education..all of it through grad school, I will come after him for every dime he is worth.

It is time that I start taking back control.

I called his mom today to let her know I was thinking of her and said that his girlfriend was asked to attend the get together instead of me so I would not be able to see her tomorrow, but that I loved her and know tomorrow will be hard. I almost cried. I miss that old man. He was like a father to me. 

Ok. I am rambling now. 

I will stop.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Glad you are still finding your way on here BFG, and glad that things, while still not easy, are looking up in some respects at least.

Sorry for the loss of extended family and how it makes you feel. I think it is good that you called his mother.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

You are allowed to ramble, BFG.

Thanks for the update. I’m glad to hear that your younger son’s bowels are coming along. Believe me, I know how this is a challenging area, both from my work with children with autism and from my own son who had encopresis. 

I can relate to the library fine. I gave up my card when I found I owed $30 in fines.

‘m sorry you will not be with the family tomorrow. I’m sure his Dad is looking down on you with love.

Take care.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

On campus post re-entrance exam. Still trying to figure out 3rd party payor stuff for school to get clearances re-done.

Child support hearing on Thursday. Not ready at all. Still hunting down documents and am terrified of the backlash. He thinks we are just going in to say "this is what we agreed on".

I think it may still be close, considering he pays for DD's braces, but the uncertainty is killing me. What if they actually reduce the payments? That would be horrible.

Looking for a cheap car that will last the next two years so I can get back and forth to school. I can't afford the payments on the vehicle in his name once I have to pay for my own insurance. 

I really wish he would just serve me with divorce papers already.

Big question of the day...

His sister called me. She was kind. I did tell her I have evidence proving they were at least emotionally involved before the split. That I have no kind words to say about the woman. She wanted me to come to her son's graduation party. He was my godson for all these years (even before we were engaged she asked us both to be his godparents). She wants me there. PSOW will be there with him as well though. Can I do this? I want to be there for my (what used to be) godson. I am not sure what protocol entails here. 

I feel completely abandoned by his family...which I knew would happen, so this engagement will be awkward anyway. However, what do you guys suggest?

Well, off to talk to some school authorities about my bill. Hopefully I can hop on again soon.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Send the kid a nice card.

Don't torture yourself.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

You should be bound by your heart.

If you want to build any sort of bridge with his family, and you think you are strong enough, then go. But be prepared for it to be hard, and be prepared that they are his family, not yours. They will always take his side.

Personally, I think I would tell your soon to be ex SIL that you just think it would be too awkward. You are not healed, you have enough to deal with, and the awkwardness is unfair all round. Send the kid a gift or card, whatever is appropriate in your circles.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

I agree with Conrad and Wazza. Its too soon.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Child support hearing yesterday. In my favor 100 more dollars plus 200 spousal and he is pissed. Swearing he will take me for full custody because I am crazy, and told me he is taking the car (it is in his name). He has hired a lawyer apparently. I wish I never filed for support. I offered spousal support back if he would just keep her away from the kids in the weekend because they are so confused. They haven't had one weekend with their dad that she was not there. He said no...well it was a bit angrier than that, but none the less he chose to pay it all and I'm left wondering if it is all worth it. 

I just wanted him to see what the state said he should be paying so he could stop claiming I was breaking him. But it just got way out of control at that point and it got ugly and the mediator person had to remind us that our son was present. 

I want to throw up all the time right now.

I don't really know what is the right thing to do. Walk away from spousal support to make peace? Is he really financially strapped? If so he has to be able to feed the kids and if I take all of this, he can't feed them. I am so conflicted right now, it's not even funny.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

BFGuru said:


> Child support hearing yesterday. In my favor 100 more dollars plus 200 spousal and he is pissed. Swearing he will take me for full custody because I am crazy, and told me he is taking the car (it is in his name). He has hired a lawyer apparently. I wish I never filed for support. I offered spousal support back if he would just keep her away from the kids in the weekend because they are so confused. They haven't had one weekend with their dad that she was not there. He said no...well it was a bit angrier than that, but none the less he chose to pay it all and I'm left wondering if it is all worth it.
> 
> I just wanted him to see what the state said he should be paying so he could stop claiming I was breaking him. But it just got way out of control at that point and it got ugly and the mediator person had to remind us that our son was present.
> 
> ...


If you had an inventory of all the things he's bought for her, you would not entertain such thoughts.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

The extra money might let you run a car and have cash left over. I forget, have the marital assets been divided yet? Can't remember if you were divorced yet. If not, all assets are common aren't they?

He ended the marriage, he walked out on his responsibilities. He had he affair. He did this. You didn't.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

He keeps claiming they were not involved. Kids still think they are friends. Admitted in front of mediator that they began seeing each other end of March. We officially separated beginning of march. We are not divorced yet.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Do NOT give up spousal. The courts do not award more than a person can pay. They looked at what you both make and made the determination based on that. He is an angry man. He will say anything to hurt you. Don’t let it. That extra money, which you are entitled to, will help you provide a better life for your kids, not only financially, but they will have a Mom who is less stressed.

Don’t bargain with this man who has caused you and the children so much pain.

Is it worth it? Yes, because he is learning that he can’t push you around and control you and that the courts will not permit his efforts to do so.

She stayed overnight and they are just friends?! Document the nights the kids tell you that she stays the night (don’t of course grill them).


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I have never grilled them.
They just volunteer the information. Many times I can't even figure out what prompts it. I don't really want to know anything about her. They just drop it out of the blue.

Oh by the way daddy's friend spent the night. 

Ok. What do you think about that? 

The answers differ. Sometimes they shrug, other times they get upset. They are conflicted and want to like her. They do like her. But they want time alone with their dad. They want her to not be there once.

He blurted in front of the domestic relations person "well she's just gonna have to move in now because you made it impossible for me to live!"

My youngest simply offered up "well duh, she's selling her house."


I think the financial stress, though overwhelming, is nothing compared to this pit in my stomach, looking at this man who bares no resemblance to the man I fell in love with as a girl.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> He blurted in front of the domestic relations person "well she's just gonna have to move in now because you made it impossible for me to live!"
> 
> My youngest simply offered up "well duh, she's selling her house."


Met at the end of March. Selling house and moving in. I always go from nothing to major financial commitment in six weeks, because I take relationships seriously, anything less than six weeks would be rushing it.

And the youngest is showing incredible naivety.

Either that or he's full of sh1t.

I am very big on getting divorce over with as little acrimony as possible, but if someone insulted my intelligence like that, I would find it very hard to control myself.

I would not assume he will be truthful or honourable. I would not waive any of my legal rights with such a person.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

No, she was already spending the night in the beginning of March. He claims they started dating the end of March.

It's the kids. I want to keep the peace for the kids.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

And I agree with you BF about the kids.

But sorry, I still think he's full of it. And I still think, not that you should be malicious or malevolent, but that you should claim your rights.

He has done the wrong thing.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Sorry, BFG, I didn’t think that you grilled the kids. That came out wrong.

What your youngest said was perfect! Out of the mouths of babes....

Wazza is so right. Don’t give up what is legally yours and your kids. You have suffered enough due to what this......nope, I can’t call him a man.....what this jerk has done. 

I must say though, I am sorry he has to move his GF in so that he can afford to stay where he is. Life is so hard, isn’t it? (This is sarcasm by the way.)


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

BF,

I'm feeling sympathy for your kids.

Affair partners rarely make good homes for children.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I guessif he is going to take the car anyway, I might as stop paying on it. He is going to accuse me of ruining his credit anyway. Why keep trying? But then I think, I could send out an olive branch. I could fix this, but for how long? Ugh. 

I just don't even know how to make peace, and it is going to be the kids that suffer if we don't.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Just get the divorce over as quickly as possible with as little emotion as possible, for the kids. Sorry, I know those words probably hurt.

As for the car...I think you would be better to have your own, not his, as quickly as possible. Couldn't the money used to service his car loan pay off yours instead?


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

If you have been making payments on the car, he owes you that money or at least part of it. I guess he can claim some for use of the vehicle. Talk to your lawyer before you hand the car over.

Does he have another car? If so it is pretty mean to take yours.

An olive branch. What is your motivation here? Do you think that if you act nice, he will change his approach? He won’t. He will see it as weakness and walk over you some more. Sorry. I know you are tired of all this and you want peace, but I honestly don’t think you will get it from him. He is mean and vindictive. He wants to hurt you. Don’t act maliciously or vindictively yourself. I think someone has already said that (sounds like a Wazza thing), but don’t put your head on the guillotine. Things need to be amicable in front of the children. Period.

Think about it. You have been so strapped financially that you weren’t eating. Now you will have more money, which is rightfully yours, and you thought of offering not to take it. And now you are thinking of offering an olive branch. Its not an olive branch, BFG. Its a white flag of surrender. And you want to wave it at someone who will see it as a sign of weakness.

He is not going to respect your wishes as far as OW goes, whatever you do. In fact, his statement at the hearing about having to have her move in, shows he will dig in deeper. 

Hold your head high, BFG. And burn the flag.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Ugh. Why is the right thing so difficult to figure out?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Also, when I am at home (work is the only place I can get online) I feel so isolated, and you guys are my therapy. Anyone want to swap text message numbers? This just seems to be progressing so differently than all my other friends divorces. :/


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

She is 28. 

He is 42.

He is telling me if I do not have it completely caught up payment wise by Friday (It was behind 2 months and I've been working at paying extra to get it caught up, and finally got it up to only 1 month delinquent) he is taking it when I drop the kids off. I have to get to work after dropping them off and will be 1.5 hours away from my job there.

She is 28. 

Why can't I get over that.

Kid sobbed all night worried about daddy not having food because his sister had to help him with food and his girlfriend. No one cried when I had no help with food and no girlfriend to buy me food. I am trying not to be hurt by it.

Ugh. I can' compete with 28.

Time at friend's house is at an end, so I have to hop off and go get my kiddos. I cannot find a car. Been looking all day. 

This sucks.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> She is 28.
> 
> He is 42.
> 
> ...


Just keep playing a straight bat. If the kids are sobbing it is because he is telling them stuff which is unfair. Kids are smart. Long term they will see through it.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

I don’t understand. You are making the car payments. What is it to him? If he takes the car and it takes you that long to get to and from work, it will affect the kids when you have them. How much earlier will they have to get you in the mornings? How much longer will they be in daycare before you can get to them? The fact that his taking the car only came up after the court awarded you more support says it all. If he does take it, talk to your lawyer about getting your payments back.

The food thing is so bogus. The court would not leave him that short when awarding support. It would affect the children and that is the last thing they want to do. Not only that, his gf does earn money. If he has no food it is due to his own financial mismanagement. And the kids should never be brought into it. 

What a prince!


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

The car is behind in payments. It was two months, and I have been working with the company to catch it up. I got it down to one month. He keeps accusing me of destroying his credit. But I keep getting call from collection agencies for bills from last June. He stopped paying on my bills that weren't utilities since June.

I haven't found a car yet. I was nauseous all day. Gagging and dry heaving (didn't eat much). I was terrified of showing up with kids and he taking it.

I did not get out of the car. I put the VAR in my pocket and had my mom on the cell phone. Nothing happened. I kicked kids out and drove away. I hated not to hug them goodbye. I am at work now.

I bought food for the boys. It really pisses me off that he can legally refuse to follow their diet because it is experimental and yet we have seen drastic improvement. He suddenly sees not change (eye roll) but if I don't buy the food, he will sabotage their diet and I suspect he already has, so I cannot take that risk.

My mother called domestic violence today, and they called me. They want me to file a PFA. I feel stupid doing that. I have barely any proof because most threats are done verbally and I did tell him I would no longer discuss anything with him unless it was via text. He has not asked to speak with me since when he calls the kids and I just hand the phone to them and do not answer.

He has never hit me, but the mind games...ugh.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Today was my wedding anniversary. I worked later.

He took the kids camping with the wh0re.

My dad came up yesterday. He drove up with a beater car that they took a loan out for so STBX can just have the keys next time he threatens. It's not pretty, but functional.

However, as such he felt within his rights to tell me how he really felt. Basically I was out of gods will marrying him, and that this was all because I walked away from god (I do not adhere to any faith anymore). That because of all the intercourse pain I experienced in our early yeaRs of marriage I couldn't expect him to do anything but stray because men need sex. That people were waiting to help me but they couldn't unless I got right with god. And so forth. He then declined to spend the night because he had to hurry back to return the trailer he rented to transport the car. I called this afternoon to see if he got home alright...he was at my brothers watching his son play a ball game. Suddenly I was not doing alright with my anniversary. I was back graduating from college when he was late for commencement packing my brothers dorm room, and he refused to even stay after commencement for dinner. I was 16 again and thrown against the wall because I dared confront him and tell him that by allowing the boys to do something I was not, that it was a double standard and his reply was to pick me up, throw me and when I landed tell me that I was right, it was a double standard because they were boys and I was a girl. 

I wish I would have called him out on his piss poor example of Christendom, but I would not lower myself to that level. He would never accept responsibility for his actions anyway. It would be my fault and really he was not the reason I walked away from church to begin with and my current world view makes a heck of a lot more sense to me than his.

And suddenly I see a pattern.

And that although I thought he was acting like a narcissistic prick like my mom can be, I had married a man just like my father and that I would never be good enough in his eyes...in either of their eyes no matter how hard I tried.

It is what it is. I will not change them. Every now and then I am faced with my fathers reality and I mourn for what I wish I could have had with a father, but I think, although I am sad about it, I will be ok. I hope.

My bigger fear is falling for the same type of man again. I am no where near ready for a relationship yet, but that may keep me out of the dating scene for good.

I hope I do not do that to my children. I never want to be the reason they are damaged.

And so, I made it through my 17th wedding anniversary. I knew it would be difficult but I managed to keep myself occupied sufficiently. 

Some days I feel like my life is a Ken Follet novel, and I just want to close the book and become something simpler. Something not as complicated. Possibly just a users manual for a simple piece of technology. No emotions, no conflicts, just simplicity. Life does not allow such luxuries though and so epic internal battles will remain. And with any luck, mayhaps I will win a few.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

How did you end up in this conversation to begin with?


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

You know, even though your father's approach was not ideal, he was there for you to an extent. 

Take what you can get. You deserve some goodness.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

The way you can avoid repeating the pattern is two-fold: awareness and determination. Awareness of the pattern and the underlying reason that you repeated it. You chose a man like your father because it is your father’s love and affirmation that you subconsciously crave. You married STBX because you want to be loved by a man who believes you are worthwhile. But you don’t believe it yourself. You were taught early on that you were not worth loving and that has shaped your relationships.

The second part of avoiding the pattern is to work on yourself. Love yourself because, if you don’t, how can someone else? If you can, go to IC and get help to develop strategies that will enable you to move past the ingrained belief that you are not worthwhile. This toxic belief will continue to hurt you. It was instilled by your upbringing and cemented by your STBX. 

If you can’t afford IC, then read everything you can on self-affirmation. Perhaps someone here can recommend some books. Practice saying to yourself several times a day “I am worthwhile. I am worthy of love.” It sounds simplistic, but your brain will get the massage and slowly change that toxic belief. 

Its not easy to change one’s fundamental beliefs about oneself. It will take determination. But you can do it. I believe in you.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Conrad said:


> How did you end up in this conversation to begin with?


He was playing with my son, I sat down near him and he says out of the blue..."I have done a lot for you, and because of that you need to listen to what I have to say without arguing with me." So I listened. Nothing more.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Frosty, I have IC once a month. She wants to see me more, but I can't afford more, so I come here when I can. It was an epiphany, that is for sure. I always thought I was stronger than that, but, I realized I wasn't yesterday. And yet, the realization, as sad as it was, felt somewhat empowering. My head knows I am worth more. My heart however, will take some convincing and I know that will take time. I am ok with that, I think...I hope.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Wazza, that is what I kept telling myself during his epic lecture. He was always excellent at lecturing.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> Wazza, that is what I kept telling myself during his epic lecture. He was always excellent at lecturing.


My Dad too. But gee I miss him now he is gone 

Seems to me that not everything is perfect, and won't be, but things are getting better. Thinking of you.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> He was playing with my son, I sat down near him and he says out of the blue..."I have done a lot for you, and because of that you need to listen to what I have to say without arguing with me." So I listened. Nothing more.


I hope he didn’t say his piece in front of your son.

I can relate to him favoring of his sons over you. I always felt growing up that my mother preferred my brother. As an adult, I looked back and figured it was just my ‘poor me’ perception.......until my Mum made a comment in front of me and my SIL that not only confirmed it, but made it clear that she preferred my brother because he was a boy.

It hurt then, but it hurt even more when I was little. I was never thrown against a wall, but I did get the wooden spoon and the strap and I don’t recall my brother ever getting either. The emotional pain was worse. 

Now I can (almost) put it in perspective. She had two sisters, no brothers. Both sisters produce only boys, between them. Being the only girl, I think I was considered special by the extended family, but not by my Mum who wanted a boy. That, combined with the old-fashioned belief she was likely raised with that boys were more valuable than girls, helps me put it into perspective. I survived, and my Mum has done some special things for me.

Your Dad is looking at life through narrow lenses. Sadly, if he is not careful, he will end up a very lonely man.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Yes, it was said in front of my son. I am sure he will repeat it to his father lol. Dad wasn't too kind in him either.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Paid the library fine without realizing the courts would take 4-6 weeks to set up payments in spite of already garnering his wages. Woops. I'm broker than broke now, but at least I can get on line at the library again. 

I need some input.

He has offered to pay for the divorce if we can use his lawyer, as well as not contest the child support (probably trying to get out of alimony). I do NOT want to meet with him to discuss. My friend has offered to come with as a witness so I will meet with him if it makes things cheaper.

He wants an extra day over the summer. I don't want to give it to him. I am already sending food to feed them when they are not with me. Why should I keep doing this? But he refuses to follow the diet.

He keeps wanting to discuss division of debt. I do not want to take anymore of this debt. I am not paying for his student loans and am not going to pay for that damn car he just bought after the separation. I do not want to pay for the car he keeps threatening to confiscate (and he is following through with it tonight but I have a vehicle now so he can have it). 

So far, I know that I am willing to give him one week during the summer around the time of his family reunion, as the children will want to be there anyway. I am willing to allow him ALMOST an extra day. I want to offer instead of bringing them back the next morning to bring them back the afternoon/evening of the day they normally come home anyway (they come home at 7:30 a.m. for school during the school year). I also want him to stop refusing to follow the diet that is helping my son go to the bathroom, regardless of if he believes it is helping his behaviors. I know it is helping them but I should not have to provide food while they are with him lest he sabotage the diet. I also want a court order stating that I am in charge of all medical decisions. I was always in charge of them before. Suddenly doctors and organizations are stalling because I am separated, insisting they must obtain his permission before we can pursue treatments. This has to stop. I didn't need a second signature when married. I should not need them now.

I need to figure out distribution of holidays. I do not know how to do that. 

I want to keep spousal support until I finish school and have no interference with whatever childcare I must set up to accomplish that. (I wish I could insist he pay for my child abuse clearances and FBI checks that I have to redo but I know I can't). Once I finish school and take my boards I will be able to get a higher paying job and will not need spousal support at that point. 

Does this sound reasonable? Am I missing anything I should ask for? I want to stab his eyes out, but then he would end up on disability and I couldn't get child support then, so I guess violence will have to avoided LOL.

The problem with all of this is that the kids services are not established yet. Their evaluations are not until the end of the month. So I don't even know when their therapies will take place. 

So many questions, and I feel like I'm spinning most days. I'm absolutely exhausted most days. But alas. Trudging along and at least surviving.

I was offered free hotel and company in California for a week if I can get airfare. I don't think I can afford it, but still...maybe if I can get a cheap divorce I will LOL. My friend does live events and has a corporate event out there and she wanted company for the week. Not sure I can swing it though. He would get an extra week with the kids though if I could LOL.

Well, what do you guys think? I don't even know what I should be asking for at this point. I hope I am asking the right questions.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

I would not enter a binding agreement to use his lawyer if I could help it. His lawyer works for him, not you.

I would also be surprised if you can get everything on your wish list. But you need legal advice as to what is possible there.

I cannot imagine him agreeing to let you have sole control over all medical decisions, not can I imagine a court ordering that. I actually think you are being unfair on that one (sorry). They are his kids too.

Glad you are able to get online more. Thinking of you.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Wazza said:


> I would not enter a binding agreement to use his lawyer if I could help it. His lawyer works for him, not you.
> 
> I would also be surprised if you can get everything on your wish list. But you need legal advice as to what is possible there.
> 
> ...


I agree with all of this.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

I agree too. It might be different about the lawyer if it were an amicable divorce and the lawyer was neutral, but Wazza is right. his lawyer works for him.

As far as the diet goes, if it is helping your son with his bowels (I assume that’s it as many autistic children have trouble with that), then get his pediatrician to write a letter stating that the diet is beneficial and recommending adherence to it at all times. Take that to your lawyer. If he still refuses to follow the diet, you may have grounds to take him to court. 

And no, you shouldn’t have to provide the expensive food for his time with the kids.....at least not unless your child support goes up to adequately compensate you for providing their meals while they are with him. 

BFG, this man has done nothing to give you reason to believe that he will be reasonable, and the fact that he wants to use the same lawyer who, surprise, happens to be his is a huge, HUGE red flag. Please get your own lawyer. It may cost you more now, but if you don’t it will cost you even more in the long run.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

The reason I want the court order for medical decisions is that he has NEVER made them. I have always been responsible for medical decisions. He does not understand medicine outside of psych meds and even that is limited because he is not an MD. I never needed his signature for treatments when we were married, and now waiting on him to sign things when he gets around to it because we are separated now and organizations feel they need his permission too, is down right ridiculous. I never needed his permission before to treat my children. He doesnt even have their medical cards. I tried to convince him to keep them in case of an emergency and his response was "I'll just call you in an emergency". As such, I do believe I have the right to get the court order. Not because I think he will fight it, but because it will stop organizations from slowing down their treatment waiting on his approval. 

I do have it noted in their charts that the diet is working. All I need to do is request it in writing. Dr. was going to give it to me last appt, and we both got distracted discussing other issues and forgot. All I need to do is call and say "I'm picking up the letter". 

He took the car last night. Now he is saying all the debt between us has to be divided evenly as per the lawyer. Can I really be responsible for this vehicle? I had to get a second car because he took it. Why should I have to pay for it? Also, he just bought a brand new car (not like my beater car). Am I going to be responsible for paying for that loan on top of the 5k one he took off to pay for the motorcycle so I would give him the title (that he never paid). I am going to be stuck paying for part of that loan too? 

Fvck it. You are right. I am going to have to shell out more money just to protect myself. He has already begun the process of financially ruining me. I just don't know where I am going to get the money to retain this lawyer. The wait list is 5-6 months for pro bono lawyers and I am broker than broke.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> The reason I want the court order for medical decisions is that he has NEVER made them. I have always been responsible for medical decisions. He does not understand medicine outside of psych meds and even that is limited because he is not an MD. I never needed his signature for treatments when we were married, and now waiting on him to sign things when he gets around to it because we are separated now and organizations feel they need his permission too, is down right ridiculous. I never needed his permission before to treat my children. He doesnt even have their medical cards. I tried to convince him to keep them in case of an emergency and his response was "I'll just call you in an emergency". As such, I do believe I have the right to get the court order. Not because I think he will fight it, but because it will stop organizations from slowing down their treatment waiting on his approval.
> 
> I do have it noted in their charts that the diet is working. All I need to do is request it in writing. Dr. was going to give it to me last appt, and we both got distracted discussing other issues and forgot. All I need to do is call and say "I'm picking up the letter".
> 
> ...


If the debts must be divided evenly, so must the assets. Except for support to the custodial parent. (Again, a lawyer needs to advise on this one).

If he is willing to let you make the medical decisions, can't he just give you a signed form of some sort? Does it need to be a court order?


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

It does seem to me that if he took a new car that he owes you at least half of the value of that car.

I know you don't think you can afford a lawyer.

The way he's behaving, I don't think you can afford not to have one.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I think I messed up today. 

DD has been so angry with me. She is angry to be here. I tell her to do her chores, she says no. I discipline her. She yells all the time. Rough morning. Today culminated in her declaring she wished she lived at her dad's and I snapped.

I laid out the timeline. Told her to do the math. Flat out explained that men don't jump into relationships like that, that quickly unless they were already eyeing it up. I told her I never let my eyes wander in 17 years of marriage. I told her that my expectations for reconciliation were therapy, and his were moving me so far away from everything I would have to quit my job and my schooling. I pretty much so laid out all my suspicions. And then she said "so, I don't believe you".

Lovely. 

I suck at this single mom thing. 

She is probably going back to her dad this weekend and telling him all of it. 

Efff.


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## TCSRedhead (Oct 17, 2012)

Aw sweetie. We've all those awful moments. When DD was 8 and yelling that she hated me and wanted to live with her dad, I asked I she meant the dad that hadn't seen her in a year. 

You're doing fine. When you both cool down, sit down and apologize for your reaction. Let her know that right now you're really hurt by her dads actions but that it was no reason to put that on her shoulders. 

You'll both be ok in time.


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## ReGroup (Dec 6, 2012)

We all have those moments - It happens.

Get back on the horse again. Chin up.

If you want to, apologize to DD for snapping at her and make yourself aware of what triggered that type of reaction.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

You know what? You are human.

I'm not convinced what you did was mess up, but even if you did, we all do sometimes.

I personally think you are doing great, and we know you have had some really hard stuff to overcome, and not as much support as you would have liked.

Don't beat yourself up.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

BFGuru said:


> I think I messed up today.
> 
> DD has been so angry with me. She is angry to be here. I tell her to do her chores, she says no. I discipline her. She yells all the time. Rough morning. Today culminated in her declaring she wished she lived at her dad's and I snapped.
> 
> ...


The Victim Chair never works.

Then again, he will be himself going forward, so she will see.


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## 06Daddio08 (Jul 26, 2012)

Everyone has those days as a single parent. Take it easy on yourself.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

You’re doing the best you can under very difficult circumstances, and you’re doing a great job.

Your daughter may have said she didn’t believe you, but that may have been an attempt to deny what she was hearing about her Dad. He’s her Dad. She loves and trusts him. He couldn’t do those things. Mom must be lying. 

She will come around. Sadly, one day she will realize that Mom was telling the truth.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I have agreed to meet with him, with my friend present. He is bringing his sister. I don't trust his sister.

We shall see how this meeting goes. 

He actually said I did not have to provide food this weekend. That he has everything made for a camping trip (except bread, which I don't mind making since they like it so much). This could be a good thing.

I don't know where the child support is. All the courts have provided thus far are the arrears. It is less than half of what the document says that he should be providing. I know this isn't him. They are taking it straight from his paycheck, but now I have 755 in my bank account and my rent is due before my next paycheck at 880. On top of this, because the courts are so slow, I have only paid half my rent this month waiting on this to kick in. It's driving me batty. 

Going to visit my brother next week with the kids. He is paying for the trip. He is a soldier and keeps calling the kids telling them he is a captain in the army fighting for America, so he's pretty sure that he is Captain America, except his tights are too small. The kids cackle every time he calls. 

I haven't visited him in years. They never came to visit or invited us to visit. My mother recently admitted to me that STBX made quite a few lewd passes at his wife. Things suddenly make sense. I plan on asking her why she didn't feel comfortable talking to me about it when it happened. But I am glad this impending divorce has at least given me my brother back. It also explains why he hates my brother so much. C'est la vie.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Good luck with the meeting, BFG. What is the purpose? I imagine he will try to talk you out of some of his court-mandated responsibilities. Please don’t give anything up. It was put in place for you and the kids. The court knew how much he makes and what he can afford. Don’t let his sob stories sway you.

I’m glad you and your brother are getting together. It will be a nice break for you and a chance to rebuild that relationship.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Treating myself to Applebee's for dinner tonight. Thank you Applebee's wifi. I was going to get the oil changed and my dad said he already did that, so I need to find dinner and kill some time before work. Sitting at the bar. Wish there was more caffein in this soda. Got up early to get this done, and tired lol.

Miss my kids.

Got in a fight over a too skimpy bathing suit with dd. apparently she is staying at her dads. Well, she thinks so. She won't be able to though. It hurts, and then I remind myself that all 12 year old girls are raging balls of mother angst and I realize she will love me again when she turns thirty.


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## TCSRedhead (Oct 17, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> Treating myself to Applebee's for dinner tonight. Thank you Applebee's wifi. I was going to get the oil changed and my dad said he already did that, so I need to find dinner and kill some time before work. Sitting at the bar. Wish there was more caffein in this soda. Got up early to get this done, and tired lol.
> 
> Miss my kids.
> 
> Got in a fight over a too skimpy bathing suit with dd. apparently she is staying at her dads. Well, she thinks so. She won't be able to though. It hurts, and then I remind myself that all 12 year old girls are raging balls of mother angst and I realize she will love me again when she turns thirty.


Glad you're getting some time out. The angsty stuff really sucks. It is likely to get better in the later teen years. I really enjoyed my girls once they hit fifteen or so.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I think I am probably over reacting. I am ok with him calling once a night to say goodnight to the children, even though it annoys me. But it is multiple times a day the kids call or he calls.

I am out of town on vacation with the kids. He KEEPS calling. Five times a day at least. I check the messages and they are "please call, I'm worried about the kids".

Um. I think I can handle them. I want to say "I give you the respect to have your vacations with the kids uninterrupted" I want to say "last I checked, you didn't see fit to take our son to the doctor, and left me to take him when he swelled due to a poison ivy reaction, I think they are in better hands and less need to worry when with me". I want to say that, but I don't. I cannot get away from him. I need time with just me and the kids. With him not calling asking what we are doing and what we are up to. If you wanted a blow by blow of our lives, you should have stayed with us. What they do when with me, is really none of your business. I want to say this, but am afraid of being accused of keeping the kids from him, when he sees them every weekend.

I struggle to keep them wanting to be with me anyway. I feel like his constant phone calls are sabotaging our chance at a peaceful existence.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Just make a decision about how often to call and stick to it. And don't try and stop him having time with them. Not fair to them, and big risk of backfiring on you.

Hope the vacation is somewhere nice.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

No, I am not trying to limit the agreed upon time he has. Unless it interferes with school. Then I would give him more time during the summer. I feel like my hands are tied when they want to call him (they don't call me when with him though). And I just did not want to deal with even thinking about him on vacation. It was bad enough when the kids brought up him and how awesome the other woman is. I shouldn't have to give up our vacation time to him so he can talk to them repeatedly. I don't even know how to broach this subject with him though.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Turn off your phone. Explain to the kids that they can use it just before bedtime or another time that works for you. There is no need for the repeated phone calls.

I would look up Parental Alienation Syndrome and become familiar with the signs. Not saying this is what he is doing, but the effects on children are tragic, and it might be wise to be aware of it.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I am aware of it, and I feel like it is happening. THough I'm not sure how to stop it. It hurts horrifically so.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> I am aware of it, and I feel like it is happening. THough I'm not sure how to stop it. It hurts horrifically so.


This happened to a mom at my school. She took her son to a counsellor who specializes in childhood trauma. We had a meeting with him earlier this week. He told us that the effects on the child are the same that are experienced by a soldier returning from combat. 

This particular child is a mess. He has been diagnosed with Parental Alienation Syndrome (PAS). This diagnosis went to court and ended up costing the father most of his access. H e didn’t change his behavior. His access is now limited to one after school visit and one day on the weekend (no overnights). He is by court order not allowed near the school. The next step if he doesn’t change his ways, is supervised visits. The mom is slowly, with the help of the counsellor, rebuilding her relationship with her son. Now the fear is that, because the child is making progress and his anxiety levels are coming down, the court will grant more access. 

By the way, these kids can present as ADHD. This boy looks like one of the most severe cases of ADHD i have seen. He’s not ADHD.

The counsellor believes the father is a narcissist and won’t change. The boy will need years of counselling.

All this to say, PAS is serious, which I know you realize. Can you get counselling for the kids? I can give you the name of the group (its international) that specializes in childhood trauma. Their website may be helpful. 

I forget, do you have a lawyer? If so, let him/her know your fear.

Hug.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I have legal advice, not an official lawyer. I am not sure how to prove it. The boys have a psychiatrist. well a new resident is starting with them soon as the old one finished his tenure and I about cried over one more drastic change. Their attendings are the same, however. It is not that he is keeping them from me, but making my oldest feel as though she has to check in nonstop. If we are doing something fun she wants to tell him. If she is upset she has to tell him, which on one level is acceptable. But the worrying about daddy eating and having to call and make sure he is ok was down right terrifying. Every time they get angry they want to move in with them. My house is an angry disaster of fist fighting and disrespect. She tells me to shut up. Refuses to go to her room for time out. My son screams he hates his sister and wants to kill himself. It is just...ugh. I guess the honeymoon is over eh? 

Boys have an intake scheduled for mobile therapy. Daughter refuses to speak to a counselor. She admitted being afraid of everything this weekend. Not wanting to touch things lest she leave fingerprints behind. Not knowing the term big brother, but very afraid of it. It breaks my heart.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Does it ever get easier? I think I am fine and then I get angry all over again. Part of me wants to know the truth. How long was this w4ore pursuing my husband? How long had they been sexually active, but I know those answers aren't good for me. I want to know why we were never worth working on and yet, he just claims his long suffering of dealing with me for 16 years was working on it enough. I "know" I will never get satisfactory answers, and yet I want them. And that is what is hard.

I also want to know why it was worth throwing our kids' health to the wind in order to get a fresh piece of a$$. Why two people with masters degrees can't figure out how to feed these kids without my express intervention of "yes, they can eat that" or "no, don't give that to them". They are going to the family reunion and he thinks just stopping at McDonald's en route is fine as long as he does not order a bun. Um...no. The grills are completely contaminated. You were in the doctor's office when he said no more eating out. He meant it. 

Why is it that I, a single mom, can plan a weekend trip away and never need to use a restaraunt to feed them and you with your marriage wrecking slvt can't figure it out together? Seriously, use a little bit of planning. It can get done. They don't have to suffer and not have fun at the family reunion like you claim if you provide alternatives. It's not that hard. Just takes planning and maybe getting up and cooking something. 

And why is SHE going to this family reunion? I loved his family like my own. And part of me hopes his aunt lays into him. She is the one who would. 

Why do I play these mind games with myself? I know they aren't good for me. And I want this divorce over yesterday, and yet I know these things take time and that we only officially separated a month and half ago, even though he was barely sleeping at the house since January. 

Today is just not a good day, preparing these kids for this trip and baking things they may want, because although it spites me to do it, I want them to enjoy themselves while traveling.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> Does it ever get easier? I think I am fine and then I get angry all over again. Part of me wants to know the truth. How long was this w4ore pursuing my husband? How long had they been sexually active, but I know those answers aren't good for me. I want to know why we were never worth working on and yet, he just claims his long suffering of dealing with me for 16 years was working on it enough. I "know" I will never get satisfactory answers, and yet I want them. And that is what is hard.
> 
> I also want to know why it was worth throwing our kids' health to the wind in order to get a fresh piece of a$$. Why two people with masters degrees can't figure out how to feed these kids without my express intervention of "yes, they can eat that" or "no, don't give that to them". They are going to the family reunion and he thinks just stopping at McDonald's en route is fine as long as he does not order a bun. Um...no. The grills are completely contaminated. You were in the doctor's office when he said no more eating out. He meant it.
> 
> ...


You are doing the right thing. Be strong.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Wazza is right, BFG. Hold your head high. You are doing what’s best for your kids. I hope his aunt lays into him too.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Daughter got bottom row of braces on and refused to out wax on them. Needless to say she was writhing. In pain eventually. I was up all night with her, trying to give her ideas to help, all of which she claimed wouldn't work. Next morning I called orthodontist for anesthetic mouthwash. Had to explain what it was, what medications were in it and find a compounding pharmacy before he would call in the script. Apparently it burned and she became violently angry, screaming at me. I sent her to her room. She refused. I took her iPod. She flipped out, called me a fvcking b!tch and tried to hit me. I flipped out and shoved her in her room. She kept screaming and I went to hit her, but she blocked me and I pulled back,but she kept screaming that she was never coming back here after the weekend. Dad would let her stay, as he's already made the offer. And I screamed back that I would get a court order making her stay here since apparently her father is not teaching her any respect for her mother. My son just cried and cried. 

I am failing miserably at this. I don't know how to fix the relationship with my daughter, and every time I turn around someone is fist fighting. They hate life with me and I can't seem to fix it. I am tired all the time. And my house is a wreck and I feel like there is never any time to clean it. I get one room clean, they trash another and I cannot keep up.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Daughter got bottom row of braces on and refused to out wax on them. Needless to say she was writhing. In pain eventually. I was up all night with her, trying to give her ideas to help, all of which she claimed wouldn't work. Next morning I called orthodontist for anesthetic mouthwash. Had to explain what it was, what medications were in it and find a compounding pharmacy before he would call in the script. Apparently it burned and she became violently angry, screaming at me. I sent her to her room. She refused. I took her iPod. She flipped out, called me a fvcking b!tch and tried to hit me. I flipped out and shoved her in her room. She kept screaming and I went to hit her, but she blocked me and I pulled back,but she kept screaming that she was never coming back here after the weekend. Dad would let her stay, as he's already made the offer. And I screamed back that I would get a court order making her stay here since apparently her father is not teaching her any respect for her mother. My son just cried and cried. 

I am failing miserably at this. I don't know how to fix the relationship with my daughter, and every time I turn around someone is fist fighting. They hate life with me and I can't seem to fix it. I am tired all the time. And my house is a wreck and I feel like there is never any time to clean it. I get one room clean, they trash another and I cannot keep up.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Daughter got bottom row of braces on and refused to out wax on them. Needless to say she was writhing. In pain eventually. I was up all night with her, trying to give her ideas to help, all of which she claimed wouldn't work. Next morning I called orthodontist for anesthetic mouthwash. Had to explain what it was, what medications were in it and find a compounding pharmacy before he would call in the script. Apparently it burned and she became violently angry, screaming at me. I sent her to her room. She refused. I took her iPod. She flipped out, called me a fvcking b!tch and tried to hit me. I flipped out and shoved her in her room. She kept screaming and I went to hit her, but she blocked me and I pulled back,but she kept screaming that she was never coming back here after the weekend. Dad would let her stay, as he's already made the offer. And I screamed back that I would get a court order making her stay here since apparently her father is not teaching her any respect for her mother. My son just cried and cried. 

I am failing miserably at this. I don't know how to fix the relationship with my daughter, and every time I turn around someone is fist fighting. They hate life with me and I can't seem to fix it. I am tired all the time. And my house is a wreck and I feel like there is never any time to clean it. I get one room clean, they trash another and I cannot keep up.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> Daughter got bottom row of braces on and refused to out wax on them. Needless to say she was writhing. In pain eventually. I was up all night with her, trying to give her ideas to help, all of which she claimed wouldn't work. Next morning I called orthodontist for anesthetic mouthwash. Had to explain what it was, what medications were in it and find a compounding pharmacy before he would call in the script. Apparently it burned and she became violently angry, screaming at me. I sent her to her room. She refused. I took her iPod. She flipped out, called me a fvcking b!tch and tried to hit me. I flipped out and shoved her in her room. She kept screaming and I went to hit her, but she blocked me and I pulled back,but she kept screaming that she was never coming back here after the weekend. Dad would let her stay, as he's already made the offer. And I screamed back that I would get a court order making her stay here since apparently her father is not teaching her any respect for her mother. My son just cried and cried.
> 
> I am failing miserably at this. I don't know how to fix the relationship with my daughter, and every time I turn around someone is fist fighting. They hate life with me and I can't seem to fix it. I am tired all the time. And my house is a wreck and I feel like there is never any time to clean it. I get one room clean, they trash another and I cannot keep up.


Not justifying her reaction, but your daughter was acting out of pain, frustration and lack of sleep. You were reacting out of frustration and lack of sleep. Not the best conditions for a mother-daughter moment.

You can’t talk to people when they in the state your DD was in. If she continues to experience pain and tries to take it out on you, hand her a few over-the-counter painkillers and leave the room.

It concerns me that stbx has offered to let DD stay with him. You have an agreement in place. He needs to respect that and make it clear to the kids that custody is shared. But, I guess unless you can show that he is alienating them from you, there is not much you can do about it.

The kids are old enough to help keep the house clean. Why not try a family meeting, when you are all well-rested, to discuss the issue and draw up a chore schedule. Post it and stick to it. You should not have to bear the entire responsibility for the state of the house.

Can you access some family support/counselling for you and the kids? I don’t know how it is where you are, but we have community agencies that provide that.

Hug.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I thought I was getting family counseling, only to be told at the first session the therapist could do me or a kid, anything else was a conflict of interest. I am exploring other options this week. 

They refuse because they have no chores at daddy's house. And I know in my head she was reacting in pain, but I can try to pacify her and she gets verbally aggressive with me. I normally have to tell her to buck up to get her to stop the dramatics. 

Things have been out of control since school let out. I am just overwhelmed.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Hard.

I guess I would put the relationship first without totally spoiling them. Your ex isn't helping. I don't like him very much.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> I thought I was getting family counseling, only to be told at the first session the therapist could do me or a kid, anything else was a conflict of interest. I am exploring other options this week.
> 
> They refuse because they have no chores at daddy's house. And I know in my head she was reacting in pain, but I can try to pacify her and she gets verbally aggressive with me. I normally have to tell her to buck up to get her to stop the dramatics.
> 
> Things have been out of control since school let out. I am just overwhelmed.


Are you getting anytime for yourself while you have the kids? I know its hard to do that, but even a nice bubble bath or a brisk walk can be very therapeutic. 

At the very least, spoil yourself when he has them. You need to keep your bucket full in order to be able to dole out of it to others. 

Hug.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I work when they are not with me. I have 3 days to cram full time status into. I generally work and come home and collapse. Trying to figure things out. The therapist is looking into family based as opposed to mobile therapy. Both come into the home. I will know more later. 

I did take what little PTO I had left after getting sick and went to my class reunion this past weekend. I looked absolutely hot and did not pay for a single drink or meal the entire weekend. It did much to boost the self esteem, and then I came home to reality LOL.

So much to do this week. Drug screen, fingerprints, background checks for school. Try to get Y membership for kids. Only if they give us discount aid though. Find pediatrician (proving difficult with the kiddos and their insurances). And because of all the background checks the money is gone again. Not sure how on earth I will afford childcare in school. Even with him helping. He won't though. He has basically stated if it comes down to paying for childcare, he will enroll them in school where he lives and I will have them on the weekends...which means never since I work weekends. Soooo...um...yeah. Childcare is on me. 

I wish i just had internet at home. This running all the way to the library to get online is for the birds.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Batting your eyelids and getting your drinks paid for...you floozey!!!!

Sounds like you are making progress, for all the hassles. Remember to take time to congratulate yourself on that.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> I work when they are not with me. I have 3 days to cram full time status into. I generally work and come home and collapse. Trying to figure things out. The therapist is looking into family based as opposed to mobile therapy. Both come into the home. I will know more later.
> 
> I did take what little PTO I had left after getting sick and went to my class reunion this past weekend. I looked absolutely hot and did not pay for a single drink or meal the entire weekend. It did much to boost the self esteem, and then I came home to reality LOL.
> 
> ...


Not sure this is something he could just do. The courts might have a different take on it. This is a threat. Push for more financial support and I will take the kids away from you. He knows you don’t want to lose them, so he thinks he has you over a barrel.

Changing schools, especially with your sons’ needs, would not be in their best interest. 

This man is all about control and about hurting you and he is not above using the kids to do it. I’m with Wazza. I don’t like him. 

I also worry what will happen when the kids get older and start asserting themselves. What will he do to maintain control over them?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

He always has been able to control them easier. I am the stricter of the two but when he speaks they listen, not sure why.

Kiddo got really tired last night after fireworks and partying all day. She is insanely jealous of posow this week because daddy took her to the beach and she has been begging to go for a year. Well we all have been. My family is there. I told her not to worry, that I wanted to go visit my family and when we did we would go to the shore as well. 

The fog is insane to watch sometimes. Things he refused to do, he runs to do with her. I shake my head and laugh at the craziness of how he has changed for her. I guess he never really did love me as he never did any of that for me. 

I have to say, it was rather nice hearing her complain about how horrible it was at his house because daddy never listens to her about posow. 

Well kids are restless and want to leave library. guess its time to jet.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> He always has been able to control them easier. I am the stricter of the two but when he speaks they listen, not sure why.
> 
> Kiddo got really tired last night after fireworks and partying all day. She is insanely jealous of posow this week because daddy took her to the beach and she has been begging to go for a year. Well we all have been. My family is there. I told her not to worry, that I wanted to go visit my family and when we did we would go to the shore as well.
> 
> ...


They listen to him for the same reason many kids listen to their father when he gets home from work. Its not just because they’ve been listening to Mom drone on all day and he’s a new voice. Its because men tend to approach things differently. I was more the disciplinarian than my H, but they listened better to him. Why, because, no matter how strict I was, I still had that maternal thing going. I took the whys, wherefores and emotions into consideration. He just spoke and sounded like there were no whys, wherefores or emotion, and they better do what he said! I think the timbre of the male voice helps too.

Thing is, when kids reach the stage were they start pushing for independence, everything changes. Your H may find that he doesn’t have that same control anymore. And as he is so into control, it could become a very difficult situation. 

Glad you are hearing complaints about OW. It boosted me immensely to learn about my husband’s OW’s faults!


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

I am male, and was the disciplinarian in my family. The kids are adults now. There is something about their relationship with their mum that I can never have. You don't see it now maybe but in 20 years you will.

Just love your kids and be you BFG and it will all turn out good.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Kiddo texted multiple times today. Sadly I got the messages long after she went to bed. It made my evening knowing she just wanted to say "hi". 

Still trying to process something she told me though and not sure if I am overreacting. She is upset about the amount of PDA her dad shows this posow. She said he kisses her non stop "sloppy kisses" and is constantly grabbing at her. I explained her dad was always wanting to do that to me, but I felt it wasn't right to let him grab my boobs or butt in front of her and her brothers. That some men just like to do that with their significant others. I tried to keep it neutral. She said he is always grabbing her boobs in front of them and doesn't listen when she asks him not to.

Here is my confusion. I was always very LD sexually and I come from a background that causes me to want to shield my younger children from any sexual displays. I was just starting to relax with the older one around when the separation happened. However, I find it insanely inappropriate to be groping each other in front of children. I find it more so that my daughter needs to beg for him not to do it and be ignored. But was I broken? Was I the prude for not permitting it when married? Is what he doing considered healthy in a married relationship? Am I just jealous? Ugh. Why do I play these mind games with myself? It's not like talking to him will change it. So why let it bother me?


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## TCSRedhead (Oct 17, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> Kiddo texted multiple times today. Sadly I got the messages long after she went to bed. It made my evening knowing she just wanted to say "hi".
> 
> Still trying to process something she told me though and not sure if I am overreacting. She is upset about the amount of PDA her dad shows this posow. She said he kisses her non stop "sloppy kisses" and is constantly grabbing at her. I explained her dad was always wanting to do that to me, but I felt it wasn't right to let him grab my boobs or butt in front of her and her brothers. That some men just like to do that with their significant others. I tried to keep it neutral. She said he is always grabbing her boobs in front of them and doesn't listen when she asks him not to.
> 
> Here is my confusion. I was always very LD sexually and I come from a background that causes me to want to shield my younger children from any sexual displays. I was just starting to relax with the older one around when the separation happened. However, I find it insanely inappropriate to be groping each other in front of children. I find it more so that my daughter needs to beg for him not to do it and be ignored. But was I broken? Was I the prude for not permitting it when married? Is what he doing considered healthy in a married relationship? Am I just jealous? Ugh. Why do I play these mind games with myself? It's not like talking to him will change it. So why let it bother me?


There isn't a right or wrong about parental PDA really. It's about our own set of personal values and comfort level. For instance, I'm extremely open about nudity and sexuality, Hub is less so. Because my daughters were raised with it, it's 'normal' for them but no less right or wrong that someone who wasn't. 

It's unfortunate that he's not willing to listen to what is making his children uncomfortable. 

I am disturbed that your daughter spun so far out of control with her anger though. Hopefully she gets some better coping mechanisms in counseling.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

When your kids are older, I have found wandering around naked at inappropriate times is a great way to get them thinking about moving out. I know you are not there yet, but keep it in mind for the future!


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Wazza said:


> When your kids are older, I have found wandering around naked at inappropriate times is a great way to get them thinking about moving out. I know you are not there yet, but keep it in mind for the future!


Always worked for me.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

While I think nudity when the kids are too young to move out is fine, I personally would draw the line at the touching you described. Those types of touches are sexual in nature and should be done in private.

But that’s me. The important one here is you daughter. If she is uncomfortable and has asked him to stop, he is being extremely disrespectful if he continues. It will probably backfire in that she will refuse to go to his place. Don’t know if she old enough to refuse, but it would be interesting to see what a judge would say if it came to that.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Currently she wants to be there. She is convinced I lie about everything right now because he says I lie. She asks if her dad lies, and I try to guide her without coming out and saying "well duh, your dad was lying about his girlfriend months before we separated" because, one all I have is circumstantial evidence, and two I don't want to do the he said she said bit.

I did reply to her question by asking how long she felt daddy was dating POSOW before he told her and she said a long time. She, however does not accept that her dad lied and I won't come out and say "well he was lying to you". I have asked "what do you think about that?" and she shrugs says "well, I don't think he is a liar" and walks away. 

Today the boys had a med check with their psych. They offered family based therapy again. I hope it goes through this time. I've been trying for a while. My IC, I just found out, is a LSW. I thought I had a clinician as a counselor. I'm not sure how I feel about this. I need to start making tangible progress. My life is a hot mess right now. And I am not sure just talking about my problems is what I need at the moment.

Things I have identified...
my ADHD is a bit out of control. It's all I can do to keep up with the boy's appointments. As such, 
...house is a wreck
...finances are a wreck
...I'm exhausted all the time just looking at the mess.

I need someone to help me organize my life. It's a simple as that. Too bad there are no people out there that will just hold your hand through setting your life up alone before you go bankrupt.

Sigh.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

My fingers are crossed that you get the family therapy.

Are you on meds for your ADHD? If not, it might be something to talk to your doctor about. Its hard to organize your life and deal with all that stress when your thoughts are running out of control. 

Do you have someone to advise you financially. When my H left, I found two great advisers. One through my bank and the other was my insurance agent. Both helped me understand where I stood and set things up that would work for me. One thing I was able to do was reduce my insurance costs while still retaining adequate coverage.

I can’t imagine the stress that you are under. Try to take care of yourself.

Hug.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

We have tried various medications to no avail, but I am contemplating going back to try another. It's not that they don't work, it's that some of the side effects are too intense. Ritalin turned me into a zombie, adderal worked but it intensified my anxiety making me violently angry. Concerts I could not afford, so I need to try some other options. 

I've asked for financial help from the bank. I asked at the therapist. I asked at the boys case management. Every one tells me "I wish I knew some resources". The debt consolidation program I am with does not take all the debt. And I have to keep harping in them to pay the debtors by the due date. Beyond that I don't know.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Updating, as I haven't in a bit.
Hmm...have not been back to doc for meds for me yet. Money not there. Have to soon because physical due for school in a few weeks. 

He told DD "no" when she begged to go to the shore, then took his POSOW. She cried. I promised a trip, since it had been a few years since I had even seen my grandmother who lives there. I call my cousin who gets ahold of our other cousin to get me a cheap rate at the hotel she works at. Finalized the details then called the grandmother to let her know we were coming. Twenty minutes later, my oil is bone dry and my engine is grinding. I had just checked the oil the week before. This had me and the kids upset and although I couldn't afford it, I called Enterprise. I wasn't about to back out on this trip. Not with how many broken promises these kids have endured.

I have buyers remorse, but not enough to regret the trip. It was wonderful. I managed three kids (all of which were hyperactive from their excitement, let alone 2 of them being clinically thus) at the beach, with water everywhere BY MY SELF. No help. Nadda. It was empowering. 

My car is probably going to die.

My brother bought a really horribly ugly, beat up doors car and said the engine runs fine. It needs inspected and a new grill I believe. But I appreciate the gesture more than he knows.

I still am financially stupid. I pay the rent, the credit consolidator company and my electric bill. I ignore all else. Well, I didn't think I was ignoring the auto insurance, and they were supposed to be taking it automatically, but alas, they haven't. And now they want a triple payment. Why I sent them a voided check and routing information, I don't know. I will be calling them this week.

Hmm. 

So much to do. Not enough time.  Probably should take another semester off, but the more I do that the longer it will take to stand on my own two feet. Anyone want to move into my 2 bedroom apt and sleep on my trundle bed in exchange for watching my kids? LOL. 

I will figure it out. I normally work well under pressure, but um...well...that hasn't kicked in yet. We shall see. 

That's it in a nutshell.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

You are making al this progress, and you say you are not yet working well under pressure. Wish I could let you see through my eyes how well you are doing.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Wazza is right, BFG, you are doing better than you think. I’m glad you got a chance to get away with the kids and get that sense of empowerment. As women, we are raised to think that we need a man to help us through life; that we are incapable of doing it ourselves. When my H left, I was terrified. Never mind that I had been on my own for three years before we married, had moved from my parents’ to the far North to take a job I’d never done before, and had done just fine. Yet, there I was, convinced my daughter and I would end up on the street because I couldn’t manage everything without him. It was extremely empowering to discover that I could do it. You're doing it too. Things will work out. And, you know the best part? Your kids are seeing their mother, a woman, be strong and independent. This is so important, especially for your daughter.

I know the financial issues must be scary. I hope that improves soon. But you ARE doing great. My wish for you is that a year from now you will look back at everything that has happened and all you have done and say, “What was I so worried about?!” 

Stay strong.

Hug.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Thanks guys. It really was empowering. 

Had a friend from school come by when kids went to bed. We watched scary movies, drank wine and ate BAD food. Had a teenage style slumber party...plus alcohol lol. Was fun. Only issue is I out them to bed early which meant they were up at the crack of dawn. Oye.

Something is really grating on my nerves. POSOW has declared a movie I permitted the children to watch as inappropriate and has mentioned it in multiple occasions. I told the kids she has no authority to say what is and is not appropriate in my home. The middle kiddo is convinced she has as much authority as a mom and is a second mom. I keep explaining she is not a step mother and she won't be unless his dad marries her. That they need to respect her as an adult, but that I call the shots in the end. Me and their dad. Dad has banned said movie, because girlfriend thinks it is bad. Oh well. They can watch it here. 

My friend looked up her picture in Facebook last night. She kept taking about how hideously ugly she looked and had me laughing. I'm not one to look her up. I want nothing to do with her. So much so that I will probably flip out if he brings her to my house for my son's birthday as it is supposed to just be a small family affair. No party, just cake. He wants a pretty pricey bday gift so it's party or gift. I just don't want to share my sons birthday with her, and he wants mom and dad together for his birthday so I have to suck it up a little for him.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

It would be in extremely poor taste for him to bering her to your house, which of course, in his case, doesn’t rule it out. I’m not sure there is anything that you can do to prevent it. But should he be thick enough to do that, as hard as it will be, rise above it. Be gracious. It will speak well of you and confuse the heck out of him.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

I think that I wild focus on respecting the kids here. 

With the movie, my take would be to allow them to watch it, but if they choose not to because Dad and OW have banned it, that is a good thing.

The party is a little more difficult...well, a lot more difficult. I agree with FrostFlower to rise above it if you can. But if it is emotionally too big an ask, better to recognise it beforehand and make other arrangements for the birthday. Not fair on the kids at all, but then this never was. And remember you have this problem forever, sadly. Future birthdays, weddings, grandkids.....it sucks.

Can you talk to your ex beforehand and reach some agreement?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Kids already saw movie. They loved it and were talking about it at dads house.

I know I am not healed enough to deal with her. I just want to tell her to back away from my kids and get her own. To remember I am an always will be their mother not her and that she is nothing in the radar of significance if he is willing to leave his family for her wiles, he will leave her petty ass too eventually. I have nothing kind to say to her. She destroyed my family.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> Kids already saw movie. They loved it and were talking about it at dads house.
> 
> I know I am not healed enough to deal with her. I just want to tell her to back away from my kids and get her own. To remember I am an always will be their mother not her and that she is nothing in the radar of significance if he is willing to leave his family for her wiles, he will leave her petty ass too eventually. I have nothing kind to say to her. She destroyed my family.


Make it very clear to stbx that she is not to come to the party. Do this by email or text so that you can do it as calmly, unemotionally as possible. Should he try to argue, either in print, or by phone, do not enter into a discussion, simply repeat, “She is not welcome in my house.” and, if he has phoned, hang up.

You need to be prepared for the possibility that he will bring her anyway. Should she arrive on your doorstep, I don’t know how you would be able to get rid of her without a scene, which would upset the kids. Perhaps someone else can suggest a way. But have a plan as to how you will handle it. Rehearse it over and over in your mind. Try not to react emotionally as this will give him a ‘win’. 

I hope he has at least an iota of intelligence and will not be so insensitive......guess I can’t use that word for him.......will not be so stupid as to bring her.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Looks like he is arriving early to pick up kiddo on the day before his bday, so we will do cake then. He does not bring her when he picks them up.

Neighbors have officially started complaining about the noise coming from the apt. I don't know how to stop it. They are hyperactive kiddos. They sword fight to play and fight like soldiers when angry. They are angry a lot. Their family just broke up. Many times I am at my wits end. Not sure how I can make it better for the neighbors. Hopefully the BSC will help.

Finally started actively looking for childcare for school. Wish me luck.

Hoping everything works out. Getting nervous about getting kid let registered for kindy and all the last minute school prep stuff. Ugh.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Glad the birthday/OW issue seems to be resolved.

The noise one is difficult. How about involving the kids in finding solutions? Have a family meeting and explain the problem. Calmly let them know how serious it is and ask for their help in thinking of solutions. What are some ways they can expend their energy without causing the neighbors to complain? 

One idea might be to take up jogging as a family. Challenge them to run across the country or maybe around the state to begin. Keep track of the number of miles you run and mark it on a big map you stick up on the wall. If you can’t afford a pedometer, you can measure out a route with the odometer on the car.

A smaller idea along the same lines is to run around the block, or even just around the building and keep track of the number of times. Set a goal and a reward, for example fifty times around the building gets a pizza and movie night. Whatever will motivate them.

Look for a set of not-too-heavy weights at the local thrift shops. Keep them put away so that they don’t become missiles when tempers fly. Bring them out a a time every day when you can supervise.

Anybody else have some ideas to help the kids get rid of some excess energy?

The anger is harder, but I find that when kids are regularly exercising, it helps to regulate their emotions. 

What is the BSC?

Good luck with getting them all ready for school. I remember all the last minute scrambling to make sure all mine had what they needed, and all the angst about a new year in a new class. Make sure you take care of yourself.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Good suggestions FF. another way to work out distances is plug the route of your trips into google maps.

With the weights, if your apartment is on the top floor be aware that they will bang when put down. Careful with that.

We just used to take our kids out to a park.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I would like to get them moving. I am going to try that. 

So much for looking for a tread mill haha.

Ads out on Craigslist. Daycares that transport are few. One charges 120 a week to watch the boys 2 days a week for less than 5 hours each time. I cannot afford that. At all. In addition there will be extra days I will need help occasionally. 

Car died completely. It is sitting along side the road right now. My brother got a cheap car. I need to get it inspected though. Never enough money to go around. Ugh.

Keep having mini panic attacks this week. I'm just stressed with everything going on.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Cars are just a pain. I have been where you are...you will get through....


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Guess who just got internet installed? 

It means no oil change or inspection this month, but with school starting Monday, I was out of time. There are things that I MUST do before Monday and they can only be done online. Going to the library is a lesson in futility as they pester and fight and I do more intervening than work. This will enable me to work when they go to sleep at night.

Kids are with their dad until Tuesday night, which buys me a few more days to find child care. I am floundering. I paid money to care.com to look for babysitters there as well. Ack. This, and the child line clearances are the only things holding up school. I have a couple days. Keep your fingers crossed.

The car salesman has been texting me. I finally consented to a "friends only" coffee before work thing. It hasn't occurred. Maybe getting out with someone who is going through it too will be good for me. However, he is unemployed and fighting his own battle and sorry buddy, but I have my own baggage. I am not interested in dating at all, let alone someone with more baggage than me. Coffee would be nice though before a 12 hour shift. LOL

My emotions go up and down. I keep having panic attacks when things don't go according to plan. My sleep cycles are a wreck and all the doctor at the place I got my physical done had to say was "you are choosing to do this to yourself". O.k. miss, I-make-200-k-a-year, talk to me when you walk a mile in my shoes. Otherwise simply help the medical aspect of my problem.

Yeah, I didn't like her. 

But physical done and handed in. 

Kiddos start school the week after me. Little dude is so excited about kindergarten he can't contain himself. Although we took the behavior specialist to register him with us, and he eloped from the premises. Not sure how she is going to work out. I tore out of there and saw both my PDD boys missing and her struggling to run across the parking lot (she is a big girl). Of course I tore off after both of them, found them both and proceeded to deal with tiny tyke's tantrum all by myself. And he was doing so well. I don't know what has caused this behavioral bursts, other than maybe the introduction of melatonin, but he has been sleeping so much better since, so I'm confused. 

Well, um...contacted a gal who just graduated with a music ed degree. She might have fun babysitting with all my instruments laying around. Maybe she will contact me back...or maybe one of the cute manny's I contacted will. LOL.

Yes this post was random. It's my first back online. With my new computer. And new internet access and...I may or may not get used to this touch screen on a laptop windows 8 thing, but it sure is cool. 

Cheers!


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Welcome to regular contact!!! Fingers crossed for the next couple of days as you sort things for school.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Yay! Regular posts from BFG!

Melatonin shouldn’t cause behavioral stuff. Its naturally produced by the body . It should just help him sleep. Maybe it was overexcitement at the the whole Kindergarten thing.

Hope the beginning of school goes smoothly for the kids and that you can find someone great to do childcare. I’ve been thereand I know its a huge worry.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Whoops. I forgot that was a mutual Facebook link lol.

Friend posted "some girls really should leave boys with girlfriends alone" to which I replied "some girls spreallybshould leave men with husbands alone too". Only to have his niece post (she is 22 and adores his new w4ore) "what's that supposed to mean"

Back to avoiding talking about it on Facebook. Probably will get back to him. I know I shouldn't care, but the backlash is never fun dealing with. Why do I still care anyway? Most days I don't.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

You shouldn't care. Politically incorrect but he did the dirty on you. Why is it incumbent on you to cop it sweet? Forgive the language, but fvck him!!!!!!!!!

By the way, two posts in less that 24 hours. You realise we will have to charge you double the normal fee!

Good on you with the car salesman by the way. Be gentle with him. Attractive women can so easily break a man's heart.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Poor dude is unemployed. Couldn't handle the shark salesman thing. LOL. But not stable enough for me.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

That is ok. But let him down gently.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I've been as clear as one can be without being flat out rude, so if he doesn't know at this one that this is strictly platonic, then I can't do anymore lol. Given he hasn't made contact for an actual day and time so who knows, it may not happen.


Oh look! I have an avatar now! Taken long enough. It's my dads family crest. Contemplating taking the maiden name back.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Nix that avatar part. I can't figure out how to edit it small enough from the iPad lol.

Edit: Ok found one small enough and it's still not showing...hmmm.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

I couldn't figure out the icon/avatar thing either, need to try again.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

I agree that you shouldn’t care. What you said is true. If your niece ( niece through your family or his?) can
t handle it is not your problem.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

I am very curious as to what a Wazza avatar would look like!


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

It is thigh his family. Mind you he has them all convinced they got together after the separation...yup cuz jumping into bed with someone as soon as I ask for a separation screams fidelity.... And the little fact that legally we are still married.

It's not that I care she knows. I care simply because of the fear of it getting back to him. That he will make my life miserable when he finds out I "trashed his girlfriend on Facebook".


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

“I’m sorry you feel that way." 

“I don’t like where this conversation is going.”

In what ways could he make your life miserable? What is the worst he could do? Maybe we can think of some ways to handle it.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I don't know. Maybe I am over exaggerating. I just dread conversations with him where he makes me out to be the bad guy. I guess the worst he could do is deny the affair and claim I am trash talking him. Accuse me of trying to start trouble. I wouldn't have even posted it had I realized his niece was a mutual friend (I keep typing MY niece, but that's not true anymore is it?). 

I just want to puke at the thought of any verbal conflict with him. It makes me physically ill and causes panic attacks. Not healthy no, but I am working on it. 

I get torn between making nice to avoid conflict and just wanting to be a *****. But being a ***** won't help me out in anyway, and frankly the past few discussions we have had were cordial. I preferred it that way. 

Made me laugh when he complained that picking up the kids was wear and tear on his car. He's not driving a car from 1994. His is a 2013 model. Please don't complain to me about wear and tear on your car. I have to figure out transporting them to him soon. He is going to start pitching a fit soon. I can see it coming. Not looking forward to taking away from sleep time on Fridays though. Hmmm.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Where are you at with custody and support? Are the arrangement legally ratified yet?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Support legally ratified. So far he is happy with the custody arrangement and I don't want to push it since he could very easily come for more. I don't want to have them any less than I have them now. He says he sent the divorce papers back to his lawyers because he did not like that he was stipulating how much and when each of us had the kids. That is the one thing we have agreed on. I'd like it to stay that way. I mean, I'd love to have them more, but he would never agree to that. And if I tip the boat he will push for full custody just because he is angry. He threatened it when I took him for child support.

So that is not court ordered. Just support is. 

P.S. Kiddo 2 loves his group therapy program. So plus one for me. And kiddo 2 is acclimating with his BSC (but um...if he elopes it will be on me to catch him as she is rather slow LOL).

No judge in his right mind would move them now, but I just don't want the drama or the fight.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Well, it upsets me that you are living on dishrag soup and he is driving a new car and complaining that you have taken him to the cleaners.

My take is it is his problem to pick the kids up for access, not your problem to drop them over. Maybe I am being harsh, maybe an even load is fair. But I just think if you have arrangements nice and legal, you are in a better position to stand your ground with him.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Dishrag soup was last month. We are doing o.k. this month. LOL. I keep looking for quick meals...which don't exist but the freezer is stocked pretty good. The car though is about as good as a dishrag though. I will probably end up offering him gas money to pick them up on Fridays because I cannot go from 7 a.m. until 8 a.m. the following morning without sleep just because he doesn't want to drive all the way down. Also if I push the issue he will be all "then you have to pick them up on Mondays" which means basically he will withhold them from school since I could never get out of work in time to drive all the way up there to pick them up and get them to school in time. I'd lose my job. 

I'm scared to go to court over the kids. I don't have 10K in lawyer fees. And he could win them anyway.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Get a slow cooker...next best thing to quick meals. Risottos?

The way i define that stuff is "quick" means little effort to prepare and can be prepared at a time convenient for me. So for example tonight, a beef casserole prepared in the morning. Turned on in the afternoon ready for supper time (or I could have done it in the slow cooker). Couscous and steamed veg take literally five minutes. Easy, and not too expensive either.

We can swap recipes if you like. I am such a domestic goddess!!


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I have got to start using mine more. I keep forgetting at have it! No cous cous though as it has gluten, but hey, rice and Quinoa work fabulous...and then to work some more of my leftover magic and make them think its not the same dish night too. 

For example...homemade tacos (soft tortillas and taco meat seasoning I make from scratch) the next day take the left over meat and add ketchup and brown sugar and voila...sloppy joes. Then all I have to make are the rolls which don't take too long to prepare, just gotta let them rise.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Yum. I am coming to your place for supper tomorrow.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

So, I was running late due to kiddo pitching fits while running errands. I get up to his place, and he hands me divorce papers and tells me to look them over...um...3 days before class starts.

I know I kept pushing for it, but once again find myself saddened that he rushed to her, is doing things with her he refused to do with me, and it is just sad. 

Not sure when I will get a chance to review them, but I don't really want to look at them yet either.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Sigh....read them. You need to. Do you have legal advice?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Yeah, my mom bought a subscription to legal shield. I am going to send them to those lawyers as well to peruse. I just don't have the stamina to look through them this week.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

How far do you have to go to get the kids to him? How about an exchange spot halfway between you?

The slow cooker has been a God-send at our house. Mine is big enough that, if I fill it, We get a meal out of it and enough to freeze for one or two future dinners. I prepare meals on the weekend that can just be popped in the oven during that week And I often get a meal ready in the crock pot, put it in the fridge, then just stick it in the electric base one morning before leaving for work. It cooks all day and is ready when we get home, but it saves getting up early and preparing it in the morning. 

One of our favorites is Crock Pot Lasagna. Easy!


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I totally need a gluten/dairy free crock pot cookbook. LOL

He lives about 1.5 hours away. I haven't had a car safe enough to transport so he has been picking up and dropping off, but it seems wrong to make him to both all the time. So I drop off and he brings them home. He has to bring them home as I am still in work when DD school day starts. He has to get her to school.

Found a babysitter, if the references check out. At least for the 2 days a week. I may need a back up, but for now, this will get things going. Waiting on one last clearance and we are set. That feels good.

Still haven't looked at the papers. I may need a hotel and a bottle of hard liquor to get through it.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

You are being way to much of a nice guy. Why do you think he could get custody of the kids if he tried?

Have you gone through the old bills online to see if you could find out when he started cheating by the texts and calls to her number?

Adultery is a big deal in some states, nothing in others. What state do you live in?

Under no circumstances sign any papers without an attorney looking them over. You can't believe anything a cheater says.

Cowboy up girl, nothing in his life is your concern or worry. The last thing you need for you or your kids is to get a raw deal and that messes up your future, your kids future, and your future relationships.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Adultery not a big deal here. He is also a specialist in their disorders. So he has that leg to stand on. I have gone through bills and there are questionable items but nothing I can prove. He also had his own cell plan and never let it go, which we know is proof but not admissible in a court of law. 

I do have a legal advisor who will look over the papers. I just haven't hired them as a lawyer yet.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Well, first day of class under my belt and now begins the panic attacks that ensue the first two weeks as I try to get myself organized.

#IcandothisIcandothisIcandothis ad nauseum


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Yay!!!!!!

I have no doubt you can do it, too.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Be prepared for much whining. The way this program is organized has me in a tizzy for half the semester LOL. Ok maybe not half, but it reduced me to not being able to breathe and sobbing like I just buried a child or something the first semester, and that was just trying to get organized! Haha. 

Hopefully I remember something organizationally wise. I don't have an OCD husband to help put me back in order this time around. 

Here goes nuthin! Eeek.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Elementary school called today to inform me little dude would not be permitted into a.m. kindergarten. I had childcare lined up for an hour or two before they got on the bus and an hour or two after the got off the bus two days a week based off of a.m. kindy.

Now, my classes are already in session. I've put things toward my loans that cannot be returned (laptop for starts) and I have just been informed that in order for me to stay in school I will need to hire full time care. I cannot afford full time day care. No ifs ands or buts. Don't tell me to talk to him about it. I know legally he is supposed to but I cannot emotionally handled telling him he needs to give more money. He just causes my anxiety to sky rocket further with his threats of taking the children. If he does, sure I can finish school, but not really because then "I" owe support and I won't have enough money to stay in my apartment. There are no dorms at my school.

Brain is reeling. I can't stop crying. If I drop they won't let me back in the program since I already dropped one semester. I thought this was all worked out. I thought it would be hard, but I was going to be able to push through. I've spent hundreds just trying to get back to school and now it's all for naught. Fvck


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> Elementary school called today to inform me little dude would not be permitted into a.m. kindergarten. I had childcare lined up for an hour or two before they got on the bus and an hour or two after the got off the bus two days a week based off of a.m. kindy.
> 
> Now, my classes are already in session. I've put things toward my loans that cannot be returned (laptop for starts) and I have just been informed that in order for me to stay in school I will need to hire full time care. I cannot afford full time day care. No ifs ands or buts. Don't tell me to talk to him about it. I know legally he is supposed to but I cannot emotionally handled telling him he needs to give more money. He just causes my anxiety to sky rocket further with his threats of taking the children. If he does, sure I can finish school, but not really because then "I" owe support and I won't have enough money to stay in my apartment. There are no dorms at my school.
> 
> Brain is reeling. I can't stop crying. If I drop they won't let me back in the program since I already dropped one semester. I thought this was all worked out. I thought it would be hard, but I was going to be able to push through. I've spent hundreds just trying to get back to school and now it's all for naught. Fvck


OK...don't panic.

Why won't they take your little dude? "Not permitted" for what reason?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

There is apparently a wait list for a.m. kindy. 

Neighbor lady has agreed to watch them for twice as much as I was paying before. It is not unreasonable her request. It isn't. I just don't have it and am going to have to figure it out. I don't know how long they will last either. She is a little old lady with a 3 year old she babysits. My boys are rough.

I still need to retain the other gal for night clinical rotations as well. I hope she agrees to stay on. Ugh. 

Seriously contemplating trying to take on a few music students, but scared of running myself ragged. Already work full time and in school full time. I just don't know where to get the extra money. :/


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Why do people search for drama? I just want calm, and boring. Really. I want to be able to breathe and stop having anxiety attacks. I am not afraid of hard work, but this one step forward ten steps back clawing all the way is like living during the World Wars in Europe.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

Why do you think your husband could get custody if he tried?


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Are there other kindies you could try? How long is the wait list?

Sorry, obvious questions....just going over things.

You have come so far...you are amazing, and you will get through this.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Chapperal I've explained it a few times in this thread, even a page or two back I believe. 

We cannot switch school districts without paying full tuition prices in our state, plus providing transporation. Last time we checked into that as an option as we were planning on moving and working out the transition (a few years ago) that public school wanted 1500 a month per child until we resided in the district. 

Private kindies are 775 a month at the cheapest and that does not address the fact that the older kid would still need child care twice a week. And I'd have to pay a sitter to watch them while I had night clinical. 

Little dude just pitched a massive tantrum. STBX just arrive five minutes after I posted last. We did bigger noy's bday thing today. He got what he wanted and little dude got so jealous he pitched a massive fit, running away, and much like his fits of old. It lasted over an hour. I am physically and mentally exhausted and jerk wants to know when I am going to get around to reading the divorce papers. I just want to pummel him.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

BFGuru said:


> Chapperal I've explained it a few times in this thread, even a page or two back I believe.
> 
> We cannot switch school districts without paying full tuition prices in our state, plus providing transporation. Last time we checked into that as an option as we were planning on moving and working out the transition (a few years ago) that public school wanted 1500 a month per child until we resided in the district.
> 
> ...


I don't see the connection with custody.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Sorry, I wasn't explaining the custody. I was explaining the switching schools. I'm too emotionally drained to explain the custody thing again at the moment.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

And the kid is raging again. I am running off of 4 hours of sleep since Sunday. I have a ton of homework. I just don't think I can do this at the moment.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

How are you doing?


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Had you been told originally that your son would be in the a.m. class? 

Go to the principal and explain your situation. If that doesn’t get you anywhere, make an appointment to see the superintendent. If s/he is too busy to see you, go and sit in the waiting room until s/he does see you. Don’t go in on the attack as that will get you nowhere. Calmly explain your situation and ask what can be done. There may be a waiting list, but that doesn’t mean they shouldn’t be able to prioritize. There is a vast difference between your case and a parent who simply wants their child in the morning class because they prefer it. 

Good luck.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Calmer. But still stressed. I have no idea where the extra money is going to come from for the day care, and very concerned about this older woman watching him. 

I also want to retain the original gal for when I have night classes (in september). So now, in order to be fair I need to hire her occasionally so she doesn't run off to another job. I could use the time to study, but I can't afford it. 

I just posted an ad to craigslist for private music lessons. I cannot think of anything else I can do that would not be extremely physically exhausting and yet, the extra practice time needed to be able to do this right is going to cut into study time as well. 

Whoever said there was tons of help for single moms was lying out their a$$. 

Just spent hours trying to get new computer functioning to be able to log into the website I have to take tests through. 

I actually sat down to study earlier and passed out. Almost missed kindergarten orientation completely tonight. Got there a half hour before it ended. Kiddo did not get to ride the bus and learn the rules for the bus because we got there too late, but did get to meet the teacher.

STBX keeps pestering me about the divorce papers. I told him he had all summer to get them to me and didn't. It was unfair, and wrong for him to expect me to go over them any time in the next few weeks. He is aware of what is going on with school and knows how tough those first few weeks are. ANd knows about the childcare issue. I told him as much and it was ridiculous to expect me to be able to commit time to a huge stack of divorce papers now. His response was "well I want to file for bankruptcy and it would benefit you to sign them before then." I said "you can wait. You've waited this long".

Seriously just want to punch him in the face every time I see him anymore. 

I blame him for my current predicaments. If he wasn't a cheating lying b-tard I would have a parent to watch these kids while I went to school. Or the combined income. I wouldn't be struggling to fit yet one more thing into my schedule. 

I know I shouldn't and it is playing the victim. At least I know that in my head. I just...ugh. Once upon a time I truly believed if you just worked hard enough you could accomplish anything. I'm starting to doubt that philosophy. It seems no matter how hard I work, something always falls apart. I'm just tired of it.

I don't even ask for easy. Just as difficult as everyone else. I'll settle for even slightly more difficult. But this fighting for every single thing non stop is getting exhausting.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Frostflower said:


> Had you been told originally that your son would be in the a.m. class?
> 
> Go to the principal and explain your situation. If that doesn’t get you anywhere, make an appointment to see the superintendent. If s/he is too busy to see you, go and sit in the waiting room until s/he does see you. Don’t go in on the attack as that will get you nowhere. Calmly explain your situation and ask what can be done. There may be a waiting list, but that doesn’t mean they shouldn’t be able to prioritize. There is a vast difference between your case and a parent who simply wants their child in the morning class because they prefer it.
> 
> Good luck.


I just don't have anymore time to devote to this. I am missing assignments in school already because of it. I can't fight it anymore. I've also done the fight the year before with the older boy and his allergy meds and 504 plan. I'm just too drained to keep fighting. I've spoken with the principal and she won't even address it. Sends me straight to whoever handled it. They did not originally promise. I was simply told by the district and principal last year (new one this year as he moved up to superintendant) that all it takes is a phone call. 

I guess that's all I can do. 

His class though is extremely diverse for less than 20 students. There were foreign accents everywhere in orientation. I think it will be good for him.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I quit. My car just broke down on the way to class. It's obvious not only does my husband hate me, but the entire universe as well.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> I quit. My car just broke down on the way to class. It's obvious not only does my husband hate me, but the entire universe as well.


Bad week. But hang in there. It is worth it.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Old coworker of both of ours just contacted me. Says she is angry because he got her fired. I said I'm sorry. She said I'm sorry he's bringing another child into this mess. I said "when is she due?" 

"They just announced it at work. I don't know".
"Well that explains the rush on the divorce papers. Sorry about the job. Hope you find a new one soon."
"Thanks"
"I have a test in five minutes gotta run. Best of luck"

And I left. 

I knew this would happen. Doesn't make my hands stop shaking. Doesn't stop my brain from wondering if he freaked out on her like he did every time I got pregnant. Doesn't make me want to sign divorce papers any faster. Maybe I'll wait 9 months. Then the kid will be born a bastard.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Ouch.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

So, do I let on that I know? The problem is, I never know what is the right thing to do. Poor innocent kid being born into his disaster of a life. (Ok mine is pretty effed up too right now, but I'm not making babies). 

Definitely divorce papers are off the table until I figure out how this is going to affect my kids.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Not an expert on divorce, but as I understand it, if you don't look at them, one risk is whatever he says goes through uncontested and you might be stuck with a less favourable decision than you would otherwise get. I don't believe you can necessarily stonewall on this. I imagine there is a time limit.

But I am not a lawyer.

Control the things you can control (and I still think you are doing a great job with all that!) and deal with what you can't control on the way that causes you least pain.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I think it is 2 years. I will be calling legal aide in Monday though.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

God this post looks like a troll. And we are separated. And he was a manipulative pr!ck. And I was pushing him to divorce me. And I KNEW he was too stupid to wrap it. So it isn't a surprise, so why do I feel like this is such a betrayal? Why is it that he is gallivanting around parading his new girlfriend to the masses, enjoying life while people pay his bills for him and I am facing the stark reality that even after the child support clears I have 200 dollars left after rent. The babysitter for me to go to school is 100 a week. So I can pay her and we can run out of food this pay period. Or I can drop out of school and have enough to pay for my car loan and insurance and maybe some eggs. 

Where does the money go so fast? I'm paying the bare essential bills. Why do they pander to him so much? Why does she even want a baby with him when his children may very well hurt her baby? How is this going to affect them? 

Why was asking for marriage and individual counseling "unrealistic demands" for reconciliation? (ok I know why but my heart is aching today). 

When will I simply just be able to breathe? I've been counting down just to be able to say I made it to 6 months, and yet...my education I have worked toward for 10 years (he kept pushing me to quit each time I tried to continue...once I lost a daycare provider 3 days before school started and once I got sick and was on bed rest for months so it wasn't ALL him...however...he would get angry that I was up all night studying or get angry that I wasn't cleaning the house. I sucked at housecleaning and still do. It has always been at the center of every argument even if it didn't start as an argument about housecleaning. Ten years, and now when there are 3 semesters left...he may ultimately win. 

The math is there. I just can't afford to go to school. The courts have dictated what is appropriate for him to pay in support so it doesn't change much from here. 

And so he gets divorced and lives happily ever after and I struggle watching everything I've worked for disappear. My dream house, my marriage, my family dissolved. And he gets to gloat that his 40 something year old sperm has made a baby. I just...ugh.

I feel like what's the point right now of even talking. I may take a break. I'm starting not to believe most of the **** I type. It just. doesn't. stop. 

Someone told me today "It can't get any worse" and I laughed and said "I've told myself that every day this week and yet it did".

I'm on such overload that I can't even react like I normally do to belligerent patients. I thought I could. I've been cussed out before, called names. Heck, no one wants to be in the hospital and those older ones go nutso at night. But I just had a visceral reaction to being called an idiotic ignoramous and "too stupid to explain it to" that I finally told the nurse I couldn't deal with the patient anymore. I have NEVER said that about a patient before. I don't care what you say about me or to me. I am clocking out when my shift is over and going home and not thinking about you again...but it really upset me today and I know it's because I feel like it's just one more negative to a long list of negatives.

I don't know. I may change my mind. But right now I just feel like it's too surreal to be real and the rest of the world probably thinks that too so I should just shut up.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

How long will school run for? What do you get at the end?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I hought if I just shut up for a while I would see it isn't as bad as it I thought it was. Things just get worse. Something happens daily. 

He is texting people calling me an idiot, but oops he is texting me by mistake. Kiddo just beat me up on way to babysitter making me have to take him home because she is 80 and can't handle it. I'm missing class today. But it doesn't matter anyway. I am quitting the end of the week because the money is long gone. 

I'm snapping. Falling apart, and there's not a damn thing anyone can do.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Sorry I haven’t been here. I haven’t been getting the email updates.

My heart goes out to you, BFG. This is all so unfair.

Are you able to put the schooling on hold? Are you eligible for a loan? Perhaps explaining your situation to the dean might help.

If there is no way to continue right now, perhaps finding a job will help you to get on your feet financially. Would you be able to work as a nurse’s aide? I know that’s not what you want, but you are drowning financially and the stress is killing you. If you end up sick, either physically or emotionally, what will happen to the kids?

As for the texts, print them. If you don’t have a printer, save them in a file. When you talk to legal aid, ask what your rights are. If there is nothing you can do, continue to save them. At some point they may come in handy. But file them without reading them. You don’t need the added stress of reading his poison. 

I know you haven’t wanted to consider medication for your son, but perhaps it is time to talk to his doctor. He is physically hurting you. What will happen in school, and yes, to the baby? I had a student who raged and would become physically aggressive. One day when his Mom was driving on the highway he freaked, got out of his safety seat and attacked her. She barely managed to pull over. She had been adamant about not medicating him, but this incident scared her, not just for herself and for him, but for her other children. She took him to the doctor the next day and he was put on meds. The result was actually amazing. He was able not only to employ the calming strategies that we had been trying to teach him, but to remain calm enough to learn. And his self-esteem grew. Before, he saw himself as ‘bad’. No-one called him that. He saw his behavior and made that judgement on his own.

No-one likes to medicate kids, but I have no doubt you would if he were diabetic. If it is what his brain needs to achieve healthy functioning, isn’t it worth a trial?

By the way, Wazza is right. Considering what you are living with, you are doing great. 

Hug.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I do work as an aide. I just can't make enough money to survive with the hours I can work since I have the kids. 

Babysitter just called and said she doesn't want him back at all as he hit me in front of her.

I was depending on my student loans to help me survive. 

My credit is shot to hell. I cannot obtain a loan. Couldn't make the payments anyway. Can't afford the loan payments on the car that died. 

I am not doing great. Probably will be fired. I walked off the job over something stupid Sunday. 

I can't stop crying anymore. 

And medicine at his age serious health affects. It's not like a diabetic med where meds can save his life. The meds they want to try CAUSE things like diabetes. They destroy the pancreas and cause heart issues.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Ok, stay calm. Deep breaths. You can get through this.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

I am extremely worried about you and about your son. You can’t continue like this. I don’t want to scare you but if he hurts another child, you may end up with the police and social services involved. And the effects of living like this can only be detrimental to both of you.

It may sound like I push drugs. I don’t. We at school and the parents try everything possible to avoid it. But in the cases of the three kids we’ve had who take Risperidal to help control raging, the parents were at their wits’ end. And, in a way, it has saved these kids’ lives. They are now able to function, which was significantly impaired before. Their peers were afraid of them and avoided them and aides asked not to work with them because of their unpredictable and aggressive behavior. All that has changed now.

None of the kids had any of the side effects listed here:

Risperdal (risperidone) Uses, Dosage, Side Effects - Drugs.com

Anyway, enough said. I understand your reluctance to go the meds route. My H and I anguished over putting our son on Ritalin which is a lesser drug. 

Does your supervisor at work know your situation? Not great to talk to non-significant others about it I know, but it may help if s/he understands the pressures you are under. 

Can you increase your hours if you have to stop school? If you can gain more income, it will help relieve a lot of the stress.

Contact your sons’ school. They may know of a babysitter who can deal with your son’s challenges. Failing that, ask any therapists involved with him. It may prove fruitless, but its worth a shot.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I should just let him have them. At least with his w4ore, they can afford to feed them. They walked around after dinner whining they were hungry all night because I have to ration food so it will last until pay day. 

I hate him for what he has reduced me to, and yet...I loved him. I lived my life for him and do not understand his hatred for me one bit. 

I will probably never see my kids again if I give them over to him. And the child support will be gone, so I will not be able to afford my apartment. 

Yay for life living in a car. He predicted it and was right. 

I'm a horrible human.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I've spoken to all of them and I do know children who have had the side effects of risperdal. My own brother jumped 200 lbs in a year. I cannot subject a five year old to that. 

All anyone tells me is "I wish there was something I could do to help"

Or my favorite "you can't expect anything else when you serve the devil" (coming from family who do not accept that I do not go to church anymore).


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

You are not a horrible human being. You are doing your best, which is all anyone can ask. 

If food is so short that you have to ration it and the kids are hungry, can you access food banks? What about social services? Better you should contact them and ask for help than a teacher worried about hungry children. Or worse, your x after the kids tell him they’re hungry when at your place.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Frostflower said:


> You are not a horrible human being. You are doing your best, which is all anyone can ask.
> 
> If food is so short that you have to ration it and the kids are hungry, can you access food banks? What about social services? Better you should contact them and ask for help than a teacher worried about hungry children. Or worse, your x after the kids tell him they’re hungry when at your place.


I have contacted social svc. they issued a food voucher for a food bank. the boys can't have most of what is in tye foid bank. x keeps offering to take them and in spite of it guaranteeing i won't have the money for rent because it means he does not need to pay chikd support to me i am seriously starting to consider his offer. if obly for tue kids sake. he wilk have full access to tell them how horrible I am but is that a reason to keep your kids? Am i being selfish to hold on to them so tight? Will they think I hate them for letting them go? He has the resources to care for them he says. Maybe i should just listen.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

You said at one point that support payments were legally agreed but custody was not. Is that right?

How does that work, I thought custody was a factor in determining support costs.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Do you have a social worker assigned to you? If not, it might be a good idea to ask for one. You need more support than you are getting, someone in your corner who knows what resources are out there and how to access them.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

They have a county case manager. They issued a food bank voucher today that should be here in the next day or two. That is about all they could provide. 

There is no day care help, or financial help. Nothing like that. 

I found out yesterday that my friend's mother is a welfare advocate. I called her today but she has not called back.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Fingers crossed that your friend’s mom can help. It is so unfair that your x can live well while you and the kids have to use food banks.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

She is coming tomorrow.

I see little options but to move to my parents. They are across the country. I don't think he will let them come with me, even though he will have his hands busy with a newborn.

I just. 

want to crawl into a dark hole and forget the world.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Thinking of you. Let us know how it is going. Hope you find a better option.

I don't like your ex very much.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Welfare advocate was supposed to be here at 12:30. It's 1:10 now and no sign of her.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Jeez, BFG, I hope when she shows up she has some solutions that will work.

Hang in there.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Something happened at some appointment she was at so she needs to reschedule. :/

Quitting school solved my groceries dilemma though. Sigh.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

I’m so sorry you had to do that. Can you return to it at a later date?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Because I got sick last semester long term, it will be my second drop. I will no longer be allowed back in the program.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

That seems incredibly unfair. Even if they counted this time, its not your fault you were sick. Can you appeal?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

No.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Another school perhaps?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Not until I pay back the original school for the supplies that should have been on my financial aid, I believe.

Just checked the bank account. I should not have gotten kids drinks at McDonalds when I dropped them off at a half way point to meet their dad. There is no A/C in my car and they were sweating. I do not have enough for my rent now.

I am officially waking up daily wondering what will go wrong now. You can feed your children or you can have a roof over your head. You don't get both. 

So much for America being the land of opportunity.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

So it looks more and more like I will have no choice but to move in with my parents. Almost 40 years old and living with mom and dad. What is the probability of me taking the kids with me? Will a judge allow it? 

They are still yelling at me when I tell them no to purchasing things. I have stopped telling them because I am broke. I just tell them no anymore. But it is not good enough. They constantly bring up that I am lying because "dad gives you XYZ per month". And telling me how daddy has no money and that's why thw w4ore had to move in.

I just don't understand why they don't see through this nonsense. Why don't they see what we drive around in vs. their dad's brand new car (edit. cars. yes plural because girlfriend felt she needed a vehicle for 4 kids)? That I don't even have a bedroom? While daddy may live in a trailer, but it's a 4 bedroom trailer. Why do they not see through this nonsense? Even when I explain to them the math they tell me I'm lying because daddy said so. 

And yet, if I end up homeless, I lose my kids. If I try to move back to my parents and start over...I lose my kids.

This is all so fvcking unfair.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Kids don't understand money. But yes, it is incredibly unfair.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

For the record, my parents are across the country. I fear he will not allow them out of the state.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

He is back to trying to prove me unfit so I can't take them out of the state. 

Not a single option I have ends with me keeping my children.

If he's that convinced, maybe I am unfit. I was unfit to stay married to. I sure have been useless since withdrawing from school. 

They are my only reason left for living. And I'm going to lose them too.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

You are not unfit. An unfit mother would not have coped with what you are living with every day as well as you have. 

As for being unfit to stay married to, he is the one who is unfit. Although he is in the field of special needs, he has refused to carry out plans which would help the boys. He hooked up with someone else while still married and got her pregnant. He is now no longer with the woman who is carrying his baby. He has put you (and his children when they are with you) in an untenable financial situation. He has taken every opportunity to put you down in order to destroy your self esteem. 

He is unfit as a human being.

Did you manage to meet with that social worker? If not, get on the phone, a hundred times a day if necessary. If that doesn’t work, go to her office and sit there until she, or someone else sees you. You are in crisis. You need help NOW.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

He is still with the other woman. She bought him a "family" car to fit all of our children. 

the lady never called me back. 

I just want to give up on everything anymore.


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## LaQueso (Dec 30, 2012)

I usually only get to lurk but I had to let you know, you are not an unfit mama!!
If He chose to leave the children in your care so many months ago then they are still just fine with you.You are the one making sure those children are well fed and taken care of, while he was busy fiddling about. 
I see myself in your position too. My Twerp is letting his POSOW write me emails accusing me of all kinds of outlandishness, including my house being so filthy that I have mice and declaring that if I need help he can provide it or a better space for the kids. I live in a state where mice, bugs and lizards are so normal that it's even mentioned in tourist brochures. If he came to to help, he'd have to help the other 12 houses on my block too. He chose to leave the kids in my care over a year ago and is now realizing the mistake he made. 
I really wish there was resting spot for you. Do you go to church? I found a great one with childcare that I could trust and once a week, I get an hour's break. There is also little group meetups and we go to a park or play land and vent and counsel each other while the kids play. That hour gets me through a little better. Plus having someone else tell me I'm not stupid or crazy is so sweet. Take advantage, even if you aren't religious. Many times they want to help just because. ( I have been known to take the cute little Mormon kid's up on their offers to help clean a yard!)
You are in a crappy spot but this isn't the end.
Are you in the USA? Call a Rep or Congressman up. Explain your story and ask them for help on what to do. It really is their job to help peoplelikeyou.
Several months ago, the Child Support wasn't being paid and I was being given the run around by him, the lawyers and the CS agency. I was in tears, with five kids, no food, no gas, electric about to be cut off and being told, it may be a month or more before the CS could be resolved. My mom had me call a rep and the next day I had a check delivered.
Don't give up!! There is hope! You are not an unfit mom!!!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Seasong (Mar 1, 2012)

Bfguru,

Hi, I have read your thread but don't post on here so have not commented much. However, your story tugs at my heart. Please no matter what, don't give up. I left my ex and took my three children. My son has ADHD and had later been diagnosed with ODD and possible Bipolar disorder. My daughters had some food allergies but were otherwise healthy. I remember the struggles and the fight to not give in to my ex or even my kids when they 'turned on me'...Life has a funny way of turning out. I will PM you in a few days if that's okay with you. There was a time I couldn't see a way out but things did get better, but they were bad for a while. 
You have to find a way to remember that there are years to think about, not just the now. Your husband is having a baby and most likely will have trouble managing a household without your help. So don't ALLOW yourself to give in to negative feelings. Easier said than done but there is no way that you have any time to let him get inside your head and stay there. You don't have much room to fall apart, but even less so because that's exactly what he wants. I did all those things but had friends to help me remember what a good mother I had always been. I was accused of everything under the sun just short of murder. 

You are in a dark place but don't throw in the towel, please. Your kids need you to fight for them. Give up being rigid in some of your thinking and maybe doors will open. School is over for now, and there is no time to mourn. What can you do instead? What else can you do for your son other than diet? Things like that. What can your parents do for you from a distance? Don't let them guilt you but don't blast them if you can help it that they might want to 'save your soul' etc. 

Sorry this sounds so scattered. Just posting random thoughts. I had a situation similar to yours but in some ways much worse as far as my ex was but my parents were more helpful financially. My life now is so different but back then, which isn't so far ago. I say pat yourself on the back for being the best mom you can be given your circumstances. 
shame on him for his actions but don't think about the past or even waste time on missing those times. Not worth all that anger. Hang on tight and look at those beautiful kids you have. Think of their futures.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Kiddo has to outline a chapter for homework. She refuses. Keeps claiming she doesn't know how to do it. I try to help her, she yells at me. I flat out give her what her title should be, she throws the paper and tells me I don't know what I'm doing. This is par for the course when it comes to helping her. Given her father may be able to help with things like that, but I've taken much higher science and maths than him, and although he has a masters degree, I proof read most of his papers until the very end when he finally had confidence.

What bothers me most, is this tantrum ends with her repeatedly telling me she hates me. She fvcking hates me. She's soon not coming back and doesn't want to live here anymore. 

She's just in her room saying how much she hates me and that her not getting her homework done is all my fault. 

Why do I try? They really do hate me. I should just let him have them and drive off a bridge. Somehow I have failed royally as a wife, and a mother, and nothing I can do will fix that.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

BFG, kids do that. It is normal, and worse given what they have to do with.

I know it doesn't help when they are being like that, but you just have to know that it is not you. It is what it is.

I am so sorry for what you are going through.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Homework is a destructive force within family life. My son used to beg me to help him, and it would end with a book being flung at my head. And I’m a teacher! My H can do math like a whiz. He cannot teach. Things rarely end well with him either. There should be a law against homework.

What I’m saying is that the scenario you described is normal and is enacted in thousands of homes across the continent every evening. 

Try to put it in perspective. She is a teen, going through all that hormonal stuff and filled with angst. She has two very challenging brothers. Her family has just broken up and life as she has always known it has changed drastically. She is trying to deal with it all as best she can.

Kiddo doesn’t hate you. She hates the situation. 

As far as the dreaded homework goes, offer help. If she refuses or becomes verbally abusive, leave the room. There are natural consequences to not getting your homework done. She may have to stay in at recess or after school. She will learn to accept help. 

If difficulty with homework becomes a pattern, talk to her teachers. Find out why it is a problem. The solution may be as simple as a little extra help in class. She may be having difficulty focusing, which would be quite natural given all the changes in her life. 

Can you talk to the counsellor at her school? She needs a neutral person she can talk with.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I know this in my head. We have fought over homework for years. I just can't take being called a liar. And the fact that is wh0res MOTHER, not even the girlfriend told my daughter she was old enough to legally dictate where she lives (yes my daughter told me this and then refused to tell me who told her, but her brother ratted the guilty party out), has me infurated. Who are these people? I've never even met their daughter, let alone them. Why would they feel they within their rights to sabotage my relationship with my daughter? What is wrong with people?


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## 06Daddio08 (Jul 26, 2012)

BFGuru, I'm sorry you're going through this with your daughter but try to remember, she's going through a lot as well. Her thought process is unfiltered and juvenile.

I think the one thing you have to realize is that you cannot parent in fear of being hated because they don't like it. I "hated" my parents for most of my teenage years, even after my father passed when I was 21 I still held anger through the sadness.

It was only when I grew up and experienced life on my own, that I realized how things really worked. Ironically enough, I father my children just as mine did me but I've tweaked it. Do I still have my off days? Yes of course and I can feel bad about it for a while but then I start feeling better.

I can only give advice to you on this based on how I feel I would act in the future with my daughter ... but I would not tolerate such language or behavior from her.

If she wanted to live at her mother's so badly, I'd let her. The "freedom" she seeks from the other side will eventually become hollow. That girl needs structure and consequences, she could also probably use an unbiased 3rd party to talk to as well.

Then again, I refused counseling as a teen too. Lol.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

She refuses counseling. 

She won't find her dad's hollow. She's always been a daddy's girl. And with how often he calls me things like "idiot" or even "*****" in front of the kids, they already think it is is ok. to speak to me with those words. They are starting to believe it. i don't want her to go live with her father, because I will emotionally lose her forever.


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## 06Daddio08 (Jul 26, 2012)

*Re: Re: This is real*



BFGuru said:


> She refuses counseling.
> 
> She won't find her dad's hollow. She's always been a daddy's girl. And with how often he calls me things like "idiot" or even "*****" in front of the kids, they already think it is is ok. to speak to me with those words. They are starting to believe it. i don't want her to go live with her father, because I will emotionally lose her forever.


I have a cousin who had parents (my uncle) that divorced very bad. They talked crap about each other non-stop and she didn't like her father much.

Years later, once she had kids and got a taste of how life was ... who do you think she's closer with more than ever?


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Calling their mother names in front of the kids is disgusting. It is also slander. The man is an ignorant jerk. His behavior would not go down well with a judge. Of course that is not going to help you at this point.

Talk to your kids. Ask them how they feel when their father talks like that. If it bothers them, which I suspect it does, help them brainstorm how they can handle it in a respectful way that lets him know that they will not put up with it. They can certainly leave the room, or not call you to pick them up (if they do, meet them outside. Don’t engage with him.).


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I'm just ugh. Can't eat. I feel hypoglycemic but I get nauseous when I eat. I am trying so hard to pull myself out of this funk. I just can't figure out how. I actually called an old voice teacher to adk if I can drive back to where she lives and just sing in her studio for a while. I am just...ugh.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Music is good. Music helps.

What else do you like to do?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I used to watch Fringe when I couldn't sleep, but I just finished the series. 

I don't know. I like to knit, but I don't have the supplies and my eyes hurt to bad to read a pattern right now. 

I had two people contact me regarding music lessons today. I'm scared to call them back. I haven't taught in almost ten years.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Call them back. Do it.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I called. No one has committed yet.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Normal for that game. You did it before, you know that, and you also know you can do it.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

This stuff is not like riding a bike. Definitely nervous.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

You will be fine. I am sure of it.

And it is like riding a bike, you don't forget how. It comes back. You are nervous at first but hide it. All you have to do is be better than your student!


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

How are you doing? Just checking in.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Not. Doing.

Car just got towed for expired inspection because I couldn't afford it. Now they want more in cash than I have in my account and it increases the amount daily. 

I should have just gone without groceries and got it inspected. I was just too afraid of something being wrong with it and not getting it back. Well, now I don't get it back and can't get to work, or the boys' doctor appointment.

Pretty sure I will be homeless next month.

Goodbye kids.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Is there no family member who can help you with all this?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

No. Parents both just had surgery and are unemployed, and live across the country.

Brother 1 just spent his savings on the damn car.

brother 2 is on disability. 

No other family. Except those that tell me that I can't expect anything else because I don't love Jesus. (I am an atheist)


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Well, I am a Christian but I cannot agree with the notion that loving Jesus will make all this go away. 

What sort of money are we talking? You don't have to answer if you don't want to. Just curious.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

It's 225 just to get it out of there by tomorrow. Every day it is there is another 35 dollars, plus the price of inspection, and any repairs they deem necessary. Oh, and I guess the price of the taxi to get out to wherever this place is. 

They refused to accept payments. They want it all up front. I can't win. It just never stops. Ever.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

The only thing I have that will remotely get me the cash to get my car back is my keyboard. I can't stop crying at the thought of losing my music again.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Hang in there. Messaged someone else who may be able to help figure out the car. Wait a day before selling the keyboard.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Wait a day and I owe the car lot even more money.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Spoke to a friend in your area who can pull some strings. Will PM you and work something out. Think it will be ok.

Take care.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

They say the storm gets worse before the dawn. You are long overdue that dawn.

Hold on tight, BFG. Things will turn around. I know its easy for me to say that, but I do believe it.

HUG>


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

How are you today, BFG?


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## Tron (Jan 31, 2013)

BF,

Off topic here for a sec. 

What meds have you tried in the past for your ADHD?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Thanks to a benevolent benefactor, I was able to afford getting the car out of impound and the inspection. It needed about 50 dollars worth of work and I just got paid so I was able to make things work. I'm ever so grateful. It's just been a whirlwind lately. 

Thursday I'm driving back to where I grew up to spend some time with my first voice teacher. She has always been like a mother to me and when my mother had a nervous breakdown (which I was dangerously close to myself this week) she was a shoulder to cry on. I actually lived with her for about a month when my mom was out of the country. So, I'm going back to spend the day, to reconnect with that little girl who was going to take over the world and to simply lock myself in her studio and play her piano (she also taught me to play piano) for a few hours. I always feel more centered when I spend time with her and I am long over due for re-centering. 

Tron, I've tried adderal and although it helps me focus I get violently angry on it if something prohibits me from staying on task. A.K.A. cleaning list gets interrupted by children I freak out. It worked, but it also exacerbated my anxiety levels exponentially. I also tried ritalin, which calmed me down....TOOOOOOO much. I was like a zombie and I was on the lowest dose available. The other meds jump in price exponentially and I didn't have insurance at the time. They wanted to try concerta last time, but after insurance I still owed 150 dollars. That's not plausible on my income. So, no meds. I figure, they didn't have ADHD as a diagnosis when I was a kid and I got through college (albeit with bad grades in the courses I didn't like) the first time and was making deans list the second attempt that I just had to drop out. It's not easy. I do get distracted a lot, but I managed to get the work done in spite of it. My house has suffered dramatically but it's suffering now without school, so...um....yeah.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Glad you have your car back. Hope you have a wonderful time with your music teacher. Sounds like a very special relationship.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Banging my head against the wall with the 12 year old today. I know they are selfish and don't understand, but ugh.

She came home excited that she was invited to a party this weekend. THe problem is she goes to her dad's on the weekends. I told her if I could find a way to get someone to watch her over night she was welcome to stay here this weekend, but she also wants to see her dad. I understand this. I told her however, she would need to be dropped off right away after she gets home from school or I would not be able to get her brothers to her dad's in time to make it to work. 

She tells me to be late. 

I don't want to say I am on thin ice with work because of the times the car broke down and her dad wouldn't meet me, but I do say I cannot be late anymore this year to work. She flips out on me. I tell her, I will lose my job if I am late. She says "so what, dad pays you (insert dollar amount he told them here)". I explain my paycheck goes to rent, she screams at me that dad's money goes to rent. So I try to explain that it has to be added to what I make or we can't afford to live here. 

She flips out and tells me this is all my fault. Then she backs up and says it is both of our fault, and I slipped and said "then yell at your dad too then." 

She tells me she refuses to because this isnt his fault. I just turned away from her to roll my eyes. 

She also tells me that even her dad agrees that showing up to the party is rude and it's stupid I would expect her to do that. 

Well, it's go early or don't go. It's as simple as that. And she is 12 and all she cares about is parties. And I don't blame her. These kids can't do anything with school mates. No games, no sports, no extra curricular because it all takes place on the weekend when they are with their dad, and he is not going to drive down here all the time for a game.

He did say he would pick her up tomorrow if she went to said slumber party. Which is a miracle because he always said no before. 

I wish I could get her to understand. I'm not doing this to spite her. I am trying to make it work. But she refuses to accept my solution, or even ask if it is a possibility. 

Ugh. Don't even know what to do about it.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

The moment she ‘flipped out’ she was incapable of rational thought. Everything you said after that was fodder for argument. Next time you and she reach this point, try, “i don’t like where this conversation is going. We can talk later.” And calmly leave the room.

If trying at a later time to discuss the issue doesn’t work, write her an email. Reflect back what you heard her say. Let her know that you heard her. Restate the reasons for your decision. Ask if she has any suggestions as to how the issue can be resolved in a way that is respectful to both of you.

I know its too late in this incidence. Perhaps an email letting her know that you heard her and understood why the party was important to her. Tell her that you wanted to make it work. Tell her about your job issues and that you can’t be late. Assure her that, although you disagreed, you love her.

Keep the lines of communication open. In the short term, she may not always hear what you are saying, but in the long run she will.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

All my kids are past the 12 year old stage. It is the start of years of hard work. 

Just remember you are there to be her mother, not her friend.

You made the right calls. Hang in there.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Today I pulled a scene from "The Wedding Singer" and taught a music lesson in exchange for meat. And I am surprising o.k. with this. 

There's a lot going on in my head right now. I am not making any official goals. Just muddling over potential options. They are there. I'm afraid to pursue them though and not sure which ones I should pursue. Where do I see myself in ten years? How will I sustain these kids and will I be able to provide for them and be happy at the same time?

I also took an under the table job granny sitting for 4 hours a week. It's nothing much. But any little bit will help me get caught up on my rent.

The piano lesson was nice though.

These past few weeks have been hell on earth. I do not like being in that dark place. I cannot see any way out when I am there. It scares me. I finally started playing piano again, just tinkering. I couldn't sing at all because my throat was sore (I used to sing all the time). It was gradual. I still wasn't doing anything in the house except feeding the kids. Not even doing the dishes until there were none to be had. I did get up and force myself to play a little, and you know what? I missed it. I cried over having walked away from a career in music to follow this man who was supposed to fulfill me. It left me confused over everything. 

So I called home...as in where I grew up not my parents. I called that first voice teacher who was a surrogate mother to me when life got too rough at home as a kid. I asked if I could come back for a day. She welcomed me back and just held me for a few minutes when I showed up on her doorstep. We sang, and I played piano on the piano I learned to play on. We talked, and as I left I had a huge grin on my face. I had not even smiled in weeks and I left realizing I had been smiling all day. 

I ran into my old choir director as well. He spent an hour trying to convince me to ditch all my healthcare goals in lieu of music ed. I contemplated it but I don't think it will be financially stable enough with how education is funded lately. 

One of the doctors at work that I have a lot in common with (and I have to keep my distance from because he is married and I recognize I have a crush on him) pulled me aside the other day and told me he had been thinking about my situation. He is pushing me to apply to the med school (right by us) for the physician assistant program. It's a master's level and I just don't know how I would fund it, but the end result would be almost double what I would make as a nurse, so it is tempting.

The confusion starts when I realize my love for medical diagnostics is just as strong as my love for music and I don't know how to intertwine the two while still meeting the children's needs. However, there are options to explore and I am hoping to alleviate some of that confusion in coming months. I am afraid to hope, and I know that is bad. Afraid to plan. And I know it is because of everything that has happened. It's almost like I look at the world through dark glasses and can't see the forest through the trees anymore. 

I'm trying. I really am trying to work out of my funk and in my musical moments I can convince myself that I have. But then I put the music away and realize I still have no answers and get depressed again. I wish the high could stay.

Well, that is this weeks development. 

I'm also writing an insane amount of fan fiction lately and should probably force myself to sleep more during those times, but I can't sleep so I write stupid stuff, but I write.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

These are good questions you are asking. This is good.

I have some exposure to the arts as a profession. There is a lot to be said for having it as a hobby. That way it is your escape from dark times, not a cause of them.

You have problems, but you have more answers than you realise. You are doing well.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I feel like my self esteem almost needs to be paid for the arts. i have a music degree for petes sake, yet I mever evem tried to make a career out it.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

What is the degree in? Yes, I know. music!! More info?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

The degree says "bachelor of science in bible with concentration in church music"
We all thought we were getting actual music degrees or at least church music degrees. We were all shocked on graduation day LOL. Basically it was a dual major and we had to take the heaviest course loads out of all the student body if we were going to graduate on time.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Amazing choice for an atheist.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Ha. I wasn't back then. I bought everything my parents told me lock stock and barrel back then. They even flat out pushed me into the college and not wanting to disrespect, I went there instead of where I originally wanted to go.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

There was a time when the best musicians in the world wrote for the church. Not now. There are many reasons for me to have a Christian faith, but the quality of church music is definitely not one of them 

What sort of music moves you? What do you listen to? What do you play?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

That time was when the only venue for performance was in the church and the bishops were as corrupt as the kings. Just because the words are sacred doesn't mean the music was. 

But I do love a good classical piece (that I can play LOL). I love singing French. I do ballads well, but not power ballads like Adele. Sometimes I feel like I have a Disney voice, other times I feel like it is operetic. I love the musicals of 90's Broadway. But right now...it's Chris Tilton and the music from the series Fringe. It's sort of overtaken e at the moment. 

Currently working on two pieces from Fringe, and some level 1 book I just bought to iron out my sight reading skills (play it cold never having seen it before), dusting off Pachelbell's Cannon, and scales on the Piano. Vocally, Vittoria Mio Core by Carissimi, Memory from Cats, On My Own and I Dreamed a Dream from Les Miserables, Oh Rest in The Lord by Mendelsson, Reflection from Mulan and Why by Nichole Nordeman. Plus just technical vocal scales trying to work out some rough spots in my voice. 

That was today's projects. I think it's time to put the music down and clean this pig sty of an apartment.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Yes I was going to mention the apartment!!! I am a very clean person, and could not bear to post on the thread of a messy person! 



There's some nice music in your list.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Yes, well, the lack of cleaning skills was part of the demise of my marriage. :/

I did manage to convince the kids to get the dishes done (their chores, and they haven't done them in over a week), I was able to gather most of the laundry and wash 3 loads. Oh dinner was done too, and the kiddo's bloody nose cleaned. Except the bathroom floor he bled on, I'll get that in the morning. After the toilet and sink, I didn't have the energy for the floor. Then the youngest wanted to watch Les Miz, and well, that music always distracts me, so we all sat down for a movie and a sing along, while the boys debated the merits of Javert and why he was so stupid he jumped off a bridge.

I need to organize all the crud that has gone to collections.

I also just realized it's 4 days past rent due. How did I forget to pay it? Thankfully I have until 6 days before they slap a late fee on. Guess I'll be walking to the leasing office tomorrow. Somehow, I've been convinced it's still September.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Sorry, the cleaning thing was lighthearted banter. I am the world's second in tidiest person.

My wife loved Les Mis. I enjoyed it but, she cried. Ann Hathaway was stunning.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I've been obsessed with it since I was a teen. Read the book, and even excerpts in French (simplified to my language level of course), know the score bye heart and seen it live with the national tour. So, well, um...I was set to see it opening weekend, but that's when I got mono and the start of my troubles. I did, however buy the movie. I have the sheet music as well. It's um...yeah...


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

That is all vey personal. Les mis never hit me that way, but Phantom did. Never forget the first time I saw it. The scene at the end of act one where Rail and Christine pledge their love and then you realise the phantom is watching.....spine tingling.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Not that scene, but when Christine took his mask off. And he flipped out and then just collapsed crying "Christiiiiine, Christiiiiine," That was when I cried. 

I used to sing Phantom all the time as well. Those arias won me many a competition. Actually went back to the teacher's house and found a sketch I did at 16? maybe 15? Framed and all of Christine laying on the floor holding his mask out. 

I was like "you still have this?!"


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

What other musicals do you like?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Always wanted to see Pricilla Queen of the Desert, and Aida.

Loved Evita. I think I am an Anew Lloyd Webber fan, really. The Sound of Music was always a favorite and it has great memories of when I was in it as a kid for a local production. Annie, is sweet as well.

Now, Opera, Carmen, Musetta, The Barber of Seville, Cosi Fan Tutte (Mozart favorite).


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Opera I have not come to. There are some beautiful melodies in the music, but if doesn't get me. Mozart is amazing though. 

Lloyd Webber's best work is amazing. A lot of Broadway stuff is good.

Priscilla Queen of the Desert was originally a movie, so within your reach.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Yes, but does the movie have drag queens on stilts? This is the allure of it.

I wish I could take my boys to Spider Man, alas, that will not happen until I win the lottery.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Mozart, drag queens on stilts....very eclectic tastes! I like it.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

What can I say? I am not boring. That's for sure. Wish he understood that, but eh. 

Part of me wants to say eff medicine and jump full force back into performing since I became convinced I couldn't do it somewhere along the way. However, the responsible part of me saws "awe sh!t. I have 3 kids to sustain".


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Taking the long term view, why must it be a choice? Why can't you have medicine and music?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Because, I'm not getting any younger. :/


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## Boricha (Sep 29, 2013)

This was so painful to read on so many levels.

I am so torn for your kids. They have absolutely no stability and spiraling out of control. You are in way over your head. You can barely take care of yourself let alone your kids. You need help. 


Your kids are acting out living with you. They might need a clutter free, stable environment. Talk to them. If they really want to stay with their dad, you need to talk with your husband. Tell him that you want to put the divorce on hold. If he can handle it, he can have full temporary custody of the kids. Tell him you are penniless and cannot give him child support until you get back on your feet.

This can give you some breathing space so that you can secure a second job. You need financial security. Rent a room from Craigslist. Save every penny. Learn money management. 

Lay aside your differences, and come up with a serious plan for the kids(before it gets even worse). It's not about you guys.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Boricha, how could that work? The husband is living in a trailer....not really a magnificent environment. And is driving a new car while nickel and diming the child support. Plus he has taken another woman and she is having his child. How does BFGuru possibly unscramble that egg? And how does she stop the lawyers making temporary custody permanent?

I have followed her thread from the beginning, and I think under the circumstances she is doing great. 

And obviously we haven't heard her ex's perspective, but it would stickin my craw for him to get away with wresting custody from her by this war of attrition. The bastard cheated on her and dumped her. Not cool IMO.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Boricha said:


> This was so painful to read on so many levels.
> 
> I am so torn for your kids. They have absolutely no stability and spiraling out of control. You are in way over your head. You can barely take care of yourself let alone your kids. You need help.
> 
> ...


What the kids do have is a mother who loves them and who has tried to do what is right for them, particularly in terms of the boys' disabilities. Their father, who works in the field of autism, was unwilling to implement the very strategies he would advocate for clients. 

BFG is doing her best to provide a stable, loving environment. Her kids are not acting out because they are living with her. They are acting out because two of them have special needs, all of them have lost the family and the life they have always known, and their father is doing his best to poison them toward their Mom. 

Do you honestly think if she gives over custody, she would ever get it back? 

I’m sure your post has only cause more hurt to a woman who is already in incredible pain.


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## Boricha (Sep 29, 2013)

I think it's an extremely difficult situation for the kids as well as both parents(the husband caused a lot of it).

But sugar coating and saying how well the OP is doing is not realistic. OP seems like a loving mother but she cannot do this alone. Two of her children are special needs kids. Maybe in the county she lives in, she can get help for herself. Someone that can help her get out of this emotional and financial mess. Her husband needs to definitely get involved more. But of course, he is in denial.

She has so little family support. Hope she can establish some kind of relationship with her parents, despite their religious differences. I am sorry if I came off too strong. 

I can feel everyone pulling for the kids and the mother. Wazza you are great!!


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

DD is officially declaring she is leaving and moving in with her friends. That she can't stand either of us. These comments come out when I need to correct inappropriate behavior, of course. And I am surprisingly o.k. with this. 

It sounds sick to admit out loud, but emotionally her telling me she is going to live with her friends is much easier on the heart strings than the previous (hopefully previously remains previous) insistance of moving in with her father. Not that the friends is going to happen either, but I can just shake my head and walk away (before I start to laugh thinking, child one day you will have a daughter just like you). 

These comments, although not right, are more age appropriate than what she had been doing before, so this is good, sort of.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

How old is she?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

She's 12. I remember being 12. I was incorrigible. I thought I was moving out too LOL. 

As long as she hates us both equally, I'm fine. Isn't that pathetic?


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## Tron (Jan 31, 2013)

My sister did that a couple of times. Got to the end of the block then walked back home. Mostly discipline related.

This too shall pass.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Not pathetic. I would feel exactly the same way.

Having raised both genders, I can tell you girls are harder work 

Just keep plugging, and don't take too much crap from your kids. One day they will respect all the boundaries they rail against now.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

My head knows this Wazza. Sometimes my heart though...ugh. They all got mad at me last night ha. I was conflicted about checking out a choir locally and hadn't really said anything to anyone. They require dues to be involved and an audition, which is the opposite of what I was looking for, but it would give me some experience performing again even in the short term. Finally around 5:00 I decided if I could find a babysitter I would go. 

That took until the last minute and I was late, but I'm not IN the choir so I didn't care. 

DD's friend came over and I said "it's a mess in here and I'm practicing for a possible audition so you're welcome to come in, but I'll be singing." 

So DD is angry I told her bestie and not her. Boys are angry because I didn't tell them they had a babysitter coming. I went to pick up the girl and came back with snacks and the only soda the boys are allowed to have, and all is well in the apartment again. LOL

I arrived 30 minutes late and sadly the entire choir was facing the only door into the room. I did manage to slip in relatively unseen and snuck back into the alto section...which by the way is filled with grey haired old ladies. I couldn't see to the other side, but did notice the tenors were all old too. And thought..."well, we won't be picking up any guys here now will we?" 

It was all classical music and I do like it, but they are working on a composer I much prefer piano works to his vocal works. 

I walked up to introduce myself to who I thought was the director (it was the assistant director as the director is out of town right now) and someone came up behind me and said "excuse me but is your name...." and I said yes, and she said "It's me, (insert name here)" and I finally recognized the woman I hadn't seen in almost 5 years. We had done our pre-reqs together at the community college. Her PA school. Me pre-med (switched to nursing shortly there-after as it seemed more financially sound). She looked great. And I found myself thinking why didn't I do the same. Sigh.

Anyway, I sat with her the rest of the rehearsal. She asked for my new number. And now, I'm thinking, old dudes aside, maybe I should try to see if I can manage the rehearsal and performance schedules, just to reconnect with an old friend. 

They do have waivers you can apply for if you can't afford the financial constraints, so I will definitely be applying for that. Now if only babysitters came free, I'd be set.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Hope it goes well. If you do it, remember to post the YouTube links to your first concert.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Good heaven's I'd have to lose a lot more weight before risking youtube. there are recordings out there. I already told you that. 

You will have to pm me for links because I'm not comfortable plastering them here LOL.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Oh come on, BFG, you are among friends here! I just sang for a dear friend who asked me to, and I am not only not a singer but am the most unconfident non-singer you are ever likely to meet. If I can do it.......

Seriously, I understand why you wouldn’t post links in a public forum. 

The chorus would be fun and it would be good to do something for yourself on a regular basis. Hope you can find a sitter.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Frostflower said:


> Oh come on, BFG, you are among friends here! I just sang for a dear friend who asked me to, and I am not only not a singer but am the most unconfident non-singer you are ever likely to meet. If I can do it.......
> 
> Seriously, I understand why you wouldn’t post links in a public forum.
> 
> The chorus would be fun and it would be good to do something for yourself on a regular basis. Hope you can find a sitter.


I dunno. You might be selling yourself short. Maybe you are the next Rhianna or something.

BFG did PM me some links as she said, and I thought the tracks were rather good actually! She owes me more


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Wazza said:


> I dunno. You might be selling yourself short. Maybe you are the next Rhianna or something.
> 
> BFG did PM me some links as she said, and I thought the tracks were rather good actually! She owes me more


lol! Ya, right!

I would love to hear BFG sing, but I understand her need for privacy.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I think I can accomodate the request for frosty. Did it go through?

Regarding the choir...I don't think I can justify the expense of a weekly sitter for something I have to pay to be a part of. It just seems irresponsible. And really, I think I'd rather try community theater more.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Beautiful voice! Thanks, BFG.

Too bad about the choir, but maybe you’ll find another one that doesn’t charge people to sing. Maybe you can connect with your friend outside of the choir. Community theater would be fun. Is there a group near you?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Thank you magicjack. Now I don't have to hear your voice when you try to reach the kids. Now if I don't get the message because I'm occupied or my cell battery has died, I don't have to contend with you delcaring I'm keeping the kids from talking to you (thankfully it is no longer multiple times a day but still), in spite of both older children having texting aps that aellow you to contact them at will via text. Now they can call you when THEY want. Now I don't have to hear you questioning everything we do or don't do. 

And for not having the most expensive internet service provider tier, it still makes a pretty clear phone call. Not too shabby for a year and a half of phone service for one flat fee of 29.95 plus tax.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> Thank you magicjack. Now I don't have to hear your voice when you try to reach the kids. Now if I don't get the message because I'm occupied or my cell battery has died, I don't have to contend with you delcaring I'm keeping the kids from talking to you (thankfully it is no longer multiple times a day but still), in spite of both older children having texting aps that aellow you to contact them at will via text. Now they can call you when THEY want. Now I don't have to hear you questioning everything we do or don't do.
> 
> And for not having the most expensive internet service provider tier, it still makes a pretty clear phone call. Not too shabby for a year and a half of phone service for one flat fee of 29.95 plus tax.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Wowzers, cranky kiddos today. I know little dude was struggling because he had a bad dream last night and it set him off on a tangent of "I miss pappy" (who passed away last year). 

Oldest kiddo was very mouthy with her siblings and middle kiddo kept tripping over his own two feet. 

I finally got things calm enough for the great pumpkin palooza 2013 and after ripping templates, and tossing one entirely, and making up his own design, we finally had 3 jack o lanterns ready for halloween. Unfortunately, mom allowing them to all clean and carve themselves this year resulted in a mess of epic proportions, and them tuckering out begging me to finish, but the carnage has been rectified. My arms are exhausted and although I had a pumpkin for me to carve as well (in addition to the distorted one given us by my friend to make pie with) I think I am taking the lazy mans approach to the final gourd. There will be much pie this year, as I'm not in the mood for making orange candle lit art anymore.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Unfortunate? This is what makes childhood fun. Well done.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Unfortunate for my arms because I had already really worked them hard with weight training today. My poor muscles could not will themselves to carve toward the end.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Keep up the weight training and next year you’ll be able to carve pumpkins for the entire neighborhood!


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I am seriously angry right now. 

I am seeing red. 

DD posted on Facebook wishing for normalcy. POSOW has the audacity to tell her she has a choice in the situation. My mother flips out and says that stbx living with posow is not normal. Stbx responds with threatening to expose all her dirty little secrets and to leave his family alone (last I checked posow was not his family but I digress), another family member says he can do what he wants because we aren't together anymore.


SHE IS TWELVE. 

She has no choice as to if she has a normal life. We as the adults have ripped that choice away from her. How dare you reprimand her over that. You are not even her parent or step parent and have no legal jurisdiction to discipline whatsoever in her life. How dare all of you turn my daughter's facebook page into a circus for your childishness. What is wrong with these people? Then, the women involved did the most petty thing and deleted their comments, as if that will magically make it all disappear from the internet so they can pretend it didn't happen. 

I just want to leave work, drive up there and take my children home. I want them both to leave us alone. Yet I know kids need their dads in their lives. How is this healthy? How will she heal if she is being torn between the adults in her life. 

I sent her a private message saying that i saw her status (I wasn't joining the circus) and that I was sorry she was having a rough time, but that I loved her and that she was strong and that she better prepare because there will be hugs when she comes home. 

I have half the mind to take her out of school early, even though it will be unexcused, and just do something alone with her. I don't even know what to do about it. 

She has facebook so she can stay in touch with her friends from her old school. Not so the grown ups in her life can make her feel like **** by turning her time line into a circus. 

It's no wonder this kid has a foul mouth on her and keeps yelling for everyone to STFU. It's no. freaking. wonder.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

You did the right thing. Don't add to the circus. Look after your daughter.


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## LaQueso (Dec 30, 2012)

What a great thing to write to your Daughter! Perfect! I'll have to remember it, since I know there will be those kind of bumps. My oldest said he hated missing out on things bouncing between houses. How sad that the adults had to get so ugly on someone else's wall and a child's to boot! 
You are doing so well!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

O.k. so I finally got a good look at the entire transcript. It's not as bad as my mom made it sound. I still don't like the "you have a choice" comment. 

However, emotionally I'm all ugh. It never should have exploded to that level. And I suggested we shut down the facebook account and only allow kids on her page, but she said she wanted everyone on her account there and was fine with it. Her dad tried to tell her that her grandmother was nuts basically and trying to attack her and her family. I explained that her grandmother felt POSOW was reprimanding her publically and was angry for her, but that it didn't make any of what happened right. She shrugged and said she was o.k.

POSOW texted her later saying she was sorry if she didnt come across right, that she cared about her and wanted the best for her. She also went on a long diatribe about how much worse other kids have it and I thought (with a chuckle) she's 12 and doesn't care about how bad other kids have it. I've tried that approach before. 

Honestly, it could be worse. She could be an evil step mom that hates my kids right? At least I keep telling myself that. But it angers me to no end when my sons keep referring to her as a mom, when they are not even married. That they call her parents grandma and grandpa and barely acknowledge my mother. I should be fine with it, but I'm not.

I don't say anything to DD, but it hurts to hear her upset that daddy buys POSOW flowers and doesn't even take her to mc dees for a one dollar parfait. I mean that hurts to hear her upset, but I found myself thinking, I can count on one hand the number of times he bought me flowers in 17 years. Why is he so gung ho over her when he never was over me? there were no gifts, barely any love notes and they had to be requested by me. I get my love language is gifts, but he didn't acknowledge that, and now he is lavishing her with them. He has been since before we officially separated. I have the bank accounts with fishy unaccounted for purchases he has no answer for. I know they had to have been gifts for her. One was even around christmas time. 

I think I'm doing good emotionally and letting go, then hearing this stuff hurts all over again. And ugh...I need to get my head on straight.

And clean my house...that too. Off to do some scrubbing.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Cleaning is good. It will help you. In fact, why not duck round and do my place when yours is done? I like to help


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

If I ever crawl out from under this mound of laundry and...win the lottery for the assumed travel expenses (as I don't know exactly where you are LOL) deal.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Are you out from under the mound of laundry? My place is getting messy! I asked Frostflower to come do it, but she told me to go away. You are my only hope.

Trying to get my housework done cheap is the only reason I hang around here!


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

BFGuru can't come to the phone right now. She is currently drowning in an ocean of linens.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> BFGuru can't come to the phone right now. She is currently drowning in an ocean of linens.


 ...but my call is important to her and has been placed in a queue?

Damn. Wonder if I can figure out how a broom works....


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

You sit on the handle and fly away right?


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> You sit on the handle and fly away right?


She's good! Don't mess with this one!


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I try.

SO, question...
is it within my rights to request posow not have me blocked if she is going to be posting on DD's facebook page? She's 12 and I monitor her online interactions. I do not like having other friends of mine coming to me complaining about things she tells my daughter. 

Not that it is overly bad, but case and point...she has been ill. I kept her home from school a few days nursing her with OTC drugs. Was an EMT, been working or volunteering in healthcare for years, and hve one semester of nursing school under my belt. 

So, why would she feel the need to tell her she needs to make sure she's getting enough fluid and not to drink xyz fluids and asking "Did you get any coughdrops?" It rather irritates me that I've kept this child alive for 12 years and she feels the need to "make sure" she's medically taken care of, even if her father doesn't know when is an appropriate time to take them to the doctor or not. 

So, new recommendations say to wait 5-10 days before dishing out antibiotics for ear aches. DD is on day 2. If I choose to wait out the weekend as the pain is subsiding and all that is left is clogged sounding ears, I have to worry about this woman accusing me of not taking care of my own kid. This stuff irritates me. 

I don't want to stalk her. I have no interest in what her facebook page says. If I did I could always log in and stalk her from DD's account. However, blocking me from seeing the conversations my daughter is having on her facebook page seems like it is crossing a line when you are trying to instill doubt in her about her own mother.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> I try.
> 
> SO, question...
> is it within my rights to request posow not have me blocked if she is going to be posting on DD's facebook page? She's 12 and I monitor her online interactions. I do not like having other friends of mine coming to me complaining about things she tells my daughter.
> ...


Well the first thing is that you are doing a great job as mum under trying circumstances. Even now your kids will sense that, and as adults they will understand so much more. I get that POSOW has wrecked large sections of your life, but I just cannot see that she has a snowball's chance in hell of turning your kids against you. Not going to happen.

If you accept that, then let me ask you a really hard question. I understand you hating POSOW, and not wanting to give her any more than she has already taken. But....what is best for your daughter? Like it or not (sorry) your ex has left you and is starting a new family. Your kids, if they have a relationship with their father, will have a relationship with his new partner. Just as one day you might form another relationship. (From talking to you online I think you have so many good qualities that there is NO doubt in my mind you will have offers. It is just up to you whether you take some lucky guy up on it).

I guess I would be seeking the most amicable coparenting relationship I could, even though it means dealing with a woman I would rather be throwing off a cliff.

I did not face what you are facing. I think the advice I am giving would be so hard to follow, and I suspect just reading it hurts. Sorry. I wish I could offer another alternative.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I do understand I'm stuck sharing my kid with her. However, she is my child and as such I do not approve of the secrecy she feels she needs t keep from me when interacting with my daughter.

Since my mom deleted her comments in the facebook fiasco, they have told her their side of the story. DD is livid now anytime her grandmother posts anything on her time line, and wants to competely block her and unfriend her. These are the things I need to monitor. The alienation of her actual family needs to stop. 

And yes, they have turned them against a lot of me. I mean we've already discussed how they call me a liar because daddy said so. It's rather frustrating. 

I wish we could come to an amicable coparenting situation. I know it's the green eyed monstor hating her wanting to have a relationship with them, but if she didn't act like she wanted to replace me I might be able to relax about it. She has not, to this day spoken one word to me. She makes herself scarce at drop off. We have never even met, though we have seen each other from afar. 

I don't know, it's just irritating. Again, I don't care to watch her facebook page. I do however have a problem with you preventing me from monitoring my daughter's facebook page. I can't even think why it would bother her that I would see her stuff. I was curious once to what she looked like. I know I wasn't blocked then, and I haven't looked at her profile since, but I do know if I wasn't blocked I'd be able to see what she said to DD without my friends (who she knows nothing about) having to relay it to me. 

They are laying low and not interacting with DD, so they can just monitor her interactions and make sure they are appropriate. I really don't know why the whole "did you get cough drops?" bothered me. It just did. If she was that worried, they could have bought her some while there. 

As it stands STBX insisted I deliver their costumes so he could take them to a halloween parade and I received partial costumes back. I'm not really mad about it as I've forgotten to return clothing too at times, but Halloween costumes kind of are essential to make sure they get back before trick or treat, now I'm going to have to buy another mask. Grrr. I think next year I'll tell him he can buy them costumes himself for his Halloween tradition. 

So, um...yeah. I wish there was a way to get this figured out. Again, I don't care about her personal timeline, but as a mother, I feel the need to monitor ALL of my 12 year old's online interactions. Especially those between her and other adults.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

I get the frustration.....in your shoes I would hate her so if you do it is fine to say so.

I repeat...replace you? Not a chance! None! I've now talked to you enough to form an opinion of what you are like, and think highly of you. But even if I didn't, you are their mum. She cannot change that. If she seriously tries, yes they will probably end up hating someone, but it's not you! 

Facebook....can you reach an agreement with hubby that both of you have access to her Facebook page, that it is a privilege not a right? Check out FB next time she is at your place.....you will see what is blocked. Maybe DD is not blocked but the POSOW has blocked you and that is why you can't see it? Dunno, haven't played enough with Facebook security. I just don't post anything there unless I don't care who knows.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

That's exactly what is blocked. POSOW woman has blocked me. So DD makes comments to her and I don't know what she is commenting on. Again, I don't care to know anything about POSOW facebook page. I do however care to see what is said when people interact with my child on facebook.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

He's married, he's married, he's married.

Just reminding myself. 

One of the physicians where I work and I get along really well. We have a lot in common, like a lot of the same things. These similarities we recognized when I was placed on a development team for the department he directs. I was very committed the process and learned a lot, but since I showed up to more meetings than everyone else (barring the good doctor) I ended up being placed in positions of leadership normally reserved for those in much higher positions. As such, I can ask for orders for patients when no one else can, and he takes what I say seriously. 

This was all fine and dandy when we were both "safely" married and well now...

I caught myself looking forward to speaking with him after stumbling into him when I was in that real dark spot after dropping out of school. He actually just listened. As a friend. Nothing more. But respected that the goals I had placed on my life had come crashing down, when everyone around me was all "Well now must not be the time get over it".

So, the next week I caught myself going out of my way to interact with him. Glad I did as he gave me an excellent idea for my education, however, I realized I am now crushing on him and I CAN'T. He is no longer "safe" to shoot the breeze with. He is married and I would never disrespect another woman by pushing that relationship. 

So today on my way out of work, I bump into him, and have to talk to him about some orders that didn't make sense for a patient anyway, so I stopped. We discussed said patient and a few hospital frustrations and then he went and had to tell me he grew up in the same country as I did as a displaced American kid, and argh...stop having things in common with me. 

So I extricated myself from the conversation as best as I could but the problem is...most people regard me as having landed from mars when I talk about certain things and this person just grins and offers his own input about it. 

I hate avoiding him because it makes work awkward, but I can't trust myself to not say something stupid that would wreck the entire friendship and place his marriage in jeopardy. (Not that I think he would...but I don't have a lot of faith in men anyway)


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Guess what I am eating for dinner tonight?

Home smoked organic sausage from the woman who has really filled the role of mother since I moved into this area the first time and started having babies. She has helped me with every single child, and even went into the OR with me on my last birth. But I digress...

I have not made sausage in 17 years. Why? Because STBX did not like it. I went without a childhood favorite all this time because he did not like it.

It tastes just as good as I remember it.

I know it's safe because "mom" made it so the boys can have it. And although it's spicier than I normally prefer my sausage...I am so NOT complaining.

Oh fattening, spicy, delectable goodness...how I have missed you.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> Guess what I am eating for dinner tonight?
> 
> Home smoked organic sausage from the woman who has really filled the role of mother since I moved into this area the first time and started having babies. She has helped me with every single child, and even went into the OR with me on my last birth. But I digress...
> 
> ...


Yummo. How do you make them?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Make what? Potato cakes, eggs or sausage?


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Huh? What's this potato cakes and eggs nonsense???? How do you make sausages at home? We are talking British style stuff, right? Not some colonial corruption of perfection.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Potato cakes...def Irish recipe from my friend who's an immigrant. We bonded because I have a lot of Irish in my ancestory (recent ancestory). 

Um...mashed spuds...I alter it a bit for the allergies, so our vegan butter and rice milk instead of the real stuff. Salt/pepper, and then I toss in our gluten free flour and fry em up like pancakes. I make my "batter" sticky for lack of a better word. Not sure if that's proper or not. It's just how I did it.

Eggs, well again, we don't do dairy so our cheese is not really cheese it's this tapioca based vegan stuff that actually tastes pretty good (only brand that tastes good though, trust me). So eggs, salt, pepper and scrambled in oil with a bit of the fake cheese.

Sausage...my "mom" and her husband purchase a bull and pig every year between her and her daughter from a local organic farm. They then butcher them themselves, smoke the pig into ham and sausage and make their own beef cuts. It is some of the best meat I've tasted. And it is from the gal I teach her piano lessons in exchange for meat LOL. They used their own casings and because I know her, she told me all of the ingredients they used in the sausage so I knew it was safe for the boys. It was delicious.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Wait, they don't use their own casings as in, cutting out their own intestines, but they used the casings from the pig/beef instead of purchasing commercial guts for their sausage.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Wow, I’m not around for a while and Wazza tries to get free maid service. Shame on him! And, by the way, Wazza, I believe I did tell you what to do with the broom.

I don’t know enough about Facebook to comment, But I do agree that no-one will turn your daughter against you.

Glad you enjoyed the sausages.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I do hate that I have this jealous internal rage when they refer to her as a mom, and her parents as a grandparent. I should be grateful she is generally kind to them. Even when they do come home complaining of things she does I think, yeah she probably should have disciplined you. BUT...then my heart screams "she is not your mother and has no legal right to discipline you!" 

It's quite the conundrum.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Your feelings are perfectly natural. It would kill me to hear my kids call another woman ‘mom’. I can’t believe your ex is allowing it. But then sensitivity isn’t a strong point for him.

Hang in there.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Frostflower said:


> Wow, I’m not around for a while and Wazza tries to get free maid service. Shame on him! And, by the way, Wazza, I believe I did tell you what to do with the broom.
> 
> I don’t know enough about Facebook to comment, But I do agree that no-one will turn your daughter against you.
> 
> Glad you enjoyed the sausages.


BFGuru, don't listen to her. It's been months since she promised to come around and pick up my used socks and undies from the floor. I had to resort to getting my wife to pick them up. Not cool Frostflower!


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

There are some men that believe that is what wives are for. 

Given they also believe that socks magically clean themselves. 

Perhaps that is where the witches and broomsticks thing began.

Wrote a poem last night. Wanted it to be more hopeful at the end...still sounded angry and bitter. I guess I need to work on me more. Ha!


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> There are some men that believe that is what wives are for.
> 
> Given they also believe that socks magically clean themselves.
> 
> ...


I remember an interview about a major artist once....cannot remember who it was. But they said it is very easy to express pain through art, but a great artist can take the pain and express beauty and joy. I found that an inspiring quote and something to aspire to in life as well as art.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Truth. The death of my father in law had me writing and as painful as it was, the end result was beautiful, if heart wrenching, even though the one line pains me now about his "loving son".


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> Truth. The death of my father in law had me writing and as painful as it was, the end result was beautiful, if heart wrenching, even though the one line pains me now about his "loving son".


Heard you sing. Have you published anything written?

Frostflower has done some writing. I have seen some if her stuff and it is really good. I am ok with words, but not in her league.

Creativity is important.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Um, not creatively. I have a few poems at a writing forum and some fan fictions at fanfiction.net (o.k. one but 4 chapters LOL) but nothing officially published except some lactation articles for a website I used to work at. 

Currently working on a project I hope to publish. Have interviews for character development this week and am excited.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Well, that was interesting. I made a "time out bottle". I heard they cause time out to be a much calmer experience. They are basically 20 ounce bottles of water and glitter glue. I used glitter and tacky glue. So you thicken the water until the glitter falls and settles in the desired amount of time. 


So he pitches a fit, and I figured while he is raging is not good, but as soon as I got him down to a wail ad hands off of others I placed it down and told him when it is finally all down he could carefully bring it to me. 

It was like...kiddi LSD or pot or something. Kid totes zoned out, and brought it back ready to talk. But because he was over tired today from being awake itchy all night (eczema flair up) he melted a few times today. Second time he threw it (thank goodness for plastic lol) but finally calmed enough to take the t/o. Last time, he demanded it! Haha. Insisted he needed his bottle for t/o. He's finally fallen asleep. Poor kiddo. 

I'm kind of amazed it worked. Score one for mom.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> Well, that was interesting. I made a "time out bottle". I heard they cause time out to be a much calmer experience. They are basically 20 ounce bottles of water and glitter glue. I used glitter and tacky glue. So you thicken the water until the glitter falls and settles in the desired amount of time.
> 
> 
> So he pitches a fit, and I figured while he is raging is not good, but as soon as I got him down to a wail ad hands off of others I placed it down and told him when it is finally all down he could carefully bring it to me.
> ...


My time out bottle has beer in it...at the start, anyway!


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Wazza said:


> Heard you sing. Have you published anything written?
> 
> Frostflower has done some writing. I have seen some if her stuff and it is really good. I am ok with words, but not in her league.
> 
> Creativity is important.


Dang! How can I make a flip comment about a man who expects his wife to pick up his socks and underwear off the floor when you go and say something nice like that?!!

Thank you.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I'm still waiting on Frosty written wonders. All's fair since we are sharing and all.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> Well, that was interesting. I made a "time out bottle". I heard they cause time out to be a much calmer experience. They are basically 20 ounce bottles of water and glitter glue. I used glitter and tacky glue. So you thicken the water until the glitter falls and settles in the desired amount of time.
> 
> 
> So he pitches a fit, and I figured while he is raging is not good, but as soon as I got him down to a wail ad hands off of others I placed it down and told him when it is finally all down he could carefully bring it to me.
> ...


I’ve been planning to make some of those bottles for my students. Glad to hear it worked so well.

I’m into sensory bins. My Halloween one has $30 worth of split yellow peas (ouch!), acrylic pumpkins, plastic spiders, black and orange sparkly tubes and plastic eyeballs. The kids love it!

After Halloween it will be a bin of dirt, construction vehicles, workers and rocks. The rocks were collected during a lakeside walk with friends.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> I'm still waiting on Frosty written wonders. All's fair since we are sharing and all.


You're getting them on your thread. When you realise that Froatflower is actually Bill, a three hundred point teamster from New Jersey, covered in tattoos, who drinks like a fish and swears like a sailor...you would never think it to read her stuff!!!


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> I'm still waiting on Frosty written wonders. All's fair since we are sharing and all.


I’ll see what I can do!


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Wazza said:


> You're getting them on your thread. When you realise that Froatflower is actually Bill, a three hundred point teamster from New Jersey, covered in tattoos, who drinks like a fish and swears like a sailor...you would never think it to read her stuff!!!


And Wazza is my *very* special friend (wink, wink!) Right, Cowboy? :smcowboy:


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Frostflower said:


> And Wazza is my *very* special friend (wink, wink!) Right, Cowboy? :smcowboy:


Please don't make me wear the tiara and tutu again.....


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Wazza said:


> Please don't make me wear the tiara and tutu again.....


But you looked so.....special. I know the cops booking you thought so.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Frostflower said:


> I’ve been planning to make some of those bottles for my students. Glad to hear it worked so well.
> 
> I’m into sensory bins. My Halloween one has $30 worth of split yellow peas (ouch!), acrylic pumpkins, plastic spiders, black and orange sparkly tubes and plastic eyeballs. The kids love it!
> 
> After Halloween it will be a bin of dirt, construction vehicles, workers and rocks. The rocks were collected during a lakeside walk with friends.


I see this in my apartment and think...DEAR LORD I'LL NEVER GET THAT ALL OFF MY FLOOR!


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Wazza said:


> Please don't make me wear the tiara and tutu again.....


Are you telling me this was you I saw at the Mummer's parade?


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> Are you telling me this was you I saw at the Mummer's parade?


Oh my gosh, Wazza, I am devastated! You swore you would only ever wear that for me!!


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> I see this in my apartment and think...DEAR LORD I'LL NEVER GET THAT ALL OFF MY FLOOR!


I think the custodian hates me!


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Apparently he wore it for the whole city! And why does he have nicer legs than me, anyway? This is wrong on so many levels.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> Apparently he wore it for the whole city! And why does he have nicer legs than me, anyway? This is wrong on so many levels.


That was my first thought too, but you should see them when he hasn’t shaved for a week.....well, actually you can’t see them! Let’s just say Sasquatch’s got nothing on him!


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

You would know to compare him to a yeti up there in Canadydid. 

Though rumors say where I used to live Sasquatch smashed the door of one of the guy's cars in town. He seen him! Quite the story. Made the local news...which came up from the state capital...which makes this story all the more disturbing. Forget I said anything.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Ok, this got very weird. How you got hold of that pic of me I will never know.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

It's the internet. I used to work for Skynet.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

I’ve told you before, Wazza, there are no secrets. But you insist on continuing to flaunt yourself in public.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Tonight was trick or treat. STBX told the kids he was coming to do ToT with them. I hated the idea, but they were excited. My thoughts were, he took the ToTing last week, to two events. I want some time alone with them to have fun as well. I mean seriously, you asked out of the family, why do you get to pretend we are a family still when you are making a family with someone else? 

However, the boys were excited so I relented. 

DD however has been ignoring his text messages. She's very angry about the baby. And seeing OW post baby stuff on her facebook every time DD opens her account. She's angry he doesn't take her to grab a snack at the local fast food store but stops and buys her flowers. (O.k. the flowers hurt. He never bought me flowers)

However, I do encourage her to talk to him because I don't want him to accuse me of alienating her. It's tough, but I do it. 

She had planned on going ToT with her friend tonight and at her age, I felt she was old enough to do so. I allowed it, but STBX was upset she wouldn't join us. I just explained they had planned this for a while. He told me he was almost ready to write her off because of her attitude toward him. I shrugged and said "she's 12. They're all like that". I didn't want to start a fight in front of the boys. And, secretly I kept thinking "please do. Please write them all off so I can take them and be in peace and put our lives back together". And on the other hand I want to strangle him and be like "she's your daughter you douch nugget. You have more emotional responsibility to her than your w4ore of a girlfriend" I said neither and simply said "she's 12" and "she'll be back".

Emotional paradoxes all night. 

However the walk around town was o.k. He kept asking "remember when" questions. Some of them I did, some I didn't. The boys ran and were excited. And they are eating all sorts of non diet approved candy tonight. I'm already regretting it LOL. Will probably double dose the kiddo on his miralax even though he's stooled twice this week. And yet, I still don't feel bad for my neighbor who thinks he is well within his rights to yell at my kids. Nope. Not feeling bad. At all. Told STBX about it and he flipped out in papa bear mode. He was ready to go yell at the guy, but I talked him down. 

Well, that's it for the paradox of the evening. I'm off to try and gte these kiddos to eat something quasi healthy. Probably never gonna sleep tonight....


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

You should be very proud of how you handled the evening. Unbelievable that he had the kids for Halloween events prior to tonight and then horned in on what should have been your time with them. If this was your day with the kids, he had no right intruding and to tell the kids without even discussing it with you so that they were excited and you would have been the meanie had you put your foot down, was downright dirty. You need a clear parenting plan that covers holidays and special days or you are going to go through this every time. 

As far as 'writing off' your daughter, that speaks to the fair-weather father that he is.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I'm ready for the xmas fight. I believe he thinks he's getting them xmas eve or the day after. 

However, due to my work schedule, so that I can actually have that holiday with them, I work pretty much from the night before Thanksgiving until that Monday. He will have them 5 straight days which I've never been away from them that long. 

Sooo...guess who's NOT getting them the day before or after Xmas? I will have them and maybe go out of town, but they will have a calm xmas with me and I'm working on trying to spoil them a bit.  Now...to figure out what to cook, because they don't like traditional fair.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I'm ready for the xmas fight. I believe he thinks he's getting them xmas eve or the day after. 

However, due to my work schedule, so that I can actually have that holiday with them, I work pretty much from the night before Thanksgiving until that Monday. He will have them 5 straight days which I've never been away from them that long. 

Sooo...guess who's NOT getting them the day before or after Xmas? I will have them and maybe go out of town, but they will have a calm xmas with me and I'm working on trying to spoil them a bit.  Now...to figure out what to cook, because they don't like traditional fair.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Will you get to have a special dinner with them on Thanksgiving Monday?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I will have just gotten off of my weekend work schedule. I don't know what I will do honestly. I tend to pass out cold for the entire day after 40 hours in three days all over night. 

Just saw the work schedule for December, and saw I was now scheduled to work Xmas night. Tried to talk to the scheduler about it and she was all "It's not fair to make those working xmas eve work that day too." It sounds like she's not going to give me the day off. If so, it may just push me out the door. I worked black friday, easter sunday, Independence day, Memorial day, and Labor day. Last year the same, except I worked both xmas and thnksgiving as well to beg for my bday off (which falls on a holiday). I'm sorry, but I'm not giving up the only holiday I have with these kids this year to make it "fair" to someone else. It's not going to happen.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Sounds extremely unfair. Would it help to present her with a list of all the holidays you have worked over the past couple of years? Would you consider working Christmas Eve so that you could have all of Christmas day with the kids? 

Are you unionized? If so, and talking with your supervisor doesn’t work, talk to your rep.

Worst comes to worst, have the kids Christmas Eve for a nice dinner and some make some new traditions. Then celebrate Christmas with them on another day. Sad, but a lot of families do that. It will bother you, but the kids will be okay with having two Christmases.

I know its an unfair situation and I can imagine how angry and frustrated you are, but quitting seems extreme. How difficult is it to find another job? Being unemployed isn’t going to help you or the kids.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Common problem with nurses I know. I don't know of a solution, changing jobs isn't it because every job has the same hassles. Sucks. But it pays the bills.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I wouldn't quit without other employment lined up. And I know it sounds childish, but I should not have to celebrate every single holiday with my kids on an alternate day. He should not get them on every holiday. It's simply not right. The three year old inside me is screaming "IT'S NOT FAIR!" 

The adult in me is saying, just wait and see what she does with the schedule. She's never screwed me over before, so maybe she will work with me. I'll wait and see. If not...well...I do have PTO left. It would hurt them, because I could always use it for that day and leave them stranded. It is in their best interest to simply work with me, really. We are low census on xmas anyway. Every year we discharge as many as possible because everyone wants to be out of the hospital for the holiday. It won't change simply because I am magically there that day. 

There is time for now to wait. I' going to try not to freak out yet LOL. 

In other news, I have consumed way too much chocolate. I think I'm going to turn into a Hershey bar.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Off work for a couple days for medical reasons. These meds are making me massively nauseous. Thankfully I had some time off saved, but blah. Back to bed now. Just didn't want you guys to think I disappeared. STBX was actually nice about me being late with kiddos yesterday. He didn't really have a choice. Meds had to wear off before I could drive.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> Off work for a couple days for medical reasons. These meds are making me massively nauseous. Thankfully I had some time off saved, but blah. Back to bed now. Just didn't want you guys to think I disappeared. STBX was actually nice about me being late with kiddos yesterday. He didn't really have a choice. Meds had to wear off before I could drive.


Medical reasons as in still suffering from chocolate overconsumption mentioned in your last post? Or something more serious? Hope you get better quickly.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

I wondered about the chocolate too! Hope you’re feeling better, BFG.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

A little more serious that chocolate consumption LOL. The drugs have had me unconscious for almost 24 hours now, with little snippets of awareness to go to the bathroom, and nothing more. LOL


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

Thinking of you. Rest up.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> A little more serious that chocolate consumption LOL. The drugs have had me unconscious for almost 24 hours now, with little snippets of awareness to go to the bathroom, and nothing more. LOL


Also thinking of you.

I have never been knocked out for 24 hours by chocolate, I diagnose excessive alcohol consumption, and prescribe two weeks of sobriety. 

If only it were that simple.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

If only my pills didn't have that huge orange label on them saying "Do not consume alcohol while on this medication". Damn you drugs and ruining my fun!


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Looks like they gave me xmas off. Great! I'm a happy girl there.

Last night I was invited to a performance by an old vocal instructor of mine. He was a featured soloist in this classical concert. I sat up front, picked grat seats, and enjoyed critically listening to the music. I haven't been able to do that in a while, barring the choir rehearsal I watched of a friend of mine, in years. It's been since college since I have been to a classical concert with full orchestra. It. Was. Awesome. And I realized, that my tastes in music line up with the age 50+ crowd. I think I was the youngest one in the audience LOL. 

But I am so glad I went alone. I didn't have to worry about if the person next to me was enjoying themselves, or if they were bored. If I was going to hear about how annoying the show was later. I listened. I (subtly) conducted from my seat LOL. I watched for nuances, and envisioned the sound waves moving about the room. My friend, did fabulous. And we went out for a bite to eat later. 

At the restaraunt they kept referring to us as "the couple in the corner". Um...he's old enough to be my grandfather LOL. Just because we both look like we just came from an elopement doesn't mean we did. Haha. He was dressed in a tux, ad I was dressed in a very nice pants suit. And well, yep..it looked a lot like wedding attire.

At the end of the evening, he said "I didn't realize how in depth your character was". I started laughing and replied, "I was 16 years old back then. What 16 year old is deep?"

All in all, great evening. I came home, and slept for 12 hours and feel like I could sleep some more, but hey...no one but the obnoxious toe biting kitty woke me up and it was great.


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## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

So glad you had a good time, BFG. You deserve it, and more of them. Also glad you will have Christmas off with the kids. Nice to see things looking brighter.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Ageism in music is pointless. Like what you like. Orchestral has not survived so many centuries by being shallow.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

This is true Wazza. I wish I could turn the spawn on to the music love.

Ah well...

Off to plan Christmas presents! I have to make this good...eeek.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Just listen to it when they are around. Great music does not need you or I to sell it, it sells itself.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

So, I think I've made progress. Albeit it small, but progress none the less. I was called into the office and written up because every Friday I am late for work. By the time I get the boys off the bus and get them fed and out the door (even though dinner is ready when they walk in the door as I plan it that way), I am already running late when I get them to their dad's. It is 1.5 hours one way, and when I get there he always tries to strike up a conversation (normally an argument over the boys' diet). If I get stuck in traffic at. all. I am late. Add to his inssessant need to talk and me trying to pull away in the car, I am late. So, I knew this was coming. 

As such, the manager opted for clock out time to pull me into her office. This meant I was 15 minutes late clocking out and STBX was fuming.

"What took you so long to get out?! I have to get to work."
"Oh I just got written up for being late every Friday"
"What do you mean?!"
"Every Friday I am late for work." 
"Well, you're going to have to get them to my house earlier then!"
"I'm not sure how you propose that as they don't get off the bus until 4:15 and I throw food at them and leave."
"well make them eat in the car!"
"Um...I have...and now my car stinks, but it does not buy enough time with rush hour traffic."
"You can't lose your job!"
"I know."
"You have to figure this out!"
"I'm working on it."
"Are you mad at me?"
"Nope. I knew it was coming. There's nothing I can do about it though."
"Oh can you buy the present for (DD) party she's going to Sunday if I bring her there and back?"
"Fine, whatever. I don't have to work that night though, so I can probably meet you somewhere."
"How about I bring them all back early that night and you can do thanksgiving with them then?"
"Um, ok" (I was planning on going out if even for a few hours while she was at the party and thanksgiving is not possible when she won't even be there, but he took me off guard)
"You can still buy the present?"
"Yeah fine."
"You're mad at me."
"Nope. But I have to go."
"You have to figure this out."
"I know, but I have to make lunch for (DS) and get him on the bus in less than 20 minutes. I have to go."
"Fine"
"Goodbye."

And I left. I actually wasn't mad! Annoyed about my only day off without kids being stuck with kids again (but mom guilt over rode that quickly), yes, but more so entertained. There he was being textbook HIM. Heaven forbid he meet me halfway. Or even ten minutes closer. Heaven forbid he put ANY extra miles on the brand new car his girlfriend bought him. I KNEW this was going to be his reaction if he found out. I wasn't even going to talk to him about it because of the fact I didn't want to get mad. But I managed the conversation, got home, put the boys on the bus and promptly called my friend and busted out laughing at the stupidity of it all. 

It's HIS fault I'm late every week and he can't seem to see past his own ass to problem shoot effectively. 

I already spoke with my boss about starting officially late on Fridays and staying later in the mornings to help with the transition. She is speaking to her boss about it. So it may all work out anyway...

However, I made progress. I didn't let it bother me. Got mad later yes, but in the heat of the moment, I wasn't mad at all. I found it hilarious.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Battery kept dying in car. Called a friend and asked her husband to come show me how to change it. Done, and now I can handle this by myself as well. Just learned something self sustainable today.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I am trying so hard not to let this bother me, but I am livid and want to vomit right now. 

STbX arrived with kids today while I was out. Called me demanding to know where I was. I explained that I had already told him I wouldn't even be finished where I was until X:00. It was that time and he is wanting to know why I'm not home. I hurry up and finish and get home so I can take DD to a party. 

They are in my apartment (I had left the door unlocked just in case I was running late). He sends the children out and proceeds to carry on and yell about the lack of disrespect DD has for him (HUGE blow up at his place this weekend apparently landing him in his bedroom crying). Somehow this equates to I am not consistent enough and trash talking him and he will see to it that she stays with him full time and learns respect.

I simply said "I'm sorry you had a rough weekend"

"No, NO! I am telling you it will not happen and if she dares ruin things on Wednesday you WILL come pick her up"

"Well, it cannot interfere with work. Decide now if she is staying with me or not"

He kept accusing me of not giving a sh!t about his day. I said "why would I not care about your holiday?"

Apparently it's gender ultra sound day and they are having a party (never wanted to throw a party when we got pregnant so that kind of stings). He refuses to let DD ruin his special day. and "I know you hate me". "I don't hate you" I replied. 

He then proceeds to continue to yell about the boys diets and how he is not going to follow it anymore because it is crap and I'm just insisting on doing it to control him. I am afraid that all the GI progress we've made will be for naught if we stop.

He kept yelling at me and I finally spoke up and said "You are in my home and you will not stand in my home and disrespect me or you can leave." I said this twice during the tirade.

He accused me of calling him names. Simply because of the facebook incident, which I wasn't involved in, my mother was. I did tell him I did not allow the children to disrespect him and that I do remind them in those moments that he is their father and they cannot speak ill of them. 

He insisted she cussed too much on facebook and in the same breath said he never sees her facebook except for that incident. I did explain that I keep a close eye on her and I only see the occasional cuss word posted in frustration.

So I finally just had to cut him off and tell him the party DD was invited to was getting ready to start and he left and as he got to the door I got the guts to speak up again..."Just for the record, this is my home. THIS, will not happen again." He started going again accusing me of the problem and I said telling me I never picked up the phone to discuss things. I said "you have my e-mail and my text for discussion" he said he refused to use it. So I told him that we could not talk without him errupting into yelling and didn't have to put up with it anymore. He started to get huffy again and I simply repeated, "No. I do not come into your home and yell. I respect that it is your home. THis is my home and it will not happen again." He tried one more time and I repeated calmly yet again, "No. It won't happen again. Goodbye. I have to get (DD) to her party."

Now I may not be the most consistent of parents, but I believe we have made leaps and bounds with respect here. I also understand disrespect comes with the age and although we do not "permit" it, it will still happen. I address those issues when they do occur. I also do try to give them freedom to express themselves. I truly believe, we, the adults in their lives are the reasons for the anger. Why does he expect her to be perfect? He's finally realizing she is not. This is not news for me. However he never listened to me when she would tease her brothers. He is listening to the w4ore when she points it out. Is it right? No. But it is age appropriate. 

He has told me he can afford a lawyer. I guess he can with the two of them grossing over 100K in spite of giving me 13K a year. However, I cannot afford a lawyer. There is NOtHING left after bills. I'm a little afraid. I am livid over all of this, and feel like I just took ten steps backwards.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Forgive me BFG, I but I really don't like your ex very much. I remember earlier incidents of him encouraging them to disrespect you, and now this.

I guess at least he has been following the diet. I remember when that was a battle. So it isn't all had.

Well done on firmly but politely standing your ground. Virtual online hug cost you are upset. Don't be. You did well.

At the end of the day you have to raise these kids together. Hang in there. Be strong.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

It's just, I don't have a lawyer and I know I should fight this, and yet the cowaring wife I used to be is afraid of the fight (yes I recognize that and know at least I'm recognizing it). 

I'm afraid of what their diets will look like off of the diet. I've spent so much effort making sure things are on the up and up, while he's told them non stop it was bogus. At least from what they've told me, but then again, they also told him I leave them alone for hours on end, when the truth is, some days I am running late after my errands and I just have her grab her youngest brother off the bus for me. It is about 30 minutes they are alone. They get it confused in their heads. 

I don't want their diets tampered with. Yet to push it, I am looking at a legal battle I can't afford. It's driving crazy. And those old insecurities came rushing back that I was indeed the worst mother ever because I hadn't rushed out and bought new shoes when we discovered a hole in the sole. My intention was to take him and get him sized tomorrow when they got back. STBX is livid he "Had to buy him shoes". He accused me of being negligent because they don't have hats and mittens. But their coats all have hoods? And there are gloves/mittens here. They just tend to lose them and find them again. It hasn't been THAT cold yet anyway. Plus, I've not ignored the hat issue. I'm knitting them all hats for christmas. I'm not understanding what is so wrong with not having a hat when you already have a hood on your jacket. 

I just sat there and listened. Tried not to let it get to me. Gotta say, I'm feeling pretty sh!tty about being accused of all of this. I start to wonder if there is truth to it. I've always done that though. How do I break that cycle without turning into someone who never thinks the are wrong? Those people don't exist. We are all in the wrong at some point.


ETA: This is my 666th post. I'm not sure what to say about that.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

666 - hell of a post? Sorry, beat I could do.

I find it hard to believe that on the one hand he is going to evict DD from his party if she blows up, and on the other he is going to sue for full custody. 

I also would be surprised if they would spend their money in legal battles given how they have cried poor. 

Finally, what sane person sticks their hand up to raise teenagers that are not theirs. Is the OW really that noble?

I reckon if you pick a reasonable position, and stand your ground gently but firmly, you will be ok.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

I know, it's a paradox. It makes no sense. And yet for how good I did with his last bit of shenannigans, my insides are in knots. 

I don't even know if it's worth it to go for emergency custody over their diet. The doctor ordered it. But he is refusing to adhere. What kind of problems is this going to cause with a major holiday on THursday? And would a judge just shrug and say too bad? And not like it matters because again...can't afford a lawyer.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> I know, it's a paradox. It makes no sense. And yet for how good I did with his last bit of shenannigans, my insides are in knots.
> 
> I don't even know if it's worth it to go for emergency custody over their diet. The doctor ordered it. But he is refusing to adhere. What kind of problems is this going to cause with a major holiday on THursday? And would a judge just shrug and say too bad? And not like it matters because again...can't afford a lawyer.


Let it go, and just be the best mum you can be. Which is pretty awesome if you consider all you have done.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

And what happens if they relapse? What happens if everything we've fought for with their behaviors and his ability to toilet on his own just stops?


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Tell me about him enforcing the diet. He refused at first. Has he continued to refuse? Or has he complied?

Is he making threats because he intends to carry them out, or because he knows it will upset you?

If one of your kids turns into a little monster with toileting issues.....give him custody for a week. Literally let him clean up the crap he is causing. Give him what he wants


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Yes, but it took months to get his GI system worked out. He was "trying" but missing at the beginning. But only trying because I handed him the doctors order and he was afraid I'd take him to court if he ignored a doctor's order. He's got money. He always had money. It's just the initial shock of the child support payments has worn off and he knows he has some to play with. 

I just wish he would leave us alone. Just...go away. I know it's not fair to the kids, but I cannot stomach an entire lifetime of interactions like this. So yes, deep down inside, I wish he'd sign his rights over. It would suck losing the child support but really, I'm financially strapped anyway. What's one more hit to the wallet? 

Just go away and leave us alone. That is what I wish for. But that will never happen.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> Yes, but it took months to get his GI system worked out. He was "trying" but missing at the beginning. But only trying because I handed him the doctors order and he was afraid I'd take him to court if he ignored a doctor's order. He's got money. He always had money. It's just the initial shock of the child support payments has worn off and he knows he has some to play with.
> 
> I just wish he would leave us alone. Just...go away. I know it's not fair to the kids, but I cannot stomach an entire lifetime of interactions like this. So yes, deep down inside, I wish he'd sign his rights over. It would suck losing the child support but really, I'm financially strapped anyway. What's one more hit to the wallet?
> 
> Just go away and leave us alone. That is what I wish for. But that will never happen.


Sorry it hurts so much. If someone else wrote this, what advice would you give them?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Good question. I don't know if there is any advice. It just sucks all the way around. Like looking at a mother who just lost a child and telling them what to do to make things better. There's just no advice to give really. 

This morning he has been texting non stop about DD's facebook. Insisting she is talking to a 20 something. All of her friends ages are listed in their 20's. Something kids are told to do so they are at less risk for pedophiles. Many of the kids this particular kid has friends with are personal friends of DD and I've met them. Or they have her school listed in their information. Also..the boy's pictures he looks ten and they did not even "friend" each other until after this party last night. It's a fair assessment that he is indeed the same age as she is, but he's flipping out insisting she shut down her account. He's always insisting she shut down the account for her attitude, because she cusses too much on it. I don't know what his issue with facebook is, but if he did the slightest amount of research he would have discovered in spite of the year of birth listed, the person was, in fact, a child. 

The funny thing is he kept insisting last night she disrespected me and all I wanted to do was say "no..not lately. It's not me she's pissed off at. It's you". I haven't had any major issues with her other than her chores. He just can't see past his own penis to realize that HIS and HER actions are what is causing DD to have problems. That his refusal to place her number one anymore (not that he ever should have placed her as solely number one but he did and now is changing the game plan on her)has thrown her forloop, and she is angry at all the changes he is constantly inflicting upon her. 

He declares we are all trying to control him and the reality is, we simply just want control ourselves without his interference. Don't force us to like your girlfriend. Don't think we have to accept it, because...well..we don't. And a 12 year old little girl is not going to be able to adequately communicate that when all she does is beg for your time and attention.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

so, what have we learned from this? He is in fact controlling. I hate to use the term narcissistic as it is tossed around here like candy at a parade, however, who else yells about being controlled while demanding to control others? Who else blames someone for things that occured in their home, when the problem isn't at the other place? 

I do know kiddos confirmed they are not allowed to talk bad about me there in the middle of the argument, so I do feel better about that.

I have learned, I'm still giving him control. Even though I don't know how to break that as it all revolves around my kids and my ability to do what's best for them. I know that he can still make me feel like a horrible mother with just a few choice words. My head knows he is insane. My heart breaks at the mere thought of not doing all that they need. 

I know they have hats coming. I'm knitting them as I speak. It's not that I haven't given thought to them. They will be christmas gifts...and they will. be. awesome. And they won't lose them because they will be their "favorite". So I know I didn't drop the ball. My head says this. I just have to get my heart to believe my head.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

I am sure it is all going to come out fine, but I know that doesn't help right now. Hang in there. It will get better.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Again, head knows you are right. I'm starting to calm. I just wish I had some legal recourse to this insanity. 

Friend brought over a tree with trimmings today. Kids totally took forever to process what just happened. Then the excitement kicked in and well...I feel bad for the neighbor beneath me.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

BFGuru said:


> Again, head knows you are right. I'm starting to calm. I just wish I had some legal recourse to this insanity.
> 
> Friend brought over a tree with trimmings today. Kids totally took forever to process what just happened. Then the excitement kicked in and well...I feel bad for the neighbor beneath me.




Kids and Christmas!


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

And cats. I didn't realize how much noise they made trying to eat the tree until my bedroom was the same room as the tree. 

Spoke with the psychiatrist today. He says because it is behavioral health, there is nothing I can legally do about him refusing to follow the doctor's orders. I almost cried in his office envisioning DS3 losing all the progress he's made. There's not a damn thing I can do to stop it either. Even with a lawyer. He's at the mercy's of his father's temper basically. Not that his dad is physically abusive, but apparently it's legal here to be negligent with your child's mental health.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Refresh my memory BFG. What legal advice did you get in your situation? You were worried about your ex taking you on through the courts. I know money is tight, but were you able to get any advice?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

There just is no money. I make less than my bills and have consolidated as much debt as possible and am ignoring the rest for now. I can't even think about doctor visits because copays are not an option right now. 

Legal advice I have gotten was in the form of some "insurance" my mom had purchased. I don't think they do anything but take your money though. I've called to ask questions as per the policy, and they give me an answer and then I talk to friends who have been through this and they tell me that the information is not true. That is not how it went down before the judge with their situations. I believe this "lawyer" is simply telling me what I want to hear. 

I can only ask questions though. Representation would require more money.


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## Tron (Jan 31, 2013)

BFG,

Sorry if you have discussed this previously in some detail, but can you please refresh my memory. What is the current custody and financial situation with your STBX?

Am I correct that your H has not filed for D?
Who has primary custody of the kids right now?
Kids school arrangements? Are you both in same school district?
How much $ does your H make?
How much is he giving you?
When is the baby due?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Sorry Tron, been busy and just got back to this site.

H has filed I believe. He gave me divorce papers and asked me to sign. I haven't.

We share custody. Me weekdays, he weekends. 5/2 ratio but works out 53/47 percent as per domestic relations.

We live 1.5 hours away so not same school district. They attend school with e.

H makes about 50K his live in girlfriend I assume as well since they work the same exct job. 

H gives what the courts order at about 1100 which includes child support, spousal support (at 189) and his portion of DD's braces.

Their baby is due in the spring.


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## Tron (Jan 31, 2013)

Just curious. Is 1100 the standard CS for that level of income in PA? Sounds a little light for 3 kids.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

It is based off of a percentage of his income? I don't know, domestic relations set it up. He makes twice as much as me at about 50k gross. 

1100 is including 189 in spousal support and his percentage of DDs 115 dollar/mos braces bill.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Tomorrow is Christmas, and I am trying to forge new traditions. I had to make contact because he wanted to talk to the children tonight. However, other than that...none. I fought them tooth and nail with everything I wanted to do (they are used to going to his parents every xmas eve), but once we got going and involved in the activities, they enjoyed themselves. 

DD wants to help wrap presents tonight, which may or may not happen, depending on how long it takes these boys to fall asleep. I just hope they are absolutely ecstatic over their gifts. I hope the used xbox I bought works LOL. I'm terrified it won't. Eeek. 

Well, off to remind them Santa will be here soon, and they'd better go to sleep. I hear much giggling coming from that room.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Please. Go. Away. 

Kids woke at 4 a.m. I hadn't even gotten to sleep yet as I was trying to finish the hat I made for my son. So I fell asleep while they played with their loot. 

I woke to make dinner for the kids, and there's 4 phone calls and 4 text messages...one of which was basically "where are you why are you ignoring my texts I called 4 times to talk to the kids".

He does this. Calls or texts then freaks out because I don't have my phone on or the battery is dead and I wake to fifty million messages from him. Today of all days I don't want to deal with that. I don't want to hear about how you are going to NYC with your w4ore when I begged you for 17 years to take me. I don't want to hear about the plans you made with your family that I am not a part of in spite of them being my life for 17 years. I don't want to hear about all the **** you can afford to buy our kids when I have to buy used or cheap e-bay knock offs. 

I'm rather bummed that the guitar I bought my youngest has a cracked neck. I know they can replace it, but between that and the 6 year old screaming his fool head off at 5 a.m. because he didn't want to share the group present. So, I just want to regroup and enjoy the holiday with my kids. I don't. Want. To. Deal. With. You.

You will have your day with them. Just be patient. 

I'd be fine if he called once or texted once asking me to have the kids call. Last night he texted "informing me he would be calling later". So I had the kids call him so it wouldn't interfere with our plans. Then after bed time, he texts again to tell the kids he loves them. Fine enough, but seriously, why do you constantly send the please tell the kids I love them texts after you know full well they are in bed, then get upset when I don't tell them right away?

Just. Go. Away


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## manticore (Sep 3, 2013)

yes, he has no rights over you, he decided to leave so why he expects anything else but a civil coparenting, you are right.

stay strong, better times will come, and your kids one day will understands your position and that you gave them all that you could even if you wanted to give them more, so don't worry keep being the good mother you are.

a new year is about to begin, focus in making this years yours, BFG's year, the year you changed your life for better and you got rid of a man who did not appreciated as you deserved.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Why would my STBXH's sister be sending me certified mail? This makes no sense and now we are getting snowed in so I won't be able to go to the post office to retrieve it. Not sure why the post man delivered the notice instead of the actual letter either.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

It will be ok. Don't stress.


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## Tron (Jan 31, 2013)

Wazza said:


> It will be ok. Don't stress.


:iagree:


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

It's the fear of the unknown. I have no idea why she feels the need to contact me, and even still, why not pick up the phone? Or text? Or even mail a postcard or letter. Shoot, everyone knows I can be reached on facebook. Why send something certified mail?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Wow...It's been a long time since I've posted. I've been busy. EVER SO BUSY. Not all good. Some real bad, but we are working through things and I'm o.k. 

I warn you now...THIS WILL BE LONG...a year recap is just going to take a while, so read if you want, or don't. It's o.k. 

Well, for the most part o.k. LOL. Finances still suck. Almost lost my apartment. Still working through that, but was able to work things out right before going to court for reposession of the apartment. Still had to go, but land lord is fine with my plan for repayment. So...yeah...that's good. Sucks I couldn't take my student loans for a more reliable vehicle, but I'll deal with that later. 

OKAYYYY....um.....what to say.... as an update, he got her pregnant. Baby died at 33 weeks gestation in February. Long story. I did feel bad for them. I'm not vile. It was HARD on my kids. 

He just told me 3 days ago, she's pregnant again. I'm all meh...whatever. I just don't understand his rationale at how it is appropriate to impregnate someone else when you are not divorced, and obviously not married to them. I don't understand how he thinks this is an appropriate example to set for our children, but whatever. That's the only problem I have with it, and I've only told two people (not my mother LOL, who still wants to kill him) before this post. 

Divorce is in 90 day wait since filing. Should be reaching that 90 days by end of the month. So I guess pregnancy doesn't matter much anyway LOL.

The only thing that bothers me is the kids. They don't want to do trick or treating here. They are all going as Walking Dead characters together "as a family" (yes the same show he refused to even sit by me to watch because he was too busy bonding with her over it). Many times I asked him to do a family dress up at Halloween time and he said no. Now he does so with her, and my children are participating, and they love getting mad at me and telling me that she understands them more than I do. Sometimes I just want to ask "dude, what's up with that?" But I know I won't be satisfied with his answer. So there's no point in asking why he does the same things with her he refused to do with me. 

The kids comments hurt, but I'm getting better at not letting them see it. Last time my son said "You don't understand me, only (girlfriend's name) does!" I just responded with "Now that's just hurtful. You're just saying that because you think it will hurt me and you don't even know what it means." And then, I walked away. 

Ummm...what else...I'm back in school (part of my financial issues), and failing and I'm o.k. with it. LOL. I mean, it's my first time back as a single mom basically. I've been out of chemistry for five years, and taking organic chem this semester. Half my class is on a retake, after taking their chems back to back. I can't expect to do better than them, but most of the problem is my ADHD and lack of focus...I need to work on that. I've wasted today, but I'm working with the disabilities office for the first time ever to help with that. Also trying to figure out finances to go back to the doc for my ADHD. My GPA is high enough to still get student loans to retake if need be so, that's a plus. 

Um...good stuff... my 11 year old just caught the reading bug. I have to confiscate Rick Riordan books from him nightly LOL. It's a tough call as a mom because secretly you are squealing that he's reading voraciously and outwardly having to be all "Dude, you need your sleep." 

13 year old has been helping watch her brothers while I'm in school. God she's gorgeous, and I'm going to have to lock her in a tower soon. She is sassy as the day is long though lol. 

6 year old, well, today is a rough day. He left his lunch home and school couldn't reach me, so they gave him regular lunch which has set off a cascade of behaviors today...but...oh well...he can't go hungry. In other news, I just got his reading scores back yesterday. Two days after fighting with him over his scholastic book order. "I WANT CHAPTER BOOKS NOT THOSE BABY BOOKS!" as I'm trying to steer him toward first grade level readers. Nope. He wasn't having it, and so I finally relented to a spooky chapter book (it is halloween after all), resigning that I'm reading most of it. Yesterday, I saw his benchmarks for reading and he brought home a Junie B. Jones book from the library...benchmarks are beyond first grade level, early 2nd grade level in most. He then sat down and read 2 pages with little help from me until he got tired at bed time. I guess he really is ready for chapter books LOL. 

Other good stuff? I'm back involved in spinal cord training again. I am helping with our monthly support meetings. We have a real hard group of patients at work right now and I finally stood up for the staff and was heard (new staff don't understand that I basically ran this department even though I was just an aide before LOL). They are going to hopefully implement what needs done to take care of these people now. 

On a personal note...No...I'm not dating. Ha! HOWEVER...One or two here know I've been chatting online with a guy since about December. I'm pretty sure I've been friend zoned, but I've gone from seriously crushing/swooning, to being fine with friendship. I know I'm not his type. But...I enjoy his conversation and friendship and this guy has done more for me that could be considered romantic than my husband ever did in 17 years of marriage. He has taught me, that it's o.k. to expect to be doted on by a lover. And he's not even my lover! I have tactile reminders of his affection...and well...as a friend that's pretty cool. I've not met him in person. There's a bit of a distance problem haha. 

This January will make two years since he dropped the bomb. That first year, you all know was horrific. There are still moments when the fear of losing the kids overwhelms me. There are also moments I want them to go with him just so I can have some peace and quiet haha. That second year...well...when I finally crawled out of that dark hole of despair, I started to work on me. With the help of you guys for the ear to vent when needed, I worked through...some of you also offered tangible help and I will never be able to say thank you enough for it. But also with the help of some of the most fabulous coworkers ever. They have been my life line. They have held me when I shut down, unable to even speak, unable to move as tears poured down my face. They have dragged me from the brink and fought to give me the will to survive. 

ANd then...well, then I started dating myself. I've been to the symphony and I listened critically to the sound. I visualized sound waves bouncing off the acoustical walls of the hall. I realized I would never have done that if I was married (well legally still am, but you know what I'm saying). I would have either been worried he was annoyed for having to come, or annoyed at having to stay with the children. I started volunteering at the theater in exchange for free tickets to the play that night. Again, not done if I was married. I've been to choral concerts, and I LOVE choral music live. I've started playing piano again and am actually taking lessons again. 

I am content. I am stressed, but content. I am worried often, but content. I am going to be o.k. (I think LOL). I can breathe again. And soon I will be taking my maiden name back, and maybe I will tell mister internet friend I've crushed on him, or maybe I won't, but I will be free soon, and that feels good. 

I never thought I'd be here. I definitely never thought I'd be o.k. here. I lied to myself for over a decade that I wasn't in a mentally abusive relationship, and that probably taints my ability to even trust again, but I have rediscovered me, and I like that person and I am hesitant to bring someone into that relationship LOL. I am a pretty cool person, and anyone would be lucky to get to know the mind inside this skull, but I'm a little selfish with letting anyone else in yet...and that's o.k. 

If you made it this far, you are a saint. But it feels good to get it all out. O.k. I'm done. Off to feed the spawn and maybe do some housework or study or something or some such! I may be back soon lol. Or maybe not until the divorce is finalized, but hey, some of you already know how to find me away from here anyway and already know all this stuff. 

Later!


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## DayOne (Sep 19, 2014)

Who are you, and what have you done with BFGuru?!?!?!


Read through most of your thread, and the most recent post. OMG! The difference between the beaten, broken woman at the beginning and the Amazonian goddess in the most recent post is stunning! 

In case you still haven't 'got it' yet, YOU'VE BEATEN THIS! 

Your strength, your confidence, your growth, LEAPS off the page. It SCREAM'S "I am woman, hear me roar!"

Congratulations. :smthumbup:


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Haha Day...it almost broke me...maybe it did and my support system put me back together (like the Bionic Man or something)...but I know I'm not completely there yet. I know I have a very hard journey. I haven't cried in a LONG time...well... the whole apartment thing...fear of losing my kids that made me cry A LOT. But barring that...I just get mad, and almost get a **** THIS I'M BEATING THIS NOW! Attitude...which just pisses me off more because NOW...doesn't seem to happen as fast as I think it should LOL. 

My biggest wish, the ability to just do school. OH IF I COULD JUST FOCUS ON SCHOOL. Or at least work part time. I get so frustrated about finances...but if I do get through school...I will be making more money than him and then he can suck it. LOL

I know I have a long way to go...but you know what...I was confident once before. I wanted to tackle the world once before...and damn it... I can do it again. 

Maybe.

Yeah...I scare myself sometimes.


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## DayOne (Sep 19, 2014)

BFGuru said:


> (like the Bionic Man or something)



Actually, The Bionic Woman would be a much better comparison. She fell from a great height (parachuting), was smashed to pieces, and came back stronger, better, faster. 


oops, showing my inner geek there.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Which is still awesome...because I've always wanted to go parachuting. 

But my major skill is panic attacks of epic proportions. I still do those well haha.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

O.k. so...there are days I am truly baffled at the lack of socially acceptable behaviors these two possess. 

A few days ago the MWW (Marriage Wrecking W4ore as me and the bestie refer to her as) texted my daughter, "Ask your mom to send some old white tee shirts for a painting project this week. They're going to get paint all over them so I figured we wouldn't buy new tee shirts for it lols".

Knowing how strapped I am, and how hard I'm struggling to keep a roof over our heads and food on the table, I was a little miffed at the request. But I didn't have any tee shirts anyway, the boys having long outgrown theirs and me too broke to replace them, and the girl..well...we are in brassier territory, not undershirts now. I sent no shirts. 

Fast forward to this weekend...my oldest changes her facebook cover photo...

They are all lined up in white tshirts, holding numbers of their birth order with a teddy bear signifying the dead baby and the MWW holding a number 5. They have a sign saying "after the storm comes a rainbow" and they have painted rainbow splatters on their tees. There is a chalkboard with their due date scribbled on it.

I'm meh, whatever, about the latest spermatic conquest. Whatever makes you feel like a man dude...but seriously...HOW EFFED UP do you have to be, to call the betrayed spouse asking her to supply materials for your baby announcement? What in the flying fvckery is wrong with these people? 

I teeter between wanting to laugh until my sides hurt over the sheer insanity of it all, and wanting to punch them both in the heads for making twice as much as I do and begging me to supply stuff for their latest bastard (which it will remain if this divorce doesn't go through before the kid is born). 

I think I'll go back to my bourbon infused tea LOL. These people are whacked.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

So, I've fallen off the wagon, gotten depressed, gone to the doctor, gotten some meds and am trying to work my way back through things. 

I truly have wonderful friends. They are my support when it gets so horrific I can't breathe. 

Child support never came through. This is not his fault as it is automatically deducted from his paycheck. There is a glitch somewhere in the system and when I call, there is an automated menu. None of them are options that work. When I press 0, hoping for a teller, nothing. And then it just hangs up if I wait. 

Ugh. This supplying for three kids alone is hard. 

The one good thing about the meds is that they make it so everything that is stressing me out does not hit me at the same time, all the time. I couldn't turn it off. So, although I'm still stressing, I'm much calmer about it. I am calling the therapist toda to set up appointments finally. I freaked out over how much I was going to spend in copays to do what they want me to (215$ before medications), but they are willing to accept a smaller copay, so that will help. A lot. 

Also, Toys For Tots approved the kiddos. And the middle school has taken the older two kids that attend there, as their xmas project. I have no idea what that means, but I am ever so grateful that they want to help. I don't ask for anything from them. But the guidance counselor has had a rough run with my spectrum disorder boy transitioning to middle school, so he tells her stuff, and she calls me and I have to explain. So she knows what's going on. She has called a few times telling me she found a resource and that I should apply. And sometimes she calls and asks if I've applied. She has really been a help, in spite of Mr. Letmegetinfights. 

well, I've been up all night and it's been a horrible night at work. I'm hitting the pillows now.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Huh? Child support never came through....as in it comes out of his paycheck but doesn't go into yours. The money is somewhere. Have you tried selecting one of the wrong options, just to get to speak to a human?


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Yup. I've tried. I even tried what they originally told me, which was to wait until it repeats the choices again, then it will bump you to a human. It's worked before so I don't know what's going on. 

I left wondering if they aren't in the office on account of the first day of buck season too. LOL

It will work out. It has to *shrug*. So I'm just going to ride this out and hope for the best....and maybe look arond for some things to pawn so I can get birthday presents for the two that are born this month, and a present or two for the younger kiddo, who isn't getting doted on by a school he does not attend. It's a good thing I hung on to the wedding rings. This one seems like a worthy cause.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Child support posted this morning. So I guess it really was a first day of buck season thing. Welcome to Pennsyltucky where life stops because "hunting". 

I should be able to access it in a day or two. Rent will get closer to being caught up, as a result.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

Landlord gave me a few months to spread my back rent out, but with the support I managed to sink it all on to the balance and I'm oficially caught up again. I have 100 dollars to get me through the next two weeks LOL, but the fridge and pantry are full, and classes ended today so gas is not an issue. I got this.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

O.k. so somehow I miscounted, and there is 700 left before payday...which is actually Friday. The conundrum is, cupboards are getting low, and I cannot access it due to a security breech at the bank. They sent out new debit cards to everyone, however mine came right around the same time I changed my name on my accounts so now I'm waiting on yet a new one. Woops. 

Oh well. Any bills that come up I can do a wire transfer and hopefully the grocery store will take a check. Even still, there's probably just enough to get through the week and the child support will be back in there. That's a separate card entirely, so I can always tap into that. This grown up stuff never ends. I really wish some days I had pushed him to let me do the finances with him so I'd learn. 

Oh wait...then he would have had me onto his cheating ways sooner. 

I'm told the judge signed the decree and we should get notification soon. Who knows. I rarely believe a word out of his mouth anymore, but hey...if he wants a divorce before his baby's born there's no point in lying. 

Again...I got this. It's tough, but...it's gonna be o.k.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

You will make it,


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