# Question to men, what do you consider as sexual desire?



## VintageDreamer (5 mo ago)

My husband and I had a huge fight very recently and one thing that came up was a repeated grievance about me. He said he has never felt any sexual desire coming from me, towards him. he also said that the way I touch him is childish. We have been married for 6 years and we have a son. Whenever we have a big fight, the same grievance is mentioned.

I consider our sex life is more than average but to be honest, he was mostly initiating or asking for them since he has the higher libido. The thing is, nowadays, I am feeling more tired (I am 40 and he is 50) and with a 5 yr old son, I have lots in my mind throughout the day (I am a SAHM) and by the time we go to bed, I prefer to rest. However, when my husband wants sex, I rarely turn him down. I could go down on him more than once a day, or having intercourse every other day. Not to mention there would be times at night when he wanted a BJ. Now and then, especially during the weekend, I dress sexily just to feel sexy and to enjoy his appreciation of my body.

I am quite confused about desire. Once I asked him, do you expect me to jump at you hungrily like those women in porn? He said no, but I don't need to explain to you like you are a child. 
Now, I would appreciate if men here could give me some insight about what they consider wives showing their desire. Because I know, I am quite traditional and so I can't really act "hot" in bed. I do enjoy our sex (especially intercourse) and I was being honest with him. We used to be more creative, but that all changed after we had our son and of course due to our age. 

So men, what do you perceive as sexual desire from your wives?


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## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

Your one child is 5, so not that young, you don't have a job, yet when you go to bed you "prefer to rest". That's it right there. No desire.


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## bobert (Nov 22, 2018)

VintageDreamer said:


> My husband and I had a huge fight very recently and one thing that came up was a repeated grievance about me. He said he has never felt any sexual desire coming from me, towards him. he also said that the way I touch him is childish. We have been married for 6 years and we have a son. Whenever we have a big fight, the same grievance is mentioned.
> 
> I consider our sex life is more than average but to be honest, he was mostly initiating or asking for them since he has the higher libido. The thing is, nowadays, I am feeling more tired (I am 40 and he is 50) and with a 5 yr old son, I have lots in my mind throughout the day (I am a SAHM) and by the time we go to bed, I prefer to rest. However, when my husband wants sex, I rarely turn him down. I could go down on him more than once a day, or having intercourse every other day. Not to mention there would be times at night when he wanted a BJ. Now and then, especially during the weekend, I dress sexily just to feel sexy and to enjoy his appreciation of my body.
> 
> ...





> I asked him, do you expect me to jump at you hungrily like those women in porn? He said no, but I don't need to explain to you like you are a child.


If your husband won't communicate his wants or needs, then tough titties for him. You're not a mind reader and communication is not childish.


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## VintageDreamer (5 mo ago)

Livvie said:


> Your one child is 5, so not that young, you don't have a job, yet when you go to bed you "prefer to rest". That's it right there. No desire.


I guess probably now that he starts schooling, it will be better. Isn’t being a SAHM a job as well without any off days?


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## TinyTbone (6 mo ago)

This is a very interesting question! As my wife and I now more open about all things, mainly I've allowed myself to be vulnerable, she and I are finding out interesting things about our perception of the other. As men, we do need to feel our partner wants...or desires us...as we to them. It kinda breaks down into 2 categories:
1. Spoken desires. I.e., leaning in close in the kitchen and telling him you wanna feel him in you now.
2. Unspoken desires. This is conveyed by non verbal communications. Can be something you wear that says come and get me. Teasing with postures that you know distract us from football! 
We want to know by whatever means you have the desire for us to be your lover. We know we want to be, but do you? It's great to chase and catch you, it is...just sometimes we need the emotional reassurance the feeling is mutual. This site is full of women who service, or perform duty sex for the husbands. This is sometimes the case for different reasons.this has been a big discussion between my wife and I now few a few months. Without the mate showing they want us between their [legs] it can cause some concern to the other as to why they don't DESIRE us. Believe me, you have seen good examples here as to the concerns of lack of desire.


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## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

VintageDreamer said:


> I guess probably now that he starts schooling, it will be better. Isn’t being a SAHM a job as well without any off days?


I had three kids under 5 and still was excited to have sex with my then-husband almost every night. I needed his touch to relax me and remind me that I was a woman, not just a mom.

You would be even more tired if you had more kids AND a full-time job, like many women. You make time for what is important to you. So if you aren't interested in having sex with him as much as you used to be, he is interpreting that as you don't desire him, which sounds correct.

And what does your age have to do with how creative you want to be sexually?


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## Captain Obvious (Mar 14, 2021)

If you never initiate sex, if you never comment to your husband how good he looks, how hot is, how turned on you are, etc, if you only have sex when he initiates or asks you, then it starts to feel like you are only having sex with him bc you feel obligated to do so or you just want him to shut up and leave you alone.


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## TAMAT (Jun 20, 2015)

VintageDreamer said:


> What do you consider as sexual desire.


Quick answer vaginal wetness.

Another answer the willingness to do a variety of sexual acts with me.


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## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

TAMAT said:


> Quick answer vaginal wetness.


I hate to break it to you, but there are lots of women who have plenty of that without them being sexually aroused.


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## BigDaddyNY (May 19, 2021)

VintageDreamer said:


> I guess probably now that he starts schooling, it will be better. Isn’t being a SAHM a job as well without any off days?


Being a SAHM is a job, and you should have down time. That said, an intimate relationship with your husband still needs to be a top priority. I'm not really sure what your husband is looking for that he feels you aren't providing. I really think it is on him to verbalize what he desires. What does he want to see and feel from you? You need to talk to him in a way that doesn't come off as annoyed, but genuinely wanting to learn what he wants.

For me, I just want to see and get the feeling that my wife is fully engaged and enjoying what we are doing in bed, or where ever it may be going down. I also like when she shows random sexual interest in me. Sometimes she will grab my butt or give my junk a squeeze while giving me a little kiss on the cheek. For me it is that little stuff.


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## CountryMike (Jun 1, 2021)

LisaDiane said:


> I had three kids under 5 and still was excited to have sex with my then-husband almost every night. I needed his touch to relax me and remind me that I was a woman, not just a mom.
> 
> You would be even more tired if you had more kids AND a full-time job, like many women. You make time for what is important to you. So if you aren't interested in having sex with him as much as you used to be, he is interpreting that as you don't desire him, which sounds correct.
> 
> And what does your age have to do with how creative you want to be sexually?


My hero!

As in well said.


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## VintageDreamer (5 mo ago)

LisaDiane said:


> I had three kids under 5 and still was excited to have sex with my then-husband almost every night. I needed his touch to relax me and remind me that I was a woman, not just a mom.
> 
> You would be even more tired if you had more kids AND a full-time job, like many women. You make time for what is important to you. So if you aren't interested in having sex with him as much as you used to be, he is interpreting that as you don't desire him, which sounds correct.
> 
> And what does your age have to do with how creative you want to be sexually?


Age equals energy 🤭 I mostly feel tired nowadays, compared to my early 30s. I was never really an active person and I used to work 12hrs shifts as a nurse and I could walk for hours in a shopping mall after. Now? I don’t have the same energy 😁. By the end of the day, I am mentally, emotionally and physically tired although only with 1 child.


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## HarryBosch (6 mo ago)

When I got divorced, I learned very quickly in therapy that I didn't express my intimacy well, my desire. I wanted to make love to my wife, but I just didn't express it well. We would end up sometimes not having sex for weeks.

When I was able to talk about it, I worked it out. My Ex and I had some intimate moments after our divorce, and I redefined desire.

Desire, in my opinion, is wanting ALL of her. You want her no matter what. Desire looks past what she is wearing. It looks past everything but what is going on in the moment. You want to absorb her, your body feels as if an electrical charge is going through you. I was doing things I had rarely if ever did to her. Your touch and feel is on high. I am sure my Ex thought she was with a different man. Desire can be so strong you lose focus on what you want for what he/she wants.

I caution anyone though who believes desire can carry the day. It can't. What it does do if anything is leave a lasting impression on both of you. If that desire was strong, both parties won't soon forget those moments... and I have to say, neither will be able to forget should they find someone else. I'm not saying that for anyone to garner any hope, but leaving with that kind of desire does leave it's impression.


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## BigDaddyNY (May 19, 2021)

VintageDreamer said:


> Age equals energy 🤭 I mostly feel tired nowadays, compared to my early 30s. I was never really an active person and I used to work 12hrs shifts as a nurse and I could walk for hours in a shopping mall after. Now? I don’t have the same energy 😁. By the end of the day, I am mentally, emotionally and physically tired although only with 1 child.


My wife was a SAHM with 2 kids until they were in middle school. That was about age 30-42 for her. The frequency of sex went down a little, but I never felt like the desire waned. We were doing it less, but when we did, it was hot and mutually satisfying.


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## CountryMike (Jun 1, 2021)

VintageDreamer said:


> Age equals energy 🤭 I mostly feel tired nowadays, compared to my early 30s. I was never really an active person and I used to work 12hrs shifts as a nurse and I could walk for hours in a shopping mall after. Now? I don’t have the same energy 😁. By the end of the day, I am mentally, emotionally and physically tired although only with 1 child.


Luckily at 5yrs old, especially starting school soon the kid work load is already just 1/3 of the baby stages. From potty trained on it's way easier. You have long been enjoying the kid stage getting easier. 

We have kids, grown now, but when children we still made sex and alone time a priority and sex didn't diminish that much. When kids went to school was even better.

So, blaming lack of spousal care on the child is a pretty weak argument.


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## VintageDreamer (5 mo ago)

BigDaddyNY said:


> Being a SAHM is a job, and you should have down time. That said, an intimate relationship with your husband still needs to be a top priority. I'm not really sure what your husband is looking for that he feels you aren't providing. I really think it is on him to verbalize what he desires. What does he want to see and feel from you? You need to talk to him in a way that doesn't come off as annoyed, but genuinely wanting to learn what he wants.
> 
> For me, I just want to see and get the feeling that my wife is fully engaged and enjoying what we are doing in bed, or where ever it may be going down. I also like when she shows random sexual interest in me. Sometimes she will grab my butt or give my junk a squeeze while giving me a little kiss on the cheek. For me it is that little stuff.





BigDaddyNY said:


> My wife was a SAHM with 2 kids until they were in middle school. That was about age 30-42 for her. The frequency of sex went down a little, but I never felt like the desire waned. We were doing it less, but when we did, it was hot and mutually satisfying.


That is what I don’t really understand. I also find it hot and mutually (I think and I hope) satisfying after. Isn’t it a sign of desire as well?


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## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

VintageDreamer said:


> Age equals energy 🤭 I mostly feel tired nowadays, compared to my early 30s. I was never really an active person and I used to work 12hrs shifts as a nurse and I could walk for hours in a shopping mall after. Now? I don’t have the same energy 😁. By the end of the day, I am mentally, emotionally and physically tired although only with 1 child.


Well, I am quite a bit older than you are (52), and I have alot of energy. So I am wondering if you aren't eating right or if you aren't getting enough exercise, because you should be feeling great at 40, not old and tired. That's for your 70s or later!!

But being creative sexually isn't about being a gymnast or doing strenuous sexual positions for hours, it's about enthusiasm and excitement to touch and be touched. What I hear in your posts are alot of excuses about why you don't want to have sex anymore, and that is what is bothering your husband. You actually DON'T have the desire to have sex with him the way you used to.

So why don't you be honest and try to solve THAT problem, instead of trying to deflect your real feelings. You need to take responsibility for how you really feel and work that out with your husband and yourself.


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## HarryBosch (6 mo ago)

VintageDreamer said:


> Age equals energy 🤭 I mostly feel tired nowadays, compared to my early 30s. I was never really an active person and I used to work 12hrs shifts as a nurse and I could walk for hours in a shopping mall after. Now? I don’t have the same energy 😁. By the end of the day, I am mentally, emotionally and physically tired although only with 1 child.


I'm in my fifties, and I do a physical job. I'm in pretty good shape. I have kids. Not to mention just going through a divorce, that was emotionally exhausting. Factor in my own baggage (anxiety) I was carrying around.

Once I discovered that intimately I could do new things and actually feel.. None of that above would have interfered with my desire for my Ex. Desire transcends any obtacles the outside world wants to throw at you.

I know everyone has their own definition of what desire is... but when you truly desire someone, everything else is just an excuse. If you have to "load" up to get that desire, have to get in shape, have to muster up something to acquire it... it isn't desire.


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## CountryMike (Jun 1, 2021)

bobert said:


> If your husband won't communicate his wants or needs, then tough titties for him. You're not a mind reader and communication is not childish.


Or no access to titties at all. That seems to be the problem.


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## BigDaddyNY (May 19, 2021)

VintageDreamer said:


> That is what I don’t really understand. I also find it hot and mutually (I think and I hope) satisfying after. Isn’t it a sign of desire as well?


In my opinion yes, but apparently not to your husband. That is why he needs to tell you what he is talking about and what he wants. You aren't a mind reader and neither is he. Effective communication is key. 

I definitely find that talking about sex is a extremely positive thing for us. We weren't always good about it, but practice makes perfect. I think it has a positive impact on the overall intimacy of your marriage and that carries over into your sex life. Telling him what you like could go a long way to helping him feel desired by you. 

It may not be directly related to your issue, but I feel sleeping naked is a great way to improve intimacy and increase the feelings of desire and attraction. Maybe worth a shot if you aren't already doing that. We've have always slept in the nude throughout out entire relationship starting with the first night we had sex. 

Here are some helpful articles about talking with your spouse about sex. 









Why it's important to talk about sex - Uncovering Intimacy


Many couples don't about sex, and we know why. It's embarrassing, awkward and uncomfortable. But it's still important. Here's why.




www.uncoveringintimacy.com












How do I open up to my spouse sexually? - Uncovering Intimacy


A reader asks "How can I open up to my spouse sexually?" Here are some tips from our course on how to become more sexually engaged for Christian wives.




www.uncoveringintimacy.com


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## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

VintageDreamer said:


> I guess probably now that he starts schooling, it will be better. Isn’t being a SAHM a job as well without any off days?


Really? I bet you know what I meant, you don't also have an employer or self owned business you need to deal with in addition to having a child.

No, being a SAHM hasn't the SAME as having a full time outside the home job/employment (or working from home employment).

Here is the rephrase, ready? You don't have an employer, nor a business to run as a self employed person.


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## Mybabysgotit (Jul 1, 2019)

VintageDreamer said:


> My husband and I had a huge fight very recently and one thing that came up was a repeated grievance about me. He said he has never felt any sexual desire coming from me, towards him. he also said that the way I touch him is childish. We have been married for 6 years and we have a son. Whenever we have a big fight, the same grievance is mentioned.
> 
> I consider our sex life is more than average but to be honest, he was mostly initiating or asking for them since he has the higher libido. The thing is, nowadays, I am feeling more tired (I am 40 and he is 50) and with a 5 yr old son, I have lots in my mind throughout the day (I am a SAHM) and by the time we go to bed, I prefer to rest. However, when my husband wants sex, I rarely turn him down. I could go down on him more than once a day, or having intercourse every other day. Not to mention there would be times at night when he wanted a BJ. Now and then, especially during the weekend, I dress sexily just to feel sexy and to enjoy his appreciation of my body.
> 
> ...


If you have to ask what desire is, then your husband is probably right. Desire is palpable. I can feel it when my wife looks at me a certain way, or kisses me. If it's not there, it's not there, but not at all your fault.


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## TAMAT (Jun 20, 2015)

Personal said:


> I hate to break it to you, but there are lots of women who have plenty of that without them being sexually aroused.


I understand women vary quite a bit in that regard, and mens responses here do also.

To add to the quick list passionate kissing. When that ends a man is no longer a lover and has become a husband.


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## Hiner112 (Nov 17, 2019)

Personal said:


> I hate to break it to you, but there are lots of women who have plenty of that without them being sexually aroused.


And some that get aroused without the wetness, especially as they get older.


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## VintageDreamer (5 mo ago)

Mybabysgotit said:


> If you have to ask what desire is, then your husband is probably right. Desire is palpable. I can feel it when my wife looks at me a certain way, or kisses me. If it's not there, it's not there, but not at all your fault.


Do you mean to say that desire is subjective to the receiver, although the other party might feel that they have already shown it?


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## HarryBosch (6 mo ago)

Mybabysgotit said:


> If you have to ask what desire is, then your husband is probably right. Desire is palpable. I can feel it when my wife looks at me a certain way, or kisses me. If it's not there, it's not there, but not at all your fault.


I think if desire is missing, it can be a death sentence for a relationship that includes two people sleeping together. If you have to ask yourself what it is, your learning curve is going to be steep if you're trying to find it with someone you are currently sleeping with. Worse is when the other desires you. The dynamic is disrupted, and it opens the door for a whole host of issues. You may never find it. It's at that point you begin asking yourself why you are in the relationship.


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## HarryBosch (6 mo ago)

TAMAT said:


> When that ends a man is no longer a lover and has become a husband.


I think desire is a two way street feeling wise, but I think it's more of a key for women. Women in my opinion want both, and aren't afraid to say so. Men feel like they are a good husband and that is enough. I'm sure when asked, most men don't think about whether they are desired or not, its more important to them that they are a good husband.

Men in my opinion have to realize that isn't enough when troubles find there way into their marriage. I know I'm generalizing. It's just women need more than just a "good husband" in my opinion. As age progresses, sure, it changes. But women deserve to be shown they are desired.. The husband at one point desired something about their wife... why should that go away because they are now married?


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## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

HarryBosch said:


> I think desire is a two way street feeling wise, but I think it's more of a key for women. Women in my opinion want both, and aren't afraid to say so. Men feel like they are a good husband and that is enough. I'm sure when asked, most men don't think about whether they are desired or not, its more important to them that they are a good husband.
> 
> Men in my opinion have to realize that isn't enough when troubles find there way into their marriage. I know I'm generalizing. It's just women need more than just a "good husband" in my opinion. As age progresses, sure, it changes. But women deserve to be shown they are desired.. The husband at one point desired something about their wife... why should that go away because they are now married?


Very often (like in the OP's case) it is the WIFE who loses her desire for her husband, while the husband still desires her the same as he always did.


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## HarryBosch (6 mo ago)

LisaDiane said:


> Very often (like in the OP's case) it is the WIFE who loses her desire for her husband, while the husband still desires her the same as he always did.


I agree Lisa, I think it has a lot to do with the husband being too busy being a good husband I'm a man and I hate to say this, but a good husband is more apt to let himself go. He doesn't worry about whether the wife wants a more fit husband or a husband that wants to dress a little nicer. Or a man who is in touch with their own desires. I've seen some men who have absolutely let themselves go while the wife is much more put together. Those guys have taken their marriage for granted.

Just my opinion, but when a husband is resting on his laurels, and the wife is smoking hot, that deficiency eventually gets noticed by the wife. When a husband thinks everything is okay in a marriage... par is good enough (Using a golf term), they don't tend to that marriage as they should. Women deserve better.


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## ccpowerslave (Nov 21, 2020)

For me I want to see my wife has a plan to have sex.

I’d say sometimes she is excited about it, or sometimes she is excited about my reaction. Don’t care either way.

She’s tired like you and she’s much lower drive than me so it’s not reasonable to expect much other than a bit of enthusiasm once things are going.

If you’re doing your husband 1+ times a day and you’re also tired then you’re a trooper.

Another thing is my wife knows exactly what I want in bed and she can do it or not do it. Without me telling her what to do which I will maybe do once a month, almost zero chance. Sometimes like last Saturday she will surprise me and in that case it was completely out of her own head. So times like that are great.

If you’re having sex often I don’t think it’s reasonable for the LD partner to seem overcome with desire.


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## Mybabysgotit (Jul 1, 2019)

HarryBosch said:


> I agree Lisa, I think it has a lot to do with the husband being too busy being a good husband I'm a man and I hate to say this, but a good husband is more apt to let himself go. He doesn't worry about whether the wife wants a more fit husband or a husband that wants to dress a little nicer. Or a man who is in touch with their own desires. I've seen some men who have absolutely let themselves go while the wife is much more put together. Those guys have taken their marriage for granted.
> 
> Just my opinion, but when a husband is resting on his laurels, and the wife is smoking hot, that deficiency eventually gets noticed by the wife. When a husband thinks everything is okay in a marriage... par is good enough (Using a golf term), they don't tend to that marriage as they should. Women deserve better.


For me at least, it would be a boundary issue. I don't understand how men can go for years complaining about how his wife isn't up for sex. If my wife wasn't up for sex, I would know within a month, probably sooner and do something about it. That something wouldn't include sitting around hoping she regains desire or asking a bunch of strangers about it.


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

LisaDiane said:


> Well, I am quite a bit older than you are (52), and I have alot of energy. So I am wondering if you aren't eating right or if you aren't getting enough exercise, because you should be feeling great at 40, not old and tired. That's for your 70s or later!!
> 
> But being creative sexually isn't about being a gymnast or doing strenuous sexual positions for hours, it's about enthusiasm and excitement to touch and be touched. What I hear in your posts are alot of excuses about why you don't want to have sex anymore, and that is what is bothering your husband. You actually DON'T have the desire to have sex with him the way you used to.
> 
> So why don't you be honest and try to solve THAT problem, instead of trying to deflect your real feelings. You need to take responsibility for how you really feel and work that out with your husband and yourself.


I wish I could like this twice. 

Sent from my Pixel 6 using Tapatalk


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## HarryBosch (6 mo ago)

Mybabysgotit said:


> do something about it.


I agree with your post. My challenge would be, if you have to do something about it, something is already wrong. I think you can rekindle desire, don't get me wrong. My question is, where did it go? 

I recall Marc878 and Evinrude78 saying this to me here when I first began posting. Once you lose your spouses desire to be in a marriage.. and I think that includes just having a desire for you, it's very hard to bring that back. That door more often than not, is closed. 

Let me clarify though that this is a long term thing. Life has its challenges, and sometimes a moment presents itself where one just doesn't feel it. That is to be expected, and I applaud you for noticing it and taking action to find or communicate the cause.

If that loss or the feeling of that loss becomes long term, I think it can be found again, but the terms have changed somewhere, something is wrong. If that goes for too long, and it is neglected, it can begin to show signs of a door closing. If you're fishing and you have a fish on, you can't let that fish go too far, because if you do, it's eventually going to snap your line and it will be gone.


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## VintageDreamer (5 mo ago)

ccpowerslave said:


> If you’re having sex often I don’t think it’s reasonable for the LD partner to seem overcome with desire.


That’s what I said to him. We both agreed that he has the higher libido, myself, low libido. If our sex frequency is more than average, (almost everyday and sometimes more than 1 a day), would I have the window for desire?


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## AlwaysImproving (5 mo ago)

VintageDreamer said:


> So men, what do you perceive as sexual desire from your wives?


This is an easy one. Desire is to come from you that you want it. Are you having fun? Do you get anything out of it yourself? Or is it a chore? Trust me you can't fake this one.

Desire can also be passion from you during foreplay or PIV.

Sound tiring? Well, that's kind of the point he's making. You'll have to negotiate with him an acceptable level of desire. I'm sure he isn't saying it has to be 100% all the time. He probably just misses it altogether.


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## AlwaysImproving (5 mo ago)

I think there is probably a lack of communication on his part. Something he is wishing for but feels since you are already giving so much that he doesn't want to push the subject to ruin what you already have. Just guessing here and trying to put myself in his shoes as a guy.


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## Anastasia6 (May 28, 2017)

Personal said:


> I hate to break it to you, but there are lots of women who have plenty of that without them being sexually aroused.


And there are those with plenty of desire and low vaginal wetness.


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## 342693 (Mar 2, 2020)

Answer to OP's question....kissing. When you start kissing, that's a clear indication to a guy what your desire is. If the woman keeps it to little pecks, you know that's all you're getting. If she dives in passionately, with her tongue...you know it's on. Has always been the best indicator for me.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

VintageDreamer said:


> My husband and I had a huge fight very recently and one thing that came up was a repeated grievance about me. He said he has never felt any sexual desire coming from me, towards him. he also said that the way I touch him is childish. We have been married for 6 years and we have a son. Whenever we have a big fight, the same grievance is mentioned.
> 
> I consider our sex life is more than average but to be honest, he was mostly initiating or asking for them since he has the higher libido. The thing is, nowadays, I am feeling more tired (I am 40 and he is 50) and with a 5 yr old son, I have lots in my mind throughout the day (I am a SAHM) and by the time we go to bed, I prefer to rest. However, when my husband wants sex, I rarely turn him down. I could go down on him more than once a day, or having intercourse every other day. Not to mention there would be times at night when he wanted a BJ. Now and then, especially during the weekend, I dress sexily just to feel sexy and to enjoy his appreciation of my body.
> 
> ...


It is about porn. These are relatively generational complaints. They have unrealistic expectations from watching Pizza BJ girl from the time they were teenagers.


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## Tracy22 (5 mo ago)

BigDaddyNY said:


> Sometimes she will grab my butt or give my junk a squeeze while giving me a little kiss on the cheek. For me it is that little stuff.
> 
> I do this to my husband at least 20 times per day


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## hamadryad (Aug 30, 2020)

I think just like women, a lot of men would prefer that their women see them as a sexy person...as being "hot" in their eyes...This whole business about "responsive desire" is just a smokescreen in a lot of cases, tbh, I never heard of it outside of here.......Its not responsive desire it's more like "ok, let's get this over with"....

Nothing beats having a woman grab your ass or rub her breasts on your back while you aren't expecting it...Or send you a text while you are at work, telling you how bad she wants your d....I know a lot of women don't do that type of stuff, because maybe they are suppressed or fear rejection, but hey, you asked, so I am giving you a male perspective... 

That being said, I don't think this type of thing is in you....That doesn't make you a bad person, but I think what he wants and what type of woman you are don't match...I think he probably should just get used to it...If you tried to do this stuff, its going to come across as phony and not genuine...


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## VintageDreamer (5 mo ago)

DownByTheRiver said:


> It is about porn. These are relatively generational complaints. They have unrealistic expectations from watching Pizza BJ girl from the time they were teenagers.


I could cry…he indeed has some porn watching habit. I didn’t want to point this out because I am trying to fix myself first and not divert everything to him 😞


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## ccpowerslave (Nov 21, 2020)

VintageDreamer said:


> That’s what I said to him. We both agreed that he has the higher libido, myself, low libido. If our sex frequency is more than average, (almost everyday and sometimes more than 1 a day), would I have the window for desire?


In my experience with my wife it will be sporadic and probably around the time she is ovulating? I tried tracking it but her periods are not super regular anymore so I gave up.

We’re having sex between 3-6 times a week, sometimes twice in one day. I’d say “get your pants off because I want to screw” level of obvious desire from her is maybe 1/mo. I don’t care as long as she is enthusiastic if she does decide to go for it. I don’t need her to be super hot for sex or anything as long as she’s having it.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

VintageDreamer said:


> I could cry…he indeed has some porn watching habit. I didn’t want to point this out because I am trying to fix myself first and not divert everything to him 😞


Divert everything to him. He's the one who has the problem. Someone who gets addicted to porn or has just been raised on it causes lots of problems in the marriage because they have unrealistic expectations. There are hundreds of posts on this forum about it. 

The women in porn are either paid actresses or human trafficked sex slaves. They don't do it because they want to. They don't act like that in real life if they have a real life. 

If your husband is entrenched in porn, he is basically asking you to do what prostitutes get paid good money for which is to flatter and validate him and make him feel like a big man. Normal would be showing each other you love each other without a lot of theatrics. Half of being a prostitute is building up the man's ego and telling him he deserves better than he's got from home and that he's extra sexy and that they can barely control themselves from worshiping at their penis. No one should have to do this crap. Just tell him he's asking you to act like a paid porn actress. Tell him he needs to get help for his porn addiction if he's using it regularly.


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## ccpowerslave (Nov 21, 2020)

BTW as the husband one thing that can help at least with the enthusiasm part is being in shape. Yesterday before dinner I did a few sets of bicep curls to swell up. As the TAM wisdom goes, “When the biceps are popping the panties are dropping.” It worked for me and she was hanging on my arms.

More bicep curls today and maybe some bench press before bed 😈


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## VintageDreamer (5 mo ago)

ccpowerslave said:


> BTW as the husband one thing that can help at least with the enthusiasm part is being in shape. Yesterday before dinner I did a few sets of bicep curls to swell up. As the TAM wisdom goes, “When the biceps are popping the panties are dropping.” It worked for me and she was hanging on my arms.
> 
> More bicep curls today and maybe some bench press before bed 😈


😄👍🏻


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

VintageDreamer said:


> I could cry…he indeed has some porn watching habit. I didn’t want to point this out because I am trying to fix myself first and not divert everything to him 😞


That’s what he wants. He expects you to look and act like a prostitute. This belongs on him because it IS him.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

Vintage Dreamer, use the search function on this forum and search for "Porn" and then click on the box that says something like "thread titles only" and see how many other people have had these same problems and read a bunch of those. This is just a repeating pattern here. There were over 500 (500 is the search limit) when I did that search not long ago. It is a big problem these days. The guys don't ever want to give up porn, even though in many cases, it is doing irreparable harm to their relationships. Many of them grew up on it at this point. My generation (I'm 69) didn't have video porn to contend with but just had magazines, which were destructive enough. Now it's an epidemic.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

It is unrealistic to expect a normal woman to maintain the body of a porn star all her life. It is also absurd to expect her to engage in humiliating and painful sex while pretending to enjoy it. Porn stars are actresses. Most women are not even physically able to do the things those women are made to do on a daily basis. The things that are done to them are painful and demeaning. Expecting your wife, especially after demanding she be a virgin when you marry, to be able to perform on the same level with a porn star is absurd. And cruel.


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## BigDaddyNY (May 19, 2021)

I still think you need him to tell you what he wants. It isn't childish to discuss this kind of thing. In fact the opposite is true. It is what adults do.


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## AlwaysImproving (5 mo ago)

Porn? Depends how much and what type. I've seen it and couldn't claim what what the women do there I would describe as desire. I think we need to ask for clarification from him.


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## BigDaddyNY (May 19, 2021)

AlwaysImproving said:


> Porn? Depends how much and what type. I've seen it and couldn't claim what what the women do there I would describe as desire. I think we need to ask for clarification from him.


Porn does show an intense level of passion, which could be seen as desire, but ad others have said it isn't real. They are playing a role.

Again, we don't know what he means when her husband says he wants her to desire him. Could it be he wants porn like passion? Maybe.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

AlwaysImproving said:


> Porn? Depends how much and what type. I've seen it and couldn't claim what what the women do there I would describe as desire. I think we need to ask for clarification from him.


It depends who's watching it and how long, if they've watched it so much that it's become normal to them. But also, even some who know it's fake still want it just like they would like a prostitute to do what they want and tell them what they want to hear. 

The OP could maybe benefit from marriage counseling.


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## LATERILUS79 (Apr 1, 2021)

CountryMike said:


> My hero!
> 
> As in well said.


LisaDiane is the hero that TAM needs and deserves. 😂


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## Lotsofheart73 (Oct 13, 2021)

Skimming the thread and it is out of control. OP came looking for advice from men about desire and gets slammed for being a sahm to a , heaven forbid, a 5 year old. And only 1!! Geez. That’s not helping her at all to being arguing about working or “not working”.

And now it comes out husband watches porn so THAT has to be the problem because nobody in the whole world watches porn without expecting wife to be a porn star. What a crock.

@VintageDreamer I am not a man but I’m going to respond anyway. porn may or may not be the problem. That is something you and hubby will have to determine. It sounds like your husband is looking for a little appreciation and affection other than when he initiates. Could be something as simple as a surprise kiss when he’s getting out of the shower or baking his favorite brownies and slipping him a naughty note or just something unexpected every now and then.

I understand the being ready to rest/sleep at bedtime. Bring it up with hubby (not in bedroom). See if the two of you can come up with a better time for the both of you. Sounds like frequency is not the problem. Just let him know that for you, the frequency doesn’t leave a lot of time for a big buildup of desire. That’s ok. Everyone is different. As long as the two of you can work together it will be ok. I think the place to start is talking it out and for you to see if you can think of little things you can do here & there to let him know you’re thinking of him. Little things can make all the difference.

And OP, sorry about the little rant above. I just can’t believe (actually I can) how some posters are just immediately off the deep end.

Also, someone may have already suggested, about the drop in energy. It happens. And it’s different for everyone. I would suggest getting a little more exercise and next time you’re at your doctor’s office ask them to test your thyroid levels. It is not uncommon for many women to go undiagnosed with hypothyroidism that robs them of energy. Or low iron for that matter.

Good luck. I hope some of the male posters were able to give you some male insight that’s helpful to you.


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## heartsbeating (May 2, 2011)

I'm not a man, yet I have a bunch of questions for you.



VintageDreamer said:


> My husband and I had a huge fight very recently and one thing that came up was a repeated grievance about me. He said he has never felt any sexual desire coming from me, towards him. he also said that the way I touch him is childish.


While you do enjoy sex, do you feel desire (or have ever) for him outside of those moments?
Does he behave in ways outside of sex that you find desirable?
How do you respond in these arguments?
What does he mean that the way that you touch him is 'childish'?
Whenever you have a big fight, how does this grievance keep coming up? As in, is the original fight about something else and then gets diverted to this? And if so, how do you resolve things together?



VintageDreamer said:


> I am quite confused about desire. Once I asked him, do you expect me to jump at you hungrily like those women in porn? He said no, but I don't need to explain to you like you are a child.


What's with him using infantilizing language (second reference mentioned here)? If you are confused about desire and what it means to him, that's a fair and open question to ask of him. His pointing the finger of blame and not supporting you to understand his needs better likely does not help ignite the sparks of desire. Well, it wouldn't for me at least. Big difference to someone sharing what they feel good about and encouraging and positively reinforcing more of that; compared with someone that makes a personal dig, assigns blame, and on top of that, fails to express or communicate what they need. How very undesirable that could be. 

And yet, in those arguments, depending on how you engage too, there's likely opportunity to switch-up how that goes. If you both want to adjust things together, nominating one another to be on the same team is needed. It could be there's some kind of feeling of hurt from his perspective, and perhaps wants to feel closer or valued by and with you, or something like that... I'm not a man and not your husband so whadda I know... however, I'd hazard a guess the defensive and muddied arguments need to focus together on what's at the core of it. Essentially, strip back and get raw (emotionally speaking; maybe physically speaking too).

Okay, lots of questions. I'm all about the details.

How I demonstrate desire to my husband beyond being in the moment of sexual intimacy, is part of my personality. Plus I feel chemistry with him and desire him as a man in his own right, for who and how he is, combined with who and how he is with me and as part of our shared dynamic. And what might be typical ways of expressing myself to my husband, may not be what you're about and who you are. Let alone, whether that also speaks to your husband. In other words, one cannot faketh the funk.


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## heartsbeating (May 2, 2011)

I will add that touch speaks the most to _my_ husband. I'm also quite expressive verbally. Some is mild flirtation, other times more explicit. Anyway, as a little light-hearted contribution to this thread, I'll share that I was recently observing my husband working in the yard. Ya know, working hard, sweaty and dirty and just overall... _mreow_. I took a photo of him from where I was and later texted him the photo with

Me: My husband is sexy 🥰
Him: My wife takes photos like a stalker 🥰

Wishing the best to you, @VintageDreamer


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## LeGenDary_Man (Sep 25, 2013)

@VintageDreamer

Your husband is watching porn? He might be getting ideas from it.

The matter of concern is that he is NOT telling you much but throwing temper tantrums at you and accusing you of being childish:



VintageDreamer said:


> My husband and I had a huge fight very recently and one thing that came up was a repeated grievance about me. He said he has never felt any sexual desire coming from me, towards him. he also said that the way I touch him is childish. We have been married for 6 years and we have a son. Whenever we have a big fight, the same grievance is mentioned.
> 
> I consider our sex life is more than average but to be honest, he was mostly initiating or asking for them since he has the higher libido. The thing is, nowadays, I am feeling more tired (I am 40 and he is 50) and with a 5 yr old son, I have lots in my mind throughout the day (I am a SAHM) and by the time we go to bed, I prefer to rest. However, when my husband wants sex, I rarely turn him down. I could go down on him more than once a day, or having intercourse every other day. Not to mention there would be times at night when he wanted a BJ. Now and then, especially during the weekend, I dress sexily just to feel sexy and to enjoy his appreciation of my body.
> 
> ...


You are also having sex with him on a regular basis (post # 33).

Your husband = D*i*k

However, you are seeking input from men here so I will provide some pointers.

1. Give him a hug when he is not expecting it. You do not have to do this regularly. Try to surprise him.

2. Sit on his lap when he is not expecting it. You do not have to do this regularly. Try to surprise him.

My wife did this recently. WE had an argument and I moved away from her and sat on a chair, checking my phone. She passed by but came back after a short while and sat on my lap . My mood completely shifted and I touched her in intimate ways. She put a smile on my face.

3. Text him when he is working. You do not have to do this regularly but sometimes. Simply mention that you love him with a heart emoji. And leave it at that.

4. Touch him and kiss him when he is not expecting it. You do not have to do this regularly. Try to surprise him.

5. Go out on a WALK with him from time-to-time. Take him to a park for a walk.

Try these activities with your husband and see how it goes.


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## Young at Heart (Jan 6, 2015)

VintageDreamer said:


> My husband and I had a huge fight very recently and one thing that came up was a repeated grievance about me. *He said he has never felt any sexual desire coming from me,* towards him. he also said that *the way I touch him is childish*. We have been married for 6 years and we have a son. Whenever we have a big fight, the same grievance is mentioned.
> 
> I consider our sex life is more than average but to be honest, *he was mostly initiating* or asking for them since he has the higher libido. The thing is, nowadays, I am feeling more tired (I am 40 and he is 50) and with a 5 yr old son, I have lots in my mind throughout the day (I am a SAHM) and by the time we go to bed, I prefer to rest. However, *when my husband wants sex, I rarely turn him down.* I could go down on him more than once a day, or having intercourse every other day. Not to mention there would be times at night when he wanted a BJ. Now and then, especially during the weekend, *I dress sexily just to feel sexy and to enjoy his appreciation of my body.*
> 
> ...


I think the answer is contained within the words you have said in your first post.

Just like you, he wants to feel sexy and that you appreciate his body. Focus on what you said you wanted, as it is what he likely wants.

Have you ever laid next to him in bed and taken all his close off him, while looking at his body and telling him who wonderful, beautiful and sexy his body is, with the emphasis on telling him those things? Have you stroked his penis, while telling him what a beautiful shape it is, what a beautiful color it is, how the size is perfect (not too big and not too small) and how much you enjoy touching him? Have you kissed his lips and then kissed down his body all the while telling him how much the sight, smell, taste and feel of him sexually arouses you? Have you told him how much you like making him erect and how wonderful it feels to hold his penis inside your vagina?

No, you don't need to install a stripper pole in your bedroom and do a strip tease for him. No you don't need to practice yoga until you can put your ankles behind you head. No you don't need to install a sex swing in your bedroom or mirrors on the ceiling. No you don't need to constantly initiate, but perhaps initiate: not sex, but foreplay much more often.

A man's biggest sex organ is not between his legs. It is between his ears. What he is saying when he asks to feel sexually desired is for you to spend much more time playing with his mind (his biggest sex organ) so that he feels sexually desired. He wants you to boost his confidence that you physically love and lust after him. At least that is what I would want. 

Yes, you are tired and you rarely turn him down when he initiates, but that is not what he is asking for.

People who have been married a long time know what each other is thinking much of the time. Have you caught yourself finishing each others sentences? You do realize that he can read your tone of voice, your facial expressions, and your body language. You realize he knows when you are tired, don't want sex, but that you don't want to turn him down. He may appreciate you not turning him down, but he wants some enthusiasm and to "enjoy your appreciation of his body." Just like you enjoy his appreciation of your body!

I hope that this answers your question; ".......So men, what do you perceive as sexual desire from your wives?...."

Good luck.

P.S. The Sex Therapist who helped save my marriage introduced my wife and me to Sensate Focus exercises. There are many descriptions of them. They are used to break down patterns that develop in relationships. They allow one to explore the joy of touching first sensually and then later both sensually and sexually with your partner. They also allow one to just focus on the joy of being touched by your partner. Another, lesson provided by the Sex Therapist was Affirmations or self-hypnosis to change your own feelings and motivation.

The following URL is about Sensate Focus Exercises After (or better yet) while exploring the wonderful feelings of touching and being touched,try some affirmations about how much you love touching his body, how much you love watching his body change as you touch him, how much your touching him changes your breathing, your heart rate, you level of arousal, and your passionate love for him.

Affirmations are related to self-hypnosis. They are used to stop smoking, to loose weight, to exercise more and for all kinds of things like controlling anger. Instead of telling yourself you are tired, tell yourself at night when you crawl into bed with your husband the sight of his body will energize you and make you want to touch and praise his body. Instead of thinking you "*can't really act "hot" in bed," *practice affirmations during the day that when you are with your husband you are not only capable of acting hot in bed, but he views you as being hot in bed. Instead of telling yourself that "*when my husband wants sex, I rarely turn him down..." *tell yourself that when he initiates sex, you relish the opportunity to take turns pleasuring each other. A URL on affirmations Affirmations to to change your life

Do you remember above where I suggested that ".....He wants you to boost his confidence that you physically love and lust after him...." Well if you say things affirming his beauty and sexuality and he keeps hearing them, they will function as if he was saying them and help boost his confidence that he is sexually desired. I took a course once on affirmations and learned that if they are said by a member of the opposite sex on a recording that you play for yourself while relaxing, they are much more effective. You can become his affirmations as well as your own.

Sorry for the length of this. Good luck. I think you have articulated the problem very well and know what it is.


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## Young at Heart (Jan 6, 2015)

Mybabysgotit said:


> For me at least, it would be a boundary issue. I don't understand how men can go for years complaining about how his wife isn't up for sex. If my wife wasn't up for sex, I would know within a month, probably sooner and do something about it. That something wouldn't include sitting around hoping she regains desire or asking a bunch of strangers about it.


You do understand that a husband with a stay at home wife, child, mortgage, car payments, etc. can feel a crushing financial burden on his shoulders to "support his family." I remember when I had a son what wanted $150 stylish athletic shoes (that was a long time ago when good quality running shoes were about $50 to $60). If it was a choice of his shoes or a new sports jacket and pants for me, it would have been for my family.

As to sexual desire, my wife and I just about divorced because we drifted into a sex starved marriage. She actually told me she never wanted to have sex with me again and she had absolutely no sexual desire for me. We had just turned 60 and I was focusing on making money to pay for two kids in college and to build up our retirement savings. I had been brainwashed into believing that the sign of a good husband was to be a good provider and she would love me for that.

I eventually concluded that I needed to change myself for me and for my happiness. That allowed me to change the way I treated her. With the help of a great sex therapist (a marriage counselor with extra training in helping couples with sexual problems), my wife understood that if things didn't change we would divorce. She decided she really wanted to remain married to me.

I just have a different perspective. People can drift apart slowly over time, especially when children are involved and each is trying as hard as they can to be the perfect spouse performing their own interpretation of a cultural mandate.


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## Young at Heart (Jan 6, 2015)

VintageDreamer said:


> > ccpowerslave said:
> > If you’re having sex often I don’t think it’s reasonable for the LD partner to seem overcome with desire.
> 
> 
> That’s what I said to him. We both agreed that he has the higher libido, myself, low libido. If our sex frequency is more than average, (almost everyday and sometimes more than 1 a day), would I have the window for desire?


My libido is much higher than my wife's 3 to 5 times a week; her's is more like once a week to once every two weeks. The Sex Therapist (when we were in our early 60's) that saved our marriage helped us negotiate a frequency that was much higher than my wife wanted and much lower than I wanted. Our goal was and is twice a week. 

One of the hard lessons I had to learn was to accept those times when my wife with her lower libido didn't want to be sexually aroused, but wanted to give me the gift of her body. It was a gift of her wanting to please me and pleasure me. It was not an obligation on her part. It was from her heart. It was something that brought her emotional joy, even if she didn't want sexual joy. Sometimes she told me that seeing how excited I got allowed her to feed off of my sexual excitement and change her desire for sex. That is how sexual desire can manifest itself.

Good luck.


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## frenchpaddy (May 31, 2021)

VintageDreamer said:


> My husband and I had a huge fight very recently and one thing that came up was a repeated grievance about me. He said he has never felt any sexual desire coming from me, towards him. he also said that the way I touch him is childish. We have been married for 6 years and we have a son. Whenever we have a big fight, the same grievance is mentioned.
> 
> I consider our sex life is more than average but to be honest, he was mostly initiating or asking for them since he has the higher libido. The thing is, nowadays, I am feeling more tired (I am 40 and he is 50) and with a 5 yr old son, I have lots in my mind throughout the day (I am a SAHM) and by the time we go to bed, I prefer to rest. However, when my husband wants sex, I rarely turn him down. I could go down on him more than once a day, or having intercourse every other day. Not to mention there would be times at night when he wanted a BJ. Now and then, especially during the weekend, I dress sexily just to feel sexy and to enjoy his appreciation of my body.
> 
> ...


as Captain Obvious response said if you are not initiate sex,and don't make him feel sexy 

IT is like what Lady di once said all she wanted was a men to hold her and tell her she was beautiful and hold her in his arms , men are not that different from women , 
a Man wants to know he is wanted wants to know you with him for the reasons your with him , he just wants more action from you that reaction if you tired going to bed and you said you do a lot of walking , you might do with taking up a sport to help get fit or just go to bed early, next time your with the doctor ask him or her if you are tired , it sounds like you have sex often just that he seems to be the one asking and initiate sex,


Captain Obvious said:


> If you never initiate sex, if you never comment to your husband how good he looks, how hot is, how turned on you are, etc, if you only have sex when he initiates or asks you, then it starts to feel like you are only having sex with him bc you feel obligated to do so or you just want him to shut up and leave you alone.


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## frenchpaddy (May 31, 2021)

Young at Heart said:


> You do understand that a husband with a stay at home wife, child, mortgage, car payments, etc. can feel a crushing financial burden on his shoulders to "support his family." I remember when I had a son what wanted $150 stylish athletic shoes (that was a long time ago when good quality running shoes were about $50 to $60). If it was a choice of his shoes or a new sports jacket and pants for me, it would have been for my family.
> 
> As to sexual desire, my wife and I just about divorced because we drifted into a sex starved marriage. She actually told me she never wanted to have sex with me again and she had absolutely no sexual desire for me. I was focusing on making money to pay for two kids in college and to build up our retirement savings. I had been brainwashed into believing that the sign of a good husband was to be a good providers.
> 
> ...


super post


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## VintageDreamer (5 mo ago)

Lotsofheart73 said:


> Skimming the thread and it is out of control. OP came looking for advice from men about desire and gets slammed for being a sahm to a , heaven forbid, a 5 year old. And only 1!! Geez. That’s not helping her at all to being arguing about working or “not working”.
> 
> And now it comes out husband watches porn so THAT has to be the problem because nobody in the whole world watches porn without expecting wife to be a porn star. What a crock.
> 
> ...


Thank you!


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## VintageDreamer (5 mo ago)

Young at Heart said:


> I think the answer is contained within the words you have said in your first post.
> 
> Just like you, he wants to feel sexy and that you appreciate his body. Focus on what you said you wanted, as it is what he likely wants.
> 
> ...


Thank you for the interesting tip! I will try that


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## Kyr1la (Sep 6, 2019)

Did you do for any medical check up? Is there underlying issue that associated with your ‘tiredness’.


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## VintageDreamer (5 mo ago)

heartsbeating said:


> I'm not a man, yet I have a bunch of questions for you.
> 
> 
> While you do enjoy sex, do you feel desire (or have ever) for him outside of those moments?
> ...


Yes, I do feel desire for him outside of sex. I love touching his body when we are in bed and grabbing his ass while kissing before he leaves for work 
Sure do. He helps me now and then with housework
During arguments, I mostly try to sound calm and refrain from calling him names. Apart from that, I am not an angel 
I have no idea what he means by childish. My opinion is that, now and then, he might wish for me to grab him down there and then immediately go down on him by surprise, when it those moments I only wanted to feel his body with my hands?
I have to say that most of the time, the original fight is about something else and then gets diverted to this. We stay upset with each other for about a day while continuing the same arguments through phone calls (when he is at work or driving), then we slowly thawed out. Sometimes we say sorry to each other, sometimes we just let it by and resume as normal.


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## VintageDreamer (5 mo ago)

Kyr1la said:


> Did you do for any medical check up? Is there underlying issue that associated with your ‘tiredness’.


Didn't do a full check up, but the thyroid was normal as far as we were told. I keep thinking if I became a mother from a younger age, I would probably get the hang of this. But motherhood at 36yrs was probably not very optimal for me (I am only speaking for myself). And on top of that, I switched from a career woman to a full time housewife and mother, trying to figure things out on my own (we are of a mixed marriage and we are an expat family). We do not have any direct family help since the day our son was born, so navigating things are challenging for us


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## frenchpaddy (May 31, 2021)

VintageDreamer said:


> Didn't do a full check up, but the thyroid was normal as far as we were told. I keep thinking if I became a mother from a younger age, I would probably get the hang of this. But motherhood at 36yrs was probably not very optimal for me (I am only speaking for myself). And on top of that, I switched from a career woman to a full time housewife and mother, trying to figure things out on my own (we are of a mixed marriage and we are an expat family). We do not have any direct family help since the day our son was born, so navigating things are challenging for us


 I know what that is like , when you don't have family around , you never can drop off the baby to mother or even just have family over ,
many take family for granted


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## frenchpaddy (May 31, 2021)

VintageDreamer said:


> Yes, I do feel desire for him outside of sex. I love touching his body when we are in bed and grabbing his ass while kissing before he leaves for work
> Sure do. He helps me now and then with housework
> During arguments, I mostly try to sound calm and refrain from calling him names. Apart from that, I am not an angel
> I have no idea what he means by childish. My opinion is that, now and then, he might wish for me to grab him down there and then immediately go down on him by surprise, when it those moments I only wanted to feel his body with my hands?
> I have to say that most of the time, the original fight is about something else and then gets diverted to this. We stay upset with each other for about a day while continuing the same arguments through phone calls (when he is at work or driving), then we slowly thawed out. Sometimes we say sorry to each other, sometimes we just let it by and resume as normal.


unless he can explain one night to have a raw discussion about what he is thinking about by childish you will never know 

Most things in an argument are stupid point scoring , and I THINK THAT is what this is


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## Wifey93 (9 mo ago)

I’m not a man but I’ll give my perspective, as I think gender is not as relevant …

For me, feeling desired is receiving signals (by text, look, touch, gesture) from my partner that they are thinking of me sexually outside of the bedroom. It can vary from being very innocent to quite explicit. It can be used to build up the tension between you two, or just a signal to your partner that you find them sexually attractive.

I think it comes naturally to some people more than others. I read a lot of erotica and I’ve been a frequently visitor to the online sex chat rooms back in the day. I wonder if that had an influence on my ‘sexual imagination’. My husband doesn’t get it, tried it with him and it was more awkward than arousing.


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## frenchpaddy (May 31, 2021)

Wifey93 said:


> I think it comes to some people more naturally than others.


and some are better at reading it than others , most of us men can't rear when a woman is trying her best to get a guy to ask her out ,


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

Every day at 50? And he is complaining? He doesn't tell you what he wants? He says you touch him in a childish way? I expect he wants you to be a porn star. You have different libidos and your husband knows. You still put quite a lot of effort in your sexual life, despite your lack of libido. But he is not happy. He is an idiot. I am a man, by the way...


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## Sfort (Sep 28, 2019)

LisaDiane said:


> Very often (like in the OP's case) it is the WIFE who loses her desire for her husband, while the husband still desires her the same as he always did.


But why is this the case?


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## AlwaysImproving (5 mo ago)

VintageDreamer said:


> I have no idea what he means by childish. My opinion is that, now and then, he might wish for me to grab him down there and then immediately go down on him by surprise, when it those moments I only wanted to feel his body with my hands?


I'm just trying to decipher as a guy. He's probably talking about the touching not being purposeful enough for his enjoyment just not realizing that you were doing it for your enjoyment. He needs to communicate more.


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## Sfort (Sep 28, 2019)

VintageDreamer said:


> I have to say that most of the time, the original fight is about something else and then gets diverted to this.


There's a reason this is the case. He is deeply troubled by your lack of display of desire for him, in his view, but he has a sense of hopelessness that it will ever be solved. Therefore, it's not worth bringing up on its own, but during a fight, the can of worms is open, so he brings it up. IMHO, the problem is very serious and will not go away on its own. It will continue to grow.

I can't speak for other men or women, but for at least some couples, the wife complains, "You never tell me you love me", while the husband complains, "You never initiate sex with me." Both complaints are shorthand for "You don't love me, and if you do, you're not showing it."


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## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

Sfort said:


> But why is this the case?


Well, that I couldn't specify. I was simply providing the counterpoint to the post I quoted.

I suppose, like most other things, it would depend on the relationship and the people in it.


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## ccpowerslave (Nov 21, 2020)

Sfort said:


> But why is this the case?


I’m not a biologist but I assume is has a bit to do with that. Check out “Come As You Are” by Nagoski it has thousands of reasons women don’t want to have sex. The equivalent men’s book would be a couple pages I suspect.


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## Diceplayer (Oct 12, 2019)

You continue to fight about the same thing because it has never been resolved. How did you show desire for him while you were dating? How did you treat him while you were pursuing him? Whatever that was, go back to treating him that way. Quit being his wife and be his girlfriend again.


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## aaarghdub (Jul 15, 2017)

Diceplayer said:


> Quit being his wife and be his girlfriend again.


^THIS

I’ve read this in a number of different places and have told my wife this same thing. To a girlfriend, sex is a destination and a hobby. To a wife, it’s usually the opposite. Girlfriends want to improve and get better at it. Wives don’t tolerate criticism. Women want boyfriends that spoil them, make ‘em laugh and do fun things with.

Absent sex, look at desire/passion by itself. Where are you excited to put your mental, physical and financial energy? Where you spend your money, how you spend your free time and what you read (print or internet) shows where you’re real desires lie. Show me your internet search history and I’ll show you you’re real desires. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

LisaDiane said:


> Very often (like in the OP's case) it is the WIFE who loses her desire for her husband, while the husband still desires her the same as he always did.





LisaDiane said:


> Well, that I couldn't specify. I was simply providing the counterpoint to the post I quoted.
> 
> I suppose, like most other things, it would depend on the relationship and the people in it.





Sfort said:


> But why is this the case?


Clinical psychologist and licensed therapist Dr Samantha Rodman Whiten (aka Dr Psyche Mom) discusses this quite a bit in her articles and on her podcasts. 

It is very typical for women in long term monogamous relationships to lose a significant degree of their spontaneous desire for their partners over time. They may have had a high degree of spontaneous desire (SD) in the opening acts of the relationship when they were young and single and doing out on fun dates drinking and dancing and partying it up etc. 

But after a number of years and the introduction of kids, diapers, bills, car payments, breast pumps, house repairs, braces, parent-teacher conferences etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc their SD and level of sexual initiative plummet. 

Meanwhile the man's level of sexual interest and SD just keeps on going and going and going like the energizer bunny. 

If the relationship is fundamentally healthy, the couple is able to maintain an interpersonal connection and maintain positive communication and work together and man doesn't let himself go and become a fat, lazy slob that drinks beer and watches TV or plays video games and wanks to porn all the time,,, and the woman keeps an open mind and is at least open to maintaining a marital sex life and the man has some seduction and foreplay initiative, she can still respond with responsive desire (RD). 

So in a nutshell, her sexual response will shift from SD to RD and can respond in a reactive way to his initiative if she is open to the idea and isn't all pissed off and resentful and bitter towards him all the time. 

As the OP and her H still have an active sex life in terms of frequency but he is complaining of her lack of initiative and apparent passion and desire - he is likely missing the single 20-something year old his was dating that would make out and grind on him on the dance floor and give him road head on the way home from their dates and then attack him and tear his clothes off as they were walking in the door leaving a trail of clothes from front door to the bedroom where she would pin him down and ride him like a stolen horse. 

They are both the same people and have a fundamentally functional marriage and relationship,,, they're simply just not young, single, childless, horny people in the stages of New Relationship Energy (NRE) anymore.

This is where MC and maybe even sex therapy can help. 

There are things that can be done to help take some of the pressure off of her to be like a porn star while he can learn to tap in to her RD better to where she does become more engaged and into it when they are intimate. 

IMHO this is a good candidate couple for MC and possibly Sex Therapy.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

VintageDreamer said:


> I have no idea what he means by childish. My opinion is that, now and then, he might wish for me to grab him down there and then immediately go down on him by surprise, when it those moments I only wanted to feel his body with my hands?


What if you asked him to show you a video with his favorite porn star so you can see how she acts? If he's having trouble articulating what he wants you to do, maybe he could show you.


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## ArthurGPym (Jun 28, 2021)

As a guy, I can honestly say that I like it when my partner tells me I'm hot or that she thinks I'm sexy. I like it when a partner comes up, unsolicited, and starts hugging me from behind or initiates lovemaking. That makes me feel like she's into me and wants me to take her to the bedroom right then and there. That is pretty hot. 

It has been my experience watching the interactions amongst my friends that many of their wives don't really act like they are into their husbands. They like the security their husbands offer and yet they seem to enjoy complaining about what their husbands are not doing for them, instead of acting grateful for the things their husbands do for them without being asked. And I totally acknowledge that many husbands are guilty of the same sin, so don't attack me gals. I am not the best one to give marriage advice because I have not been married since the 90s, but I cannot see how you keep romance and love healthy unless both partners are making the same effort to initiate romance and affection.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

As far as the role of porn, I am going to refer back to Dr Rodman-Whiten again as I think she has a reasonably fair and balanced and objective perspective on it. Her stance is that any time a couple is having trouble connecting sexually, they should not be engaging in any kind of outside sexual activity which can include porn and masturbation without porn, masturbation with vibrators, toys etc. 

Masturbation is just draining the tank. You can't go on a journey in the car if you are emptying the fuel tank all the time. This goes for both men and women. 

Let the tank fill and let the pressure build. 

RD in women is often fueled by a man's desire. If he's spanking all the time, his own innate desire is compromised. If his tank is full, he becomes more energized, more flirty, more engaging, more seductive and showing more initiative. She will thus be more likely to respond. 

This is assuming a healthy relationship and that she is at least open minded and open to having a sex life with him in the first place. 

If she truly does not find him sexually desirable in the first and sincerely does not want to have a sex life with him - then per Dr Rodman-Whiten, they should probably not be married and should be discussing the dissolution of the marriage. 

But if they do want to maintain an intimate relationship, then outside sexual relief whether through porn, masturbation, affairs etc will be a detriment.


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## BecauseSheWeeps (10 mo ago)

ArthurGPym said:


> As a guy, I can honestly say that I like it when my partner tells me I'm hot or that she thinks I'm sexy. I like it when a partner comes up, unsolicited, and starts hugging me from behind or initiates lovemaking. That makes me feel like she's into me and wants me to take her to the bedroom right then and there. That is pretty hot.
> 
> It has been my experience watching the interactions amongst my friends that many of their wives don't really act like they are into their husbands. They like the security their husbands offer and yet they seem to enjoy complaining about what their husbands are not doing for them, instead of acting grateful for the things their husbands do for them without being asked. And I totally acknowledge that many husbands are guilty of the same sin, so don't attack me gals. I am not the best one to give marriage advice because I have not been married since the 90s, but I cannot see how you keep romance and love healthy unless both partners are making the same effort to initiate romance and affection.


My husband says that when I do this, he feels like I think he's a sex object.


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## ArthurGPym (Jun 28, 2021)

BecauseSheWeeps said:


> My husband says that when I do this, he feels like I think he's a sex object.


huh…


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## BigDaddyNY (May 19, 2021)

BecauseSheWeeps said:


> My husband says that when I do this, he feels like I think he's a sex object.


That is sad, very sad. Any man that feels like his wife showing affection and desire for him is akin to treating him like a sex object needs to turn in his man card.


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## BecauseSheWeeps (10 mo ago)

BigDaddyNY said:


> That is sad, very sad. Any man that feels like his wife showing affection and desire for him is akin to treating him like a sex object needs to turn in his man card.


We are getting it figured out. I think it comes from him being abused as a child and I know that it's not an excuse. But we got this!


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## Laurentium (May 21, 2017)

oldshirt said:


> Masturbation is just draining the tank. You can't go on a journey in the car if you are emptying the fuel tank all the time. This goes for both men and women.
> 
> Let the tank fill and let the pressure build.


Otherwise your partner may start using one of those electric cars....


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

BecauseSheWeeps said:


> My husband says that when I do this, he feels like I think he's a sex object.


He's either joking, is lying or is actually a chick. 

A man could only be so lucky as to be a sex object.


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## SnakePlissken (10 mo ago)

Hi Vintage, here is an example from today that my wife did. I was in the middle of a meeting (I work from home half the time) and had to use the bathroom. 

When I came out of the bathroom, she grabbed me and pulled me in for a passionate kiss. Then she pushed me in a chair, sat on my lap and told me how much she wished I wasn't in the middle of work, so she could have her way with me. I walked back into my home office with a grin on my face like a teenager after their first good date. I felt very desired.

This is not how we have been for the most of our 12 year marriage. It took having discussions about sex, desire and showing love that were scary as can be for us. Fear of rejection and loads of other family of origin issues (Fee-Fi-Fo-FOO we call it) was blocking both of us from showing how much desired the other. We were able to communicate our needs and what buttons to push to make each other feel desired.

So....what my wife did is push two of my big feel good buttons touch and verbal affirmation. If she had a cup of coffee for me too, I wouldn't have made it back to my meeting I would have been a piece of clay in her hands at that moment.

My wife wouldn't know what makes me feel desired, if I refused to tell her. Getting through that uncomfortable conversation is so important for every couple in my humble opinion.

I wonder if your husband is falling into a emotional trap that I used to fall into and still do from time to time. If I tell my wife how to make me feel desired, she'll only do it because I asked her to to do it. Therefore, it is fake and she doesnt actually desire me....she is only doing it to shut me up. Which is kind of silly to me now that I write it out. Why would she ask the question if she didnt care to show me how I will best interpret her behavior as a display of her desire for me? Could just be me projecting why I would refuse to tell my wife what makes me feel desired.

Good luck Vintage you cant read your husband's mind. He is going to need to communicate what he wants to you, so you can show him desire the way he wants to receive it. That fact that you are here shows it is important to you.


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## SnakePlissken (10 mo ago)

oldshirt said:


> He's either joking, is lying or is actually a chick.
> 
> A man could only be so lucky as to be a sex object.


Or he was abused as a kid and hates feeling like an object to someone else rather than a person.


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## lancaster (Dec 2, 2013)

Sounds like a communication problem. Your husband needs to express what he is looking for specifically. Our spouses cannot expect us to read their minds about what they want or like. All this puritan BS about the woman having to be serve her husband or automatically know what he wants is theocratic nonsense.
Your husband needs to tell you exactly what he is looking for.
You both need to talk.


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## AlwaysImproving (5 mo ago)

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## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

AlwaysImproving said:


> @VintageDreamer I just had a discussion with my own wife about desire and thought I’d share in hopes that it helps you understand. My wife was driving home from work and was on the phone with me talking. She was talking about all the things she wanted to do that afternoon to unwind from work: take the dogs to the park, etc, etc. What stood out to me was that I wasn’t part of those plans. Ok, no big deal, I thought. She certainly wants to spend time with me because she’s talking to me and coming home to me. She’s just not saying it. After she got home, I got a quick hug and she went about her business eating and went to the other room to browse the internet on her ipad. After a while I was leading the dog to her in the other room and she called out that she’s just resting. I felt sad because I had spent all day wanting to see her but it didn’t seem a priority to her.


So you said this was a discussion you had with her about desire...you mean you brought your feelings to her attention, to request what you needed, and worked it out?


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## Longtime Hubby (7 mo ago)

Tough question to answer as I seldom see any sexual desire from my wife. She has initiated once in the past 22 Years. Never hints at sex. It’s frustrating, me always having to be the one who initiates. she says “that’s not me, you have a larger sex drive.“ I say baloney. once we start, her drive is in high gear. I fail to understand this. dating, early in marriage, she had not prob starting. now? Forget about it!


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## BigDaddyNY (May 19, 2021)

AlwaysImproving said:


> @VintageDreamer I just had a discussion with my own wife about desire and thought I’d share in hopes that it helps you understand. My wife was driving home from work and was on the phone with me talking. She was talking about all the things she wanted to do that afternoon to unwind from work: take the dogs to the park, etc, etc. What stood out to me was that I wasn’t part of those plans. Ok, no big deal, I thought. She certainly wants to spend time with me because she’s talking to me and coming home to me. She’s just not saying it. After she got home, I got a quick hug and she went about her business eating and went to the other room to browse the internet on her ipad. After a while I was leading the dog to her in the other room and she called out that she’s just resting. I felt sad because I had spent all day wanting to see her but it didn’t seem a priority to her.
> 
> Seems innocent enough, right? In just this one incident it is innocent, but over time it adds up. One of my love languages is quality time. Without it after a while I start feeling rejected and put on a shelf. I will assert my needs and make sure that I get that quality time if I have to, but what I really want is her to desire it as well. Over time when she is expressing her desires of what she wants to do to recharge: go visit family, go to the store shopping, this and that… at rarely if ever any time in that am I the object of her desire. I still want and support her to have all that other stuff, but I just want it to be me sometimes. When is the last time she came home tired from work and just wanted to be with me instead to re-energize? I’m not asking for obsession, but just feel included without having to force it all the time.
> 
> So, applying that to you, your husband mentioned touch which is also a love language. Without question, sex as well. However, he needs to be equal in this. If he wants you to desire him, then he should desire you instead of porn, also. It’s a two-way street, bud.


So how did the discussion go with your wife? What did you tell her and what was her response?


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## AlwaysImproving (5 mo ago)

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## Sfort (Sep 28, 2019)

AlwaysImproving said:


> @VintageDreamer I just had a discussion with my own wife about desire and thought I’d share in hopes that it helps you understand. My wife was driving home from work and was on the phone with me talking. She was talking about all the things she wanted to do that afternoon to unwind from work: take the dogs to the park, etc, etc. What stood out to me was that I wasn’t part of those plans. Ok, no big deal, I thought. She certainly wants to spend time with me because she’s talking to me and coming home to me. She’s just not saying it. After she got home, I got a quick hug and she went about her business eating and went to the other room to browse the internet on her ipad. After a while I was leading the dog to her in the other room and she called out that she’s just resting. I felt sad because I had spent all day wanting to see her but it didn’t seem a priority to her.
> 
> Seems innocent enough, right? In just this one incident it is innocent, but over time it adds up. One of my love languages is quality time. Without it after a while I start feeling rejected and put on a shelf. I will assert my needs and make sure that I get that quality time if I have to, but what I really want is her to desire it as well. Over time when she is expressing her desires of what she wants to do to recharge: go visit family, go to the store shopping, this and that… at rarely if ever any time in that am I the object of her desire. I still want and support her to have all that other stuff, but I just want it to be me sometimes. When is the last time she came home tired from work and just wanted to be with me instead to re-energize? I’m not asking for obsession, but just feel included without having to force it all the time.
> 
> So, applying that to you, your husband mentioned touch which is also a love language. Without question, sex as well. However, he needs to be equal in this. If he wants you to desire him, then he should desire you instead of porn, also. It’s a two-way street, bud.


Great post. I've had to do a lot of self examination over the last few years by asking myself these types of questions from time to time: Am I a fun person that my spouse looks forward to spending time with? Do I express as much desire to be with her as I want her to express to me? Are there any hobbies or interests of hers that I might be willing to share, assuming I want her to share in some of mine? Is she not interested in sex, or is she not interested in me?

There is an equivalency in my mind, even though I may be the only one who feels that way, that a spouse who never initiates, at least in some circumstances, is at least inconsiderate (assuming no health issues preventing sex.) If one spouse typically cooks dinner and never bothers to prepare a meal that his or her spouse likes, that's a problem. At least it can be solved by going to a restaurant or cooking yourself. A spouse who knows that his or her spouse needs sex, if there is love in the relationship, should at least occasionally go to the trouble of reaching out to the other spouse, even if it's not purely as a result of desire. I'm giving a shorthand view of this complicated situation, but I've given enough of my opinion to get attacked by those people here who are predisposed to engage in such tactics!


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## AlwaysImproving (5 mo ago)

.


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## AlwaysImproving (5 mo ago)

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## Longtime Hubby (7 mo ago)

AlwaysImproving said:


> What I did for this was to get my wife to agree to the assumption that we're just always going to have sex. "You mean every day?" Yea. "Ok, we can have sex every day." Man, I love my wife lol.
> 
> What this did was remove the initiating from the equation and the focus instead becomes what time of day. I did this quite a while ago. Since then things have improved in bed a lot. I got her to reframe from needing recovery between orgasms to just no pressure seeing if she was ready. If she's not feeling it no big deal, but we're already PIV when that determination is made. That way we're both always available and needs are already met.


Good for you two. There is no way she’d agree to sex daily. That only happens on vacations. I did quit complaining after she rejects my attempts. its Strange. after we have sex, she’s all “mmm that was good.” Well, why not enjoy ”good” more often? We are doing a getaway Labor Day weekend. Hoping for more “good”


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## AlwaysImproving (5 mo ago)

Longtime Hubby said:


> Good for you two. There is no way she’d agree to sex daily. That only happens on vacations. I did quit complaining after she rejects my attempts. its Strange. after we have sex, she’s all “mmm that was good.” Well, why not enjoy ”good” more often? We are doing a getaway Labor Day weekend. Hoping for more “good”


Ramp it up over time. Agree to x frequency. Then initiate extra every now and then. "But we just did yesterday." Yea, but I want you now. Months to a year later? It could work, my friend.


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## Sfort (Sep 28, 2019)

Longtime Hubby said:


> After we have sex, she’s all “mmm that was good.” Well, why not enjoy ”good” more often?


That's the great mystery. In this example, the wife says, "Awesome. That was wonderful!" and can then live without sex forever. I don't eat ice cream every day, but when I have some, it's not long before I want more. It's not a case of, "Ok, I've done that. What's next in my life?"


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## Longtime Hubby (7 mo ago)

AlwaysImproving said:


> Ramp it up over time. Agree to x frequency. Then initiate extra every now and then. "But we just did yesterday." Yea, but I want you now. Months to a year later? It could work, my friend.


It’s possible. We have a standing Sunday ”date” which was her idea. Your idea is worth a try. We are on pace this year for just over 100. Not bad compared to friends I know have it way less often. In our early 60s, too.


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## hamadryad (Aug 30, 2020)

You want sexual desire from your woman, be sexually desirable to _other women_.... 😉


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## Longtime Hubby (7 mo ago)

hamadryad said:


> You want sexual desire from your woman, be sexually desirable to _other women_.... 😉


You’re onto something.


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## CountryMike (Jun 1, 2021)

hamadryad said:


> You want sexual desire from your woman, be sexually desirable to _other women_.... 😉


This is age old good wisdom.

Like when fishing. Have good set up and bait that works for all the fish one is looking for.


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## AlwaysImproving (5 mo ago)

.


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## BecauseSheWeeps (10 mo ago)

oldshirt said:


> He's either joking, is lying or is actually a chick.
> 
> A man could only be so lucky as to be a sex object.


He's a chick... It's because at times, we aren't on the same page when it comes to sex. If we are arguing/not getting a long/have beef for any reason at all whatsoever - sex is out the door for days.


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## hamadryad (Aug 30, 2020)

AlwaysImproving said:


> There is truth to this and one should always be an attractive partner, but there is no denying complacency which requires a different set of skills to overcome. I'm not going to try to get other women's interest as an equation in my marriage.


The statement really has nothing to do with the intent of getting interest from another woman...

Ever notice that women seem to be more attracted to married men, than single ones? Not even that they would necessarily enter into an affair (although it does happen), but it seems like women want what other women have or desire, so it seems like those guys are "proven" so they get a leg up..

When it comes to sex and attraction, too many guys want their women to be fit, not fat, sexy, dress nice, smell nice, etc.....And yet all they want to do is show up...That's fine, if that is your thing, but if a woman sees her man getting a lot of attention from other women, because he has it together, it will go a very long way towards getting out of this what you want....that's all I am saying...


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## CountryMike (Jun 1, 2021)

AlwaysImproving said:


> There is truth to this and one should always be an attractive partner, but there is no denying complacency which requires a different set of skills to overcome. I'm not going to try to get other women's interest as an equation in my marriage.


You're missing a key point. Best start planning a single life.


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## AlwaysImproving (5 mo ago)

hamadryad said:


> The statement really has nothing to do with the intent of getting interest from another woman...
> 
> Ever notice that women seem to be more attracted to married men, than single ones? Not even that they would necessarily enter into an affair (although it does happen), but it seems like women want what other women have or desire, so it seems like those guys are "proven" so they get a leg up..
> 
> When it comes to sex and attraction, too many guys want their women to be fit, not fat, sexy, dress nice, smell nice, etc.....And yet all they want to do is show up...That's fine, if that is your thing, but if a woman sees her man getting a lot of attention from other women, because he has it together, it will go a very long way towards getting out of this what you want....that's all I am saying...


I know exactly what you and @CountryMike are talking about because I've watched this whole movement form over the last couple of decades, but I disagree because I don't see this as the best way of being a man or a husband. I also don't feel the need to prepare for a single life. I really wonder if this type of stuff plays out in your life as much as you think it does. Everyone I've met in person who wants to be an alpha really isn't. I'm just going to focus on being a good husband to my wife.


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## Longtime Hubby (7 mo ago)

My wife said “not surprised, cuz you are attractive” after I told her about a woman hitting on me. Flattery will get you everywhere.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

AlwaysImproving said:


> I know exactly what you and @CountryMike are talking about because I've watched this whole movement form over the last couple of decades, but I disagree because I don't see this as the best way of being a man or a husband. I also don't feel the need to prepare for a single life. I really wonder if this type of stuff plays out in your life as much as you think it does. Everyone I've met in person who wants to be an alpha really isn't. I'm just going to focus on being a good husband to my wife.


The red pill crowd uses the word "alpha" a lot, but have no clue what it means. Alpha does not, in fact, mean being a neglectful jerk who constantly threatens his wife with infidelity and abandonment if she doesn't toe the line. An alpha is a partner, a rock, a friend and a hero. It's not someone who stands over you with his boot on your neck, it's a man who stands beside you and supports and loves you. He can make you feel safe without making you feel weak, and is proud of your strength instead of threatened by it. There is nothing "beta simp" about being a good husband and father, and that is the message that movement is pushing. They're analogous to third wave feminism in the toxicity of their message. Proof? Watch how they respond to this post. 😉


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## CountryMike (Jun 1, 2021)

AlwaysImproving said:


> I know exactly what you and @CountryMike are talking about because I've watched this whole movement form over the last couple of decades, but I disagree because I don't see this as the best way of being a man or a husband. I also don't feel the need to prepare for a single life. I really wonder if this type of stuff plays out in your life as much as you think it does. Everyone I've met in person who wants to be an alpha really isn't. I'm just going to focus on being a good husband to my wife.


Ok. Go with that. Have fun being single.

On a serious note think a little deeper and you'll find out what you're being told is true. No less true just because you don't want to hear it. 

This isn't a game. It's your marriage. You have to merge what you feel should be right with what's actually factual.


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## hamadryad (Aug 30, 2020)

AlwaysImproving said:


> I know exactly what you and @CountryMike are talking about because I've watched this whole movement form over the last couple of decades, but I disagree because I don't see this as the best way of being a man or a husband. I also don't feel the need to prepare for a single life. I really wonder if this type of stuff plays out in your life as much as you think it does. Everyone I've met in person who wants to be an alpha really isn't. I'm just going to focus on being a good husband to my wife.



No problem," you do you" as they say...

But I have to point out that this is nothing new...as you are implying...In fact, it reminds me of an old episode of "the Honeymooners"...A charismatic and handsome guy moves into the apartment building and all of the ladies are fawning over him...I wont get into the whole thing, but the moral was that in order to get fawning, maybe you have to be worth fawning over, and that to never take that aspect for granted.....as a lot of the men were doing....

That doesn't mean be someone who you aren't, but maybe a lot of guys don't do very much and expect something that isn't really reasonable under the conditions....I am not implying that's you, just that it seems like a lot of guys I know are like this...and complain a lot about why they don't get sex/affection from their wives...


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## AlwaysImproving (5 mo ago)

.


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## Mybabysgotit (Jul 1, 2019)

Young at Heart said:


> You do understand that a husband with a stay at home wife, child, mortgage, car payments, etc. can feel a crushing financial burden on his shoulders to "support his family." I remember when I had a son what wanted $150 stylish athletic shoes (that was a long time ago when good quality running shoes were about $50 to $60). If it was a choice of his shoes or a new sports jacket and pants for me, it would have been for my family.
> 
> As to sexual desire, my wife and I just about divorced because we drifted into a sex starved marriage. She actually told me she never wanted to have sex with me again and she had absolutely no sexual desire for me. We had just turned 60 and I was focusing on making money to pay for two kids in college and to build up our retirement savings. I had been brainwashed into believing that the sign of a good husband was to be a good provider and she would love me for that.
> 
> ...


I would hope I understand that, seeing that my wife is a SAHM and hasn't worked in 20 years and i'm the sole provider. And yes, I get the shoe shoe situation, my wife and I just got done with the shoe talk for my 13 year old; fairly simple, my limit is $75, anything over that, he's welcome to pay the difference. What I don't understand is what any of that has to do with sex in marriage.


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## Quad73 (May 10, 2021)

AlwaysImproving said:


> @VintageDreamer I just had a discussion with my own wife about desire and thought I’d share in hopes that it helps you understand. My wife was driving home from work and was on the phone with me talking. She was talking about all the things she wanted to do that afternoon to unwind from work: take the dogs to the park, etc, etc. What stood out to me was that I wasn’t part of those plans. Ok, no big deal, I thought. She certainly wants to spend time with me because she’s talking to me and coming home to me. She’s just not saying it. After she got home, I got a quick hug and she went about her business eating and went to the other room to browse the internet on her ipad. After a while I was leading the dog to her in the other room and she called out that she’s just resting. I felt sad because I had spent all day wanting to see her but it didn’t seem a priority to her.
> 
> Seems innocent enough, right? In just this one incident it is innocent, but over time it adds up. One of my love languages is quality time. Without it after a while I start feeling rejected and put on a shelf. I will assert my needs and make sure that I get that quality time if I have to, but what I really want is her to desire it as well. Over time when she is expressing her desires of what she wants to do to recharge: go visit family, go to the store shopping, this and that… at rarely if ever any time in that am I the object of her desire. I still want and support her to have all that other stuff, but I just want it to be me sometimes. When is the last time she came home tired from work and just wanted to be with me instead to re-energize? I’m not asking for obsession, but just feel included without having to force it all the time.
> 
> So, applying that to you, your husband mentioned touch which is also a love language. Without question, sex as well. However, he needs to be equal in this. If he wants you to desire him, then he should desire you instead of porn, also. It’s a two-way street, bud.


Been there!

I now try to tackle this kind of oversight by my W with humour. It makes my point and gives her the chance to respond in a playful way vs it needing to become a talk or an issue. If you keep it sexy vs whiny you get to the intended destination a lot quicker. Especially if you've already discussed the issue; she'd need to be thick as a brick not to understand your jab/hint.


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## AlwaysImproving (5 mo ago)

Quad73 said:


> Been there!
> 
> I now try to tackle this kind of oversight by my W with humour. It makes my point and gives her the chance to respond in a playful way vs it needing to become a talk or an issue. If you keep it sexy vs whiny you get to the intended destination a lot quicker. Especially if you've already discussed the issue; she'd need to be thick as a brick not to understand your jab/hint.


I wish I could pull that off better. She doesn't always get my 3 stooges references.


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## CountryMike (Jun 1, 2021)

AlwaysImproving said:


> Believe me, I completely understand what you're saying, but I'm just choosing to believe that two wrongs don't make a right. I choose to be a better man, but at the same time not caring what other women think about me. I understand that you didn't imply that in your post that I should care with intent what other women think, but that's not the point I'm making. I'm not going to base my image of my manhood over what I perceive random women thinking of my attractiveness. Many in the movement associated with your statement will do just that, but the hilarious thing is they project their own love of themselves into the reaction they see from women and think they're alpha
> 
> I know that old and new sitcoms showed women gossiping and fawning over a guy (and RL), but that doesn't necessarily translate into an ability to carry a long term marriage. Relying on your wife to have that shallow kind of attractiveness be the basis of your sex life is a setup for failure. Probably at most 1 or 2 nights of more aggressive sex? But I haven't seen my wife throw herself at me if the waitress gets a little flirty.


No?

Then you've been missing out.


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## AlwaysImproving (5 mo ago)

CountryMike said:


> No?
> 
> Then you've been missing out.


Things that never happened for $1000, Alex.


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## CountryMike (Jun 1, 2021)

AlwaysImproving said:


> Things that never happened for $1000, Alex.


That's sad news.


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## Young at Heart (Jan 6, 2015)

Mybabysgotit said:


> .........What I don't understand is what any of that has to do with sex in marriage.


Some men can take the role of " provider" to such an extreme that it grinds them down to the point that all they do is work. That leads to letting them selves go both physically and how they dress. They may also be constantly exhausted, when they get home. Everything is for their family. They stop prioritizing themselves. That in turn makes them less interesting and desirable to the wife.


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## CountryMike (Jun 1, 2021)

Young at Heart said:


> You do understand that a husband with a stay at home wife, child, mortgage, car payments, etc. can feel a crushing financial burden on his shoulders to "support his family." I remember when I had a son what wanted $150 stylish athletic shoes (that was a long time ago when good quality running shoes were about $50 to $60). If it was a choice of his shoes or a new sports jacket and pants for me, it would have been for my family.
> 
> As to sexual desire, my wife and I just about divorced because we drifted into a sex starved marriage. She actually told me she never wanted to have sex with me again and she had absolutely no sexual desire for me. We had just turned 60 and I was focusing on making money to pay for two kids in college and to build up our retirement savings. I had been brainwashed into believing that the sign of a good husband was to be a good provider and she would love me for that.
> 
> ...


Damn that's us. For the first 15 yrs my sole benchmark as a good H and father was I'm working hard and providing. And as long as I was successful with that I was a model H in my eyes.
Then slowly started to understand there is so much more to marriage, and shifted perspectives.


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## David60525 (Oct 5, 2021)

VintageDreamer said:


> My husband and I had a huge fight very recently and one thing that came up was a repeated grievance about me. He said he has never felt any sexual desire coming from me, towards him. he also said that the way I touch him is childish. We have been married for 6 years and we have a son. Whenever we have a big fight, the same grievance is mentioned.
> 
> I consider our sex life is more than average but to be honest, he was mostly initiating or asking for them since he has the higher libido. The thing is, nowadays, I am feeling more tired (I am 40 and he is 50) and with a 5 yr old son, I have lots in my mind throughout the day (I am a SAHM) and by the time we go to bed, I prefer to rest. However, when my husband wants sex, I rarely turn him down. I could go down on him more than once a day, or having intercourse every other day. Not to mention there would be times at night when he wanted a BJ. Now and then, especially during the weekend, I dress sexily just to feel sexy and to enjoy his appreciation of my body.
> 
> ...


Hi
He is a whiner. You get a gold star for giving love making on demand. Turn the tables, get hm to make love to you when he wants to do sports, along time, before work, make him hive it to you.
Ware him out. I think the amount of bj he requires is excessive. When he wants one, say no. Tell him to go down on yyou.have seduction nights 2 x a month. He does you one time a month, and you do him. Make it romantic, pull some fun stops. Can be a start of a tradition


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## CountryMike (Jun 1, 2021)

Young at Heart said:


> Some men can take the role of " provider" to such an extreme that it grinds them down to the point that all they do is work. That leads to letting them selves go both physically and how they dress. They may also be constantly exhausted, when they get home. Everything is for their family. They stop prioritizing themselves. That in turn makes them less interesting and desirable to the wife.


Folks should take this post to heart. Some won't accept it and they do so at their peril.


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## Rus47 (Apr 1, 2021)

VintageDreamer said:


> My husband and I had a huge fight very recently and one thing that came up was a repeated grievance about me. He said he has never felt any sexual desire coming from me, towards him.


What was the huge fight about? The “grievance” maybe just thrown in for good measure?


VintageDreamer said:


> The thing is, nowadays, I am feeling more tired (I am 40 and he is 50) and with a 5 yr old son, I have lots in my mind throughout the day (I am a SAHM) and by the time we go to bed, I prefer to rest.


Get checked out by a doctor. At 40 you shouldn’t be worn out by one kid. My wife had four and was full of energy. 


VintageDreamer said:


> He said no, but I don't need to explain to you like you are a child.


So you are supposed to guess? He needs to explain what he is expecting.


VintageDreamer said:


> So men, what do you perceive as sexual desire from your wives?


Her enthusiastically responding to me. Her enthusiasm when we are intimate. Coming to me during the day, hugging, kissing me, saying “I love you”. Asking “shall we go lay down”.

Your husband sounds rather ungrateful IMO


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## ccpowerslave (Nov 21, 2020)

Longtime Hubby said:


> Good for you two. There is no way she’d agree to sex daily. That only happens on vacations. I did quit complaining after she rejects my attempts. its Strange. after we have sex, she’s all “mmm that was good.” Well, why not enjoy ”good” more often? We are doing a getaway Labor Day weekend. Hoping for more “good”


My wife is similar.

In her case I think a lot of it is the typical issue of stress. She is thinking about work and other things and her brain is always switched on. As such when she tends to enjoy sex is if I just sit there in bed holding her and I listen to what she tells me and ask enough questions to show I’m listening and I don’t tell her anything, just listen and ask.

I think it helps her clear out her head. Sometimes I’m surprised what comes out.

Anyway my wife doesn’t abuse or over indulge in anything good; sex would be in the same category. She can go every day for periods of time depending on what is going on with the rest of her life but it’s not a natural state for her.

She’s always surprised when I’m obviously physically tired or literally passing out and groggy and she’s like “should I put my PJs on?” and every time the answer is no. I have told her so many times I would go 2-3 times a day and she still can’t wrap her head around it. It’s an alien idea to her.


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## Wifey93 (9 mo ago)

It’s funny (or weird?) but for me, desire doesn’t necessarily has to be connected with affection. It’s also easier for me to express that I want my husband than that I love him. Desire is a form of sexual appreciation of my partner.

It’s easier for me to be affectionate with my husband if he expresses his desire for me, whereas for him, he expects me to be affectionate first and regardless of our current sex life. 

I know it shouldn’t be conditional, but I find it rather difficult to be affectionate when I’m essentially sex starved. In addition, it’s not guaranteed that he will want to be intimate even after a day full of being affectionate and loving towards him. In my case, he could be 99.9% sure I’ll be my most affectionate self after sex.


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## BigDaddyNY (May 19, 2021)

Wifey93 said:


> It’s funny (or weird?) but for me, desire doesn’t necessarily has to be connected with affection. It’s also easier for me to express that I want my husband than that I love him. Desire is a form of sexual appreciation of my partner.
> 
> It’s easier for me to be affectionate with my husband if he expresses his desire for me, whereas for him, he expects me to be affectionate first and regardless of our current sex life.
> 
> *I know it shouldn’t be conditional, *but I find it rather difficult to be affectionate when I’m essentially sex starved. In addition, it’s not guaranteed that he will want to be intimate even after a day full of being affectionate and loving towards him. In my case, he could be 99.9% sure I’ll be my most affectionate self after sex.


There is nothing that says you should have unconditional love for your spouse. Yes, you should stick with them through thick and thin, but a marriage requires give and take by both people. There should be reciprocity when it comes to things like love, affection and emotional needs.


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## hamadryad (Aug 30, 2020)

The thing is this....

I don't think people truly understand how difficult it really is to maintain a healthy and energetic sexual desire for the same person over the course of an entire life...Those that do, don't realize how rare of a commodity they have....Don't believe it?, just check out the threads started here and how common these problems are...And BTW, those that are just moping along with the scheduled duty sex, or the ones that got their wives/h's to knuckle under through intense therapy or threats don't count here, either..I am talking about the ones that are willing, and each is getting what they want, without any conditions..

ANYTHING you can do to sustain it should be considered and not taken for granted...I'm sorry to say, sometimes love isn't enough...I think a lot of people probably have exes or even spouses that they still may love and care deeply for,, but couldn't imagine being in bed with again...Just familiarity alone can kill off sexual interest....Imagine that...

I know this may be controversial, but I don't think we were even born with this "want" to be sexually monogamous for life...So we may well be trying to fight off forces that are bigger than we can even conceive of....Add that to the pile of issues...

Life also is tough, especially in the last few years for a lot of people...Sex becomes a lot less fun when people are struggling financially, have other outside forces, or maybe disagree on the wide array of political issues now at the forefront...

So I guess as men, we want women that want us...and as men and women, we need to do the things necessary to sustain it and keep it going...Failure on any level is probably going to be met with resistance...It's also vital to know who you are with and understand the importance of this issue in your life....If you are a woman that likes a wild tiger in the sack, don't pick a castrated house kitty....and vice versa...People won't change...no matter what you believe...


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## Mybabysgotit (Jul 1, 2019)

Young at Heart said:


> Some men can take the role of " provider" to such an extreme that it grinds them down to the point that all they do is work. That leads to letting them selves go both physically and how they dress. They may also be constantly exhausted, when they get home. Everything is for their family. They stop prioritizing themselves. That in turn makes them less interesting and desirable to the wife.


And I would go as far to say that if that "provider" can't see the world around him, and therefore, not in tuned with his family, then that idiocy will manifest itself in other ways the wife wouldn't find desirable. I was that guy from 2001 - 2011 when I worked as an investment banker. I was hardly home and I distinctly remember my wife calling my hotel and telling me our son just took his first step. Although I feigned excitement, that moment made me sad. It was in that moment that I knew I had to change my lifestyle even though I was making a ton of money and thought I was giving my wife the life she always wanted; she had everything, but we had nothing. If you can't see the world around you, then you might just deserve what comes at you.


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## ccpowerslave (Nov 21, 2020)

Mybabysgotit said:


> It was in that moment that I knew I had to change my lifestyle even though I was making a ton of money and thought I was giving my wife the life she always wanted; she had everything, but we had nothing.


I came to this realization.

My wife, sadly, hasn’t. She might be done with trinkets and baubles but she isn’t done with money and what she can get for it.

I was talking to her about retirement yesterday and she looked at me like I was crazy.


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## BigDaddyNY (May 19, 2021)

ccpowerslave said:


> I came to this realization.
> 
> My wife, sadly, hasn’t. She might be done with trinkets and baubles but she isn’t done with money and what she can get for it.
> 
> I was talking to her about retirement yesterday and she looked at me like I was crazy.


Same with me. At one point I was driven to the point of having a goal to be CEO of my company. I got pretty far up the ladder, but at some point I realized it was costing me my family time. My wife still gets very concerned when I talk about new positions, responsibilities, etc. Me scaling back and giving more of my time to her was a clear sign of desire in her eyes. 

And we are BOTH looking forward to retirement even though it is still pretty far off.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

ccpowerslave said:


> I was talking to her about retirement yesterday and she looked at me like I was crazy.


My H does the same, he talks about all the cool things he's going to do in retirement and then acts like I'm going to be there. I'll have to work until I physically can't. Not all of us make as much as he makes, and while 1/3 or so of the house we're building will be good, it won't be enough to carry me for the rest of my life. All this retirement talk is bananas to me, it'll never happen.


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## BigDaddyNY (May 19, 2021)

TexasMom1216 said:


> My H does the same, he talks about all the cool things he's going to do in retirement and then acts like I'm going to be there. I'll have to work until I physically can't. Not all of us make as much as he makes, and while 1/3 or so of the house we're building will be good, it won't be enough to carry me for the rest of my life. All this retirement talk is bananas to me, it'll never happen.


You don't pool your resources? My wife will have a smallish pension and has a 403b, but she would never have enough to retire solo. However, since we are married we have the mindset that my retirement is her retirement and vice versa.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

BigDaddyNY said:


> You don't pool your resources? My wife will have a smallish pension and has a 403b, but she would never have enough to retire solo. However, since we are married we have the mindset that my retirement is her retirement and vice versa.


We do now, but I assumed that didn't extend to the rest of our lives. My boy will leave for college in a few years. I only earn about a third what he earns. Don't men on here complain all the time about women who want to take half their stuff?


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## CountryMike (Jun 1, 2021)

ccpowerslave said:


> My wife is similar.
> 
> In her case I think a lot of it is the typical issue of stress. She is thinking about work and other things and her brain is always switched on. As such when she tends to enjoy sex is if I just sit there in bed holding her and I listen to what she tells me and ask enough questions to show I’m listening and I don’t tell her anything, just listen and ask.
> 
> ...


My favorite days consists of early coffee, bring coffee to W in bed, have a quickie. She goes back to sleep.
Then breakfast at local diner, fishing the early until late morning, home, do a couple house chores in the yard, fire up the bbq grill, lunch.
Shower, take a motorcycle ride a couple hours, home, shower again, a naked nap with W for serious full on romantic time, spend evening g with W and maybe have the kids over for supper.

Or any variation of the above. Once W asked hows my day going and I could only QUOTE a Keith Urban song....hey, who wouldn't want to be me?

I was able to eat breakfast with friends, have sex at will, go fishing, have a motorcycle ride, then close out with bbq for the entire family.

She just rolled her eyes...


BigDaddyNY said:


> You don't pool your resources? My wife will have a smallish pension and has a 403b, but she would never have enough to retire solo. However, since we are married we have the mindset that my retirement is her retirement and vice versa.


We pool our resources too. Always have.


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## hamadryad (Aug 30, 2020)

Don't feel bad, I guess Marvin Gaye struggled with this issue as well...


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## Longtime Hubby (7 mo ago)

hamadryad said:


> Don't feel bad, I guess Marvin Gaye struggled with this issue as well...


And if Marvin struggled, we are all doomed


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## ccpowerslave (Nov 21, 2020)

TexasMom1216 said:


> My H does the same, he talks about all the cool things he's going to do in retirement and then acts like I'm going to be there. I'll have to work until I physically can't. Not all of us make as much as he makes, and while 1/3 or so of the house we're building will be good, it won't be enough to carry me for the rest of my life. All this retirement talk is bananas to me, it'll never happen.


My wife makes a small fraction of what I make but all the money is somehow hers. 😊


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

ccpowerslave said:


> My wife makes a small fraction of what I make but all the money is somehow hers. 😊


You make jokes, but when this is over I'm not taking more than I think is fair. He makes more, he keeps more. It's not like I can't live on what I make (I'm doing pretty ok). I don't need to take his. I _am_ concerned about retirement, but I'll figure it out. I always do. I made choices and the consequences are mine to live with, I'm a grown up.


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## ccpowerslave (Nov 21, 2020)

TexasMom1216 said:


> You make jokes, but when this is over I'm not taking more than I think is fair. He makes more, he keeps more. It's not like I can't live on what I make (I'm doing pretty ok). I don't need to take his. I _am_ concerned about retirement, but I'll figure it out. I always do. I made choices and the consequences are mine to live with, I'm a grown up.


I’m not joking. If she took all the cash we have in our accounts and gave it away I would be like WTF but it wouldn’t be a dealbreaker necessarily for me.

I made all the money before and I can make it again. It’s just now I don’t really want to.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

ccpowerslave said:


> I’m not joking. If she took all the cash we have in our accounts and gave it away I would be like WTF but it wouldn’t be a dealbreaker necessarily for me.
> 
> I made all the money before and I can make it again. It’s just now I don’t really want to.


Yeah, same. I've always been able to make ends meet. I'd rather struggle and be hungry than be called a "gold digger," but it really won't come to that. I'll be comfortable, I just won't be able to retire.


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## ccpowerslave (Nov 21, 2020)

TexasMom1216 said:


> Yeah, same. I've always been able to make ends meet. I'd rather struggle and be hungry than be called a "gold digger," but it really won't come to that. I'll be comfortable, I just won't be able to retire.


I figure it’s one of those live by the sword kinds of things.

I went out with a buddy today for lunch and we were talking and I thought of two friends, some of my best friends I went to college with who died in the last year. One was recent and he was the smartest person I ever met and I know a lot of smart people.

Now he’s dead. He was a super nice guy. I found out watching the news and it wrecked me. It was in the national news first but then our local news I found out the story matched and it was my friend.

I actually have a beer that was his favorite in my fridge as a memorial to him and it has been there since I found out he died and I will always have one of those in my fridge.

Anyway seeing my friends who are my age start dying off it reminds me that you should do what you want while you can. I have consumed all the things I wanted. The dreams I had as a young man about things I wanted to achieve and things I wanted to acquire I have already done all of it and to be honest none of it really made me happy.

Watching my wife enjoy the vegetable garden I built for her in our yard has been better for my soul than all that material ****.

It’s easy to say that when you have done it. My wife does not feel the same.

She actually gets mad at me when I express these sentiments.

I was driving with her listening to a podcast with Anderson Cooper and Dax Shepherd where the basic gist of it was “mo money mo problems”. I was like yeah no ****. She became literally angry and went into a tirade about how I always did whatever I wanted and achieved all these things. I’m like yeah. Who did you think you married?


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## AlwaysImproving (5 mo ago)

ccpowerslave said:


> She’s always surprised when I’m obviously physically tired or literally passing out and groggy and she’s like “should I put my PJs on?” and every time the answer is no. I have told her so many times I would go 2-3 times a day and she still can’t wrap her head around it. It’s an alien idea to her.


Nice


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## ccpowerslave (Nov 21, 2020)

Yeah she doesn’t know because I don’t tell her but she wears jeans during work hours at home. I mean she WEARS those jeans. I am like damn girl you wearing those jeans!!! I mean she is what I wanted as a guy she looks exactly how I want her to look.

I don’t think she believes it.


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## BigDaddyNY (May 19, 2021)

TexasMom1216 said:


> We do now, but I assumed that didn't extend to the rest of our lives. My boy will leave for college in a few years. I only earn about a third what he earns. Don't men on here complain all the time about women who want to take half their stuff?


When they divorce that does happen a lot. I've told my wife on many occasions that my money is her money. I never call it my retirement investment, it is ours. Today my paycheck may be 10x what hers is, but it is as much hers as it is mkne. She has always worked. First making a paycheck like me. Then when we had kids she worked as a stay at home mom. And finally, once the kids were in middle school, back to working in a career she really wanted. We have always been a team all in for the marriage. As far as I'm concerned she earned everything I earned. I was able to excel at what I did because of her excelling at what she did. For me this just seemed to be the most natural way to go with our finances. 

Why would you combine resources now, but not once you both retire?


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## ccpowerslave (Nov 21, 2020)

BigDaddyNY said:


> First making a paycheck like me. Then when we had kids she worked as a stay at home mom. And finally, once the kids were in middle school, back to working in a career she really wanted.


This is like my story. I used to work on the docks. Union was on strike and I was down on my luck it was tough… so tough. Mrs worked a diner all day… etc…


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## Numb26 (Sep 11, 2019)

ccpowerslave said:


> This is like my story. I used to work on the docks. Union was on strike and I was down on my luck it was tough… so touch. Mrs worked a diner all day… etc…


But you held on to what you had
It didn't make a difference if you made it or not


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

BigDaddyNY said:


> Why would you combine resources now, but not once you both retire?


I predict we will retire separately.


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## Rus47 (Apr 1, 2021)

BigDaddyNY said:


> She has always worked. First making a paycheck like me. Then when we had kids she worked as a stay at home mom. And finally, once the kids were in middle school, back to working in a career she really wanted. We have always been a team all in for the marriage.


This is our story as well. What we have is 
OURS.

Also, BTW in a community property state half of all assets belong to each spouse, regardless of who works or their income. 

Everything we own is titled in both our names. All of our bank accounts are joint accounts. The retirement accounts would be half hers if we split.

So win lose or draw, my wife owns 1/2 of everything. So not sure where the 1/3 mentioned is coming from.


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## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

CountryMike said:


> That's sad news.





TexasMom1216 said:


> You make jokes, but when this is over I'm not taking more than I think is fair. He makes more, he keeps more. It's not like I can't live on what I make (I'm doing pretty ok). I don't need to take his. I _am_ concerned about retirement, but I'll figure it out. I always do. I made choices and the consequences are mine to live with, I'm a grown up.


Why are you getting divorced?


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

Rus47 said:


> So not sure where the 1/3 mentioned is coming from.


I brought it up because I make 1/3 the income my husband makes. (On average, this year it will closer to 1/4) It was a figure personal and specific to me.


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## Rus47 (Apr 1, 2021)

TexasMom1216 said:


> I brought it up because I make 1/3 the income my husband makes. (On average, this year it will closer to 1/4) It was a figure personal and specific to me.


Wife never made 1/10 of my income. Irrelevant. We both work and worked as a team. We are a team that owns 100% of what we own, debt free.

I guess this is actually a tj. So I will stop


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## BigDaddyNY (May 19, 2021)

TexasMom1216 said:


> You make jokes, but when this is over I'm not taking more than I think is fair. He makes more, he keeps more. It's not like I can't live on what I make (I'm doing pretty ok). I don't need to take his. I _am_ concerned about retirement, but I'll figure it out. I always do. I made choices and the consequences are mine to live with, I'm a grown up.





TexasMom1216 said:


> I predict we will retire separately.


Does your husband know you are this pessimistic about the longevity of your marriage? To you it is a foregone conclusion that you will be divorced. If you are that sure why not get it over with now? I'm being facetious, but geez you are soon negative. I really can't understand why.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

BigDaddyNY said:


> Does your husband know you are this pessimistic about the longevity of your marriage? To you it is a foregone conclusion that you will be divorced. If you are that sure why not get it over with now? I'm being facetious, but geez you are soon negative. I really can't understand why.


No of course he doesn’t know. This is a T/J. I don’t view it as negative or pessimistic. I view it as realism. I have been mulling over a plan, but again, T/J and I get my mail delivered to thin ice so it needs to stop here. There’s no reason to worry, I have no plans to take all his money.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

TexasMom1216 said:


> No of course he doesn’t know. This is a T/J. I don’t view it as negative or pessimistic. I view it as realism. I have been mulling over a plan, but again, T/J and I get my mail delivered to thin ice so it needs to stop here. There’s no reason to worry, I have no plans to take all his money.


How would your H view it? It's not all about money. Putting yourself in his shoes you might consider telling H you're divorcing him when you're ready. I'm not saying he's not a putz only you know what's going on but no one enjoys a sneak divorce imho unless tragic circumstances require it.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> How would your H view it? It's not all about money. Putting yourself in his shoes you might consider telling H you're divorcing him when you're ready. I'm not saying he's not a putz only you know what's going on but no one enjoys a sneak divorce imho unless tragic circumstances require it.


There’s no sneak divorce. I’m not planning to hit him with anything out of left field, that would be awful. I’m preparing myself for the inevitable. There’s a difference.


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## Rus47 (Apr 1, 2021)

TexasMom1216 said:


> I’m preparing myself for the inevitable.


“As you think it, so shall it be”. Self fulfilling philosophy.


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## hamadryad (Aug 30, 2020)

Rus47 said:


> “As you think it, so shall it be”. Self fulfilling philosophy.


Didn't you get the memo? All of us knuckle dragging old geezers are going to trade up from the beat up old ladies and get us some new fresh meat.....yeah....those cute, tight asses just can't wait to get to choose from the limp d!cked, fat old men just waiting to sweep them off their feet.... 😂


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## BigDaddyNY (May 19, 2021)

hamadryad said:


> Didn't you get the memo? All of us knuckle dragging old geezers are going to trade up from the beat up old ladies and get us some new fresh meat.....yeah....those cute, tight asses just can't wait to get to choose from the limp d!cked, fat old men just waiting to sweep them off their feet.... 😂


Yeah, I hear there are places where they are out walking around on the street just waiting for us.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

TexasMom1216 said:


> There’s no sneak divorce. I’m not planning to hit him with anything out of left field, that would be awful. I’m preparing myself for the inevitable. There’s a difference.


Inevitable because you want a divorce, H has screwed up somewhere driving this to a D, or you think H will one day tell you he wants a D?


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> Inevitable because you want a divorce, H has screwed up somewhere driving this to a D, or you think H will one day tell you he wants a D?


He’ll want it. Let’s stop the t/j, before there’s a problem.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

TexasMom1216 said:


> There’s no sneak divorce. I’m not planning to hit him with anything out of left field, that would be awful. I’m preparing myself for the inevitable. There’s a difference.


You really need to start your own thread and detail why you are planning for a divorce even though he is planning for a future together and appears to have no complaints of the marriage and you have no specific complaints against him. 

You’ve made mention of this over a number of other threads, but it would be more conducive to address if you consolidated it into your own thread and thus not threadjack others.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

oldshirt said:


> You really need to start your own thread and detail why you are planning for a divorce even though he is planning for a future together and appears to have no complaints of the marriage and you have no specific complaints against him.
> 
> You’ve made mention of this over a number of other threads, but it would be more conducive to address if you consolidated it into your own thread and thus not threadjack others.


Point taken. Two threads have veered off this way. It’s rude and I won’t let it happen again.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

TexasMom1216 said:


> Point taken. Two threads have veered off this way. It’s rude and I won’t let it happen again.


Start your own thread because it does raise some interesting questions. 

One of course is WHY do you feel that divorce is looming in your future when neither one of you has expressed any dissatisfaction in the marriage. 

The other raises a larger question in what happens when one begins planning for or assuming divorce and the effect that it will have on the relationship even if the other person does not know about it.

And there is also the question of what happens if and when the other person DOES catch wind that the other is planning on divorcing.

I see this as a serious issue and These are all valid questions and issues worthy of discussion. Discussion that will be more focused and meaningful in your own thread.


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## BigDaddyNY (May 19, 2021)

oldshirt said:


> Start your own thread because it does raise some interesting questions.
> 
> One of course is WHY do you feel that divorce is looming in your future when neither one of you has expressed any dissatisfaction in the marriage.
> 
> ...


If my wife had it in her head that it was only a matter of time before I dumped her I can't believe that her resentment and lack of desire wouldn't be palpable. Staying on topic, I want to see, hear and feel, on the deepest level possible, that my wife is all in for the long haul. I would sense a lack of desire without that feeling.


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