# Respect & Surrendered Wives & all that



## madimoff (Feb 17, 2010)

I haven't read it so am in no position to comment, but from what I've read I kind of understand the notion of easing back & not complaining/nagging & so on if your OH is doing their best. (don't necessarily do it, but that's another story) Not so sure about the notion of 'going along with' his every decision. And really questioning what on earth is meant by respect in the context of 'surrendering'. Yep I respect my OH tons for many things he's done, achieved and does. However. Does the surrendering thing mean you're never meant to question? Discuss? Debate? Negotiate? If I sound anti, I'm not. I'm just confused! I know it's yonks since the book came out & everyone's probably talked it to death, but could you give the subject another airing?


----------



## Crypsys (Apr 22, 2010)

My wife does not surrender to me 100%, nor I to her. We try to always meet somewhere in the middle. I am assuming you are speaking of the whole "Man rules, woman listens" type relationship? That idea to me seems old fashioned and fatally flawed IMO. You ladies are just as capable as us guys at screwing everything up and making wrong decisions. ;-)

I value my wife as my lover, friend, confidant and partner. If there is a big decision, we will make it together. That being said, personality differences also make a difference in a marriage. My wife tends to be the shy, introverted type. I on the other hand am your typical A personality. 

Most times my wife is content and would rather me make decisions. But, she knows she can (and she will) disagree with me if she feels the way we are headed is wrong. We then discuss it and come to a mutual decision. Many times she has saw things I completely missed and going with her option ended up being the better one.


----------



## nice777guy (Nov 23, 2009)

There was a lot of talk about this idea a few months ago. At first I thought it was total BS - but now I think there's a little something to it.

To me - it seems most applicable to the romantic part of a relationship. So many of us men were raised to be so polite that the thought of "taking" a woman sexually - even a willing woman - seems rude!

Its hard to explain and I don't fully understand it. But what really got me thinking about differences between men and women was the example of movie choices. I don't like Dirty Dancing or Steel Magnolias, but I'll watch just about anything with Clint Eastwood or Harrison Ford in it.

There does seem to be a difference between "feminine" energy and "masculine" energy. And if we try too hard to be alike, fair, equal in all ways, things get thrown out of balance.

Make sense? If it does, maybe you can explain it back to me!


----------



## lbell629 (May 10, 2010)

I think we need to remember that the other side of the Respect from a wife is that that the Husband needs to Love his wife. And as far as surrender and respect goes, that's two different things. Respect means not talking down to your husband or making him feel like crap. Surrendering means you can voice your opinion and make decisions together, but there will be times when you won't come to the same conclusion no matter how much you talk. And then, in my opinion, the wives should submit to their husbands. Let the guys feel like they're in charge and are taking care of and providing for you.


----------



## Crypsys (Apr 22, 2010)

lbell629 said:


> And then, in my opinion, the wives should submit to their husbands. Let the guys feel like they're in charge and are taking care of and providing for you.


Wow, interesting take lbell629. I'll be honest that's an alien concept to me. I was raised by a single mom (and my grandmother) so I grew up with females making the only decisions in the house. Upon me getting married, it was just a natural thing for me to use consensus when we disagree. Just seems kind of asinine to me to let someone make the final decision just because they have a penis. 

Maybe some men need to feel 100% in charge because they have some underlying insecurity? I honestly don't know and I'm not trying to point fingers lbell, just trying to understand.


----------



## nice777guy (Nov 23, 2009)

Wasn't long ago that I was "argu-posting" (new word - just made it up) with someone who was trying to submit to their husband. I asked "what if your husband made a bad financial decision..." as an example - would you submit? Her answer was yes - she trusted him and felt that trust gave him the confidence he needed.

A few days later she was complaining about his recent financial failures and the strain they were putting on the marriage...


----------



## madimoff (Feb 17, 2010)

I have a feeling this being brought up by a single mum & only ever seeing women making (and being eminently capable of making) all the decisions is hugely relevant. Me too. (only daughter of single mum). My OH, who's the one prompting the debate, reckons that by never experiencing first hand a man (even only some of the time) in charge means you are more likely to argue every single point because you don't see the need for deferring. Not sure I see the need to defer simply because of a penis, either - however I kind of see that there's a macho thing about having an inbuilt need to be seen to be in charge, to be the head of the unit, & so on. 
He's quite often said he feels I don't respect him, yet when we discuss what that means, and I point out that I respect his clear thinking, his business ability, his personal foresight, his relationship with our son, his balls in terms of (calculated & largely successful!) risk taking in finance & business, he hasn't got an alternative definition to offer. 
What does respect mean when applied to men that's different in some way from any other kind? Are men more likely to view 'challenge' however minor as demeaning? He's been quite strident about not wanting to 'negotiate' because 'that's for business'. ??? I'd have thought negotiation, LEADING TO compromise in which someone obviously has to 'give in' to some extent, was the way forward? Surrendering seems to be a way of shortcircuiting by giving in sooner - and ??always the same one doing the giving in? Any thoughts?


----------



## Crypsys (Apr 22, 2010)

madimoff said:


> What does respect mean when applied to men that's different in some way from any other kind? Are men more likely to view 'challenge' however minor as demeaning?


Being as you know how I was raised, you know my personal answer to that question. If someone cannot handle their views being challenged that means they themselves do not have enough reason built into them. In my experience the times people do not like being challenged are when they are on already shaky ground. 



madimoff said:


> He's been quite strident about not wanting to 'negotiate' because 'that's for business'. ??? I'd have thought negotiation, LEADING TO compromise in which someone obviously has to 'give in' to some extent, was the way forward?


I agree, I think that's the only healthy way forward in any relationship. Maybe because people are not willing to negotiate is why so many marriages have such big issues?



madimoff said:


> Surrendering seems to be a way of shortcircuiting by giving in sooner - and ??always the same one doing the giving in? Any thoughts?


But whenever one persons will constantly dominates another, resentment will build. People may be able to put up with it for a time, but after a while they will get frustrated, angry and upset about it.


----------



## VeryShyGirl (Feb 18, 2010)

I've always considered myself quite an independent person. I've always had the view that women can do anything just as well as men. I always thought the man & woman in a marriage should be equal and treat eachother exactly the same. 

Recently I've changed my opinion on this. I've come to realize that although I have always been a stubborn, independent person, deep down I WANT my husband to show dominance. I trust him fully and I want him to make some of our decisions for us. I WANT him to take charge and in a way be submissive to him. I was quite surprised when I realized this, but it just seems to be what I am naturally attracted to!

Of course if there are _major_ decisions to be made I want to be involved. I would never let him make what I felt was a bad major decision just because he has a penis!


----------



## Crypsys (Apr 22, 2010)

VeryShyGirl said:


> I trust him fully and I want him to make some of our decisions for us. I WANT him to take charge and in a way be submissive to him. I was quite surprised when I realized this, but it just seems to be what I am naturally attracted to!


And that is how my marriage works VeryShy. My wife generally wants me to make decisions and I am okay with that. But she can and does speak up when she doesn't agree or has an issue with my choice. We then work and compromise the situation. I don't see anything wrong in that.

What I have trouble understanding though is when the wife doesn't speak up even when the husband is totally and fully in the wrong. I'm just against the whole "I'm man, your woman therefore you will respect me as a man and sit down and shut up".


----------



## madimoff (Feb 17, 2010)

Crypsys said:


> And that is how my marriage works VeryShy. My wife generally wants me to make decisions and I am okay with that. But she can and does speak up when she doesn't agree or has an issue with my choice. We then work and compromise the situation. I don't see anything wrong in that.
> 
> What I have trouble understanding though is when the wife doesn't speak up even when the husband is totally and fully in the wrong. I'm just against the whole "I'm man, your woman therefore you will respect me as a man and sit down and shut up".



Just to be a bit picky, could someone define how one of these discussions goes in a 'surrendered' relationship and one that's not? Cos I'm still slightly mystified. If you feel the man 'should' or even possibly maybe slightly 'should' make most of the decisions with little or no question, challenge, etc., from the wife, what ACTUALLY happens? "I think we should scrap the vegetable plot and build a tennis court" "oh alright then" end of conversation? "I think... court" "Whaaaat? You must be joking, after all the work I've (we've both) put in?" ??? 
You get my drift? Or is it only more minor issues that warrant rolling over & not uttering a word? I'm sure some will consider this seems bullish itself, but I really want to know if there's something wrong with my inclination to express my opinion. :scratchhead:


----------



## Crypsys (Apr 22, 2010)

madimoff said:


> Just to be a bit picky, could someone define how one of these discussions goes in a 'surrendered' relationship and one that's not?


::shrug:: I dunno, I've never experienced a surrendered relationship so I'm curious as well.



madimoff said:


> If you feel the man 'should' or even possibly maybe slightly 'should' make most of the decisions with little or no question, challenge, etc., from the wife, what ACTUALLY happens?


Were you quoting me because I was the last post? I haven't expressed that I thought a surrendered relationship was the way it should be :scratchhead:



madimoff said:


> I'm sure some will consider this seems bullish itself, but I really want to know if there's something wrong with my inclination to express my opinion. :scratchhead:


I don't think it's wrong, hopefully someone who does think we are wrong will post so we can at least try and understand their thinking...


----------



## madimoff (Feb 17, 2010)

Crypsys said:


> ::shrug:: I dunno, I've never experienced a surrendered relationship so I'm curious as well.
> Were you quoting me because I was the last post? I haven't expressed that I thought a surrendered relationship was the way it should be :scratchhead:
> I don't think it's wrong, hopefully someone who does think we are wrong will post so we can at least try and understand their thinking...


Sorry, yes just sloppy posting. Nothing I've said is aimed at anyone in particular, just hopeful of learning what I've mentioned (& you seem to be endorsing the question!)
.... given that OH is giving me *the book* when we see each other Friday, a lot could hang on any answers I might receive


----------

