# Slow kick to the curb



## scalpel (Mar 21, 2010)

You know when your posts move from "Coping with infidelity" to "Considering divorce and separation" that's not a good thing. You may have read my earlier posts about my wife's straying. *Had another talk with her last night and I am more convinced that I am being kicked to the curb.*

Things at home have been pretty icy for the last month or so. Last night she revealed that I am not the kind of man she thought she was marrying - too boring and staid. No "embracing life", depressed. She does not like spending time with my family. I disagree that I am depressed (more like under stress from her actions), and also think the stress of our youngest child has adversely affected both of us. But these are just excuses I make...

What I want to know is how long can we get by just living as roomates, taking care of our shared reponsibilities? No sex - she has no desire for me according to her. *She wants to try for a year.* While I would like time for things to thaw and get better, I think a year is too long. We have been married almost 12 years. The serious trouble started about 4 months ago. Both of us realize that time and time for happiness in our lives is slipping away. If I knew that in 12 months I was going to be dumped anyways I would leave right now. Of course if I could predict the future I wouldn't be still working!

What should I do? I want to engage, but she doesn't. I think she has made up her mind we are toast. So why the year? Does it sound like a good idea? I want to remain in a good marriage with her forever, but 12 months of this would be painful.


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## Tanelornpete (Feb 2, 2010)

Plan A - Plan B.

It's that simple. Your wife is trying to set the conditions: you are alive, and a member of this relationship, you too have the same rights - and possibly even more; you were not unfaithful. (Like my convoluted grammar?) 

Find out what she means by 'trying' for a year. If by 'trying' she means, split the expenses and try not to step on one another, then I'd say, "No thank you, please find another roommate."

If, on the other hand, she means deliberately and rationally working on the marriage, then by ALL means do so! By working on the marriage, I mean purposefully working on communication, on discovering what was broken and fixing it, and by deliberately and with full intent directing all effort toward creating an affair-free, loving and honorable relationship.

Should you choose the 'roommate' method: I do NOT advise a full year! You cannot survive that kind of abuse. I'd do Plan A for as long as you can - and when your love for her begins to fail utterly, move to plan B (I'd set an personal limit of _at the maximum_ 6 months. I've not seen a person able to go beyond that limit.) Your goal is the recovery, rebuilding, and strengthening of your relationship, not a simple passing of time.

Why does she want a year? I take that as a good sign: I think she may be having some second thoughts and wants to see what may happen. Take it as a silver lining on that gray cloud - but act on your terms.


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## scalpel (Mar 21, 2010)

Thanks for your response, Tanelornpete. You have got to be the fastest typist in the world - AND insightful at the same time.

What scares me is that she doesn't show any interest in "working" on things. Frequently she has said there must be something wrong with us if we have to "work" on the emotional or sexual sides of our marriage. I don't agree, but I'm tired of having one-sided conversations.

I need to research plan A and B. I never thought I'd be in this spot. What absolutely kills me is our kids. Last night she suggested that I have more than joint custody - they could stay with me "most" of the time. Wow. From supermom to part-timer in just a few months.


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## Tanelornpete (Feb 2, 2010)

If she is reconsidering her decisions (hence the 'year' request) I'd say that doing Plan A is a great way to get through to her - it shouldn't take too long before she begins to respond 

At affaircare we use a very similar method to Plan A (which is a Marriagebuilders concept) - here's a description:

*Carrot & Stick* In this phase you focus on two things: work on yourself to be the person you once were who attracted your spouse again AND allow your disloyal to experience the natural consequences of their choices. You work on yourself by eliminating the things that extinguished love between you two (like judging, angry explosions, enough is never enough) and by re-starting the things that kindled love between you two (like romantic doo-dads). You need to do BOTH...but eliminating love extinguishers is the most important of the two. The idea here is that the disloyal is getting some of their needs met by the Other Person but you want them to see that you do "get it" and that you are an attractive alternative able to meet their needs. The second part is about NATURAL consequences. This doesn't mean that you punish the disloyal, but rather, nope--you are not leaving the house so they can move their lover in. If the disloyal wants to be with their lover, they'll need to move out and nope the kids do not go with them. There is no reason for the children to leave their home, their bed, their neighborhood, their friends, their school because the disloyal is with the OP--so a natural consequence there is that the disloyal loses some time with their children. That's the cost of choosing to have an affair and what WILL happen if they choose to divorce. Allow them to experience that hurt because it will teach them faster that affairs HURT and cost A LOT!!

You should know that this step is not "long term" because no one can give and give and give forever when an affair is being rubbed in their face. Eventually the time would come for you to say, "I've done what I could to win you over and now I need to move to the next step before I lose all love for you." Sometimes a disloyal spouse sort of sits on the fence in this step because they are getting needs met by two folks. On the occasion there are disloyal spouses whose affair just die a natural death--like the Other Person just gets sick of it and leaves them--or they begin to see the good of staying and how much leaving would hurt...and they think maybe that too much water has passed under the bridge. Periodically let your disloyal know that you would love to have them back and work on the marriage. Invite them to return. If this is your case, consider yourself blessed and move to the phase of recovering your marriage!! 

If it is not, time to move on...​
May not all apply to you, but it gives you a general idea. In any event, as long as she is willing to give it a go, I'd take advantage. But, as I said before: include your terms. Let her know that you have some doubts, but you are willing to try. 

Yes, I know, she is the one saying this - but it also works from your end: you have the right to be skeptical, and to set some boundaries. 

Take your time, be patient, and rational.


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Now playing: Steve Vai - Bledsoe Blvd
via FoxyTunes


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## scalpel (Mar 21, 2010)

I can't tell if she is involved in an affair or not. This is actually hard, because if it were an affair, then I could see how the excitement and hormones could cloud her judgement.

What I felt last night was she wasn't having an affair. She was just done with me. This is worse.

We had agreed to a cooling-off period where we wouldn't talk about things, but I initiated the talk last night. Part of it was I wanted to let her know I was available to work on our relationship and be intimate again if she wanted. Unfortunately she doesn't want to talk or be intimate. I got the sense that she was DONE.

Do people get through this resigned attitude? Do I need to shake things up, or give it space? Darned if I know.


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## Susan2010 (Apr 19, 2010)

What you do depends on how you feel, and it doesn't sound like you want to do the work or shake things up. I just think winning your wife back and improving your marriage are unconditional efforts, but you only want to try if it works in the end. I understand being confused, but if I were your wife, I'd want my man to fight for me to reverse the damage that has been done, to at least show he wants to make the effort. And it sounds to me that is what she wants. Otherwise, I don't see the purpose of her wanting to give the marriage a year. You mentioned the other forum, so I also thought yours was an affair situation. If it isn't, then you need to get to work. If you don't get to work, there is no point in you sitting around waiting for that slow kick to the curb because you will have secured your reservation on that curb.

Decide if it is worth it to you to get our wife back on your side and save your marriage. Let us know what you decide and if you need suggestions on the work you have to do.


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## Brewster 59 (Jun 19, 2010)

Ok I will tell you the flip side of the story and things I think you should at least be on the look out for. Be on the lookout for her opening up a seperate bank account in her name only, be on the lookout for new credit cards in her name only. Be on the lookout for her wanting to be gone for the majority of the day every weekend with her sister or friends. These are all signs she is saving up for her split and emotionally detatching from you. 

Im not telling you not to try to invest into saving your marriage, but do so with eyes wide open and CYA. Mine in that years time opened 3 cc accounts, and charged 10k on them which guess what buddy even if your name isnt on them your 50% liable, she had interviewed laywers and when she left it was an long term plan executed perfectly. I was totally blindsided and screwed so while Im not saying this is what is happening to you go in with eyes wide open.

Ohhh so I dont look totally stupid I worked on the weekends but instead of getting things done she was out playing and saying she deserved a break on her days off. I guess I should of known but us dumb men want to think everythings OK.


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## scalpel (Mar 21, 2010)

Susan2010 said:


> What you do depends on how you feel, and it doesn't sound like you want to do the work or shake things up. I just think winning your wife back and improving your marriage are unconditional efforts, but you only want to try if it works in the end. I understand being confused, but if I were your wife, I'd want my man to fight for me to reverse the damage that has been done, to at least show he wants to make the effort. And it sounds to me that is what she wants. Otherwise, I don't see the purpose of her wanting to give the marriage a year. You mentioned the other forum, so I also thought yours was an affair situation. If it isn't, then you need to get to work. If you don't get to work, there is no point in you sitting around waiting for that slow kick to the curb because you will have secured your reservation on that curb.
> 
> 
> Decide if it is worth it to you to get our wife back on your side and save your marriage. Let us know what you decide and if you need suggestions on the work you have to do.


It feels like I'm the one wanting things to work out. I'm the one willing to talk. She has shut down, unfortunately. Some of our problems, sex for one, can only be solved if she participates. I'm interested in improving my life and thereby making myself more attractive to her. She has said that she has tried and it hasn't worked. I'm torn up because I think she is out the door already. 

My therapist (a marriage counselor she didn't want to see together) says it's hard to change, experiment, have fun with someone under a threat. I would have to agree. Anyone have any thoughts?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## scalpel (Mar 21, 2010)

scalpel said:


> It feels like I'm the one wanting things to work out. I'm the one willing to talk. She has shut down, unfortunately. Some of our problems, sex for one, can only be solved if she participates. I'm interested in improving my life and thereby making myself more attractive to her. She has said that she has tried and it hasn't worked. I'm torn up because I think she is out the door already.
> 
> My therapist (a marriage counselor she didn't want to see together) says it's hard to change, experiment, have fun with someone under a threat. I would have to agree. Anyone have any thoughts?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Shouldn't she fight for me as well?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Susan2010 (Apr 19, 2010)

With your attitude, there is really no point in trying. Just cut your losses and move out. Tell her thanks, but no thanks.


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## Atholk (Jul 25, 2009)

What did the keylogger turn up?


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## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

Scalpel,
Have you installed a keylogger and also analyzed the pattern of her text messages? The idea of a "year" seems odd to me. Most women if they have decided it is over and not fixable would not stick around for a whole year UNLESS they are in an affair and their affair partner is not YET ready to commit to them. 

Given her inexplicable behavior you have "moral" reasonable cause to: keylog, text message analyze AND put a GPS tracker in her vehicle. In 2-4 weeks you will DEFINITELY know if she is or is not having an affair. If she is, then you deal with it. If not you get her to explain WHY she wants a year during which she has zero interest in fixing the marriage. 





scalpel said:


> Shouldn't she fight for me as well?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


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## scalpel (Mar 21, 2010)

Have not installed a key logger or a GPS on her car. Somehow my gut tells me she isn't having an affair. I may be wrong. I went through some mild obsessing earlier on, and it wasn't good for our relationship or my own psyche. Now I am focussed on what I can do to change myself. I can't change or police her behavior. If I thought she was operating under the emotional cloud of an affair it might be useful to bring it to light, expose it. Instead I'm concerned she has come to some great revelation that I am not the one for her and can't make her happy-ever. I am desperate to salvage this for the sake of my kids. Maybe what I went through earlier in life (residency) burned out my sense of self. I honestly don't give much of a damn whether I live or die, but I love my kids and want something better for them. Geez I'm getting dramatic around here! 

On another note: I must be coming across very defensive in my posts. This is the second thread where I have been told I have a bad attitude. I have been hurt by my wife's actions and words, but am willing to work to get past it. What is it about my posts that makes you (susan2010) think that? I admit I am only telling my side of the story, but isn't that the nature of these boards?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Susan2010 said:


> I understand being confused, but if I were your wife, I'd want my man to fight for me to reverse the damage that has been done, to at least show he wants to make the effort. And it sounds to me that is what she wants. Otherwise, I don't see the purpose of her wanting to give the marriage a year.


I agree.

Also, what have you done to ensure she is NOT cheating? She may be just setting up her finances.

If you don't follow Pete's plan, go to marriagebuilders and print out their Love Buster questionnaire; both of you fill one out; it tells you how to stop doing negative things. You have to do that before you can get her to fall in love with you - Love Busters stick around no matter how nice you are. Work on that for a couple months, replacing bad habits with good.

Then do the Emotional Needs questionnaire, so you know how to please her.


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## Atholk (Jul 25, 2009)

scalpel said:


> Have not installed a key logger or a GPS on her car. Somehow my gut tells me she isn't having an affair. I may be wrong.


Well the keylogger was firm advice a month ago which you agreed was a good idea. Spector Pro is good.

The I want space routine for a year just sounds like she wants to have a year to develop her exit plan. Usually there's another man involved somehow though.

We recommend keyloggers for the same reason doctors recommend xrays for suspected broken bones.


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## questions (May 7, 2010)

Hi there,
First, I'm very sorry about the pain, confusion and hurt that you must be feeling. As you know by now, people hear your experience with with a pair of hearing aids filtered by their own experiences, values, and belief systems and offer you an advice based on them. What I am about to offer you is yet another hearing aid devices filtered by my own life experience and belief system.

Based on what I read from your posts, I agree with your assessment that your w is having a mid-life crisis. It's just another expression of her unhappiness and not accepting where she is now. The pattern has been there all the time: trying to find happiness with a bigger home, a better car, home improvement, travels, and finally the ADOPTION of a girl, something she thought she was missing.
I'll come back to the topic of adoption later, but for now, I would like to point out to you that she is not going to be happy no matter what you do. She might be appeased with a few changes, such as a trip to Rome, temporarily, but as with bigger house, better car, better kitchen, a new baby girl (a human-being with needs), she'll go back to where she has been: not being happy and not accepting where she is. External changes in her situation will not fill her void. She might blame you being boring, your toddler girl being challenging, or not having the better home improvement project, as a reason for her unhappiness in her marriage, but she simply is not going to be happy unless she herself changes.

This is her own journey that she'll probably have to experience and learn the hard lessons herself. She'll learn that nothing external will bring her happiness other than her own inner peace, but such learnings might not be now. She'll chase after what seems exciting and alluring now, and that's what she wants. If you or her kids try to stop her from having her dream fulfilled, she'll resent you and the kids even more. Heck, she already blames her daughter for her marital downfall... Until she looks to herself and not others for her own unhappiness, I don't think that there's much you can do.

I know that this is a marriage blog, not necessarily self-help or better parenting blogs. While I know that you're very hurt and mentally exhausted from all these, I'd like to point out someone who is even more vulnerable in this situation. You had three older biological sons when you adopted your daughter. Now you both say that she's very difficult, and your wife blames her for your marital problems. Your W brought her into your family because she thought that maybe having a girl would fill her own void, but now that girl is adding to her unhappiness. How would you like to grow up in her shoes, believing that you were abandoned by your birth family and also broke up your adoptive parents' marriage? Even at 2.5 years old, kids are very intuitive at sensing others' feeling, and if your W already views her as a potential sources of your martial problems, she'll sense that. She could be suffering from RAD (Reactive Attachment Disorder) which are fairly common among adoptive kids. Have you looked into that? If you want your daughter to have a chance at life without insurmountable baggages to overcome, I'd like to recommend that you look into it. Even if she's not suffering from RAD, you might want to seek professional help for her and yourself from those who specialize in adoption-related issues.

I'm so sorry to take all these out now when you're suffering already. However, I see that your wife is really lost right now, and it might take her some time to come to her senses. If you can focus on yourself and your kids, please focus your energy on your and your kids' happiness and well-being. Your w is a grown-up, and she'll need to learn her own lessons...

Please take care of yourself for your kids' sake. I'm sending my prayers to your way.


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## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

Keylogger, text message review and GPS are ALL non-invasive, passive monitoring. You run them for a while and then remove them if you find nothing. You NEVER discuss them even if you find she IS cheating. 

I thought when doctors diagnosed patients they often did tests to "rule out" various possibilities. 

How is that different here? If she IS having an affair you might have a shot at your marriage. Either way you need to know.





Atholk said:


> Well the keylogger was firm advice a month ago which you agreed was a good idea. Spector Pro is good.
> 
> The I want space routine for a year just sounds like she wants to have a year to develop her exit plan. Usually there's another man involved somehow though.
> 
> We recommend keyloggers for the same reason doctors recommend xrays for suspected broken bones.


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## Brewster 59 (Jun 19, 2010)

scalpel said:


> Have not installed a key logger or a GPS on her car. Somehow my gut tells me she isn't having an affair. I may be wrong. I went through some mild obsessing earlier on, and it wasn't good for our relationship or my own psyche. Now I am focussed on what I can do to change myself. I can't change or police her behavior. If I thought she was operating under the emotional cloud of an affair it might be useful to bring it to light, expose it. Instead I'm concerned she has come to some great revelation that I am not the one for her and can't make her happy-ever. I am desperate to salvage this for the sake of my kids. Maybe what I went through earlier in life (residency) burned out my sense of self. I honestly don't give much of a damn whether I live or die, but I love my kids and want something better for them. Geez I'm getting dramatic around here!
> 
> On another note: I must be coming across very defensive in my posts. This is the second thread where I have been told I have a bad attitude. I have been hurt by my wife's actions and words, but am willing to work to get past it. What is it about my posts that makes you (susan2010) think that? I admit I am only telling my side of the story, but isn't that the nature of these boards?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I think these boards are as much for venting as for getting advice so write what you feel if some disagree with you so what? If you get a nugget of wisdom great. Take what is for you and leave the rest IMO


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## scalpel (Mar 21, 2010)

Thanks for everyone's replies. We have been on vacation and it has been hard to respond. Questions, what you wrote really hit home. I'm not sure she will ever be happy. She has bounced from one thing to the next so many times- none seems to make her happy for too long. I don't know what exactly to do because I deserve a happy partner. One that supports me and brings out my full potential. That's not what I have right now. Recently she has been pining away for our"crazy" old friends that liked to party and get wild. She thinks I have take. Her away from all of that. In reality that was 10 or 12 years ago- time, maturity and kids have mellowed us all. I can't go back, nor do I want to. 

As for our daughter. We have contacted a good child psychologist with experience with adopted kids. 

I appreciate eveyone's thoughts and comments
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Brewster 59 (Jun 19, 2010)

Hope you are having a good vacaion! Has she ever been consistant or is it normal for her to bounce around in her wants and desires? This desire to relive the past can be very bad news. Read Helps 239s thread "Need advice and perspective" This thread is all about what happens when the spouse wants to live the wild past again. Its long but intresting and Im not saying this is what is going to happen in your situation.


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## scalpel (Mar 21, 2010)

Brewster 59 said:


> Hope you are having a good vacaion! Has she ever been consistant or is it normal for her to bounce around in her wants and desires? This desire to relive the past can be very bad news. Read Helps 239s thread "Need advice and perspective" This thread is all about what happens when the spouse wants to live the wild past again. Its long but intresting and Im not saying this is what is going to happen in your situation.


Wow that is a good thread. I have only read the first 15 pages of it, but the transformation in Help239 was just awesome. I think I am in a similar situation, but not nearly as severe as his (I hope!). Right now I am doing nothing right in her eyes. The more I plead and want to talk it out, the more I look weak. There is a fine line there- I want to address her complaints and change as a husband, but I don't want to be blamed for it all. She sought out an affair on Ashley Madison, while I was at work trying to pay for the charges to the credit card. The last time we had a big talk she said I wasn't the man she thought she had married. That I had changed into someone depressed and boring. Well I agree I am not the man she married. In a lot of ways I am much improved!

I will try the detached approach for a while.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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