# I really want to be wrong about all this



## Yessongs72

Sorry, this is going to go on a bit. And may ramble also.

I have known my wife since the late 70's, we have been an item since '88 and now married 14 years with two young children. I love her very much.

We are in the UK which means in a divorce, the children almost always stay with the mother unless drugs/violence is a danger (which it completely isn't). I will lose my children.

Early this year she was contacted on Facebook or Freinds Reunited (i think that one - she was using it to find out what had happened to some of her old school freinds) by an old flame. They arranged to meet in order to 'catch up' on each others lives over the last 20 years, my wife let me know all about this, asked if i minded ("i dont want you to be the jealous husbad and use this against me in some future situation") - the meeting would be 'open' and in a public place and midday. I gave her the OK. I love and (then) trust her 

(#1: i now know meeting an ex - even openly - is rarely good news for a relationship)

They kept in touch, my wife would sometimes read me his chatty texts telling her about some semi-amusing home situation. and things seemed fine.

Then came City#1 (names changed in case she is reading this). One Saturday she spent all day here looking at (and purchasing) a fairly expensive and 'clever' sewing machine (she likes to make quilts). It was in the summer holidays as i was taking the children to my mums where they would stay for the week, the main point here is that when doing this i often stay overnight and drive home on the Sunday. Anyway the day before she tells me that the OM is on a course in City#1 and would like to meet for lunch - was this OK? etc, etc. "Fine" i reply. Now come the part where i have to do some math. City#1 is about a 1 hour drive from home, 1.5 if the traffic is bad, 2 if its awful. i got home from my mums (I didn't stay overnight) at 11pm, the house was dark and empty. "Oh, strange" i thought. She eventually got home at 2 in the morning and has never explained why. My math reckons that even if she was still buying her sewnig machine at 7 she should have bee home by 9, which leaves five hours which could easily have been spent with the OM, in his hotel room.

Time moves on. Their texts (especially his to her) gradually become more fruity (sexually suggestive) and they tend to email and phone at work.

Since getting a smart-phone in mid October she now deletes their texts fairly soon after sending/recieving

(#2: communicating secretly with an ex IS bad news)

In October i was plugging her mobile into the charger and i just happened to look at her recent texts from OM. One stood out, it said "32 days to go " Hmm i thought, is that his birthday and he'll get laid by his wife? I counted the days on he calender and realised that my wife was at a conference in City#2 that day and was then staying that night so she could meet an old (girl)freind who lived and worked in City#3, about 20 miles from City#2. Then on the Tuesday of the week she was going away (the conference was Friday/Saturday) she left her phone in her car which i saw when i went to check if the car was locked, i had a look, she had sent him a text that said ONLY the name of her hotel - that just looked like an invitation

(#3 - meeting an ex in secret is just disastrous for a relationship)

Despite her deleting all WS/OM messages her smart-phone has a (not-so-smart) setting where the first lines can be read. The first lines on the following Monday and Tuesday indicate that a significant event took place on the Saturday night. I can only think of one significant event that would take place between ex's, late at night, in a hotel 100 miles from home. Its called sex -I really hope i'm wrong.

I have (rather too late i fear) applied a little technology and now can read the texts at my convenience, i also now know that they regularly phone each other - averaging about an hour a week. I don't feel bad about this invasion of privacy, I'm the account holder - she is using my phone to contact her lover.

My big problem is that there is a huge gulf between me knowing they are having a physical and emotional affair, and me being able to prove it. If she is lying to me, she is doing it fantastically well (and to friends and family) and all my 'evidence' is quite deniable and twistable. I know that the lie must be confronted with something undeniable ("You are seeing OM", not "Are you seeing OM") so i can do nothing except get all screwed up inside. For the same reason my usual support networks are closed to me - i have to be secretive and lie-ing to prove that she is being secretive and a liar in a far worse way. Or they will just go more underground.

I really think they are having an affair, but i love her so much that i want to be wrong.


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## TCSRedhead

You know at minimum there was an EA. Did you document what you did find? 

I would suggest getting keyloggers installed. What kind of phone? Many have a capability to retrieve data later even if deleted. 

_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## walkonmars

I'm sure you are losing a LOT of sleep and developing ulcers over this. I'm afraid it's not an innocent thing. 

Perhaps you can "arrange" to be at your mums with the kids for a weekend? Have your mum meet you half-way to pick up the kids and return to watch the house? 

I assume her phone is gps equipped? You can follow at a distance.


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## TDSC60

A very common tale. Catching up with an Ex boyfriend becomes a physical affair.

You want to be wrong but know you are correct.

Not sure how it works in the UK, but if you are the account holder on the phone, can you request a printout of texts, calls, messages?

If you have access to the phone then Google some settings about that specific phone model for backing up or updating files on a computer. Some phone types really do not "delete" deleted messages and you might be able to recover enough to give you the proof you need.


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## Acabado

She's hiding at plain sight. Many affairs happen this way.
You really need to read the texts and whatever contact they have.


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## Yessongs72

thanks so far - i will try the google thing (to retrieve texts), but not tonight.

The kids thing won't work - its a three hour drive and my mum doesn't (drive). Also they only seem to meet-up away fom home (if you look at 'how to cheat' sites this is a recomended practise), thanks anyway.


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## Will_Kane

If you KNOW she is cheating on you, like all of us out here in cyberspace do, then why do you need more evidence? Isn't it enough that you know? You need hard evidence to prove it to the world?

You tell your wife you KNOW. You don't tell her how. You tell her that she must go no contact with the other guy, handwrite the no contact letter, give you complete transparency, and admit it in order for you to consider reconciliation. You tell her that you refuse to stay married to her if she is going to have affairs and lie about them when caught. Then you file.

The deleting texts is enough all by itself. If nothing else, even without confronting her about the other man, you should tell her that stops now. Tell her that you take her deleting texts as a sign of hiding stuff from you and you refuse to stay married to someone who is hiding part of their life, such as the part that is engaged in an affair with her old flame.

If she doesn't care enough about the marriage and would rather let you file and divorce her, then you are not losing much.

In your case, I'm guessing her and other man have a friends with benefits situation.

Why did you not do anything or say anything when you had ample evidence that they were going to meet for sex?


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## AngryandUsed

Hire a PI, if you can afford.

VAR, keyloggers.

There are ways to retrieve the deleted texts, google them.

A bad place to be in, Yessongs71. I wish your fears are unfounded.


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## Chaparral

Does he have a wife? If he does you need to contact her.


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## Chaparral

The Healing Heart: The 180


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## Entropy3000

This is what having less than adequate boundaries does for you. I am referring to both her AND you.

You should know now that you should never have been ok with her getting back with this guy. You certainly should not have been ok with her meeting him for lunch. Then it seems you never confronted her about why she them came home at 2am. Really? What a nice guy you are. Why would you not talk to her about this? 

Now you have all the evidence you need that they have an inappropiate relationship from what you have gathered. But it also seems it is way way past inappropriate.

Essentially you have enough to tell her she must go NC with this guy. But the very unfortunate thing is that you have allowed this to grow into what ever it is. The time to make the stand has long long passed.

But that said you need to intervene to save your marriage assuming it is saveable which it may not be.

I would find a way to stop this convention. Be creative. But if I did not stop it I would be there. I would know where she was at all times. Of course by then it would not be about c0ckbl0cking but just calling them on this and filing. So indeed plan a surprise for her. Show up as a surprise for your lovely wife. That way IF for some crazy reason she is not hooking up you are a hero. At the very least she will know you are unpredictable which is awesome for so many reasons. Make it happen. If your marriage is the #1 priority then you can make this happen. Get help from a PI as well.

It is best to deal with this early on by having good boundaries. Very hard to put the genie back in the bottle.

But you have all of the proof you need now. She should not have this relationship at all. It is too bad you have gone along willingly the way you have.


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## turnera

So what do you want? Not sure, here.

Do you want to catch them cheating? Do you want to stop them before it's a PA? Do you want to divorce?


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## EleGirl

Yessongs72 said:


> ....
> I have known my wife since the late 70's, we have been an item since '88 and now married 14 years with two young children. I love her very much.
> 
> We are in the UK which means in a divorce, the children almost always stay with the mother unless drugs/violence is a danger (which it completely isn't). I will lose my children.


The UK has joint custody. So why would you lose your children?


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## Machiavelli

If you just need evidence, there are plenty of PI's in Britain who can do the gumshoe work. If you want to catch them yourself, get a sitter for the kids and go bust them. You know where and when. Does your wife have a car? Put a VAR under her seat bottom with velcro.

Do you want to try to break them up and get your wife to come to her senses or do you just want to send her packing?


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## turnera

EleGirl said:


> The UK has joint custody. So why would you lose your children?


 I'd like to hear the answer to this.


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## warlock07

I think he meant the family courts are heavily biased in favor of the mother. And this isn't the first time I've heard of it too.


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## warlock07

You will need to catch her red handed next time she plans this stuff. A PI or a friend willing to do that should be good enough. (She will obviously be calling you/kids at home)

How old are your kids ?


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## Chaparral

For me you already have enough. A little subterfuge is in order. Something like, you have knowledge that he claims to be banging old girlfriends he has been hooking up with from facebook. She will ask you how you know that. Tell her you will take that info to your grave. But..... you want her to take a polygraph. 

You are only letting this thing get out of hand now. They are in regular contact. He just wanted to get laid, the longer it goes on he may start thinking he would rather have your wife than his. Like entropy said, you should never have let them meet up in the first place.

If she refuses the polygraph, you have all you need. If she accepts go through with it, she may try to bluff her way through it.

At this point, she and the OM appear stronger than you and thats why you are in this position in the first place. She is replacing you with someone she sees as more fit. Delay at your peril.

Call his wife.


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## Acabado

The snooping tools (keylogger, spyware, VARs, GPS...) must be in place before the confrontation. They are important not only to gather more evidence but to monitor the aftermath in case he offers R and she agrees to the rules to actually get her real intentions immediately.
IE. a NC letter means nothing if right after that she calls again to tell him she was "forced", whether it for a more lovely good bye or to coold down just for a while... 
The odds are she won't give up for good at the first attempt. Happens every time.


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## barbados

Unfortunately this sounds like an affair to me. and if it not, then as others have already said you two have some serious boundary issues. I don't want to pile on here, because you are here asking for help in a very tough situation, but this was a huge mistake to allow this meeting to ever take place. I hope things work out for you, and if you find (hopefully) that its not a PA, you stop this NOW, NC letter, etc., and you two start working on proper boundaries.


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## MattMatt

> "i dont want you to be the jealous husbad and use this against me in some future situation"


What 'future situation'? Oh, the future situation where it transpired your wife had planned to cheat on you from the very moment her old flame got in touch with her? Oh. *That* future situation?

Did she take you for mug?:scratchhead:


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## MattMatt

If you need a Private Investigator in the UK this is one place to start Association of British Investigators

I feel so badly for you. At least when my wife had an affair with an old flame she told me in advance about what she planned to do.

To find out by accident over a period of time must be so much worse.

Get STD tests as a matter of urgency.


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## DavidWYoung

What does your gut tell you? Your gut is RIGHT! So say you catch her in bed with the other guy? What will you do? What will she say?I know that you want things to be the way they were and for everything to be fine because Christmas time and you don't need the drama! Well....THAT IS NOT GOING TO HAPPEN! Your wife is killing your marriage, she doesn't give a crap about the marriage, your history, your child, you, in any way, shape or form. I am really not trying to be an A$$! I just don't want you to make the same mistakes that I and others made. You will HATE your life greatly, for a long time, if you do this wrong! Read the post of Bandit .45 and other here, if you want to come out of this with your head and your balls held high. You can write me a private if you have questions. Good Luck David


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## MattMatt

You could set up a bogus email account, send yourself an email with some details about how he is bragging about having an affair with your wife?


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## ladybird

Digital voice recorder in her car? 

Key logger on her phone Mobile Phone Monitoring Software - Monitor Text Messages, Emails, Calls, & more | WebWatcher And it is onsale for 67.00 usually its 97.00!!


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## Yessongs72

thanks, here is a rambling reply to some of the questions asked.

to clarify the losing the childen thing, i should have said losing custody, if you look at any UK divorce lawer web-site, they pretty much all advice the husband that even if the wife is totally to blame (adultery) the courts invairiably give her custody - unless it can be proven she is 'bad' for the children (drugs/violent). shagging another man does not (in their eyes) make a woman a bad mother.

What do i want - that depends upon when the question is asked 'coz i'm all over the place on this one. I think if definite PA then i would divorce. EA bothers me far less, but still bothers me - i would want it to stop.

Setting boundaries - so many of our boundaries are already defined by who and what we are, what we believe in, should a couple need to establish boundaries every time they meet someone. For instance - if she was contacted by her only-other significant ex from the early 80's it wouldn't bother me at all, there would be no boundary to set - she'd meet him once and tell me 'yep - he's still an idiot' (or similar) and that would be the end of it.
Boundaries - she has always been very righteous about relationships, disaproving of adultery both 'private' and in the lives of thoe who choose to live their lives in the glare of the media - When my older brothers marrage fell apart when he was 'caught with his pants down' the grief she gave me about it was, well, more than i wanted, she did not aprove at all and took several years to forgive him (not that my brother needed my wifes forgiveness) - so pre-existing boundaries of personal standards did exist.

Children are 9 and 6.

OM is married - kids at uni.

voice recorder would be worth investigating - she often 'phones him when she is in the car. question: how frustrating is it to listen to only one side of a phone conversation? because i imagine thats all you record.

I had already considered STD test, it is a worry. it will be done. soon.

The 'City #1 - five lost hours' is the situation i am most unsure about, she did see him for lunch, then she did go back to the sewing machine dealer (i am sure of this). the only 'evidence' is five lost hours - which could very easily be explained away by a liar (she has profesional friends all over the place - 'oh yes, i called in to see 'Rachel.C' was i really five hours? - its easy and credible, and an unsubstantiated confrontation could make things so much more difficult in every respect.

Thanks for all the input. Y72


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## Machiavelli

Yessongs72 said:


> What do i want - that depends upon when the question is asked 'coz i'm all over the place on this one. I think if definite PA then i would divorce. EA bothers me far less, but still bothers me - i would want it to stop.


Trust me, it's a PA.



Yessongs72 said:


> Boundaries - she has always been very righteous about relationships, disaproving of adultery both 'private' and in the lives of thoe who choose to live their lives in the glare of the media - When my older brothers marrage fell apart when he was 'caught with his pants down' the grief she gave me about it was, well, more than i wanted, she did not aprove at all and took several years to forgive him (not that my brother needed my wifes forgiveness) - so pre-existing boundaries of personal standards did exist.


That's why she has to go for divorce. Essentially all women are against adultery in marriage. They hate cheating and they hate cheaters. Once the limbic gets in control and makes her an adulteress, she has to justify it to herself. Naturally, her rationalization hamster picks you out of the crowd. If you were her true soul mate, this other guy would not have been able to get between her legs so easily. Therefore you are an imposter. This was further proved to her when you failed to use your soul mate mind reading powers to detect the affair, indicated that you just don't know her at all, otherwise you'd obviously know. Now that you've proven yourself NOT to be Prince Charming you must be gotten rid of ASAP before you have proof of adultery. So long as nobody knows but her and OM, her self image can remain intact. Once you smash the mirror, well, she's going to get pissed.



Yessongs72 said:


> Children are 9 and 6.
> 
> OM is married - kids at uni.


Have you spoken to his wife? If not, why not? Do it yesterday. ETA: scratch that. Get more evidence before bringing in the OMW.



Yessongs72 said:


> voice recorder would be worth investigating - she often 'phones him when she is in the car. question: how frustrating is it to listen to only one side of a phone conversation? because i imagine thats all you record..


Sometimes you can catch a session happening right there in the car. Otherwise, you'll hear her telling him what she's going to do to him next time or what she liked about what he did to her last time. Etc.

I had already considered STD test, it is a worry. it will be done. soon.




Yessongs72 said:


> The 'City #1 - five lost hours' is the situation i am most unsure about, she did see him for lunch, then she did go back to the sewing machine dealer (i am sure of this). the only 'evidence' is five lost hours - which could very easily be explained away by a liar (she has profesional friends all over the place - 'oh yes, i called in to see 'Rachel.C' was i really five hours? - its easy and credible, and an unsubstantiated confrontation could make things so much more difficult in every respect.
> 
> Thanks for all the input. Y72


Five lost hours? How about five minutes behind the dumpster at the restaurant or in a stall in the can? The nastier the better. Women like to let really let their inner slvt out in these affairs. It's really quite shocking what they're up for.


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## Chaparral

* Setting boundaries - so many of our boundaries are already defined by who and what we are, what we believe in, should a couple need to establish boundaries every time they meet someone. For instance - if she was contacted by her only-other significant ex from the early 80's it wouldn't bother me at all, there would be no boundary to set - she'd meet him once and tell me 'yep - he's still an idiot' (or similar) and that would be the end of it.
Boundaries - she has always been very righteous about relationships, disaproving of adultery both 'private' and in the lives of thoe who choose to live their lives in the glare of the media - When my older brothers marrage fell apart when he was 'caught with his pants down' the grief she gave me about it was, well, more than i wanted, she did not aprove at all and took several years to forgive him (not that my brother needed my wifes forgiveness) - so pre-existing boundaries of personal standards did exist.*

This may be the most worn out, wrong paragraph on this website. Everyone despises cheating until they do it. And yes, they still hate other people that do it.

go to doccool and see how cheaters educate each other.


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## Chaparral

BTW, by the time your gut brings you to this website, there is a 99.5% chance your spouse is cheating.


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## Shaggy

Why not set her up for another cheating opportunity and personally bust her with him? It does seem obvious that this s physical affair and that your wife is an eager planner of the event.

You need to find his wife's contact information so you can expose it direct to her and ruin their affair.


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## Thor

Yessong, welcome aboard.

Let's back up a bit. The first rule is never ever reveal your sources to her. If she knows how you found out, she will know how to avoid further detection. She will only admit to what she thinks you already know, so again you can't let her know your source because then she will know how much you know. 

The second rule is don't confront too soon. You want to nuke whatever is happening asap, but you have to have the right data. Get your keylogger in place on the computer she uses at home, and get a VAR hidden in her car. Those should give you ample advance notice of future planned hookups and some idea of what has already happened.

However, why do you want more info? Are you looking to smack her out of the fog so she will stop the affair and come back to you? Or are you looking for justification to divorce her? Perhaps confirmation of a PA rather than EA so you feel confident in your decision?

Really you do not have to prove to anybody what you already know in your gut. There is a relationship which is not acceptable to you. Even in the most ridiculous innocent coloring, it is not acceptable to you because of the secrecy and deception. So right there that is enough for you to set a nuclear boundary that you will not remain in a marriage with someone who hides and deceives, thus total transparency must begin immediately.

The crime lab evidence isn't necessary unless you personally need that kind of certainty. As others have offered, there are wordings you can use in talking to her which amount to you saying you know what is going on and it must stop at this very moment. You can know what you know just because you know it. You don't need dna or fingerprints or high def video. All you need is your own judgment and observations.


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## Entropy3000

chapparal said:


> * Setting boundaries - so many of our boundaries are already defined by who and what we are, what we believe in, should a couple need to establish boundaries every time they meet someone. For instance - if she was contacted by her only-other significant ex from the early 80's it wouldn't bother me at all, there would be no boundary to set - she'd meet him once and tell me 'yep - he's still an idiot' (or similar) and that would be the end of it.
> Boundaries - she has always been very righteous about relationships, disaproving of adultery both 'private' and in the lives of thoe who choose to live their lives in the glare of the media - When my older brothers marrage fell apart when he was 'caught with his pants down' the grief she gave me about it was, well, more than i wanted, she did not aprove at all and took several years to forgive him (not that my brother needed my wifes forgiveness) - so pre-existing boundaries of personal standards did exist.*
> 
> This may be the most worn out, wrong paragraph on this website. Everyone despises cheating until they do it. And yes, they still hate other people that do it.
> 
> go to doccool and see how cheaters educate each other.


Indeed. This is having no boundaries. One does not shoot form the hip and create boundaries as they feel. What the OP has provided are an example of inadequate and poorly defined boundaries.

Hopefully he will realize someday that being ok with certain things is not protecting the marriage and translates to poor boundaries. EXs should be totally out IMO. Certainly in meeting them alone.


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## Yessongs72

Thor, thanks for for your comments, your rules 1 and 2 are precisely why i am holding back, i need PROOF hot proof. You ask why - in my most recent post i said i would probably divorce if PA, and that (to move as quickly as posible) requires proper proof, not gut feelings. I have ordered a VAR for her car.

Chaparal, i have looked at some cheating web sites (not neccesarily the one you recommend) and that is one of the things that kind of stands out - they are doing some of the wrong things the 'right' way (according to these fkers) for instance they never meet anywhere local to either of them (city #1 is 60miles for wife, 120 miles for OM, City #2 is about 100 miles for both) and simple maths will tell you that, nowadays, OM lives about 60 miles away - any physical encounter is planned.

Machiavelli - contacting OM's wife is not an easy thing, (1) i would want rock solid evidence before doing so. (2) I don't have any contact info for her, i do know her name and have read her page on Wickipedia (she was almost famous about thirty years ago - she is still highly regarded in her sport). I will get it.

Key logging the home PC is a waste of time, wife does not use it to communicate with OM. They only email each other at work - wife let this bit of info slip out some time ago.

Entropy3000 - i am sorry i seem to have really annoyed you with the boundary thing. Yes you are right about seeing significant ex's but we often only learn these things in retrospect - you don't investigate relationship web sites until you think/realize/imagine things are going bad. I guess i was too old fashioned and relied on that 'trust' thing too much. Also theres the thing where i'm not the control freak in the marriage, my wife inherited that gene from her late mother, and shares it with both her sisters and has passed it on to our nine year old daughter.

Regards, and thanks, Yessongs72


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## costa200

What's up with you guys in the UK? Your women ask permission to meet an old flame, you allow it, then she asks to go on a date with the old flame and you will allow that too, then you are surprised that she just took it on herself to take it one step further?

Tell me, was there a point where your gut told you this wasn't ok? Or did you just disconnect from the primal instincts that have served men for millions of years?

BTW this here is worthy of analysis:



> "i dont want you to be the jealous husbad and use this against me in some future situation"


This is a very strange sentence! One i believe was thought up in advance and was kind of a slip on her part. Obviously she was sh!t testing you and you failed miserably. She knew this would not be ok and she still asked you. Instead of saying no you rolled over for her. Totally the wrong approach if i might say.

The only positive thing about all this is that you must have learned some important lessons with this episode. Apply the knowledge...



> For instance - if she was contacted by her only-other significant ex from the early 80's it wouldn't bother me at all, there would be no boundary to set - she'd meet him once and tell me 'yep - he's still an idiot' (or similar) and that would be the end of it.


I think you need to brush up on how man-woman connections work. An ex-lover is always a potential mate. Much more dangerous than a random guy. The familiarity assures it. 

And it doesn't even matter who ended things. Sexual attraction doesn't give a damn about the fine points of love. If a guy wasn't good enough for a long term relationship he may still be good enough to be a biological father of a child the cuckhold is supposed to raise.


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## Remains

Costa! That is the worst post I have ever read of yours! Not least because you are using his Englishness as a generalization - I would say about 5% of people who come here, if that, have all their ideas, boundaries, actions, all in the correct place. Probably more like 2%. That means 95-98% are as fogged as the next guy. And most on here are you blooming Americans!  

(Edit: I didn't even bother to look where you from because everyone on here seems to be American! Oops...another generalization! Haha)

I agree with your highlighting of the sentence...very telling. Though not your analysis. That is not a pre meditated reaction. That is a subconscious reaction due to her subconscious thoughts directing her to say that. That is how our gut instinct works. Why we ask questions to liars to see their reactions. Because their answers give the game away! Someone who was genuinely intending to do nothing wrong, and was prepared to divert any advances, would never have given that as an answer. All subconscious.


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## Yessongs72

costa200 - yep us Englsh guys, we're all d1cks. Seriously it is a strange sentence partly because its a mis-quote of something said several months ago, thers no way i can rember the exact phrase she used.

Secondly, i think i've done her a diservice with the comment about the 'only other significant ex' because (unlike the situation with the 'problem significant ex') she wouldn't bother meeting him. he really was a waster, she'd probably ask if i wanted to meet him instead (we were at school together). 

thirdly - no one is going to be the biological father of a child. Quite apart from being on the cusp of the menopause (oh you'll say, she's trying to get one in while she still can) she has recently had a coil fitted as she could no longer bear the side affects the pill was giving her.

and i think the sexual attaction was the nice hair the guy had in the 70's (she was mid-teenager when she started dating him), it's probably all gone now.

Big dog by the way.

Sorry, back to your first question. When do you interpret that she asked me if she could 'go on a date' ? because that was never an interpretion i put on either of her original lunch-time meeting requests. Please bear in mind that i have edited the original discussions because theres no way i can exactly remember the words used (and i don't want to ramble more than i already am) - but the point is on both occaisions the meetings were presented as being (a)very public (b)mid-day (c) platonic (e) fairly short. And i know you (or anyone else) can rip me to shreds on my naivety on those four points but the point is she sought permission and she sought to re-assure. On the other hand the City #2 meeting was secretive, hidden. Even as recently as september (long time after City #1) she would read me his texts (but probably not all of them) as they were just mundane news about his family. yep, i know - smokescreen.

Regards


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## Will_Kane

Yessongs72 said:


> i need PROOF hot proof. You ask why - in my most recent post i said i would probably divorce if PA, and that (to move as quickly as posible) requires proper proof, not gut feelings. I have ordered a VAR for her car.
> 
> Entropy3000 - i am sorry i seem to have really annoyed you with the boundary thing.


The voice-activated recorder probably will tell you what you need to know within a week or so.

However, what if you hear her telling other man how she can't wait to have sex with him again and, when you confront her, she tells you it was all just a joke, that her and other man always kid around that way? What level of proof do you need? I have heard of cheaters being caught in the act and saying, "wait, it's not what you think, I can explain." Then, later on, the betrayed says, "you were naked and having sex" and the cheater replies, "no, I had my underwear on, my clothes got wet and I took them off, then my underwear got caught on a metal button on the affair partner's jeans, and it looked like we were having sex, but I was really trying to get loose and the metal button was digging in to my leg, that's why I was making those ooh and ahh sounds." 

Sounds far-fetched, but so would any story your wife would make up to explain her lying to you and the facts you are aware of about it so far. Do you really not believe that your wife had sex with other man in the hotel after all the odd messages and deceit leading up to it?

Anyway, you are allowed to hold her feet to the fire just for lying to you; you are allowed to tell her when you don't want her to do something like go to a hotel whose name you know she just gave to the other man who is regularly sending her sexually suggestive messages; you don't have to wait until you actually have photos or recordings of your wife having sex with her other man before you put your foot down about what you are and are not willing to accept in your marriage.

Good luck with the voice-activated recorder. Hope for the best, but be prepared for the worst.


----------



## Shaggy

You might have an opportunity during the holidays if she's taking time off. She won't want to go for a week or so without contact with him. So the PC keylogger might just catch them! So get it in place ASAP. Especially if for some reason her phone became ill or nonfunctional somehow. For instance it couldn't be charged because the charger got lost, or no longer works. For example applying cleat fingernail polish on the contacts renders it useless and undetectable as to why.

The VAR is a must of course. You should have considered having 2 of them, so you can swap one out to listen to.


----------



## Entropy3000

Yessongs72 said:


> Thor, thanks for for your comments, your rules 1 and 2 are precisely why i am holding back, i need PROOF hot proof. You ask why - in my most recent post i said i would probably divorce if PA, and that (to move as quickly as posible) requires proper proof, not gut feelings. I have ordered a VAR for her car.
> 
> Chaparal, i have looked at some cheating web sites (not neccesarily the one you recommend) and that is one of the things that kind of stands out - they are doing some of the wrong things the 'right' way (according to these fkers) for instance they never meet anywhere local to either of them (city #1 is 60miles for wife, 120 miles for OM, City #2 is about 100 miles for both) and simple maths will tell you that, nowadays, OM lives about 60 miles away - any physical encounter is planned.
> 
> Machiavelli - contacting OM's wife is not an easy thing, (1) i would want rock solid evidence before doing so. (2) I don't have any contact info for her, i do know her name and have read her page on Wickipedia (she was almost famous about thirty years ago - she is still highly regarded in her sport). I will get it.
> 
> Key logging the home PC is a waste of time, wife does not use it to communicate with OM. They only email each other at work - wife let this bit of info slip out some time ago.
> 
> Entropy3000 - i am sorry i seem to have really annoyed you with the boundary thing. Yes you are right about seeing significant ex's but we often only learn these things in retrospect - you don't investigate relationship web sites until you think/realize/imagine things are going bad. I guess i was too old fashioned and relied on that 'trust' thing too much. Also theres the thing where i'm not the control freak in the marriage, my wife inherited that gene from her late mother, and shares it with both her sisters and has passed it on to our nine year old daughter.
> 
> Regards, and thanks, Yessongs72


I am saying that life is a constant learning situation. You have to adapt. If you always do what you do, you always get what you get.

I am always disappointed to see a guy messing himself over. Annoyed by that? Probably not the right word. Dismayed perhaps. It is like watching a dog run through traffic and get hit only to have them run right back into the road after they make it to the side. It is not annoying. It is heartwrenching. That is what i am expressing. I would be annoyed if you were the cheater and arguing for this. But you are the one being hurt and arguing for it. Completely different thing.

Yes your wife went on a lunch date with her EX and you were ok with it. Then you show that there may be an EA / PA with this EX. Then you go on to say that you feel that this is an ok thing. That you feel it is ok for your wife to have a lunch date with an EX. It just depends on how "you" feel abou the guy. Realize that ALL EX lovers are forever your rival. It matters now how devisive it was when they split up. Being an EX short-circuits so very much. It is mind boggling how much.

All this said, I sincerely hope you can pull this together and find a way to intervene in a firm enough way to head off a full blown affair. I hope it is not too late.


----------



## Thor

Yessongs72 said:


> Key logging the home PC is a waste of time, wife does not use it to communicate with OM. They only email each other at work - *wife let this bit of info slip out some time ago*.


You need to start thinking like a spy or a scheming politician. Just as an example, the bolded part above. It may be exactly as you say, she unintentionally let it slip. So not to pick this one detail to argue over, just to use it as an example. She has proven to be dishonest with you. If she is cheating, she is also very adept at planning deceptions. So you should never take anything she says at face value. Always look for alternate possibilities.

Perhaps she knew there was incriminating evidence on the home computer, so she let that comment out in order to keep you from snooping until she could get it erased.

I hope this doesn't spin you too far out into paranoia.


----------



## Remains

Entropy, I think OP said how he realizes how stupid it was to let his wife get in touch with, speak, text, and finally meet up with her ex. I think he said how each one was a bad decision in his FIRST post.

I think he knows full well.


----------



## WyshIknew

costa200 said:


> What's up with you guys in the UK? Your women ask permission to meet an old flame, you allow it, then she asks to go on a date with the old flame and you will allow that too, then you are surprised that she just took it on herself to take it one step further?


Ummm generalising much Costa?

I read about a lot of Portuguese guys who are cuckolds. What's wrong with you guys from Portugal, can't you hang on to your women?


----------



## lovelygirl

Entropy3000 said:


> At the very least she will know you are unpredictable which is awesome for so many reasons. .


If she learns he's unpredictable then she'll have to take it underground and become more careful. She doesn't need surprises but what she needs is the false security that her husband is unaware of what's going on.
He needs to keep on playing the fool for a while if he wants harder evidences so that he can catch her red-handed.


----------



## costa200

> costa200 - yep us Englsh guys, we're all d1cks.


No, but many of you have taken that "modern man" pill and it shows. Your posts are filled to the brim with it. You guys are stuck trying to be the women's magazine version of a man. How is that working for you guys?



> I read about a lot of Portuguese guys who are cuckolds.


Actually, no you really don't. Many portuguese guys can be getting cheated on, just like in the whole world, but you won't find many who will stand for the kind of stuff regularly seen in these types of threads from english blokes. Allowing your wife to go on dates with other dudes is pretty much not existent over here. 

Infidelity, specially a wife's infidelity, is very frowned upon and the level of acceptance of it is quite low. In fact i'll wager that you are more likely to find more cases of violent murder of the wife and her lover than guys who basically ok'ed their wives going on dates with other dudes.

You cannot stop infidelity, but you can surely make it more likely and easier. If you don't step up to the plate when needed your value as a man goes down. If your wife gets a notion that forgiveness is possible or, gods help you, likely, then you are extending the red carpet. If you ok your wife's activities that continuously exposes her to other guys and/or toxic friends with less than stellar behavior, then you are giving it a push.

What is baffling is that deep down you guys know this stuff isn't good. But you are so scared of being called dirty names (jealous, controlling, caveman) that you let yourselves be stepped all over. Basically you were indoctrinated to be like this and the results are pretty plain to see.

Having socialized with brits on vacations almost every summer i've seen it first hand. Girlfriends dancing with other guys right in the boyfriend's face (local guys who think nothing about humiliating another guy like that) and they uncomfortably grin. And everyone understands that grin. The "what the fvck does she think she is doing?" grin. Yet they are wordless. So scared of defending their own in the game. And then being bossed around by that same girlfriend like he is less than human. 

And it's not isolated. It's a trend. A noticeable trend. Heck, i don't know how these guys manage to live like that.



> thirdly - no one is going to be the biological father of a child. Quite apart from being on the cusp of the menopause (oh you'll say, she's trying to get one in while she still can) she has recently had a coil fitted as she could no longer bear the side affects the pill was giving her.


Mate, the fact that her rationality allows her to use birth control doesn't mean the rules of biology have changed. She is down to her last eggs and her hormones are running wild. Just check out the countless threads here that revolve around the affair partners not using condoms, even when there is very good reason for it and there is birth control in place. 

You are forgetting that it is the limbic system that kicks in when sexual attraction is happening. Completely independent from rational thought. 




> Sorry, back to your first question. When do you interpret that she asked me if she could 'go on a date' ? because that was never an interpretion i put on either of her original lunch-time meeting requests. Please bear in mind that i have edited the original discussions because theres no way i can exactly remember the words used (and i don't want to ramble more than i already am) - but the point is on both occaisions the meetings were presented as being (a)very public (b)mid-day (c) platonic (e) fairly short. And i know you (or anyone else) can rip me to shreds on my naivety on those four points but the point is she sought permission and she sought to re-assure.


Man, i'm not trying to hurt you. I'm asking you to think on what went down and learn from it. Life is experience. 

Being naive is a fault you could live with. Nobody will think less of you for it. But it harmed you in this case. I'm pretty sure you won't fall in that trap again.

Now, to more effective things, you got the VAR thing going, and that's important. Have you considered if it is possible to install a keylogger in her phone? Many stuff can go under the radar in text messages.


----------



## WyshIknew

Nah Costa see it all the time where I live, the potuguese guys go home with their tail between their legs because the local guys have pinched their women.


----------



## costa200

WyshIknew said:


> Nah Costa see it all the time where I live, the potuguese guys go home with their tail between their legs because the local guys have pinched their women.


Either a skewed sample or you don't actually know a single portuguese guy. I suggest you put it to the test. Come over here and enjoy our sunny beaches and mess around a married woman and see how far that will lead you. Just have an escape route ready or it's possible you'll end up 6 feet under.


----------



## WyshIknew

The Audacious Epigone: Infidelity rates by ethnicity

This survey shows that there was a one percent difference between English female infidelity and Iberian infidelity. I will grant you that it was the English women who were the highest but one percent is hardly conclusive. And who knows how much that dynamic has changed.
And it does happen here I'm afraid. I actually feel rather bad for them because most of them are job seekers who get poorly paid and badly housed and then they meet a local guy with wads of cash and a nice house and they are gone. Happens to the Latvians too. As I say not nice but it happens.


----------



## WyshIknew

Sorry. last I will say on this thread because this is a massive thread jack and OP does not need this.

Can you not make your points about infidelity without making arrogant statements denigrating whole populations.

1% does not give you that much of a moral high ground.


----------



## MrK

Will_Kane said:


> However, what if you hear her telling other man how she can't wait to have sex with him again and, when you confront her, she tells you it was all just a joke, that her and other man always kid around that way? What level of proof do you need? I have heard of cheaters being caught in the act and saying, "wait, it's not what you think, I can explain." Then, later on, the betrayed says, "you were naked and having sex" and the cheater replies, "no, I had my underwear on, my clothes got wet and I took them off, then my underwear got caught on a metal button on the affair partner's jeans, and it looked like we were having sex, but I was really trying to get loose and the metal button was digging in to my leg, that's why I was making those ooh and ahh sounds."


Sounds stupid, huh? I WISH I had tagged that post where a guy caught his naked wife climbing down off of a naked man and she CONVINCED him it was not what it looked like (later in his post, AFTER that episode, he again asked if he was justified in his suspicions or just being paranoid).

Unfortunately, I'm not joking.


----------



## lovelygirl

costa200 said:


> No, but many of you have taken that "modern man" pill and it shows. Your posts are filled to the brim with it.* You guys are stuck trying to be the women's magazine version of a man. How is that working for you guys?
> *
> 
> 
> Actually, no you really don't. Many portuguese guys can be getting cheated on, just like in the whole world, but you won't find many who will stand for the kind of stuff regularly seen in these types of threads from english blokes. Allowing your wife to go on dates with other dudes is pretty much not existent over here.
> 
> Infidelity, specially a wife's infidelity, is very frowned upon and the level of acceptance of it is quite low. In fact i'll wager that you are more likely to find more cases of violent murder of the wife and her lover than guys who basically ok'ed their wives going on dates with other dudes.
> 
> You cannot stop infidelity, but you can surely make it more likely and easier. If you don't step up to the plate when needed your value as a man goes down.* If your wife gets a notion that forgiveness is possible or, gods help you, likely, then you are extending the red carpet. If you ok your wife's activities that continuously exposes her to other guys and/or toxic friends with less than stellar behavior, then you are giving it a push.
> *
> What is baffling is that deep down you guys know this stuff isn't good. *But you are so scared of being called dirty names (jealous, controlling, caveman) that you let yourselves be stepped all over. Basically you were indoctrinated to be like this and the results are pretty plain to see.*
> 
> Having socialized with brits on vacations almost every summer i've seen it first hand. *Girlfriends dancing with other guys right in the boyfriend's face (local guys who think nothing about humiliating another guy like that) and they uncomfortably grin. And everyone understands that grin. The "what the fvck does she think she is doing?" grin. Yet they are wordless. So scared of defending their own in the game. And then being bossed around by that same girlfriend like he is less than human. *
> 
> And it's not isolated. *It's a trend. *A noticeable trend. Heck, i don't know how these guys manage to live like that.
> 
> 
> 
> Mate, the fact that her rationality allows her to use birth control doesn't mean the rules of biology have changed. She is down to her last eggs and her hormones are running wild. Just check out the countless threads here that revolve around the affair partners not using condoms, even when there is very good reason for it and there is birth control in place.
> 
> You are forgetting that it is the limbic system that kicks in when sexual attraction is happening. Completely independent from rational thought.


This is the best post in this thread. Truer words couldn't be said! 

The idea of this modern man nowadays is ridiculous. 

(A similar situation to your example) 
A guy friend of mine had no balls to get out of the club when his gf started dancing with another guy right in front of my friend's face. When I asked him why he didn't leave, his response was "_I had no problem with that. I didn't want to sound jealous and insecure. I know she loves me, no matter what she does_".
yeah ..right.... and to even think that night (before the dance) they had argued a lot and she started doing things out of spite. 
If I were his gf I would lose respect for him right away. She tested him and he failed miserably. 
That's not how Albanian guys are, in fact. Had it been another guy in my friend's shoes , the dance floor would have turned into a bloody battlefield. (I'm not saying violence is the answer but I'm trying to say that a man who has some self-respect wouldn't accept that situation.)

The same goes if the roles were reversed.


----------



## Entropy3000

Remains said:


> Entropy, I think OP said how he realizes how stupid it was to let his wife get in touch with, speak, text, and finally meet up with her ex. I think he said how each one was a bad decision in his FIRST post.
> 
> I think he knows full well.


My comments are based on his reaction to what he is going through. The aggregate of his posts. He stated he feels it is ok for his wife to have these lunch meetings. That his boundaries were fine. My point is that these boundaries were found NOT to be fine. We could have told him that before the lunch date but some folks have to experience it for themselves unfortunately. Therefore he must adapt or suffer the consequences.
Boundaries have to evolve. We must learn. Being ok with her meeting up with an EX was not fine, but it happened. He should truly know this now yet he defends that it is ok. This is my point. It is very Darwinian.

This is NOT to beat him up. However, it is intended to advise him that he can end up enabling problems by him having less than firm boundaries.


----------



## Entropy3000

lovelygirl said:


> If she learns he's unpredictable then she'll have to take it underground and become more careful. She doesn't need surprises but what she needs is the false security that her husband is unaware of what's going on.
> He needs to keep on playing the fool for a while if he wants harder evidences so that he can catch her red-handed.


She has taken it underground. Being unpredictable is good for a number of reasons. Not the least of which it is being less boring.

Indeed the context of my comment though was the key here. He is advised to show up as a surprise at her convention. He has the cover of it being a surprsie for them to spend some time together. BUT, the primary reason is to catch her red handed. I would lurk for a bit to see what happens. IF the guy is a no show he can then surprise her with his visit. 

But to be sure if and when the guy shows she will insist that there is nothing wrong with his visit and that nothing happened in the room and he spent the night on the other bed and so on. The husband will be expected to be ok with all of that too. She will have it covered. IF she is having an affair it seems to be of the more classical sense. Meaning she intends to cheat.


----------



## Machiavelli

Thor said:


> She has proven to be dishonest with you. If she is cheating, she is also very adept at planning deceptions. So you should never take anything she says at face value. * Always look for alternate possibilities.*
> 
> Perhaps she knew there was incriminating evidence on the home computer, so she let that comment out in order to keep you from snooping until she could get it erased.


I couldn't have said it better myself. Excellent point that should probably be part of the boilerplate here. I couldn't have said it better myself.


----------



## sinnister

WyshIknew said:


> The Audacious Epigone: Infidelity rates by ethnicity
> 
> This survey shows that there was a one percent difference between English female infidelity and Iberian infidelity. I will grant you that it was the English women who were the highest but one percent is hardly conclusive. And who knows how much that dynamic has changed.
> And it does happen here I'm afraid. I actually feel rather bad for them because most of them are job seekers who get poorly paid and badly housed and then they meet a local guy with wads of cash and a nice house and they are gone. Happens to the Latvians too. As I say not nice but it happens.


You're right...this turned into a massive thread jack...but you might want to throw this "study" away.

1. They lump all black people together into one category. If you don't see how the numbers would be skewed already...I don't know what to say but I'll go further.

Here's a direct quote from this "study".


> Black women occupying the top spot among their sex is of little surprise. That black men are second to those from Iberia is unexpected, however. The self-reported cheating rate among Spanish men is peculiarly high, to such an extent that I wonder if it is not a fluke or even the result of a coding error.


Why is it of little surprise? Why is it "unexpected" that black men are second?

This is pure garbage.

Asians are similarly lumped into 1 category. Most whites are seperated by country or region. Next you have "americans" which can comprise all of the above. 

Again...pure garbage.

------

OP, keep your head up. You will get through this. It sounds cliche I know..but you can do it.


----------



## tulsy

Yessongs72 said:


> When do you interpret that she asked me if she could 'go on a date' ? because that was never an interpretion i put on either of her original lunch-time meeting requests.





Yessongs72 said:


> .... she tells me that the OM is on a course in City#1 and would like to meet for lunch - was this OK? etc, etc. "Fine" i reply.



Right there, you said "Fine" to her request to go on an additional date with OM.


----------



## costa200

WyshIknew said:


> The Audacious Epigone: Infidelity rates by ethnicity
> 
> This survey shows that there was a one percent difference between English female infidelity and Iberian infidelity. I will grant you that it was the English women who were the highest but one percent is hardly conclusive. And who knows how much that dynamic has changed.


Are you serious? That data is about descent. American women with different descent. And that can mean that there are generations away from their original culture.

Not to mention that you are going to have some mexicans identifying as "spanish" and some brazillians identifying as portuguese (reasons why they would do that are plentiful) and basically contaminating the whole sample. 

It's no wonder they are all close to one another. These women grew up in America. They are culturally somewhat different but with time differences will wither and be gone. I'm not even going to go into the whole racial prejudice in the analysis. 



> And it does happen here I'm afraid. I actually feel rather bad for them because most of them are job seekers who get poorly paid and badly housed and then they meet a local guy with wads of cash and a nice house and they are gone. Happens to the Latvians too. As I say not nice but it happens.


It doesn't bother me that somewhere you get even with the crap i see over here.


----------



## WyshIknew

Sorry did reply to Costa but realised I said I would not reply so deleted to keep my word.

Sorry OP.


----------



## MattMatt

The vast majority of people who meet up with an ex for lunch, guess what they do? Have lunch. The end.

Sadly there is a minority of them who have lunch and then... cheat. Some of their poor, frightened and worried spouses come here. 

None of the former group comes here. Why would they? They have no problem. But the second group? Like Yessongs, they need help and advice because their spouse decided to play: 'drop the boundaries.'


----------



## FalconKing

MattMatt said:


> The vast majority of people who meet up with an ex for lunch, guess what they do? Have lunch. The end.
> 
> Sadly there is a minority of them who have lunch and then... cheat. Some of their poor, frightened and worried spouses come here.
> 
> None of the former group comes here. Why would they? They have no problem. But the second group? Like Yessongs, they need help and advice because their spouse decided to play: 'drop the boundaries.'


I would not be a big fan of a woman i'm seeing wanting to reminisce and catch up with a man who she used to have sex with. If she cares that much to see him, I will question even considering continuing the relationship.


----------



## Yessongs72

thanks Matt, that is precisely it about the lunch thing. You trust the person you love, trust the person who - in 24 years has never betrayed you before (some will say 'you can't be sure of that', but some say 'trust your gut' and my gut says this is her first affair).

Costa - i am sure her infidelity isn't about 'clock ticking reproduction needs'. She is, i think, doing what is termed 'cake eating', in fact they both are (he is married also). I am sure neither of them have really thought through the consequences of being caught.

Several posters have suggested i engineer a situation where they can meet and i can bust in, I don't think this is that easy (bear in mind cake eating, their affair is mainly EA with occaisional PA) their big 'problem' is geography - he lives 60 miles away, and is married, so they have to carefully plan their meetings. I don't think they will meet again this year. He is in education and this week texted (is that even a word?) her the half-term holiday dates for february. so now i am expecting her to arrange to be on a conference or course one of those weekends (she is a health-care professional and boy do they love their courses and conferences). the course/conference will be some considerable distance from either home, so busting-in not easy. However, this time at least i am pre-warned and therefore in a position to act. I know some people say that if you are even thinking along these lines then the marriage is bust anyway, but has anyone used a semen detection kit to expose their WS?


----------



## theroad

Yessongs72 said:


> Sorry, back to your first question. When do you interpret that she asked me if she could 'go on a date' ? ................
> but the point is on both occaisions the meetings were presented as being (a)very public (b)mid-day (c) platonic (e) fairly short. And i know you (or anyone else) can rip me to shreds on my naivety on those four points but the point is she sought permission and she sought to re-assure.
> 
> Regards


Their not d heads, they must just be stoners. No man with a clear mind would let his wife meet up with an x anything for any reason.


----------



## Entropy3000

MattMatt said:


> The vast majority of people who meet up with an ex for lunch, guess what they do? Have lunch. The end.
> 
> Sadly there is a minority of them who have lunch and then... cheat. Some of their poor, frightened and worried spouses come here.
> 
> None of the former group comes here. Why would they? They have no problem. But the second group? Like Yessongs, they need help and advice because their spouse decided to play: 'drop the boundaries.'


The issue is not the lunch. It is the contact. It is the rekindling of the relationship. Once you have been intimate with someone you share a special connection. Having lunch with an EX lover is continuing a relationship with an EX lover.

Having lunch encourages further and more contact. Again, folks look at EAs happening under their noses and they just see innocent behavior not realizing that the danger, the risk is this innocent behavior. The bonding. Such bonding with an EX lover is taking a huge risk.

Being ok with this activity is its own reward.


----------



## MrK

Yessongs72 said:


> ...this week texted her the half-term holiday dates for february. so now i am expecting her to arrange to be on a conference or course one of those weekends (she is a health-care professional and boy do they love their courses and conferences). the course/conference will be some considerable distance from either home, so busting-in not easy.


You'd better make it easy. I forget, is she open with you about this relationship or is she sneaking? It's an ex, so I'm guessing sneaky. She's going to schedule an overnight trip the same days as his vacation and you find it to hard to try and bust them? Seriously?

Actually, I don't see this affair lasting until February. Not if you listen to ANY of the advice give here.

And why 5 pages anyhow? He's married. Show his wife the cell phone records and let nature take it's course (which is, of COURSE, a WIFE growing a pair. HIS wife. See how fast it ends once she's que'ed in).


----------



## WyshIknew

MrK said:


> You'd better make it easy. I forget, is she open with you about this relationship or is she sneaking? It's an ex, so I'm guessing sneaky. She's going to schedule an overnight trip the same days as his vacation and you find it to hard to try and bust them? Seriously?
> 
> Actually, I don't see this affair lasting until February. Not if you listen to ANY of the advice give here.
> 
> And why 5 pages anyhow? He's married. Show his wife the cell phone records and let nature take it's course (which is, of COURSE, a WIFE growing a pair. HIS wife. See how fast it ends once she's que'ed in).


It just seems so sad that it would take the OM wife to grow a pair and stop this.


----------



## tulsy

MattMatt said:


> The vast majority of people who meet up with an ex for lunch, guess what they do? Have lunch. The end.
> 
> Sadly there is a minority of them who have lunch and then... cheat. Some of their poor, frightened and worried spouses come here.
> 
> None of the former group comes here. Why would they? They have no problem. But the second group? Like Yessongs, they need help and advice because their spouse decided to play: 'drop the boundaries.'


Where are all these people you know who meet up with their ex'es for lunch? What world is this which seems normal to you?

This should never happen...what is the point of meeting up with an ex for lunch when you are in a committed relationship with someone else.

These are called boundaries. A wise man would not be cool with another man sniffing around his significant other, let alone catching up, reminiscing about the good ol' days, looking at each other


----------



## Yessongs72

MtK, there are five pages because this thread got hijacked by what Buffy Summers would call a 'macho p1ss1ng contest' (i do like an opportunity to quote Joss Whedon).

WyshIknew (and others), there is a bit of point missing going on. The tiltle of his thread is 'I really want to be wrong...' but like so many others I Know i am not - occaisional sex is being had by my wh0re wife and her fat b'stard lover (really - he's a porker). My gut tells me this and the evidence tends to suggest this, but the evidence is currently not 'good enough' to PROVE adultery (penetrative sex with a member of the opposite sex) in a UK court. 
If i am right (which i am), i want out, I will divorce her (i just can't get past adultery, it's such a betrayal) - it's not a case of stopping the act - its happened already - its a case of proving the act, best way by catching it next time it happens. Going confrontational now, or involving OM's wife, would temporarily stop them, but in reality would only drive them underground. I honestly think that if i confronted my wife now, with the evidence i have she would lie and lie and lie and lie, maybe admit an EA (which is not adultery in English law, so puts you on the path of a two year seperation before D) but never admit to PA, and she would twist the blame onto me, and i'm not having that.

sorry, that paragraph was a bit long and rambling.

Contacting OM's wife is of course another set of problems to be overcome - i know her name (married and maiden), i know roughly where they live, i've read her Wickipedea page - she's quite attractive for a 53 year old, what is he thinking? d1ck. But they are 'ex directory' so address and land-line number are harder to get hold of (not impossible, just harder), the only contact number i have is OM's mobile (curtesy of the hacking of my wifes mobile) which isn't that useful at the moment. She will learn, and hopefully she'll throw him out on the street. Quite possibly she already suspects?

God, this is turning me into a horrible person. I'm starting to hate myself. Phone hacking, VAR, wondering about semen detection, what a horrid suspicious old git i'm becoming.

The trouble is, when i'm with her - and she with me, i just still want her so much. Love - it can be a dreadful thing sometimes.

It's starting to affect my work, i'm not sleeping properly and i can't always concentrate enough. and thats a real shag 'coz work is the thing i can bury myself in to get away from all this sh1t. And it's making driving potentially dangerous - i was driving to work, with the walkman on shuffle and it gave me a song which just took me back to better days and burning love - i probably should have stopped. And then a few days later i was taking the back roads to my firms Christmas 'do' and driving through a village i realized that back in the 80's OM's mother used to live there and so wife had probably slept with him there then (when he was the item, not the ex) and i had - i dunno - but i just had to get out of there ASAP, not a good way to drive.

sorry to go on so.


----------



## MattMatt

Yessongs72 said:


> thanks Matt, that is precisely it about the lunch thing. You trust the person you love, trust the person who - in 24 years has never betrayed you before (some will say 'you can't be sure of that', but some say 'trust your gut' and my gut says this is her first affair).
> 
> Costa - i am sure her infidelity isn't about 'clock ticking reproduction needs'. She is, i think, doing what is termed 'cake eating', in fact they both are (he is married also). I am sure neither of them have really thought through the consequences of being caught.
> 
> Several posters have suggested i engineer a situation where they can meet and i can bust in, I don't think this is that easy (bear in mind cake eating, their affair is mainly EA with occaisional PA) their big 'problem' is geography - he lives 60 miles away, and is married, so they have to carefully plan their meetings. I don't think they will meet again this year. He is in education and this week texted (is that even a word?) her the half-term holiday dates for february. so now i am expecting her to arrange to be on a conference or course one of those weekends (she is a health-care professional and boy do they love their courses and conferences). the course/conference will be some considerable distance from either home, so busting-in not easy. However, this time at least i am pre-warned and therefore in a position to act. I know some people say that if you are even thinking along these lines then the marriage is bust anyway, but has anyone used a semen detection kit to expose their WS?


If you are at this stage, why bother being Sherlock Holmes? Just confront and file for divorce. Oh, and out both of them to all and sundry.

Bearing in mind the 2 year problem...


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## MattMatt

theroad said:


> Their not d heads, they must just be stoners. No man with a clear mind would let his wife meet up with an x anything for any reason.


Or someone in love who trusts his wife implicitly? 

Throwing out insults is not why most of us come to TAM, now is it?


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## Shaggy

One thing you can do right now is post the OM on cheaterville.com, you can do this without telling your wife.

Create a new email account and use it once to send the link to the OMW. Never use the account again. Forget the password even.

60miles part? That's only 30 miles to meet. That is easy when out on a shopping trip. You should be putting a gps tracker on her car and you shoud be assuming she will be hooking up for a quikie or two over the holidays.

The texts for feb are them arranging future plans for long weekend trips


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## Machiavelli

MattMatt said:


> If you are at this stage, why bother being Sherlock Holmes? Just confront and file for divorce. Oh, and out both of them to all and sundry.
> 
> Bearing in mind the 2 year problem...


Which he says he wants to avoid by going for adultery.

Well, I say go for it, but I liked running investigations back in the day. Look, Yessongs, after you get over that falling elevator feeling in the pit of your stomach when you realize you've been sexually betrayed, you can only go up. If you don't want to do your own investigation get a PI. They'll have proof for you quickly.


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## WyshIknew

Apologies again for the earlier jack Yessongs. I really had to 'bite my tongue' back there as there was so much more I wanted to say. Plus I would have got banned.

You actually sound as though you are doing reasonably well at the moment.

Problem I see is the needing or wanting to wait until you get proof positive of a physical affair. How do you intend doing that?

If you wait till the 'conference' what will that prove unless you actually catch them in bed together? It could be total coincidence that they are there together couldn't it


What if it goes off the boil in the meantime? You may never get the proof you need.

Do you think your wife suspects that you know something. Is she aware of your problem with sleeping etc?

This may tip her off that you suspect something.

I may have missed it, I'll go back and reread, but have you now told her you are not ok with her seeing her old flame?


----------



## Chaparral

Yessongs72 said:


> MtK, there are five pages because this thread got hijacked by what Buffy Summers would call a 'macho p1ss1ng contest' (i do like an opportunity to quote Joss Whedon).
> 
> WyshIknew (and others), there is a bit of point missing going on. The tiltle of his thread is 'I really want to be wrong...' but like so many others I Know i am not - occaisional sex is being had by my wh0re wife and her fat b'stard lover (really - he's a porker). My gut tells me this and the evidence tends to suggest this, but the evidence is currently not 'good enough' to PROVE adultery (penetrative sex with a member of the opposite sex) in a UK court.
> If i am right (which i am), i want out, I will divorce her (i just can't get past adultery, it's such a betrayal) - it's not a case of stopping the act - its happened already - its a case of proving the act, best way by catching it next time it happens. Going confrontational now, or involving OM's wife, would temporarily stop them, but in reality would only drive them underground. I honestly think that if i confronted my wife now, with the evidence i have she would lie and lie and lie and lie, maybe admit an EA (which is not adultery in English law, so puts you on the path of a two year seperation before D) but never admit to PA, and she would twist the blame onto me, and i'm not having that.
> 
> sorry, that paragraph was a bit long and rambling.
> 
> Contacting OM's wife is of course another set of problems to be overcome - i know her name (married and maiden), i know roughly where they live, i've read her Wickipedea page - she's quite attractive for a 53 year old, what is he thinking? d1ck. But they are 'ex directory' so address and land-line number are harder to get hold of (not impossible, just harder), the only contact number i have is OM's mobile (curtesy of the hacking of my wifes mobile) which isn't that useful at the moment. She will learn, and hopefully she'll throw him out on the street. Quite possibly she already suspects?
> 
> God, this is turning me into a horrible person. I'm starting to hate myself. Phone hacking, VAR, wondering about semen detection, what a horrid suspicious old git i'm becoming.
> 
> The trouble is, when i'm with her - and she with me, i just still want her so much. Love - it can be a dreadful thing sometimes.
> 
> It's starting to affect my work, i'm not sleeping properly and i can't always concentrate enough. and thats a real shag 'coz work is the thing i can bury myself in to get away from all this sh1t. And it's making driving potentially dangerous - i was driving to work, with the walkman on shuffle and it gave me a song which just took me back to better days and burning love - i probably should have stopped. And then a few days later i was taking the back roads to my firms Christmas 'do' and driving through a village i realized that back in the 80's OM's mother used to live there and so wife had probably slept with him there then (when he was the item, not the ex) and i had - i dunno - but i just had to get out of there ASAP, not a good way to drive.
> 
> sorry to go on so.


You are obviously goingto unintentionally send all these signals to you wife. When she asks you whats wrong, tell her you can't stop the feeling someone close is stabbing me in the back and my life is going to go through catastrophic change.

In this country 60miles is nothing. A half hour to meet half way, half hour tryst, half hour back for a total of half an hour.

Or one could go the full 60 miles in less than an hour.

How is she acting around you now? I am expecting her radar is already on full alert. 

Feeling bad about the detective work, ie protecting your family,is as bizarre as not knowing the definition of a date. A good woman would not even ask to go on one. She already had an idea what would happen. A good woman would not even want to "catch up", she would have at least taken you with her.


----------



## Chaparral

We have heard this kind of plan before. Sorry, but you won't be able to handle it all the way to Feb. You might as well start making a new plan now.


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## happyman64

Hey Yes,

Get tough. Make some plans. Stop fretting over what has already occurred.

And nail her in the act.

You have 2 months to get all in order.

1. Secure finances. Open a new account so when you have your proof you can secure your $ over night.

2. Get OMW contact info so when you get your proof you can contact her immediately with the evidence. 

3. Have a plan in place to expose the Affair to your families if you have chosen to Divorce her. If she is going to these lengths to deceive you, then go to those lengths to expose them.

4. See a solicitor so you know your rights. If you get your proof hit her with legal papers, a fair custody plan while she is in shock. 

5. Have a plan in place after exposure for her to go somewhere to stay. She no longer gets to be part of your marriage or family. Take her creature comforts away.

No matter what happens do not tolerate her lies. Get your proof. Have a plan and execute it.

Never look back, only forward.

That should consume your time quite nicely.

Do not tip her off.

HM64


----------



## Remains

Is she in contact through anything other than texts? Email? Message app? Chatting in the car? Did you get a VAR?


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## theroad

MattMatt said:


> Or someone in love who trusts his wife implicitly?
> 
> Throwing out insults is not why most of us come to TAM, now is it?


The Dhead was used by some one else.

My stoned referrence meant that there must be some reason for a husband to use such poor judgement.

X's don't just drop in out of the blue to talk.

They want another ride with a woman from their past. They are big game hunters on the hunt for some female cat.

This is why any husband with half a brain will not allow any meetings with any X's, alone or with him there. There is not point to allow the OM a fishing expedition.

It is only the wanna be WW or WW that plays the you are too controlling card. This card is played because these WW's want enough freedom to get it on with the OM.

Even when a wife has no intention of cheating she does not complain about their husband being controlling. Know that their husbands are only protecting what is his. That there is a reason why her old flame is an X. She knows that her husband is making sure the barn doors are kept locked before there is a theft.


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## WyshIknew

If all else fails and you can't get the evidence, exposing to the OMW may give you the evidence you need as once the OMW gets her teeth into the POSOM he may 'spill the beans'. If the OMW and you can synchronise evidence it may be enough especially if you can find anything out about the previous hotel stay, even perhaps from the hotel itself.

But it's going to be hellish to last until February, you are already suffering because of this, will it get worse?

What are you going to be doing about sex? Can you bring yourself to have sex if as you say physical adultery is a deal breaker. If you have had regular sex your wife will surely be suspicious or concerned when you withdraw sex


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## Yessongs72

Sorry to be so tardy, i can't spend every night huddled over the pc. anyway.

Matt - if i confront with the evidence i have, i am going to get lies, lies, lies and lies. i must have something that is so CERTAIN, that it will just shut her up.

HM64 - as i've tried to explain before, the English courts take a different view to USA on parenting, and believe that in most cases the 'best interests of the children' are best served by them staying wit the mother, unless it can be proved she is a 'bad' parent - and adultery (apparently) does not make her a bad mother (despite not for one minute thinking about the consequences for her children when she dropped her knickers for OM).

Remains - VAR arrived today, charging now, will be in her car ready foe her monday evening phone call to fat boy.

Chaparal - Quote "In this country 60miles is nothing. A half hour to meet half way, half hour tryst, half hour back for a total of half an hour.

Or one could go the full 60 miles in less than an hour." 

agreed. I've been to the USA and when i got home (after 2 weeks) was totally freeked-out by the English traffic. Even in a car like yours (assuming the car in the picture is yours) your gonna have to work some to even get a 30mph average during the day in the English 'home counties'. And half hour tryst - she's gonna spend the first half hour whingeing about something i did, they need an hour. Even with half hour she's got to find at least 2.5 for a casual meet, not so easy (but not impossible).

Wysh - Sex, difficult but all the time i'm in this lieing 'detective' mode i've got to carry on as normally as i can. But it is'nt so good - the Saturday after 'City #2' she initiated sex and i so wanted to just shout at her and ask about her and fatboy (never ask, confront with truth) that i had trouble, i couldn't stay hard for her.
WTF.

i seem to be in a bad place at the moment.


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## MattMatt

Yessongs, you are in a bloody awkward and difficult situation. Do keep us updated.

Could you expose the OM?


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## Yessongs72

i am working on gettiing contact details for OM's wife. they are ex-directory which makes it more difficult. you think 'ooo, got it' then hit another wall. when i think about it i would expect that my wife has his address written down somewhere, probably in an address book she keeps at work? i will let this poor woman know what this POS is doing to her.

thanks


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## Machiavelli

Yessongs,

Keep you're cool and keep investigating. Don't settle for the long distance runaround. You get your proof and after that, it's your move. You're not fragile, and yours is no disgrace. Be careful in the roundabout and don't be getting close to the edge.


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## turnera

One thing I'd like to point out, once you gain your evidence, it's not that you want to 'shut her up' (in other words "make her stop"). You can't do that. You can't control another person. This is a pipe dream. More than likely she'll just say 'Fine! You're right! I LOVE HIM! And I'm leaving for him.'

The only chance you have at this is to get the evidence, TELL HER you have the evidence, and tell her you want her to stop. When she refuses (she will), you then tell her important people what she's doing and ask them to talk to her. And if that doesn't work, you then say I won't accept you cheating on me. If you don't stop, I'm separating.

I know you think you can't do that. That you will lose your children - you won't. You may not LIVE with them, but they will still be your kdis and they will still love you. 

But until you are ready to LOSE your wife, you will never have hre respect and her desire.


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## Yessongs72

turnera

i used the term 'shut her up' alongside the statement that if i confront without firm evidence she will lie - by 'shut her up' i meant 'stop the lies'. as i have previously said if PA then its over (although i accept that i also am a mixed-up, messed-up mass of contadictions and it won't be that simple).

also, i have previously clarified the 'lose the kids' to 'lose custody of the kids'.

i don't think i'll ever be 'ready' to divorce (who is?), but i am prepared to go down that path.


----------



## The Cro-Magnon

Yessongs72 said:


> turnera
> 
> i used the term 'shut her up' alongside the statement that if i confront without firm evidence she will lie - by 'shut her up' i meant 'stop the lies'. as i have previously said if PA then its over (although i accept that i also am a mixed-up, messed-up mass of contadictions and it won't be that simple).
> 
> also, i have previously clarified the 'lose the kids' to 'lose custody of the kids'.
> 
> i don't think i'll ever be 'ready' to divorce (who is?), but i am prepared to go down that path.


"You are never as trapped as you think you are"

As my friend's father says.


----------



## theroad

When you get your info never reveal your sources.


----------



## Chaparral

I would not be able to resist helping her count down the days. Like every morning giving it the 10 9 8 7 6 etc. When she asks what is going on I would say,you know the BIG weekend.......with my kids, along with a cold dead stare.


----------



## Chaparral

turnera said:


> One thing I'd like to point out, once you gain your evidence, it's not that you want to 'shut her up' (in other words "make her stop"). You can't do that. You can't control another person. This is a pipe dream. More than likely she'll just say 'Fine! You're right! I LOVE HIM! And I'm leaving for him.'
> 
> The only chance you have at this is to get the evidence, TELL HER you have the evidence, and tell her you want her to stop. When she refuses (she will), you then tell her important people what she's doing and ask them to talk to her. And if that doesn't work, you then say I won't accept you cheating on me. If you don't stop, I'm separating.
> 
> I know you think you can't do that. That you will lose your children - you won't. You may not LIVE with them, but they will still be your kdis and they will still love you.
> 
> But until you are ready to LOSE your wife, you will never have hre respect and her desire.


I'm going to have to disagree with Turnera on this one. This is really going to hit the fan. I don't believe this has anything to do with love, just a wee bit of occasional fun. I don't believe either one realizes this is the end of their families as they know it.


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## Shaggy

My advice is to not confront your wife at all at first. 

Instead take all the evidence when you get it, take it to the OMW and hand it to her at her home, then just drive away leaving your cell phone number with her.

then go home and if you can monitor your wife's location and a cell phone/texting activity.

ideally you'd be able to hear her on a var in her car when she talks down the OM from him freaking out.

You'll hear a lot of how she really feels about the marriage during that call.

You might even want to be away from home when she comes home - and have a var positioned to record her comments when she finds you aren't there. 

these will also reveal her state of mind and her plans to deal with you.

Frankly the longer you can be away and stay dark on her the better - a couple of days will leave her very shaken. The OM will dump her to save his own hide. She'll be alone without the ability to deal with you, so the couple of days of you being dark will leave her much more dealt with than anything you could possibly say to her.


----------



## Hope Springs Eternal

Machiavelli said:


> Yessongs,
> 
> Keep you're cool and keep investigating. Don't settle for the long distance runaround. You get your proof and after that, it's your move. You're not fragile, and yours is no disgrace. Be careful in the roundabout and don't be getting close to the edge.


Love the Yes quotes there...


----------



## Machiavelli

Hope Springs Eternal said:


> Love the Yes quotes there...


I thought nobody was going to notice.


----------



## alte Dame

Machiavelli said:


> I thought nobody was going to notice.


'Roundabout' reference was masterful. (Now I've got that song in my head for the day....)


----------



## Louise7

Machiavelli said:


> I thought nobody was going to notice.


I was going for the one, so I waited


----------



## Yessongs72

Chapparal - i believe you are right, except that when the hammer goes down it's going to hit all four of us.

Shaggy - when i have the firm evidence (and her contact details)and can expose to OMW , i think i've got to be extremely delicate, its not going to be good news for her, and i certainly don't think i can bottle out and leave the conflict to her.

Louise - sorry to be picky, but going for the one is later than yessongs (sad, or what)


----------



## Shaggy

Yessongs72 said:


> Chapparal - i believe you are right, except that when the hammer goes down it's going to hit all four of us.
> 
> Shaggy - when i have the firm evidence (and her contact details)and can expose to OMW , i think i've got to be extremely delicate, its not going to be good news for her, and i certainly don't think i can bottle out and leave the conflict to her.
> 
> Louise - sorry to be picky, but going for the one is later than yessongs (sad, or what)


You don't need to go dark on the OMW, just on your wife.

See, when you expose she will at first deny. Then she will blame you, then she will get angry etc....

non of that drama helps you, the marriage, or her. I'm simply suggesting you remove yourself during the pointless lies and drama and only return to talk to her when she is actually ready to talk about what she has done and what she is going to do to fix it.


----------



## Yessongs72

Shaggy - thanks for your clarification. I don't know how the eventual confrontation will pan out, but yes i will get out before she turns it all on me. I do feel really sorry for OMW, she is going to have to deal with all this crap in one go, i at least have got this 'finding-out-the-truth investigation' period to attempt to come to terms with everything (not doing very well).

i've tested my new VAR, its very small and kinda rubbish - but it records and the playback is intelligible. Its going in her car tonight ready for tomorrows shopping run (since hacking her mobile i know that they often have a twenty minute call while she is in the supermarket car park - even hiding it from her work friends now)


----------



## happyman64

Stay strong Yes.

We all know this is not easy. 

Good luck tomorrow.

And no matter what you hear on the VAR do not say anything to your wife.

Come back here to vent and get advice.


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## Yessongs72

VAR installed, of course - due to school Christmas activities and me working later than normal - she had to take the kids shopping, so no 20 minute phone call to POSOM. Kinda glad about that. She goes out tonight as well (local 'keep fit' class, nothing hidden) so she has another opportunity to call fatboy.

More importantly (for me) i decided this morning that i had better tell my department manager what is going on - if i think its affecting my work performance then sure as hell others have noticed. He was very understanding and i feel in a bit of a better place.


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## happyman64

Good move telling the boss.

And no matter what you hear do ot on front her.

Vent here.....


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## Yessongs72

OK, lets vent...

so last night i was doing the daily 'check her texts' thing, and among all the mundane lunch-time stuff (her sister, the childminder, etc was a text to POSOM "TOY" was all it said, and then the immediate reply "TOYT". Thought at first it was some secret code between them (thinking too deeply), but this morning as i was making my daughters packed-lunch i realised it was a simple acronym - "Thinking Of You" and "Thinking Of You Too".
THINKING OF YOU - what a 'king b1tch, that bugged me all the drive to work and is just going to eat me all day. Thanks b1tch.


----------



## Louise7

Yessongs72 said:


> OK, lets vent...
> 
> so last night i was doing the daily 'check her texts' thing, and among all the mundane lunch-time stuff (her sister, the childminder, etc was a text to POSOM "TOY" was all it said, and then the immediate reply "TOTY". Thought at first it was some secret code between them (thinking too deeply), but this morning as i was making my daughters packed-lunch i realised it was a simple acronym - "Thinking Of You" and "Thinking Of You Too".
> THINKING OF YOU - what a 'king b1tch, that bugged me all the drive to work and is just going to eat me all day. Thanks b1tch.


What's that phrase - 'Don't get made, get even?' Do you still have the VAR in her car? With Christmas coming up and a lot of 'family time' ahead, it is as well to keep it running. I'd also get one for the house and probably hide it in the bathroom. They will 'need' to communicate with each other over Christmas.


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## Chaparral

Actually, I could not wait that long. I would send her a message, now. "TOYT, but in an entirely new way"

You have all I would need to demand no contact, travel plans stopped or get out, and full disclosure. On second thought, I would send her the message when she got home and then take her phone from her. But that's just me. I refuse to be played for a fool.

I would also send him and his wife a message.


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## turnera

Why haven't you exposed yet?


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## Chaparral

Have you read this thread? You should confront her and demand complete transparency. You have all you need to know.

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/63187-short-term-text-flirting.html


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## 3putt

chapparal said:


> Actually, I could not wait that long. *I would send her a message, now. "TOYT, but in an entirely new way"*
> 
> You have all I would need to demand no contact, travel plans stopped or get out, and full disclosure. On second thought, I would send her the message when she got home and then take her phone from her. But that's just me. I refuse to be played for a fool.
> 
> I would also send him and his wife a message.


I would send it exactly the way your WW sent it to OM. It will send her into a tailspin panic.


----------



## Chaparral

3putt said:


> I would send it exactly the way your WW sent it to OM. It will send her into a tailspin panic.


And the thing is she will have no idea what he knows but that the cat is definitely out of the bag.

If you are determined to divorce however, you can wait till you get more proof.

OTOH, you might want to put a stop to it before it gets worse.


----------



## 3putt

chapparal said:


> And the thing is she will have no idea what he knows but that the cat is definitely out of the bag.
> 
> If you are determined to divorce however, you can wait till you get more proof.
> 
> OTOH, you might want to put a stop to it before it gets worse.


Exactly.


----------



## Yessongs72

chapparal said:


> If you are determined to divorce however, you can wait till you get more proof.
> 
> OTOH, you might want to put a stop to it before it gets worse.


i believe it cant get worse

The thing is this, i am sure she has fvcked POSOM. I KNOW IT. I prefer to use the term fvcked, it hurts me way less than 'had sex with' and way way less than 'made love'. I know it - but for several reasons i need to prove it 'beyond reasonable doubt' and i don't think any number of texts do that. 

Reason #1: When i can prove adultery, i am going to divorce her and in UK divorce for adultery can be much quicker than most other situations. However adultery (in English law) is 'sexual intercourse with member of opposite sex who is not marriage partner' - EA is not considered to be adultery.

Reason #2:The texts and long phone calls prove EA and if i confront now you can be damn sure thats all she is going to admit to (how many threads have you read where WS admits EA then truth trickles out over months/years, NC is secretly compromised, etc). If i expose now i feel i am setting myself up for a long, drawn-out end of marriage.

Reason #3: If we split over EA we have to live 2 years before proceedings can begin. I'm in my fifties, i cant hang about for two years (OK, selfish, but). If both parties agree then, for adultery, proceedings can begin after 3 months

Reason #4: If we split over EA, despite exposure i'm going to end up getting a lot of blame as she will lie to all and sundrie. I will be accused of over-reacting and encouraged to R (whereas i in fact believe PA not EA).

Reason #5: She has two older sisters, and they are all a bit (a lot) controlling and competetive. When i can expose her to them with undeniable, concrete evidence of her extra-marital sexual activity, they are going to (over many years) give her so much sh1t about it. i find that thought oddly satisfying.


----------



## Yessongs72

That last post makes me look like some callous unfeeling tw&t. I'm just taking this whole thing badly (TOY/TOYT = AAAAAAAAGGGG) and she is carrying-on serenely like everythings perfectly normal and OK. She is living the lie very well. Yet I KNOW that in City #2 they spent the night together. My wife is fvcking another man and its beating me down so hard.


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## Will_Kane

Yessongs72 said:


> That last post makes me look like some callous unfeeling tw&t. I'm just taking this whole thing badly (TOY/TOYT = AAAAAAAAGGGG) and she is carrying-on serenely like everythings perfectly normal and OK. She is living the lie very well. Yet I KNOW that in City #2 they spent the night together. My wife is fvcking another man and its beating me down so hard.


I thought that was your best post yet. Finally explains why you're doing what you're doing.

How long until they're supposed to meet up again?


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## WyshIknew

Yessongs72 said:


> That last post makes me look like some callous unfeeling tw&t. I'm just taking this whole thing badly (TOY/TOYT = AAAAAAAAGGGG) and she is carrying-on serenely like everythings perfectly normal and OK. She is living the lie very well. Yet I KNOW that in City #2 they spent the night together. My wife is fvcking another man and its beating me down so hard.


Brit here as well, still up at mo.

This is why earlier in the thread I warned that waiting to get final, absolute conclusive proof was going to be very draining on you.
I think you mentioned February before you *might * get the proof?

Hell man, you are freaking out now. This going to get worse and worse.


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## Yessongs72

Wysh

it is going to get worse, its one of the reasons i let my boss know what is going on. But if i confront and expose now she'll claim EA and it'll be awful forever (or until such time as the truth finally trickles out)


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## 3putt

Yessongs72 said:


> That last post makes me look like some callous unfeeling tw&t.


I beg to differ. It makes you look like what you are. A loyal, loving husband that has been absolutely crushed by the individual that was the object of your love and loyalty.

That's not being a callous, unfeeling tw&t. That's just being human.


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## Acabado

Provide them the opportunity. Make it irresistible. Fake a 3-4 days travel. Do it with time enough they can arrange a meeting.


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## WyshIknew

Yessongs72 said:


> Wysh
> 
> it is going to get worse, its one of the reasons i let my boss know what is going on. But if i confront and expose now she'll claim EA and it'll be awful forever (or until such time as the truth finally trickles out)


But will she not realise something is going on?

I think you have mentioned you have avoided her sexually? Is that right?
You must also have problems interacting with her on a day to day basis. She is going to want to know what is going on if your normal daily interaction has changed. If your normal desire for sex has dropped. She may even suspect that you know what is going on.


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## happyman64

Yessongs72 said:


> Wysh
> 
> it is going to get worse, its one of the reasons i let my boss know what is going on. But if i confront and expose now she'll claim EA and it'll be awful forever (or until such time as the truth finally trickles out)


Yes

Why do you think they both will deny it? Does your wife want out of the marriage? Has she ever discussed divorce?

Hm


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## Yessongs72

Wysh

i meant it'll be awful forever because if i confronted/exposed and she admitted EA (she would obviously know i knew something) but D would take longer, there would be pressure (family, etc) to reconcile, the truth 'trickling out' is the gradual uncovering of the EA lie - that it is in fact PA. (a scenario which is seen in many TAM threads)

with regard to sex, i can not withdraw from my husbandly duties - she would know something was up. it is quite normal for sexual activity to reduce (and increase) on some sort of cyclical pattern so a slight reduction goes un-noticed. i did mention that i had had trouble maintaining an erection for her (disgust can do that to you) but if that happens then i can satisfy her orally (which sometimes leaves me with the hideous thought that i may be licking POSOM's juices - apparently still there for at least 72 hours)


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## WyshIknew

Yessongs72 said:


> Wysh
> 
> i meant it'll be awful forever because if i confronted/exposed and she admitted EA (she would obviously know i knew something) but D would take longer, there would be pressure (family, etc) to reconcile, the truth 'trickling out' is the gradual uncovering of the EA lie - that it is in fact PA. (a scenario which is seen in many TAM threads)
> 
> with regard to sex, i can not withdraw from my husbandly duties - she would know something was up. it is quite normal for sexual activity to reduce (and increase) on some sort of cyclical pattern so a slight reduction goes un-noticed. i did mention that i had had trouble maintaining an erection for her (disgust can do that to you) but if that happens then i can satisfy her orally (which sometimes leaves me with the hideous thought that i may be licking POSOM's juices - apparently still there for at least 72 hours)


Well without wishing to descend into porn if you just concentrate on the clitoral area you should be fine.


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## Yessongs72

Happyman

i think they are both cake eating. POSOM is also married man. A common text from POSOM is to tell WS when his wife is out of house - so WS can phone him (its 60 miles, she cant just nip out and drop round)

she has never discussed divorce


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## Gabriel

Look, you are going to torture yourself for the rest of your life if you don't do something drastic right now.

Either hire a private investigator to have her followed and pictures taken, or, just tell you you've done this, and know what she's done, and that you're saving the evidence for court.

At that point, then, do a 180 (if not done yet, someone please post the link to the 180). The 180 helps you detach, and look strong. It works wonders. Your wife will likely beg for your attention very quickly once implemented. Do not do the 180 until you've confronted her, or else it won't work and just be confusing.


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## 3putt

Acabado said:


> Provide them the opportunity. Make it irresistible. Fake a 3-4 days travel. Do it with time enough they can arrange a meeting.


I'm with Acabado. The way your mindset is right now, and rightfully so, there is no way you can keep this up indefinitely and keep her in the dark of your knowledge of what's going on. It's already wearing on you to the point of snapping. It's palpable, my friend. And we're only online.

I think you need to set a trap to expedite exposing the physical nature of this. If you are in on this, we can all brainstorm and come up with a plan of action.

What do you think?


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## Yessongs72

Gabriel

They meet infrequently, however next time they do PI option is right up there as the thing to do. Yes i will torture myself about all this, but not for the rest of my life - they are going to engineer a meeting fairly early in the new year. Then this part of my pain will end - though i suspect it will be replaced by a whole new set of bad things.

anyway its way to late now, so i'm going to put the re-charged VAR back in her car, and 'turn in'.


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## Shaggy

An net resting way to confront her and expose her woud be to tell her you are taking her on a trip. Make sure the route went through the PO
SOMs town. Then at the last minute while going through the town call the OMW on the cell and tell her you have a skate to drop off st her house for her husband. Then drive to the POSOM house. Get your wife to get out of car with you, and lock the door o she cant get back in.

As you drive away tell the OMW this is woman who is having n affair with your husband.

See this works because supposedly your wife has ever been to his house, so she won't realize who's house you are stopping at.


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## Shaggy

Btw get two cars so you can swap them on/out.


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## Yessongs72

Shaggy said:


> Btw get two cars so you can swap them on/out.


i dont quite understand this - do you mean two VAR's? (v and c are next to each other so simple typo)


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## Chaparral

Yes he meant VAR. Spelling around here sometimes goes to hell depending on what peolpe are typing on. My own keyboard is dyslexic.

Two Vars is so you can put one in when you take one out. Many use another VAR to put in the bathroom or other place where the WW likes to talk on the phone. The car is best because everyone feels alone and safe there. Many waywards use the bathroom.


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## husbandfool

two vars is a lot cheaper than two cars!


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## Yessongs72

husbandfool - depends on the car, i've had some cheap sh1tboxes in my time.

Anyway - i'm not sure a second VAR would help much, the one in her car re-charges while i download so is ready when i need it. One at home would be fruitless (+ extra risk of it being found) - the best place to have one would be her office, but she doesn't even call him much from work when other people are around. The call records from her hacked phone show this. If she works on a Saturday she'll call him from office as the woman she shares office with never works sats, otherwise she calls him from car whilst doing the weekly 'shop'. They do email each other (only) from work - which is why keylogging the home PC would also be fruitless waste of time.

Patience. I will catch them. Christmas is a pain because its screwing all the normal behaviour patterns, but i will find them out.


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## Chaparral

What if they haven't done the deed yet? It doesn't sound like they are going crazy texting and calling like most affair partners do. You might be able to stop it before it happens.


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## Yessongs72

Chapparal - damn, i had a long, involved reply to this - then hit the wrong button and lost it. No time now, back to work. But i am sure they have fvcked, i have no doubts.


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## Shaggy

Yes var. damn iPad keyboard


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## Yessongs72

Hasn't been a great couple of days, but a couple of things today have lightened my mood slightly.

1: we were at a Christmas event this evening, and WW was just interacting with all without a care - and i suddenly realized (a) how much SHE is going to lose, (b) She hasn't got a clue i know. Its going to hit hard and come out of nowhere when i gt the evidence that enables me to confront/expose. (i know it wont be good for me either, but at least i know its coming)

2: I have got POSOM's home address - which i need (obviously) to pass all evidence on to his poor wife. Unfortuneately i don't yet have a phone number for her, but even finally getting the address was such a relief.


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## 3putt

Yessongs72 said:


> 2: I have got POSOM's home address - which i need (obviously) to pass all evidence on to his poor wife. Unfortuneately i don't yet have a phone number for her, but even finally getting the address was such a relief.


Who needs a damned phone number when you can time it to see her personally and (hopefully) when POSOM shows up.

Buddy, sorry you're having to deal with this at this time of year. My last Dday was 6 days before Christmas 2003, and I still haven't gotten over it fully. I hate this time of year. Trigger Central.

And, for the record, I hate that I hate the holidays. I used to love them.

Oh well.


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## happyman64

Patience Yes.

Everything will come together in time.

And do not feel bad about the On my way!.

She will want to know in the end what a piece of crap her H really is.


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## turnera

If you have OMW's address, just freakin' go see her.


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## Shaggy

You can go see her when her husband is off being with your wife for instance. 

If you have a name and address why can't you use the old phone book or directory assistance?


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## Yessongs72

Shaggy said "If you have a name and address why can't you use the old phone book or directory assistance?"

because she is (they are) 'ex-directory' which means their number isn't in the book and directory enquiries will not give it to you. Even getting the address cost me a tenner.


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## Chaparral

Yessongs72 said:


> Shaggy said "If you have a name and address why can't you use the old phone book or directory assistance?"
> 
> because she is (they are) 'ex-directory' which means their number isn't in the book and directory enquiries will not give it to you. Even getting the address cost me a tenner.


I don't know if they have it there, but in the US it has been mentioned here that you can have a process server take them a letter. I have no experience with it, but you might check it out. In person is the best way though. It might be more compassionate too.


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## Shamwow

Yessongs72 said:


> However, this time at least i am pre-warned and therefore in a position to act. I know some people say that if you are even thinking along these lines then the marriage is bust anyway, but has anyone used a semen detection kit to expose their WS?


Way late to the thread, but if no one else addressed this:

I did. The panties came back positive. Granted, I'd been gone and dark for like 5 days by the time the results came in, but it sure made it easy to move forward. Just make sure you haven't been with her for a while, or you'll have to pony up for a DNA test too.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Yessongs72

OK, its Christmas day and i just need to vent...

so we are driving home from a Christmas morning church service, and the kids are really getting a bt shouty about wanting to visit a playground we pass on the way home. and she caves (unusual), we detour and park up - the playground is 50% flooded (its been a fairly soggy week here in UK) so i'm sent out with them to keep an eye on them as she 'has to phone her sisters' (OK, you can see where this is going).

To be fair when i checked the my phone-kacking-site she had phoned her sisters, but also (while i was getting wet and cold) indulged in a bit of text activity with POSOM. Happy bloody Christmas.

(i just keep chanting the mantra "catch the b1tch in bed with her boyfriend" then it will end - and the real sh1te will begin)


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## walkonmars

Incredible. The worm will turn.


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## Chaparral

Has she said anything about you acting differently..? Yout must be a great actor.
So sorry about your Christmas. Good luck and prayers for your family


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## Yessongs72

chapparal said:


> Has she said anything about you acting differently..? Yout must be a great actor.
> So sorry about your Christmas. Good luck and prayers for your family


She hasn,t - but i'm sure i am (acting differently). for example - yesterday we went on the traditional (Her)family boxing day walk. All the in-laws. My nine year old daughter doing one of her favourite things - hanging with her twenty-something gurly cousins. and i was just a bit detached from it all, a bit overwhelmed with a sadness that i was going to be losing all these people i've come to love over the years. Luckily the weather was really crap so it was all hats and waterproofs which made detachment much harder to detect.

On the other hand - her acting is really peachy, 1st class. Cow!


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## Chaparral

Are you sure you don't want to break this up and save your family?


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## Yessongs72

I'm sure that when i have the undeniable evidence (next time they get together) i will tell her it is finished. i am sure that there will then be a mighty argument/pleading, with the children being the cornerstone of her reasoning that we should reconcile.

and i am sure that it wont only be her telling me that i should 'think of the children', which is all well and good - but why wasn't she thinking of the children on the 7th of November when she climbed into that hotel bed with fatboy POSOM? this eats me.


----------



## committedwife

Yessongs72 said:


> I'm sure that when i have the undeniable evidence (next time they get together) i will tell her it is finished. i am sure that there will then be a mighty argument/pleading, with the children being the cornerstone of her reasoning that we should reconcile.
> 
> and i am sure that it wont only be her telling me that i should 'think of the children', which is all well and good - but why wasn't she thinking of the children on the 7th of November when she climbed into that hotel bed with fatboy POSOM? this eats me.


I am late to this thread, but you already have undeniable evidence, do you not? You don't have to prove anything to your wife - she already knows she's having an affair.


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## Yessongs72

cw - the undeniable evidence i have would certainly prove an EA, and a cake eating liar is only going to admit to what can be proven. 

I am in the UK and the divorce laws allow a much quicker D for adultery (which HAS to be full PA) than for most other reasons - EA would require two year seperation before process can begin, PA can start immediately if both parties agree or after three month seperation if one partner does not agree.

If i seperated from her because of EA, i am going to have two years of pressure to R from many parties (probably including myself), whilst all the time knowing in my gut that the WW has fvcked POSOM

And if their relationship really is EA, then i could forgive and attempt R. i just know it isn't.

Even the text evidence from before Nov 7th is deleted - i saw it, but this was before i was hacking her phone so have later stuff recorded. The alarm bell ringing '32 days to go - ' was on her old phone. The sending him the 'hotel name' text was deleted next day (she had left the phone in her car, i really wasn't meant to see that one).

No, i NEED proof of PA. i sound harsh, but in reality every day i have to wait is a day headed downwards

and then, when i read some of the other threads on this site - the awful, awful ways some of you guys have been treated by people who are just fvcking horrible - i'm kinda glad my WW and her POSOM are a pair of older, cake-eaters, treading very carefully (because neither wants 'out' of their marriage). its still not good though.

sorry about the grammar ad punctuation - its 3 in the morning here, and i'm dead.


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## walkonmars

"...older cake eaters treading very carefully ..."

I had to lol at that. Guess you missed the thread of the 65 yr old wife banging the 25 yr old sailor. Cheaters have NO boundaries and aren't always discreet.


----------



## See_Listen_Love

Yessongs72 said:


> And if their relationship really is EA, then i could forgive and attempt R. i just know it isn't.
> 
> No, i NEED proof of PA. i sound harsh, but in reality every day i have to wait is a day headed downwards
> 
> sorry about the grammar ad punctuation - its 3 in the morning here, and i'm dead.


OP, you have grown over this thread to doing things so well, please keep going that way some more. Hold on!

Just go step by step, and now is the time to gather evidence. Do this good, and it will be a base for a healthy mind further down the road. 

Whether with her or without her.

Success is on the way, do not mess things up because of your, very understandable, miserable state of mind now.

Many threads on these forums have show the right way to do things, and you do that now. I wish I could do more, but I only can pray for your mental strength, or your capability to bear misery in these day's of the year.


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## Yessongs72

walkonmars said:


> "...older cake eaters treading very carefully ..."
> 
> I had to lol at that. Guess you missed the thread of the 65 yr old wife banging the 25 yr old sailor. Cheaters have NO boundaries and aren't always discreet.


I haven't read this post but have read others, i know that often cheaters in an affair do take 'risks' in order to see each other and have sex, but at the moment my WW and her POSOM are being discreet and making sure they are legitemately away from home when they meet (at least WW is, i don't know or care what excuse POSOM is giving his poor wife). Hell, if they were going at it like bunny rabbits they'd be a sight easier to catch. Their major 'mistake' is that they are using their 'regular' mobile phones (rather than spending a few pounds on a PAYG i'd know nothing about)


----------



## Chaparral

*
I have (rather too late i fear) applied a little technology and now can read the texts at my convenience, i also now know that they regularly phone each other - averaging about an hour a week.*

Though you can read the texts. you haven't found any smoking guns, I love yous etc. ? Why do you think that is?


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## Chaparral

Have you decided on/found a PI to get your evidence? Even if he he doesn't catch them you have to stop their communication.


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## Thor

Yessongs72 said:


> I am in the UK and the divorce laws allow a much quicker D for adultery (which HAS to be full PA) than for most other reasons - EA would require two year seperation before process can begin, PA can start immediately if both parties agree or after three month seperation if one partner does not agree.


OK here is a really delicate question, given the forum audience here.....

Does it have to be _her_ PA to trigger a quick divorce?

In other words, if you are determined to D (and I would but it is your decision), and if a PA gets a quick D, would some kind of "proof" of _you_ having a PA be sufficient for _you_ to force the D? Or is it only the betrayed spouse who can force the quick D?

Also, is there some creative way to force her to confess? Perhaps a bit risky you could confront her as if you know and see what she confesses. Or you could confront her and demand she take a polygraph (but I think this tact is high risk of failure to get proof). What about POSOM's wife as a source? Do you think she knows and perhaps has proof of PA? Is there a friend or relative of hers you know is enabling who you could talk to? That toxic friend will certainly tell her you know, and the your wife might confess to you?

Alternatively perhaps you can find a way to enable them to get together sooner so you can get proof sooner.


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## WyshIknew

If she suspects nothing could you book a hotel for you and her, but engineer a work situation or whatever where you have to stay home?
Then suggest that she uses the hotel for a little shopping trip on her own and you'll join her the next day.


----------



## Yessongs72

chapparal said:


> *
> I have (rather too late i fear) applied a little technology and now can read the texts at my convenience, i also now know that they regularly phone each other - averaging about an hour a week.*
> 
> Though you can read the texts. you haven't found any smoking guns, I love yous etc. ? Why do you think that is?


I have seen plenty of texts that are 'smoking guns/red flags', i just don't feel the need to copy them to this thread. Plenty of 'XXX' kisses - one recently (from her) quickly replied to (by POSOM) with "i hope to cash those in soon". In a reply in another thread i mentioned the recent TOY/TOYT. And howsabout (just before i started hacking her phone so could only read the first line of a deleted text) the quite horrible "i'd better delete this straight away ..." this was in the weeek after 'city #2'. (i need a way of retrieving full deleted texts from her phone - Samsung Galaxy Ace).

WW is "the only one i (POSOM) want to play with"

WW may be rubbish with technology, but.. "don't worry, some things you excell at"

I could quote more, and i know some will say thats more than enough - but all they PROOVE is text-sex EA. They hurt.

but mainly they text to make sure the coast is clear for a phone call. e.g "A (POSOM wife) out until 8.30" - "OK, leaving work to shop at 7" then at 7.15 (once she's at supermarket car-park) "OK", this is then followed by 20 minute call (my hack also logs calls). Once the Christmas interruption to normal life ends, the VAR should at least let me listen to her half of those calls.


----------



## Yessongs72

Chapparal - yes i have talked to agency about next steps.

Thor - NO, NO, NO, i just couldn't. If i can't proove adultery then GOOD (but i think i will) (proove according to UK law defenition).

Wysh - i have plenty of work situations this time of year, so she knows i wouldn't/couldn't take a weekend out at the moment. I am suspicious that they are arranging something for February - patience.


----------



## walkonmars

Your stomach must be churning every single day. But she's probably too self-absorbed with her thoughts of the POS that she doesn't even notice. 

Get plenty of rest. Get some meds from your MD if you have to to maintain your physical and emotional health. February must seem like an eon.


----------



## Yessongs72

Thor

i've been thinking about your question driving to work today. The main thing is not just the quickness or otherwise of the divorce (though, at my age, its important to not be in limbo for too long). THe point is that, to me, a PA (full-on adultery) is a deal breaker in a way that EA is not -from EA i could attempt reconciliation, PA is a bridge too far - and it is a bridge i believe they have already crossed. (i need to catch them next time they are on it)

yes, i could attempt to confront with the evidence i have, but if i flounder then i am in a world of crap.


----------



## WyshIknew

But how do you intend getting 'definitive' proof?

Short of busting into a hotel room (which I assume the hotel would be very loath to let you do) and catching them playing Mr Wobbly hides his helmet, and photographing it, what would you class as proof?


----------



## Yessongs72

wysh - i intend to use a PI agency who (a) are experienced in collecting definitive evidence and know what is required (i know this sounds like a bit of a cop out but sometimes you need to rely on the experts) and (b) if neccessary will have subtle and non-damaging ways of 'breaking the door down'.

but if there are photos of WW and POSOM meeting at hotel, and photos of them leaving some time later, i am sure that is enough for me to confront.


----------



## Chaparral

This seems to be stretching your pain and agony out so much longer than necessary. 

If you had confornted her earlier you may have stopped it before it went phsyical.

It may seem simple but all you need to do is lay out the evidence you have. If she denies it, she takes a lie detector test or you get a divorce. That gives you your answer. Usually, people don't even get to the lie detector test before spilling the beans anyway. As soon as its determined and you do divorce its not like you are stuck with her another year. You just have to wait on the paper work.

I could not live knowing what you know and pretending everything was fine.

There is also another family to consider.


----------



## Yessongs72

Chapparal - Entropy 3000 is right - the only way i could have stopped was by not allowing the very first meeting (which i could have done - she was quite open about i), by the time i was aware things were wrong, it was, i believe, already too late. I was then slow in instigating any investigation. When i realised in November, in the few days before City #2, i hadn't a clue what to do (hadn't discovered this site at the time), i nearly confronted the day after, but in retrospect am glad i didn't 'coz of sketchy evidence. so i contacted an agency, investigated and started the phone hacking, then found TAM which at least reassured me i was proceeding OK. 

sometimes (a lot of the time) i want to confront her with one of her texts (i want to shout it at her) and demand WTF she meant by it. but it would so hinder the finding of the truth.

Polygraphs - i'm a brit and its such an alien thing to us. i don't know if i trust them - i know i'd be rubbish if i was hooked up to one, i mean i sometimes give dodgy results when having my blood pressure tested because the test just freaks me a little bit, and a polygraph is blood pressure machine x10. Then theres stuff like this...

A 1998 Supreme Court decision allowed such bans, but read in part, "There is simply no consensus that polygraph evidence is reliable: The scientific community and the state and federal courts are extremely polarized on the matter."

(lifted from a USA Today article - i don't know their politics on the subject, it was just the 1st page i looked at after googling 'polygraph accuracy)

Yes, you are right - there is another family in all this (older than my family - i don't know if thats better, worse, or pretty much the same?). i fee like i'm letting her down by holding on, but (thanks to TAM) i know that really it is her tw&t husband who is letting her down - badly.


----------



## Thor

Polygraphs can be very poor or they can be pretty good. It depends on a lot of factors. I think the biggest value is the scare tactic. You tell her she has to take it or you D. She worries that the poly will extract the truth so she confesses before walking into the building.


----------



## Yessongs72

They are buildng-up towards a meeting, the scenario here is that WW occaisionally does work as an 'expert witness' in litigation and has to 'home visit' the injured party. She has a new case that involves a journey of over 200 mile each way (to a 'Northern city'. This little text (and phone) sequence is her trying to get POSOM to join her - for company and an overnight stop. Last year when she did one in the West Country, me and the kids came along for the weekend - she hasn't even raised that possibility this time.

just to clarify 'Q' is POSOMs wife

just to clarify #2 - the dates are English (day-month-year)

25.01.2013
[09:05] WW to POSOM> 'Postcode' (of client location)
[10:16] POSOM> 256 miles. 4.5 hours by car :-(

26.01.2013
[09:18] WW> wannabea passenger?
[09:42] POSOM> As nice as that sounds..........
[11:02] WW> what? i was kidknapped and had to go to City#1 once
[11:09] POSOM> City#1 is a lot closer than Northern City. There would be no time to do anything but talk.  you should be practicing your
manipulation techniques from the City#2 course. X
[11:47] WW> is that a no? 
[11:54] POSOM> You need to fly, you can't spend 8 hours in a car, even with me. 
[11:56] WW> thought you might offer to drive one way
[11:57] POSOM> I would, but that's still 8 hours 
[11:58] WW> you've clearly never driven to Scotland!
[11:59] POSOM> No I haven't 
[12:01] WW> worried about spending that much time in my company?
[12:03] POSOM> No of course not, 
[12:08] WW> if you dont fancy coming thats ok, would make the journey a bit more enjoyable thats all
[12:11] POSOM> Stop trying to make me feel guilty  I would love to spend some time with you. But the whole day in a car is not doing it for me. Sorry 
[14:50] WW> Was that a txt tiff? I'll find out about flights
[15:05] POSOM> No it wasn't  xxx xxx xxx 
[15:06] WW> I'll collect those at some point
[15:07] POSOM> Most certainly 
[15:08] WW> 

(they then dropped the subject for a few days, their daily texts were about other stuff)

08.02.2013
[16:35] POSOM> Home and chillin'
[17:42] WW> exasperated
[17:44] POSOM> You can call if you are quick. Q home soon 
[17:44] WW> i would only cry
[17:46] POSOM> Just trying to help. You sound as if you need a rant 
[18:00] WW> or something
[18:04] POSOM> Cancel flight and lets spend the weekend in Northern City

09.02.2013
[08:36] POSOM> Any time between 9.30 and 12.30 just give me 10 minutes notice.
[09:55] WW> ok ten mins
[09:56] POSOM> Perfect timing 
[10:11] POSOM> Who's phoning who? 
[10:11] Voice Call : to POSOM : duration = 30min 54seconds
[10:48] WW> xxxxx
[10:49] POSOM>  

I read this stuff and some it still floors me - even after 3 months of hacking. five bloody kisses!! b1tch, half hour on the phone!!! Cow. she dropped the kids off at a Saturday activity (i was working today) and drove to her office, so (once again) in-car VAR useless, oh well.


----------



## Shaggy

You know I'd be waiting in the northern city to greet her. 

That would really mess up her plan

I hope you have plans to ruin Val day. Like a call to Q
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## happyman64

:iagree:

Bring Q with you. Double the fun/Twice the surprise!


----------



## MattMatt

> They are buildng-up towards a meeting, the scenario here is that WW occaisionally does work as an 'expert witness' in litigation and has to 'home visit' the injured party.


Doesn't your 'wife' realise that her affair could result in her not being used as an expert witness?

Barristers and solicitors use all sorts of tricks to discredit the expert witness of the other side!

"And are you not Mrs Ima Bitton-Daside? Did you not abuse your position as an expert witness by taking your married lover on a job trip with you, whilst you were also married?"

She's as mad as a box of frogs!


----------



## JustSomeGuyWho

Shaggy said:


> You know I'd be waiting in the northern city to greet her.
> 
> That would really mess up her plan
> 
> I hope you have plans to ruin Val day. Like a call to Q
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


THIS

I'd be staking out her hotel and then knock on the door when you know they are both in there.


----------



## FryFish

She has plans to fu ck this other guy... You cannot control her, only yourself. What are you prepared to tolerate? Do you need to catch in the act her in order to feel justified leaving her? How much evidence would Q need?


----------



## JustSomeGuyWho

FryFish said:


> She has plans to fu ck this other guy... You cannot control her, only yourself. What are you prepared to tolerate? Do you need to catch in the act her in order to feel justified leaving her? How much evidence would Q need?


In the UK, what is required to prove that the affair turned physical in order to expedite a divorce?

FryFish - it appears that the laws are much different in the UK regarding divorce and that without a physical affair, it requires a 2-year separation while a physical affair is much shorter (3 months?). In the US, it varies by state but no state has that long of a separation requirement.


----------



## FryFish

Wow that kinda sucks... I guess yes needs to find a sitter for the kids and take a camera up to city#2


----------



## JustSomeGuyWho

Satya said:


> Divorce by Unreasonable Behavior is the fastest way to divorce in the UK due to EA or irreconcilable differences. I know because I did it.
> 
> Reasons for divorce in UK divorce law - unreasonable behaviour
> 
> Some caveats: You need to file within 6 months of the latest act of unreasonable behavior or the petition may be rejected in the court. You can cite this without proof of a physical affair but you will need to make a good enough case for the unreasonable behavior (clear dates and actions), such as extreme neglect for example or proof of hours of suspicious call logs. Basically anything showing disrespect and a breakdown in the relationship.
> 
> If your partner doesn't contest and your solicitor is on the ball (plus if the courts aren't too backlogged) then the whole process takes 4-6 months usually. Mine took the max time because I filed close to the Christmas holiday and the courts are slowazz then.


Aha! Good info. I think he might have enough to prove unreasonable behavior. He could hire a PI to follow them in "northern city" if he doesn't want to confront them himself ... just to be sure there is enough evidence.


----------



## Shaggy

I thought you were going to expose this cheating to omw.


----------



## terrence4159

just read your thread hand in there YES you will get them. im sorry about you having to go through this. hang tough man


----------



## JustSomeGuyWho

Man, I am so pulling for you to catch her.


----------



## Thor

Why don't you talk to a solicitor about the unreasonable behavior aspect regarding the text messages? This is clearly infidelity even if there are no photos of actual sex. The texts clearly imply sex but even without that part the rest of it is infidelity.


----------



## Yessongs72

I don't think he can go it's all too short notice for him to be able to 'pull' a weekend away from home. That doesn't stop all the kisses and half hour call from really p1ssing me off. And the VAR will be in her car - so if i'm wrong i'll know after.

I have recently (at last) got a contact number for POSOM-wife, but it's the office of the school she works at so i'd only want to call there as a last resort. but when push comes to shove - i've got a number.


----------



## Yessongs72

oh yeah - and i've ordered a semen detection kit, so if i'm wrong about him not going - then her underwear can tell me all about it. (i still find this a bit gross)


----------



## terrence4159

pulling for you yes! hang tough man you are doing awsome


----------



## Shaggy

Dude, push has come to shove.

Your wife has cheated, she's still cheating, she's trying to take him for holiday,


----------



## terrence4159

:iagree::iagree::iagree:


----------



## MrK

Can you monitor the calls and emails (i forgot, sorry). If the communication falls WAY OFF during this trip, it's because they are together. Call in sick and get up there. I can't imagine ANY scenario where, if I knew my wife was banging some guy, and knew where it was happening, I wouldn't be up there with a baseball bat.



Yessongs72 said:


> I have recently (at last) got a contact number for POSOM-wife, but it's the office of the school she works at so i'd only want to call there as a last resort. but when push comes to shove - i've got a number.


Her husband is trying his hardest to make it up north so he can bang another woman. I think she'd call that a last resort. And that other woman is your wife. If that communication breaks down, making it look like they're together, call her and see if her hubby had some last minute business out of town.


----------



## MrK

I can't believe you have gone all of this time acting normal. That's almost superhuman.


----------



## Subi

Yessongs72 said:


> Wysh
> 
> i meant it'll be awful forever because if i confronted/exposed and she admitted EA (she would obviously know i knew something) but D would take longer, there would be pressure (family, etc) to reconcile, the truth 'trickling out' is the gradual uncovering of the EA lie - that it is in fact PA. (a scenario which is seen in many TAM threads)
> 
> with regard to sex, i can not withdraw from my husbandly duties - she would know something was up. it is quite normal for sexual activity to reduce (and increase) on some sort of cyclical pattern so a slight reduction goes un-noticed. i did mention that i had had trouble maintaining an erection for her (disgust can do that to you) but if that happens then i can satisfy her orally (which sometimes leaves me with the hideous thought that i may be licking POSOM's juices - apparently still there for at least 72 hours)


if u can still do anything sexual with her knowing well.you.could be risking your health then u can reconcile.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Yessongs72

MrK - i'm not sure i am 'acting normal', i would say i have withdrwan a bit in the relationship, staying up later, slightly detached. BUT, in my favour here is that my job is very seasonal and the winter is particullarly intense with long hours and big effort required, so it is not unusual for me to be a bit tired and distant this time of year.


----------



## Thor

Tell her you have prostatitis and it hurts. Or you have had a sore throat for the last 3 days and wonder if it might be Strep. There are a lot of excuses not to have sex, just make it a believable one. That will get you through a few weekends.


----------



## Yessongs72

i had a 'bleakness' attack at work this afternoon - the future is looking very empty. i know there are people in my life that make a nonsense of that statement (e.g. my kids) but does anyone else get occaisionally overwhelmed by the sadness of it all.


----------



## MattMatt

MrK said:


> I can't believe you have gone all of this time acting normal. That's almost superhuman.


He's a Brit. We can do this s**t, umm... stuff.

Like when someone bumps into us and we apologise to them.

And I am bring serious. It's part of our national psyche, I think.

Keep at it, mate! We're all her for you!:smthumbup:


----------



## MattMatt

Yessongs72 said:


> i had a 'bleakness' attack at work this afternoon - the future is looking very empty. i know there are people in my life that make a nonsense of that statement (e.g. my kids) but does anyone else get occaisionally overwhelmed by the sadness of it all.


Yes, I did.

When my wife was in the midst of her affair we had to attend a function as a couple. Pretending that everything was all tickety boo was bloody weird to be frank and I thought: "Is this my future?"

Thankfully, it wasn't, as it turned out.


----------



## Subi

Yessongs72 said:


> i had a 'bleakness' attack at work this afternoon - the future is looking very empty. i know there are people in my life that make a nonsense of that statement (e.g. my kids) but does anyone else get occaisionally overwhelmed by the sadness of it all.


i feel so much for u. I am in the UK myself. Have you considered reconciling? There are some great R stories on here like that of Devastated Dad and many more. If u put your energy into saving your marriage and not catching her you will see some good come out of your efforts many years down the road. Its an option you might want to consider just so you keep your family together. It is very lonely on this side hence the advise.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Yessongs72

Subi - please understand i am a regular guy therfore very mixed-up and a seething mass of contradictions. I have considered R, i am certain there will be intense pressure to R not D, but i know this - even to R i have to catch her, confront her with the truth, not questions. expose her with real, tangible evidence of PA, even text kisses and "TOY" can be lied about (and i'll never find out what "dolphins" means). And pass on real, tangible evidence to POSOMs-wife so she can kick his sorry &rse to wherever she has to.

But in my head and heart - she has broken her marriage vows, she is in a constant lie, she has taken another mans c0ck inside her. and i want no more of it.


----------



## MattMatt

Subi said:


> i feel so much for u. I am in the UK myself. Have you considered reconciling? There are some great R stories on here like that of Devastated Dad and many more. If u put your energy into saving your marriage and not catching her you will see some good come out of your efforts many years down the road. Its an option you might want to consider just so you keep your family together. It is very lonely on this side hence the advise.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


And my story. A bit weird, but an example of a reconciliation in very difficult circumstances.

My wife told me in advance that she was going to have an affair, but would come back to me. You can imagine how crushed I was.

But we did reconcile. Never say never until the Adiposally challenged chanteuse has performed!:smthumbup:


----------



## MattMatt

Yessongs72 said:


> Subi - please understand i am a regular guy therfore very mixed-up and a seething mass of contradictions. I have considered R, i am certain there will be intense pressure to R not D, but i know this - even to R i have to catch her, confront her with the truth, not questions. expose her with real, tangible evidence of PA, even text kisses and "TOY" can be lied about (and i'll never find out what "dolphins" means). And pass on real, tangible evidence to POSOMs-wife so she can kick his sorry &rse to wherever she has to.
> 
> But in my head and heart - she has broken her marriage vows, she is in a constant lie, *she has taken another mans c0ck inside her. and i want no more of it.*


That's the part of my wife's affair that I blanked out in my mind.


----------



## Machiavelli

MattMatt said:


> He's a Brit. We can do this s**t, umm... stuff.
> 
> Like when someone bumps into us and we apologise to them.
> 
> And I am bring serious. It's part of our national psyche, I think.
> 
> Keep at it, mate! We're all her for you!:smthumbup:


I like the old British national psyche better: "I demand satisfaction! Choose your weapon, Sir!"


----------



## MattMatt

Machiavelli said:


> I like the old British national psyche better: "I demand satisfaction! Choose your weapon, Sir!"


Yes, that's a good point. Sort of dual personality on a national scale.:scratchhead:


----------



## Machiavelli

MattMatt said:


> Yes, that's a good point. Sort of dual personality on a national scale.:scratchhead:


It's the same as over here: the ladies (and their male running dog lackeys) run things now.


----------



## Subi

Yessongs72 said:


> Subi - please understand i am a regular guy therfore very mixed-up and a seething mass of contradictions. I have considered R, i am certain there will be intense pressure to R not D, but i know this - even to R i have to catch her, confront her with the truth, not questions. expose her with real, tangible evidence of PA, even text kisses and "TOY" can be lied about (and i'll never find out what "dolphins" means). And pass on real, tangible evidence to POSOMs-wife so she can kick his sorry &rse to wherever she has to.
> 
> But in my head and heart - she has broken her marriage vows, she is in a constant lie, she has taken another mans c0ck inside her. and i want no more of it.


-------------------------------------------------------------
Look at it, Yessongs, you are sub-consciously doing stuff with her now as you said, 'Husband duties'. That happens too once you decide to reconcile. I am going to be routing for you to reconcile because of your age and also because of the fact that you are handling it really well now. I believe reconciliation is very much on the cards for you. For your kids and for yourself too. There are a number of WS who have behaved even more disgustingly than yours yet they have been forgiven and are now working on reconciliation. Read Reconciliation stories and you will feel motivated. There are some very inspirational stories on R too. Good luck.


----------



## Aunt Ava

Subi said:


> -------------------------------------------------------------
> Look at it, Yessongs, you are sub-consciously doing stuff with her now as you said, 'Husband duties'. That happens too once you decide to reconcile. I am going to be routing for you to reconcile because of your age and also because of the fact that you are handling it really well now. I believe reconciliation is very much on the cards for you. For your kids and for yourself too. There are a number of WS who have behaved even more disgustingly than yours yet they have been forgiven and are now working on reconciliation. Read Reconciliation stories and you will feel motivated. There are some very inspirational stories on R too. Good luck.



Subi, I know you really like to push reconciliation, but not everyone can stomach to reconcile with someone who has so egregiously betrayed them. How would he ever be able to trust her again? She doesn't seem to have any qualms about lying to his fac now.

Perhaps he deserves a better life, he definitely deserves a better wife.


----------



## See_Listen_Love

Yessongs72 said:


> i had a 'bleakness' attack at work this afternoon - the future is looking very empty. i know there are people in my life that make a nonsense of that statement (e.g. my kids) but does anyone else get occaisionally overwhelmed by the sadness of it all.


Like everybody I am applauding your performance. I think you will have a better life later on, maybe even with her. She is in the Fog now, but I see she could be shocked out of the Fog, since you play your role well.

Maybe some humor could help you as an antidote? Youtube has lots of it. It will cheer you up against your will I think.


----------



## MattMatt

Aunt Ava said:


> Subi, I know you really like to push reconciliation, but not everyone can stomach to reconcile with someone who has so egregiously betrayed them. How would he ever be able to trust her again? She doesn't seem to have any qualms about lying to his fac now.
> 
> Perhaps he deserves a better life, he definitely deserves a better wife.


Aunt Ava, I reconciled with my wife. The trust comes back, but slowly, over a long period of time.

If I hadn't forgiven her? *In all honesty, I'd probably have drunk myself to death.*


----------



## Yessongs72

The semen detection kit just arrived. It's like i'm holding 'The End of Everything' in a box. Scary sh1t.


----------



## Kallan Pavithran

Subi said:


> -------------------------------------------------------------
> Look at it, Yessongs, you are sub-consciously doing stuff with her now as you said, 'Husband duties'. That happens too once you decide to reconcile. *I am going to be routing for you to reconcile because of your age *and also because of the fact that you are handling it really well now. I believe reconciliation is very much on the cards for you. For your kids and for yourself too. There are a number of WS who have behaved even more disgustingly than yours yet they have been forgiven and are now working on reconciliation. Read Reconciliation stories and you will feel motivated. There are some very inspirational stories on R too. Good luck.




Who told you he is too aged for a Divorce?

99-year-old man divorces wife of 77 years after discovering she had affair 60 years ago | Mail Online


----------



## Soifon

Kallan Pavithran said:


> Who told you he is too aged for a Divorce?
> 
> 99-year-old man divorces wife of 77 years after discovering she had affair 60 years ago | Mail Online


You are never too old for anything, my SO's grandmother just got engaged, she is 74 and deliriously happy!


----------



## happyman64

Yessongs72 said:


> The semen detection kit just arrived. It's like i'm holding 'The End of Everything' in a box. Scary sh1t.


The End,,, or maybe the Beginning.

It all depends on how you look at it.

Just get it over with.

ANd good luck.


----------



## Aunt Ava

MattMatt said:


> Aunt Ava, I reconciled with my wife. The trust comes back, but slowly, over a long period of time.
> 
> If I hadn't forgiven her? *In all honesty, I'd probably have drunk myself to death.*


Not to thread jack, but MattMatt I think you are a very special case. I honestly don't think many men could/would do as you have. I am glad it has worked out for you.


----------



## Subi

Aunt Ava said:


> Not to thread jack, but MattMatt I think you are a very special case. I honestly don't think many men could/would do as you have. I am glad it has worked out for you.


exactly and i believe Yessongs can be as good or even better. Still routing for you all the way.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## tom67

If Eric could do you can do it.


----------



## Aunt Ava

Yessongs72 said:


> If i am right (which i am), i want out, I will divorce her (i just can't get past adultery, it's such a betrayal) - it's not a case of stopping the act - its happened already - its a case of proving the act,


----------



## Chaparral

any news?


----------



## LetDownNTX

chapparal said:


> any news?


Been wondering myself!


----------



## Yessongs72

Hi y'all, thanks for your concerns.

In the overall scheme of things not much has happened - POSOM couldn't escape his family duties to join her on her trip to the Northern city. So they still haven't met up this side of Christmas (which apart from the not catching them thing doesn't bother me at all)

They have ramped up other communications though. Unfortunately she is getting into the habit of phoning POSOM from her office which renders the VAR in her car fairly useless. On the two occasions she did call from the car, #1 did not record as the cold had killed the VAR battery, and #2 was unexpected (unusual day for a call) so the VAR was plugged into the PC recharging - BUMMER.

Then came the good thing - I have been concerned that if I decide I need to use the services of a PI, that I really don't know much about POSOM - particularly what car he drives (useful info if your watching for him to arrive at a hotel). Anyway, in the half term (school) holiday WW took the kids to my mums, stayed overnight, then the next morning she arranged to visit her father - who lives quite near POSOM, so later on there was the following exchange of texts...

WW > whats yr reg
POSOM > XX ## XXX 
WW > thought i just saw you down the mxxxxy rd. Now in pub with dad

etc (gets EA-ey)

oh joy - Google 'identify car by registration', choose (free) sight, enter the reg.... and....

its a French hatchback (dull)
its grey (duller) [sorry, gray in the US]
its a non-turbo diesel (astonishingly dull)

(sorry if you drive a French hatchback, but this car is bland)

brilliant, 1-0 to Yessongs.

However, a few days later came this little exchange (its OK, I don't need a translation)

WW> diary of an old man?
POSOM> And getting older. May need to think about having an affair to make me feel young again. Any ideas? 
WW > go for it!
POSOM> Believe me I've been trying 
WW > no response from the ice maiden?
POSOM> Well to be honest a fantastic response in City #2 but frozen out since then. Summer may melt her heart. 
WW > just a bit of warmth required
POSOM> You can never accuse me of not being warm (and snuggly) 
WW > 

WW is the ice maiden - I don't know why she referred to herself in the third person. And doesn't she know that maidens were virgins - not cheating wh0res. This one knocked me a bit - especially the smiley to finish.

but the real killer was this one (edited to essentials)

WW] > how are you?
POSOM > Fine,, just cold. 
WW > im chained to the computer
POSOM > I should chain you to the bed  
WW > ha ha!

WW> I suspect that the thought of being in bed with me is the cause of your mirth 
WW > no. just that you are very direct

WW > sounds serious
POSOM > Yes, I seriously want your body.. 
WW > enough! i cant concentrate. gotta get this finished
POSOM > I'm thinking about making you quiver with pleasure, taking you to a place where you haven't been for a while  xxx 
WW > 

again it was the smiley at the end (after the offer to fvck her, or use his tongue on her, whatever) that really hurt. just sat looking at this for ages, I think I cried a bit. I nearly confronted but knew she would claim EA and I would have to settle. just numb with it. it was a big blow (not a surprise though). Sorry, I've got to stop now.


----------



## Chaparral

Yessongs72 said:


> Hi y'all, thanks for your concerns.
> 
> In the overall scheme of things not much has happened - POSOM couldn't escape his family duties to join her on her trip to the Northern city. So they still haven't met up this side of Christmas (which apart from the not catching them thing doesn't bother me at all)
> 
> They have ramped up other communications though. Unfortunately she is getting into the habit of phoning POSOM from her office which renders the VAR in her car fairly useless. On the two occasions she did call from the car, #1 did not record as the cold had killed the VAR battery, and #2 was unexpected (unusual day for a call) so the VAR was plugged into the PC recharging - BUMMER.
> 
> Then came the good thing - I have been concerned that if I decide I need to use the services of a PI, that I really don't know much about POSOM - particularly what car he drives (useful info if your watching for him to arrive at a hotel). Anyway, in the half term (school) holiday WW took the kids to my mums, stayed overnight, then the next morning she arranged to visit her father - who lives quite near POSOM, so later on there was the following exchange of texts...
> 
> WW > whats yr reg
> POSOM > XX ## XXX
> WW > thought i just saw you down the mxxxxy rd. Now in pub with dad
> 
> etc (gets EA-ey)
> 
> oh joy - Google 'identify car by registration', choose (free) sight, enter the reg.... and....
> 
> its a French hatchback (dull)
> its grey (duller) [sorry, gray in the US]
> its a non-turbo diesel (astonishingly dull)
> 
> (sorry if you drive a French hatchback, but this car is bland)
> 
> brilliant, 1-0 to Yessongs.
> 
> However, a few days later came this little exchange (its OK, I don't need a translation)
> 
> WW> diary of an old man?
> POSOM> And getting older. May need to think about having an affair to make me feel young again. Any ideas?
> WW > go for it!
> POSOM> Believe me I've been trying
> WW > no response from the ice maiden?
> POSOM> Well to be honest a fantastic response in City #2 but frozen out since then. Summer may melt her heart.
> WW > just a bit of warmth required
> POSOM> You can never accuse me of not being warm (and snuggly)
> WW >
> 
> WW is the ice maiden - I don't know why she referred to herself in the third person. And doesn't she know that maidens were virgins - not cheating wh0res. This one knocked me a bit - especially the smiley to finish.
> 
> but the real killer was this one (edited to essentials)
> 
> WW] > how are you?
> POSOM > Fine,, just cold.
> WW > im chained to the computer
> POSOM > I should chain you to the bed
> WW > ha ha!
> 
> WW> I suspect that the thought of being in bed with me is the cause of your mirth
> WW > no. just that you are very direct
> 
> WW > sounds serious
> POSOM > Yes, I seriously want your body..
> WW > enough! i cant concentrate. gotta get this finished
> POSOM > I'm thinking about making you quiver with pleasure, taking you to a place where you haven't been for a while  xxx
> WW >
> 
> again it was the smiley at the end (after the offer to fvck her, or use his tongue on her, whatever) that really hurt. just sat looking at this for ages, I think I cried a bit. I nearly confronted but knew she would claim EA and I would have to settle. just numb with it. it was a big blow (not a surprise though). Sorry, I've got to stop now.


I can't believe you are putting yourself through this. At least show this to your lawyer. It could take years to get the proof at this rate. You could have been long gone months ago.


----------



## Yessongs72

Chapparal - They are itching to meet up. They may well try to manufacture something over the Easter hols (schools out for 2 weeks). I have tested the semen detection kit - seems to work OK. I can wait until Easter, but you're right - I am going to lose it soon.


----------



## Acabado

Damm
Can't you manufacture a possibility they can't resist?


----------



## Yessongs72

Acabado - not really, I can manufacture an opportunity for WW - but no more than that, and that's not even half-way there.


----------



## TRy

Yessongs72 said:


> Chapparal - They are itching to meet up. They may well try to manufacture something over the Easter hols (schools out for 2 weeks). I have tested the semen detection kit - seems to work OK. I can wait until Easter, but you're right - I am going to lose it soon.


 I have not read all of the posts, so forgive me if I am missing something that has changed since from when you began this thread. If your goal is to save this marraige, why wait for them to meet up and have sex so that you can prove it with a semen test? Why not break it up now with just the text that you have. The texts are bad enough to divorce over if she does not go full no contact. You know what is going on, why do you need her to admit it? Why not just act on your own resolve that whatever she is doing with this affair partner is more than you are willing to live with in your marriage? You have let this go on for months as she has gone deeper in the fog with every day.


----------



## turnera

How to get her to stop itching for OM? 

Hand her your divorce papers. Suddenly, YOU will look amazing. Once she can't have you. Psychology 101.


----------



## Shaggy

Why are you letting this continue? Just expose it and file. What does her actually having more sex with him help?


----------



## bfree

He's afraid. He's trying to work up the courage to confront. He thinks once he has a smoking gun he'll have the courage and enough proof to not crumble. What he doesn't understand is that courage doesn't come externally like from some piece of evidence. Courage comes from within.


----------



## illwill

So, you still haven't acted? The sad thing is, she likely knows that you know, and everyday you do nothing makes you even less attractive. By the time you find the courage it will be too late. The problem with a smoking gun is that it has already gone off.


----------



## Chaparral

He doesn't want to reconcile. Waiting is because of divorce laws there.


----------



## chillymorn

unless you have something to gain by catching them red handed I think I would just file for divorce and end the missery.

the years you are taking off your life with all this stress isn't worth it in my opinion.

you have enogh to know that they have been in an affair for some time now. 

JMHO


----------



## Chaparral

Read the thread.


----------



## turnera

bfree said:


> He's afraid. He's trying to work up the courage to confront. He thinks once he has a smoking gun he'll have the courage and enough proof to not crumble. What he doesn't understand is that courage doesn't come externally like from some piece of evidence. Courage comes from within.


 He thinks that the smoking gun will do the work of changing her FOR him, so HE doesn't have to.


----------



## Chaparral

chillymorn said:


> unless you have something to gain by catching them red handed I think I would just file for divorce and end the missery.
> 
> the years you are taking off your life with all this stress isn't worth it in my opinion.
> 
> you have enogh to know that they have been in an affair for some time now.
> 
> JMHO


If he can prove adultery, the waiting period is much shoter for divorce.


----------



## bfree

*Re: Re: I really want to be wrong about all this*



chapparal said:


> If he can prove adultery, the waiting period is much shoter for divorce.


And in the meantime he's dying a little more each day he is with her. I think I would confront her know and wait the extra time just so I wouldn't have to put myself through this Hell.


----------



## Chaparral

bfree said:


> And in the meantime he's dying a little more each day he is with her. I think I would confront her know and wait the extra time just so I wouldn't have to put myself through this Hell.


Me too.


----------



## turnera

Yes, did you already file for divorce?


----------



## Yessongs72

I just spent an hour composing a reply, and my laptop ate it. Start again


----------



## Chaparral

Yessongs72 said:


> I just spent an hour composing a reply, and my laptop ate it. Start again


Are you sure you weren't on a samsung android tablet?


----------



## bfree

*Re: Re: I really want to be wrong about all this*



chapparal said:


> Are you sure you weren't on a samsung android tablet?


Oh don't get me started!


----------



## Yessongs72

Replying to several questions and points raised, 2nd attempt...

Shaggy/bfree/turnera - As I've written before, to me there is a significant difference between EA and PA (getting less every day) such that I believe if an EA then I must try my hardest to reconcile, but for PA I can (and should) divorce. Therefore I must be right about PA and the texts I have only prove EA. I know its more - he spend the night with her in City #2 and I'm damn sure they weren't talking about gardening - but it was before i'd started investigating properly.

Also we have two small(ish) children. If I confront her on PA, they are going to have two parents when they go to bed, and one when they get up in the morning. For their sakes I must be correct - hence SMOKING gun.

yes i'm afraid - i'm afraid of being wrong (see above), and yes i'm afraid of being alone (i'm almost in my mid fifties - not a great catch).

illwill - No, she doesn't know I know. If she did she'd be doing 'damage limitation' with her family and our church, so when it all blows up its my fault. And she just isn't. Also if they knew then no way would they have gifted me the car-reg text.

On top of all this there's who the POSOM is. This is the man who caused me so much misery in the mid 80's - and she knows this. Its such a betrayal, such a knife in my heart. And she seems to have forgotten the whole prostitute thing.

No I NEED that smoking gun, for my own peace of mind and for my children. Maybe i'll shoot myself with it. who cares.

writing these replies can be so hard, but its good - it really makes me think about where I am and the course of action (inaction) i'm taking. Sometimes I want, so badly, to confront her - to just shout the truth in her two-timing face. She's so bloody serene, like she won't be caught, she can have her cake and eat it. well she's wrong. Sorry, i'm starting to rant. 

2.30 - time to stop writing and try to get some sleep.


----------



## Yessongs72

chapparal said:


> Are you sure you weren't on a samsung android tablet?


it is a Samsung - but a laptop with windows 8

still ate the reply


----------



## the guy

Wait What

If you find a "smoking gun you will use it on me"?

Man, you are going thru some emotional torture and need this smoking gun to make a certain step in your life that will be so life changing that you plan on using this smoking gun on you?

Sir from were I'm sitting, that smoking gun would be used as a celebration and shot up in the air as a statement of jubilation that you now have the final piece to let go and move on!

I get it, it painful crap, but you must not let her win, do not let her sh1t define you, you are way better then this deciet that she owns.

It's her....not you!

It just sucks cuz she grapped you and brought you in to her sh1tty life.

You don't have to tolorate some chick screwing you over, but you do owe it to your kids to be ther as a father not as a husband.

Do you under stand how much better a father you will be when you don't have to wince every time family time includes your old lady? Do you under stand how healthy it is to see a father happy? 


Maybe I'm wrong, maybe its ok for your kids to grow up telling them selves that "its all ok my dad was unhappy, so I can be unhappy too"???????


----------



## dgtal

What are you waiting for?
Release the nuclear bomb
EXPOSE EXPOSE Expose
That will end all that bs
contact the posom wife
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## See_Listen_Love

This is taking months now, OP you are being paranoid about the PA, if you found nothing in these months you may have to accept is is an EA, with one possible hookup in the past.

What is your course of action now it is an EA for sure?


----------



## Chaparral

JustPuzzled said:


> Apologies if I have not paid attention, but what happened in the '80s?


I'm sure this the first time this has been mentioned.


----------



## Acabado

I don't recall the whole '80s thing. But obviously OM is not only a random OM but the worse OM possible, someone she knows it would cause huge damage is she were to get involved with him. It clearly put things in a different perspective: the lack to respect, the lack of caring, the disdain or even the passive agreesive, vindicatice, potential pusnishment she might be trying to inflict depending on how you intepret this.


----------



## walkonmars

Acabado said:


> I don't recall the whole '80s thing. But obviously OM is not only a random OM but the worse OM possible, someone she knows it would cause huge damage is she were to get involved with him. It clearly put things in a different perspective: the lack to respect, the lack of caring, the disdain or even the passive agreesive, vindicatice, potential pusnishment she might be trying to inflict depending on how you intepret this.


Yes I agree - not just betrayal but betrayal most foul. Vindictive and heartless. Even if it's "just an EA" this level of betrayal is inexcusable and likely unforgivable.


----------



## Yessongs72

See Listen Love - Yes its a long time, but I'm not paranoid, how can I accept an AE after seeing her smiley-face reply to his 'quiver with pleasure' and 'chain you to he bed' texts. No way. Also I've read the many threads here where the BS 'settles' and is in a long R with trickle truth and D-Day2, D-Day3, etc, so many disappointments - I really would end up crippled with unhappiness and probably dead. No, they are itching to meet - I can hang on

Everyone - the 80's thing, its complicated but basically he is much older than her and she met him at work (not one of our normal circle of friends). We were all late teens/early twenties (fast motorbikes, loud guitars - I still miss my Z650) so plenty of relationship learning/experimentation going on. She was in a fairly long relationship with a guy who EVERYONE else knew was a d1ck (she agrees nowadays) and the break-up was tediously long. She knew that I was there for her, but decided (was influenced by POSOM) to not get in the way of her then best friend who was hot for me - almost desperate (great body, but a bit too strange for me - was never gonna be a long term thing). So she ended-up in a four year relationship with POSOM, but kept me hanging on as she KNEW the thing with POSOM wouldn't last. So yeah - its hurtful. (POSOMs now wife was also always on the edge of their relationship so WW still hates her). Anyway that's not the complete story of the 80's but should serve to fill out the picture. Oh - that she met him at work then does not make this a work affair now, they have both changed careers, this is purely an 'old flame' thing.

BH - its four in the morning, time for bed I think.

oh yes - GO KIMI!


----------



## bfree

Ok, I'm going to ask this question and there really is no delicate way to phrase it. So when you and your wife were both young she kept screwing around with bad boy types while you waited in the wings? You were the more stable safe one? I'm thinking in her mind you were the beta orbiter that she settled for but she never got past her need for an alpha male type (alpha widow.)


----------



## Chaparral

Kimi Raikonen?!,,,


----------



## hookares

If the guy was worth her screwing once, he's worth it again.
As far as your children go, what kind of respect will they have for you if you continue to rug-sweep this mess and let her finish killing you with deceit?
File NOW.


----------



## Acabado

Yessongs72 said:


> Anyway that's not the complete story of the 80's but should serve to fill out the picture. Oh - that she met him at work then does not make this a work affair now, they have both changed careers, this is purely an 'old flame' thing.


Not exactly. "Old flings" affair "normaly" means someone from the past but you don't know him, it's a previous BFF you never competed with for her. I would fit more a "old fling" affair if OM was the original "d1ck! BFF as he was in the picture before you met her, even then... not exactly the classic scenario.
She know you hate MOM's guts. It's what makes it specially damaging, she's aware of it, she can't pretend to ignore the added implications of getting involved precisely with this particular AP as you were somehow "waiting for her" while she was involved with him back then. You and OM are long term adversaries.


----------



## MattMatt

Yessongs72 said:


> it is a Samsung - but a laptop with windows 8
> 
> still ate the reply


Windows 8 = spawn of the devil.

Not so bad if you use the Desktop setting and Firefox.


----------



## Chaparral

MattMatt said:


> Windows 8 = spawn of the devil.
> 
> Not so bad if you use the Desktop setting and Firefox.


My Wdws 8 is paradise compared to this Samsung Android abortion. I never know what is going to happen when I try to post or email or anything else really.

Right now, it will not let me insert Tablet after Android. 

Used my daughter's ipad this morning, it had me drooling.


----------



## Thor

Just my opinion, but getting together with a man she had a 4 year sexual relationship with can only mean it has gone physical again.


----------



## MattMatt

chapparal said:


> My Wdws 8 is paradise compared to this Samsung Android abortion. I never know what is going to happen when I try to post or email or anything else really.
> 
> Right now, it will not let me insert Tablet after Android.
> 
> Used my daughter's ipad this morning, it had me drooling.


I _*love*_ my Samsung Android!:smthumbup:


----------



## MattMatt

Thor said:


> Just my opinion, but getting together with a man she had a 4 year sexual relationship with can only mean it has gone physical again.


Maybe.

*But!* even if an affair with a former lover does get physical, there's nothing to say that the relationship cannot be saved.

After all, ours, my wife and myself, was saved, under similar (but not the same) circumstances.


----------



## JustSomeGuyWho

Yessongs72 said:


> yes i'm afraid - i'm afraid of being wrong (see above), *and yes i'm afraid of being alone (i'm almost in my mid fifties - not a great catch).*


Why are you afraid of that? Mid-fifties is still fairly young. There are a lot of women in their 50's looking and in today's internet world it is pretty easy to find them. There is a woman in my office in her mid-fifties and pretty overweight; she's nice but you would think she wouldn't have a lot of opportunities. Using the internet, she's never had to go without a date with guys her age and has finally found a great guy that she is very serious with. She's dated guys who were also not great catches (looks wise or financially) to guys who are very fit or wealthy. 

Also, unless you have a medical condition that prevents it, if you are not already fit, you should be working on that. Use this time to work on yourself, physically, mentally, financially. Reminds me of a guy who is competing in our local annual marathon for the 30th time. He didn't even start running until his fifties after he started having health problems. An 83 year old ran in last year's Boston marathon.

Give yourself more credit; I think you will be surprised.


----------



## Chaparral

You definitely need to be working out for the mental stability it helps with.

Did you read MARRIED MAN SEX LIFE PRIMER?


----------



## Laba

I applaud you for being so patient!!!!!!!!!! Bravo Maestro, you have guts that many of us don't. What we see on TAM is that way too many posters confront too early and then rant for months being gaslighted and dealing with blame-shifting.
I am keeping my fingers crossed for a successfully completed mission. 
Trust me if you become single you will be in market very short time.
Your humor is fantastic - even when you are writing about painful subject like this in your life you still bring it over with wit that many don't have. Lot's of people in your situation could learn from you, I hope you stay on TAM after this ordeal is over. Keep strong!!!!


----------



## Yessongs72

bfree - no, you are completely wrong - either you read it bad or (more likely) I wrote it poorly. In our late teens/early twenties she was the one in a (longish) term relationship - only the guy was an idiot, not a bad boy. Me stable and safe - not really - I was the one with the big motorbike and the loud guitars, hence her best friends interest. It was just a mixed-up/ff'd up time which is how late teens/early twenties should be (unless you're dull). POSOM was from outside our circle of friends.

hookares - file with what, at the moment I have nothing that can't be lied about. That's not good enough. I don't doubt that they have got physical, but I MUST be able to prove it. I am sorry if you consider not being hasty to be rug sweeping, I don't.

Matt - yeah, desktop. And I know you are big on R and I applaud you for that (don't wanna get into a R v D argument and end up getting banned like Dig) but for me I can't get past it if they have fvcked. I know once the ship hits the fan that I will be under R pressure from all sides, i'm weak (i'm a bloke). who knows.

Chapparal - No haven't read it, i'll get it after next pay day. And, yes - Kimi Raikonen (damn, only 7th after qualifying)


----------



## bfree

Ok sorry. I misunderstood then. I'm very sorry for what you are experiencing. I couldn't stand by and deal with what you are seeing and hearing on a daily basis. I would have had to confront a long time ago. You must have a lot more willpower than me.


----------



## TRy

Yessongs72 said:


> at the moment I have nothing that can't be lied about. That's not good enough. I don't doubt that they have got physical, but I MUST be able to prove it. I am sorry if you consider not being hasty to be rug sweeping, I don't


 Confront her with the emotional affair (EA) and demand full no contact or divorce. Tell her that as an ex you should have never let them reconnect in the first place, and that now you are correcting this. Tell her that if there is nothing going on between them that it should not be a problem dropping him completely out of her life like she did the 20 years before. Tell her that the more that she fights you on this reasonable request, the more she is confirming that it has gone to far. Also expose the EA to family and tell that you have good reason to believe that it was also physical; I say may because if you had solid evidence of this, we would not be having this conversation (they may have done something significant like make out without having actually f*cked yet). Tell them and her that risking her marraige for continued contact with him would confirm to you that it was also physical and that you will divorce her immediately.

Bottom line, if they may not have f*cked yet, why would you stand by waiting until it did provably happen to take action? If you want there to be any chance at saving your marraige act now. By waiting for it to go that far, you are guaranteeing that you will be ending your marraige.


----------



## See_Listen_Love

Correct me if I am wrong,

1. You know of two times they could have had sex via the texts.

2. There may be more that you do not know off.

3. The texts indicate an EA

4. You have two young children

5. You would like to kill this and have her be a normal behaving wife again.

If this all is the case you need to follow the standard operating procedure of investigating secretly untill you have enough proof to prevent gaslighting. Then you expose her to everybody. Try to shock her out of the Fog.

At the same time reading and doing NMMNG and MMSLP, working out, find some new inspirational activities for yourself? 

This could maybe repair some personal things and make you more attractive to women. Even when not wanting to admit it rationally she would see note it.


----------



## Yessongs72

Try - don't 1 and 3 contradict each other, the texts confirm (at last) that they definitely met on the two occasions I believed (City #1 - for which I only had a gut reaction to a 5~7 hour 'hole' in time. And City #2 where I had seen texts but this was before hacking so had no 'proper' record). Now I know that she was 'kidnapped' in City #1 (i.e. went to his hotel in the evening) and that POSOM wrote that good(awful) things happened (no specifics) with the 'ice maiden' in City #2 (in her hotel room, late at night). It has taken all this time to get this much.

4. Yes, two small children - which is why I must be absolutely correct before acting.

5. I can no longer consider her 'a normal behaving wife'.

TRy - they may not have 'fvcked', but I seriously doubt it. Almost anyone on this forum will INSIST that two adults (who are ex's) do not meet in hotel rooms at night to talk fishing, its to have sex. If they didn't fvck before they probably won't next time, she will come home with clean keks, the semen test will be negative, and I will blow up their EA.

But of this, there are two chances, none, and fek all.

Seriously - two hotel meetings (one an 'all nighter') - of course they have fvcked.

now I feel like crap again.


----------



## TRy

Yessongs72 said:


> Try - don't 1 and 3 contradict each other, the texts confirm (at last) that they definitely met on the two occasions I believed (City #1 - for which I only had a gut reaction to a 5~7 hour 'hole' in time. And City #2 where I had seen texts but this was before hacking so had no 'proper' record).


 I did not say that, SLL said that.



Yessongs72 said:


> Seriously - two hotel meetings (one an 'all nighter') - of course they have fvcked.


 If that is what you believe, you should act on that belief and act now. Why do the betrayed so often feel that they must have proof that the cheater cannot deny, when in fact they do not? When you ignore what you know, you are playing by the cheaters rules. You are requiring that she agree with you that she cheated before you will act. You actually are seeking her approval that you are right. Man up. You do not need to prove anything to anyone.


----------



## See_Listen_Love

TRy said:


> I did not say that, SLL said that.
> 
> If that is what you believe, you should act on that belief and act now. *Why do the betrayed so often feel that they must have proof that the cheater cannot deny*, when in fact they do not? When you ignore what you know, you are playing by the cheaters rules. You are requiring that she agree with you that she cheated before you will act. You actually are seeking her approval that you are right. Man up. You do not need to prove anything to anyone.


Now TRy, there have been clear cut cases of proof, where the WS denies by having the most amazing explanations and succeeds in gaslighting the BS. So the BS is unsure of it and WS has control instead of being remorsefull or even acknowledging the facts. 

To prevent this gaslighting it is often advised to have undeniable proof, at least at the level of those who the affair is exposed to. That will force the WS to see things with the eyes of the outsiders who he or she cares for.

And the BS will have a kind of peace of soul afterwards in his or her certainty of knowledge, it gives a better processing of the affair.


----------



## TRy

See_Listen_Love said:


> Now TRy, there have been clear cut cases of proof, where the WS denies by having the most amazing explanations and succeeds in gaslighting the BS. So the BS is unsure of it and WS has control instead of being remorsefull or even acknowledging the facts.


 When they ask con men, how they were able to get people to believe the unbelievable, con men will answer that, "it is easy to get people to believe what they want to believe". The OP just needs to stop wanting to be conned for him not to be gaslighted. As far as the cheater having control, they only have that control if the OP needs the cheater to be remorseful or if they need the cheater to "acknowledge" that they cheated.

All cheaters lie. All cheaters deny. Standing by and watching them cheat as you wait for proof that they cannot deny just so that you can get them to admit what you already know, can destroy your soul. As the OP stated "Seriously - two hotel meetings (one an 'all nighter') - of course they have fvcked." If my wife lied and secretly spent the night in a hotel room with another man, that would be enough for me.


----------



## Yessongs72

Ten years ago the UK and the USA invaded Iraq on the premise that the Saddam Hussein had 'weapons of mass destruction'. One intelligence report was believed - because it said what our leaders wanted. It was not VERIFIED. How many lives lost in what many consider an illegal war (there were no wmd's). I owe it to my children to be absolutely sure - MORE THAN TEXTS. Jumping in with two feet is not 'manning up' merely reckless.

Although i don't expect it for a minute, my WW could be the one person in ten million who is able to be alone with an ex, without fvcking them. VERIFY.


----------



## Chaparral

What really happened in Iraq depends on how much you believe your sources of information. In the Us, for example, the media is almost all controlled by very liberal folks that believe lying is justified for our own good. We have plenty of proven examples to completely discount pretty much anything we hear. Lol my favorite is when NBC had to put explosives on a pickup truck to prove the truck would blow up. And do not bring up how Dan Rather got fired.


----------



## Chaparral

Write down all your evidence an map out a timeline. You don't think you set your wife down and break her with that information?

I don't see being able to hurry the divorce along as being worth the misery you are going through.


----------



## Yessongs72

chapparal said:


> What really happened in Iraq depends on how much you believe your sources of information. In the Us, for example, the media is almost all controlled by very liberal folks that believe lying is justified for our own good. We have plenty of proven examples to completely discount pretty much anything we hear. Lol my favorite is when NBC had to put explosives on a pickup truck to prove the truck would blow up. And do not bring up how Dan Rather got fired.


Yes it does, and i don't want to hijack my own thread (and i'm certainly not saying what i think about the was), but the documentary evidence Tony B.Liar presented to the UK parliament, pretty much said 'WMD, WMD, WMD'

I am just trying to emphasise the need for verification, rather than merely acting on belief - its not always enough (and sometimes wrong)


----------



## Aunt Ava

Hang in there Yessongs72, your fortitude and patience are admirable considering you are facing such an emotionally devastating situation. 

I hope you get the solid evidence you need soon, so that you can begin to heal.


----------



## Machiavelli

Everybody gets to decide what and how much proof they need. Stay the course; you already know they've done the deed. You've spoken to your solicitor about the evidence you have already, right?


----------



## Chaparral

Can you your copies of their texts be used in court? Privacy laws are strict in some places.


----------



## Chaparral

Haven't you been chasing proof for three and a half months so far?


----------



## Yessongs72

chapparal said:


> Haven't you been chasing proof for three and a half months so far?


Something like that - and it is only in the last four weeks or so that the texts have said much about 'pre-hacking' history, VAR still fairly useless as she rarely phones from the car - her current preferred practise is to go in to work on a Saturday morning (to catch up on paperwork while its much quieter) and phone POSOM from office while working).

with regards to your other question - whether the texts are legally acceptable or not, I doubt they are sufficient. At least i am the account holder for our phones, so i am hacking myself.

Machiavelli - No i haven't spoken to a solictor yet, i have checked out a few specialist (UK) websites and they mostly indicate what evidence is sufficient - a PI observing them meeting at a hotel is fine, hence my joy at getting his car reg a couple of weks ago. Yes i have spoken to PI agency.


----------



## Chaparral

In the first few paragraphs you stated how you allowed her to meet up with ex. Is she still openly communicating or is it all hidden now? I don't see how you can be in the same room withnher. She hasn't asked you anything about your attitude? 

At least kimi won!


----------



## Chaparral

You haven't let any nasty remarks escape you? Why did you let her stay in contact with someone you disliked so much?


----------



## Yessongs72

chapparal said:


> In the first few paragraphs you stated how you allowed her to meet up with ex. Is she still openly communicating or is it all hidden now? I don't see how you can be in the same room withnher. She hasn't asked you anything about your attitude?
> 
> At least kimi won!


All hidden now, even the 'harmless' family news stuff. 

Most of the time I can be in the same room - I have to bite my tongue sometimes. I find it hardest not to say anything when she is discussing future plans - I can't see a (shared) future.

Kimi did good - points = pounds, and i'm gonna need all the pounds I can get for when I need a PI


----------



## Chaparral

You guys bet on the races?


----------



## Yessongs72

chapparal said:


> You guys bet on the races?


No, i (help to) build racing cars.


----------



## Chaparral

Lotus?


----------



## Chaparral

I guess you better not znswer that


----------



## GTdad

Sara, I waited for each installment of your story on tenderhooks. Thanks for your honesty and courage in sharing. What you did was awful, but you own it, and to me that counts for alot. I hope you post more on these boards.


----------



## Chaparral

Thanks Sara.

Ihave been a proponent of saving marriages. 80% of the couples that divorce over infidelity truly regret doing so. I wish yes had jumped on this in the beginning and saved his family. Now I think this has gone ongoing so long, divorce I probably inevitable and there are going to be apot full of broken hearts and children. Posom will surely save his marriage and Yessongs is going to be torn asunder. Very very sad outcomes ahead.


----------



## ShootMePlz!

Given all you have said....why are you still with Wayne???:scratchhead:


----------



## Acabado

Name it as you likes, My story?
You can practicaly copy/paste you initial posts.


----------



## Shaggy

If Sara is correct then you should just cut to chase and file for D. Sara be never quit cheating once she started with Wayne. It sounds like the daughters haven't been told the truth about who Wayne is and how he was responsible for destroying their family.

lessons to learn from this:

1. Divorce cheating wives

2. Exposé the affair to children when they get old enough to understand so they can hold those responsible for the loss of their family accountable.

3. When your wife stays with the AP and even marries him,do not subject yourself to the humiliation of hanging out with the posOM.


----------



## Yessongs72

sara1234 said:


> You cannot even begin to imagine how much worse this will end up for your wife than you, in the future. In the beginning, it may not seem that way, but trust me, that's how it will turn out. She has no idea what is ahead of her, so much pain, so much regret, and impossible to get over. I accept at this point that this is something that will always cause me pain and I will always regret. There's nothing else for me to do. But I promise you, you will be ok, probably happier than you were before all of this happened. In your next relationship, you will even look back and be thankful this all happened.


Sara, thanks for the encouragement. You are right - no one is going to come out of this feeling particullarly great about themselves. I don't know if i'll ever 'be thankful' this is happening but i get what you mean. Your story is scary similar, even some of the names, the main difference is I have only met POSOM once - he was from outside our usual social circle (work), I don't like him. The thing that really worries me is her potential reaction when i drop the bomb i think i may have to 'clue in' one of her sisters before i confront, so she can support WW in the aftermath, its not going to go well.

I have just (this evening) learnt that they were planning something for Easter, but it looks like a (her) family event may stop that (damn shame) - its wierd coz' its good a meetingis busted, but frustrating because another 'catch them' chance is lost.

Chapparal - correct.

and correct - i could have stopped this in the beginning as their initial meeting was quite open. At the time neither of us realized/understood the risk, The problem was it was months before i researched the 'ex factor' (i started researching once i realized something was up) it was this that led to TAM, but the damage was already done. Ignorance is not always bliss.

i wanna say loads more - my reply is fairly jumbled. but its 3.30 so officially 'the small hours' and i'm gong to bed.


----------



## Thor

Be very very careful who you reveal to before you confront your wife. Be sure this person is 100% loyal to you. Otherwise your wife is likely to get a warning before you confront her.

Really, you should rethink telling her sister anything. You can call her or send an email immediately after the confrontation.

Do what is in your best interest. Don't put her welfare above yours (and your children's)!


----------



## Chaparral

Looks like Alonso is going to win,,,,,,,,,yea, maybe Kimi can beat Massa.

Whats up over there are you still treading water?


----------



## Yessongs72

Yes, still treading water, still monitoring texts. I've retired the VAR for now as she rarely phones him from the car - she prefers the comfort of her office when she goes in on a Saturday morning.

Plenty of text activity. They did try to meet up a couple of weeks back in the (school) half-term holiday. 1st POSOM texted that his wife was away all week. The she replied that as I would be going to my mums to collect the kids, that Friday night would be a good time to meet. This got blown out of the water at the last minute as his daughter decided to spend the weekend home from uni. Damn shame (not).

They really are the most useless pair of AP's ever.

However, they tried to manufacter a private night-time meeting. Its not good.


----------



## turnera

So what are you doing about it?


----------



## treyvion

So you prayed that the wife was not cheating at the beginning of this out of love. Literally starting the connection right under your nose. This affair blows out into a much larger problem with multiple OM's.

I feel for you. I was glad you had the reality of realizing that you had to be patient and not come forward, because they would go further underground and also you look like the lier.


----------



## Chaparral

Your point of not confronting was to cut the divorce wait time down. That has not worked. You might consider psychology and a var. Start asking her, with the var running, if she doesn't have something to tell you. At first she may say no. Just act like you know everything with out bringing it up. Next time, ask her if she has a confession to make. After that you may start giving hints about what you know. Over time she is bound to crack. This assumes a confession will work in court.

There is no way she wants to end the marriage for a bit of fun. You have a lot if pressure you can apply.


----------



## WyshIknew

treyvion said:


> So you prayed that the wife was not cheating at the beginning of this out of love. Literally starting the connection right under your nose. This affair blows out into a much larger problem with multiple OM's.
> 
> I feel for you. I was glad you had the reality of realizing that you had to be patient and not come forward, because they would go further underground and also you look like the lier.


Multiple OM's?

Have I missed something? I thought there was only the one that Yessongs knows about?


----------



## crazyace

Dear Yessong, it seems to me that now instead of you wanting to be wrong for your wife's infidelity, you are hoping you are right. The perspective has changed. For sure, I agree with you that, if she was with the OM for 5-7 hrs in city 1 and a night in city 2 there surely weren't playing LUDO. But then I think it would no good to torture yourself into waiting for them to meet and exposing them. 
Can it not help if you sit down your wife when she talks about the future and discuss about the present of your relationship ?
I am not saying confront her. But may be you can start with her idea of where current your relationship is ... get her ideas, tell her a false story about some friends divorce due to wife infidelity with her EX. and then try to monitor her reactions and later messages.
If there is something suspicious , she might tell him about this or attempt to be more cautious and make a mistake. 
Catching them in person will be a big blow for you and it is better that you stay away from such torture...


----------



## FlyingThePhoenix

Hello Yessongs,

From what I have read so far you have access to Phone records/text messages and you know she is communicating with her EX-BF from work on the weekends. I understand you are waiting for the "smoking gun" evidence but this could on and on; and the longer it goes on she will catch on that you know something about the affair and your chance for a clean break away from your cheating wife will be lost.



> They really are the most useless pair of AP's ever.


 :rofl:!

If they are that pathetic then why not expedite things along so she and her EX-BF can get together sooner, giving you the “smoking gun” evidence you are looking for, instead of waiting for them to make the next move. You are only hurting yourself waiting for them to screw up (excuse the pun). From the texts you have shown us it reads like they are being very careful about this affair and do not care how long it goes on for, or who they hurt in the process. Your wife is some piece of work for doing this; she is very cold and calculating, planning things out for the long term, that much is clear. She feels safe talking to her EX-BF from work so you have no idea what else is going on. I am sorry to say this you are now a *Husband* and *Father* *ONLY* and *not her Lover*, her continuation of this affair is clear as day now that her EX-BF is on the scene the *EX-BF is her Lover again*.

Why not ask her if she wants to spend more time away with you and the kids. Watch her reaction to this suggestion. Tell her you have a friend that is getting a divorce because he caught his wife cheating on him and they are now fighting like cats for dogs over their kids. Then start monitoring all communications and see what she says to her EX-BF.

The one place you cannot seem to monitor is her work place over the weekend; is there any way around this one without breaking the law. 

I read sara1234 post, I agree 100%. Brace yourself, more hurt is coming.

Have you planned out everything?

Q. Have you taken legal advice as to your position once the affair is exposed and divorce follows? While you are waiting for the “smoking gun” evidence, there is no harm in planning for the fallout for you and the kids. Your wife can plan her own future with her EX-BF. (Sorry! that was cold).

Q. I know you said this in earlier posts that if it’s an EA you would consider R, but, will still consider R if it’s a full blown PA; even after the affair is exposed, the crying, the 1001 sorriest of excuses, I will not do it again lines? (You know what I mean…). 

Q. Are you documenting everything text message/VAR/GPS etc? 

The longer this affair continues you and your kids will suffer! Expose the affair soon and you will become stronger and healthier then you are now. But until then you are NOT in charge of this marriage, your *WIFE and EX-BF are in CHARGE of your MARRIAGE* and *YOU* and your *KIDS* are playing by their rules. You know this! Everyone wants you to be in a better place for you and your kids. Your wife has changed the conditions of your marriage without consulting you and you are now, as I stated above, a *Husband* and *Father* *BUT NOT her Lover! Her Lover is NOW her EX-BF.*

Best Regards, 

FTP! 
“Keep Calm and Carry On”


----------



## Yessongs72

Wow, sorry I got to my thread rather late (its just gone 3a.m.

(I got distracted by TheUmbrella's story - wow decisive or what, but then again - BIG evidence)

Quite a lot of stuff to take on board, the only thing i'll say now is - no, Wysh, you didn't miss anything - only one POSOM as far as I know. The only other guy she's regularly in contact with is her 84 year old widowed father, whose dog (an over-cute Norwich Terrier) got run over a couple of weeks back, very sad.

I'll try to get here earlier tomorrow night.


----------



## WyshIknew

Any updates Yessongs?

You haven't logged in since 28th May so might be talking to myself.

Hopefully no news is good news.

The pessimist in me is concerned that some crap has come down and you are struggling to deal with it.


----------



## Yessongs72

Hi Wysh, thanks for your concern.

No real news - recent texts have confirmed my thoughts that their number-one method of communication is by email from their respective offices, bummer. Recent texts also tell me that POSOM is desperate to get into her knickers. But every too-personal text (even something like "yrs") sends me a little bit lower.

I'm just feeling a bit jaded with it all. There was some gurl who posted on CWI with a story that was similar to my own, i posted this and she replied, but I think she was a faker - the thread has gone - and I just felt a bit burnt by it.

I have been reading, just not posting.


----------



## turnera

Reading...not posting...why aren't you leaving?


----------



## Will_Kane

Yessongs72 said:


> Hi Wysh, thanks for your concern.
> 
> No real news - recent texts have confirmed my thoughts that their number-one method of communication is by email from their respective offices, bummer. Recent texts also tell me that POSOM is desperate to get into her knickers. But every too-personal text (even something like "yrs") sends me a little bit lower.
> 
> I'm just feeling a bit jaded with it all. There was some gurl who posted on CWI with a story that was similar to my own, i posted this and she replied, but I think she was a faker - the thread has gone - and I just felt a bit burnt by it.
> 
> I have been reading, just not posting.


Are you waiting for definitive evidence so you can get a better financial settlement, or was it to make the divorce process quicker? Or am I just confusing you with someone else? Sorry, I don't have it in me to go back and look through this whole thread.


----------



## LongWalk

Yessongs72 said:


> Hi Wysh, thanks for your concern.
> 
> No real news - recent texts have confirmed my thoughts that their number-one method of communication is by email from their respective offices, bummer. Recent texts also tell me that POSOM is desperate to get into her knickers. But every too-personal text (even something like "yrs") sends me a little bit lower.
> 
> I'm just feeling a bit jaded with it all. There was some gurl who posted on CWI with a story that was similar to my own, *i posted this and she replied, but I think she was a faker - the thread has gone - and I just felt a bit burnt by it.*
> 
> I have been reading, just not posting.



Learning experience. No harm.


----------



## Shaggy

Why are you not acting?


----------



## Yessongs72

Well, its time.

I was away for a couple of days (Thursday and Friday, returning Saturday). On the Wednesday WW sent POSOM a text about an email she had sent him (I can't access her work emails), he replied with a big smiley face. Later her sent her a text about what he was going to do to her with his tongue.

She told me (before and after) that she was going to a barbecue at a 'girl from works house' but at 6.30pm texted POSOM that she was stuck in traffic about half-way to his house (Oh yes - POSOMs wife is away in USA for two weeks). The next set of texts was this little exchange.

[01:30] WW > home
[01:32] POSOM > Good. My bed smells of you  
[01:33] WW > nite nite
[01:34] POSOM > :-* 

'MY BED SMELLS OF YOU' I thought I had detached but this has killed me more than I thought possible 'MY FVCKING BED SMELLS OF YOU' - what a cvnt.

Semen tested the pants she was wearing today. Purple Positive. Slag.

But there is a sweet bit - most of her family are visiting tomorrow afternoon (birthday), so I plan to confront/expose with her father and sisters in the same room (I realise that this is not going to be remotely easy). fifteen hours from now the bomb goes off and she changes from WW to STBEX. I'm done.

My bed smells of you !!!


----------



## Yessongs72

JustPuzzled said:


> I actually exchanged several PMs with this woman. She seemed pretty genuine. She said that someone was sending repeated vicious messages and that she was going to delete her account. I would not be surprised if she is still reading.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Oh, In that case I apologize, and thank her for her concern and advice.


----------



## turnera

Whatever you do, DO NOT BACK DOWN TOMORROW! They will push back at you, try to blame you.

Remain consistent - that you just want them to know WHAT SHE IS DOING and WHY YOU ARE DIVORCING HER.

Leave it at that.

Oh, and print out the texts and hand out copies before you begin speaking.


----------



## Acabado

Hi Yessongs72.
Wel... it was about time. The smoking gun! It was a slow torture monitoring the ongoing EA, trying to cath them only for their plans to fail.

You claim to be done, i can't fault you. Are you sure? did you have a plan beyond confrontation? Lawyered up already? Protected, somehow? Know the probable scenarios?


----------



## Acabado

I forgot, what about exposing this POS to her wife?
Chearterville in the back of your mind?


----------



## 3putt

So sorry Yessongs. I know how brutal this has been and is now. You've been in my thoughts and prayers and will continue to be.

People just never learn...do they.


----------



## Yessongs72

Acabado said:


> I forgot, what about exposing this POS to her wife?
> Chearterville in the back of your mind?


No, i'm going to send her copies of all the texts and phone-conversation-times-and-durations. Its a bit screwed by her being out of the country but I will send a copy to her work address so POSOM won't be able to intercept it.


----------



## phillybeffandswiss

Stay calm, let her rant, rave, call you names, say you are jealous and then, when she is done, say "Shouldn't his bed smell of BBQ not you?"

I'd blow it up as well. Cheating is terrible period, but right before a family gathering? Disgusting.


----------



## Will_Kane

Yessongs72 said:


> Well, its time.
> 
> I was away for a couple of days (Thursday and Friday, returning Saturday). On the Wednesday WW sent POSOM a text about an email she had sent him (I can't access her work emails), he replied with a big smiley face. Later her sent her a text about what he was going to do to her with his tongue.
> 
> She told me (before and after) that she was going to a barbecue at a 'girl from works house' but at 6.30pm texted POSOM that she was stuck in traffic about half-way to his house (Oh yes - POSOMs wife is away in USA for two weeks). The next set of texts was this little exchange.
> 
> [01:30] WW > home
> *[01:32] POSOM > Good. My bed smells of you  *[01:33] WW > nite nite
> [01:34] POSOM > :-*


"We're just friends. Yes, I went to visit him, I didn't tell you because I knew you would interpret the wrong way. You've always been controlling and jealous and manipulative. When I was there, it was a long drive, and I was tired, so he was gentlemanly enough to offer me to lay down on his bed. I fell asleep for an hour. I can't believe you trying to make this look like I was cheating!!! I told him nite nite. WE'RE FRIENDS! THAT'S HOW FRIENDS TALK TO EACH OTHER!!!! YOU WOULD KNOW IF YOU HAD ANY. How could you even interpret it that I was cheating?"​
Are you ready for the denial?


----------



## life101

Stay calm and carry a VAR on you. Let not anyone accuse you of any improper conduct. If possible, also set a hidden camera. By now, you should know enough to not trust a cheater.

Good luck.


----------



## alte Dame

Well, the positive semen test can't be spun, can it?

So sorry. It will be hard tomorrow. You'll feel your adrenaline pumping, but you're almost done after a very long haul. Best of luck.


----------



## Chaparral

Hope this ordeal is soon behind you. Sorry you had to go through this. Good hunting.


----------



## MattMatt

Yessongs72 said:


> Well, its time.
> 
> I was away for a couple of days (Thursday and Friday, returning Saturday). On the Wednesday WW sent POSOM a text about an email she had sent him (I can't access her work emails), he replied with a big smiley face. Later her sent her a text about what he was going to do to her with his tongue.
> 
> She told me (before and after) that she was going to a barbecue at a 'girl from works house' but at 6.30pm texted POSOM that she was stuck in traffic about half-way to his house (Oh yes - POSOMs wife is away in USA for two weeks). The next set of texts was this little exchange.
> 
> [01:30] WW > home
> [01:32] POSOM > Good. My bed smells of you
> [01:33] WW > nite nite
> [01:34] POSOM > :-*
> 
> 'MY BED SMELLS OF YOU' I thought I had detached but this has killed me more than I thought possible 'MY FVCKING BED SMELLS OF YOU' - what a cvnt.
> 
> Semen tested the pants she was wearing today. Purple Positive. Slag.
> 
> But there is a sweet bit - most of her family are visiting tomorrow afternoon (birthday), so I plan to confront/expose with her father and sisters in the same room (I realise that this is not going to be remotely easy). fifteen hours from now the bomb goes off and she changes from WW to STBEX. I'm done.
> 
> My bed smells of you !!!


Oh my lord. 

Look, I'll have my phone with me on Sunday. PM me if you want, tomorrow. Well, later today, now.

This is going to be tough. Put them both on Cheaterville.


----------



## happyman64

turnera said:


> Whatever you do, DO NOT BACK DOWN TOMORROW! They will push back at you, try to blame you.
> 
> Remain consistent - that you just want them to know WHAT SHE IS DOING and WHY YOU ARE DIVORCING HER.
> 
> Leave it at that.
> 
> Oh, and print out the texts and hand out copies before you begin speaking.


Hell, print them out but read them to her parents and family.

And then tell her to leave with her parents and to take her boyfriends tongue with her.

Stay tough.


----------



## southernsurf

Yessongs72 said:


> Well, its time.
> 
> I was away for a couple of days (Thursday and Friday, returning Saturday). On the Wednesday WW sent POSOM a text about an email she had sent him (I can't access her work emails), he replied with a big smiley face. Later her sent her a text about what he was going to do to her with his tongue.
> 
> She told me (before and after) that she was going to a barbecue at a 'girl from works house' but at 6.30pm texted POSOM that she was stuck in traffic about half-way to his house (Oh yes - POSOMs wife is away in USA for two weeks). The next set of texts was this little exchange.
> 
> [01:30] WW > home
> [01:32] POSOM > Good. My bed smells of you
> [01:33] WW > nite nite
> [01:34] POSOM > :-*
> 
> 'MY BED SMELLS OF YOU' I thought I had detached but this has killed me more than I thought possible 'MY FVCKING BED SMELLS OF YOU' - what a cvnt.
> 
> Semen tested the pants she was wearing today. Purple Positive. Slag.
> 
> But there is a sweet bit - most of her family are visiting tomorrow afternoon (birthday), so I plan to confront/expose with her father and sisters in the same room (I realise that this is not going to be remotely easy). fifteen hours from now the bomb goes off and she changes from WW to STBEX. I'm done.
> 
> My bed smells of you !!!



Good Luck, stay strong and don't let her back you down, your turn now to fight back!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## phillybeffandswiss

Will_Kane said:


> "We're just friends. Yes, I went to visit him, I didn't tell you because I knew you would interpret the wrong way. You've always been controlling and jealous and manipulative. When I was there, it was a long drive, and I was tired, so he was gentlemanly enough to offer me to lay down on his bed. I fell asleep for an hour. I can't believe you trying to make this look like I was cheating!!! I told him nite nite. WE'RE FRIENDS! THAT'S HOW FRIENDS TALK TO EACH OTHER!!!! YOU WOULD KNOW IF YOU HAD ANY. How could you even interpret it that I was cheating?"​
> Are you ready for the denial?


If this wasn't so sad, I'd laugh and hope she would say this.

You mean the beds at your girlfriends BBQ weren't nice enough?


----------



## thatbpguy

Just spent the last hour reading through all this thread. 

Unbelievable.

Hope all goes well tomorrow.


----------



## Woodchuck

I have followed this thread since day one...You are a class act...Bravo....Burn them to the ground...

the woodchuck


----------



## Dyokemm

Yessongs,

Sorry. I know this sucks for you.

But I am happy that your patience under what had to be excruciating circumstances finally paid off.

Now D your worthless, traitorous WW and crush this POS in every way possible.

When a WW betrays her H with a POS she knows he doesn't get on with, then I support the BH following a scorched earth policy against both of the AP's. 

This is an extremely cruel form of betrayal by her and I don't think anyone should ever allow an enemy to get away with injuring them. Screw that person to the maximum extent.


----------



## weightlifter

Good luck OP.

Wow near year long affair and they "only" did it 3 times.

How did they get ahead of you so you couldnt have a PI?

BTW get her to spill with a (false) hope of reconciling.

Here is a sample of a successful confront script I provided to someone

To do print this this page alone. Print each section and staple them together. Even as ironman you will be a mess.


Here is my suggested confrontation with wife to break her. You need to be firm but not cruel. All sadness must look like regret for losing your marriage.

HAVE evidence in differing envelopes. D papers in the top one. Phone entries. Evidence 1 2 3 4 in small box. PI report in another envelope.

Your heart is going to be beating 120+ BPM. Even prepared with an IRON MAN ATTITUDE you are going to be a mess. Be a dominant I wont take a like mess and NEVER BEG OR PLEAD. Have water for both of you as BOTH your mouths will go dry instantly. Firm NOT cruel. The pain on your face should be regret. Have water for both of you. your mouth will be desert dry in 1 second.


PRINT THIS XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX These to next page break separate


“Name, Do you love your life with me? Our family? US and our child? This is that day you have known had to be coming and have been dreading....”


I KNOW EVERYTHING” (watch her reaction)

I need a full confession for any chance to stay together for US... FOR OUR Child (denial) At any place marked denial if she caves and agrees skip to list of questions.

[push forward divorce papers. (shake head in regret)]

“I am sorry you have done this to us. And all for that serial cheating ****pile Name”


(denial)


“TODAY is your only this chance FOR ANY possibility of reconcilliation. For that chance you must tell me EVERYTHING from the beginning to the end. Leaving out nothing. It is YOUR actions that may cause our little child to have their world turned upside down. YOUR actions could cause us to split and crush their spirit”

AGAIN, I need a full confession from you for ANY chance to stay together for US... FOR OUR CHILD. DONT MAKE ME TAKE YOU TO COURT! (denial)

[PI evidence timing printed out from envelope.]

It is YOUR actions that could possibility end the marriage to the woman who, a few months ago I could never have believe not only had an affair... [shake head in disgust]
You brought HIM INTO OUR HOME! YOU VIOLATED OUR HOME!
HOW COULD YOU HIM INTO OUR HOME [date]
YOU VIOLATED OUR MARRIAGE BED
two months ago I would have willingly walked in front of a bullet for you. NO QUESTIONS ASKED

AGAIN, I need a full confession from you for ANY chance to stay together for US... FOR OUR DAUGHTER (denial)

Sexact, sexact, sexact? You want them with him and not with me? You wantonly crush our marriage!

AGAIN, I need a full confession from you for ANY chance to stay together for US... FOR OUR child (denial)

HOW COULD YOU EVEN DO THAT!?

AGAIN, I need a full confession!

Pull out evidence item 1 or picture of it

The time for lies is over (denial)

Pull out evidence item 2 or pic of it

Find the evidence item 3 and pull it out

OVER A long time period ! NO MORE LIES! (denial)

Pull evidence item 4 or pic of them. I KNOW OM has evidence

STOP the lies (denial)

Pull out phone entries


I need to know. For me to ever heal. For any shot at us recoverying. I need to know everything. (denial)


In our state, because you cheated, you get no alimony. I get the lions share of the assets. You will live in a trailer! Make me take you to court without a confession and I will go all out to take EVERYTHING


FOR THE SAKE OF A VERY GRIM LIFE FOR YOUR Child STOP LYING! (denial)


I WILL BRING OUT THE SICK THINGS YOU DID in open divorce court in front of the whole world. I WILL GO FOR FULL CUSTODY based on what happened JUST date.* DONT MAKE me take you out of our childs world!* FOR childname.* For ANY chance at US.* I NEED THAT CONFESSION.


You are going up a very bad road. I need your confession. (denial)

You will need to modify to your own situation but for what it is worth this one worked in approximately 1 minute. He never got close to the end.


----------



## KanDo

I have been following from afar. I have one piece of advice. I hope you have the panties to do an actually DNA test to conform that the semen isn't yours....... Just incase she tries the boldface lies plan

Good luck


----------



## Yessongs72

KanDo said:


> I have been following from afar. I have one piece of advice. I hope you have the panties to do an actually DNA test to conform that the semen isn't yours....... Just incase she tries the boldface lies plan
> 
> Good luck


We haven't had sex for over a fortnight - no way is that my cvm.

Matt, thanks for the offer, I expect I shall high-tail it to see the pastor of our church.

Panic attack this morning, not nice. I look at that test paper and it numbs me, then I just fold up. sh1t this is horrible.

'My bed smells of you" THE END


----------



## warlock07

Are you prepared for confrontation? Can you do it today?


----------



## Yessongs72

warlock07 said:


> Are you prepared for confrontation? Can you do it today?


internet gone squiffy, 3rd attempt at a reply...

Is anyone ever really prepared? I'm just going to take a deep breath and go for it. 

It's not tonight, its this afternoon - her family start arriving about 1pm (1 hours time). At some point I have to persuade my youngest niece to take the kids down to the park, then Drop-The-Bomb. Scary sh1t.

I've printed some of the ruder and more incriminating texts. Not much else to do now except panic. Oh and run the Dyson over the carpet.


----------



## Chaparral

You will probably be surprised how calmly you can do this. Show no emotion and do not cry in front of her. That will give her the excuse to say he is a better man.

Good luck


----------



## MattMatt

Good luck, mate! I am online and should be for most of the afternoon. I am doing a distance learning management course in my own time. 

Be strong. PM me if you want.
*
We are all here for you.*


----------



## MattMatt

Might be worth getting this moved to Private?


----------



## Thor

Good luck.


----------



## MrK

9 months of letting his wife fvck another man, waiting for this moment.

And it will go HORRIBLY wrong...

Good luck man.


----------



## Chaparral

MrK said:


> 9 months of letting his wife fvck another man, waiting for this moment.
> 
> And it will go HORRIBLY wrong...
> 
> Good luck man.


Most likely horribly wrong for his wife. I think it would have been healthier for him to have confronted her when he first found out. His goal of hurrying up a divorce has already gone awry.

I expect his resolve by now will be fearsome. She is walking into a train wreck, look out.


----------



## MattMatt

Still here, still on line. Bloody hell this management course I am doing is doing my head in!


----------



## MattMatt

Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs...


----------



## Woodchuck

Yessongs72 said:


> We haven't had sex for over a fortnight - no way is that my cvm.
> 
> Matt, thanks for the offer, I expect I shall high-tail it to see the pastor of our church.
> 
> Panic attack this morning, not nice. I look at that test paper and it numbs me, then I just fold up. sh1t this is horrible.
> 
> 'My bed smells of you" THE END


Be prepared for "It's yours"....

What a man, his swimmers still dripping into her knickers 2 weeks after the fact.....

Best of luck
the woodchuck


----------



## thatbpguy

I am neither passing judgment or giving an opinion, but is it right to do this publicly like this? I'm all for exposure and shame, but I wonder if he should confront her privately first, husband to whor... errrrrrrrrrr, wife.

That said, this could really backfire on him and make him to be a bad guy.

I hope it goes well.


----------



## MattMatt

thatbpguy said:


> I am neither passing judgment or giving an opinion, but is it right to do this publicly like this? I'm all for exposure and shame, but I wonder if he should confront her privately first, husband to whor... errrrrrrrrrr, wife.
> 
> That said, this could really backfire on him and make him to be a bad guy.
> 
> I hope it goes well.


A Man's (or woman's) gotta do what they gotta do.

This way she has limited opportunities to allow for her to reinvent their relationship and to monsterise him.


----------



## nuclearnightmare

It will make divorce a fait accompli, which is in his best interest. No excruciating R to have to consider or endure. Instead he takes the bullet train to a better life, and partner.


----------



## happyman64

Yessongs

Just wanted to let you know that I am thinking of you right now.

I know today will just suck but in a way I hope it frees you as well.

HM64

PS
Maybe you can call Q in the US and let her know what to expect when she gets home.


----------



## Vanguard

Praying for you
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Madman1

Woodchuck said:


> Be prepared for "It's yours"....
> 
> What a man, his swimmers still dripping into her knickers 2 weeks after the fact.....
> 
> Best of luck
> the woodchuck



Or "it was only one time."

I would say "ONLY!" Still thats bs.


----------



## weightlifter

It looks like it was "only" three times.

Oh wait. That is three times of:
Crushing a mans heart.
Destroying his ego.
Obliterating his ability to trust.

Possibly permanently damaging or destroying his ability to partake in one of the ultimate human experiences: true intimate loving sex between a couple.


----------



## MattMatt

weightlifter said:


> It looks like it was "only" three times.
> 
> Oh wait. That is three times of:
> Crushing a mans heart.
> Destroying his ego.
> Obliterating his ability to trust.
> 
> Possibly permanently damaging or destroying his ability to partake in one of the ultimate human experiences: true intimate loving sex between a couple.


And don't forget hurting any children, too...


----------



## Madman1

"Now my bed smells like you"

I dont think I could get past that.

I would tell her in front of her parents "now your panty's smell like him to."

I hope she cant lie her way out of this.

Wow I hope YS is ok these things never go as planned
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## MattMatt

How's it going, mate?

You OK?


----------



## thatbpguy

MattMatt said:


> How's it going, mate?
> 
> You OK?


I wonder if he's still alive.


----------



## 3putt

thatbpguy said:


> I wonder if he's still alive.


I would imagine it's been quite the chaotic day around that household. I wouldn't expect to hear from him before tomorrow.

Of course, that's assuming he IS still alive.


----------



## WyshIknew

Well he is probably dealing with a shet storm today.


----------



## thatbpguy

WyshIknew said:


> Well he is probably dealing with a shet storm today.


Of epic proportions.

Or maybe she broke down, admitted her guilt and the family rallied behind the both of them and it all ended in a group hug.

Maybe.


----------



## 3putt

thatbpguy said:


> Of epic proportions.
> 
> Or maybe she broke down, admitted her guilt and the family rallied behind the both of them and it all ended in a group hug.
> 
> Maybe.


I'm thinking this went similarly to RDMU's confrontation. Just a hunch.

Not so sure about the group hug part though.


----------



## WyshIknew

I dunno, he sounded done and has been for months. His whole reason for waiting was to obtain the evidence he needed to pull the trigger on divorce. Why would he change his mind now?

I don't recall if he had made any plans for after the 'event'?

As I said I suspect he is dealing with a shetstorm at the mo. Perhaps it was fairly traumatic and we will not see him till tomorrow.


----------



## thatbpguy

WyshIknew said:


> I dunno, he sounded done and has been for months. His whole reason for waiting was to obtain the evidence he needed to pull the trigger on divorce. Why would he change his mind now?
> 
> I don't recall if he had made any plans for after the 'event'?
> 
> As I said I suspect he is dealing with a shetstorm at the mo. Perhaps it was fairly traumatic and we will not see him till tomorrow.



While I don't think this is what happened (and he may also have chickened out) it is possible the family elders talked to him and tried to get them to agree to work on the marriage.... and under the stress he agreed.


----------



## Acabado

WyshIknew said:


> I dunno, he sounded done and has been for months. His whole reason for waiting was to obtain the evidence he needed to pull the trigger on divorce. Why would he change his mind now?
> 
> I don't recall if he had made any plans for after the 'event'?
> 
> As I said I suspect he is dealing with a shetstorm at the mo. Perhaps it was fairly traumatic and we will not see him till tomorrow.


That was my impresion too.
The smoking gun, the hard evident still hurts but he was somehow ready. I think waiting for so long must take it's toll. This kind of affair with scarce meetings are hard to catch.
He couln't just file without the smoking gun even when he knew it was the dealbreaker.
He won't change his mind.

He will come back when he's ready.


----------



## MattMatt

I wonder if she's feeling sorry, now? Too little, too late, I suspect.


----------



## 3putt

MattMatt said:


> I wonder if she's feeling sorry, now? Too little, too late, I suspect.


I would imagine she's feeling REALLY sorry right now. Especially considering the platform on which this exposure was executed.


----------



## The Middleman

3putt said:


> I would imagine she's feeling REALLY sorry right now. Especially considering the platform on which this exposure was executed.


And I'll add she has seen the errors of her ways and is truly remorseful.


----------



## Rugs

If he does it, he will be my hero and if he doesn't, he will still be my hero. 

At first I thought he would never get to this point. I thought it would get rug-swept or he would make excuses to stop monitoring the situation. I could never keep having sex with someone and keep my mouth shut if I knew they were cheating on me. Frankly, I didn't have much respect.

But he won me over with his logic and his patience. I hope everything works out in his favor. 

His wife deserves to be humiliated in front of her family if that is what he feels is best. God knows he has put up with a lot.

I wish I would have done the same in my own situation.

Next step is to contact OMW.


----------



## Chaparral

Its about 2am in London


----------



## Rugs

I think he's still awake either way.


----------



## MattMatt

Rugs said:


> I think he's still awake either way.


I am, too. And I should be in bed!

Fact is, I'm turning in, now. 

Hopefully it all went well for YS. Or as well as it could under the circumstances.


----------



## Shaggy

I hope the texts are already on their way to the OMW so the OM has his world of pain that he deserves coming to him.


----------



## weightlifter

thatbpguy said:


> Of epic proportions.
> 
> Or maybe she broke down, admitted her guilt and the family rallied behind the both of them and it all ended in a group hug.
> 
> Maybe.


Maybe Ill win the Powerball
Maybe players will cease to exist and we wont be needed any more... Maybe simply paying attention to 10 random married women wont result in three of them sleeping with you if you are willing to stick it out a few months... Maybe getting them to cheat will take something more than this exceedingly sickeningly simple thing... I can dream of a day when we are not needed.

As the great philosophers Aerosmith said.

Dream on
Dream on
Dream on
Dream on
Dream on

(no offense meant. Just sayin)
Ill guess if he did as planned she folded in about the same amount of time as RDMUs wife. Essentially if shes smart. Oh crap then how do I explain this away then I cant get around this one then cry hard. Ill also bet there is an entirely different outcome- Divorce.
Prayers with you YS


----------



## MattMatt

If she had really been as smart as she thought she was, she wouldn't have cheated herself out of her marriage. But hindsight is always 20/20.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Carlchurchill

that must have been the WORST family gathering EVER!!!!! OMG


----------



## MrK

All I know is that it went horribly off script within 15 seconds. I hope he's good on his feet.


----------



## weightlifter

He PMed you? or you are thinking about personal experience?


----------



## MattMatt

Oh, gawd! I hope not! 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Why Not Be Happy?

Good luck Yessongs72! Hope it went well and you are as okay as you can be.


----------



## Madman1

This is the lull after exposure, poor guy.

YS I just want to encourage you. If you are already sure you will be divorcing her, then that is the only outcome that matters.

Most BS don't get much from the in laws anyway, and you really cant control what people think and believe.

The truth usually becomes clear to anyone that wants to see it.
Your in laws will want to be somewhere near the middle (more on her side probably) because of the grandchildren anyway.

All the drama is like flying over the turbulence of a mountain scape, once it's behind you it loses its meaning and significance.

You know what they say, "any landing that you can walk away from is a good one."


----------



## MrK

weightlifter said:


> He PMed you? or you are thinking about personal experience?


If you are talking to me, no, he didn't PM me. But I've had my own discussions with my wife and have read plenty on these pages to know how it usually goes.


----------



## KanDo

Wow,

I think it must have gone very poorly to have no post. Confrontation is always tough, but with the whole family involved it may have been terrible. I can hear the cries of "crazy controlling YS hacking my phone and sniffing my panties. It his love juice. What a nut case!" I hope he was strong


----------



## MrK

It's kind of crazy. You've been preparing for months, a BLIND MAN could see the truth. Yet it still goes horribly wrong...


----------



## Thor

He could be getting some well deserved sleep. He could be hauling her stuff onto the front lawn. It is a tough day for him and we are just a bunch of strangers on the internet.

No battle plan survives first contact with the enemy. Of course his confrontation did not go to plan. His absence so far today doesn't mean anything.


----------



## thatbpguy

KanDo said:


> Wow,
> 
> I think it must have gone very poorly to have no post. Confrontation is always tough, but with the whole family involved it may have been terrible. I can hear the cries of "crazy controlling YS hacking my phone and sniffing my panties. It his love juice. What a nut case!" I hope he was strong


Maybe.

This thread reminds of that one recently where the guy had us all on edge and checking in constantly to see how it turned out and in the end it was all a hoax. Very similar.

That said, I am NOT saying this is a hoax as well, but just that the similarities are parallel to each other.


----------



## weightlifter

Um. While I would like an update...

TAM is prolly not his first concern. This is his life. Yesterday may well have been the worst day of his life. Certainly in his top 10.


----------



## MrK

a 9 month hoax on an anonymous website. The guy would DEFINITELY have problems if that were the case.


----------



## thatbpguy

MrK said:


> a 9 month hoax on an anonymous website. The guy would DEFINITELY have problems if that were the case.


Good point.

Look, for the record, I don't think it's a hoax. Only that it crossed my mind in light of that other thread.


----------



## weightlifter

Just hoping she broke as fast as RDMUs wife on his April 18 confront.


----------



## MattMatt

Slightly concerned now, but his sole priority will be his children. 

YS, mate, I have my mobile to hand. If you need to PM someone, drop me a line. 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## thatbpguy

Bump.


----------



## MattMatt

thatbpguy said:


> Bump.


Bumping again
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## WyshIknew

One thing that concerns me is that YS72 had plans for exposure which have been ongoing for a year or so.

Never once did I see a plan for after the exposure other than 'divorce the b---h'.

For instance Shamwow had a plan sorted from exposure all the way through the aftermath, all of which played out well for him.

I just wonder if YS72 has been so focussed on the exposure part he forgot to plan for the aftermath and is now busy doing things on the fly?


----------



## MattMatt

WyshIknew said:


> One thing that concerns me is that YS72 had plans for exposure which have been ongoing for a year or so.
> 
> Never once did I see a plan for after the exposure other than 'divorce the b---h'.
> 
> For instance Shamwow had a plan sorted from exposure all the way through the aftermath, all of which played out well for him.
> 
> I just wonder if YS72 has been so focussed on the exposure part he forgot to plan for the aftermath and is now busy doing things on the fly?


Especially if church elders are involved.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## thatbpguy

MattMatt said:


> Especially if church elders are involved.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Good point.

Depending on the church they could have insisted on reconciliation.


----------



## MattMatt

thatbpguy said:


> Good point.
> 
> Depending on the church they could have insisted on reconciliation.


And on secrecy and they might have banned hin from using TAM.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## TRy

Exposing to her with her family there could have backfired on him big time. She would be mad that he did not discuss this alone with her first, as many cheaters seem to think that exposure to family is a bigger betrayal than their cheating. Also, since it is her family and not his, they might have agreed with her that he should not have involved them as they do not want to get involved in such things. Add in that all he had was an email that she would put a spin on with an family audience that agreed with her, and or that her family may have already known about the other man (OM), and this could have gone very badly for him.


----------



## Vegasguy

Church of Scientology? We haven't heard anything because they're both on their way to Hemet California for reprogramming? Either that or they're at the San Francisco airport, wearing robes and asking travelers for money. 

Sorry, but a little irreverent humor seemed to be needed.

Hope all is well. His posts seemed genuine.


----------



## MattMatt

I think more likely to be a fundamentalist sect of some kind.


----------



## thatbpguy

TRy said:


> Exposing to her with her family there could have backfired on him big time. She would be mad that he did not discuss this alone with her first, as many cheaters seem to think that exposure to family is a bigger betrayal than their cheating. Also, since it is her family and not his, they might have agreed with her that he should not have involved them as they do not want to get involved in such things. Add in that all he had was an email that she would put a spin on with an family audience that agreed with her, and or that her family may have already known about the other man (OM), and this could have gone very badly for him.


I wondered about that. My wife's family stood behind their betraying dughter/sister 100%. Even when she said it had nothing to do with me they really circled their wagons. He may have had a real pounding.


----------



## KanDo

crickets.......


----------



## manfromlamancha

And yet another bump


----------



## Chaparral

This is really, really worriesome . I do not like this silence. I just do not think Yessongs was the type to not come back and go over the confrontation. I hope my feeling something really went bad is wrong. I guess its better to not even think about it. I sure hope every one is safe.

Prayers for Yes's family.


----------



## JustSomeGuyWho

Chaparral said:


> This is really, really worriesome . I do not like this silence. I just do not think Yessongs was the type to not come back and go over the confrontation. I hope my feeling something really went bad is wrong. I guess its better to not even think about it. I sure hope every one is safe.
> 
> Prayers for Yes's family.


To be hopeful though, he sometimes goes long periods without posting.


----------



## MattMatt

Just hoping and praying that it went well.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## thatbpguy

Well, I am sure he's alive.

That said, I have to admit I'd have loved to be a fly on the wall.


----------



## doubletrouble

Tapping fingers... That was a really great album, by the way.


----------



## Decorum

Has RDMU come back yet?
(LostViking I know I know)


----------



## manfromlamancha

I wonder if we will hear from YS again


----------



## weightlifter

He has alot on his plate. Regardless of outcome.


----------



## MattMatt

weightlifter said:


> He has alot on his plate. Regardless of outcome.


The church elders might have got him to agree to not use the evil Internet for a period of time whilst they try to help salvage the awful mess his wife made.


----------



## MattMatt

Can't PM him.


----------



## Nucking Futs

Yessongs72 said:


> internet gone squiffy, 3rd attempt at a reply...
> 
> Is anyone ever really prepared? I'm just going to take a deep breath and go for it.
> 
> It's not tonight, its this afternoon - her family start arriving about 1pm (1 hours time). At some point I have to persuade my youngest niece to take the kids down to the park, then Drop-The-Bomb. Scary sh1t.
> 
> I've printed some of the ruder and more incriminating texts. Not much else to do now except panic. Oh and run the Dyson over the carpet.


He hasn't been on TAM since this post. Matt, what church?


----------



## Decorum

Before I came to TAM I would not have known better, but the approach in church leadership that I have seen, across several denominations equates to rugsweeping.

Not intentionally, but the mandate to preserve the marriage, offer forgiveness, and encouragement usually fails to address the damage done to the BS and the root cause of infidelity in the WS.

It would change the Church if a requirement for ordination was 6 months of research on TAM.

Just my opinion.


----------



## MattMatt

Nucking Futs said:


> He hasn't been on TAM since this post. Matt, what church?


He never mentioned a denomination, just something about Church Elders.

Could be Scottish Presbyterian, Plymouth Brethren, etc?


----------



## Nucking Futs

JustPuzzled said:


> I don't PM much. Why can't you PM him? Are you blocked?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


There's no pm link on his profile.


----------



## 3putt

Nucking Futs said:


> There's no pm link on his profile.


All you have to do is click on his username on any post he's made and select send private message to send him one.

I have (I think) a better idea though. Why don't we just sit back and let him post when he's ready to post? This a long term marriage that has been nuked by adultery, and I'm quite sure keeping us up to speed on what's happening in his life is not at the top of his priority list.

This is crushing stuff. Pretty obvious he wanted to be wrong, and now?..............

Feeling for you yessongs.


----------



## LongWalk

It is not surprising that he has fallen silent. His exposure plan pitted him against a group of people. Humans are pack animals and a lone individual who is not an establish alpha leader will have a difficult time controlling a confrontation.

My bet is is it went badly wrong and he is in a bad place. Hope I am wrong.

Yes Songs, if you are still here, TAM is here for you. Much can be rectified or addressed even if movie endings are rare.


----------



## Nucking Futs

3putt said:


> *All you have to do is click on his username on any post he's made and select send private message to send him one.*
> 
> I have (I think) a better idea though. Why don't we just sit back and let him post when he's ready to post? This a long term marriage that has been nuked by adultery, and I'm quite sure keeping us up to speed on what's happening in his life is not at the top of his priority list.
> 
> This is crushing stuff. Pretty obvious he wanted to be wrong, and now?..............
> 
> Feeling for you yessongs.


Really? That's all?


----------



## tom67

Nucking Futs said:


> Really? That's all?


A few years back I used to watch the ID channel (investigation discovery) I know those are EXTREME cases but I really about him.


----------



## Chaparral

His PMs are blocked.


----------



## 3putt

Chaparral said:


> His PMs are blocked.


I wasn't aware that was an option. Oh well.


----------



## Vanguard

MattMatt said:


> He never mentioned a denomination, just something about Church Elders.
> 
> Could be Scottish Presbyterian, Plymouth Brethren, etc?


If he's Presby or Protestant or any related branch he's farked, because they're sticklers with that. 

My divorce was as clean as it gets- both Matt. 19 and I Cor. 7 fulfilled-- and I still got flack from people. I'm not allowed to preach in certain circles anymore.


----------



## Thorburn

Vanguard said:


> If he's Presby or Protestant or any related branch he's farked, because they're sticklers with that.
> 
> My divorce was as clean as it gets- both Matt. 19 and I Cor. 7 fulfilled-- and I still got flack from people. I'm not allowed to preach in certain circles anymore.


When I gave up my ordination last year, I was only doing ministry PT, my eccleciastical body told me I did not have to do so under the circumstances and they said the same thing to me even if I sought D. I felt I did. Had I gotten D it would not have ended ministry but some churches would have never considered me. I do understand their thought process but there are many other opportunities in other churches, and I tend to run in conservative circles. 

So it all depends and like was said, some groups will not tolerate D at all. 

He might be in R. She may have seen the light. Normally when things turn like that the OP goes quiet.


----------



## nuclearnightmare

I do think he owes his supporters here a quick. "I'm ok, will post more later" so people don't worry whether something bad happened.


----------



## TRy

nuclearnightmare said:


> I do think he owes his supporters here a quick. "I'm ok, will post more later" so people don't worry whether something bad happened.


 I hope that what we said to him was of some help, but he owes us nothing. He is going through a very dark time and needs to look after himself right now. I wish him well.


----------



## Chaparral

He doesn't have to give anyone any details. It would be thoughtful if he would let us know if he survived.


----------



## WyshIknew

Bump.

YS72 hasn't logged on since early August. Hope he is ok.


----------



## GROUNDPOUNDER

Something obviously did not go as had planned/hoped during and, or after the big confrontation... Or he didn't end up confronting at all.

Also, everyone on here want's to be, or see, a BS score a victory on things like confrontations. You're going through the worst time of your life(short of a close person's passing away) when you post here.

Then, you post that you're about to take a big step, like confronting the WS, in front of family/friends, no less, and it doesn't go at all like you had hoped, or planned for...

It's tough to post those painful results here afterwards.

At least that's why I hope he hasn't come back here... I wish he'd just post one more time to say that he's o.k. and just needs to handle this on his own now.


----------



## MattMatt

I hope Yessongs is OK.


----------



## Chaparral

MattMatt said:


> I hope Yessongs is OK.


Considering how long it took to catch them, the wear and tear had to be hell. I hink Rdmu and yessongs thread go along way to prove you don't wait to catch them in the act. Its to devastating to sit back and "watch" it happen.


----------



## happyman64

:iagree:

I just hope he is ok and did not lose it or do something regrettable.


----------



## Chaparral

Yessongs was cool, he liked formula 1 and Kimi Raikonen. ; (


----------



## MattMatt

Chaparral said:


> Yessongs was cool, he liked formula 1 and Kimi Raikonen. ; (


Just have to hope that no news is good news.


----------



## happyman64

you out there Yessongs?????

Let us know you are ok.


----------



## Chaparral

He was going to expose in front of her family. Someone must have offended.


----------



## GROUNDPOUNDER

I think it's more like something had happened, or he had done, that he's embarrassed about. He doesn't want to face the music that he figures some of the TAMers would be playing.

If so, I can see his point. I know that I have read back on more than one of my past posts in TAM and thought to myself... Who is that a$$hole?


----------



## WyshIknew

Bump again


----------



## Emptyshelldad

Wow, it's weird how you begin to hope for a person you don't even know. Hoping we hear something soon , but then again some of hisnposts were pretty spread out so it's possible we won't hear how it went which is a real shame considering reading these accounts helps others in similar situations.


----------



## movin on

I always wondered how he made out. Yes songs and bolio were two I always wondered about
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## MattMatt

I wonder if we'll ever find out? Yessongs, if you are reading this, please PM someone, OK? We care about you.


----------



## movin on

MattMatt said:


> I wonder if we'll ever find out? Yessongs, if you are reading this, please PM someone, OK? We care about you.


I hope he does. Not as need to know how the confrontation went but to make sure he is ok and happy with whatever path he chose.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## verpin zal

I'd say the man confronted and the whole family backed up the WW. Some fake remorse, it meant nothings I'm sorrys flying here and there, that "bed smell" is some tongue in cheek joke every ex's use every now and then, some shower of tears and bam. The man's emotions are twirling like some crazed marionette, right away forgives and decides to R - a false one.

I ardently hope this is not the case.


----------



## just got it 55

verpin zal said:


> I'd say the man confronted and the whole family backed up the WW. Some fake remorse, it meant nothings I'm sorrys flying here and there, that "bed smell" is some tongue in cheek joke every ex's use every now and then, some shower of tears and bam. The man's emotions are twirling like some crazed marionette, right away forgives and decides to R - a false one.
> 
> I ardently hope this is not the case.


I would say it clearly did not go well

Just like Russ101


----------



## WyshIknew

Strangely Yessongs hasn't logged on since his last post several months back.

At least Russ101 is allegedly getting $150,000 hush money out of it.

One of his last posts stated that his wife wanted to reconcile but he was going ahead with the divorce and she had until then to prove herself to him.


----------



## WyshIknew

The worst thing is when they go completely quiet like this because you do tend to consider worst case scenarios.

Have they died, had to stop posting on legal advice etc etc.

Reminds me of another long time poster whose wife got the OM's name tattooed on her, then realised she really wanted hubby.

He was going great guns then suddenly just stopped posting for some reason.


----------



## Chaparral

WyshIknew said:


> The worst thing is when they go completely quiet like this because you do tend to consider worst case scenarios.
> 
> Have they died, had to stop posting on legal advice etc etc.
> 
> Reminds me of another long time poster whose wife got the OM's name tattooed on her, then realised she really wanted hubby.
> 
> He was going great guns then suddenly just stopped posting for some reason.


He seemed to be losing it mentally too. He was coming apart. He had held it together but when he got his family back, he just went to hell.


----------



## Chaparral

Yessongs also set his acct up to not recieve pms.


----------



## happyman64

Just like HerHusbands threads.

What a shame.


----------



## larry.gray

WyshIknew said:


> The worst thing is when they go completely quiet like this because you do tend to consider worst case scenarios.
> 
> Have they died, had to stop posting on legal advice etc etc.
> 
> Reminds me of another long time poster whose wife got the OM's name tattooed on her, then realised she really wanted hubby.
> 
> He was going great guns then suddenly just stopped posting for some reason.


Then there is the guy that figured out that his wife was a long time serial cheater, dumped her and then shortly later ended up in a coma after a work accident. His WW was posting on another forum and told them about it.


----------



## just got it 55

I just went through Can'thinkstraights tread

I have no earthly idea how BS survives this sh!t


----------



## WyshIknew

larry.gray said:


> Then there is the guy that figured out that his wife was a long time serial cheater, dumped her and then shortly later ended up in a coma after a work accident. His WW was posting on another forum and told them about it.


I have to say I thought that one lived under a bridge. The writing style of both of them, man and wife was very similar. He also was meant to be somebody uneducated and working a low paid job and yet his thread was peppered here and there with literary quotes.


----------



## WyshIknew

happyman64 said:


> Just like HerHusbands threads.
> 
> What a shame.


HerHusband.

Yes that was the one. He just suddenly stopped posting.


----------



## Acabado

larry.gray said:


> Then there is the guy that figured out that his wife was a long time serial cheater, dumped her and then shortly later ended up in a coma after a work accident. His WW was posting on another forum and told them about it.


He was lascarx. His wife also stopped posting in the other forum. Unlikely we'll get updates from anyone.


----------



## The Middleman

Acabado said:


> He was lascarx. His wife also stopped posting in the other forum. Unlikely we'll get updates from anyone.


What a shame. He was a guy who knew how to handle a cheating spouse.


----------



## Thor

Acabado said:


> He was lascarx. His wife also stopped posting in the other forum. Unlikely we'll get updates from anyone.


Can you give any hints where to find his wife's posts?


----------



## Acabado

Thor said:


> Can you give any hints where to find his wife's posts?


Check your PMs.


----------



## Noble1

Hope it went well for the OP.

Just got through this thread in one sitting and now I'm all like....what was the end.

Sorry for my drama need, just hope it ended well for OP.


----------



## Dyokemm

"Main thing is January 2012 and reaching for that big old spray can of Floozy-B-Gone"

This was my personal favorite....I literally chocked on my drink when I read that...I was laughing so hard.


----------



## larry.gray

WyshIknew said:


> I have to say I thought that one lived under a bridge. The writing style of both of them, man and wife was very similar. He also was meant to be somebody uneducated and working a low paid job and yet his thread was peppered here and there with literary quotes.


I considered that a distinct possibility. Trolls don't like leaving people hanging though.


----------

