# Full Circle - Now What ?



## bill2011 (Feb 5, 2011)

Hi,

It's been a while since I've been on here, been a recovering nice guy since last November, I have learned a lot about my self and my wife during this process and I would like to say things got better but they haven't. While my W has made some attempts to make things better, I have lost all interest in my wife, don't know why, not interested in sex with her anymore. Maybe all the years of chasing/begging etc have taken it's toll on me. Don't know what to do. Have 2 children and divorce will destroy their lives.

I've spent years trying to have an active sex life with her and now I don't even want it - WTF !!

I can't imagine spending the rest of my life like this


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## Acorn (Dec 16, 2010)

Yikes, I just got through posting in another thread almost this exact same sentiment. Seems like the more I detach from the old dynamic, the less I am interested.


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## Lon (Jun 6, 2011)

I'm there with you, despite the almost sexless marriage and the attraction I had for her at one point, because of the way she was acting and choosing to have affair and leave the marriage, I am so not interested in her sexually. I am definitely lonely, and find her as physically attractive as ever, the sight of her repulses me. Maybe that is why its been so easy to get my head to accept the end of the marriage, but having my family and my dream torn up is still so hard for my heart to accept.


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## Enchantment (May 11, 2011)

I would think that if you are not interested in sex with your wife, then she is likely not actually meeting the emotional needs that you really have. Sex is likely just one of those needs. What OTHER things do you need from your wife that she may not be fulfilling? Does she respect you? Show admiration for you? Is she trustworthy?


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

bill2011 said:


> Don't know what to do


About what exactly? You don't want what you don't want. What is it can't imagine?


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## AFEH (May 18, 2010)

bill2011 said:


> Hi,
> 
> It's been a while since I've been on here, been a recovering nice guy since last November, I have learned a lot about my self and my wife during this process and I would like to say things got better but they haven't. While my W has made some attempts to make things better, I have lost all interest in my wife, don't know why, not interested in sex with her anymore. Maybe all the years of chasing/begging etc have taken it's toll on me. Don't know what to do. Have 2 children and divorce will destroy their lives.
> 
> ...


You are probably suffering from neglect, emotional, psychological, physical, affection etc. You’ve been chasing your wife for what you need for so long. Whereas there shouldn’t actually be any need at all to chase for these things in a marriage, they should come naturally, without much work at all. Friends ask me if I don’t feel alone after being with my wife for over 40 years. I tell them men who are married and living with their wife can feel very lonely indeed.


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## Catherine602 (Oct 14, 2010)

I wonder if it may be that part of the manning up process is the profound realization of how badly you have been misunderstood by your wife. Maybe even treated cruelly or made to feel like a creep for finding your wife sexually attractive. 

You may recognize the paradox - we woman long to be sexually attractive and you paid this ultimate compliment to the woman who says she loves you but you have been made to suffer for it. 

In a way, I think that part of the healing process has to be an acknowledgment from your wife that she recognizes that she was misinformed about sex in the marriage and that she is sorry that you suffered for so long. 

Your wife may not have purposely set out to hurt you but you were hurt. I don't see how it is humanly possible to suddenly throw away years of hurt and resentment that has to be worked through. Does that sound reasonable and do you think that may be the case?


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## alphaomega (Nov 7, 2010)

Catherine602 said:


> I wonder if it may be that part of the manning up process is the profound realization of how badly you have been misunderstood by your wife. Maybe even treated cruelly or made to feel like a creep for finding your wife sexually attractive.
> 
> You may recognize the paradox - we woman long to be sexually attractive and you paid this ultimate compliment to the woman who says she loves you but you have been made to suffer for it.
> 
> ...


Interesting post. My wife called me a creep or similar for telling her she was hot, sexy, attractive, gave me a hard on. I didn't get it. I was her husband, but thinking she's sexually attractive was wrong?

Of course. That was just me. She didn't have any problem whatsoever with her boyfriend texting her those sentiments.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## joe kidd (Feb 8, 2011)

alphaomega said:


> Interesting post. My wife called me a creep or similar for telling her she was hot, sexy, attractive, gave me a hard on. I didn't get it. I was her husband, but thinking she's sexually attractive was wrong?
> 
> Of course. That was just me. She didn't have any problem whatsoever with her boyfriend texting her those sentiments.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Yeah. The boyfriend could talk as nasty as he wanted with mine.


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## chillymorn (Aug 11, 2010)

I think eventually something just snaps and you start to realise that they are just self centered people and if you really look at anybody who is self centered no matter how pretty. they are ulgy on the inside.

you shouldn't have to convince someone to love you.


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## Acorn (Dec 16, 2010)

Catherine602 said:


> I wonder if it may be that part of the manning up process is the profound realization of how badly you have been misunderstood by your wife. Maybe even treated cruelly or made to feel like a creep for finding your wife sexually attractive.
> 
> You may recognize the paradox - we woman long to be sexually attractive and you paid this ultimate compliment to the woman who says she loves you but you have been made to suffer for it.
> 
> ...


Thought about this post a lot last night.

At least for me as a former doormat trying to improve, you start with the healthy assumption that there will be sexual fulfillment in a marriage.

You get told you are a creep so you back off. You are told you are a sexual addict so you self-care in hiding. You realize that she is not into you, but there are plenty of gals on the internet that pretend to be, so you pick up a porn habit. Or whatever. Your sexuality is driven completely underground and you think it's your fault.

You wake up one day and realize the popular "we are just roommates". You get through the anger and if you are brave, you face up to your part of the problem. You realize a lot of the roommate situation is because of you. The underground living needs to go. The porn needs to go. The shame needs to go. And the self esteem has to be allowed to come back.

You man up and start to realize that sexuality is a good thing. You realize that a roommate situation is unacceptable and not what you want. You want to begin a healthy sexual relationship.

And that's when you realize your only option short of divorce is to start the sexual relationship is the one that helped put you in your personal hell for years, whether she meant to or not. And when you realize how profoundly she misunderstands you, and realize how little she's done to improve herself while you've been on this all-consuming manning up journey, you wonder if you even want to look at her in that way again, let alone whether it is even healthy.


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## AFEH (May 18, 2010)

Men can only take a certain amount of abuse. The level of abuse they can take just depends on the man.

But some don’t even know they are being abused and that what’s typically being abused is their Good Nature. But the abuse can get to be such that the man finally Breaks (Smashes, Ruptures). This is the time when the man can have a true Identity Crisis or Crisis of Identity.

The “Who am I?” questions begin to start. With some they have to go right back to “I Think Therefore I Am” before they can start the journey of rebuilding themselves.

But this time round they get to chose, within parameters, Who they want to be. It can be one of the most interesting and rewarding of life’s journeys.


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## joshbjoshb (Jul 11, 2011)

bill2011 said:


> Hi,
> 
> It's been a while since I've been on here, been a recovering nice guy since last November, I have learned a lot about my self and my wife during this process and I would like to say things got better but they haven't. While my W has made some attempts to make things better, I have lost all interest in my wife, don't know why, not interested in sex with her anymore. Maybe all the years of chasing/begging etc have taken it's toll on me. Don't know what to do. Have 2 children and divorce will destroy their lives.
> 
> ...


Bill, I so feel your pain.

I am also in the manning up process. And just like you, I just lost any interest to fight... or to man up... or to be always the one leading and active in this marriage.

You know, once you stop the abuse (or at least you realize it for what it is - abuse! your wife was abusing you), you start to remember what you were looking for in your wife.

If you are a nice guy, you were looking for a nice girl, emotionally stable, someone who is empowered and can take charge... you want her to be more independent...

But, if your wife is not, and she is having many emotional issues (and all women who are treating their husband like grabage do! They grew up in homes without proper marriages, or they have other issues), at some point you are just fed up. Why is it that I have to think, initiate and deal with her crazy behavioral issues?

I don't mind supporting her. I am fine with having someone which is weak and needs me. But one thing - she MUST realize that she needs me. Cry, don't yell. Come for a hug, don't start cursing me out instead.

It all boils down to the fact that your wife and my wife do not know how to deal with their emotions.

I wish you the best of luck, and to me too. I don't want to get divorced. I have kids, and my wife can be an excellent wife in all aspects if she will take care of her emotional self.

Will she?

What will the future hold for me?

Please pray for me.


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## Enchantment (May 11, 2011)

I think, perhaps, what one sees when one partner in a marriage has committed to making a large positive change, such as manning up, is that the other partner has not really committed to making a similar change. They may react to the changes in their partner (hopefully in a positive way), but there's nothing to guarantee that they will also make a large positive change.

However, I believe, that marriage is about COMMITMENT between two people. Your wives need to COMMIT to you and to your marriage.

"_There's a difference between interest and commitment. When you're interested in doing something, you do it only when circumstance permit. When you're committed to something, you accept no excuses, only results_.”

I think what you (and Acorn) have been experiencing is that your wives have not made a like-minded commitment to improving the marriage with you.

“_There's no abiding success without commitment_.” ~ Anthony Robbins 

Perhaps your wives will make that commitment to you and the marriage in time, but I think that part of 'manning up' is getting to the point where you can decide how long you await a commitment from your wife and whether you are willing to go if that commitment doesn't come.

"_God grant me the serenity 
to accept the things I cannot change; 
courage to change the things I can;
and wisdom to know the difference_." ~ Reinhold Niebuhr 

Best wishes.


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## AFEH (May 18, 2010)

Enchantment said:


> I think, perhaps, what one sees when one partner in a marriage has committed to making a large positive change, such as manning up, is that the other partner has not really committed to making a similar change. They may react to the changes in their partner (hopefully in a positive way), but there's nothing to guarantee that they will also make a large positive change.
> 
> However, I believe, that marriage is about COMMITMENT between two people. Your wives need to COMMIT to you and to your marriage.
> 
> ...


That is all so very true. The man “manning up” often overlooks to test his wife to see if she is committed to him and the marriage. I tested my wife on a few occasions by asking her to retake our vows. She turned me down flat and still I didn’t learn.

So the men should test their wives to see if they are fit enough to actually be their wives.


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## maudite (Aug 29, 2011)

joshbjoshb said:


> You know, once you stop the abuse (or at least you realize it for what it is - abuse! your wife was abusing you), you start to remember what you were looking for in your wife.
> 
> If you are a nice guy, you were looking for a nice girl, emotionally stable, someone who is empowered and can take charge... you want her to be more independent...
> 
> ...


This really spoke to me. My wife came from a very messed op childhood and had many problems. She told me once that I saved her. I came and picked her up and gave her the stability in life she needed. Her emotional problems have been constant and I have done nothing but try to help her through them our entire relationship. I have helped her change her behavior, change her bad habits and become a better person. In the end she rejected me by telling me I never did anything for her, I never really understood or knew her. She says she has changed for the better and left me behind and I will never catch up to her so I shouldn't even try............I just had a revelation.......

Thank you


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## maudite (Aug 29, 2011)

Holy ****.....Thank you so much. You have no idea.


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## bill2011 (Feb 5, 2011)

I don't regret the manning-up part at all. While I am still working on myself I feel much much better. I'm not looking to run away from my marriage either but at some level I know I deserve to have someone who can express their love both emotionally and sexually. I've been coming to this site for quite some time now and I know their are women out there who care about their man and have an interest in sex. These women are even excited about it - what a concept. Right now I don't see my W ever being that person.


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

So is it just 'her' you're not attracted to or everyone? I haven't felt physically attracted to my wife in more years than you can count. But I don't see it as a big deal because I'm not attracted to anyone. I can't remember the last time I was 'turned on'. That part's dead. I don't miss it or regret it I don't feel anything, good or bad about it at all. It's nothing, unimportant.


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## Kobo (May 13, 2010)

Divorce will not destroy your children's life.


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## bill2011 (Feb 5, 2011)

I'm not dead, I still have desires and want to have someone special to share that with. Yes, Divorce will not destroy my kids life but being realistic it will affect their lives. We will have to give up the house as neither would be able to afford it. I feel like I am stuck with my happiness vs providing for my children.


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## chillymorn (Aug 11, 2010)

bill2011 said:


> I'm not dead, I still have desires and want to have someone special to share that with. Yes, Divorce will not destroy my kids life but being realistic it will affect their lives. We will have to give up the house as neither would be able to afford it. I feel like I am stuck with my happiness vs providing for my children.


very diffacult place to be.


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## chillymorn (Aug 11, 2010)

Runs like Dog said:


> So is it just 'her' you're not attracted to or everyone? I haven't felt physically attracted to my wife in more years than you can count. But I don't see it as a big deal because I'm not attracted to anyone. I can't remember the last time I was 'turned on'. That part's dead. I don't miss it or regret it I don't feel anything, good or bad about it at all. It's nothing, unimportant.


you sound depressed 

lossing intrest in things you used to like is a sign of depression.along with loss of sex drive and indefferance


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## Kobo (May 13, 2010)

bill2011 said:


> I'm not dead, I still have desires and want to have someone special to share that with. Yes, Divorce will not destroy my kids life but being realistic it will affect their lives. We will have to give up the house as neither would be able to afford it. I feel like I am stuck with my happiness vs providing for my children.




Children are extremely resilient. What's better for them? Growing up in a particular house or growing up with a happy father? Listen, if you are so concerned about your kids that you are willing to take on living without your own happiness then I know that your the type of father that will make sure they have what they need whether you're in the same home or not. You will find a way. At one point in my life I lived with my mother and brother in a one room apartment. My brother and I shared a pull out bed. That did not do any damage on either of us.


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## bill2011 (Feb 5, 2011)

Kobo,

I hear ya, I can't help but be proud of the home I've provided for my children and everything they have and in some sense my actions could take that away from them so I guess if I go down this path I'm concerned about what they will have to go through.


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## ManDup (Apr 22, 2011)

joshbjoshb said:


> Bill, I so feel your pain.
> 
> I am also in the manning up process. And just like you, I just lost any interest to fight... or to man up... or to be always the one leading and active in this marriage.
> 
> ...


Stop looking for someone else to do your job. Your job as a man is to take charge, to be the captain of the ship. It's either you or her, and you've seen what leaving her in charge does. By nature women are just more emotional creatures, and that is by many years of evolution of the brain. Having the most emotional person do the heavy lifting in the relationship is just not a good idea. It won't work with her, or anyone else. You have to be the rock. So stop being lazy. Get to work and do what a man's gotta do.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

In short, if you want to be treated like "the man" - which has deep meaning - then "be the man".

She won't treat you like "the man" unless you are one.

That means passing Fitness Tests with flying colors.




ManDup said:


> Stop looking for someone else to do your job. Your job as a man is to take charge, to be the captain of the ship. It's either you or her, and you've seen what leaving her in charge does. By nature women are just more emotional creatures, and that is by many years of evolution of the brain. Having the most emotional person do the heavy lifting in the relationship is just not a good idea. It won't work with her, or anyone else. You have to be the rock. So stop being lazy. Get to work and do what a man's gotta do.


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## joshbjoshb (Jul 11, 2011)

I must update you guys something. I am still in the learning process and I am discovering new things every day.

Last night was the first time in years of marriage that she apologized! Well not really but kind of. 

Here's how it unfolded:

I am working from home so I have flexible hours. I told her that once a week I'd get up with the kids and take care of them so she can sleep another hour or so.

I got up and gave my child a food she didn't really think was the best for him so she yelled at me "I'd rather you not help me with the kids if you don't do it the way I want". To which I said "no problem, I am doing you a favor and if you don't want it I won't do it again. However, if you do, you will have to respect my decision and whenever you have a problem with them I'd gladly hear them if you communicate them in a respectful manner. 

I hate arguments so what I would usually do would be not to bring up the issue at all. Well now I learned I should deal with it, so in the evening I brought the issue again.

She said "well I am sorry but in the morning I had a really hard time because of x y and z" (it made perfect sense.
I said "I am sorry you had a hard time but please do not let out your anger at me".

Well, do you know how excited I am? For her to say the words "I am sorry?" it's like a miracle. Someone who was always right, apologizing to the "always wrong"....

Every day that goes by I see more and more how much she is craving leadership in our marriage, and I am happy to provide it. It is not always so simple and rosy, but I really hope we are getting better.

Still pray. We have a long way to go!


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## joshbjoshb (Jul 11, 2011)

Oh, and I should mentioned one more thing re sex. I believe than every man has a MAJOR sex drive just waiting to be activated.. your lack of it just shows how much you disrespect your wife and therefore don't care to be with her. I believe that this can change.


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## dontwanttoloseher (Aug 21, 2010)

Enchantment said:


> I would think that if you are not interested in sex with your wife, then she is likely not actually meeting the emotional needs that you really have. Sex is likely just one of those needs. What OTHER things do you need from your wife that she may not be fulfilling? Does she respect you? Show admiration for you? Is she trustworthy?


* Does she respect you?* 
NO, 
*Show admiration for you?* NO again, she adires her boss. Matt O to the point that I am not allowed to say anything negative about him


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

dwtlh,

I'd start with changing your moniker to:

notafraidtoloseher


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