# EA? Closure? Should I Just Wait?



## westegger (Jul 26, 2013)

Hi All, 

I have found this board extremely helpful so far, so I thought I would throw out my specific situation, just to be able to write about it. I have kept this to myself, aside from one friend, and it is starting to drive me a little crazy.

So, my wife and I have been married for 14 years. Very happily. No children. 

Recently, my wife had success in her field of work that got her some stories in the national public eye for a bit. Nothing like celebrity or anything, but enough that she started to get a lot of emails and Facebook messages from lots of people around the country, people she hadn't talked to in years, basically saying, "Hey, I saw you..., how is it going?" 

Well, one day, about a month ago, she mentioned that she got an email from a guy with whom she had a very tumultuous romantic relationship in the past. This was years and years before she and I were married. In fact, this relationship happened when she was like a senior in high school, and this guy was like 26 or 28. She has told me about this relationship before, and that it left he kind of mixed-up for a bit during her early college years. 

She has never talked to me in any _great _detail about this relationship, including how it ended exactly. Anyway, she mentioned that this guy had emailed her, just to say, "Is that you...?" She told me she emailed back and told him yes it was and a little about her life and he emailed back to say what he was doing in life. That was it. She hasn't mentioned it since.

Honestly? I really didn't give it a heck of a lot of thought.

Most of you on this board probably know what is coming. 

My wife and I both work from home and are always sharing the computers we have. Last week, I came home after driving her to meet some of her friends. 

When the computer screen woke back up as I rolled the mouse, her email inbox was up. Right in front of my face. The second conversation from the top caught my eye. It was from this guy, I'll call him Paul. And from the message preview I could see that the language was very cutesy, but that was not even what caught me off guard. 

The conversation contained 23 messages back and forth. 

I didn't want to open the conversation thread. In fact, I didn't open it at that point. 

First, I went to her email search bar and pulled up several other conversation threads between him and her. They were all like 6 or 9 messages long. 

What disturbed me a little bit more was that these other message threads had been moved to the TRASH folder. My wife is an admitted email hoarder, she often jokes about how many emails are in her inbox. 

Against my better judgement, I opened the threads and started reading them. My heart was pounding as I opened it, knowing that this could very well change our lives. 

Here is the best way I can characterize their correspondence. 

My wife is talking about how intense the relationship was and that she really needs some closure, answers, resolution and how much healing she has done since then. 

Paul, however, is so OBVIOUSLY always trying to work at the edges to make the conversation lighter, to engage her in talk about what her passions are and if she still finds their little in-jokes from all those years ago funny. He attaches little pictures he thinks she might find cute.

After reading through these threads, I can honestly say that that is the consistent tone through the whole of their correspondence. This offered me some relief from the initial shock of seeing that email thread. My wife, while friendly, and occasionally joking, seems to not be engaging with his flirty banter.

Near the end of their correspondence, they began to talk about having a conversation on the phone. 

Once again, my wife, seems to have an earnest need to talk seriously person to person. He keeps making jokes about how he can't wait to talk and how their electric chemistry from all those years ago might bring down the network. 

This was about a week ago. I wrestled with what to do in my mind. I even talked to a friend about it. (A good, old friend of mine who doesn't really have as close relationship with my wife as some of our other friends do.) 

I decided, with the advice of this friend that I would wait, and not say anything. He pointed out that there is absolutely no evidence that my wife wants anything other than what she is saying repeatedly in these emails. 

Anyway. Just a day ago, my wife mentioned that she had made an appointment with her therapist. I asked if it was for anything particular. She mentioned that some recent events had brought up a lot of stuff from her past. She then mentioned this guy and told me, "I'm actually going to have a conversation with Paul, because there is a lot about that time in my life that I need to get some closure on."

I cannot tell you the relief I had that she said that. 

This seems to line up with everything I read on the emails. 

However, when I said. "Oh, well, are you going to email him to ask him to have a conversation?" She said, "Yeah. I guess so. I hope he'll want to." 

So, she is obviously downplaying their ongoing correspondence, but I think she may just be doing that not to overly concern me.

I talked to my friend and he once again advised me that he doesn't see any reason for me to reveal that I read those emails. He says that it will cause a whole problem of trust between us that might not even be warranted. 

His advice, which I just wanted to run by people on this board:

1. Wait maybe a week. Then ask her if she ever had that conversation with that guy.

2. If she says, no. Ask her if that is because she no longer feels she needs to, or if they are trying to arrange a time to have it. (In this scenario, my friend actually suggested that I should snoop a bit more to check on their correspondence and see if she is telling the truth. I am very uncomfortable with that.) 

3 If she says she had the conversation: Ask her how it went, if she got what she needed out of it. Don't be afraid to push for details at this point. (My friend's point on this: "She is your wife, you care about her emotional well being, and this is a man she admittedly had a VERY emotional and romantic bond with.")

4. Ask her if she intends to keep any type of relationship or correspondence up with him. If she says that she does, she should have a really good reason for it. (My friend pointed out, however, that he could not think of a good reason.) And I should express why I feel that they should not really have anything else to do with each other going forward. 

So, just wanted to put this out there because, of course, I'm wondering if I am choosing the right course of action or if anybody has anything to add.

I will just say this before signing off:

a. I do realize that the relationship she had in high school with this older guy may well have been illegal, if you know what I mean. At the very least, I think it was wildly inappropriate, which she has expressed as well in the past.

b. I know this mightn't mean a lot, but there is nothing in my wife's behavior or our marriage that is erratic or depressed or strange. (Outside of her mentioning the therapy appointment, of course. ) 

c. I do not know from the email threads I read, (or from my wife's brief conversations with me about him,) whether or not he is married. My friend suggested that in my next conversation with her, I should find this out.

d. Yes. When I read those email threads there were obviously messages or parts of the conversation that I was missing. In other words, I don't think I saw the whole of their correspondence. 

Thanks all!


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## LoveAtDaisys (Jul 3, 2013)

I'm a little confused, but I'll try to help...

So your wife, in these e-mails, is constantly bringing up their previous romantic relationship. He is...deflecting? From what you write it sounds like he isn't engaging her. But then you say he made a joke about their chemistry?

It doesn't matter if he's married or not. What does matter is whether his conversations with your wife are inappropriate and need to be squashed.

Saying "a good reason" is a surefire way to breed resentment. What you think isn't a good reason she may think is an excellent one. It also opens up a road for her to MAKE UP a good reason, because that apparently is your criteria for her continuing this relationship with this OM. I'd leave it at "your relationship with Paul makes me a little uncomfortable. I know there's nothing there now on your end but I'm not so sure on his end; I know it wouldn't be so innocent were I him".

I don't think we have the whole story. And I don't think you have the whole story either.

I will say that this forum has recommended to me and to others to gather evidence before striking. Give her room, give her some slack and see if she hangs herself with it.


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## workindad (May 7, 2011)

If you are going to observe only, then keylog the computers and put a var in her car


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## westegger (Jul 26, 2013)

Hi Sorry if I wasn't clear.

Yes, my wife is bringing up the relationship in the terms of needing some sort of closure. He keeps agreeing that they need to talk and says he "understands why she would need that." However, he seems to be MORE interested in restarting a friendship. I have to say that my wife doesn't seem to be giving off that vibe.


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## LoveAtDaisys (Jul 3, 2013)

TRUST YOUR GUT.

That said, I think the course of action your friend gave you is the right one for now. I also agree with workindad, install a keylogger. Do you know her password for her e-mail? Keep that handy and check her e-mail throughout this mext week. Print out all of these e-mails and keep them; if she begins to suspect, she'll delete them, and you'll want the evidence if things go downhill.


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

I'm wondering what closure she needs I would be a little wary about this guy.


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## Acoa (Sep 21, 2012)

You should let her know you are not comfortable with her talking to a past lover. She married you 14 years ago, her prior relationships are closed. All she had to tell him is, "Yes, it's me and I'm married to a wonderful man. Bye!" 

Ask her what she wants to get out of a conversation with him. Evaluate her response. She already lied to you about the emails to him. So, don't trust what she says, look at how she says it. If she shows concern about your feelings, that's good. If she gets pissed and focuses on you not trusting her, that's bad.


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## Tobyboy (Jun 13, 2013)

The fact that your W feels she needs therapy after a few text exchanges with an old flame....raises some red flags!!! Those are some deep seated emotions she's been carrying for some years. All it took was one email to re-ignite those feeling again. My advise is to be fully involve in all interactions she has with this "OM". Do not let them meet without you there!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## westegger (Jul 26, 2013)

tom67 said:


> I'm wondering what closure she needs I would be a little wary about this guy.


Hi tom67. 

That is what I'm wondering, too! 

From what she has told me in the past, and some things she mentioned in the emails I saw, the relationship left her pretty messed up in the head for bit and caused some not healthy behavior in her early college years.


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## westegger (Jul 26, 2013)

LoveAtDaisys said:


> TRUST YOUR GUT.
> 
> That said, I think the course of action your friend gave you is the right one for now.


Thanks for the advice It's hard though, as I know you know, (I just read your post.)

I do have an inner sense of peace, somewhere down in there, that she is really just trying to figure out some really deep seated turmoil in her psyche from this. 

However, I also have all these little nagging alarms going off about it - deleting the emails, not being totally forthcoming, his joking becoming increasingly intimate. 

It's tough to discern sometimes what my gut feeling actually is!


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

She never got over it. Exs are ex for a reason. Ask her why a married woman needs closure from an inappropriate relationship that has driven her back into therapy.

Ask her if her marriage is worth destroying over a man who is now playing her yet again.

Tell her you are not agreeable to her talking or meeting him unless you are present.

Contact his wife and blow him out of the water.

Most guys here do not catch these things until its too late. You got lucky . First find out the dates/ages of this past affair. Let him and his wife know charges can still be brought.

Its just me but I would be jumping on him with money , guns and lawyers.


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## AlphaHalf (Aug 5, 2012)

14yrs and she still needs closure with an ex BF. Think about that statement. You need to be the center of her attention not some old fling who's toying around with her emotions as if she is still a teenager. You need to WAKE HER A$$ UP and tell her to get her priorities straightened out. 

Old fling closure should've been done the day she accepted your proposal. Screw that wait and see nonsense, crush this contact and inform "Paul" to F'off. There are some things you should not be nice about and enforcing the marital boundaries is one of them.


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## Will_Kane (Feb 26, 2012)

I don't understand the "NEED" for closure.

What NEED?

The relationship ended years and years before you married your wife, and you are married for 14 years, so is it safe to say her relationship with this guy ended at least 20 years ago?

And here is your wife, going through life, married to you, seemingly happy as a lark, doing her job, having success, and out of the blue this guy contacts her, and ALL OF A SUDDEN, she has a NEED for closure.

If this was such a great need, why did she not seek this guy out?

Sorry, I don't understand what this guy could possibly say or do to give closure to something from 20 years ago that your wife did not seem a bit concerned about a few short months ago.

Also, what kind of relationship do you have with your wife? You're married for 14 years, pledged to share each other's lives, and she didn't tell you the details of this major part of her life? OK, maybe she didn't think it important and, up til now, how were you to know that apparently it was a huge issue requiring therapy and "closure." But why wouldn't she just tell you what it's all about now? And if she doesn't tell you, why wouldn't you ask?

Is it too personal a subject for you to ask your wife about?


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## Will_Kane (Feb 26, 2012)

If my wife tells me, "I'm in contact with an old ex, remember the one I had all those problems with, and I need to see a therapist and I need to see him to get closure."

If that happens, I'm pretty sure I'm going to be asking, "Why?" "What happened?"

What do you think your wife's answer to you would be? Do you think she would say, "It's none of your business, that's between me and my boyfriend"?


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## weightlifter (Dec 14, 2012)

So far she is walking the very fine line very well...

At the top of a VERY steep slope.

My wifes email EA started innocent enough. Yep an ex.

Btw i no longer trust my wife. That 100 % implicit trust. GONE FOREVER. Think about it.


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## ironman (Feb 6, 2013)

West my friend,

this is a slow-motion train wreck in progress ... hit the brakes before it is too late! Why on earth does a woman married 14 years need closure from a high-school ex boyfriend?

Seriously man, think long and hard about that. Better yet ... put the question to her!!! Here's a hint as to the answer ... it's nothing good. 

By accepting this "hookup", you are enabling an affair. Not saying she'd go through with it ... but she's definitely considering "her options".

If I were you, I'd man up and put my foot down. But it's your call .. play with fire and you might get burnt. Standing back and just watching and accepting this behaviour from her will be viewed as "weak" in her eyes.


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

Hire a pi if you know where he lives get info asap.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Acabado (May 13, 2012)

Closure?
My guess is he cheated or dumped her. She wants to un-do the rejection, she wants validation. Becasue she was fabulous but this guy made her believe she wasn't and it stinks since then.

This kind of relink are ver very dangerous, this talking about IC makes it disturbing.

I wouldn't wait for a minute. I'd install a keylogger and put in place more snooping tools to monitor the aftermath but I'd confront this ASAP. The more time you leave her daydream and cook this in her head the worse. People get hooked up in this fantasy thing with first lovers and never come back. I've seen this many times.

Snoop, keep snooping.. but confront. Confront with the f'ing truth and demand NC yesterday.


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## weightlifter (Dec 14, 2012)

Acabado said:


> Closure?
> My guess is he cheated or dumped her. She wants to un-do the rejection, she wants validation. Becasue she was fabulous but this guy made her believe she wasn't and it stinks since then.
> 
> This kind of relink are ver very dangerous, this talking about IC makes it disturbing.
> ...


Wasnt hard to detach a case if this? Or was it rns?


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## VFW (Oct 24, 2012)

This man had an inappropriate relationship with a teenager, he took advantage of her innocence. He most likely was the first man she was with, and then dumped her after he had his fill of her. I think it is very foolish to let this fox back into the hen house. She doesn't need to talk him, she needs to know that he used her for his own guilty pleasures, not love. This is something she needs to address in counseling. Additionally, she needs to know that this is completely disrespectful to you and your marriage. Does she really want to pursue a fantasy at the expense of her marriage? In the immortal words of Barney Fife, you need to nip it....nip it in the bud.


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## Woodchuck (Nov 1, 2012)

West....

Considering the fact that this guys repertoire apparently includes statutory rape, I don't feel he would have a big issue with having sex with a married woman.....

See if you can get a background check on this guy....

Given his attraction to school girls, he might be on the sex offender registry...

At the very least tell your wife just how uncomfortable you are with her contacting this guy......

My wife has a character like this in her past......A divorced man dating a 17 year old high school girl...They are usually the scumbags they appear to be....

The hold this slug had on her immature emotions is not fair play in any ones book, and I am sorry that she still needs closure...I think that fact is testament to why these relationships can be not tolerated...

The *only *meeting my wife has had with her older man was in my plain view...

I can only say to you, go with your gut, but keep your antenna up for a possible plan for them to meet up later...

I am not disrespecting your wife, I just know that her feelings for him are still those of a school girl...And the playing field is still not level.....

the woodchuck


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## soulpotato (Jan 22, 2013)

This will only end badly. Stop it right now! She's not going to find closure, she's going to find her way deeper into an affair with this guy.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

soulpotato said:


> This will only end badly. Stop it right now! She's not going to find closure, she's going to find her way deeper into an affair with this guy.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Tell her calmly you do not want her contacting him again and if she calls you controlling ask her if she's willing to give up a marriage over this scum pos if she waivers just say "i'm sorry you feel that way" and file. It might wake her up then expose to family exactly why you are taking these actions. Ask her straight up what happened that she needs ic because of this wth.


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## A++ (May 21, 2012)

Man up and stop making yourself a cuckold.. emotional cuckold.


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## bryanp (Aug 25, 2011)

If the roles were reversed would your wife be acting like you? You know she is telling you little white lies. Why are you so afraid to honest and upfront with her? Again if the roles were reversed I doubt that your wife would be putting up with such disrespect from you. If you do not respect yourself then who will?


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

West, You are about to loose your wife to an affair.

She's already begun rationalizing it in her mind, and working out the justifications.

You would be throwing away your marriage if you do not step in and aggressively set boundaries and stop all , and I mean all contact.

Even in the short time since he contacted her, she's gone from him nit being part of your marriage, to here lying and hiding things from you. To here needing to talk to a Therapist about her feelings for him.

Suddenly you and your marriage are no longer what she most values and most worries about.

This OM is now her emotional focus, and given then chance she will have sex with him.

Do not give her the chance to continue to reopen her relationship with him further. 

Do find out if he is married - find his wife and expose the affair to her.

And draw the line - zero contact with him. None at all. She has closure when she chose to marry you. That was her vowing that all other romantic relationships were done forever. All of them.

Do not compromise here, and tell her clearly that any further betrayal will mean D. Hopefully it's not already too late, and this will wake her up.


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

Oh, and you need to drop a keylogger onto her computer to really know what she is saying, and a VAR in places like her car to catch what she will say to him,


Your friend, btw is giving you foolish horrible advice that will cost you your marriage.

Your wife has already begun the affair journey, and the longer you wait, the harder it will be to pull her back.


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## life101 (Nov 18, 2012)

I don't know if others will agree with me but I would suggest that the two of you start MC ASAP. If she were truly happy in the marriage, she would have never done it. You need to find the root cause of this "need for closure".

Success can be a very good thing or a very bad thing. Insecure human beings can get swayed away by newfound success and do things they always intended to but never had the courage of doing. My STBXW had all her transgressions during periods of success when she was getting enough attention. She might be narcissistic, and it needs to get diagnosed.


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## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

F-102 said:


> It may have gone something like this:
> 
> They first start catching up, and it's all "How you been doing? What have you been up to?"
> 
> ...


There is no closure. She's in an EA and trying to find a way to keep it going. It will soon be deeper underground. Put a stop to this EA before it's too late.


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## westegger (Jul 26, 2013)

Thanks all for the advice here. You made me see this a little clearer. I actually, today, talked to her about this. 

I did not mention having read her emails. Luckily for me, her admitting the other day that she was going to try to talk to him in person allowed me to bring this up without the static of having to talk about "snooping" or invading her privacy.

I asked her if she had had this conversation, yet. She said she was having it THIS AFTERNOON. 

I then explained, in plain language everything you all have been pointing out. 

1. This was a very inappropriate relationship in the first place.

2. I don't understand a man of 28 years old having an intimate relationship with a 17-18 year old. Period. I don't understand what kind of guy would do that, and then after all these years, reach out to that girl.

3. I want to respect your emotional need for "closure" or answers, but I have to tell you, when people act emotionally, they usually are not acting rationally. This man seems to have an strong emotional hold on you that is still palpable to this day. That is scary.

4. I cannot FORCE you not to contact this guy. I can only inform you that I will, in no uncertain terms, consider a relationship to this man of ANY KIND a threat to your well-being AND our marriage. 

She is going to have the conversation with this man. And she promised me she will debrief me about the whole conversation and that she kept reassuring me: "You know that I am married to you, you know that I want to be with you, right?" 

This was all very reassuring, except for the following two points of the conversation with her.

I asked her if this man was married. She said he was. I asked her if his wife was aware of their connection.

When I asked these questions, she got a look on her face that seemed, well, deer in the headlights is the best I can describe.

At first I interpreted this to mean, she hadn't really, in all of this, considered how she would feel if I were doing this with some other woman.

HOWEVER, later, I had another thought. Possibly, her expression was a sudden shock of fear that I was indirectly hinting that if she continued in this that I would expose this to his wife. 

Anyway. I just wanted to update everybody and I'll let you know how it goes. 

Thanks All!


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## life101 (Nov 18, 2012)

westegger said:


> Thanks all for the advice here. You made me see this a little clearer. I actually, today, talked to her about this.
> 
> I did not mention having read her emails. Luckily for me, her admitting the other day that she was going to try to talk to him in person allowed me to* bring this up without the static of having to talk about "snooping" or invading her privacy*.
> 
> ...


Correct me if I am wrong, but you are still going to let her meet him alone? Even after everyone told you the train wreck you might head into?

And there is not privacy in marriage. If it is a marriage in the truest sense, then a spouse doesn't need to hide anything from another spouse. Her (and your) right to privacy ended the day you exchanged the vows. You need to lose that mentality if you want to save your marriage.

Stop being a nice guy. That's your Achilles' heel.


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## westegger (Jul 26, 2013)

life101 said:


> Correct me if I am wrong, but you are still going to let her meet him alone? Even after everyone told you the train wreck you might head into?


I should be clear. This conversation is going to be OVER THE PHONE. This guy lives on the opposite coast from us.


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## firefly789 (Apr 9, 2013)

Sitting back and waiting is a poor choice. Instead, you should be talking to her. Teenage years can be full of turmoil and if she was in a relationship with an older man as a senior, who knows what it was like. Maybe she does just want closure and some answers. However, she is now a grown and married woman and meeting alone with him is not okay. It's good that she's going to IC, and that her texts ignore his flirting is also positive.

First, you should put a keylogger on her computer. Then, you need to tell her that you want to support her emotionally as her husband, and you want to help her go through this as a couple. Let her know that you are concerned that there is a lot to this if it requires her to go to IC and she needs to not shut you out. Your marriage could grow with more intimacy and sharing, or it could grow more distant. I would even let her know you were concerned and saw the emails and realize this is serious. Let her know that if she wants to meet with him you need to come along, to be supportive of her as her H and to give her a man's perspective of if she was just being used. (If you have a keylogger you will still know what's going on with emails.) 

She said it messed her up for a while in college, so she may really just be trying to get her head around it. But, contacting this guy on her own is not the way to go about it. If you approach her as a caring, concerned husband you have a greater chance of getting her to open up about it and working through any issues together. I would ask her to go to MC together, too. Be proactive to protect your marriage.


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## VFW (Oct 24, 2012)

After she talks to him, you need to go online and get his number. You then need to talk to him and tell him in no uncertain terms if he ever call, email, text, fb, likes or even thinks of her again you will call his wife and family. This needs to be a one way conversation you don't give a hoot what he thinks or feels. He can lie to her, but he sure as heck ain't going to lie to you. 

I would recommend counseling for you as a couple, since the fact that she even felt like she needed him to explain himself that it gives you concern for your relationship. Every time she brings him up you need to reiterate just what a dirt bag he was and what he did to her was wrong. You may want to consider bringing this up to her parents and see what they know of the situation as well.


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## movin on (Jan 24, 2012)

Tell his wife. She should know. Sounds like this guy is a real perv.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## OlderAndWiser (Apr 17, 2013)

Your know your wife is keeping secrets from you. You have no idea what is really going on here.

Why allow this private phone conversation right now? Why not tell her you need to know what is going on before you just let this happen? What is the big rush with this phone conversation?

You are playing with fire, with no good possible outcome. This is the wrong thing to do.

Also, why not ask her if you can listen in to the conversation?

Big time mistake.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

She wants closer, he wants perhaps wants legover. 

VARs are a good idea. If only for peace of mind.


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## Will_Kane (Feb 26, 2012)

westegger said:


> She is going to have the conversation with this man. And she promised me she will debrief me about the whole conversation and that she kept reassuring me: *"You know that I am married to you, you know that I want to be with you, right?" *


In my opinion, a very bad sign. Like when the owner of a sports team tells the press he absolutely supports the coach, no matter what. In case you're not a sports fan, within days after that "show of support," the coach almost always gets fired.

I feel the same way about what your wife just told you.

There is something really not right with this situation. Keep your eyes and ears open and watch your back.


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## Fisherman (Oct 26, 2012)

Will_Kane said:


> In my opinion, a very bad sign. Like when the owner of a sports team tells the press he absolutely supports the coach, no matter what. In case you're not a sports fan, within days after that "show of support," the coach almost always gets fired.
> 
> I feel the same way about what your wife just told you.
> 
> There is something really not right with this situation. Keep your eyes and ears open and watch your back.


I agree with you, that was patronizing and false reassurance.


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## The Middleman (Apr 30, 2012)

westegger said:


> I should be clear. This conversation is going to be OVER THE PHONE. This guy lives on the opposite coast from us.


If I were you, I would insist that I be in the room or listening on an extension when this conversation takes place. For me this would be a must.


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## Acabado (May 13, 2012)

The look in her face after talking about this man wife was shame, at that very second she realized she was the OW. She has thoughts about this man she couldn't want anyone to know (specially you), toughts innapropiate for a married woman about a married man.
She revelealed a lot with that look in her face. Very telling.

I believe you were too soft.
I'd tape that conversation I'd start snooping like a mad man from now on.


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## weightlifter (Dec 14, 2012)

Buy a sony icdpx312 var NOW. Best buy has them.


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## hard_to_detach (Jun 17, 2013)

Six weeks ago my wife gave me the same line of crap. She told me how committed to me she was and that she couldn't imagine herself being with anyone else, and on and on. This was all to make me feel better about meeting up with her ex so they could "catch up". No she has filed for divorce and is convinced she is going to marry this POS. 

She needs to tell you what about her relationship she needs closure and the phone call will be with you listening in.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## weightlifter (Dec 14, 2012)

OP. meet hard to detach above. Read his thread and take notes.


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## Cubby (Mar 28, 2012)

What kind of psycho-babble is this "closure" crap? West, she's married to YOU! Why are you OK-ing this phone call to the creepy ex? That just moved you down a couple of notches on the attractiveness scale in your wife's eyes. Did you know chicks dig strong, firm, confident men? Men that don't tolerate other men getting involved with their wives?


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## Fisherman (Oct 26, 2012)

You comment to her about wanting to respect her need for closure puzzles me, she is totally disrespecting you by going ahead with phone call. You just have to say no and stop this communication.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk 2


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## weightlifter (Dec 14, 2012)

Here are explicit evidence gather instructions. Please be one of the few that actually acts on this quickly. You might be surprised how fast you get answers.

VARs

Buy 2 sony ICDPX312 voice activated recorders. Best Buy sells them for like 50 bucks. DO NOT BUY THE cheapies. USE LITHIUM batteries. We have examples of 25 hour recordings using them on these sony recorders. Set bit rate to 44K and sensitivity to very high or better. Turn off the beep feature. Its on one of the menus.

Go to Walmart and buy heavy duty velcro.

Use the velcro to attach the var under her seat UP INSIDE. SECURE IT WELL!!!!!! So well even a big bump wont knock it off.

Put the second in whatever room she uses to talk in when you are not around.

Usual warning. If you hear another man get in her car STOP Listening and have a trusted friend tell you what went on. Knowing she is a cheat will kill you. Hearing her moan while another man is inside her will murder you to your very soul!!!!!! You are not strong enough to hear that. Dont try it. I know what I am talking about in this.

Play dumb husband for a bit. Dont drive her further underground! NO MORE CONFRONTS!! NEVER give up you get your intel from the VAR. You always got your info from a PI or someone saw them.

If you need clean up the recordings get Audacity. Its free from the internet. I have used it on var work for others here to remove things like engine noise. If needed, I have done var work for three men here. RDMU is the only one who has released some of the confidentiality. Read his second thread for my reliability and confidentiality. NEVER GIVE UP YOUR ELECTRONIC EVIDENCE. They were seen by a PI or something NOT your VAR!!

The ezoom GPS has been found to be easy to buy at Radio shack and useful.

Look for a burner phone. That is often why wives let the husband "see their phone"

Look for apps on her phone like words with friends. It has a non traceable texting feature.


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## See_Listen_Love (Jun 28, 2012)

westegger said:


> Thanks all for the advice here. You made me see this a little clearer. I actually, today, talked to her about this.
> 
> I did not mention having read her emails. Luckily for me, her admitting the other day that she was going to try to talk to him in person allowed me to bring this up without the static of having to talk about "snooping" or invading her privacy.
> 
> ...


Very good actions, _after you started not taking this serious enough_. 

The more you think you love her the more you should take effective action now. And see after her emotional needs, maybe she is mourning all her life about that old relation. She can very easily leave you for this.

Her shock was indeed about you telling the other woman about this,
BECAUSE..
*she is able to fool you* with this, but another woman would see the danger right away, *the OW would not be fooled* by her words

And that my friend, means she is lying to you about her feelings.


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## phillybeffandswiss (Jan 20, 2013)

I would have been on the phone with her. If not that, the entire conversation would have been held in front of me phone, text, email or whatever medium used for the conversation.


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## ironman (Feb 6, 2013)

*3. I want to respect your emotional need for "closure" or answers, but I have to tell you, when people act emotionally, they usually are not acting rationally. This man seems to have an strong emotional hold on you that is still palpable to this day. That is scary.*

What you should have done is call her out on this .. because it is utter b/s. It shouldn't be "scary" to you .. it should anger you as it is a blatant show of disrespect for you and the marriage.

*4. I cannot FORCE you not to contact this guy. I can only inform you that I will, in no uncertain terms, consider a relationship to this man of ANY KIND a threat to your well-being AND our marriage. 

She is going to have the conversation with this man. And she promised me she will debrief me about the whole conversation and that she kept reassuring me: "You know that I am married to you, you know that I want to be with you, right?" *

Yes you could have stopped her ... you're too dammed nice. It seems you are afraid of being viewed as controlling or mean .. too bad, because instead she will now view you as "weak" and unwilling to fight for her. You are literally allowing her to hookup with another man with your blessing. Very foolish. I pray you don't get burned ... because you definitely lit the fire.

*When I asked these questions, she got a look on her face that seemed, well, deer in the headlights is the best I can describe.*

As someone else said .. this is when she realized the inappropriateness of her actions ... yet she is proceeding anyway it seems. What does that tell you?


Good luck .. you're going to need it.


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

Get the om wife's phone number and call her if you want any chance of stopping this.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## weightlifter (Dec 14, 2012)

Grade c-
Since said conversation already happened tell her ANY further contact will be considered an emotional affair and will be treated as such.

Get those vars. its even money that she will remain in contact. Be prepped to threaten. You got this early like me. Well earlier than me but i shut it down hard.


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## carmen ohio (Sep 24, 2012)

westegger said:


> Thanks all for the advice here. You made me see this a little clearer. I actually, today, talked to her about this.
> 
> I did not mention having read her emails. Luckily for me, her admitting the other day that she was going to try to talk to him in person allowed me to bring this up without the static of having to talk about "snooping" or invading her privacy.
> 
> ...


Dear westegger,

Haven't read all the responses to this post of yours so maybe you've already received this advice but, in case you haven't, I think it's important for you to hear.

You just failed a major sh!t test, and failed it BIG TIME. You expressed disapproval of your WW* having any kind of relationship with another man but, when she pushed back and said she was going to speak to him anyway -- and privately -- you folded. In effect, what you told her was, "I don't want you having a relationship with this guy but I won't do anything if you do." The door is now open for her to do what she likes with him. Oh sure, she'll promise to keep you informed of what's going on but you know that she has already been keeping secrets and even lying about what the two of them are up to, so you know what that promise is worth.

I really don't get guys like you. Why are "reassured" that she is "only" talking to a past lover? I know, you're going to say, "But what can I do about it?" The answer is simple, tell her that if she's not willing to dedicate herself only to you, you don't want her as a wife. If she doesn't keeps communicating with him, file for divorce. If that doesn't straighten her out, then divorce her because any man who would be willing to spend the rest of his life with a woman who has other men in her life isn't really much of a man.

Read a few threads on TAM and you will see that nothing good ever comes from a guy letting his wife have even a seemingly innocent relationship with another guy. Learn from this. Be strong. Tell your W what you expect of her. If she doesn't do what you ask, give her consequences. If she still goes her own way, send her packing.

Or keep doing what your doing, hope for the best and become one of the hundreds of lost souls on TAM who wonder what happened to their loving wife and their happy marriage.


* BTW, I call her a WW ("wayward wife") because she is already cheating on you -- anytime a married person has communications with a person of the opposite sex behind his or her spouse's back, that is a form of cheating. In your case, not only is your WW doing things behind your back, she is lying about the nature and extent of it. So, yeah, she is a cheater.


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## westegger (Jul 26, 2013)

Hi All,

Thanks once again for all the advice. I had talk with my wife after she had the conversation with this guy. 

I let her talk and explain everything that happened on the phone call. If it happened as she said, well, it sounded pretty much like closure to me. 

So, taking all the tough advice you all have given me. I told her how I was angered that after I expressed my feelings about this situation that she still went through with the call. 

I also stated that she shouldn't have another conversation, text, email or facebook conversation with this guy ever again. 

At this point she said that did not see any reason for her to talk to him again either. 

To drive my point home, I asked her if she knew if this guy's wife knew that they were having this conversation. She said she didn't know. I asked her how she would feel if she were his wife and found out this was taking place without her knowing. 

I told her that I had looked this guy up and found out how to contact his wife and that I still wasn't sure if I should email her to let her know what is going on. (This is true by the way, I did some research and it wasn't hard to find out.) And I told her that if I ever do find any evidence that she is carrying on any type of correspondence with this guy, I WILL contact his wife. 

I also told her that we going to start marriage counseling. This last part seemed to really do the trick. While the whole conversation with me seemed sobering her, this took it to whole new level. She seemed, for the first time, to be a little scared.

I explained: I think this guy is a dirtbag for what he did to you, and I see no reason he should have even contacted you in the first place, and I cannot understand why you would need such emotional closure with this person. So, I think we need to find out, together.

By the way, I also took some of the technical precautions that others have suggested here. I am aware that my being so open and direct could possibly drive any future correspondence underground, but so be it.

Also by the way. I AM still considering whether or not to contact this guys wife about this. I mean, if I have to now have my marriage rocked, why shouldn't he have his rocked, right?

I know I'm probably being naive, but I still have NO EVIDENCE that this was anything beyond what my wife has explained it is. I really hope and pray it is, but I'll tell you what, this experience, and all of the advice I've gotten here, will keep me on my toes for the future.


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## Fisherman (Oct 26, 2012)

I think the OMW needs to be contacted. For one it will display how serious you are about this taking place and the OMW deserves to know.


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## Will_Kane (Feb 26, 2012)

westegger said:


> Also by the way. I AM still considering whether or not to contact this guys wife about this. I mean, if I have to now have my marriage rocked, why shouldn't he have his rocked, right?


Affairs thrive in secrecy. I think the truth always helps. She has a right to know. Also, you never know if by telling her the truth, you in turn receive some info from her that you were previously unaware of.


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## The Middleman (Apr 30, 2012)

I'm going to echo Fisherman and Will Kane: Do not wait ... contact this guy's wife anyway .... today! You seem to have developed the right mindset ... follow-through now.


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## workindad (May 7, 2011)

You absolutely contact his wife! And you do it pronto, without telling your wife that you have done it. You will know that she broke NC when she gets upset about your call. Speak directly to his wife, do not let OM erase your message to her.

He had no issue meeting with your wife. You should have no concern over meeting with his. 

Make certain you have the VARs in place as your contact to OMs wife has a high chance of him calling your wife for story setting purposes. Although, the conversation you had with her may trigger your wife to call him and warn him that you may contact his wife.

Bottom line, have your VARs in place and do not enable contact between this man and your wife again.


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## westegger (Jul 26, 2013)

Just out of curiosity. How should one compose an email about this?

And another question? Should I email him directly also?


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## workindad (May 7, 2011)

OP, was your wife's conversation with this guy in person?


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## workindad (May 7, 2011)

Do not tip him off about contacting his wife. Do not email her, he could delete it. Call her or go see her. Speak to her directly.

If you want to send him a F-off message after the fact- fine. However, take care of contacting his wife and outing his a$$ first.


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## westegger (Jul 26, 2013)

workindad said:


> OP, was your wife's conversation with this guy in person?


No. It was on the phone. I was not present, but I she let me know when it was taking place. And debriefed me on it immediately afterwards.


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## westegger (Jul 26, 2013)

workindad said:


> Do not tip him off about contacting his wife. Do not email her, he could delete it. Call her or go see her. Speak to her directly.


Yeah. That's what I was thinking. It'll take a little more work though. I was able to get an email and facebook for her. Can't find an actual phone listing for her though. And haven't found out where she works, yet.


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## workindad (May 7, 2011)

Why could it not be done with you present?

How far away does he live?

Are you certain they didn't meet? Have you checked your phone records to support the call and duration?


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## workindad (May 7, 2011)

westegger said:


> Yeah. That's what I was thinking. It'll take a little more work though. I was able to get an email and facebook for her. Can't find an actual phone listing for her though. And haven't found out where she works, yet.


Keep looking, you will get what you need. Do not give up!

This action will let him know in no uncertain terms that you will not tolerate him sniffing around after your wife.


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## Fisherman (Oct 26, 2012)

westegger said:


> Yeah. That's what I was thinking. It'll take a little more work though. I was able to get an email and facebook for her. Can't find an actual phone listing for her though. And haven't found out where she works, yet.


Try spokeo or some of the other lookup sites. You got her Facebook that will help.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk 2


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## westegger (Jul 26, 2013)

workindad said:


> Why could it not be done with you present?
> 
> How far away does he live?
> 
> Are you certain they didn't meet? Have you checked your phone records to support the call and duration?


I didn't want to be present. I know that is against everybody's advice, but I chose that course of action while I was still trying to get a handle on all this.

He lives very far away. On the opposite side of the country. So I'm certain they didn't meet. Even the email correspondence I saw seemed to be trying to get a phone call arranged.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

Say nothing further to your wife about contacting his wife. When you do you want to see if your wife brings this up after he contacts her about this.

After you have waited a bit to see if there is more contact, then contact his sorry a$$ and make sure he knows you know all about him and you will put him on cheaterville along with his history.

Have you googled him to see if he is on a sex offender list?

Stay very strong with your wife as her behavior is totally unfaithful.

What did she say about the convo, did it make sense? Did she show any nervousness or signs of lying about it?


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

Btw, you would be shocked at how many affairs we have seen here between old high school lovers decades and decades later.


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## JR&JR (Jun 30, 2013)

My situation was similar to what you're going through. An Ex who contacted my wife. Started off as friendly emails then he turned it up a notch with one liners at the end of his replies about how he'd been thinking of her or missed her. My wife's replies were courteous but never mentioned the past relationship or even hinted of wanting to rekindle. The issue was that she continued to email back and forth and never shut him down about bringing up their past.

I used the messenger through FB to contact the OMW. Come to find out, she had already knew about it and had contacted my wife asking her to stop the correspondence. The part where the OMW failed was by not contacting me. It's much easier to put a halt to this if there is someone on each end keeping an eye out. 

Even if your wife isn't looking for more, it's very possible that he is. Eventually your marriage will experience a rough patch and he will be there while your wife is in a weakened state. As you and most other people would agree, there's no reason to keep in touch with an ex (they are the ex for a reason). If nothing else, I believe that you should send the OMW a message so that she is aware of what's been going on.

Good Luck.


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## westegger (Jul 26, 2013)

Chaparral said:


> Have you googled him to see if he is on a sex offender list?
> 
> Stay very strong with your wife as her behavior is totally unfaithful.
> 
> What did she say about the convo, did it make sense? Did she show any nervousness or signs of lying about it?


I haven't checked about sex offender list. But I do intend to.

I will say, even from what my wife told me, (when she mentioned this years ago, and now with more detail,) This guy doesn't seem like a predator. My wife is quite attractive, in pictures of her from those years she looks stunning and a bit older than what she was at the time. She has told me that in their first meetings, through some family friends, there was instant attraction by both of them. He claims that when they first were meeting he did not realize how young she was. Then, by his admission, when he found out her real age, he was so infatuated at that point, he didn't care. 

Apparently. (This was learned by my wife in their closure conversation) He had several people in his life watching this the whole time, saying to themselves, "What the hell is he doing?" One of them finally took him aside and basically smacked him upside the head and said he was a successful, bright young guy and that he NEEDED to end this. Which he did. But without really explaining any of this to my wife.

So, my wife went from being an 18 year old having a relationship with this guy who was even flying her places for weekends away, taking her to restaraunts, to having him go, "it's been great. See ya." And then not getting responses from her letters and phone calls to him.

This, combined with some other things in her life at the time, sent her into a downward spiral that really messed her up. (This I have known since we were dating.)

At least, this is what she has explained to me. For what it's worth. To answer the question, this all makes sense based on what she has told me before. And she really didn't seem to be hedging or lying about any of this. 

However, even if all of that is the God's truth. It doesn't much change any of my thinking.


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## westegger (Jul 26, 2013)

Another question for people. I have a pretty good relationship with my wife's siblings and parents.

I actually have no idea what was going on for them during that time in her life. What they thought of this guy. I have been thinking about reaching out to one of them to ask them to tell them about this, and to confirm that things are as my wife is presenting them.

What do you think?


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## The Middleman (Apr 30, 2012)

westegger said:


> Another question for people. I have a pretty good relationship with my wife's siblings and parents.
> 
> I actually have no idea what was going on for them during that time in her life. What they thought of this guy. I have been thinking about reaching out to one of them to ask them to tell them about this, and to confirm that things are as my wife is presenting them.
> 
> What do you think?


I think it's a good idea, not only to confirm the truth but to let them know what's going on. The more eyes on the situation the better.


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## Suspecting (Jan 8, 2013)

So basically her closure was that she needed to know why he broke up with her? Doesn't really sound believable unless she still have lingering feelings for him.

How did she explain that she knows where he lives?

You should ask her if they had any other contact than the initial email(s) and the phone conversation you know about (refering to the numerous emails you read secretly.) If she lies and says no what does that tell you. That you cannot trust her. I think you are being way too passive about this. Most affairs begin like this all "innocently". You need to set proper boundaries or she will lose respect for you if she hasn't already.


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## life101 (Nov 18, 2012)

I would suggest that you still keep VAR in her car and in the bedroom. If after a few months nothing comes up you can lower your guard. It seems that you have averted a nasty fall for the time being but don't relax just yet. You have said that this guy used to fly to meet your wife when she was young, and he is doing well in his career. So what can stop him now to do that again? Or at least try it? Be very careful. Not paranoid, but careful.

And I agree with others. The OMW has the right to know. Tell her the truth. There shouldn't be any secret in a marriage.


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## westegger (Jul 26, 2013)

Well, you all have made up my mind. I am going to try and get a contact number for this guy's wife. Those of you who have made this type of call before, how did you handle it. What should I expect?


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## Suspecting (Jan 8, 2013)

Good point about flying. Takes really what 1-2 hours to fly from other side of the america? It doesn't matter even if OM lived in Europe he could still come see your wife easily.


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## westegger (Jul 26, 2013)

Thanks all. By the way. I'm starting to feel like, now that the cat's out of the bag with my wife, that I might edit or delete my original post to hide the specifics a little more or altogether. (I did a good job of masking it enough in the first post, but I'm sure, reading it now, that if my wife ever came across it, she might clearly know it is me. 

Although, I also want this advice to remain for anybody in my situation. 

Thoughts?


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## The Middleman (Apr 30, 2012)

westegger said:


> Thanks all. By the way. I'm starting to feel like, now that the cat's out of the bag with my wife, that I might edit or delete my original post to hide the specifics a little more or altogether. (I did a good job of masking it enough in the first post, but I'm sure, reading it now, that if my wife ever came across it, she might clearly know it is me.
> 
> Although, I also want this advice to remain for anybody in my situation.
> 
> Thoughts?


This stuff can help alot of people.


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

westegger said:


> Well, you all have made up my mind. I am going to try and get a contact number for this guy's wife. Those of you who have made this type of call before, how did you handle it. What should I expect?


It is what you should do, good.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## life101 (Nov 18, 2012)

Don't delete it. It might help many people in your shoes. A lot of people gave you very good advice here.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

The contact with this particular ex is dangerous because it's clear that they had an emotionally-laden relationship; or rather, their history together isn't the garden variety of where they just dated and parted ways w/o it meaning much to either of them. It sounds like your wife was in love with him and so this puts this kind of continued/renewed contact at a different level. It's a slippery slope but even moreso with the kind of history they have.


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## weightlifter (Dec 14, 2012)

West. Post 15 more times then get it moved to private section.


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## ironman (Feb 6, 2013)

westegger said:


> Also by the way. I AM still considering whether or not to contact this guys wife about this. I mean, if I have to now have my marriage rocked, why shouldn't he have his rocked, right?
> 
> I know I'm probably being naive, but I still have NO EVIDENCE that this was anything beyond what my wife has explained it is. I really hope and pray it is, but I'll tell you what, this experience, and all of the advice I've gotten here, will keep me on my toes for the future.


Good job of redeeming the situation west. She needs to be a little "afraid" of losing you. That's usually what it takes to salvage this type of situation (in those cases where it is salvageable anyway .. btw, your's seems to be so far as she is showing genuine remorse/fear,etc).

I would definitely contact the OM's wife ... at the very least it gets another pair of eyes watching what's going on.


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## OlderAndWiser (Apr 17, 2013)

West....

I would be concerned with her response to you when you explained NC to her....specifically "At this point she said that did not see any reason for her to talk to him again either".

If this was her literal response, I would have another NC conversation. Her response sounds like a bit of a bob and weave....

No reason for her to talk to him again right now, but there may be a reason in the future?

You should make it crystal clear to her what NC means. It means:

- She does not attempt to contact him via any mechanism, ever.
- If he attempts to contact her, she is not to respond and is to tell you immediately.

Don't let her weasel word you!


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## workindad (May 7, 2011)

OP, no offense but for her to still want "closure" after all these years... seems to me that the torch she carries for him still burns.

Do contact his wife. Be mindful of your wife's need to travel in the near future.


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## catsa (Jun 8, 2013)

Older and Wiser- from TAD?


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## Summer4744 (Oct 15, 2012)

Westegger. What would have happened if they had met in person? What if he had made a move for just that one last kiss? What would she have done? From what you have told us it is likely that she would have melted for him, no matter what she says now.

If you don't know the answer to these questions you are completely justified in taking the steps you did. I don't know what telling the other mans wife will do, but I wouldn't let your wife minimize what she has done. 

Read other threads here and see that a lot of affairs started this very way. She can deny all she wants, but if this guy moved to your town it is very likely that this guy would occupy a huge part of her thoughts and interests all day. Your marriage shouldn't be dependent on whether some other guy decides to show interest in her or not.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

Well now, here's a thought.

Is he sending out several such contacts out to former girl friends in the hope that at least some of them will bite? 

I think this is highly probable and that it would be a kindness (seriously) to tell his wife what he's up to.


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## Will_Kane (Feb 26, 2012)

westegger said:


> One of them finally took him aside and basically smacked him upside the head and said he was a successful, bright young guy and that he NEEDED to end this. Which he did. But without really explaining any of this to my wife.
> 
> So, my wife went from being an 18 year old having a relationship with this guy who was even flying her places for weekends away, taking her to restaraunts, to having him go, "it's been great. See ya." And then not getting responses from her letters and phone calls to him.
> 
> This, combined with some other things in her life at the time, sent her into a downward spiral that really messed her up. (This I have known since we were dating.)


Sounds like the truth.

Which I find to be very disturbing for you.

When I was in high school, I had girlfriends cheat on me with good friends and break up with me for no reason. When I had moved on to the next, I never cared one bit about them. I certainly don't care now over 30 years later.

I find it disturbing that your wife still cares so much about this guy and why he broke up with her. He was obviously a jerk for doing it how he did it, and she should have by now just written off as such with no "need" for "closure." What if he had told her yesterday that he left her because he was cheating on her with someone else, or that he just decided that she was not worth the trouble? Would your wife's whole life now be turned upside down because of what some guy from long ago thought about her?

No, the reason your wife had a "need" for "closure" was because deep down she still is carrying a torch for this guy. She believes this guy is her soul mate - what he thinks matters to her. She had put this guy out of her mind, but when he contacted her, she felt those old feelings come back.

It wouldn't surprise me if your wife had a desire to "win" this guy back.

I don't have any advice for you that you haven't already received. Just keep in mind that if this guy's name does pop up again, that you should be very wary at your wife's claims that it is in any way "innocent." Their relationship was purely romantic, and any re-contact they have will not be as old friends reminiscing about old times but rather as former lovers reminiscing about their great lost love.

Watch out because now that they have re-connected for "closure," one or the other of them (in my opinion) is likely to "need" even more "closure," so that they will "need" to re-connect again.


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## Will_Kane (Feb 26, 2012)

westegger said:


> Recently, my wife had success in her field of work that *got her some stories in the national public eye for a bit. Nothing like celebrity or anything, but enough that she started to get a lot of emails and Facebook messages from lots of people around the country, people she hadn't talked to in years, basically saying, "Hey, I saw you..., how is it going?"*
> 
> She has never talked to me in any _great _detail about this relationship, including how it ended exactly. Anyway, *she mentioned that this guy had emailed her, just to say, "Is that you...?"* She told me she emailed back and told him yes it was and a little about her life and he emailed back to say what he was doing in life. *That was it*. She hasn't mentioned it since.
> 
> ...


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## OlderAndWiser (Apr 17, 2013)

catsa said:


> Older and Wiser- from TAD?


Don't know what TAD is......


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## TBT (Dec 20, 2011)

OlderAndWiser said:


> Don't know what TAD is......


truth about deception


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## westegger (Jul 26, 2013)

Interesting development. I was out for a few hours this afternoon. Just checked our internet history and what do you know? 

My wife did a few searches on.... (drumroll) this guy's wife!

Should I look at this as a good sign? Meaning she has taken my threat seriously?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## The Middleman (Apr 30, 2012)

westegger said:


> Interesting development. I was out for a few hours this afternoon. Just checked our internet history and what do you know?
> 
> My wife did a few searches on.... (drumroll) this guy's wife!
> 
> ...


Maybe she wants to find out how easy it would be for you to find her. Take this as a "warning" that you need to expose this to this reprobate's wife. Maybe even send him a warning to get lost permanently.


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## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

The Middleman said:


> Maybe she wants to find out how easy it would be for you to find her. Take this as a "warning" that you need to expose this to this reprobate's wife. Maybe even send him a warning to get lost permanently.


"My Boyfriend's Back"

.......................... (What made you think he'd believe all your lies?)
(Wah-ooo, wah-ooo)
(You're a big man now but he'll cut you down to size
(Wah-ooo, wait and see)
My boyfriend's back he's gonna save my reputation
(Hey-la-day-la my boyfriend's back)
*If I were you I'd take a permanent vacation*
(Hey-la, hey-la, my boyfriend's back)..............................

Interesting,how they always seemed to know exactly what to do in the olden days.........


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## life101 (Nov 18, 2012)

westegger said:


> Interesting development. I was out for a few hours this afternoon. Just checked our internet history and what do you know?
> 
> *My wife did a few searches on.... (drumroll) this guy's wife!*
> Should I look at this as a good sign? Meaning she has taken my threat seriously?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Are you kidding? Are you seriously asking if this is a good sign?

She is measuring her up against the OMW. She is trying to see if she is good enough to compete with her.

If I were you, I would take this very seriously. This happened after she assured you she is done with him and you told her about MC. Very disturbing. Don't let your guard down. At least for the next six months.


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## carmen ohio (Sep 24, 2012)

westegger said:


> Interesting development. I was out for a few hours this afternoon. Just checked our internet history and what do you know?
> 
> My wife did a few searches on.... (drumroll) this guy's wife!
> 
> ...


westegger,

This is not a good sign.

You've said that, after her last conversation with him, "she said that did not see any reason for her to talk to him again . . ." So why is she doing searches on his wife? Because you threatened to talk to her. Do you think your WW is looking her up to tell her what has been going on? Of course not so, whatever her reason, it can't be good.

My guess is that your WW never got over the OM and is still obsessing about him. This means you should be very vigilant to monitor all of her communications for the foreseeable future (get a key-logger, a couple of VARs, etc.).

Also, you need to stop making excuses for and rationalizing your WW's inappropriate behavior. If things were really good in your marriage and she was really into you, none of this would be happening. As long as it is, you have a big problem.

Understand that all of this will not simply go away. It will likely be a number of months before you know if your WW is really ready to give up on the other man and probably a couple of years before the two of you have a healthy relationship again.

That is your reality and what you have to deal with.


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## See_Listen_Love (Jun 28, 2012)

westegger said:


> I haven't checked about sex offender list. But I do intend to.
> 
> I will say, even from what my wife told me, (when she mentioned this years ago, and now with more detail,) This guy doesn't seem like a predator. My wife is quite attractive, in pictures of her from those years she looks stunning and a bit older than what she was at the time. She has told me that in their first meetings, through some family friends, there was instant attraction by both of them. He claims that when they first were meeting he did not realize how young she was. Then, by his admission, when he found out her real age, he was so infatuated at that point, he didn't care.
> 
> ...


I am sorry for him and her, it seems like a real Greek tragedy. All dramatic ingredients for a fatal end are present.

Soooooo.....you take care I have not to be sorry for you too.

You do very good now, contact the OMW like people say.

And monitor in silence, you have to invest some 'unhappiness' with your own actions while you snoop. See it as an insurance premium for your marriage. And do the counseling, very good to bring that up to her.

She may already have been shocked out of the EA by you mentioning that, seeing how serious it may have gone already. Very good man-action of you that she recognizes.

(The bad interpretation, a small chance, is that she could be already in 'I love you but I am not in love with you' mode and be afraid of MC for that reason).


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## Summer4744 (Oct 15, 2012)

You are crazy if you think this is a good sign. Likely she is comparing how good looking she is compared to this other woman to see how strong her hand is in tempting this guy back. 

Sorry to tell you this bro, but your threats are the last thing on her mind right now. Right now she is thinking of the OM pretty much all the time. And no she didn't get closure.


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## AlphaHalf (Aug 5, 2012)

> No. It was on the phone. I was not present, but I she let me know when it was taking place. And debriefed me on it immediately afterwards.


Bottom line you don't know $h!t but what she wants to tell you, not tell you, downplay, or mixed lies with some truth. 14 YEARS OF MARRIAGE AND SHE STILL NEEDS CLOSURE EVEN THOUGH SHE KNOWS HOW UPSET IT MAKES YOU FEEL. 

And now she is checking out his wife online???? His business and personal life is more of a priority then you and your marriage. WAKE UP GUY! Contact the OMW.


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## weightlifter (Dec 14, 2012)

West. Please follow my instructions on the VAR. Time IS of the essence!


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

weightlifter said:


> West. Please follow my instructions on the VAR. Time IS of the essence!


Go get a var today you may also want to get a pen var and stick it in her purse.


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## nogutsnoglory (Jan 17, 2013)

westegger said:


> Interesting development. I was out for a few hours this afternoon. Just checked our internet history and what do you know?
> 
> My wife did a few searches on.... (drumroll) this guy's wife!
> 
> ...


If you take the advice of others you most likely have a good chance of stopping this before it is too late. If you do not and leave it up to her to do it you will regret that decision most likely.
She is now more curious about his wife and wants to see if she measures up to her.... Just curiosity...?


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## TRy (Sep 14, 2011)

westegger said:


> My wife did a few searches on.... (drumroll) this guy's wife!
> 
> Should I look at this as a good sign? Meaning she has taken my threat seriously?


 There is no good way to take this. She would have no reason to be concerned about your threat if she did not plan on staying in contact with the other man (OM) in the first place. That being said, I think that she was checking out the competition. Either way, it means that this is not over.

The main obstacle to their relationship in the past was that that a 28 year old dating a 17 year old was creepy and even possibly illegal. A lot of outside pressure from family and friends worked against them. Now that she is much older, the age difference is no longer a big deal. I think that the so called closure that she needed was to see if they would have had a chance today or not. I say "so called closure" because depending on what they decided in their phone call, this may only be the beginning and not the end of it. BTW, the reason they wanted to have the conversation on the phone, and not via email, is that they could say things to each other without there being a record of it; since they both are married, she did not want him to have a permanent record of what they said, and he did not want her to have one either.


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## westegger (Jul 26, 2013)

TRy said:


> The main obstacle to their relationship in the past was that that a 28 year old dating a 17 year old was creepy and even possibly illegal. A lot of outside pressure from family and friends worked against them. Now that she is much older, the age difference is no longer a big deal.
> 
> I think that the so called closure that she needed was to see if they would have had a chance today or not. I say "so called closure" because depending on what they decided in their phone call, this may only be the beginning and not the end of it. BTW, the reason they wanted to have the conversation on the phone, and not via email, is that they could say things to each other without there being a record of it; since they both are married, she did not want him to have a permanent record of what they said, and he did not want her to have one either.


Yes! I agree. All of this I have considered. 

I still haven't been able to get a phone # for the wife or a place of employment. I just called a place of employment I found listed on Spokeo and asked for her, and they didn't have anybody by that name working there.

I got some more advice from a different friend, this morning that I would like to share in a different post.


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## workindad (May 7, 2011)

Did you buy and place the vars yet? You certainly need to and do so ASAP. 

Your wife looking up OM's wife is not a good sign. Not at all. 

Use the vars ASAP.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## westegger (Jul 26, 2013)

So. I reached out to friend who knows both my wife and I and is a lay minister for the premarital and marital programs at church. 

He is a practicing psychologist and specializes in MC. I got in touch with him over the weekend and he met me for coffee this morning.

I told him of everything that has happened, and brought along copies of the emails that I was able to print out and I will try to relate his advice and characterization of the situation.

He told me he had Bad News and Good News.

BAD NEWS:

1. I am NOT overreacting. He has been dealing with married couples for years and that I would not actually believe how many seemingly happy marriages can suddenly be blown apart by ex's "just getting in touch to say hello." He assured me that I am alone, and that he has in fact, seen this exponentially increase in the Facebook/Linked In/Everybody online age. But, he assured me, "it has been happening forever."

2. There obviously IS an emotional bond beyond just a simple exes relationship. There is no doubt that my wife has some sort of romantic feelings, (even if they are conflicted, buried and confused,) for this guy.

3. From my description of the situation to him, it appears that while this guy made the first contact, my wife is the one who does appear to have driven their correspondence to an actual phone conversation. In other words: "She actually put you in this situation, not this guy." 

4. The fact that after I talked to my wife, expressing how uncomfortable I was with this, she STILL went ahead with the call as planned is a real red flag. In that moment, she was only thinking of herself and this conversation with this guy. He said that I should have insisted that I be able to listen in on that conversation. (This is the same advice I got from many on this board. I didn't listen in. Lesson learned, all.)

5. By this other guy's own admission, people in his this guy's life saw their relationship as something dangerous. My friend asked me: "Was your wife controlling then? Did she stalk him after the break-up? You said she ended up in a bad way? How bad was that spiral? I don't want to scare you, but your wife may have been an 18 year old Glenn Close during that time. If that is the case, I want to prepare you that all of that behavior may be reactivated by this contact, and you will be in for a very long painful ride." (I have to tell everybody on this board that this was actually the most shocking thing for me to get my head around. It is something I had not really considered, but it does makes sense.)

6. The feelings you have of suspicion and betrayal will not go away any time soon. Even if your wife never contacts this guy again, and everything she has told you is the truth. You will experience these feelings for a long while. 



There was more Bad News. But he then told me that there is Good News.

GOOD NEWS:

1. You caught this really, really early. You seem to have caught it even before the first actual phone call. Many are not so lucky. Many people only catch on after there have been face to face meetings. Your catching of the email correspondence tracks back very quickly to the first contact. 

2. Your wife DID tell you about the conversation without you asking, and actually about the initial contact at the time it happened. This does make a difference. (However, he did say that it is possible she mentioned the upcoming phone call knowing that if I looked at the phone itemization next month, she would have to explain a long phone conversation to a strange number on the other side of the country. Something I hadn't thought of.)

3. This is all happening when your marriage is pretty steady and solid. You don't have financial pressures, both of your careers are going really well, you are happy, you are not dealing with sick relatives, etc. Believe me, he told me, she knows this. Even though it is being overpowered by emotion right now, she does, somewhere intellectually know this. 

4. She is seeing a therapist about this. He told me that this is one of the most hopeful things, believe it or not, that leads him to believe that she is telling the truth to me about her reasons for needing "closure" etc.

5. You made some mistakes in handling this. But you did handle it and you made it known that you feel any contact with him is not acceptable. He thought my insisting on marriage counseling was a very good idea. 

GOING FORWARD 

1. Definitely get her into marriage counseling. Don't let up on that, or let time pass. Do it immediately. If she is unhappy, or does harbor fantasies of leaving it WILL eventually come out in the hands of a good marriage counselor eventually. Maybe not the first few times, but it will come out.

2. Be honest and open EVERY DAY about how you are feeling about this issue. Don't let a day go by that you don't check in with her about your feelings about this and her feelings about it. He reiterated: EVERY DAY for maybe for a month or longer. At every one of those conversations, ask her if she had any contact or if she felt as if she need any contact with that guy today. She may start to feel uncomfortable about this, it doesn't matter, SHE's the one who said this was such a big emotional thing for her, and admitted that she was seeing a therapist about it. 

(To Expand he said this: "Don't worry about making her feel like you don't trust her. YOU DON'T, this is honest. You guys have been married for 14 years, very happily and you have built up a big savings of integrity and trust. Your wife has just made a very very big withdrawal from that savings account. That type of currency is only built up over time. It is going to take time for it to get back to where it was.")

4. Do monitor her. Use a key logger. (I mentioned the voice activated recorder, he said sure. My wife doesn't have or use a car though.) Check the internet history. If you know her password, check her email. Unfortunately, he said, if she WANTS to keep contacting this guy they will get creative about contacting each other and will cover their tracks well. Don't worry though, he said, as long as you stay vigilant they will mess up somewhere. 

5. He supported my decision about reaching out to one of her family members about the relationship that my wife had in high school with this guy. 


About the next thing, I wanted to share with this board, because I know there will be differing opinions.

On the case of contacting the OMW: He told me that is a very tricky area. One part of him understands, as most on these boards seem to advise me, it could help. 

However, he cautioned the following:

a.) Do not just assume that you will automatically gain an ally who will thank you graciously and offer you information from their side. You don't know how the OMW or OMH will react. He has seen many cases where the OMW or OWH completely flips out and becomes an enemy of the WS. Harassing phone calls, threats of restraining orders, and constant calls and or emails to the BS saying how they aren't controlling their spouse. If they live in the vicinity they sometimes even come to the house with their harassment.( In his opinion, after everything he has heard about my situation, he doesn't think I should risk that type of disruption at this point in the game.) 

b. Also: "In your case," he said, "your wife drove this a bit, and I guarantee you that that is the story this guy will tell his wife when she confronts him. AND, this is important, you OR he could show her the all the emails you have and while they wouldn't exonerated him, they would go a long way towards supporting his side of the story." 

Rather, he recommended contacting the guy first and telling him that I consider this chapter DONE. And let him know that if I even FEEL that he or my wife have had any more contact, I will let his wife know about all of this. And mention that I have evidence.

On this last point, about contacting the OMW I'm really conflicted. 

Most on this board have told me DO NOT contact the guy, but DO contact his WIFE immediately.


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## life101 (Nov 18, 2012)

I agree with the counselor except for contacting the OMW. You don't contact the OM. It will only drive the correspondence underground. Remember, you don't know what they talked about and what they plan to do. You will never know.

Contact the OMW. She is not going to be your friend, at least not in the beginning. She will be angry at you and call you a jealous liar. But it is still the honorable thing to do. She deserves to know. And if she tells you that she already knows of it and that her husband told her about it, then you have one less thing to worry about.


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## aug (Aug 21, 2011)

westegger said:


> Rather, he recommended contacting the guy first and telling him that I consider this chapter DONE. And let him know that if I even FEEL that he or my wife have had any more contact, I will let his wife know about all of this. And mention that I have evidence.
> 
> On this last point, about contacting the OMW I'm really conflicted.
> 
> Most on this board have told me DO NOT contact the guy, but DO contact his WIFE immediately.



Contacting the OM first allows him time to make up and spin whatever story he comes up with. It allows him to set his wife expectations. He'll make you look like a deranged person, your wife as a stalker (perhaps she is?). He'll certainly downplay whatever interactions your wife had with him.

He who sets the first impression sets the perception. So do you want the OM to set his wife's perception first?


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## aug (Aug 21, 2011)

westegger said:


> Interesting development. I was out for a few hours this afternoon. Just checked our internet history and what do you know?
> 
> My wife did a few searches on.... (drumroll) this guy's wife!
> 
> ...



She's finding out who her competition is. She's getting as much info as she can.

Looks like she cant get her mind off her first love.


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## workindad (May 7, 2011)

Is the var in place?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## westegger (Jul 26, 2013)

workindad said:


> Is the var in place?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I have not got the var, yet. Where should I place it. My wife doesn't drive. We live in a city and she takes public transportation. I drive the car and she never uses it. Should I put one there anyway?


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## Acoa (Sep 21, 2012)

westegger said:


> On the case of contacting the OMW: He told me that is a very tricky area. One part of him understands, as most on these boards seem to advise me, it could help.
> 
> However, he cautioned the following:
> 
> ...


Sounds like you have your head on straight, good for you. It's a crappy situation, but you appear to be handling it well. 

Regarding contact OMW, it doesn't really matter if she becomes your "ally" or not. You don't even need to send her proof. You just have to let her know that her husband is talking to an ex. He may turn that on it's head and make your wife look like the aggressor. That's just fine. Having OMW rip the phone out of his hand and tell her to stop calling would be great. Having her hear OM throwing her under the bus to save his own skin would be awesome. 

You see, it doesn't matter how that plays out, either way works for you. It keeps OM from forging any sort of connection with your wife.


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## westegger (Jul 26, 2013)

I do have the keylogger installed.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

A psychologist says: "Yeah. First thing you do is, you contact the POSOM."

And say what, pray tell? "I say, Old Chap! Would you mind awfully not having carnal congress with my wife?"

This is not, in my opinion, a good idea.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## life101 (Nov 18, 2012)

Put a VAR in the bedroom then. Do you monitor the phone activities too?


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## westegger (Jul 26, 2013)

life101 said:


> Put a VAR in the bedroom then. Do you monitor the phone activities too?


I've monitored the phone activity. And her email.


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## OlderAndWiser (Apr 17, 2013)

TBT said:


> truth about deception


Still don't know anything about that. Perhaps you are thinking of another poster with a similar name....


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

Put a var where she would likely use her phone when you are not around get 2 or 3 put them in strategic places. Hire a pi in his town and he can give you her cell #. Or you can fax him the emails with your contact info and he can give them to her.


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

I agree this was caught early but you still have to act fast jmo.


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## westegger (Jul 26, 2013)

tom67 said:


> Put a var where she would likely use her phone when you are not around get 2 or 3 put them in strategic places. Hire a pi in his town and he can give you her cell #. Or you can fax him the emails with your contact info and he can give them to her.


I thought about the PI thing. Just a question? Is it expensive?


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## The Middleman (Apr 30, 2012)

I think your friend is spot on with the exception of contacting the OM's wife. I have to disagree with him on that 100%. As far as I'm concerned, you are already too late in contacting the OM's wife. The fact that your wife knows that you raised this as an option opens the possibility that the OM already knows about it. I'm willing to bet my next check that she found a way to let him know.

My advice to you is to find a way to contact OMW *right now* and explain what happened and give her the evidence. Then you can call the OM.

Just my two cents on this. Don't make the same mistake you did when you didn't listen in on their conversations.

EDIT: While the snooping is important, now is the time to be proactive and take action; being Sherlock Holmes can wait until after you contact OMW..


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

westegger said:


> I thought about the PI thing. Just a question? Is it expensive?


Go online find a pi in that area tell him you need a cell ph# search I don't know maybe $150 to $175 eh start callingand pick up those vars today


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

westegger said:


> I thought about the PI thing. Just a question? Is it expensive?


A divorce would be a lot more expensive.


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## westegger (Jul 26, 2013)

tom67 said:


> A divorce would be a lot more expensive.


Very good point.


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## workindad (May 7, 2011)

If she spends time alone in her car, put a var there. Same for any specific room of the house. See Weightlifters recommendations and how to secure with velcro. Post #47 on this thread.

This is not all that expensive to do and it is easy. She could be making calls right now that you would benefit from knowing the conversation points. Do not reveal your sources.


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## weightlifter (Dec 14, 2012)

OK Im good here too

Buy the pen var and one Sony ICDPX312.

The pen var is for her purse. Bury it down low.
The sony is for where ever she talks in the house when she is alone. If you get two the second goes in either your bedroom or the second most likely place.

Im pulling for you but look at Hard to Detach's thread for how far how fast this can go to crap!


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## See_Listen_Love (Jun 28, 2012)

westegger said:


> I thought about the PI thing. Just a question? Is it expensive?





> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *tom67*
> _A divorce would be a lot more expensive.
> 
> ...



The councellor has a very good view of the situation I think. He is close to your and your circumstances. 

On the OMW issue I would follow the advise of the posters. Posters here I have seen in action almost from minute to minute in acute situation where they are much more effective than any councellor could be. Actually cheaters have no chance while the BS shares his info and follows their advice.

Not that they cannot be wrong and make mistakes, but the relentless pursuit of every bit of info and thinking about possibilities and checks makes it almost impossible for EA/PA's to stay undetected. And then the possibilities of reconciliation, trickle truth, new D-days, or finally divorce are all supported in great detail.

Follow the advice of the posters here on the OMW / OM contacting. The best advice I could give.


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## jnj express (Mar 28, 2011)

Do you have complete and total access to all her electronics---if not make sure you do---there is no privacy in a mge.

This guy was/is fishing, and had you not caught this---you are liable to have been facing your wife flying to him, or him coming to her---just cuz 3000 miles separate them, doesn't mean they can't hook up

This guy also has no scrupels---as proved by him being 28, and her only still in hi school------he had to know he was out of line-----also your wife, has a wild side, in that she would become arm candy for an older man----do you know if they were sexual with each other back then

Make sure you check for a burner phone as best you can---and you now need to be attentive, to the tiniest little changes in her life style, should there be any, OF ANY KIND

You contact the other wife---and do not talk to your wife's X-lover------how the other wife reacts, is a chance you need to take---but she is entitled to know what is going on---and she can very well help to cut off any continued attempt at contact

Make sure you stay hard about any possible future contact, OF ANY KIND---you jump down her throat , even if she sniffs around----you are now fighting to preserve a mge

She has already defied you once, over this guy---she may have told you she was gonna call---but you, her H, asked her not to---and what did she do---she called him anyway------stay alert-------there should be nothing between them, they didn't make it 14/15 yrs ago---and are both not the same people they were back then---so there is absolutely no reason for this to go forward


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## ironman (Feb 6, 2013)

Your minister friend gave you EXCELLENT advice. The only thing I disagree with is the part about not contacting the OW.

Here is another angle to think about. If you do contact her and she does go nuts and becomes your enemy ... at the very least, this should help make your wife see the gravity of the situation she has created. In other words, it would be a wake-up call to snap her out of her fog. Either way, contacting the OMW is to your benefit.

If you contact the OM instead of his wife, then that gives him the luxury of making up whatever story he wants and a chance to continue to pursue your wife. Think about it.

Contact his wife first.


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## The Middleman (Apr 30, 2012)

ironman said:


> Here is another angle to think about. If you do contact her and she does go nuts and becomes your enemy ... at the very least, this should help make your wife see the gravity of the situation she has created. In other words, it would be a wake-up call to snap her out of her fog. Either way, contacting the OMW is to your benefit.
> 
> Contact his wife first.


At the very least the OMW will become your wife's enemy .... which is exactly what you want. The benefits of telling her far outweigh the risks.


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## weightlifter (Dec 14, 2012)

Keep a lookout for burner phones as above. Great point.


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## weightlifter (Dec 14, 2012)

West please get the var thing done.

You think its bad now? My wife had an EA and I got it early. Nonetheless my wife LIED TO me. My wife was email spooning WITH AN EX. Do you have any idea how much damage has been done? 

That 100% implicit trust. Gone forever. I am now James Effing Bond for life. go me...

and yet.

My damage is FRACTIONAL to those here whose wives gave them over fully. Let me post something from Doubletrouble IMHO one of the most powerful things I have ever read here.
***
doubletrouble
I can tell you a few things about that from a male BS standpoint. 

Echoing what wl just said, you cannot say you're sorry often enough. Keep saying it. AND follow up with real change, real actions. 

The mind movies of her being with another man are something that runs through my head EVERY DAY. Every day when I see the same model car, hear his name randomly on the radio or during my business day, and other triggers I won't go into for various reasons... they all put my mind back in that bed, with her naked and wet, him naked and hard, taking what was supposed to be mine. She gave it willingly, thoroughly, completely, and then wrote to him what it was like to be in such a realtionship where she loved him so much. 

At that point with her I had NOTHING of what I thought I did. I was oblivious at the time, and she never told me. I had to find out. They did it in OUR bed, and since I was traveling at the time, I arrived the next day. His sperm wasn't even dead inside her before she accepted mine as well. That bites, in ways I can't even describe. It's the biggest betrayal, the biggest hit on my manhood and sexuality, as a provider and ALL the roles I take on as head of the family. That guy came in and stole it all... no, she gave it all to him in those moments. 

And it's not just the moments of sex, which are bad enough. To know what was being said between the two of them, and knowing he was married anyway, so just grabbing a free piece of ass at MY expense -- it's utter destruction of my heart. 

I could write on and on, because it goes on and on, but maybe that can give you a flavor of what you've done to your husband in those moments of gonad-driven stupidity and utter irresponsibility. You should be ashamed, you should be contrite, you should apologize over and over, and you must do all the heavy lifting because it was your CHOICE to spread 'em for some strange. 

And I tell her: I hope it was worth it. 
***
You CAN FEEL THAT MANS PAIN IN HIS WORDS. Has it happened to you yet? No. We are on your side and trying to prevent a replay. Many of us here. We... try to prevent that pain from happening and we see in you, a possibility of preventing it but YOU MUST GET GOING!


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## westegger (Jul 26, 2013)

Hi All, 

Tomorrow will be a good day for me to purchase and put the VAR's in place. (My wife is out all day.) Actually, I already had one! I didn't even realize that a digital recorder I have in the drawer had a voice activated feature. I tried it ahd it worked!

No strange internet history on her laptop or our computer. Email correspondence ends with them exchanging phone numbers for the call they had this past weekend. (Although that doesn't mean much because now that they have phone#'s, why leave an email trail, right?) 

My wife has her main email and one other one. I checked both and there was nothing. 

I installed Best Keylogger. 

Also, nothing on the phone, yet. 

After reading advice here yesterday, I checked her purse when she came home yesterday and went into the bathroom. I was searching to see if she had a "burn phone" which I assume is a pre-paid wireless phone.

While I was at it, I quickly checked her phone's call log and texts. 

Now, my question to everybody here is:

How the heck do I get any work done running this surveillance state?

I'm serious kind of. My marriage is the most important thing in my life, but it is not the only responsibility that I have, right?

My friend yesterday warned me that these feelings will not subside easily, but does anybody have any tips for coping with this.


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## workindad (May 7, 2011)

I would imagine that if your monitoring shows no continuance of contact then perhaps that will help a little. side from that try IC it reay does help.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## westegger (Jul 26, 2013)

workindad said:


> I would imagine that if your monitoring shows no continuance of contact then perhaps that will help a little. side from that try IC it reay does help.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


My wife and I are going to MC. But are you recommending I see an IC in addition?


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## westegger (Jul 26, 2013)

By the way, all. I talked to one my wife's siblings, who promised to keep our call confidential, (although I know that might be impossible.)

I got more info on the original relationship. This guy didn't seem like a predator, and they buy his story about not realizing how young she was at first. They said she was often mistaken for 21 or 22, even when she was 16. 

I asked what their parents thought. This was where the sibling said something that made sense. "Oh, our parents were going through a separation at that time, in fact, they were so wrapped up in their own thing that there was basically nobody watching out for us. We were partying, drinking, my brother was arrested. They didn't like the relationship, but they weren't really putting their foot down to stop it." 

I asked about the breakup and aftermath. My wife, apparently, was pretty devastated and that, combined with her parent's separation and the stresses of the first year of college, ended up with her being in a deep depression. They don't remember any crazy stalking.

This sibling did say they remember wanting to find this guy and say, "Hey jerk, why did you do that to my sister." But then they decided that the relationship was over, it was best to just it go.


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## Acoa (Sep 21, 2012)

westegger said:


> My wife and I are going to MC. But are you recommending I see an IC in addition?


You will probably get advice coming down on both sides of that. Personally, I reccommend going for at least a few sessions. A good therapist can help you process your feelings and come with some strategies to help cope with them. 

Eventually you will need to back down the survellance, the trick is when exactly? Obviously not until what she tells you matches what she is up to. Eventually you will have to bring that up. Try to do it in a way that doesn't expose your survellance methods.


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## westegger (Jul 26, 2013)

To follow up on my conversation with the sibling above. 

This explains this deep bond that she seems to have with this guy. He was not only a romantic relationship, (not her first according to the sibling,) but he was a seemingly stable adult figure caring for her during a time of absentee parents. What a dangerous combination.


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

westegger said:


> To follow up on my conversation with the sibling above.
> 
> This explains this deep bond that she seems to have with this guy. He was not only a romantic relationship, (not her first according to the sibling,) but he was a seemingly stable adult figure caring for her during a time of absentee parents. What a dangerous combination.


That does help explain a lot.


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## workindad (May 7, 2011)

Yes, I recommend IC for you at least give it a try. A good counselor will really help. 

Also expect that everything you discussed with your wife's sibling will be told to her by them. That should not be a surprise. Just be careful tipping them off to any monitoring you may do.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## westegger (Jul 26, 2013)

workindad said:


> Also expect that everything you discussed with your wife's sibling will be told to her by them. That should not be a surprise.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Yeah. I'm assuming it will. As I said, I do have a good relationship with her siblings. At the very least, I'm hoping that if this whole EA escalates or if she does talk about it with them even now, they'll already be in gear to say, "You have a good marriage, think about what the heck you are doing?"

In other words, it won't catch them off guard.


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

westegger said:


> Yeah. I'm assuming it will. As I said, I do have a good relationship with her siblings. At the very least, I'm hoping that if this whole EA escalates or if she does talk about it with them even now, they'll already be in gear to say, "You have a good marriage, think about what the heck you are doing?"
> 
> In other words, it won't catch them off guard.


West you did the right thing there you are using resources to defend your marriage, well played.


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

And looking back with this new info, it was very perceptive of her to seek ic. If she needs more tell her fine you understand.


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## westegger (Jul 26, 2013)

tom67 said:


> And looking back with this new info, it was very perceptive of her to seek ic. If she needs more tell her fine you understand.


Yes, she is pursuing more ic. A well as us going to mc. 

I had a follow up phone call with my friend who is a counselor. He told me the reason for having the EVERY DAY check in.

If people remember he said, every day you should have a conversation about this with your wife. At every conversation you should ask her if she has contacted this guy, or if he has tried to contact her. Be very clear that she needs to include any texts or emails that he has sent her and she has not replied to. 

Sometimes, he said, spouses can get a bit weasley with this. For example, the guy might just send her a link to a funny picture or article she might like. Technically, she may not have responded to him. But this is to be considered contact. 

The reason for this is that if suddenly you find she has an email account you didn't know about, or a pre paid wireless phone with 35 messages from him that she never mentioned. She can't say, "but I never replied to him, I can't help it if he keeps sending them." 

Also, he told me that there is another reason for this check-in.

He said that my wife and this guy have now had a really deep conversation, emotional connection Naturally, like all human beings, they will both want to process this. 

Right now, he said, she had her conversation and she feels like it was closure, but soon, very soon, she will want to have a conversation ABOUT the conversation. This is just how we work as humans. And, of course, the instinct will be to talk to this other guy about it.

The key he said, is that I need her to have this processing, this conversation about the conversaton, WITH ME, or with her best friend, or her therapist, but NOT THIS GUY. I need to keep in her face about the fact that this guy and she, by her own admission, have nothing else to say to each other.

This is a very key time. He said that if she can process all of this with other people, combined with knowing how serious I am about these boundaries, it will go a long way towards possibly breaking the private, secret-sharing bond that these two have.

Right now, she may feel like he is the only one who can truly understand what she is feeling about all of this. The only one with the answers. My friend said that as hard as I am working on surveillance, I need to work even harder to smash this belief of hers.

I thought this was very interesting.

By the way. I got another two VAR's. I have one in the bedroom. I taped it behind the headboard, very low. My wife sometimes talks to friends and family in there. I put one in the office under a bookshelf there. 

I have a third one, but I haven't figured out where to put it.


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## westegger (Jul 26, 2013)

Oh, I'll just add. My friend said that at the VERY LEAST, "if she continues covert conversations with this guy, this daily check-in forces her to lie every single day, to your face." So when they get caught, it's really hard for her to find any reasonable high ground to take in her defense.


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## workindad (May 7, 2011)

Stay the course I wish you well. You can always keep the extra var as a backup to switch out when listening to vars in place.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## westegger (Jul 26, 2013)

I'm thinking of posting a separate thread message about my experience on this board here. Most specifically about the advice of friends versus the advice on this board.

As I look back through this thread, I see my own evolution. I also see what led me to post here in the first place. 

I had talked to a friend, who, it ends up, didn't give me the best advice. I don't think he was stupid, and I believe he was well meaning. However, he has, to my knowledge, never been through something like this. 

I think the point is, he probably just wanted the best for me and my wife, and wanted to assume the best for both of us. 

Before I had talked to him, I had been lurking on these boards for a bit. 

His advice, just didn't sit right with me. I kind of want to maybe warn any lurkers that friends might not give them advice from a place of experience.


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## Squeakr (May 1, 2013)

westegger said:


> I think the point is, he probably just wanted the best for me and my wife, and wanted to assume the best for both of us.
> 
> Before I had talked to him, I had been lurking on these boards for a bit.
> 
> His advice, just didn't sit right with me. I kind of want to maybe warn any lurkers that friends might not give them advice from a place of experience.


It could also be that he was trying to give you the best advice without putting himself into the situation. It is easy for an anonymous person to give you the hard truth, or less than desireable advice, as they have no personal connection to you that might be jeopardized, whereas a friend possibly puts their friendship out there to be destroyed by their advice.


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## westegger (Jul 26, 2013)

Squeakr said:


> It could also be that he was trying to give you the best advice without putting himself into the situation.


Good point. If he tells me to confront her, he doesn't know If I'm going to say to my wife, "And DAVE told me that you're a cheater and that I should..."

That makes it a lot more personal.


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## Squeakr (May 1, 2013)

westegger said:


> Good point. If he tells me to confront her, he doesn't know If I'm going to say to my wife, "And DAVE told me that you're a cheater and that I should..."
> 
> That makes it a lot more personal.


Or if you don't like it, you say to your wife, I don't like the way that Dave talked about you, and then you start to avoid Dave and the friendship dissolves, or you tell Dave off to his face when he makes a suggestions as you feel that he is slandering your wife or making you feel inferior.


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## westegger (Jul 26, 2013)

I don't hold this against him at all. I am glad that I engaged this board, because I could have waited and it would have possibly made things a lot more complicated for me. 

Dealing with the reality has given me less sleep, but in the end I really believe it hopefully got me to contain this situation before it got out of hand. Though I have made some stumbles, I hope I have been able to do some things right.


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## The Middleman (Apr 30, 2012)

In general, the more people you ask, the more diversity of opinion and experience you get to base your individual decision upon. So asking here and speaking to your friend and your minister friend just adds to your pool of information. In my opinion, you did way better than most guys we see here.

I need to ask this again. Are you going to reach out to OMW?


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## weightlifter (Dec 14, 2012)

Please keep it all on one thread for sake of lack of confuzzlement.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

Has she given you a verbatim account of what she talked about with ex bf? Imho, if she hasn't, that lying by omission.

Though most here may disagree, I would expect to get a . Word for word accting and then contact him for his side of it.

Of course I would also warn him off in words the dumbest troll could understand.

Have you checked to see if what he did was illegal and if there is a statute of limitations?.


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## westegger (Jul 26, 2013)

The Middleman said:


> I need to ask this again. Are you going to reach out to OMW?


I am still very conflicted about this, I will openly admit. I have, as I said, an email for her and I have tracked down what I am pretty sure is her email.

Don't have a phone number, yet. 

I'm dragging my feet after the warning my friend gave me. But it seems everybody on this board is 100% for letting her know.


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## westegger (Jul 26, 2013)

Chaparral said:


> Has she given you a verbatim account of what she talked about with ex bf? Imho, if she hasn't, that lying by omission.
> 
> Though most here may disagree, I would expect to get a . Word for word accting and then contact him for his side of it.
> 
> ...


We had a long debrief after her conversation, where she walked me through the whole conversation, yes. 

Many on this board have told me not to contact him until I first contact his wife. (See my above post.) 

I looked into the legal issues back when this first started. The legal ages of the states involved are and were 16. My wife was 17 and 18 during that relationship.


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## The Middleman (Apr 30, 2012)

westegger:

From my point of view, your goal here is to see to it that your wife never has any contact with this guy again for any reason what so ever. In order to do that in the most effective way possible, you need to make it both uncomfortable and difficult for them to get together. One of the best ways to do it, from the OM's side, is to let the OM's wife know that her husband has reached out to your wife to renew their relationship. Even if your friend is right and the OMW goes bat sh1t on you, she will end up watching him like a hawk; especially if she see the evidence. The fact this his wife is going to be watching him (the same way you are watching your wife) is like pouring ice water on his "nads"; it's going to take the wind out of his sails. Additionally, it shows your wife that you are not fvcking around with this.

As I said in an earlier posting, you have the right mindset. Your not letting your wife bullsh1t you and for the most part, you don't seem to be afraid to do what's necessary to preserve your marriage and more importantly, preserve your own self respect. All you need to do now, is to follow through.

Edit: The phone tracking and the keyloggers are great, but in the accounting world we call these techniques "detective controls"; meaning that we allow the "mistake" to occur and these controls may tell us that the mistake happened, hopefully in time to fix it before it becomes a big problem. The best controls to have are "preventative controls", a mechanism that doesn't allow the mistakes to happen in the first place. Telling the OM's wife is a "preventative control", get the picture?


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## CrazySaneLady (Aug 1, 2013)

Your post really spoke to me! I have personal experience with this because I am the wife who went through this process with my husband and I hope the both of you can avoid this!

I ran into a man from a relationship over 10 years ago. There were still hurt feelings on my part and I avoided him initially. But we eventually began talking again. Then he asked if I would like to go for a motorcycle ride with him (we used to ride) and so I asked my husband if that was okay with him. It was, he trusted me. I trusted myself at that point too!

But this started me spending time with him alone. No problem. But as time went by I found myself looking forward to seeing him. I began getting the attention and conversations that I was lacking from my husband. He started to become attractive to me again. I did not physically cheat, but since this has happended I have learned about the 'emotional cheat' which can be just as bad. 

Finally, my husband asked if there was anything going on because he noticed that I was pulling away from this person by changing my schedule and not seeing him so much. Yes, I told my husband how I had developed feelings for this man again, and it has been very hard on our marriage! I opened a door that has been hell trying to close again!

My advice to you is do not let her go meet that man by herself! It is harder to shut a door that has been opened than avoiding the door altogether. Escort her, join her in any way she will let you. Let her know how you feel and that this is a legitimate concern. You can explain that although you trust her, you don't trust him. If she values your marriage she will understand your concerns and try to see it from your point of view. And if she insists on going by herself, let her, but also let her know that she gets to do this only one time! No more contact after her 'closure' session with this guy. 

Had I known that my relationship with my ex was going to ignite feelings for him again, I would have stayed away from him in the beginning. But I really thought that was not possible and it was a safe friend to have. I living and learning. 

Good luck to you and your wife!


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## Squeakr (May 1, 2013)

CrazySaneLady said:


> . And if she insists on going by herself, let her, but also let her know that she gets to do this only one time! No more contact after her 'closure' session with this guy.


I don't agree with this as it only takes one time to cross from EA to full blown PA. Without the spouse there, no telling what can happen and what plans can be made to take it further underground. It might start out to be a closure thing, but can easily be swayed into an underground affair if/ when the strong enough attraction exists. It could also turn into a "I understand but let's make sure and just this one last time" things that escalates to a closure PA. We have seen it written too many times that "I never intended to cheat on my spouse when I went to meet the AP and I was trying to end it" speech. If she can't do it in front of her spouse, then she needs to do it by letter and send it off. The spouse is owed no special considerations for their AP meetings.


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## Jonesey (Jul 11, 2011)

Squeakr said:


> I don't agree with this as it only takes one time to cross from EA to full blown PA. Without the spouse there, no telling what can happen and what plans can be made to take it further underground. It might start out to be a closure thing, but can easily be swayed into an underground affair if/ when the strong enough attraction exists.* It could also turn into a "I understand but let's make sure and just this one last time" things that escalates to a closure PA.* You are so right on this.. I also feel that after OP´s last few post´s.That his marriage will be pretty much done,at that point just hope he realize it before it´s to late.. Think about it OP! After all you have told us in you´re last few post´s. You must have noticed her being very concuss in what she does, and keep doing. SHE is putting and the willingness to sacrifice everything with you.The past the present and the future.everything on the plate.. This bolded part! Can you find a way to deal with it? i she meet´s up * We have seen it written too many times that "I never intended to cheat on my spouse when I went to meet the AP and I was trying to end it" speech.*
> And given her breakup with OM,and her behaviour after word´s.The complete meltdown.That even according to you´re friend admit´s
> it can reappear. What´s you´re plan????
> 
> ...


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## The Middleman (Apr 30, 2012)

By the way westegger, how have things been between you and your wife since this has transpired? Is she moving closer to you or further away? Does she resent the position you are taking on this?


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## westegger (Jul 26, 2013)

Crazy Sane Lady, your perspective simultaneously makes me feel thankful and scared. 

I am thankful because your account makes me realize that I am fortunate to have caught this engagement with an ex very early.

But I'm also scared because it makes me see how easily this sort of thing can slide into deeper feelings and attractions. 

I definitely WILL NOT allow my wife to see this man in person, on her own OR with me present. There is no need for that to happen. If I were to find out my wife was arranging that, or if she even told me she wanted to I would say, with all honesty, that I want to start proceedings for us to be separated. 

After all I have discussed with her, (we continue to check in every day about this by the way,) a request or action like that would show me that she is too far gone down the road and that her feelings for this man are greater than her feelings for me.


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## westegger (Jul 26, 2013)

The Middleman said:


> By the way westegger, how have things been between you and your wife since this has transpired? Is she moving closer to you or further away? Does she resent the position you are taking on this?


Things between me and my wife are very good, actually. She is not really moving closer or farther away, I guess. We had a great relationship before this happened and that seems to be the same now. We have been really open about all of this.

She doesn't seem to resent any of our conversations, or the boundaries I have put down. Indeed, I think she understands how much this affected me. Last night, we were talking about this and she told me that after our conversations, she thought about Christine, (one of MY exes with whom I had a very tumultous, on and off relationship years ago.) She said she was thinking about how she would feel if I was suddenly out of the blue, having conversations with Christine. She said, "I really wouldn't like it."

In all honesty, I worry that I'm the one who has changed. We still have fun, laugh and talk. There isn't any awkwardness. 

However, I know that I can't help but feel like I'm hyper alert and wondering all the time if she's just acting like everything is normal. 

There is no weird activity and my wife was alone at home last night, so I checked the VAR's this morning and nothing our of the ordinary. Calls to her sister and her dad and a friend. The quality is not half as bad as I thought it would be. 

No weird email or internet history either. 

If they are contacting each other, it has gone underground. I checked her bag for another phone early this morning while she was showering.


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## westegger (Jul 26, 2013)

I will add that I know I need to stay alert during this time. 

My counselor friend explained that right now, they maybe feel that they had an ending conversation, BUT maybe a week from now, he or she might send that one little text that might even just say, "Hey." And that is enough to start this all over again.


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## The Middleman (Apr 30, 2012)

westegger said:


> Things between me and my wife are very good, actually. She is not really moving closer or farther away, I guess. We had a great relationship before this happened and that seems to be the same now. We have been really open about all of this.
> 
> She doesn't seem to resent any of our conversations, or the boundaries I have put down. Indeed, I think she understands how much this affected me. Last night, we were talking about this and she told me that after our conversations, she thought about Christine, (one of MY exes with whom I had a very tumultous, on and off relationship years ago.) She said she was thinking about how she would feel if I was suddenly out of the blue, having conversations with Christine. She said, "I really wouldn't like it."
> 
> ...


I'm happy to hear this ... and maybe you are right, you caught this early enough and your "no bullsh1t" attitude about what you would accept seems to have paid dividends. However only time will tell.

I can say from my experience that the hyper vigilance doesn't go away for a long time. It has been nearly three years since I caught my wife e-mailing an ex behind my back and I'm still checking sh1t; so you have a ways to go. Like you, I caught it early before any damage was done but I went nuclear when I busted her (deleting e-mails, blocking e-mail addresses, blocking Facebook, etc.).

I don't want to repeat my self like a broken record, but one last time ... you are making a big mistake by not contacting the other man's wife. I won't say more than that, but what I will do is point you to another thread and it would be wise of you to read through at least the first dozen pages. Read it and you will see what happens when you don't contact the other man's wife from the very beginning.

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/57247-she-cheated-i-hate-my-life.html#post1107509

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/1107509-post1.html


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## westegger (Jul 26, 2013)

The Middleman said:


> I can say from my experience that the hyper vigilance doesn't go away for a long time. It has been nearly three years since I caught my wife e-mailing an ex behind my back and I'm still checking sh1t; so you have a ways to go.
> http://talkaboutmarriage.com/1107509-post1.html


I am figuring that out. Just the little ways everything is different. If I call her on her cell, and it rings and goes to voicemail, my first thought is, "Is she talking to him." I start racing through all of the people should could possibly be talking to. I never, in our whole dating life and marriage had thoughts like that. 

If I'm in another room, and she's on the computer, I wonder if she's googling something about him, or messaging with him.

I wonder how I'll be if she ever has to go to near where he lives on business or something. 

Lots of thoughts like that consume me. I've found my workouts at the gym are less than 100 percent. On cardio, the thoughts drain my intensity. When working out with weights, I find my rest times drift longer and longer as I think about these things.

The only thing that has been my saviour this week is yesterday and today, I've had some intense, deadline driven work that I can throw myself into.


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## The Middleman (Apr 30, 2012)

westegger said:


> The only thing that has been my saviour this week is yesterday and today, I've had some intense, deadline driven work that I can throw myself into.


Maybe when you go into counseling you can let her know the effect this incident has had on you and the damage done. I don't know. I never told my wife what it did to me ... all she saw was intense anger for 5 days until we had the "boundaries" discussion. That was wrong on my part, I should have shared that.


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## westegger (Jul 26, 2013)

Actually, I somewhat share these feelings with her every day when we have our conversation about it. 

And I share that I'm worried that these feelings won't go away for a long time.


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## westegger (Jul 26, 2013)

We have an MC appointment already set up.


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## weightlifter (Dec 14, 2012)

westegger said:


> I am figuring that out. Just the little ways everything is different. If I call her on her cell, and it rings and goes to voicemail, my first thought is, "Is she talking to him." I start racing through all of the people should could possibly be talking to. I never, in our whole dating life and marriage had thoughts like that.
> 
> If I'm in another room, and she's on the computer, I wonder if she's googling something about him, or messaging with him.
> 
> ...


Ditto on the computer thing. "Is she emailing that pos?" Thoughts.


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## VFW (Oct 24, 2012)

westegger said:


> We had a long debrief after her conversation, where she walked me through the whole conversation, yes.
> 
> Many on this board have told me not to contact him until I first contact his wife. (See my above post.)
> 
> I looked into the legal issues back when this first started. The legal ages of the states involved are and were 16. My wife was 17 and 18 during that relationship.


While not illegal it was still an improper relationship and he took advantage of her naivete. The difference in a 28-18 year old is like a 14-18 year old. The number of years is not great, but you are not fully developed mentally until around 25. Proof of this is that, after hearing from him, she fell right back to where they had left off in her mind. If she was really over him, she would not have felt the need for the conversation. 

She now appears that she has seen how this has affected you and is remorseful. She cannot change what happened, but needs to be completely open with you. If she is not hiding phone and does not have passwords on media, then she is on the road to recovery. As for you, it is just going to take time. You will check up on her today and then go awhile, then out of the blue check again. There is nothing wrong with this, it just takes time. She needs to know that this happens and just be patient with you, as you heal. You need to try and take the focus off of the problem with exercise, hobbies, family activities, etc.


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## The Cro-Magnon (Sep 30, 2012)

westegger said:


> We have an MC appointment already set up.


And what good is that going to do since she will simply lie to herself and the counsellor about her feelings, the last "x" number of years, where she is at, her love for you. Everything. She will just lie, lie, lie.

I have been through it.


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## AlphaHalf (Aug 5, 2012)

> I will add that I know I need to stay alert during this time.
> 
> My counselor friend explained that right now, they maybe feel that they had an ending conversation, BUT maybe a week from now, he or she might send that one little text that might even just say, "Hey." And that is enough to start this all over again.



Wouldn't you agree that 2 people working together on guard duty is better then one person. Your watching from your wife's side but who is watching the OM on his side? Nobody! Your on high alert with no backup or assistance. 

Give the OM's wife the chance to fix and evaluate her marriage LIKE YOU HAVE THE CHANCE TOO. 

**Can you answer that if the OM's wife knew what was going on and you didn't have a clue, you'd want her to tell you??**

As long as he is allowed to roam unwatched or suspected there is always more of a chance that he can contact your wife again. Half assed actions, breed half assed results. Wouldn't you agree that your marriage is one of those things that you don't half step on? Go all in!


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

AlphaHalf said:


> Wouldn't you agree that 2 people working together on guard duty is better then one person. Your watching from your wife's side but who is watching the OM on his side? Nobody! Your on high alert with no backup or assistance.
> 
> Give the OM's wife the chance to fix and evaluate her marriage LIKE YOU HAVE THE CHANCE TOO.
> 
> ...


Well said!!!:iagree:


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## I'm The Prize (May 22, 2012)

AlphaHalf said:


> Wouldn't you agree that 2 people working together on guard duty is better then one person. Your watching from your wife's side but who is watching the OM on his side? Nobody! Your on high alert with no backup or assistance.
> 
> Give the OM's wife the chance to fix and evaluate her marriage LIKE YOU HAVE THE CHANCE TOO.
> 
> ...


West, I've taken the time to read this whole thread and I so agree with contacting the OMW. It is the first thing I did when I realized my FWH was having an EA with his best friend's wife. Unfortunately for me he already knew and was encouraging it because he wanted to get her off of his hands. If I had been dealing with a normal person then he would have been doing the same things I was (watching email, checking phone records, etc). But let me tell you what happened instead, it should be a big red flag to you. 
As soon as I found the phone records I call her and gave her 2 hours to tell her husband not knowing that he knew and was thrilled. That little tipping off cost me. First thing he did was to have her stop using his private email and to start using his work email. It is a secured gov. type email that no one can access from outside the building. The she convinced him to go buy a prepaid phone so that I couldn't see that they were still sexting and talking to each other. He SAID he wanted to work on our marriage. He said he had stopped. It LOOKED like he had. Then two weeks later he said he wanted a divorce and three days after that (pay close attention to this one) she flew 800 miles to spend 2 days in a cheap motel to seal the deal. I want you to remember my story every time you get wishy washy about telling the OMW. DO IT NOW!!!!!!


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## weightlifter (Dec 14, 2012)

I'm The Prize said:


> West, I've taken the time to read this whole thread and I so agree with contacting the OMW. It is the first thing I did when I realized my FWH was having an EA with his best friend's wife. Unfortunately for me he already knew and was encouraging it because he wanted to get her off of his hands. If I had been dealing with a normal person then he would have been doing the same things I was (watching email, checking phone records, etc). But let me tell you what happened instead, it should be a big red flag to you.
> As soon as I found the phone records I call her and gave her 2 hours to tell her husband not knowing that he knew and was thrilled. That little tipping off cost me. First thing he did was to have her stop using his private email and to start using his work email. It is a secured gov. type email that no one can access from outside the building. The she convinced him to go buy a prepaid phone so that I couldn't see that they were still sexting and talking to each other. He SAID he wanted to work on our marriage. He said he had stopped. It LOOKED like he had. Then two weeks later he said he wanted a divorce and three days after that (pay close attention to this one) she flew 800 miles to spend 2 days in a cheap motel to seal the deal. I want you to remember my story every time you get wishy washy about telling the OMW. DO IT NOW!!!!!!


HOLY....!

Whats with all the Jerry Springer episode threads lately?

Just. WOW.


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## The Middleman (Apr 30, 2012)

I'm The Prize said:


> I want you to remember my story every time you get wishy washy about telling the OMW. DO IT NOW!!!!!!


Forget it. He's not going to do it .... unless they get in contact again ... which will be too late.


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

westegger said:


> Actually, I somewhat share these feelings with her every day when we have our conversation about it.
> 
> And I share that I'm worried that these feelings won't go away for a long time.


Westegger

While you need to be vigilant do not let it drive you insane.

TAM has a way of letting our imaginations grow wild with our own everyday issues.

I really like how you have handled everything so far.

I had a sister go through the same experience that your wife has gone through.

Young, illicit relationship with someone older that made an impression on a young girl/womans mind.

Not good.

Thankfully my parents and my brother and I were able to convince both of them to stop all activity.

And the OM was arrested. He was 12 years older.

Stay sharp. But be confident in yourself.

Your wife is lucky to have you.


HM64


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## I'm The Prize (May 22, 2012)

weightlifter said:


> HOLY....!
> 
> Whats with all the Jerry Springer episode threads lately?
> 
> Just. WOW.


:lol::rofl::lol::rofl: Yep, I live it without getting my 15 minutes of fame. Great huh?


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