# I'm new.... My husband might be cheating on me :(



## Geny (May 13, 2019)

My husband might be cheating on me and I don't know what to do.... I want to be wrong about it 

My husband's car had a flat and I called CAA to deal with it. The guy found a phone in the trunk with the spare.... I didn't think anything of it at first. It's one of our older phones, was dead or off, and I assumed the kids had been playing with it and it was lost in the trunk. Things do slip under the mat. I told my husband that CAA put on the spare and he's PISSED. It was thunderstorming, my husband had an important meeting to get to and I thought I was being nice... We have a yearly membership so it was "free" and he hates changing tires. Why have the membership if he doesn't want to use it? He's pissed at me for doing it without asking him. It was 5 AM and he was still sleeping. I didn't want to wake him for that! I put the old cell on the table and after I took the kids to the park the phone was gone. I asked my husband about it and he said he didn't know what I was talking about but confirmed that the kids play with the old phones sometimes so it was probably that. He also pointed out that we lost a phone for over a year after it fell into the chesterfield. My kids said they didn't take it off the table though and my husband doesn't know what I'm talking about. He is acting weird as hell. He skipped an important meeting at work and secluded himself to his home office for the rest of the day. He kept being pissed at me and grumpy with the kids. I talked to a friend of mine about it and he said my husband is cheating.... I don't want that  Now I can't stop thinking about it. I want there to be another explanation. Last night he came to bed and was back to being sweet. He apologized and said he's stressed at work and overreacted. We had sex and it was really good but very out of character for him. I thought I was being stupid and overreacted as well. Now I'm not sure again.... He changed the password on his cell. He changed the password on his laptop. He wiped his desktop. He deleted Facebook. He wiped his email and changed the passwords for his other emails. He hasn't cleared out his email in YEARS. He had 1000's of emails going back probably 15 years. Now they are all gone? He said his computer crashed after an update and he had to reset it and he's tired of having a full inbox. He said Facebook is stupid and his friends were all deleting theirs too. He said work required passwords to be reset and is much more strict about privacy and confidential information. Now he's mad at me again for going through his stuff. What is going on...


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## Lostinthought61 (Nov 5, 2013)

Sorry you find yourself here under these circumstance....he is mad because he got caught......this is not on you at all.....read up on 180. His anger will quickly turn to guilt if you implement the 180. let me try to find you the link 
also talk to an attorney to understand your rights, you may not use them but have the information with you.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

It seems incredibly suspicious. If he is cheating, and it certainly looks credible, he has either ended it or gone further underground with it.

Unfortunately, you tipped him off by being nice and accidentally discovering the old phone.

It will be even harder to discover what he has been up to now as he is on high alert.

If you can go undiscovered, check the into voice activated recorders that can be hidden in cars and other places where he believes he would have privacy for making phone calls.

You might not find anything with that route if he is smart enough to only text and he keeps his other phone hidden.

Do you know anyone who could keep your confidence and is very good with computers and phones?

You could also check the "Standard Evidence Gathering" thread started by @weightlifter


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

The car was the center of the Hurricane that suddenly met you unexpectantly.

Yes, he is shady, and is likely cheating. 

I would return to the scene of his crime...the car.

Put a voice activated recorder, VAR, under the front seat.

Buy a Sony model at Best Buy and practice with it first.

He will still use the car for his communications. 

And, maybe, at some point, hire a Private Investigator.

I think he believes you may have snooped on that phone, already.
He is taking no chances. 

Rather obvious, Eh?





[THM]- Nemesis


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## MRS.SEXYTAZ (May 10, 2019)

Hi Geny,

So sad to read your post and hear your going through that . This is coming from a person that just went through that last week an feelings was confirmed to be true.. I really pray that isn't your case . 

But if you can talk to him about it .I believe that would help to ease your suspicion. U know your huband ...... I hope you know him well enough to know when he's not telling the truth or down playing a situation. Try talking to him when he's not in a bad mood if you can .

My Prayers will be with you and hope all is well.


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## Geny (May 13, 2019)

What is the purpose of a voice recorder? To hear him in the car with someone? Like sex...?


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## Geny (May 13, 2019)

What else would be in his car?


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## SadSamIAm (Oct 29, 2010)

Geny said:


> What is the purpose of a voice recorder? To hear him in the car with someone? Like sex...?


To hear voice conversations including phone calls.


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## rugswept (May 8, 2019)

Sorry Geny. 
Anyone acting like that is up to no good. A sudden purge of everything? 
That phone thing was an alarm to him and he spent the rest of the day deleting everything in sight. 

The voice recorder turns on when there are audibles. in the event he's on his burner phone, with her, for example. 
check around to see if he has condoms hidden away or something like that. 

there's something wrong here Geny. you just happened to hit into it by accident. 
you were talking to someone who said there was some cheating going on. (you said he). was that something he knew or he was surmising because of the suspicious behavior?


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## Geny (May 13, 2019)

This sucks  

So the voice recorder hears him talking in the car? I take it out and listen to it after? That's what my marriage has come to... 

We don't use condoms and I've never seen any around the house. He had a vasectomy two months ago. Condoms can't be in the car right? The temperature changes would mess with them? He doesn't like condoms so I don't know if he'd even use them. I had sex with him last night so that's disgusting....

I talked to a friend of mine. He said my husband is cheating because of the phone being hidden and the way he's acting. He doesn't have proof or know him well enough to know for sure. He just thinks it. 

****....


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Do you have any disposable income that he wouldn't notice you spending?

If so, a PI might be a solid way to figure out what he is up to.


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## Geny (May 13, 2019)

A PI? Like a private investigator? Do people actually do that?

We have a shared bank account. If he checked it he'd notice.


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## rugswept (May 8, 2019)

Geny, i just hope we're all wrong about everything. 
usually when they act like that, they're guilty as hell. 
if he had the vas, he's not that worried about unwanted children. so.. no condoms. 

with the wakeup call, if he's doing anything, they're taking it underground... extremely secretive. 
stop and think where his opportunities are. one of those, oh, i'm going to ... wherever. 
before work (suddenly going early, after work ... "Working late".). Oh, gotta meet with ... 

he has to be talking or texting her sometime. that phone you found was probably it. 
if he's talking in his car, the voice recorder will catch it. 

let's hope this is all nothing. out of all the cases most of us have seen, 
when it's in your gut that somethings wrong, something is wrong. 

good luck Geny.


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## wilson (Nov 5, 2012)

You're in a terrible situation, but you have to take control and start investigating. We all know this sucks. Don't get caught up in how much it sucks or else you won't be able to need to do what is necessary. It's like being a soldier in a firefight. You need to do what's necessary to win the battle instead of thinking about how awful it is you're in battle in the first place.

The VAR is to hear him talking when he's in the car. That's a pretty likely place he'll talk freely considering the phone was found there. One thing you might want to do is buy two VARs so you can swap them out and listen/charge one while the other is still active in the car recording. Hide them under the seat or someplace where he won't stumble across them. Keep in mind that it is generally illegal to secretly record conversations, so use them only for your own knowledge.

It might be best to let him think you believe his phony-baloney story so he gets comfortable. If he thinks you're still suspicious, he'll destroy more evidence and get better at hiding things. If you can get bank or credit card statements, look into those for suspicious charges. Phone records may help, but there might not be anything because he has an extra phone. Tax forms from past years may reveal extra bank accounts. How much of that do you have access to?

Hiring a PI can also be a good strategy to get information. You can maybe speed the investigation along by giving him a free day on the weekend or whenever where you take the kids and are gone all day. He may take that opportunity to hook up and the PI can get evidence.


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## StillSearching (Feb 8, 2013)

Can you get a friend that he doesn't recognize to follow him?


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## Geny (May 13, 2019)

Do cheaters ever admit to it if asked?

I don't know what I'm supposed to do if he is cheating. I can't even focus 

He's salary and sets his own hours. He has access to the office 24/7. There is no pattern to it. He fell asleep at the office once....but probably not... but that was over a year ago  so he could be doing it that long?

He goes out with friends every weekend. Always has. This weekend his friends rented a cabin and they are going there to drink the long weekend away. 

My husband is a stickler for keeping his car clean and looking brand new. He might find a VAR if I put it there. If he's not cheating then I'm the *******. He makes work calls from his car if he's out and I don't know if I'd get in trouble for having that recorded. He gets bank info, SIN, drivers license, passport number, etc from people.

We have a shared account. I can see it but he withdrawals a lot of money because he prefers using cash. 

I don't know how to access our phone records because it's all in his name. 

He does all of our taxes. I don't know anything about that. I don't think we've ever put bank info on them? 

He'd have sex with someone in the house if the kids and I are not here? I hate the thought of some ***** being in my house.... 

So I tell him I believe him and wait for him to slip up? I'm not a good liar. 

He knows all of my friends enough to recognize them.


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## Geny (May 13, 2019)

I'm such an idiot.


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## rugswept (May 8, 2019)

any late night "office work" or "drinking weekends" are the opportunities he's looking for. 
the really easy trap is to keep an eye on this "drinking with buddies" somewhere. 
have someone do a drive by to see if his car is there or not if you have an idea where it is. 
a GPS tracker in his car would also tell a lot. 

he definitely has opportunity on this weekend thing. 
think about his habits... is he well dressed or "spiffed up" when he goes on weekend trips? 
how can you be sure he's even with friends. 
be careful of "the cabin". that might be them having a weekend together. 

you have to develop a poker face where you don't pry or look suspicious. 
you have to go back to the innocent mode you were in when you suspected nothing. 

look Geny. this stuff is gut wrenching and consuming. 
i tried to catch the WW for a long time and never trapped her cold. it was a long time ago. 

the most telling thing is behavior. suddenly, something is just different or seems out of place. 
that, they can't hide.


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## wilson (Nov 5, 2012)

Cheaters lie extensively. They will lie right to your face and swear on their kids lives that they aren't cheating. We can't be certain he's cheating, but we can be certain that if he is cheating, he will lie about it. Even if he says he did something, he will greatly minimize it. Like, he may say he just talks to her on the phone, but the reality is that they rent motel rooms. The "weekend with the boys in a cabin" could be just a made-up excuse and none of it might be true. He could be meeting her in Vegas.

He certainly has structured things so that it would be easy for him to cheat and it would be hard for you to find out. With no good records of where the money went and where he spends his time, he could be doing anything. Getting a PI might be the best way if you can't get that history. If you can't put a VAR in his car, consider putting them in his office, bedroom, or anywhere else in the house he might talk on the phone.


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## cc48kel (Apr 5, 2017)

I'm sorry to hear this.. I really hope it's NOT true-- the cheating. I would be curious too- what a great wife to take care of the tire so hubby could sleep a bit longer-- why be so upset!!!

I'm feel like your friend-- something is up. With the spare phone and all the changing passwords....Please stay strong and stay as 'normal' as you can SO that you can investigate a bit. People on here have such good ideas such as the VAR-- you can purchase this and place it in his car. Many ppl use their cars as an private office so I'm sure you could get more information on that. I'm sure there is a way to recover passwords OR at least see what sites he's visiting. It's also up to you but I would visit an attorney--- just to see what your up against. Many have free consultations. I'm not at all saying to divorce JUST for for information for you. Talk Care and I hope you find the truth soon.


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## BigToe (Jun 2, 2011)

I am afraid to say that I think he is gaslighting you. When something doesn't make sense, it doesn't make sense. As difficult as it is to consider the worst scenario, think logically and sensibly.

Does it make sense that someone would be upset for having their tire changed, unless they knew there was something hiding in the spare tire area. Does it make sense that an old phone would suddenly disappear? Does it sound logical that he would skip a meeting and seclude himself in the home office; only to come out with changed passwords, deleted emails, and accounts? Is it possible he feigned "staying mad" at you because it gave him the time to stay secluded and spend the day deleting emails and accounts without you coming in to "make things better". Is it coincidental that after all his accounts are cleaned or deleted he suddenly feels better and is ready to "make up"? If you needed a reason to justify so many deletions and change of passwords, isn't "work required it" quite convenient?


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## Steve2.0 (Dec 11, 2017)

Get the family in the room right now and dont let them leave until that phone appears.

I might just stare at your husband the entire time.


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## Stormguy2018 (Jul 11, 2018)

Too many classic red flags here. Sorry, but yes, he is cheating.

You need to check out survivinginfidelity.com - you will find great compassionate support.


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## Geny (May 13, 2019)

I found the old cell in the kids playroom... my kids still say they didn't touch it or put it there though. I was in there all day and I didn't see it until after my husband came home.... I turned it on and there is nothing on it. My husband uses a permanent data eraser when he sells his phones every year. If he did that I'll never know what was on there. 

What if it's nothing, my kids did take it and I'm going crazy and accusing my husband. But it doesn't make sense  

I flat out asked if he is cheating and he said no. He is mad at me for thinking that. He said people who are cheating will accuse their spouse. He said I'm cheating.... I asked to see his phone and he said no because he's innocent until proven guilty. 

He wouldn't hide anything if there was nothing to hide. If he wanted anything of mine I'd give it to him. So what do I do? Walk away from my husband and ruin my family? I don't even know what he's doing  I wish he would just tell me.


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## Stormguy2018 (Jul 11, 2018)

Geny, he won’t tell you anything. But now that you’ve accused him without solid evidence, it’s cover all tracks time. 

This will make it difficult for you. Again, check out survivinginfidelity.com.


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## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

Geny said:


> I flat out asked if he is cheating and he said no. He is mad at me for thinking that. He said people who are cheating will accuse their spouse. He said I'm cheating.... I asked to see his phone and he said no because he's innocent until proven guilty.


It would seem very simple just to show the accuser your phone if there's nothing on it. If he's innocent, he could act all high & mighty about it, say that your relationship will never be the same again, but in the end, I'd think he'd show it. But you know him better than any of us here. If backed up against a wall, would he become belligerently defensive, even if innocent? Some would.


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## wilson (Nov 5, 2012)

Hang onto the phone. There are services which can try to restore the data. A likely possibility is that he planted it in the kids room after wiping it. Does the phone still have a sim card or service? If so, call 611 to see what service it uses. It might be possible to get the service history. There's also the possibility that's not even the original phone. Maybe he bought a new one at the store since he knows it would be totally clean and put that in the kids room.


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## rugswept (May 8, 2019)

the response you got from him is the usual with someone up to no good. 
the accusatory and combative behavior and denials is the usual behavior from cheaters. 
it's the secrecy and all the account changes that tells you plenty. 
now that he's on guard, he'll be really hard to pin down if he's up to no good. 

others have said it, i'll say it: go over to survivinginfidelity.com and post your story from here on Just Found Out. 
they'll quickly take it all apart piece by piece. the posters there deal with many cases. 
they'll point out ever suspicious thing and actions you should take. some of it will be the same as you heard here. 

so far the posters here think something not good is going on here.


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## Steve2.0 (Dec 11, 2017)

Geny, what kind of phone is it? If its an Iphone you can try an app like IMyfone D-Back - it will recover things he deleted... unless he completely wiped it out (which would be weird for a phone in your trunk?? who has a brand new wiped phone forgotten in a trunk?)

There are also andriod apps that let you scan the phone for deleted text messages or images.


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## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

Geny said:


> I found the old cell in the kids playroom... my kids still say they didn't touch it or put it there though. I was in there all day and I didn't see it until after my husband came home.... I turned it on and there is nothing on it. My husband uses a permanent data eraser when he sells his phones every year. If he did that I'll never know what was on there.
> 
> What if it's nothing, my kids did take it and I'm going crazy and accusing my husband. But it doesn't make sense
> 
> ...


Gene, if you want help you need to listen to the folks here, even though it may sound counter intuitive. Unfortunately you have already put him on notice that you suspect something so it will now make him go further underground and be more careful. You have to act as if nothing is wrong and go about your routine as normal. Eyes wide open, mouth shut.
Keep track manually or on pc, His timings , things that he might say which are odd, etc. Cross check but do not confront under any circumstances. VAR his car, office etc. If you have access to his home office check credit card statements, bank statements etc. You have to play it cool. Your gut is telling you something is wrong, always listen to your gut. It’s usually right.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

@Geny sorry to meet you under such circumstances, but it is possible your husband is cheating on you. 

Which is why I have moved your thread to the Coping With Infidelity section of TAM.

You'll receive a lot of good advice from people who have gone through it, themselves.


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## She'sStillGotIt (Jul 30, 2016)

Geny said:


> Do cheaters ever admit to it if asked?


Most of us have a better chance of shaking hands with Jesus than we do of getting the TRUTH out of a cheater. Lying is second nature to them. That's just the way it is.



> He fell asleep at the office once....but probably not... but that was over a year ago  so he could be doing it that long?


I guess it's possible he 'fell asleep' at his office. But after having read about all his slimy, shady behavior, I don't believe a word that comes out of this guy's lying mouth.

I'm just going to be brutally honest here and I don't say this to be mean or snarky.  I think you're one of those incredibly sweet but horrifically *naive* wives who have just been completely snowed by their shady husbands. You seem incredibly insulated from what's really going on in your marriage and I also think you're kept pretty clueless about your finances and investments, and he probably pays all the bills so you can't even access your phone bill or see the credit card statements.

There's a REASON for that, Geny, and it ain't because it just happened that way. He did that on purpose so you're kept ignorant of what he's doing when he's not home playing Happy Husband. It allows him to be able to lead a whole double life you know nothing about. It isn't an accident that you're basically kept in the dark about your finances while HE controls it all and makes sure the only thing you're concerned with is caring for the kids, the house, and for him. Other than that, it's none of your business what he's doing when he's not home.

Sadly, I've read your particular story a *million *times over the last 20 years of reading infidelity/relationship message boards. And never ONCE did it turn out that the sleazy character with the hidden phone in his trunk (and who goes out to play with his 'buddies' every weekend like a single frat boy) was innocent. Not _once _did it ever turn out that way.

Someone up there was looking out for you and finally gave you the gift of sight when you chose to call the tow truck which revealed his secret burner phone. Had he been awake, he would have dealt with this himself in order to keep you blissfully ignorant - like he's done for years. This isn't new behavior, it's deliberate, practiced, and second nature to the guy. He's been at this for YEARS.


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## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

About the only thing you can do since you literally have no standing in your marriage is to check with the wives/Sos of his friends. Try to verify the stories of the weekend partying.

And, for God's sake, haul yourself into 2019 and become an equal partner in your marriage. There is no reason everything has to be in his name. There is no reason you have to be left alone to take care of the kids every weekend while he is out partying. You're being treated like a servant - not a wife. Take control of your life.


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## Emerging Buddhist (Apr 7, 2016)

If my spouse thought I was unfaithful I would be mortified and turn over the world to show them I was true in word and deed... every account open, every questioned answered even well past their knowledge-base for any and all open reviews.

People dig bunkers for reasons... equal access to ALL accounts in your marriage is your legal right, accept nothing less.

Be prepared for the truths that may come... a relationship must have the three below in order to stand:

Trust
Communication
Respect

Deceit breaks all three.


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## Satisfied Mind (Jan 29, 2019)

Geny, I'm sorry you're in this situation, but glad you found this forum because all the signs are pointing to your husband cheating:



The cell phone with the spare tire in the trunk of your husband's car. A phone doesn't just fall in there, and your kids certainly wouldn't put it in there. Your husband put it there, and there aren't any explanations I can think of that add up to anything good. Also, if the phone had a good amount of battery power when you found it, that means it's been used recently, which is inconsistent with it being lost in the trunk. Also, you might check what operating system is currently on the phone. If it has been updated recently (or since you switched to newer phones, that means he's been using it).
Your husband's reaction to you calling CAA. I'm a car guy, and I've had some very nice sports cars. On one in particular, the wheels were custom made and were literally irreplaceable. I wouldn't let anyone outside of my shop or the dealer change my tires on that particular car. Even then, I wouldn't have reacted the way your husband did. And based on your description, clearly that's not the situation for your husband. His reaction was based on your discovery of the phone, not the changing of the tire. 
His actions the rest of the day are consistent with him cleaning his tracks. Changing passwords, wiping his computers, and deleting emails and his FB account? I mean no offense here, but you sound naive, and even you know this doesn't add up to anything good. Much too coincidental.
He was acting "weird" and the sex he had with you that night was "out of character." These are frequent indications of an affair.
His reaction to your confrontation is inconsistent with that of an innocent person. I would be upset if my wife accused me of cheating, but I would let her see everything (other than my work email, which is highly confidential) so that she could confirm that I was not. Heck, she has all of my passwords anyway. She wouldn't even have to ask.
You husband has unbelievable amount of opportunity to cheat. This isn't evidence of cheating, but opportunity is a significant factor. He has a flexible work schedule, he handles all the finances, and he takes off for the weekends and could be just about anywhere.

Unfortunately, you didn't recognize these signs for what they were early enough. I can almost guarantee that if you had checked that phone that morning, you would have found numbers or texts that would have helped you quickly figure this thing out. Your husband was already being EXTREMELY careful, and now he's gone even further underground, so catching him with hard evidence is going to be much more difficult. Here are my recommendations:



It sounds like your husband has dominated/controlled your marriage, and you've taken a very submissive role. Without putting him on notice, you are going to need to get tough and be clinical about this. We understand that this is a mentally and emotionally devastating situation you're dealing with, but you need to be as strong as you can be in how you approach it.
Start with the old phone. I would use recovery software that other posters have recommended to see if you can recover anything. You need to do this quickly to have the best chances. I would also check the software version on the phone, look up online when that version was released, and if it was more recent than when you switched phones, then you know he's been using it and at the bare minimum he's been dishonest with you.
I would get a VAR and put it under his seat. I would make a cash withdrawal and pay for it in cash. If you velcro it to the bottom middle of the seat, he is very unlikely to find it no matter how well he cleans the car. Like others have said, get two so you can replace them each time you check.
When your husband goes off on his own for an evening or weekend, look for ways to verify what he did without cluing him in. Maybe casually check with the S/Os of the guys he's supposedly with. If he says he's going to a cabin out in the woods 150 miles away, is his odometer consistent with that story?
A PI is likely to get answers a lot faster than the recommendations above, but it'll cost some money. Do you have a friend or family member you can confide in and borrow money from so that your husband doesn't notice?


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## Geny (May 13, 2019)

If backed up against a wall my husband gets defensive even if he's innocent. He'll take the hard route to exercise his rights and stand his ground. He spent a night in jail because he'd rather do that than answer some simple questions and leave.... He wasn't even in trouble!

The phone:
The battery on it was dead when I found it in the playroom... I plugged it in and turned it on. There isn't a sim card in it. A friend of mine tried a recovery program on it. He's a tech guy and does it for a living. He couldn't get anything off of it. It's a Samsung S6. It's running 6.0.1 which from what I can tell was released in 2015. There are no updates though. My husband's car is a hatchback, so the kids frequently throw things over the back seat. It could be innocent? Maybe...? 

This weekend:
I saw the messages on discord planning the weekend trip. He contributed to the cost and said he'd be there. Other wives are going and I was invited as well. We don't have a babysitter available and I don't drink so it isn't appealing to me anyway. A problem is that most (if not all) of his friends have cheated on their spouse... They'd cover for my husband if he asked them too...  He has cheated in past relationships.... but they were high school relationships. I'm stupid... 

I didn't think about checking his odometer. Can it be reset? If I can get into his car I can do that... I tried to check my husband's car and he changed the passcode to get in. He kept his keys in his pocket instead of hanging them up and I don't have an excuse to ask for them. He said he doesn't want anyone getting into the car because he keeps confidential work stuff in there and he doesn't trust me anymore...

He's talked about deleting facebook before. He's had computer issues from updates before. His work has required passwords to be changed many time before. Could it be a coincidence? Maybe?

Previously my husband hasn't given me a reason to think that he's cheating. We don't fight. We spend time together. We have a family and he's actively involved. We usually have sex every day. He doesn't complain about me or our marriage. We're happy... Or we were...

I don't mind when he goes out with friends on the weekends. He spends a lot of time with the kids and I before he goes and doesn't go until 9-11PM. I'm usually in bed anyway so I don't care. He does that Friday and Saturday. He isn't usually hung over the next day. Sunday is a family day. Sometimes he goes away for the weekend but spends more time with us before and after. It's not something that has bothered me... I like alone time sometimes. He's done this our entire marriage and dating... If that is his cheating time and he has been doing it for THAT long...  He wouldn't do that...

My husband is dominant and takes the lead. I'm not and I don't so it works for us and our marriage. I haven't cared that my husband deals with the bills because it's one less thing for me to do... I didn't have a reason to think anything of it... The filing cabinet is locked and the key is on his car keys.

Today my husband said he's going to be working late. I can't stop thinking about what he's doing... I called and texted him but he hasn't answered. I don't know what to think... Why would he cheat if he has everything at home already and we're happy? I don't know what I did wrong... I do everything that he wants. I keep him happy...  He wants me to apologize for accusing him and make it up to him (with sex) and I don't want to.

What does a PI do exactly?


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## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

Your husband could drop dead tomorrow and you wouldn't have a clue as to the finances or how to navigate settling his estate. Hell, you'd have to break into the filing cabinet that is in your own home! You're living a 1950's style of marriage and it didn't work so well, then. Maintaining your ignorance in order to make your life easier will come back to haunt you. 

A PI will conduct surveillance and other lawful spying. He may take pictures.

What you need to do is get a credit card in your name only (so if you ever want to hire a PI, you will be able to undetected) to protect yourself in event of adverse circumstances. Should your husband die in questionable circumstances, your bank accounts will be frozen and you won't be able to access funds to pay the bills. I know a lady whose husband keeled over dead from a snake bite and her bank accounts were frozen.


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## Satisfied Mind (Jan 29, 2019)

Geny, some things stood out to me from your last post:



Geny said:


> The phone:
> The battery on it was dead when I found it in the playroom... I plugged it in and turned it on. There isn't a sim card in it. A friend of mine tried a recovery program on it. He's a tech guy and does it for a living. He couldn't get anything off of it. It's a Samsung S6. It's running 6.0.1 which from what I can tell was released in 2015. There are no updates though. My husband's car is a hatchback, so the kids frequently throw things over the back seat. It could be innocent? Maybe...?


First, I'm assuming you didn't check the phone for a sim card when you first found it. Your husband easily could have removed the sim card before dumping it in the playroom (if that's what happened). Second, the phone didn't just end up in the back seat, it ended up with the spare tire. That's a lot harder to explain. Does the phone by itself mean he's cheating or did he necessarily use it to cheat? No, but it's still part of a bigger picture that doesn't add up to anything good, which is why you came here for advice.

Did your husband give an explanation for his freak-out about the tire change?



Geny said:


> This weekend:
> I saw the messages on discord planning the weekend trip. He contributed to the cost and said he'd be there. Other wives are going and I was invited as well. We don't have a babysitter available and I don't drink so it isn't appealing to me anyway. A problem is that most (if not all) of his friends have cheated on their spouse... They'd cover for my husband if he asked them too...  He has cheated in past relationships.... but they were high school relationships. I'm stupid...


So maybe nothing is happening this weekend, but that doesn't change the fact that the opportunity is still there regularly. I would continue to subtly verify where possible.

Your husband's history of cheating, even if it was in the distant past, and being surrounded by cheaters certainly aren't good signs. 



Geny said:


> I didn't think about checking his odometer. Can it be reset? If I can get into his car I can do that... I tried to check my husband's car and he changed the passcode to get in. He kept his keys in his pocket instead of hanging them up and I don't have an excuse to ask for them. He said he doesn't want anyone getting into the car because he keeps confidential work stuff in there and he doesn't trust me anymore...
> 
> He's talked about deleting facebook before. He's had computer issues from updates before. His work has required passwords to be changed many time before. Could it be a coincidence? Maybe?


So he's now locked you out of his car? If this work stuff is so confidential, he shouldn't be keeping it in his car anyway. If he's keeping personal identifying information for other people (which you mentioned he has) in his car, that's a violation of law.

I hope you see the absurd levels he's gone to close off his life to you. This isn't normal and just about proves he has something to hide. Whether he's cheating or not (99.99% sure he is), this isn't a marriage because he has blocked you out of his life in just about every way possible. What has he said you've done to lose his trust? And if he doesn't trust you, why does he still want to be married to you?

The irony is that he's taken his secretiveness and suspicious behavior and flipped it around into him not trusting you, and so far you've bought it.



Geny said:


> My husband is dominant and takes the lead. I'm not and I don't so it works for us and our marriage. I haven't cared that my husband deals with the bills because it's one less thing for me to do... I didn't have a reason to think anything of it... The filing cabinet is locked and the key is on his car keys.


There's dominant/taking the lead and there's what your husband is doing to you, which is a whole other level. At a minimum, he is lying, hiding, and manipulating. You're getting a glimpse of where this lack of access and control is getting you. Completely powerless. Even if he were a perfect husband, that is a dangerous place to be for a whole host of reasons, but it's especially bad for you if he's cheating.

Once you have a sufficient number of posts (30), I strongly suggest that you read 20yr's thread in the Private Members' Section. Her cheating husband was similar in some ways to yours with his secrecy, and a playbook should be made based on the way that she is handling the situation.



Geny said:


> Today my husband said he's going to be working late. I can't stop thinking about what he's doing... I called and texted him but he hasn't answered. I don't know what to think... Why would he cheat if he has everything at home already and we're happy? I don't know what I did wrong... I do everything that he wants. I keep him happy...  He wants me to apologize for accusing him and make it up to him (with sex) and I don't want to.


People in supposedly "happy" marriages cheat all the time. Start sampling the threads on this forum to get a taste. 

Also, I understand that you believe "doing everything that he wants" is how to keep a happy marriage, but that couldn't be farther from the truth. I'm sorry if I offend you, but no one has respect for a doormat, and if your husband doesn't respect you, it's not a good marriage.

Isn't that rich - he's treating you badly and he wants to turn that into more sex for him? I'd tell your husband that you can't have sex with someone without trust, and the trust in your marriage is clearly broken because he doesn't trust you and you can't trust him with everything under lock and key. How would he feel if the roles were reversed?



Geny said:


> What does a PI do exactly?


A variety of things depending on the situation. Background investigations (does he have a phone line or accounts you don't know about), obtaining records you clearly don't have access to, tracking/following to confirm your husband is where he says he is, etc.


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## StillSearching (Feb 8, 2013)

Geny said:


> My husband is dominant and takes the lead. I'm not and I don't so it works for us and our marriage. I haven't cared that my husband deals with the bills because it's one less thing for me to do... I didn't have a reason to think anything of it...


There's nothing wrong with that.
There's a lot of woman out on the internet to make you feel insignificant because if your life choices, don't listen to them. 
They think their life choices are more valuable then any other woman's choices.

Back to the real question. Get a VAR or a friend to follow him a bit.
A PI is very expensive.


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## Satisfied Mind (Jan 29, 2019)

StillSearching said:


> There's nothing wrong with that.
> There's a lot of woman out on the internet to make you feel insignificant because if your life choices, don't listen to them.
> They think their life choices are more valuable then any other woman's choices.
> 
> ...


It's one thing to take the lead and solely handle certain aspects of a marriage. But to actively lock your spouse out? And worse, to manipulate them when they try to get access? That's ridiculous.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

There's nothing wrong with that in a M.

But along with that, in a loving M, the H always makes sure the W has all the accounts info, in case God forbid, an accident happens or similar and he's badly injured, debilitated, or dies unexpectedly. 

A loving H makes sure his loved one has the info and tools to survive an unexpected tragedy. 

Start by asking him for all your banking accounts, passwords, etc. 

See how he reacts. I'm guessing he may be controlling things so he has more freedom.

The weekend trips and if always uses cash more than a debit card plus the cell phone and sneaky activity is, regrettably consistent with cheating.

Play the what if game with him, get all the account info at hand.

It's absolutely normal to do so.


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## threelittlestars (Feb 18, 2016)

STOP CONFRONTING HIM.... he is not all of a sudden going to sing like a canary. 

You gave EVERYTHING away too soon. You should have played dumb till you gathered evidence or clarity. 

You need to slow down. Block him out. No sex, no affections. YOU KNOW SOMETHING IS UP. just shut that down now. YOURSELF I MEAN. in your panic you are not thinking. You are not using your smarts. You are not dumb, you are getting too panicked. You need to sit back and wait to catch him. And please, channel that frustration and anger and DIVORCE this prick.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

OP,

I wanted to add:

A husbands leading in areas in a marriage should never, ever be at the expense of his wife's considerations and needs or sense of worth/well being.

Then he's just a small minded, controlling [email protected]


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

We have one lady poster here who just discovered her husband was having an affair FOR THE LAST 10 YEARS! She had zero suspicion of him, until he out of the blue expressed unhappiness in the marriage to her, and it set off her warning bells, just like you. She found condoms in his briefcase, and instead of confronting him immediately, she planted a VAR in his car, and that is when she got the life altering truth. We had another man posting here who WAS suspicious of his wife, so he hired a PI to follow her... turns out she was having an affair with another woman. 

Your husband's actions after you found that phone are those of a man who is cheating on his wife. Changing passwords, wiping history, deleting emails, getting snappy and angry... people with nothing to hide do not do these things just out of the blue! (or at all) You can try and convince yourself that you two have been so happy that there is NO WAY he could do this, or you can come into reality and dig to get to the bottom of all this. Do you want to be played for a fool for the rest of your life? I sure dont want that for you! 

Oh and stay away from that other infidelity website, SI... this one is waayyyy better!


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

The majority of men who are cheaters are looking for variety so, yes, he could have everything at home and still be looking for the shiny new toy to play with. There are certainly some red flags there but right now you don't know for sure and you may never know even if you try everything possible to gather information. Some are better at hiding things than others and at the moment you don't know if he's one who is or not. But going forward don't trust anyone blindly. Too easy to get burned.


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## StillSearching (Feb 8, 2013)

Openminded said:


> The majority of men who are cheaters are looking for variety so, yes, he could have everything at home and still be looking for the shiny new toy to play with. There are certainly some red flags there but right now you don't know for sure and you may never know even if you try everything possible to gather information. Some are better at hiding things than others and at the moment you don't know if he's one who is or not. But going forward don't trust anyone blindly. Too easy to get burned.


Just a thought....There's nothing Openminded about that.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

Geny said:


> .. Why would he cheat if he has everything at home already and we're happy? I don't know what I did wrong... I do everything that he wants. I keep him happy...  He wants me to apologize for accusing him and make it up to him (with sex) and I don't want ?


One blind spot that a lot of really good people have is they have trouble grasping that there are some really really bad people in the world and they tend to think that other people think and act and feel they way they do.

You may believe that people cheat when they are very unhappy or dissatisfied in their marriages and that their spouses are neglectful or frigid or are bad lovers.

But the real harsh truth is, most cheaters simply have bad character and are very selfish and entitled and simply want 'more.'

Their spouses are nice people. They have good lives and active sex lives. But yet these people still cheat because they want to have the nice, living spouse and family at home and screw a variety of others on the side for the fun of it.

I believe (and my track record is suprisingly accurate) that in the upcoming days, weeks and months, you will find that he has not only been screwing a variety of women, but that it has been a lot of women for a very long time and perhaps the entire time you have known him.

I'm willing to bet the farm that he has not only been unfaithful to you, but that he is also involved in some very shady business and financial matters and perhaps even involved criminally in a number of things.

I'm not trying to put you down or point fingers, but as another poster has said, you have allowed yourself to be naive and allowed yourself to be kept in the dark on a wide range of facets in your marriage.

You have been asleep at the wheel.

Your husband may be a bit of a preditor and may have intentionally targeted someone very naive and trusting and who would be happy to be blissfully unaware and unconcerned with his activities. 

I think once your eyes are opened you are going to be smacked by the tm reality that he may never have been faithful and once the lawyers and accountants start digging around, they are liking to turn up some nafarious legal and financial activities as well.


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## Robert22205 (Jun 6, 2018)

Dominating? He just sounds like a self centered bully.

Your husband acts like he has something to hide plus he has a work + a social schedule that gives him plenty of privacy to conduct an affair. Spouses have (among other things) an obligation to make you feel safe from infidelity. His secretive behavior and nights off with 'friends' is a big fail. Under the circumstances he has the burden of proof (not you) to make you feel safe. 

Whether you drink or not I suggest you go with him on weekend party trips. He should be investing that time with you and the kids.
By going with him you also would verify and know exactly 'who' his current friends are. Plus you might figure out who the OW may be. 

Where does he go every Friday and Saturday night? That seems like an easy thing to verify.
Put a gps tracker on his car or just follow him.


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## Sports Fan (Aug 21, 2014)

Geny how old are you? I'm sorry to tell you but your husband is definately cheating. The spare phone, the passcodes and the refusals to let you see his phone.

I'm assuming you do not usually accuse him of anything so your one simple request to see his phone should have seen him immedieatly hand it up. This would have eased your mind. The wife and mother to his kids. 

Instead he refused and pouted. Don't give us he did it out of principal. That's bull. His guilty as sin.

I strongly recommend you try to place a VAR strapped under his car seat or discreetly show up to his work and check if his car is parked there next time he says he is working late.


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## frusdil (Sep 5, 2013)

Geny said:


> *My husband is dominant and takes the lead. I'm not and I don't so it works for us and our marriage. I haven't cared that my husband deals with the bills because it's one less thing for me to do... I didn't have a reason to think anything of it... The filing cabinet is locked and the key is on his car keys.
> 
> *Today my husband said he's going to be working late. I can't stop thinking about what he's doing... I called and texted him but he hasn't answered. I don't know what to think... Why would he cheat if he has everything at home already and we're happy? I don't know what I did wrong... I do everything that he wants. I keep him happy...  He wants me to apologize for accusing him and make it up to him (with sex) and I don't want to.


Sweetie that's NOT dominant, that's controlling. You are a wife and mum, you run a household, you need access to the FAMILY money (it's not his money) and you need and have a right to know your financial situation and what assets you have. 

The "confidential documents" in the car is BS. If they were that "confidential" they shouldn't be left in a car, even in a garage. Ridiculous.


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## Bibi1031 (Sep 14, 2015)

It is hard to believe that in this day and age, you can be a family that existed 70 or so years ago. You need to change that yesterday. Please be more active in your marriage and in the best interest for you and your kids. You need to be all over the finances. That includes full disclosure on all monies coming in and going out. 

I'm guessing you don't work because if you did you wouldn't be this naive or trust so blindly. If you get firm and ask for complete discloser, what else could he do to you in order to keep controlling everything? Lock you out of the house? Throw you out? He will leave? You do know all those things are illegal right?

You legally have a right to know all about the money issues. He can't kick you out. He can't take the kids. Everything you both own belongs to both of you. 50/50 is what you legally are entitled too. That includes time with your kids if things get ugly. All your possessions such as property, cars, bank accounts of any type are split 50/50. 

Stop thinking your marriage was perfect. Holly cow, it most certainly wasn't! So he took off with buddies because you don't like drinking and no babysitters available eh? If he has partying time away from you and the kids, do you get alone time away from him and the kids too? 

He gives you quality time before he takes off on weekend nights for a couple of hours. What exactly is this quality time you say he does? I have a feeling it is mostly family time and not very necessary couple time only and for many hours a week. I honestly believe there has been a lot of couple time neglect in you so called happy marriage. 

I hope you implement some very needed changes in this marriage because you can't afford to be this passive and naive anymore. You need legal advise if your husband isn't disclosing anything you have every legal right to know. Lawyering up is the only option your controlling husband has left you with. He can't control that by locking you out of that option, use it!


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## alte Dame (Aug 7, 2012)

3Xnocharm said:


> Your husband's actions after you found that phone are those of a man who is cheating on his wife. Changing passwords, wiping history, deleting emails, getting snappy and angry... people with nothing to hide do not do these things just out of the blue! (or at all) You can try and convince yourself that you two have been so happy that there is NO WAY he could do this, or you can come into reality and dig to get to the bottom of all this. Do you want to be played for a fool for the rest of your life? I sure dont want that for you!


I completely agree with this. He took the sim card out and dropped the phone in the kids' room to point the finger at them. Then he went to work deleting all the evidence.

Sorry. What you're seeing are major red flags. You need a plan. A PI would work well if he has his car on lockdown. Remember as well that Google tracks people pretty relentlessly - if you have access to his laptop at all, there are ways to see his locations. (Also, remember that it might not be an affair - he could be one of those guys that visits massage parlors or sees escorts. There are sadly lots of ways to cheat.)


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

So, he threw the kids under the bus.

Mr Charming. Ehhh... no. He isn't.


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## Jus260 (Mar 24, 2016)

Stormguy2018 said:


> Geny, he won’t tell you anything. But now that you’ve accused him without solid evidence, it’s cover all tracks time.
> 
> This will make it difficult for you. Again, check out survivinginfidelity.com.





rugswept said:


> the response you got from him is the usual with someone up to no good.
> the accusatory and combative behavior and denials is the usual behavior from cheaters.
> it's the secrecy and all the account changes that tells you plenty.
> now that he's on guard, he'll be really hard to pin down if he's up to no good.
> ...



What's the point of going to Surviving Infidelity when a lot of the people post on this board and that board? She can post there and get the same advice from the same people with the same usernames. The only advantage to going to that board is people will be a lot nicer because of the way that board is moderated. Everyone is afraid to get banned. That makes it take twice as long to help people. No one has been unnecessarily harsh with Geny so far in this board.


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## [email protected] (Dec 23, 2017)

My wife and I have no passwords. We can look at each other's emails and phone records at will. But Geney, you have red flags all over the place. If he isn't cheating, then he has some other problem.


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## tink2019 (May 7, 2019)

Geny said:


> I flat out asked if he is cheating and he said no. He is mad at me for thinking that. He said people who are cheating will accuse their spouse. He said I'm cheating.... I asked to see his phone and he said no because he's innocent until proven guilty.


Oh my! I am so sorry that you are going through this. But I can definitely tell you from experience that something is amiss. When I asked my (I don't know what to call him) if he was cheating on me and I was hit with the same reaction. I mean the same reaction!! And then he stayed angry at me for about 2 weeks. i didn't have the guts to ask to see his phone. Then later found out about the other woman. 

I pray that this all ends well for you. :frown2:


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

Its pointless to ASK someone if they are cheating. They are NOT going to tell you yes.


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

3Xnocharm said:


> Its pointless to ASK someone if they are cheating. They are NOT going to tell you yes.


True. And you've just alerted them that you're suspicious so they'll be more careful going forward.


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## tink2019 (May 7, 2019)

Openminded said:


> True. And you've just alerted them that you're suspicious so they'll be more careful going forward.



So true!


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## 20yr (Apr 19, 2019)

@Geny - I just saw your thread. I am dealing with a similar situation. When I first found evidence, it was hard to accept and I kept trying to find an innocent explanation. Based on advice on this board, I used a VAR and found out about the affair.

My advice 
- play it cool and keep your eyes and ears open
-get a VAR and plant it if he ever forgets to lock car or if you can find somewhere to put it. My H made all of his calls on his commute so it worked perfectly
-consult an attorney so you know your rights. Any good atty will do a consult for free and let you know how they bill and what to expect if it becomes necessary
-do whatever online research you can to find more evidence - do you have access to the bank account, cell phone bills etc?
-don't forget to take care of yourself

Sending you lots of hugs. I know it isn't easy


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## faithfulman (Jun 4, 2018)

20yr said:


> @Geny - I just saw your thread. I am dealing with a similar situation. When I first found evidence, it was hard to accept and I kept trying to find an innocent explanation. Based on advice on this board, I used a VAR and found out about the affair.
> 
> My advice
> - play it cool and keep your eyes and ears open
> ...


Take this advice from @20yr - very few have ever handled their business as well as she has.


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## threelittlestars (Feb 18, 2016)

Geny said:


> My husband is dominant and takes the lead. I'm not and I don't so it works for us and our marriage. I haven't cared that my husband deals with the bills because it's one less thing for me to do... I didn't have a reason to think anything of it... The filing cabinet is locked and the key is on his car keys.
> 
> What does a PI do exactly?



Fist off, he is controlling.... But i want to speak on being the passive wife who has NO idea about what is going on with the bills. My husband recently had his first Bipolar 1 psychotic event and he had to be hospitalized. Almost lost his job, (ironically he is in his second psychotic even as we speak.) 

When he went into the hospital I started getting notices of the house being THREE months behind in Mortgage payments. It was shocking. Then I tracked down all the billing information and found on that front we were two to three months behind there as well. Putting us in the hole around 14 grand. We had NO CREDIT. we almost lost the house.... It was terrifying and made worse by the fact that while being married around 13 years I never knew how or where to pay the bills.... 

This time he is in a psychotic event and he has criminal charges against him and it involuntarily committed to a mental hospital. I have ALL bills paid, I have all control of finances. We are not surviving on hand outs like I was last time. And we are not immediately in danger of losing the house. 

What if your husband dropped dead tomorrow... You dont need to learn how to do theses things then. YOU NEED TO LEARN NOW. Dont be the passive Naive wife I ALSO WAS. Learn EVERYTHING now. You need to not be so codependent.


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## nekonamida (Feb 21, 2017)

Listen to threelittlestars. Your husband isn't treating you like a partner and spouse. He's treating you like a child. It's okay if he handles the finances but you need to at least know about them and be able to take over if necessary. 

If I were you, I would tell him he can schedule an appointment with a couples counselor or a lawyer. His choice. Because things are going to change whether he likes it or not and he can either be a part of that or get out of the way. 

Whether he's cheating or not, the dynamic of your marriage where he knows and controls everything and can hold that against you at the drop of a hat is worthy of divorce. When you confronted him about the second phone, you did so without accusations. You were genuinely curious. And his reaction was to go full psycho and lock you out of everything he possibly could. Even if he was hiding nothing, why would you want to stay in a marriage where your livelihood can be snatched away because you asked a regular question that most people would? You will always have to walk on eggshells for as long as you allow it. Start demanding that you get to participate as a spouse and if he won't give that to you, you can find someone else who will.


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## Conejita (Jun 21, 2019)

How does the anger turn to guilt when the 180 is implemented


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## aquarius1 (May 10, 2019)

Please. If nothing else, make yourself aware and a joint member on ALL bank accounts and finances. My sister’s husband died in a car accident and she had NO access to any accounts, they were frozen immediately. She lost her house. 
I understand that this type of relationship may work for you, but it’s damn dangerous and smacks of simply closing your eyes. Life may open them soon enough. Sorry. 
And Geny, get tested for STDs right away. Sounds like this may be a possibility given his history.


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## CraigBesuden (Jun 20, 2019)

My wife controls the bills. I did mention my concern over the years that I wouldn’t know what to do if she were hit by a bus, and she created an Excel spreadsheet with all of the passwords and information. We also don’t hide our passwords and use the same code for our phones.

Your H’s secrecy behavior is concerning. But he’s also cheating, IMO.


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## aquarius1 (May 10, 2019)

CraigBesuden said:


> My wife controls the bills. I did mention my concern over the years that I wouldn’t know what to do if she were hit by a bus, and she created an Excel spreadsheet with all of the passwords and information. We also don’t hide our passwords and use the same code for our phones.
> 
> Your H’s secrecy behavior is concerning. But he’s also cheating, IMO.


That was exactly my point. Different relationships operate differently. As long as you know where everything is should you need it, all is open. This is very different


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