# I don't know where to start.



## Bartimaus (Oct 15, 2011)

Hello everyone! This is my first post,I just joined.
Why did I sign-up and where do I start? 
Well first let me say that we have been married for 38 years. I am 57,her 56. She left me last week for the 4th time. 
I need to talk and tell my story. I feel she has made me a mental case. We are now separated because I walked upon her without her seeing me at her work and caught her and a male employee flirting. This was about two months ago. I complain about her doing things that would make any man jealous and we get into an arguement and she leaves. She has never moved in with another man but the stories I could tell you of why our marriage has been tormented would take me an hour.But just a few. First story was when we were married about 1 year and a neighbor woman about 5 houses away chases her through our door trying to grab hold of her to fight. Wife tells me she doesn't know why.My wife had been taking walks by their house while I was at work.The man(the aggressive womans husband) was the biggest womanizer in town. 2nd example is of my family confronting my best friend about him being at my house and me gone. The friend then moves out of state. BTW...that friend was over one evening and I am convinced he drugged me. When I woke up the two of them were talking and he said they had an interesting time and they are way over friendly towards each other. 
Another is of my wife telling me of a lady sending word to our neighbor wife to tell my wife to not tear up their home. My wife and her husband stood at the school bus stop together with the children waiting to go to school.
I can go on with many other incidents,some worse.. My reason for starting this thread is to get some input of why I have always put up with her being like this? I do feel that I have finally woke up from being so blind and stupid and that maybe because of my age. WHAT do I mean by being stupid? Well, everytime we separated it was because of reasons like the ones I mention here. But I have always begged her back. NOW...about me. I was abandoned as a baby by mom and dad both. It was a very troubled home. I am the dependant type that can't live alone. And my wife is my everything. I have no friends.
And I have been religious much of my marriage and think it wrong to divorce. Now,going into old age I feel I have been treated wrong and lived a tormented life due to my wifes flirting and cheating.
Whats wrong with me and where do I go from here.....I am confused.


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## sadcalifornian (Sep 18, 2011)

Does any of your family member or friend know about her inappropriate behaviors? Do you have some hard evidence other than your words and memories? If you ask for D now, how do you think your W would react? Would you be OK if you D her, or rather can you D her?


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

Have you thought about some individual counseling? By not confronting your wife over the last 38 years, you've as much as condoned her behavior and treatment of you. But the question now is what do YOU want. You've said you can't live alone, and your wife is your everything. That doesn't leave you in a good situation, as I doubt she's likely to change her ways just because you ask nicely. The counseling might help you be more comfortable with being on your own, which would put you in a much better bargaining position if you want to try to work things out with her, or if you need to start fresh on your own

C
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Bartimaus (Oct 15, 2011)

sadcalifornian said:


> Does any of your family member or friend know about her inappropriate behaviors? Do you have some hard evidence other than your words and memories? If you ask for D now, how do you think your W would react? Would you be OK if you D her, or rather can you D her?


Evidence? Some of her last words as she was leaving were,"YOU.VE NEVER CAUGHT ME IN BED WITH A MAN".
Well no,but who has actually seen that? Very few. But there are many incidents that prove her to be a cheat.
As far as family knowing...I have never told our three children untill recently. I emailed our youngest daughter to ask her mother as to why I have finally woke up. I gave several examples in where the woman has proved to be a cheat and asked which one was why I finally woke up. I have two sisters that know of her cheating. One knows a man that my wife worked with at a motel that knows of her doing things there. The other sister lived in front of us when my best friend came to the house while I was at work. Both examples were years ago and though I know of my sisters taling to other fsmily members about this they probably wouldn't tell me. Why? Because I have been a minister and they don't want to cause a divorce and may fear any violence that may happen. Few people are willing to tear up a home by talking.
As far as divorce...I told my wife I don't seek one but she is.


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

Life is to short, reinvent your self, and stay away from this women.
Its is your time finaly, take this oppertunity to move on with out her and do the things that will make *you* happy......not her.

Its never to late to go out and experience new things for your self.
You diserve good things. We all do and if the women in our lives can't provide that then its time.........time to move on with out them.


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## jnj express (Mar 28, 2011)

Hey Bart---you are just throwing out excuses, for refusing to do, what you know you should have done long ago

Stop with the I can't live w/out her, line

Perish this thought, but let us just say for example, your wife passed----you would have to live alone, and you wouldn't have a choice, you would adapt and adjust, and life would go on

Well basically your wife has passed, so as far as your mge. is concerned she is dead to you, get your D., stop living in misery, and move on, like you should have long ago.


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## sadcalifornian (Sep 18, 2011)

Gosh, you don't have any solid evidence of present A, and she is willing to D. I don't know what you can do at this point. You can't force her to stay in the M. Of course, there is the chance that she is bluffing, but... 

Because of years of rug sweeping, she feels she can always dictate the terms and threaten you to submission. This is a bad place to be. Either you agree to D and go full speed. Who knows that she may change her mind once she realizes that you mean business this time? Or, you can apologize and beg her to come back this time just like you always have been, and wait for the next opportunity to get a hard evidence. She feels she is in control thinking that without any hard evidence, she can always deny, deny, and deny.

If you have a stronger bargaining position, you can demand polygraph, but in your case, most likely she will refuse and claim she rather D than humiliate herself, or something like that. But, if you are really fed up this time, you can demand Poly or D, at which your W will obviously choose D, and you can tell everyone around you that she indeed cheated because she refuses to take Poly. 

I know a friend who a long time suspected his W of carrying on an A but without any solid proof. It was driving him crazy and his W was telling everyone that he was jealous and delusional. He got finally fed up, and he contacted lawyer and demanded that she either take poly to prove her innocence or D. She refused and everyone started to suspect that maybe his suspicion has been valid. Eventually, she crumbled and confessed everything. Well, she begged for R but he ended M a year later. So, it wasn't all happy ending.


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## atbab (Aug 22, 2011)

I am a cheating husband and going through the planning phase of a rebuild.

I do not begin to understand the pain and hurt you feel. I am fortunate in that so far my wife has not been prepared to kick me out and try again. Worth noting at this point, I was never caught either, but admitted to engaging protitutes and having an emotional affair early on in our relationship. I owned up as I knew a clean slate was required and my wife needed all the facts so she could make her own decision. 

The starting point is honesty. And it needs to be truly honest not half the facts regardless of how difficult and what the consequences. Don't worry about her reaction, don't react to her anger, resentment etc. You need to look at yourself and be honest to her and you. Sometimes writing it all down is a good place to start as you separate facts about your marriage from beliefs of what you thought is was. If your wife is not prepared to go through the same process then it is probably easier to move on. But you need to start the process and go through it with regardless of the pain or how difficult it is to relive the hurt, the lies, the false memories. When you go through this process you realise how far you were from your wife, how different your lives were, how she had no idea how you felt. 

Easier said than done yes, but even though there are still many tears my wife and I share (it has been 2 months now) we are somehow closer than we have ever been. If your wife is anything like me that finds it easier to deny the truth or run when it gets tough, this will be a big eye opener for her.

Remember to be honest with yourself first as even if you remain separated you will need to go through this to heal.


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

You have never caught me in bed with a man. Not I have never been unfaithful. Big difference.


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## Bartimaus (Oct 15, 2011)

jnj express said:


> Hey Bart---you are just throwing out excuses, for refusing to do, what you know you should have done long ago
> 
> Stop with the I can't live w/out her, line
> 
> ...



Your right I know. As I look back I can see how that even when my own mother told me about my dad having a talk with that friend of mine that came to the house when I was gone, I was in a numb state of denial that she would be cheating on me. My entire family knew about it but I guess because no one came out in plain words and said that she was cheating on me that I put it out of my mind. When I walked in the motel she worked at and a male co-worker saw me and took off running I didn't think anything of it. Though I know she was drinking there because she showed me a locked linen closet where she had saved some alcohol that people had left behind.She saved it though she never brought any home. She has always denied anything and has told me that I am sick with jealousy. Maybe I am sick but it's because I have never wanted to believe that she was cheating.


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

At 57 you'd be surprised at the number of attractive single women that are out there.
At 56 she will find there are not so many men who will want to fo anything but have bad sex with her.

It sounds like you've been the ignorant husband to the town tramp.

Is this the way you want to spend the next 30 years? Always wondering who she's recently cheated with? 

If she says it's not true, then take her to haves polygraph test.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## aug (Aug 21, 2011)

Or, simply, just move on. 

Get yourself into shape - exercise, do some weight lifting, etc.

Go out more, start talking to other women.

Protect yourself financially. Hide your assets (money).

Divorce wife.

Start dating other women.


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## aug (Aug 21, 2011)

Bartimaus said:


> ...
> 
> And I have been religious much of my marriage and think it wrong to divorce. Now,going into old age I feel I have been treated wrong and lived a tormented life due to my wifes flirting and cheating.
> Whats wrong with me and where do I go from here.....I am confused.



It's also wrong to commit adultery. In fact, it is so wrong that God made it one of the 10 commandments. There is nowhere in the Bible that God said you can not divorce an adulteress.

Your wife is an adulteress, several times.


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## Bartimaus (Oct 15, 2011)

sadcalifornian said:


> She feels she is in control thinking that without any hard evidence, she can always deny, deny, and deny.
> 
> If you have a stronger bargaining position, you can demand polygraph, but in your case, most likely she will refuse and claim she rather D than humiliate herself, or something like that. But, if you are really fed up this time, you can demand Poly or D, at which your W will obviously choose D, and you can tell everyone around you that she indeed cheated because she refuses to take Poly.
> 
> I know a friend who a long time suspected his W of carrying on an A but without any solid proof. It was driving him crazy and his W was telling everyone that he was jealous and delusional.


Exact same story here.But even though she knows my family knew when I didn't and that the proof is out there she still denies and is very rebellous. 
Can someone please expound on this point...why is she so rebellous towards me to keep telling her lies and keep cheating and never come to admission or confession? I have waited 38 years for her to show remorse and come clean but no, she just gets worse. How can a person be like this? What has caused them to be this way?


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## bryanp (Aug 25, 2011)

Demand a polygraph or divorce him. She denies because she is playing you for a fool and wishes to look good in everybody else's eyes except yours.


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## aug (Aug 21, 2011)

Bartimaus said:


> Exact same story here.But even though she knows my family knew when I didn't and that the proof is out there she still denies and is very rebellous.
> Can someone please expound on this point...why is she so rebellous towards me to keep telling her lies and keep cheating and never come to admission or confession?* I have waited 38 years for her to show remorse and come clean but no, she just gets worse.* How can a person be like this? What has caused them to be this way?



Since you are religious, allow me to put the reason this way...

Consider God and Lucifer (Satan). Why is Lucifer still rebellious?


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## Bartimaus (Oct 15, 2011)

Went downtown to the clerk of courts today and picked up the dissolution papers to get things started. She told me that we can keep what we each have and keep the house(which is paid off) as a joint thing so it will be willed or left to the three children we have. 
Looks like alot of paper work.But in less than 3 months from filing we will be done and she will have freedom from me,,which has seemed to be what she has wanted for 37 1/2 years.
Wonder if after we are divorced if she will still be as interested in other men or if she was only interested in them because she was married to a man that wanted to 'make' her stop? Hummmmm! 
What next? My only concern is having a place to live. If the dissolution goes thru as joint ownership of the paid off house and me living here I don't think she could then put me out. I have income to keep everything here going.
Or maybe she has a wealthy boyfriend waiting that she will eventually move in with and doesn't need this house? Right now she is living with our daughter and swears there is no boyfriend.
What should I be aware of about dissolution guys?


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## sadcalifornian (Sep 18, 2011)

As for dissolution, your lawyer should be able to advise you on that. The main issues are mostly finances and custody.

My XWW was a bit like your W. My prediction is that as soon as D process starts, she will put on the guise of "good" woman trying to find a "provider" type like yours. She will not choose a smart and cunning man. She will look for a real decent guy but somewhat timid or trusting kind. Trust me that she knows herself and her tendancy to stray. 

A woman like that will do well after D. Sorry to say this, but that is my gut feeling. These women are very sneaky and cunning as well as free-spirited. She knows how far she can push the envelope in each relationship. In retrospect, had you been the jealous and unforgiving kind, she would have behaved accordingly, probably more careful with her permiscuous impulses. 

It's always better late than never. You seem a good guy and should be considered a good catch despite your age, and there are plenty of good women looking for a guy like you. I have no doubt that you will find a faithful and deserving woman soon. Just be careful not to jump into another relationship too quick, which is the mistake I made. Take your time to date some women and find yourself a good woman compatible to your qualities. Having said that, there are some bad women out there too, so please dont' forget to keep your guards up all time.


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## Bartimaus (Oct 15, 2011)

I started to make a new thread with this question but decided to ask it here so there is the info. I have already posted.
My question is....my soon to be ex and our oldest daughter work at the same retail store. Within the past 3-4 months my daughter has left her husband and moved in with a man she and my wife work with. Daughter has 3 children. She packed her things and drove from her husbands house to her new boyfriends house and moved in. 
The reason my wife and I are divorcing is,for me at least, I walked upon her at work at this store and caught her and another male employee flirting. This was the straw that broke the camels back for me. Read the entire thread for more info and there is more that I havn't posted about her cheating ways.
Do I have any right to go to the stores general manager and ask him what he is running here? Do I have any legal right or could I get in trouble with the law if I talk to the manager about this. BTW...the manager isn't the one my daughter left her husband for nor is he the one I caught ny wife flirting with.


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## morituri (Apr 1, 2011)

Bartimaus said:


> My question is....my soon to be ex and our oldest daughter work at the same retail store. Within the past 3-4 months my daughter has left her husband and moved in with a man she and my wife work with. Daughter has 3 children. She packed her things and drove from her husbands house to her new boyfriends house and moved in.


Like mother, like daughter. Very sad especially since your grandchildren are victims of your daughter's infidelity. In time, your daughter will most likely find out that 'what they do with you, they can do to you' when her OM dumps her for another woman, especially one that hasn't any children, which there a plenty of them out there.



> The reason my wife and I are divorcing is,for me at least, I walked upon her at work at this store and caught her and another male employee flirting. This was the straw that broke the camels back for me. Read the entire thread for more info and there is more that I haven't posted about her cheating ways.
> 
> Do I have any right to go to the stores general manager and ask him what he is running here? Do I have any legal right or could I get in trouble with the law if I talk to the manager about this. BTW...the manager isn't the one my daughter left her husband for nor is he the one I caught my wife flirting with.


IF you had proof that your stbxw and the male co-worker were using company time to carry on with an affair, then I would say that HR would be very interested in knowing in order to put a stop to it considering that the company, like many other companies, would consider that a breach of workplace conduct and an egregious abuse of time they are supposed to be working, not having sex with each other.

Tread carefully though. Getting her fired may be counterproductive when the time comes for assessment of marital support. Talk to your attorney FIRST before you do anything that you might later regret.


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

Thereis nothing illegal about you talking to any one about any topic you want.

Don't waste time with the store mgr, you want higher up on the chain and you want HR. Don't talk verbally, send them a letter detailing what's going on especially your daughter actions.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## RadicallyAccepting (Oct 19, 2011)

Depends on what state you are in. A few states have laws where you can sue for some kind of emotional loss. But those states are few and far between, and I doubt whether any modern court would seriously consider that kind of suit.

Your daughter has grown up in a family in which she was taught that a wife has the right to seek satisfaction outside the marriage. This isn't a secret - your entire family is caught up in the dysfunction. Divorce her or accept that you live in an open marriage. Your wife clearly will never stop her cheating ways.


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## Bartimaus (Oct 15, 2011)

Was in the store today and recognised a guy that is a Facebook friend of my daughter and we got to talking. Helet me know that the entire staff knows of Daughter and her boyfriend but that the general manager doesn't want it talked about because they are both supervisors and that is against company policy he said. And that the entire store knows about me catching my wife flirting with a male employee. The wife is of course lying about it to our children and once again making me out to be a jealous nut with no cause to be upset over this. 
Let me ask the guys.....if you walk up behind your wife as a male employee is approaching her and she doesn't see you. You hear her say in a prissy sexy type voice to him, "Are you following me?" And,though I didn't hear all his words I did hear him call her "love". Who wouldn't say that what she said was at least a tease to flirt because she was implying...'are you following me because you like me'. Knowing her cheating history and tendencies to flirt....how could you even say that she may have not meant it as a tease to flirt?


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

Bartimaus said:


> Was in the store today and recognised a guy that is a Facebook friend of my daughter and we got to talking. Helet me know that the entire staff knows of Daughter and her boyfriend but that the general manager doesn't want it talked about because they are both supervisors and that is against company policy he said. And that the entire store knows about me catching my wife flirting with a male employee. The wife is of course lying about it to our children and once again making me out to be a jealous nut with no cause to be upset over this.
> Let me ask the guys.....if you walk up behind your wife as a male employee is approaching her and she doesn't see you. You hear her say in a prissy sexy type voice to him, "Are you following me?" And,though I didn't hear all his words I did hear him call her "love". Who wouldn't say that what she said was at least a tease to flirt because she was implying...'are you following me because you like me'. Knowing her cheating history and tendencies to flirt....how could you even say that she may have not meant it as a tease to flirt?


No offense, but calling that a "flirt" seems like a big stretch. Just my opinion. But I didn't hear her voice or anything else, obviously.

C
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Initfortheduration (Dec 12, 2008)

You were a minister right? After having a gomer wife. Did you ever think God was trying to tell you something. I wonder if God has mission planned for you that does not include your cheating wife. Maybe God wants you untethered and sharing the gospel.


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## Bartimaus (Oct 15, 2011)

PBear said:


> No offense, but calling that a "flirt" seems like a big stretch. Just my opinion. But I didn't hear her voice or anything else, obviously.
> 
> C
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I agree that those words could be said in that arrangement and not be a flirt. That arrangement could even be used to imply many different things. But in the tone of voice she used (which is never used around or with me) it was what most men would say was a sexy 'comeon' tone. Used to imply,are you following me because you like me. It's absolutely words and a tone of voice that no wife would use to another man if they knew their husband was standing behind them listening. She was doing a sexy roleplay type comeon with her sexy tone of voice and her stretching the word "Faaaaalowing me".


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## Bartimaus (Oct 15, 2011)

Initfortheduration said:


> You were a minister right? After having a gomer wife. Did you ever think God was trying to tell you something. I wonder if God has mission planned for you that does not include your cheating wife. Maybe God wants you untethered and sharing the gospel.


You know, someone had said something to that effect on a religious website about this weeks ago. I have no friend to talk to so I had started a thread there asking if a sinning spouse brought a lack of Gods blessing into a marriage and ministry.
My belief hjas always been that if God calls one,he calls you both. And I have lived my life with this belief. I don't blame my soon to be ex for a lack of Gods blessing but for some crazy reason I have the feeling that after we divorce and I heal that God does have a work that is more than I have ever dreamed of. But I don't know...this may just be my wishful thinking for better times. 
Initfortheduration...I really don't understand what you mean in detail but for some crazt reason think it might be a possibility. It so,,,then why? The replies on the other site convinced me that it was not a 'Joel's wife' that is the reason for a seemingly cursed life. But I have no clue really.


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## Bartimaus (Oct 15, 2011)

Those of you here that have commented and messaged have been a great help in my time of need and so I wanted to give an update.
I did contact human resourses twice. And,I went to the store and talked to the manager. I asked him what kind of joint he was running and why so much lost company time for people flirting and starting realtionships to cheat on their husbands. And of course it's company policy to say they can't control morals or supervise every associate 24 hours a day. I kept bringing him back to lost hours by the waste and of how affairs are being started and ongoing on company time on his watch. We argue and he later bans me from the store but I talk to the district manager and he puts the store manager in his place and tells me to shop the store,they want to keep my business.Lol.
I also told him of the drugs that are being used and sold there. He acts like he doesn't care! Wow Sam!
Well,tomorrow she and I are meeting at the courthouse to file the dissolution papers. In a way it is sad after 38 years but for the most part....if I can explain this....I feel blessed and that a yoke and burden has been took off my shoulders and I am feeling happy again and finding myself again. Is this normal or am I fooling myself by feeling this way? 
Sorry so long with this,guess I am bored and have no one to talk to but you guys.


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

B-
From what I've heard it is a good sign when moving on is an emotional happy feeling with a sence of relief.
The other side of the coin is moving on....depressed and doubting your choice.

If this makes sense.......running towards something versus running away from something.

So if you have the feeling that "the monkey is off your back" well then keep on keeping on.

Just like your intuition tells us somethings wrong, it also tells us when something is right.


Again after so many years there is doubt, but with the simple fact that you find your self happy and positive about moving on. well then this is a good sign. Its when we have the doubt and fear in moving on.....thats when it *not* time.

It was explained to me like this....until you are confindent and excepting this change , well then the change is not ready to be made.

Are you confident and excepting of the challenges ahead of you?

If the answer is yes then make the move/change.

Make no miss take there will be challenges....excepting them is what counts when its time to move on.


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## tinkerbelletee (Nov 11, 2011)

Im sorry but stuff that woman .... shes been used and abused....the only person you should be worrrying about is YOURSELF.....shes gone, she doesnt care so why should you? You let her walk all over you like a door mat, you knew it was happening and you let her tear you down....stuff that....you know you deserve better but she really has damaged you emotionally to the point where your asking strangers on their input on YOUR situation....YOU KNOW IN YOUR HEART AND MIND WHAT YOU SHOULD DO....better yourself only for you, get some counselling....surround yourself with supportive, loving and strong people and for goodness sake mate YOUR WORTH MORE........all the best and go like the clappers


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