# Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day



## laxyzady (Jun 19, 2019)

*Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

my fiancé of 5 years and I broke up once and when we got back together he was very strange around a specific woman that was in a group he used to work out with. I don’t think I ever met her… but she was walking by and he kind of hid. He later told me it was because he told her about our break up and I think he didn’t want to be embarrassed. Anyway, she’s not overly attractive but is fit.

When we met he talked about this group and told me that the woman’s husband was an arse and was acting very jealous regarding them being friends. He felt the man was jealous of him because he said he was so funny and made his wife laugh etc.

Anyway, there other day I saw that he had messaged her on Facebook and said “i’m not sure what’s going on in your life, but hope you are ok”

She said ‘divorce sucks etc…” 

he replied “oh sorry to hear that but focus on your children and know I’m always here for you.. and sent her a picture of the ocean and told her that she needs to look forward to good things.

I didn’t think too much about it….I didn’t bring it up. But he is always VERY jealous and weird about me…and I have to account for my every move. My friend told me last night…you know people who act like he does…are usually the ones cheating themselves.

It got me dwelling on this tonight. Would you have a problem with the messages between him and that woman? He didn’t say “WE are always here for you…” He said “I am always here for you…” 

Also, a separate issue. We've been together 5 years -- engaged 4. he tells me I'm "pushing him" or "forcing him" to marry me. We have had fight after fight. In March he told me he wanted to go through the church. I said okay. I knew he was trying to call my bluff. 
I did it -- and he signed the application. We were supposed to go through a marriage work shop last month - for which I paid 500 dollars for. He told me he had to work (last minute yeah right) but he couldn't pass up 2k. He didn't pay me back the 500 dollars and when I told him I was not happy that he is not putting this as important, he blew up and told me to stop forcing him. 

So the lady rescheduled us for the September worship and our wedding date is now Sept 28th. He saw the emails back and forth. He hasn't said anyting. We have had some fights recently where he says thinks like "the last 2 years with you have been miserable...and you want me to marry you?!" He says I drink too much. I will have a bottle of wine over the course of an entire day. I stopped drinking and he told me that I was very annoying because I wasn't drinking.

So this last fight he told me he can't marry an alcoholic....and "alcoholics end up alone". So while I truly don't believe i'm an alcoholic etc (nor does my therapist) I gave up drinking and started to go to AA meetings. He told me he was proud of me but said "let's see how long this lasts".

Today I brought up the fact that the church lady is calling and trying to establish everything for the September wedding. He told me that he felt I was forcing him again...and he doesn't feel good about the way i'm asking about this. And said "wedding take time to plan...and you are trying too hard...something isn't right." 

I said I've been asking for 3 years and you keep kicking the ball down the field. He said maybe by spring 2020. He said if I wanted to rush this he wants me to sign an iron clad pre-nup. I said WHAT? I make more money than he does! He said he thinks i'm after him for his money. I have my own successful business! He said "you want me for security and you want to quit... " Which insane. I am NOT that type. 

So then he told me that he doesn't want another failed marriage (I would be his third wife) and he wants me to know he has a very low tolerance for my screw ups and that if I were to start drinking even a glass of wine again or if I started "trouble" he would divorce me the very next day. 

SO I started crying..... hung up the phone (was on bluetooth in the car) and literally got rear ended and totalled my car. It's been a bad day. 

And I"m trying to understand what to think/do.


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## FieryHairedLady (Mar 24, 2011)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

The first thing you need to do is call your Church and get a refund.

The second thing you need to do is break up with this jerk.

These are Red FLASHING WARNING SIGNS!

Get out now!


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## x598 (Nov 14, 2012)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

he sounds like a real peach. well one that fell from the tree and is rotting on the ground and covered in ants.


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## laxyzady (Jun 19, 2019)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

Thank you for your replies. I still tend to blame myself. he just amkes it out as if I'm always the problem... 

I guess I just have to realize he isn't going to marry me, right? ANd I know I shouldn't care...he clearly isn't sweet to me at all....but there are days where things are perfect! 

Just hard to swallow after 5 years. He says he loves me and he "just wants this to be extra special".... that was after telling me he would have low tolerance for my screw ups...


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## sunsetmist (Jul 12, 2018)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

Sounds like maybe his female workout friend is getting divorced and he wants to be available to her or anyone else again.

You have your doubts? Will you really be happy for the rest of your life with someone who values you so little? He is threatening divorce, etc. before the wedding--because he is not committed to you now. Third wife--what happened to other marriages?


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## uhtred (Jun 22, 2016)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

Marriage only make sense if BOTH people actively want to be married. Otherwise I don't think it really benefits either. It sounds like he doesn't want marriage.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

Well let's see. He has managed to wreck two marriages, why be his third wife based on his track record?

He sees nothing wrong in stiffing you for $500. He picks fights. He flirts with other women. And... sorry. But you're not doing a very good job of selling him!

He sounds like the knackered old cars that are sold as "spares or repairs."

He needs to be taken to the recycling depot.  

You deserve so much better.


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## TJW (Mar 20, 2012)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*



laxyzady said:


> I guess I just have to realize he isn't going to marry me, right?


Yes, and you may well thank God for it. He doesn't want another "failed marriage", and that's exactly what you will have with this guy......


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## laxyzady (Jun 19, 2019)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

Thank you. I understand. I wish to God I could change the course... of course it wasn't always like this.


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## laxyzady (Jun 19, 2019)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

That's pretty much what he's saying...he predicts it will fail. And I don't understand why I don't have the courage to walk away despite the emotional abuse.

QUOTE=TJW;19903105]Yes, and you may well thank God for it. He doesn't want another "failed marriage", and that's exactly what you will have with this guy......[/QUOTE]


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## laxyzady (Jun 19, 2019)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

Would you consider what he said to that woman...."flirting"? I felt that way. But Lord knows I can't say anything to him...it would be a nightmare fight and he would turn it on me. I dont' think he's actively cheating. The woman barely responded to him.... but it was his message that disturbed me.

I don't even have male friends but I wouldn't say that to them...if I did.


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## Mr.Married (Feb 21, 2018)

Loser ....do yourself a favor and dump him.


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## laxyzady (Jun 19, 2019)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

The first marriage (long time ago) he left her after 8 years because he said he simply didn't love or was not attracted to her. But he left her after getting her pregnant with their third child. He started dating their neighbor shortly their after...

Second wife...I don't know. He says they fought like cats and dogs. he told me he didn't love her really and he just wanted to get married to her becuase she was smart and he thought she was a good woman. They were married 7 years. He told me he celebrated when they divorced but I recently found emails between the 2 of them from during the divorce and he's asking her to rethink if this is what she really wants... 

And she is telling him the exact same things that I often tell him....that he has large mood swings -- one minute threateing her and the next telling her he loves her.... So it's similar.



sunsetmist said:


> Sounds like maybe his female workout friend is getting divorced and he wants to be available to her or anyone else again.
> 
> You have your doubts? Will you really be happy for the rest of your life with someone who values you so little? He is threatening divorce, etc. before the wedding--because he is not committed to you now. Third wife--what happened to other marriages?


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## StarFires (Feb 27, 2018)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

This is the way it normally goes, so am I wrong to assume he asked you to marry him? And he's accusing you of rushing him into marriage? Or did you ask him?

Honestly, dear, this guy doesn't want to marry you. There is no making sense of being engaged for 3 years, and then he accuses you of rushing him just because you're making wedding plans. 

And there you are confused, blaming yourself, and trying to please him. He says your face should be blue, so you scurry around to make your face blue. What the heck is wrong with you?!

He criticizes you and puts you down, and you feel bad about yourself and get busy trying to be someone other than who you are when there is absolutely nothing wrong with you. A bottle of wine per day does not an alcoholic make. You're allowing him to control you.

He's a sundry of contradictions, and it's all because he does not want to marry you. You have to accept that.

Your friend was right. That other woman is free, and he is trying to get with her. That's what "I'm here for you is all about." He offered himself to her. It's a line that people use to catch their prey. It's the ploy people use to make their prey think they are only being friendly, only being concerned for their well being. He's pretending care and concern to place himself on her mind to let her know she can have him whenever she's ready. 

And that's also why he's being so awful to you. He is planting everything in your mind that makes you think you are so awful and imperfect so that he can blame you when he cheats with her. He's grooming you to make it all your fault. You're already believing him because you believe and fall for everything he says. He has both you women right where he wants you - all set up to screw her and have you take the blame for it. 

My goodness this guy is diabolical.
And you are clueless.


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## laxyzady (Jun 19, 2019)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

You are correct. I am acting clueless. I left out that last week during a vacation he went through my phone and found texts from my therapist saying that I need to leave him and that he will never change. She was very ruthless but she was replying to my text saying that maybe I need to make sure I correct all my issues that he names first....before leaving him. He read it all. (This was after he blew off our wedding workshop and I was crushed)

He blew up and he torturted me emotionally for 2 days. At one point we were sitting at dinner around plenty of people and he went off about how much of a nightmare our relationship is. He said he doesn't want to live like this...either I commit to fixing things and acting happier and stop trashing the relationship...or it's over. We were on a cruise ship and he saw me start to cry (I was trying to hold it) and he said that he's sick of my drama and that if I don't stop crying he will make sure we break up as soon as we hit the next port and he will fly back home without me.

I started crying and ran to the restroom. He said "don't count on me being here when you get back from your little show"

It was torture. I got myself together and told myself to fake it for the rest of the night .... and I did. He kept on and said If I wasn't going to talk about it ...we were done. I held a firm upper lip. He then snapped out of it... and calmed down.

Then he told me the next day that he was upset but he was just upset that he read that horrible stuff about him... and that he does 
still want to marry me but he wants to make sure I'm happy. 

And now this... after over a week of everything being fine.




StarFires said:


> This is the way it normally goes, so am I wrong to assume he asked you to marry him? And he's accusing you of rushing him into marriage? Or did you ask him?
> 
> Honestly, dear, this guy doesn't want to marry you. There is no making sense of being engaged for 3 years, and then he accuses you of rushing him just because you're making wedding plans.
> 
> ...


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## Mr.Married (Feb 21, 2018)

You must hate yourself plenty to even continue in this much less even remotely consider chaining your life to such a pathetic loser.


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## laxyzady (Jun 19, 2019)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

The idea that I'm going to be single.. at 43 sucks. I just don't like being alone. I am not sure how I'm going to get the strength to end this. But, i'm guessing he will discard me at some point....I don't know. 

Everyone loves him. He's successful in his profession and he has an elite profession that makes people respect him automatically ...and women throw themselves at him... I will feel the pain of this one...one way or another.




Mr.Married said:


> You must hate yourself plenty to even continue in this much less even remotely consider chaining your life to such a pathetic loser.


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## StarFires (Feb 27, 2018)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*



laxyzady said:


> The first marriage (long time ago) he left her after 8 years because he said he simply didn't love or was not attracted to her. But he left her after getting her pregnant with their third child. He started dating their neighbor shortly their after...
> 
> Second wife...I don't know. He says they fought like cats and dogs. he told me he didn't love her really and he just wanted to get married to her becuase she was smart and he thought she was a good woman. They were married 7 years. He told me he celebrated when they divorced but I recently found emails between the 2 of them from during the divorce and he's asking her to rethink if this is what she really wants...
> 
> And she is telling him the exact same things that I often tell him....that he has large mood swings -- one minute threateing her and the next telling her he loves her.... So it's similar.


You need guidance, honey. Is there an older woman in your life that you can talk with? You need someone in your life to help you learn how to navigate the world of dating and relationships - someone who can teach you how to love and respect yourself, how to choose men and set standards for the men you meet and date, and how to determine if a guy is right or wrong for you. You don't know any of these kinds of things. You're like a fish out of water. Innocent. Naive. Clueless.

So please listen to me as if I were your mother. 

1. You don't hook up with a guy just because you met him. You have to scrutinize men for their character, their good and bad qualities and tendencies. 

2. There are certain guys you don't date and definitely don't marry. 

3. One such guy is a jailbird. You know automatically he is either dirty or dishonest.

4. Another such guy is a man who would leave his pregnant wife. And no he did not start dating the neighbor AFTER leaving his wife. He was cheating on his wife with the neighbor exactly like he is trying so hard to cheat on you if he hasn't been with that woman already.

5. Another such man is one who has already been married 2 or 3 times. You cannot listen to a man's reason for his relationships breaking up. He will always, always, always, skew the facts in his favor if not all out lie. Nobody takes responsibility for breakups and divorce. They have to devise ways and reasons to blame the other person. As you can see, he didn't celebrate his second divorce. He didn't want the divorce and tried to reconcile. You found out this information but didn't take it for the liar that he is. You don't decide you want to marry a liar.

6. You don't marry a man who criticizes you or tries in any way to make you feel bad about yourself. And don't believe the criticisms. They are not true just because he said them. He's only putting you down to hurt you because you've let him know by your reactions that it hurts you.

7. You don't marry a man who falsely accuses you of things that are absurd and that you know you didn't do.

8. You don't marry a man who tries to control you.

9. You don't acquiesce to a man's criticisms, control, and accusations. The types of things you do to please a guy are things like scrambling his eggs the way he likes them, folding his slacks the way he prefers, and certain ways of making love that are not uncomfortable or degrading to you. But you don't do backward flip flops to change yourself to please him just because he criticizes and tries to control you. You leave any guy who criticizes or tries to control because he is not the right guy for you.

10. You only spend enough time with a guy to learn these types of things about him. Once you learn this is the way he is, you cut him loose. As soon as you found out he'd been married twice before, you should have kicked him to the curb. Unless he is somewhere around 60 years old and one or both of his wives died, he has no business having twice been married already. It shows you that he is flighty, selfish, and insincere and doesn't have the wherewithal to maintain a marriage. He will leave you high and dry just like he left his pregnant wife. Or, you will end up desperately trying to get rid of him because you soon learn you can't stand him and he's unpredictable. Whatever the reasons, a man twice married that is relatively young is not marriage material. You don't have to know what their circumstances were or why the broke up. You only have to know that he'd been married twice, so he's not innocent in those breakups despite what he says.

11. Even if you proceed in a relationship with a guy that has twice been married (which you shouldn't), then only maintain the relationship until you learn other undesirable things about him. If you learn that a guy left his pregnant wife and three kids, then you know he is not the guy for you because he is clearly unresponsible and undependable and will also leave you in a bad predicament. And then he will tell his next wife that the breakup was all your fault.

12. And think about what your friend said (I can't believe you never heard that anywhere before, but shows how naive you are) because it applies to many other things, not just cheating. If he accused you of planning on taking him for a ride, there is a good possibility he knows he can take you for a ride. You earn more money than him. If you marry and divorce, you will have to pay him alimony.


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## Mr.Married (Feb 21, 2018)

laxyzady said:


> The idea that I'm going to be single.. at 43 sucks. I just don't like being alone. I am not sure how I'm going to get the strength to end this. But, i'm guessing he will discard me at some point....I don't know.
> 
> Everyone loves him. He's successful in his profession and he has an elite profession that makes people respect him automatically ...and women throw themselves at him... I will feel the pain of this one...one way or another.
> 
> ...


Haha..at 43 you still have plenty life ahead of you. Gather your courage. You have what it takes. There are good men out there.....he isn't one of them. Not by a long shot.


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## StarFires (Feb 27, 2018)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*



laxyzady said:


> The idea that I'm going to be single.. at 43 sucks. I just don't like being alone. I am not sure how I'm going to get the strength to end this. But, i'm guessing he will discard me at some point....I don't know.
> 
> Everyone loves him. He's successful in his profession and he has an elite profession that makes people respect him automatically ...and women throw themselves at him... I will feel the pain of this one...one way or another.


You sound so insane that I was sure you must be 21 or 22 years old, certainly under 30. 
But I wonder if you know how desperate you make yourself and make a yourself sound.


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## laxyzady (Jun 19, 2019)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

I'm sure....I hope it is just understood that when you are with someone for this long and you change your whole life and career to relocate to be with them....It's a real mess to think of leaving. not to mention the emotional component. 

I suppose I just need to get the lady balls so to speak... and leave. Just not easy.



StarFires said:


> You sound so insane that I was sure you must be 21 or 22 years old, certainly under 30.
> But I wonder if you know how desperate you make yourself and make a yourself sound.


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## sunsetmist (Jul 12, 2018)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

Leave in pain OR live in pain with him 'til y'all divorce and you are 53 or 63 and pay alimony. Read about 'sunk cost fallacy.' 

Would you tell your daughter to marry this man?


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## Prodigal (Feb 5, 2011)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*



laxyzady said:


> ... he is always VERY jealous and weird about me…and I have to account for my every move.
> 
> We've been together 5 years -- engaged 4. he tells me I'm "pushing him" or "forcing him" to marry me. We have had fight after fight.
> 
> ...


QUESTION #1: What do you love about this man?

QUESTION #2: Why do you want to marry this man? 

QUESTION #3: You mentioned drinking an entire bottle of wine over the course of the day. Do you drink a bottle of wine every day?


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*



laxyzady said:


> my fiancé of 5 years and I broke up once and when we got back together he was very strange around a specific woman that was in a group he used to work out with. I don’t think I ever met her… but she was walking by and he kind of hid. He later told me it was because he told her about our break up and I think he didn’t want to be embarrassed. Anyway, she’s not overly attractive but is fit.
> 
> When we met he talked about this group and told me that the woman’s husband was an arse and was acting very jealous regarding them being friends. He felt the man was jealous of him because he said he was so funny and made his wife laugh etc.
> 
> ...


Read this book. It will change your life.
https://bit.ly/2FjH5fa

And why the hell are you dating a guy who's already divorced twice? Think about what that says about you.

And once you read that book, get this one: https://bit.ly/2L2kC9Y. Then you'll understand why you're still waiting after 5 years.


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## Prodigal (Feb 5, 2011)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*



laxyzady said:


> The idea that I'm going to be single.. at 43 sucks. I just don't like being alone.


Which leads me to QUESTION #4: What is about being with yourself you don't like? In fact, why don't you like your own company?


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## Prodigal (Feb 5, 2011)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*



laxyzady said:


> I'm sure....I hope it is just understood that when you are with someone for this long and you change your whole life and career to relocate to be with them....It's a real mess to think of leaving.


So the "mess" of leaving is worse than the "mess" of staying with this abusive man? SERIOUSLY????


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*



laxyzady said:


> I'm sure....I hope it is just understood that when you are with someone for this long and you change your whole life and career to relocate to be with them....It's a real mess to think of leaving.


What did HE change to be with YOU?


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## laxyzady (Jun 19, 2019)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

Good questions....I was married for 15 years. Got married young and we were a boring Catholic marriage. WHen I divorced I was so lost....I met my fiance within 5 months of divorce and I think I lost my mind to a degree. My fiance was everything my ex wasn't...FUN Smart...energetic... good looking. NARCASSIST as I soon learned.

So I wasn't single for long and I think I went from the frying pan into the blazing fire.

I am scared of being alone. I'm scared of being rejected and not finding someone to spend my life with. Like I said, not everyday was bad... but yeah, it's a mess. As you can imagine he always wants to know how I am....what I'm doing...if I'm with someone...he seems so possessive and loving to me. But as my therapist is showing...it's more about control than anything else. It can't be love when he says such mean things....



Prodigal said:


> Which leads me to QUESTION #4: What is about being with yourself you don't like? In fact, why don't you like your own company?


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## laxyzady (Jun 19, 2019)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

He did a lot in the beginning.... but it's waned now. He tried to get a job to move closer to me and really stressed himself driving back and forth traveling to be with me. 

He really has done a number on himself in that regard.... but now, he's back to just who he is ...and says flat out I will not change him... He's 52 and says he will not change much...if any.



turnera said:


> What did HE change to be with YOU?


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## frusdil (Sep 5, 2013)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*



laxyzady said:


> The idea that I'm going to be single.. at 43 sucks. I just don't like being alone.





laxyzady said:


> I am scared of being alone. I'm scared of being rejected and not finding someone to spend my life with.


Honey, you'll be more alone if you marry this jerk than you could ever imagine.

There's a BIG difference between being single and being alone.


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## WorkingWife (May 15, 2015)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

@laxyzady

OMG you poor thing. So sorry about the car accident on top of all this.

Why would you want to marry this mean person anyhow? He makes less than you but claims he thinks you're after his money? He says you need to quit drinking and then when you do that's still not good enough. 

It sounds like is he's dangling marriage in front of you to keep you hanging around but he has no desire/intention of really marrying you so he chips away at YOU to come up with reasons for putting it off, trying to make it YOUR fault and then when you call his bluff on something he gets pissed or says that's not good enough (like quitting drinking). He sounds very controlling and not very nice. 

Be thankful he has foot dragged so you can get out of this miserable relationship. Something is very wrong with this man. PLEASE do not marry him. You will end up divorced, probably after a lot of emotional pain and suffering.

I would tell him you are not trying to force him to do anything but your life goal is marriage and you're done letting him waste your time. If he suddenly comes around and wants to marry when you pull away, just keep going. You can do so much better.

I know you're talking about your troubles with him here, but seriously, why would you *want *this man?

Regarding the alcohol, I doubt your alcoholic too if you were able to just quit drinking. But a bottle of wine in one day is a little concerning if that's everyday, as opposed to say just on the weekends. STILL, is alcohol causing problems in your life? If not, what is his motive for expecting you to be 100% alcohol free? And if you are not alcoholic, why would you give up alcohol entirely for this man? What are you getting out of this relationship?


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## WorkingWife (May 15, 2015)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*



laxyzady said:


> Thank you for your replies. I still tend to blame myself. he just amkes it out as if I'm always the problem...
> 
> I guess I just have to realize he isn't going to marry me, right? ANd I know I shouldn't care...he clearly isn't sweet to me at all....but there are days where things are perfect!
> 
> Just hard to swallow after 5 years. He says he loves me and he "just wants this to be extra special".... that was after telling me he would have low tolerance for my screw ups...



He sounds like a classic abusive personality. Get away from this twisted ****. Do not marry someone who makes you feel bad about yourself.

"He just wants this to be extra special." STFU.


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## laxyzady (Jun 19, 2019)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

Well, we spend so much time together that i've become quite isolated. To answer someone's question here...yes I was drinking about a bottle of wine a day. Would have a glass at lunch.... 2 for dinner...and possibly another 1 or 2 more before bed It was my dessert and also my coping medication for his anger and my anxiety.

So I quit...I have been going to AA meetings just to meet people and get support. I think that will be very helpful and the thing is...he can't complain about it (even though he already is)... because it's what he wanted....

the other night he told me he was worried I was doing that to try to leave him..... but he doesn't want to marry me? It's so confusing 



frusdil said:


> Honey, you'll be more alone if you marry this jerk than you could ever imagine.
> 
> There's a BIG difference between being single and being alone.


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## WorkingWife (May 15, 2015)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*



laxyzady said:


> That's pretty much what he's saying...he predicts it will fail. And I don't understand why I don't have the courage to walk away despite the emotional abuse.


You're having trouble getting the courage to walk away BECAUSE OF the emotional abuse. Now get to walking, girlfriend! The sooner you get away the sooner you can start reclaiming your life.


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## WorkingWife (May 15, 2015)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*



laxyzady said:


> The idea that I'm going to be single.. at 43 sucks. I just don't like being alone. I am not sure how I'm going to get the strength to end this. But, i'm guessing he will discard me at some point....I don't know.


You will find that being alone is a relief compared to being with someone who makes you feel so inadequate. And being single at 43 will NOT suck. It will be liberating. I just got divorced at 53 and it's not like the old days when being single at this age was a social death sentence. There are a lot of single people, people are open minded and accepting of others not expecting everyone to be married with 2 kids and a dog.



laxyzady said:


> Everyone loves him. He's successful in his profession and he has an elite profession that makes people respect him automatically ...and women throw themselves at him... I will feel the pain of this one...one way or another.


[/QUOTE]

You just gave the textbook description of a narcissist. RUN. If you're not familiar, google some articles/videos. Ask your therapist about narcissists.


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## Bibi1031 (Sep 14, 2015)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

You just gave the textbook description of a narcissist. RUN. If you're not familiar, google some articles/videos. Ask your therapist about narcissists.[/QUOTE]

She knows what he is. The therapist has told her. She has been reading as well. 

Your self esteem has been shattered. That is what Narcs do. They destroy their prey and then they toss their prey when they place their eyes on another. 

You lost 5 precious years of your life on a human vampire that sucks the life out of you. Don't lose another day. It is best to be alone than in such lousy company. If leaches like this POS is all you will attract. Stop dating until your therapist has helped you to find your worth. You lack self worth right now with the fact you didn't walk away from this Incapable of giving or receiving love sack of bones.


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## Cynthia (Jan 31, 2014)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*



laxyzady said:


> Thank you. I understand. I wish to God I could change the course... of course it wasn't always like this.


God can change the course, but he gave us a thing called free will. Use it and leave this man. He doesn't want to marry you. Why are you trying to force him into something he doesn't want to do? You know this isn't going to turn out well.



laxyzady said:


> Then he told me the next day that he was upset but he was just upset that he read that horrible stuff about him... and that he does
> still want to marry me but he wants to make sure I'm happy.
> 
> And now this... after over a week of everything being fine.


Everything wasn't fine. And it isn't fine. Keep seeing your therapist and stop seeing this man.


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## Prodigal (Feb 5, 2011)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*



Prodigal said:


> QUESTION #1: What do you love about this man?
> 
> QUESTION #2: Why do you want to marry this man?
> 
> QUESTION #3: You mentioned drinking an entire bottle of wine over the course of the day. Do you drink a bottle of wine every day?


AGAIN, I am posing these questions. You answered #3. I don't know if you're an alcoholic or not, but you are going to AA meetings not for yourself, but to pacify the jerk you're with. 

So how about answering #1 and #2?


----------



## Prodigal (Feb 5, 2011)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*



laxyzady said:


> Well, we spend so much time together that i've become quite isolated. To answer someone's question here...yes I was drinking about a bottle of wine a day. Would have a glass at lunch.... 2 for dinner...and possibly another 1 or 2 more before bed It was my dessert and also my coping medication for his anger and my anxiety.


I can only hope you will read ^^THIS^^ again and see how desperate it sounds. 

On some level, you have to know this guy is bad news. Sorry, but I don't understand why being alone is considered a living hell on earth. You are isolated. So dump this jerk and start living life. 

Do you understand, on any level, what codependency is about? Do you realize you just jumped from one jerk to another because you are terrified of being alone? Hell, I'd take ALONE any day of the week over the drama-laden/dysfunctional mess you're in.

BTW, I am alone. And I LOVE it. I'm not lonely. I have friends. I have interests. But I live alone with my cat. No drama. No stress. Just living life on my terms and they way I want to live. Nobody is going to dictate my moods.

Honey, you are going to walk right into a hell of your own making if you marry this terrible man. FIGURE OUT WHY YOU HATE BEING ALONE WITH YOURSELF.


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## laxyzady (Jun 19, 2019)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

1) what do I love? I think it's the attention that he devotes to me...constantly caring where I am...what I'm doing. How I am. Always wanting to be with me.... (even though we end up fighting most of that time)

2) Why do I want to marry? At this point I think I KNOW I can't marry him...but I think it's more of the failure...the distancing he's done with me... The feeling of abandonment that makes me feel so awful. I want him to want to marry me...I want him to try to make this work and WANT to have a happy marriage with me. The fact that he constantly focuses in on why we CAN NOT marry and how awful I am ....hurts deeply. I want to fix it and I want him to want to fix it.... so we could marry. But that's obviously insane of me...



Prodigal said:


> AGAIN, I am posing these questions. You answered #3. I don't know if you're an alcoholic or not, but you are going to AA meetings not for yourself, but to pacify the jerk you're with.
> 
> So how about answering #1 and #2?


----------



## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*



laxyzady said:


> Thank you for your replies. I still tend to blame myself. he just amkes it out as if I'm always the problem...


He makes it out to be your fault and you fall for that? He's mistreating you and seems to have very little respect for you. But you believe it when he blames you?

What you have told us about him turning on you when you talk about your wedding show a man who has little to no respect for you. 

He clearly does not want to get married. I don't think you are forcing him, after all he's a big boy and could just tell you that he does not want to get married. Instead he is playing a mean spirited game of sort of playing along with your desire to get married. But when he feels you are really getting serious, he shuts it down. This is a man who does not want to marry you. After 2 failed marriages, he probable has issues about marrying at all, ever again.

In my opinion, from what you told us, you should break off the engagement and find someone else. This guy does not want to be married. He treats you with disrespect. And he seems to have another woman lined up.



laxyzady said:


> I guess I just have to realize he isn't going to marry me, right? ANd I know I shouldn't care...he clearly isn't sweet to me at all....but there are days where things are perfect!


Yep, he does not really want to marry you.

After marriage, anything that is bad not will not go away. Instead it will become 100 times worse. Don't let a few days of 'perfect' get you to ignore the fact that he is not treating you very well.



laxyzady said:


> Just hard to swallow after 5 years. He says he loves me and he "just wants this to be extra special".... that was after telling me he would have low tolerance for my screw ups...


You really need to toughen up girl.. :wink2:

A man you are going to marry and/or are married to should never have that sort of attitude towards you... "low tolerance for my screw ups"? I was married to a guy who talked to me like that. Note the word "was". This sort of nasty nick picking and putting you down will only get worse as time goes on.

The proper response to something like he has low tolerance for your screwups is - "Yea I get it. I've reached my tolerance of your screwups. Here's your ring." And leave him.

Yea to give up on a 5 year relationship is hard. Just think of how hard it will be to leave after 10 years of being treated like this... or 15 or 20 years??? Why put yourself through more of this sort of disrespect?


----------



## Laurentium (May 21, 2017)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*



laxyzady said:


> he is always VERY jealous and weird about me…and I have to account for my every move.
> 
> he wants me to know he has a very low tolerance for my screw ups and that if I were to start drinking even a glass of wine again or if I started "trouble" he would divorce me the very next day.





laxyzady said:


> Lord knows I can't say anything to him...it would be a nightmare fight and he would turn it on me.





laxyzady said:


> We were on a cruise ship and he saw me start to cry (I was trying to hold it) and he said that he's sick of my drama and that if I don't stop crying he will make sure we break up as soon as we hit the next port and he will fly back home without me.


Portrait of an abuser. Get far, far away from him.


----------



## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*



laxyzady said:


> 1) what do I love? I think it's the attention that he devotes to me...constantly caring where I am...what I'm doing. How I am. Always wanting to be with me.... (even though we end up fighting most of that time)
> 
> 2) Why do I want to marry? At this point I think I KNOW I can't marry him...but I think it's more of the failure...the distancing he's done with me... The feeling of abandonment that makes me feel so awful. I want him to want to marry me...I want him to try to make this work and WANT to have a happy marriage with me. The fact that he constantly focuses in on why we CAN NOT marry and how awful I am ....hurts deeply. I want to fix it and I want him to want to fix it.... so we could marry. But that's obviously insane of me...


So he wants to know where you are all the time, what you are doing, etc?

That's actually not love, that's _creepy!_ 

You need to be doing *this!:-*


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## FieryHairedLady (Mar 24, 2011)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

This is not love, attention, devotion, or romance. This is abuse, control, belittlement, hurt, and pain.

Run far away from this man. 

If this is what the "honeymoon" period is like, the marriage is going to be off the charts awful! 

Cut him loose and get counseling for your low self esteem and the hurt from these past 2 relationships.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

zady, read this. See if you recognize your feller:

Overview
You probably know many of the more obvious signs of mental and emotional abuse. But when you’re in the midst of it, it can be easy to miss the persistent undercurrent of abusive behavior.

Psychological abuse involves a person’s attempts to frighten, control, or *isolate* you. It’s in the abuser’s words and actions, as well as their persistence in these behaviors.

The abuser could be your spouse or other romantic partner. They could be your business partner, parent, or a caretaker.

No matter who it is, you don’t deserve it and it’s not your fault. Continue reading to learn more, including how to recognize it and what you can do next.

Humiliation, negating, criticizing
These tactics are meant to undermine your self-esteem. The abuse is harsh and unrelenting in matters big and small.

Here are some examples:

Name-calling. They’ll blatantly call you “stupid,” “a loser,” or words too awful to repeat here.
Derogatory “pet names.” This is just more name-calling in not-so-subtle disguise. “My little knuckle dragger” or “My chubby pumpkin” aren’t terms of endearment.
Character assassination. This usually involves the word “always.” You’re always late, wrong, screwing up, disagreeable, and so on. Basically, they say you’re not a good person.
Yelling. Yelling, screaming, and swearing are meant to intimidate and make you feel small and inconsequential. It might be accompanied by fist-pounding or throwing things.
Patronizing. “Aw, sweetie, I know you try, but this is just beyond your understanding.”
Public embarrassment. They pick fights, expose your secrets, or make fun of your shortcomings in public.
Dismissiveness. You tell them about something that’s important to you and they say it’s nothing. Body language like eye-rolling, smirking, headshaking, and sighing help convey the same message.
“Joking.” The jokes might have a grain of truth to them or be a complete fabrication. Either way, they make you look foolish.
Sarcasm. Often just a dig in disguise. When you object, they claim to have been teasing and tell you to stop taking everything so seriously.
Insults of your appearance. They tell you, just before you go out, that your hair is ugly or your outfit is clownish.
Belittling your accomplishments. Your abuser might tell you that your achievements mean nothing, or they may even claim responsibility for your success.
Put-downs of your interests. They might tell you that your hobby is a childish waste of time or you’re out of your league when you play sports. Really, it’s that they’d rather you not participate in activities without them.
Pushing your buttons. Once your abuser knows about something that annoys you, they’ll bring it up or do it every chance they get.
Control and shame
Trying to make you feel ashamed of your inadequacies is just another path to power.

Tools of the shame and control game include:

Threats. Telling you they’ll take the kids and disappear, or saying “There’s no telling what I might do.”
*Monitoring your whereabouts*. They want to know where you are all the time and insist that you respond to calls or texts immediately. They might show up just to see if you’re where you’re supposed to be.
Digital *spying*. They might check your internet history, emails, texts, and call log. They might even demand your passwords.
Unilateral decision-making. They might close a joint bank account, cancel your doctor’s appointment, or speak with your boss without asking.
Financial control. They might keep bank accounts in their name only and make you ask for money. You might be expected to account for every penny you spend.
Lecturing. Belaboring your errors with long monologues makes it clear they think you’re beneath them.
Direct orders. From “Get my dinner on the table now” to “Stop taking the pill,” orders are expected to be followed despite your plans to the contrary.
Outbursts. You were told to cancel that outing with your friend or put the car in the garage, but didn’t, so now you have to put up with a red-faced tirade about how uncooperative you are.
Treating you like a child. They tell you what to wear, what and how much to eat, or which friends you can see.
Feigned helplessness. They may say they don’t know how to do something. Sometimes it’s easier to do it yourself than to explain it. They know this and take advantage of it.
Unpredictability. They’ll explode with rage out of nowhere, suddenly shower you with affection, or become dark and moody at the drop of a hat to keep you walking on eggshells.
They walk out. In a social situation, stomping out of the room leaves you holding the bag. At home, it’s a tool to keep the problem unresolved.
Using others. Abusers may tell you that “everybody” thinks you’re crazy or “they all say” you’re wrong.

Accusing, blaming, and denial
This behavior comes from an abuser’s insecurities. They want to create a hierarchy in which they’re at the top and you’re at the bottom.

Here are some examples:

Jealousy. They accuse you of flirting or cheating on them.
Turning the tables. They say you cause their rage and control issues by being such a pain.
Denying something you know is true. An abuser will deny that an argument or even an agreement took place. This is called gaslighting. It’s meant to make you question your own memory and sanity.
Using guilt. They might say something like, “You owe me this. Look at all I’ve done for you,” in an attempt to get their way.
Goading then blaming. Abusers know just how to upset you. But once the trouble starts, it’s your fault for creating it.
Denying their abuse. When you complain about their attacks, abusers will deny it, seemingly bewildered at the very thought of it.
Accusing you of abuse. They say you’re the one who has anger and control issues and they’re the helpless victim.
Trivializing. When you want to talk about your hurt feelings, they accuse you of overreacting and making mountains out of molehills.
Saying you have no sense of humor. Abusers make personal jokes about you. If you object, they’ll tell you to lighten up.
Blaming you for their problems. Whatever’s wrong in their life is all your fault. You’re not supportive enough, didn’t do enough, or stuck your nose where it didn’t belong.
Destroying and denying. They might crack your cell phone screen or “lose” your car keys, then deny it.
Emotional neglect and isolation
Abusers tend to place their own emotional needs ahead of yours. Many abusers will try to come between you and people who are supportive of you to make you more dependent on them.

They do this by:

Demanding respect. No perceived slight will go unpunished, and you’re expected to defer to them. But it’s a one-way street.
Shutting down communication. They’ll ignore your attempts at conversation in person, by text, or by phone.
Dehumanizing you. They’ll look away when you’re talking or stare at something else when they speak to you.
*Keeping you from socializing*. Whenever you have plans to go out, they come up with a distraction or beg you not to go.
Trying to come between you and your family. They’ll tell family members that you don’t want to see them or make excuses why you can’t attend family functions.
Withholding affection. They won’t touch you, not even to hold your hand or pat you on the shoulder. They may refuse sexual relations to punish you or to get you to do something.
Tuning you out. They’ll wave you off, change the subject, or just plain ignore you when you want to talk about your relationship.
Actively working to turn others against you. They’ll tell co-workers, friends, and even your family that you’re unstable and prone to hysterics.
Calling you needy. When you’re really down and out and reach out for support, they’ll tell you you’re too needy or the world can’t stop turning for your little problems.
Interrupting. You’re on the phone or texting and they get in your face to let you know your attention should be on them.
Indifference. They see you hurt or crying and do nothing.
Disputing your feelings. Whatever you feel, they’ll say you’re wrong to feel that way or that’s not really what you feel at all.

Codependence
A codependent relationship is when everything you do is in reaction to your abuser’s behavior. And they need you just as much to boost their own self-esteem. You’ve forgotten how to be any other way. It’s a vicious circle of unhealthy behavior.

You might be codependent if you:

are unhappy in the relationship, but fear alternatives
consistently neglect your own needs for the sake of theirs
ditch friends and sideline your family to please your partner
frequently seek out your partner’s approval
critique yourself through your abuser’s eyes, ignoring your own instincts
make a lot of sacrifices to please the other person, but it’s not reciprocated
would rather live in the current state of chaos than be alone
bite your tongue and repress your feelings to keep the peace
feel responsible and take the blame for something they did
defend your abuser when others point out what’s happening
try to “rescue” them from themselves
feel guilty when you stand up for yourself
think you deserve this treatment
believe that nobody else could ever want to be with you
change your behavior in response to guilt; your abuser says, “I can’t live without you,” so you stay
What to do
If you’re being mentally and emotionally abused, trust your instincts. Know that it isn’t right and you don’t have to live this way.

If you fear immediate physical violence, call 911 or your local emergency services.

If you aren’t in immediate danger and you need to talk or find someplace to go, call the National Domestic Abuse Hotline at 800-799-7233. This 24/7 hotline can put you in touch with service providers and shelters across the United States.

Otherwise, your choices come down to the specifics of your situation. Here’s what you can do:

Accept that the abuse isn’t your responsibility. Don’t try to reason with your abuser. You may want to help, but it’s unlikely they’ll break this pattern of behavior without professional counseling. That’s their responsibility.
Disengage and set personal boundaries. Decide that you won’t respond to abuse or get sucked into arguments. Stick to it. Limit exposure to the abuser as much as you can.
Exit the relationship or circumstance. If possible, cut all ties. Make it clear that it’s over and don’t look back. You might also want to find a therapist who can show you a healthy way to move forward.
Give yourself time to heal. Reach out to supportive friends and family members. If you’re in school, talk to a teacher or guidance counselor. If you think it will help, find a therapist who can help you in your recovery.
Leaving the relationship is more complex if you’re married, have children, or have commingled assets. If that’s your situation, seek legal assistance. Here are a few other resources:

Break the Cycle: Supporting young people between 12 and 24 to build healthy relationships and create an abuse-free culture.
DomesticShelters.org: Educational information, hotline, and searchable database of services in your area.
Love Is Respect (National Dating Abuse Hotline): Giving teens and young adults a chance to chat online, call, or text with advocates.


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## laxyzady (Jun 19, 2019)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

Thank you so much for posting all of this. Yes, it's almost all a description of my relationship in one form or another. 

The fear tactics....the isolation...the watching my every move... it's all a good description of what I go through weekly at least.

In my professional life (and personal too) I have always been the employee (now entrepreneur) who doesn't give up. I keep thinking that there's always a way...if you work hard enough. 

And while I may not respond properly to his anger and/or fights....I do listen to what he says. I take on the blame that he assigns and I know what I am guilty of. Sometimes I can't completely stop it because I am too resentful or angry at the blow up he just recently had with me. 

So, I recognize my fault (lack of being overly nice or my quietness) and how it makes him mad. And I blame myself. And then I try to fix myself ...and he STILL goes back to whatever fight he can draw upon from 2 or 3 years ago and uses that against me. 

My point is that I'm in the cycle because I listen and take some of the blame. And it's just like drinking. I recognize drinking a bottle of wine a day is excessive. So now I'm not drinking. But I still blame myself for drinking in the first place and allowing a habit that he can and still uses against me. 

And the worst of it? He says he's proud of me for not drinking now but during a recent argument he said "let's see how long that lasts"..."if you drink even a glass of wine the day after we were to be married...I'd divorce you"

And in another situation he said something to the effect of ...well how do you want me to marry someone who I know has the tendency to become an alcoholic? 

That makes me think -- ****. I'm just never going to be okay. I have a tendency to drink too much so he will still avoid ever fully being with me. Again -- it's my fault and I take responsibility for that. But it HURTS. And I hate letting go ...wondering how much I will blame myself for...when he's gone. 




turnera said:


> zady, read this. See if you recognize your feller:
> 
> Overview
> You probably know many of the more obvious signs of mental and emotional abuse. But when you’re in the midst of it, it can be easy to miss the persistent undercurrent of abusive behavior.
> ...


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

@laxyzady You'll be fine. When you get him out of your life. :smthumbup:


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## laxyzady (Jun 19, 2019)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

So what's the magic moment? How does one get the courage to just leave. I know this sounds crazy but I keep hanging on to hope. 

The same as someone pointed out last night...I THOUGHT Everything was fine last week and it clearly wasn't. 

I have made this change and have been going to AA. Do I give that some time to set in and see his reaction? I know deep down that I wasn't a raging drunk everyday and even though 1 bottle of wine a day is excessive...it was 1 or 1.5 at lunch...a couple at dinner...and then maybe dessert. My point is ...it was over an 8 hour period. Sure there were times I have been intoxicated...and fall asleep early because of it. But, will me not drinking REALLY change everything? 

It's hard to figure out what to think... and I read all of this and it makes me think -- I need to get out ASAP. But the internal voice of mine... feels sad and worried that I could still fix this. 

Sorry to ramble out loud.



MattMatt said:


> @laxyzady You'll be fine. When you get him out of your life. :smthumbup:


----------



## FieryHairedLady (Mar 24, 2011)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

This is not about your drinking. It is just an excuse. 

So you are fine to date, sleep with, and be with for 5 years, wine and all, but not to marry.

Got it.

He has wasted too much of your time already.

Don't waste another minute.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

@laxyzady, you can't fix what's wrong,* because what's wrong is him.* 

You can't fix him, only he can fix him. But that will never happen because there are some people who seem to be addicted to being vile, horrible people. 

He is perfectly happy being a vile, horrible person. So, why would he want to change?


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*



laxyzady said:


> So what's the magic moment? How does one get the courage to just leave. I know this sounds crazy but I keep hanging on to hope.
> 
> The same as someone pointed out last night...I THOUGHT Everything was fine last week and it clearly wasn't.
> 
> ...


No, in all honesty, IT WONT change everything, the man is an abuser and this is his current excuse to abuse you. With the drinking issue removed, he will find something else. And so on, and so on...

Keep going with your sobriety, its something that you need to do for yourself. Please stop hanging onto this false hope about who he could be if only you did this or that. He is an abuser and he isnt going to change. Marrying him would be the biggest mistake of your life. Please find a way to get out of his life.


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## Tex X (May 17, 2017)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*



laxyzady said:


> So what's the magic moment? How does one get the courage to just leave. I know this sounds crazy but I keep hanging on to hope.
> 
> The same as someone pointed out last night...I THOUGHT Everything was fine last week and it clearly wasn't.
> 
> ...


You've heard the saying "damned if you do and damned if you don't"? You're living that right now, and if you stay with this man you will live this hell for as long you are married to him. He's already made statements to set the tone for a long abusive marriage. Like if you ever have 1 glass of wine ever again he'll divorce you the next day? **** that - this guy is a complete loser.

How do you get the courage to leave? Recognize that you deserve so much better than what you're getting right now. You deserve to be with someone who treats you with dignity and respect, not someone who is abusing you and tearing you down at every turn. I think you're looking at the breakup as one large ugly thing which is making it much harder for you to deal with. Try to set your emotions aside and break it down into smaller pieces and put together an action plan (finances, living arrangements, etc.). Then put one foot in front of the other and make it happen. Take it one day at a time - that's all you can really do.


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## laxyzady (Jun 19, 2019)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

Thank you for all of these responses.

The truth is I have no excuse. I already have my own place. I have an apartment in town I have to work at from time to time and I have all my own financial accounts... So, the only thing I'm really lacking is SOME belongings at his (our) place...and the courage.




Tex X said:


> You've heard the saying "damned if you do and damned if you don't"? You're living that right now, and if you stay with this man you will live this hell for as long you are married to him. He's already made statements to set the tone for a long abusive marriage. Like if you ever have 1 glass of wine ever again he'll divorce you the next day? F**k that - this guy is a complete loser.
> 
> How do you get the courage to leave? Recognize that you deserve so much better than what you're getting right now. You deserve to be with someone who treats you with dignity and respect, not someone who is abusing you and tearing you down at every turn. I think you're looking at the breakup as one large ugly thing which is making it much harder for you to deal with. Try to set your emotions aside and break it down into smaller pieces and put together an action plan (finances, living arrangements, etc.). Then put one foot in front of the other and make it happen. Take it one day at a time - that's all you can really do.


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*



laxyzady said:


> Thank you for all of these responses.
> 
> The truth is I have no excuse. I already have my own place. I have an apartment in town I have to work at from time to time and I have all my own financial accounts... So, the only thing I'm really lacking is SOME belongings at his (our) place...and the courage.


Oh girl.... RUN.


----------



## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

He will do all in his power to pull you back in once he knows you're leaving (or even if he strongly suspects it). Have a plan and stick to it. It won't be easy but it can be done.


----------



## Tex X (May 17, 2017)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*



laxyzady said:


> Thank you for all of these responses.
> 
> The truth is I have no excuse. I already have my own place. I have an apartment in town I have to work at from time to time and I have all my own financial accounts... So, the only thing I'm really lacking is SOME belongings at his (our) place...and the courage.


Well you are way ahead of the game then - honestly why are you still there? Pack your **** and leave. Or screw the belongings and just leave. Stuff can be replaced. Staying any longer will make you second guess yourself and prolong your pain. Be prepared for him to hoover you back in. It's what abusing narc's do - DON'T FALL FOR IT. You need to go full no contact with this guy. He does not deserve one more second of your time.

I also have a book recommendation for you:

Codependent No More - Melody Beattie

I'm very sorry you're going through this and I wish you the absolute best!


----------



## Bibi1031 (Sep 14, 2015)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

Your emotions are the ones you need to keep at Bay. Listen to logic and formulate an exit plan. You are financially independent, check. You have a place to live, check. You have a therapist that will help you navigate and take back your strength, self worth, and life, check!

It will take time to feel normal, but once you get out of his grip; you will think clearer and gain strength. It took you 5 years to get out, it will take you less time to heal. 

Remind yourself that you don't have another 5 years to lose on this hell of a relationship. You picked the wrong man because you were vulnerable to his lies and schemes. Narcs are incapable of love. They mimic because they lack empathy. They are the human version of leeches. Never forget that!

Time to take back control of YOUR life! We will be here to cheer you on. You haven't seen your best self yet. You will be awesome. We look forward to your new and improved YOU journey.


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## As'laDain (Nov 27, 2011)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

@laxyzady, what would you need in order to be wiling to leave this guy?


----------



## TJW (Mar 20, 2012)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*



laxyzady said:


> TI keep thinking that there's always a way...if you work hard enough.


This is another of life's half-truths which bring us so much trouble. This is true, when said in relation to yourself. It is not true at all when applied to someone else. No amount of YOUR work is going to change someone else.

This doesn't have to do with your drinking, your behavior, your desires, your codependency. It has NOTHING to do with you. This is HIM. 



MattMatt said:


> He is perfectly happy being a vile, horrible person. So, why would he want to change?


Exactly. The hours are good, and there's no heavy lifting.....



laxyzady said:


> And I hate letting go ...wondering how much I will blame myself for...when he's gone.


Hopefully....none.... because, you are to blame here for nothing.... you have to decide about everything that comes to mind. Segregate everything into "truth" and "lie"......

whatever he does.....is your fault.... put this in the lie column.....


----------



## laxyzady (Jun 19, 2019)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

Yes it's already started.

Yesterday we had the argument about the wedding. I had a car accident and so it was easy for that discussion to disappear (for him).

Then, as you know ...he totally blew on and ruined much of our vacation a couple weeks ago.... 

This morning he told me he wanted to take me somewhere for my birthday in July. So in my HEAD...I thought...oh... that would be nice.. He still wants to be with me. Maybe I should just spend some more time proving I'm not drinking and try to act happier and engaged in conversation...and he will feel better. THAT will surely make him want to be with me long term....

And so the REALISTIC part of my brain recognizes this is just more of the same. He's making more money...he wants to make me feel more complacent...and he will dangle the carrot of a bday trip and see if that will keep me calm for a bit.







Openminded said:


> He will do all in his power to pull you back in once he knows you're leaving (or even if he strongly suspects it). Have a plan and stick to it. It won't be easy but it can be done.


----------



## laxyzady (Jun 19, 2019)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

So true.... It gets confusing when you really want to try...and you want the energy to be involved for both parties.

he wants the relationship. He just wants it on his terms. My therapist says he is a narcassist and possibly BPD -- (she can't diagnose since she hasn't treated him) ... but that he will make my life a living hell but he won't ever leave me.

Often when I complain to him about his emotional abuse -- his response is always the same "if i'm so bad, why don't you leave me?"

Or..."so just RUN from me...since your life will be SO much better without me...right"

Always the same....



TJW said:


> This is another of life's half-truths which bring us so much trouble. This is true, when said in relation to yourself. It is not true at all when applied to someone else. No amount of YOUR work is going to change someone else.
> 
> This doesn't have to do with your drinking, your behavior, your desires, your codependency. It has NOTHING to do with you. This is HIM.
> 
> ...


----------



## nekonamida (Feb 21, 2017)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

Laxy, you have to give up this idea that if you do everything right, he will be decent to you. It isn't true. The fights he's picking with you are completely ridiculous. He treats you poorly and yet gets upset because you aren't acting like a top notch customer service rep by taking the abuse? To any normal person, it makes no sense that he's allowed to treat you in ways that he himself would never allow someone to treat him. And he expects you to do it with a smile.

That's because the fighting has nothing to do with your behavior and you've seen that because even when you change your behavior, he finds other things to argue about and decides to pick ones that you can't change like whatever happened years ago. He wants to argue because he wants to put you firmly in the defensive position and he wants to keep you insecure and unstable in the relationship. Because if you believe that you're causing all these problems and that he's super upset and could dumb you at any minute, you'll do whatever he wants. You'll accept abuse because you're to blame. You're NOT to blame. He just wants you to believe you are so that he can further hurt you and manipulate you.

Just think about it. His first wife wasn't good enough for him and yet he had 3 kids with her. He kept having kids even when he didn't love her. His second wife wasn't good enough for him and yet he didn't even want the divorce. He treated them both the same. He will treat you the same and one day, he will either leave you for another woman or "because he doesn't love you anymore" or you will finally get sick of it and leave yourself.

Keep talking to your therapist and start following their advice. They're right about him. Stop treating your relationship like a game that you can win. You can never win because he keeps cheating by moving the end goal or pulling the ball away from you like Lucy and Charlie Brown. He's rigged the relationship so that you will always lose. So stop playing. Get your stuff back. Block his number and move on with your life.


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## lucy999 (Sep 28, 2014)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*



laxyzady said:


> Often when I complain to him about his emotional abuse -- his response is always the same "if i'm so bad, why don't you leave me?"
> 
> Or..."so just RUN from me...since your life will be SO much better without me...right"
> 
> Always the same....


Take this jerk up on his offer. PLEASE.

Listen. He will NEVER change. You can, however. You can get this ******* out of your life. Forever. He's right about one thing though. Your life WILL be so much better without him. Love does not look like this! Or act like this! Seriously you've got your own business, your own place, your own money. . . quit smoking on that hopium pipe. It's getting you nowhere but deeper down the rabbit hole to hell if you stay. There are men out there who talk to the women in their lives with respect, dignity, and love. It's true. Imagine yourself in one of these relationships.

And I'm not saying this to hurt your feelings. But when you leave, you will be replaced in short order. He doesn't love you. Not really. He loves to torment and abuse you. Because he can. You stay. He gets off on it . You're not special to him. He will find another patsy to torture.

Dump him. He's an *******.


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## Bibi1031 (Sep 14, 2015)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*



laxyzady said:


> So true.... It gets confusing when you really want to try...and you want the energy to be involved for both parties.
> 
> he wants the relationship. He just wants it on his terms. My therapist says he is a narcassist and possibly BPD ...


If you read he characteristics of these types of people, you will see your fiancee clear as day in them. Don't count on him staying with you forever. He will until he finds another to feed his thirst to feed off of. Once he has sucked the life out of you, he will toss you and seek another. You will be his third that you are aware of. There may have been others. I lost 5 years to one of these types. Thank God we never lived together. Something deep down inside me never allowed me to make such a detrimental mistake. I married him. That was messed up indeed. I was vulnerable and naive. He swept me off my feet. 

Once I was hooked, the hell started and boy was it confusing as hell. The push & pull was crazy and so darn cyclical it is now comical that I couldn't notice the vicious cycling hoovering causes the victim while the victimizer throws guilt, shame, and confusion to control us.

Please understand that staying in this toxicity will only bring destruction to your psyche. Save yourself yesterday!


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## Inside_Looking_Out (Apr 8, 2012)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*



laxyzady said:


> So what's the magic moment? How does one get the courage to just leave. I know this sounds crazy but I keep hanging on to hope.



The magic moment was finding a message telling some random woman that 'he would always be there for her' but then turning around and telling you that if you make one more mistake, he will dump you and throw a ring back in your face. He's telling you plain as day what he thinks of you, you just aren't wanting to hear it.


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## TJW (Mar 20, 2012)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*



laxyzady said:


> he wants the relationship. He just wants it on his terms. My therapist says he is a narcassist and possibly BPD


Well, these first two sentences make sense to me. But as for the third, I'm not a shrink, I'm just a country boy raised in bib overalls. I'm sorta like Forrest Gump.... who said "....I'm not a smart man.....but I know what love IS....."....

I don't know what a narcissist is, or what a BPD is...but I know what a cruel, wife-beating, selfish-a$$ed, son-of-a-***** is....

Please don't fool yourself any longer.

It will always be the same....


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## Cynthia (Jan 31, 2014)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

If you ever want to be happily married, it won't be with this man. He is an abuser and you cannot change that.

Instead of trying to make it work with someone who doesn't want to be married to you, why don't you find someone who is already healthy and kind and have a healthy relationship with him instead?

Leave this man and go find happiness, because you will never find it with him.


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## laxyzady (Jun 19, 2019)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

Such a great point. Yes. And you know what is SO crazy? Is that I believe that he would never actually cheat on me...so when I read that message I thought well he is just Mr. No Boundaries... He has said too much before to people about his background and his ex wives that has made me uncomfortable and when I confronted him, he told me that I was TOO sensitive...that EVERYONE would think I'm insane for having a problem with the comments he made (another situation). I felt it was off...and he just went on about how he is a share-er and he likes to share with people his backround and that's just how he is...and if I have a problem, too bad.






Inside_Looking_Out said:


> The magic moment was finding a message telling some random woman that 'he would always be there for her' but then turning around and telling you that if you make one more mistake, he will dump you and throw a ring back in your face. He's telling you plain as day what he thinks of you, you just aren't wanting to hear it.


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## laxyzady (Jun 19, 2019)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

I cry thinking and admitting this...but it's the cold hard truth. And I thank my lucky stars for all of this objective opinion.

In the last month alone....I've heard the following:

"You are impossible. You are insane. I worry about your mental health. I didn't do that...(gaslighting).... You want me to MARRY you? You are so stubborn and selfish, you are the definition of people who will lose their business.... You worry me. You are controlling. You are a manipulator. THe last nearly 5 years with you have been some of the worst of my life.... You have ruined me. You have destroyed me. You are after my money. If I cry....he will say "oh poor C ...Oh poor C...POOR C...she is such a horrible victim to abuse. Cry ...tears of manipulation. Do you know how much my family hates you and my kids don't like you..... and you want me to marry you and tell them after our fights that I told them about...that I'm going to MARRY you in 4 months? Not gonna happen."

That's what I hear ... 

Today? "I love you.... I hope you know I miss you.....I'm sure you don't miss me... You are probably already plotting to leave me. "She's a woman on a mission..." 

THAT was today...of course he says the plotting to leave stuff to test me and make sure I feel insecure. And I say no.... I love you too. Which I don't know anymore.... 





TJW said:


> Well, these first two sentences make sense to me. But as for the third, I'm not a shrink, I'm just a country boy raised in bib overalls. I'm sorta like Forrest Gump.... who said "....I'm not a smart man.....but I know what love IS....."....
> 
> I don't know what a narcissist is, or what a BPD is...but I know what a cruel, wife-beating, selfish-a$$ed, son-of-a-***** is....
> 
> ...


----------



## Cynthia (Jan 31, 2014)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

Can you see the insanity of this situation? Do you see that you are the one who is choosing to stay in this crazy making situation? Why are you reassuring him? Yes, make a plan and leave. Get out.

Seriously. Even he is telling you to run.


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## Tex X (May 17, 2017)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*



laxyzady said:


> I cry thinking and admitting this...but it's the cold hard truth. And I thank my lucky stars for all of this objective opinion.
> 
> In the last month alone....I've heard the following:
> 
> ...


If you're not familiar with it please Google 'Cycle of Abuse'.


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## laxyzady (Jun 19, 2019)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

It's a tactic he uses to try to get me closer to him. I've recognized it now. he will tell me he's leaving me....but he just does it to "get my attention" as he says. 

I will end up running after him...and he is already back. He does it as ...I don't know...a game?

I don't know if he really wants me gone....does he?

Why does he try so hard to get me back then ..when I call his bluff? I know...It's stupid drama I shouldn't care about. But it's what goes through my head.




CynthiaDe said:


> Can you see the insanity of this situation? Do you see that you are the one who is choosing to stay in this crazy making situation? Why are you reassuring him? Yes, make a plan and leave. Get out.
> 
> Seriously. Even he is telling you to run.


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## laxyzady (Jun 19, 2019)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

Yes...I've read it. I know. ANd the trip offering for my birthday is perfectly in line with that.


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*



laxyzady said:


> It's a tactic he uses to try to get me closer to him. I've recognized it now. he will tell me he's leaving me....but he just does it to "get my attention" as he says.
> 
> I will end up running after him...and he is already back. He does it as ...I don't know...a game?
> 
> ...


No, he doesnt want you gone, he feeds off of you, you supply him with his narcissistic sustenance. 

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/the-...xQq9dPF5-OFeeliNf1vBdFB9yOd4oMAh5n1Txs5bhAE_c


He doesnt want to keep you because he loves and cherishes you.


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## Bibi1031 (Sep 14, 2015)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*



laxyzady said:


> It's a tactic he uses to try to get me closer to him. I've recognized it now. he will tell me he's leaving me....but he just does it to "get my attention" as he says.
> 
> I will end up running after him...and he is already back. He does it as ...I don't know...a game?
> 
> ...


That is what I stated as "push and pull.". He pushes you away and then he pulls you back in. It is a tactic and also a game of cat and mouse. This is cyclical and confusing as hell. That is how he eats away at your self worth and controls you. Once he finds a replacement that accepts his advances he will toss you to the curb. He hasn't gotten a new accepting substitute for you yet. 

He was very charming with the woman he texted and you talked about in your earlier posts. You even noticed she wasn't even interested in him and yet he was throwing himself at her. Why do you think he did this? Maybe this woman will run fast and furious away from his creepy self, but there will be a naive one that will think he is the most wonderfull man ever. A God send, yeah right, more like a devil sent to create hell on Earth!


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## laxyzady (Jun 19, 2019)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

I honestly felt on the vacation ...(yes I had a few glasses of wine by this time in the night)... that he was the devil. I could NOT get him to stop being angry. I kept asking him to please have a good night...PLEASE have a good night. PLEASE stop talking about past problems...PLEASE -- let's move forward. 

His reply was NO...unless I talk this out with him THEN that it was proof he couldn't communicate with me.....and that he will be done with me as soon as we land on US soil. (That was the day after he told me he was going to leave me at the next port)...




Bibi1031 said:


> That is what I stated as "push and pull.". He pushes you away and then he pulls you back in. It is a tactic and also a game of cat and mouse. This is cyclical and confusing as hell. That is how he eats away at your self worth and controls you. Once he finds a replacement that accepts his advances he will toss you to the curb. He hasn't gotten a new accepting substitute for you yet.
> 
> He was very charming with the woman he texted and you talked about in your earlier posts. You even noticed she wasn't even interested in him and yet he was throwing himself at her. Why do you think he did this? Maybe this woman will run fast and furious away from his creepy self, but there will be a naive one that will think he is the most wonderfull man ever. A God send, yeah right, more like a devil sent create hell on Earth!


----------



## laxyzady (Jun 19, 2019)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

I know you are right..he will find someone else fast. And I'm SURE he will be all over FB and social bragging about his new love of his life. He has a lot of clout in his community and knows a guy who gets him into all the best parties and clubs. He's 52 and so I don't like doing that stuff. But when he broke up with me...he was RIGHT BACK with that guy...in fact they were basically roommates (in his big house)...so they could go out everyday together. 

That guy is very, very connected to the wealthiest in our community and my fiance was posting pictures of himself with the Mayor etc...and at the most elite restaurants.... 

I had blocked him but when we got back together...I saw it all. 



lucy999 said:


> Take this jerk up on his offer. PLEASE.
> 
> Listen. He will NEVER change. You can, however. You can get this ******* out of your life. Forever. He's right about one thing though. Your life WILL be so much better without him. Love does not look like this! Or act like this! Seriously you've got your own business, your own place, your own money. . . quit smoking on that hopium pipe. It's getting you nowhere but deeper down the rabbit hole to hell if you stay. There are men out there who talk to the women in their lives with respect, dignity, and love. It's true. Imagine yourself in one of these relationships.
> 
> ...


----------



## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

@laxyzady So, is your boyfriend connected to the rich and powerful in your community, too?

I hope you aren't in the situation my aunt was in. She was a GI bride and moved to the States with her husband. He had intimated that his family was well connected. She thought he meant to the cream of local society, from what he had told her.

she was very wrong. It transpired his family was well into Boss Hogg style Southern Politics and were actually no better than a gang of thugs, into extortion, violence, murder and so on.  

Luckily she was able to escape with her daughter (my cousin) to the other side of the States.


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## Tron (Jan 31, 2013)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*



laxyzady said:


> In the last month alone....I've heard the following:
> 
> "You are impossible. You are insane. I worry about your mental health. I didn't do that...(gaslighting).... You want me to MARRY you? You are so stubborn and selfish, you are the definition of people who will lose their business.... You worry me. You are controlling. You are a manipulator. THe last nearly 5 years with you have been some of the worst of my life.... You have ruined me. You have destroyed me. You are after my money. If I cry....he will say "oh poor C ...Oh poor C...POOR C...she is such a horrible victim to abuse. Cry ...tears of manipulation. Do you know how much my family hates you and my kids don't like you..... and you want me to marry you and tell them after our fights that I told them about...that I'm going to MARRY you in 4 months? Not gonna happen."
> 
> ...


----------



## Cynthia (Jan 31, 2014)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*



laxyzady said:


> Why does he try so hard to get me back then ..when I call his bluff? I know...It's stupid drama I shouldn't care about. But it's what goes through my head.


So you're staying with him so you can figure him out? Why are you with this man? He makes you feel horrible. That's not healthy and not how a relationship should be.


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## Prodigal (Feb 5, 2011)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*



laxyzady said:


> I know you are right..he will find someone else fast. And I'm SURE he will be all over FB and social bragging about his new love of his life. He has a lot of clout in his community and knows a guy who gets him into all the best parties and clubs.


Yes, I'm sure he'll be hooked up with another woman - if he isn't already - before you even close the front door.

Most folks here know my story, but I feel it's important for me to share it with you. I was married to an abusive man, who was also a textbook narcissist and an alcoholic. After eight years together (five of those married), I got ANGRY. That anger/rage was what propelled me out the door.

When you are truly sick and tried of being sick and tired, you WILL leave. But as long as you just simmer and stew with resentment, you will stay. Not only will you stay, but you will keep posting about the awful things he does. At this point, I get it. He's a jerk. I don't need to know anymore about him. But YOU are posting here. It's time for you to figure out what keeps you tethered to this horrible man.

So back to my story. I got enraged on a Sunday evening. My worthless husband, who was out of work more than he was employed, wanted to hit me up for $800 to make ends meet for the month. I went ballistic. I was done financing his lazy ass. I grabbed my cat, my clothes, and my files and dumped everything in the backseat and trunk of my car. When he realized his sweet talk and empty promises wouldn't keep me from walking out, he threatened me.

My husband had an unregistered handgun in his office. When he blocked me from going out the front door, I knew he was going to try to kill me. But I was so damn angry, I shoved him aside and got into my car. He ran into the driveway and grabbed the driver's side door. I floored the car, throwing him off, and got the hell outta there. Three days later, I was in court asking for a temporary restraining order. Two weeks later, I had a permanent restraining order.

I went on to enjoy my life. Without him. And when three police cruisers pulled up in our driveway to escort him out of the house - the judge decided I could live in the house without him - he folded like a house of cards. I didn't take the judge up on his offer to live in the house because it had too many bad memories for me. But I went on to enjoy living my life on my terms. 

The freedom from resentment, fear, anger, depression, anxiety, and any-other-awful-emotion are GONE. My life. My choice. My terms.


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## Cynthia (Jan 31, 2014)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

Let's say he does love you and want you to stay, but he gets confused, because he's emotional. What difference does that make? He treats you horribly. Even if he loves you and wants you to stay, it doesn't matter, because he doesn't treat you like someone should if they love you and want you to stay.


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## laxyzady (Jun 19, 2019)

No not related to that type of people. But my fiancé is a doctor. So everyone fawns all over him. 

No one would ever believe that I would have to deal with the stuff below:


In the last month alone....I've heard the following:
"You are impossible. You are insane. I worry about your mental health. I didn't do that...(gaslighting).... You want me to MARRY you? You are so stubborn and selfish, you are the definition of people who will lose their business.... You worry me. You are controlling. You are a manipulator. THe last nearly 5 years with you have been some of the worst of my life.... You have ruined me. You have destroyed me. You are after my money. If I cry....he will say "oh poor C ...Oh poor C...POOR C...she is such a horrible victim to abuse. Cry ...tears of manipulation. Do you know how much my family hates you and my kids don't like you..... and you want me to marry you and tell them after our fights that I told them about...that I'm going to MARRY you in 4 months? Not gonna happen."
That's what I hear ... 
Today? "I love you.... I hope you know I miss you.....I'm sure you don't miss me... You are probably already plotting to leave me. "She's a woman on a mission..." 

I agree that even if he does love me ...it’s just him and his personality isn’t going to change. 

Sadly, I waited too long. I wanted another child and I’m 43 now. He used to say “when we get married” which obviously he was kicking the cab down the road there too. 

And it’s a blessing I don’t have a child with him.


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## Cynthia (Jan 31, 2014)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*



laxyzady said:


> Sadly, I waited too long. I wanted another child and I’m 43 now. He used to say “when we get married” which obviously he was kicking the cab down the road there too.
> 
> And it’s a blessing I don’t have a child with him.


What else are you willing to lose out on by staying with him?


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## lucy999 (Sep 28, 2014)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

Do you think part of why you stay is the perks that come with being with a doctor? (Status, swank parties, high brow friends).NOT judging at all. But be honest.


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## laxyzady (Jun 19, 2019)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

I think status is attractive to me. But we go to NO parties...and we have almost zero friends. So, I would say no...

I do respect him as a doctor. But I didn't like his friends in the party scene. Not at all. So, I tried to help him see that being in clubs etc is not the way he (or I) should be perceived...I am successful business owner. I'm 43. He's 52. Being in clubs and out until 2am...is not my style. 

And the high brow people that we ever are around...are my clients. So, I don't need him for that...




lucy999 said:


> Do you think part of why you stay is the perks that come with being with a doctor? (Status, swank parties, high brow friends).NOT judging at all. But be honest.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*



laxyzady said:


> No not related to that type of people. But my fiancé is a doctor. So everyone fawns all over him.


 @laxyzady

He sounds like a sociopath and/or narcissists. I'm not diagnosing him on the internet but instead just looking at behavior patterns that you describe. One of the most outstanding traits of these disorders is that the person is usually very charismatic. If they are good looking, that adds to the pull of their charisma. At an early age they learn to use their looks, their smile, etc. to control other people. The idea is that other people only have value in so much as they can meet his needs. 

For some reason you seem to have a need to be controlled in this manner. Have you seen a counselor/therapist about all this?




laxyzady said:


> No one would ever believe that I would have to deal with the stuff below:
> 
> In the last month alone....I've heard the following:
> 
> ...


Yea, but you stick around. Why?



laxyzady said:


> And it’s a blessing I don’t have a child with him.


Do either of you have children? If so are they caught up in all this too?


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*



laxyzady said:


> my fiancé of 5 years and I broke up once and when we got back together he was very strange around a specific woman that was in a group he used to work out with. I don’t think I ever met her… but she was walking by and he kind of hid. He later told me it was because he told her about our break up and I think he didn’t want to be embarrassed. Anyway, she’s not overly attractive but is fit.
> 
> When we met he talked about this group and told me that the woman’s husband was an arse and was acting very jealous regarding them being friends. He felt the man was jealous of him because he said he was so funny and made his wife laugh etc.
> 
> ...


I am not surprised that he has already been divorced twice. Why would you want to marry a man who clearly isn't interested in committing to you?


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*



laxyzady said:


> I think status is attractive to me. But we go to NO parties...and we have almost zero friends. So, I would say no...
> 
> I do respect him as a doctor. But I didn't like his friends in the party scene. Not at all. So, I tried to help him see that being in clubs etc is not the way he (or I) should be perceived...I am successful business owner. I'm 43. He's 52. Being in clubs and out until 2am...is not my style.
> 
> And the high brow people that we ever are around...are my clients. So, I don't need him for that...


What clients do you have? Could you grow your business and expand your client base to squeeze him out of your life?


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## TJW (Mar 20, 2012)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*



laxyzady said:


> ...of course he says the plotting to leave stuff to test me and make sure I feel insecure. And I say no.... I love you too.


I want to bring you something for your very serious consideration. I don't know if you have ever thought about it.

We humans are made in the image of God. We are given, by God, many of His own attributes, and some of His capability. Of course, we are not as powerful as God..... but hear me out on this one.....

In the beginning of the bible, there is a narrative describing how God created the heavens and the earth. God speaks.....and it happens......

I want to suggest to you, that what we say......happens.... not to the degree that it does when God speaks, but nevertheless, happens.....

You have recognized here, one of the oldest salesmanship games there is.... make the customer "feel" ....and get him/her to SAY IT.

We humans are our own "expert witness"....because we are made in God's image, what we verbalize becomes our "truth"....

If you want to stop loving him.....just stop saying it..... no matter what he does, cajole, plead, ask leading questions, plant suggestions.....just don't say it....stop.....no more, no more giving him the reply he has prompted....don't let it come out of your mouth......


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## laxyzady (Jun 19, 2019)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

Yes, my business is solid. It's always up and down... as most consulting businesses are...but I am solid right now. I don't have an excuse.



MattMatt said:


> What clients do you have? Could you grow your business and expand your client base to squeeze him out of your life?


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## laxyzady (Jun 19, 2019)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

Yes, my therapist has said that....although of course she can't diagnose since she doesn't see him

He is attractive and he's the type who goes to the gym daily and loves to wear tight shirts and jeans. 

He knows how to use whatever he needs...to get what he wants. When he left me I found out he was dating or starting to date a 24 year old. He still denies it but it was on Facebook posts... he was clearly hitting on her... and talking about spending a weekend out.

As for why I need to be controlled? I don't know. My therapist and I have been digging into it...and it seems there are MANY similiarities between him and my father who has passed away. 

Even the need to attention and the constant "heart attacks or strokes".... CONSTANTLY having health issues....to take all of the attention.

In the last week...he's told me several times he thought his heart was failing and now has a lump on his arm that he is concerned is cancer. It's NON STOP




EleGirl said:


> @laxyzady
> 
> He sounds like a sociopath and/or narcissists. I'm not diagnosing him on the internet but instead just looking at behavior patterns that you describe. One of the most outstanding traits of these disorders is that the person is usually very charismatic. If they are good looking, that adds to the pull of their charisma. At an early age they learn to use their looks, their smile, etc. to control other people. The idea is that other people only have value in so much as they can meet his needs.
> 
> ...


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

@laxyzady

Please take all this up with your counselor.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*



nekonamida said:


> Laxy, you have to give up this idea that if you do everything right, he will be decent to you. It isn't true.


If you read the book I'm sure we recommended - Why Doe He Do That? Inside the Minds of Angry and Controlling Men - you will see that he will NEVER be decent to you because that's how he loses power. He will continue to move the goalpost so that you never become complacent. If you 'fix' one thing he says is wrong with you, he'll just find something else. That's what abusers do. It's ALL they do. Please read the book.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*



lucy999 said:


> Do you think part of why you stay is the perks that come with being with a doctor? (Status, swank parties, high brow friends).NOT judging at all. But be honest.


I'm a writer at a hospital. Just last week, I interviewed 5 different doctors. Every single one of them was a dream. Just the nicest people you could meet. In fact, most of the several hundred doctors I know are pretty great. 

All this to say that if you like what a doctor represents, go for it. But pick one who's not abusive; leave at the first sign. 

But honestly, you're in no position to be dating. You still have plenty of time to foster and/or adopt. Fix yourself first. Learn to be ok alone. Learn to love yourself. Learn to set a high bar. Only when you're ok being alone can you see a man as a bonus, not a necessity.


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## WorkingWife (May 15, 2015)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*



laxyzady said:


> So what's the magic moment?
> 
> The magic moment is NOW.
> 
> ...


OK - HOW TO GET THE COURAGE.

Courage is overrated. 

You know he is good at twisting words and the situation and making you feel like you have to justify your existence.

Do not tell him you are thinking of leaving. Act like everything is normal, but go find and get your own place. If you talk to him about it he will talk you out of it, or it that much more difficult.

THEN: If you feel you can't face him over this, you might be able to move enough stuff over there to be able to stay there awhile and get some distance between the two of you. Move out then text or email him that you've decided to end the relationship but that you are fine and you'll be in touch in a couple weeks. Get some friends or hire someone to help you move your stuff when you're ready.

MORE IDEALLY: Once you've got the place and have some clothes and stuff over there, sit him down and tell him:
I want to break up and I'm moving out. I have a new place where I will be staying. I'll be moving all my stuff over there this week.

THEN no matter what he says, do not discuss or debate with him. Give him short simple answers to his questions that are about you and your feelings. Let him be RIGHT about everything. For example, if he asks you WHY or what can he do better, just answer with things like "I am just not happy." If you start giving details about "well you said this and I did that" that gives him something to work with to manipulate you into staying. If he says how horrible you are, what a loser, drunk, *****, whatever you are, don't respond. It doesn't matter.

THEN GO. Walk out the door, get in your car, and simply drive away.

In 6 months the details of exactly what you said and how you said it will not matter. You will be broken up and the trauma of breaking it to him will be in the past.

Keep reminding yourself that people break up all the time. Hell, he threatened to divorce you the day after he married you. Don't worry about how he feels or what he thinks, or what his friends and family will think or what yours will think. JUST GO. And then start rebuilding your friendships with people.


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## WorkingWife (May 15, 2015)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*



laxyzady said:


> Thank you for all of these responses.
> 
> The truth is I have no excuse. I already have my own place. I have an apartment in town I have to work at from time to time and I have all my own financial accounts... So, the only thing I'm really lacking is SOME belongings at his (our) place...and the courage.


When you say you lack the *courage*. What are you afraid of? His reaction or are you afraid that you will be even more miserable without him?


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## WorkingWife (May 15, 2015)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*



laxyzady said:


> It's a tactic he uses to try to get me closer to him. I've recognized it now.


GOOD. Pay attention and you will start to see the gears turning in his head before everything he says and does. And expect the tactics to escalate. JUST LEAVE. Then don't answer his calls or texts and if he comes over to your place do not answer the door.

And STOP wondering WHY he does what he does. He is not like you or me. He is not motivated by the same things. It doesn't matter WHY. He is not some puzzle you can SOLVE. It matters that you get away from him.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

*Re: Fiance told me I'm "FORCING him to marry"...and he would divorce me the next day*

You will note that the OP has been banned and the thread closed.


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