# The Reconnection Equation



## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

I originally typed this up as a response to another poster in their thread, but then decided to post it to it's own.
I have spent a number of years watching and reading about men struggling with faltering marriages and relationships here on TAM. 
There are distinct arcs. There are distinct outcomes.

1. Stockholm Reconciliation - Things don't actually improve at all. The individual simply convinces himself that they have. All that has changed is his ability to cope with the same behavior. He does change his behavior, and therefore his response, which I won't say is a waste. But ... I would say remaining in the relationship is.

2. Super Nova - Dude tries, listens, attempts to execute. Hopefully develops some self insight, but he never quite fully accepts that he CAN'T change her. Underneath all of the hope and effort, that is what he wants. 
What he NEEDS is to be able to accept and love his spouse as she is.
Eventually he hits threshold and pops, and does so spectacularly. The yield of the explosion usually makes it clear that if his focus is to be himself, then he cannot remain with his partner. For disclosure, I went Super Nova four months after finding TAM in 08.

3. Slow Burn - This guy's work is tireless. He accepts himself. He accepts her. But ... he develops boundaries. He is in for the long haul, he accepts that progress will be slow and there will be set-backs, but he remains hopeful. This is usually a marriage where respect hasn't already completely bled out. He is also prepared to accept that he may have to end the relationship if she can't respect boundaries or actively participate in the recovery of the relationship.

4. Drive Through - These guys want a quick fix. They don't really know what's going on, but they know they don't like it. They will claim they love their wives dearly, but in reading their posts it is clear that feeling is not reciprocated. They don't want to hear anything bad, like she's obviously having an affair. They don't want to change things too much, they don't want to rock the boat. They just want the wife that used to love them to somehow resurface. These guys tend not to stick around long.

5. Negative Ned - They want to fix their marriage but what is suggested they find stupid and couldn't ever possibly work for them. They would rather analyze and critique than actually DO something. Often have analysis paralysis. These guys are also quite clearly to other forum members, a primary cause of the dysfunction in their relationships, but they most certainly are never going to want to acknowledge or explore that.

6. Tragic Hero - Good man. Does the work. Looks at himself, looks at his partner, and ultimately recognizes for BOTH of their lives to improve, the relationship needs to be dissolved. Not the outcome he wants, but realizes it is the one he must choose.

7. Zen Master - Recognizes that the work NEVER ends. Is dedicated to improving himself for his benefit and that of his family. He inspires his partner, and builds a better, stronger, more present and self-aware marriage for both he and his wife.

8. Per meson: The Searcher - This guy is not sure about his marriage. Something is off either with himself or the marriage and he's looking to find out what. He is here to tweak the relationship in the right direction and eager to understand. Sometimes the answers are good and sometimes it's tragic. This stage usually transitions to another stage if the answers are tragic.



There is also that rare man, or woman for that matter who finds his or her way here, who already has what most here seek, a fulfilling marriage, and a spouse who makes them feel loved and valued.

I would like folks to remember what our overall goal here is. Despite the often loud refrain of, "Get out, divorce ..." that what we want to try and foster is a healthy and happy relationship and beneficial outcome for both individuals.

Enjoy Spring.


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## MarriedDude (Jun 21, 2014)

Very well put. 

It does seem, at times, that the advice given to posters is somewhat cookie cutter -get out, etc...I do not believe that is because of some malevolence but only because they see (as well all do) through the lens of their own experiences. Some good and some bad. 

While I do not believe that any of us are little unique snowflakes -I do believe that over years, in a marriage, the behaviors that evolve over time can be unique to the particular marriage. Then, at some point, those behaviors become unacceptable to one of the two or both. It is at that point, that many come to a place like this. It is at this critical moment -that much good could be had for the union -or conversely -utter destruction. The problem becomes -how to get that person to understand the issues and opportunities that abound at this special critical time....and doing so, fast enough while tactful enough, that some positive outcome or change is possible.

That is the hardest part -most that come her are drowning and need a life preserver thrown to them. Typically they are thrown one quickly (but they don't notice or fail to understand)-its always up to the poster to decide if they have been thrown the life preserver -or thrown the brick that will take them down. 

That is why I come here. I found that I cannot do this type of work professionally - because I take too much of it internally -its too difficult for me to observe the usually slow motion train wreak. But I have a great desire to help others -as I have been helped. I have been so blessed for so long -I want that same blessing and happiness for every other couple...I know most of them want it as well -but just have trouble getting out of their own way sometimes. 

End of my Sunday morning ramble -just wanted to say you are spot on.


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## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

I often reiterate that through all of the noise, anger and heartache that can be part of a faltering marriage, what is important to determine is whether or not you have a spouse that will join you in the challenge and work of recovery, or if you have a hardened and embittered adversary, who is going to fight you every step of the way. It can't be only one person that wants it to work.


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

You forgot my type... 

View attachment 34130


8. Torpedo Bomber. After cycling thru outcomes 1-7 he decides a sudden unexpected action is the best option.


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## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

I'm striving for 7....




Deejo said:


> I originally typed this up as a response to another poster in their thread, but then decided to post it to it's own.
> I have spent a number of years watching and reading about men struggling with faltering marriages and relationships here on TAM.
> There are distinct arcs. There are distinct outcomes.
> 
> ...


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## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

Ironic, because you are the archetype upon which number 7 is based.


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## happy as a clam (Jan 5, 2014)

Excellent post, very interesting. Then there the are "Confused Charlie's" who bounce around back and forth among the first five types, essentially spinning in circles--hoping for something, anything to "stick"-- because they don't commit to a way to fix it.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

Or because it's not fixable hence torpedoes..


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## pidge70 (Jan 17, 2011)

Would you say this list could apply to women as well?


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## Amplexor (Feb 13, 2008)

As usual, excellent and well thought out analysis Deej.

From my perspective as a BS that didn't divorce his wife.



Deejo said:


> 3. Slow Burn - This guy's work is tireless. He accepts himself. He accepts her. But ... he develops boundaries. He is in for the long haul, he accepts that progress will be slow and there will be set-backs, but he remains hopeful. This is usually a marriage where respect hasn't already completely bled out. He is also prepared to accept that he may have to end the relationship if she can't respect boundaries or actively participate in the recovery of the relationship.


After the initial shock of D-Day and the all to often response: A complete emotional melt down, loss of confidence and feeling an utter failure, I started to become more pragmatic about the whole thing. That alone took me 6-months to accomplish. With the help of TAM I began to understand concepts like EA, Fog and Rug sweeping. Once a BS understands these kinds of concepts the corrective actions needed become easier and more logical. You no longer operate in panic mode and the emotional roller-coaster begins to level.

But being pragmatic does not mean accepting everything, just what has already happened. That's where the long game comes in to play. Many come here with thread titles like, "Shell-shocked" and "Blind-sided" which is usually incorrect. If you take time to look back a the marriage, there were probably signs that the marriage had been in trouble for some time. Understanding that the marriage has been sliding for several years will put into perspective that it will likely take years to fully recover. You don't feel a need to work at warp speed and can take time for self reflection and improvement. For me, it became more of a business plan and as such I could couldn't expect to change her. Only myself and a good portion of the environment within the marriage. I think this is the basis for the "Slow Burn" recovery.

The part about "her active involvement" in recovery didn't happen for some time. Even after I killed the affair. She was more wait-and-see, not wishing to emotionally recommit to the relationship. I think this is a common occurrence as the FWW is afraid to emotionally let go of the fantasy of the AP. She has to recommit to real-life, warts and all. But given enough time, if the BH continues to show confidence and patience, they will eventually stick their toe in the water. If all goes well they'll get into deeper water with you but you need to expect you will both be treading for a while yet. Accept that as part of the process but not the final outcome. 

I won't say I ever became a Zen Master but at some point the dynamics flipped. I can remember the conversation when it became clear that this had happened. She had complete confidence and respect for me again. She knew the load was on her back to make changes in herself if she was going to reconnect. When this happens, the BH simply needs continue to lead, continue to be the man you've promised yourself to be and the final pieces will fall in place. 

A slow burn can be a successful road to recovery but is self descriptive. Long and painful. Start to finish, mine burned for 3.5 years. It was worth it.


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## Fozzy (Jul 20, 2013)

1. Unhappy ending
2. Unhappy ending
3. Glimmer of hope
4. Unhappy ending
5. Unhappy ending
6. Unhappy ending
7. Happy ending

This is actually kind of depressing.


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## happy as a clam (Jan 5, 2014)

Nice summary, Foz. And it IS kind of depressing... 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

Amplexor said:


> As usual, excellent and well thought out analysis Deej.
> 
> From my perspective as a BS that didn't divorce his wife.
> 
> ...


Always love when you post, Amp. Appreciate the input.


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## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

pidge70 said:


> Would you say this list could apply to women as well?


I think it absolutely could Pidge. Often when I'm giving a woman advice, it isn't much different than what I give to the dudes.

Do you think they resonate with women?

My premise is pretty simple, anyone that finds themselves posting on TAM usually WANTS to save their marriage. 

The input of those have gone before may be seen as projection and cynical, but ... it's also usually correct.


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## Ynot (Aug 26, 2014)

Fozzy said:


> 1. Unhappy ending
> 2. Unhappy ending
> 3. Glimmer of hope
> 4. Unhappy ending
> ...


Add "initially" after each of those and your view point will change. As the OP wrote the idea is" that what we want to try and foster is a healthy and happy relationship and beneficial outcome for both individuals"
Being in a failing marriage can be depressing. Recognizing it and recovering from it is good.
As for me I am striving for the Tragic Hero outcome. I am really working on forgiveness at this point. Eventually...


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## Marduk (Jul 16, 2010)

Insightful man.

I, myself, went through several of these.

And while 7 obviously has the best outcome, I have to say that SuperNova can be fun. We've gone there a few times now.

John - Supernova is your situation, I think.


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## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

Fozzy said:


> 1. Unhappy ending
> 2. Unhappy ending
> 3. Glimmer of hope
> 4. Unhappy ending
> ...


I do want to put a footnote on this Fozzy.

Very few people are happy about dissolution at the time it occurs, even when they most certainly want out.

So, I'm going to be self referential once again. I think that both my ex, and myself wish we could have fostered a better outcome, seven years ago. 

But, now, we have respect for one another and coparent our children very well.

Our kids are happy, and well adjusted.

She has a good partner. Loves her, loves my kids. She's happy.

I've had ... lots of good partners. I just broke the six month barrier with a woman for the first time since my marriage ended. Our motto is be open, honest, and transparent. We're in love, she's not crazy. I call that a win no matter what the ultimate outcome.

I'm a better partner today than I was when my marriage foundered.

A marriage ending is a tragedy.

But it is also a new beginning.


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## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

marduk said:


> Insightful man.
> 
> I, myself, went through several of these.
> 
> ...


I was thinking of John's circumstances as more of a 'MOAB'. Just a matter of when it's dropped.


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## Marduk (Jul 16, 2010)

Deejo said:


> I was thinking of John's circumstances as more of a 'MOAB'. Just a matter of when it's dropped.


Maybe a cruise missile is a better metaphor. 

Slow, launched from far away, comes in low and slow under the radar. 

Then flies in and takes the whole compound out.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## anchorwatch (Mar 5, 2012)

Deejo said:


> 1. Stockholm Reconciliation - *Nope*
> 
> 2. Super Nova - *Been there*
> 
> ...


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## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

I should point out that it's probably likely that any of us bump several of these types of circumstances or reactions as we go through the arc of finding our feet, then our heads, then our heart.

I don't expect anyone to react with a shrug and a smile when they are told to wake up, and open their eyes, 'your partner is screwing someone else.'

Or ...

"It's obvious your partner doesn't respect you."

This stuff isn't easy to hear. Isn't easy to respond to either.


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

marduk said:


> John - Supernova is your situation, I think.



Things don't go Supernova without a warning


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## Marduk (Jul 16, 2010)

john117 said:


> Things don't go Supernova without a warning


What, you mean a helium flash?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

No idea - I will ask Bob my pointy hair boss for a neutrino detector 

I suppose they're similar in the no warning part but supernovas are natural, random, and obvious phenomena, torpedoes are intentional, sneaky, and man made...


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## pidge70 (Jan 17, 2011)

john117 said:


> No idea - I will ask Bob my pointy hair boss for a neutrino detector
> 
> I suppose they're similar in the no warning part but supernovas are natural, random, and obvious phenomena, torpedoes are intentional, sneaky, and man made...


Sooooo, would your W be a supernova while you are the torpedo?


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

In a way.

She's content to eradicate the marriage - herself included - and go out with a Big Bang. I prefer a more, ehem, measured approach


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## pidge70 (Jan 17, 2011)

john117 said:


> In a way.
> 
> She's content to eradicate the marriage - herself included - and go out with a Big Bang. I prefer a more, ehem, measured approach


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## Dedicated2Her (Nov 13, 2010)

I'm pretty thankful for my time in the "slow burn" category. It changed me, but the biggest part it changed was getting back to being who I was before I got married. It was an awakening of sorts. 

It's nice to have a relationship with someone who isn't crazy, and I'll just leave it at that.


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## heartsbeating (May 2, 2011)

Deejo said:


> I just broke the six month barrier with a woman for the first time since my marriage ended. Our motto is be open, honest, and transparent. We're in love, she's not crazy. I call that a win no matter what the ultimate outcome.


Whoa, steady there! .....and a shared motto, nonetheless.

Keep on keepin on. Good stuff.


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## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

The boards are a funny thing. I posted just about this time in 2013 that I had met someone and fallen in love. I daresay that up to that point in my life nobody, absolutely nobody had made me feel more alive.

But as time wore on, she had concerns surrounding my children, and the fact that my ex-wife would never be out of the picture. Well ... my ex and kids are not things that I could make go away. No doubt we could have frittered along and watched our relationship deteriorate into resentment, and disrespect. Instead, it ended with a hug, a kiss, an "I love you." and watching her drive away with a smile on my face. I was very grateful for having had the opportunity to meet and share my life with that person. Frankly, I've been grateful for all of the experiences I've had and women I came to know.

Now? If ever I have to watch this woman drive away, I won't be wearing a smile. She's a gem. Wellspring of emotion and deep feelings. One of the best communicators I've ever interacted with. She is the singular most open and transparent person I have ever known.

Life is a funny thing.

Even now in seeing my ex. I see a different woman than the one I was bound up in tragic circumstances with a decade ago. A happier woman.

That doesn't make me bitter or resentful. It makes me glad for her.


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

and then there are the ones who play mind-f*ck games to stay connected...


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## heartsbeating (May 2, 2011)

Deejo said:


> It makes me glad for her.


Yikes, you sound like a zen master!

What an interesting journey. No doubt you have changed and what you're experiencing is a result of those changes. I'm not just blowing smoke up your ass (what a pleasant saying!) but I have an inkling that you are a wellspring of emotion and deep feelings. One of the best communicators she's ever interacted with and one of the singular most open and transparent people she has ever known. 

Life is funny indeed.


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## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

Dedicated2Her said:


> I'm pretty thankful for my time in the "slow burn" category. It changed me, but the biggest part it changed was getting back to being who I was before I got married. It was an awakening of sorts.
> 
> It's nice to have a relationship with someone who isn't crazy, and I'll just leave it at that.


Always nice to see you posting. Welcome to the other side.


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## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

In Absentia said:


> and then there are the ones who play mind-f*ck games to stay connected...


Ironically, that would be my ex ' s partners ex.

Has to take a toll on someone to keep those fires burning and put effort into that kind of negativity. In her case she has even pulled her partner into it.

Says a lot about a person.


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## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

heartsbeating said:


> Yikes, you sound like a zen master!
> 
> What an interesting journey. No doubt you have changed and what you're experiencing is a result of those changes. I'm not just blowing smoke up your ass (what a pleasant saying!) but I have an inkling that you are a wellspring of emotion and deep feelings. One of the best communicators she's ever interacted with and one of the singular most open and transparent people she has ever known.
> 
> Life is funny indeed.


Do me a favor and remind your husband today that he hit the jackpot.


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## heartsbeating (May 2, 2011)

No reminder needed but I thank you for the compliment!


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## Muse1976 (Apr 25, 2015)

#3. It seems to work the best for now.

I tried a couple of others, I thought real hard about #6. Maybe #7 will come after we come to a good point to attempt.


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## WandaJ (Aug 5, 2014)

I am finding myself in Super Nova. At the dying stage


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

Deejo, just wanted to extend my compliments on your list above. Well thought out and covers every example of state of mind I've seen here at TAM.

I just wanted to say that when I read the list I reversed the sexes and found that it was just as applicable to a woman's state of mind as a man's.


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## Marduk (Jul 16, 2010)

WandaJ said:


> I am finding myself in Super Nova. At the dying stage


Sorry about that Wanda.


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## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

Thanks AP. I do think they are reversible. Either #3 or #6 could easily be resolved to a walkaway spouse situation.


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## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

WandaJ said:


> I am finding myself in Super Nova. At the dying stage


I can still remember saying to my wife at the time, "Do you have any idea of how precious little you would need to do, to keep me happy and committed to you forever?"

And we couldn't do it. There was without doubt a time where we both wanted reconciliation, but the gap simply become too large to overcome.

A large part of that gap was my going Super Nova. It frightened her. And given how bad the dynamic had become at that time, I didn't care.

We have both since apologized to one another.
For everything.


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## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

Muse1976 said:


> #3. It seems to work the best for now.
> 
> I tried a couple of others, I thought real hard about #6. Maybe #7 will come after we come to a good point to attempt.


Not familiar with your story, Muse. How are you both holding up?


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

Deejo said:


> I can still remember saying to my wife at the time, "Do you have any idea of how precious little you would need to do, to keep me happy and committed to you forever?"
> 
> And we couldn't do it. There was without doubt a time where we both wanted reconciliation, but the gap simply become to large to overcome.
> 
> ...


Deejo, I think you two did the right thing for each other by releasing each other. Sometimes No Deal is the right option.


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## WandaJ (Aug 5, 2014)

Deejo said:


> I can still remember saying to my wife at the time, "Do you have any idea of how precious little you would need to do, to keep me happy and committed to you forever?"
> 
> And we couldn't do it. There was without doubt a time where we both wanted reconciliation, but the gap simply become too large to overcome.
> 
> ...


Thank you for sharing that. I do wonder where is this going? We both went through Supernova after D talk, tried to repair. it and for a while it was going great, but it seems we are loosing steam now. Still trying, but as you have said, that gap is just huge.


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

Every once in a while I think what it would take to even attempt to reconcile...

In one corner is what Deejo wisely said: "do you know how little it would take"... 

In the other corner is a couple 55g drums full of refined resentment. 

If I was 40, maybe. 

There are times I wish May 2017 arrives next month. It's like my darned cataract surgery - got one eye fixed April 15 and I'm waiting for the other. First guy ever who can't wait for surgery (June 3). That's exactly how I feel for May 2017.


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## meson (May 19, 2011)

Deejo, 

That is a really excellent taxonomy of TAM. I have run into each of those kinds myself. Before I came to TAM I was doing the slow burn for many years. The marriage was the best it had been in a decade when I came to TAM but I was not a zen master. I had feelings for someone else and it made me question my relationship with my spouse. I was confused and searching. The answers I found here made my marriage better and I took them to heart and developed much better boundaries. 

So I propose adding Searcher to the list. I have seen seen a couple of others who were here to learn and tweak their marriage but were not yet zen masters.


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## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

Deejo,
You are very kind. This board has been incredibly helpful to me. 

And you and I both know that on occasion I've demonstrated the same 'spot' blindness that we see on TAM every day. Overall I try hard to see what's real and either improve on it or if that seems impossible, to accept it. 





Deejo said:


> Ironic, because you are the archetype upon which number 7 is based.


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## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

meson said:


> Deejo,
> 
> That is a really excellent taxonomy of TAM. I have run into each of those kinds myself. Before I came to TAM I was doing the slow burn for many years. The marriage was the best it had been in a decade when I came to TAM but I was not a zen master. I had feelings for someone else and it made me question my relationship with my spouse. I was confused and searching. The answers I found here made my marriage better and I took them to heart and developed much better boundaries.
> 
> So I propose adding Searcher to the list. I have seen seen a couple of others who were here to learn and tweak their marriage but were not yet zen masters.


I like that concept. Care to write it up and I'll post it?

Also like your sig quote, read his wife's book.


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## JukeboxHero (Mar 3, 2015)

I like this post. I wonder which one I would fall into? I'm hoping for 7, but if I can't make that work, I'm wondering if I should do 6. Right now, I feel like I'm a cross between 3 & 4.


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## meson (May 19, 2011)

Deejo said:


> I like that concept. Care to write it up and I'll post it?
> 
> Also like your sig quote, read his wife's book.


Thanks for the compliment. Here is my cut at it:

The Searcher - This guy is not sure about his marriage. Something is off either with himself or the marriage and he's looking to find out what. He is here to tweak the relationship in the right direction and eager to understand. Sometimes the answers are good and sometimes it's tragic. This stage usually transitions to another stage if the answers are tragic. 


I've never read his wife's book but I've seen her in a couple of interviews. I'll take a look at it. I've often wondered what she really thought about the real possibility that he won't swim in someday.


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## Muse1976 (Apr 25, 2015)

Deejo said:


> Not familiar with your story, Muse. How are you both holding up?


Yeah, I don't really have a story. Well I do, I just haven't felt the need to post it. Not yet anyways. 

How are we both holding up? It's complicated as all stories are. I guess we will get an accurate assessment pretty soon as counseling is scheduled. 

Thanks for asking. I appreciate it. Very good post.


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

Comprehensive list, Deejo. 

I have worn several of those hats, and hopefully all but one for the last time.


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## meson (May 19, 2011)

Thanks for the addition and the nod Deejo... Hopefully it helps people identify where they are and thereby which techniques are needed to help out.


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