# Why do spouses cheat?



## ChubbieOwl (Nov 19, 2011)

I hope it's okay that I post this, it is just a curiosity, not to resolve any fears or concerns for myself.

If someone is unhappy in their marriage and having sex or a relationship outside of the marriage secretly, then why not just get divorced? Why drag it out and stay together, dragging your spouse along unknowingly?

I want to say - I am not judging or trying be a troll or whatever, I am just genuinely curious and there are bound to be people on this board that can answer.


----------



## Hoosier (May 17, 2011)

good question


----------



## lisa3girls (Apr 6, 2011)

I think mine did because I was paying for everything, and he felt justified due to self esteem issues that he projected onto me. He still feels entitled. It is ridiculous.


----------



## NoIssues (Oct 9, 2011)

Anticipated 

1. Financial pain 
2. Parental/family pain 
3. Avoiding hassle
4. Consider affair temporary
5. Not ready 
6. Testing their feelings 
7. Companionship pain 
8. Embarrassment
9. Public reputation 
10. Not wanting to give up comforts like house, stuff, surroundings
11. Belief that all their needs can be filled with both a marriage and affair

Off the top of my head. Its a cake and eat it too deal


----------



## lisa3girls (Apr 6, 2011)

And now mine is pissed at the consequences and just doesn't get

1- why I don't trust him or anything he says
2- why I am not just being more friendly about all of this
3- why we just can't settle it nicely in mediation

He lied to a year and a half, to me and to the kids.... over and over and over.... then he came back for two days, and lied some more, and snuck behind my back having contact with the OW, then told the kids we were going to try and work it out and changed his mind --

and he is truly confused about my #1????


----------



## lisa3girls (Apr 6, 2011)

sorry


----------



## AppleDucklings (Mar 27, 2011)

because people are assh0les.


----------



## Kimberley17 (Oct 10, 2011)

Because we are not getting what we 'need' from our spouse and even after many attempts of communicating those needs and nothing changing you do what you need to do to survive the marriage. It's not just about me anymore. It's about keeping my kids family together.


----------



## Arnold (Oct 25, 2011)

Kimberley17 said:


> Because we are not getting what we 'need' from our spouse and even after many attempts of communicating those needs and nothing changing you do what you need to do to survive the marriage. It's not just about me anymore. It's about keeping my kids family together.


Then why put your kids through infidelity? It is way more damaging to them than divorce, IMO.


----------



## YupItsMe (Sep 29, 2011)

Arnold said:


> Then why put your kids through infidelity? It is way more damaging to them than divorce, IMO.


A lot of people disagree with your opinion largely because they think they 

1. will never get caught
2. can get the sexual release and attention they want in secret

but then they do get caught or fall in love with the OW or OM. 

That is where the damage takes place but it isnt seen in advance of the affair


----------



## Kimberley17 (Oct 10, 2011)

Good question.. and I don't have a good answer. I guess I live in a fantasy world that I can keep my family together until my kids are older. They are now very young.


----------



## Kimberley17 (Oct 10, 2011)

And YupItsMe, you're exactly right. I do think I will not get caught and it is not only the sexual release that keeps e going back for more. It's mostly the attention that I don't get from my husband. And I am developing strong feelings for the OM which I know is bad, very bad. I would never leave my husband for him though as I would never be able to trust him.


----------



## InFlux (Oct 30, 2011)

Kimberley17 said:


> And YupItsMe, you're exactly right. I do think I will not get caught and it is not only the sexual release that keeps e going back for more. It's mostly the attention that I don't get from my husband. And I am developing strong feelings for the OM which I know is bad, very bad. I would never leave my husband for him though as I would never be able to trust him.


I'm not going to judge you because we're all imperfect people, but the fatal flaw with your logic is believing that there is no collateral damage with an affair. That an affair is "just between two people". People get into affairs because they think it's a fun release for not getting their needs met in the relationship and that no one will have to know. This is not the same as the single life, however. It's not just two people's concerns. There are other, usually unwilling, participants on both sides (spouses, kids). This is where the damage occurs. Because the reality is that by putting one's efforts into an affair partner one is withdrawing them from a spouse and family. Not to mention the high likelihood of falling "in-love" with an affair partner or having the affair being brought out into the open (usually dramatically and destructively) on one or both sides. Ultimately, though, the responsible thing to do is to either do whatever is required to fix the relationship or to end the relationship at which point one can pursue a new relationship out in the open.


----------



## Arnold (Oct 25, 2011)

I think Kimberly's response demonstrates something I have long felt: that despite claims to the contrary, the majority of affairs are retaliatory toward the betrayed spouse.
Think about it. Since STD protection is never 100% certain, and the cheating spouse really has no true idea of the affair partner's health or sexual history, there is a willingness to expose the BS to some very serious, even deadly diseases.
And, the cheating spouse seem to have no compunction about enjoying certain gratifications, while depriving the BS of similar gratification. This happens because the BS mistakenky beleives the contract he or she agreed to is still valid.
I think there almost always is a lot of anger and resentment toward the BS and that a cheater does this to pay the BS back. Even if the BS never finds out, the Ws has the satisfaction of knowing that he or she got over on the BS(sort of like spitting in someone's soup).
And, of course, there is the potential of the kids being without a parent, should a disease take hold.


----------



## allthegoodnamesaregone (Nov 18, 2011)

Kimberly17, just a question, did ever really sit down with Hubby and say " Hubby I really having some problems with "X" and it has to change" I don't know anyone whose wife cheated ever did that, my own included. 

Most of us men don't get hints from from a woman's actions or behavior, we've lived with years of weird stuff every month, PMS, PMT, issues with body image, child birth etc. and are told it's all normal in married life. If you don't club us with it over the head we DON"T GET IT!


----------



## NoIssues (Oct 9, 2011)

allthegoodnamesaregone said:


> Most of us men don't get hints from from a woman's actions or behavior, If you don't club us with it over the head we DON"T GET IT!


:iagree: That little golden nugget of wisdom cost my wife and I several years of misery before she finally spit it out directly.


----------



## Arnold (Oct 25, 2011)

I think mny cheaters, regardless of gender, have this expectation of clairvoyance from their spouses. Seems quite common among both genders.


----------



## allthegoodnamesaregone (Nov 18, 2011)

NoIssues said:


> :iagree: That little golden nugget of wisdom cost my wife and I several years of misery before she finally spit it out directly.


I just wish someone would go on Oprah, Dr Phil or any of these talk shows and bring this up! 

If a man loves his wife he would take bullet for her, wrestle a Grizzly bear naked to protect her, he'll move heaven and earth to change if he knows she's that unhappy. I know I would have done all of the above and more, but sadly my wife said nothing in a way that made me believe she was that unhappy. So another long term marriage, 24 years, down the tubes because a wife could not bring herself to say " Hubby, I'm so unhappy, we have to change 'X' right now"


----------



## oaksthorne (Mar 4, 2011)

Kimberley17 said:


> Because we are not getting what we 'need' from our spouse and even after many attempts of communicating those needs and nothing changing you do what you need to do to survive the marriage. It's not just about me anymore. It's about keeping my kids family together.


My H says he made "many attempts" too. He didn't; he was never honest. He actually told me how happy he was with our marriage and fam, and that I couldn't drive him away with a stick. It was all to keep me off the trail, I think. There is no excuse or justification for cheating, none! No matter what you tell yourself. It's a slimy, and completely selfish way of having your cake and eating it too.


----------



## allthegoodnamesaregone (Nov 18, 2011)

I agree, the "I've not been happy for a while" thing translates to "I've developed feelings for someone else and need a good excuse". Then of course the whole marital history get the big edit ;~)

In retrospect there were a lot of times I was not very happy with myself, my life and my marriage, but realized these feeling for what they were, simply the struggles of life and transitory.I never blamed my wife for any of it


----------



## AppleDucklings (Mar 27, 2011)

Kimberley17 said:


> And YupItsMe, you're exactly right. I do think I will not get caught and it is not only the sexual release that keeps e going back for more. It's mostly the attention that I don't get from my husband. And I am developing strong feelings for the OM which I know is bad, very bad. I would never leave my husband for him though as I would never be able to trust him.


......you cannot possibly be for real


----------



## Geoffrey Marsh (Aug 11, 2011)

Kimberley17 said:


> And YupItsMe, you're exactly right. I do think I will not get caught and it is not only the sexual release that keeps e going back for more. It's mostly the attention that I don't get from my husband. And I am developing strong feelings for the OM which I know is bad, very bad. I would never leave my husband for him though as I would never be able to trust him.



Wow...this is crazy talk.


----------



## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

Kimberley17 said:


> And YupItsMe, you're exactly right. I do think I will not get caught and it is not only the sexual release that keeps e going back for more. It's mostly the attention that I don't get from my husband. And I am developing strong feelings for the OM which I know is bad, very bad. I would never leave my husband for him though as I would never be able to trust him.


Disgusting and selfish.


----------



## Oregon38 (Sep 19, 2010)

Why do they cheat? Because they can and choose to. Hold on... not really that easy.

I strongly believe that there are many factors. Way of life and society for example. Everybody does it. There are movies about cheating, magazines full of cheating stories etc. It has become something which is generally accepted obviously and it seems to be so much fun. Cheaters cheat without any consequences. Even advertisement has a big influence. Buy this product because it's much better and the latest technology. Shoes got too dirty? No need to clean them, get new ones. Clothes have holes? why spend time fixing it, get new ones. This attitude can definitely be transferred to relationships. For a lot of people there seems to be no commitment anymore. Have fun as long as it works and if it requires too much involvement and energy get out of it.

Not enough sex in the marriage? it will fade anyway with age. Spouse is not beautiful anymore... don't we all know it's normal that we all age? My spouse doesn't make me happy... nobody is responsible for anybody's happiness but oneself. 

Another factor are unaddressed issues of the cheater. My ex wife's family history for example. Parents divorced, siblings divorced, siblings cheated, sexual abuse as a child etc. Stir all this up and you will have a perfect ****tail of emotional and mental problems for a future relationship.

She never addressed the damages done to herself. Instead, she was searching for the solution in me, as her partner and husband. Over a lot of years the issues were never resolved but more masked by being happily together. Then it began to wear off. I was blamed for everything, emotionally and mentally abused so she could get her "fix". Suddenly, I couldn't give anymore. The rest is history. Perfect script cheating.

Did she learn anything? No, she just repeated a pre-determined pattern which resulted in the destruction of the relationship and a broken childhood of our child. Is she happy now? I know for sure she's not, at least not inside. She might act happy and put a smile on but it's all fake. All the things she's looking for to make her feel better will eventually disappear and wear off. Like a lot of cheaters, she didn't realize that she already had everything she was looking for. But you can only miss something unless you have lost it. That day will come.


----------



## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

Oregon38 said:


> Why do they cheat? Because they can and choose to. Hold on... not really that easy.
> 
> I strongly believe that there are many factors. Way of life and society for example. Everybody does it. There are movies about cheating, magazines full of cheating stories etc. It has become something which is generally accepted obviously and it seems to be so much fun. Cheaters cheat without any consequences. Even advertisement has a big influence. Buy this product because it's much better and the latest technology. Shoes got too dirty? No need to clean them, get new ones. Clothes have holes? why spend time fixing it, get new ones. This attitude can definitely be transferred to relationships. For a lot of people there seems to be no commitment anymore. Have fun as long as it works and if it requires too much involvement and energy get out of it.


There's also the issue that's now prevalent in society: That it's the betrayed spouse's fault for the cheater going outside the marriage. That if the betrayed spouse wasn't falling all over themselves to give the wayward spouse the constant validation that they crave, that the wayward spouse wouldn't have cheated. 

So now it seems to be okay in this society we live in today, that if your spouse or SO isn't giving you what you need emotionally/physically, that it's your right to go out and find someone else who can.


----------



## InFlux (Oct 30, 2011)

There's three sides to every story (mine, yours, the truth). The BS contributed to the failure of the marriage by way of unmet needs, etc. but there is a right way of dealing with problems and a wrong way. And having an affair is definitely the wrong way. The WS blame-shifts everything on the BS because they have to to justify their actions. It's a self-defense mechanism erected by their sub-conscious. I believe many WS cheat not because they can but because they are used to having others fulfill their happiness. They fail to realize that they, themselves, are responsible for their own happiness. So when they latch-on to a new person their happiness needs are met (for awhile) at which point they'll look for it from someone else -- even if that involves an affair...


----------



## Oregon38 (Sep 19, 2010)

InFlux said:


> I believe many WS cheat not because they can but because they are used to having others fulfill their happiness. They fail to realize that they, themselves, are responsible for their own happiness. So when they latch-on to a new person their happiness needs are met (for awhile) at which point they'll look for it from someone else -- even if that involves an affair...


Amen to that!


----------



## ChubbieOwl (Nov 19, 2011)

Wow, there are some really insightful responses on here. 
And as a child of divorced parents, unless you are able to have that affair, while not taking away any time from your family, not letting any of the unhappiness of your marriage show and able strap on some really believably fake happiness, you are not doing your kids any favors. I was actually relieved when my parents finally divorced, because I was so tired of hearing them fight every night after I went to bed. Staying together for the kids is more selfish than you realize.


----------



## Numb-badger (May 18, 2011)

I'd far rather have been handed the divorce papers than be a victim of infidelity.


----------



## allthegoodnamesaregone (Nov 18, 2011)

Numb-badger said:


> I'd far rather have been handed the divorce papers than be a victim of infidelity.


Me as well, everything I ever believed in about my 24 year marriage is now seems like a lie. If I'd had a chance to address what ever issues were bothering my wife and it didn't work out I could have handled that.


----------



## tobio (Nov 30, 2010)

I felt quite flattered in a weird way when my OH told me the reason he had his EA was nothing to do with me. He said it was not about him being unhappy with me in any way but about him. The irony is that of course that did NOT make me feel better about it! In a weird way it would have been easier to understand I think if it HAD been something I was or wasn't doing. But it's harder this way because of the lack of control I had over the situation: it had to come from him.

His reasons? He had been unhappy in our family life for a long time. He was swept into an instant family ( I had two kids when we met) and for ages he'd felt resentful that meeting "the one" wasn't like he'd wanted it. The dating, moving in and getting married happened completely differently. He met the OW by chance at a job he was doing and she moved right on in on him. He didn't go out looking but welcomed the attention. He liked her but when she tried to take it a step further it jolted him a little. From then he messed about with texting her, and messaging on Facebook. The job had finished so he wasn't seeing her every day but he still needed that fix of attention.

So for him it was purely selfish. He had issues he needed to deal with and I got the brunt of his lack of ability to face up to reality. Luckily he has gone far to mend things.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

allthegoodnamesaregone said:


> I just wish someone would go on Oprah, Dr Phil or any of these talk shows and bring this up!
> 
> If a man loves his wife he would take bullet for her, wrestle a Grizzly bear naked to protect her, he'll move heaven and earth to change if he knows she's that unhappy. I know I would have done all of the above and more, but sadly my wife said nothing in a way that made me believe she was that unhappy. So another long term marriage, 24 years, down the tubes because a wife could not bring herself to say " Hubby, I'm so unhappy, we have to change 'X' right now"


And I bet even if you did ask, you got the dreaded "N" word: Nothing! Nothing's wrong!

Because in their mind, if you loved her, you should be able to read her mind and her "hints". Still, its mostly blameshifting and re-writing the marital history. Its foggy talk.


----------



## Nikki1023 (Sep 24, 2011)

POOR CHARACTER.

I dont buy into the whole..your not satisfying them..theyre unhappy..such a load of crap. 

I was seriously unhappy with my marriage at times, had extremely bad lows with him. NEVER, EVER did it once cross my mind to cheat. He's in the military, so his job pulled him away from us very often. I had MORE than enough chances to go out, and "do me"..lack of sex..bad point in marriage, the whole nine yards. 

WHY didnt I cheat? Im better than that. I made a commitment to be with him, and only him for the rest of my life. But I had an amazing upbringing from my parents. 

Him?? NOT SO MUCH. Raised by 2 selfish individuals, crappy a$$ character. He had so many issues ( I found out about POST marriage) that should have been addressed as a child. But when people are only looking out for themselves they neglect their kids.

He's going to therapy to work out his daddy issues..and to figure out why he was such a crap ball to me. 

SOOO, Kiss my butt all you " Theyre unhappy with their marriage" blabbers. Its CHARACTER. SOme have it..some dont. End of story.


----------



## morituri (Apr 1, 2011)

Kimberley17 said:


> I would never leave my husband for him though as *I would never be able to trust him.*


Are you aware of the irony of a betrayer of trust who requires trust from her partner?


----------



## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

You know what I got? I got the "We grew apart" speech. Really? HTF did that happen? You mean we grew apart when we spend all our time together, working out at the gym together, going to dinner or date nights, calling her at work to say Hi and talk, etc? Oh, but I did let her have her space because I thought she was talking on the phone with her parents, brothers, and sisters in the Philippines (in another dialect). Yeah, she pulled one over on me. Just more foggy talk.

Some spouses cheat in this day and age because they re-connect with an old lover on social networking sites like facebook/myspace, etc. They have this memory of the OP from their teenage years, and when they hear from that OP, the excitement they feel is intoxicating. First its how are you, catching up on their lives since they were together, then talking about their families, then they start talking about their intimate marital issues, and BAM! They're sliding down that slippery slope.


----------



## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

Nikki1023 said:


> POOR CHARACTER.
> 
> I dont buy into the whole..your not satisfying them..theyre unhappy..such a load of crap.
> 
> ...


You're a woman of good character. Your POS husband doesn't know what he lost when he cheated on you.


----------



## Numb in Ohio (Oct 31, 2011)

lordmayhem said:


> Some spouses cheat in this day and age because they re-connect with an old lover on social networking sites like facebook/myspace, etc. They have this memory of the OP from their teenage years, and when they hear from that OP, the excitement they feel is intoxicating. First its how are you, catching up on their lives since they were together, then talking about their families, then they start talking about their intimate marital issues, and BAM! They're sliding down that slippery slope.



Oh how this fits my H's EA to a T..... exactly what happened, she contacted him through FB, then he called her from our home and then bam, the next week they started talking as if they never lost touch, 3 and 4 days a week , 3 and 4 calls a day, then texting as well and her sending pix to him ( but he says just from the chin up) WTFE!!


----------



## allthegoodnamesaregone (Nov 18, 2011)

Yep, Social media has made it all so much easier. Once upon a time preface book/internet you might wake up at 3:00am and think, " I wonder what happened to what's her/his name", then think " They're probably fat/bald with three kids by now" and roll over, spoon with your mate and go back to sleep.


----------



## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

Yeah, back in the day, you would actually do some detective work to reconnect with an old flame. Nowadays with social networking, it just takes a few keystrokes and a mouse click.

F-102 hit it out of the park when he posted how easily EAs can develop and destroy a marriage:



F-102 said:


> It may have gone something like this:
> 
> They first start catching up, and it's all "How you been doing? What have you been up to?"
> 
> ...


----------



## allthegoodnamesaregone (Nov 18, 2011)

RWB, I'm not sure that's entirely true. Some have been perfectly wonderful spouses for upwards of 30 years, then something just snaps. 

It could be the fear of getting older and feeling they've missed out, a mental problem that's surfaced due to stress, hormone levels or medication throwing things out of whack etc. 

Like most people they wake up some days and wonder "Is this all there is", but for whatever reason they run instead of fight for their marriage. I know all my wife's friends from high School have divorced, some twice, some are now having "Spring Time " romances, which I imagine really make wive's in long term marriages a little resentful, maybe even jealous of their friends and think "Why not me , I'm prettier than her". Whatever the reason it's no excuse, the pain is almost unbearable for those of us who are left to deal with the life and family they dumped. I've got to the point I really don't care anymore about the reason why, because I don't honestly think even they know what it was.


----------



## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

the number one reason why any of us make poor decisions is fear

WS is afraid to say how they really feel and thus eek what they want outside their marriage or are afraid to admit that they can't stay monogamous and do the right thing for their partner by not getting married or divorcing
BS is afraid to stand up for themselves and present real consequences and exposures when WS cheats because they are afraid of divorce or hurting the kids or being labeled a failure, etc


----------



## Kimberley17 (Oct 10, 2011)

Yes, I have sat down and told him exactly what I need from him and some improved, some didn't. The problem is I have so much resentment that my feelings for him are not the same. Long before my affair started I was just going through the motions. I am no longer attracted to him and do not feel 'love' for him. I care like a friend.. I am not condoning my behavior and know it's 100% wrong. I am strongly considering ending the affair ...


----------



## AppleDucklings (Mar 27, 2011)

Kimberley17 said:


> Yes, I have sat down and told him exactly what I need from him and some improved, some didn't. The problem is I have so much resentment that my feelings for him are not the same. Long before my affair started I was just going through the motions. I am no longer attracted to him and do not feel 'love' for him. I care like a friend.. I am not condoning my behavior and know it's 100% wrong. I am strongly considering ending the affair ...


Don't forget to confess to your husband what you did, and then refer him to us here so we can help him get through the ride through hell he's about to be taken on.


----------



## Geoffrey Marsh (Aug 11, 2011)

Kimberley17 said:


> Yes, I have sat down and told him exactly what I need from him and some improved, some didn't. The problem is I have so much resentment that my feelings for him are not the same. Long before my affair started I was just going through the motions. I am no longer attracted to him and do not feel 'love' for him. I care like a friend.. I am not condoning my behavior and know it's 100% wrong. I am strongly considering ending the affair ...



:lol::lol:


With a friend like you who needs.....


----------



## Kimberley17 (Oct 10, 2011)

Now why would I confess to my husband?? That is the worst advice I ever got.


----------



## AppleDucklings (Mar 27, 2011)

Kimberley17 said:


> Yes, I have sat down and told him exactly what I need from him and some improved, some didn't. The problem is I have so much resentment that my feelings for him are not the same. Long before my affair started I was just going through the motions. I am no longer attracted to him and do not feel 'love' for him. I care like a friend.. I am not condoning my behavior and know it's 100% wrong. I am strongly considering ending the affair ...


You just completely condoned your behavior by what you just said. "I have so much resentment that my feelings for him are not the same." and "before my affair started I was just going through the motions. I am no longer attracted to him and do not feel 'love' for him. I care like a friend"
That is condoning. condoning: present participle of con·done (Verb)Verb: 1.Accept and allow (behavior that is considered morally wrong or offensive) to continue.


----------



## AppleDucklings (Mar 27, 2011)

Kimberley17 said:


> Now why would I confess to my husband?? That is the worst advice I ever got.


No, it's actually the best thing you could do. Since you no longer "love" your husband, you should at least give him the choice to leave you. Would you want to live with a cheater?


----------



## Kimberley17 (Oct 10, 2011)

Ok, let me rephrase.. I know it is wrong and yes I am doing it anyway. We ALL know it's wrong. Look, I was simply answering a question that was presented. Keep your attacks to yourself.


----------



## Kimberley17 (Oct 10, 2011)

AppleDucklings- are you male or female? I will never tell him..


----------



## sigma1299 (May 26, 2011)

Kim - I don't want to thread jack but the reason we're all here is to help others with the knowledge we learned from the scars we carry and the hope that we can help someone else avoid those same lessons. 

So, from another cheater, you can't fathom the prices you are going to pay for having an affair. I certainly would never have believed how large a hole it was going to tear in my soul. I will carry the scars of my actions for the rest of my life. There are many of them, ones from the pain you inflict on those you love, ones from the pain you inflict on the person you made a promise to, but the worst are the scars from letting yourself down. From not being the person you want to be. If I had it to do again I would do anything - ANYTHING - before I participated in an affair. It is just simply not worth it. If your marriage is that unhappy - leave, make up your mind to fix it or break it, but don't continue in a lie. If for no one else for yourself. 

I have made friendships with a few other people on our side of the coin here, and all of them, to a person, will tell you that there is a haunting they carry from their actions that they can never seem to get rid of. When you participate in an affair you trade a piece of your soul that you can never get back. 

It's too late for you to avoid suffering these same consequences but you can keep from getting any deeper in and making the prices you'll pay that much larger. 

You say you are seriously considering ending your affair - do it. It's going to hurt like hell but do it anyway. IMO you also must tell your H, take ownership of and be accountable for what you have done, and pay the prices; but that's another thread...

Best of luck. What lies ahead of you is very difficult regardless of what path you choose. The truth will set you free.


----------



## AppleDucklings (Mar 27, 2011)

Kimberley17 said:


> Ok, let me rephrase.. I know it is wrong and yes I am doing it anyway. We ALL know it's wrong. Look, I was simply answering a question that was presented. Keep your attacks to yourself.


Not attacking. Simply telling you like it. You probably won't like it here very much because nobody here will tell you that what you are doing is okay, nobody will support your behavior. Instead you will hear constructive critism that you yourself will perceive as an attack. Many of us here, myself included, are the victims of infedility. If we can help you to see the truth about your actions, we will and this will include you hearing things you do not like. You have the choice to stop reading if you don't like it, but the truth is still the truth.


----------



## AppleDucklings (Mar 27, 2011)

Kimberley17 said:


> AppleDucklings- are you male or female? I will never tell him..


I am female. You do need to tell your husband. The truth always comes out one way or another, but it is better for you to confess than for him to find out through another source.


----------



## morituri (Apr 1, 2011)

Kimberley17 said:


> Yes, I have sat down and told him exactly what I need from him and some improved, some didn't. The problem is I have so much resentment that my feelings for him are not the same. Long before my affair started I was just going through the motions. I am no longer attracted to him and do not feel 'love' for him. I care like a friend.. I am not condoning my behavior and know it's 100% wrong. I am strongly considering ending the affair ...


Divorce him because you are stealing years away from him, years which he could be using to move on with his life and become a much happier man. *You don't have the right to steal his life away.*


----------



## Kimberley17 (Oct 10, 2011)

Thank you all.. sigma1299 your post was very thought provoking and I needed that. How did your spouse find out? Were you in love with the OW? How long was the affair? I am definitely not looking for support. as I said multiple time I KNOW what i am doing is wrong, very wrong. I often think it is so pathetic that I never even considered cheating until I was married. How sad is that?


----------



## Numb in Ohio (Oct 31, 2011)

Kimberley17 said:


> as I said multiple time I KNOW what i am doing is wrong, very wrong. I often think it is so pathetic that I never even considered cheating until I was married. How sad is that?



:scratchhead::scratchhead::


----------



## sigma1299 (May 26, 2011)

Link below to my thread that should answer most of your questions. Mine was an EA only, but a very intense one that lasted 8 weeks. My wife turned over my cell phone when a text from the OW arrived one evening, I could have lied my way out of it but I confessed it all that night. Did I love the OW?? That's always the million dollar question isn't it? No. I felt like I did, but even in the middle of it, despite telling each other ILY every day, rationally I knew it wasn't love. I just wouldn't let myself admit that it couldn't be, I didn't want to see it for what it was. Love can't exist in 8 weeks, or in an illicit relationship. It was B.S. 

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping...a-committed-wife-cant-get-ow-out-my-mind.html


----------



## notreadytoquit (Jan 11, 2010)

Kimberley17 said:


> Thank you all.. sigma1299 your post was very thought provoking and I needed that. How did your spouse find out? Were you in love with the OW? How long was the affair? I am definitely not looking for support. as I said multiple time I KNOW what i am doing is wrong, very wrong. I often think it is so pathetic that I never even considered cheating until I was married. How sad is that?


Actually it is really sad. I feel sorry for you but I feel more sorry for your husband. Just like Apple told you above, at least do the man a favour and give him the link to this site once this all blows up in your face(and it will because the truth always rises)


----------



## always_hopefull (Aug 11, 2011)

Nikki1023 said:


> POOR CHARACTER.
> 
> I dont buy into the whole..your not satisfying them..theyre unhappy..such a load of crap.
> 
> ...


:iagree::iagree::iagree:

I only divorced my exh as a last resort. I fought until the bitter end and still struggle with it, 3 months after the D has been finalized. He was verbally, emotionally, mentally and physically abusive to me. I went for an emergency ultrasound because they couldn't hear my son's heartbeat. I told him and asked him if he wanted to come. I never ever thought he would decline. He preferred to help his brother unpack boxes after he moved that day. I could write a story on how he has failed me and our marriage, piece of work my exh.

Did I cheat NO, my reason? I have been raised that there are only two things that are important to me, that no one can take away from me, they are my word and my family, without those I truly have nothing. Both of which I would be loosing by cheating. 

@ Kimberley17. Let me ask you one thing, from the sounds of it you are trying to protect your children from the hurt of divorce. How will you justify it to your children when the affair comes into the open? Are you ready and willing to hold your child sobbing in your arms because your H, their father is on antidepressants and can barely function, willing to hear how much they hate you and can't stand the sight of your lying face? How about when they look you in they eye and tell you that they wished you had died before their dad found out so he wouldn't have to hurt? The one that haunts me the most is when my daughter lay in my lap sobbing, she looked up at me with tears in my eyes and asked "mummy...since daddy cheated and I'm half daddy, will this make me a bad person, am I going to hurt my family like daddy hurt us?" I have her a hug and told her in the calmest voice I could muster, "no baby, this just means you have seen the pain of hurting your family, it will make you stronger later in life". I didn't know what else to say. Sadly these are all the things my children have said to their father in the last year after his affair came into the light. I might add it took 3 years, and it was a ONS, but none the less it came out, then the others came out. Stop protecting your own interests and focus on truly protecting your children.

PS, none of the above is meant as an attack. It's just a little insight into what the collateral damage may look like in the later years. When your children are a little older and able to understand the gravity of what you have been doing to their family, not just your H, but your family. I wish you well in figuring out this mess, and when Dday comes, I pray for a quick and speedy recovery for your H and children.


----------



## Kimberley17 (Oct 10, 2011)

always hopefull- I commend you for being so .. um, perfect. I am not like you obviously. How did his affair come out 3 yrs later??


----------



## always_hopefull (Aug 11, 2011)

I was getting messages through fb, from his exgf telling me she was seeing him whenever he was in town, and she wasn't the only one. He was also coming home at 4am after hanging out with his hockey buddies, which apparently he wasn't. I could go on and on, but that would be one hell of a post. LOL

There is always someone who will know what is going on, a friend, co-worker, nosy neighbor, always someone. I know you seem to be content with the way things are, but I would strongly advise you to get some IC, to prepare yourself in the event that your A is ever discovered.

Please know I am far from perfect, I never tried to be. I just loved my exh enough to stick with it, that and if you knew how stubborn I was you would know why it would be a feat to sway me from my path.


----------



## Trickster (Nov 19, 2011)

I have been with my wife for over 19 years now. I think most married couples have issues. some more than others. I have other post describing my situation. I am a talker and I always talk about how I feel. The last year or so, I have been reading many books on marriage at night before bed. When my wife sees me reading she kinda laughs. I usually just tell her something is wrong, I get angry a lot and I am trying to fix my part.

I would like it for her to read the same books. I even suggested a marriage counselor and all she says to that is that we will just have to compromise.

There is a huge component of our marriage that is missing. I have communicated that to her for years now and I am SOOO close to doing something I will totally regret. The only thing stopping me is that I do not want to hurt anybody. Not my wife, not my Daughter, Not the OW, and definitely what it would do to me. I would hold on to that guilt forever. It is all up to me at this point.

I am glad I read all the posts here as well as finding this whole message board. I am not alone in how I feel.


----------



## sigma1299 (May 26, 2011)

Already Gone - do you have a relationship with someone other than your wife already that you're contemplating taking to the next level or are you contemplating going fishing for an AP (affair partner). 

You know you don't have to compromise right? You can tell her that the marriage is unacceptable in it's current form to you and that if she is not willing to work on it that is her choice but it is then your choice to leave. That might wake her up...

See my post on page four to Kimberley17... For the love of God do not cheat....


----------



## Looking to heal (Jun 15, 2011)

My view is that there is a small percent of people who should not be married and cannot live monogamously (maybe 5% to 10%).

Other than them, I don't believe cheating is in a person's DNA it arises out of opportunity intersecting with weaknesses or vulnerable times in one's marriage.

The noble course of action suggested is rather than have an affair, you should end the marriage.

Question one might have is whether current feelings of disatisfaction, malaise, considering cheating... are they permanent or maybe in a few years things could get better.

I imagine if a person ends their marriage the noble way before cheating, other spouse will ask: "is there someone else ?" to which the reply is: "no but I am thinking about cheating so I will end the marriage first"

Maybe sometimes this has happened but seems to me this would be a fairly rare occurence.


----------



## lisa3girls (Apr 6, 2011)

Arnold said:


> I think mny cheaters, regardless of gender, have this expectation of clairvoyance from their spouses. Seems quite common among both genders.


Yep, mine starting making jokes about me throwing a party when he got to old to get it up anymore... I most certainly didn't feel that way, but he was joking about it. Then after I found out about the A, he tries to tell me that was a hint he was unhappy (after telling me many times I shouldn't hint about things...or that he couldn't read my mind). :scratchhead:


----------



## Grayson (Oct 28, 2010)

Kimberley17 said:


> Now why would I confess to my husband?? That is the worst advice I ever got.


Here's a wacky notion: do it because it's the right thing to do.

It may seem like a foreign concept to someone who's said, in so many words, that she knows her cheating is wrong, but she's content to do it anyway. Just as you have a right to be unhappy in the relationship, he has the right to make an informed decision to stay in the marriage, as well. And please drop the. "I'm staying for the children" smokescreen. You're staying for your own convenience...nothing more. If you were truly concerned about impacting the children, you wouldn't want to be providing them with such a poor example. By your own actions, you're teaching them that, if one is utterly miserable, the best way to handle it is to consistently cheat, lie, and rationalize away behavior you yourself describe as "wrong." You're teaching them that it's better to keep the proverbial band-aid on, allowing the wound to become infected and fester, rather than quickly yanking it off.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Arnold (Oct 25, 2011)

Kimberley17 said:


> always hopefull- I commend you for being so .. um, perfect. I am not like you obviously. How did his affair come out 3 yrs later??


You are not perfect? Who'd a guessed?


----------



## Kimberley17 (Oct 10, 2011)

Gee Arnold.. you're a comedian too?


----------



## Arnold (Oct 25, 2011)

It was kind of a hanging curveball , Kim.


----------



## rotor (Aug 28, 2010)

ChubbieOwl said:


> I hope it's okay that I post this, it is just a curiosity, not to resolve any fears or concerns for myself.
> 
> If someone is unhappy in their marriage and having sex or a relationship outside of the marriage secretly, then why not just get divorced? Why drag it out and stay together, dragging your spouse along unknowingly?
> 
> I want to say - I am not judging or trying be a troll or whatever, I am just genuinely curious and there are bound to be people on this board that can answer.


Why don't we take a trip to the dark side and find out. 

This is a forum for cheaters that I came across in my travels. I am not going to grace them with a proper link that can be indexed but I think most folks should be able to figure this out.

dub dub dub . d o c c o o l . c o m / f o r u m /

Personally I have found it to be disturbing but at the same time VERY educational because it gives a perspective that you don’t often see which is the thought process while they are cheating rather than the usual load of BS that you hear post D-day.


Regards,

rotor.


----------



## allthegoodnamesaregone (Nov 18, 2011)

rotor said:


> Why don't we take a trip to the dark side and find out.
> 
> This is a forum for cheaters that I came across in my travels. I am not going to grace them with a proper link that can be indexed but I think most folks should be able to figure this out.
> 
> ...


Had a look at that forum....makes one want to put a double barrel in your mouth before considering marriage again. What a bunch of childish, selfish, lying B%$tards.


----------



## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

Spouses cheat b/c they do not have the healthy boundries that will protect them. Boundries that are the walls that fight temptation, give spouses the understanding that what they are doing will cause them more harm then good in the long run.

I'm not talken about what other have to go through...but the fact that when you cheat you are cheating your self out of being the person you want to be. Just like the betrayed, the wayward will have this burden of not being the person they thought they would grow up to be.

Having healthy and strong boundries prevent one from letting there moral compass from straying. Understanding that the choice they are about to make or the enviorment they are about to enter will only lead to short term gradification and in the long run will not benifit them as a healthy individual as they grow.

I think if all the waywards and future waywards had boundries,period, alot of use would not be here!


----------



## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

Or I could give you the list of excuses my WW gave me ........


----------



## sigma1299 (May 26, 2011)

rotor said:


> Why don't we take a trip to the dark side and find out.
> 
> This is a forum for cheaters that I came across in my travels. I am not going to grace them with a proper link that can be indexed but I think most folks should be able to figure this out.
> 
> dub dub dub . d o c c o o l . c o m / f o r u m /


Man that's some F'd up sh!t right there. I was the cheater and that site makes me want to puke. OMG I can't believe that I wear the same label as those heartless, harlequin romance, morons. I'm going to flush my head in a toilet now...


----------



## notreadytoquit (Jan 11, 2010)

rotor said:


> Why don't we take a trip to the dark side and find out.
> 
> This is a forum for cheaters that I came across in my travels. I am not going to grace them with a proper link that can be indexed but I think most folks should be able to figure this out.
> 
> ...


ok I took a quick look and it absolutely made me sick! These people are two headed monsters. Sorry I don't have a kinder word for them.


----------



## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

notreadytoquit said:


> ok I took a quick look and it absolutely made me sick! These people are two headed monsters. Sorry I don't have a kinder word for them.


I've seen that one and TOW. It certainly will trigger you if you're still new from DDay. But it is educational looking at the perspectives from the other side, and it absolutely validates what you learn here at TAM and other infidelity support sites:

1. They are almost always deathly afraid of exposure.
2. When caught, deny, deny, and deny.
3. When you can't deny, then TT
4. After DDay, take a break, or take it underground
5. That affair sex, or the anticipation of affair sex is so hot because of the thrill of doing something taboo/sneaky
6. The affair addiction is so strong that they will not stop, or until they get a new AP.

For the BS:
1. That computer and cell monitoring software works
2. VARs are a must.
3. The biggest of course, is NC and VERIFYING the NC.

Some of them say they do browse these BS support boards. So they are watching. These are the unremorseful broken ones.


----------



## Arnold (Oct 25, 2011)

Egads, what a site! I had no idea , even after having been through this in two marriages, that women could be so evil ( I knew men could).


----------



## AppleDucklings (Mar 27, 2011)

lordmayhem said:


> I've seen that one and TOW. It certainly will trigger you if you're still new from DDay. But it is educational looking at the perspectives from the other side, and it absolutely validates what you learn here at TAM and other infidelity support sites:
> 
> 1. They are almost always deathly afraid of exposure.
> 2. When caught, deny, deny, and deny.
> ...


What is TOW?


----------



## Geoffrey Marsh (Aug 11, 2011)

notreadytoquit said:


> ok I took a quick look and it absolutely made me sick! These people are two headed monsters. Sorry I don't have a kinder word for them.


Wow.....completely evil. 

I only read for a few minutes...it's all I could take.


----------



## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

AppleDucklings said:


> What is TOW?


The Other Woman forum


----------



## AppleDucklings (Mar 27, 2011)

lordmayhem said:


> The Other Woman forum


Is that an actual website?


----------



## AppleDucklings (Mar 27, 2011)

AppleDucklings said:


> Is that an actual website?


Okay...I googled it and I was one post away from banging my head against a wall and throwing up. Some crazy ass people. Especially the post I read from the woman who was dating a married man, and that married man is now dating someone else and she was appalled by his behavior. Really now!!!
It makes me want to make an undercover profile and use all the nonsense cheater speak just to see how much they would "understand and sympathize" with me.


----------



## Oregon38 (Sep 19, 2010)

rotor said:


> Why don't we take a trip to the dark side and find out.
> 
> This is a forum for cheaters that I came across in my travels. I am not going to grace them with a proper link that can be indexed but I think most folks should be able to figure this out.
> 
> dub dub dub . d o c c o o l . c o m / f o r u m /


I took a look at that website and was browsing almost 30 minutes around. Some seriously crazy s**t going on there. It wouldn't surprise me if I would find some posts from my ex-wife there. She would definitely be in good company.

TAM looks almost like kindergarten stuff compared to that cheater site.


----------



## YinPrincess (Jul 31, 2011)

I've never cheated in my life, but sometimes the thought enters my mind, (no other person in particular), just someone who would think I was special and treat me as such. Asking my husband for positive attention usually results in a negative, hurtful and often condescending reaction. I married him, though, so I will be faithful. I have pretty much zero hope that he'll ever change the way he treats me, though. It's a depressing thought.

Just wanted to add, that even though I don't feel it's "right" to enter into someone else's life and ask them to change who they are... Having someone who's level of attention has dropped off into the comfort zone within a year of living together, I can see how and why some people cheat.

All I ask of my husband is to act like he gives a damn about me, that he thinks I am important and worthwhile, and that he could say a nice thing or two once in awhile. Am I asking for much? To me, no, I am not. To him, I'm being needy, insecure, blah blah blah. It's always a negative reaction, no matter how I approach it. 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## morituri (Apr 1, 2011)

YinPrincess said:


> *I've never cheated in my life, but sometimes the thought enters my mind, (no other person in particular), just someone who would think I was special and treat me as such. Asking my husband for positive attention usually results in a negative, hurtful and often condescending reaction. I married him, though, so I will be faithful. I have pretty much zero hope that he'll ever change the way he treats me, though. It's a depressing thought.*
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


That is a very touchy situation you find yourself in YP. If you choose to continue being married, you are going to have to set boundaries that will keep you from having an affair. If you don't then it is just a matter of time when the perfect storm shows up at your door and catches you vulnerable and unprepared.


----------



## YinPrincess (Jul 31, 2011)

I know it is. I never thought I'd ever say what I've said here, but I am confident that I will never cheat, not even an EA, because I don't allow anyone near me. I've had many opportunities, and I know I couldn't live with or like myself if I did. There would be no justifying it. I have enough integrity in me to know when things feel wrong. I love my husband very much; I just wished he loved me too.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## OhGeesh (Jan 5, 2010)

Everyone has their own experiences and here are mine. As far as the guys I know its solely about boredom.....it was and is a game! All were married for years then started cheating lieing to everyone some got caught some didn't. More common lately I see with coworkers in their 40's is women for hire. $300-$700 for 2-3hrs of crazy fun is worth it to these guys. To be honest the few pics I've seen some of these girls 25 are gorgeous...but that's another story altogether.

All of the women I know that had affairs left their husband to be with the other man. Totally different mentality in the my experience they seemed to be truly lacking something. While the guys weren't they just wanted some differerent flavored koolaid.

For me I have never cheated....thank gosh!! If I did it would be because I was selfish and it would be the cake and eat it too problem. My wife is awesome, but imo guys get bored no excuse for it at all but its the truth......I don't know many guys that don't like the thought of some non committal strange.

The internet makes it all to easy!! 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

million$bby said:


> I have not cheated but think about it constantly. I am soo lonely and yes I have sat down and told him exactly what I needed and he is not willing or doesnt get what I am trying to tell him. I am so upset all the time it is affecting my health. I love him soo, I am so hurt and so upset I dont know what to do. I am in so much pain I want him to hurt like I do. I do not understand what happened and why. I feel like he is cheating on me though I have no proof. I am tired of trying to make this work. I feel betrayed! So why do people cheat could it be they are at the end of their rope, that maybe they want to feel some thing other than pain. I have been up all night trying to figure out why my life has turned out this way.


Don't succumb to the dark side. Cheating isn't going to take your pain away. Try to insist on MC and IC for yourself. If he refuses MC, then you may have to start D proceedings.


----------



## Numb-badger (May 18, 2011)

million$bby said:


> I have not cheated but think about it constantly. I am soo lonely and yes I have sat down and told him exactly what I needed and he is not willing or doesnt get what I am trying to tell him. I am so upset all the time it is affecting my health. I love him soo, I am so hurt and so upset I dont know what to do. I am in so much pain I want him to hurt like I do. I do not understand what happened and why. I feel like he is cheating on me though I have no proof. I am tired of trying to make this work. I feel betrayed! So why do people cheat could it be they are at the end of their rope, that maybe they want to feel some thing other than pain. I have been up all night trying to figure out why my life has turned out this way.


Slapping a divorce paper in front of him may make him realise just how serious you are.
It has the added bonuses of allowing you to keep your integrity, him keeping your trust and - as I and many others will assure you - he will thank you for it later when it settles in. Don't be suprised to hear something along the lines of:
'I'm so glad you woke me up by filing for D rather than cheat on me. I don't think I could have recovered from that.'

Best wishes

N-B


----------



## Geoffrey Marsh (Aug 11, 2011)

I think people cheat because it is easy to do.  Simple as that.

Much easier than working on a marriage or divorcing. 

Some people have said that they have thought about cheating....because their spouse doesn't do this or that or whatever...I guess this is the "need" that they need fulfilled?


Some say they have tried to talk to their spouse...and I believe they have....some people have to be hit up side the head before they will see a problem...I used to be like that. 

Anyways...cheating is easier than dealing with your problems head-on. At least until D-day.


----------



## morituri (Apr 1, 2011)

As much as I may sound like I a divorce happy guy, I seriously believe that it is only after a spouse has filed for divorce that the gauntlet has been thrown to the other spouse to show if he/she really cares or not. It MAY be the wake up call needed by the complacent spouse to take action or it may prove beyond the shadow of doubt that he/she really doesn't care for his/her spouse. In any case, filing for divorce would end all speculation as to the whether the marriage is salvageable or not.


----------



## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

I emotionally cheated (on my ex) because I was too weak to just tell him I was leaving. Selfishly, despite the craphead he was, I just chose to take care of me....and not give a rat's ass about the "us". I was done, mentally...and I simply didn't care anymore.


----------



## Sparkles422 (Jun 3, 2011)

I know why mine did:

Pride and male ego. He wanted to prove he was still manly and so he seduced this person who has been married a VERY long time and bought a motorcycle and became one of those 65 yr old greasers. Scared of death, scared of life....What a way to exist and he thinks he is feeling his oats again. Right, they sour after a while.


----------



## million$bby (Nov 1, 2011)

I just want to say I love my H more than I can say, I feel betrayed by his lack of concern for me and our relationship. I would never cheat on him. I do understand although, how people feel they are driven to that point. Marriage is very hard work. You cant always be in love, and do I believe there is a fine line between love and hate somedays. Absolutely! I am trying to build a relationship that will stand the test of time, some times it just feels like I am in it all by myself. There are so many things that contribute to the downfall of a marriage and I see what has contributed to our problems. I am trying to fix these issues, sometimes it is overwhelming and alot of the time I feel really mad at the lack of love and care in our relationship. I realize it is not just one sided I have been cold to my H over the years, and now that I see the light doesn't necessarily mean he is ready to. I hope we can make it work but if we cant at least I know I tried right up to the last minute and no matter what will always love him and want what is best for our family. Relationships are very confusing wish they came with a owners manual!


----------



## allthegoodnamesaregone (Nov 18, 2011)

million$bby said:


> I just want to say I love my H more than I can say, I feel betrayed by his lack of concern for me and our relationship. I would never cheat on him. I do understand although, how people feel they are driven to that point. Marriage is very hard work. You cant always be in love, and do I believe there is a fine line between love and hate somedays. Absolutely! I am trying to build a relationship that will stand the test of time, some times it just feels like I am in it all by myself. There are so many things that contribute to the downfall of a marriage and I see what has contributed to our problems. I am trying to fix these issues, sometimes it is overwhelming and alot of the time I feel really mad at the lack of love and care in our relationship. I realize it is not just one sided I have been cold to my H over the years, and now that I see the light doesn't necessarily mean he is ready to. I hope we can make it work but if we cant at least I know I tried right up to the last minute and no matter what will always love him and want what is best for our family. Relationships are very confusing wish they came with a owners manual!


God bless you for trying, I wish my wife had. It's been four months for me since my wife left, I don't think she spoken more than four sentences to me since she's been gone. You'd think 24 years would worth fighting for...


----------



## notreadytoquit (Jan 11, 2010)

morituri said:


> As much as I may sound like I a divorce happy guy, I seriously believe that it is only after a spouse has filed for divorce that the gauntlet has been thrown to the other spouse to show if he/she really cares or not. It MAY be the wake up call needed by the complacent spouse to take action or it may prove beyond the shadow of doubt that he/she really doesn't care for his/her spouse. In any case, filing for divorce would end all speculation as to the whether the marriage is salvageable or not.


Yeah but sometimes these cheaters beat you to the punch line and file first. What hurts me the most is that he has never voiced anything, he has never said "this does not work let's try counselling" or anything similar. It is very hard to move on without closure. And what makes it even more strange he went after a woman who is 13 years older than me and 7 years older than him(she is not rich) so people must think that I am this horrible person that he had to leave me for even older woman.


----------



## morituri (Apr 1, 2011)

notreadytoquit said:


> Yeah but sometimes these cheaters beat you to the punch line and file first. What hurts me the most is that he has never voiced anything, he has never said "this does not work let's try counselling" or anything similar. It is very hard to move on without closure.


If the cheater filed first then we know that he/she doesn't want to remain married. What else is there to discuss?

Why do you value any words that would have come out of his mouth over his actions?

Closure comes when we accept and embrace the painful truth that the person we believed loved us above all others, is either gone or never existed. Closure comes when WE betrayed spouses, come out of our own fog.


----------



## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

That is a great post, Mori.


----------



## notreadytoquit (Jan 11, 2010)

morituri said:


> If the cheater filed first then we know that he/she doesn't want to remain married. What else is there to discuss?
> 
> Why do you value any words that would have come out of his mouth over his actions?
> 
> Closure comes when we accept and embrace the painful truth that the person we believed loved us above all others, is either gone or never existed. Closure comes when WE betrayed spouses, come out of our own fog.


And that is the difficult part Morituri. When I think that I spent two years fighting infertility to have a child and to know that he might have never wanted it(he does care about him now) and to know that you were actually never loved, that hurts a lot. I don't know how any normal human being can get over that.


----------



## AppleDucklings (Mar 27, 2011)

notreadytoquit said:


> And that is the difficult part Morituri. When I think that I spent two years fighting infertility to have a child and to know that he might have never wanted it(he does care about him now) and to know that you were actually never loved, that hurts a lot. I don't know how any normal human being can get over that.


The first time my now exhusband left me, was back in 2003. 6 weeks after he walked out, I discovered I was pregnant. (Which meant I got pregnant right before he walked out on me) I went through my entire pregnancy alone. He did not go to one doctor's appointment with me. He did not once asked how I was. He did not even acknowledge that I was pregnant because it made the ow of that time, uncomfortable. He was not even present for our daughter's birth.


----------



## always_hopefull (Aug 11, 2011)

AppleDucklings said:


> The first time my now exhusband left me, was back in 2003. 6 weeks after he walked out, I discovered I was pregnant. (Which meant I got pregnant right before he walked out on me) I went through my entire pregnancy alone. He did not go to one doctor's appointment with me. He did not once asked how I was. He did not even acknowledge that I was pregnant because *it made the ow of that time, uncomfortable*. He was not even present for our daughter's birth.


Are you freaking kidding me? Those two don't deserve the Karma Bus, they deserve the Karma Steamroller. Piece of work those two. By the way, love the new avatar


----------



## YinPrincess (Jul 31, 2011)

AppleDucklings said:


> The first time my now exhusband left me, was back in 2003. 6 weeks after he walked out, I discovered I was pregnant. (Which meant I got pregnant right before he walked out on me) I went through my entire pregnancy alone. He did not go to one doctor's appointment with me. He did not once asked how I was. He did not even acknowledge that I was pregnant because it made the ow of that time, uncomfortable. He was not even present for our daughter's birth.


This makes me really sad. How could he do that... I gripe about my husband not being there, but yours really wasn't THERE for you! Being pregnant and hormonal for the last five months, I could not have withstood that, as selfish as it seems. You must be a very strong woman... I don't know what I would do, even without minimal care or concern... How dare him just abandon you like that. I'm just so sad and emotional reading this, and so very sorry you had to go through that. 

Thank you for sharing this. My hubby is a real pain... Very difficult to get along with and please... But at least he goes with me to the appointments. You deserved so much more than what you got. I'm so very sorry! 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## AppleDucklings (Mar 27, 2011)

YinPrincess said:


> This makes me really sad. How could he do that... I gripe about my husband not being there, but yours really wasn't THERE for you! Being pregnant and hormonal for the last five months, I could not have withstood that, as selfish as it seems. You must be a very strong woman... I don't know what I would do, even without minimal care or concern... How dare him just abandon you like that. I'm just so sad and emotional reading this, and so very sorry you had to go through that.
> 
> Thank you for sharing this. My hubby is a real pain... Very difficult to get along with and please... But at least he goes with me to the appointments. You deserved so much more than what you got. I'm so very sorry!
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Yeah, it was a pretty hard time. There was more to it. When he moved out to go live with the other woman of that time, he also stopped making our house payments. I was only working part-time, about 15 hours a week, so there was no way I could afford the bills on my own, and with now being pregnant, I was not going to be able to get work either. My two boys were 5 and 6 yrs old. The house (which I loved so much) was foreclosed on and I was forced out. I was now by this time, 8 months pregnant, with two young boys and I was completely homeless. In the meantime, my husband brought himself a brand new car and would take his ow on weekend trips to Chicago, Indianapolis, Des Moines...I moved into my parents house where I shared one bedroom with the children. (we slept on bunk beds) When I had my daughter, he was notified that I was in labor. He came up to the hospital but stayed in the parking lot because if he went in, it would make the ow uncomfortable. And he was worried about her because she was at home crying because his crazy wife was having "her man's" baby, so the nice guy that he was, didn't want her to feel more worried than she already did. (awwww) Well, after her birth, he decided he wanted to be a dad to her and began coming around to spend time with us...during this time, the house we had owned was still in the foreclosure process and I had left all my belongings in the house. I was finally trying to get a step back up in life. I had gotten food stamps, and found a 2 bedroom low-income apartment I could live in. When I had to move to my parents house, all I took with me was one box of clothes for the kids, one box of clothes for me and a tv. I left everything else in the house. One day, I went over to the house to see what all there was still to go through. I walked in to an empty house. My husband and the ow took everything out. The furniture, the appliances, the plates, dishes, the rest of my clothes, the kids stuff...they took everything, and because we were still legally married I could not do jack crap about it, it was his stuff too. Once again, I was left with nothing. They did this for no other reason than to be azzholes for they already had a fully furnished apartment together. (that is what he told me when I called him up and yelled at him about taking the stuff) Thankfully, all the very nice members of my church joined together and donated to me everything I needed from a couch to beds to plates. I was able to move into my apartment. The worst part of all of this is that when our daughter was one and a half years old, he asked me if I would take him back....and I did. :banghead: I stayed with him for another 6 years, then I divorced him in June 2011.


----------



## AppleDucklings (Mar 27, 2011)

always_hopefull said:


> Are you freaking kidding me? Those two don't deserve the Karma Bus, they deserve the Karma Steamroller. Piece of work those two. By the way, love the new avatar


 Thanks! We gotta encourage our friends to keep poochie's teeth clean!


----------



## YinPrincess (Jul 31, 2011)

If I were in your shoes I probably would have become incarcerated before the baby was even born.

He was just outright coldhearted and inhumane. It stuns me that we share the planet with people like this! As much as I believe in Karma and duality, I really don't think I wouldn't have done something... Okay, A LOT of vengeful things. I sincerely would have become someone I don't want to be. (The hormones made me do it)!

All kidding aside, I am really sorry. I hope you are better off without him and experiencing the love and support you truly deserve. This is unbelievable to me. Words just can't express how sorry I am you had to go through that. 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## AppleDucklings (Mar 27, 2011)

YinPrincess said:


> If I were in your shoes I probably would have become incarcerated before the baby was even born.
> 
> He was just outright coldhearted and inhumane. It stuns me that we share the planet with people like this! As much as I believe in Karma and duality, I really don't think I wouldn't have done something... Okay, A LOT of vengeful things. I sincerely would have become someone I don't want to be. (The hormones made me do it)!
> 
> ...


I was in my own fog. A very, very, very thick, thick fog. I also found the wrong support group. I found a group of betrayed women who encouraged me to do whatever my husband wanted and that would show him I loved him. No arguments, no harsh words, only loving kindness...I wish I would have found TAM instead.


----------



## YinPrincess (Jul 31, 2011)

You took the high road - there is no shame in that. I don't know I could have, even if in my heart I want to be a good person, I would have self-justified doing all the wrong things. 

In the end, it's his loss. If he just abandoned you like that, left you to struggle with children, all the while being the 'sensitive' guy for his homewrecking gf - you didn't lose a damn thing. You gained a life without a toxic person... And that's priceless!!! :smthumbup:
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## sigma1299 (May 26, 2011)

Apple. I now have a better appreciation for where the terms "asshat" and "skankasauruswrecks" came from. Given what that guy put you through your outlook on life is amazing. Love the new avatar to!!!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## morituri (Apr 1, 2011)

sigma1299 said:


> Given what that guy put you through your outlook on life is amazing


Yes she is amazing. Any man would be lucky to have her love for him.


----------



## AppleDucklings (Mar 27, 2011)

morituri said:


> Yes she is amazing. Any man would be lucky to have her love for him.


Awwwwwww Mori, you just made my day! Thank you.


----------



## rossyj (Nov 24, 2011)

allthegoodnamesaregone said:


> Kimberly17, just a question, did ever really sit down with Hubby and say " Hubby I really having some problems with "X" and it has to change" I don't know anyone whose wife cheated ever did that, my own included.
> 
> Most of us men don't get hints from from a woman's actions or behavior, we've lived with years of weird stuff every month, PMS, PMT, issues with body image, child birth etc. and are told it's all normal in married life. If you don't club us with it over the head we DON"T GET IT!


Can't speak up for all, but for me it wasnt about him anymore, it felt like survivor mode... 
And yes, i did sit down to talk to him about our issues. I tried for close to 7 months to explain and start changing thing but ... what do you do when the only reply every time is .. "it's not my problem really" It isnt easy talk when the issues are with the sexlife but this is a reply no wife should ever hear from her husband, not if he isnt prepared to deal with the results.
I felt betrayed, hurt, and totally worthless after 7 yrs of marriage, where the last 2-3 have been spent to deal with him being depressed and me trying to figure out what's happening.
So, i got my 3rd "but it isnt my problem" answer, he went to bed and sound asleep, i spent the night crying and wanting to disappear ... then the morning came and he left to work as if nothing ever happened. 
Me, still crying i went straight to the person i knew that loves me ... i have known him for few years, he never said a word before but i knew how he feels about me ...

I never cared to hide my affair, well 3 dates to be exact, in my mind i was done with my marriage. So my husband caught up on it and of course confronted me. After long discussions we have decided to try and fix our marriage. My affair was never just sex and it wasnt fair to the man, since we both knew i am not in love with him. Now, almost 4 years later, he still checks on me every few months on the phone. 
Unfortunately, i dont think my marriage got really better. I do know my husband loves me in his way ... i'm just not very sure my heart loves him as much as before.

all in all, for me the cheating was more of selfvalidation and keeping somehow my hurt soul in one piece and out of dark dark place.

ouch, this turned really long - sorry


----------



## Patricia B. Pina (Nov 22, 2011)

Because they are sadist and get thrill when they see someone else in pain.


----------



## snap (Oct 3, 2011)

Patricia B. Pina said:


> Because they are sadist and get thrill when they see someone else in pain.


I feel this statement is true for a huge proportion of cheaters.


----------



## HusbandInPain (Nov 8, 2011)

I think that's a little harsh tbh. 

I think cheaters are selfish and self centered. They are unrealistic and inconsiderate. But by and large I do not believe they actually set out to hurt the people that are married to. They just lose sight of the fact that they are supposed to be married ad get wrapped up in personal, selfish motivations.


----------



## Geoffrey Marsh (Aug 11, 2011)

rossyj said:


> what do you do when the only reply every time is .. "it's not my problem really"..


You file for divorce and not cheat.


----------



## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

Geoffrey Marsh said:


> You file for divorce and not cheat.


:iagree:

But that would be the honorable thing to do. But noooo, that would be too difficult. It's so much more easy to cheat, since that's the easy way to fix the situation.


----------



## Trickster (Nov 19, 2011)

sigma1299 said:


> Already Gone - do you have a relationship with someone other than your wife already that you're contemplating taking to the next level or are you contemplating going fishing for an AP (affair partner).
> 
> You know you don't have to compromise right? You can tell her that the marriage is unacceptable in it's current form to you and that if she is not willing to work on it that is her choice but it is then your choice to leave. That might wake her up...
> 
> See my post on page four to Kimberley17... For the love of God do not cheat....


I have bee thinking about your question for several days now and it's hard to answer. It's not a black or white question, so I thought. I've been watching myself and although I am not "fishing" I may be testing the waters. There are several women who are flirtatious with me and I like that. Although there seems to be some chemistry, I can't imagine any type of relationship with anybody... Well, maybe imagine, but that's it! 

When it comes down to it, with the perfect women, with the right environment, and even with a little alcohol, I would not cheat on my wife. It almost happened before to me. Where Everything was there for the taking with a very aggressive women and I turned it down. All that did was to open Pandora's box. There are several women who are not shy with their feelings. I just wish I felt that my wife loved or desired me and made me feel like I feel when I am near the other women. My wife and I haven't said I love you in over a year. So now when just a touch of their hand on my thighs sends electricity through my whole body. So far it's all innocent and I don't think that I crossed the line.


----------



## sigma1299 (May 26, 2011)

AG - If what you posted is as far as it's gone it doesn't sound like you've crossed a line to me either. The litmus test is what would your wife's reaction be if you told her. You are dancing on a slippery slope my friend but at least you know it which helps. Hopefully you read my post to Kimberley17 and some of my others imploring people not to cheat so I'm not going to beat that horse. What I'm going to point out is that if your needs are being so badly neglected I'm confident that your wife's needs are in just as bad a shape. What kind of marriage is it where husband and wife haven't told each other they love one another for over a year? I can't imagine it. 

So my advice - fix it or break it. Do whatever it takes to fix it or try so hard that it comes apart. Neither of you is feeling the love from the other. Communicate - figure out what it takes to reconnect. Marriage counseling is the obvious suggestion but if she won't go for it just talk to her. Hell write her a letter - anything just start communicating. If the connection just isn't there then end the marriage. No one likes to fail but as long as everyone behaves honorably there's nothing wrong with admitting that maybe it's time to amicably dissolve the marriage. If nothing gets through to her tell her that either the two of you are going to marriage counseling or you're going to an attorney, she gets to pick. If she still wont commit go get some papers drawn up, you can always throw them in the trash and maybe it will make her realize how serious this is. What have you got to lose, I don't think you're going to stay where you are one way or another.

You are testing the waters - stop it. Put that energy into your marriage until it gets better or it gets over. Even what you are doing is marginally a form of cheating. Give it your best shot and let the chips fall where they may. Again - for the love God do not cheat.


----------



## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

did you ever hear the expression "A (man) is as loyal as his options"?


----------



## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

I wish I knew how to paste a quote. Any way cheaters are not sadist, the furthest thing from there mind is others.

Sadist thinks about others and the pain they can inflicked...cheater, on the other hand only think about them selves.

The last thing on my WW mind was me, her husband, it was all about thier needs and thier happyness. She could care else about me or the OM......it was all amount the attention she got. It was all about the things *she* got out of the affair.

Hurting me or her family was the furthest thing from her mind. 


****************disclaimer**************
Sorry to generalize, there are some cheaters out there that have a moral compase way worse then my WW and find pleasure in doing on to others ...............


----------



## rossyj (Nov 24, 2011)

lordmayhem said:


> :iagree:
> 
> But that would be the honorable thing to do. But noooo, that would be too difficult. It's so much more easy to cheat, since that's the easy way to fix the situation.



I was just sharing my experience ... not seeking validation or anything really. 
Cheating doesnt "fix" a thing ... can only postpone decisions and make them harder to deal with. But also ... cheating isnt the reason for a relationship to dissolve - it is more of a sign things are not how they are supposed to be.
It's hard to keep sight of what's right and wrong when all you feel is this consuming pain and want to get away from it even for a second - just to be able to breathe again....


----------



## Grayson (Oct 28, 2010)

rossyj said:


> I was just sharing my experience ... not seeking validation or anything really.
> Cheating doesnt "fix" a thing ... can only postpone decisions and make them harder to deal with. But also ... cheating isnt the reason for a relationship to dissolve - it is more of a sign things are not how they are supposed to be.


Agreed that it is often a symptom as opposed to the problem itself. Doesn't make it any better a decision or any more conducive to the relationship's health.



> It's hard to keep sight of what's right and wrong when all you feel is this consuming pain and want to get away from it even for a second - just to be able to breathe again....


I disagree. It's not "hard to keep sight of what's right and wrong." You just don't give a large contented rodent's rear that it's wrong...it's all about getting the "pick me up," regardless of the source.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## rossyj (Nov 24, 2011)

Grayson said:


> I disagree. It's not "hard to keep sight of what's right and wrong." You just don't give a large contented rodent's rear that it's wrong...it's all about getting the "pick me up," regardless of the source.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


You kinda right ... i didn't care anymore - for me it was over and i was only taking care of my own sanity. 
After so many years of doing the right thing i got enough - i was able before to handle his divorce talk where he would ask to separate at night and move to sleep in the living room, just to call me at work the next day and ask me to figure out how to refinance our home together. Who the hell does that?! I know on my end i tried it all before slipping in the cheating zone ... but it takes two to tango...

Sadly, it is what took for him to decide he wants to keep "us" together. 
More sadly, after few years now he's getting back to his former routine and moving into same old mold ... so i am starting to think it isnt possible to save our marriage.


----------



## Numb in Ohio (Oct 31, 2011)

What about when they are caught cheating , then to make things better, they tell you to go out and do the same to hurt them so that they can consider it even,,,:scratchhead:

That's what my H told me.....
I told him that 2 wrongs don't make a right,,,DUH!!


----------



## Grayson (Oct 28, 2010)

rossyj said:


> You kinda right ... i didn't care anymore - for me it was over and i was only taking care of my own sanity.


I must once again disagree. "Taking care of your own sanity" would have been doing the right thing, the honorable thing, and putting an end to the bad situation once and for all.

No, instead, I would say you were "taking care of" something far different than your sanity.



> After so many years of doing the right thing i got enough - i was able before to handle his divorce talk where he would ask to separate at night and move to sleep in the living room, just to call me at work the next day and ask me to figure out how to refinance our home together. Who the hell does that?! I know on my end i tried it all before slipping in the cheating zone ... but it takes two to tango...


While I certainly agree that both partners normally play a part in the condition of a relationship reaching the point where one partner considers cheating, that's as far as that tango goes. Your husband may have been the most neglectful spouse on the planet, but he bears no responsibility for your decision to cheat. That choice was yours to make alone.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## ChubbieOwl (Nov 19, 2011)

Numb in Ohio said:


> What about when they are caught cheating , then to make things better, they tell you to go out and do the same to hurt them so that they can consider it even,,,:scratchhead:
> 
> That's what my H told me.....
> I told him that 2 wrongs don't make a right,,,DUH!!


Yes, that is a good point. I have a friend who was married and a man-*****. Once I asked him why he was married if he wanted to sleep with so many other women and he told me that 5 years ago his wife slept with his brother and this was his way of "punishing" her. He finally realized he was making himself miserable as well and left her.



Grayson said:


> I must once again disagree. "Taking care of your own sanity" would have been doing the right thing, the honorable thing, and putting an end to the bad situation once and for all.
> 
> No, instead, I would say you were "taking care of" something far different than your sanity.
> 
> ...


I agree with this statement.


----------



## sunshine93 (Sep 9, 2011)

allthegoodnamesaregone said:


> Me as well, everything I ever believed in about my 24 year marriage is now seems like a lie. If I'd had a chance to address what ever issues were bothering my wife and it didn't work out I could have handled that.



These are my thoughts exactly with my husband.  April


----------

