# Desire, but there's a wall...



## Equis (Nov 7, 2017)

Briefing: married 11 years, he had a ONS 5 years ago, changed jobs, quit drinking, domestic life is good but the romance isn't there. Hormones have been checked. 

I want to have an amazing sex life, but there's some things I'm not sure how to work on... I've never been a really overly sexual person, but it's even less now.

Sometimes I don't like being touched, by anyone. Husband , kids, family, anyone. No leaning, hugging, nothing. But it's not always.

Sex usually 1-2 times per month right now. Sometimes I'm not in the mood, sometimes I am but I don't want to initiate. 

The ONS stand was a huge hit to my self esteem, I'm over weight and have troubles losing it due to medications for autoimmune arthritis, which also causes fatigue... worsened by my long hours at work nursing. Two weeks ago my branch was shut down and now I'm unemployed, which adds to stress. Husband does not ever say I'm over weight or unattractive, this is my view. 

I'm not really comfortable discussing sex... We've discussed that out sex life sucks, but I don't know how to knock down these walls in the way. 

I have tried reading a couple books about opening up about sexuality, but they were not helpful for me.

Im open to suggestions... books, tutorials, can't afford counseling at this time, we did do mc for a year following ons.


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

You must first feel better about yourself. Image wise, health wise... You need to find a new position, here nursing has good potential. 

After all those you can think of the peripheral distractions including desire.

That's the summary. We can talk details if you prefer.


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## uhtred (Jun 22, 2016)

Have you eliminated physical causes? Are you on any medication? How is your health in general? Are you depressed?

Then, are you *really* interested in sex with him, or are you still angry that he cheated? You have a right to be angry - but if you are, its not surprising that there isn't much desire. 

If none of those are the issue, then I suggest just acting the way you would like to feel. See if in acting that way you end up feeling that way.


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## Spicy (Jun 18, 2016)

How old are you both?
Kids?


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

Is there more to this? Be really honest, is it all your health that has kept you out of shape or is also something else? Did you gain the weight after he cheated? Was it maybe a subconscious way to keep him physically away from you? Are you depressed? I think everyone has the right idea, even your post speaks of it. All of these things are tied together.

Can I make a suggestion? I was let go about 5 years ago for about 6 months, I remember how defeating this can feel. But how about you use the time to exercise every day for say 45 mins. Go at the pace you are able, maybe with suggestions from people who have your physical issues (swimming seems to be a good suggestion). I really believe this would change your life. First of all it gives you tangible goals and daily successes that help with depression. It also releases your bodies natural endorphins again helping with depression. It will also help you to just feel better. It's hard to carry around extra weight. It has the great side effect of helping you look better which will then help with your confidence. Confidence is going to help with feeling sexy. All of this stuff seems to hover around your issues. 

Now I bet you probably didn't want the get in shape pep talk, but I speak from experience in a way I lost some weight in the last year or so. It really does help you feel great. 

Also IC may be a thing for you. Finally what has he done to help you heal from the cheating? Did you rugsweep?


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## alexm (Nov 29, 2008)

Equis said:


> Briefing: married 11 years, he had a ONS 5 years ago, changed jobs, quit drinking, domestic life is good but the romance isn't there. Hormones have been checked.
> 
> I want to have an amazing sex life, but there's some things I'm not sure how to work on... I've never been a really overly sexual person, but it's even less now.
> 
> ...


So the desire is there, but just not the will, correct?

Sexual desire is equal parts physical and mental. You have the physical part down, now it's just the mental that has to be nailed down. I am going to assume you take care of your own needs, in order to lessen the physical desire, yes?

The mental aspect is very dependent upon how we feel about ourselves. Even within a marriage, it requires some confidence to initiate sex. Rejection is a terrible feeling for most - especially from those we love - therefore it's the brains natural way of avoiding pain. Just don't put yourself into a position to be hurt.

So, your husband had a ONS. That's painful. And the end result is that you felt rejected by him. He went elsewhere for something that should be for you only. So somewhere in your brain, you probably feel that being turned down for sex by him will give you the same, or similar, feelings. And that SUCKS. So instead, you wait for him to show interest, therefore you avoid getting hurt. And it becomes a cycle.

I can tell you that my wife has a similar mindset, in that she simply avoids situations that can possibly have a negative result. It, IMO, severely limits her in her daily life, but that's her prerogative.

She rarely initiates sex, and when she does, she doesn't exactly "put herself out there". Rather it's very subtle. Therefore if (and a big "if") it doesn't work, she didn't gamble much. Don't gamble much, you won't lose much. It's a pattern with her, and not just in sex.

Some people don't handle rejection well, or negative situations. People like my wife would rather walk that line, without having highs and lows. They'd rather be simply content the majority of the time, rather than be extremely high or extremely low. But that's life. I much prefer the latter. With highs come lows.

I believe my wife is like this because she has been hurt before (not by me) and it's become a defense mechanism. Hurt and pain is part of life, but some people feel they can skirt around that and avoid it all. You can't.


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## Young at Heart (Jan 6, 2015)

Equis said:


> ....I* want to have an amazing sex life*, but there's some things I'm not sure how to work on... I've never been a really overly sexual person, but it's even less now.
> 
> *Sometimes I don't like being touched,* by anyone. Husband , kids, family, anyone. No leaning, hugging, nothing. But it's not always.
> 
> ...


A few thoughts, you sound like you and your H (but mostly you) would be ideal couple to benefit from going to a sex therapist.

You seem to realize that you need to change yourself, which is an incredible bit of introspection and goes a huge way in solving the problem you want solved.

Please realize that your H is probably traumatized to a certain extent. Just as BF Skinner can use conditioning to train someone or Pavlov can train dogs to salivate when a bell rings, you may have been conditioning your H over part of your marriage.

When it is one of those times where you don't want to be touched, have you clearly indicated to you H that? Or does he try to touch you and never knows if he will be greeted by the woman who wants no touch or the woman who wants great sex? He may have been conditioned to not touch you and to not initiate sex. It could take a lot to change that conditioned response. 

You might want to think about starting the reconditioning process with him. If you are in the "I don't want to be touched mode" is there something you can wear a necklace or something that will make it obvious to your H what mode you are in? So he will know when he is likely to be rejected and likely to not be rejected? 

OK, when you are in the mood, why don't you want to initiate? You might want to do some introspection on that. Maybe see an Individual Counselor.

Have you ever heard about sensate focus exercises that you might do with your husband to increase your ability to possibly initiate sex or at least touch?

As to weight and self image. You know that these are your issues and you need to work on them, but is there any way your H can help motivate you and be your partner in making these changes? Seriously, he loves you and wants you to be happy. 

If for every 5 pounds you loose, can he provide you with a night off from dealing with the kids? If for every X pounds can he take you out to a romantic evening say dancing or a movie and then have him promise to make passionate love to you? 

On the other hand, can the two of you change life styles? Go to the gym together, go for walks together, take each other and your kids on hikes or bike rides on the weekend? Get yourself an exercise support group. 

Do you know what affirmations are? They are a form of saying things as a way of self hypnosis to get through to your subconscious so it will help you change. Affirmations are a great way to help in loosing weight and in improving self image. Actually having you husband record some affirmations that you listen to on a headset after relaxing might be a fabulous way to improve your self image. You can buy standard affirmation CD's on Amazon and download some on the web for free. Get your H to record some for you.

Good luck


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

Here's some free counseling... What OP describes is simple. She does not want to initiate if she's in the mood because that will be interpreted as her having desires and needs above and beyond the 1x a month routine. Such initiations raise the bar so to speak and that risks upping the frequency, which is not preferred.

It's what I call resistive desire for lack of a better word. You suppress the opportunity for reward (pleasure, bonding, etc) because you feel the risk of upping the frequency is too high.

That's where IC and eventually MC will help.


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## WilliamM (Mar 14, 2017)

That One Night Stand.

How did you two cope with that? What did he do to prove himself to you again?

My wife had an affair once. The hell she went through to get me to accept her after that was gruesome. I would not recommend that, but it must be something substantial. Truly substantial.


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## FrazzledSadHusband (Jul 3, 2014)

you may find articles on this site to be helpful - https://forgivenwife.com/

Also, as mentioned by someone else - did the ONS get dealt with or was it rug swept?


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## Equis (Nov 7, 2017)

Wow! Thanks everyone for replies!

Ok, I am on medications, they do affect my ability to loose weight. I know this, but it's still upsetting. I do ariel yoga 1-2 times weekly, but more often in the last couple weeks as I've not been working. Also horseback therapy to help with spinal mobility. We are very active people, we don't watch tv or sit around much ( 1 movie a week, no daily shows or anything). We have an acreage. Big yard. I swim in the summer but not in the winter (because it's cold here!) One of my medications is Cymbalta, it works for nerve pain and anxiety and depression. I don't feel depressed but I do have a history of depression. My previous job was very stressful, so in a way not having a job has been a relief of stress, but offers a different type of stress. 

I believe that overall the ONS was well dealt with. He took a month off work for medical leave, stopped drinking completely, and took a new position where he is home every night. Previously he worked away from home for over a week at a time. These were "expectations" of keeping the marriage. He often voices that he enjoys our marriage and is glad we're married. Overall, I have very few "episodes" where I feel sad about the ONS anymore, and often they're more fleeting thoughts than dwelling. But I think it would naive to say that there are no lasting effects from it. I'm not saying anyone thinks their spouse will cheat, but it was never a thought, there was never concern, and there was total trust that was shattered. I'm not a jealous person, was never worried when he was away for work. I found out through a drunken pocket dial that he was talking to a girl at a bar and I could hear that she was definitely inviting herself over to his hotel, and he obviously did not stop it. 

We are in our later 30's, two children ages 14 and 17. Both very independent and exceptional young adults. 


"Even within a marriage, it requires some confidence to initiate sex." This really spoke to me, I've been in two significant long term relationships in my life, the ones more than dating for a couple months. I do believe that I have a confidence issue with sex, I do not think it's due to the ONS, but most likely affected by it. With my ex he would usually initiate, and was more assertive I suppose. It's not that my husband and I had an amazing sex life that changed, it's never been amazing, we both acknowledge that. Before the ONS he watched a LOT of porn and it took a huge toll on our sex life because he couldn't get off easily, or sometimes at all. I actually didn't think about that until now. Quitting porn happened with the marriage continuation agreement. I have felt rejected at times from my husband, one time I came home in a sexy bra and panties, heels, and a cover up, but didn't really get a great response, when I brought that up he said it was nice but I didn't have "the actions"... that was hurtful to me because I put myself out there... 

I'll definitely have to do some more thinking because some of these things I've packed away and haven't thought about for a while apparently, but would definitely be significant pieces of this game. I am sure there are many factors to this situation, I don't feel that my repressed sexuality is a new thing, but probably gotten worse. My family did not talk about sex, my parents divorced when I was 8 due to my dad's infidelity. 

Due to not working right now, IC or MC is not really something I can start right now, but was hoping to in the future. 

Thank you everyone for suggestions, and thoughts. I look forward to any additional input.


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

Equis said:


> Wow! Thanks everyone for replies!
> 
> Ok, I am on medications, they do affect my ability to loose weight. I know this, but it's still upsetting. I do ariel yoga 1-2 times weekly, but more often in the last couple weeks as I've not been working. Also horseback therapy to help with spinal mobility. We are very active people, we don't watch tv or sit around much ( 1 movie a week, no daily shows or anything). We have an acreage. Big yard. I swim in the summer but not in the winter (because it's cold here!) One of my medications is Cymbalta, it works for nerve pain and anxiety and depression. I don't feel depressed but I do have a history of depression. My previous job was very stressful, so in a way not having a job has been a relief of stress, but offers a different type of stress.
> 
> ...


I am sad for you. You had it rough. All the things you listed are good. The biggest thing is you want it to change. Tell him about you wanting to change it, sex takes both of you changing this will take both of you. Also I think for many great sex doesn't happen over night (ha ha that sounds funny). So don't get disappointing if it isn't like instant results.

Anyway just keep at it. Sounds like you are a good wife.


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## TAMAT (Jun 20, 2015)

Equis,

I think the ONS was never dealt with completely. It's fairly common that affairs are not resolved even to a reasonable level but instead become a chronic pain which is tolerated. 

Did you H give you a full confession or did he claim to have forgotten the details, in which case you know he is still lying to you by omission. What I would suspect is that the ONS was actually the culmination of much longer but hidden emotional affair.

Did your H get tested for STDs? 

Did your H offer to take a polygraph?

Was the OWs Husband or SO informed.

Do you still live in the same area as the OW, or does your H still work with the OW.

Tamat


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## Equis (Nov 7, 2017)

TAMAT, I typed a copy of the whole situation... and my computer went down. So here's the briefing.

The ONS will never be dealt with completely, anyone who's been through infidelity knows this. 

The ONS was a drunk ONS, there was no emotional affair, not even sure where that came from, perhaps projection of some personal experiences? He was in this town for work for a week, he did not go there regularly. He is computer illiterate so would not have been something there. We were actually working on our marriage, trying to improve our sex life and was doing pretty well before the ONS. 

Yes he was tested for std's both immediately following as well as two follow up's with HIV prophylactic medications. 

While away from home he would drink over 12 beers a night and take sleeping pills. We don't know the OW's name, if she is married, or anything about her. He offered a full confession and answered all of my questions to the best of his memory. This occurred 3 hrs from home, it was not someone he worked with. 

He has changed positions now working where he is home every day, he has not drank in the last 5 years, no porn, he has stepped up and tries to provide me with my every want and need. My husband loved me from the second he saw me, he literally stopped in the road to stare at me... almost stalker like actually. When I picked him up from the work area the next evening (his ride was not going to be coming back for two more days, he left early) he handed me a baggy with his wedding ring, a lock of my hair, and my "instructions" of how to take care of me when I'm upset (a list that says snuggle me, listen to me, etc from when I had depression several years before this). I have no doubt my sober husband would have never done this, I'm not using that to justify what he did. It was wrong, it was painful, it destroy parts of me that can never be recovered. My husband is not a smooth talking womanizer, he's more like a walk up to a lady ask when they're due even if they're not pregnant because he doesn't know better guy. 

Although the ONS has definitely brought this issue out more, I believe it's a long lying issue that was there long before we married.


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## Slartibartfast (Nov 7, 2017)

You know, there's a foundation there that gives me hope for you. Here's my view. To say there are rough spots in this marriage is an understatement. But with the foundation that I believe is there, some good work can be done. Maybe. I say maybe, because it will, I think, require some combination of the kind of patience and caring that's going to have to be above and beyond the call of mere duty. 

You want to want to touch and be touched, want at least a shot at amazing sex. A shot is all anyone gets. It's not guaranteed. Sometimes, it can only be beautifully comfortable, and that's no bad thing. Most people, as you can readily see by reading this forum, would take that or even much less in an instant. Forget amazing. I don't even like that word. It sounds too much loaded with expectations, assumptions really. But even when it's beautifully comfortable, a sense of "that was amazing," in a gentle way, sometimes comes over one. So let's forget amazing for now. I think you'd be amazed if it just became beautifully comfortable. 

The point is, be patient. The seeds of what you are working on were planted a long time ago. You're not going to root them out in one go. And this can only work with some serious honesty, openness, and understanding. In other words, you both need to be in it together. And there needs to be a decent dose of reality. Because the reality that this is not an formula, not a plan with a schedule that will run along a track until it chugs into the destination one day. It's really pretty Zen, a work that won't ever really be over and done. But getting better, little by little, all the time is a great thing. 

So make things clear to each other. Forget the specifics or ONS's and drinking and porn and your illnesses and weight and everything else. That's one reason I think there's a foundation. You show signs of getting past those things, and he's not been a d**k and abused you about weight and such, which may not matter one whit to him anyway. Forget all that stuff. Tell him you want to want to be touched. Tell him however you need to explain that it's hard for you, and you can't say you will always respond or how long this will take, but that you will always, always be open to responding if you can. Especially that you will never, ever reject responding to punish, control or simply be one up on him. 

And he needs to be prepared to give you the opportunities to move toward, first, acceptance and then to comfort and then to desire. And he needs to know it won't progress like that. It might be comfortable one time and not the next. And at some point it might be desire and then not be the next time. (Hey! Just like married people.) But he needs to commit to providing the opportunities without being hurt or disappointed with it's not even accepted. So long as he knows you would have been more into it if there was any way for you to be. He just needs compassion. You're working on one thing here. One only. Nothing else must be allowed to intrude on that effort. You try. It works. you try. It doesn't work. You try, it works better. You try. It doesn't work at all. One day you try, and you both cry because you never thought it would be that comfortable. Maybe you're amazed. But give it time. 

To the extent that the two of you can be in it together with a commitment to gently keep at it as long as it takes, I don't see how you can fail. If there are little failures along the way, talk about them. Maybe you can't decide why it didn't work, but that's okay. Just agree that it's not important and that you will try again. It's up to you two to decide how often to give it a shot. It won't matter how often you're not in sync if you're both taking the attitude that it's better to see if it's a right time than miss a right time. He can't get his feeling hurt. You can't say, "You beast! Get away!" (Save the beast role play for after things improve.) And you get to say, "Try me. I feel touchy today." And he gets to say, "I don't think I can today." Equal access to truth. Just don't ever make up a reason to not try. It's okay to say, "I don't know why but..." 

You see the sort of thing I'm talking about. Work out how to do it for yourselves. Together. So long as both agree that the end is worth the effort, I think you'll make something of it that's a lot better than today. 

And some day, when you're well along and confident, just to validate my prurient imagination, when you're feeling rested and all touchy, holler at him. "Hey, bad boy. Wanna rock a fat girl who can make your eyes cross? Come get it!." Be gentle.


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## KatrinaR (Nov 10, 2017)

Equis said:


> "Even within a marriage, it requires some confidence to initiate sex." This really spoke to me, I've been in two significant long term relationships in my life, the ones more than dating for a couple months. I do believe that I have a confidence issue with sex, I do not think it's due to the ONS, but most likely affected by it. With my ex he would usually initiate, and was more assertive I suppose. It's not that my husband and I had an amazing sex life that changed, it's never been amazing, we both acknowledge that. Before the ONS he watched a LOT of porn and it took a huge toll on our sex life because he couldn't get off easily, or sometimes at all. I actually didn't think about that until now. Quitting porn happened with the marriage continuation agreement. I have felt rejected at times from my husband, one time I came home in a sexy bra and panties, heels, and a cover up, but didn't really get a great response, when I brought that up he said it was nice but I didn't have "the actions"... that was hurtful to me because I put myself out there...


Ouch, that would hurt, but good for you to make the effort. So the truth is you can initiate and have confidence. Know that and build from that. 

Unfortunately, your partner clearly has a history of rejecting you, whether intentionally or not. Sex has never been great, he watched lots of porn, ONS, and not a great response to your efforts dressing up. 

The good news is there is also a history and desire to improve both the marriage and sex life. Sounds like a mutual desire, at least prior to the ONS setback.

If that desire is still there and still mutual, there is hope. According to the Austin Institute for the Study of Family and Culture, 1 in 5 married couples haven't had sex in the last month, 12% haven't had sex in the last 3 months, and 6% haven't had sex in the last year. So you're not alone; it is common problem.

What may help is understanding the elements found in a sexually satisfying relationship. The Journal of Sex Research published a piece which looked at just that and found the following: 

"Sexual satisfaction and maintenance of passion were higher among people who had sex more frequently, received more oral sex, had more consistent orgasms, incorporated more variety of sexual acts, took the time to set a mood and practiced effective sexual communication. Almost half of satisfied and dissatisfied couples read sexual self-help books and magazine articles, _but what set sexually satisfied couples apart was that they actually tried some of the ideas_."

So, maybe there is a roadmap there that can help you both. I know it is hard but get back on the same page with a mutual desire to improve the marriage and once that is in place, make a point of initiating more frequently and trying new things. Spice is nice.

Best wishes....


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

And you will need to forgive him for rejecting you. Even though I know that is asking a lot. He needs to get his damn head on straight too though.


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## Equis (Nov 7, 2017)

Forgiving him, and keep trying can be two different things I believe. We used to shower together, we no longer do. I used to try giving him oral in the shower because I liked it, but he didn't care for it and would basically reject me... So that quit and he wonders why I don't do oral any more but he took the parts I liked away... 

Today I tried to flirt with him during the day when we saw each other, were both off but had appointments and errands, etc. This evening I said I'm going to go shower, I played with his nipples, he pulled away... I smacked his butt on the way out. I know this doesn't seem like a lot, but hey I'm trying here, and it's more than usual. Then I went and showered maybe 20 minutes, came back and he's watching stupid videos on his computer, he'd been working on the car and hasn't showered or anything which he usually does before any intimacy. I sat down in my towel and said oh I thought we were going to cuddle, which is kind of our let's have sex phrase ( my daughter and I have been gone since Friday) he turns off the computer, lays down, and literally starts snoring while I'm setting my alarm... 

When he watched pen ask of the time it got to the point that he couldn't even climax with me, that was a huge blow to my sexual self esteem and I think it has caused long term effects as well. 

Maybe I'm just desiring something that's not even really possible for us... over the weekend I saw a couple kissing passionately, like soft yet I just want to rip your clothes off. I was so jealous. We don't even kiss passionately, it's just like two sloths fighting over a chewed up piece candy... Our mouths don't work together. 

Sometimes I honestly think he'd be happier with someone else because I don't feel like I even make him happy.


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## Slartibartfast (Nov 7, 2017)

..


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## Equis (Nov 7, 2017)

I did talk to him about it today, he said he didn't hear me say anything about any snuggling... Ugghhh.


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## Slartibartfast (Nov 7, 2017)

..


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