# When you can't stand your spouse anymore, whose fault is that?



## hardcandy (Sep 16, 2014)

In the past year, I've reached a point where I can no longer stand my husband. Can it ever be my fault that I cannot stand him anymore?


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

What is up? How long married? Kids? What problems? Infidelity?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Nucking Futs (Apr 8, 2013)

hardcandy said:


> In the past year, I've reached a point where I can no longer stand my husband. *Can it ever be my fault that I cannot stand him anymore?*


Yep, it absolutely can be all your fault. Whether that's the case or not would depend on the details of your situation.


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## NoChoice (Feb 12, 2012)

OP,
Are you familiar with the word contentment? I read your other post and it seems you have an issue with life being too demanding and not allowing you your freedom. You also seem to regard motherhood as a nuisance rather than a privilege. Do you realize that you will never have a more important job than that of molding and shaping the next generation of the human species. The success or failure of your child will be in large part due to the lessons and training they receive in your care. How well they are equipped to deal with life and relationships is contingent upon your efforts as a mother. There can be no more important job on earth and yet you see it as a chore or a sentence. You talked of hobbies in your other post but rather than take up a hobby that you can do and still see to your child you want to take pole dancing which means leaving your child in the care of others while you dance. Your H is a good provider and seemingly a man of conscience and character but he is too controlling for you. You need more freedom to pursue other interests and you blame this lack of freedom on anyone but you. You even blamed your H for your pregnancy. You do realize that it's your body in which the egg is fertilized and therefore ultimately your responsibility to prevent it if you do not want a child. Or is that too much responsibility for you to be accountable for your own body. I think you should reevaluate your position and maybe look at the positives in your life to perhaps glean a different perspective on how bad your life really is. Perhaps you will mature in time. Hopefully you won't destroy your family before you get there. I wish you good luck.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

hardcandy said:


> In the past year, I've reached a point where I can no longer stand my husband. Can it ever be my fault that I cannot stand him anymore?


Your feelings are what they are. Accept that.

My bet is that you have both contributed to you coming to this point. Most likely neither of you is always right and neither of you is always wrong.

What is going on now?

What have you done since your lasts threads to do things to make yourself feel better about you. Let's look there first.

Did you start taking pole dancing lessons?

Have you started to drive again?

Have you found things to do that get you out of the house and round people and doing things you enjoy?


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## hardcandy (Sep 16, 2014)

Together 6 years, going on 3 years of marriage.

For me as a person, I feel great. I didn't take up pole dancing but started working out and am back to myself, tyvm. I meet up with a friend once in a while. I have moved on from the last time I posted about my marriage.

I love being a mom. However, if asking for some "me time" makes me view motherhood as nuisance then I guess we all are bad mothers. I didn't know being a mother meant, you can't want to do anything else and if you want to do something to increase your happiness, you're selfish. Sorry, this is just ridiculous thinking/judgment imo. I don't want to get into a "debate" about something based on opinions/personal perspectives. It's your opinion and I respect it.

Can you guys give me examples as to when one cannot stand their spouse is their fault? Say how they have contributed to the issue...and I will see if I've done any of it.


Thank you so much!


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## hardcandy (Sep 16, 2014)

Forgot to mention, there's no infidelity for either person.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

hardcandy said:


> For me as a person, I feel great. I didn't take up pole dancing but started working out and am back to myself, tyvm. I meet up with a friend once in a while. I have moved on from the last time I posted about my marriage.


These are positive things you are doing, that’s good.



hardcandy said:


> I love being a mom. However, if asking for some "me time" makes me view motherhood as nuisance then I guess we all are bad mothers. I didn't know being a mother meant, you can't want to do anything else and if you want to do something to increase your happiness, you're selfish. Sorry, this is just ridiculous thinking/judgment imo. I don't want to get into a "debate" about something based on opinions/personal perspectives. It's your opinion and I respect it.


All SAHM’s need “me time”. They should get it at least once a week to maintain their sanity. It’s not a selfish thing to want.
Since you do work out and do go out with a friend once in a while, you are getting some personal time. How much would you like to have?

Maybe we can all brainstorm about how you can get it.

Do you feel that your husband is doing things to prevent you from getting personal time?



hardcandy said:


> Can you guys give me examples as to when one cannot stand their spouse is their fault? Say how they have contributed to the issue...and I will see if I've done any of it.


When you say that you cannot stand your husband, I assume that means that you are very angry/upset with him.

If he did something wrong and you are that upset, you are justified. For example if he went out partying with his friend all weekend along, every weekend and spent no time with you, you would be justified in being angry with him. And you would be justified if you came to the point at which you could not stand him anymore. That is the result of his gross neglect of you.

On the other hand, let’s say that you want more time to yourself. Your husband will not help you with your child but he supports you, he does all the house work. So when he’s around you get no time to yourself if you are depending on him to help you get that time.
But if you have access to money (which you should) you have the power to make that time for yourself. For example you could find a local “mother’s day out program” where they can watch your children for 2-3 hours while you go get some time on to do things on your own. Some women do this a once or twice a week. 

You could hire someone to come to your house and watch your child, even when your husband is there. I used to do this. I hired a high school senior to do this a few times a week. When she was in college she still helped with my son. It worked out great.

Basically it would be unfair to be angry at your husband, and not be able to stand him, based on things that you have the power to change and make better on your own.

I don’t know if these fit what is going on with your relationship right now. But you gave no clue so I just posted here what came to mind.


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## southbound (Oct 31, 2010)

I assume you are asking if you not being able to stand your husband is logical? Let's face it, we all have feelings, and I've had feelings that i questioned before. If I always acted on a feeling without a little examination, I'd be in a pickle. With that said, I agree with EleGirl and her examples.

Is your not being able to stand him due to something really bad that he did or does regularly, or is it things you have control of, and perhaps you have expectations of him that he isn't meeting, yet, he really isn't doing anything terrible.


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## happy as a clam (Jan 5, 2014)

Are you still attracted to him? Or do you cringe at the the thought of having sex with him?


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## Prodigal (Feb 5, 2011)

hardcandy said:


> Can you guys give me examples as to when one cannot stand their spouse is their fault? Say how they have contributed to the issue...and I will see if I've done any of it.


I encroached on my husband's boundaries. He preferred to drink himself into a stupor. I preferred to beg, plead, threaten, lecture, and get into his business in an effort to get him to see the light and get sober..

That was my part in the debacle called a marriage. I made the futile attempt to get a drunk to stop drinking. It bothered me; that made it MY problem; not his.

People generally think they own one another's feelings; thus giving them a right to tell their partner what they need to do to make the marriage "right" from their perspective.

Do spouses have the right to have serious sit-down talks about issues and differences that are building a wedge between them? Absolutely.

But nobody has the power to control how another person behaves. That's why so many people come on here wanting to know how they can change their spouse. They cannot.


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## Blonde (Jan 7, 2013)

hardcandy said:


> I meet up with a friend once in a while. I have moved on from the last time I posted about my marriage.
> ...
> 
> Can you guys give me examples as to when one cannot stand their spouse is their fault? Say how they have contributed to the issue...and I will see if I've done any of it.
> ...



For example, if the friend you meet up with is male or if you have any other man in your life who is attractive to you and you find yourself comparing your husband to him and daydreaming about him or fantasizing about him.

That would cause you to view your spouse with unfair harshness.


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## NoChoice (Feb 12, 2012)

hardcandy said:


> Together 6 years, going on 3 years of marriage.
> 
> For me as a person, I feel great. I didn't take up pole dancing but started working out and am back to myself, tyvm. I meet up with a friend once in a while. I have moved on from the last time I posted about my marriage.
> 
> ...


I never meant to imply that you were a bad mother and I regret you taking it that way. My point was that incorporating "me time" into your parenting may require altering what it takes to improve your happiness or the perception thereof. Personally, I have found that happiness does not come from without but rather from within and that trying to find outside sources of happiness never meets with real success because once that thing is done and the "happiness" it brought fades, then it's on to the next thing. It's an illusive quest.

That was the context for the reference to contentment in my first post. I tend to think in a very linear, logical manner and it is not always received in the manner in which it was offered. In short, I was attempting to say is that if you want to be happy look inside first, then assess again. I wish you good fortune.


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## NobodySpecial (Nov 22, 2013)

hardcandy said:


> Forgot to mention, there's no infidelity for either person.


Why is it important whose "fault" it is?


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## Starstarfish (Apr 19, 2012)

> My point was that incorporating "me time" into your parenting may require altering what it takes to improve your happiness or the perception thereof.


AKA once you are a parent, you should change the activities and interests that define you and what makes you happy because you are a parent first, and a person second. 

That's the kind of mindset that encourages women to totally lose any sense of who they are or what they like and simply move into "mother mode." Which, while that might be wondrous for the cocooned growth of a new human being, usually does little for a marriage. How many men come here and say "my wife became a different person after we got married - she's not interested in anything and doesn't care about herself."



> Personally, I have found that happiness does not come from without but rather from within and that trying to find outside sources of happiness never meets with real success because once that thing is done and the "happiness" it brought fades, then it's on to the next thing. It's an illusive quest.


That might work for a more introverted personality, but for some people (myself included) one needs outside stimulation to indeed find happiness. That's simply how some people are wired.


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## MachoMcCoy (Oct 20, 2014)

It was my fault for causing it. Most of the damage was HER fault for not telling me for 10 years.


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## ChargingCharlie (Nov 14, 2012)

It's everyone's fault, and nobody's fault. I'm in the same situation - have two small children, and can't stand to be around my wife most of the time (goes without saying that sex in our house is an extremely rare event). My complaints with her are that she's immature, insecure, asexual, and a bit of a nag (has gotten better in the past year, but still has episodes). Don't have much to talk about besides the kids, and she's also afraid of her PITA, drama queen sibling who she'll ***** about, but if I say anything, I'm in trouble. Also tends to get stressed out about the kids (if she's at home all day while I'm at work, she can let me know how easy I had it, although to be fair, this also has gotten better in the past year). 

That said, I'm at fault as well. I'm not good at communicating (tend to keep a lot inside), have some PA tendencies, and try to avoid conflict. I tend to be a loner, and love to have down time, which is almost impossible with little kids. I love my kids dearly, but a lot of this came on when they came along. I often tell myself that I should have stayed single.

Point is - it's not really anyone's fault. If you can't stand being around him, not much you can do to control that. It's not a good situation, but it's there. Knowing what I know now, never would have married her, but easy to say now regarding what should have been done back then.


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## hardcandy (Sep 16, 2014)

Thank so much all for the replies! Sorry I haven't posted in a few days, was busy with Christmas. Hope you all had a good one! 

Based on what you guys have said, I'm happy to say I'm not doing any of those things, including what ChargingCharlie mentioned about his wife.

To answer Elegirl, personal time is really good now. Baby is older and more independent and I get 4hrs a night to myself. Husband is very supportive with my hanging out with my friend, who is a woman. So overall, I feel good in this department.

I'm not disgusted by him as we still have sex 2x week. It turns out that there is a side of him that I cannot stand and it has only affected me since we had the baby. 

While I was writing some of the events where I couldn't stand him, that made me wanna pack up and leave, it turned out they all have one thing in common: my husband tried to control every situation. 


So that's it! My problem is his controlling ways. 
I'm somewhat to blame because I used to try to keep the peace in our marriage and not really "fight" back. We fought so much before so I got tired of fighting but it looks like I got to the point where I can't take it anymore and hate him for it.

He likes to make decisions for everyone that he thinks it's best for them. 

What can I do to work with this? I have told him recently about his controlling ways. We ended up fighting 3x because I "fought" back. 

Is there any advice you have for me to work with a spouse that has a side that is so controlling. But then he also has a side that he's really cool and laid back.

Thanks again!

(If I forgot to answer anyone's question, my apologies! I'm responding on my phone and it's hard to see all the posts.)


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## hardcandy (Sep 16, 2014)

ChargingCharlie said:


> It's everyone's fault, and nobody's fault. I'm in the same situation - have two small children, and can't stand to be around my wife most of the time (goes without saying that sex in our house is an extremely rare event). My complaints with her are that she's immature, insecure, asexual, and a bit of a nag (has gotten better in the past year, but still has episodes). Don't have much to talk about besides the kids, and she's also afraid of her PITA, drama queen sibling who she'll ***** about, but if I say anything, I'm in trouble. Also tends to get stressed out about the kids (if she's at home all day while I'm at work, she can let me know how easy I had it, although to be fair, this also has gotten better in the past year).
> 
> That said, I'm at fault as well. I'm not good at communicating (tend to keep a lot inside), have some PA tendencies, and try to avoid conflict. I tend to be a loner, and love to have down time, which is almost impossible with little kids. I love my kids dearly, but a lot of this came on when they came along. I often tell myself that I should have stayed single.
> 
> Point is - it's not really anyone's fault. If you can't stand being around him, not much you can do to control that. It's not a good situation, but it's there. Knowing what I know now, never would have married her, but easy to say now regarding what should have been done back then.


I'm sorry to hear about your marriage. Your wife could just be really stressed out and could use a little pampering? Hope this is a phase for you guys and that you can find your way back to her.


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## LongWalk (Apr 4, 2013)

Book MC


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

hardcandy said:


> So that's it! My problem is his controlling ways.
> I'm somewhat to blame because I used to try to keep the peace in our marriage and not really "fight" back. We fought so much before so I got tired of fighting but it looks like I got to the point where I can't take it anymore and hate him for it.
> 
> He likes to make decisions for everyone that he thinks it's best for them.
> ...


So now you know the problem. It's not suprising that he fought back when you told him. That is typical. He sees this "taking control" as a good thing, a strength. He sees as an attack on himself and so has to defend himself.


I think that marriage counseling right now I a bad idea. why? Be cause will take it in the same light as he did when you told him that you are upset about his controlling ways. Plus, he is not 100% at fault here. You own 50% of that fault. 

Why? Because you have allowed him to be in control. You taught him that it's ok for him to take control and the argue his point with you until you give in.


I think that this can be solved by you working on yourself. If you change how you exercise control over the part of your life, household, marriage etc that is you domain then he will have to change in response. Use action to guide the two of you to change. Words are just noise. Find a good individual counselor who can help you grow in this way.

You could also post things that happened and maybe we can help you grow in this manner as well.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Also... do a google on "policy of joint agreement". this is what your goal should be for how you two make decisions on thing that impact both of you and your family.


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## hardcandy (Sep 16, 2014)

Yes, elegirl. He thinks he isn't doing anything wrong, but "kinda" agrees when I started pointing out his controlling ways. He is a good man, but sometimes I just really cannot stand him!!

Here is an example. This was our most recent situation that made me annoyed. We got into talking about death somehow. If you don't know, my husband hated the city we lived in, so we moved to another state. I didn't mind living in the city at all, and all my family is there, his mom and sister's family are there, too. So we moved; no regrets here as I don't really mind where we live. 

So since death was the topic, I said, "if you go, I'm taking baby and moving back to City X." He got so upset and told me I cannot do that. I asked him, "why not...it would be the best choice since my family (and his family) is there and I would need the circle of support. And baby can play with her many cousins and have grandparents, aunts, and uncles. Baby and I would have no one else here if you're gone." He then said that I have no right to do that, that he doesn't want his children growing up in City X and that they're his children, too so he can have a say. So I said, "I understand but if you're dead, why can't I make the decision that I think is best for me and baby. I would need emotional support, people to lean on if my husband died! And it would be good for baby to have so many family members around." He progressively got more upset and didn't show any understanding and kept saying I couldn't do that and I need to continue making a life here alone in this huge house we bought and that we worked hard to get ourselves out of City X and it would be for nothing if we went back. I told him that we moved to another state for him and that just because he didn't like CITY X doesn't make CITY X a bad place, that I didn't mind CITY X and actually prefer City X lifestyle to this surburban one, but as long as he is here, I don't mind this life. I also told him that he was way too controlling that he still wants to make decisions for me even while dead. He chuckled a little but then was still upset and was still clearly wanting me to say I'd stay here.

This is usually how he is when it comes to making decisions. He makes it look like what I want is completely absurd and wrong. 


I realize when it comes to the important things, I do stand my ground. And he does compromise. But I started to notice that my life is compromised because I allow the little things to slip through everyday or he would just control the situation.

That was a big situation. Here is a small everyday situation:

We would plan to go to the mall. So we go, 10 mins in, we got everything we needed. Then I would remember things like baby needs a pair of shoes or I just wanted to hang out a little with him and baby at the mall. He would make a face and rush me through and say he is tired (Probably due to his sleep apnea) and we need to leave and make it so uncomfortable for me. I normally would just say "ok, let's go." So I told him, why doesn't he just drop me off with baby or sit in the car with me so I can drive again (haven't driven in 10 years, pretty rusty and it's a new state) so I can do whatever the heck I want to do at the mall since he doesn't like it so much, he said he doesn't want to leave us alone. He has this fear that bad things would happen to us; he bought me a pepper spray. And normally, I would just say ok and let it go.

Sigh, here's another one. We were at a drive-in at Sonic. Person came out with our order and we gave her a tip. She said thanks and to ring her if we needed anything else and she left. I noticed there were only 2 ketchup packets for all the tots we ordered when she had already left and so I asked him to ask for more. He said no and that he doesn't do that, he doesn't want to inconvenience the person. I said "ok, no problem, I'll ask then." He got upset and said no and wouldn't let me and drove off. I got so angry and lost it.


Please tell me your thoughts. I know these examples can be "petty" to some people but they underline a bigger problem for me.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

The one about what you would do if he died.

He is clearly controlling. But this discussion was mixed with “death”. People can get very weird with death. His desire to control from the grave is a desire to live and always be part on you and your son’s life. He really does not want to hear what you think you will do if he dies. It’s painful. So he told you the story like that he can live with in his head.

Your husband has hang-ups about death. That is pretty clear.

The fact is that if he were to die, you will live your life as you feel you need to. You now know that he has hang-ups about death and is unconformable not existing. It’s pretty crazy, the two of you arguing about your life after his death. Just don’t’ talk about this topic again.

You could also have similar arguments about life after you move to the moon. That should be ‘interesting’. 
================================
Now the ones about the maul. I he using a cpap/apap/ or bi-pap for his sleep apnea? I’m curious as to why he’s tired if he is complaint with treatment. When was the last time he had a sleep study done?

It’s unreasonable to expect a person who is exhausted from lack of sleep to stay in the mall for longer than necessary. Asking him to sleep in the car is not good either. He ahs sleep apnea. He will not get any rest in the car. With sleep apnea he does not breath right when he sleep… awaking up every few minutes to gasp for air. So you wanted him to go sit in the car and gasp for air, without his cpap. When I sleep without my cpap I feel like I have a sore throat. 
To top it off, most men hate going shopping with their wives. The y just want to get what is needed and get out of there.

So as much as you wanted to hang out in the mall, his needs trumped in that situation. 

You need to do whatever is necessary so that you can drive. You not driving feeds into his control. You cannot even go to the store on you own. That puts you in the positon of a child and he is your father. If you act like a dependent, you will be treated like one. Hire someone to teach you of find a driving school you can attend.

================================

Now the one at sonic. He was in a bad mood, to start with. Was he tried again? I think it was more about impatience and him wanting to get out of there then control if he had called the woman back, he would have had to wait. He just wanted out of there.


Let’s talk more about his sleep apnea. I think he’s exhausted and not doing well.


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## hardcandy (Sep 16, 2014)

Elegirl, I think you misunderstood me. I didn't ask him to go sleep in the car. I asked him to just drop me off the next time we go to the mall so he doesn't have to be where he doesn't wanna be. Mall is only 5mins away. To which he says no. While I know it isn't fair to make anyone stay anywhere they don't want, I don't think it's fair to make a person leave a place when they are not ready to, either.

He isn't using any treatment (no cpap or any machine). He believes he can use natural remedies to decrease his inflammation before getting a major surgery. He's going vegan and cutting out dairy right now. He currently sleeps with a mouthpiece made for sleep apnea.

I have been with him 6ish years, he wasn't always this way. The whole time I was pregnant, he didn't have this problem but he also slept a good schedule (12-8am) then. Now he sleeps anywhere from 4am-6am to 1pm-2pm. Baby and I wake up at 8am and baby can get really loud as a 1 year old so he's not getting his restful sleep on top of his sleep apnea. He also drinks water like a fish so he has to get up to use the bathroom a few times a night and that also ruins his sleep. I have suggested him time and time again NOT to drink so much before bed. He also works out late in the night which makes him less sleepy and more awake. I told him that working out during the day would be better for his sleep. Obviously, he just does his own thing so I don't even bother to say anything.

He says he doesn't feel rested when he wakes up to which I told him he needs to let his body rest at night and for him to get his surgery but nope, he would get on a normal schedule to only screw it up the next few days by staying up later than he should. 

I know he has his "problems" and I'm willing to work around it but he doesn't like any of my suggestions. Last night, I mentioned I need to go places by myself and he says, "go ahead, take the car." And it made me so angry because he says that everytime like I can just get in the car and drive off after 10 something years. Mind you when I did drive, it was only on and off for about 1 year. I must have been 19-20 years old. I'm 31 now.

So I asked him if he still wanted to see me come home, otherwise if I got up now and just drove, I may never come back as I may have gotten into an accident on the highway (people drive at 60mph here). 

I know asking him to sit in with me requires his time as well so I can't just force him to do it. If things don't change, I will have to hire a driving teacher for a couple days. Also the problem is, my husband is 6'3 and he works out, he doesn't fit in the passenger seat as the baby's car seat is in the seat behind it and requires the passenger seat to move all the way up. We bought this Lexus hybrid before baby came and my not driving wasn't a problem then because we lived in City X with all the cabs, taxis, and subway. Anyway, we're planning on getting a full size SUV in the near future to fix this situation.

I give alternative solutions to all the issues involving me (like the mall and the drive-in) but no he just wants to do it the way he wants. He won't drop me off at the mall but he won't let me stay either. He won't ask for ketchup but he won't let me ask either. 

And regarding the ketchup situation, no it was a drive-in so we were gonna sit there and eat before heading out. The driving off was not part of the plan as this was a new experience for us; there are no drive-in places in City X. And he doesn't like asking for things we need and that's okay, but what's not ok is stopping me from doing it. It isn't like I'm asking a stranger for ketchup or making the person go above and beyond to get what I want.

Here's another example. We were supposed to put on Xmas decorations outside. He said he wasn't feeling it so I said ok watch the baby for half an hour and I can get it up myself. Obviously, he was resistant and told me that I was trying to pressure him to do something at a time he didn't want to, that I was stressing him out. I said it wasn't the case. He said fine that he would do it. Then he started giving me an attitude. Then he wanted to put the wreath in the middle of the door. I said wreath usually goes near the top. He argued with me and told me he needed to see examples. I googled it for him and he stopped but the attitude kept going on and he argued that because I made him do something he didn't want to, he was crabby. I lost it then, too because I remember clearly telling him that I would do it while he could sit back and supervise baby as she plays with her toys.

The he always accuses me of getting mad because "I didn't get what I want." But I never get what I want!! I get mad because of his behavior and his reasoning and argumentative nature not because it was about the ketchup or the Xmas decorations.

These little things happen often and my cup is full so I just wanna scream my face off. I'm not forcing him to do anything--I simply just want him to be okay if I decide to do something instead.


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## NoChoice (Feb 12, 2012)

OP,
Has the idea of IC been brought up regarding your H's controlling nature. I know some people are somewhat anal but not allowing you to get ketchup for your fries is a bit over the top. If I did not want to bother the waitress, whose job it is to wait on her patrons by the way, then I would have gotten out and got you the ketchup myself. He apperantly has issues that need to be dealt with. As for the mall, I hate the mall and would rather crawl through broken glass than to go there but dropping you off should not be an issue if it's something you enjoy.

Whatever the underlying issue is with his need to dominate, that must be addressed if he is ever to change. And, before he can deal with it he needs to see it as a problem, which it seems he doesn't. Suggest getting an outside unbiased third party that you both trust and give them some instances of his behavior and let them reiterate your feelings. If "airing your dirty laundry" is a concern then how will you keep a divorce secret? Use the assets you have in close friends or a pastor or whatever but the only way to start to fix this is for him to first recognize the problem. I wish you success.


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

I dont blame you for not being able to stand him. There is no way I could stay with a man like this. You NEVER should have allowed him to take driving away from you! Thats crazy, and 100% controlling on his part.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

You are a SAHM right?

Your husband works right? How many hours a day / week does he work?


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

3Xnocharm said:


> I dont blame you for not being able to stand him. There is no way I could stay with a man like this. You NEVER should have allowed him to take driving away from you! Thats crazy, and 100% controlling on his part.


I don' think he took driving away from her. She has hardly ever driven. They come from city X where she relied on public transportation, taxis, etc.

Now that they live in city Y, she choses not to drive and expect him to be her driver.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

hardcandy said:


> Elegirl, I think you misunderstood me. I didn't ask him to go sleep in the car. I asked him to just drop me off the next time we go to the mall so he doesn't have to be where he doesn't wanna be. Mall is only 5mins away. To which he says no. While I know it isn't fair to make anyone stay anywhere they don't want, I don't think it's fair to make a person leave a place when they are not ready to, either.


Ok, if you wanted him to just drop you off and then pick you up later, then it’s probably a reasonable request. 

The in the measurement of fair vs unfair, it’s more unfair to force a person to do something that you do not want to do. 

You are perfectly capable of getting your driver’s license and becoming a lot more independent. Maybe the reason he would not stay is because he is tired of being your driver? It’s very annoying to have someone who has every capability to be more independent, make themselves dependent… not driving is on way people do this. She assumed that after working all day I had nothing better to do than to drive her around while she wondered around stores and shopped.



hardcandy said:


> He isn't using any treatment (no cpap or any machine). He believes he can use natural remedies to decrease his inflammation before getting a major surgery. He's going vegan and cutting out dairy right now. He currently sleeps with a mouthpiece made for sleep apnea.


Interesting and probably foolish. The surgery is only about 25%-30% successful. So even after surgery he would still most likely need a CPAP. And CPAP is always works.

He’s not getting good sleep, he might not be getting any REM sleep at all, during the night he will be cranky. 



hardcandy said:


> I have been with him 6ish years, he wasn't always this way. The whole time I was pregnant, he didn't have this problem but he also slept a good schedule (12-8am) then. Now he sleeps anywhere from 4am-6am to 1pm-2pm. Baby and I wake up at 8am and baby can get really loud as a 1 year old so he's not getting his restful sleep on top of his sleep apnea. He also drinks water like a fish so he has to get up to use the bathroom a few times a night and that also ruins his sleep. I have suggested him time and time again NOT to drink so much before bed. He also works out late in the night which makes him less sleepy and more awake. I told him that working out during the day would be better for his sleep. Obviously, he just does his own thing so I don't even bother to say anything.


Why is he going to bed at 4-6am? So your husband has untreated sleep apnea, has bad sleep hygine and does just about all he can do to sabotage his sleep. 

This sounds like a reason to sit him down and read him the riot act. It’s going to kill him early and it’s causing both of you problems.



hardcandy said:


> He says he doesn't feel rested when he wakes up to which I told him he needs to let his body rest at night and for him to get his surgery but nope, he would get on a normal schedule to only screw it up the next few days by staying up later than he should.


The surgery is most likely not going to help. It has a very low success rate. He needs better sleep hygine, a good sleep study and a CPAP (or the correct type of PAP for him).

It sounds like your husband also has insomnia. Sleep apnea can cause insomnia. 

Untreated sleep apnea also leads to all kinds of health problems and mental health problems. 



hardcandy said:


> I know he has his "problems" and I'm willing to work around it but he doesn't like any of my suggestions. Last night, I mentioned I need to go places by myself and he says, "go ahead, take the car." And it made me so angry because he says that everytime like I can just get in the car and drive off after 10 something years. Mind you when I did drive, it was only on and off for about 1 year. I must have been 19-20 years old. I'm 31 now.


That sounds like he is letting you know that he is burdened your refusal to drive. I don’t blame him. 

Why are you afraid to drive? 31 is not old too old to learn. You are still very young. If a 15 year old, immature kid can learn to drive, surely you can. 

Why don’t you sign up for a diving course? I think that this should be very first thing you do in addressing your issues. 



hardcandy said:


> So I asked him if he still wanted to see me come home, otherwise if I got up now and just drove, I may never come back as I may have gotten into an accident on the highway (people drive at 60mph here).


Aren’t there side roads that you can take to get there? Are there other places you can go by side rodes? Most highways have side roads that run right next to them for slower traffic. That said, I’m not suggesting that you just jump in the car and drive. I am suggesting that you take a driving class. There are driving instructors who will come to your home .



hardcandy said:


> I know asking him to sit in with me requires his time as well so I can't just force him to do it. If things don't change, I will have to hire a driving teacher for a couple days. Also the problem is, my husband is 6'3 and he works out, he doesn't fit in the passenger seat as the baby's car seat is in the seat behind it and requires the passenger seat to move all the way up. We bought this Lexus hybrid before baby came and my not driving wasn't a problem then because we lived in City X with all the cabs, taxis, and subway. Anyway, we're planning on getting a full size SUV in the near future to fix this situation.


Good. A baby-friendly car and driving lessons. Get it done!!!!



hardcandy said:


> I give alternative solutions to all the issues involving me (like the mall and the drive-in) but no he just wants to do it the way he wants. He won't drop me off at the mall but he won't let me stay either. He won't ask for ketchup but he won't let me ask either.


He wants to do it the way he wants. You want to do it the way you want. Neither of you want to compromise. He gets to do it his way (at the mall) because he is the one driving. So you are dependent on him for this. So he wins. If you become independent, by driving, a lot of this will go away. Plus it sounds like he is very annoyed at your refusal to drive and do things on your own.




hardcandy said:


> And regarding the ketchup situation, no it was a drive-in so we were gonna sit there and eat before heading out. The driving off was not part of the plan as this was a new experience for us; there are no drive-in places in City X. And he doesn't like asking for things we need and that's okay, but what's not ok is stopping me from doing it. It isn't like I'm asking a stranger for ketchup or making the person go above and beyond to get what I want.


Ok, that is clearer. I agree that this would be very annoying. Pick your battles. This is one that I would let go for right now. Identify things you can influence/change and work on those first.
If you learn to drive again and can do more on your own, he will have less opportunity to drive you nuts.

Work on getting him to get a cpap so that he can sleep better. Maybe get him a good book on sleep hygiene. 



hardcandy said:


> Here's another example. We were supposed to put on Xmas decorations outside. He said he wasn't feeling it so I said ok watch the baby for half an hour and I can get it up myself. Obviously, he was resistant and told me that I was trying to pressure him to do something at a time he didn't want to, that I was stressing him out. I said it wasn't the case. He said fine that he would do it. Then he started giving me an attitude. Then he wanted to put the wreath in the middle of the door. I said wreath usually goes near the top. He argued with me and told me he needed to see examples. I googled it for him and he stopped but the attitude kept going on and he argued that because I made him do something he didn't want to, he was crabby. I lost it then, too because I remember clearly telling him that I would do it while he could sit back and supervise baby as she plays with her toys.


How old is your baby?

Well, he gets no sleep so he is cranky. This is what it’s like when a person is running around seriously sleep deprived. A person with sleep untreated sleep apnea is as dangerous driving a car as a person who is drunk. Think about that. Your husband is functioning at the level of a person who is drunk all day long.

If you want to fight with him about something, this is it. If you want a battle at which to live or die… it’s his health and his sleep apnea. 




hardcandy said:


> The he always accuses me of getting mad because "I didn't get what I want." But I never get what I want!! I get mad because of his behavior and his reasoning and argumentative nature not because it was about the ketchup or the Xmas decorations.


Ok, so now you have identified another problem. You think that you never get what you want. When he hears that he hears that you do not appreciate all that he does just for you and your baby. 

Can you list the things that you do get? I’d like to see a list if you would not mind.



hardcandy said:


> These little things happen often and my cup is full so I just wanna scream my face off. I'm not forcing him to do anything--I simply just want him to be okay if I decide to do something instead.


You have complete control over a lot of this.

You do not drive by choice. If you instead would get back to driving you could go spend all the time you want at the mall and anywhere else.

You could have done the Christmas decorations by yourself. Sure you have a child. But that should not keep you from hanging a wreath on the door. If you only needed 30 minutes to decorate, you could have done it in stages over a few days. 

Even the catsup thing. He said no. Well you have legs, right? I would have just opened the door and gone to get catsup.

Notice that every example you have given is one where you require him to do something. And it’s something that you could have done without him. So yes, you are trying to force him to do things, things that you do not really need him for. But instead you create situations where he has to do something, then when he does not jump at your command you get angry. Then you harbor the anger.’

Do you feel overall that your husband does not pay enough attention to you? Do the two of you spend much time together, just the two of you doing things that you both enjoy?

Your husband sounds like a cranky pain in the arse. But you are just as much to blame for this as he is. So now we know whose fault it is. Own your 50% and start


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## hardcandy (Sep 16, 2014)

I don't expect him to be my driver at all! If he's so fed up with driving me then why isn't he quick to sit in the car just for a couple hours so I can get a refresher since I already have a drivers license? I have been asking since a year and a half ago. He'll never have to drive me again!!

I just asked him if he was tired of driving me and to be honest. He said "no, not at all" and that he'll even like driving me more when we get the truck, with a happy smile so I don't think I'm forcing him to drive me.

We don't live in a city now. Anywhere you go, you need a car. In NYC, it wasn't that I relied on public transportation like a disabled person -- it was just the way of life and there was no reason to drive anywhere since it was more convenient taking the subway or hail a cab. A car would have cost $$ in parking and with the traffic, would have taken hours to get to the destination. Have you been to NYC?

He didn't take driving away from me; I met him a few years after I have stopped.

The "no" he said for the mall situation wasn't because he doesn't want to drop me off but because he wants "to be there" with me. 

He drove off immediately at the drive-in and I did say I was gonna go in to ask, to which he said that was my way of pressuring him to ask for the ketchup.

So I got a couple happenings with meetups and mommy groups within this coming month, to which he just offers to drop me off without my having to ask.

Now this is why I'm upset. He has no problem dropping me off at events like that but he won't drop me off at the mall or a place where I will be by myself...I can take care of myself!

We are SAHP(parents) and he works when he wants to: 0 hours a day or all day, he decides.

And no, he isn't operating at drunk level since he has the energy to lift heavy weights when he works out. Drunk people can't create works of art either. He's not always tired, just some parts of the day.

He has gone to IC, but not for control issues, for childhood trauma and emotional abuse by mother.

I do agree that he is irritable and pita because of not receiving quality rest...but he does it to himself and I have no control over his sleeping habits.

We know the surgery is not 100% but he said he'll take the risk that it may work for him. If it doesn't work, he said he'll ask our doc for a recommendation to the sleep center for a cpap.

Since I pointed out the control issues, he seems mindful but I can only hope.


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## AliceA (Jul 29, 2010)

I think you have fallen into a pattern of behaviour and you can't see how nearly every problem you have now is because you give away your power. 

He rushes you at the mall and gives you attitude? So ignore him and go about your business. Tell him you are getting shoes/whatever and he can leave and you'll get a taxi.

You want more freedom? Get a few driving lessons. They don't care if you already have your license. Stop relying on him.

I recently had a similar issue with a chore as you did with the xmas decorations. DH's attitude really peeved me off, so I told him to leave. It was not an easy chore but I sure as sh*t didn't have to put up with his attitude, and didn't. He came back, gave me more attitude, I ignored him, he left again. He came back and didn't say anything (see, he was learning), and we finished the last bit without any more aggravation.

So, you have the power to change a situation, to ignore his attitude and to get back into the drivers seat, all without any need to change what he is doing as such. He will learn.


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## Keenwa (Oct 26, 2013)

I thought I'd chime in, it sounds to me like a very co-dependent relationship, you keep quiet, you keep the peace, but when you want to stand up for yourself your communication style is a bit harsh so he lashes back. He is full of fear, and probably controls because he's afraid if he doesn't all hell will break loose. But you don't need to take care of his issues, only deal with your own. I am in the same situation kind of. I let myself get to a horrible place because I tried to make things work by not speaking up for myself and essentially letting myself be a doormat. So who's to blame? you both are. He clearly has a great deal of fear, which leads to his controlling behaviour and you are trying to keep the peace. Or that's how it sounds. 

I think the only way to fix this is to go to MC. You guys need to learn how to communicate in ways that don't trigger you both into places of anger and frustration. when I started counselling I thought I was right and he was wrong, I blamed him for everything that was wrong in my life even if I didn't say so out loud. It's true I felt encaged, I felt strangled by my life and by him, but a good hard look in the mirror taught me how to set my boundaries, and let him be who he is. We can't really figure out if we want to be with someone if we don't know who we are and how we want to live in the world. It's so easy to get caught up in the unity of marriage that we don't even know what we want any more, we accept all the crap, and we figure that's the way it is. But it doesn't have to be that way. 

I'm still trying to figure it out, but at least I feel like I"m in a better place and that if my husband and I split up, it will be with a better understanding of what has happened, which ultimately simply that we want different things out of life and not that I am pissed because he caged me up. We can only live a life that we accept to live and if we accept to live a life that seems crappy to us, then we have accepted that and are living it because we're not willing to try anything else. 

You say he's a good guy, give him a chance and ask him to go for counselling together and see where it leads.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

hardcandy said:


> I don't expect him to be my driver at all!


I am confused. Why did he drive you to the mall if you did not need him to drive you there? Why did you want him to wait in the car so you could stay there if you did not need him to drive you home?

Can you walk to the mall and back?



hardcandy said:


> If he's so fed up with driving me then why isn't he quick to sit in the car just for a couple hours so I can get a refresher since I already have a drivers license? I have been asking since a year and a half ago. He'll never have to drive me again!!


Why does he have to sit in the car for a couple of hours so you can get a refresher?



hardcandy said:


> I just asked him if he was tired of driving me and to be honest. He said "no, not at all" and that he'll even like driving me more when we get the truck, with a happy smile so I don't think I'm forcing him to drive me.


If he was happy to drive you anytime, anywhere you wanted him to, he would have waited out in the car while you spent all the time you wanted to spend at the mall.



hardcandy said:


> We don't live in a city now. Anywhere you go, you need a car. In NYC, it wasn't that I relied on public transportation like a disabled person -- it was just the way of life and there was no reason to drive anywhere since it was more convenient taking the subway or hail a cab. A car would have cost $$ in parking and with the traffic, would have taken hours to get to the destination. Have you been to NYC?
> 
> He didn't take driving away from me; I met him a few years after I have stopped.


Public transportation in NYC is not just for disabled people. Everyone uses it. I did not say that there was anything wrong with you using public transportation in NYC. I’m not sure why you are so defensive about me explaining to some that your hsubnd id not take driving away from you.




hardcandy said:


> The "no" he said for the mall situation wasn't because he doesn't want to drop me off but because he wants "to be there" with me.


Are you saying that he will not allow you to go to the mall without him?



hardcandy said:


> He drove off immediately at the drive-in and I did say I was gonna go in to ask, to which he said that was my way of pressuring him to ask for the ketchup.


I suggested that he did not want to get the catsup because he wanted to leave at that point. Then you replied that it was an eat-there situation so it was not that he wanted to drive off. Now you say that it was that he wanted to drive off.




hardcandy said:


> So I got a couple happenings with meetups and mommy groups within this coming month, to which he just offers to drop me off without my having to ask.


Ok. You say that he is controlling. By you not driving you are giving him control. Control can be exercised in what looks like him being nice.

He was nice and drove you to the mall. But then he did not want to stay longer with you, or sit in the car and wait for you so you say that he is controlling because of this.
So now he is going to drop you off at meetups, you will have to leave as soon as he gets there. If you want to stay and he will not wait, you will say that he is being controlling. 

This is why you need to start driving again. Your relationship will be better because then you can do what you want to do sometimes, actually very often.




hardcandy said:


> Now this is why I'm upset. He has no problem dropping me off at events like that but he won't drop me off at the mall or a place where I will be by myself...I can take care of myself!


If you want to go to places by yourself, start driving. You are giving control over to him and then you get angry with him.



hardcandy said:


> We are SAHP(parents) and he works when he wants to: 0 hours a day or all day, he decides.


So the two of you are around each other about 24/7? 



hardcandy said:


> And no, he isn't operating at drunk level since he has the energy to lift heavy weights when he works out. Drunk people can't create works of art either. He's not always tired, just some parts of the day.


Are your purposely refusing to understand. I did not say that he was drunk. I said that people with serious untreated apnea are so tired all the time that they function at the level of person who is drunk. That means that reaction times are very slow, concentration is not at optimal leaves.


It’s a testament to the human spirit that many people with sleep apnea do create works of art; they are engineers and scientist, and doctors and nurse. They function because they are fighting exhaustion almost every day. But the push forward and create and do. But they are struggling. 



hardcandy said:


> He has gone to IC, but not for control issues, for childhood trauma and emotional abuse by mother.


ok



hardcandy said:


> I do agree that he is irritable and pita because of not receiving quality rest...but he does it to himself and I have no control over his sleeping habits.


You can continue to talk to him about it, give him info, etc. Someday he might just come around.



hardcandy said:


> We know the surgery is not 100% but he said he'll take the risk that it may work for him. If it doesn't work, he said he'll ask our doc for a recommendation to the sleep center for a cpap.


Whatever.


hardcandy said:


> Since I pointed out the control issues, he seems mindful but I can only hope.


Yep.


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## hardcandy (Sep 16, 2014)

I CAN'T STAND HIM ANYMORE!!!!

I'm going to divorce him.


Lawn mower guy came unexpectedly this month, he went out to pick up the dog poop and I just asked if he could spray off a small pee puddle on the cement while he's out there. He said no and I said okay, np, I'm gonna do it. Put on my rain boots and was about to go out and he started screaming and "forbade" me to do it!! I said, I was gonna do it anyway and he got really, really angry and said I'm pressuring him to do it by going out there myself. He screamed, "no, you're not gonna do it!!!"

I cannot stand him anymore!!!!!!!!! Everyday!!! I need to leave.

Thanks everyone for the responses.


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## hardcandy (Sep 16, 2014)

I'm sorry Elegirl, are you reading my posts? The mall was his idea. He wanted to go to the mall for Christmas shopping! I didn't ask him to go sit in the car. I said he can go home and I can hang out at the mall by myself. I also said he can drop me off at the mall and pick me up later.

No, I cannot walk to the mall. It's 8 miles from home. And if I could, he will not "let" me. Just like he just "forbade" me to spray the cement.

We just got into an argument because I decided to fight back. He said, "why can't you just say ok no problem if I don't want spray the puddle." And normally, I would just say that to keep the peace.

It's not even just about driving. It's almost everything in the world!!! I just can't take it anymore.

Forget it. I'm more than capable of understanding what is reasonable and what is not.

Again, thanks for all the responses, everyone.


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## hardcandy (Sep 16, 2014)

I told him I hate his being so controlling and he said I'm the controlling one! That because I accuse him of it, I'm the one that wants to control everything, not him, and that I just want to get what I want. What the heck, I'm only trying to control my actions, not his. Obviously, I just lost it again.


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## AliceA (Jul 29, 2010)

Yeah, screaming over a pee puddle is ridiculous. You weren't making him do anything, you found a solution where he didn't have to do it, so I don't get why he was getting so upset (it isn't particularly logical). He sounds like a complete a*hole.


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## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

HC,
He likes it that you can't drive. 

Not because he's cruel, but because he's controlling.

Hire a driving instructor. It's very important that you break this dependency. 

And I agree that he is very controlling. And think it's great that you are beginning to assert yourself. 

That said, I do have one suggestion. Don't talk about what you will do after he dies. No good will come of it. 

Other than that one area - all the other stuff he is controlling - is fair game for you to address.

For just one moment, I want to explain WHY he is doing this. It does NOT make it ok. And it does not mean you should give in. 

The reason for explaining the WHY is so you might be able to assert yourself with more success and less resistance from him.

He has some anxiety issues. He truly IS worried about your safety. And yes - his fear of you going alone to the mall is HIS phobia and he does not get to use it to prevent you from going by yourself or with the baby. 

But since he does have a phobia, you could offer to:
- Reassure him you have your pepper spray
- Call him when you get to the mall safely and/or when you are about to drive home

Full disclosure. I absolutely don't believe you are obligated to do any of that. His anxieties are his issue. That said, doing them as an act of kindness while in parallel asserting yourself and being more independent will have a BIG positive impact on his quality of life. He loves you. He worries about you.

As far as the sonic incident. That's appalling behavior on his part plain and simple. It's selfish and screwed up. That said, sadly you are going to have to accept that he is going to keep doing some amount of that because he has some hard wired control issues. 

Hopefully you can learn to let the small incidents go - you can tease him about them but don't be mean spirited about it. 





hardcandy said:


> Elegirl, I think you misunderstood me. I didn't ask him to go sleep in the car. I asked him to just drop me off the next time we go to the mall so he doesn't have to be where he doesn't wanna be. Mall is only 5mins away. To which he says no. While I know it isn't fair to make anyone stay anywhere they don't want, I don't think it's fair to make a person leave a place when they are not ready to, either.
> 
> He isn't using any treatment (no cpap or any machine). He believes he can use natural remedies to decrease his inflammation before getting a major surgery. He's going vegan and cutting out dairy right now. He currently sleeps with a mouthpiece made for sleep apnea.
> 
> ...


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## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

HC,

I will add to my previous post. 

Before you pull the trigger on a divorce, gentle suggestion. 

Ask him to commit to marriage counseling. 

If he won't go, give him a choice: marrriage counseling or divorce

He needs help from a mental health specialist. 

The things that are triggering his anxiety attacks (they present to you as fury - but trust me - in his head they start out as an anxiety or fear response to losing control) are symptoms of a serious personality disorder. 




hardcandy said:


> I CAN'T STAND HIM ANYMORE!!!!
> 
> I'm going to divorce him.
> 
> ...


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## AVR1962 (May 30, 2012)

I have gotten to the same point and if I ask myself "why? is it just me?" Then I reflect on our 25 years together and what I have put up with. 

Him spending more time with his drinking buddies than at home with me and the kids.

His love for porn instead of intimacy with his wife.

His desire to take other ladies to lunch instead of me.

His lack of desire to help with kids, house, yard.

His lack of emotional support for me and the kids.

His inability to talk to me in conversation like he was actually interested in me.

When I look at it that way there is no wonder I have hard feelings and ask myself why I have put up with it for so long.


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## Keenwa (Oct 26, 2013)

I agree... Marriage counselling or divorce... 2 choices, though I'd say put up against a wall, and fearful of divorce many people would "choose" MC... while I told my H that this was not an ultimatum... that's how he saw it... he never would have committed to any counselling had he not been fearful of divorce. Only difference is that I was so far gone I didn't say "it's marriage counselling or divorce" I just said I was leaving and he begged me to "try"... 2 years later we are getting along much better but I still wonder if we wouldn't have been better off separating. it has been gruelling, difficult, frustrating etc. So while we're better friends.. there's still no couple. 

All that to say, follow your heart and your instincts... both paths are very hard, he sounds like he has a long way to go and you don't know if he's willing to look at himself in the mirror. Many people will choose to close their eyes rather than to look in a mirror... they'd rather walk away from a relationship than to face looking at their flaws and their issues. 

You should go for counselling though because otherwise regardless of whether you stay or go, you'll end up in the same situation again and again.


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## hardcandy (Sep 16, 2014)

Thanks all for your inputs. I have decided that I will work towards separation/divorce. I don't want MC or any type of counseling with him. I just don't see how a person can change their core.


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