# Gave up on the "hope" strategy and started "taking her" Its working



## NoIssues (Oct 9, 2011)

*Gave up on the "hope" strategy and started "taking her" Its working*

My wife and I have had a bit of a challenging HD LD issue that is finally improving much to both our liking which has also improved our friendship and companionship. 

She is much more loving lately which has motivated me to just be better all the way around instead of cranky and frustrated.

I was too often employing the "hope" strategy as in I "hope" *she* will initiate. I gave that **** up and started jumping her and in return she has started jumping me more without her seduction killing habit of asking me first. 

She has also restarted the BJ program. 

I guess I have to set the rythm. 

What caused our issue? In the past I took her for granted and didnt know her needs. After my reading frenzy and saving my marriage from neglect several years ago this was one of the final pieces of baggage to dispense with. 

So glad to have made some more breakthrough. 

My suggestion to anyone with a otherwise OK marriage with a LD spouse, dont self-reject by talking yourself out of "taking her". 

My wife is far from a freak. We are a little wild with our sex on occassion but she did ask me to pull her hair and take her from behind a few times so I started doing that too. 

Its helped. Now she is grabbing me back the same way and we are picking up speed.


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## Amplexor (Feb 13, 2008)

*Re: Gave up on the "hope" strategy and started "taking her" Its working*



NoIssues said:


> I was too often employing the "hope" strategy as in I "hope" *she* will initiate. .


The hope strategy is never a good one no matter your sex in a LD/HD marriage. The best way to improve it is to make your needs known understood. Be confident about them and your approach to your wife. The "taking" of one's wife is widely misunderstood IMO. Sometimes likened to groping or rape and when misapplied it is. My wife loves both to be taken and romanced to bed. After 25 years together I finally got that and understand when she wants to be made love to and when she needs to be ****ed. In our world, taking does not mean I walk up behind her and grab her boobs. I walk up behind her, turn her around and passionately kiss her and tell her "Your husband wants you." I don't want sex, I want her and that makes a big difference to her. We may not even head off to the bedroom then but I reinforce it though out the evening until it is time to. It is not about control, but complete desire for her. It's about being confident in you what and how you do it.

Part II:

You mention not meeting her needs in your previous troubles and that parallels my experience. No amount of effort on my part was going to get her in bed in anything other than a dutiful manner if I was not meeting those. Between these two things our sex life has markedly improved over the past few years.


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## I got this (Feb 25, 2013)

*Re: Gave up on the "hope" strategy and started "taking her" Its working*



staarz21 said:


> Good for you! I love it when my H does this! It has always been a turn on for me when he just grabs me out of no where and goes to town!


Very hot! Us too! Fellas take note. :smthumbup:


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## TheStranger (Jan 14, 2013)

*Re: Gave up on the "hope" strategy and started "taking her" Its working*



NoIssues said:


> I was too often employing the "hope" strategy as in I "hope" *she* will initiate.


Good for you. How did you cope with fear of rejection if you had it in the first place?

My LD and anorgasmic wife made me pretty insecure about myself. It's difficult to 'take her'. Feels like jumping from a really high place expecting a good probability to be hurt.


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## WanderingTheDesert (Nov 15, 2012)

*Re: Gave up on the "hope" strategy and started "taking her" Its working*

After a long period of serial rejection, amounting to about a 75 % rejection rate, I also went into "hope" mode. Now, I still don't initiate. I just feel like I don't have any chance of success trying to get what I want, when I want it. I told her this, along with the information that I was thoroughly unhappy with the marriage, and that I was shopping for a new place to live. Suddenly, and for the past few months, she has been initiating about 3 times a week. That's pretty good, but I need to be able to initiate. 

NoIssues, congrqts on your progress. Is there some tipping point you reached to get you back over the initiation hump? In my case, I'm really having a hard time imagining how I can ever trust her enough to try again.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Amplexor (Feb 13, 2008)

*Re: Gave up on the "hope" strategy and started "taking her" Its working*



WanderingTheDesert said:


> After a long period of serial rejection, amounting to about a 75 % rejection rate, I also went into "hope" mode. Now, I still don't initiate. I just feel like I don't have any chance of success trying to get what I want, when I want it. I told her this, along with the information that I was thoroughly unhappy with the marriage, and that I was shopping for a new place to live.


Unfortunately that's how a lot of us end up. Banished in self rejection which leads to resentment and withdrawal. A completely unhealthy handling of the situation and in our case it nearly destroyed the marriage. If either spouse gives up on their needs or desires in the marriage, it's going to get fugly one way or the other. Bottom dollar bet!


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## WanderingTheDesert (Nov 15, 2012)

Amplexor said:


> Unfortunately that's how a lot of us end up. Banished in self rejection which leads to resentment and withdrawal. A completely unhealthy handling of the situation and in our case it nearly destroyed the marriage. If either spouse gives up on their needs or desires in the marriage, it's going to get fugly one way or the other. Bottom dollar bet!


Agreed. It's definitely been no fun for either of us. That's really why I'm on TAM. Even with her initiating these past few months, if I start to feel like I want to initiate, I actively talk myself out of it. Still really wondering what tripped the OP and others to get over it.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Amplexor (Feb 13, 2008)

*Re: Gave up on the "hope" strategy and started "taking her" Its working*



WanderingTheDesert said:


> Agreed. It's definitely been no fun for either of us. That's really why I'm on TAM. Even with her initiating these past few months, if I start to feel like I want to initiate, I actively talk myself out of it. Still really wondering what tripped the OP and others to get over it.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Rejection over the years have beaten down your confidence in the area of initiating. You are now afraid of being rejected so you don't put yourself in a position to be rejected. Quite normal. I've been a salesman for 30 years so "Sales 101" Q. What is the number one reason most sales don't close? A. Because the salesperson didn't as for it. My advice is to start initiating. You've asserted yourself and your needs, your wife seems to understand that now and will likely be more receptive. But if she begins to reject consistently again don't withdraw. Talk about it and reinforce why this is important to you in the marriage. I think you've got a great head start already.


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## stevehowefan (Apr 3, 2013)

*Re: Gave up on the "hope" strategy and started "taking her" Its working*

I've struggled with the "hope" aspect, too. For seven years, I hoped my wife would initiate/want to have sex. It eventually got to where I would be mad, and "pout" in her words. It made me look weak. It made her less attracted to me. Basically, it didn't help matters. I've noticed the last few times we've had sex, I acted like it was "whatever." As in I could take it or leave it. Or I'd act like I was tired. She has actually initiated a few times since I've done that.


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## WanderingTheDesert (Nov 15, 2012)

Amplexor said:


> Rejection over the years have beaten down your confidence in the area of initiating. You are now afraid of being rejected so you don't put yourself in a position to be rejected. Quite normal. I've been a salesman for 30 years so "Sales 101" Q. What is the number one reason most sales don't close? A. Because the salesperson didn't as for it. My advice is to start initiating. You've asserted yourself and your needs, your wife seems to understand that now and will likely be more receptive. But if she begins to reject consistently again don't withdraw. Talk about it and reinforce why this is important to you in the marriage. I think you've got a great head start already.


Hmmm. Thanks for the advice and encouragement. In my business, I sell one unit every year or two, and its a very complex transaction. I really do lack skills in the closing department. 

By the way, didn't mean to thread-steal, OP.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## WanderingTheDesert (Nov 15, 2012)

stevehowefan said:


> I've struggled with the "hope" aspect, too. For seven years, I hoped my wife would initiate/want to have sex. It eventually got to where I would be mad, and "pout" in her words. It made me look weak. It made her less attracted to me. Basically, it didn't help matters. I've noticed the last few times we've had sex, I acted like it was "whatever." As in I could take it or leave it. Or I'd act like I was tired. She has actually initiated a few times since I've done that.


Right. I see more interest from her as I'm less interested. The thing is, I'm afraid I'm so far down the road of being disinterested that I fear my feelings for her are permanently damaged. While I still care for her, it's much less than , say, a year ago. 

Stevehowefan, are you experiencing something similar?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## stevehowefan (Apr 3, 2013)

*Re: Gave up on the "hope" strategy and started "taking her" Its working*



WanderingTheDesert said:


> Right. I see more interest from her as I'm less interested. The thing is, I'm afraid I'm so far down the road of being disinterested that I fear my feelings for her are permanently damaged. While I still care for her, it's much less than , say, a year ago.
> 
> Stevehowefan, are you experiencing something similar?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I still love my wife with all of my heart. I haven't lost interest in her. Matter of fact, I think that was part of my problem. I acted poutty and whiney because I cared too much. That's not very alpha of me. What did happen was I grew distant from her. She felt distant from me too. We came to an agreement in late January, and since then she has gotten much better. I will freely admit, I got attention from other females but I never acted on it. And I hate to admit it but I enjoyed the attention.


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## NoIssues (Oct 9, 2011)

*Re: Gave up on the "hope" strategy and started "taking her" Its working*

For all rejectees. Domt self reject. Rejection doesnt kill you. 

Initiate, Initiate, Initiate. Get shot down. Who cares. You cant get a hit unless you swing at a pitch. The best batter in major leaague baseball gets out more than 6 out of 10 but he hits home runs by swinging at pitches. 

Grab a bat and take swing. 

No pain no gain
Nothng ventured, nothng gained
Just do it
Go for it
Carpe friggen diem
Squeeky wheel gets the grease
Dont self-reject
Dont be a mind reader
test the water
90% of what we fear never happens
Early bird gets the worm
Second mouse gets the cheese. 

OK Im stretching LOL 

Its one of many little ideas that can make your marriage a little better. 

Put this with others and reignite that warm inner glow. 

Get shot down? Laugh it off. Its better than not trying yes?


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## naga75 (Jul 5, 2012)

*Re: Gave up on the "hope" strategy and started "taking her" Its working*

Yes it is, yes it is. 

Sail on, Captian.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Middle of Everything (Feb 19, 2012)

*Re: Gave up on the "hope" strategy and started "taking her" Its working*

Its not about getting it for me. And truly for the other get rejected/initiate 90% of the time guys/gals on here.

Not sure of the song title, but for most of us I believe its
"I want you to want me, I need you to need me."

I could have sex every day with my wife, and if it was just get it over and done with type sex? Screw that. I believe that what a lot of us fear. We want to be wanted. Need to be needed.

Taking her, and being alpha doesnt do anything for that.


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## I got this (Feb 25, 2013)

*Re: Gave up on the "hope" strategy and started "taking her" Its working*

I had a talk with my daughter tonight abut some social predicaments she is in. We talked about obstacles. The mountain was the example. 

The choices are 

1. Over the top 
2. Around the side
3. Underneath the bottom 
4. Right straight thru
5. Move it
6. Blow it up
7. Take another path

Yup. A realistic solution isnt always available. We agree. 

Your move. Whats it going to be?


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## donny64 (Apr 21, 2012)

stevehowefan said:


> I've struggled with the "hope" aspect, too. For seven years, I hoped my wife would initiate/want to have sex. It eventually got to where I would be mad, and "pout" in her words. It made me look weak. It made her less attracted to me. Basically, it didn't help matters. I've noticed the last few times we've had sex, I acted like it was "whatever." As in I could take it or leave it. Or I'd act like I was tired. She has actually initiated a few times since I've done that.


Good post. The guys who whine, ask, pout (women seem to love to tell you you're "pouting") and get angry are demonstrating to their women that sex is more important to them than it is the woman. We know that a majority of the time, this is wrong. The guys just aren't hitting the "triggers" they need to to make her willing, or better yet want it and crave it. 

Best bet is to shrug it off (as long as the rejection isn't rude). Go about doing what you were doing like you could give a chit. And if she is rude about it, address THAT, not the rejection itself. 

It's been my experience the guys that handle rejection properly just don't have to deal with it as much. 

She wants it every bit as bad as you do. You just need to figure out how to make her realize that, and not let her bullchit you otherwise. Guys who don't realize that, and act accordingly, just aren't as attractive.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## I got this (Feb 25, 2013)

*Re: Gave up on the "hope" strategy and started "taking her" Its working*



donny64 said:


> The guys just aren't hitting the "triggers" they need to to make her crave it.


Love sll your post Don but this is my favorite part.


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## WanderingTheDesert (Nov 15, 2012)

*Re: Gave up on the "hope" strategy and started "taking her" Its working*



donny64 said:


> It's been my experience the guys that handle rejection properly just don't have to deal with it as much.
> 
> She wants it every bit as bad as you do. You just need to figure out how to make her realize that, and not let her bullchit you otherwise. Guys who don't realize that, and act accordingly, just aren't as attractive.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


It's ridiculous to claim that the response to rejection causes further rejection. That may be true, but can never be known. I, for one, feel I handled rejection really well for a very long time. I hit my threshold, and only then did I blow up. Now, I don't initiate because I really don't want yet another rejection.

I don't think any of these guys are getting upset about a single rejection. I know I don't. For me, it was always:

Monday-- "Not tonight. Tomorrow" 
Tuesday-- "I'm so tired. Let's try tomorrow"
Wednesday --skip. I can see the writing on the wall.
Thursday--"I have to get up early tomorrow."

and the like. When is it OK to respond? What is a reasonable threshold? As much as many of you like to paint the picture, I don't see the rejected as whiney, weak, or anything but honest, direct, desirous, and faithful. When you're getting what you want, it's easy to tell another guy what his problem is. But do you really know? Is it even possible for you to know?

In my case, my wife failed to respond to me after repeated communication (verbal and written), many failed initiations, agreements between us about how the serial rejection was not acceptable. The response came only in the face of a threat. When she saw that other women were seeking my attention, and I showed her apartments I was considering moving in to, she responded by initiating about 3 times a week.


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## NoIssues (Oct 9, 2011)

*Re: Gave up on the "hope" strategy and started "taking her" Its working*



WanderingTheDesert said:


> When you're getting what you want, it's easy to tell another guy what his problem is. But do you really know? Is it even possible for you to know?
> 
> *Some do because they have been there and have figured it out and rebuilt their marriages. We can bot tar all of us with the same brush but some here have success solving the problems others have.
> 
> ...


Sometimes thats what it takes. I have advocated ultimatums because my wife gave me one and I woke up immediately and fixed my zhit quick.


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## WanderingTheDesert (Nov 15, 2012)

*Re: Gave up on the "hope" strategy and started "taking her" Its working*



NoIssues said:


> Sometimes thats what it takes. I have advocated ultimatums because my wife gave me one and I woke up immediately and fixed my zhit quick.


I get that there are people here who understand the issues and have experience in addressing them. That's why I value the input Amplexor provided, and I've been seeking to understand what caused you, NoIssues, to change your tune. I just don't see any value in generalized, demeaning "advice" which is really just thinly veiled self-fluffing.

So, can I ask? Was it you're wife's ultimatum that caused you to begin initiating again? I see a number of women posting here, complaining that they have a husband that doesn't initiate when the wife wants it. Is that along the lines of your situation?


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## NoIssues (Oct 9, 2011)

*Re: Gave up on the "hope" strategy and started "taking her" Its working*



WanderingTheDesert said:


> I've been seeking to understand what caused you, NoIssues, to change your tune.
> 
> *My pleasure to get you there *
> 
> ...


Not so much. My situation was more along the lines of I wanted more but was just waiting for her to initiate and it didnt happen enough. Now I say vuck that "hope" zhit and "jump" and/or "take" her assertively. She craves that and loves it. My doing that has had some very nice, hot and loving results 

1. More sex 
2. Hotter marriage
3. More fun
4. Warmer friendship
5. Better nonsexual quality time
6. More closeness
7. Much happier wife that is my sunshine still

and drum roll please. 

8. Much more frequent BJs :smthumbup:

Am I happy for me? Sure. Am I thumping a bit? Sure. But that doesnt devalue the usefulness of the tip to others to just "take" their spouse like I have successfully done. 

I know may members are suffering and I am trying to offer what has worked for me/us. Sometimes I employ humor and it gets dissed. 

Its a very serious place a lot of the time because the issues are so important and many are hurting badly but I always try to uplift unless I get a little ornery with someone with an epically zhitty attitide and then I get a bit snarky. So sue me. 

I hope this answers your question in a helpful way. If not give me another try


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## WanderingTheDesert (Nov 15, 2012)

NoIssues said:


> Not so much. My situation was more along the lines of I wanted more but was just waiting for her to initiate and it never happened. Now I say vuck that and jump and/or "take" her assertively. She craves that and loves it. My doing that has had some nice results
> 
> 1. More sex
> 2. Hotter marriage
> ...


Thanks for all the info. I certainly was laying out a bit of an insult, but definitely not in your direction. It's other posters I see that are demeaning in their advice. Yours is plain and simple "here's what worked for me. Hope it works for you." Thanks for that. 

Again, congrats on your progress. I wish your method worked for me. I've tried being the perfect husband, tried to be everything she wanted. But the response shows up when I state my needs in writing, and very clearly communicate that I'm checking out of the marriage. I do less around the house, I took a guys trip to Vegas, I do what I want and when I want. I don't give her much thought, except to coordinate child care. That gets the improved response. This isn't the marriage I want, though. It isn't the closeness I was seeking, but it improved the sex dramatically.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## NoIssues (Oct 9, 2011)

*Re: Gave up on the "hope" strategy and started "taking her" Its working*



WanderingTheDesert said:


> That gets the improved response. This isn't the marriage I want, though. It isn't the closeness I was seeking, but it improved the sex dramatically


I advocate ultimatums a lot and 180 type behaviors to prod things off a lazy complacency streak.

I live in the "whatever works" camp and to be very clear I had my turn at an ultimatum a few years after my wifes because I got my zhit together as she demanded and she got a little lazy a few years later. I in turn got annoyed after the gentle stuff didnt work and laid down some law myself.

It worked and we have been good a for several years now but I am on the job 24/7 trying to keep it high quality. 

You can still build that marriage you want by chipping away at things. Ive done it and you seem in a aituation similar to mine a few years ago. 

Keep it going. Get better at it and tune your marriage up on a regular basis just like the car and lawn mower.


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## stevehowefan (Apr 3, 2013)

*Re: Gave up on the "hope" strategy and started "taking her" Its working*

Yeah, it's definitely not the quantity I'm after. It's the quality that I am after. If my wife WANTS to have sex, that in and of itself is enough to keep me satisfied for at least a week, probably more. Plus, she's doing more to flirt with me, showing me attention and such.


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## naga75 (Jul 5, 2012)

*Re: Gave up on the "hope" strategy and started "taking her" Its working*



Middle of Everything said:


> Its not about getting it for me. And truly for the other get rejected/initiate 90% of the time guys/gals on here.
> 
> Not sure of the song title, but for most of us I believe its
> "I want you to want me, I need you to need me."
> ...


i disagree with this, at least in my situation.
stepping up and taking what i wanted actually pushed my wife in the direction of wanting/needing me.
i was in the smae situation as many posting here, rejected constantly "too tired, too late, the kids, this or that etc"...and eventually i just said screw it and stopped initiating and at that point a lot of other things started going downhill in my marriage.
changing that dynamic in my marriage has drastically altered our sex lives. for the better. and it seems the longer the dynamic stays this way, the more my wife initiates (yes she initiates often now). but the point is i dont wait for her to do it, she just does it. if i want to initiate, i dont wait for her to signal, i just do it. thats where being the leader/captain in my marriage has helped (in sex...it has helped in MANY other ways as well).
keep in mind, for the last 8-10 months my wife and i have gotten progressively better at communicating our needs and whatnot. so that has a lot to do with it, too.


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## I got this (Feb 25, 2013)

*Re: Gave up on the "hope" strategy and started "taking her" Its working*



flipflops said:


> When I stopped initiating it because of constant rejection, it didn't make H change his tune at all. I'm still "lucky" to get a few quickies a year.


It seems to me you are missing the point entirely. The point is to "take" your husband instead of self-reject and that in turn results in him doing the same. The better it is the more this is true


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## naga75 (Jul 5, 2012)

flipflops said:


> When I stopped initiating it because of constant rejection, it didn't make H change his tune at all. I'm still "lucky" to get a few quickies a year.


When i stopped initiating with my wife, like i said, my marriage got REAL rocky. I had a lot of resentment and basically stopped caring one way or the other. 
What i am saying is that i stepped up my game (as my wife and i have been slowly fixing our "issues"), and THAT is what changed the dynamic of my marriage. 
When things were all fvcked up between my wife and i, she didnt care that i didnt initiate. She was very likely happy about it. An i didnt care if she was happy or not. 
What i mean is that there is likely (read: certainly) another issue that is leading to the lack of sex.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## naga75 (Jul 5, 2012)

I got this said:


> Ir seems to me you are missing the point entirely. The point is to "take" yu husband insted of self-reject and that in turn results in him doing the same. The better it is the more this is true


Exactly.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## I got this (Feb 25, 2013)

*Re: Gave up on the "hope" strategy and started "taking her" Its working*



flipflops said:


> I've tried "taking" him...didn't work.


Maybe it doesnt work for women to change the dynamic. I dont know but it has worked for me as well to "just do it" 

Maybe its gender specific but it helped my marriage immensely to stop self-rejecting and just "take" her. 

It turned the lights back on and the sex shop was reopened. 

My philosophy was if I self-reject I have no chance. If I try and get shot down, oh well because sometimes I dont. 

I understand the fear of getting shot down again and being wanted but I agree "just do it" creates desire from the other often enough to build from it and rejection never killed anybody so push it because its worth it even with the pain. 

I like pain more than frustration. I made my choice and it worked. My sex life and marriage has gotten infinitely better since I gave up self=rejection and just "took" my wife. It does her a lot of good being wanted and enjoying assertive sex. That relit her desire as well but I made it happen by "taking" her instead of talking myself out of it.


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## I got this (Feb 25, 2013)

*Re: Gave up on the "hope" strategy and started "taking her" Its working*



flipflops said:


> I'm changing the dynamics all right. I'm moving out.


This can work too. I didnt go to that extent but I have given ultimatums and she knew I meant it. She got with the program quick.


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## MeditMike80 (Dec 29, 2012)

*Re: Gave up on the "hope" strategy and started "taking her" Its working*

I recently recovered from a sexless marriage as well. I wrote my wife a very strong letter that I would not stand for a sexless marriage any longer and if that's what she wanted I'd be out the door. After she read it, things started changing and at first it was awkward. Now we haw sex almost daily and she never rejects me. I use the same strategy you use now, I don't ask for it, I just start initiating and she never says no. I think asking for sex, getting mad, pouting, and complaining is a huge turn off for women. Women want a strong man and they want to be "taken" - not against their will, mind you, but they want the man to lead. All I have to do is passionately kiss my wife and she's ready to rip my clothes off.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## donny64 (Apr 21, 2012)

*Re: Gave up on the "hope" strategy and started "taking her" Its working*



> When you're getting what you want, it's easy to tell another guy what his problem is. But do you really know? Is it even possible for you to know?


I'd say I'm getting what my W wants. And that's a lot of sex from me. 

To answer your question, YES, I DO REALLY KNOW. It is possible for me to know. Because I've BEEN THERE. And it was bad enough that I swore off of women and dating for a long time (not just because of that...but it was a big part of it) as a result. I saw the same old thing in so many relationships, and it ...both my own and others', and it turned me off of relationships. Man meets woman. Woman can't stop throwing herself on his penis or taking it in her mouth at every opportunity. This lasts typically until some major event that "links" the couple together in a way neither can easily extract theirselves from. Moving in together. A child. Marriage.

Then one (or both) parties become complacent. They no longer fear their partner just getting up and leaving, because it's no longer so easy for the partner to do that. There will be hoops to jump through to get it done (legal or other). And they get comfortable. And it's just not as exciting or stimulating.

Or, in some cases, it is the old "bait and switch". She uses sex to GET HIM, and once he's HOOKED, she believes she can "relax" (my ex actually TOLD me that. I haven't "been there"?!!!). The "switch" comes in when someone gets too comfortable and too complacent. 

At any rate, a comfortable, complacent person is usually not working on being their best and being attractive to their mate the way they were before when they were trying to "win over and keep" this new prospective mate. 

After a while, one or both are not trying anywhere near as hard. They get rude (because they think they can). Complain about things that really don't matter and make them a big deal (because they think they can). Stop showing affection or earning affection (because they think they can). Depending on how the other partner RESPONDS to this complacency and lack of effort determines how the other person will act in the future.

Listen, you don't have to take my word for it. Look at others here who have climbed, or are in the process of climbing their way out of sexless marriages. 

My point was it was NOT done by getting angry, pouting, whining, or trying to "nice" their way to a piece of azz from their wife by being their wife's house maid, personal chef, and basically her personal b!tch and punching bag. The guys who do have success in turning it around have done so by increasing their attractiveness to their wives (or maintaining what was there originally). That is done by not being complacent themselves. Getting in shape. Doing their part around the house if they weren't already (their part, not their part and hers). By not being her doormat or punching bag. By giving your best effort on a daily basis (we all have bad days, but you have to try), and expecting the same from her.

It is also very much about learning how to deal with rejection in a constructive manner and setting the tone for the future so rejection becomes a thing of the past. Not taking her chit or being afraid of confrontation (constructive confrontation, not arguing, getting pizzed, angry, emotional, etc).

The fact is, and I know a lot of women hate to hear this, but they themselves don't really often know what they want when it comes to this. You will hear from these "LD" women, time and again say....that they're tired. That if you'd just help around the house more they wouldn't be so tired and might get in the mood. That if you'd stop "pestering her" about it, maybe she'd get in the mood. That if you wouldn't "pout" about it when she turned you down, that she might be in the mood (this one is one that has some truth to it). They say this chit a lot of times because they don't know or understand why their sex drive has gone into the basement. All they know is they don't want it, and want to be left alone.

Well, I've got news for you. She's not too tired. Remember when you were dating? How many times could she not keep her hands off of you, despite the fact that you were up partying all night and got 3 hours sleep the night before? It's not about "tired". It's about desire and attraction.

As long as you're doing your part, she doesn't want you to "do more" to get her in the mood. This is an excuse. It's bullchit. If you're doing YOUR part, why should you start doing hers....especially when you're not "getting any" or getting much of anything else in return other than a nagging, constantly "tired", and seemingly constantly pizzed off, unappreciative, unmotivated wife?!!!

What she wants and NEEDS to be in the mood, is to be attracted to you pal. And not just in the "he's hot" physical sense. But also in the way that TRIGGERS ATTRACTION IN HER BRAIN. By being a "catch". A "catch" means she has to PURSUE YOU and CATCH YOU. By being someone worthy of her pursuit, because if she doesn't pursue you, she believes YOU MAY BE GONE. By being someone who respects themselves, and won't put up with less from anyone else. That she believes has enough self respect that he MAY BE GONE if she disrespects him continually by brushing his needs and desires to the side like they don't matter.

And, this is what seemingly every woman DOES KNOW. If you're being a lazy azz, or have taken her for granted, or are being abusive, you are not going to be attracting her for long. If you, now that you are complacent (not you specifically...men in general), are more demonstrative in your anger, yell more, "lose your cool", insult her or call her names, OR act like a doormat to her by avoiding necessary conflict and caving to her on everything "just to keep the peace", SHE IS NOT GOING TO BE ATTRACTED TO THAT!

So yes, I do know. And I did a lot of soul searching, research, and learning before I finally put the pieces of the puzzle together. And then committed to respecting myself and what I wanted out of life enough to follow through with what I learned and deciding I was never going to live that kind of life again, even if the prospect of losing someone was "scary", even if they were "great".

And it works. I didn't just "get lucky" and find an HD woman. She was very LD in her previous marriage. To the point that they had sex "maybe once or twice a year", that she would give in when his complaining got to be too much, that she didn't want it, and she thought something was WRONG WITH HER. She could not figure it out. All she knew, is that she didn't want sex. Well...now she does. And it's not because I look like Mathew Mcconaughey, or have a loaded bank account. It's because despite years of knowing each other, SHE IS STILL CHASING ME, and I AM STILL CHASING HER. I firmly believe, that if I turn into an azz to her, she will likely be GONE. She believes the same about me. THAT, in a nutshell, is what WORKS.


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## NoIssues (Oct 9, 2011)

*Re: Gave up on the "hope" strategy and started "taking her" Its working*



MeditMike80 said:


> I recently recovered from a sexless marriage as well. I wrote my wife a very strong letter that I would not stand for a sexless marriage any longer and if that's what she wanted I'd be out the door.
> 
> After she read it, things started changing and at first it was awkward. Now we haw sex almost daily and she never rejects me. I use the same strategy you use now, I don't ask for it, I just start initiating and she never says no.
> 
> ...


:iagree:

I went thru this too and it is spot on despite the parade of dismissal that will now ensue from those that havent found the key to their wifes sex door YET.


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## NoIssues (Oct 9, 2011)

*Re: Gave up on the "hope" strategy and started "taking her" Its working*



flipflops said:


> I sure hope it does because I refuse to live like this. I'm already seeing changes in both of us. So, that's a good thing.


You have to break through any way you can. Good lucl. It sounds like things are finally in play.


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## naga75 (Jul 5, 2012)

*Re: Gave up on the "hope" strategy and started "taking her" Its working*

Donny is right on.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## DvlsAdvc8 (Feb 15, 2012)

*Re: Gave up on the "hope" strategy and started "taking her" Its working*

Enjoyed reading this thread and I'm just going to chime in with what I've learned... though I probably won't be following the thread. Your mileage may vary... but hopefully its helpful.

Everyone wants to be desired, only "being desired" often means two different things to men and women. Over time, feeling undesired can leave you in a no man's land... seemingly incapable of initiating because you just *know* she's not interested. In truth, you might not even want her as much because you PERCEIVE yourself to be unwanted. Get your head back in the game. You're a man. You're a badass and she wants you. Never waver from this mindset... it goes far in subtle ways you might not even realize. Mind over matter. What you think often becomes reality.

The truth is that many are not initiating in the manner that makes her feel loved. They're initiating from a place of neediness... a place where she is almost like a "tool". Then we wonder why she doesn't really seem interested at all and fall back on waiting for her to initiate. She wants to feel connected, loved and desired, in an emotional way that doesn't mean "just something to stick his junk in".

My advice for those wanting more: engage her sensually OFTEN, without escalating to having sex. Be nonchalant about the actual ACT of intercourse. Stop her. Rub her shoulders. Kiss her neck. Massage her scalp. Tell her: "I love you so much." (the so much is actually important) But don't attach the string that is sex.

Don't escalate because YOU want to... escalate when you perceive that SHE wants to. This is no different than the first time you managed to get her right? Be warm and affectionate... but SENSUAL. You're doing this because you love her, not because you're trying to get sex FROM her. If she complains that she's tired or offers up another excuse, its because she thinks you're doing this to get sex. Don't go into it with that goal. Have the goal of showing your wife you love her. Respond to "I'm tired" with "I know, that's why I thought you could use a shoulder rub." Don't go after the sex. Go after the intimacy.

Repeat this enough without consumation and you'll have built up tension in her. She'll eventually realize you're not just trying to stick tab A in slot B. She'll eventually want you to finish the job. The key is to always build tension and leave her wanting.

And having broken through the perception that you're only doing what you do for sex... that you're actually truly intimate with HER, she'll want you. She'll want you badly.

Both of you are feeling neglected in different ways believe it or not. Most women could be called LD. They're far from it. Its simply that a woman's sex drive is reactive whereas a man's is proactive. There is something that is keeping her closed... something blocking her reactive nature. Find that something and you'll see a LD woman suddenly appear to be HD. Most of the time, its the lack of feeling genuine affection without sexual strings. Lacking emotional intimacy. Other times, the man has sacrificed so much of himself that she loses respect for him. He's asking, begging and pouting over sex. Its hard to respect that guy. Hell, why would she want to have sex with that guy? Get over it by removing sex as the goal. Intimacy is the goal... sex will come.

Bottom line, its on YOU, the man, the proactive sexuality... to act in such a way as to get her reaction. Waiting on a woman to initiate, or giving up too much of your masculine self in the sexual game by seeming needy or otherwise unbalancing the sexual equation has ended many a marriage. Its up to YOU to seduce her and make her want you and you have that power. Sex is not a gift of hers to you.

If the above suggestion doesn't work... make yourself a list of what might be blocking your wife's reactive desire and work on them for a couple weeks at a time if you're not sure what it is. Don't give up, and don't become sexually needy (and my god, don't ASK for sex... women don't want to be asked for sex... this isn't elementary school). There are few things that turn off a woman more than asking for sex. You're a man... you have to tools, knowledge and intelligence to accomplish the task at hand. You're not a child that needs to ask.

It really is up to you to make her want you. Never blame your wife no matter how much you think it appropriate. That path is suicide, and its not what MEN do. If you've honestly, legitimately done all of the above... you're STILL to blame. Because YOU are the one staying with someone who returns you no affection. Own it and you'll be amazed how quickly you fix it.

Good luck! I've been there.


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## I got this (Feb 25, 2013)

*Re: Gave up on the "hope" strategy and started "taking her" Its working*

Donny nailed it. 

I also worked my effin ass off for years like a vucking reading machine like Donny and figured it out. Its about attraction which comes in all forms not the least of which is being worthy of your wife by having your zhit together. 

She isnt tired, shes turned off by you. Fix it. Whining and pleading and being a maid or acting like a woman doesnt work.

Man up and earn back what is yours


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## donny64 (Apr 21, 2012)

*Re: Gave up on the "hope" strategy and started "taking her" Its working*

As a P.S. to my above post...



> It's ridiculous to claim that the response to rejection causes further rejection.


NO, it is NOT. How you deal with and handle an unpleasant experience thrown at you by your partner has VERY MUCH to do with how they will treat you in the future.

Ever hear of a "chit test"? This rejection may not be one, but it is close. Let's say, in the case of a woman who rudely rejects an initiating husband...she throws out the "eye roll", tosses your hand to the side like you're an errant boy reaching for a cookie. Gives you a "tsk, oh gawd, go ahead then", or some such RUDE reaction. How you respond to that has everything to do with how she'll "reject you" in the future, or even if or how much she'll reject you.

If you respond poorly by pouting, begging, whining, yelling, etc., OR by taking her up on her offer of "pity sex" (the "oh, go ahead then"), then it most assuredly WILL increase the chances of it happening again. And again. And again. She has seen a poor reaction from you (anger, begging, lowering yourself to pity sex, etc), and she is going to be disappointed in what she sees. The attraction she had for you starts being chipped away. The more it happens, the more the attraction is chipped away. The more rejection it results in. Because she simply does not "want it" with someone who is becoming less attractive to her, and less worthy of her pursuit (in her eyes).

On the other hand, if you address the rudeness of it first in a calm, firm manner (i.e. "don't treat me like that...I don't do it to you, and I expect you to treat me the same"), and then handle the rejection itself in a calm, UNAFFECTED manner, she likely won't do so very often again (this is assuming you are still otherwise a "catch" that she wants to keep). She got what she wanted (no sex at that moment because perhaps she was feeling good or NOT in the mood for some reason), and you likely maintained your good standing with her, and may have very well increased her attraction for you.

Also, if she has a legitimate reason for not wanting it (really tough day or week, a health issue, etc) and you are not understanding about that, make it about you and your needs over hers (and make her feel like it's just a "stick tab A in slot B" like DvlsAdvc8 alluded to) at that very legitimate moment or time of needing to not have sex or wanting to be intimate, THAT is a death blow to her sexual attraction for you. Possibly moreso than anything else you could do. If you ever make her feel like she's just a receptacle for your junk and really don't care if she's into it, instead of showing her you are just craving being intimate with her and want to be close to her, then you're doomed. There is no short term period of time (months in the case of a some health issues) where your desire for sex should override concern for her well being and understanding that perhaps she can't or shouldn't do (or flat feels like hell and doesnt want to do) anything for a while. Respond to that appropriately and with genuine concern for her, and she will very likely see that, and make sure you're "taken care of" in some form while she recovers from whatever it is that is going on. Respond wrong...get ready for a lot of rejection.

Your response to her actions or inactions has an enormous effect on how she views you and how much she will be attracted to you sexually. Enormous.


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## I got this (Feb 25, 2013)

*Re: Gave up on the "hope" strategy and started "taking her" Its working*



DvlsAdvc8 said:


> 1. Get your head back in the game. You're a man. You're a badass and she wants you. Never waver from this mindset... it goes a long way.
> 
> 2. Most women could be called LD. They're far from it. Its simply that *a woman's sex drive is reactive *whereas a man's is proactive. There is something that is keeping her closed... something blocking her reactive nature. Find that something and you'll see a LD woman suddenly appear to be HD.
> 
> ...


I love these points. I struggled with the rest only because its not MY wifes love langauge and she would see the rest as transparant strategizing for some ass even if its well played. She needs a more aggressive approach but In no way am I dissing. 

I highlight the numbered point above where we agree because in that way we have 99% agreement. This is the most omportant point 

*a woman's sex drive is reactive *

She reacts to what you do. You have to crack the code. When you think about whining, save it and listen instead for the love of happy sex lives and marriages everywhere. Ive heard all the "It takes two" and "yet again another its the mans fault threads" She reacts to you.


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## DvlsAdvc8 (Feb 15, 2012)

*Re: Gave up on the "hope" strategy and started "taking her" Its working*

I hope the guys dealing with this realize that the advice they're getting is the tough love they NEED to get. Its not a put down, and its not dismissive. There's no need to be defensive.

You're a man, now really and truly OWN it. That's really the first step... admitting that it's not her, its ME. Without doing so you'll never escape the downward spiral of resentment.


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## MeditMike80 (Dec 29, 2012)

*Re: Gave up on the "hope" strategy and started "taking her" Its working*

A couple other points I think that can't be emphasized enough:

1. Do not pout, get mad, call names, cry, etc... Presumably, your wife married you because you are the MAN she wanted to spend her life with. If you do those things, she'll no longer view you as a man and shell loose a lot of respect for you. You need to be able to handle rejection in a mature way. Trust me, I did the mad/pouty thing - it did not work. What did work was taking charge of OUR sex life and being the leader in the bedroom. 

2. ALWAYS make sure she is satisfied. Too many women complain that their men don't know how to satisfy them. I live org assuming, I really do, but what I love more is the face of pure ecstasy I'm able to give my wife. If you make sure she's satisfied, she'll do the same for you.

In short, man up and keep her satisfied.

Also realize that sometimes she may not want to have sex with you for perfectly valid reasons and there are valid medical conditions that preclude sex (as others have pointed out).
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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