# Teen--What is a V-use?



## cc48kel

Son is a good-natured boy.. Athletic, awesome grades, doesn't ask for much-- seems to know $$ doesn't grow on trees. There's been a few times that I said 'NO' to him-- he's 16 and wanted to go to a hip hop concert AND also out 'egging' houses with other kids on his team.---WHY would I allow this?? But then again I appreciate his honesty instead of lying which I would've done in my teen years.

I was just in his room and I found this thing like a pen and then 2 small bottles (like a sample cologne). I googled it and it seems like a cigarette OR yes possibly marijuana. OMGOSH I know teens experiment and for all I know it has been there for months. Maybe he bought it to be 'cool'. Anyways, I don't want to flip out too soon.. Should I just monitor--- like if he goes out, does it bring it with?


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## jlg07

It's a VAPE.
https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=vuse

It's for smoking, but with flavored liquids (usually with nicotine in them).


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## happyhusband0005

cc48kel said:


> Son is a good-natured boy.. Athletic, awesome grades, doesn't ask for much-- seems to know $$ doesn't grow on trees. There's been a few times that I said 'NO' to him-- he's 16 and wanted to go to a hip hop concert AND also out 'egging' houses with other kids on his team.---WHY would I allow this?? But then again I appreciate his honesty instead of lying which I would've done in my teen years.
> 
> I was just in his room and I found this thing like a pen and then 2 small bottles (like a sample cologne). I googled it and it seems like a cigarette OR yes possibly marijuana. OMGOSH I know teens experiment and for all I know it has been there for months. Maybe he bought it to be 'cool'. Anyways, I don't want to flip out too soon.. Should I just monitor--- like if he goes out, does it bring it with?


Yep it's a vape pen, most likely nicotine liquid usually the pot vapes have cartridges that are preloaded. Smell the liquid if it's marijuana you'll smell it a little. Junior High and High School vaping has become very very prevalent. I had a friend of my son's, who is a year ahead of him so he is now in Junior High, told me that 70% of the kids in his class vape. Crazy crazy stupid. Bust him now, from what I hear vaping is as if not more addictive than regular smoking. I wouldn't flip on him but better to get away from it now.


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## wilson

You can get those vape pens everywhere. They're sold everywhere that cigarettes are. They're better than cigarettes since there's no smoke, but they still have nicotine, which is addictive. And one problem for teens is that they often ingest a lot of the nicotine at once. So rather than have 1 cigarette worth, they do the whole bottle which is like 20.

Obviously you don't want your kid doing it, but the reality is that he can easily do it. It'd be like saying he can't have soda. A lot of his friends probably do it and he can do it outside the house pretty much anytime. And since it's water vapor, it doesn't leave a lot of smelly residue like cigarettes, so you won't really know if he's using. So I would say talk to him about the risks, but don't come down hard on him like he's doing hard drugs.


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## Rocky Mountain Yeti

This is the modern alternative to smoking. It uses an electronic device to turn a liquid into a vapor which is drawn in just like smoking.

It does not have all the same drawbacks as tobacco, but it is addictive and it is harmful. Just google up effects of vaping to learn more. 

This is especially effective in being marketed to kids as it's a "clean" way to enjoy a variety of flavors. The same pen can be used to change flavor from time to time. Personally, I think it's insidious and went pretty much ballistic when my son did this. Fortunately, he gave it up before he got in too deep.


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## cc48kel

Thank-you so much for your replies!! I have been thinking about all that you have said and I absolutely don't want him to do this even it's the 'norm' for these teens. I'm still going with my gut that he bought it to be 'cool'. I remember MONTHS ago walking into his room and there was an ODD faint smell and some smoke (barely there) by the lamp!! I couldn't figure out what it was and he didn't offer. I'm wondering if he was 'trying it out'. Anyhow, he does have this in his drawer so I will be monitoring it. If it moves, I will have an honest talk about this as this will only lead to other things...


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## personofinterest

Just wondering.....why would a hip hop concert be a big problem?


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## cc48kel

I think it was a rapper... He was 15 at the time and last minute.. just didn't feel comfortable about being so far away and so late at night. In a few years, he'll be free to go as he pleases.


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## Beach123

Careful now... you monitorhisevery move and tell him he can't vape...

...and he's definitely going to keep doing it.whether you like it or not.

If he's doing it - why not have an honest conversation with him?

He's gonna do it anyway - talk to him openly and honestly about his use. Maybe he shouldn't need to hide things from you...

You training him to be honest or sneaky? You can't have both.


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## Blondilocks

Who is buying this product for him? It's typically illegal to sell vaping materials to minors.


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## Not

My daughter and a lot of her friends are using these. They’re safer than smoking, there is no burnt plant material being inhaled. The inventor of the original e-cigarette lost his father due to cancer from smoking and went on a mission to create a safer alternative. He did. There is a lot of hysteria surrounding these things because they look just like smoking but they are a different animal all together. Most people don’t understand them at all. The anti-smoking branch of public health absolutely hates them but many doctors are jumping on board with them because people are quitting smoking in droves with these things. I did.

Tobacco sales have plummeted and now the tobacco industry sees the light hence them now jumping into the vape industry but they most definitely are not the originators of vaping, very far from it. People hear the word nicotine and panick thinking vaping is a tobacco product from the tobacco industry, it’s not. The tobacco industry is a very late entrant into the vaping world and not seeing a whole lot of success actually when compared to the vape shops.

There is nicotine in some of them but they are also sold with no nicotine as well. It’s usually the kids that were already smoking who are using the vapes with nicotine. My daughter and her friends don’t use nicotine. They’re in it more for the fun factor, doing tricks with the vapor and such. I don’t buy them for her and have already told her I won’t because she’s not 18 but high school, they all get what ever they want whenever they want.

There is so much much worse that could be going on. Drugs, alcohol, pot etc. Studies in England have been done showing that teens who vape with no nicotine do not go on to become smokers and do not go on to move into harder substances. All of this information is available online but you have to sift through all of the puritanical scare mongering crap coming out of the US to find it. 

Google Konstantinos Farsalinos. He’s sifts through all the muck for you. He’s a physician out of the Onassis Cardiac center in Athens Greece and has a major interest in this potentially life saving alternative.


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## Edo Edo

cc48kel said:


> Son is a good-natured boy.. Athletic, awesome grades, doesn't ask for much-- seems to know $$ doesn't grow on trees. There's been a few times that I said 'NO' to him-- he's 16 and wanted to go to a hip hop concert AND also out 'egging' houses with other kids on his team.---WHY would I allow this?? But then again I appreciate his honesty instead of lying which I would've done in my teen years.
> 
> I was just in his room and I found this thing like a pen and then 2 small bottles (like a sample cologne). I googled it and it seems like a cigarette OR yes possibly marijuana. OMGOSH I know teens experiment and for all I know it has been there for months. Maybe he bought it to be 'cool'. Anyways, I don't want to flip out too soon.. Should I just monitor--- like if he goes out, does it bring it with?




It's a vaporizer. They're used now instead of smoking to reduce lung damage. By your description, it's probably a cartridge vape that uses nicotine or THC infused liquids. My best advice is not to freak out and overthink the situation. I would approach it the same way you would as if you found a bottle of liquor in his closet. Don't focus on the substance. Focus on the circumstance. And yes, take it away from him if he's only 16. Explain that whatever it is, it's not meant for kids and he's welcome to make these decisions with more discretion when he turns 18 and is out your home...

Good luck to you


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## happyhusband0005

Not said:


> My daughter and a lot of her friends are using these. They’re safer than smoking, there is no burnt plant material being inhaled. The inventor of the original e-cigarette lost his father due to cancer from smoking and went on a mission to create a safer alternative. He did. There is a lot of hysteria surrounding these things because they look just like smoking but they are a different animal all together. Most people don’t understand them at all. The anti-smoking branch of public health absolutely hates them but many doctors are jumping on board with them because people are quitting smoking in droves with these things. I did.
> 
> Tobacco sales have plummeted and now the tobacco industry sees the light hence them now jumping into the vape industry but they most definitely are not the originators of vaping, very far from it. People hear the word nicotine and panick thinking vaping is a tobacco product from the tobacco industry, it’s not. The tobacco industry is a very late entrant into the vaping world and not seeing a whole lot of success actually when compared to the vape shops.
> 
> There is nicotine in some of them but they are also sold with no nicotine as well. It’s usually the kids that were already smoking who are using the vapes with nicotine. My daughter and her friends don’t use nicotine. They’re in it more for the fun factor, doing tricks with the vapor and such. I don’t buy them for her and have already told her I won’t because she’s not 18 but high school, they all get what ever they want whenever they want.
> 
> There is so much much worse that could be going on. Drugs, alcohol, pot etc. Studies in England have been done showing that teens who vape with no nicotine do not go on to become smokers and do not go on to move into harder substances. All of this information is available online but you have to sift through all of the puritanical scare mongering crap coming out of the US to find it.
> 
> Google Konstantinos Farsalinos. He’s sifts through all the muck for you. He’s a physician out of the Onassis Cardiac center in Athens Greece and has a major interest in this potentially life saving alternative.


While vaping is not as bad as the worst possible thing a person could do for their health, lots of studies are now coming out showing the by products produced in the vapor are carcinogenic and damage lung function, other negative affects are similar to smoking it damages taste buds and causes bad breath, nobody like bad breath. Lots of people try and make vaping out to be like sitting in a steam room, it is not.

Very very few users including the teens use the 0% nicotine based products and now they're introducing different liquids which produce a stronger nicotine buzz. I had a prospective tenant who was a vape shop and the owner of that business, who had 6 vapes shops says while he checks kids IDs there are lots of ways for kids to get them usually older high school kids are buying a bunch and selling them at school like a typical drug dealer. I didn't rent to him. 

My approach to the situation would be based on the thinking if they're making that bad of a decision at 14 or 16 how bad are the decisions they're going to be making at 18-20. 

I explain it to my son like this, being cool is about being the leader not the follower, doing something because you think it makes you cooler because other people are doesn't work it makes you a sheep.


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## personofinterest

happyhusband0005 said:


> While vaping is not as bad as the worst possible thing a person could do for their health, lots of studies are now coming out showing the by products produced in the vapor are carcinogenic and damage lung function, other negative affects are similar to smoking it damages taste buds and causes bad breath, nobody like bad breath. Lots of people try and make vaping out to be like sitting in a steam room, it is not.
> 
> Very very few users including the teens use the 0% nicotine based products and now they're introducing different liquids which produce a stronger nicotine buzz. I had a prospective tenant who was a vape shop and the owner of that business, who had 6 vapes shops says while he checks kids IDs there are lots of ways for kids to get them usually older high school kids are buying a bunch and selling them at school like a typical drug dealer. I didn't rent to him.
> 
> My approach to the situation would be based on the thinking if they're making that bad of a decision at 14 or 16 how bad are the decisions they're going to be making at 18-20.
> 
> I explain it to my son like this, being cool is about being the leader not the follower, doing something because you think it makes you cooler because other people are doesn't work it makes you a sheep.


Yes, vaping is known to damage the lungs. I mean jumping from a 2 story building is better than jumping from a 10-story building, but you will still get hurt.


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## Not

personofinterest said:


> Yes, vaping is known to damage the lungs. I mean jumping from a 2 story building is better than jumping from a 10-story building, but you will still get hurt.



With all due respect, no, vaping is not known to cause lung damage because no human has ever been diagnosed with a disease or condition directly attributed to vaping. If that were the case believe you me that would have made national news and there are public health groups just chomping at the bit hoping something exactly like that happens despite the fact that FDA commissioner Scott Gottlieb would like to see every adult smoker fully make the switch over to vaping to greatly improve public health.

I will not debate this issue *because* there is that much misinformation, ignorance and straight up plain hatred of anything that even remotely resembles smoking. It’s a highly charged topic that will be pointless to discuss because of its volatile nature.


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## personofinterest

Wow, defensive much?
With all due respect, I have read various studies. You dont have to like it, but there ARE risks.


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## Not

No, not defensive at all. I thought I worded it as as respectfully as possible, I’m sorry you took offense. 

And now to avoid what’s already started, have a nice day.


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## happyhusband0005

Not said:


> With all due respect, no, vaping is not known to cause lung damage because no human has ever been diagnosed with a disease or condition directly attributed to vaping. If that were the case believe you me that would have made national news and there are public health groups just chomping at the bit hoping something exactly like that happens despite the fact that FDA commissioner Scott Gottlieb would like to see every adult smoker fully make the switch over to vaping to greatly improve public health.
> 
> I will not debate this issue *because* there is that much misinformation, ignorance and straight up plain hatred of anything that even remotely resembles smoking. It’s a highly charged topic that will be pointless to discuss because of its volatile nature.


Yes an doctors use smoke in the exam room with patients with lung problems, they didn't know how bad it was. Numerous studies have been done that clearly show the vapor created by vaping contains multiple carcinogens, byproducts of the chemicals in the liquid being vaporized. Yes vaping is much less dangerous that smoking cigarettes, but it is in no way benign, there are serious risks involved so it's best to not inhale any foreign chemicals into the lungs. And it is still nicotine which is one of the most highly addictive things on earth so it's definitely best not to start to be cool because once you get out of childhood your then doing it because you addicted not because it's cool. 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/nati...ory.html?noredirect=on&utm_term=.d79e30d9b9ee


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## Blondilocks

It doesn't seem that vaping has been around long enough for conclusive studies to have been conducted.


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## personofinterest

Yesterday, The Today Show did a report on a recent FDA study that indicates that vaporing may indeed be dangerous and toxic, especially for young people. So it might be time to climb off the horse. There is actually medical and scientific data out there showing that there is damage that is caused from baby.


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## Elizabeth001

Op...can you look at the bottles to see if the liquid contains nicotine? If it doesn’t, this very well may be a “cool” thing and perhaps it will just be a phase. One thing to note (as a smoker myself) is that if he were addicted at this point, he wouldn’t be leaving it behind. 

Ugh...if I could take back ONE mistake in my life...it would be smoking. Over 30 years later I can’t drop them. I’ll be 50 in the spring and I am REALLY feeling the effects these days. 

Good luck. Keep us posted. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Not

happyhusband0005 said:


> Yes an doctors use smoke in the exam room with patients with lung problems, they didn't know how bad it was. Numerous studies have been done that clearly show the vapor created by vaping contains multiple carcinogens, byproducts of the chemicals in the liquid being vaporized. Yes vaping is much less dangerous that smoking cigarettes, but it is in no way benign, there are serious risks involved so it's best to not inhale any foreign chemicals into the lungs. And it is still nicotine which is one of the most highly addictive things on earth so it's definitely best not to start to be cool because once you get out of childhood your then doing it because you addicted not because it's cool.
> 
> https://www.washingtonpost.com/nati...ory.html?noredirect=on&utm_term=.d79e30d9b9ee



If you’re genuinely interested in learning more about vaping you can start with this...

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/phe-publishes-independent-expert-e-cigarettes-evidence-review

If after reading that you want to learn more I urge you to do your own careful research but keep in mind that what your going to come across is going to lead to total confusion and you’ll have no way of knowing who’s lying and who’s telling the truth. The scientific fraud occurring is unprecedented and I sincerely hope these people are one day held accountable for the damage they’re causing.


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## happyhusband0005

Not said:


> If you’re genuinely interested in learning more about vaping you can start with this...
> 
> https://www.gov.uk/government/news/phe-publishes-independent-expert-e-cigarettes-evidence-review
> 
> If after reading that you want to learn more I urge you to do your own careful research but keep in mind that what your going to come across is going to lead to total confusion and you’ll have no way of knowing who’s lying and who’s telling the truth. The scientific fraud occurring is unprecedented and I sincerely hope these people are one day held accountable for the damage they’re causing.


Yep, the study shows exactly what I said Smoking is not s harmful as smoking cigarettes. But again just because something isn't as bad as something that will flat out kill you eventually doesn't mean it's not harmful. Given the OP is about a kids doing it, that's even more of a reason to not do it. 

This is also a UK study, kids in the UK might not be using these at the same rate as kids in the US because what I am hearing from my kids it the numbers in middle school alone are very high. 

Also the article is coming more from a stance of it can help people quit smoking so that is the benefit of vaping, not that it isn't harmful to tissues of the lungs or that is doesn't lead to heart disease less harmful yes but still harmful. With the huge amount of research done on just the effect of nicotine on the heart alone your looking at bad stuff in the future once a kid gets hooked. There nothing here that would suggest that vaping nicotine magically makes it nonaddictive. 

SO for current smokers of cigarettes vaping is a good thing, for kids who get hooked on nicotine because they started vaping to be cool still BAD. 

Here are facts that are not under debate vaping may be less harmful but nicotine still does the damage.

1. Nicotine is addictive. In fact it's one of the most addictive substances on earth. 
2. Nicotine constricts blood vessels dramatically increasing the risk of heart disease.
3. Nicotine alters the DNA of lung tissues increasing the risk of cancer.

A lot of parents find out their kids are vaping and tell themselves oh this is just a phase. Hopefully they're right but an addiction makes it far less likely to be a phase.


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## personofinterest

When my oldest was going through anxiety and cutting herself in little lines with a razor blade, that was much less Damaging than chopping off her arm. I still didn't want her to do it.


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## Not

happyhusband0005 said:


> Yep, the study shows exactly what I said Smoking is not s harmful as smoking cigarettes. But again just because something isn't as bad as something that will flat out kill you eventually doesn't mean it's not harmful. Given the OP is about a kids doing it, that's even more of a reason to not do it.
> 
> This is also a UK study, kids in the UK might not be using these at the same rate as kids in the US because what I am hearing from my kids it the numbers in middle school alone are very high.
> 
> Also the article is coming more from a stance of it can help people quit smoking so that is the benefit of vaping, not that it isn't harmful to tissues of the lungs or that is doesn't lead to heart disease less harmful yes but still harmful. With the huge amount of research done on just the effect of nicotine on the heart alone your looking at bad stuff in the future once a kid gets hooked. There nothing here that would suggest that vaping nicotine magically makes it nonaddictive.
> 
> SO for current smokers of cigarettes vaping is a good thing, for kids who get hooked on nicotine because they started vaping to be cool still BAD.
> 
> Here are facts that are not under debate vaping may be less harmful but nicotine still does the damage.
> 
> 1. Nicotine is addictive. In fact it's one of the most addictive substances on earth.
> 2. Nicotine constricts blood vessels dramatically increasing the risk of heart disease.
> 3. Nicotine alters the DNA of lung tissues increasing the risk of cancer.
> 
> A lot of parents find out their kids are vaping and tell themselves oh this is just a phase. Hopefully they're right but an addiction makes it far less likely to be a phase.


The article directly addresses the issues with kids, it’s one of the larger points in the article and I feel quite positive that kids in the UK experiment just as much as kids in the US do lol! 

Your focus is not on the kids it’s on the damage to the lungs and other tissues caused by vaping, the hysteria, but there are no published studies bearing this out yet. One very good reason for this is because nothing has happened yet, no one has gotten sick from vaping. That is where things stand right now so it’s absurd to debate that point. Studies done in Petri dishes in labs are mere guesses as to what might happen, not what actually will happen and I find it quite funny that studies are trying to be performed by people who’ve never learned to use the equipment involved, that’s scews any results immediately. 

Nicotine is extremely addictive when it comes in cigarette form not so much when it comes from other sources and that is the most important point when discussing kids and nicotine in vaping. Kids are not getting addicted to nicotine via vaping, it’s just not happening. It’s been shown that vaping as a nicotine delivery source isn’t quite as “effective” as cigarettes but the reason it works for smokers is because the tactile needs are met too, so it works well for smokers but the kids aren’t getting hooked because the nicotine isnt getting delivered as well as it would be in a cigarette. That is a well known fact and is why nicotine replacement therapies have such a dismal success rate! 

Now the V-Use system I’m not as familiar with because I believe that system uses nicotine salts and I’ve not read as much on that. So I can’t comment on that particular type of nicotine but as far as the affects you list for nicotine, yep some people shouldn’t use nicotine especially those with vascular conditions. I’ve never said otherwise but for others it’s perfectly safe and not a whole lot different than caffeine as far as effects go. Nicotine is one of those things where the poison is in the dose and there actually haven’t been any serious studies done on nic by itself, outside of cigarettes. This is why we’ve never seen news casts or articles screaming about death or injury by nicotine alone. It just doesn’t exist. Sure, intake to much nic and you’ll feel like crap but unless you already have a health condition where using nicotine wouldn’t be the wisest choice it’s not going to cause you injury. 

I’ve read about the nicotine in cigarettes changing the chemical signals in the brain over time which is one of the reasons why nic in cigarettes is more risky but not once over my years of research have I read about nicotine affecting DNA in a detrimental way so I can’t comment on that. You would have to post some peer reviewed research on that for me to look over but it has to be research done on nic, not cigarettes.


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## Edo Edo

personofinterest said:


> Yesterday, The Today Show did a report on a recent FDA study that indicates that vaporing may indeed be dangerous and toxic, especially for young people. So it might be time to climb off the horse. There is actually medical and scientific data out there showing that there is damage that is caused from baby.



I'm curious as to which type of vaping? Cannabis or nicotine? Dry herb vaping or the type with the premade liquid cartridges? I heard of one done in Canada that reflected that the liquid cartridges of both varieties (THC and nicotine) contained some possible harmful substances, but the types that just heated the dried plant/bud matter (as opposed to inhaling the burned smoke) causes substantially less damage to lungs (and in the case of cannabis inhalation, virtually none at all).


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## happyhusband0005

Not said:


> The article directly addresses the issues with kids, it’s one of the larger points in the article and I feel quite positive that kids in the UK experiment just as much as kids in the US do lol!
> 
> Your focus is not on the kids it’s on the damage to the lungs and other tissues caused by vaping, the hysteria, but there are no published studies bearing this out yet. One very good reason for this is because nothing has happened yet, no one has gotten sick from vaping. That is where things stand right now so it’s absurd to debate that point. Studies done in Petri dishes in labs are mere guesses as to what might happen, not what actually will happen and I find it quite funny that studies are trying to be performed by people who’ve never learned to use the equipment involved, that’s scews any results immediately.
> 
> Nicotine is extremely addictive when it comes in cigarette form not so much when it comes from other sources and that is the most important point when discussing kids and nicotine in vaping. Kids are not getting addicted to nicotine via vaping, it’s just not happening. It’s been shown that vaping as a nicotine delivery source isn’t quite as “effective” as cigarettes but the reason it works for smokers is because the tactile needs are met too, so it works well for smokers but the kids aren’t getting hooked because the nicotine isnt getting delivered as well as it would be in a cigarette. That is a well known fact and is why nicotine replacement therapies have such a dismal success rate!
> 
> *First the type of nicotine used in the majority of e-cigarettes is free base nicotine which is more easily absorbed into the blood stream making it highly addictive. Some kids mat not become addicted because they do not frequently use, but because of the fact that the brain is still developing until about the age 25 kids are also more likely to form addictions than adults. Nicotine is addictive no matter what form it is in but the kind that is in mot e-cigarettes is the worst. The tobacco industry funded plenty of peer reviewed studies showing how nicotine wasn't addictive and wasn't harmful for years and years we are now in that cycle with E-cigarettes.*
> 
> Now the V-Use system I’m not as familiar with because I believe that system uses nicotine salts and I’ve not read as much on that. So I can’t comment on that particular type of nicotine but as far as the affects you list for nicotine, yep some people shouldn’t use nicotine especially those with vascular conditions. I’ve never said otherwise but for others it’s perfectly safe and not a whole lot different than caffeine as far as effects go. Nicotine is one of those things where the poison is in the dose and there actually haven’t been any serious studies done on nic by itself, outside of cigarettes. This is why we’ve never seen news casts or articles screaming about death or injury by nicotine alone. It just doesn’t exist. Sure, intake to much nic and you’ll feel like crap but unless you already have a health condition where using nicotine wouldn’t be the wisest choice it’s not going to cause you injury.
> 
> I’ve read about the nicotine in cigarettes changing the chemical signals in the brain over time which is one of the reasons why nic in cigarettes is more risky but not once over my years of research have I read about nicotine affecting DNA in a detrimental way so I can’t comment on that. You would have to post some peer reviewed research on that for me to look over but it has to be research done on nic, not cigarettes.


Here's my main point, you will not find too many long term smokers who will tell you the don't regret starting. You are correct that the newness of E-cigarettes means there are no long term studies do you want your kid to be hooked when they do. There are also NO studies that I could find that say there is no health risks associated with vaping. Less then smoking yes but still risks which was my first and main point. 

There have been studies done which show daily use of e-cigarettes double the risk of heart attack, the good news is the risk for e-cigarette users seems to drop much faster once they stop. Just google it plenty of peer reviewed ones published in scientific journals. 

Look along with research I like to use common sense, is it a good idea to inhale foreign particles of any kind into your lungs? Is it good to inhale carcinogens of any kind or concentration into your lungs? Is it good to use a chemical known to be highly addictive?

E-cigarettes are a good product for people trying to get off cigarettes but not a great thing for kids trying to be cool. I would much rather see a kid vaping than smoking a cigarette but more kids seem to be vaping than ones who were smoking in the past.


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## personofinterest

Honestly....

This is why it's probably more important to be a good parent than a cool.parent


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## Not

happyhusband0005 said:


> Here's my main point, you will not find too many long term smokers who will tell you the don't regret starting. You are correct that the newness of E-cigarettes means there are no long term studies do you want your kid to be hooked when they do. There are also NO studies that I could find that say there is no health risks associated with vaping. Less then smoking yes but still risks which was my first and main point.


I never said anything about smokers not regretting starting smoking. I think we’re talking circles around each other. In your next sentence you ask me if I want my kid hooked and I’ve explained to you that current research, at this time, clearly shows an extremely low risk for that happening. Less than 1% percent sounds pretty damn good to me and it’s keeping her away from experimenting with the real thing. I feel better knowing that that is the case. I also said I do not buy this stuff for her and I will add that I can’t be with her every second of everyday to protect her. She knows how I feel about her using it but outside of chaining her to my side I can’t control what she does when I’m not around. 

To your next sentence, I have never stated that there are no risks with vaping because at this time it’s a complete unknown and for every study claiming there is a risk there is another study stating the methodology in the first study was flawed or it was funded by an anti-smoking group or a vape group or that in vitro results can never apply to in vivo which would render all current research null. It’s a literal circus. I would like the truth, whatever it is, but that will be a long time in coming. 

Let me reiterate for you. I am not stating that vaping either is or is not safe, no one knows that answer, only that it’s been proven to be safer than smoking, 95% safer. So we are saying the same thing. And of course it’s not a good idea to inhale anything but clean air but where can I find some? The air in our homes is dirtier than the air outside and the air outside isn’t much better unless you live in the Antarctic. Everytime you cook food on the stove your inhaling things that shouldn’t be inhaled, when you burn candles, live in a home with carpet etc. There is no safe anything unless one lives in a bubble.

If nicotine is damaging the young developing brains of our kids, including kids from years and years ago who are now fully grown, why is there not an obvious well known medical term, or condition, for all these now grown kids who are suffering from this supposed brain damage caused by nicotine? If it exists it should be something we’re all aware of, it should be a well documented medical condition in millions and millions of adults world wide. 

As for nicotine being the most addictive substance on the planet, if true, I have to ask....And? Outside of people with medical conditions who shouldn’t use nicotine, sans cigarettes, what detrimental effects is nicotine inflicting on society today? Is it producing higher crime rates? It doesn’t affect your sobriety so it’s not anything like what the typical addict experiences as far as drug addiction goes or causing fatal traffic accidents. Does it play a role in work ethic? Does it tear families apart? Remember, I’m talking about nicotine outside of cigarettes so the only information we could really go by at this time, as far as long term goes, is nicotine replace therapy and I feel it’s safe to say that nicotine replacement therapies have had zero negative affect on society. So what does stating it’s the most addictive drug on the planet mean as far as daily living goes, life in general? Not a whole lot. 

And it’s funny that you mention the tobacco companies research from years past showing that nicotine is not the problem. They were onto something, but who would believe the tobacco companies, then or now? No one. They are their own worst enemy.

So we’ve established that nothing is absolutely safe, including vaping, so where to go from here? No where until a definitive answer is given to us and that answer will not be found on this two page thread on a discussion forum for marraige. What to do about the kids in the meantime? Good luck with that.


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## happyhusband0005

Not said:


> I never said anything about smokers not regretting starting smoking. I think we’re talking circles around each other. In your next sentence you ask me if I want my kid hooked and I’ve explained to you that current research, at this time, clearly shows an extremely low risk for that happening. Less than 1% percent sounds pretty damn good to me and it’s keeping her away from experimenting with the real thing. I feel better knowing that that is the case. I also said I do not buy this stuff for her and I will add that I can’t be with her every second of everyday to protect her. She knows how I feel about her using it but outside of chaining her to my side I can’t control what she does when I’m not around.
> 
> *I'm not shaming you for your daughter using it. Kids are going to do some dumb things, I know I did a lot of dumb things, hell I'm actually surprised I survived my teenage years, I mean I did some really really dumb stuff, my point has nothing to do with you personally or your daughter using it. Hopefully she only does it every now and then which greatly reduces the risk of getting addicted. If your disapproving of it thats great and probably helping to prevent her from becoming addictive, regular use will lead to addiction, it's nicotine there is no way around that. But seriously I'm not swiping at you or your daughter, your in the same boat apparently as a huge percentage of families.What I think is very positive is you know about it and can keep an eye on it so you know if it gets too regular. It's better to know and be able to keep an eye on it and talk about it than not. *
> 
> To your next sentence, I have never stated that there are no risks with vaping because at this time it’s a complete unknown and for every study claiming there is a risk there is another study stating the methodology in the first study was flawed or it was funded by an anti-smoking group or a vape group or that in vitro results can never apply to in vivo which would render all current research null. It’s a literal circus. I would like the truth, whatever it is, but that will be a long time in coming.
> 
> *This is true which is why you have to rely on common sense. Introducing addictive stuff which is known to be carcinogenic and at least likely to result in damage to the lungs and cardiovascular system is smart to avoid.*
> 
> Let me reiterate for you. I am not stating that vaping either is or is not safe, no one knows that answer, only that it’s been proven to be safer than smoking, 95% safer. So we are saying the same thing. And of course it’s not a good idea to inhale anything but clean air but where can I find some? The air in our homes is dirtier than the air outside and the air outside isn’t much better unless you live in the Antarctic. Everytime you cook food on the stove your inhaling things that shouldn’t be inhaled, when you burn candles, live in a home with carpet etc. There is no safe anything unless one lives in a bubble.
> 
> *All true but a lot of that you don't have a choice in you can chose to vape or not to vape.*
> 
> If nicotine is damaging the young developing brains of our kids, including kids from years and years ago who are now fully grown, why is there not an obvious well known medical term, or condition, for all these now grown kids who are suffering from this supposed brain damage caused by nicotine? If it exists it should be something we’re all aware of, it should be a well documented medical condition in millions and millions of adults world wide.
> 
> *It is it's called addiction. Children who become addicted to something are also more likely to become addicted to other things like alcohol or prescription meds later in life. *
> 
> As for nicotine being the most addictive substance on the planet, if true, I have to ask....And? Outside of people with medical conditions who shouldn’t use nicotine, sans cigarettes, what detrimental effects is nicotine inflicting on society today? Is it producing higher crime rates? It doesn’t affect your sobriety so it’s not anything like what the typical addict experiences as far as drug addiction goes or causing fatal traffic accidents. Does it play a role in work ethic? Does it tear families apart? Remember, I’m talking about nicotine outside of cigarettes so the only information we could really go by at this time, as far as long term goes, is nicotine replace therapy and I feel it’s safe to say that nicotine replacement therapies have had zero negative affect on society. So what does stating it’s the most addictive drug on the planet mean as far as daily living goes, life in general? Not a whole lot.
> 
> *No Nicotine has no negative effect on society except higher medical costs globally. But no it's not some evil thing. I'm not saying it should be outlawed or that people who use it are bad, but we should do everything we can to prevent our kids from forming a habit that will lead to shorter life spans higher medical costs and other issues. For example there are employers out there who will try to figure out if a job candidate is a smoker and will not hire them if they know they are. *
> 
> And it’s funny that you mention the tobacco companies research from years past showing that nicotine is not the problem. They were onto something, but who would believe the tobacco companies, then or now? No one. They are their own worst enemy.
> 
> *Eventually the tobacco companies were forced to admit the product is addictive and causes disease. Unfortunately for them science always wins.*
> 
> So we’ve established that nothing is absolutely safe, including vaping, so where to go from here? No where until a definitive answer is given to us and that answer will not be found on this two page thread on a discussion forum for marraige. What to do about the kids in the meantime? Good luck with that.
> 
> *Yes good luck to all of us. We all do the best we can and I discuss this stuff with my kids and their friends all the time. They're all in the 10-13 year old range so it's coming. Luckily right now they have developed a strong disposition against it but who knows what will happen when they get to Junior high and high school. Another positive is my son and all his friends who are all athletes got to meet Tom Brady who told them all to stay away from it because "you'll never be a top athlete if you do". Maybe they'll ignore mom and dad hopefully they listen to Mr. Thomas Edward Patrick Brady Jr. But he also told them avocado ice cream is good so who knows. *


By the way the difference with salt nicotine stuff produces a faster and stronger buzz than the normal liquids, not surprisingly these are the ones the kids tend to use. You mentioned you didn't know about it but that seems to be the main difference I'm sure theres more to it.


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## cc48kel

Thank-you for your replies... I did talk with an 18 yr old and she told me that she has it to be cool-- apparently, she has a set of friends that do it. The flavored kind. But also said she has outgrown it now and used it more in her freshman year. Talked with a 60 yr old guy and says when he gets together with his friends, many of the wives use the vapor marijuana which is interesting. He didn't think it was a big deal and told me his kids use vaper-- they are in their late 20's. My son-- It's been in the same spot until a week ago--- I told him to clean out his drawers and now it's gone. But it was there for a long time and he has been out with friends and Holloween parties too. So my guess is he bought it to be cool. 

I did not tell him that I was 'snooping' in his drawer BUT I do have many conversations about making good choices and to do the right thing when out and about. I remind him that he has too much going for him to mess it up and that we as a family would be devastated if he got hooked on anything. He says 'I know' or 'do you think I'm stupid". I also asked him if kids are smoking in HS and he said no-- most use vapor or pills!! I asked what kind of pills-- and he had no idea but could tell the kids that use pills.. So I truly believe him, of course, I will keep an eye out and continue to have these conversations. I will look for the 'Today Show' segment and send it to him for his viewing. Between school, sports and a job that he recently got-- he'll have no time to misbehave.


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## Beach123

It's not misbehaving. 

Why didn't you just be honest with him? Tell him you found it and want to know more about why he's using it?


Somehow I find your conversation with him shame filled and with a kid who's expectations are high - you're going to have a hard time having him be open to dialog with you if you guilt him and shame him while talking with him...

Can you try and open up an HONEST conversation with him?



And what kind of pills? Stay up to date on what's happening with teenagers - OxyContin... ya, heroin in a pill. It processes in the body as heroin.

There's many more - check things out Momma!


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