# Headed for divorce



## solost99 (May 18, 2014)

A little over two month ago my wife came to me and out of the blue began naming off a list of everything I had ever did wrong over the last 7 years of our relationship. I listened without speaking because this took me by surprise. She had never acted like this before. Most of the complaints were things I had did 3 to 4+ years ago. We have only been married 2 years. I finished eating and then went to the bedroom where she had returned to. After a few minutes of probing it came out that there was someone else. A man she works with. She clams that is was not physical and I have yet to discover one piece of evidence that confirms it is. So I believe that to be the truth. This was on a Thursday evening. Friday, Saturday and Sunday we tried to spend time together and work on things but there was just no love from her and on Monday she left. She has been staying with family since. We have been to counseling twice but for now the counselor is seeing her individually. We didn't get anywhere in the two visits. 

My wife says she is confused. She says that she really isn't sure if she likes this guy and that if he were not involved she would have left me anyway and that this is just the result of my past behavior. She says she has fallen out of love with me. She says she does not want a divorce and wants to want to work on our marriage. She did go to counseling but really isn't taking the advice we are given because she does not believe the guy is part if the problem. The only advice she has taken is that she set a date to decide if she wants to move back in and work on the marriage or end it. That date is July 1 2014.

Since she left she has spent maybe two or three nights with me but no physical contact. But one day at the one month mark she stopped by after work and we randomly had sex. It was great but afterward she cried because she felt like she was leading me on and making me feel like everything was okay. That was the only time since she has been gone that we had sex. We are typically seeing each other 4-5 times a week. Eat dinner together hang out with another married couple things like that. She wont let me kiss her on the mouth. 

I told her that to help her figure out if she liked this guy or not they could spend sometime together outside of work. Three days later him and her went to dinner when her plans with her girlfriends got canceled. I have few details about the date other than she said it was "fine" and "nothing special". And that he paid for dinner. I don't know if this was a good idea or not. I would like advice on it.

As far as this man is concerned: He is single, 29, lives with his parents, hasn't been in a relationship since high-school and is over weight but working on it. What he has going for him is that he is tall, makes her feel good because he is funny, not so serious like me and has wealthy parents. I do believe that he himself is not as wealthy as my wife thinks. And by wealthy I don't mean rich. Just upper working class. She also believe he would make a better father for her children because he is better with kids than me. He actually seems to be a good guy because he has told her that she needs to go home and work things out with me. 

To give you guys some background I'm 23, she is 24. We dated for 5 years and have been married for two. We bought and remodeled our first house a year ago. We have been living in it for 6 months. We lived together at my parents for 3 years or so before moving out. She got her first real job 6 months ago and this is where she met the man. This is the first time she makes enough money to support herself. I have always been the primary provider until now. 5 days before she broke down I passed the exam necessary for me to open a business in my trade. She did not support the idea of me starting a business. Her parents are divorced and have been so since she was a baby. She comes from a very poor single mother family. My parents have been unhappily married for 40 + years and are lower working class. 

Since she has left she has spent a considerable amount of money on things I did not approve of. Excessive hair, nail and tanning products and services as well as a few random purchases. She has also given some money away to her family and is now talking about buying a car. I am very conservative as I have had to be to support us, buy us vehicles and a home on my income alone. 

So I'm really not sure what questions I need to be asking but here is my goal. I want to save my marriage and I would like to do so with the help of you good people here. 

My initial questions are:

From what you read above what have I done wrong and what do I need to do different? 

I feel like I need to make some kind of a bold move to snap her back into reality. But I don't know what and I'm scared of it backfiring. 

Thank you for your responses. Ask me questions to help you give me good advice.


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## mablenc (Feb 26, 2013)

Sorry you are here, read this, it will help you if you follow it.

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/32002-welcome-tam-cwi-newbies-please-read.html
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

She is in a physical relationship with the other man (OM). Get that straight. She moved out so she could be with him without you interfering. 

Their relationship has probably gone on longer than you realize. She was probably planning her exit years ago. 

My advice is to stop wasting money on counseling. You're flushing money down the toilet as long as the OM is in the picture. As long as the OM is around you have no shot at reconcilliation. 
He has her heart and mind. You cannot compete with him. The reason she cried when you had sex is that she felt she was cheating on him with you. He had taken your place in her heart. 

Take the money you are spending on counseling and hire a lawyer and file for divorce. Stop this circus now. Stop talking to her. Pack up all get remaining belongings and send word for her to come pick them up. Go dark and cut all contact with her except through your lawyer.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

You are young, OP. Best to let her figure these things out on her own, and just move on with your life. I would file if I were you.


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## solost99 (May 18, 2014)

bandit.45 said:


> She is in a physical relationship with the other man (OM). Get that straight. She moved out so she could be with him without you interfering.
> 
> Their relationship has probably gone on longer than you realize. She was probably planning her exit years ago.
> 
> ...


I am not defending her and I do realize that I could be wrong but I truly believe that it isn't physical. I have dedicated a lot of time to exhausting many resources and doing a lot of stalking and there just isn't any time for it. Another thing that she likes about him is that he is religious. 

I sincerely appreciate your insight as to why she cried. I really hadn't thought about it form that perspective. I believe you are on to something.

I couldn't agree with you more about counseling. They just let us talk and we get nowhere.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

*Bandit is totally correct! Whenever a spouse offers up to the other spouse that they are not participatory in a physical relationship with someone else, all that really is just "cheaterspeak" for trickle-truthing.

She's bringing up these latent "negative things" about you to your face in order to justify her feelings in continuing to see this lout. And since it's obvious that she's not spreading "her wings" for you is sadly indicative that they are being readily spread in some other quarters, and most likely for him. These complaints of hers are nothing more than a mechanism of her creating even more distance between the two of you to help her justify her continuance of the affair!

I'd say good riddance! You absolutely deserve far better out of life!*


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## jnj express (Mar 28, 2011)

You start D proceedings---as of now---she is dictating YOUR future----time for you to take control of your situation

Lets see how she really handles things when she is faced with a D---also from what it sounds like---both of you married to early---she has figured it out, and wants to move on---if that is the case---then you are better off, becoming single---and starting over


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## solost99 (May 18, 2014)

arbitrator said:


> *Bandit is totally correct! Whenever a spouse offers up that they are not in a physical relationship with someone, that is just "cheaterspeak" for trickle-truthing.
> 
> She's bring up these latent "negative things" about you to justify her feelings for continuing to see this lout. And since it's obvious that she's not spreading "her wings" for you is sadly indicative that they are being spread in some other quarters, most likely for him. These complaints are nothing more than her creating even more distance between the two of you to help her justify the continuance of the affair!
> 
> I'd say good riddance! You absolutely deserve far better out of life!*


I guess the truth is just hard to accept. I just don't see when they would be doing anything besides work. I watched them for their entire date. No physical contact and it was just dinner and back home. I gave them a free pass basically. I do know that they go to lunch together everyday for work and that parts of their job does involve them being out of the office together


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## poida (Jan 17, 2014)

bandit.45 said:


> She is in a physical relationship with the other man (OM). Get that straight. She moved out so she could be with him without you interfering.
> 
> Their relationship has probably gone on longer than you realize. She was probably planning her exit years ago.
> 
> ...


6 months ago, I would have scoffed at this response, but Bandit will be 100% right. Do not doubt it. I have seen it with my own eyes now.

She is no longer with you and mentally she has been gone and with the OM for a long time. 

IF you do want to try to save the marriage (as I did), you need to go 180 immediately and HARD. Cancel all MC, kick her out of the house immediately, move ALL her stuff out (important), don't contact her and file divorce. You need to let her figure this out herself. You can't tell her anything.

This is your ONLY chance to get her to really think about what she has done. At the moment, she is in love land with the OM and isn't thinking practically about her situation. She is totally pre-occupied by her fantasy of a new and exciting life.

Go to the gym. Get fit, get your head straight. Being where I am now, I would advise going on a few dates if you feel comfortable doing so. It will give you a better perspective sooner and it will make her think twice and eventually make her jealous as heck.

Most importantly, start personal counselling. Figure yourself out. Figure out if you are happy or if you are indeed miserable as I found out. Get yourself happy again. This will be the biggest magnet to other women.

If she comes back to you after all this, you might have somewhere to start from. 

For me, my WW wasn't willing to talk about the hard stuff or find a way to meet my emotional needs in the relationship. She simply isn't capable and never has been. For you, it could be different, but you have to do it HARD and do it immediately.


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## solost99 (May 18, 2014)

jnj express said:


> You start D proceedings---as of now---she is dictating YOUR future----time for you to take control of your situation
> 
> Lets see how she really handles things when she is faced with a D---also from what it sounds like---both of you married to early---she has figured it out, and wants to move on---if that is the case---then you are better off, becoming single---and starting over


When I told her they could spend time together she basically told me I could sleep with other women. Just said to be careful. 

I am beginning to consider the D


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

solost99 said:


> I guess the truth is just hard to accept. I just don't see when they would be doing anything besides work. I watched them for their entire date. No physical contact and it was just dinner and back home. I gave them a free pass basically. I do know that they go to lunch together everyday for work and that parts of their job does involve them being out of the office together


Serve her at work for effect and change the locks.


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

And separate your finances on Monday so you don't get screwed.


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## Turin74 (Apr 11, 2014)

'what have I done wrong?'I
Well my reading of your post is that so fast you have done... nothing (apologies if harsh). What I've learned first hand, is the faster and more decisively you act the better outcome you'll get. So stop procrastinating (I do understand this is very hard). Prepare the plan / to do list (there well be no shortage of advice on what it sold be based on) and check, check, check. Any day you can't check out an item in it (e.g. waiting for atty appointment) work on yourself, job/gym/fun, etc. The only way out imho.

_Posted via *Topify* on Android_


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

If you knew how many betrayed spouses we've had filter through TAM who insisted their wayward spouses were not having sex with their affair partners....

A wayward will come up with drastic measures to have their fun and not get caught. 

Thorburn's former wayward wife would leave her work at lunch, pick up her affair partner, drive out to the woods and have sex in the back of her SUV. She had made the SUV into a moveable fvck pad. Then she would be back to work and no one knew the difference. 

She is not living with you. Unless you stalk her 24/7 you have no clue what she's up to. No clue. So don't even raise that argument.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## verpin zal (Feb 23, 2013)

solost99 said:


> A little over two month ago my wife came to me and out of the blue began naming off a list of everything I had ever did wrong over the last 7 years of our relationship. I listened without speaking because this took me by surprise. She had never acted like this before. Most of the complaints were things I had did 3 to 4+ years ago. We have only been married 2 years. I finished eating and then went to the bedroom where she had returned to. After a few minutes of probing it came out that there was someone else. A man she works with. She clams that is was not physical and I have yet to discover one piece of evidence that confirms it is. So I believe that to be the truth. This was on a Thursday evening. Friday, Saturday and Sunday we tried to spend time together and work on things but there was just no love from her and on Monday she left. She has been staying with family since. We have been to counseling twice but for now the counselor is seeing her individually. We didn't get anywhere in the two visits.
> 
> *My wife says she is confused.* She says that she really isn't sure if she likes this guy and that if he were not involved she would have left me anyway and that this is just the result of my past behavior. She says she has fallen out of love with me. She says she does not want a divorce and wants to want to work on our marriage. She did go to counseling but really isn't taking the advice we are given because she does not believe the guy is part if the problem. The only advice she has taken is that she set a date to decide if she wants to move back in and work on the marriage or end it. That date is July 1 2014.
> 
> ...


Divorce papers are well known to unconfuse individuals like your wife. In a few seconds, no less. Those papers un-confuse the mind, un-complicate the relationship, un-rewrite the marital history, un-fog the battlefield and un-lessen your confidence.

Stand up for yourself.


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## solost99 (May 18, 2014)

tom67 said:


> And separate your finances on Monday so you don't get screwed.


What exactly do you mean. We have no joint accounts. Only the house is shared


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

verpin zal said:


> Divorce papers are well known to unconfuse individuals like your wife. In a few seconds, no less. Those papers un-confuse the mind, un-complicate the relationship, un-rewrite the marital history, un-fog the battlefield and un-lessen your confidence.
> 
> Stand up for yourself.


Sometimes....

Sometimes they smile and say "Wow! Thanks!"
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## solost99 (May 18, 2014)

verpin zal said:


> Divorce papers are well known to unconfuse individuals like your wife. In a few seconds, no less. Those papers un-confuse the mind, un-complicate the relationship, un-rewrite the marital history, un-fog the battlefield and un-lessen your confidence.
> 
> Stand up for yourself.


I will work on those Monday if everyone agrees that it is a good route to take.


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## bryanp (Aug 25, 2011)

You said that she could spend time with the OM and her response to you was that you could sleep with other women. Think about this. The only reason she that to you is because she is sleeping with the OM. If she was not sleeping with him why would she say that to you? She pretty much just confessed to you about her cheating.


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

Agreed. She is going by the cheaters handbook page for page. 

Another religious adulteress. I get a kick out of them. Just like Zanne.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## phillybeffandswiss (Jan 20, 2013)

solost99 said:


> I am not defending her and I do realize that I could be wrong but I truly believe that it isn't physical.


When you get enough posts, look up a poster named JBird. Your OP sounds very close to his, even to the point where she moved out. Then he monitored her and found out they had sex a ton. He also found out she was upset way back in 2009......... He believed as well, to the point were some poster upset him.


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## Pinkpetal (Jan 2, 2014)

You are both very young. Sometimes as we mature what we want in life changes. I think that is what has happened for your wife. Married only 2 years and yet she is taking her vows to you so very lightly. 

You have done nothing wrong here OP. Indeed, when your wife gave her permission for you to see other women, it was really about giving herself permission to carry on. I don't think you have any real hope while this other guy is still around. It really bothers me when people make their choice to check out of a relationship but never get around to informing their spouse. Words like "Im confused" or "Im not sure what I want" in my opinion are nothing less than cowardly and keep a spouse holding on. I believe that your wife has made a choice and knows exactly what she wants - she just can't look you in the eye and say it. She's not being fair. 

Im sorry OP, but it doesn't look good. My advice to you echoes what everybody else has been saying - time to move on. I know its hard to hear, but take it from someone who has been divorced - there is most definitely better love out there for you. 

Best to you.


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

SoLost


Divorce papers are a must.

Do it tomorrow.

Your wife is playing you. And by you letting her make the decisions, setting the date when she will make a decision about "your" marriage and then giving her a free pass with the OM shows her just how weak you are.

So do some thing different.

Show her consequences for her horrible decisions.

Go see an attorney.

Have divorce papers drawn up.

Have her served at work so her OM/coworker and well as the entire office knows why she is being served divorce papers.

Do not broadcast your intentions. You want to shock her. Hopefully wake her up.

She will angry good. When she goes off tell her that she is cheating on you and that you have reached your date in your mind.

Tell her you realize you don't really know her and that she has turned out to be a big disappointment.

Also, discuss her recent $$$ spent with your attorney. Do not let her run up big debts that you will be stuck with.

I understand you want to reconcile but if I was your age and had a wife acting like yours I would dump asap and go find a good woman that earns her own keep and values you.

The OM is a tool. 29 and still living of mummy and daddy.

They deserve each other.

Get tough my man. Show her consequences and stick to them.

HM


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

solost99 said:


> What exactly do you mean. We have no joint accounts. Only the house is shared


Good.
Now go see a lawyer.


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## barbados (Aug 30, 2012)

You're taking this kind of crap from her at the age of 23 and with no kids ?!?!

SERIOUSLY ??? 

Get out of this marriage ASAP !


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## manticore (Sep 3, 2013)

bandit.45 said:


> She is in a physical relationship with the other man (OM). Get that straight. She moved out so she could be with him without you interfering.
> 
> Their relationship has probably gone on longer than you realize. She was probably planning her exit years ago.
> 
> ...


OP I agree with most of what bandit said, and normally in a situation similar to yours I would say that things have gone physical or were physical before she moved out, but in your particular case you could be right and maybe she isn't physical with him yet or at least she wasn't until she moved out.

but if you are right then things are worst of what you think because it means that she is the agressor and she is commited to do everything or leave everything to have a relationship with him.

they way you described the OM if true then he is not a master manupilator that is using your wife for sex playing her for a fool, I mean he openly has admitted to her that he has not been in a relationship in more that 10 years, he is living with his parents, he is overweight (these are factors that normally will turn off any woman), I can easily imagine him as the classic chubby guy that is cheerful trying to be liked by everyone for his lack of confidence.

Again if things are really as you said then he have not many options regarding female partners so I don't see why he would be rejecting your wife as an eager woman to have a relationship with him maybe he really is a decent guy as you think, but again if this is truth that it means that is worst for you, becuase if he is not willing to engage a realtionship with her until yours and her is settled, it means that all her acts of talking of ending the relationship with you, moving out, wanting to take a time off, is just to have a shot with him.

so you have two escenarios here:

- 1. what would be the normally in a situation like yours, where she had a full blown affair and is so infautuated with the OM that is using her for sex and is buying all his crap about how he can not have a serious relationship with her until she leaves you.

- 2. yours that is even worst, she is willing to give up everything with you to have a shot with him and she is just waiting for him to give the last step for things to become physical and then once that he says that he wants a realtionship with her, she will proceed with divorce (after all she does not want to lose her back up plan (you) until he say yes).

so I agree with bandit in that regard, whatever the escenario you are just a back up plan and you should file, maybe that will help her to see that you are not a sure thing and come to her senses.


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## BobSimmons (Mar 2, 2013)

A man never helps the woman he loves go on a date with another man so she can figure out if she likes him.

By that way of thinking you might as well give her a divorce, so she can really spread her wings without committing adultery.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

*In the commission of a crime, the chief component in catching the actor of that crime is known as "probable cause." It also holds true in the issuance of an indictment.

The very same holds true for your W in the commission of abetting disharmony within your own marital relationship.

The burden of proof, IMHO, now rests with her to prove that it didn't happen. If she can, which I seriously doubt, then you may well have something to hang your hat on, inasfar as saving this union.

But reading through the lines of what you say, I really don't believe that she can. Your very own "gut instincts" are so very much more accurate than the deceptive words emanating from her lips! No loving wife would ever treat her married husband in that way, not fully expecting their marriage to survive, anyway.

If you desire, perhaps you should bounce it off of a relationship counselor first. But either way, you had best be prepared to visit with an attorney to fully explore your legal rights!*


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## Machiavelli (Feb 25, 2012)

Solost, your wayward wife (WW) is following the 7-year itch adulterous wife script, blatant hypergamy edition, to the letter. Hit her with D papers immediately and don't look back. If you're religious, get on your knees and thank God that you got to this point now instead of another five years and two kids down the road.


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## honcho (Oct 5, 2013)

“I do know that they go to lunch together everyday for work and that parts of their job does involve them being out of the office together”

This answers all your questions to what Bandit pointed out. You are young, you are interested in starting a business and you haven’t been married long. You have a future to look forward to, not spending years watching her actions and questioning everything. 

Your best bet would be to file for divorce. Counseling right now is a waste of money since she has no intention of getting anything out of it. The July date for a decision out of her is pointless and all you are doing is allowing her time to convince herself whatever has gotten into her head is a good idea. If she comes back she will just do this again more than likely sooner rather than later. 

Stand up for yourself, file for divorce and make the “hard decision” for her. You can relieve her the burden of being confused so to speak. You sound like you have a great future ahead of you, don’t let her be a boat anchor for you. Your only two years into what you hope is a lifetime commitment. A few years from now you will have much more to lose. Filing may snap her back to reality, it may not but if it does you both have a great deal of work to do in order to really fix this relationship.


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## manfromlamancha (Jul 4, 2013)

Hello Solost and sorry that you are here. I thought that I would offer my perspective:


As already said by Pinkpetal, both of you got together exclusively very young (18/19) and got married very quickly (21/22). Neither of you has had a chance to date others so her behaviour, while unacceptable, is sort of understandable.

Of the two of you, you seem tob the more confident and mature - it appears that you know what you want and how to get it whereas she has been "following" you and kind of dependent on you. I say you appear to be mature because you are still quite young and it is possible that your perceived maturity is based on confidence and not experience.

She got more confident when she got a job 6 months ago and that is when she met this OM and started the affair. This is her dating that never happened earlier in her life.

It is highly probable that at some time during these 6 months they have started to have had sex. Maybe just over a month ago when she came back and started listing all your "faults". It may not have been better sex but certainly more exciting since it was illicit sex. This might be a deal breaker for you.

You seem to think he is an alright guy - why? Because _she_ told you that he asked her to work things out with you. In his mind, at 29 (and being overweight and living with his parents and with no money problems) he is lacking a wife. The 29/24 age gap seems to be right for him, your wife (whom I assume is attractive) seems to be attracted to him (for his humour, height, religion, behaviour with kids and maybe his parent's money - so he doesn't need to change anything about his loser self), he decided to go after her and she succumbed. Except that he knew she was married!!! And this makes him a [email protected]

Also she is a liar and a cheater and you simply CANNOT BELIEVE ANYTHING SHE TELLS YOU! 

She has, quite typically for cheaters, rewritten your history to justify her behaviour and assuage her guilt. 

Her refusing to kiss you on the mouth is your biggest sign that she considers herself his and not yours any more. In her mind you have been replaced by him. 

She cried when she had sex with you because she felt she was cheating on him (although she may have had sex with you because the sex is actually better with you with him being overweight).

Her needing to move out to get some space to think is her really wanting freedom to pursue this undisturbed. Your allowing her to date him while still being married is very magnanimous of you but HUGELY WRONG ! It made it easier on her conscience and you were/are enabling her disrespectful and scummy behaviour. 

She furthered this by "giving you permission" to sleep with other women - to again, assuage her guilt.

So what do you do about this:


Whatever you decide, consult an attorney about protecting yourself financially. Do not create any assets that you will have to split 50/50 with her when divorcing.

Do not beg her to come back - simply make it clear that if you two are to have any kind of dialog, she will have to stop seeing the OM while the two of you are married (if for no other reason than to stop being disrespectful).

Also explain to her that if she ever truly wanted to work on the marriage that you have a list of must do's for her - NC letter, the whole truth (no trickle truthing), complete honesty and transparency, enforcement of boundaries with opposite sex, ownership and true remorse for her cheating etc. then, maybe, there could be reconciliation.

Gather and secure as much evidence as possible and expose this affair to your, her and his families. Expose at their work - this might get the both of them fired. This is OK because if you are to reconcile, you would want her to change her job anyway and you would want the POSOM to have consequences.

File for divorce anyway. You can always stop it later if you choose to.

Do the 180 to help yourself heal. Work on yourself physically too. Focus on making you better. Come here and vent when you need to.

It is increasingly seeming like divorcing her and dumping her is the best option but this is entirely up to you. Take care and keep us posted.


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## TRy (Sep 14, 2011)

bryanp said:


> You said that she could spend time with the OM and her response to you was that you could sleep with other women. Think about this. The only reason she that to you is because she is sleeping with the OM. If she was not sleeping with him why would she say that to you? She pretty much just confessed to you about her cheating.


 :iagree::iagree::iagree: If you do not beleive anything else being said believe what brynanp just said above. 

When a cheater gives you permission to have sex outside of the marraige, they are removing monogamy from your marraige, and thus giving themselves permission to have sex outside of the marraige without guilt. In the perverse mind of a cheater following the cheaters script, she will tell you that since you had her permission to have sex outside of the marraige, her having sex outside of the marraige was not cheating.


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## Rushwater (Feb 11, 2013)

bryanp said:


> You said that she could spend time with the OM and her response to you was that you could sleep with other women. Think about this. The only reason she that to you is because she is sleeping with the OM. If she was not sleeping with him why would she say that to you? She pretty much just confessed to you about her cheating.


Yup, I have to agree... she's boinking the 29 year old failure-to-launch jack off and does not have the guts to look you in the eye. So the guy is "religious"? I'm sure he was crying out to God as he was doing your wife. Also, she cried after sex with you because she felt guilty about CHEATING ON POSOM! You are young with a bright future, AND NO CHILDREN! Shake this rat from your neck. You may feel like you cannot live without her in the short run... but within a year, you'll come back here and thank us for giving you a harsh kick in the a$$. You're going to look back on this and think to yourself "what the hell was I thinking"?


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## murphy5 (May 1, 2014)

If she randomly drops by for sex with you, make sure you use a condom. Not sure what she might have to give you!


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## bigtone128 (May 1, 2012)

Okay my .02....I was you almost 2 years ago SOLOST....I could not believe my ex (note that name) would possibly have sex with someone else - she appeared so loyal throughout our marriage (the key word appeared) and I could not even imagine her cheating on me. But her behaviour was so weird....like yours, mine started to bring up stuff I did 25 years ago (we were together for 27 years) and I used to think (where is this coming from?). Then mine would not sleep with me. Then she would say "I love you but I have other needs." EVERYONE on this site told me she was cheating, everyone told me she probably had been for some time, everyone told me her behaviour was one where she was doing it for awhile. ALL of which I did not want to hear..so I got angry because I did not want to see the truth (especially when they said it was probably over). It has been 2 years for me and yes I am sorry you are here but the good news is you are now free. Free from a manipulative person who was probably using you and who does not love you. People who love their spouses do not cheat on them. When something like this happens our systems go into shock and we go into denial. One poster hear told me "Listen buddy, she is gone and has been for some time forget about her and move on." The same poster also said "she will be back but by the time she comes back, you will not want her." Well guess what.. they were right. At the time, I thought I would take her back in a heartbeat but as time passes you will gradually see the little ways she betrayed you. Okay, for me, how would you feel about your woman giving oral sex to some other guy? Think about it. Then going home and lying to you about it? Then there's the sex act itself and her moaning while some other random dude is having sex with her. These are the things that will come to your mind and you will eventually see she did not love you because people who love others, do not treat them like that. Then memories will hit you and you will eventually see the true extent of her betrayal towards you for example one time just before she left, her and I were in our bedroom and I was trying to engage her in sex and she kept putting me off finally she lay beside me and I tried to engage her in foreplay and I said "one of the things I like about being together so long is we know what turns each other on." to which she jumped up and yelled "A lot of guys know how to turn me on." I was shocked at what she said and said "do tell." It was such a weird moment - but I look back now and it is all clear to me. I'm two years out and I do not ever to go back to that. You are in for a rough ride but you will get through it. She will blame you for everything. She will try to turn your and her friends against you. Think about all the little secrets you told her and she will use them against you - just to save her own behind and try to establish and justify a new relationship with her new beau. 
Well, guess what people are not stupid....they will be loyal to her for a bit but over time they will see how she manipulated them and they will come to your side (but you will not want them either) because they will see the truth. A friend of my exes came to me the other night and tried to befriend me again. Nada. Not going to happen. Your life will be so much better after a few years... what you thought was love was a mirage. A figment of your own imagination. Trust me, hang in and listen to people here. They are your friends. In a couple of years, when you see what actually transpired.... you will not want her back. Take care. Do the 180 HARD!


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

solost99 said:


> I am not defending her and I do realize that I could be wrong but I truly believe that it isn't physical. I have dedicated a lot of time to exhausting many resources and doing a lot of stalking and there just isn't any time for it. Another thing that she likes about him is that he is religious.
> 
> I sincerely appreciate your insight as to why she cried. I really hadn't thought about it form that perspective. I believe you are on to something.
> 
> I couldn't agree with you more about counseling. They just let us talk and we get nowhere.


Since when do religious men date married women? Since when do religious men break up marriages?

Unless your wife quits working with him,.there is no chance she can get over him.

Iy looks like from here, if she can fall for him, she could fall for a toad. She has shown you what kind of person she really is, you have to deal with that. What could she possibly do for any man to trust her now?


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

Btw, every time a spouse says they haven't had time to have sex here, they are proven wrong. They have gone out together, they had time. He's not that religious.

Find out where he goes to church and tell his pastor what he's doing. You have to tell his boss and parents too.


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## Philat (Sep 12, 2013)

Solo, can you clear up this inconsistency? In your OP you said:

_I told her that to help her figure out if she liked this guy or not they could spend sometime together outside of work. Three days later him and her went to dinner when her plans with her girlfriends got canceled. *I have few details about the date* other than she said it was "fine" and "nothing special". And that he paid for dinner. I don't know if this was a good idea or not. I would like advice on it._

Later you said:

_I guess the truth is just hard to accept. I just don't see when they would be doing anything besides work. *I watched them for their entire date.* No physical contact and it was just dinner and back home. I gave them a free pass basically. I do know that they go to lunch together everyday for work and that parts of their job does involve them being out of the office together._

You watched them the entire time? From where? Yet you have few details? 

If this date really did take place, with your consent, it was a gigantic mistake on your part.


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## bigtone128 (May 1, 2012)

Chaparral said:


> Since when do religious men date married women? Since when do religious men break up marriages?
> 
> Unless your wife quits working with him,.there is no chance she can get over him.
> 
> Iy looks like from here, if she can fall for him, she could fall for a toad. She has shown you what kind of person she really is, you have to deal with that. What could she possibly do for any man to trust her now?


I agree here.... listen my ex left me and moved in with another dude and then when one of our mutual friends met her on the street and asked her how she was doing she said "Walking hand in hand with God!" (I guess God must be onside for adultery now). Then she actually convinced one of her friends (a pastor's wife) that what she was doing was completely legit because of the horrible way I treated her....you do not know what you are dealing with my friend.


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## Machiavelli (Feb 25, 2012)

bandit.45 said:


> Agreed. She is going by the cheaters handbook page for page.
> 
> Another religious adulteress. I get a kick out of them. Just like Zanne.


He didn't say, but maybe these women worship Aphrodite, the goddess of sex?


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

bigtone128 said:


> I agree here.... listen my ex left me and moved in with another dude and then when one of our mutual friends met her on the street and asked her how she was doing she said "Walking hand in hand with God!" (I guess God must be onside for adultery now). Then she actually convinced one of her friends (a pastor's wife) that what she was doing was completely legit because of the horrible way I treated her....you do not know what you are dealing with my friend.


*The saddest thing, bigtone, is that, unquestionably, the prevaricating cheater has already told so many different versions of their stories to so many different people, that they largely need a mega-memory computer, or some other like device, to keep score of exactly whom they've told what!

And they're rather good at that. After all, the first step in the commission of infidelity is becoming stellar at deception! It all goes hand in hand!*


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

I find the religious, sanctimonious, Christian cheater to be a fascinating animal. We need to start a thread on that dichotomy. We've had a lot of waywards pass through here who have that trait in common.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## solost99 (May 18, 2014)

Philat said:


> Solo, can you clear up this inconsistency? In your OP you said:
> 
> _I told her that to help her figure out if she liked this guy or not they could spend sometime together outside of work. Three days later him and her went to dinner when her plans with her girlfriends got canceled. *I have few details about the date* other than she said it was "fine" and "nothing special". And that he paid for dinner. I don't know if this was a good idea or not. I would like advice on it._
> 
> ...


I do not know what was said on the date and I did not watch them eat dinner but I watched the vehicle. I basically only know what someone would know if they were stalking them because that is what I did.


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## harrybrown (May 22, 2013)

Have you filed for divorce yet? Do not wait any longer.

Change the locks on your house. Tell her to go live with him, he is so perfect. (sarcasm)

You do not have kids with her. Start the 180 and get her out of your life. 

You also need to expose her to her family and to the OM parents. 

Hold off on exposing at her work. Wait until the divorce is final.

Run and run fast. She does not love you or respect you. You can see that when she told you to go after other women and admitted to you that she has already had a PA with the OM.


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

harrybrown said:


> Have you filed for divorce yet? Do not wait any longer.
> 
> Change the locks on your house. Tell her to go live with him, he is so perfect. (sarcasm)
> 
> ...


:iagree::iagree:
Once you let her date the om she lost all respect for you.
Please file and serve her at work and go from there.


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## badmemory (Jul 31, 2012)

tom67 said:


> Once you let her date the om she lost all respect for you.


:iagree:

Goodness. 

I guess it doesn't matter if you do carry through with the D, but that pretty much put the last nail in the coffin.


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## GROUNDPOUNDER (Mar 8, 2013)

So you followed her on a date that she knew that you knew about. When she'd/they'd be leaving, where they were going, and you didn't see anything. No big surprise there.

Why don't you follow her on one of her many "lunch dates" with her OM?

I'll bet that you see more than chewing going on. This is when they'd be having sex, in the back of one of there vehicles. Does she drive an SUV? Does he?

How long that they have been "having lunch" together will correlate to about how long they've been having sex together.

And the poster that said she was crying after having sex with you was correct. It was most likely brought on by her not wanting to cheat on the OM.


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## HubbyDaddy2013 (Jul 2, 2013)

She is a cheater, and does not respect you. 

You are young, AND KIDS ARE NOT IN THE PICTURE! Time to find a girl who will respect, love, and cherish you! Divorce Her, and move on! You will find a more attractive, caring wife next time around! 

Don't let her get in the way of you running your own small business either! Don't change for her!


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

So whatcha gonna do Solost?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Hopeful Cynic (Apr 27, 2014)

Honestly, I don't think it matters if she is cheating or not, emotionally or physically. Agonizing about that will only hurt you unnecessarily. This other man is just a catalyst for her realization that she married too young, and that you really aren't the guy she pictures spending the rest of her life with. You want to think it's infidelity so you can be mad at an outsider, instead of your wife, which is harder to manage when you love her.

She wants out of the marriage. You can tell this by her poor response to counselling. If she wanted to stay married, she'd actually be trying to learn something and change and improve the marriage. But she is concerned about appearances and about hurting you, and doesn't know how to accomplish the end of the marriage without looking like the bad guy.

Let me translate some of the things she is doing/saying.

*Giving you permission to sleep with other women.* This means that she wants you to fall in love with someone else to replace her. She wants there to be another woman ready to catch you before she drops you. But she still wants to drop you, and she doesn't want the burden of guilt for hurting you when she does it. She considers the marriage over, so the idea of you being with other women doesn't bother her.

*Giving you a date of July 1 before she decides about the marriage.* This means she already knows what she wants to do, she just hasn't figured out a way to do it yet without being the villain. She's waiting for you to dump her. If July comes and you haven't yet, she'll just be telling you she needs more time and asking for an extension.

*Naming everything that you did wrong in the marriage.* This means she wants the end of the marriage to appear to be your fault. She probably believes that it is your fault, because otherwise, she'd have to admit she made mistakes too.

*Not wanting you to kiss her on the mouth.* This means she no longer has any physical attraction to you. That one time she came over for sex, maybe she was horny, maybe it was a hormonal time of the month, but it was nothing to do with attraction to you - she just knew you were available. She cried afterwards because she realized she just had sex with someone she wasn't interested in, and set back her plan for making you out to be the villain.

*Her new spending habits.* This probably has as much to do with her new job as anything else. Everybody goes a little crazy with disposable income if they've never had it before. Plus, she knows her marriage is ending, and she's got to look good when she's single. She's never been single with money before, and it's fun.

So that's where I think she's coming from. As others have said, you got together with her at a very young age, and married very young. Now that she's landed a career, she's finally growing up and maturing, and she doesn't see a place for you in her adulthood. But she's a nice person and still cares enough about you that she doesn't want to hurt you, so she's procrastinating the actual break up without understanding that this also hurts you. She believes that if she treats you poorly enough, maybe you'll break up with her and save her the trouble. Meanwhile, she thinks of herself as single, and is behaving as such.

Find a chance to talk to her seriously, and tell her that you think you've both grown up since marriage, and that maybe you are just two different people now, who no longer belong together. If I'm right, she'll probably agree in relief that you understand.

And don't feel awful that this happened. It's not you, it's society. Maturity comes later and later, in this weird kind of extended adolescence we have now. And on top of that everything around us is disposable. We upgrade to the next model of phone even if nothing is wrong with the old one, we replace instead of repair things when they get worn or broken, etc. I'm not saying that you feel this way about her or your marriage, but if she does, you're out of luck.

A lot of group projects can succeed with extra work from the others if someone isn't pulling their own weight but a marriage simply isn't one of them. If one person has checked out, there's not a marriage anymore, no matter how hard the other person works.


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

solost99 said:


> I do not know what was said on the date and I did not watch them eat dinner but I watched the vehicle. I basically only know what someone would know if they were stalking them because that is what I did.


Dude.

Duuuuuuude......

Do you know how freakin' pathetic that is? Brother you need to find that jar she has your testicles in and steal them back.

Divorce this tramp and put her in your rear view... pronto.


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## phillybeffandswiss (Jan 20, 2013)

solost99 said:


> I do not know what was said on the date and I did not watch them eat dinner but I watched the vehicle. I basically only know what someone would know if they were stalking them because that is what I did.


QUIT CALLING IT STALKING. Stalkers want to be seen, they are doing something scary and purely unwanted. 

stalk
verb
: to follow, watch, and bother (someone) constantly in a way that is frightening, dangerous, etc.

They key word in that definition is "AND." 

So, you only followed. You didn't watch, bother or continue following them " in a way that is frightening, dangerous, etc." You made a bad decision, allowing the date, wanted to protect your marriage and went to WATCH what she was doing. EVEN then, you were so scared you watched the car. 

You are not stalking or a stalker, you are some guy who is worried about his marriage.


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## Philat (Sep 12, 2013)

solost99 said:


> I do not know what was said on the date and I did not watch them eat dinner but I watched the vehicle. I basically only know what someone would know if they were stalking them because that is what I did.


Soooo, you actually do not know if there was physical contact during the dinner part of the date or not, right?


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

bandit.45 said:


> *I find the religious, sanctimonious, Christian cheater to be a fascinating animal. We need to start a thread on that dichotomy. We've had a lot of waywards pass through here who have that trait in common.*
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


*Oh yeah, Bandito! I understand completely!

That rich, skanky XW of mine is/was a card-carrying ECLA Lutheran who literally contributed thousands annually to the church! I'd reckon that she feels some form of innate justification of being able to get herself a little bit of penance in getting to covertly bump uglys with her old BF's that she had at long last reconnected with on FB.

Her mantra on money is largely that if you have it, things are outstanding! If you don't, they're not! And if you can send someone to the poor house in the process of sustaining your own wealth, then more power to you!*


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## MRABoysHaveSmallPeanut (Mar 13, 2014)

solost99 said:


> I told her that to help her figure out if she liked this guy or not they could spend sometime together outside of work. Three days later him and her went to dinner when her plans with her girlfriends got canceled. I have few details about the date other than she said it was "fine" and "nothing special". And that he paid for dinner. I don't know if this was a good idea or not. I would like advice on it.


No, no and no. Never do this again. You basically gave her a free pass to have an affair with him and assured you'd wait for her when/if she's ready come back. This makes you look very weak to her and is not attractive. But you are young and can learn from all this.


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## WolverineFan (Nov 26, 2013)

I am so sorry for the heartache and pain that you are going through. I have read several of these posts and I agree with some of the advice and don't agree with others. One thing I do recommend, however, is that you purchase a book called _Love Must Be Tough: New Hope For Marriages In Crisis_ by Dr. James Dobson. The reason for this is because I agree that you need to do something to "shock" your wife back into her right mind. This books gives practical step-by-step advice on how to do that. 

The one thing that you must accept is that all marriage relationships are between two people who choose each other. Choice is the basis of all love - you cannot make her choose to love you. This doesn't mean it is hopeless because there are certainly things that you can do to help draw her back to you, and there are certainly things you can do to push her away. You cannot make that choice for her though no matter how badly you want to.

I went through a divorce five years ago that I caused. It is the greatest pain I have ever experienced and the greatest regret of my life. Having said that, there is healing to be found. Finding a support group and considering individual counseling could be a great help. My thoughts and prayers are with you.


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## Thorburn (Nov 23, 2011)

A little summary of what other have said

1. Get tested for STD's
2. Lawyer up and don't tell your wife.
3. Get your finances in order.
4. Expose this.
5. Start the 180 hard
6. Stop giving her permission to do anything.
7. Expose this to the guy's pastor
8. Don't believe anything your wife says.


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## michzz (Jun 6, 2008)

CANCEL any credit card or line of credit that you both can access!

Even if you have sorted out your bank accounts, this is a big hole. she could run up debt for you to pay so she can feather her new nest.


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## manfromlamancha (Jul 4, 2013)

I dont agree with everything said below: (see my comments in red)



Hopeful Cynic said:


> Honestly, I don't think it matters if she is cheating or not, emotionally or physically. Agonizing about that will only hurt you unnecessarily. This other man is just a catalyst for her realization that she married too young, and that you really aren't the guy she pictures spending the rest of her life with. *You want to think it's infidelity* It is infidelity! Pure and simple!so you can be mad at an outsider, instead of your wife, which is harder to manage when you love her.
> 
> She wants out of the marriage. You can tell this by her poor response to counselling. If she wanted to stay married, she'd actually be trying to learn something and change and improve the marriage. But she is concerned about appearances and about hurting you, and doesn't know how to accomplish the end of the marriage without looking like the bad guy.
> 
> ...


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## LongWalk (Apr 4, 2013)

SoLost,

Although you are in shock at the way this spun your life out of control, the good news is that now that you see the truth, you are going take back control of what you can control – you and your life.

Dump her before she dumps you.

The person who wants the relationship least is the one with power. But you need to be confident. Time for the 180


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

I'm finding it increasingly difficult to read through these types of threads. Sorry... I realize that's probably not an especially helpful comment to make but seriously... Have so many of us become so emotionally neutered that we're so completely unable to free ourselves from the thrall of such a wretched spouse?!?

Cheers to everyone posting here in an effort to help OP salvage his marriage, self-respect (though, at this point, they would seem to be mutually exclusive), or whatever. As for my contribution, I'm gonna go w/ the ol' standard...

*No kids? Run! GTFO!!!*


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## Q tip (Apr 15, 2014)

So, pretty much - you can and should close this chapter in your life.

To improve yourself, please read, understand and memorize MMSLP. It will be of more help than you know. Follow it and you will become Da Man!!,


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## waylan (Apr 23, 2014)

Interesting. The OM is religious and a good guy. Surely he has heard of the ten commandments. (These are the really important rules that God hand delivered...) What happened to "Thou shall not covet thy neighbors's wife." We already know he broke that one. "Thou shall not commit adultery." Pretty sure he helping your wife break this one too.

And where does I need time to decides if I like this other guy better come from? That time occurred before she decided to marry you. Guess what - There will always be guys that are funnier, wealthier and better looking then you. Marriage is supposed to be about loyalty and love not looking for the best deal currently.

Do yourself a favor and kick this one to the curb. Count yourself blessed that you don't have children.


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## 6301 (May 11, 2013)

What you want to do is put her on a island with the bare minimum. And that also means no contact with her. File for divorce, have her served at work, let the parents of their 29 year old loser what he's doing, and let her sweat it out. 

Then you let her know all her faults for all the years you have been together including that she's a liar, cheat, and a piss poor excuse of a wife and woman. 

Wish her all the luck in the world and tell her not to come back.

Right now she's got you as Plan B just in case her little fling falls apart, she can convince you for another chance and your playing right in her hand.

Biggest mistake you made was when you let her go off with this guy to sample his wares. Big mistake. What you should have told her from the get go when she pulled up stakes was " When you walk out the door remember that once the door is closed, don't come back because I will not accept you in my life". 

Now you have a chance to make a clean break of things. You have no kids and there can't be that much the two of you accumulated in two years of marriage and you have every right in the world to have a change of heart about her being with this guy and if she says that you said it was alright, you can look at her and say that you changed your mind and that's it.

Time for you to make a stand and quit being her back up plan and lackey. Do it now before it's too late.


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## Rushwater (Feb 11, 2013)

WolverineFan said:


> One thing I do recommend, however, is that you purchase a book called _Love Must Be Tough: New Hope For Marriages In Crisis_ by Dr. James Dobson. The reason for this is because I agree that you need to do something to "shock" your wife back into her right mind. This books gives practical step-by-step advice on how to do that.


Too late for this. The OP's wife has already put the OP in her rear view mirror and is just waiting for him to put himself out of his own misery. Unfortunately, the only real shock required is the one that gets the OP to serve D papers.


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## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)




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