# Porn and lying



## EM415

About a month ago, I accidentally found porn on my husband's computer. It was a legitimate accident, and I've been scared to confront him, because I was afraid he'd think I was intentionally snooping, which I was not. I've always trusted him and thought we had the kind of relationship where we didn't hide things from each other, so I've never been the snooping type, but I'm so disturbed by what I found. 

For awhile now, my husband claims to have "no sex drive.' He never initiates sex with me, and when I try, half the time he either ignores my attempt, or does get the hint, but has a hard time "finishing" if you know what I mean. I've tried to talk to him about it before, told him I need more affection than what I'm getting, etc...nothing changes though. We've been married almost 3 years and I had just sort of started to accept that my husband doesn't need as much sex as I'd like. Seriously, he can go months without any.  It bothered me, but I had no resentment towards him about it. I'd approached him in a gentle and understanding way plenty of times, and I had just accepted that this is just the way he is. 

Until I stumbled across porn on his computer. I was really shocked. I figured he watched it once in awhile, which I honestly don't have a problem with, however after looking a little closer, he's watching porn literally any time he's home alone. Literally any time I leave the house for more than an hour, he's viewing porn. As soon as I leave for work in the morning, he opens up a porn site. If I come home a couple minutes late, he's already gotten off on porn. Every single day! It looks like he may have even been watching it while I was upstairs sleeping (yet he won't come on to me! he says he has no sex drive! bull****.) I am so hurt that he ignores me, tells me he just doesn't have much of a sex drive, yet he's jerking off daily. He's googling images of women who look nothing like me, and it just really hurts. It's like he wants someone else  I know I'm not perfect, but I'm not a monster! I think I'm fairly attractive.....I wish he thought so too. It really hurts. 

A few nights ago, I so badly wanted to tell him what I'd found, but I'm too scared. I was talking to him about his "no sex drive issue" since he's agreed to see a doctor and get tested for low testosterone (appointment next week), and just flat out gave him the opportunity to come clean. I said to him, "do you look at porn?" and he said that he has in the past, but very very infrequently, and even went so far as to say that in the 6 years we've been together, it's probably been less than a dozen times that he's even looked. I knew he was lying right to my face, as I'd already seen the extravagant amount of porn he's viewing on a daily basis. I reminded him that I'm his wife and he can tell me ANYTHING, and that if he has anything to tell me, such as a porn problem, an affair, etc, that now would be the time to talk to me about it. He assured me that there was nothing else going on that was causing his problem in the bedroom. The thing that scared me is that if I didn't already know he was lying, I would't have been able to tell. He's voice didn't change, his eyes didn't wander, he could look me right in the eyes as he was lying. It freaked me out. What else has he been lying about, you know? Until now, I've always trusted him completely. I've believed from the bottom of my heart that he was an honest man, and it hurts to know that I was fooled. I didn't know what to say, so I just said "OK"

I'm so hurt that he doesn't want me sexually, yet jerks off to porn daily. I feel like I'm repulsive and disgusting. I feel like I'm not enough. I've spent the past few weeks trying to figure out how to confront him about it and it's eating me up inside. I thought that maybe with some counseling we could possibly work on it. But, then he lied to me, and that changed everything. I don't know what to do now. I don't know if this marriage is going to work. I can't stand the thought of being married to someone who can lie right to my face and not even flinch. I gave him the opportunity to be honest, reassured him that he can share any secretes with me, and he still lied. All of it just hurts so much. I feel like I deserve better. I'm not perfect, but I deserve someone who is sexually attracted to me and doesn't need to view porn daily and be ignoring me. I deserve someone who respects me enough not to lie to my face when I'm coming to them with an open mind and open heart. 

I need to tell him what I've found. I'm ready to tell him, and I hope he'll understand that I wasn't spying on him, it was a legitimate accident. But, once I tell him, I don't know where to go from there. I'm not sure if I'm ready to pull the trigger on divorce, but I also can't share a bed with someone who I'm so disgusted by and can't trust. I'm just really hurting and don't know what to do.


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## gouge_away

Your husband may very well be an addict.

If that is the case, he might find you very attractive, but has been desensitized to the real deal.

His finishing issues are likely do to consistent masterbation. He is so used to the sensations associated masterbating that he cannot get off otherwise.

I imagine he is aware of his problem habit and carries much shame, therefore hides it, honestly it can be quite embarrassing.

My advice would be to seek out a marriage councilor that deals with addictions, limit his computer time to when you are home. Remove the cable modem if need be, and be very clear that you are doing this to protect your marriage. It is your last attempt at building intimacy, and your only other option is Divorce, show him that this is deeply painful for you and extremely selfish of him.

MC, marriage counseling
Limit, and eliminate his exposure
Explain, 
"When you choose porn over me, I feel ignored, hurt, scared, betrayed, unattractive, unappreciated, repulsive, and disgusting. If you would stop looking at porn daily and show me that you desire me, I would feel loved, valued, safe, and attractive."

Try not to be accusatory, that will only make him defensive, you want to fight this with him not against him.


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## SecondTime'Round

Don't feel bad or afraid of confronting him about snooping. Many years ago I was in your shoes (not porn, but hook-up sites) and I was the same way....I was embarrassed for snooping (and in my case it was straight out snooping, although he could not have made it more obvious if he tried). I never confronted him until he actually acted on it, went through with sex. I VERY much regret that, and he was pissed I didn't confront him sooner too. 

Be strong and confident in your right to know this information. Don't apologize for finding out this information, even if he accuses you of snooping. So what if you had? He's obviously hiding it and it's obviously a BIG problem.


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## Luxey

EM415 said:


> About a month ago, I accidentally found porn on my husband's computer. It was a legitimate accident, and I've been scared to confront him, because I was afraid he'd think I was intentionally snooping, which I was not. I've always trusted him and thought we had the kind of relationship where we didn't hide things from each other, so I've never been the snooping type, but I'm so disturbed by what I found.
> 
> For awhile now, my husband claims to have "no sex drive.' He never initiates sex with me, and when I try, half the time he either ignores my attempt, or does get the hint, but has a hard time "finishing" if you know what I mean. I've tried to talk to him about it before, told him I need more affection than what I'm getting, etc...nothing changes though. We've been married almost 3 years and I had just sort of started to accept that my husband doesn't need as much sex as I'd like. Seriously, he can go months without any.  It bothered me, but I had no resentment towards him about it. I'd approached him in a gentle and understanding way plenty of times, and I had just accepted that this is just the way he is.
> 
> Until I stumbled across porn on his computer. I was really shocked. I figured he watched it once in awhile, which I honestly don't have a problem with, however after looking a little closer, he's watching porn literally any time he's home alone. Literally any time I leave the house for more than an hour, he's viewing porn. As soon as I leave for work in the morning, he opens up a porn site. If I come home a couple minutes late, he's already gotten off on porn. Every single day! It looks like he may have even been watching it while I was upstairs sleeping (yet he won't come on to me! he says he has no sex drive! bull****.) I am so hurt that he ignores me, tells me he just doesn't have much of a sex drive, yet he's jerking off daily. He's googling images of women who look nothing like me, and it just really hurts. It's like he wants someone else  I know I'm not perfect, but I'm not a monster! I think I'm fairly attractive.....I wish he thought so too. It really hurts.
> 
> A few nights ago, I so badly wanted to tell him what I'd found, but I'm too scared. I was talking to him about his "no sex drive issue" since he's agreed to see a doctor and get tested for low testosterone (appointment next week), and just flat out gave him the opportunity to come clean. I said to him, "do you look at porn?" and he said that he has in the past, but very very infrequently, and even went so far as to say that in the 6 years we've been together, it's probably been less than a dozen times that he's even looked. I knew he was lying right to my face, as I'd already seen the extravagant amount of porn he's viewing on a daily basis. I reminded him that I'm his wife and he can tell me ANYTHING, and that if he has anything to tell me, such as a porn problem, an affair, etc, that now would be the time to talk to me about it. He assured me that there was nothing else going on that was causing his problem in the bedroom. The thing that scared me is that if I didn't already know he was lying, I would't have been able to tell. He's voice didn't change, his eyes didn't wander, he could look me right in the eyes as he was lying. It freaked me out. What else has he been lying about, you know? Until now, I've always trusted him completely. I've believed from the bottom of my heart that he was an honest man, and it hurts to know that I was fooled. I didn't know what to say, so I just said "OK"
> 
> I'm so hurt that he doesn't want me sexually, yet jerks off to porn daily. I feel like I'm repulsive and disgusting. I feel like I'm not enough. I've spent the past few weeks trying to figure out how to confront him about it and it's eating me up inside. I thought that maybe with some counseling we could possibly work on it. But, then he lied to me, and that changed everything. I don't know what to do now. I don't know if this marriage is going to work. I can't stand the thought of being married to someone who can lie right to my face and not even flinch. I gave him the opportunity to be honest, reassured him that he can share any secretes with me, and he still lied. All of it just hurts so much. I feel like I deserve better. I'm not perfect, but I deserve someone who is sexually attracted to me and doesn't need to view porn daily and be ignoring me. I deserve someone who respects me enough not to lie to my face when I'm coming to them with an open mind and open heart.
> 
> I need to tell him what I've found. I'm ready to tell him, and I hope he'll understand that I wasn't spying on him, it was a legitimate accident. But, once I tell him, I don't know where to go from there. I'm not sure if I'm ready to pull the trigger on divorce, but I also can't share a bed with someone who I'm so disgusted by and can't trust. I'm just really hurting and don't know what to do.


I could have written this. I was there three years ago. He hid his porn use and I stumbled onto it and I was so angry, hurt, confused. Before I confronted my husband he said all of the things yours does - to a T.

I confronted my husband and once cornered he had no choice but to tell me the truth, a truth he had been avoiding because he didn't want to hurt me. Here it is: I was grossly overweight, and overall didn't do very much for my appearance at all. He just wasn't physically attracted to me and when he did have sex with me for love, he'd go soft. It wasn't his fault. It was mine.

I am 5'0 tall and was about 300LBS at the time. When we married, I was 115. No kids. I am now 120 and we're both very proud that I got the fat off.

He felt duped that I had gained so much after we married. I didn't blame him.

After we talked, I immediately changed my eating habits and joined a gym. Not just for sex, but for the health of my marriage. Also, I didn't want to have an early death either.

Not saying this is you, just tossing that out.

Be careful what you ask for....


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## farsidejunky

As a reformed addict, I can tell you what he is doing is indicative of addictive behavior.

There may be extenuating circumstances, but he is using and hiding.


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## Luxey

farsidejunky said:


> As a reformed addict, I can tell you what he is doing is indicative of addictive behavior.
> 
> There may be extenuating circumstances, but he is using and hiding.


ITA: I think my situation is probably unusual and not the probable cause of the OP's husband. He may indeed be an addict.

My husband still looks at porn, but it's only a couple of times a week now and our sex life is healthy.


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## SecondTime'Round

Luxey said:


> I could have written this. I was there three years ago. He hid his porn use and I stumbled onto it and I was so angry, hurt, confused. Before I confronted my husband he said all of the things yours does - to a T.
> 
> I confronted my husband and once cornered he had no choice but to tell me the truth, a truth he had been avoiding because he didn't want to hurt me. Here it is: I was grossly overweight, and overall didn't do very much for my appearance at all. He just wasn't physically attracted to me and when he did have sex with me for love, he'd go soft. It wasn't his fault. It was mine.
> 
> I am 5'0 tall and was about 300LBS at the time. When we married, I was 115. No kids. I am now 120 and we're both very proud that I got the fat off.
> 
> He felt duped that I had gained so much after we married. I didn't blame him.
> 
> After we talked, I immediately changed my eating habits and joined a gym. Not just for sex, but for the health of my marriage. Also, I didn't want to have an early death either.
> 
> Not saying this is you, just tossing that out.
> 
> Be careful what you ask for....


Wow, good for you, @Luxey!! Congrats! That is quite an accomplishment! (I'm sure it was very hurtful in the beginning  )


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## EM415

Thank you everyone. I would say that my physical appearance hasn't really changed since we got engaged. I weigh about the same. He's gained some weight, but I still love him and wanted to have a sexual relationship with him....so I don't think he would/could use ME as the excuse. 

I'm hurt that he knows that his "problem" in the bedroom was neglectful towards me and selfish to not get it looked at sooner (I told him I felt that way, so he was very clear) but instead of making ANY effort to fix the problem or stop watching porn, he just kept watching porn daily and neglecting me. He knew exactly what he was doing. He's only going to the doctor to get testosterone testing next week because I pretty much told him he NEEDED to after many years of him not wanting to do anything about it. He certainly didn't make that appointment out of the blue on his own free will. I think he's very selfish. 

I'm at this weird place where I'm not sure if I'm 100% sure on leaving him, but I also know I can't and won't forgive him. He knew how I felt the whole time he had his **** in his hand, he just didn't care enough about me or our relationship to stop or seek help (trust me, when I found the porn in his browser and I looked closer, I also looked for some indication that he had at least read about porn addiction, ED, etc, but he never did; he just keep masturbating while I felt neglected.)

And now that I know what a good liar he is, how can I ever trust him about anything ever again? I can't tell when he's lying and I can't trust him to tell me the truth. We had some trust issues early in our relationship and it took a long time to heal and move forward, but I did. I moved past it, and for years I thought we were in this blissful place were we trusted each other 120%, but I guess I was naive. Why should I bother going through the personal struggle and pain of trying to forgive and trust again? I did that once for our relationship, why do I have to do it again when HE made these choices? I don't know right now. I know marriage is hard, I know it takes effort on both parts, but I'm not a doormat. 

gouge-away: thank you for your suggestions. Maybe I will be open to counseling, but I'm not sure. It's just really raw right now, and maybe I need a few days to weigh my options. I don't want to do things like monitor his internet usage, take away the modem, etc. Yes, it could potentially eliminate the problem, but I'm not his mother. He's a grown man and if he wants to fix anything, he will. I refuse to babysit my husband lol  If there's any remote possibility of intimacy coming back to our relationship, having a mother-son relationship with my husband would certainly kill that haha  

Luxey: congrats on losing all that weight! That's awesome! That must have been hard to hear at first though, but I'm really glad that it all worked out in the end. 

I told him that when he gets home tonight, I need to talk to him. I told him that I have something that's been weighing heavy on me for a couple weeks and it's time to get it off my chest. Not looking forward to this!

Sorry for the long post!


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## SecondTime'Round

EM415 said:


> I told him that when he gets home tonight, I need to talk to him. I told him that I have something that's been weighing heavy on me for a couple weeks and it's time to get it off my chest. Not looking forward to this!
> 
> Sorry for the long post!


How did he react to this?

What happened early on in your relationship? Did he have an affair?


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## Luxey

He's probably freaking out right now though. I hope your talk goes well.


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## EM415

SecondTime'Round said:


> How did he react to this?
> 
> What happened early on in your relationship? Did he have an affair?


He said he was willing to talk, and that he was concerned about what was wrong and hoped that everything was okay. I apologized for making him feel nervous while he's at work, but I refuse to reassure him that everything will be okay. 

No, he never cheated on me (that I know of.....I have fully believed that, but now....can I really trust that? Who knows) It was more like his ex was trying to get back together with him and would tell me little lies about how "friendly" she was trying to get with him and how often they were speaking to each other . When I found out that he was still talking to her, I told him that he needed to cut ties, and he did. It made me wonder if I could trust him, but he proved to me that I could, and we moved past it and had a very good relationship. 
I even recently made a comment to him about how far we've come and how happy I am that we were in such a good place.


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## SecondTime'Round

EM415 said:


> He said he was willing to talk, and that he was concerned about what was wrong and hoped that everything was okay. I apologized for making him feel nervous while he's at work, but I refuse to reassure him that everything will be okay.
> 
> No, he never cheated on me (that I know of.....I have fully believed that, but now....can I really trust that? Who knows) It was more like his ex was trying to get back together with him and would tell me little lies about how "friendly" she was trying to get with him and how often they were speaking to each other . When I found out that he was still talking to her, I told him that he needed to cut ties, and he did. It made me wonder if I could trust him, but he proved to me that I could, and we moved past it and had a very good relationship.
> I even recently made a comment to him about how far we've come and how happy I am that we were in such a good place.


Oh man . 

Well, I hope the talk tonight goes well. I think you guys have a long road ahead of you.


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## EM415

Luxey said:


> He's probably freaking out right now though. I hope your talk goes well.


Possibly. I did apologize if I made him feel nervous, and he hasn't said anything since, so he's probably fine. Honestly, he should feel worried. I don't know where our relationship will go from here, and it's because of his own actions....so if he's feeling a little uneasy right now, I feel a little bit bad about that, but I can't say he shouldn't feel worried about our married, because he should.


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## SecondTime'Round

EM415 said:


> Possibly. I did apologize if I made him feel nervous, and he hasn't said anything since, so he's probably fine. Honestly, he should feel worried. I don't know where our relationship will go from here, and it's because of his own actions....so if he's feeling a little uneasy right now, I feel a little bit bad about that, but I can't say he shouldn't feel worried about our married, because he should.


Agreed!!!


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## Luxey

EM415 said:


> Possibly. I did apologize if I made him feel nervous, and he hasn't said anything since, so he's probably fine. Honestly, he should feel worried. I don't know where our relationship will go from here, and it's because of his own actions....so if he's feeling a little uneasy right now, I feel a little bit bad about that, but I can't say he shouldn't feel worried about our married, because he should.


I agree it's not your fault that he feels uneasy right now; he put himself there by lying. And at least he won't be blindsided when he gets home, he knows there's an issue.


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## EM415

I just feel very deceived, disgusted, and taken for granted. A lot of women are 100% against porn - but I'm not. I honestly wouldn't care if he used it once in awhile. I see nothing wrong with occasional viewing. But I feel like he's taken advantage of my more "lenient" views on it, and replaced me with it. The FEW times that he has tried to initiate sex, I don't turn him down. I've told him not to feel shy or insecure around me, I WANT him to want me. And STILL, he would rather have porn than me?! I'm not ugly, but I will never be as attractive as some of the girls in porn. and now he can't even finish during rare times the we do have sex.....I'll never be as pretty, thin, or whatever as the girls the turn him on and that hurts more than I can express  

I wish there was a manual for marriage! haha  Something to tell you when to stay and put the effort in, and when to tell him not to let the door hit him on the way out! Gosh, things would be much easier  LOL


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## EM415

intheory said:


> Em,
> 
> So, so sorry you are in this circumstance.
> 
> It's a common thing. And in modern times, with the internet, it's everywhere all the time.
> 
> I just want to say; don't start hating on your body! It doesn't sound like you are. But obviously since he doesn't desire you physically, and the women he looks at, don't look anything like you; it's enough to make you feel self-hate and disgust. I've been there. Don't let it happen. Celebrate all the great things about your body. If you need to exercise; do it for you and enjoy it.:smile2:
> 
> And, I totally agree about not wanting to be his mother, always "checking up" on your naughty boy to make sure he hasn't been misbehaving. YUCK!!! If he quits, he should quit of his own desire and will. Then it would really mean something.
> 
> You've been married 3 years; together 6 total? I didn't see that you have kids.
> 
> It's not too late to divorce. You're probably still pretty young.
> 
> I know that's drastic. But this isn't just about preferring porn to your wife; it's two other disturbing facts:
> 
> 
> He knew of your need for sex and closeness. He doesn't care. He knowingly has chosen to ignore your needs.
> 
> He is an expert, talented, bold-faced liar. And like you say, Em; that has ramifications for your whole relationship.
> 
> I don't know if it's possible to find men who don't occasionally prefer watching porn to having sex with their wives.
> 
> But it_ might _be possible to find one who prefers you _most_ of the time; and wouldn't be such a wretched little sneak about watching porn.


Thank you. That's exactly how I'm feeling. I feel inadequate and repulsive, even though I know I'm probably not THAT bad. 

I don't mind when a man occasionally uses porn; so long as I'm getting the affection that I need. I've told him that in the past, and apparently nothing changed. 

You are correct, we've been together for about 6 years. No kids together yet. He however does have a child from a previous relationship, who I would miss terribly if we divorced. She's honestly a huge reason that I've keep my knowledge of his porn use a secret for longer than I should have. In addition to not wanting him to think I'm spying on him, I'm partially avoiding having to make the choice of divorce, which would also mean leaving my step-daughter


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## SecondTime'Round

EM415 said:


> I wish there was a manual for marriage! haha  Something to tell you when to stay and put the effort in, and when to tell him not to let the door hit him on the way out! Gosh, things would be much easier  LOL


Like a state law or something?  Might be nice, sometimes. But, you sound like a very strong and intelligent woman. You'll figure out what is best. 

Any normal woman would feel the hurt deeply like you are now .


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## MEM2020

EM,
Was your sex life good before marriage/in the early part of marriage?

When did it go south?


[/B]


EM415 said:


> I just feel very deceived, disgusted, and taken for granted. A lot of women are 100% against porn - but I'm not. I honestly wouldn't care if he used it once in awhile. I see nothing wrong with occasional viewing. But I feel like he's taken advantage of my more "lenient" views on it, and replaced me with it. The FEW times that he has tried to initiate sex, I don't turn him down. I've told him not to feel shy or insecure around me, I WANT him to want me. And STILL, he would rather have porn than me?! I'm not ugly, but I will never be as attractive as some of the girls in porn. and now he can't even finish during rare times the we do have sex.....I'll never be as pretty, thin, or whatever as the girls the turn him on and that hurts more than I can express
> 
> I wish there was a manual for marriage! haha  Something to tell you when to stay and put the effort in, and when to tell him not to let the door hit him on the way out! Gosh, things would be much easier  LOL


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## EM415

MEM11363 said:


> EM,
> Was your sex life good before marriage/in the early part of marriage?
> 
> When did it go south?
> 
> 
> [/B]



It was never as frequent as I would have liked. But I had used his computer in the past and never really saw porn on there, so I never felt a need to spy on him or suspect that anything was interfering with our sex life. I just figured that he was tired or didn't have as much of a need for sex as other men....I tried to just be okay with that, even though it sucked. I wouldn't say there was a specific point in time that it went south


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## Luxey

EM415 said:


> Thank you. That's exactly how I'm feeling. I feel inadequate and repulsive, even though I know I'm probably not THAT bad.
> 
> I don't mind when a man occasionally uses porn; so long as I'm getting the affection that I need. I've told him that in the past, and apparently nothing changed.
> 
> You are correct, we've been together for about 6 years. No kids together yet. He however does have a child from a previous relationship, who I would miss terribly if we divorced. She's honestly a huge reason that I've keep my knowledge of his porn use a secret for longer than I should have. In addition to not wanting him to think I'm spying on him, I'm partially avoiding having to make the choice of divorce, which would also mean leaving my step-daughter


I feel so bad for you, truly. I feel lucky that the problem was with me and I could fix me. I would have felt completely crushed and defeated in your situation. IMO, the problem lies with him and his seeming addiction.


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## MJJEAN

Google "your brain on porn" and do some reading on how porn affects the brain.

Then Google the "no fap" movement and do some more reading.

If you want my take, this has nothing to do with you. He has a problem. Namely, that he's literally conditioned himself (accidentally) to constant new visual stimulation and to only be able to reach orgasm with specific manual stimulation.

If he's willing, this problem can be fixed. But it will take time and effort. He'll have to go without sex or masturbation for a while....a reset...and then build from there.

Also, his weight gain might be a factor. Men, just like women, don't want partner sex when they feel fat and unattractive.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## richardsharpe

Good evening
Here is the way I would suggest you approach it. 

1) You accidentally found out he has been looking at porn.

2) Porn itself is not the problem (trust me, you don't want to go down the rathole of the acceptability of porn). 

3). The problem is that he has been watching porn INSTEAD of being intimate with you. You desire him and are hurt when he turns you down.

4). Porn addition is a real thing. If he wants to watch less but feels that he can't stop, then approach this as a real addiction - because it is. Its every bit as real as someone with a gambling problem. 

5) If he can stop, but doesn't want to, then why does he prefer porn to you? Try to let him give a reason. Does he find you unattractive? Is there some specific sex act you won't do that he has a fetish for? 


Try not to get upset - at first. I think the key is to understand *why* he is doing this. I know it is painful to you, but if you understand you are in a better position to know how to change things.


Was the porn he watched pretty generic or specific to some topic? 


I expect this is NOT because of anything you do, or do not do. This is his problem. 


FWIW - I watch porn and don't tell my wife. I only watch because she almost always turns me down for sex. I have turned her down less than a handful of times in 25 years, and I attempt (nicely) to initiate very frequently. She knows I'm available whenever she wants.


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## MEM2020

EM,
There's a lot of goodness in you. It's obvious from the tone of your posts. You're also very smart, your writing is clear and concise, your analysis insightful. 

I imagine your H loves all those things about you and more. Sadly he's never been that attracted to you. He does have a moderate to high sex drive. He simply doesn't wish to direct that energy at you. 

The reason he's avoided an honest conversation about this is because most people hit the exits if told their partner doesn't desire them. 

There are plenty of men who will find you attractive 'as is'. I imagine you will be happier in a situation like that. 

As for your H, this isn't a winnable battle. From what you write, he's never felt much desire for you. There is no fix for that. 

I'm sorry for such a blunt assessment. 



EM415 said:


> It was never as frequent as I would have liked. But I had used his computer in the past and never really saw porn on there, so I never felt a need to spy on him or suspect that anything was interfering with our sex life. I just figured that he was tired or didn't have as much of a need for sex as other men....I tried to just be okay with that, even though it sucked. I wouldn't say there was a specific point in time that it went south


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## richardsharpe

Good evening
two more things:
Don't get hung up on his lying. Almost everyone will lie under enough stress. He maybe horrified at his own behavior, stuck with an addiction that he is too embarrassed to admit. 

Don't give up hope. Everything could be the result of a porn addiction, and it may have been going on for a while. His watching so often (whenever you are out of the house) really suggests that it is an addition / compulsion.

Additions are very strange and difficult to comprehend for anyone who hasn't experienced one. A friend with a gambling addiction described: "Its as if someone else turned the car into the parking lot of the casino. I didn't want to go. Then I walked in. I knew I was going to lose all my money, but I couldn't stop. At every step I knew how wrong it was". This was an otherwise very nice and reasonable person. She ended up in prison for stealing to support her gambling.


----------



## EM415

Maybe I should have been more clear. When we first started dating, we definitely had that honeymoon phase where we couldn't keep our hands off each other, and the sex was great. But, like all relationships, that eventually fades a little and people get more comfortable. From the point on, things weren't as frequent as I would have liked. 
I'm not sure that he's not attracted to me. He tells me he thinks I'm cute, pretty, etc. when I put a little more effort into my hair or clothing, he noticed and compliments me. He notices when I wear something flattering. But I guess it's still a possibility that he doesn't find me attractive sexually. 
Either way, whether he does or doesn't, I want to be in a relationship where I FEEL attractive and it seems like porn is more important to him than me. If it weren't, he would have sought out change after one of the many conversations we've had about his low sex drive (towards me)


----------



## cdbaker

EM415, I want to lay my thoughts on you, which may make you feel better about the situation, or worse.

For starters, I'm a porn addict, or that is to say that I love porn. With that said, I decided a few years ago that I had a problem with it (basically identical to your husband's situation) and that I needed to fix it, and so I have.

Here's the thing about porn, and men with porn in particular. It is absolutely 100% addictive, just as much so as alcohol, gambling, heavy drugs, etc. In fact, it's far worse in some ways because where as those other addictions all produce very negative, OBVIOUS signs of abuse, porn typically does not. As you already know, your husband could go jerk off to porn and come back 15 minutes later and you'll be none the wiser. If he does so twice a day for several years, you still might never notice. Neither will his friends, co-workers, family, etc. So it is an addiction that is EASY to conceal. It's like a wonderful drug with a high reward and virtually no noticeable cost. Let's say you LOVE ice cream, it's your favorite thing in the world. If you could eat it all day every day, you would, but you don't because you'll become incredibly obese and unhealthy. If that wasn't the case however, you'd probably eat a ton more ice cream, right? Right.

The second thing about porn is how deceptively destructive it can be, especially within a marriage. THIS is what I didn't believe all the time I was using porn, and what made me stop once I realized it was truth. As I mentioned, there are no obvious negatives of porn use, so it's easy to fool ourselves into believing that it's harmless, no different than watching a football game on TV for instance. The truth is that porn reprograms yourself little by little. It's very much a progressive thing. I don't want to gross you out or anything, but when you see your first porn sex scene or erotic story, it's hot! It's exciting! He does his thing, then next time he wants to see something new. Oh a threesome, with two women? Even better! Eventually that becomes kind of boring too, then he is curious about a threesome with a bit of bondage involved. Oh that's interesting! Then so on and so on and so on. Asian women, swinging, bicuriousity, interracial, etc. Before long he's into all kinds of kinks you've never imagined, the kinds of interests you could never satisfy with him in real life. 

Continuing on... it's EASY. He feels the need to get off, he can take care of it himself in 10 minutes. Sure, you could say that you aren't blocking him, you'd welcome sex with him right? Well, with porn, he doesn't have to worry about satisfying you, there is no pressure to perform, no need for foreplay, no need for cuddling afterwards if that's your thing, no need for a big production, or talking about it, or anything. It's stress free. I will speak from experience and say that sex with your partner is certainly WAY better than jerking off to porn, but sometimes it's a convenience issue. Maybe it's like getting Taco Bell vs. going to your favorite sit-down mexican restaurant. The food there might be better, but Taco Bell is cheaper, you don't have to get out of your car or wait for it, and you can enjoy it in the comfort of your home while watching football. You could beg him to go to the restaurant with you and he might occasionally agree for your sake, but it will likely be a rare thing.

Lastly, as you know, when your partner finds out (and they usually do eventually) it can hurt them tremendously. For my wife, when she found out, I defended it as if it was just an occasional hobby. Honestly, she wasn't a sexual person at all, I was lucky if we could have sex more than twice a year, but it still hurt her enormously. In fact I responded to her defensively, acting as though she was trying to control me, that porn was fake and she was real, that it didn't impact how I felt about her at all, etc. Worst of all, I actually convinced her of that, and so she felt bad for being angry about it, while still feeling betrayed by it. It was a recipe for disaster for my marriage.

So despite her and several therapists warning me it was bad, the first time I realized that maybe it was a problem was during one of the rare times we did actually have sex. We were doing it, and I realized I was going to struggle to finish. We hadn't had sex in months, there should be absolutely NO problem getting off, right? I realized that my interests had gotten so explicit and kinky via porn, that plain ol' vanilla sex with my wife was difficult to get excited by, even though it was real life! Porn had reprogrammed how I responded to sexual stimuli, it changed the way I looked at my wife, and even though she was the one who was holding back our sexual activity, I still could clearly see how porn was decreasing my motivation to have sex with her. (Again, porn being so EASY after all...)

Ultimately, it nearly cost me my marriage. She left me and we were separated for three years. It was a nightmare. I was just blinded by the whole situation, and honestly had absolutely no idea that I was harming my relationship. I did occasionally lie to cover up my use, but I did so fully out of a desire to not hurt her feelings or make her jealous or anything like that. In fact, I really thought that was just normal. That every man used porn, and every man kept that quiet from his wife.

Now for the positive element... I really did just see porn as a brief once or twice a day escape. Like when you get home from work and just want to sit down and relax for a little while before getting up to make/help with dinner. That's all it was to me, and I bet that's how it is for your husband. My guess is that he's continued to use porn without any intent of hurting you, or even realizing that it hurts you at all, and likely is completely oblivious to how it is harming your marriage. I don't think your husband is a bad guy because of his porn use, or that he can't be a good husband, or certainly that he doesn't love you or care for you. I have always loved my wife, even in the depth of my porn use, I was just completely oblivious. So I say all of this in hope that you might consider that maybe your husband is similarly blind right now to the impact of his porn use, and will at least give him the opportunity to prove that.

What he needs is a wake-up call. I'd consider getting him to agree to a marriage counseling session of some kind if you can, or if not, to just sit down and explain all of your feelings, and maybe discuss a few of the things mentioned in this thread. Explain that this is a VERY serious issue for you, one that is critical enough for you to consider ending the marriage over. Just be honest and direct, and see what kind of reaction he has?


----------



## cdbaker

EM415 said:


> Maybe I should have been more clear. When we first started dating, we definitely had that honeymoon phase where we couldn't keep our hands off each other, and the sex was great. But, like all relationships, that eventually fades a little and people get more comfortable. From the point on, things weren't as frequent as I would have liked.
> I'm not sure that he's not attracted to me. He tells me he thinks I'm cute, pretty, etc. when I put a little more effort into my hair or clothing, he noticed and compliments me. He notices when I wear something flattering. But I guess it's still a possibility that he doesn't find me attractive sexually.
> Either way, whether he does or doesn't, I want to be in a relationship where I FEEL attractive and it seems like porn is more important to him than me. If it weren't, he would have sought out change after one of the many conversations we've had about his low sex drive (towards me)


Honestly, unless there is something else going on in the relationship, my guess is that he is still very much attracted to you, very much loves you, etc. Again, I've always loved my wife, and found her to be incredibly beautiful/sexy, but that really didn't have anything to do with my porn use. As you say, the issue is that you need to FEEL attractive, loved, treasured, etc., and his using porn certainly makes you not feel any of those things. I promise he isn't using porn because you aren't attractive.


----------



## MEM2020

He has a severe porn addiction. And he has a choice in front of him. 




EM415 said:


> Maybe I should have been more clear. When we first started dating, we definitely had that honeymoon phase where we couldn't keep our hands off each other, and the sex was great. But, like all relationships, that eventually fades a little and people get more comfortable. From the point on, things weren't as frequent as I would have liked.
> I'm not sure that he's not attracted to me. He tells me he thinks I'm cute, pretty, etc. when I put a little more effort into my hair or clothing, he noticed and compliments me. He notices when I wear something flattering. But I guess it's still a possibility that he doesn't find me attractive sexually.
> Either way, whether he does or doesn't, I want to be in a relationship where I FEEL attractive and it seems like porn is more important to him than me. If it weren't, he would have sought out change after one of the many conversations we've had about his low sex drive (towards me)


----------



## gouge_away

EM415
I am also an addict, to nicotine. I imagine porn works very much the same. Your husband may be very ashamed, even ashamed that he isn't living up to your expectations, ashamed that he got himself trapped, and ashamed that he doesn't have the strength, alone, to get himself out.

The thing about addictions and their draw, is that the user builds a dependency. With all the shame that your husband must feel, porn is always there and available, porn offers instant gratification.

No matter how bad he feels, porn instantly makes him feel good for the moment, but the long term effect is it causes more shame.

He could have very well tried everything he could to stop himself, and he probably has, more than once. He may have quit looking at porn for weeks and focused on you, but couldn't finish, that caused shame, embarrassment, and porn was always there to instantly satisfy, but only for a moment, because he sunk deeper.

Think of your husband trapped in quicksand, the more he tries to get out himself, the quicker he begins to sink deeper.

You OP make addictions sound like an easy thing to kick, but I honestly wonder if you are as strong as you make yourself out to be.

I understand you don't want to be his mother, so hiding the cable modem is not an option. I wonder though, if this was a bottle, would you remove it from the house to save your marriage, or continue to watch your husband sink deeper, shaming him all the way.

I agree with you, you would be better off walking away.


----------



## EM415

cdbaker said:


> EM415, I want to lay my thoughts on you, which may make you feel better about the situation, or worse.
> 
> For starters, I'm a porn addict, or that is to say that I love porn. With that said, I decided a few years ago that I had a problem with it (basically identical to your husband's situation) and that I needed to fix it, and so I have.
> 
> Here's the thing about porn, and men with porn in particular. It is absolutely 100% addictive, just as much so as alcohol, gambling, heavy drugs, etc. In fact, it's far worse in some ways because where as those other addictions all produce very negative, OBVIOUS signs of abuse, porn typically does not. As you already know, your husband could go jerk off to porn and come back 15 minutes later and you'll be none the wiser. If he does so twice a day for several years, you still might never notice. Neither will his friends, co-workers, family, etc. So it is an addiction that is EASY to conceal. It's like a wonderful drug with a high reward and virtually no noticeable cost. Let's say you LOVE ice cream, it's your favorite thing in the world. If you could eat it all day every day, you would, but you don't because you'll become incredibly obese and unhealthy. If that wasn't the case however, you'd probably eat a ton more ice cream, right? Right.
> 
> The second thing about porn is how deceptively destructive it can be, especially within a marriage. THIS is what I didn't believe all the time I was using porn, and what made me stop once I realized it was truth. As I mentioned, there are no obvious negatives of porn use, so it's easy to fool ourselves into believing that it's harmless, no different than watching a football game on TV for instance. The truth is that porn reprograms yourself little by little. It's very much a progressive thing. I don't want to gross you out or anything, but when you see your first porn sex scene or erotic story, it's hot! It's exciting! He does his thing, then next time he wants to see something new. Oh a threesome, with two women? Even better! Eventually that becomes kind of boring too, then he is curious about a threesome with a bit of bondage involved. Oh that's interesting! Then so on and so on and so on. Asian women, swinging, bicuriousity, interracial, etc. Before long he's into all kinds of kinks you've never imagined, the kinds of interests you could never satisfy with him in real life.
> 
> Continuing on... it's EASY. He feels the need to get off, he can take care of it himself in 10 minutes. Sure, you could say that you aren't blocking him, you'd welcome sex with him right? Well, with porn, he doesn't have to worry about satisfying you, there is no pressure to perform, no need for foreplay, no need for cuddling afterwards if that's your thing, no need for a big production, or talking about it, or anything. It's stress free. I will speak from experience and say that sex with your partner is certainly WAY better than jerking off to porn, but sometimes it's a convenience issue. Maybe it's like getting Taco Bell vs. going to your favorite sit-down mexican restaurant. The food there might be better, but Taco Bell is cheaper, you don't have to get out of your car or wait for it, and you can enjoy it in the comfort of your home while watching football. You could beg him to go to the restaurant with you and he might occasionally agree for your sake, but it will likely be a rare thing.
> 
> Lastly, as you know, when your partner finds out (and they usually do eventually) it can hurt them tremendously. For my wife, when she found out, I defended it as if it was just an occasional hobby. Honestly, she wasn't a sexual person at all, I was lucky if we could have sex more than twice a year, but it still hurt her enormously. In fact I responded to her defensively, acting as though she was trying to control me, that porn was fake and she was real, that it didn't impact how I felt about her at all, etc. Worst of all, I actually convinced her of that, and so she felt bad for being angry about it, while still feeling betrayed by it. It was a recipe for disaster for my marriage.
> 
> So despite her and several therapists warning me it was bad, the first time I realized that maybe it was a problem was during one of the rare times we did actually have sex. We were doing it, and I realized I was going to struggle to finish. We hadn't had sex in months, there should be absolutely NO problem getting off, right? I realized that my interests had gotten so explicit and kinky via porn, that plain ol' vanilla sex with my wife was difficult to get excited by, even though it was real life! Porn had reprogrammed how I responded to sexual stimuli, it changed the way I looked at my wife, and even though she was the one who was holding back our sexual activity, I still could clearly see how porn was decreasing my motivation to have sex with her. (Again, porn being so EASY after all...)
> 
> Ultimately, it nearly cost me my marriage. She left me and we were separated for three years. It was a nightmare. I was just blinded by the whole situation, and honestly had absolutely no idea that I was harming my relationship. I did occasionally lie to cover up my use, but I did so fully out of a desire to not hurt her feelings or make her jealous or anything like that. In fact, I really thought that was just normal. That every man used porn, and every man kept that quiet from his wife.
> 
> Now for the positive element... I really did just see porn as a brief once or twice a day escape. Like when you get home from work and just want to sit down and relax for a little while before getting up to make/help with dinner. That's all it was to me, and I bet that's how it is for your husband. My guess is that he's continued to use porn without any intent of hurting you, or even realizing that it hurts you at all, and likely is completely oblivious to how it is harming your marriage. I don't think your husband is a bad guy because of his porn use, or that he can't be a good husband, or certainly that he doesn't love you or care for you. I have always loved my wife, even in the depth of my porn use, I was just completely oblivious. So I say all of this in hope that you might consider that maybe your husband is similarly blind right now to the impact of his porn use, and will at least give him the opportunity to prove that.
> 
> What he needs is a wake-up call. I'd consider getting him to agree to a marriage counseling session of some kind if you can, or if not, to just sit down and explain all of your feelings, and maybe discuss a few of the things mentioned in this thread. Explain that this is a VERY serious issue for you, one that is critical enough for you to consider ending the marriage over. Just be honest and direct, and see what kind of reaction he has?


Thank you for your thoughtful and concise response. I do appreciate it. 

I guess I have to ask, and it's okay if you don't answer: why did you let it get to the point of your wife leaving you for 3 years? I'm sure you knew she was hurting before that. Why wasn't that enough motivation for you to get yourself some help and fix your marriage? I know you loved her, but it doesn't seem like you respected her at all. I'm not asking you these questions to be inflammatory or to call you a jerk; I'm asking because I have these same questions about my own husband, and what you wrote was thoughtful and sounds like what I imagine my husband will tell me tonight. He knows that his "lack" of a sex drive makes me feel unloved and repulsive, he knows that I think sex is am important part of marriage, and he knows that it bothers me that he never comes on to me. Why wasn't that enough motivation for him to seek help? Why has it come to me finding a solid year of daily porn use in his browser history? The question I will ask him is, "why didn't you love or respect me enough to get ahold of this back when I first expressed dissatisfaction with our sex life? Why not one of the many times thereafter?" .... and I hope he can give me a good answer. 

I hope your marriage is back on the right track now. I'm glad you could still see hope in each other after 3 years apart. It sounds like you have something worth fighting for, and I wish you the best.


----------



## cdbaker

I very much agree with Gouge-away above, except for maybe the very end about walking away. Once he is made aware that he has been busted, and how this makes you feel, and your concern for what it is doing to him, he will likely be instantly ashamed of himself. Of course, shame can produce a range of feelings, from fear, sorrow, anger, defensiveness, desperation, etc.

It's all part of recovery, if he gets to that point. It's extremely common for people trying to recover from addiction to fail a few times along the way, so it takes a lot of patience and grace to be supportive of that.


----------



## EM415

gouge_away said:


> EM415
> 
> You OP make addictions sound like an easy thing to kick, but I honestly wonder if you are as strong as you make yourself out to be.
> 
> I understand you don't want to be his mother, so hiding the cable modem is not an option. I wonder though, if this was a bottle, would you remove it from the house to save your marriage, or continue to watch your husband sink deeper, shaming him all the way.
> 
> I agree with you, you would be better off walking away.


I know that addictions are a hard thing to quit. I do. It took me several tries to quit smoking myself, and eventually I succeeded. I guess I just wonder why I've brought up the low sex drive issue, the not "finishing" issue, several times and that wasn't enough to stop him, you know? Somewhat recently we had a conversation about those two things, and sure enough, he was looking at porn the very next day. There's about a year of history on the computer, and I don't see any break in time that shows me that he made any effort, despite my concerns over our problems in the bedroom. 

If this were alcohol of course I would try to get him help. I would support him, and I would not keep bottles in the house. However, if he showed no interest in changing, I wouldn't stick around and be his doormat forever. 

I'm not sure that I'm ready to leave. I really don't know. I'm hurt, and angry, and don't trust him. Half of me is disgusted by him and what he's done to our marriage, and the other half of me still loves him very much. It's a very conflicting place to be in. I think there's a very fine line between being a good, strong partner, and being someone's doormat, and I'm not sure what side of that line I'm on at the moment. 

But thank you - it helps to put my feelings into words and have someone understand them and offer help. I appreciate everyones time.


----------



## cdbaker

EM415 said:


> Thank you for your thoughtful and concise response. I do appreciate it.
> 
> I guess I have to ask, and it's okay if you don't answer: why did you let it get to the point of your wife leaving you for 3 years? I'm sure you knew she was hurting before that. Why wasn't that enough motivation for you to get yourself some help and fix your marriage? I know you loved her, but it doesn't seem like you respected her at all. I'm not asking you these questions to be inflammatory or to call you a jerk; I'm asking because I have these same questions about my own husband, and what you wrote was thoughtful and sounds like what I imagine my husband will tell me tonight. He knows that his "lack" of a sex drive makes me feel unloved and repulsive, he knows that I think sex is am important part of marriage, and he knows that it bothers me that he never comes on to me. Why wasn't that enough motivation for him to seek help? Why has it come to me finding a solid year of daily porn use in his browser history? The question I will ask him is, "why didn't you love or respect me enough to get ahold of this back when I first expressed dissatisfaction with our sex life? Why not one of the many times thereafter?" .... and I hope he can give me a good answer.
> 
> I hope your marriage is back on the right track now. I'm glad you could still see hope in each other after 3 years apart. It sounds like you have something worth fighting for, and I wish you the best.


"Why?" is a great question.

In short, I was inconsiderate and a moron.

Longer version: I rationalized my actions by believing that there was nothing wrong with porn, that it was completely victimless, that it didn't impact how I viewed my wife, and that it was no different than any other interest/hobby. When my wife expressed that she was extremely uncomfortable with it and it made her feel unloved, unattractive, etc., I would try to explain to her that I did very much love her, that I did still very much find her attractive, which was all true! And in our case, because it was my wife who was withholding sex through most of our marriage, I even implied that part of the reason why I needed porn was because she refused to engage sexually with me. (This also hurt her tremendously, because then she felt enormous guilt over being a partial cause of the problem, but not feeling like she could resolve it) Basically I wasn't really listening to her, or realizing that her feelings are FACTS, not cases that can be argued against.

Like if she said she felt unloved, I would respond by trying to show her all the different ways I did show her love, explain how much I did love her, how there was all this evidence that supported my assertion that I loved her, and everything that I said was absolutely true so therefore I felt that it was valid. The bottom line that I missed however was, that even though I did love her, and I could make a rock solid case for why she should feel loved, the reality was that she didn't feel loved. That was FACT. Maybe she SHOULD feel loved logically, whatever that means, but she doesn't. I can't convince her that she does when she doesn't. This is a common male affliction, lol.

Ultimately, as I mentioned, I actually convinced her that I was right. Or at least I convinced her that I should be right, and that her feelings must be wrong. (What an awful thing, to be made to believe that your own feelings are wrong, and that you have a problem) So she stuck around and didn't say anything about it, but all the while she continued to live feeling completely unloved by me due to my actions. In time, if you let a woman go feeling unloved for long enough, she will become desperate for genuine affection (not just words from someone who says sweet things in one breath, while expending it on porn the next moment) and she got sucked into an affair with another married man who knew exactly what to say to an unhappy wife.

For me, that was my "wake up call". That for all the ways I had rationalized my choices, and had convinced her I was right, the bottom line was that she was unhappy and now engaged in an affair with another man, and that my marriage was likely over. I could feel "right" all day long and lose my wife, or I could start considering the situation differently and try to save my marriage. Ultimately, I was too late to avoid the affair. My "eureka" moment that I described above when we were having sex and I realized what porn was doing to me made me realize that I needed to get away from porn, but by that point she was woefully convinced that I was hopeless. She couldn't believe anything I'd say, she just couldn't bring herself to walk away until the other man entered the picture.

So like I said, I was a moron because I didn't realize early enough that porn was a very real threat to my marriage, that it was reprogramming my sexuality, and because I didn't understand what "I feel that..." really means. I was inconsiderate because I defaulted to rationalizing and defending my own wants and desires first, before considering hers. If you stop and think about it, you can rationalize just about anything and if you do, you will genuinely feel good about it. I certainly NEVER meant to hurt my wife, I never wanted that, and I never thought I was doing anything wrong. When my wife shared that she thought I was doing wrong, I really thought I could defend it, and once she understood my case, she would accept it and move on. Ultimately when my "wake-up call" hit, I was devastated to realized what all I had done, and how I had brought down my marriage. Her affair is very much related to that, and while having an affair is absolutely wrong and she bears the responsibility for that, I can recognize how my actions drove her to that situation.

I hope that helps?


----------



## cdbaker

EM415 said:


> I know that addictions are a hard thing to quit. I do. It took me several tries to quit smoking myself, and eventually I succeeded. I guess I just wonder why I've brought up the low sex drive issue, the not "finishing" issue, several times and that wasn't enough to stop him, you know? Somewhat recently we had a conversation about those two things, and sure enough, he was looking at porn the very next day. There's about a year of history on the computer, and I don't see any break in time that shows me that he made any effort, despite my concerns over our problems in the bedroom.
> 
> If this were alcohol of course I would try to get him help. I would support him, and I would not keep bottles in the house. However, if he showed no interest in changing, I wouldn't stick around and be his doormat forever.
> 
> I'm not sure that I'm ready to leave. I really don't know. I'm hurt, and angry, and don't trust him. Half of me is disgusted by him and what he's done to our marriage, and the other half of me still loves him very much. It's a very conflicting place to be in. I think there's a very fine line between being a good, strong partner, and being someone's doormat, and I'm not sure what side of that line I'm on at the moment.
> 
> But thank you - it helps to put my feelings into words and have someone understand them and offer help. I appreciate everyones time.



Your bringing up the low-sex drive, the inability to finish, etc. are all very valid, but I'm guessing he just hasn't connected those issues to his porn use. And to be clear, it's POSSIBLE that those would still be issues even if he wasn't using porn, but certainly porn would contribute to those issues.

And I know the fact he's been doing this for years has hurt, but also try to remember that he hasn't been busted for it yet either. He needs to find out that he's been caught, that it's a serious issue for you, and that you won't put up with it. If he then continues to use it without remorse or effort to quit, then maybe he is hopeless. But don't construe his continued use to indicate that he is repeatedly, knowingly failing you. I hope that makes sense.

It's like if someone is embezzling money from their employer and they get caught. They get charged with one count of embezzlement, not one count for every instance they took money or for every dollar. If they get caught, pay for the crime, then do it again, then it's a whole different story.


As you said about how you would support him if he were an alcoholic, is exactly the kind of support he'll need if he's willing to try to give up porn. Use that as a guide for yourself, if it comes to that. It will likely mean needing to password protect or get rid of any internet accesible device in the house, including his smartphone. It will mean probably installing tracking software on whatever device you do have as well. For me, I had access to my computer with tracking software on it that instantly sent an e-mail to my accountability partner (who also happened to be my pastor) if ANY site of questionable content was accessed. I installed similar software on my phone, but these days there is no software on smartphones that can't be gotten around. I even got rid of my Playstation and portable game systems because they had web browsers built in and couldn't install tracking software on them.

I could write pages about this, but lets see how your husband responds first.


----------



## EM415

cdbaker said:


> I hope that helps?


It does, very much. So thank you, really. Considering my ill feelings and distrust towards my husband right now, I know that anything he can say to me will be looked at through a tainted lens. I don't know what to believe and what not to believe when he speaks. So, it does help to hear it from someone who has been through this and can admit that his actions were wrong. I hope that is a mindset my husband gets to before it's too late for our marriage. 

I've never cheated on my husband and I never will. But, I wouldn't be honest if I said I haven't had feelings for other people. I've never acted on those feelings or crossed boundaries with anyone, but I know that I only had the opportunity to let someone else catch my eye because I wasn't getting what I wanted at home. I've never told him that because I didn't want to hurt him when it was just a crush, but those were the times that I would try to talk to him about our pathetic sex life. I had the self-awareness to recognize that things were going wrong with me and I was staring down a path that I didn't want to go down, so I tried to approach him about it.....I guess I wish he had viewed his porn addiction the same way, and I feel pretty resentful that he didn't. I bet people will think that's a bad outlook towards an addict, if that's what he is, but I'm just being honest. 

But really, thank you. He'll be home soon....time to suck it up and have this talk I guess!


----------



## gouge_away

EM415 said:


> I know that addictions are a hard thing to quit. I do. It took me several tries to quit smoking myself, and eventually I succeeded. I guess I just wonder why I've brought up the low sex drive issue, the not "finishing" issue, several times and that wasn't enough to stop him, you know?


You had knowledge of the negative side effects smoking had to your health and finances. Yet that knowledge wasn't enough to stop you from doing it, it took wisdom, experience, or medication. 

Knowledge is not wisdom.
Wisdom is using your knowledge for good. That requires choices and actions, options, and RESTRAINTS.


----------



## FormerSelf

Hi EM,

I know that this is affecting you greatly and the result of uncovering his porn use and making a bold-faced lie about it is painful and makes you feel all sorts of betrayal and rejection, but...

His issue really doesn't have anything to do about you.

Right now, it is important to compartmentalize the hurt that you feel from his actions and be supportive about helping him get to the root of why he has been hiding his porn from you...even when you haven't cared much about it before.

People turn to things like porn when they need to rely on it for self-medicating. When life stresses them out. When they feel powerless. When they try avoid the pain of past hurts. But after, a while they don't realize that they need the the release to normalize...they begin to have to rely on their drug for much more than a random pleasure. After a while it is hard to function without it, getting addicted to the huge fantasy overload of dopamine...that it is hard to even feel things outside of porn. It robs them of being present...it robs them of their ability to feel...and it warps their idea of what is love and intimacy.

I would suggest not to waylay him with how you have been wronged and back him in a corner, but just be direct that his hiding his porn and lying about it as well as being physically avoidant is risking his marriage. If he cops up to it...then work with him to find resources to get to the bottom of it. If he just flies of the handle and tells you to back off, then he isn't ready and then you need to move in with mom...or he needs to move out until he is ready to get real and work with you.

This isn't about punishing him...this is about helping him. But yes, your feelings are important to...and it is important to have a good support system to vent and be angry...and hopefully he will get to a place where he can grasp the pain he has been causing (even when he thinks he had been expertly hiding it.


----------



## EM415

Well, I told him what I knew and how I felt. He cried. He admitted he had a problem. He said he would get help. I told him I wasn't sure how things would play out between us, that I was really deeply hurt and honestly did't know how I could move past it. We were not on good terms, but we were having a productive, calm conversation....


and then it got ugly. 


I asked him what else he needed to tell me. I told him that he needed to come clean about EVERYTHING. I noticed that he's been looking at Facebook profiles of some attractive women we know and doing it A LOT....I didn't ask him about it, but he came clean about it when I told him he needed to put all his cards on the table. He says sometimes he looks at pictures of attractive women on Facebook. That's all he looks at though.....he's not looking at his male friends, he's not looking at his unattractive female friends - he is strictly looking at pictures of attractive female coworkers, my friends, his friends, and then visiting porn sites shortly thereafter. He says he doesn't masturbate to the images or thoughts of these women, but I just don't know if I believe that. Yes, I know we're all human and can find other people attractive and look at them. I get it. But I don't go on Facebook and search for attractive male members of my circles....I don't look at pictures of attractive male friends and then visit porn sites because I'm all turned on. 

I was trying to have an open mind and conversation, but knowing that he was looking at pictures of MY FRIENDS (and his) and then getting turned on enough to go to porn sites....I just lost it. I started crying and screaming like I never have before. I tossed his car keys out the front door and told him to leave. I've never exploded like that before. I let him back in the house long enough to grab clothes and then he left. He's at his mother's house right now. 

The porn - I was horrified and disgusted....but at least those were actresses....as least those weren't "real people" if you know what I mean. But now he's oogling over women we actually know and then visiting porn sites?!?!?! How could I ever trust him again? How can I trust him to be around these women? Some of them were women that I don't know because they were his coworkers.....how can I trust him at all? I can't. 

I'm so hurt by that admission. It cuts so much deeper than the porn did. I just wish this wasn't my life right now. I would have been willing to see a marriage counselor about the porn...but this....god this hurts....


----------



## gouge_away

/Sigh/ so ends the accountability
Did you not confess that you also had a crush?
Are you so different?
When will you come clean about that now?


EM415 said:


> I've never cheated on my husband and I never will. But, I wouldn't be honest if I said I haven't had feelings for other people. I've never acted on those feelings or crossed boundaries with anyone, but I know that I only had the opportunity to let someone else catch my eye because I wasn't getting what I wanted at home. I've never told him that because I didn't want to hurt him when it was just a crush, but those were the times that I would try to talk to him about our pathetic sex life. I had the self-awareness to recognize that things were going wrong with me and I was staring down a path that I didn't want to go down, so I tried to approach him about it.....I guess I wish he had viewed his porn addiction the same way, and I feel pretty resentful that he didn't. I bet people will think that's a bad outlook towards an addict, if that's what he is, but I'm just being honest.


You seem to have missed an opportunity to see his porn addiction the same way.

You have all the answers, yet failing the test. Wisdom sister, what do you need to do right now to save your marriage? He's sinking.


----------



## EM415

gouge_away said:


> /Sigh/ so ends the accountability
> Did you not confess that you also had a crush?
> Are you so different?
> When will you come clean about that now?
> .



yeah, I did. Late last night we were on the phone and I told him that no one is perfect and that marriage takes work, and that sometimes I too find myself wandering (mentally, I would never ever act on a crush, and I believe him when he says he's never cheated too) but there's something that has just sort of kicked in and told me to smarten up and focus on what's important. He's been using pictures of women he knows to get turned on and view porn for awhile now....he said he knew what he was doing was wrong, but he chose to keep doing it. 

When he first started saying it was an addiction and he wanted to get help, I was willing to hear it. We talked about a lot of things: therapy, possible depression, etc. It was rough, but at least we were talking about the issue. But when he told me that he's been looking at pictures of women we actually know and using that arousal to go view porn, that just went too far for me. It wasn't just a couple times. It wasn't just a harmless crush. It was with many women in our circles, over a long period of time. It creeps me out big time. 

Call it part of the addiction if you want, it seems like a separate issue to me, either way, it hurts like hell and I don't think I'm so terrible for expressing that.


----------



## gouge_away

Your feelings of hurt are normal.

I do think that him being aroused by women within his circle is normal as well.
The reason nobody pointed out your crush before is because that's normal, and you knew better to act on it, yet EM, I think you feel toxic shame for that, and that is why you went into a rage when your husband confessed. What you did after was nothing short of project your shame onto him.


I don't think that his compulsivity to internet pornography is normal.
You believe he has slipped down the slope, and it creeps you out, that is a normal feeling.

EM415, you feel betrayed because your husband did not live up to your expectations.

What are your expectations of your husband?

Do you expect him not to be aroused by other women?


----------



## SecondTime'Round

EM415 said:


> . But when he told me that he's been looking at pictures of women we actually know and using that arousal to go view porn, that just went too far for me. It wasn't just a couple times. It wasn't just a harmless crush. It was with many women in our circles, over a long period of time. It creeps me out big time.


That would creep me out too, and embarrass me.....I mean, can you imagine if these women knew about it?

I'm sorry for all of this .


----------



## SecondTime'Round

gouge_away said:


> Your feelings of hurt are normal.
> 
> I do think that him being aroused by women within his circle is normal as well.
> The reason nobody pointed out your crush before is because that's normal, and you knew better to act on it, yet EM, I think you feel toxic shame for that, and that is why you went into a rage when your husband confessed. What you did after was nothing short of project your shame onto him.
> 
> 
> I don't think that his compulsivity to internet pornography is normal.
> You believe he has slipped down the slope, and it creeps you out, that is a normal feeling.
> 
> EM415, you feel betrayed because your husband did not live up to your expectations.
> 
> What are your expectations of your husband?
> 
> Do you expect him not to be aroused by other women?


Sorry, Gouge, but EM finding herself developing a crush on someone and stopping it in its tracks is NOTHING like what her husband has been doing, and I wholeheartedly disagree that she was "projecting her shame on to him." 

With all due respect, you are way off here.


----------



## gouge_away

EM415 said:


> …I wouldn't be honest if I said I haven't had feelings for other people…but I know that I only had the opportunity to let someone else catch my eye because I wasn't getting what I wanted at home. I've never told him that because I didn't want to hurt him when it was just a crush…I had the self-awareness to recognize that things were going wrong with me and I was staring down a path that I didn't want to go down, so I tried to approach him about it.....I guess I wish he had viewed his porn addiction the same way, and I feel pretty resentful that he didn't…


She noticed what she was doing was wrong, and decided to stop before it got worse...
She expected him to do the exact same thing... But he chose to continue rather than stop...


EM415 said:


> I guess I wish he had viewed his porn addiction *the same way,* and I feel pretty resentful that he didn't…


Sounds like projection to me.


----------



## EM415

SecondTime'Round said:


> Sorry, Gouge, but EM finding herself developing a crush on someone and stopping it in its tracks is NOTHING like what her husband has been doing, and I wholeheartedly disagree that she was "projecting her shame on to him."
> 
> With all due respect, you are way off here.


Correct. Of course I know he's human and he will find other people attractive and may find himself with a harmless crush every now and then. I think that's normal of all married people. However, to consistently be using image of DOZENS of our acquaintances and friends to get himself turned on enough to view porn....that's a whole other game, one that I can honestly say I have never done and I don't understand it. 

He told me that he DID make the connection between me expressing dissatisfaction with our sex life and his habitual use of porn. He understood the connection, understood that he was causing the problem, and understood the hurt it was causing me personally. I asked him if, once he made that connection, did he ever make an effort to stop or seek help....he said no. At least if he had tried and failed it would have shown an ounce of respect for me, but he never cared how he was hurting our relationship. I appreciate his honestly, but it burns to know that he was hurting me and never once tried to help himself or us.


----------



## SecondTime'Round

gouge_away said:


> She noticed what she was doing was wrong, and decided to stop before it got worse...
> She expected him to do the exact same thing... But he chose to continue rather than stop...
> 
> 
> Sounds like projection to me.


Projection of what, exactly?


----------



## gouge_away

First, her 'good faith,' did she say that she confessed her crush, or wanted to?
I don't see that she told him, she wanted to but didn't want to hurt his feelings.

Second, her knowledge of heading in the wrong direction, and subsequently stopping herself.
She expected that he would draw the parallels (without knowledge of the first)

Third, her resentment of his lack of resentment.


Do you see that she is resentful because he didn't view his porn the same way she views her crush.


----------



## EM415

gouge_away said:


> First, her 'good faith,' did she say that she confessed her crush, or wanted to?
> I don't see that she told him, she wanted to but didn't want to hurt his feelings.
> 
> Second, her knowledge of heading in the wrong direction, and subsequently stopping herself.
> She expected that he would draw the parallels (without knowledge of the first)
> 
> Third, her resentment of his lack of resentment.


Wow. You asked me if I told him, and I answered you. Apparently you didn't actually read the answer before making your comments. 

I don't have a resentment over his lack of resentment. That doesn't even make sense. I resent that I have enough self-awareness and respect for my husband to realize when I'm going down the wrong path and fix it. He doesn't, he just keeps doing disgusting things. He has no respect for me. 

You seem very out of touch. I think maybe it's time for you to move on from this conversation, since you clearly aren't even reading what I wrote. You have conclusions that you WANT to draw, and they just aren't accurate. Thank you, but I'm all set.


----------



## SecondTime'Round

gouge_away said:


> She expected that he would draw the parallels (without knowledge of the first)


No, she expected he would act like a decent man. Period. Has nothing to do with "drawing parallels." She said she wished he'd done what she'd done when faced with temptation--be a good person. It's not more complicated than that. She also could have said, "I wish he'd handled it like my next door neighbor would have." Or "the post man."


----------



## Luxey

IMO, having a crush or three in a marriage is no biggie, it's human nature. I've had them and I'm sure my husband has, too. Whatever. It's not something we moral & loyal married people actively seek out; it just kind of happens. Married people who don't cultivate those crushes....no harm, no foul.

What EM415's husband did was a HUGE foul and violation.

I can deal with my husband thinking one of my girlfriends is hot, or viewing porn a couple of times a week. Neither of those things are a big deal - but creeping my friends on FB then spanking it to porn 5 mins later??

No, no, no. That's so over the line.


----------



## EM415

Luxey said:


> IMO, having a crush or three in a marriage is no biggie, it's human nature. I've had them and I'm sure my husband has, too. Whatever. It's not something we moral & loyal married people actively seek out; it just kind of happens. Married people who don't cultivate those crushes....no harm, no foul.
> 
> What EM415's husband did was a HUGE foul and violation.
> 
> I can deal with my husband thinking one of my girlfriends is hot, or viewing porn a couple of times a week. Neither of those things are a big deal - but creeping my friends on FB then spanking it to porn 5 mins later??
> 
> No, no, no. That's so over the line.


Exactly. That crossed a boundary. Porn was offensive enough, but at least those women weren't "real." Now he's made it personal. Thinking someone is attractive and maybe having a little crush few and far between = total normal human behavior. What he did though....too far, and I don't think I can forgive or move past that. 

He said he was curious. He said that after being with me for 6 years, he wanted to see something new. Okay fine - that's what OCCASIONAL porn use is for. But to be looking at pictures of our friends on Facebook and then watching porn?! What a pig! I love him so much, but maybe he's not the man I thought I knew...this hurts too much.


----------



## SecondTime'Round

Luxey said:


> IMO, having a crush or three in a marriage is no biggie, it's human nature. I've had them and I'm sure my husband has, too. Whatever. It's not something we moral & loyal married people actively seek out; it just kind of happens. Married people who don't cultivate those crushes....no harm, no foul.
> 
> What EM415's husband did was a HUGE foul and violation.
> 
> I can deal with my husband thinking one of my girlfriends is hot, or viewing porn a couple of times a week. Neither of those things are a big deal - but creeping my friends on FB then spanking it to porn 5 mins later??
> 
> No, no, no. That's so over the line.


When I was a happy newlywed 19 years ago, I developed a big crush on my veterinarian who looked like Aiden Quinn. I didn't DO anything about it, didn't flirt with him or anything (in fact he made me so nervous I probably barely said anything lol). But, I had a crush.

Fast forward 12 years or so and my husband (now ex) started searching for sex online and found it. 

Is my resentment over the fact that he did that because of my own guilt over my crush on the vet? 

No. I never even felt guilty for having that crush. But, I did have enough decency to not hit on him, and I had an expectation that my then husband would have behaved in a similar manner.


----------



## EM415

Ladies - can I ask you - what would you do in my shoes? I know you don't know me or my husband, or the exact details of our relationship - I'm not looking for anyone to tell me what to do.....I guess I just want a little advice. Would you run and never look back? Would you try to work it out? He's told me that he feels ashamed, disgusted with himself, etc....I know he feels ashamed, but I just don't know if I would ever be able to trust him. I feel like he's this major creep and I'm being blinded to it because he's my husband. Is he this freak and I just want to see the best in him? These are the questions I'm asking myself


----------



## Luxey

EM415 said:


> Ladies - can I ask you - what would you do in my shoes? I know you don't know me or my husband, or the exact details of our relationship - I'm not looking for anyone to tell me what to do.....I guess I just want a little advice. Would you run and never look back? Would you try to work it out? He's told me that he feels ashamed, disgusted with himself, etc....I know he feels ashamed, but I just don't know if I would ever be able to trust him. I feel like he's this major creep and I'm being blinded to it because he's my husband. Is he this freak and I just want to see the best in him? These are the questions I'm asking myself


I'd run and never look back.

Creeping/stalking my friends on FB then going to porn and jerking off is a deal breaker for me. It's the stalker element I couldn't get past. I would literally be thinking _my husband is a stalker!!_ and wouldn't be able to stand the sight of him.

The caveat is this: is his creeping/stalking part and parcel of his porn addiction? If so, I would get us both some IC and MC, because I'd certainly need to get myself some therapy if I was going to stay in the marriage.


----------



## EM415

Luxey said:


> I'd run and never look back.
> 
> Creeping/stalking my friends on FB then going to porn and jerking off is a deal breaker for me. It's the stalker element I couldn't get past. I would literally be thinking _my husband is a stalker!!_ and wouldn't be able to stand the sight of him.
> 
> The caveat is this: is his creeping/stalking part and parcel of his porn addiction? If so, I would get us both some IC and MC, because I'd certainly need to get myself some therapy if I was going to stay in the marriage.


I don't really think he's stalking anyone, nothing that extreme. I think he sees them post attractive pictures of themselves (nothing sexual, just generally pretty women)...he gets curious, looks at their pictures, and then is turned on enough to go view porn. He tells me that he's not thinking about them when he's watching porn and masturbating. But the fact that it turns him on enough to seek porn creeps me out. He said that he's been with me for 6 years and he just gets turned on by other women...but to the extreme of seeking porn when you see them on FB?

I honestly don't know if the two are intertwined. Personally, I feel that porn addiction is a separate issue. He could look at all the porn he wants (not that I condone it)....but he didn't need to take it to this personal level. 
He is calling around trying to find a therapist today. He asked if I would go with him, and I said I would, but I made it clear that it doesn't mean we are staying together or that this will work.


----------



## richardsharpe

Good evening
I think looking at pictures of friends is just part of the porn addiction. Porn gets dull and the addict looks for new, different stimulation. Some go to ever more exotic (or horrifying) porn. You'll see a wide variety of really bizarre things on porn sites, and I think it is mostly for novelty. Some (very sadly) go for child porn because it is something new. Your husband is now going for what is essentially acquaintance porn - sexualizing images of people he knows. Maybe he's already gone through transexuals, old ladies, and (fake) voyeur porn. 

I don't personally see this as anything different, just his addiction grabbing at anything it can. 


You are still free to leave him - I don't think anyone should feel trapped into living with an addict. I don't think threats etc will work - I honestly think he cannot help himself.


----------



## Luxey

EM415 said:


> I don't really think he's stalking anyone, nothing that extreme. I think he sees them post attractive pictures of themselves (nothing sexual, just generally pretty women)...he gets curious, looks at their pictures, and then is turned on enough to go view porn. He tells me that he's not thinking about them when he's watching porn and masturbating. But the fact that it turns him on enough to seek porn creeps me out. He said that he's been with me for 6 years and he just gets turned on by other women...but to the extreme of seeking porn when you see them on FB?
> 
> I honestly don't know if the two are intertwined. Personally, I feel that porn addiction is a separate issue. He could look at all the porn he wants (not that I condone it)....but he didn't need to take it to this personal level.
> He is calling around trying to find a therapist today. He asked if I would go with him, and I said I would, but I made it clear that it doesn't mean we are staying together or that this will work.


Oh I see wrt the stalking issue. And yeah, I agree it's still creepy either way. TBH, I'd probably still leave, but we have no children to consider. My answer would probably be different if we did.


----------



## SecondTime'Round

EM415 said:


> He said that he's been with me for 6 years and he just gets turned on by other women...but to the extreme of seeking porn when you see them on FB?


I would not be OK with this. Even if he ceased using the internet altogether, forever, I'd be paranoid every time we were out to dinner with friends....did he just go to the bathroom to jerk off because he thinks my friend across the table is hot? 

Add to that the fact that he'd then go home with you and NOT give you sex? 

I predict if you do try to work this out you'll eventually get to a place where you just can't forgive. He can stop the porn, but the desires he has will always be there.


----------



## AVR1962

I am curious, as this is much what I have dealt with in my 23 year marriage.....were you the initiator?? I am talking when you were dating, were you the one that was pursuing the relationship and you felt maybe he was not as interested in you??

Before husband and I were married I found his porn collection....boxes! This was before internet. I saw his desire for OTHER women but I didn't feel his interest in me. He claimed it was from being single and I took that but what I learned is my husband was a porn addict. He had to get his thrills from what was convenient and safe, according to our counselor who felt this was something that was created in his young years when most males ask girls out.....he didn't but fantasized instead and that became is sex life. He lied for 11 years before he was caught, yep, he was good! I had been clear with him before we married so he knew he had to hide it.

We went thru counseling but I have not trusted him since. Like your husband he can go months without sex and i know that men do not go months without. A few months ago I asked him about the months in between and he avoided my question by laughing and saying, "Now you are interested, I have not seen any interest on your part." If anyone makes the advance it is me.

I think your husband is a porn addict and he has been hiding it from you and I have feeling if you confront him he will deny it. I would then show him what you found. Do not feel like you are snooping or that you should not confront him because you should. Time for hubby to face the truth of his actions. You need not apologize and if he tries to turn the tables on you and tell you that you had no right to snoop or that you are to blame, do not accept it....this is typical of addicts....they cannot accept the blame...they cannot face themselves or their actions. They have to turn it towards their victims.

Next step, if he admits, is counseling. Do not expect big changes. Addicts do not change unless they want to change and nothing you do will change them or their actions.


----------



## cdbaker

Yikes.

Honestly, even in the depth of my porn addiction, I never used photos of real women that I or my wife knew. That's not to say I haven't found myself attracted to a couple of them, but I've never used them as inspiration for masturbation. Maybe because I knew their husbands or probably just because I knew that would be really wrong, and potentially lead to awkwardness.

With that said, it's not terribly surprising. It's also not something that you could really understand. Number 1, you are a totally different person. Number 2, and this isn't me being sexist here, but a man's sexuality and his trigger's are VERY different from women's. Remember, men tend to be VERY visual creatures, it's very easy to arouse us via a simple photo or two, and suddenly our engines are running and we want a release, and it can often happen without us seeking it out to begin with. Luckily in your husband's case, it sounds like he never tried to take it a step farther.

What I think would be unfortunate here though is... I bet he still very much loves you, cares for you, etc. Certainly he has struggled with this addiction, one that honestly afflicts most men in this country, but I don't think that would change his feelings towards you. Now he's been caught, he's been humiliated, shamed, etc., and that's a good thing. Hopefully this can be his wake up call that he needs to make some enormous changes in his life, or lose his marriage. It's all your choice of course, but I personally think it would be unfortunate if you gave up on him now, without first giving him the chance to redeem himself. If he were to tell you that he doesn't love you anymore, or something similar, then I would completely agree with others here about moving on, but if he is willing to give it a true effort... it might be worth seeing how that plays out?


----------



## ScrambledEggs

I am going to contrast your experience with mine to show you at least have something to work with. 

The fact that your husband was willing to come clean means you at least have a chance at something functional. Consider my situation where she had affairs, denied me sex, watched porn, and more and I had to prove every last bit of it with her unwilling to admit to any of it as long as she could deny it.

Maybe it won't work but if he has in fact fully come clean, and my gut tells me has, what that means for you is it can't get any worse and can only get better from here on out. Which is not nothing believe me. 

Good luck.




EM415 said:


> Well, I told him what I knew and how I felt. He cried. He admitted he had a problem. He said he would get help. I told him I wasn't sure how things would play out between us, that I was really deeply hurt and honestly did't know how I could move past it. We were not on good terms, but we were having a productive, calm conversation....
> 
> 
> and then it got ugly.
> 
> 
> I asked him what else he needed to tell me. I told him that he needed to come clean about EVERYTHING. I noticed that he's been looking at Facebook profiles of some attractive women we know and doing it A LOT....I didn't ask him about it, but he came clean about it when I told him he needed to put all his cards on the table. He says sometimes he looks at pictures of attractive women on Facebook. That's all he looks at though.....he's not looking at his male friends, he's not looking at his unattractive female friends - he is strictly looking at pictures of attractive female coworkers, my friends, his friends, and then visiting porn sites shortly thereafter. He says he doesn't masturbate to the images or thoughts of these women, but I just don't know if I believe that. Yes, I know we're all human and can find other people attractive and look at them. I get it. But I don't go on Facebook and search for attractive male members of my circles....I don't look at pictures of attractive male friends and then visit porn sites because I'm all turned on.
> 
> I was trying to have an open mind and conversation, but knowing that he was looking at pictures of MY FRIENDS (and his) and then getting turned on enough to go to porn sites....I just lost it. I started crying and screaming like I never have before. I tossed his car keys out the front door and told him to leave. I've never exploded like that before. I let him back in the house long enough to grab clothes and then he left. He's at his mother's house right now.
> 
> The porn - I was horrified and disgusted....but at least those were actresses....as least those weren't "real people" if you know what I mean. But now he's oogling over women we actually know and then visiting porn sites?!?!?! How could I ever trust him again? How can I trust him to be around these women? Some of them were women that I don't know because they were his coworkers.....how can I trust him at all? I can't.
> 
> I'm so hurt by that admission. It cuts so much deeper than the porn did. I just wish this wasn't my life right now. I would have been willing to see a marriage counselor about the porn...but this....god this hurts....


----------



## ScrambledEggs

richardsharpe said:


> Good evening
> I think looking at pictures of friends is just part of the porn addiction. Porn gets dull and the addict looks for new, different stimulation. Some go to ever more exotic (or horrifying) porn. You'll see a wide variety of really bizarre things on porn sites, and I think it is mostly for novelty. Some (very sadly) go for child porn because it is something new. Your husband is now going for what is essentially acquaintance porn - sexualizing images of people he knows. Maybe he's already gone through transexuals, old ladies, and (fake) voyeur porn.
> 
> I don't personally see this as anything different, just his addiction grabbing at anything it can.
> 
> 
> You are still free to leave him - I don't think anyone should feel trapped into living with an addict. I don't think threats etc will work - I honestly think he cannot help himself.


This. Arousal happens in the head and a addict will look to all sorts of scenarios to play out fantasy and the desire/reward arousal cycle. Novelty is the great driver of porn addiction and it has its foundation in evolutionary biology as males are wired with a basic drive to want variety.

He has to want to change and do all the work. You can point him to information but he has to want to be different and become the guardian your shared intimacy or it won't change or work.

This video and site has tons of info for him where he can understand what his hobby is doing to him physically and mentally. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wSF82AwSDiU


Your Brain On Porn | Evolution has not prepared your brain for today's Internet porn


A "reboot" is not hard to do but weeks 3-4 are difficult because his entire libido will crash and he will feel empty and depressed. It gets better from there and after about 90 days his sex drive essentially returns to normal queues. This is totally reversible if he wants to he just has to get past the rough part.


----------



## AVR1962

ScrambledEggs said:


> This. Arousal happens in the head and a addict will look to all sorts of scenarios to play out fantasy and the desire/reward arousal cycle. Novelty is the great driver of porn addiction and it has its foundation in evolutionary biology as males are wired with a basic drive to want variety.
> 
> He has to want to change and do all the work. You can point him to information but he has to want to be different and become the guardian your shared intimacy or it won't change or work.
> 
> This video and site has tons of info for him where he can understand what his hobby is doing to him physically and mentally.
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wSF82AwSDiU
> 
> 
> Your Brain On Porn | Evolution has not prepared your brain for today's Internet porn
> 
> 
> A "reboot" is not hard to do but weeks 3-4 are difficult because his entire libido will crash and he will feel empty and depressed. It gets better from there and after about 90 days his sex drive essentially returns to normal queues. This is totally reversible if he wants to he just has to get past the rough part.


Target on advise. The addict will lie to protect his addiction. He will blame, he will make excuses and justifications, he will even believe that this is a just a man thing and therefore you should find it acceptable. The other element in this aside from addiction is dealing with the emotionally unavailable passive-aggressive male. To the OP, if you have not read I would google it, as the EU PA man has a great deal of trouble with intimacy.


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## cdbaker

Hi EM415, I just thought I'd check in to see if there has been any update?


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