# What have you done?



## Rookie4 (Nov 26, 2012)

I would like to ask FWS's what specifically they did to promote reconciliation with their BS's, besides the obvious one of ending the affair? What websites or books were of the greatest help to you? And why?


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## Regret214 (Apr 22, 2012)

In the first week, I bought the book "How to Help Your Spouse Heal From Your Affair", by Linda MacDonald. From there, I bought him "No More Mr. Nice Guy" via e-book. Also, that first week I installed a GPS tracker on my phone and texted Dig the user info so that he could see me wherever I was. Mind you, this was all before we even considered coming to TAM or anywhere else online.

We read Harley and both of us agreed it was bunk because it seemed to put a lot of onus on the Betrayed. Hell, we even dumped our first MC (week 2 after Dday I contacted her) because she got pi$$y with Dig when she found out he had emailed the xOM's Betrayed. I didn't like how she seemed to make him feel and after 4 or 5 visits with her decided she was NOT the one, even though she apparently had the credentials to deal with infidelity.

To this day, I still text him when I leave work. It's more of a habit than anything, but I know it helps him. Especially, I make sure to text him if I have a parent/teacher meeting or kids staying after for whatever reason because even though we're 2.5 years post Dday, he still can trigger.

Last but not least is pure and 100% transparency. He has had access to my email and every other login I have. Though he said a month ago that it's been seemingly eons since he's looked, knowing that he has access is vital.

Oh...did I mention that I left my career in NY to move 1300 miles away to help stop his triggers? Yes, I left the school where I taught for 16 years to move somewhere else that pays significantly less for one reason: I love Dig and I will/would do anything to make up for the stupid sh-t I did. Regardless of financial burdens and woes. I wish I could read more people who truly want to reconcile here say the same, but it seems far too many are so damn worried about money. I worry, too, but our family mental wellness doesn't have a price tag.

As for the why, well, because I love him and I will strive every day to make up for my idiocy.


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## Rookie4 (Nov 26, 2012)

I guess this is why I like you and Dig so much. You both seem pretty grounded, and realistic. You know that you are right up at the top of posters that I believe have a good chance at a genuine reconciliation. I don't say that about very many. The first book I haven't read yet, but I want to, to help me get a handle on how to help Sweetie , without giving her ideas.


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## Rookie4 (Nov 26, 2012)

Hey, you and I may be the only ones here. IDK of too many other FWS's who are still on Tam.


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## Mr Blunt (Jul 18, 2012)

Outstanding Regret!!


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## Affaircare (Jan 11, 2010)

I'm still here, and honestly I only respond to certain posts anymore since so many ask "Why? Why?" but then when I answer honestly, I get roasted. So few want to hear the real truth, and ideally what I wish is that if you ask, then when someone honestly answers, at least take time to listen to the response. 

But I digress!! You asked: "...what specifically they did to promote reconciliation with their BS's, besides the obvious one of ending the affair? What websites or books were of the greatest help to you? And why?"

I ended the affair 100% and never contacted again and never "just took a peek" or looked him up.

I ended all friendships with anyone who knew the OM and I as a couple and never contacted any of them again and never "just took a peek." 

I stopped playing the game and never played it again and never "just took a peek." I'll never play that one again or any other game where I'm not playing it with my Dear Hubby. I don't play anything alone anymore.

I sit next to my Dear Hubby when I'm on the internet, and my computer screen faces him so he can see it at all times.

When he walks in the room, I don't put down what I was looking at or close the window--I let him see what I'm doing and usually talk to him about it.

He has all of my passwords and access to everything, so I have no idea if he looks or not and I don't care if he does look or doesn't. It's 100% up to him if he wants to or not. 

If I do come in the room and see him looking through my email or on my PC I don't launch into accusations or tirades. He's my husband and allowed into my business, so I ask if I can help him find something 

I tell my Dear Hubby the truth even sometimes when it's hard or scary, so after several years of being open like that, I think he believes that if I did have something kind of hard to talk to him about...I would. And in real life, I would because I'm safe telling him the truth. He may not LIKE what I say, but if it's true he doesn't hurt me or punish me for saying it. 

We did EVERY website and book I can think of. We got started with Marriagebuilders (the Harleys) and it was a beginning but not the "end all, see all." The quizzes were a good step to get us talking though, and thinking about what we do need. It gave us common terminology too so we could express it in words we both understood. But we also did the 5LoveLanguages and Myer-Briggs personality types and Rational Emotive Behavior Therapy and all kinds of things. We still do! We love continuing to grow and understand each other better.

Okay actually there is one more thing. I committed to him and only him and nothing but him. I want to love him and I want to build love with him, so I put aside everyone else and everything else, and put my heart and mind and soul into him. I purposely focus on him and "us" and on making his life happy and on finding the joy and love in our life. Life for us is definitely NOT perfect right now, but now that I'm not lead around by my "feelings" I realize that we can BUILD happiness and love in our marriage even if life is tough.


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## 2xloser (May 8, 2011)

Apologies for the threadjack, but...

Affaircare, it is a shame if you withold anything from this community.

I've said it before elsewhere here on TAM, and I said thank you at the time, but 3 years ago, you took the time to write a post to me that meant more to me than you can ever know or understand. I was lost, inconsolable, fatigued out of my mind, maybe on the verge of a breakdown, and you took the time to explain and offer perspective, and I want to thank you for it, as I have never forgotten the impact it had on me.

I did not, could not ultimately reconcile, but your words were enormously helpful to my mental state at an enormously difficult time when I had only questions, no answers.

It is the primary reason I still come here, that I just might have an impact like that for someone who needs some perspective.

Thank you, thank you, thank you. 

End threadjack.


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## Rookie4 (Nov 26, 2012)

I have looked at the Harley's website, before, and like some of his ideas, But sometimes it seems as if it is a religious order instead of a marriage, and they seem very rigid about their procedures. Has anybody else felt that way?


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## Rookie4 (Nov 26, 2012)

Affaircare said:


> I'm still here, and honestly I only respond to certain posts anymore since so many ask "Why? Why?" but then when I answer honestly, I get roasted. So few want to hear the real truth, and ideally what I wish is that if you ask, then when someone honestly answers, at least take time to listen to the response.
> 
> But I digress!! You asked: "...what specifically they did to promote reconciliation with their BS's, besides the obvious one of ending the affair? What websites or books were of the greatest help to you? And why?"
> 
> ...


You see, AC, whenever I get down on reconciliation, I find posters like you and Regret that make me feel better about the idea. I have no intention of doing it myself, but can relate to thoughtful posters like you two, who are living it.


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## Rookie4 (Nov 26, 2012)

2xloser said:


> Apologies for the threadjack, but...
> 
> Affaircare, it is a shame if you withold anything from this community.
> 
> ...


I have no objection to such a threadjack as this. Well spoken.


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## Affaircare (Jan 11, 2010)

Rookie4 said:


> I have looked at the Harley's website, before, and like some of his ideas, But sometimes it seems as if it is a religious order instead of a marriage, and they seem very rigid about their procedures. Has anybody else felt that way?


Yep we felt that way too--like if you dared to disagree with the Harley's it was tantamount to heresy. This is precisely why we are no longer there. Nice starting point? Yes. Start you talking to each other? Yes. Is there more to it than just that? Yes.


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## Affaircare (Jan 11, 2010)

{mini-threadjack}

2xloser, 

You (and people like you) are the primary reason I haven't utterly left TAM. In real life, I really do care about the people here, even those with whom I disagree and those who have roasted me. I know that many who rail against disloyals do so out of their own pain, so I get that. And in real life, I think that a truly former disloyal is pretty rare-- 3 or 4 in every 100 I'd guess. So it is fairly unusual to meet someone who actually did turn it around, and much more usual to meet a disloyal who is still lying or who doesn't give a hoot and continues no matter who it destroys...and thus it's easy to get pretty skeptical about disloyals. 

Still I wanted to thank you for your post because it's encouraging in ways that are deep and hard to express. I'm also very grateful to see that someone I helped along is now paying it forward by helping others along. That's just coolness!!

{/mini-threadjack}


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## Rookie4 (Nov 26, 2012)

Affaircare said:


> {mini-threadjack}
> 
> 2xloser,
> 
> ...


This is a point I have tried on a number of occasions to make. That Disloyals are human, and even though they made horrible choices, they are entitled to respect. But I get shouted down , almost every time. I know of very few Disloyals who are so lacking in human grace, that they are not ashamed of their disloyalty. I guess it's the way I say it.


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## bfree (Sep 30, 2012)

*Re: Re: What have you done?*



Rookie4 said:


> I have looked at the Harley's website, before, and like some of his ideas, But sometimes it seems as if it is a religious order instead of a marriage, and they seem very rigid about their procedures. Has anybody else felt that way?


I'm Christian and I feel that way too. There is a lot of benefit in their approach but it shouldn't be the only approach you investigate.


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## bfree (Sep 30, 2012)

*Re: Re: What have you done?*



Rookie4 said:


> This is a point I have tried on a number of occasions to make. That Disloyals are human, and even though they made horrible choices, they are entitled to respect. But I get shouted down , almost every time. I know of very few Disloyals who are so lacking in human grace, that they are not ashamed of their disloyalty. I guess it's the way I say it.


You used to pizz me off. But now that I've had time to learn your "style" I look at your posts in somewhat the same way as I view Harken's posts. It takes a little more effort to discern the point that you're making but I now see it's worth it. We'll have no more flame exchanges...probably.


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## Chris Taylor (Jul 22, 2010)

While my wife read a lot of books, the real thing that saved the marriage was marriage counseling. I did all the right things a FWS should do... transparency, dialog, etc... but none of that addressed the real underlying issues in our marriage. And I don't mean that as an excuse for cheating. Our marriage would not have lasted cheating or not. It was forcing my wife into marriage counseling that was the greatest help.


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## Rookie4 (Nov 26, 2012)

bfree said:


> You used to pizz me off. But now that I've had time to learn your "style" I look at your posts in somewhat the same way as I view Harken's posts. It takes a little more effort to discern the point that you're making but I now see it's worth it. We'll have no more flame exchanges...probably.


I p*ss a lot of people off, Bfree, but I actually can be a nice person, too. Disagreements happen, and I really don't take them personally. You and I do Ok, because we both try to think.  Many people don't.


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## Maricha75 (May 8, 2012)

What did I do besides ending all contact with OM and giving my husband complete access to everything? Nothing. That is, nothing, except coming here. No books. No websites except this one.


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## Rookie4 (Nov 26, 2012)

Maricha75 said:


> What did I do besides ending all contact with OM and giving my husband complete access to everything? Nothing. That is, nothing, except coming here. No books. No websites except this one.


How is that working out for you?


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## LongWalk (Apr 4, 2013)

Rookie4 said:


> I guess this is why I like you and Dig so much. You both seem pretty grounded, and realistic. You know that you are right up at the top of posters that I believe have a good chance at a genuine reconciliation. I don't say that about very many. The first book I haven't read yet, but I want to, to help me get a handle on how to help Sweetie , without giving her ideas.


I thought you were done with her. You have a girlfriend whom you love. You don't love Sweetie anymore. Don't you just feel that she is suffering and you want to someone to love her so that the energy and hope she has directed towards your reconciliation will not simply be a waste?


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## bfree (Sep 30, 2012)

*Re: Re: What have you done?*



LongWalk said:


> I thought you were done with her. You have a girlfriend whom you love. You don't love Sweetie anymore. Don't you just feel that she is suffering and you want to someone to love her so that the energy and hope she has directed towards your reconciliation will not simply be a waste?


That's a good point. Maybe the kindest thing rookie can do for sweetie is to walk away as much as possible so she can find her own way.


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## Maricha75 (May 8, 2012)

*Re: Re: What have you done?*



Rookie4 said:


> How is that working out for you?


Doing just fine. We communicate more. And have everything open to each other. As an example, our phones are Samsung Galaxy S5. We have them fingerprint protected. His fingerprint will open mine and mine will open his. We also know each other's passwords for everything. If he forgets mine, I tell him if he asks. Is everything "perfect"? Of course not. No relationship is "perfect". But neither of us has slipped again... and D-day was 2 1/2 years ago. So, except for a few things I discuss with a few friends on here so I can get advice on how to handle it, we are doing well, over all. 
I do admit that my mental health has taken a hit these last 6 months. But whose wouldn't after losing a parent suddenly?


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## Rookie4 (Nov 26, 2012)

LongWalk said:


> I thought you were done with her. You have a girlfriend whom you love. You don't love Sweetie anymore. Don't you just feel that she is suffering and you want to someone to love her so that the energy and hope she has directed towards your reconciliation will not simply be a waste?


We were married for 20+ years. She is the mother of my kids (and a damn good one) so I will not ever be "done" with her. She is a permanent part of my family , so I will help her all I can, to have a better life .


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## Rookie4 (Nov 26, 2012)

bfree said:


> That's a good point. Maybe the kindest thing rookie can do for sweetie is to walk away as much as possible so she can find her own way.


 Don't get the wrong idea. I don't volunteer to help, but only if asked to do so.


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## bfree (Sep 30, 2012)

*Re: Re: What have you done?*



Rookie4 said:


> Don't get the wrong idea. I don't volunteer to help, but only if asked to do so.


I understand. Maybe you should consider that she'll never truly move on if you are always there for her when she needs you? I get why you help her when she asks. I'm a giver too. But people only tend to do things when they have to. She may not seek out another for emotional support if she continues to cling to you.


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## Rookie4 (Nov 26, 2012)

bfree said:


> I understand. Maybe you should consider that she'll never truly move on if you are always there for her when she needs you? I get why you help her when she asks. I'm a giver too. But people only tend to do things when they have to. She may not seek out another for emotional support if she continues to cling to you.


I agree, but I think that her clingyness" is short-term. Because of her accident, she has needed a lot of help with her recovery, and the stress, has left her very vulnerable, and needy. My GF and I stepped in, to help, and it caused Sweetie to begin to havie feelings for me again. Which, because she LIKES my Gf and would never do anything to break us up, causes her to stress even more and feel guilty. It's very complicated, but is getting better.


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## bfree (Sep 30, 2012)

*Re: Re: What have you done?*



Rookie4 said:


> I agree, but I think that her clingyness" is short-term. Because of her accident, she has needed a lot of help with her recovery, and the stress, has left her very vulnerable, and needy. My GF and I stepped in, to help, and it caused Sweetie to begin to havie feelings for me again. Which, because she LIKES my Gf and would never do anything to break us up, causes her to stress even more and feel guilty. It's very complicated, but is getting better.


No. I totally get it. Just try not to let your tender side for her interfere with her need to become more independent. You're a good man rookie.


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## Rookie4 (Nov 26, 2012)

Thanks. I do the best I can. She moved in with one of my daughters, and has done her rehab, and is almost back to normal, so she should be back in the dating pool soon. Thankfully money isn't a problem. Confidentially, I would give $100,000 for her to find a nice guy. (preferably in another town.)


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## Hurtin_Still (Oct 3, 2011)

.......makes me extremely jealous to see the BS's who have had their waywards actually see the dark impact of their actions ...and give an honest effort to help the BS's heal / cope.

.....I can only hope that one day my wife will have that lightbulb go on above her head ....but .....I'm not holding my breath.


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## bfree (Sep 30, 2012)

*Re: Re: What have you done?*



Hurtin_Still said:


> .......makes me extremely jealous to see the BS's who have had their waywards actually see the dark impact of their actions ...and give an honest effort to help the BS's heal / cope.
> 
> .....I can only hope that one day my wife will have that lightbulb go on above her head ....but .....I'm not holding my breath.


I know this is going to sound corny, and maybe it's just because of the holiday season we're approaching but I'm of the opinion that people like your wife are the ones that need prayers from us the most. I'll say a prayer for her to receive enlightenment, not just for your benefit but mostly for hers.


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## Hurtin_Still (Oct 3, 2011)

*Re: Re: What have you done?*



bfree said:


> I know this is going to sound corny, and maybe it's just because of the holiday season we're approaching but I'm of the opinion that people like your wife are the ones that need prayers from us the most. I'll say a prayer for her to receive enlightenment, not just for your benefit but mostly for hers.


.......not a corny thought for you to have whatsoever.

.......it might take more than prayers for her to realize WHY I've been / have become over-vigilant about everywhere she goes ...where she's been ...who she talks to. Or why there us an ever present touch of anger and cynicism in everything I do or say. 

.......but ...at this point ....I'm pretty much resigned to the fact that she'll remain clueless ....or ....purposefully arrogant ....whichever it may be.

....when her go-to reactions / responses related to her actions continue to be:

• "I won't allow one action to define me or my life"

• "You're really sick to dwell on this for so long".

• "I only think of this when YOU bring it up".

• "What do you want me to do about this ..after so many years".

....and my favorite ...though not used by her in a while

• "It was only sex".


......as intelligent, well read, worldly knowledgeable as she claims to be .....her clueless nature regarding the impacts related to actions ...is mind boggling ....and infuriating.


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## Rookie4 (Nov 26, 2012)

Hurtin_Still said:


> .......not a corny thought for you to have whatsoever.
> 
> .......it might take more than prayers for her to realize WHY I've been / have become over-vigilant about everywhere she goes ...where she's been ...who she talks to. Or why there us an ever present touch of anger and cynicism in everything I do or say.
> 
> ...


Or the most used, "It was all your fault!!".


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## LongWalk (Apr 4, 2013)

Rookie4 said:


> Thanks. I do the best I can. She moved in with one of my daughters, and has done her rehab, and is almost back to normal, so she should be back in the dating pool soon. Thankfully money isn't a problem. Confidentially, I would give $100,000 for her to find a nice guy. (preferably in another town.)


This is a clear statement of how you remain emotionally involved with Sweetie. Interesting that you chose that particular name for her. She remains your "sweetie" in some way or another.


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## bfree (Sep 30, 2012)

*Re: Re: What have you done?*



Hurtin_Still said:


> .......not a corny thought for you to have whatsoever.
> 
> .......it might take more than prayers for her to realize WHY I've been / have become over-vigilant about everywhere she goes ...where she's been ...who she talks to. Or why there us an ever present touch of anger and cynicism in everything I do or say.
> 
> ...


Trust me, she does think about it and it does bother her but her pride will not allow her to admit it to you and probably not even to herself. The things she says are more about trying to maintain her "power level" in the relationship. She is afraid if she actually demonstrated palatable remorse that she would have to necessarily elevate you above her in the relationship. And she's right, that's exactly what would happen for a short time. But she doesn't trust you to return control of her half of the power once you've healed. What she also doesn't see is that if that actually happened the two of you would eventually end up with a more loving and mutually satisfactory union. The truth is that she's probably hurting almost as much as you but her pride and her insecurities will not allow either one of you to heal.


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## Hurtin_Still (Oct 3, 2011)

*Re: Re: What have you done?*



Rookie4 said:


> Or the most used, "It was all your fault!!".


.......while she's never said that her actions were "all" my fault ....her common reply with the same flavor is, "you don't want to see your part".

......I've matured enough to not accept the blame in any quantity ...and when she starts talking like that ( mostly in counselling sessions) ....I toss her the car keys and walk out of the therapists office. I'm sure the 1st time that happened, she was sure that I'd be sitting outside waiting for her. Maybe she got the message related to my anger level when she didn't see me outside. I walked home ...several miles ....in pouring rain ...and didn't mind a bit ...because I removed myself from a situation where I could experience any more bulls_it from her under the protection of a therapist.

.....made me think seriously that I should have started walking about 20 years ago.


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## Hurtin_Still (Oct 3, 2011)

*Re: Re: What have you done?*



bfree said:


> Trust me, she does think about it and it does bother her but her pride will not allow her to admit it to you and probably not even to herself. The things she says are more about trying to maintain her "power level" in the relationship. She is afraid if she actually demonstrated palatable remorse that she would have to necessarily elevate you above her in the relationship. And she's right, that's exactly what would happen for a short time. But she doesn't trust you to return control of her half of the power once you've healed. What she also doesn't see is that if that actually happened the two of you would eventually end up with a more loving and mutually satisfactory union. The truth is that she's probably hurting almost as much as you but her pride and her insecurities will not allow either one of you to heal.


......(with all respect) ....trust me ......she doesn't think about it ......it doesn't bother her .....and is quite cavalier about the whole thing ....in particular when I threatened exposure to her 'circle' of friends. Her attitude is, "What ....do you think ...people will stop being my friends ...or my family stop loving me".?


....I do wholeheartedly agree with you that if she ever did display honest palatable remorse ....that it could not only help me heal ...but ....I'm sure ...gain trust again. Without that element of trust ....there is something seriously lacking in the marriage.


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## Rookie4 (Nov 26, 2012)

LongWalk said:


> This is a clear statement of how you remain emotionally involved with Sweetie. Interesting that you chose that particular name for her. She remains your "sweetie" in some way or another.


Perhaps, before you spout, you should learn to listen , first? My exwife had serious anger issues. Sweetie was an ironic nickname, because she was the opposite of sweet. I've told about that, before. And I never said that I wasn't emotionally involved with her. As a friend, and as a person whom I spent 20+ years with, of course there is going to be some involvement. Am I romantically involved with her? Absolutely not!!


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