# Marriage of 25 years is falling apart



## lostcauseTOO

Hello everybody,

To start off, over the past 25 years of marriage I haven't always been "fully engaged" in a relationship with my wife in a normal sense. See, I was in full-time ministry for all those years and she was by my side serving and raising our four children. She often felt that I was putting ministry over her. And to tell you the truth, I did and I have told her that and I was sorry. We've had good times and really bad times (especially when it came to her relationship with my mother - that's a whole different thing for a different time.)

Now that I'm out of ministry, I've faced all sorts of feelings - loss of purpose, sense of failure to both people I served and my family I sacrificed for serving those people, mid-life crisis stuff (getting older, not a lot of savings for retirement, identity issues, stuff like that) and aging children (and a young teen daughter who disrespects me) and aging parents. My mother has cancer for the second time in ten years. Yep, it's a bunch of stuff and it all weighs heavy on my mind.

So here's the deal...I currently work a full-time job and two part time jobs to help provide for our family of six. My wife works as well, but she has a little more flexibility. I'm not at home much because of my working all the time either. And the times I do have off, I'm so tired and I take little naps just to make it to my next job. I'll be 54 this October. Now as for those naps and sleeping at night - I sleep in my daughter's room at night due to issues with my daughter that I mentioned earlier. Trust me, my wife doesn't try very hard to make her sleep in her room. She'll be 14 and she treats my like crap. I've just given up on that whole matter.

So with all that stuff, I've just lost the desire to improve my marriage. I just don't care anymore. I'm pretty miserable. She seems happy. She's enjoying time with our growing children and getting into physical shape. She's looking pretty good. She keeps saying that I need to improve my relationship with her. How can I do that? We never have any time together. And we haven't had sex in about six months. She says that we can't have sex without a relationship. I understand that. It's like we're just room mates or something. Some days we don't even talk to each other and I'm actually ok with that. I don't even try to touch her or kiss her anymore. I often don't even tell her goodbye when leaving for work in the morning. Doesn't matter anyways, everyone's busy getting ready for school and her job. I've told her that I don't think I want to develop our relationship anymore. Let's just get the kids grown and out of the house. I've even been frustrated at times in our marriage that I've threatened to leave, but we always seem to make things work. I'm not a very good communicator I admit. Sad, isn't it.

I don't think I would cheat on her, but I can't say that I wouldn't if I had a chance down the road. I just don't want to hurt the kids, plus I would feel really guilty if I did. They are all now in their teens and one is getting ready to go active duty in the military. It's like I'm playing the "waiting game". I actually told her that I should just "let her go", because life with me is probably really discouraging now and she could find someone that could make her more happier.

That's a lot I've thrown out there. I'm just tired, both physically and trying to make our marriage work. I've done some counseling for my "internal issues" since leaving ministry and I don't really want to go to marriage counseling with her again. We did back when we first got married. It was about the issues with my parents. Things haven't improved in that area either. I've just quit trying.

I just don't know what to do. I feel helpless. Any advice would be greatly appreciated. And I know what you're going to say, "There sure are a lot of "I's" in his entry - pretty selfish, I know.

lostcauseTOO


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## johndoe12299

You mention you would maybe cheat if given the opportunity. So, is it simply you don't love your wife anymore? If so, it seems pretty straightforward. Be honest with her and divorce.

If you don't love your wife then I'm not sure what else is there to do unless you want to try and rekindle the flame; which it sounds like you're tired of trying.

Best of luck to you; you sound physically and emotionally drained. Is there something your wife could do to make you more attracted to her? Have you communicated those things to her?


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## lostcauseTOO

As I mentioned, she has been getting in better shape and she's looking all "toned and tan" and I'm glad for her. I have wondered if she's doing it for another guy at her work. I've joked about that with her and she just laughs it off. She's probably just doing it for herself. I'd like to be with her sexually, but hard to do when there's no time with each other and I don't sleep with her anymore. I haven't in over 3 years. Just working hard and going in and out of the house to sleep, shower and grab a bite to eat.

And the main things I forgot to say is that she's not very nice to me. Like she's getting back at me for all those years we were in full time ministry. I really don't blame her. I'm not sure if I could do anything to start over with her. We're just there now to raise the kids. No "kind" interaction at all. Just nagging and complaining. Get's tiring. Trust me.


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## BigDaddyNY

You haven't left many options. You seem to have given up and you don't want to work on the marriage, so you either learn to live with status quo or divorce and go you separate ways. Whatever you do, don't cheat. If you don't love your wife anymore and want a sexual relationship with someone else, then do the right thing a divorce first. 

My best advice is to start by working on yourself. Hitting the gym is always a great place to start. You seem to be lacking confidence and you've given up on almost everything important to you. Maybe you should be evaluated for having depression. 

It isn't exactly on the mark for your situation, but I would recommend reading The Married Man Sex Life Primer 2011 by Athol Kay. Its focus is how to get the most out of your married sex life, but it does that by focusing on making you the best and most attractive man you can be. Give it a read.


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## johndoe12299

It sounds like your mind is made up. No life is worth living miserable. It sounds like you both would be happier apart. The kids are older now. Explain them the situation and they'll be fine long term.


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## BigDaddyNY

lostcauseTOO said:


> As I mentioned, she has been getting in better shape and she's looking all "toned and tan" and I'm glad for her. I have wondered if she's doing it for another guy at her work. I've joked about that with her and she just laughs it off. She's probably just doing it for herself. I'd like to be with her sexually, but hard to do when there's no time with each other and I don't sleep with her anymore. I haven't in over 3 years. Just working hard and going in and out of the house to sleep, shower and grab a bite to eat.
> 
> And the main things I forgot to say is that she's not very nice to me. Like she's getting back at me for all those years we were in full time ministry. I really don't blame her. I'm not sure if I could do anything to start over with her. We're just there now to raise the kids. No "kind" interaction at all. Just nagging and complaining. Get's tiring. Trust me.


As I read your follow-up here, I do think you need to read the book I suggested. You don't want to ignore the fact that she is making self improvements. She may not be doing it for a new guy, but eventually she will begin to wonder if she is now out of your league and when she gets the attention of the right man you may lose her. 

Same goes for the way she is treating you. The book addresses that. She is doing what she is doing to you because you are allowing it to happen.


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## johndoe12299

Also, why do you work so many jobs, and your wife works as well? Is money that tight? How about getting some schooling, gaining a skill and get 1, high(er) paying job so you don't have to spend much time away from the family and your wife.

Also, you are probably right. If all of a sudden she just started working out and getting tan, and she's not having sex with you; she is most likely prepping to cheat/leave you or is already with someone. I know tht sucks to hear but it's likely.


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## lifeistooshort

It doesn't sound to me like you've put in much effort for your marriage over the years, so this is where you are.

And it sounds like you still don't want to make much effort....it should be all on your wife.

If that's how you feel just divorce amicably. If your wife looks good she'll find another guy.

Just try to put in some effort with the next woman in your life.

If I'm wrong and you do want to make an effort then find a counselor now.


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## Diana7

It seems odd that you both work but you still need 2 other jobs. No wonder you are so tired and you have no time together. 
As for the teenager who sleeps with her mum, that's completely wrong. Just clearly say to her that from now on you are going to sleep in your bed with your wife and she will be sleeping in her own room. Dont argue just tell them.


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## re16

Sounds like you were checked out of family by using ministry as an excuse for being checked out.

When ministry was done, you realized how much of an outsider in your own family you are, so you replaced ministry with multiple jobs, so you could remain checked out.

Now you want out instead of owning up to the problems you created.

If someone came to you as a minister and asked you what to do in this situation, it would probably be something along the lines of own your issues and step up to be the husband and father you haven't been.


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## BigDaddyNY

re16 said:


> Sounds like you were checked out of family by using ministry as an excuse for being checked out.
> 
> When ministry was done, you realized how much of an outsider in your own family you are, so you replaced ministry with multiple jobs, so you could remain checked out.
> 
> Now you want out instead of owning up to the problems you created.
> 
> If someone came to you as a minister and asked you what to do in this situation, it would probably be something along the lines of own your issues and step up to be the husband and father you haven't been.


I was thinking about that. How could someone that has been a minister for a couple decades not understand how to address this? Too close to it maybe?


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## re16

BigDaddyNY said:


> I was thinking about that. How could someone that has been a minister for a couple decades not understand how to address this? Too close to it maybe?


Its kinda like how therapists always have screwed up family situations happening. They are attracked to learning about fixing problems and healing because, you guessed it, they have problems.


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## CatholicDad

Work your 40 hour week, not one minute more. It’s not THAT exhausting is it?

I really think the only thing holding you back from reconciling with your wife- is you. Move back into your bed for goodness sake. Where’s your sex drive?? Three years and no sex and you’re cool with it??

If you’re that dang tired you better go to the doctor ASAP!


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## lostcauseTOO

I’d like to just work my regular 40 hour a week job, but once we left ministry, my income dropped my nearly 20K and I’m trying to make up for it by doing the other two jobs. Actually the one PT job helps pay for gas to get to the other two. Crazy, I know.

As for the sex drive thing, sadly I’ve turned to looking at porn sometimes and pleasuring myself. I know it’s wrong and my wife has found out and confronted me on it. I’m trying my best to stay away from those things now.


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## lostcauseTOO

re16 said:


> Sounds like you were checked out of family by using ministry as an excuse for being checked out.
> 
> When ministry was done, you realized how much of an outsider in your own family you are, so you replaced ministry with multiple jobs, so you could remain checked out.
> 
> Now you want out instead of owning up to the problems you created.
> 
> If someone came to you as a minister and asked you what to do in this situation, it would probably be something along the lines of own your issues and step up to be the husband and father you haven't been.


Good points.


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## Luckylucky

A couple of questions, mid-life crisis stuff and financial issues: was it you or someone else that had a midlife crisis and overspent? Is this why at 54 you’re working 2 jobs?

I gather from your long story that you’ve been disconnected from your marriage all along, and your wife has been perhaps wanting and trying to save the marriage, and in effect, doing her best to do much of the work? Openly asking and telling you what she needed more of? In short: you never cared much for the marriage anyway. But feel sorry for yourself for I’m not sure what.

And she seems to have reached her end, and you’re still not trying and don’t really care to put in the effort? So no sex, but you admit to yourself you can’t be bothered to show physical affection or do anything really, except the thing you take from all of this is you’re tempted to cheat?? (Bit of protection too - you think she is, or is about to). I can see exactly where this is going. (So what’s her name 😉?)

It looks like we have a lady who is not really giving up, she’s still trying. Looking good, keeping house, putting boundaries up and respecting herself, probably ‘still’ trying to stir something in you. You seem very apathetic towards your wife and family and everything really, but excited by the prospect of cheating.

Your daughter is 14. Textbook age for acting out and becoming ‘aware’ of everything she has experienced to date. (Why are you sleeping in her room?)

So why, truly deeply, is your marriage falling apart and why don’t you really care?

You care very little about how good your wife is looking, and hope she does meet someone??? Your wife does not come across as a person in your story, merely a thing you are observing and describing…

So who’s the lady you’ve met, or thinking about?


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## Luckylucky

Diana7 said:


> It seems odd that you both work but you still need 2 other jobs. No wonder you are so tired and you have no time together.
> As for the teenager who sleeps with her mum, that's completely wrong. Just clearly say to her that from now on you are going to sleep in your bed with your wife and she will be sleeping in her own room. Dont argue just tell them.


Something isn’t right about this. A 14-year old girl sleeping in her mother’s room (dad is actually sleeping in the daughter’s room - why???) is usually for protection from something. Biologically, by this age there’s a ‘push’ to be away from the mother by the daughter. It’s innate. She’s scared of something at night. I’ve seen a few cases of this before.


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## Prodigal

lostcauseTOO said:


> Actually the one PT job helps pay for gas to get to the other two. Crazy, I know.


No, I wouldn't call it "crazy" but I'd definitely call it stupid. C'mon!!!!



lostcauseTOO said:


> I’ve turned to looking at porn sometimes and pleasuring myself. I know it’s wrong and my wife has found out and confronted me on it. I’m trying my best to stay away from those things now.


Whether or not you are staying away from porn isn't the issue. The issue, as I see it, is you've tried completely nonconstructive and harmful ways to deal with the issues in your marriage. You might realize looking at porn and beating off to it are wrong .... but here you are. Frankly, it doesn't sound like you are putting a sincere - or healthy - effort into your marriage.

Do you want to stay married or not????


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## johndoe12299

He said the 14yo daughetr doesn't respect him at all...Why is that? And does he feel guilty about it so he lets her have her way(sleep in mom's bed)?


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## lostcauseTOO

Luckylucky said:


> A couple of questions, mid-life crisis stuff and financial issues: was it you or someone else that had a midlife crisis and overspent? Is this why at 54 you’re working 2 jobs?
> 
> I gather from your long story that you’ve been disconnected from your marriage all along, and your wife has been perhaps wanting and trying to save the marriage, and in effect, doing her best to do much of the work? Openly asking and telling you what she needed more of? In short: you never cared much for the marriage anyway. But feel sorry for yourself for I’m not sure what.
> 
> And she seems to have reached her end, and you’re still not trying and don’t really care to put in the effort? So no sex, but you admit to yourself you can’t be bothered to show physical affection or do anything really, except the thing you take from all of this is you’re tempted to cheat?? (Bit of protection too - you think she is, or is about to). I can see exactly where this is going. (So what’s her name 😉?)
> 
> It looks like we have a lady who is not really giving up, she’s still trying. Looking good, keeping house, putting boundaries up and respecting herself, probably ‘still’ trying to stir something in you. You seem very apathetic towards your wife and family and everything really, but excited by the prospect of cheating.
> 
> Your daughter is 14. Textbook age for acting out and becoming ‘aware’ of everything she has experienced to date. (Why are you sleeping in her room?)
> 
> So why, truly deeply, is your marriage falling apart and why don’t you really care?
> 
> You care very little about how good your wife is looking, and hope she does meet someone??? Your wife does not come across as a person in your story, merely a thing you are observing and describing…
> 
> So who’s the lady you’ve met, or thinking about?


My wife has a very strong-willed personality. She's not afraid to mix words. I, on the other hand, have been known to withdraw and keep things inside. I really don't like confrontation, but I can be very sarcastic when pressed into a corner and I've said some things that have been hurtful to her and I've asked forgiveness. Now whenever we have arguments, she keeps bringing those things up again. It's like I can't escape my past. That only encourages me to keep to myself and not even say anything, afraid it will come up again and used against me.

Now as for me seeing someone on the side currently, I'm not. To tell you the truth, I don't know when I would find the time to do that. The thought has just entered my mind from time to time.

So about my daughter...I have a great relationship with my other three children. She's always been a "momma's girl". She and my wife are extremely tight and I feel at times that they are a "tag team" against me. I've told her a number of times that she is disrespectful towards me. And at times, my wife has talked to her and she has calmed down for brief times. I try to say nice things to her and compliment her, but it really doesn't help the situation. Just hoping that she'll grow out of this stage of life, but it doesn't look promising. She has even made the comment that I'm not walking her down the aisle when it comes time for her to get married - nice words, right?!?


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## Luckylucky

Yes thanks for that, but a few of us have mentioned or asked about the sleeping situation? Why are you sleeping in her room? And why is she sleeping with her mum?


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## Blondilocks

Please explain what the problem is with your wife and your mother.


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## D0nnivain

I don't understand a few things: 

1. Why are you sleeping in your 14 year old daughter's room? 

2. Do you have to work a F/T job plus 2 P/T jobs? For your 25 year marriage it seems you put work before your marriage & family. Now you no longer have your ministry & are at a loss to define yourself but you still put work over family. Your marriage won't work until you treat it like a priority. 

Your wife seems happy enough. You are the one who is miserable. So think about what you want / need to not be miserable. I suppose sex is one of the things you need so when can you carve out time to spend on a date with your wife? Can you manage a romantic weekend somewhere to reconnect? You have to put in some effort.


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## GC1234

lostcauseTOO said:


> Hello everybody,
> 
> To start off, over the past 25 years of marriage I haven't always been "fully engaged" in a relationship with my wife in a normal sense. See, I was in full-time ministry for all those years and she was by my side serving and raising our four children. She often felt that I was putting ministry over her. And to tell you the truth, I did and I have told her that and I was sorry. We've had good times and really bad times (especially when it came to her relationship with my mother - that's a whole different thing for a different time.)
> 
> Now that I'm out of ministry, I've faced all sorts of feelings - loss of purpose, sense of failure to both people I served and my family I sacrificed for serving those people, mid-life crisis stuff (getting older, not a lot of savings for retirement, identity issues, stuff like that) and aging children (and a young teen daughter who disrespects me) and aging parents. My mother has cancer for the second time in ten years. Yep, it's a bunch of stuff and it all weighs heavy on my mind.
> 
> So here's the deal...I currently work a full-time job and two part time jobs to help provide for our family of six. My wife works as well, but she has a little more flexibility. I'm not at home much because of my working all the time either. And the times I do have off, I'm so tired and I take little naps just to make it to my next job. I'll be 54 this October. Now as for those naps and sleeping at night - I sleep in my daughter's room at night due to issues with my daughter that I mentioned earlier. Trust me, my wife doesn't try very hard to make her sleep in her room. She'll be 14 and she treats my like crap. I've just given up on that whole matter.
> 
> So with all that stuff, I've just lost the desire to improve my marriage. I just don't care anymore. I'm pretty miserable. She seems happy. She's enjoying time with our growing children and getting into physical shape. She's looking pretty good. She keeps saying that I need to improve my relationship with her. How can I do that? We never have any time together. And we haven't had sex in about six months. She says that we can't have sex without a relationship. I understand that. It's like we're just room mates or something. Some days we don't even talk to each other and I'm actually ok with that. I don't even try to touch her or kiss her anymore. I often don't even tell her goodbye when leaving for work in the morning. Doesn't matter anyways, everyone's busy getting ready for school and her job. I've told her that I don't think I want to develop our relationship anymore. Let's just get the kids grown and out of the house. I've even been frustrated at times in our marriage that I've threatened to leave, but we always seem to make things work. I'm not a very good communicator I admit. Sad, isn't it.
> 
> I don't think I would cheat on her, but I can't say that I wouldn't if I had a chance down the road. I just don't want to hurt the kids, plus I would feel really guilty if I did. They are all now in their teens and one is getting ready to go active duty in the military. It's like I'm playing the "waiting game". I actually told her that I should just "let her go", because life with me is probably really discouraging now and she could find someone that could make her more happier.
> 
> That's a lot I've thrown out there. I'm just tired, both physically and trying to make our marriage work. I've done some counseling for my "internal issues" since leaving ministry and I don't really want to go to marriage counseling with her again. We did back when we first got married. It was about the issues with my parents. Things haven't improved in that area either. I've just quit trying.
> 
> I just don't know what to do. I feel helpless. Any advice would be greatly appreciated. And I know what you're going to say, "There sure are a lot of "I's" in his entry - pretty selfish, I know.
> 
> lostcauseTOO


So, you don't want to invest time in rebuilding your relationship with your wife, but will invest time in cheating? Yeah, your priorities are straight. 

I'd suggest giving up the second job, and spending more time with your family. 

Also, you can't give up on your kid. She's your kid. You need to lay down the law. 

Sounds like you've checked out of life. Maybe you should get treated for depression. Sounds like you have it to some degree.


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## lostcauseTOO

BigDaddyNY said:


> You haven't left many options. You seem to have given up and you don't want to work on the marriage, so you either learn to live with status quo or divorce and go you separate ways. Whatever you do, don't cheat. If you don't love your wife anymore and want a sexual relationship with someone else, then do the right thing a divorce first.
> 
> My best advice is to start by working on yourself. Hitting the gym is always a great place to start. You seem to be lacking confidence and you've given up on almost everything important to you. Maybe you should be evaluated for having depression.
> 
> It isn't exactly on the mark for your situation, but I would recommend reading The Married Man Sex Life Primer 2011 by Athol Kay. Its focus is how to get the most out of your married sex life, but it does that by focusing on making you the best and most attractive man you can be. Give it a read.





Luckylucky said:


> Yes thanks for that, but a few of us have mentioned or asked about the sleeping situation? Why are you sleeping in her room? And why is she sleeping with her mum?


There really wasn't a one time event for when my daughter started sleeping in our bed. It was over a summer a couple of years ago when she and my wife were watching movies in our bedroom and it just went on from there. Whenever it was time for bed, I would tell her that it was bed time and for her to go to her room. My wife really didn't help me out with all that. Then when I started working the part time job at night, I would come home around midnight and she would be back in the bed. I'd ask her to go to her room and things went straight to hell. She'd gripe and complain and that would make my wife angry because they would have already been asleep for an hour or so. I'd just go to her bedroom and sleep. With my crazy work hours, it's just better if I sleep in there anyways, I guess.

Recently, my wife told me that she hasn't made her go to her bed because she (my wife) really doesn't want me in there with her. That hit hard.


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## D0nnivain

lostcauseTOO said:


> Recently, my wife told me that she hasn't made her go to her bed because she (my wife) really doesn't want me in there with her. That hit hard.


That's huge. You need to ask your wife if she wants a divorce. This is not healthy. It's bad for your daughter too.


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## lostcauseTOO

Blondilocks said:


> Please explain what the problem is with your wife and your mother.


Basically, ever since we started dating, my wife feels that she wasn't the one I was supposed to marry in my mom's eyes. My mom has never said anything to that account and has tried over and over again to build a relationship with her. It's like oil and water. They never fought. It was just these feeling in the air whenever they were around each other. My wife has even quit going with me and my children to go see my parents. That really hurt, but it was the best thing, I guess. My parents have even stopped trying to reach our to her. I don't talk about my parents in front of my wife anymore. My mother is going through cancer treatments for the second time in ten years. My children really don't have a relationship with either of my parents. They are closer to my in-laws.


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## farsidejunky

lostcauseTOO said:


> As I mentioned, she has been getting in better shape and she's looking all "toned and tan" and I'm glad for her. I have wondered if she's doing it for another guy at her work. I've joked about that with her and she just laughs it off. She's probably just doing it for herself. I'd like to be with her sexually, but hard to do when there's no time with each other and I don't sleep with her anymore. I haven't in over 3 years. Just working hard and going in and out of the house to sleep, shower and grab a bite to eat.
> 
> And the main things I forgot to say is that she's not very nice to me. Like she's getting back at me for all those years we were in full time ministry. I really don't blame her. I'm not sure if I could do anything to start over with her. We're just there now to raise the kids. No "kind" interaction at all. Just nagging and complaining. Get's tiring. Trust me.


It must be really frustrating for your wife to set the example for your daughter to disrespect you.

That said, it is occurring because you are allowing it to occur.

Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk


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## lostcauseTOO

GC1234 said:


> So, you don't want to invest time in rebuilding your relationship with your wife, but will invest time in cheating? Yeah, your priorities are straight.
> 
> I'd suggest giving up the second job, and spending more time with your family.
> 
> Also, you can't give up on your kid. She's your kid. You need to lay down the law.
> 
> Sounds like you've checked out of life. Maybe you should get treated for depression. Sounds like you have it to some degree.


I didn't say that I wanted to cheat. It just has popped into my mind from time to time. I have tried time and time again over the 25+ years to make things work with us. Some times have been good and others not. And now with everything going on in my life, I really don't care about anything. I may have depression. My wife thinks I may.


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## lostcauseTOO

farsidejunky said:


> It must be really frustrating for your wife to set the example for your daughter to disrespect you.
> 
> That said, it is occurring because you are allowing it to occur.
> 
> Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk


My daughter has watched my wife disrespect me all her life. When I try to put my foot down, they both just laugh at me.


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## Blondilocks

lostcauseTOO said:


> Basically, ever since we started dating, my wife feels that she wasn't the one I was supposed to marry in my mom's eyes.


Someone has most likely made her think this. 

You admit that you pretty much treated your wife like a servant for 25 years because you were 'doing the Lord's work'. Combine that with her believing that your mother doesn't think she is good enough for you and you have one beaten down and disenchanted woman. She doesn't want you in her bed because she doesn't like you nor does she trust you to have her best interests at heart.

An apology for being an insufferable husband for 25 years is too little and too late.

You won't be getting sex anytime soon. Start reevaluating your life goals and determine what you need to do to accomplish them.


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## lostcauseTOO

D0nnivain said:


> I don't understand a few things:
> 
> 1. Why are you sleeping in your 14 year old daughter's room?
> 
> 2. Do you have to work a F/T job plus 2 P/T jobs? For your 25 year marriage it seems you put work before your marriage & family. Now you no longer have your ministry & are at a loss to define yourself but you still put work over family. Your marriage won't work until you treat it like a priority.
> 
> Your wife seems happy enough. You are the one who is miserable. So think about what you want / need to not be miserable. I suppose sex is one of the things you need so when can you carve out time to spend on a date with your wife? Can you manage a romantic weekend somewhere to reconnect? You have to put in some effort.


For #1, read my response on another post. For #2, my salary went down over $20K and with a family of six, I needed to make that up with the other jobs to pay our living expenses. We don't have any debt, except the house and some medical bills from one of our daughters who has Down Syndrome.

My wife is happy. She told me the other day that she felt that I was upset that she appeared happy and I wasn't. It really doesn't bother me. She has moved on from us leaving ministry. I am the one still dealing with it - losing purpose in my life. I guess I am trying to bury those feelings by putting myself in my work to some point, but we still need the income.

We used to do date nights, but I don't think she wants to do those anymore. I've asked her many times. 


Blondilocks said:


> Someone has most likely made her think this.
> 
> You admit that you pretty much treated your wife like a servant for 25 years because you were 'doing the Lord's work'. Combine that with her believing that your mother doesn't think she is good enough for you and you have one beaten down and disenchanted woman. She doesn't want you in her bed because she doesn't like you nor does she trust you to have her best interests at heart.
> 
> An apology for being an insufferable husband for 25 years is too little and too late.
> 
> You won't be getting sex anytime soon. Start reevaluating your life goals and determine what you need to do to accomplish them.


I hear you, but it wasn't like that when we were in ministry. I never expected or demanded her to "do" ministry with me. We always talked about that our family was most important and we both tried our best to balance it all out. She grew up in a family that was in ministry as well, so she knew the importance of putting family first. I did my best too.

I really think that she doesn't like me at times or at least it appears like that. She spends more time with our teen children than me. She's always laughing and having a good time with them and then criticizing me and ignoring me. It's like I'm getting punished. How in the world can I approach her and ask to spend more time with her if she's treating me like this?


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## Tasorundo

lostcauseTOO said:


> My daughter has watched my wife disrespect me all her life. When I try to put my foot down, they both just laugh at me.


They will until they have reason not to.


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## lostcauseTOO

D0nnivain said:


> That's huge. You need to ask your wife if she wants a divorce. This is not healthy. It's bad for your daughter too.


I have asked her and she says "There's the door if you really want to leave."


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## Blondilocks

Why did you leave ministry?


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## D0nnivain

Can you take a step back? What would you say to somebody who came to you with these issues back when you had a ministry? 

A$20k loss of income is significant but are there other things you can do (change jobs) to not have to work 3 jobs? 

Your wife seems a bit checked out. You pay the bills. She does what she enjoys taking care of the kids & she's effectively kicked you out of her bed. You 2 have to find a way to reconnect or this really is over & you are nothing but the ATM. That said, your life may get more expensive divorced given the number of kids you need to support.


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## lostcauseTOO

Blondilocks said:


> Why did you leave ministry?


I was asked to resign behind doors but was told by leadership from the stage that I said I felt it was time to step down. They said that they were going in another direction and that I wasn't a right fit. I had been there for close to 9 years. I felt, and still feel, that the whole thing was a sham and I was done wrong.


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## lostcauseTOO

D0nnivain said:


> Can you take a step back? What would you say to somebody who came to you with these issues back when you had a ministry?
> 
> A$20k loss of income is significant but are there other things you can do (change jobs) to not have to work 3 jobs?
> 
> Your wife seems a bit checked out. You pay the bills. She does what she enjoys taking care of the kids & she's effectively kicked you out of her bed. You 2 have to find a way to reconnect or this really is over & you are nothing but the ATM. That said, your life may get more expensive divorced given the number of kids you need to support.


I have told her that all I'm good for is to bring in the money. I'm working my ass off and all I get is disrespect from one of my daughters and my wife, no alone time with her (sex) and definitely no free time for me.


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## D0nnivain

lostcauseTOO said:


> I was asked to resign behind doors but was told by leadership from the stage that I said I felt it was time to step down. They said that they were going in another direction and that I wasn't a right fit. I had been there for close to 9 years. I felt, and still feel, that the whole thing was a sham and I was done wrong.


Have you applied to other churches? Maybe it was time for a change but that is no reason to give up your vocation


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## lostcauseTOO

D0nnivain said:


> Have you applied to other churches? Maybe it was time for a change but that is no reason to give up your vocation
> [/QU


Not at this time. I'm not in a right place of mind to go back into ministry. Got a lot to work on before I can start to help others again.


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## BigDaddyNY

@lostcauseTOO You really need to do some work on yourself. This is going to be harsh, but based on what you've posted I can see why you lost your job as a minister. You are doing almost everything wrong. You can't manage the children in your household and you've given up leadership of you family to you wife. The way you describe dealing with your daughter is laughable. You can't figure out how to properly communicate with your wife. You have not done a great job managing your finances, since you need 3 jobs to keep up. You've turned to porn for sexual relief and you have considered cheating on your wife. These are all serious character flaws in my opinion and I find it hard to believe they weren't showing up in your day to day work as a minister, which my guess is why they decided to "go in a different direction." You are the last person I would want to be my minister based on what you have posted here.


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## lostcauseTOO

BigDaddyNY said:


> @lostcauseTOO You really need to do some work on yourself. This is going to be harsh, but based on what you've posted I can see why you lost your job as a minister. You are doing almost everything wrong. You can't manage the children in your household and you've given up leadership of you family to you wife. The way you describe dealing with your daughter is laughable. You can't figure out how to properly communicate with your wife. You have not done a great job managing your finances, since you need 3 jobs to keep up. You've turned to porn for sexual relief and you have considered cheating on your wife. These are all serious character flaws in my opinion and I find it hard to believe they weren't showing up in your day to day work as a minister, which my guess is why they decided to "go in a different direction." You are the last person I would want to be my minister based on what you have posted here.


Well said. And all very true. Just don't know where to start, but I know I need to.


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## BigDaddyNY

lostcauseTOO said:


> Well said. And all very true. Just don't know where to start, but I know I need to.


See, this is more of the same. If someone came to you as their minister with this list of issues what would you tell them?


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## CatholicDad

lostcauseTOO said:


> I’d like to just work my regular 40 hour a week job, but once we left ministry, my income dropped my nearly 20K and I’m trying to make up for it by doing the other two jobs. Actually the one PT job helps pay for gas to get to the other two. Crazy, I know.
> 
> As for the sex drive thing, sadly I’ve turned to looking at porn sometimes and pleasuring myself. I know it’s wrong and my wife has found out and confronted me on it. I’m trying my best to stay away from those things now.


Downsize, sell everything and go back to being the broke but happy couple you started out as. If you were Catholic and had to confess your porn habit to your priest every week- that habit would be gone for good in less than a year. Your marriage and family is on the line here!


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## D0nnivain

lostcauseTOO said:


> Just don't know where to start, but I know I need to.


As a minister I suspect your 1st step ought to be prayer. Ask God for guidance. Pray for your marriage. Maybe try to organize a family picnic or something after Church services on Sunday.


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## lostcauseTOO

D0nnivain said:


> As a minister I suspect your 1st step ought to be prayer. Ask God for guidance. Pray for your marriage. Maybe try to organize a family picnic or something after Church services on Sunday.


I don't go to Church anymore with my family. God and I are kind of on a "break" now.


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## lostcauseTOO

BigDaddyNY said:


> See, this is more of the same. If someone came to you as their minister with this list of issues what would you tell them?


I was a Student Minister and didn't deal with adults.


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## re16

I think you need to tell your wife that you really want to improve your marriage and would like her support in doing so. At least that way she knows you are admitting that you have issues to work on.

Your first step is to go to counseling on your own and tell them what you've told us.

Make all the money you possibly can in 40 hours, thats it. If you want more money in 40 hours, get a higher paying job.

You need to operate with energy and enthusiasm. If you wallow in your sorrow about where you are at, you will never come out of this.

I would start a daily exercise regime, early mornings. Do cardio and lift weights. This will help you organize your thoughts for the day, increase your energy level, and increase your testosterone... which you are going to need, because it is time to MAN UP and fix this.

Fight through doing this for a couple of weeks and you'll be reaping the rewards quickly.

I don't think its too late for you, but it is close. Get moving.


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## EleGirl

I just deleted two posts from people basically preaching religion to @BigDaddyNY. There is a forum here for religion. Keep the preaching to that forum.


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## Evinrude58

Too much going on here and too much info to even begin to help.
I’ll ask a few questions:
1why do you feel your feelings don’t count? You allow yourself daughter to rule your own bedroom. You allow your wife to tell you “there’s the door”. Why are you not angry and absolutely resolved to at least do something about that?

2what can you do to get one good job vs three crappy ones? Gotta make things nice for YOU before you can help others.

3 your kids don’t respect you, laugh at you, treat you like garbage. Why are you staying “so the kids are happy”??? They don’t sound all that happy.

If you no longer want to be married, just divorce. You already work three jobs, you get no sex, your kids laugh at you...
Heck, just divorce. You can’t have a much worse life. 

I’d start with letting them know you’ll be sleeping in your bed when you get gone from work and if they don’t like it they can sleep elsewhere. No discussion. Don’t say it with anger. When you get home, go to your bed. They can stay or leave. Start making your life like you want it. Have things your way. You are not making anything better for anyone as a miserable, unhappy person. You are the only one keeping you that way. Your problems have zero to do with your wife and daughter. They’re all internal. Fix you and you will find the rest of your life adapts to you in a positive way vs negative.


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## MidnightBlue

You left ministry because you were made to and not because of the harm it did to your family. Your family knew you didn’t consider them a priority and didn’t leave it for them. Had you made them a priority while working in the ministry, you would likely be in a very different place now.

Your family gave up on you, moved on without you, and became a tight knit unit despite you. You were a willing outsider and are now suffering the consequences of it.

I’m guessing your wife is getting a bit of satisfaction out of seeing you reap what you sowed. I think she sees you as someone who thought he could put his family on the back burner and expect to be greeted with open arms and enthusiasm when, not by choice, he left the thing he did make his priority. If this is the case, I don’t condone her behavior but I certainly understand it.

The whole thing has become toxic and will take a lot of work, humility, forgiveness, and sacrifice if it’s going to work. There’s a lot of hurt, bruised egos, anger, and feelings of abandonment here and it’s going to take effort from everyone in the family. This isn’t just a marriage that’s gone sour; it’s a whole family that’s in trouble. The “us against him” dynamic your wife has with the kids is very troubling and needs to be dealt with NOW. It’s destructive now but would be even more devastating should you and your wife divorce.

Now is not the time for apathy. I understand you must feel bitter and hopeless but this is not something that will just go away or fix itself with time.You’re going to have to decide that if you want your family, you’re going to have to be a fully engaged member of your family. Your job as a provider doesn’t end with paying bills. You are supposed to provide stability, love, and diplomatic leadership, as well. Your job is to set an example to your sons of the men they should be and to your daughters of the men they should choose. Look at yourself through their eyes and honestly assess how you measure up. Treat your wife the way you’d want your daughters treated and how you’d want your sons to treat their wives.

I wish you the best.


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## Arkansas

lostcauseTOO said:


> So with all that stuff, I've just lost the desire to improve my marriage. I just don't care anymore. I'm pretty miserable. She seems happy.


you are the problem

you made vows, and promises, you asked for trust and faith and it sound like your wife has given it

and you're failing her miserably and I feel very sorry for her - you need deep prayer, you need to be a man, a husband, a father, stop the selfishness and self pity - I'm guessing you are the core cause of many of the problems you identified


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## Kcden

I’m gonna give you my honest opinion and you might not like it. Seems like you not only never cared to work on your relationship with your wife but your family, which is 100% why your daughter doesn’t respect you. I honestly wouldn’t respect someone who was never there and when they were they were checked out mentally. She’s 14 not stupid she knows exactly what’s going on and most likely just thinks you don’t give an F about your family. Especially if she’s close with her mom. She prob sees how her mom puts in effort, takes care of herself and builds relationships with the kids while you just don’t care. Even in your post you make 1000 excuses and then admit you don’t try. If you wanted to fix things you would. A job isn’t an excuse, everyone has other responsibilities but prioritize what’s important. Clearly to you that’s not your wife and deff not your kids because you just write her off as being disrespectful instead of seeing things from her perspective. 
I agree with your wife 100% when she says she can’t have sex when you don’t have a relationship, she’s not a robot. 
seems like you already made up your mind but if you want to fix this you owe your whole family an apology. This can be incredibly damaging to your daughter and her future relationships with men if it goes unaddressed, and that’s what stuck out to me the most. She doesn’t respect you because she feels you don’t respect the family (which if you’re just giving up you don’t) and to me it will be harder for you to earn her trust back more so then your wife’s. You can divorce your wife if your unhappy but you can’t divorce your kids and like I said, this will stick with her. Even if you don’t care about fixing things with your wife (which you said you didn’t care so idk why you’re still married) care about fixing things with your daughter, this is a lot more damaging to her.


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## 24NitroglyceriN26

lostcauseTOO said:


> Hello everybody,
> 
> To start off, over the past 25 years of marriage I haven't always been "fully engaged" in a relationship with my wife in a normal sense. See, I was in full-time ministry for all those years and she was by my side serving and raising our four children. She often felt that I was putting ministry over her. And to tell you the truth, I did and I have told her that and I was sorry. We've had good times and really bad times (especially when it came to her relationship with my mother - that's a whole different thing for a different time.)
> 
> Now that I'm out of ministry, I've faced all sorts of feelings - loss of purpose, sense of failure to both people I served and my family I sacrificed for serving those people, mid-life crisis stuff (getting older, not a lot of savings for retirement, identity issues, stuff like that) and aging children (and a young teen daughter who disrespects me) and aging parents. My mother has cancer for the second time in ten years. Yep, it's a bunch of stuff and it all weighs heavy on my mind.
> 
> So here's the deal...I currently work a full-time job and two part time jobs to help provide for our family of six. My wife works as well, but she has a little more flexibility. I'm not at home much because of my working all the time either. And the times I do have off, I'm so tired and I take little naps just to make it to my next job. I'll be 54 this October. Now as for those naps and sleeping at night - I sleep in my daughter's room at night due to issues with my daughter that I mentioned earlier. Trust me, my wife doesn't try very hard to make her sleep in her room. She'll be 14 and she treats my like crap. I've just given up on that whole matter.
> 
> So with all that stuff, I've just lost the desire to improve my marriage. I just don't care anymore. I'm pretty miserable. She seems happy. She's enjoying time with our growing children and getting into physical shape. She's looking pretty good. She keeps saying that I need to improve my relationship with her. How can I do that? We never have any time together. And we haven't had sex in about six months. She says that we can't have sex without a relationship. I understand that. It's like we're just room mates or something. Some days we don't even talk to each other and I'm actually ok with that. I don't even try to touch her or kiss her anymore. I often don't even tell her goodbye when leaving for work in the morning. Doesn't matter anyways, everyone's busy getting ready for school and her job. I've told her that I don't think I want to develop our relationship anymore. Let's just get the kids grown and out of the house. I've even been frustrated at times in our marriage that I've threatened to leave, but we always seem to make things work. I'm not a very good communicator I admit. Sad, isn't it.
> 
> I don't think I would cheat on her, but I can't say that I wouldn't if I had a chance down the road. I just don't want to hurt the kids, plus I would feel really guilty if I did. They are all now in their teens and one is getting ready to go active duty in the military. It's like I'm playing the "waiting game". I actually told her that I should just "let her go", because life with me is probably really discouraging now and she could find someone that could make her more happier.
> 
> That's a lot I've thrown out there. I'm just tired, both physically and trying to make our marriage work. I've done some counseling for my "internal issues" since leaving ministry and I don't really want to go to marriage counseling with her again. We did back when we first got married. It was about the issues with my parents. Things haven't improved in that area either. I've just quit trying.
> 
> I just don't know what to do. I feel helpless. Any advice would be greatly appreciated. And I know what you're going to say, "There sure are a lot of "I's" in his entry - pretty selfish, I know.
> 
> lostcauseTOO


Sounds horrid. And as such, it is because it represents your life being thrown away. 25 years of your life - a lie. Sorry to hear this. Please know I want whichever of you who isn't the party at fault to know that you are both at fault. No regrets at this point...but I would say you both fully agree to it as you both are responsible.


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