# Mixed Messages From My Husband



## beatricecat (Jan 13, 2016)

So my husband and I are separated and trying to work on our marriage and last Tuesday during marriage counseling he said he still wasn't sure if he wanted to work on our marriage or not.

Later on in the week I let him know I got my tax forms and he said he would come over and bring his form so we could file taxes. The counselor had suggested that we date and so knowing that he is the one that wanted the separation I asked him that once I get my first paycheck from my new job that we can go out and do something fun together. He agreed to go with me and everything was fine, in fact for the time that he was here he smiled at me and we laughed a few times.

Before he came over I had a good job interview, I had made sure everything looked good around the house, and I was still put together from the interview. And more than anything I stayed positive and wasn't crying, or really even talking about our relationship.

But when I walked him out to the door, he reached out his arms and I didn't really notice and then he told me to come to him and he hugged me and held on for a few seconds. I was pretty shocked because he hasn't hugged me without me asking for it in nearly a month and a half, and the last time he did was after I had a breakdown and it was more out of pity than affection. Afterwards I walked him out to his bike, he told me to let him know how my other job interview on Friday goes, we said goodbye, and I walked right into my room, and cried, and I haven't stopped crying since.

I know I shouldn't be thinking too much into things, and I should just take it as something positive and that maybe he's coming around. I'm ready to be happy in our marriage again, I want to have a life with him, and I want to have fun together. I want to be there for each other and build each other up more than anything else in the world, but I'm so scared that he's just doing this out of pity for me again.

I want to give him the space he needs still so I don't want to message him about it and chase him away. But this has been killing me, and I've been trying so hard to divert my attention to other things but nothing has worked. I'm trapped in my own head not knowing if I should be over the moon with joy, or if he just sees me as a pitiful mess without him.


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## Luvher4life (Jan 15, 2016)

I don't know what has happened to you two, but from what I can see from your post is you are very emotionally dependent on him. It appears that emotional dependence is what he had to get away from to begin with. I could be totally off base with this, though. There are probably some other problems as well, but your emotional dependence on him is what sticks out the most. 

My advice is to quit being so emotional. Get yourself some help to deal with these raw emotions. It could be chronic depression that is causing you to react this way, and that is treatable. Can you love somebody TOO much? Absolutely. For your marriage to work ideally, you will absolutely have to show the ability to maintain your composure even under the worst of conditions emotionally.

Were you constantly this way before the separation? Have you sought help before? Diagnosed with depression?

You have to be able to separate your own emotions from the emotions you have for him, somehow, and that will take time. Once you have your emotions in check, YOU will be better off with or without him.


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## beatricecat (Jan 13, 2016)

Luvher4life said:


> I don't know what has happened to you two, but from what I can see from your post is you are very emotionally dependent on him. It appears that emotional dependence is what he had to get away from to begin with. I could be totally off base with this, though. There are probably some other problems as well, but your emotional dependence on him is what sticks out the most.
> 
> My advice is to quit being so emotional. Get yourself some help to deal with these raw emotions. It could be chronic depression that is causing you to react this way, and that is treatable. Can you love somebody TOO much? Absolutely. For your marriage to work ideally, you will absolutely have to show the ability to maintain your composure even under the worst of conditions emotionally.
> 
> ...


I know I do have some emotional dependence issues due to a lot of past trauma from my mom, prior relationships, and depression, and I'm going to counseling and I started taking anti-depressants to kind of help me a little.

I was able to keep myself in check before, but long story short about 2 years ago he made some really hurtful comments towards me. I held resentment against him, and he never really apologized. Things got REALLY stressful this past year and we took it out on each other. We still love each other very much, he just said he's no longer in love with me. 

I've tried really hard to separate my emotions when I'm with him lately, but it's hard. I've been working on making some positive changes, and have tried to just let him have his space while still keeping communication open every now and again. Which mostly I try to let him initiate.

But I love him so deeply, and he left me at a time when I really needed his support. That broke my heart. I'm really trying to focus on bettering myself and trying to be patient and better our marriage slowly. But he's all my mind goes back to. I've already accepted the fact that our marriage could either work out and we could be happy again, or that we could divorce and that would be the end of things. As much as I am willing to give him my heart again, as much as I've forgiven him for the pain he's caused me, and as hard as I'm going to work to save our marriage, I'm just scared that he's not going to do the same. I'm terrified that he's not going to take ownership for the things that he has done or said to contribute to the troubles we have, and then I'll be miserable and we'll go through the same thing over and over.


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## Luvher4life (Jan 15, 2016)

beatricecat said:


> I know I do have some emotional dependence issues due to a lot of past trauma from my mom, prior relationships, and depression, and I'm going to counseling and I started taking anti-depressants to kind of help me a little.


Thank you for your candor. You are at least taking steps toward recovery. That is good. One thing to keep in mind, though. None of that past trauma from your mom and prior relationships were caused by him. That baggage will put strains on any marriage..., if you LET it. Continue with the counseling, and make sure that you keep a close eye on the side effects of any medication you may be taking. I've always been told that sometimes the side effects can outweigh the benefits with some medications. Try and find the right combination that helps.



beatricecat said:


> I was able to keep myself in check before, but long story short about 2 years ago he made some really hurtful comments towards me. I held resentment against him, and he never really apologized. Things got REALLY stressful this past year and we took it out on each other. We still love each other very much, he just said he's no longer in love with me.


In the heat of arguments, things will be said that are hurtful. Did you let him know afterwards exactly what words hurt you? Two years is an extremely long time to hold resentment over some hurtful words. Internalizing that resentment only makes it worse. Sometimes you have to just let that resentment go even when it feels like it is unresolved. It is very UNHEALTHY to hold resentment, and it will continue to be a problem as long as you internalize it. My advice? Just let it go! It's easier said than done, but it HAS to be done if you want the relationship to work.



beatricecat said:


> I've tried really hard to separate my emotions when I'm with him lately, but it's hard. I've been working on making some positive changes, and have tried to just let him have his space while still keeping communication open every now and again. Which mostly I try to let him initiate.


Yes, it is EXTREMELY hard to separate raw emotion, no matter who you are. This is a traumatic experience for you.  You still have to find a way to separate your emotions to keep them from being reactionary. You are definitely headed in the right direction by making positive changes in YOU, and in YOUR life. Those changes you make in yourself are what will determine YOUR future, whether with him or without him. The fact he is still communicating with you shows that he does still care at least. 



beatricecat said:


> But I love him so deeply, and he left me at a time when I really needed his support. That broke my heart. I'm really trying to focus on bettering myself and trying to be patient and better our marriage slowly. But he's all my mind goes back to. I've already accepted the fact that our marriage could either work out and we could be happy again, or that we could divorce and that would be the end of things. As much as I am willing to give him my heart again, as much as I've forgiven him for the pain he's caused me, and as hard as I'm going to work to save our marriage, I'm just scared that he's not going to do the same. I'm terrified that he's not going to take ownership for the things that he has done or said to contribute to the troubles we have, and then I'll be miserable and we'll go through the same thing over and over.


I absolutely HATE to see somebody hurt like this. I've been through the pain of a broken heart myself on more than one occasion. Nothing I can say or do will make that pain magically go away. I know you are hurting, but you WILL get over it. It will take time, though. One thing that you will have to do to ease the pain at least a little is to catch yourself when you start thinking about what "could" have been, or what you "want" to happen, and nip it in the bud with more positive thoughts. You will have to get BUSY, and I mean REALLY BUSY to keep those emotions from staying at the forefront of your thoughts. There will be times where it is impossible to keep emotions from flowing into your consciousness, but being able to control when and where is key. Your future depends on your being able to stay on TOP of your emotions, and not letting your emotions stay on TOP of YOU. Even if your marriage doesn't work out, and I pray that it does, you will be MUCH better off when you are in control of your own emotions, instead of your emotions being in control of you.


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## beatricecat (Jan 13, 2016)

Luvher4life said:


> Thank you for your candor. You are at least taking steps toward recovery. That is good. One thing to keep in mind, though. None of that past trauma from your mom and prior relationships were caused by him. That baggage will put strains on any marriage..., if you LET it. Continue with the counseling, and make sure that you keep a close eye on the side effects of any medication you may be taking. I've always been told that sometimes the side effects can outweigh the benefits with some medications. Try and find the right combination that helps.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



And thank you for your help. I know I'm far from perfect, and I know I did let pain from my past impact my relationship with my husband. I'm trying to be as honest with myself about this whole situation as much as possible. And as hard as it is, I'm trying to not bruise his ego and point the finger at him.

The thing is, is that the most hurtful things he's ever done or said to me were never in the heat of arguments. They were always when we were around his friends, and he thinks I hate his friends, when really I just don't like how much he has disrespected me in front of them before. I definitely did let my resentment settle for too long and that is my fault, but I think I held that in because every time I tried to talk to him about things he would just say, "Well, that's just how I am." He would say sorry, but it always was followed with that statement, so it never really felt like he truly meant it. That or he would just turn it on an argument about how I hated his friends.


Like I was saying, I know what I've done to contribute to the issues we have in our marriage, and I am working on fixing those. But I know I can't be with him if he doesn't make some changes to the way he treats me. I've risked a lot and made a lot of sacrifices to be with him and try to give him a good life and he's never really done the same for me.

I'm definitely going to keep trying to just live in the now. I know I can live a good life with or without him, it's just he's really the only person I've ever pictured spending the rest of my life with, and I still really want that. But ultimately all of that rests on his shoulders right now. Just not knowing that he could wake up one day, and decide to say he doesn't want to work on things anymore and wants the divorce makes me feel helpless.


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## MRR (Sep 14, 2015)

I dont have a lot to add, however I will say that when I was going through my divorce, both my and my ex's emotions were all over the place. We lived together while going through divorce for about 2 months-- waiting for her to get her apt-- and there WERE times we just held each other in that way. It was momentary, fleeting, emotional swing. I am not speculating on your situation, but for us, it really didnt mean anything. As a matter of fact I would caution you on reading too much into it as you may be let down again-- in a sense that is what happened to me as there were times I savored those moments. It was she who was no longer in love with me, so I get your position. 

In the end, those things faded. I moved on. She still wants to give me hugs (and more actually) but I did not become attractive to her again until she saw how great I am on my own.

But to go back to the point, be very careful with reading someone's emotions in these circumstances-- you are both weak at times and it may or may not mean anything long term.


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## WandaJ (Aug 5, 2014)

I agree with MRR that this does not have to mean he wants to go back. End of relationship is like grieving process, and there might be some still positive feeling towards each other, but not enough to stay together. I would even say, that once you pass the phase of "I hate you", towards indifference, this is when it is easier to hug, to say something positive, just like you would to stranger in distress. And giving a hug is like saying teary farewell to the fairy tale that did not survive. 

Focus on yourself, unless you have more consistent signs from him.


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## beatricecat (Jan 13, 2016)

MRR said:


> I dont have a lot to add, however I will say that when I was going through my divorce, both my and my ex's emotions were all over the place. We lived together while going through divorce for about 2 months-- waiting for her to get her apt-- and there WERE times we just held each other in that way. It was momentary, fleeting, emotional swing. I am not speculating on your situation, but for us, it really didnt mean anything. As a matter of fact I would caution you on reading too much into it as you may be let down again-- in a sense that is what happened to me as there were times I savored those moments. It was she who was no longer in love with me, so I get your position.
> 
> In the end, those things faded. I moved on. She still wants to give me hugs (and more actually) but I did not become attractive to her again until she saw how great I am on my own.
> 
> But to go back to the point, be very careful with reading someone's emotions in these circumstances-- you are both weak at times and it may or may not mean anything long term.


I really am trying to not read too much into things because I don't want to set myself up to be torn down all over again. It's just really hard not to because I so badly want to save our marriage, and I don't want to pressure him and scare him off. So the only way I'm going to be able to know what he wants, is by the things he says and the actions he takes.

There is still love between us, and we both still care about each other very much, but he admitted in marriage counseling the spark was gone. And I know that if he and I both work on this, we can save what we have. It's just he has to want it, and I can't force him to do so.

So out of respect for him needing his space, I have to let him make the moves, and it's so hard when my heart is hanging in the balance.


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## ConfusionHasRunRampant (Apr 1, 2015)

i have to edit my post


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## beatricecat (Jan 13, 2016)

WandaJ said:


> I agree with MRR that this does not have to mean he wants to go back. End of relationship is like grieving process, and there might be some still positive feeling towards each other, but not enough to stay together. I would even say, that once you pass the phase of "I hate you", towards indifference, this is when it is easier to hug, to say something positive, just like you would to stranger in distress. And giving a hug is like saying teary farewell to the fairy tale that did not survive.
> 
> Focus on yourself, unless you have more consistent signs from him.


There's so much that it can mean, and that's why it's so confusing and so painful.

Like I was saying, there is still love between us, he just said the spark is gone. There was a severe lack of communication between us, and we both were behaving in ways that drove the two of us apart.

I think there is something to save there, we just need to let go of our egos, nurture our love, and have fun. And these are things that we never really got an opportunity to do, which was fine in the beginning of our marriage, but it ate away at it lately.


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## ConfusionHasRunRampant (Apr 1, 2015)

The spark goes out in every marriage, that's why it takes work. 

I'm not fond of men who disrespect their wives in front of their friends. It's a way to build themselves up and put you down and it shows the level of respect he has for you and your marriage. 

Hope is giving you false hope. Can you accept the situation for what it is, without applying a label of expectations?

Has he said he wants to work it out with you?


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

I know you want this to work out, but based on what you've said, I believe your marriage is over. 
You have to accept this, which I know is impossibly hard to do. 
However, you can't heal and get over this pain until you do accept and move on. 

Acceptance was the hardest part for me, also. But your husband only hugged you out of guilt. If he wanted you, he'd have said so. 

Also, as long as you keep yourself on the hook, he will have no reason to change his behavior and mindset toward you. He has freedom to date--- and YOU.

Move on. Detach. He may choose to come back once he sees he's lost you, but it's doubtful.

I'm sorry and wish you luck
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## beatricecat (Jan 13, 2016)

ConfusionHasRunRampant said:


> The spark goes out in every marriage, that's why it takes work.
> 
> I'm not fond of men who disrespect their wives in front of their friends. It's a way to build themselves up and put you down and it shows the level of respect he has for you and your marriage.
> 
> ...


I completely agree, and that's exactly what the counselor told him. This can be fixed, but it is going to take work and he has to want it to work otherwise he's going to sabotage it.

I've tried in the past to address a lot of these issues by talking to him, but it always became very hard and emotional for me because I really felt taken for granted and used. I made $4 more an hour than him and my income was still less because I paid for the health insurance and wanted to make sure we had good coverage so he was taken care of if he were to get in a bike wreck. I had to go through hell with the INS to keep him in the country. I tried to ask him to go out with me, and the only thing he was willing to do if his friends weren't involved is to go out to dinner. Every time I tried I would get, "Oh that sounds dumb." And this is doing things I thought he would actually like to do. Pretty much because it didn't involve his motorcycle club he couldn't care less.

My expectations aren't high, I don't expect flowers, romantic getaways, to be showered with affection and waited on hand and foot. All I want is for him to respect me regardless of who is around, spend some quality time with me once a month at least, and to tell me that he loves me without me having to say it first.

I've never really asked him to make huge changes for me, I've just asked him to love me, and stand by my side. We could live in a cardboard box, with the clothes on our back, and as long as he could love me, and respect me, I would be happy.

But at this current point he said he doesn't know if he wants to work it out. This past year was VERY hard on us, and his depression brought him to the point where he wanted to kill himself for the first time in nearly 10 years. I want an opportunity to be happy together and make good memories together before we end this. It's stupid to just say we've been married 3 years, 1 year out of the past 3 was really tough, so that means we should end it without trying to fix things.


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## Luvher4life (Jan 15, 2016)

beatricecat said:


> And thank you for your help. I know I'm far from perfect, and I know I did let pain from my past impact my relationship with my husband. I'm trying to be as honest with myself about this whole situation as much as possible. And as hard as it is, I'm trying to not bruise his ego and point the finger at him.


As with any relationship, there's plenty of blame to share on each party. You're right. NOBODY is perfect, so finger pointing is never going to solve anything. It is what it is, and the past will not change regardless. It's what we do in the future is what matters most.



beatricecat said:


> The thing is, is that the most hurtful things he's ever done or said to me were never in the heat of arguments. They were always when we were around his friends, and he thinks I hate his friends, when really I just don't like how much he has disrespected me in front of them before. I definitely did let my resentment settle for too long and that is my fault, but I think I held that in because every time I tried to talk to him about things he would just say, "Well, that's just how I am." He would say sorry, but it always was followed with that statement, so it never really felt like he truly meant it. That or he would just turn it on an argument about how I hated his friends.


I did note that you said "his" friends, which I take to mean that they are not mutual friends. Even if that is not what you meant, it showed at least some resentment. No, he shouldn't have disrespected you in front of his friends. That was definitely wrong on his part. I'm pretty sure he has detected your resentment toward them in some way, whether you meant to or not, and I think he may have reacted to that. It probably felt to him like you were trying to dictate who his friends should be, not who they are. Picking his friends over you is not right either way, but you likely put him in a position where he reacted that way. Smothered him, maybe? For the relationship to work, you'll both have to find a way to compromise some time for the sake of the other's own friends, family, etc. Not allowing that personal space can be overwhelming, and can lead to resentment, and eventually separation.



beatricecat said:


> Like I was saying, I know what I've done to contribute to the issues we have in our marriage, and I am working on fixing those. But I know I can't be with him if he doesn't make some changes to the way he treats me. I've risked a lot and made a lot of sacrifices to be with him and try to give him a good life and he's never really done the same for me.


I hate to say this, but there's a very real chance that he will not change very much, if at all. At least not enough to make you completely happy. You can't change somebody who doesn't want to change, no matter how hard you try. It's unfortunate, but the reality is you will have to make some choices as to what you can live with about him, and what you can't, and go from there. No matter how "good" you make his life, it appears he isn't appreciating it enough to make the necessary changes to make YOU happy. With that approach, are you willing to make the necessary changes to make him happy? No matter how hard you try, you will never be able to "force" somebody to be happy. They either are, or they're not.



beatricecat said:


> I'm definitely going to keep trying to just live in the now. *I know I can live a good life with or without him*, it's just he's really the only person I've ever pictured spending the rest of my life with, and I still really want that. But ultimately all of that rests on his shoulders right now. Just not knowing that he could wake up one day, and decide to say he doesn't want to work on things anymore and wants the divorce makes me feel helpless.


You're off to a good start. Learn to live without him. It's not like you really have a choice anyway, at this point. Work on YOU first. Get your emotions under control, and the rest will fall into place. I know the ideal of marriage is that you both spend the rest of your lives together living happily ever after, but as hard as it is to say, sometimes it doesn't work out that way. My advice..., move on without him, work on your emotional "independence", and quit dwelling on what "could be" or what "should be". Find your inner peace, and your own happiness, and others will want to be a part of it. Use this analogy..., would you rather be around somebody who is depressed and sad most of the time, or would you rather be around somebody who upbeat and happy most of the time?


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## beatricecat (Jan 13, 2016)

Luvher4life said:


> I did note that you said "his" friends, which I take to mean that they are not mutual friends. Even if that is not what you meant, it showed at least some resentment. No, he shouldn't have disrespected you in front of his friends. That was definitely wrong on his part. I'm pretty sure he has detected your resentment toward them in some way, whether you meant to or not, and I think he may have reacted to that. It probably felt to him like you were trying to dictate who his friends should be, not who they are. Picking his friends over you is not right either way, but you likely put him in a position where he reacted that way. Smothered him, maybe? For the relationship to work, you'll both have to find a way to compromise some time for the sake of the other's own friends, family, etc. Not allowing that personal space can be overwhelming, and can lead to resentment, and eventually separation.
> 
> 
> 
> I hate to say this, but there's a very real chance that he will not change very much, if at all. At least not enough to make you completely happy. You can't change somebody who doesn't want to change, no matter how hard you try. It's unfortunate, but the reality is you will have to make some choices as to what you can live with about him, and what you can't, and go from there. No matter how "good" you make his life, it appears he isn't appreciating it enough to make the necessary changes to make YOU happy. With that approach, are you willing to make the necessary changes to make him happy? No matter how hard you try, you will never be able to "force" somebody to be happy. They either are, or they're not.


I'm not going to lie, there definitely is some resentment still there. And that is something that I'm trying really hard to work on myself, and to not hold against my husband, or his friends. I mean, I like most of them individually, and I can have a good time with them. But the motorcycle club has been my husband's focus this past year, every time there was an issue rather than come to me, he went to his friends in the club. More than anything, I don't like what he becomes around the club, and while I might not ask my husband to quit the MC, I do need to see him show me some respect in that setting for me to be able to finally let go of some of that because that's a part of what is pulling our marriage to pieces.

I know that there is a real reality that he may never change, and to be honest if he doesn't, there aren't many women I know that would put up with some of the things he's put me through. He's never cheated on me, but he's continuously broken my heart and let me down over the past 2 years.

As for me making changes, I've already made some. I used to drink every day and I've stopped. I'm trying to go back to school so I can have a career and stop working at a job that makes me miserable. I got fired in December and not only did I get a job closer to our apartment in December, after he said he wanted the separation and I moved to my parent's place, I found a new job in less than a month, and have had 1 interview and have another tomorrow morning for better paying positions. And our apartment was a mess because my last job was so far away, that by the time I got home I was exhausted. So I'm taking steps to better organize myself, and he even admitted he was impressed when he came over on Tuesday. I'm getting help to deal with my past traumas, I've admitted my wrongs, and I really am trying to make changes in my life to better myself and better our marriage. And these are all things he said bothered him in marriage counseling, and I actually admitted to him before hand.


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## ConfusionHasRunRampant (Apr 1, 2015)

Beatrice, you "impressed" him? Oh gosh, that doesn't sound right. 

He hasn't been there for you, has disrespected you, has put his hobbies over your marriage, shown you that your marriage isn't as important as other things- and you impressed him? 

It doesn't sound like you're losing much by losing him. 

You are attached to him. That's why you obsess. 

My advice is to ask yourself why you don't love yourself enough to let this man go? He doesn't sound like the best guy and hasn't said he wants to reconcile. If he hasn't said that he doesn't want to either, he's leaving you to hope. The decent thing to do wouldn't be to keep you hanging on the fence, waiting. Let him go. 

Please, start working on loving yourself and letting him go. You sound like you're very nice. I, myself, am a bit of a people pleaser. Are you? If so, you really need to start valuing yourself more.


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## beatricecat (Jan 13, 2016)

ConfusionHasRunRampant said:


> Beatrice, you "impressed" him? Oh gosh, that doesn't sound right.
> 
> He hasn't been there for you, has disrespected you, has put his hobbies over your marriage, shown you that your marriage isn't as important as other things- and you impressed him?
> 
> ...


I know that I deserve a lot better than the way he treated me some times. But there were times that he was sweet to me and I will admit I pushed him away, and there were times that I disrespected him.

It's not that I don't love myself, or think I don't deserve to be with someone who loves me back as much as I love them, because everyone deserves love and respect. It's that as much as an insensitive jerk he can be some times, most of the time, he's funny, and someone I genuinely enjoy being around. By no means is our marriage perfect, but he still has given me some of the best memories I've had in my life, and he is a good man through it all.

I think right now more than anything, he's confused. I don't want to change who he is because he's the man that I love, I just want him to place a higher value on our marriage and me.

And who knows, our marriage could end, or we could wind up back in each other's arms happier than before. But I would rather put my heart on the line and go through some painful times if means there is even a slight chance we could wind up in a happy marriage together again, than spend the rest of my life regretting that I didn't try.

My husband to be honest has had a very privileged life and really hasn't had to make many sacrifices or had to put anyone else before himself. On top of that he's never really had a relationship lasting for more than a month prior to me. He can be very mature in some areas in life, but when it comes to relationships he can be like a child sometimes. Once he got depressed I really think he didn't know how to handle the situation, so the only thing he could think to do was leave. At first once he told me about everything he wasn't wanting to work on the relationship at all, and I even told him he didn't have to show up the counseling session but he still did.


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