# Help! 17 year old daughter is pregnant



## nikoled

Anyone dealt with this before? So not expecting this. It's a long comlicated story, but what it comes down to is that our daughter has never done anything wrong. Straight A student, dancer, really good kid. First relationship ever with a boy that is very nice, but has major issues- he was a foster child until recently and has had about every trauma imaginable happen to him. They've only been together for 2 months. This wasn't even on our radar- they were never even home alone together ever. Daughter is a junior in high school. Boy is a senior, but like I said, has absolutely no stability in his world. He doesn't even have parents. He lives with a teacher and she is wonderful and trying so hard to get this kid on track. My daughter was trying to save him I think, but in it has sarificed herself. 

When I found out I told her that she needed to put herself first now. It was time to take care of her and decide what she needs to do. I am not a very political person. I don't have strong stances on abortion, but I don't think it should be used lightly. We are now at a point of having to consider this option. When she found out she decided to break up with boy and get an abortion. We said, ok, and were supportive of her. Asked boy not to contact her anymore and made the appointment. Unfortunately she cannot even get in for another week. And boy, unfortunately, is in the hospital now having a breakdown because he is so incredibly devastated that she dumped him and is not allowing him any say in his baby. :crying:

I get it. I have sons too. My kids have had a relatively easy life. They have had no trauma and this poor boy has had more trauma than anyone should have in a lifetime already. I'm so sad for both of them- they are both good kids and know that they messed up. If daughter wanted to keep the baby we would be supportive. We are in a position where we could do this. ANd I want my daughter to make the decision herself. She is still set on abortion. She doesn't think it is fair to this boy to put this burden on him when he doesn't even have a clear future yet or any stability at all. She doesn't trust that he would be able to be involved or be a good parent- he has some other issues I haven't discolosed on here, but his past is ROUGH. Drugs, alcohol, gangs- all of that. He has picked himself up and overcame a lot. But we live in a suburban area where this is all pretty foreign to me and very scary.

The easy route seems to be to do an abortion, let boy go on with his life, and daughter will return to her life as she knew it- changed for sure, but as normal as she can be considering. Had this been a boy who was stable, etc I might feel differently, but I'm terrified for her to be tied to him forever. He treats her well, but there are just so many issues. ANd I say he treats her well, but then again, he did not use a condom and in my opinion that is disrespectful. I know she is not innocent in this. 

I don't even know what I am asking, but any one have any advice? Right now daughter has not spoken to boy since she confirmed pregnancy. This poor boy is literally in a stress center because he is so devastated. She doesn't want to talk to him because she is afraid he will change her mind. I just wanted it to be done so I was supportive of that, but I'm now feeling badly for this kid- but maybe I need to let that go and just protect my own daughter?? I don't know...


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## SlowlyGoingCrazy

I got pregnant at 16 and decided to keep my child. It was not easy and it's too much of a personal choice for anyone but the mother to be making. 

If she feels that abortion is the right thing for her to then your job is to just support her. I know it's hard not to feel bad about her ex but just worry about your own daughter right now, even without knowing his other issues it sounds like he could end up being a nightmare to co-parent with. 

If she chooses abortion, make sure she is on birth control consistently. Maybe talk to her Dr about something like depo or the patch, implant or IUD. Something she can't forget to take. Encourage her to get an STD panel and a pap test too.


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## WorkingOnMe

I've been through this twice, as the boy. Although we didn't break up right away. All I can say is that an abortion will affect her in ways she can't fathom until it's too late. I'm not anti, but will tell you with the benefit of 30 years of hindsight, I would choose differently if I had it to do over.


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## Adelais

When I was in a treatment center for depression over 28 years ago, all the other patients were suffering from losing a child to abortion, whether they were male or female. Every one of them sobbed when they read their letters to their unborn child. Their pain and guilt contributed to men being alcoholics, women being sex addicts or deeply codependent, etc. At the time I was glad I had never gotten pregnant while single, because I too would have had an abortion and been suffering from one more issue.

I have 3 daughters and a son. If any of them gets pregnant out of wedlock, they know that I will not be ashamed of them, but will help them through pregnancy and adoption. Even my 20 year old son, who is sexually active and and isn't ready for a baby says that if a girlfriend gets pregnant he doesn't want her to get an abortion. He would be ready to take responsibility for his actions. He would be devastated to know his child was murdered in the womb.

Having a baby at 17 or 18 isn't the end of a girl's life, especially in today's society. She can still get scholarships, go to college, etc. She can have the baby, and give it to a loving family for adoption.

That boy your daughter was dating is in a worse spot than your daughter. It is not fair that he has no say regarding his own child. It could push him over the edge, since he doesn't have parents or family. It would be tragic.

But at least your daughter's future is preserved. That's all that matters, right?


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## Adelais

nikoled said:


> My daughter was trying to save him I think, but in it has sarificed herself.
> 
> When I found out I told her that she needed to put herself first now. It was time to take care of her and decide what she needs to do.


Your daughter did not sacrifice herself. She is not dead. She was horny, had sex, and nature ran its course.

She was already thinking of herself. Now she needs to start thinking of others: the boy's feelings, and the baby's future.

Your daughter will have a future regardless of her decision about the baby, because she has supportive parents. She needs your love and for you to encourage her to do the better thing for everyone involved.


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## sixty-eight

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> I got pregnant at 16 and decided to keep my child. *It was not easy and it's too much of a personal choice for anyone but the mother to be making. *
> 
> If she feels that abortion is the right thing for her to then *your job is to just support her. I know it's hard not to feel bad about her ex but just worry about your own daughter right now, even without knowing his other issues it sounds like he could end up being a nightmare to co-parent with.
> *
> If she chooses abortion, *make sure she is on birth control consistently. Maybe talk to her Dr about something like depo or the patch, implant or IUD. Something she can't forget to take. Encourage her to get an STD panel and a pap test too.*


:iagree:

I'm personally anti abortion, i don't believe a child is to be punished for the mother's/father's mistakes. However, i also don't believe in shoving my controversial opinions at other people 

Your daughter will need all of your support right now, I'm sure this is throwing you all for a loop. The hormones have already started coursing through her and changing her, thing will be different after this for her, no matter her choice. She might need some counseling either way.


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## Anon Pink

If your daughter wants an abortion get it done. While it's not at all an easy thing to go through for anyone, I know several women who had abortions in the young single days and none of them claim to regret it in the slightest. 

Your worry and focus should be on your daughter. This boy may be a fantastic kid who's had some lousy hand dealt him. Without a family it would be natural for him to desperately want to create his own family. But we adults know that the fantasies of a teenager do not come to pass on wishes. 

Your daughter has her whole life ahead of her and it sounds like she intends to have that life. She needs your support for her decision. Good for you for being there for her!


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## Omego

nikoled said:


> She doesn't want to talk to him because she is afraid he will change her mind. .


I'm trying to put myself in your shoes because I have daughters around the age of 17. If there is any shred of doubt in her mind about keeping the baby, and you are able to take care of it while she continues her education, don't let her get the abortion. However, if she does want to, then you'll have to be there to support her and not try to change her mind if she is SURE this is what she wants to do.

I'm not pro anything except for myself. I would not get an abortion and I would not want my daughters to get one. I've known of a couple of women who have done so and still weep about it today (they were both in stable marriages and already had children).

my 2 cts


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## Cosmos

My niece became pregnant at 14 and my sister insisted on an immediate abortion. Within a year my niece was pregnant again... Many years later she told me that the second pregnancy had been deliberate and designed to help her deal with the grief and pain of the abortion. She's now 39 years of age and a mother of 5, but she still grieves for her 'lost' child.

I think we have to be so careful with this sort of thing, because no matter how well intentioned - an unwanted abortion can leave a lifetime of scars.


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## Openminded

I'm basically neutral on the subject of abortion. I think it's completely the choice of the person who's pregnant because she's the one who has to deal with it. Some single mothers do well and some don't. Some women regret their entire lives they had an abortion and some don't. Right now, her future is unknown but a decision has to be made soon and it's hers to make. Your job obviously is to emotionally support her -- whatever she chooses -- and not try to persuade her one way or the other. And, yes, that's very hard. But this is her life and her choice. I hope she has the maturity to deal with it either way because it's a tough road whatever she chooses. I wish the very best for both of you.


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## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Openminded said:


> Your job obviously is to emotionally support her -- whatever she chooses -- and not try to persuade her one way or the other. And, yes, that's very hard. But this is her life and her choice.


I agree. The choice is hers alone. Trying to get her to do one thing or another can end up very badly. 

Abortion has it's risks but many women do not have any regret or emotional problems afterwards. If they have the support and love and are not met with judgement, she will get through this. 

And keep in mind that teen parenting does not just change your teens. Finishing school, college, getting your first place, dating, first job and trying to move up - all with a child - is harder. The choice I made changed everything from that moment on. 
Many of the women I was with in my teen pregnancy group (a gov't thing to help us finish school) were never able to get back up. They ended up on welfare, more children, crappy boyfriends. There are horror stories on both sides of this sadly. 

It is far too personal of a choice for anyone to make other than her. 

Research abortion clinics in your area and find a good one that has a full range of services for her. Be aware that there are some places out there that will act like they will help you with getting an abortion and then once you are there pile on judgement and try to get you to change your mind. 
https://www.plannedparenthood.org/learn/pregnancy/crisis-pregnancy-centers

This link is also a nice read-through for you 
Parents | Abortion Care | Northland Family Planning Centers


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## nikoled

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> Research abortion clinics in your area and find a good one that has a full range of services for her. Be aware that there are some places out there that will act like they will help you with getting an abortion and then once you are there pile on judgement and try to get you to change your mind.
> https://www.plannedparenthood.org/learn/pregnancy/crisis-pregnancy-centers
> 
> This link is also a nice read-through for you
> Parents | Abortion Care | Northland Family Planning Centers


Thank you- I called around yesterday and was surprised that the first date available at Planned Parenthood in my area (We live in a large midwestern city) wasn't for 3 weeks. And that is just for the initial appointment. So, I called some surrounding college towns and was able to get an appointment for her for next week, but an hour and a half away. I then did a little research and there is a privately owned clinic in my area that can get her in early next week and costs a little more, but it's local. My best friend is a physician and she called around yesterday to verify that this is a good place and she felt good about it. This is an area where I previously knew NOTHING. What a learning experience.


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## nikoled

WorkingOnMe said:


> I've been through this twice, as the boy. Although we didn't break up right away. All I can say is that an abortion will affect her in ways she can't fathom until it's too late. I'm not anti, but will tell you with the benefit of 30 years of hindsight, I would choose differently if I had it to do over.


Were you involved with the decision as a boy in a relationship? My daughter has totally shut this boy out. I was supportive of that at first, but now I'm feeling really badly for this kid. I think it was her reaction to protect herself when she was hit with the reality of the situation.


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## NobodySpecial

WorkingOnMe said:


> I've been through this twice, as the boy. Although we didn't break up right away. All I can say is that an abortion will affect her in ways she can't fathom until it's too late.


Studies do not back this up. This is a myth.


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## nikoled

Cosmos said:


> I think we have to be so careful with this sort of thing, because no matter how well intentioned an unwanted abortion can leave a lifetime of scars.


Yes, this scares me. I've been careful of my words from the second she told me as I know how big this is and how this needs to be her decision for her own mental healh. I also think I probably should look for some counseling for her.


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## SecondTime'Round

I'm sorry this has happened in your family . How far along is she?


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## SlowlyGoingCrazy

nikoled said:


> Were you involved with the decision as a boy in a relationship? My daughter has totally shut this boy out. I was supportive of that at first, but now I'm feeling really badly for this kid. I think it was her reaction to protect herself when she was hit with the reality of the situation.


He seems like he could end up being toxic to her in this situation. IMO her best bet is to shut him out. If he will attempt to make her feel guilty it's only going to make things worse for your daughter. 
He is in a hospital having a breakdown. That is not a stable and suitable person for your daughter to be around right now. They will take care of him there, that kind of breakdown over something like this does not happen without underlying issues or trying to manipulate a person. Either way just respect her desire for no contact and help enforce it if he attempts to break it. 

Your daughter is mature enough to understand that he will not be a good person to co-parent with. Congrats because this is wise beyond many teenager's years. You must be a great role model for her to understand that. Teens make mistakes but good support and role models will get them through.


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## nikoled

Here's a little more info...

I am the child of a teen mom. My daughter has always known that I had a challenging childhood because of it. She sees her "grandpa" (my bio-dad) and how he never amounted to anything. Lives with his elderly mom still and never did anything with his life (we don't really have a relationship, but we see him when we visit my grandmother). I have a great mom, but it was hard. I remember. We were all very lucky that she eventually married my wonderful step father who raised us like his own and had the financial means to support us. 

My last pregnancy was very bad and its the only one she can remember. It is what she knows about pregnancy. She was 5 when I had her sister and I almost died- was horribly sick the entire 9 months. I think this terrifies her. I know every pregnancy is different, but I also know what I had runs in families and there is a chance she will have the same issues. I have not told her that at this point.

I too always thought if one of my children became pregnant or got someone else pregnant that they would have the baby and we would all just be fine. That still is a possibility. Abortion is never something I thought would even be contemplated very honestly. We can handle a baby- we have the means, she can still go to school, we love children, etc. My daughter has always wanted to be a mom. I think had this boy been someone that I wasn't so uncomfortable with I'd be more accepting of having the baby. But he is a mess. And honesly I'm fearful of what we don't know about him. I think my daughter is too now that the fantasy bubble has burst. What I do know is that he has been in the foster care system almost his entire life. He has suffered tremendous loss in his life- his parents, siblings, he was adopted once, but the parents both died (I verified this story with newspapers because it sounded so crazy that this kid would have so much loss). His older brother is a drug dealer and has tried to drag him into it by threatening his younger sister- he resisted, but only after my daughter found out and basically turned him into his foster mom. He has been threatened by gangs. He was molested by an aunt that had custody of him for a while. And I believe his foster mom told me that he is bipolar. We live in an upper middle class suburb where this life is something I know NOTHING about and neither does my daughter. She was drawn to him initially because he needed a friend. She was a good friend to him and became his confidant. He was crazy about her and started buying her nice presents and really treated her well and he is a fun person. But he also is a manipulator. He has learned to be in foster care- it is his protection device- he's smooth. He is super polite and always says the right thing. I don't think he means harm by it, but it does help him to get his way. I"m not saying my daughter is not responsible for her actions, but I definitely think there was some manipulating going on. 

I think if he was a "normal" boy I would be so much more supportive of keeping this baby, but honestly I am scared for her to have ties to him forever. I'm scared for him too. He needs the chance to build a life for himself. He has so many people trying to get him there right now- has been accepted to college, is getting all a's and b's, is learning to drive, etc. I never thought abortion would be a good option for one of my children, but in this case it is seeming like the better choice.


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## tech-novelist

I see someone else has mentioned adoption. Have you considered that option?


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## Pluto2

I am in favor of supporting your DD's decision. It is her life, and her body. While others here have expressed their belief that an abortion will cause long term harm, having a pregnancy at a young age does equal amounts of harm. From what you've shared it does not appear that the guy could provide any kind of stable co-parenting environment. So I would advise that you allow your DD to meet with the MD at the local clinic and see how she feels.

Every situation is different. But the choice is hers and hers alone.


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## nikoled

SecondTime'Round said:


> I'm sorry this has happened in your family . How far along is she?


I haven't asked for exactly when this happened but based upon last period, etc. it would have had to have been at the very beginning of November. So according to calculators around 5 weeks - very early.


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## nikoled

technovelist said:


> I see someone else has mentioned adoption. Have you considered that option?


If she chooses to have the baby she will keep it and that would be fine- we would be supportive. I think adoption would be harder on her than abortion quite honestly. Although I do think it is a great thing for some. We have several adoptees on our immediate family so we are close to that situation and have seen it up close.


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## Pluto2

If she keeps the baby, she keeps the BF. He will be part of her life, make sure she is aware of that factor.


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## SecondTime'Round

nikoled said:


> If she chooses to have the baby she will keep it and that would be fine- we would be supportive. I think adoption would be harder on her than abortion quite honestly. Although I do think it is a great thing for some. We have several adoptees on our immediate family so we are close to that situation and have seen it up close.


The father also would have to sign off on the adoption, right? That could end up being a huge fight if she chose that.

Your daughter is a lucky girl to have such a great and supportive mom.

If watching Teen Mom (don't judge lol) has taught me anything it's that most boys do not want to stick around and be a good dad and only do so because the moms push them to do so. Chances are she might even be able to get this boy to sign over his rights completely, and if not, it sounds like she could get sole custody.


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## SlowlyGoingCrazy

If the Dad is pressuring her to not have the abortion or wanting her to stay with him, I doubt getting him to give up rights will be that easy. Typically the courts don't like doing that anyway unless there is someone else willing to step in AND the bio-father has been out of the picture for a long time. 
She will likely have to deal with splitting custody with this guy, who is not stable, for the next 18 years. She will need to notify him of moves, of changes in her income, all choices she makes with the child will be shared with him, he will be in her life as she tries to date and marry. 

If anything can be learned here on TAM it's be careful who you have children with.


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## WorkingOnMe

nikoled said:


> Were you involved with the decision as a boy in a relationship? My daughter has totally shut this boy out. I was supportive of that at first, but now I'm feeling really badly for this kid. I think it was her reaction to protect herself when she was hit with the reality of the situation.



Yes I was.


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## nikoled

Pluto2 said:


> If she keeps the baby, she keeps the BF. He will be part of her life, make sure she is aware of that factor.


Yes, I think this is what she realized when she was hit with reality. She really cares about this boy. But she knows he is not good for her and has just so many issues. I think that is why she dropped him right away when she found out even though she was gaga over him the week before. But poor boy has been through so much trauma that I don't think it hit him the same way. I think to him it looked kind of like a positive where to her it definitely did not.


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## nikoled

I"m meeting with his foster mom tonight. Even that is complicated. She is the principal at my daughter's school. She adores my daughter and my daughter adores her. She never had children and is just a little older than I am. She has spent tons of time with my child over the past 2 months and really knows her, but I"m sure her loyalty is to the boy as she is raising him- she has had him for about 18 months. She is a good person. She is doing the best she knows how to do. She asked to meet with me so we could just talk. He will still be in the stress center. I'm not going to tell my daughter we are meeting until after we do I think. 

When the pregnancy was confirmed she immediately dumped him and we requested no contact for now. Foster mom knew this and took his phone so that he wouldn't call her. He went out and somehow got another phone and did call her and they talked for 2 hours. I checked our phone bill the next day and saw it and asked my child about it- she admitted it right away and said he was begging her not to break up with him. The next day he was trying to facetime her all day and my daughter was upset by it- she was trying to ignore him. I finally texted Foster mom and requested that she ask him to stop facetiming as my daughter needed sleep- she was exhausted. She went and confronted him on how he had a new phone and he took off running and threw the phone away- making me a bit suspicious about I don't even know what. The next morning, yesterday, she admitted him into the stress center. I think he was suicidal, but not sure. My daughter asked me last night to text the mom and just check up on him. I did not tell her he is in the stress center. I was asked not to. So we are meeting tonight to catch up. I want to do what I can to make this as easy for this boy as it can be, but I am really struggling with this. My daughter misses him, but knows he is bad for her and wants to just close that door. He needs closure. Not sure how to help him and help her. Ugh.


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## Cosmos

nikoled said:


> Yes, this scares me. I've been careful of my words from the second she told me as I know how big this is and how this needs to be her decision for her own mental healh. I also think I probably should look for some counseling for her.


Counselling is a good idea. Your daughter needs to be made aware of all her options and the responsibilities that will come with any choice she makes.

As harsh as it might sound, unless the young man is in a position to help financially support and co-parent the child, what he wants / doesn't want can't be a consideration right now - although counselling might be a good idea.


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## larry.gray

Anon Pink said:


> If your daughter wants an abortion get it done. While it's not at all an easy thing to go through for anyone, I know several women who had abortions in the young single days and none of them claim to regret it in the slightest.


I think that many people get wound up in their own political views and either dismiss that there are some women who aren't bother in the least as your friends were and then there are others that think no women will be bothered. 

The reality is that some are incredibly troubled by it and others who are not. I suspect the biggest factor is how supported they are.


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## Pluto2

larry.gray said:


> I think that many people get wound up in their own political views and either dismiss that there are some women who aren't bother in the least as your friends were and then there are others that think no women will be bothered.
> 
> The reality is that some are incredibly troubled by it and others who are not. I suspect the biggest factor is how supported they are.


Nik's daughter will never suffer from a lack of support in her decision.


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## WorkingOnMe

Pluto2 said:


> Nik's daughter will never suffer from a lack of support in her decision.


From what I've seen at my kid's high school, you really can't predict how this boy will react once it's too late and he's been completely shut out of the process. Without his buy in, who knows what he'll do or say to their friends. Are they going to be at the same school after her abortion? Who will their friends side with? Support from parents is great, but at this age support from friends means just as much.


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## Anon Pink

My heart breaks for this boy. He sees this baby as his only family. He sees this abortion as the same as the way his family rejected him. My heart really breaks for this boy. 

But the decision your daughter makes has to be one that she wants because it's the decision she is most confident regarding her further. Whether that confidence is that being a single parent is doable or about not wanting to by pass her plans for her life, the choice is hers.

I'm so sorry this is heartbreaking all around. I'm so thankful I've never (knock wood still have a 16 year old) had to deal with this. Makes you realize that as distasteful as it is putting your sweet innocent daughter on birth control, facing something like this is much much worse.


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## nikoled

WorkingOnMe said:


> From what I've seen at my kid's high school, you really can't predict how this boy will react once it's too late and he's been completely shut out of the process. Without his buy in, who knows what he'll do or say to their friends. Are they going to be at the same school after her abortion? Who will their friends side with? Support from parents is great, but at this age support from friends means just as much.


Those are good points. From my daughter's point of view the only people at her school that know are her, her best friend, and of course her principal. I know there are most likely others. I"m sure that Principal/Foster mom has had to tell someone as she has had to take off work to deal with boy in stress center. 

As for the boy, however, he was expelled in September and no longer attends this school. That being said, his foster mom is the principal. He is sometimes at the school after he gets out of his charter school that he attends- not often, but occasionally. He doesn't keep in touch with too many people, but there are a few. 

We did talk about rumors and that she can say whatever feels comfortable with if something like that comes up. We've also discussed telling people- I want her to have all of the support she needs, but it is also one of those situations that once you tell someone you cannot untell them. So I told her to be choosey and really think about whether or not she wants people to know. Although she has several close friends, right now she is choosing to just tell one- the one she is closest to and is a grade ahead of the other friends so they don't all hang together or anything. She has asked that we not tell her siblings, grandparents, etc. So we are abiding by that at this point. Her dad and I know and we each told one friend- we needed some support and my best friend is her doctor so she has been invaluable. 

I do get what you are saying though.


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## richie33

The boy didn't even get a chance to react, daughter just cut him off. That will leave a mark on both their lives.


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## CuddleBug

We all have moral free will and choice.

Abortion or keep the child.

Being 17 and pregnant is got to be scary and I feel for you. Wow.

My wife was on birth control day one we got married and waited 6 months before going all the way to be sure. Before that we only had oral sex.

We've only had one close call that made us freak out. Her period was late, no blood but cramps......So I got an early pregnancy kit and she did two tests. One when she got home and one first thing in the morning. Both results were negative.

We figured since she is 37, could be early menopause, stress, her body is used to the same birth control and it minimizes her flows to almost nothing at times. So we learned all that and its normal even though we thought we were pregnant.

If she chooses an abortion, there are consequences. If she keeps the child, there are consequences.

It's up to her really. All you can do is support her through this tough time.

If she has the abortion, there will be emotional scars.......and regrets.

If she keeps the child, she will grow up fast. They both get married, he works, she works, and start their lives together. When their child is 19 and out of the house, she'll only be 36? That's very young still.

Maybe getting pregnant is a blessing in disguise?


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## nikoled

Anon Pink said:


> My heart breaks for this boy. He sees this baby as his only family. He sees this abortion as the same as the way his family rejected him. My heart really breaks for this boy.
> 
> But the decision your daughter makes has to be one that she wants because it's the decision she is most confident regarding her further. Whether that confidence is that being a single parent is doable or about not wanting to by pass her plans for her life, the choice is hers.
> 
> I'm so sorry this is heartbreaking all around. I'm so thankful I've never (knock wood still have a 16 year old) had to deal with this. Makes you realize that as distasteful as it is putting your sweet innocent daughter on birth control, facing something like this is much much worse.


I know- I was so wrapped up in dealing with her that I didn't really consider him until yesterday- it had only been a day and a half. And then I started to feel really sad for him. He has had so much loss and this is heartbreaking for him. I get that. He asked his mom if he could call me and just tell me he was sorry :crying:

I am meeting with her tonight and wondering if there is a way to make it easier for this boy. I don't know if this was his intention or just a stupid mistake. My initial thought is what kind of boy doesn't use a condom??? That's just so basic. He walked to the store to get her pregnancy test- if he can do that he can walk to the store to get condoms. But then again it happened and although she claims there was a lot of pressure from him, it was not forced so she is partly responsible for that poor choice.

This is my daughter's first real boyfriend. I honestly was considering having a birth control talk with her soon, but they had only been together a little over a month when this happened. That seems crazy to me! They don't go to school together so they don't see each other everyday. Neither can drive yet so they aren't going anywhere. Anytime they've gone somewhere it has been in a group. If they were at our house or his there was ALWAYS an adult present. I just did not think it was a possibility given all of those circumstances. Not yet. They were never home alone or out alone. 

I haven't dicussed this with her yet, but I know she needs to be tested for STD's too. This boy was molested multiple times as a young teenager. I am positive this was not his first rodeo too. That is scary. We definitely will be having a talk when this is all said and done about future sexual partners and experiences- how you must plan ahead and consider and ask about things like STD tests, etc. But I want to get her through this initial crisis first. We did send our oldest child, a son, off to college with condoms. I know he wasn't sexually active when he left, but he has had 2 serious girlfriends since he has been to college and I'm pretty certain he is no. We are fully aware it can and does happen- Just wasn't quite there yet unfortunately.


----------



## nikoled

richie33 said:


> The boy didn't even get a chance to react, daughter just cut him off. That will leave a mark on both their lives.


Yes, I realized yesterday that maybe that wasn't the kindest thing to do...I feel like he is going to need some closure. I feel really badly about that. My daughter pushed him away and I went all mama bear and asked that foster mom help us by giving her some space for now. My child has a HUGE support system, a great family, lots of friends, great grades, etc. I feel like she will be ok. But am now feeling badly that this kid has not much and the most important person in his life left him very suddenly. I'm hoping we can find a way to help him without compromising her.


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## sixty-eight

Anon Pink said:


> My heart breaks for this boy. He sees this baby as his only family. He sees this abortion as the same as the way his family rejected him. My heart really breaks for this boy.
> 
> But the decision your daughter makes has to be one that she wants because it's the decision she is most confident regarding her further. Whether that confidence is that being a single parent is doable or about not wanting to by pass her plans for her life, the choice is hers.
> 
> I'm so sorry this is heartbreaking all around. I'm so thankful I've never (knock wood still have a 16 year old) had to deal with this. Makes you realize that as distasteful as it is putting your sweet innocent daughter on birth control, facing something like this is much much worse.


My heart doesn't break for him. I get a weird gut feeling that he manipulated her into getting pregnant on purpose to create the perfect family that he doesn't have. The kind of person that pokes holes in condoms.

I was hesitant to post that at first, because i'm having a hard time determining if the thought could be a genuine prospect or if it's simply rooted in my own prior experiences. I'm still not sure.


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## nikoled

sixty-eight said:


> My heart doesn't break for him. I get a weird gut feeling that he manipulated her into getting pregnant on purpose to create the perfect family that he doesn't have. The kind of person that pokes holes in condoms.
> 
> I was hesitant to post that at first, because i'm having a hard time determining if the thought could be a genuine prospect or if it's simply rooted in my own prior experiences. I'm still not sure.


And that situation has definitely crossed my mind. 

My daughter has told me that he is a good manipulator. I think it was a coping skill he learned in foster care. He is easy to like. He is smooth. She does feel like she was manipulated into having sex with him- I can't be sure that is the case and of course it still is partly her fault, but I can see that it is a possibility.


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## richardsharpe

Good evening
I think a fair number of kids engage in unsafe sex, some get pregnant. Its very unfortunate, but understandable. 

Unless she has moral / religious objections, I think an abortion will be the best solution for her and for the boy. Having a child when you are young can make life extremely difficult in ways in which she might never recover. Also it is a terrible thing to be an unwanted child - even if you parents do their best to love you.

I know abortion is fraught with moral / religious issues, and reasonable people will strongly disagree.

In the end I believe it is her body and her choice. As parents the best you can do is to support her decision.

BTW - double check the laws in your area. If she is 17 and he is 18 be sure that isn't statutory rape. Unless there was some coercion, the boy shouldn't suffer for their mutual mistake.


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## sixty-eight

nikoled said:


> And that situation has definitely crossed my mind.
> 
> My daughter has told me that he is a good manipulator. I think it was a coping skill he learned in foster care. He is easy to like. He is smooth. She does feel like she was manipulated into having sex with him- I can't be sure that is the case and of course it still is partly her fault, but I can see that it is a possibility.


to me, the factors that determine it as a possibility are:

If attachment issues are present, foster care can exacerbate them
smooth talker/manipulator
potential love bombing/ relationship became serious quickly

It doesn't have to be true, but...


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## EnigmaGirl

There are no options that won't come with consequences at this point.

She has to decide which of those consequences make the most logical sense for where she is in life. I worked in a girl's group home for years and there isn't any easy decision at this point. Her choice needs to be dependent on her own internal sense of direction...not someone else's and you need to explain to her that she's going to be dealing with that decision for the rest of her life...its not going to be simple and over.

My advice is to give her all the information you can. Tell her whatever decision she makes, you'll support her and if she is leaning towards making the decision to have the child...she needs the facts about what that means...to her personal life, to her financial life...and she needs immediate parenting classes. Young people often just aren't fully prepared mentally for the patience and sacrifices it takes to raise a child.

I'm sorry you're dealing with this. Whatever your daughter does is the right choice for her as long as she's making an informed choice.

If its any help, I married far too early and had my oldest daughter 4 months before my 20th birthday. I had to delay finishing my 3rd year of university for a semester which was really depressing at the time but was determined to go right back to school and did. I worked, went to school and raised my child. There are great resources out there for mom's attending school and working and I utilized those and my family helped where they could. I finished school, then went to graduate school and started a great career. My daughter today is in graduate school herself and is a wonderful, clever, strong young woman who I'm very, very proud of. It was very tough at the beginning but the challenge also helped to make me into the person I am today.


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## kristin2349

nikoled said:


> Yes, I realized yesterday that maybe that wasn't the kindest thing to do...I feel like he is going to need some closure. I feel really badly about that. My daughter pushed him away and I went all mama bear and asked that foster mom help us by giving her some space for now. My child has a HUGE support system, a great family, lots of friends, great grades, etc. I feel like she will be ok. But am now feeling badly that this kid has not much and the most important person in his life left him very suddenly. I'm hoping we can find a way to help him without compromising her.



Ugh Nikoled, I'm so sorry you and your family are going through this. I don't have the answers. I have never had to make a choice like this for myself and I don't have kids. I have had several friends have abortions when I was a teen and in college and am still friends with several of them and they all felt they made the right decision at the time. Those that I have spoken to about it after the fact anyway. My best friend got pregnant at 17 and kept the child and her life has been difficult, she has never married and never got to go to college.

As far as the boy goes your daughter has to do what is right for her, end of story. If I were in your shoes and she wanted to proceed with the abortion I would consider telling the boy that she had a miscarriage. I normally don't condone lying, but I think it would help him deal with it better in the end. 

As for word of this getting out in school, she should tell no one if she truly wants it kept a secret. But if word gets out, teenagers have fairly short memories when it comes to drama, they tend to like it fresh. No matter what she decides it will soon be yesterday's news.

My thoughts and prayers are with you and your daughter as you make this difficult decision.


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## EnigmaGirl

> My child has a HUGE support system, a great family, lots of friends, great grades, etc. I feel like she will be ok.


I think you're right. This is the number one indicator that she'll be ok. One thing you may want to ensure is that family members work hard not to shame her or make her feel guilty for her sexual choices. She'll be dealing with enough personal guilt on her own.



> But am now feeling badly that this kid has not much and the most important person in his life left him very suddenly. I'm hoping we can find a way to help him without compromising her.


This is very kind. The only thing I should caution you on is that my husband and I have one kid who always seems to pick up "strays." He married one of them and got divorced a year later, she was just too damaged and was very conflict-driven. It was a really big learning experience for him. Its very noble to want to save someone but it doesn't work if they aren't prepared to do the work to save themselves.

If he purposely got your daughter pregnant, I'd be concerned that he's got issues that are deeper than you can help him with.


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## MarriedDude

NobodySpecial said:


> Studies do not back this up. This is a myth.


I have no view one way or the other on abortion that i would want to discuss other than -I believe that the father should have input -HOWEVER -the mother has by far the largest stake in a pregnancy in term of her body and her future life therefore it should, in the end, be the woman's decision.....that being said.

Are you seriously stating that there are No/Zero/Nada studies that will back up the idea that her future feelings about this issue are unknown and this young woman may regret her decision to abort the pregnancy at some future date? Or are you saying that future regret of past actions is a myth? 

There is no telling how this young woman will feel about this 20 years from now. As young as she is -I feel badly for her (and all involved) that it falls to her at this young age to make a very difficult decision, for which there is no remedy once made if she changes her mind. 

I think OP is doing all she possibly can by supporting her daughter in whatever decision she makes.


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## Pluto2

Let's not turn this into a debate on abortion. It is not our decision.


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## Cosmos

larry.gray said:


> I think that many people get wound up in their own political views and either dismiss that there are some women who aren't bother in the least as your friends were and then there are others that think no women will be bothered.
> 
> The reality is that some are incredibly troubled by it and others who are not. I suspect the biggest factor is how supported they are.


Support is essential... My niece told me that all she got was a slap across the face from her mother when she broke down in the cab on the way home from the abortion clinic. So damaging...

It sounds like the OP will help her daughter make the best decision for her and her unborn child. IMO, it's up to the boy's foster parents to help and support him through all this. The OP, her H and daughter have enough on their plates right now.


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## Liten

I also feel bad for the boy, this without knowing anything about him other than what has been written here.

I cannot offer much advice about abortion, not because I don't have views on it but because I am a bit afraid that my views will be regarded as "weird". Sorry, English is not my first language.

I can however maybe help you with some input about the boy. It seems like he never had the good influence of a father or a male role model. By that I mean what a father is really supposed be like. I understand that the principal means well but trying to raise a male teenager to be a man and behave as one will be difficult at best as a woman and close to impossible at most times. Given this boy's circumstances with being in foster care I don't give the principal much of a chance. It is at least good to read that he can be polite and has someone that cares for him. I am not trying to be sexist or anything, I am sure there are single mothers raising young men who will be very good fathers.

I will give you a short story from my life to explain why I wrote the above. My BIL came from an abusive home. When his father wasn't happy for any reason he and his brothers got a punch in the face. When they were old enough to punch back, they did. That was their view of what a father was like and behaved. My BIL met my sister at a teenage age. My father being what he was, fair, loving, decisive, had boundaries of what to tolerate etc was not what my BIL was used to. When my father forbid my sister to do something he expected to be obeyed. This did not agree with my BIL and he tried to handle my father the about the same way he handled his. No punches thrown but my father let my BIL know it was his rules.

My BIL has told me that if is wasn't for my father he would never have known how to behave as a man and as a father. As time went on they got along better and better. My BIL never shed a tear when his father died, but cried his eyes out when mine did. The point is that people can change, when faced with challenges and when circumstance change. The boy in your and your daughter's life can change too, but that will take more work.

You sound like a good person and mother, I am sure that whatever decision you do it will be right. Again, I am sorry if anything I wrote comes out sounding strange, English is not my first language.


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## ExiledBayStater

If your 17-year-old daughter wants an abortion, she gets one. Where I live, a 17 year old wouldn't even need parental permission. I admire that you have the empathy to think of the boy. However, he's not going to be there to support your daughter through the pregnancy and infancy. Hopefully your husband treated you like royalty when you were pregnant. Who would be there to do that for your daughter? 

Then there's the matter that your daughter will be right in the middle of school. I imagine your daughter would give birth some time in late July or August. She wouldn't have very long to recover. 

She should think long and hard so she is calm and sure of her decision once she is at the clinic. She should also find out exactly when in the procedure is the point of no return, and ask about sedation. Even when she's at the clinic, she can still walk away...until she can't.

Nature can be so cruel. Fertility peaks at a point when most modern Westerners definitely should not be having kids.


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## MJJEAN

I helped my younger sister through an abortion when she was 16. Twice. And I've been there for friends abortions, too.

If you are still at the appointment setting stage, I highly recommend you opt to have your DD put into twilight sleep, which is somewhere between conscious and out. The procedure is somewhat painful...discomfort my foot!...and really gross to see and hear. I don't want to be too graphic, so trust me. The women I've been there for seemed to handle it better when they weren't fully aware of the actual dilation and removal.

Post procedure you'll want a large stash of pads because she will be bleeding for up to two weeks and cannot use tampons. You'll also want foods like soups and jello for your DD to eat for a day or two as her tummy might be really upset. Also, if the clinic doesn't prescribe anything, get her some otc pain meds like Motrin or Aleve. She'll be sore and she'll cramp.

If it helps, my mother had an abortion before me and then had 4 kids. My sister had two abortions and is now the mother of 6. My mom was haunted by her choice until the day she died. My sister has been just fine . 

Be VERY careful who knows. With social media, news spreads FAST. Theoretically, everyone could know within a day. There is also a chance the bf could blab and add the "she's the evil wh0re who killed my child" spin on it. Might want to be prepared for the worst just in case. Teenagers can be so brutal.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## NobodySpecial

MarriedDude said:


> Are you seriously stating that there are No/Zero/Nada studies that will back up the idea that her future feelings about this issue are unknown and this young woman may regret her decision to abort the pregnancy at some future date? Or are you saying that future regret of past actions is a myth?


I was replying to this:

"All I can say is that an abortion will affect her in ways she can't fathom until it's too late."

You are welcome to look for your own studies. But what I have read indicates that the majority suffer no ill effects.


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## JohnA

Thank you for your post MJJean. It expressed a lot of my thpughts and helps to dispell they are all heartless baby killers. 

Where their underlying issues of why your sister had two abortions at 16? If so did the clinic offer any info as to possible issues and where to seek up.


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## EnigmaGirl

> You are welcome to look for your own studies. But what I have read indicates that the majority suffer no ill effects.


In my opinion, there may be negative effects from every choice.

Abortion may come with bad feelings.

Choosing to keep the child comes with a lot of potential issues. Its expensive and you need babysitters constantly to help you through at that age and you don't usually don't have parenting skills and patience. 

I'm the mother of two and although I adore my children, there were days when they were collicky newborns or covered in explosive bowel movements (exactly how did that get in your hair?) or hiding report cards...that were rough and I thought about how much easier and cheaper life would have been without children. 

Adoption comes with a boatload of issues too...especially since you have to stay pregnant and give birth which affects school and work. Plus I'd imagine you spend a lot of time wondering if you did the right thing and if the child is being raised well.

There's only one "right" and that's when a woman only gets pregnant when she wants to give birth and raise a child. Every other decision is a personal choice made by a woman who uses the current data she has to make the best logical and emotional choice FOR HER. 

The parents' role in that is simply exactly what this OP is doing. Support her, don't guilt her out or add to her sense of self-disappointment and get her all the information she needs to make an informed choice. And most of all, to support whatever comes after she makes the decision. 

Adult behavior unfortunately comes with adult consequences and this young woman has to make this decision on her own.


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## BetrayedDad

Abort mission... I repeat ABORT.

These two people are INCAPABLE of raising a child.

At least your daughter is smart enough to realize she's not able.

This world is filled with enough broken and fvcked up people.


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## pidge70

My oldest daughter got pregnant at 16. I told her when I found out that adoption and abortion weren't options for her. She was grown up enough to have sex, she was grown up enough to deal with the consequences. She graduated HS and graduated with top honors from college. She is now 26, and my grandson is 9. Her and her bf are still together.

Obviously you have to do what is right for your family. I hope your daughter will be okay with her decision. When I got pregnant at 18, I thought about abortion. I just couldn't do it. While I can understand your wanting to respect your daughter's decision, I personally couldn't do it. 

As for the boy, I feel truly sorry for him. I will never understand how the father of a child has no say in what happens. It takes two to make a baby, and he should have every right to be a part of what happens.


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## EnigmaGirl

> My oldest daughter got pregnant at 16. I told her when I found out that adoption and abortion weren't options for her. She was grown up enough to have sex, she was grown up enough to deal with the consequences. She graduated HS and graduated with top honors from college. She is now 26, and my grandson is 9. Her and her bf are still together.


I think adult behavior is allowing her to make the choice by herself and not be forced into a decision based on someone else's moral code. I have daughters and there's no way I'd force them into my way of thinking on this issue if they became pregnant. They do have to live with the consequences and they deserve the right to make the decision their own. I respect my kids rights and I know I raised them with the ability to make their own choices.



> Obviously you have to do what is right for your family. I hope your daughter will be okay with her decision. When I got pregnant at 18, I thought about abortion. I just couldn't do it. While I can understand your wanting to respect your daughter's decision, I personally couldn't do it.


OP, this is what I mean by "guilting." Please don't say stuff like this to your daughter or let others do it while she's trying to work through this. This is the type of language that can cause long-term damage later.



> As for the boy, I feel truly sorry for him. I will never understand how the father of a child has no say in what happens. It takes two to make a baby, and he should have every right to be a part of what happens.


The male's decision making power ends when their biological contribution ends. Women have longer decision periods simply because they're the ones who have to be pregnant and give birth. He's not doing that...she is. 

She certainly can choose to consider what he has to say but ultimately it is not his decision to make...its hers.


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## pidge70

EnigmaGirl said:


> I think adult behavior is allowing her to make the choice by herself and not be forced into a decision based on someone else's moral code. I have daughters and there's no way I'd force them into my way of thinking on this issue if they became pregnant. They do have to live with the consequences and they deserve the right to make the decision their own. I respect my kids rights and I know I raised them with the ability to make their own choices.
> 
> 
> 
> OP, this is what I mean by "guilting." Please don't say stuff like this to your daughter or let others do it while she's trying to work through this. This is the type of language that can cause long-term damage later.
> 
> 
> 
> The male's decision making power ends when their biological contribution ends. Women have longer decision periods simply because they're the ones who have to be pregnant and give birth. He's not doing that...she is.
> 
> She certainly can choose to consider what he has to say but ultimately it is not his decision to make...its hers.


Oooops, you caught me. I am a horrible mother. I wasn't trying to force my way onto the OP. I was just stating what I did. I get that people, (you) won't agree with my actions. That's perfectly fine with me. I am vehemently anti abortion, but I obviously realize people are allowed to make their own decisions. I also don't get where I used any "guilt shaming." 

I think someone inferred a little too much.


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## NobodySpecial

EnigmaGirl said:


> In my opinion, there may be negative effects from every choice.
> 
> Abortion may come with bad feelings.


Of course. All of life's decisions can. I was disagreeing with the prevalent notion that abortion, by its nature, leaves lifelong, horrible scars.

I agree with everything else.


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## NobodySpecial

pidge70 said:


> My oldest daughter got pregnant at 16. I told her when I found out that adoption and abortion weren't options for her. She was grown up enough to have sex, she was grown up enough to deal with the consequences.


How is abortion or adoption not dealing with the consequences?


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## sapientia

Pluto2 said:


> Let's not turn this into a debate on abortion. It is not our decision.


Agreed^. The only one that will have to live with the consequences of the decision is her and her family.

@OP - support your daughter, whatever her decision.

I will say that the world is not a kind place for young, single mothers. Some have raised children young, without support and made it, but no bones about how absolutely difficult it will be for her, even with your support.

Personally (again, not my decision), I think there are plenty of children being born into this world without adequate support and resources. Your daughter need not feel guilty about not bringing another one into the world at this time. If she were my daughter, I would be counselling her to learn from this experience and work VERY hard to improve her situation in life (college, good job) so that when she does DECIDE to have children, she can give them the best life experience she can.

Remember:
Quality of life >>> Quantity.

FWIW.

Good luck to your family,
- Sapi


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## ExiledBayStater

NobodySpecial said:


> How is abortion or adoption not dealing with the consequences?


If you replace "deal with the consequences" with "raise the baby" the sentence is easier to understand.


----------



## NobodySpecial

ExiledBayStater said:


> If you replace "deal with the consequences" with "raise the baby" the sentence is easier to understand.


I am not sure what your point is. Raising the baby is what... punishment? In this day and age, pregnancy is met with choices. Adults make choices.


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## ExiledBayStater

NobodySpecial said:


> I am not sure what your point is. Raising the baby is what... punishment? In this day and age, pregnancy is met with choices. Adults make choices.


I agree with you and I wasn't trying to make an argument. I was just explaining something, since I don't think the poster is coming back to respond.


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## SlowlyGoingCrazy

I for one am glad my son was a choice and not a consequence. It's something that has changed the entire course of my life from that point on and because you are a teen, you are starting that life at a deficit. With statistics against you, for you and your child. Grandparents, friends, family, they don't live it, it's not their life and it shouldn't be their choice. 
No one should be deciding what to do other than the mother herself.

OP- you sound like an amazing and supportive Mother. Whatever your daughter chooses she will have that advantage on her side.


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## MJJEAN

JohnA said:


> Thank you for your post MJJean. It expressed a lot of my thpughts and helps to dispell they are all heartless baby killers.
> 
> Where their underlying issues of why your sister had two abortions at 16? If so did the clinic offer any info as to possible issues and where to seek up.


My sister was using condoms sporadically and got pregnant because she wasn't consistent with condom use. 

After the abortion, she was given the Pill. The clinic staff were very pro birth control beginning immediately after the procedure. She got pregnant about 6 months after the abortion because she flaked out on taking her birth control pills properly.

The second clinic recommended the shot. She had some serious side effects from the shot and ended up pregnant again at 17. She had twin girls just after her 18th birthday. Two years later, she had her 3rd daughter. Then, 6 years after that, she married and had the other three girls.

In her mid 20's, she started having "female problems" that worsened over time. When she was 30, she was diagnosed with PCOS. Turns out, it runs in our family. She had severe menstrual issues, it was extremely painful for her to have sex with her DH, and she had cysts. So, a hysterectomy was performed. She's actually very glad she had the girls when she did.



pidge70 said:


> As for the boy, I feel truly sorry for him. I will never understand how the father of a child has no say in what happens. It takes two to make a baby, and he should have every right to be a part of what happens.


Biology dictates who gestates the young. Fair or not, the reality is the male makes his decision when he has sex with a female. He knows that if he impregnates her, she will decide what will become of the child. 

So, basically, this boy had his "say" when he chose to have unprotected sex with a girl who may or may not decide to terminate.


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## Therealbrighteyes

If I may weigh in here, I got pregnant at 17 and had an abortion. It was my decision and I don't regret it at all. I also got pregnant at 20 and now have a wonderful 22 year old son. I don't regret that decision in the slightest. The difference between both unplanned pregnancies was who the father was. The first was an abusive, manipulative person who would have made a terrible father. The second was with a kind and compassionate man who I knew would be a wonderful father, regardless if our relationship lasted. It has. 

This is your daughter's decision, nobody elses. It is her body and her health being risked here, not the boy's, not yours, only hers. Support whatever decision she makes. 17 and pregnant is _terrifying_, especially when people are questioning her decisions. 

Lastly, you daughter didn't do anything "wrong". She had sex. Teenagers do that and sometimes pregnancy happens even with the best birth control. She is still a "really good kid" and going through the worst time of her life. Hug her for me. She needs it.


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## dignityhonorpride

Just want to chime in here. I had an abortion at age 19. Yes, it's awful that it had to happen (BC failed), but I never experienced depression. In fact, today, I know that there is no way - at all - that I'd be where I am today if I'd had a baby at 19. 

Sent from my VS986 using Tapatalk


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## SecondTime'Round

How did the meeting with the principal/foster mom go last night?


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## *LittleDeer*

I can give you some first hand advice here. I fell pregnant at 16 and had baby at 17. I had baby girl and she's now an adult studying psychology. Things can work out if she chooses to have and keep the baby. 

That said, the decision should be hers and hers alone. If she goes through with the pregnancy her body, life, opportunities and health could be effected. Statistically speaking he's unlikely to be around, whilst he may be, those are just the stats. The emotional and financial costs of sole parenthood are high and it's extremely difficult and they will largely fall on your daughter. 

Also if she chooses to have an abortion that's never an easy thing, but many women who have them don't regret it and feel it was a wise decision. 

I don't like the insinuation that your daughter must somehow be punished because she was being selfish and thinking of herself when she had sex, it's normal and natural to want sex, and she should not have to pay a high price for it. 

Personally I'm glad I had my daughter, but I'm even happier that no one made me have her, I wasn't forced to carry a child I didn't want, because that would have been truly dreadful. It's her body and should be her choice.


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## Omego

pidge70 said:


> I also don't get where I used any "guilt shaming."



FWIW I didn't read your post that way. And I think it's amazing that everything worked out for your daughter. Hope the OP will let us know what happens.


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## BetrayedDad

intheory said:


> And, as mentioned upthread; why IS she attracted to a guy who seems to be a train wreck?


Aren't all girls attracted to the "bad boys?" /end sacrasm

What a shock! He's a horrible provider... I hope step two isn't to find a beta man to help raise the child for her.


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## ExiledBayStater

BetrayedDad said:


> Aren't all girls attracted to the "bad boys?" /end sacrasm
> 
> What a shock! He's a horrible provider... I hope step two isn't to find a beta man to help raise the child for her.


Let's just not go there right now.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## SlowlyGoingCrazy

No judgements betrayed. Women are allowed to sleep with whoever the heck we want to. Not all of them are going to be someone you'd want to raise a child with. There isn't a single thing to indicate this girl is looking for _anyone _to help raise this child with. 

She smartly understands that he isn't someone she wants to co-parent with. I wish every woman had that amount of understanding. I sure didn't at that age. Some girls think they'll have the baby and the guy will suddenly shape up and step up and they'll all be one big happy family. This girl has the maturity to know what is best for her and IMO it's indicative of what a wonderful support system she has at home and in her Mother. 

In the future when any woman is ready to have a child and they do so with a partner that is capable of being a father, it won't be because he's a "beta provider". 
Maybe men who are finding themselves filling ONLY that position should stop complaining about it and fix their picker to find women who see them as more. Maybe they should have the maturity this girl has to know who they should be parenting a child with and who is not a good fit to do so. 


But let's not get into painting women as users. Bad women and bad men are minorities. They do not speak for the whole gender. The vast, vast majority of women are not like that.


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## nikoled

Hi everyone-

Met last night with Mom/Principal. It went well, but is jus so sad. I did find out that boy tried to jump out of a moving car on Sunday night. Unfortunately since the holidays are the busiest times in the stress center there were no beds so mom was forced to call his probation officer and have him put in shelter care to keep him safe until there are beds. I heard more about his childhood and why his coping skills are so poor and it is unbelievably awful the things this kid has gone through. He is a good person, but bad luck and bad choices keep getting him. She's fighting to get him every bit of help possible because he will be 18 soon and then things change...

I guess there are several colleges interested in him for football and he wants to be a firefighter. He has good grades and works hard in school but isn't the brightest and had nothing stable in his life during those formative years so the hope is that he will be ready for college next fall.

She was very respectful of the fact that it's my daughters decision to make and wanted her to know that she still thinks the world of her. I guess she knew before I did and told my daughter on the phone that she had 30 minutes to tell me because she wanted her to just get it done. I'm glad she was there for her.

My daughter keeps asking how boy is doing. Mom told me to tell her that he's fine and that she will take care of him. Mom did tell me that boy feels like he ruins everything and has now destroyed someone else's life. He just wants to be responsible and do what's right and when my daughter immediately dumped him he didn't understand that. So I asked if it would be helpful for us to see him and she thought so. She is going to arrange but now that he's been turned over to probation it is all a little complicated. I asked my daughter last night if she wanted to see him and she does. She's so worried about him- she doesn't say it but I can tell. 

I hope seeing him is the right thing- I think it will be. They needs to make peace with this whole thing. They both know a baby wouldn't be good for them right now- too much stacked against them.

I'll keep you all posted- thanks for the advice.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## nikoled

intheory said:


> It's strange that your daughter could feel so much caring and sympathy for this boy. Feel attracted enough to have sex with him (after one month?). But could instantly "shut him out" as soon as she found out she was pregnant.
> 
> So either she can easily have sex with people she doesn't really care about; which is quite common. Or, it's easy for her to cut people out of her life, when she perceives they will be difficult for her in some way.
> 
> She seems clueless about reproduction and biology. I'm sure she knows the facts. But she doesn't seem to be connected to reality. Sex is designed to lead to babies.
> 
> And, as mentioned upthread; why IS she attracted to a guy who seems to be a train wreck? That's something you could maybe talk with her; and nip in the bud. It's not healthy. Being sympathetic and kind is one thing. She doesn't have boundaries to prevent that becoming sexual. Probably she has a good, upper-middle class life and has been very sheltered. That's great. But, once again, she doesn't seem to be in touch with reality.
> 
> I think it's terrible how fathers get shut out. I think they should have a say. But I don't want to get into the clùštèrfùçk about abortion rights.
> 
> Fwiw, she probably shouldn't have a kid right now. This boy doesn't have both oars in the water (bless him).
> 
> If she has an abortion, I surely hope that she doesn't get demonized on social media. Like someone said upthread, be careful who you tell.
> 
> Your daughter is so, so lucky to have parents like you. She has no idea.
> 
> She sounds a bit too sheltered and protected from how nasty life can get. Maybe this will wise her up.


Here's a bit more backstory- my daughter is a dancer. She spends tons of hours each week at the dance studio. She's also a straight a student in honors classes and a bit of a perfectionist. When she was a freshman she started having panic attacks- too much stress. We told her you don't have to be perfect, can cut down on dance, etc, but she was an exhausted anxious mess so we did what is very common for dancers- put her in online school. This allowed her the opportunity to sleep, train, and do well in school. She also started anxiety meds which have helped a ton. Fast forward 2 years and she is a little older and ready to return to her old high school. So she went back this fall, but didn't know too many people. This boy texted her when he saw she was back and they became fast friends. He needed someone to talk to and she's a good listener. She doesn't have tons of friends at school because she hasn't been there. I was cautious but they were chaperoned all the time by either principal or us. However we were not always in the room with them. She was back at school and happy so I was thankful. She was vulnerable and so was he.

I think she dumped him so fast because she suddenly realized the reality of what was happening and what had happened and it scared her. She hasn't forgotten him and moved on- she asks about him every day so I don't think it's anything that weird, just her coping with the fact that she made some not so great choices and now has time tough consequences.

I think she has learned a lot- so have I. And I'm sure we will continue learning.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## nikoled

I think maybe I should add that I think my daughter really wanted to be just friends with this kid from the get go. She likes him but she's always known he probably isn't good for her. She has tried to break up with him but it's hard when he is always in crisis and she felt like she didn't want to cause him more stress or add to his pain. Which is why when this all happened I told her flat out you need to put YOU first now. And asked foster mom to help by encouraging boy to giver my daughter space.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Cynthia

I'm sorry that your family is in this position. It is difficult, but a baby has already been made. Plans should be made for how to make sure that both your daughter and her child are taken care of, rather than trying to make it all go away. Encouraging her to kill the child will cause more harm than good in the long run. She knows she is carrying a child. That is going to mess with her soul for the rest of her life.
Further there are risks to abortion that are not really discussed. Have you thought about what happens during an abortion? It's pretty horrible.
I encourage you to contact a crisis pregnancy center in your area and find out what options are available to help your daughter. There is no reason why she cannot consider carrying the child to term and finding a loving home. There are many couples that would be wonderful parents who are waiting for a child to love.


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## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Please do not ever go to a crisis pregnancy center. They have been caught outright lying to women about their options, their pregnancy, hiding facts and manipulating women into keeping pregnancies that they do not want. Horrible people. 

If we really want what is best for the woman and her emotions during this time, using words like killing and child and "mess with her soul" are counterproductive and help no one.

ETA http://www.huffingtonpost.com/caitlin-bancroft/crisis-pregnancy-center_b_3763196.html


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## MarriedDude

nikoled said:


> Hi everyone-
> 
> Met last night with Mom/Principal. It went well, but is jus so sad. I did find out that boy tried to jump out of a moving car on Sunday night. Unfortunately since the holidays are the busiest times in the stress center there were no beds so mom was forced to call his probation officer and have him put in shelter care to keep him safe until there are beds. I heard more about his childhood and why his coping skills are so poor and it is unbelievably awful the things this kid has gone through. He is a good person, but bad luck and bad choices keep getting him. She's fighting to get him every bit of help possible because he will be 18 soon and then things change...
> 
> I guess there are several colleges interested in him for football and he wants to be a firefighter. He has good grades and works hard in school but isn't the brightest and had nothing stable in his life during those formative years so the hope is that he will be ready for college next fall.
> 
> She was very respectful of the fact that it's my daughters decision to make and wanted her to know that she still thinks the world of her. I guess she knew before I did and told my daughter on the phone that she had 30 minutes to tell me because she wanted her to just get it done. I'm glad she was there for her.
> 
> My daughter keeps asking how boy is doing. Mom told me to tell her that he's fine and that she will take care of him. Mom did tell me that boy feels like he ruins everything and has now destroyed someone else's life. He just wants to be responsible and do what's right and when my daughter immediately dumped him he didn't understand that. So I asked if it would be helpful for us to see him and she thought so. She is going to arrange but now that he's been turned over to probation it is all a little complicated. I asked my daughter last night if she wanted to see him and she does. She's so worried about him- she doesn't say it but I can tell.
> 
> I hope seeing him is the right thing- I think it will be. They needs to make peace with this whole thing. They both know a baby wouldn't be good for them right now- too much stacked against them.
> 
> I'll keep you all posted- thanks for the advice.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Life tends to throw things at you...it's those moments when you find your strength (or don't) -you are doing great -you found your strength -your daughter will find hers. 

Whatever decision your daughter makes -the world will keep spinning -and people like her (from what you described) drive on regardless.


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## Cosmos

> Posted by Nikoled
> 
> Met last night with Mom/Principal. It went well, but is jus so sad. I did find out that boy tried to jump out of a moving car on Sunday night. Unfortunately since the holidays are the busiest times in the stress center there were no beds so mom was forced to call his probation officer and have him put in shelter care to keep him safe until there are beds. I heard more about his childhood and why his coping skills are so poor and it is unbelievably awful the things this kid has gone through. He is a good person, but bad luck and bad choices keep getting him.





nikoled said:


> I think maybe I should add that I think my daughter really wanted to be just friends with this kid from the get go. She likes him but she's always known he probably isn't good for her. She has tried to break up with him but it's hard when he is always in crisis and she felt like she didn't want to cause him more stress or add to his pain. Which is why when this all happened I told her flat out you need to put YOU first now. And asked foster mom to help by encouraging boy to giver my daughter space.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_



OP, 18 years of co-parenting with this unfortunte young man could prove extremely difficult... Another thing for your daughter to consider should she choose to keep the child.


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## EnigmaGirl

> I'm sorry that your family is in this position. It is difficult, but a baby has already been made. Plans should be made for how to make sure that both your daughter and her child are taken care of, rather than trying to make it all go away. Encouraging her to kill the child will cause more harm than good in the long run. She knows she is carrying a child. That is going to mess with her soul for the rest of her life.
> Further there are risks to abortion that are not really discussed. Have you thought about what happens during an abortion? It's pretty horrible.
> I encourage you to contact a crisis pregnancy center in your area and find out what options are available to help your daughter. There is no reason why she cannot consider carrying the child to term and finding a loving home. There are many couples that would be wonderful parents who are waiting for a child to love.


sigh...

OP, this is why you should be careful at home to keep this private so that you don't run into this type of nonsense when your daughter is trying to make an informed decision.


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## nikoled

CynthiaDe said:


> I'm sorry that your family is in this position. It is difficult, but a baby has already been made. Plans should be made for how to make sure that both your daughter and her child are taken care of, rather than trying to make it all go away. Encouraging her to kill the child will cause more harm than good in the long run. She knows she is carrying a child. That is going to mess with her soul for the rest of her life.
> Further there are risks to abortion that are not really discussed. Have you thought about what happens during an abortion? It's pretty horrible.
> I encourage you to contact a crisis pregnancy center in your area and find out what options are available to help your daughter. There is no reason why she cannot consider carrying the child to term and finding a loving home. There are many couples that would be wonderful parents who are waiting for a child to love.


I really respect you from prior advice you have given me and do respect your point of view. I always thought I leaned toward anti-abortion. But now that I am wearing these shoes my view has changed. 

I will be fully supportive if my daughter wants to have and keep the baby. I am able to babysit while she goes to school. We can absorb the cost. We have the space. My husband and I are young parents and we have the energy and time to help with a young child. So adoption would not be an option for her. But I truly think in our particular case we have to consider abortion. I know to some it is very morally objectional and I get and respect that. Never thought we would be considering it.


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## Pluto2

nikoled said:


> I really respect you from prior advice you have given me and do respect your point of view. I always thought I leaned toward anti-abortion. But now that I am wearing these shoes my view has changed.
> 
> I will be fully supportive if my daughter wants to have and keep the baby. I am able to babysit while she goes to school. We can absorb the cost. We have the space. My husband and I are young parents and we have the energy and time to help with a young child. So adoption would not be an option for her. But I truly think in our particular case we have to consider abortion. I know to some it is very morally objectional and I get and respect that. Never thought we would be considering it.


And thank goodness your daughter has options in making this difficult decision. We are all different and one persons choice is just that, their choice.


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## Cynthia

First, I am not trying to be in your face or to offend you. I understand this is a difficult situation. No doubt about it. The reason I am using the words that I am is because this is the reality of what your daughter will eventually face.



nikoled said:


> I know to some it is very morally objectionable and I get and respect that. Never thought we would be considering it.


This is why it is very likely that your daughter will suffer if she has an abortion. Eventually she will grapple with the reality of killing her child. That is a heavy burden to bear and can have much greater negative consequences than dealing with a baby and the circumstances surrounding this situation will.
She should be aware of exactly what she is doing, because eventually she will and then it will be too late and the pain surrounding that decision could be terrible.
I'm going to step out of this thread, because I don't want to cause any contention. I have followed your story and care about you and wanted to share my concerns that you may not have considered in this highly emotional situation.


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## Pluto2

Its nice to have an opinion.


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## EnigmaGirl

> First, I am not trying to be in your face or to offend you. I understand this is a difficult situation. No doubt about it. The reason I am using the words that I am is because this is the reality of what your daughter will eventually face.





> This is why it is very likely that your daughter will suffer if she has an abortion. Eventually she will grapple with the reality of killing her child. That is a heavy burden to bear and can have much greater negative consequences than dealing with a baby and the circumstances surrounding this situation will.


Who are you to assume that you know how someone will feel or what they will experience? What utter arrogance.

There are myriads of women who have abortions who have no regrets about their decision and there are many mothers who give birth who do have regrets.

You have every right to make whatever decision you choose should you find yourself pregnant but you have ZERO right to tell another person what they should do in their situation with their body and their life. 

I have two daughters and as much as I want grandchildren, I would never be inhuman enough to force my daughter into a decision she didn't want should she find herself in this position. Its so very, very wrong. 

OP, please keep your daughter away from people who have the audacity to insist they absolutely know what she should do. She has the right to decide what is best for her. And as long as she makes an informed choice, she's doing the right thing.



> I know to some it is very morally objectionable and I get and respect that. Never thought we would be considering it.


Other people's moral objections can apply to their own bodies and lives. They have nothing to do with your daughter's rights.


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## SlowlyGoingCrazy

Then let's all help destigmatize abortion so these women don't need to suffer due to other people's moral objections.


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## Pluto2

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> Then let's all help destigmatize abortion so these women don't need to suffer due to other people's moral objections.


I agree 100%, but just not in Nik's thread.

This thread is about a mother trying to support her daughter through a difficult time.


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## Anonymous07

Nikoled, I highly, highly suggest your daughter get into counseling asap *before* she makes a decision one way or the other in regards to this pregnancy. Either choice will have life long consequences and you want to make sure she is confident in her decision, being able to deal with it many years from now. She needs to know all the information and get all of her feelings out in the open to be able to deal with this in a healthy way. 

I worked in a pregnancy clinic while I was in college and have seen both sides, where some did okay with an abortion and some did not. Some did well with parenting and others struggled. It's a very tough choice to make and think about what the future will look like. This is not something for her to take lightly. She seems to really care for this guy, as she did sleep with him, so I do think she still wants to be with him, but she is just scared. This is not how she expected things to happen and has put up a wall to protect herself, which ultimately does not help her. Counseling is a must. 

I have no personal experience in regards to abortion, but I have had an unplanned pregnancy. I got pregnant when my son was only 6 months old, while he had a lot of health issues(breathing problems, cyanosis, chest/neck retractions, etc), which was very scary and exhausting. I did not want to be pregnant while dealing with all of that and I panicked. After that panic feeling lifted, I knew I did always want that baby, but unfortunately miscarried a week and a half later. I am very glad I never made any decisions while I was in that state of panic and fear because the decision would not be what I would normally make. 

It's so great to see your support for her, no matter what she chooses. I just strongly urge that she gets counseling first, to make sure she is making the choice from a solid stand point instead of in fear.


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## MarriedDude

Pluto2 said:


> I agree 100%, but just not in Nik's thread.
> 
> *This thread is about a mother trying to support her daughter through a difficult time.*


Exactly...and from what I have read -she hasn't done anything other than support her daughter.


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## Eagle3

OP, I didn’t want to chime in when I saw this thread but will just to add the other side here. I want to say first off you seem like a great mother and one who cares deeply for her daughter which I comment big time. You have gone to great lengths to help her and all mothers should be as helpful as you been in this difficult situation your family is in (my wife got pregnant at 16 not w me and it was not as smooth as you are being). Anyway I just want you to see some things.

First off you say you care what the boy is but you have made it clear you see faults with him due to his upbringing. Well he cant control that. When you said he might be manipulating your daugher due to be foster home care I can tell you that is probably not the case. I grew up in foster homes abandoned by my mother. You don’t learn these traits in there. You learn to surivive and have a guard up that the world thinks you are crap cause no one wants you. And guess what your daughter has proved that to him. I mean they were close enough to have sex and a baby comes in and boom she stops talking to him? Imagine if the roles were reversed and your daugther was the poor girl from other side of the tracks and he was with the good family and he all of a sudden stopped talking to her cold turkey? No on here would like him including me.

But as you said hes been dealt a crap hand in the world and look by your statements he gets great grades and in sports to get into college. That is a sign of someone raising them up from their past. But you blame him for no protection. Well yeah he is at fault but so is your daughter. To say hes disrespectful? Come on? I mean you know who is having unprotected sex these days? Most teens including your daughter. If anything with your parenting and family structure she should have known just as much as him.

You keep saying there was no chance as they were always watched well guess what it happened. They are young and dumb and probably telling each other they are in love. Now that the pregancy has happened I am sure your daughter is trying to play to you and all of a sudden hes this and that. Wrong. He was charming and good enough for her to like and sleep with so he should be good enough to have the resepct to talk to during this. Now I am not telling you what to do. Your daughter might be better off not having it and getting on but to cut him out cold is not right either. Your daughter owes it to him to at least talk to him. She can make a baby with him like an adult she can talk to him like one.

Again you seem like a caring mother but I think you need to see your daughter put you in this issue with her great backgound just as much as the boy who has a crappy one did too. Fair is fair. I hope whatever you do you and your daughter are well going forward.


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## Adelais

There is no hurry, as abortion is legal until ? weeks in your state. She won't even begin to show until 3 months, so no one will even know she is/was pregnant. Let her take time to think about it rather than push her. She might have a miscarriage, as Anonymous07 did, and then she will not have had to make any decision at all. Consider encouraging her to think about it until she is 13 weeks along. Most miscarriages happen before then if the baby is nonviable. (I've had 3 miscarriages that I know of. Who knows how many I actually had, because my periods were never regular anyway, and I wasn't keeping track until after my first child was born.)


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## nikoled

Eagle3 said:


> OP, I didn’t want to chime in when I saw this thread but will just to add the other side here. I want to say first off you seem like a great mother and one who cares deeply for her daughter which I comment big time. You have gone to great lengths to help her and all mothers should be as helpful as you been in this difficult situation your family is in (my wife got pregnant at 16 not w me and it was not as smooth as you are being). Anyway I just want you to see some things.
> 
> First off you say you care what the boy is but you have made it clear you see faults with him due to his upbringing. Well he cant control that. When you said he might be manipulating your daugher due to be foster home care I can tell you that is probably not the case. I grew up in foster homes abandoned by my mother. You don’t learn these traits in there. You learn to surivive and have a guard up that the world thinks you are crap cause no one wants you. And guess what your daughter has proved that to him. I mean they were close enough to have sex and a baby comes in and boom she stops talking to him? Imagine if the roles were reversed and your daugther was the poor girl from other side of the tracks and he was with the good family and he all of a sudden stopped talking to her cold turkey? No on here would like him including me.
> 
> But as you said hes been dealt a crap hand in the world and look by your statements he gets great grades and in sports to get into college. That is a sign of someone raising them up from their past. But you blame him for no protection. Well yeah he is at fault but so is your daughter. To say hes disrespectful? Come on? I mean you know who is having unprotected sex these days? Most teens including your daughter. If anything with your parenting and family structure she should have known just as much as him.
> 
> You keep saying there was no chance as they were always watched well guess what it happened. They are young and dumb and probably telling each other they are in love. Now that the pregancy has happened I am sure your daughter is trying to play to you and all of a sudden hes this and that. Wrong. He was charming and good enough for her to like and sleep with so he should be good enough to have the resepct to talk to during this. Now I am not telling you what to do. Your daughter might be better off not having it and getting on but to cut him out cold is not right either. Your daughter owes it to him to at least talk to him. She can make a baby with him like an adult she can talk to him like one.
> 
> Again you seem like a caring mother but I think you need to see your daughter put you in this issue with her great backgound just as much as the boy who has a crappy one did too. Fair is fair. I hope whatever you do you and your daughter are well going forward.


I actually agree with much of what you said and I think I've said as much in my prior posts. If I have not let me clarify. 

I do think it is disrespectful as a boy not to use a condom when having sex with a girl that you care about, BUT that doesn't mean that my daughter is not also at fault. She could have insisted or stopped or offered to get some or whatever and she did not. If I implied that this is just his fault that was not my intention. Yes, they were not alone ever- as in home alone, but they are teenagers. I'm not ignorant enough to know that it is impossible for things like this to happen. I did plenty of questionable things as a teen too- I get it.

I also agree that she owes him the opportunity to at least talk before the decision is final. We have reached out to the family and are awaiting a time to do so. He is in protective custody right now to keep him safe so we have no control over when, but we have initiated that contact and I truly hope that it happens. She tried to break up with this boy several times over the past month- I think she got in over her head and was feeling guilty so even though she liked him she didn't like where the relationship had gone and was trying to break up. But every time he would get so depressed/suicidal/etc. so she would take him back. I understand that he needs to have some input and closure, but at the same time I needed to help her put up her wall for a couple of days while her head got clear because he was unable to give her a little space. She cares so very much for this kid. He has poor coping skills. But should she stay with him just because he cannot handle her not staying with him? That's not really fair either. Our hearts are all hurting for him, but I also need to make sure we aren't making decisions based soley upon him.

Yes, I do see faults in his upbringing. It was HORRIBLE. It's not his fault and it doesn't need to define him- but he is young. He is being given the opportunity to go to college, to play football, to have a career. This kid deserves the opportunity to be able to take advantage of these GOOD situations being offered to him. Not that a baby isn't a good situation- I truly believe babies are a blessing and no one loves their children more than I do. But in thie particular situation it is an obstacle that might prevent some things that he NEEDS to happen in order to be able to survive. His story in a nutshell- born to drug addicted parents. Put in foster care as a preschooler. Shuffled around to 3 different placements. Adopted. Adopted dad died. Adopted mom went crazy. Adopted mom killed herself in front of him. Aunt took him in. Cousins molested him. In and out of group homes. Birth parents recently died. There is so much more. The details are just horrendous. 

I know that people can overcome. I so hope he can. I could look at this baby as a blessing that is supposed to somehow motivate and help him to grow and step up. And that thought has crossed my mind and I feel guilty for trying to keep it out of there-Because I also need to consider MY child. This boy may not be able to overcome. He is connected to some pretty bad stuff. And as much as my heart hurts for him it also is terrified.


----------



## Cosmos

nikoled said:


> I really respect you from prior advice you have given me and do respect your point of view. I always thought I leaned toward anti-abortion. But now that I am wearing these shoes my view has changed.
> 
> I will be fully supportive if my daughter wants to have and keep the baby. I am able to babysit while she goes to school. We can absorb the cost. We have the space. My husband and I are young parents and we have the energy and time to help with a young child. So adoption would not be an option for her. But I truly think in our particular case we have to consider abortion. * I know to some it is very morally objectional and I get and respect that. Never thought we would be considering it.*


Be guided by your _own_ moral compass, OP, not anyone else's. By the sounds of things it won't let you down...



> I know that people can overcome. I so hope he can. I could look at this baby as a blessing that is supposed to somehow motivate and help him to grow and step up. And that thought has crossed my mind and I feel guilty for trying to keep it out of there-Because I also need to consider MY child. This boy may not be able to overcome. He is connected to some pretty bad stuff. And as much as my heart hurts for him it also is terrified.


Your daughter is your main priority. Whilst I feel deeply sorry for the young man, his feelings about whatever your daughter decides to do cannot be allowed to influence her decision making right now.


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## ExiledBayStater

If he really wants to be a dad, there's more where that came from as far as he is concerned. Put bluntly, his sperm is not a real estate claim to your daughter's womb. There is more to making a baby than having sex.

My wife is pregnant. Even though I go out to get Ben & Jerry's for her when she's craving, pay the mortgage and utilities, pay the medical bills, massage her when she's sore or even when she's not, and wash her clothes so she doesn't have to go down the scary stairs to the basement, I still have to be mindful of her personal space and remember that she is her own person. It is hard at times, my kid is in there.

I don't know if she should discuss the abortion with him. She certainly shouldn't engage him if he tries to talk her out of it. Maybe she can say some kind words and well-wishes to make for an amicable breakup (I know nothing about breakups).


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## jld

ExiledBayStater said:


> If he really wants to be a dad, there's more where that came from as far as he is concerned. Put bluntly, *his sperm is not a real estate claim to your daughter's womb.* There is more to making a baby than having sex.


That is good enough to be a signature, EBS.


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## dignityhonorpride

Nik, just wanted to comment again. Your description of the boy and his situation hits close to home for me. I also had a rough upbringing and, when I got pregnant, I was at a turning point - I had the opportunity to make something of myself, to get out of that situation, that area, etc. I went forward with the abortion, moved out of my abusive parents' home, started working 3 jobs and going to college...and now less than 10 years later, I make more than both of my parents combined, am married, and have a full life. Meanwhile, the girls who got knocked up and never left my hometown are working at gas stations and call centers, some have been in and out of rehab, 2 have lost custody of their kids. People can talk all they want about the supposed side effects of abortion, but again, for me -- I'm sad that it happened, sad that I got pregnant at all, but I've never had any related psychological problems.

I really admire you for how well you are handling this. No matter what happens, I'm quite sure that your daughter will be grateful to you. 

Sent from my VS986 using Tapatalk


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## sapientia

CynthiaDe said:


> This is why it is very likely that your daughter will suffer if she has an abortion.


She will also suffer if she keeps this child. So, likely, will the child no matter what level of help is available to her.

The father is clearly disturbed. This will bring its own set of problems if she is forced to stay in contact because of a child.

Quality of life >>> quantity.

Wishing you and your daughter love and peace, Nikoled.


----------



## Anonymous07

Nikoled, 

I think with the way you talk about this boy, being "damaged" and "not good" with his troubled past, has a big effect on how your daughter sees him, too. I honestly think she really likes him(she slept with him, she wants to see him, etc.), but is now pulling away because you do not approve of him. Having a tough life and upbringing does not mean he is doomed for the future. There are many who can pull themselves up and do great things. From some small things you have said, it looks like he is on a nice path with good grades and a plan for the future(fire department - great job). 

This would be another reason counseling is a good idea. To see how she really feels about him and how your opinion of him may be affecting her decision making. I just wonder if your opinion is causing her to make a decision she may or may not like later on.


----------



## Pluto2

And I wonder if you are projecting your own views onto someone else's situation to get the result you think is desirable, having never met Nik's daughter or the young man.


----------



## Anonymous07

Pluto2 said:


> And I wonder if you are projecting your own views onto someone else's situation to get the result you think is desirable, having never met Nik's daughter or the young man.


Should we ignore all possibilities then? I'm pointing out something that can be a possibility. 

I have no motive, one way or the other. What is yours? You seem very pro-abortion route.


----------



## Pluto2

I'm very pro Nik's daughter which includes the right for her to choose what is best for her, and supportive of Nik in helping her guide her daughter.


----------



## Anonymous07

Pluto2 said:


> I'm very pro Nik's daughter which includes the right for her to choose what is best for her, and supportive of Nik in helping her guide her daughter.


And I'm not? 

Part of doing just that, is looking at all sides and possibilities. I pointed out more for them to look at and think about. It doesn't mean I'm trying to sway one way or the other. That was your own odd opinion.


----------



## Pluto2

agree to disagree


----------



## TheTruthHurts

Nikoled I read the first few pages then jumped to the end so I'm sorry if my post missed the current state of this for you.

I do know of a few people in this situation. I have twin 17-year old boys and several younger girls.

In college W and I had a few scares and though she was a good catholic we knew we weren't prepared for kids so we planned on a few hour drive for an abortion. Was just a scare, but we never told our parents or family. In sure many have been in this place.

A neighbor down the street with a boy my sons' age got pregnant in college and had the kid. Dad was a loser and rarely ever sees the kid. Never amounted to anything. Mom basically gave up her life to raise her son, stayed in her parents home and they created a basement apartment. She was pretty and fun but only dated one summer in the past 17 years. She did finish college but has pretty low self esteem and it's so sad she never had a youth, never found a husband, never had a relationship (except 1 mr. Right now that we encouraged). Keep this in mind please.

A couple of years ago another of the boys friends had a sister who got pregnant. Now grandma and grandma are new parents, daughter had to drop out of college. Now all 3 of their kids have to go to community college locally because parents can't afford college and don't trust the kids.

It's a sucky lose-lose decision. I'm really sorry you find yourself here. If you keep it, your daughter will likely forfeit the rest of her childhood, have severely limited her college options, possibly miss many normal relationships with boys and men (sorry but true), and you will raise the child basically. Your son-in-law will either permanently be in your life - which is bad - or won't be - which is bad.

If you end the pregnancy, well that will be tragic too. But I probably would have made that decision as a young person. If it were my kid, ???????????

Btw last year my boys were in nice suits for a national honors society night, and afterwards I took them to a drug store in a neighboring town. I told them to buy condoms - even though they were not sexually active. Told them it's the "good kids" at risk - you guys don't expect to get laid then all of a sudden you're in that position and have no protection and no experience. Exactly your situation I'm sure. And you can't really protect them from this. So sorry


----------



## TheTruthHurts

intheory said:


> SlowlyGoingCrazy said:
> 
> 
> 
> * Women are allowed to sleep with whoever the heck we want to. Not all of them are going to be someone you'd want to raise a child with.*
> 
> She smartly understands that he isn't someone she wants to co-parent with.
> 
> 
> 
> SGC,
> 
> This is a very interesting point. And I'm going to have to disagree with you.
> 
> Before having sex with anyone, a really good litmus test for whether or not it's "right" (?) or not -- I believe women should ask themselves, "would I want to have this guys kid?"
> 
> She doesn't actually have to want to get pregnant _at that time_. BUT, if the _very idea_ of getting pregnant with that particular guy is less than attractive; it's an indication that you know, on some level, that he is not a suitable sexual partner for you.
> 
> And, same for guys. Before having sex with a woman, ask yourself; would I want _this_ particular woman to have my kids? Would I want to pay child support for the next 18 years to raise _this _woman's children?
> 
> You can use this test even if you are sterile, or have gone through menopause. Would you have had kids with this person if you could? Or when you were young? If the response you get from yourself is "no"; then don't have sex with them.
> 
> And I could have been in OP's daughter's shoes when I was 18 or 19. I'm probably just lucky. I'm not judging.
Click to expand...

Hmmm I can guarantee most young men think the opposite - there are girls to have sex with and girls to marry. Now of course you ALSO want to have sex with the "marrying kind" too. But you would NEVER rule out sex with the "fun kind". You just might do different stuff with them.

Of course I found my marrying kind as my first real girlfriend so I never acted upon all those other thoughts...


----------



## TheTruthHurts

I'm not going to disagree except to say that many 17 year olds don't have the capacity to make those lifelong judgements. Very sad


----------



## sapientia

intheory said:


> Before having sex with anyone, a really good litmus test for whether or not it's "right" (?) or not -- I believe women should ask themselves, "would I want to have this guys kid?"
> 
> She doesn't actually have to want to get pregnant _at that time_. BUT, if the _very idea_ of getting pregnant with that particular guy is less than attractive; it's an indication that you know, on some level, that he is not a suitable sexual partner for you.


Teenage brains don't stop developing until around age 25. They are driven by hormones, not logic, at that age. It's a nice suggestion but not practical for the age of the OPs daughter.

The better course is to bow to biological urges, and make sure there is open discussion about sex -- including practical availability of contraceptives. Condoms make great stocking stuffers for the holidays for teenagers!



TheTruthHurts said:


> I'm not going to disagree except to say that many 17 year olds don't have the capacity to make those lifelong judgements. Very sad


Agreed^. At least she has the help of her mother, which far too many young teenagers don't have.


----------



## TheTruthHurts

OP I hope you are doing ok. Have there been any developments?

I referred to your situation at home - with my twin 17 year old boys but in front of my younger girls too. I let them know these things happen and asked if they knew anyone at school who had gotten pregnant. We had a good discussion.

I still believe they don't have the maturity or life experience to be assured of making the right decisions about sex should the situation arise. But we're talking about it so doing what we can.


----------



## nikoled

Anonymous07 said:


> Nikoled,
> 
> I think with the way you talk about this boy, being "damaged" and "not good" with his troubled past, has a big effect on how your daughter sees him, too. I honestly think she really likes him(she slept with him, she wants to see him, etc.), but is now pulling away because you do not approve of him. Having a tough life and upbringing does not mean he is doomed for the future. There are many who can pull themselves up and do great things. From some small things you have said, it looks like he is on a nice path with good grades and a plan for the future(fire department - great job).
> 
> This would be another reason counseling is a good idea. To see how she really feels about him and how your opinion of him may be affecting her decision making. I just wonder if your opinion is causing her to make a decision she may or may not like later on.


I don't think this boy is hopeless- I am actually pro-this boy. When he was expelled from school he came and talked to us as did his mom and said if we didn't want our daughter seeing him anymore they both understood. I don't think he is doomed. But I do think that he needs every opportunity he can right now to get his life on a good track. He isn't quite on that nice path yet, but he is close and I hate to derail or detour him when he is tredging ahead. There are just a lot of uncertainties I guess. Not like there aren't with most situations, its just the odds aren't so in his favor this time and I want him and my daughter to have the best shot at a good future that they can.


----------



## nikoled

TheTruthHurts said:


> Nikoled I read the first few pages then jumped to the end so I'm sorry if my post missed the current state of this for you.
> 
> I do know of a few people in this situation. I have twin 17-year old boys and several younger girls.
> 
> In college W and I had a few scares and though she was a good catholic we knew we weren't prepared for kids so we planned on a few hour drive for an abortion. Was just a scare, but we never told our parents or family. In sure many have been in this place.
> 
> A neighbor down the street with a boy my sons' age got pregnant in college and had the kid. Dad was a loser and rarely ever sees the kid. Never amounted to anything. Mom basically gave up her life to raise her son, stayed in her parents home and they created a basement apartment. She was pretty and fun but only dated one summer in the past 17 years. She did finish college but has pretty low self esteem and it's so sad she never had a youth, never found a husband, never had a relationship (except 1 mr. Right now that we encouraged). Keep this in mind please.
> 
> A couple of years ago another of the boys friends had a sister who got pregnant. Now grandma and grandma are new parents, daughter had to drop out of college. Now all 3 of their kids have to go to community college locally because parents can't afford college and don't trust the kids.
> 
> It's a sucky lose-lose decision. I'm really sorry you find yourself here. If you keep it, your daughter will likely forfeit the rest of her childhood, have severely limited her college options, possibly miss many normal relationships with boys and men (sorry but true), and you will raise the child basically. Your son-in-law will either permanently be in your life - which is bad - or won't be - which is bad.
> 
> If you end the pregnancy, well that will be tragic too. But I probably would have made that decision as a young person. If it were my kid, ???????????
> 
> Btw last year my boys were in nice suits for a national honors society night, and afterwards I took them to a drug store in a neighboring town. I told them to buy condoms - even though they were not sexually active. Told them it's the "good kids" at risk - you guys don't expect to get laid then all of a sudden you're in that position and have no protection and no experience. Exactly your situation I'm sure. And you can't really protect them from this. So sorry


Yes, and ironically I believe this happened right after her National Honors Society Induction...

Yes, no matter what the decision/situation will not be perfect- both sides have their challenges for sure! Just not something I even thought we would be dealing with at this point with this child. Live and learn. She has over a 4.0 GPA and a bright future ahead. I know it will all be fine either way- it's just a hard situation.


----------



## nikoled

intheory said:


> SGC,
> 
> This is a very interesting point. And I'm going to have to disagree with you.
> 
> Before having sex with anyone, a really good litmus test for whether or not it's "right" (?) or not -- I believe women should ask themselves, "would I want to have this guys kid?"
> 
> She doesn't actually have to want to get pregnant _at that time_. BUT, if the _very idea_ of getting pregnant with that particular guy is less than attractive; it's an indication that you know, on some level, that he is not a suitable sexual partner for you.
> 
> And, same for guys. Before having sex with a woman, ask yourself; would I want _this_ particular woman to have my kids? Would I want to pay child support for the next 18 years to raise _this _woman's children?
> 
> You can use this test even if you are sterile, or have gone through menopause. Would you have had kids with this person if you could? Or when you were young? If the response you get from yourself is "no"; then don't have sex with them.
> 
> And I could have been in OP's daughter's shoes when I was 18 or 19. I'm probably just lucky. I'm not judging.


IN theory that would have been a great discussion to have with her before she had sex. I did not. This was her first boyfriend and only together a little over a month when this happened so we hadn't even gotten there. It's not like she didn't know anything- she is 17 and sex/birth control has been discussed, but probably not as in depth as was needed apparently. We did send her older brother off to college with condoms. We just didn't think we were there yet. But yes, that is a good discussion topic for the future.


----------



## nikoled

So we went to our initial termination appointment this morning. I dreamt all night about being shot at and running to try to get in or away from the clinic safely. My husband ended up driving us there just so he could walk us in- I don't know what I was expecting- picketers? People yelling things? Something. But it was not like that at all. The door was locked and you had to be buzzed in- otherwise it felt pretty safe. We were told at PLanned Parenthood to count on 6 hours for our initial appointment. This place is private so a little more expensive, but appointments were just 2 hours thankfully. They did blood work (Which my child does not do well- always passes out), an ultrasound (the tech just kept saying it is very small- couldn't even see the fetus- just the sac), counseling, etc. It all went as well as it could. Everyone was very nice. There was a huge variety of people in the waiting room- all backgrounds, ages, etc. She left feeling comfortable with this option. 

We went out to lunch and I wanted to make sure that I had made it very clear that it is OK to change your mind, we could handle a baby, we support her either way. I wanted her to make sure she was making the decision for the right reasons and not just because she didn't want to let her dance team down or something like that. I think it was good for her to hear that. Right now she is scheduled for Friday, but I told her we could push it out one more week if she needs another week to think. I did find out at the appointment that there was a condom used, but it failed- she could have just said that, but then again at this point there really was no reason to lie. The nurse went through proper condom usage  

After lunch I texted foster mom. My daughter has asked several times to talk to boy, but doesn't know that he is inpatient right now. I wanted to give her an update and let her know that daughter still wanted to talk to him sometime if that is a possibility. So, she is setting up a meeting for them with a counselor. I think that will be good. I know she needs counseling too- the doctors office today offered quite a bit of that and it was helpful. They actually were great. We were at a big family dinner last night with grandparents, etc and I found her lying in a couch away from everyone crying at one point. I know it is so hard to pretend nothing is going on when you are living through trauma and told her that. I expect that we will have a few more ups and downs this week before decideing 100% for sure. 

Anyways, that is the update. Thanks for all of your support and input.


----------



## jld

Nikoled, you are doing a beautiful job with this. I am so glad your daughter has such a loving, caring mom. 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## TheTruthHurts

Thanks for the update - thinking about you be your daughter.


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## Pluto2

sounds like you are doing a wonderful job. I know this is a stressful time for everyone, particularly your DD.


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## nirvana

I think a 17 year old is too stupid to make such kinds of decisions. I remember when I was 17 and me and my other classmates were so dumb about the world. Here these days we treat 17 year olds like grown ups. Just turning 18 does not make one a grown up mentally.

Anyway, in this case, I think the girl should have an abortion, clean the slate and move on with life. She should not be saddled with a child at this age.


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## SaffronPower

Nik...I wish you were my mom.


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## Pluto2

intheory said:


> Sapientia,
> 
> I've heard that too. I guess I have to concede there's something to it, if there's scientific evidence. I do agree that we don't stop physically growing until our wisdom teeth come through; approximately 20 years old. Makes sense there, you do stop being a teenager at 20.
> 
> 25 though? It's strange to me. If "teenage brains" don't develop fully until 25 then should people under 25 be allowed to vote, get married, get fulltime jobs, join and fight in the military, consume alcohol, vote in elections and have access to "adult" entertainment materials.
> 
> All the above are considered inappropriate behaviors/privileges for people who are not adults. If people between 18-25 have these "rights", then should they not also have all the responsibilities that accompany those rights?
> 
> It's a rhetorical question, to be sure. But one that we should think about before we start considering people up to 24 years of age to be "older children", or at least; not fully adult.


Well, that's a can of worms, there. The US enlists children on a regular basis. 
http://www.globalresearch.ca/americ...g-children-to-serve-in-the-armed-forces/11210

And these children still lack the mental development of the adults who use them. We really don't value our children much in this country.
Sorry for the tj. I'll stop.


----------



## EnjoliWoman

As the mother of a 17y/o girl who has her first boyfriend, I can somewhat understand your position. If she's a dancer (serious dancer), a pregnancy could really hurt her dancing. Looser ligaments, changes in the hips, etc. are a huge physical change to cope with. A baby is a pretty major commitment. I don't think I could raise another child, but then again I'm divorced. I used to be very much against abortion as I was adopted, the product of a teen pregnancy. The more I thought about it, it was the bravest, hardest thing my birth mother ever had to do - carry me and give me up all in my best interest. She went on to become a doctor which likely wouldn't have happened if she were a single mother. Win-win. On the other hand, if I'd never been born, I wouldn't know any different. I know several women who had abortions at various stages of life. The only one who had any regrets, was one whose mother forced her to have one at 16. She didn't regret the abortion but resented her mother forcing her instead of it being her choice.

Too many kids (and maybe this boy) think a child equals unconditional love for life. It does, but it's the parents who give unconditional love; the child cannot come into this world with the 'job' of making a teen's life 'whole'. I'm glad you are all taking such a thoughtful approach and being supportive. I hope I don't have to do this with my daughter, but I feel the same as you - counsel, discuss options and let her make the choice. It's pretty major to make life altering decisions at 17. So far those are limited to career/school-type decisions. Starting a family or opting not to have one yet is huge. It's quite the lesson in adult-hood. Hugs to all - I'm glad you are supportive of the boy, too.


----------



## turnera

intheory said:


> Sapientia,
> 
> I've heard that too. I guess I have to concede there's something to it, if there's scientific evidence. I do agree that we don't stop physically growing until our wisdom teeth come through; approximately 20 years old. Makes sense there, you do stop being a teenager at 20.
> 
> 25 though? It's strange to me. If "teenage brains" don't develop fully until 25 then should people under 25 be allowed to vote, get married, get fulltime jobs, join and fight in the military, consume alcohol, vote in elections and have access to "adult" entertainment materials.
> 
> All the above are considered inappropriate behaviors/privileges for people who are not adults. If people between 18-25 have these "rights", then should they not also have all the responsibilities that accompany those rights?
> 
> It's a rhetorical question, to be sure. But one that we should think about before we start considering people up to 24 years of age to be "older children", or at least; not fully adult.


It's true. My DD is 25 (and a psych grad student), so I'm well aware of the 'still developing' part, lol. And so is she; we talk about it a lot. I've been closely watching it in her and all her friends, in all their various manifestations. And I've watched them as they matured and changed. There's a reason why they say hire a teenager while they still know everything.

I was on my own at 18 and had to learn my way through. But I made a LOT of mistakes, just not being mature enough, that have affected everything else in my life. So yes, you CAN get a job, vote, serve...but you're more likely to do it _wisely _when you're older.


----------



## turnera

EnjoliWoman said:


> Too many kids (and maybe this boy) think a child equals unconditional love for life. It does, but it's the parents who give unconditional love; the child cannot come into this world with the 'job' of making a teen's life 'whole'. I'm glad you are all taking such a thoughtful approach and being supportive. I hope I don't have to do this with my daughter, but I feel the same as you - counsel, discuss options and let her make the choice. It's pretty major to make life altering decisions at 17. So far those are limited to career/school-type decisions. Starting a family or opting not to have one yet is huge. It's quite the lesson in adult-hood. Hugs to all - I'm glad you are supportive of the boy, too.


I've been watching several of DD25's friends who had kids simply because they 'wanted someone to love them.' And then ended up utterly miserable, depressed, and angry at life.

I also remember being that age and wondering 'what is this thing called love and why don't I feel it for my mom when she keeps telling me she loves _me_?' I thought something was wrong with me because everyone kept talking about love and I just didn't get it. It wasn't until I was much older, around 30, that I started feeling that true love and understood what sacrificing yourself for a greater good or someone else's good meant.


----------



## NextTimeAround

Read the 2006 edition of "Freakonomics." The authors make a direct relationship between the ease of getting an abortion and low crime rates.

Ceaucescu outlawed abortion in Romania. And it was those 20 somethings that he forced to be born that led to his demise.


----------



## sapientia

intheory said:


> sapientia said:
> 
> 
> 
> Teenage brains don't stop developing until around age 25. They are driven by hormones, not logic, at that age.
> 
> 
> 
> Sapientia,
> 
> I've heard that too. I guess I have to concede there's something to it, if there's scientific evidence. I do agree that we don't stop physically growing until our wisdom teeth come through; approximately 20 years old. Makes sense there, you do stop being a teenager at 20.
> 
> 25 though? It's strange to me. If "teenage brains" don't develop fully until 25 then should people under 25 be allowed to vote, get married, get fulltime jobs, join and fight in the military, consume alcohol, vote in elections and have access to "adult" entertainment materials.
> 
> All the above are considered inappropriate behaviors/privileges for people who are not adults. If people between 18-25 have these "rights", then should they not also have all the responsibilities that accompany those rights?
> 
> It's a rhetorical question, to be sure. But one that we should think about before we start considering people up to 24 years of age to be "older children", or at least; not fully adult.
Click to expand...

Here you go:
http://mobile.nytimes.com/blogs/parenting/2012/05/03/the-evolving-teenage-brain/?referer=

The national geographic article was from 2011 which will reference the research but you'll need a subscription to access.


----------



## EnjoliWoman

There's tons of reliable data sources to support that. I'd heard mid-20s YEARS ago. 

At What Age Is The Brain Fully Developed?

Young Adult Development Project


----------



## nikoled

Hi Everyone- So today is the day. She is getting dressed. I'm set to go, but so incredibly nervous. This week has had ups and downs for sure. We met with boyfriend, his mom, my daughter and his therapist on Wednesday. That was good. My daughter does know now that he was suicidal and is in care at the moment. The therapist met alone with the 2 of them for a while and I think that was very helpful. My daughter was able to say I need some space right now and he had to hear it. He was able to say that he supports her choice (although it was clear that it wasn't his preference). They both received a lot of support and validation and that was good. He wrote my husband and I a letter- it was heartbreaking and sweet. He has had just such an AWFUL past- that part just breaks your heart. Basically he feels that my daughter has inspired him to want to be more and do more in his life and that is great. But it is also a huge burden on her and that is something she needs to be able to say I can't take right now. So she was given permission to do that.

She had a few moments seeing babies or young children where she was like what am I doing??? Am I ending this for the right reasons? She had to process and make sure she wasn't doing it just because she wanted to keep dancing- it had to be bigger. We've helped her with that still not telling her it is the only choice. She did tell another friend and I told that friend's mom and we got tons of support there too so that was good. It is hard to have such a big thing going on in silence and I don't want that to harm her so I was glad she told one more very trusted friend. I also have set up counseling for her starting next week.

Yesterday I think kind of was a turning point for her- she broke down at school. The nurse called and said she could go home. The nurse knows both of these kids and figured out what was going on so she excused her for the day- she needed a day to just process I think. But when I got to the school to get her she was with the principal. She saw her in the hall and saw that she was not ok and took her to her office. This made a HUGE difference for my child. She asked her her greatest fear and she said hurting the boyfriend. She explained to my daughter that he will survive. She will make sure he is ok. And basically gave her permission to do whatever she needs to do to take care of herself right now. They talked about the heart and the mind and how they don't always match and how hard that can be. It was very touching and was exactly what she needed- I was very grateful. Just hearing that she did not need to worry about him because his mom has this was huge for her. 

Anyways, it is going to be hard day I am sure, but hopeful that there will be brighter ones ahead. Thank again.


----------



## Pluto2

You and your daughter are in my thoughts.

Never, ever doubt was a supportive, loving parent your are. Ever.


----------



## Openminded

I hope everything went well (acknowledging this process is certainly not easy). 

I think the boyfriend (unknowingly or not) has put too much responsibility for his future wellbeing on your daughter. It's good she has inspired him to seek a better life but obviously they are far too young at this point to think about a life together. Hopefully, he will back off some and not pressure her going forward. The both need to heal and that takes time.


----------



## Anonymous07

Well, it's all done now, so there is nothing to be done, but I wish she could have gotten counseling first before going through with the abortion. Hearing that she broke down at school is hard to hear and a big example of why counseling should have been done asap, not postponed until later. I hope she is doing okay now and can move forward in a healthy way. Please focus on her counseling to help her with this ongoing process.


----------



## nikoled

Anonymous07 said:


> Well, it's all done now, so there is nothing to be done, but I wish she could have gotten counseling first before going through with the abortion. Hearing that she broke down at school is hard to hear and a big example of why counseling should have been done asap, not postponed until later. I hope she is doing okay now and can move forward in a healthy way. Please focus on her counseling to help her with this ongoing process.


We did do counseling first. She had 2 sessions, one with boyfriend and one without, she met with a physician/friend, school nurse, etc. I do have counseling set up for her this week and next as well. I told her she could wait one more week to decide if she wanted to, but she chose not to. The good thing is that the procedure is much easier at barely 6 weeks. It still is a horrible decision to have to make and I can't say I am 100% comfortable with it, but I think peace will come. It is sad anyway you look at it. She is feeling physically well today and I think at least today is doing just fine.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## nikoled

Openminded said:


> I hope everything went well (acknowledging this process is certainly not easy).
> 
> I think the boyfriend (unknowingly or not) has put too much responsibility for his future wellbeing on your daughter. It's good she has inspired him to seek a better life but obviously they are far too young at this point to think about a life together. Hopefully, he will back off some and not pressure her going forward. The both need to heal and that takes time.


Yes, I agree. It's not her responsibility to save him- I think she got lost in that. We are going to be addressing this with counseling as well because I honestly think it's been damaging too.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## nikoled

Pluto2 said:


> You and your daughter are in my thoughts.
> 
> Never, ever doubt was a supportive, loving parent your are. Ever.


Thank you - nice to hear. Of course I have some doubts/sadness today, but she's feeling well at the moment so I'm managing.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## lifeistooshort

Hi, I just wanted to lend support to your daughters decision and also agree that it's not your daughters job save this young man. 

I taught high school for a while in a part of town where families struggled financially and saw quite a few pregnancies, and it was almost always the case that the bulk of the burden fell on the girl and her family No matter how good the boys intentions. 

Teen relationships almost never work out and the boy goes on to live his life, while the girl is saddled with a child she can't afford and is ill equipped to raise. He's seldom able to support said child at that age and may even make some effort to see the child from time to time but the bulk fell to her.

Even when the boy did make an effort it was seen as helping her, not unlike guys who view chores as helping out.....thus insinuating that chores are really her issue and he's doing a favor to help. 

I'm sure there are men here who had kids in their teens and stepped up, and I commend them. It's just not usually what I saw. 

The young man's issues are his and his family's to deal with. .....teen drama can be taxing. Suicide threats are often a manipulation tactic anyway.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## TheTruthHurts

You're a good mom.


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## EnjoliWoman

Glad to hear she is feeling better and both of them have a good support system. I agree it's noone's job to save another. It's important that they support each other's dreams but that's true for ANY good friend. Saving is another matter. 

I'm sure it was a both sad and a relief.


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## Anonymous07

nikoled said:


> Yes, I agree. It's not her responsibility to save him- I think she got lost in that. We are going to be addressing this with counseling as well because I honestly think it's been damaging too.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I'm very glad to hear she is in counseling, but please don't jump to the conclusion that she is trying to save him. It is possible that she actually likes the guy and just wants to be with him. I know you view him that way, but it does not mean your daughter has the same thought process. It's never a good idea to jump to conclusions. I would make sure not to word things that way, as it can put thoughts into your daughter's mind that are not truly hers. Let her go through the process in therapy to come to her own conclusions.


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## nikoled

Daughter was a bit of a mess today and didn't go to school. I can tell this is going to be a little harder to process than it appeared at first. I have her set up for a counseling appointment tomorrow. She has missed so much school in the past week. Boyfriend called her today just for a few minutes. He is still inpatient so he doesn't have phone access often. I guess he will be discharged at the end of the week. She has literally spoken with him 3 times since she found out she was pregnant and that is it. Went cold turkey pretty much and I think that has been really hard on her. On one hand it has allowed her some space to really contemplate her relationship with him. On the other hand she misses him and I think with the hormonal issues she is going through it's hitting her a little extra hard. I'm glad he was able to call today and ask her how she was doing. She needed that. I'm glad she is starting therapy tomorrow. She had a couple of sessions last week, but not with someone that will be consistent for her. HOping this is a good match. Looking forward to her being able to get back to dancing too- that will be a great distraction. Thanks again.


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## sapientia

TheTruthHurts said:


> You're a good mom.


I completely agree. Love and peace to you and your family going forward, you deserve it.


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## Anonymous07

nikoled said:


> Daughter was a bit of a mess today and didn't go to school. I can tell this is going to be a little harder to process than it appeared at first. I have her set up for a counseling appointment tomorrow. She has missed so much school in the past week. Boyfriend called her today just for a few minutes. He is still inpatient so he doesn't have phone access often. I guess he will be discharged at the end of the week. She has literally spoken with him 3 times since she found out she was pregnant and that is it. Went cold turkey pretty much and I think that has been really hard on her. On one hand it has allowed her some space to really contemplate her relationship with him. On the other hand she misses him and I think with the hormonal issues she is going through it's hitting her a little extra hard. I'm glad he was able to call today and ask her how she was doing. She needed that. I'm glad she is starting therapy tomorrow. She had a couple of sessions last week, but not with someone that will be consistent for her. HOping this is a good match. Looking forward to her being able to get back to dancing too- that will be a great distraction. Thanks again.


I don't think you understood what I meant by therapy before, when I strongly urged it. I meant what she is starting now. That is therapy with one person she will continually see, whom she can open up to and trust. Seeing a couple random counselors is not the same and doesn't work as well as being followed by one therapist. 

I do think it is great that she is starting that therapy today though and do hope she is a good fit with which ever therapist she is seeing. It's so important for her to continue to see the same therapist and be able to be open with that person. It will help her currently and in the future as she learns to deal with everything that comes along with this. It will be an ongoing process, not something she'll move on from in a weeks time. It's definitely not an easy situation to deal with, but with therapy I am sure she'll learn to deal with it all in a healthy way. You're doing good by getting her into therapy now. 

It sounds like she really cares for this boy and I'm glad they were able to talk.


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## TheTruthHurts

How are things nikoled?


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## nikoled

TheTruthHurts said:


> How are things nikoled?


Sorry I haven't been back here, but things are good. Boyfriend was inpatient for 3 weeks - got out right before Christmas. Our daughter saw him a couple of days before Christmas for a few hours and then he went to church with us on Christmas Eve. They still have a relationship- I don't know if that is good or bad yet. We are all watching them like hawks and they are being both very gentle with one another right now. When BF was inpatient he got a lot of therapy, some meds, etc and really came out much different- no matter what he is in a better place so if anything good came out of this it is that he got some much needed help and is on a better path. My daughter is doing well. She did tell a couple of trusted friends what was up and seems fine with her decision. She had a rough couple of weeks there and now needs to jump back in and make up some school work etc. It was nice that they had a break from school to regroup. When it starts back up it will be a busy time for our daughter as dance season really picks up so that might be a good thing too- it will limit the time she can spend with BF. We thought about forbidding the relationship, but have decided that might backfire so instead we are putting limits on it- so far that seems good, but we will adjust if needed. Daughter is working on skills- standing up for herself, letting people know what she needs, etc. So many life lessons. Anyways, thanks for asking how we are- I think we are doing pretty well.


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## karole

Is your daughter is therapy?


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## nikoled

karole said:


> Is your daughter is therapy?


Yes, we started that right away. She claimed she didn't need it, but we have insisted. I think she is OK with it. I figured it gave her someone she could tell everything to if she didn't want to tell us as well as someone to help her sort out her thoughts, etc. She has only gone a couple of times because of the holidays, but hoping to be able to keep it up for a bit.


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## PhillyGuy13

Just read thru all your updates over the past few months Nik - hope ALL the kids are doing well as well as you and your husband
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## sahtrader

I'm sorry that you all are going through something so difficult. My daughter is only a baby right now but I'll weigh in. A relative became pregnant in college. The parents were really overbearing and practically made her give up her baby for adoption, even though my relative wanted to keep the baby. It's just that the parents wanted to protect their status in society. My relative is in her 60s and still holds a grudge against her parents and lives her life mooching off her siblings. For her, it's her way of getting back at the family for the pain she endured giving up her child. She never got married and never had anymore children. It's a very sad situation that never got better with time.


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## Amplexor

Zombie Thread. Closed.


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