# Potential Infidelity I'm heartbroken please help



## jef999

I've been in a strong healthy relationship with my wife for 16 years, 9 of them married. I work away from home a lot, during my last trip away my wife bumped into a old college pal she hadn't seen in years, he is in the same line of work as her and they kept in touch after their first meeting. She told me she's met her old pal and that he'd offered to sell her some equipment for her business. She picked me up from the airport at the weekend and I instantly thought her behaviour was a bit off, she seemed nervous. Her friend crept up in conversation and I asked when we could go and see this stock she was buying , she was dismissive and evasive about the whole thing and that evening she was on messenger chatting to someone for ages. I did something that I've never done before and I really regret, I had a look at her messenger list and saw that she's been chatting with her new friend, constantly for the last 2 weeks since they first met up again. Not only that but it was really flirty both from her and him, his wife left him 6 months ago, they also had a secret meeting before she picked me up from the airport, I'm pretty sure nothing happened but this really turned my world upside down. I confronted her about it and we talked, she said she didn't know why she met up with him in secret she said I could trust her that nothing would happen however she wanted to be able to choose her own friends, I don't have a problem with her having friends, but I can't help feeling that a single male friend who she met with in secret is an appropriate friend, I also dont feel that her sitting in front of me flirting with a single guy on messenger is appropriate (when I say messenger I mean that she was typing to him not physically talking) as I'm sure she wouldn't sit there on the phone and speak to him in that manner if I was there. I feel devastated, really heartbroken, she's always been my best mate, we do a lot together and have always had a good relationship. I can't see a good ending to this, if I sit back and do nothing I really think I'll loose her to this guy, he's single , lonely and has found someone willing to meet up with him in secret from her husband, he's also got a lot in common with her. If I confront her and ask her to stop or confront him and ask him to back off I think it will damage our marriage , I'm not that kind of guy , I'm not controlling and I dont want to be, she should be free to do what she wants. I really regret looking at her messenger history, not only because of what I found but because it's a huge breach of the trust we have, or had. Please help  What should I do?


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## TaDor

This is how it always starts.... and its already rolling. Nip this in the bud now, or you'll REALLY have a nightmare on your hands in a matter of months, if not weeks. She already had a Secret meeting with him. In NO WAY is that a GOOD THING!!

Watch this video, now. Then show it to her. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m8QKOUbosNo

I kid you not... losing my wife over stupidity, destroyed our family, our home. So look at books and counseling NOW!

Ask her, "mind if spend some secret time with a woman?"

The others will give more info. Sooner you put a stop to this, the better. I could have saved my marriage *IF* I had taken caught on what was going on 4~8 weeks earlier.


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## arbitrator

*You had "probable cause" to examine the transcripts of her messages to the OM! Don't feel guilty about that!

She needs to understand that she has breached marital boundaries in doing what she did in contacting this guy behind your back, who by all designs, has now found himself a rather easy target to get himself a rather easy oblivious potential source of nookie, all without the first discerning element of your knowledge!

Your W needs to understand that from this point on, that she must obligingly acquiese in handing over any and all passwords to any of her electronic accounts!

To not do so is simply a dealbreaker and a potential marriage-ender!
*
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## SunCMars

@Jeff999 quote

I can't see a good ending to this, if I sit back and do nothing I really think I'll loose her to this guy, he's single , lonely and has found someone willing to meet up with him in secret from her husband, he's also got a lot in common with her. If I confront her and ask her to stop or confront him and ask him to back off I think it will damage our marriage , I'm not that kind of guy , I'm not controlling and I dont want to be, she should be free to do what she wants. I really regret looking at her messenger history, not only because of what I found but because it's a huge breach of the trust we have, or had. Please help What should I do?
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

Sorry you are here.

I copied the last part of your post because it has the answers typed here.

Some on this forum would say to wait and to gather more information. If you confront too early you will drive the affair underground. This may happen.

You MUST come down on her hard, not harsh [yet]. Tell her that the relationship with this guy must end. 

She absolutely must not contact this guy again. Do not, I repeat, Do not tolerate her contacting him again.. She must go NC! 

Do not back down. Your marriage is over if you do. You have typed this same plan already above in your post. 

I too do not see a good ending to this if she continues. You will tell her that you will not tolerate three people in your marriage.

She will gaslight you and say that they are only friends. Respond with, I am the only male friend that you need. I do not need another man trying to get in my wife's pants.

At some point you will need to give her an ultimatum if she is in a fog over this guy. I hope not.


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## eric1

She is on the midst of an emotional affair (hopefully not more). It is more than appropriate to expose it as any other affair.

Your wife isn't a special snowflake and your marriage isn't special. He was to have sex with her and is feeding her attention until he gets it. She wants his attention and will feed him sex so that she keeps on getting it. That's how these things work.

You put the breaks on it by stopping it and by VERIFYING it has stopped. Cheaters lie just like she lied to you about the meeting. So demand access to her electronics - this BECAUSE YOU DONT TRUST HER. And you need to be overly clear that she is to go No Contact with him, and you need to be clear what the consequence will be if she breaks it (exposure then divorce).

Sorry but if you're asking if there is a way to do this without putting your foot down there isn't. It doesn't mean you need to be a jerk about it, but you do need to be calm, forceful and direct


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## rzmpf

jef999 said:


> If I confront her and ask her to stop or confront him and ask him to back off I think it will damage our marriage , I'm not that kind of guy , I'm not controlling and I dont want to be, she should be free to do what she wants. I really regret looking at her messenger history, not only because of what I found but because it's a huge breach of the trust we have, or had. Please help  What should I do?


Your marriage is already damaged otherwise she would not have gone behind your back to communicate and meet this guy in secret which further damages your marriage. 

She lied to you about him and if you had not looked at the messenger you would still be clueless about her breach of your trust.

If you (and she) are doing nothing to stop this relationship your marriage will be destroyed.

If she takes this guy over you and resents you for wanting to have NC you have the answer about who means more to her. Show her the consequences her actions will have.


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## jsmart

SunCMars said:


> Some on this forum would say to wait and to gather more information. If you confront too early you will drive the affair underground. This may happen.
> 
> *You MUST come down on her hard,* not harsh [yet]. Tell her that *the relationship with this guy must end*.
> 
> *She absolutely must not contact this guy again. *Do not, I repeat, Do not tolerate her contacting him again.. *She must go NC!*
> 
> *Do not back down. Your marriage is over if you do.* You have typed this same plan already above in your post.
> 
> I too do not see a good ending to this if she continues. You will tell her that you will not tolerate three people in your marriage.
> 
> She will gaslight you and say that they are only friends. Respond with, I am the only male friend that you need. I do not need another man trying to get in my wife's pants.
> 
> At some point *you will need to give her an ultimatum if she is in a fog over this guy. *I hope not.


Exactly this. You must not be passive. Get that "I don't want to be controlling" [email protected] out of your head. Your marriage & family are in serious jeopardy. 

You MUST confront and INSIST on NC with this guy. EVER.

I'm concerned that she may have at least kissed him before meeting you. Which would explain her nervousness. The 1st kiss is HUGE to a woman. Hopefully it didn't happen but I'm afraid it probably did. 

The men who come here taking the timid line, get destroyed by their WW. You can't nice her back nor play the pick me game. You have to be bold and decisive. The men that are willing to lose it all, are the ones that usually save their marriage. The timid ones that come here with EA evidence but are weak, come back weeks later to explain that it's now a sexual PA.


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## 86857

Just say to her, 

"Of course you can choose your friends honey. No need for you guys to meet in secret. So message him & let’s all 3 go for a drink together.”

Her reaction will tell you everything.


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## nursejackie

I had an EA/PA with a coworker many years ago. I have thought carefully about how H could have stopped it had he known in the earlier stages and acted. He had found communications between us, knew that we socialized at work functions and once a week after work as a group. He never seemed to worry about it and I convinced myself there was nothing wrong if it wasn't physical. Of course I KNEW there was something wrong. I knew I was developing feelings for him. And, of course these things turn into a PA eventually.

If H had gotten firm and demanded that I quit contact with him I would have gaslit and gone underground especially if he got angry. If he had confronted calmly and with conviction- showed me how this was taking my time and emotional energy away from my marriage -I may have listened. It would have been very beneficial to pair that with concern for what was missing in our relationship and how we could both work towards fulfilling those needs. (I was basically lonely- your wife could be too) If he had insisted on MC to explore these issues maybe I would've woken up and realized the damage that I was causing by this flirtation and the devastation I could cause if it continued or went physical.

I think the confident addition to all of this that he would be out the door no questions asked if I continued to jeopardize the marriage would have driven the seriousness of what was happening. If he had put the shoe on the other foot and asked how I'd feel if he were doing the same….

I really only ever wanted my husband- I just wanted more of him. This does not excuse what I did or what your wife is doing (definitely an EA) I'm just trying to give you my perspective at the time.

Weigh all the advice given and do what you are able to do. Good luck.


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## arbitrator

eric1 said:


> She is on the midst of an emotional affair (hopefully not more). It is more than appropriate to expose it as any other affair.
> 
> Your wife isn't a special snowflake and your marriage isn't special. He was to have sex with her and is feeding her attention until he gets it. She wants his attention and will feed him sex so that she keeps on getting it. That's how these things work.
> 
> You put the breaks on it by stopping it and by VERIFYING it has stopped. Cheaters lie just like she lied to you about the meeting. So demand access to her electronics - this BECAUSE YOU DONT TRUST HER. And you need to be overly clear that she is to go No Contact with him, and you need to be clear what the consequence will be if she breaks it (exposure then divorce).
> 
> Sorry but if you're asking if there is a way to do this without putting your foot down there isn't. It doesn't mean you need to be a jerk about it, but you do need to be calm, forceful and direct


*This ~ Totally!

And always keep in mind that being strong is no discernible guarantee that their marriage is in any way going to be saved!

Do remember that any attempt in trying to effectively save a wayward marriage always has two or even more participants involved ~ and not just one!*
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## rzmpf

The thread title is misleading. There is no "potential" infidelity. There is infidelity already, at least emotional but chances are that there already has been something physical happening and if OP does nothing it will become physical very soon.


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## ThePheonix

"I'm not controlling and I dont want to be, she should be free to do what she wants."

You're not very alpha are you Jef. And now you worry about if you do nothing, she'll ditch you for him. You see where that "sweet, non-confrontational, not controlling" attitude got you. You feeling that you regret looking at her flirty messages with this guy, while your there after a trip no less, sucks. She's lost some romantic interest in you and she connecting with other guys. If it were completely and totally platonic, she wouldn't be nervous about it, sending flirty messages, and reading the riot act to you about keeping him around. I would love to hear the conversation you two had when you confronted her about the messages. Did she even stop messaging him while ya'll talked? 
You need to put your alpha hat on Dawg, and get off this namby pamby "I'm not that type guy" and the go along to get along attitude. It ain't that sexy my man. From my experience, I'd put money on more wives married to non controlling guys cheat than those married to somewhat controlling guys. It like a business. Show me one with loose internal controls and I'll show you a business with fraud going on.
You have enough now to re-address the perennial flirtatious notes and her insistence in being friends with the respective guy. If you don't you may as well go ahead and invite the guy over to keep her company while you run errands for a couple of hours.


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## TX-SC

You need to confront her now and put an end to this. Don't wait until she is too deep in the fog to turn around and see what she is doing. Make sure that your wife knows that she is crossing boundaries. Demand 100 percent openness and she needs to stop chatting up this guy. She needs to know that she is emotionally cheating and you won't stand by while that happens. I'm willing to bet there is more to their meeting than she is letting on.


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## RWB

jef999 said:


> Not only that but it was really flirty both from her and him, his wife left him 6 months ago, they also had a secret meeting before she picked me up from the airport, *I'm pretty sure nothing happened *but this really turned my world upside down.


J999,

Pretty sure?

Do you really believe the whole, well look who I bumped into. This OM was probably thrown out of his house for cheating on W. He looked your wife up and arranged the whole "1st chance meeting". 

That your wife was willing to meet him privately in secret again is very telling. She was/is very interested. They probably held hands and kissed like teenagers. Don't believe a word she says, verify.


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## Talker67

its all good advice given so far. 
I would add that she might need a new sexual component to your marriage that is missing. Maybe you need to add some new things in the bedroom, maybe some role play, toys, new positions....things that maybe in the past she would have refused, but NOW after watching 50 shades of gray to talking with some of her GFs, she wants to try out.

Oddly, some women are embarrassed and ashamed to ask for these things from their hubby, but will ask some total stranger for them! go figure. Probe a little and try to figure out what would bring some sizzle back to her plain hamburger meal.


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## GusPolinski

Dude.

You are so behind the 8 ball here. Additionally, you're concerned w/ all the wrong things (i.e. violating your wife's "privacy", not being "controlling", etc.)

This is _at least_ an emotional affair, if not a full-blown _physical_ affair. And, assuming that it's not yet gone PA, you've got a rapidly-closing window of opportunity here in which you can work to ensure that it doesn't, so you need to ditch your anxious faux complacency and put on your game face.

This is how you do that...

"Wife, I have no interest in 'controlling' you. I do, however, expect you to 'control' yourself.

I'm not an idiot. I've seen the messages between the two of you, and they're BEYOND inappropriate. Additionally, you've been meeting up with him, and _in secret_ no less.

Until now I've been far too passive in dealing with this, thinking that a more 'take charge' approach would only add to the damage that's _already_ been done to our marriage. I now see this perspective for the abject foolishness that it is, and it ends TODAY.

So, if you want this 'friendship', then you're welcome to it. Know, however, that continuing in it will mean an end to our marriage.

In short, either you cut the bullsh*t -- immediately and permanently -- or we're done."

And you have to MEAN IT.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## MattMatt

A "SECRET" meeting, huh?

See a solicitor/lawyer to see about protecting your assets and your family.

And keep monitoring her.

And get rested for STDs/HIV ***NOW***.

And tell her that you are being tested because you can no longer trust her to have your best interests at heart. 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## chillymorn

decide if her cheating is a deal breaker.

if it is then call a lawyer and get the ball started.

don't even talk about it with her just file for divorce and have it served. go dark and only talk about things you have to.


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## 86857

GusPolinski said:


> Dude.
> 
> You are so behind the 8 ball here. Additionally, you're concerned w/ all the wrong things (i.e. violating your wife's "privacy", not being "controlling", etc.)
> 
> This is _at least_ an emotional affair, if not a full-blown _physical_ affair. And, assuming that it's not yet gone PA, you've got a rapidly-closing window of opportunity here in which you can work to ensure that it doesn't, so you need to ditch your anxious faux complacency and put on your game face.
> 
> This is how you do that...
> 
> "Wife, I have no interest in 'controlling' you. I do, however, expect you to 'control' yourself.
> 
> I'm not an idiot. I've seen the messages between the two of you, and they're BEYOND inappropriate. Additionally, you've been meeting up with him, and _in secret_ no less.
> 
> Until now I've been far too passive in dealing with this, thinking that a more 'take charge' approach would only add to the damage that's _already_ been done to our marriage. I now see this perspective for the abject foolishness that it is, and it ends TODAY.
> 
> So, if you want this 'friendship', then you're welcome to it. Know, however, that continuing in it will mean an end to our marriage.
> 
> In short, either you cut the bullsh*t -- immediately and permanently -- or we're done."
> 
> And you have to MEAN IT.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


:iagree: :iagree: :iagree:
TOTALLY agree with @GusPolinski who provided verbatim what you should say next.
Pay attention to Gus OP! 
Bring out both barrels and shoot this thing down ASAP. :2gunsfiring_v1: 

You seem appalled that you checked her messages. Make NO apologies for it. She will probably try to divert the conversation with accusations that you invaded her privacy. Don't go on the defensive. Go on the attack with,
"Honey, I ain't no fool & I will not be fooled. I knew something was up the minute you picked me up at the airport. Just needed to confirm it that's all."


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## farsidejunky

GusPolinski said:


> Dude.
> 
> You are so behind the 8 ball here. Additionally, you're concerned w/ all the wrong things (i.e. violating your wife's "privacy", not being "controlling", etc.)
> 
> This is _at least_ an emotional affair, if not a full-blown _physical_ affair. And, assuming that it's not yet gone PA, you've got a rapidly-closing window of opportunity here in which you can work to ensure that it doesn't, so you need to ditch your anxious faux complacency and put on your game face.
> 
> This is how you do that...
> 
> "Wife, I have no interest in 'controlling' you. I do, however, expect you to 'control' yourself.
> 
> I'm not an idiot. I've seen the messages between the two of you, and they're BEYOND inappropriate. Additionally, you've been meeting up with him, and _in secret_ no less.
> 
> Until now I've been far too passive in dealing with this, thinking that a more 'take charge' approach would only add to the damage that's _already_ been done to our marriage. I now see this perspective for the abject foolishness that it is, and it ends TODAY.
> 
> So, if you want this 'friendship', then you're welcome to it. Know, however, that continuing in it will mean an end to our marriage.
> 
> In short, either you cut the bullsh*t -- immediately and permanently -- or we're done."
> 
> And you have to MEAN IT.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Reread this post as many times as it takes to sink in, @jef999.

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk


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## TX-SC

GusPolinski said:


> Dude.
> 
> You are so behind the 8 ball here. Additionally, you're concerned w/ all the wrong things (i.e. violating your wife's "privacy", not being "controlling", etc.)
> 
> This is _at least_ an emotional affair, if not a full-blown _physical_ affair. And, assuming that it's not yet gone PA, you've got a rapidly-closing window of opportunity here in which you can work to ensure that it doesn't, so you need to ditch your anxious faux complacency and put on your game face.
> 
> This is how you do that...
> 
> "Wife, I have no interest in 'controlling' you. I do, however, expect you to 'control' yourself.
> 
> I'm not an idiot. I've seen the messages between the two of you, and they're BEYOND inappropriate. Additionally, you've been meeting up with him, and _in secret_ no less.
> 
> Until now I've been far too passive in dealing with this, thinking that a more 'take charge' approach would only add to the damage that's _already_ been done to our marriage. I now see this perspective for the abject foolishness that it is, and it ends TODAY.
> 
> So, if you want this 'friendship', then you're welcome to it. Know, however, that continuing in it will mean an end to our marriage.
> 
> In short, either you cut the bullsh*t -- immediately and permanently -- or we're done."
> 
> And you have to MEAN IT.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Great post, as always. She has to be made aware that you will not be a backup plan for her. If she wants this other guy, then divorce and move on.


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## The Middleman

I can't tell you what to do, but I can tell you what I did when I was in a similar situation. I confronted my wife who re-connected with an old ex-boyfriend via e-mail and very clearly told her I wasn't comfortable with it, and I wanted it to end immediatly. Period. If it continued, I would be gone. That's the short version of the longer story which can be found here: http://talkaboutmarriage.com/genera...sion/296722-wife-contact-ex.html#post13913554

I think you just have to lay the cards on the table and say "him or me". If she says she isn't ending contact, you know exactly where you stand. If I found myself with that kind of disrespect, I would grab as much of the money as I can and disappear ... and send everyone in the family all the evidence I had of the 'friendship' so they know in no uncertain terms why I left. I'm a scorched earth kind of guy; for me there is no middle ground in a situation like this. Just my two cents.


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## ThePheonix

jef999 said:


> What should I do?


Use Gus's post as your blue print, follow it verbatim, and get the show on the road right now. At the very best, you're already a lower level betrayed spouse.


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## G.J.

jef999 said:


> . If I confront her and ask her to stop or confront him and ask him to back off I think it will damage our marriage


Sorry but when I read this part I couldn't for the life of me understand your thought pattern :surprise:

Errr

ITS DAMAGED

You need to fix it quickly or contact a lawyer and help her so her 'secret meetings' don't have to be secret


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## badmemory

OP,

The worst you can do is to do nothing. Otherwise there are two directions you can go. 

You can take the advice given and insist that she end contact - if you are ready and willing to end your marriage if she doesn't comply.

Or, you can stop talking to her about this for now, and start full fledged covert monitoring to get that smoking gun evidence - then confront. (Check her cell phone records, VAR and GPS in her car, key logger on her computer, spyware on her cell, etc.) Two potential problems with this approach however. You risk this going PA before you can get the evidence; and since you've already done a "soft" confront, she may attempt to take this underground, which would make monitoring her more difficult. If you don't find anything after a few weeks, then you can still insist that she stop contact.

But you need to do one or the other. If it were me, I'd take the first option and continue to monitor to make sure she had ended contact.

You don't have to accept this from her and you shouldn't.


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## G.J.

Actually badmenory raise's a very important follow through

IF you confront at this stage you need to closely monitor for a long time after I'm afraid

If you choose to bury your head at least read a few of the posts on this board to see how these old friend relationships develop


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## Graywolf2

Before you do anything else at least put a voice activated recorder (VAR) under her car seat.

Look Here:
http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/209754-standard-evidence-post.html

You have a royal flush of risk factors:

Old friend that she’s comfortable with and can talk about old times

They can talk about his failed marriage and how it compares to hers

He’s single with no wife to keep an eye on him

My guess is that she’s around 40, a very dangerous time of life

I would also step up your game with your wife. Pay more attention to her. Talk to her more and *listen*. That’s what the other guy is doing to get into her pants.


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## G.J.

If you go the VARs at the minute before confronting ( I WOULD ) don't leave it for more than a couple of days

If it hasn't gone to PA its very close as she's already into secret meetings


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## eric1

Please listen to Gus and the guys suggesting a VAR


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## Marduk

jef999 said:


> I've been in a strong healthy relationship with my wife for 16 years, 9 of them married. I work away from home a lot, during my last trip away my wife bumped into a old college pal she hadn't seen in years, he is in the same line of work as her and they kept in touch after their first meeting. She told me she's met her old pal and that he'd offered to sell her some equipment for her business. She picked me up from the airport at the weekend and I instantly thought her behaviour was a bit off, she seemed nervous. Her friend crept up in conversation and I asked when we could go and see this stock she was buying , she was dismissive and evasive about the whole thing and that evening she was on messenger chatting to someone for ages. I did something that I've never done before and I really regret, I had a look at her messenger list and saw that she's been chatting with her new friend, constantly for the last 2 weeks since they first met up again. Not only that but it was really flirty both from her and him, his wife left him 6 months ago, they also had a secret meeting before she picked me up from the airport, I'm pretty sure nothing happened but this really turned my world upside down. I confronted her about it and we talked, she said she didn't know why she met up with him in secret she said I could trust her that nothing would happen however she wanted to be able to choose her own friends, I don't have a problem with her having friends, but I can't help feeling that a single male friend who she met with in secret is an appropriate friend, I also dont feel that her sitting in front of me flirting with a single guy on messenger is appropriate (when I say messenger I mean that she was typing to him not physically talking) as I'm sure she wouldn't sit there on the phone and speak to him in that manner if I was there. I feel devastated, really heartbroken, she's always been my best mate, we do a lot together and have always had a good relationship. I can't see a good ending to this, if I sit back and do nothing I really think I'll loose her to this guy, he's single , lonely and has found someone willing to meet up with him in secret from her husband, he's also got a lot in common with her. If I confront her and ask her to stop or confront him and ask him to back off I think it will damage our marriage , I'm not that kind of guy , I'm not controlling and I dont want to be, she should be free to do what she wants. I really regret looking at her messenger history, not only because of what I found but because it's a huge breach of the trust we have, or had. Please help  What should I do?


You're being emotional. You need to be rational.

Your response to "you can trust me with him" is that "you've already lied to me about him. He's already disrupted our marriage and eroded my trust for you. He's hitting on you and you're playing right into that. I'll make it easy for you -- go have your boyfriend. At the expense of your husband."

And then walk the hell away and refuse to discuss it any further unless it's in the context of how she was wrong to lie to you and how he's going to be gone from her life forever.


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## The Middleman

marduk said:


> You're being emotional. You need to be rational.
> 
> Your response to "you can trust me with him" is that "you've already lied to me about him. He's already disrupted our marriage and eroded my trust for you. He's hitting on you and you're playing right into that. I'll make it easy for you -- go have your boyfriend. At the expense of your husband."
> 
> And then walk the hell away and refuse to discuss it any further unless it's in the context of how she was wrong to lie to you and how he's going to be gone from her life forever.


This is pretty much what you have to do. Along the lines of what I said.


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## CantBelieveThis

OP please listen to the advice given to you here, I know for you it might sound abruptive and scary even, but believe me is worse to regret not acting decisively later on when is too late. This is a cancer to your marriage, it needs to be treated swiftly and w strength, that's the only way. 

Sent from my SM-T700 using Tapatalk


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## JohnA

You confronted and she denied your request. The problem is not that you might damage your marriage; the problem is she has damaged the marriage. This poster's marriage mirrors your http://talkaboutmarriage.com/private-members-section/319202-ive-been-played.html. Going forward remember to be polite and diplomatic in tone but determined in your actions.

Approximately how old are you and she? Do you have children? If so how old? 

What you need to do today: What have you done to prepare for divorce? Being prepared might be the only thing 
What state or country do you live in? Are you fimilar with divorce laws? Begin to search for a MC and make an appointment for yourself, not with her. Why not with her? Because it is for you to get your head straight, objectivity look at the fault lines in the marriage and the issues in it that you caused. Again, you caused. Why just you? Because your the only one right now that that realizes the problem. 

You know his name find out who his wife is gad contact her. Tell her what is happening, that he has told your wife you left him. Ask her what really happened and why. 

Begin using the 180 as a tool to help you see straight and make good decisions. Critical Readings For Separation and Divorce - LoveShack.org Community Forums. Again polite and dipolmatic at all time.


----------



## KJ_Simmons

OP....I was in the same situation as you. http://talkaboutmarriage.com/general-relationship-discussion/312953-cause-concern-wife-male-workout-partner.html I thought the same way you did - be trusting, be nice, she'll come around. That $hit doesn't work.

I took the advice of alot of the same posters who have given you advice, and it was gold. You don't nice your wife out of a fog. You whap her upside her head with a hard dose of reality and consequences, and give her a decision to make with regard to your futures.


----------



## Yeswecan

As many have stated, the marriage is already damaged and trust all but lost. Confront now.


----------



## JohnA

hi @Can'tBeliveThis who was your WS OM background? I know @calvin wife's EA never told her he was about to go to prison.


----------



## threelittlestars

So you are already making your first mistake. She was keeping something from you. Her meeting up with him secretly and you are TRYING to claim that you trust her? Really....WHY? she already lied and you caught her. Stop apologizing for snooping, she gave you probable cause. As we say to women facing infidelity, find your ***** boots and squash this.... Honestly i can't understand why people think that it hasn't progressed to physical cheating. If they have an opportunity to be face to face in the flesh that is already half way there what would stop them from touching each others hands intimately or a grope here or there. Or a kiss. Its EASY when you have physical access, and she HAD PHYSICAL ACESS... the burden of PROOF is on her. Ask her for a polygraph and get some peace of mind man. I went an ENTIRE year thinking my cheater actually had sex with another. The poly put my mind at ease.


----------



## CantBelieveThis

JohnA said:


> hi @Can'tBeliveThis who was your WS OM background? I know @calvin wife's EA never told her he was about to go to prison.


some drug addicted loser who tried to knock up a 7/11 while he was high, idiot....he went in for 3 years, is actually suppose to be out next month....


----------



## JohnA

Hi @KJ_Simmons,

Good to see you doing well. Colud you update your thread? @jef999 The guy looking to cash in on KJ marriage was a gym instructor. KJ dug into who the other man was and found a player who was openly boasting about his many girlfriends on his facebook page. 

Again, there are issues in your marriage otherwise you would not be here. How your wife is acting is a separate issue, hiding the issues. You need to separate the two. Her EA or PA is how she as choosen to respond to them and is completely on her. It is no different then you having a one night stand on a business trip because you where lonely. 

You mentioned you travel a lot for travel. How often and how long? 

You might find this tread helpful http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/24796-just-let-them-go.html


----------



## alte Dame

I've been on here for a while & experience breeds knowledge, so I will tell you what I know I would do now in a case like this. I would say to my spouse:

"You are cheating, lying, and hiding things from me. I'm not going to do this dance with you. If you think so little of me and our marriage that you can do this, then go to him. He's all yours and you're all his. I'm not fighting for someone who has so little love and respect for me."

Then I would watch my spouse completely freak out.

You need to be strong and stand up for yourself immediately.

So sorry about this.


----------



## Rubix Cubed

GusPolinski said:


> Dude.
> 
> You are so behind the 8 ball here. Additionally, you're concerned w/ all the wrong things (i.e. violating your wife's "privacy", not being "controlling", etc.)
> 
> This is _at least_ an emotional affair, if not a full-blown _physical_ affair. And, assuming that it's not yet gone PA, you've got a rapidly-closing window of opportunity here in which you can work to ensure that it doesn't, so you need to ditch your anxious faux complacency and put on your game face.
> 
> This is how you do that...
> 
> "Wife, I have no interest in 'controlling' you. I do, however, expect you to 'control' yourself.
> 
> I'm not an idiot. I've seen the messages between the two of you, and they're BEYOND inappropriate. Additionally, you've been meeting up with him, and _in secret_ no less.
> 
> Until now I've been far too passive in dealing with this, thinking that a more 'take charge' approach would only add to the damage that's _already_ been done to our marriage. I now see this perspective for the abject foolishness that it is, and it ends TODAY.
> 
> So, if you want this 'friendship', then you're welcome to it. Know, however, that continuing in it will mean an end to our marriage.
> 
> In short, either you cut the bullsh*t -- immediately and permanently -- or we're done."
> 
> And you have to MEAN IT.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


 QFT!
Gus nailed it as usual and I would add the standard VAR in the car and one where she converses on the phone, in the house. This is all textbook WW script. I just wanted to be one more to tell you this because it seems like it takes at least 3 dozen, or more, of these suggestions for any "nice guy" betrayed spouse to take action.


----------



## workindad

Op sorry for the spot you are in. 

There is only one reason the two would need to get together for a secret meeting. They are adults and obviously attracted to each other. 

If they just wanted to chat there is no reason to meet. If it was appropriate. There is no reason to hide it.


----------



## Marc878

There is no such thing as privacy to cheat in a marriage. It's an emotional affair at the least so infidelity has already happened. *Secret meeting!!!!!* More details of what you found are needed. It's a good bet it may have already gone to a physical affair.

You are like many who come here. It's shocking!!!! You at this time are in fear of pushing her away. Know this!!!!! She's already gone probably. Dig deep now!!!!! Read up on the attachment. If you want to salvage this unless it's a dealbreaker for you.

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping...vidence-post.html?highlight=standard+evidence

You need a VAR in her car now. You don't know the whole story and she will not divulge the truth at this time I'd bet. Unfortunately this is not unique.

The ones would come out best in these situations get strong and stay there. They are about to destroy your, life, family and future as you knew it. If you are weak and timid at this time you I'll lose.

Sorry you are here.


----------



## Marc878

jef999 said:


> I've been in a strong healthy relationship with my wife for 16 years, 9 of them married. I work away from home a lot, during my last trip away my wife bumped into a old college pal she hadn't seen in years, he is in the same line of work as her and they kept in touch after their first meeting. She told me she's met her old pal and that he'd offered to sell her some equipment for her business. She picked me up from the airport at the weekend and I instantly thought her behaviour was a bit off, she seemed nervous. Her friend crept up in conversation and I asked when we could go and see this stock she was buying , she was dismissive and evasive about the whole thing and that evening she was on messenger chatting to someone for ages. I did something that I've never done before and I really regret, I had a look at her messenger list and saw that she's been chatting with her new friend, constantly for the last 2 weeks since they first met up again.


You regret finding out your wife is having an inappropriate relationship with another man? Really? Cmon man.



> Not only that but it was really flirty both from her and him, his wife left him 6 months ago, they also had a secret meeting before she picked me up from the airport, I'm pretty sure nothing happened but this really turned my world upside down.


Famous last words. Better wake up!!!!



> I confronted her about it and we talked, she said she didn't know why she met up with him in secret she said I could trust her that nothing would happen however she wanted to be able to choose her own friends, I don't have a problem with her having friends, but I can't help feeling that a single male friend who she met with in secret is an appropriate friend, I also dont feel that her sitting in front of me flirting with a single guy on messenger is appropriate (when I say messenger I mean that she was typing to him not physically talking) as I'm sure she wouldn't sit there on the phone and speak to him in that manner if I was there. I feel devastated, really heartbroken, she's always been my best mate, we do a lot together and have always had a good relationship. I can't see a good ending to this, if I sit back and do nothing I really think I'll loose her to this guy, he's single , lonely and has found someone willing to meet up with him in secret from her husband, he's also got a lot in common with her. If I confront her and ask her to stop or confront him and ask him to back off I think it will damage our marriage


She's already damaged the marriage. 



> I'm not that kind of guy , I'm not controlling and I dont want to be, she should be free to do what she wants. I really regret looking at her messenger history, not only because of what I found but because it's a huge breach of the trust we have, or had. Please help  What should I do?


There's a big difference between controlling and protecting your marriage, life, family and future. So she's free to become involved with another man???? You don't get strong and wake up you'll be on the outside looking in.


----------



## jef999

Some tough reading but these two posts helped a lot, thanks everyone for your input. Confronted her again today but a lot differently, no more passivity, everything laid on the line and no messing around. Happy with the result so far but time will tell, getting her to see it the other way around really helped. 



nursejackie said:


> I had an EA/PA with a coworker many years ago. I have thought carefully about how H could have stopped it had he known in the earlier stages and acted. He had found communications between us, knew that we socialized at work functions and once a week after work as a group. He never seemed to worry about it and I convinced myself there was nothing wrong if it wasn't physical. Of course I KNEW there was something wrong. I knew I was developing feelings for him. And, of course these things turn into a PA eventually.
> 
> If H had gotten firm and demanded that I quit contact with him I would have gaslit and gone underground especially if he got angry. If he had confronted calmly and with conviction- showed me how this was taking my time and emotional energy away from my marriage -I may have listened. It would have been very beneficial to pair that with concern for what was missing in our relationship and how we could both work towards fulfilling those needs. (I was basically lonely- your wife could be too) If he had insisted on MC to explore these issues maybe I would've woken up and realized the damage that I was causing by this flirtation and the devastation I could cause if it continued or went physical.
> 
> I think the confident addition to all of this that he would be out the door no questions asked if I continued to jeopardize the marriage would have driven the seriousness of what was happening. If he had put the shoe on the other foot and asked how I'd feel if he were doing the same….
> 
> I really only ever wanted my husband- I just wanted more of him. This does not excuse what I did or what your wife is doing (definitely an EA) I'm just trying to give you my perspective at the time.
> 
> Weigh all the advice given and do what you are able to do. Good luck.





GusPolinski said:


> Dude.
> 
> You are so behind the 8 ball here. Additionally, you're concerned w/ all the wrong things (i.e. violating your wife's "privacy", not being "controlling", etc.)
> 
> This is _at least_ an emotional affair, if not a full-blown _physical_ affair. And, assuming that it's not yet gone PA, you've got a rapidly-closing window of opportunity here in which you can work to ensure that it doesn't, so you need to ditch your anxious faux complacency and put on your game face.
> 
> This is how you do that...
> 
> "Wife, I have no interest in 'controlling' you. I do, however, expect you to 'control' yourself.
> 
> I'm not an idiot. I've seen the messages between the two of you, and they're BEYOND inappropriate. Additionally, you've been meeting up with him, and _in secret_ no less.
> 
> Until now I've been far too passive in dealing with this, thinking that a more 'take charge' approach would only add to the damage that's _already_ been done to our marriage. I now see this perspective for the abject foolishness that it is, and it ends TODAY.
> 
> So, if you want this 'friendship', then you're welcome to it. Know, however, that continuing in it will mean an end to our marriage.
> 
> In short, either you cut the bullsh*t -- immediately and permanently -- or we're done."
> 
> And you have to MEAN IT.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## JohnA

Perhaps now you can review your marriage for these 12 toxic elements*


Lying to or hiding things from your partner
Withholding any kind of affection
Harboring quiet resentment
Lack of communication
Being stubborn about things or getting entrenched in certain positions
Bickering about mundane daily issues and chores
Condescension
Staying in a relationship out of convenience
Manipulation
Jealousy
Presenting a false version of yourself at the beginning.*
Staying together because you've become codependent


----------



## JohnA

Watch her actions and look for these


Red flags*

Sex life dropped off noticeably
Passwords on phone and computer
Much more time on line...fakebook.
More GNOs...staying out later.
Less eye contact and holding hands...much less physical contact.
Less communication.
Staying up late on computer.
Dressing more provocative
More shopping-spending...clothes.
3 hour groceries shopping trips
Gasoline use and mileage went up
Generally disconnected from family.
New friends that I wasn't introduced to
Cell/text usage went up...way up.
New hair style and attention to makeup
Started exercising more.
Secretive about whereabouts during contact
She would become annoyed easily with me.
Household responsibilities dropped way off.
ecame more forgetful in general
A noticable distancing from her family.
Much more waxing...trimming...shaving....not for me.

Hat tip @chapparal


----------



## GusPolinski

jef999 said:


> Some tough reading but these two posts helped a lot, thanks everyone for your input. Confronted her again today but a lot differently, no more passivity, everything laid on the line and no messing around. Happy with the result so far but time will tell, getting her to see it the other way around really helped.


Good job.

Now comes the truly crappy part...

You have to start watching her more closely.

That may even include monitoring of one sort.

In fact, given that you often travel for work, it would be naive to think that she'll cut this guy off cold turkey.

Smart money has her reaching out to him the next time you're away.

Keep your eyes open and your ear to the ground
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Graywolf2

jef999 said:


> Some tough reading but these two posts helped a lot, thanks everyone for your input. Confronted her again today but a lot differently, no more passivity, everything laid on the line and no messing around. Happy with the result so far but time will tell, getting her to see it the other way around really helped.


This is very good but you should have a VAR in place before you kick the ant nest. Buy at least two now.


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## virtualhope

I'm sorry you're going through this and I can imagine how you must feel. After 9 years of a strong healthy marriage, it's completely understandable to feel confused about what's happened and even a bit uncertain about the future. I know things may look bleak right now, but I hope that you will not give up on your marriage. Great marriages are built on trust and open, honest communication. And sometimes they also require loving confrontation in order to repair the broken places and restore unity. I hope that you will find the strength and resolve to do whatever is needed in this situation and pray that the result is a marriage that is also stronger and more resilient. Stay the course and be encouraged. My thoughts and prayers are with you.


----------



## Yeswecan

Keep us posted. We are here for you!


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## TaDor

Also, if you can - track her phone with GPS. It came in handy when I caught mine spending 2 hours from home going to the POSOM's home. She DID NOT go to any park, as she said.

Get software that allows you to monitor without her knowing. It may cost you about $50 or so for 6 months, but YOU'LL be able to see what she is texting and where she is going. So if she's at some unknown house or motel, you can call and pretend to know nothing and watch her lie.

This is EARLY, don't trust her fully yet.
Have her watch that video.

My three things YOU must do:
1 - Get the book "Not Just Friends" Shirley Glass HERE: Dr. Shirley Glass - NOT "Just Friends"
2 - Watch the video (Infidelity: What every couple should know) : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m8QKOUbosNo
3 - Go to Couples Counseling. Women have emotional needs. When a man cheats, he'll usually try to save the marriage. When a woman cheats - she is likely to set it on fire and watch it burn.


If you and your spouse value your relationship - Watch the video, read the book! I cannot stress that enough.

Also, Listen to what GUY and Eric says.

I found this site weeks too late. If I found it 8 weeks earlier - my life and my family life would be so different! Had only did google earlier when I suspected, not when it was on fire.


----------



## No Longer Lonely Husband

You have been given good advice. Confront, expose to your friends and family. Like it or not you are in a battle for your marriage. You must be firm and strong. I think this most likely has gone physical, hence the nervous behavior, I would go see OM, too. If your wife does not like that tough shyt! Man up! Do not mouse out or you will lose.


----------



## Be smart

Sorry you are here my friend.

I need to ask. What is history between your wife and OM ? Old boyfriend or what ?

I like your second post a lot more but now you need to be careful. I see big problem here. You are away from home a lot and there is a lot of opportunity for your wife to continue this Affair or worse,find another one. 

Check her phone,mail and other accounts. If you find something dont tell her,come back here and talk with us. 

There is other thing-your wife knew about her consequences but she keep communicating with him and doing it in front of you. This shows me she lost respect for you my friend. She even attacked you in some way saying she wants to chose her friends but she knew this man was not a friend. He is/was something more.

Keep watching her.

Stay strong.


----------



## TDSC60

Definitely keep a close eye on her behavior. With you out of town, she is basically free to do what she wants unless you can check her location occasionally.

What about kids? What is your situation?

Some cheaters just become better at hiding their cheating once they are confronted and figure out how you busted them.


----------



## The Middleman

jef999 said:


> Some tough reading but these two posts helped a lot, thanks everyone for your input. Confronted her again today but a lot differently, no more passivity, everything laid on the line and no messing around. Happy with the result so far but time will tell, getting her to see it the other way around really helped.


A good first step .. but only a first step. Continued vigilance on your part is necessary to assure she is actually ending this thing. Keep in mind you may only just have driven her relationship with this slug underground. If she was enjoying his company, she might not want give it up so easily. You need to continue to monitor and show you mean business. Here is a thread of a guy who thought he caught an affair before it happened and only drove it underground. Read it and learn from it ... it's a horror story: http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/57247-she-cheated-i-hate-my-life.html#post1107509

Also, are you comfortable that you know the truth about the extent of their relationship so far? Are you sure it didn't go further than you know? What did she admit to?


----------



## G.J.

jef999 said:


> Some tough reading but these two posts helped a lot, thanks everyone for your input. Confronted her again today but a lot differently, no more passivity, everything laid on the line and no messing around. Happy with the result so far but time will tell, getting her to see it the other way around really helped.


So......what was different ?

Summary of how you confronted with agreed lines to follow ?

Her reaction..comments..indignation to begin with then acceptance ?


----------



## No Longer Lonely Husband

jef999 said:


> Some tough reading but these two posts helped a lot, thanks everyone for your input. Confronted her again today but a lot differently, no more passivity, everything laid on the line and no messing around. Happy with the result so far but time will tell, getting her to see it the other way around really helped.


Do not be lulled into a false sense of security. Be ever vigilant. VAR is imperative. One in her car and one in your house in the room she spends the most time in. It is not fun to have to be hyper-vigilant, but after the "secret meeting" you have no choice if you want the truth.
So you laid everything on the line. Do you have any concrete evidence she told you the truth? No. Cheaters lie. Do not forget this fact.


----------



## Slow Hand

Wow, good luck, you're gonna need it. So sorry you are here, but know that you are among some great folks who are looking out for your best interest. You'll know which ones, they get a lot of likes.:wink2:

I played the PI game for a bit and it was grueling, I came to the realization that it just wasn't worth it anymore. I never did find anything inappropriate, but she sure did lie and gas light me. She wanted me to believe I was crazy and that I need to see a shrink! She even told me that I was demon possessed and that nobody likes me anyway. So glad I didn't believe her. :grin2:

But, I'm afraid she likely went PA, she had the opportunity and the way she acted when she picked you up at the airport, says it all. Then there's that damn secret meeting you regret uncovering, time to man up!



> She picked me up from the airport at the weekend and *I instantly thought her behaviour was a bit off, she seemed nervous.* Her friend crept up in conversation and I asked when we could go and see this stock she was buying , *she was dismissive and evasive about the whole thing* and that evening she was on messenger chatting to someone for ages. I did something that I've never done before and I really regret, I had a look at her messenger list and saw that she's been chatting with her new friend, constantly for the last 2 weeks since they first met up again. *Not only that but it was really flirty both from her and him*, his wife left him 6 months ago, *they also had a secret meeting before she picked me up from the airport*


In my opinion, I'd serve her with divorce papers, that ought to wake her up! 

You've been given most excellent advice on this thread, I hope you heed the warning!


----------



## jsmart

Getting the VAR in place is critical. With you traveling a lot, there is ample opportunity for her. You should also watch for a sympathetic friend that will egg her on. A WW will usually have a confidant. That's where a VAR can also help identify enemies of your marriage.

I'm concerned that this is already gone PA. Not necessarily sexual yet but like I said in earlier post, they probably kissed and held hands at the secret meeting before picking you up. Which is why in your gut you noticed that she was distant and nervous. 

These initial stages in a PA are HUGE. They start with her appearing to not be present in the moment. Kissing during sex will stop. Expect kind acts such as special meals all done out of guilt. The path ends with wife refusing to have sex with husband to stay loyal to her new man. 

If it she has started the PA, it will be hard for her to stop. The chemicals that the brain releases while sneaking around committing adultery are as addictive as crack or heroin. She'll feel guilt and the logic side of her brain will try to convince her to stop but like a junkie, she'll be drawn to him and will find herself willing to perform any acts to keep the feeling going.

In your last post it seems like you're starting to understand the seriousness of your situation but I'm not getting a sense of urgency. Almost like, you think we're blowing this out of proportion. So many BHs come here with the "You don''t know my wife" or "What we have is different." This will be wrong. We've seen this story so many times and know that bold, decisive action are the only way to even have a chance to stop this. The respect her privacy and attempt to nice her will repulse her right into other man's bed.


----------



## 86857

Good work @jef999. 

What happened on the confront this time? 

Find out who OM is. Does he live locally, married etc? 
She should tell you. She must know all about him by now. Suspicious if she doesn't tell you. 
She's your W so she should answer any question you have - truthfully. 

If not, google his name. Amazing what will pop up on google. 

No matter how well it seems to have gone this time, monitor. 

Read http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/209754-standard-evidence-post.html


----------



## eric1

jsmart said:


> Getting the VAR in place is critical. With you traveling a lot, there is ample opportunity for her. You should also watch for a sympathetic friend that will egg her on. A WW will usually have a confidant. That's where a VAR can also help identify enemies of your marriage.
> 
> I'm concerned that this is already gone PA. Not necessarily sexual yet but like I said in earlier post, they probably kissed and held hands at the secret meeting before picking you up. Which is why in your gut you noticed that she was distant and nervous.
> 
> These initial stages in a PA are HUGE. They start with her appearing to not be present in the moment. Kissing during sex will stop. Expect kind acts such as special meals all done out of guilt. The path ends with wife refusing to have sex with husband to stay loyal to her new man.
> 
> If it she has started the PA, it will be hard for her to stop. The chemicals that the brain releases while sneaking around committing adultery are as addictive as crack or heroin. She'll feel guilt and the logic side of her brain will try to convince her to stop but like a junkie, she'll be drawn to him and will find herself willing to perform any acts to keep the feeling going.
> 
> In your last post it seems like you're starting to understand the seriousness of your situation but I'm not getting a sense of urgency. Almost like, you think we're blowing this out of proportion. So many BHs come here with the "You don''t know my wife" or "What we have is different." This will be wrong. We've seen this story so many times and know that bold, decisive action are the only way to even have a chance to stop this. The respect her privacy and attempt to nice her will repulse her right into other man's bed.





This is exactly right. You need to STOP her affair, not convince and plead her not to have one. You need the tools in place ( VAR/Electronic Monitoring) to assure you of this - these are not you being a needy jerk, these are tools an assertive man who doesn't take this kind of betrayal lying down. You need to calmly and rationally tell her that she needs to provide you a complete written timeline down to what color shoes she was wearing on their date. You need to tell her in no uncertain terms that no contact means no contact, and if he reaches out that her only move if she does want to stay married is to let you know right away. You need to avoid her gas lighting - she is allowed to have friends but it's patently clear neither of them are looking to have a friend. Period. 

You need to follow this up with a poly. Poly tests are a debate, but what isn't a debate is the look on her face when you tell her that you have scheduled one. 

These things are all essential if you ever want to trust her again. They are a first step
And need to be done. If you do not do these then you can kiss any hope of self-preservation away, much less a happy marriage


----------



## michzz

eric1 said:


> This is exactly right. You need to STOP her affair, not convince and plead her not to have one. You need the tools in place ( VAR/Electronic Monitoring) to assure you of this - these are not you being a needy jerk, these are tools an assertive man who doesn't take this kind of betrayal lying down. You need to calmly and rationally tell her that she needs to provide you a complete written timeline down to what color shoes she was wearing on their date. You need to tell her in no uncertain terms that no contact means no contact, and if he reaches out that her only move if she does want to stay married is to let you know right away. You need to avoid her gas lighting - she is allowed to have friends but it's patently clear neither of them are looking to have a friend. Period.
> 
> You need to follow this up with a poly. Poly tests are a debate, but what isn't a debate is the look on her face when you tell her that you have scheduled one.
> 
> These things are all essential if you ever want to trust her again. They are a first step
> And need to be done. If you do not do these then you can kiss any hope of self-preservation away, much less a happy marriage


She will argue with any demands you make and try to flip it on you, to blame you for her behavior. Don't tolerate this.

Be ready, as others have said, to walk over this.

It is likely she has minimized just exactly when and how often they met and what they did. 

It is in the cheater's script.


----------



## jb02157

I wonder how much of a difference it would have made for you to confront, telling her that you know what's going on making her make a conscious decision of whether she wants to pursue the OM, or stay dark and monitor and see how far it goes. I'd hate to know that the only reason she didn't go farther is because I told her that I knew what she was doing. That wouldn't really prove anything. She may just pursue someone else that you didn't know about and stay as dark as possible about it. 

If the OP's wife decides to stop and save the marriage...this time, I would still be awfully worried that she wouldn't try something like that again. She seems to have the desire for some type of an affair the only thing you don't know is how far she would take it.


----------



## naiveonedave

jb02157 said:


> I wonder how much of a difference it would have made for you to confront, telling her that you know what's going on making her make a conscious decision of whether she wants to pursue the OM, or stay dark and monitor and see how far it goes. I'd hate to know that the only reason she didn't go farther is because I told her that I knew what she was doing. That wouldn't really prove anything. She may just pursue someone else that you didn't know about and stay as dark as possible about it.


You present a real catch 22. My problem with your opinion of making her stop it, is that sometimes people mess up and need help to stop from messing up. Once it goes PA, it is totally different than a little infatuation.


----------



## eric1

The problem with giving her rope to hang herself is that it'll decimate him.

Be honest, direct and don't access crap for answers. Investigate thoroughly. You'll know quickly if she isn't being truthful and if it's worth pursuing.

I mean if you stop her and she still cheats atleast you can love with yourself.


----------



## Be smart

Here is my opinion,maybe I am wrong.

He did confront her and tell her this needs to stop and how he feels about it,but the problem is his wife keep doing it and what is even worse she was texting this man in his presence.

So I am asking is it worth of "Fighting" for her or stopping this Affair if she cares so little about him ? She knows how he feels at this moment but she is chasing this man not caring about her husband at all.

If you want to solve this with your wife you need to place some VARs in your house. Your wife has a lot of free time and you need to be sure this Affair is over and will never happen again. Also your wife needs to apologize to you and she needs to learn some boundaries.

Stay strong.


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## michzz

Ultimately, I HATED the idea of policing my ex-wife, thinking that that would "make" her love and respect me. All it did was feed her disdain for me and ruin my self respect.

I latched onto the idea that if policing is the only thing keeping her "faithful" (or in her case, appearing to be faithful), then I don't want any part of it.

Not just self control, but an active "not tempted, not gonna be!" attitude was what I seek out of a wife.

Self control means to me that there is a constant fight within to stay coloring within the lines. Policing means i have to play daddy to a petulant teenage girl personality-wise.

No thanks!

BTW, I learned the hard way and spend MANY years chasing her to want me.

Yuck


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## sixbravebulls

I was where you are now two years ago. I had an awesome marriage and then found my wife was friend's with her ex (who she knew I hated) on FB. Then I found the emails....

Two years later the bad feelings come and go. Mostly I'm over it, but the triggers will always pull you back into a funk.

Social media, texting, chatting - I just don't see how women can resist all the new forms and ways of getting attention from men. These women can't help themselves and because it's electronic and private no one else can save them.


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## Sports Fan

Nip this in the bud now. Squash it hard and fast.

If you share joint accounts withdrawl the money and put it in your own personal account. Tell her that you will not tolerate this cra...p whilst she is married to you. 

Do not feel bad for looking at her messanger. She gave you good reason to doubt her and your fears were confirmed. Take it from me. No good could come from this.

She is already lying to you and meeting him behind your back. Eventually if it hasnt already this will turn physical.

I say this in a nice way but man up and squash this unremorsefully now. Your marriage is already in a bad place with your wifes current behavour. You cannot make it any worse by asserting yourself that you wont tolerate her behavour. If she threatens to leave let her in fact offer to help her pack. 

You need to wake her up back to reality. However do not bluff any of this. You have to be ready to follow through on any actions you threaten.


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## TDSC60

sixbravebulls said:


> I was where you are now two years ago. I had an awesome marriage and then found my wife was friend's with her ex (who she knew I hated) on FB. Then I found the emails....
> 
> Two years later the bad feelings come and go. Mostly I'm over it, but the triggers will always pull you back into a funk.
> 
> Social media, texting, chatting - I just don't see how women can resist all the new forms and ways of getting attention from men. These women can't help themselves and because it's electronic and private no one else can save them.


And because it is electronic, they don't consider it cheating. It appears that they think of it as a game and playing a computer game is not cheating - right?. At least that is how I think of the mind-set some use to justify what they do.


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## G.J.

TDSC60 said:


> And because it is electronic, they don't consider it cheating. It appears that they think of it as a game and playing a computer game is not cheating - right?. At least that is how I think of the mind-set some use to justify what they do.


That an interesting thought TDSC60


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## Thor

jef999, this is exactly how it goes. Ok, she's not on FB with him, yet, as far as you know. But still this is the psychology of it. It happens _all the time_. Just ask any marriage counselor how frequently an affair starts by touching base with an old friend from college or high school.

https://youtu.be/4Gc30PPvs3M


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## Thor

G.J. said:


> Actually badmenory raise's a very important follow through
> 
> IF you confront at this stage you need to closely monitor for a long time after I'm afraid
> 
> If you choose to bury your head at least read a few of the posts on this board to see how these old friend relationships develop


Four years from the first Facebook incident with my wife and an ex-bf and a recurrence. Things had improved in many ways during that time, and I had even decided I was the one who was now holding onto the past, not her, so I was mulling over the idea of blocking him on my FB. He would disappear to me, meaning I would never see any posts, pictures, tags, or mentions of him. Then he popped up again on my wife's FB.

I think in OP's case this *is* infidelity already, given not only her secret meeting but her frequent electronic messaging contact. Which means there is now a need for _permanent_ monitoring of no-contact with him.

It could be 6 months, it could be 4 years (like my wife), it could be another 10 years. One or the other is almost certain to break no-contact.

Permanent transparency is now in order. No secret passwords to phones, emails, social media, computer, etc. OP gets instant access to all her electronics at any time for any reason. She's proven herself dis-loyal to the marriage. OP has every right to verify she is on the straight and narrow.


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## jef999

Hi Guys, 
I haven't replied or added any comments for a few days because I've been waiting to see how things work out.
To answer some of the questions here's a bit more information.
The guy in question went to college with my wife for a few years about 20 years ago, they were part of a small but very close group of friends who lived and studied and partied together. No prior romantic involvement. The have not spoken at all since college until they met recently. He is in the same line of work as my wife and it is an unusual career for a woman. 
Regarding the secret meeting: they were both planning to go to a public sale ( to do with their line of work) but for other reasons my wife was unable to go. The arranged to meet at his house instead for an hour, it was on her way to pick me up from the airport. I'm 100% positive nothing sexual happened for reasons I wont go into on here. However, she did still keep the meeting secret from me. 

About us: We are both independent, we dont have kids, I work out of the country for about 6 months a year usually for a month at a time, I've done this for our entire relationship. I've never had a reason in 16 years not to trust her. 

My first confrontation with her was emotional, I did not give myself any time to think, I jumped in with both feet and the conclusion was unsatisfactory. Which lead me to seek advice here. 
My second confrontation was much calmer, I explained why I was not happy. I made her see it the other way round and got her to imagine if I did what she did and how she would feel about it. I've explained the consequences of her continued behaviour in this manner. 
I've demanded that contact ends. And I've told her the marriage will be over if she lies or sneaks about again (This is no idle threat either, I cant spend 6 months a year in a constant state of worry, anger and stress wondering what she's up to. If I cant trust her again I cant stay married, for the sake of my own mental health) 
There was a lot more said but I wont go into it here, the outcome is that we are starting out fresh taking every day as it comes. Very early days yet but I'm hopeful that what we have is strong enough to overcome this. I'm hopeful that I've stopped anything from developing further. 
On the surface things are looking much better, we are talking more than ever, even planning to get dressed up and go out on a date, something we've not done for a while, and generally spend a bit more quality time together. 
However, I'm not naive and I'm not ready to trust yet so I have taken on board a lot of follow up advice from here and put some into action. I'll find out if she does go behind my back again. 
This weekend was the first hurdle as I've been away working but I can confirm that we cleared the hurdle no problem. 
Thanks everyone for all the advice. It genuinely has helped and I think I'm on the right track. I'm hoping I wont need to update this thread again but who knows what the future will hold. 
Good luck to anyone in a similar situation. 
Jef999


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## G.J.

jef999 said:


> I'll find out if she does go behind my back again.
> This weekend was the first hurdle as I've been away working but I can confirm that we cleared the hurdle no problem.


How do/did you accomplish the above and what was her excuse going to a guys house ????

And what did she say about "Not only that but it was really flirty both from her and him" Texting ?


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## jsmart

jef999 said:


> Hi Guys,
> I haven't replied or added any comments for a few days because I've been waiting to see how things work out.
> To answer some of the questions here's a bit more information.
> T*he guy in question went to college with my wife for a few years about 20 years ago, they were part of a small but very close group of friends who lived and studied and partied together. No prior romantic involvement. *The have not spoken at all since college until they met recently. He is in the same line of work as my wife and it is an unusual career for a woman.
> Regarding the secret meeting: they were both planning to go to a public sale ( to do with their line of work) but for other reasons my wife was unable to go. *The arranged to meet at his house instead for an hour,* it was on her way to pick me up from the airport. I'm 100% positive nothing sexual happened for reasons I wont go into on here. However, she did still keep the meeting secret from me.
> 
> About us: We are both independent, we dont have kids, I work out of the country for about 6 months a year usually for a month at a time, I've done this for our entire relationship. I've never had a reason in 16 years not to trust her.
> 
> My first confrontation with her was emotional, I did not give myself any time to think, I jumped in with both feet and the conclusion was unsatisfactory. Which lead me to seek advice here.
> My second confrontation was much calmer, I explained why I was not happy. I made her see it the other way round and got her to imagine if I did what she did and how she would feel about it. I've explained the consequences of her continued behaviour in this manner.
> I've demanded that contact ends. And I've told her the marriage will be over if she lies or sneaks about again (This is no idle threat either, I cant spend 6 months a year in a constant state of worry, anger and stress wondering what she's up to. If I cant trust her again I cant stay married, for the sake of my own mental health)
> There was a lot more said but I wont go into it here, the outcome is that we are starting out fresh taking every day as it comes. Very early days yet but I'm hopeful that what we have is strong enough to overcome this. I'm hopeful that I've stopped anything from developing further.
> On the surface things are looking much better, we are talking more than ever, even planning to get dressed up and go out on a date, something we've not done for a while, and generally spend a bit more quality time together.
> However, I'm not naive and I'm not ready to trust yet so I have taken on board a lot of follow up advice from here and put some into action. I'll find out if she does go behind my back again.
> This weekend was the first hurdle as I've been away working but I can confirm that we cleared the hurdle no problem.
> Thanks everyone for all the advice. It genuinely has helped and I think I'm on the right track. I'm hoping I wont need to update this thread again but who knows what the future will hold.
> Good luck to anyone in a similar situation.
> Jef999


They have a past connection. Just because she told you they never hooked up doesn't mean it's true. She would tell you that to put your guard down. Even if true, they could have both had a thing for each other but never had the opportunity make things happen. 

She went to this man's house for an hour after weeks of secretly communicating and flirting with each other and you know nothing happened? Yet she was acting so shady when she picked you up, that your gut had you research infidelity and sign up on this forum.

You have no idea how many men come here for advise thinking they uncovered an EA when after more digging it turns out it was a PA. I posted earlier that I thought that she probably kissed him and finding out she went to his house for at least an hour, that you know of, I think it more so.


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## 86857

Thanks for update @jef999. Considering you guys have been together for 16 years & you are away for 6 months each year, it sounds as if you have a very good marriage. I assume there hasn't been any other incident like this. 

Now that you have explained it, I tried to put myself in W's position. I too hung out in a close-knit small group at university. We lost contact. If I came across one (a guy), I would definitely like to meet up & hear about the others too. I'd be disappointed I couldn't go to the conference & if he said let's meet up, I would, to talk about old times & the others. If it had to be at his house, I'd be uncomfortable after all those years, even if we were only platonic friends & I would suggest a meet at a cafe/bar. Ones home is a very private space. I wouldn't invite him to mine in these circumstances. 

They weren't meeting up so he could sell her business equipment. He could have emailed her the details or set up a business meeting for later. They were meeting to catch up in person. They both knew that. But it's understandable in the circumstances. 

OK, so thus far I would have met him, but not at his house. Let's say I did meet him at his house, I'd also have sent a text to my H to say e.g., "Hey, guess who I bumped into, Mr X from univ. Can't get to the conference but I'm going over to his house instead as he has some business equipment he'd like to sell me." See, even that sounds very strange. No wonder she felt awkward & lied about it. 

Afterwards, being married, naturally I wouldn't have flirted with him for the next 2 weeks. Are you 100% sure they didn't meet again? You were away, right? Hopefully you could tell from the texts. I'd be furious. A secret meeting at his house ends up in 2 weeks of flirting. What if you hadn't found out. Still can't understand why she would text in front of you and then have the gall to get arrogant on the confront, saying she would 'choose her own friends' while knowing it was a 'friend' she had to lie about to you because it was so inappropriate and knowing she had been text flirting with him. 

If I was in your position, it would take me a long time to get past it. I wouldn't want it to be like that but I just know I would. I'd probably feel the niggles about it for quite a while. Having my spouse flirting with someone, then lying to me when caught would put me on alert, and not just for a month. You were lucky to catch it early. I'd also be wondering what would have happened if I hadn't found out. 

Have you asked her to send him a no contact text, in front of you, telling him she is married & shouldn't have flirted with him & would not be engaging with him again, even through business? I hope so. Even that doesn't guarantee they won't but it's a start. 

I would want verifiable truth going forward. I don't know for how long, maybe a year. . . especially because you're away so much. He's not the only man she meets, as she works in a male-oriented field. So I would be monitoring everything, her email, messages, FB etc. I don't know if you're a techie but it's easy to do, even f you're away. You must NOT let her know you are doing it though because she can go underground. Don't ask her for passwords etc. Easiest is a key logger on her computer. Gives you everything in one fell swoop. You have to be careful with the firewall etc & know what you're doing. With her phone, when you're back you can copy her backup from her computer to yours & check it out with Wondershare Dr Fone. That will give you everything on her phone. And a GPS tracker for her car, there are very good ones these days. For good measure, I'd have a PI keep an eye on her when you were next away, say just over a weekend. DON'T feel in the least guilty about snooping. You owe it to yourself to protect yourself. You are a good H who didn't deserve being stabbed in the back & you must ensure you don't get stabbed again. 

It may seem like overkill but like I say, after 16 years of marriage to be lied to & have her flirting would, for me, put a new light on the marriage I thought we had. A trashing of it if you will. The worst thing is the trust. She broke it. 

So if I put all those measures in place & everything was fine, for a year probably, well then great. But I'd sure be doing it. 

From what you say it seems she will be faithful going forward. I'm glad you told her in no uncertain terms that if she ever lies to you again, or you find out she is flirting with someone, it's an instant divorce. She has the cheater weakness unfortunately, no matter what way you look at it. Cheaters have the ability to inflict the greatest pain we will ever know on us which is why R takes years, because it's so hard to get past. In your first post you said your world has been turned upside-down. That is what I mean.

You may not agree with me. I too was deceived in very much the same way once, an EA. The relationship was great up to then. It was afterwards too, we got past it, or so I thought. Heck we even got married. But I kept up the surveillance, not heavy duty. It wasn't as if I was watching him every minute. I couldn't & wouldn't live like that. But I kept a subtle eye out. Yes, you've guessed it. It happened again 3 years down the track. And the relationship was still going great. It really was. I'm divorced now. So I'm coming at this from my own perspective, hence my long post I guess. I would do anything I could to protect anyone from going through that kind of pain. I do believe in the saying, 'once a cheater, always a cheater', from my own experience, friends etc & naturally on TAM. They won't always cheat again but when this sort of thing happens, you know they have the potential to. 

Good luck with it & I really hope it all works out well for you in the future. 
Maybe post now & then. I find Tammers are great for a view from the outside, cheater stories have so many similarities so you get hints on what to look out for . . . and to give me a reality check.


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## farsidejunky

@jef999

I understand why you may see it necessary to withhold information from the board. I also am unsure whether or not that information would change my view on this situation.

Bottom line is that I cannot envision a scenario, based on the facts you have presented, that she was/is not cheating on you.

Proceed with extreme caution and vigilance.

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk


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## threelittlestars

Not to be a negative nancey, but you don't just put this kind of topic to rest like that. STARTING OVER? You do that after the shock has worn off. This stinks of rug sweeping, and her (affair) is going to go under ground.... Sorry, but your wife has not woken up. Wayward's RARELY wake up that fast. And....Im just thinking you are in shock, and scared and just want things to go back to the way they were. As someone who went through what many would call a minor infidelity a year and a half ago, I'm still on SI and TAM daily. Im still hurting and in pain DAILY....this is not something that poof YOU START OVER. 

It takes work even on the BS side, and i don't really get the feeling you are addressing that work. It may just be a part of the shock you are going through, but soon you do need to realize that you can't just....MOVE ON that fast. You can move on, but it does not happen over night or even a week. 

But i DO wish you luck. I just hope you do it right, it will save you months, if not YEARS of stress and further heartbreak.


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## sparrow55

i really suggest that you dig a little and verify that this is the first time it happened. Her initial non-chalance was worrying




> I'm 100% positive nothing sexual happened for reasons I wont go into on here.


Do you mean PIV ? There is still stuff she could have done without having sex. How sure are you that it didn't happen either ?


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## Decorum

There is some rugsweeping going on here.

She is acting out of fear of losing you, she has not come to the place where she is ready to leave you for the OM but she had a good start in that direction. Are you really ok with that?
Do you really think fear is enough?

She is open to letting other men meet her needs.
What does that tell you?

I'm not seeing any genuine remorse, but op is witholding things so its hard to say for sure.

If you had not caught her, she would be in the "we are just friends" mode, and "you are trying to control me", "your insecurities are the problem".

This may not be her first rodeo.

I dont think this is over by a long shot.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## just got it 55

Yeah... I'm with the crowd on this one 

You're not out of the woods yet Skippy

55


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## Augusto

The way you explained it by the two of you starting over sounds like she was planning to fvck this guy. You have been given good advice. However you have also done all you can. If she goes outside and plays around, you have no reason to fight for your marraige as she would have made her choice. Your wife was sharpening the dagger for your back. She may not have been able to throw it now but she could later on.


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## tech-novelist

jef999 said:


> Regarding the secret meeting: they were both planning to go to a public sale ( to do with their line of work) but for other reasons my wife was unable to go. *The arranged to meet at his house instead for an hour, it was on her way to pick me up from the airport. I'm 100% positive nothing sexual happened for reasons I wont go into on here.* However, she did still keep the meeting secret from me.


I cannot imagine how you could be 100% certain that nothing sexual happened during that hour in his house.

Unless perhaps you work in the NSA and have camera access to his entire house, but that seems pretty unlikely...


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## TDSC60

jef999 said:


> Hi Guys,
> I haven't replied or added any comments for a few days because I've been waiting to see how things work out.
> To answer some of the questions here's a bit more information.
> The guy in question went to college with my wife for a few years about 20 years ago, they were part of a small but very close group of friends who lived and studied and partied together. No prior romantic involvement. The have not spoken at all since college until they met recently. He is in the same line of work as my wife and it is an unusual career for a woman.
> Regarding the secret meeting: they were both planning to go to a public sale ( to do with their line of work) but for other reasons my wife was unable to go. The arranged to meet at his house instead for an hour, it was on her way to pick me up from the airport. I'm 100% positive nothing sexual happened for reasons I wont go into on here. However, she did still keep the meeting secret from me.
> 
> About us: We are both independent, we dont have kids, I work out of the country for about 6 months a year usually for a month at a time, I've done this for our entire relationship. I've never had a reason in 16 years not to trust her.
> 
> My first confrontation with her was emotional, I did not give myself any time to think, I jumped in with both feet and the conclusion was unsatisfactory. Which lead me to seek advice here.
> My second confrontation was much calmer, I explained why I was not happy. I made her see it the other way round and got her to imagine if I did what she did and how she would feel about it. I've explained the consequences of her continued behaviour in this manner.
> I've demanded that contact ends. And I've told her the marriage will be over if she lies or sneaks about again (This is no idle threat either, I cant spend 6 months a year in a constant state of worry, anger and stress wondering what she's up to. If I cant trust her again I cant stay married, for the sake of my own mental health)
> There was a lot more said but I wont go into it here, the outcome is that we are starting out fresh taking every day as it comes. Very early days yet but I'm hopeful that what we have is strong enough to overcome this. I'm hopeful that I've stopped anything from developing further.
> On the surface things are looking much better, we are talking more than ever, even planning to get dressed up and go out on a date, something we've not done for a while, and generally spend a bit more quality time together.
> However, I'm not naive and I'm not ready to trust yet so I have taken on board a lot of follow up advice from here and put some into action. I'll find out if she does go behind my back again.
> This weekend was the first hurdle as I've been away working but I can confirm that we cleared the hurdle no problem.
> Thanks everyone for all the advice. It genuinely has helped and I think I'm on the right track. I'm hoping I wont need to update this thread again but who knows what the future will hold.
> Good luck to anyone in a similar situation.
> Jef999


Thanks for the update. I hope you are on the right track.

Please come back for an update in a month or so just to let us know you are OK.

We like to see good updates. Too few of those on here.


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## jsmart

tech-novelist said:


> I cannot imagine how you could be 100% certain that nothing sexual happened during that hour in his house.
> 
> Unless perhaps you work in the NSA and have camera access to his entire house, but that seems pretty unlikely...


TN, you've been here long enough to know that when a BH says he knows nothing happened it's because through his wife goggles he only sees a snow flake telling him, I would never do that. She was just playing around.

We TAMers have seen this movie so many times that we can already predict where this is heading. I truly hope I'm wrong.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## tech-novelist

jsmart said:


> TN, you've been here long enough to know that when a BH says he knows nothing happened it's because through his wife goggles he only sees a snow flake telling him, I would never do that. She was just playing around.
> 
> We TAMers have seen this movie so many times that we can already predict where this is heading. I truly hope I'm wrong.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Sure but this is a bit out of the ordinary even so. Usually a BH says something like "I can't believe my wife would cheat on me", but that is a little different from "She has been over at a man's house for an hour and 'forgot' to tell me about it, but I'm *100% certain* she didn't do anything sexual with him".


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## workindad

tech-novelist said:


> I cannot imagine how you could be 100% certain that nothing sexual happened during that hour in his house.


ABsolutely agree. She didn't need to swing by his house for an hour for a secret meeting. 

Get checked for STDs, There is a high possibility that you are being lied to. Wanting to believe a lie does not make it true.

Good luck
WD


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## TaDor

A quickie can take a few minutes. Throw in some oral sex for a few minutes... you can do a lot in an hour.


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## SunCMars

@Jeff999

Any updates?


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## ABHale

Read this same story awhile back. 

She ends up cheating on him.


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## TaDor

The OP posted another thread or on another site?


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## ABHale

TaDor said:


> The OP posted another thread or on another site?



I read this story over a year ago.


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