# This is tragic. Too bad her husband wasn't more "controlling."



## MSalmoides (Sep 29, 2016)

This is a truly sad tale. I still don't understand how a husband tolerates it when his wife goes out with friends at all hours and does *whatever* at clubs and strange apartments. But, I've seen it all over these boards. Wives will say "If he objects to me going out with my friends at the club, getting drunk, staying out until noon the next day, and having some strange dude have his hands all over me then he is controlling." WTF?!? Controlling? Girl's weekend in Vegas? No f'ing way is an objection to that by a husband controlling. Ask how many husbands who trusted their wives under similar circumstances only to find out that their wives ended up screwing some random dude what they think now. I used to think differently about the GNO in Vegas (that's just an example) thing but much less so as I've seen more and more wreckage from this crap.

Now: Coke dealer admits to running drug den where mom overdosed | New York Post

Then: Our double lives: Dark realities behind ?perfect? online profiles | New York Post

You know, the word "controlling" is thrown around a lot here and on other boards. Basically, from what I've seen it's mostly used by women who are cake eaters. They want the perks of having a good man in their lives while screwing someone else, and when the good man tries to set boundaries he's "controlling." One wonders if her husband was more "controlling" her children might have a mother in their lives. Instead, they get to read about how their mother was found on the street dead with her panties in her purse.

Damn this is heartbreaking.

~MS


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

MSalmoides said:


> This is a truly sad tale. I still don't understand how a husband tolerates it when his wife goes out with friends at all hours and does *whatever* at clubs and strange apartments. But, I've seen it all over these boards. Wives will say "If he objects to me going out with my friends at the club, getting drunk, staying out until noon the next day, and having some strange dude have his hands all over me then he is controlling." WTF?!? Controlling? Girl's weekend in Vegas? No f'ing way is an objection to that by a husband controlling. Ask how many husbands who trusted their wives under similar circumstances only to find out that their wives ended up screwing some random dude what they think now. I used to think differently about the GNO in Vegas (that's just an example) thing but much less so as I've seen more and more wreckage from this crap.
> 
> Now: Coke dealer admits to running drug den where mom overdosed | New York Post
> 
> ...


I don't think anyone in there right mind would think objecting to the things you posted to a committed partner was controlling. If they do they shouldn't be married. I know if I was married to someone like that I would just divorce them. Not controlling just not putting up with sh!t. People don't just decided after they get married that they are going to go out partying. This a pattern in their lives way before marriage. Husbands and wives put up with it because they have their own problems, just like people who are repeatedly abused have issues. I am convinced that a lot of these serial cheaters and abuser pick non assertive people to marry so they can eat their cake. That is why so many threads where this terrible stuff happens the WS seems to lack the strength to leave. It is a parasitic relationship. Healthy human beings don't put up with this kind of abuse for very long. A lot of times these people are a lost cause. 

I feel bad for this woman's kids, but her husband is better off.

The kicker to this whole thing is the second article's qoute at the end



> “So many of the husbands work late hours and their wives are home alone,” she tells The Post. “So, on weekends, it’s common for them to go out to bars and clubs in the city without their husbands. Many of the women in Manhasset are partiers.”


See it's the husbands fault and you wonder why so many men are not getting married. The guy who dragged this woman out of the drug den and left her in the street to die doesn't even get a word said about him. She is giving sympathy even though she was fully in control of her actions, nope her husband drove her to this. :FIREdevil:


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## MrsHolland (Jun 18, 2016)

MSalmoides said:


> This is a truly sad tale. I still don't understand how a husband tolerates it when his wife goes out with friends at all hours and does *whatever* at clubs and strange apartments. *But, I've seen it all over these boards. Wives will say "If he objects to me going out with my friends at the club, getting drunk, staying out until noon the next day, and having some strange dude have his hands all over me then he is controlling." WTF?!? Controlling? *Girl's weekend in Vegas? No f'ing way is an objection to that by a husband controlling. Ask how many husbands who trusted their wives under similar circumstances only to find out that their wives ended up screwing some random dude what they think now...........................................


I've been here for quite a few years and never seen anyone say this. Not once.

There have been plenty of threads where the wife or husband are called controlling but that is usually when they *are *being controlling.


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## EllaSuaveterre (Oct 2, 2016)

I think you may have forgotten to link to the news article or what-have-you in which this "girls' weekend at Vegas" occurred. I wouldn't be shocked about a girl's weekend in Vegas for a married woman, but only for a bachelorette party for one of the girls' friends or something. And I'd think her husband would at least be back waiting in the hotel after the party


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## Andy1001 (Jun 29, 2016)

EllaSuaveterre said:


> I think you may have forgotten to link to the news article or what-have-you in which this "girls' weekend at Vegas" occurred. I wouldn't be shocked about a girl's weekend in Vegas for a married woman, but only for a bachelorette party for one of the girls' friends or something. And I'd think her husband would at least be back waiting in the hotel after the party


I played the field for a long time when I was younger.Bachellorette parties always congregated around the bars and clubs in my area.It was just so easy,girls away for a weekend without husbands or boyfriends,copious amounts of alcohol and more.I will give every man this piece of advice,if your fiancée insists on going then make sure there is someone from your side of the family who you can trust there to keep an eye on her.The worst thing about it was it was the bride to be's friends who would encourage her to have a ons.The times I have seen stag parties and bachelorette parties meet up and the stag and bride to be end up leaving with each other for the night still amazes me.


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## NoChoice (Feb 12, 2012)

Children must be controlled lest they end up dead in the street with their panties in their purse.


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## Married but Happy (Aug 13, 2013)

Evolution in action. I also find the idea of "controlling" your spouse or SO to be offensive and demeaning. You CAN negotiate mutually acceptable behavior, and discuss consequences if violated - which must be acted on if they are to have any meaning. Adults are expected to make informed choices, unless they are mentally ill or addicts. And then they are expected to get help.


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## Andy1001 (Jun 29, 2016)

Married but Happy said:


> Evolution in action. I also find the idea of "controlling" your spouse or SO to be offensive and demeaning. You CAN negotiate mutually acceptable behavior, and discuss consequences if violated - which must be acted on if they are to have any meaning. Adults are expected to make informed choices, unless they are mentally ill or addicts. And then they are expected to get help.


This is all very politically correct but it is impossible to enforce .You get a drunk young man or woman,surrounded by a group of drunk people who encourage them to take drugs,sleep with a stranger or anything else you care to mention and peer pressure and lowering of morals will lead to disaster.
How can you enforce morals on a drunk woman in vegas when you are thousands of miles away,especially when her "friends"ere egging her on.This is not a hypothetical situation,I have seen this firsthand.


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

Andy1001 said:


> This is all very politically correct but it is impossible to enforce .You get a drunk young man or woman,surrounded by a group of drunk people who encourage them to take drugs,sleep with a stranger or anything else you care to mention and peer pressure and lowering of morals will lead to disaster.
> How can you enforce morals on a drunk woman in vegas when you are thousands of miles away,especially when her "friends"ere egging her on.This is not a hypothetical situation,I have seen this firsthand.


I am not sure you can "save" people, Andy. Ultimately, they are going to be who they are.


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

EllaSuaveterre said:


> I think you may have forgotten to link to the news article or what-have-you in which this "girls' weekend at Vegas" occurred. I wouldn't be shocked about a girl's weekend in Vegas for a married woman, but only for a bachelorette party for one of the girls' friends or something. And I'd think her husband would at least be back waiting in the hotel after the party


I would not want to go to something like that *without* my husband, tbh.


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## Rowan (Apr 3, 2012)

Andy1001 said:


> This is all very politically correct but it is impossible to enforce .You get a drunk young man or woman,surrounded by a group of drunk people who encourage them to take drugs,sleep with a stranger or anything else you care to mention and peer pressure and lowering of morals will lead to disaster.
> How can you enforce morals on a drunk woman in vegas when you are thousands of miles away,especially when her "friends"ere egging her on.This is not a hypothetical situation,I have seen this firsthand.


I believe the point is that you cannot enforce your will on another functional adult, and that trying to is a fool's errand. What you can do is set boundaries for yourself and mutually agree to boundaries for the relationship. If those boundaries are crossed, then consequences - separation, divorce, whatever - are enacted. But it's entirely foolhardy to imagine that anyone really has control over their partner. Trying to be controlling is healthy for neither partner. Instead, choose someone who has a track record of similar boundaries to your own, agree to boundaries for the relationship, and if the other party decides to cross those boundaries, then find it within yourself to not stay with someone who isn't compatible with the life you want to have. You cannot control another person. You can completely control yourself and the choices you make about what you will and will not tolerate in your life and your relationships.


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## Married but Happy (Aug 13, 2013)

Andy1001 said:


> This is all very politically correct but it is impossible to enforce .You get a drunk young man or woman,surrounded by a group of drunk people who encourage them to take drugs,sleep with a stranger or anything else you care to mention and peer pressure and lowering of morals will lead to disaster.
> How can you enforce morals on a drunk woman in vegas when you are thousands of miles away,especially when her "friends"ere egging her on.This is not a hypothetical situation,I have seen this firsthand.


He can't "enforce" anything if he's not present, of course - and why should he play the role of parent? If he is present, he can tell her it's time to leave if she's getting drunk. He can try to force her, but there may be consequences for doing so. She can make choices - she's not some peer-pressured adolescent, after all. If she makes bad choices, he needs to follow through with consequence - in the OP's scenario, she suffered the ultimate consequence for her stupidity. In most cases, I don't believe in saving people from their own stupidity - if they have no experience with the situation, however, I might, but after that they need to have learned from it.


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

Every man and women has inappropriate desires and thoughts on occasion. If you do not, you are dishonest, naive', not introspective, or asexual. OK, there are always a few who do not. Numbers are small.

The thoughts are natural and if they are fleeting and weak, not a problem. They are called fantasies.

Why put yourself [or passively permit] your loved one to be in that position.

Temptation is real. The perfect storm, perfect circumstances can allow many people to fall from grace.

Being in the military reserves and out of town, I saw countless cases of men and women who did indeed make those mistakes.

Divorce swiftly followed. Cheating the first time is difficult for most. Thereafter....not. 

Divorce first, then party....if that is what you really want.


I too can be had. 

To date, I have successfully resisted. God has not spared me, I have resisted for moral, stubborn and logical reasons. But then, HE created me, so her spared me....Huh? 

However, for some, honor often stands on wobbly legs. I understand this.

Religion [Christian] was created to keep people on healthy paths. For the most part, it has been a force for good. It promotes family values and good, sustaining lifestyles. The faith does not guarantee that its adherents will follow the "healthy" proscriptions in its teachings. 

Life is hard. People do terrible things to each other, with or without a religious background.


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## MSalmoides (Sep 29, 2016)

MrsHolland said:


> I've been here for quite a few years and never seen anyone say this. Not once.
> 
> There have been plenty of threads where the wife or husband are called controlling but that is usually when they *are *being controlling.


Yes, I was a bit over the top.

What is controlling? Because I've seen a number of stories here where somebody goes out and parties, stays out late, then when confronted they accuse their spouse of controlling them. 

What is the difference between setting boundaries and controlling? Isn't setting a boundary an attempt to control someone else's behavior because they lack self-control?

I just see controlling used a lot but it seems to me that "controlling" is often code for "I want to do whatever I want and you can't stop me."

~MS


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## Lostinthought61 (Nov 5, 2013)

You know who i really feel bad for our her children, the doctor they found dead, half undressed....one when they are old enough their kids are going to want to know how mommy dies...now that is an interesting legacy you want to leave your kids.


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

MSalmoides said:


> Yes, I was a bit over the top.
> 
> What is controlling? Because I've seen a number of stories here where somebody goes out and parties, stays out late, then when confronted they accuse their spouse of controlling them.
> 
> ...


It sure can look that way.


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## samyeagar (May 14, 2012)

There is indeed a fine line between strong boundaries and being controlling. Often times it is nothing more that a slight difference in the wording used to convey, though they come from completely different places...in it's most simple form...

You can't do that...
I'm not OK with that...

One is controlling, the other is a boundary.

Controlling is telling another person what they can or can't do, the focus is on the other person...whereas a boundary is expressing what the boundary holder will do in response to certain behaviors, the focus is on the boundary holder.

As you noted, I too have often seen the word "controlling" thrown around in an effort to shame someone, and guilt them into allowing otherwise intolerable, or undesirable behavior to continue...sort of "I don't like being told no"


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## Married but Happy (Aug 13, 2013)

IMO, boundaries are limits you set for yourself, or agree to after negotiation with your partner. They may be principles you live by. These are not controlling - except you use them to set your own limits for what you consider to be ethical behavior.

Rules are limits set by others, usually without your agreement. Rules are controlling, and I won't observe them unless I either agree with them despite not having any say in making them, or if I can't accept the consequences of breaking them. I am less likely to respect a rule than a negotiated boundary. I CAN do whatever I want, and you CAN'T stop me - you can create consequences. The rule-breaker may then consider the odds: how often does this controlling person actually keep their word, their integrity, and follow through, anyway?


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## Rowan (Apr 3, 2012)

In my experience, controlling behaviors attempt to control another person. Boundaries attempt to control _the self_. 

I have a personal boundary that I will not remain in a relationship with a cheating partner. I could not 'make' my husband be faithful. There was no mechanism on earth to accomplish that. Nor was I inclined to even try. I knew that I could not control another person. He was, is, and always will be, entirely free to see as many women as he pleases. But, having a husband who routinely dates and sleeps with other women doesn't work for me. The only thing that was within my power was my own reaction to the situation and my choices as to how to respond to it. So, I left. 

Now, did he accuse me of being controlling? Yes, he did. 'Controlling' is one of those words that's sometimes used to strike out at a partner when the natural consequences of one's actions begin to catch up. Cheaters often regard any consequence for their own behavior as someone else's fault. The reality is that I did not try to change (control) him. I saw him for who and what he was, decided that didn't work for me in a romantic partnership, and ended it so we could both move on. The fact that what he really wanted was both the marriage to me _and_ the other women - to have his cake and eat it too - is what led him to see my actions as controlling. 

You know what's _actually_ controlling? Manipulating a partner in order to cake-eat while avoiding the consequences of your own actions. Lies, hiding, accusations, blame-shifting, gas lighting, are controlling. They're designed to control the relationship and your partner so you don't lose the good thing you have while you're getting other little goodies on the side.


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## MSalmoides (Sep 29, 2016)

I guess that I just don't understand how modern relationships work. This place isn't for me. Peace all.

~MS


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## samyeagar (May 14, 2012)

MSalmoides said:


> I guess that I just don't understand how modern relationships work. This place isn't for me. Peace all.
> 
> ~MS


I'm not really understanding where this is coming from. What part of this discussion is related to modern relationships, as opposed to what you were wanting to discuss? Where did it come off the rails for you?


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

jld said:


> I am not sure you can "save" people, Andy. Ultimately, they are going to be who they are.


And this is why you should never take *"this type"* (Ella I added this because I want you to understand I am particularly NOT talking about you) of cheater back. That is who they are. The are a person who is not worth investing the effort in. It's like asking a dog to be a horse, ain't going to happen. The thing that lets them cheat in this completely disrespectful type of way before as a twisted kind of celebration of marriage is the thing that makes them unable to even comprehend the pain they cause, they are emotional stunted. If you don't get the pain you caused what's to stop you from doing it or something else like this again. You shouldn't waste a moment.


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

Rowan said:


> I believe the point is that you cannot enforce your will on another functional adult, and that trying to is a fool's errand. What you can do is set boundaries for yourself and mutually agree to boundaries for the relationship. If those boundaries are crossed, then consequences - separation, divorce, whatever - are enacted. But it's entirely foolhardy to imagine that anyone really has control over their partner. Trying to be controlling is healthy for neither partner. Instead, choose someone who has a track record of similar boundaries to your own, agree to boundaries for the relationship, and if the other party decides to cross those boundaries, then find it within yourself to not stay with someone who isn't compatible with the life you want to have. You cannot control another person. You can completely control yourself and the choices you make about what you will and will not tolerate in your life and your relationships.


These type of boundaries should not really have to be said in my opinion, I should never have to say to my spouse, I don't think it is wise for you to get drunk and be out to all hours of the night when you are in love with me. If you love me you should be done shopping around. If you have to say that then you are making a bad choice in marrying a person like that. Those types of people should be reserved for the shallowest types of relationships. 

Once I got married I stopped going to strip joints for 2 reasons, one I don't believe when you are on a diet you go to a bakery and stair at the doughnuts. Two I didn't want to disrespect my wife or have her have to worry about it. It just didn't mean enough for me to do that. I go to bars with my friends and drink but never late, and if it is late I am on the phone with my wife letting her know. The bars we go to are usually places with lots of types of beer, or sports bars. None of this is a sacrifice, just like waxing my Dodge Challenger I enjoy doing that. 

Also if my friend told me he was thinking of cheating I would punch him in his face (not really). And if he did cheat I would be done with him. I would want him to do the same. I love my friend deeply, I want the best for them, cheating would not lead to the best. 

Anyway just saying.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

MSalmoides said:


> This is a truly sad tale. I still don't understand how a husband tolerates it when his wife goes out with friends at all hours and does *whatever* at clubs and strange apartments. But, I've seen it all over these boards. Wives will say *"If he objects to me going out with my friends at the club, getting drunk, staying out until noon the next day, and having some strange dude have his hands all over me then he is controlling." * WTF?!? Controlling? Girl's weekend in Vegas? No f'ing way is an objection to that by a husband controlling. Ask how many husbands who trusted their wives under similar circumstances only to find out that their wives ended up screwing some random dude what they think now. I used to think differently about the GNO in Vegas (that's just an example) thing but much less so as I've seen more and more wreckage from this crap.


I've been on TAM for a long time and have read thousands of posts on here. I've ever read anyone saying what you claim is said all over these boards.


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## TheTruthHurts (Oct 1, 2015)

sokillme said:


> These type of boundaries should not really have to be said in my opinion, I should never have to say to my spouse, I don't think it is wise for you to get drunk and be out to all hours of the night when you are in love with me. If you love me you should be done shopping around. If you have to say that then you are making a bad choice in marrying a person like that. Those types of people should be reserved for the shallowest types of relationships.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Interesting. Personally I went to strip clubs for years after I was married when out of town. Always talked to my W before and after and often went alone.

W is a very conservative Catholic girl.

The thing is neither of us had a problem with this. Naive perhaps, but we also dated 6 years before marriage and knew each other well. It never once occurred to me to cheat and I doubt it occurred to my W.

But marital context is important too. We were each others best friends. We both had firm but unspoken rules of no OS friendships. We did everything together virtually all the time when we weren't working, which was a lot. We spoke multiple times a day. And we both worked long, long hours at tough jobs that paid well (mine did anyway) with lots of responsibility. And we had more than enough money and didn't really want anything.

I'm not foolish enough to believe my marriage is special and completely affair proof. But I also believe your character and your spouse's character is evident every day. The question is- can you see it?

I make an exception for a crazy, one time, in an alcohol or grief impacted state, ONS because (from what I've learned over a lifetime) these things can happen to good people. And it usually wrecks them. There are a couple of people on TAM that come to mind. I'm not pretending makes it any different for the BS, but I am saying this type of affair is different from one where a guy or girl goes to vegas with their friends with poor or no boundaries. The latter case is premeditated, and I believe if someone cheats in that scenario and doesn't immediately come clean, then they're culpable and I'd tend to believe they had planned for this to possibly happen. And I can't help but believe someone like that wouldn't give clues to their character in their daily life. But perhaps their S has them on a pedestal and doesn't notice?

Bottom line is I'd trust my W to go with girls to vegas. But I'd vet the girls first naturally. And we know of a couple that might have looser boundaries. If they went, my W probably wouldn't because she wouldn't enjoy herself around women acting out away from their spouses. Same here. On this I agree with you @sokillme, a guy who would step out in his lady in front of me is no friend of mine.



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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

sokillme said:


> These type of boundaries should not really have to be said in my opinion, I should never have to say to my spouse, I don't think it is wise for you to get drunk and be out to all hours of the night when you are in love with me. If you love me you should be done shopping around. If you have to say that then you are making a bad choice in marrying a person like that. Those types of people should be reserved for the shallowest types of relationships.
> 
> Once I got married I stopped going to strip joints for 2 reasons, one I don't believe when you are on a diet you go to a bakery and stair at the doughnuts. Two I didn't want to disrespect my wife or have her have to worry about it. It just didn't mean enough for me to do that. I go to bars with my friends and drink but never late, and if it is late I am on the phone with my wife letting her know. The bars we go to are usually places with lots of types of beer, or sports bars. None of this is a sacrifice, just like waxing my Dodge Challenger I enjoy doing that.
> 
> ...


*Well articulated!

I can unequivocally say that if my best friend, who is married, ever did that to his precious wife, I'd absolutely own his a$$!

And if his wife unbelievably did that to him, I'd be there for him in an instant, just like he and his W were there for me when my RSXW abandoned me to go "bump other trains" to try to satisfy her immorally jaded and insatiable ego!*


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

sokillme said:


> See it's the husbands fault and you wonder why so many men are not getting married. The guy who dragged this woman out of the drug den and left her in the street to die doesn't even get a word said about him. She is giving sympathy even though she was fully in control of her actions, nope her husband drove her to this. :FIREdevil:


I don't think that anyone is saying that it's the man's fault. Explaining a situation is not laying blame.

The women who do this are the only ones who are responsible for their behavior.

Perhaps the reason that the there is nothing much said about the guy who left her in the street to die is that there is not really a lot to say about him. He's clearly a piece of trash and a horrible person. I'm sure everyone who reads that understands that he is despicable.


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

EleGirl said:


> I don't think that anyone is saying that it's the man's fault. Explaining a situation is not laying blame.
> 
> The women who do this are the only ones who are responsible for their behavior.
> 
> Perhaps the reason that the there is nothing much said about the guy who left her in the street to die is that there is not really a lot to say about him. He's clearly a piece of trash and a horrible person. I'm sure everyone who reads that understands that he is despicable.


Then why write it, the implication is that this woman's husband was never home and that is why she started partying (like that is an excuse anyway). There isn't even any basis for that, for all we know he could have been home crying. It's written in my opinion because society still has this antiquated notion that women are the fair sex and men are the philanderers. Whenever you see these types of stories it very hard for some people to accept that nowadays a woman has just as much potential to be a louse as men. Hense, if her husband was just home she would have never got caught up in this crowd justification. 

Hell, I used to believe woman were the fair sex too until I got on these boards for a year and I was cured of that idea real quick.


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

TheTruthHurts said:


> Interesting. Personally I went to strip clubs for years after I was married when out of town. Always talked to my W before and after and often went alone.
> 
> W is a very conservative Catholic girl.
> 
> ...


If it works for you that's fine not judging. Just wouldn't work for us, I also don't want be leaving there thinking about some other stunningly built woman who I just saw naked. Why would I want to do that to my monogamous self, makes no sense? Not going to help my marriage too much.

Did you just say your wife cheated on you once already but you would still be fine with her going to vegas?


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

sokillme said:


> Then why write it, the implication is that this woman's husband was never home and that is why she started partying (like that is an excuse anyway).


The woman who is quoted is apparently not even someone who knows that woman who died. She’s just some woman who has a business in that neighborhood. Why was she quoted? Because it’s a lame story talking about how people live double lives--the life they show on social media and their real life. They needed to quote someone to fill up an inch in the story. 

“So many of the husbands work late hours and their wives are home alone,” she tells The Post. “So, on weekends, it’s common for them to go out to bars and clubs in the city without their husbands. Many of the women in Manhasset are partiers.”



sokillme said:


> There isn't even any basis for that, for all we know he could have been home crying.


Again, the quote has nothing to do with the woman who died. It’s a general statement made by some woman about what she thinks women in that neighborhood are like. So yea, we have no idea what the dead woman’s husband was doing. He might have been working. He might have been home with the kids. He might have been out cheating on his wife. Or he might have been doing something else.

But no one in that article is blaming him for his wife’s death. You seem to see people blaming men all over the place. That is your personal filter. And it’s a distorted filter.



sokillme said:


> It's written in my opinion because society still has this antiquated notion that women are the fair sex and men are the philanderers. Whenever you see these types of stories it very hard for some people to accept that nowadays a woman has just as much potential to be a louse as men. Hense, if her husband was just home she would have never got caught up in this crowd justification.


Again this in your interpretation. Since the person quoted in the article apparently did not know the deceased woman and her husband, how would she know if her husband was working or now?


sokillme said:


> Hell, I used to believe woman were the fair sex too until I got on these boards for a year and I was cured of that idea real quick.


Yea, woman cheat at almost the same rate as men cheat. After all, who did you think all those men were cheating with?

But it still does not mean that all women are cheaters, evil, bad, etc. Most are not.


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## TheTruthHurts (Oct 1, 2015)

sokillme said:


> If it works for you that's fine not judging. Just wouldn't work for us, I also don't want be leaving there thinking about some other stunningly built woman who I just saw naked. Why would I want to do that to my monogamous self, makes no sense? Not going to help my marriage too much.
> 
> Did you just say your wife cheated on you once already but you would still be fine with her going to vegas?




No infidelity in my marriage. And looking at strippers isn't the same as wanting sex for me. I never wanted sex with any of them but enjoy looking at naked women, particularly when I was out of town 5 days a week. Now I don't travel and am older - I think there's an age after which going to a strip club alone looks kind of creepy. But that's just me.


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## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

MS,
You mean - aside from all the murderers right? The murderers being - tip o the iceberg of the intimate partner violence iceberg. 

And I say iceberg - because the stats aren't tracked less you stop a beating heart. 

But hey - if you only believe the homicide numbers - 72% of the killers are male. 

Homicide is sort of the ultimate expression of control. So yeah I find your comments a bit odd. Most of the murdered women aren't cheating, just trying to end the relationship. 





MSalmoides said:


> This is a truly sad tale. I still don't understand how a husband tolerates it when his wife goes out with friends at all hours and does *whatever* at clubs and strange apartments. But, I've seen it all over these boards. Wives will say "If he objects to me going out with my friends at the club, getting drunk, staying out until noon the next day, and having some strange dude have his hands all over me then he is controlling." WTF?!? Controlling? Girl's weekend in Vegas? No f'ing way is an objection to that by a husband controlling. Ask how many husbands who trusted their wives under similar circumstances only to find out that their wives ended up screwing some random dude what they think now. I used to think differently about the GNO in Vegas (that's just an example) thing but much less so as I've seen more and more wreckage from this crap.
> 
> Now: Coke dealer admits to running drug den where mom overdosed | New York Post
> 
> ...


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

I feel bad for her husband...to have to grieve the death of the woman you thought you knew, only to find out she was a coke ho. 

I agree with everyone else. Boundaries are for you: what you are willing to accept from others and what you will not do to others. If a husband is willing to accept his wife disappearing all night, two or three nights a week with no explanation, then he has set his boundary with her...which is no boundary at all. Same with a wife. We teach people how to treat us.


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## TX-SC (Aug 25, 2015)

Boundaries must be set by the individual. My wife must set and enforce her own boundaries. I too have boundaries regarding what is right or wrong for both me and my spouse. If I cross my own boundaries, I am at fault and must fix that issue. If my wife crosses the boundaries, she either must fix that issue or we are no longer compatible. 

I have NEVER been a fan of GNO or BNO. I don't have a desire to go drinking and clubbing with guys. We might go fishing or mountain biking, but not out clubbing. My wife doesn't drink alcohol and has no desire to party. We work well together. I would not marry someone who has that need. If she"developed" that need later, we would have to divorce. I will NOT sit up worrying over my wife out partying and clubbing. That's college age crap and needs to stop once you are married, and especially after you have kids.


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