# I am confused



## Lonely00 (Aug 8, 2014)

My wife and I have been married for 8 years. We have 4 year old twin girls. I started to notice that our sex life was becoming weaker after kids. It went from once a week to nothing for the last three months. About three months ago she told me that she is no longer "in" love with me and does not find me attractive anymore. She claims that she is not attracted to me because we have nothing in common anymore. I was blindsided by this. I love my wife more than I can describe. She is the breadwinner of our family but I have a great job that pays 80k/yr. she makes roughly double what I do and doesn't find me financially supportive. I have passed over many jobs to support her career to take care of our family. She travels 1-2 weeks a month and we do not have any family close to help. My job is very flexible so I can make this work by going in late and leaving early. 

We started marriage counseling about two months ago and she claims she has been feeling like this for years. I am in a place right now where I don't know what to do. I don't want to see my family get torn apart. I love my wife and kids and want our family to stay together. I habe been praying bit things seem to be turning for the worst, I don't understand what she is thinking because she could not do what she does without me and the sacrifices that I have made. I do not hold this against her at all.

Is there anyone out there who can relate???


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

The obvious first question... Have you investigated for someone else in the picture? 

She's gone from home large chunk of time... Trying to fix your marriage will be difficult under whose conditions. 

C
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## synthetic (Jan 5, 2012)

She's cheating.


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## Jasel (Jan 8, 2013)

Ya sorry to say she's cheating on you


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

synthetic said:


> She's cheating.


Since she makes double what you make hire a PI you have the money.
Check cell phone records.
Voice activated recorder in her car use lithium batteries.
Do not beg.
Do not cry in front of her.


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## Lonely00 (Aug 8, 2014)

I have found nothing that would suggest cheating. Has anyone out there ever recovered from something like this?


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## Hicks (Jan 14, 2011)

You have to start listening.
Your wife has an interest or a relationship with another man. All the signs are there. This can range to a secret crush to a full blow sexual affair. But there is definitely another male that she wants more than you.

Step 1 - you have to inventory what is going on. That is done by searching for Weightlifter's standard evidence post. It mostly involves you not discussing this with your wife and planting VAR's and spying.

Step 2 - your wife does not respect you. She views you as weak and unnattractive. This is for many reasons but at least from what you have been told it is due to her being the main breadwinner.

So, your goal is to a) find out what you are dealing with and b) Be more respect worthy.

Regarding item b)....You need to speak to a lawyer, plan out a divorce and tell your wife that she should leave. If she ever demonstrates that she wants to be a proper wife to you, then stop the process. Remind yourself that it is your wife who is screwing up the kids, not you.


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## LongWalk (Apr 4, 2013)

VAR her car. Look at phone records. Go through her FB friends.

Don't act needy. Don't beg.

Hit the gym.

Fake being happy.

Don't tell her you love her if she never says it


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## GA HEART (Oct 18, 2011)

As a woman I will say that she may or may not be cheating, but finding out FOR SURE can't hurt. You want to save the marriage, but it will be impossible if she is hung up on someone else. If she isn't cheating, you can move forward. If she IS cheating, you need to address that first, then decide where to go from there.


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## manfromlamancha (Jul 4, 2013)

Lonely00 said:


> I have found nothing that would suggest cheating. Has anyone out there ever recovered from something like this?


What exactly have you done to see if she is interested in or having an affair with someone else ?


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## Lonely00 (Aug 8, 2014)

I have been through all of our phone records and digital media accounts. I found absolutely nothing. It just doesn't add up. There are times I feel hope and then there are times like today where I am angry and want to say screw it. I don't deserve to be treated like this from a woman I love so dearly. I just can't imagine how my little angels will feel if this doesn't work out.


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## Blossom Leigh (Mar 27, 2014)

Does she have a second phone for work purposes?


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## Hicks (Jan 14, 2011)

These things all indicate that there is another man she is comparing you to. She may not be having sex with him. He may not even know about it. But there is definitely another man you are being compared to. You need to snoop better (weightlifter post in Coping with Infidelity please review this before doing anything else). It is right there in the top of the list currently. 

You have to react strong and not weak. The angry / screw it guy is who you have to be. Imagine her shock when you act like you don't need her and don't grovel. It will cause her respect for you to go way up.


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## Cubby (Mar 28, 2012)

Ahhh, the classic "ILoveButI'mNotInLoveWithYou" line. 98 percent of the time, the translation is there's another guy in the picture. Even though you've found nothing, you better be more thorough in your search. Velcro a VAR securely under her car seat.

Any relationship-y talk you have with her will be futile. And concentrate on not being weepy, sullen, butthurt, sad, angry, etc. Since she's not attracted to you, that kind of behavior will only make it worse. Don't dig a deeper hole than the one you're in.

Also concentrate on finding evidence. The fact that you can't find anything might mean all the communication is done at her work. 

Good luck and I'm sorry you're here. The good news is that you're going to get the best advice you can find. You're a fool if you don't listen.


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## naiveonedave (Jan 9, 2014)

any guy friends at work? Lots of business travel with grouips? Lots of happy hours or GNOs?

If they work together, there may not be any electonic or phone.


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## Lonely00 (Aug 8, 2014)

She has a work phone but there is no way I can get into it. It has a 10 digit code and yes she does have a lot of guy friends at work. She also travels about a week per month. I am going to put a VAR in her car as she has an hour commute every day. I just can't believe that it has come to this. How can my wife be such a monster? I have been going along happy and not showing her my pain this far. I also told her I won't continue to live like this and will be gone if she can't treat me like a husband. What a *****.


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## ButtPunch (Sep 17, 2014)

Sadly, I agree with the other posters. I would go into stealth mode to rule out an EA, PA, or a secret crush. For her to lay the ILYBNILWY speech tells me it's more than a crush. 

While investigating, Do not try to woo your wife back. No dinners, buying flowers, breakfast in bed....nothing. I want you to read two books asap. Married Mans Sex Life Primer by Athol Kay and No More Mr. Nice Guy by Robert Glover. 

Best of Luck
BP


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## ButtPunch (Sep 17, 2014)

Lonely00 said:


> She has a work phone but there is no way I can get into it. It has a 10 digit code and yes she does have a lot of guy friends at work. She also travels about a week per month. I am going to put a VAR in her car as she has an hour commute every day. I just can't believe that it has come to this. How can my wife be such a monster? I have been going along happy and not showing her my pain this far. I also told her I won't continue to live like this and will be gone if she can't treat me like a husband. What a *****.


Very good. This is the way you need to react. The healthy way. Most BS on here including myself thought they could "nice" their wives back. All that does is make you look weak and pathetic and pushes her further away. 

Do not let her know you suspect her cheating. I repeat....do not let her know you suspect her cheating.


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## Cubby (Mar 28, 2012)

Lonely00 said:


> She has a work phone but there is no way I can get into it. It has a 10 digit code and yes she does have a lot of guy friends at work. She also travels about a week per month. I am going to put a VAR in her car as she has an hour commute every day. I just can't believe that it has come to this. How can my wife be such a monster? I have been going along happy and not showing her my pain this far. I also told her I won't continue to live like this and will be gone if she can't treat me like a husband. What a *****.


Gotta get weightlifter on the batphone for the VAR expertise....


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## Cubby (Mar 28, 2012)

Lonely00, here's weightlifter's instructions on use of VAR:

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/209754-standard-evidence-post.html


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## manfromlamancha (Jul 4, 2013)

OK so she started saying this 3 months ago. That is when she would have "found" someone else. As everyone is telling you, she has either started an affair with someone or is considering it and comparing you to him. The classic "I love you but am not in love with you" line is standard in cheater script as is "we don't have anything in common anymore". This is all justification for her cheating. The bit about not being happy with you or the marriage for years is also classic marital history rewriting. 

You do need to somehow get access to her phone and email as these will be great sources of info. The VAR should help too. Do not let on that you suspect anything until you have solid proof and then too, NEVER REVEAL YOUR SOURCES of info (ever).

Weightlifter's thread in evidence gathering is solid and you should follow the advice.

This is not to do with your behaviour, but more to do with her need to cheat! You cannot believe anything she tells you and you certainly will not be able to sway her with being nice.

Start taking steps to protect yourself and contact an attorney to get advice. Also carry a personal VAR on you to record conversations because if she gets a hint that you are on to her she can (and others have been known to) make claims of domestic violence and all sorts to get you thrown out of the house. Never agree to leave the house!

Let us know how you get on with this and also if you have any queries. We are here to support you and have seen this many, many times before.


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## tryingpatience (May 7, 2014)

All I can tell you at this point is to follow the advice given to you from here on in. There is no harm in finding the truth either way. If you're wrong than your relationship can survive that. Infidelity that's a different set of cirucmstances.

Many of us have experience the "cheater's script" so the more you read here the more you'll see it. Time to think about what your boundaries are and what you're willing to live with. You'll need to be strong on your boundaries because if it is cheating you'll face a moment of limbo where you won't know what to do.

Cheating is painful but limbo is hell.


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## Anon1111 (May 29, 2013)

Tough situation. You try to be a nice, modern guy. You do what your wife says she wants. You support her career. You become the primary caregiver for the kids. After all, she would do the same for you if the roles were reversed.

Then, in the end, she loses respect for you for doing the very thing she asked you to do.

If I were you, I'd get a really good divorce lawyer. I would seek full custody of the kids, child support, spousal support and take the house and make her move out. Make her put her money where her mouth is.


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## Lonely00 (Aug 8, 2014)

That will be tough. I live in about the most conservative state you can live in. Do you think I would have a chance to win custody??? Even if I can't prove she is cheating?


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## Anon1111 (May 29, 2013)

She travels for work frequently. You said yourself that your job is more flexible. Talk to a lawyer-- I would bet that you could put together a strong argument for primary custody. At the very least, the pursuit of this should increase your negotiating leverage.


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## lenzi (Apr 10, 2012)

Lonely00 said:


> That will be tough. I live in about the most conservative state you can live in. Do you think I would have a chance to win custody??? Even if I can't prove she is cheating?


If you spend more time taking care of the kids then you have a good chance.

Also depends a lot on the philosophy of the courts in your state.

Read up on some case law. Speak to a few attorneys.


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## ButtPunch (Sep 17, 2014)

Slow down folks......Let's catch her first. Then we can start lining up the lawyers. Read the books I suggested....take a deep breath....concentrate on the task at hand.


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## Anon1111 (May 29, 2013)

Maybe there is an affair, maybe not. The problem is deeper than that. She is telling him to his face that she doesn't love him and hasn't for some time. Does he really need to know more than that?


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## AliceA (Jul 29, 2010)

You're right, you don't deserve to be treated like that. I stalled my career too in order to help DH get what he wanted, a business of his own. It's unbelievable that she doesn't appreciate what you've done for her and your children. Some high paid guy who worked long hours and travelled away couldn't look after your girls. It sounds like she's craving one of these guys she works with but if she had that reality, would she want it? I think the others are right, the fog of an affair would explain her lack of logical thought processes.

Plus, once the shine wore off a new relationship, she probably hasn't yet realised she'd be just as disinterested in sex with them as she is with you. That's a problem that follows a person around.


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## Lonely00 (Aug 8, 2014)

Texas


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## wanttolove (Jan 25, 2012)

Geez, I am reading through the comments here and am struck by how passive aggressive it is to try to catch one's spouse at cheating. It's dishonest and one way to ensure that your partner will never trust you again! Ask. Just plain ask. If she lies, then she lies, but you have not done something that is wrong. Keep asking if she does not give a reason for not loving you. Persist. Pursue.

But don't become a detective. Don't hate.


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## SongoftheSouth (Apr 22, 2014)

Lonely00 said:


> My wife and I have been married for 8 years. We have 4 year old twin girls. I started to notice that our sex life was becoming weaker after kids. It went from once a week to nothing for the last three months. About three months ago she told me that she is no longer "in" love with me and does not find me attractive anymore. She claims that she is not attracted to me because we have nothing in common anymore. I was blindsided by this. I love my wife more than I can describe. She is the breadwinner of our family but I have a great job that pays 80k/yr. she makes roughly double what I do and doesn't find me financially supportive. I have passed over many jobs to support her career to take care of our family. She travels 1-2 weeks a month and we do not have any family close to help. My job is very flexible so I can make this work by going in late and leaving early.
> 
> We started marriage counseling about two months ago and she claims she has been feeling like this for years. I am in a place right now where I don't know what to do. I don't want to see my family get torn apart. I love my wife and kids and want our family to stay together. I habe been praying bit things seem to be turning for the worst, I don't understand what she is thinking because she could not do what she does without me and the sacrifices that I have made. I do not hold this against her at all.
> 
> Is there anyone out there who can relate???


Whats to be confused about?? She can't stand you and tells you that, she makes alot of money, you are the primary care parent. File for divorce. Once you do that you will look strong and decisive. She will pay plenty in alimony, child support and give you half the sh*t she has probably paid for . Pretty good deal for you but she probably doesn't understand that she is about to get screwed financially since she is successful and you are considered the primary care giver. Drag this out longer and you will get more in alimony depending upon where you live. Oh yeah - she's probably cheating on you by the way.


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

Lonely00 said:


> I have found nothing that would suggest cheating. Has anyone out there ever recovered from something like this?


Yes I have but my wife had to get rid of her boyfriend first.

You cant compete with new love and your wife is in a fog.

I find it strange that if your wife isn't cheating then why in the hell does she want to break up the family unit.

Your wife is only thinking about one thing and thats when she gets to see her boyfriend again.

Maybe we all could be wrong...but find out for sure so you don't look like a fool trying to be a great husband when you have already been replaced months ago.

It would be a shame if you do all this great work to save the marriage when her and her boyfriend are laughing at you at the same time.

Please listen and invest in finding out what you are really fighting against.


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## synthetic (Jan 5, 2012)

wanttolove said:


> Geez, I am reading through the comments here and am struck by how passive aggressive it is to try to catch one's spouse at cheating. It's dishonest and one way to ensure that your partner will never trust you again! Ask. Just plain ask. If she lies, then she lies, but you have not done something that is wrong. Keep asking if she does not give a reason for not loving you. Persist. Pursue.
> 
> But don't become a detective. Don't hate.


If she lies, then she lies?!

How would you know if she's lying or not?

And it's not a matter of "if" she lies. She will lie. All cheaters do. It's not like when you ask them they turn around and say "Oh yeah btw honey I forgot to tell you, but I'm screwing that guy from work. Hope you don't mind"

Do you always give advice like this to people?


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## Coco2014 (May 8, 2014)

wanttolove said:


> Geez, I am reading through the comments here and am struck by how passive aggressive it is to try to catch one's spouse at cheating. It's dishonest and one way to ensure that your partner will never trust you again! Ask. Just plain ask. If she lies, then she lies, but you have not done something that is wrong. Keep asking if she does not give a reason for not loving you. Persist. Pursue.
> 
> But don't become a detective. Don't hate.


So you mean if someone wants to fool and screw up nice people, the nice people shall do nothing but just let them fool him/her and screw up him/her through the whole process. In this way, the nice people will come out of it still being nice people without doing anything "mean" but just got screwed up?


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## AliceA (Jul 29, 2010)

It'd make life so much simpler if simply asking someone to tell you the truth actually elicited a truthful response. Problem is, if they're lying to you by having an affair, they aren't suddenly going to become truthful and tell you about it. So the answer to the question will be, "no, I'm not cheating", in most cases (I say most because not everyone reacts as expected, but most do). So what benefit have you gained by asking the question as it wouldn't actually allay any of your fears? None. What possible downside might come from asking? A spouse that is now on high alert and makes sure not to make any slip ups that will let you find out about an affair, while trying to make you feel incredibly guilty for ever doubting them, and using that 'doubt' as a reason to make you the bad guy in an attempt to break up.

I think I'd hold my cards to my chest a little longer. No harm in proving your suspicions wrong.


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## ButtPunch (Sep 17, 2014)

wanttolove said:


> Geez, I am reading through the comments here and am struck by how passive aggressive it is to try to catch one's spouse at cheating. It's dishonest and one way to ensure that your partner will never trust you again! Ask. Just plain ask. If she lies, then she lies, but you have not done something that is wrong. Keep asking if she does not give a reason for not loving you. Persist. Pursue.
> 
> But don't become a detective. Don't hate.


Bad advice here


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## lenzi (Apr 10, 2012)

wanttolove said:


> Geez, I am reading through the comments here and am struck by how passive aggressive it is to try to catch one's spouse at cheating. It's dishonest and one way to ensure that your partner will never trust you again! Ask. Just plain ask. If she lies, then she lies


They ALL lie.

Then what? All is well because the betrayed spouse didn't snoop?

Your advice is worthless.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Lonely00 said:


> She has a work phone but there is no way I can get into it. It has a 10 digit code and yes she does have a lot of guy friends at work. She also travels about a week per month. I am going to put a VAR in her car as she has an hour commute every day. I just can't believe that it has come to this. How can my wife be such a monster? I have been going along happy and not showing her my pain this far. I also told her I won't continue to live like this and will be gone if she can't treat me like a husband. What a *****.


So basically she has a second life that you are not privy to.

Hire a PI.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

wanttolove said:


> Geez, I am reading through the comments here and am struck by how passive aggressive it is to try to catch one's spouse at cheating. It's dishonest and one way to ensure that your partner will never trust you again! Ask. Just plain ask. If she lies, then she lies, but you have not done something that is wrong. Keep asking if she does not give a reason for not loving you. Persist. Pursue.
> 
> But don't become a detective. Don't hate.


Oh puhleaze.

Ignore this poster.


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## Hopeful Cynic (Apr 27, 2014)

There are two possibilities.

1) she's cheating on you and lying to you. The solution to this one is snooping on emails, using a VAR, looking for weird receipts from places she hasn't told you she's been, etc, but NOT confronting her, etc, to gather incontrovertible evidence to put you in strong position for confronting her about her lies. She'll either stop the affair once you know about it and you can try reconciliation, or she'll continue it, either blatantly or more secretively. In the second case, there is nothing you can do to save your marriage, you can only save your sanity by giving up on her and getting out of the marriage.

or

2) she's not cheating on you, but something has happened to make her consider it. She's doing what most of us WISH our cheating exes had done, which is express unhappiness while there is still a chance to fix it, or at least part amicably before she pursues another man. It's very likely that having a rush of infatuation for another man has caused her to question her feelings for you. But if she has integrity, she hasn't begun to cheat, and is instead softening you up for a request for a divorce. I would continue with the counselling, as long as the therapist is a good fit, and maybe something can be rekindled.

In both cases, you need to be strong, face the possibility that your marriage may be over, either amicably or in horrible betrayal, and understand that you may be a single father after this all falls down. Finding that strength is critical, for yourself and your children, no matter what ends up happening. Find a counsellor just for yourself, as you will need emotional support you aren't getting from your wife. Be self-reliant. Don't beg her for answers or for her love; be an independent human being worthy of respect. Don't woo her because it will feel like a bribe from a weak person to her. Be a kind and thoughtful person, but not a doormat.

A relationship is a group project where one partner CANNOT make up for the lack of the other partner pulling their own weight. You will know, eventually, whichever option it is above, if she is still pulling her weight or not.


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## treyvion (Apr 29, 2013)

Var in the car will catch her. Take it in for a car wash, install the var under the passenger seat or under the dash. Let it capture data for a week. Youll get way more than you imagine. On the cell, connect it to a computer and download its contents.


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## Mostlycontent (Apr 16, 2014)

My guess is that that the PA started about 3 months ago, which is when you said she stopped having sex with you. That's usually a pretty good indicator of when an affair has started.

To go from having sex once a week, which still isn't much, to not having had sex in 3 months just wreaks of an affair. About three months ago is when it likely got physical is my guess.


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## LongWalk (Apr 4, 2013)

There are threads here that can serve as positive examples: Jerry123 and Bagdon


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