# You will know this is for you



## Deb1234 (May 31, 2009)

This is kind of a rant in response to something my husband posted. I didn't want to make his thread into an argument so I've posted it separate from his. 

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13 years of marriage and you tell me you've been lying to me and secretly been having cybersex using my webcam with tons of women for the last two years.

I told you to stop and not lie to me anymore and that although I would probably never trust you again, I would work on trying to salvage our relationship. 

Yes, I installed spyware on the computer and never told you about it. Would've kind of ruined the whole point of having it, wouldn't it?

A year later, you start up again with the cybersex and on top of that, are actively searching online for local women or couples who want a one night stand.

Did you think I was kidding the first time when I said this was your one chance?? Did you think I was kidding when I said I would probably never trust you again?? Yes, I didn't want to talk to a counselor. I am very uncomfortable talking to a stranger about my personal life who is only listening because he/she is getting paid to. Yes, there were a couple, maybe two times, where I screamed and yelled and threw things. Yes, there was the silent treatment, which wasn't any form of punishment, but was me being depressed and angry and just not wanting to talk to you while I was working things out. What did you think I would do? Just hug you and tell you all was forgiven? Sit down quietly and talk rationally about all of this? If that's the case, you have never really known me at all.

As far as the penpal and the computer thing. Yes, I went looking for a penpal because I no longer have a best-friend that I can talk these things over with and do you even know the meaning of the word PLATONIC?

NO! I am NOT looking through your emails or anything else. I've NEVER cheated on you and never wanted to and everytime you accuse me of lying to you and cheating on you, you just make me more angry and push me further away. Yes, I did look at the phone bill after I found out you were lying to me yet again about seeing and talking till two in the morning with your long lost female friend from high school but not before that.

For the record, I thought I had a wonderful husband up until that night you told me. I knew that there were kinks in our relationship but I have always been faithful to you, trusted you implicitly and I told you I loved you at least once a day up until that night, and I always figured we could work out anything that came our way. 

That night made me feel like a stupid, friggin idiot with her head in the sand living in a dream world. I question now if there even is such a thing as a marriage with no deception that will last "till death do us part". I'm beginning to think that being an incurable romantic is just another form of stupidity and I'm tired of feeling stupid. 

I'm sorry if this upsets you, but I will never take you back. I refuse to set myself up a third time for the kind of pain that I have gone through twice already because you want other woman in our relationship and can't be truthful with me.

More than anything I am sorry for our four children but I hope that they will understand someday and hopefully, in the future, will see that we are happier without each other.

I guess I also don't expect that you reading all this will make any difference. You have believed that I've lied to you and been cheating on you our entire marriage, regardless of what I've said and I've just about given up on caring whether you believe me or not. 

I WILL keep trying to maintain at least a friendship with you because I believe, deep down inside, that you are a good person, that you are sorry for the way things have turned out and that you are the best dad you know how to be. I also want our children to know that even though things haven't worked out between us, we both will still put them first as much as we can by both of us being there for them as much as possible.


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## Tanelornpete (Feb 2, 2010)

I realize this is a rant, and thus not a very good reflection of reality, but I did want to point out some things that might help in the future:

First, I have yet to find an affair that happened out of the blue. In every case I've ever seen, there were problems in the marriage prior to the infidelity. The infidelity is the wrong choice of solution to the problem. 

Infidelity gives the betrayed spouse moral grounds to divorce. Moral, but not necessary. 

But what I am concerned with here - and something that might help you one day, should you actually step into marriage again, is that unless problems are dealt with, bad things result. In this case - infidelity. And since:



> Yes, I didn't want to talk to a counselor. I am very uncomfortable talking to a stranger about my personal life who is only listening because he/she is getting paid to


You appeared to be unwilling to try to find out what those problems were, it is no surprise that infidelity happened again.

I do want to point out this too: there is absolutely _nothing_ wrong with checking your spouses' phone records, and there is absolutely no reason at all, why either spouse should have passwords of which the other spouse is not aware. You would be absolutely within your rights as a spouse to know what any email your spouse writes actually says. So there's no reason to even feel the need to defend yourself against that! You were married!

So, my advice, regarding:



> I'm sorry if this upsets you, but I will never take you back. I refuse to set myself up a third time for the kind of pain that I have gone through twice already because you want other woman in our relationship and can't be truthful with me.


Take the time, before you ever enter into a relationship with someone again (even a 'platonic' friend) to learn how to deal with troubles, how to communicate them, and how to solve them. 

Before the pain you face now happens again. Why? Because if you do the same thing you've always done, there is a HUGE chance you will face it again.


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## Deb1234 (May 31, 2009)

I'm know now that there were warning signs in our relationship, at the time though, I think I just had my blinders on and was choosing to think everything was ok. We did attempt to determine and act upon the problems in the relationship but yes, there were some things I was just not willing to compromise on and some things that apparently went too deep to change.

Thank you for the insight. I have always been willing and open to talking about anything and everything in a relationship but I'm the first to admit that I don't hold back on my opinions and I'm far from perfect. But I would also like to think that I am open minded and willing as well. I will definitely work on myself first before I engage in anything with anyone else for some time.

This is as close to a counselor as I am willing to get for now, but you are all wonderful so far. It is nice to get unconditional, honest responses from people who have either been there or seem to know what they are talking about, so thank you all again.


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## Tanelornpete (Feb 2, 2010)

You know what's really odd - it almost always happens that the loyal spouse does not realize the problems are bad until its almost too late. The loyal spouse will understand that there's a problem, but since it doesn't seem all that bad to them, it gets put off. But the problem is enough for the other spouse to start looking somewhere else. 

The major problem is communication: neither spouse is communicating exactly what needs to be said. And the marriage suffers. 

Real communication is so important to learn!


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## Chris Taylor (Jul 22, 2010)

That could have een written by my wife. I only had one affair and have been regaining her trust ever since.

In our case, we were both at fault for letting our marriage disintegrate (however an affair was NOT the solution). And my wife said exactly the same thing you did... she wasn't going to discuss our issues with some stranger.

It wasn't until she realized that I was planning on moving out did she agree to marriage counseling. It was then she realized that she, too, was responsible for issues within our marriage and worked to be better (as I did, too).

The easy thing to do is to point the finger of blame at your husband and refuse to let a marriage counselor guide the reconciliation process so discussion can take place is a reasonable, non-hostile setting.

If that is your choice, so be it.


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## Deb1234 (May 31, 2009)

I sincerely hope things work out for you and your wife chris taylor but sometimes things are just not salvageable and I truly must keep telling myself that I deserve better and don't have to settle for someone who doesn't really and has never really loved me. I know everyone has a different definition now of what it means to love someone and his is very different from mine.

Yes, I refuse to go to a counselor. I think we are well beyond that point now. Speaking to a counselor is not the solution for everyone.


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## Chris Taylor (Jul 22, 2010)

I realize everyone reached the end of their rope and it sounds like that is where you are at.

I'm not trying to convince you to save the marriage, just to realize that there are a lot of reasons and no one is 100% at fault for a marriage going south.

I wish you well in whatever direction you go.


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## AWife (Sep 25, 2010)

I don't know that I agree 100% that problems in the marriage are the only reasons people cheat. In a marriage with two whole, healthy people that is probably true. My ex-husband could not stop. I don't know if it is an addiction for him or his trying to fill a void in himself. He is now cheating on his 4th wife. That's 2 wives since me. I'm certainly not perfect, but I was not a bad wife. I did forgive him once and tried to be better. He still cheated and continues to cheat. 

I wish the OP the best of luck. You do deserve better. Never forget that and continue to love your children more than you hate/are angry with him.


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## Tanelornpete (Feb 2, 2010)

> I don't know that I agree 100% that problems in the marriage are the only reasons people cheat.


Actually, there is still a problem in the marriage - the person is cheating, which means that they are not aware of the importance of the rational commitment they made to their spouse. 

All people can 'not cheat' - this is not an autonomic reflex like breathing: you have to actively choose to partake in the action. It's incorrect to give them the option of saying 'I _can't_ quit.' The actual statement is 'I _won't_ quit.' 

And that points to trouble in the marriage, does it not? AWife: no one ever accuses anyone of being a 'bad' wife. At the same time, there are no 'perfect' wives. No 'perfect' husbands, either. It's not a question of how 'good' you were. It's a question of boundaries, of making excuses for behavior ("I just 'can't quit"), and lack of diligent work by one or both spouses in the marriage.

That lack of work on the marriage (by one or both spouses) is the problem that pre-dates an affair. If both spouses are actively working on the marriage, an affair is extremely unlikely (if even possible). At the very least, the problem that leads to the choice of an affair is one of lack of proper communication: heading off troubles before they start, clearly stating boundaries, and clearly practicing respect of one another. If one spouse is not respecting another one, the problem has two parts: one, a lack of respect, and two, the lack of work on changing that problem! In any event - the problem is there before the affair starts!

Deb: I am curious: you say your husband _NEVER_ loved you! If that is so, why in the world did you marry him? _What on earth brought you together? How did you manage to procreate?_ Arranged marriage? It seems to me that (as you state, does not compromise) - isn't choosing to make your vows to someone who refuses to love you somewhat of a compromise?


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## Tanelornpete (Feb 2, 2010)

By the way, Deb - I am not saying you are making a mistake anywhere - I am hoping to save you some major trouble in the future...


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## Deb1234 (May 31, 2009)

I've come to the conclusion that everyone has a different definition of what the word love means.

I believed my husband loved me and I loved him very much. I would brag to my coworkers about what a great husband I had and how lucky I was.

Soo many years later, I find out that he has believed, almost through the entire relationship, that I have been cheating on him (I NEVER have), he was lying to me, not trusting me and looking for other partners.

How can that be love? How can you not trust someone, constantly doubt them and be looking for fulfillment (of whatever kind) with someone else and call that love? It just doesn't make sense to me. 

For me, I think I loved the mirage of who I thought my husband was. I loved the man who I trusted so much that I didn't mind when he flirted with girls at the grocery store in front of me because I knew he was mine and was just trying to make them smile. 
I didn't mind when he took his buddy to the strip club because I knew he wouldn't do anything to upset me there (he did and lied about it, I found out later).
I knew that he respected me enough to let me know if there were any problems brewing so we could talk about it and work it out (where is the respect when you think someone has been lying to you for years?).

I've always believed (and told him this repeatedly) that cheating shows a complete lack of respect for the person you are with and the relationship you have with that person. 

So, yes, I loved my husband and then I found out that the person I thought I loved, never really existed at all.

Maybe I'm crazy to think that that kind of person really exists at all. 

I know I'm not perfect and I know I had a part in all of this too, but I'd like to think that I deserve better.


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## friendly (Sep 21, 2010)

Deb1234 is right. 

Everybody deserves a second chance but NOT 3rd chance.

She's been faithful to her husband. She's a good wife, a great mother of 4 children, and a brave woman who stands strong at the side of truth.

It's all his faults to cheat AGAIN. He was forgiven but cheated again! No excuses from that cheater should be sympathised. 

He, the constant cheater, at this moment, can only regret himself and come clean to his wife. He's caused all the hurt and damages in the family. What did he want from her? If he loves her, why did he cheat again, again and again?

Excuses me, what was so fun to cyber sex? It's an extremely stupid behavior, wasn't it? He has a wife, who loves him with all her heart, who is a wonderful & clean woman.

What else made him feel so good? Some stupid females who only look for a D?

She has the right to choose not to forgive him again if her husband doesn't feel VERY sorry and come ALL clean to her. Please give her space and respect no matter what she decides. It's her life.


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