# Crime novels



## RobQ (Mar 1, 2015)

I mentioned in one of my first posts here that my wife is an avid reader and that her taste in books has changed over the years from what I would consider "romance" now to almost exclusively contemporary crime novels - Patterson, Cain, Koontz, etc. 

As she is a "retired" stay at home mom while I am still working full-time she has ample time to read plus she likes to read in bed for an hour or so before going to sleep each night (a different topic). I am not much of a fiction reader - I read alot for work and if I read at home it is usually something professional or business related. On vacation I will bring some fiction to read.

Anyway, over the years I have been a bit naive (if that is the right description) of what these books are actually about. I recently decided to read her most recent James Patterson novel, one titled "Swimsuit".

Ever since I feel like the wives here who have discovered their husbands porn stash. The opening chapter was about a kidnapped model who is stripped naked, tied to a bedframe, raped and then slowly decapitated with a hunting knife all while being filmed. The following chapters must have had 10 more similar rapes and subsequent killings. I couldn't finish reading it. 

This is what passes for mainstream fiction these days?

It has been hard for me to accept that my sweet dear wife is an avid reader of this stuff. I am trying just to let it go, but it continues to bother me on some level.


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## Constable Odo (Feb 14, 2015)

RobQ said:


> I am trying just to let it go, but it continues to bother me on some level.


Why exactly does it bother you?

I've read a couple of Patterson's novels, but nothing that graphic.

Some of the Kellerman novels I've read have been a bit more graphic. As have a few of the Dean Koontz books.


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## RobQ (Mar 1, 2015)

Constable Odo said:


> Why exactly does it bother you?
> 
> I've read a couple of Patterson's novels, but nothing that graphic.
> 
> Some of the Kellerman novels I've read have been a bit more graphic. As have a few of the Dean Koontz books.


I really don't know why it bothers me but it does.

I am not a user/viewer of porn but if porn is deemed harmful why isn't this stuff?


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## LonelyinLove (Jul 11, 2013)

This is my book genre of choice too.

And I love true crime TV shows.

It's just how we roll.


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## GTdad (Aug 15, 2011)

RobQ said:


> I really don't know why it bothers me but it does.
> 
> I am not a user/viewer of porn but if porn is deemed harmful why isn't this stuff?


The most common criticisms of porn is that it creates unrealistic sexual expectations, may hurt actual performance in the sack, and robs the spouse of the sexual focus that spouse deserves.

Where's the analogy between that and graphic crime fiction? Are you concerned that your wife may want to be brutalized, or that she's planning to dismember you in your sleep?


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## Fozzy (Jul 20, 2013)

I've been reading King and Koontz since I was a boy. Haven't murdered anyone yet, but I guess there's still time.


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## Lostinthought61 (Nov 5, 2013)

Sleep with one eye open...just sayin


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## rrrbbbttt (Apr 6, 2011)

Try Balducci , Child, W.E.B. Griffin, not his son, Original Robert B. Parker, Burke, etc. for mystery fiction


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## WandaJ (Aug 5, 2014)

I love crime novels, and Scandinavians are world kings of intelligently written crime novels.


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## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

I don't get it either. Ask your wife what she thought about that book and if the torture bothered her or excited her.


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## nuclearnightmare (May 15, 2013)

WandaJ said:


> I love crime novels, and Scandinavians are world kings of intelligently written crime novels.


which is ironic because there is no crime in Scandanavian countries.


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## GTdad (Aug 15, 2011)

nuclearnightmare said:


> which is ironic because there is no crime in Scandanavian countries.


Ah, for the good ol' days when they routinely pillaged and burned the UK and Russia.

That's "civilization" for ya.


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## Fozzy (Jul 20, 2013)

OP, i just saw your other thread about this issue. It seems to me that what's really bothering you is the amount of time your wife invests in reading, vs spending quality time with you. I think you'd be better served to look in to that aspect of things vs dissecting a genre of fiction.


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## chillymorn (Aug 11, 2010)

yep its porn!

written descriptions of sex is by definition porn!


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## richardsharpe (Jul 8, 2014)

Good evening
to me it is porn - and that's OK. Lots of people have fantasies about things they would never consider doing in real life.


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## Rowan (Apr 3, 2012)

OP, if you are concerned about her reading pornographic material, I'm baffled as to why this wasn't a concern for you when she was reading romance novels. Is it that the novels contain graphic descriptions of sex that's an issue for you? Or is it the violence that's of concern? 

I'm just trying to figure out why romance novels were okay but crime fiction isn't.


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## norajane (Feb 7, 2012)

Do you watch television and movies? Much of it is about crime and crime fighting, complete with graphic rape scenes, murder scenes, etc., and they are very popular or they wouldn't be in their 10th seasons with multiple spin-offs.

Game of Thrones has all of that and even more gore and it's very popular. Dexter ran for 8 seasons? and was about a normal, everyday, job-holding serial killer who chops up his victims and throws them into the sea.

I don't read those particular authors because they're too formulaic and dull, but I like clever mysteries quite a lot. My favorite author is Sara Paretsky. Ladies, look her up! She writes about smart female detective who investigates financial crimes, but finds and gets into a lot more trouble. It's about detecting (and people), not so overtly graphic, and doesn't follow a formula that monkeys could copy.


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## RobQ (Mar 1, 2015)

GTdad said:


> The most common criticisms of porn is that it creates unrealistic sexual expectations, may hurt actual performance in the sack, and robs the spouse of the sexual focus that spouse deserves.
> 
> Where's the analogy between that and graphic crime fiction? Are you concerned that your wife may want to be brutalized, or that she's planning to dismember you in your sleep?


I think the constant imagery of sadistic rape and mutilation must be as harmful to "the sexual focus that spouse deserves" as porn don't you think. I mean if I show up in bed 10 minutes after she has read a sequence about a teen girl being tied up, gagged, and then raped while being gutted do you think makes her more or less apt to want to have sex with me?


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## RobQ (Mar 1, 2015)

Blondilocks said:


> I don't get it either. Ask your wife what she thought about that book and if the torture bothered her or excited her.


I have had several frank discussions with her over the past couple of days about these books. She initially was resistant to talk about it with me especially after I recounted some of the more "memorable" scenes I had read. She said she knew what was in the books so I didn't have to tell her. Eventually some discussion actually happened.

Some of her comments:

"it is just words"
"it is just fantasy"
"why do I care what she reads"
"no, it doesn't affect me"

She says the attraction is not the gore and sadism but the family life of the police and the familiarity of the characters. I made the point that there are dozens of novels depicting family life and that there are serial stories that don't involve the misogyny depicted in these books and so it seemed to me that without the titillation of the violence she wouldn't read them

She feels those books are "boring".


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## RobQ (Mar 1, 2015)

Fozzy said:


> OP, i just saw your other thread about this issue. It seems to me that what's really bothering you is the amount of time your wife invests in reading, vs spending quality time with you. I think you'd be better served to look in to that aspect of things vs dissecting a genre of fiction.


True enough Fozzy. However, now that I know she leaves my company to read about teen girls being gagged, raped and decapitated I feel even worse about it.


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## RobQ (Mar 1, 2015)

richardsharpe said:


> Good evening
> to me it is porn - and that's OK. Lots of people have fantasies about things they would never consider doing in real life.


So it should be okay with my wife if I spend my evenings watching video depictions of young girls being bound, gagged and raped?


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## RobQ (Mar 1, 2015)

Rowan said:


> OP, if you are concerned about her reading pornographic material, I'm baffled as to why this wasn't a concern for you when she was reading romance novels. Is it that the novels contain graphic descriptions of sex that's an issue for you? Or is it the violence that's of concern?
> 
> I'm just trying to figure out why romance novels were okay but crime fiction isn't.


I guess I view romance and sex as normal. Might even enhance MY love life!

I view reading graphic descriptions of rape followed by throat slitting and drowning in ones own blood a little differently.


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## GTdad (Aug 15, 2011)

RobQ said:


> I think the constant imagery of sadistic rape and mutilation must be as harmful to "the sexual focus that spouse deserves" as porn don't you think. I mean if I show up in bed 10 minutes after she has read a sequence about a teen girl being tied up, gagged, and then raped while being gutted do you think makes her more or less apt to want to have sex with me?


I don't know. The important question is whether _you_ think it's effecting your sex life. Is it?


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## Fozzy (Jul 20, 2013)

RobQ said:


> I guess I view romance and sex as normal. Might even enhance MY love life!
> 
> I view reading graphic descriptions of rape followed by throat slitting and drowning in ones own blood a little differently.


IMO, those trashy romance novels have more of a chance of negatively impacting your sex life than James Patterson.

I think you're barking up the wrong tree here. Books aren't keeping your wife from sleeping with you. It's likely there's something in your relationship that is.


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## RobQ (Mar 1, 2015)

Fozzy said:


> IMO, those trashy romance novels have more of a chance of negatively impacting your sex life than James Patterson.
> 
> I think you're barking up the wrong tree here. Books aren't keeping your wife from sleeping with you. It's likely there's something in your relationship that is.


Well I guess I will count you as one vote in favor of torture porn.


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## GTdad (Aug 15, 2011)

RobQ said:


> Well I guess I will count you as one vote in favor of torture porn.


Low blow, man.

I guess I'm trying to figure out what the issue is. I don't read stuff or watch movies in which kids get seriously hurt or killed by adults. It just pushes a primal button in me that I can't get past. But if my wife can take it, okay. Often times it's just the author or movie-maker setting up the reader or viewer to really, really hate the Bad Guy and want to see him "get his".

So is your concern the aesthetics, or the impact this stuff may have on your wife and hence the relationship?


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## RobQ (Mar 1, 2015)

GTdad said:


> Low blow, man.
> 
> 
> So is your concern the aesthetics, or the impact this stuff may have on your wife and hence the relationship?


Both.

Again, having never read a contemporary crime novel until this week, I am literally shocked by what is passing for mainstream fiction. In the James Patterson (as mainstream as it gets) I just read, a 12 year old girl is mutilated and killed. If I had such a description on a word document on my computer I could probably get arrested. 

I have to believe a long exposure to this stuff has to have an impact. Thinking back it would appear to me that my wife has graduated from reading romance novels to "thrillers" to almost exclusively crime novels. A little google research into her favored authors indicates a path into the more graphic and violent. She seems to be "bored" by what she used to read and now needs more and more graphic violence to stay interested.


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## Fozzy (Jul 20, 2013)

RobQ said:


> Well I guess I will count you as one vote in favor of torture porn.


K. Good luck bro.


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## RobQ (Mar 1, 2015)

Lila said:


> :iagree:
> 
> Rob, I too read your other thread and it seems like you are focusing your energies on resolving the wrong issue. You may not like the gory crime novel genre but it's very popular if the NYT's Best Seller list is any indication.


Obviously it's "popular". Don't know that that equates to good or healthy.



> Would the books bother you so much if you and your wife shared a healthy sex life?


As I have stated I am concerned that the books are part of the reason that my wife is not as responsive sexually as she used to be. Could this be similar to the many threads here started by wives who feel that their husbands prefer porn to them?


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## Rowan (Apr 3, 2012)

RobQ said:


> Obviously it's "popular". Don't know that that equates to good or healthy.
> 
> 
> 
> As I have stated I am concerned that the books are part of the reason that my wife is not as responsive sexually as she used to be. Could this be similar to the many threads here started by wives who feel that there husbands prefer porn to them?


Do you think she's substituting masturbation to the fantasy material in these novels as a replacement for sex with you? Or is it that you think the graphic nature of what she's reading is turning her off so she desires sex less?


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## RobQ (Mar 1, 2015)

Rowan said:


> Do you think she's substituting masturbation to the fantasy material in these novels as a replacement for sex with you?


No



> Or is it that you think the graphic nature of what she's reading is turning her off so she desires sex less?


I don't think it is "turning her off" as much as it has become a preferred source of adrenaline/excitement such that sex has moved further down the food chain.


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## Constable Odo (Feb 14, 2015)

Order a badge and set of handcuffs and next time she's reading in bed, flash your badge, tell her you're going to have to interrogate her for a murder, and cuff her to the bedpost


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## Decorum (Sep 7, 2012)

RQ,

Rape fantasy's are not uncommon for women, it is part of that "Wanting to be taken" and a doorway to the "inner $lut".

I think it ranks up there with 3 ways for men and such.

I admire your courage for even mentioning it on TAM, because you are asking for an anal exam, but that's another fetish.

Anyway it excites her at her core, it may be showing up now because she may be a little bored with you, this could have been any number of things that she is preoccupied with like a video game or reality tv shows we are talking about here.

Seriously I don't think the content itself is overtly dangerous because as I said many women harbor this loss of control fantasy, but as she gets older and things are not as exciting it may be a borderline issue that affects her libido.

But I think the first place to look is ageing, the sameness of the relationship and life in general. 

Let me hasten to add this does not mean you are doing anything wrong, people change and go through things, sometimes it sucks, you can see the HD/LD threads all over the place here.

As an antidote, when we were first married (29 yrs ago) my wife read romance novels, and they were pretty tame (mostly written by Christian authors). I never said a word about them but I could tell they were meeting some need for that kind of excitement in her.

She stopped reading them on her own. I would have been fine if she had continued, but she just felt like it was making her discontent on some level. I didn't take it personally, she is responsible for her own synapse and happiness. I am after all quite a catch, ha ha.

So I think it meets a need, the question is when does it become counterproductive, and that bar can change as life moves along.

Take care!


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## RClawson (Sep 19, 2011)

My wife has been an avid reader for years. It has always been the mystery thrillers (with a wise cracking detective who is laying pipe every chapter). It never really bothered me until it seemed to consume all of her spare time. 

Years later it is "just a diversion to get my mind off of work" but honestly it has damaged our relationship permanently on numerous levels. Those books pretty much dictate the atmosphere at our home on all sorts of levels. I am not much of a fan of anything she reads (I get the diversion) but it interferes with our relationship on all kinds of levels. She is not going to give them up.........at all.

Sex and mutilation though? I understand how this could be perplexing.


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

Fozzy said:


> I've been reading King and Koontz since I was a boy. Haven't murdered anyone yet, but I guess there's still time.



Start worrying when she reads Gone Girl 

The rest of the stuff is hit or miss quality but generally ok.


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## Fozzy (Jul 20, 2013)

Adding this to my Kindle.


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## WandaJ (Aug 5, 2014)

Rob, you are giving way too much credit to those books. Books like Paterson are like pop corn - you know you should stop eating, but you continue to do it. Once you finish the book, you won't remember the next day what was it about. They are easy entertainement. 
I love thrillers and crime stories, and some of them have grisly crime descirption - which takes about half a page out of few hundred pages. you get through it quickly so you can focus on the mystery part. All there is too it.

Believe me, it never affected my sex life, one way or the other. No connection what so ever. I don't think books are your problem.


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## Decorum (Sep 7, 2012)

RClawson said:


> It never really bothered me until it seemed to consume all of her spare time.
> 
> ... but it interferes with our relationship on all kinds of levels. She is not going to give them up.........at all.
> 
> Sex and mutilation though? I understand how this could be perplexing.



See, ...I think that is what my wife saw down the road, so as easily as it is for some to dismiss it, there may be certain women, ...good women ...whose life and relationships would not be edified by these but quite the opposite.

"Sex and mutilation" yeah I was giving her the benefit of the doubt that she was overlooking the mutilation for the forced sex fantasy, but if not that would be disturbing, I agree.


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## WandaJ (Aug 5, 2014)

Fozzy said:


> Adding this to my Kindle.


so you know Norwegian writer Jo Nesbo? One of the smartest crime story writers, he is a writer, economist and musician, all in one.


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## happy as a clam (Jan 5, 2014)

There are plenty of excellent crime novels and series of a "whodunnit" nature -- solving murders -- that aren't so grisly, descriptive, and perhaps sexually debasing to women (which OP is concerned with).

While I am personally not a James Patterson fan, I can't say I wouldn't read one or two if I was bored. However, IMHO the content of the books isn't as troubling as the fact that she seems to ADDICTED to them and obsessed with them. Any addiction, whether it's porn, alcohol, sex, drugs, gambling, is incredibly unhealthy for a relationship. Addictions are escapes from your real life, your problems, your relationships.

Her constant reading is causing problems for OP, and for that reason alone she should be sensitive to his feelings and perhaps try to branch out a little in her book genre selections. At the very least, they should have a meaningful conversation about it and she should REALLY listen to what he is trying to convey instead of blowing him off telling him "I can read whatever I want. What do you care?" And for crying out loud, quit reading so d*mn much anyway! That's time that could be spent doing couples activities.

I love to read. I read often. But I try to do it when SO is doing his own hobby or activity. When we're together, I put the book down and we're TOGETHER.


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## RobQ (Mar 1, 2015)

Lila said:


> You might be on to something. It could be very possible that your wife enjoys her novels more than she enjoys having sex with you.
> 
> Her obsession with her books is not any different than the obsession gamers suffer.
> 
> ...


Good advice Lila. Thank you.

Tonight I am going to "suggest/demand" that we go on a walk together and when she goes to bed....l go to bed!


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## RobQ (Mar 1, 2015)

RClawson said:


> My wife has been an avid reader for years. It has always been the mystery thrillers (with a wise cracking detective who is laying pipe every chapter). It never really bothered me until it seemed to consume all of her spare time.
> 
> Years later it is "just a diversion to get my mind off of work" but honestly it has damaged our relationship permanently on numerous levels. Those books pretty much dictate the atmosphere at our home on all sorts of levels. I am not much of a fan of anything she reads (I get the diversion) but it interferes with our relationship on all kinds of levels. She is not going to give them up.........at all.
> 
> Sex and mutilation though? I understand how this could be perplexing.


Sounds like the problem at your house is worse than at mine. 

I still don't get the appeal of what is nothing other than torture porn. I am still shocked that my wife has been reading this stuff almost exclusively for 10 years.


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## RobQ (Mar 1, 2015)

WandaJ said:


> Rob, you are giving way too much credit to those books. Books like Paterson are like pop corn - you know you should stop eating, but you continue to do it. Once you finish the book, you won't remember the next day what was it about. They are easy entertainement.
> I love thrillers and crime stories, and some of them have grisly crime descirption - which takes about half a page out of few hundred pages. you get through it quickly so you can focus on the mystery part. All there is too it.
> 
> Believe me, it never affected my sex life, one way or the other. No connection what so ever. I don't think books are your problem.


Wanda, thanks for your insight. 

The Patterson book I read was just plain bad. But I think your characterization of the gore is greatly underestimated unless you are reading different books. In this book there were at least 10 "grisly crime descriptions" most of which occurred over several pages. Including the torture rape of a 12 year old girl. 

That is one of the defenses my wife claimed....that the attraction is not the gore but the "mystery". Kind of like me saying that I only buy Playboy for the articles.

I have been doing some research into this phenomenon of the crime novel. It would seem that as the level of violence in these books(usually against women) escalates so do the sales (again to women mostly). 

Perhaps you are reading them for the mystery but it would seem that the violence is a needed ingredient. After all there are plenty of mystery books out there without the violence.


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## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

"Kind of like me saying that I only buy Playboy for the articles."

Haha. My husband actually had the gall to say that to me when we were first married. So, from there on in, I fetched the mag from the mailbox and cut out every single picture of a girl (including those fabulous Vargas fantasies).


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## WandaJ (Aug 5, 2014)

RobQ said:


> Wanda, thanks for your insight.
> 
> The Patterson book I read was just plain bad. But I think your characterization of the gore is greatly underestimated unless you are reading different books. In this book there were at least 10 "grisly crime descriptions" most of which occurred over several pages. Including the torture rape of a 12 year old girl.
> 
> ...


I was talking about mysteries in general. I do not read Paterson at all, tried one book, that's it. "Mine" books are not really about gory details,they more about mysteray and - yes, this true - about main character, and his screw up life (usually brilliant detective with problems, lol)


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## RobQ (Mar 1, 2015)

WandaJ said:


> I was talking about mysteries in general. I do not read Paterson at all, tried one book, that's it. "Mine" books are not really about gory details,they more about mysteray and - yes, this true - about main character, and his screw up life (usually brilliant detective with problems, lol)


Do you have any recommendations? Perhaps I can get my wife onto some of these rather than the torture porn.


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## WandaJ (Aug 5, 2014)

Anything for you, Mr. Sterling

from the higher shelf: Jo Nesbo and Henning Mankell - Scandinavians. One has a series about middle age detective with drinking problems and a lot of women. The other one has series wiht depressed detective with no luck with women. You get mystery plus personal story. 

Others;
Tana French - Irish woman author, great stories. I would suggest starting with her. Probably the best fit.
Charlotte Link - her books read like good novels.
Camilla Lackberg

Val McDermid - she is classic, but often has stories about serial killers and those are a little graphic. 
John Sanford
Tami Haog

On the lighter note, targeted towards women:

Carol O'Connell, Louse Penny, Higgins-Clark, Harlan Coben

I like European crime stories, because they often read like real novel. More nuanced, less violent.


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## GTdad (Aug 15, 2011)

And my favorites, Lawrence Block and Martin Cruz Smith.


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## WandaJ (Aug 5, 2014)

GTdad said:


> And my favorites, Lawrence Block and Martin Cruz Smith.


Never heard of them, will have to check it out. Thanks!


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## GTdad (Aug 15, 2011)

WandaJ said:


> Never heard of them, will have to check it out. Thanks!


Block's "Scudder" series is his best. Cruz Smith wrote "Gorky Park" and has a series devoted to the Russian detective in that novel, Arkady Renko. "Rose" by him is a great book as well.

ETA: "When the Sacred Gin Mill Closes" by Block and featuring Scudder, is darn near poetry.


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## LonelyinLove (Jul 11, 2013)

I read Patterson too...every night before I go to sleep. I am reading the Alex Cross series now. 

I love his work...if my H tried to stop me....well..LOL. He could try I guess.

He reads Tolkien and Clancy. Both bore me stiff.

To each his literary own.


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## RobQ (Mar 1, 2015)

WandaJ said:


> Anything for you, Mr. Sterling
> 
> from the higher shelf: Jo Nesbo and Henning Mankell - Scandinavians. One has a series about middle age detective with drinking problems and a lot of women. The other one has series wiht depressed detective with no luck with women. You get mystery plus personal story.
> 
> ...


Thanks Red 

I also realize that generally as a non-reader I have been missing out on a shared experience with my wife. I will pick out a few from your suggestions for us to read together - hopefully turn a negative into a positive.


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## RobQ (Mar 1, 2015)

LonelyinLove said:


> I read Patterson too...every night before I go to sleep. I am reading the Alex Cross series now.
> 
> I love his work...


Still have a hard time understanding how rape, sadism, and misogyny makes for good entertainment.


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## LonelyinLove (Jul 11, 2013)

RobQ said:


> Still have a hard time understanding how rape, sadism, and misogyny makes for good entertainment.


Well, then you don't.

I don't get grown men beating each other up over an oval shaped ball but many people love it.

My 12 yr old son is a chess whiz, I can barely play checkers.

My H listens to classical music while driving to work...I rock out to Hair Bands and Ozzy.

Just because you don't understand or like it doesn't mean your wife has to feel the same way.

I have enjoyed this genre for years, and I haven't gone Ted Bundy on anyone.....yet....


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## RobQ (Mar 1, 2015)

LonelyinLove said:


> Well, then you don't.
> 
> I don't get grown men beating each other up over an oval shaped ball but many people love it.
> 
> ...


So my wife should be ok with me watching 3 or 4 hours of porn every night? Hey, no different than Beethoven, right?


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## happy as a clam (Jan 5, 2014)

RobQ said:


> So my wife should be ok with me watching 3 or 4 hours of porn every night? Hey, no different than Beethoven, right?












:lol:


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## Rowan (Apr 3, 2012)

RobQ said:


> So my wife should be ok with me watching 3 or 4 hours of porn every night? Hey, no different than Beethoven, right?


And, once again, as I think someone mentioned fairly early upthread, this seems to be more an issue of the amount of time she's spending reading. Actually, I wouldn't be bothered at all by a partner spending a few minutes watching porn every night, if that's his thing. I _would_ mind him spending 3-4 hours watching porn - or reading, or playing video games, or building model airplanes, or any other hobby I can think of - every night. Because that would considerably eat into the amount of quality time we would have as a couple. For me, the lack of quality time together would be the major issue. 

So, again, is your real concern the amount of time she's spending reading, while the content is more of a red herring? Would you be content if she were spending that 3-4 hours reading Shakespeare or Whitman?


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## RobQ (Mar 1, 2015)

Rowan said:


> So, again, is your real concern the amount of time she's spending reading, while the content is more of a red herring? Would you be content if she were spending that 3-4 hours reading Shakespeare or Whitman?


She has plenty of time to read during the day, as she is a "retired" stay at home mom, while I am still working and so I don't think it is just the total time spent that bothers me. I have felt bad in that as we have a HD/LD relationship she has always preferred to curl up in bed with a book rather than with me.

The content DOES bother me. As I have stated in previous posts I am having a hard time grasping that sadistic rape, torture and neck slitting makes for great entertainment. Consequently I feel even worse knowing that she leaves me behind to go up to bed to read a relaxing, loving story about a young woman being raped and fed into a wood chipper.


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## fitchick1961 (May 5, 2015)

I've readd almost all older Patterson, he never used to be that gory, I mainly read for the storyline or mystery, so I would skip over a lot of the descriptions myself. I've read all of John Saul, now there's a sick pup, all of his books are about children being, possessed,killed etc, but I've read everything he's written, and I love kids. . I used to read a lot, and I get very engrossed, to the point where I don't hear anything or anyone. I don't read as much as as I used to,tho. I generally skip over the descriptions of rape, descriptive killing and too much sex detail, I read for plot etc, the story itself


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## RobQ (Mar 1, 2015)

fitchick1961 said:


> I've readd almost all older Patterson, he never used to be that gory, I mainly read for the storyline or mystery, so I would skip over a lot of the descriptions myself. I've read all of John Saul, now there's a sick pup, all of his books are about children being, possessed,killed etc, but I've read everything he's written, and I love kids. . I used to read a lot, and I get very engrossed, to the point where I don't hear anything or anyone. I don't read as much as as I used to,tho. I generally skip over the descriptions of rape, descriptive killing and too much sex detail, I read for plot etc, the story itself


My wife has made the same claims, that she skips over the "bad parts" and is only interested in the plot and the family life of the characters. My issue with that claim is that in couple of Patterson novels I have read in the past week, once you take out the rape, killing and blood letting there is no plot or mystery to these books. 

A few weeks ago my wife was reading an non crime thriller book. I asked her how it was. Her reply "boring"! I continue to believe that people read his books for the rape and blood letting. After all, there are plenty of books with outstanding plot and character development that are gathering dust on the library shelves in favor of these.


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

I think it's pretty funny that if Walter Mosely was a white guy everyone would rise up and scream he's a racist. Because 'Afraid of the Dark' and some of his earlier books, frankly, are.


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## RClawson (Sep 19, 2011)

RobQ said:


> Sounds like the problem at your house is worse than at mine.
> 
> I still don't get the appeal of what is nothing other than torture porn. I am still shocked that my wife has been reading this stuff almost exclusively for 10 years.


It is so interesting that someone compared this to other addictions that consume so much time and diminish a relationship. I never thought of it in that light but it makes sense. 

it really is sad. We had a pretty intense discussion last fall regarding our relationship and I pressed for more quality time together (like the time she spends with her friends). She state her home comfort zone is her in her room reading and me in my office doing whatever. That is when she is most content in her life. Truly you cannot make this stuff up.


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## happy as a clam (Jan 5, 2014)

Nope. Your wife is full of sh*t. She is not skipping over the parts where the prostitute gets axe murdered!

James Patterson is NOT winning any literary awards with the exception of LOCAL "best new book awards"... What a joke. He is writing to the mass media appeal, trying to attract someone, ANYONE (your wife!!) 

He is NO Truman Capote. Or James Michener. Or any other author of any REAL esteem... She is settling for sh*t literature...

You need to schedule marriage counseling and BAN this drivel from your home...
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## RClawson (Sep 19, 2011)

Don't hold back.


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

I'm finishing up a book on the 1854 London cholera plague. That's pretty thrilling.


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## Fozzy (Jul 20, 2013)

happy as a clam said:


> Nope. Your wife is full of sh*t. She is not skipping over the parts where the prostitute gets axe murdered!
> 
> James Patterson is NOT winning any literary awards with the exception of LOCAL "best new book awards"... What a joke. He is writing to the mass media appeal, trying to attract someone, ANYONE (your wife!!)
> 
> ...


The day my spouse tells me what I can or cannot read is the day I pack my bags.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

GTdad said:


> The most common criticisms of porn is that it creates unrealistic sexual expectations, may hurt actual performance in the sack, and robs the spouse of the sexual focus that spouse deserves.
> 
> Where's the analogy between that and graphic crime fiction? Are you concerned that your wife may want to be brutalized, or that she's planning to dismember you in your sleep?


You want some real porn? Get some Westerns. I keep one in my bedside table for those nights when I need to get turned on in advance of SF with my husband, with the pages turned down for quick access. These are REAL sex, from a MAN's perspective.

Patterson? pfffft.


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## Nucking Futs (Apr 8, 2013)

Runs like Dog said:


> I'm finishing up a book on the 1854 London cholera plague. That's pretty thrilling.


Were there zombies?


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

Nucking Futs said:


> Were there zombies?


Nope just dead people. Lots of dead people.


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