# Is my marriage finished? There is something seriously wrong.



## marriagetalk (Jun 7, 2016)

So here goes.

I'm a 34 year old male that has been married for about 12 years now. I have a 11 year old daughter and 6 year old son.

Up to about the 9 year mark I had cheated on my wife. My wife and I were having marital problems at that mark. There was an issue with sex demand. I wanted more and she wanted less. This had been going on for several months. I tried negotiating with her and tried to get into therapy with her (she refused). I eventually searched and found a married woman in a similar marital situation (lack of sex). I would leave work (take off/disappear) we would **** endlessly (sometimes 4/5 times a day). This relationship went on for several months.

Anyway my wife had found out and we ended the relationship. My wife was devastated and it appeared we were headed down divorce. Since she did not want to go through therapy I indicated that I would seek therapy for myself. I attended several months of psychotherapy etc. In all honestly it didn't really help. I went to 2-3 different therapist and discussed my issues with sex drive etc. Most of them either wanted to transfer me etc.

So, recently my wife and I were having some major marital issues. During this time the marriage was more less bland. My biggest complaints in the marriage was my wife's lack or importance of marital maintenance. Before I had cheated on her till now, she never made an importance of dating, the night out, etc. She places 100% of her focus on the children, ignoring/disregarding me. I've explained this to her several times, but she's stubborn, it dosen't soak through. I explained to her that if the marriage is not maintained everything else suffers. I think the major issue is cultural conflict, my wife is from China (I'm American), my thought is her view of a marriage is not in alignment with the American norm. She sees the marriage as more/less a utility (like a business). I make the money, maintain the home and she sits home and maintains the children, with no regards to the intimacy or maintenance of the marriage, and that's an A+ situation (in her mind)

Another thing that boils my blood is the lack of her working. Our daughter is 11, my son is 6. It's a point right now where both are in school FT and both can walk home from the bus. I recently started intentionally coming home early so that I can take both of my kids to their swimming practice. I intentionally did this so that she can get more time home and more time to look for a job.

She has a Master's degree and is educated, can speak English well etc... I make a salary in excess of 6-figures. We had a big fight over her inactivity and lack of desire to use her degree and gain some skills. Every time we've had this kind of fight, she'd get real angry, it was a sore spot for her to talk about. But I can't really understand what the problem is. I told her I would help her and I'm pretty sure I can get her a good job. We would get so angry that we won't talk for a few weeks. I ended up telling her in text that in order for this marriage to continue she needs to do the following (1) Get a job (2) become more intimate with me etc... maintain the marriage. I'm doing everything in my power to give her the ability to do this!

Finally she came back after a week with this ****amamie idea about starting a eBay business. She wants to buy Chinese junk from a warehouse and sell it on eBay, based on my experience, I tell her it won't work. The eBay market is over-saturated, she would not make a dime. I tell her that if she came with this idea at around 2000 it would probably work, but now NO. She's stubborn again and dosen't listen to experienced people! We go to some of these distributors and end up buying about 1000 worth of stuff. I'm of course involved in this (even though it's supposed to be her company). I put all this stuff on eBay for her and of course most of it dosen't sell worth a ****. 

We get into an argument again. But this time we are talking about divorce (which is what I was talking about to her few weeks back, but she kept avoiding). I tell her if we divorce, she's going to have to get a job anyway, so why not get one now. 

Anyway my big issue is I've already worked out the cost of the divorce and what I would be paying. I have somewhat of a plan in action to which after we separate, I can come up with property equity etc to buy her out. My big issue are the children. She's wants them of course!! I'm worried about their welfare and how it would affect them both socially academically. 

I'm also not understanding my my mind, why can't she do these 2-3 simple things, to try to save the marriage!!!

WHY!!!


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## Unicus (Jun 2, 2016)

This doesn't look good.

1) You have a history of marital issues.

2) You have vastly different culturally determined expectations about marriage. Cultural issues are some of the hardest b/c they are ingrained the longest, and therefore the most resistant to change.

3) You seem over that imaginary line of pent up anger and festering resentment over #1 and 2 and perhaps all the others I haven't mentioned.

You can reach a point of no return, when the resentment is so strong that nothing can really satisfy....you making "Well into 6 figures" yet demanding her work is an example... IDK if you're there, but you might consider therapy for yourself (and with her) to determine what side of the line both of you are on and if it can be redrawn.


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## Bananapeel (May 4, 2015)

You both need to go to marriage counseling to learn how to communicate and work through your problems. Good luck.


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## GuyInColorado (Dec 26, 2015)

Why is divorce so expensive? Because it's worth it!

Sucks she doesn't have a job. You definitely want her making $50K+ a year to help offset your child support/maintenance. If she isn't working, she'll get allocated minimal wage and you'll be paying big bucks to support her. 

I make around six figures and STBX makes $60K. With two kids, I'm paying around $600m for child support and no alimony.


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## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

If you wanted an American marriage, perhaps you should have married an American girl.


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## marriagetalk (Jun 7, 2016)

GuyInColorado said:


> Why is divorce so expensive? Because it's worth it!
> 
> Sucks she doesn't have a job. You definitely want her making $50K+ a year to help offset your child support/maintenance. If she isn't working, she'll get allocated minimal wage and you'll be paying big bucks to support her.
> 
> I make around six figures and STBX makes $60K. With two kids, I'm paying around $600m for child support and no alimony.


I see where you are going, it's worth it for her, yet during our discussions she indicated she will do what is fair. We calculated a 50% equity (plus savings) as 91K. I can probably come up with that in 12 months, but it will be a tall order. Either that or I will have to relinquish my property (which is what I don't want to do). No Alimony. I've talked to attorneys in MD, if she signs a sep agreement w/o alimony then it's pretty much done.


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## marriagetalk (Jun 7, 2016)

Bananapeel said:


> You both need to go to marriage counseling to learn how to communicate and work through your problems. Good luck.


This was something I forgot to ask.

What would be the efficacy of marriage counseling at this point!!!!!

She started being more "fake sexually". Sexually faking it and acting more sexually with me (just after I confronted her on this issue). It is not satisfying, I confronted her on this fact and how it correlates with my discussion with her.


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## Rowan (Apr 3, 2012)

marriagetalk said:


> *Up to about the 9 year mark I had cheated on my wife.* My wife and I were having marital problems at that mark. There was an issue with sex demand. I wanted more and she wanted less. This had been going on for several months. I tried negotiating with her and tried to get into therapy with her (she refused). I eventually searched and found a married woman in a similar marital situation (lack of sex). I would leave work (take off/disappear) we would **** endlessly (sometimes 4/5 times a day). This relationship went on for several months.
> 
> Anyway my wife had found out and we ended the relationship. My wife was devastated and it appeared we were headed down divorce. Since she did not want to go through therapy I indicated that I would seek therapy for myself. * I attended several months of psychotherapy etc. In all honestly it didn't really help. I went to 2-3 different therapist and discussed my issues with sex drive etc. Most of them either wanted to transfer me etc.
> *


Has there been only the one affair with the married OW at the 9-year mark? Your wording in that paragraph is a little confusing. 

Also, you say therapy did not help and that your therapists mostly wanted to "transfer" you. What does that mean? Transfer you where? Why? 

Also, how often are you and your wife intimate now?


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## marriagetalk (Jun 7, 2016)

Rowan said:


> Has there been only the one affair with the married OW at the 9-year mark? Your wording in that paragraph is a little confusing.
> 
> Also, you say therapy did not help and that your therapists mostly wanted to "transfer" you. What does that mean? Transfer you where? Why?
> 
> Also, how often are you and your wife intimate now?


Yes, just that woman!

I have a history of mental health issues, depression, social anxiety etc (in college). My mother is bipolar, sister has a history of suicide and was committed briefly. 

So going to a therapist is not something entirely new. 

Why do they want to transfer me (beats me). My best guess is that I'm to complex to deal with and they don't give a ****. 

My wife is intentionally becoming intimate, but I doubt her authenticity.


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## jerry123 (Apr 9, 2012)

From what I read, she's against MC or even IC. 

She's gotten way too used to getting her way. She thinks the sex is her only control method. And it pretty much is. 


You're in a situation that a lot of men are in with a sahm. 

No marriage works when only one person is trying way too hard to fix it. 

Stop talking about your lack of sex life. 
Stop leaving work to help with kids, they are in school. She can look then. 
Get advice from lawyer if you did not already on exactly what you'll be dishing out. 


If she's willing to have a level headed talk with you then spell it out. 

Get a part time job while kids are at school. 

You're done talking, take action. Seems you have just talked in the past. She knows this and using it against you. 

That's why if you don't act, the sex will stay the same. 

There will be a moment where she will think of her options. If you're a decent looking guy you have more power to meet a woman who will respect you. 

She will be a divorced mom with 2 kids and I'm guessing she's in her 30's. 

You're still young. Your 40's are prime for a guy.

I've read tons of stories that guys regret staying in a sexless marriage for the kids.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## StilltheStudent (Sep 14, 2015)

Right now if you divorce your wife will likely receive sole use of the property, the children, and sizeable chunks of both alimony and child support. At best you might be able to fight your way to an equal share in the house which she will maintain and then eventually buy you out of when the youngest turns 18.

I have read tons of stories where, pre-divorce, the wife agrees to a 50/50 split, and then the moment the papers are served and attorneys are involved, she suddenly realizes what "she has coming to her," and runs with it.

Divorce, right now, screws you financially and as a parent.

I would suggest, highly, that you invest some time in convincing her to get a job, get her out of the house, and take a heavy role in providing (and documenting) parental care.

She is likely becoming intimate because she values this arrangement and sees increased intimacy as the investment she needs to make to hold on for now.

Which means you can use that to your advantage: leverage that investment to improve your situation for eventual divorce while you, at the same time, address some of the issues in your marriage.

The affair is a problem, that is undoubtedly in the back of her mind. Fix your issues. All of them.

That means physical fitness, mental maturity, and non-sexual intimacy with your wife, while being a solid and fun dad.

Then you can make demands of her.


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## marriagetalk (Jun 7, 2016)

StilltheStudent said:


> Right now if you divorce your wife will likely receive sole use of the property, the children, and sizeable chunks of both alimony and child support. At best you might be able to fight your way to an equal share in the house which she will maintain and then eventually buy you out of when the youngest turns 18.
> 
> I have read tons of stories where, pre-divorce, the wife agrees to a 50/50 split, and then the moment the papers are served and attorneys are involved, she suddenly realizes what "she has coming to her," and runs with it.
> 
> ...


I like this, makes sense, Yep, she's become complacent. Problem is iI've talked to her about getting a job, she has her own ideas.

Big problem is she's stubborn. She has her way of doing things, even though they may be wrong. Then she does those wrong things, then messes up. I then tell her "see I told you so". She dosen't look at history to see that I'm usually always right in these things.

Now she's marching down the divorce path, but will have to get a job after the divorce (which is what I want from her now!!!).

It makes no logical sense. Yeah I get it, she has the ability to get a lot. During discussion, she indicated she's not interesting in getting me bankrupt, she wants to get what's fair. We talked 50% division of property and 50% split custody. She would take home a fair share of 91K. In all honesty and my personal opinion 91K with a Master's is plenty. Not including CP of course.

In terms of legal issues with adultery, I spoke with several attorneys. They had indicated since the affair happens long ago and we've had sex since the affair it's been "reconciled".


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## marriagetalk (Jun 7, 2016)

jerry123 said:


> From what I read, she's against MC or even IC.
> 
> She's gotten way too used to getting her way. She thinks the sex is her only control method. And it pretty much is.
> 
> ...



Actually she's in her 40s. I'm in my mid 30s.


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## jerry123 (Apr 9, 2012)

Affairs have no biding decision in divorce court unless your state allows it anyway. Which I believe most states are no-fault. 

It's what is best for kids. 

For Christ sakes, she has a masters degree. Judge will know this. Hence you'll not be on hook for much alimony since she can work. 

She's stubborn because it's her way of maintaining status quo. You tell her to do something like find a job and she pu$$y foots around it. 


The sex thing mentioned in a post would not sit with me. Pity sex is worst form of sex. I'd rather be sexless.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## jerry123 (Apr 9, 2012)

marriagetalk said:


> Actually she's in her 40s. I'm in my mid 30s.


Oh damn, you're a higher sex rank. A woman in her 40's with 2 kids is not a catch unless she's smoking hot.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## StilltheStudent (Sep 14, 2015)

jerry123 said:


> Affairs have no biding decision in divorce court unless your state allows it anyway. Which I believe most states are no-fault.
> 
> It's what is best for kids.
> 
> ...


She is a stay at home mom who put her career on hold to be the primary care-taker for two young children while her career-driven husband stayed away and cheated on her.

Yeah, I am certain none of that will be mentioned in court and that, if it is, it will have zero influence on the decision.

No Fault Divorce is not much of a salve in this case; we have a non-working mother who has provided the majority of parental care.

OP is at her mercy in a divorce.


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## jerry123 (Apr 9, 2012)

StilltheStudent said:


> She is a stay at home mom who put her career on hold to be the primary care-taker for two young children while her career-driven husband stayed away and cheated on her.
> 
> Yeah, I am certain none of that will be mentioned in court and that, if it is, it will have zero influence on the decision.
> 
> ...


I understand that....

But, she has a masters degree. Judge will take into account her able to work. Just because she put her career on hold does not mean she can't not ever work again. 

Anyway, a lawyer will give you better advice than TAM when it comes to alimony.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## tech-novelist (May 15, 2014)

jerry123 said:


> I understand that....
> 
> But, she has a masters degree. *Judge will take into account her able to work*. Just because she put her career on hold does not mean she can't not ever work again.
> 
> ...


You seem to be under the illusion that divorce laws are applied evenhandedly to men and women. That is generally an expensive error to make.


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## jerry123 (Apr 9, 2012)

tech-novelist said:


> You seem to be under the illusion that divorce laws are applied evenhandedly to men and women. That is generally an expensive error to make.


I understand this...


That's why he will need a really good attorney.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## tech-novelist (May 15, 2014)

jerry123 said:


> I understand this...
> 
> 
> That's why he will need a really good attorney.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I'm not sure that will be enough, although obviously it can't hurt.


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## marriagetalk (Jun 7, 2016)

StilltheStudent said:


> She is a stay at home mom who put her career on hold to be the primary care-taker for two young children while her career-driven husband stayed away and cheated on her.
> 
> Yeah, I am certain none of that will be mentioned in court and that, if it is, it will have zero influence on the decision.
> 
> ...


Or you could look at it like this, she decided to pump out kids as an excuse to be able to sit at home, because of course that is her comfort zone. Yeah I understand, taking care of kids is a job too (even though it's a 0 AGI on the ole 1040). 

Yes, there are women who have kids and who go out there on the streets and work a job, coming home and managing the kids a the same time, making dinner and they might date a few times. These are wonder women, my wife certainly doesn't fit this category. 

In terms of me cheating on her, I admitted too it and went to therapy. I also gave indications as to how and why it happened, although not good excuses, my wife is not an angel. If the roles were reversed how would the response be? In terms of being career driven, she obviously wasn't I'm not for living in a trailer and depend on alimony/cp/welfare all my life! Yeah I'm driven and I'm at home around 4 every day.


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## marriagetalk (Jun 7, 2016)

jerry123 said:


> I understand that....
> 
> But, she has a masters degree. Judge will take into account her able to work. Just because she put her career on hold does not mean she can't not ever work again.
> 
> ...


I've spoken to several attorneys. In general she could theoretically ask for 6 years alimony at 25% of my income. However, since she has a degree and a will to work, the judge will impute her income. In generally she would safely get up to 3 years max. In addition I can hire a vocational evaluator which would make a determination. She isn't asking for alimony though. She indicates that she only wants half of the property and some joint custody of the children. Also if she does, then I think it will get messy, because I'm going to start fighting for other things.


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## StilltheStudent (Sep 14, 2015)

Legal counsel and a willingness to decide what is important to you and fight for it.

Always the best way to go!


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## GuyInColorado (Dec 26, 2015)

My STBX was working 1 day a week as a nurse. Child Support is based off her working full time, which she will do in a few months. The court expects her to work full time since she is capable. I'm allowing her not to work full time for a couple months, thus she gets no alimony. Alimony for me wasn't much, maybe $200m for 3 years. 

It's only money, can make more tomorrow!


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## ariel_angel77 (May 23, 2014)

My advice is that maybe you should start thinking of her more than you think of yourself. You cheated on her probably thousands of times, and she stayed with you. That right there deserves wife of the year award. Then she's trying to increase sex and that's not good enough, you say she's faking it? If my husband cheated, I wouldn't even be able to look at him. Maybe if you hadn't cheated, you could appreciate her attempt to mend the intimacy between you two instead of thinking of hot affair sex. Also at least she's trying to create some sort of business. It just seems to me that anytime she tries you just say "not good enough". When YOU should be the one trying after destroying your marriage. Come on, several times a day for several months? I can't imagine how she even stayed in the marriage, how she is intimate with you. But she obviously loves you and doesn't want to divorce you. Consider yourself lucky to have found that kind of person in this world, someone that loyal.

If there is genuinely a problem about her not wanting to work and there being a shortage of income, stop funding her "fun money" or other things she has out of luxury and tell her that if she wants to have those things, she needs a job, that you can't do this alone. But you should seriously lighten up. You really sound like you hate your wife. I don't know how she does it.


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## marriagetalk (Jun 7, 2016)

ariel_angel77 said:


> My advice is that maybe you should start thinking of her more than you think of yourself. You cheated on her probably thousands of times, and she stayed with you. That right there deserves wife of the year award. Then she's trying to increase sex and that's not good enough, you say she's faking it? If my husband cheated, I wouldn't even be able to look at him. Maybe if you hadn't cheated, you could appreciate her attempt to mend the intimacy between you two instead of thinking of hot affair sex. Also at least she's trying to create some sort of business. It just seems to me that anytime she tries you just say "not good enough". When YOU should be the one trying after destroying your marriage. Come on, several times a day for several months? I can't imagine how she even stayed in the marriage, how she is intimate with you. But she obviously loves you and doesn't want to divorce you. Consider yourself lucky to have found that kind of person in this world, someone that loyal.
> 
> If there is genuinely a problem about her not wanting to work and there being a shortage of income, stop funding her "fun money" or other things she has out of luxury and tell her that if she wants to have those things, she needs a job, that you can't do this alone. But you should seriously lighten up. You really sound like you hate your wife. I don't know how she does it.


If you have read between the lines of what others have posted here (as well as in my OP). She's avoided working and resulted to use me as her "Plan A". Why she doesn't want to divorce, because it's easier to stick around me. I can think of several other reasons, where else can you sit in a nice 4K sq foot home to simply walk the kids to the bus stop, prepare some dinner then pick the kids up. In a few years the bus stop thing will stop, once my daughter becomes older. It's like super welfare!!!!

This is 2016 not 1916, both men and women work. I'm not sure which timeframe you are in?


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## Prodigal (Feb 5, 2011)

marriagetalk said:


> I've talked to attorneys in MD, if she signs a sep agreement w/o alimony then it's pretty much done.


You have to wait for one year after she signs to formally file for divorce. However, if she refuses to sign the separation agreement, the maximum amount of time you have to wait for a divorce is three years. That is, if she doesn't start pursuing counter-arguments to contest your agreement.

I just get the feeling from your posts that you are done, as in the point-of-no-return. Yeah, I'd vote for your marriage being over.


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## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

Having two kids 5 years apart is hardly 'pumping them out'. Since you're the one with mental issues, have you thought about what it is like for her to live with you?

It is normally not a good idea to rub a person's nose in it by saying "I told you so". Makes you sound like you're ten. Since you're a know-it-all, why did you buy all that junk when you didn't think it would sell?

You're not doing everything in your power to help her fill your love bank. You criticize her, cheat on her and want to divorce. You know why she doesn't do those 3 things you want? Because she doesn't want to - she isn't getting anything in return. You are not the only one in this marriage, you know.


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## MachoMcCoy (Oct 20, 2014)

Bananapeel said:


> You both need to go to marriage counseling to learn how to communicate and work through your problems. Good luck.


Sorry BP. I'm going to pick on you. I finally snapped.

This is NOT advice. Everyone in the world knows that marriage counseling exists, and they all know WHY it exists. I'm guessing they've ALL thought about that already.

Sorry. Rant over.


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## cons (Aug 13, 2013)

OP-

I'm confused...are you wanting to save the marriage or divorce? I think to be successful and not cause lingering pain to all involved (especially your kids) you need to choose and then be ALL IN with that choice...

If you choose divorce, I realize you want to protect yourself, but please keep your children's best interests in mind during decisions that affect them. Don't use them as pawns or a means to reduce any financial burdens, but do what is best for them...


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## MachoMcCoy (Oct 20, 2014)

marriagetalk said:


> I ended up telling her in text that in order for this marriage to continue she needs to do the following (1) Get a job (2) become more intimate with me etc... maintain the marriage. *I'm doing everything in my power to give her the ability to do this!*
> 
> I'm also not understanding my my mind, why can't she do these 2-3 simple things, to try to save the marriage!!!
> 
> WHY!!!


Look at that bolded part. You are giving her the ability to do what YOU want her to do. You need to reword that. Let's see....

"I'm doing everything in my power to get her to want to do this". 

Let's try that. Does it make more sense? No? OK. Then let me ask you this: 

Does your wife love you? If yes, like a brother, a roommate, a wife or a lover? You can pick multiple responses. I just want to see what YOU think. I didn't get past this OP, so you'll excuse me if it has already been addressed. 

As far as the cultural angle, you need to go to an Asia site. Find out what makes them tick. If your wife were American, I'd say she doesn't love you. She didn't love you before the affair, and I doubt it helped.


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## MachoMcCoy (Oct 20, 2014)

marriagetalk said:


> Sexually faking it and acting more sexually with me (just after I confronted her on this issue). *It is not satisfying,* I confronted her on this fact and how it correlates with my discussion with her.


This is an awesome move on her part. My wife did it. Sex gets kind of rapey at that point, doesn't it? But it puts the discussion in her favor. "He knows he can have sex any time he wants it, he just doesn't take it".

My wife used to just lay back and let me do my thing. But I'm disgusting, so THAT I took. It was the groans and eye rolls and complaints of "AGAIN?!" that stopped me. At THAT point the rapey aspect combined with a feel of indentured sex servitude. That got to be too much, even for me.

But technically, I can have it any time I want. But I don't take it any more. Thanks anyhow.

Funny story. She offered me a BJ on my birthday. (I didn't take it. I can have it any time I want, remember?) Anyhow, to this day I have no idea if it was a sincere offer. Something tells me that she knows a birthday BJ is more pathetic than no BJ's at all. By a LOT. 

So she offered me a BJ to insult me?



I told you I was a sick ****. In more ways than one.


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## marriagetalk (Jun 7, 2016)

Blondilocks said:


> Having two kids 5 years apart is hardly 'pumping them out'. Since you're the one with mental issues, have you thought about what it is like for her to live with you?
> 
> It is normally not a good idea to rub a person's nose in it by saying "I told you so". Makes you sound like you're ten. Since you're a know-it-all, why did you buy all that junk when you didn't think it would sell?
> 
> You're not doing everything in your power to help her fill your love bank. You criticize her, cheat on her and want to divorce. You know why she doesn't do those 3 things you want? Because she doesn't want to - she isn't getting anything in return. You are not the only one in this marriage, you know.


Because in the first time in 12 years she decided to apply herself and do something of commercial value. I believe I had already said she's strong headed, yet I went along with it knowing it would fail. She dosen't listen to reason and logic real well. .

I'm sorry you don't understand exaggerations (i.e. pump them out).

Not sure I understand your "love bank" issue. You realize I'm not physically living separately. I help with the kids, chauffeur them to practice, at home around 4 etc.... In addition to bringing in the dough that pays for 100% of all the bills etc. What more is required. I'm asking her to do a %. 

I guess I can ask "what if the roles were reversed"?


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## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

"What more is required." How about a little kindness and respect - not to mention love. You might want to drop the "I'm the bill payer" attitude. Baby maker trumps bill payer any day of the week. So, until you can 'pump out' a brand spanking new human being, get your priorities in order and show her some respect.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

So what happened after your affair? How did you two interact?


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