# Damn if i do damn if i don't



## heavyweight1

Hi everybody , I have been here before about 7 years ago during separation from my wife , this forum has helped me a lot going through very difficult times of my life and I will say this again Thank You All Members for your support, understanding and help that I received here back then !

Today I am 100% back on my feet , raising my 12 yo son is my number 1 priority....job career is also going pretty good , my freedom and the choices I make are entirely up to me and I enjoy my freedom a lot . Now , I haven't dated anyone in 7 years and I am beginning to feel lonely at times , I basically do everything by myself , from cleaning to cooking to shopping and even dining out . Then I start thinking about what it would be like to be in relationship again ...doing things together , have a family structure with responsibilities , going to social functions together , cuddling on the cold winter nights , watching movies ...not being able to have 4 tall boys , sleeping past 10 am on Saturday would not be acceptable , shaving every other day would put me on the couch for the night ...waaaaait whaaat ? No way in hell I would accept those rules !
Those were just random examples . I just don't know if I could handle relationship anymore since I am basically my own boss in my own life and "I am going to spend $200 on power tools today and nobody is going to stop me "... but then I have those moments where I am so lonely it makes me want to cry , and then I would do anything "to buy her those Louis Vuitton shoes just to see her smile"

Any thoughts ? Am I beyond any help ? Can I hope for relationship without loosing my freedoms ? Or am I just naive middle aged man who is hoping to have both worlds at the same time ? 

Thank you


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## Andy1001

heavyweight1 said:


> Hi everybody , I have been here before about 7 years ago during separation from my wife , this forum has helped me a lot going through very difficult times of my life and I will say this again Thank You All Members for your support, understanding and help that I received here back then !
> 
> Today I am 100% back on my feet , raising my 12 yo son is my number 1 priority....job career is also going pretty good , my freedom and the choices I make are entirely up to me and I enjoy my freedom a lot . Now , I haven't dated anyone in 7 years and I am beginning to feel lonely at times , I basically do everything by myself , from cleaning to cooking to shopping and even dining out . Then I start thinking about what it would be like to be in relationship again ...doing things together , have a family structure with responsibilities , going to social functions together , cuddling on the cold winter nights , watching movies ...not being able to have 4 tall boys , sleeping past 10 am on Saturday would not be acceptable , shaving every other day would put me on the couch for the night ...waaaaait whaaat ? No way in hell I would accept those rules !
> Those were just random examples . I just don't know if I could handle relationship anymore since I am basically my own boss in my own life and "I am going to spend $200 on power tools today and nobody is going to stop me "... but then I have those moments where I am so lonely it makes me want to cry , and then I would do anything "to buy her those Louis Vuitton shoes just to see her smile"
> 
> Any thoughts ? Am I beyond any help ? Can I hope for relationship without loosing my freedoms ? Or am I just naive middle aged man who is hoping to have both worlds at the same time ?
> 
> Thank you


There is nothing to stop you dating and forming a relationship without actually marrying.There are plenty of women in the same boat as you,they want a man in their lives but on their own terms, and don’t want anyone moving in with them.
You are conjuring up some dream woman in your head who will be available when you want her but will then vanish when you want to be alone.These women exist but it works both ways,when she wants her downtime you have to disappear.
Your comment about being sent to the couch has me puzzled.Do you put women on some sort of pedestal,are you actually afraid of the opposite sex?


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## arbitrator

Andy1001 said:


> There is nothing to stop you dating and forming a relationship without actually marrying.There are plenty of women in the same boat as you,they want a man in their lives but on their own terms, and don’t want anyone moving in with them.
> You are conjuring up some dream woman in your head who will be available when you want her but will then vanish when you want to be alone.These women exist but it works both ways,when she wants her downtime you have to disappear.
> Your comment about being sent to the couch has me puzzled.Do you put women on some sort of pedestal,are you actually afraid of the opposite sex?


*Perhaps the OP is a lot like me in that he is consummately lonely, and seeks another relationship hoping for the best; but at the same time, he remains all too fearful that those demons from his relationships past will once again rear their ugly heads, plummeting yet another new relationship into abysmal failure!*


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## Bananapeel

It isn't difficult to have a relationship and still maintain the freedom and control over your own life. If you communicate directly and openly you are far more likely to find someone that fits with that relationship style. As @Andy1001 alluded to, you can't be afraid of women or put them on a pedestal because by doing that you are implying that you have to change to please them, rather than finding someone that also wants what you want. The secret to a happy relationship is sorting through people to find someone you are truly compatible with, rather than trying to make someone like you by changing who you are. Some people have difficulties with this because they aren't good with finding/dating members of the opposite sex, so they are afraid to discard incompatible matches and instead try to mold a relationship through compromise instead of compatibility. For anyone that has a difficult time dating I'd highly recommend trying to date multiple people at the same time so that you can change your mindset into one where you evaluate your many choices and select your best option, and also develop the confidence to turn down incompatible candidates.


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## Hoosier

It is extrememly hard to have self determenination and a relationship at the same time. I have been trying to for 7 years, with three different women, all eventually want control over my actions, unhappy when they are/were not. Such that the questions start, over and over, where were you (at home, I talked with you earlier in evening) when you are not together. I still think it can be done, but she is one in a million and can take awhile to find her.


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## Baseballmom6

I think a lot of women want the same thing as you do OP, independence but also a romantic partner. I have been in a committed relationship for 3-1/2 years now. My BF and I see each other on weekends (most weekends). We don't talk much during the week and no daily texts/emails between us. If we have something that can't wait until the weekend then we call/text/email each other. Don't get me wrong I will occasionally let him know I am thinking about him and vice verse but we also don't feel the need to speak every day and we only live 10 miles apart. I also know I can call him for anything, at anytime and he will respond. I say all that to tell you a lot of my single divorced female friends want exactly the same thing. They are out here! Hard to find I'm sure but they are out there.


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## SunCMars

arbitrator said:


> *Perhaps the OP is a lot like me in that he is consummately lonely, and seeks another relationship hoping for the best; but at the same time, he remains all too fearful that those demons from his relationships past will once again rear their ugly heads, plummeting yet another new relationship into abysmal failure!*


No, Arb, that ain't it...

You are just too damn tall.
You also hold your head up too high.

Then to top it off..
You wear a Stetson Hat to make you taller.
Wear alligator skin cowboy boots with two inch heels.

Ach, your head is in the clouds.

No one can see your *face. That is the problem.

Um, maybe *not!




TH-


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## SunCMars

I assume, I presume you are a heavy weight man.

No problem, you are in the majority.

Is this part of the reason you have not sought out a relationship.

Because you, have fear of rejection?

Weight wise.
Waist wise.
Waste wise, waste of time.
Wait wise. Not having sufficient patience.

And, of course, the prospective women would 'likely' comment on your weight.

Seven years of no sex.....
That is a head scratcher.

Any new woman would question that. No sex for seven years.

Come up with a good reason for that fact. 
That question is coming. If not asked, it will be pondered.





TH-


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## arbitrator

SunCMars said:


> *No, Arb, that ain't it...
> 
> You are just too damn tall.
> You also hold your head up too high.
> 
> Then to top it off..
> You wear a Stetson Hat to make you taller.
> Wear alligator skin cowboy boots with two inch heels.
> 
> Arb, your head is in the clouds.
> 
> No one can see your *face. That is the problem.
> TH-*




* Mars: Are you sure that you're not one of the guys on my football officiating crew? You sure as hell sound just like one of them!*


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## SunCMars

Baseballmom6 said:


> I think a lot of women want the same thing as you do OP, independence but also a romantic partner. I have been in a committed relationship for 3-1/2 years now. My BF and I see each other on weekends (most weekends). We don't talk much during the week and no daily texts/emails between us. If we have something that can't wait until the weekend then we call/text/email each other. Don't get me wrong I will occasionally let him know I am thinking about him and vice verse but we also don't feel the need to speak every day and we only live 10 miles apart. I also know I can call him for anything, at anytime and he will respond. I say all that to tell you a lot of my single divorced female friends want exactly the same thing. They are out here! Hard to find I'm sure but they are out there.


Agh,

That would not 'do' for me.

I woud want an eye, a hand and a mindful lock on my SO.
At all times.

My imagination would run wild. Would drive me, uh, to unhappy.

Otherwise, else, it sounds like FWBs.

That I cannot abide....for long, maybe for short.


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## FeministInPink

heavyweight1 said:


> Hi everybody , I have been here before about 7 years ago during separation from my wife , this forum has helped me a lot going through very difficult times of my life and I will say this again Thank You All Members for your support, understanding and help that I received here back then !
> 
> Today I am 100% back on my feet , raising my 12 yo son is my number 1 priority....job career is also going pretty good , my freedom and the choices I make are entirely up to me and I enjoy my freedom a lot . Now , I haven't dated anyone in 7 years and I am beginning to feel lonely at times , I basically do everything by myself , from cleaning to cooking to shopping and even dining out . Then I start thinking about what it would be like to be in relationship again ...doing things together , have a family structure with responsibilities , going to social functions together , cuddling on the cold winter nights , watching movies ...not being able to have 4 tall boys , sleeping past 10 am on Saturday would not be acceptable , shaving every other day would put me on the couch for the night ...waaaaait whaaat ? No way in hell I would accept those rules !
> Those were just random examples . I just don't know if I could handle relationship anymore since I am basically my own boss in my own life and "I am going to spend $200 on power tools today and nobody is going to stop me "... but then I have those moments where I am so lonely it makes me want to cry , and then I would do anything "to buy her those Louis Vuitton shoes just to see her smile"
> 
> Any thoughts ? Am I beyond any help ? Can I hope for relationship without loosing my freedoms ? Or am I just naive middle aged man who is hoping to have both worlds at the same time ?
> 
> Thank you


Not all women have those "rules." You just need to find someone who is compatible with you, and who wants the same type of relationship that you do. You get to set the parameters for what you want out of a relationship... a healthy relationship encourages both togetherness and independence.


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## Vinnydee

I have lived with a woman since I was 19. I am now 67 and married for 46 years. I love relationships. The secret is to not view yourself as half of a couple but rather as individuals. It also helps if you enter into a relationship with the right partner. Don't do what I did and get engaged to a lesbian who is now married to a woman she was with for 32 years. My wife and I have little in common besides our undying love for each other. We met and were engaged 3 weeks later. Truly love at first sight and we still do not know why.

The secret to a happy relationship is to not spend too much time together. We also never had kids.  Be two individuals who vow to go through life together. I know couples who have individual bank accounts and a joint account for household expenses. That way no one can complain about spending too much on beer or new shoes. We have not done that because I can buy whatever I want as can my wife. We always put our marriage above all else so would not dream to do anything that might hurt it. I still ask my wife if she is OK with my purchases and the answer is always yes. Same when she wants something. 


We also like to please each other. If not for the desire to make my wife happy and give her a lifestyle to make up for raising her younger siblings in a house with two alcoholic and violent parents, where there was only fear and no happiness, I would not have been driven to succeed as I have done. Of course my wife made it possible for me to succeed by agreeing to relocating 9 times for better job opportunities. I cannot imagine not being in a loving relationship. You just need the right partner and a mindset that you can design your relationship any way you want to. There is not just one way as society dictates.


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## Mr.Married

It's called casual dating .... give it a try.


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## Steve2.0

I think you are falling for the old "get into a relationship and hand over your balls" game.

Be yourself, if a female wants to enter your world and enjoy it then so be it... but dont alter your life and habbits for a relationship. 

_Take me as I am, or leave me how you found me_


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## NobodySpecial

heavyweight1 said:


> Hi everybody , I have been here before about 7 years ago during separation from my wife , this forum has helped me a lot going through very difficult times of my life and I will say this again Thank You All Members for your support, understanding and help that I received here back then !
> 
> Today I am 100% back on my feet , raising my 12 yo son is my number 1 priority....job career is also going pretty good , my freedom and the choices I make are entirely up to me and I enjoy my freedom a lot . Now , I haven't dated anyone in 7 years and I am beginning to feel lonely at times , I basically do everything by myself , from cleaning to cooking to shopping and even dining out . Then I start thinking about what it would be like to be in relationship again ...doing things together , have a family structure with responsibilities , going to social functions together , cuddling on the cold winter nights , watching movies ...not being able to have 4 tall boys , sleeping past 10 am on Saturday would not be acceptable , shaving every other day would put me on the couch for the night ...waaaaait whaaat ? No way in hell I would accept those rules !


Maybe those were your ex-wife's "rules". They are not relationship rules. Hold on to your N.U.T. s and you can have a relationship that does not kill your individuality.



> Those were just random examples . I just don't know if I could handle relationship anymore since I am basically my own boss in my own life and "I am going to spend $200 on power tools today and nobody is going to stop me "... but then I have those moments where I am so lonely it makes me want to cry , and then I would do anything "to buy her those Louis Vuitton shoes just to see her smile"
> 
> Any thoughts ? Am I beyond any help ? Can I hope for relationship without loosing my freedoms ? Or am I just naive middle aged man who is hoping to have both worlds at the same time ?
> 
> Thank you


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## Ynot

As others have mentioned there is no reason why you have to give up any part of who you are to be in a relationship. You absolutely do NOT need to alter who you are to be in one. If the other person cannot accept you for you, then they are not right for you. 
In the meantime, just date and have fun. Along the way, I think you will be pleasantly surprised with what you find. There are lots and lots of women out there in the world. Many of them would appreciate some, most or all of who you are and what you want.
My ex was discouraged drinking, she abhorred sports, valued style over substance etc. etc. Along my journey I have found women who enjoy hitting happy hours, dive bars and/or just partying. I have enjoyed watching football, basketball and soccer games, live and on TV with women who insist on it (not for me, but because they want to see). I have met women who think nothing of throwing on a baseball cap and heading out for breakfast after some morning loving. Another thing I have discovered is that many women LOVE sex.
So quit making excuses and start living.


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## Diana7

heavyweight1 said:


> Hi everybody , I have been here before about 7 years ago during separation from my wife , this forum has helped me a lot going through very difficult times of my life and I will say this again Thank You All Members for your support, understanding and help that I received here back then !
> 
> Today I am 100% back on my feet , raising my 12 yo son is my number 1 priority....job career is also going pretty good , my freedom and the choices I make are entirely up to me and I enjoy my freedom a lot . Now , I haven't dated anyone in 7 years and I am beginning to feel lonely at times , I basically do everything by myself , from cleaning to cooking to shopping and even dining out . Then I start thinking about what it would be like to be in relationship again ...doing things together , have a family structure with responsibilities , going to social functions together , cuddling on the cold winter nights , watching movies ...not being able to have 4 tall boys , sleeping past 10 am on Saturday would not be acceptable , shaving every other day would put me on the couch for the night ...waaaaait whaaat ? No way in hell I would accept those rules !
> Those were just random examples . I just don't know if I could handle relationship anymore since I am basically my own boss in my own life and "I am going to spend $200 on power tools today and nobody is going to stop me "... but then I have those moments where I am so lonely it makes me want to cry , and then I would do anything "to buy her those Louis Vuitton shoes just to see her smile"
> 
> Any thoughts ? Am I beyond any help ? Can I hope for relationship without loosing my freedoms ? Or am I just naive middle aged man who is hoping to have both worlds at the same time ?
> 
> Thank you


if you have the right partner you should be able to feel relaxed and free. I feel free and I have been married for 12 years. My husband is a very easy going, easy to please, patient and laid back man.


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## heavyweight1

SunCMars said:


> I assume, I presume you are a heavy weight man.
> 
> No problem, you are in the majority.
> 
> Is this part of the reason you have not sought out a relationship.
> 
> Because you, have fear of rejection?
> 
> Weight wise.
> Waist wise.
> Waste wise, waste of time.
> Wait wise. Not having sufficient patience.
> 
> And, of course, the prospective women would 'likely' comment on your weight.
> 
> Seven years of no sex.....
> That is a head scratcher.
> 
> Any new woman would question that. No sex for seven years.
> 
> Come up with a good reason for that fact.
> That question is coming. If not asked, it will be pondered.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TH-


 To assume personal appearance of a person simply by user name is kind of silly , don't you think ? If my login name was firstpresident1 , would you actually describe me as George Washington ? Silly .
7 years no sex ? I think I could explain...I also think some ladies would be quite happy with that .


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## heavyweight1

Formally known as Hoosier said:


> It is extrememly hard to have self determenination and a relationship at the same time. I have been trying to for 7 years, with three different women, all eventually want control over my actions, unhappy when they are/were not. Such that the questions start, over and over, where were you (at home, I talked with you earlier in evening) when you are not together. I still think it can be done, but she is one in a million and can take awhile to find her.


That is exactly what I am afraid of , my ex was extremely controlling , obsessed , observant ( not in the positive way ) , to this day it gives me chills just to think that I could fall in the same s#%t if I was to get into relationship again . On the positive note , I am actually looking at online dating sites to see if that's something that would work for me , some of them have personality questionnaire which helps determining compatibility between people , I know I have some way to go before I find the courage to form relationship or I will wait for the one in a million


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## BluesPower

heavyweight1 said:


> That is exactly what I am afraid of , my ex was extremely controlling , obsessed , observant ( not in the positive way ) , to this day it gives me chills just to think that I could fall in the same s#%t if I was to get into relationship again . On the positive note , I am actually looking at online dating sites to see if that's something that would work for me , some of them have personality questionnaire which helps determining compatibility between people , I know I have some way to go before I find the courage to form relationship or I will wait for the one in a million


You know what guys it just really is not that hard. You can date, try a few on for size, and don't get serious about any of them. If you date one and she is cool, and the sex is good, OK, hang with her until she shows her cards, then dump her. 

Most say it takes 6 months for crazy to come out, that may be right, I find it can take longer, and sometimes quicker. When crazy comes out, you move on.

I went through a bunch this way until I found "The one" so to speak that is not crazy and has all the other good attributes...


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## KevinZX

Nearly a year into my separation, i know what you mean about freedom etc, it is great, but like you i hanker after the female company i had when she was agreeable and not a pain in the ass. It has been seven years for you and this i know from speaking to many people in our situation, their are many many women out there seeking the same things as us all, a relationship based on mutual trust and a little give and take, maybe you should take the plunge and start asking women out, if you know any that is, i don't know any that are ready for a relationship, maybe you will, it is a big step but one you will not regret. 

Love and Peace always

KevinZX


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## Mr.Married

heavyweight1 said:


> I am afraid of


Perhaps it isn't the women that are the problem


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## SunCMars

heavyweight1 said:


> To assume personal appearance of a person simply by user name is kind of silly , don't you think ? If my login name was firstpresident1 , would you actually describe me as George Washington ? Silly .
> 7 years no sex ? I think I could explain...I also think some ladies would be quite happy with that .


I apologize for the heavyweight inference/remark.
Just adding levity...

I do not offer any such redress about the 'no sex' for seven years.
Simply do not admit this...do not.




They will assume you dated others.

************!!*************

They will assume you dated Rosy Palm.


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## SunCMars

If I were in the dating market and the woman I was dating said, Uh, I haven't had sex in seven years I would not date her a second time.

That would tell me she is low desire.....
Better put......no desire.

We have a lady friend who has been divorced for fifteen years.
She has not dated since.

She is a very beautiful women, gets hit on all the time.
She will not date anyone. No, not even women.

Uh, low desire, Ya think!

Very few men would be happy with this. I suspect that is why she is divorced. 
Her husband was a healthy specimen. A normal guy as far as we could tell.
One day he up and left her. He moved back to his old country.


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## SunCMars

BluesPower said:


> You know what guys it just really is not that hard. You can date, try a few on for size, and don't get serious about any of them. If you date one and she is cool, and the sex is good, OK, hang with her until she shows her cards, then dump her.
> 
> Most say it takes 6 months for crazy to come out, that may be right, I find it can take longer, and sometimes quicker. When crazy comes out, you move on.
> 
> I went through a bunch this way until I found "The one" so to speak that is not crazy and has all the other good attributes...


Ahhh...

This 'crazy' thing in women.

Most are not 'crazy'...they aren't.

It is just that men have not learned to obey.

When they make a suggestion....think of it as a command.

Learn that, bend and obey, you have learned women.

OK, Gals, have at me!!


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## Bananapeel

SunCMars said:


> Ahhh...
> 
> This 'crazy' thing in women.
> 
> Most are not 'crazy'...they aren't.
> 
> It is just that men have not learned to obey.
> 
> When they make a suggestion....think of it as a command.
> 
> Learn that, bend and obey, you have learned women.
> 
> OK, Gals, have at me!!


Hilarious, my friend! :rofl:

I find quite the opposite is true. Women tell me something that I don't want to do, then I say no, then they get really turned on because I have a backbone, then they give me the porn start treatment. 

Oh, and the crazy ones can be spotted usually anytime from within a few minutes to a few dates.


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## Vinnydee

You are very right about this. Some guys will put up with anything as long as they are getting steady sex. Most men are afraid of being rejected in the dating scene and know how long it takes to find someone to love. They rather put up with someone than have to start all over again. The problem with that is that courtship love blinds us to each other's faults. Courtship love disappears after marriage and all of a sudden you see each other's' faults. That is the time when a decision has to be made whether or not to stay together and build a mature kind of love. This is the reason why so many couples break up or divorce after 2 years of marriage.


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