# Thinking of becoming a nun



## Cup of Tea (Apr 15, 2020)

We've been married for 12 years. For probably the last 9, our sex life has gone from wonderful, to ok, to meh, to ugg, full blown cringe. I cannot stand having sex at all, and believe its to a point where its having an impact on my mental health.

We almost divorced 2 years ago, but stuck it out and this is a huge issue that I cannot see getting any better. I was honestly looking forward to not having sex even be a part of my life anymore. I was ready to bury and forget it.

I began to have bitter feelings about sex after having our daughter 9 years ago. He began asking me 4 weeks postpartum, but I'd had a class 4 episiotomy with no anesthesia and was still a _little_ traumatized. (It took the Dr. 2 hours to reconstruct my vagina and anus) I of course refused, as tearing stitches, excruciating pain, and dying from an infection weren't anything I was interested in. Blood and clots don't really turn me on either. He left me alone until 7 weeks when the Dr. cleared me, then wasn't going to take no for an answer anymore. It hurt like an s.o.b., but I powered through, and it was pretty tolerable after 5-6 times. But it planted a bad seed.

A year later I got spayed, after he refused to get a vasectomy, even though he promised to. I thought maybe he'd have some pity on me after that awful delivery, but "he didn't want some doctor touching his junk." So instead of taking some chemical for the rest of my life I did the deed. I knew it wouldn't be good for me to get pregnant again. To this day, I can't think about birth too much without getting phantom pains in my bottom. So I jumped through the insurance hoops, went through with the pain of the procedure, and the more painful follow up to make sure I was infertile. I did all this with some comfort that at least we could have sex whenever with no worries. Stupid me.

Well over the next few years, the sex went from good to just awful. He gained weight to the point that he couldn't really get it in anymore. I spent YEARS on top because that was the only way to get any kind of penetration. Missionary became a no-no as I enjoy breathing and there was no other position gave me even basic pleasure. I put on a brave face for many years, but after recieving no pleasure in return for my efforts I quit initiating and would actively avoid being intimate. I would give in every now and then, and can think of only a few times over the years where it wasn't just horrible. 

On top of the awful quality, there were other factors to making me hate sex. Mister had zero regard for my sleep and would initiate at 3-4 in the morning, then get very upset when I wouldn't spring to life and become some goddess. Consequences would include making sure I was fully awake by turning on all the lights, asking me a bunch of nit-picky questions, and making unnecessary noise. So I started sleeping on the couch to try and get some sleep. But he would just wake me up on purpose out there, too. Add on years of harassing messages throughout the day, bugging me for sex when I was in the middle of an activity, pouting, yelling, guilt trips, constant sex jokes, him making me go get his ED meds, and not even being able to cuddle without being groped and you get a very bitter wife who wants to sew herself shut and never deal with this bullsh** ever again.

I've communicated once about how I was unsatisfied. It was met with extreme defensiveness and anger. I tried to be as gentle and tactful as I could be, but I recieved just a hurricane in return. Valentine's Day is coming up and I just want to drive my car off a cliff. Thinking about sex makes me really anxious and depressed, usually resulting in a migraine and nausea. I try not to think about it at all. I deeply hate the smell and the mess, and most of all I hate being teased. Thats all sex is anymore. I get one lick of licorice ice cream instead of a scoop of a good flavor and that's not fair. 

My heart loves this man. We have so much of our lives invested in each other, but this sex issue makes me just sick to my core. Even if we ended up splitting, I would be happy living alone as I have ZERO desire to be intimate with anyone. I've been tainted from years of being bitter and unsatisfied. 

This is bothering me to the point of wanting to start the divorce process again, but divorcing someone over awful sex is so shallow. I hate this situation and don't want sex to be a part of my life anymore, but know that's so unhealthy in a marriage. What am I supposed to do?


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

I think it's time to let him go. He was very insensitive and I don't know why men think that that's going to go unnoticed and women aren't going to take that inside their heart and hold it against them. 

Get out of this awful thing and let him know it's over before Valentine's Day so you don't have to bear that. Get your own attorney. You know what takes a long time so you need to get started. You could just go ahead and move out but first you need to get that attorney and get things going so you don't put that off. 

You need to do that so you have some oversight on your finances and assets. 

He sounds like a five-year-old. I don't know how anyone would ever tolerate all the nonsense he's putting you through in the middle of the night to wake you up. It's appalling and childish and he has no care whatsoever for your physical well-being or your needs or your wants. Time to dump him.


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## Angie?or… (Nov 15, 2021)

It doesn’t sound like you would be divorcing over awful sex alone (although that might be a good reason if he isn’t willing to work with you). He sounds extremely selfish and inconsiderate, insisting on sex when you weren’t yet recovered from a brutal delivery, refusing vasectomy and harassing you at 3 in the morning.

What is unhealthy is you being stuck in a marriage with a man who refuses to take care of himself or concern himself with your well-being. 

You have tried, you have a right to be safe and happy, there is nothing wrong with divorce in your situation.


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## Mr. Nail (Apr 26, 2011)

Long time no see. 
The first thing I thought when I read this was, "What? you are still married?
The next thing I thought was "well that sure fills in a lot of holes in the story."
And to answer your Question. No that is not a shallow reason for divorce.


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## ccpowerslave (Nov 21, 2020)

If I was you I’d leave.


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## Chaotic (Jul 6, 2013)

I read somewhere that repeatedly and purposefully depriving a partner of sleep can be considered abusive. And that's one of the less offensive things he's done.

I'd leave if I were you.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

Chaotic said:


> I read somewhere that repeatedly and purposefully depriving a partner of sleep can be considered abusive. And that's one of the less offensive things he's done.
> 
> I'd leave if I were you.


It absolutely is abusive.


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

It’s unfortunate you didn’t get out then. This is who he is and he apparently doesn’t see any reason to change. It usually comes down to accept him or leave him. I hope this time you leave him.


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## CatholicDad (Oct 30, 2017)

Sounds like he needs some education on how to please your spouse, how to be nice to your spouse, etc… he also needs to understand that it is outright cruel to leave someone continually unsatisfied. I mean, if he can’t get the job done surely there are some battery powered options available… ok I’m making light here but this is in fact a very serious issue. I hope he would be open to learning here because I suspect he is also dissatisfied on some level… doesn’t everyone want a mutually satisfying love life?

You’re too angry and PO’d to be a nun and pretty sure they don’t accept some kids momma- 😆.


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## moulinyx (May 30, 2019)

Yuck.

Your story makes for an awful mind movie. Really sad he has turned intimacy into such a terrible experience for you. No one would be excited for unrewarding sex. At that point it’s just an exhausting workout and a mess.

He sounds like he lacks basic empathy. How is he not understanding that he needs to make sex “fun” for you too? This issue is so much deeper than bad sex I’m afraid.


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## TXTrini (Oct 2, 2013)

@ Cup of Tea
I can't imagine how you can love such a callous, unfeeling man, are you sure it's not attachment because you're used to him? Personally, I'd have dumped him after he hurt you when you were barely recovered from surgery. That is not love!

The crappy sex is not the issue here, you're married to a selfish, entitled baby.


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## Young at Heart (Jan 6, 2015)

Cup of Tea said:


> We've been married for 12 years. For probably the last 9, our sex life has gone from wonderful, to ok, to meh, to ugg, full blown cringe. I cannot stand having sex at all, and believe its to a point where its having an impact on my mental health.
> 
> We almost divorced 2 years ago, but stuck it out and this is a huge issue that I cannot see getting any better. I was honestly looking forward to not having sex even be a part of my life anymore. I was ready to bury and forget it.
> 
> ...


Well we have definitely heard your side of the problem. However, near the end you say, ".....*My heart loves this man. We have so much of our lives invested in each other, but this sex issue makes me just sick to my core*..."

Based on the above and your last sentence, *What am I supposed to do?* My advice is to look yourself in the mirror and figure out what you want your life to look like in 10 or 20 years? If as you suggest by your title you want to take a vow of celibacy and you don't want to invest any effort in changing then divorce your H.

If on the other hand, you do want a sex life and sexual intimacy at some point in the future (whether that is with or without your husband), then you need to heal from your anger and trauma. To do that you will have to examine if you had any role in where you and your husband now stand in regards to sex. 

The reason I am saying that is that your husband has a side to this story and it may not be the same. If for no other reason than the next man in your life, then you need to understand how different actions on your part could have resulted in different outcomes or how not letting a problem fester could have made it easier to solve.

If you learn those lessons, you just might find some middle ground with husband before you divorce him. Yes the same guy who toward the end you say your heart loves him.

Again, as to what should you do? Figure out what you want your life to be. Then get either some professional marriage counseling or else organize a celebration among friends and family where you take your formal vow of celibacy. You get to choose what your really want in life, but then you need to live with the consequences.

Good luck.

P.S. I was in a sex starved marriage, felt I was the victim of a frigid wife, and after introspection realized that I was part of the problem. That allowed me to apologize and work on reconciliation. We both committed to making our marriage work and it did.


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## thunderchad (12 mo ago)

If you still love him and want to be with him perhaps you could let him have sex with other women.


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## happyhusband0005 (May 4, 2018)

Cup of Tea said:


> We've been married for 12 years. For probably the last 9, our sex life has gone from wonderful, to ok, to meh, to ugg, full blown cringe. I cannot stand having sex at all, and believe its to a point where its having an impact on my mental health.
> 
> We almost divorced 2 years ago, but stuck it out and this is a huge issue that I cannot see getting any better. I was honestly looking forward to not having sex even be a part of my life anymore. I was ready to bury and forget it.
> 
> ...


This sounds so bad it almost makes me never want to have sex again. Yikes. I mean getting rid of him is the way to go. If you want to stick it out have you tried using a vibrator while your riding him?

Also if you want to try and save it you might as well just be fully honest and direct and tell him he's fat, smelly and sex with him makes you sick. Maybe he will wake up join a gym start eating healthy and learn how to actually turn a woman on.

I had to add the knowledge that guys like your husband exist is the reason why when I first joined TAM I thought women who cheated were justified. Don't think that anymore but yuck.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Cup of Tea said:


> We've been married for 12 years. For probably the last 9, our sex life has gone from wonderful, to ok, to meh, to ugg, full blown cringe. I cannot stand having sex at all, and believe its to a point where its having an impact on my mental health.
> 
> We almost divorced 2 years ago, but stuck it out and this is a huge issue that I cannot see getting any better. I was honestly looking forward to not having sex even be a part of my life anymore. I was ready to bury and forget it.
> 
> ...


As high drive as I am, I think I lost my desire for sex just reading this and I didn't even have to experience it.

If he's not listening to you and working to make it better, I don't see you just "powering" through much longer. That actually does emotional and mental damage that you are already experiencing.

Might want to get with a lawyer just to see where you stand.


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

The truth is that your husband has been a jerk for years and even though he put in some effort for awhile when you were going to divorce him it apparently didn’t last — at least regarding sex (and maybe all the rest of it too). He definitely doesn’t want a divorce but that doesn’t mean he’s ever going to be who you need him to be. Can you live with that for the next few decades?


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## graciegracie (12 mo ago)

Young at Heart said:


> Well we have definitely heard your side of the problem. However, near the end you say, ".....*My heart loves this man. We have so much of our lives invested in each other, but this sex issue makes me just sick to my core*..."
> 
> Based on the above and your last sentence, *What am I supposed to do?* My advice is to look yourself in the mirror and figure out what you want your life to look like in 10 or 20 years? If as you suggest by your title you want to take a vow of celibacy and you don't want to invest any effort in changing then divorce your H.
> 
> ...


Young at Heart - You cannot be serious with some of these comments?
The woman has been torn from rectum to vagina and scarred - do you understand things don’t go back the same after that for many women and that sex can be painful for a long time afterwards? Imagine your penis was stitched back together after being torn apart…would it ever be the same?

Where I live at least…
Forcing someone into painful sex is RAPE
Forcing someone to have sex when they don’t want to is RAPE
Forcing someone to continue a sex act when they are no longer into it is RAPE

*Even if you are married to them*. Might be different in your country or State, who knows.

OP.…get the heck out. It’s abuse.
Your OH can go abuse some other poor woman.  (or just use his hand)


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## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

Cup of Tea said:


> We've been married for 12 years. For probably the last 9, our sex life has gone from wonderful, to ok, to meh, to ugg, full blown cringe. I cannot stand having sex at all, and believe its to a point where its having an impact on my mental health.
> 
> We almost divorced 2 years ago, but stuck it out and this is a huge issue that I cannot see getting any better. I was honestly looking forward to not having sex even be a part of my life anymore. I was ready to bury and forget it.
> 
> ...


I am curious...would you be willing to open your marriage to him having sex with other women, while you guys stay married?

I'm wondering, after everything you posted about him, HOW your "heart" could love the man you described??
You sound like a long-suffering martyr of a partner, and he's an abusive monster...WHAT do you even LIKE about him?

Other than opening your marriage, you should definitely divorce and set you both free to have the sex lives you each want. You don't need to worry that you are shallow for divorcing over awful sex -- you would be divorcing because you both want different things and you don't want to meet eachother's needs anymore.


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## ThatDarnGuy! (Jan 11, 2022)

Do the man a favor and let him go. I don't think you understand the importance of sex to a husband in a relationship. A sex starved marriage absolutely destroys a guy in a marriage. Everything you described with the begging, jokes, etc is his desperate attempt of saying I am hurting. Its not a mature way of communicating, but that is what it is. Lack of sex affects a husband mentally and physically. 

To a guy, sex is saying I love and care about you. I honestly think its very selfish of you to just want to completely bury the idea of ever having sex again with no concerns about him. What you are doing is injecting the marriage with a lethal dose of poison. Denying sex to your husband is about as hurtful as if he looked at you and said you are a useless and ugly person who I have no feelings for. 

I am not saying that you are a bad person. But it sounds like you have given up on the marriage.


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## Talker67 (Apr 7, 2016)

today's nuns have sex...just the lesbian kind. so....there is no sanctuary there.

uh...well if you hate sex, and it only brings back painful memories....i guess the first question is: do you hate sex with your husband, or with ALL MEN.

if it is all men, then there is no real sense to divorce him and marry someone else....you will be similarly pissed off after all that.

Can you arrange some way for your husband to get sex without bothering you? like will be happy with a hand job only from you? you owe him that, at least, as you say otherwise he is a good guy.

or do you know a friend who is single and horny, and would love to service your husband once a week or so?

Try to figure out a logical solution, and separate it from the traumatic memories of child birth.


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## ThatDarnGuy! (Jan 11, 2022)

Talker67 said:


> today's nuns have sex...just the lesbian kind. so....there is no sanctuary there.
> 
> uh...well if you hate sex, and it only brings back painful memories....i guess the first question is: do you hate sex with your husband, or with ALL MEN.
> 
> ...


That is one heck of a friend 😳. I can imagine that conversation lol. Hey Betty, my husband is lonely and I hate sex. Can you come over a couple times a week to have sex with my husband? I will cook you a to go meal 🤣


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## graciegracie (12 mo ago)

ThatDarnGuy! said:


> Do the man a favor and let him go. I don't think you understand the importance of sex to a husband in a relationship. A sex starved marriage absolutely destroys a guy in a marriage. Everything you described with the begging, jokes, etc is his desperate attempt of saying I am hurting. Its not a mature way of communicating, but that is what it is. Lack of sex affects a husband mentally and physically.
> 
> To a guy, sex is saying I love and care about you. I honestly think its very selfish of you to just want to completely bury the idea of ever having sex again with no concerns about him. What you are doing is injecting the marriage with a lethal dose of poison. Denying sex to your husband is about as hurtful as if he looked at you and said you are a useless and ugly person who I have no feelings for.
> 
> I am not saying that you are a bad person. But it sounds like you have given up on the marriage.


So a woman should just put up with painful and humiliating sex because “sex is important to a husband”….where is the respect and decency here?

Sex should be an expression of mutual pleasure between two consenting people. Not an ownership transaction…or what is essentially prostitution the way some of you men word it. ie “I provide the house and income, you do what I want in bed, even if it really hurts you or upsets you”.

In my marriage, I look after the kids *and* work - so bring many things to the relationship. Sex is never forced on me and if I’m in pain or ill, not expected of me. At all. Finnito. 

I hope some of the men here get bad ED (or penile cancer). Then you might get it.


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## ThatDarnGuy! (Jan 11, 2022)

graciegracie said:


> So a woman should just put up with painful and humiliating sex because “sex is important to a husband”….where is the respect and decency here?
> 
> Sex should be an expression of mutual pleasure between two consenting people. Not an ownership transaction…or what is essentially prostitution the way some of you men word it. ie “I provide the house and income, you do what I want in bed, even if it really hurts you or upsets you”.
> 
> ...


You come off as a very bitter and angry person.... No one said anything about owning anyone or treating anyone like a prostitute. 

You also seem to view your marriage as a business partner when you say "In my marriage, I look after the kids and work ". Do you use sex as a bargaining tool or withhold it as punishment?

I also would never wish cancer on ANYONE. I have seen the toll it takes on a person and their loved ones. You wishing cancer or medical issues on anyone is a very low and sad way of thinking.


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## Talker67 (Apr 7, 2016)

ThatDarnGuy! said:


> That is one heck of a friend 😳. I can imagine that conversation lol. Hey Betty, my husband is lonely and I hate sex. Can you come over a couple times a week to have sex with my husband? I will cook you a to go meal 🤣


pretty much, yeah.

if she is horny, does not have a BF for whatever reason, or has a sexless marriage and HER hubby gave her a hall pass too.

why the hell not?

Sex is important to some people. If one is HD and the other is LD or Asexual....why torment your mate by demanding they also lead a celebate life. You can continue the marriage that is "ideal" in your eyes (a non sexual one) while your partner gets enough sex to not go totally crazy.

it is almost a perfect arrangement.

Not for everyone. But most marriages do not have one partner who despises sex, so the marriage is already not a standard one


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## Young at Heart (Jan 6, 2015)

graciegracie said:


> Young at Heart - *You cannot be serious with some of these comments?*
> The woman has been torn from rectum to vagina and scarred - do you understand things don’t go back the same after that for many women and that sex can be painful for a long time afterwards? Imagine your penis was stitched back together after being torn apart…would it ever be the same?
> 
> Where I live at least…
> ...


*As to serious, yes I was.* 

She was in a horrible situation. Do I think she had every reason to divorce her husband? Yes. Did She have reasons to report it as rape to the police? Yes. 

However, she said, "......*My heart loves this man* ......"

*Did you read that part?* 

Did you read the part about her almost divorcing him 2 years ago, but decided not to?

Could she have PTSD? Possibly. Could she have battered wife syndrome? Possibly, she stated some of the symptoms.

Was she raped? Probably. If she was, should she have reported it to the police? Absolutely, Yes! But note, I said *if *she was raped. Was what happened horrible? I seriously think so, but I don't know (and don't want to know the details) enough to see if it was rape. Police and courts can sort that out. 

Do I know that things don't work as well after surgery? Yes and no. I have had a number of surgeries and from my experience (which was not with genitals, but with other nerve groups), it depends on the the skill of the surgeon, post surgery therapy, treatment and general health.

When did this all occur with the OP? 9 years ago from her story. Has it continued? We have no idea from what she posted. Has she emotionally struggled with the trauma of that since then? Yes. Do she and her husband have other but different on-going sexual problems? Yes, it appears so from what she has posted. Even if she can get over the trauma of the horrible post childbirth PIV ordeal, are her current sexual problems between her and her husband enough to warrant a divorce? Possibly, but that is up to her, and her husband. Luckily, he probably can't legally prevent it.

From her story she also almost divorced him 2 years ago, but decided not to. Is she allowed to make such choices for herself? Yes, if she is mentally competent and doesn't require a guardian. Do we know what her husband may have promised to save the marriage? Nope. All we have is her side of the story. Although, I must say her H didn't sound like much of a husband even from just her side of the story. He also need a lot of serious therapy and counseling.

Did I advise her to figure out what she wants for her future? Her child is probably about 9 years old. I suggested she figure out what she wants her life to look like in 10 and 20 years. That would make the child 19 and 29 and likely an independent adult. I suggested that she focus on healing herself mentally and emotionally. She could have PTSD or battered wife syndrome and should find out and if so get appropriate treatment.

Did I say she needs to have sex with her husband, against her will? Nope, it is her choice to have sex and her body and she clearly has indicated she doesn't really want to have sex with him. I seriously, hope she thinks about her future and gets help. I also think she needs to understand and develop the skills and courage to stop any physical sexual abuse or mental abuse from anyone who enters her life, especially if she wants any kind of future intimate relationship with anyone of her choosing that treats her properly.

Even with therapy and healing, do I think that there is a high percentage chance that the marriage will survive? No, but again, it is her choice on filing for divorce, but she really needs some counseling and/or therapy. And again, *I am serious.*


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## ThatDarnGuy! (Jan 11, 2022)

Talker67 said:


> pretty much, yeah.
> 
> if she is horny, does not have a BF for whatever reason, or has a sexless marriage and HER hubby gave her a hall pass too.
> 
> ...


That actually wouldn't help at all. It would make things worse.

When a guy loves a lady, he wants sex with her. Good sex is a way to bond and make the guy feel secure and loved. Her telling him to just have sex with another lady is a slap in the face. She might as well say that you are not worth any effort and I don't care about your feelings or needs.


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## Talker67 (Apr 7, 2016)

ThatDarnGuy! said:


> That actually wouldn't help at all. It would make things worse.
> 
> When a guy loves a lady, he wants sex with her. Good sex is a way to bond and make the guy feel secure and loved. Her telling him to just have sex with another lady is a slap in the face. She might as well say that you are not worth any effort and I don't care about your feelings or needs.


some might see it that way.
but some exasperated sexually deprived partners would consider such a hall pass to be a godsend.

you can blow it all up and divorce. sure.
but if you want to try to make it keep going, you are NOT going to do it until the HD spouse is getting laid again. This is not rocket science. he or she needs wild sex. at least once a week.


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## ThatDarnGuy! (Jan 11, 2022)

Young at Heart said:


> *As to serious, yes I was.*
> 
> She was in a horrible situation. Do I think she had every reason to divorce her husband? Yes. Did She have reasons to report it as rape to the police? Yes.
> 
> ...


She has stated that she doesn't care to ever be intimate again... That statement right there shows she has no desire to work on the marriage. Intimacy is a major factor to a successful marriage. 

I think he should go ahead and get out of the marriage and start his process of healing and realize that a vast majority of women are not like this.


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## ThatDarnGuy! (Jan 11, 2022)

Talker67 said:


> some might see it that way.
> but some exasperated sexually deprived partners would consider such a hall pass to be a godsend.
> 
> you can blow it all up and divorce. sure.
> but if you want to try to make it keep going, you are NOT going to do it until the HD spouse is getting laid again. This is not rocket science. he or she needs wild sex. at least once a week.


I understand what you are saying, and it sounds good on paper. But a husband wants to feel that intimate connection with their wife. 

If he were to have sex with another lady in the next bedroom. That will not do anything to help with the void he feels inside from a lack of intimacy from his wife


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## Young at Heart (Jan 6, 2015)

ThatDarnGuy! said:


> She has stated that she doesn't care to ever be intimate again... That statement right there shows she has no desire to work on the marriage. Intimacy is a major factor to a successful marriage.
> 
> I think he should go ahead and get out of the marriage and start his process of healing and realize that a vast majority of women are not like this.


The OP's husband has not asked for advice. 

The OP and her H seriously considered divorce 2 years ago, but decided against it. We don't know what they discussed or the reasons why they didn't go through with it.

My wife once told me she would never have sex with me again. I decided if that were the case I would divorce her. But first, I worked on healing myself and trying to heal my marriage. I also wanted to part on good terms for the sake of our adult children. Turns out the Sex Therapist who helped us, got my wife to understand that if she never had sex with me again, I would divorce her and it would be easy for me to find a new woman to love me and give me sex and loving relationship I needed. 

So, I agree with you, that if she is serious about never being intimate with him, that he should seek some therapy and counseling and then divorce her.


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## Young at Heart (Jan 6, 2015)

graciegracie said:


> So a woman should just put up with painful and humiliating sex because “sex is important to a husband”….where is the respect and decency here?
> 
> Sex should be an expression of mutual pleasure between two consenting people. Not an ownership transaction…or what is essentially prostitution the way some of you men word it. ie “I provide the house and income, you do what I want in bed, even if it really hurts you or upsets you”.....
> 
> .....I hope some of the men here get bad ED (or penile cancer). Then you might get it.


Women should not need to have sex with anyone just because it is important to a man. 

I agree that Sex should mostly be an expression of mutual pleasure between two consenting people. However, if there is an HD/LD mismatch of libido's, then they should talk about it and find some compromise that works for both of them. Something that they both can live with. 

As an aside the Sex Therapist who helped save my marriage, helped my wife understand that sometimes if my libido was more than hers, it would mean that she should figure out how to find joy in providing me with sexual pleasure. I love to bring my wife to orgasm, it makes me feel good. It was hard for me to accept her giving me sexual pleasure without my bringing her to orgasm, but because she is LD, she really doesn't want that as much as I do.

One of the things that helped us both understand this was the Sensate focus exercises. They were about learning to accept sensual pleasure from your partner by taking turns when you were the only party getting the pleasant touches. Then learning how to give sensual pleasure and focusing on the sensations of giving with no thoughts of anything in return. To make an HD/LD relationship work, the HD partner needs to understand that they need to accept the give of their partner's body some of the time and that it is a gift joyously given. 

That is not prostitution or using the LD partner, as long as what they are doing is something that they enjoy. 

As to ED or penile cancer. I once discovered a lump on a testicle and it really scared my wife and me. I would not wish cancer or the fear associated with cancer on anyone. 

Again the OP has gone through a lot. Her marriage and relationship with her H sounds like it is in serious trouble and has been for over 9 years.


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## Angie?or… (Nov 15, 2021)

Talker67 said:


> today's nuns have sex...just the lesbian kind. so....there is no sanctuary there.
> 
> uh...well if you hate sex, and it only brings back painful memories....i guess the first question is: do you hate sex with your husband, or with ALL MEN.
> 
> ...


I very much doubt if she has any friends who are horny enough to come and service her morbidly obese husband and bring him his ED meds. If he wants to get laid by anyone at all, he probably needs to do a LOT of work on himself.


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## TXTrini (Oct 2, 2013)

Angie?or… said:


> I very much doubt if she has any friends who are horny enough to come and service her morbidly obese husband and bring him his ED meds. If he wants to get laid by anyone at all, he probably needs to do a LOT of work on himself.


Uhm, I doubt anyone would want to service him for free.


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## graciegracie (12 mo ago)

ThatDarnGuy! said:


> You come off as a very bitter and angry person.... No one said anything about owning anyone or treating anyone like a prostitute.
> 
> You also seem to view your marriage as a business partner when you say "In my marriage, I look after the kids and work ". Do you use sex as a bargaining tool or withhold it as punishment?
> 
> I also would never wish cancer on ANYONE. I have seen the toll it takes on a person and their loved ones. You wishing cancer or medical issues on anyone is a very low and sad way of thinking.


Not bitter or angry, just disgusted to see how entitled some men are - thinking marriage gives them total rights to someone else’s body. 

The #1 reason many women shut up shop after marriage is because health issues (caused through pregnancy, birth control, breastfeeding and menopause) can cause extremely painful sex or low/no libido. The reason I mentioned penile cancer or ED was to put your genitals in the same pants/perspective as a woman with these common health issues. I don’t wish anyone to get life threatening illnesses…but jeez! The accusations that women pretend to like sex at the start to get the man and the house and then just stop sex for no reason are very out of touch. 

I never use sex as a bargaining tool. That’s not cool. I was highlighting that I’m not a “kept women” whose part of the marriage contract is just to cook, clean and be a sex slave. I contribute to bills, mortgage, raising kids and sharing a life with someone. It’s a partnership…or should be. 

But some of the posts indicate here that a man marries purely for sex on tap, and wouldn’t marry if sex was off the table at any time. Sex and love are actually different things. 

I was possibly angrier here than intended as I’d just read the disgusting condescending and anti women tripe from the single dad guy who spouts his book here.


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## Talker67 (Apr 7, 2016)

TXTrini said:


> Uhm, I doubt anyone would want to service him for free.


good point. the husband will have to put in some effort on his own if he wants the sex to continue. at least losing the weight and improving the hygiene!


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## graciegracie (12 mo ago)

ThatDarnGuy! said:


> She has stated that she doesn't care to ever be intimate again... That statement right there shows she has no desire to work on the marriage. Intimacy is a major factor to a successful marriage.
> 
> I think he should go ahead and get out of the marriage and start his process of healing and realize that a vast majority of women are not like this.


Any woman who has had severe birth trauma is well within her rights to never have sex again. I know of women who were never able to have vaginal sex again after a difficult birth. Or, who have prolapse, permanent incontinence or pain. Some things cannot be fixed with surgery.  It also greatly impacts on a woman‘s health (prolapse can stop physical activity) and self esteem.

Yes, I have been angry about this, but the voice of women is often lost as it‘s not spoken about. Even a “normal” birth has the ability to affect a woman’s sexual function in ways a man can never understand. My heart breaks for these women and I will always advocate for the women who suffer in silence.


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## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

graciegracie said:


> *Any woman who has had severe birth trauma is well within her rights to never have sex again. *I know of women who were never able to have vaginal sex again after a difficult birth. Or, who have prolapse, permanent incontinence or pain. Some things cannot be fixed with surgery.  It also greatly impacts on a woman‘s health (prolapse can stop physical activity) and self esteem.
> 
> Yes, I have been angry about this, but the voice of women is often lost as it‘s not spoken about. Even a “normal” birth has the ability to affect a woman’s sexual function in ways a man can never understand. My heart breaks for these women and I will always advocate for the women who suffer in silence.


ABSOLUTELY.

But then any husband who has a wife who never wants to have sex again, is well within HIS rights to not stay married to her.

Men are certainly not entitled to total right to someone else's body. But then neither are women entitled to total right over someone else's monogamy, agency, or marriage commitment.


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## Numb26 (Sep 11, 2019)

LisaDiane said:


> ABSOLUTELY.
> 
> But then any husband who has a wife who never wants to have sex again, is well within HIS rights to not stay married to her.
> 
> Men are certainly not entitled to total right to someone else's body. But then neither are women entitled to total right over someone else's monogamy, agency, or marriage commitment.


This. I never understood why sexless marriages are so hard to deal with. One person has made the decision to end sex as part of the relationship for any number of reasons and the other has to make a decision whether to stay or leave. I don't understand the complaining.


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## Angie?or… (Nov 15, 2021)

Sex is of course a part of marriage, and should be mutually enjoyable. But no one should force extremely painful sex on a partner. They should show some compassion and be a grownup while waiting and working together toward a solution.

And I can’t help noticing that male and female posters are treated very differently. If a guy came on here and said, “Having sex with my wife makes me sick because she weighs 300 lbs., won’t bathe and initiates by punching me in the balls, but I looove her,” NO ONE would tell him oh your poor, poor wife deserves sex. You have no right to deprive her. Why don’t you give one of your buddies the opportunity to come service her? No, everyone would say she is an abuser, get out!


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## ccpowerslave (Nov 21, 2020)

LisaDiane said:


> I am curious...would you be willing to open your marriage to him having sex with other women, while you guys stay married?


From her description I doubt this guy would have any takers that he wasn’t paying for. He sounds like a disgusting pig unfortunately.



graciegracie said:


> I hope some of the men here get bad ED (or penile cancer). Then you might get it.


Wow…


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## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

Angie?or… said:


> Sex is of course a part of marriage, and should be mutually enjoyable. But no one should force extremely painful sex on a partner. They should show some compassion and be a grownup while waiting and working together toward a solution.


I agree with you. However, the only solution for THIS OP is that she doesn't want sex at all. That's the ONLY work she wants to do is to not take responsibility for her feelings about her husband and leave, which is definitely what she should have done.

She says it's out of the love in her heart for him, but that felt odd to me, because she described one of the most repulsive men I could ever imagine...I wouldn't want to have sex with someone like that either, birth trauma or not. I think maybe she wants to keep the life she has with him, but she doesn't want to care about HIS needs, only her own.

How interesting that she hasn't been back to answer any questions we've asked her.

I would say, sex is part of monogamy. If someone expects me to be monogamous to them, they must meet my sexual needs. FULL STOP. I consider refusing sex to be a form of abuse. Maybe the women on here who have never been in a desert of sexual rejection won't understand that, but I have lived it, and it's brutal. Women who take their partner's desire for granted cannot know how it feels to be dying of thirst, while the person who promised you water holds it and says, "I don't feel like giving you any".

And guess what...there are TONS of other things couples can do to be sexually intimate that don't include PIV. She wants any and all sexual contact to stop. And that's just not fair or reasonable...if he's that repulsive to her, she needs to leave him to find someone who will love him the way he is (if he can)....which, FYI, is what men who come on here complaining about their wives bodies get told by many posters.



Angie?or… said:


> And I can’t help noticing that male and female posters are treated very differently. If a guy came on here and said, “Having sex with my wife makes me sick because she weighs 300 lbs., won’t bathe and initiates by punching me in the balls, but I looove her,” NO ONE would tell him oh your poor, poor wife deserves sex. You have no right to deprive her. Why don’t you give one of your buddies the opportunity to come service her? No, everyone would say she is an abuser, get out!


I'm not really sure where you are getting this, but I've heard it alot from other women on here. MANY posters in this thread told her straight out to leave him, he's gross, abusive, etc.

I have seen posts by men who complain about their wives the way you described, and most of the advice is talk to her, help her diet, exercise together, go to counseling, etc. And of course, the basic, bottom line advice is, if you have a partner who doesn't care about you or your marriage...LEAVE. There aren't any other options.

No one would tell the guy in your example to put out and shut up...just like NO ONE said that to this OP.


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## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

ccpowerslave said:


> From her description I doubt this guy would have any takers that he wasn’t paying for. He sounds like a disgusting pig unfortunately.


Well, that wasn't my point. I wanted to know if she would be ok if he focused his sexual desire on someone else.


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## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

graciegracie said:


> Not bitter or angry, just disgusted to see how entitled some men are - thinking marriage gives them total rights to someone else’s body.
> 
> The #1 reason many women shut up shop after marriage is because health issues (caused through pregnancy, birth control, breastfeeding and menopause) can cause extremely painful sex or low/no libido. *The reason I mentioned penile cancer or ED was to put your genitals in the same pants/perspective as a woman with these common health issues.* I don’t wish anyone to get life threatening illnesses…but jeez! The accusations that women pretend to like sex at the start to get the man and the house and then just stop sex for no reason are very out of touch.
> 
> ...


This isn't any excuse...nor is it even an accurate comparison to the health issues you mentioned for women.


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## Rus47 (Apr 1, 2021)

Reading OP's previous threads from two years ago, the painful sex wasn't even mentioned then. Just a bunch of other stuff like the husband not doing plumbing and other maintenance around the house. OP hasn't thought much of her husband for a long time, from her description he doesn't seem much of a prize. Maybe he was a real prize when they married, but evidently the shine wore off long ago. She planned to divorce two years ago, but instead of carrying through she allowed her husband to reel her back in. When she hit the freeway at 80 mph with her kids, she should have just kept going and never looked back. Would have avoided wasting another 2 years unhappy.

IMO you should proceed as planned two years ago. Dust off the plans you made. Go live what is left of your life as you wish. If don't ever want intimacy again, that is your right. You don't need to join a convent to live a happy life going forward. Your husband has been nothing but irritation to you for years. Evidently he has no appealing qualities. Both of you will be happier away from one another.


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## She'sStillGotIt (Jul 30, 2016)

*


Cup of Tea said:



A year later I got spayed, after he refused to get a vasectomy, even though he promised to. I thought maybe he'd have some pity on me after that awful delivery, but "he didn't want some doctor touching his junk."

Click to expand...

*You married a real selfish pig. Seriously. A real *pig*. In between him trying to have sex with you after your surgery right up to this selfish ass-hole behavior, the only word I can think of for him is "pig."

I deleted the rest of this post because I can see that no matter how much this guy* ****s all over you* OP, you've still managed to delude yourself into thinking he's worth staying with.

I'll just say good luck to you.


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## graciegracie (12 mo ago)

LisaDiane said:


> This isn't any excuse...nor is it even an accurate comparison to the health issues you mentioned for women.


Do you know anyone who has suffered immensely from birth trauma? If you’d seen what I’d seen, you’d understand. It keeps getting swept under the carpet when men sook about not getting enough sex.


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## ThatDarnGuy! (Jan 11, 2022)

graciegracie said:


> Do you know anyone who has suffered immensely from birth trauma? If you’d seen what I’d seen, you’d understand. It keeps getting swept under the carpet when men sook about not getting enough sex.


I think we all get it.... You seem to despise all men and can't seem to comprehend the idea of how any guy could possibly have any expectations of joy or happiness out of being in a marriage. How dare they have a sex drive unless you say its ok.


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## graciegracie (12 mo ago)

ThatDarnGuy! said:


> I think we all get it.... You seem to despise all men and can't seem to comprehend the idea of how any guy could possibly have any expectations of joy or happiness out of being in a marriage. How dare they have a sex drive unless you say its ok.


Geez, that’s inaccurate.
I happen to like men, am very sex positive and think that between two consenting adults, it’s a beautiful thing. Sex is not the only joy you should be having in a marriage. 

However, unless you own a vagina, you cannot know what it‘s like to have sex when it is forced upon you, you are unwell, or have a vaginal injury. You don’t seem to want to acknowledge it’s a possibility and is way more common than you think. Women often hide it because they are ashamed. I keep bringing it up so other women who are suffering get brave enough to speak out. 

For men, the worst things that happens during sex is not cumming, maybe a bit of chafe or not being able to get it up. The possibilities for women when it goes wrong are so much worse. Bad sex hurts, can be degrading, humilating and damaging. 

Good sex with a responsive, attentive partner (who cares about a woman’s needs) is what every woman deserves.


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## Young at Heart (Jan 6, 2015)

Rus47 said:


> *Reading OP's previous threads from two years ago, the painful sex wasn't even mentioned then. * Just a bunch of other stuff like the *husband not doing plumbing and other maintenance around the house*. OP hasn't thought much of her husband for a long time, from her description he doesn't seem much of a prize. Maybe he was a real prize when they married, but evidently the shine wore off long ago. She planned to divorce two years ago, but instead of carrying through she allowed her husband to reel her back in. When she hit the freeway at 80 mph with her kids, she should have just kept going and never looked back. Would have avoided wasting another 2 years unhappy.
> 
> IMO you should proceed as planned two years ago. Dust off the plans you made. Go live what is left of your life as you wish. If don't ever want intimacy again, that is your right. You don't need to join a convent to live a happy life going forward. *Your husband has been nothing but irritation to you for years*. Evidently he has no appealing qualities. Both of you will be happier away from one another.


Thank you so much for doing the research. The OP's post really sounded a bit one-sided. By that I mean if she contemplated divorce 2 years ago and he is the exact same person she described here, why would she not have gone through with the divorce.

Since your research showed her previous concerns did not involve the traumatic post birth trauma that was front and center in this post, it makes me wonder why such a thing would not be discussed then. I agree that she wants a divorce and if she has said she never wants intimacy with him, then she should go through with past plans on divorce. Is her waffling on divorce about her 9 year old child? Is she trying to emotionally work herself up to filing for divorce? Is she changing her story to get people to encourage her to divorce her husband? Does she need the support of others to divorce him? If so she should look to friends and family.

I don't think anyone has said don't divorce him. Some people have told her to figure out what she wants. Others have said the guy described is so horrible she should immediately divorce him. I don't think joining a convent is said seriously as she has a 9 year old child, she would need to abandon. 

I think that there is a lot that we don't know and that we have only heard one side of the story. Your research confirms that.


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

Cup of Tea said:


> I've communicated once about how I was unsatisfied.


Once?  Men think with their penis, so it's imperative you drive the concept home by expressing your disgust fully, several times. You need to be honest with him.


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## Talker67 (Apr 7, 2016)

LisaDiane said:


> ABSOLUTELY.
> 
> But then any husband who has a wife who never wants to have sex again, is well within HIS rights to not stay married to her.
> 
> Men are certainly not entitled to total right to someone else's body. But then neither are women entitled to total right over someone else's monogamy, agency, or marriage commitment.


i think there are a relatively small percent of women who can not have PIV sex from having an actual bonafide medical condition.

but it is obvious there are a MUCH LARGER percent of women who do not want sex, and just make up excuses. those women are just pure evil, and destroy the marriage, and their husband's ego. 

So excuse me if i look at such statements very skeptically.

I think the obvious tell... when a woman says she can not have *any *sex due to some medical reason, but also refuses to give BJs, hand jobs, anal sex, other kinky sex.

AND this in no way is meant to imply that there are not lazy guys out there too scamming a horny wife, saying "i can not give you sex because of blah blah blah" also!


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## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

graciegracie said:


> Do you know anyone who has suffered immensely from birth trauma? If you’d seen what I’d seen, you’d understand. It keeps getting swept under the carpet when men sook about not getting enough sex.


Yeah....my sister and ME (with my first).

Have you ever seen anyone suffer with CANCER...??

So I have seen what you've seen and I've lived it, I understand, and I still believe you have no excuse.


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## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

Young at Heart said:


> Thank you so much for doing the research. The OP's post really sounded a bit one-sided. By that I mean if she contemplated divorce 2 years ago and he is the exact same person she described here, why would she not have gone through with the divorce.
> 
> Since your research showed her previous concerns did not involve the traumatic post birth trauma that was front and center in this post, it makes me wonder why such a thing would not be discussed then. I agree that she wants a divorce and if she has said she never wants intimacy with him, then she should go through with past plans on divorce. Is her waffling on divorce about her 9 year old child? Is she trying to emotionally work herself up to filing for divorce? Is she changing her story to get people to encourage her to divorce her husband? Does she need the support of others to divorce him? If so she should look to friends and family.
> 
> ...


Every time I read stories on here, I think of how my EX could spin the story of his sexlessness and why I left him.


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## Rus47 (Apr 1, 2021)

There are lots of reasons why a spouse may no longer want to share sex with their partner. Physical changes, emotional changes, resentment, partner doesn't tickle their fancy anymore, gained weight, whatever. Simple solution is to be honest, state reasons, and take action to dissolve the sexual contract. No need to drag things out for months or years. Once at this point why be miserable and make the partner miserable? Just be honest and ethical.

Btw, a couple can be friends without being married (which is a sexual relationship).


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## MikaGold (11 mo ago)

Selfish son of a bih! It's ok for a man to very much want sex, but your husband was clearly selfish and doesn't have any empathy.
But you had to be more definite 'no'. As you allowed him to let him abuse you! Sorry for the rude question, Do you respect yourself???? You clearly didn't. 
I had a normal natural birth and it still hurt so much after a month he had to put his feelings aside. He did. But I know from my exes that some can be emotionally abusive or unaware at all of woman's feeling unless clearly explained of them. You are a woman having a hard time expressing herself so it's also a factor to take into. 

Sounds like spoiled.
Mister had zero regard for my sleep and would initiate at 3-4 in the morning, then get very upset when I wouldn't spring to life and become some goddess. 

He abused you! Like you said 'harassment'
#So I started sleeping on the couch to try and get some sleep. But he would just wake me up on purpose out there, too#

You were bitter becaude just not happy.

Your really need to stand up for yourself!!! You need to know your self worth. SAY YOU LOVE YOURSELF UNCONDITIONALLY 😔
Also, it's ok for him to react like this, don't be totally shutting it off. It's clearly a sensitive subject to him, and eat unexpected. So do not give up after this kind of reaction. When I touch a subject my husband is sensitive about, I back off and usually touch it another day, when he called down and I start by saying honey, i want to ask you why it felt sensitive to you. Etc everyone has a different character I can't be give you precise advice on approaching your husband. 
#I've communicated once about how I was unsatisfied. It was met with extreme defensiveness and anger#

Mari Kondo. Do it. It's not a joke. But do it her way, the proper way not Netflix or YouTube videos way. Please buy the 2 books (I bought on Google books) I promise you your life will improve. Why? You will be much more confident in your choices!!!! Which is what you clearly need besides being clear on what you want. (divorcing, coming back, thinking of divorce - I call it moon cycles as you come and go with your decisions.) 
It enhances and improves decision making skills the right way (and most beneficial).


And no its not just sex you'd divorce him for. It's overall quality of life, if you can go to a therapist, they can pinpoint all. But it's a torture of a life that you live. Life is to be enjoyed and I know that love is not what we should always base our decisions on. You say you love him, but that's not enough. I love my cat but had to leave him with my ex whom I loved when I was leaving. All for the quality of life and perusing the future that I deserve . I still acknowledged the love but love is not enough! Long story short my dreams came true and I'm married with a kid. And I love this man differently. Our love is much more deeper on soul level. This explains that all you have now is not all you can be. The life can and will be better but you need to make the leap my dear. You need to talk to someone who can support your decisions. Hence good you came here.


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## Cup of Tea (Apr 15, 2020)

happyhusband0005 said:


> I had to add the knowledge that guys like your husband exist is the reason why when I first joined TAM I thought women who cheated were justified. Don't think that anymore but yuck.


Cheating is never an answer. I have _0_ desire to start another relationship for any reason..


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## Cup of Tea (Apr 15, 2020)

TXTrini said:


> @ Cup of Tea
> I can't imagine how you can love such a callous, unfeeling man, are you sure it's not attachment because you're used to him? Personally, I'd have dumped him after he hurt you when you were barely recovered from surgery. That is not love!
> 
> The crappy sex is not the issue here, you're married to a selfish, entitled baby.


He didn't hurt me physically postpartum. His advances were verbal only, and after plainly explaining that I still have a lot of healing to do, he understood and didn't ask again until after my appt. It hurt emotionally more than anything.


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## Rus47 (Apr 1, 2021)

So Cup of Tea, do you plan now to proceed with your plans from two years ago? If not why not? Do you plan to be in the same place in 2024 as you are today as you were in 2020?

You know what is said about doing the same things expecting different results. Isn't this thread expressing your unhappiness caused by your failure to act previously?


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## Cup of Tea (Apr 15, 2020)

Openminded said:


> It’s unfortunate you didn’t get out then. This is who he is and he apparently doesn’t see any reason to change. It usually comes down to accept him or leave him. I hope this time you leave him.


There are times I regret not getting out when I really wanted to. But my stupid heart still skips a beat when he comes home sometimes. And I still get those annoying butterflies when he chops a few cords or wood or when he takes care of his mom. He also extraordinary kind to me when my 14 year old cat died. He hates cats! Those moments give me hope.

A divorce now would also have to include a long distance move as the housing market here is unreasonably inflated and there's no inventory to rent or buy. Our careers and families are here. Our daughter is on her last semester of her senior year and it would completely derail her, and I couldn't pull the youngest away from her family. Lots of deep roots here.


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## Cup of Tea (Apr 15, 2020)

Rus47 said:


> So Cup of Tea, do you plan now to proceed with your plans from two years ago? If not why not? Do you plan to be in the same place in 2024 as you are today as you were in 2020?
> 
> You know what is said about doing the same things expecting different results. Isn't this thread expressing your unhappiness caused by your failure to act previously?


I don't know how to proceed from here. Other things got better, but this issue has never has. I'm not going to derail my daughters last year of high school, tear my family apart, or give up my career.


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## Cup of Tea (Apr 15, 2020)

ThatDarnGuy! said:


> Do the man a favor and let him go. I don't think you understand the importance of sex to a husband in a relationship. A sex starved marriage absolutely destroys a guy in a marriage. Everything you described with the begging, jokes, etc is his desperate attempt of saying I am hurting. Its not a mature way of communicating, but that is what it is. Lack of sex affects a husband mentally and physically.
> 
> To a guy, sex is saying I love and care about you. I honestly think its very selfish of you to just want to completely bury the idea of ever having sex again with no concerns about him. What you are doing is injecting the marriage with a lethal dose of poison. Denying sex to your husband is about as hurtful as if he looked at you and said you are a useless and ugly person who I have no feelings for.
> 
> I am not saying that you are a bad person. But it sounds like you have given up on the marriage.


I cared and tried to make our sex life work for years and years with very little reward back to me. I'm all worn out from trying.
I can't fill his cup when mine is empty.


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## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

Cup of Tea said:


> There are times I regret not getting out when I really wanted to. But my stupid heart still skips a beat when he comes home sometimes. And I still get those annoying butterflies when he chops a few cords or wood or when he takes care of his mom. He also extraordinary kind to me when my 14 year old cat died. He hates cats! Those moments give me hope.
> 
> A divorce now would also have to include a long distance move as the housing market here is unreasonably inflated and there's no inventory to rent or buy. Our careers and families are here. Our daughter is on her last semester of her senior year and it would completely derail her, and I couldn't pull the youngest away from her family. Lots of deep roots here.


This is a strange way to feel about the repulsive, selfish, rapist, abusive bully you described in your first post.


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

LisaDiane said:


> This is a strange way to feel about the repulsive, selfish, rapist, abusive bully you described in your first post.


Well, nothing is black and white, is it? 😊


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## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

In Absentia said:


> Well, nothing is black and white, is it? 😊


True, but it's just strange to have someone paint something very black and then come back and say it's white.


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## badsanta (Oct 13, 2014)

Cup of Tea said:


> We've been married for 12 years. For probably the last 9, our sex life has gone from wonderful, to ok, to meh, to ugg, full blown cringe. I cannot stand having sex at all, and believe its to a point where its having an impact on my mental health.


So how do things work when you have sex alone and self pleasure? No need to go into any detail as you can say things work just fine in that department or just indicate that you have no desire for that.

In the event that you do not self pleasure, then do you think it might be difficult for your husband to please you if you can't do it yourself? If you try to show him what it is that you want, you should simply be able to demonstrate and I am sure he would enjoy watching as opposed to getting upset. 

Regards, 
Badsanta


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## MikaGold (11 mo ago)

Talker67 said:


> separate it from the traumatic memories of child birth.


You sound insensitive and have you been through traumatic birth? She can't just find a logic solution, it's not so simple, it needs proper healing and therapy. . That's how traumatised she is. Your spouse that needs to be there 100%supportive and understanding, pressures her and she gives in. Yes he was soooo much wrong. Still is, and yes she should stand her ground. But. Nie it's done and dealing with it is very hard. it's like falling off the bridge after someone already crashed into you.


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## MikaGold (11 mo ago)

thunderchad said:


> If you still love him and want to be with him perhaps you could let him have sex with other women.


Do you really simplify it this much? Not very thoughtful. 
It's a complex situation with complex feelings. And do you know when 'letting significant other sleep with others' is MAYBE a good idea? Only if they are on healthy and stable grounds.


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## MikaGold (11 mo ago)

I'LL ANSWRR WITH CAPS LOCK TO THIS. 


ThatDarnGuy! said:


> Do the man a favor and let him go. I don't think you understand the importance of sex to a husband in a relationship. A sex starved marriage absolutely destroys a guy in a marriage. THAT'S NOT TRUE. REMEMEBER NOT EVERY MAN IS THE SAME AS YOU. EVERY MAN IS AFFECTED DIFFERENTLY.
> Everything you described with the begging, jokes, etc is his desperate attempt of saying I am hurting. Its not a mature way of communicating, but that is what it IS. NO, IT DOESN'T ALWAYS MEAN SOMEONE IS HURTING. MAYBE A PERSON IS SIMPLY INSENSITIVE ETC Lack of sex affects a husband mentally and PHYSICALLY. YES IT AFFECTS EVERYONE POSITIVELY OR NEGATIVELY
> 
> To a guy, sex is saying I love and care about you. IT'S ALSO FOR A WOMAN... BUT THE SEX NEEDS TO SHOW IT TOO. THE QUALITY OF SEX IS VERY IMPORTANT. I honestly think its very selfish of you to just want to completely bury the idea of ever having sex again with no concerns about HIM. SHE IS CONCERNED VERY MUCH FOR HER WELLBEING. SHE'S TRAUMATISED AND BEVER GOT PROPER CARE FROM HIM. HE IS THE ONE THAT SEEMS SELFISH. What you are doing is injecting the marriage with a lethal dose of POISON. NO, SHE IS NOT. THEY ARE BOTH TOXICATING IT BUT IN DIFFERENT WAY. HER FAULT LIES ONLY IN NOT FINDING HER VOICE AND ACTING AS IF NOTHING IS AS HORRIBLE AS IT IS TO HER. BUT IT'S VALID. IT'S NOT A POISON. Denying sex to your husband is about as hurtful as if he looked at you and said you are a useless and ugly person who I have no feelings FOR. HMM MAYBE TO SOME.
> ...


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## ThatDarnGuy! (Jan 11, 2022)

MikaGold said:


> I'LL ANSWRR WITH CAPS LOCK TO THIS.


You are entitled to answer however you like. But a sex starved marriage affects a guy at every level from physical to mental. 

The effect on a guy is comparative to what a wife feels when her guy never compliments her, says thank you, no affection including hugs or kisses, does not say I love you, refuses to talk, no compliments on dressing up, etc.


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## Cup of Tea (Apr 15, 2020)

badsanta said:


> So how do things work when you have sex alone and self pleasure? No need to go into any detail as you can say things work just fine in that department or just indicate that you have no desire for that.
> 
> In the event that you do not self pleasure, then do you think it might be difficult for your husband to please you if you can't do it yourself? If you try to show him what it is that you want, you should simply be able to demonstrate and I am sure he would enjoy watching as opposed to getting upset.
> 
> ...


I used to be able to self pleasure no problem, but its gotten difficult over the years as the memories of what (even mediocre) sex feels like fades away. And fingers just aren't the same as, well, you know....


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## Talker67 (Apr 7, 2016)

MikaGold said:


> You sound insensitive and have you been through traumatic birth? She can't just find a logic solution, it's not so simple, it needs proper healing and therapy. . That's how traumatised she is. Your spouse that needs to be there 100%supportive and understanding, pressures her and she gives in. Yes he was soooo much wrong. Still is, and yes she should stand her ground. But. Nie it's done and dealing with it is very hard. it's like falling off the bridge after someone already crashed into you.


i am not insensitive.
i just have a low tolerance for whining.
a year later, it is 100% whining to tell hubby the shop is closed because you had a bad day a year ago

this is SERIOUS STUFF. A husband usually will walk away from a sexless marriage!

If the man told the woman "i can not give you sex because the boss chewed me out in front of the other guys, and i feel inadequate now", you would be screaming at him to grow a pair of balls.

same with women, grow a pair...of whatever you need to snap the hell out of it.


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## Cup of Tea (Apr 15, 2020)

ThatDarnGuy! said:


> You are entitled to answer however you like. But a sex starved marriage affects a guy at every level from physical to mental.
> 
> The effect on a guy is comparative to what a wife feels when her guy never compliments her, says thank you, no affection including hugs or kisses, does not say I love you, refuses to talk, no compliments on dressing up, etc.


Again


Talker67 said:


> i am not insensitive.
> i just have a low tolerance for whining.
> a year later, it is 100% whining to tell hubby the shop is closed because you had a bad day a year ago
> 
> ...


Are you even married?


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## badsanta (Oct 13, 2014)

Cup of Tea said:


> I used to be able to self pleasure no problem, but its gotten difficult over the years as the memories of what (even mediocre) sex feels like fades away. And fingers just aren't the same as, well, you know....


There is a book I read written by women for women regarding sexuality when you don't have much to feel sexy about in day to day life (as a man I was curious about this perspective). The book advocated for women to consume erotic media (books and videos) and self explore as a way to cultivate feeling sexual and to confidently get to know themselves sexually. 

There is A LOT more to sexuality than a penis in a vagina resulting in orgasm. Perhaps you have a husband that makes these things down right impossible to explore (and you should feel entitled to complain about that), but just like your husband sends you to buy his ED medication, you should be buying things for yourself as well (perhaps send him to go get them). 

I once corresponded with a woman here and was surprised she struggled to shop for sexual novelties that resulted in something she could enjoy. Most of it was crap. But through trial and error she discovered a few toys that were extremely effective, if not way more effective than her husband. My point being is if you have tried to self pleasure, you have to put some effort into it and if you try novelties you'll likely have to try more than a dozen before finding something worth while. 

If your husband can't please you and has a solid history of not knowing what to do along with weight gain that makes things worse, you are going to have to take more responsibility for your own pleasure. 

If you have an adult novelty store near you, odds are there is a very helpful woman at the counter that can give you some advice on simple things you might enjoy. Sexual novelties have advanced a lot in the past decade. While most are nonreturnable for obvious reasons, most can be tested by touching them with your hand to see if you are interested in how something might feel once you power it on (as in seeing how powerful it is). With lithium batteries today there are novelties now powerful enough to make you orgasm while comfortably sitting in your car, tossing the vibrator out on the driveway and then slowly running over it repeatedly with your car (although that may break it, YMMV)! 

But seriously invest some time and money in yourself and don't feel ashamed to walk into a novelty store and ask for help. Perhaps send your husband to pick up your new vibrator. When he asks you about it, tell him that it is for you to enjoy by yourself and that he can buy one for himself too if he wants one and that you might be willing to help him shove it where the sun doesn't shine! 

Cheers, 
Badsanta


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## Talker67 (Apr 7, 2016)

sorry, i think i am starting to threadjack


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## Angie?or… (Nov 15, 2021)

ThatDarnGuy! said:


> You are entitled to answer however you like. But a sex starved marriage affects a guy at every level from physical to mental.
> 
> The effect on a guy is comparative to what a wife feels when her guy never compliments her, says thank you, no affection including hugs or kisses, does not say I love you, refuses to talk, no compliments on dressing up, etc.


Actually it’s probably comparable to what a wife feels when her husband doesn’t care if she is in terrible pain, breaks promises and intentionally deprives her of sleep. He abused and betrayed her and the marriage FIRST, thereby destroying her ability to feel safe and sexual with him.

She really ought to move on, but for her own sake, not for his. However, she has indicated she doesn’t want to do so, therefore if he doesn’t want a sexless marriage, he has 2 options. Leave himself, or start working hard to heal the damage HE caused and make himself into a man who isn’t repulsive.


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## Angie?or… (Nov 15, 2021)

Talker67 said:


> i am not insensitive.
> i just have a low tolerance for whining.
> a year later, it is 100% whining to tell hubby the shop is closed because you had a bad day a year ago
> 
> ...


The abuse and betrayal he has put her through is also SERIOUS STUFF deserving of divorce. And if he refuses to fix what HE broke, he has the option of moving on.


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## ThatDarnGuy! (Jan 11, 2022)

Angie?or… said:


> Actually it’s probably comparable to what a wife feels when her husband doesn’t care if she is in terrible pain, breaks promises and intentionally deprives her of sleep. He abused and betrayed her and the marriage FIRST, thereby destroying her ability to feel safe and sexual with him.
> 
> She really ought to move on, but for her own sake, not for his. However, she has indicated she doesn’t want to do so, therefore if he doesn’t want a sexless marriage, he has 2 options. Leave himself, or start working hard to heal the damage HE caused and make himself into a man who isn’t repulsive.


We have only heard one side of the story..... This poster is all over the place. She had a complicated birth but still had sex over the years that she admitted brought some pleasure. But she couldn't care less about trying anymore. 

Before judging this guy as a worthless sack of 💩. It would be interesting to hear his side of things.... Based on the tone of her message, she doesn't seem like the most joyous person to be around.


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## badsanta (Oct 13, 2014)

Talker67 said:


> ^a woman, to read such a book and fathom even the fist concept, would need to WANT to have sex.
> A woman who goes eeeewww when you mention giving your hubby a bj, as if she never did it....lost cause


We are NOT talking about a getting a woman to desire sex with her husband, but more so to enjoy taking responsibility for her own pleasure and to do so selfishly WITHOUT needing her husband. 

The purpose of that would help the OP let go of some resentment towards her husband for not being able to pleasure her as she may be able to take care of that without him. 

As for getting her to both let go of resentment AND desire her husband, well without him doing some work and trying to be a more compassionate person in the bedroom, that is going to be a lost cause. If she can demonstrate that she is easy to please to her husband in the bedroom and show him how to do it (without needing his penis), perhaps that is what is needed to start a path to rekindle things. 

Realistically though he sounds like a selfish partner that is unwilling to learn. He likely wants sex only and exactly WHEN he wants sex and for her to somehow be enthusiastic about it in that exact moment without any effort needed on his behalf. I imagine he wants her to already be wearing lingerie, do a sexy dance, and jump on top to do all the work while he just lays there all starfish. Perhaps she might enjoy that a little but he doesn't last long enough for her to preheat her oven and get anything to cooking. If that is really what he expects, I would advise the wife to get some lingerie, do a dance, and try to extend foreplay by giving him a handjob with a good bit of something in it to numb him up and humiliate him into being unable to enjoy anything, even if he later takes matters into his own hands.





__





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Is an example of something that is safe and effective for the wife to use in this manner on her husband to make things more interesting. If he gets worried about unexpectedly feeling numb, she can blame his weight and tell him to take better care of himself or else his penis will probably just stop working. She might even secretly enjoy that. 

Regards, 
Badsanta


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## Talker67 (Apr 7, 2016)

sex is so important to a marriage. i do not think you can hold together a marriage without good sex. so i agree @badsanta, good sex is needed here.
How to do it...there is no set way. 
But it is not unheard of for the person not getting good sex from just TELLING the lazy partner how to shape up and do it right.
Maybe they watch porn together and she says "See...like THAT!"


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## MikaGold (11 mo ago)

ThatDarnGuy! said:


> You are entitled to answer however you like. But a sex starved marriage affects a guy at every level from physical to mental.
> 
> The effect on a guy is comparative to what a wife feels when her guy never compliments her, says thank you, no affection including hugs or kisses, does not say I love you, refuses to talk, no compliments on dressing up, etc.



I see your point. Doesn't mean I agree completely. I think you didn't grasp her state and what exactly she's been through.
I understand some men can be affected like this but for this couple, I think they are not compatible anymore. I think for so many years she was sacrificing herself (it sure is sacrifice if you hate doing something but you do it anyway for the other person) and that's how the disgust to sex only enhanced and she became more bitter with time. Resentment. 

It's much deeper issues than just sex itself in their marriage. Sometimes change of attitude could work but not for her, she's past it. 
She'd have to work on her subconscious mind to respect and love herself and then maybe anything can be better.

It's taking space to know what one really wants. And maybe you will like how you feel without him. Or you will have the space to clarify your feelings and get big clarity. 
Emotions are like compass, they are to guide you, they are valid.


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

MikaGold said:


> I think you didn't grasp her state and what exactly she's been through.


Exactly. The trust was broken and nothing can be done about that. You can't forget. Of course, the OP feels conflicted because he is still her husband and has good qualities. I don't really see how this can be fixed, though.


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