# An assessment you might not agree with



## okeydokie (Sep 10, 2008)

I have been reading threads on this forum for awhile now and i have come to a conclusion that alot of you are gonna beat me up over, but i feel compelled to share:

Women want their men to be like women, like their best "girlfriend", they want men to connect with them on the same emotional plane and respond to them like their best girlfriend would. They want men to be complicated and analytical about their relationships, to sit and talk everything out no matter how important or petty. 

Men want sex


carry on..............


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## preso (May 1, 2009)

okeydokie said:


> Women want their men to be like women, like their best "girlfriend", they want men to connect with them on the same emotional plane and respond to them like their best girlfriend would. They want men to be complicated and analytical about their relationships, to sit and talk everything out no matter how important or petty.
> 
> Men want sex
> 
> ...



Your generalizing and that is not fact. Some do and some don't.
Also to point out ... there are degrees.
Some people are also more mature in what they expect.

Unrealistic expecations is the number one reason for divorce but those things you mentioned are only true for some.


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## scarletblue (May 20, 2009)

My husband is very complicated and analytical. He is not a terribly emotional person, however. That is OK with me. I don't expect him to be all emotional with me. He understands that I'm very emotional. Heck, I cried at the end of the Meet The Robinson's cartoon movie.

By the way.....I want sex more than he does.


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## Loving Husband (Aug 3, 2009)

My wife is big on the emotional part but doesn't offer it in return cause she is afraid to expose herself. It's a problem of why we continue this circle. I don't know if my wife has ever initiated sex.. Then again I want it all the time and probably don't give her the opportunity.. I am almost 40 and have the drive of a guy in the 20's..  My wife has the drive of a 50 year old.. Kind of funny.


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## MarkTwain (Aug 1, 2008)

okeydokie said:


> Women want their men to be like women, like their best "girlfriend", they want men to connect with them on the same emotional plane and respond to them like their best girlfriend would. They want men to be complicated and analytical about their relationships, to sit and talk everything out no matter how important or petty.


No! That's the signal a lot of women give out, but it's fake!

What they actually want most of the time is a tough guy who won't buckle. It's a test:

If they say "jump" and your response is simply to ask "how high?", you just failed the test.

If they signal that you should walk on egg shells and you go right ahead and do it, you just failed the test. And above all... If they treat you with disrespect and never show any love or desire for you or your body and you stay with them instead of packing your bags - you failed the test.

It's all mind games. The fact is, that if you behave like a women, they will not fancy you at all. Do you think your wife would fancy her best girlfriend? 

Be a man.


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## FoundLove (Aug 23, 2009)

My husband is not a deep thinker like I am but he is more affectionate and lovey dovey than me.

I do not desire my husband to be like one of my girlfriend's. I am a tomboy so I get along better with men anyway. 

If I want to have a girly chat, I will call my sister or friend.


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## okeydokie (Sep 10, 2008)

mommy22 said:


> Correct me if I'm wrong men, but it seems to me that most men want communication in the relationship along with the sex. They don't want to analyze everything to death, but they do desire for their wife to not only be a sexual partner but a best friend as well.



oh i do indeed, but i cant be one without the other.


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## okeydokie (Sep 10, 2008)

MarkTwain said:


> No! That's the signal a lot of women give out, but it's fake!
> 
> What they actually want most of the time is a tough guy who won't buckle. It's a test:
> 
> ...


so most of them are lying on here?

i am the tough guy you speak of, not an ***hole per se (i know sandy will disagree). it isnt working out that well for me. i know my wife isnt "all women". the mind games are what makes it so complicated mark, i have no desire to expend effort on that crap. and the fact that they want you to play along makes my original point.


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## MarkTwain (Aug 1, 2008)

okeydokie said:


> so most of them are lying on here?
> 
> i am the tough guy you speak of, not an ***hole per se (i know sandy will disagree). it isnt working out that well for me. i know my wife isnt "all women". the mind games are what makes it so complicated mark, i have no desire to expend effort on that crap. and the fact that they want you to play along makes my original point.


If you actually read what the "women on here" are asking for, it is not very much. They say things like "if only he would romance me a little - I would want more sex" or "A quick grope is not foreplay".

Women don't want a girlfriend experience from a husband they want a g'dam lover.

However, what I am talking about is very subtle, and I'm not sure if you quite grasped it: Women don't so much lie, as "run interference". It's as if they say to themselves "why talk straight in a language he can understand when I can talk in code?". 

A woman I know nagged her husband all the time. One day she told me that when she got on his case the other time asking him to do this that and the other round the house and with the kids, what she was really hinting at to him was "GET A JOB". But she did not say it straight out. Instead she mad being at home 24/7 hell for him in the hope that he would "get it" and run screaming from the house.

So what I am saying is that your marriage is sub optimal because you have completely failed to understand your wife. Now I'm not saying that she has no part in all of that, but she is not the one writing threads on here. You don't need her help to fix this. If you simply understood her, you would know what to do next. And that might include walking right out the door. Nothing should be ruled in or out. To do so would be to shirk your duty to yourself to live life right on the edge.


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## okeydokie (Sep 10, 2008)

MarkTwain said:


> If you actually read what the "women on here" are asking for, it is not very much. They say things like "if only he would romance me a little - I would want more sex" or "A quick grope is not foreplay".
> 
> Women don't want a girlfriend experience from a husband they want a g'dam lover.
> 
> ...


welcome back by the way


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## MarkTwain (Aug 1, 2008)

One question I have to ask you is: You have been on here many months, and read all the threads as well as started a few of your own. Has it helped? Is your marriage better, worse or the same?


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## preso (May 1, 2009)

My husband is in no way girlfriend-like.

I'd be horrified to have a man who was like a woman... yuck !
If I wanted a MAN LIKE THAT .... might as well turn gay.


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## sisters359 (Apr 9, 2009)

> No! That's the signal a lot of women give out, but it's fake!
> 
> What they actually want most of the time is a tough guy who won't buckle. It's a test:
> 
> ...


Ah, be careful here. Generalizations can be very dangerous! 

What *I* want is another adult who can be vulnerable yet also knows how to take care of himself--someone who wants me and trusts me enough to share things with, but who is not needy. Someone who can be alone but chooses to be with me. That's what I offer in return. 

What I don't want is extremes: too needy and dependent, or too controlling and/or uncompromising. Both extremes suggest poor self-esteem. 

What I NEED is attraction/chemistry. If I don't desire you, then all the rest is moot and we should just be friends. This is not to say that chemistry alone makes a good relationship; far from it. But starting (a commitment) with out it is dooming a relationship to failure.

Also: most women do not intentionally play mind games. They do not "choose" to talk in "code." Sometimes, I am trying to say something difficult in a way that may be less painful. Sometimes, even I don't have a clear grasp on what I want (although I may not even know that). Just like men, women have myriad ways of communicating b/c we are individuals. Few people are intentionally cruel or misleading. Just because I'm an adult does not mean I have everything figured out all the time. I'm human. I make mistakes, with others and even with my own feelings. I'm an adult, so I accept responsibility for those mistakes. 

Oh, and before you say, "well don't try to say it in a way that is less painful, just spit it out," remember, (a) "simple and direct" is supposedly a male virtue, and would you want women to be just like men? and (b) not all men are simple and direct or so clear on what they want that they always say it perfectly. Men are famous (infamous) for their "disappearing acts" when they lose interest in a woman for example, but how many have the guts to just say, this isn't working, I'm moving on? Very, very few--and leaving someone to wonder if/when the next call is coming is pretty mean, but I don't think guys want to be mean; I think they want to avoid a confrontation or do not want to witness any pain they might cause.


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## Blanca (Jul 25, 2008)

okeydokie said:


> I have been reading threads on this forum for awhile now and i have come to a conclusion that alot of you are gonna beat me up over, but i feel compelled to share:
> 
> Women want their men to be like women, like their best "girlfriend", they want men to connect with them on the same emotional plane and respond to them like their best girlfriend would. They want men to be complicated and analytical about their relationships, to sit and talk everything out no matter how important or petty.
> 
> ...


this is what i used to think, too. not so much anymore.


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## lastinline (Jul 21, 2009)

I have found this forum to be very cathartic, and I have to say it has allowed me an opportunity to basically "think out loud" and bounce thoughts off others in similar situations. All in all it has definitely helped my marriage, and I believe that you are dead on right when you say that: women don't want a "girl friend" for a husband. I know I exasperate the hell out of my wife, but I honestly know as well she appreciates having a "manly man" for a husband, even if she doesn't always understand me. By the way, good post sisters359, perhaps men and women aren't that different afterall. I agreed with everything you wrote.


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## karajh (Jul 25, 2009)

MarkTwain said:


> No! That's the signal a lot of women give out, but it's fake!
> 
> What they actually want most of the time is a tough guy who won't buckle. It's a test:
> 
> ...


I agree with this assessment whole heatedly! I do want to be able to talk with my husband, but I have girlfriends to chat with and I am not really all that emotional most of the time anyway! My husband and I both enjoy sex though, so that is a positive I guess and I am 40 with the drive of a 20 year old myself and that saying a lot considering how I was in my 20's.. LOL>> :iagree:


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## GAsoccerman (Mar 24, 2008)

growing up with 5 sisters I pretty muched walked through male "hell" lol 

Anyway, I can say I unerstand women somewhat, particularly my wife, I know her better then she knows herself.

I have learned to push her to do things she would have not done otherwise and instead of upsetting her she has embraced it.

I have certainly learned things from my wife and she has pushed me to be more "manly" then I thought I was or could be. 

I think the biggest thing I have learned is communication, instead of just thinking it, I say it, and let the dust settle where it may, I can be a big jerk, but I am always telling you how I feel, my wife knows this and understands it. She hides things and lies, I know this, but usually it is childish stuff, like that is not her glass of milk on the table, yet I know it's hers, she is 38 not 5...but I let her win the battle, but I win the battle battles that mean something to me.


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## Mommybean (Jan 22, 2009)

All *I* want from my H is open and honest communication. On BOTH sides. Any problem we have had in our relationship boils down to communication, even including the issues he carries from his past that he is just now coming to terms with...he was afraid of them, never talked to me about them...his running from them RULED his life, and conversely OUR life as a couple and as a family. 

I appreciate my H for standing up to me when it needs to happen. I do NOT want total control in our relationship, been there, done that and it bored me to no end. Our sex life is awesome, because we bring no resentment into it...we say what needs to be said now, when it needs to be said, both GOOD and BAD.So, i'm not looking for a girlfriend in my H, all I want is a committed, invested, PARTNER...and I have that.


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## MsLonely (Sep 23, 2010)

okeydokie said:


> I have been reading threads on this forum for awhile now and i have come to a conclusion that alot of you are gonna beat me up over, but i feel compelled to share:
> 
> Women want their men to be like women, like their best "girlfriend", they want men to connect with them on the same emotional plane and respond to them like their best girlfriend would. They want men to be complicated and analytical about their relationships, to sit and talk everything out no matter how important or petty.
> 
> ...


LOL

No, it's true!

Men and women are different creatures. They view things differently. Men like to grasp main ideas when women would pay attention to details.


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## COGypsy (Aug 12, 2010)

okeydokie said:


> so most of them are lying on here?
> 
> i am the tough guy you speak of, not an ***hole per se (i know sandy will disagree). it isnt working out that well for me. i know my wife isnt "all women". the mind games are what makes it so complicated mark, i have no desire to expend effort on that crap. and the fact that they want you to play along makes my original point.


I don't think most people are lying on here, I just think the perception might be skewed. This is a place where by its nature, people come when things are at their worst--so we talk about the _total lack_ of communication and the _total lack_ of sex or whatever other extreme might be the issue. That could totally paint a picture where some could assume that (typically) women want nothing but to sit and emote and touch feelings with their partner and that men are total horn dogs constantly humping at their wives legs, or any number of other generalizations, really-- 

This board is such a small sample of humanity and relationships though, in the greater scheme of things that it couldn't possibly describe everyone, or every facet of their relationships. Especially the vast, vast majority of people who get along just fine from day to day in their marriages, which I'm guessing is a number far greater than the number of people on this board, wouldn't you say?

That being said, I think that the adage that women have to feel loved to have sex and men have to have sex to feel loved is largely true and a big disconnect for couples at times. Similarly, I'd go so far as to say that overall, women place a greater value on and have a greater need for verbal communication, but that doesn't necessarily mean that they want a jammie-wearing girlfriend out of their husband, or that they are particularly effective communicators themselves. Likewise, I'd say that overall, men place a greater value on a more physical connection, but that doesn't necessarily mean sex is the only way they feel "connected" nor does it always make them a great lover  

For the record though, we're about the opposite at my house 

So I'd say that I think your assumption is too extreme and simplistic with what men and women want from each other, even if it may be based on broad characteristics that many men and women seem to have.


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## MarriedWifeInLove (May 28, 2010)

I agree with everyone on some level.

I do think some women except their men to be women - express their feelings, talk about things that are wrong, nuture more, etc.

Well, men are wired differently from women. I have found that most men act from their "head (the big one)" if you will, while most women act from what their "heart" is saying. 

Just like the saying that making love to a woman starts with their most important sex organ - their brain; making love to a man starts with their most important sex organ - the little head.

Not to say that there aren't men and women who "don't" fall into this category - but I'm with okiedokey on this one - the "majority" do fall into these categories.

If us women could work it out and deal with the fact that our men are not one of our "girlfriends," and if our men could work it out that we are not "one of the guys," and everyone could give a little and compromise, then TOM wouldn't have so many negative postings about relationships and marriage.

I have read Men are From Mars and Women are From Venus and it is so on target with the differences between men and women and how they think, why they act like they do, etc. I was astonished to learn that "most (not all mind you)" men don't have SEX as the #1 in their top 5 - it's on the list, but not at #1. When we, as women can figure out what they (men) are all about, we have much more satisfying relationships. 

I have been doing a lot of reading, researching, etc., and know what my husband is about better than ever in our 25+ year marriage. I just wish I had done it sooner and save a lot of disagreements and resentments in our past.


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## ButterflyKisses (Aug 30, 2010)

I think ideally the perfect guy would be someone who is a leader, reliable, logical, strong-willed, etc, but also displays compassion, kindness, empathy, etc. 
So, a balance of all those to me would not be considered needy or clingy but also not emotionally distant either.

Sensitive AND manly, is that a feasible combination?


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

My husband is my Best friend and I his, and he can easily talk to me like one of the guys, so I guess we are really screwed up, outside the norm, but we already know that.


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## Bluemoon7 (Jan 27, 2010)

I agree with a lot of you, more or less.

The discussions on TAM do kinda give the impression that men want sex and women want a friend. However, that's a simplification, and only a piece of what's really happening in the marriages.

What I want in a husband is an equal partner. I'm a strong woman, but I'd like my husband to be able to tell me when I'm wrong, when he doesn't agree, whatever. He doesn't. He's VERY passive aggressive. He accomplishes what he wants by mopping, sighing, acting upset and me prying out of him what's bothering him. It's very unattractive.


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## less_disgruntled (Oct 16, 2010)

MarkTwain said:


> No! That's the signal a lot of women give out, but it's fake!
> 
> What they actually want most of the time is a tough guy who won't buckle. It's a test:
> 
> ...



You're right but you're wrong. Every woman I've known who wanted "a real man" would just do what I said when I was around then go behind my back. Last time I checked it was illegal to beat someone for doing that. Every woman who wants a man to "open up" dumps **** on him (me) for being "vulnerable." God help you if you're under stress at work or working on a degree. Then again I'm letting my experience cloud my judgment.

My wife is, at least, still interested in having sex with me. Which probably makes it worse, it means she respects me on some level. I think that makes it a double-bind.

And if this stuff were completely true, it really wouldn't explain why so many men are here posting stories about how they've been good providers and caretakers but emotionally distant and getting divorced over that distance. I think "be a man" advice is so prevalent because it really means "your situation is hopeless, better salvage what you have left."

The only thing I can think of is that parental dynamics and family norms matter tremendously. Some people don't know how to have adult-adult relationships so they treat their spouse as a child. Some people don't know what a marriage looks like; some people are more committed to commitment, if you will, than others. Some people are just selfish. And I think some women (and some men) just want to be married to robots. I'm going to the psychiatrist to see if they have anything like that.


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