# Need to know.



## Confusedandseekingadvice (Jun 17, 2012)

First I want to say this situation is very much my fault. Not solely my fault of course, but still something I had a heavy hand in. Right now I am in a relationship that has been successful through hardship. However in the past few months I made the mistake of letting my insecurities push my partner away. I suggested a separation which she resisted completely. A few days later we had a party and decided to explore new horizons with other people. Myself with a friend we hardly new, Her with a friend we have known for years and both care deeply about. I had a pointless night and she found an emotional connection. I then made the mistake of trying to step in and say it had to stop later in the evening because I was afraid. We have been together five years, living together two years and married almost a year. We have a young son whom we both love implicitly. Now I made the agreement that she can explore her feelings with the third party, because she took my prior advice and believes a separation is something she needs. I am doing all I can to be supportive in a situation where, for all intents and purposes, we are both single and I am competing with another man for her affections. If I fight her I will lose, if I don't win her affections fairly, I lose everything, and no matter how much I am acceptable with the situation, any time spent between them makes it difficult for me not to be physically sick. I am a very emotional and loving person, and I made the grave mistake of looking for validation where I needed none, and now I am paying the price. The advice I seek is what I can do to relax myself, stop stressing and do what I do best, Love my wife, try to assure her happiness, and fight for her with all I have, just as she deserves. Any advisement would be appreciated, but please know I have carefully weighed all of my options and will not regard anything along the lines of "She is a *insert insult here* move on and stop trying.* As advisement. She is younger than myself by two years and much earlier in our relationship she fell for someone else and I gave up. I only had my chance to make up for it because he did not show interest. I refuse to make the same mistake again because I know she is worth the fight, and worth the roiling ocean of emotions cascading within my heart.


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## Tiberius (Mar 22, 2012)

I had to read your post twice to understand it, but I am still unsure if I did.
You told your wife that you want to be separated, she refused, then you go to a party( Swingers I suppose)and while you did not enjoy your parner, she made an emotional connection with hers.
Can you explain why you wanted separation when you say that you love your wife/partner and do not want to lose her?


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## Vanguard (Jul 27, 2011)

Why in God's name would you agree to start dating other people while you're married?

Do things that capitalize on her interests and fantasies. I would say give her a lot of oral but now she's with someone else and you have no idea what kind of filth he is. 

I don't know what to tell you. Why would you do this to your wife? Or your son?


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## Confusedandseekingadvice (Jun 17, 2012)

I understand how this situation could be confusing, As I said I was insecure and seeking validation where I did not need to. It was a normal party at which we decided to swing with others. Now I am in a situation I have put myself in and I am realizing that I never wanted to be here, and that I am the one capable of fixing it, I just need to talk it out and try to understand how I should cope with her decisions.


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## MadeInMichigan (May 8, 2012)

Another fine example of being careful what you wish for.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Confusedandseekingadvice (Jun 17, 2012)

WhiteMousse said:


> Why in God's name would you agree to start dating other people while you're married?
> 
> Do things that capitalize on her interests and fantasies. I would say give her a lot of oral but now she's with someone else and you have no idea what kind of filth he is.
> 
> I don't know what to tell you. Why would you do this to your wife? Or your son?


Sometimes you make decisions to benefit and strengthen your relationship which others could never agree to. Everyone is of differing opinions. The man she is seeing is a close friend and I do know how to treat my wife in bed. I am doing all I can for her and catering to all of her interests and needs.


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## Confusedandseekingadvice (Jun 17, 2012)

MadeInMichigan said:


> Another fine example of being careful what you wish for.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I understand that completely. I am here because of my choices as much as if not more than hers. I am just doing my best to cope as well as I can. I want to keep my negative emotions in check so I can be all I can for her sake.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

So, you have a child you both love 'implicitly'.

In fact, you loved him so 'implicitly' that you both decided to cheat on each other.

Yes, that makes perfect sense! 

Now I am getting a headache...


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## Confusedandseekingadvice (Jun 17, 2012)

MattMatt said:


> So, you have a child you both love 'implicitly'.
> 
> In fact, you loved him so 'implicitly' that you both decided to cheat on each other.
> 
> ...


Which makes more sense, seeking truth and finding whatever means necessary to either fix our relationship, or end it on good terms, or find out the hard way later when he can understand and make him suffer through that?


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## OldWolf57 (Mar 20, 2012)

He is new and exciting, you are a known quality. you can't compete. So just tell her if she want the friend, then you will go on and see a lawyer to get the D started. Tell her yeah you screwed up, but since she care more for the E/P relationship with this friend, you wish her well. You just want to go on with your life with someone only there for you now.


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## jh52 (Apr 29, 2012)

If I understand -- she had sex with this close friend that you agreed to -- and now she wants a separation from you to explore her feelings ? Is this correct ??

If this is the case === how did you each choose whom to sleep with? Did you pick the person you slept with -- and did she pick this close friend ?

I ask this because if she chose your close friend -- and now wants to separate -- they may have been having an affair (at least an EA) for her to leave you so quickly.

Just more to think about !!


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

You've chosen a strategy that will lead to total failure.

You let her have sex with another person. Then when you said you wanted her to stop, she refused. Then she said she's going to continue to cheat, and you've agreed to let her cuckold you.

Stop playing this game. You've already lost that game. The only way to win is to change the game and the rules.

Kick her out. Tell her you won't accept being an option. You won't wait to be second place. 

I suspect the two of them actually set you up. They may have already been playing around, and they set you up to endorse her cheating with him. You just didn't see it coming, and now they won't stop.

No one who actually cared about you would treat you with so little care or regard. Refuse to be abused this way - tell her to get out. Your son stays with you, and you get the residence. She can come by and get her stuff in 48 hours or it will be given to charity.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

When the two of you agreed that you could have different partners at the party, neither of you agreed that either of you could have an ongoing relationship with the party hookup.

Let that sink in. This is not what you agreed to.

Tell her that either she stop the affair or you are filing for divorce. When you file, file for 100% custody as she has abandoned you and your son.

This is the truth of what is going on.

Right now you are doing exactly the wrong thing. People who have affairs are caker eaters. They want their affair partner and the safety net of their spouse. She will never stop the affair until either he dumps her or she is forced to choose between the two of you.

What a life.. to have two lovers, one of which takes care of financial support, the house and the child. And the other lover is just for fun.

I want that life too..


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

Why don't people play consequences before they do stuff?

"If we do 'x' what are the possible consequences, good or bad?

Finding out about negative consequences afterwards is silly.

I suggest MC.


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

This isn't the best place to ask about polyamory. And open relationships meant to repair broke marriages won't survive especially when one of the partner is against it.

Ok, your wife is not a *insert insult here*. But you don't want to be in a relation where you want to fight a man for your wife's affections.That is what you do when you are dating.


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## ArmyofJuan (Dec 29, 2010)

You need to remove yourself from this situation. The more you try to "fix" things the worse you are going to make it.

Stop trying to fix your wrongs, you can't and you will just become more frustrated. Like someone else already said, you can't compete with the OM so even trying will make you look pathetic. You may be better than the OM but it simply doesn't matter right now. She ain't gonna care.

Accept your situation for what it is and stop fighting it. Move to a D and if there's a chance for R she will try to stop you later. For what you did you really don't deserve a second chance so stop acting like you are entitled with her. When she sees you accepting your fate she may soften up.


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## OldWolf57 (Mar 20, 2012)

are you going to give us an update ??


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## river rat (Jan 20, 2012)

I suggest that you see a counselor to explore your own insecurities which led up to this debacle. Make yourself a better person. Stop chasing her. Read about the 180 to help yourself detach. At some point, she may decide that your love is something she wants; maybe not. But you need to prepare yourself to move forward w/ your life regardless.


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## Machiavelli (Feb 25, 2012)

so this guy was a friend already, huh? You do know this is an old scam where women are already banging the friend and then bring up this idea of swinging and/or poly so they can carry on right under your nose, right? It's highly unlikely the swap was their first time.

Come down on her with D papers. If she snaps out of it that's fine, if not at least you tried.

ETA: she was the one who suggested the swinging right?


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## Thorburn (Nov 23, 2011)

So you pushed for separation first. She resisted completely. (LET"S THINK ABOUT THAT) - typically (not always) when a person asks for a separation it means I don't want to be with you and we are free to do whatever and whomever we want. Because that is what typically happens.

So your wife said no to the separation. But I can imagine it got her thinking and we do not know what the he*l the entire conversation, body language, etc. took place because we only have your condensed version. I bet your wife started to think, WTF, he does not want to be with me.

Then the party.

She got an emotional attachment. DUH. You wanted to separate=not be with the wife. You allowed her to be with another guy she has known for a long time=hook up, love, emotional attachment, sex. 

And now you are not happy with the way things have turned out.

This is one of the craziest things I have ever heard.

You want to push your wife out of your life by separating, you then push her into the arms of a man for pleasure and you are thinking what?

Stupid is as stupid does.


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## Thorburn (Nov 23, 2011)

Another drive by. Post and run.


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## badbane (Jun 9, 2012)

Okay you have literally said it was okay to try something new out. Now that you put the separation on the table you literally handed your wife an Get out of marriage free card. 
This is a simple fix. 
1. tell your wife that your were stupid and you don't want a separation. That she is the one you always wanted. 
2. Tell her you want to be exclusive and you do not want to share her with anyone else.
3. If she wants a separation go see a lawyer and draw up some divorce papers. (not to really divorce her but to show her that it is all or nothing.)
4. Start seeking validation through other means. I love my wife but if she is your only source of validation then you will always be hypersensitive. You should be getting validation from friends, work, hobbies, your child, and your wife. She can't be the only thing you fall back on cause women are moody. You will find yourself on a validation rollercoaster.

From the looks of it the guy thought is some weird way he was doing some good. I think the most effective part of this site is that no one here patty cakes issues. So you are forced to admit mistakes. If you are unwilling to admit mistakes and really own them. This site will never work for you. I think this site is awesome.


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## Confusedandseekingadvice (Jun 17, 2012)

Alright so here is what happened. shortly after my emotionally distraught posts, I suffered emotional strain on a level which manifested physically. ((Not harming myself mind you, I've made mistakes in my life but that is just ridiculous.)) After this I changed the game, as some people suggested. I accepted my fate and waited it out, after which point I let this "friend" know that what he was doing did not merit the actions of a friend. I explained to him what he was doing to me and that he wasn't making this a "win-win" situation, like he apparently thought he was, for anyone. Shortly thereafter his childish actions, general immaturity, lack of skills or knowledge in bed, and fear of me led their relationship to a dead end. I welcomed her return to me gladly, after all I still love her, and we agreed that we should never attempt a separation for the prospect of bettering our future again. We also agreed that for the sake of our future, things need to change. If we get into a situation where our relationship becomes strained in any way again, we will seek counseling, and as a last resort, divorce. That is an option we will only consider if our relationship becomes irreconcilable. For now our relationship continues happily, and the "friend" has disappeared into the woodwork. I would like to note that we are in a no penalty state, so no legal action could/will be taken on anyone's part. I would also like to thank those of you who were constructive and attempted to help me. To the others I simply say that negativity is not particularly helpful in a situation where the asking party is emotionally distraught. I move on with my life facing problems as they come and riding out the wild and ever changing winds of marriage. I am happy, happier than I have been in a while, and somehow I knew that regardless of the result, I would have been happy. Since some of you brought this up, the affair did not start until that night, I know this for a fact because I can be rather paranoid, and no offense to my wife, but she has never been very good at covering her tracks.  Also, I believe the question "How could you be that stupid?" was asked. Answered simply, alcohol, and I can be an insecure, stubborn, a**hat sometimes. At any rate, things are better now, and I don't have any worries about the future. At least none that involve this subject


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## Silverlining (Jan 15, 2012)

By sharing your story, you have helped others....


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## Confusedandseekingadvice (Jun 17, 2012)

In response to the last post, all I had to do was accept things as they were. I knew it was by my own hand as much as anyone elses that I ended up in this situation. After all was said and done and we both had some time to reflect on the situation, she apologized, attributing most of her actions to the prospect of something new and exciting.. She was very remorse ful, and I forgave her easily, having already accepted the situation. I let her know that I still love her and hold no ill will towards her for her choices. Especially considering that I tried to make some of those choices for her. It's not an easy thing to accept your mistakes, swallow your pride, and know full well that you might lose. But hard as it was, I realized that I could do it, for her. Sometimes you do things you didn't know you were capable of for someone you love, and that's what I did. What I've learned from this is that when you are commited to someone enough to marry them, you need to accept them as they are, flaws and all. Don't try to change them, be open with them, and always be honest. Sometimes in order to win, you have to put everything on the table, and accept that it's a gamble. Knowing that something you hold so dear could very well be gone forever is a very sobering thing, no matter what you have been through. The advice I would give anyone interested enough to read through the whole situaton is to appriciate what you have, and if you love someone, make an effort to show them every day how much they mean to you. No one knows what will happen tomorrow, and you don't want to end up in my situation, with the last good point in your relationship a way back and no way of knowing if you will ever have a chance to show how you really feel again. You can talk all you want and do anything for someone, but really, in the game of love, two people have to play. If only one person wants to share a future with someone, nothing they say will have any meaning.


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## Malaise (Aug 8, 2012)

Confusedandseekingadvice said:


> Sometimes you make decisions to benefit and strengthen your relationship which others could never agree to. Everyone is of differing opinions. The man she is seeing is a close friend and I do know how to treat my wife in bed. I am doing all I can for her and catering to all of her interests and needs.


How on earth did you think that sharing your wife would 'benefit and strenghten' your relationship?

I can never understand this point of view.

You essientially told her that you did not value or cherish her and that she could be shared like a power drill or hedge clipper.

UFB


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## Confusedandseekingadvice (Jun 17, 2012)

Malaise said:


> How on earth did you think that sharing your wife would 'benefit and strenghten' your relationship?
> 
> I can never understand this point of view.
> 
> ...


While I understand your issues with this, you wouldn't discuss a seperation with your powerdrill, or hedge clipper. At least I certinly hope you wouldn't. One of the reasons I thought a seperation was a benitit is because it can show you just how much someone means to you. All the little things that make your day better. Sometimes people need to have things taken away before they realize what they have, while it's terrible it is also true. I know of no one who has made this dicision mutally and not benifited from it in the long run. Either you realize you really aren't right for each other or you realize exactly how foolish you really are for thinking it was a good idea in the first place. That is my two cents on the subject.


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## Kallan Pavithran (Jan 17, 2012)

You are lucky that OM was a chump and immature or not good in bed, else you might have been saying something different.


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## Confusedandseekingadvice (Jun 17, 2012)

_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Confusedandseekingadvice (Jun 17, 2012)

Yes, but I came to terms with that possibility. In the end I'm just happy that she found her happiness. Its more of a plus that she found it with me, but I would have been happy as long as I knew she was happy.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## WyshIknew (Aug 18, 2012)

Confusedandseekingadvice said:


> In response to the last post, all I had to do was accept things as they were. I knew it was by my own hand as much as anyone elses that I ended up in this situation. After all was said and done and we both had some time to reflect on the situation, she apologized, attributing most of her actions to the prospect of something new and exciting.. She was very remorse ful, and I forgave her easily, having already accepted the situation. I let her know that I still love her and hold no ill will towards her for her choices. Especially considering that I tried to make some of those choices for her. It's not an easy thing to accept your mistakes, swallow your pride, and know full well that you might lose. But hard as it was, I realized that I could do it, for her. Sometimes you do things you didn't know you were capable of for someone you love, and that's what I did. What I've learned from this is that when you are commited to someone enough to marry them, you need to accept them as they are, flaws and all. Don't try to change them, be open with them, and always be honest. Sometimes in order to win, you have to put everything on the table, and accept that it's a gamble. Knowing that something you hold so dear could very well be gone forever is a very sobering thing, no matter what you have been through. The advice I would give anyone interested enough to read through the whole situaton is to appriciate what you have, and if you love someone, make an effort to show them every day how much they mean to you. No one knows what will happen tomorrow, and you don't want to end up in my situation, with the last good point in your relationship a way back and no way of knowing if you will ever have a chance to show how you really feel again. You can talk all you want and do anything for someone, but really, in the game of love, two people have to play. If only one person wants to share a future with someone, nothing they say will have any meaning.


Pleased it all worked out for you.

I don't know how many times these arrangements work well for couples, but in the short time I have been posting and lurking on this forum I have seen many instances where things have gone badly wrong.
And although this could be a kind of confirmational bias on my side it always seems to be the man who ends up getting hurt.


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## Confusedandseekingadvice (Jun 17, 2012)

My only response to that is many times the male initiates the situation, believing it is for the best, and shows further inclusiveness by changing his mind. That is never good in the eyes of a women, or any partner really.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

How long were they together ?

Any chance they might reconnect again? 

How permanent do you think the break up is ? any chance that this was a lovers quarrel.

The not good in bed might just be something to make you feel better, no ?


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