# Wife doesnt seem affected by low sex drive



## Advicepleaseforme (Apr 11, 2016)

I'm sure this has been covered repeatedly, but here's my situation. My wife and I have been married for 7 years, together 9. We have a 3 year old daughter. 

Her low sex drive has been a source of frustration most of our marriage; she had a slightly higher sex drive when we were dating. Over the past year it has gotten to the point where I don't know what to do. We only have sexy 2-3 times a month. Then only after I feel I have guilted her into it. We have a very open communication relationship. We have talked many times about how we view sex differently and how I see it as a way to express our love where she gets that in other ways. 

She says that I meet all her needs in our marriage: I'm a good provider, I do most of the cleaning and all of the cooking. I plan nice, monthly, date nights for just the two of us. She acknowledges that the lack of sex is completely on her and understands my frustration and says she will work on it; but for more than a year she hasn't done any thing to help the situation. I offer to go to a counselor, to do more around the house, to watch our daughter so she can have alone time or do more with her friends, I read books and visit pages like this. But she has put forth no effort, to my knowledge to change the situation. I think I feel more hurt by her lack of trying to fix the problem than the lack of sex itself.

I know if she were feeling neglected in our relationship I would go out of my way to show her I was trying to address and correct the problem. I think she just, deep down, thinks that sex isn't that much of requirement for marriage and as long as we have it once every other week or so she's doing her part. 

Not sure where else to turn. Any suggestions?


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## Palodyne (Mar 3, 2016)

Here is your problem, you are kissing her a** to much. You are cooking and cleaning and allowing her girls night out's. And date nights. STOP this now!!! She is viewing you as weak. The more you kiss her a** the weaker you appear to her, and the less sexually attractive you appear to her.

No more date nights, no more kissing her a**, no more cooking and cleaning for her!! Tell her she is going to pull her damn weight from here on out. You are not going to accept her scraps. If she doesn't like it she can hit the door and find someone else to put up with her crap.

I guarantee, if you stand up to her and demand her pull her weight or you will dump her. You will find a big difference in her respect and sexual desire for you. You need to assert yourself.


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## Satya (Jun 22, 2012)

Why would things change when she can keep things exactly as they are? You are doing everything (in the way of accommodating her needs) so that there's nothing for her to do. There's no consequence. 

She is not meeting one of your fundamental needs, and worse she knows it. You're doing the same thing over and expecting a different result. You can't change her, you can only change yourself. Change what you do, see what happens. 

Are you attractive? When you look in the mirror, would you want to have sex with you?

Some people just don't value sex or need it in the same way as a spouse. Some people let insecurities consume and destroy their sex drive. There are all kinds of reasons that good, regular sex doesn't happen. Many women don't understand that sex is vitally important for men, to bond with their mate and feel loved. We are not taught this in sex ed.


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## Married but Happy (Aug 13, 2013)

Stop being the nice guy. It won't buy her affection or sex. Search this site for and read about "the 180." You need to distance yourself, work on yourself, and help less. Once she respects you more, the sex _may _improve. If she's just truly low drive (LD), nothing will help, and you'll have to decide if it's good enough to stay. Also find, download, and read "No More Mr. Nice Guy."


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## Happilymarried25 (Mar 19, 2014)

She probably gets her needs met through talking and spending time with you. She doesn't enjoy sex as often as you do. My husband is the same way. She doesn't see it as a problem. You knew this and had a baby with her so you obviously have accepted it. You can't change her so why not accept the situation and enjoy the positives in the marriage. People are saying don't clean and help out so much but if you stop all that then odds are she will say "I'm not having sex with you because you aren't helping me with what I need".


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## woodyh (Oct 23, 2015)

I don't agree with some of the above answers, being a "nice guy" is not causing her low drive, that is just her. If you weren't so nice, would she step it up? Maybe for a little while.

Some people don't have an interest in sports, so don't that don't watch it or play it. Some don't care about fishing, so they don't do it. Some people have low sex drives, so little to no sex
doesn't bother them and they don't think about it. Only occasionally on a special occasion or on an occasion they make get horny, but it is not on their minds much.

It is unlikely she will change, some people do, but most don't. The best you can do is get her to meet in the middle somewhat, but it will end up closer to her needs, not yours.
Maybe she can satisfy you in other ways, HJ etc.


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## alexm (Nov 29, 2008)

Hoo-boy. You just described my wife to a T.

The posters above are correct, to a point. A lot of the advice given in these threads are from people who don't quite have the same issue. Doesn't mean they're wrong, at all, but it often means they're quite a bit more blunt. Outside-looking-in, you know?

What is good advice is to not kiss your wife's ass all the time, in hopes of getting her in the mood. Kiss your wife's ass because you love her! But if you've ever said something along the lines of "honey, I do all this stuff for you, but you still don't have sex with me as often as I'd like" - that only creates pressure and, eventually, resentment.

Life (and marriage) IS full of tit-for-tat, but it's an unwritten rule. You don't talk about it, or use it as leverage. If you want to do more than your share of household chores, or you want to show your partner how much you love them - then do so. But never with the expectation of getting exactly what YOU want in return, ESPECIALLY when it's sex, and your partner is LD.

SHOULD you be getting something in return? Well, yes. That's the unwritten rule, isn't it? And you probably are - just not exactly what YOU want, unfortunately.

My wife and I also have sex 3-4 times a month. Occasionally more, occasionally less.

And during the period of time that I spent whining about it (ie. I do ALL of this for you, and you're not meeting MY needs!), guess what? I got less.

LD folks are a freakin' mystery, and always will be. Most of them honestly enjoy sex, but simply don't require it nearly as often as the rest of us do. My wife thoroughly enjoys sex with me - 3, 4 times a month.

But the bigger a deal you make of it, the less likely you are to achieve your goals. Currently, 3-4 times a month is what I can reasonably expect (and thank god it's good). It's not my ideal, but it is what it is.

But, I get that the main issue is not the lack of physical sex, it's the severe lack of showing any interest in "fixing" the situation. That's the toughest part to deal with. It's difficult, but people in our situation have to remember that this is not how our spouses show their love to us. That doesn't mean they don't love as just as much we do them - it's just not in the way WE want it, necessarily.


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## PAPS18 (May 17, 2012)

Here is my point of view, I have a LD wife for sure-it has been a month for us-for various reasons-we are usually 2-3x a month, sometimes less. BUT, if you go on a site with women and ask-what can I do to get my wife more interested in sex-the first thing you will read is-HELP her more around the house. Allow her time to rest, help with the kid(s), help with household duties, and then she might be more interested in sex. But then, you post to a bunch of men and they will say-STOP being the nice guy. You are a pushover and are weak, just stop doing everything and that will get her attention. I honestly don't think either work with a truly LD woman/wife. Likely, her priorities don't involve sex with her husband. In MOST cases, I firmly don't believe it is because the wife doesn't love her husband, or that she is totally not attracted to her husband. I believe it just is how they are built. They don't think about sex very often, they don't need it very often and thus it just doesn't happen. 

There is NO DOUBT that the person that wants sex the least has control in the that aspect of the relationship. What I do believe is interesting is how you go about either a compromise or potentially making the LD spouse feel bad-which could lead to pity sex. What I mean is this-assuming as I do that most wives do love their husbands and are not trying to hurt him on purpose, you can throw a compromise out and see if they are willing to potentially schedule sex-this puts it on the priority list so to speak-but it also can lead to disappointment because when that day/time comes, something-ANYTHING can happen to postpone the sex. You can also make moves on your wife frequently-ask her for sex or just start cuddling and kissing, and make her say no. Deep down I have to believe that they do feel some guilt every time they say no-BUT-every time your spouse rejects you, it takes its toll on your mentally so you have to have the salesman mentality-you have to be able to handle rejection without any problem. 

For me, I have thrown in the towel with asking frequently for sex, in fact, I don't ask any longer. I simply have said, I am a green light at ANY TIME, ANY LOCATION. Funny thing is, when she does initiate sex, she still asks me if I want to have sex or cuddle. I laugh each time and say, why do you even ask that-but that is just her mentality because she doesn't understand the concept of always being ready for sex like I am. 

My opinion is this-UNLESS the woman wants to change, no change is forthcoming regardless of what you do. IF she truly cares about that aspect of the relationship, she will start asking questions about wanting to get more interested-maybe asking her doctor, or doing research. Just like for me, I have wanted to understand why she has low sex drive and how I can change her-or what I can do to maybe get her to change so I have sought about boards like this over the years to read/try to understand-but you come to realize-there is NOTHING you can do. It is like anything in life, if it is a priority, you make the time and put in the effort. For my wife, if our kids had a sickness, were struggling in school, etc etc, she would be looking up how to help or what do do, because the kids are a priority for her. She realizes sex is important to me but in her mind, it is simply not a big deal. Her mindset is that men always want sex, no amount of sex she has with me would be considered "enough", and as she has told me-it is just not a priority for her. She has apologized for not being the woman I want her to be-she has basically said this is who I am, I am not changing so deal with it. She has not said, divorce me if you are not happy-but essentially she is saying she is not changing. I am not going to divorce her because I love her and I love my kids. BUT, I don't think a threat of divorce would change her in any way-she is who she is so I have to accept it and make the best of the situation. I suppose that is the bottom line for most guys that don't want a divorce-you really just have to make the best of what you have.


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## badsanta (Oct 13, 2014)

Advicepleaseforme said:


> *She acknowledges that the lack of sex is completely on her and understands my frustration and says she will work on it;* but for more than a year she hasn't done any thing to help the situation.
> 
> Not sure where else to turn. Any suggestions?



So, you make her feel broken and also managed to get her to acknowledge that SHE IS BROKEN. What do you think that does to her self esteem and self confidence?

Imagine if it were the other way around and your wife complained that you never pleased her enough. She had to badger you to perform, and would likely get upset if you were not able to readily orgasm repeatedly are were not really into it exactly the way she wanted you to be. You later admit the problem is you and that you will work on it. Then she goes out and buys an industrial strength vacuum pump to try and help you! (I am going out on a limb in case you tried toys to help her).

Sexuality is all about self confidence and feeling worthy of being loved. Unfortunately eroticism does NOT play by democratic rules of kindness and fairness. Eroticism plays very unfair and needs playful discord and distance in order to thrive.

Try developing a fetish for tease and denial and beg your wife NOT to let you have sex with her! Next time she says "NO" get all excited and ask her to say it again. Next thing you know you will be complaining that your wife it horrible at playing the tease and denial game because she enjoys too much making you fail and orgasm ALL THE TIME!!!!!!

Why does this work? Because you are making her feel loved, accepted, and desired just the way she is. But in a way that heightens erotic discord and playfulness in such a way that makes her playful attempts to turn YOU into the "failure" exquisite! 

Cheers, 
Badsanta


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## NobodySpecial (Nov 22, 2013)

I am trying to imagine in what universe "asking" for sex is hot? And in no universe ever was the covert contract of housework for sex hot. Grown up people do housework because it needs to be done. In two income households, both do housework because it needs to be done. 

Sex comes from attraction. Attraction comes from confidence, fun, dating and the like. NOT from housework. If she is taking on more than her share of the burden there, the idea is not to "help" her with the housework. It is to step up to do your fair share so she is not both burdened and resentful. 

The 180 is not about becoming a jerk. It is about getting your hot and sexy man self back.


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## richardsharpe (Jul 8, 2014)

Good evening
If she is truly LD, then there is nothing you can do. If she knows how important sex is to you, but keeps turning you down, either she really doesn't want sex, or she doesn't care about you. 

I know that many here don't believe anyone is really LD, but many of us have met people whos behavior seems to indicate that they are.


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## PAPS18 (May 17, 2012)

Richard, I totally agree. I think some of us can't imagine a scenario described here-like I can't imagine an LD man. I don't think I am HD either, I like to think I am MD, middle. I don't require or even want sex daily or even every other day. I think I would be completely thrilled with 3x a week. But, as I know my wife has a job that is demanding and never seems to end, seeing that we have kids and activities with kids, I would be fine with 1x a week at this point in time-but I often go without for weeks at a time-right now I am at 4 weeks-for various reasons-some out of our control. That being said, I think some women don't believe us when we say our wives are LD. My wife has told me, sex is NOT a priority and apologized for not being the woman I would like her to be. When she said that I was speechless, there was nothing more I could say and she said that about 7-8 years ago, and we don't talk about sex any longer. I don't initiate it, well, that is lie, rarely I will but usually still I am rejected which then starts my cycle of never initiating all over again. It is just not worth it-my wife knows I will never turn her down for sex-unless I have a stomach bug or the flu, she has a green light. Often times I think, what would it be like to KNOW that any time I initiated sex, I would get a yes-just hard to imagine. I did say no to her ONE TIME in our marriage-because I was pissed at her and figured, this will show her how it feels-she simply said OK, rolled over and feel asleep within minutes. Meanwhile, I toss and turned all night realizing I had just pissed away my shot at sex for the week. She has told me I should not take it personal when she says no, but I can't help but do so. 

My wife is LD plain and simple-she has told me as much, she doesn't masturbate-thinks that is gross, thinks porn is gross, gets highly embarrassing with any sexual talk at all-has never used any dirty words during sex, I have used a few in the heat/passion of the moment and she gives me a look of disgust or just says stop talking that way. Funny thing is, early in our relationship she was the aggressor much more often-and when we were trying to have kids, she wanted sex constantly-but it was for a reason-same as early in the relationship when she was trying to show me that she was interested. Not going to say total bait and switch but certainly the years of dating led me to believe that once married, she would be all over me. We waited until marriage to have intercourse (well we did slip up once), but had oral and naked make out sessions as frequently as we could. I was a priority for her then, but now I have been passed over for kids and career.


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## NobodySpecial (Nov 22, 2013)

richardsharpe said:


> Good evening
> If she is truly LD, then there is nothing you can do. If she knows how important sex is to you, but keeps turning you down, either she really doesn't want sex, or she doesn't care about you.
> 
> I know that many here don't believe anyone is really LD, but many of us have met people whos behavior seems to indicate that they are.


For my part, it is not about believing someone can be LD. For me, when I looked LD, it had nothing to do with my drive. Needing to perform sex when I don't want to as some kind of pity gift is a MASSIVE TURN OFF. When approached with I want to have sex, can you give it to me, I recoil. Just YUCK. That approach seems really unlikely to have any effect. My willingness to fake it till I could make it came when DH was fun, funny, working out, doing fun things with me and our friends.


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## NobodySpecial (Nov 22, 2013)

PAPS, was this the case before marriage as well? Priority can be relative to everything going on in one's life. If she was always like this, pre-marriage and pre-kids, I am betting "priority" is relative.


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## PAPS18 (May 17, 2012)

NS, before marriage, I was a priority. She was the aggressor more than I, looking back on it. Certainly made me feel wanted, she would suggest spending nights together etc, even after marriage, she would still plan trips and do some special things for me sexually but since kids, I have done EVERYTHING. I get that kids are a top priority, but we were before kids and I have told her this before. I still put her first, kids are a close second, but no doubt kids are way ahead of me as is her job I feel like. Kids are getting older so maybe I become more a priority here soon, but we are getting older too-I fear by the time she comes back to me, I will too old or not able to appreciate it.


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## NobodySpecial (Nov 22, 2013)

PAPS18 said:


> NS, before marriage, I was a priority. She was the aggressor more than I, looking back on it. Certainly made me feel wanted, she would suggest spending nights together etc, even after marriage, she would still plan trips and _do some special things *for me* sexually _but since kids,


Was she ever INTO it? I mean, if sex was always a gift to you, then I am not sure why that would change. 



> I have done EVERYTHING. I get that kids are a top priority, but we were before kids and I have told her this before. I still put her first, kids are a close second, but no doubt kids are way ahead of me as is her job I feel like. Kids are getting older so maybe I become more a priority here soon, but we are getting older too-I fear by the time she comes back to me, I will too old or not able to appreciate it.


Here's the thing. If she says oh yah I don't have a sex drive, and you say oh ok well can you give it to ME sometimes, do you see how unattractive that is? I mean, it does not sound like she has ever been that into it, if she "gave" it to you throughout your history. If that is the case, it is totally unfix-able unless you are willing to blow up your marriage.

I remember after our first was born my husband saying, in a very loving way, I love you. I want to be with you forever. But there is no way in hell I am living the rest of my life in a sexless marriage. And I was never ever LD. If a person who has a healthy drive can be driven to sexlessness over kids, house, work... image what someone who either does not have a high drive, or maybe has been raise to view sex as a means to an end feels?

(He then left the house to go workout. When he got home, he brought a nice dinner. We made sweet love that night.)


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## wantshelp (Mar 10, 2016)

Happilymarried25 said:


> You knew this and had a baby with her so you obviously have accepted it.


Having a baby is not an obvious sign of acceptance of her LD. I have two kids with my wife and have never accepted her LD. For me the kids were the result of desperation to reignite her sex drive, but it in no way signified my acceptance. But, that's me...


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## NobodySpecial (Nov 22, 2013)

What my husband did after the birth of our first (quite sometime after not immediately) was to tell me that he loved me very much. He would do anything and everything I needed for me to find him attractive again. But he was not living the rest of his life in a sexless marriage. This was not a threat. This was a FACT. He did not give me a timeline. He did not issue threats. He simply informed me that at some point, he was going to have to cut bait. He was then very patient as I began trying to fake it until I could make it. He never pushed me. He just accepted what I was able to do. Slowly my insecurity faded, my confidence in my body grew. My confidence in his love grew. And our sex life grew even better than it had before.

I would bet my left butt cheek that if had done nothing, we would be divorced now after several sexless years until he had had enough.

Just experience from the other side.


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## wantshelp (Mar 10, 2016)

PAPS18 said:


> Not going to say total bait and switch but certainly the years of dating led me to believe that once married, she would be all over me.


I can totally relate.


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## wantshelp (Mar 10, 2016)

NobodySpecial said:


> What my husband did after the birth of our first (quite sometime after not immediately) was to tell me that he loved me very much. He would do anything and everything I needed for me to find him attractive again. But he was not living the rest of his life in a sexless marriage. This was not a threat. This was a FACT.


I did the exact same thing with my wife. I was all-in and professed my love after the birth of our first, but she continued to be LD. But, I did not tell her that I would not stay in a sexless marriage. It really is a threat. There are clearly consequences implied. You're just saying that worked for you.


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## NobodySpecial (Nov 22, 2013)

wantshelp said:


> I did the exact same thing with my wife. I was all-in and professed my love after the birth of our first, but she continued to be LD. But, I did not tell her that I would not stay in a sexless marriage. It really is a threat. There are clearly consequences implied. You're just saying that worked for you.


When I say it was not a threat, I meant that it was, as i said, a fact. Meaning it was not an idle threat. He did not envision the rest of his life in a sexless marriage. He was relaying honest information about how he envisioned his life. But that alone would not have done much if not accompanied by caring patience. We were pretty young when we got married. Sex before marriage was like forbidden fruit to me. But I had been raised with very repressive, backward views on sex. So somewhere in my befuddled mind, it did not need to be important. His patience and kindness helped me past that we well as to resume seeing myself as a sexual being in addition to being a mother. That wife did not mean just caring for the kids and the home. It meant caring for and with him as he was caring for and with me. He never ever pressured me for anything. He took what I could and did do with cheer and grace. As my comfort in him and confidence in myself grew, I was able to grow into more openness with him.


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## richardsharpe (Jul 8, 2014)

Good evening
Before he told you that he wasn't willing to live like that, did you realize how important sex was to him. Was there any other way that you could have understood? 

I've often assumed that people who are LD but who love their partners really don't understand how important sex is to some people. Or maybe sex really is very unpleasant to an LD? 







NobodySpecial said:


> When I say it was not a threat, I meant that it was, as i said, a fact. Meaning it was not an idle threat. He did not envision the rest of his life in a sexless marriage. He was relaying honest information about how he envisioned his life. But that alone would not have done much if not accompanied by caring patience. We were pretty young when we got married. Sex before marriage was like forbidden fruit to me. But I had been raised with very repressive, backward views on sex. So somewhere in my befuddled mind, it did not need to be important. His patience and kindness helped me past that we well as to resume seeing myself as a sexual being in addition to being a mother. That wife did not mean just caring for the kids and the home. It meant caring for and with him as he was caring for and with me. He never ever pressured me for anything. He took what I could and did do with cheer and grace. As my comfort in him and confidence in myself grew, I was able to grow into more openness with him.


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## PAPS18 (May 17, 2012)

NS, I have done basically what your husband did EXCEPT I didn't make a threat-because divorce was not an option, and sexless marriage to me is sexless. My wife and I do not have a sexless marriage-unless you consider I guess about 20-24x a year sexless. I have always supported her, she stayed home with our kids because we both wanted that (not because we could truly afford it) and we have had arguments about lack of sex but I know she is truthful when she says she is doing the best she can-sex is just not a priority for her. She enjoys sex when it happens-she is not the type to fake, she is a very genuine person, she enjoys it and loves me. She is attracted to me, I know she is-we both look within 5lbs or so of what we looked like 25 years ago-we have both aged well. I have been complimented by so many of my wives friends for all I do to help and be involved with my kids. Put it this way, when we can afford to get away from home, she is very into it but often times is reluctant to go-I have to plan EVERYTHING, she balks about leaving the kids-even though they are teens, we have great and passionate sex while away. Then come home and life gets in the way. I just wish she would plan something sometimes-to show she really wants to go away with me. She used to do that, which is what I referenced in she used to FOR ME, when someone suggests you get away, makes the plans-it makes you feel special and wanted. I rarely if ever feel that way.


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## NobodySpecial (Nov 22, 2013)

richardsharpe said:


> Good evening
> Before he told you that he wasn't willing to live like that, did you realize how important sex was to him. Was there any other way that you could have understood?


Of course I knew it was important to him. I had dated him and married him. I knew who he was. I certainly did not intend to be sexless. I had a baby on my mind. I can get to sex later. I had a house on my mind. I can get to sex later. I had a job on my mind. I can get to sex later. But the more we didn't have it the more I didn't want it. And it was not the threat of divorce that did it for me. It was the knowledge that he was going to stand up on his man feet and make determinations for his grown up man self about how he was going to live his life. 



> I've often assumed that people who are LD but who love their partners really don't understand how important sex is to some people. Or maybe sex really is very unpleasant to an LD?


I have no idea. I would bet a zillion dollars that LD is a cover for most people, albeit probably an unwitting one. I used to have a friend (self proclaimed LD) who commented to me after my hysterectomy about how it must be a relief not to have to have sex for the recovery weeks. (This was years later from the other events I have been discussing.) I was like um, no. I like having sex with my husband. Remember you used to too? I remember accidentally walking in on the two of you going at it like bunnies. I used to have to avoid your apartment when his car was in the drive. But he is a typical nice guy beta man who checked his man card at the marital door, drools and begs after her like an unattractive puppy.


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## NobodySpecial (Nov 22, 2013)

PAPS18 said:


> NS, I have done basically what your husband did EXCEPT I didn't make a threat-because divorce was not an option, and sexless marriage to me is sexless. My wife and I do not have a sexless marriage-unless you consider I guess about 20-24x a year sexless. I have always supported her, she stayed home with our kids because we both wanted that (not because we could truly afford it) and we have had arguments about lack of sex but I know she is truthful when she says she is doing the best she can-sex is just not a priority for her. She enjoys sex when it happens-she is not the type to fake, she is a very genuine person, she enjoys it and loves me. She is attracted to me, I know she is-we both look within 5lbs or so of what we looked like 25 years ago-we have both aged well. I have been complimented by so many of my wives friends for all I do to help and be involved with my kids. Put it this way, when we can afford to get away from home, she is very into it but often times is reluctant to go-I have to plan EVERYTHING, she balks about leaving the kids-even though they are teens, we have great and passionate sex while away. Then come home and life gets in the way. I just wish she would plan something sometimes-to show she really wants to go away with me. She used to do that, which is what I referenced in she used to FOR ME, when someone suggests you get away, makes the plans-it makes you feel special and wanted. I rarely if ever feel that way.


Man card. Yesterday.


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## PAPS18 (May 17, 2012)

No thanks, that man card crap is just crap in my opinion. But we are free to have our own opinion. If not having a man card means not letting lack of sex lead me to divorce, so be it.


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## NobodySpecial (Nov 22, 2013)

PAPS18 said:


> No thanks, that man card crap is just crap in my opinion. But we are free to have our own opinion. If not having a man card means not letting lack of sex lead me to divorce, so be it.


What do you think a man card is? It can start with something as simple as taking control of your own body back. You already know that complaining to your wife does not work. What are you interested in trying differently? 

If divorce is not an option, it is not an option. That is fine. That does not change the fact that you probably don't appear very manly and attractive to your wife.


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## PAPS18 (May 17, 2012)

I think I am attractive to my wife, I don't think that is a problem-could it be sure-but that would mean I have always been unattractive to her I guess. She is busy, has a demanding job-I don't-I have a job that allows me to leave it at work. Man card to me is saying you think I am a pushover which is incorrect. I am a family man, and loving husband and a good guy. I am not someone that makes ideal threats-because if I said, sex or I am leaving, I am not prepared do to that. I do take care of myself-I hate that I have to do that, but I do. She doesn't know but I really don't care about that-because I will take care of my needs when I feel the need. I just think you have me pegged a certain way-so I am going to just leave it that way. It is ok, I have you pegged a certain way as well!!


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## NobodySpecial (Nov 22, 2013)

PAPS18 said:


> I think I am attractive to my wife, I don't think that is a problem-could it be sure-but that would mean I have always been unattractive to her I guess. She is busy, has a demanding job-I don't-I have a job that allows me to leave it at work. Man card to me is saying you think I am a pushover which is incorrect.


Nope. I think you are a fairly typical person who has been TOO nice. I think the weekend trips and housework are covert contracts. You learned what millions of men have learned. Happy wife, happy life. Do, do, do, do, do and she will want to have sex with you. It aint so.

I was very much like your wife. Raised Catholic. Mom was a duty sexer. And sex was BAD except for kids of which they had tons cuz Dad was a horn dog. She took her marital responsibility seriously. But between her and the nuns, I got it. Sex was this dirty nasty thing you did to get a husband and have babies. Then you have to keep doing it sometimes because... well... men.

I remember when I objected to DH's masturbating. He started hiding it. Then finally he said, look. I do this. I have always done this since I was a teenager. I did not sign up for stopping this when we got married. (This was years and years before kids.) Out of deference to your feelings, I will be more discreet. You won't see evidence of it. I will never rub it in your face. But I am not going to stop. And I am not going to lie to you.

That made me stop and think. One baby step in mental adjustment. But he showed me his strength that day. He is not going to kiss my ass, even when I *thought* I was right. He didn't. And he was going to maintain control over that element of himself, thank you very much.




> I am a family man, and loving husband and a good guy. I am not someone that makes ideal threats-because if I said, sex or I am leaving, I am not prepared do to that.


Have you noticed that since you made that quite clear I have not repeated that suggestion? I actually think you misunderstand what I mean anyway, so it would not be likely to have the desired effect.

When my husband said that to me, I did not think, Oh gee if I want to keep this bankroll/husband/toy thing. I did not need him. I made all the money. I did not see it as a threat. I could easily find a new man, even with a baby. I thought I want THIS man. This strong, calm, self assured man.




> I do take care of myself-I hate that I have to do that, but I do.


Have to? Do you see masturbating as a bad thing? We both do it even when we are having lots of rocking good sex. It is perfectly normal and healthy.



> She doesn't know but I really don't care about that-because I will take care of my needs when I feel the need. I just think you have me pegged a certain way-so I am going to just leave it that way. It is ok, I have you pegged a certain way as well!!


Sorry you think that. I was only trying to help.


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## PAPS18 (May 17, 2012)

NS, I know you are trying to help but you are using YOUR experience to generalize and make everyone fit into your life-I am happy all turned out great but part of the reason it turned out great is because of YOU. You were the reason, not your husband. You wanted to change, you wanted things to be different than Mom. I am fully aware change has to come from within-and she is NOT changing at least for now-so I make the best of it. Every success story I read it happens because the person rejecting the sex decided they needed to make a change. 

She thinks masturbation is a bad thing, I do not as I have been doing it since, forever. But if I was having more sex, I would not be doing it because honestly I don't have time and don't want that much myself. We are busy with kids honestly-but I suspect if we were connecting every weekend, I would be pretty content. Problem is, we will skip a weekend here and there.


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## NobodySpecial (Nov 22, 2013)

PAPS18 said:


> NS, I know you are trying to help but you are using YOUR experience to generalize and make everyone fit into your life-I am happy all turned out great but part of the reason it turned out great is because of YOU. You were the reason, not your husband. You wanted to change, you wanted things to be different than Mom. I am fully aware change has to come from within-and she is NOT changing at least for now-so I make the best of it. Every success story I read it happens because the person rejecting the sex decided they needed to make a change.
> 
> She thinks masturbation is a bad thing, I do not as I have been doing it since, forever. But if I was having more sex, I would not be doing it because honestly I don't have time and don't want that much myself. We are busy with kids honestly-but I suspect if we were connecting every weekend, I would be pretty content. Problem is, we will skip a weekend here and there.


I wish you luck.


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## PAPS18 (May 17, 2012)

Thanks NS, I have patience and that is a virtue. I also pray each day for my wife and I to have a better physical connection-we are best friends, just not with enough benefits for me at least.


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## UMP (Dec 23, 2014)

NobodySpecial said:


> I remember when I objected to DH's masturbating. He started hiding it. Then finally he said, look. I do this. I have always done this since I was a teenager. I did not sign up for stopping this when we got married. (This was years and years before kids.) Out of deference to your feelings, I will be more discreet. You won't see evidence of it. I will never rub it in your face. But I am not going to stop. And I am not going to lie to you.
> 
> That made me stop and think. One baby step in mental adjustment. But he showed me his strength that day. He is not going to kiss my ass, even when I *thought* I was right. He didn't. And he was going to maintain control over that element of himself, thank you very much.


My wife has a very hard time if she thinks our kids know that we have sex. For example, we were all ready for some sex and my daughter texts my wife and says "I'll be home in a few minutes with 2 of my friends." I told my wife to tell her to come home in an hour. She refused and I replied "I DO NOT CARE IF MY CHILDREN KNOW WE ARE HAVING SEX. SEX IS GOOD IT IS A GIFT FROM GOD. OUR KIDS SHOULD BE HAPPY WE ARE HAPPY AND HAVING SEX." 

I could tell that something in her brain went off and she finally got it.(the sex was fantastic BTW)

I like reading your posts because my wife is a lot like you and I appreciate the fact that you made the effort and changed. It's an interesting thing to see someone like you verbalize what my wife is going through.

Oh, and it really helps when a man, "mans up." That is very difficult to learn for a man in the culture we currently live in.


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## NobodySpecial (Nov 22, 2013)

UMP said:


> My wife has a very hard time if she thinks our kids know that we have sex. For example, we were all ready for some sex and my daughter texts my wife and says "I'll be home in a few minutes with 2 of my friends." I told my wife to tell her to come home in an hour. She refused and I replied "I DO NOT CARE IF MY CHILDREN KNOW WE ARE HAVING SEX. SEX IS GOOD IT IS A GIFT FROM GOD. OUR KIDS SHOULD BE HAPPY WE ARE HAPPY AND HAVING SEX."
> 
> I could tell that something in her brain went off and she finally got it.(the sex was fantastic BTW)
> 
> I like reading your posts because my wife is a lot like you and I appreciate the fact that you made the effort and changed. It's an interesting thing to see someone like you verbalize what my wife is going through.


I think the point that is missed is that I would not have done had he just asked me to. Regulars to this board understand the issue of respect. I think subconsciously I would not have respected him if he allowed me to control that important part of his life. If he wanted me to just gift him sex for the rest of our lives, I'd have wound up resentful.



> Oh, and it really helps when a man, "mans up." That is very difficult to learn for a man in the culture we currently live in.


Ayuh.


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

wantshelp said:


> I did the exact same thing with my wife. I was all-in and professed my love after the birth of our first, but she continued to be LD. But, I did not tell her that I would not stay in a sexless marriage. It really is a threat. There are clearly consequences implied. You're just saying that worked for you.


It may be viewed as a threat. However, it is also clearly communicating what you will and will not tolerate.

January of 2014 I said the same thing to my wife. We are also great now. However, it was not entirely because of the threat. It was also because I worked on my crap, quit drinking and porn, and started to focus on really meeting my wife's needs. My expectation was that she do the same within a certain time frame. 

If you communicate to your S.O. a boundary, and they perceive it as a threat, they are welcome to ignore it, resist it, or any other action besides honor it. If it is a TRUE boundary, and one you are actually willing to enforce (as opposed to bluffing), they can do so at the detriment of the marriage.


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

wantshelp said:


> I did the exact same thing with my wife. I was all-in and professed my love after the birth of our first, but she continued to be LD. But, I did not tell her that I would not stay in a sexless marriage. It really is a threat. There are clearly consequences implied. You're just saying that worked for you.


You did the exact same thing except, you know, the part that actually worked. So really, you did the exact opposite.


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

PAPS18 said:


> NS, I have done basically what your husband did EXCEPT I didn't make a threat-because divorce was not an option, and sexless marriage to me is sexless. My wife and I do not have a sexless marriage-unless you consider I guess about 20-24x a year sexless. I have always supported her, she stayed home with our kids because we both wanted that (not because we could truly afford it) and we have had arguments about lack of sex but I know she is truthful when she says she is doing the best she can-sex is just not a priority for her. She enjoys sex when it happens-she is not the type to fake, she is a very genuine person, she enjoys it and loves me. She is attracted to me, I know she is-we both look within 5lbs or so of what we looked like 25 years ago-we have both aged well. I have been complimented by so many of my wives friends for all I do to help and be involved with my kids. Put it this way, when we can afford to get away from home, she is very into it but often times is reluctant to go-I have to plan EVERYTHING, she balks about leaving the kids-even though they are teens, we have great and passionate sex while away. Then come home and life gets in the way. I just wish she would plan something sometimes-to show she really wants to go away with me. She used to do that, which is what I referenced in she used to FOR ME, when someone suggests you get away, makes the plans-it makes you feel special and wanted. I rarely if ever feel that way.


Again, you did "basically" the same thing, except the part that actually worked. So you did not do even close to the same thing. You refuse to assert your boundaries, so you get what you get. Personally I don't think you should complain about it unless your willing to take the hard steps. It's like listening to someone who doesn't vote complain about the president.


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

@PAPS18:

Ignore @NobodySpecial at your own peril.



NobodySpecial said:


> Nope. I think you are a fairly typical person who has been TOO nice. I think the weekend trips and housework are covert contracts. You learned what millions of men have learned. Happy wife, happy life. Do, do, do, do, do and she will want to have sex with you. It aint so.
> 
> I was very much like your wife. Raised Catholic. Mom was a duty sexer. And sex was BAD except for kids of which they had tons cuz Dad was a horn dog. She took her marital responsibility seriously. But between her and the nuns, I got it. Sex was this dirty nasty thing you did to get a husband and have babies. Then you have to keep doing it sometimes because... well... men.
> 
> ...


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

WorkingOnMe said:


> Personally I don't think you should complain about it unless your willing to take the hard steps. It's like listening to someone who doesn't vote complain about the president.


QFT.


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## NobodySpecial (Nov 22, 2013)

WorkingOnMe said:


> You did the exact same thing except, you know, the part that actually worked. So really, you did the exact opposite.


I did not think that would go over super well if I said it. The thing is, for some people divorce really is NOT an option. He could do other elements of the 180. But those boundaries which are fluid are not boundaries at all.


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