# I'm tired of this Love Language business



## jennifer1986 (Feb 4, 2012)

This is gonna be quite a bit of rant...I'm also tired physically after running 4 miles of up/down hills...passed by many cyclists who smiled at me, and I was like "yeah the only man that doesn't smile at me is my h". 

Anyways. I read Love Languages/HNHN/Love Busters. Kind of organized them in my mind and quickly did HNHN's questionnaire. My biggest love language is words of affirmation, and the HUGEST love buster is disrespectful judgements, my h's expertise. I want to give him the quiz, but I know he would roll eyes. Every time he saw me reading a "marriage" book he made a sarcastic comment (like "so, learning a lot?""living life by the book, huh?""books teach u everything, huh?")(Like I said before, my h does NOT read books). 

So I try to "do the quizzes for him". For example, it's clear his love language is acts of service. This also fits the *domestic support* from HNHN. So I try to do more little things, cooking and cleaning. Physical touch, sure, but I keep trying to improve the sex with almost no progress (trying to slow it down a bit so I get more enjoyment). He is hardly ever turned down for *sexual fulfillment. * 

I ask myself about his top needs. So, yesterday cousins were visiting and the kids were all in the pool. I wanted to relax but instead went changing into my suit although I am a horrible swimmer. I also told him it's never too late to learn swimming and perhaps I can take up lessons with the younger kid. I'm working on *recreational companionship.* 
He always criticized me for not being athletic enough (I'm the reading/writing type), so I decided to sign up for a 10 k, but he said signing up for a run 2 months ahead is stupid--your schedule might change, you might have to work (yes I work on Saturdays), I said it's called a commitment. So, every time I try to do something "good" it turns out to be not so good. But I said I would start training regardless. With* physical attractiveness*, I have no doubt I've been very diligent on that. *Admiration?* It's hard for me to say "u r so wonderful" when he never says anything positive about me, but I constantly tell him how all his decisions are good and we are very lucky to have everything. 

But on my end...there is no display of *affection* outside bedroom. *Conversation*, yes, but it is about what he likes to talk about. I do not dare to talk about my interests. (Long history of him accusing my hobbies). *Honesty and Openness* is usually not a problem. I have all the* financial support *I need and my h is definitely a *family *man. 

So, I sound like many other wives. The h is a wonderful man (any man that satisfies *financial support* and *family commitment* generally fits in that category). But the w can be miserable. 

I know it's not a one-sided business, but what can I do when he doesn't see there's a problem, and when I try to point out the problems he gets mad? Last night I tried to talk and he sat up in the bed angrily ("you always have boundless energy at bedtime, huh". I hear this line so often when I try to talk to him. The problem is, there's never a good time to talk. Day time is not good either. "Now our whole day will be ruined, huh"). I felt hurt and pulled the blanket over my head to be quiet. Amazingly....the guy that claimed he was tired and needed to rest came to grab me in 20 min. So he wanted sex when I wanted to talk, and now my feelings were bad and he "spoke his love language to me". I was like, what to do? 

Eventually, I told him how I was feeling and it's hard to have sex when I feel so rejected. He stopped but neither could fall asleep. He then approached me again and I made myself "speak his language". It's not that I hate sex--I'm the HD spouse! So we had sex but I still feel so empty.


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## Gaia (Apr 27, 2012)

Stop giving in to him. When he makes a snide remark tell him flat out he is being a jerk and you don't appreciate it. Don't keep giving him what he wants if your needs are not being fullfilled... you will only end up resenting him so bad it may feel like hate.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## KathyBatesel (Apr 26, 2012)

I want to thump your guy on the nose and say, "Hey Bozo!" but that's probably not a good idea. I can sure relate to your situation. The same things happened in my first and second marriage!

Before I continue, let me tell you that I think he's in the wrong and that you may have some serious compatibility issues, but you can't force him to change, so I'll tell you what I've done that I think can help your situation.

First, when he makes those critical comments (and even when he's not) start educating in a fun, flirty way about YOUR value to him. When he says, "So, learning a lot?" say, "Sure am. Whenever you have a problem with your relationship, I'll be the girl who can fix it for ya." When he says "signing up two months ahead is stupid. Your schedule might change," say "Yep, I'll have to make sure I have plenty of training time, so I may not be making dinner as often." 

Next, remember that it's ok to "fish" for the words of affirmation that you crave. Looking back, I think of my ex and the way he would subtly toot his own horn. We jokingly called it "fishing" because he'd be fishing for compliments by telling about something he did "right" today or that he was proud of. Using that same flirty approach, let your husband hear those things. If he doesn't respond with compliments, tell him, "Now that you've let me know your negative thoughts, I want to hear all the good ones you're bottling up inside!" Show that you are excited to hear him be positive and do not let him off the hook until he gives it to you. You can capitalize on the things you know he doesn't like if he keeps trying to wriggle out of it. "If you don't recognize something good about this, I'm going to keep you awake at bedtime talking about this, so why not make it easy on both of us so we can fool around instead?" Stay upbeat and positive as you do this so it doesn't turn into a hostile power struggle.

Finally, remember that YOUR thoughts control how you feel. His words have no power unless you give them power. When he's snarky, remind yourself that his negativity is a way a man can try to feel powerful when he doesn't. For instance, when he sees you reading self-help books about marriage, he KNOWS that you're criticizing him and his performance in the marriage even though you may not have used any words to him at all. So he gets snarky and hopes you'll feel like it's a waste of time. That way, he won't see evidence that he's underperforming. 

On this note, make it a point to be VERY concise about what you want. Don't try to have discussions. If you want something, boil it down to a simple request that you can make in twenty words or less. "I want to hear three compliments from you each day so I can feel more loved." You do not have to justify it, explain it, or anything else. He'll understand what you're asking for and decide whether or not to do it. If he says, "this is dumb" you can say, "I don't care if it's dumb. It's important to me and I'm asking you to do it. Will you or won't you?" If he continually proves uncooperative, you may want to think about that and what it means to your relationship.


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## Thundarr (Jul 4, 2012)

What can you do with someone who's not willing to learn. He just sounds mentally lazy to me. Mix in a little arrogance and a pessimistic attitude. Recipe for disaster. And it will be ALL YOUR FAULT since he's too lazy to figure out what happened.


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## wiigirl (Jun 14, 2012)

Thundarr said:


> What can you do with someone who's not willing to learn. He just sounds mentally lazy to me. Mix in a little arrogance and a pessimistic attitude. Recipe for disaster. And it will be ALL YOUR FAULT since he's too lazy to figure out what happened.


:iagree:


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## KathyBatesel (Apr 26, 2012)

Thundarr said:


> What can you do with someone who's not willing to learn. He just sounds mentally lazy to me. Mix in a little arrogance and a pessimistic attitude. Recipe for disaster. And it will be ALL YOUR FAULT since he's too lazy to figure out what happened.


Isn't this true of 99% of the population when we feel overwhelmed? This guy doesn't strike me as a bad guy. He strikes me as a little defensive and scared. He feels like he doesn't measure up, and wants to "prove himself." He's going about it in the wrong way, but he isn't able to be openly sensitive yet because it's scary for him.


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## jennifer1986 (Feb 4, 2012)

KathyBatesel said:


> when he sees you reading self-help books about marriage, he KNOWS that you're criticizing him and his performance in the marriage even though you may not have used any words to him at all. So he gets snarky and hopes you'll feel like it's a waste of time. That way, he won't see evidence that he's underperforming.


Yes, in accordance with this other book I read: _how to improve ur marriage without talking about it. _ (Just the title is enough to make me read it.) The male shame factor is a huge thing. 

Conciseness is definitely important. But now he's at the stage where he doesn't even want to hear ANYTHING. That's kind of a problem. I really want him to hear at least one thing out, that this* DISRESPECTFUL JUDGEMENTS* he's been doing to me all our life (and I was fighting with it before reading these books) does too much damage. I am not asking him to do anything positive before he stops the negatives. 

Trying to react with humor is a good strategy. I guess sometimes I just have no energy to employ that because I am so sick of his remarks. I have repeatedly told him we have similar IQ's (I'm sure mine is a tad higher), comparable educational backgrounds (lie, he has a master, I have a doctorate), blah blah blah....so he cannot be ALWAYS right and lecturing me. 

He just came in and asked if the kid can use leftover pizza to feed fish in the pond (we are on vacation)....sometimes I don't know if I should laugh or cry when I am so miserable and cannot answer a simple dumb question like that.

I am past the resentment stage....either I fix it or I leave. Thought I made that clear to him about 1/2 yr ago when I moved out for a short separation. He easily forgets.


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## Gaia (Apr 27, 2012)

If your to tired to use humor try telling him what he says is hurting you. He may come back with.... "well that isn't how it is" or something similar but try to explain that its how your taking it and you would appreciate if he tries a different approach. One that isn't going to be hurtful to you.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## KathyBatesel (Apr 26, 2012)

jennifer1986 said:


> Yes, in accordance with this other book I read: _how to improve ur marriage without talking about it. _ (Just the title is enough to make me read it.) The male shame factor is a huge thing.
> 
> Conciseness is definitely important. But now he's at the stage where he doesn't even want to hear ANYTHING. That's kind of a problem. I really want him to hear at least one thing out, that this* DISRESPECTFUL JUDGEMENTS* he's been doing to me all our life (and I was fighting with it before reading these books) does too much damage. I am not asking him to do anything positive before he stops the negatives.
> 
> ...


You said, "I am not asking him to do anything positive before he stops the negatives. " 

You'll sabotage yourself if you adopt this approach, methinks.

Major edits: His "disrespectul judgments" are only disrespectful in your mind. He thinks he's being clever, most likely. Could you view them as his "self-comforting" judgments instead?

Also, your use of humor is to disengage and not allow yourself to be affected by his immature response, while teaching him that it's ok to do what you want (in a way that he can accept, which means no discussion about it, no needling, no cajoling... just simple requests that he can respond to with easily achieved actions.)


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## GetTough (Jul 18, 2010)

Its' this simple. If he doesn't stop criticizing you, your marriage is over, either really or de facto. Sooner or later.


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## jennifer1986 (Feb 4, 2012)

KathyBatesel said:


> You said, "I am not asking him to do anything positive before he stops the negatives. "
> 
> You'll sabotage yourself if you adopt this approach, methinks.


There is a reason I have this approach. 

My h has a never-fail one line response when I gently, neutrally, nicely....ask him to be positive. 

He says "sorry I can never satisfy you (or be good enough for you)."

So I stick to the bare minimum because i think a human should at least have the decency to not hurt the spouse. That has nothing to do with "being good enough".

I have said quite a few times on this site that my h is the king of passive-aggressiveness......


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## jennifer1986 (Feb 4, 2012)

Gaia said:


> If your to tired to use humor try telling him what he says is hurting you. He may come back with.... "well that isn't how it is" or something similar but try to explain that its how your taking it and you would appreciate if he tries a different approach. One that isn't going to be hurtful to you.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I do tell him plainly when he hurts me now. Before, I would not say anything, because it would always be a no-win battle--he would turn the table and say he had no such intention. In other words, it was all MY problem. 

I was happy to see in all the books it's simple--it only matters how the receiving end feels, not otherwise. However, he does NOT get it. 

But I will continue to be clear on my end. If he keeps being stubborn, something else drastic has to happen.


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## rj700 (Jun 22, 2012)

> I am past the resentment stage....either I fix it or I leave. Thought I made that clear to him about 1/2 yr ago when I moved out for a short separation. He easily forgets.


So why did you move back in? How short was the separation? Ultimatums are only effective if you are willing to follow through. 



> but what can I do when he doesn't see there's a problem, and when I try to point out the problems he gets mad?


Does he get mad or does he get defensive? It's not necessarily that he doesn't see a problem, it's that he doesn't see himself as the problem. Or probably more importantly, he doesn't want to admit that he is part of the problem.


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## jennifer1986 (Feb 4, 2012)

rj700 said:


> So why did you move back in? How short was the separation? Ultimatums are only effective if you are willing to follow through.


Well, IMO, there is no such thing as ultimatums. I have always wanted to work my marriage out, and my motto is never give up, but I just simply could not take it anymore. I was not trying to make a show or threaten. I drew up the kid's schedule so I would be taking care of him 1/2 of the time. It lasted only 2 wks with my h making efforts to change his behavior. Besides, a clean quick separation is almost impossible since we work in the same office. It takes a while if we really divorce to sell the business, etc. 


> Does he get mad or does he get defensive? It's not necessarily that he doesn't see a problem, it's that he doesn't see himself as the problem. Or probably more importantly, he doesn't want to admit that he is part of the problem.


He does see there is a problem. But he does think it's my problem since he is doing ok (most of his demands are met). Therefore he has his famous line "I cannot satisfy you" or "I really want you to be happy but if you are so miserable here then we can go our own ways."


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## rj700 (Jun 22, 2012)

Sounds like you're in a box then. This probably won't help, but my replies to his famous lines would be:

"I'm not asking you to satisfy me, just stop criticizing me"
"You want me to be happy, then make an effort"

Yes, I know neither of those will fly and the 1st one is only a half truth as you do want him to satisfy you.


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## Ten_year_hubby (Jun 24, 2010)

jennifer1986 said:


> I am past the resentment stage....either I fix it or I leave.


Be real careful that you are not painting yourself into a corner her. Realistically, the only thing you can fix is yourself and although fixing yourself will certainly change your marriage, the result may not be exactly the "fixing" you had in mind. Likewise if you left and he was OK with it (and I would be) then you really don't have the club you think you have to threaten him with so you may end up losing more than you thought when you walk.

It sounds to me like you two trade disrespect aka emotional hurt. My wife tends towards this because that is what she learned from her family. I also let her suck me into it for the first decade of our marriage until I finally reoriented my thinking and wrestled myself out of it and became a proponent for change.

My first target was sarcasm along with eye rolling, muttering under the breath, shrugging, sighing, any and all that stuff. Maybe you can't do what I did being the woman and all, but I told my wife in direct incontrovertible language that I was unilaterally banning sarcasm and disrespectful body language from either of us. Whenever she is sarcastic, I call her out on it and directly state that I don't want to hear it and I want her to stop it. I don't ask for an apology, I don't argue, I just tell her I don't like it, I don't want it, it's hurtful and it's destructive and that both of us will benefit if our marriage improves and this is an improvement. Same for shrugging and sighing and all that. I'm on a hair trigger with this stuff and she knows it. I also invite her to let me know whenever I am sarcastic, I admit that I am wrong and I state my desire to improve and not do it.

Amazingly, this has been quite successful. Although she will argue that she is justified in her actions by something I have done, I just ignore her excuses. She has never argued that sarcasm is rightful. I have found that her disrespectful behaviors start small and escalate. By nipping them in the bud, the bigger, more destructive stuff happens far less frequently


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## Cosmos (May 4, 2012)

It sounds like you're putting a lot of energy into trying to learn his love language and keep him happy, and he's simply sitting back and waiting for it all to happen with little or no effort on his behalf. Time to pull the rug from under his feet, IMO, by concentrating more on yourself and what makes you happy. You H sounds way too complacent - and that can be a dangerous thing in a relationship.


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## jennifer1986 (Feb 4, 2012)

Ten_year_hubby said:


> Realistically, the only thing you can fix is yourself............... if you left and he was OK with it (and I would be) then you really odon't have the club you think you have to threaten him with so you may end up losing more than you thought when you walk.
> 
> It sounds to me like you two trade disrespect............ I'm on a hair trigger.............


It's hard to multiple quote on my iPad. 
(1) I definitely agree the only thing we can fix is ourselves. However, as described in _the Passionate marriage_, marriage is an ongoing process. We need to constantly grow and improve, but the SO has to also grow. We are supposed to make ourselves better, and that's what I'm trying to do. If the SO refuses to grow, then the couple will hit a critical point, which is where we r now. 
(2) I will lose a lot if I walk but it's a simple fact I cannot go on living a certain way. It's like Meryl Streep's line in Hope Springs: "sometimes I feel less lonely if I'm alone."
(3) I have definitely attacked him back in the past, but I would not say we trade disrespect. That's more his league. My weak areas are housework, complaint about work, losing patience with kids, etc. 
(4) If u can magnify ur wife's sarcasm 10 times u might understand how I feel. I know when women nag and show disrespect. But when my h does it, it's a very condescending, paternalistic way. It's enough to make me feel like running out of my home, screaming, and grabbing any man that just says anything nice to me after 10 yrs of the constant badgering.


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## KathyBatesel (Apr 26, 2012)

Things started to go wrong a long time ago when all this first started. His contribution was a demeaning remark, yours was acceptance of it. 

Obviously a change must take place - either the relationship status, or in one of the people. You can't change him. 

But to get to the kind of behavior that will foster changes in him, it will take the ability to put all the past hurts aside and treat the next one as if it is brand spanking new. Then do it again when another comes up. And again for the third. For the rest of your life. You're seeing a personality trait that he cannot change - when he feels vulnerable, it's his "go to" response and is so ingrained that he's not likely to be capable of learning another way at this point, especially when he still feels vulnerable. 

The question is, are *you* able to set aside all those hurts? The answer might honestly be "no," in which case, you guys are in trouble.


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## GetTough (Jul 18, 2010)

Sometimes I think that a huge number of people struggle their whole lives with defining just how they won't take crap from others, especially those closest to them. The reasons it's so tricky include (a) defining what's acceptable is very fuzzy and subjective (b) consequences of setting boundaries are short term pain for long term gain, and we know how much people tend to go for short term feel good.


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## jennifer1986 (Feb 4, 2012)

KathyBatesel said:


> The question is, are *you* able to set aside all those hurts? The answer might honestly be "no," in which case, you guys are in trouble.


I am operating under the belief I can set aside old stuff, o/w I would not even bother. Of course, hurt cannot just go away, but hope for a better future (boy I sound like the presidential candidate) prompted me to work on my marriage.

I tell my h this constantly, because I did scream and cry before, asking him to stop hurting me. So his other famous line is "my I've ruined 20 yrs of ur life". I am now calmly telling him it's his choice if he wants the next 20 yrs to be happy for both of us.


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