# Reconciliation- are my expectations unreasonable?



## Astonefeather (Jan 1, 2010)

My husband is trying to reconcile. He has made a huge effort, but I feel as though I've spoon fed him everything. I can't think of a single thing that he has done on his own. All of this would be fine if he would take it a step further and actually follow through on his promises.

I was led to believe that seeing a therapist on his own was something he was planning to do. So far he hasn't even made an appointment. He has emailed with the therapist, but simply cannot be bothered to call and just make an appointment. 

If you've read my previous thread you will know that there is a new baby involved and he is spending his weekends up here visiting. However, he spent his two days off last week cleaning out the refrigerator. He has tomorrow off of this week and still has no appointment set up. He has a lot of excuses, but still prioritized meaningless chores over following through with starting therapy.

The other big thing is that he still maintains friendships with women when he has promised that I would be his focus. The woman in question is a very nice girl, but I just can't share my husband with anyone right now if he expects to reconcile. He was visiting this past weekend and she was texting him and calling him. He replied in secret. I know from snooping now that their interactions were very minimal and harmless, but why did he reply at all much less in secret?!?! 

In this situation, I called the woman and explained that I left my husband over an emotional affair. I talked to her for an hour and she is now super clear on my feelings. I hold no ill will against her, but it was important that I assert myself. I have no reason to suffer in silence anymore. I needed her to know and my husband just won't be bothered.

Basically, I feel like I am over this marriage. Every time he screws up or doesn't follow through, I get upset. He will do a little piddly thing here or there and I will be happy. But instead of finding my happiness as an inspiration to keep trying, he gets complacent and just stops. I believe he genuinely wants me home, but he still doesn't want to work on our marriage. 

He agreed to child support. He agreed to pay on the first of the month. He didn't. Then when I called it into question, he voiced concerns that I will pocket his money.

He doesn't care that I am not asking for alimony, or for him to sell the house and give me half, etc. I just wanted him to support his child. I knew he wouldn't pay by the first because it just wasn't important enough for him to remember. So I say never mind. I don't want his money. I don't want to follow him around and demand he support his daughter. I would rather just have nothing to do with him than have him keep stringing me along.

Right now I am very hurt and very upset. When I see him in person I get my hopes up because I so desperately want to go home. But the more time that passes the more I feel like he's just stalling.

Maybe I'm asking too much?


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## The Cro-Magnon (Sep 30, 2012)

No, you're not, and you know you are not too.


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## SadandAngry (Aug 24, 2012)

Maybe you need to divorce him to wake him up. Maybe he won't wake up. For your daughter's sake though, it behooves you to take away his choice in the matter, if he will not follow through on his responsibilities.


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## Syrum (Feb 22, 2011)

Please don't disadvantage yourself and your daughter. The less income you have, the less money you will have to ensure your daughter quality of life.

Do not leave him with the house and not paying child support, the least he can do is financially support his child. Do not feel guilty about that that.


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## Paladin (Oct 15, 2011)

He should be willing to move mountains, eat broken glass, fight an alligator, basically anything and everything to show you that he cherishes the incredible gift you chose to bestow on him when you gave him a chance at R. The fact that you made this post obviously shows that he doesn't care. He just wants you to forget about it and move on. He needs a wakeup call, and a harsh one. DO NOT let him off the hook when it comes to financial support of you and your child. Actions have consequences, and maybe he is too much of a heartless troll to feel the pain of realizing what he did to you, but he certainly may feel the pain of having an empty wallet, and no loving, caring, understanding partner to go along with it. Give him the boot, and take him to the cleaners.


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## RWB (Feb 6, 2010)

Lawyer up.


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## survivorwife (May 15, 2012)

:iagree: With all of the above.

Another EA. *sigh* Just because it isn't the same woman as your first thread, it is the same character flaw of your H. The "knight in shining armor" Different woman. Same dance.

As to the financials, he should be paying child support. He is the child's father. Does he get to abdicate financial responsibility unto your family? Nope. Demand it. It doesn't matter what you do with the money, he has the obligation to support his child, not your parents and family.

You could try to wake him up by filing for divorce. Demanding child support, alimony, half of the marital assets, etc. When he begins to feel the "squeeze" then he might wake up. I said "might" because frankly I think he wants to skate by and have you do all the "heavy lifting".

I'm so sorry that he hasn't, on his own, seen the light. He is a father now. Time to grow up.


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## Mr Blunt (Jul 18, 2012)

*GIVE Ultimatums NOW!!!*


He has the choice as to which he wants. He can choose one of the two below:




> He should be willing to move mountains, eat broken glass, fight an alligator, basically anything and everything to show you that he cherishes the incredible gift you chose to bestow on him when you gave him a chance at R.
> 
> You could try to wake him up by filing for divorce. Demanding child support, alimony, half of the marital assets, etc. When he begins to feel the "squeeze" then he might wake up. I said "might" because frankly I think he wants to skate by and have you do all the "heavy lifting".
> 
> ...


Stop allowing this man to use you as a Yo Yo
He either should shyt or get the hell off the pot!
You have the power to make this man be a man or pay the consequences

*You and your child’s well being are being affected by this cop-out of a man. It is your responsibility to protect you and your child*

It will be hard, stand firm, get support from family, friends, church, and put a stop to him using you as a yo yo; take away his strings so that he can no longer string you along


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## The Middleman (Apr 30, 2012)

I followed your last thread and you put up with more crap from your husband than any woman should have had to. While I can understand that he might want some female companionship while you guys are separated, if he is truly serious about reconciling, he has to give that up and concentrate on you only. The fact that you called this woman speaks volumes about his seriousness. I think SadAndAngery gave the best answer here:



SadandAngry said:


> Maybe you need to divorce him to wake him up. Maybe he won't wake up. For your daughter's sake though, it behooves you to take away his choice in the matter, if he will not follow through on his responsibilities.


When you add in the money and the refusal to go for therapy, the decision is a no brainer ... lose him!


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## alte Dame (Aug 7, 2012)

I, too, followed your earlier thread and I have the idea that what's operating with the two of you is The Law of Conservation of Relationship Sense - you've got all of the good sense and he has absolutely none. This means that you will always be dragging him kicking and screaming to do the reasonable, adult thing. It looks like he's not having physical affairs, but he simply won't see that 'chatting' constantly with other women is not OK. You have to force the issue every time. He says 'sure,' I'll get counseling, but will only do it if you take him by the hand and set him in front of the therapist's door.

He's driving you crazy. Anyone can see that. If it were me, his Waterloo would have been the most recent texting relationship. I think when he's driven you just nuts enough, you'll reach that state of indifference that allows you to send him on his way. It doesn't sound like you're there yet, but if this keeps up, you will be soon.


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## Astonefeather (Jan 1, 2010)

I cannot file for divorce until we have been living separately for at least one full year in this state. I could file faster if I had undisputed proof of a physical affair, but I do not.

I don't think his emotional attachment to his friend was physical, but I have doubts just because the opportunity was there so many times. His "no contact" letter to her was pitiful and insincere and he saved her contact information on his second email account because even now he just can't let her go. I don't think that the woman who was trying to reach him all weekend meant any harm. I don't think my husband meant any harm either. He just doesn't think that he should have to make huge sacrifices right now when I can't guarantee him a reward for his efforts. He would rather reply in secret than have to drop contact with her or even explain that we are going through a very hard time and his wife needs his full attention. My husband has male friends, but it's only the woman who reach out to him. That's not his fault, but it is his fault for letting them.

I told him he has three options in moving forward. Option A is that he puts all his effort into trying to win me back. That he makes a HUGE effort to reflect on the past and work towards undoing the hurt that his actions caused during the past year. If he was willing to really REALLY try, then I would be willing to try my best to forgive. I offered to maybe join him in therapy and work towards being a family. I wanted to give the separation the full time and then get remarried as a gesture of a new beginning.

Option B would be that he tries, but doesn't do the tough stuff. I can appreciate his efforts and good intentions and we could be good friends one day but that I would be divorcing him.

Option C would be he does whatever he wants to and I distance myself and negotiate settlements through attorneys and I never speak to him again unless it involved our daughter and her needs.

I got upset recently because he started to take back his offer of going to counseling on his own. He didn't see the point if I wouldn't go with him. He is extremely willing to do what I ask of him if I do it too. He doesn't understand that I am trying to move on, but I was willing to let him catch up to me if he ran. I am still walking away and rather than running to catch up, he is sitting there waiting for me to turn around. I was willing to move home, to go to therapy with him, and to continue to work on our marriage but I needed him to really show me that he would do anything for the chance to win me back. 

While he was here, I thought he was really going to make a try for Option A. But when he prioritized cleaning the shelves in the refrigerator over making an appointment with the therapist, I knew he was really gunning for Option B. Now I think he's heading for Option C because he still just won't communicate. If his friend had been blowing up his phone all weekend and he had shared that with me, it wouldn't have been an issue. But rather than keep me in the loop about his contact with other women, he replied on the sly and tried to call her as soon as he was on the road back to North Carolina. I had told him from Day One that he was allowed to do whatever he wanted, but that I would grow to hate him if he just kept putting my feelings on the back burner and took care of his own desires. 

I was recently talking to a friend who is 3 months pregnant herself. I told her my story and she could completely relate even though she is more like my husband in terms of being social. She admitted that she wished her boyfriend would erase every woman he knows out of his phone. She trusts that he loves her, but a pregnant woman needs her man to treat her like she's the only woman on earth. I didn't get that. I went through a very emotional and fragile experience alone. I wanted to work on my marriage but I will not work backwards. I need to get on with my life. My husband feels like he shouldn't have to work on it alone, but right now it's his only option. Either win me back without me having to spell out every little detail, or move on yourself. But really, cleaning out the fridge took precedence over our marriage? 

I have since decided to drop off contact with him. I was sending him pictures of the baby throughout the day and telling him about her every smile and coo. But I don't owe him that. That was a gift I gave him because I can't help but feel sorry for him in his situation. I feel like I kicked a puppy. My husband is a good person, but he just isn't husband material. He's just a big kid and he still wants to pout about what feels fair to him. I paid my dues. I was in therapy alone for months going twice a week. I was going to attorneys, reading books, checking out forums, and trying to take care of my business. All alone. While pregnant. If he thinks that it isn't fair that he should take a turn doing the heavy lifting then that's totally his choice. I give up.


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## SadandAngry (Aug 24, 2012)

It's men like him that have made it so unfair in courts for men who were cheated on. Get the best lawyer possible and extract the best settlement you can out of him. If he doesn't want to be an adult, he shouldn't play at it by getting married, having sex, and having children.


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## alte Dame (Aug 7, 2012)

Fair enough. Now you have to follow through. I'm assuming the love is fading for you. If so, it will make the days ahead a bit easier.


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## survivorwife (May 15, 2012)

Astonefeather said:


> I don't think his emotional attachment to his friend was physical, but I have doubts just because the opportunity was there so many times. His "no contact" letter to her was pitiful and insincere and he saved her contact information on his second email account because even now he just can't let her go. I don't think that the woman who was trying to reach him all weekend *meant any harm.* I don't think my husband meant any harm either. He just doesn't think that he should have to make huge sacrifices right now when I can't guarantee him a reward for his efforts. He would rather reply in secret than have to drop contact with her or even explain that we are going through a very hard time and his wife needs his full attention. My husband has male friends, but it's only the woman who reach out to him. That's not his fault, but it is his fault for letting them.


Define "harm". After all, he is still a married man with a new daughter. As such, is he not "off limits" to all other women? Are you not supposed to be the only woman that matters in his life? Do these women take his attention away from you and your daughter? Do these women discuss you or your marriage with your H? Do these women have a desire to have a future "friendship" (or whatever) with your H. There is potential "harm" in any "friendship" with another woman and he is continually taking that risk.

Just trying to give you food for thought, my friend. You see, my stbxh saw "no harm" in his female friends. The ones that were not mutual friends of the family. The ones that he would contact secretly. The ones that he continues to be in contact with. The ones who offer "innocent" advise on our marriage based solely on his version of me, and not who I really am.

And yes, I completely relate to your comment about him not wanting to make the sacrifice. It's like he is saying that he has one foot out the door and will not turn back in, shut the door behind him and give you his full attention. He leaves it to you to do the work, to pull him in, to shut the door yourself, and to handle those other women "friends" of his, the ones he just can't help that are attracted to him. It's all your job. He is a narcissist.

Fortunately it appears that you do have your head on straight and you are headed in the direction of seeing to it that you are and your daughter are fine. You will be. I can tell. And, if it takes a year before you can act, at least you are in a place where you have support of family and friends.


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## survivorwife (May 15, 2012)

One more thing. And to answer your question which is the subject of this thread, namely "are my expectations unreasonable?"

No. You are not being unreasonable at all.


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## Astonefeather (Jan 1, 2010)

I married my husband knowing he had many female friends. I never really liked sharing him with other women, but it wasn't a deal breaker until this past year. I really only put one limitation on his freedom and that was no more slumber parties at her place. Especially when she was so obviously manipulating my husband into being her hero while excluding me from their friendship.

But moving forward I just can't abide him having female friends at all. And for whatever reason it's only the single women who reach out to him. I just don't trust my husband anymore and he isn't taking appropriate measures to earn my trust back.

He's mad that he feels that I'm pushing him to do things on my schedule. He is still trying the "wait and see" approach. I said that if he doesn't want to work on things right now then don't bother at all. He makes me feel like I'm being a jerk by demanding that he act RIGHT NOW if he intends to act at all. I am done waiting for him. I have no reason to work towards resolution anymore. 

Last night he started to make a huge gesture and drive up to discuss our latest upset regarding his contact with another female friend. I told him to just go home and he did. At the time I really meant it, I wanted him to go home. But it occurred to me later that if he really intended to follow through and drive up to see me he would have. He is so quick to take the easier path. He went home and went to bed and that was it. Nothing more. 

He hasn't sent me flowers, or a card, or child support, or an update on his therapy or anything at all. If he reads this posting and sends me flowers it will be status quo. He has no original thoughts on anything. He just does the bare minimum and only the things I have told him to do. Him driving up here in the middle of the night would have been the first and only huge gesture that he'd come up with on his own. But it was an empty gesture.


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## survivorwife (May 15, 2012)

Astonefeather said:


> I married my husband knowing he had many female friends. I never really liked sharing him with other women, but it wasn't a deal breaker until this past year. I really only put one limitation on his freedom and that was no more slumber parties at her place. Especially when she was so obviously manipulating my husband into being her hero while excluding me from their friendship.
> 
> But moving forward I just can't abide him having female friends at all. And for whatever reason it's only the single women who reach out to him. I just don't trust my husband anymore and he isn't taking appropriate measures to earn my trust back.
> 
> ...


I take it that you have directed him to this forum? If so, then he should be aware of the damage that an EA can cause a spouse.

Interesting that he is sometimes the "knight in shining armor" when another women requests his help, but seems to fall a bit short when his own wife is in need of some effort.

I hear ya. One would think that he would act on his own feelings of wanting to repair the marriage and do what he feels should be done instead of relying on you for direction. One would think he would do everything you requested PLUS special things just for you. I know this is hurting you. Apparently he does not. 

As to his anger that YOU are "pushing" HIM to help repair the marriage, sadly he seems focused only on himself. You, on the other hand are fine in that you are with your baby girl and the family that loves you and her. The clock is ticking. Either he wakes up and mends his ways on his own volition, or you will be a single mom. And a strong one. And certainly worthy of someone else who will love and cherish you.


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## Astonefeather (Jan 1, 2010)

I did direct him to this site during his paternity leave stay. We had a chance to really go over all the things that have been going wrong for years and work through a ton of issues. I really saw hope for the future. 

We had a good talk on the phone the other night. He's been doing a little work independently and that means a lot. I keep going back and forth about how I really feel towards him. I know we can at least be friends one day, but I really wanted him to try for more.

He will be here every weekend through Christmas. Then he will have to start staying elsewhere when he comes to visit. There is a current struggle regarding his father (my father-in-law) right now that is causing me stress. I am trying not to let my frustrations with my father-in-law affect my attitude towards my husband, but it's hard. My husband is trying to keep things calm, but in doing so has asked me to put my feelings on the back burner so that his father can have the opportunity to step up to the plate. Honestly, I don't think that my FIL is the type of man to ever reach out unless he wants something. I sincerely doubt that he will call me to talk. I'm sure I will end up waiting patiently and then being doubly upset when no call ever comes. 

Then I will turn to my husband and be hurt that I got set up to be let down for no reason at all. I recognize my husband is trying, but he's not really supporting me in the ways that I would need him to. 

There is just no reason to take an infant on a four hour road trip to see a recently purchased property that has no running water, electricity, furniture, etc. It might be overrun with rats and roaches for all we know. But to have a nice cup of coffee and hold his grandchild just isn't what he wants to do. So it's starting to sound as though he doesn't want to see my beautiful baby badly enough to give us an hour of his precious time at a more comfortable/convenient location. Either way, it's at least an hour in the car since he definitely won't drive to my home to meet her. He's just too busy and important for that. It's very hurtful. He hasn't called, sent a card or a gift, or even a text or email welcoming my daughter into the family. Nothing. Not a single thing. And yet, he's upset at us that driving across the state in the middle of winter to a potentially unsafe location isn't something we're eager to do.

That's off topic. But it's an example of how I need my husband's full support and I'm not getting it. He's trying, I know he is, but I'm just so torn.


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## Kasler (Jul 20, 2012)

Astonefeather said:


> I did direct him to this site during his paternity leave stay. We had a chance to really go over all the things that have been going wrong for years and work through a ton of issues. I really saw hope for the future.
> 
> We had a good talk on the phone the other night. He's been doing a little work independently and that means a lot. I keep going back and forth about how I really feel towards him. I know we can at least be friends one day, but I really wanted him to try for more.
> 
> ...


This is completely unacceptable, say no. My grandmother actually tried something like this. 

I was against, GF wanted to make a good impression though. 

Drove all the way out there to be ignored by her, and I nearly blew up several times. 

This is not crass, but if you're father in law wants to see a newborn, he should be the one coming down, not the other way around. A baby should be outside at a bare minimum in the winter as well.


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## Astonefeather (Jan 1, 2010)

I would be willing to drive the hour's long trip to where he will be staying for the night before heading off to see his property. My father in law will be flying in on Christmas Day and is eager to leave early on the 26th. He has three small children (ages 2-6) with his second wife and they will be in attendance. Christmas is a huge deal for my side of the family and I am not willing to travel anywhere on Christmas Day. 

Again, everyone is welcome to come to my parents' house anytime. And I am willing to drive to my husband's family an hour away anytime before or after Christmas Day. But it's extremely confusing and hurtful to not get a straight answer right away about them sticking around for an extra hour to meet the baby. My FIL argues that he would rather see family for more than just an hour and was pushing my husband to agree to drive across the state for a night or two. But it sounds like it's coming down to either my FIL gets his way or he won't wait an extra hour to meet his grandchild. 

Where I could use my husband's support in this would be for him to agree to my calling his FIL and setting boundaries. These boundary issues keep happening in silly and frustrating ways. I am not willing to sacrifice my baby's first Christmas with loving and supportive family to make my FIL's life easier. My efforts in the past to do things his way have been unappreciated. My grandfather recently passed away and my remaining grandmothers are 92 and 80 years in age. Again, Christmas is for family who actually shows they care. 

This is an example of my husband trying but still getting it wrong. I understand he wants to preserve his relationship with his father, but his asking me for favors about setting limits on my need to communicate boundaries is upsetting. I agreed to wait until Sunday before I assume his father isn't going to call me as promised. But the waiting is already driving me nuts and adds to the growing resentment I feel toward my husband. I am not sure why I agreed to put my needs on hold for him yet again. This is the sort of codependent crap I keep falling into.


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## Paladin (Oct 15, 2011)

Astonefeather said:


> ...
> I agreed to wait until Sunday before I assume his father isn't going to call me as promised. But the waiting is already driving me nuts and adds to the growing resentment I feel toward my husband. I am not sure why I agreed to put my needs on hold for him yet again. This is the sort of codependent crap I keep falling into.


Its ok to change your mind, tell your H that waiting is making you feel like (what you wrote her) and you no longer want to do it. Tell him that you need his support and want him to make sure that (things happen the way you feel they should) boundaries are set and enforced. It might make things uncomfortable for him/them, but at this point in time, that's ok.


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## Kasler (Jul 20, 2012)

Just say no. If you don't want to go, don't. as a grandfather he should be trying to make every effort to see his grand child if he really wanted to


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## Astonefeather (Jan 1, 2010)

I'm working on laying down boundaries before they are crossed. I think maybe that was part of the communication breakdown over the years. I am hoping that if I clearly lay out basic expectations in advance, then the consequences won't seem so shocking to him in the future. I know I tried this with the other woman stuff and he still acted shocked when I left him. I need to be clear and concise and then be willing to follow through the first time. I need to stop making excuses people by thinking "well, maybe I didn't make it clear."

My husband is trying really hard and I keep taking out things on him that are not his fault. My paternal grandfather recently passed away and my father is upset. My parents have a lot of tension in their marriage and it echoes a lot of the problems in my own relationship with my husband. This time of year is hard and I've given up breastfeeding so I could go back on antidepressants and aspirin for my headaches. There's just a lot of stress that is not my husband's fault, but I need to channel it better.

Anyway, I finally got a response from my father in law. He is willing to wait around for a few hours for us to bring the baby to meet him. There is a lot of stress involved with seeing my father in law, but I think if I can continue to be polite but firm about things it might be okay.


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