# Never wants to talk



## nikki4384 (May 9, 2008)

My BF and I have been together for 4 years now and have 2 kids. We have a ... decent relationship. You know good days, bad days, a little of both sometimes. But here's the problem. We do have a lot of fights over things that could be worked out. But he never wants to talk. The Problems that could be squashed by having a simple conversation or discussion continue to go on because he doesn't want to talk about it. Which of course then starts something else because it still needs to be talked about. So last night I tried to talk to him about some important stuff and all I got was i don't want to talk about it. So today I asked him " do you even want to be in this relationship anymore". it should have a simple yes or no answer, but I got " i don't know". And the crazy part about it is I don't know myself. I love him, but it just seems there is more bad days than good lately, and I just can't handle the stress anymore. What to do???


----------



## swedish (Mar 6, 2008)

I don't know probably means, yes on good days, no on bad days. You are probably feeling the same way. I agree, not talking through issues will only make things worse. Maybe you both need to just work on how you communicate with one another. If the current way makes you both feel defensive it will either make you more riled up or want to shut down altogether. You may realize that you both want the same things, but have different views on how to get there? There is an article in here on communication, which I thought had some good tips for handling difficult conversations...maybe take a look?
Talk About Marriage »Focused Topics »Articles » Defensive Behaviors in an ARGUMENT: by Jennine Estes, M.A., IMF


----------



## nikki4384 (May 9, 2008)

That article is good, thank you. He definatly is automatically defensive. All I have to do is ask a question like "what are you doing?" and Automatically I get " why you asking me allthese questions, your not my mama, i don't have to answer to you!" And it's hard for me to blame him because his family is about as disfunctional as they come. He was mainly raised by his grandma because his dad has been in jail his whole life and his mom is extremly unstable (mentally, emotionally, financially, etc...). I found out recently that's why he hasn't asked me to marry him yet, because everyone in his family that gets married gets divorced and hates eachother. But at the same time, I was raised that no matter what or where you come from, YOU make your own life. His mom now, sits there and makes excuses for his behavior with "well he never had a father figure, or anyone to teach him the right way" but at some point, to me, you have to take responsibility for your own life and make what you want out of it.


----------



## swedish (Mar 6, 2008)

I was raised more like you and agree with having to take responsibility for your own life. I also can see his mom's point that there are probably things your husband had to learn however he learned because of his dad being absent. My dad has a severe gambling addiction so I could be completely financially irresponsible myself based on what I learned growing up, but I decided that I never want to go months without electricity, hot water, food, clothes, the stress of creditors calling constantly so I started working at age 12 to buy my own clothes and have $ for hanging out with friends and worked ever since, never looked back. I think it has a lot to do with knowing what you want and being strong enough to work hard to get there on your own. I think in your case, it will be easier for you to change how you approach conversations then it will to expect him to react differently. If over the years he began to feel that you speak to him as if he were a child even the most innocent query at this point might make him feel that way. My husband has a difficult time answering hard questions involving what he was thinking when he had an emotional affair...why did he do it...why does he love me...etc. Sometimes I need to say...did you feel unappreciated at the time? and if he says yes, maybe a little...I would continue from there...but never get defensive or it would have shut down the lines of communication on the spot. We have come along way in being able to share with each other how we feel (we never argued in the past, we used to keep everything to ourselves which was just as damaging to the relationship)


----------



## nikki4384 (May 9, 2008)

I know that he has had a really hard life, and I feel for him, that is why I've put up with it for so long. And I've told him " Iknow you have potential to be great, you just have to figure out what it is that you want to do and do it" but it's like it falls on deaf ears. And his mom is really a bunch of the problem. She is basicaly trying to make up for not being there for him when he was little, so now she trys to do EVERYTHING for him. If we move she moves to the same place, she gives him money, cooks for him everyday, and basically treats him like the 5 year old she missed out on. Which has turned him into a 5 yr old again. I mean even on my birthday, she got me a card and signed his name because she knew he wouldn't remember. Which is nice, but she needs to let him handlehis own business, or he never will. And then at the same time she does all this for him, she tears him down like nothing I've ever seen before. Just last week, he came back from his mom's bawling. Because she had basically put him down and told him everybody, including me would be better off with out him. She has fought him, called the cops on him, stolen from him (used to be a crackhead, possibly still is), and even stabbed him when he was 14 (a BF of hers was beating on her and he jumped in to help her, so she cut him for trying to fight her BF). So basiclly I am trying to make something normal out of a VERY abnormal situation. Lord give me strength!!!


----------



## nikki4384 (May 9, 2008)

Ok so now I just talked to him, and I told him that until he can "decide" whether or not he wants to be with me I'm going to go to my mom's house. His response in good ole Jc fashion was " So, I don't care, bye *****, go on, you aint doing anything for me anyways." Which basically means he thinks I'm full of it and that I'm just trying to threaten him. So when I get home and I start packing stuff he'll cuss and yell and argue some more, tell me to get out and leaave, that he doesn't care about me, etc... and then when I start to take the kids to the car that's when it's really gonna hit the fan. He's gonna say something about "you can leave but your not taking my kids" and then he'll probably forcfully take the kids from me, knowing that I won't leave without them. So here is my question. By doing this is he "saying" that he wants to keep his kids or that he wants me to stay but is too pig headed to actually say that so he finds something that is going to MAKE me stay?


----------



## swedish (Mar 6, 2008)

If you have decided that he is lazy and will not change to better himself or his family (you and the kids) and are past the point of working on things, I wouldn't leave right this second (unless there is a concern that he will be violent) I would go home and be as normal and make the move when he isn't there (if he's at his mom's etc.) The last thing you want is for your kids to see and be in the middle of this. Taking them to your mom's will be a big adjustment for them knowing it's not just visiting grandma for a day, but moving out. I wouldn't do it lightly or without a solid plan that minimizes the disruption to them. If your bf raises his voice in the meantime, don't go there. Just quietly say "I really can't let our kids be in this type of atmosphere anymore so please keep your voice down if you want to talk"...Make a pact to yourself that the fighting is done and go from there...when he realizes he's getting no feedback, he will eventually back down...just stay strong and don't give in, no matter how irritated you get by something he says.

If in his eyes your role in this relationship is to 'do blah blah blah for him' what in the world is in this for you? If he says you aren't doing anything for him anyway, what exactly is he doing for you?


----------



## draconis (Oct 3, 2007)

nikki4384 said:


> Ok so now I just talked to him, and I told him that until he can "decide" whether or not he wants to be with me I'm going to go to my mom's house. His response in good ole Jc fashion was " So, I don't care, bye *****, go on, you aint doing anything for me anyways." Which basically means he thinks I'm full of it and that I'm just trying to threaten him. So when I get home and I start packing stuff he'll cuss and yell and argue some more, tell me to get out and leaave, that he doesn't care about me, etc... and then when I start to take the kids to the car that's when it's really gonna hit the fan. He's gonna say something about "you can leave but your not taking my kids" and then he'll probably forcfully take the kids from me, knowing that I won't leave without them. So here is my question. By doing this is he "saying" that he wants to keep his kids or that he wants me to stay but is too pig headed to actually say that so he finds something that is going to MAKE me stay?


Have the sheriff or local police escort you so there will be no trouble.

draconis


----------



## balsimon (May 10, 2008)

draconis said:


> Have the sheriff or local police escort you so there will be no trouble.
> 
> draconis


I agree with this if making this dramatic change is truly necessary (I'm _not_ saying it's not necessary), and if there's a reason that the move has to be made while the kids and boyfriend are in proximity. That's essentially giving him license to hold your kids hostage so as to control you.

Questions and comments for you to consider...

1 - Have you really played the cards in your hand fully and honestly?

2 - If so, and you have to move the kids, is there any reason you _want_ to make the move with them and your boyfriend where he can force his will upon you?

3 - Maybe this should have been my first question, but I'll ask it here: what is the legal status of the kids? Are they by both of you? Does he have a paternal claim?

4 - While it sounds like his mom is a significant source of difficulty, the responsibility is for him to "grow up." 

5 - When he said "I don't know," to your question about whether he wanted to stay together or not, I didn't get any ambiguity about what he meant. What I "heard" was "yes - as long as you do thing my way." You said he behaves like a 5 year old? The description you made of his behavior makes this seem an accurate assessment.

So - why do you want a relationship with a 5 year old? Is it because he's the father of your kids or some kind of dysfunction within you? (Note: I'm *not* saying that I'm right. I'm just asking - no judgment whatsoever. Sometimes we - _and God know I_ - can be blind to the nature of our own problems.)​
6 - Final question. And please understand that again - I'm not saying this idea is any good in your situation. I'm just asking, OK? Are there problems that you can just take action on without his input? For example, buying if you need a new stove, can you just go ahead an buy it? (Start with something smaller though if you can.) Then if/when he challenges you, the answer would be that you tried to talk with him but he shut you down. What would his reaction to such efforts be? Do you have any concern about him getting violent or would he just sulk? The latter is something that you can deal with. Violence is a different thing altogether.

I don't know you or him, and I'm not a marriage counselor - so all I can do is ask questions and hope they're somewhat helpful.

Sometimes one can really use a professional's help, though even professionals can prove problematic. The ultimate responsibility for your own life is - for good or not - your own. 

I hope things work out for you and your kids (and even for your boyfriend, though not at your expense).

Regards,
Bal


----------



## nikki4384 (May 9, 2008)

Well, thank you everybody for your input. I do have to say that the article that Swedish referred me to helped alot! After I got off, I had an hour's worth of traffic to sit and think about things and I re read the article and realized that Yes, he does have a communication problem, but that I am not helping it any either. I realized that it doesn't help him want to talk when I always start a convo with what he's not doing. And I admit I am at fault with that alot. I took alot of advice from that article and when I got home of course there was some tension, but instead of lashing out in a hurt and angry state, I stayed calm and after sending the kids to grandma's for the night, we had a very long, very good talk. We got alot of things sorted out (on both sides) and made some agreements (and semi written contracts of what will be routinly handled by each person) so that we will hopefully never be in this place again. We talked until about 2am and both went to bed happy. So I know that there are things that still need to be worked on, but for now all is good! Thank you again to everybody.


----------



## swedish (Mar 6, 2008)

I'm glad to hear things settled a bit on your end and you were able to have a good talk. The hard part is that life keeps going...work/kids/traffic/etc. and there will be more days where you feel at your wits end, so keep that conversation fresh in mind and know what type of communication will get you the results you are seeking. Take care.


----------



## TheHubby (Mar 20, 2008)

As a guy, usually most problems can be solved pretty simply. From my experince I always seem to here women tell me, "we need to talk" when mean are pretty simple & long discussions over something that is typically simple takes way too long. 

Usually after a 15 hour day, I sometimes feels like just walking in, sitting down & not saying a thing. Which usually ends with me walking in the house, grabbing the baby & hearing what she needs me to do before I can even make it to the couch or bathroom. 

How come a it is so hard to keep it short & to the point & make an effort to solve it swiftly. We could use the time wasted talking doing something better together.


----------



## balsimon (May 10, 2008)

TheHubby said:


> How come a it is so hard to keep
> it short & to the point & make an effort to solve it
> swiftly. We could use the time wasted talking doing
> something better together.


Guy to guy, TheHubby, the thing is that both of you
need to _want_ things to work out well for both of
you. If you view this as any kind of zero-sum-game,
where you lose if she wins or she loses if you win,
there simply will be no winners.

When you're not in a stressed out mode, talk to your
beloved and say, "Look - I really do want to talk about
the things that are important to you. But can we think
about how to do it so that it's not just as I come in
after a hard day and a hard commute? I just need a
little down-time so I can transition from work to
home."

If your wife is at all reasonable, she'll see the value
of this and you two can negotiate a better way of
communicating.

If she can't see the value in this, then the question I
would ask is this: you want me to care about your
feelings. Do you care at all about mine?

If the answer is "no," well, then you have a real
insight into your relationship. If the answer is yes,
then I'd just restate my case and add, "Now you just
said you valued my feelings... Can we please figure out
a better way and better times to talk?"

This isn't perfect, but it's how I would do it - how I
have done it in similar situations in my own marriage.

Of course, my wife is wonderfully reasonable, which is
one reason why I married her. But there's a heart-logic
and a mind-logic to this kind of thing. You just need
to figure it out in your marriage.

Best of results to you,

Regards,
Bal


----------

