# Question for those that cheated...



## highwood (Jan 12, 2012)

and cheated with someone who knew you were married.

I said to H..how could you have been attracted, etc. to someone who knew you were married and didn't seem to care..didn't that turn you off of them??

I don't get it..why wouldn't that have bothered you that OW knew you were married and didn't care???

I am just trying to understand the whole dynamic of infidelity.


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## sigma1299 (May 26, 2011)

There's no ration or reason in an affair. Trying to find logic in it is like pissing in the ocean to raise the tide. 

SHOULD it have bothered me? Sure - of course - it does now, but affairs are all about fantasy and ignoring reality. 

The dynamic is selfishness - total and complete selfishness.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

It was only after the A that I saw what a crap thing it was for OM to pursue me. In the thick of it, it didn't occur to me at all.


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## highwood (Jan 12, 2012)

Thanks for your responses! 

I know, maybe I am trying to over analyze what H did...I just want answers to everything. H has concluded that he was selfish and didn't think of the consequences of his actions.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

highwood said:


> H has concluded that he was selfish and didn't think of the consequences of his actions.


I can attest to that, too.


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## cantthinkstraight (May 6, 2012)

When I found out this past friday (a day before our 12th anniversary, mind you) 
that my wife had been carrying on
an affair with a soccer dad from my kids team, I asked
her what he said about her being married/accounted for.

He didn't care.

They DON'T care!

He's seen me at soccer practice, WITH my wife AND 2 kids...
yet he didn't care that he was helping tear down a family.

Why?

Because it was all about getting his d!ck wet and
being able to conquer someone else's wife.

Most OM see that as an accomplishment. 
No two ways around it.

I got mine, who cares about yours...


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## sigma1299 (May 26, 2011)

For me there was the additional dynamic that my AP was also married - so we were both guilty of the same thing. To have realized it in her would have meant facing it in myself - not something I was willing or able to do in the midst of it all.


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

Cheaters don't care about the morals of the people they cheat with. Its obvious that if they did, they would be able to find their AP.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LoveMyKids80 (Apr 24, 2012)

sigma1299 said:


> There's no ration or reason in an affair. Trying to find logic in it is like pissing in the ocean to raise the tide.
> 
> SHOULD it have bothered me? Sure - of course - it does now, but affairs are all about fantasy and ignoring reality.
> 
> The dynamic is selfishness - total and complete selfishness.


I agree with you. My STBXH was just plain selfish. Having 2 kids running around all the time and one of them living in our bedroom, he just felt there wasn't enough time for him. He felt neglected, so instead of talking to his wife about it, he chose infidelity. He tells me he just wants to be happy and smile...OH and to be able to have sex whenever, wherever he wants. If that isn't selfish, I don't know what is.

The whole idea of an affair is just like a new relationship....you get all giddy, butterflies in the stomach feeling, cute/sexual texts back and forth. But like all relationships, things fade and you're left with 'real life'. Then what do you have? Basically the same relationship you just previously ruined.


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## cantthinkstraight (May 6, 2012)

LoveMyKids80 said:


> The whole idea of an affair is just like a new relationship....you get all giddy, butterflies in the stomach feeling, cute/sexual texts back and forth. But like all relationships, things fade and you're left with 'real life'. Then what do you have? Basically the same relationship you just previously ruined.


Bingo was his name-O.


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## lovemylife26 (Mar 21, 2012)

Cheaters don't care at the moment, they live for the moment of having someone else touch them or care for them. They don't care anyone besides themselfs, they are getting their needs meet so why worry.
Instead of talking to your SO they look for love/sex in the wrong places. If they just took the time to talk to SO they would of know that they were hurting just as much.


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## blueskies30 (Jan 27, 2010)

I have a guy at my kids school who has pursued me asking me out right for sex. There was NO sexual talk from me at all to him and I was and never will be attracted to him. I told him, didn't you know I was married? He says yes. I said aren't you married? He said yes, I said what about your wife? He said of we are having problems. 

This man asked me for sex when my youngest baby was about 2-3 months old. She's is now almost 4yrs. The man has not given up, he asked again repeatedly, even following me to school when I was picking up my preschooler, only a few months ago. 

He's still married and I'm still married and he'd still like the chance, but he's never going it
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## BigLiam (May 2, 2012)

sigma1299 said:


> For me there was the additional dynamic that my AP was also married - so we were both guilty of the same thing. To have realized it in her would have meant facing it in myself - not something I was willing or able to do in the midst of it all.


Presumably, you have apologized to her BH, right?


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## johnnycomelately (Oct 30, 2010)

I think the truth is that most people looking for an affair would prefer a married person - at least they also have something to lose if it all comes out.


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## johnnycomelately (Oct 30, 2010)

blueskies30 said:


> I have a guy at my kids school who has pursued me asking me out right for sex. There was NO sexual talk from me at all to him and I was and never will be attracted to him. I told him, didn't you know I was married? He says yes. I said aren't you married? He said yes, I said what about your wife? He said of we are having problems.
> 
> This man asked me for sex when my youngest baby was about 2-3 months old. She's is now almost 4yrs. The man has not given up, he asked again repeatedly, even following me to school when I was picking up my preschooler, only a few months ago.
> 
> ...


Tell your husband.


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## sigma1299 (May 26, 2011)

BigLiam said:


> Presumably, you have apologized to her BH, right?


Well there's a long story as to why but no - to the best of my knowledge he has no idea it ever happened. I will point out here that it was an EA only so there is no risk of STD's that he should know about. Not ideal I know and I actually would like to apologize to him. My wife and I collectively agreed not to disclose it to him because we didn't want the drama in our marriage. We were working on us and just wanted the OW to go away - she had bunny boiler tendencies - we just wanted to be left alone so we left them alone.


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## ilgitano (Apr 2, 2012)

cantthinkstraight said:


> When I found out this past friday (a day before our 12th anniversary, mind you)
> that my wife had been carrying on
> an affair with a soccer dad from my kids team, I asked
> her what he said about her being married/accounted for.
> ...


I will say that's even worst than that... It's more like:"hey dude, i'm doing you wife behind your back and she's loving it"... they're actually proud of it


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## RWB (Feb 6, 2010)

HighW,

My wife serial cheated on me for years before I found out. In her last affair, she admitted to her OM3 that she had had an affair with her boss years ago. She "explained" that she new it had no future with him and she knew she was just another woman for him, but she was starved for affection. wtf


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## Fvstringpicker (Mar 11, 2012)

cantthinkstraight said:


> being able to conquer someone else's wife.
> 
> Most OM see that as an accomplishment.
> No two ways around it.
> ...


During my younger years, I was pretty much a serial cheater and ran around with several wives. I really didn't look at it like I was conquering someone's wife. Nor did I feel superior to the husband. The wives were simply available; if not to me, to someone else. I took advantage to what was being offered. They could have said no. Many did. You seem to blame the soccer dad for seducing your wife. In a lot of case the seduction is the other way around. In all my experiences, the women send out verbal and non-verbal messages they are may be available. And when approached, they let you know real quick. In the final analysis, your wife was primarily responsible for her choice that resulted in tearing down your family. It like my cousin, Judge "Andy" S. sez, "Don't tell me that Boy. Your friends didn't make you do anything."


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

johnnycomelately said:


> I think the truth is that most people looking for an affair would prefer a married person - at least they also have something to lose if it all comes out.


Or better put, they'll have each other to fastly hold on to when both of their married relationships ultimately heads South and disintegrates against the rocky shores of betrayal and divorce.


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## BigLiam (May 2, 2012)

sigma1299 said:


> Well there's a long story as to why but no - to the best of my knowledge he has no idea it ever happened. I will point out here that it was an EA only so there is no risk of STD's that he should know about. Not ideal I know and I actually would like to apologize to him. My wife and I collectively agreed not to disclose it to him because we didn't want the drama in our marriage. We were working on us and just wanted the OW to go away - she had bunny boiler tendencies - we just wanted to be left alone so we left them alone.


Don't you feel he has the right to know, though? You impacted his marriage, after all.
Guess I just do not understand this callousness.


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## sigma1299 (May 26, 2011)

He does have a right to know, I just don't believe it's my responsibility to be the one to tell him, especially when doing so would likely have further threatened my marriage. It's his wife's job to tell him but I doubt she's a big enough person to do so. It's not callousness on my part, it's the lesser of two evils. I compromised my marriage once, I'll not put it second again even if that means that he never learns of what happened.


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## BigLiam (May 2, 2012)

sigma1299 said:


> He does have a right to know, I just don't believe it's my responsibility to be the one to tell him, especially when doing so would likely have further threatened my marriage. It's his wife's job to tell him but I doubt she's a big enough person to do so. It's not callousness on my part, it's the lesser of two evils. I compromised my marriage once, I'll not put it second again even if that means that he never learns of what happened.


How could telling the BH hurt your marriage? You tell him and then bow out.
Sounds like a rationalization.


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## NatashaYurino (Jan 2, 2012)

cantthinkstraight said:


> When I found out this past friday (a day before our 12th anniversary, mind you)
> that my wife had been carrying on
> an affair with a soccer dad from my kids team, I asked
> her what he said about her being married/accounted for.
> ...


:iagree:
I believe a lot of women who go after married men feel the same way. They see it as the ultimate badge of honor. After all "he did risk loosing EVERYTHING he has with his wife and family, just to sleep with me. I guess that says a lot about how desireable I am!".


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## lisab0105 (Oct 26, 2011)

NatashaYurino said:


> :iagree:
> I believe a lot of women who go after married men feel the same way. They see it as the ultimate badge of honor. After all "he did risk loosing EVERYTHING he has with his wife and family, just to sleep with me. I guess that says a lot about how desireable I am!".


THATS EXACTLY IT! That is precisely how women think. It is horrible and insulting. But so true. 

They may not know you, but they want to "win" over you. It is the biggest ego boost to a woman when she gets a man who "belongs" to someone else.


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## BigLiam (May 2, 2012)

NatashaYurino said:


> :iagree:
> I believe a lot of women who go after married men feel the same way. They see it as the ultimate badge of honor. After all "he did risk loosing EVERYTHING he has with his wife and family, just to sleep with me. I guess that says a lot about how desireable I am!".


There are some seriously messed up people out there. I feelpeople like the OM and the fellow poster here with the history of committing adultery in his younger days, as well as trhe women you describe are really lacking in compassion and empathy.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

lisab0105 said:


> THATS EXACTLY IT! That is precisely how women think. It is horrible and insulting. But so true.
> 
> They may not know you, but they want to "win" over you. It is the biggest ego boost to a woman when she gets a man who "belongs" to someone else.



But it really doesn't detract from exactly how dirty and how hurting that that flawed logic is; regardless of whether it is a man or a woman.

They're greatly risking the breaking of their loved ones hearts all over a few moments or days of strange calculated sexual bliss. I would highly suspect that by the time of their ultimate betrayal, that their conscience has long since ceased to exist!


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

Fvstringpicker said:


> During my younger years, I was pretty much a serial cheater and ran around with several wives. I really didn't look at it like I was conquering someone's wife. Nor did I feel superior to the husband. The wives were simply available; if not to me, to someone else. I took advantage to what was being offered. They could have said no. Many did. You seem to blame the soccer dad for seducing your wife. In a lot of case the seduction is the other way around. In all my experiences, the women send out verbal and non-verbal messages they are may be available. And when approached, they let you know real quick. In the final analysis, your wife was primarily responsible for her choice that resulted in tearing down your family. It like my cousin, Judge "Andy" S. sez, "Don't tell me that Boy. Your friends didn't make you do anything."


I'm looking forward to the karma bus visiting you.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## BigLiam (May 2, 2012)

Fvstringpicker said:


> During my younger years, I was pretty much a serial cheater and ran around with several wives. I really didn't look at it like I was conquering someone's wife. Nor did I feel superior to the husband. The wives were simply available; if not to me, to someone else. I took advantage to what was being offered. They could have said no. Many did. You seem to blame the soccer dad for seducing your wife. In a lot of case the seduction is the other way around. In all my experiences, the women send out verbal and non-verbal messages they are may be available. And when approached, they let you know real quick. In the final analysis, your wife was primarily responsible for her choice that resulted in tearing down your family. It like my cousin, Judge "Andy" S. sez, "Don't tell me that Boy. Your friends didn't make you do anything."


The affair partner is also committing adultery and has participated in hurting others. The WS and the OM/OW are co-conspirators, equally involved in this victimization.


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## Fvstringpicker (Mar 11, 2012)

Shaggy said:


> I'm looking forward to the karma bus visiting you.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I've ridden the karma bus. I am very regretful for my actions. I was playing a losing hand. You get caught up and addicted to such behavior, trying to prove something you never can and fill holes in your life you can never fill. There is not a day that goes by I don't wished I hadn't have done the things I've done.


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## Fvstringpicker (Mar 11, 2012)

BigLiam said:


> The affair partner is also committing adultery and has participated in hurting others. The WS and the OM/OW are co-conspirators, equally involved in this victimization.


I agree to a great extent. My point is the WS is always a willing participate and often the instigator. The business of going over and beating up on the OM/W is foolish. If it wasn't them, it would likely be someone else. If the WS wasn't primed for an affair, it wouldn't happen. In the case of cheating wives, men normally don't go after women who will likely reject them. This gals have sent out signals they are interested. I don't think cantthinkstraight wife was drugged or hypnotized. The soccer dad didn't care if she were married. They didn't think they'd get caught. Out of 20 men, I expect half or better with play with a married woman if given the chance.


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## BigLiam (May 2, 2012)

Nor were you. So , where was your conscience? Many of us are hit on by married women , yet do not respond. What distinguishes you? 
I have heard the "no duty owed" rational. But, it makes no sense to me. We all owe one another a duty of care IMO. It is the "golden rule."
I have no explicit agreement with others not to hurt them. Yet, I do have such a duty, implicitly and morally. 
I could have easily beaten up the other man, I am pretty sure. I had the urge to.
But, my XW was already getting enough ego strokes and seeing men fight over her would have fed her huge ego even more.


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## LoveMouse (Apr 22, 2012)

I had an old GF contact me, she asked me to come and see her a bunch of times.....we all know where that's going....her H worked during the day so it would have been easy but I am not like that, let her find another schmuck to help her cross that line! We all have to be responcible for ourselves.
Mouse


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## Just Tired Of It All (Oct 22, 2011)

ilgitano said:


> I will say that's even worst than that... It's more like:"hey dude, i'm doing you wife behind your back and she's loving it"... they're actually proud of it


OK OK... if I looked over all the replies to quickly and messed the answer to this I aplogize in advance.

NOW.. for the question that is bothering me, and which applies to my situation.. 

So from what I have read, this seems to sum it up for the men, well most anyway.. If there married, well then they just added another notch to there belt loop so to speak.. Am I pretty accuruate on this statment? This is what I think of my husband anyways, he had other women before I meet and married him.. Me I didnt.. I dated of course, but I never had sex with any of them. Its not because I couldn't I think we have already determined that if a women is seeing a guy and then if she --for most-- wants it to go to that level it would be pretty easy.. I chose not to.. I didnt want to be that type. I wanted to only be with one guy, give him the special part of me no one other than him has ever had... Still to this day I have not, just my H.. 

I thout it meant somthing, maybe I was wrong... Because after ----- 20++++ years he went and pretty much threw what I felt was special away, when he.. (although he claims it never went sexual not even kissing, trust me i asked alot and OW claims the same go figure right!!) became way to close to another female I felt Like I had been tainted!! (I still feel it went sexual I will always beleive that, I just can not beleive a man would become so close to another women and risk everything just for emotinal connection-- and loose his wife for it sorry just my opnion) Yes I know it sound exagerated but it does feel that way to me.. Just because He had others before me, well after he meet me then that was history. Somthing I accepted along time ago, as far as I was concerned once he meet me, his past didnt have an equation into us... he started a new life with me, and I gave him the part of me I held dear so that it would be a life long exclusive connection that I had not ever experienced or shared with another. Yes to me, that is what it was about. 

I have remained in the relationship with him.. trying to R.. but somtimes it just feels like I lost that connection and I do feel like he debased what I thout was special about our marriage the whole point of me saving myself.. I do feel tainted.... 


But the question after my rambling, sorry feel free to post your opnions on the rambling above ... 

Ok, so what is it with the women.. when the women Know that the man is married.... it is said that men can compartmentalize there emotions from sex, But for women sex enhances there emotions to the man.. its not a notch on there belt loop, it is more a deeper like a relationship to women.. and when they Know the man is married and goes home to his wife, then why do they not only get into the whole mess but try to stay in it.. It has to bother them for the man to go home and stay at night in his wifes bed and be living a life with the wife a kids and NOT IN SECRET.. they cant contact them while they are with there wife and kids.. And I know that for long times he couldnt contact her, I do know at times when one of these long time frames past were he couldnt contact her she would be upset about it.. But yet she still held on to her relationship to a marry man knowing full well she was his hidden little dirty secret....

She would never be introduced to his children, which are an important part of his life, never be "OUT" in public or family functions were his family "meaning his kids" would be.. If he did go out in public, and he had been caught or seen "not by our kids", he would run away from her like he did not KNOW her like she had the plage, yes it happened.. Sometimes they had been seen an he couldnt run away from her so not to be caught in time, and he would say she is a freind.. I dont Know how many women could live like that, being shunned by her so called man if anyone was to ever see them out or being called JUST a freind.. 

And she isnt married, so she had nothing to loose.. HE is the one who had somthing to loose which he tried very hard not to.. How can women be OK with being treated well like I said-- A dirty little secrect-- Knowing they will not be accepted as the women in his life.. And she Knew, many people made it clear that she would never be around his kids freinds or not.. To be honest our kids are older and they made it clear, its kinda hard well almost impossible to hide " Dads little secret" when your kids are old enough to drive or move out on there own to be honest..

They had came face to face to her at one point, I luckly wasnt around, but as for what I was told it was not a very nice situation.. It came down to the point of them ALMOST ripping into her, I am thankful that did not occur.. I had a talk with them after this, and I asked them to not lower themselves to her... They should never be violent with anyone, its not worth it....There is no sense in them taking the chance or getting in trouble they are young and have a great future ahead of themselves and I wont allow her or the situation to tarnish them to.... but my point to this LONG POST is.. AP are most likley, or in my case very aware of how they are veiwed or accepted.. 

So why do women resign themselves to such fate or be Trivialized. I get it if they are not aware of the mans marital statues or his family situation.. But what about those who do? What goes on in there little minds that they would lower themselves to such treatment I mean if you take your dog out to play you are at least proud to tell people hey this is my dog.. Seems to me they would at least want to be treated better than a dog.. 


Sorry for the long post, but once I get started well the subject of A, just brings out so much thouts and somtimes It just is a stress releiver to poor it out.. Better than holding it all in to the point you feel like your going to loose it... Thank you all for being patient and reading my Rambling.. But to be honest, it is how I feel and all reply/opnions/thoughts/ or just a yeah I know the feeling reply is always welcomed and appreciated... Ok time for me to stop pouring it all out at once......ok time for me to go back to reading the forum.. such good advice do you all give. dont know what I would done/do without all you fine people...:smthumbup:


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## Just Tired Of It All (Oct 22, 2011)

UMMM WOW, that post is longer than I even realized.. Sorry folks.. guess I had more to pour out than I even noticed... Dang does the subject of Affairs get me going... thats probley my longest post ever.. Touchy subject I guess for me.. 

The lenght of the post even amazed me I just started typing an it poured out like turning on the water faucet.. Sorry if it tooooooo Long.. oooppppssssss wow


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## Fvstringpicker (Mar 11, 2012)

BigLiam said:


> Nor were you. So , where was your conscience? Many of us are hit on by married women , yet do not respond. What distinguishes you?.


I rationalized my behavior. At the time I viewed it as, "she's going to sleep with somebody. It may as well be me." I also believed, and to some extent still do, that if a woman cheats, she has basically lost all interest in the man she married so she was married in name only. I can't take it back and don't recommend it. It's a nasty business. Like many things, you don't realize the ramifications until until after you've done the deed. Worst of all, I committed a sin against God.


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## oaksthorne (Mar 4, 2011)

sigma1299 said:


> He does have a right to know, I just don't believe it's my responsibility to be the one to tell him, especially when doing so would likely have further threatened my marriage. It's his wife's job to tell him but I doubt she's a big enough person to do so. It's not callousness on my part, it's the lesser of two evils. I compromised my marriage once, I'll not put it second again even if that means that he never learns of what happened.


Sometimes that is the way the cards are dealt. My H's OWH was a gun freak and I didn't need him stalking my H while we were trying to work things out. Once I knew more about him I felt safe in insisting the his WW inform him or I would. They are now working on their issues according to her. He has done the drive by viewing of my H to size him up, but he is a pretty nice guy from what I can tell. He surely didn't deserve the sh!t sandwich she gave him.


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## sigma1299 (May 26, 2011)

BigLiam said:


> How could telling the BH hurt your marriage? You tell him and then bow out.
> Sounds like a rationalization.


It wasn't him we were ever worried about, it was her. Like I said she went quasi bunny boiler as it was. We were both convinced that if her marriage feel apart she was going to come after me (not physically but to destroy my marriage so I would end up with her) and make our lives hell. We had settled down, our reconciliation was going well - it wasn't worth the risk. I clearly don't feel the same depth of obligation to a stranger that you do, but regardless I feel more obligation to my wife than him. 

I know exposure is a common tactic here, and if the affair can't be busted it's a very effective tool to that end. However, I am personally more of the position that someone else's private life is not my business. Yes I was involved in his marriage but I never touched his wife and I removed myself after less than 8 weeks. 

OP, it was never "another notch in my belt" for me. I can't speak for others but that wasn't the case at all for me.


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## BigLiam (May 2, 2012)

I really don't think there is a bit of difference between men and women in this cheating arena. Some men seek some sort of emotional bond, others do not. Same for women.
The common denominator is a lack of empathy and incredible selfishness.


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## sigma1299 (May 26, 2011)

BigLiam said:


> I really don't think there is a bit of difference between men and women in this cheating arena. Some men seek some sort of emotional bond, others do not. Same for women.
> The common denominator is a lack of empathy and incredible selfishness.


Agree completely!!! :iagree::iagree:


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## highwood (Jan 12, 2012)

lisab0105 said:


> THATS EXACTLY IT! That is precisely how women think. It is horrible and insulting. But so true.
> 
> They may not know you, but they want to "win" over you. It is the biggest ego boost to a woman when she gets a man who "belongs" to someone else.


Exactly..I have wondered that! I think for H's EA it was probably a thrill for her to know that he was still communicating with her behind his wife's back, made her feel like she was the greatest thing.

...as well as she was in Singapore and we are in Canada..the ***** knew that it wasn't so easy for me to show up on her doorstep. So she knew she was safe from any confrontations with me. Gutless *****!


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## courseplotter (May 8, 2012)

I cheated because I wanted to. There's really no other reason.

At the time I was married to a somewhat functional Borderline, the marriage was sexless and I had completely checked out due to various things. I turned inward to myself and did what I wanted.

So, I met a girl at work, we fell head over heels for each other and began an EA which turned into a PA. She was married and so was I. We had both reached the end of our emotional ropes.

So, no, being married didn't affect me or her. My state of mind at the time, and hers, was whacked, operating outside of character for both of us. We both regret the affair and wish we had chosen to end things on our respective sides the right way, then gotten together.

We've been married for several years now. Probably one of the few times an affair became a successful marriage.


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## Fvstringpicker (Mar 11, 2012)

courseplotter said:


> My state of mind at the time, and hers, was whacked, operating outside of character for both of us.


Oftentimes the WS is driven to seek confort outside the marriage because the so called "victim" has made the life of the now cheating spouse a hell on earth. If you treat your spouse poorly for long enough, who knows what they'll do when another man/woman comes along that treats them better. I guess my question is are you happier and better off now than when you were when married to the ice queen? If the answer is yes, as far as I'm concerned, you did the right thing, albeit you could have done it better.


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## courseplotter (May 8, 2012)

You nailed it. Especially in cases like this, the BS never understands (most likely because they can't or won't).

But that won't be a very popular opinion around here.


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## NatashaYurino (Jan 2, 2012)

arbitrator said:


> But it really doesn't detract from exactly how dirty and how hurting that that flawed logic is; regardless of whether it is a man or a woman.
> 
> They're greatly risking the breaking of their loved ones hearts all over a few moments or days of strange calculated sexual bliss. I would highly suspect that by the time of their ultimate betrayal, that their conscience has long since ceased to exist!


:iagree:


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## BigLiam (May 2, 2012)

Fvstringpicker said:


> Oftentimes the WS is driven to seek confort outside the marriage because the so called "victim" has made the life of the now cheating spouse a hell on earth. If you treat your spouse poorly for long enough, who knows what they'll do when another man/woman comes along that treats them better. I guess my question is are you happier and better off now than when you were when married to the ice queen? If the answer is yes, as far as I'm concerned, you did the right thing, albeit you could have done it better.


I doubt this is as frequent as you claim or is claimed by the cheater. Typically, from what I have read, it is the cheating spouse that is the main contributor to marital dischord.


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## Fvstringpicker (Mar 11, 2012)

I'm not giving a percentage. I know there are any number of reasons people cheat. Speaking from a male perspective, when a wife is a constant nag, complainer, blaming and belittling her husband, coupled with little/no sex, it ain't gonna be long before the ole boy is checking out the azzez of other females. When the opportunity presents itself, you know what's likely to happen. ( and I not referring to ordinary problems that occur in all marriages)


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## NatashaYurino (Jan 2, 2012)

Fvstringpicker said:


> I'm not giving a percentage. I know there are any number of reasons people cheat. Speaking from a male perspective, when a wife is a constant nag, complainer, blaming and belittling her husband, coupled with little/no sex, it ain't gonna be long before the ole boy is checking out the azzez of other females. When the opportunity presents itself, you know what's likely to happen. ( and I not referring to ordinary problems that occur in all marriages)


I see what you mean. Despite the fact I still don't believe it makes it okay when this husband cheats. But the same can be said about a lot of women. When their husbands begin to treat them more like mothers and servants/housekeepers and all of the sudden they comes across a man who sees them as women/sexual beings instead of someone who is only good to wash and cook, she might eventually feel attracted to him, because he gave her an ego massage. Not saying it makes it right for them to cheat, but just like with men, it sure pushes them a lot closer to doing the deed.


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## cantthinkstraight (May 6, 2012)

Fvstringpicker said:


> You seem to blame the soccer dad for seducing your wife. In a lot of case the seduction is the other way around.


Uh, NO. I don't... 

I blame my wife more than *anyone* in this.

I blame him for disrespecting my kids and family, as he knew them from seeing them at practice.
I blame him for pursuing a married woman, as those with
morals usually don't go around doing that. He can't help it,
he's a pig and a dooshbag. I get it....

Ultimately it was my wife who was lying to me. Not him.
I wasn't in a relationship with HIM for 17 years.

Read and then re-read my thread before assuming such silly things, please.


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## cantthinkstraight (May 6, 2012)

NatashaYurino said:


> I see what you mean. Despite the fact I still don't believe it makes it okay when this husband cheats. But the same can be said about a lot of women. When their husbands begin to treat them more like mothers and servants/housekeepers and all of the sudden they comes across a man who sees them as women/sexual beings instead of someone who is only good to wash and cook, she might eventually feel attracted to him, because he gave her an ego massage. Not saying it makes it right for them to cheat, but just like with men, it sure pushes them a lot closer to doing the deed.


Then there's my case, where she had everything she
wanted and still did what she did.

I've never expected anything from her but love and honesty.

Turns out she a great liar, doesn't know how to love.

Go figure.


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## TorontoBoyWest (May 1, 2012)

blueskies30 said:


> I have a guy at my kids school who has pursued me asking me out right for sex. There was NO sexual talk from me at all to him and I was and never will be attracted to him. I told him, didn't you know I was married? He says yes. I said aren't you married? He said yes, I said what about your wife? He said of we are having problems.
> 
> This man asked me for sex when my youngest baby was about 2-3 months old. She's is now almost 4yrs. The man has not given up, he asked again repeatedly, even following me to school when I was picking up my preschooler, only a few months ago.
> 
> ...


This is stalking is it not?

R/O time.


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## oaksthorne (Mar 4, 2011)

BigLiam said:


> I doubt this is as frequent as you claim or is claimed by the cheater. Typically, from what I have read, it is the cheating spouse that is the main contributor to marital dischord.




This was my experience. I thought we had a wonderful marriage. Then he started distancing and being "at work" , or" at the gym" a lot. He rewrote our relationship so he could feel better about his A with the OW. Her H was a mean insensitive beast too, just like me. The BS's faults, real or imagined were blown out of proportion so they could do what they wanted and feel justified.They cried on each other shoulders about how unfulfilled they were. Now he would do anything to take it back, he wishes that he had never met her ( according to him), but he can't take it back and we will never be the same.


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## courseplotter (May 8, 2012)

oaksthorne said:


> Your post reads like the self justification of any garden variety cheater. It is always the victim's fault that the cheater is a skank. This is nothing new.


And this reads like the comments of a garden variety BS.

Does the BS have any responsibility for the success of the marriage or is the WS cheating the perfect excuse to not take any of that responsibility?


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## NatashaYurino (Jan 2, 2012)

cantthinkstraight said:


> Then there's my case, where she had everything she
> wanted and still did what she did.
> 
> I've never expected anything from her but love and honesty.
> ...


That's true. Some people (males AND females) will cheat on you even if they couldn't be happier with the life they have. Like you said "go figure"?!:scratchhead:


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## BigLiam (May 2, 2012)

NatashaYurino said:


> I see what you mean. Despite the fact I still don't believe it makes it okay when this husband cheats. But the same can be said about a lot of women. When their husbands begin to treat them more like mothers and servants/housekeepers and all of the sudden they comes across a man who sees them as women/sexual beings instead of someone who is only good to wash and cook, she might eventually feel attracted to him, because he gave her an ego massage. Not saying it makes it right for them to cheat, but just like with men, it sure pushes them a lot closer to doing the deed.


Yeah, but the problm is that in most cases the cheating spouse is lying about his BS's deficiencies to justify the cheating.
One study I read about found that in the vast majority of cases, the cheater was the main contributor to the pre-affair problems, despite their claims to the contrary.
Makes sense, don't you think? After all , a cheater has already demonstrated a lack of integrity, poor communications skils, lack of compassion and empathy, as well as poor problem solving abilities.
Think someone with those deficiencies was the ideal spouse?


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

I am a BS arriving late to this conversation and I'm probably just repeating stuff that others have said.

I would say that the fact that my husband and the AP were married was what drew them together.

He complained to her about me; she complained about her loveless marriage to him. They bonded over their shared experiences. (Sure, lots of rewriting of marital history going on, but who are we to quibble with the love of true soulmates.)

She was safe because she was married and never going to leave her spouse. This allowed him the freedom of the classic cake-eater. I did his laundry, made dinner, and took 90% care of his beloved children; she listened without ever criticizing, idolized him for a while, and was filled with endless affirmations, whether deserved, or not so deserved.

So that is my basic theory (I expect someone else also came up with this one, sorry I didn't get a chance to read all the posts). They bonded over their commonalities in their married lives. His marriage had hit a bumpy patch-stressful job, lots of travel, tiny children, exhausted b*tchy wife. Her husband married her for love, but she married him for status and to please her parents, and was apparently never in love with him (poor guy!!). And I think that is fairly typical, for two married affair partners. Except the part about her not marrying for love :rofl: (selfish you-know-what that she is!)

----------------

However, when an unmarried woman is drawn into an affair with a married man, IMO something very different is going on.

I personally believe that women are drawn to men that are capable of commitment, including being decent fathers.

I know this is counter-intuitive and makes no sense to be drawn to someone who is TAKEN.

A married dad is a proven commodity. He has publicly demonstrated that he will walk down the aisle with someone, he can impregnate someone, and he will stick around after the baby is born. He subconsciously represents the core of what calls a woman biologically.

Single guys--well, it's anyone's guess what direction they'll go. Maybe they'll marry you after they bed you. Or, maybe they won't. Maybe they'll cry with joy when you say you're having their baby. Or maybe they'll blanche and head for the hills.

Just my pet theory. Obviously, this wouldn't rise to a woman's conscious level the vast majority of the time.


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## NatashaYurino (Jan 2, 2012)

BigLiam said:


> Yeah, but the problm is that in most cases the cheating spouse is lying about his BS's deficiencies to justify the cheating.
> One study I read about found that in the vast majority of cases, the cheater was the main contributor to the pre-affair problems, despite their claims to the contrary.
> Makes sense, don't you think? After all , a cheater has already demonstrated a lack of integrity, poor communications skils, lack of compassion and empathy, as well as poor problem solving abilities.
> Think someone with those deficiencies was the ideal spouse?


Oh, there is NO doubt in my mind that many times the cheating spouse IS indeed lying about their SO. I bet their lovers (male and females) hear all kinds of horror stories about the CS's home life that simply isn't true. 

Women painting these terrible images of their husbands being cold, aggressive, unattentive. And the classic one "he doesn't have time for me", when in fact the guy might not have time because he is killing himself at work to provide for his family. 

On the other hand I can only wonder what kind of stories prostitutes and strippers hear from some of their clients, "oh my wife only cares for my money", "she nags all the time", "I am living in a sexless marriage". I mean, not doubt some men are dealing with this kind of women, but many (and I mean many) are just lying to the OW. 

It makes them (cheating spouse) feel better about what they are doing, plus they get more sympathy(spelling?) from the OM/OW.


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## BigLiam (May 2, 2012)

NatashaYurino said:


> Oh, there is NO doubt in my mind that many times the cheating spouse IS indeed lying about their SO. I bet their lovers (male and females) hear all kinds of horror stories about the CS's home life that simply isn't true.
> 
> Women painting these terrible images of their husbands being cold, aggressive, unattentive. And the classic one "he doesn't have time for me", when in fact the guy might not have time because he is killing himself at work to provide for his family.
> 
> ...


Yes. and let's not forget about the women visiting male prostitutes, either. Remember Fred Garvin, Garrett Morris's "best boy in my stable"?


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## Ben Connedfussed (May 4, 2012)

iheartlife said:


> I am a BS arriving late to this conversation and I'm probably just repeating stuff that others have said.
> 
> I would say that the fact that my husband and the AP were married was what drew them together.
> 
> ...


This situation develops when the spouse is not honest and attempts to deal with his/her problems at home. I personally believe that spouses find the OP just to reek and rave the disappointments. As the relationship with the OP forms, they find comfort, understanding, and a mutual standing... (falsely) to have the reason in their minds that what they suffer is real, only to have sex with someone they have no resentment or 'troubling' with. Couples should deal with their relationships and if not 'satisfied' then end it. Do not use a side line affair to end the marriage. Be honest! Do not find comfort in the arms of a ... The money would and should be much more well spent in counseling! An excuse... another form of 'have my cake and eat it too' so to speak. It make may sense, or it may not (what I say) but my perspective is I stand firm with the 'I do' not the "I did someone else while I am suppose to be with YOU" I think it is rather hard to say, to admit and then walk away. The fact is that 'sharing and then bearing' is much more harder on the innocent spouse than 'bearing the loss.' Some folks are such creeps. My motto here states... Honesty is the best policy, because I would not like to be the person that Wants Their Cake And Eat It Too. Herein is a truth... Honesty is the best policy!


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## Ben Connedfussed (May 4, 2012)

I agree with BigLiam about this matter. The unfaithful spouse is the 'one' who just lets things lie or go... No caring! This creates the atmosphere to 'easier blame the innocent spouse' for all the problems and discord in the relationship thus saying, "It is you, not me who has the problem here!" Another 'psych me out game' to place the blame in an inappropriate place. Hear this... "No one will bomb their own Country!"


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## NatashaYurino (Jan 2, 2012)

BigLiam said:


> Yes. and let's not forget about the women visiting male prostitutes, either. Remember Fred Garvin, Garrett Morris's "best boy in my stable"?


Yes Liam, I know that women use those types of services too (like having sex with male strippers). I was just using examples that we see and hear about a lot. What I said goes to both genders, just in case someone may have thought I was talking about men only.


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

After talking about this very subject with my W and reviewing the spread sheats I created for a years worth of cell phone useage. In W case it seems like she used OM's more then any thing.

In what I mean is W would have flings and as W continued to remind OM's that she was married the OM realized that it wasn't what they were looking for after all. The sex was on the run but after that there was no meeting W kids and family. There was no meeting OM family. There was no going out in the light of day, and it was W terms or no terms at all.

On the spread sheet the OM's cell # appeared for just a few weeks in general and would never come up again, typical of a ONS the # would appaer for just a week. It was rare to see a OM cell # come up for a month at a time but it did happen and that same # would stop appaering but would appaer later in the year.

So from what I gathered her 2nd life was filled with bandaids she found and pealed off when they would get to close or wanted more. Her rational is way get serious with a guy that would be with a married women. Believe it or not there are a few guy that walked away mabey two out of twenty. But for the most part OM new the score, but a few wanted more but couldn't.

The point is everycase is different and understanding infidelity could take a life time to achieve, with all the variables involved.


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## slater (Feb 3, 2012)

BigLiam said:


> Yeah, but the problm is that in most cases the cheating spouse is lying about his BS's deficiencies to justify the cheating.
> One study I read about found that in the vast majority of cases, the cheater was the main contributor to the pre-affair problems, despite their claims to the contrary.
> Makes sense, don't you think? After all , a cheater has already demonstrated a lack of integrity, poor communications skils, lack of compassion and empathy, as well as poor problem solving abilities.
> Think someone with those deficiencies was the ideal spouse?


i'd love to read that study.....


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## BigLiam (May 2, 2012)

slater said:


> i'd love to read that study.....


I'll try to locate the source. May take some time, as I have read about 6 books on infidelity, as well as vistied a half dozen sites.
I questioned how, exactly , they could formulate questions or do the research on this. I seem to recall their sources were therapists that wound up seeing both spouses in counseling vs the actual couples, so there was some subjectivity, I expect. But, the conclusion was that cheaters, in general(exceptions, of course) were the ones typically less invested in the marriage from the start, and had, throughout the years been less willing to do the work needed to preserve the health of the marriage.
Also, infidelity is fairly rampant among the personality disordered, and those folks are experts at portraying themselves as victms.


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## Fvstringpicker (Mar 11, 2012)

oaksthorne said:


> Are you for real? There is no justification for lying, and cheating, period.


Don't get me wrong. I'm not saying it's justified. I'm predicting what is likely to happen in such circumstances. My observation is that its is analogous to stealing. some people will steal right off the bat. Some people will steal if they are starving. Of those some will steal if they are a little hungry. Others would have to be very hungry. Some may not steal at all. You can never predict what a person will do until they are placed in a situation. If a marriage goes south, some will get a divorce, some will stay in the marriage, some will seek affairs. Many are like monkeys. They won't let go of one limb before they have a firm grasp on another. What people do and what many others, and sometimes themselves, judge as right is often different.


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## oaksthorne (Mar 4, 2011)

courseplotter said:


> And this reads like the comments of a garden variety BS.
> 
> Does the BS have any responsibility for the success of the marriage or is the WS cheating the perfect excuse to not take any of that responsibility?


I took responsibility for my marriage, I worked very hard to make and keep him happy; he kept telling me how happy he was and what a wonderful wife I was. He is passive aggressive I have found, and anything negative he sat on. I could not fix what I didn't know about. When he met her he rewrote the marital hx to justify cheating. The cheater is 100% responsible for choosing to be sneaky, and dishonorable. The cheater tells himself that he is "driven into the arms of another" what complete and utter crap! Grown ups make their own choices; selfish children blame others for them.


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## Fvstringpicker (Mar 11, 2012)

One course I teach is Fraud Examination. Rationalization is an element of all fraud. Rationalization is an element of all cheating.


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## BigLiam (May 2, 2012)

oaksthorne said:


> I took responsibility for my marriage, I worked very hard to make and keep him happy; he kept telling me how happy he was and what a wonderful wife I was. He is passive aggressive I have found, and anything negative he sat on. I could not fix what I didn't know about. When he met her he rewrote the marital hx to justify cheating. The cheater is 100% responsible for choosing to be sneaky, and dishonorable. The cheater tells himself that he is "driven into the arms of another" what complete and utter crap! Grown ups make their own choices; selfish children blame others for them.


Me, too. Did all I could. She would not do her share and was always emotionally detached. Typical cheater, very emotionally stunted.


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## BigLiam (May 2, 2012)

Fvstringpicker said:


> One course I teach is Fraud Examination. Rationalization is an element of all fraud. Rationalization is an element of all cheating.


Not with sociopaths. They do not need to rationalize.


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## Fvstringpicker (Mar 11, 2012)

Rationalization is the mainstay of a sociopath. They adopt their own belief system based on their own logic and perception.


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