# Hi everyone



## EmptyInside2013 (Aug 28, 2013)

Hi,

I'm new here. Usually I use forums on internet for auto repair, etc so this is new to me but I feel so desperate for an answer, any answer, etc. I'd like to post what has transpired over the last 2 months in my marriage (wife left after committing adultery), in the hopes that someone, anyone out there can give me some insight to perhaps her thought process, rationale, anything! I'm so lost and lonely. I'm not giving up on her or my marriage. Thanks.


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## BetrayedAgain7 (Apr 27, 2013)

Hi EI2013,

Welcome! Sorry for your troubles. Most of us here have been through the same or similar, so there is quite a lot of collective knowledge for you to take advantage of if you need too. 

Can you give us the back story? Do you have any specific questions that we can help you with?


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Sorry you are here. Infidelity is a hard thing to go through.

One thing to start with is to read the book "Surviving An Affair" by dr. Harley. It's a quick read and will give you good direction.

How long have the two of you been married? Do you have any children?


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## ThePheonix (Jan 3, 2013)

In a nutshell Dawg, she lost romantic interest in you. Women crazy in love with their husbands don't up and leave them for another man.


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## tulsy (Nov 30, 2012)

EmptyInside2013 said:


> ...I'd like to post what has transpired over the last 2 months in my marriage (wife left after committing adultery), in the hopes that someone, anyone out there can give me some insight to perhaps her thought process, rationale, anything! I'm so lost and lonely. I'm not giving up on her or my marriage. Thanks.


Umm, can you provide some more details? 

Hard to gain "insight" to *her* "thought process" without a greater understanding of how your relationship was before, after, and leading up to D-day.


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## Cabsy (Mar 25, 2013)

As safe of an assumption as lack of romantic interest might be, it's a bit early to be drawing conclusions given that we have few details. The guy is obviously hurting and breaking it down like that is a bit harsh.

Why and how she left, how much of it has to do with her problems, how much of it relates to marital problems, etc is important. Also is she going through a honeymoon phase, did she really want out of her marriage and just took the easy way out, is it just hormones and endorphins? Kids? Who knows?

2 months seemingly left in the dust is not a good sign to say the least. I hope you've at least begun to move your life in your own direction. Make sure you're taking care of yourself, improve on areas you feel need work, etc. It will be good for you and will make you more attractive to women overall, whether or not your wife chooses to be among that group.


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## Acabado (May 13, 2012)

Sorry man, read a few threads, tell us your story.
Familiarize with the lingo, usual concepts, etc.

Welcome TAM CWI newbies- please read this


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Did you find out or did she leave and then tell you?


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## EmptyInside2013 (Aug 28, 2013)

whew, ok, here it goes. I apologize for length, but I will try to keep simple regardless.

Part 1 of 2:

Wife: 35 yrs old who had two wonderful children when I met her, 1 boy, 1 girl. We met when she was within the last few months of her separation from 1st husband. Story was they split because she knew he was messing around, she asked him to stop, he didnt, so she left. She allowed kids to stay with him and she rented a house and lived with her two brothers. We dated for little over a year, and then got married. Our 9 yr anniversary is this coming Sept. 9th. 

Her background: Very family oriented (her family), nothing disparaging can be said about any of her family. She has 3 brothers (two of which are bums, the other, the youngest, hard working professional) She was always very very affectionate, loving and caring, especially about me and the job I do. (Firefigher). She was abused sexually/emotionally as a child but NEVER has had counseling/therapy. Her mother never took that step for her so it is unresolved. Her mom and I always got along despite differences. Wife would routinely express to me things like, "I could never imagine you with someone else", etc. Despite her good qualities, she is a very selfish person. She does not handle problems, but rather turn back to them in hopes they will resolve themselves. Never apologizes for anything as she has VERY difficult time admitting any wrongdoing. Last couple of years was rough because she had two major surgeries one year apart and last year she was in danger of dying. 

My background: First few of marriage while she was still blissfully happy I did what some do and continue to go out and drink and act as if I was still single, however despite being out late and with questionable friends, I NEVER CHEATED on her, but I would imagine in her mind I did or would. Im 38 years old, this is first marriage. After a few years, I grew up and began the role of seriousness about the marriage. I ALWAYS accepted her kids as my own and my relationship with them has been great. She and her ex have admittedly stated how good of a stepparent I am. I still had late nights here and there, but my focus was our house, kids, etc. I almost literally bend over backwards giving her what she wants, and NEVER sugarcoating anything. I was always brutally honest with her and despite her love for "family" there have been times that Ive proven that I am the only person she can TRULY and unconditionally depend on.

Timeframe:
Marriage till 2012: ups and downs like normal people, but she became increasingly less affectionate, less sex (sometimes attributed to her physical ailments in recent 2 years.) She even became unwilling to let me vent frustrations at daily events for me that were not marriage related, simply brushing my problems off as not important. This led me to occassionally talk to friends (some female) because I felt I couldnt confide in my wife. But nothing EVER happened sexually with these women.

2012 (March) I was speaking to a female friend at her house. Her husband is also my friend, my wife found out I was there with her husband being present and WWIII broke out. She moved out for 3 days to friends house but called on day 2 crying about she didnt want our marriage to be over. Clearly I was the one at fault, but SHE was adamant about working things out. A few months goes by, all clears up then she got sick and was hospitalized for 2 months. Of course I was there everyday along with her mom, but of course.......no family, none of her "tight knit" family were there but me and her mom. During an argument after she was released from hospital, she commented to me that I only came to hospital everyday to make myself look good.

Things simmered down, and in December of 2012 we began what I consider to be a fantastic turn of events. Absolutely no arguing whatsoever. We got along better, talked, confided, sex was still not as much but she asked me to be patient cause of her physical ailments. Sometimes she drank a little at get-togethers so later that night we could have sex cause the alcohol took some edge of the pain for her. This better marriage continued until late april 2013.

Next thread continues....


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## EmptyInside2013 (Aug 28, 2013)

Part 2 of 2.

April 2013.

She seemed to overnight became less inclined to talk after work, etc. We did less with each other and when I addressed these issues, she kept saying "Im fine", "Im tired, dont feel good, etc"
It was a complete 180.

This continued through May and into first part of June. Her shift is 6a-6pm as a dispatcher at an ambulance company. She routinely would come home late due to it being busy. Sometimes 8 or 9, even later. This always happened for last few months and there was NEVER an inclination to me about it being suspicious since it was something she did for more than a year. Also note that my wife was not sociable. She didnt hang out her GF's, didnt party, wasnt out at wierd hours, etc. She literally just stayed at off on days off and chilled with the kids.

So here where it all went downhill.

June 12th (wed) she is working. I order food and she isnt home yet from work at 10pm. I text and she says "sorry, i was chatting with Katie, I'm on way". I cant explain at all my emotion or feeling at the time but something didnt feel right. I never felt that way before. I drove to her work and her truck was gone. When I got home, she was confrontational as if she knew what I was gonna say. We argued about why her truck was gone but the argument was fruitless. She said I was talking to Katie. I let it go that night. *She slept in bed with me* that night. 

June 13th. She worked, we had replacement windows done that day and we texted back and forth to chat about the windows. I asked if we could talk about what happened and she said "fine". When she got home, I addressed issue, and she simply sat there and said "Im moving out, I want a divorce". I was stunned. I asked if it was b/c of someone else and she said adamantly "no".
We argued more, and then we went to bed separately.

June 14/15: She slept separate but we didnt argue at all, and it was as if nothing ever happened.

June 16 (Father Day) I went to work, I said goodbye, she said "I love you, be careful", something she hadnt said in weeks. Later that day we argued and she said "I dont want to talk about this, I told you I was leaving". She grabbed some clothes and left. She stayed at a family members house next few weeks.

June 17th (D-Day) I wanted so desperately to talk to her, world was spinning out of control, I drove to her work around her quitting time, when I went through the lot, out of corner of my eye I spotted her truck and another vehicle next to hers in a back corner. I backed up and a guy got out of her front seat, fell on ground trying to get into his truck. I confronted them both. She had nerve to ask me "what are you doing here?" We argued, I asked that guy (who NEVER GOT out of his truck) who he was, was he sleeping with my wife and was he married. He didnt tell me his name, and said no to the last 2 questions. I am very resourceful (I know many policemen as well), I simply stated to them "I will know by tomorrow who he is". I wrote down his tag number and left. The next day I found out his name, that he WAS INDEED married with a 6 month old child and he was a coworker of my wifes.

June 18 - 24, just text arguing, etc. She called an attorney, as did I. She kept pressing to me that she didnt want a 12 month separation (standard in Maryland) but a complete divorce and only way to get that is through adultery complaint that she WANTED me to generate. But also in MD, she must provide a "witness" which has to be the party she had affair with.

June 25. My friend goes to his gym (across from wifes work) sees her drive into parking garage, he calls me. I go there and see her and that guys truck in garage. I walk right up and two of them are in her back seat. I couldnt see anything specific due to low light conditions. I was so angry, I smacked backwindow and they both got out and left. It took everything I had not break every tooth in that guys mouth. I left, and called the guys wife. She was surpisingly not shocked simply stating that she didnt know anything physical was going on but that she already confronted her husband about talking to my wife 6 weeks ago!! Which puts that time frame around her beginning the odd behavior.

June 26 - Late July. Arguing, texting, and no progess on anything, even with lawyers. For someone who wanted a divorce so bad, she just simply walked away from everything expecting or anticipating I would handle it. She even got an apartment. She picked up mail one day and said she would be back the following saturday for furniture. I expected her "family" come help with a moving truck, etc., but when I ran into her at Walmart 2 days prior and asked what time she was coming..........she said "I dont know, I dont have anyone to help me move". So, me, being who I am, rented a truck and spent 3 days helping my wife move into her apartment. She broke down crying one time, gave me the most sincere hug I've had in *literally* 2 years, and when I asked if she still loved me, she said yes. So again, out of all her "dependable" people, I was still the ONLY one she could truly depend on despite that I should have been the last one. She never admits wrong, still has not said she is sorry, but sent a text message a few days after that saying "thanks for your help, I know I didnt deserve it".

We talked minimally since then with her making small talk and even agreeing to get lunch with me then changed her mind. Things were settled down, no progress through attorneys, then it happened. I was debating filing the adultery complaint, and hired a P.I to be sure and yup, on Monday July 29, that guys truck was at her apartment at 9:30pm and again on Thursday at 11:30pm.

After hearing that on that Monday night, I called that guys wife again, but she said what I didnt expect. She initially said, "he's not here, we argued over weekend and he is staying away for few days". I was nauseated cause I knew damn right well where he was. She then proceeded to tell me that her and him were going to marriage counseling, things were getting better overall, and that she makes him tell her when he gets to work if my wife is working that day too. She said anything else happens....marriage is over. And I was speechless. She seemed so happy, I didnt have the heart to tell her I knew his truck was at wifes apartment. We hung up, I called wife, didnt let on I knew he was there, and we argued furiously about how I felt I was made a fool of and how Ive always been there for her and I feel so betrayed. Later that night, she called me asking me "why did you call his wife again" and I replied that I just wanted to chat with her. Apparently after I talked to his wife she called her husband to see where he was. He didnt know that I actually didnt say anything to his wife but Im sure he was uncomfortable. I told my wife that his said they were working things out which is information I seriously doubt this guy told my wife.

So. thats it. My wife remains in apartment. No progress from laywers. Her and I have had no contact WHATSOEVER since Aug 2. I do forgive her, but I dont understand what happened since her and I were getting along so well.

Just a few notes. Things ive been told over years by her.
2 years ago: "Im not in love with you anymore" told to me during argument.
Also been told, 'my family is permanent, you are temporary" though clearly Ive shown otherwise

Now I feel lost, and feel like she has ripped MY family from me including kids I treat as my own. And to my knowledge, this guy has not been at her apartment much at all since that last thursday. Sorry for this being so long, just easier to get opinions when all facts are laid out. Thank you.


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## workindad (May 7, 2011)

You really need to study mmslp
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## workindad (May 7, 2011)

Sorry for the short post got cut short. 

You cannot decide for her if you are permanent or temporary. 

Your best chance now is likely to take strong actions. Start with a hard 180 and do it for you. 

Get checked for stds.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## harrybrown (May 22, 2013)

Tell the OMW where he was when he was gone. Talk to your wife's family. Let her mother know about her lover. Do not help her anymore. She is in the fog of the affair. If she will not change jobs, then you should file for divorce. She will not wake up and change. She does not respect you. Respect yourself and show her that cheating has consequences.


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## sinnister (Dec 5, 2010)

Sorry man. You keep putting yourself in position to let her stab you in the heart. Don't die of bloodless. Stop letting her stab you!

She is living with another man.

Think about for a second. Your wife is LIVING with another man. Whether you forgive her or not is irrelevant. She's moved on. And I think you're better off for it. She is damaged to do what she did to you.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

Please have a look at the stickies in this section, read up on the 180, have a look at the Newbies thread and start disconnecting yourself from this cake eating woman. And STOP helping her out. In ANY way.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

Get the two books listed below. You can download them too.

start out on this thread for new folks http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/32002-welcome-tam-cwi-newbies-please-read.html


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## herblackwings (May 16, 2013)

I agree with all the above. Do 180, don't be helpful to her, detach ASAP, get a lawyer, expose all data on the OM to his wife - that poor new mom has to deal with this too. It sucks man but I know the quicker you can detach from her the easier it'll get. Good luck
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

You are not going to be able to get over what she has done.

This site is to help you, not save your marriage. The Healing Heart: The 180


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

Forget helping her out, go help his wife out.


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## Acabado (May 13, 2012)

EmptyInside2013 said:


> Just a few notes. Things ive been told over years by her.
> *2 years ago: "Im not in love with you anymore" told to me during argument.*
> Also been told, 'my family is permanent, you are temporary" though clearly Ive shown otherwise


Sorry to say man, the bolded piece above means this is an ongoing 2yrs affair (With means she was the permanent mistress while he got pregnant his wife) or she is cheating on you regulary with other men since - at least - two years ago.
This phrase is a code for "I'm in love with someone else".
This also put into perspective the reaction she had last year when you showed poor boundaries with that woman. I Imagine she changed mind afyer kicking you out only becasue OM didn't toke the oportunity to keep her.

She's gone, friend, she was gone already two years ago, she decided to cheat on you for so long that despite the false reality, the facade she presented, she doesn't value you at all.
She's not coming back because she's to stuborn or proud but becasue she stopping loving you time ago, much time you can imagine.

Whatever is going on is not recent. Not at all.
I'm very sorry.


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## barbados (Aug 30, 2012)

1) She was abused sexually/emotionally as a child but NEVER has had counseling/therapy. Her mother never took that step for her so it is unresolved. 

_So she is physiologically scarred._

2) Despite her good qualities, she is a very selfish person. She does not handle problems, but rather turn back to them in hopes they will resolve themselves. Never apologizes for anything as she has VERY difficult time admitting any wrongdoing. 

_So she is completely selfish and lacks any coping skills._

3) Told you 2 years ago : "I'm not in love with you anymore" 

_This is classic cheater speak. Don't be surprised if you find that her cheating began this far back. _

4) Also told you : "My family is permanent, you are temporary" 

_And this one is the worse, for as much as you have stated how much you love HER KIDS, they are HER KIDS and HER FAMILY in her mind, not yours. This is how she views you._


You deserve MUCH MUCH better than this. She is a selfish, damaged person. She is already moved out, so go complete 180 on her, proceed with the D, and stop doing ANY favors for her.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

If you really want to take her back, you have to break up the affair. You do this by exposing the affair to her family, his family, his workplace and posting him on cheatervile.com CheaterVille :: Don't Be the Last to Know. Cheaterville has a service that you can send people the link to anonymously. Send it to as many people he knows that you can. See if you can find a picture of him, facebook maybe.

Cheaters scurry like roaches, which they are, when you ecpose and everyone is looking at them funny.

Doesn't their workplace have rules against fraterinazion? 

The way you have handled this, with kid gloves, has made you look small to your wife while the other man takes what he wants, namely two women.

Catching them together scrogging in the car and not doing anything mad you look......................well weak as hell.


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## aug (Aug 21, 2011)

Quite likely her earlier divorce was due to her cheating (not her ex-husband).

Cheaters lie. Cant trust what she says about her first husband. Perhaps you should call him up and ask him about her.


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## DavidWYoung (Feb 3, 2012)

I am sorry that you are here but there are some things that you seem not to understand. Now I am not saying this to hurt you but you don't seem to understand

1. Your wife, does not love you, respect you, want you, at all!

2. In your wife's eyes, you are a wimp and a doormat.

3. All of the hard work that you did for her over the years means nothing to her!

4. You wife has already left the marriage and you can not nice her back. ( In fact, she will hate you if you try!)


5. You can not control her actions, only your own.

6. You will need to make a plan on what to do for yourself for three months, twelve months and five years. This is very important or you will end up like me and waste most of your life on a woman who doesn't give a damm about you.

7. TAM is a very good resource for picking yourself up and dusting yourself off and starting a new happy life. The future is coming, ready or not. I hope you learn from our mistakes.

Good luck, it is going to get better. David


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## EmptyInside2013 (Aug 28, 2013)

Thank you all for the replies and guidance. Just to point out a few things, the only reason the day in the garage I didnt beat on that guy is because I love my job more than I hated him. The Fire Dept does not tolerate stuff like that, and it would have been a big hit for me at work if I was locked up for battery/assault, etc. 

He doesnt live with her, his vehicle was seen at her apartment twice within 4 days of each other but hasnt been there since. ( 3+ weeks now). I have realized that there may be more to the story with her ex-husband than I know, however, its hard to explain, but wife is really not sociable like I said before. Its hard to explain through written word, but the whole time, whole marriage, she never gave ANY indication of screwing around, no wierd calls, texts, emails, late nights, not being where she said. She spent a VERY VERY large portion of her time home, on days off with the kids and me. If she has been screwing around for last 2 years with or without this guy in particular, then she is very very good at it. Im suspicious by nature of everything and everyone and I never ever until that night on the 12th remotely though anything.

As far as lawyers go, we both have one. She initially was ok with a separation then changed mind and said she wanted me to do adultery complaint to speed things up. We've both had lawyers since June 28. As of this writing, she backed off of the adultery complaint which Im sure is because she knows that guy has to be the "witness" in state of Maryland, and I can only imagine how that convo went (if at all). He probably told her to piss up a rope. I get the feeling that he has already pushed her aside to salvage his own marriage. 

What bothers me the most is, I am the most dependable person she has and yet I feel as if she took 10 yrs of a relationship, 9 yrs of which were marriage and just walked away like nothing ever existed. I just dont understand that. She goes from having a home, kids rooms that had some personality, pets, whatever she wanted, husband who took care of finances (keeping track), took kids everywhere, let her sleep, etc, etc, etc to a **** 3 bedroom apartment in a not so great neighborhood. Something I forgot to mention, her son (15yrs old), has NOT SPENT THE NIGHT with her there since she moved. (one month ago!) Her daughter has, but her son just doesnt want to. Her ex-husband and I get along just fine btw, and we get beers together occassionally.

As far as her mom goes, weve had our differences, but were still close. The night I saw them in truck I called her mother upset, left her a voicemail. I have never gotten a reply either text, email or whatever about it from her mom. At the very least I know that her mom knows about this guy no matter what wife says to her. Though I am sure wife is not telling the whole truth. She didnt even tell her own attorney about being caught in the truck. Im having hard time believing that this person who was so loving and sweet the first couple of years has turned out to be this callous, unfeeling individual who has simply destroyed our lives together. I hate being in our house, its lonely. She even told her daughter (around Aug 2 when we had fight) that when I call her daughter on her bday on Aug 6, that she shouldnt answer the phone and not to ask me for anything,..ever. Luckily the childs father put a stop to that and told daughter, that she WILL have communication with me b/c what her mother was doing is wrong.


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## EmptyInside2013 (Aug 28, 2013)

Sorry, forgot why I mentioned lawyers. Its a virtual standstill. What is unfathomable to me is she "wants" divorce, "wants" to be apart, gets an attorney but then my lawyer and I do all the work. Another example of turn back to issues and they will go away.


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## EmptyInside2013 (Aug 28, 2013)

Chaparral said:


> You are not going to be able to get over what she has done.
> 
> This site is to help you, not save your marriage. The Healing Heart: The 180


Ironically, from Aug 2 until Aug 23, (3 weeks), I did just what the 180 said. I completely made zero contact. No email, text, phone, nothing. Now, I was instructed on the 2nd to do that via my attorney, and perhaps she was told same hence why I received no communication from her either. So it seems as if maybe the 180 wasnt quite as effective partly due to no-contact being attorney driven. Last I texted was the 23rd because of kid needs before school starts. Should I start over again with the 180??


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## toonaive (Dec 13, 2012)

If she is not going to put the effort into the divorce, you must do it. There will come a time after the required separate, waiting period that either mediation will be required, or a pretrial conference in front of a judge or magistrate to determine where the "constipation" is, and will impose time limits on the transfer of information to get the divorce moving. The stalling tactic by her is to gain advantage over you. Your emotions are still pretty raw, her emotions have long matured by now. She is only nice to you on occasion because she wants something. She is not the person you married. Maybe she never was. By her actions, she started planning to leaving you quite a while ago. That is why she was treating you so disrespectfully for so long. Her love for you is long dead! Know that!! Get control of your divorce, and please stop talking to your inlaws. In the end, they will not support you.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

The faster you move on the faster you will be happy.

No way I would not have my lawyer depose that a$$ hoe. Let him twist in the wind.

Your wife w abused, she is broken , we see that a lot here. I feel sorry for her but she needs counseling.


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## EmptyInside2013 (Aug 28, 2013)

I agree with the stalling, but I dont know why. She made it clear that if I pushed the adultery she would waive interest in house, my pension, etc. I havent spoken to mother-in-law at all actually. I left that voicemail way back in June, otherwise no contact with her at all. 

Its funny though, how back in December it was her idea to try to make things work, etc. We were getting along up until late April like I said, and that first night when I asked, "why are you doing this?", her reply (i believe to be a cop-out), was "im tired of walking on eggshells, were werent getting along as well as you thought, it was in your head". She went on to say, "I just cant get past all the arguing over the years, and making things work everyday is too hard".

All I can say to that is WTF?


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

Tell her counting the posom, her ex, and you, she is a three time loser, time to get help.


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## EmptyInside2013 (Aug 28, 2013)

Chaprral: I tried to quote an earlier message of yours but not sure if it worked., so I'll just type it here, I read the 180 thing you posted and honestly, from the last argument (Aug 2 till just last friday the 23rd) I tried that. 3 weeks no contact from either of to us to the other, however Im not sure how much of that was attorney driven. I was told by lawyer not to contact and I assume she was told same, but when I broke the rule last friday to ask about kids before school she replied cordially and then nothing since. She seems to be doing the 180 thing much much better than I regardless of lawyer instruction. Though she knows she was always better at turning a blind-eye whereas I am a "lets do something now, not wait" kind of person. I read that whole 180 list but Im not sure even if I do those things it will have ANY effect at all good or bad on her. Perhaps she doesnt give a damn. The list was very very good reading though. Most of things there I had been/still doing.


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## lenzi (Apr 10, 2012)

EmptyInside2013 said:


> Sorry, forgot why I mentioned lawyers. Its a virtual standstill. What is unfathomable to me is she "wants" divorce, "wants" to be apart, gets an attorney but then my lawyer and I do all the work. Another example of turn back to issues and they will go away.


What's not to understand? You always take care of everything. Even after you caught her cheating and she said she didn't care and wants a divorce you still helped her move to her new apartment!

She sees you as a doormat who will do anything she asks, whenever and however it needs to be done, even if it's filing papers and paying any necessary fees to dissolve the marriage so she can be free to continue screwing the other guy.

In this case, I say go ahead and file for the divorce yourself and stop wasting useless energy trying to figure out why she's doing what she's doing, you'll never know. Get to a point where you can just shake your head, and just not care anymore about what she does or why she does it.

Oh, and try to redirect the anger that you have toward the other man. Sure he's a cheater, but he's not really hurting you. He's just some guy with a penis that your wife invited to her bed. But he could be anyone, he's not the one who promised loyalty, faithfulness, etc. He couldn't get inside your wife without her consent. She's the problem, he's only a symptom.


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## Jasel (Jan 8, 2013)

EmptyInside2013 said:


> I agree with the stalling, but I dont know why. She made it clear that if I pushed the adultery she would waive interest in house, my pension, etc. I havent spoken to mother-in-law at all actually. I left that voicemail way back in June, otherwise no contact with her at all.
> 
> *Its funny though, how back in December it was her idea to try to make things work, etc. We were getting along up until late April like I said, and that first night when I asked, "why are you doing this?", her reply (i believe to be a cop-out), was "im tired of walking on eggshells, were werent getting along as well as you thought, it was in your head". She went on to say, "I just cant get past all the arguing over the years, and making things work everyday is too hard".*
> 
> All I can say to that is WTF?


She most likely had no intention of making things work. Just like she's stalling the divorce now she was probably stalling for time back then to make plans with the OM. To do that she needed to string you along long enough to get her ducks in a row, and the easiest way to do that was to go through the motions until she no longer needed to bother.

You need to read Married Man Sex Primer and implement the 180.


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## awake1 (Jan 29, 2013)

EmptyInside2013 said:


> whew, ok, here it goes. I apologize for length, but I will try to keep simple regardless.
> 
> Part 1 of 2:


I'm going to give you my impression of your story, and I hope it helps. My narrative may not be the true one, but I hope it makes you examine things. 


EmptyInside2013 said:


> Wife: 35 yrs old who had two wonderful children when I met her, 1 boy, 1 girl. We met when she was within the last few months of her separation from 1st husband.  Story was they split because she knew he was messing around, she asked him to stop, he didnt, so she left. She allowed kids to stay with him and she rented a house and lived with her two brothers. We dated for little over a year, and then got married. Our 9 yr anniversary is this coming Sept. 9th.


Did the kids ever move in with you? It sounds like you're a a "beta provider". That is, a man used mostly for his ability to provide for the woman. This has probably sustained your relationship rather than her romantic interest in you. (for what little there was)



EmptyInside2013 said:


> "I could never imagine you with someone else", etc. Despite her good qualities, she is a very selfish person. She does not handle problems, but rather turn back to them in hopes they will resolve themselves. Never apologizes for anything as she has VERY difficult time admitting any wrongdoing. Last couple of years was rough because she had two major surgeries one year apart and last year she was in danger of dying.
> 
> My background: First few of marriage while she was still blissfully happy I did what some do and continue to go out and drink and act as if I was still single, however despite being out late and with questionable friends, I NEVER CHEATED on her, but I would imagine in her mind I did or would. Im 38 years old, this is first marriage. After a few years, I grew up and began the role of seriousness about the marriage. I ALWAYS accepted her kids as my own and my relationship with them has been great. She and her ex have admittedly stated how good of a stepparent I am. I still had late nights here and there, but my focus was our house, kids, etc. I almost literally bend over backwards giving her what she wants, and NEVER sugarcoating anything. I was always brutally honest with her and despite her love for "family" there have been times that Ive proven that I am the only person she can TRULY and unconditionally depend on.


See part one. But now that her health is probably improved, kids are a bit older you're no longer needed. 

Like me, you get a "PLAN B" seal of approval. 



EmptyInside2013 said:


> Things simmered down, and in December of 2012 we began what I consider to be a fantastic turn of events. Absolutely no arguing whatsoever. We got along better, talked, confided, sex was still not as much but she asked me to be patient cause of her physical ailments. Sometimes she drank a little at get-togethers so later that night we could have sex cause the alcohol took some edge of the pain for her. This better marriage continued until late april 2013.
> 
> Next thread continues....


The alcohol made you temporarily more attractive to her. I'm sorry, but I saw this first hand myself.


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## awake1 (Jan 29, 2013)

EmptyInside2013 said:


> Part 2 of 2.
> 
> April 2013.
> 
> ...


Probably already going on well before this point. 

There is often an ebb and flow to affairs of alternating hot and cold. 


EmptyInside2013 said:


> June 26 - Late July. Arguing, texting, and no progess on anything, even with lawyers. For someone who wanted a divorce so bad, she just simply walked away from everything expecting or anticipating I would handle it. She even got an apartment. She picked up mail one day and said she would be back the following saturday for furniture. I expected her "family" come help with a moving truck, etc., but when I ran into her at Walmart 2 days prior and asked what time she was coming..........she said "I dont know, I dont have anyone to help me move". So, me, being who I am, rented a truck and spent 3 days helping my wife move into her apartment..


Oh. My. God. You help your cheating wife get setup in her apartment? 



EmptyInside2013 said:


> She broke down crying one time, gave me the most sincere hug I've had in *literally* 2 years, and when I asked if she still loved me, she said yes. So again, out of all her "dependable" people, I was still the ONLY one she could truly depend on


You're being played. 


EmptyInside2013 said:


> despite that I should have been the last one. She never admits wrong, still has not said she is sorry, but sent a text message a few days after that saying "thanks for your help, I know I didnt deserve it".
> 
> We talked minimally since then with her making small talk and even agreeing to get lunch with me then changed her mind.


If she wants lunch with a man, and the other guy isn't available, I guess she'll call you. 


EmptyInside2013 said:


> Things were settled down, no progress through attorneys, then it happened. I was debating filing the adultery complaint, and hired a P.I to be sure and yup, on Monday July 29, that guys truck was at her apartment at 9:30pm and again on Thursday at 11:30pm.


Duh. You think that's the first time? Prob been having sex with him for many, many months.


EmptyInside2013 said:


> And I was speechless. She seemed so happy, I didnt have the heart to tell her I knew his truck was at wifes apartment. We hung up, I called wife, didnt let on I knew he was there, and we argued furiously about how I felt I was made a fool of and how Ive always been there for her and I feel so betrayed.


Come on dude, you call and interupt your wife having sex with her partner to tell her hwo upset you are and how you deserve better? 

From the moment you caught them in the parking lot, you should have known better. 


EmptyInside2013 said:


> Just a few notes. Things ive been told over years by her.
> 2 years ago: "Im not in love with you anymore" told to me during argument.


Probably already in an affair of some kind by this point. This is her covert way of saying "fair warning, you're plan B" 




EmptyInside2013 said:


> Now I feel lost, and feel like she has ripped MY family from me including kids I treat as my own. And to my knowledge, this guy has not been at her apartment much at all since that last thursday.


When this guy sees what he'll lose in divorce, your wife will be his throwaway. 

Then she'll come crawling back, after having her fun with this other guy. You'll get sloppy seconds. 

Those few months with this OM mean more to her than all the years with you. 

An hour sex session with this OM means more to her than anything you could offer in the future. What does that say about her opinion of you? 

You need to read no more mr nice guy and married man sex life primer. 

You have been lied to, taken advantage of, mistreated and abused. You were picked because you're nice and a doormat. You were picked because some other man wouldn't raise her kids. 

It's true man, i'm sorry but it honestly sounds like on some level you were picked by her because she knew you'd help with bills and child rearing. But she didn't find you attractive and simply gave you duty sex. But you put up with that, believing the lies and excuses. 

Why are you at this point in life? Because you're too selfless, caring, devoted and nice. It also sounds like oneitis. Go out and you'll be amazed at how your stock has risen while you were busy being led along by this woman.

You're just not selfish enough. Why don't you demand more out of life than what you got?

But now her health is better, kids are older. In her mind you served your purpose, but she will keep you in the background as a backup all while keeping an eye out for something better. 

She just isn't into you. That's it.


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## EmptyInside2013 (Aug 28, 2013)

I guess she just changed then. I remember clearly the first couple of years, joking with guys at the fire station when they would make the cliche' references about their wives and their minimal sex, I'd joke saying "i dont have that problem', cause I didnt. For quite a few years she was very into me and our relationship but I guess it did change.

Kid situation was my wife and her ex-husband split the time with the kids every 4 days due to her schedule. So they had lives, rooms, etc in each household, with their dad and his wife and with me and mine.

She had her chance last year when she thought i stepped out on her, (if she had a guy then) that was her chance, why remain an additional year?


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## carolinadreams (Nov 30, 2012)

1. Your old marriage is dead.

2. Your wife's emotional and physical needs are primarily being met by this other man, as long as he is the focus of her affection and thoughts you are an obstacle to her self entitlement

3. You wife sounds like a child that want's stuff to magically work out on it's on with no effort on her part. File that divorce!

From your description your wife has a lot of dysfunction and damage, you're feeling the hurt right night, and it's a blow to your ego, but you really need to consider that if you do attempt to reconcile " you are taking back a damaged person. Can you as a person get past that and the harm she has chosen to do you?


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## wranglerman (May 12, 2013)

She has disrespected you big time, and although I do feel you have been treated like a door mat I think it honorable that you helped her move out.

As many have said, she was testing the water with other guys at least 2yrs ago and I think Awake1 has pretty much summed it up.

Please have some dignity and let her go on her merry way, keep out of harms way, she will come back and stab you a few more times if you let her, and also, get tested for STDs, seriously this is not a new thing for her so the chances of you getting caught in the cross fire are high!!!

The sexual abuse is familiar as far as cheaters go and the fact that it was never addressed during counselling means she has learned to compartmentalize and is able to put things in boxes where they stay until she wants to open them, this is true for affair partners too, she comes home lovey dovey to you after a sordid hour long session in the back of the truck with the other guy, so he gets let out to play and play time is over back in the box back to happy wife and homemaker, she seriously needs IC to get her problems addressed but that will never happen,so just protect yourself and your assets as much as you can as the fall out could be nuclear!!!!


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## EmptyInside2013 (Aug 28, 2013)

Should I still divulge to the OM's wife about my knowledge of him being at my wifes apartment? OM's wife thinks her marriage is getting better after the initial shock of my first phone call to her the night I saw W and OM in garage. She doesnt know (for sure) that he has been at W apartment. Do I tell?

And Ive read some other posts and threads about directly communicating (written letter) with the OM, being non belligerent, just stating that he is partially responsible for this damage.?


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## Acabado (May 13, 2012)

EmptyInside2013 said:


> *Should I still divulge to the OM's wife about my knowledge of him being at my wifes apartment?* OM's wife thinks her marriage is getting better after the initial shock of my first phone call to her the night I saw W and OM in garage. She doesnt know (for sure) that he has been at W apartment. *Do I tell?*


Do it NOW.

And ignore the advice of confronting OM, even less in writing. You already behaved like a doormat helping your wife to set up her apartment. Don't appear even more weak.


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## alte Dame (Aug 7, 2012)

Call the OMW again asap. She has a right to know that her so-called reconciliation is a complete sham. Tell her exactly where he was when he went away to 'think.'

Please!!


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## 3putt (Dec 3, 2012)

Acabado said:


> Do it NOW.
> 
> And ignore the advice of confronting OM, even less in writing. You already behaved like a doormat helping your wife to set up her apartment. Don't appear even more weak.


I agree with not confronting in writing, but disagree with not confronting this POS face to face. I would put the fear of God, Allah, or whoever the hell he prays to in him.

Make her not worth his effort. I know this will spark some massive dissent, but if it's good enough for a 40 year clinical psychologist specializing in infidelity (Dr. Bill Harley), then it's good enough for me.

Jack his sorry ass up against a wall. I guarantee he'll think twice about messing with the wrong man's wife.


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## 3putt (Dec 3, 2012)

And call this poor woman now. Right now.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

ThePheonix said:


> In a nutshell Dawg, she lost romantic interest in you. Women crazy in love with their husbands don't up and leave them for another man.


In your experience. Other people's realities may differ, partially or substantially.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

Acabado said:


> Do it NOW.
> 
> And ignore the advice of confronting OM, even less in writing. You already behaved like a doormat helping your wife to set up her apartment. Don't appear even more weak.


:iagree:


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## 6301 (May 11, 2013)

First mistake. Your too nice of a guy. You catch her twice and your trying to nice your way back in. Remember twice you caught her.

Second. When she's moving out, she doesn't have a truck and no one to help and you do the work. Think she didn't know that? That's when you should have told her that if you want to be a great big self sufficient independent woman, you better get your stuff out of the house by such and such a day or it will be on the curb.

She wanted you to have a witness to her adultery. You got it. The bum in the truck who she's sleeping with. You got his name, address and phone number. Let the attorney subpoena him. He won't have a choice and if he lies under oath, his ass will be in jail. That's what she wanted isn't it? Your being the nice guy and doing as she wished.

I would also let his wife know where he bunking out. She thinks he's either sleeping in the back of his truck or in some flea bag motel. Don't think she would be happy if she found out that he's sleeping next to a warm clean body. She deserves to know she's being played. Wouldn't you?

I would run to a lawyer ASAP and give her a life's lesson that she finally has to grow up and take responsibility for her selfish and unacceptable behavior.


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## EmptyInside2013 (Aug 28, 2013)

I guess I have decisions to make then. To be honest with everyone here who has replied, originally I asked my attorney to file for separation, then when my wife was being nasty one day for a whole other reason, she went on and on about me just filing for adultery and she would go along with it, she knows she needs a witness and that it must be him. Her attorney even told mine that he was willing to do it if she was, however, when mine asked me how I wanted to reply, I said let her lawyer do the separation since they had done nothing at all yet. To be perfectly honest I felt stuck. One hand she wanted to agree with adultery to give her the absolute immediate divorce which I did not/dont want but if I do it, that means I would be YET AGAIN, giving her what she wants. If I dont do it she had already threatened my pension if I dont. 

On principle alone, I feel like not giving in and forcing her to do a 12 month Maryland separation however, honestly, part of that is so I dont feel like everything is so final. Its very hard to put into words the sheer amount of effort and time I gave this woman, helped her new career take off, practically rehabbed the ENTIRE home the way she wanted it, took care of her kids, in addition to, and I kid you not, I did all the work in the house regarding cleaning, etc as well. (Im a bit of neat freak anyway).

As far as the OM's wife goes, I want to tell her (though I think she knew that night I called after his truck was at her apartment) that I had more to say. Im sure she thought it odd that I called at 9:30pm knowing she has a baby there and taking a chance on OM picking up phone unless I already knew he wasnt there. I want to tell her, except............ I have already been told weeks ago by my attorney after he conversed with hers about not "harassing" her. She called and said that I did after that night because she suspected I was at apartment. If I tell wife now while the legal thing is still in flux, his wife will dig into his ass, he'll call her and she may file a protective order on me though its unwarranted. I'll be blamed for being there though I wasnt. Im not sure how to let her know that I know without incriminating myself inadvertently.

I keep blaming myself for that first night when she wasnt at work, if I would have let that go, I doubt she would have brought it up the following week like she said she planned on doing. I should be taking every piece of advice here, I just feel like Im living in another life. All my hard work in the home, and Im so nauseated when I walk in door, memories, etc. I cant escape anything. I just want out of my own mind.


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## 3putt (Dec 3, 2012)

EmptyInside2013 said:


> I guess I have decisions to make then. To be honest with everyone here who has replied, originally I asked my attorney to file for separation, then when my wife was being nasty one day for a whole other reason, she went on and on about me just filing for adultery and she would go along with it, she knows she needs a witness and that it must be him. Her attorney even told mine that he was willing to do it if she was, however, when mine asked me how I wanted to reply, I said let her lawyer do the separation since they had done nothing at all yet. To be perfectly honest I felt stuck. One hand she wanted to agree with adultery to give her the absolute immediate divorce which I did not/dont want but if I do it, that means I would be YET AGAIN, giving her what she wants. If I dont do it she had already threatened my pension if I dont.
> 
> On principle alone, I feel like not giving in and forcing her to do a 12 month Maryland separation however, honestly, part of that is so I dont feel like everything is so final. Its very hard to put into words the sheer amount of effort and time I gave this woman, helped her new career take off, practically rehabbed the ENTIRE home the way she wanted it, took care of her kids, in addition to, and I kid you not, I did all the work in the house regarding cleaning, etc as well. (Im a bit of neat freak anyway).
> 
> ...


Good God, dude. Where the hell are your balls???? Pull your head out of your ass and call this woman now! Look, I feel for you. I hate it. I've been where you are and it SUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUCKS to high heaven.

But, you know what? It's gonna suck for even longer than it already has if you don't get on your gitty-up and start taking some action here. Yeah, she wants you to exit stage left fast and furious because she knows you could fvck everything up with one damned phone call! You're in the driver's seat and you're not even aware of it.

A woman would NEVER allow herself to be painted as an adulteress in a court of law this fast if she were damned sure it wouldn't matter what you did or didn't.

Bet on it pal. Make the call.


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## alte Dame (Aug 7, 2012)

It's not harassment to provide truthful information. Send a note to her at her home. Have someone else tell her. Just tell her. You can be sure that the OM has been spinning madly to stop her from finding out the whole truth.

If you file with adultery, use that night as part of the record. I know this is hard, but you have to stop being afraid. This isn't Kafka's world - people aren't going to arrest you and drag you off for 'feeling guilty.'


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## EmptyInside2013 (Aug 28, 2013)

I was simply concerned about my job. Im 6 years off of retirement. If I couldnt trust my wife to not do what she did, I certainly couldnt trust her to not do something that would threaten my job. However, I will find a way to inform the OM's wife. Its eating my up that she thinks everything is getting better, I would want someone to tell me. I just have to do it delicately and the right way.


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

My I suggest, and I quote " Hellow Mrs. OM why is everyone in twnn keep see your husbands truck at my wifes apartment?"

Or

" we need to support each others marriages so I want to inform you that your H truck has been seen at my wifes apartment by other poeple in town".


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## EmptyInside2013 (Aug 28, 2013)

Ironically, when I spoke to his wife first time, she asked me if I knew this guy she is friends with and I said yeah. He works PT at same place as my wife. I was considering talking to him to just "pass on a message" so to speak. For the first few weeks my wife really thought that her life at work with the gossip and jeering was due to me and my big mouth telling people, but in reality, I know that her whole office knew whats up before I said anything and given that most are fulltime firemen like me, I knew it was a building full of gossip. Old adage., telephone, tele-friend, tell-a-fireman. lol.

My wife always underestimated my resourcefulness.


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

EmptyInside2013 said:


> Should I still divulge to the OM's wife about my knowledge of him being at my wifes apartment? OM's wife thinks her marriage is getting better after the initial shock of my first phone call to her the night I saw W and OM in garage. She doesnt know (for sure) that he has been at W apartment. Do I tell?
> 
> And Ive read some other posts and threads about directly communicating (written letter) with the OM, being non belligerent, just stating that he is partially responsible for this damage.?


Yes you absolutely should tell her.

You should also report the affair to their work,


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

Btw, there is this thing called cheaterville.com, put the OM up there.


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## BetrayedAgain7 (Apr 27, 2013)

EmptyInside2013 said:


> On principle alone, I feel like not giving in and forcing her to do a 12 month Maryland separation however, honestly, part of that is so I dont feel like everything is so final. Its very hard to put into words the sheer amount of effort and time I gave this woman, helped her new career take off, practically rehabbed the ENTIRE home the way she wanted it, took care of her kids, in addition to, and I kid you not, I did all the work in the house regarding cleaning, etc as well. (Im a bit of neat freak anyway).


Your feeling of it not being so final is coming from not WANTING it to be final. 

I don't blame you for feeling this way, given all the effort you have put into this relationship.

However, you are an honourable nice guy who has been done over like a dogs dinner. Time to start creating some very firm boundaries around yourself. Easier said than done I know, but if you don't then you are in for a whole heap of pain down the road.

She is damaged, you cannot repair her. But you can heal yourself. You have a right to peace of mind and a good life. You will not find it with her.


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