# Backed into a corner?



## Sacrosanct (Jun 16, 2014)

I need some advice. So about 4 years ago my husband had an EA sexting type relationship. We worked through it and I agreed to take him back under the condition that I would leave if it happened again. He was very remorseful (I thought) and regained my trust. Fast forward to this past weekend when I caught him messaging a family friend's daughter on FB. He is 51 and she is about 25. The messages were not really that bad (yet) but they were headed there I am sure. They were talking about getting together and going away to an island together and how much he wanted to see her. Nothing sexual. I wish I would have just let things unfold for a few more days/weeks but I did not because my hand was forced (her boyfriend actually caught her and messaged me with details and called H to threaten him). 

Even though the messages were semi-innocent it brought everything flooding back from the previous time. I just don't think it's appropriate to be telling another woman you want to see her so bad and crap like that. Anyway, now I feel like I am in a position where I HAVE TO LEAVE. Even though it seems kinda foolish to throw 20 years away over non-sexual but flirty FB messages. Kids know dad is supposed to be moving out (because he told them mom wanted him out-such a manipulative sick effer). I can't stand the sight of him because I know he has most likely been doing stuff like this all along although he denies it. He has offered to go to therapy because he thinks he needs help. He acknowledges that he thrives on the attention. He did not blame me but did state that I have been emotionally distant and he thought I was cheating (never have but I have recently started some new hobbies that he finds suspicious because he is jealous and controlling) so he was seeking other attention I guess. 

Can I even give him another chance given my ultimatum from the past? I mean if I give him another chance doesn't that give him the license to do whatever because I'm a doormat who doesn't stick to her guns? Or doesn't it really count because this wasn't really "that big of a deal". Just need some insight from you guys...


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## GuyInColorado (Dec 26, 2015)

Is the marriage worth saving? Do you two love each other, are intimate on a regular basis? 

If it is worth saving, you need marriage counseling. He needs individual counseling. He needs to get rid of social media accounts and you need full access to his electronic devices. Do you check the phone bill? I'd also use Dr Fone to recover deleted text messages (it's free to view them...pay only to save them).


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## Bananapeel (May 4, 2015)

IMO he F'd up so he needs to take the initiative to make things better. If you want to give him another chance wait first to see if he approaches you with a solution and is willing to work through it. I'm a big believer that actions speak louder than words, so look at his actions and see what they are communicating. Trying to alienate your kids from you is not how he should be acting if he values what you have and wants another chance. The ball is in his court so see what he does with it.


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## Rocky Mountain Yeti (Apr 23, 2017)

Two things from your post jump out at me. 

First:
"Even though the messages were semi-innocent..."
There is no such thing as "semi-innocent." Either there was adulterous (not necessarily physical, but still seeking something outside the marriage) or there wasn't. This one is binary, not shades of grey. Whether you ultimately decide this is a one or a zero will help you answer your larger question.

You then continue with "...it brought everything flooding back from the previous time." Of course it did. And he knows (or at least should) that communication of this nature would have that effect and therefore must be avoided at all costs. This is further indication of where this falls on the side of either innocent or not innocent (no middle ground). Even under the best possible explanation, it's not caring or loving.

Second:
"He did not blame me but did state that I have been emotionally distant and he thought I was cheating..." 
Either he is 
1. Projecting; since he is being adulterous, he expects the same of you or,
2. Deflecting: trying to shift the glare of the exposing spotlight off himself and on to you.
Neither of these is the behavior of a faithful, loving mate. 

The only possible mitigation I find is his willingness to go to counseling. But even that is not a guarantee of positive intent--it is often used as a smokescreen and many people go through counseling just for appearances to keep from losing their mate, all the while never really intending to grow, learn, or change.


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## TAMAT (Jun 20, 2015)

Copy all the messages to the girls parents, your WH has to pay for this in one way or another to keep him from doing it again.

He is 50 years old he should not be involved with and disrupting young peoples lives by exploiting his position as a family friend.

Tamat


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## Abc123wife (Sep 18, 2013)

"They were talking about getting together and going away to an island together and how much he wanted to see her. Nothing sexual."

Wtf? Not sexual? Why else do a female and male go off to an island together? He can't wait to see her? For what? Site seeing?!

How creepy! Your 51 year old WH is messaging a family friend's 25 year old daughter! Why would you want to stay with this serial cheater who is trying to manipulate you by involving your children?


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## Spicy (Jun 18, 2016)

Who was his first EA with? Someone he knew in real life or an random online person?

This is very serious and it is someone you all know. Tremendous damage is being done.


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## Satya (Jun 22, 2012)

IMO it doesn't matter how "big of a deal" this was.
It broke your trust and was a blatant disregard for your relationship.
It's not foolish and it's not throwing away 20 years. Think of it as opening yourself up to a better 20 years moving forward.

Your children need to know the truth. Ideally that should come from you both, but do not be afraid to defend yourself. Children, with age, learn the real deal most times anyway.

The young woman is an adult so I'm not sure how much good exposing to her family would do. She's in a prime age to soak up attention and validation like a sponge, so unless she's got bars on her windows she's going to do whatever she wants. Exposure might shake up her home life, however, so it probably would be worthwhile, anyway.

Focus on detaching from him and getting help for your kids (therapy, if necessary) so they can learn to process their emotions over the split. I don't know how much good therapy will do for your husband. As @Rocky Mountain Yeti pointed out, it could be an excuse to appease you or shut you up. For kicks, why don't you schedule a MC session and then tell him the date you've booked. It would be great to see his response.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

Sacrosanct said:


> I need some advice. So about 4 years ago my husband had an EA sexting type relationship. We worked through it and I agreed to take him back under the condition that I would leave if it happened again. He was very remorseful (I thought) and regained my trust. Fast forward to this past weekend when I caught him messaging a family friend's daughter on FB. He is 51 and she is about 25. The messages were not really that bad (yet) but they were headed there I am sure. They were talking about getting together and going away to an island together and how much he wanted to see her. Nothing sexual. I wish I would have just let things unfold for a few more days/weeks but I did not because my hand was forced (her boyfriend actually caught her and messaged me with details and called H to threaten him).
> 
> Even though the messages were semi-innocent it brought everything flooding back from the previous time. I just don't think it's appropriate to be telling another woman you want to see her so bad and crap like that. Anyway, now I feel like I am in a position where I HAVE TO LEAVE. Even though it seems kinda foolish to throw 20 years away over non-sexual but flirty FB messages. Kids know dad is supposed to be moving out (because he told them mom wanted him out-such a manipulative sick effer). I can't stand the sight of him because I know he has most likely been doing stuff like this all along although he denies it. He has offered to go to therapy because he thinks he needs help. He acknowledges that he thrives on the attention. He did not blame me but did state that I have been emotionally distant and he thought I was cheating (never have but I have recently started some new hobbies that he finds suspicious because he is jealous and controlling) so he was seeking other attention I guess.
> 
> Can I even give him another chance given my ultimatum from the past? I mean if I give him another chance doesn't that give him the license to do whatever because I'm a doormat who doesn't stick to her guns? Or doesn't it really count because this wasn't really "that big of a deal". Just need some insight from you guys...


This is not the only other time he did this. This is the only other time you caught him doing this, which may not be the same thing.

And do not let him blame you for his bad behaviour.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

TAMAT said:


> Copy all the messages to the girls parents, your WH has to pay for this in one way or another to keep him from doing it again.
> 
> He is 50 years old he should not be involved with and disrupting young peoples lives by exploiting his position as a family friend.
> 
> Tamat


Her parents? Why? She is 25, not 15, she is an adult in her own right.

However, keep in touch with her boyfriend as their communications might have gone underground.


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## Sacrosanct (Jun 16, 2014)

Spicy said:


> Who was his first EA with? Someone he knew in real life or an random online person?
> 
> This is very serious and it is someone you all know. Tremendous damage is being done.


The first one was someone he randomly met at a sporting event. That one hurt less even though there were nude pics and stuff involved because this one is a "real" person. One I may see from time to time. One whose parents I will now avoid due to embarrassment. I can't believe he would put me in a position where I would have to see her and even hang out with her all while they are carrying on a secret relationship behind my back. That hurts SO bad.


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## Sacrosanct (Jun 16, 2014)

Thank you all for your insight. I am happy to have people to share this with because I am too mortified to tell anyone else. I think you are right that he is most likely a serial cheater and that he will most likely never change. I know deep down that it is time to end this relationship but it is SO SCARY!!!! 20 years. Poof. Plus he is not easy to leave as I did leave him years ago due to his controlling ways and he made my life hell. Typical narcissist behavior. In and out of court, constant threats, on and on. I am dreading going through that again. In fact I basically went back to him before because it "was easier". I am just so scared and it would be so much easier to just forgive and forget and continue on raising the kids, living the good life etc. I know that comes at my own expense however...


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## RWB (Feb 6, 2010)

Sacrosanct said:


> Even though the messages were semi-innocent it brought everything flooding back from the previous time. I just don't think it's appropriate to be telling another woman you want to see her so bad and crap like that. *Anyway, now I feel like I am in a position where I HAVE TO LEAVE. Even though it seems kinda foolish to throw 20 years away over non-sexual but flirty FB messages.* Kids know dad is supposed to be moving out (because he told them mom wanted him out-such a manipulative sick effer). I can't stand the sight of him because I know he has most likely been doing stuff like this all along although he denies it. He has offered to go to therapy because he thinks he needs help. He acknowledges that he thrives on the attention. He did not blame me but did state that I have been emotionally distant and he thought I was cheating (never have but I have recently started some new hobbies that he finds suspicious because he is jealous and controlling) so he was seeking other attention I guess.
> 
> Can I even give him another chance given my ultimatum from the past?


S,

The old 3rd chance?

Nope. Don't do it. I gave my fWW a 2nd, no way in hell would I go a 3rd. 

BTW, very likely this "affair" is just the one you caught him in and he still blames you. You can do so much better.


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## Thor (Oct 31, 2011)

I have no doubt this was an affair. It was a betrayal of your marriage. And that is the crux of the matter really. Betrayal. Beyond that it is only details which don't really matter all that much. He could have stolen money from you for something you greatly object to, and that would be a betrayal. He could have had sex with a stranger at a bar, and that is another kind of betrayal. But those are just the details.

A lot of us, probably almost all of us, get too tied up into the details, ignoring the more important issue that this person is willing to betray us and knew it was wrong as they did it.

I think you should talk to a lawyer to get good information on how to proceed with divorce to get the best outcome for yourself. Also, find resources to help with how to divorce a personality disordered person. Narcissists and Borderlines can be somewhat managed during divorce. There are books and websites on how to do it. 

A personal therapist for you might be a big support as you go through all this.

Good luck.


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## She'sStillGotIt (Jul 30, 2016)

Sacrosanct said:


> They were talking about getting together and going away to an island together and how much he wanted to see her. Nothing sexual. I wish I would have just let things unfold for a few more days/weeks but I did not because my hand was forced (her boyfriend actually caught her and messaged me with details and called H to threaten him).


He's lucky it was the young lady's boyfriend and not her FATHER. What the hell is wrong with this fool that he has to be acting like some middle-aged lech, sniffing around the daughter of mutual friends? 

It's extremely obvious that you're trying desperately to delude yourself into thinking his disgustingly inappropriate behavior with a supposed friend's daughter was just 'flirty,' but even you admit you have no idea where it would have gone had her boyfriend not intervened. I think anyone over 12 years old knows exactly where he would have tried to take that. Since he's already proven himself to be a liar and a cheater as well as an untrustworthy supposed 'friend' to her father, you're fooling yourself if you think he has some kind of code of ethics that would have prevented him from jumping ALL over the opportunity if it had arisen.



> I can't stand the sight of him because I know he has most likely been doing stuff like this all along although he denies it. He has offered to go to therapy because he thinks he needs help. He acknowledges that he thrives on the attention. He did not blame me but did state that I have been emotionally distant and he thought I was cheating (never have but I have recently started some new hobbies that he finds suspicious because he is jealous and controlling) so he was seeking other attention I guess.


You're more than likely *right*. You don't catch them every time they cheat. You caught him once, he faked 'remorse' and put on the sad puppy dog eyes swearing on his children's lives that he'd never do it again, then continued doing it - just being a whole lot sneakier to avoid getting caught again. I think it would also be terribly* naive *to believe there was never a woman stupid enough out there to meet with his pitiful ass. You'd be surprised at how desperate some women can be for sex or attention. So it would be very wise to get yourself a full STD screening, regardless of how many lies he tells you about never having met up with anyone.


> Can I even give him another chance given my ultimatum from the past? I mean if I give him another chance doesn't that give him the license to do whatever because I'm a doormat who doesn't stick to her guns? Or doesn't it really count because this wasn't really "that big of a deal". Just need some insight from you guys...


How many chances are you supposed to give a serial cheater?

And one whose more than likely physically cheated numerous times over the years, as well?

Keep 'forgiving' a remorseless serial cheater and this, unfortunately, is where you'll continue to find yourself.


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## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

Sacrosanct said:


> I need some advice. So about 4 years ago my husband had an EA sexting type relationship. We worked through it and I agreed to take him back under the condition that I would leave if it happened again. He was very remorseful (I thought) and regained my trust. Fast forward to this past weekend when I caught him messaging a family friend's daughter on FB. He is 51 and she is about 25. The messages were not really that bad (yet) but they were headed there I am sure. They were talking about getting together and going away to an island together and how much he wanted to see her. Nothing sexual. I wish I would have just let things unfold for a few more days/weeks but I did not because my hand was forced (her boyfriend actually caught her and messaged me with details and called H to threaten him).
> 
> Even though the messages were semi-innocent it brought everything flooding back from the previous time. I just don't think it's appropriate to be telling another woman you want to see her so bad and crap like that. Anyway, now I feel like I am in a position where I HAVE TO LEAVE. Even though it seems kinda foolish to throw 20 years away over non-sexual but flirty FB messages. Kids know dad is supposed to be moving out (because he told them mom wanted him out-such a manipulative sick effer). I can't stand the sight of him because I know he has most likely been doing stuff like this all along although he denies it. He has offered to go to therapy because he thinks he needs help. He acknowledges that he thrives on the attention. He did not blame me but did state that I have been emotionally distant and he thought I was cheating (never have but I have recently started some new hobbies that he finds suspicious because he is jealous and controlling) so he was seeking other attention I guess.
> 
> Can I even give him another chance given my ultimatum from the past? I mean if I give him another chance doesn't that give him the license to do whatever because I'm a doormat who doesn't stick to her guns? Or doesn't it really count because this wasn't really "that big of a deal". Just need some insight from you guys...


Do you want him in your life? Aren't your kids old enough to tell them the truth, they must be at least teenagers?
He needs consequences and tbh I would expose him to the parents of the 25 year old. He sounds creepy texting girls half his age. Maybe he does have a problem, tell him to go get help. You want a separation, do not consider taking him back if he doesn't get help.


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## TAMAT (Jun 20, 2015)

MattMatt,

You wrote, *Her parents? Why? She is 25, not 15, she is an adult in her own right.*

Except that if he is a family friend he may have known the girl when she was 15 or even younger. 

There is also an element of trust the girls parents have extending to him by allowing him to be a family friend, which he has betrayed. 

Yes Monica Lewinski was 23 when she had her affair with President Clinton, but Clinton was the one in a position of power.

Tamat


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## Jus260 (Mar 24, 2016)

Abc123wife said:


> "They were talking about getting together and going away to an island together and how much he wanted to see her. Nothing sexual."
> 
> Wtf? Not sexual? Why else do a female and male go off to an island together? He can't wait to see her? For what? Site seeing?!
> 
> How creepy! Your 51 year old WH is messaging a family friend's 25 year old daughter! Why would you want to stay with this serial cheater who is trying to manipulate you by involving your children?


This is like the story years ago when a football player was in his car wearing a bullet proof vest, was in posession of an assault rifle and several handguns, clearly on his way to attempt murder. He missed his exit on the way to the victim's house. The cops pulled this idiot over when they saw him making an illegal U turn. 

He was given 7 years for who knows what. It should have been for attempted murder because that's clearly what he was in his way to do. The punishment has to fit the crime and you have to take into account what the ultimate intention was.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

TAMAT said:


> MattMatt,
> 
> You wrote, *Her parents? Why? She is 25, not 15, she is an adult in her own right.*
> 
> ...


But he may not have.

And she is old enough to have children her own, run a household budget, etc.

So outing her to her parents might seem petty.


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## alte Dame (Aug 7, 2012)

The years go by quickly and you will regret letting this go on and on. I know you have sunk cost here, but that isn't an argument against taking your life back.

He sounds like a serial cheater. He sounds abusive. He is definitely a liar.

Do you really want to find yourself dying next to him years from now? You're worth SO much more than that. 

Don't think of it as 20 years lost. Think of it as the time you had your kids, so definitely a life positive.

I think you should go big.

Kick him out. He's calling your bluff here. I would call his.


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## Sacrosanct (Jun 16, 2014)

I have always suspected that he really likes younger girls. He has extremely poor boundaries and is always in some type of inappropriate thing with younger girls whether it is texting or just talking. Not always sexual but just inappropriate. Like he is immature and doesn't get boundaries do you know what I mean? Has inappropriate texts with guys too, just not stuff that adults deal with...he's like trapped in high school ****. I don't think he ever grew up. This post is making me cry because here I am still too scared to make a definite move...despite these flaws. Yet there is a lot of good too which of course has been downplayed in light of the betrayal. Makes me sick.


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## Jessica38 (Feb 28, 2017)

I recommend getting a copy of Surviving an Affair and following the steps given to a T. Your husband is having another EA and IMO you need to treat it as such by exposing to family and friends (including your kids on your own so your husband isn't able to minimize the affair/damage to them first), and to give your husband the chance to save your marriage (if you're willing) by coming to you hat in hand and willing to implement extraordinary precautions to give you the safety of knowing it would be almost impossible for something like this to happen again.

That's only if you're willing to consider recovery though. Your husband has very poor boundaries around women and was willing to risk your relationship for ego nibbles.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

TAMAT said:


> MattMatt,
> 
> You wrote, *Her parents? Why? She is 25, not 15, she is an adult in her own right.*
> 
> ...


Under those circumstances, I would agree with the point you make.


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## David51 (Sep 12, 2017)

Jessica38 said:


> I recommend getting a copy of Surviving an Affair and following the steps given to a T. Your husband is having another EA and IMO you need to treat it as such by exposing to family and friends (including your kids on your own so your husband isn't able to minimize the affair/damage to them first), and to give your husband the chance to save your marriage (if you're willing) by coming to you hat in hand and willing to implement extraordinary precautions to give you the safety of knowing it would be almost impossible for something like this to happen again.
> 
> That's only if you're willing to consider recovery though. Your husband has very poor boundaries around women and was willing to risk your relationship for ego nibbles.




Once a cheater always a cheater, in my opinion.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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