# How much of women's affairs are about the loss of respect.



## sokillme

_*Note: To be clear, I am not saying cheating is caused by a lack of respect, cheating is only caused by a lack of character.*_

So as you probably all know I have been reading on here and other sites for quite a while. I was reading a post on another site and the guy basically said, caught her and for 3 months he was trying to nice her back, then at the 3 month mark something changed and he told her he was divorcing, and on a dime as is usual she changed.

It made me think, this is SO COMMON. But I used to think the wife changes because of the fear of losing the marriage. But I am wondering is it really because his assertiveness makes her regain her respect for him?

respect -


> a feeling of deep admiration for someone or something elicited by their abilities, qualities, or achievements.


Besides guys who marry assholes, it seems to me there are two types of guys who get cheated on the most. The guy who is cruel to his wife, and the guy who is a pushover or not assertive, or just an idiot. In both cases it seems like the wife has lost the feeling I described above.

It not even that they fall out of love with their husbands but more so when they lose respect for them. Like maybe being with someone that wives can respect is the most important factor in the bond? _(Someone with good character won't cheat but someone who is iffy might)_

Am I on to something here? Ladies how important would you rate having respect for your SO is in your relationship?


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## theloveofmylife

Yeah, I couldn't be attracted to someone I don't respect and admire (at least not long term). I respect my husband as a good man and admire him in many ways, and he still makes my heart beat faster just entering a room.


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## C.C. says ...

sokillme said:


> Like maybe being with someone that wives can respect is the most important factor in the bond?


I would say it is THE most important factor in the bond and THE most important factor in whether or not a woman would cheat.

I’ve always thought this.

I’m not talking about respect on the level of whether or not he’s a good father and friend. That’s different. I’m talking about respecting him as the MAN in the relationship. The leader. The protector. The one that refuses to be disrespected.

I know women cheat for all reasons and sometimes they cheat because they feel entitled. Maybe they’re sex fiends. Maybe their husband is cruel and they’re looking for a soft place to fall.

But the respect aspect is the main factor, I believe. That’s why so many “nice guys” fall by the wayside. When you’re too accommodating and understanding to a woman, she’ll stomp all over you. Not on purpose usually. It’s in our blood, man.

* I’m speaking only for myself here and that’s just one woman’s opinion. I really do believe that respecting a man as the MAN (sexy, strong, commanding yet fair, sweet only to his woman, won’t be pushed around) is the #1 thing that would never allow us to cheat on him. Not out of fear. Out of absolute ultimate respect for him.

I know for myself, I want to work for it.

ok, ok I’ll turn in my woman card now lol.


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## sokillme

C.C. says ... said:


> I would say it is THE most important factor in the bond and THE most important factor in whether or not a woman would cheat.
> 
> I’ve always thought this.
> 
> I’m not talking about respect on the level of whether or not he’s a good father and friend. That’s different. I’m talking about respecting him as the MAN in the relationship. The leader. The protector. The one that refuses to be disrespected.
> 
> I know women cheat for all reasons and sometimes they cheat because they feel entitled. Maybe they’re sex fiends. Maybe their husband is cruel and they’re looking for a soft place to fall.
> 
> But the respect aspect is the main factor, I believe. That’s why so many “nice guys” fall by the wayside. When you’re too accommodating and understanding to a woman, she’ll stomp all over you. Not on purpose usually. It’s in our blood, man.
> 
> * I’m speaking only for myself here and that’s just one woman’s opinion. I really do believe that respecting a man as the MAN (sexy, strong, commanding yet fair, sweet only to his woman, won’t be pushed around) is the #1 thing that would never allow us to cheat on him. Not out of fear. Out of absolute ultimate respect for him.
> 
> I know for myself, I want to work for it.
> 
> ok, ok I’ll turn in my woman card now lol.


Actually this has been my experience. When I was young, I knew this girl who I was pursuing and she was kind of giving me the run around. Then one day I got fed up and just ghosted. For a few years later she met one of my best friends and found out that this guy knew me. He told me that she practically gushed about me. It seemed weird to me because she was not into me before. Then I bumped into her and she asked out and tried to pursue me, but I had long since moved on. 

That is an extreme example but it seem to me one consistency about this stories is the women who cheat, the ones who don't come from some serious dysfunction usually just don't respect their husband. Some of them still love their husband but they don't see him as the guy they want to follow, and the guy they cheat with is a guy they do want to follow. Usually someone at work or something. 

This is why I tell men, get your **** done. Don't ever expect your wife to take care of you. Let her do that because she wants to not because you expect it. I often tell my wife NOT to do that, that I can do that on my own. This is the reason. I will make unilateral decisions for her benefit without discussion, like if we need something done that is going to benefit her I say we are doing this, even though I know her first impulse is she would want to sacrifice. Nope, I can see you need this so we are doing it. Big and small. I do this because that is what a leader does. Part of taking care my **** is taking care of her and there is no compromise on that. 

However I will call her on her ****. I recognize the tests and call them out. I am at the point where now I just laugh like, yeah, your not serious with this. 

I think I learned that from my Father, but also being around my sisters and them telling me not to be a wimp. But when I was young I did try to nice girls into liking me but that was more about trying to hedge my bets against rejection.

What's funny is women want to respect he man, and men want to be respected. Got to earn it though. 

I think maybe the advice for a successful marriage is to be the man that is easy for your wife to respect.


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## happyhusband0005

sokillme said:


> So as you probably all know I have been reading on here and other sites for quite a while. I was reading a post on another site and the guy basically said, caught her and for 3 months he was trying to nice her back, then at the 3 month mark something changed and he told her he was divorcing, and on a dime as is usual she changed.
> 
> It made me think, this is SO COMMON. But I used to think the wife changes because of the fear of losing the marriage. But I am wondering is it really because his assertiveness makes her regain her respect for him?
> 
> respect -
> 
> 
> It seems to me there are two types of guys who get cheated on the most. The guy who is cruel to his wife, and the guy who is a pushover or not assertive, or just an idiot. In both cases it seems like the wife has lost the feeling I described above.
> 
> It not even that they fall out of love with their husbands but more so when they lose respect for them. Like maybe being with someone that wives can respect is the most important factor in the bond?
> 
> Am I on to something here? Ladies how important would you rate having respect for your SO is in your relationship?


"You can't respect someone who kisses your ass" - Ferris Bueller.


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## theloveofmylife

happyhusband0005 said:


> "You can't respect someone who kisses your ass"


It depends on the context, but yeah. 😇



C.C. says ... said:


> * I’m speaking only for myself here and that’s just one woman’s opinion. I really do believe that respecting a man as the MAN (sexy, strong, commanding yet fair, sweet only to his woman, won’t be pushed around) is the #1 thing that would never allow us to cheat on him. Not out of fear. Out of absolute ultimate respect for him.


Well said.

I adore my man. Why the hell would I want any other?


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## TomNebraska

C.C. says ... said:


> ...
> 
> But the respect aspect is the main factor, I believe. That’s why so many “nice guys” fall by the wayside. When you’re too accommodating and understanding to a woman, she’ll stomp all over you. Not on purpose usually. It’s in our blood, man.
> 
> * ...


It seems to pretty much come down to a basic power struggle doesn't it? 

Took me longer to figure that out than it should've. And a little longer to get over it and not be bitter about it. 

Sometimes I find it helps to remind myself that the lady who sang "_Stand By Your Man_" was *married five times*.


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## Torninhalf

sokillme said:


> So as you probably all know I have been reading on here and other sites for quite a while. I was reading a post on another site and the guy basically said, caught her and for 3 months he was trying to nice her back, then at the 3 month mark something changed and he told her he was divorcing, and on a dime as is usual she changed.
> 
> It made me think, this is SO COMMON. But I used to think the wife changes because of the fear of losing the marriage. But I am wondering is it really because his assertiveness makes her regain her respect for him?
> 
> respect -
> 
> 
> It seems to me there are two types of guys who get cheated on the most. The guy who is cruel to his wife, and the guy who is a pushover or not assertive, or just an idiot. In both cases it seems like the wife has lost the feeling I described above.
> 
> It not even that they fall out of love with their husbands but more so when they lose respect for them. Like maybe being with someone that wives can respect is the most important factor in the bond?
> 
> Am I on to something here? Ladies how important would you rate having respect for your SO is in your relationship?


I know for me personally I have lost all respect for my STBXH and I now have zero physical attraction to him. It took a while for it to completely disappear but now that it is gone I can’t see it ever coming back.


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## NextTimeAround

> I recognize the tests and call them out.


can you give examples of a few tests. I'd like to think that I don't do it.


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## sokillme

TomNebraska said:


> It seems to pretty much come down to a basic power struggle doesn't it?
> 
> Took me longer to figure that out than it should've. And a little longer to get over it and not be bitter about it.
> 
> Sometimes I find it helps to remind myself that the lady who sang "_Stand By Your Man_" was *married five times*.


It's not power it's strength. The caveat is you have to marry someone who has character. But even if they don't cheat on you, if your wife loses respect for you, your marriage is dead. And strength doesn't mean be a bully, or boss. It means get your **** done, take care of your own, don't take any ****, and be emotionally strong enough to show your soft side to your wife. Not be emotional but show your feelings.


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## sokillme

NextTimeAround said:


> can you give examples of a few tests. I'd like to think that I don't do it.


Well everyone is different.

For me it's mostly about being moody. I will only put up with that **** for so long. You don't get to talk to me without respect much or I will call that **** out and detach until there is an apology. I will respectfully call you out on that. 

I used to get a hard time from my Mother in Law about Football as my Father in Law isn't into sports. Just ignored it did what I wanted, bought the ticket. Now I earned the money to pay for the Ticket. Didn't whine wasn't disrespectful, just said that is not what we do in our house, did what I wanted.

My wife and I negotiate things. A lot of my friends wives pick out their cloths, make all the plans, **** like that. Nope, I learned how to dress myself growing up, I want to have style, the only person laying out my cloths was my Mom until I was about 11. Plans are discussed. Trips are planned together, finances are planned together. Our wedding was our wedding. It was her day, but our wedding. I was involved in all the planning. I went in there wanting it to be her day, but it reflected me too, I didn't just act like tell me when to show up. Our house is decorated with our styles (a combination of both of us). She has even brought stuff home where I am like, nah. 

I am active in every part of our marriage. It is my priority.

I also want to say so I don't sound like an ogre, that I am my wife's biggest advocate. And she makes it easy because there is no one I respect more. I know I know her better then even her parents. If she told me she wanted to be an airline pilot I would be trying to make a way for her to do that. No questions asked. 

We are a team.


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## lovelygirl

I can't stress enough how important _*maturity and responsibility *_are in a man. 
These 2 elements lead to_ respect _and respect leads to _sexual attraction. _
This is how it works for me. 

I don't get to respect a man who is not mature enough to get his sh*t together (maturity) and not only for him (but in way) also for his SO (responsibility)_._ It's attractive how a man is able to go a step further and "take care" of his SO, not because the latter can't but because the man is confident enough that this is the right choice for both him and his SO. It makes him reliable and confident in my eyes. 

These will make him NOT allow disrespect and call his SO if ever happens to be treated unfairly. This is about having personality and self-worth.

Being a team with your SO is a great act of maturity and responsibility. This is a huge sexual attraction_ per se_ because it makes him a* real man* in my eyes and not just a boy who's lazy and wants to be taken care of_. _

All these make him want be a respectful leader and a protector and I think all women want these core elements in their man. 

Respect him as a human being and respect him as your MAN are 2 different things. The latter is very appealing to keep on seeing him with a different eye.


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## TJW

I agree with the premise that respect is the greatest factor in adultery. Ephesians 5:33 is a command which does not license disrespect on the basis of her husband's actions.

A wife who does not respect her husband should begin by having respect for God. Conversely, the husband is not licensed in this passage to not love his wife because she doesn't have his dream attributes.


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## Luckylucky

Respect is fleeting though. Sure, I’ve had times where my man did something and I lost respect - in that moment. Tomorrow is always a brand new day, he gets a chance to start over. None of that would make me want to cheat though. I’m sure he’s had moments too where he’s lost respect for me. All things are feelings and feelings change all the time. 

I’ve known a few cheating women and men over the decades, and they were just juvenile and entitled little people. Many of these were adult friends of my parents and to be honest even as a kid/teen I don’t think any of these people had the capacity to consider deep concepts like respect. Sorry to sound so superior, they struck me as a little simple in their outlook. Many of those people are BSC as old people let me tell you.


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## Livvie

lovelygirl said:


> I can't stress enough how important _*maturity and responsibility *_are in a man.
> These 2 elements lead to_ respect _and respect leads to _sexual attraction. _
> This is how it works for me.
> 
> I don't get to respect a man who is not mature enough to get his sh*t together (maturity) and not only for him (but in way) also for his SO (responsibility)_._ It's attractive how a man is able to go a step further and "take care" of his SO, not because the latter can't but because the man is confident enough that this is the right choice for both him and his SO. It makes him reliable and confident in my eyes.
> 
> These will make him NOT allow disrespect and call his SO if ever happens to be treated unfairly. This is about having personality and self-worth.
> 
> Being a team with your SO is a great act of maturity and responsibility. This is a huge sexual attraction_ per se_ because it makes him a* real man* in my eyes and not just a boy who's lazy and wants to be taken care of_. _
> 
> All these make him want be a respectful leader and a protector and I think all women want these core elements in their man.
> 
> Respect him as a human being and respect him as your MAN are 2 different things. The latter is very appealing to keep on seeing him with a different eye.


.
What do you mean by a "leader and protector"? You.say you think all women want these things.

I have a full time professional job. I own my own home. I manage work, my finances, my home, my vehicle, and absolutely everything that goes along with those things. 

I'm single and looking for a life partner. Partner being the key word. I am nicely capable of navigating life as an adult.... so what is a future man supposed to _lead_ me on? You didn't say collaborate, you said LEAD. So what does that leadership look like? Why would it be leadership rather than partnership? 

And by protect do you mean physically, like in the instance of an intruder or something like that?


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## GC1234

sokillme said:


> But I am wondering is it really because his assertiveness makes her regain her respect for him?


I think you raise a good point here! Yes.


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## farsidejunky

The thing that is truly hard for some to grasp is that in order for one to be irreplaceable, respected, cherished, etc, they must actually act in a way that makes them irreplaceable, respected, cherished, etc.

It takes effort. It doesn't just happen organically for most of us.

Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk


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## DudeInProgress

Livvie said:


> .
> What do you mean by a "leader and protector"? You.say you think all women want these things.
> 
> I have a full time professional job. I own my own home. I manage work, my finances, my home, my vehicle, and absolutely everything that goes along with those things.
> 
> I'm single and looking for a life partner. Partner being the key word. I am nicely capable of navigating life as an adult.... so what is a future man supposed to _lead_ me on? You didn't say collaborate, you said LEAD. So what does that leadership look like? Why would it be leadership rather than partnership?
> 
> And by protect do you mean physically, like in the instance of an intruder or something like that?


Even a partnership, there is a leader. There’s no such thing as a truly 50-50 relationship, especially a romantic/marriage relationship. Yes it’s a partnership, and it should be collaborative, but there is always a leader. Someone always has the final authority and responsibility to lead the dynamics, effectiveness and vision of the relationship. And in every successful marriage I’ve ever seen, that leadership role is the man.

Think of it like the captain / first officer model. They are a collaborative leadership team for their ship or aircraft, or family as the case may be. The first officer has important responsibilities and is a critical and valued source of input, advise and feedback for the captain. Decisions are often made collaboratively, but there is only one captain.


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## farsidejunky

NextTimeAround said:


> can you give examples of a few tests. I'd like to think that I don't do it.


A classic test is what @MEM2020 used to refer to as poking, and my wife still periodically does.

Normally when she pokes, she is in a crabby mood and she comes at me with some form of "I told you so" over the 10% of something that isn't working well, while completely disregarding the 90% that is...even if she contributed to part of that 90%. It is a manifestation of her internal dialogue and cognitive bias that says I'm not listening to her when in fact she was a major part of that solution. There is NO competing with that insecure internal dialogue. 

You effectively have three options in this situation:

Worst option: escalate and have a heated argument. This instinctively shows her that I don't have control over my composure. 

Satisfactory option: "Are you done?" and/or withdraw, with a lack of meeting needs, until an apology is made. Another option I use when I have nothing witty is to simply say, "I Don't have the ability nor the interest to compete with your internal dialogue".

Ideal option: Say something humorous about the situation. "I swear... You look just like... You are the spitting image of someone who just suggested X was a good idea." That normally elicits a smile, followed by a flirty "shut up". Situation diffused. Handled like a boss.

However, if the mood is foul enough, sometimes the ideal option doesn't work. If she escalates further, I will revert to the satisfactory option.

Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk


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## sokillme

Luckylucky said:


> Respect is fleeting though. Sure, I’ve had times where my man did something and I lost respect - in that moment. Tomorrow is always a brand new day, he gets a chance to start over. None of that would make me want to cheat though. I’m sure he’s had moments too where he’s lost respect for me. All things are feelings and feelings change all the time.
> 
> I’ve known a few cheating women and men over the decades, and they were just juvenile and entitled little people. Many of these were adult friends of my parents and to be honest even as a kid/teen I don’t think any of these people had the capacity to consider deep concepts like respect. Sorry to sound so superior, they struck me as a little simple in their outlook. Many of those people are BSC as old people let me tell you.


Don't apologize, keeping your word makes you superior.


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## Livvie

DudeInProgress said:


> Even a partnership, there is a leader. There’s no such thing as a truly 50-50 relationship, especially a romantic/marriage relationship. Yes it’s a partnership, and it should be collaborative, but there is always a leader. Someone always has the final authority and responsibility to lead the dynamics, effectiveness and vision of the relationship. And in every successful marriage I’ve ever seen, that leadership role is the man.
> 
> Think of it like the captain / first officer model. They are a collaborative leadership team for their ship or aircraft, or family as the case may be. The first officer has important responsibilities and is a critical and valued source of input, advise and feedback for the captain. Decisions are often made collaboratively, but there is only one captain.


So, help me out here... because I really really don't understand.

I'm currently single, looking to find my life partner. My kids are high school senior and college graduate age.

So it's going to be just my partner and myself as our basic family living unit going forward into the future, as older adults. I come with a full time job with healthcare, and a lot of assets, financial and real estate. I have no unsecured debt.

What kinds of issues will we NOT 50/50 collaborate on, _that he will take the lead role on_?

My brain is kinda breaking trying to figure out what you all mean. 

In what ways will the male/captain take the LEAD? And WHY?

It won't be where we live. I have real estate with a **** ton of equity, and a job in a certain location. Seems to me where we live should be a 50/50 decision, why would he take the lead?

It won't be finances. I've been running my own finances for a decade now, in my previous long marriage I'm actually the one who was in charge of finances because that's a strength of mine, and my profession involves finances. Why would it not be 50/50 and why would he take the lead?

Family involvement decisions.... We are both older adults, why would any decisions about family not be collaborative, why would he take the lead? 

Trips, vacations, leisure and hobby activities. My brain is straining to come up with a reason my male partner would take the LEAD in this stuff. Just because he's a male? Why?

Help me out here, people. I don't understand in what life decisions the dude should take the LEAD on and exactly WHY?


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## farsidejunky

Livvie said:


> So, help me out here... because I really really don't understand.
> 
> I'm currently single, looking to find my life partner. My kids are high school senior and college graduate age.
> 
> So it's going to be just my partner and myself as our basic family living unit going forward into the future, as older adults. I come with a full time job with healthcare, and a lot of assets, financial and real estate. I have no unsecured debt.
> 
> What kinds of issues will we NOT 50/50 collaborate on, _that he will take the lead role on_?
> 
> My brain is kinda breaking trying to figure out what you all mean.
> 
> In what ways will the male/captain take the LEAD? And WHY?
> 
> It won't be where we live. I have real estate with a **** ton of equity, and a job in a certain location. Seems to me where we live should be a 50/50 decision, why would he take the lead?
> 
> It won't be finances. I've been running my own finances for a decade now, in my previous long marriage I'm actually the one who was in charge of finances because that's a strength of mine, and my profession involves finances. Why would it not be 50/50 and why would he take the lead?
> 
> Family involvement decisions.... We are both older adults, why would any decisions about family not be collaborative, why would he take the lead?
> 
> Trips, vacations, leisure and hobby activities. My brain is straining to come up with a reason my male partner would take the LEAD in this stuff. Just because he's a male? Why?
> 
> Help me out here, people. I don't understand in what life decisions the dude should take the LEAD on and exactly WHY?


The simplest way to look at it is this.

You two have something you simply can't agree on. Not major relationship type issues, but more along the lines of something financial.

Who has the final say?

In our relationship, I have the final say on most things, unless she is clearly more knowledgeable than I. Then I defer. But that is far less frequent than the former.

Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk


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## Livvie

farsidejunky said:


> The simplest way to look at it is this.
> 
> You two have something you simply can't agree on. Not major relationship type issues, but more along the lines of something financial.
> 
> Who has the final say?
> 
> In our relationship, I have the final say on most things, unless she is clearly more knowledgeable than I. Then I defer. But that is far less frequent than the former.
> 
> Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk


So, if neither of you has more knowledge about something than the other, you get to make the decision just because you are a male?


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## farsidejunky

Livvie said:


> So, if neither of you has more knowledge about something than the other, you get to make the decision just because you are a male?


Not because I am male, but rather because my wife is more comfortable in that role. 

What I am espousing has nothing to do with male or female, and everything to do with who has the more dominant role in the relationship.

Oftentimes it is a woman. It just isn't that way in my marriage.

Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk


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## DudeInProgress

Livvie said:


> So, if neither of you has more knowledge about something than the other, you get to make the decision just because you are a male?


no, not because he’s male, because he is the leader in the relationship. It’s the same in my marriage and every other successful, long-term, generally happy marriage that I’m aware of.

Someone is the leader. There is no such thing as a true 50/50 across the board, it doesn’t work like that. It’s always 51/49, 55/45, 60/40, etc. That does not make one better or more important than the other, it’s just the leadership dynamic of the relationship. And the VAST majority of women prefer the man to be in that role. And every time I’ve seen it reversed, the woman loses respect for the man and it’s not a good situation.

And every time I’ve seen a couple claim they are 50/50, it’s not. There is still a leader in the relationship, it’s just not the man.


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## lovelygirl

Livvie said:


> .
> What do you mean by a "leader and protector"? You.say you think all women want these things.
> 
> I have a full time professional job. I own my own home. I manage work, my finances, my home, my vehicle, and absolutely everything that goes along with those things.
> 
> I'm single and looking for a life partner. Partner being the key word. I am nicely capable of navigating life as an adult.... so what is a future man supposed to _lead_ me on? You didn't say collaborate, you said LEAD. So what does that leadership look like? Why would it be leadership rather than partnership?
> 
> And by protect do you mean physically, like in the instance of an intruder or something like that?


I meant it in a totally different context.

I was referring to the vibe and the "energy" that the man brings into the relationship, rather than the liteal meaning of "protector".

I was grown in a family where mom was the only decision-making party and I feel that, as a woman, she didn't have much support in terms of a "male" energy. I miss that.

Just becauase a woman is indipendent financially and has her own life, she still needs a "strong" man by her side - meaning - one who brings the same type of vibe into the relationship.

As for taking decisions, working as a team would be ideal but there are spheres where one dominates the other from time to time. It really depends on how they agree and on the natural flow of the relationship.

Sent from my SM-N960F using Tapatalk


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## sokillme

Livvie said:


> So, help me out here... because I really really don't understand.
> 
> I'm currently single, looking to find my life partner. My kids are high school senior and college graduate age.
> 
> So it's going to be just my partner and myself as our basic family living unit going forward into the future, as older adults. I come with a full time job with healthcare, and a lot of assets, financial and real estate. I have no unsecured debt.
> 
> What kinds of issues will we NOT 50/50 collaborate on, _that he will take the lead role on_?
> 
> My brain is kinda breaking trying to figure out what you all mean.
> 
> In what ways will the male/captain take the LEAD? And WHY?
> 
> It won't be where we live. I have real estate with a **** ton of equity, and a job in a certain location. Seems to me where we live should be a 50/50 decision, why would he take the lead?
> 
> It won't be finances. I've been running my own finances for a decade now, in my previous long marriage I'm actually the one who was in charge of finances because that's a strength of mine, and my profession involves finances. Why would it not be 50/50 and why would he take the lead?
> 
> Family involvement decisions.... We are both older adults, why would any decisions about family not be collaborative, why would he take the lead?
> 
> Trips, vacations, leisure and hobby activities. My brain is straining to come up with a reason my male partner would take the LEAD in this stuff. Just because he's a male? Why?
> 
> Help me out here, people. I don't understand in what life decisions the dude should take the LEAD on and exactly WHY?


Well this doesn't have to be your style. Let me first say, my wife is more then capable of taking care of herself and she was doing fine with that before she met me. I do not see my wife as a child, she has strengths and weaknesses like I do but is just as competent as I am.

If you think of areas in the marriage like projects, then my sense it there are times when my wife wants me to operate as a project leader. That doesn't mean I am king of the castle it means I am facilitating an environment where she can succeed in her role. I call my marriage a team, meaning we negotiate everything. But I am very consciously trying to create and environment for her to feel safe and free to succeed in. This is what I mean by - get **** done. To me that is what leaders do. The don't say - you do as I say. They say what are our goals, what are we doing. Then, OK how can I help us get there. Now this is the role I see myself in and it's not like we said, you need to be in this role and I need to be in this one. Over time though I could see this is really what she needed. But also acting this way falls in line with my nature and brings me a great sense of purpose.

In our case, my wife is really running the day to day aspects of the home, but my job is to facilitate an environment to enable her to do that successfully. Usually I will say, we need to think about this, or we need to protect ourselves here. I make it a point to monitor those things. Also my wife's style is to push herself and I may even say - please stop cleaning today and relax.It's OK if this isn't done. Or this is great and enough for me, in something she is insecure about. Often that has to do with guilt she might feel. Now that is specific to us, but I can be another set of eyes and give her a perspective of how I see her but she might not see herself. Again I am an advocate.

I think where people get into trouble is often leader is equated with boss. That is just not the same thing. Very often my wife is making the choices , there are times when she is better at it (finances is a good example, she worries about the bills so she does most of them. But you can bet I am aware of what is going on), there are times where I am willing to defer because it fits the end goals of her feeling safe. I feel my job it to create the environment for her to succeed. Kind of like a producer works with a director on a movie set. My wife does that for me to, but in our relationship it's more about how she nurtures me.

Again this may not be progressive enough for some folks, but I feel like my job is to be very strong and hard against the world, sometimes against her worst fears and her nurturing is kind of the thing that gives me peace in that role.
I wonder how many wives really understand this. Physical intimacy is also usually a part of that for men. A good example would be the lyrics for Marvin Gaye's sexual healing. Yes seriously, this is not an analogy it's a real thing. The level of release for most men when their wives show them the kindness of nurturing them (no only speaking here about sex), is like getting a full tank of gas. Not sure what the equivalency would be for women. Maybe it's the same thing but that hasn't been my experience.

In our relationship my kind of steadiness and strength is something I know she often draws on to as a kind of emotional focal point in a turbulent life. That's specific to us, but I would bet it's not uncommon, I think it's the husbands job to figure out what that is, but to offer that freely and work hard at doing that.


----------



## QuietRiot

sokillme said:


> I will make unilateral decisions for her benefit without discussion, like if we need something done that is going to benefit her I say we are doing this, even though I know her first impulse is she would want to sacrifice. Nope, I can see you need this so we are doing it. Big and small. I do this because that is what a leader does. Part of taking care my **** is taking care of her and there is no compromise on that.
> 
> However I will call her on her ****. I recognize the tests and call them out. I am at the point where now I just laugh like, yeah, your not serious with this.


I’m not going to lie, I find this behavior very hot. I’ve never been the feminist type, and I do love a man with assertiveness and authority. Or I should say my DNA loves it? I don’t know. A man with soft hands so to speak is a huge turnoff.

However, even without the respect, even if I were with a passive man with a weak spine I didn’t respect, I still wouldn’t cheat on him. I simply do not have that behavior in me. Even before I was cheated on, the thought of crossing lines made me physically queasy, regardless of the guy I was with. 

So I guess... I don’t know the answer to that! I think it could boil down to the person themselves rather than the relationship they are in... I dunno.


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## LisaDiane

I don't know that lack of respect leads to AFFAIRS, exactly...but definitely will kill any feelings of TRUST or LOVE...for ME anyway.

There is NO way that I can trust or love a man I don't respect. That's what happened with my STBX - watching him lie and pretend, and be too afraid (WEAK) to talk about issues was very very hard, but when his level of self-centered choices was undeniable (to me), ALL my respect died, and with it, the trust and love.

It was like the MASKS came off, and I realized I was married to a man I would never have married - EVER - if I met him as he is NOW. The real person he was underneath the mask was someone I had absolutely NO respect for. So I could never ever trust or love him.

To ME, RESPECT means there is something special about him that speaks to ME personally, and it doesn't matter what that is - it can even be something small - but there has to be something, or else he's just a regular man/person like everyone else out there - he's not SPECIAL to me, to my heart.

HONESTY is probably my most important quality in order for me to respect anyone. It's especially important to me, because I am impulsively open and honest, so it puts me at a big disadvantage to be with someone who chooses to deceive and trick me - because I will always believe them (at first), and I'm easily hurt by that.

But something small would be stuff like compassion for others, choosing to be unselfish to benefit me or others who are depending on him, being willing to make tough choices and LIVING WITH the consequences (instead of whining or blaming others), etc.

Being kind to animals and little creatures is also important to me. We saw a stray dog get hit by a car once, and he pulled right over to get him and take him to the vet - NO ONE ELSE STOPPED!!!!!
That meant SO much to me!!! I fawned all over him for a full week after that, I was so in awe of his care and kindness! Lol!!

Anyway, I don't know if a lack of respect really leads to affairs, but it will definitely destroy the bond and sense of commitment that someone feels towards their partner. I ended my relationship with him once I reached that tipping point. What any other person does with THAT feeling is on THEM.

But I DO think that cheating is the ultimate act of disrespect towards the other partner. And is a waste of time to forgive.


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## sokillme

LisaDiane said:


> I don't know that lack of respect leads to AFFAIRS, exactly...but definitely will kill any feelings of TRUST or LOVE...for ME anyway.


You guys are right to call me on this, how often do I say that the only reason for affairs are lack of character. I should have worded it better.

A better way to put this is loss of respect works like your quote and if she has a lack of character she might be more susceptible to cheat. Just your quote is bad enough cheating or not though.


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## lovelygirl

QuietRiot said:


> I’m not going to lie, I find this behavior very hot. I’ve never been the feminist type, and I do love a man with assertiveness and authority. Or I should say my DNA loves it? I don’t know. A man with soft hands so to speak is a huge turnoff.
> 
> However, even without the respect, even if I were with a passive man with a weak spine I didn’t respect, I still wouldn’t cheat on him. I simply do not have that behavior in me. Even before I was cheated on, the thought of crossing lines made me physically queasy, regardless of the guy I was with.
> 
> So I guess... I don’t know the answer to that! I think it could boil down to the person themselves rather than the relationship they are in... I dunno.


You found the godamn right words. 

Assertiveness and authority!!!

These turn me on!!!!!

Sent from my SM-N960F using Tapatalk


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## LisaDiane

lovelygirl said:


> You found the godamn right words.
> 
> Assertiveness and authority!!!
> 
> These turn me on!!!!!
> 
> Sent from my SM-N960F using Tapatalk


I would like to add that a guy can have all the assertiveness and authority that he wants, but if he's a liar who makes terrible choices with his "authority", and then won't own them, then I lose ALL respect for him and there's NO way I'm supporting him or tying my balloon string to his rock!!!


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## lovelygirl

LisaDiane said:


> I would like to add that a guy can have all the assertiveness and authority that he wants, but if he's a liar who makes terrible choices with his "authority", and then won't own them, then I lose ALL respect for him and there's NO way I'm supporting him or tying my balloon string to his rock!!!


Sure! This must be emphasized.

It's one thing to be controlling and posessive, it's another to lead with respect.

Sent from my SM-N960F using Tapatalk


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## sokillme

I think an interesting part of this is how consistent some guys who get cheated on are. The nice guy wimp shows up on these sites all the time, they guy who is afraid to make waves or who doesn't want to confront. The guy who feels that if he just is self sacrificing enough his wife will love him and treat him with respect. It's like a long running stereotype for a reason.


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## LisaDiane

sokillme said:


> I think an interesting part of this is how consistent some guys who get cheated on are. The nice guy wimp shows up on these sites all the time, they guy who is afraid to make waves or who doesn't want to confront. The guy who feels that if he just is self sacrificing enough his wife will love him and treat him with respect. It's like a long running stereotype for a reason.


It makes me wonder sometimes if those types of women just pick those types of men on purpose...because I don't see women like that going for stronger men who won't put up with crap. Women like that may have been dumped by more "respectable" men already, but remain unwilling to see that they have issues that need to be addressed, and instead pick a weaker guy who THEY can dominate and take advantage of.


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## QuietRiot

LisaDiane said:


> I would like to add that a guy can have all the assertiveness and authority that he wants, but if he's a liar who makes terrible choices with his "authority", and then won't own them, then I lose ALL respect for him and there's NO way I'm supporting him or tying my balloon string to his rock!!!


Believe me, feeling this right now! They are good qualities to have but they aren’t the ONLY qualities to have. They can be used for good or wielded like a weapon.


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## LisaDiane

QuietRiot said:


> Believe me, feeling this right now! They are good qualities to have but they aren’t the ONLY qualities to have. They can be used for good or wielded like a weapon.


And if he's so weak, he uses those qualities as a weapon, then I rescind my deference to him.

And if that happens too many times, then any respect I had is gone!


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## QuietRiot

sokillme said:


> I think an interesting part of this is how consistent some guys who get cheated on are. The nice guy wimp shows up on these sites all the time, they guy who is afraid to make waves or who doesn't want to confront. The guy who feels that if he just is self sacrificing enough his wife will love him and treat him with respect. It's like a long running stereotype for a reason.


Probably most of the men who do it the opposite way don’t come to get support from forums? “You cheated. Buh bye.” Is how that goes. 

Seems like every day someone is trying to slap some man into males who were cheated on here.


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## Luckylucky

I’m going to say something controversial - as a woman I think opportunity, a growing bond/time to form a friendship and self-restraint has a lot to do with it too rather than lack of respect. 

I’ve never really had an opportunity to even consider cheating. By this, I mean I haven’t had the opportunity to be with another man, be friends with another man, be in regular contact with any other man.

Let me tell you, a good-looking man with ‘that’ stare who appears to see right into me can leave me flustered, blushing and babbling. I won’t lie. But it stops right there and I’m able to somehow switch off as soon as he opens his mouth and talks the talk. And we all know that ‘talk’, those lines, the attention he gives you. So I make sure I’m never put in a close position with him ever again and can recognise exactly what he’s wanting and that he’ll say whatever he needs to say, look at me in whatever way he needs to to get what he thinks he’s going to get. A connection? A woman who just ‘gets him?’ Being an utter b**ch in response to this kind of flattery works a real treat. They don’t come back for more. 

I don’t want any of that. I don’t like getting high. So I make sure there is no opportunity. And above all I go home happy to give my all to my husband. 

Women, we’ll encounter this a lot. Whether I respect my husband or whether he’s abusive or neglectful or whatever - I just stop that ‘moment’ and never look back. 

I am certain I’m not very popular with a lot of my husband’s friends and colleagues because any attempt by them to be more than friendly gets shut down quickly. That’s ok, I’d rather be a b*_ch in their eyes than be a b_%ch to my husband.


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## sokillme

Luckylucky said:


> I’m going to say something controversial - as a woman I think opportunity, a growing bond/time to form a friendship and self-restraint has a lot to do with it too rather than lack of respect.
> 
> I’ve never really had an opportunity to even consider cheating. By this, I mean I haven’t had the opportunity to be with another man, be friends with another man, be in regular contact with any other man.
> 
> Let me tell you, a good-looking man with ‘that’ stare who appears to see right into me can leave me flustered, blushing and babbling. I won’t lie. But it stops right there and I’m able to somehow switch off as soon as he opens his mouth and talks the talk. And we all know that ‘talk’, those lines, the attention he gives you. So I make sure I’m never put in a close position with him ever again and can recognise exactly what he’s wanting and that he’ll say whatever he needs to say, look at me in whatever way he needs to to get what he thinks he’s going to get. A connection? A woman who just ‘gets him?’ Being an utter b**ch in response to this kind of flattery works a real treat. They don’t come back for more.
> 
> I don’t want any of that. I don’t like getting high. So I make sure there is no opportunity. And above all I go home happy to give my all to my husband.
> 
> Women, we’ll encounter this a lot. Whether I respect my husband or whether he’s abusive or neglectful or whatever - I just stop that ‘moment’ and never look back.
> 
> I am certain I’m not very popular with a lot of my husband’s friends and colleagues because any attempt by them to be more than friendly gets shut down quickly. That’s ok, I’d rather be a b*_ch in their eyes than be a b_%ch to my husband.


This makes sense and is a good thing. I think where even women who employ this strategy (which is a good idea) run into problems is when they lose respect for their husband and then they are forced into a continued relationship with someone from work for instance, who IS worthy of respect but where the close proximity and mutual chemistry causes them to catch feelings. She is already emotionally compromised with her husband, so it's a lot harder to just shut that down. Now someone of character will address the issues in the marriage and either fix them or end it. Someone of less character may just cheat. But the lack of respect is what opens the door.


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## Luckylucky

@sokillme this is the thing, but is she catching feelings and THEN seeing her husband differently and then thinking she’s losing respect? Tough one.


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## sokillme

Luckylucky said:


> @sokillme this is the thing, but is she catching feelings and THEN seeing her husband differently and then thinking she’s losing respect? Tough one.


Agreed, workplace affairs often work like this. Character is the only thing that stops them. Not acting on those feelings only because you know it's wrong, being able to ignore your feelings. That is a big lift for lots of people. 

Still if they guy is cruel or out every night, then he is just leaving himself open. Not that it's right, it's not but you still shouldn't leave your car unlocked with the keys in it. This is real life after all.


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## lifeistooshort

farsidejunky said:


> Not because I am male, but rather because my wife is more comfortable in that role.
> 
> What I am espousing has nothing to do with male or female, and everything to do with who has the more dominant role in the relationship.
> 
> Oftentimes it is a woman. It just isn't that way in my marriage.
> 
> Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk


I find that in ny relationship I choose where I wish to be assertive.

So for many things I'll defer to what he wants because my opinion on the matter isn't that strong.

But when I feel strongly I speak and most of the time he goes along with it.

It seems to work.


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## lifeistooshort

sokillme said:


> Agreed, workplace affairs often work like this. Character is the only thing that stops them. Not acting on those feelings only because you know it's wrong, being able to ignore your feelings. That is a big lift for lots of people.
> 
> Still if they guy is cruel or out every night, then he is just leaving himself open. Not that it's right, it's not but you still shouldn't leave your car unlocked with the keys in it. This is real life after all.


My father used to say that if a guy doesn't take care of his woman someone else will.

You can take from that what you will, but that was his view of things.


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## heartsbeating

I shall be annoying and answer a question with a question.

I'm curious on views of how self-respect is demonstrated? @sokillme I'm happy to retract this if you feel it's side-tracking your discussion.


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## ccpowerslave

Insofar as leading goes I know the areas my wife wants to do. One example is taking trips, she always wants to plan everything and do all the legwork for them.

For most other things I try to be decisive and tell rather than ask. I used to have a bad habit of asking her when I already knew my plan and I wasn’t budging on it. So in the case where I asked and she picked the “wrong” answer she would rightly get pissed. So now when I ask and she goes against my plan as happened today I go with it immediately and I try to only ask when I don’t care if she messes up my plan.

Today I had the best plan ever of having Japanese udon for lunch. I told her that we were having tacos for dinner but then I stupidly asked her what she wanted for lunch. She said “something hot”. I said “You know what is hot is UDON!” She said yes it is but you know what else is hot is tacos, and I know you had a plan to have tacos for dinner but instead you’re going to make smothered steak and peas. “Ok dear.”

Thank you for coming to my TED talk on how to be a leader in your marriage.


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## heartsbeating

ccpowerslave said:


> Thank you for coming to my TED talk on how to be a leader in your marriage.


LOL!


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## Not

DudeInProgress said:


> no, not because he’s male, because he is the leader in the relationship. It’s the same in my marriage and every other successful, long-term, generally happy marriage that I’m aware of.
> 
> Someone is the leader. There is no such thing as a true 50/50 across the board, it doesn’t work like that. It’s always 51/49, 55/45, 60/40, etc. That does not make one better or more important than the other, it’s just the leadership dynamic of the relationship. And the VAST majority of women prefer the man to be in that role. And every time I’ve seen it reversed, the woman loses respect for the man and it’s not a good situation.
> 
> And every time I’ve seen a couple claim they are 50/50, it’s not. There is still a leader in the relationship, it’s just not the man.


I have to agree with this, at least as far as my personal experience goes. When I was married I was the dominate in all decision making and it had a huge affect on my respect for him as a partner as well as a male. I saw him as weak and ineffective. He never took initiative, never took control of anything. The only time he ever tried to assert his dominance was when he wanted to spend money, then he was the big man of the house barking orders or insisting that we start living on a better budget. Then he'd forget about the budget in a few days and rinse and repeat.

At one point I had become to stressed and asked him to take over doing the bills at least and he flat out refused saying he didn't need that kind of stress. I was sitting there crying, just way over loaded asking for help. He knew if I was crying it was serious, I never cried. I never asked him for anything again and I know he was more than happy I didn't.

He didn't help with the kids, the housework, anything. All of this killed any sexual attraction I had for him, he even looked physically unappealing to me and I had absolutely no faith in any opinions or suggestions of his for solutions to problems. I felt he was a lazy user and more than ok with letting someone else handle everything so his life could be easy.

I never cheated and never would have. I see cheating as something separate from the loss of respect. Cheating takes a certain type of person and that kind of person _would_ use the problems that cause lack of respect as an excuse to cheat, for sure but lack of respect does not cause cheating.


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## Mybabysgotit

sokillme said:


> _*Note: To be clear, I am not saying cheating is caused by a lack of respect, cheating is only caused by a lack of character.*_
> 
> So as you probably all know I have been reading on here and other sites for quite a while. I was reading a post on another site and the guy basically said, caught her and for 3 months he was trying to nice her back, then at the 3 month mark something changed and he told her he was divorcing, and on a dime as is usual she changed.
> 
> It made me think, this is SO COMMON. But I used to think the wife changes because of the fear of losing the marriage. But I am wondering is it really because his assertiveness makes her regain her respect for him?
> 
> respect -
> 
> 
> Besides guys who marry assholes, it seems to me there are two types of guys who get cheated on the most. The guy who is cruel to his wife, and the guy who is a pushover or not assertive, or just an idiot. In both cases it seems like the wife has lost the feeling I described above.
> 
> It not even that they fall out of love with their husbands but more so when they lose respect for them. Like maybe being with someone that wives can respect is the most important factor in the bond? _(Someone with good character won't cheat but someone who is iffy might)_
> 
> Am I on to something here? Ladies how important would you rate having respect for your SO is in your relationship?


I've been preaching so long now. If a woman doesn't have respect for her husband, the marriage is pretty much over and for sure she's not having enthusiastic sex with you. That's why I cringe when needy men wonder "why isn't my wife having monkey sex with me". If a woman has respect for her husband, she's not going to cheat, she's going to be horny as heck for him, she won't put him down, she will bend over backwards for him.

Men don't need to respect their wives to have sex with their wives and to treat them good. Men just want a girly girl who's also a good mom.


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## Hiner112

Hiner112 said:


> The root cause of many issues is respect. If you respect your spouse many potential issues will not occur. There will be times in every relationship when you're not "feeling the love" but if you respect your partner which is independent of your hormones at any particular time it can maintain the relationship until your feelings come back.
> 
> If you respect your partner, you can disagree with them without the value you see in them or the relationship diminishing (as much).
> 
> If you respect each other, when they bring up issues you will listen and take them seriously even if you don't agree and vice versa.
> 
> If you respect your partner, you'll see them as a real person with their own wants, needs, and desires. You'll take them into account when making your decisions.
> 
> Conversely, being treated or treating others with contempt is an efficient way to kill the feelings between you. If you feel like you're being used (financially, sexually, as a housemaid, etc), you will know that they don't value you and for all intents and purposes the relationship is over except for the paperwork and logistics.


This was a response of mine to a "Biggest issue in marriages?" thread a while ago. It's pretty closely related.

As some have pointed out assertiveness helps get you respect but if you aren't competent you can't keep it. If you're competent without any assertiveness there's a good chance you'll never be in a position to be cheated on because no woman will notice you.

Its also intimately tied to the discussion about treating men like babies. If men are being taken care of as sign of regard or love then it is a positive but if they're being taken care of because they can't take care of themselves then that is a problem.

I'm generally competence without a ton of assertiveness. I don't manufacture an opinion about things that don't affect me personally or I haven't thought about deeply. I'm not going to make something up on the spot usually. I'm also not overwhelmed when random issues come up like infestations, breakdowns, sicknesses, etc. When my ex basically stopped helping out around the house, my response was basically "that's fine, I can handle it" and I think a major contributor to her loss of feeling for me was this "passive" response.


----------



## sokillme

Mybabysgotit said:


> I've been preaching so long now. If a woman doesn't have respect for her husband, the marriage is pretty much over and for sure she's not having enthusiastic sex with you. That's why I cringe when needy men wonder "why isn't my wife having monkey sex with me". If a woman has respect for her husband, she's not going to cheat, she's going to be horny as heck for him, she won't put him down, she will bend over backwards for him.
> 
> Men don't need to respect their wives to have sex with their wives and to treat them good. Men just want a girly girl who's also a good mom.


Yep, good advice assuming you married a women with reasonable expectations =

Be the man your wife respects.


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## AVR1962

I have a few lady friends who have had affairs on their husbands. In every situation these women had a parent who was also a cheat so they each had that as an example in their lives which I find over and again with men and women. The women were all needing something they were not getting from the marriage whether it was emotional support, feeling loved and wanted by their spouse. I do think in every situation the women had lost love and respect for their spouse but could not bring themselves to tear up the family with divorce. One got caught, she confessed, they did counseling and are still together after 25+ years of marriage. One of the marriages did fail, she eventually divorced him. The other couple is separated now and she has been sleeping around with alot of different men.


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## sokillme

AVR1962 said:


> The women were all needing something they were not getting from the marriage whether it was emotional support, feeling loved and wanted by their spouse.


This is a toxic idea. You marry someone to give something not get something. If you are unhappy you talk about it.


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## heartsbeating

sokillme said:


> Yep, good advice assuming you married a women with reasonable expectations =
> 
> Be the man your wife respects.


I really feel the significance is more about having self-respect.

From that place, strength of character emerges.


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## sokillme

heartsbeating said:


> I really feel the significance is more about having self-respect.
> 
> From that place, strength of character emerges.


Do you mean the person who cheats doesn't have self respect?


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## heartsbeating

sokillme said:


> Do you mean the person who cheats doesn't have self respect?


That might be another topic ...what I meant was there's focus on being a husband that a wife can respect. 
I'm suggesting being a man that respects himself / statement could be gender neutral though.


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## notmyjamie

By the end of my marriage I had very little respect left for my husband for many reasons. I had the chance to cheat...ExH hadn’t touched me in 6 years and I was severely lacking in attention, sex, and love...I did not take that man up on his attempt to be with me. I could never have lived with myself if I had cheated. Now I’m so very glad I turned him down. My lack of respect for exH May have contributed to a desire but my own morals and character made me choose not to go there.

I work with a woman whose husband is an alcoholic, hasn’t had sex with her in almost a year, and she has lost all respect for him for those and many other reasons. She cheated on him and she’s falling apart now from the guilt. She broke it off with AP but she still feels despondent over what she has done. Just not worth it.

So I think lacking respect can lead to a desire to be with someone else but who you are inside determines how you proceed with that.


----------



## sokillme

heartsbeating said:


> That might be another topic ...what I meant was there's focus on being a husband that a wife can respect.
> I'm suggesting being a man that respects himself / statement could be gender neutral though.


I agree but I kinda think it's the same thing.


----------



## Untrusting

sokillme said:


> _*Note: To be clear, I am not saying cheating is caused by a lack of respect, cheating is only caused by a lack of character.*_
> 
> So as you probably all know I have been reading on here and other sites for quite a while. I was reading a post on another site and the guy basically said, caught her and for 3 months he was trying to nice her back, then at the 3 month mark something changed and he told her he was divorcing, and on a dime as is usual she changed.
> 
> It made me think, this is SO COMMON. But I used to think the wife changes because of the fear of losing the marriage. But I am wondering is it really because his assertiveness makes her regain her respect for him?
> 
> respect -
> 
> 
> Besides guys who marry assholes, it seems to me there are two types of guys who get cheated on the most. The guy who is cruel to his wife, and the guy who is a pushover or not assertive, or just an idiot. In both cases it seems like the wife has lost the feeling I described above.
> 
> It not even that they fall out of love with their husbands but more so when they lose respect for them. Like maybe being with someone that wives can respect is the most important factor in the bond? _(Someone with good character won't cheat but someone who is iffy might)_
> 
> Am I on to something here? Ladies how important would you rate having respect for your SO is in your relationship?


I would say respect is very up there. For me, I’d never cheat because it’s also an issue of self respect, but for a woman to feel bonded to a man I believe she has to trust that he can protect and come through for her. This happens in a lot of ways, for example following through when he says he will do something and having her back when times are hard for her. For me, when I found out my spouse had sought out women before we got engaged, I experienced what I would call a severe emotional disconnect that’s been hard for me to get through, because I feel he failed me in a way. Some men aren’t doing things or are doing things they shouldn’t be, and a woman will ask and ask for a thing to stop (or start). In my experiences in relationships and with seeing others relationships, women sometimes ask for things a very long time before they get fed up with asking and emotionally exit the relationship. Other women I’ve noticed, have everything served to them on a platter. The man cooks, cleans, adores her, flowers all the time, etc, etc. He has bent over so far backward for someone who hasn’t matched his effort that he seems weak to her. Tbh I think this one is the most tragic because it’s some poor guy just trying to be the best he can be, and he’s not appreciated until the silver platter is taken away and she realizes she’d have to start all over, older, and with someone who may not treat her as well.


----------



## WandaJ

farsidejunky said:


> The simplest way to look at it is this.
> 
> You two have something you simply can't agree on. Not major relationship type issues, but more along the lines of something financial.
> 
> Who has the final say?
> 
> In our relationship, I have the final say on most things, unless she is clearly more knowledgeable than I. Then I defer. But that is far less frequent than the former.
> 
> Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk


Why do you have final say on most things??


----------



## ConanHub

WandaJ said:


> Why do you have final say on most things??


I'm guessing he takes far more responsibility for and repercussions from any choices made but I could be mistaken.


----------



## DownByTheRiver

It is certainly one of the things that will let a woman go ahead and cheat. 

A recent example of a woman who cheated on her longtime husband, it is because she is both narcissistic and bipolar. The narcissism drove it more than anything. I lived with her decades ago before she got that bad with the bipolar, but her narcissism was manifesting as someone who was a huge attention w****. She fed on admiration and attention more than anything. She did respect her husband and loved him, but she had to keep having that validation and attention and drama. A lot of men do it for the same reason.


----------



## AVR1962

sokillme said:


> This is a toxic idea. You marry someone to give something not get something. If you are unhappy you talk about it.


If two people could give equally to a marriage and keep the communication open is key. I have known there to be a loss of balance however where one is giving and the other is abusing the giving. I have seen where people who have come from a religious background feel like they have to forgive but what they are forgiving should be a huge flag to walk away from. To say that marriage should be about giving is a true statement but we also have to be able to address those issues in the marriage that are harming the relationship.


----------



## Bulfrog1987

I no longer respect my husband because he feels helping out or doing any home chores makes him 'the woman' in a marriage and he literally told me he wasn't built to scrub floors or wash dishes. After he actually said that out loud, any remote ounce of respect I had for him vanished.


----------



## Bulfrog1987

sokillme said:


> be emotionally strong enough to show your soft side to your wife. Not be emotional but show your feelings.


This right here is what I'm talking about! There's nothing that gains my respect and admiration for a man than this.


----------



## sokillme

Bulfrog1987 said:


> I no longer respect my husband because he feels helping out or doing any home chores makes him 'the woman' in a marriage and he literally told me he wasn't built to scrub floors or wash dishes. After he actually said that out loud, any remote ounce of respect I had for him vanished.


Did you marry Fred Flintstone?


----------



## sokillme

Bulfrog1987 said:


> This right here is what I'm talking about! There's nothing that gains my respect and admiration for a man than this.


I think context is important in that quote, for instances it's OK and healthy to be emotional in reasonable circumstances such as death or whatever. I don't want to make it seem like I am advocating for men to act like Vulcans. If anything that has gotten us into problems too. We all should strive for emotional intellegence.


----------



## EleGirl

Bulfrog1987 said:


> I no longer respect my husband because he feels helping out or doing any home chores makes him 'the woman' in a marriage and he literally told me he wasn't built to scrub floors or wash dishes. After he actually said that out loud, any remote ounce of respect I had for him vanished.


Did you tell him what your reaction to this is?


----------



## oldshirt

Bulfrog1987 said:


> I no longer respect my husband because he feels helping out or doing any home chores makes him 'the woman' in a marriage and he literally told me he wasn't built to scrub floors or wash dishes. After he actually said that out loud, any remote ounce of respect I had for him vanished.


The devil is in the details and a matter of context here. If all he does is sit around drinking beer and playing video games and doesn't lift a finger to provide for or take care of the family home, then I understand your grievance.

But does he do other things to provide for the support, safety and functioning of the house and home besides scrubbing floors and washing dishes? Does he climb up ladders to work on the roof and gutters? Does he do maintenance and repairs on the lawn mower and take care of the lawn? Does he patch holes in the concrete in the driveway? Does he unclog the toilet when you drop a big bomb that gets stuck? Does he keep the cars in running order? Does he work 2 or 3 jobs to pay for everything? 

If we are going to judge men by how much they scrub the floor and make them shine, we're probably setting ourselves up for disappointment. Not to be sexist but most men simply have a different scale of what constitutes a thorough scrubbing and how clean is clean. 

I've tried to scrub the floors and thought if I could do that it would take some of the stress and pressure off of her, but no matter what I do or how much elbow grease I put into it, she would just come along right behind me and do it anyway and say that I didn't do it right. (sigh ) So in that sense, I guess I am not "built" for scrubbing floors either.


----------



## Bulfrog1987

@oldshirt 

So to be more clear, I have NEVER asked him to do either of those things, that's him pulling that out of what I'm trying to describe as my own needs for more of a connection and knowing that he appreciates me. I needed him, these last three years to get up with our son once in a while during the night, maybe cook a meal once month, offer to out our son to bed once in a while so I can go to bed when I'm exhausted. Now, our child doesn't want him to do anything for him, because 'that's momma's job.' It's freaking sad, and he's mad at me. Oh yes, I tell my son, "Now make sure when dad comes to help you, even though you're calling for me that you freak out." Like I need that on my plate too. No, this is just the circumstances of you avoiding being involved. 

Yes he can do all the things you described above. And because he has those abilities, that's the only contribution he will provide when needed. They are important things too to a household but not all a healthy household runs on. I too, have worked on our home, removing drywall, patching drywall and painting, even putting a floor down myself in my office. I cut the grass, he does not, though he would if I let it grow tall enough. I also can and do fix plumbing because I've been put in a position where I had to do it. So I'm not down playing those important contributions of a talented male, it's just there are other desires and needs I have other than simply having a 'manly' man, who won't attempt to connect with our family on any other level.


----------



## DownByTheRiver

I think the main reason is loss of respect but not for the reasons you cite necessarily all those sometimes, but for losing respect for them because they are showing disrespect to you in a myriad of ways, I'm doing their part around the house too sex to financial. 

But you're right that most women do not like someone who is desperate, but then I would ask why she married him if that's the case because that kind of behavior is pretty obvious overall.


----------



## Bulfrog1987

EleGirl said:


> Did you tell him what your reaction to this is?


I've not told him in the literally words no. We are just going about our day to day. He loves to pretend everything is fine, would rather put his head in the sand than give anymore attention to it. 


The day he said that to me, we were sitting outside and it just took me back to when he made it point to tell me how we are not partners and I should have married a woman if that's what I wanted. I didn't speak a word from that point on. It was just the seal to the envelope of knowing what I need to do next. We are finished. Well, I am finished.


----------



## EleGirl

Bulfrog1987 said:


> @oldshirt
> 
> So to be more clear, I have NEVER asked him to do either of those things, that's him pulling that out of what I'm trying to describe as my own needs for more of a connection and knowing that he appreciates me. I needed him, these last three years to get up with our son once in a while during the night, maybe cook a meal once month, offer to out our son to bed once in a while so I can go to bed when I'm exhausted. Now, our child doesn't want him to do anything for him, because 'that's momma's job.' It's freaking sad, and he's mad at me. Oh yes, I tell my son, "Now make sure when dad comes to help you, even though you're calling for me that you freak out." Like I need that on my plate too. No, this is just the circumstances of you avoiding being involved.
> 
> Yes he can do all the things you described above. And because he has those abilities, that's the only contribution he will provide when needed. They are important things too to a household but not all a healthy household runs on. I too, have worked on our home, removing drywall, patching drywall and painting, even putting a floor down myself in my office. I cut the grass, he does not, though he would if I let it grow tall enough. I also can and do fix plumbing because I've been put in a position where I had to do it. So I'm not down playing those important contributions of a talented male, it's just there are other desires and needs I have other than simply having a 'manly' man, who won't attempt to connect with our family on any other level.


I would like to move (or copy) some of your posts on this thread to that thread you already have. They give valuable info to help us all know what you are going through. Are you ok with that?

You work outside the home as well, right?

When I asked my son's father to share in the housework with me, specifically clean toilets, he told me with indignation that he does not do toilets. So I replied to him that we have a problem because I don't do them either. And then I hired someone to do the house cleaning. If he's too good to clean a toilet, so am I. And for the records, yea, we both had full time jobs.


----------



## Bulfrog1987

EleGirl said:


> I would like to move (or copy) some of your posts on this thread to that thread you already have. They give valuable info to help us all know what you are going through. Are you ok with that?
> 
> You work outside the home as well, right?
> 
> When I asked my son's father to share in the housework with me, specifically clean toilets, he told me with indignation that he does not do toilets. So I replied to him that we have a problem because I don't do them either. And then I hired someone to do the house cleaning. If he's too good to clean a toilet, so am I. And for the records, yea, we both had full time jobs.


That is fine. There's so much that's gone on and going on that should probably just not even respond to others on their posts. I mean well, but I have my own thoughts based on what I'm going through that just may not actually be helpful? _sigh_ I don't want to push my biases' on anyone else. 

Yes I work for a call center (cloud based) from home and then am the director of a two day a week mother's day out program as well. You do make a good point though and in his defense, I actually do remember him telling me to hire someone, I never did because I could do it all, I just never understood why he wouldn't help. Plus we didn't have the money for it really.


----------



## EleGirl

Bulfrog1987 said:


> That is fine. There's so much that's gone on and going on that should probably just not even respond to others on their posts. I mean well, but I have my own thoughts based on what I'm going through that just may not actually be helpful? _sigh_ I don't want to push my biases' on anyone else.
> 
> Yes I work for a call center (cloud based) from home and then am the director of a two day a week mother's day out program as well. You do make a good point though and in his defense, I actually do remember him telling me to hire someone, I never did because I could do it all, I just never understood why he wouldn't help. Plus we didn't have the money for it really.


Your posting on other threads is not a problem. I just thought it would be good to have that info on your own thread. I'll copy it so it's on both threads.

About the housekeeper.. let him pay for it. Though from what you have said on your thread, it's the least of your problems.


----------



## oldshirt

Bulfrog1987 said:


> @oldshirt
> 
> So to be more clear, I have NEVER asked him to do either of those things, that's him pulling that out of what I'm trying to describe as my own needs for more of a connection and knowing that he appreciates me. I needed him, these last three years to get up with our son once in a while during the night, maybe cook a meal once month, offer to out our son to bed once in a while so I can go to bed when I'm exhausted. Now, our child doesn't want him to do anything for him, because 'that's momma's job.' It's freaking sad, and he's mad at me. Oh yes, I tell my son, "Now make sure when dad comes to help you, even though you're calling for me that you freak out." Like I need that on my plate too. No, this is just the circumstances of you avoiding being involved.
> 
> Yes he can do all the things you described above. And because he has those abilities, that's the only contribution he will provide when needed. They are important things too to a household but not all a healthy household runs on. I too, have worked on our home, removing drywall, patching drywall and painting, even putting a floor down myself in my office. I cut the grass, he does not, though he would if I let it grow tall enough. I also can and do fix plumbing because I've been put in a position where I had to do it. So I'm not down playing those important contributions of a talented male, it's just there are other desires and needs I have other than simply having a 'manly' man, who won't attempt to connect with our family on any other level.



I read your other thread. IMHO it's basically time to stick a fork in it. I think you've been used and played. 
You thought he was a charming mature and developed man and were probably flattered that he was giving you time and attention. 

But as was alluded in your other thread, it was all more dark and predatory. 

When a 44 year old man is wining and dining a 20 year old woman, it's easy for the 20 year old to think that the reason she is getting his attention and courting is because she is skinnier and prettier and sweeter than those jaded and nasty 30something and 40something year old women with their muffin tops and cellulite. 

But real reason is the mature women with the life experience and wisdom can see what duds and losers and dysfunctional protoplasm they really are and so they won't touch them with a ten foot pole. 

Yes the 20 year olds are skinnier and prettier but what is more important to guys like this is they are naive and more easily manipulated and used. They lack the life experience and wisdom to smell the rat and know whats really going on. 

They think they have won the prince, but what they have really gotten is the village drunk and village sheister dressed up in the prince's old clothes from the castle's thrift shop. 

Now you are the jaded 30something with the stretchmarks and the lines on your face from gritting your teeth and having a permanent scowl. 

But you can also see him for the dud and failure that he really is. Now you can smell the rat and can spot the predator a mile away. Now you will know which men are to be avoided at all costs. And now you can warn the young 20somethings that the grown men sniffing around them taking them to fancy restaurants and trendy clubs in nice cars aren't exercising their ability to get the prettier and skinnier girls because they are such a fine catch..... but rather because experienced and mature women can see through their bullshyt. 

They won't listen to you of course because now they'll be the ones thinking you are the bitter and jaded one. But they'll learn. Just as you have.


----------



## Bulfrog1987

oldshirt said:


> I read your other thread. IMHO it's basically time to stick a fork in it. I think you've been used and played.
> You thought he was a charming mature and developed man and were probably flattered that he was giving you time and attention.
> 
> But as was alluded in your other thread, it was all more dark and predatory.
> 
> When a 44 year old man is wining and dining a 20 year old woman, it's easy for the 20 year old to think that the reason she is getting his attention and courting is because she is skinnier and prettier and sweeter than those jaded and nasty 30something and 40something year old women with their muffin tops and cellulite.
> 
> But real reason is the mature women with the life experience and wisdom can see what duds and losers and dysfunctional protoplasm they really are and so they won't touch them with a ten foot pole.
> 
> Yes the 20 year olds are skinnier and prettier but what is more important to guys like this is they are naive and more easily manipulated and used. They lack the life experience and wisdom to smell the rat and know whats really going on.
> 
> They think they have won the prince, but what they have really gotten is the village drunk and village sheister dressed up in the prince's old clothes from the castle's thrift shop.
> 
> Now you are the jaded 30something with the stretchmarks and the lines on your face from gritting your teeth and having a permanent scowl.
> 
> But you can also see him for the dud and failure that he really is. Now you can smell the rat and can spot the predator a mile away. Now you will know which men are to be avoided at all costs. And now you can warn the young 20somethings that the grown men sniffing around them taking them to fancy restaurants and trendy clubs in nice cars aren't exercising their ability to get the prettier and skinnier girls because they are such a fine catch..... but rather because experienced and mature women can see through their bullshyt.
> 
> They won't listen to you of course because now they'll be the ones thinking you are the bitter and jaded one. But they'll learn. Just as you have.



95% of this is true, however I don't have frown lines or a permanent scowl. I had cellulite and was chubby way back when and still weigh the same I did 15 years ago. Thankful for that lol. I do now also have a few stretch marks from my son, but I can live with that! I'm not all used up so I got that going for me haha.


----------



## oldshirt

Bulfrog1987 said:


> 95% of this is true, however I don't have frown lines or a permanent scowl. I had cellulite and was chubby way back when and still weigh the same I did 15 years ago. Thankful for that lol. I do now also have a few stretch marks from my son, but I can live with that! I'm not all used up so I got that going for me haha.


I am sure you are a hottie. My point is not to imply that you are at all unattractive but rather to point out that you are now the woman that your 20 year old self thought was was all jaded and bi+chy and overweight etc and why that successful and charming 30/40 something man with the Lexus was picking her instead of the women closer to his age. 

Now that you have the life experience and the wisdom and knowledge, you can see the truth. Your 20 year old self didn't.


----------



## Bulfrog1987

oldshirt said:


> I am sure you are a hottie. My point is not to imply that you are at all unattractive but rather to point out that you are now the woman that your 20 year old self thought was was all jaded and bi+chy and overweight etc and why that successful and charming 30/40 something man with the Lexus was picking her instead of the women closer to his age.
> 
> Now that you have the life experience and the wisdom and knowledge, you can see the truth. Your 20 year old self didn't.


Oh yes. I'm fully on board with what you were trying to portray. He also was also bankrupt when I met him, so no Lexus or fine dining there, I genuinely loved him. But moving on from the shallow, I'm definitely aware of what I wasn't then. You have hit the nail on the head.


----------



## DownByTheRiver

Bulfrog1987 said:


> I no longer respect my husband because he feels helping out or doing any home chores makes him 'the woman' in a marriage and he literally told me he wasn't built to scrub floors or wash dishes. After he actually said that out loud, any remote ounce of respect I had for him vanished.


Yeah, because look what that means he thinks of you -- in his eyes, you are lowly and so are other women. He thinks he's superior. Not uncommon, but tragically ignorant.


----------



## DownByTheRiver

Bulfrog1987 said:


> That is fine. There's so much that's gone on and going on that should probably just not even respond to others on their posts. I mean well, but I have my own thoughts based on what I'm going through that just may not actually be helpful? _sigh_ I don't want to push my biases' on anyone else.
> 
> Yes I work for a call center (cloud based) from home and then am the director of a two day a week mother's day out program as well. You do make a good point though and in his defense, I actually do remember him telling me to hire someone, I never did because I could do it all, I just never understood why he wouldn't help. Plus we didn't have the money for it really.


Well, it's good he's down for hiring someone, but it doesn't diminish his crap attitude thinking he's better than women and above doing things they do routinely. Once you leave him, he will try to find a new maid and cook and babysitter but if not, he can hire his own housekeeper.


----------



## DownByTheRiver

Bulfrog1987 said:


> 95% of this is true, however I don't have frown lines or a permanent scowl. I had cellulite and was chubby way back when and still weigh the same I did 15 years ago. Thankful for that lol. I do now also have a few stretch marks from my son, but I can live with that! I'm not all used up so I got that going for me haha.


Well, there's nothing that says you have to go right out and get married again.


----------



## Bulfrog1987

DownByTheRiver said:


> Well, there's nothing that says you have to go right out and get married again.


No plans on it. I'm perfectly content to be alone


----------



## Bulfrog1987

DownByTheRiver said:


> Well, it's good he's down for hiring someone, but it doesn't diminish his crap attitude thinking he's better than women and above doing things they do routinely. Once you leave him, he will try to find a new maid and cook and babysitter but if not, he can hire his own housekeeper.


Yeah, he'll try. Doesn't bother me in the least.


----------



## DownByTheRiver

Bulfrog1987 said:


> Yeah, he'll try. Doesn't bother me in the least.


Well, when you leave someone, that's the goal, to just stop caring what they do. Takes a strong confident person to pull it off. And of course if there's kids, you can't just shut it down.


----------



## Bulfrog1987

Bulfrog1987 said:


> Yeah, he'll try. Doesn't bother me in the least.


yes! I wish more women felt this way. The only care I have is my sons well being. Beyond that, I’m not a person that needs to be with a man for contentment. I want to be with a man to love and fulfill a relationship. I’ve already been alone you know. I just have to get to where I can do it alone financially


----------



## DownByTheRiver

Bulfrog1987 said:


> yes! I wish more women felt this way. The only care I have is my sons well being. Beyond that, I’m not a person that needs to be with a man for contentment. I want to be with a man to love and fulfill a relationship. I’ve already been alone you know. I just have to get to where I can do it alone financially


Since child support goes away at 18 and leaves the woman without a career, I just advise foregoing child support by insisting on what has become the norm in the US, which his 50/50 joint custody (assuming the kids are still kids) so he has them 3 1/2 days a week in a row and you have them the other 3 1/2 and that gives you time to work, shop, leisure, etc. that you probably have not been having at all and gives him responsibility for doing as much as you are for the kids. That's assuming those are y'all's kids together. That way you have an equal chance to make a living. You and he have the same obligations to take off work sometimes to report to school or whatever, to pick the kids up, to feed them, house them. And it gives you more time overall. He'll have to learn to deal with it. He'll probably try to get out of it, but you really should insist to be fair to yourself and also so that the kids see their father plenty. If he doesn't want to have that responsibility some days, too bad, because you need to have that made into a judge's order or legal agreement. That way, he can't be trying to beg you to do extra and you won't have to have that much to do with him.


----------



## Divinely Favored

farsidejunky said:


> A classic test is what @MEM2020 used to refer to as poking, and my wife still periodically does.
> 
> Normally when she pokes, she is in a crabby mood and she comes at me with some form of "I told you so" over the 10% of something that isn't working well, while completely disregarding the 90% that is...even if she contributed to part of that 90%. It is a manifestation of her internal dialogue and cognitive bias that says I'm not listening to her when in fact she was a major part of that solution. There is NO competing with that insecure internal dialogue.
> 
> You effectively have three options in this situation:
> 
> Worst option: escalate and have a heated argument. This instinctively shows her that I don't have control over my composure.
> 
> Satisfactory option: "Are you done?" and/or withdraw, with a lack of meeting needs, until an apology is made. Another option I use when I have nothing witty is to simply say, "I Don't have the ability nor the interest to compete with your internal dialogue".
> 
> Ideal option: Say something humorous about the situation. "I swear... You look just like... You are the spitting image of someone who just suggested X was a good idea." That normally elicits a smile, followed by a flirty "shut up". Situation diffused. Handled like a boss.
> 
> However, if the mood is foul enough, sometimes the ideal option doesn't work. If she escalates further, I will revert to the satisfactory option.
> 
> Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk


My wife was going to get on the roof to do something i was about to do. I told her she was not getting on the roof and she said she was perfectly able to do it. I told her to get off the ladder before i spank that Azz. She tries to protest as she walks away with a smile. 

No i just say Daddy said! And she says, "Yes, Daddy"

When she used to get riled up and bichin i would tell her This conversation is over until you can speak in a civil tone and i would walk away and go do something outside.


----------



## Divinely Favored

Livvie said:


> So, if neither of you has more knowledge about something than the other, you get to make the decision just because you are a male?


Say you want to invest 50k and hubby says no.....you decide to do it any way and loose it. The hardship to the family is your fault because it was your choice. If hubby is a leader and he agreed...the final decision and responsibility is his. My wife does not like responsibility of making a decision that will possibly hurt the family so something she is thinking about doing is brought to me, if it is something she is indecisive about i make the decision. She does not like to spend money on herself so many times if i know we have the funds and it is something she would like, i tell her we are getting it, dont argue with me.


----------



## sokillme

oldshirt said:


> I read your other thread. IMHO it's basically time to stick a fork in it. I think you've been used and played.
> You thought he was a charming mature and developed man and were probably flattered that he was giving you time and attention.
> 
> But as was alluded in your other thread, it was all more dark and predatory.
> 
> When a 44 year old man is wining and dining a 20 year old woman, it's easy for the 20 year old to think that the reason she is getting his attention and courting is because she is skinnier and prettier and sweeter than those jaded and nasty 30something and 40something year old women with their muffin tops and cellulite.
> 
> But real reason is the mature women with the life experience and wisdom can see what duds and losers and dysfunctional protoplasm they really are and so they won't touch them with a ten foot pole.
> 
> Yes the 20 year olds are skinnier and prettier but what is more important to guys like this is they are naive and more easily manipulated and used. They lack the life experience and wisdom to smell the rat and know whats really going on.
> 
> They think they have won the prince, but what they have really gotten is the village drunk and village sheister dressed up in the prince's old clothes from the castle's thrift shop.
> 
> Now you are the jaded 30something with the stretchmarks and the lines on your face from gritting your teeth and having a permanent scowl.
> 
> But you can also see him for the dud and failure that he really is. Now you can smell the rat and can spot the predator a mile away. Now you will know which men are to be avoided at all costs. And now you can warn the young 20somethings that the grown men sniffing around them taking them to fancy restaurants and trendy clubs in nice cars aren't exercising their ability to get the prettier and skinnier girls because they are such a fine catch..... but rather because experienced and mature women can see through their bullshyt.
> 
> They won't listen to you of course because now they'll be the ones thinking you are the bitter and jaded one. But they'll learn. Just as you have.


Haha! Cold stark wisdom and hilarity all in one. This is like one of your signature post in my mind. Proud it's in my thread.


----------



## sokillme

Divinely Favored said:


> Say you want to invest 50k and hubby says no.....you decide to do it any way and loose it. The hardship to the family is your fault because it was your choice. If hubby is a leader and he agreed...the final decision and responsibility is his. My wife does not like responsibility of making a decision that will possibly hurt the family so something she is thinking about doing is brought to me, if it is something she is indecisive about i make the decision. She does not like to spend money on herself so many times if i know we have the funds and it is something she would like, i tell her we are getting it, dont argue with me.


Reminds me of this


----------



## Emerging Buddhist

sokillme said:


> _*Note: To be clear, I am not saying cheating is caused by a lack of respect, cheating is only caused by a lack of character.*_


*"How much of women's affairs are about the loss of respect."*

I am going to sound like a stuck track here, but I believe that cheating is caused by a loss of respect and a loss of love for only one individual... ourselves.

When we fail to love ourselves and respect ourselves enough, many hurtful things happen the in wake.

I believe that to love ourselves more means we constantly evaluate our self-respect, watch our actions and ensure they align with our words, spend time honestly reviewing our heart and thoughts making sure that "do no harm" applies to situations that center on realizing desire is a double-edged sword where only the middle is safe.

I really doesn't take two to cheat, it only takes one... where it starts.

You are only a victim once.

After that the need to feel or be loved takes an unhealthy turn as we forget to love ourselves more and look outside to satisfy a desire that is allowed to control us instead of the other way around.

It hurts to not feel loved, but it hurts far more when we begin to believe that we can find it in harmful situations.

Respect is the first casualty, and it is also the hardest to recover.


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## singing79

Livvie said:


> .
> What do you mean by a "leader and protector"? You.say you think all women want these things.
> 
> I have a full time professional job. I own my own home. I manage work, my finances, my home, my vehicle, and absolutely everything that goes along with those things.
> 
> I'm single and looking for a life partner. Partner being the key word. I am nicely capable of navigating life as an adult.... so what is a future man supposed to _lead_ me on? You didn't say collaborate, you said LEAD. So what does that leadership look like? Why would it be leadership rather than partnership?
> 
> And by protect do you mean physically, like in the instance of an intruder or something like that?


This video willexplain to you why your previous long marriage failed & why your current one isn't working either.






Men do not flourish in marriage, with women with your predisposition


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## ConanHub

singing79 said:


> This video willexplain to you why your previous long marriage failed & why your current one isn't working either.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Men do not flourish in marriage, with women with your predisposition


She said she was single???


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## ConanHub

It's penis size guys!!!!

Everyone knows that's why wiminz cheat!!!!😋


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## ConanHub

singing79 said:


> This video willexplain to you why your previous long marriage failed & why your current one isn't working either.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Men do not flourish in marriage, with women with your predisposition


P.S. I actually see eye to eye with @Livvie on a lot of topics and could easily see having a successful relationship with someone of her mindset and accomplishments. I'm also a fairly traditional man.

I don't really see her positions as being contrary to men with my mindset. Their are disagreements but Mrs. C and I don't see everything the same either and we have been together over 30 years.


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## gr8ful1

As a Christian, that video was very powerful. Loved it. Thanks for posting!


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## Ragnar Ragnasson

Livvie said:


> So, if neither of you has more knowledge about something than the other, you get to make the decision just because you are a male?


Oui, but of course mon cheri. Do you not know the penis rules in all ties?

Now full disclosure, no, I don't use that bit of justification at home, myself, but I encourage others to! 🤣🤣🤣🤣 while they're also being smartass and all superior like.

As long as they return and tell us how that really worked for them.

Some W may do a Lorena Bobbet on said H.
That will change things.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson

Luckylucky said:


> @sokillme this is the thing, but is she catching feelings and THEN seeing her husband differently and then thinking she’s losing respect? Tough one.


Serious question, what feelings is she catching?


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## sokillme

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> Serious question, what feelings is she catching?


Well it probably would start with a crush.


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## sokillme

Man, I hate the title of this post, every time I read it I think who is the a-hole who wrote that - oh yeah right.


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