# wife discovered porn, now wants me out



## devoted_guy

This focused topic area seems to be the one where porn and marriage is discussed, and although my behavior is far from an "addiction," here goes. . . .

We've been married 12 very happy years, and have three beautiful children together. All is well in our marriage and our lives. I am (I believe) a devoted family man and a loyal and loving husband. Never had an affair, never wanted to, never would dream of it. She too is infinitely loyal and devoted to our family, and gives of herself in an extremely unselfish way. We share in all the work of running a household and raising our children. We also share no small amount of joy, both as a couple and as a family of five. I feel compelled to add (just for background) that religion plays no role whatever in our lives (if we differ there, please don't judge; I promise not to judge you in return.) 

I am ashamed of it, but I admit to having viewed free porn on-line occasionally (perhaps once a week during some periods; not at all for long stretches). Doing so has never made me feel good about myself; quite the opposite in fact. For me it is not a craving, or even particularly enjoyable. I did it in an idle, mindless way. Makes it all the more puzzling that I did it at all! 

Anyway, it finally happened - my wife discovered some images on the computer. She angrily confronted me, and I did not deny it or try to minimize it. All this happened about a week ago, and since then I feel as though I have been desperately fighting to preserve some - any - vestiges of my married life and family life. I have been as contrite as a person can possibly be. I apologized profusely, agreeing that it is disgusting and shameful behavior, not to mention hurtful to her. I swore to never ever do it ever again. That is a promise that will never be broken, ever. 

We have spoken many times about this over the last several days. Mostly it's her levelling accusations at me: this is the same as cheating; how can I ever believe a word you say; how could you hurt me like this; my self-respect can't stay intact if I remain married to you; you are no better than the "average guy" but I didn't think I married an average guy; you've made your choice and you don't seem to want me; this is always the way it starts - then there's affairs and divorce (here she lists others - friends and also public figures - who in her mind serve as examples of the "inevitable" downward spiral from porn viewing to infidelity to divorce). For my part, I bear these words as best I can, I must admit usually in tears, as they hurt a great, great deal. We have always imagined our marriage as an especially strong one, our family unit as unshakably whole. Never before in our marriage has the prospect of divorce been raised as a real possibility, even in anger. But, on this occasion, I am sorry to say that she has indicated that she does not want to remain married to me. Cuts deeper than any knife.

Through these conversations, I repeatedly acknowledge her anger and hurt, and I say (and believe) that she has a right to feel the way she does. I also apologize (again and again), and promise to never do it again. These utterances she dismisses as the words of a person who simply cannot be trusted. 

If you've read this far, perhaps you will indulge a little more background here. My wife is a wonderful woman, I love her like life itself, I am completely devoted to her, and I tell her these things all the time (she now says that I have wiped away any such thing that I've ever said to her). She is extremely generous with her time and herself, and her first priority is always me and our family. She can be very understanding and charitable too. But. . . there is one "demon" that took me a long time to understand, and which may help explain her powerful reaction. I will not call her a "man hater" - that's too strong a term - but she does have a strong aversion to much of what might be considered "characteristically male" behavior - bravado, borish behavior particularly toward women, emotional cluelessness, intimidation, etc. I hasten to add that she has these attitudes for very good and understandable reasons (which I won't go into here, but which have nothing to do with me). The way these attitudes play out between us is that any hurt or upset on her part, even if fairly modest in scale, gets transformed into generous helpings of hostility aimed at me. That might be a bit of an understatement. It has been hard on me, from time to time; I consider authentic hostility to be something of a "love spoiler." But I know where it comes from, and I accept and appreciate her for all the many wonderful things she is. 

Anyway, it seems that, in her mind, I have offended in the absolute worst way possible, in that most "characteristically male" of ways - by viewing porn. By doing so I have transformed myself from the man that she loves (or loved), the man she "thought was different," into just another clumsy, rude jerk who is ruled by his penis. (She has basically said this.) 

I tried to explain that, in the male brain, which is very different in this respect than the female brain, female body parts are just things that we have an urge to look at. It isn't rational thinking; it is just a base urge. I also tried to explain that me looking at porn has zero emotional content: it is nothing but that base urge. For example, I would never in a million years want to see or touch one of the girls in the images, in real life. I quickly add, when explaining these things, that this is not to minimize or dismiss her hurt, which is real, and which I caused with my thoughtlessness. That it hurts her the way it does is reason enough, obviously, for me to swear to never go near another porn image again (and stick to that promise).

There is no "last straw" aspect to my story; no dark broader context that bears on her reaction to my transgression. We were very happy, blissfully so I would say, with no unresolved points of friction. Sexually, we have (had now) a great relationship. In terms of frequency (up until "the discovery" anyway), maybe 3, sometimes even 4 or 5 times a week. How many married couples of 12 years do that, and with 3 young children? And, this is the honest truth (but now she doesn't believe me): to me, she is the most beautiful woman in the entire world. No one even comes close. When we make love, all I think about is her. I don't play any "highlight reel" in my head, or imagine being with someone else. All my "highlight reels" star her and only her. 

Friends, I screwed up, big time. I admit that. My error was hugely stupid, thoughtless, foolish. I have asked and asked for forgiveness, but it doesn't appear that I am going to get it. I am terribly scared. I love her so very much. I want my children to grow up in a "whole" family. I have even suggested to her that maybe we could just be housemates; I would be a good and considerate one, and I would respect her privacy (and I would remain a faithful husband, though an "unconventional" one I guess). All this only seems to make things worse. I would surely appreciate frank (but hopefully gentle) thoughts or words of advice. Thank you for reading.


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## lamaga

Nothing is wrong with looking at porn occasionally. I think she's kind of nuts. (and I'm female)


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## Atholk

She's going to keep ranting at you until you tell her to knock it off, you aren't going anywhere, you've watched a little porn now and then for the last decade and the only time it's threatened the relationship is when your wife blew up into a shrieking banshee wanting to ruin everyones life.

Her blowing up at you in a complete over-reaction is about the stuff in her past, not really anything you did now. Perhaps she should get counseling and/or marriage counseling before she guts the childhood for three kids.

You also sound like you were walking on eggshells around her before all this blew up.


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## Maricha75

devoted_guy said:


> *I am ashamed of it, but I admit to having viewed free porn on-line occasionally (perhaps once a week during some periods; not at all for long stretches). Doing so has never made me feel good about myself; quite the opposite in fact. For me it is not a craving, or even particularly enjoyable. I did it in an idle, mindless way. Makes it all the more puzzling that I did it at all!
> 
> Anyway, it finally happened - my wife discovered some images on the computer.*


Ok, in general, I will admit that I am against porn. Much for the same reasons your wife stated, but that is my PERSONAL view. I don't push that view onto others. If someone asks my opinion, I give it. But I don't try to force anyone to change his or her mind to my way of thinking. I am thankful that my husband views porn the same way I do. Really, that is all that matters: that we are on the same page.

Now, with that being said, I bolded and quoted one part of your post that stood out to me. I can tell you why you are ashamed, and why it made you feel bad about yourself. It is because you were doing it in secret, hoping your wife wouldn't find out. Honestly, I don't think it is even the viewing that made her angry. I think it is more likely that you were HIDING it from her, ashamed of yourself. And, in keeping it hidden, THAT is what made it an issue. Perhaps she would have been against it from the start. Perhaps not. The fact is, now you will never know. 

Athol suggested your wife may need counseling. I agree with that... but I think you do as well. You were ashamed of watching it. You need to learn what made you want to view it. It could be that "guy thing" (ftr, I don't buy into that because not all men view it, not all men enjoy it)... or there could be something that you felt you needed. I can't say because I don't know.

And, as you said religion doesn't play a part in this...you both need to discover what made her so adamantly against it. Frankly, I think it was because you hid it. But i would be pissed if my husband hid porn as well! Try to get her to go to counseling, but IC AND MC... IC for both of you.

Good luck!

Oh, Lamaga, I don't think she was nuts lol. I think she really was reacting to the fact that he had it hidden from her. Maybe I'm wrong. *shrug*


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## Jamison

You both are mismatched on your views on the issue, so its best to go your separate ways, and find someone who shares the same views and let her do the same.


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## Cherry

Atholk said:


> She's going to keep ranting at you until you tell her to knock it off, you aren't going anywhere, you've watched a little porn now and then for the last decade and the only time it's threatened the relationship is when your wife blew up into a shrieking banshee wanting to ruin everyones life.
> 
> Her blowing up at you in a complete over-reaction is about the stuff in her past, not really anything you did now. Perhaps she should get counseling and/or marriage counseling before she guts the childhood for three kids.
> 
> You also sound like you were walking on eggshells around her before all this blew up.


This


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## YinPrincess

Maricha75 said:


> Ok, in general, I will admit that I am against porn. Much for the same reasons your wife stated, but that is my PERSONAL view. I don't push that view onto others. If someone asks my opinion, I give it. But I don't try to force anyone to change his or her mind to my way of thinking. I am thankful that my husband views porn the same way I do. Really, that is all that matters: that we are on the same page.
> 
> Now, with that being said, I bolded and quoted one part of your post that stood out to me. I can tell you why you are ashamed, and why it made you feel bad about yourself. It is because you were doing it in secret, hoping your wife wouldn't find out. Honestly, I don't think it is even the viewing that made her angry. I think it is more likely that you were HIDING it from her, ashamed of yourself. And, in keeping it hidden, THAT is what made it an issue. Perhaps she would have been against it from the start. Perhaps not. The fact is, now you will never know.
> 
> Athol suggested your wife may need counseling. I agree with that... but I think you do as well. You were ashamed of watching it. You need to learn what made you want to view it. It could be that "guy thing" (ftr, I don't buy into that because not all men view it, not all men enjoy it)... or there could be something that you felt you needed. I can't say because I don't know.
> 
> And, as you said religion doesn't play a part in this...you both need to discover what made her so adamantly against it. Frankly, I think it was because you hid it. But i would be pissed if my husband hid porn as well! Try to get her to go to counseling, but IC AND MC... IC for both of you.
> 
> Good luck!
> 
> Oh, Lamaga, I don't think she was nuts lol. I think she really was reacting to the fact that he had it hidden from her. Maybe I'm wrong. *shrug*


I think this hits the nail on the head. At least for me it does. I've noticed a lot of women who are comfortable with porn use are in relationships where it's not some big secret and they are also getting their sexual needs met.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Hope1964

I also think she's nuts, but if you look at things from her perspective, apparently him viewing porn = cheating, so she's having a very normal reaction from the POV of the betrayed spouse.

If she really insists on taking a stand about this, perhaps your best recourse would be marriage counseling.

Maybe if you do some reading around the Coping with Infidelity forum you can come up with some ideas. You need to treat her as if you are a fully remorseful wayward husband (which btw from what you wrote, you do appear to be) and hope she comes round.

Is there ANY chance you can convince her that the porn use you described is nothing more than 99.99% of healthy red blooded males??


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## lamaga

But if she's going to assume that looking at porn once a week = cheating, why the heck wouldn't he hide it? I would.


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## Speed

Divorce over you occasionally looking at porn?

Either you aren't being completely truthful about the situation or your marriage wasn't nearly as solid as you thought it to be.


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## Hope1964

lamaga said:


> But if she's going to assume that looking at porn once a week = cheating, why the heck wouldn't he hide it? I would.


Are you asking me? I agree with you. The hiding it is totally part of it, as it is with any cheater who gets caught.


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## lamaga

Huh...not sure if I'm agreeing with you or not, Hope 

I don't think that looking at porn, even in secret, in any way equates to cheating. I've been cheated on, and Lordy, how much I would have loved for that not to have happened and for him to have been only looking at porn. I think that equating the two seriously minimizes the experience of those who have actually experienced physical cheating. 
But...that's just me, and I'm used to being wrong around here


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## diwali123

All you do is look at pictures? No video? I'm a woman and I don't think there's anything wrong with porn. People have been depicting bodies and sex acts for thousands of years. 
Is she a feminist? I think some women view it as being debasing to women, that the poor innocent people in these pictures are being used and abused. Could that be where she is coming from?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## ocotillo

devoted_guy said:


> Anyway, it finally happened - my wife discovered some images on the computer. She angrily confronted me, and I did not deny it or try to minimize it.


Curious: Were you actually saving these images on the hard drive or was your wife combing through the browser cache?

The reason I ask is because people don't usually save images to a family computer unless they don't care if they're found. Conversely, people don't usually comb through a browser image cache unless they are suspicious.


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## Hope1964

lamaga said:


> Huh...not sure if I'm agreeing with you or not, Hope
> 
> I don't think that looking at porn, even in secret, in any way equates to cheating. I've been cheated on, and Lordy, how much I would have loved for that not to have happened and for him to have been only looking at porn. I think that equating the two seriously minimizes the experience of those who have actually experienced physical cheating.
> But...that's just me, and I'm used to being wrong around here


I don't think it does either. But apparently this guys wife does. That's why I am equating her reaction to that of a BS.


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## tacoma

lamaga said:


> Nothing is wrong with looking at porn occasionally. I think she's kind of nuts. (and I'm female)


Ditto.

I`m very happy I chose wisely enough to avoid the possible destruction of my entire life due to someone else's irrational insecurities.

Go ahead..flame away!


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## tacoma

lamaga said:


> But if she's going to assume that looking at porn once a week = cheating, why the heck wouldn't he hide it? I would.


Jesus H Christ Lamaga they`re gonna burn you alive sometime in the next two pages!

Quiet woman!


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## lamaga

It's okay, I'm used to it


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## diwali123

I'm just curious, if you watched a mainstream movie that was nc17 and had nudity and sex in it, would she consider that cheating?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## lamaga

Good point, diwali, where IS that Maginot Line, anyway?


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## Hope1964

It always floors me, the number of women who have such attitudes toward porn. I always wonder if they wear a sheet with a hole in it to bed when they want to get pregnant, and are completely chaste the rest of the time.


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## GTdad

I really hope this guy comes back. I understand that we all have differing ideas about what's acceptable in a marriage and what's not, but this truly seems unjust to me.


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## Hope1964

GTdad said:


> I really hope this guy comes back. I understand that we all have differing ideas about what's acceptable in a marriage and what's not, but this truly seems unjust to me.


Me too


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## devoted_guy

(The original poster here.)

Thanks for replying, everyone. Some responses in return.

Speed - actually my original post was completely truthful, and is a full account of all the details that I think are relevant. My situation may seem a little "out there," perhaps, but it's the situation I'm in. I don't have much incentive to make up a story here. 

ocotillo - No, wasn't purposefully saving them. Nor was I taking the steps you might imagine a "sneaky guy" would take to delete traces of my porn viewing. Not too "smart" I guess? This may sound crazy at some level, but there is an element of relief in being caught. I see now how hurtful and damaging my behavior was, and boy I sure would hate to be still doing it. Too bad it had to cause my wife such anguish, just for me to get that clarity.

Maricha75 - your words could be construed as critical, but they are nonetheless dead on. It is absolutely accurate that the real hurt, the real sense of betrayal, flows from the fact that I was hiding what I was doing. I think that's where the equivalence with "cheating" came from, in her mind. I too think that equating what I did with real cheating is to minimize the latter, as lamaga said. But her sense of betrayal is real. Your post helped me get some clarity on this. It is a little off-base for me to argue that "what I did wasn't really all that bad," when for my wife, the real issue is that I hid something I knew she would not like. The fact that the behavior has something to do with sex certainly sharpens the sting, but the central issue is the concealment. That's an important notion to ponder and act on. In marriage, trust is, if not everything, then at least extremely important.


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## Maricha75

Hope1964 said:


> It always floors me, the number of women who have such attitudes toward porn. I always wonder if they wear a sheet with a hole in it to bed when they want to get pregnant, and are completely chaste the rest of the time.


Nope, no "holey sheets" nor chaste woman here.


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## MEM2020

DG,
This is a fascinating read. First of all - props to you for being completely transparent in your post. I do think you have to ask yourself one very serious question: Do you really want to save your marriage? 

Not asking that to be a smart aleck. Asking it because the thing that has best worked for you up until now, is about to absolutely blow up your marriage. And that 'thing' is appeasement. Your W has a reservoir of hostility - fairly obvious what the source is and that is sad. 

But you have enabled a pattern that is not very good in the long haul and that is the loss of proportionality. 

One quick example from 20 plus years ago. W and I were not married - she got pregnant by accident - it was equally our fault. The withdrawal method is not exactly the most reliable means of birth control. She was very anxious, embarrassed, etc. about the pregnancy as she comes from a large, devout catholic family. Shortly after I moved in I realized that her reactions in conflict were out of whack with what is reasonable. This peaked when she exploded over me handing her a few tissues instead of one. 

I told her we were done. She was being emotionally abusive, it was rapidly escalating and I deserved better. I was calm and about to pack. She freaked, apologized for being a total bltch and begged forgiveness. 

Back to you: Every time you apologize or ask forgiveness or radiate shame around her you AMPLIFY her belief that what you did was off the charts awful. It makes her MORE angry. 

Stop apologizing. Stop asking forgiveness. Be polite and brief in your interactions. IF she brings this up or alludes to it in any way simply respond like this: We both brought baggage to the marriage. I have accommodated yours without reservation for 12 years. I understand you - accept you and love you. You on the other hand are never more than one step from throwing me in the "bucket of the enemy" which is men/maleness. It is not acceptable and after 12 years of being a good guy I deserve better. 

And then no matter what she says - shut up. Do not respond. Let her talk and say what she wants. As long as she stays within the bounds of rational and respectful. If she doesn't - hold your hand up and tell her - we can continue when you can treat me with respect. And then go on about your life until she decides whether 12 years of good is outweighed by this event.

The more you appease her - the more she will think that even YOU believe this is a terminal offence...



devoted_guy said:


> This focused topic area seems to be the one where porn and marriage is discussed, and although my behavior is far from an "addiction," here goes. . . .
> 
> We've been married 12 very happy years, and have three beautiful children together. All is well in our marriage and our lives. I am (I believe) a devoted family man and a loyal and loving husband. Never had an affair, never wanted to, never would dream of it. She too is infinitely loyal and devoted to our family, and gives of herself in an extremely unselfish way. We share in all the work of running a household and raising our children. We also share no small amount of joy, both as a couple and as a family of five. I feel compelled to add (just for background) that religion plays no role whatever in our lives (if we differ there, please don't judge; I promise not to judge you in return.)
> 
> I am ashamed of it, but I admit to having viewed free porn on-line occasionally (perhaps once a week during some periods; not at all for long stretches). Doing so has never made me feel good about myself; quite the opposite in fact. For me it is not a craving, or even particularly enjoyable. I did it in an idle, mindless way. Makes it all the more puzzling that I did it at all!
> 
> Anyway, it finally happened - my wife discovered some images on the computer. She angrily confronted me, and I did not deny it or try to minimize it. All this happened about a week ago, and since then I feel as though I have been desperately fighting to preserve some - any - vestiges of my married life and family life. I have been as contrite as a person can possibly be. I apologized profusely, agreeing that it is disgusting and shameful behavior, not to mention hurtful to her. I swore to never ever do it ever again. That is a promise that will never be broken, ever.
> 
> We have spoken many times about this over the last several days. Mostly it's her levelling accusations at me: this is the same as cheating; how can I ever believe a word you say; how could you hurt me like this; my self-respect can't stay intact if I remain married to you; you are no better than the "average guy" but I didn't think I married an average guy; you've made your choice and you don't seem to want me; this is always the way it starts - then there's affairs and divorce (here she lists others - friends and also public figures - who in her mind serve as examples of the "inevitable" downward spiral from porn viewing to infidelity to divorce). For my part, I bear these words as best I can, I must admit usually in tears, as they hurt a great, great deal. We have always imagined our marriage as an especially strong one, our family unit as unshakably whole. Never before in our marriage has the prospect of divorce been raised as a real possibility, even in anger. But, on this occasion, I am sorry to say that she has indicated that she does not want to remain married to me. Cuts deeper than any knife.
> 
> Through these conversations, I repeatedly acknowledge her anger and hurt, and I say (and believe) that she has a right to feel the way she does. I also apologize (again and again), and promise to never do it again. These utterances she dismisses as the words of a person who simply cannot be trusted.
> 
> If you've read this far, perhaps you will indulge a little more background here. My wife is a wonderful woman, I love her like life itself, I am completely devoted to her, and I tell her these things all the time (she now says that I have wiped away any such thing that I've ever said to her). She is extremely generous with her time and herself, and her first priority is always me and our family. She can be very understanding and charitable too. But. . . there is one "demon" that took me a long time to understand, and which may help explain her powerful reaction. I will not call her a "man hater" - that's too strong a term - but she does have a strong aversion to much of what might be considered "characteristically male" behavior - bravado, borish behavior particularly toward women, emotional cluelessness, intimidation, etc. I hasten to add that she has these attitudes for very good and understandable reasons (which I won't go into here, but which have nothing to do with me). The way these attitudes play out between us is that any hurt or upset on her part, even if fairly modest in scale, gets transformed into generous helpings of hostility aimed at me. That might be a bit of an understatement. It has been hard on me, from time to time; I consider authentic hostility to be something of a "love spoiler." But I know where it comes from, and I accept and appreciate her for all the many wonderful things she is.
> 
> Anyway, it seems that, in her mind, I have offended in the absolute worst way possible, in that most "characteristically male" of ways - by viewing porn. By doing so I have transformed myself from the man that she loves (or loved), the man she "thought was different," into just another clumsy, rude jerk who is ruled by his penis. (She has basically said this.)
> 
> I tried to explain that, in the male brain, which is very different in this respect than the female brain, female body parts are just things that we have an urge to look at. It isn't rational thinking; it is just a base urge. I also tried to explain that me looking at porn has zero emotional content: it is nothing but that base urge. For example, I would never in a million years want to see or touch one of the girls in the images, in real life. I quickly add, when explaining these things, that this is not to minimize or dismiss her hurt, which is real, and which I caused with my thoughtlessness. That it hurts her the way it does is reason enough, obviously, for me to swear to never go near another porn image again (and stick to that promise).
> 
> There is no "last straw" aspect to my story; no dark broader context that bears on her reaction to my transgression. We were very happy, blissfully so I would say, with no unresolved points of friction. Sexually, we have (had now) a great relationship. In terms of frequency (up until "the discovery" anyway), maybe 3, sometimes even 4 or 5 times a week. How many married couples of 12 years do that, and with 3 young children? And, this is the honest truth (but now she doesn't believe me): to me, she is the most beautiful woman in the entire world. No one even comes close. When we make love, all I think about is her. I don't play any "highlight reel" in my head, or imagine being with someone else. All my "highlight reels" star her and only her.
> 
> Friends, I screwed up, big time. I admit that. My error was hugely stupid, thoughtless, foolish. I have asked and asked for forgiveness, but it doesn't appear that I am going to get it. I am terribly scared. I love her so very much. I want my children to grow up in a "whole" family. I have even suggested to her that maybe we could just be housemates; I would be a good and considerate one, and I would respect her privacy (and I would remain a faithful husband, though an "unconventional" one I guess). All this only seems to make things worse. I would surely appreciate frank (but hopefully gentle) thoughts or words of advice. Thank you for reading.


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## Caribbean Man

GTdad said:


> I really hope this guy comes back. I understand that we all have differing ideas about what's acceptable in a marriage and what's not, but this truly seems unjust to me.


Vagina Politics at it's best.
She will just keep going on and on.
No need for him to be " deeply ashamed " or anything like that. If she feel that porn is offensive to her,then ok,apologize and move on. 
i am sure that there has been times she did stuff that was offensive to him........

Many years ago my wife tried something like that on me,she didn't get too far though.

He had better start " snooping around."
Check her mobile phone records etc.


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## dormant

Responding to "It could be that "guy thing" (ftr, I don't buy into that because not all men view it, not all men enjoy it)"

In my opinion, it is only natural to want to look at these things. It is the way we men are wired. If a man doesn't look, there can only be a few reasons:

1) He was raised thinking it is dirty and is afraid he'll get caught
2) He is lying
3) He is gay


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## Maricha75

dormant said:


> Responding to "It could be that "guy thing" (ftr, I don't buy into that because not all men view it, not all men enjoy it)"
> 
> In my opinion, it is only natural to want to look at these things. It is the way we men are wired. If a man doesn't look, there can only be a few reasons:
> 
> 1) He was raised thinking it is dirty and is afraid he'll get caught
> 2) He is lying
> 3) He is gay



1. He viewed it when he was younger, before we ever met, and was disgusted by it... it was something his dad had readily available and his mom was fine with it being viewed. She just didn't care for it, herself.
2. He's not lying. He doesn't view it, period. Verified.
3. So...you believe my husband is gay? While I know that has happened in marriages, I can certainly attest to the fact that my husband is most definitely attracted to me, his wife. He has never given any indication that he does NOT find other women attractive. His former EA partner is an indication of that. 

There ARE NORMAL (as in not seeing things as dirty from a religious viewpoint) straight men out there who do not care for porn. It's just a fact. They may not run in your circle, but they do exist. Some of them have even posted on TAM. What I wonder is why people think a normal straight man can't make the choice that he doesn't like it. 


But, as you said above:


> *In my opinion*


which meant that the only thing that matters is that my husband and I know the truth about all three points you suggest: he's not gay, he isn't lying, and he wasn't raised thinking it was dirty, nor is/was there an issue with being caught. He just chooses not to view it. And I am glad we agree on it.


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## mrswoods

nothing wrong with abit of porn, i must say a few years ago i was abit closed minded about it, but i got into glamour modelling and now have alot of porn star friends so i see both sides of it, from the people and how nice they are to the filming and then how it all comes together. porn is just abit of fun and im sure she would rather have you wanking over a porn film instead of sleeping with other women 
some couples find that watching them together improves your sex life and then she has nothin to be worried about because shes there watching it with you 

hope it all works out for you tho x


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## MrsOldNews

lamaga said:


> Nothing is wrong with looking at porn occasionally. I think she's kind of nuts. (and I'm female)


I agree!


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## devoted_guy

Interesting analysis, MEM11363.

It hasn't escaped me that the manner in which I often respond to my wife's anger and hostility is, in effect, encouraging that hostility. Believe me, I have had ample opportunities to muse over the psychology that operates in my marriage! I have my own "psychological features" that may not be helping, particularly in the present crisis. For example, I have a rather powerful "shame response" (perhaps you noticed?). Sort of the opposite of a politician  

But back to my wife. Your remark about her being quick to kick me over to the "bucket of the enemy" is, unfortunately, spot-on. When you're in that bucket, you don't get much in the way of the usual benefits of love and marriage, like charity and forgiveness. Trouble is, there is little prospect for these behavior patterns to change. Trust me. There is, shall I say, a certain "rigidity" there, in terms of her point of view, on all things. Having something approaching a reasoned discussion or debate, particularly on something like recent events, is simply impossible. I appreciate the comments of a number of responders who offer that looking at a little porn is not the end of the world. But to my wife, what I did is deserving of kicking me into that enemy bucket, and then kicking the bucket over the edge of a cliff. In this, she is a "Very Convinced Person." To suggest that it maybe wasn't quite that bad only makes matters worse. 

Reading this, you may wonder why I want to save my marriage? Please remember that you only know her through what I've told you, and only in the context of the unpleasant circumstances in which I now find myself. She has many dimensions, most of which are desirable, attractive, wonderful. We all come as package deals. As I alluded to in my original post, she has been profoundly affected by some rather horrific events earlier in her life. Anybody would have been affected. (By the way, to suggest to her that this is the case constitutes fighting words.) But I am, I think, a flexible person, and I can accommodate to this way of being. We have three children, we have a happy life together provided certain land mines can be avoided. I am not about to shred all of that because I am sometimes (emphasis on "sometimes") desperately unhappy due to what I feel is unfair or rough treatment. 

Wow that reads a lot more like a "defense" than I intended. Just trying to explain, perhaps not all that well. In any case, I cannot say that matters are really in my hands now. I am doing my best to move on, in some respects along the lines of MEM11363's counsel. Time will tell. But if healing does occur, I will, unfortunately, carry forward the knowledge that there are "goofs" on my part that can cause the house to collapse around me. And (the tough part), I now have some data that suggests the goofs that qualify are not necessarily grievously serious.


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## seesah

devoted_guy said:


> Interesting analysis, MEM11363.
> 
> It hasn't escaped me that the manner in which I often respond to my wife's anger and hostility is, in effect, encouraging that hostility. Believe me, I have had ample opportunities to muse over the psychology that operates in my marriage! I have my own "psychological features" that may not be helping, particularly in the present crisis. For example, I have a rather powerful "shame response" (perhaps you noticed?). Sort of the opposite of a politician
> 
> But back to my wife. Your remark about her being quick to kick me over to the "bucket of the enemy" is, unfortunately, spot-on. When you're in that bucket, you don't get much in the way of the usual benefits of love and marriage, like charity and forgiveness. Trouble is, there is little prospect for these behavior patterns to change. Trust me. There is, shall I say, a certain "rigidity" there, in terms of her point of view, on all things. Having something approaching a reasoned discussion or debate, particularly on something like recent events, is simply impossible. I appreciate the comments of a number of responders who offer that looking at a little porn is not the end of the world. But to my wife, what I did is deserving of kicking me into that enemy bucket, and then kicking the bucket over the edge of a cliff. In this, she is a "Very Convinced Person." To suggest that it maybe wasn't quite that bad only makes matters worse.
> 
> Reading this, you may wonder why I want to save my marriage? Please remember that you only know her through what I've told you, and only in the context of the unpleasant circumstances in which I now find myself. She has many dimensions, most of which are desirable, attractive, wonderful. We all come as package deals. As I alluded to in my original post, she has been profoundly affected by some rather horrific events earlier in her life. Anybody would have been affected. (By the way, to suggest to her that this is the case constitutes fighting words.) But I am, I think, a flexible person, and I can accommodate to this way of being. We have three children, we have a happy life together provided certain land mines can be avoided. I am not about to shred all of that because I am sometimes (emphasis on "sometimes") desperately unhappy due to what I feel is unfair or rough treatment.
> 
> Wow that reads a lot more like a "defense" than I intended. Just trying to explain, perhaps not all that well. In any case, I cannot say that matters are really in my hands now. I am doing my best to move on, in some respects along the lines of MEM11363's counsel. Time will tell. But if healing does occur, I will, unfortunately, carry forward the knowledge that there are "goofs" on my part that can cause the house to collapse around me. And (the tough part), I now have some data that suggests the goofs that qualify are not necessarily grievously serious.


So you have to walk on eggshells because _she_ has issues she hasn't sorted out? That seems backwards to me.

I have my own aversion to porn and wouldn't appreciate discovering that my husband was lying about it, but I wouldn't blow up at him like your wife did to you. If he apologized and said it wouldn't happen again, I would move on. Then again, I am receiving therapy for my own "demons".

She seems like a very black and white thinker. Either you're an angel or the devil and right now, because you were sneaky and looked at porn, you're the devil. 

I agree with MEM11363. I think you're enabling her behavior. It's one thing to validate her feelings, it's another to let yourself get walked on because you made ONE MISTAKE. I understand that you're afraid that it may be the end of your marriage if you put your foot down and demand respect from her, but you need to stand up for yourself.

I think you both need IC and MC. It appears she knows about your shame response and she's feeding off of it. She knows you feel badly about it, you've made that clear to her, yet she continues to shame you about it?


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## seesah

I would like to add that, OP, you are not the cause for her continued anguish over your porn usage. She is. Her discovery of the porn may have caused her to feel an upwelling of rage and disappointment that you are really just an average guy. Maybe she had such high expectations of you that it shattered her idea of you as the "ideal guy". You're not perfect, no one is. However, she has chosen to continue to feel the way she does. She may not know how to control those feelings but she is the one who is allowing this to consume her.


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## gameflashasia

Hope1964 said:


> I also think she's nuts, but if you look at things from her perspective, apparently him viewing porn = cheating, so she's having a very normal reaction from the POV of the betrayed spouse. y8
> 
> If she really insists on taking a stand about this, friv perhaps your best recourse would be marriage counseling.
> 
> Maybe if you do some reading around the Coping game flash with Infidelity forum you can come up with some ideas. You need to treat her as if you are a fully remorseful wayward husband (which btw from what you wrote, you do appear to be) and hope she comes round.
> 
> Is there ANY chance you can convince her that the porn use you described is nothing more than 99.99% of healthy red blooded males??


i think so


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## Maricha75

devoted_guy said:


> Interesting analysis, MEM11363.
> 
> It hasn't escaped me that the manner in which I often respond to my wife's anger and hostility is, in effect, encouraging that hostility. Believe me, I have had ample opportunities to muse over the psychology that operates in my marriage! I have my own "psychological features" that may not be helping, particularly in the present crisis. For example, I have a rather powerful "shame response" (perhaps you noticed?). Sort of the opposite of a politician
> 
> But back to my wife. Your remark about her being quick to kick me over to the "bucket of the enemy" is, unfortunately, spot-on. When you're in that bucket, you don't get much in the way of the usual benefits of love and marriage, like charity and forgiveness. Trouble is, there is little prospect for these behavior patterns to change. Trust me. There is, shall I say, a certain "rigidity" there, in terms of her point of view, on all things. Having something approaching a reasoned discussion or debate, particularly on something like recent events, is simply impossible. I appreciate the comments of a number of responders who offer that looking at a little porn is not the end of the world. But to my wife, what I did is deserving of kicking me into that enemy bucket, and then kicking the bucket over the edge of a cliff. In this, she is a "Very Convinced Person." To suggest that it maybe wasn't quite that bad only makes matters worse.
> 
> Reading this, you may wonder why I want to save my marriage? Please remember that you only know her through what I've told you, and only in the context of the unpleasant circumstances in which I now find myself. She has many dimensions, most of which are desirable, attractive, wonderful. We all come as package deals. As I alluded to in my original post, she has been profoundly affected by some rather horrific events earlier in her life. Anybody would have been affected. (By the way, to suggest to her that this is the case constitutes fighting words.) But I am, I think, a flexible person, and I can accommodate to this way of being. We have three children, *we have a happy life together provided certain land mines can be avoided.* I am not about to shred all of that because *I am sometimes (emphasis on "sometimes") desperately unhappy due to what I feel is unfair or rough treatment. *
> 
> Wow that reads a lot more like a "defense" than I intended. Just trying to explain, perhaps not all that well. In any case, I cannot say that matters are really in my hands now. I am doing my best to move on, in some respects along the lines of MEM11363's counsel. Time will tell. But if healing does occur, I will, unfortunately, carry forward the knowledge that there are "goofs" on my part that can cause the house to collapse around me. And (the tough part), I now have some data that suggests the goofs that qualify are not necessarily grievously serious.


As I stated above, and has been stated by at least one other person... get into counseling. Walking on eggshells is not the way to live. Your three wonderful kids WILL notice! Trust me on this! My three noticed when I was walking on eggshells around their dad. It wasn't about porn, it was a different issue. But we worked thru it. He is in IC due to mental/psychological issues. I have been able to sit in on a couple of his sessions. I learned a lot from his therapist. And SHE told HIM that I should NOT have to walk on eggshells! We honestly would be in MC if we actually had the money to go (fixed income). TAM has been my therapy, as well as a few ladies from our church. And, for professional therapy, we have his psychologist for now.

My point is this. I stated my PERSONAL views on porn. Knowing my view, I also agree that your wife's reaction to you viewing it was over the top. I think, still, that she is more upset that you hid it than that you did it. That's how I would feel. Yes, I would be upset about IT, but more upset about it being hidden. You need to get her into counseling to deal with HER issues. And, you both need to get in to see if you can work thru this. 

Regarding the happy life: if you are giving in to EVERYTHING, just to keep the peace, it makes you a "Nice Guy". You can't do that. That is NOT what you want you kids to grow up seeing as a normal relationship. A doormat is NOT what you want them to learn, regardless of gender. If you continue to do this, they will learn the behavior and carry it into their future relationships. Is that what you really want? My advice: stop apologizing to her. You have done that, plenty. Stop telling her it will never happen again. Again, you have told her plenty of times. I won't tell you to stop or to continue viewing it. Regardless, you told her you won't, so if you intend to keep that promise, then don't view it. Show by action, not just words. Constantly begging for forgiveness, constantly placating her is NOT going to fix this. The only thing that will resolve it is action. The question is... what will you do?


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## anonymouskitty

You could tell her that you were just following instructions on how to do the tantric upside down jackhammer thingy with handcuffs , don't tell me she's not interested in the a little tantric upside down jackhammer thingy with handcuffs?

On a more serious note though your wife has issues that go way beyond your watching porn. Find out what they are and help her deal with them.

Watching porn is to men what smutty romance novels are to women, we men are visual creatures and thus can't get off on how the knight in shining armour swooped down and saved the beautiful princess. It is completely healthy except if you're addicted to it. In fact if you check your local adult store you'll find that there are a lot of female oriented or couples porn/soft core that both of you can watch together.



> My point is this. I stated my PERSONAL views on porn. Knowing my view, I also agree that your wife's reaction to you viewing it was over the top. I think, still, that she is more upset that you hid it than that you did it. That's how I would feel. Yes, I would be upset about IT, but more upset about it being hidden. You need to get her into counseling to deal with HER issues. And, you both need to get in to see if you can work thru this.


This probably is one of the reasons why she's pissed, the secrecy.


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## Vanton68

anonymouskitty said:


> *Watching porn is to men what smutty romance novels are to women, we men are visual creatures* and thus can't get off on how the knight in shining armour swooped down and saved the beautiful princess.


Agreed!!!! No matter how many women say "I'm not accepting that excuse that men are more visual", it doesn't make it so.


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## GetTough

lamaga said:


> Nothing is wrong with looking at porn occasionally. I think she's kind of nuts. (and I'm female)


I agree with this 100%, but at the same time it will not help him to get defensive in this situation. She doesn't see it that way.


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## GetTough

devoted_guy said:


> ...Having something approaching a reasoned discussion or debate, particularly on something like recent events, is simply impossible...


Please see my responses on this thread. I think they will REALLY help you. Do NOT over-apologize.

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/49353-ok-im-bad-guy.html


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## EleGirl

I think that when the time is right you should see if you can get your wife to go to MC with you.

It's not just this porn issue; it's her rigidity and thinking that she can drop the hatchet on your marriage for what amounts to pretty minor things.


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## LostWifeCrushed

OK, I am going to go against the grain here. Are you saying you did not know she had a problem with porn before you married? If so, then I think divorcing over a first discovery is extreme. But I find it hard to believe you had no clue she felt like this. Which means you decided to throw her values out the window. Just do what you want and think you've outsmarted her. THATS what she is responding to.

Debating the pros and cons of porn aren't going to help you solve this problem. All that matters is what you've led your wife to believe and the agreement made between you

Everyone is allowed to feel how they want about porn. To thine own self be true. But you should not be lying about this. You should not be leading her on to think you don't do porn and then doing this behind her back.

I hope thats not what happened. If she had feelings this strong about it, there must be a reason. What if she was sexually abused or something like that. Just saying. She's really got a strong reaction. I would try to get to the bottom of it.


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## GhostRydr

What I dont get are you guys who save images/video on your PC.

Porn is so everywhere why the need to save?

I dont save or download anything.

But if you wanna keep some stuff you like, write down the website and revisit it from there not your saved pictures. Keep your secret naughty list where she cant spy..and NOT on your PC either! Paper....old fashioned paper

and tell her to grow up and welcome to the real world. Stop being contrite and dust off your man card. The woman is out of control and needs to be "reset" if everything you are saying is true.


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## Beelzebub

crazy crazy crazy. your wife has anger issue.


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## Maricha75

GhostRydr said:


> What I dont get are you guys who save images/video on your PC.
> 
> Porn is so everywhere why the need to save?
> 
> I dont save or download anything.
> 
> But if you wanna keep some stuff you like, write down the website and revisit it from there not your saved pictures. *Keep your secret naughty list where she cant spy..and NOT on your PC either! Paper....old fashioned paper*
> 
> and tell her to grow up and welcome to the real world. Stop being contrite and dust off your man card. The woman is out of control and needs to be "reset" if everything you are saying is true.


Yea, that's it... encourage him to hide some more. And if she locates the piece of paper while straightening up the house because he didn't hide it well, what then? He knows she has issues. He knew that going into the marriage. He married her anyway. He HID this from her... and encouraging him to HIDE it from her some more is NOT going to make things better. This is coming from a woman who doesn't like porn, whose husband doesn't like porn (and no, he's not gay), and I don't read smutty novels. Yea, I know... You don't believe me when I say my husband doesn't view it. Believe what you want. 

The point is, his wife is entitled to her personal view on the subject...as am I...as are you... and anyone else. She doesn't have to accept it in the marriage. He knew that was a condition going in... and he broke it. Now, he's trying to fix it.

dg, if you are still lurking, you have apologized enough. It is all up to her whether she is going to continue the marriage or not. For crying out loud, don't hide things from her. If this is a deal breaker for her, I am sorry. If not, then see if you can come to an agreement. Just don't lie to her anymore!


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## SunnyT

Ya know.... regardless of the "crime", you don't have to cower and grovel for ever. You don't HAVE to leave if she yells at you to. You just have to do what you think is right, if you want to repair the damage. 

She's "not the boss of you". 

You know where she stands on the porn issue now tho! It's up to you to respect that, but she can't MAKE you.


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## GhostRydr

I just look at it as guys wouldnt have these problems up front as long as they tell their girlfriends/fiances to deal or not deal with the fact they/we, like to masturbate and view porn now and then.

Too many men arent being men by pretending, oh honey you are all I need I only touch myself when we have sex or view naked women when its you undressed. LOL! What is this grade school, where us guys would pretend we didnt jerk off so we wouldnt be made fun of?


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## ladybird

So your wife discovered you viewing porn once and she blows her top. 

I am a woman, do not like porn whatsoever.

Your sex life with your wife doesn't seem to be suffering because of it.

You can tell your wife my story. Things won't seem so bad then

I will say this- I have always had issues with porn- always, but when I would come across it on my husbands computer, it would upset me, but not like your wife.. At the time we had a very good sex life.. So I was like ok whatever and let it go (it was maybe a couple times a year) 

Fast forward to 4 years ago. Our sex life went down hill.. I was pregnant and my husband told me "we don't have to have sex" I was really starting to show at this point. I was like ok whatever. Well we didn't have sex for over a year! Our son was 6 months old by the time we had sex again. I felt that something was way off, but I kept my mouth shut for a while, thinking that things would get back to normal.. They never did.

I thought my husband was having an affair. Once i found out he was viewing porn all the time, It was just as bad, he may as well had been having an affair.

When I confronted him about it, he flat out denied it. Told me that it wasn't him, it was his 18 year old son (his son lived with us at the time) He said "you know I don't look at that ****" Yeah right, but there was no point on going any further with it.

Some months later I found it again. This time I knew it was him. His son had moved out.. fought about it. Promised to never do it again.

(Now mind you... I told him how frustrated I was due to the lack of our sex life. WE had sex maybe once every other month. I told him how i felt about the way things were and he just blew it off.) I did ask him to come to me. I don't care if it was in the middle of the freaking night, Wake me up.. I don't care.

Every time I found porn, I cut me like a hot knife each and every damn time. I felt like I was betrayed (i was in a way). I would come on to my husband only to be blown off or he would yell at me telling me "I am not in the ****ing mood" (Yeah well I can't imagine why)

Feb this year. He never stopped. It got worse. as soon as I would leave the house, he would hop on his computer. The last time it happened I was LIVID! 

I left finally him, took my son and I to my mothers house. I could no longer take the emotional torment that he was putting me through. I was depressed and I was a walking time bomb just waiting to go off.. I wasn't good enough for him anymore (that is how i felt.)

After all the talks we had about the way things were, and that things needed to change. He didn't hear me or didn't care. That i wanted sex way more then I was getting, only because he felt guilty. 

The reason why I have crazy issues about porn now is because, My h and I were not having sex!! He used it as a replacement for sex with me. If him and I do work things out. IT will NEVER be allowed in our house again PERIOD! It doesn't matter if I find it once in 5 years!

I left alot out, but this is the jist of it... Let your wife read my story maybe then she will realize it could be a lot worse.


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