# mmmng for my 16 old old



## chillymorn (Aug 11, 2010)

Should i get my son a copy? 

or any other suggested reading material about becoming a man.

thoughts?


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## badsanta (Oct 13, 2014)

Let him pay the bill for putting new tires on the family car that he uses to get back and forth from High School or tell him he can ride the bus if he can't afford it.

Also tell him that for at least one day that he needs to pay and/or provide for everything that the family eats. He can hunt or fish if he chooses to do so. 

That is the kind of stuff that will make him a man. For me it was realizing I could build a house.

Just giving him books makes you look kind of girly if you ask me!


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## chillymorn (Aug 11, 2010)

badsanta said:


> Let him pay the bill for putting new tires on the family car that he uses to get back and forth from High School or tell him he can ride the bus if he can't afford it.
> 
> Also tell him that for at least one day that he needs to pay and/or provide for everything that the family eats. He can hunt or fish if he chooses to do so.
> 
> ...


girly. lol

we already do hunt/ fish he shot more deer this year than i and he skinned and butchered it. basicaly feed us all winter he is a man in that regard.he helps when asks without an attitude and gets near perfect grades.worked all last summer and saved all of it.

I have had discussions about choosing a girlfriend and how to treat other people. all that stuff. how to be a good stewart of the money you earn etc.

Some times teaching from a different source is better that hearing it from dad.

I coached baseball for years last couple of years when his bat wasn't up to snuff i tried to take him and pitch to him. he wouldn't listen to a thing I said. he wasn't rude but I could tell that hes wasn't really listening.So I took him to a batting coach who told him the same stuff I tried but he ate it up and is hitting much better. 

some times they need to feel the learned it on their own for it to sink in and i was just thinking some of these books that are suggested might be food for though for him as he matures. Hes a big time reader so I thought it might be something for him to read and ponder.

i appreciate you feed back I am similar in regards to not just giving him anything without earning it.


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## Forest (Mar 29, 2014)

Is that the Married Man's something or other primer book? Are you serious?

Expose a growing boy to a ponzi scheme?


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## VermisciousKnid (Dec 27, 2011)

Forest said:


> Is that the Married Man's something or other primer book? Are you serious?
> 
> Expose a growing boy to a ponzi scheme?


You're confusing MMSLP with NMMNG.


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## Buddy400 (Aug 30, 2014)

chillymorn said:


> Should i get my son a copy?
> 
> or any other suggested reading material about becoming a man.
> 
> thoughts?


I disliked the way the book is written, but this is the most important concept you can teach your son about women. Popular culture is giving young men all the wrong information on this topic. It's like the mainstream advice given to men in sexless marriages: "Do more housework".

I have a son that used to get run over by girls. I spent a lot of time teaching him how it really works. He's now in a very good relationship. My proudest achievement was when he told me that his girlfriend told him "you're the first boyfriend I've had that didn't put up with my sh!t". She adores him.


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

Well, you'll have to look at this, but it's my recommendation since you have the other stuff covered. I think you've probably got it all covered, though. 

Hold on to Your NUTs: The Relationship Manual for Men: Wayne M. Levine: 9780979054402: Amazon.com: Books


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## skype (Sep 25, 2013)

I doubt if he will understand this book until he meets a selfish woman who takes advantage of him.

Our son was in a horrible relationship, and he would not listen to us until she stole money from him and lied about it.

Some people just have to learn from experience, and cannot understand your hard-earned wisdom.

Would you have listened to your father if he had recommended this book?


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## chillymorn (Aug 11, 2010)

skype said:


> I doubt if he will understand this book until he meets a selfish woman who takes advantage of him.
> 
> Our son was in a horrible relationship, and he would not listen to us until she stole money from him and lied about it.
> 
> ...


I hear you. 

sometime delivery is everything. my father was a old school steel worker who taught with a crack upside your head when you fvcked up. I am trying to be more proactive by explaining things when the moment is fresh ...timing is everything when life happens and their a lesson i try to capitalize right then and there. so far it has worked well and for the most part I can see he takes what i try to teach him seriously.

and some times I can tell hes halfa$$ed listening but thats ok hes still listening. and some of it is sinking in. 

I still have moments when I say to my self ......thats what the old man was trying to tell me.


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## chillymorn (Aug 11, 2010)

2ntnuf said:


> Well, you'll have to look at this, but it's my recommendation since you have the other stuff covered. I think you've probably got it all covered, though.
> 
> Hold on to Your NUTs: The Relationship Manual for Men: Wayne M. Levine: 9780979054402: Amazon.com: Books


thanks I like it.

of course i will read it myself to make sure its appropriate.


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

chillymorn said:


> Should i get my son a copy?
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Right after I buy "The Five Love Languages" for my daughters 

Send him a few time zones away for college, be stingy, and demand excellence. For extra credit send him to see the world. 

Kids have no real benefit to gain from such books...


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## Thor (Oct 31, 2011)

Do you think he is a Nice Guy?

There are a number of good books out there for the teen/college Nice Guy. NMMNG is certainly an excellent book. I would probably steer away from MMSL at his age, and certainly avoid any PUA or Red Pill oriented materials. The Way of the Superior Man has some excellent sections on how women's minds work, and it dovetails nicely with NMMNG. There is some New Age stuff in WOTSM which I don't subscribe to.

When giving him any books it is important to tell him that not every part is necessarily correct or applies to him. He should think critically with an open mind, and be willing to experiment with what he reads.

I gave both my daughters 5LL. At some point I think it is also a very valid book for a young man to read, though I haven't given it to S19 yet.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Just teach him not to take sh-t from anyone, man or woman.


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## batsociety (Jan 23, 2015)

Dude, no. No. A book on _Dianetics_ would be more useful.

Here's an idea: Let him figure out what it means to be a man by himself. Let him figure out relationships for himself. By all means, once he is older and seems to be having problems you can suggest these kinds of books to him, but I think they're pretty much useless for an impressionable kid (cough and everyone else cough).


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## FrazzledSadHusband (Jul 3, 2014)

I had a thread similar to this a while back. 

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/genera.../220266-wife-got-upset-over-gift-my-boys.html

I gave all three of my sons NMMNG. 

About 6 months ago, my oldest was complaining about his job, I told him he was being too nice & not looking out for himself. I pointed him to chapter I felt he needed to review. He just texted me in the last week & let me know he got a promotion.

They will also get 5LL. In fact, I have a nephew and 2 nieces getting married this summer. All three are getting 5LL & a note from their uncle.

Don't agree with other poster making light of giving a book. I've taught my boys how to hunt, fish, take care of their cars & to stand up for themselves as best I can. I also know I'm no expert. NMMNG says it better than I can, not to mention the boys get tired of dad being on their case.


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## chillymorn (Aug 11, 2010)

Thor said:


> Do you think he is a Nice Guy?
> 
> There are a number of good books out there for the teen/college Nice Guy. NMMNG is certainly an excellent book. I would probably steer away from MMSL at his age, and certainly avoid any PUA or Red Pill oriented materials. The Way of the Superior Man has some excellent sections on how women's minds work, and it dovetails nicely with NMMNG. There is some New Age stuff in WOTSM which I don't subscribe to.
> 
> ...


i do think he has nice guy tendencies.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Quite honestly, if my old man gave me a book to read I would be like "... ooooooooooooooooooook"

I'd rather he set an example as he did, for the most part. Same way I'm setting an example for my daughter of what to expect from men.
If you're already doing that, then that's all you need really, sure he may slip and fall, but that's why you're there, not a book.


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

What the kid needs is some time with his parents in order to understand the part about growing up and making do with what they're dealt. 

They're not yet in a position to understand where these techniques outlined in the DIY books apply and using them outside this very narrow field could have epic disaster results


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

john117 said:


> What the kid needs is some time with his parents in order to understand the part about growing up and making do with what they're dealt.
> 
> They're not yet in a position to understand where these techniques outlined in the DIY books apply and using them outside this very narrow field could have epic disaster results


I quoted this because I thought it was pretty good advice. I do think other posts are good too.

I guess what I wanted was to be able to go and do things I liked with others my age in a semi-supervised setting. I really enjoyed playing baseball, and even playing a couple of years of basketball for the grade school I attended. I did not like Webelos, but I think that was because I felt like an outsider who jumped in the middle, not being a cub scout first. 

I liked the things that dad was interested in me doing and tried harder to please him and do a good job in those activities. I wanted to join clubs at school, but I really had little support to do those from mum and dad. I wanted to deliver newspapers for a little extra money, but there was no route available that was close enough. I would have liked them to sign work papers so I could get a job, but they didn't want to do that. I think they wanted me to go to college, but they didn't support me in that decision with actions that placed me in groups of children who would likely be attending in the future. There were cliques, with nicknames like "heads", "freaks", "jocks", "nerds", and "geeks". 

While those weren't very nice, they did describe whether those children would likely attend college. They also described the groups one needed to be hanging out with, if one wanted to have the best chance of understanding the thinking of those who would be attending college and living a lifestyle. Each of them is a different lifestyle. 

Don't kid yourself. It makes a difference. 

You will see where your son wants to be, and where he is most suited to be happy and find the greatest amount of success in life for his skills and abilities, but it takes you spending time with him and doing things with him, to some extent. It takes paying attention to what he likes doing from a variety of choices, which you provide. It takes an openness to accept that he may not be the same as you in all things and willingness to help him and be proud of him in what he chooses over time, rather than what you think he wants, while guiding him when he has made a mistake. It takes guidance from you, toward a goal when you see that he would be better suited for something he has not realized. 

Well, that's what I wished happened for me, anyway. The book may well just show you what is important in relationships in a manner that you can exemplify for him, rather than him reading and interpreting it himself. I don't know his age, either. I don't know your situation. I have no right to tell you how to raise your son. I just know what I wish would have happened. I know what I think would have helped me, and that's what I've written here. 

Use what you can and discard the rest. I can't tell anyone what is best for them. We all have to do what we can with the resources and abilities we have. Opportunities aren't the same for each of us, either. We just do the best we can and muddle through.


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

One also needs to understand the limitations of the processing ability of a teenager. Furthermore one needs to understand that kids grow up at 25+ and not at 18. 

I am preparing for the launch of my older girl. She just landed a full ride plus teaching assistantship position for grad school and we will use her relative windfall to teach her how to make "adult" choices. So we have to go thru apartment hunting in her new college town, explain utilities and so on as she will be many hours away. 

Relationship wise it's the exact same thing. You work with them and explain the emotional birds and bees involved and hope for the best. You have to be there for them whether in person or in thought. They will learn but slowly and steadily. And when they do learn it will be a great experience for both of you.

The best things that my dad taught me were to reign in my emotions and be more rational, and to read people and situations. He was career army, then politics. A good mix. Mom taught me to appreciate the arts and to be resourceful. No DIY here.


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## Thor (Oct 31, 2011)

FrazzledSadHusband said:


> I also know I'm no expert. NMMNG says it better than I can, not to mention the boys get tired of dad being on their case.


And our kids know for sure we parents are idiots! Somehow when it comes from an outside source it carries far more weight.

I also gave my girls Dave Ramsey's book when they were in college. Both really bought into the philosophy and are very financially responsible. My son as a high school senior was not receptive to the Dave Ramsey material for teens. Sometimes people just aren't ready for the message.


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## Thor (Oct 31, 2011)

chillymorn said:


> i do think he has nice guy tendencies.


I like 2ntnuf's post. Boys used to be mentored by adult men, and thus learned the ways of the adult world. But that has all broken down. 

I tried to spend a lot of time with my kids, and we have made it a priority to be sure they learn skills. All of them learned to change a flat tire, change the oil in the car, replace an outlet or light switch, unclog a toilet, use the lawn mower, etc. My son has learned all kinds of home improvement stuff like totally remodeling a bathroom.

As teens they don't want to spend so much time with their old man.

I think it is good to give teens information but to also make it clear they are the one who is making a decision. They have to take charge and be the leader of their own self. Basically, emphasize independence and self reliance. Self confidence helps prevent becoming a Nice Guy.

With a 16 year old I think I would give him the book and then tread pretty lightly. If there is something you see specifically, you could point it out to him.


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## FrazzledSadHusband (Jul 3, 2014)

Thor said:


> And our kids know for sure we parents are idiots! Somehow when it comes from an outside source it carries far more weight.
> 
> *I also gave my girls Dave Ramsey's book when they were in college. Both really bought into the philosophy and are very financially responsible.* My son as a high school senior was not receptive to the Dave Ramsey material for teens. Sometimes people just aren't ready for the message.


:smthumbup: Our local high school actually teaches out of one of Dave Ramsey's book. My one son started quoting him & I had to ask "Where did you hear that?" Right now he's employed & don't owe nobody nothin!


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

There are two different things here - financial responsibility vs emotional responsibility. 

Financial responsibility is generally learned the hard way. I make sure my daughters rarely have lots of spending money  in college and as a result they really manage well. Too well . On the other hand I don't feel I'm exactly a paragon of financial responsibility so... But financial responsibility is easy to teach. The rules are there for everyone, and apply to everyone in general.

Emotional responsibility is a whole different ballgame. You're dealing with an individual for whom you hopefully have feelings, not with Citibank or your landlord. The number of possible moves is exponentially larger, and the outcomes are harder to predict. Obviously the kids need both so...


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