# Is there any way to change a spouse's aversion?



## TX-SC (Aug 25, 2015)

I don't need to go into how much I love and lust after my wife. I have stated that here numerous times. I have also talked about her LD. So, here's the biggest problem for me, and I know this is also to some extent related to the LD issues. 

My wife thinks that her vagina/vulva (we'll just say V here) is disgusting and she has a general aversion to bodily fluids. I absolutely love to perform oral on a woman, and especially my wife, but she says that's disgusting. I can easily make her O that way, but she just doesn't like me to do it since she says her V is gross. I have tried just after a shower, etc, but she says no. 

It's hard to push that issue since I want her to be comfortable. So, we just never do that. Honestly, I miss that tremendously. FWIW, she also doesn't like BJs but that's not a huge deal. Yes, I would love one occasionally, but it's not something I sweat over. 

When we dated and for the first few years of marriage, she would let me go down on her, but even then I could tell it made her uncomfortable. She now won't even consider it. 

So, can you reverse an aversion like that? At least I can guarantee she doesn't have lesbian tendencies!


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## Herschel (Mar 27, 2016)

Does she loosen up at all when she is drinking?


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## Lurkster (Feb 8, 2016)

Well....I can't say from experience, as my W loves it when I oralize her, and I love doing it! 

However, a friend of ours, years ago, was complaining to my wife, that her husband was always trying to slither down on her and give her a good licking. She thought it was gross, but he kept trying.
My wife told her "What are you, stupid?" My W told her I did it all the time, and she absolutely loved it. 

Seems it had a lot to do with upbringing, and things that her mother told her about sex & "uglies", and where you should never place your face. 

Anyway, after some talking with my W, a female friend, and someone other than her 'perverted husband' she did relent.

These gals seem to have no problems talking about stuff like that.....still.....

:smile2:


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## TX-SC (Aug 25, 2015)

Herschel said:


> Does she loosen up at all when she is drinking?


She doesn't drink.


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## chillymorn (Aug 11, 2010)

if you find a way you will be a very rich man. 

unfortunately I don't think people change unless they want to.and she doesn't seem to really care.


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## Young at Heart (Jan 6, 2015)

TX-SC said:


> ....So, here's the biggest problem for me, and I know this is also to some extent related to the LD issues.
> 
> My wife thinks that her vagina/vulva (we'll just say V here) is disgusting and she has a general aversion to bodily fluids. I absolutely love to perform oral on a woman, and especially my wife, but she says that's disgusting. ......she just doesn't like me to do it since she says her V is gross. I have tried just after a shower, etc, but she says no.
> 
> ...


You married the whole package. You point out that she was uncomfortable with "dining at the Y" when you were dating. It got worse over time. Is that surprising? 

Sit down and look yourself in the mirror. Is this something that you want, because you want it or is something you feel she should want? Is it a taboo that has you excited because she doesn't want it? Why is it so important to you?

She has and is being very clear with you that she doesn't want this, under any circumstance. So why not move on to something else?

Marriage is about compromise and things that both can accept and live with. 

For those issues that some call marital gridlock issues you need to understand your partner's reasons, fears, and concerns. That only comes from listening carefully to them. The Gottmans in their Marriage workshops say that to negotiate a gridlock issue with your spouse, you need to be able to explain their reasons for not doing something better than they can. Only then should you try to negotiate change. That is because only then will you have insights in to what variations, alternates or substitutes might be acceptable to them.

If this is really that important to you learn from listening to her what it is that she is concerned about. I think you already listed the issues, you just need to believe her and deal with it.

In the grand scheme of things called marriage, if this is your major concern, you are a pretty lucky guy. 

My wife will not let me go down on her. She feels it is gross. She also is LD and has body self image issues. I can either fight with her about it or live with her desires. 

If I like the taste of her and the smell of her aroused V, there are other ways during sex I can achieve those things in ways she does not object to. Get creative once you understand her perspective.

Good luck to you.


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## lifeistooshort (Mar 17, 2013)

Is it possible that you doing it even when your could tell she was uncomfortable made her aversion worse?

I love when my hb gives it to me, but being pushed your partner knows you're uncomfortable can be a big turnoff.

So why would you do it if you know she doesn't like it?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## PAPS18 (May 17, 2012)

TX-SC, my wife is the same for the most part. When we were dating, we were not having intercourse and I went down on her anytime we were sexual and she gave me BJ's. Early in marriage, that continued but somewhere along the line it got to be less and less. I have actually had an orgasm when giving my wife oral pleasure (and I can't think of a single time I have gone down on her that she has not had a very strong O)-so no doubt giving is something I enjoy more than she enjoys receiving. It is another one of those, hard to imagine scenarios because if she loved to give me Bj's, I can't imagine telling her NO, don't do that. She will let me now maybe every three or four months, and we only have sex a few times a month so not horrible and it is not something I have to have-I enjoy doing it, actually I LOVE doing it and she for the life of her can't understand why-she is paranoid about smell/taste for sure. She also makes me wash my face after I am done before she will kiss me, I think you have mentioned your wife was like that as well. My wife has not given me a BJ in about 5-6 years but interestingly, she touches my penis more now than she ever has before. It was almost like before, she was afraid to touch it like it would bite!!! But now she does touch me but never gives me oral-and I am fine with that because other than early in our relationship, that has always happened very infrequently-she simply doesn't enjoy it. I think this goes along with sex in general though with my wife-she just doesn't have the need for any of it like I do. I like to think oral can offer some variety but she doesn't seem to see it that way. 

I have told myself that if by some chance I am ever single again, I am going to be a lot more upfront about sexual needs. If faced with dating again, I would point blank ask a woman if she enjoys oral giving and receiving. My wife if I had asked her that when we first started dating would have turned beet red and tried to change the subject. In a sense, I think you can learn a lot about a woman with how they can or can't talk openly about sex. I bet there are very few LD women around that don't get embarrassed or at least feel uncomfortable talking in detail about sex. Just my two cents, could be wrong and usually seem to be.


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## TX-SC (Aug 25, 2015)

lifeistooshort said:


> Is it possible that you doing it even when your could tell she was uncomfortable made her aversion worse?
> 
> I love when my hb gives it to me, but being pushed your partner knows you're uncomfortable can be a big turnoff.
> 
> ...


Well, at first I wasn't sure that she was uncomfortable with it. Then, as I figured that out, the frequency fell off because I would make sure she was okay with it first. Then, later, she decided she just doesn't want that, so we don't do it anymore. I never "pushed it on her" or anything like that. After 20 years of marriage, she is certainly open enough to tell me if she wants it or doesn't want it.

The whole question comes down to asking whether there might be a way to get her to open up to it and enjoy it. I'm not asking how I can force the issue. I want to know if there is anything I can do that might make her more comfortable.


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## TX-SC (Aug 25, 2015)

MSprings said:


> I have to admit I agree with your W. I'm not disgusted by my own anatomy but I don't want someone down there. It's a strong preference and trying to force it is like someone trying to force you to eat calliflower if you have a natural aversion to it.
> 
> I'd suggest you not push it. Locker room talk is that the more guys try to force something the woman doesn't like the less the woman wants sex.


Fair enough. I would not force anything on her, I was just wondering if there might be a way to get her to be less self-conscious about it and maybe even enjoy it?

As a woman who has a similar aversion, can you explain what it is about that area that bothers you?


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## TX-SC (Aug 25, 2015)

PAPS18 said:


> TX-SC, my wife is the same for the most part. When we were dating, we were not having intercourse and I went down on her anytime we were sexual and she gave me BJ's. Early in marriage, that continued but somewhere along the line it got to be less and less. I have actually had an orgasm when giving my wife oral pleasure (and I can't think of a single time I have gone down on her that she has not had a very strong O)-so no doubt giving is something I enjoy more than she enjoys receiving. It is another one of those, hard to imagine scenarios because if she loved to give me Bj's, I can't imagine telling her NO, don't do that. She will let me now maybe every three or four months, and we only have sex a few times a month so not horrible and it is not something I have to have-I enjoy doing it, actually I LOVE doing it and she for the life of her can't understand why-she is paranoid about smell/taste for sure. She also makes me wash my face after I am done before she will kiss me, I think you have mentioned your wife was like that as well. My wife has not given me a BJ in about 5-6 years but interestingly, she touches my penis more now than she ever has before. It was almost like before, she was afraid to touch it like it would bite!!! But now she does touch me but never gives me oral-and I am fine with that because other than early in our relationship, that has always happened very infrequently-she simply doesn't enjoy it. I think this goes along with sex in general though with my wife-she just doesn't have the need for any of it like I do. I like to think oral can offer some variety but she doesn't seem to see it that way.
> 
> I have told myself that if by some chance I am ever single again, I am going to be a lot more upfront about sexual needs. If faced with dating again, I would point blank ask a woman if she enjoys oral giving and receiving. My wife if I had asked her that when we first started dating would have turned beet red and tried to change the subject. In a sense, I think you can learn a lot about a woman with how they can or can't talk openly about sex. I bet there are very few LD women around that don't get embarrassed or at least feel uncomfortable talking in detail about sex. Just my two cents, could be wrong and usually seem to be.


Thanks for the great reply! I think your situation is in many ways similar to ours. I love my wife and I love having sex with her. The fact that the oral thing doesn't happen is only a minor aspect of all of it and I certainly am not going to complain about what I DO get. I know my wife has an aversion to bodily fluids, so if she gives me a hand job to completion, she's usually like "Eww, let's clean that up!" But, she has no problem with me ejaculating inside her V, so that's a good thing!


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## TX-SC (Aug 25, 2015)

Lurkster said:


> Well....I can't say from experience, as my W loves it when I oralize her, and I love doing it!
> 
> However, a friend of ours, years ago, was complaining to my wife, that her husband was always trying to slither down on her and give her a good licking. She thought it was gross, but he kept trying.
> My wife told her "What are you, stupid?" My W told her I did it all the time, and she absolutely loved it.
> ...


She's not really the type to talk about it to friends, etc. I wish she would!


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## Lurkster (Feb 8, 2016)

Have you told your W that you _really-really-really_ love doing it to her? 
Does she know it's not just for her kix? 

I've told my wife that many times, especially early on when we first were married. Some reassurance may help?


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## TX-SC (Aug 25, 2015)

Young at Heart said:


> You married the whole package. You point out that she was uncomfortable with "dining at the Y" when you were dating. It got worse over time. Is that surprising?
> 
> Sit down and look yourself in the mirror. Is this something that you want, because you want it or is something you feel she should want? Is it a taboo that has you excited because she doesn't want it? Why is it so important to you?
> 
> ...



Thanks or the reply! Yep, I am not going to push the issue here. I can get close enough to smell her and I can taste her other ways (usually in a way that she doesn't realize I am). It's certainly not the same though. But, oh well. Like you say, this is a whole package deal. I love everything about her and would not jeopardize that by pushing this small issue with her.


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## Lurkster (Feb 8, 2016)

TX-SC said:


> She's not really the type to talk about it to friends, etc. I wish she would!


Yeah, I hear you. 
This gal is about the only friend she talks to about such things. Enough to make me leave the room too. 

:surprise:


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## lifeistooshort (Mar 17, 2013)

TX-SC said:


> Well, at first I wasn't sure that she was uncomfortable with it. Then, as I figured that out, the frequency fell off because I would make sure she was okay with it first. Then, later, she decided she just doesn't want that, so we don't do it anymore. I never "pushed it on her" or anything like that. After 20 years of marriage, she is certainly open enough to tell me if she wants it or doesn't want it.
> 
> The whole question comes down to asking whether there might be a way to get her to open up to it and enjoy it. I'm not asking how I can force the issue. I want to know if there is anything I can do that might make her more comfortable.


Ok. So I know with me that it took me a little while to be comfortable enough to enjoy it.....before my hb I'd had one bf try it. Even when I started going along with it, it took me a while before I could finish that way. 

For me I have some abuse in my background that makes me have a hard time with intimacy and vulnerability. I grew into it because I guess hb and I clicked that way, but you've had plenty of time with your wife. 

Have you tried just touching her with your fingers, or having her touch herself while you kiss her breasts? I LOVE that, and it could help her ease into it. 

It is unfortunate that she sees her body parts as dirty, but maybe baby steps? As women get older they often get more comfortable with their bodies because we just care less about our little imperfections.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## TX-SC (Aug 25, 2015)

lifeistooshort said:


> Ok. So I know with me that it took me a little while to be comfortable enough to enjoy it.....before my hb I'd had one bf try it. Even when I started going along with it, it took me a while before I could finish that way.
> 
> For me I have some abuse in my background that makes me have a hard time with intimacy and vulnerability. I grew into it because I guess hb and I clicked that way, but you've had plenty of time with your wife.
> 
> ...


She has no issues with me touching her there. I can get her off fairly easily with my fingers and we also use a vibrator for most of our sex. She generally has an orgasm most of the time, sometimes two or three. Occasionally, she'll just say she's not feeling it today so lets just focus on you (me). That usually happens when she has a lot on her mind or is tired. 

I have asked her if there is any kind of abuse in her past and she says that there isn't. I know she and her parents are not that close, but there doesn't appear to be any kind of abuse. I thik, for some reason, she just has an aversion to that area, or at least to licking or kissing that area. She has mentioned several times about urine and being "dirty" down there, especially if it's evening and she hasn't had a shower since morning. She definitely doesn't like morning sex unless we have already had our showers.


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## TX-SC (Aug 25, 2015)

Lurkster said:


> Yeah, I hear you.
> This gal is about the only friend she talks to about such things. Enough to make me leave the room too.
> 
> :surprise:


I kind of wish my wife had a female friend like that. Of course, I would want her to be a friend of the marriage, but someone she can talk to about sex and that sort of thing. She isn't close enough to her two sisters to discuss that. Her family is much more uptight about talking about such things than mine is. Heck, my family will downright embarrass you!


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## MJJEAN (Jun 26, 2015)

Does she shave? If not, do you think she might be willing to try shaving? I have been shaving every other day since the 90's and the main reason I continue to do so is I like how fresh and clean it feels, even hours after a shower.


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## TX-SC (Aug 25, 2015)

MJJEAN said:


> Does she shave? If not, do you think she might be willing to try shaving? I have been shaving every other day since the 90's and the main reason I continue to do so is I like how fresh and clean it feels, even hours after a shower.


No, but she trims if fairly close, almost to bare.


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## chillymorn (Aug 11, 2010)

lots of advice says not to push the issue. that it will make things worse and while I don't disagree with this I think that gentle persuasion can be use along with communication and answers to why she let you in the early part of your relationship and not she doesn't.

In my opinion its kind of bait and switch. 

lets say in the early part of the relationship you bought flowers and took her on dates or were clean and tidy and then after a few years of marriage you slowly stopped doing those things. and she communicated to you that she really liked those things and you said I just don't like that any more. would the advice be the same? ......don't push him it will make him not want to do it even more.

or if you used to kiss her deep and long and then you stopped because you never really liked it.


I think there should be reasonable compromise.in all such matters but sometimes partners just refuse to compromise. and then you have to decide is this a deal breaker or not. keep in mind that resentment builds and builds and even if you think its not that after years and years you might end up saying I should have hit the road way back when I figured out she didn't or he doesn't care about my needs.

good luck


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## Capster (Jun 10, 2014)

Here's what I did for my LD wife. FWIW, for decades she's had a long list of stuff she would never do. She does much of them now (mostly for my pleasure). But it was a process.

First, make sure you're in max physical conditioning. I had an advantage that when I started, I was already at my target weight. I did step up my workouts by doing more weights, running a bit more and taking fewer rest days (now I only rest about once every 3-4 weeks). I'm actually in my 50's and have abs for the first time in my life. So try to be as desirable as you can be.

Secondly, establish that you are a confident man with a healthy sex drive. I initiated just about every night, and not one of the weak initiations like stroking her back to kinda signal I'm ready. I would lock the door, strip, and lay on top of her (a very dominant position) and kissing her. Soon she would be initiating herself, probably because it gave her back some sense of control as opposed to waiting to see when I make my move.

Next, I did communicate with my wife over time the things I wanted to do. The theory was that she would figure inevitably she'd have to do some of them, so she would pick the less egregious one. For instance, I wanted to start getting BJ's (one of the things on her no list), so I told her I wanted to start getting those, tie her up and light bondage, and maybe some more visual sex positions. For a LD wife, the BJ seemed the less egregious to her, so I started getting them. Frequently. For you, you could mention sitting between her legs and watching her MB (a kind of sensate focus therapy), more visual sex positions, and BJ's. But note this has to be after you've established 1 and 2 above.

Lastly, whatever you want her to do, don't ask. Don't say "can we do doggy." Instead, tell her to "roll over." Take charge in the bedroom and be a confident man. Note that this is a process. Lots of positive feedback to her. Also I would admit that the first time she does something, she might seem to be doing it in anger a lot. But interestingly, afterwards she would always be lovey dovey. I've noticed this a lot in some of the game sites. It's not uncommon for women to want to cuddle after being dominated.

I still have things I'm working up to. I'll add some stuff, and then over time it becomes natural. Then step it up again. It's a process. Hope this gives some ideas.


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## UMP (Dec 23, 2014)

I think the number one way to overcome a sexual aversion is by developing lust and passion in your partner. 
My wife has an aversion to anal sex. However, if I can get her worked up enough, she currently lets me rim, poke, probe, prod, etc.
Perhaps your wife fancies her nipps being sucked. Work on that till she cannot stand it and see if she's open to some muff diving.
In other words, take what she currently likes to it's MAXIMUM in order for her to openly desire something even more mind blowing.

I have noticed that my wife is much more pliable when she is beside herself in pleasure.

Oh, and don't forget the wine.


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## Happilymarried25 (Mar 19, 2014)

"I don't need to go into how much I love and lust after my wife" Wow your wife is so lucky. I have my doubts she will get over her aversion to you going down on her. It's in her mind that it's where she goes the bathroom so why would you enjoy being down there. She might be embarrassed that it will not smell or taste right (even after a shower). I notice that is a women is LD about sex she likely doesn't enjoy oral sex (both receiving and giving). Sorry, I don't understand her thinking, I think she should allow you to go down on her as you enjoy doing it and she gets an orgasm.


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## always_alone (Dec 11, 2012)

It is super sad when women hate their bodies so much. Unfortunately, it is all too often drilled into us to think this way. And once an aversion is developed, it is entrenched.

If she is going to change, she will have to be motivated. She has to see what's in it for her. And not just what *you* think she ought to want. But what she herself really wants. 

If you are able, bringing her to a very high level of arousal might help.


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## 2ndchanceGuy (Sep 28, 2015)

OP , how old are both of you ?
I was married to a LD woman . There was never what I would call a breakthrough but I did learn how to give her a massage that would put her in the mood at certain times. Almost always it was 2-3 days before her cycle ( ovulation , be careful ) she was able to relax and have sex. 
In her mid 30s she finally started to like it more ( including oral ) but was still what I would call LD 
I should also add she had been sexually abused at age 8 through 10 
Have you thought about seeing a sex therapist ? It sounds like your wife has quite a few hang ups about sex. 
Good luck


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## TX-SC (Aug 25, 2015)

2ndchanceGuy said:


> OP , how old are both of you ?
> I was married to a LD woman . There was never what I would call a breakthrough but I did learn how to give her a massage that would put her in the mood at certain times. Almost always it was 2-3 days before her cycle ( ovulation , be careful ) she was able to relax and have sex.
> In her mid 30s she finally started to like it more ( including oral ) but was still what I would call LD
> I should also add she had been sexually abused at age 8 through 10
> ...


I am 47 and she is 42. I agree, lots off hangups. We've been married 20 years.


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## Young at Heart (Jan 6, 2015)

TX-SC said:


> ......She has mentioned several times about urine and being "dirty" down there, especially if it's evening and she hasn't had a shower since morning. She definitely doesn't like morning sex unless we have already had our showers.





TX-SC said:


> I am 47 and she is 42. I agree, lots off hangups. We've been married 20 years.


Again, one of the principal lessons I learned in Sex Therapy was that I can change myself, but I can't force my wife to change. If I am lucky, by changing myself and the way I allow my wife to treat me, she may decide to change herself, but that is totally up to her.

Give it a rest, unless you really know what her true reasons are.

She told you urine. Do you believe her? If not why? It is her choice.

Now think for a few minutes how common mild female incontinence is.



> according the Agency for Healthcare Research and Quality. About 25% to 45% of women suffer from urinary incontinence, defined as leakage at least once in the past year. The rates of urinary incontinence increase with age: 20%-30% of young women , 30%-40% of middle-aged women, and up to 50% of older women suffer from urinary incontinence.


Incontinence: Common Female Bladder Problems

Have your really listened to your wife and her reasons or do you just brush them off ans not being valid? Show her some respect, believe her when she says she doesn't want to do something. If you don't you are going to drive her further from you.

Good luck.

P.S. Some women "leak" when they orgasm, so maybe she is afraid of that as well. She get's to figure out what she is comfortable doing or not doing.


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## woodyh (Oct 23, 2015)

The only time my wife let's me go down on her is after I give her a full body massage, she likes then, but usually not any other time. She never gives me oral back. That is one thing
I really, really would like to get, but she absolutely on no uncertain terms will not give oral.

I like giving though!


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## Hicks (Jan 14, 2011)

Her aversion is all learned behavior. She is not genetically inclined to hate her vagina.

You have to teach her that sex is a good thing. You don't do this by talking to her about sex. You do this by modeling that sex is a good thing and modeling that lack of fulfilling sex will lead to bad outcomes in her life.

But, it's not going to be easy, starting from where you are at.

PS, she probably doesn't really think her vagina is all that bad. She just found a way to put you off that you cannot argue with.


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

TX-SC said:


> Fair enough. I would not force anything on her, I was just wondering if there might be a way to get her to be less self-conscious about it and maybe even enjoy it?
> 
> As a woman who has a similar aversion, can you explain what it is about that area that bothers you?



It's hard for men to understand why it is so common for women to be uncomfortable or averse to receiving oral sex. Why we dislike our lady parts.

When we were young girls we didn't have any problems with our bodies. Our lady parts felt good when we rubbed them. But then puberty started and our lady parts turned on us! It became a messy affair down there. We were disgusted by the increased discharge puberty brings. We were disgusted by the unwashed smell. And then BLOOD happened! Pubes and periods and pads and cramps and what we once gave no thought to was now something we had to cater to! 

Add in being shamed by a parent or being on the receiving end of a mother saying some pretty negative things about our lady parts in teaching us to be clean... Dumb stupid vajayjay ruins everything!

Your wife has had years of building disgust for her lady parts. Having babies makes it worse because that thing we're not too fond of is now something everyone wants to see! And then birth happens and OMG talk about MESS!

On a scale one side has good things about our lady parts and the other side has negative things about our lady parts. Which direction do you think the scale favors?

What to do...
1. Tell her frequently (at the right time) that you love being down there. Explain to her that her lady parts are a source on wonderment and beauty to you. You're going to have to be poetic to convince her you really do feel love and attraction toward her lady parts.

2. Get her to talk about what she felt about her lady parts growing up. Was she ashamed? 

3. She need to understand that although she is well aware of how bad and strong her personal scent can get, you do not experience it the same way. Some people smell Sour kraut and their mouth waters. Other people smell that and think someone has vomited. She associates her scent with something very negative and you associate her scent with something very positive. If she could wrap her brain around that truth, then she could learn to relax and let the pleasant feelings your efforts provide wash over her. 

You have to do all three for an extended period of time. Each time she insists she doesn't like it, you have to correct her thinking and remind her to just relax in the knowledge that you LOVE being there.


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## techmom (Oct 22, 2012)

Anon Pink said:


> It's hard for men to understand why it is so common for women to be uncomfortable or averse to receiving oral sex. Why we dislike our lady parts.
> 
> When we were young girls we didn't have any problems with our bodies. Our lady parts felt good when we rubbed them. But then puberty started and our lady parts turned on us! It became a messy affair down there. We were disgusted by the increased discharge puberty brings. We were disgusted by the unwashed smell. And then BLOOD happened! Pubes and periods and pads and cramps and what we once gave no thought to was now something we had to cater to!
> 
> ...


Also to add, most women have been taught to turn off the good sexy feelings in order to stay virtuous, we can't automatically flip the switch when we marry. Some women have an easier time of it than others, and some women still carry the shame and guilt for being sexual beings.

Thus, most women were taught that boys/men will say anything to get us to lay with them but we must be strong and dammit you better not do it or else you will be shamed for life. Which is another switch we can't just flip after marriage.

Which is why I state time and time again that people find their match sexually or else they will be doomed to a lifetime of feeling pressure or frustration.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

if she doesnt like it then leave it, and enjoy what you can do.


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