# Is this appropriate behavior for a long separated and divorced couple?



## cauliflowerwings (May 27, 2021)

There's outright hostility and there's a clean break, and then there's my partner and their ex-spouse. I get that each marriage and divorce relationship is unique, but can you please shed some light on whether I am just overreacting or if this situation _is_ weird?

I don't know if it's just me or if this is what an actually healthy divorced relationship looks like. Please share your outsider insight.


partner used to sleep over their house on the couch if it was too late to go home (pre-Covid)
partner's ex still nonchalantly asking them to fix things around the house (toilet is plugged, bike tires need pumping)


partner's ex calls them late at night to discuss kid-related things (they work shift work and don't get home until late but 11pm calls that wake us up at night feels symptomatic of not having boundaries)
partner's parents paid for the ex to join a family vacation trip a few years ago
partner had the ex on their work insurance benefits plan up until my partner got a new job a couple weeks ago
the ex tends to control even our time with the kids. She was trying to get us to take the kids to a certain activity, when only one of the children wants to go and the other was staunchly against the activity, and we had spoken directly to the kids about this. My partner won't get the kids for Father's Day either (not even just for an hour or lunch) because it happens to be the only day off the ex has
my partner wanted to invite the ex to our wedding not because they're friends but because she's the kids' mom and she might like seeing them dressed up (?) and/or it may make it more comfortable for the kids. When I said I didn't want their ex there, they were surprised and made a light attempt to change my mind

I've always accepted that I'd be the second wife to my partner. But sometimes I kind of feel like a second wife in the sense that it's a polyamorous relationship rather than because I came second chronologically because of the examples above. As individuals, my partner's ex and my partner are awesome. The kids' mom will do anything for them. My partner does his best. But I feel like my partner is committed to pleasing their ex-wife in a way that I'll never contend or be okay with. If I'm overthinking this, please tell me so. I appreciate all your wisdom and insight. Thank you!

Background Info:
My present partner has kids from their first marriage. Their kids are preteens already, having spent the last 8 years living with their mom as their sole custodian. Partner and their ex did not have a legal custody agreement because they were both too deep in debt to hire lawyers, just a verbal agreement that the mom will give access to my partner any time. My partner left the marriage because of irreconcilable spending differences that got them in the hole. They say that they were just so miserable and eager to leave, while their ex tried to get them to stay for the family. Because my partner was the one who left, the breakup of the marriage was pinned on them and so their ex demanded the following (in retribution?):

no custody battle for the kids; as the bio mom, my partner's ex would get the kids but would let my ex access them whenever
my partner would pay $$$$ to the ex for the kids; to date, my partner pays $2k for both kids. Where we live, the typical child support is $400 each....you can see how much they overpay, but because a lawyer was never consulted they took this as acceptable
because all my partner's money went to the kids, they were not able to rebuild their credit or even afford housing suitable for their kids to visit. The arrangement became that my partner would go to their ex/kids' mom's house which the ex was "gracious enough to ask for their family to let my partner come to". The ex lived with her parents/kids' grandparents.
Pre-Covid/pre-me partner saw the kids multiple times a week at their house and their sports games. During the pandemic, at most, my partner saw the kids 2 times in a month. When I questioned if this is okay, my partner tells me that they accepted that this is the arrangement because now the kids have grown to know nothing else beyond living at their mom's and my partner just visiting and they have an almost strained relationship with my partner. They're not very eager to sleep over at our place or go with us on local trips, for examples. My partner doesn't want to rock the boat either because they don't want to upset the kids' mom.

It really bothers me that they don't have a legal custody arrangement in place. When my partner has broached the subject, their ex would accuse them of not trusting her, of keeping the kids from my partner. My partner is reminded of their guilt, and the subject is dropped. Aside from the issues that bother me about their arrangement, I realized it was all to appease their ex. The examples above stood out to me, which I now speculate stem from my partner's continued guilt/shame-induced commitment to their ex.



cauliflowerwings said:


> Update: Thank you all for taking the time to read and share your thoughts and answer my questions. I wrote down my feelings around this as well as the examples I have that prompted those feelings. We spoke after work and he started by stating plainly what he always has - that he wants to be with me and he'll always meet me where I need him to (metaphorically speaking). I half-read to him what I wrote, he listened. I told him the examples I have in the post, and he was a little blindsided. To him, those things were done just so he could be in his children's lives, make sure they're protected and provided for, and just his innate sense of helping when someone asks. I pointed out why each scenario was unacceptable to me and how they were not "normal". He listened, said he will work on my non-negotiables, and processed the conversation through the evening. By night, he conceded how wrong it was to conduct themselves the way they have and how thoughtless it was of him to not think about the optics of it, and how his attitude has hurt his progress with himself, his kids, and me.
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## VladDracul (Jun 17, 2016)

cauliflowerwings said:


> I've always accepted that I'd be the second wife to my partner.


You need a change in attitude on this one. If you were hired as a replacement for a person that left a job, would you accept being treated as second class to your predecessor? You ain't no "second wife". You are the wife with all rights and privileges. By the way, if he's stayed over at her house, he was likely f-ing her and may still be. Watch your back. When a man sez, "It ain't the puzzy that controls me. Its because of the kids", its the puzzy.


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## hubbyintrubby (Jul 5, 2019)

Here's the thing. That relationship between your husband and his ex-wife can look however he and she want it to. He's laying down and taking it like a champ from her in a lot of different areas, out of guilt from the sounds of it. She's really drilling into him that if he changes things, it's going to be because he doesn't trust her and it'll be bad for the kids etc, when in all reality, she wants that money. $2,000 opposed to $400. Come on. 

Now...like I said, their relationship can look however they want it to look...but you get a say also. It sounds like he is breaking some boundaries you have in your head about their relationship. The things is, those boundaries need to get out of your head and into your husband's ear. He needs to know how you feel about these things and what you're willing to do about them if they continue. She needs to stop asking for those little things to help around the house, no more late night phone calls, no more her controlling your husband's time with the kids. He can stand up for the things he wants too.

Make it clear you do not want to be married to somebody who seems to still be married to someone else.


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## cauliflowerwings (May 27, 2021)

hubbyintrubby said:


> Here's the thing. That relationship between your husband and his ex-wife can look however he and she want it to. He's laying down and taking it like a champ from her in a lot of different areas, out of guilt from the sounds of it. She's really drilling into him that if he changes things, it's going to be because he doesn't trust her and it'll be bad for the kids etc, when in all reality, she wants that money. $2,000 opposed to $400. Come on.
> 
> Now...like I said, their relationship can look however they want it to look...but you get a say also. It sounds like he is breaking some boundaries you have in your head about their relationship. The things is, those boundaries need to get out of your head and into your husband's ear. He needs to know how you feel about these things and what you're willing to do about them if they continue. She needs to stop asking for those little things to help around the house, no more late night phone calls, no more her controlling your husband's time with the kids. He can stand up for the things he wants too.
> 
> Make it clear you do not want to be married to somebody who seems to still be married to someone else.


Thank you. For some reason, maybe a momentary glitch, the forum looked like it deleted this discussion so I added this post to my new member introduction post where others commented on it as well. 

The update I have is that I wrote down the non-negotiables for me, spoke to my partner about this, and upon reflection, he conceded that he had been thoughtlessly doing those things and that he realizes now it was wrong. "Wrong" in the sense that it isn't how he wants his relationship with her to be. Outside of these instances that look husband and wife-ish, their interactions and conversations are exclusively children-related already.


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