# This Girl Needs Guidance



## need_guidance (Mar 1, 2014)

Hello,

I'm new to the forum and am really grateful to have found it. I will make this as short and to the point as possible.

I've been with my boyfriend for going on 6 years. We've lived together for five of them. Off and on. I kicked him out twice and about a year ago, I broke up with him because of trust issues (rightfully so) and I made him move out. He has been staying with a friend of his. We decided to "work things out" and he's been staying with me part-time.

We're not married and he knows this is something that I want and has promised that he'll work towards it. 

He has had some financial issues after being divorced from his first wife, child support, etc. 

Our relationship evolved pretty quickly and we moved in about a year after he divorced. He hasn't lived alone since he was in his early 20's.

Well, when I first took him back we decided that we would live apart until he got his stuff together. I know that him not having a place or a true "establishment" for his daughters was weighing on him and that he needed to prove to himself that he could do it on his own as he's been down on himself for quite some time. 

Now, I've always been there for him and his daughters. I love them like my own. They've always had a warm place to stay (even after we broke up momentarily) I've never disappeared on them during our struggles.

It's time for me to move as my lease is up and I've realized that I love him and I want to continue to move forward. I realized why should we live separately if we've been together for so long already. Like it would be taking a step in the wrong direction if we're wanting to build a future together.

So yesterday I brought that up to him and he told me that we "could" start looking for a place together but that he wants to live alone for at least a year. That he needs to establish a foundation as he has furniture in storage and his families, etc. and that he needs to be alone in order to be a better person to me. That he needs to be alone to work on himself. He still wants to be together in the meantime.

Now, I get that he feels that he NEEDS to do this for himself but part off me really thinks that after all of the time I've invested in this relationship and the sacrifices I've made that he would be on the same page as me. Why would we take steps further from what we say we want? He has financial issues so why wouldn't he just say let's just do this already? It makes most sense to me.

I've sacrificed a lot for him over the years and have provided so much. I just want him to be on the same page as moving "forward". In his eyes, this is moving forward because he'll be in a better place for himself.

He has lots of guilt because he feels that he ruined his marriage, and not being there for his daughters all of the time. He drowns his sorrows by smoking marijuana everyday and drinking, etc. Occasionally will take pills and/or do cocaine. He has gotten better with it though and is slowly tapering off. You may think why would a girl like me be with him? Because I feel like I know who he is and our connection is so strong. He has so much potential, is a loving father, etc. and does the best he can. He is getting better.

I am a really responsible woman, very attractive, take care of my loved ones , have a good job and am on top of my finances. 

I've sacrificed so much. Up to the point of being told that I wasn't allowed to renew my lease in two months because he was staying here and he shouldn't have been. 

So to me, he knows how I feel and that I don't feel comfortable with him wanting to live alone. Because of my trust issues (again, rightfully so) and because after all this time we should be moving together towards a better future, towards marriage, saving money and not apart and after all that I've sacrificed and given that he would be willing to come to some sort of compromise on how I feel and what I want in order to be happy. 

Right now it's what he wants and that's that. 

He told me that he loves me and will always be by my side. How with us living apart?

Am I wrong to think that he just doesn't want to be with me anymore? and is just using me for a place to stay until he finds his own place?

Or am I paranoid in thinking that there is someone else in the picture and he wants his freedom to do what he wants when he wants?

Or should I just respect and understand that this is something he needs to do for himself? To feel like a "man" and that he can stand on his own two feet?

I'm in a state of panic right now and my mind is racing with so many different thoughts.

I get that he may be scared because I've thrown him out twice but he brought those upon himself with being dis honest and not trust worthy.

Again, am I wrong? I don't want to jump to the wrong conclusions here and make any bad decisions so I'm here to get an outsiders perspective.

Is it time for me to move on?

I look forward to your advice as I'm a bit of a wreck over here.

Thank you and I hope to hear from you soon. It would mean a lot.


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

I would break it off. This is not the guy for you. You can and will find someone more suited to you.

Please be strong. Please just end it completely.


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## JustHer (Mar 12, 2013)

I suggest you look at the relationship for how it "is" not how you "want" it to be.

You had trust issues so you kicked him out. He has financial issues. He hasn't been on his own for any length of time.

I am sorry, but I keep hearing how YOU sacrificed. You are the one that kicked him out. Then you decided to work on it. Now that he has finally figured out what HE wants, and your lease is not being renewed, you are upset at all you have done for him.

That is what dating is all about. Trying people out to see if it works. You put in what you want to, no one makes you do it.

I feel your pain and panic, but you need to step back and look at this for what it is. If your lease would have been renewed, you probably wouldn't have wanted him to move back in with you. He is still untrustworthy. Slow down, maybe look at dating other people.


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## Prodigal (Feb 5, 2011)

need_guidance said:


> He drowns his sorrows by smoking marijuana everyday and drinking, etc. Occasionally will take pills and/or do cocaine. He has gotten better with it though and is slowly tapering off. You may think why would a girl like me be with him? Because I feel like I know who he is and our connection is so strong. He has so much potential, is a loving father, etc. and does the best he can. He is getting better.


So you're in love with his potential? That is loving in a WHAT IF manner. What if he gets off the pot and booze? What if he gets off the coke? What if he gets his finances in order? WHAT IS, is this: He is a substance abuser. Addict? Maybe, maybe not. He alone owns that. 

You? Well, why not give dating a try? Or at least cool down the relationship. See how he responds/reacts.

A guy worth keeping copes with life on life's terms. He doesn't need to use substances to cope. Sure, I can see having a drink after a particularly stressful day. But daily use of substances? Nope. Not healthy. Not one bit.


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## JustHer (Mar 12, 2013)

I missed the drug use....

OP, seek counseling.


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

I was thinking maybe you should give it a try until i reached the Marijuana , Cocaine and Alcohol part.

I think you feel sorry for this guy , but he is ultimately responsible for himself and his drug use.
He's addicted to hard drugs even though you have been there for him in every sense of the word.
He's divorced , has two daughters and owns absolutely nothing.
You feel as though you must help him, and maybe feel a little guilty.
Your feeling are mixed up so you probably think it's love.

I think you should first sort out your feelings , alone or perhaps with a professional counselor.

It sounds a bit like a codependent relationship to me.


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## SlowlyGettingWiser (Apr 7, 2012)

*YOU*

have invested 6 years in this relationship and don't want to 'waste' the time you've already invested
have kicked him out twice because you can't trust him (Is he a cheater? A thief? A liar?)
are responsible, attractive, hold down a good job and are fiscally responsible
are not allowed to renew your lease because you CHOSE to have him live there with you
have always been there for him and his girls (you love being their sorta step-mom)
insist that you have provided 'so much' and have made many 'sacrifices' for him
say your 'connection' is so strong, he has POTENTIAL, and you want him to move in with you (he doesn't want to)
*HE*

been kicked out twice as untrustworthy (Again: Is he a cheater? A thief? A liar?)
has promised to work towards marriage and he's doing this by:
​
slowly tapering off pills, cocaine, daily weed smoking and daily drinking!
believes he ruined his marriage and has not been there for his daughters as much as he ought to have been
has financial issues and at least TWO children already to support
wants to live on his own for at least 1 year
Why do you believe that you deserve SO LITTLE from a relationship?
Why are you a "parent" in a parent/child relationship with a full-grown man?
Are you more interested in "being married" and "being Mom" than you are in being in a healthy mature relationship (cuz this ain't that healthy, mature relationship)?

You've wasted 6 years on an untrustworthy, drug-addicted, immature, unreliable man-child/boyfriend/husband/father. You think sinking 6 MORE years into this mess is going to net you what you want?

The only thing more depressing than wasting 6 years on a going-nowhere relationship is wasting 7 years on a going-nowhere relationship. If he could BE a better man, he would just DO IT and BE a better man. But in 6 years, he's made piss-poor progress. YOU want to make excuses for him. YOU want to live on HOPE for what he COULD be instead of looking at what he HONESTLY IS! Too bad for you, worse for his daughters!

*If you TRULY want help:*

Get into Individualized Counseling and fix yourself; you're a VERY broken woman to accept this relationship. If you don't believe US, book 3-6 appointments with a counselor/therapist (nothing long-term...just a few visits). Bring your initial post with you and an OPEN MIND.
Start by reading "Codependent No More" by Melody Beattie. You are exceedingly codependent. 

This relationship will NEVER be good...we can see that even if you can't. Provided you get real and LEAVE this relationship your next relationships will be just as dysfunctional as this one UNTIL/UNLESS you fix YOURSELF...because YOU'RE every bit as broken as he is.
Please see a professional and have a healthier 2014, thereby ensuring a happier/healthier future.

BEST WISHES!


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## IrishGirlVA (Aug 27, 2012)

need_guidance said:


> I get that he may be scared because I've thrown him out twice.......


I bet he has told you this, hasn't he? That he is afraid of moving in because YOU have thrown him out before? Yeah, I bet he has. Regardless of the circumstances of him being asked to leave he will always use this as his ace card because it transfers the blame onto you and off of him. It's called blame-shifting and gaslighting. 

I know you want all your sacrifices (emotionally and financially) to pay off but if it hasn't happened by now, it is doubtful it ever will. How much more do you need to sacrifice for this relationship? 

Look for a new place for yourself. Not for him. Do not count on him to pay half the rent if he moves in and makes sure you get something you can afford comfortably on your own. 

I think you need to step back from this relationship and put things into perspective. If you have waited him for 5 years, he can wait for you. Right? 

Don't be afraid to make an ultimatum at this point. 

Stop living in limbo. Just because he can't make a decision doesn't mean you can't! 

I know it's not easy but sometimes we just need to know when it's time to pull our investment.


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## KathyBatesel (Apr 26, 2012)

Love and compatibility are not synonyms!


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## AliceA (Jul 29, 2010)

SlowlyGettingWiser said:


> The only thing more depressing than wasting 6 years on a going-nowhere relationship is wasting 7 years on a going-nowhere relationship. If he could BE a better man, he would just DO IT and BE a better man. But in 6 years, he's made piss-poor progress. YOU want to make excuses for him. YOU want to live on HOPE for what he COULD be instead of looking at what he HONESTLY IS! Too bad for you, worse for his daughters!


:iagree::iagree:

I agree with the whole post, but I can see this hit the nail on the head. You've already wasted 6 yrs on him, thinking he's going to one day turn into the person you want him to be.

Just because someone has the *potential* to be everything you want doesn't mean they will ever *be* everything you want. Accept the reality, stop dreaming your life away.


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## need_guidance (Mar 1, 2014)

Hello all,

Just got back from home and it is really good to read all of your input/thoughts after a long crazy day of work.

I want to clarify to an earlier poster that I am not asking him to move with me because I can't renew my lease here. I'm at no point of desperation financially, etc. I've got myself covered and have always taken care of myself and my daughter. I asked because I thought it was just time for us to make that move.

Also, as far as the trust issues go. It started not too soon after we started dating. I had heard a few things from people to watch him, etc. and I started to check up on him. He was on my cell phone account and I felt that I needed to check for myself. I saw that he had called and texted his ex before me a few times. When I confronted him about the number he said that it was someone he worked with. Then he was out with another woman at a bar from work and lied about that and I found that they were texting NUMEROUS times during the work day as well but he deleted the text. I only saw the number of times they texted and it was ALOT. Came home with what looked to be lipstick on his lower shirt once. Smelling of perfume a few times and while doing laundry I noticed suspicious stains on his underwear when we weren't intimate.

So things like that have made me not trust him and I'm major paranoid. When I kicked him out last time it was for something as simple as a hang up when I called his hotel room when he was out of town for work. That threw me over the deep edge. I realized then that I couldn't handle the pain and panic that I felt at that moment thinking that he was with another woman. It was a build up of everything. Of him not marrying me, the drinking, the mis-trust, etc.

Now he said that he hasn't proposed because how/why would he when we were having problems because of my mis trust in him? So I always felt/feel like "maybe it is me?" If I would just trust, relax and let things "flow" (as he says) that it would just happen. I guess I'm naïve to believe that for a second. Gaslighting?

I don't know why I'm holding on. Am I fearful of being alone? Absolutely, that I can't deny. I'm going on 38 and I am petrified that I'll be alone and/or have a hard time finding someone.

It makes me sad because again, I know how good he CAN be so in the back of my mind I'm thinking "well, IF he goes off on his own and gets his stuff together and feels better about himself than I'll get that good man once and for all" 

Also, I feel like if I don't give him the space and IF he does change and I walk away that the next woman in his life will get all that I loved, etc. I guess I'm not thinking rationally. This I know.

As far as co-dependent no more, I've read it. Twice. Still here in the same boat.

I'm going to reach out to someone to talk to as far as a therapist goes because you're right. I'm broken as well. I believe that a lot of my issues stem from the abuse in this relationship.

I'm so tired of hearing from so many people "you're so beautiful, why aren't you married? you're so smart, why aren't you married? you're so much fun and a great person, why aren't you married?" I wonder to myself why too but I guess a lot of is that I've wasted so many years on the wrong person.

I have to get strong. Do what I have to do for my life and kick fear to the curb. Not easy at all for reasons I mentioned above.

I'm so happy to have this forum here as you have already opened my eyes to so much.

Please keep the advice flowing. I appreciate it.


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## alte Dame (Aug 7, 2012)

You should value yourself more. This man isn't faithful, does drugs, drinks, can't afford his own place....

The lying about other women would be enough for me. You say you have a lot going for you. Why would you settle for this sort of man? I'm not judgmental about earning power if there's honesty and work ethic, but he hasn't been faithful. This makes the rest of his situation a bad bet. Overall, bad signs for a future with him.


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## Emerald (Aug 2, 2012)

Yes, counseling for sure to get over your fear of being "alone" w/o a man.

You have a daughter. Have you ever been married? I can understand wanting to get married again but you are still very young & you sound like a wonderful woman. You will meet another man but not until you lose your current b/f....because honestly, he does not sound like a good catch.

He has lots of problems......financial, drugs & alcohol, possible cheating, lying.....& really, what is his PLAN to reach what you think is his potential? Lots of talk & no action?

Remember, those that fail to plan, plan to fail.

Finally, I am so very sorry but I don't think he is in to you as much as you are in to him.


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

"Feel the fear . . . and do it anyway."


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## Prodigal (Feb 5, 2011)

need_guidance said:


> Now he said that he hasn't proposed because how/why would he when we were having problems because of my mis trust in him? So I always felt/feel like "maybe it is me?" If I would just trust, relax and let things "flow" (as he says) that it would just happen. I guess I'm naïve to believe that for a second. Gaslighting?


Oh, so because you mistrust a pot-head/heavy drinker who snorts coke as well, YOU are the reason he hasn't proposed. Granted, I could be wrong, but he sounds like an addict. And you shouldn't be surprised. He's doing exactly what addicts do. Gas lighting, turning the tables, shifting the blame, and keeping you just enough off balance to keep you hooked.



need_guidance said:


> I don't know why I'm holding on. Am I fearful of being alone? Absolutely, that I can't deny. I'm going on 38 and I am petrified that I'll be alone and/or have a hard time finding someone.
> 
> As far as co-dependent no more, I've read it. Twice. Still here in the same boat.


I think you know why you are holding on. I really do. You are scared sh!tless you're going to die alone. I hate to break it to you, but we ALL die alone. Nobody can do our dying for us. Or our living. 

You may have read Codependent No More twice, but it doesn't seem to be sinking in. And I've got a feeling you have been elsewhere seeking guidance regarding this situation. Friends, family, co-workers perhaps? 

What is you are seeking? Validation to stick with a guy who has all this "potential" you imagine? If he gets his act together, he will make you happy, complete your life, and you will gain what you feel inside you lack. That's my guess.

And you will remain in the same old boat. The boat is leaking and taking on water, but you will go down with your ship.

Guidance? Time to jump ship. Seriously.


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

Prodigal said:


> I think you know why you are holding on. I really do. You are scared sh!tless you're going to die alone. I hate to break it to you, but we ALL die alone. Nobody can do our dying for us. Or our living.


:iagree:


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## SlowlyGettingWiser (Apr 7, 2012)

need_guidance said:


> I want to clarify to an earlier poster that I am not asking him to move with me because I can't renew my lease here. I'm at no point of desperation financially, etc. I've got myself covered and have always taken care of myself and my daughter. I asked because I thought it was just time for us to make that move. *I understand; my point was that you harmed YOURSELF to benefit HIM. You allowed him to live with you against your lease mandates and NOW you MUST move at the end of your lease...no option to stay even if you wanted to! If you were going to move ANYWAY, then it didn't matter. If you wanted to STAY at your place and not incur moving costs, you shot yourself in the foot by allowing HIM to stay with you against the lease. *
> 
> Also, as far as the trust issues go. It started not too soon after we started dating. *I had heard a few things from people to watch hi*m, etc. and *I started to check up on him*. He was on my cell phone account and I felt that I needed to check for myself. *I saw that he had called and texted his ex before me a few times*. When I confronted him about the number *he said that it was someone he worked with*. *Then he was out with another woman at a bar from work and lied about that and I found that they were texting NUMEROUS times during the work day as well but he deleted the text*. I only saw the number of times *they texted and it was ALOT*. Came home with *what looked to be lipstick on his lower shirt once*. *Smelling of perfume a few times* and while doing laundry I noticed *suspicious stains on his underwear* when we weren't intimate.
> 
> ...


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## SlowlyGettingWiser (Apr 7, 2012)

Have you pulled out "Codependent No More" and a pencil/notebook?


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## need_guidance (Mar 1, 2014)

Well hello all. It’s been a very long time since I’ve been back. I’ve been living in denial.

Quick recap/update. I was able to stay at my apartment, thank goodness. This was back in February. My boyfriend at the time still wanted to find his own place (you’ll need to read from the beginning to get that story). He wanted to get his own place UNTIL he got a DUI in May. When he got the DUI he said maybe we should just live together until we can move into a bigger home. I told him how that makes me feel like he’s using me and he states that he’s not. It’s just what he wants to do.

I decide to believe because MAYBE he’s changing. MAYBE he’s going to finally give me what I want, the marriage, the proper commitment, the compromise. Well, it’s been how long now and there still is no compromise. We live in a small apartment. Me, him and my 20 year old daughter and it’s getting tight space wise. I told him that I want to look into buying a home for all of us. So he can have more space and so his daughters can have their own room when he gets them. I told him where I was interested in moving and he still won’t compromise. He said that he wants to live where he wants to live. Up the street from his daughters. This is very unrealistic of him because he has horrible credit, bankruptcy, felony on his records and he cannot get approved nor afford close to where his daughters live. It’s just not realistic. I spoke with him about this and even thought where I suggested is where we can afford and is only about 10-15 minutes from his children he still won’t budge and compromise. I’m willing to do all of this (even without a formal commitment) and still nothing.

Now this is a man who has done me wrong. Has hidden female “work” relationships from me, I caught him in our old home with his ex girlfriend a week after I moved out because of catching him texting female co-workers. Will not marry me or has an issue when I want to discuss it because he will on his own timing (it’s going on SIX years) and I’m still trying to think the best. Wanting to give the best because I feel that it may make him come around. Well, it’s still the same thing.

I broke up with him a year ago and threw him out to take him back to live in again and I’m back to square one with him. He hasn’t changed much.

We got into it yesterday as he will not put our status on Facebook as in a relationship because he feels that why would we do it now after 6 years. Then he also has all of his posts to show as “custom” to only certain people which concerns me given his history. This is coming from a man who is hardly on Faceboook, so why is he taking the time to customize his page for certain people to see certain things and not. Well, this was naturally a concern for me so I asked him “are you wanting to hide me from Facebook” and he lost it on me. Yelled and screamed and said that he’s never going on Facebook again. Then told me he was done and to never waste another minute of his life with a Facebook question. That I was accusing him of doing something wrong. I really was only asking and he didn’t even give me an opportunity to explain why I was asking. Hung up on me and didn’t take my calls the rest of the day. He also didn’t come home until 11:00 last night. He reeked of alcohol. Not only am I upset about him not calling or coming home and taking a FB question as an attack and a free pass to go and get drunk but he drove home, in a car that he is borrowing and without a valid driver’s license while completely drunk.

Even if I asked him about FB, why couldn’t he just answer me calmly and lovingly? Instead of flipping out?

When we got back together I told him that he would need to reassure me patiently and lovingly when I needed it because it’s hard for me to trust him after everything and he promised. Well, he hasn’t. When challenged with a question he doesn’t like he flips out on me. Yells, and gives me silent treatment. This is even when I have changed so much. I haven’t even questioned him on anything. Not like I used to. And he still gets upset.

About a month ago, we were drinking and I got really upset. Things with us were stewing mentally and I let out some aggression. I couldn’t find him at a concert we were at. He lost me and when I found him I pushed him because firstly, I was drunk and 2nd I was upset that he left me (or I thought he did). Well, he choked me in front of everyone at the concert. Put his arms around my neck and told me to stop. I was traumatized and left him there. Well, the next day he acts like nothing and says that he wouldn’t have choked me had I not pushed him. So, I thought maybe I shouldn’t have. Wrong, right? 

Forgave….stupid I KNOW..he made me feel like I shouldn’t have pushed him

He’s for the last few months, started locking his phone. He never did this before and his reason is because I lock mine. Well, I really have nothing to hide as I’ve never done anything wrong. He on the other hand should be transparent. Why is he locking his phone?

He’s also been acting very moody and distant. One minute he is happy and loving and doing the sweetest things and the next he is so crabby and quiet.

I took him and my daughter out on Sunday for lunch and coffee and to spend the day window shopping and he was so quiet and seemed so unhappy. 

So I feel like maybe he’s seeing someone else again?

I just am in a numb state right now because I know what I have to do. I just can’t bring myself to do it. I keep thinking that it’s me. Like I shouldn’t have questioned him about FB. I should just be patient about marriage. If I change then he will. If I stop questioning then we won’t have arguments. If I continue to be a step-mom and play the wife role without the commitment that I crave and pretend to be happy while I’m doing it then he’ll change. 

Doing all of this when I really don’t want to…like I don’t want to play step-mom or be the person I’ve been for six years without a marriage commitment but I still do…

I've offered to buy a home, etc. like what am I doing wrong? why me?

I’m so attached to the good times and moments and when he is good…and the potential and what could be that I think WHAT IF I did this/that that it’ll happen.

Because when I’m doing all that, it seems fine. But then again, when I’m doing all that he doesn’t seem fine and can still be crabby and moody. I just don’t know whether I’m coming or going anymore and I have this crippling fear. Why? Why am I so afraid to lose a loser? 

Nothing has been resolved since last night. He just came home. I didn’t say anything when I left this morning and my daughter said he left. I haven’t heard from him and I normally do every morning. So did he break up with me? Did I push him away? Is he seeing someone else? I just don’t know what to do or feel right now.

I’m feeling panicky, confused, proud, don’t know what to say or do…

I really need advice and guidance..I’m feeling lost/crazy

Thank you in advance
P.S. Sorry for rambling…I worded it the best way I could to give you all an update from February

P.S.S. My friends and family do not like him...they say I can do so much better..I have a great job, am attractive, fun to be with, a good "fake" wife and step-mom...


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

Everyone tried to tell you, you wouldnt listen. He is a worthless POS. Kick his sorry ass out, out of your home AND out of your life. And you need to do some serious soul searching or therapy to figure out WHY you think that THIS is the kind of man you deserve to have in your life.


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## aug (Aug 21, 2011)

And you think marriage to him would magically change him into a better person?


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

Personally, I think you should be in individual counciling to figure out why you're willing to put up with that kind of treatment. That's the real issue here. 

C
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Prodigal (Feb 5, 2011)

need_guidance said:


> I just am in a numb state right now because I know what I have to do. I just can’t bring myself to do it. I keep thinking that it’s me. Like I shouldn’t have questioned him about FB. I should just be patient about marriage. If I change then he will. If I stop questioning then we won’t have arguments. If I continue to be a step-mom and play the wife role without the commitment that I crave and pretend to be happy while I’m doing it then he’ll change.


Are you serious????? Neither you or anyone else has the power to make another person change. That is magical thinking. Are you really so desperate to have this piece of scum that you would suck up to him just so he might marry you? Lady, get yourself into some very, very in-depth counseling. Because this is one of the more over-the-top posts I've seen on TAM.



need_guidance said:


> I've offered to buy a home, etc. like what am I doing wrong? why me?
> 
> I’m so attached to the good times and moments and when he is good…*and the potential and what could be that I think WHAT IF *I did this/that that it’ll happen.


Buy him a home. Buy him a car. Heck, buy him a stable of thoroughbred horses. Maybe you can buy him into marrying you.

But you are not in love with this man. You are in love with his potential, what he could be if you just kiss his worthless a$$ enough.

Sorry, it doesn't work that way. But if you want to buy this loser, then by all means go for it and report back as to how that works out for you.

I simply cannot comprehend why women run after men like this. The guy is using you and he's a major loser.

Frankly, I couldn't care less about hearing what he's doing. He's not posting; you are. 

It's time for you to ask yourself why you stay. Because this is your problem; not his. Let him own what is his to own. Get back on your side of the street and get professional help. Because you are in dire need of it. Seriously.


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## inquizitivemind (Jul 16, 2013)

I agree that you need counseling. Nobody should let anybody treat them like this. It is simply unacceptable behavior. You KNOW inside of you that he is a loser. Leave him. Don't waste any more time on him. Someone else will come along better once this one is gone. I promise.


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## oddball (Sep 5, 2012)

I am not surprised no one likes this scumbag. He cheats, is dishonest, is irresponsible with money, drives drunk, ruined his 1st marriage, appears uncompromising, and displays extreme addict tendencies. So he is a mess from what you posted. Potential or not, his current behavior over a six year period is very crap.

This is from what you have told us.

You are financially secure, attractive, well employed, in a position to buy your own home and only 38 years old.

So why on Gods green earth can you not see that you need help? Why do you value yourself so little? Why do you want to marry a man who strangles you in public?

Did you take any of the advice given in this thread. Have you worked Codependent No More? Did you find a therapist as suggested?

Your lack of self worth is the problem here. You are in love with King Baby, and think he is the issue. He is not. He will most likely not change (only a few of us addicts do).

You are 38 - get a life you can be proud of.


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## need_guidance (Mar 1, 2014)

Hello and thank you for the input. It is tough but that’s what I need. I don’t know what my deal is. I don’t know why I value myself so little. I think it’s because I went from one good relationship to a bad one to this bad one. At first it was amazing. He swept me off of my feet. So charming. I felt a love and energy like I never did before. 

Then I started feeling insecure. Thought he was maybe talking to other women. My detective started kicking in and I started snooping. I put him on my cell phone plan so I had access to the cell records and I decided to check. Well, I saw a number that he had called texted a few times so I decided to call. This “girl” said that she didn’t know what I was talking about. I asked him who she was and she said that was his boss’s wife. Well, after I checked the cell phone records again it showed that he called that number very briefly so I called to ask her again and wouldn’t you know? She said “it’s my husbands friend, why do you keep calling me?” SOOOO he called her to tell her to tell me that if I called again. This was his ex girlfriend before me. He started seeing her when his wife left him and supposedly left her for me. So she lied for him. I know a few people who know her and according to them she’s always been a woman who slept with “taken” men. No surprise that she responded that way.

So from that point, I spiraled downward into a I have to be better than any girl, always checking up on him obsession. I constantly checked on him and questioned him. I know that drove him nuts. But it was difficult for me not too. Especially when he told me when we first started dating that he has cheated on all of his ex girlfriends with the exception of his wife. That he stopped with her and it came back to bite him in the ass and she cheated on him numerous times. Had multiple affairs.

So with that I feel that I drove him to do the things he did, like have communication with co-workers that I didn’t know about. He was “seen” at a bar with a woman from work. My friend saw him out. He denied it. Then I found that he was texting this person all day everyday for months until I got home at 5:00 then it stopped. Then one day, I received my answer regarding her. He left his email up at home and I checked and I found an email from him and her and she was saying how “she seems happier because she’s not so fu*ked up over him like she was before and that if he ever needs a friend, she’s there for him.” So of course I confronted him and it was some woman that was just a “friend”. It all added up to an emotional affair if not anything physical in my mind because why would she be so “fu*ked” up over him if there was nothing going on? 

I moved out at that point. To find out that I was pregnant a week later. I forgave him because I figured we were going to be having a baby and maybe this was the change we needed and we started talking and seeing each other again. Talked about him moving back in. I had a miscarriage. A week after, we were out for dinner and he kept acting strange that day. Saying he didn’t have much time. Needed to do his own thing that night. Which is something he NEVER did. He was just acting strange. My gut and intuition knew something was VERY wrong. So I argued with him. Followed him to the house that we lived in and he threw me out. Practically threw me down the stairs. Saying that I was crazy and that everyone says I’m crazy and to get out. Well, I left in tears. The feeling of something wrong didn’t’ leave so I decided to take a drive to “our house” that morning and looked in the window and there was a woman standing there. I walked around to the other side of the house to go in and he accidentally left the key in the door so I walked in. What I saw was a bed made up on the floor with wine glasses. She was upstairs in the bathroom so I walked up to confront her. He walked down asking me what the hell I was doing. When I walked in the bathroom, guess who it was? It was his ex. The one he texted and talked to when we first started dating that sleeps with taken men. I was frozen and in shock and didn’t even know what to say. I just started walking out. When I walked past him I did go to slap him because I felt enraged. Do you know that he grabbed me by the arm and threw me out of the house? Over her? Called a few minutes later to say that nothing happened. They just talked all night. She needed a place to stay because she lives far and was at a bar in the area and got too drunk to drive. LIES. It was planned out in advance. That’s why he was so anxious for me to leave.

Guess what? I forgave. Because I felt so low. I felt like all of these woman want him and why wasn’t I the one that was winning? Woman seem to always be after him. He's a hot commodity at work. 

It didn’t help that he didn’t leave me alone after that. He was up my butt. Crying, apologizing, begging me not to leave. Told me the magic words of “I’m going to marry you”. It seemed that’s all I needed to hear at that point. I was in the biggest stage of denial. Guess I still am.

So that is a history. Sorry so long but I figured it would help give you some insight as to why I am the way I am. I’m torn down. I feel like I can’t do any better. I feel like I’m the one who is not worthy because of all that has happened. Especially after seeing these women and how trashy they seem. The one is 50 and the other is a sickly looking skinny materialistic woman who has a track record for sleeping with taken men. So WHY would he pick her over me? Why would I get treated that way over someone like that ? Major slap to self esteem.

So with all of that I’ve tried to over compensate because I felt like I was the issue. If I changed this, if I stopped nagging, if I was the happy go lucky fun woman I used to be he would stop. I felt that he did this because I nagged him too much. Questioned him too much. Was tired of being around his daughters and playing the wife role and I made that clear to him. So I would go back and forth with being who I thought he wanted to getting angry and pissy that I was even doing that and back to being the girl who complained, was unhappy and questioned everything and back and forth and round and round.

Still doing that to this day. I have stopped questioning. Haven’t said anything about his phone. Have toned down a lot and have put on this I’m going to be the best woman I can be and act a certain way to see if that changes. I keep thinking it’s me. That is hard to take.

He was married and treated his wife like a queen. The one that cheated on him. I see how he is when he treats me like a queen and I’m like “well, why can’t I have that all of the time?” I’m the good one and he won’t give it to me. But he gave it to his cheating wife? When he knew she was cheating? Because of the kids, etc. It’s like I feel what did she have that I don’t’ have? Why are all these woman better than me? What do I need to do in order to make it happen for me? His wife and these ex's that he's cheated with have all been engaged. His ex wife is on her 3rd marriage. Again, what do these woman have that I don't? That my boyfriend see's in them that he doesn't see in me? Obviously they have something going on that I don't, right? It's just how I feel.

I’ll be 40 in a month. I feel like I’m too old and beat up for anyone to have interest in me. I have very little social life because I only have a few girlfriends who have their own thing going on. When I do go out and am social, men never talk to me. EVER. Makes me feel I'll be alone forever. Unattractive. Unwanted. I always here "you're intimidating". Is that a real thing? lol

So he’s like my best friend. My companion. The one that I can hang out with and have fun with when my friends aren’t around because they are hardly ever around. I feel like a loser with no friends. And he knows that. Like why couldn’t I bet that girl that has a good social group of girlfriends and her own life that goes out and shops and does girly things? I don’t. I know his ex does and the girls he cheated with. All while I’m at home with him and my daughter and nothing to do. Like I feel like if I were a different woman.

I've turned my life into only him and have lost myself so I felt like I needed to fix that so he can SEE that I can be that woman who has her own identity and go out and be in a relationship at the same time.

There is a lot, right?

It's all the what if? Why me?

So here I am. I have no $ to seek a counselor. I have books that I can read. I think a counselor is most important though but I can’t. So again, I have books and I have all of you all. My TAM family.

Again, sorry for the long thread. I wanted to give a history as to possibly why I am how I am and how badly I want to fix it.

I want a husband, a beautiful home, friends, social life, stability in every way etc. More than anything in the world.

I also feel and am scared that he will change for the next woman who has all of those qualities of his ex wife and marry them and change.

I can’t seem to take the leap of faith to get where I need. I feel like I know, trust me. That’s why I’m here but I’m scared and I feel like I’m the issue.

Thank you all for listening to me, understanding me and taking the time to help me through this.


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## Emerald (Aug 2, 2012)

You have an unhealthy, dysfunctional obsession with this man. You are co-dependent on his every word, action, mood, etc.

You say you can't afford counseling but I think you can because you also talk about buying a house. Some counselors will allow you to make payments. You can vent here all you want but you really need in-person professional help.

Remember you are a role-model to your daughter. You owe it to her to be a fully-functional adult that is not obsessed with this type of man.


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## committed4ever (Nov 13, 2012)

Your story sounds so familiar. Especially the part about having a 20 year old daughter because the poster I am thinking about had a daughter who was 19 at the time. 

Did you sign up under another name before, because it was this time last year that I remember a similar story. Everybody pretty much dropped out of the post except Ele girl because you just could not leave him? Then he actually left and you tried so hard not to take him back; he kept calling and you could not bring yourself to ignore his calls?

Gosh I hope not. I hope you have not fallen back into a relationship but your inability to leave him makes you seem like that same person. That would be so sad if you are that same person.


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## nice777guy (Nov 23, 2009)

need_guidance said:


> I’ll be 40 in a month. I feel like I’m too old and beat up for anyone to have interest in me. I have very little social life because I only have a few girlfriends who have their own thing going on. When I do go out and am social, men never talk to me. EVER. Makes me feel I'll be alone forever. Unattractive. Unwanted. I always here "you're intimidating". Is that a real thing? lol


Why do you feel too "beat up" for anyone to have interest?

Do you realize how many of "us" feel kind of like this at that age?

Next time someone tells you that you're intimidating, ask them what they mean!!!


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

committed4ever said:


> Your story sounds so familiar. Especially the part about having a 20 year old daughter because the poster I am thinking about had a daughter who was 19 at the time.
> 
> Did you sign up under another name before, because it was this time last year that I remember a similar story. Everybody pretty much dropped out of the post except Ele girl because you just could not leave him? Then he actually left and you tried so hard not to take him back; he kept calling and you could not bring yourself to ignore his calls?
> 
> Gosh I hope not. I hope you have not fallen back into a relationship but your inability to leave him makes you seem like that same person. That would be so sad if you are that same person.


I think you're right! The whole bed made up on the floor thing sounds WAY too familiar! 

NG, whether you are that girl or not, you seriously need help.


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

How much of your financial constraints (like not being able to afford counseling) are caused by being with your partner?

C
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## happy as a clam (Jan 5, 2014)

need_guidance said:


> So I argued with him. Followed him to the house that we lived in and he threw me out. Practically threw me down the stairs. *Saying that I was crazy and that everyone says I’m crazy* and to get out.


NG... I'm sorry if this is harsh, but I'm beginning to think he's right. You ARE crazy... Crazy for staying in this hot mess of a relationship, crazy for accepting his dog-like treatment of you, crazy for putting up with his lies, his deceit, his cheating, his drug and alcohol abuse, and now physical abuse (throwing you down a flight of stairs). What is wrong with you?

You need SERIOUS counseling, like yesterday. You have incredibly low self-esteem -- actually, NO self-esteem.

Get away from this man and get yourself into intensive counseling.


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

Obviously, you need far more help than TAM can provide since you didn't listen last time. Go into therapy (quit finding excuses not to) and find out why you are so desperate that you continue to settle for that loser. You're worried about waking up at 40 in your situation. Would you rather it happen at 50? Or 60? Because it for sure will happen.


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

I re-read Girl's last post...yeah, its her. I recognize ALL of these statements now:
*
- So with that I feel that I drove him to do the things he did,

- I felt like all of these woman want him and why wasn’t I the one that was winning? 

-I feel like I’m the one who is not worthy because of all that has happened

-So WHY would he pick her over me?

-So with all of that I’ve tried to over compensate because I felt like I was the issue. If I changed this, if I stopped nagging, if I was the happy go lucky fun woman I used to be he would stop.

-Have toned down a lot and have put on this I’m going to be the best woman I can be and act a certain way to see if that changes. I keep thinking it’s me. 

-He was married and treated his wife like a queen. The one that cheated on him. I see how he is when he treats me like a queen and I’m like “well, why can’t I have that all of the time?” I’m the good one and he won’t give it to me. But he gave it to his cheating wife? When he knew she was cheating? Because of the kids, etc. It’s like I feel what did she have that I don’t’ have? Why are all these woman better than me? What do I need to do in order to make it happen for me? 

- Again, what do these woman have that I don't? That my boyfriend see's in them that he doesn't see in me? Obviously they have something going on that I don't, right? It's just how I feel

-It's all the what if? Why me?

-I also feel and am scared that he will change for the next woman who has all of those qualities of his ex wife and marry them and change.
*
This is an exercise in futility folks, we are beating a dead horse.  Many of us tried to save it before.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Six years is a long time. 

He has told you what he wants to do and is not budging from that. 

So either you are ok with that and continue the relationship living apart or you break it off.

You get to decide what is best for you.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

KathyBatesel said:


> Love and compatibility are not synonyms!


Love this.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

need_guidance said:


> Also, as *far as the trust issues go. It started not too soon after we started dating.*


And yet you stayed with him for six years. Six years or not trusting him. Gosh, I cannot imagine. That is not living or loving.

The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result. Do you want to be in this position six more years from now?

Do you really want to marry a man who you can't trust, doesn't want to live with you, and uses drugs? I mean, you have a daughter. Would you recommend she marry someone like this? She is seeing this for herself and probably thinking this is what a healthy relationship is like. 



Prodigal said:


> I think you know why you are holding on. I really do. You are scared sh!tless you're going to die alone. I hate to break it to you, but we ALL die alone. Nobody can do our dying for us. Or our living.


Is that you, Mom? :rofl: That is something my mom would have said. Seriously. It's spot on.


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## committed4ever (Nov 13, 2012)

Jellybeans said:


> And yet you stayed with him for six years. Six years or not trusting him. Gosh, I cannot imagine. That is not living or loving.


You should remember her JB. I think you hung in with her for a while on her thread under another name, around this same time last year. I think a few of the facts have been tweaked but I really think its the same person.

What a shame.


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## need_guidance (Mar 1, 2014)

Yes, I know. I do feel crazy.

He made me question and say maybe I am crazy...if everyone else says I'm crazy.

He didn't throw me down the stairs but you can tell he wanted to.

I do not have any self esteem.

The money that I am being given for a deposit on a home is from my family. 

I can look into counseling at a payment option.

I am here because I am desperate for help. Anything, a book, this forum for support because I NEED it and I WANT it. It's gotten to that point.

I just need confirmation that it's not me. That I didn't do anything to have this brought on me. That I didn't contribute to any of it, etc.

Please be patient with me. I'm not NOT listening to you all because I don't want to. This is very difficult for me.

I truly am in tears as I write this. Thank goodness we have private conference rooms in where we can work from time to time at work.

Because I am truly a mess. I'm so embarrassed, ashamed and disappointed in myself.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

committed4ever said:


> You should remember her JB. I think you hung in with her for a while on her thread under another name, around this same time last year. I think a few of the facts have been tweaked but I really think its the same person.
> 
> What a shame.


Who was it? Links?


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

need_guidance said:


> I do not have any self esteem.
> 
> I am here because I am desperate for help. Anything, a book, this forum for support because I NEED it and I WANT it. It's gotten to that point.
> 
> Because I am truly a mess. I'm so embarrassed, ashamed and disappointed in myself.


We can advise you but only you can actually help yourself. It's good that you feel the way you described because it means you know you deserve more.



need_guidance said:


> I just need confirmation that it's not me. That I didn't do anything to have this brought on me. That I didn't contribute to any of it, etc.


Well, you may not be responsible for HIS actions/thoughts/decisions, but you certainly hold responsibility for being int he status quo. Why? Because you have continued to accept it for the last six years. So yes, you have contributed to this dynamic you are by staying in it and not doing anything to change it by way of actually cutting it off. He has told you want he wants/needs. Tell him what you want/need. If they don't match up, then move on.


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## need_guidance (Mar 1, 2014)

Thank you. Thank you for offering to be here to help. It really does mean a lot.

How do I get past the missing him part? The parts where he's done things that other boyfriends haven't. The special things and the things that I do love that connect us?

He's the one that I talk to always about work, etc. everyday

Who is always cool with where I wanna go eat, if I want a random this or that. Like he's been a best friend/companion and attached at the hip kind of person.

How do I get over that? Like being afraid to lose that?


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Ok first of all, I was reading this thread in pieces. So I am reading more and more as I go alone (should have probably read all of OP's posts at the same time).

Holy hell:



need_guidance said:


> MAYBE he’s going to finally give me what I want, the marriage, the proper commitment, the compromise. *Well, it’s been how long now and there still is no compromise.*
> 
> I told him that I want to look into buying a home for all of us. So he can have more space and so his daughters can have their own room when he gets them. *I told him where I was interested in moving and he still won’t compromise. He said that he wants to live where he wants to live. *Up the street from his daughters. This is very unrealistic of him because* he has horrible credit, bankruptcy, felony on his records and he cannot get approved nor afford* close to where his daughters live. It’s just not realistic. I spoke with him about this and even thought where I suggested is where we can afford and is only about 10-15 minutes from his children *he still won’t budge and compromise*.
> 
> ...


It was very hard for me to read past that point.

You choose this relationship every day. 

For some reason, you think this is the treatment you deserve. 

And as long as you think that, that's what you'll get back. After all the bullsh*t, after everything the past six years, after him CHOKING YOU in front of a crowd at a concert, you STILL choose to stay. 

I don't know what else to tell you.


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

Do you have many other friends? Start doing stuff with them. Start talking to them about work and things on your mind. If you don't have friends, start cultivating some. Start doing things away from that guy in your life. 

You know what you need to do. You know what you'd tell your daughter to do. But you're the only one that can do it. We can only offer advice and an ear. You need to act. 

C
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

need_guidance said:


> Thank you. Thank you for offering to be here to help. It really does mean a lot.
> 
> How do I get past the missing him part? The parts where he's done things that other boyfriends haven't. The special things and the things that I do love that connect us?
> 
> ...


This has been answered about a hundred times for you and you dont listen. Why do you keep asking? You refuse to do anything differently.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

need_guidance said:


> How do I get past the missing him part?


You mourn it like you do with any other break up.



need_guidance said:


> The parts where he's done things that other boyfriends haven't.


You counter those thoughts with the ones of him choking you, refusing to compromise ever, cheating on you, lying to you. 

Then you get some therapy or read some books to find out why you value you yourself so little that you'd put up with such horrible mistreatment. Why are you attracted to this behavior? Spend a long time alone. This relationship is a toxic mess.


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

And please, please, please do not tie yourself tighter to him by signing a lease together or getting pregnant!

Btw, how old is your daughter? Can you invest yourself emotionally in your relationship with her?

C
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Re: the daughter:

I just want to say: as a mother, you are giving her an example that this is normal/ok for a man to treat her this way. She may end up seeking out similar relationships OR resenting you for this whole thing. 

Just saying. 

That whole lead by example thing.


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## Faeleaf (Jul 22, 2014)

This sounds really familiar, because although the circumstances are different, this is how I felt in my first marriage. I fell so hard for the guy. I thought he was the one - I was _sure._ I made the vows, and I meant them. 

Six months into our marriage, and I thought we were happy, in love. That's when he cheated on me. I was desperate to fix it - sure I could fix it. I forgave him immediately, and though my heart was in bits I worked super hard to repair the breaks, patch up the leaks. I had to keep the ship afloat. I read all the relationship books, and was devoted to meeting his needs. I thought, "I'll never love anyone else like I love him." 

There were more affairs. There was the occasional scary temper. There was the attraction to under-age girls (ages 12-14, which...yikes). I tried, repeatedly, to forgive everything, fix everything. I was manic to make it work. He was my world. Every time he did something terrible, I told myself, "It won't happen again." Of course, I was deluding myself.

It took too long for it all to come into focus, for me to admit the truth and realize what I had to do. I'm not proud of that, and not thrilled about the time, love, and energy I wasted trying to make him something he was not, unwilling to see the truth for what it was. But I got there eventually, kicked him out and filed for divorce. I will not sugar coat this part - it was the hardest thing I have EVER done. I never knew my heart could hurt so much. I wanted to die to make the pain stop.

This is the part I need you to hear - it was all worth it. Every bit of it. You know the words to the song "The Broken Road," right? Everyone does. That's me, because all of that misery led me to my current spouse and our very, very happy marriage. Every day I am surprised all over again by him, by how good we are together, by how much better my life is now. It's no longer ME being devoted to my husband...it's US being devoted to each other. I am telling you...that's the best thing in the world.

THIS is what can happen when you step away from the broken things. THIS is what makes stepping away from the broken things worth it. THIS is what you are delaying by what you know, deep down, is an inevitable breakup and the heartache that will come with it. It's coming...you know it's coming. Be as strong as you can. Get through it. Hurry up and get to the GOOD stuff.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Faeleaf said:


> It took too long for it all to come into focus, for me to admit the truth and realize what I had to do. I'm not proud of that, and not thrilled about the time, love, and energy *I wasted trying to make him something he was not, unwilling to see the truth for what it was*. But I got there eventually, kicked him out and filed for divorce. I will not sugar coat this part - it was the hardest thing I have EVER done. I never knew my heart could hurt so much. I wanted to die to make the pain stop.
> 
> This is the part I need you to hear - it was all worth it. Every bit of it.


:smthumbup::smthumbup::smthumbup:


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## need_guidance (Mar 1, 2014)

Faeleaf - Thank you for your story. It is helpful to know that I'm not the only person who has been in these shoes.

It's so hard because even though we're not married, we're like family. He's been a party of my daughters life for years and me a part of his daughters lives. I'm so close to his sisters and family. 

It's like a divorce without being married. There is a lot involved.

I just can't stop feeling what if I didn't question? what if I trusted? What if I didn't need to "talk" all the time, etc. Then what if?

He showed some points of change. Tiny bits of progress so that had me hopeful. Like just recently he semi agreed to living where I wanted and yesterday he said he LOOKS at rings for me but just can't afford them. 

These things have given me hope. I need to remember that it is very unlikely that he will change 100%. That the old him will come out again.

I need to remember all of these things.

Now, I have to get to a point of breaking it off...what to say...how to do it...

Because for him it may be out of nowhere because he is changing towards to who I want (according to him)..

Do I seek therapy after I break up with him? Or do I go while I'm with him to make me strong enough to do it?

So many questions....Just want to do the right thing for me in order to avoid a melt down...


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

need_guidance said:


> He showed some points of change. Tiny bits of progress so that had me hopeful. Like just recently he semi agreed to living where I wanted and yesterday he said he LOOKS at rings for me but just can't afford them.


Now you are going back to justifying his behavior. You stated earlier he said it's his way or no way; that he does not want to compromise on moving at all. As far as rings go--he looks at rings? So do I when I go window shopping. He can't afford them? For six years he hasn't been able to "afford" them. Check it out: if a man wants to marry you, he will. Some don't even use a ring. They propose w/o one. Or use a cracker jack box ring. 

You already know. You just want to keep believing one day he's going to wake up and be someone else.

Word to the wise: he's not. He is who he is, not this fantasy of who you WANT him to be.

Six years is a long time. Six more years is even longer.


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

Make an appointment for counseling now. This minute. Your parents would help you buy a house so for sure they will help you get rid of him. It won't get any easier by postponing it. 

As to what you say? That you have tried but it doesn't work for you and there's no negotiating on his part that will be acceptable. It's over. Period. No matter what he promises. And stick to that. Keep repeating it. 

Start the process.


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## Faeleaf (Jul 22, 2014)

need_guidance said:


> Faeleaf - Thank you for your story. It is helpful to know that I'm not the only person who has been in these shoes.
> 
> It's so hard because even though we're not married, we're like family. He's been a party of my daughters life for years and me a part of his daughters lives. I'm so close to his sisters and family.
> 
> ...


I hear you - I really do. People who flippantly say "just leave him," don't have any idea the world of trouble and hurt encased in those words. There is no "just," right?

I _did_ have kids with my first husband. Two of them. I really struggled with which would be worse in the long run - the divorce, or living with an unstable, sometimes explosive and frequently deviant father. It wasn't an easy question to answer.

And I LOVED him, completely and totally. I've told you the bad things, but he was also my best friend. the one I always wanted to talk to, the one I always turned to. I could not envision a life for myself that didn't include him. 

I will give you one piece of good advice that a friend gave me. Start writing it down. The "bad" stuff. Just keep a list. Date, time, what happened, how you felt. Only the bad stuff. If you are like me, as soon as the storm is over I started white-washing, making myself believe it was all over and everything would be good now. Having it down in black and white, seeing the patterns, really brought it home to me. I had to face up to the fact that it was NEVER going to change. The ugly things on the paper weren't just my PAST. They were also my FUTURE, if I stayed.

Also, I think it helps to not kid yourself about how hard leaving is. It is hard...I won't lie about it. The day I kicked him out was worst day of my life. Worse even than the day my brother died. At the end of it I called my dad, and confessed that the only thing in the world I wanted was to have my husband back, to sit with me on the bed and rub my back, tell me everything was going to be alright. Thankfully, he understood, and was able to talk me through it. But I can really relate to your feelings on this.

I am terrified of going to the dentist. Even when I have a gawd-awful toothache, I would honestly prefer that to a dentist visit. The only way I can get myself to go is by acknowledging how better I'm going to feel when the relief of having it all over is washing over me. No pain, no more dread, just sweet relief. Knowing that between THIS moment and THAT moment was a dentist chair, so I may as well hurry up and get to it.

So put yourself in the future, with this mess behind you. You are with a good man - loyal and trustworthy, someone you admire and believe in. Someone who makes you laugh, who makes you relax, who makes you gasp, who makes you thankful every day to be alive and sharing your life with him. Someone who shares your ideals, your dreams, and your values. 

Between THIS moment and THAT moment is a breakup. It's going to be really hard, and complicated, and more than once you will cry and wrestle with self-doubt and loneliness and regret. Yes. But you may as well hurry up and get to it. There is wonder and beauty and indescribable love on the other side.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Openminded said:


> As to what you say? That you have tried but it doesn't work for you and* there's no negotiating on his part *that will be acceptable. It's over. Period. No matter what he promises. And stick to that. Keep repeating it.
> 
> Start the process.


Open nailed this. Get counselling and tell him you are done.
The longest you stay in this, the longer it will take to move on and start a new life.

Also, the bolded: it's impossible having a healthy relationship with someone who REFUSES to compromise. Truly. Those relationships are one-sided. and who wants a relationship with someone who won't ever bend to you to listen to you or validate your feelings or actually try to meet you halfway?


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## PAgirl (Sep 10, 2013)

You are holding on to the fact that he looked at rings. How can you possibly WANT to marry this loser??? HE WILL NOT CHANGE AFTER MARRIAGE!!

I totally understand you are in love. BUT, you really can get over him and love someone else! Someone MUCH better!

And the fact that you say you don't attract men when you are out socially... its probably because you have no self esteem and it shows I bet. Most people are attracted to others who exude a positive energy. Get therapy and get yourself back!


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## Prodigal (Feb 5, 2011)

3Xnocharm said:


> This is an exercise in futility folks, we are beating a dead horse.  Many of us tried to save it before.


Yeah, I thought this sounded familiar. The reason I couldn't remember the OP's name the first time around is I believe she yanked her thread after we all got so disgusted with her we told her to just quit b!tching about this bum she is so "in love" with.

Charm, you nailed it. This is the same woman.

OP, you are ill. You need professional help. You spent over 20 pages on this forum moaning and groaning the last time.

Now you are back.

My gut instinct tells me you are either mentally ill or this is a bogus post that keeps recycling.

Either way, folks are wise to you.


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## need_guidance (Mar 1, 2014)

Prodigal - Coming from a woman who clearly has issues along with an extremely low self esteem, the LAST thing I need to hear is something like that from you. He tells me I'm crazy and now you tell me that I'm mentally ill? I came here for help. Not to have what I'm feeling reinforced. I came here for encouragement and positive advice and to maybe feel better about things and what I'm doing.

You saying that just makes me feel worse and makes me feel like yes, maybe it is ME and not him with the issue. Maybe if I weren't so crazy or mentally ill it would be different. Maybe I'm paranoid and did question him too much. Or maybe I made things up in my head. 

He always says that I make things up in my head.

So I feel crazy, he tells me I'm crazy so therefore maybe I am really mentally ill and the problem.

Maybe if I were normal and didn't act the way I do, then it'd be different? Maybe that's why he cheated on me. Because I'm mentally ill and question and am paranoid?

Please, and I ask kindly. If you can word things differently due to my fragile mental state right now.

I really am going through enough already and I'm feeling worse.

To all of the others. Thank you for your compassion, patience, understanding and kind support. It means the world. I am heeding your advice although not easy. I still need the support to get through this.

Again, thank you.


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## Faeleaf (Jul 22, 2014)

It's an online forum, not a courthouse. You're not a criminal that needs to be scolded. You're a human being like all of us, that bumbles around like we all do, trying to make the best of whatever bad job we have going. 

Our "judgments" are opinions only, our advice is based on extremely limited information, and you are not at all obligated to follow it. I hope you aren't the type of person who blindly follows advice once it's been given to you, no matter how sound. 

If anything, I hope you take my advice like a lens, and slide it up next to the lens of your own thoughts and feelings. Looking through both lenses - yours and mine together - you'll gain a slightly wider perspective, a slightly different focus and viewpoint. That is the right way to take advice after all - neither disregarding it nor letting it supplant your own intuition, but come alongside it and enhance it.


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

Faeleaf said:


> It's an online forum, not a courthouse. You're not a criminal that needs to be scolded. You're a human being like all of us, that bumbles around like we all do, trying to make the best of whatever bad job we have going.
> 
> Our "judgments" are opinions only, our advice is based on extremely limited information, and you are not at all obligated to follow it.* I hope you aren't the type of person who blindly follows advice once it's been given to you, no matter how sound.
> *


Not to worry, she NEVER follows ANY advice.


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## need_guidance (Mar 1, 2014)

Some people here are way harsh. They don't know the shoes that I'm in. 

It's fine though. I do appreciate the advice from the understanding, compassionate and patient people here.

Thank you so much, Faeleaf!!


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## PAgirl (Sep 10, 2013)

I agree people can be harsh here. They don't know you personally. So people are going to type whatever they feel. If it was face to face, it might be less harsh. But the bottom line how everyone here feels is still the same, harsh or not. You need to leave him. But Im wondering how healthy YOU are? I have a HUGE problem with the drug abuse. You have a 20 year old that probably sees him do it. And Im wondering if YOU also take pills and do coke. This is a very unstable and crazy lifestyle you are living. Maybe you want that? I mean, I really don't know how you managed to stay with this guy for six long years unless you ENJOY the craziness and drama.


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## Prodigal (Feb 5, 2011)

need_guidance said:


> Some people here are way harsh. They don't know the shoes that I'm in.


Oh, puuullleeeezzzeeeee. You're with a man who physically and emotionally abuses you for years, and anonymous people here are "way harsh." And "they don't know the shoes" you are in? How do you know that? You don't know squat about some of the hell these folks have walked through.

I don't see what shoes you are in, other than the ones you choose to wear. 



need_guidance said:


> I do appreciate the advice from the understanding, compassionate and patient people here.


No, what you do appreciate are the people who aren't familiar with your previous 20-something page post. You don't take advice, appreciate it or not. Seriously.

Nevertheless, good luck. I hope all your dreams and wishes come true. Really.


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## need_guidance (Mar 1, 2014)

PA Girl, what you just said makes sense.

As far as the drug use goes, he doesn't do cocaine very often. It's very seldom and it has never been in my home. Just want to clarify that. I mentioned it because he has, on occasion, done it.

I do not do drugs. I will have an occasional drink. Wine after a crazy day of work but my getting drunk/party days are few and far in between. 

No I do not love the craziness and drama. I just question myself. Even more when someone like Prodigal tells me I have a mental issue because then I think that I'm not normal and it is me that needs to change and work on things. Maybe I'm too hard on him? Maybe this, maybe that. So that makes it hard for me to leave because I feel like if I changed than it'd be different.

I feel extremely confused.


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## PAgirl (Sep 10, 2013)

You may not realize you crave that craziness drama lifestyle until you find yourself in a normal, healthy relationship... and then you become bored and start thinking about old DUI boyfriend.

I think the first step is to build your confidence. It doesn't sound like you can leave him in this state of mind. But he sounds toxic and I hope you get strong enough to do the right thing.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

need_guidance said:


> Prodigal - Coming from a woman who clearly has issues along with an extremely low self esteem, the LAST thing I need to hear is something like that from you. He tells me I'm crazy and now you tell me that I'm mentally ill?


Despite what anyone calls you, it's up to you to develop your self-esteem. 



need_guidance said:


> I came here for help. Not to have what I'm feeling reinforced. I came here for encouragement and positive advice and to maybe feel better about things and what I'm doing.


We are just people on the internet typing on our computers and/or phones. 

People can tell you anything and validate your feelings and acknowledge that your husband/partner sucks based on what you have stated, but ultimately *it is up to YOU *to actually do something about it. 

It is your life. And your choice.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

need_guidance said:


> No I do not love the craziness and drama.


So then end it.



need_guidance said:


> I just question myself. * Even more when someone like Prodigal tells me I have a mental issue *because then I think that I'm not normal and it is me that needs to change and work on things.



Eh. Not to sound like my dad (ok, I will) but if your friends told you to jump off a cliff, would you do it? 

I don't think Prodigal meant it in the way that you need to be locked into an institution (I think? :scratchhead: ) but rather that mentally, you should evaluate what it is that attracts you to this behavior. Mentally, why do you put up with it if it makes you unhappy; why do you think you deserve this? Why do you stay? 



need_guidance said:


> Maybe I'm too hard on him? Maybe this, maybe that. So that makes it hard for me to leave because* I feel like if I changed than it'd be different.*


Even if you changed, he is who is he is. You cannot MAKE anyone do anything. Or BE something/someone they are not.


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## Prodigal (Feb 5, 2011)

need_guidance said:


> No I do not love the craziness and drama.


Sure, that's why you are back to explain why the man you are with is crazy and/or making you crazy. Right. 



need_guidance said:


> I just question myself. Even more when someone like Prodigal tells me I have a mental issue because then I think that I'm not normal and it is me that needs to change and work on things.


Everyone questions themselves from time to time. They don't agonize along the lines of, "Am I right?" "What can I buy him to get him to love me?" Blah, blah, blah.

And, yeah, you DO have mental issues. "Abnormal" is a subjective term. I don't know if you're abnormal, but you have mental health issues. 

WHY? Because you keep coming here listing all the crap this loser pulls and how you can change to make him a better person.

THAT is a definite symptom of underlying mental issues.

YOU CANNOT AND WILL NOT CHANGE HIM. Because you cannot embrace that and start on a path to taking care of yourself, yes, you DO have mental issues. 



need_guidance said:


> Maybe I'm too hard on him? Maybe this, maybe that. So that makes it hard for me to leave because *I feel like if I changed than it'd be different*.
> 
> I feel extremely confused.


^^THIS.^^ Here is a perfect example of someone who isn't exactly thinking in a healthy manner. What-if thinking. Magical thinking. I-can-control-the-outcome thinking. Sick thinking.

B.S. You aren't the least bit confused. Your madder than he!! that this asshat won't conform to what you want him to be; what you imagine he can be.

This guy must be one heckuva lay, because other than possible sexual prowess, he has ZIP going for him.

You, on the other hand, ARE one sick puppy. Seriously. And please realize this: you are not going to convince me, or anyone else here, that we are harsh, cruel, or wrong.

You don't want guidance. You want people to tell you that you are a poor-pitiful-martyr who is giving it all for her man. You can make him right. 

Just handle you with kid gloves. Unlike the scumball who physically/emotionally abuses you.

Trust me. In this case, I AM right. Really.


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