# Ladies, please do me this one favor:



## UMP (Dec 23, 2014)

IF YOU ARE AN HD WOMAN, PLEASE DO NOT READ FURTHER.
THIS POST MAY OR MAY NOT APPLY TO YOU. IF YOU ARE AN HD WOMAN AND READ FURTHER, YOU ARE READING AT YOUR OWN RISK AND MAY BECOME PISSED OFF. IF YOU HAVE READ THIS POST PRIOR TO ME POSTING THIS DISCLAIMER, I OFFER MY MOST SINCERE APOLOGIES. I MOST DEFINATELY BELIEVE THAT MOST OF THE WOMEN ON TAM ARE HD. IN FACT, IF I COULD, I WOULD INVITE EACH AND EVERY ONE OF YOU TO MY HOME TO HAVE A TALK WITH MY WIFE. 


Don't ever, from now till death do us part, ever initiate sex with your husband by using a question.
Example : "Honey, do you want to have sex tonight?" (Bad, very Bad!)

Please change the question into a statement of desire.
Example: "Honey, I want to f$ck you tonight." (Good, very Good!)

Can someone give me an Amen ?


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## Lloyd Dobler (Apr 24, 2014)

ump said:


> don't ever, from now till death do us part, ever initiate sex with your husband by using a question.
> Example : "honey, do you want to have sex tonight?" (bad, very bad!)
> 
> please change the question into a statement of desire.
> ...


amen!


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## Anon1111 (May 29, 2013)

!

It shouldn't be asked as if you are saying, "honey, would you like to have chicken or fish tonight?"


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## UMP (Dec 23, 2014)

Lila said:


> Why would "Honey, do you want to have sex tonight?" not be okay? :scratchhead:


Because it shows no real initiation or desire from you.
You are leaving it all up to him. He wants to sense desire and passion FROM you to HIM. Asking a question will not do this. Making a statement as to what you want to do because of the passion welt up inside of you will.


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## badsanta (Oct 13, 2014)

UMP said:


> Don't ever, from now till death do us part, ever initiate sex with your husband by using a question.
> Example : "Honey, do you want to have sex tonight?" (Bad, very Bad!)
> 
> Please change the question into a statement of desire.
> ...


Ummmmmm.

Since I'm not a good listener, I doubt I would even be able to tell any difference between the two versions of that statement. My wife has finally learned just to throw her boobs in my face and then run!


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## Fozzy (Jul 20, 2013)

I agree with the underlying premise that more passion/enthusiasm is better, but it's all relative.

My wife won't initiate at all, so I'd be thrilled to death with option 1.

THEN we can think about moving on to option 2.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

Not all men have the same problems. Some husbands have a lower drive than their wives. I wish these "all men want this or that" ideas would go away. If we could caveat by saying "if your husband wants more sex than you do, then..." it would be better.


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## doobie (Apr 15, 2014)

If I said either of those things to my husband the answer would be no. Not all men want sex - my husband has only wanted sex once in the past six months and we've had sex less than 20 times in our two year marriage. On many of those occasions it was "duty sex" as a result of me begging for it and threatening divorce if we didn't sort this problem out. However, the sex only now happens when I do beg for it. To me, this means that our marriage is deeply dysfunctional - however, he's thrilled with the marriage and says he's never been happier in his life. He's always raving on about how much he loves me but I find that nowadays I'm taking this with a pinch of salt. He can say it til he's blue in the face, but I no longer believe it because there's no actionable proof of this.


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

What is this asking thing you're talking about?


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## Thundarr (Jul 4, 2012)

Questions can work. Something like You ready for this?


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## LuvIsTuff (Feb 20, 2015)

Lila said:


> LOL. I get that.
> 
> 
> 
> I don't know UMP. My H and I have a pretty good sex life but I can't remember ever telling him "Honey, I want to F*** you tonight". That's just not my style and I consider myself a passionate lover. I might walk around singing "Let's get it on", but definitely not using the F*** word. That one's strictly reserved to express myself during


"That's not my style"? Really? Buying roses isn't my style. Making a kick ass meal, from scratch, isn't my style. Showing up to my wife's office with a card and a pack of Hershey kisses isn't my style. But guess what, I DO IT BECAUSE SHE LIKES IT! Not my style?!


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## LuvIsTuff (Feb 20, 2015)

Lila said:


> Why would "Honey, do you want to have sex tonight?" not be okay? :scratchhead:


A woman could do SO much better than "Hey, wanna do it?". How about "I've been thinking about you all day and can't wait to put the kids to bed", or "I hope you ate your Wheaties this morning because you'll need your energy when I get a hold of you". Seriously, ladies, you expect us to put some creativity in to it. It's not that hard(pun intended).


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

How about reading all of the replies?


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## LuvIsTuff (Feb 20, 2015)

Lila said:


> LuvIsTuff said:
> 
> 
> > A woman could do SO much better than "Hey, wanna do it?". How about "I've been thinking about you all day and can't wait to put the kids to bed", or "I hope you ate your Wheaties this morning because you'll need your energy when I get a hold of you". Seriously, ladies, you expect us to put some creativity in to it. It's not that hard(pun intended).
> ...


Is that your advice to every HD spouse with an LD spouse? Personally, I'll happily step out of my comfort zone if I think it will make a positive impact on my marriage. But that's just me...


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## egap416 (Mar 16, 2015)

I'm shy and not much of a talker. English isn't my first language (it is my husband's). The times I've tried to do the sexy kitten thing, it's been painfully awkward and ridiculous. So I've learned to keep it simple. Grab his **** and whisper one word in his ear: "tonight". Nothing else is said. He gets the message. So far no complaints.


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## LuvIsTuff (Feb 20, 2015)

egap416 said:


> I'm shy and not much of a talker. English isn't my first language (it is my husband's). The times I've tried to do the sexy kitten thing, it's been painfully awkward and ridiculous. So I've learned to keep it simple. Grab his **** and whisper one word in his ear: "tonight". Nothing else is said. He gets the message. So far no complaints.


And that shows DESIRE! Exactly what the OP suggested. See how easy that was??


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## lifeistooshort (Mar 17, 2013)

I think there's a difference between asking if he wants to have sex while you're doing the dishes and asking while you're rubbing/grabbing his a$$.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LuvIsTuff (Feb 20, 2015)

> I'm not saying this to be mean but you have an LD wife who rarely shows you desire... and you're expecting her to initiate sex with "let's [email protected]#"? Or " I hope you ate your Wheaties"?.
> 
> You're expectations are not in sync with reality. That's why I said manage your expectations and you'll be happier.


I'm not referring specifically to my wife. The OP made a "request" to the ladies and I'm simply saying, in a general statement, that it's not that difficult to show desire. There's a lot more ways to do it than just saying "Let's F". Any statement that shows sexual desire would be awesome!!

And if managing expectations is the solution, there's a sh!t load of people coming to this forum that are wasting their time. Hell, do you tell a man who's wife only has sex with him once every 6 months to "manage his expectations"? At what point does the LD bare the responsibility for being a terrible spouse? There's something about the whole "managing expectations" idea that makes my blood boil. To a point, I can see it. I don't expect my wife to bring her hot co-worker home with her for a threesome. But how hard is it to talk dirty or show sexual desire through words?? It's not.


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## WandaJ (Aug 5, 2014)

It is not that simple if woman is the one who wants it more often?


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

Lila said:


> Why would "Honey, do you want to have sex tonight?" not be okay? :scratchhead:


If I walked into the front room, dressed in my s1utiest lingerie, with my tallest boots, makeup and hair done, and I stood in front of my husband and sweetly and innocently asked, "Honey, do you want to have sex tonight?", my husband would be naked faster than Road Runner could escape Wiley Coyote.


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

UMP said:


> Because it shows no real initiation or desire from you.
> You are leaving it all up to him. He wants to sense desire and passion FROM you to HIM. *Asking a question will not do this.* Making a statement as to what you want to do because of the passion welt up inside of you will.


HOW you asking the question absolutely CAN do that.


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## Fitnessfan (Nov 18, 2014)

Created2Write said:


> HOW you asking the question absolutely CAN do that.


I could be dressed up like a porn star and asking if I can go down on my knees for him and if he is not in the right mood, it won't happen. So....depends on the guy but I do imagine this works for most.


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## NosborCrop (Feb 25, 2015)

amen =/


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## LuvIsTuff (Feb 20, 2015)

Created2Write said:


> Lila said:
> 
> 
> > Why would "Honey, do you want to have sex tonight?" not be okay?
> ...


And look at all the work you put in to the presentation. Once again, it shows desire and effort. Can't ask for any more than that.


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

See, the thing that bugs me most about the opening post, is that the poster is taking his own preferences and assuming all men would respond the way he does. I have, many times, looked at my husband from across the room and said very pragmatically, "Hey. Think we should have sex?" It has, never once, hindered him from literally jumping out of his clothes, climbing on top of me and letting me stick my tongue down his throat. 

In a marriage where sex is an issue, I get that a HD spouse wants to feel passion and desire from their LD spouse. But it can't be strictly on his/her own terms. The LD spouse should have the freedom to be who they are in the bedroom. A woman shouldn't have to act like a prostitute to make her husband feel desires.


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

LuvIsTuff said:


> And look at all the work you put in to the presentation. Once again, it shows desire and effort. Can't ask for any more than that.


Yes, but the point is that it's not WHAT is said, it's HOW it's said.


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## LuvIsTuff (Feb 20, 2015)

Lila said:


> LuvIsTuff said:
> 
> 
> > I'm not referring specifically to my wife. The OP made a "request" to the ladies and I'm simply saying, in a general statement, that it's not that difficult to show desire. There's a lot more ways to do it than just saying "Let's F". Any statement that shows sexual desire would be awesome!!
> ...


I don't buy the "I can't". Sorry. I coach basketball for a living and I don't allow the words "I can't" from my players. "Can't" is a 4 letter word in my world, and a cop out with something you're actually capable of doing.


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## LuvIsTuff (Feb 20, 2015)

Created2Write said:


> LuvIsTuff said:
> 
> 
> > And look at all the work you put in to the presentation. Once again, it shows desire and effort. Can't ask for any more than that.
> ...


My old sales manager used to say "if served properly, some people would eat a plate full of sh!t". Presentation is everything.


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## Grayson (Oct 28, 2010)

Created2Write said:


> See, the thing that bugs me most about the opening post, is that the poster is taking his own preferences and assuming all men would respond the way he does. I have, many times, looked at my husband from across the room and said very pragmatically, "Hey. Think we should have sex?" It has, never once, hindered him from literally jumping out of his clothes, climbing on top of me and letting me stick my tongue down his throat.
> 
> In a marriage where sex is an issue, I get that a HD spouse wants to feel passion and desire from their LD spouse. But it can't be strictly on his/her own terms. The LD spouse should have the freedom to be who they are in the bedroom. A woman shouldn't have to act like a prostitute to make her husband feel desires.


While the OP appears to have used somewhat extreme ends of the spectrum to make the point, why go to the further extreme and equate displaying genuine desire with "acting like a prostitute?"

Some seem to have gotten the gist of the point being made: that a genuine expression of desire/affection is, generally speaking, more effective than an expression that "duty sex" might be available if the HD partner is amenable. And I can agree with that. Such an expression of genuine desire can take many forms, but the key is that it *is* genuine.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## PhillyGuy13 (Nov 29, 2013)

She rarely initiates it. So whether she asks me to have sex or tells me we are having sex, I'd be over the moon in either scenario.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

Grayson said:


> While the OP appears to have used somewhat extreme ends of the spectrum to make the point, why go to the further extreme and equate displaying genuine desire with "acting like a prostitute?"


Because I've seen many posts from men on this forum who seem completely unsatisfied with their wife's unique sexual personality. Now, I can understand the frustration of being with someone who won't have sex with the lights on, or isn't comfortable with oral sex, or won't try new positions. And I really feel for the people in those situations. 

However, sex is meant to be _mutually_ enjoyable, and if a spouse, whether male or female, is pressured too far outside of their comfort zone, or is made to fee that they aren't enough as they are to kindle desire in their husband or wife, then sex will no longer be mutually enjoyable. That's why I say, "act like a prostitute." Not every woman, or man, is comfortable with dirty language, or being really loud and noisy, or trying every position they can think of, and that should be okay. 

Examples: I'm extremely noisy during sex. Don't know how not to be. My husband? Nope. He gets into it and I know he enjoys it, but where I scream as loud as I can even when our neighbors can hear, he's more subdued. I like roleplay. No, I LOVE roleplay. My husband? He's not much of a fan. Acting isn't his thing, and while he can improvise fake first dates and come up with a fake identity and take on a false personality (and man does he do it so f----g well!), it's not something he gets into. I love pretending to be stripper/prostitute. Actually went and stood on a corner once in a s1utty outfit and a trench coat...he even called my cell and pretended to be "booking" me for the evening. Bonus, I even got paid.  My husband? WOULD NEVER DO IT. He'd never strip (not much of a dancer), and I doubt he'd ever play a male prostitute. It's just not in his nature, and there's only so much you can pretend until it feels overly fake for your spouse. I would work as a stripper and a prostitute because, deep down, I'm really a s1ut at heart. Don't let the Cinderella façade fool ya.  

Anyway, wordy response...but yeah. 



> Some seem to have gotten the gist of the point being made: that a genuine expression of desire/affection is, generally speaking, more effective than an expression that "duty sex" might be available if the HD partner is amenable. And I can agree with that. Such an expression of genuine desire can take many forms, but the key is that it *is* genuine.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


And that is where my issue is. It's not that a genuine form of desire is needed, it's what constitutes a genuine form of desire. No one spouse gets to dictate what is and isn't genuine desire to the other. "Honey, wanna have sex?" can be very genuine without any sexual frills and glitter. That said, "I guess we can..." in response to a sexual move, definitely not interest. "Wanna have sex?" said in a clearly disinterested tone, definitely not genuine interest. But the initiation doesn't have to include lingerie and hooker heals, nor does the statement need the words fvck, c0ck, d1ck or p-ssy to be genuine interest.


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

LuvIsTuff said:


> I don't buy the "I can't". Sorry. I coach basketball for a living and I don't allow the words "I can't" from my players. "Can't" is a 4 letter word in my world, and a cop out with something you're actually capable of doing.


Depending on how you're raised, "can't" may absolutely be completely accurate. I have a friend, very innocent, never curses, grew up in a sheltered family...the idea of her even mouthing the "f" word is unfathomable. 

People can not be placed into boxes. We are all unique, and while some sheltered men and women outgrow, for lack of a better word, their more conservative upbringing (like yours truly here), others don't. And they shouldn't be made to feel as if they're sexually defective because of that.


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## staarz21 (Feb 6, 2013)

LuvIsTuff said:


> "That's not my style"? Really? Buying roses isn't my style. Making a kick ass meal, from scratch, isn't my style. Showing up to my wife's office with a card and a pack of Hershey kisses isn't my style. But guess what, I DO IT BECAUSE SHE LIKES IT! Not my style?!


Good for you? 

If it's not your style, your wife should KNOW that and not expect it. It's not my H's style to take me on lavish vacations. I don't expect him to either. It's not my H's style to show up and surprise me in the middle of the day with flowers...so I don't expect him to. If I did expect him to - I would end up being pretty disappointed. 

If it's not her style to demand her H have sex with her - then it's not her style and her H should not expect her to do that every time.


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## Mr. Nail (Apr 26, 2011)

Heck with that, tonight I'm going to say, "Honey would you like a cup of tea?"


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## hambone (Mar 30, 2013)

Lila said:


> Seriously....I think if you learned to manage your expectations you'd find yourself in a much happier place.


WOW... that's like a "get out of jail free" card.

Wife says, "Honey.. can you PLEASE take out the trash" .. She just needs to learn to manage her expectations!

"honey, can you please go get a job and make some money for a change".. She needs to learn to manage her expectations.!

"Honey, could you please just lift one finger to help arround the house once in a while?" Needs to learn to manage her expectations!



WOW Lila... THANKS!!! You have given me a whole new perspective on life... I don't have to do SQUAT!!! She just needs to learn to manage her expectations!!!


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## lifeistooshort (Mar 17, 2013)

hambone said:


> WOW... that's like a "get out of jail free" card.
> 
> Wife says, "Honey.. can you PLEASE take out the trash" .. She just needs to learn to manage her expectations!
> 
> ...



Extreme examples. There is a difference between "honey would you do your part in the house" and "honey would you do a better job with the dishes so they live up to my expectations". See?

"Honey, I'd like to have sex once in a while" is one thing. "Honey, the sex isn't up to my expectation" is a little dicier. Do the things you do around the house have to measure up to her expectation? Does your job need to measure up to her expectations? You'd likely be upset if this was the case, and with good reason. The fact that one can expect a partner that contributes and has sex with them is one thing, but when you start with whether something is up to one's expectation things get a little fuzzier. Do you feel that the things you do to contribute at work and around the house need to measure up to your wife's expectation, or is it enough that you do them?


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

lifeistooshort said:


> Extreme examples. There is a difference between "honey would you do your part in the house" and "honey would you do a better job with the dishes so they live up to my expectations". See?
> 
> "Honey, I'd like to have sex once in a while" is one thing. "Honey, the sex isn't up to my expectation" is a little dicier. Do the things you do around the house have to measure up to her expectation? Does your job need to measure up to her expectations? You'd likely be upset if this was the case, and with good reason. The fact that one can expect a partner that contributes and has sex with them is one thing, but when you start with whether something is up to one's expectation things get a little fuzzier. Do you feel that the things you do to contribute at work and around the need to measure up to your wife's expectation, or is it enough that you do them?



Very well said.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

hambone said:


> WOW... that's like a "get out of jail free" card.
> 
> Wife says, "Honey.. can you PLEASE take out the trash" .. She just needs to learn to manage her expectations!
> 
> ...


This is ridicules.

Why is it necessary for a woman to use the F word when she wants sex?


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

LuvIsTuff said:


> I don't buy the "I can't". Sorry. I coach basketball for a living and I don't allow the words "I can't" from my players. "Can't" is a 4 letter word in my world, and a cop out with something you're actually capable of doing.


Can you please explain why you seem to think that Lila has to use the F word to let her husband know when she wants sex?


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## Fozzy (Jul 20, 2013)

Mr. Nail said:


> Heck with that, tonight I'm going to say, "Honey would you like a cup of tea?"


I see what you did there


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## hambone (Mar 30, 2013)

Lila said:


> I understand you're being facetious but read my other posts on this thread (and luvtuff threads) before you pass judgement on my comments.


No,,, I'm serious.

If I'm not meeting her expectations. she just needs to manage her expectations better.

I REALLY appreciate the new perspective.


If I wasn't retired, I'd try this approach at work. Supervisor comes by, want's to know why I haven't done anything... "Dude... learn to manage your expectations!!!"


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## hambone (Mar 30, 2013)

EleGirl said:


> This is ridicules.
> 
> Why is it necessary for a woman to use the F word when she wants sex?


You're cherry picking... Ignoring the over all principle.


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

And what is the overall principle, hambone?


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

hambone said:


> You're cherry picking... Ignoring the over all principle.


No I am not ignoring the over all principle. The principle here is that the OP is telling women that women need to initiate sex in a way that expresses desire and passion for their spouse.

Lila said that she would not use the F word but she has her own way of initiating that expresses her desire/passion. She has a good sex life.

But she's is getting hell because she will not use the F word. 

Her husband has not asked her to use the F word. So why are others on this forum giving her a hard time for expressing her desire/passion when initiating in a way that works for her and her husband?


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## LuvIsTuff (Feb 20, 2015)

EleGirl said:


> LuvIsTuff said:
> 
> 
> > I don't buy the "I can't". Sorry. I coach basketball for a living and I don't allow the words "I can't" from my players. "Can't" is a 4 letter word in my world, and a cop out with something you're actually capable of doing.
> ...


Have you read the thread? It has nothing to do with what Lila or any other woman wants. Its about what the man wishes his woman/wife would say to him.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

UMP said:


> Don't ever, from now till death do us part, ever initiate sex with your husband by using a question.
> Example : "Honey, do you want to have sex tonight?" (Bad, very Bad!)
> 
> Please change the question into a statement of desire.
> ...


Why do you think you need to ask women who are you not married to, to do this? (show passion and desire to for our husbands/SO's.. not necessary use the sentence you think we need to be using.)

Why do you assume that we women need this lesson from you?

It pretty presumptuous of you to assume that we do not already know this and do not already do this.

Sure, maybe you wife does not. Maybe some wives do not. But why assume that women need to be told this.


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## happy as a clam (Jan 5, 2014)

UMP said:


> Please change the question into a statement of desire.
> Example: "Honey, I want to f$ck you tonight." (Good, very Good!)


I just start undressing him. No need for words ... Less confusion that way!

:lol:
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

LuvIsTuff said:


> Have you read the thread? It has nothing to do with what Lila or any other woman wants. Its about what the man wishes his woman/wife would say to him.


Why do you assume that Lila's husband, or any other woman's husband, what his wife to say: "Honey, I want to f$ck you tonight."

Using Lila as an example. She and her husband have apparently worked out what works for them. They have a good passionate sex life. So exactly why does she have to do what you and the OP are telling her to do?


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

This thread is giving me a headache. I think, when my husband gets home, I'll ask him if he wants to have sex. Without the use of expletives or vulgar language, because neither are necessary to communicate desire.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

WandaJ said:


> It is not that simple if woman is the one who wants it more often?


Exactly. Especially if she is rejected a lot. So she may just ask to feel out whether he's going to say No again or not...


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## Thundarr (Jul 4, 2012)

UMP you specified what you want to hear from your wife. That's fine because it's how you feel but it's not associated with only men or with all men. For example, not only do I not mind being the initiator but I wouldn't like it to be any other way. It's nice my wife is generally receptive and it's nice she lets me be the primary initiator and it's even more nice that she probably knows that that's what works for us. She doesn't need to throw the f-bomb at me when she's in the mood.


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## LuvIsTuff (Feb 20, 2015)

EleGirl said:


> LuvIsTuff said:
> 
> 
> > Have you read the thread? It has nothing to do with what Lila or any other woman wants. Its about what the man wishes his woman/wife would say to him.
> ...


You, Lila, and the others that are getting defensive about my comments are taking them far too literal. It's all purely hypothetical. The OP simply said that he'd like his wife at the very least to show some effort and desire. The issue in question is whether or not a spouse should be willing to step out of his/her comfort zone if they know it will be pleasing to their spouse. 

Personally, I don't buy the idea that you shouldn't ask or want your spouse to do things that don't come naturally for them. Being affectionate never came natural for me. Affection was never modeled to me by my parents and I thought it was normal to not show affection. After years of my wife making a big deal about it, I finally started stepping out of my comfort zone and eventually became naturally affectionate. It's my norm now. Had my wife just let me be me, she'd still be starved of her most basic need. I could have said "I can't". She's probably glad I didn't.


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## Marriedwithdogs (Jan 29, 2015)

Geesh, glad my hubby isn't hung up on how it's asked or "stated". If I say "want some" he sprints towards me like a kid in a candy store!


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

LuvIsTuff said:


> You, Lila, and the others that are getting defensive about my comments are taking them far too literal.


I'm not defensive. I have no reason to defend myself against anything here. 

You are writing on the internet. We cannot see your body language. Your words will be taken literally. There is no indication that you really did not mean what you said, that it was humor, or anything else but exactly what you wrote.



LuvIsTuff said:


> It's all purely hypothetical. The OP simply said that he'd like his wife at the very least to show some effort and desire. The issue in question is whether or not a spouse should be willing to step out of his/her comfort zone if they know it will be pleasing to their spouse.


I'm sorry but I did not get the secret decoder ring that translated the OP to what you think it said. The UMP did not say anything about his wife in the OP. The title of the thread is * “Ladies, please do me this one favor:” * 
And here is the OP.. not a word about his wife… it’s him lecturing all us women. Why I’m not sure. :scratchhead:


UMP said:


> Don't ever, from now till death do us part, ever initiate sex with your husband by using a question.
> Example : "Honey, do you want to have sex tonight?" (Bad, very Bad!)
> 
> Please change the question into a statement of desire.
> ...


Let's say for a minute that the OP is talking about stepping out of one's comfort zone. Why does he (and you) think that we women need such a lecture?



LuvIsTuff said:


> Personally, I don't buy the idea that you shouldn't ask or want your spouse to do things that don't come naturally for them. Being affectionate never came natural for me. Affection was never modeled to me by my parents and I thought it was normal to not show affection. After years of my wife making a big deal about it, I finally started stepping out of my comfort zone and eventually became naturally affectionate. It's my norm now. Had my wife just let me be me, she'd still be starved of her most basic need. I could have said "I can't". She's probably glad I didn't.


This is what the books “His Needs, Her Needs” and “Love Busters” is about. You did read them, or did you? They are about a couple exploring their needs and how to fill them. And then each filling each other’s needs. 

However, the general idea of getting out of your comfort zone to meet your spouse’s needs is not the subject of this thread. 

The subject of this thread is to lecture women to show desire and passion for our spouse. .. the OP gave a sample that some people said does not fit their lives for different reasons. 

Lila & CreativeWriter because they have good, passionate sex lives. They are just fine. They do not need to do what the OP wants them to do. They need to do what their husband wants them to do.

Some others objected to it because they have husbands who withhold sex. Their husbands would not be moved to have sex with them a lot of the time no matter how they initiated. So UMP’s ‘advice’ would not work for them. 

If you want to talk about the general idea of meeting your spouse’s needs, then start a thread on the topic. I’m sure that there will be plenty of people who will discuss the topic.


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## LuvIsTuff (Feb 20, 2015)

EleGirl said:


> This is what the books ?His Needs, Her Needs? and ?Love Busters? is about. You did read them, or did you? They are about a couple exploring their needs and how to fill them. And then each filling each other?s needs.


I did actually. I replied directly to you in my thread MWSTHLIIM,S


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

LuvIsTuff said:


> I did actually. I replied directly to you in my thread MWSTHLIIM,S


I just saw that.. and posted.


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## Stuckinrut (Feb 24, 2013)

When the odd time my wife wants to give me sex she asks every time " do you want to have a quick session I got 2 min?" I always reply" YES but again you don't have to ask just start I am ready whenever you are! " but she never does. The whole time i am thinking "why didnt you quit looking at computer 20 min ago so we could have real sex like a happily married couple does and enjoy each other.

If I try to start something usually start with back rub+leg rub and then try get under the tank top and shorts she wears to bed I immediately get " HEY GET OUT OF THERE WHAT ARE YOU DOING" (I AM THINKING WHAT THE H*LL DOES IT LOOK LIKE)followed by a slap to the arm or a good nudge at this point I know its another failed attempt to help our relationship. 

So yes I will take her asking it doesn't happen that often but I would kill for a "I want to scr*w now! Or just as good no talking her just unzipping my pants and I will get the message.


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## TheCuriousWife (Jan 28, 2013)

UMP said:


> Don't ever, from now till death do us part, ever initiate sex with your husband by using a question.
> Example : "Honey, do you want to have sex tonight?" (Bad, very Bad!)
> 
> Please change the question into a statement of desire.
> ...


This isn't just for ladies.

That is my husband's only way to initiate.


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## Mr. Nail (Apr 26, 2011)

Hmm the thread has wandered and branched. I would say it was successful if it hadn't been for the "you must say the certain word or he won't get turned on theory." Honestly I think the original objector has no problem with the word as she says it a later time in the interaction. What the man was asking for was confidence and assertiveness. That is not an unusual request. 

Onward. Is it better to ask or declare. We are being taught, for safety's sake to ask, and ask again. But the romantic in us knows that this in not the way to light the fire. thus my tea comment. 

Part of the archaic double standard that so many of us are suffering the effects of is this notion that any woman who admits that she wants sex must be (struggling for the right word here) lets just say bad. On the other hand if she asks the man if he is interested, then she can hide her desire by focusing the topic on his. But the history and the wording tend to leave the man thinking Pity sex, which we are being trained to reject, and is much less attractive. Now if we (men) analyze it long enough we could see through the layers and properly interpret "would you like to have sex?" as "Hey stud, I want some". but we just aren't that fast and the moment is gone.

Onward some more. Expectations. My favorite joke was that my secret to a long lasting marriage was low expectations. The first three years of our marriage I forgot her birthday. Now she's ecstatic any time I remember valentines. While there may be some truth to that it is just mean and I did not do it on purpose. Women are taught never to do anything they don't want to do, aren't comfortable with, might be painful etc.. There are good safety reasons to teach this but, is it really the only path. Is it ok to explore your fantasies? Is it ok to push the envelope? I mean for Pete's sake you wax. Someone had to be the first to boil up a giant thistle and eat the first artichoke. All this thread was really asking for was for people to own and express their desires clearly. BTW it takes me up to 3 false starts to make a decent request lately so I need this advice as much as anyone. 

For the record the F word is not used in our house. But I do know people who simply can not say or hear the right emotion without that word. I did not like the first 3 minutes of four weddings and a funeral.
MN


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## UMP (Dec 23, 2014)

Lila said:


> LOL. I get that.
> 
> 
> 
> I don't know UMP. My H and I have a pretty good sex life but I can't remember ever telling him "Honey, I want to F*** you tonight". That's just not my style and I consider myself a passionate lover. I might walk around singing "Let's get it on", but definitely not using the F*** word. That one's strictly reserved to express myself during


Ok. I get that.
However, if you want to get him up faster and harder, and even MORE passionate, try it. You'll be glad you did!


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## UMP (Dec 23, 2014)

Thundarr said:


> UMP you specified what you want to hear from your wife. That's fine because it's how you feel but it's not associated with only men or with all men. For example, not only do I not mind being the initiator but I wouldn't like it to be any other way. It's nice my wife is generally receptive and it's nice she lets me be the primary initiator and it's even more nice that she probably knows that that's what works for us. She doesn't need to throw the f-bomb at me when she's in the mood.


That's great. No F bomb needed. If your wife came up to you and said, "honey, I need/want your willie nelson inside me tonight"
I'm certain you would enjoy that.


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## UMP (Dec 23, 2014)

intheory said:


> A little off-topic, sorry,
> 
> Anything you attempt in sex, without having real desire to do it; isn't going to turn out so well.
> 
> No matter what words you say; it's the desire that's behind them which makes all the difference.


Not really off topic at all. I agree. What better way to initiate with real desire by asking with a statement of desire vs. a question.


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## WandaJ (Aug 5, 2014)

LuvIsTuff said:


> I don't buy the "I can't". Sorry. I coach basketball for a living and I don't allow the words "I can't" from my players. "Can't" is a 4 letter word in my world, and a cop out with something you're actually capable of doing.


but they all are basketball players. You would get me on your team and suddenly you would see "I can't" in action with my 5'3 height and no desire to kill my body to achieve something.

But it does not mean I don't excercise, I just don't do basketball.


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## LuvIsTuff (Feb 20, 2015)

UMP said:


> Not really off topic at all. I agree. What better way to initiate with real desire by asking with a statement of desire vs. a question.


Some people just don't get what you're saying. Seems straight forward to me. I'm on board.... Just looking for some assertiveness, a display of desire, and a willingness to do whatever a man likes in order to make the event more passionate.


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## UMP (Dec 23, 2014)

Mr. Nail said:


> All this thread was really asking for was for people to own and express their desires clearly.


Exactly !!
I think a little effort from the LD side to the HD side, in this regard, would go a LONG way.


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## UMP (Dec 23, 2014)

LuvIsTuff said:


> Some people just don't get what you're saying. Seems straight forward to me. I'm on board.... Just looking for some assertiveness, a display of desire, and a willingness to do whatever a man likes in order to make the event more passionate.


I honestly cannot remember the last time my wife asked me for sex by using a statement rather than a question. I think this is just a very small symptom of a deeper problem with LD folks. My wife in particular has deep seeded "good girl" issues. If our family is watching tv (we have older kids 21,18,16) and a sex scene comes on, she reaches for the fast forward button as if nuclear waste just dropped on our front door.
For my wife, it is SUPREMELY difficult to use a statement of desire to initiate sex with me.

I find that quite sad and repressed.


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## UMP (Dec 23, 2014)

Lila said:


> Thanks for the suggestion UMP, but I think I'm going to stick with what works for me. Dirty talk is just not in my repertoire and probably won't ever be. Luckily, a simple "Honey, I'm horny" is all H needs to get going. Different strokes for different folks.


It does not have to be "dirty" at all.
A simple "I really want you tonight"
"I want to feel you inside me tonight"
"Come up to be bed early, and showered, I want to show you something you might like."
"I want your (insert code word for p$nis) tonight"

All this will work just fine. "Dirty" is beside the point. Clearly expressing intent and desire is the point.


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## jorgegene (May 26, 2012)

I think it depends on who it comes from (the question I mean).

My own wife is high drive. If she phrased the question that way
"honey do you want to have sex?" I would know she meant it and meant it with vigor. It would be sexy to me and I would would jump on it.

But I know what you mean. Coming from a LD person and said in a 'blah' sort of way, it would sound like duty sex.


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## UMP (Dec 23, 2014)

jorgegene said:


> I think it depends on who it comes from (the question I mean).
> 
> My own wife is high drive. If she phrased the question that way
> "honey do you want to have sex?" I would know she meant it and meant it with vigor. It would be sexy to me and I would would jump on it.
> ...


To me, these kind of LD problems need to be addressed in small steps. I cannot expect my LD wife to all of a sudden come to the front door salivating and ripping my clothes off.
However, asking her to change a question to a simple statement can be done and starts you in the right direction.
Baby steps.


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## richardsharpe (Jul 8, 2014)

Good evenign all

"would you like to get to be"
"sorry, I'm too tired tonight"

"I really want you now"
"sorry I'm too tired tonight"

"I'd like to Fck you right now".
"{annoyed noise}, I'm too tired tonight"

"How about a long backrub and some cuddling"
"The backrub sounds great, but I'm too tired for anything else"

"How about going for a walk to the lake (a few miles away)"
"Sure, let me get my shoes".


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

UMP said:


> I honestly cannot remember the last time my wife asked me for sex by using a statement rather than a question. I think this is just a very small symptom of a deeper problem with LD folks. My wife in particular has deep seeded "good girl" issues. If our family is watching tv (we have older kids 21,18,16) and a sex scene comes on, she reaches for the fast forward button as if nuclear waste just dropped on our front door.
> For my wife, it is SUPREMELY difficult to use a statement of desire to initiate sex with me.
> 
> I find that quite sad and repressed.


Why do you think that all women are like your wife?

If you want her to do things differently then you need to talk to her. We women on TAM have nothing to do with your wife.


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## LuvIsTuff (Feb 20, 2015)

UMP said:


> Exactly !!
> I think a little effort from the LD side to the HD side, in this regard, would go a LONG way.


It's funny how all the men totally get this, but the women are pushing back. LOL  It must be nice to have a sex life that you're completely content with.....


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## lifeistooshort (Mar 17, 2013)

richardsharpe said:


> Good evenign all
> 
> "would you like to get to be"
> "sorry, I'm too tired tonight"
> ...




Well in all fairness sex takes a lot more out of me then walking a few miles.

At least if it's good it does


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

UMP said:


> Exactly !!
> 
> I think a little effort from the LD side to the HD side, in this regard, would go a LONG way.





LuvIsTuff said:


> It's funny how all the men totally get this, but the women are pushing back. LOL  It must be nice to have a sex life that you're completely content with.....


You are wrong here. The women get that UMP is saying that women (all women) need to be more passionate when approaching their spouse for sex. What you and UMP do not get is that most of the women on TAM are not LD. So he's and you are talking to women who do not act like his wife or your wife.

While some of the women here might not use the f-bomb, we all have ways of expressing our passion and desire. 

You and UMP are making a fatal mistake in assuming that all women are LD and passionless. It's a fatal flaw because it's part of the reason that people tolerate LD and withholding wives... because of the acceptance of the myth that women tend to be LD and not get sexuality.

You keep trying tell us women that we haven't a clue. Believe me we have a clue. I know the women who are posting on this thread pretty well. They have a clue. I have a clue. Who you are talking to the wrong women.


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## jorgegene (May 26, 2012)

richardsharpe said:


> Good evenign all
> 
> "would you like to get to be"
> "sorry, I'm too tired tonight"
> ...


yah, the excuses can be hilarious.


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## Plan 9 from OS (Jul 13, 2012)

"I suppose if you really want it, we can have sex today". Works for me...:rofl:

Seriously though, when my wife initiates she only says 2 words: "You ready?" Normally we're laying in bed together and she'll either turn over with a smile on her face or jump on top of me. So phrasing it in the form of a question is perfectly fine for me. In reality the bottom line is context. You should know your spouse well enough for when he/she is showing desire or not. So the verbal communication could be anything - it's the nonverbal communication that's really important.


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## jorgegene (May 26, 2012)

my wife is very HD, but she's shy when it comes to sex. She hardly ever asks outright. She uses physical measures to let me know, like rubbing me. Or 'oooh honey, he's getting big, I think he wants to come out to play' I wish she would just tell me like the OP says when she wants it.

Often recently, she'll tell me "I wanted to jump on you last night but you looked so tired". I'm trying to tell her 'no, please tell me when you want it' But she's having trouble getting over her shyness. we need to work on that.


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## LuvIsTuff (Feb 20, 2015)

EleGirl said:


> You are wrong here. The women get that UMP is saying that women (all women) need to be more passionate when approaching their spouse for sex. What you and UMP do not get is that most of the women on TAM are not LD. So he's and you are talking to women who do not act like his wife or your wife.
> 
> While some of the women here might not use the f-bomb, we all have ways of expressing our passion and desire.
> 
> ...


For the love of God, if he's not talking to you then he's not talking to you. He's specifically talking about wishing his wife would show desire rather than be "ho-hum, lets get this over with". If you show desire in ANY way, and your husband is content with it, then good on you... He's not addressing you.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

LuvIsTuff said:


> For the love of God, if he's not talking to you then he's not talking to you. He's specifically talking about wishing his wife would show desire rather than be "ho-hum, lets get this over with". If you show desire in ANY way, and your husband is content with it, then good on you... He's not addressing you.


No, he is talking to the women on TAM.

If he was talking to his wife, he would have mentioned that he is talking to his wife.

So what you are saying is that he is not talking to all the women who you are saying do not get it on TAM. So why are you arguing with the women who he's not talking to?

Further, if he wants to talk about what he wants his wife to do, he needs to word his posts more clearly. And he needs to tell it to his wife not other women who have nothing to do with his problems with his wife.


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## UMP (Dec 23, 2014)

EleGirl said:


> You and UMP are making a fatal mistake in assuming that all women are LD and passionless.


That is ABSOLUTELY not true. I don't believe that for a second.

I do believe that my wife is LD.
I also believe their are LD women lurking on TAM that do not post, but read with intrigue. If I help only ONE LD women or spark something in their brains to better understand their HD husbands, I feel the post is worthwhile.

I will change (If able) my op to read, "If you are an HD women, please do not read further" (done, with a twist )


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

UMP said:


> That is ABSOLUTELY not true. I don't believe that for a second.
> 
> I do believe that my wife is LD.
> I also believe their are LD women lurking on TAM that do not post, but read with intrigue. If I help only ONE LD women or spark something in their brains to better understand their HD husbands, I feel the post is worthwhile.
> ...


That's good, let people know who you are taking to.


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## WandaJ (Aug 5, 2014)

Ladies, don't make a mountain out of the mole. The guy shared his fantasy. Just becasue he did not add all the politicaly correct clauses like "if this is yor style, if you are LD, if that or that" doesn't mean he says all women must do it. 

He shared the fanstasy quite common for men, nothing wrong with it. If it was Eureka moment for some women here that's great. If it does not apply to you, just move forward. He wasn't disrespectful or anything like this, more desparate. The guy vented his feelings here, that's all.


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## Middle of Everything (Feb 19, 2012)

Awesome. Another thread on TAM that quickly turns into 7-10 pages of "us vs. them".


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## UMP (Dec 23, 2014)

EleGirl said:


> That's good, let people know who you are taking to.


The other problem I have, and probably many of the HD men on TAM is that my only REAL reference point is my ONE wife.
If I had a haram of 43 wives, I could have a more broad view of women in a sexual setting.

Maybe, in the interest of science, my wife could allow me to move to another country where polygamy is legal and round up 10 or 20 wives. I think, again, in the interest of science I should have as many as possible. I'll go with 50 as a round number.
Are there any government programs for this sort of thing?
I would like to apply.

I'll call it the "Masters and Willie Johnson Research Project."
Unfortunately, I don't believe I would physically survive the 'honeymoon" faze of the project.

Oh...I almost forgot, I need permission from my current wife


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

UMP said:


> The other problem I have, and probably many of the HD men on TAM is that my only REAL reference point is my ONE wife.
> 
> If I had a haram of 43 wives, I could have a more broad view of women in a sexual setting.
> 
> ...


:rofl:

Most people here only have a reference of one. Sometimes more if they have been in more than one marriage or long-term relationship.

If I took my 2 marriages as a way to judge all men, I'd say that all men bait and switch. All men pretend to be high drive. Then after being married for 2-4 years and figure they have her trapped, then end all sex. I mean all sex. And that they will go years 5 years, 7 years refusing sex at all.

Sure the wife could say "Honey, I want to f$ck you tonight." But what's he going to do? He's not going to respond as you would. He's going to tell her that she's disgusting or make some stupid excuse.

Keep in mind that men are as likely to make a marriage sexless as women are. It's just women who do this.

But you see, I get that not all men are like that. It would not take me having a harem of men to know this. Though it is an idea.


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## LuvIsTuff (Feb 20, 2015)

Lila said:


> Incorrect. Ump's OP clearly states:
> 
> *Ladies, please do me this one favor:*
> 
> ...


Just read between the lines. Seriously....:scratchhead:


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## LuvIsTuff (Feb 20, 2015)

UMP said:


> That is ABSOLUTELY not true. I don't believe that for a second.
> 
> I do believe that my wife is LD.
> I also believe their are LD women lurking on TAM that do not post, but read with intrigue. If I help only ONE LD women or spark something in their brains to better understand their HD husbands, I feel the post is worthwhile.
> ...


I completely got it, UMP. No need to get so specific. It seems much more logical to assume you're only addressing the women who may relate to how your wife is than to assume you're actually telling every last woman on TAM to do what you said.


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## Thundarr (Jul 4, 2012)

WandaJ said:


> Ladies, don't make a mountain out of the mole. The guy shared his fantasy. Just becasue he did not add all the politicaly correct clauses like "if this is yor style, if you are LD, if that or that" doesn't mean he says all women must do it.
> 
> He shared the fanstasy quite common for men, nothing wrong with it. If it was Eureka moment for some women here that's great. If it does not apply to you, just move forward. He wasn't disrespectful or anything like this, more desparate. The guy vented his feelings here, that's all.


Thank you Wanda. I've been scratching my head as well wondering how this thread became so postured. I agree with your take on it.


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## UMP (Dec 23, 2014)

WandaJ said:


> Ladies, don't make a mountain out of the mole. The guy shared his fantasy. Just becasue he did not add all the politicaly correct clauses like "if this is yor style, if you are LD, if that or that" doesn't mean he says all women must do it.
> 
> He shared the fanstasy quite common for men, nothing wrong with it. If it was Eureka moment for some women here that's great. If it does not apply to you, just move forward. He wasn't disrespectful or anything like this, more desparate. The guy vented his feelings here, that's all.


WandaJ, 
If we could harmlessly duplicate whatever part of YOUR HD brain that is accessed to initiate, desire and enjoy sex into our LD wifes brain, every HD man with an LD wife on TAM would empty their bank accounts to pay for this procedure before you could say one word.

Maybe I'm on to something. I'm calling Bill Gates, NOW.


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## LuvIsTuff (Feb 20, 2015)

WandaJ said:


> Ladies, don't make a mountain out of the mole. The guy shared his fantasy. Just becasue he did not add all the politicaly correct clauses like "if this is yor style, if you are LD, if that or that" doesn't mean he says all women must do it.
> 
> He shared the fanstasy quite common for men, nothing wrong with it. If it was Eureka moment for some women here that's great. If it does not apply to you, just move forward. He wasn't disrespectful or anything like this, more desparate. The guy vented his feelings here, that's all.


FINALLY!!! Thank you, WandaJ!!:lol::smthumbup:


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## WandaJ (Aug 5, 2014)

EleGirl said:


> :rofl:
> 
> Most people here only have a reference of one. Sometimes more if they have been in more than one marriage or long-term relationship.
> 
> ...


Elle, not all post are directed at you. We cannot make every post about everybody. Sometimes we just have to relax and watch others with different experiences to share with us. If it involves a little humor once in a while, why not? 

Frankly, I believe that there are more LD women on TAM than we realize. But they do not post, as the HD crown is too loud. Maybe we need to give them more acceptance, so we all learn soemthing. 

you are HD, I am, others are. But there are many that are not.


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## UMP (Dec 23, 2014)

EleGirl said:


> :rofl:
> 
> Most people here only have a reference of one. Sometimes more if they have been in more than one marriage or long-term relationship.
> 
> ...


Sometimes, in desperation, you feel all alone and helpless, wanting to scream at the world, kind of like Charleton Heston in "Soilent Green" "SOILENT GREEN IS PEOPLE FOOD"

In retrospect, I was probably just talking to MY wife. If only she could hear me.


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## Mr. Nail (Apr 26, 2011)

Thank you Richard, 
I've been waiting for the sample conversation section of this thread.
Here is my misguided offering.

Honey, are you interested in sex tonight?
Yes , please, I would love that.
Did you have anyone in mind for that?

. . . .


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## UMP (Dec 23, 2014)

staarz21 said:


> I think trying to push someone out of their comfort zone is going to make them uncomfortable with you. They are going to think that no matter what they do or try, it will never be enough and you're always going to want more. They weren't comfortable doing it the first time - but you're going to want it almost every time.
> 
> Now, I can't remember if it was UMP or LuvIsTough that said this but one said that their wife has "good girl" issues. That's not her issue, it's yours. If you weren't satisfied with the kind of sex she can give you, then why proceed to marry her? If you didn't find out until after marriage, then why stay for however many years you have stayed? I don't know your story in particular because I don't have that kind of time to go back and research...
> 
> ...


Actually, I understand this completely and I agree. However, 23 years in and add a million other reasons, I don't want a divorce.

Now, I can understand, COMPLETELY that I should not EXPECT my "reserved wife" to change and do such and such or act in such and such way.

HOWEVER, how, may I ask, am I supposed to simply make these desires vanish from my mind? (remember, no divorce)
It would be analogous to telling a lion that he now lives in a vegan land and he is no longer able to eat meat.

The only TRUE way I can think of is castration, which is not an option I want to entertain.

That's the type of desperation I'm talking about. 
"Between a rock and a hard place" comes to mind.

However, I have come to the conclusion or illusion (depending on your viewpoint) that miracles do happen. I cannot and will not live the rest of my life without hope. My hope endures.


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

LuvIsTuff said:


> It's funny how all the men totally get this, but the women are pushing back. LOL  It must be nice to have a sex life that you're completely content with.....


Umm...there have been men who've posted who also took an issue with the OP. Just so ya know. 

Also, we're not pushing against the idea of expressing sexual desire, we're pushing back at the idea that UMP's preference is the only acceptable form of sexual expression. 

My husband and I have an extremely active, healthy, loving sex life and it's not uncommon for me to look at my husband while he's playing his bass or playing a video game, or stretching on the floor and say, "I think I wanna make out" in a completely monotone voice. He knows that I want it, and want it badly. He'll drop what he's doing, give me his goofy "I'm totally gonna have sex with that beautiful woman!" grin that I love, and bam! Naked. Blow job. PIV on the couch. Laugh because my legs cramped. Move to the bedroom. Noisy, loud, rough sex. Gentle sex. Totally getting f----d.

I doubt that my husband would change anything about that. And nor would I. We have our own rhythm, our own sexual desire and expression. He sees me stare at his naked body whenever he gets out of the shower, he gropes me constantly, I grope him constantly. Desire doesn't have to be expressed in words at all. It can be expressed in looks, in touches, in body language. In fact, for me it heightens my arousal to express desire in every way but words...sure, it's great to hear my husband whisper in my ear what he thinks and feels, but it's also great to just close my eyes and feel his hands on my body, and listen to the sound of his breathing, the moans of pleasure he makes. No words needed, and desire is overwhelmingly clear.


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

UMP said:


> It does not have to be "dirty" at all.
> A simple "I really want you tonight"
> "I want to feel you inside me tonight"
> "Come up to be bed early, and showered, I want to show you something you might like."
> ...


One does not need to speak to "clearly express intent and desire".


----------



## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

LuvIsTuff said:


> For the love of God, if he's not talking to you then he's not talking to you. He's specifically talking about wishing his wife would show desire rather than be "ho-hum, lets get this over with". If you show desire in ANY way, and your husband is content with it, then good on you... He's not addressing you.


If he was talking to his wife, then he should have addressed the thread to her. Because he addressed the thread to the "ladies" of TAM. We came and read what he had to say, and now we have responded. But he absolutely WAS talking to us. 

And he didn't say, "Ladies of TAM who are LD and have a hard time expressing desire..." He assumed that, because we're women me must all, by default, be low drive, and therefore must need a man to tell us "how it's done."


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

LuvIsTuff said:


> UMP said:
> 
> 
> > Exactly !!
> ...


Yes, yes it is. More than content. It freaking ROCKS!!


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## Anon1111 (May 29, 2013)

I'm going to make a generalization about men. It doesn't apply to all men, which is why it is a generalization.

If the average man is given a choice between his wife who is perfectly buttoned down, demure and never says or does anything sl-tty, and

A clone of his wife who is exactly the same in all aspects except that she acts like an insatiable sl-t toward him (and him only), doing and saying the nastiest sh-t imagineable and giving every indication that she cannot get enough of it,

THEN

The average man is going to choose the clone 100 out of 100 times and not only that would gladly cut off a couple of fingers and toes to make the trade.


----------



## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

richardsharpe said:


> Good evenign all
> 
> "would you like to get to be"
> "sorry, I'm too tired tonight"
> ...


:rofl: I've had one of those too.

Me: Do you want to have sex?
Him: My back hurts.

Me: I really want to to fck me right now
Him: My leg feels numb.

Me: I can't wait for yu to do me when we get home.
Him: (Less than excited response).

Him: Let's give each other massges.
Massage proceeds...
Then he rolls over. WTF?

Me: Do you wanna come in? (Sexy eye bat)
Him: I need to go home and do XYZ.

Always tired, sleepy, hurting. Only could have sex in afternoon on a certain day, never while on period, hardly ever went down on me (1 out of every 20-30 times), etc. Said he did not enjoy morning sex and always when he wanted it. 

Coming from my relationship prior where X wanted to go anytime/anywhere and lived between my legs for oral, super disheartening.

Eventually I just started not asking or being sexual because one can only be rejected so many times before you realize they really just don't want to fck.


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

WandaJ said:


> Ladies, don't make a mountain out of the mole. The guy shared his fantasy. Just becasue he did not add all the politicaly correct clauses like "if this is yor style, if you are LD, if that or that" doesn't mean he says all women must do it.
> 
> He shared the fanstasy quite common for men, nothing wrong with it. If it was Eureka moment for some women here that's great. If it does not apply to you, just move forward. He wasn't disrespectful or anything like this, more desparate. The guy vented his feelings here, that's all.


I get he vented his feelings, but unfortunately his feelings are a part of a greater pool of feelings that feed the lie that women aren't as sexual as men. Unfortunately that mole hill has already been blown into a mountain because there are men who take their experience and apply it across the board of female sexuality, placing women in a box with a stereotype and wrapping it up with condescension. UMP wasn't condescending, but there are many who have been and, as a HD, very sexual wife, it doesn't sit well with me to have a stranger make blanket assumptions and statements that are indirectly directed at me that imply that, because I'm a woman, my husband must be sexually dissatisfied.


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## anonmd (Oct 23, 2014)

So, evidently it matters not whether it is an LD M or F. The same list of lameass excuses apply 

I remember having a conversation 20 years ago after an awesome session in which I committed to NEVER turn her down. And I never have. There was one time after 14 hours in the car where I was dog tired and I commented something along the lines of "I might have to turn you down if you want to". But that was as close as it ever came to a rejection from me. Doesn't work the other way around, it has not really been much of an effort to keep up my end of the promise





Jellybeans said:


> :rofl: I've had one of those too.
> 
> Me: Do you want to have sex?
> Him: My back hurts.
> ...


----------



## WandaJ (Aug 5, 2014)

Lila said:


> However, I do feel it is necessary to defend my position when I share differing experiences and am told they are wrong, or I'm instructed on how to 'correct' my approach, _which btw work perfectly well for me_, in order to agree with the original post.
> 
> I'm not making a mountain out of original post, but I do think that women should not feel like they are lacking simply because they don't initiate sex as instructed in the OP. My point is and has been, different strokes for different folks. If it works for you and your partner, then roll with it.


Hi Lila, and that's ok. Defending your position is part of the discussion. But sometimes we have to relax a little. For me there was montly desperation in UMP's post. He was basically saying " Goddamn woman, show some passion once in a while". Sometimes we can learn things from a little more abstract discussion. Let's not turn every other post into gender wars.

there are posters and post that are disrescpetful and put blanket negative statements on women. Those we need to call out. But this is not one of them.

Maybe it is just easier for me, because I am on the same side as UMP. We both getting our share of sex, and it is good, but we both want more adventure, and our spouses are just not into it.


----------



## WandaJ (Aug 5, 2014)

Created2Write said:


> UMP wasn't condescending, but there are many who have been and, as a HD, very sexual wife, it doesn't sit well with me to have a stranger make blanket assumptions and statements that are indirectly directed at me that imply that, because I'm a woman, my husband must be sexually dissatisfied.


I agree with you, but statistically there is more LD women than men. But if you come to TAM if you would think all women are HD, because we scream every time someone comments on LD women : "No, not me, don't you dare suggest it would be me". That's why we don't hear here much from LD women, we made them into bad guy, so they lurk, but do not write. 

And even among thos who are HD, many of us went through LD phases. I sure wasn't horny when I had toddler and infant at home, or when my marriage was living hell.

All I am saying let's give some breathing ground. I think we do not have to fight the fight that women like sex too anymore. But there those face that exactly issue in their marriages every day. (both genders)


----------



## richardsharpe (Jul 8, 2014)

Good evening jellybeans
I think it is difficult for people who have never had a LD partner to really imagine what it is like. 
There are LD women and men. I have no idea whether there are more LD men or women, but there are a significant number of both.



Jellybeans said:


> :rofl: I've had one of those too.
> 
> Me: Do you want to have sex?
> Him: My back hurts.
> ...


----------



## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Anon1111 said:


> I'm going to make a generalization about men. It doesn't apply to all men, which is why it is a generalization.
> 
> If the average man is given a choice between his wife who is perfectly buttoned down, demure and never says or does anything sl-tty, and
> 
> ...


I agree with this.

But why do men often seem to prefer to marry the button down woman and then complain that she's not like the clone? Of course not all men do this, but it seems that a lot do.


----------



## justamale51 (Mar 20, 2015)

UMP said:


> IF YOU ARE AN HD WOMAN, PLEASE DO NOT READ FURTHER.
> THIS POST MAY OR MAY NOT APPLY TO YOU. IF YOU ARE AN HD WOMAN AND READ FURTHER, YOU ARE READING AT YOUR OWN RISK AND MAY BECOME PISSED OFF. IF YOU HAVE READ THIS POST PRIOR TO ME POSTING THIS DISCLAIMER, I OFFER MY MOST SINCERE APOLOGIES. I MOST DEFINATELY BELIEVE THAT MOST OF THE WOMEN ON TAM ARE HD. IN FACT, IF I COULD, I WOULD INVITE EACH AND EVERY ONE OF YOU TO MY HOME TO HAVE A TALK WITH MY WIFE.
> 
> 
> ...


Sounds dirty and aggressive (on the woman's part).

A turn on for a guy!


----------



## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

WandaJ said:


> Elle, not all post are directed at you. We cannot make every post about everybody. Sometimes we just have to relax and watch others with different experiences to share with us. If it involves a little humor once in a while, why not?
> 
> Frankly, I believe that there are more LD women on TAM than we realize. But they do not post, as the HD crown is too loud. Maybe we need to give them more acceptance, so we all learn soemthing.
> 
> you are HD, I am, others are. But there are many that are not.


Let's see. We are on an open forum and most every one uses their own life experience to flesh out their points... but apparently I'm not allowed to? Got it :scratchhead:

I started posting on this thread because some of the male posters were grossly twisting what many of the female posters were saying. These posts were taking the false stance that see, women just do not get it.. women do not want to meet the needs of the men in their lives.

Sorry if it bothers you that I post just like very one else does.


----------



## TakenforGranted (Mar 17, 2015)

UMP said:


> IF YOU ARE AN HD WOMAN, PLEASE DO NOT READ FURTHER.
> THIS POST MAY OR MAY NOT APPLY TO YOU. IF YOU ARE AN HD WOMAN AND READ FURTHER, YOU ARE READING AT YOUR OWN RISK AND MAY BECOME PISSED OFF. IF YOU HAVE READ THIS POST PRIOR TO ME POSTING THIS DISCLAIMER, I OFFER MY MOST SINCERE APOLOGIES. I MOST DEFINATELY BELIEVE THAT MOST OF THE WOMEN ON TAM ARE HD. IN FACT, IF I COULD, I WOULD INVITE EACH AND EVERY ONE OF YOU TO MY HOME TO HAVE A TALK WITH MY WIFE.
> 
> 
> ...


Amen


----------



## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

WandaJ said:


> I agree with you, but statistically there is more LD women than men.


I doubt this. 



> But if you come to TAM if you would think all women are HD, because we scream every time someone comments on LD women : "No, not me, don't you dare suggest it would be me". That's why we don't hear here much from LD women, we made them into bad guy, so they lurk, but do not write.
> 
> And even among thos who are HD, many of us went through LD phases. I sure wasn't horny when I had toddler and infant at home, or when my marriage was living hell.
> 
> All I am saying let's give some breathing ground. I think we do not have to fight the fight that women like sex too anymore. But there those face that exactly issue in their marriages every day. (both genders)


I disagree. I think it's very necessary to fight that fight, and to do so consistently. Eventually we may just get to a place where neither gender is placed in a sexual stereotype...men who are LD won't be made to feel as if they are somehow less of a man because they don't want sex every day. HD women will actually be believed when they say they are HD (I don't know how many times I've had men on this forum say that I'm lying through my teeth when I say I'm HD. Or tell me that I'm some rare oddity, some freak of nature, for desiring sex as much as I do.) Maybe, if we fight the fight well enough and long enough, sexual individuality will be recognized and accepted.


----------



## WandaJ (Aug 5, 2014)

EleGirl said:


> Let's see. We are on an open forum and most every one uses their own life experience to flesh out their points... but apparently I'm not allowed to? Got it :scratchhead:
> 
> I started posting on this thread because some of the male posters were grossly twisting what many of the female posters were saying. These posts were taking the false stance that see, women just do not get it.. women do not want to meet the needs of the men in their lives.
> 
> Sorry if it bothers you that I post just like very one else does.


Thats the thing, I didn't really see much twisting on this thread. Everyone is welocme to post, but that bring risk of others disagreeing with you. I simply think you are taking this UMP's post way too seriously, and start arguing where there is really no argument.


----------



## justamale51 (Mar 20, 2015)

Faithful Wife said:


> Not all men have the same problems. Some husbands have a lower drive than their wives. I wish these "all men want this or that" ideas would go away. If we could caveat by saying "if your husband wants more sex than you do, then..." it would be better.


Generalisations tend to have a degree of truth in them...

While it's true that SOME women also complain of a lack of sex, the fact is that MOST men (in marriage situations) do!


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

justamale51 said:


> Generalisations tend to have a degree of truth in them...
> 
> While it's true that SOME women also complain of a lack of sex, the fact is that MOST men (in marriage situations) do!


LuvIsTuff and some of the other guys were twisting things that Lila and others were saying. Because of this Lila and other women were defending what they said and the those same posters continued to twist it.

My opinion differs from yours. That's ok.


----------



## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

justamale51 said:


> Generalisations tend to have a degree of truth in them...
> 
> While it's true that SOME women also complain of a lack of sex, the fact is that MOST men (in marriage situations) do!


Please show us the study that you have to back up your claim that MOST married men complain about not getting enough sex?

Generalizations are often false, perpetuated by untrue gossip. 

There is plenty of info out there backing up that men make a marriage sexless or near sexless as often as women do.


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## Anon1111 (May 29, 2013)

EleGirl said:


> I agree with this.
> 
> But why do men often seem to prefer to marry the button down woman and then complain that she's not like the clone? Of course not all men do this, but it seems that a lot do.


Generalizations:

The typical man wants to find a sweet, nice girl who is so into him that she transforms into a raging sl-t just for him. If she did that with everyone else it would not make him feel special.

The typical woman wants to find a bad boy who could f-ck any woman but reserves his commitment for her. If he would commit to just anybody or if he did not really have the option to f-ck lots of other women, then his commitment would not make her feel special.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Anon1111 said:


> Generalizations:
> 
> The typical man wants to find a sweet, nice girl who is so into him that she transforms into a raging sl-t just for him. If she did that with everyone else it would not make him feel special.


Which proves my point.



Anon1111 said:


> The *typical woman wants to find a bad boy who could f-ck any woman* but reserves his commitment for her. If he would commit to just anybody or if he did not really have the option to f-ck lots of other women, then his commitment would not make her feel special.


Yet another generalization.


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

The bad boy persona is overrated, overused. 

I'll keep my nice guy, thank you.


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## Anon1111 (May 29, 2013)

EleGirl said:


> Which proves my point.
> 
> 
> 
> Yet another generalization.


That's why I prefaced my post with "Generalization".

My point is that both men and women frequently have unrealistic expecations. They are all grounded in similar motivations though.


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## lifeistooshort (Mar 17, 2013)

I've always equated bad boy with d0uche bag. No thank you.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

lifeistooshort said:


> I've always equated bad boy with d0uche bag. No thank you.


:iagree: same here... who wants to have to deal with that?


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## Anon1111 (May 29, 2013)

Created2Write said:


> The bad boy persona is overrated, overused.
> 
> I'll keep my nice guy, thank you.


Some guys dig fat chicks.

Some women dig nerds.

We can really drill down and say words have no meaning. It sounds even better if you can do it in French.


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

Anon1111 said:


> Some guys dig fat chicks.
> 
> Some women dig nerds.
> 
> We can really drill down and say words have no meaning. It sounds even better if you can do it in French.


I'm not following...

I meant what I said, fyi.


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## Anon1111 (May 29, 2013)

The point is that if you treat every exception as if it is the rule, then there is no meaning to anything.


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

Anon1111 said:


> The point is that if you treat every exception as if it is the rule, then there is no meaning to anything.


Ah. Well, to that I say that if you give men and women and their sexuality the confines of those "rules", you're going to miss out on just how many "exceptions" there are.


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## LuvIsTuff (Feb 20, 2015)

Anon1111 said:


> I'm going to make a generalization about men. It doesn't apply to all men, which is why it is a generalization.
> 
> If the average man is given a choice between his wife who is perfectly buttoned down, demure and never says or does anything sl-tty, and
> 
> ...


I'm going to say that this is more than a generalization. It's a simple fact. It's like the lyrics of that Ludacris song that says "a lady in the street but a freak in the bed".


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## Anon1111 (May 29, 2013)

Created2Write said:


> Ah. Well, to that I say that if you give men and women and their sexuality the confines of those "rules", you're going to miss out on just how many "exceptions" there are.


I'm cool with the exceptions. Whatever floats your boat.

Most people operate within a certain range and are fairly predictable. 

In philosophy there is this question the "problem of other minds", i.e., how can you ever really know what others think or whether they even think at all.

If you get real skeptical about things, the answer is, you can't know.

But obviously it is not practical to go around living your life like that, so everyone makes the assumption that they DO know.

Acting like you can't make any assumptions is a logical trap. It's a neat exercise for freshman philosophy class, but doesn't really do much beyond that.

signed,

Nerdy Do-chebag.


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

It depends on what is being assumed, though. My issue is with placing people into stereotypes. It serves no purpose other than to categorize and alienate people. We all have aspects of ourselves that are stereotypical, and yet are individually unique. Biologically speaking, while we are all made of the same DNA code, we are also utterly and completely different from each other, and that goes into the, literal, biological makeup of who we are. 

If we can be that different on a biological scale, I believe we can be different emotionally, sexually, intellectually...I simply do not buy stereotypes.


----------



## Anon1111 (May 29, 2013)

Created2Write said:


> It depends on what is being assumed, though. My issue is with placing people into stereotypes. It serves no purpose other than to categorize and alienate people. We all have aspects of ourselves that are stereotypical, and yet are individually unique. Biologically speaking, while we are all made of the same DNA code, we are also utterly and completely different from each other, and that goes into the, literal, biological makeup of who we are.
> 
> If we can be that different on a biological scale, I believe we can be different emotionally, sexually, intellectually...I simply do not buy stereotypes.


We'll probably have to agree to disagree, but we're not that different from each other.

We're not even that different from most mammals.

You can look the world over and with a high degree of probability predict what any individual man or woman will prefer sexually.


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## Mr. Nail (Apr 26, 2011)

Hey Anon1111,

One night about 10 years after the wedding some twit swaped my freak in the sheets clone out for the button down uncomfortable with anything wife.


----------



## WandaJ (Aug 5, 2014)

staarz21 said:


> Good for you?
> 
> If it's not your style, your wife should KNOW that and not expect it. It's not my H's style to take me on lavish vacations. I don't expect him to either. It's not my H's style to show up and surprise me in the middle of the day with flowers...so I don't expect him to. If I did expect him to - I would end up being pretty disappointed.
> 
> If it's not her style to demand her H have sex with her - then it's not her style and her H should not expect her to do that every time.


not sure about that. What you are saying that we do not need to get out of our comfort zone to make our partner happy. Isn't Five Love Languages about it - about doing things that make your spouse loved, even if they are not your thing?


----------



## WandaJ (Aug 5, 2014)

Created2Write said:


> Umm...there have been men who've posted who also took an issue with the OP. Just so ya know.
> 
> Also, we're not pushing against the idea of expressing sexual desire, we're pushing back at the idea that UMP's preference is the only acceptable form of sexual expression.
> 
> ...


you are talking about situation with balanced desiers. not the same as dealing wiht LD spouse.


----------



## WandaJ (Aug 5, 2014)

Created2Write said:


> I doubt this.
> 
> 
> 
> I disagree. I think it's very necessary to fight that fight, and to do so consistently. Eventually we may just get to a place where neither gender is placed in a sexual stereotype...men who are LD won't be made to feel as if they are somehow less of a man because they don't want sex every day. HD women will actually be believed when they say they are HD (I don't know how many times I've had men on this forum say that I'm lying through my teeth when I say I'm HD. Or tell me that I'm some rare oddity, some freak of nature, for desiring sex as much as I do.) Maybe, if we fight the fight well enough and long enough, sexual individuality will be recognized and accepted.


For you it is just ideological war on stereotypes, for many people with mismatched desires is everyday reality. Let's show some empathy, these are serious issues, killing marriages.

This thread is simply not the one to get so wrapped up about.

And turning TAM into politicaly correct place will kill it.


----------



## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

Amen, Lila.


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## LuvIsTuff (Feb 20, 2015)

Lila said:


> So, which is it? Should we take the OP seriously and provide feedback for a healthy discussion, or do we laugh it off as silly guy talk?


I actually believe it's the latter. The OP was loaded with sarcasm. When he finished with "can I get an amen", that pretty much told the story.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

FF - do you normally do it every day? IE: if you don't, then could the "meh" face be because you just had sex last night?

Just curious. Thanks for reporting your results!

I think men and women are all different on this particular issue. I know many women who can get turned on by their man, but the way he initiates turns her off. Even though one woman says "this" turns her off, while my other friend will say the exact same "this" is what would turn her ON, if only she could get him to do it. (Ie: Friend one "I wish he would stop initiating like a cave man". Friend two "I wish he would go cave man on me to initiate!")

My H has his tastes and they are pretty consistent. He definitely doesn't like me coming out of nowhere with major nasty nasty stuff. I wouldn't like that either, as for a real initiation. I like it when he does it as a joke and is chasing me around the house saying horribly nasty things that he'd never initiate with. That's just for fun though. Neither of us have a problem with really nasty talking for fun in the right moments, just not at initiation.

When making a true initiation, I think we both size the other one up, and then decide what our best chances are. Most of the time I just go sit on his lap and start making out with him to initiate. We make out and grope each other for awhile and if the mood grows from there, we both know it and head toward the bedroom.

He will do that, too, but is more likely to stop making out for a minute and say something like "how can I get somma dat?" as he pulls the back of my pants out and peeks down at my butt, or just shoves his hand down there. 

This is usually not a "right this minute" initiation. It may mean a "hopefully later tonight" request, and usually is. 

If either of us are tired and it is going to have to be one side bringing all the energy, that one will suss out the situation and take over. A lot of times with something like "let's get you laid down on this bed and I'll rub your back"...and from there liberties are taken (he he). It is nice to go from relaxing back rub right into sex.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

Since we're all giving our opinions anyway.. I believe statistically speaking....more men are higher drive over women.. this seems so obvious to me -it could slap me in the face...

and I say this being a High Driver myself. 

Even IF most of one's friends are higher drive (being a female) .. and if you know more men who are rejecting.. just like some of us have more Women friends who aren't interested, one of my friends never had an orgasm in her life, could live without sex.. 

We could all site a dozen plus stories & try to make it 50/50.. does any of it really matter though?? it only matters about the individual situation.. and really.. it's just devastating / crushing when it's lacking day after day, month after month, no passion, little to no desire.. male or female!!

I am one who feels it's HARDER on a woman to deal with this JUST BECAUSE she is more Emotional by her very nature , I also feel women are tremendously beautiful , lovely, meant to be the objects of desire to pull a man in, catch his gaze... that magnetic attraction....she is wanted by MEN... accustomed to "attention".. if we cant pull our husbands in.. it is absolutely crushing to us.. 

Would men want to argue THIS with me, that they are the primary objects of desire.. I doubt it !

This article touches on this... the differences in our brains.. does this not count ??

Love, sex and the male brain - CNN.com



> Perhaps the biggest difference between the male and female brain is that men have a sexual pursuit area that is 2.5 times larger than the one in the female brain. Not only that, but beginning in their teens, they produce 20 to 25-fold more testosterone than they did during pre-adolescence.
> 
> If testosterone were beer, a 9-year-old boy would be getting the equivalent of a cup a day. But a 15-year-old would be getting the equivalent of nearly two gallons a day. This fuels their sexual engines and makes it impossible for them to stop thinking about female body parts and sex.


Also.. although Husbands may put their Job over their wives, some hobby, or hanging with buddies.... I rarely hear women complaining that her Husband is putting the kids before her.. .oh it happens.. but it's surely less common.. that Dad is too involved with his kids...(unless maybe he is coaching a team or something)...

I think when men DO communicate, they say what they need to say ...yet they fail to express the emotions behind it many times .. where as women are often too emotional... Men rarely Nag, they just get angry... then back away...

It's a Brain differential.. I looked some of these up...isn't it generally true! 










Speaking of Testosterone... more men are in Prison over that too.. far more Sex offenders are men .... Overwhelmingly men are addicted to PORN, locker room bragging, Egos are related to sexual activity, ogling.. I mean seriously.. men have it on the BRAINS more, they squirt more... how often do they have trouble getting off.. now that is a rarity.. in comparison to women... 

But again.. who cares, none of that diminishes the fact WOMEN and MEN hurt in these situations. Anyone who is Higher Drive trying to live with a rejecting cold "doesn't get it" "doesn't feel it".. no enthusiasm , no passion.. . GOD HELP YOU [email protected]#

Nothing sweeter in life.. I say.. and Yeah.. My husband likes when I come at him telling him just want I am going to DO to him.. not asking.. but taking. 

But then I've read plenty of posts where MEN do not like aggressive women.. this too is so individual.. some may even see that as "pressure"....they are more geared to be the Dominant ...a little chase make them feel more of the MANLY MAN...if anything.. they prefer SUBTLE..


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## ET1SSJonota (Dec 25, 2012)

EleGirl said:


> Generalizations:
> 
> The typical man wants to find a sweet, nice girl who is so into him that she transforms into a raging sl-t just for him. If she did that with everyone else it would not make him feel special.
> 
> ...


Did you really use a generalization to bolster your point, and then immediately turn around and dismiss another point because it was a generalization? From the same post? In the same post?

Just. Wow.


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## ET1SSJonota (Dec 25, 2012)

Why does everyone try to so hard to find a way to be offended? It's a terrible dynamic to look for pain in everything. Why not look for the positive, or at least how you can come away with it as a positive?

I'll admit that the OP could have used better language. But just as everyone up in arms is coming from a different situation - so is HE. His situation would be improved with the application of the recommended. And you know what: if some of you women, HD or not, would give it a whirl, you might find that your man was appreciative. Or not. YMMV. 

You don't even have to use the vulgarity. Look at the overarching premise, which he repeated again. Don't "ask" if he's interested - which may indicate you are just suggesting duty sex (which can have terrible connotations). Make a statement of desire - whether or not it is for your own enjoyment or just to please him. Use whatever words you want. 

Personally - I bet my wife would at least occasionally like ME to use those words on her. Then again, she's an ex-sailor's wife and I don't always "take her" like she really wants.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

ET1SSJonota said:


> Why does everyone try to so hard to find a way to be offended? It's a terrible dynamic to look for pain in everything. Why not look for the positive, or at least how you can come away with it as a positive?
> 
> I'll admit that the OP could have used better language. But just as everyone up in arms is coming from a different situation - so is HE. His situation would be improved with the application of the recommended. *And you know what: if some of you women, HD or not, would give it a whirl, you might find that your man was appreciative. Or not. YMMV*.
> 
> ...


In the bolded part above, you've made a perfect example that explains why some of us women, HD or not, are speaking out on this thread.

You've built in an assumption in the bolded statement that holds something like this in it: I assume you women are actually just offended by the edgy nature of the suggested action.



Just because I said it would be better to use more precise language in the OP, doesn't mean I have some kind of adverse reaction to his actual suggestion.

Sheesh, I'm the biggest wh*re I know. And I definitely get plenty of quality sex with my awesome, hot hunk husband. And we've both got plenty of filth mouth when we want some.

There are other reasons that we women might be wanting a little more precise language than that we are all "too prude" (built into your assumption) to handle the original suggestion.

Even those who said it wasn't their style, also clearly expressed they have their ways of wording initiation that everyone is happy with.

Is it not possible that we actually have a point, and that you don't really know what it is, and try to find out? Rather than assume you know what our point is and having it wrong and then chastising us for speaking up.

This is an open forum where ideas are shared. I have no qualms about the OP, I just asked that the language was more clear and there are many good reasons I'm making that suggestion. People can just ignore it and not respond, too. Or they can find out why I feel that way. I have made an effort to find out why the OP feels the way he does, too.


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## ET1SSJonota (Dec 25, 2012)

Faithful Wife said:


> In the bolded part above, you've made a perfect example that explains why some of us women, HD or not, are speaking out on this thread.
> 
> You've built in an assumption in the bolded statement that holds something like this in it: I assume you women are actually just offended by the edgy nature of the suggested action.
> 
> ...


You both completely missed my point, and then attempted to school me by restating almost the same point. Amazing. 

There was no assumption built into that statement other than if you were denigrating the suggestion of a statement of desire to have sex vs. questioning if the husband/SO wanted sex, then maybe you haven't done it and should give it a whirl. Any other "assumption" you may have read into it was simply not there.

I don't take it as an end all be all, just a single poster making a suggestion that would improve his outlook on his sex life if his partner did it. YMMV. Perhaps there are a few lurkers out there who might read it and get an idea. Still others might see the vociferous opposition to the suggestion and think it was therefore a bad idea. You get where I'm going with this?


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

ET1SSJonota said:


> Did you really use a generalization to bolster your point, and then immediately turn around and dismiss another point because it was a generalization? From the same post? In the same post?
> 
> Just. Wow.


LOL... you apparently completely missed my point....

But you have apparently missed a lot more of what's been said on this thread.


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## ET1SSJonota (Dec 25, 2012)

EleGirl said:


> LOL... you apparently completely missed my point....
> 
> But you have apparently missed a lot more of what's been said on this thread.


I must have... but please enlighten me. The first part seems to be suggesting a generalization was good. The second part suggested that the generalization (a different one) was to be dismissed. 

I'm clearly not in possession of telepathic skills, and it may have been that you meant something different. Could you restate/elaborate?


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

ET1SSJonota said:


> You both completely missed my point, and then attempted to school me by restating almost the same point. Amazing.
> 
> There was no assumption built into that statement other than if you were denigrating the suggestion of a statement of desire to have sex vs. questioning if the husband/SO wanted sex, then maybe you haven't done it and should give it a whirl. Any other "assumption" you may have read into it was simply not there.
> 
> I don't take it as an end all be all, just a single poster making a suggestion that would improve his outlook on his sex life if his partner did it. YMMV. Perhaps there are a few lurkers out there who might read it and get an idea. Still others might see the vociferous opposition to the suggestion and think it was therefore a bad idea. You get where I'm going with this?


The OP was posted to school women on how to express desire because obviously women just do not know how to express desire. 

On the topic of lurkers. If the lurkers have half a brain they can read the thread and see that women talked about all kinds of other ways that they actually do express desire successfully in their marriages. So an lurker might have learned a lot of different ways to do this. Not just the one expressed in the OP. Of course this assumes that the said lurkers actually need to be schooled in showing desire. I'll bet that the vast majority do it just fine.


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## ET1SSJonota (Dec 25, 2012)

EleGirl said:


> The OP was posted to school women on how to express desire because obviously women just do not know how to express desire.
> 
> On the topic of lurkers. If the lurkers have half a brain they can read the thread and see that women talked about all kinds of other ways that they actually do express desire successfully in their marriages. So an lurker might have learned a lot of different ways to do this. Not just the one expressed in the OP. Of course this assumes that the said lurkers actually need to be schooled in showing desire. I'll bet that the vast majority do it just fine.


His example specifically showed how an expression of female desire could be less than desirable, and preferential way for it to be expressed to HIM. 

Then you guys followed up with all sorts of reason why what he said was wrong/contradicted him. 

Note I'm not saying you/others' methods are wrong. They can be/are wildly successful in YOUR marriages. But not in others. So maybe, just maybe, it's ok to suggest that a woman make a sexual statement, instead of asking a sexual question? Mkay? A suggestion that can be taken, or left, or applied with a grain of salt. 

Or are you still just interested in being combative?


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

ET1SSJonota said:


> His example specifically showed how an expression of female desire could be less than desirable, and preferential way for it to be expressed to HIM.
> 
> Then you guys followed up with all sorts of reason why what he said was wrong/contradicted him.
> 
> ...


Do you realize that on every thread on this forum people express their opinions? You will find few if any threads in which everyone just goes on about how brilliant the OP is. Instead the OP is a like a conversation starter and it goes from there.

It's actually quite alright to have opinions that differ from the OP's and from that of others.


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## ET1SSJonota (Dec 25, 2012)

EleGirl said:


> Do you realize that on every thread on this forum people express their opinions? You will find few if any threads in which everyone just goes on about how brilliant the OP is. Instead the OP is a like a conversation starter and it goes from there.
> 
> It's actually quite alright to have opinions that differ from the OP's and from that of others.


I wholeheartedly agree with your post, but perhaps you could do more practicing of the principle, and less preaching.


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## samyeagar (May 14, 2012)

Context is really important I think. I think in most situations, some variant of the active statement "I want to have sex with you" shows more over desire than the passive variant "Do you want to have sex with me?". If my wife and I are sitting in the living room watching something on TV and she looks over at me and asks if I want to go have sex, that tells me that she was thinking about sex in a typically non sexual setting, and it comes off as a pretty active initiation. If we are half naked in bed at the end of the day and asks the same question, it can come off as pretty passive, almost like a take it or leave it. I know for myself, I would always prefer the active statement...some variant of "I want to..."


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