# Is she isolating me from my parents?



## modernknight (Apr 24, 2015)

I should add some kind of disclaimer or background to the top of every post. Some of you will know me from previous posts. Perhaps I work on a standard summary for those who don't know me. Actually... I'll do that and add a background section for my posts from now on. Then I post about the latest 'incident'.

<Background>
I'm here looking for answers as I'm in a relationship that I have identified as unhealthy and though I know I should probably leave it, I'm hanging on. Maybe because I'm emotionally tired, maybe because I'm scared, maybe because I'm weak. I'm still going through a stage of thinking that things are my fault. Hence, why I ask here.

My girlfriend and I have been in a relationship for around 6 years, we are both in our late 30s, and have lived in an apartment together for about 4 years. Her 14 year old son also lives in the apartment. The son and I are close (he calls me his second dad) and his father is an active part of his life, taking him for the ocassional night/weekend. His father seems like a really decent guy.

We have problems (I think she is jealous, controlling, and quite often angry; I'm dependent, a door mat, and an approval seeker, and reading "no more mr nice guy" for the second time, and looking into getting some therapy to help me make the right decisions).

<Incident>
While we were on holiday recently her son got burned by boiling hot water as he helped his mum in the kitchen. I was outside working on the barbeque. This resulted in a few hospital visits and leaving the holiday earlier than planned so we could go home to get better treatment (we were in a remote area, didn't speak the language, and were concerned about the treatment). Cutting a long story short, when we got back to our house, my girlfriend went into detail with her parents about what happened. Yet... she told me not to go into detail with my parents. Bearing in mind that my parents are not her sons grandparents, and my parents live in another country, and her relationship with them is okay, I was surprised by this. I asked her what kind of detail she meant--and why--but I didn't really get a concrete sensible answer. She got angry when I said that I didn't really agree with limiting information and thought it was perfectly normal to say what happened, how, etc to my parents. I've always been close to them. Why should I suddenly not tell them how her son got burned?! or that we ended up in hospital and what happened?! It doesn't make sense.

I've already concluded she is isolating me from my parents (whether intentional/unintentionally I do not know). However... because I know I'm weak and have somehow lost the ability to stand-up for my beliefs, I want to ask here. Do you think it is right that I should limit information to my parents? Or do you think her request is odd?


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## lucy999 (Sep 28, 2014)

Poor kid, hope hes ok. Is it possible she doesn't want your parents to think she was neglectful of her child since it happened when he was with her? Maybe she has no issue telling her parents because they obviously know her better than your parents do? Maybe she doesn't want your parents to judge her? That's the first thing that came to mind.


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## modernknight (Apr 24, 2015)

lucy999 said:


> Poor kid, hope hes ok. Is it possible she doesn't want your parents to think she was neglectful of her child since it happened when he was with her? Maybe she has no issue telling her parents because they obviously know her better than your parents do? Maybe she doesn't want your parents to judge her? That's the first thing that came to mind.


That came to my mind too at first. I asked her and her response was that it is not the reason.

She could only say that she doesn't think they need to know, that the three of us are a small family unit that shouldn't need to tell everything to people outside of our unit because this is our life, not theirs. It was at this point where I mentioned how I've always been close to my parents and tell them certain things that happen in my life. I do not believe this particular subject is off-limits or needs to be kept private to protect anyone. It would be different if it was something of a real personal/embarrassing/private nature such as an STD for example. In that case I could totally understand. In that case I wouldn't need to be asked to not disclose things, I would not disclose such a thing in the first place.


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## MJJEAN (Jun 26, 2015)

She's not telling you that you can't talk to your parents. She's telling you that she doesn't want you talking about her personal life events with people who are virtual strangers to her. Big difference.

I love my DH. I encourage him to talk to his parents often. I like his parents very much. But they have always lived in another state, we see them once a year at most, and even then it's only for a few hours over a couple of days. So, I don't know them that well. Because of that, there are some things I prefer DH keep between us.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Wolf1974 (Feb 19, 2014)

I dont believe isolation is the right word. Control of information is more of what she is going for. Sounds likes she doesn't want everything known to all people unless she approves. Here is the most important question.. does she communicate with you? Is she open and honest with you? Does she talk to her parents about things and then you find out later about them. That would cause more of a deal breaker than her not wanting your parents to know. As someone else said that could simple stem from her not wanting to be judged by virtual strangers.


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## Orange_Pekoe (Jan 5, 2015)

I don't think her request is odd at all, and I don't think she's isolating you from your parents. Isolating you from your parents would be along the lines of, don't call them, talk to them or see them.

Her request is not odd - she probably feels as though people will criticize her parenting, because she was in the kitchen when her son got burned (sorry to hear it and I hope he's OK now!). Whereas with her own parents, she feels "safe".

Now - saying that it isn't odd, doesn't make the request "right". If you're a part of the family and you'd like to go in to detail with your parents, that's your prerogative.


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## karazy (Aug 31, 2015)

It is not isolation at all. It's her and her kid which has nothing to do with your parents and she just doesn't want that information shared with them. Her parents are her family and her child is their grandson. You should respect that. There are things I ask my husband not to tell his parents if I'm involved. Doesn't matter what degree it is. For example, when I got pregnant, I asked my husband not to tell his parents until I'm passed the first trimester, but I told mine. I'm much closer to my parents and if something bad happened, it would be easier to tell my parents. 

Isolation is when she tells you that you cannot have any contact with your family at all.


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## tripad (Apr 18, 2014)

Seems like the issue lies with you .

You seem too sensitive and calling yourself doormat and such sounds you have insecurity issues


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## ricky15100 (Oct 23, 2013)

Have you got any other examples of why you think she is isolating you? You've mentioned , jealousy and control issues


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## frusdil (Sep 5, 2013)

Full disclosure - I can't my inlaws and I don't see them. Hubby sees them on his own.

I do ask him not to discuss anything about me, or our marriage with them. I don't want them knowing any of my business.

Hes not your son, she doesn't want them to know. Do not betray her trust.


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## Wolf1974 (Feb 19, 2014)

frusdil said:


> Full disclosure - I can't my inlaws and I don't see them. Hubby sees them on his own.
> 
> I do ask him not to discuss anything about me, or our marriage with them. I don't want them knowing any of my business.
> 
> Hes not your son, she doesn't want them to know. Do not betray her trust.


Wow must be a lot of history there for you to feel that way. Sorry to hear this..... must make holidays Difficult:|


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## frusdil (Sep 5, 2013)

Wolf1974 said:


> Wow must be a lot of history there for you to feel that way. Sorry to hear this..... must make holidays Difficult:|


There is...there's been undertones (from their side) from the day I met them. I tried so hard Wolf, I really did. But they just don't like me and don't think I'm good enough for their son. It's not personal, they did the same to his first wife, but it's still hurtful and offensive. I'm not perfect, but I'm a loving, devoted wife and stepmum and I make their son very happy. That should be enough for them, but for whatever reason it isn't.

Luckily I'm not a 20 something new bride, I'm a 42 year old woman and just won't tolerate the bs, lol. Hubby can see them, I'm more than happy for that, but I have no desire to.

Holidays aren't that difficult - I made it very clear to hubby that holidays belong to me and our daughter. He has to fit the inlaws in around us. He's happy with that - he knows what they're like.


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## Tobin (Jun 24, 2015)

She's not isolating you, you're being oversensitive, he's not your kid, you can simply tell your parents that there was an accident involving the son and his mother prefers the matter not be discussed further and just leave it at that without getting all bent out of shape and making bad assumptions.


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## frusdil (Sep 5, 2013)

Tobin said:


> She's not isolating you, you're being oversensitive, he's not your kid, you can simply tell your parents that there was an accident involving the son and his mother prefers the matter not be discussed further and just leave it at that without getting all bent out of shape and making bad assumptions.


Or just not mention it to his parents at all seeing as it's not really any of their business.

Adults don't have to tell their parents everything.


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## modernknight (Apr 24, 2015)

Thanks for all the comments. I agree with what you say when you say she has the right to ask me what to do with information that is about her or her child. She does have that right. I also, should respect it. And have respected her request.

I just feel a little uncomfortable when she is telling her work colleagues/piano teacher that her son was burned by a pan of boiling water, and yet I'm supposed to only say that he had an accident to my parents, my brother, my friends, and so on. At a time when my relationship with my own parents is becoming more and more distant because she doesn't want me to visit on my own, doesn't want to visit for Christmas, and doesn't want to (can't afford to) visit them more than once a year, I'm scared that this situation distances me more.

Like you say, it is her right, but it's a pan of boiling water. I think most well-adjusted, rational adults will understand that it's okay for a 14 year to help in the kitchen and accidents such as these can happen without judging the parents as negligent. People do judge though which is why I see--and agree--with what you say.

It's a fair point that limiting information could avoid unnecessary judgement. However, I've already been told by my brother that my parents had commented on how strange I was acting when asked how the holiday was during last weeks phone conversation. They told him they were worried I was hiding something. Considering they've already seen (first hand) how difficult she can be, if they feel I'm hiding information (which I am), they are more likely to judge her negatively than if they knew what actually happened.


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## Wolf1974 (Feb 19, 2014)

Just out of curiosity what is the end game here with her? Are you planning on marrying? Seems like after 6 years you both are not on the same page about communication and that's just one of the issues right? Don't you and her sleep on a porch while her son has a room? Don't you financially support her?


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## lilith23 (Sep 6, 2012)

modernknight said:


> Thanks for all the comments. I agree with what you say when you say she has the right to ask me what to do with information that is about her or her child. She does have that right. I also, should respect it. And have respected her request.
> 
> I just feel a little uncomfortable when she is telling her work colleagues/piano teacher that her son was burned by a pan of boiling water, and yet I'm supposed to only say that he had an accident to my parents, my brother, my friends, and so on. At a time when my relationship with my own parents is becoming more and more distant because she doesn't want me to visit on my own, doesn't want to visit for Christmas, and doesn't want to (can't afford to) visit them more than once a year, I'm scared that this situation distances me more.
> 
> ...


So there is more to the story. If it was just this accident then it doesn't seem like a big deal ommiting information, however she not allowing you to visit your parents by yourself nor visit them more than once a year sounds more controlling.

Are you sure you are ok with this? I don't mean the accident, but she limiting you visiting your family. Does she also limit anything else like what you do at home or where you can go out to, or going out with friends?

I've seen cases in which the guy is a doormat and submits to his insecure gf's demands. The guy couldn't even do his own stuffs at home as she wanted to always do stuffs together, and him wanting to hang out with male friends might also trigger insecurities.
In the end, the more he submits, the more demanding his gf becomes. It does not help her face her own insecurities, and all it does is that the gf gradually loses respect towards him.

Conflicts sucks, but standing for yourself is the only way to keep the relationship equal. There s no real relationship if there is no equality. Not that you should simply assert yourself and not yield in any ways, but rather not allowing the minimum boundary be crossed.


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## Uptown (Mar 27, 2010)

modernknight said:


> She is jealous, controlling, and quite often angry.... Is she isolating me from my parents?


MK, as discussed in my *May 30 post* at your earlier thread, you are describing some of the classic warning signs for BPD (Borderline Personality Disorder). I mention this again because, if your GF really does have strong BPD traits, her attempts to isolate you from your own family members is exactly what you should expect. Indeed, this isolating behavior -- which is intended to make you easier to control -- is one of the *18 BPD Warning Signs* I mentioned before.


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## frusdil (Sep 5, 2013)

modernknight said:


> Thanks for all the comments. I agree with what you say when you say she has the right to ask me what to do with information that is about her or her child. She does have that right. I also, should respect it. And have respected her request.
> 
> I just feel a little uncomfortable when she is telling her work colleagues/piano teacher that her son was burned by a pan of boiling water, and yet I'm supposed to only say that he had an accident to my parents, my brother, my friends, and so on. At a time when my relationship with my own parents is becoming more and more distant because she doesn't want me to visit on my own, doesn't want to visit for Christmas, and doesn't want to (can't afford to) visit them more than once a year, I'm scared that this situation distances me more.
> 
> ...


So there _are_ issues between her and your parents...that explains why she's adamant that you don't tell them.

Whatever happened to leave and cleave? I seriously don't understand grown adults who have to tell their parents everything. Wtf?


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

I went back and read your other threads to refresh my memory.

1.	Her teen son has the master bedroom.
2.	You two sleep in a room that is supposed to be a winter garden
3.	You work full time, but she’s angry because you are no with her all the time.
4.	You do most of the cleaning and cooking… this includes ironing her kids clothes.
5.	She’s overly jealous and falsely accuses you of flirting, etc.
6.	She got angry when you called your mother to wish your mother’s happy birthday. She wanted you to only call your mother with her.
7.	She yells at you, calls you names, *****es at you when you do not jump through the right hoops then kicked you out of YOUR home for her son’s birthday. (this from the thread where you called her a name)
.

She's not trying to isolate you as much as she is trying to control you. Since you parents live in another country, simply controlling your phone calls with your parents will have the affect of isolating them.

You chose to stay with her, so I don't know what to say. I hope that you do get into counseling so you can get the strength to get out of this.


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## frusdil (Sep 5, 2013)

As someone with EXTREMELY difficult, nosey and overbearing inlaws, I would like some more info...

OP, are you the type who tells your parents everything? Like, EVERYTHING? There are some things that they just don't need to know.

I am adamant with my husband that he is not to discuss ANYTHING about me or our family with his parents. Me in particular, and our finances/wills or day to day decisions. They lost the right to know anything when they started openly treating me like something they stepped in. If he discussed any of our private business with them, I would absolutely hit the roof. He's welcome to discuss himself and anything to do with just him, that's his business, but anything that affects me or about me is absolutely off limits. People would probably say that I'm controlling on this issue, I guess I am, and I have reason to be. I make no apologies for this.


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## modernknight (Apr 24, 2015)

frusdil said:


> As someone with EXTREMELY difficult, nosey and overbearing inlaws, I would like some more info...
> 
> OP, are you the type who tells your parents everything? Like, EVERYTHING? There are some things that they just don't need to know.
> 
> I am adamant with my husband that he is not to discuss ANYTHING about me or our family with his parents. Me in particular, and our finances/wills or day to day decisions. They lost the right to know anything when they started openly treating me like something they stepped in. If he discussed any of our private business with them, I would absolutely hit the roof. He's welcome to discuss himself and anything to do with just him, that's his business, but anything that affects me or about me is absolutely off limits. People would probably say that I'm controlling on this issue, I guess I am, and I have reason to be. I make no apologies for this.


No. I am not that type. I am not the type who tells my parents everything.

There are definitely things that parents do not need to know. However... when they ask me how my holiday was, I do want to be able to tell the truth instead of "yeah... it was good. full stop." For me, the truth is "yeah, it was good, though Fred had an accident and got burned by boiling water". And when my parents say "what happened?" that I can freely say "ah, he picked up a pan of boiling water that had hot handles and got boiling water on his arm". Rather than not be able to answer what happened because I'm not supposed to go into detail.


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## modernknight (Apr 24, 2015)

EleGirl said:


> I went back and read your other threads to refresh my memory.
> 
> 1.	Her teen son has the master bedroom.
> 2.	You two sleep in a room that is supposed to be a winter garden
> ...


Thanks. Today I made an appointment with my doctor. Hopefully he can refer me to a therapist/councilor.


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## modernknight (Apr 24, 2015)

Wolf1974 said:


> Just out of curiosity what is the end game here with her? Are you planning on marrying? Seems like after 6 years you both are not on the same page about communication and that's just one of the issues right? Don't you and her sleep on a porch while her son has a room? Don't you financially support her?


Good questions. 

End game: yes we're talking about getting married but of course I'm scared to do this which is one of the reasons why I'm here. 

Comms: one of many.

porch: no, we don't sleep on the porch. Far from it. The room is a sunroom (or in german "wintergarten"). I don't have a picture of the actual room so here's one I found off the internet which gives you a good idea of the "type" of room: https://oldslide.com/wp-content/upl...ration-with-large-open-window-for-sunroom.jpg
Technically, it's meant to be a sunroom where people have plants and maybe a chair or too. It has laminate flooring, blinds plus curtains for the large windows (there is no ceiling window, just wall windows). We have our bed in there along with a couple shelve of drawers. I actually find it quite nice, especially with the view of the stars at night or trees during the day. The problem is that there is no wall in between the kitchen and the sunroom, so if you're in the kitchen you can see our bed. Also, the door only closes from the outside and is glass so that too affects our privacy. Actually... we could make it more private by modifying the door to close from the inside and adding blinds between kitchen and bedroom, and of course on the door. But my girlfriend does not want to do that. She wants me to find a bigger apartment.

Financial support: Yes and no. She has an afternoon job which she uses to chip in toward various things but I pay most of the bills (full rent, phone, internet, water/gas/electric, main food shopping and so on). And for holidays I end up paying most of it. On a morning she is a mature student trying to improve her qualifications to get a better job.


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## Tobin (Jun 24, 2015)

modernknight said:


> yes we're talking about getting married


You've stated in several posts that you've considered leaving the relationship. With those types of doubts, getting married is completely off the table- if of course you're a sane person who doesn't want to make a mistake that he'll regret for the rest of his life.



modernknight said:


> Technically, it's meant to be a sunroom... I actually find it quite nice


Sounds like you've been given no choice whatsoever about the sunroom being your bedroom and you're trying to go along with it and convince yourself that it's a good thing that you're in a room that's not designed as a bedroom and gives you no privacy because _it doesn't even have a door._ In one of your other threads you talk about a more expensive apartment which has a big room and a small room and the son would have gotten the larger room. Why? You're two people, he's one, and you're the one paying for all of this!



modernknight said:


> The problem is that there is no wall in between the kitchen and the sunroom, so if you're in the kitchen you can see our bed.


How can you have sex knowing her son could see you at any time?



modernknight said:


> Also, the door only closes from the outside


What does this even mean? How can a door only close from one side?



modernknight said:


> we could make it more private by modifying the door to close from the inside and adding blinds between kitchen and bedroom, and of course on the door. But my girlfriend does not want to do that.


She doesn't want privacy with you? Does she use this as a reason not to have sex? Or does she not care if her son sees you in action?


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## AliceA (Jul 29, 2010)

You aren't being honest with her. Honesty should dictate what happens in this relationship in my opinion. If you were to tell her what you've told us here about how you feel about her behaviour and your doubts about marriage, a possible reaction she would have would be to end it, which is exactly what should happen. If not, then at least it's out there and no one keeps walking towards a marriage destined to fail.


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## modernknight (Apr 24, 2015)

Tobin said:


> You've stated in several posts that you've considered leaving the relationship. With those types of doubts, getting married is completely off the table- if of course you're a sane person who doesn't want to make a mistake that he'll regret for the rest of his life.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


We can be sure that we won't be disturbed during intimate moments. There is a door from the hallway which we can secure. Of course, if that is not secured and/or the son is in the kitchen, then we're not going to do anything. That's just wrong. BOTH of us care very much about the son to avoid exposing him to anything that will disturb/corrupt/hurt him. We have a very healthy/active sex life and take all precautions to ensure the son doesn't see or hear anything. 

Regarding the sunroom. I'm not trying to convince myself I like it. I would love to have a conventional bedroom. There are aspects of the room that I like. Just are there are aspects I dislike.

Regarding the biggest room. I know it's convention in many families that the parents have the biggest room and then children get the smaller rooms. Furthermore, the convention there tends to be that the oldest gets the bigger and the youngest gets the smaller. That's how it was in my family. I don't know where this convention came from but it seems like a status/authority/power symbol. If it makes more functional/logical/emotional/health sense for a child to have the larger room due to his or her needs then I have no problem with that. It's never been an issue that we have the smaller room. I know that a young teen needs his space. For him, his room is HIS space and should remain exclusively so because as he develops as an adult he will need this privacy. That's important to developing as a well balanced adult. If we were to stick him in the current small room with it's limitations then it would negatively affect him. I'm not going to do that. I don't agree with that. It doesn't matter to me that there is no 1-1 mapping between the quantity of money I pay for rent and the space I get in the house.

p.s. A door can only close from one side if........ it has a handle on one side (the outside) and when pushed closed doesn't stay closed unless the locking mechanism is employed.


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## modernknight (Apr 24, 2015)

breeze said:


> You aren't being honest with her. Honesty should dictate what happens in this relationship in my opinion. If you were to tell her what you've told us here about how you feel about her behaviour and your doubts about marriage, a possible reaction she would have would be to end it, which is exactly what should happen. If not, then at least it's out there and no one keeps walking towards a marriage destined to fail.


That's true. I am considering telling her that we should put any discussion of marriage on hold until we resolve our issues.


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## Tobin (Jun 24, 2015)

modernknight said:


> There is a door from the hallway which we can secure. Of course, if that is not secured and/or the son is in the kitchen, then we're not going to do anything.


But the son could walk into the kitchen at ANY time. Maybe he gets up at night to take a piss and decides to get a drink of water, and/or he hears noises coming from your bedroom so he walks into the kitchen to investigate. Even if it never happens, the possibility is there and that's gotta be on your minds when you're intimate. 



modernknight said:


> That's just wrong. BOTH of us care very much about the son to avoid exposing him to anything that will disturb/corrupt/hurt him. We have a very healthy/active sex life and take all precautions to ensure the son doesn't see or hear anything.


Getting off topic here, but many people think that exposing children to the sounds if not the sights of sex is healthy. I've even heard stories where the parents have sex in front of the kids. Not saying I agree.. but to each his own I guess. 



modernknight said:


> Regarding the sunroom. I'm not trying to convince myself I like it. I would love to have a conventional bedroom. There are aspects of the room that I like. Just are there are aspects I dislike.


The point is that you would not have chosen the sunroom. Your girlfriend chose it and you went along with it to appease her. The more you go along, the weaker you are, and the less respect she has for you. Next time this sort of thing comes up just say "no, it aint gonna happen that way, sorry". She'll put up resistance but ultimately you will hold your ground and "win". 



modernknight said:


> Regarding the biggest room. I know it's convention in many families that the parents have the biggest room and then children get the smaller rooms.
> 
> I don't know where this convention came from but it seems like a status/authority/power symbol. If it makes more functional/logical/emotional/health sense for a child to have the larger room due to his or her needs then I have no problem with that.


Yes it's sort of an authority symbol, which it SHOULD be because.. wait for it.. parents are the authority in the household! Not to mention there are usually TWO of them with TWICE as much stuff as one teenager. 



modernknight said:


> For him, his room is HIS space and should remain exclusively so because as he develops as an adult he will need this privacy.


His privacy is more important than yours because he's.. developing? Not seeing any sense there. 



modernknight said:


> p.s. A door can only close from one side if........ it has a handle on one side (the outside) and when pushed closed doesn't stay closed unless the locking mechanism is employed.


Seems like an easy fix, get one of those dummy handles and screw it to the inside of the door so you can grab it, and get some sort of latch bolt for your side to keep the door shut. Under $10 at the local hardware store, should take less than 5 minutes to do the job.

Some sort of temporary partition could easily be erected to block the view from the kitchen to at least give you some semblence of privacy.



modernknight said:


> That's true. I am considering telling her that we should put any discussion of marriage on hold until we resolve our issues.


You're "considering" telling her how you feel about marriage.

You're afraid of her. This has to stop.


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## AliceA (Jul 29, 2010)

modernknight said:


> That's true. I am considering telling her that we should put any discussion of marriage on hold until we resolve our issues.


It only merits consideration then, not action? Every moment you continue to live this lie I would consider you a dishonest person, but that's just me. From her side you are leading her on, letting her think there's a happy ending to this fictitious relationship. I say fictitious because what you haven't told her the reality of it, so whatever she thinks is happening here isn't actually what's happening.


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## modernknight (Apr 24, 2015)

breeze said:


> It only merits consideration then, not action? Every moment you continue to live this lie I would consider you a dishonest person, but that's just me. From her side you are leading her on, letting her think there's a happy ending to this fictitious relationship. I say fictitious because what you haven't told her the reality of it, so whatever she thinks is happening here isn't actually what's happening.


Bearing in mind that her insecurities have already wreaked havoc on our relationship, telling her that I want to stall getting married until we have resolved our issues is likely to result in a much larger shock-wave than it would for a well-adjusted individual. I do agree with you. Much of my behaviour is inherently dishonest. 

I was not that way at the beginning of the relationship. I've always been an open, down-to-earth, calm individual. Now, I'm dishonest. Because I'm scared. Scared of her reaction. I'm so scared of her reactions, that I've spent the last week worrying about telling her that I want to do a language course to study the language of the country I live in and should definitely improve. So if I'm scared to tell her that, don't you think I'm going to be scared to tell her that I want to stall getting married?

Yes I know it's wrong! It's dishonest. I should probably leave. This relationship is unhealthy. And so on and so on. That's why I am here! And I know that I have a part in this too. If I had stood up for myself then I wouldn't be in this situation. So it's not just her who has a problem, it's me too. And that's why I should probably go back and edit the first line of this comment. It's not "her" insecurities that wrecked this relationship. It's "our" insecurities that have wrecked this relationship. I'm just as complicit as she is.

Back to only considering... no. Not only considering. But maybe I wait until I see the councilor/therapist. Writing here helps. Reading books helps (e.g. no more mr nice guy). But not enough. Nowhere near enough. I have an appointment to get a therapist. Before I go exploding the relationship and maybe causing more damage by cancelling the engagement I think it might be wise to run that one by a therapist..


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## modernknight (Apr 24, 2015)

Tobin said:


> You're afraid of her. This has to stop.


I know. You don't know how bloody seriously I know that. It drives me crazy. I want to stop being afraid and stand up for myself. How hard can it be right? For some reason though... I have a real big problem with that. :-(


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## AliceA (Jul 29, 2010)

You are definitely not alone in being bound by your fears I think. Constantly people post here saying they don't like something their partner is doing but refuse to talk to them about it due to fear of their reaction. Even if they know they won't be physically harmed, they act as if their life is in danger.

I can't imagine that sort of fear in a relationship, so it's easy for me to judge, but I see it as such a waste of a person's life.


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## modernknight (Apr 24, 2015)

breeze said:


> You are definitely not alone in being bound by your fears I think. Constantly people post here saying they don't like something their partner is doing but refuse to talk to them about it due to fear of their reaction. Even if they know they won't be physically harmed, they act as if their life is in danger.
> 
> I can't imagine that sort of fear in a relationship, so it's easy for me to judge, but I see it as such a waste of a person's life.


I understand your point. I think I act in fear because the pain of emotional/mental suffering can evoke similar reactions to those of physical suffering. If I had been subjected to physical abuse I would have left this relationship immediately. However, I think many of us perceive a difference in emotional and physical abuse. Sometimes we don't see emotional abuse as seriously (or as transparently) as we see physical abuse. Also... emotional abuse is far far more subtle than physical abuse. You can be emotionally abused and not even know you're being abused!!!

I am only now becoming aware of weaknesses that have allowed me to get into this position. As such, I have tolerated and accepted emotional abuse for a number of years which has worn me down. So I have got to the point where because of the emotional suffering I have experienced, I now act as if my life is in danger.

Take the language course. I live in Germany but am English. I told my Girlfriend last week that there is an upcoming German course at my work which I was really interested in going to. She immediately expressed negativity toward it and while she did not expressly state that I was "not allowed", she acted in such a way to make me feel like I was being selfish, that I had promised to not do a course (I hadn't), that she felt I didn't have time to give to this course (because then i wouldn't be giving enough time to looking for another apartment), and so on. She sulked, she spoke to me unkindly, and so on. I realise now that this was emotional bullying and guilt tripping to manipulate me into not going. I was able to successfully avoid getting angry and just let her behave that way without reacting. 

Today, I had the first day of the course. A 1.5 hour session at my work. I think she had thought I was going to cancel because last night she seemed surprised when I mentioned that I would need to leave the house at 0720. She bristled and later in the evening, when we were in bed she was clearly keeping herself as far away from me as possible (she normally likes to snuggle up next to me). Then... after moving restlessly for a while she started complaining and suggested that my deciding to do the course was selfish of me and that she might have to quit her uni course because I wont' be around so much to help her. Rubbish really. She wouldn't have to quit her course. I support her in so many ways.

Then this morning... she was cold, off with me, and didn't want to kiss me back (like she normally does) when I left for work. She also told me she would be out and busy all morning and I shouldn't call her (I usually give a mid morning call). In other words... she subjects me to various forms of emotional abuse. 

The good thing is... I did the 1.5 hour course. I will continue next week. It was lots of fun, made me happy, and I learned a load of stuff in only one lesson! I feel good for doing something for me.

So really... maybe you see... if I have suffered this kind of emotional abuse over the years, it's probably no wonder I now am "scared" to do things I want to do or talk about things that may result in a negative response. On Thursday I have my doctors appointment to request a therapist. Hopefully I am on the right path.


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

Here's another way to think about things, mk. You can only be emotionally abused if you allow what she says or does to hurt you. If you were to not take it personally, not allow it to have power over you, it would not likely bother you. In fact, you might instead feel compassion for the distress your gf is obviously feeling at your decision. 

That does not mean you would not take the course, as it is wise to learn the language of the country you are living in, but that you would at the same time show empathy for her. All that energy that is now spent feeling hurt and sorry for yourself could go into constructive problem-solving. Wouldn't that be empowering?


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## modernknight (Apr 24, 2015)

jld said:


> Here's another way to think about things, mk. You can only be emotionally abused if you allow what she says or does to hurt you. If you were to not take it personally, not allow it to have power over you, it would not likely bother you. In fact, you might instead feel compassion for the distress your gf is obviously feeling at your decision.
> 
> That does not mean you would not take the course, as it is wise to learn the language of the country you are living in, but that you would at the same time show empathy for her. All that energy that is now spent feeling hurt and sorry for yourself could go into constructive problem-solving. Wouldn't that be empowering?


I've been re-reading/watching Wayne Dyers material since he passed away at the end of August. One quote from Wayne Dyer: "“You cannot always control what goes on outside. But you can always control what goes on inside.” Specifically, that no one can make me feel something unless I allow it to. For example: no one can "make" me angry. It is my thoughts about what they said or did that result in me becoming angry. 

So as with your post above. Here I am, on this thread, posting that she is "emotionally abusing me" when the fact is that I am actually "emotionally abusing myself". I am emotionally abusing myself because I allow myself to react negativity to my thoughts about her words/actions. It kind of fits with "The Work" from Byron Katie. The turnaround. 

I like what you suggest and already have had the opportunity to try it out in real life. I had my German lesson (along with 4 other work colleagues) on Wed morning. As mentioned it was very constructive. Last night, while my girlfriend and I were out having a meal prior to going to the cinema she asked the question I had been dreading: "Is your teacher a man or a woman?". I answered honestly, "a woman". The mood instantly soured as she expressed her fear through anger, contempt, and so on. Because we spent so long discussing it (I was subjected to a torrent of criticism for taking the course, that I shouldn't need to take a course as she can teach me, her father learned German via books, her friends think I am disgusting for going to a German course, and so on). 
I practiced not taking it personally, not allowing it to have power. I practiced compassion. This really did change my reactions, responses, and so on. I also tried to diplomatically inquire into the underlying unspoken cause for her objections to this German course. Which of course must be fear based? I believe that she is scared of losing me and is experiencing unhealthy jealousy and then trying to control/manipulate me to "protect" herself. In a way that is arguably not healthy. Without trying to "judge" (which I am kind of doing here) or to "blame" I tried to navigate around the subject of fear by basically telling her that I understand she is worried it's a female teacher because I too have fears and jealousy when she does something with a man (e.g. meeting an old male friend for a coffee this week--and getting a lift in his car--after she accidentally bumped into him in town). Then I stressed that I love her and reassured her that I want to stay in the relationship and not interested in anybody else.
Sadly, this didn't do anything to make the situation better. We spoke for too long to go to the cinema so had to go home. She slept in her sons bed (he was at his fathers) leaving me alone in the bed (I did not object or make a scene--I accepted). During the night, she got up a few times and turned all the lights on and made noise that woke me, then started another round of criticism. Thankfully, despite the stress and lack of sleep, I was able to maintain my composure and not say/do anything that would make things far worse.

I will continue to practice your suggestion. And continue reading "Your Erroneous Zones" from Wayne Dyer. Both definitely have had a positive impact on how I'm dealing with this. I saw the Doctor yesterday. I now have a referral to a Neurologist to start down the path of getting some professional therapy.


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

She has likely been the victim of emotional abuse herself, mk, and is doing to you what was done to her.

Someone has to stop the cycle, and start the healing. And it sounds like you have the courage to be the one. I salute you.


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## modernknight (Apr 24, 2015)

jld said:


> She has likely been the victim of emotional abuse herself, mk, and is doing to you what was done to her.
> 
> Someone has to stop the cycle, and start the healing. And it sounds like you have the courage to be the one. I salute you.


Thanks. Yes, it's time to start setting boundaries and regaining control over my life.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

modernknight said:


> I'm here looking for answers as I'm in a relationship that I have identified as unhealthy and though I know I should probably leave it, I'm hanging on. Maybe because I'm emotionally tired, maybe because I'm scared, maybe because I'm weak. I'm still going through a stage of thinking that things are my fault. Hence, why I ask here.


Scared.

And stop doing what you know is unhealthy. If she says to do something that goes against the grain, don't do it. Listen to YOUR voice.

And start educating yourself on what you can do, like this:
http://www.healthyplace.com/abuse/verbal-abuse/your-verbally-abusive-wife-what-can-you-do/


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