# Step forward



## Ynot (Aug 26, 2014)

After my divorce I moved 125 miles from where I lived to a new city. I live closer to my daughter now so I get to see her regularly. So it was quite a shock to go out to breakfast yesterday with the lady I have been seeing and see my ex having breakfast with my daughter in the local cafe near my apartment.
I am pretty sure we arrived first. We had to sit at the counter because they were very busy. There was a large mirror behind the counter and I could see the dining room behind me. I looked back and at the far end of this small dining room was my ex sitting there having breakfast with my daughter. 
She caught my attention because I didn't recognize her at first, but at first glance thought she was very attractive. My ex has long curly brown hair and is taller at 5'8". I just thought wow she looks my ex, then I realized that it was my ex.
The woman I am seeing is shorter and has straight blonde hair, but I have noticed that I seem to be attracted to women who share similar features as my ex did.
Anyways, I don't know if she saw me. I didn't have to walk past her table on the way out, but I did pass thru her field of vision. I made a conscious effort not even to look her way as we left. I never said anything to the new woman and simply left without acknowledging my ex's presence.
It did bother me. My ex had been on my mind anyway. She is the mother of my children and it was mother's day. Part of the reason I am bothered is because I wasn't bothered as much as I felt like I should have been (?) I spent the rest of the day planting flowers at my new girl's place, but my mind kept drifting back to all of the previous mother's day that I would spent doing that for my ex. One noticible difference was the appreciation my new girl showered on me as opposed to the indifference I mainly got from my ex.
I don't know. I guess I am just sharing an experience. I feel that my lack of reaction and acknowledgement was another step forward.


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## MJJEAN (Jun 26, 2015)

Forward progress is good! 

LSS, DD has always been very close to her paternal grandparents. She was a few months away from 18 and decided she wanted to go down south, go to school there, and hopefully find better economic opportunities than are available here. Her POS father was living near his parents at the time. He hadn't had much contact with DD over the course of 10 years, so it never crossed my mind that he'd come with his father when Grandpa came to pick up DD and her gear

I still harbor so much loathing for my ex that when I saw him get out of the truck to help load DD's gear, the look I gave him actually made him step behind his father, skitter around to the other side of the truck, and dive in. I honestly think I would have done violence had he not moved so fast and had I not felt too much respect for his dad to pulverize the POS right then and there.

You're doing better than I am.


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## joannacroc (Dec 17, 2014)

That's interesting. How old is your daughter who was with her? Had it been me, I would have said hi to my son, and given him a hug if he was older. But he's currently under 3, so it would just have upset my son to see me and then not be able to have me, and to have me leave. Did you choose not to say hi to your daughter for similar reasons? Because you had a GF with you? Because you wanted to avoid conflict for your daughter's sake? I'm just curious about the kid element, having debated what I would do in a similar situation.


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## Ynot (Aug 26, 2014)

joannacroc said:


> That's interesting. How old is your daughter who was with her? Had it been me, I would have said hi to my son, and given him a hug if he was older. But he's currently under 3, so it would just have upset my son to see me and then not be able to have me, and to have me leave. Did you choose not to say hi to your daughter for similar reasons? Because you had a GF with you? Because you wanted to avoid conflict for your daughter's sake? I'm just curious about the kid element, having debated what I would do in a similar situation.


My daughter is an adult. 24 years old. She had her back to where I was so I doubt she saw me at all, I chose not impose myself in their breakfast as it was mother's day. I have not introduced my daughter to the women I have been seeing, and that would not have been the approriate time regardless,


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## Ynot (Aug 26, 2014)

So the story continues...
This afternoon, I am sitting at my desk working when I get a text from my future DIL, "watchadoing?"I responded that I was working so she asked if I had time to talk. I said yes and so she called me. 
Apparently my ex wants to meet with me before the upcoming wedding to hash things out so that there isn't tension. She said she would be willing to come to me and would be agreeable to have my counselor sit in as a mediator in case things escalated. She said she was willing to discuss why she left it would make me feel better about things. 
I told my DIL I was agreeable to meet her. I told her that one the biggest sources of anger that I have is the way she left. I feel I deserved more as her husband of 24 years and being the father of her children. As much as I feel I didn't deserve the treatment I got, I feel even worse about my kids having to see their father treated like a piece of trash to be tossed aside and devastated. 
Early on when ever I said such a thing, I was told that I "wouldn't get the answer I was looking for". But the thing is nobody ever bothered to ask me what that was. Simply put the only thing I ever wanted was the truth.
I have spent months languishing in self doubt, blaming myself. I was such a loser. I was a failure. I was just a miserable SOB that couldn't be happy, etc etc. I never heard a reason, all I ever got was "we talked about it til we were blue in the face"
I guess it was just another thing I chalked up to being taken for granted over all those years. 
All I ever wanted was the truth. Heck if she had told me anything, it would have been better than nothing.
So I called my counselor to see if he would be interested in mediating. He hasn't called me back yet. So I will see.

As an aside, I have to admit a certain guilty pleasure I felt when MY DIL informed me that my ex is now working 2 PT jobs, 75 hours a week, to try to make ends meet. Apparently she was let go by the company who "loved her" because she was such a dedicated employee. I remember having a discussion with her about how she was putting them first while the people who loved her and cared about her got lower priority. Poetic justice? I dunno. She is also now estranged from the "bestie" she moved in with. The one who's exH (her bestie had left her H about a month before my X left me) told me that the whole thing was staged to make me the bad guy, because my ex "knew what buttons to push".


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## Ynot (Aug 26, 2014)

So I am still mulling over this meeting. I think it is very coincidental that she reaches out the day after seeing me with someone else. I also think it is interesting that now she is working two part time jobs trying to make ends meet. i don't know, maybe she just wants to make peace. My future DIL, says my X is having problems relating to our daughter, which is a problem I am having as well. I chalked it up to the fact that her mother pulled the rug out from underneath her and then she had to watch her father freefall into despair. 
Part of me is still so angry. At a time when we should have been setting an example for our daughter to follow, my X decided to chuck it all with no reasons given. Not only did she ruin our relationship but she screwed up every one else's as well.
Then there is a part of me that thinks the only reason for her to reach out now, is so that she can try to preserve her own image. I have no interest in bailing her out of that.
Who knows. I called my counselor. He is off on a medical leave at this time. But said he might be able to refer me to someone else. Maybe I will just go and listen. I have no interest in hearing her lie, so if she does, I may just cut it off early and leave. Maybe she is genuinely interested in making things right between us (I am not talking about a reconciliation but actually being civil again) I cut off all communications with her until she was ready to actually talk about what happened. Maybe she is finally ready?


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## Ynot (Aug 26, 2014)

My thinking this morning is to just go and listen. As I said, I am still very angry about how things went down at the end. Maybe she will give me the closure I have been looking for. But I am not interested in helping her rehabilitate her image. She was the one who decided to go this route, I owe her nothing in the way of helping her make it right. She hurt me. She hurt my family and she is the only one who can make it right. I will be curious to see what her motives actually are


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## Hoosier (May 17, 2011)

I wrote a reply a couple of days ago, on my phone, not sure where it went! Either way. You and I have a lot in common. I get completely that you have questions you want answers to. I can remember taking hours to print out old phone records to see how much she and he were texting back in forth (never once looked at bill before I found out about A, always trusted her completely) because I wanted to KNOW. Today, you could print out those texts, put them on my desk, and I would simply throw them away. Because I have taken a large step forward, I don't care
Any contact with my x just threw me into a spin, that's why I haven't seen her in over 4 years, because that works best for me. My daughter has a wedding in one week, she invited her mother after I told her she should. Now it looks like she will not attend. Either way, I have no need to talk with her before "to ease tensions" I simply plan on ignoring her, staying away from her. It wont be hard. My point? Any interaction between the two of you is kinda pointless. It is what it is. I would suggest you continue healing instead of peeling off the scab again. Just my 2 cents.


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## Hoosier (May 17, 2011)

You can be assured her motives have nothing to do with helping you or your family heal. It will be all about her trying to do something for her. Isnt it always all about her?


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## Ynot (Aug 26, 2014)

Hoosier said:


> You can be assured her motives have nothing to do with helping you or your family heal. It will be all about her trying to do something for her. Isnt it always all about her?


That is my gut reaction as well. She wants to restore her image. I have no interest in doing that. There was no cheating (that I know of) she just decided to walk away, because "we" were "both" walking on eggshells at the end. I know I was. But as far as I could tell, she was just having a merry old time at my expense. Her decision to leave was made in anger of her own creation. If I meet with her it would only be to once again allow my children to see that I am not the bad guy. I didn't choose it, I didn't want it. But I was given no choice.


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## EnjoliWoman (Jul 2, 2012)

I'm not sure what hashing it out, or listening to an explanation that probably has little merit, will accomplish. I'd be more inclined to tell her that you know how to be polite at public functions. And then go and essentially ignore her aside from a polite nod and smile. 

Will she be bringing a date? Perhaps that is why she feels the need to make sure you don't air her dirty laundry. Tension won't be avoidable between you two. Best to remain far apart aside from the polite acknowledgement. I assume you are parents of the groom and will have to be in photos or be seated nearby? Regardless, you can do all of those things without her feeling the need to drag you to some mediator.

Are you planning to take a date? It might be worth talking to your son/DIL about the photos and make it clear that noones date is to be part of the family photos. That's really the only thing that would tick me off if she brought some OM and insisted he be in the photos. If there is a wedding planner, they should be made aware of the situation so someone is in charge of intervening if such a thing occurs.


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## BetrayedDad (Aug 8, 2013)

Ynot said:


> Apparently my ex wants to meet with me before the upcoming wedding to hash things out so that there isn't tension. She said she would be willing to come to me and would be agreeable to have my counselor sit in as a mediator in case things escalated. She said she was willing to discuss why she left it would make me feel better about things.


Personally, I'd of told her, "Thanks for the offer but I'm all set. Have a nice life!" and hung up the phone.

I agree with @Hoosier. This has nothing to do with helping you heal. This is about her alleviating her guilt. Women are emotional creatures and overthink everything ad nauseam. In other words, many women want to "be friends" after they dump you so they don't have to carry the guilt of being the dumper. They can point to the new found friendship and say to themselves, "see it was for the best, now we are both happy!" It's a form of cake eating. 

FVCK that sh!t.... All that will leave you is more bitter and resentful. Go NO CONTACT and let her wallow in her guilt forever. Don't give her the satisfaction. You will regret it.


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## Ynot (Aug 26, 2014)

I called my counselor. He is off on medical leave. He recommended someone else in his practice to me. I called and talked to him. He wants to met with me first rather to see if it would be a comfortable fit before agreeing to meet with her and I. I will meet with him on Monday. He will decide if we move forward or not.
My inclination is that I agree with what many of you have said. I do believe she is just attempting to fix her own image, but as I said I am not interested in helping her do so. She reached out to me thru our children, so I am only doing this at their behest.
I know I shouldn't care what others think, but my kids and my family are all I have left from my past. It is important to me, that they know I tried. 
If the meeting happens, I will listen. As my friends have said, whatever she says, regardless of whatever it is, will at least be confirmation of one of the things that I have felt. 
When it all went down, I was angry. I was bitter, I was upset, I was a jagged ball of emotions. I also went the route of prescription anti-anxiety drugs, to which I had bad reactions to. Most of all I was highly reactive. My thoughts on my divorce are built on this baseline.
In the interim, I have had time to reflect. I am no longer reactive, I am no pro-active. I have tried to learn my lessons, only time will tell if I have. I understand I was not faultless and I have changed. The way I see it, there is no real downside to this meeting. She will either confirm what I think or she won't. It won't change anything if she doesn't, but it could help me gain the finality that I have been looking for. If it doesn't then again nothing will have changed.
She may actually show some real contrition which would make it easier for me to forgive. Or she may show up with completely selfish line of crap, hoping I will buy into it, which I will not. I have no idea what she may have to say. I will listen and respond, this time from a position of strength and confidence rather than as the beaten defeated man I was then.


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## Ynot (Aug 26, 2014)

I realize that I may be being the biggest idiot and glutton for punishment on earth here. But I love my family. My children want me to do this. They do not want issues at their weddings. I completely understand this. I have told them I have no intention of creating a scene. Maybe my intentions are not what they are afraid of?


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## Hoosier (May 17, 2011)

Sure they don't want issues at the wedding, but who is going to be having issues if you don't meet? If my x were to show up at my daughters wedding week from tomorrow, think I could get thru it just fine by simply not engaging her. I wont have a problem restraining myself from kicking her and the POSOM a$$, I'll daydream maybe, but think I can stay in my chair no problem. 

Go, if you really want to go, everyone chooses for themselves, but really don't think it is necessary, nor will it be fruitful. Just sayin...


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## Hoosier (May 17, 2011)

Sure they don't want issues at the wedding, but who is going to be having issues if you don't meet? If my x were to show up at my daughters wedding week from tomorrow, think I could get thru it just fine by simply not engaging her. I wont have a problem restraining myself from kicking her and the POSOM a$$, I'll daydream maybe, but think I can stay in my chair no problem. 

Go, if you really want to go, everyone chooses for themselves, but really don't think it is necessary, nor will it be fruitful. Just sayin...

which way is fueling the drama fire? With the meeting, the x gets to talk for hours about the meeting coming up, gets the emotions that are going to FLOW during the meeting, gets to talk about it afterward to anyone who will listen how she was a victim in it all. 
OR
You go to wedding, ignore her, no talking, no exchanges, your kids see you are not a raving lunatic, thank you for being civil. You go home.


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## anewstart60 (Sep 24, 2015)

Ynot said:


> I realize that I may be being the biggest idiot and glutton for punishment on earth here. But I love my family. My children want me to do this. They do not want issues at their weddings. I completely understand this. I have told them I have no intention of creating a scene. Maybe my intentions are not what they are afraid of?


This my friend is what it is all about. You do what makes you children comfortable at events such as this. They need to be protected from any embarassment a scene may cause and to make sure that wouldn't happen I would do whatever I had to.
Like you, for me it's all about the kids now not the ex.


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## Ynot (Aug 26, 2014)

I am putting this out here as a public service to others who have gone thru, are going thru or will go thru everything that I have been thru.
I have been thinking about my ex wanting to meet me. I did not pursue this. I did not request this. It has come thru my children. I have told myself I am doing this for them. But when I really think about it, I am doing this for me.
I have had to come to the realization that what is really holding me back from really moving forward is that I still harbor some deep seated FANTASY, that some how, some way, my ex is going to realize the incredibly stupid thing she has done, throwing away a perfectly good marriage, destroying my family and lying to my children, that she will show remorse and contrition, agree to counseling and that we can somehow get past this horrible thing that has happened to us and become a happy, healthy couple for all of our remaining years on earth.
As I highlighted, this is a fantasy, but it is still in my mind and still holding me back. But this is an opportunity to confront my fantasy head on and dispel it as that or in the mind set of "never-say-never" validate it as a real possibility.
I have spent the last 21 months of my life trying to make sense of what happened to me/us/her. I have learned many lessons. I know I wasn't perfect, but I am a different person than who I was at the end of my marriage. I will be curious to see if the same holds true for her, regardless of which way it is.
Many of my memories of what happened are clouded thru the blur of anti-anxiety drugs and emotion. I am now far removed from that. Perhaps she will be able to explain to me the how and why things happened? Perhaps she had tried, but I didn't hear it thru the anger? Maybe I will understand. Or perhaps, I will hear the same old selfish, song and dance I remember from that time. Which will confirm that I really am better off without her.
Almost two years removed from the marriage, I am much more aware of my weaknesses. I am aware of my need to be more assertive, I am aware of white-knight tendencies, I am aware of my people pleasing and kowtowing. These were all things I was doing at the end of my marriage. I had ceased being me, I had lost my self respect, and had allowed myself to become a doormat. 
Regardless of what happens, I am looking at this as an opportunity for me, to find closure for me, to kill this fantasy one way or the other and to really start moving forward.


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

Ynot,

As others have said, this is highly unlikely to do a damn thing but hurt you deeply. I'm in a similar time in healing as you are. I have finally refused to talk to my ex on the phone. My mind has been soooo much better. I rarely think of her. She is remarried. She sends me emails giving me parenting tips to try and lure me into commun. To get her ego kibbles. I don't bite. It feels good.

Your wife, as said, is having a meeting only for HER benefit. If she wanted to get back together, it would only be because she's working so hard, not because she discovered her love for you. Once it's gone, it's gone-- my opinion.

There can be zero good come from this. You'll never understand why it happened. Even if she tells you.

Women will even watch you writhe in agony over seeing them just to boost their own ego.
That's what is going to happen here. 
You're going to want to ask if there's any way it could work out, because you've changed and all, and she is going to gleefully tell you no. It's going to put you back mentally about 20 months. 

You have just got to let her go. That's what I've done, and I feel better all the time. 

I know you're going to go, but it's going to hurt you. Just wanted to warn you. I doubt it's under your power not to go.

I hope it goes ok. I know regardless what happens that you're going to be hurting, so I'll just say good luck and be strong. This kind of stuff, we men aren't made for. Helplessness. I hate that feeling most of all.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Bibi1031 (Sep 14, 2015)

In all honesty to yourself...can you get past the anger and bitterness of her letting the life you two built go? Can you really forgive and forget if the reconciliation card is placed on the table? 

You have some deep soul searching to do and real fast since the wedding is coming up soon. I think she fears your reaction because she knows your deep seated anger is still there. She knows you very well. Be cautious and keep being honest with yourself.


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## Ynot (Aug 26, 2014)

Just an update for those who may be wondering.
I went to see a counselor. The guy I had been seeing is off on medical leave, so I met with a new one. He did not feel as though he were ready to jump in quite yet. He wanted to meet with me again. Could've been a marketing ploy, maybe not. 
In the meantime I had informed my future DIL that I was doing this and wouldn't know anything until after I met with him. 
She responded with a "great! let me know asap since X wants to meet asap since the weddings are coming up. So once I got back I told her the counselor was a no go for the time being but that if my X was serious, we could meet on Tuesday 5/31. This one of the days she had offered as a possibility. I said she could pick the time and the place. Anyways, I didn't hear anything until yesterday. Apparently she can't get off work from her minimum wage waitressing job in order to meet and has offered up several dates in August as possibilities. I texted my DIL to ask what happened to her sense of urgency? To which she replied, that my X just wasn't going to be free, she just wanted to make sure I was open to meeting her and as far as the weddings go we will just have to be go along to get along. Whatever, it just further confirms my thoughts that in the end she was all style over substance and appearances mattered more than reality.


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## brooklynAnn (Jun 29, 2015)

Let it go my friend. You were doing so well and making such improvements. Don't let this one tiny thing cause you to move two steps back. Understand the person you are dealing with and realize you have no power to change her or how she response. 

What you do have, is the power to control your reaction and response. And that is all you can do. 

Enjoy the rest of your weekend. Don't dwell on this and have some fun.


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## Ynot (Aug 26, 2014)

The reality is that this whole situation has once again prompted me to relook and reconsider and rethink everything that has happened. In the process I am sharpening my focus and refining my conclusions and assumptions. It has not been a bad thing overall. Rather it has been an exercise in intellectual and emotional development which I can learn from - about me, about my life and how I look at it.


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