# Not sure what to do. Please help



## Louis8 (Mar 21, 2013)

About 8 months ago my wife (of 9 years) went out of town for a wedding without me. When she came back, I noticed some odd behavior, such as being distant, working out more, changing her clothes and appearance, etc... Her behavior toward me changed and she basically was marginalizing me in her life. Being very brazen and uncaring. At first I thought it was a friend rubbing off on her or something, but then...

I found out she was texting this guy she met at the wedding. She'd lay in bed and do this before bed time almost every night. I asked her about it and she lied and said it was her girlfriend. Knowing she lied, I looked up the phone records. Tons of texts and calls early in the morning before I got up. Long calls at all hours to this guy when she went on a girls vacation shortly after this wedding.

Unfortunately, I confronted her over the phone because I was very upset (and in the process, she covered her tracks). She continued to lie but I finally got it out of her it was a guy and where she met him. She swears up and down nothing happened, but there was no reason to lie because I've never been jealous and I'm okay with her having guy friends and vice versa. 

I got it out of her that she was sexually attracted to him and she thought about having sex with him. But, she swears nothing happened. 

I'm not dumb. I know you don't have that kind of contact with someone, lie about it, and nothing's going on. So I've been suspicious and untrusting, but I couldn't prove anything. 

Fast forward 8 months later, I see this guy is face timing her on her iPhone last night. I'm all the way across the country for another 2 months and can't confront her in person and I don't want to alert her that I'm aware of them talking before I see more of their communication. (I think I should point out this guy lives out of state, so they probably aren't in constant physical contact)

So needless to say I'm freaking out right now. I've known her since we were in high school (we got married later) and I thought we both really loved each other before this. 

Any suggestions on how to handle this? I feel pretty confident something happened or may still be happening. Do I sound crazy? It sucks because I just don't really trust her any more and I'm too far away to do anything. 

Please, I really need some advice.


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## jnj express (Mar 28, 2011)

For starters, how about a definition of mge.------You don't allow your wife to have time with other men, who are not friends of your mge---especially when you are apart----you are just allowing her to go in harms way-------do you remember when you took vows---it was just the 2 of you, no extra members of the opposite sex thrown in.

Does this come from the fact that you both were promiscuous in Hi School, moving about with lots of different partners, cuz, normal marrieds do not allow their partners to just freely have contact with those of the opposite sex, unless they know, and can trust that person, -----throw on top of that, being alone, and not having physical needs met---you got a recipe for disaster.

You need to lay low---investigate, and try somehow to get home on the weekends, even if it costs money---cuz it is to the point of money vs. your mge---and to have any hope of your mge making it, you need to be with your wife.


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## Louis8 (Mar 21, 2013)

I should clarify...

We don't openly (or in my case knowingly) have alone time with members of the opposite sex. What I intended to say is we both have friends that are of both sexes, and in the past there hasn't been any jealousy. There has never been a situation (until now) where either one of us has been alone with another man/woman or had conversations like they've been having.

I just wanted to give some context because it didn't really make sense why she would lie to me about talking to someone unless she had something to hide. I've never confronted her on something like this before, or vice versa, because it's never had to come up.

I've been reading on these forums more and I think I see a pattern. And, I think you're right about the information gathering. I have a way to do that partially, but yeah it's hard when you're on the other coast.

I felt like I was just starting to get over the hurt from before, but now this happens. Guess it never truly went away. I can't get over the way she lied to my face with ease. And now this same guy is showing up in our life again... And it's 5 in the morning and I'm too wound up to sleep


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## Remains (Jan 24, 2012)

Definitely go into information gathering mode. Pretend all is good. This is how you will get to any truth. 

(NEVER reveal your sources of information gathering. Whichever route you follow.)

Or, as jnj said, you can stop this now. You can lay down the rules of your marriage and give her the ultimatum that she gives this guy up immediately, it is either him or the marriage. And any attempt to have contact with him will be interpreted as her choice is him over the marriage. And follow through with the consequences. You know what is going on. Tackle it now if you want to save what is left of your marriage. If not, she has 2 months free reign to escalate this situation to a place that your relationship may not recover from.

Again, never ever reveal your sources.


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## rrrbbbttt (Apr 6, 2011)

1. Prepare yourself, you think it has not become a PA but she was away from you and now you are away from her and are not there to see what has happened. 

2. She has changed since she was free to do whatever she wanted. She is now texting another man, even though she knows it bothers you. In my opinion, it has gone Physical, probably at the wedding, and she is now trying to maintain that relationship. She is trickle- truthing you.

3. Demand NC with the POS. Get her to write a letter and you send it after you have read it.

4. Demand Passwords and monitor the texts.

If this does not stop her or she does not agree with your demands:

5. If she doesn't, prepare for D. Seperate your assets so that she is not taking from you to continue this affair.

6. Do the 180 on her.

7. Get a VAR and put in her car

8. See a lawyer and find out your options right away.

8. Never reveal your sources of anything as stated above


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## walkonmars (Aug 21, 2012)

Do you have kids?

Do you have family living nearby for support? Does she?

Why are you across the country? Military?

How are your finances? Does she work/able to support herself?


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## illwill (Feb 21, 2013)

Your marriage is over. What I mean is the old one is. Figure out what your dealbreakers are, and this time she needs REAL consequences. Gather your info and when you confront only speak of your marriage in the past tense. She needs to understand and truly believe you will divorce her.

If more betrayed spouses simply filed for divorce on DDay there would be no trickle truth and a lot more remorse and regret.


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## Louis8 (Mar 21, 2013)

No kids. She can support herself now. Neither of us have direct family in the region where we live, but not too far away. I am in school right now, so that's why I am across the country. I went home last week and all seemed fine. 

She originally told me she had broken contact with him by sending an email (now I realize I should have asked to see it). Unfortunately, this guy is a friend of the family (due to the wedding) and he lives in an area she wants to move to (to be fair, she wanted to move there before she met him, but still).

So it sounds like my options are:
1. Pretend like all is good and gather more information to be sure
2. Lay down the law and confront her with the demands mentioned by rrrbbbttt
*(BTW, what is the 180?)*

For all I know, this guy could have been trying to contact her and she rejected it. However, I never laid down any rules after this happened other than she has to talk to me when there is something wrong so we don't get in this place again. Yes, I did threaten with a divorce when I originally found out, so I think she knows thats on the table.

I think information gathering might be the right move. I don't want to blow it by confronting her and then she covers up her tracks again. I could be wrong, but being in this state of not knowing seems worse than if I just knew and could move on.


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## ArmyofJuan (Dec 29, 2010)

You need more evidence but this doesn’t look good.

The options are yours, tell her you will not tolerate her speaking to him and if she continues then she needs to leave and you’ll file for a D or go all ninja and do the VAR/phone records thing. Don’t waste your time talking to her to get info; you already know she’ll lie right to your face.

The lying by itself could be a deal breaker, it means you can’t trust her and it’s not a good idea to be married to someone you can’t trust.

Even if there wasn’t an A (all the signs point to at least an EA) her lying to a major problem and needs to be address on its own.


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## Plan 9 from OS (Jul 13, 2012)

Louis8 said:


> No kids. She can support herself now. Neither of us have direct family in the region where we live, but not too far away. I am in school right now, so that's why I am across the country. I went home last week and all seemed fine.
> 
> She originally told me she had broken contact with him by sending an email (now I realize I should have asked to see it). *Unfortunately, this guy is a friend of the family (due to the wedding) and he lives in an area she wants to move to (to be fair, she wanted to move there before she met him, but still).*
> 
> ...


How can the guy be a friend of the family, but she only met him at the wedding? Why did she go to a wedding by herself? Why did she take a vacation to go somewhere without you? 

Yeah...if full blown sex didn't happen at this wedding reception, a lot of inappropriate touching did happen. 

The other guys who have been through this will get you all set up on how to gather intel to determine the depth and severity of the betrayal.

But I'll offer this up to you to think about. Without knowing anything else aside from what you posted. You are 1) too trusting, 2) have a low sense of what constitutes proper boundaries, 3) Probably have the notion that privacy is important within a marriage (it's actually bad).


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## rrrbbbttt (Apr 6, 2011)

Quick google search showed this link for 180 The 180 | Being a Beautiful Mess


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## Louis8 (Mar 21, 2013)

Thanks for all your help. 

I like ArmyOfJuans approach. I definitely believe there was at least an EA, perhaps something else. It's that and the boldface lying that have caused my mistrust.



> How can the guy be a friend of the family, but she only met him at the wedding? Why did she go to a wedding by herself? Why did she take a vacation to go somewhere without you?
> 
> Yeah...if full blown sex didn't happen at this wedding reception, a lot of inappropriate touching did happen.


He's a childhood friend of her cousin's husband. So not like a close friend of the family, but one nonethelesss. I was supposed to go to the wedding with her, but I was busy at work and we decided to save the money. I'm fairly certain that she did not know this guy prior t the wedding. As far as vacations, her and her best friend take a yearly girls vacation. Do you think that should stop? They're doing it agian this year.

rrrbbbttt, thanks for the link. I wasn't sure exactly what to search on and just searching for the 180 returned all kinds of random stuff. Giving this a read now.


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## Louis8 (Mar 21, 2013)

> But I'll offer this up to you to think about. Without knowing anything else aside from what you posted. You are 1) too trusting, 2) have a low sense of what constitutes proper boundaries, 3) Probably have the notion that privacy is important within a marriage (it's actually bad).


Thanks for this. I think #1 dictates #2. I would say until this happened, all of her guy friends were either my friends or boyfriends/husbandds of her girlfriends. So it was not like she had guy friends she would hang out iwth or talk to, unless we were all hangning out togehter. 

But yes, perhaps I am too trusting and have a poor sense of proper boundaries. Until this happened, I never had a reason not to trust her and we're married. Shouldn't you give you SO the benefit of the doubt until they give you a reason not to trust them? Isn't that part of the package? I'd rather be alone or with someone else in a less serious relationship than having to always wonder if I'm being lied to.

And for 3, you maybe right here too. I didn't feel the need to check her private emails and/or texts. I'm just not like that. If I have to live in that way, I'd rather just split up. I don't love anyone that much to make my life that kind of hell.


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## Toffer (Jan 31, 2012)

Louis,

First of all, distance is a relationship killer that should be avoided at all costs. Is there anyway she can move to where you are? That should be part of your agreement to R. And BTW, she should move NOW

Next, as part of your R, you need to tell her how she's destroyed the trust you had for her and that one of the steps to restoring that trust will be for her to take a polygraph for you. If she refuses, you then have your answer on whether her affair went physical or not.

If she agrees, don't let her off the hook. Schedule the test and drive her to it. Many a parking lot confession have been rendered by waywards as they sit in the lot or the reception area of the polygraph office.

Good luck. I think you're gonna need it


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## B1 (Jun 14, 2012)

To me, I would already have all the info I needed. She is carrying on a relationship behind your back! DID YOU HEAR THAT, she is having a relationship with another man, right now, what more do you need.

Yes, I believe it very likely went physical at the wedding. If you gathered info that would be the only reason I would see to do it. But still, I would call her out and threaten a poly to see if it went physical.

Lay down the law, she stops or you leave her, she chooses...him or you.
My guess is this is NOT going to be easy for her, she believes she is very emotionally connected to this guy, maybe even thinks she is in love. Think about it, she knows you were on to here, yet she is still doing it...that attraction to him is strong. It won't break off easy. She may even fight you. It's like a drug and she is addicted right now!

Again she chooses him or you! Fly home for the weekend and get to the bottom of it and give her this ultimatum.

Sorry your going through this, it's all consuming, I know.
If it were me, I would fly home, if possible, and get to the bottom of this! It's going to drive you crazy if you don't get some resolve soon.


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

Obviously she never ended contact she just took it under ground.

You need to assume its been physical and they were likely having cam sex this last time, she thinks your away so it's safe to do.

Don't assue he's too far away to hook up. He could easily fly in for a weekend or she could fly to him. You are away so she's got compete freedom for anything.

Based on her actions post the wedding, I'd say they hooked up, otherwise she wouldn't have been acting the way she did. He came back woman who is in a new relationship. Not a woman who mer and flirted with someone. No, it was a new relationship founded on having hooked up.


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## lisab0105 (Oct 26, 2011)

Lets put it like this...the more time you spend "gathering information" is one more day you are letting your wife choose another man over yourself. 

You know she is face timing him..not to be vulger but I am sure they are not just talking at this point. 

You don't need any other information. Tell your wife to end all contact. Tell this friend of the family to stop talking to your wife. Let her family know that she is having an emotional affair with this guy. 

End this before she does anything else she can't take back. 

You don't need anything else. There is nothing for her to cover. It is him or her marriage. Make her choose now.


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

At this point you know she's continuing to lie to you. She's putting lots of energy into this other man, and choosing him over you.

Accept nothing less than a polygraph before you accept that they haven't been having sex.

Look for secret email accounts and messaging accounts.


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## Hicks (Jan 14, 2011)

The question is, if she loses you, what does she lose?

Has she already lost what you have to give her, when you made the move to live far away? 

It's hard to take the hard line with her, if she does not really need you.

That's what you should ponder.


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## phillybeffandswiss (Jan 20, 2013)

Louis8 said:


> No kids.
> For all I know, this guy could have been trying to contact her and she rejected it. However, I never laid down any rules after this happened other than she has to talk to me when there is something wrong so we don't get in this place again. Yes, I did threaten with a divorce when I originally found out, so I think she knows thats on the table.


Don't play this minimization, self blame and excusing game, it only makes the truth hurt worse.


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## LetDownNTX (Oct 4, 2012)

lisab0105 said:


> Lets put it like this...the more time you spend "gathering information" is one more day you are letting your wife choose another man over yourself.
> 
> You know she is face timing him..not to be vulger but I am sure they are not just talking at this point.
> 
> ...


While I agree with all of this in most cases, I think that with him being half way across the country and not there to keep an eye on her that it gives her plenty of time to get it all underground before he comes back home (burner phone, etc). All the while being sweet, batting her eyelashes and saying she loves her husband and wont talk to OM again!


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## BobSimmons (Mar 2, 2013)

But he definitely knows something is up now, so when he gets home, he'll be able to install the keyloggers, software on her phone and VAR. If she's in as deep as it looks, it will only be a matter of time before she/he try to get in contact again.

He tried once to confront, she took it underground. Gather the evidence so the next time you confront she has nowhere to twist or try wriggle her way out of it.


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