# So hard to keep dealing with this



## tap41303 (Apr 16, 2014)

Ok so my wife and i have been together for 10 years, married for 5. She has always been not very affectionate. You know shes not into the just kissing all the time or saying i love you and whatever so ive gotten use to that. However, its just really starting to bother me. I have no security in our relationship because i receive no validation. I love her with all my heart and i tell her everyday and i just dont understand how if you love someone you can keep those feelings to yourself. She says i love you after i say it to her and all but she never initiates anything. She is the same way with our daughter. Shes 4 and my wife snaps at her a lot and gets irritated easily, same way she does with me. Its almost as if she doesnt know how to express affection.
Now the sex thing, again, its always been a rare thing with her, even when we first met. I dont know why i keep thinking she will change. She goes through spurts where she wants it a lot but for the most part it is once a month. (today we hit the 2 month mark, a new high! : ( ) Today was my birthday, but she was sick cuz she is 2 months pregnant so i knew it was a no go. I brought it up to her about how this is just killing me and i need her to act like she cares. She got mad, said it was the pregnancy hormones and bs. Which yea i can understand but this has been going on for 10 years.
It is just beyond frustrating to be so in love with someone and not have any type of recurrent reciprocation. We only see each other for a combined 16 hours a week on average due to our work schedules. I take a lot of time off though because she begs me to stay with her and she doesnt want me to go. Its just so damn confusing, its mixed vibes all the time. I just need advice on how to proceed with this. Divorce is not an option for me. I just cant keep my sanity when im feeling this way constantly.

Sorry if im rambling, i just couldnt take it anymore and i had to vent it out. I hope someone has gone through something similar or can shed some light on this. 
Thanks


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

You'll find a lot of men here and several women who made the mistake of marrying someone who doesn't place sex or physical affection very high on their list of priorities. 

You say your wife has always been this way, people will ask why you married her. But I did the same thing so I can assume that at the time, your love was so strong you didn't feel the absence of their love. And now you do.

There are various things you can do but the bottom line is, unless you're willing to make this a make or break issue, you're stuck.

I decided to leave. He decided I was worth the effort to change. And he has.


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## As'laDain (Nov 27, 2011)

are you fulfilling all of her needs? 

find out what they are. if your not fulfilling all of them, then start doing it and see if it changes. if you ARE fulfilling all of them, then only fulfill her needs when she fulfills yours. 

right now its not an issue for her. its just annoying her that you keep whining about it. its an issue for you. 

make it an issue for her as well.


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## Rowan (Apr 3, 2012)

That she is asking you to stay with her, not to leave, to take off work to spend time with her, is probably a good sign. It may be that the two of you don't get enough quality time together for her to feel emotionally connected to you. Some work on figuring out what each of your emotional needs are might help some.

However, you did marry a woman with a much lower sex drive than your own. It may be that early on, she was meeting enough of your other emotional needs that the lack of sex wasn't a deal breaker for you. If so, then getting back to something closer to the relationship you two had when dating might help lessen your dissatisfaction about sex. But it's unlikely that your wife, who has never been high-drive, is going to suddenly flip a switch and become a sexual dynamo. I think you need to figure out if the sexlife you had earlier on with her is enough and try to work back toward that as a goal. If that level of sex won't work for you any longer, then you'll have to decide if you want to stay in this relationship. You probably aren't going to get much more sex than you had during the "honeymoon" phase.


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## jorgegene (May 26, 2012)

tap;

When you say you hit the '2 month mark, a new high', does that mean you had sex twice in one month?

how long has it been average once per month?

Always, or how many years?

When you do have sex, is it satisfying to both of you? 

obviously, you find her attractive. Do you think she finds you attractive? Is there anything you think you can do to up your sexiness to her?

Is scheduled sex an option? Set aside like sunday afternoons for example. Sunday afternoon is sex time.


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## 6301 (May 11, 2013)

You already compounded the problem by getting her pregnant again.

If this has been going on for such a long time and your not satisfied with the way your being treated, and she refuses to move off of square one, then adding another kid isn't going to help you one bit. Your digging yourself a deeper hole.


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## C123 (Jun 20, 2012)

6301 said:


> You already compounded the problem by getting her pregnant again.
> 
> If this has been going on for such a long time and your not satisfied with the way your being treated, and she refuses to move off of square one, then adding another kid isn't going to help you one bit. Your digging yourself a deeper hole.


Well, it's a little too late for this advice.

Some women have a harder time with pregnancy than others, especially the first few months. So long as she's never made excuses about sex before, then I'd take her at face value.

With that said, I'm afraid you made this bed and now you must sleep in it...with no sex, of course. 

Most men who now live in sexless or low sex marriages did not have much idea of what they were in for because their spouses were shagging them rotten at the beginning of the relationship. When I moved in with my wife after 3 months of dating, we were having sex every single day. Over time, that dwindled and then after marriage, it dropped off a cliff due to a number of reasons, one of which is that ultimately, she's pretty LD. However, I had no reason to know that when we were dating and engaged.

You, on the other hand, knew your wife was LD, yet you still married her. There was no reason to think she'd get more sexual as you were married longer. Marriage and kids and bills and mortgages and life and the end of the "honeymoon" phase do not make women hornier.

Now you have a family (and congrats on the impending kid, by the way!) and you need to make a choice. Can you live with your wife (who did not falsely advertise who she was when you were dating) the way she is, or can't you?

It seems like she loves you in her own way, just as she likely always has. Now you need more than you used to and are asking her to change to suit your needs. I think it's fair to have discussions with her regarding this, but you can't pin this on her. This is on you. You knew what you were getting when you said "I do."

People change. You need more than you used to. Figure out what's best for you, but don't forget about the promises you've made to the people you love...wife and kids.

Best of luck!


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## GettingIt_2 (Apr 12, 2013)

tap41303 said:


> Ok so my wife and i have been together for 10 years, married for 5. She has always been not very affectionate. You know shes not into the just kissing all the time or saying i love you and whatever so ive gotten use to that. However, its just really starting to bother me. I have no security in our relationship because i receive no validation. I love her with all my heart and i tell her everyday and i just dont understand how if you love someone you can keep those feelings to yourself. She says i love you after i say it to her and all but she never initiates anything. She is the same way with our daughter. Shes 4 and my wife snaps at her a lot and gets irritated easily, same way she does with me. Its almost as if she doesnt know how to express affection.
> Now the sex thing, again, its always been a rare thing with her, even when we first met. I dont know why i keep thinking she will change. She goes through spurts where she wants it a lot but for the most part it is once a month. (today we hit the 2 month mark, a new high! : ( ) Today was my birthday, but she was sick cuz she is 2 months pregnant so i knew it was a no go. I brought it up to her about how this is just killing me and i need her to act like she cares. She got mad, said it was the pregnancy hormones and bs. Which yea i can understand but this has been going on for 10 years.
> It is just beyond frustrating to be so in love with someone and not have any type of recurrent reciprocation. We only see each other for a combined 16 hours a week on average due to our work schedules. I take a lot of time off though because she begs me to stay with her and she doesnt want me to go. Its just so damn confusing, its mixed vibes all the time. I just need advice on how to proceed with this. Divorce is not an option for me. I just cant keep my sanity when im feeling this way constantly.
> 
> ...


This seems to be a fairly common dynamic that pops up on TAM--the husband who has a higher need for affirmation of love and affection paired with a wife who has a lower need and, in fact, who can feel crowded and even experience a loss of attraction by the needs of her husband. 

It describes my husband and I, and this dynamic was a significant contributor to ten years of low emotional and sexual intimacy. 

There is a thread somewhere about the "temperature" of the spouses in a marriage. (I think it's by MEM11363) I think the gist of it is that one spouse runs emotionally warmer, and one runs emotionally cooler. If there is a significant distance between the two temps, it can cause problems. Neither spouse is right or wrong, they're just not the best match, "emotional-temperature" wise. 

I run much cooler than my husband. I need space, I can get distant, and am not one to have affection and affirmation on my mind a lot. It's not that I don't feel it, but I need to focus on it to act on it. When I'm busy or am working things out in my mind (as I often am during the day) emotional thoughts tend to get pushed to the back. When I'm in this mode, initiation of affection from my husband often annoys me because it forces me to "switch tracks," which I don't do well. If he interrupts me to discuss family issues or scheduling or ask me to do a task, I'm usually fine--it's within the realm of "work." No shifting necessary. 

My husband runs warm. He prefers to see me smiling and ready for a hug as often as he want one, or wants to give one. He like when I pop into his office (he works at home) for positive contact multiple times a day. He doesn't want me coming in to ask a question or get his opinion or to discuss the family schedule or what's for dinner. I can sit on his lap, give him a kiss, do something sexual--all good. The thing is, I'm usually in "work" mode during the day and it's just not on my mind. I find that my husband will start to watch me for signs that I'm upset--with him, in particular, but also about anything. Then he has the urge to try and "fix" it. He wants to get me back to smiling, being affectionate, etc. In the meantime, I get exasperated--I was just working, after all! I feel scrutinized. I feel crowded. I become aware of his lack of satisfaction with my demeanor. 

In the past, I think I often felt that I never got the _chance_ to initiate affection on my own terms because he was either doing it, or watching me and waiting/hoping for me to do it. It resulted in me feeling resentful. It also caused my sexual attraction for him to tank--I guess I saw him as needy, and this carried over to sex. I felt like I was always wanted, always needed . . . less so than _desired_ as a woman. I didn't see him as a confident lover, rather as a questioning one. What I mean is that he became tentative to initiate unless there was guaranteed success, and he became very withdrawn when there was not. Eventually, I noticed he was always gauging me for signs that I would accept his advances--always "questioning" the circumstances and adapting his behavior accordingly. 

So that is, in part, how we ended up having sex just a few times a month for the ten years after we were married, down from many times a week for the ten years we dated. 

What we've done to successfully address it is to understand how we are emotionally different. It's actually helped him a lot to understand that I'm just cooler--not cooler for him, but that's just my personality. He gives me more space and doesn't withdraw or "watch" me or try to diagnose and fix my mood. He attends to his own wants and needs without making sure it's "okay" with me first. 

I focus on keeping affection and positive interactions on my mind, and act on them multiple times a day. At first I had to pick ways to sort of "schedule" them. For example, I started to offer to fix him lunch and bring it into his office every day. I knew that when lunch rolled around, it was time to put work out of my mind and focus on my husband. Another thing I've done: after my late morning post work out shower, I saunter into his office wearing little to nothing and sit on his lap for five minutes. I know that he craves this sort of thing, and I'm happy to make him happy now that I understand it better. 

Our marriage is vastly improved, and our emotional and sexual intimacy is better than it's ever been in our marriage. He and I were lucky in that we BOTH worked on understanding our dynamic better and making changes FOR the other person, but I do think one person can also change the dynamic when a better understanding of their spouse is gained. 

Sorry for the long post, OP, but, as I said, it seems like this warm husband/cool wife pairing isn't uncommon and results in the same sort of complaints.


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## MissScarlett (May 22, 2013)

I don't know, I guess having married someone who was LD than I was - I think as a young newlywed you have every reason to think things will improve.

Of course with the benefit of hindsight you can see that the person you married did stay the same sexually. They didn't deviate from how things were in the beginning.

However, at the time, don't we expect that absolutely everything is going to improve? Like many if not most newlywed couples, my DH and I ate dinner on a camping table for 2 years. We were each barely making 20k/year. I had every reason to believe we would eventually own a house, be able to retire, have children, that we would eventually be making a comfortable living.

Why not assume that the longer the sexual relationship the better it would get too? I certainly did. We didn't live together before marriage (although we were having sex.) I don't think I was off in thinking living together and spending much more time together was going to result in better, kinkier, more erotic sex. I, for one, can't tell a person they got what they married (sexually) because I did the same thing.


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## jb02157 (Apr 16, 2014)

I understand completely what you are going through and I very much disagree with the other who have posted here. I'm about to say something that most people won't agree with, but it's true and if people disagree, I don't care. 

People don't run hot and cold, it's foolish to believe that. Sex for women isn't a priority unless they are looking to attract someone. In both of our cases that's already done. Our wives don't have to worry about that so they don't care if they aren't being as attentive as they should be. Soceity gives women the option to be a refuser, if men don't like it, they are free to give the women everything they have in a divorce or deal with it. So, we deal with it. Society is built for marriage to fail like this. Unless marriage becomes a level playing field, men will never get what they deserve in a marriage, only having to supply everything and get nothing in return, and women will be free to do as they wish an not have responsibilities. In any other contract, one party not living up to their responsibility is a breech of contract, not in a marriage contract. Men have to learn to go withoout sex or go without money


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## jb02157 (Apr 16, 2014)

I did the same thing you did. I married an asexual woman hoping things would improve..they never did. I wish I could take it back.


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## GettingIt_2 (Apr 12, 2013)

Yes, you do always have the option to give up, do nothing, cheat, wallow in your helplessness, punish your wife emotionally, or become a bitter shell of a person. 

Our choices define us.


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## I Don't Know (Oct 8, 2013)

MissScarlett said:


> I don't know, I guess having married someone who was LD than I was - I think as a young newlywed you have every reason to think things will improve.
> 
> Of course with the benefit of hindsight you can see that the person you married did stay the same sexually. They didn't deviate from how things were in the beginning.
> 
> ...


I couldn't agree more MissScarlett. I felt the same way in my first marriage. In my mind more time together would mean more sex. Or if I was just not that good at it, it would get better and then she'd want it more. Doesn't work that way, but as a optimistic 20 something it makes perfect sense.


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## onedge (Nov 27, 2013)

I am sort of like your wife in a way. My husband is usually the one who kisses me or says I love you. I do respond back but usually my mind is elsewhere. I am more the dominant one when it comes to initiating sex, though.


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## chillymorn (Aug 11, 2010)

maybe your just not good in the sack! and she is dissatisfied so she avoids sex and is afraid to mention it as not to hurt your feelings.

If you have read up on how to please a woman....find her g spot,good at oral etc etc also on how to make love to her mind through out the day and she still is a cold fish sexually then you need to decide if this (having a unsatisfying sex life) is a deal breaker or not!


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## Truly Abby (Sep 16, 2013)

jb02157 said:


> I understand completely what you are going through and I very much disagree with the other who have posted here. I'm about to say something that most people won't agree with, but it's true and if people disagree, I don't care.
> 
> People don't run hot and cold, it's foolish to believe that. * Sex for women isn't a priority unless they are looking to attract someone.* In both of our cases that's already done. Our wives don't have to worry about that so they don't care if they aren't being as attentive as they should be. Soceity gives women the option to be a refuser, if men don't like it, they are free to give the women everything they have in a divorce or deal with it. So, we deal with it. *Society is built for marriage to fail like this. Unless marriage becomes a level playing field, men will never get what they deserve in a marriage, only having to supply everything and get nothing in return, and women will be free to do as they wish an not have responsibilities.* In any other contract, one party not living up to their responsibility is a breech of contract, not in a marriage contract. Men have to learn to go withoout sex or go without money


This is not 1952. Thanks for the laugh. :rofl:


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## Big Mama (Mar 24, 2014)

I do not like sex, I have never liked sex. I do not like holding hands and cuddling. I do not like kissing, I'd rather kiss my dog. 

Some of this has to do with emotional connections and how I am afraid of them. Maybe your wife is afraid of emotional connections. Has she been "hurt" by someone in the past? Just curious. 

That being said, I have reasons for feeling the way I do. Childhood issues, sexual abuse as a teen, and the list goes on. My parents were not affectionate folks, church looked down on being openly affectionate. So why would I grow up believing it is safe to be cuddly much less sexual. How is your wife's up bringing, religious and family, as far as setting an example?

I try to show my husband I love him. I have packed his lunch every day since we got married. (20 years) I am a stay at home mom, and I fix home cooked meals every evening for supper. I wash his clothes, fold his clothes, clean his house, make his meals, pack his lunch, run errands he ask of me even if they are inconvenient. I would think all of that says LOVE. But it obviously doesn't cause my H has the same gripe. I am just not that friendly in the sack or loving out of the sack either. Kind, thoughtful, caring, yes, but affectionate and "loving" not so much. 

I am surprised no one here has suggested marriage counseling or a sex therapist. It might be worth a try.


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## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

Victim speak at it's finest. 




jb02157 said:


> I understand completely what you are going through and I very much disagree with the other who have posted here. I'm about to say something that most people won't agree with, but it's true and if people disagree, I don't care.
> 
> People don't run hot and cold, it's foolish to believe that. Sex for women isn't a priority unless they are looking to attract someone. In both of our cases that's already done. Our wives don't have to worry about that so they don't care if they aren't being as attentive as they should be. Soceity gives women the option to be a refuser, if men don't like it, they are free to give the women everything they have in a divorce or deal with it. So, we deal with it. Society is built for marriage to fail like this. Unless marriage becomes a level playing field, men will never get what they deserve in a marriage, only having to supply everything and get nothing in return, and women will be free to do as they wish an not have responsibilities. In any other contract, one party not living up to their responsibility is a breech of contract, not in a marriage contract. Men have to learn to go withoout sex or go without money


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## soulseer (Jul 26, 2013)

MEM11363 said:


> Victim speak at it's finest.


unconstructive criticism at its best. 

With constructive criticism suggestions/observations/advice have the potential to aid the person being criticised.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LongWalk (Apr 4, 2013)

tap41303 said:


> Ok so my wife and i have been together for 10 years, married for 5. She has always been not very affectionate. You know shes not into the just kissing all the time or saying i love you and whatever so ive gotten use to that. However, its just really starting to bother me.
> *You have reached the breaking point.*
> 
> I have no security in our relationship because i receive no validation. I love her with all my heart and i tell her everyday and i just dont understand how if you love someone you can keep those feelings to yourself. She says i love you after i say it to her and all but she never initiates anything.
> ...


*You don't provide anything positive about your wife or marriage to make it worth staying. It's not just the sexlessness, but her lack of interest in you except as a celibate companion. 

What interests does she have in life? Does she watch a lot of TV. Surf Facebook for hours? Does she work out?

Why is that you need her so much and she doesn't need you much at all except as a roommate?

Are you sorry she pregnant again? Are you feeling trapped?

Are you overweight? Smoke? Drink?*

Watch this video for insight.

Tell yourself you are going to solve this problem and have a good life.


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## scientia (Aug 27, 2012)

tap41303 said:


> We only see each other for a combined 16 hours a week on average due to our work schedules.


There are possibly ways of dealing with this. What is the breakdown of those 16 hours?



> I take a lot of time off though because she begs me to stay with her and she doesnt want me to go.


It sounds like there are things that she wants and perhaps not getting.


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

Anon Pink said:


> You'll find a lot of men here and several women who made the mistake of marrying someone who doesn't place sex or physical affection very high on their list of priorities.



One would have to be Honest Abe to admit before marriage that they don't like sex or that they don't put a priority in it.

A mistake is when you press the blue button vs the red button. This is more like sticking a red sticker on top of the blue button...


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## usmarriedguy (Dec 9, 2013)

I knew my wife had a much lower interest in sex before marriage 
-yes, I also hoped it would improve. 

...but decided it was workable and that the good outweighed the bad. 

I do not know what advice to give. 
You need to realize that she loves in her way and love is not often like a romantic novel or a Disney movie. 

It is a shame, I am a real sap for romantic love stories but life gets in the way. Kids, work schedules, etc..


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## MeatTrain (Dec 4, 2013)

tap41303 said:


> Ok so my wife and i have been together for 10 years, married for 5. She has always been not very affectionate. You know shes not into the just kissing all the time or saying i love you and whatever so ive gotten use to that. However, its just really starting to bother me. I have no security in our relationship because i receive no validation. I love her with all my heart and i tell her everyday and i just dont understand how if you love someone you can keep those feelings to yourself. She says i love you after i say it to her and all but she never initiates anything. She is the same way with our daughter. Shes 4 and my wife snaps at her a lot and gets irritated easily, same way she does with me. Its almost as if she doesnt know how to express affection.
> Now the sex thing, again, its always been a rare thing with her, even when we first met. I dont know why i keep thinking she will change. She goes through spurts where she wants it a lot but for the most part it is once a month. (today we hit the 2 month mark, a new high! : ( ) Today was my birthday, but she was sick cuz she is 2 months pregnant so i knew it was a no go. I brought it up to her about how this is just killing me and i need her to act like she cares. She got mad, said it was the pregnancy hormones and bs. Which yea i can understand but this has been going on for 10 years.
> It is just beyond frustrating to be so in love with someone and not have any type of recurrent reciprocation. We only see each other for a combined 16 hours a week on average due to our work schedules. I take a lot of time off though because she begs me to stay with her and she doesnt want me to go. Its just so damn confusing, its mixed vibes all the time. I just need advice on how to proceed with this. Divorce is not an option for me. I just cant keep my sanity when im feeling this way constantly.
> 
> ...


Sorry I don't have much to add on the sex situation, but I was worried when I read your wife often snaps at your daughter and you have another kid on the way. You're the father, step in and do something. You don't want your kids growing up with all sorts of insecurities because their mother doesn't express affection for them and snaps at them.


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