# Expectations Versus Reality



## cat5 (Jan 30, 2014)

I’m early 40s, wife mid 30s. two kids, 7 and 3. 

I am frustrated and I don’t know what I can do short of upending everyone’s life and I don’t know that its worth it. 

My wife stays home with the kids. She's fine with kids. Kinda sucks at the homemaker stuff, but thats not a big deal to me.

My frustration stems from the lack of intimacy and closeness. I’m not talking about only sex but not being able to have an conversation without the kids interrupting. We don’t spend much time together. 

Occasionally, I’d say once every six weeks or so, we’ll have either my parents or a babysitter stay for the weekend and we’ll take off. Those times are great but too infrequent. 

The crux of my issue is that my wife goes to bed super early. She’s in bed just about every night before the 7 y/o. She in bed by 7. Before people start jumping on the over exhaustion from the kids, a little more information. The oldest is in school. The youngest is in day care three days a week. Both sleep through the night most of the time. And if they do get up I take care of them if its before 1am, she takes care of them if they wake up after that. 

Is she depressed and thats the cause of her sleeping so much? I don't think so, but I wouldn’t rule it out. She claims that the more she sleeps the better she feels the next day and generally staying up later isn’t worth it. 

Before the chorus chimes in with suggesting I help out more, I do plenty. Do I do half of the house/kid work? No, I don’t. I don’t know how I could given I have a job and she doesn’t. That said I give her frequent breaks on evenings and especially the weekends. Typically on weekends we will split the day. Where she relaxes in our room for half the day and I’ll relax the other half. I don’t feel a need for this myself but she frequently communicates that she desires time to herself. I guess my hope is that if I can give her plenty of time to herself then perhaps there will be something left in her tank once the kids are in bed but thats not the case.

When we have weekends w/o the kids she’ll stay up later but will sleep in the next day so it doesn’t impact her sleep. Every so often she’ll have a ladies night and will stay out late and on those occasions and she deal with not getting her normal sleep. 

So every night by 7:30 everyone is asleep in bed. I don’t need or want 12 hours of sleep so I watch TV, work, play video games, drink, and generally am alone. Its a lonely existence. 

Communication. I have talked to my wife about my desire to spend more couple time together and initially the weekends were sufficient, but they were more common then. I have expressed my desire to have one night during the week that we cuddle and watch TV and one night on the weekend that we either have a date night or spend time together at home after the kids are in bed. She’ll tell me she’ll try and do better but nothing has changed to date.

I do find it very frustrating that she is willing to go out with her friends and stay out late but our marriage isn’t worth the sacrifice of staying up past 7. Lately even when we’ve had a sitter it hasn’t gone well. She has a tendency to invite her friends on our dates. The way it goes is she’ll have a few drinks then text her friends and see if they can meet us out. I’ve talked to her about this but the behavior doesn’t stop. She will typically ask me if I am ok with her inviting others and before I can say anything she will have texted someone. More than a few times after these occurrences I’ll tell her afterwards that I don't want her inviting others on our dates and she’ll respond that either she understands my point of view or she say that I am controlling her. 

One last piece of info. We have been very fortunate. I started my own company ten years ago and have done well. Our house is paid off, as is the beach house she spends her summers at with the kids. 

Part of what I struggle with is expectations versus reality. What motivates someone to make sacrifices, work hard, and take risk? I guess it varies, but for me it was the thought of what my life would be like if I could manage to be successful. A part of it also is men are generally viewed as success objects, where are women are sex objects. I never expected to be successful and then also be the loneliest I have ever been. It's disappointing. 

All that said what can I do? I have communicated my feelings. I have communicated my expectations. What can you do about a partner who disregards the others needs short of walking away? I honestly feel that her attitude is that I can’t do anything about it. I feel that she believes I’ll eventually give up and stop asking. The alternative is I don’t see the kids at least half the time. Nuke their lives and pay her millions to go away. Not a great option and she knows it and treats me accordingly.


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## BluesPower (Mar 27, 2018)

cat5 said:


> I’m early 40s, wife mid 30s. two kids, 7 and 3.
> 
> I am frustrated and I don’t know what I can do short of upending everyone’s life and I don’t know that its worth it.
> 
> ...


Well, at least you are realizing that is not going to work long term for you. That is about the first smart thing that you have done. 

There are a host of things that could be going on, so I will list and discuss the possibilities in no particular order.

1) She is not, and maybe never was, that into you. It might be the I love you but I am not in love with you. So this possibility is that she has lost her attraction to you, because she has you locked down. She really does not need to worry about really keeping your engine revved op or screw your brains out because she knows you are reluctant to divorce her. She does not have to try hard to keep you, so guess what she does not. 

You have taken care of her, spoilt her if you will, especially with 3 days of daycare for the youngest. What exactly is she doing during those three days??? From your post she is not doing laundry and cleaning the house... 

2) She could be depressed and there are some sign of that. But really there are no deep red flags for depression. But is does happen and sometimes it is not totally visible. 

3) She could be having an affair, yes she could. She has three days of the week to go get laid and she is not working. She has her girls nights out, and you don't go with her... 

Not saying she is but she could be, it would explain a lot. 

Those are just 3 possibilities, she also could be an entitled lazy princess as well, and since she is really not that attracted to you sexually and she has your nuts in a vice, she really does not care. 

The thing is this, it is not working for you and it should not be. You can go to mc and see if she will change, and she you the attention that you deserve. It might work. 

Before you go to mc, send her to the doctor about the depression and go with her. Have her checked out, thyroid, hormones the whole bit. Then check her phone, phone bill, and make sure she is not having an affair. 

Because if she is depressed, or she is having an affair, mc will be a waste of time and money. 

It may be worth a try to save this. 

You could the tell her you are filing for divorce and see is she gets her butt in gear...


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

Marriage counselling.


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## Jessica38 (Feb 28, 2017)

cat5 said:


> My frustration stems from the lack of intimacy and closeness. I’m not talking about only sex but not being able to have an conversation without the kids interrupting. We don’t spend much time together.
> 
> Good for you for recognizing- and wanting- a high quality marriage where you both meet each other’s emotional needs. Many husbands don’t realize that in order for their wives to want sex, many women need to feel emotionally connected first, through intimate conversation, affection, and recreational companionship (as explained in the book His Needs, Her Needs).
> 
> ...


I don’t think you’re anywhere near the point of having to give up. You just need a plan and the knowledge of how to reach your wife. She may not know how lonely you are. And you may not know why she’s fallen out of love with you. The good news is you can get it back and it’s FAR easier for a husband to influence his wife than the other way around. She could be in withdrawal for some reason. Any ideas why? Does she have guy friends that she spends one on one time with? Do you or have OS friendships? Any history of EAs on either side or PAs? Conflict? Resentment?


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

Why would you tolerate her "going out late with the girls" when she can't muster an in home date night with you?

"Never make someone a priority when all you are to them is an option."

-Maya Angelou


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## Marc878 (Aug 26, 2015)

She does what she wants because she's learned she can and all you're gonna do is talk about it.

Better wake up to the reality that you've allowed.


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## Herschel (Mar 27, 2016)

I’d find out if she really is going to bed or maybe goofing around on her phone. Find out if she is legitimately asleep by 8? Sounds crazy to me. Of course it’s 11:45 here, so 🤷*♀


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## BigDigg (Jan 11, 2018)

Has she been checked out medically? 12hrs of sleep daily seems extreme for anyone over a long period. Could be things like vitamin D deficiency, thyroid issues, hormone issues, etc.


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## personofinterest (Apr 6, 2018)

My first thought was a medical issue. Thyroid maybe?

It really ISN'T right for her to go out with her buddies but NOT make time to go out with you. It's hurtful and selfish.

My question would be why. The fact that she will make energy to go out with them means she CAN drum up some energy to do things she enjoys. Which makes me ask...does she ENJOY time with you.

You could find the answer to that question, OR you could join the typical - her XY combo makes her awful and entitled and you should just kick her to the curb.


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## Edo Edo (Feb 21, 2017)

When she "goes to bed" at 7:00, shut off the Wifi around 7:15 - 7:20 and see if she complains or even brings it up. Do this every night. Then you will see if she is actually tired/going to sleep, or if she's messaging a secret lover or goofing off online instead of being with you.


(Note this won't work if she has a smart phone, but you should see the data rack up on her phone when she gets the bill at the end of the month...)


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## cat5 (Jan 30, 2014)

farsidejunky said:


> Why would you tolerate her "going out late with the girls" when she can't muster an in home date night with you?
> 
> "Never make someone a priority when all you are to them is an option."
> 
> -Maya Angelou


Thanks all for your reposes!

What does not tolerating her going out on girls night look like? Do I tell her she can't go? I can tell you she will not stand for that. It would be a power struggle. I have in the past told her I expected equal treatment. That for every girls night, I expected a date night. Didn't go well. In fact she brought it up in MC as an example of how I'm controlling. 

For those who suggested MC, we've did that for almost 2 years. We stopped when things seemed to be better, about a year ago. I have thought about starting back but to me it seems the only real way in which MC helps us is by giving her someone who she has to be accountable to. Meaning that she'll do right by me so she doesn't have to hear it from the counselor. Is that anyway to live? 

For those concerned about her health. She does see her Dr. for annual visits and such. I wouldn't say she actually sleeps 12 hours. Most nights she falls asleep after watching TV for an hour or two. I'd say she averages probably around 10.5 hours a night. Part of the problem is the kid routine currently. They both get in mommies bed after baths and watch TV together. She'll put the younger one in his bed after he falls asleep, then she'll fall asleep before the older child. 

Again thanks everyone!


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

Why do you allow her to define "controlling"?

She sounds like she would rather find excuses than to spend time with you.


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## Bananapeel (May 4, 2015)

You're getting walked all over by her. She's a SAHM, and apparently not a very good one. She doesn't treat you well. She goes out when she wants and doesn't want to spend time with you. So what are you getting out of this?


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## BluesPower (Mar 27, 2018)

Guy's did I miss something in the original post...

It is an arranged marriage, and she sounds completely nuts to me? 

What am I missing?


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## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

BluesPower said:


> Guy's did I miss something in the original post...
> 
> It is an arranged marriage, and she sounds completely nuts to me?
> 
> What am I missing?


I don't think you are missing anything except this woman seems incredibly pampered and she has gotten used to living the good life and not paying any attention to her husband...


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## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

You are by ever sense of this statement, "A paycheck". At this juncture you need to get a set, sit your W down and pointedly advise her your unsatisfying marriage that she has every power to correct but spends the entire summer at the beach, goes on GNO, uses the kids an an excuse and sleeps like a lamb. In short, shake up her cushy world. 

I don't know how you put with it this long. MC helped as you stated but your W fell back into her ways. She looks to fix this or the nice home/beach house with summers away will be a fond memory.


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## Windwalker (Mar 19, 2014)

I can certainly understand why his wife calls him controlling when he tries to shake things up, in his current state he sounds like an excellent doormat.


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## Mr.Married (Feb 21, 2018)

Why would she want to change when she is getting everything her way?
When you supplicate her like this then there is no reason for her to change.
She has no reason to pursue you in any way shape or form.

This is how I usually see these things shake out: You demand change, nothing happens. You demand change, nothing happens. You demand change, nothing happens.

The key here is that your demands end with her not having to do a single thing because you aren't going to do anything about it. Until you do something that rocks her
world in a fashion that she understands you are willing to lose everything for change....then the cycle will continue.

Understand it is yourself that needs to change first.


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## WilliamM (Mar 14, 2017)

What is wrong with upending everyone’s lives?

I get what I want, and my wife is happy to please me. However she does know I would upend lives in a heartbeat. I would not just rock the boat but I would sunder the boat into splinters before sunrise. I have no hesitation to bring the world to its knees to get what I want.

To the bold go the spoils.


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## Mr.Married (Feb 21, 2018)

Yeah...his wife is the bold one. She has what she wants. She doesn't have to smash the boat, just keep his leash tight.


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## cat5 (Jan 30, 2014)

WilliamM said:


> What is wrong with upending everyone’s lives?
> 
> I get what I want, and my wife is happy to please me. However she does know I would upend lives in a heartbeat. I would not just rock the boat but I would sunder the boat into splinters before sunrise. I have no hesitation to bring the world to its knees to get what I want.
> 
> To the bold go the spoils.


I don't disagree with what you said. In fact I agree completely. 

How to you rock the boat? I'd think the typical response would be do the 180 or whatever. I don't think she notice, let alone mind if I started going out more. Dressing better, getting in shape, etc I've done all that. So short of nuking the situation by filing divorce what options are there? 

In a lot of ways I feel like I am dealing with a defiant teenager. Expect with a teenager I could take the car keys, cell phone, or ground them from going out. But my wife isn't a teenager that can be punished. Know what I'm saying?


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## Bluesclues (Mar 30, 2016)

cat5 said:


> WilliamM said:
> 
> 
> > What is wrong with upending everyone’s lives?
> ...


I wonder if she looks at you like the defiant teenager. Your initial post you said everyone was asleep by 7 and then amended that she is upstairs getting the kids to sleep and will fall sleep with the 7 year old in your bed (note I wrote your, not mommy’s bed). And you are downstairs playing video games and drinking. 

You also said she goes out with friends “every once in a while” but goes out with you every six weeks. Honestly what is the frequency of every once in a while? It seems the guys here pounced in the going out with friends thing like she does it weekly and you grabbed that rope. 

I am not saying you don’t have a right to be upset. The kid routine - especially having them fall asleep in your bed - is not good for your relationship or your kids. But she may be seeing you as a selfish jerk that drinks alone and amuses himself while she is taking care of the kids. So start there. Change the kid routine. I will warn you that is a very hard habit for a mom to break. But put your foot down.


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## BarbedFenceRider (Mar 30, 2018)

cat5 said:


> I don't disagree with what you said. In fact I agree completely.
> 
> How to you rock the boat? I'd think the typical response would be do the 180 or whatever. I don't think she notice, let alone mind if I started going out more. Dressing better, getting in shape, etc I've done all that. So short of nuking the situation by filing divorce what options are there?
> 
> In a lot of ways I feel like I am dealing with a defiant teenager. Expect with a teenager I could take the car keys, cell phone, or ground them from going out. But my wife isn't a teenager that can be punished. Know what I'm saying?


Stop Paying her....You obviously "pay" her when she has GNO. You pay her when she sleeps in late. You pay her with sitters and daycare. STOP IT. She is either a roommate or a wife. Can't be both. Also, when you are gone....Do you KNOW what she is up to? Not to be going down that often road but, someone has to say it.....

As for being raped in alimony...Who says you have to divorce? I believe there is a 180 guide to follow somewhere around here....If someone would please put the link up. (Muchas Gracias).


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## Marc878 (Aug 26, 2015)

The problem is you're laying in the victim chair waiting for someone to fix your problems because you won't do it yourself.

MC isn't going to fix this. You'll wallow until you decide you've had enough.


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## cat5 (Jan 30, 2014)

Marc878 said:


> The problem is you're laying in the victim chair waiting for someone to fix your problems because you won't do it yourself.
> 
> MC isn't going to fix this. You'll wallow until you decide you've had enough.


Wait, what?

I'm fairly certain that my query was in regards to what I can do. But I was asking for something a little more specific than "don't take it anymore" what does that mean anyway?

I am all about solutions. Spare me the hyperbole. 

I would assume just about everyone here, given the nature of this board, has been in or in need of MC at some point. Let me ask those that have, how would it have gone for you, especially the guys out there, if you started playing games with money? From my experience that would have been a shortcut to being run over by both my wife and the female sympathetic counselor. And if divorce ever were to happen, if you don't think you'd end up regretting making a power struggle over money, try it. Find out just how many sympathetic judges there are to the male experience. 

Here is the crux of the problem as it relates to me and more broadly to men. In the world we live in if women aren't getting what they want from a marriage they can shut their legs. End intimacy. Sure it's their body and all that. What about men? What is the male equivalent? Cutting her off from disposal income? Seriously? 

Let me tell you how that'll play out legally and in the court of public opinion this day and age. Unless the wife is spending well beyond your means tightening the purse strings goes over like a turd in the punch bowl. This is especially true if the wife is working. Now look at the other side. If a woman decides she doesn't want to be intimate with her husband what occurs in the court of public opinion? The opposite. There must have been something the guy did or at the very least perhaps she fell out of love with him. There is no blame. For a guy if you withhold money without good reason she will be the victim and you the perpetrator. Every time. 

So perhaps I should ask in a more direct way, how can I shake things up without threatening divorce and without making HER the victim?


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## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

cat5 said:


> Here is the crux of the problem as it relates to me and more broadly to men. In the world we live in if women aren't getting what they want from a marriage they can shut their legs. End intimacy. Sure it's their body and all that. What about men? What is the male equivalent? Cutting her off from disposal income? Seriously?


Sex really isn't something that only men enjoy.

The equivalent of women shutting their legs, is men doing the same thing by withdrawing sex (since it's our bodies and all that).

At the end of the day if your wife doesn't want to have sex with you. Feel free to have sex with those that do want to have sex with you.

Seriously your wife's entitlement to sexual fidelity or to being your sexual partner ends upon her unilateral withdrawal of sex.


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## Windwalker (Mar 19, 2014)

cat5 said:


> Wait, what?
> 
> I'm fairly certain that my query was in regards to what I can do. But I was asking for something a little more specific than "don't take it anymore" what does that mean anyway?
> 
> ...


Cough BS cough.

There is nothing in the "rule book" that says you have to provide more than food, clothing and shelter beyond the basics. So yeah, I sense some hyperbole.

What? She's going to piss mad moan about you being a skin flint. BFD! She wants spending money all she has to do is get a job. Pretty simple really.

Every single day when you get up the first words out of your mouth should be, "get a job". The last words out of your mouth everyday should be the same. She says something to you, you simply reply back, "did you say something about getting a job? I didn't hear you." Girls night out? Get a job woman, should be the first reply. 

Who rightly gives a bloody rats ass what the court of public opinion thinks. You can't go to jail for being a tight wad. You can't be prosecuted for it. People ask about the situation or say something simply tell them she's a mooch.

You are playing to not lose the game, rather than playing to win. Wars of attrition are rarely pleasant. I am also of the opinion that there is nothing between ANY woman's legs worth my self respect or becoming a slave for. Period! She lacks respect for you because you lack respect for yourself. 

Yes, these statements probably make me a **** in many people's eyes. When they pay my bills and buy my food, they can then have a say. Until that time, they can sit and spin.


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## Mr.Married (Feb 21, 2018)

Windwalker said:


> You are playing to not lose the game, rather than playing to win. Wars of attrition are rarely pleasant. I am also of the opinion that there is nothing between ANY woman's legs worth my self respect or becoming a slave for. Period! She lacks respect for you because you lack respect for yourself.


Exactly.

Cat5 ..... You have to be prepared to lose all and follow through if it gets to that point. She has already had a life of conditioning to have to do nothing. Stop playing not to lose and start playing to win.
and yes.......you are sitting in your victim chair. There is no reward without risk. Honestly I don't see this coming to divorce as she seemly has a lot to lose in the comforts of life. You might be surprised how fast she turns it around, but you absolutely have to be willing to go through with it if it comes to that. Failing to do so only further illustrates your current position...you talk...and do nothing.

I know you find most of the post harsh or offensive. It isn't that people wish you ill will, but that you will need some harsh reality to get the outcome you seek. Everyone would rather see you happy instead of miserable, but it will take some to get there. Your going to have to get firm in what you want.


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## [email protected] (Dec 23, 2017)

Livvie, what you're missing is her PA or EA. Her H is missing it too. Read back and it will be clear that her interests are not centered in her H.


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

cat5 said:


> I don't disagree with what you said. In fact I agree completely.
> 
> How to you rock the boat? I'd think the typical response would be do the 180 or whatever. I don't think she notice, let alone mind if I started going out more. Dressing better, getting in shape, etc I've done all that. So short of nuking the situation by filing divorce what options are there?
> 
> In a lot of ways I feel like I am dealing with a defiant teenager. Expect with a teenager I could take the car keys, cell phone, or ground them from going out. But my wife isn't a teenager that can be punished. Know what I'm saying?


Always give defiant people what they say they want. 

It rarely works out the way they plan.


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## WilliamM (Mar 14, 2017)

Your wife doesn’t work. You control the money.

You control your attitude towards her.

When my wife and I had problems I controlled the money, and my attitude towards her. I went too far, my wife is mentally ill and wasn’t able to comply with my demands. I say I danced with the devil.

But there is a long way between normal day to day life and the pure hell I put my wife through.

Say no to anything your wife wants. Take away all methods she has to spend or access money. Refuse to hold her or kiss her or say any kind word. Tell her as long as she thinks a marriage is just a roommate arrangement you will treat her like that neighbor jock you don’t like. Remind her every hour you are abandoning her because she abandoned you.

Let me tell you, that’s how I started before I really got mean. If I had known my wife was mentally ill I would have proceeded differently. 

I put my wife through incredible hardship for 15 months before I realized just how broken she is. 

But one thing for sure was she knew every moment I was furious and she was being punished. She knew she was in a prison of torture and there were only two ways out. She could leave me or change her ways.

I never let her think things were okay.

Stop being nice.

If I had it to do over again I would not be as cruel as I was. But I would be cruel, and she would know why.

But if I had it to do over again I would have had my wife into the right psychiatrist immediately.


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

OP, list out the things you do for her on a regular basis. Make the list as specific and lengthy as possible. 

Then, imagine for a moment she died today. Go back through the list you made by crossing off anything you would continue to do after she died.

Anything on the list that you did not cross off are acts of service specifically for her. Those are the things you stop doing immediately.

If after stopping those things she does not complain, then hang it up...your marriage is toast.

If she does complain, that is good. Answer her simply and CALMLY with this:

"If you want more from me, you can start by doing more for me."

She will likely relate this to sex and complain more.

Just shrug your shoulders and go do something you want to do. If necessary, repeat that phrase every time she complains. 

Here is the prism by which any decision should be made regarding your wife and your relationship:

"Never make someone a priority when all you are to them is an option."

-Maya Angelou

In fact, I would print it and tape it to your bathroom mirror.

That is how you withdraw from her, OP.

Get out of the victim chair and focus on you.


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

ETA
I’m so sorry I completely missed that there is a reconciliation after an affair involved in this quandary. For what it’s worth I’ll leave my post here in case her sleep needs haven’t yet been medically addressed.

I knew a woman who slept around 15 hours a day, more on the weekends. She had been to many doctors to discover why she needed so much sleep and nothing had, at the time, been diagnosed. She said if her brain wasn’t actively engaged, if she wasn’t moving, she’d fall asleep. It was fascinating to hear how easily she fell asleep and stayed asleep, like dead to the world, like the deep deep sleep infants and young children enjoy. I also knew a woman who inherited a fatal form of not being able to sleep, forget the name. Her mother had it and died in her 40’s, as did this woman. She refused to have children knowing she would probably pass on this genetic abnormality to her kids.

My husband is one of those people who falls asleep shortly after sitting down. I always picked the movies because he slept through them most of the time. I joke that he watches the same movies over and over, Shawshank Redemption anyone, because he has yet to actually see every part of the movie. It did feel lonely because he just couldn’t stay awake. Work, dinner, tv/sleep M-F made for a very solitary marriage.

My point is, OP, that it’s unfair to assume your wife has much control over her need for sleep. My belief is that she doesn’t.

Having said all that, I completely understand your loneliness.

After having a complete medical work up to rule out thyroid or other medical avenues, it’s time to sit down and problem solve together.

You begin by admitting you feel cut off and alone because the woman you claimed as your wife is no longer involved in your day to day interaction enough. 

Do not make her feel like she is sleeping so much on purpose, to spite you, or being careless. She cannot control her need for this much sleep so don’t make her feel like she SHOULD.

I want to spend more time with you, I miss being with you. But I know you need sleep. I want to find a way that we can both get what we need...


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## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

Anon Pink said:


> ETA
> I’m so sorry I completely missed that there is a reconciliation after an affair involved in this quandary. For what it’s worth I’ll leave my post here in case her sleep needs haven’t yet been medically addressed.
> 
> I knew a woman who slept around 15 hours a day, more on the weekends. She had been to many doctors to discover why she needed so much sleep and nothing had, at the time, been diagnosed. She said if her brain wasn’t actively engaged, if she wasn’t moving, she’d fall asleep. It was fascinating to hear how easily she fell asleep and stayed asleep, like dead to the world, like the deep deep sleep infants and young children enjoy. I also knew a woman who inherited a fatal form of not being able to sleep, forget the name. Her mother had it and died in her 40’s, as did this woman. She refused to have children knowing she would probably pass on this genetic abnormality to her kids.
> ...


We are unsure if she's actually sleeping. Someone suggested he figure out if she actually sleeps or if she is reading or on her phone in there instead.


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## cat5 (Jan 30, 2014)

There hasn't been an affair. 

As far as what is she up to after in bed. Like I said she's normally in bed by 7 or 7:30 most nights. Typically she watches tv until around 8 maybe 8:30. Sometimes she listens to podcast on her phone. Even when she's listening to podcast she is in bed, lights off, no headphones. At times the podcast is still on when I go to bed. She gets up around 7, btw. 

Someone asked about the frequency of the GNOs. It varies. Could be twice in a week but then not for a month or more. Really depends on whats going on. On average I'd say once every three weeks or so.


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