# I think my ex is gay



## Holland (Aug 20, 2012)

I need to breath or I will have a melt down. I can't talk about this IRL because it goes against my core values to start rumours or say things that are unfounded that would harm another person...

So here I am online, anon as I have to get this out.

Many know my story, was with the ex for almost 20 years, 3 kids and what became quite early on a passionless, sexless marriage. the typical story, great friends, successful as a couple, financially stable, lots of fun, travel, adventure. Great co parents, great social lives and from the outside we were the Golden Couple.
I stayed because I loved him and wanted to keep my family intact.

Over the years it impacted my health greatly to the point where I was losing hair, chest pains, a dark cloud always over my head which thankfully did not turn into depression. I could never work out what was wrong, I am an attractive woman, work hard, intelligent, cooked and cleaned and did all the right things. I got and still get plenty of male attention. I have suffered greatly with this internal fight in my head "was it me or was it him?", I was reduced to believing that it was me, I must be an ugly monster, a horrible person, why else would my then husband not want me sexually? 
I ended the marriage and we were both relieved. I had tried to do it earlier but he would hang on tighter, say he would fix things but never did, he never once went to a Dr or sought any help for his sexual issues. 

Anyway a few small things have happened recently that have convinced me that it was in fact him and not me that was the problem. I truly believe he is gay. 

It should be liberating but instead it is crushing, all those wasted years, all my self doubt, the blow to my health and self esteem. It makes me want to cry, I have been crying about it. I was trying so hard in a situation that was futile before it even began, I was robbed of time and happiness, I was made to feel bad about myself all at the hands of this meek and mild man that everyone adores, I suffered through the humiliation of rejection which has impacted my post divorce life.

Thankfully I had the guts to end the marriage and move on, life now could not be more opposite to my past life but the scars and pain are there and always will be.

What really pisses me off is that if he had of had the guts to be honest then he could have saved me this torment, I would not have judged him. I would then have known it wasn't me, I am not an ugly monster.

Not sure what to do with any of this, it is just another part of the process and writing it down and discussing it if anyone wants to will help. If anything it at least makes me so adamant that sexual compatibility is paramount, it must be discussed at the start of a relationship in an honest and open way. As my kids start to become sexually active I need to get this across to them, I don't want them suffering like I have.


----------



## SecondTime'Round (Jan 15, 2015)

I have no advice as I deal with many of the same issues from a heterosexual ex, but just empathizing with you. I think a revelation like this, after how hard you fought, would be a whole different kind of anger many of us have not experienced. Keep journaling. Maybe some counseling.


----------



## Omego (Apr 17, 2013)

How dishonest of him to not face his issues and hide behind the facade of a traditional marriage in order to keep up appearances.

On the other hand, you have children, and that's always the bright side of failed marriages, in my opinion.

I'm glad you got out and that you now have a fulfilling relationship.


----------



## Heatherknows (Aug 21, 2015)

Holland said:


> What really pisses me off is that if he had of had the guts to be honest then he could have saved me this torment, I would not have judged him. I would then have known it wasn't me, I am not an ugly monster.
> 
> Not sure what to do with any of this, it is just another part of the process and writing it down and discussing it if anyone wants to will help. If anything it at least makes me so adamant that sexual compatibility is paramount, it must be discussed at the start of a relationship in an honest and open way. As my kids start to become sexually active I need to get this across to them, I don't want them suffering like I have.


There is nothing you can do about the past. It would have been great if he told you he was gay prior to marriage but he didn't for whatever reason. 

Your marriage wasn't a waste. You have children. I believe you said you have a new boyfriend?


----------



## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

Whether someone is gay or just a sexless zombie, entering into a heterosexual marriage is a low-down act of fraud and enslavement. Glad you got out. He's stole enough of your life. Don't give the fraudulent sack of feces another second.


----------



## anchorwatch (Mar 5, 2012)

Holland, if that's your conclusion, do you believe he knew all along or developed into himself over time? 

Either way, it doesn't change who you are today. Better off, than back then...


----------



## sixty-eight (Oct 2, 2015)

Omego said:


> How dishonest of him to not face his issues and hide behind the facade of a traditional marriage in order to keep up appearances.
> 
> On the other hand, you have children, and that's always the bright side of failed marriages, in my opinion.
> 
> I'm glad you got out and that you now have a fulfilling relationship.


for the betrayal aspect, he may have not been self aware enough to know at first.

Or, i knew a few men in a former religious environment who were specifically guided to suppress any "sinful" homosexual urges and marry a woman.

or he may just have been a selfish man who wanted a beard, if it's true.

i'm certainly not absolving him. i've often thought my stbx might be gay, but if he is, he can't admit it to himself.

I'm glad you're happy now, and away from that situation Holland.


----------



## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

If he was in denial about it himself, how could you have known? Of course you couldn't. It sucks he lied to himself all those years and wasted your time and emotional energy! I'm sorry this has happened to you. I'm so HAPPY it is in the past for you now!


----------



## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

Faithful Wife said:


> If he was in denial about it himself, how could you have known? Of course you couldn't. It sucks he lied to himself all those years and wasted your time and emotional energy! I'm sorry this has happened to you. I'm so HAPPY it is in the past for you now!


Depressed or gay, he had sense enough to know he wasn't taking care of his wife, sexually, as he promised. He didn't get himself squared away and he didn't leave, so he goes in the ranks of the dishonorable.


----------



## anonmd (Oct 23, 2014)

This is worse than the bait and switch female transformation from sex loving girlfriend to frigid mother. Not orders of magnitude worse but worse.>

And yes, I am somewhat (though not 100%) serious0


----------



## Holland (Aug 20, 2012)

Yes we have children, 3 amazing humans that I am so in love with. They were worth it all without a doubt.
Yes I have moved on and re partnered with a man that truly is my match and we are compatible in all areas of life. 

I do believe my ex was genuinely attracted to me at the start, hell even now I sometimes catch him giving me that look. But he is a supressed person in so many ways and I'm sure he saw me as his ticket to get out from underneath the weight of it all. He comes from a family that don't communicate well and that had to appear perfect to outsiders, no wonder he used me as a cover to the outside world, the perfect wife and family.

I am sure he did not do anything intentionally to begin with, we had a wild ride at the start and maybe he thought he could overcome who he really is but as time goes on I do get angry that he basically held me hostage to our situation. He should have been honest, he should have sought help, he should have taken responsibility for himself. he should not have played happy families.

The ironic thing is that I am not a judgemental person, I am open minded to alternative lifestyles to the one I choose. I am a pretty free and wild sort of gal, if he could have been honest with anyone it would have been me. He is so damn supressed though that he can't be honest with himself.


----------



## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

Holland,
What a sickening feeling. There is a tv series called: Masters of sex

It is about masters and Johnson and it is really good. 

There is a scene that you will identify with. In truth kind of a heart breaking scene. 





Holland said:


> I need to breath or I will have a melt down. I can't talk about this IRL because it goes against my core values to start rumours or say things that are unfounded that would harm another person...
> 
> So here I am online, anon as I have to get this out.
> 
> ...


----------



## Holland (Aug 20, 2012)

Hi MEM

do you know which episode? I have watched some of the series on and off if I happen to catch it on TV.

Yes I feel sick, not sure why this has jumped up to bite today, just woke up and it hit me. I have had suspicions for a little while due to something that happened but another clue was presented 2 weeks ago and it is crushing. You have seen me through the first phase of post divorce torment which was the devastation of being rejected, counselling and discussion here really helped. Then I did not care what the reasons were because I got out, was free and moving on.
Now I feel like I am heading towards a big melt down and have to get a grip.


----------



## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

Whether he is gay or not, it's the past. No matter what happened, it sure is beneficial to accept it and let it all go. 
I've found that one of the awful things in life is that we never know how different and sudden life can change for the worse. It's also wonderful how quickly and unexpectedly it can change for the better.
Sounds like yours is for the better.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Spotthedeaddog (Sep 27, 2015)

He could also have been somewhat asexual (being asexual doesn't mean they don't want family and friends).
Or he could have been LD, or sexually repressed.

Sad he wasn't willing, or able?, to share what his drivings were in the matter.


----------



## anonmd (Oct 23, 2014)

I thing it is season 2 that it plays out, the character is/was Masters supervisor at the orig. hospital/university. 




Holland said:


> Hi MEM
> 
> do you know which episode? I have watched some of the series on and off if I happen to catch it on TV.
> 
> ...


----------



## Holland (Aug 20, 2012)

spotthedeaddog said:


> He could also have been somewhat asexual (being asexual doesn't mean they don't want family and friends).
> Or he could have been LD, or sexually repressed.
> 
> Sad he wasn't willing, or able?, to share what his drivings were in the matter.


When I first arrived at TAM I was unfamiliar with the terms LD and HD, after a while here I settled on thinking he is repressed and/ or LD and that in itself is OK.
But I have witnessed a few things lately that make me think he is repressed and/ or gay. That is not OK as far as him marrying me goes. I would deal with LD if he had of made an effort to compromise but if he is in fact gay or has tendencies then I have been conned and used even though I know there is a part of him that will always love me. I just feel like dirt 

Just getting it out helps. Might be time to go back to IC.


----------



## Heatherknows (Aug 21, 2015)

Holland said:


> When I first arrived at TAM I was unfamiliar with the terms LD and HD, after a while here I settled on thinking he is repressed and/ or LD and that in itself is OK.
> But I have witnessed a few things lately that make me think he is repressed and/ or gay. That is not OK as far as him marrying me goes. I would deal with LD if he had of made an effort to compromise but if he is in fact gay or has tendencies then I have been conned and used even though I know there is a part of him that will always love me. I just feel like dirt
> 
> Just getting it out helps. Might be time to go back to IC.


If he's gay which sounds like he is my guess is when he married you he really didn't think he was. I don't know him or you IRL but my sense is this wasn't a case of conning. It sounds like he really wanted to be straight, probably felt sexual feeling for you and wanted to grab you and marry you and hope you'd stop his gay feelings. IDK, I'm guessing.

IC would be a good idea.


----------



## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

Heatherknows said:


> If he's gay which sounds like he is my guess is when he married you he really didn't think he was. I don't know him or you IRL but my sense is this wasn't a case of conning. It sounds like he really wanted to be straight, probably felt sexual feeling for you and wanted to grab you and marry you and hope you'd stop his gay feelings. IDK, I'm guessing.
> 
> IC would be a good idea.


Took him 20 years to figure out that plan wasn't working? Would we excuse a depressed mother for starving her own child? Would we excuse a surgeon for walking out midway of a routine surgery because they decided they didn't really want to be a surgeon? This woman is a human being with perfectly normal needs. Someone promised to fulfill those needs and then failed to even seriously try for many years and refused to leave so she could find a real partner. If you obligate yourself to another human you do what you promised. People aren't little private experiments or handy cover stories. They aren't walking ATM machines. They aren't slaves. If a person abuses another person, they are an abuser. If some exploits another human they are an exploiter. 
If one has a screw loose, they need to see a shrink, maybe several. 
If one has plumbing issues, they need to get those issues fixed or become experts in other forms of sex, intimacy, and romance. Watching your alleged partner slowly die inside every day for a couple decades is just evil.


----------



## Holland (Aug 20, 2012)

I agree with you UB. The thing is I've done lots of work so I don't become bitter and twisted, after all it is my fault I stayed for so long, that was my choice, my mistake and I was in such a healthy place until recently about all this.
There is a part of me that feels so sorry for him, another part that is happy to co parent with him and another part that if allowed could grow into a nasty person. Revenge, blame and all that stuff is not for me except for the part about the best revenge is moving forward and having a great life.
This guy is the father of my kids and that is what matters now, I cannot afford (emotionally) to hate him.


----------



## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

Having active sperm or viable eggs doesn't make anyone a decent human being but I applaud your positive attitude.


----------



## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Holland said:


> When I first arrived at TAM I was unfamiliar with the terms LD and HD, after a while here I settled on thinking he is repressed and/ or LD and that in itself is OK.
> But I have witnessed a few things lately that make me think he is repressed and/ or gay.* That is not OK as far as him marrying me goes. I would deal with LD if he had of made an effort to compromise but if he is in fact gay or has tendencies then I have been conned and used even though I know there is a part of him that will always love me. I just feel like dirt *
> 
> Just getting it out helps. Might be time to go back to IC.


There is no reason that you should feel like dirt. Though it's pretty normal for a person who has been wronged to feel like it reflects badly on them.

When you start to get that 'feel like dirt' feeling, remember that you are acting like a mirror reflecting his image back on himself. That's what you are experiencing.. it's as though his 'dirt' (the con job) rubbed off on you. It did not. Step aside and imagine a mirror reflecting his image back at him. Get out of the way the bad that is reflecting off of him. It is not yours to bare.


----------



## FalconKing (Aug 8, 2012)

Holland said:


> I need to breath or I will have a melt down. I can't talk about this IRL because it goes against my core values to start rumours or say things that are unfounded that would harm another person...
> 
> So here I am online, anon as I have to get this out.
> 
> ...


Holland i've read a lot of your post and appreciated your input on these forums. You've talked a lot about your marriage and how you have grown since. I do not know you in person, but if I did I would take a lot of pride in that. I said that to say that I really think you are being too hard on yourself. You didn't waste anything. I feel like, when we care about someone we always want to believe what they do and think of them in the best ways even when we see incongruence between their words and actions. Your ex-husband could have been trying to deny his urges or maybe this has been a journey he has been on that has finally come to fruition. For your efforts you have beautiful kids and a very strong sense of self worth. Vent here if you need to. But nothing was wasted. 



sixty-eight said:


> i knew a few men in a former religious environment who were specifically guided to suppress any "sinful" homosexual urges and marry a woman.


Can cosign. I dated a girl whose ex-husband had affairs with other men. Deeply religious guy, and presented himself as very stoic and wanting to wait for marriage to have sex. She didn't have much experience with men and he used abstinence to hide the fact that he wasn't sexually attracted to women. I work with a very religious woman whose husband is gay and she is in denial. Her ex-bf was gay as well. These men are suppressing their urges because of guilt but also they come off as having superb self control because they use abstinence to dance around the fact they are not attracted to women. 

I guess what i'm saying is that women are tricked like this a lot...

I think a flamboyant, animated, stylish, well groomed man that is in touch with his feelings and not interested in using a woman for sex is probably pretty attractive to a lot of women


----------



## Satya (Jun 22, 2012)

Holland, I can't offer much as you process all this, but can sympathize with your feelings. 

I learned that my ex h wanted to live life as a woman, during a confession out of the blue, on a Monday morning before I had to head to work. Long story incredibly short, it really, really fvkt with my head and I wasted many years on a sham. 

As he was learning to be a she, I heard through 3rd parties about girlfriends, then eventually boyfriends, which took my place pretty soon after I left the house. I dunno if "she" was a lesbian, bi, or both...?? 

My anger phase was pretty belated but when it came... Oh boy. I'm so glad I didn't unload on my ex.... Like I needed to feel even more pathetic!

You were blessed with children, something I am still working towards. The mistake I made was to allow my ex to dictate my reproductive timetable.

I gained a mountain of knowledge from my experiences, to the degree that I feel I have very little in common with old friends that have had a pretty stable life. I use this knowledge daily and it expands as I continue through life. 

I'm glad you learned the truth you needed to lessen the burden of your misplaced self-guilt. That was a terribly destructive phase for me personally.


----------



## FalconKing (Aug 8, 2012)

Satya, I remember your story. I'm glad you decided to post in this thread because I feel you could contribute a lot. I hope you have been well.


----------



## Satya (Jun 22, 2012)

Thanks, Falcon!

I do empathize about the kinds of confused, frustrating, and dark thoughts that enter your mind when you feel you've been cheated out of love, affection, support, devotion, etc. Holland's situation reminds me of how I felt as more truths became apparent to me... More and more I was in shock of the lie I had lived. It was a long time before I felt prepared to trust even the smallest of actions by others.

Lying in this manner can be terribly destructive of your confidence, it does a number on your psyche to be gaslighted and told you're crazy and wrong for knowing in your gut, that things are not right. So Holland, I hope you are most certainly not blaming yourself any longer. I made many mistakes, but I was always trying to do the right thing. My ex got the best of me, but I know there is still plenty of love to offer. The same is true of you.


----------



## Spotthedeaddog (Sep 27, 2015)

Holland said:


> When I first arrived at TAM I was unfamiliar with the terms LD and HD, after a while here I settled on thinking he is repressed and/ or LD and that in itself is OK.
> But I have witnessed a few things lately that make me think he is repressed and/ or gay. That is not OK as far as him marrying me goes. I would deal with LD if he had of made an effort to compromise but if he is in fact gay or has tendencies then I have been conned and used even though I know there is a part of him that will always love me. I just feel like dirt
> 
> Just getting it out helps. Might be time to go back to IC.


Most LD dont make effort to compromise, that's the problem.
They spend time evading or shutting down instead.


----------



## Holland (Aug 20, 2012)

Thanks FK, new day today, thank you so much for your kind and thoughtful words. My kids are an amazing result of the marriage. Actually today was VCE results day and my boy has aced it, we went out for brekky to celebrate, the ex, kids and me. As I sat there I felt much better, looking at what we have created. I won't hold myself responsible for who he is and his actions.

Satya, I am lost for words and deeply sorry for your experience. You always come across as well grounded and articulate. Wow what a terrible thing for another human to do to another, it just seems so cowardly as does my ex. I wish you well on your journey to have children and thank you for your words of encouragement it means a lot.


----------



## sixty-eight (Oct 2, 2015)

EleGirl said:


> There is no reason that you should feel like dirt. Though it's pretty normal for a person who has been wronged to feel like it reflects badly on them.
> 
> When you start to get that 'feel like dirt' feeling, remember that you are acting like a mirror reflecting his image back on himself. That's what you are experiencing.. it's as though his 'dirt' (the con job) rubbed off on you. It did not. Step aside and imagine a mirror reflecting his image back at him. Get out of the way the bad that is reflecting off of him. It is not yours to bare.


I think this is excellent advice, that many people here can relate to. Taking the shame of being duped onto ourselves. I was struggling with this today myself.

I often feel like if i could go back and have a do over, i wouldn't. The bright spots that are the kids, overpower all of the bad things.


Holland said:


> My kids are an amazing result of the marriage. Actually today was VCE results day and my boy has aced it, we went out for brekky to celebrate, the ex, kids and me. As I sat there I felt much better, looking at what we have created. I won't hold myself responsible for who he is and his actions.


Congrats to your son, and to you!


----------



## bestyet2be (Jul 28, 2013)

sixty-eight said:


> I often feel like if i could go back and have a do over, i wouldn't.


This is something I've struggled with: At times I've wished I could have a such a "do over" or wish away the bad things in my past. I think the key to mental health is to find reasons not to.

Maybe suffering really is good for the soul? Maybe I'm the product of all those hard things, and without them I wouldn't even be "me" as I now know myself. And so maybe wishing I therefore wasn't "me" is simply a meaningless question to even ponder?

Would I really be a better person, in a "better place" now if I hadn't suffered and wasted and continue to deal with repercussions of all those various choices, failures, and pains? No, I need to decide I'd quite possibly be a worse person, and so, "No thanks to that do over!"


----------



## Holland (Aug 20, 2012)

It's OK intheory, have always been very anon here so not concerned about confidentiality.

These things may seem harmless on paper but they all give me reason to believe he is gay.

The sexual issues we had just being the starting point, once we had the kids sex was pretty much non existent.

Since divorce he has not had any serious relationships. He does have a female friend but there is no real closeness that is evident. 

Earlier this year our son went overseas with mate and their teacher for 2 months, The ex became overly friendly on "Line" (chatting app) to the point where it became embarrassing for our son who asked me to tell his dad to leave his mate alone. His mate felt awkward about it all and TBH I just find it weird that a grown man would be trying to strike up a friendship with his sons friend.

Just recently we had Graduation night for our son and while standing talking to the ex I noticed his reaction when the boy mentioned above came into the room, hard to explain. He also had the same reaction, expression on his face, smile, look of interest when another of the Year 12 boys came into the room.

I don't know, it all just re enforces a gut feeling I have had for some time about his sexuality. There are other things but too hard to explain, more of a "you had to be there" type of moments.


----------



## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

I once worked for a woman..... first time we met - she must have felt awfully comfortable opening up to me, how we got on this subject -I can't remember.. 

She shared her story....which was such a blindsiding...it was similar to yours Holland.... she, too, married what seemed like this WONDERFUL man.. they had 6 children together...they too seemed like this perfect couple.. beautiful home... she stayed home raising their daughters...all lovely...close knit family... you wouldn't even think "dysfunctional" in any way.....then once they were all raised. . leaving the nest...in their 50's ..

I think she was like 54 at the time.. he comes to her & tells her he is Gay, he needs to go find himself.... she never suspected it even!... Her world collapsed....How could she be living with this and not [email protected]#... She didn't get into "bedroom" talk ... but spoke of the shock... 

They divorced...and one fine day within the next 2 yrs.... she runs into an old acquaintance in the grocery store... he recently lost his wife.. she wasn't ready to trust again after her experience.. but he won her over somehow.....they start going out.... and have been married happily ever since..

It's really a shame if people can't open up honesty, transparently with their inner stirrings while dating....at the very least to give some PAUSE....to avoid something like this..

I , too, would feel robbed of 20 yrs if this happened to me.. I can understand being very angry... It's surely a walk in forgiveness even.. sounds you have went above & beyond to hold your marriage together.. very honorable...you just didn't [email protected]# 

Who would THINK that.. this is one thing that lady said to me.. something like THAT never enters your mind.


----------



## Heatherknows (Aug 21, 2015)

Holland said:


> It's OK intheory, have always been very anon here so not concerned about confidentiality.
> 
> These things may seem harmless on paper but they all give me reason to believe he is gay.
> 
> ...


He's gay.


----------



## UMP (Dec 23, 2014)

Holland, 
Don't think on this as a negative. You have 3 children that you love.
Sure, many sexual years were wasted and he caused you much pain because of his deceit.
If you had a do over and could go back in time and not marry him you would never have the children that you have. Even if you could go back, I still think you would go through the same thing providing you still could have your children.

I have a 21 year old mentally handicapped daughter. Even as a young 16 years old boy, one of my biggest fears was having a handicapped child. The mental anguish you go through as a parent is difficult to say the least. However, if I could go back in time and make her a "typical" child, I would not because she would no longer be who she is, the person who I have grown to love just the way she is, regardless.


----------



## MRR (Sep 14, 2015)

Crazy, since my separation/divorce 2 years ago, I know of THREE similar situations. The women range in age from 38-45. 

One I went on a few dates with and she was married for 20 years, has 2 daughters. She has a ton of anectdotal evidence, that did not make sense at the time, but did not have the courage to admit he is gay, even now that they are divorced. He used to go out alone and brag to her that he did not hit on other women but came home 'with a bunch of business cards'. As a matter of fact, though she does care about him, she is fearful that he may find out that she has told a few people (even though he still has not admitted it to her)

Another, met online but our kids are in the same grade at the same school, so I actually had met briefly her and her sister previously (both have kids in the 4-8 range, same as me). We went out a few times and the topic of failed marriage/divorce came up, specifically our own personal situations. She is convinced that her ex is gay and said he was on the website 'grinder' which i now know if a hook up app for gays. She had other reasons. After she told me about this-- we have been seeing each other casually since last spring-- I have met him a couple times and...well total generalization but I do believe her now. 

Third one...mother of my daughter's good friend. About two years ago my ex wife and I were in process of divorce, as were this couple. My ex went out for drinks one night with the mom, and she spent 3-4 hours telling her about how she was divorcing him b/c he is gay. One of the numerous details is that in this city gay men will mingle about at a certain sears for other gay men and he apparently was there every weekend. Sears. I met him and believe this one as well. 

So, in any case, you are not alone. And I was a bit surprised at how common this is. I honestly believe, in all three of these cases, that these men are gay and did not want it publicly known (or in one case will not even admit it to himself). Yes, unfair. Glad you have moved on....


----------



## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

Holland,

Season 1 episode 12. 

The single most important step at this point is to avoid confusing selfishness with malice. 

Let me frame this differently. Your H was so terrified of being perceived as (in his mind) defective that he:
- Gave up the chance of a relationship with real physical intimacy
- Tolerated an increasingly tense emotional relationship

Part of this is that I'm guessing he wanted children. That desire is wholly independent of orientation. 

Besides - you can't apply today's societal view to a decision he made 25-30 years ago. Society was WAY more hostile to gay folks back then.

As always - I'm not saying that what he did to you was ok. It wasn't. Merely describing how he coped with a situation that he saw as intolerable. 


QUOTE=Holland;14387114]Hi MEM

do you know which episode? I have watched some of the series on and off if I happen to catch it on TV.

Yes I feel sick, not sure why this has jumped up to bite today, just woke up and it hit me. I have had suspicions for a little while due to something that happened but another clue was presented 2 weeks ago and it is crushing. You have seen me through the first phase of post divorce torment which was the devastation of being rejected, counselling and discussion here really helped. Then I did not care what the reasons were because I got out, was free and moving on.
Now I feel like I am heading towards a big melt down and have to get a grip.[/QUOTE]


----------



## Holland (Aug 20, 2012)

MEM11363 said:


> Holland,
> 
> Season 1 episode 12.
> 
> ...


[/QUOTE]

I'm good with all you have said here MEM, regardless of all that has happened he is at his core a fairly decent human. Actually I still trust him in looking after some of our financial matters, he is a great parent from a practical POV (although he is emotionally stunted and our son in particular comes to me for this need). At this point in time I feel sorry for him, not angry with him.

Thank you for everyone's input, getting it all out and reading the replies has helped immensely.


----------



## brownmale (Apr 20, 2015)

Are you sure about what you say? What makes you think this way?

Let me just play devil's advocate here...

To start of, none of us know what we will turn out to be over time. So it's often not a case of deliberate cheating.

The bait-and-switch from sex-loving-gf-to-frigid-wife has been mentioned above. When we started two decades ago, I would not have imagined that the tables would have turned so drastically on our respective roles. She wanted sex every day, sometimes more than once a day. Now, I struggle to get it once a week, and as a man, it can be pretty depressing.

The sex and relationship was great initially. This was as long as our desires were in balance. But, somewhere along the line the equation tipples. One turns out to be HD (and not getting it) and the other LD, and not giving it. This can be very sad.

After the sense of deprivation felt over the years (divorce is not an option, don't ask why or give your perspective on this, it won't fit), I might just turn gay. Some of us might be curious about same-gender sex, but never want it. I've always preferred women, and find them a good complement to my own maleness. But after the emasculation I've felt, the thought sometimes sometimes at the back of my mind is: who knows if a man might turn more fulfilling? And less complicated?


----------



## Holland (Aug 20, 2012)

brownmale said:


> Are you sure about what you say? What makes you think this way?
> 
> Let me just play devil's advocate here...
> 
> ...


I really don't get how this has any relevance to my situation. If you are trying to say it is all my fault just because I am female then knock yourself out.

I really cannot see any connection with my situation to yours. Can anyone else or am I missing BMs point?


----------



## Spotthedeaddog (Sep 27, 2015)

MEM11363 said:


> Holland,
> 
> Season 1 episode 12.
> 
> ...


[/QUOTE]


No free rides. Sure that's the way *he* felt, but the sympathy and "old world" rules, they stop counting the minute he took a long term commitment with someone else. Yes, he might have felt he could "do his best" or "chin up" but what about his consideration for his partner? Literally what I just stated amounts to he was willing to *use* her for his own ends; at what point does that ethically become ok to take someone elses only lifetime chance to love another who cares equally for them? If he had come clean, and they agreed to try, that would be decent and fair - but to force another through their life, to be used for his lie? To prey on her trust - that is such utter cowardice.

The absolute greatest thing from the modern attitude toward homosexuality, and homosexual marriage, is that no-one should be ever treated the way that husband treated her without her consent.
It is nearly a manipulative form of enslavement - sure gilded bars (we hope) but completely unethical towards a trusting innocent partner. 
Not so bad if he doesn't suspect he was gay, which occasionally happens - and thus needs be discussed between partners when it occurs. But to deliberately do that? scum.


----------



## IWantGreatMarriage (May 20, 2014)

Holland said:


> It's OK intheory, have always been very anon here so not concerned about confidentiality.
> 
> These things may seem harmless on paper but they all give me reason to believe he is gay.
> 
> ...


Is he gay or paedophile? 
Gay would ne ogling men his own age and not teenagers


----------



## Holland (Aug 20, 2012)

IWantGreatMarriage said:


> Is he gay or paedophile?
> Gay would ne ogling men his own age and not teenagers


Not going to go there, never would I suggest he is into children. These are 18 yr olds, many men perv on 18 yr olds.


----------



## Heatherknows (Aug 21, 2015)

brownmale said:


> .
> 
> After the sense of deprivation felt over the years (divorce is not an option, don't ask why or give your perspective on this, it won't fit), I might just turn gay. Some of us might be curious about same-gender sex, but never want it. I've always preferred women, and find them a good complement to my own maleness. But after the emasculation I've felt, the thought sometimes sometimes at the back of my mind is: who knows if a man might turn more fulfilling? And less complicated?


...you're gay too.


----------



## Heatherknows (Aug 21, 2015)

Holland said:


> I really don't get how this has any relevance to my situation. If you are trying to say it is all my fault just because I am female then knock yourself out.
> 
> I really cannot see any connection with my situation to yours. Can anyone else or am I missing BMs point?


He decided to "come out" on your thread.


----------



## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

Holland,

Brownmale is in the situation that you were in. 

But he lacks your coping skills. So he's slowly going mad. I'm not being funny or clever or mean spirited. People who lack the coping skills to deal with this type situation, end up damaged. 






Holland said:


> I really don't get how this has any relevance to my situation. If you are trying to say it is all my fault just because I am female then knock yourself out.
> 
> I really cannot see any connection with my situation to yours. Can anyone else or am I missing BMs point?


----------



## Holland (Aug 20, 2012)

MEM11363 said:


> Holland,
> 
> Brownmale is in the situation that you were in.
> 
> But he lacks your coping skills. So he's slowly going mad. I'm not being funny or clever or mean spirited. People who lack the coping skills to deal with this type situation, end up damaged.


going on BMs logic I should be the one that turned gay, not my ex husband.

Anyway on to coping skills, I get that others such as BM et al struggle and TBH I did not cope well during the time. You mentioned earlier MEM that the ex had to live with an increasingly tense emotional situation (not your exact words) and to be painfully honest with myself, then yes he did. I did not cope well during this time and am the first to admit I would have been very difficult to live with.
No doubt the ex was just hoping I would give in and eventually I did, turned my sex drive off completely, he may have been relieved but I then became resentful and I am sure that is when my health started to fail.
This is a no win situation.

I coped very well after the separation as I made it a priority and did the hard yards. There are many here that my instinct tells me will not go on to happier lives post divorce from a sexless marriage as they have a victim mentality and won't take responsibility for their own failings.


----------



## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

Holland said:


> There are many here that my instinct tells me will not go on to happier lives post divorce from a sexless marriage as they have a victim mentality and won't take responsibility for their own failings.


Totally agree.


----------



## brownmale (Apr 20, 2015)

Holland said:


> I really don't get how this has any relevance to my situation. If you are trying to say it is all my fault just because I am female then knock yourself out.
> 
> I really cannot see any connection with my situation to yours. Can anyone else or am I missing BMs point?


I'm saying that the changing gender relations in the last generation or so sometimes threaten the male of today.


----------



## Elizabeth001 (May 18, 2015)

The "male of today" will just have to get over himself.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------

