# taking power back



## paramore (Jan 11, 2011)

ok I have gotten to the point where I am taking my life back, where I want my life to be, I am taking myself back, I am taking my place in my marriage back, I don't want to make hubby uncomfortable, but I feel that we are still married....do I go full on to what I want/need? I am in the mindset where I just act on my feelings, it's gonna hurt no matter what, and he can follow suit whatever he wants to do....I am DONE with tiptoeing around the issues. I know where I want my life to go, and I am prepared to go full bore in getting where I want my life to go. Like I said it's gonna hurt like hell either way....any advice?


----------



## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

For lack of a better term..thats great your "manning up" ;-)

I think it will hurt a lot less by owning your self and knowing what you want. In the long run....which ever way this thing goes you can say you did it on your terms. You did this for your self and empowered her self to stop taking crap.

You go girl!


----------



## twotimeloser (Feb 13, 2011)

Where do you want to go in life, as you say...


Dish the goods Girl!!


----------



## paramore (Jan 11, 2011)

I want to be happy, I want my family to be happy, I want for him to be happy, I want my kids to be happy That's where I want to go, I want to be with someone that loves me for me. I am moving forward to attain that goal. That's where I want my life to go. If it doesn't happen, it doesn't happen, like you said at least I know I did it on my own terms.


----------



## twotimeloser (Feb 13, 2011)

paramore said:


> I want to be happy, I want my family to be happy, I want for him to be happy, I want my kids to be happy That's where I want to go, I want to be with someone that loves me for me.



Ok, someone who loves you - - that is an actual place. The other things are results. They are results of filling certain desires.. so again, I ask.. what do want to do?



paramore said:


> If it doesn't happen, it doesn't happen, like you said at least I know I did it on my own terms.


If it doesnt happen? 

THese things are not things you should do, they are things you MUST do. You need to turn your shoulds into musts. That is how change happens.


----------



## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

Thats good if you can make your self sad, then you can make your self happy.

For instance, I make sure when W calls or enters the room I am positive and up beat. No matter how sh*tty my day was or hers I will be happy. Dam it I'm happy I don't care how b*tchy she is...you can't take my happiness away so cheer up. Right? 

The only thing we have after going through this crap is a positive out look that we will carry on. We diserve to be happy. We diserve good things. And if they can't give me those things well screw them. We will get it some were. Right?


----------



## paramore (Jan 11, 2011)

Exactly. I am holding him because it makes ME happy, I am playing with my kids cuz it makes me happy, it makes them happy. I am not doing things now for him...if it makes him happy too, then that's good for him. I am changing my outlook on life to make ME happy, it's up to him if he falls into line or not.

Twotime, I have to be happy, I have to let go of the negative aspects in my life, and I am taking steps to make that happen. For instance, I am working on how I react to negative things, and how I have dealt with them in the past, because I believe I didn't deal with them correctly. I am working on not freaking on the little things, working on my temper, because those things do not make me happy.

All I want is to be happy, that is my destination.


----------



## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

After getting screwed over by a DS the little things don't really bother me that much anymore. If you know what I mean? I for one had made a disicion after D-day that I dieseve to be happy. Infact it was part of my 180.

I wasn't going to spend the rest of my life cring about how she cheated and what caused it all...no way, at that point of my life I had to change and being more positive at home and at work, pretty much everywere. I wasn't going to let this infidelity crap beat me down. 

My take its not so much a destination but a way of life, b/c there is so much bad sh*t out there pushing and pulling at us that you may never get there unless you just demand to be positive/happy right now no matter what come next.


----------



## twotimeloser (Feb 13, 2011)

paramore said:


> Exactly. I am holding him because it makes ME happy, I am playing with my kids cuz it makes me happy, it makes them happy. I am not doing things now for him...if it makes him happy too, then that's good for him. I am changing my outlook on life to make ME happy, it's up to him if he falls into line or not.
> 
> Twotime, I have to be happy, I have to let go of the negative aspects in my life, and I am taking steps to make that happen. For instance, I am working on how I react to negative things, and how I have dealt with them in the past, because I believe I didn't deal with them correctly. I am working on not freaking on the little things, working on my temper, because those things do not make me happy.
> 
> All I want is to be happy, that is my destination.


I get that... I guess what i am asking is what are you going to do to get happy?


----------



## paramore (Jan 11, 2011)

Trudge forward, get myself to where I actually love the person I see in the mirror. I refuse as of right now to rely on someone else for my happiness, I am being happy for me. I am in counseling, I am actively reading up on how to improve myself for me. I am actively getting my self worth back, finding myself again, that is what I am doing right now to become happy.


----------



## twotimeloser (Feb 13, 2011)

paramore said:


> Trudge forward, get myself to where I actually love the person I see in the mirror. I refuse as of right now to rely on someone else for my happiness, I am being happy for me. I am in counseling, I am actively reading up on how to improve myself for me. I am actively getting my self worth back, finding myself again, that is what I am doing right now to become happy.


Try looking for some work or going back to school. Something social will help all of that! Meet new friends!


----------



## paramore (Jan 11, 2011)

Ohhhh yeah, I am working towards that I just gotta figure out what I would go back to school for, or what kind of job I would want to do.


----------



## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

Marriage counseler? lol


----------



## paramore (Jan 11, 2011)

We are doing the marriage counseling, and IC. He hasn't been to his first IC yet, work keeps getting in the way. I will be going for my second IC on Thursday, we have been to one MC session. He agreed to one more, he's committed to doing both, he's made it sound like it. 

I want to start volunteering at our local humane society, come spring. Once I get the farm all cleaned up from an icky snowy winter. I am going to have my hands full with that for a bit.


----------



## paramore (Jan 11, 2011)

No way I could take in a foster animal right now, and they don't really do that, but I love pups, so just being around them and doing some good will make me feel good.


----------



## Forsaken (Feb 14, 2011)

Here's a great quote for ya!

"The world ain't all sunshine and rainbows. It's a very mean and nasty place and I don't care how tough you are, it will beat you to your knees and keep you there permanently if you let it. You, me, or nobody is gonna hit as hard as life. But it ain't about how hard ya hit. It's about how hard you can get hit and keep moving forward, how much you can take and keep moving forward. That's how winning is done! Now if you know what you're worth then go out and get what you're worth. But ya gotta be willing to take the hits, and not pointing fingers saying you ain't where you wanna be because of him, or her, or anybody! Cowards do that and that ain't you! You're better than that!" 

-Rocky Balboa


----------



## AmImad (Jan 28, 2011)

Forsaken said:


> Here's a great quote for ya!
> 
> "The world ain't all sunshine and rainbows. It's a very mean and nasty place and I don't care how tough you are, it will beat you to your knees and keep you there permanently if you let it. You, me, or nobody is gonna hit as hard as life. But it ain't about how hard ya hit. It's about how hard you can get hit and keep moving forward, how much you can take and keep moving forward. That's how winning is done! Now if you know what you're worth then go out and get what you're worth. But ya gotta be willing to take the hits, and not pointing fingers saying you ain't where you wanna be because of him, or her, or anybody! Cowards do that and that ain't you! You're better than that!"
> 
> -Rocky Balboa


I wish there was a like button!

Today is a new day for me, I'm picking myself up, dusting myself off and moving forward for my children and I, today I had cancer cut out of my left breast, that cancer was also my cheating husband..cut out of my heart..


----------



## paramore (Jan 11, 2011)

LOVE the quote forsaken, and Good for you AmImad!!!! I hope your H realizes before it's too late what a good woman you are, as I hope mine comes around.


----------



## AmImad (Jan 28, 2011)

paramore said:


> LOVE the quote forsaken, and Good for you AmImad!!!! I hope your H realizes before it's too late what a good woman you are, as I hope mine comes around.


I got out of surgery he called if I was ok, then texted me telling me that he never wants to come home... I doubt he'll realise anything any more


----------



## paramore (Jan 11, 2011)

Ok, quick subject change...why the H$#* would he call and ask if you were ok, and then say he's never coming home? That jacka$$ is still trying to play headgames with you, and you just had surgery!!! Did you ask him to come home?

Last night I was feeling faulty again, as in just lonely/sad/emotionally tired. I am guessing it will get better with time. I just went upstairs, sat quietly for about 10 20 minutes, didn't go completely away, but I was able to power through it without looking mopey or sad.

I did go to bed in a very quiet mood though, cuz he saw me on here, and I have suggested to him before perhaps he should come and do some reading on here...and he laughed and said ANOTHER community site? That's just where people with crappy marriages come to hook up with each other. See, when we first got internet, I kind of got addicted to a q/a site, that's where he met his first EA.

So anyways, I was very sad/disappointed that he would think that, even though I know where he was coming from. I simply said, it's not like that here at all, told him my screen name, and said well if you ever want to, go and look at all of my posts. I have not been inappropriate in a one, I said, I will log in RIGHT NOW, and you can read my save Pm's. I had given him pw's to all of my things, guessing he threw the list away yet again. So anyways, enough rambling, I simply smiled, gave him a hug and kiss, and went to bed, I am sure he knew something was up, I just walked away, no reason to get into a disagreement over it. He has a very passive/aggressive way about him, I knew when he was smiling and laughing about TAM, he meant it a completely different way, he wasn't kidding around. Didn't argue, didn't cry, just smiled and walked away.


----------



## paramore (Jan 11, 2011)

Ok, so last night, I had told him, didn't demand, but told him, after much thinking, it would make me comfortable if he deleted the first and second EA from his fb, and his phone, I believed both phone numbers were on there. Turns out he only has the latest EA's phone number on there. So anyways, I had mentioned, which I am pretty sure I have mentioned before to him, that I had pm'd the first EA about a month ago with some questions, and explained to her why I felt the need to contact her, and I mentioned what I had discovered him doing, the latest EA, and the fact that he had been telling the swap woman he loved her as well. Anyways, I felt the need to tell her basically we had both failed each other as husband and wife, and I felt the need to explain my side of things, as I am pretty sure he trashed me pretty bad to her. I did that for ME.

So anyways, he mentioned he was kind of mad at me for contacting her, as I guess she won't even talk to him on facebook. He said he thinks the only reason I contacted her or even the last EA was to manipulate things to get the situation the way I wanted. He doesn't understand why I needed to contact either one of them. Well while I contacted the first one for completely different reasons, the second one when I called her to stop talking to my husband was me standing up for my marriage. I said LOTS of women would do that.

Anyways, since he's the one who had told people in the first place, I felt the need to get my side out there, I am TIRED of being demonized and made the bad guy!!! I am not the only one who made mistakes. He said you don't see me talking to your mom or sister, I said that's you, I am a different person than you. If you don't feel the need for people to have your side, that's your choice, in my opinion, people can only be objective if they have both sides. 

He feels if we are meant to be things will work themselves out, that the relationships will end on their own. I reminded him, YOU ended things with second EA, I am not sure, but I believe that according to what he says, the first one kind of fizzled out and they decided they were just friends. She had messaged me back saying he basically wasn't the person she thought he was, and didn't want to be a part of something that made me uncomfortable. I never asked her ONCE to stop contacting my husband, as I didn't want to be seen as demanding/controlling.

He told me this morning she wouldn't even talk to him, so it's basically over between those two, how is that MY fault??? I told her what was going on, evidently he hadn't, how is it MY fault that from what I am gathering, that he chose to withhold info from her about what he was doing, that he chose to start another EA? 

He wanted to be able to still be friends with her, I stated you guys crossed that boundary, how do I know 6 months from now you won't start it back up? I told him I don't talk to any guy I ever said I love you to, there in my memory, was only one other guy lol, but that's beside the point, I haven't spoken to him since the last time I saw him which had to be 15 16 years ago I think.

So gist of it, I am the bad guy again, supposedly trying to manipulate our situation to get the outcome I want. He went on about the snooping again, which I gotta admit, I haven't been doing. I have been checking the alltel minutes every few days, but I haven't creeped his phone, I was on his computer when he came home on break the other day cuz I was checking something on his WOW. How can I creep his computer when I have no passwords, etc??? I asked him this and he said I don't know, he said you could be checking my phone and not mentioning it, cuz there's nothing on there, ok fair statement. 

I volunteered my computer, said check the history, come and look at the pm I sent first EA, etc. He said I don't want to, OK FINE!!!! It boils down to we are two different people, he handles things differently. I am not sure what else to say to him, he's asked me to have faith in him, I have some, while shaky, not as much as it was a week or two ago. He still has zero in me.

I am just tired of being the bad guy all of the time, tired of being accused of being manipulative, when I am doing things I need to do for ME. I am tired of him saying things about me to people, when they don't have the full story, and I have to put this as a disclamer, it's not like he's spouting off to every Tom, ****, and Harry. I am talking about people he's already told.

He is more than welcome to contact anyone I have told my story to and tell his side, I am sure they would listen.

and LOL I see the name in between Tom and harry got blinked out, so I'll say Tom, Richard, or harry lol


----------



## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

paramore said:


> He told me this morning she wouldn't even talk to him, so it's basically over between those two, how is that MY fault??? I told her what was going on, evidently he hadn't, how is it MY fault that from what I am gathering, that he chose to withhold info from her about what he was doing, that he chose to start another EA?


It's NOT your fault. He wanted his cake and to eat it too and now realizes that isn't gonna happen anymore. Good for you for calling him out on his BS and confronting the EA chick. 

He is being the stereotypical cheat: blaming you for his bad behavior and deflecting from what he's done cause it justifies what he's done. He won't accept responsibility for the ugliness of his actions so he has to find a scapegoat--you.


----------



## WhereAmI (Nov 3, 2010)

I'd say, "I see you're upset that there are consequences to your affair." You don't need to explain yourself to him. He's not respecting you in the least. Don't allow him to think of himself as a victim.


----------



## paramore (Jan 11, 2011)

Yeah, thanks Jelly, the thing is, the first EA, I was very very nice, wasn't confrontational at all, as I can sympathize with her for reaching out, she is unhappy in her marriage, I can do that because I did it too. I told her that. I was very friendly and polite, when I called the second one on the phone the morning i found out, I wasn't mean, I just said politely, I found the texts I want you to stay away from my husband and my family, goodbye.

I know he is using me as a scapegoat, as I stated above, I am tired of being made the bad guy, I assume he told her all of my shortcomings, so I felt I had the right to stand up for myself and tell my side. It isn't manipulative, I never ONCE asked her to stop talking to him, she is making that choice herself. She had stated that he didn't seem to be the person she had had a friendship with the last two years. I guess it is what it is, I wish his job wouldn't load him down. He is supposed to have his first IC apt this afternoon and his job loaded him down, this will be the second time it will have to be rescheduled. I know that is the truth, his job is unforgiving like that, he works for a well known delivery company.

I also must add, that I mentioned to him how it still blows my mind that he feels bad about hurting both of them, and how he doesn't care about how I feel yet. I didn't yell it, I just looked him in the eye and said it in a conversational tone. He started bringing up the times I did things and I didn't care about how he felt, ok fine, but that was then, this is NOW. Doesn't really matter I guess that at the time I wasn't feeling needed/etc. NOW is what matters, I am working on ME, I am NOT that person anymore and I won't allow myself to be her ever again, he isn't seeing it the way I do, but again I can't make him see it, he has to want to be able to open his eyes.


----------



## paramore (Jan 11, 2011)

Thanks for the reply whereami. We are BOTH victims of each others stupid stupid mistakes, I am just handling it I believe in a much more healthy manner. I am diving all the way in and dealing with it all, I have to if my personal sanity has any chance lol. While it sucks, I am slowly seeing myself for who I really am, and I am slowly starting to like that person again. Too bad he can't see that.

I am trying to do what is right and good, am I anymore or less guilty of misdeeds than he is? Heck no, but I am not throwing things in his face or blaming him for everything, I own what I did, I did some really stupid stupid stupid things, I wasn't the wife he needed, and for all of these things I am truly sorry and remorseful, I am moving on from that crap, I have to. I just hope for himself he can open his eyes, and do what he needs to do for himself.


----------



## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

paramore said:


> He started bringing up the times I did things and I didn't care about how he felt, ok fine, but that was then, this is NOW.


He is still deflecting and not owning what he did.

Until he faces real consequences for what he did, he will continue down this path. He sees you as "safe" and "always there" for him so he doesn't "get" the hurt you feel.


----------



## paramore (Jan 11, 2011)

I agree completely Jelly, only he can get to that place, it's not up to me to get him there, I can't. He is home, I won't ask him to leave. We are just taking things one day at a time, that's all we can do right now. I told him a few days ago, I am a damn good woman, and if he wants to trade to an older model or a chubby little troll (that's what I call the EA high school girlfriend lol) that it's up to him. I am moving on, and that me and the kids are going to work on being a better family, if he wants to catch up, it's up to him. I looked damn good at the time too, I had gone shopping with a friend earlier in the day, found a cute little tshirt that emphasized....well everything very well LOL. I told him I am moving forward with my life, I am becoming a better person, if you want to be with that person, it's up to you, if not? Well that's his choice, and that as much as it would hurt, I would be ok.

I told him I am doing this stuff on MY terms, knowing that if it ends, I can know I did the right thing for myself and my kids. I told him that if it ends, HE is going to have to be the one to end it. That is just how I am feeling right now, I am not saying that my mind couldn't change a year from now, I mean everyone has their breaking point, I just know it's not right now.


----------



## paramore (Jan 11, 2011)

How goofy is this? lol, I was just thinking, I have lost around 60 70 lbs since Oct/Nov, because of all the stress and whatnot, is it weird to think, well at least something good came of this? LOL, just reading that statement makes me laugh.


----------



## HurtinginTN (Feb 22, 2011)

I've lost about 25 pounds in the last month and a half also. Funny that their affairs are making our bodies look better. I have been doing a lot of crunches lately since my fat belly has become fairly flat. I told my son I was working on a 6-pack. He looked at me the other night and said, "Daddy, it looks like your are starting to get a pack." At first, I was like "What is a pack?" Then, I said, "Oh, you mean a 6-pack." He replied, "No, just a pack." It cracked me up. He's 7. I guess the "pack" has stages 1 - 6 in his mind. So far, I'm at a 1. 

A lot of people have commented about me losing weight. I always say that I wouldn't recommend my weight loss program to anyone. Well, perhaps the boyfriend. lol


----------



## paramore (Jan 11, 2011)

LOL, no kidding Hurt. I wouldn't recommend my weight loss strategy to anyone else either.


----------



## HurtinginTN (Feb 22, 2011)

I don't know the whole story on the swap. However, you seem to have a lot of guilt about it. It looks like to me that both you and your husband were willing participants. I'm not saying it was right or wrong, but both of you were willing adults and equally responsible. 

Like you told Jellybeans, I believe you need to cut yourself some slack on the guilty feelings. "Everybody makes mistakes. Everybody has those days." From the wisdom of Hannah Montana. lol


----------



## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

It's like the old joke, the man goes to the doctor and he prescribes him Viagra and Prozac. Ironically, if either one works he doesn't need the other.


----------



## paramore (Jan 11, 2011)

LOL, sorry about that Hurt, not so much willing, I was naive, stupid, etc....but I did partcipate, I could have said NO, but I didn't. Like I have said, I own my mistakes, and know what I did was horrible. My deal right now is, I feel he is still blaming me for EVERYTHING, and I refuse to be the only bad guy here. He isn't owning his responsibility, that's his problem, not mine. I am doing what I need to do. The guilt is there, and in some way shape or form, it will always be there. I am working towards forgiving myself, forgiving him. It's gonna be a long road, but in the end, at least I'll have ME back, which has been lost for a very very long time.


----------



## paramore (Jan 11, 2011)

I am not mad about earlier conversation, but I wish he could have the capacity to see where I am coming from, I am just ranting now. I know why he is doing what he is doing, the look of sadness on his face from first EA not wanting to contact him hurts lol. I am guessing she is taking her power back, haha. Good for her, I do believe she is a good woman, and I don't really hate her, how can I? I did the same thing as she did. I unfortunately allowed myself to be stupid and idiotic to let it get physical. I just wish he had that look of sadness someday when he realizes how much he has hurt me, because he knows I feel horribly about my actions, and am trying to atone for my crappy behavior, and grow as a person.


----------



## paramore (Jan 11, 2011)

We were talking last night, he told me before the trainwreck that his original plan was to stay until our eldest two kids hit 18, then split so he didn't have to pay for all that child support. I didn't freak but inside I was W T F!!!!! I am trying to process that statement, he said the trainwreck had just kind of moved up the date. I am just floored, not emotional about it at all at this point. I told him, you don't wanna be here, go, if you wanna file, file. I can't stop you. Emotionally we were both effed up before and now, so what's keeping him here? These are random thoughts going through my head since last night. Questions without answers, my favorite thing in the entire world. lol.


----------



## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

paramore said:


> Like I have said, I own my mistakes, and know what I did was horrible. My deal right now is, I feel he is still blaming me for EVERYTHING, and I refuse to be the only bad guy here. He isn't owning his responsibility, that's his problem, not mine. I am doing what I need to do. The guilt is there, and in some way shape or form, it will always be there.


Oh me, oh my, you and your hub sound so much like me and mine. He hasn't expressed remorse for his cheatings. And I am gutted w/ my guilt.

I agree with ya--if he won't work with ya--don't sweat it. You can only do your part.

What is your avatar from? It's very Twilight-ish. LOL


----------



## TimT (Mar 25, 2011)

paramore said:


> Trudge forward, get myself to where I actually love the person I see in the mirror. I refuse as of right now to rely on someone else for my happiness, I am being happy for me. I am in counseling, I am actively reading up on how to improve myself for me. I am actively getting my self worth back, finding myself again, that is what I am doing right now to become happy.


There a many things that drive my clients toward change, but many of the motivations (including the desire for better circumstances in life) result in only short-term satisfaction. What I like about much of what you're saying, paramore, is that your change is becoming rooted in a growing clarification of _who you want to be._ When you're change is driven by that vision, change that "takes" is much more likely. It's hard, though... like learning to swim against the current.

Good work! Keep it up.


----------



## paramore (Jan 11, 2011)

Thanks so much Tim, and my avatar is Kahlan Amnell and Richard, from the show Legend of the Seeker, based on the books by Terry Goodkind.


----------



## paramore (Jan 11, 2011)

ok, I have been thinking, I don't want to, because it's a huge inconvience, but why don't I give him a taste of real life without me, I take the kids tonight and stay between my best friend and my sisters house, and watch my daycare kids, there are two, there and at my home just making it when he's not there. Lord knows I don't want to, I just wonder if him being at home alone for once will wake him up. When he left, he had family, and I was alone with the kids, for once he would be home with the pups, I would have family around for once, I had the kids, yes, but not quite the same. Please convince why I shouldn't, because I don't want to.


----------



## HurtinginTN (Feb 22, 2011)

Paramore, I don't know. Everybody keeps telling me to never leave the home. I was ready to this week. I don't see how it can help anything in my situation. In my case, I believe being there and Plan A will be best.


----------



## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Yeah, don't leave the home, Paramore. It is never a good thing to do that. 

How are you doing?


----------



## Forsaken (Feb 14, 2011)

I keep seeing the title to this topic and it makes me want to listen to Take the Power Back by Rage Against the Machine. lol, sorry kind of off topic.

Everyones losing weight and I've managed to gain weight again  Before this whole EA BS I was sitting around 155-60 lbs and now I'm up to 175-180... [email protected] I guess it doesn't help that I've been so depressed and have had so many anxiety problems that I've been so physically and mentally worn out that I don't really want to do anything.


----------



## paramore (Jan 11, 2011)

You'll get there Forsaken, lol. I love Rage Against Machine. I am really struggling with suspicion today. I have been only checking minutes used every few days, but I checked saturday and Sunday, and nighttime and weekend minutes have gone up, it's very possible it was his little brother, I added him to ourcircle today. It's just so hard when I secondguess everything he's doing. I am doing my best to have faith. For instance, I left for about an hour, he hadn't been on the phone all day, but then I leave the house???? I do get that he maybe wanted to talk to a family member for privacy, as I wouldn't talk to my mother about what's going on when he's here, everyone needs private time to talk to a family member when there's crisis. I just pray it was a family member, and he wasn't talking to her. I won't know until next month. I just wonder what I do then if her number pops up. 

On another subject, I watched Fireproof today, I managed to not cry for maybe 5 minutes of the whole movie? Some of the dialogue was torn from our mouths. Wow, it was just so spot on, I'm not particularly that religious, but that movie just moved me.

I am gonna watch it again tonight, if he wants to watch fine, if he wants to bury himself in the computer, that's his choice, but I am gonna watch it a few more times before I have to take it back to the video store on Friday.


----------



## Forsaken (Feb 14, 2011)

I check the phone usage everyday on the internet, if I had to wait a whole month I would literally go insane... Though I guess I probably have already gone insane. No one should have to do this, but I feel like I have to.

She other night one of OM texted my wife, she didn't have his number programmed into her phone so she asked me if I knew whos number it was. I told her no and said she should ask who it is. Once I did find out I was pretty pissed off because he wrote her at 10:40pm on a friday night saying "Miss you". After he wrote back saying it was him, I ask for the phone and didn't know how to work it so she helped me and I sent him back a message right infront of her saying "Yea, so go a head and just lose my number please."

He didn't write back after that, hopefully he gets the clue this time. Stupid bastard just get drunk and texts my wife at night. It really pisses me off, especially because she told him not to anymore a while back and she quit her job and everything. Plus, how can he write my wife saying "miss you" when they only knew each other for like 4 months and there was nothing physical going on? My wife has says that when they texted each other it was always about his relationship problems and he was asking her for advice. 

What a douche. I wish I knew who is g/f was so I could write her or call her and let her know what her piece of sh!t b/f was doing at 10:30pm-4am.


----------



## paramore (Jan 11, 2011)

no kidding Forsaken, I know the night/weekend minutes went up about an hour over the weekend, so it would have been on his lunchbreaks, and it's not unusual for him to call his little brother, so he's added now so it uses our mobile/mobile minutes, so next weekend if he calls little bro, the anytime minutes go up, I so want to ask who he was speaking with....and I told him I wouldn't creep his phone. Is it ok to creep it if there's suspicions, or does that fall under snooping.


----------



## Forsaken (Feb 14, 2011)

I think it's ok because you have probable cause.


----------



## paramore (Jan 11, 2011)

It's hard to say, because if he's being truthful, then I feel like a fool...on the other hand lol.


----------



## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Hey Para. Check your private messages. I sent you one.


----------



## paramore (Jan 11, 2011)

It amazes me how a person can just backslide after logging onto facebook, my husband hasn't been logging on unless I'm asleep or not around. I see that he logged on while I was asleep last night again, how so? Cuz he commented on a friends picture 7 hours ago. I had asked him awhile ago why he does wait until I'm not around. He said because if someone messages me, and you see it I don't want you to freak out, because it's not my fault if they message me. Ok....well it's not your fault if YOU weren't contacting them to begin with, what's wrong with me seeing the message and showing me you are being truthful and trustworthy??? So now I am frantically wondering if he's been messaging with the high school girlfriend through facebook email, because I am pretty confident that there hasn't been phone calls.

If I were a real jerk, I'd hack his facebook, and then be the one with egg on my face if he's telling me the truth. I would never hack his page, but man, the peace of mind would be VERY nice....on the other hand, if you've got nothing to hide, THAN STOP %*$$*# HIDING IT!!!!! Why not log on in my presence???? He's mentioned he may just delete his facebook, ummmm, yeah so you can start a dummy account???? I dunno, it just sucks that just seeing that little comment can take me back to all of the doubts, I will be fine in a little bit, the what if's just make me a little crazy from time to time.


----------



## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Hey if he deletes his FB, I think that would be a great thing since so many of his EA folks are on there. It would prob be a great thing for your recovery, IMO.


----------



## paramore (Jan 11, 2011)

He's mentioned it, I should clarify that the thing he commented on WASN'T either of his EA's it was a mutual friend of ours, more of a gramma type lol. It was the fact that he logged on after I went to bed, which seems to be the only time he logs on anymore. If he's not talking to either one of them, why not remove them off of his list? and block them, it would sure mean something to me, and according to him, last I asked, last EA's phone number is still on there. It's like a slap in the face, he doesn't want to be told he has to remove them, right now it's a control thing, he doesn't want to be told what to dol


----------



## Chrono (Mar 23, 2011)

Man I f-ing hate Facebook so much. Seriously, it's like a drug for someone who has had an EA relationship on it. I caught her yesterday visiting the OM's business "page" on Facebook again. I told her that I wanted "NO CONTACT". No business contact. NADA. Why is that so f-ing hard to understand? 

I've keylogged the computer, I read all her texts, I checked phone records more than once a day, I'm freaking out over here. And then she goes and looks up his business page which doesn't have anything useful on it but a different phone number that I'd not seen before. So of course, I made a note of that number. 

I confronted her about visiting the page... she went BALLISTIC. Why? I'm not sure. She said she can't live with me not trusting her. It's been 13 DAYS since D-DAY! She just doesn't get it. She refuses therapy. She just wants to throw **** and put holes in my walls.

I come last night after taking my daughter out, she is in tears. She finally got it. She finally understood. She said she was sorry and that she is f-ed up. I apologized for getting angry about it. She said she doesn't know how to fix our marriage.

Honestly, I don't either. I need to take back the power. This sucks.


----------



## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Yeah seriously FB ... how many stories do we hear that start out with "My wife/husband recently found their ex/former flame on FB"...

and then you know how the rest of the story is going to go.

I was watching TV the other night and they were saying on CNN how more than half of Americans are on FB. It was about 51% .
When I first separated, I immediately got off FB. I was so hurt and couldn't deal with The World, let alone all this social contact. My ex immediately created an account and friended tons of women. FB is always going to remind me of the OW since she is on there.


----------



## Chrono (Mar 23, 2011)

My counselor is telling me that she is trying to play games with me. I don't know if this is true. Just yesterday I felt for the first time that she truly was remorseful. I don't who or what to believe. She obviously knows I'm spying on her at some level. She knows I check her computer and her phone. Is she just leaving me a trail to find? She is trying to make ME leave? If I leave, I lose all my power and my kids. F that.


----------



## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

If he knows you're aware of the affair, she could just be hiding it better now. They do that sometimes. 

Tell OM's WIFE TODAY!

And no, you don't leave. You aren't the one at fault here. If she wants out, she goes.


----------



## Chrono (Mar 23, 2011)

I talked to him on the phone on D-DAY. He is 10 years younger, not married. Just a "player". I think I scared him off with legal speak.

I've yet to see any of his other numbers show up on phone records. Trust me, I watching them >.<


----------



## Chrono (Mar 23, 2011)

At some point, I'm just going to have to trust her. Show her that I trust her. And then let her either mess up again or love me till ever after.

That's how I'm going to take the power back. Turn it upset down. I already know and have felt the worst case scenario in this situation. Now I just gotta do it, much harder than it sounds.


----------



## paramore (Jan 11, 2011)

Keep watching, in my hubbys case, I haven't decided if it's him just "standing his ground" so to speak, or his way of rubbing it in my face, saying see? you can't tell me what to do. I mean seriously, if he's not talking to either one, then get RID of them!!! After I told my EA guy no more contact, I deleted him immediately, and his wife. I have told him numerous times come look at the call logs, I can PROVE there has been no phone contact.

I mean the guy tried to contact me through my game to see how I was, I told him NC!!! I immediately told my husband he tried to contact me.

I am better now, but I am still highly suspicious. If you don't have anything to hide STOP SHOWING THE BEHAVIOR!!!!!! It is almost to the point, that I don't want to leave the house when he's home, cuz he'll log on, or stay up til all hours to ensure he doesn't log on. Why wait til I'm not around, why did you log on at 1230am, why didn't you check it at 9 when I was awake? I mean REALLY!!!!! 

If he's telling me the truth, then there shouldn't be any reason why you wouldn't log on in my presence and if she tried to contact you through mail or chat, then tell me!!!!!


----------



## paramore (Jan 11, 2011)

Thing is chrono, it's hard to even put a little trust in when they KEEP showing shady behavior. I mean, I am pretty sure there hasn't been phone contact, according to the minutes used, but doesn't it seem shady that he doesn't log on unless I'm not around? Says he doesn't want me to go ballistic if I see a message that got sent, well ok. If they contact you, and you didn't start it, fine, that's not your fault then, let me read it and then delete it. Delete and block her numbskull!!!!


----------



## Chrono (Mar 23, 2011)

There is going to be shady behavior. I mean, look what happened to me yesterday. Shady behavior, I went ballistic and I reset all the work I'd done the last two weeks. It actually feels WORSE then D-DAY now. It's bs. I want the upper hand. I need to stop feeding into these games. I didn't do anything wrong. I'm not leaving. My house, my kids, my terms.


----------



## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Para, it sounds sound odd he feels he has to hide when he's online to you. Tell him it makes you feel like he is hiding something from you.


----------



## paramore (Jan 11, 2011)

Sure is....on the chance that he's being truthful, then show me!!!! I mean I was pretty mad this morning, I am not now, although when he gets home, I am going to ask him about it. Calmly, and pray to god he is telling me the truth. I am going to ask him if he'd be comfortable logging on in my presence and look at his facebook mails, we'll see what he says to that, if he refuses. I am going to ask him if he has been contacting her, and we'll see what kind of sh*t flies then. I know I won't freak, I am to a point, where I won't cry, I won't scream, I will remain relaxed and calm, I know I can do that. Only way I would know at this point is to get a keylogger, and I think he has changed the pw on his computer...hmmmmm, maybe I should go and check that. LOL. I will first just wait til he gets home and simply ask him, and go from there after I gauge his reaction.


----------



## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Calm and relaxed is the way to be.


----------



## paramore (Jan 11, 2011)

I have said that to him, my exact words were the first time I noticed it, was "Can you see why you only logging on when I am not around could be seen as suspicious behavior?" He said yes. I said if you have nothing to hide, then don't. He knows I know both women are still on his friends list, I so wish I could log onto his account and if either one were on...see if they'd try to chat me up.

Like I said, IF he's being truthful, and S tried to email him, and he didn't initiate it or respond, then that's all well and good. I just wish he'd realize how much more comfortable it would make me if he deleted/blocked, I have verbalized that more than once to him. If they were gone, I wouldn't be nearly as worried.


----------



## Chrono (Mar 23, 2011)

Either ask for the password, I did and I got it, OR install a keylogger that will get it for you. I did that as well. Sucks but I need to make sure we're on an even playing field.


----------



## paramore (Jan 11, 2011)

I f*cking hate this.....enough said. I don't want to police my husband....


----------



## paramore (Jan 11, 2011)

well his precious , his first EA he contacted him by his request via FB I assume, I am trying hard not to break again. She must have given him her phone number again. I am trying so hard not to break down in tears. My EA guy tried to contact me via WoW again yesterday, (Sunday.) I told husband, and didn't reply back leave me alone, I just blocked him. I am trying to fight off the tears right now, because he's still upstairs sleeping. He didn't say a word to me, I am being completely honest with him. If her "friendship" is so much more important than making me comfortable, why does he effin stay????? I am sorry, I am not even making sense to myself right now.

I am just so hurt, angry, yet again. I am asking myself, why even bother???? If we don't work, let her go until we are completely done. I know we can and more than likely will work out, but LET HER GO!!!!!! Why did she give him her phone number again????


----------



## paramore (Jan 11, 2011)

ok, so my 6 year old son evidently hear me talking to a female friend, about this latest thing, the phone call and text convo yesterday, I take proper precautions, I go into another room, one of the porches, I try to make my convos private, I guess son cussed his dad out earlier about hurting his mom with the phone, FRACK!!! I guess I need to invest into a private soundproof room. How frustrating.


----------



## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Yeowch. Sorry to hear that happened with your son. 

So he should definitely be deleting/no contact via FB w/ the EA chick. Why hasn't he?


----------



## The 13th_Floor (Mar 7, 2011)

What is more important to the two of you: World of Warcraft and Facebook, or your uh, lets see here, your marriage? Paramore, I've read many of your posts and pardon me for saying this, but what power have you taken back? He's logging into Facebook (marriage killer, in your case and mine) while you're away. If you're not going to delete your accounts, why haven't you installed a keylogger? 

Reading these power struggle posts have made me so glad that I'm NOT sticking around to mend the marriage my wife has destroyed with her infidelity. All I'm reading around here are LS's saying they want to salvage their marriage's, but not following through. Read the subject line: "Taking Power Back." What power are you taking back exactly, the Horde's power from the Alliance? There's no "minor healing potion" that's going to save your marriage.

If you want to take the power back, TAKE IT, and stop putting up with lie after lie from your husband. Delete his FB account, cancel your internet service, install Websense and block FB. No keylogger yet, really? Are you scared to see the truth? 

I don't mean to sound like a jerk, but I read the subject line of this thread, browsed the forum and see nothing more than you being stomped on. Don't let this happen to you.


----------



## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

^ I agree with this. He should not have a FB if he's used it as a medium to contacting several women he's had affairs with. He shouldn't use it if he is truly committed to making your marriage work.


----------



## paramore (Jan 11, 2011)

No 13th you don't sound like a jerk at all. That comment about the horde and alliance made me LOL!!! The power I have taken back is within myself, our marriage is in HIS hands, he is finally going to an IC tomorrow. I have started counseling myself and have really made some tremendous strides for myself personally, am I still struggling, oh heck yeah, but Rome wasn't built in a day.

The above posts were more of rants than anything, so I do apologize for those. It all boils down to this, he views me as being controlling through the whole marriage, he doesn't want to be controlled by me anymore, was I? To a fair degree yes, but really that's due to him not really standing up and really saying what he wants. Anyways, me actually going in and deleting his things would just be more ammo in his arsenal against me, me trying to control him and the situation to get what I want. Do you see the brick wall I am up against? I have to play my hand very carefully.

The game was something that I played waaaayy to much for a very long time, and for instance, I rarely play anymore, mostly I let my 6 year old on and just run around and kill rabbits. Although I was outside doing something, son made a DK and got upset cuz he couldn't get out of starting area, so he and I sat down and I helped him out. One of the things I did for me was seriously limit my time on the game and internet altogether. I only logged onto play over the weekend cuz husband wanted to do some stuff together.

Talked some this morning, he's not mentally in a healthy place to make a decision that would make him happy, I totally get that. He's seeing the way I am being now, which is completely different that how I had been for so long, he's afraid I am trying to manipulate him, nope, I'm doing it for me dude. This is me, educating myself with books, forums, etc, it's for my sanity and well being.

It sucks to feel bulletproof one day, and then feel like a little wishy washy girl in the next moment, but those are getting better. I am getting stronger day by day, I am doing things that are good for me right now, looking out for my kids. Like a good friend told me, I have just got to put it in Gods hands.

I do believe he isn't completely out of the fog yet, I do believe he hasn't hit rock bottom yet, either that or he has and just isn't strong enough to pull himself out yet. I am going to just stop asking for now, talking about it, and see what our counseler does, we are seeing the same one for MC and IC.

You are right though, I do need to let him stop hurting me, time to put on that bulletproof vest, and continue to work on taking power back from him, I have gotten power back from myself, but I do need to really dive into taking it back from him. I have to a certain degree, but haven't been trying hard enough.

I should add, I do not have the password to his computer to install a keylogger, the internet I could cancel, for sure, but then I wouldn't have anywhere to vent!!! LOL!!!! I am pretty sure my friends get tired of me talking about this crap all the time hehehe. We do have two internet cards, his isn't on contract anymore, mine is still on contract. Maybe I should call and cancel his today *evil grin*


----------



## paramore (Jan 11, 2011)

ok where do I find the stickies for plan a and b, and the 180 I need to change my gameplan


----------



## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

First, I'm assuming you have not cheated. Is that correct?



paramore said:


> Ok, so last night, I had told him, didn't demand, but told him, after much thinking, it would make me comfortable if he deleted the first and second EA from his fb, and his phone, I believed both phone numbers were on there. Turns out he only has the latest EA's phone number on there.


Did he remove it?



> So anyways, he mentioned he was kind of mad at me for contacting her, as I guess she won't even talk to him on facebook. He said he thinks the only reason I contacted her or even the last EA was to manipulate things to get the situation the way I wanted. He doesn't understand why I needed to contact either one of them. Well while I contacted the first one for completely different reasons, the second one when I called her to stop talking to my husband was me standing up for my marriage. I said LOTS of women would do that.
> 
> Anyways, since he's the one who had told people in the first place, I felt the need to get my side out there, I am TIRED of being demonized and made the bad guy!!! I am not the only one who made mistakes. He said you don't see me talking to your mom or sister, I said that's you, I am a different person than you. If you don't feel the need for people to have your side, that's your choice, in my opinion, people can only be objective if they have both sides.


You need to continue doing what you need for YOU and not let him gaslight you into being 'compliant'. HE cheated, YOU guide the rules now. Period. If he doesn't like that, he can leave. If you won't hold to even that one rule, he will continue to cheat on you.



> He told me this morning she wouldn't even talk to him, so it's basically over between those two, how is that MY fault??? I told her what was going on, evidently he hadn't, how is it MY fault that from what I am gathering, that he chose to withhold info from her about what he was doing, that he chose to start another EA?


Why are you allowing him to contact either one of them? 

You need to set your boundaries a LOT HIGHER than you are. 



> He wanted to be able to still be friends with her
> 
> So gist of it, I am the bad guy again, supposedly trying to manipulate our situation to get the outcome I want.


So what? HE cheated, not you, right? Again, you need to start saying so what? You need to start acting as though you are a PRIZE and he is LUCKY you haven't kicked his sorry ass out. If you don't, he will cheat again, because you haven't given him any consequences.



> He went on about the snooping again


Again, so what? HE cheated. HE now gets to be snooped on because he has LOST your trust for the foreseeable future. That is just a consequence of cheating.



> How can I creep his computer when I have no passwords, etc???


Uh, why do you NOT have his passwords? Again, you have set the bar too low.



> he's asked me to have faith in him


Too bad, so sad. HE cheated.



> He still has zero in me.


Faith in you for what? What possible reason would he be able to give that he has lost faith in YOU? Did you cheat?



> I am just tired of being the bad guy all of the time, tired of being accused of being manipulative


You realize, right, that this is HIM manipulating YOU? Stop letting him. Stop caring what he thinks.


----------



## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

paramore said:


> If I were a real jerk, I'd hack his facebook, and then be the one with egg on my face if he's telling me the truth. I would never hack his page, but man, the peace of mind would be VERY nice


How about you rewrite this as a BETRAYED spouse?

"Since I have been cheated on AT LEAST twice now, I am going to check his facebook, as is my RIGHT as a betrayed spouse, to make sure he has indeed stopped cheating on me."


----------



## paramore (Jan 11, 2011)

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/21495-husband-cant-look-me-same.html

Here is my story Turnera, and after all that went down, I discovered another EA at the end of February. I have taken the steps to cut off contact on my end, haven't spoken to the guy in about 2 months, he recently tried to contact me to see how I was, twice, I didn't respond back and told my husband immediately.


----------



## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Well, I see that you are not allowing OM to contact you any more. You are doing the correct thing. Your husband is NOT.


----------



## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

And btw, what you're describing is PA, not EA, since they were physical.

What boundaries are you prepared to set up?


----------



## paramore (Jan 11, 2011)

Basically, Turnera, he is saying I have been controlling our entire relationship, and to a certain degree that is true, not entirely. I unfortunately can't stop him from contacting them, I am pretty sure he hasn't contacted the last EA, I do know he tried to contact the first EA sometime last week, but she hasn't contacted him back, he wants to tell "his side" for the things I told her. He feels that he needs to do that so she doesn't hate him, because she was there for him when I wasn't, WTH!!! I have told him how can you take steps in improving yourself while still having that emotional connection, (supposedly not romantic anymore), the guy in my case? I feel nothing, I initially missed the friendship, like for a week LOL. This first EA lasted about two years, on his end.


----------



## paramore (Jan 11, 2011)

We are locked in this power struggle basically, and I have made it clear that I am not going to be his scapegoat anymore, that is one boundary that I have set up.


----------



## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

paramore said:


> I am pretty sure he hasn't contacted the last EA, I do know he tried to contact the first EA sometime last week, but she hasn't contacted him back, he wants to tell "his side" for the things I told her. He feels that he needs to do that so she doesn't hate him, because she was there for him when I wasn't


Para, you won't be able to work on your marriage until he cuts off ALL contact with her. The fact he's still contacting her is a very bad sign.


----------



## paramore (Jan 11, 2011)

yes, yes it is. I agree. He went to counseling today, I am praying that if they covered that, he was honest and the counseler tells him he needs to quit, she pretty much said that at our first MC session.


----------



## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Regardless of whether MC covered it or not, YOU need to cover that with him.

Also, he seems to hold you at a different standard--it's ok for him to have multiple EA/PAs but the one time you do it, while he's getting serviced upstairs by the wife of the swap guy, he is up in arms about it?

Do you see the imbalance here?


----------



## paramore (Jan 11, 2011)

Ohhhh yeah, I do, remember 2 EA's and the swap wife was an EA/PA combined. I know right??? Not scorekeeping, he took the first step, I have covered that with him. I have covered all of this with him. I have explained more than once holding onto this first EA is hindering the personal healing he needs to do. He stepped outside of the marriage first, really that's a moot point, it's in the past, what matters is the actions of NOW. I gotta applaud the guy though, I always thought I was the massively hardheaded one, I have NEVER come across such a hard egg to crack, haha.

This actually was part of a conversation once after the discovery of the last EA, I asked him what he would have done if I had started another EA after all of this was said and done, he said he just would have been done completely, that we weren't meant to work out, I was like WTF???? I know I am being held to a different standard, I feel that he's still justifying it in his head, well J (me) did all of this to me, I am doing what makes me happy. There is no justification to it, we both failed as spouses, and both stepped outside of the marriage, yes he did more, but we are both equally responsible for the state our marriage is in, we are both personally responsible for the stepping outside of the marriage. It irritates me that I am being held to a different standard, only he can come to the realization that he's being completely unfair. I am NOT accepting his justifications or his you did this you did that, anymore, I haven't been doing that for awhile. We are BOTH at fault, I am prepared to atone for my indiscretions, and be the wife that he deserves. I am prepared to face the consequences of my actions, husband isn't there yet.


----------



## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

The point is, you have to decide what YOU will accept in a marriage. 

And then convey that to HIM.

"I cannot stay married to you if you have to have a relationship with OW."


----------



## paramore (Jan 11, 2011)

Yes, that I do need to do.


----------



## paramore (Jan 11, 2011)

I must state too, that I have given him all of my pw's several times, and all of these sites I have set up for auto login anyways, but if he wanted to log in on his laptop, that would be perfectly fine. I have written them all down at least 2 3 times, he says he has no interest and throws them away, then i make another list again. I mean EVERYTHING. I had had his pw's but when he was staying at his sisters, he changed them just to prove the point he won't be controlled. He could log onto this laptop right now and see everything. He keeps saying, well how do I know you don't delete stuff before i could see it, well then, wait til I'm not around or haven't been on here yet today, login and see what's going on, there's NOTHING, he could even read my inbox on here, I wouldn't give a hoot.


----------



## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Again, this isn't about YOU. It's about what HE is willing to give. And if he isn't willing to give YOU total transparency - after a HISTORY of cheating - then YOU have to make it clear you will not share him.

I know you don't want to end your marriage, but here's the thing - you don't HAVE a marriage if he believes he can keep secrets from you. You will NEVER be happy, no matter how much you sacrifice just to keep the family together. Retain your dignity. And SHOW him you deserve to be respected.


----------



## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

turnera said:


> The point is, you have to decide what YOU will accept in a marriage.
> 
> And then convey that to HIM.
> 
> "I cannot stay married to you if you have to have a relationship with OW."


Agreed.


----------



## paramore (Jan 11, 2011)

This is on a completely different note just had to whine, sump pumps failed overnight, woke up to a foot and a half of water in basement, we have a brand new furnace and washer, I am praying that we get the water out, and it can dry out, we can't afford another damn furnace!!!! I think the water heater can be fixed, but the darn furnace was almost 3k!!!! We don't have that kind of money, like I said nothing to do with infidelity, just wanted to have a pity party for a moment. Although we did have a discussion on whether a person can change who they are fundamentally, I stated that while you really can't you can change thought processes and how you react and handle things, he disagrees.


----------



## Niceguy13 (Apr 7, 2011)

Para I am in much the same boat as you except farther down the river. Going the route you are going he is eventualy going to ask you for a divorce anyways. I understand you want to work on your marriage but he is unwilling to do so. He has shown no transparencey and at the very least is defnitley breaking NC though probaly more. Don't do what I did don't wait beg and plead. He is deaf right now. File papers for you and your kids work on you. Wait for him to come around but don't wait just for him. If he doesn't come around by the time you move on it is his lost. My biggest regret over my situation is that I didn't respect myself I let my DW walk all over me and file on me. Yes I want to save my marriage but her respect for me is so eroded by now any chance of that happening will be after the D. That is how you can take the power back. Right now you are still playing the "game"with his set of rigged rules. To have a loving marriage you both must be on equal grounds.


----------



## HurtinginTN (Feb 22, 2011)

paramore said:


> yes, yes it is. I agree. He went to counseling today, I am praying that if they covered that, he was honest and the counseler tells him he needs to quit, she pretty much said that at our first MC session.



I've paid several hundred dollars for my wife's "counsellor". Apparently, this counsellor is OK with the affair. My wife has had several comments that reflect this after her appointments.

"Lots of people have affairs."

"You can't kick me out of the house. It's in my name, too."

Counsellor - "What are you going to do if Mr. Perfect isn't so perfect when you meet him?" Wife - "Then I guess I'll go to marriage counselling." 

I hope your husband's counsellor gives better advice.


----------



## paramore (Jan 11, 2011)

she does, she has told husband point blank, she thinks the marriage is worth working on, as we are very compatible, want the same things, still love there, alot more on my side than his. Today just hasn't been the best day, as you saw from my rant above, we had water in our basement. I called my dad, hubby had a job interview at 9, he had said before, I'll take care of it when I get back. Well I called my dad, I thought two heads/two pumps are better than one, and I know my husband gets frustrated with the pump if it isn't working right, and my dad usually...not always...but usually can get things running. So my husband wouldn't come when my dad was there.

I suppose he didn't want to face my dad, my dad doesn't know the whole story, husband knows that. He had errands to run because of my dad being there. Finally he said, I'll do as I'm told, I'll come home and help. Now all of the sudden I am in the wrong. I am tired of all the things that I have been doing the last two months being viewed as wrong. While he was gone this last time, I had no vehicle, I had to call my dad to come fix the pickup, the time before, I had no hot water or working kitchen sink, I had to call my dad to fix them, cuz my husband had no time, I mean, it's become habit to call my dad. I mean in the last 4 5 months, I've been left with non working things in the house and my husband wasn't around, it's become a habit for me to run to my dad. Right or wrong??? Sheesh


----------



## HurtinginTN (Feb 22, 2011)

I don't see any problem with calling your dad. I called my father-in-law a couple of weeks ago to help me fix our garage door. My daughter decided to ride it up when it was opening. She grabbed the handle and held on while it lifted her up. It got a little off track. I got it a lot off track trying to fix it. I definitely needed help getting it fixed. He knows the story. You have to get help where you can sometimes.


----------



## paramore (Jan 11, 2011)

thanks hurt.


----------



## paramore (Jan 11, 2011)

So, MC last thursday told us we have to "schedule" times to talk about things, and work on communication, fair enough. She told him that he needs to work on accepting that my intentions are good and not manipulative, me to "back off" and him to "come forward", again fair enough. Well anyways, Saturday I just had some gut feeling. He had been texting with the first EA on Saturday. Now I have to say that it is non romantic now, but that's not the point. I intercepted a text that said,"I know she (me) has got you on a short leash." 

Well, understandably, I was angry. I woke him up at 3am, he had to work at 630 lol, and told him I intercepted a text from her, I did not scream or raise my voice. I expressed that we don't have a chance at all with you still in contact with her, he said why? I was like WTF? lol. I told him, she is still a third person in our marriage, and I won't accept sharing my husband, and basically said it's her or me. Well, he very begrudgingly erased her off his phone. 

This morning, we had a small disagreement, he was half asleep trying to start intimate relations with me, and I swear to God he said last EA's name, well I could have been mistaken, and I told him that, giving him the benefit of the doubt, cuz he was half asleep. So anyways, he said to me this morning, you have been on me getting rid of their numbers for the last few weeks, you'll stop at nothing until I do it, I got rid of M's number, you got your way, yet again. I said, all she has to do is text you again and you'll have it, well I don't think she will, because my husband has been the one that initiates the contact. He feels she deserves an explanation, as I have told him that I contacted her at the end of Feb, partially for closure, and trying to forgive, and I told her what he had been up to.

I guess my question is, I am in the right aren't I? I stated my boundaries, and stuck to them. If he wouldn't have erased at least that one, I would have either packed up the kids and went to sisters for awhile or packed up his things. I am not being controlling and manipulative am I? His main issue with me right now is in the past I was controlling, and evidently I am being controlling and manipulative to "get what I want". I am simply refusing to be disrespected anymore. I won't apologize for demanding him to make a choice. Now I am gonna work on the last EA's number, I KNOW there has been no contact, but he is keeping it as a means of control.

I will also add this, I politely contacted her through facebook, asking she cease all communication with my husband, as this friendship continues to be detrimental to our marriage, he doesn't know this, but if he ever reads TAM he will, but oh well lol. I was well within my rights correct?


----------



## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Hell yes! you are in the right! 

When you got married, he VOWED to love YOU and take care of YOU. Here he is telling you he cares more about his own feelings than yours. That is wrong. Do NOT back down.

Don't make it a demand that he get rid of their numbers. Instead, you state - again - 'I understand you have reasons for wanting access to your EAs. If that's what you want badly enough, you're welcome to keep them. But if you DO keep them, I will consider that your decision that your access to your affair partners is more important to you than MY feelings, and I will not stay in that marriage. YOU choose. I'm not telling you what to do; I'm telling you what *I* will do if you don't stop all contact forever - leave you.'


----------



## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Para, did she write you back? Did you send the email her her husband??

Yes, you were well within your rights to tell him to knock it off.


----------



## paramore (Jan 11, 2011)

that is the thing, I think I may have made it come across as a demand, I said pretty much verbatim, I won't share my husband, it's either her or me. Jelly, I haven't yet, I got busy yesterday afternoon, and was in town all morning doing grocery shopping, and laundry with 3 kids under 6 lol, quite the endeavor. No she hasn't written me back yet.

Turnera, I am already pretty sure what the answer is, but I have an email all ready to go with Jelly's help, what's your take on contacting the first EA's husband after several months, when the friendship isn't romantic anymore...

It has recently come to my attention that your wife and my husband are still in contact. Their relationship has been inappropriate in the past, by admission from my husband, and caused problems in my marriage in the past and their continued contact is having an adverse effect on it currently. I have asked my husband previously to cease all contact with her, and have discovered recently they are still in contact. While I believe their relationship as of right now is no longer romantic, I am writing you this so that you are also aware of this on your end and because you have the right to know as well of what is going on. Feel free to contact me.

This is what Jelly helped me with, as for the last EA's guy I have tried every avenue i could to find him, even though I know there has been no contact. I even contacted her ex hubby, whom she cheated on with another married man, he has no contact info for him. I had gotten a cell number that was dcd.


----------



## paramore (Jan 11, 2011)

My main thing is this, I am pretty sure I am gonna send it here within the next few minutes, but is that considered being manipulative? I mean in the sense that I would gain something by it, which is what my husband is convinced that is what I have been doing all along.


----------



## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

No it is NOT manipulative. Your husband basically signed a 'contract' with you and he is straying from it. You have the right to protect your 'property' - your marriage. And yes, the OW's husband needs to know they're still in touch.

If you want, let your husband know tonight, LATE tonight, that you let OW's husband know. Again, if he gets angry, you just keep stating 'I'm fighting to save my marriage. It won't survive if you keep in contact with other women. Out of the two of us, *I* am the one doing the right thing. And, if you no longer contact her, you have nothing to worry about, do you?'

It feels like you waver a lot, second-guess yourself. Worst thing ever. Stay strong, stay mad. The only way you'll keep your husband.


----------



## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

I think you really should send the one email to the husband of the one still texting your hub (the one you emailed).

As for the other EA-yeah if they are still in contact, send away (to the hub).


----------



## paramore (Jan 11, 2011)

second ea, there is no contact, I am quite sure of that, and you are right, I do secondguess myself, reason being, I have some people giving good reasons to do this/that/the other thing. All people are giving good reasons to support their point of view, I am getting there day by day, I mean, it wasn't up until yesterday I didn't have the guts to stand up for myself and contact the OW to ask to cease contact. Thing is too, counseler said I need to back off on the "saving marriage talk" we are only allowed to discuss Sundays and Wednesdays for 2 hours, we didn't do it on Sunday, because he feels me confronting him with the text at 3am on Sunday morning took the place of that hahahaha. He said, it was very disrepectful that you woke me up when you know I had to be to work early, I fired back, well it's very disrespectful of you to continue to be deceitful and duplicitous and continuing to lie to me when you know how I feel about what you were doing LOL, he didn't have much to say except, "Am I allowed to leave for work now?" hahahaha, don't worry my perverbial balls are growing lol.


----------



## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

If he's not in contact with 2nd EA anymore, I prob wouldn't send anything to her.

But as for the first EA chick you emailed, I would definitely send that email to her hub. Soon.


----------



## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Good for you for learning to stand up for yourself. Don't listen to his manipulation BS.


----------

