# My ex continues to amaze...



## Rowan

I'm just venting here. My best friend is a family therapist, so I try not to burden her further with my drama. And my family would pretty much be willing to help me hide my ex-husband's body at a moment's notice, so I try not to vent much to any of them, either. 

My ex came by yesterday to pick up our son for his weekend, and asked to speak to me privately for a moment. So, while DS was finishing his packing, we stepped out on the deck to speak. Ex immediately started telling me that I should be more careful about talking to my friends. It got back to his girlfriend that he asked me out a couple weeks ago - though he was and still is in a committed relationship with her. She was angry and hurt, and now doesn't want to hang out with my husband's (formerly our mutual) friend who told her. He's pissed at me because _I_ hurt his girlfriend and cost him a friendship. 

He wanted an apology. He did not get one.

He has no sense that it was inappropriate to ask me out while already in a relationship. No sense that it's not my job to keep secrets for him. No sense that maybe he shouldn't be doing things he needs to hide from the person he's in a relationship with. No sense that it was _his behavior _that was hurtful, rather than me who did something wrong. He's still in the mindset that anything he doesn't want his partner to know about is simply none of her business - and that everyone else should know and respect that fact. 

You'd think I would be past the point of being surprised by anything he does. But, astoundingly, I am sometimes still amazed at the level to which he can suck.

:slap:


----------



## Miss Taken

I've never seen the word "ex-husband" written so beautifully. Sounds like there's a good reason as to why he's your ex and he just wanted to help remind you of that by behaving like a d0uche-canoe.


----------



## Pluto2

I am just sitting here ..... shaking my head and chuckling. Not at you!

Some people work themselves into a frenzy to avoid responsibility for the trouble in their lives that their actions have created. I bet he never had to clean his room as a child, either (joking-sort of). Why do I think he and my ex would be best of friends.
So did you keep a straight face while he spewed?


----------



## lenzi

Rowan said:


> He has no sense that it was inappropriate to ask me out while already in a relationship.


Do you have a sense that it's inappropriate for him to ask you out because..he's your *EX* husband, who cheated on you many times over many years?

What did you say when he asked you out? Why did he think you might say yes?


----------



## lifeistooshort

Sometimes the only options are keep a sense of humor or compromise your sanity. Option number one is usually better.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## EnjoliWoman

Haha! Amazing sense of entitlement.


----------



## Rowan

I did keep a straight face. Even when he started in with trying to reassure me that he didn't ask me out with the intention of seeing both of us at the same time! Why would I think that?!?! If I'd said yes, he was planning to break up with her. But not because he's afraid to be alone, was looking for an excuse to break up with her without it being his fault, or was on the prowl again for the next new thing while holding his current partner in reserve as a fallback. He's not like that anymore!

He then drunk texted me at nearly midnight last night to let me know how great I am. To thank me for being so classy in greeting his girlfriend last night and in wishing her a happy early Mother's Day. And to let me know he appreciates my efforts to be nice ot her since it must be really hard for me. I didn't tell him that what I'm containing when I speak with her isn't jealousy or hurt, but the nearly overwhelming need to warn her to run!


----------



## Rowan

lenzi said:


> Do you have a sense that it's inappropriate for him to ask you out because..he's your *EX* husband, who cheated on you many times over many years?
> 
> What did you say when he asked you out? Why did he think you might say yes?


I said no. That it just wasn't ever going to happen and that if I wanted to be with him, I wouldn't have divorced him. That he'd had plenty of chances to be a good husband in the 16 years we were married, but he clearly hadn't been interested then or at any point in our 3 years of false R. That I would never trust him again, would never again be willing to be anyone's backup plan or second/third/fourth choice, and that I was utterly done. The same things I told him the dozen or so times he asked if I was sure about the divorce in the 10 weeks between my filing and it being final, and the three other times he asked me out/to change my mind since finalization.

He thought I might say yes because he can't fathom that I actually left him, and he honestly thinks that one day I'll get over my mad and come back. Because he's just that guy.


----------



## LongWalk

Deluded
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## 2galsmom

Rowan said:


> I did keep a straight face. Even when he started in with trying to reassure me that he didn't ask me out with the intention of seeing both of us at the same time! Why would I think that?!?! If I'd said yes, he was planning to break up with her. But not because he's afraid to be alone, was looking for an excuse to break up with her without it being his fault, or was on the prowl again for the next new thing while holding his current partner in reserve as a fallback. He's not like that anymore!
> 
> He then drunk texted me at nearly midnight last night to let me know how great I am. To thank me for being so classy in greeting his girlfriend last night and in wishing her a happy early Mother's Day. * And to let me know he appreciates my efforts to be nice ot her since it must be really hard for me.* I didn't tell him that what I'm containing when I speak with her isn't jealousy or hurt, but the nearly overwhelming need to warn her to run!


:rofl: 

I am sorry for your situation but you made me laugh, or rather he did. It is so nice of you! Yes, it must be so hard for you seeing someone who has no regard for anyone but himself treat another woman with complete disrespect.


----------



## Cloaked

Miss Taken said:


> I've never seen the word "ex-husband" written so beautifully. Sounds like there's a good reason as to why he's your ex and he just wanted to help remind you of that by behaving like a d0uche-canoe.


d0uche-canoe? I disagree. He is more like a mobile automated crap canon! With unlimited ammo!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## BetrayedDad

Rowan said:


> I said no. That it just wasn't ever going to happen and that if I wanted to be with him, I wouldn't have divorced him. That he'd had plenty of chances to be a good husband in the 16 years we were married, but he clearly hadn't been interested then or at any point in our 3 years of false R. That I would never trust him again, would never again be willing to be anyone's backup plan or second/third/fourth choice, and that I was utterly done. The same things I told him the dozen or so times he asked if I was sure about the divorce in the 10 weeks between my filing and it being final, and the three other times he asked me out/to change my mind since finalization.
> 
> He thought I might say yes because he can't fathom that I actually left him, and he honestly thinks that one day I'll get over my mad and come back. Because he's just that guy.


Sounds EXACTLY like my ex wife's mentality. We should try to hook them up. They'd be a perfect match!


----------



## TheGoodGuy

Douche-canoe is my new favorite word. 
You're doing great Rowan!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## MrsVain

First let me congratulate you on your ability not killing this bastard or at least kicking his a$$. you need to be applauded for keeping your senses.

he sounds like my ex. never his fault, always someone elses (MINE) fault. never taking responsibility for his actions, his choices or his decisions. mine is forever blaming his anger, and sadness on me. it is my fault he drank and never came home, it was my fault that he started seeing a crackhead before our divorce was even filed because i wasnt treating him right.

i shake my head while reading this. at least he had the decency to ask you to step outside where your son couldnt hear him tell you off for telling the truth. my ex has taken to bad mouthing mommy to our boys to try to win brownie points. i never can understand how men like that think they actually have a right to tell us anything. i am not your wife anymore, i can see all the BS lies you toss around, the rose colored glasses are off and i am no longer obligated to try to understand what is wrong with you or to decode your hidden messages or try to be your therapist.


----------



## 2ntnuf

but, but, he just wants to be your friend...

Don't friends have each other's backs?


----------



## 3Xnocharm

Rowan said:


> He has no sense that it was inappropriate to ask me out while already in a relationship. No sense that it's not my job to keep secrets for him. No sense that maybe he shouldn't be doing things he needs to hide from the person he's in a relationship with. No sense that it was _his behavior _that was hurtful, rather than me who did something wrong. He's still in the mindset that anything he doesn't want his partner to know about is simply none of her business - and that everyone else should know and respect that fact.
> 
> :slap:


I was just involved with someone JUST LIKE THIS! It never occurred to him to act with integrity so that he didnt have to constantly lie and cover up. Also, he believed that NOT telling someone something that he didnt want them to know, was NOT a lie! That IS A LIE, a lie by omission! I cant tell you how many times we went round and round about that! Why cant people just be honest!


----------



## Lon

Astoundingly hilarious (I'm sorry if it causes any pain Rowan)  I wonder what he would say if it ever got back to his gf that he confronted you looking for an apology that it got to his gf he asked you out? Would he come seeking another apology? How many times before he figures it out?


----------



## MrsVain

3Xnocharm said:


> , he believed that NOT telling someone something that he didnt want them to know, was NOT a lie! That IS A LIE, a lie by omission! I cant tell you how many times we went round and round about that! Why cant people just be honest!


my ex was like that too. wtf is wrong with men these days. of course when you do it to them, they get all mad and pissy. but cant see it as wrong when they do it to you. my ex before our divorce and i am sure he will again now after, would tell my kids "dont tell your mom, what she doesnt know, wont hurt her" WTF kind of thinking is THAT and to tell your kids to lie to mommy is okay because you are just covering your own a$$. And yet when confronted i was trying to control him or manipulate him?

they are the master at controling and manipulating. i didnt see it while it was happening. i would call my mom, seriously thinking i was losing my mind until she would tell me, that is NOT what you told me he said. or she would tell me, that is NOT what happened. i see it much better now that he left and we are divorced. 

and now he is mad because he cant play me anymore. still cant see that it was his actions in the first place. 

be strong, and do what is right. just a thought. does your ex tell your son anything. i am struggling with trying to protect mine or to just let them see their dad's true colors. i also am struggling with how to prepare them when he talks bad about me and what to tell them or how to explain that daddy is a big fat liar?


----------



## EleGirl

Rowan said:


> .... And my family would pretty much be willing to help me hide my ex-husband's body at a moment's notice, so I try not to vent much to any of them, either.
> 
> ...


All I keep thinking of here is how you all would pull this off and not leave any forensic evidence for those darn CSI to figure out who done it... (I've been watch way too many CSI Miami and NY reruns lately).

:rofl:

Your ex is a tool. But you already knew that. Too bad the one he's with now is not smart enough to know this.


----------



## Rowan

MrsVain said:


> does your ex tell your son anything. i am struggling with trying to protect mine or to just let them see their dad's true colors. i also am struggling with how to prepare them when he talks bad about me and what to tell them or how to explain that daddy is a big fat liar?


I don't ask my son what he and his Daddy talk about, and I don't say anything about his father if I can't say something nice. He's 14, and reads people frighteningly well. He knows why we divorced, and has said things to indicate that he has no problems seeing his father for who he is. I encourage him to form his own relationship with his Daddy, and to always be respectful and use his manners. I try to be honest with my son, while not doing or saying anything to alienate him from his father. It's sometimes a tough balance, but I try very hard not to add drama or crazy to my son's life. 



EleGirl said:


> All I keep thinking of here is how you all would pull this off and not leave any forensic evidence for those darn CSI to figure out who done it... (I've been watch way too many CSI Miami and NY reruns lately).


LOL!


----------



## Jellybeans

He sounds like an idiot, Rowan.


----------



## Pluto2

Why is it these men never seemed like idiots when we married?


----------



## FeministInPink

Pluto2 said:


> Why is it these men never seemed like idiots when we married?


They are very good liars/fakers! Mine was a brilliant emotional con artist. BRILLIANT.


----------



## vi_bride04

Pluto2 said:


> Why is it these men never seemed like idiots when we married?


B/c we were too busy listening and believing their explanations of "how great of a guy" they were. It blinded us to the character of their true nature. 

I mean, a guy THAT GREAT can't be bad, right?


----------



## FeministInPink

If it's too good to be true...


----------



## Catherine602

Can you have him pick the kids up at the door without entering the house?


----------



## Pepper123

20/20 hindsight can me a mother f*****


----------



## ne9907

vi_bride04 said:


> B/c we were too busy listening and believing their explanations of "how great of a guy" they were. It blinded us to the character of their true nature.
> 
> I mean, a guy THAT GREAT can't be bad, right?


:iagree:

I still believe my ex is a great guy. But not for me anymore.


----------



## Rowan

Catherine602 said:


> Can you have him pick the kids up at the door without entering the house?


I try, but it's not always possible. Hospitality is a huge thing here. If I were rude enough to not invite him in - particularly in front of our son - he would definitely notice. I would come out looking mean and unreasonable for being rude to him. And chances are excellent that he'd just come in anyway, forcing me to either accept his presence against my will or be the bad guy who's throwing him out of my house in front of our child. Yay, passive-aggressive games! 

If I'm coolly polite and gracious, there's nothing to criticize, challenge or rebel against. Basically, I treat him like a casual acquaintance, maintaining distance and giving him nothing shiny to chase. 

He's not dangerous or anything, just profoundly self-centered.


----------



## Blossom Leigh

"must be so hard for you"

sounds SO patronizing ... yuck...

glad you can see through that... took me some time to see through it too and now, come back fast with "don't patronize me." He has learned not to argue that he wasn't... its a beautiful thing then they realize they can't get one over on you and start respecting you for who you really are instead of their warped perception.


----------



## 3Xnocharm

Who cares if you're the bad guy? Its YOUR home, therefore YOUR rules. He can honk outside when he gets there.


----------



## FeministInPink

Rowan said:


> I try, but it's not always possible. Hospitality is a huge thing here. *If I were rude enough to not invite him in - particularly in front of our son - he would definitely notice. * I would come out looking mean and unreasonable for being rude to him. And chances are excellent that he'd just come in anyway, forcing me to either accept his presence against my will or be the bad guy who's throwing him out of my house in front of our child. Yay, passive-aggressive games!
> 
> If I'm coolly polite and gracious, there's nothing to criticize, challenge or rebel against. Basically, I treat him like a casual acquaintance, maintaining distance and giving him nothing shiny to chase.
> 
> He's not dangerous or anything, just profoundly self-centered.


I feel like that's the exact message that you should be sending! (That he is NOT WELCOME.) I would not be letting a casual acquaintance inside my house.

EDIT: He would be the rude one for trying to force his way into your house.


----------



## Rowan

Guys, he's not angry or dangerous or hateful - just delusionaly clueless and ridiculously, comically, entitled. For the most part - despite the occasional wtf moment like the other day - I find him amusing rather than offensive. 

Being rude, insisting on him staying outside, etc., would create drama. I can't compete with him in passive-aggression, he's better at it by miles. So I just don't play. Frankly, I just don't care enough to insist on standing on principle. Being calmly polite, gracious, and agreeable, especially in situations that I don't care much about one way or another (like him coming into my house), costs me nothing and keeps the drama level very low for everyone. This is not fawning conflict avoidance, it's jovial _apathy_. 

Perhaps that's not the way some would handle their serial cheating ex. In my situation, it works for me. :shrug:


----------



## Lon

Rowan, that is exactly how I approach my ex too. Though she can be a little deceptive sometimes, so I tend to be guarded with her.


----------



## FeministInPink

Rowan, if it works for you


----------



## EnjoliWoman

Rowan, I think you are doing well choosing your battles. AND setting a good example for your son.

I CRINGED at letting ex into my house two times. One was a year that I had just been in my house for almost a year and it was ex's turn for Halloween - he lived in a condo in a scary section of town so I offered for him to take her trick or treating in my neighborhood. But he just stood in the entrance while she finished getting her costume on. Then approximately a month later kiddo's room got new carpet, and paint and adhesive flowers for the walls along with new curtains and bedspread and she wanted to show him so I let her. 

This was right before the summer of hell when he sued for emergency custody and took her away. So much for the high road. Since then he is court ordered to not go down my street nor can he have anyone else do it. And I like it that way.


----------



## malcolypse

Um yaaah... you have no responsibility to keep his secrets nor to keep quiet about his or anyone's misbehavior. Even LESS so an ex!

Good old reminders as to WHY he's an ex!


----------



## Tasty

Your ex has not grown up yet. He should learn to think before making moves he might regret. And to take responsibilities for consequences that show up. You owe him no duty at all to cover his a.se or project him in good light. I think you handled him perfectly.


----------



## FeministInPink

Tasty said:


> Your ex has not grown up yet. He should learn to think before making moves he might regret. And to take responsibilities for consequences that show up. You owe him no duty at all to cover his a.se or project him in good light. I think you handled him perfectly.


And there's a good chance he will never grow up, from what it sounds like.


----------



## Rowan

I think that's a huge part of it. He just never grew up. Another big part of it is just the way his mind works. It's....interesting, in a sort of clinical way. It's entirely crazy-making to live with. He gaslights without realizing it. He's self-centered while honestly thinking other people are. He lacks empathy and self-awareness but really believes he has those things in spades. He doesn't try to be manipulative, he just is, in a very fundamental way. A friend told me last night that it's like he doesn't even function in the same reality as everyone else. 

On the way home from dinner out with friends last night, he texted me to ask if I would drive him to have his vasectomy today - the one he refused to get while we were married. Apparently, his girlfriend is out of town on a business trip. He copped a hurt, offended, slightly guilt-trippy, attitude when I refused. So I just wished him luck with his surgery and said good night.

Idiot.


----------



## EnjoliWoman

Well. That takes a lot of nerve. He is rather oblivious, isn't he?


----------



## Rowan

Astoundingly so.


----------



## FeministInPink

Rowan said:


> I think that's a huge part of it. He just never grew up. Another big part of it is just the way his mind works. It's....interesting, in a sort of clinical way. It's entirely crazy-making to live with. He gaslights without realizing it. He's self-centered while honestly thinking other people are. He lacks empathy and self-awareness but really believes he has those things in spades. He doesn't try to be manipulative, he just is, in a very fundamental way. A friend told me last night that it's like he doesn't even function in the same reality as everyone else.
> 
> *On the way home from dinner out with friends last night, he texted me to ask if I would drive him to have his vasectomy today - the one he refused to get while we were married. Apparently, his girlfriend is out of town on a business trip. He copped a hurt, offended, slightly guilt-trippy, attitude when I refused. So I just wished him luck with his surgery and said good night*.
> 
> Idiot.


Wow. *shakes head*


----------



## mishu143

OMG he sounds exactly like my husband!! I can't wait to be divorced and over it all.


----------



## yruhere

playing the blame game is he? Sad....


----------

