# How to make progress if your man would rather not actually TALK about it?



## madimoff (Feb 17, 2010)

I'm going to try not to make this TOO long!! I’m wondering if it’s men, or everyone, who doesn’t like having conversations specifically aimed at being about their relationship problems and how to build, reconnect, understand, etc – we had a slightly stressed weekend but the worst bit was when I brought up love languages & ended up on the end of a bit of a mouthful about how he’d rather be sitting having his coffee etc etc & have a weekend without emotional conversations. I did my best to not react badly, but wonder how to take it from here: is it seriously better to attempt to achieve improvements single-handed and if so, HOW if you aren’t getting feedback from the OH about, for example, WHAT his emotional needs are – a straight question – or WHAT he’d like me to be telling him (words of affirmation, straight question) etc etc? ? I mean, I’ve been sending naughty texts to show him I DO think about sex, and that’s SO unlike me – even then, when I mentioned it, all he said was ‘that’s progress’! It's not that he's totally blanking Love Languages, Love Busters etc, it's getting any further and jointly LEARNING from it that's proving a bit problematic!
(nb always remembering we don't live together fulltime, it's kind of 10 days together 10 days in different countries)


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## woodstock (Feb 21, 2011)

From recent experience, I found what works is to meet up (not married but in a complicated relationship) for coffee or something and talk about things, but made a HUGE effort to keep it light, smile a lot and not get too hard handed on him. Mostly I asked him questions about HIS language then responded with how mine was different in same situations. I made sure to tell him how part of my language was simply feeling loved that he was willing to go out of his comfort zone just to talk about the things there. I made sure it was not just about him needed to see me, but that I wanted to be able to see him better as well. Just absolute masic communication.

For the first time he opened up to me, somewhat without even knowing it, and for thefirst time our "talking about it" ended very well, no fighting. As soon as he felt frustrated I agreed to stop, we said something nice, then just smiled at each other and had our coffee. After I made an extra effort to let him know that it meant a lot to me that he opened up and that I hoped it would continue. He has since acted on what we talked about for the first time EVER  I am still in shock over that one HAHA


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## madimoff (Feb 17, 2010)

That sounds a good set-up and a good outcome; I'm up against the LONG time he's been asserting that instead of belly-aching we just need to live life and get on - I feel though that a mix of TAM & the googling I'd been doing have taught me a lot about where I've (big admission coming up) been doing wrong (who, me?!!) as well as things we can both think about, adjust,etc, in our behaviours reactions & so on and 'just getting on' is a bit like sticking your head in the sand & hoping a camel doesn't happen along & cr*p on you!
Because he's not here all the time, in my mind that pretty much doubles the time (over 15hrs a week-ish) that seem to be suggested for progress to be achieved, and without 'scheduled, accepted, *our homework* conversations we're not going to get anywhere anytime soon
Maybe I have to actually memorise your scenario & suggest that: at least if the chat's got some kind of end in sight, of his making, he won't be stressed about not being able to watch the ocean because he's involved in an *emotional* discussion:scratchhead:


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## greeneyeddolphin (May 31, 2010)

Not sure how long you have been together, or your past histories, so this may not apply, but: 

As a woman, until I met my boyfriend, I was in relationships that were rather one-sided. The men I dated, and the one I married, were all about what I could do for them: satisfying their sexual needs, their emotional needs, almost acting as a slave in some senses. I never got what I needed, or wanted, and never even got asked. I got used to that. 

So when my boyfriend and I got together and started having problems, when he asked me to tell him what I needed from him...I was stumped. I had no idea what to tell him. I knew in vague terms: I wanted to be loved, to be happy, etc. But I couldn't give him specifics of "I need you to do this so I feel loved" or "I need you to support me in this so I can be happy." 

And since I couldn't answer the question, I preferred to avoid it. I felt like admitting I didn't know what I needed would make me look stupid or pathetic, but I didn't want to lie and tell him stuff to do that maybe wouldn't do anything. 

Maybe you could try sending him an email asking him to think about the answers to some questions, or to think about some topics you'd like to discuss and ask him to set aside some time to discuss those things next time you see him. Given time to think, he might be better able to handle the conversation. 

Of course, I'm a woman, and we tend to think very differently from men, so I don't know.


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## frustr8dhubby (Dec 23, 2010)

I think it is probably "generally" a male thing. Most of us are not good at expressing feelings in general.

I, however, have the opposite problem. I try to discuss our problems but she would rather talk about just about anything but them.


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

Discussion is fine. 50,000 word epistles that go on for 11 hours are something else. My wife is a terrier. She literally will not stop. And even if you agree with her, she will not stop. It's an interrogation and a beat down. And if you walk away you'll hear muttering and grumbling nonstop. And if you leave the house and come back hours later it starts in again. In any case it's really just a litany of everything that's bad and how it's my fault.


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## MarriedWifeInLove (May 28, 2010)

Runs like Dog said:


> Discussion is fine. 50,000 word epistles that go on for 11 hours are something else. My wife is a terrier. She literally will not stop. And even if you agree with her, she will not stop. It's an interrogation and a beat down. And if you walk away you'll hear muttering and grumbling nonstop. And if you leave the house and come back hours later it starts in again. In any case it's really just a litany of everything that's bad and how it's my fault.


You know why she doesn't stop - because she doesn't get positive feedback that she is BEING HEARD.

My husband thinks he can HEAR ME when he's watching TV, but guess what - I'm not getting his undivided attention.

And when you tell her she's right, you agree with her - is it genuine or is it just to get her to shut up (we can tell the difference).

I know that when I think my husband has 'heard me' I'm less likely to go on and on and repeat myself.

But he very rarely listens with his undivided attention - either the TV, computer or his beer is involved - which means I'm actually not BEING HEARD, I'm just BEING TOLERATED.

Perhaps guys need to remember that women use BOTH SIDES OF OUR BRAINS when we talk, do things, etc. So we have a lot more to work with. You guys just use ONE SIDE - hey - I might have just hit on why we can't get along. :smthumbup:


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## credamdóchasgra (Sep 24, 2010)

M,

there's a book called "How to improve your marriage without talking about it."

when I'm on an actual computer, I'll find the link if you don't get a chance to find it.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## MarriedWifeInLove (May 28, 2010)

credamdóchasgra said:


> M,
> 
> there's a book called "How to improve your marriage without talking about it."
> 
> ...


I think it's under marriagebuilders.com.

Already read it.


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## madimoff (Feb 17, 2010)

AtruckersG: Been together 10 years, friction almost all the way in varying degrees - I'm the most (intelligent! -he'd agree!) challenging of his several monogamous relationships including let's say more than one marriage - we've not made it past a now broken engagement
I had possibly slightly more sexual partners than he (both of us only just more than one hand!!) and he's supposedly now over his considerable sexual jealousy - not helped by one of my problems which was tarring him with the same brush as one of my 'previous' for whom I was a bit on the side thus giving me the perfect reason (maybe he'd be right to say excuse) for thinking men are only after one thing
nb googled the book, and probably won't be able to buy it cos of mailing issues, but one description of a male baby fits my OH to a T so maybe there's something in it------ !


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

MarriedWifeInLove said:


> You know why she doesn't stop - because she doesn't get positive feedback that she is BEING HEARD.


There's an element of that, that's true. On the other hand I've heard it all in its glorious illuminated calligraphic beauty about 359,000 times already. Call me old fashioned but if a woman wants to be heard, she has to whisper. Shouting at me won't fix a thing. It won't it really really really really won't.

Contrary to popular believe "I Love Lucy" was not a documentary.


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## Blanca (Jul 25, 2008)

My H is not a talker. At all. I used to feel so insecure in the relationship so I wanted to talk about the relationship ALL the time. I needed him to console me, reassure me, and make me feel that we were OK. I was soooo needy. My H felt exactly like *Runs Like Dog*. He felt like nothing was ever good enough and that I was just trying to make him feel guilty. 

I dont talk about my relationship much anymore but I feel at peace with where Im at. Dont get me wrong, we have our problems, but i dont see the need to talk about it much. We both know what the problems are and quite frankly I've got many other things on my mind. Talking has its place but, in addition to being draining, it adds to the frustration and confusion. There is the saying that communication is 20% verbal and 80% nonverbal, so i focus on the other 80% now. I never talk about issues if my H is not willing and in the mood too. I will ask him if he can talk but I never just go into it randomly. If he doesnt seem to be paying attention i dont get moody and throw a fit anymore and start labeling his reaction as unloving. I ask him if this is not a good time for him. Maybe Im more understanding because im tired and have a million things to do so I know how he feels now. Usually the only time i talk about my relationship is when I do the boundary book with my H, which is maybe once every couple weeks. 

Not talking about the marriage was counterintuitive to me initially. I thought once i stopped talking about my needs and his needs, that we'd drift apart and no one's needs would get met. So I guess fear was the under lining motivation. And divorce is a possibility. But the alternative of talking about it all the time was also leading to divorce, not to mention losing my mind. I figured i only had my sanity to gain by trying a different approach. I didnt just stop talking, though. I stopped asking and needing and started working on giving to myself. I started to see him as a friend and asked myself if i would treat a friend that way. i started paying attention to his problems and struggles. I also had to work on my resentment. That was the biggest factor. But these are all things I can do without constantly talking to him. 

I am listening to Eckhart Tolle's _The Power of Now_ audio book and its basically in-line with how I feel about the problems in my relationship, and life in general. It is very empowering to be able to chose the peace of being present.


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## madimoff (Feb 17, 2010)

Blanca said:


> My H is not a talker. At all. I used to feel so insecure in the relationship so I wanted to talk about the relationship ALL the time. I needed him to console me, reassure me, and make me feel that we were OK. I was soooo needy. My H felt exactly like *Runs Like Dog*. He felt like nothing was ever good enough and that I was just trying to make him feel guilty.
> 
> I dont talk about my relationship much anymore but I feel at peace with where Im at. Dont get me wrong, we have our problems, but i dont see the need to talk about it much. We both know what the problems are and quite frankly I've got many other things on my mind. Talking has its place but, in addition to being draining, it adds to the frustration and confusion. There is the saying that communication is 20% verbal and 80% nonverbal, so i focus on the other 80% now. I never talk about issues if my H is not willing and in the mood too. I will ask him if he can talk but I never just go into it randomly. If he doesnt seem to be paying attention i dont get moody and throw a fit anymore and start labeling his reaction as unloving. I ask him if this is not a good time for him. Maybe Im more understanding because im tired and have a million things to do so I know how he feels now. Usually the only time i talk about my relationship is when I do the boundary book with my H, which is maybe once every couple weeks.
> 
> ...


OMG sounds so like me & him - the needing reassurance (mind you we've had some pretty mega issues for which even he can see my side of wanting that!) the him thinking nothing is ever good enough, the finding talking so draining
I *get* the notion that communication can be 80% non-verbal - in fact because of our love languages I've jokingly tried to get him to see that we could deal with half our problems if I learned to 'show' & he learned to 'tell'! 
Just cos I'm not totally sorted on this, please tell me how you work on resentment without constantly talking to him? I suppose it'd be partly simply accepting that resentment achieves b***** all, but can you ever totally ditch it without some input from him? I'm not sure I will be able to.


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## MarriedWifeInLove (May 28, 2010)

Runs like Dog said:


> There's an element of that, that's true. On the other hand I've heard it all in its glorious illuminated calligraphic beauty about 359,000 times already. Call me old fashioned but if a woman wants to be heard, she has to whisper. Shouting at me won't fix a thing. It won't it really really really really won't.
> 
> Contrary to popular believe "I Love Lucy" was not a documentary.


And she knows that you feel that you've heard it all in its glorious illuminated calligraphic beauty about 359,000 times already.

I'll repeat my original statement:

"She doesn't feel she's being heard."

Think about it...


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## Blanca (Jul 25, 2008)

MarriedWifeInLove said:


> And she knows that you feel that you've heard it all in its glorious illuminated calligraphic beauty about 359,000 times already.
> 
> I'll repeat my original statement:
> 
> ...


She knows she's being heard because the guy isnt deaf- hence the resentment on her part. Nor is he dumb so we can assume he understands her as well. It would be more accurate to say she's not getting what she wants. She knows he hears her. He's not doing what she wants to she's stepping on the gas petal, so-to-speak. The question is not if she's being heard but how to get what she wants assuming he does hear her.


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## Blanca (Jul 25, 2008)

madimoff said:


> please tell me how you work on resentment without constantly talking to him? I suppose it'd be partly simply accepting that resentment achieves b***** all, but can you ever totally ditch it without some input from him? I'm not sure I will be able to.


I work on my resentment by recognizing my motivation that got me to the point Im at. I had to recognize why I ignored signs and kept pursuing something that led to so much pain. Why did i chose to ignore the initial pain? why did i chose to brush aside certain occurrences? What was the motivation behind my actions? Was it really because i just loved him so much? No, it wasnt. That was difficult for me to acknowledge because I had built myself up in my own mind that i was the martyr and that I was the one that supplied all the love in the relationship. But I had alternative motives and when i acknowledged that it was my motives that kept propelling me into pain, and not my H, my H was no longer a hostage of my happiness. I had to acknowledge that no one but me ignored the signs and no one but me chose to stay with him. Why do you chose to stay together? What's in it for you?

You can ditch resentment without any input from him at all. Really. Resentment is you crossing your own boundaries. It has nothing to do with him. But the pain in your heart is an entirely different story. That needs input from him. But you cannot really reach the pain until you've conquered the resentment.


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