# Married but separated, now there's another woman. Feeling broken...



## lanajade33

My husband and I have been together 8 years, married 4. In November he said he loves me so much but wasn't "in love" with me and we should separate for a while, and that he was going to be staying with friends while we figured things out. I found out a few weeks later that he was seeing a coworker of his when I found a series of love letters she wrote to him. They were confessing of love and her believing he is her soul mate and wanting to spend her life with him. It was heart shattering to read these letters because I don't know how a girl could say these things to some one who wasn't reciprocating the same words... So I confronted him and he admitted that he has deep feelings for her and was confused as to what he wants. He still wanted to spend time and talk to her but he was willing to try therapy with me even though he doesn't think it will help because he just isn't in love with me. So, We have a counseling appointment set for next Friday but I'm really not sure if it's going to do any good.

He spends half the week at home, since we have 2 kids and a lot of household responsibilities. The other half he spends out, either at friends or mostly I assume with this other girl. On the nights he's home we are still sleeping in the same bed and cuddling. He said he didn't want to have sex during this time because he doesn't want to add to the confusion, but it has happened twice due to both of us being weak and obviously still attracted to each other. I admit I am extremely weak around him, and cry in his arms and tell him how much I love him. I just can't seem to conceal my pain from him. He says he loves me everyday.

Night before New Year's Eve we went out for casual dinner, and in the car on the way home he asked me what my plans were for new year. All I wanted to do was tell him I wanted to be with him for the new year, but I felt the tears coming and I didn't want to ruin our good night we were having, so I just didn't answer him. He just said its ok you don't have to tell me your plans, and he put a sweet song on and held my hand the rest of the car ride home. The next morning (thurs New Years eve) he left for work and said he wont be home until Sunday. later that day we texted I love you to each other, but I havent heard from him since. He's obviously spending the long weekend with her. We have never gone this long without at least checking in or sending a text. We have also always cherished our New Years kiss at midnight, which he didn't seem to care about at all.

I'm so afraid that he is nurturing this new relationship while pushing ours aside and it will ultimately sway his heart to leave for good. I don't know what to do. We have built such a big life together that no contact seems impossible. I realize I am allowing myself to be a doormat, I'm still in shock, but I just don't know what to do because this situation is so screwed up!


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## TheTruthHurts

I'm so sorry

Do you or he have family close to you? Be open and honest with them. Let them know your H is doing this. They can both provide support and reach out to him in a way you can not. It could help break him out of his fantasy thoughts about this new woman and leaving you as plan B. It may also force him to realize he has responsibilities with the kids that he is not addressing.


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## lanajade33

TheTruthHurts said:


> I'm so sorry
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> Do you or he have family close to you? Be open and honest with them. Let them know your H is doing this. They can both provide support and reach out to him in a way you can not. It could help break him out of his fantasy thoughts about this new woman and leaving you as plan B. It may also force him to realize he has responsibilities with the kids that he is not addressing.


We agreed not to say anything to our families or the kids until we know for sure or at least try counseling, because it will cause such devastation. Well I agreed to that initially but I now realize he only wanted to do that to protect his image to everyone we know. I did confide in my best friend this past week but only because I have been feeling so isolated and desperately needed some one to talk to that wasn't him.


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## jsmart

He is deep in affair fog. A new Vag is intoxicating to men. We have a hard time resisting but few will actually want to leave our families for one. I think a Shock and Awe campaign can snap him out of the fog.
You have to be willing to blow everything up in order to save it.

1. File D (Have him served at work)
2. Go 180 (your muffin shop is closed to him)
3. Work on getting hotter. (go exercise, eat right, ETC)
4. Dress nicer, hair, make up (classy & pretty not cheap wh0rish)
5. Continue to being the best mother possible. (while in the fog, waywards get neglectful to kids)
6. expose to his family, friends. (let him feel the shame)

Unless he was some irresponsible bad boy, when he sees his wife moving on with her life all the while getting hotter, he'll be stopped in his tracks. Right now he to comfortable that you will be there as plan b. Removing that option shakes waywards up.


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## lanajade33

That's what my friends advice was as well. She was shocked that I didn't blow things up right out the gate, because I have always been a strong and independent person. This situation has just completely broken me and I'm struggling not to lose myself. Thankfully my kids are what gives me the only strength I have right now. I guess I have to find a way to channel that into being stronger around him and letting him know the way he's treating our marriage is wrong. I also worry it will backfire, or that he will see through it.


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## giddiot

You need to do these things now. The longer you wait the lesser the chances he will snap out of it. It's like an addiction because its chemical. Blow it up right away. Right now your hiding it for him.


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## always_hopefull

If you really want to save your marriage your going to need to do two things, expose them both for what's going on, they're having an affair. You also need to file for divorce, this doesn't mean you have to follow thru if he pulls his head out of his ass. It just means he is aware he can no longer cake eat. Stop letting him stay at the house all week! Why would he want to leave his affair? His world is perfect. Wife, kids, mistress and you protecting his secret. Also keep those letters safe, take photos, take copies, secure them in various places, you may need them later when he tells eyeryone he met her after your separation..

I'm so sorry your here. How old are your kids? Does he work with this woman? Is he her boss?

Please start the 180, stay away from your H, right now he's using you and if you keep on this path it's only going to get worrse for you, sadly I speak from experience on this. Save your money on marriage counseling, get IC, individual counseling and work on you. There is no MC that will work while he's in another relationship.


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## arbitrator

*"Woman-Up" and get yourself to your lawyer's office like yesterday! He has no respect for what he's doing to either you or your kids. All that he's remotely interested in is getting his appendage steadily worked out by a little convenient and accommodating "strange!" 

He is no husband to you and is certainly no father to your kids!

It's beyond time to "give him the air" and free yourself to find a man who will truly and solely love you for the woman that you are!*
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Adelais

lanajade33,
First I want to tell you how sorry I am for your pain. I went through infidelity as well, know how broken you feel.

There is nothing you can do right now to stop feeling bad. Just make sure you keep taking care of yourself: eat, drink, try to sleep. If you can't sleep, don't hesitate to get some meds from the Dr. to help. If you can't get out of the depression, and antidepressant will also help.

Now regarding the affair, what your husband has achieved at the moment is the perfect "cake eating" situation. He has both you and the OW.

The cake eating must be stopped immediately, for your sanity, and to help him get a grip on reality.

You must stop letting him come home and sleep in your bed. Stop hugging him, crying in his arms, and telling him you love him. Stop letting him tell you he loves you. If he wants to spend time with her, then let him. But with that decision, have him take all his clothes and things he needs and move in with her...ahem...I mean, "his friends."

He is not staying with his friends, he is with her, you can be sure. Set up visitation times, so he can spend time with the children. Do not discuss anything with him, except for your plans to divorce him because you will not share him with anyone.

Someone here has a great list of things to do in your situation, and hopefully they will post them on your thread soon.

In the meantime, you have to find your self respect. You showed self respect when you didn't beg him to spend New Years with you. You don't have to be spiteful or mean, but you must tell him that he can no longer come stay with you after being with her. It is time to play hardball.

You need to tell his parents and family what he is doing. By keeping it a secret he is able to play his game easier, and not face any consequences. The family's knowledge can help blow the top right off of the affair.


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## lanajade33

always_hopefull said:


> I'm so sorry your here. How old are your kids? Does he work with this woman? Is he her boss?


Kids are 10 and 11, we are a blended family. Daughter is mine and son is his from previous relationships. Kids have been together since they were 2 so they don't remember life without each other as a sibling. My daughter also calls my husband daddy since he has been a father to her as well since as far back as she can remember.

The other woman is a coworker. I don't know much about her, other than her name and that I believe she is younger. Not that I am old, I'm only 34, but I think she is mid 20's....


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## lanajade33

Thank you all for this advice and your kind words. In my heart I think I knew I have to do these things, but it's so hard coming to terms. This all happened so out of left field, it was only a week prior that he was telling me that he could not fathom growing old without me beside him. Just so, so shocking.


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## Adelais

lanajade33 said:


> Thank you all for this advice and your kind words. In my heart I think I knew I have to do these things, but it's so hard coming to terms. This all happened so out of left field, it was only a week prior that he was telling me that he could not fathom growing old without me beside him. Just so, so shocking.


I too was completely blindsided. He had always been faithful, and said he loved me and was kind and thoughtful. All of the sudden he said he hadn't loved me in 5 years and wanted a divorce. Within a couple of days he admitted there was another woman. That was 7 years ago and we're still married, working on how to improve ourselves and our marriage. He realizes that the OW was a wh0re and he had serious self esteem and other issues that allowed him to fall for her. He's working on those now.

Lana, if you do the 180, he could realize that what he is doing is insane, and come out of the affair fog. It might take a few days. Keep posting about his and your interactions and people here will help translate is crazy words and behaviors, and give you advice on how to at least keep your own sanity.

Chances are that it will fizzle out with coworker (s!ut.) Affairs usually don't turn in to life-long relationships. If you can expose it, he is likely to dump her and come home. Then the real work begins.


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## imtamnew

Well if the ow is a ****, the wh is no better. In fact he is much worse.

Are you sure you want this man in your life?

Have you gotten tested for STD'


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## JohnA

It almost always is the case the BS (regardless if gender) first instinct is to preserve the marriage. If they reconcile at some point they start to realize their feelings have changed. They want out now. 

Blow this up now. Do you want your daughter calling her mommy? Really ? Why are you NOT BEING FAIR TO YOURSELF ???

Why did and his sons mother split? 

Some links for you: 

Abv (bs ws posm ow etc) and general info http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/32002-welcome-tam-cwi-newbies-please-read.html

This site has mixed reviews. It contains a plan A and B. But I think that is mostly because BS fail to realize that that they need to do both together. He would advise you to sit down today with ypur children abs tell them in non-graphic terms that adultery has occurred. He would also advise to expose to every person known to either of you.

Read some of @Rosealgow or @turnea or @bandit.45 to start with.


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## always_hopefull

lanajade33 said:


> Kids are 10 and 11, we are a blended family. Daughter is mine and son is his from previous relationships. Kids have been together since they were 2 so they don't remember life without each other as a sibling. My daughter also calls my husband daddy since he has been a father to her as well since as far back as she can remember.
> 
> The other woman is a coworker. I don't know much about her, other than her name and that I believe she is younger. Not that I am old, I'm only 34, but I think she is mid 20's....


I can understand why his son stays there during the week, for stability and school etc, but your H needs to take him EVERY WEEKEND, stop being his baby sitter and enabling his affair. Start now, tell your H his son misses him and he needs to take him EVERY weekend from now on, starting today. Also tell him he needs to find a suitable place for them both to live, that your tired of enabling his playboy lifestyles. This isn't on you, sure the kids will be heartbroken, but they'll be heartbroken if your H leaves with his son for the OW.

How old is your H, under what circumstances did his previous marriage end? What custody arrangement does he have with his son's mother?


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## wanttolove

My heart breaks for you. Reading your story is painful. You have some tough decisions to make, but it's obvious you have to get tough.

I pray that you get some face to face guidance and quickly. You are going to hear differing opinions here, many are good, many are not so good. Only someone that you can actually talk to and who knows the details of your relationship, who knows you, is going to be able to truly help you. There are tools here that can help you find that face to face guidance, a counselor, but it might be good to ask someone that you trust for a recommendation -- a friend who has gone through a similar situation, a pastor who can help you find a counselor. A lawyer is also a good place to start, terrible as that may seem.

Best wishes. Please do something.


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## JohnA

Sorry, some of the names I posted (@ followed by name) I misspelled two names

@turnera 

@RoseAglow 

Lana you need to know what you are dealing with. You must study and master the concept of " the fog" and the 180


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## lanajade33

always_hopefull said:


> How old is your H, under what circumstances did his previous marriage end? What custody arrangement does he have with his son's mother?


He's 35. His first marriage ended - his story - she lied to him about continuing birth control so she could try to trap him, since their marriage was rocky from the start. She admitted she stopped taking the BC and he felt betrayed and felt she could never be trusted.They started divorce process before his son was even born, although it seemed very mutual.

She recently moved a good distance, so now he only has his son weekends and she has him during the week because of school.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## NWCooper

lanajade33 said:


> He's 35. His first marriage ended - his story - she lied to him about continuing birth control so she could try to trap him, since their marriage was rocky from the start. She admitted she stopped taking the BC and he felt betrayed and felt she could never be trusted.They started divorce process before his son was even born, although it seemed very mutual.
> 
> She recently moved a good distance, so now he only has his son weekends and she has him during the week because of school.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


He left his first marriage because he felt betrayed and she couldn't be trusted....hmmm, do you see the irony here?

I am sorry you are being treated this way. If he is off spending the weekend with someone else, who has his son? Is it you? He shouldn't be "dating" while he is married and you really need to put your foot down about it. And he really shouldn't be off "dating" and you are babysitting his child. That is messed up.

He seems to have it all worked out to his advantage, you keeping quiet, you are at home pining for him while he is out having fun, you are there and available when he wants to throw you a bone. He won't change any of this behavior unless he is forced to and why would he...it's working out really well for him. You need to make it stop working out so well!


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## EleGirl

Lana,

I'm sorry for what you are going through. I know it's painful and very confusing as I've been through it as well.

The others here are right. You need to take a hard line on this if you want to save your marriage. Even if your marriage does not survive this, you and your children will do much better in the long run if you take a hard line.

So what does it mean to take a hard line.

1) Start treating him according to the 180 for betrayed spouses.. see the link in my signature block below.

2) Ask him to leave and move out. Why? Because that puts all of responsibility of meeting his needs (his emotional needs and his son’s needs) on the OW. This usually breaks up an affair in no time. Right now the OW only has to meet a few of his needs. You are meeting all the others. She did not bargain to be a real partner for him, only a fun affair partner.

You can ask him to move out of your home but you cannot make him because it’s still his legal residence. So if he will not move out, then tell him that he can no longer sleep in the same bed with you. If he will not move out, then he can go sleep on the couch, the floor, in the garage. You don't care. You are not going to share a bed with YOUR HUSBAND who is having sex with another woman.

You do not do anything for you. NO cleaning, no picking up his messes, no cooking for him, no laundry, nothing.

3) Tell him that he has to take his own son every weekend. If he’s spending time with the OW, nothing will put a huge crack in his relationship with her faster than a child who is angry that his father is ruining his family once again. The OW will hate this. But that’s not the only reason.. he main reason is that he has a son that is his respopnslibty.

3) Expose the affair to his parents and siblings. Expose it to your family. Get copies of those letters as proof just in case he denies it. Show them to the families if you need to have proof. When you expose, tell them that you are exposing in the hopes that they will talk to him about giving up the affair and returning to your marriage. Do not come off as vindictive and as if you are trying to get revenge. That would turn people against you. Somehow I don’t think you would do this anyway as you sound like its not in y our character to do this. Expose to a few close friends as well if you think they would help you in getting him to end the affair.

4) Do you know the people he is supposed to be staying with? Expose the affair to them as well. They probably already know about it. If they do, tell them that you are disappointed that they would help a married man cheat but that you hope that they will start to help to get him to end the affair.

5) Some people are suggesting that you file for divorce as a way to shock him. That’s cool if you have a few thousand dollars lying around that you can blow an on attorney for a divorce that might never happen. If you don’t have that kind of money, you can still do the divorce thing by going to your state’s court system’s self-help website, Download the divorce forms and instructions. Start filling them out and leave them where he can see them, say the kitchen table. I mean fill them out for real because you might be filing them. Keep posting here and we can help you decide when the time comes to file them. But this is to let him know that you are dead serious that you are not going to stay married to a man who is cheating on you and who will not fix the marriage.

6) If two do end up going to the marriage counselor, the point that you need to drive home during that counseling meeting is that you will not continue in a marriage while he is cheating. He has to go no contact with the OW (other woman) before you will continue counseling to fix the marriage because right now there is no marriage. I suggest that you write down the speech that you want to give him in counseling. And you read it. You can tell him and the counselor that you wrote it out because you are so devastated that you know you would not be able to say this without some help.

Get the book *“Surviving and Affair” by Dr. Harley*. It will explain to you why you need to stop meeting his needs, stop leaning on him, stop crying in his arms. And why you need to put 100% of the responsibility for meeting his needs onto the affair partner. This ends the affair like 99% of the time pretty quickly. But the book goes into detail.

What is the financial situation? Do you have your own bank account? Do you work or are you a stay at home mom (SAHM)?


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## JohnA

Lana one of the concepts you learn is trickel truth. It occurs when a WS says " yes we are close but I love you and I swear it was only a kiss". Eye roll here, right translated "we went at it like bunnies in the back of the car at work".

I have noticed BS who come here often omit critical facts. For example your original post gave me the ideal that the boys mother was out of the picture. The posters here need a more detail picture if you want great advise. To start:

First: at what point did you and your husband meet during his and the boys mother's reoationship ? For example: he had moved out, filed for divorce sixs months prior to us meeting. I missed this: You stated the boy is 11 and your daughter is 10. At worst his son was 3 months old when you became pregnant. 

Second: what is your relationship with the boys mother? Can you verify his story with her? 

Third: when your husband has custody does he spend all that time with him ?


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## Starstarfish

First, I'd call a lawyer before assets start disappearing when he looks to start a new nest. His desire to separate was so you could continue to cover his obligations towards your stepson while he s!uts around. He's cake eating. Don't be his Plan B, blow this thing up.

- Start documenting when he's not home caring for the son during his time. Pictures, times, etc. Keep it for yourself if you want to press for custody or save it for the mom. 

- Call his parents/siblings. Ask for advice or ask if they'd like to come visit and watch the kids while you do some chores because he's too busy on the weekends with his mistress.

- Call your family. Same thing.

- Anonymous call to his boss. 

- File.

End this limbo. He's keeping you as a backup plan and babysitter. Make this uncomfortable for him.


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## JohnA

Really should have mentioned @EleGirl from the start. When you see the @ symbol with a name that takes you to a page with info about that person, including links to their individual posts on all threads on TAM. Please try it,

Also for your info elegirl is a moderator and is widely respected. Did you notice she has over 25,000 posts?


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## lanajade33

JohnA said:


> First: at what point did you and your husband meet during his and the boys mother's reoationship ? For example: he had moved out, filed for divorce sixs months prior to us meeting. I missed this: You stated the boy is 11 and your daughter is 10. At worst his son was 3 months old when you became pregnant.
> 
> Second: what is your relationship with the boys mother? Can you verify his story with her?
> 
> Third: when your husband has custody does he spend all that time with him ?


We met when his son was about a year old, although we were friends first for about a year, so his son was 2 when our relationship started. His divorce was final at that point and he had already dated a few people. From putting the timeline together in my head based off of what he told me, he started a very serious relationship with some one immediately after his separation. The ex wife had to have still been pregnant with his son at the time.

I have a very cordial relationship with my stepsons mom. I do my best to be there for him without meddling in her parenting choices. We aren't very chatty though.

When he has his son he stays in the house. This weekend was different because the kids were both away at grandparents for the new year.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## staarz21

Lana, 

I'm so sorry you're here. 

Your H is cake-eating...big time and I hope you can soon realize it. He's having sex with both of you. He is "dating" both of you by going out for dinners, etc. He is keeping both of you hooked just enough (cuddling, sleeping in same bed, still telling you he loves you) so that he can go have fun with his co-worker without any of the consequences - i.e. splitting marital assets. He doesn't want to lose that. His reputation is also on the line. 

There is a reason he didn't want you to tell anyone what he was doing. It's because it would ruin the fun he is having right now. 

Unfortunately, that's exactly what you need to do. You need to expose this for what it is...an affair. He can't be halfway. He can either stay with you and work on it, or he can get the hell out. 

I really hope you can find your strength soon. It's so hard to make that first step. You are being taken advantage of, take control and stop it now.


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## Prodigal

lanajade33 said:


> ... So I confronted him and he admitted that he has deep feelings for her and was confused as to what he wants. He still wanted to spend time and talk to her but he was willing to try therapy with me even though he doesn't think it will help because he just isn't in love with me.


Cake eater. And you allow it.



lanajade33 said:


> He said he didn't want to have sex during this time because he doesn't want to add to the confusion, but it has happened twice due to both of us being weak and obviously still attracted to each other. I admit I am extremely weak around him ...


Here is what makes me wonder, to some extent, whether or not this post is authentic. Your husband is f*cking another woman while you sit at home waiting for his return. Lady, why aren't you ENRAGED at what this pr!ck is doing to his marriage and his family? Dang, woman! I'd be on the phone calling his family and mine letting them know what a cake eating piece of sh!t he is.




lanajade33 said:


> I realize I am allowing myself to be a doormat, I'm still in shock, but I just don't know what to do because this situation is so screwed up!


Screwed up? Why? This is posted every single day on TAM. One spouse decides to go outside the marriage and mess around. What is screwed up is your reaction to your husband inserting his penis into another woman's vagina. Now THAT is screwed up! 

Call an attorney.

Out his affair to both families.

Sit back and let it play out. Frankly, your game plan of waiting for him to change isn't in your best interests. What IS in your best interests is kicking him to the curb - for now, at least - and getting him out of your house. Work on what you need to do to protect yourself. Seriously.


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## JohnA

Thank you Lana,

Lana I think you taken a couple of his good qualities and glossed over many bad ones. Lana you have been living a fantasy for 8 years. He was screwing around while his wife was pregnant ? Really ? Do you get how evil that is? I am thankful your hands are clean but his are not. Hindsight is 20/20, so the question is what now ? 

Start by following Elegirl's advise. 

The fact you knew about his past behavior and still feel love for him makes me wonder about co-dependence on your part. I think all great relationships are symbiotic not parasitic. Your marriage has crossed over the line from symbiotic to parasitic. 

I started a thread today on great posts on TAM. I posted one for you http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/32002-welcome-tam-cwi-newbies-please-read.html. Co-Depent is a concept discussed discussed often on Tam. Anyone have a link in a thread on this subject that made you stand up and shout THIS!!


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## lanajade33

I do realize that my reaction is unhealthy. I think it's because we have had such a loving 8 years and this is so sudden. My love for him was always based on how he treated me and not judged by his past. So I'm having a hard time believing this is real. Then part of me is scared of him now, like I don't even know who this person is. Maybe I am co-dependent and that's where my desperation is stemming from. Maybe I have been just glossing over his bad qualities all this time. I've always been such a strong person and right now I feel so weak. I hate it. I have to gather my thoughts and figure out what exactly to say to him tomorrow when he gets home.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## JohnA

Hi, the thing is the past is our future unless we change it. Look his actions are on him and only him. Do you understand? Do not play if only I had games on adultery! Do you understand that ? Do you realize I keep saying "do you realize that" because your life and the kids life will be shyt until you really get it ? Really getting is not knowing it, not owing it, it is being it.

Redemption is not forgetting Forgiving, it is about concert steps we take never to allow it to happen again. The only mistake in you made in not realizing the steps you needed to take to prevent it from happening again. This is hindsight, it's only value at this point is how does it help you avoid the mistakes of the past in your future.

Have you looked at any of the links I have embedded in my posts? Is so which ones, and did any of them ring true to you ?


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## JohnA

About tomorrow read bandits thought on 180 here http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping...-does-not-know-if-she-wants-stay-married.html

The 180 is not about necessary cold and insulting. Remember what the poster Satya said on the subject: "polite and diplomatic".

For example tomorrow if he asks how was your week-end, answer typical and change the subject to joint responsibilities such as the needs of the children. Silence is always golden at this point. The answer "I am not sure, it is a lotnto think about and I am not ready to discuss this with you" is great. Usually the WS will try to get you to talk about it in attempt to manipulate you. Just keep "saying please give me space and time for me to come to an understanding" meanwhile talk with a lawyer. 

Keep him out of your decision making process.


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## MJJEAN

lanajade33 said:


> I do realize that my reaction is unhealthy. I think it's because we have had such a loving 8 years and this is so sudden. My love for him was always based on how he treated me and not judged by his past. So I'm having a hard time believing this is real. Then part of me is scared of him now, like I don't even know who this person is. Maybe I am co-dependent and that's where my desperation is stemming from. Maybe I have been just glossing over his bad qualities all this time. I've always been such a strong person and right now I feel so weak. I hate it. I have to gather my thoughts and figure out what exactly to say to him tomorrow when he gets home.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


You should be scared of him because you know who he is. He's a manipulative liar and a serial cheater. He's shown you that very clearly.

I don't think your reaction to his affair is "unhealthy". I think it borders on insane. Letting him come home to you as if nothing is wrong? Letting him sleep in your bed and touch your body? Talking to him, going out with him, etc? All the while knowing he is having sex, conversation, and sharing an emotional bond with another woman? Risking health and happiness hoping that he didn't get an STD from his cheap side piece?

AWW, HELL, NAW!

It would be snowing in the Sahara before I'd let a philandering husband come within 5 feet of me or my bed while actively having sex with another woman every chance he gets.

If you want the affair over, you're going to have to make his life real uncomfortable. Do the 180. Next time he wants to crawl in your bed to cuddle or screw, tell him to take his sorry azz to his mistress's house. When he wants a meal or his laundry washed tell him to have his wh0re do it. Expose his skeezy betrayal to everyone...friends and family, at least.

Affairs thrive on the fantasy and the fun and the idea of star-crossed love and the delicious taste of forbidden fruit. Once you stop being his doormat and his affair exposed the whole thing will become a lot less fun for him and he'll either wake up from the affair fog or he'll make the decision to leave his 2nd wife for a 2nd OW. Either way, you'll be able to move on.


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## Be smart

This is why I hate this "modern marriages". Once you got problems in your marriage husband or wife file for Separation and all of sudden it is ok to date other people and sleep with them.

If you want to work things out you should stay together and try it,not doing it with other people in the picture.

Sorry you are here @lanajade33. I know it hurts but please dont cry in front of him. Dont let him see you crushed.

You know he was having an Affair before he brings this talk about Separation and Not in Love with you.

Find yourself a lawyer and see you rights,especially with custody. 
Expose his Affair to family and friends. Dont feel ashamed doing it please.
Spend your time with good friend,family or your children.

Stay strong my lady.


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## Hopeful Cynic

lanajade33 said:


> I do realize that my reaction is unhealthy. I think it's because we have had such a loving 8 years and this is so sudden. My love for him was always based on how he treated me and not judged by his past. So I'm having a hard time believing this is real. Then part of me is scared of him now, like I don't even know who this person is. Maybe I am co-dependent and that's where my desperation is stemming from. Maybe I have been just glossing over his bad qualities all this time. I've always been such a strong person and right now I feel so weak. I hate it. I have to gather my thoughts and figure out what exactly to say to him tomorrow when he gets home.


He has everything he could want right now. He has the lovely stable marriage with you part-time, and he has his sex affair the rest of the week. You parent his child for him whenever he wants to be away with his mistress. He's going to say and do (including sexing you up now and then) whatever he has to, to keep the CURRENT situation going as long as he can.

Basically, you need to treat him as the evil twin of your husband, who murdered him and took his place. He is not the man you thought he was, and probably never was. He treated you nicely for the last eight years because he had no alternative, that's all, but now he's found one and you see who he really is.

Tell the stepson's mother what's going on and say that your home is not appropriate for the boy anymore as his father isn't living there. Arrange playdates through the mom with your former stepson and your daughter now and then if you like, to help their transitions, but your home is no longer a residence for the boy. Once you tell someone, the rest will snowball.

You're in shock, that's all. After disbelief fades, anger will come, and that will give you the energy to do what you need to do.

You don't actually need to tell the man anything. Get all his stuff out of the master and put it in the boy's bedroom or a spare room, or the basement. Put a lock on your master and keep all your important stuff in there. Everything he'll try to say is a lie anyways.

ChumpLady.com - Leave a cheater, gain a life is a great resource for finding the strength to leave.


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## JohnA

Remember a manipulator knows they will get you as long as they keep you talking, they will get there way.

Why are some salespeople so pushee? I remember a book on sales saying never accept "no" until the third time a prospect says it. The next rule is "on the third no is when the selling begins."

Do you really want to live this 24/7? You have to 180. Try posting some sample questions he might ask and your answer. Use the @username to let me know @JohnA if you want to get my input or @username to reach out to anyone here. Role playing at times helps.


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## lanajade33

JohnA said:


> Do you really want to live this 24/7? You have to 180. Try posting some sample questions he might ask and your answer. Use the @username to let me know @JohnA if you want to get my input or @username to reach out to anyone here. Role playing at times helps.


 @JohnA
I will 180, but I know it will be hard. I think the first thing wouldn't really be him asking me anything, but more me letting him know when he gets home tomorrow it's not going to be like its been for the last 7 weeks. Starting with us not sleeping in the same bed. I'm pretty sure he will act like he's totally fine with that for the first night or 2, but by mid week he'll be saying something to try to get me to lay down with him. then I will ask him to move out. He will probably say no, but will end up just sleeping out more days. I'm just going to focus mostly on staying strong and not crying in front of him. That's really my biggest weakness right now. He knows how to trigger it too, so I have to get tough fast.

He does occasionally ask me who I'm texting, or what I'm doing on my phone, which I usually just don't respond.

We also have a counseling appointment set for Friday... I liked the one suggestion of writing down everything I want to happen in order to consider reconciliation, and then reading it at the appointment. That way my thoughts are organized and I won't forget anything I really want to say.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Hopeful Cynic

lanajade33 said:


> We also have a counseling appointment set for Friday... I liked the one suggestion of writing down everything I want to happen in order to consider reconciliation, and then reading it at the appointment. That way my thoughts are organized and I won't forget anything I really want to say.


I would not hold out much hope for counselling or reconciliation. You need someone who is genuinely remorseful about what they've done, not just sorry they got caught. You don't have that. You don't even have someone who has ended the affair.

Counselling and reconciliation cannot work as long as the affair continues.

Him ending the affair and going no contact with her, including quitting his job and finding a new one, has to be the very first condition. If he balks, he isn't sorry enough to reconcile with.


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## Adelais

Hopeful Cynic said:


> Tell the stepson's mother what's going on and say that your home is not appropriate for the boy anymore as his father isn't living there. Arrange playdates through the mom with your former stepson and your daughter now and then if you like, to help their transitions, but your home is no longer a residence for the boy.


IDK if this is a good idea right now. It is not the boy's fault, and the boy is not acting out. Why traumatize him immediately? Give it a few days. Don't make the boy feel like you don't want him. Make sure he knows he is loved. If he is going to have to move out, make, it gradual if you can.

Your husband needs to feel all the weight and responsibility for his actions, for sure. But don't take it out on the boy, if he is not causing trouble and if you love him.


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## frusdil

I'm so sorry you're in this position OP. What a skanky rat your husband is.

I echo the other posters, you MUST implement the 180. I'd go so far as saying you need to go "grey rock" as well. I completely understand your reaction, and I'd likely be the same at first, but for anything to change, YOU have to change what you're doing. You need to do the following:

1: Implement 180
2: Move ALL of his things into his sons bedroom. He is not to sleep in YOUR bedroom.
3: No more sex, cuddles, hand holding or emotional support for OR from him. You need to find the support you need elsewhere.
4: No more cooking, cleaning, washing...ANYTHING for him. NONE. He can get his wh0re to do it.
5: Change ALL of your passwords on your FB, email, phone, tablet etc. If you don't have a passcode on your phone, put one on.
6: Copy all the love letters, and store them off site.
7: Get the separation papers, complete them and separate all bank accounts etc.
8: EXPOSE this cheating scumbag to everyone - his family, his employer, your family, your friends. EVERYONE.
9: NO MORE CRYING IN FRONT OF HIM. You go grey rock. You answer questions with as little info as possible. When he asks who you're texting/talking to you say "It doesn't concern you".

Marriage Counselling is useless while he's with his wh0re. The only way you should agree to this is he has to cut ALL contact with the wh0re, including quitting his job. If he won't do that, there's your answer sweetie. I'm sorry.

If you're determined to save this marriage, you need to be prepared to risk losing it, to do so. He needs an urgent wake up call NOW to cut this crap out.


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## AliceA

Do you think it would be okay for you to go out and get yourself a boyfriend, spend evenings with him telling him how much you love him, then coming home to your husband, telling him you love him and sleeping with him too? Oh, and then telling your husband to keep quiet about it while stringing him along, spending entire weekends with your boyfriend?

It's sick. It's so twisted and sick I cannot fathom how the hell you are functioning in that situation. I cannot fathom how you didn't kick him out on his arse the moment you found out.


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## Satya

Jumping up and down, playing the "pick me!" dance won't work. It's just degrading. 

By allowing him into your life and your bed (what I call the "bedroom revolving door"), knowing you are not the sole woman in his life, you are 100% disrespecting your health and your personal integrity. You are worth more than giving your love to a disrespectful, selfish man like that... Or don't you agree? 

Your self esteem is shot, and your man is eating up the ego kibbles given by 2 women. I think you should cut off his unnecessary supply and focus on repairing your self worth. 

Please get an STD test pronto if you haven't already. You need to learn to let him go. Your future happiness depends on it. I think you owe yourself a bit of kindness and care. He won't sheet or get off the pot so YOU need to take your future by the horns.


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## Evinrude58

lanajade33 said:


> I do realize that my reaction is unhealthy. I think it's because we have had such a loving 8 years and this is so sudden. My love for him was always based on how he treated me and not judged by his past. So I'm having a hard time believing this is real. Then part of me is scared of him now, like I don't even know who this person is. Maybe I am co-dependent and that's where my desperation is stemming from. Maybe I have been just glossing over his bad qualities all this time. I've always been such a strong person and right now I feel so weak. I hate it. I have to gather my thoughts and figure out what exactly to say to him tomorrow when he gets home.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I know exactly how you feel. Your only hope of remaining married is to follow the divorce advice, detach so he will see you getting away, and exposing him to his family so he will not have a support group. 
It's weird how this type thing can weaken you and tear you up so that you just feel numb. There is no anger because your emotions are all screwed up. 

This man is not showing you he loves you if he's cheating. 

One more thing. Cheaters always say they aren't in love with their spouse, when a couple of months previous to the affair, they claim to love you, etc. Of course they don't feel the same for you, when their mind is on their affair partner 24/7. Of course they can't see anything but good in the AP--- they don't have to depend on their loyalty and don't have to live with them or do anything but fu** them and read their love letters. 

This guy is playing you hard. Once you turn him loose, he'll be begging you to take him back. When he does, tell him you care about him, but just aren't in love w him anymore. 

I'm so sorry. I know it's hell that you're going through. You must take stows to move forward. See a lawyer, quickly.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## JohnA

Hi Satya I have always admired your words on the 180 "diplomatic and polite"

Hi Lana, so did you order twin beds for your bedroom yet? I would have. It solves the arguement of who sleeps in what bed, eh? Do you think he wants to argue it is ok for him to sleep next to you after spending the night elsewhere? If he does you really need to have a long conversation with the ex about possible abuse in that marriage. Look, I don't go looking just because of a wisp of smoke. But person who can't understand why another would not physically sleep next to them under these circumstances is person who makes me think WTF? Followed by what else don't I know about them. 

Lana, what might he say or do that would cause others to think huh?


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## Lilac23

lanajade33 said:


> My husband and I have been together 8 years, married 4. In November he said he loves me so much but wasn't "in love" with me and we should separate for a while, and that he was going to be staying with friends while we figured things out. I found out a few weeks later that he was seeing a coworker of his when I found a series of love letters she wrote to him. They were confessing of love and her believing he is her soul mate and wanting to spend her life with him. It was heart shattering to read these letters because I don't know how a girl could say these things to some one who wasn't reciprocating the same words... So I confronted him and he admitted that he has deep feelings for her and was confused as to what he wants. He still wanted to spend time and talk to her but he was willing to try therapy with me even though he doesn't think it will help because he just isn't in love with me. So, We have a counseling appointment set for next Friday but I'm really not sure if it's going to do any good.


You cannot be involved with him while he is carrying on with her. It makes you pathetic in his eyes and he will lose all respect for you. He's not 'in love' with you because he now thinks he is in love with her. He might go to therapy out of guilt but as long as he is still seeing her it probably doesn't have much point.



lanajade33 said:


> He said he didn't want to have sex during this time because he doesn't want to add to the confusion, but it has happened twice due to both of us being weak and obviously still attracted to each other.


My guess would be that he's cutting off sex with you because he feels it's cheating on the other woman. But, hey, he might throw might you a bone to be nice every once in a while because he's such a nice guy.



lanajade33 said:


> I admit I am extremely weak around him, and cry in his arms and tell him how much I love him. I just can't seem to conceal my pain from him.


You MUST stop doing this, it's not going to change his mind and will probably drive him away. He knows you love him, what he doesn't know is if he 'love loves' you. Begging and crying wont help him find out. He isn't your safe person anymore that you can run to and expect him to fix your problems. He has morphed into someone else and it's totally understandable and ok to be confused because he had a headstart on you in this new dynamic. You need to catch up! You need to do whatever can help you regain some control in this relationship. Find your pride and you will be able to control your emotions better. I hesitate to call it game playing but it's kind of like that at first, eventually it will become authentic. Fake it til you make it!



lanajade33 said:


> He just said its ok you don't have to tell me your plans, and he put a sweet song on and held my hand the rest of the car ride home.


Bless his heart, what a sweetie! I am continually amazed at the things these d!ckheads will do when they are cheating. He's the one doing this, he's the one playing you both, he's the one breaking your vows and catting around half the week and he makes it seem like he's in inner turmoil over it and he throws you a half @ssed semi sweet gesture while glossing over spending the next few days with the other woman. Honey, you need to find your backbone and get in touch with your righteous anger. If he wants to be with her, let him go and have the single life with all it entails.




lanajade33 said:


> I realize I am allowing myself to be a doormat, I'm still in shock, but I just don't know what to do because this situation is so screwed up!


It's good you realize that it is screwed up because it is! He should not be treating you this way and you should not allow him to. It can be hard to stand up for yourself because you don't want him to completely throw in the towel on the relationship. But as long as you allow this to continue, the less the chances of you getting him back permanently are.


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## JohnA

Oh in the spirit of the 180 now would be a great time to answer my last post that discussed abuse: @JohnA "I guess a lot of time that might be the case and I know sometimes abuse is in the eye of the beholder. Is there something I posted here that might lead to say that. Can you provide links to threads or articles I should be aware of"? 

Part of the 180 and grey rocking is making the other person answer the question without you sharing your plans or thoughts. Do you see how I framed the suggested response forces me to either drop the subject or forces me to start to communicate ? Then it becomes the question if I am being truth. 

Do you remember that classic break up line "it's not you it's me ? Sometimes the "me" person is right. I remember trying to use it and she agreed. Oh for the record, that nasty rumor that she offered to set me up with a friend - it's not true.


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## EleGirl

lanajade33 said:


> He does occasionally ask me who I'm texting, or what I'm doing on my phone, which I usually just don't respond.


Keep in mind that it's none of his business now what you are doing. So don't tell him. Just shrug off his questions but this and anything else. 

If he continues to pester about it, the answer is "It doesn't concern you".



lanajade33 said:


> We also have a counseling appointment set for Friday... I liked the one suggestion of writing down everything I want to happen in order to consider reconciliation, and then reading it at the appointment. That way my thoughts are organized and I won't forget anything I really want to say.


I am really hoping that you will read the book I suggested "Surviving an Affair" by Dr. Harley.

One of the things that he suggests is that in the BS (betrayed spouse) needs to require that the WS write a no contact letter to the AP (affair partner). IT's a requirement for the BS to even start consider recondition.

The letter is all about what a cad the WS has been and how much the WS has hurt their spouse and children. There is nothing in it about lamenting ending the affair, etc. 

The letter is written and signed by the WS and the WS and BS mail it out together. That's to make sure that it is sent. 

Here is on sample letter. I got it from the link at the bottom of this post.

---------------------------- 
Dear Other Person,

The relationship I had with you was thoughtless and selfish. It hurt many people, particularly my spouse, who did not deserve to be treated that way. I am committed to my marriage and determined to rebuild after all the hurt I’ve caused my family. I am going to work hard to be the husband/wife that he/she deserves.

Because of the terrible offense to my spouse and the damage I have done to both our marriage and our family, I am permanently ending all contact with you. Please respect my wish to regain my integrity and to heal my family. Please also respect my wish and do not attempt to contact me in any way at any time.

My spouse has all the details of our relationship and he/she will also be told of any attempts at contact.

Sincerely,

Disloyal Spouse


----------------------------

Sample No Contact Letters | AFFAIRCARE


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## EleGirl

JohnA said:


> Hi Satya I have always admired your words on the 180 "diplomatic and polite"
> 
> Hi Lana, *so did you order twin beds for your bedroom yet*? I would have. It solves the arguement of who sleeps in what bed, eh? Do you think he wants to argue it is ok for him to sleep next to you after spending the night elsewhere? If he does you really need to have a long conversation with the ex about possible abuse in that marriage. Look, I don't go looking just because of a wisp of smoke. But person who can't understand why another would not physically sleep next to them under these circumstances is person who makes me think WTF? Followed by what else don't I know about them.
> 
> Lana, what might he say or do that would cause others to think huh?


No twin beds in the same room. 

He can sleep on the couch or an air mattress on the floor. But he cannot sleep in the same room as lana.. even twin beds in the same room is too intimate for this situation. And why spend the money on twin beds? That's a lot of money.


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## JohnA

Hi @EleGirl you are correct. Sometimes I find myself and others need very small steps. If she is not up to telling him to get out of the bedroom, this at least gets him out of her bed. So perhaps after a week spent in twin beds she will tell him to get out. 

Of course that brings up the topic of enabling, which is what she is doing now.


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## EleGirl

JohnA said:


> Hi @EleGirl you are correct. Sometimes I find myself and others need very small steps. If she is not up to telling him to get out of the bedroom, this at least gets him out of her bed. So perhaps after a week spent in twin beds she will tell him to get out.
> 
> Of course that brings up the topic of enabling, which is what she is doing now.


I agree that letting him sleep in the same room is enabling. 

Lana, if you want to have any chance at all to save your marriage, you need to take a hard stand here. That means you kick him out of your bedroom. 

Taking baby steps of moving him to a twin bed in the same room with you si not going to have the impact that you need to make on him. He has to know that he is going to lose you if he does not stop this affair ASAP.


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## aine

frusdil said:


> I'm so sorry you're in this position OP. What a skanky rat your husband is.
> 
> I echo the other posters, you MUST implement the 180. I'd go so far as saying you need to go "grey rock" as well. I completely understand your reaction, and I'd likely be the same at first, but for anything to change, YOU have to change what you're doing. You need to do the following:
> 
> 1: Implement 180
> 2: Move ALL of his things into his sons bedroom. He is not to sleep in YOUR bedroom.
> 3: No more sex, cuddles, hand holding or emotional support for OR from him. You need to find the support you need elsewhere.
> 4: No more cooking, cleaning, washing...ANYTHING for him. NONE. He can get his wh0re to do it.
> 5: Change ALL of your passwords on your FB, email, phone, tablet etc. If you don't have a passcode on your phone, put one on.
> 6: Copy all the love letters, and store them off site.
> 7: Get the separation papers, complete them and separate all bank accounts etc.
> 8: EXPOSE this cheating scumbag to everyone - his family, his employer, your family, your friends. EVERYONE.
> 9: NO MORE CRYING IN FRONT OF HIM. You go grey rock. You answer questions with as little info as possible. When he asks who you're texting/talking to you say "It doesn't concern you".
> 
> Marriage Counselling is useless while he's with his wh0re. The only way you should agree to this is he has to cut ALL contact with the wh0re, including quitting his job. If he won't do that, there's your answer sweetie. I'm sorry.
> 
> If you're determined to save this marriage, you need to be prepared to risk losing it, to do so. He needs an urgent wake up call NOW to cut this crap out.



:smthumbup:


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## lanajade33

EleGirl said:


> I agree that letting him sleep in the same room is enabling.
> 
> Lana, if you want to have any chance at all to save your marriage, you need to take a hard stand here. That means you kick him out of your bedroom.
> 
> Taking baby steps of moving him to a twin bed in the same room with you si not going to have the impact that you need to make on him. He has to know that he is going to lose you if he does not stop this affair ASAP.


If I had the money to get twin beds I'd rather use it on a lawyer.. which I don't really have that kind of money right now anyway. But luckily we do have a spare bedroom that has a bed, although we've been using that room for storage. It can just be cleared out and he can just stay in there. Or I'll stay in there if he refuses. Which he will probably refuse since he thinks I will just accept it and get in bed and cuddle with him. 

I'm so nervous about seeing him later. I will keep you all updated. I'm really blown away by all the responses I've gotten here. I really thought about everything said here and I'm realizing that I can't continue what I was doing anymore, it's ridiculous and I feel like an idiot
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Adelais

Lana, he is a big boy. Do not give up your bed. You did not do anything to make yourself have to leave the marital bed.

Let him clean the spare bedroom if he wants to sleep on a bed. He can sleep on the floor or on the couch if he refuses to clean off the spare bed himself. Do you think his "friends" cleaned a room and made a nice bed for him? Guys "crash" on other guy's couches or on their floor. You are not his maid...especially given that he has chosen the path he is on and it is his fault he is not allowed into your bed anymore.


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## JohnA

Lana sometimes in life the best course of action is to act now. Apologize later. 
Move his stuff before he gets home.


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## Adelais

Lana, I am thinking that you should just tell him to not think of sleeping under your roof anymore since he is in another relationship.

Since he is already staying with people (OW) for days at a time, tell him to come get the rest of his stuff so he doesn't have to bother coming back, except for visitation of his daughter (and his son as long as he is still with you.)

If you aren't strong enough for that right now, I can promise you that you will get there very quickly as long as he is still with OW.


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## jsmart

lanajade33 said:


> If *I had the money to get twin beds I'd rather use it on a lawyer.. *which I don't really have that kind of money right now anyway. But luckily we do have a spare bedroom that has a bed, although we've been using that room for storage. It can just be cleared out and he can just stay in there. Or I'll stay in there if he refuses. Which he will probably refuse since he thinks I will just accept it and get in bed and cuddle with him.
> 
> *I'm so nervous about seeing him later.* I will keep you all updated. I'm really blown away by all the responses I've gotten here. I really thought about everything said here and I'm realizing that I can't continue what I was doing anymore, it's ridiculous and I feel like an idiot
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


You don't have to buy new furniture. Implementing 180 is free. I agree with others, that you don't leave marital bed. Let him sleep on floor or couch. 

He's the one that should be nervous. Move all his $hit out of master bedroom. No more Mrs Nice Gal. Let your inner b!tch loose. She's in there. Don't fall for any of his words and DEFINITELY DON'T give him any. As a wife and mother your vag is sacred. His POSOW is willing to share a man but a woman of your stature doesn't share a man. You want to send a message of your value.

As a matter of fact, I would try to find something to do when he's do to come home. I'm talking psych ops here. You coming in hours later happy with the kids, gives him a visual of what he's throwing away. Let his imagination take him to thoughts of another man walking in with you and kids.


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## Lilac23

I would be pleasant, but detached. I wouldn't be b!tchy to him because then he would know that he has you upset and still has control. It's like he's a stranger now. Make plans and don't include him but take his kid along, if you want to, don't change how you treat his child. I would also let your families in on his 'confusion', you need support right now and you would get it from your family. You're only protecting and making it easier on him by not telling anyone. If you have your family to talk to, it might help you to be less emotional around him. Right now, he's the only that knows what's going on so that kind of make him the only one you can talk to about, not cool of him to isolate you like this.


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## jsmart

When I said release her inner B!tch, I didn't mean it in a passive aggressive way. I'm talking being cold and calculating. He is now an acquaintance that shares household responsibilities. Basically an icy 180. If she's tries a timid 180, she's likely to cave to his moves and give in to him. As long as he has access to muffin shop, she's giving him most of her power.


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## lanajade33

I just got this text... "Hey baby, I will be home in about 30 min. Can I get you a coffee?"

How do I respond to this? He's already trying to lay it on... But I'm ready let him know he's moving his stuff into the guest room as soon as he gets here.

I'll update you guys as soon as I can. Again, very thankful for this encouragement.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## lanajade33

Lilac23 said:


> Right now, he's the only that knows what's going on so that kind of make him the only one you can talk to about, not cool of him to isolate you like this.


I have said this exact thing to him. I feel so isolated and that he's making it so I only have him to talk to and not our families.. His response was that he will always love me and that he will always be my family and be there for me, no matter what. 

Very manipulative
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## lanajade33

intheory said:


> The victims that we tend to forget about.
> 
> lanajade's daughter is about to lose the only dad she has ever known, by the sounds of it.
> 
> And the WH's son is about to lose his stepmom, his stepsister; while gradually absorbing the knowledge that his dad is a cheat.
> 
> Whatever you do lana, treat this boy well. That's a great focus for your energy right now; loving, supporting and caring for these kids, who did nothing to bring this sh.i.tfest about.


They are everything to me. And I will do everything I can to keep them close and to stay in my stepsons life. My husband did say that even if we divorce that he wants to have visitation with my (our) daughter. I do believe that. He stays very connected to her and loves her as much as his son. I will never deny him that. I know that when we tell them what's going on they will be so devastated and that will definitely kick in my instinct to focus on protecting and being there for them.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Evinrude58

Be as cold as ice. Don't respond to bs texts like that. Calling you baby?
This guy is a cake eater extraordinaire! He's loving having two women that he thinks is willing to go for his crap. 
I would serve him papers at work. In front of his coworkers. You def shouldn't sleep with him. Who knows what this **** he's banging in the side has been doing in her past!
Besides the fact that you're reinforcing his fantasyland of having two women. 
Bring on the frozen tundra and have him served with papers. Once he gets a little dose of a reality check, his sorry arse will be groveling at your feet. He is probably in disbelief that you haven't done this already, but is thinking what a great deal he's getting since you're enabling this affair, and he isn't seeing any consequences. If you do nothing, how could he possibly respect you?

I know firsthand how hard it is, but I'd seriously go cold as ice and serve him with papers. No doubt that is what has to happen. You don't have to follow through with divorce, but that is probably for the best. He's shown you how important you are to him. Once you get over this, you're going to start seeing this in a different light, and every negative thing he does will be amplified by a million.

I'm just sad all this happens with people. Why can't they just do the right thing, on major stuff like cheating, at least?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## lanajade33

Evinrude58 said:


> Be as cold as ice. Don't respond to bs texts like that. Calling you baby?
> This guy is a cake eater extraordinaire! He's loving having two women that he thinks is willing to go for his crap.
> 
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I know it now. I didn't respond. Then he called the house twice. I answered on the second call, he says hey babe did you get my text? Do you want a coffee?
I was like "I'm good. See you when you get here."

I am worried about him having unprotected sex because he had a vasectomy years ago so he wouldn't worry about making a kid. Thank god for that. But he probably thinks she's so innocent he wouldn't think about diseases. I'm not touching that anymore.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Lilac23

lanajade33 said:


> I have said this exact thing to him. I feel so isolated and that he's making it so I only have him to talk to and not our families.. His response was that he will always love me and that he will always be my family and be there for me, no matter what.
> 
> Very manipulative
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


You need your family right now :frown2:. Sisters are great at a time like this!


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## Lilac23

lanajade33 said:


> I just got this text... "Hey baby, I will be home in about 30 min. Can I get you a coffee?"
> 
> How do I respond to this? He's already trying to lay it on... But I'm ready let him know he's moving his stuff into the guest room as soon as he gets here.
> 
> I'll update you guys as soon as I can. Again, very thankful for this encouragement.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Don't respond, take the kids and leave so he can come home to an empty house.


----------



## EleGirl

Evinrude58 said:


> This guy is a cake eater extraordinaire! He's loving having two women that he thinks is willing to go for his crap.


Yep, her husband is the most cake eating WH I have ever head of. And I've been on marriage forums like this since 2002, so I've read thousands upon thousands of stories. 

Keep that in mind Lana. Your husband is a real piece of work. How dare he treat you like there is nothing wrong. Most men who cheat, cheat for the fun of getting some extra sex. They still want their wife. Well it does not work that way in today's world.




Evinrude58 said:


> I would serve him papers at work. In front of his coworkers. You def shouldn't sleep with him. Who knows what this **** he's banging in the side has been doing in her past!


Lana, do you know if your state allows for alienation of affection law suits? Serving your husband at work and the OW with an alienation of affection suit at work at the same time would have a HUGE impact.


.


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## Adelais

Hoping you are strong right now Lana. ((((Lana))))


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## EleGirl

Some questions Lana:

Do you have a job, or are you a SAHM (stay at home mom).

Do you and your husband have a joint checking/savings? Or is the money kept in his name? What access do you have to money?

You say that you do not have the money for a lawyer. Does your husband have any money?

Also, if you don't mind sharing, what state do you live in? If you don't want to put it out there, please PM me. My thought is to help you in getting something filed so that he has to pay you child support and spousal support. 


.


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## lanajade33

EleGirl said:


> Some questions Lana:
> 
> Do you have a job, or are you a SAHM (stay at home mom).
> 
> Do you and your husband have a joint checking/savings? Or is the money kept in his name? What access do you have to money?
> 
> You say that you do not have the money for a lawyer. Does your husband have any money?
> 
> Also, if you don't mind sharing, what state do you live in? If you don't want to put it out there, please PM me. My thought is to help you in getting something filed so that he has to pay you child support and spousal support.
> 
> 
> .


We both work, although he makes more money than me and also carries our benefits. 

We have a joint checking, as well as each of us kept a personal checking account.

I am not sure if he has money for a lawyer or if he's been putting money aside, I suspect he has. 

We live in PA. The OW lives in NJ. (H works in NJ)
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## MJJEAN

lanajade33 said:


> I have said this exact thing to him. I feel so isolated and that he's making it so I only have him to talk to and not our families.. His response was that he will always love me and that he will always be my family and be there for me, no matter what.
> 
> Very manipulative
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Why does he get to cheat on you openly AND decide who you can and cannot talk to about the anguish he's putting you through? Not exposing his actions to friends and family is nothing short of protecting him and his mistress. Talk to whoever you want and say whatever you want!

The proper response to him always being your family blah blah blah is "Thank you, but that's not a healthy way for me to handle this situation." 



lanajade33 said:


> I know it now. I didn't respond. Then he called the house twice. I answered on the second call, he says hey babe did you get my text? Do you want a coffee?
> I was like "I'm good. See you when you get here."
> 
> I am worried about him having unprotected sex because he had a vasectomy years ago so he wouldn't worry about making a kid. Thank god for that. But he probably thinks she's so innocent he wouldn't think about diseases. I'm not touching that anymore.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Again, don't talk to him like he's your buddy. He's not. A good response here would have been "Thank you for asking, no." and then silence.



IMFarAboveRubies said:


> Hoping you are strong right now Lana. ((((Lana))))


Me, too.


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## VeryHurt

I am sorry you are not being respected.

My advice is simple: 

Read all the previous posts and follow the advice that has been given to you by others who have been in your shoes.

End of Story !!

Good Luck !


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## EleGirl

Lana, so what happened when he came home today?


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## EleGirl

If you file for divorce, you will get child support and spousal support (alimony) until the divorce is final.

Basically, if you file for divorce you will get interim (Pendente Lite) spousal support. And you will get child support.

You will also get child support after divorce and probably spousal support for at least half the length of your marriage.

Plus, if you can prove your husband's infidelity, you will most likely get a larger share of your joint assets.

Pennsylvania is one of the few states that still takes adultery serious in a divorce.

*Child Support and Spousal Support*

Here are two articles for you.. one on spousal support and one on child support. There are two kinds of spousal support. One is the support you would get during the divorce process, 

How to Calculate Alimony Payments in Pennsylvania

How to Calculate Child Support in Pennsylvania

Alimony in Pennsylvania: Understanding and Calculating Spousal Support | DivorceNet.com

*Divorce an adultery*

"Unlike many states that only have “no-fault” divorces, Pennsylvania allows spouses to seek "fault" divorces. In a fault divorce, courts will consider either spouse’s misconduct as it relates to the divorce. Marital misconduct includes adultery, abuse and drug addiction."

"Pennsylvania, courts will consider adultery when dividing a divorcing couple’s property. The spouse who cheated may receive a smaller portion of the parties’ assets as a result of his or her infidelity."

Adultery in Pennsylvania: Does Cheating Affect Alimony? | DivorceNet.com

If you read more on the above website... a person who cheats usually is not eligible for spousal support in your state. So, even though your husband is cheating, do not even think of seening any other guy until your divorce is final. Dating during a divorce is considered adultery. But in today's world, people are often even courage to date during a divorce. So knowing this is important.


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## lanajade33

EleGirl said:


> Lana, so what happened when he came home today?


When he came home he had a coffee for me even though I said I didn't want one. Then he came up to me and went to give me a hug, I just put my hand up to stop him and he was like "what's wrong?" 
I said "really? You don't know what's wrong?" And he said he wasn't in the mood to talk about anything. So I said that's fine but we won't be sharing a bed or a room anymore. He said he wasn't leaving his bedroom and that I could take the spare room if I really wanted to sleep alone. I told him he needed to stay in the spare since he isn't even home 50% of the week anymore. He was just so adamant about not talking about anything tonight and that our daughter was going to hear us. Neither of us was yelling, I was very polite actually. He just completely shut off and then left to pick up dinner for himself.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## EleGirl

He's a piece of work.

First he is openly having an affair.

And now he says that he will not move out of the bedroom, you can?

My suggestion is that you take his stuff out of YOUR bedroom and dump it in the spare room. He can figure out how he is going to live in that room.

You also need to put a lock that uses a key or an combination so that he no longer has access to YOUR room.


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## EleGirl

Do you know how to change a lock?


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## lanajade33

EleGirl said:


> Do you know how to change a lock?


Yes I know how. Would I be allowed to do that? I mean if we are headed to D would it come up with the lawyers that I locked him out of the room?

I am just going to sleep in the spare tonight. He completely shut off. I knew he was going to act that way.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## EleGirl

I think that you need to get a VAR (voice activated recorder) and keep it on you at all times when you are round him. Do not let him see it or know you have if.

There is something really wrong with a man who is openly cheating and then will not move out of the marital bedroom. He displaying some very strong marcasite traits.

You can change the lock on your bedroom door. There is no court in the land that would hold I against you under these circumstances. You cannot lock him out of the house, but there is another bedroom for him. 

Next time he is gone, throw his stuff in the spare room. Leave a note on top of his stuff that says something like..

"You have been cheating for some weeks now. And you have the audacity to try to throw me out of the MY bedroom because I don't want to sleep in the same room with a cheater? Really? Get real.

I put all you stuff in here. You need to pack and leave this house permanently."

With the lock on the door, he might be very belligerent. you will need the VAR at that point. if he does, just call 911. With a recording of his being belligerent he will be removed from the home and you can get a restraining order most likely.


.


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## EleGirl

Have you told your family yet that he is cheating?

Have you told his family?


----------



## MJJEAN

lanajade33 said:


> Yes I know how. Would I be allowed to do that? I mean if we are headed to D would it come up with the lawyers that I locked him out of the room?
> 
> I am just going to sleep in the spare tonight. He completely shut off. I knew he was going to act that way.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


You can't lock him out of the house without a court order, but you sure can change the lock on your room to keep him out.

Of course he shut down. He's probably in shock. Here he was thinking he was going to have a few days of New Years debauchery with his mistress and then come home to his poor, broken, helpless wife's loving arms only to be told she is quite reasonably asking him to sleep elsewhere. He spent the whole weekend in fantasy land and the last weeks consequence free and now he's seeing for the first time that he might have to face consequences for his actions and that maybe one of those consequences could be losing you.

Change the lock and move his crap to the spare room or pretty it up and move your own things in there. Put a lock on that door if there isn't one. Whatever you do, don't give in. Stand your ground. It will be hard, it will be lonely, it will hurt, but soldier on. Either he'll snap out of it and end the affair to reconcile with you or you'll get divorced, but by following the 180 no matter what happens, you'll be in shape emotionally to handle it.


----------



## Annie123

lanajade33 said:


> Yes I know how. Would I be allowed to do that? I mean if we are headed to D would it come up with the lawyers that I locked him out of the room?
> 
> I am just going to sleep in the spare tonight. He completely shut off. I knew he was going to act that way.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I'm really sorry that all this is happening to you, you seem like a really nice person and don't deserve any of this.

Your husband seems to be a narcissistic, selfish and controlling manipulator who doesn't give a darn about your feelings. 

Be strong. You know what you need to do. Also, talk to your family and friends. It will help a lot.


----------



## lanajade33

EleGirl said:


> Have you told your family yet that he is cheating?
> 
> Have you told his family?


I just told my mom today. No one in his family or friends knows.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## EleGirl

lanajade33 said:


> I just told my mom today. No one in his family or friends knows.


What did your mom say?

When you going to tell his family? The sooner you do it, the better chance it has to blow up the affair.

And be sure that you tell them where he spent the holiday. Also that you asked him to move into the spare bedroom and he told you to move out of the bedroom. If his family has one ounce of decency they will call him and rip him a new one.


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## lanajade33

EleGirl said:


> What did your mom say?
> 
> When you going to tell his family? The sooner you do it, the better chance it has to blow up the affair.
> 
> And be sure that you tell them where he spent the holiday. Also that you asked him to move into the spare bedroom and he told you to move out of the bedroom. If his family has one ounce of decency they will call him and rip him a new one.


My mom was shocked. She cried. She was sad that I've been going through this alone for 7 weeks and also sad for my daughter, and mostly that he wasn't who she thought he was.

I will tell his parents, but it makes me sick even thinking about it. They are much older than my parents and not in good health. They are such kind and gentle people. I hate thinking of upsetting them. I know his mother will be shattered.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## MattMatt

lanajade33 said:


> My mom was shocked. She cried. She was sad that I've been going through this alone for 7 weeks and also sad for my daughter, and mostly that he wasn't who she thought he was.
> 
> I will tell his parents, but it makes me sick even thinking about it. They are much older than my parents and not in good health. They are such kind and gentle people. I hate thinking of upsetting them. I know his mother will be shattered.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


And if she is shattered? It is ALL on him for hurting his own mother.

He is what every mother wants in a son. A cheating POS who hurts his wife and daughter.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## JohnA

Stay strong lana. 

The first epithany I had after D-Day was how I reacted to this situation is what would define me. In each decision I made my first thought was is this who I want to be woud act and then acted.

You have a choice of actions about who sleeps where tonight. What does each choice says about you.

The second epiphany I had was to get up in the morning, think of the actions I took the previous day and judge myself harshly by those standards I set for myself. Every moment of the day I pushed myself and cruse myself for my mistakes and weakness as I failed to live up to stadards. But right before dinner I just let it all go for the rest of the day. I would encourage myself saying that something's just take time to achieve. When God created time, he plenty of it was my motto for the evening. When I went to bed I think tomorrow is a new day to grow and I would sleep soundly.


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## EleGirl

Lana,

There are stages that a betrayed spouse goes through, just as there are stages of grief.

The most productive stage is anger. I'm not talking about throwing things around the room kind of anger. Instead I'm talking about the kind of anger that gives us the energy and stamina to do what needs to be done. If you can find that anger, use it to give you the strength you need right now for yourself and your children.


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## Evinrude58

I think I would hire someone to get physical evidence of his adultery if the law in your state actually cares.

My state doesn't give a rip what my cheating ex was doing.

As far as him "not feeling like talking"...... I'll bet he REALLY wants to talk A LOT after he figures out how badly he's going to get the bad end of this divorce. And he might not look so great to his OW when he can't afford a tank of gas to come see her.

Your husband is really messed up to be spending nights with his mistress and asking for a hug and giving you coffee upon his return. He must think he is quite a movie star to think you'd let this go on indefinitely.
I'd be very careful around this guy.
You need to be safe.

He sounds like a person with no conscience to me. I'd be afraid of him if I were a woman.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## EleGirl

Evinrude58 said:


> I think I would hire someone to get physical evidence of his adultery if the law in your state actually cares.
> 
> My state doesn't give a rip what my cheating ex was doing.
> 
> As far as him "not feeling like talking"...... I'll bet he REALLY wants to talk A LOT after he figures out how badly he's going to get the bad end of this divorce. And he might not look so great to his OW when he can't afford a tank of gas to come see her.
> 
> Your husband is really messed up to be spending nights with his mistress and asking for a hug and giving you coffee upon his return. He must think he is quite a movie star to think you'd let this go on indefinitely.
> I'd be very careful around this guy.
> You need to be safe.
> 
> *He sounds like a person with no conscience to me. I'd be afraid of him if I were a woman.*


That's my take too. His actions are just way over the top.


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## JohnA

Her husband has one of the worst cases of fog ever posted about here on TAM.


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## Satya

Lana, you moved his stuff out of your bedroom and put a lock on your door, right? 

My recommendation is to not engage (talk) with him, unless it's about kid matters. Just take actions to SHOW him you're finished. 

It's very important that you DO NOT CAVE in front of him. If you get emotional, go for a walk, come here and vent, etc. Do not talk to him. Your emotions will be the very thing he will use to worm his way back in. You need him gone, yesterday. 

Start to LIVE like he's already out of your life. That means removing his stuff from your space, not cooking his meals or doing his laundry, telling his family you are not going to play pick me with his new lover, not giving a sheet what he does or where he goes, because he's already gone. Get it?


----------



## tripad

lanajade33 said:


> EleGirl said:
> 
> 
> 
> What did your mom say?
> 
> When you going to tell his family? The sooner you do it, the better chance it has to blow up the affair.
> 
> And be sure that you tell them where he spent the holiday. Also that you asked him to move into the spare bedroom and he told you to move out of the bedroom. If his family has one ounce of decency they will call him and rip him a new one.
> 
> 
> 
> My mom was shocked. She cried. She was sad that I've been going through this alone for 7 weeks and also sad for my daughter, and mostly that he wasn't who she thought he was.
> 
> I will tell his parents, but it makes me sick even thinking about it. They are much older than my parents and not in good health. They are such kind and gentle people. I hate thinking of upsetting them. I know his mother will be shattered.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_
Click to expand...


Be prepared that his parents turn on you n become hostile .

My ex 's parents seemed that nice too till they turn on me n hissed like poison cobra .


----------



## lanajade33

EleGirl said:


> That's my take too. His actions are just way over the top.





Evinrude58 said:


> He sounds like a person with no conscience to me. I'd be afraid of him if I were a woman.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I am starting to worry. I'm constantly playing his behavior in my mind, trying to figure out his intentions. It can't be good, he's just been too dishonest. Or he's really just trying to carry on this double life for as long as possible.

It makes me so sad to hear that this is one of the worst you all heard. Yesterday I woke up still kind of hopeful we could reconcile, but I'm not seeing it happening anymore.

My mom wants me and my daughter to visit her for a couple of days, so I can sit and talk about all of this and just to get out of the house for a bit. I'm thinking about taking a couple days off and going today.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## jsmart

lanajade33 said:


> My mom was shocked. She cried. She was sad that I've been going through this alone for 7 weeks and also sad for my daughter, and mostly that he wasn't who she thought he was.
> 
> *I will tell his parents, but it makes me sick even thinking about it. They are much older than my parents and not in good health. They are such kind and gentle people. I hate thinking of upsetting them. I know his mother will be shattered.*
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Telling his parents isn't to destroy them. When you tell them, you're doing it in a help me fight for the marriage. They will want the marriage to survive out of self interest. Being older, they've lived life and know that their grand-children's well being is best served in an intact family.

It was good that you told your mom. You need that moral support. We're here for you but it's not the same as family.

I agree with @EleGirl , that he sounds way over the top. Most WH coming home after cheating for the weekend would be meek and caving to your demands. For him to come out of his face and say for you to sleep elsewhere is fvcked up. 

I'm praying that God gives you strength to stand up to his bullying.


----------



## tripad

Yup he's fuzk up to ask you to sleep elsewhere after his rendezvous affair . wtf .

He's going to leave you with no ground of survival after cheating . he's sick in the mind . 

Tell his parents but be prepared they are not on your side . They may not think about the grandchildren . I am speaking from experience .


----------



## farsidejunky

tripad said:


> Yup he's fuzk up to ask you to sleep elsewhere after his rendezvous affair . wtf .
> 
> He's going to leave you with no ground of survival after cheating . he's sick in the mind .
> 
> Tell his parents but be prepared they are not on your side . They may not think about the grandchildren . I am speaking from experience .


It is not out of the realm of possibility that they helped to form the person he has become.

Expect nothing positive from them.

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk


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## tripad

Yup 

I saw the truth after everything comes to the surface 

Saw the similarity of them all .

While going through the lies n deceit , they may play the Mr nice guy , Mrs nice mil . once exposed , there's no need to pretend . you see true ugliness n similarity between them .


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## JohnA

Lana,

What were the terms of his last divorce? Who was his ex's lawyer ?


----------



## lanajade33

JohnA said:


> Lana,
> 
> What were the terms of his last divorce? Who was his ex's lawyer ?


The terms on the papers cited irreconcilable differences and that he volunteered to take on most of their joint debt and also paid her rent for some time after, as well as provided benefits. Because she was pregnant with their son. I can't remember if there was spousal support on top of it.

I know who his lawyer was, not sure if hers still practices in the area.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## EleGirl

Lana, 

Where did each of you sleep last night?


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## lanajade33

EleGirl said:


> Lana,
> 
> Where did each of you sleep last night?


I stayed in the spare room. I actually slept better in there, maybe getting out of the room and bed we shared made it less depressing. So I think I'm just going to move my stuff in there and put a lock on it. I don't have that much stuff to move anyway.

Although this morning when he was leaving for work he came in and so I woke up to him trying to hug me goodbye. 

My mom said I should play nice for another week because she wants to help me get an appraiser in to find out the worth of some of his valuables before he starts removing them from the house. He has a collection that is worth a lot, which was mostly purchased during our marriage. 

I don't think I mentioned that he is bipolar and has serious manic spending habits, especially when it comes to his collection.

Edited to add: he is on meds, but still goes through manic episodes.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## farsidejunky

lanajade33 said:


> I stayed in the spare room. I actually slept better in there, maybe getting out of the room and bed we shared made it less depressing. So I think I'm just going to move my stuff in there and put a lock on it. I don't have that much stuff to move anyway.
> 
> Although this morning when he was leaving for work he came in and so I woke up to him trying to hug me goodbye.
> 
> My mom said I should play nice for another week because she wants to help me get an appraiser in to find out the worth of some of his valuables before he starts removing them from the house. He has a collection that is worth a lot, which was mostly purchased during our marriage.
> 
> I don't think I mentioned that he is bipolar and has serious manic spending habits, especially when it comes to his collection.
> 
> Edited to add: he is on meds, but still goes through manic episodes.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Your mom is smart. Document all of it with pictures.

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk


----------



## EleGirl

lanajade33 said:


> I stayed in the spare room. I actually slept better in there, maybe getting out of the room and bed we shared made it less depressing. So I think I'm just going to move my stuff in there and put a lock on it. I don't have that much stuff to move anyway.
> 
> Although this morning when he was leaving for work he came in and so I woke up to him trying to hug me goodbye.
> 
> My mom said I should play nice for another week because she wants to help me get an appraiser in to find out the worth of some of his valuables before he starts removing them from the house. He has a collection that is worth a lot, which was mostly purchased during our marriage.


Your mom is right about getting his stuff appraised. Before stuff starts to disappear, get photos of everything you can in the house. With things that are valuable, make sure you get pictures of the markings on them.

If you have anything valuable of your own, like jewelry, pack it up and store them in a safe place like your mother's.

Another way to go, if you are up to standing up to him on this, is to rent a storage unit and move all valuables there, to include his collections. Just tell him that you are getting them appraised for the divorce and so you are keeping them safe.

Also do you know where he keeps his financial and legal papers? You need to get copies of everything thing you can. You need to find out what investments (if any) and bank accounts he has and how much he has in them.

One thing you can do about seeing a lawyer is that if there is enough in his accounts and in home equity, you can ask a lawyer to petition the court to pay for you legal fees out of marital assets. Since your husband is involved in adultery, the court is likely to find that he has to pay for your legal fees out of his portion of marital assets.



lanajade33 said:


> I don't think I mentioned that he is bipolar and has serious manic spending habits, especially when it comes to his collection.
> 
> Edited to add: he is on meds, but still goes through manic episodes.


This makes sense and goes a long way to explain why he's acting the way he his. He's probably in a manic state right now. 

This will probably be followed my him going into a massive depressive state. (not your problem right now)


----------



## lanajade33

EleGirl said:


> If you have anything valuable of your own, like jewelry, pack it up and store them in a safe place like your mother's.
> 
> Another way to go, if you are up to standing up to him on this, is to rent a storage unit and move all valuables there, to include his collections. Just tell him that you are getting them appraised for the divorce and so you are keeping them safe.


The only thing of value that I own is my engagement ring and wedding band. And a camera. I really don't have much stuff. 

Unfortunately I wouldn't be able to move his valuables to a storage, because of the nature of what it consists of. Also he keeps it locked in a room in the basement and I don't have a key so I have to figure out how to get in first. Then I can and definitely will take pics of everything and get it appraised without him knowing, because I feel like if I told him I was going to have it valued he would start moving some of it to his friends or something. And he knows that I do not know know by memory what everything is. I think that's why my mom suggested I play nice a little bit longer.

So as I'm writing this he just text me this:

Hey being that I have a psych appt tomorrow eve, and thus will be staying home tomorrow night, I was going to hang out and stay at (friend name)'s today after work ok? 
I'm really going to try to keep the overnights during the week to just one night at a time, on the weekends that we have (son name), obviously I will be home with you and the kids, so on those weeks there may be a time where I sleep out 2 nights in a row since I will obviously be home on those Friday's. I want you to know that I love you very much, and it means so much to me how supportive you have been through all of this. I know it's not easy. But always remember that I do love you so very much!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## EleGirl

lanajade33 said:


> The only thing of value that I own is my engagement ring and wedding band. And a camera. I really don't have much stuff.
> 
> Unfortunately I wouldn't be able to move his valuables to a storage, because of the nature of what it consists of. Also he keeps it locked in a room in the basement and I don't have a key so I have to figure out how to get in first. Then I can and definitely will take pics of everything and get it appraised without him knowing, because I feel like if I told him I was going to have it valued he would start moving some of it to his friends or something. And he knows that I do not know know by memory what everything is. I think that's why my mom suggested I play nice a little bit longer.


The way you get into the room is that you hire a locksmith. Just tell the lock smith that you lost your key and you want him/her to make you a new key. Then do not tell your husband that you now have a key.

When thinks were going downhill with my son’s father, he was cheating, I took his keys when I could and got copies made of all of them. Then when he was in the shower, I went through is car several times. I found all kinds of things that he was hiding the nooks and crannies of his car.



lanajade33 said:


> So as I'm writing this he just text me this:
> 
> Hey being that I have a psych appt tomorrow eve, and thus will be staying home tomorrow night, I was going to hang out and stay at (friend name)'s today after work ok?
> I'm really going to try to keep the overnights during the week to just one night at a time, on the weekends that we have (son name), obviously I will be home with you and the kids, so on those weeks there may be a time where I sleep out 2 nights in a row since I will obviously be home on those Friday's. I want you to know that I love you very much, and it means so much to me how supportive you have been through all of this. I know it's not easy. But always remember that I do love you so very much.


I agree with your mom to an extent. You playing nice for a while might work out for you in the long run. You can still sleep in another room and not do things like dates with him. But you can be civil. Use the time to prepare for a divorce. As long as he is in the affair, you may as well start to protect yourself legally. If he ever does end the affair, at that point you can decide if you want to stay or not. You can decide if you have just lost your love and trust of him to the point of no return.

Does his cell phone have location tracking?

You need to keep every one of his texts. They show a few things. 1) You two are not separated so he cannot claim that you were separated and thus the adultery does not count. 2) That he’s wacked in the head. 3) That he is off having an affair. 4) That you do not forgive him and accept his affair. (this is important in a divorce).

Also, see if you can, get him to talk about the affair in texts. You could text him and say, that he needs to realize how much his affair with {her name} hurts you. Get him talking about it. That’s proof that you can use in court if you need it.

Do you have access to a copy machine? If you do, open up his texts and use the copy machine to get a copy of the texts on your phone. Also you can down load them. But getting a copy, on your phone shows the number they are from and that they are not forged. Then store those copies at your mom’s.


----------



## staarz21

lanajade33 said:


> So as I'm writing this he just text me this:
> 
> Hey being that I have a psych appt tomorrow eve, and thus will be staying home tomorrow night, I was going to hang out and stay at (friend name)'s today after work ok?
> I'm really going to try to keep the overnights during the week to just one night at a time, on the weekends that we have (son name), obviously I will be home with you and the kids, so on those weeks there may be a time where I sleep out 2 nights in a row since I will obviously be home on those Friday*'s. I want you to know that I love you very much, and it means so much to me how supportive you have been through all of this. I know it's not easy. But always remember that I do love you so very much!*
> _Posted via Mobile Device_




WTF???

Omg. I would be kicking his @ss right now. There is no way in hell I would EVER put up with that. He's staying at his girlfriend's house while telling you that he loves you?

Forward that text message to his girlfriend and see if she knows that he's still telling you he loves you. 

This is beyond disgusting and you need to get past the depressed/hopeful "we're still going to work it out" stage and get straight on to the p*ssed off /exposing to everyone stage. 

This is horrible, disgusting behavior.


----------



## BetrayedDad

lanajade33 said:


> I realize I am allowing myself to be a doormat, I'm still in shock, but I just don't know what to do because this situation is so screwed up!


You know what to do.... You've said as much. STOP being a doormat! Here is how:

1) FILE for D immediately (process can be stopped at any time though I hope you follow through, he's an a$$hole)

2) Treat him like the plague. Don't talk to him or touch him. He sleeps on the couch like the dog he is.

3) Start untangling your lives and finances AS EXPIDITIOUSLY as possible. Assume that it is over, frankly I hope it is.

4) Hit the gym, diet, get in shape, doll yourself up. Start preparing to hit the open market. 34 is plenty young to find a stud.

If he wants this trashy girl, let him have her. 4 years of marriage is better than 24. You have your whole life to start over. You have no kids together so BAIL. 

Many would ENVY your situation. It's the kids that end up hurt the most but that guilt is on him. You've done NOTHING wrong so dump this LOSER.

He keeps you around as a babysitter for his son while he fvcks his gf on the side. He "loves" you about as much as a tuna fish sandwich.

You DESERVE better than this piece of sh!t you married. Good Luck and don't be afraid. It's HIS loss not yours. Believe that!


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## lanajade33

EleGirl said:


> The way you get into the room is that you hire a locksmith. Just tell the lock smith that you lost your key and you want him/her to make you a new key. Then do not tell your husband that you now have a key.
> 
> When thinks were going downhill with my son’s father, he was cheating, I took his keys when I could and got copies made of all of them. Then when he was in the shower, I went through is car several times. I found all kinds of things that he was hiding the nooks and crannies of his car.
> 
> 
> 
> I agree with your mom to an extent. You playing nice for a while might work out for you in the long run. You can still sleep in another room and not do things like dates with him. But you can be civil. Use the time to prepare for a divorce. As long as he is in the affair, you may as well start to protect yourself legally. If he ever does end the affair, at that point you can decide if you want to stay or not. You can decide if you have just lost your love and trust of him to the point of no return.
> 
> Does his cell phone have location tracking?
> 
> You need to keep every one of his texts. They show a few things. 1) You two are not separated so he cannot claim that you were separated and thus the adultery does not count. 2) That he’s wacked in the head. 3) That he is off having an affair. 4) That you do not forgive him and accept his affair. (this is important in a divorce).
> 
> Also, see if you can, get him to talk about the affair in texts. You could text him and say, that he needs to realize how much his affair with {her name} hurts you. Get him talking about it. That’s proof that you can use in court if you need it.
> 
> Do you have access to a copy machine? If you do, open up his texts and use the copy machine to get a copy of the texts on your phone. Also you can down load them. But getting a copy, on your phone shows the number they are from and that they are not forged. Then store those copies at your mom’s.


His cell doesn't have location tracking. But I did take pics of all and even kept one of the letters from her. The one I kept is dated late November and describes them being intimate so I have that as proof as well. 

I also have a copy of his car key. I'm sure I can find a minute to get in there and look around either when he's in the shower or out walking the dogs. I would not be surprised if he was storing a bunch of things in there. 

I hate being sneaky but I guess this is the only possible way to protect myself and my daughter.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## JohnA

Lana.

I think some of the steps you have described and @EleGirl suggestions are great and you need to act on them. 

The reality is you are in an open marriage that is only half open. Is he such a great and wonderful guy that he makes two women happy and content? That and "it takes more then one woman to satisfy an amazing man like him" are his take aways.

His last text sounds like a bad line by a pimp in a hollywood movie.


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## EleGirl

lanajade33 said:


> His cell doesn't have location tracking. But I did take pics of all and even kept one of the letters from her. The one I kept is dated late November and describes them being intimate so I have that as proof as well.
> 
> I also have a copy of his car key. I'm sure I can find a minute to get in there and look around either when he's in the shower or out walking the dogs. I would not be surprised if he was storing a bunch of things in there.
> 
> I hate being sneaky but I guess this is the only possible way to protect myself and my daughter.


Is there any way that you can get your hands on the other letters and get photo copies of them?

I think that you need to get a lock smith out there as soon as you can. You need to get into that room. No telling what he is hiding from you in there. It might not just be his collectables.

When I searched my husband's car, I looked in the wheel well, in the place where the jack and tools go. Under any rug/mat that will come up. He hid stuff all over the place. I found condoms in with his tools.. geez.


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## JohnA

Also his last text was an attempt to placate you since you have shown signs of become more independent. He will cycle though several modes to keep you but in the end never become the guy you thought he was. 

EleGirl and more then a few others can tell you what to except from these cycles. I would say expect more texts like the last one, to him being very sweet and understanding to being very cold, blaming you, and threatening. From the extremes and everything between he will claim understanding and love for you. That is his weapon. Delete these from his texts and words and just examine and judge what is left.

By the way was there ever any abuse in his parents marriage or any other of his past relationships?


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## lanajade33

JohnA said:


> By the way was there ever any abuse in his parents marriage or any other of his past relationships?


Not that I know of. His parents have been together 45 years. Of his own past relationships I do not know of any abuse either. But who knows, he certainly wouldn't tell me if there was.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## JohnA

Then he will start by crying, telling you how woderful you are, how much he needs you, blah, blah
It will evolve into we are both adults, need to think of kids, work out a fair compomise, blah, blah, blah,
The evolve into bluster, belittleing you, warning of a dire future, blah, blah, blah

Repeat cycle 

Mix up cycle 

Stay in the home, keep your noise clean, be firm in your choices, use the 180 diplomatically and politely. Once you have a taste of owing your own life you will never settle for less.


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## lanajade33

EleGirl said:


> Is there any way that you can get your hands on the other letters and get photo copies of them?
> 
> I think that you need to get a lock smith out there as soon as you can. You need to get into that room. No telling what he is hiding from you in there. It might not just be his collectables.


He keeps the letters in his book bag that he brings to and from work with him. I can easily make additional copies when he steps out.

Since he won't be home until later tomorrow night, I can contact a locksmith first thing in the morning and hopefully get them to come by the afternoon. Hopefully they will be able to make me a key for it.

I will keep you guys posted. Kind of glad I won't have to deal with seeing him tonight and having it be just me and my daughter.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## JohnA

Good thought, I hope you go though with it.


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## EleGirl

Lana,

If you wanted to, you could probably call a lock smith tonight and have on there early in the morning.

Most service now how someone answering their phone all the time and setting up appointment.

I do this all the time.... call after work.


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## Starstarfish

I'd be really tempted to text back and ask why he needs to "sleep out" in a really calm way to see if you can get something incriminating on text.


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## lanajade33

Starstarfish said:


> I'd be really tempted to text back and ask why he needs to "sleep out" in a really calm way to see if you can get something incriminating on text.


I used to text him that when this all first started. He just won't respond. He is consistent in not contacting me at all when he stays out.

It's fine though. Tomorrow when my daughter gets home from school we are going to stay at my moms for a couple of days. He'll be coming home to an empty house.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## JohnA

Not responding to his text and asking why is the 180 in action.

When you take your daughter be sure to text him when you are leaving and when you will be back - nothing more. Only discuss your daughter and perhaps important financial matters.


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## EleGirl

lanajade33 said:


> I used to text him that when this all first started. He just won't respond. He is consistent in not contacting me at all when he stays out.
> 
> It's fine though. Tomorrow when my daughter gets home from school we are going to stay at my moms for a couple of days. He'll be coming home to an empty house.


One thing you can be pretty sure of is that he is telling the OW all sorts of things about you that are not very nice. He is probably telling her that either he is staying at his friends to be near his children or that he stays at the house to be near his children.

And he's telling her that he does not love you. That he has not had sex with you in weeks, months, years.

At some point, sending the OW things like the messages he sends you might help to break up the affair.


.


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## EleGirl

I suppose that you have seen your husband in a manic phase before. Has he ever been delusional when in a manic phase?


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## lanajade33

EleGirl said:


> I suppose that you have seen your husband in a manic phase before. Has he ever been delusional when in a manic phase?


Definitely. Most of the time I think that delusion is a major driving force of his manic episodes, and also a determining factor in how long it lasts. 

Maybe that's why I initially was soft on him? Maybe I was hoping for that to be the exuse since I also know that he is very easily persuaded when manic, but then I realize at the end of the day he still knows right from wrong. He's so used to being able to recover whatever damage he does at that time, but this isn't spending too much money or impulsively quitting his job.. This has been 7 weeks of breaking my heart and spirit. I don't know how much longer I can go before that can't be recovered. I'm really scared it probably can't already.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Hopeful Cynic

lanajade33 said:


> My mom wants me and my daughter to visit her for a couple of days, so I can sit and talk about all of this and just to get out of the house for a bit. I'm thinking about taking a couple days off and going today.


A very good idea. Don't do it until you have all your valuable and sentimental things safe though, and photos or copies of all his valuables and documents. Don't give him a chance to get his things out or take yours.

And since this isn't his biological daughter, you don't need to tell him anything about your trip.



jsmart said:


> Telling his parents isn't to destroy them. When you tell them, you're doing it in a help me fight for the marriage. They will want the marriage to survive out of self interest. Being older, they've lived life and know that their grand-children's well being is best served in an intact family.


When you tell them, it won't be you destroying them, it will be him. He has already hurt them. You would just be the pain signal reaching the brain.



EleGirl said:


> This makes sense and goes a long way to explain why he's acting the way he his. He's probably in a manic state right now.


Ugh. Yeah, this explains a lot of his delusions.



lanajade33 said:


> I want you to know that I love you very much, and it means so much to me how supportive you have been through all of this. I know it's not easy. But always remember that I do love you so very much!


So delusional! He really believes this is just another ordinary manic episode that you'll support him through and be waiting faithfully on the other side. Everything is sunshine and roses to him right now.

It does mean he probably won't be thinking strategically for a divorce. Especially if you're behaving civilly and maintaining his delusion until you have your ducks in a row.



lanajade33 said:


> Definitely. Most of the time I think that delusion is a major driving force of his manic episodes, and also a determining factor in how long it lasts.
> 
> Maybe that's why I initially was soft on him? Maybe I was hoping for that to be the exuse since I also know that he is very easily persuaded when manic, but then I realize at the end of the day he still knows right from wrong. He's so used to being able to recover whatever damage he does at that time, but this isn't spending too much money or impulsively quitting his job.. This has been 7 weeks of breaking my heart and spirit. I don't know how much longer I can go before that can't be recovered. I'm really scared it probably can't already.


This one is certainly extreme, and crosses a line. I wouldn't be scared that it can't be recovered. That's a waste of your limited mental energy. I would be acknowledging that it can't be recovered and using your energy to mitigate the damage to your life. Even if he does flip to normal tonight and come home grovelling and apologizing, if you try to accept him and reconcile, you'll always be tense, waiting for it to happen again. That's no way to live. Seize control of your life, since he is medically unable to seize control of his own.


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## EleGirl

Another thing that you will want to secure are family pictures. Believe it or not, in divorce one person often hides them and never lets the other spouse have any of them.

One of my sister's ex's did that. He went into the house when she was not home, took everything of value to include family pictures. It's been years and he till give her any of them.

If you take them, then you can make copies for him at some time.


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## lanajade33

EleGirl said:


> Another thing that you will want to secure are family pictures. Believe it or not, in divorce one person often hides them and never lets the other spouse have any of them.
> 
> One of my sister's ex's did that. He went into the house when she was not home, took everything of value to include family pictures. It's been years and he till give her any of them.
> 
> If you take then, then you can make copies for him at some time.


I did not even think of that. Why would anyone do that?? I'll definitely lock that in the spare room with the rest of my stuff...
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## imtamnew

If you can get a locksmith, so can he.

Move it out.


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## Lilac23

lanajade33 said:


> The only thing of value that I own is my engagement ring and wedding band. And a camera. I really don't have much stuff.
> 
> Unfortunately I wouldn't be able to move his valuables to a storage, because of the nature of what it consists of. Also he keeps it locked in a room in the basement and I don't have a key so I have to figure out how to get in first. Then I can and definitely will take pics of everything and get it appraised without him knowing, because I feel like if I told him I was going to have it valued he would start moving some of it to his friends or something. And he knows that I do not know know by memory what everything is. I think that's why my mom suggested I play nice a little bit longer._Posted via Mobile Device_


Mama is smart! Try and find paperwork that documents what he owns, if you can't access the valuables themselves. That way, at least you will have a record of what he owns and can find out their worth.



lanajade33 said:


> So as I'm writing this he just text me this:
> 
> Hey being that I have a psych appt tomorrow eve, and thus will be staying home tomorrow night, I was going to hang out and stay at (friend name)'s today after work ok?
> I'm really going to try to keep the overnights during the week to just one night at a time, on the weekends that we have (son name), obviously I will be home with you and the kids, so on those weeks there may be a time where I sleep out 2 nights in a row since I will obviously be home on those Friday's. I want you to know that I love you very much, and it means so much to me how supportive you have been through all of this. I know it's not easy. But always remember that I do love you so very much!
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Was 'what a piece of sh!t' running through your mind when you read this? If so, let me be the first to welcome you to the anger phase and I'm so happy to see you have arrived! :toast:

I would dissect that text line by line but that would take too long. In summation, he is a manipulative [email protected]@rd that is trying to negotiate the terms of his affair with you. In his strange mind, he thinks you are mad because of the number of days he was gone and maybe he can keep you on his side if he limits the nights he spends fornicating with another woman per week. And see how he avoids mentioning where he is on those nights? Then he tries to throw you a bone by saying 'how supportive' you've been during his adultery and how he knows it's 'not easy' to sit at home knowing your husband is out wining, dining and putting his penis in another woman's vagina. But it's all ok but he 'loves you so much'! :banghead:

This is not love, it is closer to hate. How could someone do this to you and put you through so much pain while claiming to love you? In real love, it actually causes you pain to know that you hurt someone you love. Imagine your child in the street and a car is bearing down on them, you would not hesitate to put your own life in danger to prevent them from being hurt, it's not even a thought, it's just instinct to throw yourself in the line of danger. It's not you, it really is him. He didn't forget to take out the garbage or pickup milk from the store. He intentionally did this and is intentionally lying and manipulating you for his own gain. I wouldn't even want to attempt to reconcile with this @$$.


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## Lilac23

EleGirl said:


> Another thing that you will want to secure are family pictures. Believe it or not, in divorce one person often hides them and never lets the other spouse have any of them.
> 
> One of my sister's ex's did that. He went into the house when she was not home, took everything of value to include family pictures. It's been years and he till give her any of them.
> 
> If you take then, then you can make copies for him at some time.


My sister's ex kept the video of her giving birth. LOL, why would he want that?!?! He's not like an involved father or anything, he just did it for the simple fact that she wanted it and he could bug her by taking it.


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## tripad

staarz21 said:


> WTF???
> 
> Omg. I would be kicking his @ss right now. There is no way in hell I would EVER put up with that. He's staying at his girlfriend's house while telling you that he loves you?
> 
> Forward that text message to his girlfriend and see if she knows that he's still telling you he loves you.
> 
> This is beyond disgusting and you need to get past the depressed/hopeful "we're still going to work it out" stage and get straight on to the p*ssed off /exposing to everyone stage.
> 
> This is horrible, disgusting behavior.


Agreed .

I hope you are NOT believing all his sh1t .

How about you tell him I love you too but I am getting fuZk tonight by another man for a night or two and I will be back honey .

He is using you for laundry and a hot meal without the alimony and child support he has to pay if you divorce him.

Better get all these evidence of his adultery and use it in court


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## Lilac23

EleGirl said:


> One thing you can be pretty sure of is that he is telling the OW all sorts of things about you that are not very nice. He is probably telling her that either he is staying at his friends to be near his children or that he stays at the house to be near his children.
> 
> And he's telling her that he does not love you. That he has not had sex with you in weeks, months, years.


Or that you cry all the time and he feels soooo sorry for you but he's doing the honorable thing and remaining emotionally / financially available to you while you adjust to the fact that the divorce is all your fault. He's such a giving and generous person! He's a prince among men! A martyr! And you keep throwing yourself at him because you use sex as a weapon against him but he is saving himself for his weekend Lolita. Let's all have a moment a silence for his brave sacrifice.




EleGirl said:


> At some point, sending the OW things like the messages he sends you might help to break up the affair.


Nice^^^^!!!! Save all your texts!


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## always_hopefull

lanajade33 said:


> I used to text him that when this all first started. He just won't respond. He is consistent in not contacting me at all when he stays out.
> 
> It's fine though. Tomorrow when my daughter gets home from school we are going to stay at my moms for a couple of days. He'll be coming home to an empty house.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


That's great. Just remember to be gone the whole weekend, come back later Sunday. Also turn off your cell and give it to your mum to ensure you're not tempted to answer the phone.


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## azadehnasri2015

It is a very bad situation. one important point is that you must be strong. if you cry and tell him not to go , the situation become worse and his decision will become stronger. because when sb sees other weakness, he would think that person is inferior. be happy and tidy, cook the foods that he likes. make your self more beautiful by buying good clothes. if he goes, do not worry. you will find another person too. 

Sent from my GT-N5100 using Tapatalk


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## lanajade33

azadehnasri2015 said:


> It is a very bad situation. one important point is that you must be strong. if you cry and tell him not to go , the situation become worse and his decision will become stronger. because when sb sees other weakness, he would think that person is inferior. be happy and tidy, cook the foods that he likes. make your self more beautiful by buying good clothes. if he goes, do not worry. you will find another person too.
> 
> Sent from my GT-N5100 using Tapatalk


I am getting stronger at not showing weakness, but I feel like the rest of this goes completely against a 180. How can cooking for him or buying new clothes change anything? Seems like it's just continuing to cater him and letting him know he can continue what he's doing, no?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## TheTruthHurts

lanajade33 said:


> azadehnasri2015 said:
> 
> 
> 
> It is a very bad situation. one important point is that you must be strong. if you cry and tell him not to go , the situation become worse and his decision will become stronger. because when sb sees other weakness, he would think that person is inferior. be happy and tidy, cook the foods that he likes. make your self more beautiful by buying good clothes. if he goes, do not worry. you will find another person too.
> 
> Sent from my GT-N5100 using Tapatalk
> 
> 
> 
> I am getting stronger at not showing weakness, but I feel like the rest of this goes completely against a 180. How can cooking for him or buying new clothes change anything? Seems like it's just continuing to cater him and letting him know he can continue what he's doing, no?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_
Click to expand...

You are right. But you should buy yourself nice clothes that you like - after all he is spending your marital assets right now on the OW. Do it for you.

There is a risk of escalating his behavior which you don't want to do until the assets are accounted for and yours are protected.

I would move your valuables, photos and keepsakes to your mothers instead of the other bedroom in the event he gets the same idea about getting past your locked bedroom door. You could even get a few photo reprints to have some remain in the house to look normal.

But other than that I would not seem defiant or antagonistic toward him - just confident, independent and as a good mom concerned about your daughter. He might feel you are adjusting to the new normal he is trying to establish - and allow you to continue to plan your personal protection.

Keep us posted about the locksmith.


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## lanajade33

I could not sleep so was up since 3:30am. Decided to look around his side of the bedroom and I found a set of keys under his nightstand. After I dropped off my daughter at school I came home and tried them all on the basement room. One of them worked. So I was able to get pics of everything and I also found some paperwork and a handwritten list he made of everything. 

I'm definitely going to bring whatever I can to my moms today. The only thing I have at the house is my engagement ring. A few months back I knicked it at work so haven't been wearing it since. If I move it out of the room he will definitely notice, so I might just leave it. I can just make a copy of the appraisal and leave that at my moms.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## TheTruthHurts

You're doing great


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## farsidejunky

lanajade33 said:


> I am getting stronger at not showing weakness, but I feel like the rest of this goes completely against a 180. How can cooking for him or buying new clothes change anything? Seems like it's just continuing to cater him and letting him know he can continue what he's doing, no?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Lana:

You are doing it for YOU. It is to build YOUR confidence back up. These are concrete actions that show him you are moving on.

It SOMETIMES has the effect of bringing them out of the fog, however...Remember you are doing it for YOU, to help YOU heal and detach.

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk


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## EleGirl

lanajade33 said:


> I could not sleep so was up since 3:30am. Decided to look around his side of the bedroom and I found a set of keys under his nightstand. After I dropped off my daughter at school I came home and tried them all on the basement room. One of them worked. So I was able to get pics of everything and I also found some paperwork and a handwritten list he made of everything.
> 
> I'm definitely going to bring whatever I can to my moms today. The only thing I have at the house is my engagement ring. A few months back I knicked it at work so haven't been wearing it since. If I move it out of the room he will definitely notice, so I might just leave it. I can just make a copy of the appraisal and leave that at my moms.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Does he know that you knicked the ring? You could always tell him that you took it to be repaired.

Get a copy made of the key to that room. Actually get a copy of all the keys that you found.


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## always_hopefull

lanajade33 said:


> I did not even think of that. Why would anyone do that?? I'll definitely lock that in the spare room with the rest of my stuff...
> _Posted via Mobile Device_



You said he has a psych appointment soon, contact the psychiatrist and tell him he's manic, cheating and he should want to prepare/educate your H that divorce is a real possibility. As for that "loving" text he sent you, I'd either ignore it, or send him something like this..."I am not, nor will I ever be supporting of your having an affair with another woman. I am merely "tollerating" your behavior, for now." You can add or leave out "Please understand that I may reconsider my ability to continue a relationship like this". If you continue to say little to nothing about his actions, he is viewing this as you supporting him. It's the old "you never said I couldn't" excuse.

I would also let his ex know he's manic, she may not want her son around him. If you are truly wanting stability for your daughter, keep her away from him, right now he's mentally unstable and who knows how he will react when he becomes angry or depressive. Is your mum close by? Can you stay there and go to work?

My doctor told me two things when I divorced my ex, "depression can be contagious", my ex has depression and his behaviour/moods were effecting me quite severely, she also said it's okay to love someone who is mentally ill, but you need to love yourself more! Right now your sacrificing yourself for his love. Please get yourself into a support group for bipolar families and some IC to help you cope.


----------



## EleGirl

azadehnasri2015 said:


> It is a very bad situation. one important point is that you must be strong. if you cry and tell him not to go , the situation become worse and his decision will become stronger. because when sb sees other weakness, he would think that person is inferior.


This is true. Which is why Lana is doing the 180… not only to show strength, but to build her emotional strength.


azadehnasri2015 said:


> be happy and tidy, cook the foods that he likes.


Being as happy as you can is part of the 180.
The “tidy, cook the foods that he likes”. She is not his maid. He has lost the right to have a wife who does anything at all for him. Not doing these things for him shows strength.


azadehnasri2015 said:


> make your self more beautiful by buying good clothes.


I agree, this can be a strong part of a 180. At this point Lana should be doing things for herself. That includes working out, new clothing, even a makeover if she wants. But if Lana does this, she should do it for herself.


azadehnasri2015 said:


> if he goes, do not worry. you will find another person too.


At this point her husband is not calling the shots. He still thinks that he is in control. But he is not. Lana is in control. Lana is decided if she is going to kick him to the curb. I have a feeling that her husband is going to be losing a very good wife over this.


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## lanajade33

EleGirl said:


> Does he know that you knicked the ring? You could always tell him that you took it to be repaired.
> 
> Get a copy made of the key to that room. Actually get a copy of all the keys that you found.


He knows I knicked it, I told him right away I was so upset. We took it to a jeweler who said he can send it to a diamond cutter to be repaired and luckily it would have minimal affect on the value. But it will cost about 500-600... So we were waiting until tax return to have it re-cut and re-appraised since we didn't have that kind of money to shell out right away.

I'm really wondering what these other keys are for. Most of them are slightly smaller than house size keys... There's 7 keys total.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## EleGirl

always_hopefull said:


> You said he has a psych appointment soon, contact the psychiatrist and tell him he's manic, cheating and he should want to prepare/educate your H that divorce is a real possibility. As for that "loving" text he sent you, I'd either ignore it, or send him something like this..."I am not, nor will I ever be supporting of your having an affair with another woman. I am merely "tollerating" your behavior, for now." You can add or leave out "Please understand that I may reconsider my ability to continue a relationship like this". If you continue to say little to nothing about his actions, he is viewing this as you supporting him. It's the old "you never said I couldn't" excuse.
> 
> I would also let his ex know he's manic, she may not want her son around him. If you are truly wanting stability for your daughter, keep her away from him, right now he's mentally unstable and who knows how he will react when he becomes angry or depressive. Is your mum close by? Can you stay there and go to work?
> 
> My doctor told me two things when I divorced my ex, "depression can be contagious", my ex has depression and his behaviour/moods were effecting me quite severely, she also said it's okay to love someone who is mentally ill, but you need to love yourself more! Right now your sacrificing yourself for his love. Please get yourself into a support group for bipolar families and some IC to help you cope.


Lana, I quoted this because it is solid advice. You do need to start getting firm that you are not supportive of his affair... that you object to it with every fiber of your being.


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## EleGirl

lanajade33 said:


> He knows I knicked it, I told him right away I was so upset. We took it to a jeweler who said he can send it to a diamond cutter to be repaired and luckily it would have minimal affect on the value. But it will cost about 500-600... So we were waiting until tax return to have it re-cut and re-appraised since we didn't have that kind of money to shell out right away.
> 
> I'm really wondering what these other keys are for. Most of them are slightly smaller than house size keys... There's 7 keys total.


They could be lock boxes, post office boxes, keys to locks on storage bins… all kinds of things.

I would definitely make copies.

Then I would start looking for any mail in is locked room that is a po box, or contract for a storage unit.


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## always_hopefull

TheTruthHurts said:


> There is a risk of escalating his behavior which you don't want to do until the assets are accounted for and yours are protected.


Absolutely correct. Are the credit cards in your name too? If so call the company and tell them you have martital discord, do the same if you have a joint bank account, money will be frozen but bills will still be paid, but he can't spend the cash. Please see a lawyer asap so you are not on the hook for his manic bills, have you seen his statement yet? If you are on the account you may be liable. Has he been going to work?

Eta: if there's savings, take half, put it into another account in your name, if you have direct deposit change it to your own account. Protect yourself, and your daughter from being collateral damage. An affair is brutal, sadly I know, but right now he's mentally unstable and you need to find the strength to protect both of you. You can always R later if that's what you want.


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## lanajade33

always_hopefull said:


> You said he has a psych appointment soon, contact the psychiatrist and tell him he's manic, cheating and he should want to prepare/educate your H that divorce is a real possibility.


His psych appointment is tonight. I thought about calling the doc to fill her in on his behavior, but I'm afraid she will tell my husband I called and he will freak out and it will make things so much worse.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## EleGirl

lanajade33 said:


> His psych appointment is tonight. I thought about calling the doc to fill her in on his behavior, but I'm afraid she will tell my husband I called and he will freak out and it will make things so much worse.


It's a fine line. You might want to wait until his next appointment. Right now getting yourself in as good a situation as possible is priority one. How often does he see the doc?


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## lanajade33

EleGirl said:


> It's a fine line. You might want to wait until his next appointment. Right now getting yourself in as good a situation as possible is priority one. How often does he see the doc?


He doesn't see the psychiatrist often, probably once every 3 or 4 months. Sometimes longer. Just to check in and refill his meds. Maybe do some blood work. I'm positive he will not divulge his behavior in detail.

We do have a (probably pointless) counseling appointment on Friday with a different doc, his old therapist, who I know he admires a lot.

I was thinking of even trying to squeeze an appointment of my own with either one of them before he sees them. That way I'm protected by doc/patient confidentiality.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## lanajade33

always_hopefull said:


> Absolutely correct. Are the credit cards in your name too? If so call the company and tell them you have martital discord, do the same if you have a joint bank account, money will be frozen but bills will still be paid, but he can't spend the cash. Please see a lawyer asap so you are not on the hook for his manic bills, have you seen his statement yet? If you are on the account you may be liable. Has he been going to work?


He's definitely been going to work. I am positive. Plus that's where OW works.

Thankfully we have no credit cards anymore. We each had our own for a while, and last year they were maxed out. His manic spending wasn't allowing us to make a dent with minimum payments, it was burying us... So we closed the accounts and made a deal with the cc company to pay them off, but they aren't active so can't be used.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## EleGirl

lanajade33 said:


> He's definitely been going to work. I am positive. Plus that's where OW works.
> 
> Thankfully we have no credit cards anymore. We each had our own for a while, and last year they were maxed out. His manic spending wasn't allowing us to make a dent with minimum payments, it was burying us... So we closed the accounts and made a deal with the cc company to pay them off, but they aren't active so can't be used.


You might want to pull his credit report. With his manic state, he might have a card or two that you don't know about.

Where does he keep all his financial paperwork? Did you find anything of importance in that room besides his collectables? Like were there any financial papers?


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## lanajade33

EleGirl said:


> You might want to pull his credit report. With his manic state, he might have a card or two that you don't know about.
> 
> Where does he keep all his financial paperwork? Did you find anything of importance in that room besides his collectables? Like were there any financial papers?


We have online credit monitoring that I set up a long time ago so I can make sure he doesn't open any new accounts. I check it monthly and he knows about it. Plus his credit is so shot that he wouldn't get approved for anything from anywhere.

Nothing was in the room except for his stuff and the list.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## TheTruthHurts

From what you've said I am not feeling you are very safe in the event he believes you will leave. On the one hand it would be good for his therapist to see copies of his texts to you, but on the other hand it is of no value to you to bring him out of his delusions if you are not going to stay married. And frankly I hope you are not considering staying married.

If you are resigned to leave the. Protect yourself and the kids first. Do not agitate the situation or try to bring him to reality. Do the 180 for YOU alone, but maybe even soften it around him - and just be courteous and mildly pleasant - which may be very hard. You are in a tough spot - you need to free yourself mentally but not appear threatening to him until you file.

Keep us posted and listen to the good advice here. Yes copy all the keys - maybe a hardware store can identify if the are post office boxes etc. Tell them you have them (maybe from your parents house) but don't know or forgot what they belong to. They might be able to quickly identify some.


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## JohnA

If they are keys to a United States Postal box it is illegal to copy them. It should say it right on the key. The key maker should also 
Recognize it and refuse to copy, 

Good to see you on course on to a better life Lana. You will find each step you take, no matter how small, will boost you self-esteem. 

Quick question how is your personal credit rating and do you own or rent? If your score is low - why ? Is it because of him? Either way do not let it cause you to settle staying in your marriage. Don't wait till the money gets better. It never will. He will always use debt as a leverage to continue to entrap you. Remember my post about cycles ? One of his mantra will be: "now is not a good time financially and I love you, you patience and kindness always amaze me. I love you, I love my family, please I know we can make it Lana. You are everything to me and I am lost with out you."


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## lanajade33

JohnA said:


> If they are keys to a United States Postal box it is illegal to copy them. It should say it right on the key. The key maker should also
> Recognize it and refuse to copy,
> 
> Good to see you on course on to a better life Lana. You will find each step you take, no matter how small, will boost you self-esteem.
> 
> Quick question how is your personal credit rating and do you own or rent? If your score is low - why ? Is it because of him? Either way do not let it cause you to settle staying in your marriage. Don't wait till the money gets better. It never will. He will always use debt as a leverage to continue to entrap you. Remember my post about cycles ? One of his mantra will be: "now is not a good time financially and I love you, you patience and kindness always amaze me. I love you, I love my family, please I know we can make it Lana. You are everything to me and I am lost with out you."


I don't think any of the keys are PO box or safety deposit box. I think they are probably to small locks and/or small safes.

We own our house together. My credit isn't as bad as his, but has gone downhill since we married due to trying to stay afloat with bills and letting my student loans suffer. It can be recovered in time though.

I honestly don't know what he wants. He says he isn't "in love" with me anymore. Then he wants to go to counseling. Then he says he will always love me. He even told me that he told the OW to her face that he will always love me. And of course she said she accepts that and will never try to change him. It's insane, I'm seeing that now. He says he doesn't know what he wants, but part of me feels like he has already made up his mind to be with her and is playing nice to me for the time being. Then I think he just wants to push me to be the one to end it so he can say he wasn't the one who left. Most of the time I feel like he really just wants to relish in this double life he's created for himself.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## TheTruthHurts

Yep I think you nailed it. The full disclosure is to prevent him from making you the bad guy. So you will want to be sure to do that in time. But you have ample evidence with the texts etc


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## JohnA

He is a coward, to frighten to cut you loose to find a new relationship. He is coward and lazy for making you do the work to formally end the marriage. TheTruthHurts nailed it; full discloser will stop him from playing more mind games. You must stop the mind games. Yet another reason for the 180.

Bottom line: the second he committed adultery he ended the marriage. 

Take your the last paragraph of your last post, marry it to my thoughts on him being a coward. Send to your mother and friends.
It will stop these mind games.


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## lanajade33

Getting ready to leave for my moms for a couple days. Wanted to update, just found a new note from OW to my husband...

Baby I love you so much.
Don't ever feel like your not allowed to be upset or not supposed to feel sad about Lana. I love you, and all I want is for you to be happy no matter what the situation is. You never need to hide or feel ashamed of that. And don't ever let it make you feel guilty or wrong. I love you unconditionally, that will never change. If I can do anything for you let me know. 
Forever yours,
SLVTFACE

Wow she's really putting on a performance. She's so perfect! Guess he's having second thoughts.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Annie123

lanajade33 said:


> Getting ready to leave for my moms for a couple days. Wanted to update, just found a new note from OW to my husband...
> 
> *Baby I love you so much.
> Don't ever feel like your not allowed to be upset or not supposed to feel sad about Lana. I love you, and all I want is for you to be happy no matter what the situation is. You never need to hide or feel ashamed of that. And don't ever let it make you feel guilty or wrong. I love you unconditionally, that will never change. If I can do anything for you let me know.
> Forever yours,
> SLVTFACE*
> 
> Wow she's really putting on a performance. She's so perfect! Guess he's having second thoughts.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


issed:issed:issed::gun: (couldn't find the barf emoticon)


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## EleGirl

lanajade33 said:


> Getting ready to leave for my moms for a couple days. Wanted to update, just found a new note from OW to my husband...
> 
> Baby I love you so much.
> Don't ever feel like your not allowed to be upset or not supposed to feel sad about Lana. I love you, and all I want is for you to be happy no matter what the situation is. You never need to hide or feel ashamed of that. And don't ever let it make you feel guilty or wrong. I love you unconditionally, that will never change. If I can do anything for you let me know.
> Forever yours,
> SLVTFACE
> 
> Wow she's really putting on a performance. She's so perfect! Guess he's having second thoughts.


Oh my, she's quite an actress. If she is not upset about him being confused or whatever, wait until she does get royally pissed... that might be just about the time when you send her all those texts he's been sending you.

He and she make quite a pair, don't they. 

I hope that you get a few days rest and get your strength renewed at your mom's.


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## always_hopefull

lanajade33 said:


> Getting ready to leave for my moms for a couple days. Wanted to update, just found a new note from OW to my husband...
> 
> Baby I love you so much.
> Don't ever feel like your not allowed to be upset or not supposed to feel sad about Lana. I love you, and all I want is for you to be happy no matter what the situation is. You never need to hide or feel ashamed of that. And don't ever let it make you feel guilty or wrong. I love you unconditionally, that will never change. If I can do anything for you let me know.
> Forever yours,
> SLVTFACE
> 
> Wow she's really putting on a performance. She's so perfect! Guess he's having second thoughts.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Wow, could someone please pass me an industrial sized vomit bag?

What a load of hogwash. I wish I wasn't on my phone, I'd try and post the "just let then go" thread. 

Is his name on it as well as hers? Part of me says copy it and go put it on all the cars at work. There are some people worth fighting for, do you truly believe your H to be one? I dont think this will be his last affair, now that his financial binging has been stopped he has found a new outlet for his manic phases. 

Are you sure he's still on his meds?

I hope you and your D arrived safe and sound.


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## EleGirl

always_hopefull said:


> Wow, could someone please pass me an industrial sized vomit bag?
> 
> What a load of hogwash. I wish I wasn't on my phone, I'd try and post the "just let then go" thread.
> 
> Is his name on it as well as hers? Part of me says copy it and go put it on all the cars at work. There are some people worth fighting for, do you truly believe your H to be one? I dont think this will be his last affair, now that his financial binging has been stopped he has found a new outlet for his manic phases.
> 
> Are you sure he's still on his meds?
> 
> I hope you and your D arrived safe and sound.


There is always a problem with blowing up someone's job. If Lana decides that it's a lost cause, she is better off with him working. The last thing she needs is to be stuck with paying him support and alimony. 

But I love your idea.... wonder how long they would still be employed there were Lana to do that.


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## Lilac23

lanajade33 said:


> His psych appointment is tonight. I thought about calling the doc to fill her in on his behavior, but I'm afraid she will tell my husband I called and he will freak out and it will make things so much worse.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I am pretty sure they don't tell, especially if you tell her you don't want her to know that you called. She cannot legally give you any information on him but she can listen to your 'concerns'.


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## JohnA

Hi @EleGirl I think she might really, really, really meant what she texted. Which is why it scares me. Grezz the WS and OW together, Oh Vey. 

While she might mean her words her actions will conflict with them and cause Lana harm. I doubt either the WS or OW have a firm grasp on reality at this point. We are witnessing the fog taken to the twilight zone level squared. 

Lana sometimes when a person screams at you for no reason and tells you what they are going to do - believe them. Get yourself and your daughter safely to the side lines.


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## always_hopefull

EleGirl said:


> There is always a problem with blowing up someone's job. If Lana decides that it's a lost cause, she is better off with him working. The last thing she needs is to be stuck with paying him support and alimony.
> 
> But I love your idea.... wonder how long they would still be employed there were Lana to do that.


I agree on he needs to keep working, but sometimes just the knowledge you can do something like that can empower you. Too bad she couldn't visit her H at work and drop it in the office by "mistake". I know, I'm bad.

However, if it's an at fault state would he be entitled to alimony.if he was let go due to an affair in he workplace?


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## EleGirl

always_hopefull said:


> I agree on he needs to keep working, but sometimes just the knowledge you can do something like that can empower you. Too bad she couldn't visit her H at work and drop it in the office by "mistake". I know, I'm bad.
> 
> However, if it's an at fault state would he be entitled to alimony.if he was let go due to an affair in he workplace?


Oh I get it. I told in an earlier post about my sending the zip file to the women my H was cheating with so that they could all see how 'special' they were to him. That was my second husband.

The one before him... I caught him cheating with a woman who worked at the hospital where he doing his medial internship. I called her one day pretending to be a person calling from voter registration to verify her information. And I was sooo nice and friendly. We started talking and she told me all about her boyfriend (my husband) who was going to help her get an apartment. I never let her know who I was. She was so dumb. First to think that anyone from the Secretary of State's Office would call her about her voter registration (I did not even know if she was registered.. LOL). Then she was even dumber to tell me tons of details about the affair. Stupid woman. 

I get it. It can be empowering to at least think of the crazy things we could do.


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## Jessicacalifornia

Just start by taking care of yourself, get a separation filing started and custody paperwork. Getting family involved didn't help me in my situation. I tried reaching out to my MIL when I caught my husband cheating and told her. I needed help because he had drug and porn addiction problems which he does, and needed her to at least call him as we have no family remotely near to us. She snapped back at me that if our marriage wasn't working maybe divorce was better and she said she was sure all my friends believe my stories. but she didn't see any fault in her son. The very next day he nearly broke my arm when he came to pack his stuff and I had to call police. My own family wanted me just to have him arrested and leave him. You need to understand that he's committed a crime against your marriage and yourself. It's over. Deal breaker, entirely.
_Posted via Mobile Device_
_Posted via Mobile Device_
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## tripad

yes 

never trust the in laws .

remember they will side their children even if they murdered you .


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## lanajade33

Well I had to leave my moms and come home tonight because he text to say he will be out of the house until Friday and now there is no one to take care of our dogs. He knew I was at my moms which is like 2 hours away. And he knows I don't have any family to call on where we live, because I moved out of state to be with him when we first started dating.

I'm so angry at him for being so hurtful and having no sign of genuine remorse, it's like he thinks he can make me a prisoner in my house or something while he decides what he wants to do.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## JohnA

Lana,

"while he decides what to do" ???? 

You need understand and he needs to understand - he waits for LANA TO DECIDE !!!


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## TheTruthHurts

Just go home, get the dogs and bring them to moms. Don't let him see you riled up. Keep this in mind as you move forward - he will make this hard so be prepared and look out for #1


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## tech-novelist

It may not seem that way, but you are doing everything right.

Just make sure that he doesn't get a chance to hurt you or the kids, and otherwise keep on doing what you are doing.

We're all on your side!


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## Abc123wife

lanajade33 said:


> Well I had to leave my moms and come home tonight because he text to say he will be out of the house until Friday and now there is no one to take care of our dogs. He knew I was at my moms which is like 2 hours away. And he knows I don't have any family to call on where we live, because I moved out of state to be with him when we first started dating.
> 
> I'm so angry at him for being so hurtful and having no sign of genuine remorse, it's like he thinks he can make me a prisoner in my house or something while he decides what he wants to do.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Why did you allow that to happen? A simple response "As you are aware I am at my mim's house 2 hours away. I am not available until Friday (or whatever day you planned to return). There is no reason that you can't be home and take care of the dog."

WTF reason would he need to be supposedly couch hopping to gain some separation from you if you are not even there? No matter what the assets or financials that you need to get together, there is no way I could be nice to that man for 1 more minute. He should either live at home 100% or he is out 100%. Tell him outright that he cannot go between spending the night with his lover and coming home. Just tell him he has abandoned the home and family and cannot keep coming back! There has to be some law against this kind of extreme emotional abuse! See an attorney ASAP to see what can be done.


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## EleGirl

Lana, 

If you can, either take the dogs and go to your mom's for find someone to take care of them while you are gone. 

You need to do what is good for you and your children.


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## Lilac23

lanajade33 said:


> Well I had to leave my moms and come home tonight because he text to say he will be out of the house until Friday and now there is no one to take care of our dogs. He knew I was at my moms which is like 2 hours away. And he knows I don't have any family to call on where we live, because I moved out of state to be with him when we first started dating.
> 
> I'm so angry at him for being so hurtful and having no sign of genuine remorse, it's like he thinks he can make me a prisoner in my house or something while he decides what he wants to do.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


He displays a shocking lack of empathy.


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## EleGirl

Lana.. checking in on you


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## lanajade33

EleGirl said:


> Lana.. checking in on you


I'm ok. I let my daughter hang at my moms last night and I came home to take care of the dogs, crash here, and head back this morning. I couldn't take them with me to my moms because she's renting an apartment while she house hunts and they don't allow dogs, and my dogs are huge so can't even hide them. Anyway my husband called while I was here and said he felt bad I did that and he'd come home today to care for them. I told him when we divorce I'm taking them.

I'm coming home tomorrow anyway because we have our counseling appointment, followed by a weekend with the kids since my stepson will get here tomorrow night as well. 

So today H was texting me pretty much all day from work, about what he wants to do with the kids this weekend, what he wants to do for my daughters birthday (2 weeks from now) the usual "I love you no matter what babe".. And then he said he gets out of work early tomorrow and he will do a bunch of stuff around the house and how we can have lunch together if I want to... I made sure all of my responses were super short but not b!tchy.

Right now I'm sitting here trying to collect my thoughts to write down all the things I want to make sure I say at our appointment, but my mind is all over the place and I don't know where to start.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Lilac23

lanajade33 said:


> I'm ok. I let my daughter hang at my moms last night and I came home to take care of the dogs, crash here, and head back this morning. I couldn't take them with me to my moms because she's renting an apartment while she house hunts and they don't allow dogs, and my dogs are huge so can't even hide them. Anyway my husband called while I was here and said he felt bad I did that and he'd come home today to care for them. I told him when we divorce I'm taking them._Posted via Mobile Device_


Translation = his girlfriend has plans tomorrow so he doesn't have anything else to do.



lanajade33 said:


> So today H was texting me pretty much all day from work, about what he wants to do with the kids this weekend, what he wants to do for my daughters birthday (2 weeks from now) the usual "I love you no matter what babe".. And then he said he gets out of work early tomorrow and he will do a bunch of stuff around the house and how we can have lunch together if I want to... I made sure all of my responses were super short but not b!tchy._Posted via Mobile Device_


I would say "I am not ok with playing happy family when we are getting a divorce. It will just confuse the kids more when they find out".



lanajade33 said:


> Right now I'm sitting here trying to collect my thoughts to write down all the things I want to make sure I say at our appointment, but my mind is all over the place and I don't know where to start.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Be honest but unemotional. You are not ok with what he is doing and the lack of respect he is showing you and your family. You love him but you cannot stay in a relationship with someone who treats you this way. You do not want a divorce but you have no choice as your partner is already going outside the marriage. Be calm and logical, some people get off on being able to upset their partners and get a reaction, don't give him one! Nothing worse can happen then already has. He is already sleeping with someone else and asked for a divorce, how else can he really hurt you at this point? 

He can sense you are detaching and no longer a slave to him so he's trying to reel you back in by offering to do house chores and 'family time'. What he really needs to do is end his extramarital affair, for a start.


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## EleGirl

lanajade33 said:


> I told him when we divorce I'm taking them.


What did he say to that?


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## EleGirl

I agree with what Lilac advises you say at the counselor's. Keep it clear and simple. Do not cry (if at all possible). If he gets upset, just look at him with a poker face. Practice your poker face.

I would also tell the counselor that when you made the appointment you were under the false impression that you had a marriage to save. Now you realize that there is nothing to save. Your husband has been living with another woman and coming home on some days to be with the children. You are done.

Then look at him and tell him what Lilac suggested.

That way the counselor knows up front what's up.


----------



## lanajade33

EleGirl said:


> What did he say to that?


When I told him I'm keeping the dogs (and the cat) he didn't say anything, but I could tell he accepted it. There's no way he'd try to take the animals away from our daughter.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## lanajade33

EleGirl said:


> I agree with what Lilac advises you say at the counselor's. Keep it clear and simple. Do not cry (if at all possible). If he gets upset, just look at him with a poker face. Practice your poker face.


That's why I'm stressing. I'm worried that no matter how hard I try, I'm going to cry. It's so hard to look at him and not feel emotional because part of me can't help but miss the person I married. How do I practice forgetting that? I'm going to give it everything I have, but even if I end up crying I'm not changing my stance.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## MRR

Lilac23 said:


> Translation = his girlfriend has plans tomorrow so he doesn't have anything else to do.
> 
> 
> 
> I would say "I am not ok with playing happy family when we are getting a divorce. It will just confuse the kids more when they find out".
> 
> 
> 
> Be honest but unemotional. You are not ok with what he is doing and the lack of respect he is showing you and your family. You love him but you cannot stay in a relationship with someone who treats you this way. You do not want a divorce but you have no choice as your partner is already going outside the marriage. Be calm and logical, some people get off on being able to upset their partners and get a reaction, don't give him one! Nothing worse can happen then already has. He is already sleeping with someone else and asked for a divorce, how else can he really hurt you at this point?
> 
> He can sense you are detaching and no longer a slave to him so he's trying to reel you back in by offering to do house chores and 'family time'. What he really needs to do is end his extramarital affair, for a start.


I do not know that I would say anything more about 'when we get divorced'. Sounds like you are trying to get him to react. 

I think your best option is just not to discuss anything with him. He doesnt tell you when he is a the gf's right? you just have to guess. 

Well, time to let him guess about you/your feelings, etc. 

As far as the constant texts, you do not have to respond to all of them. Just send one text telling him you already have plans, or if you are not sure, dont answer.


----------



## lanajade33

Went to our counseling earlier... I said everything I wanted to say, although I did tear up a couple of times. (So did he) but I didn't sob or sound weak.

The counselor agreed with me that he cannot continue the way he is carrying on because it's not fair to anyone involved and will not create any kind of progress. If he was to work on anything with me he would need to cut off the OW 100%

My husband said he loves me and can't picture his life without me, but he's afraid that too much damage has been done and we won't be able to get back "in love". But still he's afraid of making the wrong decision.

The counselor told him it may never be a clear answer, but more a leap of faith. So I said I think he should leave the house. So that's what's happening now.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Lilac23

lanajade33 said:


> Went to our counseling earlier... I said everything I wanted to say, although I did tear up a couple of times. (So did he) but I didn't sob or sound weak._Posted via Mobile Device_


Perfectly understandable, you are going through a hard time!



lanajade33 said:


> The counselor agreed with me that he cannot continue the way he is carrying on because it's not fair to anyone involved and will not create any kind of progress. If he was to work on anything with me he would need to cut off the OW 100%_Posted via Mobile Device_


Good for the counselor for being honest and logical.

_Posted via Mobile Device_[/QUOTE]My husband said he loves me and can't picture his life without me, but he's afraid that too much damage has been done and we won't be able to get back "in love". But still he's afraid of making the wrong decision._Posted via Mobile Device_[/QUOTE]

Still delaying decision making and cake-eating.

_Posted via Mobile Device_[/QUOTE]
The counselor told him it may never be a clear answer, but more a leap of faith. _Posted via Mobile Device_[/QUOTE]

True yet why would it be a leap of faith? You have been his wife for what, ten years? He knows you and he still loves you, he just wants to be able to sleep with other women too.

_Posted via Mobile Device_[/QUOTE]So I said I think he should leave the house. So that's what's happening now._Posted via Mobile Device_[/QUOTE]

This doesn't mean it's the end of your marriage but it is the end of letting him rule your life with his indecision. Who knows, you may decide _you don't want him_. Take good care of yourself during this time! Try to get some rest and exercise. get together with your family and friends, just treat yourself as well as possible.


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## EleGirl

Lana,

It sounds like you did as good as can be expected, maybe even better than that.

I'm really surprised that he is leaving. After his audacity of tell you to leave the master bedroom, I would not have expected him to willingly leave.

If there is any hope for your marriage, him leaving could be a good thing. The affair was not built on the OW meeting all of his needs. Now she will have a lot of respopnslibty put on her. She will most likely not like this at all... maybe at first... but not after a short while.

Have you read the book "Surviving an Affair". It describes what happens to an affair when the BS is no longer in the picture.

I'm sorry that this is all happening to you. It is never fair.


----------



## Satya

lanajade33 said:


> My husband said he loves me and can't picture his life without me, but he's afraid that too much damage has been done and we won't be able to get back "in love". But still he's afraid of making the wrong decision.


This means he wants to maintain having his cake & eating it, too. In other words, he doesn't choose you. 



lanajade33 said:


> So I said I think he should leave the house.


And this is you telling him he can take his cake & stick it. 

Well done for following through with your boundaries. Now, stick to them!


----------



## Lilac23

Do you have a kid together or is your daughter from a previous relationship?


----------



## AVR1962

Lady, I see my your post that you are very hopeful and at the same time very naive. He's gone and he's just trying to keep you holding on. My first husband did the very thing you have described in your post. I too had a hard time grasping the reality that he was gone and it was him that had pursued her. I thought he loved me and it was hard to get thru my head that he could ot have or he would not have done this, we had two children, were high school sweethearts. 

Find your support system and surround yourself with them as you are going to need it. Of course he is spending his spare time with her and their relationship right now is based on physical, that's all it is but he is loving it and can't see past his desires. Doesn't mean you did anything wrong. just shows who he is and you can be thankful that it is happening now and you have found out rather than realizing at 20 years married that he had messed around on you the entire marriage. 

Even if you could repair the damage and he would come back to you, you would not be able to trust this man. men like this are cheaters, you married a cheater. Let him go!!!


----------



## Hopeful Cynic

lanajade33 said:


> The counselor agreed with me that he cannot continue the way he is carrying on because it's not fair to anyone involved and will not create any kind of progress. If he was to work on anything with me he would need to cut off the OW 100%


What was his response to that?



lanajade33 said:


> My husband said he loves me and can't picture his life without me, but he's afraid that too much damage has been done and we won't be able to get back "in love". But still he's afraid of making the wrong decision.


He's ALREADY made the wrong decision.

And honestly, I think he's past the point where anything is his decision to make. It's YOURS.



lanajade33 said:


> The counselor told him it may never be a clear answer, but more a leap of faith. So I said I think he should leave the house. So that's what's happening now.


If he's not clearly choosing YOU, but is still waffling between you and her, doesn't that tell you everything you need to know about his convictions?

He's not trying to decide between two women. He's failing to choose one of them.


----------



## lanajade33

Lilac23 said:


> Do you have a kid together or is your daughter from a previous relationship?


My daughter is from a previous relationship, but he sadly he passed away when she was still a baby. My husband is the only father she has ever known and has been in her life since she was 2.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## lanajade33

Of course now.

My husband came to the house today to get some of his things. While he was here he was very emotional and said that after our counseling appointment he realizes that he still sees potential in our marriage even though he feels that we are currently not "in love". He said he still feels it is possible to get it back because he thinks about me the majority of the time he is away. He now wants to know if while he is out if of the house if I would consider spending time with him without the kids, like meeting for coffee or dinner during the week. And that he would stop seeing the OW so we are able to decide if divorce is the right thing or if we should consider reconciling.

I am now officially more confused than ever in my life. I just spent so much time emotionally preparing myself for separation and now I don't know what to feel.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## frusdil

lanajade33 said:


> He now wants to know if while he is out if of the house if I would consider spending time with him without the kids, like meeting for coffee or dinner during the week. And that he would stop seeing the OW so we are able to decide if divorce is the right thing or if we should consider reconciling.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Honey, this is all part of the manipulation. Unless he's prepared to ring OW with you right next to him, and on speakerphone so she knows it's the two of you calling, and telling her that it is over, and there will be no communication in any form EVER AGAIN between the two of them.

PLUS

THAT HE'S QUITTING HIS JOB.

There is absolutely ZERO point in even entertaining this idea.

He's a cheater. Cheaters are liars. They cannot be trusted. He works with the OW. 

Honey, this will not work. Too much damage has been done. Imagine 5 years down the track, when you reflect on this time and remember the appalling way he's conducted himself...you'll become raging angry - or you should. I don't think a marriage can survive this.


----------



## Happilymarried25

He is not going to stop seeing the OW. He is just saying that so you will see him and then once you start dating him again and get all soft he will try to get you into bed again or not divorce him because you will have hope that he will be coming back to you. He is doing this to keep stringing you along in case things with the OW don't work out. I bet if you would talk to the OW she would tell you that he told her that he had no plans to see you and won't be getting back with you. He is playing both of you.


----------



## NWCooper

I, too, think he is stringing you along. He liked having the two of you and he wants it to continue.

If he truly wants to reconcile your marriage ( if you are willing ) he needs to be home every night and diligently working on earning your trust back and continuing with counciling. With him living elsewhere half the time and then wanting to "date" you, it's as if you are auditioning for the role of wife along with that other tramp. And he decides who wins. 

He is the one who strayed from his vows, and lost trust in this relationship. If he doesn't try to earn it back, it will ultimately never work. He doesn't seem to get that and thinks the decision is his to make. Disabuse him of this notion.


----------



## EleGirl

Lana,

I agree with the others. He is not sincere at this point.

He would have to write a no contact letter to her. I posted a no-contact letter earlier. He shows it to you (you could let us know what it says so that we can tell you if it fits what a no contact letter must be. A. And then the two of you mail it to her and email it to her.

I'm no wild about the idea of him calling her to tell her that he is ending the affair because she will cry and carry on. That will only suck him in. And it would too traumatizing to you.

He has to give you her full name, address and phone number and a photo of her so that you know who she is so you can protect yourself. That way if she shows up, contacts him, etc. you know who she is.

He would have to quit his job because as long as he is working with her, the affair will not end. 

So, before you will consider even talking about reconciliation he has to, in this order:

Quite find a new job and quit the current one.

Send her a no contact letter that he shows you and that you mail with him. This ends the affair.

He can never have any further contact with her under any circumstance. If he does, he has to tell you immediately about it.

He cannot have secrets of any kind, so:

I believe you said that he keeps his money separate from yours. He has to put all of his money/assets in joint accounts.
He has to give you the key to that room. No more him hiding things, locking stuff up to exclude you and spending money on his toys without consideration to the marital/family budget and joint budget decisions.
 He has to give the you passwords to his cell phone and every computer/internet account he has. You get to open them up and look through them before he gets a chance to delete them.

Those few items are for you to even consider getting back with him. Do not just take him back at this point. He will not change. He has nothing to lose by playing you along further (in his mind).


----------



## TheTruthHurts

Don't you think you deserve better? Don't you believe you can do better?


----------



## MJJEAN

Tell him he has to:

1) In front of you, completely break off all contact now and forever with the OW and explain to her that he is doing so in order to work on his marriage because he loves you.

2) Find another job

3) Move back into the house, even if it's in a separate sleeping space, because you can't commit to working on a marriage when you are living separate lives in separate residences.

If he's not willing to do the bare minimum above, let him go!


----------



## Lilac23

lanajade33 said:


> Of course now.
> 
> My husband came to the house today to get some of his things. While he was here he was very emotional and said that after our counseling appointment he realizes that he still sees potential in our marriage even though he feels that we are currently not "in love". He said he still feels it is possible to get it back because he thinks about me the majority of the time he is away. He now wants to know if while he is out if of the house if I would consider spending time with him without the kids, like meeting for coffee or dinner during the week. And that he would stop seeing the OW so we are able to decide if divorce is the right thing or if we should consider reconciling.
> 
> I am now officially more confused than ever in my life. I just spent so much time emotionally preparing myself for separation and now I don't know what to feel.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Don't stop preparing yourself for separation based on one conversation, actions speak louder than words. Something that you may want to keep in mind is that often in these situations, once the dust has settled and you are back together a lot of anger comes out at the way you have been treated. Is that something you could handle? And knowing that he has done this once, are you prepared for the possibility in could happen again? Can you ever trust him again? Look at the kind of person he is, honestly, and decide if that is someone you want to be with. 

He needs to do most of the work in the relationship, right now, because he is the one that f*cked up. You are not the one that went outside the relationship, he did. Offering to quit seeing other people isn't that magnanimous of him once you're married. 

Is changing jobs an option for him? Where would he be staying while he is gone? What's going to change in your relationship? What led to him seeing the other woman in the first place? How is he going to prove you can trust him? You need to ask yourself and him all of these questions. Just because he throws you a bone and squeezes out a few tears doesn't negate everything that has happened. How many tears have you cried since he 'found himself' in another woman's bed?

I am not saying you should never get back with him, but you need to make sure he works for it. If you don't, you'll find yourself in the same situation a few years down the road. You still need to be strong and show him that you _can and will_ survive without him. Look how much he has changed since you started to get a backbone! You need to keep your power here and not give it up again.


----------



## lanajade33

NWCooper said:


> If he truly wants to reconcile your marriage ( if you are willing ) he needs to be home every night and diligently working on earning your trust back and continuing with counciling. With him living elsewhere half the time and then wanting to "date" you, it's as if you are auditioning for the role of wife along with that other tramp. And he decides who wins.





frusdil said:


> PLUS
> 
> THAT HE'S QUITTING HIS JOB.


I know. And he wasn't even committing, just saying he wanted to decide together whether or not we move forward with divorce or commit to reconciliation. 

I told him that i couldn't answer him right then and that I'd still want him to stay out of the house for now, and also did mention that i know he'd still be seeing her at work.

He said he will start right now looking for another job.

He also said he made us another counseling appointment for next week.

Then after he left he sent a text asking if I'd go to the movies with him one night this week.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## lanajade33

There's no way I would have him call her in front of me. I'd lose my sh!t. If somehow we are to come to a decision of reconciliation, I will definitely make him write a letter and post it here for you guys to review.

But I honestly don't know if that's going to even come to that. Seeing him cry really tugs at my heart, but like some people already said here, maybe that's what he's trying to do.

Maybe I'll never really trust him, even if I want to believe I could.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## TheTruthHurts

To the movie - "no"

Nothing more.

All these other things BEFORE anything else.

Also - these should be inalterable demands on your part. Then and only then, you will begin to evaluate what you need before you CONSIDER reconciliation.

Movies - that's denial and rug-sweeping.

I don't think he has the character to be open, honest and even considerate enough to warrant an attempt at R


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## TheTruthHurts

By all these things - I meant the things other TAM member stipulated before considering R


----------



## EleGirl

lanajade33 said:


> I know. And he wasn't even committing, just saying he wanted to decide together whether or not we move forward with divorce or commit to reconciliation.
> 
> I told him that i couldn't answer him right then and that I'd still want him to stay out of the house for now, and also did mention that i know he'd still be seeing her at work.
> 
> He said he will start right now looking for another job.
> 
> He also said he made us another counseling appointment for next week.
> 
> *Then after he left he sent a text asking if I'd go to the movies with him one night this week*.


I hope you are not going to go to a movie with him. This would be rewarding him and feeding into his cake eating.

You are worth a lot more than what he is offering you at this point. He needs to do a lot of work before you should be giving him the time of day. 

He is still trying to have both you and the other woman. 

.


----------



## EleGirl

lanajade33 said:


> There's no way I would have him call her in front of me. I'd lose my sh!t. If somehow we are to come to a decision of reconciliation, I will definitely make him write a letter and post it here for you guys to review.


IMHO, it would be very disrespectful to you to have to be in on such a phone call.

The reason for the no contact letter is that any in person or phone no contact "meeting" just gives the cheating spouse and their affair partner another chance to talk about their feelings for each other. So it seldom ends an affair. Only leads to the need for yet another phone call or another in-person meeting.



lanajade33 said:


> But I honestly don't know if that's going to even come to that. Seeing him cry really tugs at my heart, but like some people already said here, maybe that's what he's trying to do.
> 
> Maybe I'll never really trust him, even if I want to believe I could.


It take a lot of work on his part to prove that he could be trusted. He seem to be a very manipulative person. Is that his normal way of being towards you?


----------



## lanajade33

EleGirl said:


> I hope you are not going to go to a movie with him. This would be rewarding him and feeding into his cake eating.
> 
> You are worth a lot more than what he is offering you at this point. He needs to do a lot of work before you should be giving him the time of day.
> 
> He is still trying to have both you and the other woman.
> 
> .


I told him I'm not going to the movies with him. But that I will go to the counseling appointment with him next week.

I definitely need to see him make an effort, and prove something to me... because the more I think about it, the more I feel like he's doing things he knows will play on my sympathy and good nature in order for him to try to maintain what he has going on.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## lanajade33

EleGirl said:


> It take a lot of work on his part to prove that he could be trusted. He seem to be a very manipulative person. Is that his normal way of being towards you?


That's the thing! He's never been close to this way towards me. Never manipulative at all. He was always the type to go out of his way to be kind to me, surprise me with something if I wasn't feeling well, give me a card just because, stop by my job on his way home to bring me coffee. A real sweetheart and a gentleman. I've known him 10 years.

Now that's not to say I haven't caught him in lies, with his manic episodes there's been issues. But I always tried to be understanding and never held it against him.

Unless it's possible that I've just had blinders on for a decade 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Hopeful Cynic

lanajade33 said:


> Unless it's possible that I've just had blinders on for a decade


Well, I had blinders on, or at least rose coloured glasses on, for my whole marriage, so yeah, it's possible.

For this reconciliation to have a chance, he needs to be 100% remorseful, of his own volition, because he's realized his mistake. He needs to cut off contact with the other woman, including changing jobs, and do whatever is needed to earn your trust back. He has to think of these things on his own, not because you or a marriage counsellor told him they were important.

Do you think he's telling you what he thinks you want to hear, or telling you honestly what he thinks and feels?

Here's a great site you shouldn't let him see. Real Remorse? Or Genuine Imitation Naugahyde Remorse? - ChumpLady.com


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## EleGirl

lanajade33 said:


> That's the thing! He's never been close to this way towards me. Never manipulative at all. He was always the type to go out of his way to be kind to me, surprise me with something if I wasn't feeling well, give me a card just because, stop by my job on his way home to bring me coffee. A real sweetheart and a gentleman. I've known him 10 years.
> 
> Now that's not to say I haven't caught him in lies, with his manic episodes there's been issues. But I always tried to be understanding and never held it against him.
> 
> Unless it's possible that I've just had blinders on for a decade


Yes it is possible that you have had blinders on for a decade.

That is what 'being in love' does to us. Our body/brain produces and uptakes a lot of oxytocin when we are 'in love'. That is the hormone that makes us feel attached to someone and in love. It is also called the amnesia hormone. Why? Well it's the one a woman's body puts out by the bucket load when they give birth. That's why women do not really recall the depth of the pain of child birth. Oxytocin keeps us in lala land... we see our mate through rose colored glasses.

Men's bodies produce it too, mostly during sex. Which is why a lot of sex is good in marriage. It's also produced when a couple does a lot of non-sexual bonding.. like talking, snuggling, etc. It keeps the couple bonded and in love. And it makes them not see each other's flaws quite as clearly.

It's pretty easy to tell when a couple has lost their bond. For example after they have stopped spending a lot of time together and the sex falls off. Then the oxytocin levels fall. At that point we see people who complain about everything their spouse does. They start to see the flaws. and we see both men and women not want sex with their partner. When oxytocin gets really low, people do not want their partner to touch them. The rose colored glasses are off at that point.


----------



## sapientia

lanajade33 said:


> *I told him I'm not going to the movies with him. But that I will go to the counseling appointment with him next week.*
> 
> I definitely need to see him make an effort, and prove something to me... because *the more I think about it, the more I feel like he's doing things he knows will play on my sympathy and good nature in order for him to try to maintain what he has going on.*
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


You got it right on both counts. If he wants you, now he has to WORK for it. I hope for your sake he makes the effort, but if not, you seem like a very decent, worthy woman so don't worry. There will be plenty of decent men interested in you should you decide to divorce.

Good luck and stay strong. I've been there; you will be just fine.


----------



## lucy999

Hopeful Cynic said:


> Real Remorse? Or Genuine Imitation Naugahyde Remorse? - ChumpLady.com


YES. Chump Lady can help you put things in perspective real quick. She cuts through all the BS your H is doing and saying.

I think you would be wise to quit doing the pick-me dance. It's not your H's decision to make. It's yours, all yours.

He's got it made! He's a cake-eater galore.


----------



## jelly_bean

Sorry to jump in late on this one, I have been off TAM for a few months. I don't want to say all people are the same but your spouse might be my STBXH twin! I feel your husband might have narcissist personality disorder, he can be charming and loving, but selfish at the same time. He worries the most about what others think of him and worst of all he will NEVER have the ability to feel empathy.

Have you ever discussed a possibility of a personality disorder with your MC without him present? I would suggest you get a professional opinion, if you are dealing with a personality disorder then you really need to educate yourself.

I have been living on my own for over 12 months and my STBXH still does the same things your spouse does, try to plan family trips and events, ask me to go out, and basically keeping in arms reach in case somehow I lose my mind and want to come back, all while still in contact will the initial OW. He met two more while we were separated but reconciling and he is still in contact with them as well. He sees nothing wrong with it and because of his NPD he never will.

Good luck!


----------



## Lilac23

lanajade33 said:


> I know. And he wasn't even committing, just saying he wanted to decide together whether or not we move forward with divorce or commit to reconciliation.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I totally hate all those f#cking facebook quotes like 'if you can't handle me at my worst then you don't deserve me at my best'. But! This one is totally relevant here. Never make someone a priority when all you are to them is an option.― Maya Angelou


----------



## lanajade33

jelly_bean said:


> Sorry to jump in late on this one, I have been off TAM for a few months. I don't want to say all people are the same but your spouse might be my STBXH twin! I feel your husband might have narcissist personality disorder, he can be charming and loving, but selfish at the same time. He worries the most about what others think of him and worst of all he will NEVER have the ability to feel empathy.
> 
> Have you ever discussed a possibility of a personality disorder with your MC without him present? I would suggest you get a professional opinion, if you are dealing with a personality disorder then you really need to educate yourself.
> 
> I have been living on my own for over 12 months and my STBXH still does the same things your spouse does, try to plan family trips and events, ask me to go out, and basically keeping in arms reach in case somehow I lose my mind and want to come back, all while still in contact will the initial OW. He met two more while we were separated but reconciling and he is still in contact with them as well. He sees nothing wrong with it and because of his NPD he never will.
> 
> Good luck!


Is it something that comes and goes? It does describe how he's been recently but not how he's always been. How can anyone possibly live with some one like that long term??

I thought about seeing the MC without him a bit ago, but now not even sure if it's worth it.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## always_hopefull

lanajade33 said:


> Is it something that comes and goes? It does describe how he's been recently but not how he's always been. How can anyone possibly live with some one like that long term??
> 
> I thought about seeing the MC without him a bit ago, but now not even sure if it's worth it.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Your H is already diagnosed as Bipolar, this will be your life if you stay with him, broke, and trying to convince yourself he loves you. What you really need to do is love yourself enough to know when is enough. Remember your settings example for your daughter, what would you tell her to do?

My suggestion, get into a support group asap for families of BPD. learn how to heal from those who know.


----------



## Tito Santana

lanajade33 said:


> Is it something that comes and goes? It does describe how he's been recently but not how he's always been. How can anyone possibly live with some one like that long term??
> 
> I thought about seeing the MC without him a bit ago, but now not even sure if it's worth it.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Lana,

I just read the whole thread. Sorry this is happening to you. When I read these threads on TAM, I'm constantly amazed (in a bad way) of what people do to loved ones, or people they should love. It's very early in the year, but I'd say your H is comfortably in the lead for the POS of the year award. It's crazy cake eating and manipulation in seeing how his words to you are juxtaposed with his actual actions and how he is treating you. I'm glad that you are seeing this now and acting accordingly. You deserve a hell of a lot better than what he can provide, even if he does eventually come to his senses.


----------



## jelly_bean

lanajade33 said:


> Is it something that comes and goes? It does describe how he's been recently but not how he's always been. How can anyone possibly live with some one like that long term??
> 
> I thought about seeing the MC without him a bit ago, but now not even sure if it's worth it.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


There is triggers for sure so people like that me that lived with him for years adjust to avoid the triggers. MAJOR RUGSWEEPING! I lived like I was always walking on egg shells. He wasn't violent per say but quick to anger and great at pushing blame to others. The best way to describe it is he would get mad at your for being mad at him even if you are fully justified. And the silent treatments were horrifically painful.

That being said when he was content and getting what he wanted, which was really the first 5 years of our marriage, he was much easier to live with. Then he convinced me to start a business, and it all went downhill. I finally found my voice and he didn't like it so full on NPD behavior kicked in. Didn't take long for him to cheat and of course blame me for that. Once he figured out he could get the narcissist supply fulfilled outside the house he just kept doing it. Twice during our so called R.

I am still trying to detach from him but it is very hard. They can be so charming and loving and yet poisonous. Truly the wolf in sheep's clothing.

He is just so different from me, I think way to much about other's happiness and feeling whereas he can not. His brain is not wired that way.


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## lanajade33

jelly_bean said:


> There is triggers for sure so people like that me that lived with him for years adjust to avoid the triggers. MAJOR RUGSWEEPING! I lived like I was always walking on egg shells. He wasn't violent per say but quick to anger and great at pushing blame to others. The best way to describe it is he would get mad at your for being mad at him even if you are fully justified. And the silent treatments were horrifically painful.
> 
> That being said when he was content and getting what he wanted, which was really the first 5 years of our marriage, he was much easier to live with. Then he convinced me to start a business, and it all went downhill. I finally found my voice and he didn't like it so full on NPD behavior kicked in. Didn't take long for him to cheat and of course blame me for that. Once he figured out he could get the narcissist supply fulfilled outside the house he just kept doing it. Twice during our so called R.
> 
> I am still trying to detach from him but it is very hard. They can be so charming and loving and yet poisonous. Truly the wolf in sheep's clothing.
> 
> He is just so different from me, I think way to much about other's happiness and feeling whereas he can not. His brain is not wired that way.


Oh wow. Everything you're saying resonates with me because it sounds just like us. My H is already diagnosed bipolar, but this could very well be present also. 

Very sad. I'm so sorry that this happened to you as well.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## EleGirl

Lana,

How are you doing? Is your husband still bugging you, or has he been leaving you along since you had him move out?


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## lanajade33

EleGirl said:


> Lana,
> 
> How are you doing? Is your husband still bugging you, or has he been leaving you along since you had him move out?


I'm a mess. Honestly, I feel like I'm on this tortuous emotional roller coaster. I've had super strong moments that I'm proud of and a few weak ones that I'm not proud of. 

He's still bugging me as in texting me "sweetheart" "baby" "I love you"

He made us another counseling appointment for next Tuesday. I told him I'll go but I'd like to discuss something productive like how to tell the kids, or move forward with visitation, or preserving my relationship with his son who I love so dearly. 

My husband maintains that he still thinks about me constantly, however is still talking to the OW.. So it's very clear he wants to keep eating cake, and is trying his best to get back to that place.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Lilac23

lanajade33 said:


> I'm a mess. Honestly, I feel like I'm on this tortuous emotional roller coaster. I've had super strong moments that I'm proud of and a few weak ones that I'm not proud of.


Are you taking care of yourself, eating, sleeping, getting some exercise, talking to family or friends?



lanajade33 said:


> He's still bugging me as in texting me "sweetheart" "baby" "I love you"


Thinks he can sweet talk you.



lanajade33 said:


> He made us another counseling appointment for next Tuesday.


Where's he spending the weekend? There's not much point in counseling until he cuts off all contact with OW.




lanajade33 said:


> My husband maintains that he still thinks about me constantly, however is still talking to the OW.. So it's very clear he wants to keep eating cake, and is trying his best to get back to that place.


Actions, not words, are what you need to listen to.


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## JohnA

Lana,

How you handle yourself though this will define you. Accept you could not stop him from acting as he has. You can control how you can react to it. Imagine a husband who had experienced what you are currently. Ask yourself what did he do that impressed you. What did he do that his children think of what he said and did. Ask your self how these actions showed, self respect, strength of chacter, great resolve, and an absolute rejection of allowing his ex-wife to demean him. 

From the moment you wake up till you sit down to dinner consider every reponse in light of the behavior and actions you admired by this imaginary man. Judge yourself harshly though the day always demanding of yourself to live up ton those goals. But once dinner hits the table let it all go. Tell yourself Rome was not built in a day, and there a time and place for this tell yourself tomorrow in the shower is soon enough to begin again. Be kind to yourself in the evening and embrace your children and the joy of life.


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## lanajade33

Lilac23 said:


> Are you taking care of yourself, eating, sleeping, getting some exercise, talking to family or friends?
> 
> 
> 
> Thinks he can sweet talk you.
> 
> 
> 
> Where's he spending the weekend? There's not much point in counseling until he cuts off all contact with OW.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Actions, not words, are what you need to listen to.


I'm doing better this month than I was before. December I lost 12 lbs, wasn't sleeping or talking to anyone. Now I'm doing much better with that and having my mom to talk to has been huge. As well as everyone's words and advice on here.

I am not sure where he is spending the weekend. He said he will be here Friday night but I don't know if he meant he's stopping by or staying. That's the night he asked me to go to the movies with him...

Last night was our daughters school concert. So he came and sat by me and put his arm around me. I wanted to cry. But I just forced myself not to react at all, plus we were in an auditorium full of teachers, parents and students.

I agree that going to MC seems pointless now. I don't even know if I will want to go if he were to agree to cut off the OW. I just don't think I could believe him.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## JohnA

Keep moving forward Lana. Keep asking yourself as each event occurs "how would the person I want to be respond". 

Did you ever truly expose to anyone besides your mother? I think this link explains why it is necessary to do so, Exposure 101 - Your Most Powerful Weapon - Marriage Builders® Forums


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## happy as a clam

Tito Santana said:


> It's very early in the year, but I'd say your H is *comfortably in the lead* for the POS of the year award.


Amen to that!


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## AVR1962

jelly_bean said:


> There is triggers for sure so people like that me that lived with him for years adjust to avoid the triggers. MAJOR RUGSWEEPING! I lived like I was always walking on egg shells. He wasn't violent per say but quick to anger and great at pushing blame to others. The best way to describe it is he would get mad at your for being mad at him even if you are fully justified. And the silent treatments were horrifically painful.
> 
> That being said when he was content and getting what he wanted, which was really the first 5 years of our marriage, he was much easier to live with. Then he convinced me to start a business, and it all went downhill. I finally found my voice and he didn't like it so full on NPD behavior kicked in. Didn't take long for him to cheat and of course blame me for that. Once he figured out he could get the narcissist supply fulfilled outside the house he just kept doing it. Twice during our so called R.
> 
> I am still trying to detach from him but it is very hard. They can be so charming and loving and yet poisonous. Truly the wolf in sheep's clothing.
> 
> He is just so different from me, I think way to much about other's happiness and feeling whereas he can not. His brain is not wired that way.


Your husband will not be any different with his new prize. That charming person you fell in love with will soon be that cold person you described with this woman too. Yes, we adapt in the marriage, we accept, we try to make the best of our situations but in this case he has made a choice. I know how hard it is but in the long run of this you will be ever so thankful that he made this choice. I seriously doubt that this new love will work out and when it falls apart your husband very likely will be calling you up and being all sweet again. Lady, men like this repeat themselves over and over again. I honestly do not think they know what love is. If you look back at your marriage, seriously look at your 8 years together....can you see it was more sexually oriented and you trying to please him?? You deserve more. You deserve someone who loves you for who you are, not someone who uses the same line on every lady that crosses his path and pays attention to him.


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## Lilac23

lanajade33 said:


> I'm doing better this month than I was before. December I lost 12 lbs, wasn't sleeping or talking to anyone. Now I'm doing much better with that and having my mom to talk to has been huge. As well as everyone's words and advice on here.
> 
> I am not sure where he is spending the weekend. He said he will be here Friday night but I don't know if he meant he's stopping by or staying. That's the night he asked me to go to the movies with him...


I lost 15 pounds the first three weeks, breakup diet! Did he come by on Friday?



lanajade33 said:


> Last night was our daughters school concert. So he came and sat by me and put his arm around me. I wanted to cry. But I just forced myself not to react at all, plus we were in an auditorium full of teachers, parents and students.


This is good! Controlling yourself in front of him is key, let it all out later when you're alone or with someone you can trust but in front of him you are Fort Knox. He's just not someone you can trust right now, he does not have your best interests at heart, only his. Do you watch The Bachelor? It's amazing the crazy sh!t women will do to get five minutes of some mediocre dude's time! And the guys know it too, they enjoy and get it off on it but they don't respect it. It might be a fun way to distract yourself too, lol!



lanajade33 said:


> I agree that going to MC seems pointless now. I don't even know if I will want to go if he were to agree to cut off the OW. I just don't think I could believe him.


This was totally my issue too! If he did it once, what's to stop him from doing it again? And what would it say about me if I got back with someone who could do this to me in the first place? It actually made me sick to think about getting back together after that.


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## EleGirl

Hi Lana.. just checking in with your. Hope you are ok.


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## Adelais

lanajade33 said:


> I'm doing better this month than I was before. December I lost 12 lbs, wasn't sleeping or talking to anyone. Now I'm doing much better with that and having my mom to talk to has been huge. As well as everyone's words and advice on here.
> 
> I am not sure where he is spending the weekend. He said he will be here Friday night but I don't know if he meant he's stopping by or staying. That's the night he asked me to go to the movies with him...
> 
> Last night was our daughters school concert.* So he came and sat by me and put his arm around me*. I wanted to cry. But I just forced myself not to react at all, plus we were in an auditorium full of teachers, parents and students.
> 
> I agree that going to MC seems pointless now. I don't even know if I will want to go if he were to agree to cut off the OW. I just don't think I could believe him.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I'm glad you are dong better this month than last month. You definitely sound stronger by the things you are thinking and writing.

The next time he enters into your physical space, get him out, or get yourself out. It wouldn't have been super obvious to everyone if you had removed his arm from around your shoulders with one sweeping move immediately after he put his arm around you. You have the right to tell him that you are both on the path to divorce, and physical touch is no longer appropriate or comfortable for you. 

You really will feel better if you have your own personal space and it is not violated by him, when you know what he is doing on the side.

Your idea of no longer going to counseling might be wise. Really all you and he need to be talking about are 1. the conditions of the divorce and separation of property, and 2. visitation of the children.


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## lanajade33

EleGirl said:


> Hi Lana.. just checking in with your. Hope you are ok.


I'm doing ok. Still up and down. He spent the entire weekend at the house. Brought me coffee and all his usual sweet talk continues... He slept in a separate room but t said Friday night he heard me crying in my sleep. I don't remember having a bad dream or anything, but he swears he heard me. He's still asking me to go to the next counseling appointment which he had scheduled for tomorrow after work.... But he's not saying anything else about our situation, like if he has cut ties with OW. I didn't even ask. Part of me doesn't even care.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Lilac23

lanajade33 said:


> He slept in a separate room but t said Friday night he heard me crying in my sleep. I don't remember having a bad dream or anything, but he swears he heard me.


Did he wake you up or try to comfort you? If not, it may be bullsh!t.


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## EleGirl

Lana,

I think that it's a hardship for you to have him around at all. 

Have you considered talking to an attorney and see what you can do about getting him out of there? It is definitely a wakeup call that he needs.

From what you have said, he still slept in the master bedroom and let you go sleep somewhere else. This shows an arrogance on his part that is basically narcissism How he can make you sleep anywhere but your own bed is beyond reality. There is something profoundly wrong with him.

If you do end up going to counseling with him. I think you need to tell the counselor, in front of him that you asked him to leave the master bedroom because of his cheating and his response was to kick you out of the bedroom.


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## lanajade33

Lilac23 said:


> Did he wake you up or try to comfort you? If not, it may be bullsh!t.


He did wake me up and try to comfort me, but i just couldn't remember what I was dreaming.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## lanajade33

EleGirl said:


> Lana,
> 
> I think that it's a hardship for you to have him around at all.
> 
> Have you considered talking to an attorney and see what you can do about getting him out of there? It is definitely a wakeup call that he needs.
> 
> From what you have said, he still slept in the master bedroom and let you go sleep somewhere else. This shows an arrogance on his part that is basically narcissism How he can make you sleep anywhere but your own bed is beyond reality. There is something profoundly wrong with him.
> 
> If you do end up going to counseling with him. I think you need to tell the counselor, in front of him that you asked him to leave the master bedroom because of his cheating and his response was to kick you out of the bedroom.


_Posted via Mobile Device_

He did initially say that he wouldn't leave our room, so that first night I just took the guest room to avoid him. After that I put a lock on the spare room and made it my own, and told him I actually prefer sleeping in there now. I get better sleep in there being out of the bedroom and bed we shared. He still tries to get me to lay and cuddle with him in our room though. 

As far as the counseling, the MC told him last time that he wouldn't be able to counsel us if he continues to see another person. He told my husband it would be inevitable that counseling would fail because it would take 100% cease of contact with OW and 110% of his effort on our relationship, which he couldn't possibly give with a third party involved.


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## happy as a clam

lanajade33 said:


> He did initially say that he wouldn't leave our room, so that first night I just took the guest room to avoid him. After that I put a lock on the spare room and made it my own, and told him I actually prefer sleeping in there now. I get better sleep in there being out of the bedroom and bed we shared.


Regardless of which room you prefer, EleGirl is right. You still need to mention it to the counselor so he can get an accurate picture of how arrogant, self-serving, and narcissistic your husband is.

And listen to the counselor. It is pointless to try to fix this while the other woman is still in the picture. Time to visit a lawyer.


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## Adelais

lanajade33 said:


> _Posted via Mobile Device_
> As far as the counseling, the MC told him last time that he wouldn't be able to counsel us if he continues to see another person. He told my husband it would be inevitable that counseling would fail because it would take 100% cease of contact with OW and 110% of his effort on our relationship, which he couldn't possibly give with a third party involved.


Sounds like you have a good counselor. Perhaps you should you go one more time and tell the counselor about the sleeping situation. At least he should trade bedrooms with you until you are able to get him out of the apartment all together.

Even if he stops seeing OW, you shouldn't sleep (have sex) with him until he has had STD testing. HIV takes 6 months to a year to show up on a test. It would be easier to not have sex with him if you don't share a bed, and he should be the one to sleep in the smaller room until he is officially disease free.

Hang in there Lana. You are doing great.


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## Adelais

lanajade33 said:


> I'm doing ok. Still up and down. He spent the entire weekend at the house. He's still asking me to go to the next counseling appointment which he had scheduled for tomorrow after work.... But he's not saying anything else about our situation, like if he has cut ties with OW.* I didn't even ask. Part of me doesn't even care.*
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


The red part is a good sign that you are getting stronger. Keep finding your self respect and take care of yourself.


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## Lilac23

lanajade33 said:


> _Posted via Mobile Device_
> 
> He did initially say that he wouldn't leave our room, so that first night I just took the guest room to avoid him. After that I put a lock on the spare room and made it my own, and told him I actually prefer sleeping in there now. I get better sleep in there being out of the bedroom and bed we shared. He still tries to get me to lay and cuddle with him in our room though.
> 
> As far as the counseling, the MC told him last time that he wouldn't be able to counsel us if he continues to see another person. He told my husband it would be inevitable that counseling would fail because it would take 100% cease of contact with OW and 110% of his effort on our relationship, which he couldn't possibly give with a third party involved.


Lots of therapists wont continue to work with an addict unless the addict is at least trying to maintain sobriety, there's really no point. You can't be fully immersed in one world if you're trying to keep your foot halfway in another one. How do you feel about filing for divorce? It may give him a wake-up call that he can't continue to string both of you along and needs to sh!t or get off the pot.


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## cma62

@lanajade33
Has anybody heard how Lana is doing??


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