# Should I Stay or Should I Go?



## Sasquatch71 (Feb 6, 2015)

My wife does a lot of things that hurt my feelings. I won't relate the whole history, but it has come to a head this week. She is on business travel for the week. I have asked her to give me her return flight info so that I can pick her up at the airport. I also sent her an email telling her how much I love her and asking her if she would take my hand and recommit to our marriage and being happy in our marriage. She never responded to that email and she never gave me her flight information. I know she is busy on this trip. But yesterday, she called me and told me that she had the afternoon free, from 3:00 through the evening. When I woke up this morning, she still hadn't responded to my email and she still hadn't given me her flight information. She flies back tonight. I sent her an email telling her that it hurt my feelings that she didn't respond to my email, especially when she had the afternoon free. She called me this morning and yelled at me. She told me that my feelings always have to come first and that I don't have any respect for her and her work schedule. I actually thought I did a good job of being respectful. My email to her even said that I didn't want to make a big deal of this but that I wanted to share my feelings. She yelled at me. I actually know I should get out of this marriage, but divorce is so hard. What do you, the internet world, think I should do?


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

What should you do? Start by reading "No More Mr Nice Guy" and "Married Man's Sex Life Primer". 

C


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## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

Sasquatch71 said:


> What do you, the internet world, think I should do?



Tell her to take a cab.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

You sound needy and whiney. If you talk like this to your wife I doubt she has any respect for you. Download the mmslp book linked to below . No more mister nice guy can be downloaded from the Internet for free, google it.

Are you a stay at home dad?


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## Sasquatch71 (Feb 6, 2015)

I'm not a stay at home dad. But I am a "Nice Guy". I appreciate the recommendations. Some of them look promising. I wonder if I can effectuate a change within the framework of my marriage or if I'm going to have to start from scratch.


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## Married but Happy (Aug 13, 2013)

Don't pick her up at the airport, for starters. If she hasn't given you the information by now, tell her to take a cab if she calls. You're busy. While you're waiting, read NMMNG that PBear suggested. You can buy it on amazon or google for a free pdf download.


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

Sasquatch71 said:


> I'm not a stay at home dad. But I am a "Nice Guy". I appreciate the recommendations. Some of them look promising. I wonder if I can effectuate a change within the framework of my marriage or if I'm going to have to start from scratch.


Your focus shouldn't be on saving the marriage or making her happy. It should be in making YOU the best you can be. It might be your current wife who benefits from it, it might be wife 2.0.

Hows the ol' sex life? 

C


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## happy as a clam (Jan 5, 2014)

Text her this:

Yellow Cab 444-4444


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Sasquatch71 said:


> My wife does a lot of things that *hurt my feelings*. I won't relate the whole history, but it has come to a head this week. She is on business travel for the week. I have *asked her to give me her return flight info *so that I can pick her up at the airport. I also sent her an *email telling her how much I love her* and *asking her if she would take my hand and recommit to our marriage** and being happy *in our marriage. She never responded to that email and she never gave me her flight information. I know she is busy on this trip. But yesterday, she called me and told me that she had the afternoon free, from 3:00 through the evening. When I woke up this morning, she still hadn't responded to my email and she still hadn't given me her flight information. She flies back tonight. I sent her an email telling her that *it hurt my feelings* that she didn't respond to my email, especially when she had the afternoon free. She called me this morning and yelled at me. She told me that my feelings always have to come first and that I don't have any respect for her and her work schedule. I actually thought I did a good job of being respectful. My email to her even *said that I didn't want to make a big deal of this* but that I wanted to *share my feelings*. She yelled at me. I actually know I should get out of this marriage, but divorce is so hard. What do you, the internet world, think I should do?


I would have yelled at you too. You sound like a 12 year old boy with his first girlfriend.

Women don't date boys. They date men. Confident, aggressive, self-respecting men. Men don't ask permission. Men don't say they don't want to make a big deal. They certainly NEVER say 'you hurt my feelings.'

Women have to respect their man. If they don't, they get angry, they ignore, they walk all over him, and they either cheat on him or leave him. You're probably getting ALL of that. 

The two books listed above are your only real hope. Get them TODAY and start reading.


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## DoF (Mar 27, 2014)

#1 - don't talk about ANYTHING important over email. Face to Face

#2 - if you feel that this marriage is worthless, get the hell out of there ASAP. Yes, it won't be easy, NOTHING is. But fear of ANY of that should not stop you.

#3 - She comes off like one of those "way too into her job" type of people. I have a feeling her job is a priority over her marriage (just a feeling I get).

It's hard to say "you should divorce" her based on what you wrote. Actually, I would say no, you should not divorce her because she didn't reply to your email right away or yelled at you (those are minor).....but you should divorce her if you feel that marriage is worthless and brings 0 value to your life/you are miserable.

Read : we need more detail about issues


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## DoF (Mar 27, 2014)

Sasquatch71 said:


> I'm not a stay at home dad. But I am a "Nice Guy". I appreciate the recommendations. Some of them look promising. I wonder if I can effectuate a change within the framework of my marriage or if I'm going to have to start from scratch.


Personally, if you are a nice guy...I say don't change. 

If your loved one (or ANYONE) uses your niceness against you or takes advantage of you due to your niceness......RECOGNIZE THE PERSON IN FRONT OF YOU.

Those kinds of people are the worst people out there IMO. I use my niceness as a people **** filter. I simply separate myself from such people and complete isolate myself from them.



I don't believe in NOT Being nice to accommodate our ****ty society or crappy people. Ohh HELL no.


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## Red Sonja (Sep 8, 2012)

DoF said:


> Personally, if you are a nice guy...I say don't change.
> 
> If your loved one (or ANYONE) uses your niceness against you or takes advantage of you due to your niceness......RECOGNIZE THE PERSON IN FRONT OF YOU.
> 
> ...


Like X 1000

Realize that there are people who do not deserve your "niceness" and act accordingly.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Here is the thing about being a 'nice guy'. The term "nice guy" is often used to describe a man who does what appears to be something 'nice' on the surface. But they are really passive aggressive acts. Over time the wife learns that they are passive aggressive acts.. hence her ignoring the email and not responding to it.

Asking her via email if she would take your hand and recommit is that is called a "sh!t test". If she answered anything less than an very enthusiastically, gushy "Yes, oh yes you are the love of my life" type answer she's in trouble. My bet is that she did not answer because he does not appreciate being backing into a corner with an email that forces her to gush with butterflies and unicorn.

If you are not happy with your marriage, you can bet she is not either. It does not mean that she does not love you. It means that a truthful answer to your email would come out as less than butterflies and unicorns and then you will say that she's not loving, etc etc.

My bet is that she's learned to not play your sh!t test game.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

You are confusing being a Nice Guy with being a decent human being. The Nice Guy mantle is given to men who subjugate themselves in the naive hope that it will make their wives want them more. Is it ok, would you mind, you hurt my feelings...by themselves they are innocuous. In the situation described, it is needy and whiny and NOT self-assured and won't attract anyone.


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## Happilymarried25 (Mar 19, 2014)

How long have you been married? Do you two have children together? Does she make more money than you? I notice that some women who are *****y to their husband tend to make more money than them and not respect them. If you don't have children and feel you are always being disrespected then leave. If you do have children then maybe think about counseling.


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## DoF (Mar 27, 2014)

PS. I like The Clash


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## Basic"FairyDust"Love (Nov 19, 2014)

Chaparral said:


> You sound needy and whiney. If you talk like this to your wife I doubt she has any respect for you. Download the mmslp book linked to below . No more mister nice guy can be downloaded from the Internet for free, google it.
> 
> Are you a stay at home dad?





turnera said:


> I would have yelled at you too. You sound like a 12 year old boy with his first girlfriend.
> 
> Women don't date boys. They date men. Confident, aggressive, self-respecting men. Men don't ask permission. Men don't say they don't want to make a big deal. They certainly NEVER say 'you hurt my feelings.'
> 
> ...


There was nothing wrong with his messages to his wife. His wife is the one that is wrong with her attitude.

I would suggest though that he pulls back more to protect himself emotionally if she keeps treating him like that.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Yeah, good luck with that.


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## BurningHeart (Dec 30, 2012)

You violated all of the "man" rules. You're not allowed to show emotions, hurt, fear, pain, sadness, sorrow and if you ever do, you are now labeled as needy, insecure and weak. You're supposed to act like you don't really give a crap, women seem to love that.
Nice guys finish last & I'm one too. It's a curse instead of a blessing.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

You guys keep on thinking that. 

Or, you could do some reading about the psychology behind why women want and need strong, confident men - and ignore, abuse, or grow to hate weak, unconfident men.


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## Basic"FairyDust"Love (Nov 19, 2014)

BurningHeart said:


> You violated all of the "man" rules. You're not allowed to show emotions, hurt, fear, pain, sadness, sorrow and if you ever do, you are now labeled as needy, insecure and weak. You're supposed to act like you don't really give a crap, women seem to love that.
> Nice guys finish last & I'm one too. It's a curse instead of a blessing.


I'm not one of those women.



turnera said:


> You guys keep on thinking that.
> 
> Or, you could do some reading about the psychology behind why women want and need strong, confident men - and ignore, abuse, or grow to hate weak, unconfident men.


I want a man with a good balance of vulnerability and strength. I want a man to express and show his love and care for me. I would appreciate a man wanting a happy marriage and wanting to know when to pick me up from the airport.


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

No more Mr Nice Guy should have been called "No More Doormat". There's a difference between being nice and getting walked over. Just like there's a difference between being "alpha" and being an ass hole. Gotta find the line... 

C


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## RoseAglow (Apr 11, 2013)

Hi Sasquatch71,

I travel on occasion for work. I get an impression similar to Ele's, which is to say she is not happy in the marriage either and basically isn't responding to your requests because they are male sh!t tests. You want her to show you that she loves you. She is not in love with you currently and isn't about to go into it via email.



Sasquatch71 said:


> My wife does a lot of things that hurt my feelings. I won't relate the whole history, but it has come to a head this week. She is on business travel for the week. *I have asked her to give me her return flight info so that I can pick her up at the airport.*


It is very nice of you to want her travel info and to be willing to pick her up from the airport. Did she ask you to pick her up, or are you just offering? If you're offering, there is no need to follow-up. She can get herself to and from the airport. If she is like me, I prefer to drive myself so that my options are fully open for departure/arrival. She also might just be trying to avoid you for as long as possible (sorry to say).

I am asking because she sounds like she is very much withdrawn from you. Personally I think it is very rude that she wouldn't give you her itinerary. I always email mine to my husband. That way if anything bad should happen- airplane crash, terrorist activity, earthquake etc. he'll know if I am on the plane/in the area etc. He will also know the approximate time to expect me home. Only a withdrawn spouse would not give the mate a heads up on these items.




> I also sent her an email telling her how much I love her and asking her if she would take my hand and recommit to our marriage and *being happy in our marriage*. She never responded to that email and she never gave me her flight information.


So the bold suggests that you realize she is not happy. 

That is a HUGE request over email. You just asked her to re-commit to you, even though you can see she isn't happy- that is a bad strategy to begin with. You should have a plan to offer about getting your marriage on track before you ask her to re-commit, otherwise what is she setting herself up for? More of the same? Plus, asking over email implies that you are either too afraid to ask her face to face or that you're desperate for some kind of validation from her RIGHT NOW. 

Either way, what are her options? It's not going to be Yes, because she is clearly not happy with you at the moment. It's not going to be No as God only knows that that would unleash from you-emails? Phone calls? Texts? Some kind of drama would likely ensue, right?



> know she is busy on this trip. But yesterday, she called me and told me that she had the afternoon free, from 3:00 through the evening.


If you spoke with her yesterday, why didn't you ask her for her flight info? Or did you ask and she said No? Did you follow up on your email about renewing her commitment? I ask because from the next quote, it sounds like you ducked these issues on the phone and instead resorted to email:



> When I woke up this morning, she still hadn't responded to my email and she still hadn't given me her flight information. She flies back tonight. * I sent her an email telling her that it hurt my feelings that she didn't respond to my email, especially when she had the afternoon free.* She called me this morning and yelled at me.


I want to be very clear that I think your wife is acting poorly in many ways. I think it is rude to not give you her itinerary. I think it is terrible behavior to yell at your spouse, barring an emergency like FIRE! DUCK! GRAB THE KID! etc.

Your behavior here is not good either. It was *extremely weak* to send an email complaining that she didn't respond to your first one. You spoke with her on the phone since you sent the first one, right? She did call you to spend some phone time, it's not like she ignored you entirely. AND you know she is returning tonight. Why not wait?




> She told me that my feelings always have to come first and that I don't have any respect for her and her work schedule. I actually thought I did a good job of being respectful. My email to her even said that* I didn't want to make a big deal of this but that I wanted to share my feelings.* She yelled at me. I actually know I should get out of this marriage, but divorce is so hard. What do you, the internet world, think I should do?


If you didn't want to make a big deal about it, why did you send a second email? Was there a precipitating issue that makes you need an answer right now? Or that requires that you need to make your feelings heard immediately? 

If not, then I tend to agree with her that you are not respecting her work. She is away on business. She spoke to you in the afternoon and then did whatever- hit the gym, caught up on her email, took a nap, got a mani/pedi. Who knows? It's rare to get real free time when away on business. Let her focus on her work while she is away, she will be home soon and can focus on you. 

Your posts and your emails make you sound like you were pestering her. 

I am sorry you are hurting so much. Your wife is not acting like a caring, loving spouse. She is angry and rejecting- and that hurts.

At the same time, it won't help you if you fall to pieces over it. You don't win any points or send a message like 'Look at how much I love you!' by becoming an emotional mess. 

When people are hurt by their loved one, it is a common, instinctual response to try to show them how much they are hurting you in an attempt to get them to stop. And some people do stop; but many don't. At that point, the appropriate response is to pull away a bit and get yourself some emotional protection. 

I agree with the other posters who are telling you to pull away a bit, get yourself together. Do some things that will make you feel better about yourself, like hit the gym.

I recommend that you search for MEM's temperature thread. You are the "hot" spouse right now; I think you'll find a lot more success if you find a way to cool down, stop smothering her, give her space.


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## norajane (Feb 7, 2012)

Sasquatch71 said:


> My wife does a lot of things that hurt my feelings. *I won't relate the whole history,* but it has come to a head this week. She is on business travel for the week. I have asked her to give me her return flight info so that I can pick her up at the airport. I also sent her an email telling her how much I love her and asking her if she would take my hand and recommit to our marriage and being happy in our marriage. She never responded to that email and she never gave me her flight information. I know she is busy on this trip. But yesterday, she called me and told me that she had the afternoon free, from 3:00 through the evening. When I woke up this morning, she still hadn't responded to my email and she still hadn't given me her flight information. She flies back tonight. I sent her an email telling her that it hurt my feelings that she didn't respond to my email, especially when she had the afternoon free. She called me this morning and yelled at me. *She told me that my feelings always have to come first and that I don't have any respect for her *and her work schedule. I actually thought I did a good job of being respectful. My email to her even said that I didn't want to make a big deal of this but that I wanted to share my feelings. She yelled at me. I actually know I should get out of this marriage, but divorce is so hard. What do you, the internet world, think I should do?


I suspect there is a *long *history of issues between you that led up to this. 

Is there truth to what she is saying - that your feelings always have to come first and you don't have any respect for her? If she is saying this, she must believe there is some truth to it. If so, no, she's not going to recommit by email when you two have resolved nothing.

We can't tell you what to do because this one exchange comes at the end of a long road to where you two are now. How and why you got there matters a lot more than this one incident when it comes to deciding to divorce.


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## Q tip (Apr 15, 2014)

Dude,

Read, reread, understand and memorize Married Man Sex Life Primer 2011 by Athol Kay. 

You are a classic beta. You think you're doing all the right things. You are doing precisely the wrong things. The book will seek to balance you. You have no alpha and have been completely betaized. 

EVERYTHING you've been taught about women is wrong. When you start reading the book, you will pull away and disagree. This is the blue pill, Neo. You need to take the red pill.

Some call it manning up. It's just finding your balance in a world of anti-testosterone indoctrination.

Before you get the book, the first chapters are about you getting your fat pasty white arse over to the gym and getting buf. Work out. With a vengeance. So take action now. Lift heavy weights. Free weights. Forget those weight machines for betas. Free weights. Just do the 6 or so basic exercises. 

No time? Bovine Excreta. Once you start working out,e verything else finds time anyway.

Read the book. Your life depends on it. Alpha up, dude. After a few months working out, the other ladies will start noticing you. Your W will notice the ladies noticing you. You'll gain confidence, grace, and start being a real man. Trust the process. 

My W sees other ladies checking me out now. She's not jealous, she likes that she picked a guy that other ladies notice. 

You have lots to learn. The book will help you identify and deal with the daily sh!t tests. With macho ease.

Up your sex rank, dude. Now. 

Just yesterday, my W told me how much she admires my V shape. She had that "smile" and knowing eyes on me. Time to ravish that wife of mine again...

Ok, time for you to read chapter two...


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