# Can A Long-Term Affair Really End?



## Calibre12 (Nov 27, 2012)

Found out husband had an secret 8 year "friendship that never got physical", even after I divorced him. I found out after the divorce. Based on what he told me before we remarried, it was clearly an EA, although he barely wants to admit that. They both said "Nothing happened..." I know that it was an affair. Question is can it really end and if so what would cause it to end?


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## old timer (Nov 23, 2012)

I'm in the process of ending a 5 yr PA now. 
Will it work? I truly do not know.

You remarried him w/ the knowledge the A was still in progress?


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## Calibre12 (Nov 27, 2012)

No. I remarried him after he told me the "friendship" ended. After finding this website and reading up on things, even realizing some of my actions and reactions were part of a natural process, seeing some stuff on his phone (encrypted mssgs now) etc., it may still be going on. My question is: Is it possible for one to end and why would it end?


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## Married in VA (Jan 6, 2012)

A long term affair is a relationship. After a while, it really ceases to be an affair and becomes a regular relationship. Like any other relationship, it can end.

Why does it end? Many reasons really. The partners finally realize the grass isn't greener on the other side. Since affairs are adulterous by their nature the lack of trust takes its toll. Cheaters are ALWAYS suspicious since they are cheating themselves. It only takes a little event to betray a cheater's trust. The reasons are really too numerous...


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## hotsthrnmess (Dec 5, 2012)

Yes, it can end, but when an affair becomes years-long, it's much harder to end it (from what I've seen). Basically, that affair becomes it's own long term relationship and just like a break-up with someone you're with for a while, it can be hard. Sounds discouraging, but if your WS is truly remorseful and serious about ending it and doing what it takes to mend the relationship, it's possible. As for why they might end it? Realizing what they're losing, exposure, the regular reasons an affair would end, I'd assume. I hope it works out for you, RR!


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## Calibre12 (Nov 27, 2012)

old timer said:


> I'm in the process of ending a 5 yr PA now.
> Will it work? I truly do not know.
> 
> You remarried him w/ the knowledge the A was still in progress?



Why did you or what caused you stay in it so long? Too, what makes it difficult for you to be decisive that it is over?


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## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

Why would a man choose to spend more than 8 years on a woman he couldn't have sex with? Were they exchanging recipes and dress designs?


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## Calibre12 (Nov 27, 2012)

unbelievable said:


> Why would a man choose to spend more than 8 years on a woman he couldn't have sex with? Were they exchanging recipes and dress designs?


Apparently so. Did I forget to mention OW is Jesus' sister too?


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## old timer (Nov 23, 2012)

RightfulRiskTaker said:


> Why did you or what caused you stay in it so long? Too, what makes it difficult for you to be decisive that it is over?


I really cannot answer those questions.
I'm still trying to figure it out myself.

But I will agree w/ *unbelievable* - what man would continue an 8 yr A w/o sex?


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## MrMathias (Nov 19, 2012)

Married in VA said:


> It only takes a little event to betray a cheater's trust.


I find this statement really intriguing. Seems to be true too- at least from my experience and the cheaters I've known.


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## daisygirl 41 (Aug 5, 2011)

Of course it can end, if he wants it too and if he actually admits to you and to himself that he is having an A! 
It can also end if the OW wants to end it!
Doesn't sound like there is any incentive for either of them to end it though. 
Just makes you wonder why he didnt hook up with her when you guys divorced. Is she married too?


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## canttrustu (Feb 22, 2012)

*"Apparently so. Did I forget to mention OW is Jesus' sister too? "*



they always are honey, they always are. Just as pure as the driven snow.....


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## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

RightfulRiskTaker said:


> Apparently so. Did I forget to mention OW is Jesus' sister too?


Maybe they both were partners in a unicorn ranch.


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## canttrustu (Feb 22, 2012)

unbelievable said:


> Maybe they both were partners in a unicorn ranch.


:lol:
I find it INCREDIBLY hard to believe that two adults who are attracted to each other and carried on an 8 yr relationship were NEVER physical......:scratchhead:


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## Calibre12 (Nov 27, 2012)

Daisygirl41: After the divorce, phone bills show numerous phone calls some 3 hours long with a few breaks, texts in early morning hours and the only one I did find 2 weeks after it was sent was from her to him at 5:15am saying "I am here". He said Mel was a new employee who came to pick him up that morning because his car broke down. I don't have more proof than this. They said "Nothing happened". DrMathias, a counselor, he and I called her and she acted blase, under her breath she said to him "You betrayed me maan". Sounds like they hooked up big time. He said she was telling him she was under the sheets with her legs spread apart/ one leg hanging off the bed, but he ended the conversation (blatant sex talk is his concept of flirting BTW). He tells me the only proof I have is phone bills which only show phone calls versus touching or meeting up. So the phone bills showed that they stopped talking for about 1 month. He said she had asked him if he was sleeping with anyone since the divorce and he told her me. He would not say if it was a question or statement when she said "No obligations". So, they did hook up it seems and she found out he was still "with" me. I didn't even know I was a player when she, the player, got played. She didn't like it. But the emotional investment between them is so great...Let's call it what it really is, the love relationship, that I think she came back to him during our reconciliation. I felt it in every part of my being, was too naiive to get to solid proof before we remarried...Not to mention I felt like I was in a daze when I found out...I was in a different kind of bewilderment fog. But I think they love each other. I think it's just that the societal ramifications of them making it permanent will be great since he apparently lied to me, his children, his family, my family, counselors and the church about it all.


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## RWB (Feb 6, 2010)

LTA ending?

Can't say for everyone... just what I learned from my wife's LT affairs when I caught her cheating. 

One was with her boss (principal). It lasted for over a year and half. It only stopped when he moved out of state. They had sex infrequently... but, remained in contact, at the gym, at work, emails as long as he was in town. I asked her did you ever stop the affair prior to him moving. In truth, she said no. He just lost interest when she quit having sex with him. She said they always remained "friends". 

Another with a HS friend from way back. This affair continued for for over 3 years. Initially they would meet for sex driving 150 miles round trip or when in the same town. She said after about 2 years she realized how stupid she was and all he wanted was the sex. She said it just fizzled out. However... I "recovered" deleted Office *.pst files and her memory was somewhat distorted. She told me that she quit corresponding at a certain time frame. Her emails showed that she was still calling and emailing him years later. He was trying to hookup for a quick evening out near home and she was excited and planning it out. She says they never met again. 

See where I'm coming from... She admits that as long as they kept trying she was never really over. In counseling, she told me and MC that she would promise herself that she was done cheating... no more contact. But, one out to the blue email asking "Hey... what's going on?" and she was sucked right back into the addiction for intention and dreams. 

Sad Sh!t to say the least.


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## Calibre12 (Nov 27, 2012)

In a myriad of other things found on his phone (encrypted) & his numerous non-verbals, this morning I checked his phone and saw that Blackberry Messenger was "Last Used: 5:17am". He denies using it, states that the phone updates itself etc. I called the phone company, they said "last used" is "last used" by the owner. His biggest, biggest thing is to tell me I have NO proof of anything. Why does he INSIST on staying in this marriage?????????


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## canttrustu (Feb 22, 2012)

RightfulRiskTaker said:


> In a myriad of other things found on his phone (encrypted) & his numerous non-verbals, this morning I checked his phone and saw that Blackberry Messenger was "Last Used: 5:17am". He denies using it, states that the phone updates itself etc. I called the phone company, they said "last used" is "last used" by the owner. His biggest, biggest thing is to tell me I have NO proof of anything. Why does he INSIST on staying in this marriage?????????


because he's got you at home taking care of the kids and him and he's got whoever on the side for some fun....win, win until you put a stop to it.

stop asking him questions, he will continue to lie. You need to get proof. Until then, the more questions you ask the sneakier he will get making it harder for you to get the proof you need.


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## Calibre12 (Nov 27, 2012)

RWB said:


> LTA ending?
> 
> Can't say for everyone... just what I learned from my wife's LT affairs when I caught her cheating.
> 
> ...


Soo sorry to hear you are going through this. It is the most painful thing I have ever endured and I hate myself for being such a big fricking IDIOT. I have more than mastered the pain now. I have a plan and the timing is soon.


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## BjornFree (Aug 16, 2012)

Dig's wife had a 5 year affair or so I gather, it ended.....apparently. I think the worst thing about any affair is the fact that the BS can never completely trust their partner to not renew the affair or start a new one. Your question stems from that problem.


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## Calibre12 (Nov 27, 2012)

Update: Now he tells me that Blackberry told him to tell me that I should put a passcode on his phone so that I can be reassured that he isn't using the phone during the twilight hours. How ridiculous!!!! SO I should password protect his phone every morning and every night like I don't have anything else to do with my damn life!


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## canttrustu (Feb 22, 2012)

RightfulRiskTaker said:


> Update: Now he tells me that Blackberry told him to tell me that I should put a passcode on his phone so that I can be reassured that he isn't using the phone during the twilight hours. How ridiculous!!!! SO I should password protect his phone every morning and every night like I don't have anything else to do with my damn life!


WHat??????


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## remorseful strayer (Nov 13, 2012)

RightfulRiskTaker said:


> Found out husband had an secret 8 year "friendship that never got physical", even after I divorced him. I found out after the divorce. Based on what he told me before we remarried, it was clearly an EA, although he barely wants to admit that. They both said "Nothing happened..." I know that it was an affair. Question is can it really end and if so what would cause it to end?


Do you have proof positive it is not a physical affair. 

The guys always try the it's just an emotional affair. 

Men don't have JUST emotional affairs. 

It's either gone physical, has been physical or was planned to be physical. 

A man does not waste his time gossiping with the girls unless he thinks there's going to eventually be a booty call.


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## remorseful strayer (Nov 13, 2012)

RightfulRiskTaker said:


> Found out husband had an secret 8 year "friendship that never got physical", even after I divorced him. I found out after the divorce. Based on what he told me before we remarried, it was clearly an EA, although he barely wants to admit that. They both said "Nothing happened..." I know that it was an affair. Question is can it really end and if so what would cause it to end?


double post deleted


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

RightfulRiskTaker said:


> Why does he INSIST on staying in this marriage?????????


Cheating is not about choosing between two people! The choice has _already_ been made. He wants BOTH. And if he gets something out of both, he's going to fight for both until he is forced, by OUTSIDE circumstances, to give something up.

Counseling costs money and time
Counseling is unpleasant
Counseling forces you into self-examination
Counseling forces you to compromise and maybe give up the things to which you devote excessive time and attention

Divorce is expensive
Divorce means change and upheaval
Divorce means moving homes
Divorce means altering your routine, how you get to work, where you buy your lattes and get your gas


Divorce means admitting that your selfish longterm "friendship" destroyed your marriage and that your family and friends will see you as a cheater


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

RightfulRiskTaker said:


> Update: Now he tells me that Blackberry told him to tell me that I should put a passcode on his phone so that I can be reassured that he isn't using the phone during the twilight hours. How ridiculous!!!! SO I should password protect his phone every morning and every night like I don't have anything else to do with my damn life!


Take him up on it.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

To answer your original question, my H had a 4.5 year affair...emotional based on hundreds of messages, all of which I found (meaning I was never intended to read them) spanning the whole relationship.

My experience was that the length of time made it much easier for him to end it (the _second_ time) for the reasons Married_in_VA gave on the previous page. Basically, things petered out into a tamer relationship. Stronger infatuation had worn off.

This was because they spent less time communicating. She had "got a life" and was in grad school and didn't have as much time to sit and play footsy over the cellphone. That lack of contact allowed my H to gain a better perspective. She was never going to leave her H for him, she would probably cheat on him, she didn't perceive him as _her_ soulmate, she had not been honest about her relationship with her husband, she didn't share many of the same values.

However, I am now seeing a new pattern on the boards--I think there are 3 or 4 people like that now or recently--where their spouse has become SO enmeshed with their confidant that it's like cutting off their right arm to extricate them. As Shirley Glass says in her book Not Just Friends, they've slowly built a brick wall between themselves and their spouse--they are not sharing their true selves (hopes, fears, dreams) and they have opened a window to this third party (and are sending all that emotional energy in their direction).

Non-physicality seems to play a big role in people defending these intense (and very harmful to the marriage) virtual relationships in their own minds. They don't believe you can break your marriage vows by communicating with someone this way, and they've lied to themselves for a very long time to justify the relationship. That mental construct can be very hard to break.


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## Calibre12 (Nov 27, 2012)

remorseful strayer said:


> Do you have proof positive it is not a physical affair.
> 
> The guys always try the it's just an emotional affair.
> 
> ...


:iagree: He didn't even try to say it was and emotional affair, he said it was JUST a "friendship". But, I don't have pictures of him on top of her and no one has ever told me they have seen them together. They are THAT smart. The only proof I have is personal...His choice of words and foibles in conversation plus inadvertently comparing me to her (hands, feet making comments about shape of my nails and nail color - subtle crap like that, plus the songs he selects to listen to, the women he stares at when we used to go out, look just LIKE her. I did do the expose her on the internet 3 months ago, to see how he and she would react...He was livid about something else "coincidentally"...she was completely quiet...Nothing!!!! SHe just paid $ to have it removed. I got a PI for a short time last year - I DID all the work and NOTHING. Nothing much on spyware...I think he has had a go phone for a while now, can't find it... I noticed that her FB pictures for a 34 y.o. are only of her and male family members...No ex's, no other man. Not to mention, our sex life is good only one event a year, while the other occassional times it's just crappy.


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## canttrustu (Feb 22, 2012)

iheartlife said:


> To answer your original question, my H had a 4.5 year affair...emotional based on hundreds of messages, all of which I found (meaning I was never intended to read them) spanning the whole relationship.
> 
> My experience was that the length of time made it much easier for him to end it (the _second_ time) for the reasons Married_in_VA gave on the previous page. Basically, things petered out into a tamer relationship. Stronger infatuation had worn off.
> 
> ...


OH Iheart are you saying your H's AP wasnt......honest.:scratchhead: well, I'll be.... 
that would probably hurt her feelings. :rofl:


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## thesunwillcomeout (Jun 25, 2012)

Geez honey--it's like your husband studied the manual and decided not to deviate a lick from the script. Somewhere along the line any intelligence has been leeching from his brain to the nether member where we know there's no brain retention. I am so, so sorry. And to hear that "Jesus' sister"-not, was under the sheets, spread and all with one leg off the bed, well that's quite a picture. You sure it wasn't Damian's daughter cuz I think that sounds more like it!?

You know what's happened and what's going on. What a bummer he's put you through this again (though last time you didn't know it). Glad you have a plan in place. Time for him to face the consequences. 

Btw, does your plan include exposing her too?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## thesunwillcomeout (Jun 25, 2012)

RightfulRiskTaker said:


> Update: Now he tells me that Blackberry told him to tell me that I should put a passcode on his phone so that I can be reassured that he isn't using the phone during the twilight hours. How ridiculous!!!! SO I should password protect his phone every morning and every night like I don't have anything else to do with my damn life!


Dumb, dumb, dumb. That's just downright stupid. Ask him if you can set the password on his burner phone too!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

RightfulRiskTaker said:


> :iagree: He didn't even try to say it was and emotional affair, he said it was JUST a "friendship". But, I don't have pictures of him on top of her and no one has ever told me they have seen them together. They are THAT smart. The only proof I have is personal...His choice of words and foibles in conversation plus inadvertently comparing me to her (hands, feet making comments about shape of my nails and nail color - subtle crap like that, plus the songs he selects to listen to, the women he stares at when we used to go out, look just LIKE her. I did do the expose her on the internet 3 months ago, to see how he and she would react...He was livid about something else "coincidentally"...she was completely quiet...Nothing!!!! SHe just paid $ to have it removed. I got a PI for a short time last year - I DID all the work and NOTHING. Nothing much on spyware...I think he has had a go phone for a while now, can't find it... I noticed that her FB pictures for a 34 y.o. are only of her and male family members...No ex's, no other man.


There are other people on this board like you...Remains and bronwen come to mind but I know there are several others. Actually, Natalie on the boards now has a similar situation--her husband's issue is serial cheating (striking up flirtacious likely virtual relationships with cute young things) but he also seems to enjoy playing 'hide the ball.' All of these men would never admit anything, ever.

Here's the thing: people like this, who refuse to admit that they're doing anything wrong--for these folks, evidence gathering is for YOU and not for them. You need to decide what you can live with, and what you can't, and figure out what you need to learn in order to make your choices. People who pretend like nothing's going on aren't going to suddenly fall to their knees because you found hard core evidence. No, these folks are just going to say you're losing your mind, you're paranoid, or you doctored the evidence.


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## Calibre12 (Nov 27, 2012)

thesunwillcomeout said:


> Geez honey--it's like your husband studied the manual and decided not to deviate a lick from the script. Somewhere along the line any intelligence has been leeching from his brain to the nether member where we know there's no brain retention. I am so, so sorry. And to hear that "Jesus' sister"-not, was under the sheets, spread and all with one leg off the bed, well that's quite a picture. You sure it wasn't Damian's daughter cuz I think that sounds more like it!?
> 
> You know what's happened and what's going on. What a bummer he's put you through this again (though last time you didn't know it). Glad you have a plan in place. Time for him to face the consequences.
> 
> ...



I think the major expose 3 months ago was enough. I hate the fact that they may get away with it, AGAIN. It may have only put them further underground since I did it 2 years after the "invisible" fact OR maybe she did get the shock of her life and dumped him AGAIN. But, I just want to get out as soon as I am able. Maybe she will help him to pay for the divorce fight, since she is such a "smart, funny, kind, caring, loyal friend".


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## canttrustu (Feb 22, 2012)

RightfulRiskTaker said:


> I think the major expose 3 months ago was enough. I hate the fact that they may get away with it, AGAIN. It may have only put them further underground since I did it 2 years after the "invisible" fact OR maybe she did get the shock of her life and dumped him AGAIN. But, I just want to get out as soon as I am able. Maybe she will help him to pay for the divorce fight, since she is such a "smart, funny, kind, caring, loyal friend".


vomit.


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## Calibre12 (Nov 27, 2012)

thesunwillcomeout said:


> Geez honey--it's like your husband studied the manual and decided not to deviate a lick from the script. Somewhere along the line any intelligence has been leeching from his brain to the nether member where we know there's no brain retention. I am so, so sorry. And to hear that "Jesus' sister"-not, was under the sheets, spread and all with one leg off the bed, well that's quite a picture. You sure it wasn't Damian's daughter cuz I think that sounds more like it!?
> 
> You know what's happened and what's going on. What a bummer he's put you through this again (though last time you didn't know it). Glad you have a plan in place. Time for him to face the consequences.
> 
> ...



Sooo funny...His name is Damian. Too, she was "celebate at the time" because she just couldn't take the pain of screwing married men who were supposed to marry her only to find out they were married when their wives called her...the last one being her father's friend...According to Damian. My greatest frustration is being so demoralized by these low-life scumbags...My God, she gets up everyday to go to a job where she is such the crusader for a cause for unfortunate children and families, writes blogs like "You know what's romantic? Getting insurance for your children before they board a boat" and has the company's by line as "Your friends with benefits"...Go figure...Miss valiant, nicey, nice... The internet queen is even still employed after the expose.


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## jenny1981 (Jun 14, 2012)

RightfulRiskTaker said:


> Found out husband had an secret 8 year "friendship that never got physical", even after I divorced him. I found out after the divorce. Based on what he told me before we remarried, it was clearly an EA, although he barely wants to admit that. They both said "Nothing happened..." I know that it was an affair. Question is can it really end and if so what would cause it to end?


Oh course a LTA could end as could a long term marriage. They both could end for many different reasons. I believe a LTA ending with Absolute NC is slim to non. Just like any other relationship there needs to be closure. When the LTA ends because bs demands it then I find it hard to believe the AP's cut ties completely. However if the ow/om outs the relationship then the ws may feel betrayed by their ap and choose to never speak to them again. Remember ladies and gentleman cheaters are excellent liars and most know how to cover their tracks.
IMO a long term affair is a relationship!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## remorseful strayer (Nov 13, 2012)

RightfulRiskTaker said:


> :iagree: He didn't even try to say it was and emotional affair, he said it was JUST a "friendship". But, I don't have pictures of him on top of her and no one has ever told me they have seen them together. They are THAT smart. The only proof I have is personal...His choice of words and foibles in conversation plus inadvertently comparing me to her (hands, feet making comments about shape of my nails and nail color - subtle crap like that, plus the songs he selects to listen to, the women he stares at when we used to go out, look just LIKE her. I did do the expose her on the internet 3 months ago, to see how he and she would react...He was livid about something else "coincidentally"...she was completely quiet...Nothing!!!! SHe just paid $ to have it removed. I got a PI for a short time last year - I DID all the work and NOTHING. Nothing much on spyware...I think he has had a go phone for a while now, can't find it... I noticed that her FB pictures for a 34 y.o. are only of her and male family members...No ex's, no other man. Not to mention, our sex life is good only one event a year, while the other occassional times it's just crappy.


I am glad to see that you already suspect it is or was physical.

Also, sometimes the emails are written in code, with certain words meaning something else because they are afraid they may be found. Just a head's up.


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## old timer (Nov 23, 2012)

*RRT:* My theory - for what its worth: 

During the time you were divorced, your H had the opportunity to spend unlimited amounts of time w/ the OW. 

This allowed him to see that OW wasn't someone with whom he'd like to spend the rest of his life. Hence he came back to you. 

(this is coming from my own personal experience)


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## alte Dame (Aug 7, 2012)

I think your H is far worse than most of the cheaters on this forum, since he put you through this bad marriage hell twice. It defines pure selfishness. And the OW is busy believing that she's making the noble sacrifice. Win-win for the two of them.

If I were you, I wouldn't be able to run fast enough from them. They deserve one another.

Can you dust off the old divorce petition? I'm not in your shoes, but I can well imagine that the hurt is wearing off and you are now just feeling anger and a desire for some righteous retribution.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

old timer said:


> *RRT:* My theory - for what its worth:
> 
> During the time you were divorced, your H had the opportunity to spend unlimited amounts of time w/ the OW.
> 
> ...


Yes, what do you think about this theory?


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## thesunwillcomeout (Jun 25, 2012)

RightfulRiskTaker said:


> I think the major expose 3 months ago was enough. I hate the fact that they may get away with it, AGAIN. It may have only put them further underground since I did it 2 years after the "invisible" fact OR maybe she did get the shock of her life and dumped him AGAIN. But, I just want to get out as soon as I am able. Maybe she will help him to pay for the divorce fight, since she is such a "smart, funny, kind, caring, loyal friend".


Oh lord. These people. 

When I posted that I hadn't read your post yet about exposing her. Good for you. The fact he's protecting "smarty pants" (that's one from my trigger-box) tells you he is not committed to you and your children. If you ask him to leave, draw the line (again, so sorry), he will not "win" or "get away with it". Cake eating is getting away with it and you're not gonna let that happen. Time to do something to build yourself up, cuz he can't have you.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## thesunwillcomeout (Jun 25, 2012)

RightfulRiskTaker said:


> Sooo funny...His name is Damian. Too, she was "celebate at the time" because she just couldn't take the pain of screwing married men who were supposed to marry her only to find out they were married when their wives called her...the last one being her father's friend...According to Damian. My greatest frustration is being so demoralized by these low-life scumbags...My God, she gets up everyday to go to a job where she is such the crusader for a cause for unfortunate children and families, writes blogs like "You know what's romantic? Getting insurance for your children before they board a boat" and has the company's by line as "Your friends with benefits"...Go figure...Miss valiant, nicey, nice... The internet queen is even still employed after the expose.


That's because with this type of person they "help" victims AND play the victim. Sounds like her meds are out of whack.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## thesunwillcomeout (Jun 25, 2012)

And! Wild about the Damian--thing. Freaky! I can edit that if you want? (-:
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Calibre12 (Nov 27, 2012)

iheartlife said:


> Yes, what do you think about this theory?


I wish I could believe it...But in retrospect, she sent him a text on Christmas Day 2 yrs ago, while we were reconciling and I was still in the bewilderment fog. One week later, he told me that it said "Merry Christmas to you and the fam". He only told me because a guy I briefly dated after the divorce, sent me a Happy New Year email and I showed it to him. He deleted her text so I never did see the actual contents. But his behavior was agitated that night more secretive, texting a lot, phone in bathroom - going to bathroom very often, distracted - day dreaming, from then on. He told the counselors and our pastor that he and her reconnected on FB after I filed the divorce in 2009. Then I found phone bills in an old box of his,(one of each year) for 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009. I saw her # on there for about 12-14 days of that particular month of each bill for those years. When I confronted him, he tore up the bills. He said he apologized to the pastor and counselors for lying to them. He said that he rarely called her and she was just a friend and didn't want to tell me because I would badger him about it...How convenient, I would demand the truth and he preferred to keep up the lie so that he looks like the good guy married to an unreasonable woman.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

I just couldn't live that way...the only reason I've reconciled is that my husband admitted everything. Of course, it's easy for me to say, because I have all that evidence you're describing, my H tried to delete it but he was unsuccessful.


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## alte Dame (Aug 7, 2012)

Is there anything he could do now that would make you NOT want to divorce him? Is it recoverable for you in any way? He is a liar, for sure, and the two of them have a secret life, so you're the odd man out in your marriage. Are you still emotionally caught?


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## Calibre12 (Nov 27, 2012)

Financially caught but not emotionally caught anymore...Just can't understand why he doesn't want a divorce. I plan to file next month.


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## Calibre12 (Nov 27, 2012)

iheartlife said:


> I just couldn't live that way...the only reason I've reconciled is that my husband admitted everything. Of course, it's easy for me to say, because I have all that evidence you're describing, my H tried to delete it but he was unsuccessful.


Your comment made me cry. I never wanted to live this way. I did not expect my life to be this way...I actually have morals and values, I just didn't know he didn't and he brought someone into my life who doesn't. My children don't deserve this. Would you believe I have a 6 month old DS baby.


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## thesunwillcomeout (Jun 25, 2012)

So sorry you're going through this. Do you mind me asking about your children? It's amazing (though common) that he's not considering them either, at all
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Calibre12 (Nov 27, 2012)

thesunwillcomeout said:


> So sorry you're going through this. Do you mind me asking about your children? It's amazing (though common) that he's not considering them either, at all
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Two girls 18 (started college) and 12, 1 boy 6 months old


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

RightfulRiskTaker said:


> Your comment made me cry. I never wanted to live this way. I did not expect my life to be this way...I actually have morals and values, I just didn't know he didn't and he brought someone into my life who doesn't. My children don't deserve this. Would you believe I have a 6 month old DS baby.


(((((HUGS))))) I am so sorry. I certainly hope I didn't hurt you with my post.

When I made that comment, I was just trying to express what you seem to be saying yourself. The stress and anxiety that deceit causes wears people down until they crack.

I think what really gets to me is how much the majority of people minimize emotional affairs. They just don't get that it's about the LYING

Here are links to the Policy of Radical Honesty

The Policy of Radical Honesty

Emotional Honesty

Historical Honesty

Current Honesty


When I was re-reading this the other day, what struck me was that Dr. Harley says that dishonesty kills romantic love. It is a tragedy that your husband has made such selfish choices.


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## thesunwillcomeout (Jun 25, 2012)

thesunwillcomeout said:


> So sorry you're going through this. Do you mind me asking about your children? It's amazing (though common) that he's not considering them either, at all
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Oh didn't see the 6-month old comment when I posted. Oh dear. I'm so sorry (and sorry for my sideways out of the mouth comments.) Though I often get salty in my language here and that hurt side comes out in snarky comments I realize sometimes it doesn't help anyone. Just trying for levity but not the right way. The high ground does help. Ultimately you have Someone who will never let you down. That has to be your greatest solace. 

When my husband was in the thick of it he'd sometimes say nighttime prayers with our children and tuck into those prayers asking to be forgiven for selfishness (mind you this was for the kids). I would listen from the next room and wonder about what my H was struggling with though I had a hunch but didn't know all the details. He now says that when he was praying that he was definitely thinking of what he was doing. I still listen for it on nights when he prays with the kids. It's not there now -- not that he doesn't cover the bases...it's just that he's now actually focused on them (and stopped the other.) I do wonder about your children. Sadly, your H is so self-absorbed he's not only blowing up your lives but he's destroying his own and he just doesn't see it. 

You will get through this. So sorry for all the heartache.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## MrMathias (Nov 19, 2012)

I had a very extensive text Facebook conversation between my WW and her OM. 10k messages. There wasn't much to indicate anything other than kissing and cybersex webshows. So, naturally my WW admitted the stuff I could prove or at least infer. 

Most of it sounded like two people that wanted to be together but hadn't had the chance.

I was wrong. 

From my perspective, I simply could not believe that two adults in heat, that text graphic scenes to each other, would kiss for twenty minutes without making a move and advancing it further. I was right. 

I think your instincts are probably spot on. 

I wish you well.


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## thesunwillcomeout (Jun 25, 2012)

RightfulRiskTaker said:


> Two girls 18 (started college) and 12, 1 boy 6 months old


Oh dear. Pivotal time for your daughters, and the challenge of a DS baby. Sounds like he isn't good with dealing with the hard parts of life. I'll bet all 3 children are beautiful. Do you have a good support system there?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Calibre12 (Nov 27, 2012)

Thank you for sharing with me. He had the nerve to tell me last night that our older daughter doesn't voluntarily contact him or speak to him...He's so devastated by this...I asked him what his expectations were since while he was calling his "friend" to find out how she's doing for 7 years of their lives and 1 year after the divorce, if he thought the children didn't notice he was inattentive, they only saw him on saturdays and sundays (because of his job shift) and they did without a lot of perks their friends had...He was too sleepy to hear me and said he has to pray to God about it. It didn't naturally occur to him that there would be fallout from his actions.


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## Calibre12 (Nov 27, 2012)

DrMathias said:


> I had a very extensive text Facebook conversation between my WW and her OM. 10k messages. There wasn't much to indicate anything other than kissing and cybersex webshows. So, naturally my WW admitted the stuff I could prove or at least infer.
> 
> Most of it sounded like two people that wanted to be together but hadn't had the chance.
> 
> ...


Miss Cutesy-Pie is tight lipped about the whole thing - threatened me with harrassment lawsuit if I ever contact her (2 yrs ago). I believe they are so rehearsed in their responses and protective because they are hooked, lined and sinkered. It would be so taboo for him to divorce me for her now because of the DS baby. It would make them both look like the trash they really are.


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## old timer (Nov 23, 2012)

thesunwillcomeout said:


> Sounds like he isn't good with dealing with the hard parts of life.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Most of us cheaters aren't, I'd guess. The hard emotional parts, anyway. We'd rather take the path of least resistance and go outside the marriage looking for a solution, instead of facing up to our own personal issues and doing the "heavy lifting" of nurturing our marriage. Until we totally accept our shortcomings and confront them head on - we'll take the easy way out every time.


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## thesunwillcomeout (Jun 25, 2012)

RightfulRiskTaker said:


> ...He was too sleepy to hear me and said he has to pray to God about it. It didn't naturally occur to him that there would be fallout from his actions.


Bla bla bla on the praying bit. And re the fallout, they NEVER consider this because they're only thinking of themselves. Likewise he can't "see" he caused his daughter's distance because he's too self-absorbed. Again, so sorry.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## thesunwillcomeout (Jun 25, 2012)

old timer said:


> Most of us cheaters aren't, I'd guess. The hard emotional parts, anyway. We'd rather take the path of least resistance and go outside the marriage looking for a solution, instead of facing up to our own personal issues and doing the "heavy lifting" of nurturing our marriage. Until we totally accept our shortcomings and confront them head on - we'll take the easy way out every time.


Sir, thank you.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Acabado (May 13, 2012)

RightfulRiskTaker said:


> His biggest, biggest thing is to tell me I have NO proof of anything.


This says it all. Delinquent's speech. Reality (potential pushishment) is what can be proved beyond a reasonable doubt. As long as you can't provide hard evidence, worthy of jail time, he's free... only this is not a court, it's a marriage. It's about honesty and good faith, not about getting away with murder with technicalities and lawyers tricks. Gaslighting become the default, a lifestyle. Dancing around the truth allows him to be somehohw at charge, wich is complete delusional.

With no honesty there's no love but manipulation. It's simple.


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## Calibre12 (Nov 27, 2012)

Acabado said:


> This says it all. Delinquent's speech. Reality (potential pushishment) is what can be proved beyond a reasonable doubt. As long as you can't provide hard evidence, worthy of jail time, he's free... only this is not a court, it's a marriage. It's about honesty and good faith, not about getting away with murder with technicalities and lawyers tricks. Gaslighting become the default, a lifestyle. Dancing around the truth allows him to be somehohw at charge, wich is complete delusional.
> 
> With no honesty there's no love but manipulation. It's simple.


With no honesty there's no love but manipulation. It's simple.[/QUOTE] - Thanks a million, well received. I can't wait to start a new life, to start my life over again. To wake up one day not wondering what's going on will be a welcomed relief. You know what the worst part is? Someone telling you for 15 years not to trust your gut feelings and using God as his cloak.


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## hookares (Dec 7, 2011)

My ex ended her affair she was having with the guy she moved into what was once our home less than six months after our divorce. She did it by starting another with a different guy.


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## Calibre12 (Nov 27, 2012)

thesunwillcomeout - Just want you to know you didn't hurt me. It was some well-spent tears - recalling my younger dreams for my life. It's quite okay and I am happy to shed.
iheartlife - Thank you for your warm concern and care. 

A big thank you to all for allowing me to be vulnerable and feel supported


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## thesunwillcomeout (Jun 25, 2012)

RightfulRiskTaker said:


> thesunwillcomeout - Just want you to know you didn't hurt me. It was some well-spent tears - recalling my younger dreams for my life. It's quite okay and I am happy to shed.
> iheartlife - Thank you for your warm concern and care.
> 
> A big thank you to all for allowing me to be vulnerable and feel supported


big big hug.


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## remorseful strayer (Nov 13, 2012)

old timer said:


> Most of us cheaters aren't, I'd guess. The hard emotional parts, anyway. We'd rather take the path of least resistance and go outside the marriage looking for a solution, instead of facing up to our own personal issues and doing the "heavy lifting" of nurturing our marriage. Until we totally accept our shortcomings and confront them head on - we'll take the easy way out every time.


Old Timer, you are absolutely right.


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