# Always had disparate sex drives, trying to deal after Affairs



## Robsia (Mar 11, 2013)

Back story: I moved out of the house June 2012 because of my H's anger issues. I was going to divorce him, although I still loved him. He asked if I would reconsider and continue our relationship in separate houses if he promised to get help with his anger issues. I agreed, but on the condition that we were still bound by our vows - i.e. that there was fidelity on both sides, like before we moved in together, but were still dating. He agreed. I found out in March that he had had an affair from September - December 2012. Then found out in May that there was another from Dec 2012 to Jan 2013, plus an ongoing contact with an OW he met on a dating site. I put a stop to the ongoing contact, and we have been trying to R since then. We still don't live together as we don't feel we are ready for various reasons.

We had a problem last night. During our marriage we always had a disparate sex drive - mine is higher than his, unusually. Quite often during our marriage I would initiate sex, only for him to lie there in bed like a lump of stone, totally ignoring my advances. Eventually I would get upset and withdraw, which would lead to an argument. He didn't always reject me, but it was more often than not. Conversely, there was only ONE occasion during our entire relationship when I rejected him - only because it was late, I was dog-tired, I had a headache and I had to be up early in the morning. Every other time he has initiated sex, I have enthusastically gone along with it. Every single time.

Fast forward to D-day 2 in May this year. I decided I was not going to initiate sex again. I was going to let him take the lead. I told him this, that I needed him to be more forthright in the bedroom, that I was tired of always being the aggressor, and that I needed him to be more caveman. I had also examined my feelings as to why I felt rejected and upset when he didn't want to have sex and I said that if he didn't feel like sex, to tell me, so there was no expectation. This seemed to work.

He has been very busy with work for the last few weeks but he comes round on Fridays and Saturdays. So pretty much every Friday, he has said something like "It's been a long day, is it ok if we just go to sleep?" and I have not been upset - which is real progress for me. Of course I understand that when you're tired, you're not always in the mood - which is okay. So I was happy, that we had established that if he just told me in advance, there was no expectation on my part, and no need for me to feel upset. But then on Saturdays, when he hadn't been working and wasn't tired, we would generally have sex, and it was good. I felt he was really listening to me. He was being more aggressive, more caveman, and it was great.

So, now we come to this weekend. Friday was as usual - tired, no sex. But then Saturday we went upstairs. He didn't say anything about just going to sleep, so I went to bed in my underwear, which is our tacit signal for me being interested - otherwise I put my nightwear on. Next thing I know he's lying there snoring away. I get upset. I leap out of bed, throw my pjs on and yank the light off then I lie there and seethe. After a while he wakes up and, I know this was wrong, but I start an argument. I end up accusing him of having an affair again, because the last time he lost interest in sex was when he was getting it elsewhere. He just basically ignored me. Didn't even deny it, or tell me I was being daft, let alone try to reassure me.

We argued back and forth and ended up talking about expectations. he told me that my default expectation when we go to bed should be "no sex" so I said if we were going to end up in a sexless marriage, then we may as well divorce.

Eventually we slept, but I didn't sleep well. He slept till gone noon and when he eventually got up, we small-talked for about an hour then took ourselves to the hall so we could talk out of earshot of DD2.

Now, I am NOT expecting that he should be willing to have sex whenever I want it, which would be an unreasonable expectation, but I reiterated the idea of him telling me if he wasn't in the mood, then I wouldn't have any expectation. He told me I shouldn't have an expectation of sex anyway and that I was being unreasonable. He said that the onus should not be on him to tell me that he doesn't want to have sex. Now, I don't think it's unreasonable that there is an expectation of sex within a marriage. We are both still relatively young (I'm 40, he's 44), we are in good health, so on a Saturday night, not too tired, not ill, and no reason to get up early in the morning, why should I not have an expectation of sex?

For me, sex is so much more than the physical, it is the ultimate expression of love. When we have sex, I feel cherished, loved, cared for, wanted, desired, safe. When we don't have sex, I feel unloved, unwanted, undesirable. I tried to explain this to him but his only response was that he didn't feel that way, therefore I shouldn't either.

I reminded him that I wasn't expecting him to have sex whenever I wanted to, but that a compromise would be that he simply tell me, then I have no expectation and I'm not upset. He doesn't see why he should. I should alter MY expectations so that my default position is that of "no sex" like his is. We just ended up going round in circles and I ended up getting upset and telling him to leave.

He also NEVER comforts me or reassures me when I am upset, which is a separate issue. he says that when I have upset HIM, he doesn't want me to comfort him, so he doesn't see why he should comfort me when I am upset. He says this despite the fact that I've tried to explain my needs. He refuses to accept that my needs might be different from his.


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## larry.gray (Feb 21, 2011)

I'm sorry to say you're not going to find a bunch of help in SIM. The low drive man just doesn't show up here. HD guys, HD women, some LD women but only one LD drive man.

The men that frequent this forum just can't relate to your husband in any way. Lots of guys who are sex starved and would love to have a wife that does 1/10 of what you're doing in trying to get him aroused.

Honestly it makes me question why you are committed to him? What does he bring? I can understand sticking with a guy that causes sexual frustration but is great otherwise. But cheating, emotional abuse and no sex? Sorry, I don't get it.


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## Robsia (Mar 11, 2013)

larry.gray said:


> Honestly it makes me question why you are committed to him? What does he bring? I can understand sticking with a guy that causes sexual frustration but is great otherwise. But cheating, emotional abuse and no sex? Sorry, I don't get it.


I was wondering that myself this morning. I mean, we do have a good bond and a good friendship, everything else aside, which is the only reason I was considering R in the first place.

But I could never consider a relationship of any sort without sex - and plenty of it. And I shouldn't be belttled ("Is that all you think about?" "There's more to life than just sex, you know" etc) and made to feel bad for wanting to have sex with my husband, surely?

I guess I'm looking for opinions as to whether I am being unreaonable or not in my approach/expectations.


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## samyeagar (May 14, 2012)

I don't think you are being unreasonable wanting and expecting sex regularly from your husband. It may be unreasonable if you are demanding it three times a day, but to be honest, most guys would try their hardest to accomodate. My STBW and I have an a no rejection without damn good reason policy, we both actively initiate, and have had less than 10 days in the past year that we haven't had sex at least once.


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## larry.gray (Feb 21, 2011)

Robsia said:


> I guess I'm looking for opinions as to whether I am being unreaonable or not in my approach/expectations.


No, you're not. Not at all. "Normal" men meet their wives sexual needs, and enjoy doing it.


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## john_lord_b3 (Jan 11, 2013)

larry.gray said:


> No, you're not. Not at all. "Normal" men meet their wives sexual needs, and enjoy doing it.


:iagree: This is true. The basic concept is just like what Mr. Gray said. Why bother getting married if we are not going to make our spouses happy? If happiness includes providing sexual satisfaction, then it's part of the commitment..In the matters of sex, there are some negotiations needed in regards to frequency, timing and what techniques are acceptable (and what isn't).. but the concept of mutual satisfaction, and the unacceptability of sexless marriage, should be non-negotiable...


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## MissScarlett (May 22, 2013)

You are not being unreasonable in your desires.

Here we have a man who never wants to have sex, tells you to never plan on sex and has a wife who is always available for sex.

And yet he goes outside your marriage for sex. Not once but twice.

It sounds a bit like he might be staying with you for the kids but is no longer attracted to you. (Hoping this is not the case but why hate sex so much but also go out of your marriage to get it?)


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## debraarzn (Jul 8, 2013)

The low drive man just doesn't show up here. HD guys, HD women, some LD women but only one LD drive man.


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## larry.gray (Feb 21, 2011)

john_lord_b3 said:


> :iagree: This is true. The basic concept is just like what Mr. Gray said. Why bother getting married if we are not going to make our spouses happy? If happiness includes providing sexual satisfaction, then it's part of the commitment..In the matters of sex, there are some negotiations needed in regards to frequency, timing and what techniques are acceptable (and what isn't).. but the concept of mutual satisfaction, and the unacceptability of sexless marriage, should be non-negotiable...


I wish to pay you respect john_lord_b3. I could see how you could take offense to my post, but you didn't. You're a great asset to the forum.


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## john_lord_b3 (Jan 11, 2013)

Robsia said:


> ...So, now we come to this weekend. Friday was as usual - tired, no sex. But then Saturday we went upstairs. He didn't say anything about just going to sleep, *so I went to bed in my underwear, which is our tacit signal for me being interested - otherwise I put my nightwear on. Next thing I know he's lying there snoring away. I get upset*.


Oh  so sorry to hear this. He seemed very selfish!



> He told me that my default expectation when we go to bed should be "no sex" so I said if we were going to end up in a sexless marriage, then we may as well divorce..


:iagree: logical! 



> Now, I am NOT expecting that he should be willing to have sex whenever I want it, which would be an unreasonable expectation, but I reiterated the idea of him telling me if he wasn't in the mood, then I wouldn't have any expectation. He told me I shouldn't have an expectation of sex anyway and that I was being unreasonable. He said that the onus should not be on him to tell me that he doesn't want to have sex. Now, I don't think it's unreasonable that there is an expectation of sex within a marriage. *We are both still relatively young (I'm 40, he's 44), we are in good health, so on a Saturday night, not too tired, not ill, and no reason to get up early in the morning, why should I not have an expectation of sex?*


yes, logical, I myself are in weekend sex schedule, so I see no reason why that good chance are being wasted?



> For me, sex is so much more than the physical, it is the ultimate expression of love. When we have sex, I feel cherished, loved, cared for, wanted, desired, safe. When we don't have sex, I feel unloved, unwanted, undesirable. I tried to explain this to him but his only response was that he didn't feel that way, therefore I shouldn't either.
> ..


Well, I was guilty of not understanding about this, until my wife communicated with me how she felt about me not initiating. Our current schedule was the result of the negotiations that came after the talk. I believe the word that stick on my head is "have I became so unattractive to you after giving birth to your son?". That was the moment I realized that having sex with me is my wife's way to reassure _herself_ that she is still attractive in my eyes, that I still love her and treasure her as my lover, not just as the mother of John Jr. 

Your husband's answer is so totally like a person who doesn't "get it".. He seems like a person who always thinks "As above, so below" or "The way I feel, should be the way you feel". All of this points to him being an insensitive person. Was he always this insensitive? How was he when the two of you were dating?

Do you still want to reconcile? What are his PLUS side that makes you still love him?




larry.gray said:


> I wish to pay you respect john_lord_b3. I could see how you could take offense to my post, but you didn't. You're a great asset to the forum.


:corkysm60::smnotworthy: Thank you very much! You're a wonderful poster too!


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## Jasel (Jan 8, 2013)

He might not even be LD he just might not be all that into you anymore. He's LD yet has two affairs? (Im assuming PA) He doesnt sound too different from some of the women Ive read about who assume they are LD for years only to realize theyre pretty much just LD when it comes to their spouse, not necessarily other people.

Anyway it sounds like you deserve better than that. Everything youve gone through and it doesnt sound like things are improving. You might want to consider pulling the plug in that marriage.


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## Robsia (Mar 11, 2013)

john_lord_b3 said:


> Your husband's answer is so totally like a person who doesn't "get it".. He seems like a person who always thinks "As above, so below" or "The way I feel, should be the way you feel". All of this points to him being an insensitive person.


I confess I have been guilty of this. I have an ASD and one of the traits is lack of empathy. I struggle to understand that someone else's feelings about a given situation can be any different from my own. This is something I have learned since being married and it was a difficult lesson. But I am now trying harder to see things from his POV. So I get that he struggles sometimes also. But when I spell my needs and feelings out to him very plainly, and he STILL refuses to see it, I am at a loss to know what else to do.



> Was he always this insensitive? How was he when the two of you were dating?


These problems didn't arise when we were dating. We were still in the courting stage and on our best behaviour.



> Do you still want to reconcile? What are his PLUS side that makes you still love him?


Sometimes I do, and sometimes I don't. It depends on how he is. His plus sides are that when we get along and don't argue, which is most of the time, to be fair, we do have a good relationship. We click and we have so much in common. I have never known someone with whom I have so much natural chemistry. So when it's good, it is so good, that I tend to forget or push aside when it's not so good. I'm hoping that the MC and our own efforts can improve matters so that the good is more like 99% of the time rather than 75% and that when we do argue, we can learn to deal with it better.


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## southbound (Oct 31, 2010)

I don't think your being unreasonable at all. I agree with your views of sex, that it is more than just the physical, but it made me feel loved and wanted. I would have loved to have had a wife with your attitude!


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## john_lord_b3 (Jan 11, 2013)

Robsia said:


> I confess I have been guilty of this. I have an ASD and one of the traits is lack of empathy. I struggle to understand that someone else's feelings about a given situation can be any different from my own. This is something I have learned since being married and it was a difficult lesson. But I am now trying harder to see things from his POV. So I get that he struggles sometimes also. But when I spell my needs and feelings out to him very plainly, and he STILL refuses to see it, I am at a loss to know what else to do.


Does he know you're now trying harder to have more empathy? Perhaps he hasn't noticed it yet.. permanent changes takes time



> These problems didn't arise when we were dating. We were still in the courting stage and on our best behaviour.


 logical.. but it does hurts when reality struck..



> Sometimes I do, and sometimes I don't. It depends on how he is. His plus sides are that when we get along and don't argue, which is most of the time, to be fair, we do have a good relationship. We click and we have so much in common. I have never known someone with whom I have so much natural chemistry. So when it's good, it is so good, that I tend to forget or push aside when it's not so good. I'm hoping that the MC and our own efforts can improve matters so that the good is more like 99% of the time rather than 75% and that when we do argue, we can learn to deal with it better.


Ah, but see, you still have hope, and a bit of optimism. This is a good thing, you still love him and recognize that your relationship is good 75% of the time. I am certain that as long as mutual love and commitment is there, you can work out the rest.

In my country there was a book written about verbal skills between couple, it has plenty of tricks of wording and rewording things, so that the wife (this is written for wives) could avoid any arguments and still able to get the husband to do what she wants, simply by rewording the questions/requests/comments. So the wife appeared to be not arguing, but still get what she wants in the end. 

Perhaps you could look for this kind of verbal skills book in your language.

(when I said verbal skills, it meant something like this: http://www.hitchedmag.com/article.php?id=773)


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## arielucrz (Jul 9, 2013)

I'm sorry to say you're not going to find a bunch of help in SIM.


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## KalmAndKollected (Sep 26, 2012)

I can relate to your husband.

He's got resentment somewhere, or has lost attraction to you.

Lets focus on things outside of the bedroom:

Any affairs, or perceived affairs on your end?
Ever crash three of his cars?
Nag him about things to do?
Spend money you don't have?
Limit his time with his family or friends?
Do you have a poor self image about yourself?
Are you considerably over weight?
No friends of your own?
Unrealistic expectations about things in general?


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## Robsia (Mar 11, 2013)

KalmAndKollected said:


> I can relate to your husband.
> 
> He's got resentment somewhere, or has lost attraction to you.
> 
> Lets focus on things outside of the bedroom:


*Any affairs, or perceived affairs on your end? *

No

*Ever crash three of his cars?*

No - that's oddly specific.

*Nag him about things to do?*

No

*Spend money you don't have?*

No - I am the frugal one.

*Limit his time with his family or friends?*

No. In fact I have to encourage him to see them. He hardly ever spends time with his family or friends.

*Do you have a poor self image about yourself?*

Only since he played away. Now I feel quite low.

*Are you considerably over weight?*

No

*No friends of your own?*

I have all the friends I need

*Unrealistic expectations about things in general?*

We differ on what is classed as unreasonable. I don't think it is unreasonable to expect my husband to love me, care for me, want to make me happy, and comfort me when I am upset

One thing I did learn this evening is that his affairs have had an affect on him, bedroom-wise. He says that he wonders if I am thinking about it, and getting upset about it, and he say he wonders why I would let him anywhere near me.


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## chillymorn (Aug 11, 2010)

are you happy? he cheated and is not making an effort to show remorse. he doesn't desire you for what ever reason.(most likely because your too available for him).

might just be time to pull the plug.


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