# Wife Cheating with Another Woman



## Jamesjohn

My wife and I have been married for ten years and have two young kids. A few weeks back, I noticed my wife to be secretive. She changed passwords for her email and facebook and even regularly changed her phone PIN. From my investigation, I found out that before we got married, she had a relationship with a lesbian. This lesbian was her first love so it seemed. She hid this from me (later she told me that it was already the PAST). After we got married we moved to another country. While there we were busy with work and adjustments with the new environment. For the first five years our relationship was great. We had a great time. We normally held hands in public and we have been so sweet. However, during one of our visits in our country, I noticed that whenever we get into her friends in the mall she would remove her hands from mine and she did not even introduce me to her friends. When I asked her, she said she forgot. But it happened in other occasions until such time that I decided to stop being so sweet with her in public. That's when our feelings for each other started to erode. During that time, job back to another country demanded a lot of travel and I was always tired from too much demand from work. I seldom had sex with her. She seemed to be alright with it. I noticed though that we began to be a little 'cold' to each other especially when the kids came as we were busy taking care of them and at the same time work. 
While we were in that country, my wife started communicating with her friends back home and they always talked about someone whose name I could not get. It appeared that my wife was still interested with her lesbian lover. She pestered her friends about the life and situation of the lesbian who from what I gathered became addicted to drugs and broke a few families by having affairs with married women. The lesbian has already reformed according to my sources.
Last year, I was temporarily posted in our country and I brought my family with me. A few days after arrival, my wife met with her friends together with her former lesbian lover. A few months later they started texting. A couple of months back, her friend had a get together at our house while I was on an overseas trip. The lesbian slept in our house with her other friends. Nothing happened. I found out that my wife invited her other friend to come to our house as an excuse for the lesbian to sleep in our house. IN other words, my wife manipulated the situation so that it will not be obvious for the maids at home. A few days after that, my wife started going out with the lesbian again. I found out that my wife is the one always asking the lesbian to go out and even paid for their movies and food. They watched movies together. From what I gathered they made out in the movie houses, car parks and at the house of the lesbian. 
While this was happening the lesbian even attended one of the parties we hosted at home. I was introduced to her. I did not know the situation by then that by that time my wife and the lesbian were already into a monthlong affair. During that time, I remember my wife asking me to allow her to go out with her friends on an trip somewhere but I refused. I told her that we should go together as a family. She insisted that she should also have time with friends alone. I refused. I found later that she and the lesbian were planning on a trip together. 
I discovered all of these from different sources and confronted by wife. She admitted and asked for forgiveness. At first she said it was just nothing. That they were just sending SMS regularly showing their care for each other. When I probed further, she admitted that she started to fall in love with the lesbian and that she was happy that I discovered it and that I puled her out. A few days later after the confrontation, we talked some more and I told her I'm trying to forgive her. That's the time she admitted that she already had sex with the lesbian several times. I said that I have to recover from this. She begged for my forgiveness. I love her so much so I told her that I've forgiven her. I'm still trying to cope. I gave her options - to stay with the marriage or get out. She does not want our marriage to break as according to her she loves me very much and she does not want the children to grow with their parents apart. She promised to be faithful and never do it again. When I pressed for the reason why she did it, she said that I was a bit cold and always busy and did not have time for sex. I felt bad and guilty that my shortcomings drove her to infidelity. She acknowledged that it was not an excuse and admitted that it's her mistake and promised to correct it. She said she already broke up with the lesbian. 

She has changed a lot and never goes out on her own. We always go out together. Our confrontation happened about 2 weeks ago but we have made a lot of progress in terms of our relationship. Since then, we had become more open and transparent. We are trying to catch up with lost times. We have sex almost every day - sometimes 3 times a day. We went out of town to be together. So far, we are doing good. We are like new lovers again. 
But in my mind, I worried that she might do it again. Te other day, I saw her quickly remove a SIM card from one of her phones and stashed it away. I'm probably just paranoid but I suspect, that she still communicates with the lesbian by phone. I hope I'm wrong. Thoughts?


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## MattMatt

I lost my first LTR girlfriend to another woman. Hurt like anything. My best wishes to you. Stay strong for your children.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Jamesjohn

Thanks a lot for your encouragement Matt Matt


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## warlock07

Did your wife send a message to the lesbian that she wants nothing to do with her in the future ? Did you expose the lesbian to her friends ? Did you get to read the texts between them ?

Get tested for STDs.

I have a feeling that you are taking it way too easy because the affair was with a woman. This will come back and bite you in your ass today.


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## SomedayDig

It always scares me when I read about a wayward swapping SIM cards. I don't know why except to say that they're really devoted to the deception.

OP...you gave HER the option to reconcile. That is a mistake because that is YOUR option. She alread had hers and you see what she did with it?

As warlock said and I agree - you seem to have taken this too lightly because it was another woman. 

You need to get to the bottom of the reason(s) WHY she chose to step outside of your marriage before you can truly begin to reconcile. 

The sex of an affair partner matters not. She cheated on you. You are going to still get trickle truth and not get the full version of what really happened.

Besides, she's already gotten you to do most of the heavy lifting by taking blame for her affair.


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## Jamesjohn

Thanks a lot Warlock. My wife told me that she called her lover and told her to end the relationship. She also told me that they really had planned to end it because she's feeling guilty already. But I did not see the texts between them. 

No, I did not expose the lesbian to her friends. So far, only the three of us know this - the lesbian, my wife and myself.

Maybe I'm taking too easy because I love her so much and I'm really thinking of the children.




warlock07 said:


> Did your wife send a message to the lesbian that she wants nothing to do with her in the future ? Did you expose the lesbian to her friends ? Did you get to read the texts between them ?
> 
> Get tested for STDs.
> 
> I have a feeling that you are taking it way too easy because the affair was with a woman. This will come back and bite you in your ass today.


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## AlphaHalf

> But in my mind, I worried that she might do it again. Te other day, I saw her quickly remove a SIM card from one of her phones and stashed it away. I'm probably just paranoid but I suspect, that she still communicates with the lesbian by phone. I hope I'm wrong. Thoughts?



This is another red flag that your letting slip by AGAIN. How can you not be paranoid when she already had an affair behind your back a few weeks ago. Get that SIM card. Don't close your eyes and hope for it to go away. Expose her for her lies and make her accountable for her actions. If it was a man would you take it so lightly? Both of you should STD test.


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## SomedayDig

Brother...that is called rug sweeping.

I love my wife, too. I still hammered her with questions of why and how, as well as exposing to those who are close to us. Your wife had an AFFAIR. Don't think that another man is not a possiblity in her closet or future if you don't get to the bottom of this pronto.


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## Jamesjohn

Thanks for the advice. Before I gave the option, she actually told me that she wanted to stay in this marriage no matter what. She has a lot to lose if she won't stay because she could not return to the country where we migrated because her visa is attached to me and she does not have money of her own. I have already started to change all our bank accounts from joint to only my name telling her that I would invest them offshore.

We have agreed that I will never forgive her if this happens once again. Now that all our bank accounts are only under my name she maybe more careful. And if this situation gets out and the family knows, this will be a huge scandal and I'm not sure where she will end up. 

I believe that we have already gone to the bottom of the issue. First, she said she did not have feelings for the lesbian anymore but was only tempted when they met recently. But they only for a once and after a few days she told me that they started having sex. She told me that she was the one who always initiated it. Having sex in the movie houses and car parks seemed to be not her style and she told me that she's very sorry about it and regretted it. She even said that she has already lost respect for herself and wants to forget all of these and move on. She even asked to go back to the country where we migrated. Second, of course is my coldness and being too busy - this one is true for sure. 

The SIM card is still a puzzles to me. She might not be into something and I'm planning to catch her. Should I confront her? 



SomedayDig said:


> It always scares me when I read about a wayward swapping SIM cards. I don't know why except to say that they're really devoted to the deception.
> 
> OP...you gave HER the option to reconcile. That is a mistake because that is YOUR option. She already had hers and you see what she did with it?
> 
> As warlock said and I agree - you seem to have taken this too lightly because it was another woman.
> 
> You need to get to the bottom of the reason(s) WHY she chose to step outside of your marriage before you can truly begin to reconcile.
> 
> The sex of an affair partner matters not. She cheated on you. You are going to still get trickle truth and not get the full version of what really happened.
> 
> Besides, she's already gotten you to do most of the heavy lifting by taking blame for her affair.


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## SomedayDig

To confront or not to confront, that is the question. You need that SIM card and you need to find out what is on it by any means.

As for your coldness...okay...I was a pilot flying all over the world. I wasn't cold, I was just absent. Did that give my wife the green flag to have her affair? No. It shouldn't give your wife the green flag either.


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## Jamesjohn

My wife actually offered that we tell her Mum about this but I refused as I don't want this to become a scandal. Maybe we should?



SomedayDig said:


> Brother...that is called rug sweeping.
> 
> I love my wife, too. I still hammered her with questions of why and how, as well as exposing to those who are close to us. Your wife had an AFFAIR. Don't think that another man is not a possiblity in her closet or future if you don't get to the bottom of this pronto.


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## SomedayDig

Telling her mother is simply another person in the corner of the marriage. You need someone else to hold her accountable. It's not about scandal, brother. It's about someone besides you knowing the truth and someone who will actually have your back.


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## Jamesjohn

I actually tool the SIM while she was sleeping but there was nothing in it at all. I,m planning to give it a week or so when things are a bit stable and let her believe everything is OK and then start snooping once more. I'm happy you guys are giving another perspective. Thanks a lot.




SomedayDig said:


> To confront or not to confront, that is the question. You need that SIM card and you need to find out what is on it by any means.
> 
> As for your coldness...okay...I was a pilot flying all over the world. I wasn't cold, I was just absent. Did that give my wife the green flag to have her affair? No. It shouldn't give your wife the green flag either.


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## Jamesjohn

Shall I let her know when I told that person? Perhaps one of our common friends who will not spread the issue might be a good idea.




SomedayDig said:


> Telling her mother is simply another person in the corner of the marriage. You need someone else to hold her accountable. It's not about scandal, brother. It's about someone besides you knowing the truth and someone who will actually have your back.


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## SomedayDig

Now THAT is a sound plan. Let things "cool" down a bit and wait her out. One thing about people who commit adultery is that if they aren't fully blasted out of LaLa Land, they will find their way back there quickly.


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## SomedayDig

Jamesjohn said:


> Shall I let her know when I told that person? Perhaps one of our common friends who will not spread the issue might be a good idea.


You would want to let her know AFTER you talk. Make sure it is a discreet friend who is truly a friend of the marriage. This isn't about blame or casting stones. It's about accountability. The reason you don't tell your wife first is so that she can't run "defense" before your talk.


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## warlock07

Jamesjohn said:


> Thanks for the advice. Before I gave the option, she actually told me that she wanted to stay in this marriage no matter what. She has a lot to lose if she won't stay because she could not return to the country where we migrated because her visa is attached to me and she does not have money of her own. I have already started to change all our bank accounts from joint to only my name telling her that I would invest them offshore.
> 
> We have agreed that I will never forgive her if this happens once again. Now that all our bank accounts are only under my name she maybe more careful. And if this situation gets out and the family knows, this will be a huge scandal and I'm not sure where she will end up.
> 
> I believe that we have already gone to the bottom of the issue. First, she said she did not have feelings for the lesbian anymore but was only tempted when they met recently. But they only for a once and after a few days she told me that they started having sex. She told me that she was the one who always initiated it. Having sex in the movie houses and car parks seemed to be not her style and she told me that she's very sorry about it and regretted it. She even said that she has already lost respect for herself and wants to forget all of these and move on. She even asked to go back to the country where we migrated. Second, of course is my coldness and being too busy - this one is true for sure.
> 
> The SIM card is still a puzzles to me. She might not be into something and I'm planning to catch her. Should I confront her?


Where are you from ? Of all the things she stands to lose, where do you think "love for you" stands ? The lesbian OW is in which country ?


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## warlock07

Jamesjohn said:


> Thanks a lot Warlock. My wife told me that she called her lover and told her to end the relationship. She also told me that they really had planned to end it because she's feeling guilty already. But I did not see the texts between them.
> 
> No, I did not expose the lesbian to her friends. So far, only the three of us know this - the lesbian, my wife and myself.
> 
> Maybe I'm taking too easy because I love her so much and I'm really thinking of the children.


Your logic doesn't make sense. If you are really thinking about the kids and keep the family intact, then you need to stop the affair. If you really need to stop the affair, then you need to be pro-active about it and stop being in denial. 

Do you know where she hid the SIM cards ? Would she tell you if you ask her about it(She probably won't).Can't believe why anyone would have a reason to hide SIM cards unless she is continuing the affair.

Make your wife call her lover in front of you. Listen to what she says to the lover. Then you talk to this woman and confront this woman. Try to retrieve all the communication that happened in between them.


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## Jamesjohn

Ok, thanks for the advice. 



SomedayDig said:


> You would want to let her know AFTER you talk. Make sure it is a discreet friend who is truly a friend of the marriage. This isn't about blame or casting stones. It's about accountability. The reason you don't tell your wife first is so that she can't run "defense" before your talk.


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## Jamesjohn

OK I'll ask her to call her lover in front of me. I'm I'll do it pronto. I know she will be irritated but I think it would be great to see her facial expression as they talk on the phone.




warlock07 said:


> Your logic doesn't make sense. If you are really thinking about the kids and keep the family intact, then you need to stop the affair. If you really need to stop the affair, then you need to be pro-active about it and stop being in denial.
> 
> Do you know where she hid the SIM cards ? Would she tell you if you ask her about it(She probably won't).Can't believe why anyone would have a reason to hide SIM cards unless she is continuing the affair.
> 
> Make your wife call her lover in front of you. Listen to what she says to the lover. Then you talk to this woman and confront this woman. Try to retrieve all the communication that happened in between them.


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## Jamesjohn

We are from Eastern Europe and we moved to North America. We are currently in Europe and the lesbian is in Europe. 
I can feel my wife still loves me. 




warlock07 said:


> Where are you from ? Of all the things she stands to lose, where do you think "love for you" stands ? The lesbian OW is in which country ?


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## 6301

Honestly, if you knew that she was in a lesbian relationship before you were married, then you had to know that something like this might happen in your marriage. People are who they are. I'm not putting her down because of her sexuality preference but if your bi or gay, well that's who you are. There's always that chance that she would fall back on it. It's a chance that you have to take but an affair is an affair. It's hard enough to have a wife who cheats with another man but now how could you feel secure with her being around other women? Sorry but you didn't think this out before you married her. I hope you don't think that I'm coming down too hard on you but you can't turn off your sexual preferences like a light switch. My sister married a gay man who "became" straight and it didn't work out. He is gay and that's the way it is. Wasn't bad enough that he lied to her but he lied to himself. The only things in life that is guaranteed is dying and paying taxes. I hope for the best for you and that you and your wife can work it out.


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## Jamesjohn

Thanks a lot.

I did not know that she had a lesbian relationship before we got married. Almost everyone close to her knew except me. That's probably the reason why every time we meet her friends - who by the way are mostly lesbians - she would remove my hand from hers. Probably, she was not comfortable them seeing us knowing what she is. I asked her whether she is a bisexual but she said that she's really attracted to men and that she is ONLY attracted to this particular lesbian because of the way she is being cared and loved by this lesbian. I asked her why she kept the lesbian relationship from me in the past, she said that she considered it a PAST and that she did not really love the lesbian during that time. But when met, she fell in love again. 

My wife is really feminine and enjoys sex with me so much. She had a boyfriend after the lesbian and then me. 

What really puzzled me is that when she had the affair recently, she forgot all her values and decency. She did not care that people would see them in malls and cinemas and even in car parks. She told me that she was the one who initiated sex with lesbian whenever she goes to the house of the lesbian. 

She has promised to stay in the marriage and I believe her for now but I guess I need to be vigilant.



6301 said:


> Honestly, if you knew that she was in a lesbian relationship before you were married, then you had to know that something like this might happen in your marriage. People are who they are. I'm not putting her down because of her sexuality preference but if your bi or gay, well that's who you are. There's always that chance that she would fall back on it. It's a chance that you have to take but an affair is an affair. It's hard enough to have a wife who cheats with another man but now how could you feel secure with her being around other women? Sorry but you didn't think this out before you married her. I hope you don't think that I'm coming down too hard on you but you can't turn off your sexual preferences like a light switch. My sister married a gay man who "became" straight and it didn't work out. He is gay and that's the way it is. Wasn't bad enough that he lied to her but he lied to himself. The only things in life that is guaranteed is dying and paying taxes. I hope for the best for you and that you and your wife can work it out.


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## warlock07

Jamesjohn said:


> We are from Eastern Europe and we moved to North America. We are currently in Europe and the lesbian is in Europe.
> I can feel my wife still loves me.


So she needs you to be close to her lover ?


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## Jamesjohn

No i'm temporarily assigned her for work and will go back to North America in a year.



warlock07 said:


> So she needs you to be close to her lover ?


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## bryanp

Is it possible that she knows you very well. Is it possible that she knew that she could engage and initiate lesbian sex in parking lots and even in your home and in your bed; because down deep she knew that if and when she got caught you would forgive her anyway? In short, she really had nothing to lose.

Cheating in your home and bed and degrading herself in such a way in parks and cars is so massively humiliating and disrespecting to your marriage and humiliating to you as a husband and man. She clearly had been planning this from the very beginning. She played and humiliated you in the worst possible way. She was able to have her cake and eat it and her marriage remains. She played you for a total fool and degraded you in your own home and really there were no consequences for her.

If the roles were reversed and you had set up with an ex girlfriend many time to have sex in your home and marital bed would she have been so accepting and forgiving as you have been? Sorry but her actions show she wants to remain being taken care and has very little respect for you. If you do not respect yourself then who will?


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## BobSimmons

Jamesjohn said:


> The SIM card is still a puzzles to me. She might not be into something and I'm planning to catch her. * Should I confront her?*


The fact you even have to ask is a worry..why does she need two sim cards, has she had two sim cards before, ask her for the sim card and see her reaction..


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## CEL

James I think you got it pretty good. But lets me just say that YES you will need to expose the affair to your friends and family there is no shame in this because you did nothing. No matter if you were cold to her that does not excuse an affair. What happens if you get a medical condition and can't have sex does that mean she can go screw around? Of course not. I would plan for later this week or at the latest next week before you let the disclosure go. Let her know you are going to expose the affair and let her hear the conversation if they have questions she needs to answer them. This is her mess not yours it is not your job to clean it up she shyte all over you marriage vows and you love and trust. She needs to hand write a no contact letter to the women and give it to you to mail. This should happen TODAY you only have her word that she broke it off and her word is meaningless now. She could of written "We need to be apart because I want to be with my kids but someday we will meet up and I know our love will endure" or some crap like that. You just do not know the first step is the no contact the second is exposure the third is complete transparency she crapped all over you and your kids if this was someone outside you marriage you would be out for blood but since it is her you are going easy on her. This does neither you nor her any good all this is to ensure a stronger marriage.


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## 6301

I stand corrected. I misread it and thought you knew about her relationship before you married. Sorry for the error. Hope you can work this out. Good luck.


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## Jamesjohn

Guys, I'm really desperate to work this out considering the future of our children. Can you please give me the pros and cons based on your experiences? Thanks a lot.


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## Jamesjohn

I confronted my wife yesterday about the SIM card. She admitted that after we have agreed of a no contact for life with her lover she called the lover two times to put an end to the affair. I was furious and told her that she broke my trust again. She she was worried that I would not allow her to call. Of course I said I won't allow contact anymore because we want to move on. She cried a river and apologized but I said I could not easily forgive her now and threatened for a separation. She begged and promised not to do it again. 
Now guys, should I decide to leave her now? She has been begging for me to stay and asked me to work this together and that we help each other to move on.


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## jnj express

Don't separate------go very dark on her, and get into a good strong 180

No mr nice--guy, no lovey--dovey----make her sign a post--nup---take away her CC's----and make sure she understands---every thing she has is open to you---for your inspection at any and all times---she is never to hide anything from you ever again---make sure she knows the consequence to the boundary for her hiding things from you is immediate D

Print out a D packet from the country you would file a D in, and bring it home and put it where she can see it

Make sure she is fully aware that she is on the thinnest of ice---as she has repeatedly "dissed" you and the mge---it mattered not whether it was with man or woman---it was with another human being----and it was cheating, and by still contacting her lover---she is still lying to you----as to her needing closure---that is pure drivel---she knows that she is NC, and she defied you---that needs to be addressed severly---the D packet in the home, should take care of that

To print out the D packet---go to google, go to your countries legal forms---go to D packet, and print it out---it costs you nothing but some printer ink---but it will make a world of difference when your wife sees it


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## TOMTEFAR

I would file. You don't have to go through with it but it makes a strong statement. 

If you want to R you need to show her consequences of her actions.

Remember a D takes time so you will have time to work it through within yourself. It will also allow you time to observe her behaviour and figure out if she is realy remorcefull and such.


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## mineforever

Steps for "180" 
http://www.network54.com/Forum/23. 95/thread/1302875291/last-1302891381/The+The 180

---------------For those that are interested in Michelle Weiner Davis's divorce busting 180 degree list, here it is:
1. Do not pursue, reason, chase, beg, plead orimplore.
2. No frequent phone calls.
3. Do not point out good points in marriage.
4. Do not follow him/her around the house.
5. Do not encourage talk about the future.
6. Do not ask for help from family members.
7. Do not ask for reassurances.
8. Do not buy gifts.
9. Do not schedule dates together.
10. Do not spy on spouse.
11. Do not say "I Love You".
12. Act as if you are moving on with your life.
13. Be cheerful, strong, outgoing and attractive.
14. Don't sit around waiting on your spouse - get busy, do things, go to church, go out with friends, etc.
15. When home with your spouse, (if you usually start the conversation) be scarce or short on words.
16. If you are in the habit of asking your spouse her whereabouts, ASK NOTHING.
17. You need to make your partner think that you have had an awakening and, as far as you are concerned, you are going
to move on with your life, with or without your spouse.
18. Do not be nasty, angry or even cold - just pull back and wait to see if spouse notices and, more important, realize
what she will be missing
19. No matter what you are feeling TODAY, only show your spouse happiness and contentment. 
Show him/her someone he/she would want to be around.
20. All questions about marriage should be put onhold, until your spouse wants to talk about it (which may be a while).
21. Never lose your cool.
22. Don't be overly enthusiastic.
23. Do not argue about how they feel (it only makes their feelings stronger).
24. Be patient
25. Listen carefully to what your spouse is really saying to you.
26. Learn to back off, shut up and possibly walk away.
27. Take care of yourself (exercise, sleep, laugh & focus on all the other parts of your life that are not in turmoil).
28. Be strong and confident.
29. Know that if you can do 180, your smallestCONSISTENT actions will be noticed much more than any words you can 
say or write.
30. Do not be openly desperate or needy even when you are hurting more than ever and are desperate and needy.
31. Do not focus on yourself when communicating with your spouse.
32. Do not believe any of what you hear and less than 50% of what you see. Your spouse will speak in absolute negatives
because they are hurting and scared.
33. Do not give up no matter how dark it is or how bad you feel.
34. Do not backslide from your hardearned changes. 2 things to think about if you do this:1) You have to do the 180 list NOT to be manipulative but because it's the right thing to do for you. You have to heal from this experience. You have to back off for your own sanity now. You have to have a plan and know that you will be a better person with or without them after all is said and done -- that you will live and learn and move on no matter what. So you have to be geniune when you follow these ideas, rather than faking it and being insincere because your only goal is to get them back. That's not what you want to do. Having a certain person as our spouse is not a need, it's a want. When I wrote down a list of all the definite needs in my life, I realized that almost everything beyond food, clothing and shelter is a want. 10 seconds after I looked at the list, I stopped making decisions based on emotion. That's when I realized that my wanting to have her was causing me to beg and plead for her to come back. That was driving her away more so I stopped doing it immediately. In doing my own version of the 180 list I could tell nearly an immediate change in her behavior.2) Realize that when your spouse sees your new attitude they are very likely to be a little jealous or at least have some curiosity about what's going on in your life to cause this change. However, they very well may react the same way towards you for some time (especially if they read books or go to message boards also). REALIZE that this tactic can also work simultaneously on you if the spouse begins to likewise. Be aware of it and plan to have your own feelings of jealousy and curiosity in advance. However, like with #1 above, if you're doing the 180 list to better yourself and everyone involved, then it will matter less what they are doing.


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## bryanp

I am sorry but she now knows that your threats are hollow. After all of this cheating, disrespect and humiliation toward you and your marriage; you forgive her and she promises to build trust with you. She then proceeds to call her lover two more times behind your back.

You now have no credibility at all because she knows that she can continue to lie to you and all you can do is give her hollow threats. You judge a person by their actions and not by their words and her actions speak volumes toward how she really feels about you.

Clearly there have no consequences to her actions. All she has to do is show you some tears and you back down time and again. NO consequences to her actions equals no motivation to change.
If you do not respect yourself then who will? She is still playing you.


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## bfree

Jamesjohn said:


> I confronted my wife yesterday about the SIM card. She admitted that after we have agreed of a no contact for life with her lover she called the lover two times to put an end to the affair. I was furious and told her that she broke my trust again. She she was worried that I would not allow her to call. Of course I said I won't allow contact anymore because we want to move on. She cried a river and apologized but I said I could not easily forgive her now and threatened for a separation. She begged and promised not to do it again.
> Now guys, should I decide to leave her now? She has been begging for me to stay and asked me to work this together and that we help each other to move on.


Have you exposed to family and friends yet? If not this would be a good time to do it. Maybe ask a trusted family member to help you to keep your wife honest for a while until she gets her cranium out of her rectum. I would also agree that you need to turn your back on her for a while and not be there for her. She needs to see that you are serious and ready to take the next step which is obviously divorce. You cannot just let this slide with no strong response or as bryan says she will just wait until you aren't looking and do it again.


----------



## BobSimmons

Question: If you want to make one phone call to a number in your address book, do you buy another phone?

If she's calling twice just to break up, why buy another SIM card? It's because there it won't show up on the phone bills when they come in. What she did is called taking the affair underground. You caught her, she swore to end it but went out and bought a new card to continue contact.

How much more disrespect are you going to take?

You set boundaries and she crossed them. You asked her to respect you and the marriage so you could work on it together..what did she do, went behind your back again.

Unfortunately this is now your life. Never knowing if she's sincere or not. Never knowing if the OW is still in the picture. Every time she's late home wondering where she is.

It seems crying and begging is enough for you, you seem to fall for it every time. For you, that is not good. For your marriage, it's terminal.


----------



## bryanp

I think that Bob Simmons totally nailed it. It is so obvious that down deep that your wife has so little respect for you and knows exactly how to manipulate you due to your desperation for her.

Ask yourself why should your wife respect you at all after everything she has put your through? She lies and manipulates you for her own selfishness without consequences for her actions. One more time. If you do not respect yourself then who will since your wife clearly does not.

Bob made such a great point. Do you really go out and but a new phone to make 2 phone calls? I am sorry my friend but you are in major denial and clearly in a fog yourself. Do you really want to live your life like this? Good luck.


----------



## Shaggy

I would physically destroy the second SIM card after you access all the call logs and texts from it.

You might even take away your wife's cell phone. From her breaking no contact so soon, I think it's very likely you will catch her again and again so you will need to be very vigilant.

Obviously she has to also end her friendships with ALL the mutuel friends that she shares with the other woman, all of them must go forever.

You should also be exposing the affair.


----------



## bandit.45

File for divorce. She's a lesbian and has been lying to you about her orientation from before you were married. 

You are a front for her. She can live the straight life and keep up appearances by staying married to a straight, while sneaking around behind your back cheating with other lesbians. She's a sneak and a coward. She doesn't have the guts to come out or to divorce you and set you free as she should.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## See_Listen_Love

Because of the kids I would advise not to D. But it could not hurt to have the papers on the corner of the table, as a warning that you are serious about this.

I take it she is bisexual, and she lied about several issues. You need to have the truth from her. At this moment she would like to be married to you because she liked the married life with husband and kids, but also was in love with her old flame. If you were grown apart because of the busy lifestyle, she did not attach to you anymore.

You both could work on it, IF she is bisexual, if she is a lesbian, I think you have no chance of success.

Maybe a poly?


----------



## LostViking

See_Listen_Love said:


> Because of the kids I would advise not to D. But it could not hurt to have the papers on the corner of the table, as a warning that you are serious about this.
> 
> I take it she is bisexual, and she lied about several issues. You need to have the truth from her. At this moment she would like to be married to you because she liked the married life with husband and kids, but also was in love with her old flame. If you were grown apart because of the busy lifestyle, she did not attach to you anymore.
> 
> You both could work on it, IF she is bisexual, if she is a lesbian, I think you have no chance of success.
> 
> Maybe a poly?


Staying in a farce of a marriage is never good for the kids. I'm European like you and I understand your mindset. But over the years I have changed my point of view in that regard. How can this man raise healthy happy children in an environment of lies and deception?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Jamesjohn

Guys,

Thanks for your advice. Over the past few days, we have tried to move on. I told my wife that I was separating from her. She begged and almost committed suicide. She confessed to everything. I found out that the relationship started last March and ended at the end of April when I caught them. She said that she regretted everything and has already cut all ties with the old flame. She blocked all communications. She also cut her contacts with mutual friends with the old flame for life. She threw away all SIM cards and gave me all passwords to her email accounts, skype, bank accounts, etc. She is also giving full control of all her finances and I will just give her enough funds for grocery, etc. We agreed to have a post nuptial that should she do it again, she will lose everything and will not get anything from me aside from being barred from seeing the kids for life. She told me that she has given her old flame stuff like perfume, shirts and a USD 100 infinity ring. She told me that the ring was just a remembrance since they have planned to end to relationship anyway because she has been feeling guilty. I have talked to the old flame by phone who promised me not to get in touch with my wife anymore. 

My wife is getting all the stuff back and she is returning all the stuff given by the old flame. So far, we are getting along well. 

Our sex life has been at its best and we have been more caring for each other. I realized that I have neglected her for so long and am trying to compensate for that. I can feel she is so sincere and promised to do everything to make our marriage work. We have prayed together and she promised to God to never commit this sin again. 

Please pray for us, guys. 

Thanks a lot.


----------



## warlock07

Trust but keep verifying


----------



## bfree

Jamesjohn said:


> Guys,
> 
> Thanks for your advice. Over the past few days, we have tried to move on. I told my wife that I was separating from her. She begged and almost committed suicide. She confessed to everything. I found out that the relationship started last March and ended at the end of April when I caught them. She said that she regretted everything and has already cut all ties with the old flame. She blocked all communications. She also cut her contacts with mutual friends with the old flame for life. She threw away all SIM cards and gave me all passwords to her email accounts, skype, bank accounts, etc. She is also giving full control of all her finances and I will just give her enough funds for grocery, etc. We agreed to have a post nuptial that should she do it again, she will lose everything and will not get anything from me aside from being barred from seeing the kids for life. She told me that she has given her old flame stuff like perfume, shirts and a USD 100 infinity ring. She told me that the ring was just a remembrance since they have planned to end to relationship anyway because she has been feeling guilty. I have talked to the old flame by phone who promised me not to get in touch with my wife anymore.
> 
> My wife is getting all the stuff back and she is returning all the stuff given by the old flame. So far, we are getting along well.
> 
> Our sex life has been at its best and we have been more caring for each other. I realized that I have neglected her for so long and am trying to compensate for that. I can feel she is so sincere and promised to do everything to make our marriage work. We have prayed together and she promised to God to never commit this sin again.
> 
> Please pray for us, guys.
> 
> Thanks a lot.



This is great news. It sounds like your wife is sincere and you handled this very well. I pray that this really solidifies things between you both going forward. Use this crisis to strengthen the bond between you and never take your marriage for granted again. Having a good marriage is work. Don't get lazy and you'll be fine.


----------



## Omgitsjoe

Very good news and we apprciate the update. She does sound sincerely sorry with what had happened. 

Good luck and yes you and your family will be in my prayers.


----------



## Shaggy

That's great news. 

I would suggest you have her take a polygraph to establish the whole story really has been finally told. Act, quickly while she is cooperating.

For the things she's getting back, I suggest you trash them. No lingering memories. That said, also trash from your wife's wardrobe all the clothes, lingerie, shoes etc that she wore for the other woman. 

It may sound extreme, but you want to purge everything connected to the affair.

You may also want to delete pictures and saved emails from her as well.

Then plan for the future. What is your game plan if in 6 months or a year your wife becomes distant again?


----------



## bandit.45

I don't mean to be a buzzkill here but how do you get a wife with the opposite sexual orientation to stay faithful to a husband for the rest of her life.?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Jamesjohn

Difficult to answer. I asked her and she told me that she is more attracted to men. She is only attracted to one lesbian and that is her old flame. I can also attest that in our life together I never saw her look at other women 'lustfully'. According to her and to my spies my wife has never committed any infidelity before except for this one. Looks like her relationship with the old flame has been so deep. But now she hates her for not standing up for her.





bandit.45 said:


> I don't mean to be a buzzkill here but how do you get a wife with the opposite sexual orientation to stay faithful to a husband for the rest of her life.?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## bfree

Shaggy said:


> That's great news.
> 
> I would suggest you have her take a polygraph to establish the whole story really has been finally told. Act, quickly while she is cooperating.
> 
> For the things she's getting back, I suggest you trash them. No lingering memories. That said, also trash from your wife's wardrobe all the clothes, lingerie, shoes etc that she wore for the other woman.
> 
> It may sound extreme, but you want to purge everything connected to the affair.
> 
> You may also want to delete pictures and saved emails from her as well.
> 
> Then plan for the future. What is your game plan if in 6 months or a year your wife becomes distant again?


Burning things together would be a good visual demonstration of ending this relationship and putting it in the past. Plus it would be a bonding experience for the two of you.


----------



## bfree

Jamesjohn said:


> Difficult to answer. I asked her and she told me that she is more attracted to men. She is only attracted to one lesbian and that is her old flame. I can also attest that in our life together I never saw her look at other women 'lustfully'. According to her and to my spies my wife has never committed any infidelity before except for this one. Looks like her relationship with the old flame has been so deep. But now she hates her for not standing up for her.


Maybe she represents the person who took her L virginity. If so she may have had a special place in her heart. Perhaps the possibility of losing you has soured the romantic memories she had for this woman and now she sees things in a more realistic light. Only time will tell. I agree with others that you should still maintain healthy vigilance that your wife doesn't reinitiate contact with her.


----------



## See_Listen_Love

I get from you post she is sincere in remorse, but keep in mind temptation can be a power too strong to withstand, so while meaning now what she says she could fall back.

Even with a DD2 or DD3 as a possibility I would say she is worth while to try to have her come back to you.


----------



## MattMatt

Jamesjohn said:


> Guys,
> 
> Thanks for your advice. Over the past few days, we have tried to move on. I told my wife that I was separating from her. She begged and almost committed suicide. She confessed to everything. I found out that the relationship started last March and ended at the end of April when I caught them. She said that she regretted everything and has already cut all ties with the old flame. She blocked all communications. She also cut her contacts with mutual friends with the old flame for life. She threw away all SIM cards and gave me all passwords to her email accounts, skype, bank accounts, etc. She is also giving full control of all her finances and I will just give her enough funds for grocery, etc. We agreed to have a post nuptial that should she do it again, she will lose everything and will not get anything from me aside from being barred from seeing the kids for life. She told me that she has given her old flame stuff like perfume, shirts and a USD 100 infinity ring. She told me that the ring was just a remembrance since they have planned to end to relationship anyway because she has been feeling guilty. I have talked to the old flame by phone who promised me not to get in touch with my wife anymore.
> 
> My wife is getting all the stuff back and she is returning all the stuff given by the old flame. So far, we are getting along well.
> 
> Our sex life has been at its best and we have been more caring for each other. I realized that I have neglected her for so long and am trying to compensate for that. I can feel she is so sincere and promised to do everything to make our marriage work. We have prayed together and she promised to God to never commit this sin again.
> 
> *Please pray for us, guys.
> *
> Thanks a lot.


Consider it done.:smthumbup:


----------



## torn2012

Hi Jamesjohn. I've just read your thread. I'm sorry you're going through this. My own marriage ended a year ago because of my wife's intrest in women so I sympathize with some of what you are going through.

You seem to be handling this well so far. Well done on getting her to confess and take steps toward getting your marriage back on track. But I have to say (and I'm sure you know this already) that this is no time to rest.

It seems to me that your wife only got serious about fessing up and breaking contact when you made it clear that you were prepared to walk. You must keep this up. She engaged in the affair and continued to be in contact with this woman after you made her promise not to because she believed you would take her back regardless. If you allow her to be in that frame of mind again she will likely betray you again.

Be very skeptical about everything she does and says from now on. Cheaters by nature are master manipulators. She will say all the things she thinks you need to hear so don't take anything on face value. 
This was no mistake. You don't take a wrong turn and end up with your mouth full of vagina. This affair was deliberately and meticulously orchestrated. And she did it not because of some chance encounter, she did it because she wanted to and she thought she was smart enough to do it without you finding out. She even had the nerve to flaunt her lover in front of you in your own home. She treated you like a fool. But you my friend are no fool. 

Do not allow her to convince you that you should forget or ignore what happened with kind words or with amazing sex. You NEED to remember, you need to maintain the rage. Because if you don't, You'll be back here again.

I know it's hard and counterintuitive but sometimes you also have to remove the children from your decision making process when it comes to D or R. Many will disagree with me on this one but my reasoning is that your children need you to be the best man that you can be more than they need to have both parents in the one house. Just my opinion. 

Also don't be to quick to pass off the homosexual tendencies of your wife. My own experience was that it was an undeniable force within my ex wife's makeup. Being with a woman was as fundamental to her as hunger is to you and I. She starved herself of it but eventually she knew that she wasn't able to live an authentic life without it.

Sorry for the long winded post! Some of what I say might seem harsh but I'm in your corner mate!

One more thing. You really need to stop focusing on your failings within the marriage. NOTHING you did warrants the betrayal your wife committed. Stay strong!

I wish you well.


----------



## Jamesjohn

Thanks a lot my friend. I will always remember your advice and stay vigilant. We are praying together now so that both of us will not fall into this kind of temptation in the future and for our marriage to remain strong. 

We have written a postnuptial and all her resources are with me now so the stakes are very high for her should she fall back again. I think she clearly understand that while I love her very much I will have zero tolerance on her doing this again even just talking to her ex flame and their mutual friends. 

I just pray it won't happen again as I made it clear that I don't care about children anymore should this happen again.

Thanks a lot for your support. 




torn2012 said:


> Hi Jamesjohn. I've just read your thread. I'm sorry you're going through this. My own marriage ended a year ago because of my wife's intrest in women so I sympathize with some of what you are going through.
> 
> You seem to be handling this well so far. Well done on getting her to confess and take steps toward getting your marriage back on track. But I have to say (and I'm sure you know this already) that this is no time to rest.
> 
> It seems to me that your wife only got serious about fessing up and breaking contact when you made it clear that you were prepared to walk. You must keep this up. She engaged in the affair and continued to be in contact with this woman after you made her promise not to because she believed you would take her back regardless. If you allow her to be in that frame of mind again she will likely betray you again.
> 
> Be very skeptical about everything she does and says from now on. Cheaters by nature are master manipulators. She will say all the things she thinks you need to hear so don't take anything on face value.
> This was no mistake. You don't take a wrong turn and end up with your mouth full of vagina. This affair was deliberately and meticulously orchestrated. And she did it not because of some chance encounter, she did it because she wanted to and she thought she was smart enough to do it without you finding out. She even had the nerve to flaunt her lover in front of you in your own home. She treated you like a fool. But you my friend are no fool.
> 
> Do not allow her to convince you that you should forget or ignore what happened with kind words or with amazing sex. You NEED to remember, you need to maintain the rage. Because if you don't, You'll be back here again.
> 
> I know it's hard and counterintuitive but sometimes you also have to remove the children from your decision making process when it comes to D or R. Many will disagree with me on this one but my reasoning is that your children need you to be the best man that you can be more than they need to have both parents in the one house. Just my opinion.
> 
> Also don't be to quick to pass off the homosexual tendencies of your wife. My own experience was that it was an undeniable force within my ex wife's makeup. Being with a woman was as fundamental to her as hunger is to you and I. She starved herself of it but eventually she knew that she wasn't able to live an authentic life without it.
> 
> Sorry for the long winded post! Some of what I say might seem harsh but I'm in your corner mate!
> 
> One more thing. You really need to stop focusing on your failings within the marriage. NOTHING you did warrants the betrayal your wife committed. Stay strong!
> 
> I wish you well.


----------



## torn2012

You are very welcome my friend.

Be sure to keep posting here whenever you want advice or just need to vent.


----------



## Suspecting

Jamesjohn said:


> Difficult to answer. I asked her and she told me that she is more attracted to men. She is only attracted to one lesbian and that is her old flame. I can also attest that in our life together I never saw her look at other women 'lustfully'. According to her and to my spies my wife has never committed any infidelity before except for this one. Looks like her relationship with the old flame has been so deep. But now she hates her for not standing up for her.


For comparison, have you ever seen her look other men 'lustfully'? How do you know the other woman is gay?

I see from your posts she now is financially dependent on you but do you realise that in the long run you can't 'force' her like this, the will must come from her. I don't like to bring the dreaded word here, but eventually she will start feeling being controlled and might build some resentment towards you because of that.


----------



## Jamesjohn

In the course of our marriage, my wife would always tell me about how she would fantasize about famous actors. She even dreamed of them according to her. 

On the control part, I told her that once our trust has been rebuilt, I will return these privileges to her.


----------



## Jamesjohn

Suspecting said:


> For comparison, have you ever seen her look other men 'lustfully'? How do you know the other woman is gay?
> 
> I see from your posts she now is financially dependent on you but do you realise that in the long run you can't 'force' her like this, the will must come from her. I don't like to bring the dreaded word here, but eventually she will start feeling being controlled and might build some resentment towards you because of that.


I know the other woman is gay as she attested by common friends.


----------



## Jamesjohn

Guys, we are trying to move on but there are times when her infidelity start playing in my mind again and I become upset. I think it becomes lesser and lesser now and I learn how to laugh and joke around. Hopefully in the coming minds, we can put these things behind us. 

Please continue to pray for us.


----------



## torn2012

Unfortunately you will be on an emotional roller coaster for some time Jamesjohn. There will come a time when you are able to be yourself again but first you will have to endure some pain.

Ride it out my friend. You can't see it yet but better days are on the horizon.


----------



## bfree

*Re: Re: Wife Cheating with Another Woman*



Jamesjohn said:


> Guys, we are trying to move on but there are times when her infidelity start playing in my mind again and I become upset. I think it becomes lesser and lesser now and I learn how to laugh and joke around. Hopefully in the coming minds, we can put these things behind us.
> 
> Please continue to pray for us.


Just keep in mind that when you trigger it will eventually pass. Just knowing that may help you ride it out.


----------



## Acabado

Jamesjohn it's not going to be easy.
Maybe you could hang wround the reconciliation thread. You will be welcomed there.

Healing thoughts your way.


----------



## See_Listen_Love

Jamesjohn, I think you are rugsweeping.

This is too quick done with, with prayer you cannot cover what happened, it will start rotting under the carpet.

While being in favor of forgiving and starting anew, you first need to know what exactly you are dealing with.


----------



## Jamesjohn

Thanks a lot for this very good reminder.

I believe what I'm dealing with is that my wife has been 'de-virginized' by her lesbian lover when they were in college. They have had good memories that re-sparkled when they met again recently - which is 15 years later.

I also found out that during the past 5 years, my wife has been actively seeking to know the whereabouts of this lesbian. She said she just had this longing with the lesbian. 

We had lots of discussion lately and she promised not to do this again. She appeared to have been traumatized.






See_Listen_Love said:


> Jamesjohn, I think you are rugsweeping.
> 
> This is too quick done with, with prayer you cannot cover what happened, it will start rotting under the carpet.
> 
> While being in favor of forgiving and starting anew, you first need to know what exactly you are dealing with.


----------



## torn2012

How are you coping with this now Jamesjohn? I hope you are feeling better.


----------



## dsGrazzl3D

Sorry this happened to you.
I think you mentioned about kids at the beginning... Are they okay? Are they too young to know about these problems? Hope all is well. I'm still hoping none of her previous time with LL (lesbian lover) and friends included your kids. That might be a much bigger struggle. I hope this was away from them. 
`will pray for your marriage and family! Good Luck.


----------



## Jamesjohn

Honestly, guys, it's really a roller coaster ride. I continually discover things that make me upset. My wife just confessed to me that after the night we had a confrontation, she gave (they did not meet but sent through her friend) her lesbian lover an infinity ring. She said she gave the ring because she already bought it a couple of weeks back and wanted to get rid of it and was scared I would know it and get angry if the ring remained at home and I saw it. I believed that she was confused right after the confrontation and did not know what to do with the ring. But I was upset because she should have told me about it and did not give the ring anymore. What makes it more upsetting is that for months I have told her that I want to buy two infinity rings for our upcoming 10th anniversary. 
Anyway, she promised to take back the ring. Together we sent a letter to the lesbian lover and ask her to return the ring. 
What do you think about this behavior guys. 
Right after that I know that she has not communicated with the lesbian anymore as I took her phone and has shown remorse. She even knelled down in front of me asking for forgiveness. She has lost weight and looked so pale now because of the tool this has caused her. 
I have nagged at her and told her unsavory words emphasizing how disrespecting she has been. She apologized profusely. She surrendered all credit cards, and ATMs. She just asks money from me when needed and she accounts them everyday. She has signed a post-nup that should this happen again, she would not get anything from me. 
Thoughts, guys.


----------



## Jamesjohn

Hello, my kids are too young to know about what's happening. They do not know that we are fighting and we are trying to rebuid the relationship. One time, the LL picked up my wife and my son from his school. I was so mad of that. My son is 7 years old and does not know anything so far. 



dsGrazzl3D said:


> Sorry this happened to you.
> I think you mentioned about kids at the beginning... Are they okay? Are they too young to know about these problems? Hope all is well. I'm still hoping none of her previous time with LL (lesbian lover) and friends included your kids. That might be a much bigger struggle. I hope this was away from them.
> `will pray for your marriage and family! Good Luck.


----------



## bfree

Jamesjohn said:


> Honestly, guys, it's really a roller coaster ride. I continually discover things that make me upset. My wife just confessed to me that after the night we had a confrontation, she gave (they did not meet but sent through her friend) her lesbian lover an infinity ring. She said she gave the ring because she already bought it a couple of weeks back and wanted to get rid of it and was scared I would know it and get angry if the ring remained at home and I saw it. I believed that she was confused right after the confrontation and did not know what to do with the ring. But I was upset because she should have told me about it and did not give the ring anymore. What makes it more upsetting is that for months I have told her that I want to buy two infinity rings for our upcoming 10th anniversary.
> Anyway, she promised to take back the ring. Together we sent a letter to the lesbian lover and ask her to return the ring.
> What do you think about this behavior guys.
> Right after that I know that she has not communicated with the lesbian anymore as I took her phone and has shown remorse. She even knelled down in front of me asking for forgiveness. She has lost weight and looked so pale now because of the tool this has caused her.
> I have nagged at her and told her unsavory words emphasizing how disrespecting she has been. She apologized profusely. She surrendered all credit cards, and ATMs. She just asks money from me when needed and she accounts them everyday. She has signed a post-nup that should this happen again, she would not get anything from me.
> Thoughts, guys.


James, Google the term "alpha widow" and read the descriptions. Basically an alpha widow is a woman that has been in a relationship with a true alpha male type. She will probably not choose a long term relationship with him because true alphas are not nurturing or caring men. But they will always crave the way they felt when with him. I honestly feel that you have something like that going on here with your wife except its more like she's a lesbian widow. She may be married to you, you might be the best match for her in a long term relationship, you might in fact be the best man in the world. But she is always going to long for that lesbian relationship that she had with this woman. Its always going to be in her head. She will always be looking to get back to "nirvana." And when things aren't exactly peachy between you two she will turn her imagination and attention back to this woman. You might be able to force her to stay married to you but I don't think you'll ever be able to purge those lovely memories out of her head.


----------



## Jamesjohn

I really agree with you. It looks like what you are saying is true. My wife told me that she could not live without me. She could not imagine a world without me. But I asked her why she longs for her LL. She told me that her feelings for me are different for her feelings with the LL. I believe that she started turning her imagination when at some point in time our relationship was a bit cold but not very bad. She said that she longs for the care of the LL which is different from the way I care for her. I don't think I could purge those memories.
Any advice? Perhaps, I should be more nurturing to her? Or should I just call it quits if I can't accept that I share her love with an LL?





bfree said:


> James, Google the term "alpha widow" and read the descriptions. Basically an alpha widow is a woman that has been in a relationship with a true alpha male type. She will probably not choose a long term relationship with him because true alphas are not nurturing or caring men. But they will always crave the way they felt when with him. I honestly feel that you have something going on here with your wife except its more like she's a lesbian widow. She may be married to you, you might be the best match for her in a long term relationship, you might in fact be the best man in the world. But she is always going to long for that lesbian relationship that she had with this woman. Its always going to be in her head. She will always be looking to get back to "nirvana." And when things aren't exactly peachy between you two she will turn her imagination and attention back to this woman. You might be able to force her to stay married to you but I don't think you'll ever be able to purge those lovely memories out of her head.


----------



## torn2012

*Re: Re: Wife Cheating with Another Woman*



Jamesjohn said:


> Honestly, guys, it's really a roller coaster ride. I continually discover things that make me upset. My wife just confessed to me that after the night we had a confrontation, she gave (they did not meet but sent through her friend) her lesbian lover an infinity ring. She said she gave the ring because she already bought it a couple of weeks back and wanted to get rid of it and was scared I would know it and get angry if the ring remained at home and I saw it. I believed that she was confused right after the confrontation and did not know what to do with the ring. But I was upset because she should have told me about it and did not give the ring anymore. What makes it more upsetting is that for months I have told her that I want to buy two infinity rings for our upcoming 10th anniversary.
> Anyway, she promised to take back the ring. Together we sent a letter to the lesbian lover and ask her to return the ring.
> What do you think about this behavior guys.
> Right after that I know that she has not communicated with the lesbian anymore as I took her phone and has shown remorse. She even knelled down in front of me asking for forgiveness. She has lost weight and looked so pale now because of the tool this has caused her.
> I have nagged at her and told her unsavory words emphasizing how disrespecting she has been. She apologized profusely. She surrendered all credit cards, and ATMs. She just asks money from me when needed and she accounts them everyday. She has signed a post-nup that should this happen again, she would not get anything from me.
> Thoughts, guys.


This is tough Jamesjohn. I know right now you are desperately trying to cling to the hope that the marriage can be salvaged. I know because I felt the same way. My wife initially said she wanted to try and make things work. But it wasn't long before I could tell that she wasn't happy. Read my thread if you want to know about the path I walked, you may find similarities with your own struggle.

I don't buy her excuse for sending the ring after you confronted her. There are so many other things she could have done if she wanted to get rid of it. She could have pawned it, donated it to charity or even just thrown it in the trash. By sending the ring to her lover she was sending a powerful message. Especially after you made it clear that you wanted her to do that for you!

Think of it this way- he words to the lover were "we can't see each other anymore because my husband found out". But her actions were "I give you this ring that symbolizes my eternal love for you". That's literally what an eternity ring is for.

And she kept this from you after you demanded the truth.

My friend, if you want my honest opinion, I'm afraid that I don't think your wife can truly commit her heart to you.

I think she understands how much she has to lose if you separate. That is what drives her to desperately fight to stay married to you. But her actions are not those of a person who puts her husband above all others.

You can try to reconcile if you have the energy for it. But you are making a rod for your own back by continuing to stay despite her repeatedly breaking your trust and the rules you both agreed to.

If it was me, knowing what I know now, I would be filing for divorce.

My opinion, I think in the very least you need some time apart so that you can decide if you can live with this without her continuously interfering with your thoughts. And by time apart I mean she leaves. Not you.


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## bryanp

I think BFREE absolutely nailed. She may love you to a degree but her heart and emotionally love will always be with her girlfriend. Her connection with this woman is something you will never have with her. She is with you but she knows she is supposed to be with you and her children. She has a life style that she does not wish to abandon. 

Let me ask you this and be totally honest. If there was a situation where your wife had to make an immediate choice to to be able to save from death at the same time for you and her girlfriend and she could only save one----Who do you think she would save? I think your honest answer will tell you everything you need to know.


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## chillymorn

pull the plug now. get a lawyer protect your self and be there for your kids. 


I don't think there any chance of recovering for this.


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## RClawson

bfree said:


> *Google the term "alpha widow" and read the descriptions. Basically an alpha widow is a woman that has been in a relationship with a true alpha male type. She will probably not choose a long term relationship with him because true alphas are not nurturing or caring men.** But they will always crave the way they felt when with him*. I honestly feel that you have something like that going on here with your wife except its more like she's a lesbian widow. She may be married to you, you might be the best match for her in a long term relationship, you might in fact be the best man in the world. But she is always going to long for that lesbian relationship that she had with this woman. Its always going to be in her head. *She will always be looking to get back to "nirvana." And when things aren't exactly peachy between you two she will turn her imagination and attention back to this* woman. You might be able to force her to stay married to you but I don't think you'll ever be able to purge those lovely memories out of her head.


This is truly enlightening. Thanks!


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## bfree

*Re: Re: Wife Cheating with Another Woman*



Jamesjohn said:


> I really agree with you. It looks like what you are saying is true. My wife told me that she could not live without me. She could not imagine a world without me. But I asked her why she longs for her LL. She told me that her feelings for me are different for her feelings with the LL. I believe that she started turning her imagination when at some point in time our relationship was a bit cold but not very bad. She said that she longs for the care of the LL which is different from the way I care for her. I don't think I could purge those memories.
> Any advice? Perhaps, I should be more nurturing to her? Or should I just call it quits if I can't accept that I share her love with an LL?


See that's the point. There is absolutely nothing you can do. This is all in your wife's head. Her sexual identity is at the very least fluid enough to call her bisexual but I strongly suspect she is in fact lesbian but attracted to specifically one type of woman. In the future if she meets up with a woman that reminds get of this woman all those feelings will bubble up to the surface once more. There have been numerous stories about women that took the kids and ran off to be with another woman. Even if she doesn't do that the chances are that she will eventually act on her feelings. Maybe she waits until the children are older and then leaves you. You have to decide if you can live with that uncertainty. In any case I would have legal documents signed protecting the financial future for you and the children. After that is done I would insist that your wife go to counseling to determine whether she is actually lesbian and repressing her sexuality or has an obsession with this particular woman. You need to find out now where you are in her mind before you waste a good portion of your life with her only to be left alone when get older.


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## See_Listen_Love

Let her go. Like a bird, you have to wait if she comes back or not.


An alternative, in Europe no so strang anymore as in the US: Have an open marriage, the core is your both family with the kids. Like a kind of community.

It has plus and minus, but I look primarily at the kids in this case. I do not really believe in the current practice of serial monogamy with lots of destroyed families all over the place.

The old marriage is still dreamed of, but does not exist for the majority of people. Let's be real about his.


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## Acabado

Jamesjohn said:


> She said that she longs for the care of the LL which is different from the way I care for her. I don't think I could purge those memories.


You can't. She can though if she wants to. She needs to completely give up the fond memories. The only way I know is (if you can endure it) is throwing OW and the relationship under the bus, sharing everything what was/is in her mind. Any little secret - between them - has to be in the open. Secrets hold power themselves. Your wife nees to violate their relationship and betray her with you. Sharing eveything with you will cheapen it. The idealized, lieerent, romantic notions fade while surface the sordidness.
That's why the only one who can do it is her. She needs to decide to renounce to OW and their relationship in her heart forever.
It was very hard for me but necessary. In that phase I wasn't interested in R with her but very invested in destroying any little piece of their star crossed love story.
And you will never know for sure if she's still thinking about it fondly. There's sure an element of feel good/scapism and fantasy which with time becomes an addiction sort of, we tend to resort to our addictions to ease anxiety. Who knows whether she go back there in her mind when she needs to ease her anxiety?


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## LostViking

Try this. 

Ask your wife if you can have a threesome with her an the OW. Watch her hit the ceiling. 

She is not bisexual JJ. She is a lesbian hiding as a bisexual. She does not love you more than as a friend who shares the bills. She does not see you as her mate. 

Divorce her and put an end to this charade. She is being selfish and you are enabling her.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## aug

LostViking said:


> Try this.
> 
> Ask your wife if you can have a threesome with her an the OW. *Watch her hit the ceiling.*


Or, maybe not?


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## Suspecting

LostViking said:


> Try this.
> 
> Ask your wife if you can have a threesome with her an the OW. Watch her hit the ceiling.
> 
> She is not bisexual JJ. She is a lesbian hiding as a bisexual. She does not love you more than as a friend who shares the bills. She does not see you as her mate.
> 
> Divorce her and put an end to this charade. She is being selfish and you are enabling her.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


This does not make sense asking since the OP said the OW is gay. She would not have sex with him. Even if they were both bisexual it does not mean they would be open to group sex. That's not what the term bisexual means.


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## LostViking

Suspecting said:


> This does not make sense asking since the OP said the OW is gay. She would not have sex with him. Even if they were both bisexual it does not mean they would be open to group sex. That's not what the term bisexual means.


No that's not what I mean . Its a test of loyalty to see how she reacts. My guess is she would not want to share the OW with JJ even if the OW was amenable. JJ's wife is a compartmentalizing cake eater. She would never allow him into that side of her life. Its about control: having these two people want her is a huge ego boost and turn on. If he were to threaten that dynamic she would show her true colors.


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## Suspecting

LostViking said:


> No that's not what I mean . Its a test of loyalty to see how she reacts. My guess is she would not want to share the OW with JJ even if the OW was amenable. JJ's wife is a compartmentalizing cake eater. She would never allow him into that side of her life. Its about control: having these two people want her is a huge ego boost and turn on. If he were to threaten that dynamic she would show her true colors.


She will just say that she's a lesbian and don't sleep with men. I actually asked the OP about this and he's sure the OW is gay. Not something she can change and he gets nothing accomplished. Even if she accepted she would be sharing her husband with the OW. That is not a test of loyalty but contradicting it heavily. It would give a message she doesn't care if he sleeps with other people.


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## Jamesjohn

Guys,

I talked to my wife about her sexual fantasies. She told me that she looks at her lesbian lover as man and not a woman. She said that she could not imagine seeing her lover naked. She told me that never in her life had she seen a naked woman. She just acts like a woman imagining the OW as a man. She is just being touched and she does not touch. 

Does this make sense? Is this believable?






Suspecting said:


> She will just say that she's a lesbian and don't sleep with men. I actually asked the OP about this and he's sure the OW is gay. Not something she can change and he gets nothing accomplished. Even if she accepted she would be sharing her husband with the OW. That is not a test of loyalty but contradicting it heavily. It would give a message she doesn't care if he sleeps with other people.


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## MattMatt

Jamesjohn said:


> Guys,
> 
> I talked to my wife about her sexual fantasies. *She told me that she looks at her lesbian lover as man and not a woman*. She said that she could not imagine seeing her lover naked. She told me that never in her life had she seen a naked woman. She just acts like a woman imagining the OW as a man. She is just being touched and she does not touch.
> 
> Does this make sense? Is this believable?


So, in effect, it is the same as your wife cheating with another man?:scratchhead:

Ask her about that. See what she says.


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## Jamesjohn

In a way, yes. 

Oh my, these creatures are hard to figure out.

I'm calling it quits, guys!



MattMatt said:


> So, in effect, it is the same as your wife cheating with another man?:scratchhead:
> 
> Ask her about that. See what she says.


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## Jamesjohn

Now, the problem about moving on starts. I don't know what to do with the kids. Post nup is almost done. She's still hoping I change my mind.





Jamesjohn said:


> In a way, yes.
> 
> Oh my, these creatures are hard to figure out.
> 
> I'm calling it quits, guys!


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## Jamesjohn

We will be undergoing spiritual counseling soon on how to mvoe on with inner peace.



Jamesjohn said:


> Now, the problem about moving on starts. I don't know what to do with the kids. Post nup is almost done. She's still hoping I change my mind.


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## LostViking

I'm sorry JJ. It's hard letting go and walking away from someone you love. But you could never know any peace with this woman. She is incredibly confused and in denial. She needs counseling and lots of it. You need to move on and find someone more emotionally and psychologically stable.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Nucking Futs

Jamesjohn said:


> In a way, yes.
> 
> Oh my, these creatures are hard to figure out.
> 
> I'm calling it quits, guys!





Jamesjohn said:


> Now, the problem about moving on starts. I don't know what to do with the kids. Post nup is almost done. She's still hoping I change my mind.


This confuses me. Are you divorcing? Is that what "calling it quits" and "moving on" means? If so, why the post-nup?


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