# �Can�t beat �em, join �em� regrets



## Confusedwife157 (Apr 12, 2018)

*“Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*

For years, even before we were married, I caught my husband watching porn. I’ve always been disgusted by this and it would lead to terrible fights. Long periods of time would go in between making me think he’s over it. I was wrong. 
I’ve found it on his phone, computer, my iPad, you name it. 
I confidently went to a good friend of mine that happens to be a male. I asked him to be honest with me and he was. He expressed that it had nothing to do with me, and that “it’s a guy thing.” I love my husband and he’s an amazing father, so I needed to find a way to work through this. My friend suggested I watch it with my husband. What went from awkward, to curious, to enticing has now become REGRET! I feel cheap, he talks to me like I’m a porn star and it’s breaking me! I need to feel loved and wanted, yes but I do not want to feel like he’s acting out his fantasies on me! I want to be made love to. I want him to passionately kiss me, but the way he talks is going to far! 
What have I done?! And what do I do?


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*

*Time for a "Come to Jesus Meeting" to let him know that his porn activity/habit is grossly unacceptable!

You deserve far better treatment than being spoken to like you're a common prostitute and he knows far better than that!*


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*



Confusedwife157 said:


> For years, even before we were married, I caught my husband watching porn. I’ve always been disgusted by this and it would lead to terrible fights. Long periods of time would go in between making me think he’s over it. I was wrong.
> I’ve found it on his phone, computer, my iPad, you name it.
> I confidently went to a good friend of mine that happens to be a male. I asked him to be honest with me and he was. He expressed that it had nothing to do with me, and that “it’s a guy thing.” I love my husband and he’s an amazing father, so I needed to find a way to work through this. My friend suggested I watch it with my husband. What went from awkward, to curious, to enticing has now become REGRET! I feel cheap, he talks to me like I’m a porn star and it’s breaking me! I need to feel loved and wanted, yes but I do not want to feel like he’s acting out his fantasies on me! I want to be made love to. I want him to passionately kiss me, but the way he talks is going to far!
> What have I done?! And what do I do?


Their is one red flag that I notice in this story. Why when this was going on did you not just talk to your husband, why did you go to another man? I am not saying you cheated or anything, but what I am saying is it's a pattern it seems. Your problem is not sex or even porn, though those are a problem right now, your problem is that you guys don't talk. Sounds like it's hard to have these discussions without them getting emotional. You both need to stop that though and have hard talks that are painful. 

His fantasies are not necessarily wrong, men sometimes want porn star sex. That doesn't mean he doesn't love you by the way and it's not necessarily wrong. However you have a right to want to be wanted and have passion and be romanced at times as well. There is a happy medium in there that you both can probably get to if you just talk about it. You need to understand each others motivations, and not be afraid of them.

Talk to your husband. Tell him how you feel. Don't get mad, show him you are sad. Entreat him, so he is not defensive. 

Not -

"You make me feel like a cheep ****" -even if he does. 

But -

"Husband I am trying really hard to understand your needs, but it makes me feel cheap, especially when you never take the time to romance me and passionately make LOVE to me. Just like you need fantasy, I need romantic connection. I have tried really hard for you, why won't you do the same for me sometimes? It is hurting me. Please help me."

At least give that a chance.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets!*

*One thread please!*


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## Confusedwife157 (Apr 12, 2018)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*

I hear what you’re saying and I do need to be open with him. I was honest with him about going to this male friend of mine because I needed a males perspective on this to help me understand. Needless to say, he loved my friends advice! 
It wouldn’t even be so bad if it were, every so often. But it’s becoming more frequent and the idea of someone joining has been his fantasy for a long time but I know he’s thinking this could be a real deal. But I need to tell him it scares the life out of me and would be a deal breaker! 
I feel to blame because I got myself into this and don’t know how to get out without seeming like a hypocrite.


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## Confusedwife157 (Apr 12, 2018)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets!*

Can I delete this one? I just registered in here tonight and this was my first post. I didn’t see that the one went through so I reposted. Sorry :/


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets!*



Confusedwife157 said:


> Can I delete this one? I just registered in here tonight and this was my first post. I didn’t see that the one went through so I reposted. Sorry :/


* @EleGirl ~ could we get you to delete one of these two threads? Appears to be an accidental duplication on the part of the OP! Thanks!*


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets!*



arbitrator said:


> * @EleGirl ~ could we get you to delete one of these two threads? Appears to be an accidental duplication on the part of the OP! Thanks!*


done


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets!*



EleGirl said:


> done


*Thank you, dear! Appreciate it!*


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*



Confusedwife157 said:


> I feel to blame because I got myself into this and don’t know how to get out without seeming like a hypocrite.


On being a hypocrite..... :|

Those who are not hypocrites are single-minded plow horses, wearing blinders, or, are liars. :surprise:

Everyone has competing interests, competing needs, competing wants.
Choosing one and sticking to one is never a sure and lasting thing.

Choosing one and sticking to one comes with practice and living with failure. Practice and employing common sense leads to Wisdom.

Learn to eat crow. Add salt and pepper, avoid the beak and the claws! :grin2:




KB-


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*



Confusedwife157 said:


> I hear what you’re saying and I do need to be open with him. I was honest with him about going to this male friend of mine because I needed a males perspective on this to help me understand. Needless to say, he loved my friends advice!
> It wouldn’t even be so bad if it were, every so often. But it’s becoming more frequent and the idea of someone joining has been his fantasy for a long time but I know he’s thinking this could be a real deal. But I need to tell him it scares the life out of me and would be a deal breaker!
> I feel to blame because I got myself into this and don’t know how to get out without seeming like a hypocrite.




You’re not a hypocrite. Porn is like food in that there are all kinds. Agreeing to eat with someone is not agreeing to eat at a steak house when you’re a vegan. Make sense?

Everyone has an opinion on porn and I happen to be a woman who enjoys porn married to man who rarely watches porn, because company laptop, company cell, so porn history on those devices would lead to being fired.

Regarding sexual fantasies, we all have them and we can’t really control what our dirty minds imagine. Some fantasies some are creative role playing like a fireman rescuing a barely dressed woman or the boss and the secretary, some are situational like meet me behind the shed when we’re both covered in dirt and grime, and some are desires for a certain kind of lover. Some fantasies, however, are things we would not ever ever want to happen in real life, and that’s okay too. 70% of woman have rape/ravishment/reluctance fantasies but that obviously doesn’t mean they want that to happen! 

Porn is based on fantasies and watching porn is watching a fantasy. Having something turn you on doesn’t mean you want it to actually happen! Personally, having two men is a fantasy I sometimes indulge in but I wouldn’t want it in real life...also I’m 29 and have never had kids in my fantasies so not reality based at all. I’m a 56 year old cancer survivor with surgery scars, so I’m a far cry from my fantasy me.

*Sharing fantasies/ watching porn genres is most times a good idea, but this does NOT EVER require either partner to engage in those fantasies in real life!!!!*

Your husband needs to understand that you feel cheapened by porn. That while it may turn you on, it also leaves you cold and you don’t want porn to play a major role in your sex life.

Will he respect that?


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*



Confusedwife157 said:


> I hear what you’re saying and I do need to be open with him. I was honest with him about going to this male friend of mine because I needed a males perspective on this to help me understand. Needless to say, he loved my friends advice!
> It wouldn’t even be so bad if it were, every so often. But it’s becoming more frequent and the idea of someone joining has been his fantasy for a long time but I know he’s thinking this could be a real deal. But I need to tell him it scares the life out of me and would be a deal breaker!
> I feel to blame because I got myself into this and don’t know how to get out without seeming like a hypocrite.


Why? He is your husband you are entitled to have desires and want. You also can always say no if it makes you uncomfortable. If you don't feel cool about adding someone (which I would NOT be cool with too) then don't do it. Your marriage is not contingent on him getting his every sexual fantasy met. Just because you looked at porn doesn't mean you have to do everything he wants. Don't let him or anyone else make you feel guilty about that. 

Just talk to your husband.


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## uhtred (Jun 22, 2016)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*

OP, have you made it clear to him what sort of talk / behavior you like / dislike? Some people like "porn talk", others find it offensive, some (like me) just find it sort of dumb sounding

If you have told him and he continues, then he is disreguaring your interests, but is it possible he doesn't know it bothers you?


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## Confusedwife157 (Apr 12, 2018)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*



Anon Pink said:


> Your husband needs to understand that you feel cheapened by porn. That while it may turn you on, it also leaves you cold and you don’t want porn to play a major role in your sex life.
> 
> Will he respect that?


He’s a great man, truly in so many ways. I think if I can bring myself to bring it up to him, he’d understand but I can’t help but feel he’ll secretly be let down on the idea of not being able to act out these fantasies. He’s seriously gone as far as looking into it!
At the time I had plenty to drink and went along with it. But in a much clearer state of mind I know the regret that I’d feel, and don’t know that our marriage would survive something like that! 
And the increase watching of porn makes me feel like the there is no inocense in our love making anymore, it’s all about what he sees and how they talk....like I said, occasionally it would be ok, but has he forgotten I’m his wife? Because once we’re behind closed doors it’s ALL about the dirty talk, “firing up a movie”....


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## Confusedwife157 (Apr 12, 2018)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*



uhtred said:


> OP, have you made it clear to him what sort of talk / behavior you like / dislike? Some people like "porn talk", others find it offensive, some (like me) just find it sort of dumb sounding
> 
> If you have told him and he continues, then he is disreguaring your interests, but is it possible he doesn't know it bothers you?


To be honest, the only time I’m turned on by it is only if we’ve had a few drinks on the weekend. Otherwise, I REALLY don’t care for it! I would think when I’m not reciprocating that he would get it, but it doesn’t stop him..


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## uhtred (Jun 22, 2016)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*



Confusedwife157 said:


> To be honest, the only time I’m turned on by it is only if we’ve had a few drinks on the weekend. Otherwise, I REALLY don’t care for it! I would think when I’m not reciprocating that he would get it, but it doesn’t stop him..


I think its worth talking to him about it - nicely. It can be tricky figuring out what someone really wants from their reactions.


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## VermiciousKnid (Nov 14, 2017)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*

Two things:

1. DON'T talk about personal relationship issues in your marriage with another man. EVER.

2. Communicate your concerns to your husband with a real heart to heart, in a quiet place, no kids around. Make sure you emphasize how important this is to you.


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## Rocky Mountain Yeti (Apr 23, 2017)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*



VermiciousKnid said:


> Two things:
> 
> 1. DON'T talk about personal relationship issues in your marriage with another man. EVER.


Unless it's an anonymous man behind an anonymous screen name on TAM :wink2:


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*



Confusedwife157 said:


> He’s a great man, truly in so many ways. I think if I can bring myself to bring it up to him, he’d understand but I can’t help but feel he’ll secretly be let down on the idea of not being able to act out these fantasies.


Everyone has their limits. When it comes to sex I think people should think of all the variations as a matter of personal taste. Like with food, some are game to try anything including live bugs and fried dog. Others aren’t game to try anything further than what they grew up with. If you think of sex like food choices, why would you feel like you’ve disappointed him because you’re not interested in live bugs or fried dog? On the other hand, being game to try some new menu items keeps life interesting.




> He’s seriously gone as far as looking into it!
> At the time I had plenty to drink and went along with it. But in a much clearer state of mind I know the regret that I’d feel, and don’t know that our marriage would survive something like that!


What two people get up to in the privacy of their bedroom is no one’s business. Two people, meaning both are game. If your husband is trying to talk you into something that repulses you, as fried dog or live bugs would, you are under no obligation to try it. 

IMO, watching ménage porn and enjoying it is far far far different than being asked to engage with a third. If you feel like he will be disappointed in you for refusing you have to ask yourself if he is capable of being the kind of husband you thought you were getting.




> And the increase watching of porn makes me feel like the there is no inocense in our love making anymore, it’s all about what he sees and how they talk....like I said, occasionally it would be ok, but has he forgotten I’m his wife? Because once we’re behind closed doors it’s ALL about the dirty talk, “firing up a movie”....



I’m unsure what you mean when you say the innocence in love making. Do you feel like married sex should be an organic spontaneous expression of love and commitment? 

With the easy availability of porn, more and more people like yourself are being caught having to redefine their attitude about what married sex should look like. Yes, it’s okay to dirty talk your wife, or husband. It doesn’t mean love has been forgotten.


I like dirty talk, others don’t. I don’t see sex as always having to be an expression of committed love. I like sex to be playful and fun, creative and sometimes unpredictable. But I’ve been married for 33 years and believe me sex looses its appeal if it’s not infused with creativity and playfulness.

IMO, porn has its place in an adult’s sex life, but it should be used as a tool for fun. If it goes beyond that it becomes the focus of sexual expression and that’s where sex stops being fun and starts being a compulsion, and that’s problematic.


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## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*



Confusedwife157 said:


> He’s a great man, truly in so many ways. I think if I can bring myself to bring it up to him, he’d understand but I can’t help but feel he’ll secretly be let down on the idea of not being able to act out these fantasies. He’s seriously gone as far as looking into it!
> At the time I had plenty to drink and went along with it. But in a much clearer state of mind I know the regret that I’d feel, and don’t know that our marriage would survive something like that!
> And the increase watching of porn makes me feel like the there is no inocense in our love making anymore, it’s all about what he sees and how they talk....like I said, occasionally it would be ok, but has he forgotten I’m his wife? Because once we’re behind closed doors it’s ALL about the dirty talk, “firing up a movie”....


Your H needs to start firing up the respect for his W. At this juncture, explain to your H that you did your best to be what he has in his fantasy land. But you are not that person. At the very least you entertained the notion but it is not for you. Your H should respect your decision.


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*



Confusedwife157 said:


> To be honest, the only time I’m turned on by it is only if we’ve had a few drinks on the weekend. Otherwise, I REALLY don’t care for it! I would think when I’m not reciprocating that he would get it, but it doesn’t stop him..


Just curious about why dirty talk turns you on when you’re relaxed and buzzed, but turns you off when you’re not? 

You should just tell him “Honey when I’m buzzed your dirty talk turns me on, but when I’m not I don’t care for it. How do you feel about keeping dirty talk for weekends only?”

You’re right though, he should be paying better attention to how you’re responding.


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## Bananapeel (May 4, 2015)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*

It's OK to try new things and decide they aren't for you. It's also OK to compromise and do things one way sometimes and other ways other times. I'm sure you can find a happy medium that you both enjoy if you give it some time and honest open communication.


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## uhtred (Jun 22, 2016)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*

I agree that he should be paying attention - but sometimes people's reactions are not as obvious as they think that they are. If she sometimes enjoys that, I could see him getting confused if he isn't very preceptive. 

I like the idea of giving him better hints as to when she wants that sort of behavior. 





Anon Pink said:


> Just curious about why dirty talk turns you on when you’re relaxed and buzzed, but turns you off when you’re not?
> 
> You should just tell him “Honey when I’m buzzed your dirty talk turns me on, but when I’m not I don’t care for it. How do you feel about keeping dirty talk for weekends only?”
> 
> You’re right though, he should be paying better attention to how you’re responding.


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## salparadise (Sep 13, 2016)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*



Confusedwife157 said:


> For years, even before we were married, I caught my husband watching porn. I’ve always been disgusted by this...


I think you should try to realize that feeling disgusted this fantasy is not the equivalent of owning the moral high ground. Watching porn occasionally is not the problem; many people do so without it causing marital issues. The problem is that you are disgusted by something he enjoys, and the discord arises when you believe that a) difference is unacceptable, b) you are more correct than he, and c) he can-should-must adjust his preferences and become you (by virtue of a and b).



Confusedwife157 said:


> But it’s becoming more frequent and the idea of someone joining has been his fantasy for a long time but I know he’s thinking this could be a real deal. But I need to tell him it scares the life out of me and would be a deal breaker!
> 
> I feel to blame because I got myself into this and don’t know how to get out without seeming like a hypocrite.


Fantasy is one thing, acting it out in real life is entirely different. If you can find it within you to indulge and enjoy the fantasy with him, well, that would be ideal (although perhaps not possible). 

Maybe if you communicate and the two of you acknowledge that it's never going to actually happen, that it's just role play, then you could let go of the negative reaction. I guess what you're saying is that you tried that and it's a turnoff. I seriously doubt that you'll be able to edit his erotic fantasy such that it never crosses his mind again. Would you prefer that he pretend to be exactly who you want him to be?

Woman have active, deviant fantasy worlds too, ya know. And many women embrace and enjoy their fantasies (without ashamed or afraid). Nancy Friday published a book on women's fantasies called "My Secret Garden." Your husband's fantasy is pretty tame compared to some of those! Perhaps reading that book would help broaden your perspective. 

I believe the best solution is to communicate, compromise, and make it clear that this cannot and will not happen in reality. If this were a brand new relationship I'd say you're simply incompatible and move on, but since you're married, invested and love the guy I think you have to find a way to make it flow and avoid a sexual stalemate. Perhaps he can do love-dovey sometimes and you can indulge his kind of eroticism sometimes. If not, I can't envision an positive outcome.


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## chillymorn69 (Jun 27, 2016)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*

Maybe a compromise.

Hey honey I don't mid the porn sex BUT I also very much like when you make sweet compassionate love to me and it seems a little ....no a lot unbalanced. I have gone outside my comfort zone because I know it turns you on but it seems like thats all you want . Don't you care
what I like?


Can we meet in the middle ?




I actually have much stronger orgasms when were making love instead of porn sex. 


So what do you say? Can we compromise ?


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## Confusedwife157 (Apr 12, 2018)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*



chillymorn69 said:


> Maybe a compromise.
> 
> Hey honey I don't mid the porn sex BUT I also very much like when you make sweet compassionate love to me and it seems a little ....no a lot unbalanced. I have gone outside my comfort zone because I know it turns you on but it seems like thats all you want . Don't you care
> what I like?
> ...


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## chillymorn69 (Jun 27, 2016)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*

Your welcome.

Good luck!


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## Confusedwife157 (Apr 12, 2018)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*



Anon Pink said:


> Just curious about why dirty talk turns you on when you’re relaxed and buzzed, but turns you off when you’re not?
> 
> You should just tell him “Honey when I’m buzzed your dirty talk turns me on, but when I’m not I don’t care for it. How do you feel about keeping dirty talk for weekends only?”
> 
> You’re right though, he should be paying better attention to how you’re responding.


I’m much more uninhibited after I’ve had a few drinks, that’s when I’ll get into watching porn with him, role play with him and allow our fantasies to run wild. But there’s a time and place....that’s the time for me. I’ll unleash that side of me then no problem. I just feel like I’ve unleashed the beast with him now though. Because that’s the ONLY kind of sex he wants. I still want to be made love to. I want him to caress me lovingly and tell me he loves me during. 
I don’t feel like I’m out of line with this. I’ve tried to talk to him about it before but perhaps I was too passive about it because it went in one ear and out the other.


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*



Confusedwife157 said:


> He’s a great man, truly in so many ways. I think if I can bring myself to bring it up to him, he’d understand but I can’t help but feel he’ll secretly be let down on the idea of not being able to act out these fantasies. He’s seriously gone as far as looking into it!
> At the time I had plenty to drink and went along with it. But in a much clearer state of mind I know the regret that I’d feel, and don’t know that our marriage would survive something like that!
> And the increase watching of porn makes me feel like the there is no inocense in our love making anymore, it’s all about what he sees and how they talk....like I said, occasionally it would be ok, but has he forgotten I’m his wife? Because once we’re behind closed doors it’s ALL about the dirty talk, “firing up a movie”....


You want to know what is really attractive, telling him YOUR fantasies. Open yourself up to him, let yourself be free with him. Tell him to turn off the movie and then be intimate with him sexually. Maybe he is going to porn because he feels a void there, because you have left that open. Show him who you are, don't be afraid. Whatever that may be. 

Second, if you don't want to have anyone in your relationship with you then tell him. You have every right to do that. Don't feel guilty about it. You can role play that if he wants but you are just not into that. Besides that is a really risky thing to do, I think you are wise. I don't think it works, but even the folks who tell you it does also say it takes lots of planning and both people have to really be on board. There are other things you can do that seem risky but really arn't. 

Also if you want romance let him know. If he has problems with not feeling comfortable with that send him over here or online and someone will help him. I find that just like women have a hard time being open and vulnerable sexual sometimes, men also have trouble with romance. They have no frame of reference. They are afraid they may come off as weak or stupid. Sometimes. Sometimes they are just lazy. 

Again though I go back to the communication. Talk about this stuff. I think the most attractive thing to me as a man more then anything else is when a women is comfortable enough with me to let me see that side of herself. That is a big turn on. That she desires to show me that side of herself. 

Talk to your husband. Have courage. If he is a good man he will appreciate it.


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## Rocky Mountain Yeti (Apr 23, 2017)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*



Confusedwife157 said:


> I’m much more uninhibited after I’ve had a few drinks, that’s when I’ll get into watching porn with him, role play with him and allow our fantasies to run wild. But there’s a time and place....that’s the time for me. I’ll unleash that side of me then no problem. I just feel like I’ve unleashed the beast with him now though. Because that’s the ONLY kind of sex he wants. I still want to be made love to. I want him to caress me lovingly and tell me he loves me during.
> I don’t feel like I’m out of line with this. I’ve tried to talk to him about it before but perhaps I was too passive about it because it went in one ear and out the other.


Things work well when both partners derive joy from pleasing the other, and are willing to, at least occasionally, indulge the other (at least within acceptable bounds).

Is there any chance he could 
1. be made to understand what pleases you the most and
2. he could find fulfillment in adding to your fulfillment?

_Dear, 
If you could find your way sometimes to put me at the center of your universe, take the time to worship me as your sexual goddess, and take pleasure in caring for me in a sweet, loving, intimate way... then I could probably find it in my heart to welcome you in provocative dress, talk dirty, and ride you like a buckin' bronc in our own private rodeo. 

We're supposed to be a team, *taking care of each other*. So far, things feel to lopsided to maintain the bonds we need for a lifetime union._


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## Confusedwife157 (Apr 12, 2018)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*



Anon Pink said:


> I’m unsure what you mean when you say the innocence in love making. Do you feel like married sex should be an organic spontaneous expression of love and commitment?
> 
> I guess what I meant by that is the holding, the compassion, the kissing, feeling more love than just pure lust..
> 
> ...


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## personofinterest (Apr 6, 2018)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*

One of the things that makes the pornography discussion so hard is that the focus always turns to "is it bad or okay." And most of the time, people who will cling to their porn rights like grim death will bverate whoever doesn't like porn. And the ones who don't like porn will go look for articles about addiction....

But none of that really matters.

Here is the issue: If you know something hurts your partner, and you claim to love your partner, you don't do it.

Period.

End of story. If you love your "personal time material" more than your spouse, just own it.

OP, if this makes you feel cheap and dirty, it isn't for you, and there is nothing wrong with that. Your husband has to decide what matters to him more, the images of strangers, or the wife he claims to love.

It really IS that simple.


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## Confusedwife157 (Apr 12, 2018)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*



Rocky Mountain Yeti said:


> Things work well when both partners derive joy from pleasing the other, and are willing to, at least occasionally, indulge the other (at least within acceptable bounds).
> 
> Is there any chance he could
> 1. be made to understand what pleases you the most and
> ...


Love this! Thank you!


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*



Anon Pink said:


> I’m unsure what you mean when you say the innocence in love making. Do you feel like married sex should be an organic spontaneous expression of love and commitment?


She would have done well to marry the guy in the other thread whose wife lied to him about her sex count who everyone puts down. > What she means is she want kindness and tenderness. Everybody's different.

OP a good place would be where you both can do both and you both want to do both, at different times of course, because in doing so you see it from your partners eyes. You can appreciate how being how he likes makes him excited, and he can appreciate how being tender makes you feel loved. 

I wish more people would see their sex life like decorating a room in your house. You have some parts of the room that are your taste and other parts that are your partners taste. At then end of the day when you go into the room you see the piece of art that your spouse picked and it makes you happy because here is this personal thing that the person you love has put in your room that you get to see that reminds you of them. And there is also that piece of art that you picked that you just love to look at. Here is this room that is a some of both of you.


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## VermiciousKnid (Nov 14, 2017)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*



Confusedwife157 said:


> Anon Pink said:
> 
> 
> > I’m unsure what you mean when you say the innocence in love making. Do you feel like married sex should be an organic spontaneous expression of love and commitment?
> ...


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*



Confusedwife157 said:


> Anon Pink said:
> 
> 
> > I’m unsure what you mean when you say the innocence in love making. Do you feel like married sex should be an organic spontaneous expression of love and commitment?
> ...


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## Rocky Mountain Yeti (Apr 23, 2017)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*



Confusedwife157 said:


> Love this! Thank you!


Hopefully it can be helpful.

I've never needed any encouragement to want to please my wife. I'm a firm believer that people who put others first tend to be inherently more happy. But it's human nature to be selfish and not see the joy that comes from a truly intimate (emotionally and physically) union. I know I'm not going to get wile monkey sex every day, so I've learned to be happy with lots of cuddle time and enjoy the hard core stuff when it comes.


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## Confusedwife157 (Apr 12, 2018)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*



VermiciousKnid said:


> Confusedwife157 said:
> 
> 
> > The subject of the conversation with the other male is not as relevant as you discussing your marital issues with another male. That is a bad practice. Is it cool if your husband discusses you and your marriage with other women 1-on-1?
> ...


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## Confusedwife157 (Apr 12, 2018)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*



sokillme said:


> You want to know what is really attractive, telling him YOUR fantasies. Open yourself up to him, let yourself be free with him. Tell him to turn off the movie and then be intimate with him sexually. Maybe he is going to porn because he feels a void there, because you have left that open. Show him who you are, don't be afraid. Whatever that may be.
> 
> Second, if you don't want to have anyone in your relationship with you then tell him. You have every right to do that. Don't feel guilty about it. You can role play that if he wants but you are just not into that. Besides that is a really risky thing to do, I think you are wise. I don't think it works, but even the folks who tell you it does also say it takes lots of planning and both people have to really be on board. There are other things you can do that seem risky but really arn't.
> 
> ...


Solid advice! Thank you!


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## minimalME (Jan 3, 2012)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*



Confusedwife157 said:


> I’m much more uninhibited after I’ve had a few drinks,


This is me too, so I completely understand. I'm very high strung and self-conscious, so a couple of drinks helps.



> I just feel like I’ve unleashed the beast with him now though.


I understand this also, because I've had dates try and be very manipulative with a line of 'you've opened this door and now you can't close it'. For me it was merely talking about sex, and then once it was kissing. So, it wasn't even that serious, but there was this pressure for more with an attitude of 'you aren't allowed to stop now'.

But you can say no and you can put a stop to stuff that makes you uncomfortable. And you don't even have to go into lengthy explanations. That it makes you uncomfortable is enough. As another poster said, your husband should respect this, although I hear what you're saying in that your protests don't seem to phase him. I honestly don't know a healthy response to that, cause I'd just cut him off.


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## becareful2 (Jul 8, 2016)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*

One of the things I've learned from reading this board is that we have to enforce our boundaries. If porn is repulsive to you, then that is your red line so you need to enforce it. Don't compromise your boundaries to please your cuckold husband (a cuckold is a husband who wants to watch another man have sex with his wife because it turns him on). I see two posters have suggested you compromise with your husband. I'm not sure that is good for your mental health and self-esteem. 

*This thread* was made by a woman whose husband also has cuckold fetishes. *The post I made to her* may apply to you as well. Take what you need and leave the rest.

You'd be surprised how many marriages have been destroyed by porn addiction and other fetishes like cuckoldry that were born out of the porn addiction.

Do you and your husband have any children?


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## ABHale (Jan 3, 2016)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*



Confusedwife157 said:


> I hear what you’re saying and I do need to be open with him. I was honest with him about going to this male friend of mine because I needed a males perspective on this to help me understand. Needless to say, he loved my friends advice!
> It wouldn’t even be so bad if it were, every so often. But it’s becoming more frequent and the idea of someone joining has been his fantasy for a long time but I know he’s thinking this could be a real deal. But I need to tell him it scares the life out of me and would be a deal breaker!
> I feel to blame because I got myself into this and don’t know how to get out without seeming like a hypocrite.


It’s not being a hypocrite. Just tell him you tried it and now you are finished. It’s just not who you are. 

Also, porn is not a every guy thing. Have most guys looked at it, yes. Do most guys continuously look at it, no. It actually sounds like an addiction with your husband. 

Put a stop to it if you are no longer comfortable with it.


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## personofinterest (Apr 6, 2018)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*



VermiciousKnid said:


> Confusedwife157 said:
> 
> 
> > The subject of the conversation with the other male is not as relevant as you discussing your marital issues with another male. That is a bad practice. Is it cool if your husband discusses you and your marriage with other women 1-on-1?
> ...


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## VermiciousKnid (Nov 14, 2017)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*



Confusedwife157 said:


> VermiciousKnid said:
> 
> 
> > My husbands co worker is one of his best friends and he’s one of hers. *He does talk candidly with her, and she’s also shed light on things us “women” tend to go through.* We find it helpful and have a mutual trust there. So I guess for us it works.
> ...


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## VermiciousKnid (Nov 14, 2017)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*



personofinterest said:


> VermiciousKnid said:
> 
> 
> > I have to wonder if this is such a big deal because it deflects from the problem pornography is creating in the OP's marriage...
> ...


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## personofinterest (Apr 6, 2018)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*



VermiciousKnid said:


> personofinterest said:
> 
> 
> > Only that literally millions of affairs start almost this exact way. I don't believe there's a relationship expert on the planet that espouses talking about your marital issues 1-on-1 with members of the opposite sex.
> ...


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## VermiciousKnid (Nov 14, 2017)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*



personofinterest said:


> VermiciousKnid said:
> 
> 
> > Oh I agree. It's just that it is not the topic of this thread. What do you think about the porn issue? Should she just suck it up because men need porn?
> ...


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## Steve2.0 (Dec 11, 2017)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*

Check out "yourbrainonporn.com" - Maybe read it with your husband

The spike of arousal fades pretty quickly and to get the next spike you need to search for more taboo type porn. This is where some of the weirder fetish's come from. He is clearly addicted to it since he didn't stop after your original talks. 

While I don't think porn is an evil thing, in your case it seems to be detrimental to your sexual relationship so it IS in fact a problem.

I might also suggest reading a book called "when I say no, i feel guilty" -> It teaching you communication techniques that will help you in challenging conversations like the one you want to have with your husband.

In the end, you cant change someone... you can only tell them what you want/need, the rest is up to them.... and your response to their reaction is up to you.


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## Rocky Mountain Yeti (Apr 23, 2017)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*



VermiciousKnid said:


> personofinterest said:
> 
> 
> > Nobody "needs" porn. He might want porn. This is a communication problem. They're not effectively communicating with each other about this issue or many others. That's why I touched on what I did. Now we've learned that both of them are communicating about these issues with other people, who are not in any way trained to be therapists, about personal marital problems. As for porn, it is what it is. Some experts say it's harmless if kept in moderation and not hidden, others say it's toxic and leads to much bigger problems.
> ...


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## Confusedwife157 (Apr 12, 2018)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*



becareful2 said:


> One of the things I've learned from reading this board is that we have to enforce our boundaries. If porn is repulsive to you, then that is your red line so you need to enforce it. Don't compromise your boundaries to please your cuckold husband (a cuckold is a husband who wants to watch another man have sex with his wife because it turns him on). I see two posters have suggested you compromise with your husband. I'm not sure that is good for your mental health and self-esteem.
> You'd be surprised how many marriages have been destroyed by porn addiction and other fetishes like cuckoldry that were born out of the porn addiction.
> 
> Do you and your husband have any children?


Thank you for explaining what “cuckold” is as the next thing I was going to do is google that. 
We do have children, three of them. And they adore their father as do I. He truly is a wonderful man in SO many ways. It’s just behind bedroom doors that he unleashes this pornagrapgic side of him. When I finally started watching with him it was actually ok at first, and not as repulsive as the idea of it was to me at one time. And maybe because I felt more comfortable with him watching it WITH me vs finding out he’s watching it alone. But watching it with him now has turned him into an animal! Trust me, at times, I’m ok with it. I just hate that that’s the ONLY kind of sex we have now. I’m not a porn star and I don’t want to be treated like one every time we’re together. He used to hold me more and it used to be more sensual. I LOVED that! Now it’s definitely porn sex 100% of the time. 
I recieved some really great advice on this site as far as how to bring it up to him and suggestions on what to say. I’m so thankful I’ve found this page! 
When the moment is right, I’m going to have a heart to heart and let him know how this has all made me feel. 
I said in one of my comments that I would think he’d pick up on how non responsive I am when he starts talking like that when I’m not in “that” mood. But that all falls into the “Men are from Mars Women are from Venus “ category. I assumed he should pick up on that, but no, he needs to be flat out told. 
I appreciate your advice on not compromising my boundaries, because I’ve been doing that for a while and am realizing I’m starting to feel more detached. The sooner the better on this talk!


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## Confusedwife157 (Apr 12, 2018)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*



VermiciousKnid said:


> Confusedwife157 said:
> 
> 
> > That's interesting. Can I ask why he's not asking _you_, his wife, to shed light on things that women tend to go through"?
> ...


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*



Confusedwife157 said:


> When the moment is right, I’m going to have a heart to heart and let him know how this has all made me feel.
> I said in one of my comments that I would think he’d pick up on how non responsive I am when he starts talking like that when I’m not in “that” mood. But that all falls into the “Men are from Mars Women are from Venus “ category. I assumed he should pick up on that, but no, he needs to be flat out told.
> I appreciate your advice on not compromising my boundaries, because I’ve been doing that for a while and am realizing I’m starting to feel more detached. The sooner the better on this talk!


This isn't a mars/Venus thing. If you haven't expressed your true feelings about this matter, there is no way for him to know. 

Why haven't you yet? Why have you let your boundaries be trampled? These are questions you probably don't know the answer to yourself, but he is supposed to figure them out for you, with no words from you about it?

Stop tip toeing and express yourself. He deserves to know how you really feel, and you need to learn how to own your feelings and decisions. Why wait for "the right moment"? Tell him tonight after the kids are in bed you want to talk. Make the moment and then seize it.


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## Confusedwife157 (Apr 12, 2018)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*



Faithful Wife said:


> This isn't a mars/Venus thing. If you haven't expressed your true feelings about this matter, there is no way for him to know.
> 
> Why haven't you yet? Why have you let your boundaries be trampled? These are questions you probably don't know the answer to yourself, but he is supposed to figure them out for you, with no words from you about it?
> 
> Stop tip toeing and express yourself. He deserves to know how you really feel, and you need to learn how to own your feelings and decisions. Why wait for "the right moment"? Tell him tonight after the kids are in bed you want to talk. Make the moment and then seize it.


If you’ve read through all of this, (I know it’s a lot) but I did post that I tried to have this conversation with him already but must’ve been too passive because it went in one ear and out the other. I’m aware he’s not a mind reader. I just came here to seek advice on the best approach without feeling like a hypocrite since I’ve joined him now in some of his fantasies. 
It’s just too much now. A little goes a long ways for me.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*



Confusedwife157 said:


> If you’ve read through all of this, (I know it’s a lot) but I did post that I tried to have this conversation with him already but must’ve been too passive because it went in one ear and out the other. I’m aware he’s not a mind reader. I just came here to seek advice on the best approach without feeling like a hypocrite since I’ve joined him now in some of his fantasies.
> It’s just too much now. A little goes a long ways for me.


Oh I totally get where you are coming from and why it's all very distasteful to you at this point 

I'm just encouraging you to put yourself first, stop letting your boundaries down, and talk to him about this NOW, not later. Don't let him think that you are ok with this for even one more day. You love him, you want to have great sex with him....you don't want to resent him and feel turned off by him. He needs to know all of that.

You've got this.


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## ABHale (Jan 3, 2016)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*



Confusedwife157 said:


> VermiciousKnid said:
> 
> 
> > Neither my husband nor myself have issues with having friends of the opposite sex. These are people that have been in our lives and are very dear to us. Neither of us would ever ask the other to compromise those friendships. And we’ve both found it helpful (at times) to go to our friend of the opposite sex to ask advice because if I were to have asked him, he would’ve gotten defensive and I wouldn’t have gotten a straight answer. This friend of mine is detached from the situation therefore can give me a very real and candid and quite simple response, that actually helped me see things from my husbands perspective. (Which btw my husband appreciated very much.)
> ...


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## CatholicDad (Oct 30, 2017)

I don't want to sound judgy or preachy here but I just can't understand how anyone could think porn is compatible with marriage. In my experience it really is harmful to men. I mean, isn't marriage supposed to be one man, one woman!

I personally think my wife is enough.... so glad I weeded porn out of my life years ago. It's just so ridiculously wrong!


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## Herschel (Mar 27, 2016)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*

Porn is fine. We spend too much time worrying about what should be and not enough time just letting us be what we are. Porn has been around since the beginning of time.

I was concerned that you said that you don’t really even think about sex unless you’ve been drinking. That’s a huge red flag there. I wouldn’t want to be with a woman who didn’t yearn for me. Maybe your lack of desire for him has made him want to turn you Into his sex kitten. Like, now he finally feels like you want him. The lack of desire and the lack of communication make this feel really dysfunctional to me.


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## CatholicDad (Oct 30, 2017)

Sure, as you say porn is fine and this is all her fault. 

That's ridiculous.


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## Confusedwife157 (Apr 12, 2018)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*



Herschel said:


> I was concerned that you said that you don’t really even think about sex unless you’ve been drinking. That’s a huge red flag there. I wouldn’t want to be with a woman who didn’t yearn for me. Maybe your lack of desire for him has made him want to turn you Into his sex kitten. Like, now he finally feels like you want him. The lack of desire and the lack of communication make this feel really dysfunctional to me.


Not once did I say that I only think about sex when I’ve been drinking. Not once did i say there’s a lack of desire for him. What I said was I’m much more uninhibited with sex after a few drinks. We have sex often and most often I haven’t had anything to drink. 
After I’ve had a few drinks, I’m more likely to engage in watching porn with him, let the dirty talk run wild. And that’s fine with me. The problem is, I also want to be made love to other times. Held, passion, kissed....there is no balance anymore since I’ve started watching porn with him. The making love is out the window and it’s hardcore porn sex and talk 100%. THAT is the problem. 
I’ll be his “sex kitten” at times....other times I want to be his loving wife. Does this make sense?


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## uhtred (Jun 22, 2016)

Makes complete sense to me.


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*

Me too.

Your husband needs to be educated in a way that makes sense to him.

Say this gently and without anger:
“I feel cheap and used when the balance of our sex life consists of hard core and very little soft core. I need more loving romantic sex. I need a balance of both and it’s not happening.”

And here is the last thing you say before you exit the room and let him think before you come back to the topic:

“How can we better balance what we each need?”


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## Herschel (Mar 27, 2016)

*Re: “Can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” regrets*



Confusedwife157 said:


> To be honest, the only time I’m turned on by it is only if we’ve had a few drinks on the weekend. Otherwise, I REALLY don’t care for it! I would think when I’m not reciprocating that he would get it, but it doesn’t stop him..


I apologize. I misread porn for sex.


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