# I messed up. Now what will be fair.



## oddball (Sep 5, 2012)

Ive been married for 19 years and have 3 children, oldest being 14. I recovered from a drug and gambling addiction 10 years ago. Unfortunately I started gambling again earlier this year. I now have a credit card debt i need to disclose

Tomorow I am going to come clean. My wife and I have had a rocky marriage, and we have been talking about divorce. I think the reason she hasnt pushed the issue was 1. Financial implications and 2. She didnt want to admit failure.

I know she is going to want to divorce now once I own up.

We struggle to maintain one family home. We work together in our own small business. We struggle month by month to maintain our middle class lifestyle.

My worry is the children. Ideally I would move out our home and find somewhere else to live. But we cant support two households.

Ive blown my credibility - and as the one causing the break up of the family - I am not sure how to proceed.

She will kick me out. Where do I go. I can couch surf for a bit - but in the short to medium term need to find a place to stay. We have equity in the house. But i don't want to disrupt the children lives too much.

I guess my question is this. Do i surrender my rights to fair treatment in the divorce because I'm the offending party in the marriage?

What do I say to my children. Do I admit addiction? Do we just say I was dishonest? 

I'm pretty anxious, I have stopped gambling, but know Im heading into a ****storm of note.

Any advice appreciated.


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## afab (Jul 28, 2015)

I wouldnt count on disaster till it happened. You say you both run the business so how would it be if youre not together. Surely you can make some way with the bank that stops you taking money out. Even stops you having a credit card. That would cure your gambling.


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## SecondTime'Round (Jan 15, 2015)

How much debt are we talking about here?

I would not forfeit all your financial rights if it comes to divorce. You need to be able to at least try to have a decent place to live where your kids can visit you.


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## Pluto2 (Aug 17, 2011)

Most courts will separate child support and equitable distribution. The child support is based on guidelines, and most don't consider the amount of debt any party is carrying. It is what it is.

If your wife were to come on here, she would likely be advised to assert that your gambling constituted a dissipation of marital assets in any equitable distribution claim. That means you should be responsible for carrying the debt in a divorce action. In reality she will get stuck with it, too, as the wife of a card holder. Is her name on the card? Is bankruptcy a possibility, like a Chapter 13 plan?

Practically speaking, this may be a time in your life when you are going to have to get a second job while couch surfing to get this under control.


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## Jane139 (Jan 6, 2015)

A lot depends on where you live, i.e if a community property state or not. You should get a free consultation with a divorce lawyer to get an idea what is likely to happen, if divorce can't be avoided.


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## oddball (Sep 5, 2012)

Thanks for the responses. I dont live in the US, but in Africa. IM confessing today, so I will get a better idea of the response of my wife. The amount of money in US dollars is about 3000 which is a about 1 months salary for me. 

Today is going to be a tough day


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## gouge_away (Apr 7, 2015)

Buddy, sell some stuff until the debt is paid off.


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## oddball (Sep 5, 2012)

The issue is not the debt itself. Im on my way to a meeting wherre its pretty certain I will get some consultancy work. I can slowly pay the debt off. The issue really is the lies and deceipt, and my addiction taking grip again.

My question was about how much I "fight" for what will be fair to me in the impending divorce. Our laws are pretty clear, and I hope we can use a mediator as opposed to a lawyer. But I suspect my wife my want to break my balls as a "punishment" for what Ive done.

Addicition my friends is a terrible thing. It makes us do and become who we are not meant to be.

I dont use my addicition as an excuse - I chose to gamble again.But what followed was a ride on the crazy bus that was both humiliating and extremely destructive to myself and my family.


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## Dycedarg (Apr 17, 2014)

$3000.00 is by no means unmanageable. As you said, the problem is the gambling itself. 

I'm going to venture a guess and say I don't think your wife is a particularly vindictive woman. Have you gone to counseling? If not, I would highly recommend it. I have a hunch that the animosity coming from your wife is due to the uncertainty and insecurity she's feeling, not because she hates you or anything.


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## gouge_away (Apr 7, 2015)

You seem to realize its your marriage you're gambling.

I'd quit thinking about your outcome and go all in to save your marriage.


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## oddball (Sep 5, 2012)

Well I returned from a business trip on Friday and we had the chance to talk. She is divorcing - my dark shadows are too much for her to deal with. I understand that.

So now its all about the kids, and an amicable divorce. She keeps saying we must disrupt the children as little as possible. I agree - except for her that means she keeps the house - and all the equity in it - until the kids leave home. It means I get them every second weekend (because forwards and backwards between us is not good for them?)

I think my older 2 girls 12 and 14 will have a say, im not sure what they will say, but I am prepared to listen. My 7 year old and I are pretty close. We do stuff together and I read to her most nights. When im on business away, she really misses me.

While my actions and addiction has lead to this - my wife is not perfect. I am not prepared to be punished because she wants to maintain her lifestyle. If she stays in our current home, I will have very little to find a rental with. Her view is I only need a 2 bedroom apartment. I ask her where my children must stay when they come over. Her response is I can just visit them in our current home. This is not working for me.

I want to create an environment where they feel they have a space to come too - not a blow up mattress on the floor somewhere - like visitors.

We have agreed to get a family mediator involved to assist with maintenance and visitation. I just want what is fair. I want to be able to have a relationship with my children in my space sometimes. Not always as a visitor in the old family home.

She says I should have thought about this before gambling our money away. She is right to a point - but is me being punished with unreasonable demands on her part in the best interests of everyone?

So many grey areas. I would really appreciate any insights.


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## depressedandexhausted (Aug 24, 2015)

Go get help. Speak to a doctor and start going to meetings. Get a support group first. 
This will help if you try to save your marriage.

If you file divorce it will show you are aware of your issue and are showing that you want to get better. Just because you have an addiction doesn't mean you don't deserve to see your kids. You deserve to have a life. This divorce is not going to be easy but most states have abolished fault based divorce. If you show your working on recovery it will be much better. You should get an attorney, do not listen to what your wife says, you need legal counsel.

Being that you have been married for 19 years you might have to pay (most likely will) alimony, however the court is also going to split all marital debts between the two of you, and look at your ability to pay and what her income is. No matter what your current lifestyle is going to change. 

As for the equity in your house, she doesn't get to keep that, it is usually split half and half and the party keeping the house buys out the other party. However, due to your outstanding debt from gambling it might be in the best order for you both to sell the house and pay off the debt. I don't know I am not in your situation. OH and DO NOT MOVE OUT, if your name is on the mortgage or deed she has no right, what so ever to kick you out! I cant stress this enough.

3000, is nothing in a gambling debt. My uncle was addicted to gambling, he got an excess of 220,000 in less than three days.


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## oddball (Sep 5, 2012)

Ive checked out meetings but they dont exist here. I got off coke 12 stepping in NA. Ive self excluded from the casino - and havent gambled in a good month now.Ill have to figure out better support - but I found the 12 step thing quite destructive to my self esteem. 

I dont think there is much to be saved of the marriage, it had a lot of problems before I did this act of sabotage. I ponder whether it was a deliberate action driven by my subconcious. My wife is very concerned about what people think of her. I think she stopped loving me as a husband a few years back, but couldnt confront the failure that would be. Now she has a nicely written history of "I left him because you cant trust an addict" - which is also not untrue Lol!

Anyway, its really about finding fairness in all of this. She is not rushing me out the house, and we are setting up with a mediator. We agreed we should conclude by year end, and not tell the kids until we can tell them what is going to happen

We still share a bed, but there is no affection. Hasnt been for some time. Im just trying to be a good dad. And am trying to work. Work is tough. Im not focussed.


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## oddball (Sep 5, 2012)

Divorce conversation continues. My wife and I are trying to be fair and amicable. We see a family mediator next week hopefully. Im looking for an apartment. The main challenge is her reluctance to sell our current home and release equity. She is reluctant because dhe consistantly points out the children need minimum disruption. In addition, our mortage repayment is quite low, so selling and renting wouldnt be easier - but it would release equity. I guiess she also nervous that a gambling addict with available cash is not a good combination. Fair point that. I already take on extra consulting work wherever I can, so I cant really take on another job. But its going to be very hard to run two households. Its pretty standard here that mother gets primary custody - and father every second weekend. Im really not happy with that - but what I read says its best not to keep taking the children to and fro all the time. Ive asked for access in the week, maybe one night or so. She said I could see them at home once a week. I also want fixed days to take them to school. Its a good way to chat about school and remain in touch. The family mediator will interview the three girls, theyre 7,12 and 14 - and hear there views.

I must commend my wife. Ive devasted her with my relapse. She hasnt displayed much anger and is trying to be reasonable. Both of us are a bit bewildered that it has come to here. She see no turning back, and the marriage was very lonely for me, its not been healthy for a while. My relapse was the final straw, but t was getting toxic with lots of resentment, anger, and little visible love shown. This was also not a good example for my children.

My overwhelming emotion currently is fear. Fear of loosing my children, fear of loneliness, fear of screwing up my life and being 45 with addiction issues and dark personality issues hanging over my head.

This is my life that I have created. Much I am proud of. But dark shadows hang.

Okay, Im writing for therapy now.

What really gets me is the huge gap between how I am perceived in society and who I am. I'm a respected person in my profession, and speak on platforms around the world. I work in development, with social and economic justice issues underpinning what I do. I work with poor communities and champion education rights. I talk about fair trade and producers getting fair share. I talk about non racialism, inclusivity, social justice. I work with very poor families in a community health project. No one would ever imagine Im as messed up as I am. There is much I do right - for a better world. Yet my own world, my family, my own children, I have not been fair or just to. Good works should begin at home. Shadows shadows shadows....


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## lifeistooshort (Mar 17, 2013)

Have you considered that it might be best for them to stay in their home? You claim you don't want to disrupt their lives but you want to force them out of their home so you can have a bigger house. That's extremely disruptive.

You don't deserve to be destitute but this is a tough situation all around and will require some sacrifice for the good of your kids. I know am apartment will be a little tough but you can manage. Why should they have to leave their home because you have a gambling addiction?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## lifeistooshort (Mar 17, 2013)

depressedandexhausted said:


> Go get help. Speak to a doctor and start going to meetings. Get a support group first.
> This will help if you try to save your marriage.
> 
> If you file divorce it will show you are aware of your issue and are showing that you want to get better. Just because you have an addiction doesn't mean you don't deserve to see your kids. You deserve to have a life. This divorce is not going to be easy but most states have abolished fault based divorce. If you show your working on recovery it will be much better. You should get an attorney, do not listen to what your wife says, you need legal counsel.
> ...



Absolutely incorrect regarding the house. First of all he's not the states, he's in Africa so their laws might be different. Even in the states it is false that the custodial parent doesn't keep the house. Courts consider the kids interest which is to stay in their home
When I was divorced I got to stay in the house with the stipulation that if i sold it ex would get half of equity and when the younger child turned 18 I'd either sell it or buy him out.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## oddball (Sep 5, 2012)

Yesterday was mediation day. I have agreed to leave my family in the house, and we have a parenting plan drawn up. I get the children every second weekend and get to take them to school 2 morning a week. This will be good for keeping in touch with their activities. I get to see them on Wednesday evenings for 3 hours. They can choose if they want to sleep over on Wednesday nights if its not disruptive to schooling. 

We are now finalizing the child support payments. The income we have is finite, but I want to be as generous as I can, without leaving myself nothing to live on. Apartment hunt continues. Going to view one today that is walking distance from home. 

My main concern is making my apartment hospitable for my children. They're used to a good lifestyle. I wont be able to afford satellite tv and wifi etc initially - but will start with wifi. My older two are on smartphones and will want to be in contact with friends and social media. 

My apartment will be a downgrade from their home with their mother. I will have to show them that things do not bring happiness. I sincerely hope they will adapt and find joy in being with me.

I am fearful of living on my own again. Its been more than 20 years, and even then I lived in shared houses. I fear the solitude and the loneliness that will be. But if i cant find happiness in solitude, I will have to learn that.

My friends are all married with families. We have a lot of shared friends. I wonder how that is all going to pan out. Time will only tell. Fear is often unwarranted. Its future tripping. What will be will be.

The last big thing is telling the children. We have chosen not to tell them until we know exactly what is happening. That is clarifying, so in the next week or so we will have to tell them. I'm dreading that.

On a positive note I have had absolutely no desire, or even thoughts of gambling. That crazy bus has been parked. It needs to stay parked.

I feel relief and sadness that my 20 year relationship is over. I still love my wife. But we have not been good together for quite a long time. The MC didnt work, and then I burnt my bridges by betraying trust. Be that as it may, perhaps happiness lies ahead for us, as we untangle all these years of being together.

My heart aches for my children, who are about to have there little worlds explode.


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## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

Oddball, I hope you get the help you need and would recommend your family get some counselling too.

You obviously give alot to others in the work you do but have dropped the ball in your own family.

Just try to be the best father you can be, when you are with your kids. The best gift you can give them is to be honest (with the older ones) and get yourself totally free of your addiction.

Good luck


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## oddball (Sep 5, 2012)

Thanks Aine

Yes, i dropped the ball in my own family. I havent really started to deal with that. I know that I will need to work on forgiveness for myself over time.

As my children get older I will share my addiction with them, as I fear the genetic implications for my children. Im not ashamed of being an addict. It is what it is. I am however ashamed of what my addiction has lead to.

I am also not convinced our marriage would have survived anyway. Its been a very tough relationship for a couple of years now. But its all academic now really.

Thanks for the good wishes, Im writing here for myself really - but its always nice to get a response


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## lifeistooshort (Mar 17, 2013)

You did the right thing letting them stay in their home. As for seeing you at your apartment, it might not be such a big deal. You're their father and that will never change. Just be fun to be around and be strong as their father so they have security with you. 

Also, this is an opportunity for them to see that sometimes difficulties happen. How you deal with this will be a model for them as they face difficulty in their own lives.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## oddball (Sep 5, 2012)

So things have just come to a standstill. The divorce is still happenning, but we cant agree about child support. We had one discussion, my wife got really mad with me, I didnt want to fight - and left the room. Ive been waiting for her to re engage, but its not happenning. Im still apartment hunting, but cant really commit until I know my monthly budget. This is symtematic of our marriage. She would never confront or want to make decisions. She asked me yesterday when Im moving out. I said once we agree on child support. She walked off, and watched tv the rest of the night.

I took my children camping over the long weekend, which was great fun. It was pretty relaxed without there mom around. Im a bit more easygoing, and don't hold everything up to a perfection level that is unrealistic.

I'm not enjoying the limbo. My heart is very sore. I feel deaply sad and think about the fact we will never have another family holiday, or fun family outings - all of us together. 

But feelings are impermanent, and sadness will pass.

Divorce is not an easy process I am finding out. But it is what it is.


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