# Keeping Things Hidden



## George2010 (Dec 28, 2010)

Hello Everyone,

My wife has a relationship with another man that appears to be a friendship of sorts. When I've asked her about it she seems to become defensive and angry that I am questioning her. She says that she is doing nothing wrong, that I am just being jealous. She has become so angry about it that it has escalated to a full blown fight. 

She says that it's primarily a business relationship, but she also says that she feels sorry for him because of his poor physical health and failed marriage.

I know that they talk on the phone several times a day, not always during times that would be considered typical for a business relationship, and that she makes an effort to ensure that I am not around when they talk. I've asked her to be open about her relationship with this person, but she has not been forthcoming. 

What are your thoughts? Any advice you could pass along would be of great help.


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## nice777guy (Nov 23, 2009)

I'm guessing your gut says its more, otherwise you wouldn't be here.

Its likely an emotional affair - could be a physical affair. The overblown, angry response is a classic sign.

Start looking around in the infidelity section on this board and you'll find a lot of familiar signs.

I would recommend a book called Not Just Friends that walks you through the signs and how to handle things.

Strap in and hold on, because you might be in for a hard bumpy ride...


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## major misfit (Oct 17, 2010)

The book recommendation is a good one. Absolutely get the book. I believe the author is Shirley Glass? My mind fails me more and more. 

Your gut is telling you something your mind doesn't want to believe. There is SOMETHING going on between your wife and this so-called "friend". I guess WHAT is yet to be determined. I'd sure get to snooping and checking around. But by all means...whatever you find keep close to your heart. Don't divulge how you came across your information. Never ever reveal your sources.


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## George2010 (Dec 28, 2010)

Thanks for the pointers. I will definitely get the book.

Major, when you say that I should not reveal what I find nor my sources, do you mean persons who may have provided me with information about the situation? Why would it be bad to reveal what I find or how I found it if that method was not though a mutual acquaitance?


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## nice777guy (Nov 23, 2009)

George2010 said:


> Thanks for the pointers. I will definitely get the book.
> 
> Major, when you say that I should not reveal what I find nor my sources, do you mean persons who may have provided me with information about the situation? Why would it be bad to reveal what I find or how I found it if that method was not though a mutual acquaitance?


I "think" what Major is alluding to would be more along the lines of phone bills or e-mail accounts. If you start asking about these kinds of things, she'll change passwords or just find another way to communicate.

If a mutual acquaintence spotted her and someone out on the town, I would certainly mention it, but casually. But if its someone who sees things on a regular basis (co-worker?), then I'm not so sure.

One thing I found was that asking a lot of questions helped. First of all, you could tell by the angry reaction that you were onto something. Second, ask enough and their answers will become inconsistent. Hard for them to remember what lies they've told. Doesn't help end things, but will help you verify.


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## 827Aug (Apr 27, 2008)

George2010 said:


> When I've asked her about it she seems to become defensive and angry that I am questioning her. She says that she is doing nothing wrong


This is a big red flag to me. I've had a male friend for very many years. There has never been anything romantic going on between us. Therefore, I never felt the need to hide anything. When I talk to him on the phone, it's usually in the family room in front of others. My estranged husband was never threatened by that friendship. Does your wife talk on the phone to him in front of you? Is her phone locked? Do you have access to all of her accounts? If nothing is going on, she shouldn't be getting so defensive.

The other posters have given you some good advice. Hope you get to the bottom of this.


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## major misfit (Oct 17, 2010)

nice777guy said:


> I "think" what Major is alluding to would be more along the lines of phone bills or e-mail accounts. If you start asking about these kinds of things, she'll change passwords or just find another way to communicate.
> 
> If a mutual acquaintence spotted her and someone out on the town, I would certainly mention it, but casually. But if its someone who sees things on a regular basis (co-worker?), then I'm not so sure.
> 
> One thing I found was that asking a lot of questions helped. First of all, you could tell by the angry reaction that you were onto something. Second, ask enough and their answers will become inconsistent. Hard for them to remember what lies they've told. Doesn't help end things, but will help you verify.



Yes, that's what I meant. If you put a VAR in the car and you hear something, don't divulge how you found out about it. Same thing if you find texts, emails, conversations, etc. Never say a word about it. If someone mentions seeing them together somewhere, mention it in passing AFTER you ask her about it first. Such as "where did you have lunch today" if someone mentions seeing the two of them together at a certain restaurant. Innocuous questions. But never divulge the hard evidence. Niceguy is right...it will cause them to go underground, cover their tracks better. 

Is her cell phone like an extention of her arm? Is she NEVER without it? Even to the point of sleeping with it?


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## George2010 (Dec 28, 2010)

Yes, my gut tells me something else. The defensiveness and secrecy raises some very strong suspicions. 

Major, NiceGuy, thanks for clarifying the need to keep sources and information close to the vest. I will continue to observe. 827Aug, I have access to some accounts, including phone. She typically does not talk to him in front of me. The rare occasions are when I happen to be there when he calls, and those calls are very short and non-conversational. I have been suspecting that he is sometimes told when we will be spending time together (i.e., when not to call).

I will continue to read posts on this forum. Ones I've read so far have been eye opening and very helpful. I've also started reading Not Just Friends. So far I've found it to be very insightful. I appreciate the reference!

What are your thoughts on the trade off between snooping and trust in a situation such as this? It is a risk that I am taking, but if there is no affair, the (discovered) snooping could be damaging.


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## MarriedWifeInLove (May 28, 2010)

Trust your instincts, they are usually right.

If snooping is done right and carefully, your wife will never know (trust me I have experience on this). I have no issues at all with snooping, if you can't get your wife to give you the truth, then you have to get it somehow - you deserve to know.

So choose carefully what you want to snoop on and how you do it.

And I totally agree with Major and NiceGuy, keep things close to your chest. The more you reveal to her the more time she has to make excuses and cover it up.

Business relationship discussions don't take place late at night unless you're Donald Trump and the fact that he has a failed marriage to boot - this is ripe for either an EA or PA.

How is your own relationship doing? Are there problems? Has she expressed that she is dissatisfied, is she distant, has your sex life gone to hell, what other signs could you be missing?


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## nice777guy (Nov 23, 2009)

I've always thought that its only "snooping" if there's something being hidden.

Some people here might recommend a keylogger on her computer, installing a GPS on her car, or hiring a PI. To me, that's going too far. But looking at the number on her cell phone that pops up when it rings is totally normal. And you have every right to look at "your" cell phone bill - including any detailed billing information that may show who she's calling and when.

I found keeping a journal to be very helpful. It helped me sort through my own thoughts and feelings. And it also helped me catch inconsistencies in her stories.

Trust your gut and keep your eyes open.



George2010 said:


> Yes, my gut tells me something else. The defensiveness and secrecy raises some very strong suspicions.
> 
> Major, NiceGuy, thanks for clarifying the need to keep sources and information close to the vest. I will continue to observe. 827Aug, I have access to some accounts, including phone. She typically does not talk to him in front of me. The rare occasions are when I happen to be there when he calls, and those calls are very short and non-conversational. I have been suspecting that he is sometimes told when we will be spending time together (i.e., when not to call).
> 
> ...


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## BigBadWolf (Nov 30, 2009)

Your woman, she is in at least an Emotional Affair. 

Contunie to study this site and search and learn everyting you can about affairs, the stages of affairs, the predictible behavior of affairs. 

Affair behavior is so predictible it is a literal script. Learn it learn it learn it!!!!!!



George2010 said:


> What are your thoughts on the trade off between snooping and trust in a situation such as this? It is a risk that I am taking, but if there is no affair, the (discovered) snooping could be damaging.



Listen, I'm not sure who told you what concerning a woman, but unnerstand this one ting:

A woman, she is LOVING the jealousy of her man.

You are willing to take a risk for your woman?

You are willing to fight for your woman?

You are willing to stick your neck out, do the research and legwork, and fight fight fight for your marriage to this woman?

Can't you see the shining mettle you are made of, to unnertake these tasks!!!!!!

Fight, and fight hard!

Your woman, be sure if she is not in an affair she will see your mettle, and love you for it.

Of course, if she is in an affair (sadly she is, at least EA), then nothing under the sun will be "right" about you until you smash the affair, and first tings first, the affair MUST be smashed before there is any progress at all.

Be bold, have courage, fight fight fight!

This site, many people here that will help. Listen to them.

I wish you well.


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## George2010 (Dec 28, 2010)

MarriedWifeInLove said:


> Trust your instincts, they are usually right.
> 
> If snooping is done right and carefully, your wife will never know (trust me I have experience on this). I have no issues at all with snooping, if you can't get your wife to give you the truth, then you have to get it somehow - you deserve to know.
> 
> ...


It is a bit more difficult to determine the legitimacy of calls since are in the hospitality industry. Business discussions do take place at off hours in our case, but that is more the exception rather than the rule.

Those signs of problems in our relationship are there. I fault myself as the key reason for that. I am making significant progress in correcting that.

I AM willing to fight for my wife, and thanks to the posts on this thread I am beginning to understand just how deep this is. Wolf, I thank you for your encouragement!


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