# I never wanted to leave or consider a divorce...I was forced to, please advice.



## ADM

My story is long and complicated and I don’t know whether I can tell it all. I am trying to make it short.

I’ve know my husband in a bulletin board 7 years ago. We first started our long distance relationship as an adventure on a vacation we took together. Things turned serious on the long run. We met each other frequently. He was going through a separation followed by a divorce. Two kids were involved back then. I have sustained him during this process. I have even suggested him to get back to his ex wife for kids’ sake if he felt like it. This was before I gave in to this relationship I considered impossible at the time. I loved him very much and I think still love him despite what I am going through. 
We started a life together when I started my post grad studies abroad. We lived together. We had little problems now and then but I labeled them as problems that come along when grownups and self sufficient people like us share life together. He started showing complexes concerning his children. In fact I had gone through a lot of discussions concerning kids since I had none of my own but respected the hierarchy of the responsibility he had and really appreciated it. What kind of man could one be if he didn’t care about his kids? I even have encouraged him time after time when he was down so he could find the courage to continue.
Then I left to my country. It was a decision we both took. I had obligation toward my company and had to get back. There started our real problems. I think he was a little jealous about the life I had and thought I was having a great time. We have had many fights and doubts. He wanted to impose himself and I didn’t’ like it. I wanted him to believe my heart and soul was with him but didn’t feel like sacrificing all just like teenagers. He want d me to look for a job in his country (we are both from the same country, he only emigrated when he was 20) and I did so, but didn’t have a chance to be offered anything at all. He was bringing his kids’ discussion all the time. I knew I made him uncomfortable when he was with his kids thus I proposed to give him time alone during vacation or things like that so he could better serve his children. He took that as a selfish behavior. I wanted to let him know that was not true and that he was insulting me in a sense…he didn’t trust me. 

In the mean time we have been married and planned a life together. Love was all around. We had a little off sometime but then it was him who looked for me and I gave in. We met again, discussed and moved on. I was pregnant and we planned to use this thing as a possibility to move in together. I could use this time as time to get used to being abroad, far from family, social and professional life. I wanted to use it as time to adapt myself to new life. So I took maternity leave and moved to our brand new house. Then crises come and I don’t seem to find a job at all. Our baby comes and we are all happy about that. Our life is better off but we still have small problems now and then. It comes the time to get back from maternity leave and I do so after we have discussed it. I see that my professional life is not like before and I don’t feel like being far and sacrificing my family comfort etc for my job, so I ask for a lay off and leave. This was all done after we agreed to do so. That was a year ago. I am still in search with no chance of a job.
Our disputes have been escalating. I have figured out my husband doesn’t want to take responsibility of me and our son. He is always in favor of all concerning his other kids but never doing the same for our baby. He also, hasn’t been providing for our needs. For me, being and independent girl long ago (I started working when I was 18) this seemed very logic although it disturbed me. We have had discussions about this as I don’t like this kind of misbalanced behavior. 
He leaves home every three weeks to go to his kids. They live 1200 km far from us. He leaves in total 10 days a month. It is a big problem for me. First that is a lot to accept. Second he goes and stays over his ex mother in law who lives just opposite to his ex who now is married to another man and have had two other children with him. Despite the fact we come from a conservative mentality, I don’t find it normal. I have been accompanying him several times, but that is very unnatural and makes me feel very uncomfortable. I have accepted it (!!!) because I wanted to show him I support him in his duty as father. 
This tolerant behavior has lead to other stuff which now I cannot stand anymore.
Last time he raised his voice in front of his kids. They are very good kids, indeed, but discipline is something they don’t’ know. Their mother does not do that. So, while I was trying to give him some advice on how to maintain home, he screamed at me in front of his daughter. It was very devastating. I said nothing but when he came to “console” me in our room I got very very very upset. I left for my country after this. My parents, wanting to unlock the situation (which I never told them since I don’t want them to get involved in our life…considering all the times we dispute) had invited him to come over offering him a ticket. He used this to press me. I found it very immature and said no. I was very ready to stay there forever but with help from friends and his promise he would change attitude, I gave in and turned back.
Before I go any further, I must say I have had a story with his mother. When I was pregnant 6 months with my son and invited by her at her home to spend x-mas, she made a storm out of nothing calling me names which I never responded back and forcing us to leave her house. I expected my husband to take a position he never took. I was told later his mother’s attitude was to exhaust situations and people like that and everybody let her go and gave in after a while. I didn’t feel like letting it go for two reasons; first because I never missed her respect and second because Ii never gave her a chance to disrespect me. Even when she cursed and called me names I said nothing. But I was very doubtful about my husband’s position afterwards. I expected him to take an action but he argued his mother was like that and when he tried to tell her what she did she would say it was nothing she did and that she didn’t mean it like that was something to be discussed. We always have had arguments about this fact. He never cut communication with her or diminishes it a little. That was very devastating for me to understand considering his mother left him when he was 15 and went with another man.
So, or discussions about his compulsive behavior (like buying collectables in internet when we have to bye grocery), or kids or mother etc has been our daily agenda for some time. All the time he was saying he never meant any of them to hurt me, but never proved the opposite. I am not saying he did it deliberately, but this kind of immaturity I cannot stand. 
Last time we had a discussion he threatened me with the baby. He said he didn’t want me to leave, despite me being unhappy. I went mad. After 12 hours he said I could leave if I felt like. He even offered therapy for both. I don’t believe in therapy but accepted to do it if it was for our best. It never happened. So now I am being tired and wanted to leave for some days. He says he understands me and has his support. Kids are on their way for vacation and I don’t leave since my baby loves them. Of course, I stay and make a promise with myself that would keep situation positive. 
My DH finds again the way to make me unhappy. His daughter has her birthday and we have to do it great since she has to turn 10. I realize he needs help and only two days before they arrive he has no plans. For my husband, a kids’ birthday is inviting all his old family and do a BBQ. For me, kids deserve better. They deserve to have other kids and do a b-day for kids. I know my husband’s concern is his mother who for the record doesn’t even know her kids b-days. In reality he was very OK to do it in a kid’s environment and so we did. He thanked me a lot in front of everyone for the “so great” party and arrangement I made. I didn’t’ take it for granted. After this kids are at home and I am happy for my son who is very happy having children around (need to mention he loves kids). 
They have arrived in our country with their mother and their father in law and rented a house for the vacation. The house belongs to my sister’s in laws ex mother in law. I found out my sister in law stayed over at this place during the w-e of the great event and even invited (!!!) us to dinner there (like she knows to cook). I found it absurd she stayed over there and even more absurd she invited us for dinner. It is true we have very good relationship with the ex of my husband, but to my opinion, we should stay over borders of courtesy and don’t exaggerate. 
The first week of their stay kids had to stay with their mother and the second week would come over to our place. They show up very shortly at our home and had to leave to go to their relatives who live in the same city. My husband has to leave with hem and it is right there I find out they have been making plans to go to laser game and spend evening over there. For the hundredth time I feel like left behind in dark and not been considered to organize at all. I don’t know whether I mentioned it at all that I suffer from being left in dark about any plans my husband does. He organizes it all (mainly considering kids or stud that has to do with him) without discussing it with me first and I have to accept it. I refused to leave as a demonstration against his behavior. When he left we were having a great time with the baby. His cousin and he called to invite but I refused. He listens to the baby crying and tells me he is crying because he knows his sister and brother were having fun over relatives and he was left home. Actually a toddler doesn’t have those kind of thoughts and in reality after a long day at the crèche he was simply hungry and tired and he needed to be taken care of. After that he arrives home and accuses me for what I mention above. I said I was not being selfish but just took a position to tell him for the immense time I didn’t like the way he was treating me. Time ago when I didn’t want to get involved in the life with his kids he accused me for being selfish and now that I WANT to be considered he doesn’t want me anymore and ignores my presence or my contribution at the decision making. He wanted to take the baby with him. First I refused but then I dressed the baby in tears and gave him to his father. It was still evening and although it was 2 in the morning none of them was at home. I called over his cousin and she told me they just left. I have been waiting at the window for several hours. When he gets home and finds me desperate he asks what he could do to smoothen my pain. I didn’t respond. 
In the morning he wakes up to go to his therapist. I was exhausted from last night and had vertigo so I asked him to take care of the baby. He takes the baby with him and that was 9 in the morning. I wait and wait and wait for them to come but no show up. I prepare lunch but still no show up. I send and SMS at 2PM but no response. I even send one to his cousin but no hope. I took than I walk to calm down and gather my ideas. At about 18 o’clock I receive an SMS telling they were coming over home. At the time I’m coming back home I receive a call from his cousin and she was telling me she just saw the SMS and that my husband left to do some grocery shopping and that he went home, but then again she told me they would come back over her place. I was shocked again. She said she thought I knew it. I wished them a great time. By the time I arrive home I see none there. No husband, no baby, no grocery shopping. I wait and wait and wait and none comes. It is then 2h35 in the morning when I call his cousin. I ask her where the baby is and I am being very upset. She tells me baby is sleeping and that, of course, the baby was where I called and gives the phone to my husband to whom I scream. I couldn’t hold my anger anymore. I called him immature for doing the same thing two nights in a row and demand him to bring me the baby immediately. 
He comes with no kids but the baby. He tries to (again !!!) console me. I tell him what I think is exaggerated and go to bad. In the morning, early, he leaves telling he would have to pick up kids from their relatives. They come home and everything is fine. At a certain moment I am in skype with my family and have shut the door. When I open the door I see none at home. When I SMS him asking where they were and why he didn’t tell me where they were going he responded they were at the park and no reason for why he didn’t’ tell me when he was going. 
In the mean time I see a missed call at our fix line. I call back and see that was my sister in law. She tells me she was looking for his brother to discuss the party of tomorrow. I ask: “What party?”….she tells me that it was pasque and that they had planned to go to this house of campaign that belonged to her ex mother in law and that my husband’s wife had rented for vacation. Hell no!!! I tell her I wasn’t aware of anything at all. I thought that my husband wanted to go and do this ritual of collecting eggs in the bushes since children loved it and that was that. To my surprise NO. When kids went all to bad he comes to the room and tells me: “You know there is a party tomorrow” I say I didn’t know about any. He tells me it was there. I say ehe…and after that I find out, not only there is a party, but it is a party about his daughter again and where would come the whole family (including his mother) and that he has been organizing it long ago.
I couldn’t believe my ears when he asked me to take the baby with him. I told him I wanted a divorce. The reason is because I felt insulted for not being included in such a thing, or worst, for being ignored. I told him I didn’t like it at all the he never considered my feeling even for a second. I told him I found it exaggerated he organized a party with his sister at a place his ex wife rented with the family that has been celebrating this birthday just a week ago. I told him I found it exaggerated he didn’t consider even for a second to ask me do a sacrifice toward his mother if it was really necessary to do something like that. I accused him for being a hypocrite and mediocre when asking me to give it another try all the times we have been disputing and bagging me to stay and on the other hand him doing nothing to show me he is a team with me. I told him this was a vanitous relationship and that I refused to grow my child in an environment where his mother was disrespected, offended and taken for granted. I started packing and told him it was time for me to leave from I house I never belonged. I had to stay calm as I had too many things going over my head and since this wasn’t planned I didn’t’ know where to go. I decided to go to another state and not go back to my country to my parents and family.
I SMSed him when I arrived at my friends’ house since he wanted to talk to the baby. He called the baby only ones and has been now 4 days he has not called him anymore. This has devastated me. The baby keeps on asking of his father and I don’t know what to do. I am searching a job and a house and am planning on staying here, not because that is something I wanted to do but because I have to take over responsibility and move on. I feel forced on my decision. 
I have never planned a divorce on my life. I have been so convinced that was the father of my children and I didn’t marry when I was 20. This has been done as wanted and planned and with love and care. Now Ii feel trapped and lost on the road. 
I know it is a very confusing story and I didn’t tell it right, but it took me half a day to put it down and I am not going back to correct it.
I hope some of you find the time to advice me on what to do.
I have been hoping he would do something to win us back, but nothing so far. Silence reigns!
Thank you all for caring. I appreciate every thought.


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## ADM

He just called to talk to his son. In reality he called my friend on her mobile. I think he wanted more to talk to her, or at least that is what I prefer to believe. I took the phone and I said he has to call his child on a regular bases. The baby has not slept well. He asks about his father continuously and when we mention him the baby says: "Mama, papa went with Her and Him (his other children)..."
He was very distant on the phone, and so was I too.

Anyways, from a conversation he has had yesterday with my friend over the phone I have the feeling he is now going through lots of anger while I am loosing ground here because I am still under shock.


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## ADM

Not even a word?  That is sad...


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## LVS

I am sorry for what you had to live
You wanted it you planned for it with love and care but you forgot the most important part in a relationship is the communication
without communication no love can stand or survive for long time
with serious problems and nothing has been done or a plan has been made to solve them 
I think you talked about therapist i wonder why you didn't try to go by yourself if he didn't go the therapist would give you lot of helpful things at least to make you feel better
I can feel your anger I can feel the stressing life you were living and i can understand your decision to leave but i wish you were able to control your anger to give yourself time to find a good plan for leaving 

If your husband is middle eastern I can understand his behavior
I don't give him right about anything he seems very manipulative and controlling person and he seems more stubborn to think of bringing you back at least for now i think he is so angry know as you mentioned and he may want to punish you especially if you don't have resources and as i see him he may want to see you running back on your knees and begging him to be back together which you should never do it
i can't go further with my thoughts because i don't know what's the real situation can you explain more
Something not clear too you don't want to go to your parents for what reason? and you don't seem to have the money to take care of yourself and your baby how you are going to another state and how long you think you can stay with your friend


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## sisters359

It's pretty difficult to understand all of this, but one thing is clear--you need some help communicating. You are acting childishly at times, and he is not telling you things you want or need to know. 

You say you don't "believe" in therapy--that is pretty close-minded. Therapy helps a lot of people figure out their problems; what is there to believe in? If you think it is just for "weak" people, think again. A lot of very happy people got happy with therapy--those who refuse remain angry, or worse. 

Nothing will change if you do not take steps to help yourself and without someone impartial to help you, things may well get worse. You cannot make him change; you can change yourself and how you respond to him (so you don't scream, for example). He may be making a lot of mistakes, too, but if you make the effort to change first, or go to therapy together, then he will be more likely to change, too. Good luck.


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## ADM

Le vieux sage said:


> I am sorry for what you had to live
> You wanted it you planned for it with love and care but you forgot the most important part in a relationship is the communication
> without communication no love can stand or survive for long time
> with serious problems and nothing has been done or a plan has been made to solve them
> I think you talked about therapist i wonder why you didn't try to go by yourself if he didn't go the therapist would give you lot of helpful things at least to make you feel better
> I can feel your anger I can feel the stressing life you were living and i can understand your decision to leave but i wish you were able to control your anger to give yourself time to find a good plan for leaving.
> 
> If your husband is middle eastern I can understand his behavior
> I don't give him right about anything he seems very manipulative and controlling person and he seems more stubborn to think of bringing you back at least for now i think he is so angry know as you mentioned and he may want to punish you especially if you don't have resources and as i see him he may want to see you running back on your knees and begging him to be back together which you should never do it
> i can't go further with my thoughts because i don't know what's the real situation can you explain more
> Something not clear too you don't want to go to your parents for what reason? and you don't seem to have the money to take care of yourself and your baby how you are going to another state and how long you think you can stay with your friend


Mon mari est la moitié de l'Europe occidentale et la moitié de l'Europe de l'est. Ce mélange a un goût très amer. Je le vois très liberall à une heure et très conservatrice sur les autres. Quand il est libéral et têtu, il fait la démonstration ce qui concerne son enfance.....

I will continue on Enlgish, but I particularly would like to hear your opinion...

My husband is half western European and half from East Europe. This mixture has a very bitter taste. I see him very liberal at times and very conservative at others. When he is liberal and stubborn he is demonstrating what concerns his childhood. Obviously he is a survivor. I do believe he doesn't trust women because he doesn't give in with all his heart.He has never had a good role model in his life (and probably here I am exaggerating since I'm his wife not his shrink). His behaviour is very contradictory. For example he is the one to agree to make the party for kids only and he is the one to regret it afterwards. I cannot tell you how come he get manipulated by all people but his wife. I cannot tell him why he is such a stubborn person, something I have very much realised too and told him also. He has always promised to work it out and never did so. On the other hand I feel lonely in the boat as I have sacrificed it almost all for our family (to tell it I did that only for him is very stupid, I did it for all of us) and our future together. 
I do understand he thinks I have no options right now. Yes! But that is not true. The world will always be in need for those who can wash and clean although I let my career on its peak ... I made all this road to here not to get back and knee bagging him to take me back. I am still holding on my decision and believe that was the right thing to do.Ths tituation forced me to react inorder to save my face...what the hack... He didn't expected it that hursh but that is what scares me right now. Because it did cross his mind I was going to make a big fuss and despite that he did it anyway.

I thing now he is getting more angry since he is getting more practical. So, for him pay for two families which are in deifferent states and km apart will be very difficult and he is trapped into that for the moment. 

If his anger concerns my leave it means he is not in the right track. Only when he starts thinking of what caused me to leave things could have another course. For the moment the hope is lost!!!


And YES, he is very manipulative and if he things of something, he will do it at ANY cost (it's just an observation). 

Please tell e what do you want to know more. I value a lot your opninion...I am simply trying to understand it myself too...


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## ADM

sisters359 said:


> It's pretty difficult to understand all of this, but one thing is clear--you need some help communicating. You are acting childishly at times, and he is not telling you things you want or need to know.
> 
> You say you don't "believe" in therapy--that is pretty close-minded. Therapy helps a lot of people figure out their problems; what is there to believe in? If you think it is just for "weak" people, think again. A lot of very happy people got happy with therapy--those who refuse remain angry, or worse.
> 
> Nothing will change if you do not take steps to help yourself and without someone impartial to help you, things may well get worse. You cannot make him change; you can change yourself and how you respond to him (so you don't scream, for example). He may be making a lot of mistakes, too, but if you make the effort to change first, or go to therapy together, then he will be more likely to change, too. Good luck.



I have gone once through therapy when I was pregnant, living far form my husband, having lots of problems with him (I thought that was the long distance relationship and his jealousy about my job and all). I went there because I took all the blame on me. To tell it shortly, I should have sticked more into my decisions and tell him I was sure of my thoughts and show my dedication otherwise. In stead, I started tolerating him very much. I thought we needed some tolerance in order to handle such a complicated relationship with all kids and stuff. I regret it today. I was very hormonal and not my real me. That shake him a bit but not for the right direction.

I have changed a lot!!! See I gave it all for my family and our future together and when I promised I would walk down the isle with him at any cost I meant it (this doesn't imply I meant loosing my dignity and disregarded for my feelings), just to show my husband and myself too that I was thinking in long terms and not selfish. And...where am I now...no job, no family, no money and above all with a toddler that wakes 3 in the morning and asks for his father. What hell of a mother wouldn't get sensitive about that?! 

Anyways, he has always used intermediaries to talk to me. We have also talked. We seem to agree and then again he does something else, not necessarily the same things, and we start fighting again. This has brought me to the obvious opinion that he disregards me and what I feel or the consequences of what he does, he simply doesn't care. We have a very good communication channel...and we do speak a lot...he is not being sincere when he doesn't tell me stuff...and that is our difference.

I do believe my husband lacks prencips, because there are things we A PRIORY don't do because we have prencips. Like for e.g. I don't cheat my husband or lie to hime because I shouldn't not because my husband don't like it...(it's just a silly example to make my point clear)...so, if he doesn't feel like telling me all and doing things on my back...I would have the right to think he lacks sincerity etc etc etc

BUT, yet again, if there is something that could save this family and our relationship with dignity, I am willing to do it...but this time there is no way back!!! and I don't know how to ensure that.


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## ADM

Today I received a mail from him. Actually I expected that to happen. It was very predictable. He wants to have the child for a week but is not telling where and how although I know.

We, now, live in between our ex home and this of my husband's children. This means, every 3 weeks he gets to see his kids, he plans to get here first, pick up the baby and go to kids. Then come back, give back the child and go back to his home. 
I kinda expected that considering the distances, his schedule and his financial situation. 
However, I still cannot believe how come he things I'll be giving the baby so he can go and stay over his ex-mother in law and his ex wife. This is terrifying me. The situation will confuse the baby a lot. And besides, I am never willing to leave the baby for a week anywhere outside our ex home even if it is with his father.

I haven't responded yet but I am in real need of an advice here. I am planning to tell him we will be traveling back (and that corresponds with those dates) and stay over there for some days since we have administrative issues that cannot be resolved in distance by not letting him know I predicted his move....but then again he deserves a lesson because the issue will come back again in the long run. 

I really don't know what to do...Help me!!!


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## ADM

I see, nobody likes long stories...but if it was that simple as a physical abuse or sth similar I wouldn't be looking for an opinion but would have left in the minute. 

I responded, and I wasn't so smooth...but yet again very short. He deserved it!!! Men, he seems he has been busy all those years scheduling everyone forgetting children don't need to be seen, they need to be taken care of. In the same time this kind of vulgar pragmatism gives me nerves...so I wrote 4 short clear sentences.
I still cannot believe he's not fighting for his family. It seems like accepting the defeat is simpler...it sucks.


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## LVS

I understand your situation i am really sorry for not bing able to reply before now
I was trying to deal with my own problems and i read all your story it's not about long or short story but i can understand it is really hard to wait a reply so long when your life is on fire and you are burned 
After reading your posts as you described your relationship
i can see each one of you in the opposite side nothing is going to put you together
i can feel your anger in your letters
i know your hard situation but to take a life decision with less chance to regret it later you need to have clear mind
you said you were going to tell him that you are going back i don't know why you changed your mind 
It was a good idea especially he asked to see the child so you have an excuse to go back with your head up. The way you left home wasn't helpful for your situation you need to be close to him to be able to discuss things in a mature way whether you are leaving or staying 
so many things need to be clear for both of you and if you decided to get back together maybe this time you can convince him to do therapy you both need therapy you need to learn how to manage your anger and how to clear your mind he needs to learn how to deal with his abusive way how to respect you how to communicate and how to take his responsibilities toward you and your son
i wish i can help you in a more professional way 
but i know that you know what you need you know what you want just it's the matter of the time and the way to say things 
i know you are right but i need you to make sure you ask for your rights in a wise way
hopefully my reply will be helpful


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## ADM

There is nothing I can do anymore. Now it's over!

I appreciate very much your time and thoughts though more than anything else knowing what u'r going through at this moment. I really, really wish you from the bottom of my heart u live the life you deserve afterwards.

As for me, I responded telling I wouldn't agree with the solution him taking the kiddo over his ex wife and the rest and asked him to rethink. I made it also clear my door is open for communication.
The response back was devastating; he said it's over and there is no chance for getting back. He also said he doesn't have the means to come and see the child for only two days since his children are all over Europe and distances make it impossible. I refuse to accept he cannot be more creative. He is not proving at all he can make sacrifices for his children and treat them equally. e had misunderstood my message thinking I was taking back what I said. I made it clear it was me who ended the relationship just to make it clear that even if we have to discuss, it will be for other things and he needs to apologise for what he did. 
Now I feel very bad...because I still love him and just for this absurdity I feel even worst. How unrealistic and and bad dreamer I can be...am very confused and sad now but I believe this is just the beginning....isn't it...
I always thought we would grow old together...


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## ADM

It is horrible to think I have to go through a divorce. I so disagree with this...  my god, what wlse do I have to go through for loving someone.


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## LVS

I am sorry that you are going through all this hard time alone i know it is really hard i can feel you tell me how does your life look like now how you spend your time if you are looking for work and if you know anybody around you to at least emotionally support you and if he is paying you for your expenses with your baby or not

One fact you can't go back in time
i don't know if you feel guilty about something in your relationship but it's not time to blame yourself for anything

Just know one thing love is not everything in a relationship if you have nothing to share or to give to this relationship to increase and nurture love it will die with the passing time and if you love someone who doesn't meet your expectation than you don't love him you love his representative in your mind and what you dream about your relationship to be
with what you mentioned about what's happening now all you can do as i think is find a friend for both of you who can be a third part to bring you together 
maybe this will work and you can speak your mind directly to him and you can agree on what to do next


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## ADM

Thank you my dear thank you. Coming here after a sleepless night seeing someone has read me and given me comfort, helps a lot.

I know time is the best remedy but I don't know how my days will roll after this. I haven't been sleeping the whole night. 
One thing is sure; I am at friends house and that has helped me have bright moments during the day. I have been going through less and have been suffering much much more. It is not that I am not suffering but being with them has certainly been very positive. 
She is my friend of 20 years and I know she does it with the heart.
She has been our intermediary for some months now. That is not sth I chose, it has been my H against my will who has communicated with everyone, including my family for all conflicts we might have had. It is not that I didn't want him to talk to them, it is because he has confused everyone and used them. We don't need to disturb everyone for everything we do. In the first days he talked to her and showed very much positive feelings. After some days he changed 180 degrees and we have been trying to solve this puzzle ever since. Now we have none who can connect us or anything. He confuses everyone by being so in need of help and thoughts, and then by disappointing all as he never does things in line with his strategy...nothing.

Besides, I think he has misunderstood the whole thing. Even if I am thinking of counseling (thought) and wanted to give it another chance is because I valued our relationship and wanted it to work with all my heart. But if he perceives this as a regret on what I did, then he is not in the right track.
Anyhow, I hurt him because he hurt me and the child. I told him to start forgetting everything because we dont' need someone so weak in our lives. I cannot make up with the fact he is doing sacrifices for the other children but not for ours. I don't want to believe he doesn't have the means to meet his son and put up with his option to bundle trips. I would welcome the opportunity to go back at our apartment even for some days if he would have shown a little effort he doesn't like the situation. Now I am not sure he is the person he claims to be towards me or even the child. Someone who loves his son makes the 900 km and sleeps in the car just to see the child and doesn't say I have no other option because you didn't let me. It is easy to blame it on someone else. It is already too much I am saying it is "our" fault we ended up here.
Anyways, this could be because those are the first days only. I don't know. I am very confused!!! ...and restless. 

I know time will clear out everything, even my confused and senseless thoughts...but yet again, I cannot bare the pain.


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## LVS

ADM you need time to relax and drop your anger to be able to think in a clear way
you need to figure out what you want and work to find a way to realize it no matter what he wants or what he does 
and you need to fill your time with things you like to do enjoy your life with or without friends you need to make this period less hurting to be able to move on in life
be closer to yourself reach to your mind and your heart see your inside beauty and use it to deal with your hardest situation 
Good luck


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## ADM

He has asked to come and see his son. Obviously he will get a hotel nearby. I sent me a mail asking if I had a problem with it. I answered I was very happy for the son he would get to see his father. And was preparing myself on how to approach his arrival and evaluating whether I felt like talking to him or not...hmmmm.
Yesterday the instructor from the creche of my son wrote to ask me why would we give up the creche for him. I was puzzled and devastated to know his father had resigned that right. 
Outrageous I wrote to him why in hell would he give up the creche knowing how much have we been praying for that place to have. You need luck to have a place in the creche in this country and yet again nothing i clear where we are going to settle from now on so I would prefer him advising me before taking these kind of decisions. But no, he did it again as he wished and thought. I don't want to translate this as an action against me, but yet again I'm struggling my mind here that how in hell can he go on deciding and taking actions that affect us all on my back.

I am reading "Too bad to stay, too good to leave" to give an answer to my thoughts. I believe it is a very ambiguous relationship, at list on my side. I still reading and still finding out it's ok between us i.e. what we hav had between us has been love and all that, then why are we heading apart?

Am I delusional or is it I cannot see things clearly? I am blowing my mind here...


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## ADM

He will come to see his son this w-e and I still don't know how to behave...dn't really know.  It is so confusing...do I have to give it a thought or just give it a damn...dont' know.


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## LVS

It is good to hear from you again i hope you are feeling better

Both of you need to communicate it should be fair and calm if you are not able to have calm conversation find a third part
whatever the subject you are going to address 
even if you decided permanently to end your marriage you still have your child so you will have to stay in touch to deal with so many things together like the issue of the creche or any other issues....
and if you need to work on fixing your marriage you also and for most need to have better communication skills therapist should help you 

"Too Good to Leave Too Bad to Stay" is a very good book your H needs to read it as well
this book gives you very useful insights i think you can see more about your issues at chapter 6 YOU'VE GOT A HOLD ON ME, 
7 TALK TO ME, and 14 R-E-S-P-E-C-T
and when you check the end of the book the author advice you what kind of books you read after this one it depends of your situation

This is also a very good book to read "THE DIVORCE REMEDY:The PROVEN 7-Step Program for Saving Your Marriage" by Michele Weiner She is a marriage therapist and you can also join her website Divorce Busting® - How to Save Your Marriage, Solve Marriage Problems, and Stop Divorce 
because when your anger is not talking i might feel yourself in ambivalence whether you did right or wrong so these books if they didn't help you to fix your marriage at least you will be having clear vision about what you want and what was right or wrong in your relationship

Good Luck and thanks for posting on my thread


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## ADM

I dont' know, I have ups and downs. We have been communicating and I have tried to call his conscience. I told him to look back and be sure what he does now doesn't come around anymore. He has not changed much. I thought I made it clear before in the first e-mail series. He now even goes farther by asking me to go back and take a house that the social services will pay so our child can have a stability in his life and so he can see his father more, and by thus,we could hope in (if ever) sth like getting back like old times. BUT, as condition I must let he free do whatever he wants to do. LOL
I have 22 years of schooling for which I worked hard...I am looking for a job since a year but not been lucky. I am not saying I wouldn't work anything, yes I would do, but if the situation suggests and I prejudge all people leaving under social aid when they can do better. On the other hand, paradoxically, he admits I'm not allowed to get back in our apartment when I am the one to pay for the sofa he is sitting in, for the pillow he is sleeping in, for the blanket that is worming him. Anyways, told him he didn't understand a thing from what I said, and now he is wondering what did I mean by that in the next message and asking me what did I meant when asked him to look back and be more visionary.

My friend, on the other hand, told me he has written her some days ago to say I have BPD . I cannot stand anymore the fact he is mixing my sad feelings and anger he is not respecting me and is pretending I am ill.  At this stage I don't know what to do anymore and I don't have any strategy whatsoever to go further or approach him if he is ever showing up on Friday to see his child.

Help needed!

I am reading the book very carefully and believe the issue is he is all looking it on me and not admitting he has not been just in not respecting me. I will go through the rest of the book tomorrow and I am planning on giving it to him as a gift to let him know I care.

 It is very sad to get to know my husbend, my love is trying to find me sick with BPD, i still am undr shock.
I left my country, home, family, work to get close to my family and all this disbalance and lose of ground has gotten back into me not as a shock of balance but as an illness. 

Don't really know.


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## turnera

ADM, just do what is right for you and your son. Your husband is an adult. He can deal with whatever decisions you have to make in your son's best interests. 

And talk to as many people as you can about your situation, including doctors, so that you are protected in case he tries anything, ok? The person who provides information first is the one usually believed.

And do get some help from a psychologist or counselor. You can't stay like this for long before you develop permanent harm.


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## created4success

Le vieux sage said:


> ADM you need time to relax and drop your anger to be able to think in a clear way
> you need to figure out what you want and work to find a way to realize it no matter what he wants or what he does
> and you need to fill your time with things you like to do enjoy your life with or without friends you need to make this period less hurting to be able to move on in life
> be closer to yourself reach to your mind and your heart see your inside beauty and use it to deal with your hardest situation
> Good luck


I agree w/you, LVS. When I'm angry, there's no way I can see straight.

ADM: as lvs said, what do you want? How can you work to get what you want (apart from what's going on w/him)? 

I would encourage you to focus on you and stop obsessing about what he's doing and how he may be making you miserable...


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## LVS

I strongly agree with turnera to get help and see therapist i know your finance might not be enough but you still can see free counseling talk to your pastor they can give you a list for organizations that give so many kind of support

ADM you are an honest person with what you think and say
so it is easy for him to know everything about you 
your strength points and your weaknesses and he will use them against you he knows which point hurts you more or trigger your anger so don't give him this chance if you can't cool down and have a clear mind to think right he will get you i will copy and past something could help you they gave it to me at BPD family website

"It seems to me that your mind right now is racing 100 miles an hour with thousand of thoughts. It is very hard to make decision when your mind is full on CONFLICTING and UNSURED thoughts. 

1. Take a walk every day for 15 to 20 minutes. Walk slowly and count your breath (1-2-3-4, in, 1-2-3-4, out). 
2. Meditate if you know how. 

These 2 steps will slow your mind down and let CLARITY come in."

Please ADM it worth to try you will see the difference


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## ADM

Ladies, it so nice of you to come and give me courage.

I have been to our generalist long ago when I doubted I was under lots of stress and asked for explanation. I told him my story and about the postpartum depression I had after I delivered the child (episiotomy was the real reason). I told the doctor about the anxiety I was having when my husband left to go to his other children because I felt incapable and weak to be left alone because I was all alone in the city. I told him what life I had before and what I had started leaving. He said to me only tow words when I ended with "This is it"...he said: "It is ENOURMEOUS!!!" and exclaimed. He gave me some sleeping pills I never took because I nor have trouble to slip or ups and downs of humor for no reason. I know very well about mental diseases, I have a pedagogical background that allows for me to know what it is. I checked again yesterday and nothing compiles with my situation. I don't have BPD, I am just under lots of lost ground and the situation disturbed because he confuses me a lot.

Let me tell you what I had today. I wrote him (since he asked what could he bring from home when he came to see the child) to bring me the bed and some other stuff for the child. It breaks my heart my child is sleeping in a portable bed which is not as comfortable as his real bed. he answered he was about to write to me that he would take the train this time and couldn't bring much.

I dont' eat that. I came here by car and I don't know why he is traveling around Europe by train when it is not that convenient. It was him who wrote me a weak ago to tell him what I wanted to be brought by him (not specifying if it was things I needed or the child needed).

Now tell me ladies, isn't this confusing? What shall I believe he has in his mind.

Thank you to you all!

I took that walk LVS suggested, actually I do lots of walks and I love nature. I thought of all I have at hands now. I would have felt very comfortable if I started a new life here. All depends if I'll get a positive response to my applications here. Then, time will tell whether it was best. For the moment I cannot deal with all versions he is telling like once it was a mistake what he did, please stay and then like I was aware he would do the thing. Then again, once I had planned it all to leave and abandon him and next I'm not loving him anymore and had been planning to abandon him long ago. If he doesn't make his mind, I cannot make mine either. 
I love this family, I gave it all for it, now what I am getting as a prize to that is disrespect and accuses for being dishonest and ill. I have never lied him or any one else in my life, I have never let him down (he has done it a lot). I have never missed respect to my husband, I have never walked away from my responsibilities, always kept my promises and done lots of sacrifices. I am a smart loving woman and mother, I handle all the house, I cook and serve to my husband, I can joke and laugh, I can run and walk on high hills with dignity, I can be beautiful and ugly, I can discuss complicated topics and routines equally with people from all levels...I am simply a person who loves to live while being alive. Enough is enough, now I need to be shown I am appreciated and loved and respected and counted. That is all I want. 

I dont' have a strategy for tomorrow, I still think he'll change his mind and surprise me...I'll keep on training to not be mad or whatever to him. I'll keep on saying to myself "I won't be bothered, I'm strong, I can handle it"...

Wish me luck and please tell me what you think.


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## turnera

Can you get a puppy or a kitten? They do wonders.

As for your husband...he is just trying to throw as many obstacles in your way as possible while still 'appearing' to be helpful so that you give up and come back.


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## LVS

As turnera said he wants to make you come back but not with your head up
you have all the potential to move on in your life
he will keep saying or doing things to bother you and let you down or even to let you regret leaving him he will put all the obstacles that he can to feel you begging him for help

Keep in your mind that
Sometimes what we need is different than what we want
you want him to change 
you want to go back to him and 
you want to love him back
you want to live with him and your child as a happy family...

But you need to feel secure 
you need to feel loved for who you are 
you need to feel appreciated
you need to feel respected.......

If he comes to you and said he is going to change will you believe him? or do you think he will fill your needs?

you need to rethink you situation it's better if you can write down all the points negative and positive in both situations
if with all the difficulties that you are going through in your current situation is better than going back so you know what your decision should be
if you think that going back can give you more chance to save money or find a job or make a good plan to leave you will have to think if you can handle the worst situation with him

but if you go back under his conditions he might be more mean and try to punish you 

I can see how you feel i know it's really hard 
keep doing this exercise it will help clear your mind to be able to chose what is right for you and your child


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## ADM

I had a dog, a wonderful Westy (Milou was his name) he took it away from us. I had the dog when his ex wife wanted to send him to the SPA (it is a center where they collect all abandoned dogs) since she couldn't take care of the dog as she had 2 kids to grow. Then she bought another big dog AND delivered another two kids. Tell me now how can you deal with such conflicting and contradicting situation. So I sheltered the dog and have been taking care of him for about 6 years. He really did miracles. Then the dog started degenerating when the child came. It was still my problem, not his. when the dog popped in the car because he was sick and not for anger, he gave the dog away, I cried for a week and will not get another anymore.

yet, when I checked on an apartment today and envisioned myself in with my child and all, I thought it will be best to have a dog, for the child also. Ladies, the boy and the dog were so much fun together I laughed a lot. LOL Still can tell it was wonderful. My husband thought it was some kind of revenge from the dog. LOL One who knows about dogs knows they don't do revenge. I tried to explain to him but useless. He wasn't there when I let the dog away, although he was the one to arrange for it.

sooooooooo, LVS, that is exactly I'm planning on telling him if he bothers to ask. With no dignity I will not get back anymore. I, fortunately, know what I want and what I need right now.

I will keep on training to not let him manipulate me even with words. I know when I behave like that he gets mad. Let me see...I will keep you posted as soon as I have some news.
You have given me so much strenght and courage...thank you!!!


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## created4success

turnera said:


> Can you get a puppy or a kitten? They do wonders.


Yeah, animals are great companions. When I was going through my rough spot in my marriage a few years back, my wife had our "furry children" to fall back on to keep her sanity. I remember that I was jealous of our dogs because she ignored my immature behavior and shenanigans and lavished her attention on them instead, which ended up being a good thing in the long run.


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## ADM

He is here, no progress whatsoever, only regress and there is no hope. I insisted on talking about it all he talks to me about the week with children. Our relationship doesn't appear to be the topic at all. Yesterday when I drove him to his hotel I had enough. He said he wanted to sleep not talk, I was very shocked...tried to make him reason he said we need time and that he needs his children. I summarized to him again what I have been doing before. Told him children are not games for each other. I will not let my child get confused yet never alone like going away a week at this age. I told him this epidemic sense of culpability he is caring and for which he doesn't only need to suffer but make everyone suffer should be removed as epidemic. My concentration will not be on this. Children are very happy at home sleeping, all the three and abusing with them has been more than enough. I told him I could bring, myself, the child if he wanted for a w-e and that's all I can do, all the rest is exaggerated.
He needs time because I have made him suffer but he doesn't want to know if we suffer too. He talked me about his med. I asked about the name and who the hell was this doctor counseling on family that took only one side's opinion before suggesting stuff. I wanted to call the doctor and ask for an appointment. He said he didn't' know the name of the med which was very funny. I was laughing. Then he said he would ask the doctor if his name could be given because there is a professional ethic in consideration and a privacy. Hell no, there is no privacy of my own this doctor cannot discuss, if he does exist of course.

so, the overall is this is going nowhere. He wants us be in his city, renting an apartment with the social assistance money and ask for the joint custody which is never our case. That means he is going to fill like this his time LOL: 2 weeks with the baby, 1 week with the other two and one for his own pleasure. This makes me laugh out laud. He is pretending to organise all this people he hurt on his life very mathematically. yes it is very basic i.e. everyone deserves his time, but cannot be like this. He said he was sad his daughter was crying on the phone. that means he has promised his daughter he would bring the babe without consulting me. So no he can take the consequences and all consequences of all he does.
He threatened this morning he would take the car. I didn't make any resistance. this is very cheap. If he wants the car for which he is the one to pay insurance, he can have it. this means I will not have a chance to take our child out where he goes in the park or elsewhere as I do every day because there are long distances. I don't care anyway. I will not be broke for long time but this will remain always in my mind. What a jerk I was married to!!!


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## ADM

He left before time saying "Later" to his son. Not Goodbye or anything likely...strangely. I wasn't the one to hold my son in the arms. It was the friend that hosted us. I don't know now how much the baby is feeling out of all this. 

I am still cold but for how long. My life has been completely ruined and I have very few chances. Miracles are really needed.

This is a very bad situation considering also the toddler in the middle.

I am cold and clear yet so much confused.

God help me!!!


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## LVS

turnera said:


> ADM, just do what is right for you and your son. Your husband is an adult. He can deal with whatever decisions you have to make in your son's best interests.
> 
> And talk to as many people as you can about your situation, including doctors, so that you are protected in case he tries anything, ok? The person who provides information first is the one usually believed.
> 
> And do get some help from a psychologist or counselor. You can't stay like this for long before you develop permanent harm.





created4success said:


> I agree w/you, LVS. When I'm angry, there's no way I can see straight.
> 
> ADM: as lvs said, what do you want? How can you work to get what you want (apart from what's going on w/him)?
> 
> I would encourage you to focus on you and stop obsessing about what he's doing and how he may be making you miserable...


I just repeat what turnera c4s and me said before 
i can add that
you need to feel more empowered 
you need to see what is the best to be done for you and your child
don't think about him anymore 
Talk to your pastor get counseling advice or anybody can give you assistance
I know the YMCA in USA has a free legal advice they can help you with so many legal things to know all your rights 
I know it's in Europe too you can know your rights and what are his responsibilities 
Gather all kind of information that can clarify your way
all what i am asking you to do is to have in details what you can do supported by the law
You will have a card in your hands to protect yourself from his manipulative actions
Start your way to move on in your life


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## ADM

That is so true.
As a start I'm going back to my ex place while he is not there in order to organise my papers so I have the right to be registered here. I will go to the Ministry of Justice and ask for the separation procedure and what has to be done in those cases. I will go to my doctor and ask him what risks am I running and will contact a divorce lawyer online right now. I fear getting back alone there. I will take the night bus and have to be around that plase for some 40 hours but I need to be strong since this is my life and none but me has to live it. If it has to be suffered I will let it happen and I will know that better days will come afterwards.

I send him an SMS asking to do not disturb people here when calling. The family I am staying over is very generous and comprehensive but I don't want them to be involved both ways. I see them now and understand they have lost hope and have disrespect for my H although they don't say much. In stead I proposed him to collect all the phone money and buy to his son diapers and milk. That is the basis he HAS to provide for his son. Than we can go through the rest. He is not spending any money on the calls but I wanted that clear once for ever that kids need to be feeded as first then they have to be changed and thenn they need to be cuddled.I received an angry response after, he was telling me it wasn't me who decided how, when and for how long he was going to contact his sonm I had to mind my business and him his... and that he has transferred the money. I want now to play cool and not be disturbed by him as much as I can, so I responded by asking if that was the money for April or May? The message was never delivered as the phones are closed.
I will seek legal advise as soon as I can and will talk to the doctor as soon as I get there. 
As you may see, I cannot sleep now and that I'm not feeling very bad though my head is full. I don't know what I will find at home when I get there. I hope he hasn't changed the lock or done something that will shock me so I can finish in reason what I have started in my head.
Need some help from the god here.


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## turnera

We're praying for you, too!


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## LVS

I thought you took all your significant things and important papers with you when you left 
When you are willing to go and get them?

keep us updated
we wish you all the luck


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## ADM

I am about to leave in a while. I have left papers concerning the transcription of the marriage, the papers of the car and many more. I took passports, IDs, Book of Family and certification of birth for my son. I had built a life there so imagine how much do I have to take. If I take all I have the house remains on the kitchen and the bed only. The rest, all furniture, library all of it execpt the TV I have paid for. Souvenires, photos, docs, and I don't know what more. But I cannot take them this time, don't have the means.
I have found a legal advicer today and will meet him Wed 11AM, found also a social therapist and shring will meet her tomorrow at the train station when coming in the morning and will do therapy. Then will go to the administration to renew my resident permit. Lots to do, besides I got a number of emergency in case I have psychological problems when I enter the house since I am alone...and so I will leave in two hours travel all night and be in the morning there. I didn't feel like telling him I am going there, cus I don't need permition to enter the house now. I hope I will not have a big shock. I will tell him later I passed by.
I am very cold but don't know for how long. May be the fact I am packed with help will keep me calm. Ah, I have also RDV with the family doctor tomorrow at 16h00 so I will aks his advice about the accusation for BPD .

THANK YOU LADIES...THANK YOU IN DEED.


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## ADM

Here I am at the hotel and still not done.

He had changed the lock of the dore. I went to the police and did the reporting. They offered me assitance social and legal. The social service lady told I had the right to open the dore. So I did. When I entered the appartment, nothing, really nothing that once belonged to me like clothes, books, docs, personal belongigs, souvernirs, nything I ever had wasn't there. I took some stuff for the baby took my pillow, drrank a coffee and run left the place. I went again to the police to report what I found out and there I come to know he has been reporting me to the police several times. That's what the officer said. 
Apparantly, as the socaial lady told me, he is very exposed towards the law and that he has to pay for all he has done. There was another extraordinary thing that happened; the lady gave me the address of a divorce lawer, the best in town, and when I contacted her, she told me my husbend had already been at her so she couldn't accept me. 
The police aked me why I hadn't been contacting my husband. I answered I want to talk to my lawer first.
I am nor angry, or mad. I am very cold and shocked all alone in this city fear I was married to the devil. I told the police the gay was over to meet his son this w-e and didn't inform me about the situation. It is my very first time in my life I am going to a police station and dealing with this extreme type of things. But this i my life and I have to go through all this in order to put some order in my life. I am so anxious to meet the lawer today. I found another one online. I will talk to the social assistance at the police station as soonn as I can also. She really gave me lots of hope yesterday. 

Sorry the confusion ladies. I just wanted to inform you how more colorful a life can get.

I miss the baby, he doesn't stop asking me every single minute. He sais I'm at the bus station and want to pick me up. He picks up the coat and wants to go to the station to pick me. I am still not done and will not be able to leave before 19.30 today which means I will arrive there the next morning. 

I fear I have seen only the top of iceberg. 

I was married to Dr. Jekyll and Mrs. Hyde.


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## ADM

I don't know why I am feeling so weak this morning. I thought I was very strong since I am surviving days like yesterday. I don't know . this country needs another 2 hours to awake up and start functioning and I am in such a rush.

God help me!!!


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## LVS

I am sorry for what you had to go through
I expected that i think turnera too and also you
you had right to fear because we all know your husband he won't keep any important things for you especially those papers 
I wish you had take them with you
I am not surprised about what he did
He seems this kind of people the very mean one like my H

and i hope you can find other copies and your lost is not so big

I am proud of you for all what you have done there and i wish you the best


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## turnera

I'm proud of you, too. I'm sorry it came to this. But your son will benefit from seeing such a strong, loving mother who took such good care of him at a time like this.

My husband's mother is a bit schizophrenic. We bought her a house, but she decided the neighbors were sending their roaches over to her house, and her other son convinced her we were stealing from her (WE bought the house!), so in the middle of the night one day, she had her other son move her out of that house, without telling us she was leaving. When we went there (we had been out of town), we found everything that had ever had anything to do with my husband, left behind. 

She disowned him. She left all the birthday cards he had ever given her as a child, his school pictures, things he made for her, everything we bought for her...she left behind. She broke his heart that day. And when we finally found her, she acted like nothing had happened!

Sometimes you just have to accept the hand you're dealt. And deal with it.

But you'll be stronger in the end.


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## ADM

I am stronger! I will tel you what I had to go through today and all the details as soon as I get where I'm hosted. It has been long but at the end consturctive. I cannot bear however that my son is asking for me every single second and he doesn't let the phone. It breaks me into billion peaces. I look forward to have him in may arms...I cannot stand it anymore. I will take the trip now and arrive in the morning with the night service. 

Thank you to all, you have been a very significant source of strength for me. Thank you!!!


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## created4success

> I just repeat what turnera c4s and me said before
> i can add that
> you need to feel more empowered
> you need to see what is the best to be done for you and your child
> don't think about him anymore
> Talk to your pastor get counseling advice or anybody can give you assistance
> I know the YMCA in USA has a free legal advice they can help you with so many legal things to know all your rights
> I know it's in Europe too you can know your rights and what are his responsibilities
> Gather all kind of information that can clarify your way
> all what i am asking you to do is to have in details what you can do supported by the law
> You will have a card in your hands to protect yourself from his manipulative actions
> Start your way to move on in your life


Great advice and resources! 

Also, I just found a bunch of free resources which I posted to my blog (*see signature link below*) on how you can cope with just what you're going thru.

In particular, there are at least two or three organizations that I know of that offer FREE marriage counseling, which is listed on my blog.


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## ADM

Listen ladies, I have a 23 month old baby who needs constant care. I live at friends and here, although it is the best place I could ever be, is getting crowded. I need to find a solution, e shelter, a job above all. I am not having any luck on any of them. Besides, I need a life. I am not having any...this is the overall that kills my hope.

For the rest...here I'm telling you the story...

when I arrived there, I found the door locked. I went and did the reporting. The police directed me to the Victim's Aid. The lady there, who is in charge advised I have full right to open the door. So with the PR I went and opened the door. When I entered the apartment, all my personal effects, were removed. I could have done exactly the same thing to his stuff, but I belong to another kind of people. However, strange enough, all the furniture, except the curtains, were in place. I put a post-note-it in most of the stuff, saying it is mine (my name over like X's thing or so) and at the door of my son's room I put the note "Everything that is in here, belongs to X and the baby (name)"...got some stuff for the baby and left. I went to the police and did another reporting which cost me more. The police officer told me I was already in the files and that my husband had already done a reporting on me .
We had a fight 2 months before. He got hurt and needed medical assistance. He threatened me he wanted to take away the baby from me. I wanted to commit suicide...then he took the knife off me and hit me so I fell off, he cut his finger with the knife while pulling it from me. Later, strange enough he could trust me, he left me alone with the baby and went to seek medical assistance. he must have done then the reporting I discovered 2 months later. I had pressure from my family to report and I had signs all over...like in the face and in my legs he hit to take the knife off and that he didn't want me to be with the baby. I never reported him...so here I am recorded in the police. I didn't know waht to do of shame. But this I didn't learn until the next day when I went to seek the same aid from the lady of victims. She was kind enough to go through the system and tell me all reporting on me. I felt very manipulated, cus when he went to the hospital, I felt so bed and went to pick him up...some evening later he told this was stupid and seduced me . So than we started a wonderful life together. We went out every Wednesday and created a routine of fun things we'd do together. He even made research on counseling and wanted us to go....so this was back then.

After I spent some hours in the police station I met a lawyer who made me feel like even more used. He talked about money, never listened to me, made it very uglu so what I was going through..so I felt used and prejudged. I left the cabinet and went back to the social assistance lady who was nice enough to contact another lawyer. Wait...the nice part. A day ago she recommended me a lawyer, whom when I called recognised my family name and told me my H had already seen her. LOL some time ago...and although he didn't come back she couldn't take me. I was panicked...I felt again used. So this new lawyer was recommended by this one and she agreed to help me. I left the country and have been spending time with my baby. I missed him soooooo much so I woke up at 4 o'clock in the bus and until I had him in my arms at 11 I couldn't rest. yesterday I spent it like that.

I called again the social assistance lady yesterday. She told me my H has passed there with his daughter. That means he left the state where his other children live with the daugheter. that is a distance of 1200 Km or more and went to the police station to tell them he had removed my stuff and safely placed them in his sister's garage. Then he met with the social assistance lady. The office that received me was the same to receive my H and had called the lady he had over the H of the lady of 2 days before. She told me he didn't tell much, nor she asked him more. He had taken the girl off school, taken her and exposed to the police station and to all this story and she has seen the door and all...that is very irresponsable of him. If I were him I woldn't do it to a girl of 10 years old. I was shocked to hear that.

Today I receive an SMS from his cousin telling me his daugheter will be moving in there and his mother will take care of him and her. I had to imagine all this. All I couldn't see is how can all come to this point.
I am so desperate today and don't know how much more I can handle. I am going nuts and feel so much used and hopeless I cannot explain.


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## ADM

Please don't judge me for what I did that evening in February, I was desperate and he esaurated me all with all the psychological pressure. That is what I also told to the mean lawyer when he asked me whether there were any physical violence, I told him in 2010 I expect the law to consider also psychological and verbal abuse as much important as the physical one....and as you see, I am that kind of victim. The impression my H gives to all and my strong and expressive character, has mislead the whole world, including me. I came to a point to ask whether I was normal to be so touched by almost everything he did. Well, apparently today everyone things I have tolerated him a lot...what the hell!!! 

And yes, there was, I had the signs all over me and refused to go to the police because I can defend myself and did it for my family. In the same time my H kept peridoic communication with all my family, my mother and brother especially and some friends of mine talking to them dead worried about me...what a jerk!!!


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## turnera

Just keep strong knowing you're doing the right thing, no matter what ANYONE thinks.

YOU know the truth.


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## LVS

ADM sorry for the delay 
so much going on with me but I want to add my voice to turnera 
we are believing you and believing in you you are a brave and a strong woman 
keep going do not give up
Our prayer with you!!!


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## ADM

He has started bombarding me with messages. Today he threats me he would talk stuff and threats he will go again to the police since we are not done. The legitimizes his actions and keeps on telling I was the one to end up the relationship so here were the conseguences. I am so tired of all this crap.
Where else will he go...what else will he do.


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## turnera

You have a lawyer, right?


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## LVS

Yes ADM you need to see your lawyer and at the same time keep looking to find a job i know how much your life is stressed now but you need to keep going in your life don't forget to take care of yourself you are a strong woman don't allow any situation to let you down don't give up and always keep us updated


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## ADM

I have a lawyer I haven't met. She finally answered yesterday to my mail saying she'll come back to me latest on Friday. She has two cabinets and is a very busy person. I got her nema from the other lawyer my H had alredy contacted.

Today in the morning he sent a mail CC to my brother. At the same time he answered to my other mail I was asking him to contact the child and confirming the date he can see his child. I asked him to do not take a bath with his child all naked. On response, he is accusing my friends they gave the child a bath, not him. Shocking!

I have told him I don't care what he does with what he knows about me, I told him I don't give a damn to all he does from now on. I told him we will communicate only about our child and that I'll write him about what the baby does every second day. The rest I give a crap! I told him I am not responsable for what the others know about him. I told him even if I tak an action (assuming I am the source of info and that he asks me to apologize for thelling his life) will not make him less miserable and less unlucky than he is. I told him the others know him better than I do.

The letter my brother wrote was after that. The H of my friend where I am staying wrote him asking a tel no so he can ask him questions concerning this lies he is inventing. I personally had nothing against or assumed anything when asked him not to take a bath with the baby. I wanted him to hide his privates and that's it!!! It is my right to suggests things that can disturb the baby.

I don't know where all this is going.

I will call tomorrw the hotline about the divorce and tell the whole story and the risks I'm runnig. I dont' fear him. I will handle this with time, it will take energy because I have never dealt with so much crap and didn't know people can go so far, but now that I am in, I have to deal with it.

P.s. The lawyer doesn't know about this crap, she knows the great story only.


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## LVS

Hello ADM
we are always waiting you to keep updating us
with so much going on in my life don't think if i don't post it means i am forgetting about your problems
please keep us updated

did you call the hotline?
and what happen with your lawyer?
are you still looking for job

hope everything will be fine with you
i am proud of you


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## Anna11

Wow ADM I read all your story it sounds very difficult, We all have different experience, i am a mother of 2 (16 and 12 yrs) old and working fulltime. I feel for you but hang on, I sufferered my h leaving me and my kids AUG 07 and with lots of turmoil which I thought will never end. There is hope, God knows everything and believe that God is never too late nor early, He is on time to help you and son. Always remember that good things happen to good people. You may not understand for now what is God plan, but someday you will and you will thank Him for letting this thing happen to you and your son....

Have faith!


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## ADM

TY ladies, I appreciate you keeping an eye on me...so many things have happened and not finished yet.

I received the D papers, awful stuff in there. I received them right after I came from a trip home where I went to meet my family and borrow money to start my life over. I haven't started working yet, but there is big HOPE, it has never been any closer. I have now a house, my child feels good, my dad is over now for some vacation and my H has disappeared again.

We went over the apartment (800 km fr) and made the transfer. I took almost everything and brought it to the new apartment. My stuff was all over the place and the furniture brought together in the middle of the living room. He threatened and couldn't believe we did that. Then for the days we stayed there we had an improvement in our relationship. I told him to change the divorce papers as that would cost us lots of money. He agreed. When we left and came here we had spoken and seen in skype all the time. I was doing that for the kid. Then when I send him some calculation and asked him to pay for the kid he got angry and it turned back where it was, even wors between us. I told him if he goes on like this he had to go through my lawyer cuz I'm not taking threats any longer. He quit ringing or sending messages. We even had agreed upon he would come over to take the child for 1 week and he never did. We had also agreed he would take him during August for Summer vacation, and I'm not sure whether that's never gonna happen. My lawyer send me his lawyer's concerns about the situation and that my H envisions an accelerated procedure so he can have the child and I pay for that.
I cried a lot the day I received this message but that is because I am still fragile and sensitive to the divorce and all the rest.

I have done lots of improvements in my life like reading lots of books on this situation. I would like to stop the divorce, but now, with all that has happened and where it is stuck now, won't give it much hope.

any thoughts would be appreciated...TY


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## turnera

Good for you for taking care of yourself. fwiw, a lot of men turn vicious when you go up against them and don't just give them whatever they want. They are more combative than women, it's like a first instinct, I think. So just ignore him. Let him spit and sputter and blow off steam. Let your lawyer protect you.

Don't badmouth him to your son, but don't give him high expectations, either. Let him envision life with you, and if his dad happens to show up here and there, so much the better, but let him focus on life with you. It's good that your father is helping.

And you never know...you can always remarry after divorce. Lots of people do. And if you did, it would be with an understanding that he owes you respect, so you'd be in a much better place. And if not, you'll still be happier because you're able to be yourself, and your son needs that.


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## ADM

turnera, u cannot imagine the joy of my child when he saw his new room with all his furniture, plays and all the rest. I took pictures! I paid all that money to bring the furniture here (would have been cheaper to buy him a new room) just because I want him to feel safe. The baby was sick for 6 consequent days when we went to pick up our stuff. Fever above 39.5 constantly. We made a thorough check up and found out NOTHING. I guess it was stress. He has only 2 years but is a very vivid child. It breaks my heart when he asks about his father and I tell him he is at work, but I have nothing to do. It was ME all the time who used to approach my H and break the situation, now I am TIRED. I don't want to spoil him anymore. It is enough he is not as good as I thought, enough he is not paying, enough he is talking nonsense, enough he PROHIBITS me from sending the child in a creche so I can have my space to find a suitable job...and I'm not able to talk bad about him....I don't think I will ever do. It is because of my principle and because I don't want my child to be disturbed by this.

My H was concerned about this, he explicitly asked me to not talk bad to the child about him. It surprised me as I never though I would before that...well he was also so "kind" as to tell me I would make a life and find a man not only for me but also for the child to "support" us as I am an excellent woman and deserve a better life. LOL

Men is the last thing I'm thinking of right now. I need a life which I gave up before for this family. I still remember the face of my lawyer when I told him I quit my job to be close to my family. I will never do that again so to risk the financial health of my child and become dependent on others.

As for the lawyer: he asked me to send him some provision I don't have at the moment and that was why I cried a lot. I am hoping on getting that job soon enough before November when the D takes place....


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## LVS

Good to hear from you the good news
You are doing great
You are so strong and wonderful woman and mother
I hope that everything will be fine with you and you get a job very soon to ease your life
He is acting really bad you are acting like a lady good for you and your baby and as turnera said let your lawyer protect you..

About divorce, now you feel you regret it,
just keep in your mind as turnera said that you can remarry after divorce. thinking this way will make your life less hard i understand very well what you feel
we really know they don't deserve us but the detachment is really hard. It's only a matter of time.

Good luck 
and keep in touch


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## ADM

He sent me an text today saying: "You haven't allowed to talk to my son in almost a month. Tell me when I can call him."

I haven't' answered yet. I am angry at him making this assumption and accusation and haven't made my mind on how to answer.

I want him to take his son and spend time with him but I am not willing at all serve him skype or msn conversations while he is not being responsible. All he does so far is against me and not in the interest of the child. I am so over this and would have liked to have the power to open people's eyes' and make them see right. I child need to be fed and loved at the same time, something his father doesn't seem to get so far. 

If I would respond the same way, I would have to cut all possible connection until the court told me what to do...so is his father doing, right, telling me he won't pay until court tells him to do so ...  but It is not my aim to disconnect him from his child .

any ideas? :s


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## turnera

No matter how you feel about him or what he does to you, your son needs his dad in his life.


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## LVS

ADM said:


> If I would respond the same way, I would have to cut all possible connection until the court told me what to do...so is his father doing, right, telling me he won't pay until court tells him to do so ...  but It is not my aim to disconnect him from his child .
> 
> any ideas? :s


You can do that and respond the same way but it might not look good in the eyes of the court
And as turnera said your son needs his dad in his life 

And be aware of the legal things he might use the text message against you in the court i think you need to respond maybe by email with CC to your lawyer 

you need to prove that you are not preventing him from being in contact with his son....

About the child support issue you can't make him pay now if he doesn't want to but when you get the court order you can request to make him pay back for all the time he didn't pay (someone gave me this advice)

You are doing good so far but i know it is hard and he is triggering your anger but you need to cool down and be more patient to be able to handle the situation you are going through. 

Good luck


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## ADM

Yes, ladies, thank YOU! It is because I recognise his role that I am hesitating to answer.

On the other hand, I was the one to call and ask him to call our son once upon a time and create a regular schedule so the child would know how to say and he was the one to tell me he had nothing to talk with a 2 year old child...so no what else?! Now I am, again, the one to "prevent" him to speak with his son?! Doesn't that lack logic?

Anyway, as you said...need to think over it because I think there is something behind it...like a lawyer or the stress that has augmented as their other children have to go on vacation on August to his father and they were supposed to be the three of them together...or otherwise, his lawyer.

I am thinking on answering him he was the one to not show up on July where he was supposed to come and spend a week with our son. I asked my father to postpone his visit to us because the baby wouldn't be there...and my H never showed up. Well, it's a mess.


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## ADM

I thought a lot after all I decided to send him a mail, a simple one. Well I saved one full of anger SMS in my drafts I wanted to send to him, but I didn't ( I knew I wouldn't, i just needed to write it). There are many ways I could have answered, what I did is count the days he didn't made ANY effort at all to contact his son in any way possible through me or not. They are 27 days altogether. And then posed him the question why he didn't take his son the week he said....I'm waiting for the answer. I think it will began on excusing and defending and attacking again. I am so damn tired of this person I'm feeling sometimes like I wanna give up the child, give it to him and let him do whatever HE thinks is best for all...as he takes pleasure on blaming me all the time...this is not about the child, this is all against me. If it were for the child he would have found the way to connect with him or whatever...but NO, I'm gonna fight back if he asks for it.


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## turnera

Always take the high road, ADM. It'll work out in the long run.


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## ADM

Well, here we go again attacking and blaming. It is a vicious circle. He started over with his paranoia like I took away the child from him, that I will be held responsible for the "crime" I did, that the judging day is approaching etc .
It was my anniversary and he ruined it completely. I first tried to tell him in two words I was not kidding with the child that I was taking good care of him and that I am proud of what I do. He kept on writing long and irritating. I responded by asking if he knew any better mother to my son than me...not answered yet.

My mother on the other hand has send him an SMS, he just brought up his paranoia again...my mother things she has improved the things, well I don't.

Can someone tell me if there exist a way I don't hear, don't see for and from this man anymore? I have a big day with a very important interview in front of me and I cannot find the peace I need. Every time he appears although I know very very very well he is not right, I become like this. I want to punch his face and tell him he is an imbecile and paranoiac and illusionist who never thought of child's interest, his only interest is hunting me to death.

Any advice will be appreciated.


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## turnera

Stop reading his texts and answering his calls.


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## ADM

Yes, but my son will always be there and if I don't have the courage to respond to his calls, who will do it for my son  

He called today, I gave it to the baby and activated the speakers. He was telling him his daughter was over for vacation...he had told me they have to do vacation the three last weeks of August and he would take his son there too...now things have changed. He told his son he would call during lunch break so he could speak to his half/sister. I was in an interview by the time they called, and it is the time when the baby sleeps every day, so no chances, had to switch it of twice. he hasn't been sending anything any more. 

I just received a mail from the lawyer and apparently if I don't pay him before September I'm uncovered. That is my concern, the real one.

As far as for my H, I cannot understand me at times...I so despise the guy when I am ok yet again I cannot get me how much of an impact he has on me when accusing and attacking me. The moment passed, but I don't know whether I can handle it another time without wishing him the worst. I hate him nuts!


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## turnera

Are you reading up about abuse, so you can recognize why you still feel attracted to him?


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## LVS

It is not only about your son you seem still as turnera said attracted to him waiting to hear something positive from his side that would never happened not with abusers unless if they want to get any of their needs met then they will become angels lol

Hope your interview is for a job and i wish you good luck

You said something of him ruining an occasion is it your anniversary or birthday(anniversaire)b/c i don't see it make sense to celebrate your anniversary it is already ruined.

If it is your birthday Happy Birthday and please ADM try to work more on yourself more to not let him no matter what he did ruin any occasion in your life

Good luck and hope you will find a job very soon


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## ADM

Well, what is that you suggested me to read? I am reading Changing your life and everybody into it after some other book. Let me know what else pls ladies.


He called again, but I cannot answer each time because I have a life whihc he doesn't seem to get and sent me another mail accusing my phone is off and that he, again (specifically this word) could not speak to his son. We are playing hide and seek here. I want to punch him in his face and tell him he is an ars.


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## turnera

Why Does He Do That? Inside The Minds Of Angry And Controlling Men by Bancroft. Also, any books by Patricia Evans.

Be careful about not giving him access to his son. That can get you in legal trouble.


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## ADM

He just threatened he is gonna bring it to the justice for child kidnapping. He called while I wasn't at home nor yesterday or today. Just two times. For about 27 days he didn't do a single attempt to contact his child. Nor he came to pick up his child as we agreed. He knows the address, I have sent pictures and he has talked to us for several weeks in skype while the child was playing into his new room. what is the trouble here, I don't get it...there might be some moments I am not able to answer the phone, right? 

I am going to check on the books now 

I am going through a very difficult period...


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## ADM

Help me GOD!


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## turnera

Can you print out copies of your emails or calls, to show that you are trying to contact him? Have that handy. Have you gone to the police yet to put a restraining order on him? I think you need to.


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## jeffreygropp

This is not healthy. Wow... I didn't want to chime in because anything this sticky is not something I want to influence a decision on. That being said I think you're being too lax here and need to consider taking this to a legal route like turnera said.


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## ADM

What do you mean jeffrey, I don't know?

Apparently, my H has paid extra money and has accelerated the separation. I have information that the first hearing will be in August instead of November, o.w. he is bluffing...I don't know  there is no child kidnapping, there is no evidence the child is in danger, that there is no violence at all  so I cannot understand how come he has got that possibility ...but well, tomorrow everything will be clear. I am going to write to my lawyer tonight and tomorrow I will have all the responses i think....

turnera, he leaves far away from here and he has got this cute little face and can play very well the victim and everyone things I am to blame since I do not hide my feelings in general  while my H reaches and gets the mercy from all  so I don't know how to play that card


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## turnera

Keep a copy of Why Does He Do That, and every time someone asks you why you are being so mean to him, hand them the book, and say "You can find my husband in here, if you care to read about it. THIS is why I left him and protected our child from living with him."

Have you called the police for a restraining order?


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## ADM

Is that viable for EU too? I mean call police and ask for a restraining order...I don't know whether I can do that and how to justify that ...what do I tell them?


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## ADM

I just saw it, though it doesn't seem feasible since I moved far from the country where the juridiction applies...how can I do that  may be it's too late  I should be physically there, at the police


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## turnera

I'm sorry, I don't know what applies where you are. Just start making phone calls.


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## ADM

I don't know whom to call anymore. The lawyer didn't know anything, which seems strange, but could be that it is true this hearing or decision day is close, like he said, tomorrow I am going to call the court to learn whether there is a process like he claims. The lawyer's office told me he might be bluffing. I was thinking the same but I doubt that since he mentioned a fixed day next month while talking to my mother. 
this restriction order I should have done time ago, back than when he hit me and wanted me to get out of the apartment, when he pushed me to call the police to tell them I wasn't ok. I didn't call the police and didn't file e report because I thought if I report this they will come and take the child away. I don't know what I was thinking when I had my body full of sign of evidence. Now it is gone and haven't done that. If I had known what I know now I would have had everything in my side.

turnera, the laws in EU are pretty much the same. It doesn't change too much from state to state. 

I am now brain storming what do I have to tell to the judge during those 15 minutes I will be alone with me and what line of defence I will keep when I will be in front of the judge with my H. I have no clue on how to be convincing and simple...any advice?

It is 4 AM here and I cannot sleep. Too much crossing my mind...I feel like a criminal, but I don't know what crime I did.


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## turnera

Go online and find websites about abuse, and read up about how to get out of it, how to get it out of your system, how to move on and start liking and trusting yourself again. The abuse has whittled that away, so that you no longer trust yourself. But you are worthy of respect and love and fairness. Right now, you have to take it. Later, you'll find someone to give it to you.


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## ADM

everything is true, it is for next month!


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## turnera

So what? You know what you need to do. That much sooner to get him out of your life and protect your kid.


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## ADM

Listen to this; he send me yesterday replying my previous mail concerning him missing for 27 days. I had asked him whether he knew any better mother to my son, which he answered yesterday I was about to be send in court for child kidnapping. Today, he had taken the same mail, starting from the point of my last question saying that he never doubted I was a great mother and his intention was not to take my son away from me. BUT, he had to aim for the maximum so he could have little...so in other words; he paid 3K Euro to accelerate the process, instead of paying the creche to his son for 6 months or even going on vacation with all of his kids to a fantastic resort for 1 month. He preferred to "kill" me so somebody tells him his rights...while he has no clue he also has obligations towards his son. I didn't answer! It irritates me! ...I will not answer.

Now, all my energy should be put to preparing the speech to the judge, there I am stuck and need help .

TY turnera xx


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## turnera

Just speak from the heart. Write out a timeline of the things he has done, and see if you can give that to the judge. Show him that you didn't make this decision lightly, but definitely show him that your husband has been harmful.


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## ADM

7.30 in the morning, one court officer came to hand me in the court papers for this very urgent hearing. They are 15 pages of lies and lies and lies and lies like he hasn't seen his son in 4 months or contacted him at all, or that I am unstable and insane or many more facts...none of them true. I cannot understand how he can build a file on lies for which he knows I have relevant evidence that kills his lies on the spot...?! I am so worried things are not going into the right direction .


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## LVS

You are letting your anger get you( rira qui rira le dernier) in a meaning you don't need to revenge from his stupid actions you need to live in peace with your child away of his influences on your mind

You should not be worried since you know what is going on and you know all the lies 
all you need is to collect proof of his lies you don't have to prove all are lies it is enough for the court to doubt his honesty 

And do as turnera said "Just speak from the heart. Write out a timeline of the things he has done" 

I don't know how much it can help but you can also write him email talking about when he hit you let him reply in a way acknowledging his violent action maybe you can use it with the other things that he done to you....

you don't need anything just relax let your mind slow down do some walk and meditation to clear your mind and get some rest

you are fine, you are doing great things, you are on the right direction just believe more in your self...


Good luck


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## ADM

He did it again, he cried in front of the judge letting her know the child was there and I didn't let him meet with his dad.
Thanks god my lawyer interfered saying it was her who advised NOT to bring the child in court to avoid emotional problems. The judge, then, asked me if the child was there and if I could give it to the father so they could spend time before the decision came out. The decision will not be out before end of August. 
My parents are also leaving today and I'm all alone. What am I going to feel like...don't know...it's gonna be hard...hard.

Too much going on, too much...


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## turnera

Stay strong. You'll win out in the end.


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## ADM

Hi girls, time for me to wine again. Today it is one of those days that I feel like crying although I don't want to and I don't think that is of any good.

It's been a while since I received the court decision. it is all about H's interest, nothing on kid's interest. To make the story short, the judge has given me custody BUT his father has to see the child the first w-e of each month and most of vacation. Transportation fees on me, transportation on me! By this, I mean the child has to make till the end of the year has to make more than 5K km so his father "can exercise" his parental authority. I mean who on earth would want a child to spend so many times on the roads without considering neither his age or the climate conditions, that he has to travel wither being sick or in good health. I AM ANGRY!...VERY ANGRY! I see here nothing but revenge for me moving out and far from that mess of a marriage that was killing anyone on it. Ironically I have to pay for the transportation. How am I supposed to travel back home for another 900 km if I have to take the child from his father's home by 7PM on a Sunday evening...hell NO! Besides,. there is no chance I can have another hearing before 6 months in order to modify the decision.

In the mean time, the evil teases me with his stupid messages that I have stopped answering and keeps me responsible for all this. He tells me this is the only way he can make me aware of my "mistakes". Hell NO, again! I took over all my responsibilities and am working like hell to pay for the kindergarten so thi child can play with kids of his own age instead of staying home with me, while his father tells me I AM the one who HAS to pay, since I took the child away of him....hell NO, again.

This is a very bad day!

I work now in a pressing for some little money that pays only the kindergarten. I cannot believe how far I could go with this. I feel frustrated and almost finished.


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## turnera

Just know that your son will understand, one day, what you've done for him. He'll see which of you acts out of love. 

So sorry.


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## LVS

Dear ADM
I am sorry because you have to go through all these hard things It is really hard but if nothing else you can do i hope that you can be able to adjust yourself to this situation i think it is a big price but it should be paid 
Do you think your freedom worth paying this price?
You are the most one who knows the answer

I wish you the best you are really strong and i am proud of you
Good luck!!


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