# Hi There...



## twotimesone

Been a long time lurker and decided to create an account. 

I'm currently married for about 16 years. My marriage was on the rocks already and my W don't seem to want to go to couples counseling. I'm a type of person who believes a marriage is a commitment and you should follow it for the good of the family. Anyways, thanks.


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## notmyjamie

Welcome to TAM. You might want to post a little bit more about what's happening in your marriage to get some advice.


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## Tasorundo

What are the rocks you are on?


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## wilson

Counseling isn't the right thing for everyone. Once you share more of your situation, I'm sure you'll get lots of advice about other things you might try.


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## twotimesone

Thanks for replying. It is mostly about sexlessness in the marriage after the kids are born. W barely wants to initiates and we have starfish sex. It is gotten to a point where I want to initiate but W usually makes the usual excuses. She spends alot of time doing her hobbies and doesn't think our marriage is a priority. She thinks I am always the problem in the marriage and doesn't want to do anything about it.

In any case, in order to gain some sanity, I decided to outsource. Not proud of it but I figured that since I am married with kids and all, I think I will keep doing this until the kids are out of the coop then I will just go on my own.


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## personofinterest

twotimesone said:


> Thanks for replying. It is mostly about sexlessness in the marriage after the kids are born. W barely wants to initiates and we have starfish sex. It is gotten to a point where I want to initiate but W usually makes the usual excuses. She spends alot of time doing her hobbies and doesn't think our marriage is a priority. She thinks I am always the problem in the marriage and doesn't want to do anything about it.
> 
> In any case, in order to gain some sanity, I decided to outsource. Not proud of it but I figured that since I am married with kids and all, I think I will keep doing this until the kids are out of the coop then I will just go on my own.


So to cut through the crap....

You cheated on your wife. Do you take any responsibility for your choice? Because it WAS a choice.


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## 269370

twotimesone said:


> In any case, in order to gain some sanity, I decided to outsource.



Where to?



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Tasorundo

Yeah, outsourcing is a pretty open ended word. If you cannot even call what you did (whatever it may be) what it actually is, I think that says a lot about you and your feelings about what you are doing.


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## wilson

twotimesone said:


> In any case, in order to gain some sanity, I decided to outsource. Not proud of it but I figured that since I am married with kids and all, I think I will keep doing this until the kids are out of the coop then I will just go on my own.


For the good of your family, you should really consider divorce. This kind of thing rarely stays secret. It's very unlikely that the secret will last until the kids are out of school. If your kids are very young, the divorce won't really affect them that much. If the secret comes out and you end up divorcing when they're tweens, it can really mess them up. But young kids will adapt to two houses as the new normal.

One thing you need to keep in mind is that your emotional state towards your family will change as you satisfy your needs externally. It's likely you'll develop feelings for the other person and will resent your wife more. And then there's the whole issue of time management as you're sneaking around.


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## personofinterest

wilson said:


> For the good of your family, you should really consider divorce. This kind of thing rarely stays secret. It's very unlikely that the secret will last until the kids are out of school. If your kids are very young, the divorce won't really affect them that much. If the secret comes out and you end up divorcing when they're tweens, it can really mess them up. But young kids will adapt to two houses as the new normal.
> 
> One thing you need to keep in mind is that your emotional state towards your family will change as you satisfy your needs externally. It's likely you'll develop feelings for the other person and will resent your wife more. And then there's the whole issue of time management as you're sneaking around.


Um....also the fact that it is wrong and deceptive....


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## wilson

personofinterest said:


> Um....also the fact that it is wrong and deceptive....


I don't think I implied any different. There are many reasons his behavior is wrong. If you would like to expand on some of those reasons, feel free to make a new post.


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## personofinterest

Just observing the variety of ways different genders are addressed regarding cheating.


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## notmyjamie

twotimesone said:


> I'm a type of person who believes a marriage is a commitment and you should follow it for the good of the family.





twotimesone said:


> In any case, in order to gain some sanity, I decided to outsource. Not proud of it but I figured that since I am married with kids and all, I think I will keep doing this until the kids are out of the coop then I will just go on my own.



Do you not see how contradictory these two statements are? You can't possibly believe in the commitment of marriage if you're cheating on your wife and plan to continue to cheat until your kids are older and then you'll leave her. 

If you're here looking for validation of your choices, you've come to the wrong place. If you've come to learn how you can help your wife get over your betrayal because you're truly remorseful for your actions you might get help. But from your own admission you plan to continue so I doubt you'll get much help. 

Sorry your marriage had problems...you took what was a molehill and turned into an insurmountable mountain. Infidelity never fixes anything, ever. I know exactly what it's like to have a spouse who doesn't want sex. So I am quite sympathetic to anyone who is dealing with that believe me. But deal with it you must...either figure out how to get a healthy sex life back with her or leave her. But don't say you won't leave because you believe in the commitment of marriage while you're ****ing someone else on the side. You just make yourself sound ridiculous.

I wish you good luck in figuring out your life and I wish your wife good luck as well.


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## MattMatt

twotimesone said:


> Thanks for replying. It is mostly about sexlessness in the marriage after the kids are born. W barely wants to initiates and we have starfish sex. It is gotten to a point where I want to initiate but W usually makes the usual excuses. She spends alot of time doing her hobbies and doesn't think our marriage is a priority. She thinks I am always the problem in the marriage and doesn't want to do anything about it.
> 
> In any case, in order to gain some sanity, I decided to outsource. Not proud of it but I figured that since I am married with kids and all, I think I will keep doing this until the kids are out of the coop then I will just go on my own.


If you are genuinely not proud of it, stop doing it.


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## twotimesone

Yes I outsourced, but it is mostly physical, not emotional. I don't think about this person all the time and I don't text her either in ways that people get caught. I'm not thinking of a future with this person. It is not someone I am friends with. 

I'm not looking validation or sympathy of what I am doing. And if this will blow up in front in my face, I will deal with that too. If I decided to go thru for a divorce, it will cost me financially and right now and it will probably ruin my chances for early retirement. 



notmyjamie said:


> Do you not see how contradictory these two statements are? You can't possibly believe in the commitment of marriage if you're cheating on your wife and plan to continue to cheat until your kids are older and then you'll leave her.


Maybe you and I have a different view of Marriage. I want to stay because I have a commitment for the kids, and not for my W.


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## MattMatt

twotimesone said:


> Yes I outsourced, but it is mostly physical, not emotional. I don't think about this person all the time and I don't text her either in ways that people get caught. I'm not thinking of a future with this person. It is not someone I am friends with.
> 
> I'm not looking validation or sympathy of what I am doing. And if this will blow up in front in my face, I will deal with that too. If I decided to go thru for a divorce, it will cost me financially and right now and it will probably ruin my chances for early retirement.
> 
> 
> 
> Maybe you and I have a different view of Marriage. I want to stay because I have a commitment for the kids, and not for my W.


You are cheating on your wife. And, by extension, on your kids, too.

That's not good. In fact, that's very bad, indeed.

Cheaters often reinvent the history of their marriage in order to justify their cheating. Have you done that?


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## notmyjamie

twotimesone said:


> Yes I outsourced, but it is mostly physical, not emotional. I don't think about this person all the time and I don't text her either in ways that people get caught. I'm not thinking of a future with this person. It is not someone I am friends with.
> 
> I'm not looking validation or sympathy of what I am doing. And if this will blow up in front in my face, I will deal with that too. If I decided to go thru for a divorce, it will cost me financially and right now and it will probably ruin my chances for early retirement.
> 
> 
> 
> Maybe you and I have a different view of Marriage. I want to stay because I have a commitment for the kids, and not for my W.



The very definition of marriage is the commitment between 2 partners. So yes, my definition is all about the husband and wife remaining committed to each other. I applaud you for wanting to stay together for your children. However, I guarantee things will be MUCH worse for your kids if you end up divorcing due to infidelity vs divorcing because you and your wife are more like roommates than a couple. I stayed in my crappy marriage for a LONG time for the kids and now I'm realizing I did them no favors. And I especially didn't do myself any favors.

You want credit because the woman you're screwing is not someone you have feelings for and you don't plan a future with her? Does she know this? Having sex with another woman is still cheating whether you love her or not. Your wife will still be hurt either way. The "Sex is just sex" excuse doesn't work when you're talking about cheating on your spouse.

You're admitting that you're staying for your kids and because it's cheaper to keep her. So I'm not sure what you're looking for from this forum? You seem pretty confident in your choices. But, you came here for a reason and I think you're unhappy, even with the added sex in your life. I think what you want is a loving wife who is attracted to you and desires you. I can't blame you there at all.

I feel for you. I really do. As I said, I lived with the whole sexless marriage thing too. I just see this blowing up in your face pretty badly. And your wife deserves to be told you want out of the marriage because she is not acting like a loving wife anymore before you go banging someone else. As I said, cheating is never the answer. 

Have you threatened to leave your wife over this issue?


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## twotimesone

notmyjamie said:


> The very definition of marriage is the commitment between 2 partners. So yes, my definition is all about the husband and wife remaining committed to each other. I applaud you for wanting to stay together for your children. However, I guarantee things will be MUCH worse for your kids if you end up divorcing due to infidelity vs divorcing because you and your wife are more like roommates than a couple. I stayed in my crappy marriage for a LONG time for the kids and now I'm realizing I did them no favors. And I especially didn't do myself any favors.
> 
> You want credit because the woman you're screwing is not someone you have feelings for and you don't plan a future with her? Does she know this? Having sex with another woman is still cheating whether you love her or not. Your wife will still be hurt either way. The "Sex is just sex" excuse doesn't work when you're talking about cheating on your spouse.
> 
> You're admitting that you're staying for your kids and because it's cheaper to keep her. So I'm not sure what you're looking for from this forum? You seem pretty confident in your choices. But, you came here for a reason and I think you're unhappy, even with the added sex in your life. I think what you want is a loving wife who is attracted to you and desires you. I can't blame you there at all.
> 
> I feel for you. I really do. As I said, I lived with the whole sexless marriage thing too. I just see this blowing up in your face pretty badly. And your wife deserves to be told you want out of the marriage because she is not acting like a loving wife anymore before you go banging someone else. As I said, cheating is never the answer.
> 
> Have you threatened to leave your wife over this issue?


"A loving wife" is a joke. My Wife treats me like crap because she gets pissed off when I don't do whatever she says. She doesn't cares about my priorities but I have care about hers. At this point, we are just like roommates. And I did confront my wife about this issue and she doesn't care about every other thing that I said anyways, but she just wants to make it look like I am the problem. 

Like I said, I will probably stay for maybe about 8-13 years and I will probably be out. Maybe my kids will find out, maybe they won't, but I have done this for years and so far I haven't been caught.

Another thing I consider is what happens when I get divorced. At this point, I am kind of jaded about the whole marriage thing, probably won't get married again. I think if I get divorced, I will be miserable and alone, just too much of a pain to get into another relationship.


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## Diana7

Good to hear that you are such a happy adulterer, liar, deceiver and all round good guy.:|

My husband didn't have a good sex life in his first marriage, but guess what, he didn't cheat, lie, or deceive his wife, and when the marriage did end after 23 years it was her who cheated and ended it. Why didn't he cheat? Because he is a man of character and integrity and honesty and he actually believes in commitment and faithfulness and keeping the promises he makes. 
You are none of those things. I hope you know that there will be bad consequences, there always are.


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## notmyjamie

twotimesone said:


> "A loving wife" is a joke. My Wife treats me like crap because she gets pissed off when I don't do whatever she says. She doesn't cares about my priorities but I have care about hers. At this point, we are just like roommates. And I did confront my wife about this issue and she doesn't care about every other thing that I said anyways, but she just wants to make it look like I am the problem.
> 
> I didn't say your current wife is that person. I meant that you desire a loving wife and a real relationship. Most people do. So my advice is leave this marriage and free yourself up for someone who can love you the way you want/need to be loved. That's what I have done. It's hard, I know. And for me the hardest parts haven't even hit me yet. But I know it will be worth it. ETA: Even if I never find someone else to love, it's more lonely standing next to someone who is supposed to love you than standing by yourself.
> 
> 
> Like I said, I will probably stay for maybe about 8-13 years and I will probably be out. Maybe my kids will find out, maybe they won't, but I have done this for years and so far I haven't been caught.
> 
> As someone who stayed in a bad marriage that was a lie for 14 years I think this is a very poor choice. Better to retire later and be happy in the interim while you work towards retirement. You only have one life to live...do you really want to live so much of it next to her?? ETA: Also, the longer you go without getting caught, the greater the chances you will get caught. You'll get sloppy. Just ask the poster who just caught her husband who has been cheating for 10 years. I'm sure he thought he had it all locked down.
> 
> Another thing I consider is what happens when I get divorced. At this point, I am kind of jaded about the whole marriage thing, probably won't get married again. I think if I get divorced, I will be miserable and alone, just too much of a pain to get into another relationship.
> 
> 
> If you're able to have this other woman in your life now then you are able to attract someone else. And while it may be a pain to start up something new, it could be worth it. You would need some time to heal from the pain of this marriage but someday you may feel ready again. Don't you think you're worth it?


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## aine

twotimesone said:


> Yes I outsourced, but it is mostly physical, not emotional. I don't think about this person all the time and I don't text her either in ways that people get caught. I'm not thinking of a future with this person. It is not someone I am friends with.
> 
> I'm not looking validation or sympathy of what I am doing. And if this will blow up in front in my face, I will deal with that too. If I decided to go thru for a divorce, it will cost me financially and right now and it will probably ruin my chances for early retirement.
> 
> 
> 
> Maybe you and I have a different view of Marriage. I want to stay because I have a commitment for the kids, and not for my W.


So to put it all in a nutshell. Your wife doesn't bend over, you will do whatever it takes to get your needs met (including cheating) and in spite of your delusional statement about being committed to marriage, you are really only committed to this marriage because you might be taken to the cleaners financially if you divorce. It is amazing how people like you lie to yourself. You are in denial. Everything here is about YOU YOU and YOU some more. You don't give a **** about the kids, because the relationship with their mother has changed and they will know it.

Be a man, own your ****! I assume you have gone through your 16-year marriage blaming your wife, how much effort have you actually put into the marriage, how much time have you given your wife. It obviously took effort to court and bed the OW, maybe if you spent more time watering your garden at home it would yield more.
You come across as a selfish self-centered human being, I really don't know what you want from us. Perhaps someone to slap you on the back and tell you you are doing the right thing? 
Imagine explaining this to your own mother or your kids, how do you think it would sound. Time for you to stop thinking with your **** and start working on your inner man.

You should
1. Tell your wife you want a divorce
2. Be honest and say you cheated, let the chips fall where they may
3. Explain to your kids (I am sure hey are old enough, that you don't love mummy anymore and you want to explore other gardens)
4. Your wife probably already knows, let her make the decision for you, hopefully, she will set you free.
5. Get a good lawyer and tell your wife to do the same
6. You are doing no one any favors by cheating and sneaking around, better you end the marriage so everyone can move on and be authentic


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## aine

twotimesone said:


> "A loving wife" is a joke. My Wife treats me like crap because she gets pissed off when I don't do whatever she says. She doesn't cares about my priorities but I have care about hers. At this point, we are just like roommates. And I did confront my wife about this issue and she doesn't care about every other thing that I said anyways, but she just wants to make it look like I am the problem.
> 
> Like I said, I will probably stay for maybe about 8-13 years and I will probably be out. Maybe my kids will find out, maybe they won't, but I have done this for years and so far I haven't been caught.
> 
> Another thing I consider is what happens when I get divorced. At this point, I am kind of jaded about the whole marriage thing, probably won't get married again. I think if I get divorced, I will be miserable and alone, just too much of a pain to get into another relationship.


OMG, you really are a piece of work. Its all about ME< ME ME ME ME. 

_My Wife treats me like crap because she gets pissed off when I don't do whatever she says_ Could you be more explicit about this exactly? Is is because you go out late, dont come home to be with the family, etc? I guess in order to sleep around for many years like you say, you would have to split your time for the family. But hey you have needs so she should just get with your programme. Do you hear yourself?

_At this point, we are just like roommates_ YUP, that usually happens when you are out ****ing around with OW, wives usually don't really welcome their husbands home with open arms when they know in their gut what is happening. 


I_ will be miserable and alone .........._. "oh woe is me..." This is all BS.
"_I have done this for years and I haven't been caught_" I guarentee your wife already knows that you are a POS and decides to stay in the marriage because of the kids and the financial security, women know these things and that is why she wont sleep with you, she knows you are a man ***** and she might catch something from you. 

_just too much of a pain to get into another relationship_ God forbid you might have to put any effort into a relationship with a woman. No wonder your marriage is on the rocks as you put it. You really would be a prize catch. Why dont you just divorce and sleep with prostitutes. Sounds to me like your wife is far too good for you.


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## MattMatt

aine said:


> OMG, you really are a piece of work. Its all about ME< ME ME ME ME.
> 
> _My Wife treats me like crap because she gets pissed off when I don't do whatever she says_ Could you be more explicit about this exactly? Is is because you go out late, dont come home to be with the family, etc? I guess in order to sleep around for many years like you say, you would have to split your time for the family. But hey you have needs so she should just get with your programme. Do you hear yourself?
> 
> _At this point, we are just like roommates_ YUP, that usually happens when you are out ****ing around with OW, wives usually don't really welcome their husbands home with open arms when they know in their gut what is happening.
> 
> 
> I_ will be miserable and alone .........._. "oh woe is me..." This is all BS.
> "_I have done this for years and I haven't been caught_" I guarentee your wife already knows that you are a POS and decides to stay in the marriage because of the kids and the financial security, women know these things and that is why she wont sleep with you, she knows you are a man ***** and she might catch something from you.
> 
> _just too much of a pain to get into another relationship_ God forbid you might have to put any effort into a relationship with a woman. No wonder your marriage is on the rocks as you put it. You really would be a prize catch. Why dont you just divorce and sleep with prostitutes. Sounds to me like your wife is far too good for you.


Whenever I hear or read the "ME, ME, ME" stuff I always think of this song by The Muppets:-


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