# 180?



## Owyn (Jul 9, 2012)

One week ago I confronted my wife and found out she was having an emotional affair. She denied it and said they were just friends, like almost every one does. The next day she admitted it and wanted to fix our marriage.

The first step was giving me access to her cell phone, email account and Facebook account. I seen this as a very positive sign. However, it seems like she wants to work on our marriage one day and not the next.

This is where I'm being confused. Only a couple days after the discovery she is angry with me, we argue and then she understands why we are where we are. The next day she is fine and seems to be okay with my monitering of her activity. But yesterday she became angry with me again, and we had to agrue about it all over again. Maybe today she will be okay with it again, I don't know. And if I have a bad day or bad thoughts, she's not good at supporting me during that time, it seems she tries to ignore it.

I had to give her the "him or me" ultimatum before she would come clean about it. And I seem to have to remind her that I am willing to file for divorce if she doesn't put in the effort needed to fix our marriage. I have another post regarding it, please message me or look for that post if you want more details.

I want us to attend marriage counselling and she doesn't want to go. She only shows remorse on her "good" days and shows no caring at all on her "bad" days, until we argue about it and I remind her.

I'm confused if she might be getting mad because of the loss of her EA, which I've heard could be true. Or is she mad because she doesn't really want to work on our marriage? Thoughts?

I don't want to, but should I begin the 180? If so, can some one point me to a good thread about it please.

Thanks,

Owyn


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## morituri (Apr 1, 2011)

The problem with ultimatums is that they bind you to carry them through and if you can't then you will lose not only respect but credibility as well. A better approach is conveying to her that you have reached the middle point of whether to R or D and that you can't guarantee anything to her unless there are some serious and positive actions on her part towards R.


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## anonymouskitty (Jun 5, 2012)

You're not doing the 180 for her, you're doing it for you.Incorporate all the relevant elements of the 180 and see yourself becoming stronger emotionally.

I know most people won't agree with me about it since she's being open about it, most people think now is the time for counseling, its not trust me on that. When you enter the counselor's office you want two people not three. 

The need of the hour is to be detached

The Healing Heart: The 180


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## PHTlump (Jun 2, 2010)

Owyn said:


> I'm confused if she might be getting mad because of the loss of her EA, which I've heard could be true. Or is she mad because she doesn't really want to work on our marriage? Thoughts?


There are a lot of things that could be going on. An affair, whether EA, or PA, gives the disloyal spouse frequent shots of endorphins. It's like being on heroine. Leaving the affair can lead to withdrawal symptoms.

Also, most people don't cheat while in good marriages. So, she's leaving Mister Perfect who gets her brain on heroin, and you're still leaving the toilet seat up. So that's going to be frustrating for her. That's where counseling can help. The big problem is her actions, but you helped create the environment where she wanted to cheat. So long term, you need to do some changing as well.

Also, this may have been the worst thing she's ever done. Working through the guilt and shame will be hard for her. Some disloyals simply refuse to do it. Better to justify it and blow up the family than to admit that they did something horrible.

You might do a mini-180. Your wife is semi-committing to your marriage. You might want to pull back a bit to get your head right. But I think you should try counseling.


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## Owyn (Jul 9, 2012)

@morituri: The ultimatum is true. If I find out for sure that she is still talking to the other guy, I will have to leave, even if I don't want to. I can't live like that.

@anonymouskitty: Thanks for posting the 180. I've looked over all the points... and I notice some that will be difficult for me. However, I will start working on them now and see where it gets me.

@PHTlump: You mention withdrawal symptoms, could her anger with me be a symptom? Are you aware of anything else I should be looking for to help determine this? I know I've had a hand in messing up our marriage, as stated in my other post, we grew apart. I am fully willing to fix all I can, but it goes against the 180... so I have to pick a single path.

She doesn't want to go to counseling, and she's embarrassed to talk about the situation. Perhaps she's suffering with what PHTlump said "Some disloyals simply refuse to do it". I truly think counseling would help us, but I don't know how to get her to go and take it seriously. Any advice on that? Counseling or divorce?

She has openly given me access to her phone and other accounts, yet gets angry (some days and not others) when I ask about them or check. It seems strange.


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## anonymouskitty (Jun 5, 2012)

She's still in the withdrawal phase, now is not the time for counseling.


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## PHTlump (Jun 2, 2010)

Owyn said:


> @PHTlump: You mention withdrawal symptoms, could her anger with me be a symptom?


Sure. You're the guy who took away her fix. Look, even if you were right to quash the affair, which you were, and even if she commits to your marriage, which it seems she has, she's still not getting her fix.

Look at it like your wife is quitting smoking. She's going to spend some time in withdrawal. And time in withdrawal is going to be an emotional roller coaster for her and for you with bits of rage, sorrow, and confusion.



Owyn said:


> I know I've had a hand in messing up our marriage, as stated in my other post, we grew apart. I am fully willing to fix all I can, but it goes against the 180... so I have to pick a single path.


I would be careful with the 180. It's really for marriages where one spouse has checked out, or is determined to cake-eat, and the other spouse needs to let go. That's not your situation.



Owyn said:


> She doesn't want to go to counseling, and she's embarrassed to talk about the situation. Perhaps she's suffering with what PHTlump said "Some disloyals simply refuse to do it". I truly think counseling would help us, but I don't know how to get her to go and take it seriously. Any advice on that? Counseling or divorce?


I would shelve the divorce talk for now. She's stopped her affair and given you the transparency you asked for. She needs to work through her emotions at losing her affair/fix and that could take a while.

Also, she knows that, in counseling, she will have to discuss the worst thing she has ever done with a stranger in great detail. Nobody is going to be anxious to start those conversations.

So, I think you should devise a timeline. Let her work through things on her own for a few weeks. Then start the counseling. Be watchful of any backsliding on her part. Occasional outbursts are normal.


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## Owyn (Jul 9, 2012)

Thanks for the advice. It helps me to understand and better deal with her mood swings. I will continue down the same path for now. I'm going to have to keep monitering her and maintaining the transparency for my own peace of mind. I'm constantly worried it's still going or could start again, which are feelings I think are normal.

I'm going to consider some of the points from the 180 but continue to work on my marriage as if it's going to be okay. Also, I will delay the counseling for a while longer.

Thanks.


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## Acabado (May 13, 2012)

anonymouskitty nailed it. The moods swing are withdrawal. She will flip flop between sadness and anger, the full spectrum of emotions for a while, untill the detachement from OM/affair fades. MC will be a waste for now. Detach, focus on yourself for a while. Make her worry about losing you.
They cope with the anxiety mostly being angry, to you, the one who made her cut her drug.


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## daisygirl 41 (Aug 5, 2011)

Maybe the A is still going on!
Trust but verify!
Good luck
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## NornIron7 (Jul 5, 2012)

Mood swings it is. My WW went through every emotion under the sun. It took months and perhaps even now I'm deluding myself that its over. The EA ia worse than a PA in my opinion. Women want to talk. They want empathy. If they don't get it at home ndn someone else is willing to listen and tell them how wonderful they are then they lap it up.


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## costa200 (Jun 27, 2012)

Gotta love these situations when the BS is more into R than the WS...


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## Acabado (May 13, 2012)

> Gotta love these situations when the BS is more into R than the WS...


Sadly I'd say it's the norm.


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

Owyn said:


> Thanks for the advice. It helps me to understand and better deal with her mood swings. I will continue down the same path for now. I'm going to have to keep monitering her and maintaining the transparency for my own peace of mind. I'm constantly worried it's still going or could start again, which are feelings I think are normal.
> 
> I'm going to consider some of the points from the 180 but continue to work on my marriage as if it's going to be okay. Also, I will delay the counseling for a while longer.
> 
> Thanks.


Use the steps in the 180 that are about self improvement: losing weight, getting in shape, dressing nicer, taking up a new hobby, being cheerful and fun to be around (even when it is the last thing you want to do) and not following your wife around like a wounded puppy (that's an important one).

A modified 180 where you are not pursuing your wife or being needy... just giving her space and letting her see you start to live for yourself.... is probably what you need to do. 

I agree that it is not time to do a "hard" 180, where you detach emotionally and treat her like another piece of furniture.


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

costa200 said:


> Gotta love these situations when the BS is more into R than the WS...


That is the usual Costa. Rarely is it the other way around.


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## bkaydezz (Jul 9, 2012)

yep. definately going through ea withdrawls. one day she is certain with you then the next she is having what ifs.


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## Owyn (Jul 9, 2012)

Thank you all for the positive reinforcement about her mood swings, it was confusing me. I hope she will soon realize what we can have if she commits to me again.

@bandit.45: Thanks. That is what I plan do to. I will pick some points from the 180 and start to work on them, without commiting to it fully. 

I know she is having a hard time dealing with things right now. But I hope I start seeing more support from her in terms of helping me. Yesterday was pretty good, she didn't want to spend much time with me but she wasn't mad either.


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## anonymouskitty (Jun 5, 2012)

Owyn, at this point her problems are hers to deal with. Don't be the shoulder she cries on. If she's moody, leave her and don't confront her at all. You need to act cool and unemotional. Buddy, its best to help ourselves, I know you're in pain but don't expect her to help you just yet. When you're in true R, then you can expect her to sympathize with your pain. Right now all you need to concentrate on is you


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## Owyn (Jul 9, 2012)

Right. Okay, I understand. I guess I was looking for more remorse and caring about me at this time, to show me she is upset about what she did to me. But if it is normal for that to come out after the withdrawl stages, I will look for it then. Hopefully it happens, or I will worry.


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## anonymouskitty (Jun 5, 2012)

Maybe it will, maybe it won't. The point of 180(or in your case, relevant components of it) is that no matter what happens you'll be alright. You become a rock, immune to any change in the weather, stationary and observant.


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