# said wrong name



## stupid guy (Apr 25, 2010)

i said the wrong name twice and it was my ex wifes name i love my wife very much but she thinks i have something for my ex but i dont im sure of it we have been reading a marriagr help book and i had been thinking bout the things i done wrong in tha marriage and comparing with the things i was doing wrong in this one i have two children by the first wife and been divorced from her for bout 8 yrs been married again now for 3 yrs and it just happened my wife and i are having a hard time dealing with any thoughts


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## stupid guy (Apr 25, 2010)

i am the wife. my husband leaves out important details on his post. 

we did start a marriage counseling book for various reasons that may or may not be related to this issue. (such as extreme dishonesty or deciet in several areas and at one point he started going to the bathroom to masturbate INSTEAD of having sex with me) i know everyone does it, but our sex life took a back seat to that activity.

what he DIDN'T say is that he called me his ex-wife's name at the moment of orgasm. twice. in one week.

he says he has NO feelings for her whatsoever.
he says he wasn't thinking of her.
he says he wasn't fantasizing about her.
he says he doesn't know why he said her name unless it's because the marriage counseling book made him think about all the mistakes he made in his first marriage.

i am upset because the counseling book made him think about the problems he had with her, instead of the problems WE have. 
he said the book made him feel he owed her an apology, which he changed his mind about when i disagreed.

i am upset because i feel he is being dishonest, again.

other problems concerning the ex-wife include: 
1)tension or discomfort when she is around 
2)his affection toward me changes when she is around (doesn't happen as much anymore)
3)at one time he put my exboyfriends number in his phone under HER exlover's name
4)in a relationship with a girl before me, he also called her his exwife's name during sex
5)he only recently in the last year got rid of all of her pictures, mementos, etc.
6)he very often uses or used her in conversations with phrases like "when i was with HER" or "when she and i were together"

he doesn't believe any of this adds up to anything.
he doesn't believe there is a reason for any of it.

i feel he's honest, but only to a point.
i feel he cares, but only to a point.
i feel he loves me, but only to a point.
in essence: his love feels more like words than actions.
he says it, but his actions don't prove it.

one of the major problems in our marriage has been his dishonesty and his inability to open up and communicate effectively about issues that affect us both.

case in point: his post leaves out vital details.


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## DawnD (Sep 23, 2009)

Hello "the wife" lol. Don't get the wrong impression, no one here is going to tell your H that its okay to be calling out an exes name during sex. Definately not okay. But I think men seem to think in sets of one problem at a time, and he is starting with what he thinks is the biggest problem. 

As far as him feeling he owes his ex an apology. Honestly if you are there with him and he simply puts "hey, I realize I made a lot of mistakes with you and I am truly sorry" and then he feels as if he has made ammends, I don't see the harm. BUT there are a lot more educated people on here than me that may have some better insight. He does have two children with her, so there is history and the absolute need to contact each other while trying to raise the children.

For "the husband" lol. Definately are going to have to move past the mistakes you made with your ex years ago and worry about the ones you are making right now with your wife. Its okay to feel bad about how you treated people in the past, but part of fixing that is how you are treating the people in your life right now. No wife wants to hear how a relationship was between you and your ex constantly. That isn't fair at all. I think for me to be at all helpful with some of the problems your wife listed you will have to be more forthcoming. Why did you get rid of the pictures of your ex? Was it asked, or did you feel it was time? Honesty is the foundation of a marriage. You have to be real and honest with your wife, or you will dig a hole so deep you will never get out. 

Best of luck you two and I hope someone here has more experience in this area!!


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## stupid guy (Apr 25, 2010)

i brought the boxes when i left and never went throuhg them i stuck them in the closet and forgot bout them untill she went through them and said something about them then i went through them and got rid of everything


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## DawnD (Sep 23, 2009)

You know, my husband forgot about a box with pics of him sleeping with his ex girlfriend and of a stripper shaving her down under all in this box. He deployed to Korea, and when I went around unpacking things, I came across them. And I will admit, I completely over reacted. In some cases, I do believe that it is an honest to god " completely pushed it in the back of my mind that those were still there" mistake. 

The girl before you two got together isn't relevant, you can't use something that doesn't even involve yourself, its not fighting fair. You do however, have a very valid point in actions not matching words. If you guys truly want to work this out, I would honestly see the need for the husband to see his own individual counselor, because I get the feeling he is uncomfortable being honest around you. He just might feel that you are judgemental of him. I don't say that to be mean, I say it from personal experience as my husband once thought he same of me. 

Can you two actually talk to each other and "hear" one another or is it just talking? I am guilty of this as well. I was listening, but I didn't really hear what he was telling me. It can usually clear a lot of things up in a matter or minutes whereas just listening just gaggles everything up worse. 

Can you both do me a favor and tell me what of the issues listed above is recent and what happened more than 2 months ago??


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## stupid guy (Apr 25, 2010)

we're in a struggle, neither of us is playing fair.
but i am fair enough to admit 
that even if i couldn't see that 
i'd still say it 
because it's normally true in any argument. 
one or both people pull out all the stops. 
one or both are "the bad guy".
i admit to a possibility that its me.

some of the list happened more than two months ago, 
some less. 
but i disagree that it isn't fair to bring up the previous girlfriend 
or the events more than two months ago when my point is this:
over a period of six years since they divorced in 2004 the ex is still a complication in his emotional life and she isn't even around. what does that MEAN? it feels imperative.

i don't judge him, 
i've done some completely idiotic things in my life, 
i have no right. 
however, if i disagree with his actions, he feels judged.
when i say they don't match his words, he doesn't know why.
i'm not sure how to remedy that.

honesty should be a comfortable thing no matter who you're talking to but especially your spouse. 
i mean, it's your SPOUSE...
the one person in the world you chose over ALL others
to share yourself with
the good, the bad, the ugly, the embarrasing, etc.
where is his trust in me and his faith in us
that in any event 
even tho i may get angry, 
disagree, 
get mean,
misunderstand, 
act like a child, 
that i love him and he WILL get through to me when the truth is hard to handle?
when does he start actually BELIEVING that i love him?
enough to know that even if it means a little extra work,
that i can take anything he can dish out.
and if i couldn't i wouldn't have married him.

(possibly relevent to the above statement: the first lie i figured out was somewhere around four months into our relationship, so pretty much since the beginning he hasn't trusted me enough to be honest, a fact that feels like baggage from the ex wife)

also, 
please understand, 
when the second occurance happened (wrong name during sex)
he didn't say a word about it for two weeks.
past issues have been difficult to resolve because of this ongoing communication gap.

but even if i screamed everyday to the top of my lungs
I DON'T WANT TO TALK ABOUT IT 
he's my husband and supposed to be there like no one else will. 
hold me down and coo like my mother did, 
protect me from the storm like my father did, 
bug the crap out of me to "just see it my way" like my siblings did, 
keep pleading his case like the kids do.
in other words: not throw his hands up and do nothing.
in all issues "just between us", he's the only family i've got.
if i can't count on him during those times, who can i count on?

but he keeps quiet because he doesn't know what to say when he makes a mistake.
it leaves ALOT of room for misunderstanding when it leaves such a wide gap in communication.
i'm searching for answers, getting none that match his actions, filling in my own blanks
and using alot of his habits over the past three years to do it with.

i feel stuck 
ive been looking for a reason to trust him since the very first lie he told and what he's given me is a repetitious string of deciet that i haven't handled well. 
by now i feel like a lunatic.
and may very well be.

he lied to me the night before we got married, 
which is possibly still an issue 
but i maybe think the repetition of it that kept up for two more years is the culprit. 
once, last year, i asked him when he was going to start being honest, how long i had to wait...he said "i'm almost there". 
i don't think he understands how much that stuck in me, or how much it hurt.
he continued to lie up until a few months ago.
"he says he stopped anyway" ...
and i say that gently, knowing i could be wrong, not yet believing 
that he's changed.

i seriously and honestly never thought he would knowingly and willingly repeat the mistake of breaking my trust but he did. 
the shock value of that alone has been overwhelming.

which makes this current "ex" issue very hard to comprehend, because it feels "imperative", because i am habitually suspicious and because i can't seem to believe a word he says.


i have to admit your comment disheartens me.
"If you guys truly want to work this out, I would honestly see the need for the husband to see his own individual counselor, because I get the feeling he is uncomfortable being honest around you"

if you aren't comfortable enough with the person you chose to spend your life with to be completely forthcoming about who you are, then the possibility exists that you chose the wrong person. 

a possibility which makes me terribly sad for two reasons.
1) he will never be happy or be himself, no one deserves that
2) i love him so deeply and have since i met him 20 years ago....


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## DawnD (Sep 23, 2009)

I get you feel that it is imperative that he mentioned the ex's name with the previous girlfriend, but it might feel to him that you are using things against him to prove you were right. (not saying at all this is what you are doing, just that he might feel that way)

The part where you talk about what your H should be. Did he know that he was supposed to be all this before marriage?? Did you specifically sit down and tell him that exact thought? Because nobody thinks alike and he couldn't have possibly known thats what you needed it you didn't directly tell him.

Don't let the thought of him needing individual counseling hurt you! There are a lot of reasons why this might be great for him IN ADDITION to your marriage counseling. The individual counselor can help him think through things and also help him express those things to you. Its a benefit, not anything to get hurt over. By no means does him needing an individual counselor mean he can't share with you and be honest with you, it just means that maybe he needs someone of his own to share with and get feedback. 

About the honesty thing, I completely feel you. My H has a bad history of lying and trying to "omit" things from what happened. It is heartbreaking and it destroys the foundation of what happens. But when I finally was at the end and said you know what, I am just done, the truth came out. The truth about how he felt that if he told me things that I was judging him. Was I ? No, but that is how he felt. Sometimes I would get so busy with trying to "get to things" that I was completely ignoring his feelings. That hurt him pretty bad. So maybe when you see your marriage counselor you can talk about that. On BOTH sides. I am sure there have been times in your marriage where you feel your needs and emotions were being ignored! It happens to all of us. But I can give you a sample of what happened with me to get us to a good place.

We talk about one issue at a time, and we rotated when things were really bad. Not petty crap, the good stuff. One of the days was the topic of feelings. And as it turned out both of us were feeling like our own feelings were being ignored but thought that we were meeting the others. Big suprise when we both found out we weren't. The hard part is to talk without fighting about it. ( That definately goes for both of you) When things get heated, then take a break and reflect on what has been said. 

Don't let any of this get you down. You are correct in that he is definately having some issues with the ex wife. What the issue is, I don't know but I do know that the best way for him to uncover that is with his own counselor. Sorting out feelings about your exwife is never something you want to do in front of your current wife. But if you truly want him to sort it out, you have to get him in there and let him do it. I know part of you wants to help and wants to know, but he has to do it. 

Don't think that you both can't be happy together! Of course you can, but happiness takes a lot of work. And it looks like since you are seeing a marriage counselor that you have already taken steps to make it better! Thats great! Now just take it one step further and this can all be sorted out.


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## stupid guy (Apr 25, 2010)

DawnD said:


> I get you feel that it is imperative that he mentioned the ex's name with the previous girlfriend, but it might feel to him that you are using things against him to prove you were right. (not saying at all this is what you are doing, just that he might feel that way)


all i need for him to see is that it's POSSIBLE i'm right
i'm not positive i am
however, if we don't explore it, we'll never know.
he is adament that the ex being a continual relationship problem for him isn't possible, that it must be something else.



DawnD said:


> The part where you talk about what your H should be. Did he know that he was supposed to be all this before marriage?? Did you specifically sit down and tell him that exact thought? Because nobody thinks alike and he couldn't have possibly known thats what you needed it you didn't directly tell him.


we didn't talk about these things before we married. 
so i entered in thinking he knew what the vows required of us both. [love, honor, cherish, forsaking all others, in sickness and health]
and he entering in thinking certain things were "none of my business" [direct quote]
neither of us told the other one.



DawnD said:


> Don't let the thought of him needing individual counseling hurt you! There are a lot of reasons why this might be great for him IN ADDITION to your marriage counseling. The individual counselor can help him think through things and also help him express those things to you. Its a benefit, not anything to get hurt over. By no means does him needing an individual counselor mean he can't share with you and be honest with you, it just means that maybe he needs someone of his own to share with and get feedback.


please understand,
"someone of his own" was supposed to be me
years later, i'm still shocked that it isn't.
we've both been in bad marriages.
i admit i have baggage of my own with continual dishonesty.
the only thing he and i can agree on is that type of relationship,
it ends things.
badly.




DawnD said:


> About the honesty thing, I completely feel you. My H has a bad history of lying and trying to "omit" things from what happened. It is heartbreaking and it destroys the foundation of what happens. But when I finally was at the end and said you know what, I am just done, the truth came out. The truth about how he felt that if he told me things that I was judging him. Was I ? No, but that is how he felt. Sometimes I would get so busy with trying to "get to things" that I was completely ignoring his feelings. That hurt him pretty bad. So maybe when you see your marriage counselor you can talk about that. On BOTH sides. I am sure there have been times in your marriage where you feel your needs and emotions were being ignored! It happens to all of us. But I can give you a sample of what happened with me to get us to a good place.


for me, without honesty, we are an accident waiting to happen.



DawnD said:


> We talk about one issue at a time, and we rotated when things were really bad. Not petty crap, the good stuff. One of the days was the topic of feelings. And as it turned out both of us were feeling like our own feelings were being ignored but thought that we were meeting the others. Big suprise when we both found out we weren't. The hard part is to talk without fighting about it. ( That definately goes for both of you) When things get heated, then take a break and reflect on what has been said.


we try to sustain our discussions to one issue at a time, but the communication problem makes it a chore we are both sick of.



DawnD said:


> Don't let any of this get you down. You are correct in that he is definately having some issues with the ex wife.


eureka! 
i started out telling him nearly the exact same sentence.
however by now, because of the repetition, and his inability to admit or explore that possibility, i have filled in all the blanks he can't and he is "still in love with her" and it's "the only possiblity", it's "the only one thing that seems plausible" that he would be "afraid to share with me".
see how his silence and refusal to entertain the possibilty allows me room to take the ball and run with it? especially when his actions lead me in that direction?



we aren't currently seeing a marriage counselor. he bought a book two months ago that we began working on to help him communicate and help me actually hear him.
unfortunately, when he opened up, his ex wife jumped out of the closet while we were having sex and said "guess who" because [he says] when we started the counseling book he started thinking about all the mistakes he made with her, and felt like he owed her an apology. 
the first time it happened i believed him.
the second, i find it impossible.


i'm still stuck. or maybe even uber tightly wedged.

i appreciate your words, even though some of them hurt.
they are helpful.


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## OneMarriedGuy (Apr 5, 2010)

OK, I have to say this is truly interesting having both parties posting. I've said more than once that if I posted my story I'd get lots of "you're a good guy - I'm sorry for you" type stuff and that if my wife did the same she would as well. You see more often than not - that IS going to be the case.

SG-H 
You are married to SG-W now, whatever you find in marriage help, think of how to apply it to the current marriage. I'm not saying you can't realize where you screwed up before. I'm not even saying you shouldn't be a man and take ownership of your actions and mistakes. I'm saying that you need to make sure SG-W is number one and you need to make sure she KNOWS it.

Sorry but you need to control your mouth - if you can't figure out why saying another woman's name during sex or any other intimate moment is way BAD - well, then I've absolutely no idea of what to tell you. This goes for apologizing to the previous wife re: the marriage help book as well. Even if it isn't so, you have to be able to see why this would make SG-W feel like the previous marriage was more important to you than the current.

OK- these are just surface things. They are the result of something deeper. The something deeper is that SG-W does not feel "safe" in the marriage. She doesn't feel #1 to you. Your actions stated here certainly don't help and may be the general "whole" to creating her feeling, maybe not. Find out what her major love languages are -learn to speak them. Make her feel number 1

SG-W
While I can't say one way or the other - I can see where another woman's name could pop out. I only tell you this because it almost happened to me. Simply almost said a past woman's name. The good news for you is this. I was in NO way thinking of the other woman during sex and was not in any way emotionally still involved with this other name. I can't explain why - frankly it scared the [email protected] out of me that it almost popped out!

I can truly see the things making you uncomfortable. However, you really can't expect him to be your mom, dad, siblings and friends all rolled up into one to get a point home to you. You are going to have to work on your communication skill a bit as well and make yourself a bit more approachable. He shouldn't have to wrap you in duct tape and strap you to a chair to push communication through to you. (sorry if I got that wrong - just what it sounded like to me)

The biggest steps to repair here are going to be something like this

SG-H
You need to apologize - with no "BUT"s in it. If you need take some time so that you really can get your head around it. Also it would be most helpful if you could really mean it 

Bad example: I'm sorry you think my ex is important to me but she isn't, I wasn't even thinking of her you are just so jealous

Good example: I'm sorry I hurt you by having those things and saying her name. I really get how it could have hurt and I do not want to hurt you or make you feel insecure. I love you and only you.

Work on showing SG-W how special she is to you. Were there some things you did for her often in the beginning of your relationship that rather faded off in time - maybe go retro and bring them back into the relationship.

SG-W 
Just because he is trying doesn't mean there won't be mistakes. You need to at least make a cut off of the past for a while. Try to see present actions for a while without referring them with the past. In other words try giving him the benefit of the doubt for a while while he is trying to change his action pattern for the better. 

Work on not having the attack list ready to fire. It is really hard to have communication if words are being machine gunned around. 

For communication try this. Even if it seems dumb to have it printed out - do it - why not?

1> A states issue and tells how it made them feel (uninterrupted)
2> B gives response and how they saw situation (uninterrupted)
3> A clarification and hopefully some insight into Bs statement (uninterrupted)
4> B clarification and hopefully some insight into As (uninterrupted)
That's it for going back and forth ...now
5> A makes a closing - if possible state how you see where B was coming from. Leave the word "but" out of this. if you see a possible thing to help prevent in future suggest it
6> B make closing hopefully apologize - acknowledge A's suggestion - if you see another alternative offer it up as just that - another alternative not a replacement of A's

All the time keep in mind that YOU love the other AND that they love you. Talk to them as you would like spoken to. do not talk down to them or if they don't see your way - do not speak to them as children that cannot see the obvious.

So in summary
Apologize
Take ownership of your actions (no blame what you did on the other party)
Express Love
Communicate (no BUTs and let the other person speak uninterrupted)

most likely ...
Have altercation and repeat the above

Last thing is very important! Humans are not perfect! We will hurt each other, the trick is learning to do it as little as possible and to communicate love and forgiveness and to truly attempt to not repeat.


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## stupid guy (Apr 25, 2010)

OneMarriedGuy said:


> SG-H
> Sorry but you need to control your mouth - if you can't figure out why saying another woman's name during sex or any other intimate moment is way BAD - well, then I've absolutely no idea of what to tell you.


In his defense (and he will probably say the same) he was well aware that saying her name during sex was WAY BAD, the first time. The second time...pardon my french...he knew he was screwed not having any good explanation. His awareness of the "bad bad bad" factor isn't a concern. We are both standing straight up with attention.




OneMarriedGuy said:


> OK- these are just surface things. They are the result of something deeper. The something deeper is that SG-W does not feel "safe" in the marriage. She doesn't feel #1 to you. Your actions stated here certainly don't help and may be the general "whole" to creating her feeling, maybe not. Find out what her major love languages are -learn to speak them. Make her feel number 1


hit the nail on the head. 
and yes, his actions are the general whole of creating that feeling.



OneMarriedGuy said:


> SG-W
> While I can't say one way or the other - I can see where another woman's name could pop out. I only tell you this because it almost happened to me. Simply almost said a past woman's name. The good news for you is this. I was in NO way thinking of the other woman during sex and was not in any way emotionally still involved with this other name. I can't explain why - frankly it scared the [email protected] out of me that it almost popped out!


that doesn't sound like good news.
i'm having a hard time relating an "almost wrong name" to "saying the wrong name, twice". 
maybe it's the "twice" thing that's really my undoing.
he said it once, i believed she wasn't on his mind.
he said it again, ....what? it's just a freak accident?
*groan* it truly is impossible to believe him [at this point in time]

when it happened the first time i searched the internet till my eyes bugged out, 
trying to find someone who felt the same horror i did. 
to my dismay, most people it's happened to, like you, thought it was a fluke, some even thought their incident was comical.

i relented, admitted he was right and believed him whole heartedly.

i can't find any information on the net about someone that it's happened to twice.



OneMarriedGuy said:


> I can truly see the things making you uncomfortable. However, you really can't expect him to be your mom, dad, siblings and friends all rolled up into one to get a point home to you. You are going to have to work on your communication skill a bit as well and make yourself a bit more approachable. He shouldn't have to wrap you in duct tape and strap you to a chair to push communication through to you. (sorry if I got that wrong - just what it sounded like to me)


i'm not sure you did get that one right.
basically i expect him to deal with my emotions like family would.
I.E. - not give up 

there's plenty of room for improvement on my communication skills.
when he talks, at least half of what i hear is :
i don't know or i don't remember

i do fill in his gaps with the most logical and rational possibilities.
even the ugly ones.
i explore not EVERY possibility, but ANY possibility.

he will only explore the possibilites that adhere to what he thinks or feels at the moment, 
seemingly unwilling to believe that we all have subconcsious or supressed emotions that we can't always readily access for sound decision making.


also - it is usually the most logical and rational possibilites that he denies the most yet he doesn't have the communication skills to relate to me WHY.

communicating with him is like asking someone "why do you love me?"
and them replying "lots of reasons" yet they can't tell you any specific one.

extremely frustrating.




OneMarriedGuy said:


> SG-H
> You need to apologize - with no "BUT"s in it. If you need take some time so that you really can get your head around it. Also it would be most helpful if you could really mean it
> 
> 
> Good example: I'm sorry I hurt you by having those things and saying her name. I really get how it could have hurt and I do not want to hurt you or make you feel insecure. I love you and only you.


he's apologized almost identically and i'm sure he means it.
what i can't tell is this: 
if he's apologizing for some uncontrollable freak accident that he really can't explain, 
or 
sorry because he got caught fantasizing about his ex wife and doesn't want to admit it so he doesn't have to deal with the work it will take to move past that
[or maybe he thinks it would be a "deal breaker" and i'd hit the door running]

his known character up until a few months ago has been dishonesty to the point of disregard. 
[meaning he has repeated the same mistakes with multiplicity]
rebuilding trust takes time.
because his pattern of dishonesty is so long, it's taking more than a few months of proclaimed honesty for me to believe he's adopted a new frame of mind.



OneMarriedGuy said:


> SG-W
> Just because he is trying doesn't mean there won't be mistakes. You need to at least make a cut off of the past for a while. Try to see present actions for a while without referring them with the past. In other words try giving him the benefit of the doubt for a while while he is trying to change his action pattern for the better.


this feels agreeable. i do need to make a cut off of the past.
unfortunately, the past pattern is that for three years we have no more moved past one land mine until we were mangled in the next. i admit i have lost faith that he is willing to [not change that pattern] but eliminate it.

everyone makes mistakes. we have no choice we're human.
but repeating them is a conscious choice we make or break.




OneMarriedGuy said:


> Work on not having the attack list ready to fire. It is really hard to have communication if words are being machine gunned around.


the attack list:
i have ..
ignored it
refuted it
told myself it didn't exist
doused it with emotional gasoline and set it afire
dug it up
buried it deeper
nothing worked.
until he got the marriage counseling book.
suddenly, the list became harder to recall.
it was groovy, less pain, more connection.
unfortunately, when the second occurance happened (wrong name during sex) i was the one that became quiet and he abandoned the book and every thing he was doing that worked.

[noteworthy: the second time it happened, i didn't say a word, neither did he. it was the first time in the history of our relationship that i was unable to communicate. when i stumbled, he didn't catch me]




OneMarriedGuy said:


> For communication try this....


the tips you give are very similar to the counseling book that was helping. 
after the second time (wrong name during sex) i deleted the book (an E-book) in a moment of extreme disappointment and anger that he dropped it like a hot potato.
a week later he went into the recycle bin and got it back.
a week and a half went by and he never even looked at it.
we still were barely speaking.
it was like me being sick with starvation
him seeking and finding food
then refusing to help me get it in my mouth.
it sent the message "i can do this, i just don't want to"

possibly a childish irritation on my part: he has spent countless hours on a video game instead.




the feedback is a blessing and i appreciate it.
i'm sure he will too, he's working nights and hasn't had a chance to get back here yet.


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## OneMarriedGuy (Apr 5, 2010)

SG-W you sound a bit like me in your thinking process. If so these things will hit home pretty well.

You want to be able to mathematically add up the and get the answers. 
It drives you up a wall when your mate won't give you the info you so desire to help you make your calculations. 
You tend to obsess on and analyze every possible combo that could exist.
It makes you feel that your spouse is so very uninterested in your relationship that they don't feel the need to resolve things right away.
It makes you feel unloved that your spouse knows you are in pain and yet seems to be nonchalant about it if it means they may have to change something they like doing or a way they like to behave
While in normal circumstances you are not a "searcher" of their private things, in a crisis, you become a bloodhound - you simply need facts!

While I can't help a lot of what is going on, and still feel some of my feelings are valid... I can tell you I am now on medication to help me not to obsess so much. I am truly grateful for it. It helps me not be as anxious around my spouse and lets things progress between us a bit more slowly than at my "got to fix it today" speed.

Just a thought...


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## OneMarriedGuy (Apr 5, 2010)

SG-H & SG-W

The way I got myself to keep going even when I thought my spouse was no longer on board with the program was this.

I found the "me" I wanted to be. Learned how I wanted that "me" to be towards my spouse. Put is my head that I would be an actor not a reactor.

An actor lives their lives according to what they believe is right. A reactor lives their lives in constant reaction to how others act. It is very hard to be an actor when you feel the other is not acting properly toward you. 

What this does is to help the process hold out when one or the other of you fails and doesn't behave their best. Because at least one of you is steadfast it gives the other the opportunity to pick up and get back with the program easier.

Learn to talk about problems instead of letting them fester ...BUT do it in a loving way! Do it not to change the other person but to allow them to understand the way their actions made you feel. Learn to listen not to be corrected but rather to see how your spouse thinks. So often my wife and I find that there was not a right or wrong to the whole incident at hand, rather that we approached it from two different sides that neither of us saw before.

It is hard, you will need reminders (one of the reasons I'm on here, trying to help others when my marriage is certainly not a pillar of example) to keep you on track. All I can say is that it is working, I see more hope than ever now. We have some big hurdles still to jump but I believe we are making each other feel loved now and that will be so important. I look forward to seeing her and am applying what I learn to my interaction with my kids as well. 

In the end you can not sustain this attitude for every with somebody if they don't start to change their reactions toward you. But be forewarned, habits are hard to break. The way you currently act with each other is a habit. It will take time and sometimes you will find yourself picking up the cigarettes again and saying to heck with it. Doesn't mean you failed, just means you didn't suceed ..yet. Throw the cigarettes out and try again  

btw...I think it is so kool that both of you are on here


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## DawnD (Sep 23, 2009)

I see where you said that you need your H to see that its possible to see that you are right. Is being right more important that getting to the bottom of it??

I also read that you are supposed to be "someone of his own" to talk to. But the truth is, that something is happening thats making him not want to talk to you. So in this case, he needs someone to sort it out with before talking to you. On the up side of that, once he gets to where he doesn't need the middle man anymore, you will be that person! Just because you aren't right now doesn't mean you won't ever be.

Lies can be for so many reasons that it gets hard for us women to understand. You lie out of embarrassment, anger, fear and a whole other list of things. Does it make it right? Of course not. But this is something that really needs to be worked through with the marriage counselor! Use the counselor for both of your needs. I saw you aren't seeing one now, so maybe you need to get one! No shame in that. We have been to one as well and it really opened my H's eyes to hear things from a third person.

Him not filling in the blanks for you shouldn't be seen as an opportunity for you to take the ball and run with it. That should be seen as him honestly not knowing the answer yet, and trying to talk it out without anger or frustration. If you are anything like me you will say right now "How could he NOT KNOW!!!" but it happens. There are a lot of things my H needs to ponder on for a bit and I was so surpised that when I didn't push, he came to me to talk it out. Sometimes he doesn't even understand WHAT he was thinking or why. Annoying, yes. Impossible, no.

I know a lot of people here recommend taking the marriage builders emotional needs survey. Both of you take it and share with each other so you know ( and have on paper) the needs your spouse feels you aren't meeting. I think that would be a great thing for you guys. I have taken with the H as well, and it helped me understand a lot about him. Doesn't take too long and I do believe you can print it off and just see where your partner feels the strongest and needs the most. 

I do have a feeling that you two are going to be fine, you are just having a hard time getting through a crises. But thats how you truly see each other, by actions during a crises. Best of luck to the both of you and keep posting if it helps ( even just to vent)


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## stupid guy (Apr 25, 2010)

DawnD said:


> I see where you said that you need your H to see that its possible to see that you are right. Is being right more important that getting to the bottom of it??


oh my, no way.
i don't WANT to be right about the issue, but i'm wondering who in his right mind could deny the possibilty, given the various complications in his life involving her since their divorce.

oh my, yes, i hope i'm wrong about there being a deep issue involving the ex wife. 
i definately want to believe it's a fluke.
but i base decisions on what is.
and these things about the ex....they are what they are.
she shouldn't be in attendance unless it involves the kids, yet she is.

i definately don't believe it's abnormal in any way for me to wonder why she is, want rid of her, and feel the need to bloodhound for a solution.

what i wish he'd say i'm right about is that ...anything's possible.

our minds can use all sorts of tricks to hide information about experiences that aren't pleasant, and all the feelings that go along with it.




DawnD said:


> I also read that you are supposed to be "someone of his own" to talk to. But the truth is, that something is happening thats making him not want to talk to you. So in this case, he needs someone to sort it out with before talking to you. On the up side of that, once he gets to where he doesn't need the middle man anymore, you will be that person! Just because you aren't right now doesn't mean you won't ever be.


i understand that i'm not.
and that someday i could be.
i'm just incredibly open - i admit it hurts because i should be.



DawnD said:


> Lies can be for so many reasons that it gets hard for us women to understand. You lie out of embarrassment, anger, fear and a whole other list of things. Does it make it right? Of course not. But this is something that really needs to be worked through with the marriage counselor! Use the counselor for both of your needs. I saw you aren't seeing one now, so maybe you need to get one! No shame in that. We have been to one as well and it really opened my H's eyes to hear things from a third person.


i believe there are plenty of reasons for lies, but no excuses.
lying is a completely selfish act because the liar takes into account only his own feelings and seperates one couple into two people in the blink of an eye.
i know, as i've said, i've done some really foolish things in my life...
lying can also become a habit, but so can being selfish.
when the person you married makes a habit of loving themself more than they love you, i think it's okay to question why, if they realize it, if they like it that way or if they want help to change it.
i'd like to think that if i slipped into such selfish habits that he'd help me save me from myself, or at least ask me at length if i wanted to be saved.



DawnD said:


> Him not filling in the blanks for you shouldn't be seen as an opportunity for you to take the ball and run with it. That should be seen as him honestly not knowing the answer yet, and trying to talk it out without anger or frustration. If you are anything like me you will say right now "How could he NOT KNOW!!!" but it happens. There are a lot of things my H needs to ponder on for a bit and I was so surpised that when I didn't push, he came to me to talk it out. Sometimes he doesn't even understand WHAT he was thinking or why. Annoying, yes. Impossible, no.


i don't see it as an opportunity, my emotions do, the ones that fend off pain. 
some things in me seem automatic, i don't like them. 
but being the bloodhound that i am, i work on them daily.

i actually think the bloodhound in me helps more than it hinders.
of course, in certain areas, or used unwisely, it can hurt as well.

it is helping to vent.
alot.


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## Harvard (Aug 11, 2009)

well, a lot of drama here. I can say I have never done this during sex but in a fight it has slipped a few times over the years. 

Our minds are tricky but if it happened to me I would be bothered too. Let your spouse know you had a brain fart, all you can do buddy. she needs to let it go if she believes you do not still love her.


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## DawnD (Sep 23, 2009)

It would make sense to wonder about him denying the possibility, but if you look at it from his side, that could be mistaken with you telling him how he feels. ( its a stretch, but it could be lol) I certainly feel the fact that there is something underlying, unfortunately the only thing we have is that he read some of a book and felt bad about how he treated her. I completely agree with there being an issue, just having trouble pinpointing what it might be. 

Is his ex around a lot in person?? Other than when kid stuff comes up??


I know it hurts to know that he won't talk to you. Pushing won't work and it honestly might only make him say things he doesn't mean. I have pushed my husband so far before that he actually told me " why don't you tell me what I am supposed to say so you'll just leave me alone". That was YEARS ago but I still remember it. And I felt horrible. So definately don't make my mistakes lol.

Completely okay to question your SO loving themself more than you. But then again, you have to love yourself first. His actions should be more geared towards you for sure. But have you talked about what kinds of things you enjoy him doing for you or to help you? Vice versa as well, but a good way to start this is to sit down and both of you make a list of what the other person does that makes you feel special. Even if its things that haven't been done in years, or never. Make another list of things that make you feel badly. Obviously lying is going to be one of yours. And the whole name issue will be at the top also. But show each other what hurts and what helps. The H and I have gotten to a point where we don't have to sit down and make lists anymore, but we do sit and talk about hey, anything I should be doing for you that I'm not?? 

You don't have to answer this, but I just thought I would ask. Feel free to say its too personal. Are you scared to be intimate with him since the name thing happened?


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## stupid guy (Apr 25, 2010)

he started the book he gave it up
he started this thread he gave it up
he starts things to keep me hanging i think, give me hope, then walks away

he read something on the internet recently that said a newage theory in resolving marital problems is to NOT talk about them
that was right up his alley so we talk even less than before now

i'm terrified for him to touch me but i let him when i'm strong enough to do it without flinching
and i give him sexual gratification on days i'm strong enough to fake it
the whole time sick to my stomach, waiting for it to happen again
it's really not worth the heartache though
it feels exactly like suffering
i'm pretty sure he can sense some of that, he's not stupid
but he keeps quiet
hoping that i'll get over it and get used to sex again "in time"

and i shut up too so he can have his peace and quiet
but that's a fake too
i'm still in pieces
he knows it, he just chooses to look the other way

so now i'm just like him, quiet with a forced smile
so if there was ever a doubt my mind that he's faking his love or our marriage
now there is none
cause i see what it takes to be this way

faking it isn't easy for me
mentally
emotionally
or sexually
but hey, as long as he's happy

i pretty much give up
i don't want to divorce
but i'd give my eye teeth to be over him
i work on it everyday now instead

you can't fix problems if you can't talk about them
and i realized yesterday i don't have a chance in hell as we were talking about his teenage son sneaking behind his back smoking when he told me "i'd rather him do it behind my back" so he doesn't have to face it or deal with it.

i was sick when he said that but i kept quiet.
at that moment it finally hit me.
he prefers to keep problems hidden.
it's easier for him that way.
and i can't make him change that.
and i'm done trying.
i simply don't believe that real love allows for his type of disregard.

after three years, i'm waving the white flag.

there's no hope here i think.
for the marriage maybe, but not an intimate one, not a close one, and definately not an honest one.

thanks for your help though.


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