# Here is a big ? for the women here really hope to see some talk on it



## beninneedofhelp (Nov 24, 2009)

Ok in a separation to a possible divorce why is it so hard for a women to accept that her man has really changed when she sees the changes even?. Why is it so hard for them to want to try it when there is real changes and why does the hole im scared to get hurt thing come in when no matter what there is always that chance to be hurt with any situation at any given time??

And most importantly what is the best way to get around that is it truely giving her space or time alone or what is best to get through or past that wall of iron will and set determination??
And i mean this in all cases and exspecially those that when the women seems set on doing it but drags her feet the hole way doing nothing at all about filing just lets things sit with no contact and not filing or anything else .. I mean mine dont even go out she just sits home with the kids and works but is spending more time with her family.. What should i think of that as well ?But really how does a man get around that wall if there is any advise id love to hear about it


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## beninneedofhelp (Nov 24, 2009)

hopefully this post gets some real insight but then again its a question or set of questions that may be tough to answer on


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## jessi (Feb 11, 2009)

People not just women have a hard time putting their emotions out on the limb in case they get hurt again.
read the 5 languages of love by gary chapman. see what your wife is needs, do things that she needs and see if the wall doesn't come down.....good luck.....
remember this will take time and only 1 person can do this, you will be so happy you did


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## wantingmore (Nov 24, 2008)

maybe joint counseling will help you guys. 
i know in my case I wanted a break because I was tired of tryung and getting no where. I wanted space for us both to decide where to go from here.
When a guy has changed and wants his wife back, we always think the change is just for a bit and after awhile everyone will settle back into there old ways. So part of that needing space is to decide if we have it in us to get on that roller coaster again. Especially if we have been trying so hard.


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## beninneedofhelp (Nov 24, 2009)

well got some good posts in here just didnt get much love but i am happy to say i think wantingmore made something a bit more clear to me i just wonder how long the roller coaster can be i guess that depends on a lot of things


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## DawnD (Sep 23, 2009)

yep, wantingmore said it beautifully. Women can see change in their husbands, but have severe doubts about it being permanent if it hasn't been before. My H has that down pat. Change for about a month or so, then right back to where we were. 
The only advice is to stick to your changes, and she may very well be waiting to see if it is going to be for good or just for a while. I would definately ask her if that seems to be what is happening in her mind!


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## themrs (Oct 16, 2009)

I agree with wantingmore and Dawn. Last year my husband made some amazing changes. He wanted me to be ecstatic, but I was waiting for the bottom to fall out. He was disappointed in my lack luster response to his improvements.

But another part of me was thinking why should I give him praise for things he should have been doing all along? I know everyone needs encouragement, but why should I give someone a high five for coming home at night or spending time with their own kids?


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## triton1984 (Nov 20, 2009)

themrs said:


> I agree with wantingmore and Dawn. Last year my husband made some amazing changes. He wanted me to be ecstatic, but I was waiting for the bottom to fall out. He was disappointed in my lack luster response to his improvements.
> 
> But another part of me was thinking why should I give him praise for things he should have been doing all along? I know everyone needs encouragement, but why should I give someone a high five for coming home at night or spending time with their own kids?


On one hand I understand where your coming from but on the other I have to ask do you want him to continue in the current pattern and if so what harm would some encouragement do? Amazes me how many obstacles and walls we put up in our marriages....we want our spouses to do certain things and when they attempt to do them we are mad or indifferent that they haven't done them sooner. 

One of the most important things I read was a simple comment.... to treat our spouse at least as good as we treat our friends. It is sad that the person we have been the most intimate with....gets cut less slack than a good friend.


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## artieb (Nov 11, 2009)

themrs said:


> But another part of me was thinking why should I give him praise for things he should have been doing all along?


Because he's finally figured it out?



> I know everyone needs encouragement, but why should I give someone a high five for coming home at night or spending time with their own kids?


Because you want him to keep doing it. Don't think about the distant past: think about what's going on _right now_, and what will happen tomorrow. If he's doing things that make you happy, _thank him_ for doing it.

You can live in the past when he was unsatisfying to you, but that comes at the cost of living in a future which you'll like better. You've got a choice between exacting justice for every shortcoming he's ever had, or letting that go and aiming toward a happier future.

If it's the happier future you want, then absolutely, positively, encourage behavior you like by expressing thanks and otherwise rewarding it.

If you focus on the past, or you ignore the effort he's making, all you'll being doing is making him regret his decision to come home and spend time with his family. If he regrets that decision enough, next time he might make a different one.


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## themrs (Oct 16, 2009)

I'm not talking about what I SHOULD do or what I even did for that matter. With my own children I have adapted a philosphy of praising the behavior I like and ignoring the behavior I don't like. I do the same thing for my husband.

It doesn't negate my feelings about praising someone for something they should have been doing all along. It's an obvious fact of life that we get more with honey than we get with vinegar. I'm not disputing that at all. I'm simply answering the questions posed by the OP and giving some insight about how a person might FEEL about having to give a grown adult a pat on the back for picking up their own socks or paying a bill on time. 

Furthermore, if these praise-worthy actions were prompted only by the prospect of separation or divorce it becomes even more unlikely in my mind that the "changed" partner will keep up this good behavior in the long term. As soon as things become comfortable again, the "changed" partner suddenly begins to revert back to their old habits because the truth is they only made the adjustments so they could keep things the same. Once they have the partner back around for a significant period of time, it's safe to just do what they were always doing until the next time they have to make temporary adjustments to appease their partner.


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## sisters359 (Apr 9, 2009)

> giving some insight about how a person might FEEL about having to give a grown adult a pat on the back for picking up their own socks or paying a bill on time.


Yep. Who wants to be mommy to her husband? I don't want or need any praise for being an adult; thank you. That would be condescending. 

And also: if someone only "changes" b/c I threaten to leave, does he actually love me? Or does he just fear being alone? If he loves me, why weren't my expressed needs/desires "good enough" reason for change before? Frankly, I realized I didn't care if my husband changed--he clearly did not love me very much if my expressed needs, etc., meant nothing to him without a threat. 

Just my point of view!!


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## beninneedofhelp (Nov 24, 2009)

well i see there are more posts here now and see some posts that seem to be very unforgiving i guess is the best way to say it.. But i got to ask is there not a chance the spouse just didnt understand or see it till he got hit in the head with a anvil ?? I mean wow am i the only person that might not have seen the hints or something or is there some other reason the divorce rate is so high in this country?
but here is something for those that dont think a threat sometimes is the wake up call someone may need sometimes it takes less but a lot of people seem to be caught not understanding things till they have to sit down and really evaluate and that ussually happens cause of lack of communication skills.. i was asking how to get around them walls if there was a way but seems some people dont no how to truely forgive maybe and might not see what might actually happen if they did but for those that just posted saying why wasnt it enough before without a threat or things of that nature read this and try to take this into consideration as well cause sometimes all people are blind to the obvious till something tragic happens to them to WAKE UP and then change happens
a little peice from mort fertel you might no of him


Hi Benjamin,
A woman who just discovered that her husband
cheated on her for many years recently asked me a
great question.
She said, "My husband apologized 100 times,
stopped his affair, and is committed to being a
new man. I see he's changed. But wouldn't I be
better off divorcing him and starting fresh with
someone new?"Besides im scared of being hurt again.
I can understand her point of view.
Right now in her marriage there's so much pain,
baggage, and a mountain of hurt to heal. The same
is probably true in your marriage, whether the
issue is infidelity or something else like trust or verbal abuse.
Is it possible to come back once the trust is
broken? Benjamin, can you heal from your
ordeal? Or maybe it just makes sense to just
start over with someone else?
Most victims of infidelity (and other emotional
hardships) believe that they'll be safer in a
relationship with someone who never cheated on
them or hurt them. I completely understand this
FEELING. However, the OPPOSITE is most likely true.
In the case of the woman above, it appears that
her husband really changed. And I've seen many
people transform themselves after getting the "I
want a divorce" wake up call. Unless her husband
is a pathological liar or a sex addict, he's LESS
LIKELY to make the same mistake again compared to
someone whose track record is clean or only had a short
break in time from it once or twice before. In other
words, once a spouse learns their lesson, they're
LESS vulnerable to make the same mistake than
someone who's never erred in that way before.
According to a 1998 survey by researchers at the
University of Chicago, about 25 percent of
married men and 17 percent of married women in
the United States ADMIT to having been
unfaithful. The noted author Shirley Glass'
research suggests it is probably closer to 25
percent of women and 40 to 50 percent of men!
That means that starting from scratch gives the
above woman a 50% chance of finding another
husband who will be faithful.And if your spouse is 100%
faithful then you got something most do not get in life.
Now let me ask you this, at this point
in this woman's husband's life, given all he's
been through and learned, what are the chances
that he'll screw up again? If this woman gave him
another chance, what's the likelihood that he'd
make the same mistake that almost caused him to
lose his family years before? In my opinion, it's
dramatically less than 50%. In fact, I think it's
slim to none providing he has had enough time away
to actually see and understand im not talking one or two
weeks but a month or more so he reflects in a true manor..
Let me clarify that I'm talking in this case
about a man who truly transformed himself and
succeeded to prove that he's changed. I'm NOT
talking about someone who continually makes empty
promises.
If this woman were to leave her husband, I think
Las Vegas would give her LOWER odds that this
sort of thing would never happen to her again.
Here lies an unfortunate irony. People wait years
and years for their spouse to wake up and change
their ways. Then when they finally do it, they're
told it's too late.
I understand why someone would feel, after being
cheated on, for example, that "it's too late."
But the fact of the matter is that they're about
to walk away from a person who is FINALLY
prepared to be a wonderful loving spouse and might
be the one person they really do click with in life.
In my experience, it's these people, people who
have made serious mistakes, people who have had
the harshest wake up calls, who become the BEST
spouses and are capable, more than anyone else,
of forging the MOST fulfilling relationships.
Do you see the irony here?
The mistakes that ruin relationships are those
that transform the sinners into people capable of
the most outstanding relationships. The
unfortunate thing for the victim is that they
don't know how to heal from the hurt that would
enable them to reap the benefit of their ordeal.
So the roles become reversed. The person who was
ruining the relationship stands ready to
transform it; while the person who wanted to work
on the relationship all along becomes the cog in
the wheel that inhibits true love.
In other words, the woman above has a choice. If
she lets her husband go, he'll most likely fall
in love with another woman and treat her like a
queen. He'll be the husband to his new wife that
the woman above always wanted him to be to her.
I've seen it happen way to often in my job. Some lucky
women owes a poor victim a lot of gratitude. But this
woman has another option. She could forgive her
husband and become that lucky woman!
The question is: how do you heal from your
ordeal? How do you forgive? How do you get to the
head-space where you're able to give your spouse
another chance? Its not always easy for some but its worth it.


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## themrs (Oct 16, 2009)

beninneedofhelp said:


> well i see there are more posts here now and see some posts that seem to be very unforgiving i guess is the best way to say it.. But i got to ask is there not a chance the spouse just didnt understand or see it till he got hit in the head with a anvil ?? I mean wow am i the only person that might not have seen the hints or something or is there some other reason the divorce rate is so high in this country?
> but here is something for those that dont think a threat sometimes is the wake up call someone may need sometimes it takes less but a lot of people seem to be caught not understanding things till they have to sit down and really evaluate and that ussually happens cause of lack of communication skills.. i was asking how to get around them walls if there was a way but seems some people dont no how to truely forgive maybe and might not see what might actually happen if they did but for those that just posted saying why wasnt it enough before without a threat or things of that nature read this and try to take this into consideration as well cause sometimes all people are blind to the obvious till something tragic happens to them to WAKE UP and then change happens
> a little peice from mort fertel you might no of him


It's hard to forgive someone who you feel can not understand how much they truly hurt you. Most people can forgive, they just don't want you to forget what they forgave. 

Making amends and changing the behavior is a huge part of the healing process, but knowing that the person really understands why you were upset in the first place is also a part of it. No one wants to think their partner is only changing to avoid divorce. Maybe I'm alone, but I'd like to think any positive changes my husband makes he makes because HE wants to be a better man for himself - not just morph into what he thinks my idea of a better man is. There is a distinction.


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## beninneedofhelp (Nov 24, 2009)

Id agree with that, that is why i put the letter from mort fertel in there its saying when someone truly changes not just a act or show but sometimes it does come from the I want a divorce wake up call> but also leaves a person that is hurt like that with walls and fears that are tough to get around and leaves them with a serious choice if they see it. My situation stands at that point i feel , i no the changes i have made are life long and she sees them but fears me reverting back and is unforgiving and sees me with resentment when she looks at me and such , my question was more on how does one get around them walls and reconnect emotionally to build on again and maybe get that last chance 
for i for one have two beautiful kids that need us both and i am not ready to give up on that either otherwise it be easier to walk away right now and just give up when most probably would have by this point i have not, i dont want a last chance to be a lost chance

And if you dont mind id appreciate your take on my latest thread in general its long but i had a lot happen in the last couple days that im not sure how to take it right now cause i almost did just that give up that day, and all though you may not no the hole story its all here but its a long story since i have posted a lot on my situation on my threads.. 
Im maybe in that small percentage that actually truly changed for the right reasons and is willing to go the distance if there is hope but id like to here what you would say on this and my thread in general cause you sound like you have a hardened heart to this type of thing or once did in the past and your views may help me soften the wall i cant seem to figure out or maybe i did some how with the latest events but im not sure what or how it happened if it did and im not sure how to take the latest , funny how you can view others situations clear headed but not your own at times...
but i have done everything i can to be a better person friends family and people in general can see it even the wife but still wont lower her walls and open the door a little bit ,but i no she wants to as well and that too is explained in my threads but to make it short i have a person that is in contact with her as a mutual friend that lets me no what she says and for some reason she opened up to her when she was a total stranger and talks with her a lot even calls her when she is troubled and that too had gone cold till recently then suddenly picked back up then died for a week or two then suddenly she called again a few times over the last couple days a lot , very confusing im not even sure if i should think on things no more but i feel i must for im trying to save a family being together and with two young kids i need to be there for them and for the wife as they deserve just regret i didnt see it the way i do now.


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## themrs (Oct 16, 2009)

I don't know your wife. If it were me, the grand gesture would do it. I'd be more likely to think he was for real this time if he were to do something that I had been telling him I wanted to do for years that he never did. I'm not talking about simple every day things. I mean something over the top romantic and thoughtful that proves your love. 

Other than that, the only thing that will break down the emotional walls she has built us is time.


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