# Is there any chance for us?



## raising5boyz (Nov 8, 2008)

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This may be on the long side as there was a lot involved. I have posted before, and it may be somewhat different in facts as that is what I knew then, and this is what I know now. 

Here we go! I will try to stay with the short version...

We have been married 3 1/2 years. We were both very happy...except for the many small lies he told...things like he wasn't smoking when he was...small lies about spending habits...and other stupid non-significant lies he told. I always knew deep down that he was lying, but ingnored it to skip the fight.

In July he was working at a house where some teenage girls lived with their parents...he ended up being charged with "communicating with a minor for immoral purposes" and "assualt 4 (for allegedly hugging and tickling her)". He did not tell me about the charges. I was clueless and knew nothing until Nov when he came home one day and said he wasn't happy and moved out. 10 days later I caught him with another woman that had moved into the house he was renting with him (mind you, he was telling me there was no one else and that we would work out our problems and be back together soon). I lost it and assualted him and went to jail for the night...he was also arrested that night for the warrants that were issued regarding the charges from July. That is when I learned about the charges. Soon thereafter I accessed an email account of his that I didn't know about and found A LOT of emails to other women...including prostitutes...asking for sex. This emails were from Sept and Oct. I was shocked and devasted. Because of the assualt, there were restraining orders put into affect that made it so we could have no contact with each other. I proceeded with divorce papers (will be final in 3 weeks). There were many hurtful, angry things that were said and passed through other people. A week and a half ago we broke the restraining orders and started talking. That was the first time we had talked since this all happened. He finally appologized...he cried...he gave some explanations. He said when he got the charges he was so affriad to tell me about them, and so sure that our marriage would end that he opted no to tell me, and then started searching for someone to take my place. He says he has always been afraid to be alone, and so he was searching for someone new. He has since admitted that he did meet up with one hooker for a BJ and that he has also slept with his ex wife a couple of times since we seperated. He admitted to flirting with many women during our marriage, but swears that until the last two months of our marriage that he was faithfull. He says that the accusations by the 17 year old were completely false...that there were some inappropriate comments made in her presence, but that they were not directed to her. 

Now what??? I have been so hurt by all of this...read my other post to get a more complete picture. I still love him so much...I'm not getting over him at all yet...he was a wonderful, and I mean wonderful, husband and father until the very end. In some ways I want to just forgive and forget, and chalk it all up to him running scared in the end, but it is a lot to deal with.

I'm sure this is jumbled jibberish, so please feel free to ask questions.

Is there any chance to work through this? Oh...and let me add...some of his confesions only came after he pledged to do anything I asked to fix this, and I requested a lie detector test...then he admitted the things he admitted...that was 3 days ago...but tonight is when he admited to sleeping with his ex-wife. Is there still more admissions to come?


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## raising5boyz (Nov 8, 2008)

Anyone??? Advice PLEASE???!!!


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## flipflopchic (Jan 28, 2009)

I always believe in trying everything before divorce. But, their is a side of me screaming to leave him. That is ALOT of lies and deception.

I had a very difficult time breaking up with my daughter's biological father. I started that conversation several times. The last time he cried, really cried; and my heart went out to him. But, leaving him was the second best decision of my life. 

Trying everything means trying counseling. From what you have said, it sounds like he would agree to anything. 

Please don't get offended........have you asked him to get an STD test? I would be present during the entire test and it would be a doctor of my choosing. Results would be sent to me per his approval, which he would give at the doctor's office. 

Wishing your family lots of healing.


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## raising5boyz (Nov 8, 2008)

I have gotten checked recently, and he will be seeing the doc next week.

This is a huge amount of deception and hurt to get over. I have no idea what to think. Part of me wants to run and part of me wants to hug and hold him and help him overcome his issues. I think that this is possibly an actual sex addiction of some type. I don't know. He seems to be so sincere about wanting to fix his problems and be the father and husband that the kids and I deserve. He seems so sincerely sorry about the hurt and damage he has caused. He says the time he was away from me was the most miserable time of his life and that he knows it is his fault that we are at the point we are at. He is taking responsibilty for his actions (possibly for the first time in his life) and is wanting to repair the damage the best that he can. 

SO *C O N F U S E D*!!!


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## flipflopchic (Jan 28, 2009)

If you do decide to take him back.........I would make certain he understand the extremely tight rope he would be walking and that there would be NO more chances. 

If he messes up one more time, no matter how small.........it's just too much of a pattern. No more excuses.


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## jaclynnbaker (Jan 30, 2009)

I am very much against divorce for any reason. I feel that there are acceptable reasons that are laid out in the bible, but I am still careful in suggesting divorce even in these cases. This includes non-support (abandonment) and infidelity. You have these in this situation. The main thing for you to consider (because OBVIOUSLY THIS PERV IS NOT, though is those boys. They do not need to be around, muchless RAISED by a man like this! Our children model our behavior. You would basically be raising little perverts! The issues with the minor girls, that is just disgusting! I mean, do your kids know about all of this? I hope not, but how would they feel about bringing a girlfriend home to meet mom and dad knowing dad is into girls?? It is just one of those things with me. That crosses the line. I can forgive and forget alot, but messing around with little girls is totally disgusting and I can't see how you would even CONSIDER talking to him muchless bringing him back into your lives. I would keep him as far away from my kids as possible. Cut all ties and tell him to have a nice life. Sorry....that is just me.


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## MrsVain (Feb 1, 2009)

i am also very much against divorce, but actually in the process of considering it myself so i dont feel like i can preach.

the only thing i can say is those are big issues to deal with. do you honestly think you can live with it and put the boys thru that? have you checked the police report from the charges? you already admitted he lies, can you believe him about that? once that trust is broken, and now that you know, it is hard to just put it behind you. You will be forever questioning is he cheating. when he is late, when is he online, when he is working on another house with women or in his case girls. does he have to register as a sex offender, can you live with that. having the state and all your neighbors knowing he is on sex offender list? can your children deal with that?

Plus, he already told you he cant be alone. okay. so he prefers to be with you, but if not you then just about anyone will do. can you handle knowing that? 

it is good that he seems to be trying, and only time will tell. but dont be surprised when he goes back to his old ways. people tend to give up when it gets too hard.

godd luck and god bless.


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## StrongEnough (Nov 25, 2008)

I would think long and hard before you make a decision to allow him back into your life. Make him prove himself to you. It might take a year or longer, who knows? Really consider the children now and what they have gone through since he left and ask yourself if you want to go that route again if in a month he is back to his old ways.


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## raising5boyz (Nov 8, 2008)

The consensus seems to be what I am already feeling....marriage is very important, but this one may be past saving. If I want to feel it out for a while, how should I proceed? I feel as though only time and his actions can help this situation...so the divorce is supposed to final in 3 weeks...go through with it or postpone it? He is willing to sign a post-nup of sorts that will state I will recieve everything in the event that our marriage ends, and will put an immediate parenting plan into affect that will greatly restrict his time with the one son we have together. His willingness to do that seems to be a good sign to me that he is serious about fixing his issues and doing what it takes to repair the damage he caused. This is very difficult and of course, there is way too much to write to state all the facts involved. I truly believe he is a wonderful man that went off the deep end bad. He has a super hard fight ahead of him to even begin to fix things....so how do I proceed?


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## voivod (Aug 7, 2008)

r5b...
is this the guy you took out the craigslist ad about???


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## raising5boyz (Nov 8, 2008)

Hello again...it's been a busy week, and I finally got back on here.

Voivoid: Yes, he is the one I posted on craigslist about...and had an ebay listing about.


Updates: I think he is sincere. He is going to counseling, and reading all the self help books he can get his hands on. He is going to church and meeting regularly with the bishop. He is willing to let me install a "watchdog" type program on our computers that will make it so I can see everything he does online. He is signing a post-nup that will make it so if our marriage ends, whether by my choice or his, I will get EVERYTHING, minus his clothes and one vehicle, and includes a parenting plan that I chose for our son. These actions alone make me feel more comfortable with postponing the divorce. The time he will be spending in jail will be the time that I decide what I want. My judgment is too clouded at the moment...I will be seeing my own personal counsel starting this week, and we had our first marriage counseling session last Thursday. After just one session, I think the reality is....am I willing to risk going through this again? 

I can feel myself starting to feel indifferent, and I know from my first marriage/divorce and from reading in these forums, that those feelings are me letting go, giving up, and coming closer and closer to moving on...and maybe that is what should happen.


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## Ryley01 (Jan 2, 2009)

Well.After reading your post, I feel terrible for you.Like many of the above posters, I am not always for divorce either, but after reading some of the things that your husband has done to you, I have to say that giving this man a second chance would be a terrible mistake.I say pick yourself up, dust yourself off, and move on.Wouldn't it be nice to have a stress free life on your own with your kids?


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## raising5boyz (Nov 8, 2008)

Update: I have been to two marriage counselors, and a personal counselor now...much to my surprise...they are saying that this marriage can be fixed and repaired. They are saying the best way to accomplish this is to have him living in our home together. They say the kids will be fine, that it is better for them to see an attempt to reconcile (even it it ends eventually) then to live with him leaving so suddenly. That the pain from the abandonment will be more difficult than what they are going through now with him trying to fix what he messed up. One of my closest friends won't even speak to me right now because "I am exposing my kids to that man again". I was thinking maybe she was right until I heard the counselors views of it. The other thing the counselors are saying is...that he needs to get evaluated by a psychiatrist for sexual addiction, and that we have ALOT of strengths in our marriage, and that his willingness to seek help and finally completely confess and take full responsibility is very important and shows them his commitment to fixing his issues once and for all. 

Please, feel free to express your feelings and insight to this. I am still a mess of confusion. They also told me I am putting too much weight on this decision. That just because I am willing to work on it, does not mean I am willing or even should be willing to accept his apologies, or give him an answer to the ending or saving the marriage. They said that decision does not need to be made today or anytime soon. That came as a relief to me, as I had felt I was giving a yes or no to our marriage, and I don't feel ready for that yet. The only thing I'm giving a definite yes to right now is trying to fix things, and not getting a divorce yet. 

Make any sense? All insight and comments are appreciated.


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## been through it all 2008 (Feb 9, 2009)

I understand how you must feel. It must be very hard going through all that you are going through. I don't believe in divorce, even though have came very close several times. I don't blame you at all for his deeds/sins. He is responsible for his own actions. I would like to know though how things were between you before this came to be. Did you let him know how wonderful he was on a daily basis? or did you make sure he knew how disappointed you were? did you give him an encouraging word, or did you make sure he knew he failed again? Were you always riding him for something or did you reach out then to hug and hold him? did you show him you loved him by doing things for him or were you telling him what you wanted done? I could go on, but you get my point. A man's ego is so much a part of who he is and if he felt that he always did everything wrong, never good enough, never saw your smile, then he may have grown frustrated. The reason I am saying this is also because no matter how wicked our husbands are, what they do that disappoint us, we should never tell our moms, dads, friends, neighbors, etc. and we certainly shouldn't put an advertisement on ebay about what they have done. I don't remember his name, only the picture vaguely, which is good. Other people knowing about a man's secrets, destroys their manlihood, their ego, who they are. So it's a good thing we don't see anyones real name on this forum. I do realize people need to talk, as I do, but if it would hurt the partner, it should be done in secret. I think you should give him another chance, but be willing to let go of what he has done when he is back home. I wouldn't talk about it to the kids, to your relatives, to your friends if it is negative towards your husband. Build him up, tell him he is great. After awhile he will want to live up to that wonderful man, and after all we women have alot of flaws too!


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## raising5boyz (Nov 8, 2008)

I always praised him for what a wonderful father and husband he was. He was told over and over again how satisfied I am was in bed. I constantly told him how lucky I felt to be his wife. If anything, I think my praise of him may have made it more difficult to come to me about the charges he was facing.

As for the ebay listing, it was not my best move, but in my defense, it did not say his last name, and I did not send the link to his family and friends as I had thought about. It also was removed after 2 days of a 7 day listing. It was definitely done out of hurt and anger.

There are a lot of people that have been told about what he has done by myself or by him. I had never spoken negatively about him to my family or friends until he made it clear we were done. And even then, it was for support, not out of maliciousness. It is amazing though, the same people who were most disappointed and disgusted are the same people who are welcoming him back with open arms and are willing to give him the support he needs. He is a lucky man to have so many people who care about him and want to see him change for the better.

I also believe that others knowledge of his actions has helped him to realize he is still loved and has helped him face how serious his issues are.

As for the kids, they were told enough to understand that they had NO fault in him leaving, and to understand that we are trying to make our marriage work now.


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## been through it all 2008 (Feb 9, 2009)

I'm sorry I must have not been clear, and you must have misunderstood my point. With the ebay thing, I don't believe you told about the girls, so nothing of what I said was referring to that. Being a victim of child molestation by all means this behaviour needs to be reported. I too, have a block on my computer. The girl should have told and she should get help. Please don't misunderstand. The only thing I ask is you read what I wrote again, and see if from a point of view without the girl. All I am saying is that sometimes we as wives think what we do in our own eyes is ok, but what they do is terrible. We think we can make them change if we nag, but it brings negative results. We think if we tell everyone we know, how terrible our husband is they will see how rotten he is and feel for us. We do it to make ourselves feel better, but in the long run causes greater damage. Why do you think your friend is not talking to you because you are thinking about letting him go home? our friends, relatives, etc. mostly only hear the negative about our spouse so it paints a picture of how this man is and who this man is and it's not a pretty one. If men know you talk negatively about them it makes it even worse. Yet, if they hear you saying great things about them, they know their wife is special, because in her eyes he is wonderful. Believe it or not it makes a difference in his life how you see him as a man. If all he hears is negative and that is all you are telling others, then eventually he thinks he may as well become what you say he is. I don't mean any hard feelings. Everything he did was wrong. I know though, and have learned the hard way that a lot of (not all) problems maybe could have turned out differently if I could have seen some of the damage I had done. We can never change our spouses, it is impossible. Yet, we can change ourselves. Again, he is responsible for his own actions, and you are responsible for yours. Sometimes, the truth is what we NEED to hear, not what we want to hear. I feel for your pain. I really do. I hope it all works out for you and that you will have a blissful marriage!


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## raising5boyz (Nov 8, 2008)

Well...i don't think you have a clear picture of our marriage...I have never said anything negative about our marriage until he made it clear that he was done. At that point, I talked to others for support...not for them to feel sorry for me. I actually have a lot of trouble with sympathy. It's nice to know people care, but that is all. If you were to ask him if I am a nagger or if I belittled him, he would tell you no. I will not say I am perfect, and can be a complete biatch if I am having a really off moment (thus the ebay posting), but over all our marriage was very good. I appreciate the advice, but really cannot find any fault in what he chose to do. The only fault I had in that was that I made it clear I do not tolerate unfaithfulness, but even at that, here I am trying to understand how and why this all happened, and willing to work trough it.


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## moogvo (Dec 21, 2008)

First of all, I have to say that things aren't always what they seem... Thinking that a marriage will end and looking for a replacement just in case is a bit of a stretch. You look for a replacement car when you know yours isn't going to run for much longer, but a marriage is entirely a different thing.

As far as lies... I can tell you with certainty that lies are probably the most difficult of all things to deal with. They destroy the trust in a relationship. One of the vital things that are needed for a relationship to survive is trust.

Has he told you the truth? Maybe and maybe not. At this point, you will not believe that he has told you everything no matter what. You will always think that there is something else that is being kept a secret.

That said, I am also a proponent of making marriages work and really trying before throwing in the towel.

You should start with a talk. This talk should be even toned and not turn into a screaming contest. You should start by telling him that you are willing to give your marriage a chance, after all, the two of you got married until "Death do us part", not "for now because we have nothing better to do".

You will need to address him with your concerns. Explain that you can deal with the truth, but that you cannot ever deal with lies. Let him know that if he ever wants to earn your trust back, that he is going to have to be honest with you.

I told my wife that I was willing to try to work it out with her, but that any more lies would be the end no matter what.

The lies about smoking... Was he a smoker when the two of you met? The first thing I told my wife when we met was that I was not looking to be re-built and re-shaped into what someone else thought I should be. I told her very quickly that trying to make me quit smoking was not allowed. If I wanted or felt the need to quit, I would do it on my own.

I have a friend who has been dating a girl for about 4 months now. There are severe issues that he has with her. He told me that "if he could get beyond some of the things she has done in the past, then maybe he could shape her into the woman that he wants..."

Lemme tell ya REALLY quick on this one - We are who we are. I never agreed to be bent and/or shaped to fit someone else's needs or desires. We don't have the right to try to make our mate "who we would rather them to be" We all have habits. Usually bad ones that get under the skin of the other. Some of those habits may be rehabilitated, but by and large, you learn these habits and decide whether or not you can accept them and live happily with them. if not, then it is time to move on. This should take place in the dating process...

Now then, If your relationship is going to work, he is going to have to be willing to earn your trust back. You are going to have to be willing to allow him the opportunity to earn your trust. Understand that there are probably things about his sorded affairs that you will never know about. I am on the fence about whether or not it is okay to play around while separated... That one will have to be yours to decide on. Consider, however that if he did have an affair, take comfort on some level that he did it while the two of you were separated, rather than ping-ponging to each of you. Take refuge in the fact that he did not drag her into your bed (Physically or otherwise).

The incident with the girls that ended up in an arrest... This is still America... We are supposed to be presumed innocent until proven guilty. I have seen so many cases of false accusations that have turned marriages upside-down and even ended them entirely. Consider that this might be one of those times... Maybe it isn't. What do you feel deep in your heart?

I feel for you having to deal with all of this drama. The first step is to decide if you really want to work it out, and be willing to put the same 100% into it that you would expect him to. This has to be a 2-sided effort.

Good luck on this and please keep us up to date!

~Moog


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## MrsVain (Feb 1, 2009)

I repeat


MrsVain said:


> i am also very much against divorce, but actually in the process of considering it myself so i dont feel like i can preach.
> 
> the only thing i can say is those are big issues to deal with. do you honestly think you can live with it and put the boys thru that? have you checked the police report from the charges? you already admitted he lies, can you believe him about that? once that trust is broken, and now that you know, it is hard to just put it behind you. You will be forever questioning is he cheating. when he is late, when is he online, when he is working on another house with women or in his case girls. does he have to register as a sex offender, can you live with that. having the state and all your neighbors knowing he is on sex offender list? can your children deal with that?
> 
> ...



Can you live with a sexual offender? I dont think the children are going to be all that bad with abandonment since he is going to be gone while he is in jail anyway. do you want your kids growing up think being in jail is okay? visiting daddy in jail is okay? i personal dont think children should be allowed to see parents in jail, and have told my husband if he is in jail for any reason, he will not see his kids because they are not going. 

you might have alot of stong points in your marriage, but in my book someone who sexually propositions a child is not someone i want my children growing up around or being exposed to on a daily basis. 

But if you and your counselors think otherwise, then you dont need my advice.


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## f'nidiotneedshelp (Feb 1, 2009)

MrsVain said:


> I repeat
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I am the husband that is being referred to by raising5boyz. I would first like to let you know that I am NOT I repeat am NOT a sex offender. My kids will not have to come visit me in jail, I am going for 3 and a half weeks or so. My kids KNOW that being in jail is NOT ok, they also KNOW that when a person makes a mistake in life they need to do what is needed to right their wrongs, if that means Jail then so be it. As far as the "sexually propositions a child" comment... That was an ACCUSATION, I was not convicted of that, that charge was DROPPED... I was accused of Assault 4 for moving her out of my way, by putting my hands on her back and MOVING her aside so that I could get past her. The girl was making the sexual propositions to my employees and I, we ignored them to the best of our ability, other than when the guys and I made comments, NOT directed to the girl, with each other. At this point I would say you are correct we DON'T need your advice if this is the way you feel. I know that I have made a LOT of mistakes in my life, and in my marriage, but I am a man and I am doing what I need to do to right my wrongs and to move my life forward. My marriage is important to me, I haven't shown it, but truly it is. I would have been back here months ago, if I weren't afraid of going to jail for violating a restraining order. I know that I have a long road ahead of me in fixing my marriage, but I will tell you this right now, this will be the BEST road I have ever been down. So if being a man, realizing my wrong doings, trying to fix my life, and showing my kids that I can be a better father and husband is such a bad thing for them to be exposed to, then maybe you should step back and take a second look. I know that there is DEFINATELY a chance for us, all I have to do is fix me, she is willing to give me that chance, to fix my life, our life, and to show our kids that I can be a good person, and to be a good example for them. I know that in order to be a good example I need to be honest, loving, caring, compassionate, respectful, and a lot more.... I also know that I need to honor, cherish, respect, and love my wife 300% of the time. I am willing to do what it takes to be a good example for my kids and for the rest of my family. I hope that you are willing to understand that, if you aren't then personally I don't need to hear from you at all. Sorry if this post sounds rude, I am fiening for a smoke right now, and I am a bit ticked off at the last post. Please keep the comments coming so that we can feel the TRUE support that is out here for us. Thank You and may Heavenly Father Bless you in all you do.


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## MrsVain (Feb 1, 2009)

Well, you sure did put me in my place, right and that clears it all up. my mistake from mis reading the orginal post. 

and i am glad you got online to set me straight because that was my only concern for your wife and for your children.

I am glad you and her are trying to make it work. i give you kudos for that and for regonizing the hard work it is going to take to make your marriage work. and for putting it into action.

as far as my advice goes, if it dont fit, then dont take it. i never claimed to have the answers (i wouldnt be on this site posting my own issues if i did). The only thing i put on your wife's post is my concern that you were a sexual preditor and offender. other then that, i didnt say a word to any of her vents or issues. it is hard to put everything down and some things are far off the true mark. 

anyhow, you surely dont need me, and seems like i am the only person here to offend you. 

Good luck to the both of you.


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## raising5boyz (Nov 8, 2008)

Mrs Vain: Please feel free to post on my thread...I appreciate all advise I can get. I take what I think is good, leave what I think is bad, and comtemplate all in between! 

Moog: Thanks for the post. I don't beleive all the truth has come out yet. Even if all the events have been told, I have yet to get a satisfactory "Why". Maybe it shouldn't matter as much as I think it does. I just feel like if he can give me a why, then we can do things in our marriage to help prevent him from even thinking about straying again. Although I will not accept any responsibility for the affair, I do know that every marriage can be improved upon. Maybe he doesn't want to hurt my feelings and be honest with me. Maybe he really wasn't satisfied with our sex life. I was very pleased with it...but that doesn't mean he felt the same way. 

As for the smoking..he did smoke before we got marries...but had also claimed months before we moved in together that he had quit. Really, it's the lying that bothers me above all about it, and second it's the money spent on it....our finances cannot support the habit financially. Afterall, we were raising 9 kids on one income from a failing business.

He just told me today that it really bothers him when I make fun of myself. I am not a small, skinny woman. He has always said my weight doesn't bother him, and that I am beautiful, but I think he is feeding me a crock of crap and that my weight bothers him, and he wanted to enjoy someone with a smoking hot body...afterall, he said things like that in his emails to the women, that I read. He said so many things like he wasn't being satisfied at home, that he had a high sex drive and wasn't getting enough, that he wanted someone with a great body. Now he tells me he was just saying those things cause thats what other men were saying in their posts to woman...but I really believe that that is what he wants, and that I am not good enough to keep him satisfied. He admitted today that he did feel our sex life was lagging a little, and that he wanted a confidence boost, and to learn a few new things...so I guess thats what prostitutes are for? What the hell??? I am really wondering if he has the ability to be faithful...he was looking for months for other women...he met a few...claims to of only to done something with one....I just can't seem to believe what he says. The whole prostitute thing REALLY REALLY bothers me. It makes me so sick to my stomach...how can I ever trust him again? How can I let him go anywhere without me and believe his story??? 

As for wanting him to change...he lived a completely different lifestyle before we got married, but claimed to be sick of living that way, and said he was ready to live a real life, a religious life. He did a great job of it for 3 1/2 years that I know of. Now he claims to want that life again...honest, law abiding...etc. But seriously...what am I to believe? My counselor basically said I should stop doubting and ride the ride and see where it goes. 

But above all...the questions that keep coursing through my mind are..."Why didn't he love me enough? Why wasn't I good enough? Why didn't he just leave me and have his freedom that obviously he wanted? Why does he want me now? I am the smae person...the same size...the same looking...the same in bed...why would I be good enough for him now to be faithful to me???


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