# Old Men and Young Tail



## endlessgrief

Perhaps some of you men can get me to understand this ever growing fascination. Some men, when they and their wives begin to age and their wives are not so perky and gravity has taken its toll divorce their spouses for young hot girls. 

I understand the wanting of the young hot girls. But being of a certain age, one must question why. I imagine there is nothing to talk about. He mentions the Beatles and she says she hates bugs. You get my drift?

It seems these young girls like to go out with older men for their money. Do the men know this? Are they in denial? Donald Trump for instance is one of the grossest men I have ever seen and he has a beautiful young wife. If he wasn't Donald Trump and worked at Sears, would she still marry him? It all seems so shallow.

I know so many women, myself included, who exercise and do everything they can to stop the hands of time so our husbands won't leave us for a younger woman. How pathetic. 

I am 44 and find some younger men attractive, but I would not want to be with them because I still view them as kids. And if I date a guy who uses the word "awesome" over and over, I may just kill him.

What makes men beleive that a hot young thing is sexually attracted to their pot bellies, balding head, flat ass, droopy balls, and hair growing out of their ears. 

Our society is turning so vapid that I cannot watch regular TV anymore (I download Horror Movies and Heavy Metal). My husband of 20 years said that I put on a few pounds and is not attracted to me anymore. He says this as he is sitting there in his boxers, no tshirt, belly sticking out, greasy hair, uncut toenails, not bothering to shave so he looks like big foot. He says that he cannot get it up anymore due to his depression. Funny, I caught him two nights ago jerking off to ****** porn. I told him that the cure of male impotency is NEW PU**Y. Of this I have no doubt. 

What do you guys think? Men, are women who (god forbid) age, turn men off? And if so, is it the media? We are being bombarded with youth this and tight buns that. 

But these girls are in for a rude awakening when they hit 40. All those tatoos they get around their belly buttons are going to distort after having children or just aging. Their fake boobs are going to look ridiculous when they are 50, chasing around their children in curlers and a bath robe. Who is worse, the money grubbing young girl or the sleazy sex obsessed older man who just wants to enter the fountain of youth?


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## dubbizle

[I am a guy] I think it comes down to thinking that your are still seen as hot by somebody else besides your wife or husband and it just feeds the EGO.If you actually start dating somebody that is seen as hot then others start thinking you must have something going on if you can be older and still be with a hot body which again is an EGO thing.

I think a lot of people had the same opinion of themselves you talk about when they were younger and thought they where so hot and cool and were to good for anybody,but then life took over and they got knocked down a whole lot of pegs and get pissed off at the younger people who replaced them.

If you are rich or famous then its just people getting their needs met,the younger gal like the things they get and maybe publicity and the older guy always knows he can get another younger gal to show off with and have sex with which makes him stick out.

I should say my wife is 13 years older then I am and is still hot as hell at age 62[no kidding] and I still love when she comes homes and changes clothes so I can see her naked.


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## Gratitude

Old men and young tail? 

My father who is now remarried, began his affair with her when she was only 21, and he was 35 with two small children. She was immature and spiteful and blatantly told me to my face that if she couldn't have any children as he didn't want anymore, then neither would he. I haven't seen him for 12 years.

My husbands father who is 56 just married a lady from another country who is 25. So his step mother is younger than him. He's not the most comfortable man to be around anyway.

Messed up. I mean really, love? Give me a break. I'm sure there are a few cases out there AS ALWAYS, everything has an exception. I just think the whole things ridiculous. Just my own experience in life though, and I guess that's how we form our opinions.

That probably didn't have anything to do with the post did it. I've had my rant though


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## Kobo

Well there is a term for older women dating younger men so I would say it happens both ways. I'll also say that its not the norm.


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## Almostrecovered

not for me because I do value the ability to relate on many levels including shared generational values and experiences

the reasons I would think they do

1) status- having a trophy wife in some circles elevates your social standing 
2) sexual drive- younger women are fertile- now the older man may not want children but he has an instinctual drive to be attracted to young and fertile
3) ego- similar to status but feeding their own heads with the fact that they can attract younger women
4) fear of mortality- they wish to feel younger by being with someone younger


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## CandieGirl

What makes men beleive that a hot young thing is sexually attracted to their *pot bellies, balding head, flat ass, droopy balls, and hair growing out of their ears*. 

Our society is turning so vapid that I cannot watch regular TV anymore (I download Horror Movies and Heavy Metal). *My husband of 20 years said that I put on a few pounds and is not attracted to me anymore. He says this as he is sitting there in his boxers, no tshirt, belly sticking out, greasy hair, uncut toenails, not bothering to shave so he looks like big foot. He says that he cannot get it up anymore due to his depression. Funny, I caught him two nights ago jerking off to ****** porn.* I told him that the cure of male impotency is NEW PU**Y. Of this I have no doubt. 

But these girls are in for a rude awakening when they hit 40. All those tatoos they get around their belly buttons are going to distort after having children or just aging. Their fake boobs are going to look ridiculous when they are 50, chasing around their children in curlers and a bath robe. Who is worse, the money grubbing young girl or the sleazy sex obsessed older man who just wants to enter the fountain of youth?[/QUOTE]

:rofl:

I couldn't possibly begin to give MY opinion, but I just wanted to let you know that I laughed out loud at my desk...thanks for that, I needed it!

:lol:


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## Mistys dad

Maybe your question could be less hostile toward men and more questioning about their partners.

Many men hit the 40S and 50S and lose some of the financial burdens they carry. It is the first time since they were teenagers that they have that kind of freedom. More time, more money, more freedom, more motivation to do things.

The derisive term "mid-life crisis" was invented to explain what happens when a man decides that there is a life to be lived. Oh the horror, suddenly after decades in the grind, he wants to have some fun.

Now, take that man and put him with a woman that feels like she always wants to stay close to home. Once the nest is empty it is time to live quietly alone. A woman that feels once the babies are done, the sex isn't necessary. A woman who is going through a change in her body that manifests itself in anger, grouchiness, withdrawal, depression.

Now certainly that is not all women, or all men. But the post 40 divorce is far more likely to be started by the woman, than the man. As a post forty man, I would not marry again if I was divorced. I would also want to be with someone who wished to live the life I did.

I will say this for myself. There is no woman's age that is a turn off. There is only attitude that turns off. I find women from the twenties to the sixties that are attractive, sexy and fun to be around. I also find women from the twenties to the sixties that are so angry, rude, self centered, aloof, and hostile that I wouldn't want to be in the same room with them. I'm sure it is no different for men.


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## isla~mama

I've always been attracted to older men. My husband is older than I am. When I was dating I always lusted after my BFs dads :smthumbup: (but never acted on it!!). Guys my age (well, not so much anymore as I get older ) just look like little kids to me. So I'm sure there are *some* women out there who genuinely are attracted to older guys. But I'm agreeing with you.... I don't think Donald Trump would have his string of gorgeous younger women if he were a bum. But who knows.... women fall for losers all the time.

That being said your husband is being horrid giving you a hard time about weight-- and if you are trying to defy age and gravity you should be doing it for yourself, not for him.


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## that_girl

I don't know. My husband married me and I'm 7 years older 

And I already had a kid.

I must be awesome. :rofl:


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## tiredwife&sahm

Well I guess men will forever be looking cause no woman stays young and looking great to society standards and if you have kids 'forget about it'. Its just inevitable. I have 4 kids and my body just couldn't hold up to that, I don't think many women can regardless of their age. My husband better not say a word about it either.


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## Acorn

I'm in my early forties. What I have noticed most in my life, especially the last few years, is that the people around me that are my age are very jaded and bitter about various things in their lives. Even on the verge of divorce, everyone is always telling me how positive I am, etc. 

I think the #1 thing I would look for in a new partner is a positive outlook on life - a truly positive, I can get by the bad stuff attitude and enjoy the day.

I worry that I will need to date a lot younger to find that. And I worry that dating younger will get me a host of other problems I haven't even thought of.


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## mr.miketastic

If I were single, and a younger woman showed interest...well they do actually and seem shocked when they learn I am in my mid-40s, but anyway if I were single why shouldn't I try a go at dating one? I don't have a pot belly, I am not bald, I am still in good shape at 6'5' or so and 215 give or take a pound and groomed daily...Why not?


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## frustr8dhubby

Ah yes generalizing "all men" again. For me, age is not a factor at all. My wife is 3 years older than me, gained a tiny bit of weight, and sags a little, and I still find her sexy but she could care less.

Maybe you are different but some of us are likely attracted to women who still like sex. My wife could be Angelina Jolie but since kids sex is icky or "mommies don't do those things" sure some "younger tail" would be exciting. Hell at this point so might Betty White!!!


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## In_The_Wind

I started dating my wife when she was 22 I was 37, One day early in our relationship I asked her if she didnt want to date someone closer to her age and she said well what are you in your early thirties I laughed and said no I am 37 she made me show her my drivers license and she was floored she couldnt believe i was 15 yrs older than her, anyway she said she loved me just the way I was Next month I will turn 50 and she is 35 we have been married for 12 years now everyone that meets me thinks i am in my older thirties kinda funny in a way. 
PS I take really good care of myself work out, eat right, etc


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## CandieGirl

The usual typical answers from both sides...not learning anything new here!


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## Halien

The largest study done recently was sponsored by AARP and revealed that a wide margin of divorces in mid life are initiated by women.


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## Conrad

Halien said:


> The largest study done recently was sponsored by AARP and revealed that a wide margin of divorces in mid life are initiated by women.


The anecdotal evidence here would indicate the same.


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## Kobo

*Dean* said:


> Just checking for understanding, what are your hoping to learn?
> 
> The men on this board may give additional input if you provide us
> with additional information, information your looking to learn about.


She wants men to admit we're the pigs she imagines


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## Lionelhutz

As for the attraction factor. Yes, middle aged men are bringing much less to the table physically for their 20 something girlfriends, that doesn't matter. As long as he has money and or status she will be able to tell herself and her friends that he is "exciting" or "interesting". Just like some men can fool themselves into arguing that his relationship with a hot but air-headed B*tchy bimbo is "special" and "not what you think".

Despite all the talk about cougars, most middle aged single women prefer men with money or status even if they don't need further financial security. Money can make the most repugnant man "fascinating" or "dynamic" whereas exactly the same guy within an average income would be seen as revolting. 

Also I think men middle aged men may think that younger women are simply more sexual than women in their own age group as a result of leaving a sexless or nearly sexless marriages. 

I have also seen a few of these old guy/young girl relationships where they are both very comfortable with and aware of the reciprocal shallowness of their choices.

I think very few men decide to leave an otherwise good relationship just because of age. It may seem that way because of the choices of those just leaving relationship but that doesn't mean it was the cause. Those who would leave for that reason are useless as spouses anyways.

Personally, I have employed too many 20 somethings in the past few years and my patience for same is limited.


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## Kobo

Halien said:


> The largest study done recently was sponsored by AARP and revealed that a wide margin of divorces in mid life are initiated by women.


Shhh with your facts and all of that flim flam.


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## Gratitude

Kobo said:


> Shhh with your facts and all of that flim flam.


LOL


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## hookares

I view young girls as being synonymous with wondering what your high school sweetheart looks like now, after thirty years , or so.
If I want to see how things went, I just look in the mirror and figure she sure as hell wouldn't want to see ME.
Every guy I know who ever split with his lifelong companion to take the leap into fantasy land with the kiddies, ended up wondering where she was spending those Saturday nights, (or more) out with her "girlfriends".


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## mr.miketastic

CandieGirl said:


> The usual typical answers from both sides...not learning anything new here!


How about, my wife is hot at 45 and she is the one who really turns me on? Sometimes, you don't really have much of a choice on who you find attractive, and if a younger woman is smart, confident and strong, I could definitely see something starting...were I single.


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## Lionelhutz

Kobo said:


> Shhh with your facts and all of that flim flam.


I see that fact cited often, but I'm not sure how much it explains the whys and hows marriages ending. 

Follow the money. After separation there is rarely a financial motivation on men to seek to start court action but a strong motivation for women, particularly if children are involved.


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## FrankKissel

Halien said:


> The largest study done recently was sponsored by AARP and revealed that a wide margin of divorces in mid life are initiated by women.


I don't doubt that's true, but I'm curious to know what you think that means.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Halien

Over lunch with a supplier's VP, he told me his take on marrying a woman half his age: "You keep pretending that you're hot and horny for me, and I'll pretend that the arm reaching seductively around by backside for a hug isn't really going for my wallet." 

Honestly, though, I regularly meet with men who are successful after starting their own companies since my job includes creating technology agreements with new companies. For the most part, you get a very clear picture of their dedication to their wife through getting to know them.


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## CandieGirl

Don't really give a sh!t either way, but it sure is amusing to read the replies from all you guys justifying your desire to be with younger woman.

When I was 23, the man I was seeing was 46. We were together for 2 years, and it was great! So please don't tell me that I imagine all men to be pigs; you don't even know the half of it. One day, maybe I'll write out my memoirs for y'all, and you'll truly see who the real pig is. Oink, Oink!


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## SimplyAmorous

It's all about sex and ego, I've had the opportunity to talk to an older man ( 76 yrs) about such things, yeah, people really open up to me... I didn't bring this on....I don't stop them.... maybe even when I should... but he went on about how him & his wife had great sex till she hit menapause.... after that-she didn't want to touch him again, He hated it...guess what .... he still had a sex drive...old geezer nearing 76 still going strong.....his wife (gone now) ,but she was out of the count for yrs upon yrs, he had some close situations where he almost cheated on her.....she didn't even want to sleep in the same bed with him....things they used to do suddenly repulsed her -once she went through "the change"...

He tells me ..."just wait".. I tell him I'll never do that to my husband, just hearing how he has felt is warning enough.

So what has he been doing all of those years.... he checks out all the younger women in church, they probably think he is just a jolly friendly old man (which he is).....but I know he is checking them out, cause he tells me about it. Just an old man's fantasy. If one of those women wanted him, he would jump, but he isn't some tycoon with a limmo and fame, so what does he have to offer. If you have something to offer them and they are materistic.... you will get them. 

I am sure this is very common if the sex life at home has been dead for years...you live on fantasy -until you find a taker. .


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## FrankKissel

Lionelhutz said:


> I see that fact cited often, but I'm not sure how much it explains the whys and hows marriages ending.
> 
> Follow the money. After separation there is rarely a financial motivation on men to seek to start court action but a strong motivation for women, particularly if children are involved.


I think you're largely correct.
According to people who've studied these things, there are three primary reasons women file more often:

1. Divorce laws in most states favor women in child custody matters. In states where shared custody is the presumption, the rate of women initiating divorce is lower.
2. There more financial incentive to divorce for a woman.
3. Men are more likely to engage in behaviors that cause their partner to divorce them, i.e. substance abuse, infidelity, domestic violence, gambling, etc.

I'd suggest a fourth reason is that men are more willing to settle for an OK marriage (and get their needs met outside the marriage if necessary) whereas women tend to romanticize marriage and want out if/when things are less than ideal.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Kobo

CandieGirl said:


> Don't really give a sh!t either way, but it sure is amusing to read the replies from all you guys justifying your desire to be with younger woman.
> 
> When I was 23, the man I was seeing was 46. We were together for 2 years, and it was great! So please don't tell me that I imagine all men to be pigs; you don't even know the half of it. One day, maybe I'll write out my memoirs for y'all, and you'll truly see who the real pig is. Oink, Oink!




Yup, we all desire to be with younger women. You old hags should just deal with it. 

/sarcasm


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## Kobo

FrankKissel said:


> I think you're largely correct.
> According to people who've studied these things, there are three primary reasons women file more often:
> 
> 1. Divorce laws in most states favor women in child custody matters. In states where shared custody is the presumption, the rate of women initiating divorce is lower.
> 2. There more financial incentive to divorce for a woman.
> 3. Men are more likely to engage in behaviors that cause their partner to divorce them, i.e. substance abuse, infidelity, domestic violence, gambling, etc.
> 
> I'd suggest a fourth reason is that men are more willing to settle for an OK marriage (and get their needs met outside the marriage if necessary) whereas women tend to romanticize marriage and want out if/when things are less than ideal.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


None of those point to a large amount of men desiring a relationship with younger women as the cause. Pretty sure that's what this thread is about.


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## Halien

FrankKissel said:


> I don't doubt that's true, but I'm curious to know what you think that means.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


You can do a search on AARP studies on divorce for the information, but it is mostly results oriented, so papers on motivations often cite this study. My take is that men and women adapt differently to what is really just a dysfunctional marriage. Men might accept the status quo, and women see the passage of their children into adulthood as the time to end a broken marriage, at least with the walk away wife scenario as one contributor. Just my opinion. There is probably still a tendency for women to do more in the home, so why should she stay? But I don't think it is fair to pin the blame of men seeking younger wives entirely on men. When my brother divorced, the site he used for dating factored in income, and he was inundated with younger women interested in him. His ex was 10 years older, and he is only interested in a similar age.


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## FrankKissel

As for the original question, men are biologically hardwired to be attracted to the appearance of fertility. And, like it or not,a woman in her mid-40s is not going to appear as fertile as your average 24 year old.
Cold. Hard. Truth.

This, of course, doesn't mean that every man will, or even want to, dump his wife of 20 years for the first young thing that pays him attention. A lot (most?) Of men will be flattered by it and move on with their lives. But you better believe the natural attraction is there.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## CandieGirl

I might be a hag (at 41) but there are plenty of old codgers out there who would still want me ;-)


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## SprucHub

If the question is, why would someone choose to be with a person with whom they have nothing to talk about, the answer, quite clearly, is that the first person is not interested in conversation.


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## Runs like Dog

My FiL's second wife was the same age as his eldest daughter.


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## tacoma

endlessgrief said:


> Perhaps some of you men can get me to understand this ever growing fascination. Some men, when they and their wives begin to age and their wives are not so perky and gravity has taken its toll divorce their spouses for young hot girls.


You`re assuming these men left their wives ONLY because they got older.
Trust me, there`s always more to it than that.



> I understand the wanting of the young hot girls. But being of a certain age, one must question why. I imagine there is nothing to talk about. He mentions the Beatles and she says she hates bugs. You get my drift?


This would depend on the person.
Most young people today are into the music and culture of my generation.
It`s actually become a marketing concept.



> I know so many women, myself included, who exercise and do everything they can to stop the hands of time so our husbands won't leave us for a younger woman. How pathetic.


Maybe y`all are concentrating too much on your age and not enough on the emotional bond of marriage



> What makes men beleive that a hot young thing is sexually attracted to their pot bellies, balding head, flat ass, droopy balls, and hair growing out of their ears.


Hmm..I`m 45, in the best shape of my life.
There are a few young women interested in me and I`m quite sure it`s not due to my non-existent money.



> Our society is turning so vapid that I cannot watch regular TV anymore (I download Horror Movies and Heavy Metal). My husband of 20 years said that I put on a few pounds and is not attracted to me anymore. He says this as he is sitting there in his boxers, no tshirt, belly sticking out, greasy hair, uncut toenails, not bothering to shave so he looks like big foot. He says that he cannot get it up anymore due to his depression. Funny, I caught him two nights ago jerking off to ****** porn. I told him that the cure of male impotency is NEW PU**Y. Of this I have no doubt.


You obviously married an ass, or he turned into one later.
Maybe you should explore where,when and why your disconnect with your husband happened.
If your husband isn`t attracted to you chances are it isn`t due to the physical aspect of your relationship.
It`s emotional probably resentment of some type. 



> What do you guys think? Men, are women who (god forbid) age, turn men off? And if so, is it the media? We are being bombarded with youth this and tight buns that.


Age doesn`t turn me off.
I don`t think it does most men when concerning the woman they love.



> But these girls are in for a rude awakening when they hit 40. All those tatoos they get around their belly buttons are going to distort after having children or just aging. Their fake boobs are going to look ridiculous when they are 50, chasing around their children in curlers and a bath robe. Who is worse, the money grubbing young girl or the sleazy sex obsessed older man who just wants to enter the fountain of youth?


I don`t think you`re going to understand it because you believe you already know the answer.
The irony is that your answer is wrong and therefore you`ll never understand it.


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## CandieGirl

SprucHub said:


> If the question is, why would someone choose to be with a person with whom they have nothing to talk about, the answer, quite clearly, is that the first person is not interested in conversation.


I've heard many people say this...and I'm sorry, but how can you have nothing to talk about? Is everyone in your life the same age as you?

I've enjoyed people from all age groups all my life; there's never been a shortage of conversation, no matter if the other person is 70 or 17.


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## FrankKissel

SprucHub said:


> If the question is, why would someone choose to be with a person with whom they have nothing to talk about, the answer, quite clearly, is that the first person is not interested in conversation.


Why are we assuming a woman in her 20s is intellectually and conversationally inferior to an older man?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## CandieGirl

*Dean* said:


> Woman have this *competition *thing going against each other when it
> comes to how they dress, look, etc.
> 
> Sometimes I think that just them thinking about their husbands looking
> at younger woman, encourages them to be and look their best.
> 
> If a man doesn't always kiss his wife's axx, sometimes keeping her guessing, she stays on her toes............playing more the role of the good wife.


Yes, they're all on display for one another...sad, though, to see the ones who are trying to compete with women 20 years younger, as if the men won't notice....sad and funny, all rolled into one.


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## This is me

I think this goes both ways. My no returned wife started exercizing for the first time on our 20 year relationship, lost weight, looked into a boob job, got braces on teeth that were just fine, and then dropped the Divorce word.

Shocked the hell out of me. It is not gender specific that someone will desire their youth again.


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## CandieGirl

Desire it all you want, it ain't ever comin' back, no boob job, braces or face lift can bring it, either.


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## Trickster

I was buying groceries the other morning. I just came from the gym wearing my work-out shorts and a t-shirt. I have some muscles and not at all a body builder. I was getting deli me whe this young beauty smiled at me and said good morning. no big deal. A couple minutes I saw her on the bread isle... Hello again... When I was checking out... there she was again smiling. Then asking me how I get my calves so muscular and what I do to stay in shape. She was probable in her 20"s and I am 44. Was she flirting? Don't know but my ego was sure feeling it.


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## CandieGirl

I guess you've never worn a dress and high heels. Can be quite uncomfortalbe, and believe me when I say they come off as soon as I walk in the door from work. Hubby doesn't like it? Tough. He can come work with me if he wants to see. Either that, or he can take me out for dinner, where I'd be more than happy to dress the part, AND get ogled by all the guys while we're out ;-)

I'm 41, and no slouch in the looks dept...bonus? I know exactly who I am, I love myslef, and I don't face the insecurities that many women my age appear to suffer from.


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## SprucHub

I guess I should use emoticons when being sarcastic. I think women in their 20's y/o can be thrilling conversationalists, and can have lots in common with 40+ y/o men. I think depending on interests, it can be a fun, fulfilling relationship. But, generally, they would be at different stations in life, on beginning the family building stage and one through a significant part of it, and onto the personal fulfillment stage (grown kids means more time for hobbies and interests). Part of the relationship seems like it would be going through a class that one of the two has already taken. Part of the enjoyment of relationships is discovering things together. So a single, never married 45 y/o who had been carrier oriented, should have no issues with a 25y/o. But a divorced dad of 2, has been through so much.

Why would the divorced dad do it? Young women look a certain way that old women do not - like new cars look different than classic cars. Some prefer that young look, enjoy the ego boost of being attractive to women they could not have gotten when they were in their 20's, want to rub their ex's nose in it, like the status of having a trophy. Also, continuing the car analogy, some prefer breaking in a new car rather than dealing with the issues a classic might have. Also, it seems that younger women are likely to be more doting than older, more established women.


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## Halien

Already Gone said:


> I was buying groceries the other morning. I just came from the gym wearing my work-out shorts and a t-shirt. I have some muscles and not at all a body builder. I was getting deli me whe this young beauty smiled at me and said good morning. no big deal. A couple minutes I saw her on the bread isle... Hello again... When I was checking out... there she was again smiling. Then asking me how I get my calves so muscular and what I do to stay in shape. She was probable in her 20"s and I am 44. Was she flirting? Don't know but my ego was sure feeling it.


I usually don't recognize flirting (when its with me) unless it comes with a 2 X 4, so I wouldn't know. Lordy, I've sure walked into it, though. About 10 years ago (I was about 37), I stopped at a store and the young woman beside me was having a real dilemma with her screaming toddler. I made goofy faces and the toddler started smiling. At first, I thought the mom said, "you want to take her home?" I said, "No, my wife might have a problem with that." She said, "No, I said, 'Do you want to take me home?' My home..." Now, I can speak stupid-talk in twenty languages, so after muttering something about needing to get home to replace the hot water element I had just bought, I ran.


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## eagleclaw

CandieGirl said:


> I guess you've never worn a dress and high heels. Can be quite uncomfortalbe, and believe me when I say they come off as soon as I walk in the door from work. Hubby doesn't like it? Tough. He can come work with me if he wants to see. Either that, or he can take me out for dinner, where I'd be more than happy to dress the part, AND get ogled by all the guys while we're out ;-)
> 
> I'm 41, and no slouch in the looks dept...bonus? I know exactly who I am, I love myslef, and I don't face the insecurities that many women my age appear to suffer from.


That's a funny perspective. I mean being willing to put in the effort for everyone except your husband. Can't imagine why a spry young thing putting in effort to get his attention might succeed.


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## Broncos Fan

I agree with those who say this phenomenon isn't gender-specific. I've had issues with my wife going through a stretch a few years back where all she wanted was the attention of younger men since she'd hit 30. It was rough on our marriage for sure, and I absolutely felt somewhat betrayed given that I'd spent years being careful not to do that kind of thing to her in regard to younger women. We're in a better place in our marriage now after a lot of discussion and soul-searching by both of us, but it certainly was difficult watching her going through the motions of trying to get male attention, especially younger male attention. Ego is a big part of it for men and women, and as people age and marriages get boring (which they all can at some point), plenty of people try to get that old feeling back by appealing to the younger crowd.


----------



## Trickster

Halien said:


> I usually don't recognize flirting (when its with me) unless it comes with a 2 X 4, so I wouldn't know. Lordy, I've sure walked into it, though. About 10 years ago (I was about 37), I stopped at a store and the young woman beside me was having a real dilemma with her screaming toddler. I made goofy faces and the toddler started smiling. At first, I thought the mom said, "you want to take her home?" I said, "No, my wife might have a problem with that." She said, "No, I said, 'Do you want to take me home?' My home..." Now, I can speak stupid-talk in twenty languages, so after muttering something about needing to get home to replace the hot water element I had just bought, I ran.


That could be flirting... If it were me I would think that I was so good with the child to get them to stop whinning and screaming to help out at home. I have to hit with a 2X4 also. Years and years ago friends would have to tell me when a lady was flirting with me. I would never know.


----------



## that_girl

When I was 27, i dated a 41 year old man. We dated for 3 years and he was a good guy. Emotionally immature though. Yea.

Then I dated people my age. They were alright. Not very stable.

When I met Hubs, I thought he was in his late 20s. I was 31 so I thought it was no biggie. He thought I was in my late 20s, lolll  We never cared about age. i have good genetics though. Thank you, Mom's side of the family!


----------



## tjohnson

I am sorry of the pain you are going through. It is unbelievable how so many men can be so superficial, cruel, and selfish. I know someone who dumped the wife who put on weight after bearing 2 beautiful babies for a women 10 years younger. It is a terrible thing. 
As for your situation, I am wondering if there is more than his erection problems or lack of attraction to your body as you point out. It is inevitable for everyone’s body to become less attractive as the years go by. Even if my wife’s boobs hit her knees when she walked/and or weighed 300 lbs I would find a way to make love to her. I don’t relish the thought of my wife looking like this as it is not good for either of us. That said, him telling you he is not attracted to you is hurtful. I can only conclude that he is either an insensitive person and/or is harboring resentment. His “lack of attraction” may be more than superficial. When I am upset with my wife, I typically don’t want to have sex with her. 
“Attraction” can mean more than just appearance. Mental illness is no excuse for bad behavior and you should not tolerate it. I think appearance may have less to do with things than may think.


----------



## CandieGirl

eagleclaw said:


> That's a funny perspective. I mean being willing to put in the effort for everyone except your husband. Can't imagine why a spry young thing putting in effort to get his attention might succeed.


Re-read the post. Then you can comment and I might actually take you seriously.

BTW, how many of you ladies (men, your wives) do their housecleaning/cooking/gardening in dresses and heels?

Connard...


----------



## jnyu44

I think everyone here has basically covered the range of possibilities.

Guys in great relationships with their wives (the burden on both to make it great), don't seem to care in the slightest bit on whether or not their wives have aged. Some of the crazy people here even seem to love their wife more as they age together. He does have the responsibility to take care of himself and make you feel secure in your relationship so that you don't think twice about your age. Unfortunately, if your relationship is anything like mine, you have two people who want the other to change before he/she will change. 

Btw, Donald Trump is not only rich, he is also a very charming guy and he is a legend. I don't doubt for one second that the women he marries are attracted to him. While he has his flaws like everyone else, he is strong, successful, intelligent, charming, kind (in certain situations), and has a legacy that will last for a long time. 

I can't speak from experience because I'm still 26, so I suppose younger would be like 16-17...I'm not down with that. I find a lot of 22-23 year old girls way less exciting than my 31 yo wife (we have other issues though).

Before I got married, I couldn't imagine marrying 5 years younger. Intelligence is one thing, but life stage and experience are a whole different game. I think perspectives change a lot as you age and gain more experience. 

Basically, yes of course we'd love to take that young thing home and show her a good time, pot belly and sasquatch hair and all, but a ton of other factors go into our decision making (societal pressures, our own insecurities, etc.)

...most of us here will probably enjoy the flirting for a few seconds and then run home to replace the water element


----------



## CandieGirl

*Dean* said:


> CandieGirl will love this
> 
> About 8 years ago I worked with a man in his mid 40's who was trying
> to turn back the clock. Not a bad looking man, turned grey early
> but had a bit of a large rear end. He worked out every day, but still
> couldn't get a smaller rear end. Diet didn't help either.
> 
> Over a long xmas break from work, he got Lipo done on his bottom and
> belly.
> Took a while for the swelling to go down but afterwards, he was looking
> good and dropped lots of inches in the waist.
> 
> Then started dating some very good looking women and brought a sports car.
> 
> His biggest problem now.......he stopped exercising, started drinking a lot of beer
> and eating unhealthy things. His bottom started getting big again!


LMAO! (or back on...)


----------



## CandieGirl

*Dean* said:


> I'm guessing that you were a big challenge in your younger days.
> I also detect some attitude too........my wife has an attitude.
> It drives me crazy sometimes and gets me all hot and bothered.
> 
> I'm all far taking my wife out to dinner or out on the town.
> She looks great all dressed up. I'm also ok with dress down days too.


Oh you betcha...! I love looking good, Dean, and I've got major attitude in a good way. Am loving all these blokes who are trying to scare me by saying my husband looks at younger women. Ooooh, really? Guess I'd better get used to it, ay? I don't plan on keeling over anytime soon, so there'll be more and more younger women everyday!!!

I already had my turn to be a young 20 something...had a blast, too.


----------



## Runs like Dog

I'm in fairly good shape. Like liquid metal terminator. Same vaguely bemused dead glare too. Usually have a phone in my ear...so talking to myself and people steer wide of me. Little chickniks smiling at me? Couldn't tell you. It's not that I have bad manners, I have no manners.


----------



## eagleclaw

CandieGirl said:


> Re-read the post. Then you can comment and I might actually take you seriously.
> 
> BTW, how many of you ladies (men, your wives) do their housecleaning/cooking/gardening in dresses and heels?
> 
> Connard...


Your post sounded like your effort ALWAYS ended at the front door when you walked in.. and no way in hell you were wearing a dress and high heels once you were off work. It read that way because that is what you said.

But I agree, I dress like a slob when I'm doing dirty chores etc - but I try to look good at other times - and sometimes go all out even if were just going for a quick dinner together. Generally my wife does the same. And we enjoy lounging in sweatshirts together from time to time. But as a rule, If I'll put the effort in for someone else I would also for her, and do.

It does not sound like in YOUR case your husband in wanting... or being tempted by younger models.... but if others read your one post and leave there effort at the front door as you suggest - it may not read quite as well in there situations.

BTW - I'm embarressed to admit I have had to grab a robe quickly to answer the door and only able to find my wifes much smaller, femine, frilly, robe - have created a whole NEW sexy look that probably didn't need to be discovered.


----------



## CandieGirl

eagleclaw said:


> Your post sounded like your effort ALWAYS ended at the front door when you walked in.. and no way in hell you were wearing a dress and high heels once you were off work. It read that way because that is what you said.
> 
> But I agree, I dress like a slob when I'm doing dirty chores etc - but I try to look good at other times - and sometimes go all out even if were just going for a quick dinner together. Generally my wife does the same. And we enjoy lounging in sweatshirts together from time to time. But as a rule, If I'll put the effort in for someone else I would also for her, and do.
> 
> It does not sound like in YOUR case your husband in wanting... or being tempted by younger models.... but if others read your one post and leave there effort at the front door as you suggest - it may not read quite as well in there situations.
> 
> BTW - I'm embarressed to admit I have had to grab a robe quickly to answer the door and only able to find my wifes much smaller, femine, frilly, robe - have created a whole NEW sexy look that probably didn't need to be discovered.


No, my case brings about a whole other set of problems. issed:

If he's tempted by younger models, these days, I'm tempted to let them have him. He can't even keep up with me, and I'm only a few years younger. Good luck to him with a 25 year old version of me.


----------



## Stryker

To be frank from my childhood days to till this day, I have had older women in a large number as friends and pals..along with my age ones , slightly younger and much younger ones..

and I tend to say that Older Women have a mature , loving and even a better persona than some of the young bragging women..


----------



## 827Aug

My divorce attorney says he has observed this phenomena for more than 40 years and can easily sum it all up. The money is what attracts these younger women. When the money is gone so is the attraction. This is definitely the case with my estranged husband and his young harem. Without the money, he's not nearly as attractive.


----------



## eagleclaw

CandieGirl said:


> No, my case brings about a whole other set of problems. issed:
> 
> If he's tempted by younger models, these days, I'm tempted to let them have him. He can't even keep up with me, and I'm only a few years younger. Good luck to him with a 25 year old version of me.


That's funny. At 41 I can keep up with my wife just fine - in fact I outpace her as I could easily do it every day. However, every now and then she wants to do it two or three times. In a day usually no problem. In an evening........ well the refractory period is definately not what it used to be. Third time will be tough if not a lot of time in between. And I may peform ok, but I'll never finish. Just part of getting older I guess. 

I don't know that it's an age thing. I actually find older, bolder, confident, woman who know who they are and what they like far sexier than young, dumb, flakey girls. My wife is all the prior things. But I think if guys are tempted, I would guess the attractions as often as not is the willingness, the effort, the eager to please mentality a lot of younger women project. 

If a guy is banging his head against the wall and the wife is just not showing interest, or that she is attracted to him and not projecting that his needs are a priority to her... then he is going to get VERY tempted with interest coming from outside of the marriage unrelated to age. It's just that generally younger women are much braver flirting and hitting on men.


----------



## CandieGirl

I'm not worried. My husband is practically deceased. Really? He's the one that should be worrying.


----------



## eagleclaw

:scratchhead:Who said you should be worried? I don't get it. Why is he practically deceased? I'm confused.


----------



## Enchantment

Old men wanting young wives... young women marrying for money... none of it is anything new under the sun...been around since the beginning of time.

But, like anything - you get what you pay for. If all you are concerned about is the vapid and doing things for appearances sake or out of unfettered selfishness, then you are sure to receive your just desserts in shallowness and its attendant - misery - in time. 

I'm not even going to worry about it - if you attend to your own side of things and try to be the best that you can - let that self-confidence radiate from you in every way - believe me - 'young tail' won't matter, and if it does - that's THEIR loss.


----------



## eagleclaw

Enchantment said:


> Old men wanting young wives... young women marrying for money... none of it is anything new under the sun...been around since the beginning of time.
> 
> But, like anything - you get what you pay for. If all you are concerned about is the vapid and doing things for appearances sake or out of unfettered selfishness, then you are sure to receive your just desserts in shallowness and its attendant - misery - in time.
> 
> I'm not even going to worry about it - if you attend to your own side of things and try to be the best that you can - let that self-confidence radiate from you in every way - believe me - 'young tail' won't matter, and if it does - that's THEIR loss.


Well said.


----------



## L.M.COYL

I think there is something inherently appealing about a mature, successful and powerful man having a trophy wife. I mean it seems so commonplace: younger women are attracted to not only the above attributes but also the experience, charisma, etc, while older men love the suppleness, open-mindedness and flexibility (in oh-so- many ways). I mean, it's not like you actually have to talk to each other for protracted periods; that's what your mates are for!


----------



## Lionelhutz

In the interests of full disclosure, the reserve situations do exist. 

Many years ago, I had a relationship with a woman in her late 40s when I was in my 20s. Does that make me a himbo?


----------



## Runs like Dog

Once you go Susan Sarandon you never go back.


----------



## LostWifeCrushed

*I'd suggest a fourth reason is that men are more willing to settle for an OK marriage (and get their needs met outside the marriage if necessary) whereas women tend to romanticize marriage and want out if/when things are less than ideal.*

Wow i agree with Frank on this one. 100% on the money


----------



## RClawson

CandieGirl said:


> I've heard many people say this...and I'm sorry, but how can you have nothing to talk about? Is everyone in your life the same age as you?
> 
> I've enjoyed people from all age groups all my life; there's never been a shortage of conversation, no matter if the other person is 70 or 17.


Candie,

I do see your point but I listen to my daughters friend's (just out of college) talking in the other room and I want to shove a hot needle in my ear. It is a maturity issue. It is having lived a little and having some life experience and substance. If I was single I am not interested in being a mentor I want someone who has shared interests, hobbies, outlooks and passions.

Young girls are certainly nice to look at but to me women over 40 and into their 60's are the total package. I have thought that since my 20's.


----------



## Stryker

Older Women also take their liking for younger men..but most get their due as Ashton Kutcher did to Demi Moore recently , who had disowned and ditched Bruce Willis for the younger guy...


----------



## hookares

CandieGirl said:


> Don't really give a sh!t either way, but it sure is amusing to read the replies from all you guys justifying your desire to be with younger woman.
> 
> When I was 23, the man I was seeing was 46. We were together for 2 years, and it was great! So please don't tell me that I imagine all men to be pigs; you don't even know the half of it. One day, maybe I'll write out my memoirs for y'all, and you'll truly see who the real pig is. Oink, Oink!


So what's this? Is the fact that I NEVER chased the bobby -sox tail while my ex was out screwing anything she thought would go further just one more of my many failures in taking twenty years to wise up? Well, at least I'm now making up for past failures, although as a guy gets older, what constitutes as a "young girl" gets older.


----------



## jnyu44

Candiegirl - it seems to me like you already want to give up on the relationship and you're not really looking for advice here (which is of course totally fine). If you actually sincerely do want to patch things up, you might want to take an alternative to the attitude route. 

My wife has plenty of attitude and while it was great to be dating an opinionated woman with plenty of sass and fire, it can be really trying for me to be married to one. 

I don't want to be quick to tell you that your approach is wrong since I know nothing of you and your husband. What I'm trying to say is that if you really want to fix this problem with your husband, maybe the attitude should take a back seat this time around (while of course protecting yourself if he turns out to be a complete jerk and not willing to work it out).


----------



## Trickster

CandieGirl said:


> If he's tempted by younger models, these days, I'm tempted to let them have him. He can't even keep up with me, and I'm only a few years younger. Good luck to him with a 25 year old version of me.


Sometimes I will comment on a woman we see about her looks. I don't think that I am putting my wife down. She may see it different though. It's just my imagination running away with me... My wife said something along them lines... "If you think you can have her...go for it. I won't stop you". The truth is...is that I would not want a 25 year old. Hopefully your husband feels the same way... Let him dream a little.


----------



## CandieGirl

This is not my thread, I was just commenting along with everyone else.

My problem is quite different....my husband doesn't lust after young women. He doesnt lust after anything! Christ, if he did, maybe I'd know he was still alive in there somewhere.


----------



## CandieGirl

jnyu44 said:


> Candiegirl - it seems to me like you already want to give up on the relationship and you're not really looking for advice here (which is of course totally fine). If you actually sincerely do want to patch things up, you might want to take an alternative to the attitude route.
> 
> My wife has plenty of attitude and while it was great to be dating an opinionated woman with plenty of sass and fire, it can be really trying for me to be married to one.
> 
> I don't want to be quick to tell you that your approach is wrong since I know nothing of you and your husband. What I'm trying to say is that if you really want to fix this problem with your husband, maybe the attitude should take a back seat this time around (while of course protecting yourself if he turns out to be a complete jerk and not willing to work it out).


Yes I am ready to give up. If you go through my threads, you'll see that I've been around here since April of last year, working on our various problems. In addition, we're in counselling since July...I'm not sure what the point of your comment is, sorry.


----------



## that_girl

My doc just seemed shocked that I'm almost 36. He asked me if I was really born in 1976. He was ready to put 1980something. LOL yes.


----------



## Runs like Dog

God has a quirky sense of humor. He made gorgeous 20-something year olds who then open their mouths and all that comes out is hysterically funny retarded nonsense. Here's a tip for you youngsters. Stand there be gorgeous, strike a pose and STFU.


----------



## Zzyzx

Anecdote from the front lines: while I prefer women within 10-12 years of my age, I dated a 24 year old girl for awhile a few years ago. I was fitter and had more stamina than she did. We'd go hiking and she could not keep up with me. Or we'd go to the gym, same thing. But she did have other attributes that kept me coming back. Excellent conversations, good taste in wine, caring and all that. I got to show her a few things and she was appreciative of that. She liked older guys in general. We broke up because I made clear to her that I wasn't interested in children at my age. Last I heard she's about to marry a 40 year old guy who wants to start a family. I wish him well; her stamina hasn't got any better... lol


----------



## lovestruckout

Was having this discussion with some girls from work in their 30s. They unanimously agreed that the rare older man in his 40s and 50s that still has a 6 pack, is good looking, has hair, and is generally a put together guy would be near the top of their lists. Something about being old and hot combination, at least with these gals, seems to seduce them.


----------



## bubbly girl

Enchantment said:


> I'm not even going to worry about it - if you attend to your own side of things and try to be the best that you can - let that self-confidence radiate from you in every way - believe me - 'young tail' won't matter, and if it does - that's THEIR loss.


:iagree:


----------



## desperateguy

I think there's more than having a hot bod. Women in 20's do have a certain vitality and life to them that older women often don't have. I'm not saying that it's better to have that, I wouldn't date a woman in her 20s (I'm 39), but there is an appeal in that sense of freshness and life. And yeah, a hot bod doesn't hurt  I'll be honest.


----------



## jnyu44

CandieGirl said:


> Yes I am ready to give up. If you go through my threads, you'll see that I've been around here since April of last year, working on our various problems. In addition, we're in counselling since July...I'm not sure what the point of your comment is, sorry.


Sorry if my comment came off as if I was criticizing you. I reread my comment and I can definitely see how it can be taken that way. Before commenting, I didn't look at how long you've been here or whether or not you tried to patch things up.

I wasn't trying to come down on you hard or anything at all. The point of my comment was just to try to get you to let go of the "attitude" part because it's something that hits home with me. However, I will concede that I probably shouldn't have commented without knowing more about you and your situation. Sorry, was just trying to help.


----------



## EleGirl

I'm 62 and married to a 15 year old.......

Oh wait, are we talking about chronological age or behavior age? :rofl:


----------



## AFEH

endlessgrief said:


> Perhaps some of you men can get me to understand this ever growing fascination. Some men, when they and their wives begin to age and their wives are not so perky and gravity has taken its toll divorce their spouses for young hot girls.
> 
> I understand the wanting of the young hot girls. But being of a certain age, one must question why. I imagine there is nothing to talk about. He mentions the Beatles and she says she hates bugs. You get my drift?
> 
> It seems these young girls like to go out with older men for their money. Do the men know this? Are they in denial? Donald Trump for instance is one of the grossest men I have ever seen and he has a beautiful young wife. If he wasn't Donald Trump and worked at Sears, would she still marry him? It all seems so shallow.
> 
> I know so many women, myself included, who exercise and do everything they can to stop the hands of time so our husbands won't leave us for a younger woman. How pathetic.
> 
> I am 44 and find some younger men attractive, but I would not want to be with them because I still view them as kids. And if I date a guy who uses the word "awesome" over and over, I may just kill him.
> 
> What makes men beleive that a hot young thing is sexually attracted to their pot bellies, balding head, flat ass, droopy balls, and hair growing out of their ears.
> 
> Our society is turning so vapid that I cannot watch regular TV anymore (I download Horror Movies and Heavy Metal). My husband of 20 years said that I put on a few pounds and is not attracted to me anymore. He says this as he is sitting there in his boxers, no tshirt, belly sticking out, greasy hair, uncut toenails, not bothering to shave so he looks like big foot. He says that he cannot get it up anymore due to his depression. Funny, I caught him two nights ago jerking off to ****** porn. I told him that the cure of male impotency is NEW PU**Y. Of this I have no doubt.
> 
> What do you guys think? Men, are women who (god forbid) age, turn men off? And if so, is it the media? We are being bombarded with youth this and tight buns that.
> 
> But these girls are in for a rude awakening when they hit 40. All those tatoos they get around their belly buttons are going to distort after having children or just aging. Their fake boobs are going to look ridiculous when they are 50, chasing around their children in curlers and a bath robe. Who is worse, the money grubbing young girl or the sleazy sex obsessed older man who just wants to enter the fountain of youth?




Your husband's a jerk.


You need to ask yourself just why are you living with a guy like him. And when you find the answer have the courage to fix your problem.


----------



## SimplyAmorous

I don't believe my husband will ever be this type of man, I just know him too well.... he is the type that, once in love, nothing or noone can pull him away...terribly attached to 1 woman- for life. I believe what separates such men is something called "*vasopressin*"..... how much of this is in your genetic makeup even. 

Studies done on prairie voles have confirmed this fact, such people, with a healthy dousing of this.. are the hopelessly monogomous romantics of our day... such couples, blest enough to find each other & mate... will ride out their life together... never caring to be with another, the romantic attachment remained , despite our aging. 

But it sure helps when we take care of each others emotional & sexual needs along the way....I can still look at my husband, nearing 50, and still see that hot young man I married, I know he has the ability to see me "forever young" as well, we have to look at ourselves in this light too, so long as we are alive.... age is all in the mind, or so I want to believe! I really don't like getting older, but I am not at all worried about THIS issue ..with my husband. I know I have a keeper for life.


Science tracks down the roots of infidelity - research suggests that staying faithful is a matter of genetics 

A little about the "science" behind all of this...

Attachment and Monogamy as Studied in People and Rodents

.


----------



## Halien

SimplyAmorous said:


> I don't believe my husband will ever be this type of man, I just know him too well.... he is the type that, once in love, nothing or noone can pull him away...terribly attached to 1 woman- for life. I believe what separates such men is something called "*vasopressin*"..... how much of this is in your genetic makeup even.
> 
> .


Do you think the same thing applies when women pursue much younger men? I'm serious, because from my own personal experience, it seems like it is more of a "seize the moment" type of affair when an older, married woman initiates a sexual relationship with a younger guy. Its happened to me twice from 17 to 19, my BIL, and more recently my son. My son got the h3ll out of dodge when she woman initiated, but he is still dealing with guilt over their divorce. He really looked up to the woman's husband.


----------



## CandieGirl

Halien said:


> Do you think the same thing applies when women pursue much younger men? I'm serious, because from my own personal experience, it seems like it is more of a "seize the moment" type of affair when an older, married woman initiates a sexual relationship with a younger guy. Its happened to me twice from 17 to 19, my BIL, and more recently my son. My son got the h3ll out of dodge when she woman initiated, but he is still dealing with guilt over their divorce. He really looked up to the woman's husband.


I've always been into older men...sometimes, much, MUCH older men. I can't say why I hold this double standard, but the thought of an older woman/younger man just makes me want to yurk...no offence to anyone intended. I hold the same double standard toward gay men vs. lesbians...lesbians just wig me out. Maybe what it means is I just don't like women? I don't know...


----------



## Broncos Fan

*Dean* said:


> This subject seems to bother a lot of women.
> 
> I just smile when I see the title of this thread.
> 
> I'm amazed that on old past threads some of our famous posters
> will write that it's ok for their husbands to get sex from other woman
> if something happens to them, that they just don't want to know about it.
> 
> But thinking about him getting some young stuff.....young tail.....that drives them crazy.


I think this is why so many were so freaked out by that news story with the teacher moving in with his 18 year old student and abandoning his family. It underscores a reality that no amount of social engineering can do anything to change.


----------



## EleGirl

*Dean* said:


> This subject seems to bother a lot of women.
> 
> I just smile when I see the title of this thread.
> 
> I'm amazed that on old past threads some of our famous posters
> will write that it's ok for their husbands to get sex from other woman
> if something happens to them, that they just don't want to know about it.
> 
> But thinking about him getting some young stuff.....young tail.....that drives them crazy.


I think you are missing the point. What bothers older women about this topic is that it makes them feel like they are bing thrown away or have no value to men once they reach a curtain age. 

Personally I hope my husband (STBXH) finds some younger woman who can get him out of the horrible place he's at. He needs something to inspiire him to return to life.

I on the other hand, I plan to get out there and live life... and yea, I might become a cougar..meaning that I will consider dating younger men. It's the man's vitality, intelligence, sense of humor, etc that attract me. And younger men have that as well.


----------



## EleGirl

Broncos Fan said:


> I think this is why so many were so freaked out by that news story with the teacher moving in with his 18 year old student and abandoning his family. It underscores a reality that no amount of social engineering can do anything to change.


And yet, were the teacher a female and the student a male people call her a 'cougar' and are pretty mean about her. I have seldom if ever read or heard anything nice said about older women who date younger men.

To me the issue of the 18 year old moving in with the teacher is two fold.. 1) it broke up a family 2) he was her teacher and hence in a position of authority over her. Other than that he was her teacher it's no more dispicable than any other affair.


----------



## CandieGirl

We aren't all freaked out by this...personally, I already had my run at being a young chick. Now, I plan on enjoying being middle aged, then, hopefully someday an old woman!


----------



## CandieGirl

Some of the things the OP said made me laugh, that's all, like her descriptions...that's what led me to comment in the first place. Not because I am outraged about older men/younger women. It would be a more than a little hypocritical given my history.


----------



## Broncos Fan

EleGirl said:


> And yet, were the teacher a female and the student a male people call her a 'cougar' and are pretty mean about her. I have seldom if ever read or heard anything nice said about older women who date younger men.
> 
> To me the issue of the 18 year old moving in with the teacher is two fold.. 1) it broke up a family 2) he was her teacher and hence in a position of authority over her. Other than that he was her teacher it's no more dispicable than any other affair.


They may be "mean" about the cougar, but she would likely walk away scott-free or with a slap on the wrist in most jurisdictions. This guy waited until she was 18 and they're still trying to jail him, while national news shows have been running features on the whole situation for the past week. This has women freaked out. 

Understand though that I'm not praising the guy. He's ruined his life, her life and his family's life. He's basically done at the age of 41. But the fact that he'd do that just to be with an 18 year old underscores something inherent in men and younger women that most people don't want to face.


----------



## Broncos Fan

CandieGirl said:


> We aren't all freaked out by this...personally, I already had my run at being a young chick. Now, I plan on enjoying being middle aged, then, hopefully someday an old woman!


No offense, and maybe you're different and I'm speaking generally of course, but women are deeply, deeply freaked out by the fact that men will always have at least some attachment to the idea of a younger female. It isn't that different from men being deeply freaked out by the fact that if they ever lose the ability to provide, their wives would at least consider stepping out on him or, if she's kind, divorcing him. That doesn't mean we actually do those things to each other, but the tendency is there buried somewhere. It's just one of those uncomfortable truths that most people don't want to acknowledge.


----------



## CandieGirl

Broncos Fan said:


> No offense, and maybe *you're different* and I'm speaking generally of course, but women are deeply, deeply freaked out by the fact that men will always have at least some attachment to the idea of a younger female. It isn't that different from men being deeply freaked out by the fact that if they ever lose the ability to provide, their wives would at least consider stepping out on him or, if she's kind, divorcing him. That doesn't mean we actually do those things to each other, but the tendency is there buried somewhere. It's just one of those uncomfortable truths that most people don't want to acknowledge.


I am different. And I've already experienced being a young woman. Now there are women younger than me. It's life. Besides, I'm only 41. There are still loads of old bags who wish they were MY age!!!

:rofl:


----------



## CandieGirl

Broncos Fan said:


> *They may be "mean" about the cougar*, but she would likely walk away scott-free or with a slap on the wrist in most jurisdictions. This guy waited until she was 18 and they're still trying to jail him, while national news shows have been running features on the whole situation for the past week. This has women freaked out.
> 
> Understand though that I'm not praising the guy. He's ruined his life, her life and his family's life. He's basically done at the age of 41. But the fact that he'd do that just to be with an 18 year old underscores something inherent in men and younger women that most people don't want to face.


Cos it's just nasteh....! :lol:


----------



## Broncos Fan

CandieGirl said:


> I am different. And I've already experienced being a young woman. Now there are women younger than me. It's life. Besides, I'm only 41. There are still loads of old bags who wish they were MY age!!!
> 
> :rofl:


I think this is the right attitude, for all of us I mean. We're all aging and it doesn't matter ultimately, does it? But I can say honestly, truly, that the most attractive woman in the room is the confident woman who knows what she's about and has gained a lot through experience. I've known even average looking women who have that "something" that puts them head and shoulders above much younger, prettier women. Accepting yourself is hugely important. I wish I could get my wife to accept herself more, because she's one of those women who has gotten more attractive with each passing year, but still worries that she no longer measures up.


----------



## Gratitude

As my mother said, it would be different if he had gone off with a woman around her own age, rather than her being only 21 at the time.

It's more a feeling of being traded in for a "younger model".


----------



## isla~mama

Broncos Fan said:


> Understand though that I'm not praising the guy. He's ruined his life, her life and his family's life. He's basically done at the age of 41. But the fact that he'd do that just to be with an 18 year old underscores something inherent in men and younger women that most people don't want to face.


Don't forget she was his OW before he divorced... men leave wives for OW all the time, it's not entirely an age thing. Probably the one thing all OW by definition have in common is sexual eagerness.


----------



## Broncos Fan

isla~mama said:


> Don't forget she was his OW before he divorced... men leave wives for OW all the time, it's not entirely an age thing. Probably the one thing all OW by definition have in common is *sexual eagerness*.


This is a big factor, especially for the sort of weaker men who leave their wives for other, maybe younger, women. I'm sure people get bored with each other and then this other person comes along and seems like she's into him. It's probably not real and won't last, but he's too dumb to get that at the time. That movie "Election" popped into my head when I first read about this situation.


----------



## MickeyD

I have actually never been with a woman younger than me. On average, the women I have been intimate with in the past have been about 10 years older than myself. My oldest was old enough to be my mom (in her 60s). My wife was the spring chicken, a year older than me.


----------



## Stryker

*The Man should be able to handle n care both old and young big girls ...in case old and young femme are at hand..*:yawn2::awink::smcowboy:


----------



## SimplyAmorous

Halien said:


> Do you think the same thing applies when women pursue much younger men? I'm serious, because from my own personal experience, it seems like it is more of a "seize the moment" type of affair when an older, married woman initiates a sexual relationship with a younger guy. Its happened to me twice from 17 to 19, my BIL, and more recently my son. My son got the h3ll out of dodge when she woman initiated, but he is still dealing with guilt over their divorce. He really looked up to the woman's husband.


I think it is a very sad thing when this happens ... personally I would find it so *demeaning *to go there..... even if I was single. My guess is any older wife who does this is very unhappy at home and obviously not getting her needs met within the marraige, due to the husband being emotionally distant, or sexully rejecting... they have probably given up on love and..... Excitement is the next best thing, plus it boosts their ego if a young man wants them, the whole "milf" thing. (no different from an older man wanting a younger woman...boosts the ego). 

Sexually speaking, from this hormone book The Alchemy of Love and Lust 

...it says that older women (late 30's into 40's) and younger men are both in thier *PRIME *and well, would make the hottest lovers really, but that can only last a season (I think of Demi Moore & Ashton Kutcher).... How sad of an ending, though how could it not be predicted. I just heard Madonna (52 ?) has as 25 yr old boyfriend, I don't care how famous they are, I think it is SAD. 

Even older men & younger woman are a better match sexually as younger women's drives have (generally) not been awakened the way they will be later in life by a Test dowsing......which I should know all about......and yeah, what I wanted more than anything else in this life.....during that WILD unrelenting spell.....if my husband could have been 25 again, so he could have handled my drive, that would have been pure heaven to me. But I worked with what I had. 

Just goes to show...no matter who we are with, at what age, if this is who we married....we need to take care of our spouse -even if we don't feel the same, that is our answer, our lesson in these things.... young wives be there for your young explosively horny husbands--even if you don't feel the same, cause someday you just MIGHT feel EXACTLY what he is feeling - and will be kicking yourself the way I did.... and older men be there for your older wives when her time comes (at least my husband had compassion -cause he knows what that feels like).

These things can only cause that vasopressin monogomy bond - to rise within our marraiges.


----------



## Sanity

Personally there is nothing sexier than a elegant mature woman who knows what she wants and how she wants it 

Younger girls might be fun for a bit but a mature woman will give you good loving AND a great "pillow talk" conversation based on life experience and interesting topics.


----------



## Sanity

MickeyD said:


> I have actually never been with a woman younger than me. On average, the women I have been intimate with in the past have been about 10 years older than myself. My oldest was old enough to be my mom (in her 60s). My wife was the spring chicken, a year older than me.


LOL Did you make sure the batteries on her life alert necklace were fully charged before making sweet love? :smthumbup:


----------



## Catherine602

This thread is very deaturbing. I wonder why this is ok. Why is it ok to have a thread with a title that celerbrates the objectification of young girls? the title is deeply offensive. Women = body parts for sexual use. Young girls are even better body parts. I just find this desturbing. The celebration of the sexualization of younger and younger women by old men is simply disgusting to me. These old men have had their chance at youth. Now they look with averace to shipon off thier youth like leeches. Why is it acceptable to view any segment of humanity as service object. 

How can you regard young girls "tails". They are living human beings. They have purpose in their lives the freedom to mature without the imposition of old men circling them like wild dogs. What do they have in common with these woman, what will they talk about? They are separated by generations and cannot possibly understand them. They certainly don't care about them as peopjus except the parts that they can use, pleasure. ust their "tails". So how is this supportable by those of us with minds not emersed in a sex sex sex. Why should we support the use of young women as sperm receptacles for played out old men. 

Mom and dad, If you are wondering what to tell your daughters as they hit their teens, refer to this thread as a a good object lesson. The problem is that the advances of these men are often intrusive and unwelcomed. I teach students about this age and they are very frank. They are frequently approached by old men, obviously looking to have sex with them. The old perv is a running joke and unwelcomed presence. 

I am at a loss to understand why men are so angry when their wives dismiss theor need for sex. Women read this garbage and the message is clear. Women are useful for sex. The arts of them, thoughts feeling emotions right to choose what to do with their bodies. 

It is not feminism that makes a women declare their right to refuse, it is the fear of being used. Reading this garbage and ready acceptence as an appropriate topic for a marriage forum, is ample confirmation of a woman right to jave sex when she desires it 

I wonder how many men who regard these young women as objects for their sexual gratification, have daughters in their 20s? I wonder how they would feel if these girls were persued by old men looking for a young body part to masturbate into. .
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## tacoma

Umm..Catherine, I didn`t see anyone mention young "girls" in this thread until your post.

Just sayin`


----------



## isla~mama

Broncos Fan said:


> That movie "Election" popped into my head when I first read about this situation.


I was just thinking about that film... what a dismal portrayal of relationships!


----------



## Catherine602

Nothing you said is relavent to calling young women tail and to seek them out for their tail. It is dehumanizing and no other group could be spoken about in this manner except women. It is difficult for me to understand how you came to the conclution that young women were somehow responsible for men regarding them as sex objects. Most young women don't welcome being used but I may be wrong. 

Young women don't call their bodies tail and I am certain they do not see themselves as walking tails waiting for an old man to come alone and use them. 


I teach young men and women in this age group. 100s of young men and women have pasted through my classes.. There were many relationships, engagements and marriages not one was in a relationship with an old man. 

However, they do talk about being approached by old men. They call them pervs. 

I don't know where I said men are to blame I said the men who regard women as objects effect the attitude of many women towards men. I don't think women are at fault for having a normal human reaction thier objectification. That is unless women are expected to never object to anything men do. 

I reserve my right to speak as I feel and I don't care who calls me a feminazi. It wrong and going down the tied raid of men being blamed every time a women say anything that is less than gushing is a crock. 

Men are not weak the ones with a healthy ego can voice thier objection with out feeling attached or my concerns negated because they cannot admit that they are wrong.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Broncos Fan

Catherine602 said:


> Nothing you said is relavent to calling young women tail and to seek them out for their tail. It is dehumanizing and no other group could be spoken about in this manner except women. It is difficult for me to understand how you came to the conclution that young women were somehow responsible for men regarding them as sex objects. Most young women don't welcome being used but I may be wrong.
> 
> Young women don't call their bodies tail and I am certain they do not see themselves as walking tails waiting for an old man to come alone and use them.
> 
> 
> I teach young men and women in this age group. 100s of young men and women have pasted through my classes.. There were many relationships, engagements and marriages not one was in a relationship with an old man.
> 
> However, they do talk about being approached by old men. They call them pervs.
> 
> I don't know where I said men are to blame I said the men who regard women as objects effect the attitude of many women towards men. I don't think women are at fault for having a normal human reaction thier objectification. That is unless women are expected to never object to anything men do.
> 
> I reserve my right to speak as I feel and I don't care who calls me a feminazi. It wrong and going down the tied raid of men being blamed every time a women say anything that is less than gushing is a crock.
> 
> Men are not weak the ones with a healthy ego can voice thier objection with out feeling attached or my concerns negated because they cannot admit that they are wrong.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Thing is, the thread isn't really praising the situation you're describing. In fact it was started by a woman criticizing this kind of interaction. And the phrase "young tail" wasn't chosen by men, but you seemed to say that in your first post. No one is trying to keep you from speaking your mind, but I think you're criticizing something that has little to do with the people you're criticizing.


----------



## Anubis

Oh lordy. 

/Cathereine, not every war is your war.

Here's a flip side of the same coin to consider.

First, the standard boilerplate disclaimer that while we are talking about a large group of males and females, we are not talking about *every* man and woman, and the fact that individual exceptions are all over the place, it does not invalidate the shape and distribution of the larger population.

/prefix "as a group, "

I am hearing a lot of bemoaning that as women get older they have to compete with younger women for the affection and attentions of the more desirable men (who have status, money, power, looks, etc), and that the younger women have more power in the dating market due to youth, beauty and fertility.

What about the young men, who as a group have less status, money, power, etc. who have to compete with the older men who have more? I don't see a single iota of sympathy for them from the gals here. They have no issue with young women passing over the guys around their own age on the basis of things that generally correlate with age in men. Until I see that, you're not going to get much sympathy from me about being passed over for a younger gal.

Like it or not, it's a harsh truth with a lot of evolutionary reasons behind it. 

From the wikipedia entry for "hypergamy".



> Some evolutionary psychologists believe that women exhibit mate-selective preferences for spouses who are greater than them in terms of attained physical attractiveness, educational level, job status, social standing, and capital accumulation. In comparison, males would tend to place higher emphasis on the value of physical attractiveness in a woman alone.[5][6]
> 
> In an anthology about money and relationships by many prominent female writers, the authors expressed that the role money plays in determining how women select long-term male partners is often considered a taboo subject


I think most gals have NO idea what it's like for a young man, when the girl he has a relationship with decides to trade up . It happens every day, and the message about it delivered to men from they day they are born is "Deal with it. Make something more/better of yourself/money/etc and climb the ranks of men so you can be more successful with women". Often, It makes an mental impact (often resulting in bitterness that needs resolving) and further fuels the drive of young men to make them selves successful.

It's just the way life is.

I'll bet that most of the men here have experienced it when they were younger and dating. I certainly did, and it was nothing unusual -- very few women marry (and stay married to) the first guy they date. As individuals, we remember what it's like to have been dumped when we were young because they wanted more than we had to offer. And later in life, when we have a lot more to offer, we tend to take up the opportunity to get with the girls who wouldn't give us the time of day when we were younger. Why shouldn't we? After all, no one is ever telling young women to settle for less than the best guy they can get.

As our experiences are different sides of the same coin, I expect these statements to be mildly polarizing along gender lines...

it is what it is. /cliche

/hey... 100th post!


----------



## that_girl

My lovie friend Gina Moffit and a song she wrote about old men who would hit on her at work :rofl:

I love that girl.  She's so talented. We met on the streets in santa monica almost 5 years ago. Dang. I was sketching, she was waiting for a spot to sing. Fast friends. But that song cracks me up!!


----------



## Anubis

that-girl,

Cute video. Vocals needs to be mixed more prominently. I'll see your video and raise you one: Be Handsome, Be Attractive, Don't be Unattractive

Dating and attraction is inherently unfair.


----------



## that_girl

LOL She was recording in her bedroom. Not professional. wasn't trying to compete


----------



## bubbly girl

My husband has his hands full keeping up with me! LOL He doesn't need a young chick.

He wants to grow old with me and I want the same.:smthumbup:


----------



## allthegoodnamesaregone

Anubis said:


> Oh lordy.
> 
> /Cathereine, not every war is your war.
> 
> Here's a flip side of the same coin to consider.
> 
> First, the standard boilerplate disclaimer that while we are talking about a large group of males and females, we are not talking about *every* man and woman, and the fact that individual exceptions are all over the place, it does not invalidate the shape and distribution of the larger population.
> 
> /prefix "as a group, "
> 
> I am hearing a lot of bemoaning that as women get older they have to compete with younger women for the affection and attentions of the more desirable men (who have status, money, power, looks, etc), and that the younger women have more power in the dating market due to youth, beauty and fertility.
> 
> What about the young men, who as a group have less status, money, power, etc. who have to compete with the older men who have more? I don't see a single iota of sympathy for them from the gals here. They have no issue with young women passing over the guys around their own age on the basis of things that generally correlate with age in men. Until I see that, you're not going to get much sympathy from me about being passed over for a younger gal.
> 
> Like it or not, it's a harsh truth with a lot of evolutionary reasons behind it.
> 
> From the wikipedia entry for "hypergamy".
> 
> 
> 
> I think most gals have NO idea what it's like for a young man, when the girl he has a relationship with decides to trade up . It happens every day, and the message about it delivered to men from they day they are born is "Deal with it. Make something more/better of yourself/money/etc and climb the ranks of men so you can be more successful with women". Often, It makes an mental impact (often resulting in bitterness that needs resolving) and further fuels the drive of young men to make them selves successful.
> 
> It's just the way life is.
> 
> I'll bet that most of the men here have experienced it when they were younger and dating. I certainly did, and it was nothing unusual -- very few women marry (and stay married to) the first guy they date. As individuals, we remember what it's like to have been dumped when we were young because they wanted more than we had to offer. And later in life, when we have a lot more to offer, we tend to take up the opportunity to get with the girls who wouldn't give us the time of day when we were younger. Why shouldn't we? After all, no one is ever telling young women to settle for less than the best guy they can get.
> 
> As our experiences are different sides of the same coin, I expect these statements to be mildly polarizing along gender lines...
> 
> it is what it is. /cliche
> 
> /hey... 100th post!


I'm glad this was brought up, young men are hit with this all the time. I can't recall a single time I dumped a girl, I was always dumped for someone higher on the "food chain" by young women. 

By the time I hit my very early 20's I began going out with older women, usually about five years older than myself and I learned a lot from them about what makes women tick.
They taught me not to take it personally, it just was the nature of things, the best way to deal with it was to become the guy with all the advantages......

Unfortunately I forgot most of that when I finally got married at 34, my wife being 24. I was traded in back in July after 22 years of marriage, my wife trading up to a guy who is considerably less attractive, but make three times what I do. If there is any lessons in all this is we are all replaceable if the spouse can pull it off...


----------



## Catherine602

Broncos Fan said:


> Thing is, the thread isn't really praising the situation you're describing. In fact it was started by a woman criticizing this kind of interaction. And the phrase "young tail" wasn't chosen by men, but you seemed to say that in your first post. No one is trying to keep you from speaking your mind, but I think you're criticizing something that has little to do with the people you're criticizing.


I don't really care which gender started the thread, my objection is in reference to the title an some of the ensuring discussion. 

Are you saying that women can't be as addled brained as men by pointing out the gender of the poster? 

I don't like to speak ill of my gender but some of us can be as ill advised as men. The fact tgat we shoukd know better is another mark against us. 

I dont think that a thread with this title should be on a people positive site. There have been many discussions on may-december romances but they were about relationships between men and woman who care about each other. Nothing is caring about young women who are thought of in thermes or their female anatomy 

What reaction do you think you would get if you approached a young woman and said "what is your feeling about older men and young tail? You'd be lucky to leave the premises with insulting comments hurled your way . and not brick bats. 

If you can't say it to them then don't say it about them. 

It is offensive to me.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Catherine602

T I understand that but is it the young women's fault that they attract this kind of attention. They can't help being young and in their prime. We all get our chance. Why should they be labeled negatively just because one azzzzhole decided to leave his old lady. Why not entitle it "old geezers and foolish old men" if the frustration with some man in the posters life?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## mr.miketastic

Catherine602 said:


> T I understand that but is it the young women's fault that they attract this kind of attention. They can't help being young and in their prime. We all get our chance. Why should they be labeled negatively just because one azzzzhole decided to leave his old lady. Why not entitle it "old geezers and foolish old men" if the frustration with some man in the posters life?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


If anyone were to start a thread like that, then I think it might be you. Funny that this thread was started by a woman who is frustrated by the man in her life. Looks like men are always playing a zero-sum game... Or in the words of a nerd, a zer0-node cluster.


----------



## Gratitude

Catherine602 said:


> What reaction do you think you would get if you approached a young woman and said "what is your feeling about older men and young tail? You'd be lucky to leave the premises with insulting comments hurled your way . and not brick bats.
> 
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I can only speak for me personally as a young(ish) woman and in my early years that if somebody said this to me, I would not be offended. It is what it is. Not every woman feels objectified with these phrases.


----------



## Tall Average Guy

Catherine602 said:


> I don't really care which gender started the thread, my objection is in reference to the title an some of the ensuring discussion.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


That would be more convincing if your first post on the subject did not immediately attack men on this subject:



> This thread is very deaturbing. I wonder why this is ok. Why is it ok to have a thread with a title that celerbrates the objectification of young girls? the title is deeply offensive. Women = body parts for sexual use. Young girls are even better body parts. I just find this desturbing. *The celebration of the sexualization of younger and younger women by old men is simply disgusting to me. These old men have had their chance at youth. Now they look with averace to shipon off thier youth like leeches. Why is it acceptable to view any segment of humanity as service object. *


In a post by a woman bemoaning this behavior, you took an opportunity to lash out at men. Your post reads to assume that a man posted it, because it equates the objectification in the title with the objectification of young girls by old men.

Unfortunately, by setting that tone, it takes away from some otherwise very good points. People who might otherwise have agreed are now on the defensive and far less likely to try and understand what you are communicating. That you backed away does not take away from a person's initial reading of your attack and how it will color their reading subsequent posts.

Finally, I saw very little approval of this occuring. Rather, I most read people explaining why it may occur.


----------



## CandieGirl

All men are pigs!


----------



## chillymorn

CandieGirl said:


> All men are pigs!


Swine it what we like to be refered to as.....onik oink.


----------



## chillymorn

women are just a guilty as men ever hear of a cougar?

if word offend you then you have deep problems they are just words and both genders use them equally to praise and rip.


----------



## CandieGirl

I onlly hate 'cougar' because i get grossed out by older woman/younger man. Just a personal thing, I guess.

Plus, I can picture this one woman I saw about 2 years ago, drunkk off her ass at the local meat market, in too tight clothes, trying too hard to pick up some young guy. Pathetic looking. So I associate a cougar with that vision, not the ahtletic sports model 40 something type of Hollywood lore.

All men are pigs!!!


----------



## chillymorn

*Dean* said:


> When my two daughters were growing up, getting ready to date,
> etc........I used that phase.......men are pigs....to get across
> the point that a man or boy would say anything to get into a girls pants.
> That all men think about is sex. Will say anything for sex.
> 
> My younger one surprised me one day and asked;
> Daddy were you a pig to mommy?
> 
> Good thing her mother was there to answer that question.


and of course you yes thats how I know all men are pigs,


----------



## Mistys dad

All men are pigs,

until the day we quit chasing that person,

then we just go back to being *******s.


----------



## CandieGirl

*Dean* said:


> When my two daughters were growing up, getting ready to date,
> etc........I used that phase.......men are pigs....to get across
> the point that a man or boy would say anything to get into a girls pants.
> That all men think about is sex. Will say anything for sex.
> 
> My younger one surprised me one day and asked;
> Daddy were you a pig to mommy?
> 
> Good thing her mother was there to answer that question.


And my grandmother used to tell me "Don't let the boys maul you."...

LMAO!

I never had a problem with the boys when I was young...I never really felt that they'd say/do anything to get laid. Then again, I was one of those girls that was puttin out....:rofl:


----------



## chillymorn

its funny that when a man chases aftrer younger women we are labled (by society?) PIGS

but when women do the same thing they get a much nicer lable(by society?) cougars.

interesting.


----------



## Enchantment

Trenton said:


> Albeit you may have a lot to do with a game I personally adore, I couldn't disagree with your post above more...such a poet.
> 
> I came across a quote recently and it completely applies here...
> 
> "A question that sometimes drives me hazy: am I or are the others crazy." -Einstein
> 
> Why is it I see the world so differently? Is money just another example of power equal to that of the muscles of early humankind? Do you really feel we are stuck within the limits of our biology and nothing more?--victims yet have all the tools necessary to choose differently?
> 
> This limiting thinking is so destructive, predictable and too comfortable. As thinking, empathetic beings are we not capable of something more than this? Am I to believe I am trapped within the confines of my biology forever while we are at a point where we can trade up hearts via transplant and treat a multitude of illnesses?
> 
> Why is it so many would like to hold fast to and believe that our mental and emotional capacity must stay at the core of the core of where we came from or that the majority must always be correct by default?
> 
> It comes down to what we choose to value in ourselves and in those we choose to love. We are capable of so much more than most are willing to believe.
> 
> I believe in limitless possibilities...like fractals. We define ourselves and then empower or disable ourselves based upon our own definitions.


:iagree:

Poetic indeed, Trenton. Very nice.


----------



## Gratitude

chillymorn said:


> its funny that when a man chases aftrer younger women we are labled (by society?) PIGS
> 
> but when women do the same thing they get a much nicer lable(by society?) cougars.
> 
> interesting.



Cougars sounds more predatory. I'd start running.


----------



## allthegoodnamesaregone

chillymorn said:


> its funny that when a man chases aftrer younger women we are labled (by society?) PIGS
> 
> but when women do the same thing they get a much nicer lable(by society?) cougars.
> 
> interesting.


Especially when the Cougars have often dumped the "Old Boar" for younger pigs......


----------



## chillymorn

Gratitude said:


> Cougars sounds more predatory. I'd start running.


na I want to get caught.......limp,limp look I'm wouded an easy meal for some forouious cougar Oh no fall down and pertent to get away one eye looking back saying wTF is she already.


I guess cougars want younger poorer less experianced lovers.


----------



## chillymorn

allthegoodnamesaregone said:


> Especially when the Cougars have often dumped the "Old Boar" for younger pigs......


so women can be PIGS also. interesting and men can be meat instead of tail. also interesting.


----------



## Enchantment

chillymorn said:


> its funny that when a man chases aftrer younger women we are labled (by society?) PIGS
> 
> but when women do the same thing they get a much nicer lable(by society?) cougars.
> 
> interesting.


It is interesting. Most especially when you start to study the real-life behaviour of pigs and real-life behaviour of cougars.

Pigs, while admittedly having perhaps too much of a perversion for liking to cool down while lying in a pile of mud, are actually very intelligent and intuitive creatures. They are among some of the quickest animals to be able to learn things.

Learn about pigs: http://www.nytimes.com/2009/11/10/science/10angier.html

Cougars, in real-life are actually a bit of nasty business.  They are reclusive and hunt alone. They come together only for mating purposes, and they are stalk-and-ambushers. Not exactly nice, eh?

When you look at the real-life characteristics of each of the animals involved, I think it is quite a dichotomy indeed. The label of 'pig' having a very negative connotation while in real-life pigs are anything but, and the label of 'cougar' having a more positive connotation while in real-life cougars are anything but.

For me, it goes back to a comment I made in another thread the other day about labels. Labels are bad - they represent stereotypes and not the real, human individuals that underly it all. I say lose the stereotypes and lose the labels.

As for me... call me whatever you want...I don't answer unless you say my name.


----------



## Catherine602

Oh I forgot that I dare not utter a word about the destructive nature of some behaviors and beliefs many men find acceptable. If that makes you or anyone not want to read my post then dont read tgem. I am not sure why you point out that my post will not be popular reading if I write anything negative about men? . 

Is that supposed to make me shape what i say to please a particular audience? Well it wont. My thoughts and the expression of them are not controlled by anyone but me. I have no fear of being shunned or attacked for them. If those things matter to you then let them, you are free to do what you like. 

In my estimation, vicious negativity about women is rarely question by women on this forum. Not because the are acceptable but because women are relentless attracted and driven off the forum. I stand by the comments I made. 

They do bear on the subject matter at hand in my judgement. You may not like to hear them but I don't see why that should stop me. Oh yea I am biased
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Broncos Fan

Catherine602 said:


> Oh I forgot that I dare not utter a word about the destructive nature of some behaviors and beliefs many men find acceptable. If that makes you or anyone not want to read my post then dont read tgem. I am not sure why you point out that my post will not be popular reading if I write anything negative about men? .
> 
> Is that supposed to make me shape what i say to please a particular audience? Well it wont. My thoughts and the expression of them are not controlled by anyone but me. I have no fear of being shunned or attacked for them. If those things matter to you then let them, you are free to do what you like.
> 
> In my estimation, vicious negativity about women is rarely question by women on this forum. Not because the are acceptable but because women are relentless attracted and driven off the forum. I stand by the comments I made.
> 
> They do bear on the subject matter at hand in my judgement. You may not like to hear them but I don't see why that should stop me. Oh yea I am biased
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


You're absolutely entitled to your opinion and what you say is actually kind of interesting, though in a bizarre way. I think my only issue at this point is that whatever the intention of the thread was, helpful to OP or not, it's gone in an entirely different direction now because you've placed a ton of emphasis on whether or not she should have used a particular phrase in her title. That's too bad.


----------



## mr.miketastic

Catherine602 said:


> Oh I forgot that I dare not utter a word about the destructive nature of some behaviors and beliefs many men find acceptable. If that makes you or anyone not want to read my post then dont read tgem. I am not sure why you point out that my post will not be popular reading if I write anything negative about men? .
> 
> Is that supposed to make me shape what i say to please a particular audience? Well it wont. My thoughts and the expression of them are not controlled by anyone but me. I have no fear of being shunned or attacked for them. If those things matter to you then let them, you are free to do what you like.
> 
> In my estimation, vicious negativity about women is rarely question by women on this forum. Not because the are acceptable but because women are relentless attracted and driven off the forum. I stand by the comments I made.
> 
> They do bear on the subject matter at hand in my judgement. You may not like to hear them but I don't see why that should stop me. Oh yea I am biased
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Step back a moment and re-read. You were bemoaning how offensive the thread was, attacked men, crawfished when called on it and now you are telling people to not read your posts if offended? Physician, heal thyself!


----------



## Mistys dad

Catherine602 said:


> Oh I forgot that I dare not utter a word about the destructive nature of some behaviors and beliefs many men find acceptable. If that makes you or anyone not want to read my post then dont read tgem. I am not sure why you point out that my post will not be popular reading if I write anything negative about men? .
> 
> Is that supposed to make me shape what i say to please a particular audience? Well it wont. My thoughts and the expression of them are not controlled by anyone but me. I have no fear of being shunned or attacked for them. If those things matter to you then let them, you are free to do what you like.
> 
> In my estimation, vicious negativity about women is rarely question by women on this forum. Not because the are acceptable but because women are relentless attracted and driven off the forum. I stand by the comments I made.
> 
> They do bear on the subject matter at hand in my judgement. You may not like to hear them but I don't see why that should stop me. Oh yea I am biased
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Bemoan the visious negativity towards women all you want.

Then take a minute and go back and see what you have called men in this thread.


----------



## Catherine602

I disagree if I see some term that is an affront to my sesibilities then I'll say it. 

What bad about that. That I raise a concern that makes people uncomfortable or that it has no merit? If it has no merit then say so. if it makes you uncomfortable that to bad. 

I think your use of bazaar is bazaar. many threads turn on the opinion of one poster. I never had the sense that there was some unwritten rule governing post in that way. I said what I saw. The discussion is instructive for me. I don't mind that people disagree and give cogent resonses. I don't mind being swayed by there options. Why shouod you? That has happened a lot for me. That is why I say what I feel. 

Putting a labels on legitimate concerns is meaningless.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Tall Average Guy

Catherine602 said:


> Oh I forgot that I dare not utter a word about the destructive nature of some behaviors and beliefs many men find acceptable. If that makes you or anyone not want to read my post then dont read tgem. I am not sure why you point out that my post will not be popular reading if I write anything negative about men? .
> 
> Is that supposed to make me shape what i say to please a particular audience? Well it wont. My thoughts and the expression of them are not controlled by anyone but me. I have no fear of being shunned or attacked for them. If those things matter to you then let them, you are free to do what you like.
> 
> In my estimation, vicious negativity about women is rarely question by women on this forum. Not because the are acceptable but because women are relentless attracted and driven off the forum. I stand by the comments I made.
> 
> They do bear on the subject matter at hand in my judgement. You may not like to hear them but I don't see why that should stop me. Oh yea I am biased
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


If your goal is merely to rant and rage against what you consider unfair, then have at it.

But if your goal is to convince others so that you can effect change, than consider your approach.

Unfortunately, if you continue to stand by your comments lashing out at men alone, then your rhetoric will hide the quality of your points.


----------



## mr.miketastic

Catherine602 said:


> I disagree if I see some term that is an affront to my sesibilities then I'll say it.
> 
> What bad about that. That I raise a concern that makes people uncomfortable or that it has no merit? If it has no merit then say so. if it makes you uncomfortable that to bad.
> 
> I think your use of bazaar is bazaar. many threads turn on the opinion of one poster. I never had the sense that there was some unwritten rule governing post in that way. I said what I saw. The discussion is instructive for me. I don't mine that people disagree and give cogent resonses. I don't mind being swayed by there options. That has happened a lot for me. That is why I say what I feel.
> 
> Putting a labels on legitimate concerns is meaningless.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Imagine having to hear the same music every time you turn on a radio? 
Now imagine someone posting how men are awful and are all objectifiers, pigs and <insert gross generalization here> ad infinitum, ad nauseam. Of course people will get offended, and of course you can tell them to stop reading your posts, but the way it was handled by you is like a coke-fiend telling others drugs are bad and then immediately snorting a huge rail.


----------



## chillymorn

Catherine602 said:


> I disagree if I see some term that is an affront to my sesibilities then I'll say it.
> 
> What bad about that. That I raise a concern that makes people uncomfortable or that it has no merit? If it has no merit then say so. if it makes you uncomfortable that to bad.
> 
> I think your use of bazaar is bazaar. many threads turn on the opinion of one poster. I never had the sense that there was some unwritten rule governing post in that way. I said what I saw. The discussion is instructive for me. I don't mine that people disagree and give cogent resonses. I don't mind being swayed by there options. That has happened a lot for me. That is why I say what I feel.
> 
> Putting a labels on legitimate concerns is meaningless.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


so its allright if you offend but not if somone offends you?

special rights not equal rights,

why don't you take your own advice and not respond to the post that offend you? Its seems that do the exact thing to don't want others do.


----------



## CandieGirl

...I love men...


----------



## Catherine602

I don't know why you repeat this point I already said I don't care. If you or anyone stops reading and commenting on all furtue post by me then so be it.. Alright I'll take your ultimatum and I stand by my post. Now you can adhear to your line in tge sand and stop reading all future post.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## AFEH

mr.miketastic said:


> Step back a moment and re-read. You were bemoaning how offensive the thread was, attacked men, crawfished when called on it and now you are telling people to not read your posts if offended? *Physician, heal thyself!*


I can’t see that happening. Not for a long time yet anyway.

She was probably deeply wounded as a young girl, maybe even traumatised and now likely suffers from PTSD. And each time she reads something here that triggers her, she gets traumatised again and hence her repeated attacks on “Man”.

But unfortunately she is like the woman who cries “Rape” when no rape has occurred. But to prove her point and to try and maintain her credibility she just makes more and more things up as she goes along. And so she becomes deluded through repetition, she actually believes the things she says as though they are the honest truth. She sure does paint all of man kind with one exceedingly big and dirty brush.


She will likely go on this way until she heals her innermost wounds. But then again she may never do that but until that time she’ll be reliant on the goodwill, patience and tolerance of man. Even right now in TAM in the men’s clubhouse.

Even now in these days the woman who falsely cries Rape gets less than a third of the sentence than the man would have got had he actually been guilty of rape.


----------



## Catherine602

If I have offended anyone then they should be as forthright as I was. Making an accusation with out supporting it is difficult to answer. That is why I gave some dataio about why it offended me. You might do the same.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Catherine602

Afeh you got it. Age 15 and it has affected my perception of men. The rape stuff Is way off the mark but the rest is on target so that triumphs the not so accurate stuff. You obviously feel strongly about this and I accept that. 

In fact, some very patient and secure men on this forum have helled me enormusly to heal some of my wounds. This forum helped me more than years of therapy and i am greatful for that. There are still tiggers. Since I experienced this at such a young age and the perpetrator was never punished enrages me. I have suffered but he whet on with his life accepted by the community with a lovely wife and 3 children. 

He was free to destroy other girls. It seems that the spirit, minds and emotions of girls don't matter, just their tails. That's what bother me about this term and the easy acceptence of this behavior by our culture. It invites this kind of thing by the more unscruplous men so it is sweep under the rug. 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Broncos Fan

Catherine602 said:


> Afeh you got it. Age 15 and it has affected my perception of men.
> 
> In fact, some very patient and secure men on this forum have helled me enormusly to heal some of my wounds. This forum helped me more than years of therapy and i am greatful for that. There are still tiggers. Since I experienced this at such a young age and the perpetrator was never punished enrages me. I have suffered but he whet on with his life accepted by the community with a lovely wife and 3 children. He was free to destroy other girls. It seems that the spirit, minds and emotions of girls don't matter, just their tails.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Ahh, this suddenly makes a lot more sense then. It's a good thing AFEH perceived all this in your background. I had no idea. Hopefully things keep getting better for you and I'm glad to hear this site has been so helpful.


----------



## Tall Average Guy

Catherine602 said:


> I don't know why you repeat this point I already said I don't care. If you or anyone stops reading and commenting on all furtue post by me then so be it.. Alright I'll take your ultimatum and I stand by my post. Now you can adhear to your line in tge sand and stop reading all future post.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


So your goal is not to persuade others and change their mind, but merely to antagonize? That is to bad, because you very often have important things to say and consider. That effecting change is merely a dressing for your words is sad.


----------



## AFEH

Catherine602 said:


> Afeh you got it. Age 15 and it has affected my perception of men. The rape stuff Is way off the mark but the rest is on target so that triumphs the not so accurate stuff. You obviously feel strongly about this and I accept that.
> 
> In fact, some very patient and secure men on this forum have helled me enormusly to heal some of my wounds. This forum helped me more than years of therapy and i am greatful for that. There are still tiggers. Since I experienced this at such a young age and the perpetrator was never punished enrages me. I have suffered but he whet on with his life accepted by the community with a lovely wife and 3 children.
> 
> He was free to destroy other girls. It seems that the spirit, minds and emotions of girls don't matter, just their tails. That's what bother me about this term and the easy acceptence of this behavior by our culture. It invites this kind of thing by the more unscruplous men so it is sweep under the rug.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Out of all my time on TAM I have seen just two men I’d consider as “bad men”. Just two out of the hundreds here.

Yet you treat all the men on TAM as though they are bad men. That is your starting point with them. And in that you do all the men on TAM a massive disservice in that you falsely accuse them of heinous crimes against women.


I can assure you all the men on TAM are Good Men, bad men don’t come to places like TAM, some struggling one heck of a lot with the woman in their lives. Yes men do struggle as well and we do have emotions. Some times exceptionally strong emotions.


I think you owe all the good men on TAM a very big apology.




The guy in England who was falsely accused of rape considers that his life has been destroyed and his parents say the same thing. Yet the woman gets just two years in prison for her crime. But such was the hideous and evil nature of her false accusation the judge jailed her even though she was pregnant with twins.



Watch out for you false accusations and persecutions of Man based on one man’s crime against you.


----------



## Catherine602

That is very hard to do AFEH as you know. Working towards it is the key. 

I am not aware of false accusation. Just because there have been fallse accusations of rape does not make my experience a lie. It is also not inconsequential. The fact that it was ignored is a reflection of this fear of false accusation and the cavalier attitude towards rape. In the past all rape victima were treated like liers or the crime was considered inconsequential. That has changed to a large degree due to women forcing change. 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Catherine602

Tall Average Guy said:


> So your goal is not to persuade others and change their mind, but merely to antagonize? That is to bad, because you very often have important things to say and consider. That effecting change is merely a dressing for your words is sad.


What happen to not reading my post?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Anubis

Trenton said:


> Albeit you may have a lot to do with a game I personally adore, I couldn't disagree with your post above more...such a poet.
> 
> I came across a quote recently and it completely applies here...
> 
> "A question that sometimes drives me hazy: am I or are the others crazy." -Einstein
> 
> Why is it I see the world so differently? Is money just another example of power equal to that of the muscles of early humankind? Do you really feel we are stuck within the limits of our biology and nothing more?--victims yet have all the tools necessary to choose differently?
> 
> This limiting thinking is so destructive, predictable and too comfortable. As thinking, empathetic beings are we not capable of something more than this? Am I to believe I am trapped within the confines of my biology forever while we are at a point where we can trade up hearts via transplant and treat a multitude of illnesses?
> 
> Why is it so many would like to hold fast to and believe that our mental and emotional capacity must stay at the core of the core of where we came from or that the majority must always be correct by default?
> 
> It comes down to what we choose to value in ourselves and in those we choose to love. We are capable of so much more than most are willing to believe.
> 
> I believe in limitless possibilities...like fractals. We define ourselves and then empower or disable ourselves based upon our own definitions.


I'm quite curious now. What exactly is it that you think I am saying that you completely disagree with?

Are you saying that generally speaking, women do not value those traits I mentioned in men?

Or are you saying that as men age they do not acquire more of those traits?

Or are you saying that young men do not have the experience of being dumped for a (usually) older man who has more to offer?

Or are you saying that women are not encourage by (media/families/mothers/etc) to find/keep the "best" man they can (via their own definition of best)?

Or are you saying that men (of all ages) do not compete for the most desirable women?

Or all of the above?

You've got me confused.


----------



## CandieGirl

Back to the original question of who is worse, the money grubbing young girl, or the dirty old pervy man, I'd say it's a tie...


----------



## that_girl

I'm getting old. I would love if someone said I was a hot piece of ass :rofl:

Hubs says it. that's good enough for me


----------



## that_girl

CandieGirl said:


> Back to the original question of who is worse, the money grubbing young girl, or the dirty old pervy man, I'd say it's a tie...


And so they belong together!

:smthumbup:


----------



## tacoma

that_girl said:


> And so they belong together!
> 
> :smthumbup:


That's all I've been trying to say!


_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Tall Average Guy

Catherine602 said:


> What happen to not reading my post?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Where did I say I would not read your posts? I did say that much of the valuable information that you seek to convey will be lost in the din of your tone and unreasonable attacks. While, I will continue to read your posts to try to gain insight if possible, it will be difficult not to discount some points.


----------



## LovesHerMan

that_girl said:


> And so they belong together!
> 
> :smthumbup:


Remember Anna Nicole Smith and J. Howard Marshall? I also got a hoot from Hugh Hefner and those twins.


----------



## Kobo

Don't know why you guys still bother with Catherine. Just read her stuff (or not) and move on. There are many who can't see the world outside their hurts. Both women and men on this board. Every issue is seen through that lense. There is no need to argue with her or discuss. She won't see your side. Take what you can from her posts and move on.


----------



## Kobo

that_girl said:


> I'm getting old. I would love if someone said I was a hot piece of ass :rofl:
> 
> Hubs says it. that's good enough for me


You're a hot piece of ass


----------



## Mistys dad

that_girl said:


> I'm getting old. I would love if someone said I was a hot piece of ass :rofl:
> 
> Hubs says it. that's good enough for me


We could start a poll.:redcard:


----------



## CandieGirl

Working in an industry that is male dominated, I get stared at and ogled every day. They're all just so happy to see a pair of titties walking by, they don't care HOW old I am...LMAO!


----------



## mr.miketastic

CandieGirl said:


> Working in an industry that is male dominated, I get stared at and ogled every day. They're all just so happy to see a pair of titties walking by, they don't care HOW old I am...LMAO!


What's even more awesome is if that sweet pair is attached to someone who knows the difference between NBD, Hot-add and SAN transport modes


----------



## that_girl

Mistys dad said:


> We could start a poll.:redcard:


:rofl::rofl::rofl: No, no. lolll That's ok. But thanks for the laugh!


----------



## Tall Average Guy

CandieGirl said:


> Working in an industry that is male dominated, I get stared at and ogled every day. They're all just so happy to see a pair of titties walking by, they don't care HOW old I am...LMAO!


If I recall that picture you used as your avatar correctly, it was not desparation that was making them stare!


----------



## FirstYearDown

mr.miketastic said:


> Imagine having to hear the same music every time you turn on a radio?
> Now imagine someone posting how men are awful and are all objectifiers, pigs and <insert gross generalization here> ad infinitum, ad nauseam. Of course people will get offended, and of course you can tell them to stop reading your posts, but the way it was handled by you is like a coke-fiend telling others drugs are bad and then immediately snorting a huge rail.


:iagree:

Catherine, why is it okay for you to denounce men? :scratchhead: 

All of the awful generalizations just make you look irrational and sexist. As a woman, I find that embarrassing and sickening. 

You remind me of Andrea Dworkin....nasty assumptions about males which are ridiculous at best. Ugh! 

Your bad experience is no excuse for being horrendously insulting to males. I was sexually abused at seven, raped at nineteen and duped by more than one manipulative man. 

Guess what? I still don't think that all men are evil and cruel. So drop the "I hate men because one was so awful to me" nonsense. All that does is give you an excuse to be bitter.


----------



## AFEH

Catherine602 said:


> That is very hard to do AFEH as you know. Working towards it is the key.
> 
> I am not aware of false accusation. Just because there have been fallse accusations of rape does not make my experience a lie. It is also not inconsequential. The fact that it was ignored is a reflection of this fear of false accusation and the cavalier attitude towards rape. In the past all rape victima were treated like liers or the crime was considered inconsequential. That has changed to a large degree due to women forcing change.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I know you are not aware of false accusations. That’s because you actually believe what you say, you do not believe your accusations to be false. And so you feel justified in making your accusations and therefore do not retract them. But they are your delusions.


----------



## Anubis

Trenton said:


> That is a lot of questions. I hope you'll answer mine!
> 
> I won't disagree that all of what you are saying happens or that the majority accepts it as a natural occurrence.
> 
> What I am saying is that it doesn't have to happen. We are not biologically destined to do any specific actions and are very capable of doing differently.
> 
> Those who do behave in a certain way that suits them are still responsible for that behavior and those they hurt as a result of their behavior.


Now that I see what you were saying, I don't think we were disagreement at all. Also, did you notice my disclaimer at the start of my post? 

We all carry a lot of biological programming. Each one of us is a unique blend of factors, but when I look at humans in en-mass, the tendency is to do and pursue things that support reproductive success. 

However, as individuals, we like what we like. And as individuals, we are looking out for ourselves. I don't think that people make the decisions just because of biological destiny as you call it, but that they think and believe that they are making a choice that is good for them.

Being dumped by someone you want to stay involved with sucks, especially when it is for someone else who has something to provide that you don't. But it's a a part of life too. 

All that said, I should note that I didn't really address part of the the OP's post which dealt with the act of leaving your spouse for someone younger (or richer). There's a completely separate issue there from what I was talking about --calling it quits on a marriage because because you found someone 'better' (assuming that for the sake of this discussion, there is nothing wrong with the current marriage - good sex, communication, etc). In that case I've got multiple problems with the person who leaves and didn't take their marriage seriously. There is always going to be someone out there who is richer, or younger, or whatever than you, and if your partner is going to spend the years with you looking to trade up to the next better thing... well, that was never a partnership and a commitment in the first place.

On the flip side, when we are single, aren't we often in the process of trying to find the best partner for us? If you are going to decide that person X is better for you than person Y, no matter what the reason, isn't that the time to make the choice? I guess I see marriage as dividing line for this behavior. You're done looking at the cars on the lot and it's time to make a decision and take just one home (or none) and no more 'test drives' :rofl:.


----------



## allthegoodnamesaregone

Anubis said:


> Now that I see what you were saying, I don't think we were disagreement at all. Also, did you notice my disclaimer at the start of my post?
> 
> We all carry a lot of biological programming. Each one of us is a unique blend of factors, but when I look at humans in en-mass, the tendency is to do and pursue things that support reproductive success.
> 
> However, as individuals, we like what we like. And as individuals, we are looking out for ourselves. I don't think that people make the decisions just because of biological destiny as you call it, but that they think and believe that they are making a choice that is good for them.
> 
> Being dumped by someone you want to stay involved with sucks, especially when it is for someone else who has something to provide that you don't. But it's a a part of life too.
> 
> All that said, I should note that I didn't really address part of the the OP's post which dealt with the act of leaving your spouse for someone younger (or richer). There's a completely separate issue there from what I was talking about --calling it quits on a marriage because because you found someone 'better' (assuming that for the sake of this discussion, there is nothing wrong with the current marriage - good sex, communication, etc). In that case I've got multiple problems with the person who leaves and didn't take their marriage seriously. There is always going to be someone out there who is richer, or younger, or whatever than you, and if your partner is going to spend the years with you looking to trade up to the next better thing... well, that was never a partnership and a commitment in the first place.
> 
> On the flip side, when we are single, aren't we often in the process of trying to find the best partner for us? If you are going to decide that person X is better for you than person Y, no matter what the reason, isn't that the time to make the choice? I guess I see marriage as dividing line for this behavior. You're done looking at the cars on the lot and it's time to make a decision and take just one home (or none) and no more 'test drives' :rofl:.


All I can say is it's a weird old world, my wife left for a younger man who is the complete opposite of me, he's fat, and appears to have social problems, but makes a lot more money than me and is quite a bit younger. I can see where a wife might hit 45 and think "there must be more to life" and grab at a better financial option, but I don't get what's been happening to me lately.

Where it gets weirder, is this past three weeks I have had very obvious offers from much younger women (late 20's - early 30's, I'm 57") who know I don't have a lot of money, but from getting to know me seem to find me highly attractive. 

I'm in great shape due to the 180 I started back in July. I'm in the gym four days a week and [email protected] 6'1" and 180lbs. I'm in the best shape of my life and still have all my hair, but still I am 57! not 37. 

These are very attractive women who are very intelligent and would be a prize for any man. Why they would be attracted to a man of my age I have no idea, it's not like I could whisk them off to Paris with me or offer them much in the way of anything material. It's mystery to me why this "Young tail" is so interested in this "Old Boar"


----------



## ocotillo

endlessgrief said:


> Perhaps some of you men can get me to understand this ever growing fascination.


Have you ever seen the 1958 movie _Gigi_ with Leslie Caron and Louis Jourdan? The one where Maurice Chevalier sings the song, 'Thank Heaven For Little Girls' (For they grow up in the most delightful ways....)

I don't personally approve of the wealthy mature man / "kept" woman relationship because it hearkens back to a time when women had fewer rights and opportunities. But I also don't believe this is an ever growing fascination. Gigi was only a movie, but what it depicted was a historical reality not so very long ago. 

The professional courtesan was a socially acceptable station in society and men with means got away with such relationships right under everyone's nose. The relationship between Louis XV, Marie Leszczyńska, his legal wife and Jean Antoinette Poisson, his mistress is a famous example, but it is not unique.


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## chillymorn

personaly tail don't do much for me I like snapper!!!!!!!!


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## allthegoodnamesaregone

stritle said:


> if i'm ever looking again, i'd look for someone younger.
> it's just a more likely match for the active lifestyle i like.
> same age is still fine, but the number of available women that have kept in good shape and are active, is far less.


That's what I'm finding as well, even my wife who was 11 years younger than me quit doing things like rollerblading and even going for walks after our youngest reached about 10. ( she would have been 40). It was like pulling nails to get her out of the house and away from the TV and computer. I'm in the gym most days of the week and seldom see any women my age (57) in what I would consider good physical shape. It seems they quite going at about 45, at least in my area.


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## allthegoodnamesaregone

Trenton said:


> Personally, if I were ever looking again, age would not be a deterrent nor would financial status. I'm 37 so not considered young tail anymore anyway--haha.
> 
> BUT I do think older men offer more maturity and knowledge and hopefully know themselves and know what they want better than they did when they were in their 20-30's. Of course, if they're set in their ways, unwilling to explore and basically a curmudgeon I wouldn't want anything to do with them, but a sustained passion for life is very attractive.


Well, you'd be "Young tail " to me ;~) I guess in my case you might be right. It could be a matter that both women know from our social interactions I do have quite a passion for life. They also know what I've been through with my MLC wife and have said they find my "Onward and Upward" approach to life very admirable. 

I don't know where this will go, I promised myself I'd give it a year on my own before I did anything. I'm approaching 9 months since my W gave me the speech and walked away with basically the clothes on her back, and it does not appear she's coming back...So it looks like "Young Boar" is on the menu for her and "Young Tail" for me.


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## allthegoodnamesaregone

Trenton said:


> OK, got ya. I misinterpreted your post to mean that more often than not biology dictates our choices.


I like the car analogy, we just got traded in for what appeared to be a better model....Hopefully they find out "mileage will vary" and you have to read the fine print about warranties ;~)


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## sirdano

I would rather grow old with someone I can relate to than someone that does not understand me.

There is more to life than just SEX. In then end you will need someone to talk to.


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## Jellybeans

My exH is 4 yrs my senior and I've always dated around my age and someday I'd like to date someone 7-10 years older than me at some point just to try it.


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## cloudwithleggs

older men well i'm thinking going younger men, wonders if men over 40 really still have a sex drive or energy, so seeing as i keep getting offered twenty year olds i might just have to go there for sex. I am seriously considering it.


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## that_girl

Age isn't a big deal. My husband is 7 years younger but our chemistry and ability to get along is better than with the men i dated who were my age or older.

When you're both adults, in the same place in life (career, etc) then who cares. It's maturity, not age, that helps a relationship be good.

I dated a man who was 14 years older than me and I swear, I felt like his mother!

With Hubs, he may be younger, but I feel protected and taken care of. He is smart, innovative and a good provider. I never think about his age because he's so mature.


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## anotherguy

The 'MILF' thread made me notice this thread too...

Frankly, beyond the superficial attractiveness of youth, I am not seriously attracted to women younger than...say... I dont know.. 35 or 40? 

Actually forget that line of reasoning - focusing on age is abroken concept in some respects. What I am more attracted to is confidence, intelligence, disposition, wit, kindness, empathy, humor, perspective, experience, health, self awareness, adventurousness, exhuberance, curiosity... personality traits and the like. 

Yeah a nice a$$, flawless skin, tight body and the like are nice...which may or may not be more likely in youth. When you get right down to it for me, those I realize now... are not worth much in the grand scheme of things. You can have a killer body that makes me lust after you... but I assure you... that lust will last for about 30 seconds if I dont fully respect you as a person or an equal.


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## cloudwithleggs

who the hell wants a relationship, i don't, just sex will do me fine and the only moaning i ever want to hear is sexual.


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## anotherguy

cloudwithleggs said:


> who the hell wants a relationship, i don't, just sex will do me fine and the only moaning i ever want to hear is sexual.


"who the hell wants a relationship"...That pretty much says it all doesnt it?

Thats all fine - you and I are simply looking for different 'things'. For me, sex is just about pointless wthout a relationship... it certainly isnt nearly as good nor as satisfying. 

Sex by itself, on the other hand - with any warm body... is better than nothing I suppose.


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## AFEH

Jellybeans said:


> My exH is 4 yrs my senior and I've always dated around my age and someday I'd like to date someone 7-10 years older than me at some point just to try it.


I wonder why that is? If it’s about maturity (or lack of it) from my experience a person’s biological age doesn’t give any indication at all about how mature they are. There’s many an elder person who is exceptionally immature and with some it seems the more they age the more child like they become.


I think the same goes with emotional intelligence. Biological age doesn’t give any indication about how emotionally intelligent a person is. It’s one of the delights I find in my son’s twenty-five year old partner, her emotional intelligence and maturity. She’s far more inclined that way than some people I know who are two or three times her age.


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## Runs like Dog

Older is better because who wants a woman who hasn't cracked her own owners' manual yet. If I wanted something with some assembly required I'd go to IKEA. 

Slowly swirling bourbon around in her mouth is tons sexier than organic milk.


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## larry.gray

CandieGirl said:


> All men are pigs!


Not all men are constantly thinking about how to get a woman in the sack.








Some are gay :smthumbup:


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## AFEH

Runs like Dog said:


> Older is better because who wants a woman who hasn't cracked her own owners' manual yet. If I wanted something with some assembly required I'd go to IKEA.
> 
> Slowly swirling bourbon around in her mouth is tons sexier than organic milk.


You really think because a person is older they’ve cracked their owners manual? Some in their 40s, 50s, 60s, 70s and 80s are still operating with the owners manual they had as five year olds and in their teens! A vast number of people simply haven’t updated their owners manual as time has gone by and they remain totally unaware and unadjusted to the often massive changes both inside and outside of them.


Biological age gives absolutely no indication of what lays inside a person. Not even from a health and fitness perspective let alone emotional and spiritual maturity.


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## tacoma

AFEH said:


> Biological age gives absolutely no indication of what lays inside a person. Not even from a health and fitness perspective let alone emotional and spiritual maturity.


My life experience evidences this idea as false.

Age is indeed a general indicator of maturity and experience of intellect.

It is in fact a strong indicator.


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## AFEH

tacoma said:


> My life experience evidences this idea as false.
> 
> Age is indeed a general indicator of maturity and experience of intellect.
> 
> It is in fact a strong indicator.


:rofl:


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## krismimo

Interesting topic, I'm 28 years old and my husband is 46 years old. I think it is funny when some people who do not understand something just put everything all in one category. But lucky me I don't take things personally or else I would have jumped ship long ago. I dated people my age and it didn't work out, my husband was married to someone the same age and it REALLY didn't work out. We love each other for us.... I have been though a lot in my young life to appreciate the small blessings that do come our way. 

Did he suffer from a mid life crisis? NO... is he rich? No... Am I looking for a father figure? No.. Am I submissive do I know what I want in life am I a young girl who doesn't know which way is up HELL No, he loves me for me and I love him for him. But I understand the misconception and I understand the dirty looks, and I have received the petty comments about money and it all wasn't true. But we have a wonderful marriage and we make the most of it. My husband is a kidney patient he has kidney disease (Kidney failure) and I help take care of him something his first wife did not want anything to do with by the way and she was the same age as him, so age in a lot of cases has nothing to do with maturity.


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## anotherguy

airplane888 said:


> Every young women I see reminds me of my 22 year old daughter, what is really hot is a 48 - 60 year old women that have has one butt instead of 4. Nothing is more of a turn on than a flat belly that lines up with there pubic area and cheeks on her butt that I can hold in one hand ....
> 
> airplane


friend... TMI. You are creeping me out a little.


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## tacoma

AFEH said:


> :rofl:


Do you care to elaborate or would that be too much trouble for you?


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## CandieGirl

Broncos Fan said:


> I know yours is the right attitude to have, but honestly I'm almost at the opposite point myself these days. I spent every day from the ages of 18 to 35 being a good husband, working hard, being "the grown up." My wife responded these last few years by saying I'm boring and that she wants to sleep around (she hasn't done so thankfully). I turned down so many come on's by women over the years, but *my wife gets hit on these days in a bar* or something and she thinks the other man is a god of some kind. But just knowing that I missed out on the early freedom that so many take for granted and it meant nothing to her really makes being single seem appealing these days.


Yes, she's reinventing the wheel, don't you know? Makes me laugh...

I remember being 22, seeing all the older broads in the bar, and we'd all laugh at them...35-40 sitting there, all whoored up, looking for god knows what. Puh-lease!!!


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## CandieGirl

larry.gray said:


> Not all men are constantly thinking about how to get a woman in the sack.


No I know of at LEAST one who isn't. Amazing odds, dontcha think.


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## Acorn

tacoma said:


> My life experience evidences this idea as false.
> 
> Age is indeed a general indicator of maturity and experience of intellect.
> 
> It is in fact a strong indicator.


I wish I agreed with this... just last weekend I saw a youth sports coach whining, jumping up and down, and complaining about a call by the referee in a game full of 10 year old kids. She looked ridiculous. I think even the 10 year olds were embarrassed!


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## anotherguy

Acorn said:


> I wish I agreed with this... just last weekend I saw a youth sports coach whining, jumping up and down, and complaining about a call by the referee in a game full of 10 year old kids. She looked ridiculous. I think even the 10 year olds were embarrassed!


I'm with Tacoma on this one. You are citing an aberation - an emotional moron and holding it up as evidence.

I suppose I am no better, using my own anecdotal evidence to support my position... but I do believe age, life, wisdom and experience are generally good things - and there is only one way to get them. Time.

Yeah - if you are an idiot - time may concentrate and refine that as well.


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## Acorn

anotherguy said:


> I'm with Tacoma on this one. You are citing an aberation - an emotional moron and holding it up as evidence.
> 
> I suppose I am no better, using my own anecdotal evidence to support my position... but I do believe age, life, wisdom and experience are generally good things - and there is only one way to get them. Time.
> 
> Yeah - if you are an idiot - time may concentrate and refine that as well.


Age and experiences give you the opportunity to mature and grow, but it up to the individual what they do with the experiences.

Maturity-wise, I'll take the 30 year old who is more in touch with themselves and has reflected a bit on their experiences than the 70 year old who has run his life on auto-pilot.


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## anotherguy

AFEH said:


> Biological age gives absolutely no indication of what lays inside a person.


No, it doesnt in a general sense. But I will bet with you that given 2 random samplings of 1,000 people... the first between 18 and 25 and the second between 45 and 55... you will find meaningful differences in outlook, ability to handle crisis, familiarity with a wider range of circumstances and social situations.

You can rest assured that experience in life matters. I think its disingenuous to suggest that it does not. It is not an automatic credit, but certainly nets to the positive.


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## anotherguy

Acorn said:


> Maturity-wise, I'll take the 30 year old who is more in touch with themselves and has reflected a bit on their experiences than the 70 year old who has run his life on auto-pilot.


Pithy, but Im not so sure. I have found 70 year olds have some things to learn from - and likely more than the wisdm of a well rounded 30 year old... if I was to make a bet.


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## AFEH

tacoma said:


> My life experience evidences this idea as false.
> 
> Age is indeed a general indicator of maturity and experience of intellect.
> 
> It is in fact a strong indicator.





tacoma said:


> Do you care to elaborate or would that be too much trouble for you?


Not too much trouble just can’t see the point. You can no more “prove your point” than I can prove mine. Such is the nature of the topic. And I have no wish whatsoever to convert you to my point of view. Or to be converted to yours.

Your mention of intellect _“the ability to understand and to think in an intelligent way, the ability to do these things to a high level”_ or _“a very educated person whose interests are studying and other activities that involve careful thinking”_ rather put me off anyway being a bit academic.

Even those with the highest of intellects can struggle with both emotional and spiritual maturity and intelligence. No matter what their age or “experience of intellect”!


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## Jellybeans

AFEH said:


> I wonder why that is?


Because as I said, I want to try it. Nothing more, nothing less. I have never dated someone 7-10 yrs older and want to experience it.


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## AFEH

anotherguy said:


> No, it doesnt in a general sense. But I will bet with you that given 2 random samplings of 1,000 people... the first between 18 and 25 and the second between 45 and 55... you will find meaningful differences in outlook, ability to handle crisis, familiarity with a wider range of circumstances and social situations.
> 
> You can rest assured that experience in life matters. I think its disingenuous to suggest that it does not. It is not an automatic credit, but certainly nets to the positive.


I’m at an age when a policeman looks about ten years old. I’m not talking about ageism whatsoever which I believe to be a very serious issue. Went through all that a while back and I’ve even been guilty of it myself when in my thirties. I wouldn’t hire anyone over forty! Which when I was in my fifties looked very much more than stupidity.

There are many elder people who are just older versions than the person they were in their young teens and even younger! Having as Acorn says, run their lives on autopilot. I actually think they are more the norm than the exception.


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## anotherguy

AFEH said:


> ..There are many elder people who are just older versions than the person they were in their young teens and even younger! Having as Acorn says, run their lives on autopilot. I actually think they are more the norm than the exception.


I can entertain that notion. Im not ready to accept that the majority of people do not generally benefit from life however - that they are simply 30+ years older and have gained nothing of utility.

shrug.


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## CandieGirl

Jellybeans said:


> Because as I said, I want to try it. Nothing more, nothing less. I have never dated someone 7-10 yrs older and want to experience it.


Unless you're 12 , it won't really make that much of a difference. The gap seems to narrow with the passage of time, at least with my experiences.


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## AFEH

anotherguy said:


> I can entertain that notion. Im not ready to accept that the majority of people do not generally benefit from life however - that they are simply 30+ years older and have gained nothing of utility.
> 
> shrug.


Jolly good!


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## nice777guy

AFEH said:


> I’m at an age when a policeman looks about ten years old. I’m not talking about ageism whatsoever which I believe to be a very serious issue. Went through all that a while back and I’ve even been guilty of it myself when in my thirties. I wouldn’t hire anyone over forty! Which when I was in my fifties looked very much more than stupidity.
> 
> There are many elder people who are just older versions than the person they were in their young teens and even younger! Having as Acorn says, run their lives on autopilot. I actually think they are more the norm than the exception.


I can't help but think that "experience" is one of life's best teachers.

Of course - there are people who just never learn - but I believe (or hope!) that they are the exception to the rule.

Are you not wiser now than you were as a younger version of your same self?


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## AFEH

nice777guy said:


> I can't help but think that "experience" is one of life's best teachers.
> 
> Of course - there are people who just never learn - but I believe (or hope!) that they are the exception to the rule.
> 
> Are you not wiser now than you were as a younger version of your same self?


I don't think wise is an attribute a person gives to themselves. I think it is a description given by others. I don't think of myself as wise. In fact I've done a lot of looking at my history and I've been a grand fool on many an occassion. But I'm not bothered about it.

The point I've reached is "I'm an ass, you're an ass". Not you personally NG .


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## Runs like Dog

I guess when it's the other way around e.g. woman teacher and the entire 10th grade class, as is often in the news now, they're simply trading skill for frequency and zero refractory period.


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