# What she says and what she does...



## seeking sanity (Oct 20, 2009)

I'm 2+ years separated with an 8 month attempt at Reconciliation in between. (We have 4 kids, together 16 years, apart the first time for 11 months, she basically left for an OM, been apart the second time since May 09.)

I'm dating right now, as is she, and I'm psyching up to put in the divorce papers, but I'm hesitating and trying to figure out why. 

I love her and miss her, but I've been lied to so often, and she never really embraced reconciliation due to probably a lot of factors. The 8 months we were back together were brutal on me emotionally, and while I forgive the past affairs, I haven't forgiven her for the period we were back together, or the things she did after.

Right now we are getting along and there are periodic trial balloons we both put out, but inevitably she backs off. I'm just trying to live my life with as few complications as possible (and get some needs met elsewhere without it being too serious).

And so that gets me to the question: Why do I continually allow myself to stay available to her, even a crack? For example, two weeks ago we went for dinner, had a nice time, and at the end of the night as I was leaving her place, she said something about it feeling odd that I was leaving. A few days later I invited her to come over after work and she said maybe, but then never showed up. (I didn't expect she would.) 

What she says to me is that she misses me and is open but then acts in ways that create distance. I've gotten to the point where I only look at her actions and not her words. Why can't I get it and move on?


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## dobo (Jun 30, 2009)

A stupid thing called hope.


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## knortoh (Sep 5, 2009)

And if you keep on seeing her - dinner etc - inviting her over - the hope is fuelled...


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## seeking sanity (Oct 20, 2009)

So I just stop talking/hanging out I guess?


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## Ash22 (Oct 21, 2009)

I would think, at least I know for me, it would be hard to continue to talk/hang out like your doing...i think it would just keep "fueling the fire" of hoping that we get back together.


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## Ilovemyfeelings (Oct 20, 2009)

She is driving you crazy...just LOVE yourself enough to say NO more wishful thinking...IF it doesn't come easy, best let it go...When one loves you they don't play with your feelings...love yourself first..


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## knortoh (Sep 5, 2009)

Sure, reading actions and not words is best - and maybe you need to decide that you _want_ to move on before you can - maybe that's not what you want at the moment and that's okay - one day you will - it takes time and it's messy...


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## seeking sanity (Oct 20, 2009)

What do I need to be able to move on? Good question.

Originally I wanted to be able to say I'd given it my all to make it work, and I believe I've done that. The whole thing has been protracted and I've gone to the wall emotionally.

(ExW would never really engage fully in R. I never got sustained transparency, or honesty. Didn't looked at herself. And at the end of our reconciliation she stated she wasn't sexually attracted to me after months of avoiding sex with me.)

So, I get that she's been pretty clear in her actions despite occasional overtures the other way.

And I'm dating a gal right now, who IS sexually attracted to me and having a great time.

And yet there is the pull... I guess, I don't know what it takes to move on. I'm looking for guidance.


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## knortoh (Sep 5, 2009)

Can I say that if you are dating and you are having fun that you are moving on? Perhaps what you are now feeling is the last little twinges of disapointment etc...? Or maybe you feel guilty for moving on ....


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## Ilovemyfeelings (Oct 20, 2009)

right now it's best to muti-date this is to get you to move on...If you feeling guilty by getting to know other women....go slow.... you may find that you like one.......

but right NOW its going to seem like a rebound to you and to the other ladies if your having sex...just enjoy and DATE...your in NO hurry YOU need to feel good about you again..
learning new people... there is someone that better suits you....this gets your mind off of HER...even if it may be a bad date...just enjoy yourself....

But I wouldn't count on her...anymore


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## seeking sanity (Oct 20, 2009)

> Can I say that if you are dating and you are having fun that you are moving on? Perhaps what you are now feeling is the last little twinges of disapointment etc...? Or maybe you feel guilty for moving on ....


I suppose the above is true and I have deliberately been moving on. I just let myself get into this "what if" thinking. Much of it has to do with having 4 young kids. I made the mistake of looking at some old photos of us when we were young, and it made me pine a bit. It's also that if I could control the universe I'd stay married and work through the problems. Wonder if I should suck it up and try again, but I just don't see much trying on her part. We start a conversation by email/text and she stops responding. Stuff like that. I think it's probably because she doesn't want to face the difficult things because it makes her feel bad and she's unwilling to face those feelings. I don't know, I hate that I'm still speculating after all this time...


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## knortoh (Sep 5, 2009)

Maybe not that much time considering that you have such a history - I am sure that you would suck it up and try again if she wanted - she isn't showing those signs though by the sound of it.....it feels like such a waste doesn't it?


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## seeking sanity (Oct 20, 2009)

If feels like a huge waste.

I read another thread on what men need in relationships, and I wrote that at core they need to feel strong. For me, the lack of purpose, I'd argue the motivator to fight and be strong in life, has been difficult to accept. I have purpose around raising my kids, supporting them, etc, but the time put into the marriage feels so pointless now. Like the struggle was for nothing. As a result I don't feel very strong these days. More weary, and like I'm grinding in out to fulfill my various responsibilities. But it's out of duty and not a higher purpose.


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## Ash22 (Oct 21, 2009)

I would say, in a way kinda like what you tell me, if she doesn't want to R you can't keep trying. I know I feel like if I only do a little more if I only call one more time, email or text this that it will be the answer and He will say that he wants me again. But I know it doesn't work like that and you know it doesn't work like that. I would continue to go out and date and to live then thats when they see what they are missing the most. And the strength is there believe it or not, bc how else would you get through the day? You may say I barely get through the day but the point is you do.


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## knortoh (Sep 5, 2009)

Wow - that's very deep and I am not sure that I completely understand what you are saying...?
but I think that maybe you are working stuff out... 
and that you are exhausted - but tired is not the same as 'weak'...it just means you need a rest...
is this really what you are getting at..how do you get off the treadmill so that you can recuperate...?
or are you still wanting to work it out and so your feel frustrated? 
or both? 
I know that I feel both.


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## seeking sanity (Oct 20, 2009)

Thanks guys. It's not that I'm trying to work it out. I'm open to it, but I realize I can't be the one to initiate it, and I'd have some pretty big walls to overcome. A few weeks ago I invited her for dinner after we'd had a brief email exchange which I basically asked "do you want to get divorced?" as we're both dragging our feet on it. That lead to a small amount of hope, and was a set back in a way.

Essentially I'm 180ing. Like, today she came over for a visit with the kids. I'm fine with that because I want reciprocal access on days I don't have them. We had a chat but I don't bring up R or relationship or anything heavy. We make small talk and I act pleasant. Plus we've known each other for 1/2 my life, so there is a long history.

I am tired, but trying to do things that make me feel good. I'm working on my property, try to do something physical every day, maintain order in my life. Probably I have a low grade depression. I'm at the point I don't hold hope to R, and I mostly don't pursue it (I am seeing another woman after all), but occasionally I let my mind wander. Looking at her blog and twitter don't help. Trying to wean myself off doing that.


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## knortoh (Sep 5, 2009)

It's a messy business and you sound like you are doing great - managing a productive relationship over the kids and acknowledging just where you are at...it takes time and i think you need to count from when she left the 2nd time and not the first....


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## seeking sanity (Oct 20, 2009)

Spent most of the day with ex yesterday for Halloween. Had a nice time taking the kids out, etc. Then this morning my DD told me that ex's "friend' (the OM who she initially left me to be with) had slept over earlier in the week while the kids were with ex. (My heart dropped, and then I reminded myself why I need to keep an iron wall up with her no matter what.) 

In fairness, I was away last week, and ex had the flu, plus had just got some difficult medical news, so I can understand the impulse to have him over. I guess he took my kids to school in the morning to give her a break. 

Objectively I get that she needed help. Emotionally I hate his guts for destroying my family and it's an insult he has anything to do with my kids.

I guess it's that I didn't know they were still seeing each other. I had mentioned to her yesterday that my friends' ex was already having her lover over while she had her kids, and how irresponsible it was to involve the kids in a new relationship, and ex agreed it was not smart. But she had done the same thing earlier in the week and failed to mention it.

Just feeling stupid, like I was played yesterday. Like I allowed myself to be a bit open to her, and how whenever I do that, it just sets me up to be hurt. I need to assume she'll act in a selfish way.


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