# BH now a madhatter..... any others?



## hurtininMan411 (Mar 24, 2016)

Well, my wife had an affair on me after 13 years of marriage. Said she was jealous I didn't have to work as hard as her. was better looking than her, I got to do more fun things than her... yada yada yada......
This was three years ago I found out she had a 6 mos. affair. Texting mostly... but she did say she was visiting her sister and went and met him at a motel and spent the night with him.
I caught her a month later. She passed out and dumbass texted her. Her phone went off. I was going to turn it off so it didn't disturb her and wake her up. Well...... I found out,. they were planning another meeting that week. Busted!
We have been in R for that past three years. If you call it that. I can't get it out of my head. I truly think about it every single ****ing day. I have two kids and they are the ONLY reason I truly stayed. Probably not the best plan. But I did.
I will tell you as a man this really puts a damper on the ego. My wife going out and finding another ****!
Well fast forward.... to 4 mos ago. I was out at lunch by myself. Was sitting next to a woman who was by herself. We started to chat. Not sure how but cheating and spouses came up. Her husband did the same thing to her. We were in the same damn boat. We clicked. Laughed. Talked. and exchanged info.
Do you know how good I felt. Never would I ever even let myself get that far before my wife did that to me.
Now I know I cannot use that as an excuse to cheat..... But it was an excuse to cheat. I know that exchanging info ... I had already done it.
Long story short. She and I have gotten together often. She and I really get along and know what the other has gone through. Any of you can swing a 2x4 at me. I don't really care. I never would have entertained this idea if my wife hadn't stabbed me in the back.
I was in bliss in my marriage.
Well, this woman and I finally slept together and it was the first woman I had been with other than my wife in 17 years. OMG.
Sex was phenominal. We stayed in the hotel for three hours. For almost that entire time we were......"together". I didn't have visions for the first time in three years of my wife and her boyfriend. My ego was definitely boosted. I did it for several reasons. 1) revenge affair may top it 2) to feel what she did 3) I really like this woman 4) because at that point I could I can go on. but you get the picture. 
I would like to hear from any other madhatters. Experiences... pleasures... pains....
I will say I am still seeing my friend. It is an escape from reality. But god what a fun escape.
You can call me a ****ty person. But had I not caught my wife... she would still be doing what she was.......
Well..... let it fly people... 
With that said. I don't want to perturbe anybody. Offend anybody. 
I think I just wanted to get my story out there and hear from others........
H


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## Maxo (Mar 8, 2016)

I think that once the first spouse cheats, he oe she has voided the marriage contract.


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## rzmpf (Mar 11, 2016)

Well both you and your wife are exactly the same. You both have an excuse why you cheat and both of you don't seem remorseful. You just needed an excuse to cheat, she gave it to you just as you gave her hers. You could have divorced then, you could have divorced when you found this other woman but you wanted to cheat. Neither of you has moral highground and you obviously deserve each other. At this point you could try an open relationship, it either works for you being together for parenting reasons or just destroy the illusion that is your marriage. In both cases you can f** around all you want without the whole lying and hiding (except that is what turns you on).


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

Maxo said:


> I think that once the first spouse cheats, he oe she has voided the marriage contract.


I would agree. But he should have divorced or separated from his wife first. 

He needs to tell his wife what he did, and if need be, end this sham of a marriage he is in.


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

So why not just divorce and be done with it? You know what you're doing is wrong. Nobody needs to tell you that. What are your plans?
This didn't "just happen", and she may have just told you a total line of bs.
I don't know what you want to hear.
What you're doing doesn't really make any sense. And when you get caught ( you know you'll get caught, right?), your wife will take you to the cleaners and you've given her good reason for it.

I just don't understand what you are thinking. You're also putting your kids in a predicament. 
Sure, it's a "revenge affair", but what you're doing is because you wanted to, not for any other reason. 
You have stopped to the level of your rotten wife.
I think you'd have been better off divorcing. This is gonna wreck your mind, as you've admitted.
I'm sorry. You should stop this. Your affair partner is not marriage material, either.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## joannacroc (Dec 17, 2014)

Maxo said:


> I think that once the first spouse cheats, he oe she has voided the marriage contract.


I guess. Personally I wouldn't be able to sleep at night, though.


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## eric1 (Apr 10, 2015)

You obviously know what you're doing is wrong and it's obviously a sign that you're just not one of the types who can get over what she did. 

If you stayed for the kids just let it be known that they will be MUCH better off in two happy environments than one toxic/depressing one.


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## Truthseeker1 (Jul 17, 2013)




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## PhillyGuy13 (Nov 29, 2013)

Maxo said:


> I think that once the first spouse cheats, he oe she has voided the marriage contract.


Well, to me it depends on the R. He calls it a sham over the past three years. If his wife was truly remorseful and did everything she could to put the marriage back together then I disagree.

If they both kind of rug swept it, never talked about it again for three years and are both living in a haze, then yeah the marriage effectively ended when she started hooking up with the other man.

Still, divorce probably would have been the better option. Do you plan on telling your wife, to complete the revenge? Or go on seeing the other woman on the side?

Hope you are practicing safe sex. I've counted at least four people in your post who have enjoyed multiple partners in the recent past.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Truthseeker1 (Jul 17, 2013)

@PhillyGuy13 - I wonder how common RAs after this length of time are - even in "R" - I would guess the BS's guard goes down and if someone comes along the BS might be prone to take advantage of the opportunity rationalizing by saying hell my WS did this to me so why not..married people are tempted everyday but knowing your spouse was shagging someone else might make a person a bit more open to that temptation...


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## PhillyGuy13 (Nov 29, 2013)

Truthseeker1 said:


> @PhillyGuy13 - I wonder how common RAs after this length of time are - even in "R" - I would guess the BS's guard goes down and if someone comes along the BS might be prone to take advantage of the opportunity rationalizing by saying hell my WS did this to me so why not..married people are tempted everyday but knowing your spouse was shagging someone else might make a person a bit more open to that temptation...


I'm sure it does. Mind you I'm not judging. I am sure that even in the most successful R, that foundation of trust is forever weakened.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Truthseeker1 (Jul 17, 2013)

PhillyGuy13 said:


> I'm sure it does. Mind you I'm not judging. I am sure that even in the most successful R, that foundation of trust is forever weakened.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Oh I didn't think you were judging at all - but your post just made me think - I know married people get tempted everyday and give in or not give in for a variety of reasons - I was thinking of a scenario - lets say a person is out of town on business and the chance comes along - are they more prone to grab the chance since whatever guilt they may have felt is erased by their spouses affair?


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## hurtininMan411 (Mar 24, 2016)

I would say yes..... I went out of my way during my marriage to never even in be in a situation to tempt me. So yes.... at that point I feel it makes you more vulnerable to an affair. Is it right...... no Is it wrong...... yes. Am I at her level now........ yes......
Why not divorce? the kids and their stable lives. also $$ Where we live everything is split down the middle regardless. To divorce means different lifestyle $$ wise. No more big house, yada yada...... I love my wife.... I am still "trying" to make it work..... I know kinda hypocritical at this point.... But walk in my shoes first!


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## Truthseeker1 (Jul 17, 2013)

hurtininMan411 said:


> I would say yes..... I went out of my way during my marriage to never even in be in a situation to tempt me. So yes.... at that point I feel it makes you more vulnerable to an affair. Is it right...... no Is it wrong...... yes. Am I at her level now........ yes......
> Why not divorce? the kids and their stable lives. also $$ Where we live everything is split down the middle regardless. To divorce means different lifestyle $$ wise. No more big house, yada yada...... I love my wife.... I am still "trying" to make it work..... I know kinda hypocritical at this point.... But walk in my shoes first!


What I think is you need to take two steps immediately - 1) END the affair - play time is over and you are endangering not one but two families - so cut the sh!t 2) SEEK counseling ASAP 

What was your wife like post affair? Was she remorseful? Did you two just rugsweep it? You need to fill in those details for TAM readers in oder for people to give you better advice...

Believe me I'm not judging you at ALL - the most unsympathetic victim of infidelity is a WS IMO - but the path you are on is not healthy...


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## stephscarlett (Sep 2, 2015)

so you had an affair because your wife had an affair. Do her actions really have that much power over your own integrity? 
A RA is just another affair, justified by excuses as they all are. 
Hope you're proud of yourself. 
Was this other woman married? You do realize you used another person to feel better about yourself? Do you feel better about yourself? Did it take any pain away from being a BS? 
Do you love your wife? If so, why would inflict the same pain upon her?


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## stephscarlett (Sep 2, 2015)

hurtininMan411 said:


> But walk in my shoes first!


I kinda am. I had an affair and my husband had two RA. Guess I'm owed one. 
But ya know what, in rebuilding a marriage after an affair someone has to stop the immature crap and acting out. 
Please don't miss an opportunity to take a look at yourself and how ego, masculinity, justice and grace are important to you. You could learn a lot about yourself. 
Have you told your wife? 
So, now you both have to heal as a WS and a BS. Good luck. It's really hard.


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

Blaming your wife for your RA? The victim chair is comfortable for you.

If you let the actions of others change your standards, they were likely never truly your standards to begin with.

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk


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## hurtininMan411 (Mar 24, 2016)

Truth.... as to my wife... she was regretful she got caught. she would talk about it for a short bit. She would only truly admit a certain extent so I wouldn't get more pissed. Only once.... he never came... he went limp.... 
After a while she wanted to rugsweep.... its been a year.. why bring it up....we've been doing so good......

Steph, yes the other woman is married. She is in the exact same boat I am....
Yes we are just as bad as they are ..... I already admitted that.
Did I use her to feel better.... yes
Did she make me feel better..... yes she did/ does......
So to all of you... I said let the 2x4's fly...... I will still admit... yes this is wrong... I should not be doing it..... I am at her level now.... it is just an excuse .......
Oh and I did do counceling. Just never seemed to help......


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

hurtininMan411 said:


> I would say yes..... I went out of my way during my marriage to never even in be in a situation to tempt me. So yes.... at that point I feel it makes you more vulnerable to an affair. Is it right...... no Is it wrong...... yes. Am I at her level now........ yes......
> Why not divorce? the kids and their stable lives. also $$ Where we live everything is split down the middle regardless. To divorce means different lifestyle $$ wise. No more big house, yada yada...... I love my wife.... I am still "trying" to make it work..... I know kinda hypocritical at this point.... But walk in my shoes first!


So, I do understand. Thing is, a good man is going to stop cheating and do the right thing. What are you going to do?
You know you can't have both.


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## Truthseeker1 (Jul 17, 2013)

hurtininMan411 said:


> Truth.... as to my wife... she was regretful she got caught. she would talk about it for a short bit. She would only truly admit a certain extent so I wouldn't get more pissed. Only once.... he never came... he went limp....
> After a while she wanted to rugsweep.... its been a year.. why bring it up....we've been doing so good......
> 
> Steph, yes the other woman is married. She is in the exact same boat I am....
> ...


So you two never resolved her A - it she is remorseful then you never had an R to begin with...


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## Truthseeker1 (Jul 17, 2013)

stephscarlett said:


> Do you love your wife? If so, why would inflict the same pain upon her?


 @stephscarlett you know I respect your posts - but that questions you posed I have seen other waywards on another site post that and I guess my answer is so the WS can feel what the BS is going through.._*I'm not talking about you*_ - but when I read another WS pose that question to their spouse it rang hollow to me...


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## Married but Happy (Aug 13, 2013)

So, what now, OP? Sounds like your wife isn't truly remorseful and isn't actively working on reconciliation. Your RA at least ended the mind movies for you, but you know the affair is still wrong. Is it time to end yours, tell your wife, and demand that you both work on R, or split up? Those are the only good options left at this point, I think.


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## Truthseeker1 (Jul 17, 2013)

Married but Happy said:


> So, what now, OP? Sounds like your wife isn't truly remorseful and isn't actively working on reconciliation. Your RA at least ended the mind movies for you, but you know the affair is still wrong. Is it time to end yours, tell your wife, and demand that you both work on R, or split up? Those are the only good options left at this point, I think.


The WW tried to rugsweep and the OP let her and as we all know here rugsweeping solves nothing...


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## TX-SC (Aug 25, 2015)

Call it an exit affair and start working toward divorce. If you like this new woman in your life, date her. I will warn you that very few affairs have what it takes for a real, long term, honest relationship.


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## stephscarlett (Sep 2, 2015)

hurtininMan411 said:


> Truth.... as to my wife... she was regretful she got caught. she would talk about it for a short bit. She would only truly admit a certain extent so I wouldn't get more pissed. Only once.... he never came... he went limp....
> After a while she wanted to rugsweep.... its been a year.. why bring it up....we've been doing so good......
> 
> Steph, yes the other woman is married. She is in the exact same boat I am....
> ...



Take some deep digging looks into your soul hurtin. It'll be worth it whether you stay or leave.


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## stephscarlett (Sep 2, 2015)

Truthseeker1 said:


> @stephscarlett you know I respect your posts - but that questions you posed I have seen other waywards on another site post that and I guess my answer is so the WS can feel what the BS is going through.._*I'm not talking about you*_ - but when I read another WS pose that question to their spouse it rang hollow to me...



I get that truth... but why is the WS feeling the same pain so important? Why is that MORE important than keeping integrity and not falling off the deep end yourself?


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

stephscarlett said:


> I get that truth... but why is the WS feeling the same pain so important? Why is that MORE important than keeping integrity and not falling off the deep end yourself?


Rhetorical. It's not.

Revenge? Dig two graves.

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk


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## justastatistic (May 16, 2014)

hurtininMan411 said:


> .... I am still "trying" to make it work.....


With all due respect, this is simply not true. There is a reason we tell BS's whose spouses have not stopped the affair and gone NC to not bother with marriage counseling. You can't work on a marriage while you are engaged in another relationship. It simply can't be done.

So man up. If the OW were to offer to leave her husband to be with you, would you go? If so, see if she wants to pursue a relationship together, be honest with your wife and go find your happiness and leave her to find her's. If the answer to the question is no, then stop being a cheater, terminate contact and either find a way to fix your marriage or find a way to leave so that you each can find your own happiness.


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## Graywolf2 (Nov 10, 2013)

hurtininMan411 said:


> Well, this woman and I finally slept together and *it was the first woman I had been with other than my wife in 17 years.* OMG.





hurtininMan411 said:


> Yes we are just as bad as they are ..... I already admitted that.


No you are not *just as bad *as they are. 

In general I think that revenge affairs are bad. They are especially bad if you’re on a mission to have one. It’s forced and you’re using your affair partner.

On the other hand the WS did lower the bar. If time passes and you’re spontaneously attracted to someone that feels the same about you then why not? The rules were changed by the WS. Even if you do have an affair you’re still not even. The WS’s actions permanently altered the marriage. Your RA did not. 

Basically the WS can’t be all that righteously indignant even if you renewed your vows. That’s because you merely did what they have already done. They broke the old vows, you broke the new vows.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

I know EXACTLY how you felt.

A similar thing happened to me.

You need to be 100% honest with your wife.

That was what saved my marriage. Honesty.

Counselling might be of benefit.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Truthseeker1 (Jul 17, 2013)

stephscarlett said:


> I get that truth... but why is the WS feeling the same pain so important? Why is that MORE important than keeping integrity and not falling off the deep end yourself?


As usual you make a lot of sense :smile2:


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## Truthseeker1 (Jul 17, 2013)

Graywolf2 said:


> On the other hand the WS did lower the bar. If time passes and you’re spontaneously attracted to someone that feels the same about you then why not? The rules were changed by the WS. Even if you do have an affair you’re still not even. The WS’s actions permanently altered the marriage. Your RA did not.
> 
> Basically the WS can’t be all that righteously indignant even if you renewed your vows. That’s because you merely did what they have already done. They broke the old vows, you broke the new vows.


Great way to put things..also the BSs guard might go down and an overture they might have rebuffed now makes them feel good - the WS has essentially taken any guilt away from the BS enjoying such an overture...which is why I have seen WSs write elsewhere they get incensed that their BS doesnt seem as guilty about their RA if at all...they took the guilt away when the cheated first...


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

PhillyGuy13 said:


> Hope you are practicing safe sex. I've counted at least four people in your post who have enjoyed multiple partners in the recent past.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Yes, those nanobot cooty viruses are bi-polar pathogens. They can seep out of your keyboard and into your fingertips, transdermally, of course.
A little osmotic pressure gradient is necessary. This is accelerated by having dirty hands, a dirty mind is a given. 

My two Martian cents.


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## bryanp (Aug 25, 2011)

What do you think your wife's reaction be if she found out about you?


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

farsidejunky said:


> Blaming your wife for your RA? The victim chair is comfortable for you.
> 
> If you let the actions of others change your standards, they were likely never truly your standards to begin with.
> 
> Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk


No truer words spoken.

Divorce first, put the wiener in the new bun after the fact,


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## hurtininMan411 (Mar 24, 2016)

pissed hurt indignant rightious


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## PhillyGuy13 (Nov 29, 2013)

SunCMars said:


> Yes, those nanobot cooty viruses are bi-polar pathogens. They can seep out of your keyboard and into your fingertips, transdermally, of course.
> A little osmotic pressure gradient is necessary. This is accelerated by having dirty hands, a dirty mind is a given.
> 
> My two Martian cents.


I don't know what any of this means. I guess it goes over my simpleton head.

My post refers to the fact that they are all at higher risk for STDs.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## DoneWithHurting (Feb 4, 2015)

He did what he did because his wife emasculated him. He needed to feel like a man again. From what I see mission accomplished. Question now is will he continue and destroy what is left of his marriage or will he walk a straight path? I don't know if he can since he has developed feelings for his ap and still doesn't trust his wife. I don't blame him.


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## Ripper (Apr 1, 2014)

First, I don't believe in reconciling physical affairs. 

Second, I fall into the camp that once one spouse breaks the marriage, the other spouse is free from any further obligations. 

Obviously, divorcing your wife would have been best, but seeing how gynocentric family courts are I understand your hesitation of pursing that option. I certainly understand not wanting my children subjected to the revolving door of strange men your wife would parade thru the lives as she climbs back on the carousel.

My main concern with RAs is making sure no innocent parties are injured in the process. You wife isn't a innocent party and if you believe the other woman, her husband isn't either. So I say, game on. Just make sure to take care of you kids, take care of yourself, and start laying the groundwork for divorce once your nest is empty.


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## Truthseeker1 (Jul 17, 2013)

DoneWithHurting said:


> He did what he did because his wife emasculated him. He needed to feel like a man again. From what I see mission accomplished. Question now is will he continue and destroy what is left of his marriage or will he walk a straight path? I don't know if he can since he has developed feelings for his ap and still doesn't trust his wife. I don't blame him.


I would think a BSs guard is down and vulnerable and if the right person comes along - BOOM - its going to happen...this is not the usual RA people talk or write about - it usually occurs within a short period after Dday with the first willing person - a RA like that is different - this type of RA should scare a WS more because it happened naturally when the BS was not looking for action...in fact this type of RA would ring a WS bell more than one wiht some pickup at a bar in the aftermath of Dday..


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## New_Beginnings (Nov 16, 2015)

The whole woe is me and yes felt so great to have sex with someone new... Now we are even.. Smh sad and unfornate, unfortunately will bring by far more pain and damage to this marriage. 

I'd get out now... Get the paperwork for divorce and do both of yourselves a favor. Allow each other to heal and do some self work before placing a new person into a web of a mess.


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## hurtininMan411 (Mar 24, 2016)

I agree with everyone of you


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## IIJokerII (Apr 7, 2014)

MattMatt said:


> I know EXACTLY how you felt.
> 
> A similar thing happened to me.
> 
> ...


 The only salvation for this marriage is a concussion grenade...


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## TAMAT (Jun 20, 2015)

HurtinMan,

First off I understand why you did what you did, many if not most BH want to even the score. You never recovered from your Ws affair and she did not even give you the most basic of just compensation as she is still lying to you about the details of her affair. As long as your WW kept her intimacy with the OM from you the affair continued.

To recover I think you need to ...

Get a polygraph for your WW and yourself so you both have the facts about these affairs.

Go back and expose the OM your WW had an affair with his wife, family, work etc needs to be informed.

Make your apology to the OWH.

Tamat


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## soccermom2three (Jan 4, 2013)

I couldn't do a revenge affair. I prefer taking the high road.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

*Do yourself and your family a severe favor by getting tested for the presence of STD's! If your W didn't give the disease to you, then don't be giving it to her!

And by the way, after visiting Dr. Sawbones for those medical tests, go on down the street a little further to see a good family attorney and do the honorable thing to end this charade of a marriage! 

You have so aptly proven that you are absolutely no good for each other! *
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Graywolf2 (Nov 10, 2013)

TAMAT said:


> First off I understand why you did what you did, many if not most BH want to even the score.





Truthseeker1 said:


> I would think a BSs guard is down and vulnerable and if the right person comes along - BOOM - its going to happen.


It’s not always evening the score. The WS’s affair removes a major reason why the BS never had an affair. My main reason for not having an affair is that I know that I would feel as guilty as hell and my wife would see it on my face when I walked in the door. If she had an affair I wouldn't feel guilty at all and I bet my face would be fine.


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## Satya (Jun 22, 2012)

Well, now you're no longer better than her in all the ways she claimed. You're about the same.


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## Kobold (Dec 5, 2015)

What happens if it turns out that your OW's husband really didn't cheat on her, what if she's been lying to you all along? They do that you know. Did you ever stop to think about the possibility that you might be getting fed a load of BS from her and that you're now guilty of helping her betray an innocent man like you once were? Something to think about.


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## threelittlestars (Feb 18, 2016)

Well, first i got to say i empathize. In many ways i have rationalized and RA. Hell i even posted a confession that i wanted it last week. But, i know its an unhealthy coping mechanism. See this is the way i see it, a RA may be acceptable if you already think that it is too late to have a healthy marriage and PLAN on or EXPECT to divorce in the (near) future. i see little point to turn myself inside out on the ethics and morality of the decision to sleep with another if i am entirely out of the marriage. But I chose not to have a RA, now or yet because i still harbor hope that the marriage could survive. I already see it sinking as it is, i don't want to blow another hole in the ship. 

You sir blew a hole in your already sinking ship. Why? Did you feel it was a lost cause, because if you didn't then you just wanted and affair and you rationalized your right to it.... On that i would say you should confess your affair and be done. Don't Expect your wife to forgive you, just because you claimed to. 

On the subject of the OW....Cheaters LIE.... Im sure your wife lied to her lover, don't expect that you are getting the truth from her either. 

Please please...quit it with the self righteous feelings....
On another side I'm REALLY glad i read this post. It will keep me honest and on the right path because, i just don't want to see the world as you do. and I'm dangerously close to it. 

Good luck.


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## TaDor (Dec 20, 2015)

@OP : you are no better than your wife. It would have been more understandable if you had done this very early on, before R started. But 3 years? If your wife has been faithful since then and you DID this, you have just done something so very stupid. Maybe YOU understand more how your wife could have done what she did.

But this OW you had sex with, is as much of a low-life as the POSOM who pumped his penis into your wife.

Thing about it, this "friend" of yours KNOWS you are married and is willing to do this which may wreck your family and cause harm to your kid(s).


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Bad choice but I get it.

You should divorce and start over.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

Some words that come to mind...

Immoral

Spineless

Weak

Coward
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Satya (Jun 22, 2012)

Next episode, we find out that the OW is actually "happily" married.


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

Satya said:


> Next episode, we find out that the OW is actually "happily" married.


_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## sparrow555 (Jun 27, 2015)

hurtininMan411 said:


> Truth.... as to my wife... she was regretful she got caught. she would talk about it for a short bit. She would only truly admit a certain extent so I wouldn't get more pissed. Only once.... he never came... he went limp....
> After a while she wanted to rugsweep.... its been a year.. why bring it up....we've been doing so good......
> 
> Steph, yes the other woman is married. She is in the exact same boat I am....
> ...




What you did is akin to putting sand into the fuel tank because the engine was having issues. 

Your situation was sh!tty in itself before you complicated it to even worse situation.

About the OW, you know nothing about her other than what she told you. You don;t know if she is a psycho, if her H is a psycho or if she just a nut case that cheats with a lot of guys and gave you STD. Maybe she is bunny boiler that will stalk your kids and wife when you dump her.You don;t know how she will react if she gets caught either. 

You introduced a lot of unknown parameters into your situation. Noone can now guess on how this will end.


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## TaDor (Dec 20, 2015)

After reading more info from the OP. 

You both screwed up. You both never finished or even started a real R. You both rug-swept the problem. You BOTH should have been going to therapy and talked about the problems in your relationship. The counseling should have been long term and involved the both of you. If your wife refused counseling, then you should have divorced her 3 years ago... 3 years of trauma that you have done to yourself.

The affair that my WW did lasted about 3 months and ended 2 months ago. I honestly think I am further along healing than you are NOW and before you meet your AP. 
Why? Because of a desire for both of *US* to work on ourselves and for our family unit. Typing this, I am about to go pick up my woman from an AA meeting. She goes 3~5 times a week.
We both have therapy. We both go to couples meeting at self-help groups - *SHE* asks us to go and I support her and we go. We enjoy doing things together, to grow and heal together.

She is open to me, and we talk.


Your future with this woman is not likely to be successful. You're in an affair fog - you are in a fantasy. You both are cheaters who are married to people who cheated you and rug-swept your problems. What you both doing is not how you fix anything. How are YOU going to trust your heart to this woman? Who is as much of a liar as you are?


Your best best if you want to stay married - is perhaps have a 6-way with your entire lot at the same time. Maybe get some honesty in your lives for once.


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## gogetting (Mar 24, 2016)

Interesting justification. So now both of you are cheaters without remorse. 
Good luck with that 'marriage', I hope you feel better about yourself.


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

PhillyGuy13 said:


> I don't know what any of this means. I guess it goes over my simpleton head.
> 
> My post refers to the fact that they are all at higher risk for STDs.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Alien sarcasm. Unfamiliar confabulation conjecture/injection in virtual space. 

Word play....lighten the mood. Damn TAM needs helium!


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## ThePheonix (Jan 3, 2013)

PhillyGuy13 said:


> Hope you are practicing safe sex.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_



And remember, "safe sex" includes staying off cell phones and certainly not texting each other. >


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## TAMAT (Jun 20, 2015)

HurtinMan,

I hope you are going to tell your WW what you did, it may be a cheaper way of getting the truth out of her than getting a polygraph. 

It also may be the only way of getting her to realize the pain she has caused you. 

Please realize you have no future with the OW no matter how wonderful she seems to be.

Tamat


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Kobold said:


> What happens if it turns out that your OW's husband really didn't cheat on her, what if she's been lying to you all along? They do that you know. Did you ever stop to think about the possibility that you might be getting fed a load of BS from her and that you're now guilty of helping her betray an innocent man like you once were? Something to think about.


OP. How did you verify your gf was cheated on by her H?

I'm almost certain you didn't.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## kenmoore14217 (Apr 8, 2010)

Two kids and two low-life parents. Just peachy.


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

Sounds to me like this other woman is quite adept at getting men in bed. 
I'm betting this is not her first rodeo. And I wouldn't doubt if her husband has never cheated on her, and she's a pro at it.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## stephscarlett (Sep 2, 2015)

i'm sure her husband is abusive too. That's what they usually say.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

What a shame your kids are going to grow up thinking they can/should cheat. Once they find out their parents are a sham.


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## Augusto (Aug 14, 2013)

To me it just sounds like you checked out when she did and you are mentally done and just going through motions of just being an entity. But at the same time a slap in the face to your kids that you both have done. Good luck to you both.


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## G.J. (Nov 4, 2014)

Sorry if ive missed this but as long as you tell your wife then the future can be discussed 
and you BOTH can decide where you want to go from here


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## workindad (May 7, 2011)

hurtininMan411 said:


> ..... I know kinda hypocritical at this point.... But walk in my shoes first!


I have walked in these uncomfortable shoes. You are not the first and will not be the last to get cheated on.

How someone responds is entirely up to the person in the mirror.

You want to do something for your kids, address the issue... all of it.

Your outlook does not sound like a healthy example to be setting for children...


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## Clay2013 (Oct 30, 2013)

bandit.45 said:


> I would agree. But he should have divorced or separated from his wife first.
> 
> He needs to tell his wife what he did, and if need be, end this sham of a marriage he is in.


This is just one of the many reasons I never support staying with a cheater. 

C


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## BetrayedDad (Aug 8, 2013)

OP - I don't blame you one bit for banging another chick.

I do fault you for staying married to a turd and banging another chick.

I won't go as far as saying your no better than her but you need to dump your current wife.

This marriage is no longer salvageable....


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## alte Dame (Aug 7, 2012)

Your WW ruined your nice life with her remorseless betrayal and because of your family and financial situation, you have decided to stay in the marriage. You still love your WW, you say, but you also really, really resent her for emasculating you and destroying everything.

It is so infuriating to hate what we love. I know how that is. You feel trapped through no fault of your own. So, you want some intimacy with a woman who hasn't disrespected you in the most basic way. And the sex and loving feels so good.

I get it. I can understand.

You say you want 2X4's, so here is mine:

Life is too short to be eaten up daily with hurt, anger, and resentment. Why not divorce? So what if you take a financial hit? Unless you would be eating cat food as a result of the divorce, I think it would be worth the peace of mind and improved quality of life to just call it quits with your wife. You don't love her anymore the way a husband should. You love her in the way someone feels attraction but at the same time wants to strangle the person, no?

We're so fortunate in our modern world. We have choices. Choices. You can choose to live happily. You can choose to live with honor and honesty. Sneaking around and feeling self-righteous about it is a pretty pitiful and sordid enjoyment. I don't think it will satisfy in the end.

Mad hatters have broken lives. To continue this is a choice.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

soccermom2three said:


> I couldn't do a revenge affair. I prefer taking the high road.


Nor could I. Until I found myself in the midst of a revenge affair. Tricky stuff, real life, it has a nasty habit of jumping out at you when you are least expecting it.


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## Truthseeker1 (Jul 17, 2013)

MattMatt said:


> Nor could I. Until I found myself in the midst of a revenge affair. Tricky stuff, real life, it has a nasty habit of jumping out at you when you are least expecting it.


Agreed..what WSs dont realize is when they cheat they forever alter the marriage and I do think their affair has the effect of eliminating or greatly reducing whatever guilt a BS might feel succumbing to temptation...I know @MattMatt it had the opposite effect on you...but I do wonder for a lot of BSs who do have RAs - do they feel less guilt for having actually cheated?

I also think when a WS is finally faced with being the victim of betrayal it brings their understanding to a whole new level - because they don't fvcking understand until they are in the BS's shoes...what many want and get is to avoid any repercussions for their bad behavior...


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

Truthseeker1 said:


> Agreed..what WSs dont realize is when they cheat they forever alter the marriage and I do think their affair has the effect of eliminating or greatly reducing whatever guilt a BS might feel succumbing to temptation...I know @MattMatt it had the opposite effect on you...but I do wonder for a lot of BSs who do have RAs - do they feel less guilt for having actually cheated?
> 
> I also think when a WS is finally faced with being the victim of betrayal it brings their understanding ot a whole new level - because they don't fvcking understand until they are in the BS's shoes...what many want and get is to avoid any repercussions for their bad behavior...


I felt worse about my cheating than I did about my wife's affair.

I actually ended up on Seroxat for a while.


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## threelittlestars (Feb 18, 2016)

MattMatt said:


> Nor could I. Until I found myself in the midst of a revenge affair. Tricky stuff, real life, it has a nasty habit of jumping out at you when you are least expecting it.


I have to agree with this. I too would say, No...I walk the higher road. But after a while, even BS can be broken too...or we fracture and crack worse as time wears on and bam, you have a land slide, (Slippery slope as you call it) and you find yourself rationalizing why its okay to have an affair. 

So don't be too sure. You can only try to walk the high road. Actually walking it has pitfalls and hazards too.


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## Truthseeker1 (Jul 17, 2013)

MattMatt said:


> I felt worse about my cheating than I did about my wife's affair.
> 
> I actually ended up on Seroxat for a while.


Yeah...I remember that -I'm not sure if your reaction to having an RA is typical but it does show what a decent human being you are..me on the other hand i'm a vengeful pr!ck lol


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## Downunder view (Mar 25, 2016)

Both parents taught me it is fine to do what I know is wrong if it makes me happy. Funny thing is, neither are happy.


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## Truthseeker1 (Jul 17, 2013)

threelittlestars said:


> I have to agree with this. I too would say, No...I walk the higher road. But after a while, even BS can be broken too...or we fracture and crack worse as time wears on and bam, you have a land slide, (Slippery slope as you call it) and you find yourself rationalizing why its okay to have an affair.
> 
> So don't be too sure. You can only try to walk the high road. Actually walking it has pitfalls and hazards too.


I think all people in relationships get tempted but for a BS perhaps even unconsciously there is a little WTF in the back of their mind if a really attractive person comes along...because its not like their spouse sitting at home didn't do it...


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

If the OP had come here to say oops, I slipped and did it (once), I wouldn't say a word. I've always said everyone can make a mistake, choose bad things.

But that's not what he's doing. He's now gleefully carrying on a full-blown affair with no regard for anyone. After saying he only stays married to have his kids every day. 

Big difference.

I see selfish choices, not just a victim.


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## wishingwell (Mar 12, 2016)

I think my husband cheated but I cannot imagine replicating his behavior, especially since we are still in the same home for the children. I don't think two wrongs makes a right and i think you should at least separate before starting a new relationship - I'm really new to all of this, but based on what you said and considering I am in a similar situation, i can't imagine you are complaining about her cheating when you have engaged in the same activity, despite what she did. However, I do feel for you. I can see this is painful for you... i would separate... don't stoop to her level
i'm sorry you went through this and I feel horrible for you as I now know what it feels like...be strong and do the right thing.
good luck


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

threelittlestars said:


> I have to agree with this. I too would say, No...I walk the higher road. But after a while, even BS can be broken too...or we fracture and crack worse as time wears on and bam, you have a land slide, (Slippery slope as you call it) and you find yourself rationalizing why its okay to have an affair.
> 
> So don't be too sure. You can only try to walk the high road. Actually walking it has pitfalls and hazards too.


I was self-medicating with alcohol.


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## 86857 (Sep 5, 2013)

Interesting post OP, no 4x2s coming your way. . . I get it. 

You say you love WS and you guys have kids. So why not use the RA to get proper R happening, if you want to. 
Doesn't sound as if you guys did proper R with her rug sweeping etc and I'm not getting feeling there was true 100% remorse. 

Here’s what it would look like:

Confess your EA, every detail, don’t hold anything back. Do the opposite of what she did with you. No rug sweeping. 

Then tell her truthfully exactly how you have felt for the past 3 years, not being able to rid yourself of the mind movies, hearing nonsense like it was only once - they all say that - and being told it didn’t need to be discussed because you guys were doing so well. In whose opinion? Hers!

This is the way you can take the high road now because it sound as if you were a very loyal husband before she cheated. You mentioned you avoided situations where you might be tempted which is admirable. 

In any case, it might make her take R seriously and I guess she will see it from the other side - how much it hurts. 

Does WS suspect you are having an A? Its so easy for the spouse to detect. 

Are you able to hide all this from the kids? How old are they?

Something tells me that you are a BS who won’t ever get over the betrayal. Be honest with yourself. Can you really ever get over it? Because it's been 3 years and you are still really suffering. If you think you can't, then D would seem to be the only option. 

I understand staying for the kids too but kids aren’t stupid. Even if they are too young to pick up on it now, they will when they are older. 

I also noticed when you gave the reasons you did it, you put “because I really like OW” in 3rd position. Maybe she feels the same, i.e. you guys are just having some fun. However, if either of you are falling in love with the other, then there's more hurt coming there too. 

Just a thought.


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## Vikings (Feb 3, 2016)

If you want to cheat then you need to file for divorce and leave your spouse before you do it.


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## Augusto (Aug 14, 2013)

turnera said:


> If the OP had come here to say oops, I slipped and did it (once), I wouldn't say a word. I've always said everyone can make a mistake, choose bad things.
> 
> But that's not what he's doing. He's now gleefully carrying on a full-blown affair with no regard for anyone. After saying he only stays married to have his kids every day.
> 
> ...


Well by his language he couldn't give a **** about his current wife. But what about his kids? I mean what is going to happen to them? They will be pulled many directions and will have the real possibility of having to have two sets of parents. It's going to be as confusing as hell.


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## hurtininMan411 (Mar 24, 2016)

As I said I agree with all of you. On everything.
As for her man. I have talked with her best friend... yea I know.. not a friend to her marriage.
I know he cheated on her. I have seen the texts from him confirming it.....

H


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## Fenris (Mar 4, 2014)

GusPolinski said:


> Some words that come to mind...
> 
> Immoral
> 
> ...


Bridge

Goats


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## stephscarlett (Sep 2, 2015)

hurtininMan411 said:


> As I said I agree with all of you. On everything.
> As for her man. I have talked with her best friend... yea I know.. not a friend to her marriage.
> I know he cheated on her. I have seen the texts from him confirming it.....
> 
> H


so you're being used for the same reasons you're using her.
How does that make you feel?


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## threelittlestars (Feb 18, 2016)

And so you just accept the facts and don't disagree but still did it? 

Thats some SEVERE psychological disorder your packing. Its like you know its wrong and do it any way.....??? Like a serial murderer who kills and KNOWS its wrong but does it anyway... and will likely kill again. 

Do you not see that YOU just might be more messed up than even your WW? She stopped the affair when she realized the damage, Sure she has not been perfect during R, but now i am wondering why....You are a pretty messed up dude. Maybe you have completely emotionally detached or don't know how to do that healthily in the first place. I don't know, but the lack of feeling, and lack of ANY shame in what you have done just drops my jaw to the freaking floor. 

Please get into IC and figure out where YOUR mental problems have NOT been helping you in your life. 
And YES you are messed up. Yes you need help....Why? Your kids are watching you make poor and SELFISH decisions. Do you want them to do the same?


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## alte Dame (Aug 7, 2012)

hurtininMan411 said:


> As I said I agree with all of you. On everything.
> As for her man. I have talked with her best friend... yea I know.. not a friend to her marriage.
> I know he cheated on her. I have seen the texts from him confirming it.....
> 
> H


If you agree with everyone, then why have you posted? Do you just want to talk?


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## TaDor (Dec 20, 2015)

@hurtininMan411 : So what do you want to get from the people here? You want to feel like a turd because people are validating that you are acting like a turd?

Questions have been asked, if you want more input, you should reply to them. Otherwise, this is pointless speculation from our point of view - other than, you know what you are doing is wrong.

So, you agree that this OW is also a turd? That she is JUST AS dis-honest as her husband and your wife.


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## bfree (Sep 30, 2012)

@hurtininMan411

What do you want? Do you want to continue to be married to your wife? Do you want a divorce? Do you want to continue the relationship with this other woman? What you want to happen dictates what advice you'll receive.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Augusto said:


> Well by his language he couldn't give a **** about his current wife. But what about his kids? I mean what is going to happen to them? They will be pulled many directions and will have the real possibility of having to have two sets of parents. It's going to be as confusing as hell.


Bullshyte.

If he REALLY cared about his KIDS, and not HIMSELF, he would have BEEN the man they would have wanted to live up to.

He's just another selfish cheater who doesn't want to go without seeing his kids every day. For HIS sake.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Well. Maybe he knows he can't justify his RA but it took away his mind movies and feelings of inadequacy and obviously feels good.

He knows it sucks but it cleared some stupid damage out of his head.

Which makes it abundantly clear he should have divorced his skank and moved on and up instead of wallowing in pigshyt with his stupid WW.

Do you get this OP?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

Short term alleviation of pain, revenge etc for long term misery, not a great trade tbh!


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## cpacan (Jan 2, 2012)

Well, monogamy is usually something that you subscribe to in order to receive the same courtesy from your partner. When someone says "let's be exclusive" - it's because they want to feel the safety, security and peace that is usually an implicit part of a commited relationship. I don't think it's because they can't find the energy to have sex with other people, or because they don't have the opportunities.

So when your partner shows you, by their actions, that they really don't honor and value the agreement to be exclusive, why would you?

There's a lot of talk about the BS still having integrity and values, taking the higher road etc. OP actually kept his end of the agreement, untill it became a onesided agreement (which isn't an agreement anyway ). Now, they share the belief, that monogamy sucks and that exclusivity doesn't work for them - next step could be to get things out in the open, in order to create rules that will support having house and kids together etc.


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## Be smart (Feb 22, 2015)

My friend you are just like your wife.

Do you remember her excuse for 6 month Affair ? She cheated on you because she was jelaous on you !!!

In my opinion you are doing a lot worse thing. Why ? You know this will hurt your children and children from this other woman. 
You even brag about Affair of your post,saying you went for like three hours. Good for you but it is not answer to your problems my friend.

Ask yourself what do you want from your Marriage ! Remember your kids are learning from you and your actions.

Stay strong.


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## Maxo (Mar 8, 2016)

hurtininMan411 said:


> I would say yes..... I went out of my way during my marriage to never even in be in a situation to tempt me. So yes.... at that point I feel it makes you more vulnerable to an affair. Is it right...... no Is it wrong...... yes. Am I at her level now........ yes......
> Why not divorce? the kids and their stable lives. also $$ Where we live everything is split down the middle regardless. To divorce means different lifestyle $$ wise. No more big house, yada yada...... I love my wife.... I am still "trying" to make it work..... I know kinda hypocritical at this point.... But walk in my shoes first!


I do not see the consequential affair as the same.
Here are the distinctions I see:
First, from a strictly contract analysis,the material breach by the cheater voided the contract,thus relieving the betrayed of his obligation to abide by it. Absent a reaffirmation of the original contract ( and there may have been one,either express or implied by committing to R), there is no longer a contract to abide by.
Second, the trauma of this type of betrayal,often,renders the victim less in control of his or her faculties,such that the betrayed should be cut a lot of slack if poor judgement is used either in having a consequential affair or recommitting to a marriage foolishly.
Then there is the amount of damage that a consequential affair may cause. I think that a cheater is less damaged for three reasons.
First,the type of person who cheats is a person that was never fully committed to the other spouse. As such,being betrayed is less painful and more a narccissistic injury than a true loss of a love relationship.
Second, while the initially betrayed spouse is,often,left feeling that his or her deficiencies caused the straying,thus damaging self esteem and confidence,abetrayer who is subsequently betrayed can deflect these types of feelings of inadequacy by pointing to the initial cheating as the cause vs personal deficiencis or inadequacies. Thus it does not personally damage the initial cheater as much.
Third, there is the lack of surprise. I think any rational person would know that by cheating he or she runs an increased risk of being the recipient at some point. While it may still come as a bit of a shock, I do not see how it could rise to the level of that experienced by the initially betrayed.
Finally, I feel that fundamental fairness should allow each of us to have equal pleasure out of life. If my spouse cheats on me and gets to experience all those thrills and pleasures associated with sexual variety, I would think that if she cares for me, she would want my limited years here on this earth to contain an equal measure of fun,excitement and pleasure.
Just some random thoughts on this. I never retaliated or had a consequential affair. I just got out relatively quickly.


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## TaDor (Dec 20, 2015)

So... because the BS has been weakened by the cheating spouse and should be cut some slack because of less control of his/her faculties... 

The initial cheater might not of had full control of theirs.


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## Maxo (Mar 8, 2016)

TaDor said:


> So... because the BS has been weakened by the cheating spouse and should be cut some slack because of less control of his/her faculties...
> 
> The initial cheater might not of had full control of theirs.


It may not be the strongest of the arguments,but,as we have seen( contrary to how the effects of infidelity are often plrtayed in movies etc.), this is no small trauma, often leading to things like suicide,PTSD, severe depression,job loss,huge weight loss,insomnia...the list goes on.
So,yes,I do think the traumatization might be something to factor in.


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## TaDor (Dec 20, 2015)

I've experienced a lot of that. Lost 30lbs, thousands of dollars lost...


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## Maxo (Mar 8, 2016)

TaDor said:


> I've experienced a lot of that. Lost 30lbs, thousands of dollars lost...


Sorry to hear that, me,too. These cheaters do unbelievable damage.


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## calmwinds (Dec 10, 2012)

So now instead of being a BH, you're a lying, cheating, amoral SOB fvcking another man's wife, who is a wh0re for cheating on her husband? Bravo! You traded being a good, but hurting person for being an idiot. Divorce your wife. You and this woman deserve eachother.


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## Maxo (Mar 8, 2016)

calmwinds said:


> So now instead of being a BH, you're a lying, cheating, amoral SOB fvcking another man's wife, who is a wh0re for cheating on her husband? Bravo! You traded being a good, but hurting person for being an idiot. Divorce your wife. You and this woman deserve eachother.


I did not realize he was involved with a married woman. I should have read more closely.
There is no justification for hurting another family.


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## sixbravebulls (Aug 18, 2015)

hurtininMan411 said:


> Well, my wife had an affair on me after 13 years of marriage. Said she was jealous I didn't have to work as hard as her. was better looking than her, I got to do more fun things than her... yada yada yada......
> This was three years ago I found out she had a 6 mos. affair. Texting mostly... but she did say she was visiting her sister and went and met him at a motel and spent the night with him.
> I caught her a month later. She passed out and dumbass texted her. Her phone went off. I was going to turn it off so it didn't disturb her and wake her up. Well...... I found out,. they were planning another meeting that week. Busted!
> We have been in R for that past three years. If you call it that. I can't get it out of my head. I truly think about it every single ****ing day. I have two kids and they are the ONLY reason I truly stayed. Probably not the best plan. But I did.
> ...


I totally understand what you are going through. Exercise those demons. Nothing wrong with staying for the kids. I am too. My parents were divorced and it SUCKED.


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## TaDor (Dec 20, 2015)

Since all four of them are cheaters? Then here is a simple solution that doesn't require divorce and pain.

All four of them have 4-way sex, date each other openly. Hell, even 3-somes for all if one is at work or sick. Sometimes MM/F other times FF/M.

Its a WIN! WIN! WIN! WIN!

Its the only way for all of them to not be turds. Then there is no more lying, no more pain and they can go out clubbing, and vacations with each other.


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