# Secretly Videotaped



## Persimmon (Feb 4, 2013)

First off, my husband and I have been together for about 8 years and have two kids.

About a year ago I suspected he was secretly videotaping me because I found a hidden camera/thumb drive in our home. He claimed he found the thing at work- and treated me like I was crazy. He even got offended and angry with me for suspecting such a thing. I believed him.

A couple of months later it happened to be laying on the floor next to his night stand. We were literally just about to have sex when I saw him pick it up and place it ON the nightstand pointing at us. I called him out and he responded "Oh I was just picking it up!" 

When prodded later he continued to deny videotaping me- of course telling me I was the crazy one. He once again, would get really angry at me for questioning him. He would make me feel like I was betraying him by not trusting him. I couldn't question him without him getting extremely defensive and turning it around on me. I had to let it go because I had no proof.

A month or two later (about 6 months ago), I found yet a new and different thumb-drive recording device place 'just so' in the top of his closet, pointing at the bed. I then found a hidden file on it- of us having sex. I ripped apart the room and also found numerous of the little memory cards for the drive hidden in his dresser, yet no more videos.

I immediately e-mailed him because at the time he was at work, and asked him again if he was video taping me, and again turned it around like "how dare I accuse him of such a thing." He swore up and down he would NEVER do such a thing to me etc... I felt so incredibly manipulated! Especially because THREE times I'd asked him and he turned it around on my, and I was left feeling like a horrible un-trusting wife for questioning him. 

Upon presenting my evidence, he confessed. 
He confessed to have been video taping our sex for the past TWO YEARS. 

Now during this time he was video taping me, we had been going through a rocky period. My father passed away and a depression (plus meds) left me with a lack of sex-drive. I felt extremely alone and once the sex decreased, it caused a lot of problems. I continued to try, yet felt resentful because he didn't ever seem to care about what I was going through or how I was feeling, only whether he got laid and how good it was. If I ever said 'no,' it would be a fight and he would accuse me of "not trying." I was so angry because i WAS putting forward effort. I felt like he was always holding sex over my head... and never willing to hear me when I said we really needed to work on our relationship in order for me to feel close to him. When I found out he was video taping me, I felt I never really DID matter to him. 

In the end was left feeling extremely manipulated and used, and that sex mattered more to him than me; his wife. Why else would he sabotage our entire relationship? He had always been very sex driven, and would get nasty with me if I would turn him down. He also watches porn, and I fear he may have put videos of me up online. Of course he says he didn't, but how can I trust him? I probably would have even left him if it wasn't for the kids.

This past 6 months, I've done my best to work through it, but I can't seem to trust him. I've convinced myself that he doesn't see me as a real or equivalent person- that he has zero respect for me. I, of course, also question his love. In the end, he has made me feel worthless. 

We've gone on fine on a day-to-day basis, but it comes up once in a while. He swears up and down he's sorry, and has realized how much it hurt me. I KNOW he's sorry. He explained he got caught up in the excitement of it and never stopped to think about how it might hurt me.

Also- still, every so often he gets very angry with me for still being mad and un-trusting, and gets pissed if I bring up how it still makes me feel. He thinks I should "get over it" or "move on" because it's been 6 months. He says he loves me and he made a mistake... but this was a TWO YEAR mistake, not just oops one time. 

How am I supposed to feel? Am I over-reacting? Should I learn to move on and forgive him, believing him when he showers me with all the "I love yous and I'm so sorrys?" How would you feel?


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## Plan 9 from OS (Jul 13, 2012)

He betrayed you, so I think you are valid to still have these feelings. However, I think this is being swept under the rug too. Two years is an awful lot of taping, and what was he doing with all of it? Any idea if he uploaded some of them onto any of the porn sites? If he's also into porn, this should be a valid concern.

You are right that it was not "just a mistake". He deliberately made the decision to tape the two of you in secret for a long period of time. 

The feelings and healing mechanisms are most likely very similar to infidelity. You may want to move this to CWI. Even though it does not involve infidelity with a 3rd person, it is still a betrayal on a very deep level. How is your husband getting help for this? Are you two in counseling? Sounds like he needs some help.

How is he rebuilding the trust with you?


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## Persimmon (Feb 4, 2013)

I have no idea what he was doing with the taping. He swears it was for his pleasure only, and that he couldn't ever share me, even with other men on the internet. The problem is he'll lie and lie until I have him in the corner with the hard evidence. I have no way of figuring out if there are videos of me somewhere... 

You are right, it IS being swept under the rug. Only time has passed, with a few big blow ups. I can't stand that he gets angry with me for needing to be reassured. As for rebuilding trust, other than he is saying sorry when he can and telling me he loves me, there has been nothing. He simply tells me I need to trust him, and it's on me!!

It's like he just wants it to go away and is waiting on me to get over it. I feel pressure to 'let it go' when I can't. He makes me feel like it's me who needs to learn to trust, not him needing to earn it. He's not seeking help, nor are we together.

I'm not sure what he could do to actively earn trust? How do you do that?

You're right, it's betrayal on a very deep level. Thank you for your input, this is my first time talking about it to anyone.


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## john_lord_b3 (Jan 11, 2013)

Dump him. Get out of the relationship ASAP. If he is capable of doing that, imagine what else he is capable of doing behind your back??

There is nothing wrong with couples filming their own lovemaking, for novelty value. But to do that without mutual consent is very wrong!


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

If it had happened only once I might be able to forgive it. But 2 years of taping? I would not be able to handle that. That's huge.

Did you confescate all of the memory cards you found? I hope so. 

Does he still have a camera? If he does he needs to let you keep it under lock and key and he gets it from you when he wants to use it and gives it back to you.

Also I think he should allow you to put a keylogger on his computer so that you can monitor whether or not he puts videos of you on the internet.

Have you searched his computer for videos of you?

I'm not sure I could stay with a man who did something like that.


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## Persimmon (Feb 4, 2013)

Yes, I took all memory cards and video taping devices. I've gone through his computer and found nothing. 

I'm going to talk to him today about complete transparency.

During those two years when we were having problems, I reached out to an old friend/ex. He lived across the country and I talked to him on the phone frequently for a matter of months. I confessed, and it was nothing ever physical or even more than catching up and talking about life in general. It was me reaching out because I was lonely and YES it was very, incredibly wrong of me. I'm realize HOW wrong it was by hiding it. I should have just said something. But because I did this... he justifies his own behavior of video taping me the whole time. I fear this has a lot to do with why we can't heal. It's almost as he sees it an eye for an eye when to me these are two completely separate instances, though both betrayals. 

As for leaving- we are married, two kids, and I'm also 9 months pregnant. I was a few months along when I found out about all this. Plus I, of course, love him. Therefore I feel like I might make a huge mistake by just leaving.... is it possible for a man to do this to his wife and truly love and respect her?


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## jaharthur (May 25, 2012)

Persimmon said:


> is it possible for a man to do this to his wife and truly love and respect her?


No.


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## Cletus (Apr 27, 2012)

So why do you think he did this behind your back?

Did he ask you and get turned down? If not, what would have been your reply? Do you have a history of him being more overtly sexual than you? Has he been shot down on a lot of other requests that set an expectation of failure?

Something made him hide this from you, regardless of whether it was right or wrong. Why do think that is?


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## I'mInLoveWithMyHubby (Nov 7, 2011)

I was secretly video taped by my ex h as well. I never felt so violated in my life. It was so much worse then him having affairs on me. This is something that I never forgave or got over. Who knows if if he had shown his friends. I was a very shy person to begin with. It's a very very sick thing to do. 

I thank God that I'm with a man I fully trust now.


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## Persimmon (Feb 4, 2013)

Why do I think he did this behind my back?

Well, before marriage we had a great sex life. Did a lot of experimenting, dress up, pictures, photos... all that. I was open to video taping and and such, as long as I knew where they were and had control over their disposal. After a few months I would go back and delete pics and videos and such, as I was always afraid of them being found or something. Then one day I found that he'd been stashing them on a disk, hidden from me, and lying about deleting them. After that I no longer trusted him to take photos or videos and it was off limits.

We continued on with our relationship- his lie forgotten and forgiven, yet even years later I didn't trust him to videotape me or take pictures during sex. Therefore he did it behind my back. 

Yes, he's always been very sexual. Even playing dress up I felt got out of hand. EVERY time we went to have sex or be intimate, he would want to me wear a certain something. I talked to him about it and we did the give-and-take. Playing dress up sometimes and plain sex others... I guess he just couldn't give up the video taping so he did it behind my back.


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## Holland (Aug 20, 2012)

> it possible for a man to do this to his wife and truly love and respect her?


 do you really need to ask?

Your situation is dysfunctional and very unhealthy. He treats you with contempt and you ask the question above. 

This would be a complete deal breaker for me.


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

I suspect that what he's sorry for is that he got caught. Not for what he did. 

I'm in the "dump him" camp. You could try marriage counseling to try to rebuild things, though. Rebuilding trust is tough, though. 

C
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Regga (Jan 22, 2013)

Um!!! Depending on where you live, this is illegal!!!! I would be gathering up some documentation about your life with him and walking to the police station! How DARE your HUSBAND do this to you!


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## Shadow_Nirvana (Jan 1, 2013)

Look, I think this is some serious ****. But I'm not in the "dump him!" squad... not just yet any way.

He should take some intensive counseling to see why he does what he does. The oversexualness, the lies and deceit, compartmentalizing... You have to talk to him, calmly but firmly about these things. He's obviously troubled, bu you obviously love him. If he doesn't accept any change is necessary, start detaching yourself from him and hope he'll come to his senses. If he does, great. If he doesn't, that means he's unwilling to look at himself even when that means losing you.

Next, you need some IC yourself. Basically to get over this with the least emotional scarring as possible. But also to understand how you came into this situation. There seems to be serious red flags in his behaviour, but why did you overlook them?

Only after both of you have done some intense soulsearching can you even think about reconciling. If that is not the case, there will rugsweeping, blameshifting on his part, and a huge sense of distrust and emotional disconnect on your part.


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## Vaya Con Dios (Aug 20, 2012)

Yeah Yeah, dump him, he doesn't love you, he's got no respect for you. etc. etc. 
If you take ANY of this advice you may end up as miserable as this lot!....You need to ask yourself do you LOVE him still, even after he's hurt you...find out why he's done this...MAYBE just maybe this 'was' his little perversion, sure it's no excuse but he may have though it was spicing up the bedroom antics... well for him anyway......8yrs is a long time I've been with my wife for 18yrs or so and nothing makes her blush now, I HAVE ALWAYS asked her permission but to be honest I think your ONLY PROBLEM is if your hubby was being MALICIOUS..I don't think so, but you know him better!


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## Homemaker_Numero_Uno (Jan 18, 2011)

Persimmon said:


> First off, my husband and I have been together for about 8 years and have two kids.
> 
> About a year ago I suspected he was secretly videotaping me because I found a hidden camera/thumb drive in our home. He claimed he found the thing at work- and treated me like I was crazy. He even got offended and angry with me for suspecting such a thing. I believed him.
> 
> ...


It's a felony.
I'd file a police report and also file for a divorce, with damages.
My exH took still photos during a Skype session even after I told him several times it was a condition of the Skype session that he not record anything. During the session I asked him a couple times to make sure he wasn't taking photos. He was. What an a**. Even though nothing came of my report (and other things that happened, also felonies) it made me feel better filing and when I got my divorce I also got a freedom from harassment order. I told him if I ever see any of those documents on the internet or elsewhere, he was going to be held accountable, because there is a report of what he did and that I did not ever agree to it and that he needed to destroy all copies. 

Men who do this don't deserve to be husbands.
They are not husband material.


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## Homemaker_Numero_Uno (Jan 18, 2011)

Vaya Con Dios said:


> Yeah Yeah, dump him, he doesn't love you, he's got no respect for you. etc. etc.
> If you take ANY of this advice you may end up as miserable as this lot!....You need to ask yourself do you LOVE him still, even after he's hurt you...find out why he's done this...MAYBE just maybe this 'was' his little perversion, sure it's no excuse but he may have though it was spicing up the bedroom antics... well for him anyway......8yrs is a long time I've been with my wife for 18yrs or so and nothing makes her blush now, I HAVE ALWAYS asked her permission but to be honest I think your ONLY PROBLEM is if your hubby was being MALICIOUS..I don't think so, but you know him better!


Most of us are not unhappy. 
We are incredibly happy to live in a country where we can legally sever our ties to people who break laws and also break trust, which is a moral quality necessary to have an equal and rewarding relationship between two people. It is a sacred bond.


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## Cletus (Apr 27, 2012)

Homemaker_Numero_Uno said:


> Most of us are not unhappy.
> We are incredibly happy to live in a country where we can legally sever our ties to people who break laws and also break trust, which is a moral quality necessary to have an equal and rewarding relationship between two people. It is a sacred bond.


And one that you have probably bent, one way or another, in your marriage as well. As we all have, intentionally or not.

Only the OP knows the full story of how big a breach of trust this amounts to. Personally, I think that something you were OK with in the past and later change your mind about is certainly less egregious than a never allowed activity. 

Blowing up your marriage over advice you get on a free internet site is something you had better be really sure about. What the OP can take away here is that everyone thinks this is wrong and needs to be dealt with - on HER terms.


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## Jack I (Nov 23, 2012)

Persimmon said:


> First off, my husband and I have been together for about 8 years and have two kids.
> 
> About a year ago I suspected he was secretly videotaping me because I found a hidden camera/thumb drive in our home. He claimed he found the thing at work- and treated me like I was crazy. He even got offended and angry with me for suspecting such a thing. I believed him.
> 
> ...


Interesting thread.My wife recently discovered I had recorded us having sex as well.But I actually recorded the AUDIO,and not the video.She got upset a little then thought it was kind of funny.I might start my own thread.....


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## Holland (Aug 20, 2012)

Vaya Con Dios said:


> *Yeah Yeah, dump him, he doesn't love you, he's got no respect for you. etc. etc.
> If you take ANY of this advice you may end up as miserable as this lot!..*..You need to ask yourself do you LOVE him still, even after he's hurt you...find out why he's done this...MAYBE just maybe this 'was' his little perversion, sure it's no excuse but he may have though it was spicing up the bedroom antics... well for him anyway......8yrs is a long time I've been with my wife for 18yrs or so and nothing makes her blush now, I HAVE ALWAYS asked her permission but to be honest I think your ONLY PROBLEM is if your hubby was being MALICIOUS..I don't think so, but you know him better!


I'm far from miserable. This guy lied to her for 2 years and continued to disrespect her knowing full well he was doing something against her wishes. There is so much disrespect in this story it is sad.
He sounds very malicious.


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## triggerhappy (Oct 14, 2012)

That is some sick stuff. What I don't understand is how can one be married to someone is basically a total stranger.

Please don't allow yourself (or anyone else) to make you believe that anything you did, or didn't do, gave him an excuse to do this. This is some creepy-ass s&it and it's beyond comprehension. 


I honestly cannot believe some of the things I read on this site, but I keep coming back because it's like I have a morbid curiosity about it.


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## Homemaker_Numero_Uno (Jan 18, 2011)

Cletus said:


> And one that you have probably bent, one way or another, in your marriage as well. As we all have, intentionally or not.
> 
> Only the OP knows the full story of how big a breach of trust this amounts to. Personally, I think that something you were OK with in the past and later change your mind about is certainly less egregious than a never allowed activity.
> 
> Blowing up your marriage over advice you get on a free internet site is something you had better be really sure about. What the OP can take away here is that everyone thinks this is wrong and needs to be dealt with - on HER terms.


I've not committed a felony, that's for sure.
Geesh, this is not even worth a dialog with you.
FWIW I fought tooth and nail against advice here, and it caused me to stay in a relationship long enough to be raped as well as to have had the indecent photos taken of me that was a felony to do so. Here's some advice. STICK TO YOUR OWN EXPERIENCE UNLESS YOU HAVE ACTUAL STATISTICS WITH REFERENCES TO BACK UP YOUR STATEMENTS.
Yes, I am shouting. Imagine that.


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## Homemaker_Numero_Uno (Jan 18, 2011)

Cletus said:


> And one that you have probably bent, one way or another, in your marriage as well. As we all have, intentionally or not.
> 
> Only the OP knows the full story of how big a breach of trust this amounts to. Personally, I think that something you were OK with in the past and later change your mind about is certainly less egregious than a never allowed activity.
> 
> Blowing up your marriage over advice you get on a free internet site is something you had better be really sure about. What the OP can take away here is that everyone thinks this is wrong and needs to be dealt with - on HER terms.


The principles of consent upon which the felony law is based requires permission for each and every act, each and every time. Once you have expressed a desire for the act to stop, even if it's been started, it must be stopped. Our laws for rape and other felonies involving personal privacies that our Constitution guarantees both males and females, married, single, partnered, parents and children, disabled and powerful alike, are based on the principles of consent. In order to give up our liberties, it needs to be a conscious and informed decision. No exceptions.


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## Cletus (Apr 27, 2012)

Homemaker_Numero_Uno said:


> I've not committed a felony, that's for sure.
> Geesh, this is not even worth a dialog with you.
> FWIW I fought tooth and nail against advice here, and it caused me to stay in a relationship long enough to be raped as well as to have had the indecent photos taken of me that was a felony to do so. Here's some advice. STICK TO YOUR OWN EXPERIENCE UNLESS YOU HAVE ACTUAL STATISTICS WITH REFERENCES TO BACK UP YOUR STATEMENTS.
> Yes, I am shouting. Imagine that.


Easy there, no foaming at the mouth.

There's no crime if she's unwilling to press charges. Only she can decide if that's appropriate. Just because you're outraged doesn't mean she is required to be as well.

She wasn't asking for a legal opinion anyway or she would have been on a legal site. That makes my opinion every damn bit as valid as yours, and you would do well to remember MY first amendment rights while you're flying off the handle.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## CuddleBug (Nov 26, 2012)

From the very beginning, he should of asked you first, can I record us having sex?

If you thought about it and said yes, then good for you both, but if you would of said, no, it's personal what we do, then no it is.

By him recording you both having sex for 2+ years, denying it (lying to you) isn't cool. Not in my books anyway.

What would you do if you found out your man was slipping you a sleeping agent, and having sex with you while you slept? You ask him, he denies it. 2+ years later, yes, I have sex with you while you sleep, feet, etc. Same thing, right?

I would never do that to my wife ever. I know she is camera shy so I don't go taking pictures of her while she sleeps, ever!!!

You have to put the shoe on the other foot if you don't know if this is a good idea..............would you like it if she had anal sex with you while you slept or video taped you in the shower?


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## Tigger (Dec 5, 2007)

That was very painful and sickening to read.

I would be worried they were online somewhere. Where do you think all those amateur videos come from?

I would not stay just because you are pregnant. You have to think about your and the kids long term well being.


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## committed4ever (Nov 13, 2012)

It kills me the way people on TAM are so quick to tell others to dump their spouse especially when the OP did not ask if she should. She did mention it in later post on this thread but dayum the woman has 2 kids a 3rd on the way she loves her husband and that's the advice she gets. 

I was reading a thread yesterday of how a wife was taking care of a know good bum of a husband who being extremely vebally abuSive and I was just wondering how many posts it would take her to admit that he was also physically abusive and yet the TAMers were giving her advice of how she could handle the situation and advising IC and MC but noBody said dump him. Then a few posts later it came out about the physical abuse too. 

OP if you love your husband and want to save your marriage don't let some of these negative nellies project their heartaches on you. Yeah you should be ticked off at your husband but if your husband is willing to stay in the marriage then I encourage you to try and work it out.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Terry_CO (Oct 23, 2012)

committed4ever said:


> It kills me the way people on TAM are so quick to tell others to dump their spouse especially when the OP did not ask if she should. She did mention it in later post on this thread but dayum the woman has 2 kids a 3rd on the way she loves her husband and that's the advice she gets.
> 
> I was reading a thread yesterday of how a wife was taking care of a know good bum of a husband who being extremely vebally abuSive and I was just wondering how many posts it would take her to admit that he was also physically abusive and yet the TAMers were giving her advice of how she could handle the situation and advising IC and MC but noBody said dump him. Then a few posts later it came out about the physical abuse too.
> 
> ...


You sound more tolerant of outright disrespect and sneaky behavior.

I was too - in a terrible marriage for years, and I just tolerated it, hoping things would work out. I just wish I had been on TAM during that time. I would have gotten the kick in the pants I needed to rediscover my own self-worth, and stop letting myself be walked all over and psychologically tortured.


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## Shadow_Nirvana (Jan 1, 2013)

Terry_CO said:


> You sound more tolerant of outright disrespect and sneaky behavior.
> 
> I was too - in a terrible marriage for years, and I just tolerated it, hoping things would work out. I just wish I had been on TAM during that time. I would have gotten the kick in the pants I needed to rediscover my own self-worth, and stop letting myself be walked all over and psychologically tortured.


Look if there are people who can reconcile after having an affair, this can definitely be reconciled... under the right circumstances.

OP, if you love your husband and if you are willing to work this through, you have to be firm. He will probably resist in some ways(it would be weird if he didn't, according to the liar handbook for dummies). But you have to make him know, that you will not be settling for a husband who is deceptive. 

Deception, the need to sneak around comes from a weak charachter. He knows that he's lying to you, he knows it's wrong, but isn't strong enough to talk to you about how he felt. Maybe he was ashamed that he wanted to do something like that, he had to keep it a secret to deal with the shame but keeping something like that secret builds more shame and the compulsion to keep it a secret but keep doing it grows and grows.

I don't know, maybe I'm reading too much into the "Nice Guy" sexual manipulative and deviant behaviour.


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## Persimmon (Feb 4, 2013)

Thanks guys... all this really, really helps. I've needed some outside input for a while now, and have gotten sick of living in my own head. I've got a lot to think about!!


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## Terry_CO (Oct 23, 2012)

Shadow_Nirvana said:


> Look if there are people who can reconcile after having an affair, this can definitely be reconciled... under the right circumstances.


You may be right. If they have truly reconciled and are trusting again, that's great.

I never again could trust a spouse who had an affair, but that's just me


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

I do not think you should D him over this. He did lie, but he hasn't cheated, he hasn't given them to others. He has violated your truth.

He clearly has a major sexual attraction to self made porn of you: videos, pics, dress up etc. some people are into erotica, some being dominated, his thing is sell made porn.

You knew this was a big thing for him, you just didn't really understand how driven to have it he was. It's his personal sex daemon that's inside him.

What he did was 100% wrong, violating your trust. I do not think he it to either hurt you or harm you. He did it because of his inner sexual need to have those videos and pics of you.

I suggest the two of you find a therapist to work with. One the has experience in dealing with people with no traditional sexual desires, things like dealing with feitshes. And I mean sex fetish, in the sense of a strong sexual desire for inclusion of things into the sex act. 

Yelling at him won't fix this, but working with a therapist to figure out what it is in him and his past that has created this overpowering need might help.


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## dogman (Jul 24, 2012)

What's a marriage without trust? Well, it's a marriage without trust.
But still a marriage. 
If he used these recordings for choking his chicken that's one thing and you can work through this but if he put it out there on the net you should send him packing.

I can't see him doing this without putting stuff on the net, from the number of times he's done it to his attitude. You need to find out. 

Get a polygraph, it's that important.


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## phillybeffandswiss (Jan 20, 2013)

Persimmon said:


> Thanks guys... all this really, really helps. I've needed some outside input for a while now, and have gotten sick of living in my own head. I've got a lot to think about!!


I'm going to preface this with I am not blame shifting. You have every RIGHT to put a stop to anything you do not like in a marriage. I just want you to see something I picked up from your two major posts.

Men and women are sometimes childish when it comes to sex at times. We threaten, withhold, cajole and ration sex when we fight. Sometimes it is appropriate other times it is mean and vindictive. When I read your OP I was, and still slightly am, disgusted with his behavior. How dare he record your intimacy without your permission. The trust is destroyed, you have to worry about the internet and how can you trust him when you have sex again.

Your second post put it in the proper context. I still do not agree with what he did, but I have a better understanding of why it may have happened. You may not agree, but see if this make any sense. My wife had an Emotional Affair and I came here looking for advice. One thing everyone mentions is addiction and drug euphoria concerning the affair partner. That not only do they have to quit cold turkey, but they will go through withdrawal like symptoms. When they are forced, depending on when it is caught, they will lie, trick, make contact, and other things counterproductive to the marriage. The one thing many do is take it further underground to the point of using chat features on phone apps. That shocked me as I NEVER thought about game apps being used to cheat.

Do you see where I am going?


Again, I am not blaming you at all or excusing his actions. I'm just giving you different perspective after you said:


> Yes, he's always been very sexual. Even playing dress up I felt got out of hand. EVERY time we went to have sex or be intimate, he would want to me wear a certain something. I talked to him about it and we did the give-and-take. Playing dress up sometimes and plain sex others... I guess he just couldn't give up the video taping so he did it behind my back.


You both used to engage in videotaping, dress-up and other sex games. Your GUT told you it was "out of hand." Everything was going along fine, until you found a private stash, of you, that he kept for himself. He broke the rules and you said no more photos and video. I agree with you completely on this action. Like the drug addict, He took it underground, for two years, until you became suspicious and caught him. I bet he only stopped for a few times, when you originally laid down the law and was already searching for ways to secretly record you.

Like you I knew there was an issue, but I TRUSTED my spouse and I ended up here. That's our only "mistake" we trusted them enough to make the right decision and we didn't continue to monitor their actions. In other words, we didn't make a mistake because you should trust your spouse. The one thing I have learned is I also need to trust my gut. If I would have told her then, I have a problem with you talking to this guy and set up boundaries WITH CONSEQUENCES I may not be here.

If you love him research a good individual counselors for his sex issues and you both go to a marriage counselor. Please research heavily, because there are too many horror stories of crappy help on this board. If you do decide the marriage is worth saving, after you get help, set very strong boundaries on this issue. No, it isn't being controlling it is making your marriage safe for both partners.

One other thing, 2 years is a long time for videotaping. I would have a forensic computer analyst check all your computer devices for website traces and uploads. Unless your husband is extremely tech savy, many things are never fully erased. That would ease your mind a bit, on whether he put you on the internet or not.


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## PastOM (Apr 12, 2013)

I'm astonished at the posts here!

Sorry that your H taped you, but I am having an incredibly hard time understanding what the big deal is. Ask him to destroy the recordings, get some counseling, and maybe even get comfortable with it - share it with each other.

Is it so hurtful that he wants to relive your sexual encounters rather than looking at porn on the internet? Yes, he lied about it, but that's because he realized that you don't like it.

Sorry to make every one mad here - but to suggest to the OP that she divorce - REALLY??? No cheating, no gambling, no porn!!!


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## Alexandria (Apr 21, 2013)

Wow, and I thought I had a low self-esteem. You ask are you over-reacting. R U serious? This guy basically betrayed you, lied to you, has been a jerk with sex and clearly a pervert and you ask if you are over-reacting? The answer is no. Ditch him NOW. This is not just your run of the day mild betrayal, this is sick and illegal stuff. And, he has the gonads to get mad at you. What he is did is wrong and bad and it is not really open for discussion. LEAVE.


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## nothingtodeclare (Apr 13, 2013)

If I found out my wife had been secretly taping us, I may be upset. If it was for her own personal stash, I'd be aroused. I would not consider her a sick pervert. If she uploaded to the net ot shared it, that's the end.


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## Wiserforit (Dec 27, 2012)

PastOM said:


> I'm astonished at the posts here!
> 
> Sorry that your H taped you, but I am having an incredibly hard time understanding what the big deal is. Ask him to destroy the recordings, get some counseling, and maybe even get comfortable with it - share it with each other.
> 
> ...


It is a felony in a lot of states, so discounting a felony perpetrated on a spouse is not very understanding. Raping a spouse is also thought of as no big deal by some. 

This is a case of a husband using psychological abuse to force sex upon her when she didn't want it, and taping same. So it rises to a level much higher than simply taping consentual sex. There seems to be an element of malicious sadism involved here. 

There isn't any information on what he did with these tapes so this leaves open the horrendous possibility of others watching this husband force sex upon her. 

I'd be going all-out on the forensics.


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## PastOM (Apr 12, 2013)

Wiserforit said:


> It is a felony in a lot of states, so discounting a felony perpetrated on a spouse is not very understanding. Raping a spouse is also thought of as no big deal by some.


A felony is a crime, and is therefore committed against the state, not the person. So H may be breaking the law for which there may be a prison term greater than one year. That's a risk he should weigh. 

I do not recall rape being mentioned in this thread, and if I missed it, please excuse me. If not, I hope that you are not equating this case with rape. 



> This is a case of a husband using psychological abuse to force sex upon her when she didn't want it, and taping same.


I have not read that in the original statement from the OP. When I was married, I wined and p!ssed and complained if my wife turned me down, as she did if I turned her down. Are you equating normal arguments about sex, or the lack thereof as abuse??



> So it rises to a level much higher than simply taping consentual sex. There seems to be an element of malicious sadism involved here.


What element of malicious sadism do you see here?? What are you talking about??



> There isn't any information on what he did with these tapes so this leaves open the horrendous possibility of others watching this husband force sex upon her.


I agree with this statement. The H must come clean if he has, or intends to use these images for anything other than his (and hopefully her) private viewing.



> I'd be going all-out on the forensics.


From the allegations that you've leveled here, I believe you.


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## wiigirl (Jun 14, 2012)

Terry_CO said:


> You may be right. If they have truly reconciled and are trusting again, that's great.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Same here....once trust is broken its never the same.


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## McMuffin (Dec 17, 2012)

I can tell you that they make RF detectors that will expose hidden cameras and audio equipment....

RF Detector


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## lisab0105 (Oct 26, 2011)

What I would kill for my man to enjoy me/us and our sex life enough to want to tape it and masturbate to it! Between his cheating and his rejecting me for porn...no joke but it would make my freaking day if this was happening to me.


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## badcompany (Aug 4, 2010)

jaharthur said:


> No.


I disagree, there is another possibility. In pre and post pregnancy, or stress-full times it's normal for the woman to be tired, depressed, and..no surprise...LD. During this your H could be getting online for some one handed relief to fill the gaps and finds your video's far more stimulating that some of the gum chewing floozies going thru the actions with Bob Scratch-it for some $$$ for their next bag of nose candy.
If that's the case you should be a bit flattered, not upset, and maybe's he's embarrassed to come clean due to that...and your anger.

Or....you could be correct and maybe he's cashing in on them selling them somewhere. You need to find out.


Edit: Sorry I see someone already touched on this...thought I'd add my .02.


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## Wiserforit (Dec 27, 2012)

PastOM said:


> A felony is a crime, and is therefore committed against the state, not the person. So H may be breaking the law for which there may be a prison term greater than one year. That's a risk he should weigh.


Think you are being smart. You are showing your character.



> I do not recall rape being mentioned in this thread, and if I missed it, please excuse me. If not, I hope that you are not equating this case with rape.


Just like you, spousal rapists don't think they are harming the spouse they are raping. 

The videotaping is a felony. Rape is a felony. Battery is a felony. All felonies various husbands, like you, think are fine to perpetrate upon a wife. 




> I have not read that in the original statement from the OP.


She said so in the OP right here:



> * If I ever said 'no,' it would be a fight and he would accuse me of "not trying." *I was so angry because i WAS putting forward effort. I felt like he was always holding sex over my head... and never willing to hear me when I said we really needed to work on our relationship in order for me to feel close to him.


This was in the period he was videotaping. 

Obviously you have zero empathy for this woman and cannot even read her post properly. There is something very wrong with men like this.


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## PastOM (Apr 12, 2013)

Wiserforit said:


> Think you are being smart. *You are showing your character.*
> 
> *Yikes! Just stating facts.*
> 
> ...


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## nothingtodeclare (Apr 13, 2013)

*Re: Re: Secretly Videotaped*



Wiserforit said:


> Just like you, spousal rapists don't think they are harming the spouse they are raping.
> 
> The videotaping is a felony. Rape is a felony. Battery is a felony. All felonies various husbands, like you, think are fine to perpetrate upon a wife.


You are out of control with this.


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## jaharthur (May 25, 2012)

It's beginning to sound like kindergarten around here.


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## Soifon (Oct 5, 2012)

I agree with group of posters saying this is not divorce worthy. I feel like you have every right to be angry and your trust broken but I don't think this warrants something as serious as divorce and I don't think you really want to break up your family either. It seems to me that he did this for his own personal viewing. If on the other hand he did upload it to porn sites that is an entirely different story. But you don't know that, nothing points to him having done it. To divorce over a suspicion is taking it way too far IMO.

My advice to you is that you both seek MC to overcome this and to find a way to open communication between the two of you. He shouldn't be afraid to let you know what he wants and what turns him on but he also needs to respect you if you say no. And if he is being reasonable you should also try to find a common ground sexually that you can both be happy with.

While you are working on that I would absolutely put a keylogger on the computer, without him knowing, and just silently keep an eye on what he is doing online. Also get the RF detector someone linked and just be vigilant in monitoring him until you feel the trust has been reclaimed. If you ever find he is uploading videos or visiting sites for homemade porn then I think you can take this to the next level.


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## Jirish (Jul 1, 2013)

I am the offender in this original post. I am Persimmon's husband. She told me some time ago that she came on her for advice, and I respected that she needed to go to someone to talk about what I did to her. I was recently reading over the e-mail she sent me explaining her intentions and decided to come see if I can find her advice (searching “video” made it easy).

I admit I am responsible for my deception, and any pain and abuse that went along with it. I also admit that my wife would have been justified for leaving me for my deceiving her this way. However, I am very grateful that she decided that a marriage with three children is worth working on. I love my wife with all of my heart, and my actions were not acceptable or reflective of how I feel about her in my life. I am regretful for the pain that I have put her through, and I’m embarrassed that I treated her like an object rather than a living, breathing, feeling person. I will always remember the pain I put her through, and will have to live with it for the rest of my life…and I don’t expect any sympathy in return.

Reading these comments I can’t say I disagree with the people who see me as a demon. I did something that is deserving of my demonization. I am, though, surprised at how many people were so quick to tell a wife to leave her partner of eight years, with two children and one more only weeks away. I pictured this forum as a place for “advice” when my wife mentioned it, not a place that she would be getting rash calls to judgment from strangers. I am grateful that a few of you (even people that thought she should leave me) were able to provide some advice that was useful. I just don’t understand how some people would have me called a rapist, and look to have the father of her children arrested and imprisoned for this mistake. 

Never was it my intention to share anything online or with anyone. This was not a matter of 100s of secret tapes and it was only for my personal use. I am very attracted to my wife, so much so that prior to making this mistake I actually sought out internet porn that had actresses that resembled my wife. The reason I turned to the deceptive practice was because the novelty of internet porn began to wear off and I remembered how aroused I was by watching my wife when we did this together. This is in no way justification. I told my wife I wouldn’t do it and I did it anyway. That is a lie that I have to live with, and it is trust lost that may never be recovered. And that is no small issue.

This became an obsession with me. It became more about trying to get a video than anything else, and that’s why I became so pushy with my wife over sex. I was being a self-centered cad that forgot that sex is about love too. But I was addicted to the arousal that came from seeing us together, and I used that as my number one excuse for it being “okay”. I lied to myself and made excuses so that I could gratify a desire without thinking of the pain it would cause.

Normally, I would not share this with other people because it’s embarrassing to talk about my self-gratification, but I want to be clear that I would never want to share my wife with other people. I consider my wife to be one of the most beautiful women I have ever known, and I tend to be more possessive than I’ve ever been with past relationships. The idea of other men seeing her in this manner bothers me a lot. 

In the end, I regret ever bringing this pain into our relationship. I hope that others can learn from my mistake. I am not writing this so that my wife sees my regret. I have already personally told her everything that I have said here.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

What do you think others can learn from "your mistake"?


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## Jirish (Jul 1, 2013)

Faithful Wife said:


> What do you think others can learn from "your mistake"?


Well there are a few things that can be learned. Selfishness can cause irreparable pain and damage a relationship. Trust is far more important than personal desires. Personal desires do not justify mental abuse. The fact that I had to make excuses for my action was evidence enough that I shouldn’t have been doing it at all. 

I’m fairly certain that if someone who is acting in the same way reads both my wife’s post, and mine that maybe he would see that his behavior is not acceptable.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

I'm fairly certain a reader who is secretly videotaping someone would NOT feel that way, and that they would actually not read this post at all. That reader would not want to see or hear evidence that they were doing anything wrong. That reader would already be going to great lengths to get away with something so shady that they are clearly not worried about doing the Right Thing.


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## PHTlump (Jun 2, 2010)

Faithful Wife said:


> I'm fairly certain a reader who is secretly videotaping someone would NOT feel that way, and that they would actually not read this post at all. That reader would not want to see or hear evidence that they were doing anything wrong. That reader would already be going to great lengths to get away with something so shady that they are clearly not worried about doing the Right Thing.


I think Jirish's posts can be instructive. I'm sure that, in order to give him justification for doing what he did, he rationalized that his actions weren't all that bad. And I think someone susceptible to those same rationalizations could have his eyes opened by the pain the Jirish has caused his wife.

Similarly, I think all spouses should spend some time reading Coping With Infidelity posts. Even those who aren't cheating, or haven't been betrayed. It's not just psychopaths who betray their spouses and harm their marriages. Good people can do bad things when they rationalize that it's not all that bad, nobody will ever know, it's only one time, etc.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

I would much rather hear from his wife. She is the one who has to deal with the pain.


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## richie33 (Jul 20, 2012)

But it's a step in the right direction that he chose to come on this thread. It can be harsh Jirish but it may help your marriage.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

To me it is just gross and it seems like Jirish expects pity from people...I have pity for his wife, not him.


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## Jirish (Jul 1, 2013)

Faithful Wife said:


> I'm fairly certain a reader who is secretly videotaping someone would NOT feel that way, and that they would actually not read this post at all. That reader would not want to see or hear evidence that they were doing anything wrong. That reader would already be going to great lengths to get away with something so shady that they are clearly not worried about doing the Right Thing.


Okay, as long as you are convinced. I happen to be a person that did do the wrong thing. I am the guy responsible for this shady behavior to the OP, and I feel that it's worth the effort to tell people that this is a potentially life changing act. If you don't agree that it may help someone so be it, I'm not here to convince you otherwise.

I'd aver that just because a person is capable of doing something this despicable doesn't mean they are incapable of correcting their actions if they see the potential loss it may cause the subsequent pain. I am a very loving and affectionate husband, I treasure my wife, and I’d do anything in the world for her. I made a mistake, and I intend on making up for it for the rest of my time with her. I am a person, and I make stupid mistakes. That doesn’t mean I’m without conscience or regret.

I love my wife very much, and had I read something similar, maybe I would have stopped before getting caught. I can’t say for sure, but maybe. I objectified my wife and if other husbands can see that this behavior is nothing more than objectification and not just a fetish satisfaction, then it’s worth my embarrassment.


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## Jirish (Jul 1, 2013)

Faithful Wife said:


> To me it is just gross and it seems like Jirish expects pity from people...I have pity for his wife, not him.


Why would I want pity and for what? I haven't made a single excuse for my behavior. There is no excuse. I played the pity game with my wife, I've moved beyond that and now I just want to heal. I'm not here to change my wife's story. Everything she said was true...I abused her. I acted distrustfully, and I am lucky that my wife is giving me another chance. I don’t want your pity, I don’t even know you.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

The fact that you don't understand why some people would tell your wife to leave you, to me just shows you don't actually "get" it.

I would still like to hear from your wife.

I know you don't know me or anyone here and you don't owe us anything...all I am saying is that your wife came here to disclose something that would cause a divorce AND criminal charges to be filed in MANY marriages, she left the board, and now you are here...and to me, reading your posts doesn't really assure me (not that you need to care what I think) that she is actually ok.

If anything, you responding here instead of her makes me worry for her even more.

Again, I understand you don't need to think twice about what anyone here thinks...but hopefully you also understand how your story and your wife's story could really press some buttons on other people. Your wife's story made me sick to my stomach when I read it, and it still does.


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## Jirish (Jul 1, 2013)

Faithful Wife said:


> The fact that you don't understand why some people would tell your wife to leave you, to me just shows you don't actually "get" it.
> 
> I would still like to hear from your wife.
> 
> ...


Okay.


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## Cletus (Apr 27, 2012)

Put me in the category of those who was surprised by the forum's reaction to the original post.

I had no idea that a someone would be so emotionally distraught by their spouse covertly videotaping their lovemaking. It just didn't register in my brain as a betrayal at the level that would terminate a relationship. 

I learned a great deal reading the thread initially.


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## Jirish (Jul 1, 2013)

Faithful Wife said:


> The fact that you don't understand why some people would tell your wife to leave you, to me just shows you don't actually "get" it.


I believe what I said was that I wouldn't have blamed my wife for leaving me, and I didn't blame people for thinking I was a demon. My comment about "leaving me" was more aligned with the notion that people so quickly came to that conclusion when two children and an impending birth was a part of the equation.


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## Jirish (Jul 1, 2013)

Cletus said:


> Put me in the category of those who was surprised by the forum's reaction to the original post.
> 
> I had no idea that a someone would be so emotionally distraught by their spouse covertly videotaping their lovemaking. It just didn't register in my brain as a betrayal at the level that would terminate a relationship.
> 
> I learned a great deal reading the thread initially.


Cletus - my biggest betrayals was that she had verbalized to me that she no longer felt comfortable with videotaping or pictures and I went behind her back. I also made her feel guilty for not having regular sex with me...when in truth I was doing it so that I could satisfy my fetish. It's not the fetish itself that is wrong; it was the abuse behind my actions.

Edit to add: This doesn't mean that the behavior isn't abusive if the spouse has not verbalized their discomfort with being videotaped or photographed. Consensual sex goes beyond the physical...every aspect should be consented to.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

From the wife's original post:

_"He once again, *would get really angry at me for questioning him*. *He would make me feel like I was betraying him by not trusting him. I couldn't question him without him getting extremely defensive and turning it around on me.* I had to let it go because I had no proof."_

_"Now during this time he was video taping me, we had been going through a rocky period. My father passed away and a depression (plus meds) left me with a lack of sex-drive. *I felt extremely alone and once the sex decreased, it caused a lot of problems. I continued to try, yet felt resentful because he didn't ever seem to care about what I was going through or how I was feeling, only whether he got laid and how good it was. If I ever said 'no,' it would be a fight and he would accuse me of "not trying." *I was so angry because i WAS putting forward effort. I felt like he was always holding sex over my head... and never willing to hear me when I said we really needed to work on our relationship in order for me to feel close to him. When I found out he was video taping me, I felt I never really DID matter to him."_

_"Also- still, *every so often he gets very angry with me for still being mad and un-trusting, and gets pissed if I bring up how it still makes me feel. He thinks I should "get over it"* or "move on" because it's been 6 months. *He says he loves me and he made a mistake... but this was a TWO YEAR mistake*, not just oops one time."_


Just quoting to keep some perspective on what actually occurred. It wasn't just the videotaping....it was the blame shifting, denial, and cruelty to his wife after her father died.


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## Jirish (Jul 1, 2013)

Please see above comment to Cletus.

Now I'm done. I didn't come on here to argue with you or anyone else. I have no intention of justifying my actions. I told my wife I was posting here, but I didn't tell her I was going to carry on with people about what I did. This is about what I did to her, not about whether or not I am seeking your pity.


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## nuclearnightmare (May 15, 2013)

Persimmon said:


> Yes, I took all memory cards and video taping devices. I've gone through his computer and found nothing.
> 
> I'm going to talk to him today about complete transparency.
> 
> ...



OH...reading too fast! missed this (bolded part) first time thru.
Is it possible for a woman to do that to her husband and truly love and respect him?? Both of you crossed important boundaries. a little mutual forgiveness and MC could [potentially go a long way I think. 

though a polygraph for him to test whether or not he posted any of the videos is not a bad idea, I'd say.


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## Jirish (Jul 1, 2013)

nuclearnightmare said:


> OH...reading too fast! missed this (bolded part) first time thru.
> Is it possible for a woman to do that to her husband and truly love and respect him?? Both of you crossed important boundaries. a little mutual forgiveness and MC could [potentially go a long way I think.
> 
> though a polygraph for him to test whether or not he posted any of the videos is not a bad idea, I'd say.


It's absolutely possible for my wife to have done that. Her father had died less than a year before and I had acted like an ass. She also didn't completely lie to me. It had been mentioned that she had talked to him, it was just not known how much. Even after we reconciled this part of our relationship I did what I did.

At this point my wife and I are working on our relationship. It's not always easy, but we love each other. We have three beautiful kids, one only four months old. My commitment is to those children and my wife. It's a lesson a husband and father learns when he almost loses everything because of self-centered stupidity.


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## MrsDraper (May 27, 2013)

He will never respect you. This is a major violation of trust. Leave him, leave him, leave him. Be gone tomorrow, because he is probably taping you taking a shower tonight. 

This is some sick stuff. I would not be surprised if he has been sharing the videos if he is really into porn.


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## PHTlump (Jun 2, 2010)

Faithful Wife said:


> Just quoting to keep some perspective on what actually occurred. It wasn't just the videotaping....it was the blame shifting, denial, and cruelty to his wife after her father died.


Well, all that behavior is consistent with his taping. Behavior like this is common on the Infidelity board. If a spouse is having an affair, and the betrayed spouse becomes suspicious, the disloyal spouse starts the head games of indignant anger at being suspected and will often accuse the betrayed spouse of being the one having an affair.

If you're going to be a jerk by taping your wife when you've promised not to, you're pretty much going to commit to it. That's not an action where you're only going to be a little bit of a jerk. You're going to be a great big awful jerk.

However, I think you've gone too far in suspecting him of foul play. There was nothing in the OP's posts, and there's been nothing in his posts, suggesting any violence. He's just been a real jerk. But a nonviolent one.


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## nuclearnightmare (May 15, 2013)

PHTlump said:


> Well, all that behavior is consistent with his taping. Behavior like this is common on the Infidelity board. If a spouse is having an affair, and the betrayed spouse becomes suspicious, the disloyal spouse starts the head games of indignant anger at being suspected and will often accuse the betrayed spouse of being the one having an affair.
> 
> If you're going to be a jerk by taping your wife when you've promised not to, you're pretty much going to commit to it. That's not an action where you're only going to be a little bit of a jerk. You're going to be a great big awful jerk.
> 
> However, I think you've gone too far in suspecting him of foul play. There was nothing in the OP's posts, and there's been nothing in his posts, suggesting any violence. He's just been a real jerk. But a nonviolent one.


Sounds like they have both been jerks in the relationship. She's the one that had the affair!


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## jaharthur (May 25, 2012)

nuclearnightmare said:


> Sounds like they have both been jerks in the relationship. She's the one that had the affair!


Affair?



> During those two years when we were having problems, I reached out to an old friend/ex. He lived across the country and I talked to him on the phone frequently for a matter of months. I confessed, and it was nothing ever physical or even more than catching up and talking about life


Some affair.


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## salamander (Apr 2, 2013)

Jirish said:


> I am the offender in this original post. I am Persimmon's husband. She told me some time ago that she came on her for advice, and I respected that she needed to go to someone to talk about what I did to her. I was recently reading over the e-mail she sent me explaining her intentions and decided to come see if I can find her advice (searching “video” made it easy).
> 
> I admit I am responsible for my deception, and any pain and abuse that went along with it. I also admit that my wife would have been justified for leaving me for my deceiving her this way. However, I am very grateful that she decided that a marriage with three children is worth working on. I love my wife with all of my heart, and my actions were not acceptable or reflective of how I feel about her in my life. I am regretful for the pain that I have put her through, and I’m embarrassed that I treated her like an object rather than a living, breathing, feeling person. I will always remember the pain I put her through, and will have to live with it for the rest of my life…and I don’t expect any sympathy in return.
> 
> ...


It is beautiful and amazing that you came to speak your side. I, however, don't know you nor do I know you, so you could possibly be any number of problemmatic personalities/behaviorpatterns and so could she. In my experience, a partner who would stalk his woman on the internet after taping her without her permission is not going to be my first go-to person to trust.

If you are in fact operating in the field of trust, I wonder what steps you are taking to counteract what you very rightly name as "selfishness". Because in my personal experience, that is actually Narcissism when it comes across like you have in this thread, not just because she wrote about you, but also your abuse apologism.

at the same time, I know in my own relationship, radical acceptance has caused me to swallow some severely bitter pills.

I feel guarded, yet openminded.


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## salamander (Apr 2, 2013)

Jirish said:


> Well there are a few things that can be learned. Selfishness can cause irreparable pain and damage a relationship. Trust is far more important than personal desires. Personal desires do not justify mental abuse. The fact that I had to make excuses for my action was evidence enough that I shouldn’t have been doing it at all.
> 
> I’m fairly certain that if someone who is acting in the same way reads both my wife’s post, and mine that maybe he would see that his behavior is not acceptable.


I relate to this explanation. It sounds a whole lot like what my H said to me after he groomed me into "consenting" to a threesome with another guy. I forgive my man, because the trend was never a personality trait nor a typical route of his behavior. I forgave him because I can take a larger perspective and view his actions along with my own on other occasions in the light of compassion.


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## salamander (Apr 2, 2013)

PHTlump said:


> I think Jirish's posts can be instructive. I'm sure that, in order to give him justification for doing what he did, he rationalized that his actions weren't all that bad. And I think someone susceptible to those same rationalizations could have his eyes opened by the pain the Jirish has caused his wife.
> 
> Similarly, I think all spouses should spend some time reading Coping With Infidelity posts. Even those who aren't cheating, or haven't been betrayed. It's not just psychopaths who betray their spouses and harm their marriages. Good people can do bad things when they rationalize that it's not all that bad, nobody will ever know, it's only one time, etc.


This is a more clear elucidation of my own experiences, both of mine and my spouse's behavior on 2 or more critical occasions.


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## salamander (Apr 2, 2013)

Jirish said:


> Okay, as long as you are convinced. I happen to be a person that did do the wrong thing. I am the guy responsible for this shady behavior to the OP, and I feel that it's worth the effort to tell people that this is a potentially life changing act. If you don't agree that it may help someone so be it, I'm not here to convince you otherwise.
> 
> I'd aver that just because a person is capable of doing something this despicable doesn't mean they are incapable of correcting their actions if they see the potential loss it may cause the subsequent pain. I am a very loving and affectionate husband, I treasure my wife, and I’d do anything in the world for her. I made a mistake, and I intend on making up for it for the rest of my time with her. I am a person, and I make stupid mistakes. That doesn’t mean I’m without conscience or regret.
> 
> I love my wife very much, and had I read something similar, maybe I would have stopped before getting caught. I can’t say for sure, but maybe. I objectified my wife and if other husbands can see that this behavior is nothing more than objectification and not just a fetish satisfaction, then it’s worth my embarrassment.


I, too, have done dispiccable acts, and I, too, am grateful and appreciative of the forgiveness my H has shown (and vice versa)


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## salamander (Apr 2, 2013)

Cletus said:


> Put me in the category of those who was surprised by the forum's reaction to the original post.
> 
> I had no idea that a someone would be so emotionally distraught by their spouse covertly videotaping their lovemaking. It just didn't register in my brain as a betrayal at the level that would terminate a relationship.
> 
> I learned a great deal reading the thread initially.


taping anyone without their permission is a basic offense in the court of American law. probably other nations, too, I'm just speaking in terms of my own culture. That's why Snowden is running from the law, he whistleblew on our governmental eavesdroppers...

at least this "eavesdropper" has the decency to "profess" regret for his actions! Honestly, what more can we ask of someone?


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## salamander (Apr 2, 2013)

Jirish said:


> I believe what I said was that I wouldn't have blamed my wife for leaving me, and I didn't blame people for thinking I was a demon. My comment about "leaving me" was more aligned with the notion that people so quickly came to that conclusion when two children and an impending birth was a part of the equation.


It's because you actually DON'T get it...IT being, the gravity of your transgression. What you did was worthy of ditching you no matter what the reproductive status was. YOU VIOLATED YOUR WOMAN in a very deep, very real, very traumatizing way. How can you ever expect to move forward before you move THROUGH this obstacle in your Karmic life????


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## salamander (Apr 2, 2013)

Jirish said:


> Please see above comment to Cletus.
> 
> Now I'm done. I didn't come on here to argue with you or anyone else. I have no intention of justifying my actions. I told my wife I was posting here, but I didn't tell her I was going to carry on with people about what I did. This is about what I did to her, not about whether or not I am seeking your pity.


I am in no way a pity function, yet I AM a clear-thinking human who has also served many years as a teacher and guide to people of every age and description. I still think this thread is one of valuable insight to you as you traverse your moral continent.


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## Batman4691 (Jun 24, 2013)

Well, well, well,...Has everyone finished with extracting their pound of flesh from the OP's husband??

I find it incredibly disturbing that people can receive snippets of a marital problem from one spouse and tell that person to "dump the a**hole". 

Let's recap a bit shall we?

1.) The OP admits before this 2 year problem she use to share in dress up, photo taking, and other sexual play with her husband while in the bedroom.
_(A dream come true for most men.)_

2.) During a time of stress in her life, father's death, drugs she was taking, she lost her sexual drive and began refusing her husband's advances in the bedroom. Her husband becomes upset, and sexually frustrated.

3.) The OP starts erasing and deleting all the photos and videos taken consensually during their previous times of sexual play. She now views these things as wrong and embarrassing.

4.) During this time of tremendous emotional upheaval, where her husband hasn't done anything wrong yet, she can open up herself and carry on a 2 year "emotional affair" with a long lost boyfriend. Having regular phone chat sessions where they reportedly chat about life in general. (_Sure_).

5.) It's during this time of withholding, or denying sex on a normal basis with her husband, that he starts feeling his wife is turning cold toward him. She even goes as far as admitting to her husband she has contacted, and is chatting with an old boyfriend. (_Talk about emotional abuse_.) 

6.) She lies to her husband about the extent of her phone calls to her old boyfriend, leading her husband to believe it it's just a few times, when in reality it is regular, and spans 2 years.

7.) The OP's husband feels backed into a corner, physically and emotionally abandoned by his wife who is now chatting it up with an old boyfriend.

8.) The OP's husband starts looking for a sexual outlet. He turns to internet porn and finds no satisfaction. No one measures up to his wife. He looks for the photos of him and his wife that were previously consensually taken. He finds that his wife has erased and deleted them. 

9.) Grasping at straws, knowing his wife is becoming less inclined to have sexual relations with him, he makes a big mistake and secretly video tapes several of their rare sexual encounters to enjoy on his own, and in private. _(Not completely out of left field, because she use to previously allow a camera in the bedroom.)_

10.) The OP suspects something with the hidden cameras and confronts her husband. He denies it because it is his only way to enjoy his wife when on the rare occasion she would share herself physically with him. 

11.) The OP finds *one* video of herself and her husband having sex that has been recorded without her knowledge. She is rightly upset. She confronts him with the "evidence" this time and he admits to secretly recording their sexual encounter. 

12.) They try a period of reconciliation, a time of forgiveness for both parties involved. However, OP cannot find the trust she use to have in her husband, and keeps bringing up the video when arguing with her husband. _(Not exactly part of forgiveness is it, using past mistakes as weapons in arguments of today)_ 
She doesn't know if she can ever trust him again to be truthful with her and seeks advice.

*************************************
NOW, I didn't write this post to score brownie points with the other TAM members who have previously voiced their opinions, and judging by some comments will probably make some people angry. I don't care.

I feel sorry for the OP's husband. I have been denied in the bedroom by an LD spouse when previous behavior dictated otherwise. It is an extremely emotional as well as physical rollercoaster to be put on. 

The only thing wrong the poor guy did was want to experience some sort of sexual fulfillment *with his wife * and made the mistake of recording it without her permission for his own personal use.

All who posted that their should be further technical investigation into the husband's computer's history and internet habits need to calm down and take a breath.
I find it strange that you never mentioned the wife's phone habits *for two years*. 
Maybe there should be an investigation and phone transcripts tracked down to see if the OP and her old beau were just talking about the weather.

edit:
I find it very hypocritical of some women who can conveniently overlook the OP's emotional "phone" affair with her old boyfriend, but would eviscerate any man who had done the same thing.


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## salamander (Apr 2, 2013)

I have been an HD wife who has withdrawn from my even-higher-drive???no not really, another term....higher dopamine risk seeking mate? upon occasion...those occasions being times when his risky woohoo exceeded my wow risk is intoxicating yeehaw!.

It doesn't have to be a blame game. My hubby was not cognizant of why i put the brakes on. I was not cognizant of why he saw our sex in terms of transactionalism.

Ultimately, my offense at his actions had to be equal in validity to his offense at my actions.

or basically, otherwise stated, our pain became common coin. We respected each other equally, via recognition, awareness, empathy, and ultimately, compassion towards and receiving of one another.

That last part is criticaL: compassion towards, and receiving. Dont leave one iota out in your plan!!


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## salamander (Apr 2, 2013)

btw, hubby also says, no honey not tonight. It's really NOT THE END OF HTE WORLD people!! one of the Four Agreements is, STOP TAKING THINGS SO PERSONALLY!!!


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## FemBot (May 1, 2013)

The part of this story that the OP is having difficulty forgiving is the fact that he lied to her face when confronted several times. It's not about the videotaping or anything else. How can your H lie to you and make you feel crazy with such ease? The transgression is not the problem, it's the feeling of mistrust she's been left with. She needs to learn to be vulnerable again if she wants to forgive and her husband needs to be trustworthy from now on. They can rebuild the trust but it takes the two of them.

Any time she brings it up and rehashes old feelings, he has to be understanding, listen and apologize again and again. She will heal a little each time. If he dismisses her feelings and gets annoyed by her bringing it up 'again' it will make things worse.


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## badcompany (Aug 4, 2010)

Ha...I called it Page 3....
It's obvious that there were other problems here that lead to the taping being the subject of a blowout. From what I see there was an EA going on plus the loss of her father and meds involved on her part. BOTH of you are at fault for building up your cold war "emotional weapons stash" instead of ironing things out. I'll never understand why women, when thrown a curve ball in life consisting of one or more stressful situations, why they go off the rails, lash out at their SO, and create alot of problems, when they need to be embracing them instead.
You both handled this wrong, but IMO the OP started it with the EA and cold shoulder and she ultimately owns this.


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## Michelleinmichigan (Jun 26, 2013)

Persimmon said:


> First off, my husband and I have been together for about 8 years and have two kids.
> 
> About a year ago I suspected he was secretly videotaping me because I found a hidden camera/thumb drive in our home. He claimed he found the thing at work- and treated me like I was crazy. He even got offended and angry with me for suspecting such a thing. I believed him.
> 
> ...


I'm so sorry. Does he watch porn?


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## janefw (Jun 26, 2012)

> just don’t understand how some people would have me called a rapist, and look to have the father of her children arrested and imprisoned for this mistake.


They didn't call you a rapist. Also, it's not a "mistake" to deliberately ignore your wife's requests not to film her, and to lie repeatedly that you are not filming her. It's a quite deliberate deception. The fact that you don't own up to it means that you are unlikely to change.


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## Michelleinmichigan (Jun 26, 2013)

Normally I would agree with you except I had a friend go through a similar experience. i spent years telling my friend that she had to be more dutiful to her husband, and it wasn't right that she wouldn't have sex as often as he wanted.

Turns out the guy had a little porn/sex addiction problem and a double life. He was passive-aggressive and that type of abuse is horrible. He also engaged in gas lighting behavior, so wifey never knew what the hell was going on, but she would come in and out of depression. She was either being used like a blow up doll for H to to self medicate, or was constantly evading his sexual advances, and "emotional needs" that were impossible for her to fulfill. She was exhausted, confused, lonely, and believed it was all her fault.

I knew her all my life and though she wasn't like that before. I thought she simply changed. Like an idiot I told her she had to try for the kids. He pretended to be a doting husband, a victim of her problems, he told told me he would do anything for her. etc. Friend told me that he really never showed any concern about things she was going through, if it was the anniversary of her mother's death, and she said she was sad. He would just look at her and walk away. I told her men don't always understand those things. I didn't realize it was constant. He was present in body, but his mind was out. Nobody knew what she was going through, and she didn't understand it herself.

Turns out a neighbor told her exactly who her husband was, which basically a Jeckyl and Hyde personality. Husbands porn use was the reason she cringed when he touched her, it felt like an assault. He was the reason for her depressions. He ended up admitting everything, because he was cornered.

The problem with friend, and the problem that OP have is that once you see first hand, someone's ability to lie the way that they have, it is impossible to trust again. That will be the case with anyone. Once that mask comes off, the experience is something you don't get over.

What do you do if your spouse is not who you thought they were? It is beyond creepy.


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## nuclearnightmare (May 15, 2013)

Michelleinmichigan said:


> Normally I would agree with you except I had a friend go through a similar experience. i spent years telling my friend that she had to be more dutiful to her husband, and it wasn't right that she wouldn't have sex as often as he wanted.
> 
> Turns out the guy had a little porn/sex addiction problem and a double life. He was passive-aggressive and that type of abuse is horrible. He also engaged in gas lighting behavior, so wifey never knew what the hell was going on, but she would come in and out of depression. She was either being used like a blow up doll for H to to self medicate, or was constantly evading his sexual advances, and "emotional needs" that were impossible for her to fulfill. She was exhausted, confused, lonely, and believed it was all her fault.
> 
> ...



this is an intriguing story. probing a little on the details. you use terms 'double life', 'sex addiction', 'porn use'......what do you mean? did he go outside the marriage for sex, physical affaits etc?


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## badmemory (Jul 31, 2012)

Batman4691 said:


> Well, well, well,...Has everyone finished with extracting their pound of flesh from the OP's husband??
> 
> I find it incredibly disturbing that people can receive snippets of a marital problem from one spouse and tell that person to "dump the a**hole".
> 
> ...


OK, I'm late to this party and it looks like OP has left the building; yet the thread lives on. It is an interesting topic, so let me throw a theory out there about the husband's motivation to do this.

Again it's just a theory, and I do agree that taping without her knowing is plain wrong.

1 - Husband is frustrated due to lack of sex from wife.

2 - He starts watching porn and masturbating to compensate.

3 - Gets the idea to video his own lovemaking as a supplement to the porn. He particularly likes the new thrill of masturbating to a video of himself and his wife. He's hooked. 

4- Wife cuts off video taping. 

5 - He's compelled to continue it undercover. Still doing it to masturbate, along with the other porn. Still doing it because he's not getting enough sex from his wife.

I propose that it's a porn addiction issue that the husband let get out of control. He needs addiction counseling and they need MC to get past this betrayal issue.

Just a theory mind you. OP if you're still here, let me know what you think.


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## Michelleinmichigan (Jun 26, 2013)

I agree with some things badmemory, except when people have porn/sex addictions. It usually starts in their youth, where the addict traces it back to being exposed to pornographic images at young ages ( I've read as young as 5). Prbably had parent sex addicts.

Lack of sex doesn't suddenly make healthy men watch porn. Porn does make healthy women get turned off by sex with the addict. (not always)

There is no amount of sex that satisfies addicts. They always need more, different, and eventually deviant if they don't get it under control.

There many addicts that claim they were otherwise normal hetero sexual men, that end up engaging in homosexual acts, simply because it is the only thing that will give them their fix. They admit to having NO attraction to men. It is progressive, and an "active sex" life just fuels the addiction.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

This is very simple. No means no, the wife said no, and she meant it. The husband completely disregared the wife's plainly stated no and did something extremely creepy and horrible. What else is there to understand?


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## Michelleinmichigan (Jun 26, 2013)

nuclearnightmare said:


> this is an intriguing story. probing a little on the details. you use terms 'double life', 'sex addiction', 'porn use'......what do you mean? did he go outside the marriage for sex, physical affaits etc?


I realize that my friend knew a lot of things she wasn't willing to repeat to anyone. She would almost rather believe that the problems were her fault, than think that the father of her kids was a perv.

She knew about an EA, found text messages, caught him in more lies etc. She was sure there was more to it. That's when he called me and played me like an idiot. I wanted to save her children from a divorce over a "misunderstanding".

He would leave the bed at night saying his wrist hurt. She always complained that he would wake up looking like he had a hangover.

He would lie, confuse things, made it seem like she was crazy.

Then a neighbor, confessed some pretty nasty details. He pretended to be doting husband and father, didn't even cuss. The Party Animal Porno looking neighbor called him The Devil. Friend never knew why. But he ended up confessing PA lewd and lascivious remarks etc.


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## Jirish (Jul 1, 2013)

I’m starting to regret posting here; I didn’t intend to have people decide who is to blame. I need to make some things clear; I am to blame for my actions.

I don’t know who said what, and I’m not going to go back and address each person directly…except Faithful Wife, and to you I just say, “You’re absolutely annoying”. I don’t even see why you are on a forum like this if you aren’t here to contribute to a healing process, or to provide help. I have the feeling that even if my wife were to come on here and tell you that I’m not a sociopath you’d tell her that she’s just an abused woman that has been conditioned to “obey”. For you to imply that I may have caused my wife physical harm and that’s why she’s not here now is stupid and uncalled for without more information. 

As for other things, I guess I can clear things up a little bit since there is a lot of speculation and much of it wrong. Some of the speculation is completely unfair to my wife, since this was her venue to vent and get some advice. First of all, I am not cyber-stalking my wife. She told me the very day she submitted the original post. She told me the site she did it on, and asked that we begin a journey of complete transparency from that day forward as a solution to both of our relationship failures. I didn’t come on here out of respect and because it was hard to face what I had done. 

Now, I decided to comment yesterday after reading it because I saw that people had misunderstood her remarks about talking with her ex and because it’s part of my healing to accept responsibility and see the pain I caused. 

She happened to leave town recently, and I was missing her. When I miss her I tend to read some of our e-mail correspondence. I read the one that had the “transparency” in it that mentioned this site and post. 

I am a middle aged male that has never been in love before…my wife was the first woman to ever steal my heart, so I have somewhat of an attachment to her. It may have been a part of the reason I was so “sexually obsessed” with her. Prior to being with my wife I didn’t need sex often because the women I was with were never fully gratifying. I’m not gay, not remotely attracted to men (not that it bothers me); I just needed more than empty sex. 

My wife and I had a very active sex life when we first got together, she was always “available” and initiated just as much as me. We taped, took pictures, and dressed up (all occasionally, not all the time). I began to want all of those things more and more. 

Finally she said that she no longer wanted to be videoed or photographed because she was afraid I would misuse them, I promised her I wouldn’t. I had put some of the stuff on a disc, while others were on the computer. She asked me to get rid of it so that it would not get discovered. I deleted all of the stuff on the computer, but I kept the disc. When she asked if I had destroyed it I told her “yes”. I lied because I thought it was harmless at the time. No less a lie though and it was wrong. She discovered the disc and there was an argument that ensued. We got through this problem. 

In the interim her father passed away, and she fell into a depression. I didn’t recognize it for what it was, and was certainly insensitive to her depression after she explained to me what she was feeling. I tried to be a good husband, but I just didn’t handle it well. The sex began to dwindle to once a month maybe, partly as a result of her depression and partly because when we would have sex I would always want to satisfy the clothing fetish. It got old to her and she needed to feel loved, not objectified.

I didn’t recognize how selfish I was being and I pushed back harder. When the sex began to dwindle to no more than once a month I betrayed her wishes and began secretly videotaping. This was a month or so after she began talking to her ex regularly…however my reasoning was not to get even; I didn’t even know the extent of her communications at the time. I was merely being selfish and had an unhealthy obsession with my wife. I prefer our sex life to watching the sex life of actors. 

My wife had not hidden the fact that she was talking with her ex from me. She was less than honest about how often, and she made the calls to him when I wasn’t around usually, but when I asked her she never denied talking with him. I don’t believe it was an emotional affair at all. I know my wife very well, and she is not one to step out. When I finally asked her about it, she explained to me that she talked with him because she needed someone to talk to about her problems, and this guy was always willing to talk with her (in a way she led him on). Remember, I wasn’t providing her with an outlet for her pain and depression over her father’s death. When I asked her to stop talking with him, she did…he was not happy, but she insisted he stop calling and they’ve not talked since.

I, on the other hand, continued to record (or attempt) our sex when it would happen. I would also push sex when she didn’t want to…I would get upset that we were only having sex once a month or so, and I would tell her that she wasn’t trying. In reality, I was to blame because I wasn’t providing her emotional support, and I was insensitive to her needs. This happened regularly, she’d say “no”, I’d get upset and we’d fight. This went on for a little over a year, maybe a year and a half. I can’t be certain.

Finally, onetime while we were being intimate she noticed the thumb drive camera and asked if I was recording us and I said that I wasn’t. I pretended that I didn’t know what the drive was, and told her I found it at work. I lied. She didn’t ask me about it again, and I was relieved. I don’t know how much longer it was, a month, two months…not sure, but she found my camera in my closet. She called me at work and asked me again if I had been recording our sex. I lied and said “no”. I did the standard cornered routine of being “offended” that she would accuse me. When I came home, she asked again. Again I lied. Then she asked me to come clean one more time…I lied again. After she showed me the camera, I tried to deny it again. Finally I admitted to what I had done. We’ve been working on it since. 

When she posted here, it had been 6-8 months since I had been caught. I had been apologetic, but I hadn’t fully taken responsibility. I wanted to continue with the excuses…blaming the ex…blaming our sex life, or blaming my obsession. When she would bring it up I would get defensive and get upset that it was being brought up again.

I mentioned in our last fight (which was in the fight right before posting here) that for us to heal she needed to get past it. I had meant it to be that she not bring it up anymore. It was the wrong thing for me to say and expect. I was once again being self-centered and not seeing that she needs to heal, and part of that healing is for me to allow her to be angry.

I also had to heal from the misdirected grudge I had held. I had to accept my real reason for why I did what I did to her. I did it for one reason alone…I was selfish. I lied because I was cornered and embarrassed. I lost her trust because covering my ass was more important than being honest with my wife. 

So, for the person that said that I don’t get “it” if I don’t understand why people would suggest that she leave me. That was not my intention. I meant to move so “quickly” to that advice when there are kids involved and a baby on the way. Not that it was the advice given, but it was given without any other advice. I get it…I wouldn’t blame my wife today if she decided to leave me for this even after all this time. Trust is a big thing in a relationship, and I damaged that trust.

For the people that think she is to blame because of an emotional affair; that would just be another excuse for my bad behavior. I don’t believe she had any intentions other than to seek out a person that would listen to her and be there for support. However, even if she had other intentions, it doesn’t excuse my violation of her trust and privacy. I didn’t put the camera up to catch a cheater; I placed the camera to satisfy my selfish desire. 

I hope this clears things up and people can stop with the speculation. We have been working very hard on our communication and transparency in our relationship. It’s not always easy, but it is helping.


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## Michelleinmichigan (Jun 26, 2013)

Good for you Jirish. You are a lucky man if you are able to work this out. Go to church, a little God in your lives helps to forgive, heal, and start new.

Make sure you never let yourself slip. My friends husband had a chance, probably several. When it happened again, it was too much too late.


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## mineforever (Jan 31, 2013)

When it is all said and done it is you and her's relationship....and the only two peoples opion that really counts is yours and hers. It really sounds to me like the two of you are talking again and working through what has happened and why..how you two got to the place you were at. Thats what is important...keep the communication lines open and honest.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

Jirish...I am sorry for not being more respectful to you. I understand you think I'm a bad person to be on a message forum. Your wife's testimony hit me in the gut, that's all I will say. When I said I would like to hear from her, I am sorry if you felt that implied I meant you might have harmed her...I did not mean that. I meant that I wished we heard from her to know her mental and emotional state.

Again, sorry. You are clearly brave to even be here. My own projections apparently won't let me be anything close to objective on your thread so I'll leave it but will wish you and your wife the best.


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## Batman4691 (Jun 24, 2013)

badmemory said:


> OK, I'm late to this party and it looks like OP has left the building; yet the thread lives on. It is an interesting topic, so let me throw a theory out there about the husband's motivation to do this.
> 
> Again it's just a theory, and I do agree that taping without her knowing is plain wrong.
> 
> ...


I find it interesting you quote me, and address the husbands issues with sexual fulfillment, but never once mention the wife's emotional affair with an old boyfriend. Did you just skim over that part, or is that easy for you to understand and forgive?

Who in your mind was the betrayed?


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## Batman4691 (Jun 24, 2013)

Jirish said:


> For the people that think she is to blame because of an emotional affair; that would just be another excuse for my bad behavior. I don’t believe she had any intentions other than to seek out a person that would listen to her and be there for support.


I am a middle aged man myself and have been married for 28 years. After reading your last post I am truly blown away. 

Let me get this straight, it's all your fault, because of your "bad behavior". You believe you drove your wife into the emotional arms of another man. Whom *she* chose to call, and pour her heart out too. 
Then after leading this man on for several months or years, she had to put the brakes on, and tell him the calls had to stop, for which *he was upset*.
Knowing this, don't tell me that you are going to stick to your wife's story that they were just conversing about everyday things, or _*"she had no intentions other than to seek out a person that would listen to her and be there for support." *_
Do you really believe this? 
If so, why did she lie to you about the full extent of her phone calls to this man? :scratchhead: 
Moreover, why was he upset at not being able to be her shoulder to cry on anymore when she put a stop to it? Wouldn't he find it a good thing you two were reconciling if her intentions over the phone with him were pure?

_(Somehow, you are the one that has lost all trust because of your lies to her, but she bears no responsibility for her lies to you about the extent and purpose of her phone calls to another man )_

In the future, when your marriage hits a rough patch, (and it will), will it be okay with you if she hops on the phone and starts dialing up an old boyfriend for support? 

To tell you the truth, your two main posts sound like prepared statements from the captors of prisoners of war given them to read publicly as a way to break them down and demoralize them. 

I appreciate the fact that you two are working things out together and want to give your marriage a chance, but don't be a doormat where you accept the blame for everything that has gone wrong with your relationship. You have problems to work on and be sorry for, but she most certainly does too.


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## Batman4691 (Jun 24, 2013)

Jirish said:


> My wife had not hidden the fact that she was talking with her ex from me. She was less than honest about how often, and she made the calls to him when I wasn’t around usually, but when I asked her she never denied talking with him. I don’t believe it was an emotional affair at all. I know my wife very well, and she is not one to step out. When I finally asked her about it, she explained to me that she talked with him because she needed someone to talk to about her problems, and this guy was always willing to talk with her (in a way she led him on). Remember, I wasn’t providing her with an outlet for her pain and depression over her father’s death. When I asked her to stop talking with him, she did…he was not happy, but she insisted he stop calling and they’ve not talked since.



*Try reading it this way and tell me again that the OP in this thread doesn't bear the brunt of the blame. There's more going on here than meets the eye.*



Jirish said:


> My husband had not hidden the fact that he was talking with his ex from me. He was less than honest about how often, and he made the calls to her when I wasn’t around usually, but when I asked him he never denied talking with her. I don’t believe it was an emotional affair at all. I know my husband very well, and he is not one to step out. When I finally asked him about it, he explained to me that he talked with her because he needed someone to talk to about his problems, and this girl was always willing to talk with him (in a way he led her on). Remember, I wasn’t providing him with an outlet for his pain and depression over his mother’s death. When I asked him to stop talking with her, he did…she was not happy, but he insisted she stop calling and they’ve not talked since.


*The quote is exactly the same, but switch the genders around and it paints an entirely different picture.*

*Would you women out there for one minute give the advice you gave this man after viewing it in this manner?*


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## Jirish (Jul 1, 2013)

Faithful Wife said:


> Jirish...I am sorry for not being more respectful to you. I understand you think I'm a bad person to be on a message forum. Your wife's testimony hit me in the gut, that's all I will say. When I said I would like to hear from her, I am sorry if you felt that implied I meant you might have harmed her...I did not mean that. I meant that I wished we heard from her to know her mental and emotional state.
> 
> Again, sorry. You are clearly brave to even be here. My own projections apparently won't let me be anything close to objective on your thread so I'll leave it but will wish you and your wife the best.


All is well.


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## Jirish (Jul 1, 2013)

Batman – I completely understand your objections to my statements. Where it goes astray is when you assume that my wife hasn’t taken responsibility for her actions, and that there were no discussions about that issue, as well as fights. There were, and we reconciled. I told her not to talk with him anymore, she promised me she wouldn’t. My reason for taking blame, was not for ALL of our problems, it is taking responsibility for what I did to my wife. I own my actions, and I refuse to place blame on my wife. She accepted responsibility for her part already. 

However, I chose to recognize my shortcomings in our relationship when it comes to emotional support and doing so I also recognize why she sought it out elsewhere. The reason the ex was so upset is because he is completely obsessed with her and has been for years. She never fully recognized it for what it was, but I had. That is part of the reason I didn’t want him talking to her. Even though he was thousands of miles away, I feared he would get the wrong idea and do something rash. Instead, he just got upset that he couldn’t contact her anymore. 

My wife was wrong for what she did…she admitted to that already, and we’ve dealt with it – and still do at times. This thread is not about advice for me, and I’m not really seeking it. She did hurt me with this –EA—but I can tell you with all certainty that it was not my reasoning for secretly videotaping our intimacy. That’s my overall point..


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## olwhatsisname (Dec 5, 2012)

he is probably marketing the vid.


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## badmemory (Jul 31, 2012)

Batman4691 said:


> I find it interesting you quote me, and address the husbands issues with sexual fulfillment, but never once mention the wife's emotional affair with an old boyfriend. Did you just skim over that part, or is that easy for you to understand and forgive?
> 
> Who in your mind was the betrayed?


I used your quote because I thought you did a good job of summarizing the timeline. No other reason. No hidden agenda, no skimming over.

My intent was to simply suggest a possible motivation for the man's secret video taping, as that was the topic of the thread; and this is a "sex" forum. Never the less, I didn't think the EA was a part of that particular issue, so to suggest that I'm condoning an EA is your mistake.

Further, as a betrayed spouse in R myself; no, I'm not prone to be understanding and forgiving about infidelity. Anything but. However, I do think those discussions are better dealt with in the "Coping with Infidelity" forum.


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## nuclearnightmare (May 15, 2013)

JIrish:
the problem some of us are having is, since it was your wife that started this thread, why has she stopped posting in it? Especially given these recent questions we've raised. You are, essentially, responding in her behalf. where did she go? She had no trouble speaking up for herself, about her "violated rights", in February - what gives?


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## Jirish (Jul 1, 2013)

nuclearnightmare said:


> JIrish:
> the problem some of us are having is, since it was your wife that started this thread, why has she stopped posting in it? Especially given these recent questions we've raised. You are, essentially, responding in her behalf. where did she go? She had no trouble speaking up for herself, about her "violated rights", in February - what gives?


 My wife is on vacation. I mention that at the beginning that she had left so I have been going through email because I missed her. I'm not speaking for her or answering questions for her I am responding to speculation and peoples responses to my comment. Whether my wife chooses to respond to this thread anymore is up to her, she may not be seeking any more advice I do not know.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## nuclearnightmare (May 15, 2013)

Jirish said:


> My wife is on vacation. I mention that at the beginning that she had left so I have been going through email because I missed her. I'm not speaking for her or answering questions for her I am responding to speculation and peoples responses to my comment. Whether my wife chooses to respond to this thread anymore is up to her, she may not be seeking any more advice I do not know.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


OK. and I believe you when you say what you did was not connected to what she did.

What you did was not a 'betrayal' in the same sense, or to the same degree as what she did. you both lied but she's the one that brought an outside person into the relationship. She seems to display almost no introspectiveness......going on and on about what you did making it so hard for her to ever "trust" you again. i.e. if you can trust her again, after what she did, why shouldn't she be able to trust you again...and to realize that without others having to point that out to her


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## Batman4691 (Jun 24, 2013)

Jirish said:


> *My wife is on vacation.* I mention that at the beginning that she had left so I have been going through email because I missed her.


That statement alone speaks volumes about your relationship with your wife. 

Does she usually go on vacation without you?? :scratchhead: 
I would be more than concerned about her activities away from home given her past ease that she seeks out old "friends" for support. 
I would think that a vacation together would be just the thing you two needed in reconciling your marriage, not more time apart. 

But what the heck, it isn't my wife and marriage. Thank God.


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## janefw (Jun 26, 2012)

There's something up with this thread. Reads to me like one person posting as both husband and wife. Too convenient she went away and he started posting with such similar words and phrases. Meh. Not convinced at this point.


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## Jirish (Jul 1, 2013)

Batman4691 said:


> That statement alone speaks volumes about your relationship with your wife.
> 
> Does she usually go on vacation without you?? :scratchhead:
> I would be more than concerned about her activities away from home given her past ease that she seeks out old "friends" for support.
> ...


My wife took the kids to see their grandmother. We moved for my job many years ago and don't live near family. We had a baby 4 months ago. I used all my vacation time at that point and now I have stayed behind to work.

I'm amazed at how much everyone WANTS there to be mre to this than what has been explained.


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## Jirish (Jul 1, 2013)

janefw said:


> There's something up with this thread. Reads to me like one person posting as both husband and wife. Too convent she went away and he started posting with such similar words and phrases. Meh. Not convinced at this point.


Why? Maybe it's exactly what it is. SMH at all the bull**** on here. And the word is convenient.


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## janefw (Jun 26, 2012)

Jirish said:


> Why? Maybe it's exactly what it is. SMH at all the bull**** on here. And the word is convenient.


Thank you so much for the correction - the combination of alcohol and iPad is not a good one.

It's my opinion that there is something odd about having two people who post identically and use the same phrasing. Not many people are that similar.

And yes there is lots of b.s. I call b.s. on this thread.


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## Jirish (Jul 1, 2013)

janefw said:


> Thank you so much for the correction - the combination of alcohol and iPad is not a good one.
> 
> It's my opinion that there is something odd about having two people who post identically and use the same phrasing. Not many people are that similar.
> 
> And yes there is lots of b.s. I call b.s. on this thread.


Great, then don't offer advice or take anything away from it. Your problems are solved.


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## farside (Oct 27, 2012)

janefw said:


> There's something up with this thread. Reads to me like one person posting as both husband and wife. Too convenient she went away and he started posting with such similar words and phrases. Meh. Not convinced at this point.


I actually thought the same thing for a moment but I am taking this for face value. 

Jirish: It seems like your wife has moved on from this and I'm happy to hear that. If it is the case, its time for you to move on too. You are arguing with anonymous people on the internet about what appears to be one of the most personal problems a couple can have. Stop feeding the trolls, wanna be therapists and people that are displacing their own issues on you.

If your wife has forgiven you, forgive yourself (and never do it or anything similar again). The more you post here the more you will keep it going.


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## Jirish (Jul 1, 2013)

farside said:


> I actually thought the same thing for a moment but I am taking this for face value.
> 
> Jirish: It seems like your wife has moved on from this and I'm happy to hear that. If it is the case, its time for you to move on too. You are arguing with anonymous people on the internet about what appears to be one of the most personal problems a couple can have. Stop feeding the trolls, wanna be therapists and people that are displacing their own issues on you.
> 
> If your wife has forgiven you, forgive yourself (and never do it or anything similar again). The more you post here the more you will keep it going.


Agreed. This went further than I wanted it to go. I just wanted people to see the malice from the side of the victimizer. It's also become clear to me that some people need to see that not everyone that hurts someone they love is a sociopath. I'm not defending my actions or justifying my motivations. My only intention was to help others see how their actions could potentially affect others.

But you have given the best advice I could have received on here. Thank you for withholding judgement.


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