# Not sure how to word this



## berries (Nov 4, 2013)

I got accused of being a troll in the CWI forum for my forum name and using the word devastated in my title so I have no idea what words I am allowed to use here without having accusations thrown at me.

Anyway, my husband has had 2 EA's, the latest one with my former best friend. We've been married 21 years, have 4 kids, I homeschool and have for the past 12 years.

I told my husband that after the first of the year, he has to move out. I can't get over it this time. I have offered to help him find a place to live. Yesterday, I went down and opened a checking and savings account in my name only so that we can start to split our finances.

I guess I just need somewhere to get my thoughts down. Last night my husband tried to explain to me how he never wanted to hurt me by having an EA with my best friend but that they both knew that what they were doing would hurt me. And so every day for 5 weeks he emailed her all day while I thought he was working and he knew it would hurt me but he didn't want to hurt me but he didn't do anything to stop doing it either. Does any of that make a lick of sense to anyone? I think if you don't want to hurt someone and you know you are doing something that will hurt them, then you stop doing that particular thing. Is that crazy?


----------



## mablenc (Feb 26, 2013)

It's called a cheaters high, nothing matters because they are high on endorphins.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## berries (Nov 4, 2013)

Well, he has said that he just didn't care too. That is just hard for me to wrap my brain around. Why didn't he just leave me? He said to her again and again that is what he wanted so why not? He was being horrible to me, I would not have stopped him.


----------



## mablenc (Feb 26, 2013)

have you read this?

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/32002-welcome-tam-cwi-newbies-please-read.html


----------



## berries (Nov 4, 2013)

Yes, I have. I still have trouble wrapping my brain around all of this.

I am not in limbo, but for now I have to live under the same roof with him. He claims he wants to R and so he is pulling out all the stops trying to convince me it isn't false. I am 180ing the best I can. But it still just baffles me how someone I loved so much could be so cruel.


----------



## cdbaker (Nov 5, 2010)

I think others here have good points, but one more that I'd want to throw out there is that anonymity or confidence that they'll never be caught + temptation = people doing things that they might otherwise never do. 

Berries, everything you have said is absolutely right. I don't want to discredit that. He knew what he was doing was wrong and that it would hurt you if you ever found out. The thought I will emphasis there is the "if you ever found out" part. That doesn't defend him of course, but it's worth noting. I'm guessing he is crushed by how everything has played out, not just at being caught and possibly having to watch his marriage crumble, but also over hurting you.

I guess a good example is if you get home from the grocery story and find that you came home with two candy bars in the bag but notice you were only charged for one. Keeping the candy bar, or not going back to pay for it, is absolutely wrong. It's theft. At the same time, you know you aren't going to get caught, and the store probably won't miss the $0.50, you spend lots of money at the store all the time anyway, etc. etc. etc. We find ways to rationalize things that are wrong. The thing is, the average person would probably never ever intentionally steal that candy bar. But when someone is confident they won't get caught, and the temptation is there to allow it, people sometimes do bad things.

Again, this does NOT by any stretch defend his actions. But I noticed you asking repeatedly "How someone could do this" and saying how it "doesn't make any sense" and such. It sounds like he was getting that endorphin rush, figured he wasn't hurting anyone if he was confident that he didn't actually want to leave you at all, and that you wouldn't find out. All nonsense of course, the lies people tell themselves when they are trying to rationalize something they know is wrong, but at the very least, I bet he never wanted to hurt you and probably never really intended it to go any further than it did. I'm sure that isn't exactly comforting, but it's worth noting.

Can he change? I bet he is fully capable of real genuine change. It would take a lot of effort on the part of BOTH of you. (Not that his actions are your fault at all, but in this type of situation it is always a good idea to try some self reflection to see if there are issues before the affair that you contributed to or didn't do enough to prevent, know what I mean?) Don't assume that his desire to save the marriage and his efforts to that end aren't genuine, as I'd bet that they are very very real. Honestly the way I see it, you are sort of in the driver seat and therefore you can lay out the expectations as you see fit. Perhaps try giving him a list of concerns you have, things that you need to see happen, proof that he needs to commit to, etc. See if he's willing to commit to that and see what happens?


----------



## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

berries said:


> . I have offered to help him find a place to live. Y?


You are very kind. Most people would not do that.

Sorry to hear this happened to you. And sorry to hear you got slighted here at TAM. We have had a lot of trolls lately and sometimes we may make the wrong call on it. 

Good for you for separating finances and standing your ground.

Sorry that it was your "best" friend and husband. You deserve way better. 

It will hurt for a long while but I promise, it gets better.


----------



## berries (Nov 4, 2013)

Caught him in yet another lie just a few minutes ago. I cannot wait until I can get him out of here.


----------



## cdbaker (Nov 5, 2010)

Sorry to hear that berries. Was it related to the EA in some way?


----------



## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Don't help him move.


----------



## berries (Nov 4, 2013)

It was related to the EA. Funny how he said he sent me everything and yet new things keep popping up. This trickle truth is for the birds. And really I don't need any more information. I have enough to know that I am DONE.

I am going back into the attorney's office Monday. It is time to talk strategy.


----------



## berries (Nov 4, 2013)

I am really hurt about my former "friend". I still have to stop myself from calling her when I see something funny or just to see how she is doing. I talked to her every day for 26 years. I wish I could just flip a switch and not care anymore but I just can't.


----------



## berries (Nov 4, 2013)

Oh and he now admits he lied to me when he promised never to cheat again. Duh. Like I hadn't already figured that out.


----------



## cdbaker (Nov 5, 2010)

So have you told him you are giving up? How has he responded to it all?


----------



## berries (Nov 4, 2013)

I haven't told him I have given up. I can't until I am ready to pull the trigger. He is very wishy-washy with me. One minute he acts like he cares, the next he makes snide comments to me.


----------



## berries (Nov 4, 2013)

We went to marriage counseling last night with a new therapist. Basically, she thinks we are doomed. She thinks I deserve better. I can't say I disagree. I'll be glad when I can get all my ducks in a row and file. I am SO done.


----------



## berries (Nov 4, 2013)

I got the "We need to just move on" line last night. 6 whole weeks after I found out my husband of 21 years had just had his 2nd EA and this time it was with my former"best" friend of 26 years and it is time for me to move on. I asked him if he had been smoking crack. He then said maybe he didn't word that right, maybe not move on but move forward.

I told him the only thing I was interested in moving forward with right now is a divorce. How can I make plans to move forward with someone who hasn't even bothered to earn my trust back? He has been a jerk, has shown no remorse and I'm just supposed to move forward?


----------



## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Of course you need to just move on. He can't wait til he can date her openly. And pretend that it only happened after the divorce.

gag me


----------



## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

You HAVE told his parents and siblings, right? Right?


----------



## berries (Nov 4, 2013)

Oh his parents and siblings would be thrilled to know. They have never liked me. And they have decided that they don't like our oldest daughter either because she reminds them too much of me. I will be glad to be rid of these people. Too bad my kids will still have to deal with them.


----------



## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Great! So tell them. Today.


----------



## berries (Nov 4, 2013)

I stopped the marriage counseling. It was throwing good money after bad at this point. I know where I stand, I can't get past it this time. He had too many chances to break it off but didn't. And 2 EAs and the only reason they stopped was because I broke up with his girlfriends for him. What kind of man cheats and then makes his wife break up with his affair partners?

I'll tell you what kind. The kind I do NOT want to be married to. I'm giving my kids one last Christmas as a family. But when the New Year starts, I'll be taking out the old trash. He knows he has to be out the first of the year.


----------



## berries (Nov 4, 2013)

Looks like to time to move on to the next forum. He is moving out next weekend.


----------



## cdbaker (Nov 5, 2010)

I'm sorry to hear you are going through this. It's no fun thats for sure.

How has he responded to everything since your last update regarding him? (around 12/4 it looks like?)


----------



## berries (Nov 4, 2013)

He stopped his individual therapy. He is still trying to blame me for the affair and shows no remorse. Says he doesn't want to see the emails they exchanged again, so he is trying to set the terms.

He will start to say the right thing but he can't maintain it for 24 hours. His actions show no remorse and he keeps trying to talk his way out of this even though I have told him that there is literally NOTHING he can say that will change anything.


----------



## cdbaker (Nov 5, 2010)

That's awful that he'll try to blame you for the affair and is without remorse...

...I'll say the following, but I don't want you to feel like I am defending him or saying that he isn't doing anything wrong or that you should forgive him or anything like that. Just wanting to add something to help offer a different perspective.

Back when my wife had her affair, there were a lot of things I saw her struggle with in the time after D-Day. Obviously, you (and I in my situation) went through a tremendous amount of pain that you still suffer from today. For the offending spouse however, it's pretty awful for them too. First they go from the wonderful little high's they experience with the other person, to that being gone in a flash (assuming nc), the guilt and shame of the world descending upon them, and finding themselves stuck in a deep relational pit that they have to dig themselves out of all by themselves. It's their own fault of course, but it still sucks nonetheless.

For my wife, she could acknowledge all the right things that she needed to acknowledge. The affair was her choice, her fault. The affair was selfish and wrong. The affair represents the ultimate betrayal of trust in the marriage. The betrayal means she'll have to work very hard to rebuild that trust. She could acknowledge and accept all of those things. Then eventually she would want to point out that I shared some of the responsibility. She wasn't exactly wrong, there is no such thing as a perfect spouse so certainly there are things that I did in the marriage that helped lead her to stray or at least be vulnerable to another. But she experienced enormous frustration that before the affair it was probably felt that we were each 50/50 responsible for our marital problems, but after the affair it suddenly felt like she was 100% at fault for everything. I could certainly see your husband feeling that way, because it all makes sense, and depending on how he shares that I could certainly see it coming across as partially blaming you.

As for saying/doing the right things for only a short while before failing, I remember a bit of that with her as well. One day she would feel resolute to say and do all the right things, accepting her responsibility and seemingly determined to make it all right. Then the next day the burden of the guilt/shame would just be too much for her, she'd be depressed, frustrated that she is in that situation and feels like at least part of it was my fault, and would lash out from time to time in anger/hurt.

I don't really remember her trying to talk her way out of it. I think that's probably more of a guy thing. I think women are more understanding that hurt feelings take a while to heal and that words and promises, whether they prove true or not, can't speed up that healing process, so she probably didn't really try.

So yeah I'd say it's probably still time to look at a separation and maybe see how he reacts.


----------



## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Actions are the only things that count.


----------



## berries (Nov 4, 2013)

He left tonight. We are officially separated.


----------

