# What to do?



## LoveHope (Jan 4, 2013)

I found this site through a friend and she even offered to help me get set up to post my dilemma on here. This seems like such a great hub of information. 

I have been married to my wife for less than two years, dated three altogether. I am 26 and she is 28.

A little bit about my wife and why I fell for her so quickly. She is (was?) a fiercely loyal person when it comes to those close to her. She is generous, giving, successful, outgoing, extremely witty and intelligent...she has a certain magnetism to her that is very difficult to articulate. She is the perfect balance of an independent successful modern day woman and a nurturing traditional old school woman..if that makes any sense. She will work a very mentally demanding job, make great money, but then come home and make sure dinner is ready and the house is clean. She insists on doing these things. In addition to this, she is very exotic and very beautiful. She constantly gets attention from men, and I was quite proud of how effortlessly she turns down any attempt at anyone flirting with her. Actually, the only reason I was hesitant in proposing to her is because I felt she was just too beautiful (i know it sounds stupid), and it would be a constant competition.

Recently, I noticed she got a bit salty with me when she proposed the idea of volunteering together a few saturdays a month. I told her I wasn’t interested, and she expressed how disappointed she was in me. She is involved in the community and meets a lot of people, she organizes and hosts charity events, and I am always in awe at how easily people are drawn to her -- both men and women.

For the last two weeks, she’s been in somewhat of a haze. The sex had not decreased and dinners were still made, nothing too out of ordinary. She would stay up while I went to bed. I chalked it up to stress. Her phone was not off limits, no clear signs of anything nefarious. We were sitting in bed and I noticed her chatting on facebook with a male name I didn’t recognize. I asked who it was and she seemed irked and snappy and said “so and so from such and such”. Since she meets so many people I didn’t worry. But then I started to develop a nagging feeling.

The nagging feeling prevailed... I came home early and logged in to her facebook. There were 100s of messages exchanged between the two. He is someone she met at such and such. She told him our marriage has an “expiration date”. He told her how highly he thought of her. They got along well and had a lot in common..they had met twice, made some inside jokes about the encounters, but they were not physical. I know this because they got on the topic of sex. She sent him a sexy picture of her in a Halloween costume, he responded with him in boxers..he is obviously an attractive guy. He is well spoken and attractive and into same things she is passionate about. They talked about the exchanging of nude pictures and she said she wouldn’t do that while in a relationship and unless in a relationship. He said he respected that. BUT. She said he can feel free to send his. Which he did, and let’s just say this didn’t help my diminishing self esteem. She complimented him and told him he had a lot to be proud of ...in that department. They spoke about quality over quantity and she said she doesn’t sleep around, even when she was single.


This all started after I repeatedly ignored her trying to communicate to me that she wanted us to do a small weekend get away, reignite some of our intimacy... now that I look back on her attempts, I realize I have taken her for granted big time.

I am so confused. What the hell is she doing?! What do I do? I don’t want to lose her, but feel like I may already have. Please offer insight.


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## The-Deceived (Jan 8, 2013)

She's in the beginnings of an emotional affair, at the very least.

The suggestive pictures, frequency of their communication, and her comment about the "expiration date" are HUGE red flags my friend. She will end up in bed with this guy.

You may feel you took her for granted, but her communications with this douche-canoe are highly inappropriate and are a sign of things to come. She has disrespected you and crossed a serious boundary line.

I think you have 2 courses of action.

1. Keep quiet and start spying. Keylogger, VAR in the car, etc. Gather evidence and wait for her to take it to the next level

2. Bust her azz NOW, call her out on the utter inappropriateness of her actions and stop this before it goes physical (if it hasn't already).

If you are going to confront, you need to have this evidence you've already acquired on hand to show her so she can't deny, which she will. 

Good luck.


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## The-Deceived (Jan 8, 2013)

PS

Sorry you're here.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

You need this book

Dr. Shirley Glass - NOT "Just Friends"

Your wife is having an emotional affair and it sounds like it's well on its way to a physical affair. There's a CWI newbie link in my signature that would be a good idea for you to read too.

My advice would be to start gathering evidence and see how far it's gone - you've already been doing this, but do a bit more till you're satisfied you know everything. Then, decide what you want to do and what you need from her. Finally, confront her calmly, tell her what you know, and tell her what must happen for you to remain with her.

If you decide to stay together I recommend MC and these books

Love Busters, His Needs Her Needs and the companion workbook 5 Steps to Romantic Love


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## Rags (Aug 2, 2010)

I think in this situation, where you seem to have caught the EA in a (fairly) early stage, it's probably not too late to kill it.

As I understand it, killing requires exposure - part of the attraction is the secrecy - take that away, and it loses much of its appeal.
You'll also need to admit that you've been neglecting her, and that it will stop - BUT
You must also make it absolutely clear, blinding clear, that you WILL NOT TOLERATE infidelity - and if she thinks your marriage is temporary, or a 'plan B' then you will kick her out of the door so hard she bounces, twice.

Be a sensitive man, but be a man!

If she's not willing to give you 100%, to the exclusion of all others, she's not worth it, and you deserve better - and she needs to know that.
It's most likely the thing that will make her want you over him.
And if it doesn't, you're well shot of her.

Then make sure you're the best man & husband material you can be.


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## just got it 55 (Mar 2, 2013)

Just Say "experation date " if she says what ? then say this milk has a experation date.Its a good thing a marriage doesn't have one of those


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## carolinadreams (Nov 30, 2012)

LoveHope said:


> This all started after I repeatedly ignored her trying to communicate to me that she wanted us to do a small weekend get away, reignite some of our intimacy... now that I look back on her attempts, I realize I have taken her for granted big time.
> 
> I am so confused. What the hell is she doing?! What do I do? I don’t want to lose her, but feel like I may already have. Please offer insight.


You save a copy of all the Facebook message and confront. 

Your actions may or not be reason for her to terminate your marriage, there is never a justification for infidelity. 

Improving your marriage and infidelity are two separate items, decouple them immediately in your mind.

You need to lay down the law and stop the contact between your wife and this man and or other men. Does this other man have a girl friend or wife? You should be able to see his information there on facebook.

Do you have assets to protect in the event of Divorce, are you in a fault or no fault state?

Exposure to your wife's family and definitely the other man's family may shut this thing down quickly.


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## The-Deceived (Jan 8, 2013)

just got it 55 said:


> Just Say "experation date " if she says what ? then say this milk has a experation date.Its a good thing a marriage doesn't have one of those


Awesomesauce.


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## LoveHope (Jan 4, 2013)

So much great information here, thank you all. I want to confront her more than anything, but she is clever and I know without something very solid it will lead to a lot of "gaslighting" (is it?) and rug sweeping. So far, it's like she's enjoying toying with him... she is hot and cold and it seems from the conversation she is loving the ego trip. 
They have met on two separate occasions and both seemed like food and drinks during the day. Nothing physical because based on the picture she sent he said something to the effect of how he'd worship every inch of her amazing body. She then said "I think things are getting a little out of hand.." Is she crazy? We are in a no fault state.


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## LetDownNTX (Oct 4, 2012)

I think you are very lucky in that you caught it early (hopefully) and can put it to an end, if you wish.

The whole thing is still disturbing but atleast it hasnt escalated to more.

What do you plan on doing next?


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## carolinadreams (Nov 30, 2012)

LoveHope said:


> So much great information here, thank you all. I want to confront her more than anything, but she is clever and I know without something very solid it will lead to a lot of "gaslighting" (is it?) and rug sweeping. So far, it's like she's enjoying toying with him... she is hot and cold and it seems from the conversation she is loving the ego trip.
> They have met on two separate occasions and both seemed like food and drinks during the day. Nothing physical because based on the picture she sent he said something to the effect of how he'd worship every inch of her amazing body. She then said "I think things are getting a little out of hand.." Is she crazy? We are in a no fault state.


Print out a photo of his pecker and Photoshop Merry Christmas 2013 Mr. and Mrs. Love Hope, hand it to her and tell her you've picked out the Christmas Card already for this year. 

There's only going to be gaslighting and rugsweeping if you allow it.

Were you able to find out if the other man, has a wife or girlfriend? Embarrassment and forcing the OM (other man) into covering his ass and scrambling is often a good tactic have him dump her like a week old diaper.


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## carolinadreams (Nov 30, 2012)

If she reacts poorly to a confrontation do you have cash on hand to cover your living expenses? It may be worth it to go take out cash or transfer it to your sole account prior to.


You may want to have a voice recorder on you, or at least start your cellphone. A friend of mine was popped with a domestic abuse charge after his wife, roughed him up (that's insult to injury), so it's nice to have a recording of what may be a volatile moment.

During confrontation, the guilty party often denies and deflects. The point of the confrontation is to deal with the infidelity, (your wife is cheating with this other man even if it hasn't progressed to something physical yet), not deal with what ever other myriad problems you may have. Be adamant about staying on target, and not letting her deflect.

Mrs. LOveHope to stay in this marriage, you have to cut all contact with this man immediately. People suggest a no-contact letter I called the OM with my wife sitting beside me and said it was done, never contact him again and she affirmed it - which ever way floats your boat.

Talking about the other issues after she is in individual counseling and you have made the decision to reconcile or not.


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## skip76 (Aug 30, 2011)

I don't understand how this is not enough to confront. She said your marriage will expire and asked for pictures of another guys junk. She then mentioned how she liked said junk. 
Bust her ass. Hopefully she will feel ashamed you even had to read that if not well....
Then you have to be willing to leave.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

She's definitely in an EA which I seriously doubt has effectively reached PA status. I would do just enough reconnosance to "indict" her on her actions. That could mean with what info you are already in possession of, or you could gather a little more. To that end, it's your call largely contingent upon how repentant she is for her actions! Best of luck!


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## LoveHope (Jan 4, 2013)

My mind keeps racing. One minute I am sure of how I'll handle it, the next I feel like that's the worst idea possible. I have taken the rest of the day off work to consider my options and snoop further. I noticed that last two weeks she has been going through a bottle of whiskey every two days or so, judging by how many empty bottles are in the recycle bin. She is also prescribed Xanax and takes it regularly. She has not slept with this guy or had physical contact beyond a hug, I am almost positive. She's going through some crisis it seems. It would explain the way she comes off in their conversations....one minute she is receptive to their flirting, the next she is chastising him.

He is single, a business owner...no wife or girlfriend to expose to.

Finding the empty whiskey bottles has changed my mind about confronting her directly today.


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## TRy (Sep 14, 2011)

LoveHope said:


> So much great information here, thank you all. I want to confront her more than anything, but she is clever and I know without something very solid it will lead to a lot of "gaslighting" (is it?) and rug sweeping. So far, it's like she's enjoying toying with him... she is hot and cold and it seems from the conversation she is loving the ego trip.
> They have met on two separate occasions and both seemed like food and drinks during the day. Nothing physical because based on the picture she sent he said something to the effect of how he'd worship every inch of her amazing body. She then said "I think things are getting a little out of hand.."


 What do you mean that you do not want to confront until you have something solid? Dude you already do have something solid. She told the other man (OM) that your marraige has an expiration date, meaning that she will soon be available to him. She encouraged him to send her nude pictures of him, and then complement him on the size of his d*ck. They sexually flirt so heavily that even she told the OM that "I think things are getting a little out of hand..". That is cheating dude and you have it in hard copy. 

Make a copy of this stuff, print it out and store the copy in a sage place. Then confront her right now before it gets worse. Every day your positions gets worse and the OM's gets stronger. Do not accept blame for her cheating. You are both 50%-50% responsible for the issues in your marriage but she is 100% responsible for her cheating. Cheating never fixes a marraige. Tell her she must drop all contact with this other man and drop the organization that she sees him at. Tell her that in addition to full no contact (NC) with the other man, she must agree to full transparency without complaint which includes all passwords. Do not give her time to decide. Be willing to immediately file for divorce and mean it. She may try to call your bluff so be willing to follow through. You can always stop the divorce if she gives you good reason to.

You must be willing to end the marraige if she is cheating in order to have a chance at saving it and having a marraige where she will not cheat. There is no way to nice your way out of this. It may already be too late and she may pick the OM, but the odds only get worse with every day that passes.
Tell her that she must pick you and the marriage or the OM. Tell her that the only correct answer is for her to say yes that she is picking you; that any other answer, or giving you no answer is her not picking you, and that you will file immediately.


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## LoveHope (Jan 4, 2013)

She got home this evening and looks...sad. I almost feel bad for her. She is at the gym, and I have the facebook chat printed and will leave it on bathroom sink so that she can see it when she goes to shower.


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## LoveHope (Jan 4, 2013)

There seems to be a delay in getting my posts approved.
Last night, I was ready to confront but backed out last minute. I wanted to think about it a bit more. But I secretly was hoping she wouldn't contact him, or she would call off whatever they have going on.
Sure enough, at 11pm like clock work she's grabbing her laptop, phone, ipad and going to do "some work" so that she can fall asleep. She wasn't in bed until almost 4am, yet she had to be at work at 7am... this is nuts. Once she left I checked the chat and sure enough, time stamped from a little after 11 pm until after 3am.

The conversations weren't racy. They joked about some video they both saw, discussed their love for pretentious foreign films, had one of the "deep" existentialism conversations, and talked about their hobbies. When she mentioned going to sleep, he expressed he wished he could cuddle with her. That was the only inappropriate comment as far as the conversation went. 

So now I feel if I bring up the convo where he sent her his junk, she can cover it with this seemingly innocent one and claim she told him to back off?? I don't know. I think I messed up!


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## just got it 55 (Mar 2, 2013)

LoveHope said:


> She got home this evening and looks...sad. I almost feel bad for her. She is at the gym, and I have the facebook chat printed and will leave it on bathroom sink so that she can see it when she goes to shower.


OK LH You know what to do. Stop this right Now.Make sure she is sober when you confront. Get the conversation on record.Be cool write a script of questions or statements. Stay focused on the EA/ PA whichever it is.I think you should give her 1 last chance to come clean. It will make for a better R if that is what you want. 

Do not take a stand you are not willing to follow through on.My way of thinking would be 
Say

Here is your 1 and only chance 

If she does not come clean Tell her to leave now

(Then show her the printout)

Tell me everything now

You will stop this EA / PA NOW

No Contact

You will call him right Now And I will tell him it is over then she must tell him the same

Then set some ground rules for moving forward

No Social Media

No Smart Phone

I bit of hesitation is all she will need to get over on you Do not allow this to happen


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## badmemory (Jul 31, 2012)

LoveHope,

From reading your information, my sense it that your wife is looking for an exit affair. I wasn't surprised to find out this guy is single, later in your posts.

She may be holding back on him for now, wanting her to romance her some more, so she can better judge his stock as a future husband. 

I don't mean to upset you any more, but that's just the way I see it.

After you confront, and assuming you decide to R, make sure she sends him a no contact letter, that she becomes completely transparent and that she demonstrates remorse. Continue to monitor her covertly for the short term.

Then get in to MC and work on your (mainly hers) issues. 

I'm wishing you the best.


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## CEL (May 7, 2013)

Okay I am going to take this in two parts please be aware I am not blaming you for her behavior but I can see why she is unhappy.

For You
1: Talk to you wife when she is sad. Simple right be engaged in her life which is your life. Ask her about her day.

2: Share hobbies do you do anything together anymore? If you say tv then no you don't do anything together. Go work out with her get in better shape, Date Night every week, try that volunteer thing. You are not part of her life and that is on you, you need to be with her and share a life together not just a household.

3: Compliment her sounds like she is terrific do you every tell her the things that you said in your first post.

Her
1: What she is doing is wrong no way around it. No Contact order and defriend him.

2: She needs to come to you and tell you that she no longer feels connected to you. You are her Husband and you love her you are and will be there for her.

You both got work but the point is you are living separate lives you need to get back to sharing ONE life.


Good luck and keep posting you will need the support.


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## LoveHope (Jan 4, 2013)

She sat me down and confessed everything tonight. Said we both would be happiest with a divorce and that we are not on the same page in life, nor are we getting there. She was remorseful about engaging in the EA, but stated she made sure it never crossed into a PA until she spoke with me. She told me we are not the kids we were back then. She thanked me for everything I've done for her and we held each other. I thanked her for all she selflessly gave me, and kept on giving until the last month. She is letting me keep the house, but asked that I let her slowly transition out of it while she finds a new place and gets settled in. This was long time coming, but my heart is ripped to shreds. She stated that the only thing this EA did was open her eyes to what needs to be done. 

I think back to all of the times we took care of each other when one of us was sick, or the trips we took, or how happy we once were...and my heart rips to shreds.


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## Machiavelli (Feb 25, 2012)

How did the confrontation go?


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## BjornFree (Aug 16, 2012)

> He is someone she met at such and such. She told him our marriage has an “expiration date”.


What you need to do, IMO, is to get rid of her before the expiry date.

Listen carefully. You are 26 years old. No kids. Your wife who's 28 is already disconnected from the marriage. Perish any thoughts of the marriage going all the way till death do you part. Divorce her while you have no excess bagage. Date around for a couple of years and don't marry before you hit thirty and are really ready to settle down. My best wishes to you.


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## megmg (Sep 30, 2012)

Stop.............thinking about what to do and act, your wife's cry for help and change is apparent.. Book a holiday for the 2 of you or the very least a weekend way, do not take no for an answer... Show her what she saw in you the first place, give her the attention she requires at this moment in time, do not let another give them that attention, CHANGE what you are doing NOW


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## distraughtfromtexas (Apr 25, 2013)

Hope you're doing okay, LH.


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## just got it 55 (Mar 2, 2013)

Machiavelli said:


> How did the confrontation go?


I think the Sh!t hit the fan


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## LRgirl (Apr 9, 2013)

LoveHope said:


> She sat me down and confessed everything tonight. Said we both would be happiest with a divorce and that we are not on the same page in life, nor are we getting there. She was remorseful about engaging in the EA, but stated she made sure it never crossed into a PA until she spoke with me. She told me we are not the kids we were back then. She thanked me for everything I've done for her and we held each other. I thanked her for all she selflessly gave me, and kept on giving until the last month. She is letting me keep the house, but asked that I let her slowly transition out of it while she finds a new place and gets settled in. This was long time coming, but my heart is ripped to shreds. She stated that the only thing this EA did was open her eyes to what needs to be done.
> 
> I think back to all of the times we took care of each other when one of us was sick, or the trips we took, or how happy we once were...and my heart rips to shreds.



LH, did you get to confront her, or did she confess of her own accord?

You know, maybe like Megmg said, it could be one hell of a cry for help....she didn't move into PA with this OM...that's something?

I wouldn't know which way to go though when the WS says it's over before you get the opportunity to make a move on what _you_ want in order to stay in the relationship. Hard!

What are LH choices people of TAM? He needs help and clear perspective to point him in the right direction........

If you have been happily married mostly, maybe lost site of one another lately, maybe taken one another for granted recently.....there is hope in my opinion....How happy did you believe you were? Can you win her back...do you want to win her back? If you want to save your marriage then fight for it!

Please be safe and let us know how you are.


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## CEL (May 7, 2013)

LoveHope I have some questions for you. Do you love her? I she your one and only? Are you willing to fight for her? There are things you can try but until you honestly answer these questions no one here can help you. If you decide to move forward and try to win her then it is hard work with a lot of pain involved and no guarantees. But that is your decision to make. Let us know.


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## carolinadreams (Nov 30, 2012)

That sounds like nonsense.

The week I found out my wife was having an EA long distance and had just started a PA, I confronted her that monday night with the way she was acting and treating me - and she dropped the I love you but I'm not in love with you bomb on me.

It's very likely this man or maybe even other people are in your wife's head and you are getting alienation of affection.

If you think you want to save your marriage drop that nice guy crap right now.

If you are over her and her shallowness then it doesn't matter.

If you want to save it then tell her you expect a month of no contact with this guy or any other, and marriage counseling first, or that you will file an alienation of affection lawsuit and name this guy in the divorce papers.

Your course of action hinges on what you really want, and what you want to do to get there.

There's billions of woman in the world though and I'd bet you could find someone that's going to love you without cheating and then rationalizing it to you afterwards.


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## LRgirl (Apr 9, 2013)

carolinadreams said:


> That sounds like nonsense.
> 
> The week I found out my wife was having an EA long distance and had just started a PA, I confronted her that monday night with the way she was acting and treating me - and she dropped the I love you but I'm not in love with you bomb on me.
> 
> ...



You are correct, there are billions of women in the world, and billions of men also....but when you love A man, or A woman the other billions don't exist.

I could get slated for this opinion, and of course I do not mean D for everyone is the wrong choice, but IMO, walking away from the WS without attempting R is wrong.

OK, there are situations for sure where all the will in the world is not going to change some very dysfunctional cheaters....but the majority cheat because they have loose boundaries, lose sight of their spouse and relationship....these things with hard work can be made better....providing WS wants to stay.

If A BS D immediately or WS walks immediately, like an exit affair....who's learning what? Another relationship with another person can just end up the same. Nobody has worked through anything! And, to boot, you are more likely to end up bitter and twisted and still have trust issues (BS) and boundary issues (WS)

If a marriage can be worked on, if there are still some foundations in place.....surely R is the way to go. 

It is almost always down to both partners in the relationship that things start to 'go bad' and it creeps up on you, and sometimes, like in my case it is only in hindsight you realise you weren't the happiest married woman / man alive (which i thought I was! ) 

The WS made the worse choice ever........but we all have to take some responsibility for the issues that lead to the betrayal.

I hope this makes sense.

UPSHOT......it is always worth trying to make the marriage work again, many do and they are happier for it.


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## LoveHope (Jan 4, 2013)

I had written a response, but it never showed up. She confessed. I don't want to write a novel if it won't get approved again


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## LoveHope (Jan 4, 2013)

She sat me down and confessed everything tonight. Said we both would be happiest with a divorce and that we are not on the same page in life, nor are we getting there. She was remorseful about engaging in the EA, but stated she made sure it never crossed into a PA until she spoke with me. She told me we are not the kids we were back then. She thanked me for everything I've done for her and we held each other. I thanked her for all she selflessly gave me, and kept on giving until the last month. She is letting me keep the house, but asked that I let her slowly transition out of it while she finds a new place and gets settled in. This was long time coming, but my heart is ripped to shreds. She stated that the only thing this EA did was open her eyes to what needs to be done. 

I think back to all of the times we took care of each other when one of us was sick, or the trips we took, or how happy we once were...and my heart rips to shreds.

This happened on 5/11


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## Mr Blunt (Jul 18, 2012)

You have been hit very hard!

With the circumstances that you wrote I see only one approach for you now.

Start building your self up and get all the help you can!

Get real busy working on you. *Get lots of help and force yourself to not let the ripped up heart dominate you.*

*Millions of men have recovered and so can you.*


You will think that your life is almost destroyed but that is not true. You may believe that now but *if you build yourself up you will see that you can recover and have a good life.*


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## jnj express (Mar 28, 2011)

You may not have a choice in this anymore-----

Your wife seems to want to move on w/out you----You can't force her to do what you want her to do

If you think there is any love there, for sure do NOT grovel/beg/be mr nice guy----SHE WILL JUST LOSE MORE RESPECT FOR YOU----IF YOU WANNA FIGHT THIS THRU----START A GOOD 180, AND SHOW HER WHAT SHE WILL BE LOSING

In the end if she wants out---if the expiration date has arrived---then quietly move on---and learn from this mge----whatever you think you did wrong in the mge---make sure it is not repeated with anyone else

Also know this----there were marital problems, and you had a partial responsibility for them---but you have NO RESPONSIBILITY FOR HER EA


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

Lots of EAs have been ended through exposure and through demanding no contact with the OM.

You can basically just accept that you've been betrayed and roll over and take it,or, you can stand up for yourself and not simply smile and accept it.

The fact is that you wife engaged in a long term series of choices to betray you to get to where she is right now. He feelings for you didn't just shut off instantly nor did her feelings for the OM suddenly appear.

She's spend a tremendous amount of relationship building time with him, time that was stolen away from your relationship.

So her speech about being honorable is total lies. Ok, she didn't have sex with him, but she did engage in extensive courtship and relationship building. Basically she's been dating him.


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