# So why does she have to say that?



## discouraged1 (Mar 16, 2010)

So... my wife at each and everytime she is getting ready to perform oral on me (which is only 3-4 times per year) says "is this gonna be quick?".
I understand why she says it:
Jaw hurts, doesn't like to do it, has a headache, fill in the blank of excuses... right.
I just want to know that if you are not doing it for your partners pleasure than why do it at all? If you have to preface the deed with a timeline it pretty much kills the mood... and at least for me is really kind of aggravating.
Looking for feedback ladies on how I can position this with her and get my point across without offending her.


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## woodstock (Feb 21, 2011)

She just wants you to realize what a gift it is and to show appreciation. Just picking a bad way to express that


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## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

It's a way of "giving" to you without truly "giving", a way to play the role of partner while actually remaining boss. She wants you to understand that even though she is on her knees, she's still in charge. The price to you for receiving oral from her is that you must be informed that she is doing it against her will and you owe her.


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## Whatshisname (Jan 12, 2011)

Sounds like she doesn't really like doing it and not only want's you to know this but also wants to punish you by ruining it somewhat for you.


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## michzz (Jun 6, 2008)

It's the same kind of thing that my wife does that is also a mood killer.

If I take a shower before bed and on those rare times she's even in the mood she says something like "are you clean?"

Total turn off, because it's got that hostile quality to it.

She's flirting but also telling me a passively aggressive message at the same time.

I've called her on it and even told her I don't like it. But she does it anyway. 

And i definitely do not respond with any interest.

I think that in her twisted mind she thinks that her less than once a month weird expression of interest is something I ought to be grateful for.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

michzz said:


> It's the same kind of thing that my wife does that is also a mood killer.
> 
> If I take a shower before bed and on those rare times she's even in the mood she says something like "are you clean?"
> 
> ...


In your case, you shouldn't. You should be forming and exit plan like yesterday. 

As to the OP, her saying that is exactly as Michzz stated. Next time she says that seriously look her in the eye and tell her "Don't do me any favors" and get out of bed and go do something else. She will get the message loud and clear. Not only is 4 times a year ridiculous but she is prefacing these "favors" like she has a stop clock in her head and then has the audacity to voice this to you. She is selfish AND lazy.


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## michzz (Jun 6, 2008)

Brennan said:


> In your case, you shouldn't. You should be forming and exit plan like yesterday.
> 
> As to the OP, her saying that is exactly as Michzz stated. Next time she says that seriously look her in the eye and tell her "Don't do me any favors" and get out of bed and go do something else. She will get the message loud and clear. Not only is 4 times a year ridiculous but she is prefacing these "favors" like she has a stop clock in her head and then has the audacity to voice this to you. She is selfish AND lazy.


I am, and that is the correct move--out of the bed.


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

michzz said:


> I am, and that is the correct move--out of the bed.


I know you are.  and yes it is the correct move.
Seriously, I cannot believe how selfish this wife is. 4 times a year and she acts like it is some gift she is "giving" him and then tells him in essence make it quick I have more important things to do. Wow. 
As for offending her? Well, why is that your concern really? Isn't her behavior pretty offensive to YOU? She needs to have the point hammered home to her that her actions are really offensive and you won't tolerate it anymore. 
I would also strongly suggest that you check out the Men's Forum. Yeah, lot's of testosterone in there but lots of fantastic insight and help.


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## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

You might just tell her, "I'm sorry my needs are bothersome to you. I won't trouble you with them." Get out of bed and drive on as if nothing has happened. Dress extra nice for work and start coming home late and act happy when you're home. Start acting like sex with her rarely crosses your mind.


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## bluesky (Jan 29, 2011)

unbelievable said:


> It's a way of "giving" to you without truly "giving", a way to play the role of partner while actually remaining boss. She wants you to understand that even though she is on her knees, she's still in charge. The price to you for receiving oral from her is that you must be informed that she is doing it against her will and you owe her.


:iagree::iagree::iagree::iagree::iagree::iagree::iagree:


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## bluesky (Jan 29, 2011)

michzz said:


> It's the same kind of thing that my wife does that is also a mood killer.
> 
> If I take a shower before bed and on those rare times she's even in the mood she says something like "are you clean?"
> 
> ...




Perhaps I am passive aggressive, but i would ejaculate in her mouth for that.


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## bluesky (Jan 29, 2011)

discouraged1 said:


> So... my wife at each and everytime she is getting ready to perform oral on me (which is only 3-4 times per year) says "is this gonna be quick?".
> I understand why she says it:
> Jaw hurts, doesn't like to do it, has a headache, fill in the blank of excuses... right.
> I just want to know that if you are not doing it for your partners pleasure than why do it at all? If you have to preface the deed with a timeline it pretty much kills the mood... and at least for me is really kind of aggravating.
> Looking for feedback ladies on how I can position this with her and get my point across without offending her.



You can't.
You are past that point.


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

unbelievable said:


> You might just tell her, "I'm sorry my needs are bothersome to you. I won't trouble you with them." Get out of bed and drive on as if nothing has happened. Dress extra nice for work and start coming home late and act happy when you're home. Start acting like sex with her rarely crosses your mind.


Your approach is a million times better than mine. I totally agree.


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## Scannerguard (Jan 26, 2010)

The next time she's talking about something I'd pose the same question to her.

A ride in the car is a perfect time.


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

bluesky said:


> Perhaps I am passive aggressive, but i would ejaculate in her mouth for that.


You don't even know half of what she has done. If you did, you would have added about 45 more angry faces to your post.


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## Mrs. In Love..But (Jan 11, 2011)

bluesky said:


> Perhaps I am passive aggressive, but i would ejaculate in her mouth for that.


That is funny!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## discouraged1 (Mar 16, 2010)

bluesky said:


> Perhaps I am passive aggressive, but i would ejaculate in her mouth for that.


If I do that I may not get any oral action for a few years.... although I have thought about it many times.


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## bluesky (Jan 29, 2011)

discouraged1 said:


> If I do that I may not get any oral action for a few years.... although I have thought about it many times.


Sorry dude...this just seems unfair.


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## Catherine602 (Oct 14, 2010)

Judging by your post "only 4 -5 times a year" you seem dissatisfied with what she does give. Let's see, that about once every 3 months, that more than many men get. If she has jaw pain and does it anyway, do you think that you could feel a little grateful that she gives you an orgasm with no expectation of getting one herself and having jaw pain afterwards to boot. Saying it's an excuse does not seem to have a place in a loving relationship..

Maybe a little commiseration, have a nice warm hot towel for her and wrap her have lovingly and hold her instead of pouting and grumbling like a small child. If you did that held her and kissed her like you were just a little appreciative she may surprise you by a change in her attitude. Of course if you think she owes you more bj i can see why you would be sour. But since your attitude gets you nowhere, why not change up. Do you say it's an excuse because you want your pleasure and can not face the notion that she may have to hurt to give to you? Have you any proof she is faking? 

Why not assume she does get jaw pain unless you are absolutely sure she does not. Better than calling her a the woman that you want to maintain a loving relationship with a lier. Kills the mood in so intimate encounter. I think if I said my jaw hurt and my partner got an attitude, I would feel that they cared more for the pleasure they got from my mouth and not so much about me. I would feel used. You can counter this by the warm towel act as if you care. Better yet, get a dildo about your size and give it a bj so that you see what it is like. Maybe you will be more sympathetic. 

Why does she have to say that? I think her attitude matches yours - she is an ungraceful giver to an ungraceful receiver. So now you understand each other. A change in your attitude may help her to give to you more and more enthusiastically. The worse thing is to give to someone who shows a sense of entitlement and dissatisfaction.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## michzz (Jun 6, 2008)

Catherine602 said:


> Why does she have to say that? I think her attitude matches yours - she is an ungraceful giver to an ungraceful receiver. So now you understand each other. A change in your attitude may help her to give to you more and more enthusiastically. The worse thing is to give to someone who shows a sense of entitlement and dissatisfaction.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


A begrudging gift is no gift at all.


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## Catherine602 (Oct 14, 2010)

Wish I had not read this too late. please say no more about the ejaculating in her mouth for revenge. It ugly and common, of course there is the usual comic chorus egging you on. Don't do it examine your thought while you are at it. What are you thinking - no matter how you feel to use you cum in her mouth say a lot about what you think of her, about cumming in her mouth and the whole act of the bj. Is your cum a weapon then, spraying it in her mouth will show her what, that you are in control, that you degrade her with your junk, that you don't respect her. 

How in the would do you get any pleasure out of a bj with your hostile feelings towards your partner. I want to understand. If she knew that you were so angry that you regarded her as a mouth disconnected from a person with feelings what do you think she would feel. I can't see how you can otherwise accept a bj from her if you dislike her so much. It it that separation thing men do when it comes to sex? Maybe women are right to stop the bj in an unsatisfactory relationship if it just means the usefulness of the mouth of a per you don't like.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Catherine602 (Oct 14, 2010)

michzz said:


> A begrudging gift is no gift at all.


Did you read what I sad about the warm towel? What do you think give him some suggestion to help don't whip things up and then not give him a possible solution. No mater what her attitude is he has control of what her does and he can change the way he frames the bj and have a more enjoyable experience not an angry grudging experience. I still can't figure out how any one can get any pleasure out of it.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## TeaLeaves4 (Feb 19, 2010)

bluesky said:


> Perhaps I am passive aggressive, but i would ejaculate in her mouth for that.


And I'd leave a few teeth marks for that.

Jeez


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## TeaLeaves4 (Feb 19, 2010)

Catherine602 said:


> Wish I had not read this too late. please say no more about the ejaculating in her mouth for revenge. It ugly and common, of course there is the usual comic chorus egging you on. Don't do it examine your thought while you are at it. What are you thinking - no matter how you feel to use you cum in her mouth say a lot about what you think of her, about cumming in her mouth and the whole act of the bj. Is your cum a weapon then, spraying it in her mouth will show her what, that you are in control, that you degrade her with your junk, that you don't respect her.
> 
> How in the would do you get any pleasure out of a bj with your hostile feelings towards your partner. I want to understand. If she knew that you were so angry that you regarded her as a mouth disconnected from a person with feelings what do you think she would feel. I can't see how you can otherwise accept a bj from her if you dislike her so much. It it that separation thing men do when it comes to sex? Maybe women are right to stop the bj in an unsatisfactory relationship if it just means the usefulness of the mouth of a per you don't like.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


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## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

I think what both parties need is to place the other spouse's needs and feelings first. If they did, her joy in pleasing him would exceed her temporary jaw discomfort. He wouldn't be focused on getting a BJ but rather on giving his wife pleasure. Figuring out how to give him pleasure should be her concern.


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## Whatshisname (Jan 12, 2011)

Catherine602 said:


> Judging by your post "only 4 -5 times a year" you seem dissatisfied with what she does give. Let's see, that about once every 3 months, that more than many men get. If she has jaw pain and does it anyway, do you think that you could feel a little grateful that she gives you an orgasm with no expectation of getting one herself and having jaw pain afterwards to boot. Saying it's an excuse does not seem to have a place in a loving relationship..
> 
> Maybe a little commiseration, have a nice warm hot towel for her and wrap her have lovingly and hold her instead of pouting and grumbling like a small child. If you did that held her and kissed her like you were just a little appreciative she may surprise you by a change in her attitude. Of course if you think she owes you more bj i can see why you would be sour. But since your attitude gets you nowhere, why not change up. Do you say it's an excuse because you want your pleasure and can not face the notion that she may have to hurt to give to you? Have you any proof she is faking?
> 
> ...


Wow, just wow.


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## Draguna (Jan 13, 2011)

Catherine602 said:


> Judging by your post "only 4 -5 times a year" you seem dissatisfied with what she does give. Let's see, that about once every 3 months, that more than many men get. If she has jaw pain and does it anyway, do you think that you could feel a little grateful that she gives you an orgasm with no expectation of getting one herself and having jaw pain afterwards to boot. Saying it's an excuse does not seem to have a place in a loving relationship..
> 
> Maybe a little commiseration, have a nice warm hot towel for her and wrap her have lovingly and hold her instead of pouting and grumbling like a small child. If you did that held her and kissed her like you were just a little appreciative she may surprise you by a change in her attitude. Of course if you think she owes you more bj i can see why you would be sour. But since your attitude gets you nowhere, why not change up. Do you say it's an excuse because you want your pleasure and can not face the notion that she may have to hurt to give to you? Have you any proof she is faking?
> 
> ...


Oh Catherine, this is the first time I disagree with you. Ofcourse we only have his side of the story, but from what he said, I'd say he feels somewhat resentful and hurt by the comment his wife made. Ok, an off colour joke was made, but it was meant as a way of getting revengein his mind. You know, the same way you sometimes wish you could just punch someone in the face or wish you would just have put that person in place with a perfect comeback you thought of just now. 

That said, 4 is quite low. And I can't imagine telling any loved one that. It just says no repect. Either do it and stop because you are tired, or just don do it.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Catherine602 (Oct 14, 2010)

Draguna said:


> Oh Catherine, this is the first time I disagree with you. Ofcourse we only have his side of the story, but from what he said, I'd say he feels somewhat resentful and hurt by the comment his wife made. Ok, an off colour joke was made, but it was meant as a way of getting revengein his mind. You know, the same way you sometimes wish you could just punch someone in the face or wish you would just have put that person in place with a perfect comeback you thought of just now.
> 
> That said, 4 is quite low. And I can't imagine telling any loved one that. It just says no repect. Either do it and stop because you are tired, or just don do it.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Ok D I should have left out all of the interpretation because I thing the most important think is to change his approach. Yes what she said is a mood killer but i need to go by the attitude he displays by the information in the post and try to give him advice from my woman's point of view.

What I really want to say is that he could make his response to her complaint of jaw pain more caring. Even if he thinks the jaw pain is faking I think he should assume that it is true. Offer her comfort (hot wet towel good for relax jaw muscle) can only be a win win. 

If she has pain she will feel loved and cared for, if she is faking she will feel loved and cared for and guilty. Either way, her love bank is filled by his positive attitude instead of drained by his anger and doubt. He get a more loving attention and his love banks gets filled. 

That was the main thing that got buried in the post. I think what is happening now is frustrating and makes him unhappy and feels unloved. Granted, he has to make the difficult leap of faith and be loving to someone who is not acting loving. I really think it is worth a try.


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

Catherine,
For the first time I think you missed the point. First off Michzz never said get off in her mouth, some other person responded to his post that way. Secondly, the OP's wife is using excuse after excuse "my jaw hurts" among other things. Look, we are talking 4 times a year here not everyday. How her jaw could hurt is beyond me and her in essence of "hurry up" is selfish and lazy to say the very least.


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## Draguna (Jan 13, 2011)

Catherine602 said:


> What I really want to say is that he could make his response to her complaint of jaw pain more caring. Even if he thinks the jaw pain is faking I think he should assume that it is true. Offer her comfort (hot wet towel good for relax jaw muscle) can only be a win win.
> 
> If she has pain she will feel loved and cared for, if she is faking she will feel loved and cared for and guilty. Either way, her love bank is filled by his positive attitude instead of drained by his anger and doubt. He get a more loving attention and his love banks gets filled.


Thanks for your explanation. This is a great idea. Would like his input on it. Naturally, if he has tried being loving often just to get shot down, it's no use trying and he should change tactics to what was posted before. 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Catherine602 (Oct 14, 2010)

Brennan said:


> Catherine,
> For the first time I think you missed the point. First off Michzz never said get off in her mouth, some other person responded to his post that way. Secondly, the OP's wife is using excuse after excuse "my jaw hurts" among other things. Look, we are talking 4 times a year here not everyday. How her jaw could hurt is beyond me and her in essence of "hurry up" is selfish and lazy to say the very least.


Yes you're right - suffering the usual lazy shimming the thread. Didn't read carefully enough. I still think if he tried to control his reaction he would get a better response. What he is doing now is not working. 

What will help him to have a better happier sexual experience with his wife. He cant make her stop making excuses, why is she doing that? He can influence her attitude I think by toning down his.


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

Catherine602 said:


> Yes you're right - suffering the usual lazy shimming the thread. Didn't read carefully enough. I still think if he tried to control his reaction he would get a better response. What he is doing now is not working.
> 
> What will help him to have a better happier sexual experience with his wife. He cant make her stop making excuses, why is she doing that? He can influence her attitude I think by toning down his.


I disagree with you on this. The next time she wants to give him a bj and says "how long will this take" (as I stated before), he needs to get up from the bed and tell her "Don't bother.". She already set the tone and the mood by those words. I don't think he has an attitude at all, I think she does. I mean come on! If a man was going down on you and said "How long is this going to take" would you not be turned off???


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## Scannerguard (Jan 26, 2010)

Brennan has a point. . .when I am verbal and am making love with my partner and doing that, I am specific to say, "Please. . .can we let this last awhile." or something thereof.

It's an honest request, not one to just get her going.

Women (and men) are often self-conscious enough to know it takes awhile to reach climax during oral sex to not have that pressure on them.

I was being serious with my comeback of asking if she could be quick during the next conversation. 

Often, Conversation is to women is as sex is to men. And sex, at a basic level, IS communication. I know just raw humping and sucking wouldn't seem like it, but it is.

Hit the mute button, Just cut her off and parrot her words to her back and she'll get the point.

Now. . .honestly think about it. . .if you have been cutting her off and only giving her commercials and a mute button with the remote when she has tried to talk to you, well, then you get how she feels too.

But in a game of one upmanship, I am certain men can always out-"dote" women, at least I am pretty sure with me, I can. She's being a dote. . .show her you can be a bigger dote, while communicating with her at the same time.

Need more dote lessons and want a change up from touchy-feel-goody psychology, feel free to ask me anytime.


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## woodstock (Feb 21, 2011)

Brennan said:


> I disagree with you on this. The next time she wants to give him a bj and says "how long will this take" (as I stated before), he needs to get up from the bed and tell her "Don't bother.". She already set the tone and the mood by those words. I don't think he has an attitude at all, I think she does. I mean come on! If a man was going down on you and said "How long is this going to take" would you not be turned off???


Have yet to meet the man who will turn down a BJ, even when the tone is not set LOL It would have to be a REALLY bad tone for any man I know to say "don't bother" LOL I get that it would work, but I think that's asking alot HEHE

Oh, and if the man said it to me (depending on how good he is at it) my response would be "Well, hun, longer now that you said that so you better get at it" HAAAAAAA


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## MarriedWifeInLove (May 28, 2010)

If it was me and the shoe was on the other foot - I would take it to mean "hurry up, I don't really want to drag this out." I don't think it has anything to do with her jaw getting sore, etc.

My jaw gets sore, I get tired, especially in my situation, since my husband can't always maintain an erection and because of his issues, it can take a while, and sometimes it doesn't work at all. So I EXPECT that I'm going to get tired, jaw is going to get sore, I'm going to run out of saliva, etc., etc.

But NEVER, have I said - can you hurry this up.

It's insensitive and rude and it's her way of saying that I'm doing you a favor, please hurry it up so I don't have to spend that much time at it.

I suggest that the next time you do oral on HER, that you ask her to hurry up and see what kind of response you get!


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## AgentD (Dec 27, 2010)

It sounds like she wasn't into that, and wanted to get it over with.


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## bluesky (Jan 29, 2011)

Catherine602 said:


> Wish I had not read this too late. please say no more about the ejaculating in her mouth for revenge. It ugly and common, of course there is the usual comic chorus egging you on. Don't do it examine your thought while you are at it. What are you thinking - no matter how you feel to use you cum in her mouth say a lot about what you think of her, about cumming in her mouth and the whole act of the bj. Is your cum a weapon then, spraying it in her mouth will show her what, that you are in control, that you degrade her with your junk, that you don't respect her.
> 
> How in the would do you get any pleasure out of a bj with your hostile feelings towards your partner. I want to understand. If she knew that you were so angry that you regarded her as a mouth disconnected from a person with feelings what do you think she would feel. I can't see how you can otherwise accept a bj from her if you dislike her so much. It it that separation thing men do when it comes to sex? Maybe women are right to stop the bj in an unsatisfactory relationship if it just means the usefulness of the mouth of a per you don't like.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Are you for real????


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## HelloooNurse (Apr 12, 2010)

"I just want to know that if you are not doing it for your partners pleasure than why do it at all? If you have to preface the deed with a timeline it pretty much kills the mood... and at least for me is really kind of aggravating."


It seems she does not enjoy giving you head. So if she did as you recommend and just not do it at all, then she would be accused of ignoring your needs, being heartless, and being a horrible human being. You would then be whining on here that "my wife refuses to give me head".

So which would you prefer? Its pretty obvious she doesn't like doing it. And that is not actually so bad - different strokes for different folks. I'm sure there are plenty of other things she DOES enjoy doing. So is your cup half full or half empty?


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## CallaLily (Jan 13, 2011)

bluesky said:


> Perhaps I am passive aggressive, but i would ejaculate in her mouth for that.


I understand being upset about if a spouse was not into what they are doing and it ticking you off that they would ask that question. 

However, I think that since she isn't into it anyway, if you were to do that, then that's a sure fire way for her to not do it again period. Thats not going to make her like it more.


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

Dear me after being whacked over the head for a lifetime about the ineffable female orgasm and how it's slightly more complex than 2nd order mixed partial differential equations and how it can literally take hours to come to fruition in any of its 15,314 different variations, I've got say that comment smacks of hypocrisy. "How long will this take?" I dunno, if you do it right about 5 minutes. If you're really good at it, about 12 minutes.


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## woodstock (Feb 21, 2011)

Runs like Dog said:


> Dear me after being whacked over the head for a lifetime about the ineffable female orgasm and how it's slightly more complex than 2nd order mixed partial differential equations and how it can literally take hours to come to fruition in any of its 15,314 different variations, I've got say that comment smacks of hypocrisy. "How long will this take?" I dunno, if you do it right about 5 minutes. If you're really good at it, about 12 minutes.



meanwhile, I can do for myself (in the right circumstance) in probably under a minute  lympic1: and if a guy is actually willing to learn without feeling inadequate just because he NEEDS to learn, I can teach him to get me off in less than ten... while he gets to gain satisfaction at the same time... But sometimes guys just don't take the idea that they need to learn very well  then they just end up self conscious and worse at it!!!!


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## Catherine602 (Oct 14, 2010)

bluesky said:


> Are you for real????


Yea are you? Got a problem with what i wrote? Don't be shy, say it.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

Faster isn't always better, you know.


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## Catherine602 (Oct 14, 2010)

Brennan said:


> I disagree with you on this. The next time she wants to give him a bj and says "how long will this take" (as I stated before), he needs to get up from the bed and tell her "Don't bother.". She already set the tone and the mood by those words. I don't think he has an attitude at all, I think she does. I mean come on! If a man was going down on you and said "How long is this going to take" would you not be turned off???


I see what you are saying and I thought about it but still dont think waking away takes him in the right direction. He should do a MEM.- freeze when she says it, stare in her eyes for 5 sec, without making a move. Then, in a calm, firm and cool voice tell her that what she said was unacceptable. 

Remind her that he cares about how she feels and loves her and he would think that a simple request for a special show of love would be welcomed as are her request to him. He can ask her to tell him what the problems are so he can fix it. I think he should be very cool. Tell her he cares about her concerns and would like her to voice them before it gets to the point of hostility. 

He can only do this if he does communicate with his wife in matters other than sex outside of the bedroom so it does not seem like he is ready to take only when its about sex and he has to have been attentive to her needs or she may pull out a litany of his transgressions. 

There is still a work around if there are relationship problems - work on them and then do the MEM. :smthumbup:

Where is the OP why did he not come back.


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## Scannerguard (Jan 26, 2010)

LOL.

It reminds me of a funny Playboy cartoon I saw once. . .a skeleton is down between a woman spread eagle - his head is right there and he is looking up and the caption says:

"Are you there yet?"

LOL!

(an eternity passed)


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## michzz (Jun 6, 2008)

Getting back to the OP's point that it was a turnoff when his wife basically c0ckblocked her own husband with her comment.

Those kinds of comments are not even mercy sex being offered.

They are expressions of disdain.

This is not a lighthearted moment, or an occasional wanting to not have sex. It's about a wife who doesn't say directly that she doesn't want him, but has found a complicated way to express it while acting otherwise.

He's annoyed and wants to not play the game.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## IanIronwood (Jan 7, 2011)

Catherine602 said:


> How in the would do you get any pleasure out of a bj with your hostile feelings towards your partner. I want to understand. If she knew that you were so angry that you regarded her as a mouth disconnected from a person with feelings what do you think she would feel. I can't see how you can otherwise accept a bj from her if you dislike her so much. It it that separation thing men do when it comes to sex? Maybe women are right to stop the bj in an unsatisfactory relationship if it just means the usefulness of the mouth of a per you don't like.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


How in the world can he get any real pleasure in a BJ that so obviously begrudged?

My advice? Next time she asks that, stop, look her dead in the eye, and say "You know, it probably will. And it probably won't be that good anyway, since you obviously aren't into it. Tell you what: when you have enough respect for me to offer again without the wise-ass, shrewish comments, let me know."

And then drop the temperature about 40 degrees. 

And 3-4 times a year might be "more than most men get" -- but it's far, far less than most men deserve. When that came up in my counseling sessions, once upon a time, I had to look at my wife in shock and say, "Let me get this straight: you think I'm the best husband and father in the world. So the best husband and father in the world only deserves head ever 3-4 months? Really? You think I'm worth that little?"

Things got better after that.


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## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

I've been griping on here about my wife's low sex drive for quite some time. We've been dealing with this for eight years. Anyway, last night, we were cuddling and I made my little "moves". She asks, "do you want to get off?". This happens about once a month or so and I usually say "yes", we do our thing and it's another dry spell. This time, I just said, "no thanks, I'll wait until you're into it." 
Fast forward to this morning. My wife (who never initiates) actually initiated full blown sexual intercourse. When she came home from work this afternoon she initiated it again...


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## woodstock (Feb 21, 2011)

Ahhhh so the women doesn't want to think the guy just wants to get off... what a revelation!!! Who'd a thunk it?

When the woman says that she is saying "really, it's just about you gettin some ain't it!" for some reason you probably gave her that thought. Let her see/feel that it's more than that and WOW she wants it again LMAO Sorry, but from a woman's perspective that's a no brainer... she really said "you wanna get off?" HAAAAA LMAO that's kinda awesome LOL


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## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

I've told her a thousand times it's about the intimacy and not just sex. I actually think this has more to do with control than with sex. By asking me "do you want to get off?" She's basically putting me in a position to ask her to supply something she already knows I want. That puts her in charge and made me submissive. When I declined without appearing angry or disappointed, maybe she realized the power of granting or withholding sex was fading. If she wanted to retain a position of strength in the relationship (which she surely does), she'd have to find another way. Bingo....she turned to seduction.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

discouraged1 said:


> So... my wife at each and everytime she is getting ready to perform oral on me (which is only 3-4 times per year) says "is this gonna be quick?".
> I understand why she says it:
> Jaw hurts, doesn't like to do it, has a headache, fill in the blank of excuses... right.
> I just want to know that if you are not doing it for your partners pleasure than why do it at all? If you have to preface the deed with a timeline it pretty much kills the mood... and at least for me is really kind of aggravating.
> Looking for feedback ladies on how I can position this with her and get my point across without offending her.


 I would be very hurt if I was on the receiving end of such hurrying words. My 1st reaction might be pi**y sarcasm of some sort -not that I recommend this -this will only make her defenses go up more - that you should be happy with what you get- so don't do this!. 

If you can't bring yourself to momentarily RISE ABOVE the hurt, take it in stride, take a deep breathe, but not staying silent -- show a half laugh -a witty comment in return -just to bring a lighter mood to the "cloud" she just brought into the bedroom, plus conveying it stings somehow - giving her another chance to take it back, an opportunity to turn it around. Maybe she will even say she is sorry, then showing how she cares & wants to pleasure you. Sometimes us women just don't think when we speak. 

But if the mood is broken, you can't rise above it, the words wound too much, you NEED to share your hurt with her. This needs to be opened up & discussed (if you feel resentment will grow) - you want to do all you can to enhance your emotional connection. 

Explain as gently as you can that with her words, the way she is expressing them (maybe unknowingly) , it speaks of her "setting a timer" - something she is counting down to get "over with" -it makes you feel like a "burden". 

And that it would mean the world to you - feeling she wants to be there - to care for you and Love you in this very intimate way. To feel as though Your pleasure is something she accually cares about. I know this all sounds mushy as all get out, but isn't that what speaks to us women? 

I am assuming when you go down on her, you show love , enthusiam and surely no rush to the finish and she feels relaxed and able to pleasurably receive. This is all but what any of us want from our partners.


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## discouraged1 (Mar 16, 2010)

Catherine602 said:


> Yes you're right - suffering the usual lazy shimming the thread. Didn't read carefully enough. I still think if he tried to control his reaction he would get a better response. What he is doing now is not working.
> 
> What will help him to have a better happier sexual experience with his wife. He cant make her stop making excuses, why is she doing that? He can influence her attitude I think by toning down his.


Catherine602 As I try to catch up on this entire thread I think from the beginning your of your response you have assumed many things. Let me give you some information that may help give some color to the picture. 
I am always up for oral giving and receiving.....or basically any sex act. I love to give without exception and could care little about if she is spotless clean or any aroma. I will stay there all night if it takes it. I want nothing more than to please her and for her to enjoy it.
For her it's clean just out of the bath and no odor tolerated and many times she stalls by watching TV, doing her nails, or basically anything that delays the deed. A big build up before sh e starts.....Sometimes she avoids it by delaying till the next day even though she has told me she would do it on that day. I am not begging or bugging her regularly but if I don't press the issue she would just never do it.
She doesn't like any type of kissing unless it is a peck, no tongue, she says I get saliva on her face.
She doesn't show affection and almost never initiates any type of intimacy.
I very seldom ever say anything to her negatively and show her complete appreciation for any act...... especially bj's since they are few and far between. I basically take what I can get at this point. 
Early in our marriage I did cum in her mouth, which she hates... this was more than 10 years ago and learned this is unacceptable.
I would be more than happy to rub her feet, provide a backrub, massage, vacuum, dishes, wash clothes, munch her rug, or virtually anything else if she wants. A warm towel and holding her head are miniscule compare to what I am prepared to do.
My attitude is one of giving and very happy to receive anything. My reaction now is to not say anything that would jeopardize the little action I currently receive although it really pisses me off!
Your input is greatly appreciated as I would love to know how to bring this to her attention and improve my delicate situation.


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## discouraged1 (Mar 16, 2010)

HelloooNurse said:


> "I just want to know that if you are not doing it for your partners pleasure than why do it at all? If you have to preface the deed with a timeline it pretty much kills the mood... and at least for me is really kind of aggravating."
> 
> 
> It seems she does not enjoy giving you head. So if she did as you recommend and just not do it at all, then she would be accused of ignoring your needs, being heartless, and being a horrible human being. You would then be whining on here that "my wife refuses to give me head".
> ...


HelloooNurse - She basically does not like to do much of anything...... usually she cums when on top and does actually relatively fast. Usually within 5 minutes or so. Other than that she is virtually a prude. Doesn't like oral giving or receiving in general, never initiates, hates tongue, says she has no fantasies, proud I am the only one she has been with.


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## discouraged1 (Mar 16, 2010)

Catherine602 said:


> I see what you are saying and I thought about it but still dont think waking away takes him in the right direction. He should do a MEM.- freeze when she says it, stare in her eyes for 5 sec, without making a move. Then, in a calm, firm and cool voice tell her that what she said was unacceptable.
> 
> Remind her that he cares about how she feels and loves her and he would think that a simple request for a special show of love would be welcomed as are her request to him. He can ask her to tell him what the problems are so he can fix it. I think he should be very cool. Tell her he cares about her concerns and would like her to voice them before it gets to the point of hostility.
> 
> ...


Great advice....... I should be more attentive and communicate more outside of the bedroom. However if I do, and have in the past, I am not sure things will ultimately change.


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## Catherine602 (Oct 14, 2010)

D that's like night and day from your original post. You give too much and she takes it for granted. I think you are justified in withdrawing some of you giving to match hers and be as nice to her as she is to you. This is not tit for tat, youare reflecting her so she sees herself Read the Man Up post in the mens clubhouse. This may sound counterintuitive but when she treats badly and you try to be nicer to her it actually makes it worse. Think about it simple human nature, right now she thinks she is more valuable than you. She is sure that she can treat you any way she please and suffer no consequences. In fact instead of defending yourself you are nicer to her rewarding her bad behavior. 

We are not far removed from the having of children when we behavior badly. What do you do with a child correction and consequences. You do that for you kids and you can apply to you wife. There are many long threads by men going through the manning up process. They get guidance from other men and the transition is amazing. 

Would you be comfortable starting a thread in the Mens lounge asking for help. This may sound like your basic ques about bj is not answered but the only way this will change to having reciprocal sexual enjoyment. It sounds like she really does not want to do it. I was the same was at first with my husband. He did not get angry but more loving and appreciative of all of the advancing that I made sexually. What made me comfortable is his attitude of acceptance of me. 

You are not at this stage yet- first you have to get your wife so that she treats you as if you mattered a lot. You can do that with the manning up thing. She will want to give to you because you create the right tension. 

Sorry I got you wrong.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Catherine602 (Oct 14, 2010)

I did not see you last post, my advice is good only if ahe is behaving like a human not a grouch. You may have withdraw to get things in the wright communication mode. I am telling this from a womans point of view I would not give you a bj either and here is why. Even from this distance I van tell you are too permissive. You are not authoritative enough you are more like a guy friend that I could take or leave. In contrast my husband takes no s**t from me and I am no slouch. Just being honest.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## bluesky (Jan 29, 2011)

Would someone please offer Catherine602 a warm towel.....


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## Catherine602 (Oct 14, 2010)

bluesky said:


> Would someone please offer Catherine602 a warm towel.....


Why I use baby wipes - I can't swallow yet. It's difficult to keep towels warm for 20 mins any suggestions. But the warm towels are a good idea I'll try it. Thanks
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## discouraged1 (Mar 16, 2010)

Catherine602 said:


> Why I use baby wipes - I can't swallow yet. It's difficult to keep towels warm for 20 mins any suggestions. But the warm towels are a good idea I'll try it. Thanks
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I do have to admit that one time early in our marriage she was acting very prudish...... so once she fell asleep I spank it until I was ready and gave her a facial. I offered a towel but she was not really happy about that. Well you live and learn I guess... She got the point though.


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## Mrs.G (Nov 20, 2010)

discouraged1 said:


> So... my wife at each and everytime she is getting ready to perform oral on me (which is only 3-4 times per year) says "is this gonna be quick?".
> I understand why she says it:
> Jaw hurts, doesn't like to do it, has a headache, fill in the blank of excuses... right.
> I just want to know that if you are not doing it for your partners pleasure than why do it at all? If you have to preface the deed with a timeline it pretty much kills the mood... and at least for me is really kind of aggravating.
> Looking for feedback ladies on how I can position this with her and get my point across without offending her.


Your wife is just giving you a BJ, to make you happy. She does not enjoy it; people tend to want to finish unpleasant things fast.

Women often participate in sexual acts they don't like, just to make their men happy.

Your wife lets you know to appreciate it, since she hates giving head.


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## Catherine602 (Oct 14, 2010)

discouraged1 said:


> I do have to admit that one time early in our marriage she was acting very prudish...... so once she fell asleep I spank it until I was ready and gave her a facial. I offered a towel but she was not really happy about that. Well you live and learn I guess... She got the point though.


D why did you do that, silly fool, what were you thinking?? It was a long time ago but woman NEVER forget. No matter how angry and frustrated you get don't do sexual things to her with our her consent. 

She has made you very angry and I think you have to discuss that with her. Do you think you can talk to her about your anger as part of a general realignment of what you will and will not do going forward?.


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## Trenton (Aug 25, 2010)

Hmmmm if my husband came in my face while I was sleeping he would not be a happy man for a very, very long time.


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## notaname (Feb 4, 2011)

Yup, I'd say she got the point.

Sex is a weapon.


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## discouraged1 (Mar 16, 2010)

Catherine602 said:


> D why did you do that, silly fool, what were you thinking?? It was a long time ago but woman NEVER forget. No matter how angry and frustrated you get don't do sexual things to her with our her consent.
> 
> She has made you very angry and I think you have to discuss that with her. Do you think you can talk to her about your anger as part of a general realignment of what you will and will not do going forward?.


Well at the time she was being most difficult and withholding everything. Frustrated I gave into a little fun and revenge.
I don't know if I can get her to talk about it since she is the one with the issue she usually tries to change the subject. She is not very open when it comes to communication and so she doesn't share her thoughts, wishes, etc.
She says she never fantasizes, has no real preferences, little intimacy other than the deed itself.


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## Jamison (Feb 10, 2011)

Trenton said:


> Hmmmm if my husband came in my face while I was sleeping he would not be a happy man for a very, very long time.


I would never do that to a woman. BUt see that was all about him. He could have just did what he needed to do, without all that, but no he had to some how throw her into the mix even while she was sleeping. And because she was being difficult like he said, then he did it out of spite/control. Gee, I can't imagine why she wouldn't want to do certain things. Of course she is disconnected from it. maybe you found your own answer, its how you treat her.


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## Draguna (Jan 13, 2011)

discouraged1 said:


> I do have to admit that one time early in our marriage she was acting very prudish...... so once she fell asleep I spank it until I was ready and gave her a facial. I offered a towel but she was not really happy about that. Well you live and learn I guess... She got the point though.


That... Did not help you case. :scratchhead:


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

That sounds like assault and battery.


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## Syrum (Feb 22, 2011)

discouraged1 said:


> I do have to admit that one time early in our marriage she was acting very prudish...... so once she fell asleep I spank it until I was ready and gave her a facial. I offered a towel but she was not really happy about that. Well you live and learn I guess... She got the point though.


Holly poo. That is f'd up. I would feel like a piece of poo, like you cared nothing for me.

You want a blow job and more sex, here's what you do. Act like you love her more than anything, show her you care about her by paying attention to her, what she looks like (compliment), what she likes and doesn't like. Do nice things for her, pay attention and really listen, like when you were first together. Make her feel that she can trust you. 

but don't be a push over, don't let her talk down to you, listen to her valid complaints with a fair mind but don't be a push over. Act like a strong man.

Admit to the things you have done wrong in the relationship that have gotten you to this point. Own them and change them.

Not just for a few days, do it forever.

Then let her know how sexy she is and how much you want her, be aggressive about it (in a loving but assertive way), and let her know when she gives to you sexually that you think she is a goddess on earth.

easy.

P.S never do anything revolting like you did above again. I don't think I could ever trust a guy who did that. Yuck!


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## CallaLily (Jan 13, 2011)

Well, turn about is fair play in my book. So If I woke up to something like that he had done, then he can't say anything when I do something to him when he is a sleep. :smthumbup: And it would be something he didn't like, and then I would dare him to open his mouth about it.


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## bluesky (Jan 29, 2011)

> Then let her know how sexy she is and how much you want her, be aggressive about it (in a loving but assertive way), and let her know when she gives to you sexually that you think she is a goddess on earth.


*This is interesting. This is exactly how men have affairs with woman.*


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## Catherine602 (Oct 14, 2010)

Syrum said:


> Holly poo. That is f'd up. I would feel like a piece of poo, like you cared nothing for me.
> 
> You want a blow job and more sex, here's what you do. Act like you love her more than anything, show her you care about her by paying attention to her, what she looks like (compliment), what she likes and doesn't like. Do nice things for her, pay attention and really listen, like when you were first together. Make her feel that she can trust you.
> 
> ...


Great advice!! 

D you have a lot of work to do before you get where you want to be but you can do it. Nothing will change if you don't take responsibility for your "stuff". Don't make the mistake of thinking it's just your wife, she has her problems and you have yours. Your job is to make yourself the best man you can be.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Mrs.G (Nov 20, 2010)

Catherine602 said:


> Great advice!!
> 
> D you have a lot of work to do before you get where you want to be but you can do it. Nothing will change if you don't take responsibility for your "stuff". Don't make the mistake of thinking it's just your wife, she has her problems and you have yours. Your job is to make yourself the best man you can be.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I am a sexually confident woman, with a high sex drive. I love different positions, giving and receiving oral, as well as anal sex. My husband was the first man to come in my mouth and the only man whose cum I've swallowed. He just makes me feel comfortable, so I have explored new things with my husband. 
Guess what? I do not want cum in my face. I think it's disgusting and degrading. Unlike other men I have been with, my husband does NOT pressure me.
I hate to feel obligated in bed. I never tried anal with an ex, because the sexual bully kept badgering me about it all the time. 
Cumming in a woman's face while she sleeps is disrespectful and cruel. If my husband ever pulled antics like that, the trust would be too damaged for the marriage to be loving. A prude just needs to feel safe in a relationship. She likely sees you as self centered and wicked. I will never understand how men get off on a woman hating the sex.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

Runs like Dog said:


> That sounds like assault and battery.


It is, at least here in Texas. 
Got the point? Wow, just wow. 
I was rooting for you prior to this. Now? Not a chance.


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## okeydokie (Sep 10, 2008)

discouraged1 said:


> I do have to admit that one time early in our marriage she was acting very prudish...... so once she fell asleep I spank it until I was ready and gave her a facial. I offered a towel but she was not really happy about that. Well you live and learn I guess... She got the point though.


well thanks, you just dropped those of us men who have similar struggles with our wives way down the credibility scale with the women in here that want to help, now we are all pigs, thanks a bunch, jeez

what the hell were you thinking???


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

okeydokie said:


> well thanks, you just dropped those of us men who have similar struggles with our wives way down the credibility scale with the women in here that want to help, now we are all pigs, thanks a bunch, jeez
> 
> what the hell were you thinking???


Robbie, you will never be viewed as a pig. Ever.
And pig is far from what this guy did.


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

Jamison said:


> I would never do that to a woman. BUt see that was all about him. He could have just did what he needed to do, without all that, but no he had to some how throw her into the mix even while she was sleeping. And because she was being difficult like he said, then he did it out of spite/control. Gee, I can't imagine why she wouldn't want to do certain things. Of course she is disconnected from it. maybe you found your own answer, its how you treat her.


Nailed it.


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## okeydokie (Sep 10, 2008)

Brennan said:


> Robbie, you will never be viewed as a pig. Ever.
> And pig is far from what this guy did.


:rofl:


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## SaffronPower (Mar 6, 2011)

Don't worry about offending her, just tell her it kills the mood. Maybe she just thinks she's funny and doesn't realize that it spoils it for you. Ask her calmly to not use that phrase anymore. If she gives you grief about this you have bigger problems.


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## Catherine602 (Oct 14, 2010)

okeydokie said:


> well thanks, you just dropped those of us men who have similar struggles with our wives way down the credibility scale with the women in here that want to help, now we are all pigs, thanks a bunch, jeez
> 
> what the hell were you thinking???


Not me. I don't think I have ever read of something like this happening. In anger, we imagine doing things to the object of our anger but people seldom translate that to action, unless something is very wrong. No offense to D but, he seems a little off, maybe it is deprssion. But I think that men would not even think of doing this. Guys, have you known of any man in his right senses who has done this to a sleeping spouse? I don't think this anomoly should sinks the credibility of the men posting about their problems.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## discouraged1 (Mar 16, 2010)

Jamison said:


> I would never do that to a woman. BUt see that was all about him. He could have just did what he needed to do, without all that, but no he had to some how throw her into the mix even while she was sleeping. And because she was being difficult like he said, then he did it out of spite/control. Gee, I can't imagine why she wouldn't want to do certain things. Of course she is disconnected from it. maybe you found your own answer, its how you treat her.


This happened along time ago... over 15 years. I have never done anything like it again and treat my wife very well.


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## discouraged1 (Mar 16, 2010)

Catherine602 said:


> Not me. I don't think I have ever read of something like this happening. In anger, we imagine doing things to the object of our anger but people seldom translate that to action, unless something is very wrong. No offense to D but, he seems a little off, maybe it is deprssion. But I think that men would not even think of doing this. Guys, have you known of any man in his right senses who has done this to a sleeping spouse? I don't think this anomoly should sinks the credibility of the men posting about their problems.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


This was done over 15 years ago and never since, I treat her with utmost respect and dignity. Not even sure why I thought I should post it and now it is clear I should not have mentioned it... When you are in your early 20's you do and say real stupid things.

Thanks you to everyone for their advice. It is greatly appreciated.


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

discouraged1 said:


> This was done over 15 years ago and never since, I treat her with utmost respect and dignity. Not even sure why I thought I should post it and now it is clear I should not have mentioned it... When you are in your early 20's you do and say real stupid things.
> 
> Thanks you to everyone for their advice. It is greatly appreciated.


It doesn't matter if it was 15 years ago or 15 minutes ago, she remembers it and is acting accordingly. You also said "she got the point". What point was that? You did a sexual act to her without her consent. So where has that gotten you? :scratchhead:


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## Draguna (Jan 13, 2011)

Strange huh? I'm not saying I agree with that, but people can forgive an affair easier than someone having spit on them once before and being nice since.


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## CallaLily (Jan 13, 2011)

Draguna said:


> Strange huh? I'm not saying I agree with that, but people can forgive an affair easier than someone having spit on them once before and being nice since.


Yeah, but who knows, maybe there is more to it than we know about.


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## Catherine602 (Oct 14, 2010)

discouraged1 said:


> This was done over 15 years ago and never since, I treat her with utmost respect and dignity. Not even sure why I thought I should post it and now it is clear I should not have mentioned it... When you are in your early 20's you do and say real stupid things.
> 
> Thanks you to everyone for their advice. It is greatly appreciated.


i think it is a forgivable offense. i did so many stupid things when I first got married I am glad my husband is not like a man and forgets. I read research that the brian is still developing and impulse control is not yet firmly in place so it most likely a developmental thing. 

Speaking of never forgetting, I am glad you mentioned it the facial incident. Why did you? Something is there after all this time. Maybe it was like a confession because you feel guilty and regret it happened? Sometimes guilt makes you think you don't deserve good things. 

I have tried writing out things that I feel guilty about that no longer have any meaning to the person I am now. I say I am sorry and what I am doing now to make sure it never happens again, then I burn it. 

Does this sound like it is something you feel? Maybe that's why you allow your wife to say things that hurt you because you have done things that you are not prod of. 

You did your penance now it is time to move on. You are no less deserving of a happy satisfying marriage than anyone else. Now work in that direction, it will be slow but keep slogging away. 

How are things going with your wife. Are you working on the relationship or just moping around and feeling sorry for yourself. Sounds like you are mopping??


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## ladyybyrd (Jan 4, 2011)

I would never say that to my husband! Sounds like your wife just doesn't like doing it all that much.


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## discouraged1 (Mar 16, 2010)

Catherine602 said:


> i think it is a forgivable offense. i did so many stupid things when I first got married I am glad my husband is not like a man and forgets. I read research that the brian is still developing and impulse control is not yet firmly in place so it most likely a developmental thing.
> 
> Speaking of never forgetting, I am glad you mentioned it the facial incident. Why did you? Something is there after all this time. Maybe it was like a confession because you feel guilty and regret it happened? Sometimes guilt makes you think you don't deserve good things.
> 
> ...


I agree mostly Catherine602, guess I just wanted to say it and I wanted everyone to know I know I am not perfect. I try to give more than I take and feel frustrated. I would do almost anything to get physical affection vs. feeling it's a chore!
I am working on it, told her no today to something she wanted me to do (not sexual). I usually do most everything she wants...
Thank you for your responses, they are very appreciated.


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## Catherine602 (Oct 14, 2010)

discouraged1 said:


> I agree mostly Catherine602, guess I just wanted to say it and I wanted everyone to know I know I am not perfect. I try to give more than I take and feel frustrated. I would do almost anything to get physical affection vs. feeling it's a chore!
> I am working on it, told her no today to something she wanted me to do (not sexual). I usually do most everything she wants...
> Thank you for your responses, they are very appreciated.


Hi discouraged the thing is that when you give more than you get, resentment towards the person who does not return equally. I think it is great that you are beginning to even things out. Look at the types of things you are doing, stop over giving and cool things down with your wife. Don't beg, don't act needy, don't act as if she is the one with all the power. Have tried to follow the advice of MEM? If not why. Have you read some of the information on manning up?. 

You also sound depressed and as such, you may need meds to give you a jump start. As far as imperfections, when you are depressed, you see your imperfections as bigger than they really are and your good qualities less than you should. Go to a therapist and get an evaluation for depression and Try a small change and post about it so you get support. You can do it, if you act and stop vegetating. It's hard but necessary to get out of your unhappiness.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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