# Marriage and feelings



## reesespieces (Aug 3, 2009)

I come across a lot of people nowadays who say it's okay to make decisions in your marriage based on feelings, regardless of the consequences. Take a situation where someone is unhappy, and they've been unhappy for a long time. They might not be unhappy consistently, but time and time again they find themselves feeling that way and decide to divorce. Is it wise for them to make a decision like that based on their feelings?

Let's take the same situation and replace unhappy with angry, confused, or bitter. Does it still make sense to make decisions based on those feelings? In marriage, do some feelings trump other feelings? 

I might be in the minority but I am of the camp where two people should work out what is wrong and figure out a way to resolve their problem together. I am aware this doesn't always work and can leave one or both people feeling worse than before...at that point, would they be justified in making a decision to divorce based on their feelings? Why or why not?

I'm interested to get married people's views on this.


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## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

I believe you are absolutely on track. If we were free to be slaves to our "feelings", marriage wouldn't require a contract. People would just do as they felt for as long as they felt. Couples who remain married for decades frequently behave in ways marriage requires even when (especially when) they don't "feel" like it. 
No two people ever shared the same space for years and remained constantly giddy-thrilled with each other throughout the process. As a married partner, we are expected to remain faithful even when we "feel" tempted to do otherwise. We are expected to be good partners, good parents, good providers, when we might "feel" like running off and joining a rock band, staying home and getting high, selling disobedient kids into slavery, or whatever. We take vows to behave in specific ways, not to always "feel" certain ways. If we were to be slaves to our feelings, a marriage ceremony and contract would not be required. We could just shack up until the giddy feeling passed and then toss our partner to the curb and search for another giddy feeling.


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## Adeline (Jan 24, 2014)

no, I agree with you. Whatever emotion it may be, you should try to work through it and fix it first. It seems that the emotion that most frequently comes up is "unhappiness." People are "unhappy" in their relationship and therefore should move on. Well, what is making you unhappy? Is it your own individual life, are you not happy with your own accomplishments? Is your spouse not tending to your needs to way you would like? Then try to figure out how to remedy that. If you have tried a few different options consistently for an extended period of time and it still hasn't changed, then you may need to call it quits. But, emotion alone I would say would not make me automatically divorce. Heck, I'm sort of in that situation right now. I'm unhappy in my marriage. But it is because of the way my spouse is treating me. He is also unhappy, but I am not sure why. It seems more his own personal self. Despite it being this way for over a year, I am still trucking along. Granted I should have not waited this long until trying external options, but yeah. Finally trying to get into marriage counseling. That is the last straw for me, for us. I'm not sure the timeline I will put on that for duration of sessions... but definitely at least a good several months, and as long as there is some bit of progress I will keep going. If it was emotion alone that I make my decisions on, I would have been long gone by now.


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## SunnyT (Jun 22, 2011)

But you are assuming that both spouses are self-aware and want to improve the relationship. 

Seems like whether it's a lack of communication or a lack of self-awareness, often one spouse isn't going to help do the heavy lifting.


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## foxguy148 (Jan 25, 2014)

Honestly, this is 2014, marriage as an institution is probably doomed given the current society/culture. 

I myself am married but would strongly recommend to my 2 year old son not to get married, I myself if I ever divorce will opt to never marry again. It seems to have become some sort of contract were one party feels entitled to do what they want because they are "married", hence the constant threads on here , "she/he never did this before we were married". A relationship must have a leader, a leader must make decisions, if the other partner is not willing to go along, then you won't have much of a relationship in the end.

Current society/expectations simply no longer align with the idea of marriage anymore.


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## Hortensia (Feb 1, 2013)

unbelievable said:


> I believe you are absolutely on track. If we were free to be slaves to our "feelings", marriage wouldn't require a contract. People would just do as they felt for as long as they felt.


And that's how it should rightfully be. Marriage is not a prison. We're born free and happy individuals and meant to stay this way- married or not.

If the marriage has more positive aspects than negative and if it makes you overall happier than unhappy, then definitely fight to work it out. But if you feel miserable, trapped and alone, or your spouse feels this way, then doubtless, free yourself. You should only stay because you want to. Because it feels good.

Life is too short to live a sexless, loveless marriage, pining after somebody else or with a spouse who pines after somebody else.
Do you even want a spouse who actually does not want you? 

Life's meaning is to be happy, people. Not to sacrifice yourselves and to suffer. 
It will be a while before humankind starts to wake up from this limited beliefs though...


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## Married but Happy (Aug 13, 2013)

Feelings are valid, and often there is a reason for them that can't always be articulated or explained logically.

I do think that feelings should seldom be the _sole_ reason for making decisions - but there are situations where they are sufficient. Most problems should be worked on together, whenever possible, when both people do so willingly, reasonably, and in good faith. Many people cannot do that, of course.


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## Hortensia (Feb 1, 2013)

foxguy148 said:


> Honestly, this is 2014, marriage as an institution is probably doomed given the current society/culture.
> 
> I myself am married but would strongly recommend to my 2 year old son not to get married, I myself if I ever divorce will opt to never marry again. It seems to have become some sort of contract were one party feels entitled to do what they want because they are "married", hence the constant threads on here , "she/he never did this before we were married". A relationship must have a leader, a leader must make decisions, if the other partner is not willing to go along, then you won't have much of a relationship in the end.
> 
> Current society/expectations simply no longer align with the idea of marriage anymore.


I agree with all your post, minus "the relationship should have a leader". Um, not always. Unless it is a relationship when one spouse is submissive and the other one a leader, in which case it works out.
But otherwise, marriage should be partnership and companionship, doing things together, taking decision together, respecting each other. No one should be above the other.

I'm not a fan of the contract either. I don't want my spouse to stay out of obligation. That's why we made a promise- if one wants out, the other one agrees without raising hindrances.


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## married tech (Jan 18, 2014)

> It seems that the emotion that most frequently comes up is "unhappiness." People are "unhappy" in their relationship and therefore should move on. Well, what is making you unhappy? Is it your own individual life, are you not happy with your own accomplishments? Is your spouse not tending to your needs to way you would like?


That's a huge issue my wife has. She lets her feelings run her life and those feelings are as ever and rapidly changing as the colors of a kaleidoscope. 

As you say unhappiness is her biggest issue. She feels that her happiness should come from others. I however strongly disagree being I make my own happiness and always have. 
So much of what she does to herself makes her unhappy yet she feels I should be the one to fix those things in her life. Not her herself who does them.  



> But you are assuming that both spouses are self-aware and want to improve the relationship.
> 
> Seems like whether it's a lack of communication or a lack of self-awareness, often one spouse isn't going to help do the heavy lifting.


That's where our problems start. We have developed a what I see to be a very imbalanced load sharing in our marriage which I see as being my fault for not standing up to her wishes and whims as I should have when I saw them as becoming a problem.

She wants to run our relationship and I for the most part tried to be fair and stand back and let her. Unfortunately where she let her emotions and whims lead us right now is not a good place.


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## foxguy148 (Jan 25, 2014)

married tech said:


> As you say unhappiness is her biggest issue. She feels that her happiness should come from others. I however strongly disagree being I make my own happiness and always have.
> So much of what she does to herself makes her unhappy yet she feels I should be the one to fix those things in her life. Not her herself who does them.
> 
> I see as being my fault for not standing up to her wishes and whims as I should have when I saw them as becoming a problem.
> ...


There are millions of women out there in fact I would say the majority at least in the western world, who believe the above, that a man should make a woman happy, they believe it is your job, this belief develops in early childhood from Disney type movies/stories is reinforced by the media all throughout their lives, you know the princess mentality, it is way out of control, hence millions of women develop the above view, not all of them but many of them do. 

Next you come to your next complaint, they also want to run the relationship, they want an equal say in the marriage, etc. But notice how that doesn't match up with my first paragraph, they only want equality when it suits them, unfortunately this is the way millions of women have been trained in the western world, hence it's on epidemic levels and why marriage as an institution is doomed for failure once enough guys wake up to this.


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## Cletus (Apr 27, 2012)

Married but Happy said:


> Feelings are valid, and often there is a reason for them that can't always be articulated or explained logically.


I've never agreed with this. Feelings are real, but they are most assuredly not always valid, and I despise that modern movement to make them appear so.

Feelings based on bad information, personal phobias, lack of awareness of self or of others ought to be corrected, not validated.


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## married tech (Jan 18, 2014)

> There are millions of women out there in fact I would say the majority at least in the western world, who believe the above, that a man should make a woman happy, they believe it is your job, this belief develops in early childhood from Disney type movies/stories is reinforced by the media all throughout their lives, you know the princess mentality, it is way out of control, hence millions of women develop the above view, not all of them but many of them do.
> 
> Next you come to your next complaint, they also want to run the relationship, they want an equal say in the marriage, etc. But notice how that doesn't match up with my first paragraph, they only want equality when it suits them, unfortunately this is the way millions of women have been trained in the western world, hence it's on epidemic levels and why marriage as an institution is doomed for failure once enough guys wake up to this.



You nailed it.  

Except my wife is from Turkey. However she has adapted to the irrational and unrealistic American expectations incredibly fast and well.


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## Married but Happy (Aug 13, 2013)

Cletus said:


> I've never agreed with this. Feelings are real, but they are most assuredly not always valid, and I despise that modern movement to make them appear so.
> 
> Feelings based on bad information, personal phobias, lack of awareness of self or of others ought to be corrected, not validated.


You're right, of course. I should have said "Feelings are _often _valid ..."

We rarely have complete or good information, and few people are so psychologically well-integrated to have consistently good awareness of self or others. It's often not possible to correct this without a lot of time and effort, and the person to whom the feelings apply may be actively thwarting your efforts.

Feelings can be the best indicator of a situation and can lead to the best choices. Logic can as easlily lead you astray as invalid/incorrect feelings, especially if the starting premises are false - besides, how many people are good at logic and reason, anyway?

Particularly suspect are those who would deny your feelings and try to engage in a logical debate - they may not have your interests at heart, only their own selfish desire to manipulate you.


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## Cletus (Apr 27, 2012)

Married but Happy said:


> You're right, of course. I should have said "Feelings are _often _valid ..."


I guess I would say that they are just as often invalid. Which leaves you kind of stuck on what to do about them until you uncover which is right.



> Feelings can be the best indicator of a situation and can lead to the best choices. Logic can as easlily lead you astray as invalid/incorrect feelings, especially if the starting premises are false


It's not logic leading you astray then - it's the false starting premise. Probably that same false starting premise that is leading you to inappropriately feel bad.



> - besides, how many people are good at logic and reason, anyway?


Far, far too few.


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## ocotillo (Oct 17, 2011)

reesespieces said:


> Is it wise for them to make a decision like that based on their feelings?


I would think decisions would (should) be based on the circumstances that invoke the feelings rather than the feelings themselves. 

If the circumstances justify the decision, then they justify the feelings too.


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## Lyris (Mar 29, 2012)

How many Disney Princess movies have you actually seen? Because I watched Tangled yesterday with my daughter and saw exactly none of what you are suggesting. In fact, I can't think of any Princess movies that have entitled spoilt heroines. Snow White spends the movie cleaning up after the 7 dwarves. Cinderella works her ass off for her nasty family before her virtue is rewarded. Sleeping Beauty doesn't ask for anything much, although she doesn't do a lot either. Rapunzel offers to sacrifice her freedom to save her man's life. Merida from Brave saves everyone in her town.

So your claims of the evils of Princess movies are another example of people blindly repeating what they've heard without knowing anything about the examples they're using.

I'd say marrying a 'female' from another culture and transplanting them might have a fair bit to do with your marriage not working out. For all sorts of reasons.


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## Stressedandsad (Jan 29, 2014)

I like this thread. So many of the ones I've been reading seem to say that if you and spouse are experiencing heartache and big problems that there is no hope. Cheaters keep cheating, lack of respect never turns around, they always show their true colors etc. Married nearly 29 years and had to work at it constantly. While this current rough patch seems to be the worst, I like hearing that the plane can be righted from a tailspin.


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## married tech (Jan 18, 2014)

> How many Disney Princess movies have you actually seen? Because I watched Tangled yesterday with my daughter and saw exactly none of what you are suggesting. In fact, I can't think of any Princess movies that have entitled spoilt heroines. Snow White spends the movie cleaning up after the 7 dwarves. Cinderella works her ass off for her nasty family before her virtue is rewarded. Sleeping Beauty doesn't ask for anything much, although she doesn't do a lot either. Rapunzel offers to sacrifice her freedom to save her man's life. Merida from Brave saves everyone in her town.
> 
> So your claims of the evils of Princess movies are another example of people blindly repeating what they've heard without knowing anything about the examples they're using.



Interesting take on things.

I have watched all of those movies as well and in the end of every one of them what I saw was some poor girl getting rescued from her less than perfect life to go and live in some rich castle to be taken care of by someone else who has wealth and servants to do her work and whims for her for the rest of her life. 

Shrek is about the only love and live happily ever after fairy tail I can relate too and to be honest I told my wife that is the life I live and will continue to live should she come here.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

This is how I feel....on the Feelings in marriage.... Sometimes we can BE Over Emotional , especially right in the THICK of something , a fight we just had... we must be able to take a step back.. remember the good... along with what is happening in the moment...weigh it.....and seek wisdom....










Speaking for myself... I expect so much from a partner... and I am ready and willing to give back as much ....as it should be...this is what marriage is all about.. a partnership of giving...and growing together for happiness... for shared Joys....

Sure we make mistakes along the way....no one has halos, we have unruly moments we'll have to forgive each other for, there will be disagreements where we need to come half away / agreeing to disagree...yielding and trusting the other....but decide to go forth in peace...

*Healthy Communication* and *self Awareness* is paramount for success..and happiness... 

But when the days, weeks, months...drag on..where one's attitude takes a .. "I don't really care about you, your needs/ desires/ wants anymore .. I'm gonna do my own Thing.. Live with it"... ..showing a cold callous unworkable spirit ... shutting the other out.. whether through words spoken, or passive aggressive stubborn behaviors.....one can *FEEL* the divide in the air...suffocating the other....*enter FEELINGS..*..

None of us want to BEG and feel like a burden to get the attention of the one who vowed to love & cherish us for life... this starts getting REALLY REALLY OLD.....If one wants to take this attitude...and run with it, thinking it's OK.. wake up and smell the roses cause your spouse -the one who DOES care, is suffering....... unless they enjoy being miserable.... they may just decide they had ENOUGH ...those greener pastures will be smelling pretty damn good. 

I am NOT one who would stay in a miserable marriage....if I felt Unloved, uncared for.......these are tangible feelings...*when we ARE LOVED.. we FEEL IT .. it moves us... and we want to give back...that's just how it works unless you are a Narcissist or mentally ill*... if this is a struggle.... buy The Love Dare  ..take this 40 day challenge..gotta start somewhere... 

If there is *Resentment,* sit down together determined to open that up...acknowledge where you both screwed up, go to MC if you have too...Talk through it and overcome....life is too short .

We must always look at our own hand though, what have WE DONE to cause our spouse hurt, or any resentment and ask, seek and show them (through actions) we want to BE there (speak their love languages starting today), to change this so our relationship can be renewed.. restored, on the path back to emotional intimacy....this takes Self awareness again.. 

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/genera...transforming-our-marriages-relationships.html


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## Lyris (Mar 29, 2012)

It's just as easy to read those princess stories as virtuous women being rewarded. So do the right thing and you'll find true love. Plus, in Tangled in particular, rapunzel was prepared to sacrifice her freedom for someone she loved, and was restored to her birthright as a princess only after standing up for her principles. Merida wasn't rescued by anyone, nor did she want to be. I haven't seen Frozen yet, but it has different themes again.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## reesespieces (Aug 3, 2009)

SA, I love your Venn diagram! It really captures a lot of the things people should know before marriage (but don't).

The take on feelings is interesting. I believe feelings have their place and just are. We shouldn't allow them to override our decisions or be the main reason why we make a decision. 

I know a lot of people say it's not fair to the person for them to have to feel bad and remain in a situation causing them to feel poorly. In their marriage, if one spouse feels badly enough the argument I hear is they are justified in getting a divorce.


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

married tech said:


> You nailed it.
> Except my wife is from Turkey. However she has adapted to the irrational and unrealistic American expectations incredibly fast and well.


Hey, we're almost neighbors :smthumbup:

My wife is from a few countries east of Turkey (one of the -istans) and unfortunately feelings and emotions run the show. Reality measured in parts per million, while feelings are a dime a dozen.

Between emotionally charged cultures like theirs and the 'irrational and unrealistic American expectations' things can get fairly interesting to say the least.

Luckily for her she married a perfect no-emotions guy from Europe.That has helped curb her emotions and feelings by quite a bit.


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## married tech (Jan 18, 2014)

> Hey, we're almost neighbors
> 
> My wife is from a few countries east of Turkey (one of the -istans) and unfortunately feelings and emotions run the show. Reality measured in parts per million, while feelings are a dime a dozen.


Turkey is very European in culture and not so much middle eastern but yes most days my wifes emotional swings could get her passed off for being from a middle eastern nut case country. 

Today she is in a jealous rage over the fact that I am getting some tax money back and she is not. 
Personally which would you rather have? Make $20K and get $1000 back or make $50K and not get any back?


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

At least Turkish food is a lot better than -istan food , emotions be darned. 

I have found that emotions come and go often depending on how an issue is framed. In the tax issue instead of focusing on refund focus on taxes paid... That's a simple case but often our emotions flare up because of the way things present themselves.

For example, my house pays $6500 a year in property tax which sounds like a lot till you realize it's a near mansion in size and that the money supports the best school system in the state. So, start at the end with the benefits and walk backwards towards the cost. This helps keep things a bit more in check.


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