# whats your opinion on housewives



## yichud (Mar 14, 2017)

whats your opinion on women that put their family ahead of their career by choosing a life as a wife, and a mother?


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

Im a fan. If the conditions are right.


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## Cynthia (Jan 31, 2014)

yichud said:


> whats your opinion on women that put their family ahead of their career by choosing a life as a wife, and a mother?


My opinion is that each person and each couple should do what they believe is best for their own family. If a husband and wife decide that it is in the best interests of the family for the wife to stay home with the children, I have no problem with that.

I've been a SAHM for over twenty years. During that time, I have homeschooled three children. I'm almost finished homeschooling and plan to go back to work when my last child's high school education is completed. It is a sacrifice, but for our family it has been helpful. There are many reasons why we chose this lifestyle and it has worked for us. 

I have friends who have worked full time while raising families and I think they have it a lot harder than I do. It has made our family life a lot easier for me to be a SAHM, which is why we made that choice. When I was working full time with a young child, it was a lot more stressful on both my husband and me. Our schedule is a lot easier to manage with me at home. I can't say what is best for anyone else, only what is best for us.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Housewives are hot.


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## 225985 (Dec 29, 2015)

When she cheats you will be paying spousal support in addition to child support.


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## Miss Independent (Mar 24, 2014)

.


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## uhtred (Jun 22, 2016)

No problem if that is what she wants to do, and if she finds a husband who wants that sort of traditional arrangement.

Its not an arrangement that I would want.


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## frusdil (Sep 5, 2013)

I'm a SAHM and I absolutely love it. I homeschool our daughter (my stepdaughter) who we have full time, and get to be home and be there for when she or my husband are sick. If our girl is sick, we don't have to scramble trying to find someone to look after her because I am there.

She has some special needs so attends a lot of appoinments, which I am able to take her to myself. I wouldn't want someone else doing that. I like to be there with and for her.

I have friends who work full time and I honestly don't know how they do it, my life is so easy compared to theirs. It has it's moments, but I wouldn't trade it for anything. I'm incredibly lucky. My husband values my contribution to the household, and while it may not be financial, he knows that some things can't be measured in dollar terms.

Wouldn't swap my life for anything.


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## WorkingWife (May 15, 2015)

yichud said:


> whats your opinion on women that put their family ahead of their career by choosing a life as a wife, and a mother?


I'm all for it if that is what both spouses want, and am envious of those families. I think it's definitely great for the kids.

My only concern would be if the marriage goes sideways later in life, the wife may be very vulnerable financially if she has no recent work experience.


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## Lifeiscomplicated (Sep 27, 2016)

WorkingWife said:


> I'm all for it if that is what both spouses want, and am envious of those families. I think it's definitely great for the kids.
> 
> *My only concern would be if the marriage goes sideways later in life, the wife may be very vulnerable financially if she has no recent work experience.[*/QUOTE]
> 
> Exactly, that is my problem now.


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## Vinnydee (Jan 4, 2016)

My wife is proud to be a housewife. If not for her holding down the home front I would not have been able to advance as quickly as I did in my profession. She put up with 13 relocations over our 44 years of marriage plus taking care of things when I was overseas for 3 months each year. She happily decorated each of the 9 houses we have lived in, some as little as 2 months before another transfer. She is the Mistress of our home and runs it like a well oiled machine. I could not imagine my life without her. Don't even want to think about it.


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## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

I believe that is a choice made by her in consultation with her partner. I have done both. 

However, there is not enough support for women who give up good careers to go back into the work force. I left a good management position and now find I am starting at the bottom again, it sucks.

Looking back I do not regret the time I spent with my kids, they are much better for it I believe and we have a good relationship. However, I do regret giving up my career to be a housewife and support my husbands career, frankly I got no thanks for it and am now struggling to kickstart again on much lower pay than my H earns. Frankly society (where I live) puts little value on what mothers contribute.

If I had stayed in my career I could not have depended on my husband to carry half the load at home (he is not that kind of man) and the stress would have probably killed me.


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

I think my attitude about it depends on how it's approached. Some think it's a huge sacrifice they're making that the husbands should be thankful for. Others see it as a gift they should be grateful for. I could only deal with the latter. And if I have to be the sole provider of that lifestyle, I expect to be taken care of. In every way.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

yichud said:


> whats your opinion on women that put their family ahead of their career by choosing a life as a wife, and a mother?


What is your opinion?

And why do you ask?


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## WorkingWife (May 15, 2015)

Lifeiscomplicated said:


> WorkingWife said:
> 
> 
> > I'm all for it if that is what both spouses want, and am envious of those families. I think it's definitely great for the kids.
> ...


Yep. It's a total screw job on the stay-at-home-spouse. I don't know how alimony works, but I can't imagine it makes up for what you could earn if you had your own career. And it doesn't last forever - and once you are over 40 or 50, it can be *really *hard to get a career type job because employers look at you and think:

1) You may not stick around that long
2) You're more likely to have health issues
3) You won't be happy with entry level pay
4) You won't be willing to put up with hours/requests a young person will. (Though with many of today's millennials, it's probably more likely to be the young people who lack the work ethic and already think they are something special.)


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## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

WorkingOnMe said:


> I think my attitude about it depends on how it's approached. Some think it's a huge sacrifice they're making that the husbands should be thankful for. Others see it as a gift they should be grateful for. I could only deal with the latter. And if I have to be the sole provider of that lifestyle, I expect to be taken care of. In every way.


I get you, I would probably feel the same way but at this juncture in my life though I am still with my H. If I knew then 20 years ago, what I know now I would not have given up my career at all as I feel I was sold a pig in a poke big time. One lives and learns I guess and I know I am better off than most in that I could work again. Many women give it all up and the laws in their country are not like those in the west and they get squat on a split.


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## Andy1001 (Jun 29, 2016)

My gf is just about to have our baby and I would love for her to be a sahm.She isn't too keen though.


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

If she can trust her husband not to exploit her vulnerability in any way, it is really nice for the whole family.


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## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

jld said:


> If she can trust her husband not to exploit her vulnerability in any way, it is really nice for the whole family.


Therein lies the crux, if she can trust her husband to be a man of honor who doesn't use his position in the family to hold all the power. Unfortunately, there are too many men especially in the culture I live in, think that they are somehow entitled just because they have a pee pee!


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

aine said:


> Therein lies the crux, if she can trust her husband to be a man of honor who doesn't use his position in the family to hold all the power. Unfortunately, there are too many men especially in the culture I live in, think that they are somehow entitled just because they have a pee pee!


True. Too few men have the integrity I wish they did. And their wives and children pay the price.


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## Satya (Jun 22, 2012)

I've known both SAHPs and working parents. I know a few that work about 25-30 hrs a week and child mind the rest of the time.

I wouldn't presume to judge. I've seen the good examples and the bad in each of those cases. 

Where I grew up, it has now become yuppie young parentsville, unfortunately. Most husband are breadwinners and wives meet at the Starbucks every morning with their baby strollers in tow. I used to watch them while I was waiting for my train to come rolling into the station. They'd slag off their husbands to each other and complain about having no free time. Um... You're having a coffee and chatting right now? Again, I've known amazing SAHPs who raise some brilliant children, they work tirelessly to engender good qualities in the next generation. But I've seen plenty that would rather complain, browse Facebook, and go out with their friends than raise children. It saddens me because I have no children yet, but I hope to. I can't fathom ignoring or thinking so little of something I'd feel blessed to have in my life. I also know myself and have come to terms with needing a balance between working and raising kids, if I had such a choice available to me. 

There are all sorts in this world.


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## naiveonedave (Jan 9, 2014)

aine said:


> Therein lies the crux, if she can trust her husband to be a man of honor who doesn't use his position in the family to hold all the power. Unfortunately, there are too many men especially in the culture I live in, think that they are somehow entitled just because they have a pee pee!


works both ways... She decides he spends too much time working (aka neglecting her needs/wants) or finds a bf, and he is hit with virtually unending alimony. 

I do think kids, especially young kids, are better off with a sahp.


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## Lifeiscomplicated (Sep 27, 2016)

WorkingWife said:


> Yep. It's a total screw job on the stay-at-home-spouse. * I don't know how alimony works, but I can't imagine it makes up for what you could earn if you had your own career. And it doesn't last forever - and once you are over 40 or 50, it can be really hard to get a career type job because employers look at you and think:*
> 
> 1) You may not stick around that long
> 2) You're more likely to have health issues
> ...


I am married but it does make life difficult if you are dependent on someone else financially especially if there are problems in the relationship. 

I have been a SAHM for the best part of 17 years. Managed to get a steady casual job nearly 2 years ago working 6 hours a week and that was through a good friend. Didn't plan on staying out of the workforce for the length of time that I did but factor in a 3rd child and with childcare being so expensive it wasn't worth me working especially part time as was my preferred option. Were I live it is very hard to find work of any kind whether it is part time or full time and unless you know someone it is very difficult to find employment especially when one has been out of the workforce for X number of years and is of a certain age (late 40's onwards). It doesn't seem to matter even if you have upskilled in different courses it comes down to who you know, not what you know.


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## Wolf1974 (Feb 19, 2014)

Very sexy and desirable to find a woman who puts family first. Have not met many of those in my life


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## tropicalbeachiwish (Jun 1, 2016)

I don't have kids and I work full time, but I'm giving my opinion any ways (whether you like it or not! LOL)! 

I have a lot of respect for SAH Moms or Dads. I think it's a great way to raise children. However it comes with some potential issues though. 
1. the SAH Mom or Dad can not be lazy! They really must be all about the kids, keeping up on the home, running errands, cooking meals. 
2. Both parents must be completely on board with the decision. If there's any hesitation by either, there'll be resentment. 
3. Both must specifically talk about the division of housework, financials, and how to handle any hobbies that the parents may have. 
4. If the kids are not home schooled, then I think after a certain age, the SAH parent should go back to work. This is when the kids become independent and you don't have to do as much for them, whatever age this is.


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## chillymorn69 (Jun 27, 2016)

the divorce rate is huge.

anybody that don't or can't make their own way in the world is making a huge mistake or at least taking a huge risk of not being able to support ones self if something happens ........such as divorce or even a death of a spouse who supports you. 


common sense would be to always be mindful of this.


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## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

yichud said:


> whats your opinion on women that put their family ahead of their career by choosing a life as a wife, and a mother?


SAHM? I have one. Everyone should have one. J/K. It works for us. I make plenty so my W does not need to work however....if my W was not a SAHM I could not do what I do in my field of work. My W is a great W and excellent mother.


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## Jessica38 (Feb 28, 2017)

jld said:


> If she can trust her husband not to exploit her vulnerability in any way, it is really nice for the whole family.


This is so insightful. My husband has always been very appreciative of what I do for our family so he can focus on his career (for our family). It's actually the major reason I feel fierce loyalty to my spouse- I am so appreciative of the huge responsibility he takes on providing for us, and he's very appreciative of what I do for him and our children.

And I know so many women who stay home are well-educated these days (myself included), that many of us do have hobbies/side gigs/continued learning we take advantage of to stay mentally stimulated. I know several (myself included) who launched small businesses once our children grew older. Raising kids teaches a lot about how to prioritize time and get things done efficiently. And most women I know who do it treat it like a career- we learn as much as possible about child development, effective parenting techniques, networking and volunteering in the community, school, and/or homeschool groups. *Adding that many women with careers can do all of this too. I know doctors, teachers, successful realtors, millitary, etc. who work part-time and make time for all of these things with their children as well.


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## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

Jessica38 said:


> This is so insightful. My husband has always been very appreciative of what I do for our family so he can focus on his career (for our family). It's actually the major reason I feel fierce loyalty to my spouse- I am so appreciative of the huge responsibility he takes on providing for us, and he's very appreciative of what I do for him and our children.


My W is very similar. Very appreciative of what I do and is vocal about it(and physical :grin2 I appreciate the heck out of my W and make sure I show it everyday. We do not bicker over the little things(after 22 years we figured it just is not worth it). We do not bicker over major things as we do not have any. 

And let me say my W does a lot during the week to keep our weekends free. That is huge for us being able to do things together.


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## Bananapeel (May 4, 2015)

When I was married my wife worked for the first half of the marriage and was a SAHM for the second half of the marriage (kids went to public school when they were old enough), so I got to experience both. I didn't really care what path she chose as long as she was happy and felt fulfilled by it, since I made enough money to support our family. It was a convenience having her around the house so I could spend more time focusing on my career while she focused on the kids and keeping the house running. However, now that I am single and work full time while taking care of my kids (half time custody) and handling the housework, I just don't see how it was a full time job. Cooking, running errands, dishes, and laundry averages about an hour a day and most of it can be done while doing something else. It's a pleasure to be able to sit down and do homework with my kids or play with them after school, so I don't consider that work. And a housecleaner can clean my house top to bottom far more thoroughly than my ex wife and it takes less than two hours every other week. So my opinion is that if you can afford it then it is a nice option, if she wants to do that. However, it isn't necessary and isn't as big of a contribution to the family as people make it out to be.


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## DustyDog (Jul 12, 2016)

yichud said:


> whats your opinion on women that put their family ahead of their career by choosing a life as a wife, and a mother?


My opinion is that the marital couple makes these decisions. If the marital couple has decided that the woman or man stay home to be with the kids, and they actually do it, then to my mind, they've strengthened the marital unit and the family.

In the US, we are richer than ever - when measured in terms of "hours of work at minimum wage" to buy things, almost everything is lower priced than any time in the past (ignoring bumps and dips of the past 5 years). I know many families who have 2-4 kids, raising them with one lower middle class income.


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## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

Bananapeel said:


> However, it isn't necessary and isn't as big of a contribution to the family as people make it out to be.


I don't even want to touch this.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

yichud said:


> whats your opinion on women that put their family ahead of their career by choosing a life as a wife, and a mother?


That's like asking what my opinion is of a man who works. Nowhere NEAR enough info here to HAVE an opinion.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

What of I think of SAHM/W's?

Well I want one... hopefully she will do all the house work, shopping, cooking, take care of the dogs (children are grown and gone), and even do the yard. And hopefully she will not nag.

What a great concept. Where do I get one?


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## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

EleGirl said:


> What of I think of SAHM/W's?
> 
> Well I want one... hopefully she will do all the house work, shopping, cooking, take care of the dogs (children are grown and gone), and even do the yard. And hopefully she will not nag.
> 
> What a great concept. Where do I get one?


See, I told ya everyone should have one. :smile2:


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## chillymorn69 (Jun 27, 2016)

EleGirl said:


> What of I think of SAHM/W's?
> 
> Well I want one... hopefully she will do all the house work, shopping, cooking, take care of the dogs (children are grown and gone), and even do the yard. And hopefully she will not nag.
> 
> What a great concept. Where do I get one?





comes with a high price tag...........half of everything you own! weather you stay together or not!:surprise:


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## chillymorn69 (Jun 27, 2016)

even if she/he cheats on you. they still get half.


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## chillymorn69 (Jun 27, 2016)

even if they abuse you!

I could keep going but you get my drift,


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## TX-SC (Aug 25, 2015)

I can only speak for my own views. I have no issue against it for other couples, though it's rough in a divorce. The husband will end up paying to support her, even if she cheats, and she will have a hard time getting back into the work force. But, each couple must decide on their own. 

My wife is a working professional and so am I. If we divorced, she and I would be on equal footing. I would have it no other way. Our children have not suffered in this arrangement. 

Sent from my LG-US996 using Tapatalk


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

chillymorn69 said:


> comes with a high price tag...........half of everything you own! weather you stay together or not!:surprise:


Na, I'll get one without marrying her/him. Just need a contract that stipulates that she/he is an employee and that I put little to now value into what they do. So I can throw them out on the street (fire them) any time I want. And if they leave, they get nothing.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

By the way, you are being trolled.


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## DustyDog (Jul 12, 2016)

chillymorn69 said:


> comes with a high price tag...........half of everything you own! weather you stay together or not!:surprise:


No. Only half of what you acquire after you get hitched. If you went into it with $10 million, then you would leave with $10 million...plus half of whatever additional growth occurred after said hitchment.


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## TX-SC (Aug 25, 2015)

yichud said:


> whats your opinion on women that put their family ahead of their career by choosing a life as a wife, and a mother?


It depends... Do they watch lesbian porn? 

Sent from my LG-US996 using Tapatalk


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## Marc878 (Aug 26, 2015)

Being a housewife is the toughest job there is. 

My total respect as I had to step in and do it fir awhile.


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## chillymorn69 (Jun 27, 2016)

DustyDog said:


> No. Only half of what you acquire after you get hitched. If you went into it with $10 million, then you would leave with $10 million...plus half of whatever additional growth occurred after said hitchment.


If you married before you accuired anything.
Every case is different. 
Anyrhing you comingled. If you co mingled your 10 million or any assets.

You grt the drift......i hope ...do you want to argue the tiny points some more?


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## chillymorn69 (Jun 27, 2016)

Marc878 said:


> Being a housewife is the toughest job there is.
> 
> My total respect as I had to step in and do it fir awhile.


Omfg,

I'm sick of this statement!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

No offence to you if thats your opinion .

Just courious is it tougher than a sniper, how about roofing in july, the president, police man,fireman,brain surgen,

This statement is an insult to anybody who has a really hard job.

And the best part they can always go back to work.


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## Satya (Jun 22, 2012)

Like any job, I would suppose the amount of work required depends on job expectations and also personal effort. If you care about a job, you'll put more effort in. If you're working to strict deadlines, you'll meet those deadlines or face consequences. I guess one benefit is that there's not as much fear that a sahp will get "fired" for not delivering. Maybe expectations need to be renegotiated every once in awhile, but they can kind of function as their own boss. At least that's how I view it. 

Is being a sahp hard? First you'd have to define hard and cite a source of comparison.


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## Marc878 (Aug 26, 2015)

chillymorn69 said:


> Omfg,
> 
> I'm sick of this statement!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> 
> ...


Opinions are like ass holes. Everybody has one.


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## chillymorn69 (Jun 27, 2016)

Marc878 said:


> Opinions are like ass holes. Everybody has one.


agreed


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## m00nman (Nov 29, 2014)

Marc878 said:


> Opinions are like ass holes. Everybody has one.


... and they often stink. 

As a "Mr. Mom" SAHP of two kids and one with special needs who happens to be a veteran and a college graduate I call foul. I also happen to have been raised by a widowed and single working mother. In my experience having money is nice, but time is the MOST precious commodity we have. By criticizing people for not sacrificing time with dependents for a paycheck, well that just tells me that they weren't raised right. 

IMO the first three years of a human being's life are the most important because that's the time when basic physical skills are developed, mental faculties are established and emotions and attitudes are formed. It's not something that should be outsourced.


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## taytay03 (May 23, 2016)

The way you ask that question is very leading. I, as well as many working mothers, probably feel like they put 'their family ahead' of all things they do. I work crazy hours and miss out on professional development opportunities because my family comes first


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## prunus (Oct 29, 2016)

blueinbr said:


> When she cheats you will be paying spousal support in addition to child support.


Do you mean when he cheats? Either can cheat. Being a SAHM doesn't make you more prone to cheating than a working man. But, yes, if you decide (together of course) for one parent to stay home while the other works, there will certainly be spousal support involved in the marriage fails.


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## prunus (Oct 29, 2016)

WorkingWife said:


> I'm all for it if that is what both spouses want, and am envious of those families. I think it's definitely great for the kids.
> 
> My only concern would be if the marriage goes sideways later in life, the wife may be very vulnerable financially if she has no recent work experience.


Yes, this is the situation I'm in now. I love being home with the kids, but I wanted so badly to work at least part time and go to school during my crappy marriage. But, ex wouldn't allow it and now he's paying the (very expensive) price for it. Instead of encouraging me, he tried to control me. He figured he could keep me in the marriage this way. It worked for way too long, but I finally snapped out of it.


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## prunus (Oct 29, 2016)

WorkingOnMe said:


> I think my attitude about it depends on how it's approached. Some think it's a huge sacrifice they're making that the husbands should be thankful for. Others see it as a gift they should be grateful for. I could only deal with the latter. And if I have to be the sole provider of that lifestyle, I expect to be taken care of. In every way.


Please explain "In every way". Do you feel your sole obligation would be a paycheck in this situation?


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## 225985 (Dec 29, 2015)

prunus said:


> Do you mean when he cheats? Either can cheat. Being a SAHM doesn't make you more prone to cheating than a working man. But, yes, if you decide (together of course) for one parent to stay home while the other works, there will certainly be spousal support involved in the marriage fails.




No, i meant when she cheats. This was specific advice to the OP. If he cheats paying support would be his consequence, not something involuntarily forced on him by another. They are not comparable.


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## alte Dame (Aug 7, 2012)

From the point of view of a married woman and mother who has tried the following while raising children:

- SAHM
- PT professional, PT SAHM
- FT professional with childcare,

my own experience was that, from a pure logistical point of view, stress levels for me went this way, from most stressful to least stressful:

- PT professional, PT SAHM
- FT professional with childcare
- SAHM

For me, having two jobs rather than one was the killer. As a woman of my generation, I was always the primary for raising the kids, so juggling work and home almost sent me to the ER with an early heart attack.

Just my experience.


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## DustyDog (Jul 12, 2016)

chillymorn69 said:


> If you married before you accuired anything.
> Every case is different.
> Anyrhing you comingled. If you co mingled your 10 million or any assets.
> 
> You grt the drift......i hope ...do you want to argue the tiny points some more?


It might be quite different outside the US. Within the US, each state's laws discuss it differently. And not all states officially recognize "marital assets". However, from what I've read, most states, in practice act as if "marital assets" is the method of evaluation.

Individual assets are not the primary focus - it's net worth of each individual. So, if an individual had acquired nothing prior to marriage (a very rare condition - people tend to be net positive or net negative, but having net worth = zero means that you have debt exactly equal to the sum marketable total value of your clothing, car, kitchenware, etc), then the equation still holds.

Comingling does not change typical family court's desires to split marital assets 50/50...but it might make it difficult to do so.

If a couple needs to figure this out, then they can do so without an attorney. Gather your documentation and see if you can create an obvious trail showing who owned what assets before marriage. Watch for those comingling cases. For instance, if she owned a house before, then they married and since he earned more, they chose to have him work and her stay at home, then he took over the mortgage payments. He might think those mortgage payments should be summed up, and called an increase in marital assets - because they went to the house. However, most of those payments paid for mortgage interest. Interest accrued while they were married, therefore, it was an expense shared 50/50. In the end, perhaps only 5% of the payments he made actually added equity to the house. So, although he put $1200/month into that house for 5 years, he will only "get back" $150 in added equity. This is what frustrates people, but the math is correct.

It's much harder if the "large" expenses paid by one person leave little or no obvious added fiscal value. House repairs are expensive, but are not perceived as adding value to the house...that is, it's hard to sell a house if a repair is required, so you do them to make it saleable, not to increase how much you get for it. From the cases I've read, a court will agree that an upgrade you did to a house increased its value only if the jurisdiction to which you pay property taxes agreed and in fact, increased the assessment and property tax levels.

So, yes, there are things that complicate the process. And in the case of comingling, a court may decide that the effort required to sort out the threads of who actually had which value prior to marriage is too difficult to be worth doing. 

But the fundamental objective remains the same.


Sadly, it can work against those who are responsible, but naive.

In the early 90s, a co-worker of mine was going through a divorce. She was happy to have no career ambition and worked as a "go fer" for us, at about 25% over minimum wage. Her husband was some sort of near-savant level engineer in the crazy world of rock and roll synthesizers/keyboards and special effects - an equipment designer. One day he decided he was a woman in a man's body, they saw counselors for six months and both decided splitting was best for both of them and the daughter who never saw dad anyway.

But when all the financial discovery stuff came out - ho boy. Before the marriage, she had $20,000 in savings and a one year old Honda, very modest furniture in her apartment and a large room full of crafting supplies. She never balanced her checkbook, but just paid bills and when she noticed a lot of money in checking, she moved some into savings. Together, they bought a house and he set up a lab and upgraded equipment over and over. Turns out he would periodically refinance the house to buy his next round of tech goodies - and tech goodies, two years later, are worth nothing because the next generation does more and costs less. And he borrowed lots...but at his income, was always able to make the payments.

So, on the day they started looking at their finances, it turned out they went into it with:

Her - approx $25,000 total assets
He - approx $15,000 net debt

Upon assessing marital assets the first time, it seemed that:
House, value $80,000
Mortgage debt $120,000
Two cars worth no more than the loans on them
His lines of credit at $95,000 debt, maxxed out
His gear $20,000
Her simple possessions essentially without market value

So, at this point, the total net worth of the two combined was negative $115,000

Each person, therefore would "share" $57500 in debt when they divorced.
In his case, he'd add his pre-existing $15k and owe $72,500 total
She would take the $57500 and add her pre-existing $25,000 and owe $32,500.

To her, that $32.5k debt was astronomical...she didn't think of numbers that big! Remember this was the 1990s, not today. Her income of $14,000 would have been adequate for her lifestyle if she rented a small apartment with the daughter, but saddled with that much debt!!!

The way the court worked it out included giving her the house, and requiring him to secure financing to pay off the mortgage, so the house could be in her name free and clear. This unbalanced the equation - now his debt leaving the marriage was far more than hers...so to compensate for that, he did not have to pay either child support or alimony.

So, she got - a house. And that was no gift.

It took a team of a dozen of us a year to make that house sale-worthy. It had been purchased cheaply because it was in an undesirable area and not in very good shape. We carefully assessed "reasonable" for the neighborhood which thankfully had started becoming gentrified. All we did constituted repairs, she insisted on paying for materials, which were about $15,000. The house sold for that $80k, but before we descended upon it, it was unsellable - literally - too many code violations.

So she was then 45, no noteworthy assets, no noteworthy education and a child 4 years away from college.

I don't know how she resolved things eventually, because the next year, she and child moved to Florida to be with her parents as they entered their final years. I think the family had money, and she was an only child, so it probably worked out.


I saw a couple of 'morals' to her story...

- If you plan to live the kind of life that requires money - don't ignore money. Attempt to evaluate your net worth at least once a year
- Make sure both spouses are aware of the couplehood's income, spending, and debt
- Make sure there IS a financial goal (e.g. save $30,000 for the kids college by 2021) and when you do the annual review, check progress toward that
- Avoid debt like the plague. 
- Know your spouse!!! Hard to imagine having been married 15 years and not noticing that your spouse believed they were mis-gendered at birth.
- I hate to say this, but unless you know you have the world's most perfect marriage, stay aware of how divorces tend to work, so that you have at least an inkling of an idea of what to do to prepare and survive one.


IMO, understanding the fundamental methods of how courts approach marital assets is not a tiny point - it's the starting point, from which all else derives, for D.



As it turns out, I had been operating on a very different divorce plan, but didn't even know it. I struggle with organization and completing things - I'm told I have ADHD. As with many others with ADHD, I am blessed with excess amounts of IQ points. My rate of "saves" at the last minute is quite high...although I didn't know this until after my split. When I was 40 and with no net worth and realized that retirement was now much closer than when I started working, I decided it was time to learn how to invest. Took little time to find methods of trading that multiplied nicely, and learned that the key to success isn't a good trading formula, but being so conservative that even if a deal goes bad, it can't hurt much...preservation. I didn't like doing it, but I did it enough years to build up a net worth that, if not abused, will see me well into retirement.

So, one possible "plan" is to be so open-minded that you're willing to learn whatever it takes to recover.


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