# 20 years later



## hillj225 (Dec 20, 2012)

I taken a new job out of state and my wife won't be able to join me until the spring due to job and other reasons. I have been away for 2 months now and am visiting for the holidays. 5 days ago while having some cuddle time I asked her out of the blue had she ever cheated on , me. She paused briefley and said she had something to tell me. She confessed to an affair that happened about 20 years ago. This was while I was deployed to Korea. She went on th say she couldn't remember who he was but recalled vague details about him as time went on. She said it was horrible, she didn't enjoy it. Never saw him again, said he was stupid and on and on. I am still in a state of shock with all kinds of questions. She has excellent recall about things but says she is not going to talk about it because she has carried it for 20 years and won't carry it any longer. I don't feel she has any regards to what I am feeling. Like I said, right now I am numb and don't know how to proceed. Anyone else been where I am now?


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## doc_martin (Oct 19, 2012)

hillj225 said:


> She has excellent recall about things but says she is not going to talk about it because she has carried it for 20 years and won't carry it any longer.


But isn't telling you talking about it? That seems pretty mean to just give you the quick and dirty version but deny a chance a true disclosure. 

I guess it just goes to show that no matter how much time goes by, Dday is always Dday. 

I wish you luck. Try to focus on how the marriage has been for the last 20 years. It is unlikely worth throwing that away, but try to explain to her that a bomb like this can't be left on your porch unexploded.


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## LetDownNTX (Oct 4, 2012)

hillj225 said:


> I taken a new job out of state and my wife won't be able to join me until the spring due to job and other reasons. I have been away for 2 months now and am visiting for the holidays. 5 days ago while having some cuddle time I asked her out of the blue had she ever cheated on , me. She paused briefley and said she had something to tell me. She confessed to an affair that happened about 20 years ago. This was while I was deployed to Korea. She went on th say she couldn't remember who he was but recalled vague details about him as time went on. She said it was horrible, she didn't enjoy it. Never saw him again, said he was stupid and on and on. I am still in a state of shock with all kinds of questions. She has excellent recall about things but says she is not going to talk about it because she has carried it for 20 years and won't carry it any longer. I don't feel she has any regards to what I am feeling. Like I said, right now I am numb and don't know how to proceed. Anyone else been where I am now?


What a terrible thing to have to find out 20 years later. For her its history but its new to you. She needs to be compassionate of how it has made you feel.

I dont think that if I held something for 20 years like that that it would ever slip out of my mouth. I can imagine the shock you felt hearing it come out of her mouth after all this time.

Im sure its going to be hard to go back to work with this in your lap.


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## hillj225 (Dec 20, 2012)

We have 5 days to talk about and work something out. I want to talk about it and find out why, how etc. but she keeps insisting she doesn't remember. I am hurt more than angry and just want to know why and how. Our marraige will make it but I want to talk about it and try to understand the emotions I am likely to experience.


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## Stonewall (Jul 5, 2011)

If she won't talk about it and takes that kind of attitude. You have a big problem. She should be contrite and tell you anything and everything about it to begin the healing. If not she is not remorseful.


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

I would suggest she go to get a polygraph test then. She doesn't want to talk about it? She does not sound remorseful whatsoever.


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## hillj225 (Dec 20, 2012)

tom67 said:


> I would suggest she go to get a polygraph test then. She doesn't want to talk about it? She does not sound remorseful whatsoever.


_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## hillj225 (Dec 20, 2012)

It's as if she is saying "that was 20 years now deal with it"!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## MysticMouse (Dec 17, 2012)

hillj225 said:


> It's as if she is saying "that was 20 years now deal with it"!
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Tell her the affair was 20 years ago but the lie has been the past 20 years.


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

hillj225 said:


> It's as if she is saying "that was 20 years now deal with it"!
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Yea she's basically saying ef you! See if she passes the polygraph if asked if this was her only affair because I'm sure you feel right now you can't believe a thing she says.


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## alte Dame (Aug 7, 2012)

I would be firm and say that she has no choice. She did your marriage no honor when she slept with another man. Now it's time to honor it by telling you everything you want to know.


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## walkonmars (Aug 21, 2012)

She got the monkey off her back. And put it on yours to deal with - and just wants you to forget about it now that her conscience is clear. 

Tell her to get some paper and write out all the details. She remembers a whole lot more than she's saying. Tell her you've been happy with her for the last twenty years ( if you have). And you look forward to the next twenty, but it can't be with secrets. 

Give her a few days to do this. See what she comes up with.


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## snap (Oct 3, 2011)

What a b*tch move. Tells enough to relieve her guilt, doesn't give much a damn about you.

She does remember everything.


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## MrMathias (Nov 19, 2012)

It's new news to you. She *owes* you time to process it. It's a massive bomb drop like no other. 

It could be very true that she doesn't remember much, especially if she's telling the truth about it being a bad experience. I had smoking hot sex with a former GF seventeen years ago... I knew it was hot then, and now, but I recall very little. I don't think about it. 

I think it is good she told you.


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## iJordan (May 8, 2012)

hillj225 said:


> She has excellent recall about things but *says she is not going to talk about it because she has carried it for 20 years and won't carry it any longer.*


This sort of s h i t makes my blood boil and it occurs far too often with cheating spouses. Equating the 'pain' they've went through carrying their affair to the _actual_ pain they caused the betrayed spouse is contemptible and shows a fundamental lack of remorse. 

You should tell her straight that she doesn't get a choice in whether she talks about it or not; she will tell you everything—and as many time as you want to hear it.


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## snap (Oct 3, 2011)

If she was still guilty all those 20 years about it, she does remember it everything.

Also, it's really worth asking why she spilled the beans now.


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## DWM (Sep 27, 2012)

This is replaying my last few months. My stbxw probably told me of an incident 20 years ago (letting a co-worker seduce her and admitted to kissing ) because she didn't care anymore what I thought of her anymore because she was planning to leave soon anyway. All her other actions were not demonstrating any contrition but she was establishing new boundaries (stopping visibility on her e-mail and bank account etc which simply made me more suspicious) and eventually used a pretext to justify her final walking out.


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## Toffer (Jan 31, 2012)

Wow. Just Wow!

This woman was able to face you every day for 20 years and lie to your face and now she wants you to "get over" it?


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## Dad&Hubby (Aug 14, 2012)

I'd take a WHOLE different stance.

I'd focus on the lie, and how she's lied to you up until the moment of confessing and start threatening kicking her out etc.

She's playing a power trip over this. YOU need control over this. You have to deal with it. Start talking divorce and how you're going to keep your options open when you go away etc. Put the fear of "g0d" in her. Tell her STEP 1 (make sure you allow yourself the ability to go further) you need full disclosure for you to even CONSIDER staying with a liar of a wife.


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## WasDecimated (Mar 23, 2011)

Dad&Hubby said:


> I'd take a WHOLE different stance.
> 
> I'd focus on the lie, and how she's lied to you up until the moment of confessing and start threatening kicking her out etc.
> 
> She's playing a power trip over this. YOU need control over this. You have to deal with it. Start talking divorce and how you're going to keep your options open when you go away etc. Put the fear of "g0d" in her. Tell her STEP 1 (make sure you allow yourself the ability to go further) you need full disclosure for you to even CONSIDER staying with a liar of a wife.


I'm sorry you find yourself here on TAM. You have joined an elite group of folks whose great burden in life is that they were disrespected in the worst possible way...by the one who promised to honer, love and respect them.

I agree. The good thing is she told you. The bad thing is, well....everything else. It took her 20 years to tell you the truth but she doesn't seem to have any remorse or empathy. I would take a hard line with her. It doesn't matter how long ago she did this...it is all new to you. A while back there was a 90 year old guy in Europe that divorced his wife for cheating back in the 1940's. Cheating is cheating! There is no statute of limitations on infidelity. You need to find out if this was an isolated incident or just the tip of the iceberg.


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

If she is going to keep up this attitude tell her the marriage is on hold as well as her moving in with you in the spring. Take your time to decide what YOU want.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

I think you somehow need to differentiate between what she cannot recall, vs what she will not talk about.

I can accept, for example, that if she was drunk or whatever she might not remember much. And if she is guilty she might have blocked stuff out. So I don't necessarily agree with those who think she remembers everything.

But I would zoom in on this bit:



> She has excellent recall about things but says she is not going to talk about it because she has carried it for 20 years and won't carry it any longer.


I would be tempted to say you will not accept this, that she has to tell you everything she knows. 

You have five days....if it were me I would probably disappear without her for a day, and ask her to use that day to write down all she remembers. If she refuses, I might suggest she go home so you can have time to process this new information.

I'm not suggesting this lightly. When it fully hits you are going to have a whole lot of emotions, and I don't believe it's likely you could live with the current situation. Your wife probably doesn't get this either. The point of sending her home is to make her realise that the current situation is unacceptable to you. 

And you should do whatever you do in a way that is natural to you, but as much as you can I would keep the tone of things calm. Aggression gets people's backs up. Sending her away without visible anger...refusing to be with her when you have been apart so much, and in this season, will probably be far more worrying.

But, bottom line, at least she told you. Don't crush that fragile positive carelessly.


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

> She has excellent recall about things but says she is not going to talk about it because she has carried it for 20 years and won't carry it any longer.


And you will carry it for the rest of your life. The details aren't for her. They are for you!!


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## 67flh (Sep 26, 2011)

i call horsecrap on this one,"if" your wife isn't a hoe she knows EXACTLY who he was. woman don't cheat 1 time in a marriage and not know who he is.i'm guessing he is someone real close to your family.


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## Machiavelli (Feb 25, 2012)

67flh said:


> i call horsecrap on this one,"if" your wife isn't a hoe she knows EXACTLY who he was. woman don't cheat 1 time in a marriage and not know who he is.i'm guessing he is someone real close to your family.


No. This story is just a bone she's tossing out, which in her mind, relieves her of the burden of secrecy. Nevertheless, there's probably much, and many, more to the story. Women minimize, minimize, minimize. OP was deployed for a year.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

Betrayed Spouse Bill of Rights

30 Oct 2008 39 Comments

by jemjesterin adultery, betrayal, life, recoveryTags: affair, betrayed, cheating, infidelity, recovery, rights, self respect


I posted this today on a support board and felt I should share it here.

Betrayed Spouses Bill of Rights
In a world where a marriage is as likely to end as not, we sometimes forget what a partnership is in the early days after discovery of infidelity. We lose ourselves in the desperation to hold onto your loved one. Remembering your rights will help you no matter which path your marriage takes.

1- You have a right to the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth. By having an affair, your spouse has closed off the relationship with you and opened one with the OP (other person). You have a right to insist this is reversed for your healing and to assure that loyalties have been realigned.

2- You have the right to trust- but verify. Trust has been broken, ‘snooping’ is not snooping. It is verifying that someone proven to be a liar, sneak and cheat has changed their ways. Like an addict, a WS(wayward spouse) will often go back to their emotional fix. You have a right to verify this is not happening.

3- You have the right to insist there are only two people in the marriage. That choice was made when you made vows to each other. Even a moment with a third person is too much. You owe your WS no time to ‘think about it’. There’s a marriage or there’s none.

4- You have a right to know who the OP is, the flip of this is you do not have a right to harm or harass this person. Hold yourself to a better standard than the OP did.

5- You have the right to choose to give the gift of reconciliation or to divorce. You have the right to take some time to make that choice. If you one day realize you cannot live with the truth of what has been done, you have the right to walk away.

6- You have the right to insist your WS gets STD testing done and to see the results. Even if the WS claims it has not gotten physical, as many WSs will admit to “only a kiss” when it has gone much further.

7- You have the right to insist that your WS initiates and honors NC (no contact) immediately. You have a right to have input and to be a witness to how NC is established.

8- You have a right to set and enforce boundaries. This is not blackmail or any of the other negative words your WS might use. This you protecting yourself.

9- You have a right to hold onto evidence for as long as you need it to feel safe. Your WS has created an atmosphere of risk and danger. It is natural to have a safety net to counteract what has been brought into your marriage.

10- You have a right to know who your WS’s friends are and the nature of their interactions. If it is kept a secret, it is not healthy for the marriage and therefore something is amiss.

11- You have the right to out the affair to anyone you deem will help you and/or your marriage. This is not your secret to keep, this is not your shame to hold. You owe no protection to those that failed to protect you.

12- You have a right to heal on your timeline. As long as you are making steady progress, you are healing. It is a slow process and a WS that says things along the lines of, “You’ll never get over this!” does not have a full grasp of the damage betrayal causes. This is a healing process that takes from 18 months to five years.

13- You have a right to yell, cry, fall apart and otherwise handle this in any way that relieves some of the devastating pain, shock and loss of trust. Your world has been turned on its end. You do not have the right to physically, verbally or otherwise abuse your spouse.

14- You have the right to insist on a true marriage. A marriage of partners, where you love, honor and protect each other. If you feel your marriage is missing one of these components, either fixing it or leaving are your only two options. You don’t have the right to cheat and/or turn someone else into a betrayed spouse.

15- You have a right to love yourself. Often the betrayed have forgotten themselves as an individual. This is the optimum time to remind yourself that you are unique and lovable in your own right. That as much as you might love your spouse, you should love yourself enough to refuse any sort of mistreatment.


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## Remains (Jan 24, 2012)

OP, I hope she is talking to you. What your wife did was not a guilt ridden unburdening. It was cruel. Very. I don't know why she would do that, come out with it after all this time and then refuse to talk. Only reason I can think is she has been threatened with being outed. Has she fallen out with someone recently? Or has someone come back in your life after a long time out of it?


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## Acoa (Sep 21, 2012)

She doesn't remember, she didn't enjoy it, it didn't mean anything, it was a long time ago.

This are all things she is saying to minimize the affair. Let her know that when she tries to minimize the affair it maximizes the impact on you as the BS. 

Minimization efforts make it seem like the WS thinks it wasn't so bad and next will come the "aren't you over it yet" stuff.

My WW wife and I are 7 months past DDay and last week was the 1st time she really owned up to the severity of her actions.


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## hillj225 (Dec 20, 2012)

I again made an attempt to talk about it last night but it the conversation crashed and burned. She actually played the victim and accused me of making her secondary in the marraige. As some of you stated, she is minimizing this whole thing as nothing. In a nut shell all she tells me is, "I went to the club, I had a little to drink and was not drunk or high, we went to a hotel, he used a condom, I didn't enjoy it, it was the worst 15 minutes of my life, I never saw him again". She keeps saying she is not going to tell me anymore and get over it. I really love her and will not throw away 25 years of joy but I want to get thru this. Her story just doesn't add up.


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## Acoa (Sep 21, 2012)

Yeah, it definitely sounds like there is more to it. She brings it up then wants to bury it again? Sounds fishy.


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## Plan 9 from OS (Jul 13, 2012)

hillj225 said:


> I again made an attempt to talk about it last night but it the conversation crashed and burned. She actually played the victim and accused me of making her secondary in the marraige. As some of you stated, she is minimizing this whole thing as nothing. In a nut shell all she tells me is, "I went to the club, I had a little to drink and was not drunk or high, we went to a hotel, he used a condom, I didn't enjoy it, it was the worst 15 minutes of my life, I never saw him again". *She keeps saying she is not going to tell me anymore and get over it. I really love her and will not throw away 25 years of joy but I want to get thru this. Her story just doesn't add up.*


Surely your wife doesn't believe that after dropping this bombshell on you that you are supposed to simply get over it. I'd tell her that if she insists on you getting over it, she may not like your choice on how you get over it if you know what I mean. Keep in mind that your marriage is nowhere near as strong as you thought it was if wife admits to having an affair yet berates you because you are having a hard time processing this new info.


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## Dad&Hubby (Aug 14, 2012)

Machiavelli said:


> No. This story is just a bone she's tossing out, which in her mind, relieves her of the burden of secrecy. Nevertheless, there's probably much, and many, more to the story. Women minimize, minimize, minimize. OP was deployed for a year.


I was thinking the exact same thing. She may be feeling guilt over being an unfaithful wife as a whole (as in even recently) and by confessing to an affair 20 years ago, that she can't remember and that you both should just move on from, it lets the pressure out of the cooker if you will.


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## iJordan (May 8, 2012)

She didn't give this information unsolicited; he asked her out of the blue and she responded. This situation is extremely plausible at face value without the need to conjecture numerous affairs. The likely reason she admitted to her ONS is that she felt enough time had passed to own up _and_ get away with it (i.e., _'it was 20 years ago; you're not going to throw away 20 years of marriage, blah, blah, blah...'_).

The real problem is that hillj225's wife should be showing some shame; she should be begging for forgiveness and wallowing in contrition. Instead, she is rug-sweeping. He needs to grab his balls and tell her that for the acute future, she no longer gets a say in what she tells him—he will state what he wants to know and she will dutifully respond without reciting that b u l l s h i t cheater's script.

Stop being walked over, hillj225. You're likely wearing this _'I really love her and will not throw away 25 years of joy'_ on your sleeve and she's aware of it. Drive the severity of her betrayal home and make her accountable for her actions.


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## Kallan Pavithran (Jan 17, 2012)

iJordan said:


> She didn't give this information unsolicited; he asked her out of the blue and she responded. This situation is extremely plausible at face value without the need to conjecture numerous affairs. The likely reason she admitted to her ONS is that she felt enough time had passed to own up _and_ get away with it (i.e., _'it was 20 years ago; you're not going to throw away 20 years of marriage, blah, blah, blah...'_).
> 
> T*he real problem is that hillj225's wife should be showing some shame; she should be begging for forgiveness and wallowing in contrition. Instead, she is rug-sweeping. He needs to grab his balls and tell her that for the acute future, she no longer gets a say in what she tells him—he will state what he wants to know and she will dutifully respond without reciting that b u l l s h i t cheater's script.*
> 
> Stop being walked over, hillj225. You're likely wearing this _'I really love her and will not throw away 25 years of joy'_ on your sleeve and she's aware of it. Drive the severity of her betrayal home and make her accountable for her actions.




Read this many times and digest it. This is the best advice for you.

She is not remorseful and dont allow her to blameshift and take away the focus of your discussion to something else.

She is in TT and minimising.
A polygraph will be the best for you.


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## hillj225 (Dec 20, 2012)

Reaching down and grabbing them and standing up like I need to. Thanks for the advice and let the chips fall where they may.


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## Cdelta02 (Sep 20, 2012)

Seems like she is on her way out.

Ask her if its ok if you did the same and gave her no additional info. If she says yes, then you know above is true.


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## kenmoore14217 (Apr 8, 2010)

" "I went to the club, I had a little to drink and was not drunk or high, we went to a hotel, he used a condom, I didn't enjoy it, it was the worst 15 minutes of my life, I never saw him again"."



THAT'S A LOT OF REMEMBERING FOR NOT REMEMBERING!! 
CURIOUS: WHY DID YOU ASK IN THE FIRST PLACE. (SORRY IN ADVANCE IF I MISSED THIS)


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## hillj225 (Dec 20, 2012)

Why did I ask in the first place? It just came out of nowhere. I was actually playing. Now that I look back, she is always accusing me of being unfaithful sayings she would understand if I was. She says I'm a handsome man and woman would throw themselves at me if I was available. She has been abusive in the past but we have gotten over those past episodes. I've never given her a reason to think I have a girlfriend but she use to bring that up a lot in the past and now occassionally. She teases me about falling for some woman where my job is now. It all kind of makes sense that she projects how she feels onto me.


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## 3putt (Dec 3, 2012)

hillj225 said:


> Why did I ask in the first place? It just came out of nowhere. I was actually playing. Now that I look back, she is always accusing me of being unfaithful sayings she would understand if I was. She says I'm a handsome man and woman would throw themselves at me if I was available. She has been abusive in the past but we have gotten over those past episodes. I've never given her a reason to think I have a girlfriend but she use to bring that up a lot in the past and now occassionally. She teases me about falling for some woman where my job is now. It all kind of makes sense that she projects how she feels onto me.


I believe a lot of this is directly attributable to 20 years of lies and deceit. No one with a conscience can carry this kind of load for this length of time without it oozing out in some form or fashion. The problem she has right now is, until she completely unloads, she's still going to be carrying around a lot of dead, guilty weight. And now that the cat is out the bag, things will continue to get worse and worse, because now their are 2 suffering instead of just one.

Half truths are often times more devastating than the lie itself. Why? Because now our imaginations are taking over filling in the gaps that she refuses to fill. It's human nature, and unless she comes completely clean, your imagination is going to go into turbo mode and it will make this out to be one helluva lot worse than it really is.

She better come to grips with this. And soon.


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## hillj225 (Dec 20, 2012)

@3putt You hit the nail on the head. The meter on my imagination is in the red and I told her so. I play this thing out over and over in my head and it is not getting any better. She is at work and keeps texting me how sorry she is and saying she wants me to forgive her. I will but forgetting is another story. I tell my self if you don't want to hear the answer then don't ask the question. I know I will continue to be angry but I wll not let her walk on me and I told her that. Still got a hand full and am squeezing.


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## loveisforever (Jun 21, 2012)

hillj225 said:


> I again made an attempt to talk about it last night but it the conversation crashed and burned. She actually played the victim and accused me of making her secondary in the marraige. As some of you stated, she is minimizing this whole thing as nothing. In a nut shell all she tells me is, "I went to the club, I had a little to drink and was not drunk or high, we went to a hotel, he used a condom, I didn't enjoy it, it was the worst 15 minutes of my life, I never saw him again". She keeps saying she is not going to tell me anymore and get over it. I really love her and will not throw away 25 years of joy but I want to get thru this. Her story just doesn't add up.


"She keeps saying she is not going to tell me anymore and get over it. "

Unbelievable! That is her attitude toward you after PA and 20 years of lying? Do you see any respect for you as a husband? And you still want to stay in the marriage "AS IS"? Get a self-respect for yourself! You teach how your wife treat you. 

If this is OK and you do not put marriage on the line, that means you are too weak to stand for yourself as her ONLY husband! You just allow her to clear her conscience to go F* whoever she likes.

And she also justify this as if you are such a person when she tease you about your fooling around. She sees you as such a low moral person as her and you have not slapped her face by strong words.

"I really love her and will not throw away 25 years of joy " Really? 20 years of lying has nothing to do with your " joy"? Be decent and self-respect, not a slave to your "joy".


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## 3putt (Dec 3, 2012)

hillj225 said:


> Still got a hand full and am squeezing.


hill, I would make it very simple for her. Let her know that you will no longer consider staying in a marriage with someone that has so little respect for you and your feelings. You have a right to full disclosure on what happened, verified by a polygraph. If she refuses, then tell her to be prepared for ending the marriage.

Maybe she can live with the continual lying, but I highly doubt you can.

She still thinks she's in control of the situation. I would disabuse her of that notion straight away.


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

Have you asked her if she wants to know today to in 20 years if you decide to have a revenge one night stand? 

Her story is way to neat and tidy. She admits to not being drunk or high, so she's made a conscious choice to cheat. She claims the guy was bad in bed so she didn't keep doing it. All nice an tidy. She's cheater, but she claims to have chosen to not cheat again because the guy was bad.

Notice she doesn't claim to have stopped because she chose you. She stopped because the guy was bad in bed. He was good enough at the bar, and on the way to his room. He was even good enough to get naked with, but he sucked in bed so she decided not to cheat again?

Sorry, there no remorse in there at all. There isn't even empathy at all for how you are hurting her. None at all. That alone should have you thinking that perhaps this marriage hasn't got a lot of love, respect or future in it.

What I mean is 20 years ago she cared so little for you that she chose to cheat.

Now 20 years later, she cares so little for you that she has no empathy for your pain.

See a pattern and problem here?


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

hillj225 said:


> She is at work and keeps texting me how sorry she is and saying she wants me to forgive her. .



See how even how it's about HER. It's about her being forgiven. It's about her getting back to nice piece she had before you found out. It's about her getting through this with the least stress and coming out of it looking the best she can.

It's not about her helping you deal and heal at all.


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## 3putt (Dec 3, 2012)

Shaggy said:


> See how even how it's about HER. It's about her being forgiven. It's about her getting back to nice piece she had before you found out. *It's about her getting through this with the least stress and coming out of it looking the best she can.
> *
> It's not about her helping you deal and heal at all.


True words, and the quickest way to deal a death blow to this mindset is to start informing your family and children of what is going on and why. She hasn't just lied to you, but everyone else as well.


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## AngryandUsed (Jun 23, 2011)

Hillj225,

I was you in Jan 2011.
I don't believe that she just got drunk and had a 15 minutes sexual encounter with an unknown man. Sorry, it just doesn't add up. You know this only too well.

In my case, my wife said it was an EA for about her2.5 years and it never went physical and she is swearing on kids.

Now, don't get angry.

Get the truth. You have no way of digging any evidence at this stage....

It has to come from her. Until then, try to control your emotions, dear.

Hard. Patience will help unfolding the canvas.

I can feel where you are now.


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

Shaggy said:


> See how even how it's about HER. It's about her being forgiven. It's about her getting back to nice piece she had before you found out. It's about her getting through this with the least stress and coming out of it looking the best she can.
> 
> It's not about her helping you deal and heal at all.


I know you are leaving soon but try next week to schedule a polygraph test for her at least bring it up and see how she reacts.


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## Mr Blunt (Jul 18, 2012)

> I went to the club, I had a little to drink and was not drunk or high, we went to a hotel, he used a condom, I didn't enjoy it, it was the worst 15 minutes of my life, I never saw him again". She keeps saying she is not going to tell me anymore and get over it.
> 
> The meter on my imagination is in the red and I told her so. I play this thing out over and over in my head and it is not getting any better. She is at work and keeps texting me how sorry she is and saying she wants me to forgive her.




If your wife is really sorry and wants to help you then her top priority is going to be giving you as much support as she can. The way you have worded her reactions seem to be that she is not considering you enough.

As much as possible she needs to answer your questions; the questions should be to help you but not to get all the details, if any, that would give you triggers and emotional hell for the rest of your life.

The major issues you now know and that is that she betrayed you. You do not need to know how many organisms she/he had, was it the best sex she ever had, how big his d!ck was, etc. Get as much information that will help understand more and convince you that it was a one time thing and that she has never had any more affairs in the last 20 years. That will be eventually the information that will help you the most. If she will not help you in those areas it is going to be very bad for your relatuionship. If there are more betrayals then that is a whole other story!

*If there is no more to it than a one night stand and she has been faithful and a good wife for the last 20 years, you have a lot to work with*. She should realize that she needs to give you everything she has got to help you recover. She may have good reasons for herself for acting like the affair was a long time ago and the wounds in her may have seared over a bit but your hurts are fresh wounds and she put them there and she need to do all that she can to help you. If she does not she can expect a very rough time for you and that will spill over on to her.

If it was a one night stand, it was the worse 15 minutes of her life, she never saw than man again, and she never had any other ONS, then she needs to reassure you over and over again how she will continue to be faithful to you and then do double work on her ACTIONS to prove it for the next 20 years.
I did notice that you said that she talked a lot about you having an affair and that would be a concern to me if I were you.

*Only get information that will help you; do not get non-productive information that will give your imagination triggers that will rip your heart apart for the next 20-30 years.* Do not be like a moth drawn to the flame.


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## RWB (Feb 6, 2010)

hillj225 said:


> She confessed to an affair that happened about 20 years ago. This was while I was deployed to Korea. She went on to say she couldn't remember who he was but recalled vague details about him as time went on. She said it was horrible, she didn't enjoy it.


Hill,

Hear a truth about cheaters... ONS are rarely the truth. Cheater are rarely stop with one affair. Don't be suprized if there is much more to the story.


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## alte Dame (Aug 7, 2012)

I would suggest that there is more calculation in her confession than you know. If you can get to the bottom of exactly why she told you this after all these years, I think you will start to uncover some things about what is happening right now with her. I suspect she's preparing the groundwork for something.


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

alte Dame said:


> I would suggest that there is more calculation in her confession than you know. If you can get to the bottom of exactly why she told you this after all these years, I think you will start to uncover some things about what is happening right now with her. *I suspect she's preparing the groundwork for something.*


Well he did ask but I agree.

She was unfaithful when he was deployed years ago and now he is effectively deployed / gone for extended periods now.

Even if what she says is close to the truth, it is not something one just gets over and leaves.

It makes you wonder if she still intends to follow him. Maybe she wants an out. Maybe she just blurted out the affair and then realized she was not prepared to deal with it with him.


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## theroad (Feb 20, 2012)

Said before, but will say again. Schedule a polygraph test. Tell WW the date. As the day gets close WW will trickle truth some more info in the hopes to get you to cancel the test.

Don't cancel tell her it is on to confirm what she has said.


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## walkonmars (Aug 21, 2012)

RWB said:


> Hill,
> 
> Hear a truth about cheaters... ONS are rarely the truth. Cheater are rarely stop with one affair. Don't be suprized if there is much more to the story.


Agree. What makes this more likely than not is your statement that she's accused you of cheating in the past. Thieves often think everyone else is stealing. Same with cheaters. 

Keep squeezing and harden your spirit.


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## 3putt (Dec 3, 2012)

Entropy3000 said:


> Maybe she just blurted out the affair and then realized she was not prepared to deal with it with him.


I think this may prove to be prophetic when it all comes out. Pretty sure she's been dying to get this out, but was expecting more of a response like, "Well, it was 20 years ago", and then he just drops it or asks minimal questions.

I don't think she was counting on that, while it was 20 years ago for her, it's in the here and now for him. That's, I believe, where the anger is coming from. She was expecting a lazy curve ball response and he came with a high and tight heater.


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## WonderHow (Dec 17, 2012)

So a few things to think about:

1. I don't know about you, but I can recall in great detail almost all of the women I slept with (most of them > 20 years ago). Some even that were picked up when in bars at college where - you know - lots of drink was had as part of it. She is minimizing.

2. If you were the BW maybe hooking up for a ONS would make sense. But women rarely just go out and bang different dudes. Sure it happens but there's usually a lot more emotional stuff that happens as part of it.

3. A friend who gave me some very sage advice as I was navigating my d-day told me how he found out his wife was having an affair. Turns out she admitted to an affair 20 years ago to throw him off the trail of the affair she was currently having. If you've recently left town for work and she has proven that "when the cats away..." perhaps she is doing something similar.

You've heard lots and lots of people on this thread say you're not getting the full story and I can almost guarantee you've only touched the tip of this sh1t iceberg.


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## mel123 (Aug 4, 2012)

michzz said:


> Don't let her off the hook. She knows exactly everything about it. His name, how often they met, why she did it.
> 
> If she opened the can of worms she must dump it all out to whatever level you need to know.


:iagree:

She knows exactly who the OM is, it more than likely started out as an EA then went physical over a period of several months. 

You may know him also,but never suspected him banging your W.

sorry you are going through this


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## workindad (May 7, 2011)

Sorry you are going through this. I absolutely agree with the polygraph. You may be surprised what she "remembers" in the parking lot. Do not tell her in advance when scheduled, just drive her there and explain when you park the car. 

Good luck
WD


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## hillj225 (Dec 20, 2012)

workindad said:


> Sorry you are going through this. I absolutely agree with the polygraph. You may be surprised what she "remembers" in the parking lot. Do not tell her in advance when scheduled, just drive her there and explain when you park the car.
> 
> Good luck.
> I will be departing today to go back to my new job early. She insist on lashing out at me and refuses to takee responsibility and at least discuss it. It appears her plan all along was a way out. Looks like a long emotional road ahead but it begins with this first step. I am calling her bluff and let the chips
> ...


_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

Divorce should be an option. Let her know that. 

99-Year-Old Italian Man to Become World's Oldest Divorcé - Yahoo! News


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

hillj225 said:


> Why did I ask in the first place? It just came out of nowhere. I was actually playing. Now that I look back, she is always accusing me of being unfaithful sayings she would understand if I was. She says I'm a handsome man and woman would throw themselves at me if I was available. She has been abusive in the past but we have gotten over those past episodes. I've never given her a reason to think I have a girlfriend but she use to bring that up a lot in the past and now occassionally. She teases me about falling for some woman where my job is now. It all kind of makes sense that she projects how she feels onto me.


All the chips fall into place now, don't they ? 

At this point, it is likely more than a one night stand or worse more than one man.. She confessed the minimum when you caught her off guard.


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## dogman (Jul 24, 2012)

Shes a wimp when it comes to breaking up with you so she's trying to get you to do it. Several things may be true.

1. She cheated more and this is the tip of it. She wants you to leave her.

2. She is involved with someone else and this is the tip of what she wants the issue to be. She wants you to leave her.

3. She never cheated, it's made up that's why details are so vague. She has someone she wants to see on the side and...she wants you to leave her.

I think she wants you to leave her. Find out why.

I cheated on a girlfriend once, I admitted to it when I had to but the story was totally made up. The truth would have revealed so much more. So I admitted a totally false story to offset the truth.

The problem is remembering the lie you told. So the story becomes very vague over time. So the lesson is, if you lie keep it simple and vague. Try not to give names for them to check the facts elsewhere. It sucks, I know but I've grown up since then.


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## hillj225 (Dec 20, 2012)

I did not mention it but we have a daughter who is a senior in high school. That is part of the reason I have not left. My oldest son who is in another state just booked me a room at the mariott. I get to spend a couple more days with her. What a lousy way to spend what is supposed to be a joyus family time. The children don't know but they know something is very wrong. Our blow ups do not happen when our daughter is at home.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## TCx (Dec 15, 2011)

Wow. 95% of this thread has been conjecture and accusation without any basis in fact or information. I find that to be despicable.

I agree that she needs to come clean. And the fact that she blurted it out when you asked out of the blue leads me to believe that she's wanted to get it out for a long time and you provided her with the opportunity.

Of course she's going to rug sweep; she's been doing it for 20 years. It is a behavior that has demonstrated itself, for 20 years, work to protect her. That's called behavior reinforcement. What, you think that just because he asked she's going to blurt it all out?

She doesn't want to talk about it because she is protecting herself. You can't expect her, after 20 years, to just say "OMGOSH! I've hurt you!!!" because she's dealing with 20 years of repressed guilt and shame. And until she's made peace with herself she's not going to be able to focus on you. People are selfish. We ALWAYS satisfy ourselves before others, that is the law of nature (though most deny it). Sad but true.

So you have two ways forward. You can either decide to work through this together or you can work through this yourself by beating her with a stick by threatening divorce, polygraph tests, etc. But with each escalation you make it more and more impossible for the two of you to relate on the subject.

SHE IS GOING TO LIE TO YOU. Can you accept that?

Yes, a nuke has just gone off in your life. What happens if you start throwing nukes back? M.A.D.

The more you attack her, the more she will regress back in her shell and try to hide from the problem. That's how people work. You attack them and they defend themselves.

I know that you're hurting and that you haven't had any time to work through the pain but also consider that she's scared ****less too. Give her a non-threatening atmosphere to talk in (like you did with the cuddling and question) and she will trickle truth you but it will come out just the same.

Think about it, you going nuclear on her has DEMONSTRATED to her that you will react with anger and cause a fight if she's honest with you. Naturally she is going to want to avoid that behavior! And now, with each lie, she is digging herself further and further into guilt and she's feeling more and more cornered. Of course she is going to lie even more!

IMHO, before you schedule the polygraph and start escalating to divorce, maybe try something less threatening like IC for yourself (to help deal with the hurt you're going through) and MC for the two of you to give each of you a safe place to talk. If you lash out at her, explain why you lashed out at her.

This only has to be a power struggle if you decide that it has to be. You are obviously hurt and need to sort through your own pain and as your wife, it is her responsibility to help and support you with that. And that means talking about it. Tell her your needs and the truth will come... slowly.


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## TCx (Dec 15, 2011)

Also, can i ask you a question?

That you are hurt/angry is without question. But how much of the anger and aggression that you're feeling right now is genuinely yours and how much of it has been worked up by the posts here? Or how has the conjecture in this thread affected your personal well being?

I ask not so that you will question your own viewpoint but because I'm truly interested in the psyche of the BS. How much of your mind is now filled with thoughts like, "she's trying to leave me but is too cowardly", "she has had multiple affairs", "she is a liar that has been lying to me for 20 years", and how has that affected how you interact with your W?


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

hillj225 said:


> @3putt You hit the nail on the head. The meter on my imagination is in the red and I told her so. I play this thing out over and over in my head and it is not getting any better. She is at work and keeps texting me how sorry she is and saying she wants me to forgive her. I will but forgetting is another story. I tell my self if you don't want to hear the answer then don't ask the question. I know I will continue to be angry but I wll not let her walk on me and I told her that. Still got a hand full and am squeezing.


Hill

I am glad you love your wife. She is going to need that love now.

Tough Love!

Have you realized yet that her memory is coming back now Hill?

Keep pressing now. Get all the facts. She owes you that if she is really sorry.

Re-assure her that you are not leaving her but you expect all the truth and for both of you to work this out together....

I think you will see there is likely more info. I also think you will see she has kept this burden inside of her a long time. That makes a person guilty and mental.

And now she has put that burden on you out of her guilt.

So work on it together.

HM64


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## hillj225 (Dec 20, 2012)

Since I took the job in another state she is always saying this is my chance to break free. I love dearly but will noy be walked on and lied to. We have raised our voices but I have not nor will I call her out of her name. I want answers and the truth if we are to mend. We've had our rough patches over the years and have even seperated for a while but never for infidelity, well at least nothing I knew of.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

That you knew of???

And that is what you need to focus on.

Because there is a chance your S had more to do with her issues than yours.

Dig for the truth.

Tell her there is no time like the present to get her baggage off her chest.

Sorry your Xmas is off to such a rough start.


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## mel123 (Aug 4, 2012)

TCx said:


> Wow. 95% of this thread has been conjecture and accusation without any basis in fact or information. I find that to be despicable.
> 
> .


TC , I disagree with with you on this. Your use of the word "despicable" directed toward your fellow posters, that shows a condescending an arrogant attitude.

Granted NONE of us know the true facts in this situation. However, the posters have taken the information they have been given and offered their thoughts according to their own "life experiences" . Those "life experiences" can vary greatly.

The purpose of forums like this to get a broad view from those who have gone through and experienced similar circumstances in the past.


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## TCx (Dec 15, 2011)

mel123 said:


> TC , I disagree with with you on this. Your use of the word "despicable" directed toward your fellow posters, that shows a condescending an arrogant attitude.
> 
> Granted NONE of us know the true facts in this situation. However, the posters have taken the information they have been given and offered their thoughts according to their own "life experiences" . Those "life experiences" can vary greatly.
> 
> The purpose of forums like this to get a broad view from those who have gone through and experienced similar circumstances in the past.


Fair point. And while I don't believe in censorship, I do believe in conscientious delivery.

If people are relating their views based on their own experiences, don't you think it is more responsible to say, "My wayward did X" rather than, "Your wayward is doing X"?

There is a remarkable difference between the tone of those two. One offers experience, the other one undermines his W in his eyes.

We're all here for a reason. I guess I get angry when people forget that the OP and his spouse of 20 years are in dire straits and that he's in the initial stages of BS fog which means he's still reeling from events, doubting himself and everything in his life and is probably very susceptible to suggestion; especially from people who 'know what they are talking about' (aka - are figures of authority in his eyes).


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## hillj225 (Dec 20, 2012)

I am back at my job in the other state. We are working out our issues but all questions are not answered. She is remorseful about the affair/ons but I don't know if I will ever be satisfied with her responsI I am trying toforgive but this is the hardest thing I have every encountered emotionally in my 54 years on earth. I really want to find this guy with the limited information I have. She only gave me his nick name and first name and says she does not remember his name. This happened at around a military base so I don't know if he was a solider like myself or a local civilian trying to pick up women while husbands were deploye.


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## Mr Blunt (Jul 18, 2012)

> *By Hillj225*
> She is remorseful about the *affair/ons* but I don't know if I will ever be *satisfied with her responses *I am trying to f*orgive *but this is the hardest thing I have ever encountered emotionally in my 54 years on earth.


You are right you will never be satisfied with her response if you think the responses are going to a make your pain go away. You said that she is remorseful about the affair and it was a ONS. If that was an ONS and 20 years ago then your efforts would be better served focusing on the here and now. Your statement that it was an ONS tells me that you believe that she has been faithful ever since otherwise you would have not called it a ONS you would have said ONE of her affairs or One of her ONS.

If she has been faithful to you for 20 years and is remorseful then what good will come from you finding the OM? Would not your time and efforts trying to heal yourself, work on R, and the future be better than trying to find out details that will be triggers for you the rest of your life? You know she cheated and that is probably enough for you to deal with at this time.

You working on forgiving and her doing everything she can to help you NOW is much more important than details about what happened 20 years ago. I am not saying that you should not be interested in the details; that is natural but *how much good are the details going to do as opposed to how many triggers it will produce for the rest of your life?*

If this situation happened in the last year or two I could see looking into the past more because she still may be in the fog. However, I have never heard of anyone being in the fog for 20 years without any contact with the OM. If your wife has been in contact with the OM for 20 years you would know it wouldn’t you?

This crises should have you both use your motivations now present to rebuild and heal each other beginning today. If that isn’t the goal for both of you then that means the healing will be very difficult or impossible IMO

*Working on yourself to get yourself in a better position to deal with the affair, and to be able to make it with or without her, will pay off for you more than getting details about what you can not change and will produce triggers. *


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## lovelygirl (Apr 15, 2012)

Shaggy said:


> Have you asked her if she wants to know today to in 20 years if you decide to have a revenge one night stand?
> 
> Her story is way to neat and tidy. She admits to not being drunk or high, so she's made a conscious choice to cheat. She claims the guy was bad in bed so she didn't keep doing it. All nice an tidy. She's cheater, but she claims to have chosen to not cheat again because the guy was bad.
> 
> ...


The best post in the thread. Truer words couldn't be said.

It was her bad luck that her affair partner wasn't as hot as she expected him to be...otherwise the affair* would still be going* or who knows..she might have even left your for him. 

There was no declare of love for you. 
You were nowhere in the picture and you were NOT the reason why she stopped the affair. 

How romantic is that?


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## hillj225 (Dec 20, 2012)

I am just putting one foot in front of the other and trying to keep it together. The seperation is not making it easy because in my alone time it weighs on my mind and I wonder about other times I was away on deployement and even now being away from her with her being in the town she grew up in. There is just alot of frustration but I have to learn to trust again.


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## walkonmars (Aug 21, 2012)

hillj225 said:


> I ...The seperation is not making it easy because in my alone time it weighs on my mind and I wonder about other times I was away....


Do you want to have a marriage with her? If your daughter was in college would you have enough in common with your wife to stay?

She isn't going to tell you anymore. She just won't for whatever reason.

IMO that gives you the moral authority to end your marriage. Ending the marriage doesn't mean you hate her, don't like her, don't love her. It means you were honoring a set of vows you made to her 20 years ago and will do so no longer. 

Seek individual counseling.


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## theroad (Feb 20, 2012)

You must schedule a polygraph test to get the whole truth.

Set the appointment then tell the WW when the date is. As the day gets close your WW will as other WW's before her will all of a sudden and remember more. This is just some trickle truthing by your WW to get you to believe that she has now told you all so you can cancel the test.

Don't cancel. Tell WW the test is still on to confirm.

Marriages always suffer when the spouses are pulled apart by their jobs.

You need a new job.


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## hillj225 (Dec 20, 2012)

We are working things out from a distance but I have to say it is not easy. I have nights where I can't sleep because I think of the betrayal. I have somewhat of an obsession in finding the guy and hearing what he says happened. I have contacted people I was stationed with where the ons/affair happened to see if they remember him based on just his nickname and first name. My wife had a friend who knew all about the tryst and I am trying to track her down to hear what she will say without giving her any infomation that I have. My wife doesn't know I am doing this because it will cause a big fallout if she does. I'm sorry, I am in love with this woman but it is killing me on the inside. How long does this last? It has been almost a month and I can physically feel the pressure of stress inside my chest. Thanks to all who have responded. I am thinking it maybe time to seek professional help.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

hillj225 said:


> There is just alot of frustration but I have to learn to trust again.





hillj225 said:


> We are working things out from a distance but I have to say it is not easy. I have nights where I can't sleep because I think of the betrayal. I have somewhat of an obsession in finding the guy and hearing what he says happened. I have contacted people I was stationed with where the ons/affair happened to see if they remember him based on just his nickname and first name. My wife had a friend who knew all about the tryst and I am trying to track her down to hear what she will say without giving her any infomation that I have. My wife doesn't know I am doing this because it will cause a big fallout if she does. I'm sorry, I am in love with this woman but it is killing me on the inside. How long does this last? It has been almost a month and I can physically feel the pressure of stress inside my chest. Thanks to all who have responded. I am thinking it maybe time to seek professional help.


I am going to suggest you tell your wife what you are doing.

Here are my reasons.

First, secrets are no good for a marriage. You can see the damage she is doing by keeping one, and you could do further damage by playing the same game.

Second, I can only explain her behaviour three ways. (1) She is incredibly self-absorbed and your feelings don't matter. Or (2) she is withholding details that she thinks will upset you because she is scared of losing you. Or (3) she just doesn't get how it is affecting you, and thinks if she keeps quiet it will all blow over.

I think most likely she is motivated by some combination of 2 and 3. I can tell you it will NOT blow over. In fact the most dangerous thing you could do, in my view, is suppress your resentment, because it will just come out somewhere else. And in asking you to accept no details, she is in my view increasing the risk of losing you because of the details you crave but do not know.

So, in your position, I would say to her. "I need the full truth. Whether you give it to me is up to you, but be aware I am going to look anyway. I need to. And it saddens me that you don't think enough of me to help me with what I need, especially. Since you caused the problem."

Not aggressive, not attacking, but totally unyielding. 

You are not going to regain trust until you complete this journey. The irony is, that by forcing you to look elsewhere for the truth, she is further damaging your trust when she could be helping repair it.

I hope I don't seem harsh here. I admire that she told you, and I expect she is panicking. But she is not handling this very well at all, and her responses are exacerbating the damage.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

hillj225 said:


> We are working things out from a distance but I have to say it is not easy. I have nights where I can't sleep because I think of the betrayal. I have somewhat of an obsession in finding the guy and hearing what he says happened. I have contacted people I was stationed with where the ons/affair happened to see if they remember him based on just his nickname and first name. My wife had a friend who knew all about the tryst and I am trying to track her down to hear what she will say without giving her any infomation that I have. My wife doesn't know I am doing this because it will cause a big fallout if she does. I'm sorry, I am in love with this woman but it is killing me on the inside. How long does this last? It has been almost a month and I can physically feel the pressure of stress inside my chest. Thanks to all who have responded. I am thinking it maybe time to seek professional help.


Your WIFE is the one who should be tracking these people down to set your mind at ease. 

Stop it. You're killing yourself here. Your wife needs to step up to the plate and start the healing process for you here, otherwise you will need to do it on your own and that can NOT include being with her.

She's had 20 years to process this - you've had a month. To you, it's the exact same as if she cheated on you one month ago. If she doesn't get that, and I can tell she doesn't, then be done with her. She is not worth your time.


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## FryFish (Sep 18, 2012)

> How long does this last? It has been almost a month and I can physically feel the pressure of stress inside my chest. Thanks to all who have responded. I am thinking it maybe time to seek professional help.


Hmm... if she was being honest and helpful and doing EVERYTHING right you are looking at 3 ish years of pain/anger and a lifetime of distrust... The way she is acting, you will be angry for as long as you are with her...


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## Wiserforit (Dec 27, 2012)

Something wrong with this picture. Something missing.

She told you in the context of you leaving for this job, separating from her. There has to be a reason related to it. She isn't coming clean on the affair completely, but chose to tell you this much. So it makes me wonder what is going on.

You are being trickle-truthed for sure. And she is playing "blame the victim": guilt-tripping you for wanting to know about infidelity. 

I do have some understanding about being 20 years before but this just brings about a lot of questions and experience dictates there is more here than just what she's said. So it makes me think that her purpose was not to come clean for your benefit.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Wiserforit said:


> Something wrong with this picture. Something missing.
> 
> She told you in the context of you leaving for this job, separating from her. There has to be a reason related to it. She isn't coming clean on the affair completely, but chose to tell you this much. So it makes me wonder what is going on.
> 
> ...


Maybe. Why could it not just have been a moment of truth?

It took my wife many years to understand that, in asking for details of the affair, I was not trying to punish or hurt her. In part this reflects the guilt with which she punished herself.

It's vy easy to over think this stuff amassing all sorts of evil motivations that just aren't there.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Hope1964 said:


> Your WIFE is the one who should be tracking these people down to set your mind at ease.
> 
> Stop it. You're killing yourself here. Your wife needs to step up to the plate and start the healing process for you here, otherwise you will need to do it on your own and that can NOT include being with her.
> 
> She's had 20 years to process this - you've had a month. To you, it's the exact same as if she cheated on you one month ago. If she doesn't get that, and I can tell she doesn't, then be done with her. She is not worth your time.


You can probably do it and be with her. She is just making the process harder.

Relationships are a strange tension between emotions and feelings. All of us make choices that are risky viewed logically, because we crave the emotional rewards.

If she was clearly not worth his time, I suspect he would already have left.


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## bryanp (Aug 25, 2011)

If the roles were reversed I am sure that your wife would be demanding answers just like you. I think it would be interesting how she would respond to you suggesting a polygraph.


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## Rottdad42 (Nov 26, 2012)

Hill, this is one of the reasons I came to this board. Exactly. I feel your pain. I spent many sleepless nights, confusion, how, when, why. why, why.... To drop a bomb like and not talk about it turns a grenade into a nuke. IMHO she needs to tell you so the healing can begin it's the only way.


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## hillj225 (Dec 20, 2012)

I agree that more should be told but as I stated before when I bring up the subject she accuses me of not forgiving her and we get into an argument. She says she is waiting for me to explode. I have always been good about hiding my emotions and handling problems myself. But this one I am not. Again I appreciate all the comments and I don't take offense to what is being said nor do think some of you are being harsh. Misery loves company they say and boy or boy do I have misery. I have tried to be positive and upbeat in life and whatever comes my way good or bad but this is more painful than a love one dying! I have written her a letter expressing my feelings and my intentions of finding the other person involved and approaching her friend who knows about the ons/affair. I have been sitting on it for about 4 days now waiting on the right moment to hit the send button. I am also keeping a journal that I write in daily about my thoughts and feelings.


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## donny64 (Apr 21, 2012)

She remembers. I remember every vivid detail when I almost cheated on my ex 20 years ago. 

And it was her choice to "carry it" for so long. And now she wants you to carry it for her. No go.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## C-man (Oct 23, 2012)

hillj225: The thing you must make your wife understand is that even though it took place 20 years ago, for YOU it is like it happened just now. She has to know and appreciate the fresh pain she is causing.

I also find it hard to believe that she doesn't remember. 20 years is not that long ago, especially for such a life-altering event. Of course it IS possible that she has blocked the memory out - through guilt or whatever. You would know her better than anybody to judge.

But whether she remembers details or not - she has to work to repair the damage as if she just did it yesterday.


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## Wiserforit (Dec 27, 2012)

Wazza said:


> Maybe. Why could it not just have been a moment of truth?
> 
> It took my wife many years to understand that, in asking for details of the affair, I was not trying to punish or hurt her. In part this reflects the guilt with which she punished herself.
> 
> It's vy easy to over think this stuff amassing all sorts of evil motivations that just aren't there.


Fine, a moment of truth if you wish. But why did this moment of truth happen when he is moving off to live separately.

His question did not come out of thin air. He was moving. She was giving him a lot of guff about this being the time to leave her. It was her actions prompting his question. He would not have asked otherwise.

So why is this chosen as the moment of truth? People do things for reasons, not randomly.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

hillj225 said:


> I agree that more should be told but as I stated before when I bring up the subject she accuses me of not forgiving her and we get into an argument. She says she is waiting for me to explode. I have always been good about hiding my emotions and handling problems myself. But this one I am not. Again I appreciate all the comments and I don't take offense to what is being said nor do think some of you are being harsh. Misery loves company they say and boy or boy do I have misery. I have tried to be positive and upbeat in life and whatever comes my way good or bad but this is more painful than a love one dying! I have written her a letter expressing my feelings and my intentions of finding the other person involved and approaching her friend who knows about the ons/affair. I have been sitting on it for about 4 days now waiting on the right moment to hit the send button. I am also keeping a journal that I write in daily about my thoughts and feelings.


"No, I haven't forgiven you. I want to forgive you, but I don't even yet know what it is I have to forgive, so I can't stop processing it. My biggest fear is if you leave this too long the damage may become irreparable."


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Wiserforit said:


> People do things for reasons, not randomly.


Disagree.

We could have a long and very interesting discussion on this point but it would be a thread jack.

Maybe you would accept that people sometimes go with what they call "gut feel" and it is not a conscious reason, nor anything that can be simply divined, for the purpose of the discussion?

But if you think she is playing some game of relationship chess, then I don't accept that.


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## Wiserforit (Dec 27, 2012)

Wazza said:


> Maybe you would accept that people sometimes go with what they call "gut feel" and it is not a conscious reason,


"Gut" feelings are not random. They are in response to something. 

And "gut" feelings ALWAYS have basic emotions behind them like fear or suspicion or whatever it is. 




> nor anything that can be simply divined, for the purpose of the discussion?


Magic and randomness are a far more complicated world than things happening for straightforward reasons. 



> But if you think she is playing some game of relationship chess, then I don't accept that.


No problem. You can live in a world where things happen without reasons. 

But it doesn't simplify things. What it does is impute chaos to the world and eliminates our ability to plan rationally. 

I've posed this as a question, not offering an opinion for what the reason is. I've observed that the reason is missing, other than its correlation to him leaving.

It's actually a pretty important question: why choose to tell him this now after 20 years, especially when he is leaving. It is a no-brainer that this is going to cause a rift rather than bring them closer together. Causing a rift when they are separating is worth wondering about.


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## Mr Blunt (Jul 18, 2012)

> By Hillj225
> She is remorseful about the affair/ons but I don't know *if I will ever be satisfied with her responses*
> 
> I have written her a letter expressing my feelings and my *intentions of finding the other person involved and approaching her friend* who knows about the ons/affair



If you find this other man and her friend are you going to be satisfied with their responses? Will you trust them?

If she has been faithful to you for 20 years and is remorseful then what good will come from you finding the OM?
*What exactly are your objectives in contacting these two people that you probably will not trust? 

How will that help you?*


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## hillj225 (Dec 20, 2012)

I feel like I have to prepare myself for both a life with her and without her. Middle of the road shall we say but the only thing you find in the middle of the road are yellow lines and dead possums. She called me tonight and can sense something is not right. I played it off like it was job stress but she can tell after 24 years of marriage. I know if I lay it out she will choose to stay where she is which is her hometown where her family and friends are. What am I afraid of?


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## hillj225 (Dec 20, 2012)

Mr Blunt said:


> If you find this other man and her friend are you going to be satisfied with their responses? Will you trust them?
> 
> If she has been faithful to you for 20 years and is remorseful then what good will come from you finding the OM?
> *What exactly are your objectives in contacting these two people that you probably will not trust?
> ...


My objective in contacting the om and the friend is to see what story they tell. I am looking for the ugly truth and not some pretty lie to spare my feelings.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

hillj225 said:


> I feel like I have to prepare myself for both a life with her and without her. Middle of the road shall we say but the only thing you find in the middle of the road are yellow lines and dead possums. She called me tonight and can sense something is not right. I played it off like it was job stress but she can tell after 24 years of marriage. I know if I lay it out she will choose to stay where she is which is her hometown where her family and friends are. What am I afraid of?


She had an affair, and if you insist on knowing the details she will leave you? Is that what you have said?

Perfectly natural to be afraid, but if fear stops you confronting the issue that is destroying your marriage, where does it get you?


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## Mr Blunt (Jul 18, 2012)

> Originally Posted by Mr Blunt
> If you find this other man and her friend are you going to be satisfied with their responses? *Will you trust them?*
> If she has been faithful to you for 20 years and is remorseful then what good will come from you finding the OM?
> 
> ...





> She confessed to an affair that happened about 20 years ago.


*That is a pretty lie?

If you find them and if they tell you anything you think that you will trust them?*


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## hillj225 (Dec 20, 2012)

Mr Blunt said:


> *That is a pretty lie?
> 
> If you find them and if they tell you anything you think that you will trust them?*


_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## hillj225 (Dec 20, 2012)

I don't or can't trust anyone at this present moment but I feel, no I deserve some answers. I will sort thru each story and find the truth whether I like it or not.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Machiavelli (Feb 25, 2012)

hillj225 said:


> I don't or can't trust anyone at this present moment but I feel, no I deserve some answers. I will sort thru each story and find the truth whether I like it or not.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


How are you monitoring your wife's present activities while you are away? Is she sexually attractive at all?


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## Machiavelli (Feb 25, 2012)

Wiserforit said:


> I've posed this as a question, not offering an opinion for what the reason is. I've observed that the reason is missing, other than its correlation to him leaving.
> 
> It's actually a pretty important question: why choose to tell him this now after 20 years, especially when he is leaving. It is a no-brainer that this is going to cause a rift rather than bring them closer together. Causing a rift when they are separating is worth wondering about.


It's the exact same phenomenon of a woman provoking an argument before she rushes off to spend the night with her "girlfriend."


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## Mr Blunt (Jul 18, 2012)

> Originally Posted by hillj225
> I don't or *can't trust anyone* at this present moment but I feel, no I deserve some answers. I will sort thru each story and *find the truth* whether I like it or not.


*You do not trust the OM or her friend so you will not be able to find the truth.*

You have indicated that your wife has only one ONS 20 years ago and is remorseful. You are focusing on something that will not be the best direction for you to get better. If fact it could even wind up making it worse.

First, you should be focusing on building yourself up emotionally by getting all the professional and non-professional help that you can that will help you deal with this shock. Also, what is the best path for you to take for your family?

Second, you should concentrate on working on the here and now with your wife, you, your family, and marriage. You do not have to make a quick decision right now as your wife is not involved with OM or in fog. You can use time to your benefit and allow your efforts to determine if your marriage is going to be more of an advantage or disadvantage to you.


You did not answer either one of the questions that I gave you before (See below)


> What exactly are your objectives in contacting these two people that you probably will not trust?
> 
> How will that help you?




Your answer to one of the questions was that you do not trust anyone but that you are going to find the truth. How can you get the truth from someone that you do not trust?

*Even if you did find the truth specifically how will that help you?*

Hillj225, I am not responding you to gode you I think that you are focusing on an area that will not help you the most and may even hurt you. I understand your desire to find out the details but *given the scenario that this was a one time ONS, 20 years ago, and your wife is remorseful, then wouldn’t your efforts be better served by working on the present and not the past? The past you cannot change*


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## hillj225 (Dec 20, 2012)

Mr Blunt said:


> *You do not trust the OM or her friend so you will not be able to find the truth.*
> 
> You have indicated that your wife has only one ONS 20 years ago and is remorseful. You are focusing on something that will not be the best direction for you to get better. If fact it could even wind up making it worse.
> 
> ...


_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## hillj225 (Dec 20, 2012)

My objective is to see if they all tell the same story. I have some details as to where they met, where the ons took place, how they got to their meeting place, how they got to the motel, bareback or condom etc. I want to confront her with what someone else says and I will decide based on her truth or deception what to do. The guy and the friend don't owe me anything and don't have to protect themselves or me. My wife does and is protecting herself making out like she was the victim and not the culpret. I have teenage eyes who knows evetything and everywhere my wife is so I am not overly concerned about her being active sexually while I am away. Besides she has never missed my calls early or late.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## snap (Oct 3, 2011)

hillj225 said:


> The guy and the friend don't owe me anything and don't have to protect themselves or me.


The guy screwed you over once already, I don't see any reason for him to be helpful. No; I'm not really against confronting, just don't expect him following some "guy's code".


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## dogman (Jul 24, 2012)

hillj225 said:


> I feel like I have to prepare myself for both a life with her and without her. Middle of the road shall we say but the only thing you find in the middle of the road are yellow lines and dead possums. She called me tonight and can sense something is not right. I played it off like it was job stress but she can tell after 24 years of marriage. I know if I lay it out she will choose to stay where she is which is her hometown where her family and friends are. What am I afraid of?


I would do the same as you. Not because it's the best thing to do but because I would HAVE to do it. No choice. I HATE to be lied to and played for a fool.

You sound like your wife is a decent wife and you have a pretty good relationship, maybe because you get run over by her and your used to it, I don't know. But it works. Her disclosure of this now is messed up. You have no choice but to find out all you can to live in peace the rest of your life.

You don't want to be wondering all kinds of things about other men or a longer affair than she admits. Chances are very, very high that the story she gave you is only what she is willing to admit. The truth is ALWAYS worse than what someone will admit. Especially when there is no way to verify details.

Don't be so easy going. Start to take control of things. Be the alpha and don't let her anger control the tempo of the relationship. It's a huge step but maybe that's why your meant to go through this. So you can take back control of your relationship.

Remember the one who's willing to throw down is the one who will come out on top and right now that's her.


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## Mr Blunt (Jul 18, 2012)

> By hillj225
> My objective is to see if they all tell the same story. I have some details as to where they met, where the ons took place, how they got to their meeting place, how they got to the motel, bareback or condom etc. *I want to confront her with what someone else says and I will decide based on her truth or deception what to do.* The guy and the friend don't owe me anything and don't have to protect themselves or me.* My wife does and is protecting herself making out like she was the victim and not the culpret*. I have teenage eyes who knows evetything and everywhere my wife is so I am not overly concerned about her being active sexually while I am away. Besides she has never missed my calls early or late.
> Posted via Mobile Device




You want to get what “someone else says”, compare it to what your wife says, and then decide on R or D? *Because you do not trust any of those that you will get information from, your task will be very difficult and unreliable.*

You are determined to find out that your wife was the “culprit” Go for it then.
*Will you be helping yourself more by satisfying yourself that your wife is the culprit, if that is the case?*


You have a wife that has been faithful for 20 years, is remorseful, and needs healing just like you need healing. You and others think that getting more details is the way to go and I think that you working with today and the future is a better approach given your scenario.

Your wife has admitted to betraying you and having sex with another man. That is the main issue and that she has been faithful for 20 years. *The question of did she want it, did she enjoy it, how big was it, etc is not the best way for you to help yourself and your wife IMO*

I know that there are different ways at looking at these situations and I know that WAZZA has over 20 years of successful R and marriage and so do I. However, you will do what you want to do so have at it. I hope that your way works out best for you and your wife. 


*Will you keep us informed as to how this works out for the next year or two?*

I have been wrong before and would be open to learning.


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## hillj225 (Dec 20, 2012)

I have a 3 page letter I have been mulling over for a week now that I will send for her as an attachement to read this afternoon. She wants to talk about what is bothering me. We will dicusss the contents of the letter and let the chips fall where they may.


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## Rottdad42 (Nov 26, 2012)

Hill, I understand your reasons. You are looking for answers, period. For me it didn't matter the who, what where. It was information I was seeking. I need facts to help me weigh everything in. For me it was the only way to move on, forever. After 20 plus years marriage, you deserve the skinny. Whatever the info. I think the letter is a good idea.
Best of luck man.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

hillj225 said:


> I have a 3 page letter I have been mulling over for a week now that I will send for her as an attachement to read this afternoon. She wants to talk about what is bothering me. We will dicusss the contents of the letter and let the chips fall where they may.


Is the letter honest? Is it as gentle and non threatening as you can make it while still firmly confronting the issues?


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## JMGrey (Dec 19, 2012)

Wazza said:


> Disagree.
> 
> We could have a long and very interesting discussion on this point but it would be a thread jack.
> 
> ...


Granted I haven't been here very long but I've notice that in a few threads you seem to go out of your way to paint infidelity as something that "just happens" sometimes or that there is, as you say above, "no conscious decision", and that's a load of crap. Anyone that engages in infidelity knows consciously what's at stake (marriage, family, reputation, financial security, employment, etc.) or they wouldn't try to cover it up, or hide it for 20 years. The "gut feeling" you mention, that's simply the conscious decision that their mental and physical gratification is more important than those consequences. Stop trying to make victims out of perpetrators.


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## hillj225 (Dec 20, 2012)

The letter is in no way threatening but it just outlines my bottled up feelings which she keeps saying she wants to know about. As I stated I have been sitting on this letter for a few days now editing it for content. We had/have almost 25 years of love invested in each other and need to start healing and she has to be part of the source.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

JMGrey said:


> Granted I haven't been here very long but I've notice that in a few threads you seem to go out of your way to paint infidelity as something that "just happens" sometimes or that there is, as you say above, "no conscious decision", and that's a load of crap. Anyone that engages in infidelity knows consciously what's at stake (marriage, family, reputation, financial security, employment, etc.) or they wouldn't try to cover it up, or hide it for 20 years. The "gut feeling" you mention, that's simply the conscious decision that their mental and physical gratification is more important than those consequences. Stop trying to make victims out of perpetrators.


I don't go out of my way to do anything except join in the discussion and offer perspectives. 

In moments of weakness in my life I have done things that I was later ashamed of. Things that I would normally not do. Conscious decision? Yes in a sense. Fully considered? No.

I don't view someone who is immoral with premeditation the same as someone who has a moment of weakness.


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## carmen ohio (Sep 24, 2012)

hillj225 said:


> The letter is in no way threatening but it just outlines my bottled up feelings which she keeps saying she wants to know about. As I stated I have been sitting on this letter for a few days now editing it for content. *We had/have almost 25 years of love invested in each other and need to start healing and she has to be part of the source.*


Dear hillj225,

I can understand your anguish in learning that your wife was unfaithful and over her having kept this from you for so long. I also think you have the right to know everything about what happened, especially whether she is being truthful that it was a one time occurrence. You also have good reason to be troubled by her seeming indifference to the pain this has caused you and her unwillingness to answer your questions.

I believe that you need to be frank about what you want from her. Given her response so far, however, I think you also need to be prepared for her to continue to insist that she remembers little and to refuse to discuss it. If she does this, what will be your response?

In your posts, you have said repeatedly, in one way or another, that you are _not_ prepared to lose your marriage over this (the only exception being the post in which you said, _"I feel like I have to prepare myself for both a life with her and without her"_). If she knows this (or, put another way, if you don't indicate in some manner that you are prepared to leave her), what reason does she have to discuss this further?

Another option might be to ask her to take a polygraph test on her claim that she only cheated once and say that, if she passes, you will consider the matter closed. If she agrees and passes the test, you learn the answer to the most important question and if she fails the test or refuses to take it, you would have reason to believe that there was more than a single adulterous encounter. But what would you do then?

You could also do a "hard 180" until she relents but, again, what if she doesn't relent? Would you eventually give up and take her back or would you file for divorce?

You want answers but it seems to me that you haven't figured out what you're going to do if you don't get them. If I were you, I wouldn't send the letter until I knew the answer to that question because what you ought to say in the letter depends on it.

With your original question, _"have you ever cheated on me," _you opened a veritable Pandora's box. In the Greek fable, there was no undoing this. I hope you can do better than the Greeks.

Wishing you a good outcome.


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## JMGrey (Dec 19, 2012)

Wazza said:


> I don't go out of my way to do anything except join in the discussion and offer perspectives.
> 
> In moments of weakness in my life I have done things that I was later ashamed of. Things that I would normally not do. Conscious decision? Yes in a sense. Fully considered? No.
> 
> I don't view someone who is immoral with premeditation the same as someone who has a moment of weakness.


That must be where you and I differ because all cheating is with premeditation. It may be protracted, but it's still premeditated. It all begins with people wanting something and deciding that they can't or won't find it in their partner.


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## hillj225 (Dec 20, 2012)

Is it normal for your libido to increase after finding out about your wife cheating? I'm not talking about some weird thing where you picture the two of them together, but wanting to bond sexually more. We did have our talk before and after I sent the letter and I must say it went verery well. A lot of remorse from her and a sincere apology. She resisted at first but I was persistent and we got a lot of things out without yelling and screaming. It was uncomfortable for both of us. We talked for about an hour before I sent her the letter and she called me after reciving the letter and cried saying she would tell me whatever I needed to know in order for us both to begin healing. She didn't realize the depth of my hurt and still doesn't know. She has offered up all her email and facebook accounts and passwords. I don't fully trust her and know it will take time to build it up again. I still hurt and don't know how long it will last but we are putting one foot in front of the other. 25 years is a lot of time to invest in someone then lose it. Thanks to all for some good advice. It's not over yet.


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## JCD (Sep 2, 2012)

iJordan said:


> This sort of s h i t makes my blood boil and it occurs far too often with cheating spouses. Equating the 'pain' they've went through carrying their affair to the _actual_ pain they caused the betrayed spouse is contemptible and shows a fundamental lack of *empathy*.
> 
> You should tell her straight that she doesn't get a choice in whether she talks about it or not; she will tell you everything—and as many time as you want to hear it.


Here. I fixed that for you. But other than that, I agree with your post.


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## JCD (Sep 2, 2012)

Well, good luck. It's hard at long distance but it can be done.

My wife and I are resolving issues only seeing each other every 2 months or so (work)

Skype.

When you have conversations, some of them will be uncomfortable. That's okay. But when you run into something that either can't stand anymore, either of you can cut the conversation short as long as you both know that you WILL revisit that issue in the future. That makes it 'safer' to discuss things.


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## theroad (Feb 20, 2012)

hillj225 said:


> Is it normal for your libido to increase after finding out about your wife cheating? I'm not talking about some weird thing where you picture the two of them together, but wanting to bond sexually more.


Normal. Happens often. Often enough that there is a name for it. Hysterical Bonding. A phyiscal reclaiming is needed to help the BS's mind heal. Also helps the WS to reconnect mentally with the BS.


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