# Wife wants a sixth baby… I don’t



## GLE3 (May 24, 2013)

Hello, first time poster. Before I go into my issue I must say this site is amazing. I’ve learned more in a week reading stuff from this site than I have in 8 years of my marriage on my own. Truly revealed some crushing truths about myself. I find myself drawn to the Man UP sticky as I feel it directly applies to me. Now to the issue (as if there was only one ). I have a family of seven (3 boys, 2 girls). Two teens that I married into (Drew, Hannah) and 3 little ones (7(Luke), 4(Grace), and 16(Owen) months). Our first original ‘family plan’ was to have one (for three total). About a couple years after that one the wife changes her mind and wants another. She sites she just has ‘a feeling’ or desire to hold a little one in her arms again. I tell her it wasn’t in our plan, and she says she can’t help it…. I would have to admit that most of the reasons I had against having another baby made me feel selfish (delay in retirement, not being able to get to next phase of our life together, simply not wanting to go through that part of child rearing again, my family suffering through the wife’s post-partum issues). So, as you can tell the end result was me ditching things that come from above the neck and just going with my heart and agreeing to have a fourth. The wife was comfortable with a vasectomy at that point but I drug my feet and we ended up having our ‘bonus baby’ Owen. He was totally unplanned. The wife now says something ‘hit her’ having our last baby and wants a sixth. The same kind of things are swimming through my head again as with our fourth, only this time I see absolutely no way to financially support a family of 8. Heck, we tread on thin ice as it is with 7 as we are a one income family that is earning a salary that is recommened for a family of about 5 and a half. I honestly don’t even know what a family of 7 should be bringing home financially to comfortably support them. Google hasn’t been helpful on numbers greater than 5..lol. The wife working is out of the question as she has EDS and is on a pain management program.

So we have had discussions about it over the last two months and I tell her I am happy with the size of our family and site some of the difficulties I list above. She says those aren’t legitimate reasons and that I choose to not listen to my heart like she does. She says things will just “work themselves out financially”. We have substantial credit card debt (that I’m paying off with a 401k loan) and we qualify for and sometimes utilize government assistance because of our current income and family size. Our oldest boy is headed off to college, we have 20 more years of our mortgage, and braces to put on a majority of our kids because they have teeth like mine….. Then of course we are just not that responsible with our money. How does that compute to “work themselves out financially” after we add on an 8th? Last night after another one of her “ready to have a baby” questions me calmly and gently say I understand her perspective and her confidence in her perspective but I am her equal and I feel just as confident in my stance. She remarked, ‘I don’t like that the end result is not having a baby though’, followed by acting withdrawn and maintaining that there is nothing I can really do for her. Could someone give me some perspective on this? Is this something I should endure? Just let her be with it? We’ve hit a good part of our marriage at this time and I almost feel like I’m threatening that.


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## anchorwatch (Mar 5, 2012)

Have you read this?

http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi3500_policy.html

If your not enthusiastic about it, don't do it.


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

Personally, I think you should have snuck out in the middle of the night and got a vasectomy without telling her. I can't imagine any reason to put yourself further behind the financial 8 ball with another child and then expect things will just magically work themselves out. Unless of course, your wife's retirement plan is buying PowerBall tickets...

Tell her you compromised on the 4th, the fifth was a "bonus", and now it's time to stop. Then go get snipped (after telling her, of course). It's time to take a stand and be proactive.

C


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## BrockLanders (Jul 23, 2012)

GLE3 said:


> Hello, first time poster. Before I go into my issue I must say this site is amazing. I’ve learned more in a week reading stuff from this site than I have in 8 years of my marriage on my own. Truly revealed some crushing truths about myself. I find myself drawn to the Man UP sticky as I feel it directly applies to me. Now to the issue (as if there was only one ). I have a family of seven (3 boys, 2 girls). Two teens that I married into (Drew, Hannah) and 3 little ones (7(Luke), 4(Grace), and 16(Owen) months). Our first original ‘family plan’ was to have one (for three total). About a couple years after that one the wife changes her mind and wants another. She sites she just has ‘a feeling’ or desire to hold a little one in her arms again. I tell her it wasn’t in our plan, and she says she can’t help it…. I would have to admit that most of the reasons I had against having another baby made me feel selfish (delay in retirement, not being able to get to next phase of our life together, simply not wanting to go through that part of child rearing again, my family suffering through the wife’s post-partum issues). So, as you can tell the end result was me ditching things that come from above the neck and just going with my heart and agreeing to have a fourth. The wife was comfortable with a vasectomy at that point but I drug my feet and we ended up having our ‘bonus baby’ Owen. He was totally unplanned. The wife now says something ‘hit her’ having our last baby and wants a sixth. The same kind of things are swimming through my head again as with our fourth, only this time I see absolutely no way to financially support a family of 8. Heck, we tread on thin ice as it is with 7 as we are a one income family that is earning a salary that is recommened for a family of about 5 and a half. I honestly don’t even know what a family of 7 should be bringing home financially to comfortably support them. Google hasn’t been helpful on numbers greater than 5..lol. The wife working is out of the question as she has EDS and is on a pain management program.
> 
> So we have had discussions about it over the last two months and I tell her I am happy with the size of our family and site some of the difficulties I list above. She says those aren’t legitimate reasons and that I choose to not listen to my heart like she does. She says things will just “work themselves out financially”. We have substantial credit card debt (that I’m paying off with a 401k loan) and we qualify for and sometimes utilize government assistance because of our current income and family size. Our oldest boy is headed off to college, we have 20 more years of our mortgage, and braces to put on a majority of our kids because they have teeth like mine….. Then of course we are just not that responsible with our money. How does that compute to “work themselves out financially” after we add on an 8th? Last night after another one of her “ready to have a baby” questions me calmly and gently say I understand her perspective and her confidence in her perspective but I am her equal and I feel just as confident in my stance. She remarked, ‘I don’t like that the end result is not having a baby though’, followed by acting withdrawn and maintaining that there is nothing I can really do for her. Could someone give me some perspective on this? Is this something I should endure? Just let her be with it? We’ve hit a good part of our marriage at this time and I almost feel like I’m threatening that.


Not sure where you live but I figure I'd need around $200,000/yr for a family of 8. My wife and I have 4 kids, I couldn't imagine another body in the family. From a practical perspective think of matters like being able to fit 8 people into a car. My wife's minivan wouldn't hold 8 people. Your trunk will be filled with strollers etc, where would you put groceries? You can probably win your wife over with practical statements like that and demonstrate how much more difficult it will be for her.


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## deejov (Sep 24, 2011)

It's a purely emotional desire, and all the logic in the world isnt going to address her emotions.

Try talking to her about her emotions on this. 
It's okay to want it, but why, what is the void, how does she feel about it, what's the emotion?

That might help you better communicate with this.


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## daisygirl 41 (Aug 5, 2011)

You need to find out exactly why your wife wants another child. Is there some kind of emotional void she is trying to fill!
It's sounds as if you ha e a lovely family ready, having another one could be disastrous for your finances and your marriage.
I love babies and love being pregnant. Hubby had the snip after our 3rd child as I knew there would be a time when we wanted another but financially it would have been a disaster.
We got a puppy instead!!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## anchorwatch (Mar 5, 2012)

She's trying to fill something that she is missing emotionally. Having more children hasn't worked yet. Find out what it is. 

Don't have more children. You will end up resenting her.


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## chillymorn (Aug 11, 2010)

If you don't want another baby then get sniped. if not most likley you will have another!


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

I vote for you getting snipped, secretly if you need to.

Your wife's desire for another child is not reasonable. She's not dealing with reality.

You both need to agree or there should not be another child.


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## Westwind (May 20, 2013)

I was one of nine siblings. With a large family, we sure had to learn how to get along together and have everone pitch in to help. The older kids take care of the younger ones. As for the money needed, adjustments were made as the family got bigger. The majority of us went to college, and those that did not have done OK. One who has an automatic transmission business does better than the college gradulates. I liked being in a large family, the everone helping out feeling of it. I would say do not automatically give up on the idea of another baby, do the thing of having all the benefits in one column and all the negatives in another and see how it balances out.


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## Mavash. (Jan 26, 2012)

Sadly at some point you will have to say no. You agreed to ONE then she talked you into TWO and now she wants another one. At what point do you stop?


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## norajane (Feb 7, 2012)

> She says things will just “work themselves out financially”.


Finances are not influenced by magic. The money coming into the household has to be greater than the money going out of the household or you will eventually be in debt. You're already in debt. Another child will only send you deeper into debt. It's not hard to see that things won't just "work themselves out financially." 

In any case, you should never have a child unless you really want one. It doesn't sound like you do. You had already decided not to have more kids after #4. 
When you had #4, you said you were planning to get a vasectomy, but didn't get around to it, which is how you ended up with #5. Were you using birth control then? If your wife is in charge of birth control now, I'd be very cautious about having sex. She might stop taking her pill without telling you or something.


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## GLE3 (May 24, 2013)

I've wondered the same thing about the void.... She battles with depression and has some self confidence issues. One of the few things she thinks she is good at is being a Mom. I let her know having another wouldn't make her any 'better'. I really couldn't get her to talk about it though. It's a challenge to get her to talk about negative circumstances sometimes. That maybe my issue though, as after reading more and more stuff on this forum, I realize I may be intimidating her when I ask questions. Still learning how to talk to her...


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## Giro flee (Mar 12, 2013)

That desire for a baby has never gone away for me. We already have four and I know I will never have another. I've tried doing daycare for others, it helps but it isn't the same. I can be really blue about it every once in a while, but then I put on my big girl panties, suck it up, and move on. Talk about how she can cope with that desire instead of acting on it, it might never go away. At some point she will have to just be sad about it, it gets easier after a while. Our youngest is already ten and I still feel that craving every time I see a baby.


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## Westwind (May 20, 2013)

GLE3 said:


> I've wondered the same thing about the void.... She battles with depression and has some self confidence issues. One of the few things she thinks she is good at is being a Mom. I let her know having another wouldn't make her any 'better'. I really couldn't get her to talk about it though. It's a challenge to get her to talk about negative circumstances sometimes. That maybe my issue though, as after reading more and more stuff on this forum, I realize I may be intimidating her when I ask questions. Still learning how to talk to her...


Get some couples counseling about her depression and self confidence and leave the option of another baby open. It might be better to have the baby anyway. Do not put any pressure on her in counseling about a baby.


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## Starstarfish (Apr 19, 2012)

> It might be better to have the baby anyway.


How? I'm sorry, but when a couple is already on the risk of financial collapse, in what world is it the better choice to introduce another child into that scenario?

And what if after this one she wants another, and another, and another?


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## GLE3 (May 24, 2013)

Asked her about her emotions when it came to baby and she did summerize to say she has a feeling of incompleteness. But only regarding her 'picture' of our family... She says having the last baby unplanned may have something to do with this. After our fourth, she says she truly was ready to be done. And by that I say she simply just didn't think of having a fifth in the approximate two years of time after our 4th was born and getting pregnant with the fifth.

She has had 3 unplanned pregnancies total (two teens and our 4th). Maybe that has something to do with this...

Don't get me wrong, I love all my children... But having our fifth was scary(our age mid late 30's, not having ideal finances, totally caught off guard - we found out after a month and a half went by). Sounds more like a recipe that would make one not have another rather than TO have one.


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## Mavash. (Jan 26, 2012)

Some women get idealized notions of how having babies is supposed to go. And if it doesn't go right they want to do it again until their fantasy is realized.

I can see why your wife would want to "try" for a baby if her others were accidents.

But here's the thing some things in life you don't get do overs and there isn't a time machine. She needs help mourning the fact that it didn't go the way she wanted it to.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

> *GLE3 said*: I've wondered the same thing about the void.... *She battles with depression and has some self confidence issues.* One of the few things she thinks she is good at is being a Mom. I let her know having another wouldn't make her any 'better'. I really couldn't get her to talk about it though. It's a challenge to get her to talk about negative circumstances sometimes. That maybe my issue though, as after reading more and more stuff on this forum, I realize I may be intimidating her when I ask questions. Still learning how to talk to her...


I agree with the others....there is a Void & she keeps attempting to fill this with more children...I don't understand how...if they were accidents /unplanned -why this would make her feel better to have another. What birth control method was being used? Sounds whether you want another or not... if something is not changed here.....#6 might slip in there...

With her bouts of depression.. ..and being in debt already- having a hard time climbing out, this is NOT something that should be going forth..

You have already been very gracious ....but there comes a time to put your foot down...

Might be time for the Snip (though I wouldn't do it secretly -seen that suggested )... or getting her to agree to an IUD....this is not permanent ..that way, once out of debt...and she gets a handle on her depression... .then you can re-talk about this... 

This would be FAIR....and ya know that day may never come... but it's something healthy for all - to work towards... This is reasonable... don't cave to your wife.. she has some work to do. 



> *Blocklanders said:* Not sure where you live but I figure I'd need around $200,000/yr for a family of 8.


When I read others give figures like this... I shake my head...we must be living in dirt then..... We are a family of 8 , making less than 1/3 of this..

I have found so long as husband carries a Good family health care plan... that we can live within his income ....it's never been difficult for us even...and no, we are not on Food stamps or Gov Assistance ...we own our own house & land....we just live very frugally...

We've never paid interest on a vehicle, pay all our credit cards in full....we drive older cars by choice....Buy used clothes, enjoy flea markets, garage sales, look for BOGO's & use coupons, do rebates... go to the $1 theater..... save anyway we can...I've never minded this lifestyle....as it has allowed us to have more children & not go into debt.

We even managed to go to Disney twice... but we'd never fly or stay on property! 

Though, we do live in a lower "cost of living" area than many as having been in a # of these discussions on TAM... can't imagine some of the costs they quote for renting & taxes in other areas. 

I really enjoy our larger family, it keep us busy...always something going on. 

How old is the youngest right now? She could join a MOPS group (if less than kindergarten age) ...to get together with other Moms, make some friends...could help her get involved with some other things..... 

Mops International


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## deejov (Sep 24, 2011)

Mavash. said:


> Some women get idealized notions of how having babies is supposed to go. And if it doesn't go right they want to do it again until their fantasy is realized.
> 
> I can see why your wife would want to "try" for a baby if her others were accidents.
> 
> But here's the thing some things in life you don't get do overs and there isn't a time machine. She needs help mourning the fact that it didn't go the way she wanted it to.


I agree with this Mavash. I had to 'mourn' the fact that I could not have anymore than one, and had to take steps to stop trying. I had no problem getting pregnant... just not able to carry them to term. The heartbreak over filling that void versus practicality. It was something I just had to ..... mourn. 
No point spending the rest of my life being sad about something that wasn't meant to be. Denying the people present in my life, is all I was doing.


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## BrockLanders (Jul 23, 2012)

SimplyAmorous said:


> I agree with the others....there is a Void & she keeps attempting to fill this with more children...I don't understand how...if they were accidents /unplanned -why this would make her feel better to have another. What birth control method was being used? Sounds whether you want another or not... if something is not changed here.....#6 might slip in there...
> 
> With her bouts of depression.. ..and being in debt already- having a hard time climbing out, this is NOT something that should be going forth..
> 
> ...


It's the cost of living differences. I live on Long Island NY, about an hour from NYC. On 70, 000 there is no way you could have 8 kids here on that salary without being on assistance. Even double that salary and you would have a tough time.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## tacoma (May 1, 2011)

Tell her no.

Then go get snipped.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Thundarr (Jul 4, 2012)

*Both of you need to be above board and honest*. The importance of having a baby to her and the importance of not having a baby to you will weight in what you decide but there's no room for an accidental on purpose pregnancies at your ages. That would be a betrayal.

My preference would be much like your wife's; to have lots of kids but at some point you guys have to weigh if it's responsible or not. Again, you guys have to figure out the answer but there's just no room for deceit. If you decide you against it then I think it's your responsibility to be safe ( condoms, vasectomy, etc ). If she agrees to birth control on behalf of your wishes then it's her responsibility to not have an accident.


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## GLE3 (May 24, 2013)

She would get off pain meds in a second if I agreed to another one if that was doctor's orders.

Never did any kind of birth control. I would trust her if we started though. I would prefer just to get the vasectomy done. I'll see what google says on IUD's, maybe that's an option.

Once again thanks a bunch everyone, for you support and perspective!


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

BrockLanders said:


> It's the cost of living differences. I live on Long Island NY, about an hour from NYC. On 70, 000 there is no way you could have 8 kids here on that salary without being on assistance. Even double that salary and you would have a tough time.


 Not 8 kids here...minus 2 ... then add Mom & Dad = Family of 8. 

We live in Amish country... A higher paying blue collar job in our area is to be envied .... husband has one of those....When he got hired 15 yrs ago, we felt like we hit the lottery...so hard to get in there... We would be considered on the "well to do" side to many of our friends even....Probably sounds hard to believe I suppose.. what a different experience it is - depending on where one lives. WOW.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

GLE3 said:


> I'll see what google says on IUD's, maybe that's an option.


 I have the Paragard Copper "hormone free" IUD.... 

A little about this... once inserted, can stay in up to 12 long years.. if insurance doesn't cover it , cost about $500 + ...and Doc visit... can be inserted on OBGYN visit in less than 3 minutes, large CRAMP... that's it. 

1st 2 periods after insertion will be heavier (this is normal) then should go back to complete normalcy (did for me anyway). 

I had mine put in on the way home from the hospital having our last son... they can numb her if she wants...though not necessary for insertion ....the Nurse Practitioner I had talked me out of it... I was fine. Once inserted, she is immediately protected... not another thought to birth control... she will have light spotting for a few days... (normal )... Never had an issue with mine in the last 6 yrs. Can't feel it, never think about it. 

If a woman is a candidate, I personally feel it's the best on the market (though I am admittedly a bit biased -as my experience has been so good)......plus if anyone changes their minds in the future, it can be taken out in the docs office and she is fertile again. (my Aunt had one for 10 yrs, got it out, and had her only daughter at age 42)...

But if your wife is allergic to copper, it's not an option... best candidates are women who've had at least one child ....because the uterus is already stretched and it is less likely (though rare) to fall out. 

Can read all about it here >> ParaGard® (intrauterine copper contraceptive)

There is another IUD called Mirena .. this one is only for 5 yrs and has hormones in it... can almost stop your periods... like taking birth control pills...(I would never recommend this one, but that's just my opinion).


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

One issue with IUD's is that they can fail.

YOur getting snipped is the best way to prevent accidental pregnancies.


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## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

OP, do you know how your kids might feel about another sibling. The hours in a day do not increase to parents simply because they have more kids. 

I think parents fool themselves thinking that their kids are perfectly happy losing their childhood to take on parental roles -- and usually with all the responsibility but no authority to actually make the younger siblings do anything.

I have read stories about how 13 year olds are expected to do the midnight feedings of their newborn siblings because that's simply what their parents told them they had to do. Do you plan to cut into your older children's homework time to do the housework and babysitting of the younger siblings...... once again ajob that the parents are supposed to do.

And of course, there is the irony of how mothers get vilified for outsourcing childcare to a nanny or daycare center -- atleast those people get paid for their services. But no one contemplates the loss of a childhood due to have more siblings than the parents can rightfully take care of.

Some people may have happy memories of coming from a large family, but parents are human too and have a tendency to play favorites. From that same family, if you could talk with some of the other family members, you may not find similarly happy memories of childhood.

OP, perhaps this is a good time to have a look at your family and household. Is your wife adequately engaged in the lives of your existing children. Is she involved with school activities? Are they getting involved with after school or community activities to increase their social interactions and to develop good social skills? Perhaps these are topics that you and she could broach in MC......., that is, if could afford that.

I hope that both you and our wife work out this issue for the best.

ETA:


> and we qualify for and sometimes utilize government assistance because of our current income and family size


I also don't think it's a good idea to teach your kids that it's ok to have more kids because the government will *always* step in with some assistance/


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## Thundarr (Jul 4, 2012)

GLE3 said:


> She would get off pain meds in a second if I agreed to another one if that was doctor's orders.
> 
> Never did any kind of birth control. I would trust her if we started though. I would prefer just to get the vasectomy done. I'll see what google says on IUD's, maybe that's an option.
> 
> Once again thanks a bunch everyone, for you support and perspective!


She wants kids and you don't. I think the onus is on you and not her regarding any procedures. Something sounds self absorbed about asking her to deal with a potentially dangerous or painful thing when you're the one who doesn't want more kids.


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## belleoftheball (May 16, 2013)

EleGirl said:


> I vote for you getting snipped, secretly if you need to.
> 
> Your wife's desire for another child is not reasonable. She's not dealing with reality.
> 
> You both need to agree or there should not be another child.


I totally agree with this. It may sound harsh and wrong, but I think your wife is in some kind of fog and needs to wake up. It may be a little costly to get snipped at first, but look at how much you will be saving. If you do not want another child and in all honesty it does not sound like you need another, than go get fixed and not tell your wife. I mean you will still be having sex, but with no worries on your end and she will finally realize that another baby is not gonna come of it. Whatever you choose to do though, I wish you luck.


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## tacoma (May 1, 2011)

I might have missed something.

Why doe he need to get the V secretly?

I'd think that would be difficult to do without her ever finding out and when she does find out it will be ugly.

It's your body OP, tell her you don't want more kids and that you're getting the V.
It's much easier and more equitable that you do it since you're the one who wants no more kids.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## SunnyT (Jun 22, 2011)

And her wish for more kids.... will pass.

It's not unusual to "want more". I had my tubes tied after 5.... because apparently "more" can happen at any time and "more" isn't always a good idea. 

The whole idea of wanting another baby is just emotional/wishful thinking. I think especially when the youngest becomes a toddler... you kind of want that infant back! But one day, they all kind of grow up and do their own thing...and then YOU PARENTS CAN TOO! (That in itself is awesome!)

Then grandbabies come around..... they are awesome too! You love them and squeeze them and play with them.... and hand them off when they stink! 

Stick to your guns. This will pass.


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## Wiltshireman (Jan 23, 2013)

OP,

If you do not want any more children then do not father them. No one should be pressured into having a child / children just to please a partner. 

If you are certain how you feel then tell your wife that you are not having any more children. Do not have unprotected sex.

On a purely practical point the cost difference between a family of seven and one of eight is minimal.


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## Starstarfish (Apr 19, 2012)

When they are young, perhaps - but the cost of college these days isn't "minimal."


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## GLE3 (May 24, 2013)

NextTimeAround said:


> Is your wife adequately engaged in the lives of your existing children. Is she involved with school activities? /




Probably something I should have brought up in my original post……

My Wife is a selfless, loving, and passionate mother. She will put each one of her children before anything else, and I love her for that. We could have double the children we have right now and she would have enough love to go around. She is the one that lets me know about choir concerts and dance recitals. Whatever else, you name it…. Funny daily interactions, a ‘that was a first moment’, or the latest mischief my 4 year old has gotten into..  I do not question her as a mother. The thing is.. she is all about heart. The idea of that baby hit her heart before it went anywhere else. So not like me. I'm not on here to bash her, but to understand and find a balance where we can work through this and feel loved and respected, regardless of the outcome.

Planned or unplanned, our children are very much wanted and cared for by her and myself.

I am worried about our finances but I do not feel we are close to financial ruin. I work in an IT Department for a large insurance company in Michigan. If I had a mindset as Simply does with my money, I don’t think I would be where I am in the finance department. I just fear I’ll increase the risk of denying my children of something if I consciously choose to have another. Maybe it’s only that…a fear. It’s the provider in me. 

I hadn’t really thought about Thundarr’s viewpoint… I agree, asking her to do the IUD wouldn’t feel right as it is my stance to not have another. Was really only thinking of the IUD as something not as ‘final’ as getting the V. I was attracted to the idea of using it to let us both think about (a sixth) for a while.

I agree with others, getting the V secretly doesn’t sound like the right thing for me. I’m thinking I would have to be straight forward with her on this, because I know she would feel betrayed and totally bypassed. Sometimes I get worried about 'rocking the boat', but this would be a good example on what I would need to do for me, if I were to make this choice. I'm sure we could come to an understanding, as she has always appreciated when I have been up front with her.


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