# Marriage in crisis - Need help



## Phoenixny (Sep 24, 2013)

I came across this website while searching for answers to help me deal with my particular situation. The issues in my marriage have so far been discussed only between my husband and me. I need fresh perspectives, feedback and advice so that I can understand whether my marriage can survive the trauma it has been enduring, or whether it is a lost cause. This is going to be a long write-up, and I would appreciate your patience in hearing out completely this saga which first began fifteen years ago. I am the perpetrator in this story, my husband is the victim. 

I would shorten the story and give you the bare gist, but I have been accused of many things including lying, concealing, not sharing relevant details, so I want to put out everything here (without writing a book) so that you have the full story. As this is an anonymous account, I have the intention of baring every truth - just to clear my conscience and to get your valid opinions. I am prepared to hear all sorts of judgments, but please keep in mind that I am here to get advice on improving the situation. I need your help... so please, HELP ME, regardless of your personal opinions about my character.

Background: I arrived in this country at the age of fourteen. My family is well-educated and middle-class. I was brought up with strong moral values. I went to a girls-only school in my home-country, and did not have any interaction with boys or men, other than my close relatives. When I came to the US, I went to a public high school, which had girls and boys. I experienced culture shock during my sophomore and junior years, but in my senior year, I made some friends - they were "cool kids" who took me under their wing. I was flattered that they would befriend me - and they admired my intelligence. Under their influence, I began to think that it was cool - no, that it was necessary - to have a boyfriend, that make-up and attractive dressing was necessary to look beautiful. I was a very awkward teenager, I didn't consider myself beautiful, and so I felt the need to wear lipstick and look attractive. My mother was furious when she saw me with lipstick on, and she said, "only prostitutes wear lipstick". I was stung to the core, as I only wanted to look and feel pretty, that was the first demeaning remark someone had ever made to me. Other than that, my mother is a good woman, and I don't really have any complaints against her or my dad. However, there was a growing generational and cultural barrier between us, and there were some difficult times when I felt that my parents did not understand me. I couldn't talk to them freely about what I was experiencing in school, in America, without being slapped with a resounding judgment.

I graduated high school and began university with a scholarship. I was barely nineteen years old when my parents had to move back to their country. Since I was on a scholarship, I convinced my parents that I deserved to stay on and complete my education. So, at the age of nineteen, my parents left me behind in the care of family with $40,000 to finish my education and carve out a bright future for myself.

Now begins my story.

I had a part time job tutoring at the university's computer centre. One of the technicians who worked there had a friend who visited him. This guy, Mr.A, was 5 years older than I, seemed sophisticated, funny and smart. We connected right away. When he asked for my number, I was flattered. He then called and asked me out on a date. It was my very first date, and it was everything I anticipated. He brought me flowers, took me out to a fancy restaurant, then for a walk, and then he dropped me home ending the date with a peck on my cheek, leaving me happier than I had ever been in my life until then. He asked me out on a second date a few days later, it was just as great. On the third date, he told me he was Muslim, and asked if it was ok with me. I was shocked, but since I was raised to be secular, I decided (far too quickly) that a person's religion shouldn't matter. We had some blissful times together - there was much chemistry between us, but he was always respectful. He often told me that he was struck by my innocence and lack of sexual experience, and that he did not want to do anything which I was not ready for. He professed to love me, and led me to believe that we would marry some day. A couple of weeks later, he dropped a bombshell on me. He was illegal in the US, and now that he had a Canadian green card, he was going to move to Canada. He planned on visiting the US, however, the border authorities did not let him re-enter, and so, after 2 months of meeting the guy of my dreams, we were separated indefinitely. We continued our relationship long-distance, building a strong emotional connection. We used to have sexually-charged conversations on the phone. He told me it was okay since we weren't really doing anything, and because we were going to be married anyway. Fast forward to a year and half later.... he told me that he had talked to his mother several times, and that she was firmly against our marriage because I was not Muslim. I refused to convert, I felt that he should accept me just the way I accepted him when he first told me about his religion. So then he dumped me saying that he couldn't go against his mother. He said he wished that he could marry one woman to please his mother and another who was his true love. I was upset to hear such talk and I told him we couldn't talk anymore. But he kept calling me, and since I was still in love with him, I gave in, thinking he would convince his mother eventually. But what ended up happening is that he went to his country and got engaged to some "pious" girl his mother picked out for him, and amazingly enough, this girl offered her charms to him... and he ended up sleeping with her. When he returned to Canada and told me this, I felt outraged that he cheated on me, and I left him.

Upset as I was, I went on a self-destructive path. Skipping unnecessary details, I will move on to the time I met Mr.B, a guy in one of my classes at school. B was a nice guy, and we connected. Before we became intimate, I told him of my heart break, and he comforted me. He did not try to seduce me, but the intimacy just happened. He told me that he could not marry me because he was Muslim, and his parents would want him to marry a girl from his background. I was fine with that, I told him I didn't want to marry him either. I don't think the phrase was even coined back then, but I guess we were what we now call "friends with benefits". He became my first sexual partner. I was attracted to him because he was kind, gentle, respectful and always made me feel good about myself. We talked about our educational and career goals, studied together, helped each other with schoolwork, and of course, were intimate with each other. We were in a relationship for close to a year, until I transferred to a different university. We never actually broke up, we just parted and drifted apart on good terms. 

Some months later, I was returning home from classes late at night when this guy on my bus started talking to me. He was Afghan... and Muslim. I will call him Mr.C. (I think my obsession with Muslim men dates back to Mr.A, I felt like I was looking for him in every guy I met). So C asked me out and I said sure. _*(Yes, I was so easy to pick up....please analyze and tell me why you think I was so easy to pick up). *_It was a winter evening, and it was already dark when he picked me up on a street corner in his car, drove to a park, and sweet-talked all the way. Once he stopped, he immediately proceeded to demand sex. I was outraged...what did he think I was? He wouldn't even woo me, and he wanted me to do something with him in his car? He got really aggressive, and tried to touch me. I wouldn't take off my coat. He unzipped himself and grabbed my hands and put them on him. I am soft spoken as a rule, but I got loud and said I wanted him to take me home. He then started verbally abusing me, telling me I was ugly, that I didn't deserve to be with him, said I gave him "blue balls" (I didn't know what that was at the time) and I don't know what else he said to me - I don't remember - but then he dropped me back at the street corner where he picked me up. The minute I stepped out, he revved up the car and left me in the dust. I was relieved. 

_*Is it too mild to call me stupid? Yes, I was pretty messed up. Should I have stopped dating after that? Was this episode a mistake on my part, or was it because I was inherently bad?*_

Soon after this, I was in my last semester at the university, almost 22 years old. Although I started out on a scholarship, my grades had fallen abysmally because I was doing less studying and engaging in self-destructive behaviour. BTW I also worked to support myself by giving tuitions to students. In my last semester, I worked hard and landed an internship with a prestigious company in the engineering industry. One day, my boss invited a colleague from a different department to train me on some new software the company had acquired. This colleague, who I will call Mr.D, was a young guy, around 25 years old, and white - the first time I dated anyone outside my race. I found his intelligence and manner of talking in the corporate world very attractive. We ended up dating, however we kept it secret because we did not want people at work to know about it. We became intimate rather quickly. For one, we were attracted to each other, two, I had my own apartment by this time, and so did he, and thus, we had lots of privacy, and thirdly, I had begun to think that sex was what guys expected to receive and girls were expected to give when dating took place. But it was apparent rather soon that we really didn't have much in common with each other. One day, we had an accident - a condom broke - and I ended up going on the emergency pill. That put a sobering note on the relationship, and we came to a mutual decision to end the relationship. As he explained to me that last day, neither of us felt heart break as it was lust, not love which brought us together. 

Then there was a gap of about 6 months or so, and I was offered a job with the company. It was a great moment for me, as it meant that I could continue living in the USA. It was also a day of independence, and the beginning of a more comfortable life since I now was earning a decent salary. Filled with excitement and anticipation, I felt like the only thing I was lacking was the perfect guy. I wanted to get married, and I started to think that I wanted to be with a guy from my own country. I also wanted a guy who was from my own socio-religious background, someone my parents would not object to. So I did what most people from my country did when they were ready to marry: I created a profile on a matrimonial website. In addition to the similar socio-economic-religious requirement, I wanted someone who was americanized as I was; someone who had blended east-west values as I did. Thus, I came to meet Mr.E. At first it seemed like we were very compatible - but later - after we (unfortunately) became sexually intimate - I discovered that I didn't like him at all. He was selfish, stingy, too clingy and he wanted to have sex all the time. I ended up breaking up him.

Around this time, Mr. A's ban on entry into the US was lifted. One day he called me out of the blue, and told me he was in town and wanted to see me. He told me that in the intervening years, he realized my value and appreciated me for who I was. Also, the fiancee his mother set him up with turned out to be a fraud who was only looking for dollars and a green card. He wanted a chance to persuade me that he had changed and that he would give me a good life and make up for his earlier mistakes. I couldn't say no, and he ended up at my apartment. We did not have sexual intercourse, as while he did know that I dated after him, he did not know that I had been sexually active. (I don't know why I did not tell him that...I guess I am a liar?) We did however engage in oral sex. (It's not like I really wanted to, but for some strange reason, I felt obliged to. It was as if I owed men my body just because they deigned to speak to me or woo me or whatever). He introduced me to some of his family members (but not his parents) and asked for some time to persuade his mother. However, I reflected and decided that things could not work out between us because our families were too different. I broke up with him, however he continued to call me once in a while.

End of Part 1 of 3 parts.

How would you characterize me as a person? Would you say that my promiscuity was a result of pitfalls in judgment, poor self-esteem, sexual awakening/adventures, or deliberate disregard for moral values? What sort of punishment did I deserve? How could I make amends for my crimes?


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## Jasel (Jan 8, 2013)

> How would you characterize me as a person? Would you say that my promiscuity was a result of pitfalls in judgment, poor self-esteem, sexual awakening/adventures, or deliberate disregard for moral values? What sort of punishment did I deserve? How could I make amends for my crimes?


Well it says part 1 of 3. Are we supposed to wait for the rest?? So far I'm not really seeing anything out of the ordinary except for the creepy bus guy.


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## Squeakr (May 1, 2013)

Jasel said:


> Well it says part 1 of 3. Are we supposed to wait for the rest?? So far I'm not really seeing anything out of the ordinary except for the creepy bus guy.


Agree and I don't see anything about a Marriage referred to in the title either????


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## Jasel (Jan 8, 2013)

Squeakr said:


> Agree and I don't see anything about a Marriage referred to in the title either????


She mentioned a marriage in the first couple of sentences which is why I was wondering if we're supposed to wait for more.


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## pplwatching (Jun 15, 2012)

Phoenixny said:


> How would you characterize me as a person? Would you say that my promiscuity was a result of pitfalls in judgment, poor self-esteem, sexual awakening/adventures, or deliberate disregard for moral values? What sort of punishment did I deserve? How could I make amends for my crimes?


I'd characterize you as normal. We all come of age and fumble our way through relationships. We learn about sex and expectations from how the people around us behave and treat us. Don't beat yourself up over the path that you took, or what you learned along the way. Your job now is to decide the kind of person that you want to be now, and change your life and your actions to better reflect the kind of person that you want to be now that you've learned so much about life, relationships, and sex.

In my opinion, none of what you've written has anything to do with whatever problem you're facing now. If you have broken marriage vows and had an affair then own up to it and do what you need to do to move on. If you want to remain married, then work towards creating a healthy marriage. If you don't want to be married, then divorce and move on.

Your past led you to where you are now, but you get to decide what your future holds.


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## ScrewedEverything (May 14, 2013)

Take a breath. If I counted right, we're talking about having 2 sexual partners (I think most would discount the one-time oral dalliance with Mr. A) in a 4 year period. Few would call that promiscuous. Particularly since we are talking about a period in life when most people engage liberally in "sexual awakening/adventures." In fact, by most western standards, you were almost prudish. So why so hard on yourself? 

That characterization of yourself in the last paragraph says poor self-esteem and poor self-confidence more loudly than any of the actions you described.


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## Phoenixny (Sep 24, 2013)

*Part 2 of 3*

Year 2000: I began my new job at this prestigious company. I was hired to assist DH (Dear Husband, for we ended up getting married), who developed software. He was Muslim and from my culture/region.

I used to deliberately act liberated when DH was around, I wanted to be the anti-thesis of the Muslim woman stereotype. I guess I was projecting my anger with Mr.A onto him. He thought I was on the path of ruin, and wanted to "save" me. He did not want any girl from our culture to lose her values. He would wait for me after work to offer me a ride home, looking for an opportunity to befriend me. I just avoided him. 

One day, I was sick from asthma, and feeling fatigued as I did, I reluctantly accepted his offer to drop me home. He also picked up his friend on the way, and the three of us went to dinner. I did not want to go, but I couldn't say no out of politeness. I was too sick to talk, so I mostly listened. What I heard changed my mind about Mr.D. I came away from that meeting with a new respect for him. I was absent from work for the next few days due to my illness, and DH called to ask about me, and came to visit me. Thus began our friendship in December 2000.

In March 2001, we were hanging out after work, watching a comedy on television at my apartment when we exchanged our first kiss. He was 26 years old and had never had a girlfriend because his religion and morals forbade it. I genuinely liked him, but I'm not sure why I kissed him. Was it a routine thing for me to do that? Or was it because my heart beat just a little faster when he was around, and a jolt of electricity ran through me? Anyway, I was very nervous knowing that he was a different sort of person from the men I'd known. I had a premonition that he might not approve of the men in my past since he himself did not have a past. On my birthday, we made love for the very first time. He told me that we were going to marry and have children together, and I could see his sincerity. 

A few days later, I worked up the courage to tell him about my past. Unfortunately I lacked the courage to tell him the complete truth. Partly because I was ashamed, having sensed for the first time that I might have done something which may have been acceptable in the West, but was seen as something very very shameful in the Eastern mindset; and partly because, we worked together, and I was afraid that he might be upset and tell everyone at work - I would be shamed, and I couldn't afford to lose my job, as it would mean going back home (since I was on a work visa). So I made a big mistake - i told a half-truth. He didn't say much then, but I could see that he was profoundly hurt by my truth. He came back a few days later and asked more questions. Then I made more mistakes - I did not tell the complete truth. I told bits and pieces of the truth, sugar-coating it in between tearful stammers. I cried, I was very ashamed - not so much because I fully realized what I had done, but because I could see disgust in his eyes, which told me that I was scum. I wanted only to salvage my dignity, I wanted him to see me as the person he loved and respected only a few days ago. But the damage was done, and things would never again be the same. 

He seemed to come to terms, and we closed the chapter; but in a few days, he would ask me something, and when the answers did not make sense, he would get upset at me and demand more answers to his questions. It was an interrogation in which he would be asking questions, screaming at me, looking at me with scorn, and I would be crying, pleading for understanding and forgiveness. My offense was cheating. I was shocked - how had I cheated on him? I had cheated by not waiting for him to come into my life, for giving myself away so easily. I had cheated by responding to the occasional phone call or email from an ex-boyfriend. This was extremely disrespectful to him. 

During the ensuing months, we had alternating periods of bliss and trauma. Since I lacked the courage to tell him the entire truth, the exercise was like pulling teeth without an anesthetic. Every few months he would learn something new. I am not a good liar, nor was it ever my intention to lie to him. Hence, the truth would come out unraveled in bits and pieces. I accept completely my fault here, and take responsibility for the damage it did to our relationship. He is a perfectionist, who has very little tolerance for the faiblities of human nature. I was a woman - who in his mind was supposed to be the epitome of chastity and modesty- and yet I had committed the biggest offence, namely fornication. He could not get over it. He would scream at me, denigrate me for hours, days, at a stretch. I was gripped with an overpowering fear - I would beg for forgiveness, cry, stop eating for days. I began to hate myself, my body. I had nervous breakdowns. I tried to cut my veins, but stopped short I don't know why. Once I took half a bottle of sleeping pills, and came close to death; but then I made myself throw up. It was never my intention to manipulate him - I only wanted him to understand that I understood why he was so angry, that I hated my offence and would do anything to change things. I wanted his forgiveness, but he only saw it as an attempt at manipulation, he thought i was being cunning. He would not be manipulated by my tears, my grief... but everything I felt stemmed from genuine remorse. 

In November 2001, I converted to Islam, thinking that my sins would be forgiven and that DH and I could have a new start together. But nothing changed... the same questions popped up, and there was still much of the truth waiting to be told. He needed to have the complete truth told to him, but I knew that he could not handle it, and I lacked the courage to tell it. Our fights escalated, the pattern was the same. I might do or say something that would trigger his anger. He would verbally abuse me, physically punish me (like making me stand in the cold in the middle of january without a jacket, to make me feel the pain I had given him with my truth). I believed that I was despicable, that I deserved every punishment, that I had to go through hell and purgatory before I could get to heaven. So I debased myself and endured every ignominy. He would ignore me, my phone calls to beg him to take me back. He scorned me by saying that even if he left me, I could easily take another lover, so I needn't do this drama of being heartbroken by his rejection. So I believed that in order to prove that I was a changed person, I needed to convince him, to make him take me back. If I became the changed person that I wanted to be, then I couldn't be with another man after being intimate with DH. My only redemption was with his forgiveness.

I also came to hate sex and my body. I wanted to divorce myself from my past, and to become a clean, new person. DH and I continued to be intimate, but honestly I didn't want to do it. I felt that if pre-marital sex was wrong in the past, then it was wrong now too. But DH said that we were going to be married, so it was okay. I didn't object because I didn't want to have another fight. I was afraid that if I said no, DH would say that I slept so easily with other men, but I was acting pricey with him. It would be many many years before I came to accept my past, myself, and sex as a normal part of married life.

The fights continued, atleast once every month something would go wrong. DH said he detested my tears and protestations (arguments) because I cried and protested when I told him lies about the past. One time when he left me, he made me sign a contract if I wanted him to return. The contract specified that I could not do any one of seventeen things. These included not crying, not lying, not arguing, not being impudent, not defended myself, not forget things (esp things he told me to do or not do), not being hysterical/suicidal, obeying him immediately and gracefully, etc. If I didn't sign it and promise to do all these things, which were for my own benefit, then he would not return. I realized that they would only benefit me and the relationship, so I signed. 

However, I had become very defensive and paranoid as a result of all the fighting, and whenever I perceived that I was about to be attacked, I would pre-emptively defend myself by explaining my motive. This would trigger a fight.

Sometimes he would provoke my hysteria and tears. For example, he often tells me that nobody respected me in the past. The only reason people respect me now is because I am with him. That he lifted me out of the gutter, elevated me to a status of respect; and whenever he wanted, he could throw me back into the gutter. Such things were heartbreaking to hear, and I would cry or get upset and stand up for myself, which would then result in a major offensive on his part.

He always says that I am the one who introduced indignities into our relationship, that because of my past, our relationship is tainted, and everything is therefore my fault. His responses are only reactions to my actions.


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## Phoenixny (Sep 24, 2013)

Thank you for your replies. Please bear with me, I need to tell the full story. also, the baby just woke up, so I will sit down to write the rest later.


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## MovingAhead (Dec 27, 2012)

I'm sorry, but if you tell the full story, you won't get that much advice. The important details are what matters. You would be better served by only including the people who directly affect your predicament. It is hard for many of us to read through so many details and pick out the ones really important. It gets confusing.


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## Phoenixny (Sep 24, 2013)

ScrewedEverything said:


> Take a breath. If I counted right, we're talking about having 2 sexual partners (I think most would discount the one-time oral dalliance with Mr. A) in a 4 year period. Few would call that promiscuous. Particularly since we are talking about a period in life when most people engage liberally in "sexual awakening/adventures." *In fact, by most western standards, you were almost prudish*. So why so hard on yourself?
> 
> That characterization of yourself in the last paragraph says poor self-esteem and poor self-confidence more loudly than any of the actions you described.


Thank you. 

Why I'm so hard on myself is answered in Part 2.

The reason I mentioned ethnicities is because I would like you to take into account cultural sensitivities. Try, if possible, to judge me by conservative eastern standards.

Poor self-esteem and poor self-confidence - that is something I will address in my last post, because it pertains to the person I have become today. Please bear with me!


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

You need counselling to help you work out what you did, why you did it and what you should do.


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## Phoenixny (Sep 24, 2013)

MovingAhead said:


> I'm sorry, but if you tell the full story, you won't get that much advice. The important details are what matters. You would be better served by only including the people who directly affect your predicament. It is hard for many of us to read through so many details and pick out the ones really important. It gets confusing.


I understand, but I cannot abridge the story more than this. It is important to me to get feedback based on the complete confession and my current situation. I have never been able to tell anyone my story, and if i can't do it on an anonymous board, then where else can i tell it? Thanks for replying. I'll try to be as clear as possible.


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## Phoenixny (Sep 24, 2013)

MattMatt said:


> You need counselling to help you work out what you did, why you did it and what you should do.


I agree, but DH refuses to go for counseling- he considers it a shame that anyone should know the truth about me. Since I can't see a therapist, I'm turning to this board for help.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

Phoenixny said:


> I agree, but DH refuses to go for counseling- he considers it a shame that anyone should know the truth about me. Since I can't see a therapist, I'm turning to this board for help.


Nothing available through the mosque?


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## Phoenixny (Sep 24, 2013)

Part 3:

Things continued the same way in our relationship. We were very attached to each other, and we thought that the fact that our relationship could survive all these storms was an indication of how strongly we loved each other.

Our parents were against the marriage simply because of the country and religion factor. It took 8 years to secure their acceptance. His parents, though initially against the marriage, were finally persuaded to come around. My parents were staunchly against it, but told me that they would have to accept it if I presented them with a fait-accompli. I mention this, because it put me under a lot of pressure to make my marriage successful. If things did not work out, there were a lot of people waiting to say, "We told you so." on my side and on his side.

In September 2009, after 9 years of knowing each other most intimately, we got married. A day before the marriage, we had another fight, and I told him that you have long known everything there is know about me. There are no more secrets. Think hard about whether you still want to marry me. 

After the marriage, things were good in the beginning, but soon the same issues began to resurface. Keen to be accepted, I did my best to make everyone happy - and within a few weeks, everyone in his family, and extended family came to love and accept me as one of their own. However, DH began to complain that I cared more about his family than I did about him, that I was not giving him enough time. 

I got a great job working at a top not-for-profit organisation that worked for the health and dignity of women around the world. Yet, in my own home, I was made to feel like a non-entity or less than human on account of my past sins. DH says that every time i disobey him, or argue or cry or get upset, it takes him back to the lies I told him initially, and that begins a reel of tape in his brain where he sees visual and graphic images of me doing nasty things with my ex-partners. He sometimes makes me stand or sit and listen to him for hours as he lists my wrongs and questions my actions. It is no less than an interrogation of a criminal or war captive. I am deprived of sleep and mentally fatigued... yet he says that he is going through the same thing. _*I want to ask, is it really the same? Is his anguish the same as mine when he is the one screaming and I'm the one who has to submissively listen to verbal abuse? I really need to understand what he is going through, because at times like this, I do honestly feel like I'm the victim.*_ The situation at home affected my performance at work, and I feel that it is the reason why I did not get the permanent position.

Then we discovered that I was pregnant. The joy was short lived. My first trimester was difficult what with the raging hormones. I had a terrible acne breakout, and I felt most unattractive. And we had a terrible fight. I was under extreme stress, and begged him not to bother me as it would affect the baby, to forgive my faults, but he said that the baby was just an excuse and i just wanted to escape my responsibility. After the first ultrasound, he was gentler with me and did not fight with me for the rest of my pregnancy.

When I was in the sixth month of my pregnancy (Jan 2012), DH underwent a back surgery, which left him on bedrest for 6 weeks. I was his primary care-giver and I did everything from prepare his food specially, get his medicines, take him to the ER in an emergency, stay by his side at the hospital, care for him through the pain and discomfort at night, change his urine catheter, assist him in the bathroom when he had gut-wrenching bowel movements, clean up after him, help him take showers, comfort and console him when he thought he couldn't do it. I did it because I loved him, but also because I believed that I could earn his love and respect through my dedication. He was touched, and spoke to me with love and respect for the first time in years, said that we needed to forgive each other and move on. I was so happy that day.

Then our child was born... I thought that things were getting better for us. But his feelings faded away. As I got busy with motherhood, he started feeling ignored, though I tried never to let him feel that way. Somehow everything I do is not enough. My efforts are not good enough. What am I doing wrong? I resolve every time to not argue or defend myself, to be quiet when he is angry..but there comes a point when I either break down in tears or I explode at the injustice, and then all hell breaks loose.

When our baby was three months old, we were on vacation. On the last day, we were scrambling to check out when I said something that he perceived as disrespectful. A big fight ensued and he raised his hand to strike me. I spoke up loudly and said, don't ever hit me again. That made him furious and he threatened to divorce me. He kept provoking me until I spoke up for myself. At that point, he stopped in the middle of nowhere in rural Virginia, and made me get out of the car with the baby in the car seat. He drove off, and for 10 mins I was stranded on the roadside, shaking in fear and despair. He returned after 10 mins, told me to put the baby in the car and get back in. When the baby was in the car, he drove off again, leaving me standing all alone, totally shattered from within. He returned after another 20 minutes, and screamed at me all the way from Virginia to New York City.

That is an episode which I find very hard to forgive. I cannot bear to be separated from my baby, who is all I have at this point. But DH thinks that I have no right to forgive him - for he has done no wrong. He says that the root cause of all the evil in our lives is my past and the lies I have been telling.

Now, September 2013, twelve years since we first met - my past is still an issue. A few days ago, he called me a prostitute. He thinks I sold my body for some benefits. He calls me a liar. Yes, I lied for a long time - first about the past, then about little mundane things. He says I'm a compulsive liar - but in my defense, I say that fear of reprisal motivated me to lie even about the smallest things. However, I have completely stopped lying now. Maybe it is too little too late. 

Currently we are in the middle of a fight. DH has been questioning me for the past 3 days for hours. He asks specific questions about my past. Apparently he made notes on his computer about the answers I gave him in the past, so he compares my answers to what he has in his notes. He is very angry with me now because my answers are different from what he has recorded. So he says I'm still a liar.

He says that he will not end this until I tell him the truth. He wants to know why I did what I did. I reply that I did it because I had the freedom, because I was messed up; but he won't accept that answer. Then I say, I don't know why, and he won't accept that answer either. The problem is that, in the past, fed up with the interrogation, fatigued and desperate to end the fight, I have often told him what I thought he wanted to hear. The other problem is that, because of what he put me through, I almost tore myself away from the past in the sense that I suppressed many of the memories. Whatever I remember, I have put down in this topic. But he says he can't accept "I don't remember" as an answer. He wants me to think and retrieve those memories. It is torture for me to visit those lanes in my memory, and even when I do, I find that I truly cannot remember what I wore on the day I met the Afghan guy, or what my daily schedule was like with Mr.A. He says that it is not possible for anyone to forget such things, that I continue to lie and conceal. He says things will never be the same until I tell him the full truth. He says that he thinks he will not let me go to my US citizenship interview, and that he will fight for custody of our child if we divorce - he is sure that the court will grant him custody as he can prove that i'm an unfit mother since he has all my past emails (he took over my existing email accounts 12 years ago and read and archived all my emails to and from my ex-partners).

In August of this year, he told me that the only way he could ever respect me is if i proved that I can become someone. He acknowledges that I'm intelligent, and he wants me to become a doctor. That will redeem me in his eyes. So now I'm enrolled in school full time, working part-time as a math tutor, volunteering one day a week at a doctor's clinic, doing most of the household chores and managing the baby (who has recently started going to day care). I'm exhausted most of the time, but DH expects that I should make time for him, that I should be available for sex instead of falling asleep in my son's room as I nurse him at night. I need to be a good wife.

Twelve years later, this is the situation I find myself in. I'm finding it very hard to study and succeed in my classes. I have three exams next week and I'm very stressed out.

How much of this do I truly deserve? How can I resolve this situation with DH? What can I do to fix things, for I really do want my marriage to work out. Obviously this post has only had negative stuff, but DH and I have had a lot of good memories too. 

The reason I put this post under Cheating, is because DH says I have cheated on him, even though my affairs took place before I ever met him. That is the crux of the problem in our relationship.

Please advise.


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## Phoenixny (Sep 24, 2013)

MattMatt said:


> Nothing available through the mosque?


even I wouldn't go to the mosque. it is a small community and we cannot take such a risk.

BTW we are not particularly religious. We do not actively practice the religion.


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## MovingAhead (Dec 27, 2012)

Your husband is an ass and a fool. I know there are cultural differences and I am not trying to be Ethnocentric, but a man should never hit a woman, nor should he leave her stranded on the side of the road.

You neither deserve to be hit or controlled or treated like property. If you would like that life you can go live over in a country where that kind of treatment is ok, but here, I don't think most people take kindly to men who treat their wives like that.


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## now_awake (May 29, 2013)

No, no, no! There is NO infidelity here. This is a case of severe abuse! You have done nothing wrong! I know you probably find that difficult to believe, but that's because of how long you've dealt with this trauma. Please please find a woman's shelter! You may think I'm overreacting, but it's difficult to see the seriousness of a situation when you're in it. 

Edit: i had a link here, but I realize that maybe it's not safe to visit it if you have a shared computer.


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## Jasel (Jan 8, 2013)

I read through all of that and your sexual history sounds very tame compared to most of the women whose sexual history I know. Cultural differences aside, your husband just sounds like an abusive @$$hole and I don't think any amount of truth or verification of your past behavior, whether he knows everything or not, is going to change anything. It's obvious he's always going to think that there's more or something you're holding back. Whether that's your fault for trickle truthing, his for having unrealistic expectations, or a combination is debatable but at this point probably doesn't even matter as I doubt much is going to change.

What exactly are you looking for and what are your options? And have you thought about finding a therapist, one who is familiar with your religious and cultural values, who you could see on your own??


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## pplwatching (Jun 15, 2012)

The man that you married is a hypocrite. He had sex with you before marriage and yet chose to belittle and degrade you for having sex before marriage. What did he feel entitled him to this double standard? 

He is also abusive, controlling, and manipulative. His actions can not be described any other way. Unfortunately, many women married to such men are unable to come to terms with this and stay in these relationships because they feel powerless to change anything. These men usually go to great lengths to make women feel powerless.

It is up to you if you want to stay in this marriage. It will require a great deal of change on his part to make this marriage a healthy one. It is unfortunate that a child is in the middle of this mess. 

Best of luck to you.


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## pplwatching (Jun 15, 2012)

You write that on the eve of your wedding that you told him everything, and that he chose to marry you anyway. One of the principles of a loving marriage is that it is a commitment to constant personal growth and change. We each accept our partner for who they have been, who they are, and who they will become. In the case of your marriage, your husband refuses to love who you were and you (rightfully) can not love who he is.

Another cornerstone of a loving marriage is that we treat each other with respect, dignity, and love at all times. Your husband does not treat you this way, but perhaps he has simply never learned how to nurture a loving relationship. Loving spouses do not throw temper tantrums and mistreat those that we love when we feel like we're not getting enough attention or aren't getting our way. We certainly don't degrade those that we love and use terrible, hurtful words to control them. We never leave them stranded on the side of the highway or make them stand in the cold because we are angry. 

Your husband is wrong. People do not respect you simply because you are married to him. If they knew the truth about him, the opposite would be true. They respect you because of who you are, and who you have shown yourself to be. They love and respect you because of the way you treat them. He knows this, and also knows that when people see who he really is that they will not respect him. This is why he doesn't want to go for marriage counselling. Because he knows that his behavior shames himself.

You have nothing to be ashamed of in your past. It is important to understand that it is in the past. It is unfortunate that you felt that he couldn't handle knowing about your past, but that is not the crime here. The injustice is holding on to the past and refusing to let go of things that can not be changed, especially in light of the fact that you have shown love and kindness to him. You can not change how or what you told him. 

You have a marriage in name only. The good news is that he can learn to be a better spouse and earn respect if that's what he wants to do. There is no shame in admitting that we have made mistakes in the past and seeking to become better people. Only he can choose to see the beauty inside of you and choose to nurture a loving marriage with you.

It would seem to me that if he is unwilling to see the beautiful and loving person that you are, and to treat you in a manner that you deserve, that your options are very limited. In time you will see that you do not deserve his words or his actions. If you are still married to him at that time you will become very resentful and very bitter. If you are divorced when you learn to love yourself, then learning to love yourself again will empower you to live a more fulfilling life, and you'll find another person to love.

Take care of the little one, and God bless you.


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## Phoenixny (Sep 24, 2013)

Thanks for your replies.

What am I looking for? Well, first answers to give to him tomorrow.
He wants to know:

- how I could sleep with Mr.B without the premise of a long-term relationship? he feels it contradicts my previous defense that I did it because I had low self-esteem, and because I was desperately looking for love. I don't think it is contradictory because I did feel low about myself at the time, and Mr.B did treat me well.

- how could i go with Mr.C (Afghan) from the bus? And why I did not stop dating, why that incident didn't put fear in me. Also, he feels that there is no way that nothing more happened, he feels that the guy must have raped me, and I'm concealing the fact. However, the truth is exactly as I have told. Yes, I came close to being raped or killed, but all I can say is that I was fortunate nothing bad happened.

- how I could break up so casually with the white guy

- if i was looking for someone from my culture after the white guy, then why did i leave the indian guy

I'm not really looking to you guys to supply me with answers.... i'm looking for some insight into my character. maybe you see something i don't. DH will not accept my answer that i was messed up or that I don't remember or understand why I did what I did.

secondly, I'm looking for a way to convince him to bury the past. i still want to make my marriage work.

I cannot leave him because I cannot bear to be separated from my child. If I initiate divorce, he will put me through hell.

I feel suicidal sometimes because i think that it is the only way to escape my painful situation. but i think of my child and my family and desist. anyway, i'm a seasoned scarred war veteran. I want to survive, and make my life dignified and successful. I'm willing to give it my best no matter how long it takes. 

Am I a fool to think that if I do the right thing, then things will eventually work out for me?


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

You have a pattern of getting together with abusive Muslim men. And finally got married to one. 

What is your relationship with you family now ?


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## pplwatching (Jun 15, 2012)

My insight into your character is that you are a beautiful person trapped in a terrible situation that you don't know how to handle. In my very humble opinion, in the morning you should refuse to give him any answers at all because doing so simply perpetuates this madness. Doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results is the very definition of insanity. 

What you fail to see is that this is not about your character. This is about your husband's insecurity and his inability to love you and accept that you are a human being, who like all of the rest of us learned the hard way about sex, love, and life. We learn from our mistakes and we get on with living a loving and fulfilling life. He is not willing to let you do that, and _that_ is what this is about. He can only control you as long as he makes you think that you are somehow defective or in need of his forgiveness.

This is your marriage, and you have to handle this situation as you see fit. In your shoes, I would not tolerate this sort of interrogation. It only serves to perpetuate his power over you. Point out to him that all of these things are in the past, that they happened before you met him, and most importantly that the fact that these questions refuse to die is tearing apart your marriage. There are no answers that you can give this man that will satisfy him. The best that you can do is demand that he treat you with the dignity and respect that you deserve - and have proven that you deserve, and put these issues to rest once and for all.

This man needs to realize that his actions are mean, hurtful, and destructive to his marriage. In your shoes I would tell this man that if he can not move past this and treat me with respect, that I will file for divorce because this treatment is both intolerable and violates my love that I gave to him.


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## WalterWhite (Sep 14, 2012)

Phoenix,

Your husband is abusing you physically, mentally, verbally, and physiologically. What he is doing may we'll be the norm in eastern backward cultures, but it is never just and healthy. It is abuse and people like your husband NEVER EVER change. You will NEVER have peace in that culture and with him. You should have married a decent westerner that respects women, is forgiving, non judgemental, and kind. Get out of this hell you call marriage! This is not of God. That culture is of Satan.

You are a normal decent woman. Too bad that culture you married into makes you feel dirty and scum. You are none of these things. 

If you don't get out of this marriage, it will sap you of your health, your youth, and your self respect.

Do you really think that coming up with answers to his demanding questions is going to change anything? Make it better? No, it will not! For every answer you give him, he will have 5 more!


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

Your husband is an abusive man. The fact that he didn't ever date anyone else well into adulthood is very disturbing, combined with his naive and ignorant views on adult relationships and loyalty makes me wonder about his mental state. 

He is abuse and cruel, without any empathy, he spouts foolish rhetoric that is just ignorant mindless quotes from people who spread hate.

My advice is get yourself and your child to a centre for abused women and don't ever go back. Get legal help in divorcing hum and obtaining a restraining order against him.

He is an abusive bully and neither you nor your child should be subject to his cruelty.


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## now_awake (May 29, 2013)

I'm not surprised that you're not going to listen to our advice. You are in a deep fog right now, and I get that. 

Since you ask about your own character, I'll address that for you. As many many of us are, you are a people pleaser. You never learned to stand up for yourself and say no. This is probably due to your upbringing and the dynamics of your parents relationship (I'm not saying it was an abusive dynamic, necessarily). You are most likely codependent, again, as many of us are. It's not 'bad', it's just that we never learned to set boundaries to protect ourselves from others. 

So, as codependents, we find ourselves going from one bad situation to the next, always wondering why these things happen to us. That will be our reality until we wake up to the truth. Again, there is nothing bad about this, it doesn't make us bad people. At the time, we only did the best we could with what we knew about ourselves. But our job in life is to grow and learn. 

My codependency and people pleasing has led me to pick addicts as partners. For you, it has led to ending up with abusive men. 

I'm learning that there is a huge difference between codependent behavior and compassion. We can be compassionate without letting others abuse us. 

Again, I urge you to go to a women's shelter. They will most likely get you free legal advice from a lawyer and then you can know the truth of your situation with your son and not the fear that your husband has instilled in you.


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## Knobbers (Sep 25, 2013)

My earliest memories are of my father beating my mother. I then watched him verbally abuse her for most of my childhood. When I married my wife, I promised myself I would break the cycle and never hit her, what I didn't realize is that I verbally abused her for ten years.

I didn't realize what I was doing was not right, because it was all I ever knew about marriage. I wasn't horribly abusive verbally, but looking back I was very wrong. One day my wife said to me "you sound just like your father" and then it hit me. What I was doing and the man I tried to be nothing like, I was becoming a spitting image of him, minus the physical abuse.

Needless to say, I turned it around and now have the most amazing life and marriage a man could ever ask for. It took a very strong woman and for me to be brutally honest with myself to change, but I did it. I'm one of the few who realized before it was too late and for that I am so grateful.

Now, what I'm getting at is I'm not sure your husband will ever change and based on what you write it doesn't seem to be getting better. You may be afraid of leaving your husband, but you should be more afraid for your son to grow up and treat his future wife the same. You have done nothing wrong, based on your story, your character seems perfectly fine and if anything you are prudish compared to women I've known most of my life. You have not sinned, and have nothing to be sorry for.

Please leave that man, or you might be sorry in 20 years when your son marries and treats his wife the same way you are being treated. Break the cycle now, so your son wont have to. Best of luck, you have many things going for you and certainly can make a great life for you and your son without that abuser you call a husband.


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## lewmin (Nov 5, 2012)

By American culture, your past relationships and sexual history before you got married is very tame...it would not be an issue with me at all and the overwhelming majority of people on this board. Most of us have some history before getting married, and that's more of the norm. When you are in college and in your 20's that is a time to explore and develop your character and your independence. You never jumped right into the sack with anyone and waited until you felt there was some kind of a real connection. Most men respect that attribute.

You seem like a great person, but men have been emotionally abusing you for a long time. You deserve better and you are still young and have your whole life ahead of you. Your current husband has brainwashed you to the point that you have a horrible opinion of yourself and your sexuality. That's just awful. I hope some good eventually comes out of this posting of your life on TAM.


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## Phoenixny (Sep 24, 2013)

Today was Day 4 of the fight. As soon as we got into the car to go to school, he started screaming at me. He says that we will have no relations, no conversation until I tell him the complete truth. Not what I think he wants to hear, not what I imagine happened, but the plain truth. He won't take "I do not remember" for an answer. But when I tell him everything I know, he won't accept it as the truth. It's a vicious cycle. He says that the only way things will change is if I can convince him that it is the truth.

@Knobbers- I understand what you are telling me, and I actually have thought about it. I do fear that my son will emulate his father's behaviour, as my husband emulated his own father. DH keeps saying that his dad mistreated (the correct word would be "abused") his mom, but for some reason, he thinks that he does not do it to me. He thinks that he treats me wonderfully, and I'm an ingrate for complaining. I should be eternally grateful to him for salvaging my life, because had it not been for his intervention, I would most likely be a single mom of an illegitimate child. No one would want me.
I truly thought he married me because he loved me...and often times it does seem like he loves me... but then he will say things like, "I married you because you promised to abide by those seventeen things. You promised that you would change. I married you because I'm a man who keeps his promises, unlike you, I do not go for multiple partners. You trapped me by seducing me, and I had to marry you because of the intimacy we shared."

Such accusations shatter me, make me crumble. I never ever had the intention to seduce or trap him. I only ever loved him...but he says, how can it be love when you did it with all the others? And I don't have an answer to that. 

Anyway, what I want to ask you is, how did you change?

One time he screamed at me for 20 minutes (because I forgot my phone at home) in front of his 4 year old niece who adores me. She got all quiet, but didn't say a word. Later, I was concerned for her well-being, so I asked her what she thought happened in the car. She said Uncle got mad at you. I said, yes, he did.. but how did it make you feel? She said, scared. I asked her, do you think it's okay for him to scream like that? She said, yes... you shouldn't do things that will make him mad, and then he won't get mad.
She said it in such a matter of fact way that it sent chills down my spine. This 4 year old is already processing verbal abuse as something that is very normal. Is that what will happen to my son, I thought? Perhaps one day he will rationalize it all as Mommy's fault. 

DH once threatened me that he would not let our son go because when he grows up, he intends to tell him the truth about his mother. These are the fears that make me put a lid on everything. I want to protect my son, as I cannot imagine the damage that my past will do to his young mind. I also can't bear to be exposed like that to him. Motherhood is so sacred, how can someone disrespect it like that?


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## Phoenixny (Sep 24, 2013)

@now_awake - Thank you for your post and your insight. Much of what you said makes sense. I need to work on myself, and learn to help people without compromising my well-being.

I don't want anyone to think that their advice will fall on deaf ears. This is a very difficult situation, I am paralyzed by the fear of what will ensue if he finds me talking about this even on this forum, let alone go to a women's shelter or seek a lawyer's advice. However, I do realize that life cannot continue like this. That is why last week, I reached out to a South Asian Domestic Violence organization. However, I never got a reply from them, and that was very discouraging for me. I felt like maybe they didn't believe me. After all, DH doesn't hit me regularly...he only hit me twice in twelve years.
My son is my weakness right now, but he is also my source of strength and my motivation to resolve this situation.


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## Phoenixny (Sep 24, 2013)

Knobbers said:


> Best of luck, you have many things going for you and certainly can make a great life for you and your son without that abuser you call a husband.


I don't see how. I am empty-handed...what do I have going for me? I don't have much money, where will I live, how will I care for my son? I just enrolled in school, how will I continue my education? What can I do if DH sues for custody of my son?

It's much easier said than done.


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## Phoenixny (Sep 24, 2013)

Jasel said:


> What exactly are you looking for and what are your options? And have you thought about finding a therapist, one who is familiar with your religious and cultural values, who you could see on your own??


Please see my reply to Knobbers above.

I have not looked for a therapist. For one, I would rather save every spare penny for the day I might be discarded. I would be interested in going to counseling with DH, but otherwise, I can survive. Just coming to this board and having the majority of my feelings validated has given me relief and strength. Thank you.


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## pplwatching (Jun 15, 2012)

Phoenixny said:


> I cannot imagine the damage that my past will do to his young mind.


Your past is not the problem. Your husband is. 

He wants you to believe that your past is a problem because that is how he controls you; by making you believe his terrible lies. By yelling at you and demanding answers he controls all of the communication. Instead of standing up for yourself and your rights you break down and give him what he wants. By making you believe that you have no value, he keeps you from asserting your rights as a human being and as a woman. 

Your fear is his greatest weapon against you. As long as you let him control you with it, nothing will change. If I were in your place, I would simply tell him that I refuse to be interrogated and belittled any longer by such a cruel and abusive man. Take your son and leave. Don't fear freedom. There is a better life waiting for you without him.


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## TooBroken (Sep 23, 2013)

OP, you have done nothing wrong in your marriage as far as infidelity. Your husband's perception is skewed, and I doubt that's even from a cultural standpoint. He is abusive. Period. 

I left the abusive father of my children years ago. I did have to hear a lot of folks chide me for depriving them of their father, but to raise children in this atmosphere teaches young men to emulate their fathers and young women to believe it is to be expected. And that helped me hold my ground better than anything else. If I couldn't be strong for myself, I could be strong enough to put my children in a healthier emotional situation. 

I hope that you find the strength to leave this horrible man. He is cruel to you. He's judged you unfairly. You've accepted that judgment out of your own feelings of guilt. Forgive yourself for whatever wrongs YOU perceive and move on. 

You are stronger than you realize, and you can do what is right for you and for your child. 

In the meantime, I hope you find all the support you need here.


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## TooBroken (Sep 23, 2013)

I would also suggest that you find a hotline for victims of domestic violence. Verbal and emotional abuse is still abuse. I know that there are many many battered women's shelters across the country, and they can often help victims relocate and begin life over again while providing lots of emotional support. Everything they do is confidential, too.


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## Phoenixny (Sep 24, 2013)

pplwatching said:


> The man that you married is a hypocrite. He had sex with you before marriage and yet chose to belittle and degrade you for having sex before marriage. What did he feel entitled him to this double standard?


DH says he's not particularly religious, and pre-marital sex doesn't bother him so much, it's the multiple partners that bothers him. But that contradicts his other statement which is, 1) how could you cheat on me, not waiting for the man you would marry is cheating him. 2) even if he had pre-marital sex, he married me, the only person he has been intimate with, so that makes it okay.
3) it's ok if people have pre-marital sex as long as they have the intention of marrying that person. since i didn't have any intention of marriage, that makes it wrong.


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## Phoenixny (Sep 24, 2013)

pplwatching said:


> You write that on the eve of your wedding that you told him everything, and that he chose to marry you anyway.


I just want to clarify that he knew everything months before we got married - telling him everything on the eve of the wedding would not give him enough time to make an informed decision - that would be manipulative and unfair. 

He knew everything atleast 5 months before we got married. We just happened to have an argument the eve of our wedding, it escalated, and he said that he didn't think we should get married. 
I told him that there was still time, i was not forcing him to marry me, he could still walk away.


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## pplwatching (Jun 15, 2012)

Phoenixny said:


> DH says he's not particularly religious, and pre-marital sex doesn't bother him so much, it's the multiple partners that bothers him. But that contradicts his other statement which is, 1) how could you cheat on me, not waiting for the man you would marry is cheating him. 2) even if he had pre-marital sex, he married me, the only person he has been intimate with, so that makes it okay.
> 3) it's ok if people have pre-marital sex as long as they have the intention of marrying that person. since i didn't have any intention of marriage, that makes it wrong.


This is called "rationalizing". He wanted to have sex with you, so he makes up rules to validate his thoughts and actions. This doesn't surprise me given what you've told us about him.

Do you live in the US, Canada, or in somewhere in Asia now?


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## now_awake (May 29, 2013)

How disappointing that they never replied! What kind of domestic abuse organization would do such a thing?  and know if you do contact someone, your husband doesn't need to know! If your afraid of this site, maybe use a computer at the library or something?

I understand feeling paralyzed, I really do. I'm still in my situation as well. I'm a stay at home mom and I'm not sure where I would go if I left. I've been afraid that I would lose the kids if I stood up for myself. I have to fight those irrational thoughts all the time. I ask myself, would a judge really take my kids away and place them full time with someone who just started 12 steps? Wouldn't I get a job or go on assistance if finding a job took time? When push comes to shove, we will do what is necessary in a situation. But I do understand the complexity of your situation! I know it's easier said than done!


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## Phoenixny (Sep 24, 2013)

In the US.


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## pplwatching (Jun 15, 2012)

Phoenixny said:


> He knew everything atleast 5 months before we got married.


He chose to marry you. It is unfortunate that he did, given that he is not capable of loving you or accepting the road that you walked to become who you are today. The interrogations and accusations will never stiop. There is nothing that you can say that will make him love you and accept you. Even though you did nothing wrong, he has already judged you and sentenced you.

Now you just have to decide if you are going to allow this situation to continue or not. It may not seem like it's your choice, but it is. You can choose to fight for your dignitity and your marriage, walk away from it all, or stay. None of these choices will be easy, but I hope that you find the strength and support that you will need.


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## pplwatching (Jun 15, 2012)

In the US you have rights. There are both legal and commuity organizations who will help you get away from this terrible situation if that's what you want to do. The laws here generally favor mothers, and you will be able to get financial support from him. If you can document his abuse, then you may be able to get sole custody of your son. Many lawyers will give you a free consulation.


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## Phoenixny (Sep 24, 2013)

@now_awake: I'm using a computer at the school library.

The problem is, DH appears perfect, my fear is that no one would ever believe my story. In fact, he often tells me that.

Which reminds me. I should tell you that the other day when we were in the car, I hit him several times. I know I should not have done this, but I lost my mind. This is because he said, "You were a prostitute who sucked d***s for a living". My son was in the car seat next to me, and I felt like DH had thrown acid on my face (even though he's only 16 months and cannot understand anything). This was a blatant lie, a hurtful accusation. I am willing to take responsibility for what wrong I have done, but that burden is already too heavy, and I cannot bear to have lies piled upon my character by the person who is supposed to protect me and care for me.

DH says that I'm the abuser in the relationship because my constant lies and concealments have abused and ruined his life.


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## Knobbers (Sep 25, 2013)

Phoenixny said:


> I don't see how. I am empty-handed...what do I have going for me? I don't have much money, where will I live, how will I care for my son? I just enrolled in school, how will I continue my education? What can I do if DH sues for custody of my son?
> 
> It's much easier said than done.


Ma'am, 

You are far more educated than myself, you seem pretty intelligent and have to be a tough woman to deal with all this stuff for a decade.

Custody of your son should be easy, purchase a var and start recording your husband acting like an idiot. He comes off mentally insecure and unstable, I don't think a judge would look past it.

As for where you can live, I'm sorry, I can't help you there. Believe me, I would if I could, but there has to be someone you can reach out to.

I understand this wont be easy, but nothing worth doing is. I can only share for you the dysfunctional situation you are in was similar to my mothers and her staying almost ruined whatever chance I had at a semi functional marriage. If you don't mind risking your sons future then stay and be a slave to an abusive husband. The cycle will most likely continue and will be passed on to your grandchildren.

I'm sorry, I know that isn't the reply you wanted, but I have no clue what options are available to you.


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## Stonewall (Jul 5, 2011)

How wonderful is multiculturalism. Cultures that allow or encourage such treatment of women makes me sick to my stomach. Women who give birth to us, nurture us, bind our wounds, feed us, beautify and enrich our lives, care for us in so many ways; treated like crap! It disgusts me. Please find a way out plan your escape. You have done nothing wrong. Nothing!


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## Thorburn (Nov 23, 2011)

Your husband's culture and religious views tend to have a lower value of women then typical Western norms. Hence your niece's responce as a 4 year old is showing that she too is learning that men rule.

Look, if my wife told me her past history and I found out she lied, I would be upset. In fact I got upset at her a few years ago when she decied to tell me something about her sexual past that she left out. But let me explain how I got upset. I never demanded she tell me about her past. When she did I had no problem with it. She told me she never had sex with a man until me. Then I find out a few years ago that she did, partially. I was upset for about an hour. I did not yell at her, I did not stomp out, I remember telling her that why after all these years did you decide to tell me this after over 25 years of "I never had sex at all?" We discussed it and that was that. 

If my wife had been more sexually active prior to our marriage, frankly I would not have cared too much.

Your husband has serious issues and it has to do with his religious views and cultural views of women. In his mind you will never be an honorable woman, you can never, ever be. He will continue to put you down, his family will as well.

I have served in Turkey, Eqypt and Iraq. I have had muslim friends. Honestly, you are in a horrible situation and until your husband changes his view it will never get better. He will hold your past sexual encounters as dishonorable and there is nothing you can do about it.

Frankly, what you did in the past is typical and normal, sexually. 

Picking these men who share the same religious views and hearing what they all basically said should have been enough to keep you away. It is a double standard, but it is culturally and religiously ingrained in them.

You also having a male child will become a hugh issue. If he gets wind of you threatening to leave him it will become a hugh mess.


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## Knobbers (Sep 25, 2013)

Phoenixny said:


> Today was Day 4 of the fight. As soon as we got into the car to go to school, he started screaming at me. He says that we will have no relations, no conversation until I tell him the complete truth. Not what I think he wants to hear, not what I imagine happened, but the plain truth. He won't take "I do not remember" for an answer. But when I tell him everything I know, he won't accept it as the truth. It's a vicious cycle. He says that the only way things will change is if I can convince him that it is the truth.
> 
> @Knobbers- I understand what you are telling me, and I actually have thought about it. I do fear that my son will emulate his father's behaviour, as my husband emulated his own father. DH keeps saying that his dad mistreated (the correct word would be "abused") his mom, but for some reason, he thinks that he does not do it to me. He thinks that he treats me wonderfully, and I'm an ingrate for complaining. I should be eternally grateful to him for salvaging my life, because had it not been for his intervention, I would most likely be a single mom of an illegitimate child. No one would want me.
> I truly thought he married me because he loved me...and often times it does seem like he loves me... but then he will say things like, "I married you because you promised to abide by those seventeen things. You promised that you would change. I married you because I'm a man who keeps his promises, unlike you, I do not go for multiple partners. You trapped me by seducing me, and I had to marry you because of the intimacy we shared."
> ...



Ma'am,

Sorry I didn't respond to this first, just seen it. First of all, what you write makes me so sad to read, this man is beating you down so bad that you have zero confidence. You sound like an intelligent, caring and beautiful person. This husband of yours will take these precious gifts from you if you let him, please don't.

Its no wonder you have no faith in your ability to leave him after all he has said to you. He wants you to think you can't make it on your own, he wants you to think you need and owe him everything. He wants to make you feel unattractive and untouchable by other men in this world, its part of his illness. He is so insecure that he is projecting it onto you and you are taking the bait. Please stop believing this drivel he spews, you are worth something and you will thrive out from under his thumb.

What made me change is seeing how much hurt I was causing the mother of my children and only person in this world not of my blood that I love unconditionally. I never beat her down or made her feel worthless like your husband does, I always told her she was better off without me in fact. What I did was flip over the smallest things and take out my bad day on her, when all she wanted to do was help. I had an epiphany one day when we were fighting over some task we were doing, I couldn't fix something and started yelling like a jerk. She then finally stood up to me and said the quote about my father, I could see the hurt on her face and how hard it was for her to say it. That moment and look changed my outlook on life forever and was what I needed to see what a jerk I was and had been for years. This woman stuck by me while I was a drug addict and this is how I was thanking her? Needless to say, from that day on I've tried to repay her commitment to me by treating every day like it will be out last together. If you treat someone with that thought in mind, stupid things like who they slept with years before meeting you won't matter.

Ask your husband this, if it was your last day together on earth is this how he would be treating you. If that don't get him to pause and ponder, he is helpless and you would learn all you need to know about him.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Well, culture notwithstanding, you live in AMERICA and, in America, women are not to be abused.

Divorce him and don't waste the rest of your life miserable. You only get one life. Stop worrying about anyone else. They don't have to live your life. And you need to healthy and whole to take care of your child.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Phoenixny said:


> I don't see how. I am empty-handed...what do I have going for me? I don't have much money, where will I live, how will I care for my son? I just enrolled in school, how will I continue my education? What can I do if DH sues for custody of my son?


He won't get custody of your son when you are not negligent or a crack addict. Not in America.

You can get grants or loans to continue your education and they will be enough to pay for an apartment, food, and transportation. And once you finish, you'll be able to easily support you and your son.


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## Phoenixny (Sep 24, 2013)

turnera, thank you for your post. unfortunately, life is not that simple. i still have to live within my social community. it doesn't mean that i have to buckle down to oppression, but i can't just throw away all these years either. if it comes to the point where i have to walk away, i will - but not until i am satisfied that i have exhausted all options.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

Phoenixny said:


> Today was Day 4 of the fight. As soon as we got into the car to go to school, he started screaming at me. He says that we will have no relations, no conversation until I tell him the complete truth. Not what I think he wants to hear, not what I imagine happened, but the plain truth. He won't take "I do not remember" for an answer. But when I tell him everything I know, he won't accept it as the truth. It's a vicious cycle. He says that the only way things will change is if I can convince him that it is the truth.
> 
> @Knobbers- I understand what you are telling me, and I actually have thought about it. I do fear that my son will emulate his father's behaviour, as my husband emulated his own father. DH keeps saying that his dad mistreated (the correct word would be "abused") his mom, but for some reason, he thinks that he does not do it to me. He thinks that he treats me wonderfully, and I'm an ingrate for complaining. I should be eternally grateful to him for salvaging my life, because had it not been for his intervention, I would most likely be a single mom of an illegitimate child. No one would want me.
> I truly thought he married me because he loved me...and often times it does seem like he loves me... but then he will say things like, "I married you because you promised to abide by those seventeen things. You promised that you would change. I married you because I'm a man who keeps his promises, unlike you, I do not go for multiple partners. You trapped me by seducing me, and I had to marry you because of the intimacy we shared."
> ...


Your past, in the eyes of God, I would suggest, is nothing to the present abusive horror that is the evil of your husband.
*
Your husband is hurting your son. Not you.*


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## MovingAhead (Dec 27, 2012)

Phoenixny said:


> turnera, thank you for your post. unfortunately, life is not that simple. i still have to live within my social community. it doesn't mean that i have to buckle down to oppression, but i can't just throw away all these years either. if it comes to the point where i have to walk away, i will - but not until i am satisfied that i have exhausted all options.


Sorry, but this is just crap! Your social community is the people you socialize with. You can choose this!

If you choose to stay where you are beaten down then that is your choice, but don't complain when it happens. You have the absolute choice to leave!


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## Phoenixny (Sep 24, 2013)

Thorburn and Knobbers, thank you for your posts, they were very useful/helpful. 

I could not reply in detail because the situation had escalated. DH wanted me to apologize for my behavior, or else he would not permit me to go for my immigration interview. I had enough and I stood up for myself. So he dragged the issue out in front of his parents, threatened to divorce me, degraded me in front of them, and seized all the immigration papers so that I cannot go to the interview. But I don't care any more, this is just another way for him to be vindictive. I have to figure out what to do next because he says he is going to kick me out. Also my mother in law asked what I wanted and I said that I wanted him to be a decent man and treat me with respect, or else I would leave. Gee also tried to stop me from going to take my exam, and shoved me to the floor as I tried to take my bag. But I walked out. And I'm going to ace this exam.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Phoenixny (Sep 24, 2013)

Moving Ahead, thanks for your post, but you need to understand that the world I live in, the world that has shaped who I am today, is very different from your world. I understand that I have to take responsibility for the choices I make, and I have resolved to make courageous A's wiser choices, however if it takes me longer to take a courageous step, I can only hope that I will have a support system to count on, not one that will refuse to help me because I didn't take their advice immediately they gave it. 

This man has pulled my string and I have danced to his tunes all these years. I've had enough of that.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## manfromlamancha (Jul 4, 2013)

PhoenixNY I do understand the world in which you exist - however here is what I believe you need to do immediately:


Build up a support system around you - and I do not mean an Asian woman's shelter or anything like that - I mean good decent and trustworthy friends who may also have children like you. Make sure you pick people who have exhibited stability, integrity and may I say preferably from different cultural backgrounds and walks of life.
Start working on exercises to build up your self esteem and confidence - become the woman you set out to be when you first came to the USA - I do not mean that you should forget your cultural background - quite the opposite - embrace and use it to derive strength from in your new adopted country - what you are experiencing now with your H has very little to do with your cultural background and much more to do with his and his insecurities and shortcomings
Make sure that your children see you as confident and strong - do not let him ever abuse you again and certainly not say the sort of things he says in front of your kids - get yourself into a position where he faces real consequences for doing this - the law takes a very dim view of this sort of abuse
Take up hobbies and activities (even with your kids) where you have "you time" and enjoy yourself during these times - this will help you with strengthening your resolve to stand up to him when the time comes
And finally sit him down and make him understand that no matter what he tries to do, you will not tolerate his behaviour (remember that by this time you have your support structure in place) - you are educated and clever - you do not need to put up with anybody's crap least of all his

Only once you do this and do it properly and without wavering, will you really know if he can be with you or not - from what you have said I suspect not but I maybe wrong.

Good luck and start working on this asap.


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## JadedHusband (Aug 17, 2013)

This guy is going to eventually "honor kill" you if you stay. He may try if you leave. 

Sorry to be so culturally insensitive but trying to associate with people who incompatible with western civilization will get you nowhere if you intend to live your life as a person instead of a man's property.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Phoenixny (Sep 24, 2013)

manfromlamancha said:


> Good luck and start working on this asap.


Thanks MFLM.

this is a full blown war now, and I'm fighting for my family....to keep my family together, it has now become imperative that I stand my ground. Had I been smart, I would have long before planned for this day...but I was in denial. As for friends, I never made any, because my home life was so unstable that I felt like I could not enjoy normal friendships. Right now, one of my friends is staying with me, she is a student visiting from India, and she had no place to stay so i invited her. With all this craziness going on, I just hope H doesn't embarrass me by fighting in front of her. I have a couple of trusted friends, who unfortunately have moved out of my city. Well, I guess I'd better get started...
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Phoenixny (Sep 24, 2013)

JadedHusband said:


> This guy is going to eventually "honor kill" you if you stay. He may try if you leave.
> 
> Sorry to be so culturally insensitive but trying to associate with people who incompatible with western civilization will get you nowhere if you intend to live your life as a person instead of a man's property.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


You cannot imagine how many times I've wished I were dead. I'm not afraid any more. He won't physically harm me, unless he loses his sanity, then all bets are off....but even if this kills me, I'm going to go down fighting to the end. 

I'm so angry right now, I just hope that my anger doesn't fizz out like it usually does the next day...
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Phoenixny said:


> With all this craziness going on, I just hope H doesn't embarrass me by fighting in front of her.


You know how to make sure you won't be embarrassed? By telling her now, ahead of time, how he hurts you. Confide in her. Tell her the truth. So, when he treats you like crap, she is in on it, and she'll know to ignore him, leave the room, whatever you ask her to do.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Phoenix, have you investigated your city's shelters yet? Just in case you get kicked out of your house? Have you been to a lawyer to find out your rights when he tries to pull such a stunt?


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## Knobbers (Sep 25, 2013)

Phoenixny said:


> You cannot imagine how many times I've wished I were dead. I'm not afraid any more. He won't physically harm me, unless he loses his sanity, then all bets are off....but even if this kills me, I'm going to go down fighting to the end.
> 
> I'm so angry right now, I just hope that my anger doesn't fizz out like it usually does the next day...
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


When your anger fizzles out and you no longer feel like sticking up for yourself, think of your son. He doesn't have a choice to get away at the moment, you have to do the right thing and decide for him. Stay strong and be your own independent woman, no longer are you property of an abusive husband.

This is a new day Ms. Phoenixny, the first day of the rest of your life. The day you take your life back. Best of luck, I'm rooting for you!


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## TooBroken (Sep 23, 2013)

I agree with Knobbers' idea. Get a VAR and record your husband being abusive. Perhaps one of the more tech savvy members here can give you some advice on other things like cameras. 

When I left my abusive ex, it took a lot of planning. I didn't get out overnight. But knowing I had a direction to go to save my children from growing up to be just like him gave me hope.

When I left, he never saw it coming. And trust me, I was terrified. I hid every knife in the house. I even hid his hiking stick. He ended up slinging CDs at me like they were weapons. 

He didn't know I was leaving until 5 minutes before, and the police who came to escort me and the kids out showed up in the middle of his tirade. He cooled his jets immediately with the cop there, but the cop AND my friends who had come to help me carry my things out had all heard him.

Be careful. And if you feel weak about doing it on your own, you can always focus on doing it for your child. Do you want your child to be just like his father. Or if you have a daughter, do you want her to be like your niece and think that she deserves to be beaten down? 

I'm so sorry that you're in this situation.


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## Phoenixny (Sep 24, 2013)

the situation has escalated...

he is also not letting me go to my naturalization interview. and he's throwing me out, he says.

i decided that today i was going to start living free from fear. i called my mom and told her everything. she said that she suspected something like this, she was not surprised. she stood by me, and wanted to talk to him, but i asked her not to talk to him today, let the dust settle. 

then when i started getting my son ready for day care, the husband decreed that our son would not go anywhere, that i would not go to work today, that i would withdraw from school, answer his questions, and from then on obey him. he then took away my phone, which had this website open. i'm afraid my account may be compromised, so i will no longer post under this handle. i called my mother, who asked to speak to him. 
right now he's talking to my mother on the phone.


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## now_awake (May 29, 2013)

Stay strong phoenixny! We're all rooting for you and your son!


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## pplwatching (Jun 15, 2012)

I wish you the best in dealing with this situation. I know that it is impossible for you to post here now if he's monitoring your web usage, but know that there are people who care and who will help you. Let us know if we can offer you any support.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Please call the police!


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## Thorburn (Nov 23, 2011)

Phoenixny said:


> the situation has escalated...
> 
> he is also not letting me go to my naturalization interview. and he's throwing me out, he says.
> 
> ...


This would have been the moment to call the police, take your son to day care, go to work, and tell him to go pound sand.


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## Jasel (Jan 8, 2013)

And please let us know if you're okay even if you can't go into details.


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## Phoenixny (Sep 24, 2013)

I'm okay. Thank you all for your support. I will update you somehow whenever possible.


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

Phoenixny said:


> the situation has escalated...
> 
> he is also not letting me go to my naturalization interview. and he's throwing me out, he says.
> 
> ...


You are in NY, right?


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## TooBroken (Sep 23, 2013)

Has anyone heard from Phoenixny? Kinda worried about her situation.


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## manfromlamancha (Jul 4, 2013)

How are things going Phoenixny ?


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