# Another LD post...



## pctomm (Jul 30, 2013)

Hi all,

First post here, long time lurker. I usually browse this forum when I just can't take it anymore, and at least I know there are others out there that are going through the same thing. 

I'm 33, so is my wife, we have 3 kids, and are generally quite happy. We rarely disagree, never fight,etc.

However, she is LD, and sex is just not that important to her. She's actually told me that she wouldn't mind if she didn't have sex for years. Our sex life now is I would say on average once every 2-3 weeks. Sometimes we'll go a month without it, sometimes twice in the same day, and then drought, basically it's just all over the place. 

We have talked about it, and she knows it's an issue. Although I don't want to talk about it anymore because what's the point. We've been together for 10 years. I'm not naive enough to say that it's only her fault, but I don't know what to change about my behaviour.

Sometimes we have that conversation where she just 'gets it' and it looks like we're on the right track, and then she just shuts down a few days later. She's been away for the weekends for the last 3 weeks while I do some home reno stuff. I didn't chase her around when she was home during the week, but last night after 2 weeks of no sex, I tried to kiss her while we were in bed. She just gave me this look that said 'what are you doing?' And squirmed away. FML

In any case, is sex important enough to challenge a family? I love my wife, I love my kids, is it worth putting them in jeopardy over sex?


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## Red2 (Apr 28, 2013)

Only you can answer that question. For some it is a dealbreaker to live without any intimacy for years, others put up with it for the sake of the children, still others seek something on the side to keep them from going insane....


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## Anon1111 (May 29, 2013)

I don't have an answer for you, but I have been going through the same thing for several years. Like you, I do not want to break up my family over this, but it is very hard to live with. Maybe you are better at compartmentalizing than me, but I find it hard to believe that you manage to get along so well generally if this area is so lacking. Personally, I tend to alternate between trying hard to fix things for a while, then giving up in frustration and anger and living in a cold war state until that begins to seem intolerable, then the cycle of trying to fix things begins again. But each time, I have a little less energy to try. At some point, I will give up, but I haven't quite gotten there yet. Good luck to you.


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## pctomm (Jul 30, 2013)

I find I am good at suppressing it, but it does get harder over time. As a guy, I just don't understand what the big deal is. We're married for crying out loud, I don't understand how easy it is for her to say no.

I've never, and I mean never, said no to anything sexual when it comes to my wife, in 10 years. I'm not saying I've never disappointed her in some way in that department, but I've always tried.


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## MissScarlett (May 22, 2013)

Are you ever as blunt with her as you have been in your post - that you consider a life without her because she is starving you of every humans need to feel desired and physically nurtured? 

I'm sorry you find yourself in this situation. By marrying we reduce our sexual outlet to one person and are at their mercy of what they will and will not give us. Facing a life of only a trickle of affection is bleak indeed.


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

pctomm said:


> She's been away for the weekends for the last 3 weeks while I do some home reno stuff.


Where? With the kids or without?


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## treyvion (Apr 29, 2013)

Red2 said:


> Only you can answer that question. For some it is a dealbreaker to live without any intimacy for years, others put up with it for the sake of the children, still others seek something on the side to keep them from going insane....


You can either go insane or have your drive and need dimished to where you don't "feel" you need it, converted to a LD.


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

WorkingOnMe said:


> Where? With the kids or without?


I was wondering that myself. You should have said what is your problem when she turned away when you tried to kiss her WTH! Obviously this is bothering you and it should. "Man up" have one final talk and say I can't and won't control you however, I am not going to keep living in a loveless and sexless marriage and I have had enough the ball is in your court. Be very cool, calm and dispassionate all business when you tell her this if you don't consider divorce as an option she won't even think of changing.


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## Fozzy (Jul 20, 2013)

It's like looking in the mirror. I'm in EXACTLY the OP's situation. Thirties--3 kids--had the discussion with no apparent progress...only difference is he's apparently better around the house than me  .

I wish I had some pithy advice. If I ever get it figured out, I'll let you know.


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## pctomm (Jul 30, 2013)

She had the kids too, went to the in-laws/grandparents cottage. 

I'm going to sound callous, but even though she had the kids there are 6 people there dying to take care of them, so there's no excuse for exhaustion etc. 

I've been blunt with her, but never discussed divorce. It's just not a subject I'd want broached, once it's out there, it's hard to take back I suppose. 

Thanks for the replies, I don't expect anyone to solve my issue, but talking to others about it helps. 

I'm fairly certain that we're going to 'connect' tonight, as I know she feels like she's pushed me away far enough and it's time to come back. I just wish it wouldn't have to be this big production every time.


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## bestyet2be (Jul 28, 2013)

My thinking is that, somehow or other, you communicate that you're committed to your marriage to the extent that you're willing to be rejected and humiliated. (Maybe not forever, but for the forseeable future) Then, somehow or other, you communicate to her that it's not in her best long term interest to have a husband that's rejected and humiliated. I'm working hard on those "somehow or others," along with other things, myself. You didn't say whether she was always LD. If she was ever HD, I feel like that's more hopeful.


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## pctomm (Jul 30, 2013)

She was what I consider HD, or at least very receptive for the first 4 months of our relationship. 

After that it's brief bliss, but LD in general. Although she was HD for a few amazing weeks later on in a pregnancy.


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## treyvion (Apr 29, 2013)

Anon1111 said:


> I don't have an answer for you, but I have been going through the same thing for several years. Like you, I do not want to break up my family over this, but it is very hard to live with. Maybe you are better at compartmentalizing than me, but I find it hard to believe that you manage to get along so well generally if this area is so lacking. Personally, I tend to alternate between trying hard to fix things for a while, then giving up in frustration and anger and living in a cold war state until that begins to seem intolerable, then the cycle of trying to fix things begins again. But each time, I have a little less energy to try. At some point, I will give up, but I haven't quite gotten there yet. Good luck to you.


The point which makes it hard to understand is HOW:

HOW can someone put up with this, not even recieving intimacy and affection from the one they take care of and care about, when they could get it much easier on a one night stand or someone who isn't supposed to care about it that much.

This part will drive you crazy.


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## pctomm (Jul 30, 2013)

^ Exactly that. I just don't get it.


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## Hicks (Jan 14, 2011)

pctomm said:


> Hi all,
> 
> 
> In any case, is sex important enough to challenge a family? I love my wife, I love my kids, is it worth putting them in jeopardy over sex?


That's a personal decision.

However, I doubt your wife can ever turn sexual unless she is aware you will leave her if your marriage is non sexual.

But you should look at it as a process of leading your wife into drawing the conclusion about what is right and what is wrong. 

Currently you are being led by your wife's view. The view that she doesnt want sex and that you are unsure if sex is important.

You have to through a series of actions turn this around so that ultimately she admits that sex is important in a marriage and she either becomes more sexual toward you or verbalizes to you that she is unwilling to meet your needs as a man... And at that point your decision on whether to stay married is based on her outright acceptance or rejection of your idea of a marriage.


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## pctomm (Jul 30, 2013)

Hicks, 

That was seriously very helpful.


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## barbados (Aug 30, 2012)

Have you guys tried MC ? 

I am not a believer in sexless marriages. People need physical intimacy on a regular basis, and what constitutes "regular" varies from person to person. Its a concern for me that your wife is acting this way at such a relatively young age, which does not bode well for the future.


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## treyvion (Apr 29, 2013)

barbados said:


> Have you guys tried MC ?
> 
> I am not a believer in sexless marriages. People need physical intimacy on a regular basis, and what constitutes "regular" varies from person to person. Its a concern for me that your wife is acting this way at such a relatively young age, which does not bode well for the future.


I'm having a problem right now, imagining the sheer numbers of Lady of the Lake like "power view" LD "witholders", and then just the sheer number who don't have the need because it's being met elsewhere. Eitherway it's cheating.


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## GettingIt_2 (Apr 12, 2013)

pctomm said:


> Hi all,
> 
> First post here, long time lurker. I usually browse this forum when I just can't take it anymore, and at least I know there are others out there that are going through the same thing.
> 
> ...


How long have you been married, and what is the rest of your marriage like? Does your wife have "beefs" with you that might be causing resentment? What is your level of non-physical intimacy? Do you confide in one another? Feel comfortable communicating both the good and the bad, or do you tend to keep thing bottled up? 

I agree with most of the other posters: lack of sexual intimacy is definitely an issue worth pushing. Sweeping it under the rug and trying to just deal with it will probably result in worse problems later. 

You must, must make her understand your emotional need to connect with HER physically. She must know that you desire sex with HER as an expression of love and commitment to HER. She must know that it's not just about you getting your rocks off, scratching an itch, relieving your sex drive with the most available warm body. She also must know how deeply it affects you when you go for long periods of time without this connection--how your unmet emotional need affects your work, your relationships, your happiness, your ability to focus, etc. 
She has to come to understand that sex is something that she contributes to the well being of your marriage--not just something that you demand from her. 

I know it seems, sometimes, that women should just "know" all this already. Trust me, they don't always. Obviously your wife knows lack of sex is a problem for you--of course women get it that men like and want sex a lot. What they don't always get is that wanting and needing sex from a spouse is a bit different than just wanting it in general. Sex in a committed, long term relationship (one that involves the complications of kids, home ownership, entwined finances, relationships with extended family, careers, etc.) is different than sex with casual partners, new partners. It helps develop and cement long term relationships. It deepens the intimacy because it forces vulnerability and trust. You can have a functioning marriage without it, but a truly emotionally fulfilling marriage means both partners feel their sexual needs are being met. 

I don't know what the root of your wife's LD is, but the fact that she isn't willing to try and find out is a tip off to me that she doesn't understand how truly crucial sexual intimacy is to you OR that something is stopping her from wanting to address her LD. I'm sure she has many excuses/reasons for why she doesn't want to have sex, but I doubt any of them are the REAL reason. SHE might not even know this. But until she is willing to take a hard look things won't change. 

For what it's worth, I was LD with my husband for ten years after we had kids. I had various reasons for not wanting to fix things, but although my husband tried and tried for years to express his dissatisfaction, I didn't really get it until I decided to look into my LD on my own. And the only reason I decided to look into it was because my husband NEVER let up on wanting to get our sexual relationship back. He regularly tried to address it with me; he didn't try to do things to make me feel more sexual, he didn't apologize for his desire, he didn't accept a sexless marriage. He expected sexual intimacy from me. Living with him like this was not comfortable, and that's the only reason I was able to fix things when I finally decided to take a look at myself. 

I do suggest individual counseling for your wife, if she is willing and wants to be able to participate in a sexual relationship with you. She has to figure this out--but she has to want to, first.


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## bestyet2be (Jul 28, 2013)

treyvion said:


> HOW can someone put up with this, not even receiving intimacy and affection from the one they take care of and care about, when they could get it much easier on a one night stand...


I'd say for the sake of one's _*own*_ honor and dignity. (As I recall, we're talking about her LD, not her No-D or her infidelity, which of course would be very different.)


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## MissScarlett (May 22, 2013)

The reverse is also true - she loves her husband, she loves her kids - is lack of sex worth putting her family in jeopardy? 

The person with the lower drive is always the one who is in control.


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## treyvion (Apr 29, 2013)

bestyet2be said:


> I'd say for the sake of one's _*own*_ honor and dignity. (As I recall, we're talking about her LD, not her No-D or her infidelity, which of course would be very different.)


The honor in being sexless?


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## malmale (Oct 5, 2010)

bestyet2be said:


> I'd say for the sake of one's _*own*_ honor and dignity. (As I recall, we're talking about her LD, not her No-D or her infidelity, which of course would be very different.)


I don't see how we can be proud by not providing your own partner with something he/she needs...


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## pctomm (Jul 30, 2013)

Awww I was so close 


Put the kids to bed, essentially the clock is ticking because I know one of them will wake up in a few hours. 

She wants to watch tv, so we do that for a bit, then it's 'can we cuddle for a bit?' sure. After that back rub, then she needs to chat. Finally 2 hours later, we're almost there, clothes come off. She's not really into it, but it is what it is. In any case, 5 minutes later, said kid wakes up and game over. 



It's the amount of energy that goes into it on my part that's unbearable. I know men and women are different, and in my mind it's so simpe just to sneak in the time. For her it's the tail end of hoooours/days of preparatin an trying.


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## Trying2figureitout (Feb 3, 2011)

Ok let me spell this out for everyone... there is no such thing as LOW DESIRE... or HIGH DESIRE.

In a marriage it has nothing to do with DESIRE.... it has to do with how your wife FEELS about closeness to you as her husband. These wives team up with other wives doing the very same thing to their husbands they justify it. They know sex is 'supposed' to slow down after marriage and they and heir friends support each other in making their husbands miserable...its a game to them.

Face it if you love to Waterski but haven't done it in twenty five years does that say anything about DESIRE...NO. Same for SEX she may desire SEX but does not put in the EFFORT to have it and she MAY desire it with a closer partner.

So what is the solution.... drumroll........

Either push your marriage to the brink of divorce over the issue and show her how ridiculous her views are on the subject.

OR

Put up with it for LIFE!!!!

My wife has four years. We are making progress.


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## bestyet2be (Jul 28, 2013)

treyvion said:


> HOW can someone put up with this...when they could get it much easier on a one night stand





bestyet2be said:


> I'd say for the sake of one's _*own*_ honor...)





treyvion said:


> The honor in being sexless?


Given the specific situation the OP described, I simply don't see how he could feel OK with himself, his future interactions with his wife and children, if he went the extramarital route. You may disagree, but I don't think I expressed myself unclearly....?


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## treyvion (Apr 29, 2013)

bestyet2be said:


> Given the specific situation the OP described, I simply don't see how he could feel OK with himself, his future interactions with his wife and children, if he went the extramarital route. You may disagree, but I don't think I expressed myself unclearly....?


Right, he loves his family. Does not want to cheat on his wife. Wife is causing image of a sexless male, possibly some other attributes are stripped out with it. Now all of a sudden other males still on the prowl who didn't have this part stripped out appear more masculine and more attractive.


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## eyuop (Apr 7, 2013)

Improve yourself and stop stressing about your wife. Work out a ton. Take testosterone if you have the money. Buy a cool motorcycle and go out for rides. Find men to hang with and get into doing some fun stuff that is a bit risky (like skydiving or something that gets the adrenaline flowing). Flirt with other women (harmlessly, of course). Quit monitoring your wife's sex drive and live life to the fullest. Take the kids camping without her. Leave her in the dust physically. Get some new clothes that you feel really good in. Some jewelry, too. Get a haircut.

Enter the world with new confidence every morning. Quit taking crap from your wife and just go for life, taking it by the throat. Improve on yourself. After a while, other women will take notice of you. This is a good thing. Your wife feels like she is in control and comfortable. She is not that attracted to you because you aren't as exciting to her as you once were, and she doesn't have any competition. Women love competition. If there is a guy that is highly sought after by women, even married women will fantasize about him. You need to become that man that women desire. Your wife needs some competition in the attraction department. I'm not saying go out and cheat. This is all about the tease! If after you do all of this she just isn't interested in you, there will be other women who will be. Win-win.


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## CuddleBug (Nov 26, 2012)

pctomm said:


> Hi all,
> 
> First post here, long time lurker. I usually browse this forum when I just can't take it anymore, and at least I know there are others out there that are going through the same thing.
> 
> ...



You're both 33 years old and in the prime of your lives.

You have three awesome kids.

You never fight and get along great.

Sounds great.:smthumbup:


After having 3 beautiful children, her hormones may be permanently off and meds might be required. See the family Dr.

She might be scared of getting pregnant again, with her 4th kid.

She might of gained unwanted weight and doesn't feel sexy or as attractive as she used to be.

Raising 3 kids is a full time job in itself and that will drain her big time.

She is your wife and regardless if you have kids or not, she is to take care of your needs and is not her own anymore. And that goes for you as well, to take care of her needs and not your own anymore.

If she knows you want sex with her and she is usually turning you down and you are miserable. she must change this and do what's best for the marriage and not herself.

Is there something she would love you to do for her as well?

And she didn't need to have 3 kids. She could of had 1 kid and still worked a part time career. It's all choice.


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## PieceOfSky (Apr 7, 2013)

I wish your wife could have a visit from the Ghost of Sexless Future. Anything can happen, but if your and your wife's next thirteen years go like my wife and I's, it's not going to be pretty.

Depression, no intimacy, much resentment -- especially from her. Even hatred from her.

Sure, it has not all been caused by those many years of near sexlessness (which, apparently for her, included quite a burden quarterly).

It is more important than she knows -- she doesn't have a clue. Depending on how much reading you have done here, maybe you have an inkling of the toll it can take, maybe not.

Never tried it, but consider printing out some posts from losers like me. Maybe it'll strike a nerve and motivate her to not do this to you.

My wife recently caught one of the three documentary episodes about Happiness on Netflix (I think the presenters first name was Daniel). One included interviews with a few couples on the brink or back from the brink. One husband had told his wife he was going to divorce her if the intimacy did not return; lucky for them it did. Anyways, that guy's approach really pissed off MY wife. But, I think seeing that story might have affected her for the better.

Does she even realize there are a bunch of people in this world who suffer greatly from the lack of sexual intimacy, and the daily, if not hourly, rejection they feel?

Btw, lest anyone feel even more forgotten, women also suffer when their partner is indifferent or unwilling or able to meet the need to connect via sex. So, misery all around.


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## CuddleBug (Nov 26, 2012)

How's this one:


I too have been married for 13+ years.

I am HD and my wifee is LD.

LD wife to be has a lot of sex with HD hubbie to be, they get married and her true LD self comes out and the sex starts to really trickle off.

HD hubby has many talks with her and initially the sex increases, but it feels like duty or chore sex and weeks later, the LD spouse is back to their old ways.

This goes on and on, year after year.

Then when the LD spouse needs emotional support and closeness, the HD spouse can't be bothered. Of course the LD spouse blames the HD spouse for their lack of intimacy and for everything.

If the LD spouse met their HD spouse half way out of love and not duty or chore sex, that would be the way its supposed to be. But in reality, its the HD spouse killing their sex drive for their LD spouse and it makes them miserable, depressed and very vulnerable to cheating.

But if you listen to me more and gave me more emotional support, I might be in the mood more???? Yah, right!!!!


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## bestyet2be (Jul 28, 2013)

CuddleBug said:


> LD wife to be has a lot of sex with HD hubbie to be, they get married and her true LD self comes out and the sex starts to really trickle off....


Amazing how common this is! Now as I understand it, the "experts" claim sex and money issues are really misinterpreted power issues. I'm not sure I accept that universally, but I think there's a lot to it. The interesting thing that supports the power theory, is how often the LD partner was formerly higher. I've also heard of where the supposed LD partner is actually masturbating to avoid partner sex, not irretrievably LD at all. The problem is something else. May be power.

When the LD partner rejects the HD partner, that is power, and the HD partner feels powerless. If that's simply a fact, what remains, is what the HD partner does about it. If the HD has a core belief that meaningful and valuable things in life require some effort and sacrifice, he won't quit or run from the situation. Then, the HD partner will hide his hurt (I'm not going to do that any more), or shut down his desire (I'm not going to do that any more), or express his hurt with anger (I'm not going to do that any more), or express his desire and hurt briefly and without anger.

I've realized this is also oh so common, LD: "Well if you wouldn't talk about it all the time and ask for it all the time, maybe I'd be more interested." Then HD avoids talking about it for weeks or months, but this accomplishes nothing. I now think this response actually feeds a useless power struggle.

If and when I'm faced with this again, my response will be, "I understand that we're not going to have sex now and perhaps for some time, and it hurts, but I still need to tell you again today how much I desire you." Then I've got to stop talking, to avoid the chance of becoming angry. The point is that I'll feel hurt and broken *ANYWAY*. The only decision is whether I make it obvious how little power she has to exert to cause this damage.

Unsaid in my mind will be, "In spite of everything good I've tried to do and be, I can't be everything you wish, so I understand in some ways I'm a disappointment to you. That notwithstanding, I feel broken and "adrift in the ocean." I hope that you'll decide it's not in your interest to have a husband who's broken and adrift in the ocean, but for now, if that's working for you, broken and adrift in the ocean I will be, and I won't hide it or pretend if feel otherwise, but I'm hurt, not angry, so I'm not going to do anything to otherwise poison my enduring faith in a better future."

This mindset is something I'm aspiring to, probably not something I can ever perfectly achieve, but my not far from 20 year marriage has been improving, so I'm hopeful.


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## bestyet2be (Jul 28, 2013)

PieceOfSky said:


> Never tried it, but consider printing out some posts.... Maybe it'll strike a nerve and motivate her


Funny, I have printed, and left out for my wife, excerpts of a few postings from this forum, which from the context were clearly written by women. One full page, and another day just a few lines. I think it's been at least a little helpful.









Some of what I've read on this site is quite beautiful, even some of the painful stuff.


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