# How much can you forgive?



## Redwine (Mar 31, 2020)

Good afternoon everyone,
I am new to this site but I just feel I need some advice and wanted to know what the general concensus is on how much you can forgive someone before its gets past breaking point?

My story is quite long so I wont go through all of it but my wife (now seperated) had an affair and based her new career on this person. They are not together anymore but she met her current boyfriend who she now lives with and he was her mentor in her new job, in this new career.
Theres so much water under the bridge and everyday is so hard despite being 6 months since we seperated and 18 months since I found out about the affair. We tried for 12 months to make things work but because of her new career and the positions it puts her in, it was too hard for me to completely 'let go' and trust 100%.

Theres 2 children involved so its not like I can just walk away for the rest of my life. 

My ex has made it clear how shes thrown all of her life away with her actions and is deeply sorry and really does wish it was different. Basically without saying the words I think she wants to be back together. Ive never seen her like this before. Shes in such a state over everything.
For me with everything thats happened it was so tough and still is to deal with. She was someone I idolised and did everything I could to make our family happy and secure and my world came crashing down.
How much do you think people can forgive because as much as I still love her, theres so much water under the bridge and I just dont know what to do right now.

Its like I want to stand tall and strong and say no but I feel myself being down about it a lot and cant move on enough.

Thank you for any comments.


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## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

I think you should forgive. Not doing so will ride on your mind. Never forget! Now, it appears your WW is all about making you plan B. The grass not greener on the other side yadda yadda. Why not complete the D if you have not already. Maybe start to date again. Start over. If none of that appeals to you, go NC as much as possible. Kid logistics talk only. No emotional talk. No can you fix my leaky sink crap. That escapade is over. This will help you detach. Without a doubt, another will come along and command your attention, love and respect you. Your XW will be just that, your XW.


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## Tilted 1 (Jul 23, 2019)

Holy hell, your kidding right? Your the only thing that she knows who has his **** together. Now she's sorry.

So that we can understand, your divorced or just separated? And she throwing in the kids now? Good grief man. I heard of gullible, but come on.

It's reeks of weakness, on your part it you take her back. For what purpose, until sees fed and clothed then tell you she tried again and ripping that wound open again which will probably do you in.


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## Tilted 1 (Jul 23, 2019)

Take her off the pedestal, while your at it.


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## Redwine (Mar 31, 2020)

Tilted 1 said:


> So that we can understand, your divorced or just separated? And she throwing in the kids now? Good grief man. I heard of gullible, but come on.


Were seperated. Were still really amicable and for the kids especially so. They are my main concern but I just dont know if its a huge weakness taking her back. She hasnt thrown anything at me, shes very open and admits its all her fault whats happened and why we are where we are.

I have tried dating a little so far and its been not only a welcome distraction from this side of my life but also good to try and feel for others.


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## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

Redwine said:


> Were seperated. Were still really amicable and for the kids especially so. They are my main concern but I just dont know if its a huge weakness taking her back. She hasnt thrown anything at me, shes very open and admits its all her fault whats happened and why we are where we are.
> 
> I have tried dating a little so far and its been not only a welcome distraction from this side of my life but also good to try and feel for others.


There you have it. You are seeing others and it is a good distraction and connection outside the crap sandwich your WW fed you. So, do you take your WW back and become the town warden watching your WW every move, text, phone call, search on the internet and GPS tracker on the car...or......do you let your WW sit and wonder why she screwed up an entire family while you find another who will love and respect you? 

BTW, it is nice your WW owns her crap in this. It does not make it all better though.


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## Tilted 1 (Jul 23, 2019)

Redwine said:


> Were seperated. Were still really amicable and for the kids especially so. They are my main concern but I just dont know if its a huge weakness taking her back. She hasnt thrown anything at me, shes very open and admits its all her fault whats happened and why we are where we are.
> 
> I have tried dating a little so far and its been not only a welcome distraction from this side of my life but also good to try and feel for others.


Admitting faults isn't the same as doing something about those faults. It's a cop-out, nothing to fix it just accept me as I am. Horse pucky.


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## TJW (Mar 20, 2012)

Redwine said:


> shes thrown all of her life away with her actions and is deeply sorry and really does wish it was different


Well, she can wish in one hand, and **** in the other, and see which one materializes faster.

The word "forgive" is a wonderful word. It is more applicable to the betrayed person than the betrayer. And, it is much more beneficial to the betrayed than the betrayer. For your own sake, and the sake of your children, maintain the conditions of forgiveness.

There is, however, no requirement in "forgiveness" for you to reconcile and re-establish a home with her. It simply means that you have given up the "right" to return evil for evil, and have chosen to act in "good" toward her instead. You have done this, already.

If there is actually any question in your mind regarding "taking her back".... that question should be:

If you were given the opportunity to marry a woman, about whom you know the things you know NOW about your wife, would you accept ?

@Tilted 1 has it right on the nose. Your wife is "wishing it was different", which is a far cry from "doing the work required to make it different". I'd have to see the elbow grease first.


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## skerzoid (Feb 7, 2017)

Redwine said:


> My ex has made it clear how shes thrown all of her life away with her actions and is deeply sorry and really does wish it was different. Basically without saying the words, I think she wants to be back together.


Basically, without saying the words, she isn't giving you ****. If she isn't saying "I want to be with you for the rest of my life" she isn't committing to anything.

To rebuild any trust would take years. Other than wistfully yearning for her old life back, she would have to do very heavy "work" to rebuild your former relationship.

Here are actions she would have to take for any kind of reconciliation to even be considered:


*As long as she is living with another man, you have no options.* He or She must move out.
*Change jobs.* (This may have to be delayed for now because of the virus scare and economic downturn). She valued climbing the corporate ladder more than her family. She would have to take this step as the den of iniquity she works in would always have you wondering "Who's up next?"
*She goes to HR.* These are very inappropriate Supervisor/Underling relationships. There are all sorts of legal ramifications (This also may need to be delayed till the air clears).
*She must take a polygraph to find out if she is telling the truth as far as her intentions are concerned. *Un-announced polygraphs may be demanded to check on her later.
*Sign a strict Post-Nuptial Agreement favorable to you.*
*She would have to agree to total transparency with all communications. * No privacy between husband and wife.
*Even with all these actions, she would have to re-enter the relationship understanding that there is no guarantee of forgiveness on your part.*
*For her to regain equality in the relationship, which is the only healthy type of relationship, it will take years.* Are you & she really willing to endure for this to take place?


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## Redwine (Mar 31, 2020)

Skerzoid thank you and thank you to everyone else so far.

Ive never thought of taking this to the extremes like is listed. 
I have thought that I would have to ask her a number of things she must do in order to make this work.
One of which would probably be to quit her job. She joined the Police and in the UK the police does have a reputation for affairs and infidelity. Its rife actually. I would need her to give up this career which is a big ask in my eyes but if she genuinely wants to be with me I think it would need to be done.
The other is to change her mobile number and remove herself off social media. I would need this to reduce her interaction with other people and to see how committed she was to the relationship.
This does sound to me like im being controlling and I dont like this sort of thing but for me to build any level of trust I would need to see that I (and the kids) am the main focus.


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## Tilted 1 (Jul 23, 2019)

Redwine said:


> This does sound to me like im being controlling and I dont like this sort of thing but for me to build any level of trust I would need to see that I (and the kids) am the main focus.


It's not controlling, it's only the minimum and beginning of what she would need to earn your forgiveness. Period!!


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## skerzoid (Feb 7, 2017)

Police, Medical Staff, Educators (I'm a teacher/coach myself) all seem to be riff with this stuff. You would have to be controlling in the years leading up to a re-establishment of equality in the marriage. Equality = Trust. Until she has proved herself worthy, you would have to be in control. Otherwise, get ready for a repeat. She has shown what she is negatively capable of.


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## jlg07 (Feb 24, 2017)

" They are not together anymore but she met her current boyfriend who she now lives with and he was her mentor in her new job, in this new career. "

Umm, WHAT? She feels bad and wants to come back BUT SHE IS LIVING WITH HER BF from her Job?
The logic escapes me. You should know she is STILL not trustworthy -- I BET she didn't tell her BF she wanted to leave and come back to you. So, if she is still hiding things, why do you think she is honest with YOU?


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## BluesPower (Mar 27, 2018)

Redwine said:


> Skerzoid thank you and thank you to everyone else so far.
> 
> Ive never thought of taking this to the extremes like is listed.
> I have thought that I would have to ask her a number of things she must do in order to make this work.
> ...


Brother, what you wrote here is just the beginning. I mean the very beginning.

Why would you even think to get back with a woman when she is living with her new boy friend? What is that about?

I gotta tell you that your thinking is kind of off here. She has had, any number of affairs because you do not know the truth in any way, and she missed good old reliable, (YOU), and she might want to come home??????

I mean what are you thinking?


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## Laurentium (May 21, 2017)

Yeah, she needs to establish complete "no contact whatsoever" with the affair partners.


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## OutofRetirement (Nov 27, 2017)

I am trying to understand: 

1.She left you for one guy while she was in a previous career,
2.then she changed careers (police), 
3.then she got involved with her "mentor" (a new level of mentoring, I guess), cheated on guy 1, 
4.and now is moved in with the mentoring guy. 
5.And I guess she's learned all she can learn from the mentoring. 
6.So rather than be honest with mentor guy, she is behind his back telling you she wants you again.
7.If you agree, she will dump him. If not, she will stay with him
8.Meanwhile, the kids went first with one guy, then with the other guy. 
9.All in about 18 months.

Is that correct?


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## OutofRetirement (Nov 27, 2017)

How old are the kids? 
Have you looked into statistics with cohabiting with kids with biological mother and non-biological boyfriends?


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## TDSC60 (Dec 8, 2011)

jlg07 said:


> " They are not together anymore but she met her current boyfriend who she now lives with and he was her mentor in her new job, in this new career. "
> 
> Umm, WHAT? She feels bad and wants to come back BUT SHE IS LIVING WITH HER BF from her Job?
> The logic escapes me. You should know she is STILL not trustworthy -- I BET she didn't tell her BF she wanted to leave and come back to you. So, if she is still hiding things, why do you think she is honest with YOU?


I am also shaking my head at how OP can even consider R with her living with her current BF. Dude actions speak louder than words. Oh wait.......she has not actually said anything about R.....only that she is sorry for the original affair.


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## hinterdir (Apr 17, 2018)

Redwine said:


> Good afternoon everyone,
> I am new to this site but I just feel I need some advice and wanted to know what the general concensus is on how much you can forgive someone before its gets past breaking point?
> 
> My story is quite long so I wont go through all of it but my wife (now seperated) had an affair and based her new career on this person. They are not together anymore but she met her current boyfriend who she now lives with and he was her mentor in her new job, in this new career.
> ...


Well, first let me say that I hate when people use the word "forgive" to describe this type of scenario.
Forgiveness is 100% a matter of the heart....letting go of hate and bitterness and letting that poison go. It is usually healthy for the wounded party to forgive because it frees their heart up, in a sense, and let's them heal and move on.
A person can "forgive" a cheater but leave the relationship forever. A person can stay married but never forgive their spouse.
We should always forgive. That isn't what we are talking about I'm sure.
You are asking about staying with a partner, staying married or in a relationship.

I have very, very, very hard lines on that. I'd divorce my wife if she ever even kissed another man. The mental picture of another man actually touching my wife everywhere and her him in a sexual way, full intercourse, oral, her feeling those sensations, the passion, those memories permanently engraved in her memories...I would find that utterly repulsive. I would find her forever gross, vile, disgusting, tainted....there is no way I'd EVER want her again and divorce would be the only way.
God almighty could tell me that she'll be the most loyal, loving, selfless, giving wife fore the next 30 years and will never even come close to betraying me again and I couldn't care less. She was with another man...that can never be undone, I would never stay with her. She'd be dead to me. Yet I would forgive her. Family members sometimes forgive the murderers who killed their children. That doesn't mean they have a relationship with the killers and welcome them into their house. They forgive in the heart and move on. You don't have to see or hang out or be MARRIED to the one you forgive.

So forgive your wife if you haven't already.
But....take her back? Give her your heart again? Take her into your bed after she's had another man inside her? Kiss her after her mouth has been all over him, know that for a bit all of her lust and passion and consuming thoughts and desires were all on him, she felt his hands all over her....in the most intimate ways?
I cannot even get my mind around how anyone would EVER stay with a cheater or take them back.
Divorce and remove that person from your life FOREVER..

Think about it, if you take them back you'll be a nervous wreck. You'll always be wondering if they are telling the truth, wondering if they are where they say, playing detective and checking up on them, calling them, wanting to check their email and phone to see if anything is amiss. You won't have peace, you'll have anxiety, you'll always have those mental flashbacks of her with other men.
That is WEAK! Do not live like that. Dump her, divorce her, get her out of your life and get peace. Enjoy life, find yourself again and a new loyal person.
Forgive? Yes.
Take back? NEVER!!!!!!

I think you'd be a fool to take your cheating, lying, selfish, betraying wife back. You'd be in torment and anxious and you'd probably have less than 10% chance it would work and 90% she'll get horny and selfish again a year or two down the line and you'll be kicking yourself for even trying this.


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## cp3o (Jun 2, 2018)

Redwine said:


> Good afternoon everyone,
> I am new to this site but I just feel I need some advice and wanted to know what the general concensus is on how much you can forgive someone before its gets past breaking point?


I may be weird - but I don't understand the question.

*Forgive* - _Stop feeling angry or resentful towards (someone) for an offence, flaw, or mistake. _

I don't stop feeling angry because I decide to do so. Anger is not, for me, a choice - it's an emotion. An automatic reaction to something external to me. Just as I don't decide who to love, the date on which I will start to respect someone - or the action that will cause me to dislike a person.

For me - it happens. Emotion is what I feel - not what I decide I will/should/have to do.

Sometimes forgiveness is speeded by understanding - if one knows why a thing was done there may be extenuating circumstances - but beware the flip side - such knowledge may ensure that forgiveness never happens. 

There is a difference between choosing to overlook something and forgiveness.

Don't confuse the two.

With overlooking the anger is still there - perhaps buried, perhaps denied - but still there, baleful and dangerous, Whilst it remains it may gradually whittle away at happiness but their is always the potential to erupt catastrophically.

With forgiveness the anger has gone - sadness and regret may remain but the poison has dissipated. Great if it can happen - but I don't believe we can make it happen - and therefore, try as we might, there is always the possibility that it cannot occur. That's not our failure - it is simply reality.

FWIW - I doubt that I would ever forgive had your wife done to me what she has done to you. Having said that - I would never trust her again - and, I suspect, without trust forgiveness is irrelevant.


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## Buffer (Dec 17, 2019)

Hi Re, brother allot going through your mind I am sure. Forgive yes please do as it helps heal and move in. Forget never be able to do that of course. Can you really see yourself in five years time being in a committed relationship with her? As she seems to become infatuated with her mentors, trainers and work colleagues. She will always run that risk no matter where she ends up working. Major proof of commitment is required from her. Possible even a post nuptials for future infidelity. Better to keep her amicable and you find a woman who will have the basic commitment of monogamy. 
One day at a time
Buffer


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## Redwine (Mar 31, 2020)

Good morning everyone, Thank you for your comments so far. My head has been in so many different places recently over this. 
Its hard to turn off feelings for someone, despite their actions.
But when I look at the idea of us being together again, the restrictions on her life and the measures she will have to go to I just cant see it happening today. And yes the thoughts of her with someone else etc isnt nice at all. Its horrible, but isnt the be all and end all of the decision for me.
Its strange how some days I just want to have her back and other days I do stand tall and say "Im worth more than this" and be strong! The mental side of this is such a chaotic rollercoaster, even after all this time.

To answer some questions from earlier posts:
The affair she had was with a police officer. She was off work until our youngest child was old enough to start reception at school. She started seeing this officer and then decided she wanted to be a police officer too. She'd already got the ball rolling to join up then I found out about the affair and she was no longer with this person.
Skip 12 months forward after I found out and shes in training out on patrol everyday and was paired with a mentor. We werent in the best of places (in my opnion because I didnt enforce the restrictions on her life that I should have) and I said I needed a break from eachother to see what we wanted. She decided she wanted to call the whole thing off and be able to start seeing other people. Within days she had been out on a date with this mentor and 5 months later they are living together in rented accommodation with our children who I do see very regular. 

Thinking about all of this and being able to get so many different perspectives on this, I think she wants to have her cake and eat it. I think if she wants to come back to me, she definately needs to show actions speak more than words and do the things required, like splitting from her boyfriend and cutting ties with a few things. Only then after seeing all of that can I consider getting back with her.
Right now I think if she did all of that I will still be looking over my shoulder and worrying about her. I might feel different in reality but Im not sure right now.
Its just so tough when she has been everything Ive ever known and I lived for her for 16 years. Such a rollercoaster of emotions each day. Today its a strong day to stand tall and not take any nonsense, mainly down to the fact Im able to voice my concerns on paper here and get some perspective. Theres only so many times I can chat to my friend about this topic without feeling like its all I ever talk about to them so thank you for allowing me to talk about things on here.


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## JMarie (Aug 15, 2019)

I’m so sorry your going through this. 
I’m going through something similar. I’m back and forth also about how I feel. Forgive. Angry. Sad. All that. 

My head knows what must be done. But my heart is sad. It’s a normal grieving period for those who are normal. I’ve been through loss of a love before. I know that one day I won’t hurt anymore. And if I’m lucky, and find again. I’ll look back and wonder why I stayed as long as I did with this one. 

Stay strong. It’s time to move on. You’ll be happier on the other side.


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## Tilted 1 (Jul 23, 2019)

What you are going through is the five stages of grief. But once you accepted, truly what she has done. You see that the mind movies that will repeat and repeat, just isn't worth it. And you are plan B.

But what is happening is now is the same you will live from this point forward. Strong and then weak- but the desire you wish for can never put back in place. You know this on your strong days. You have not written, what you know she did for you ( they generally do more for the affair partner). This will bring resentment (in your heart) if you allow her to return. Don't kid yourself. It would never ever be what it once was, if this is your mindset or think forgiveness can over come this? Hardly.

Post some of your strong, reasons why NO on her return. 

Let us help you. You are able and capable of remaining strong without her. But because you were hoping one day she would return isn't reason enough to allow it.


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## oldtruck (Feb 15, 2018)

nothing wrong with wanting to try recovering your marriage.
though WW has show that she wants to come back by ending
her relationship with her current lover and move out and live
alone first for 6 months.

She also has to give up her job because she has to go NC with 
OM 1 and OM 2.


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## She'sStillGotIt (Jul 30, 2016)

Redwine said:


> How much do you think people can forgive because as much as I still love her, theres so much water under the bridge and I just dont know what to do right now.


I guess it all depends on whether you're willing to swallow all your pride, all your dignity, and all your self respect and become a welcome mat for someone who literally **** all over you.

If that's who you want to be, take back the evil succubus.

I'll never understand why some people refuse to ACCEPT it when someone shows them exactly who they ARE. She *showed *you exactly who she is and how low she's willing to sink and you're actually thinking about taking someone like this back.

You can only claim "victim" status so long. If you're foolish enough to take this low life back, then you're a volunteer for every rotten thing she does to you after that.


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## Marduk (Jul 16, 2010)

"Forgive your enemies, but never forget their names."

Go ahead, forgive her. I personally think it's overrated, but some people swear by it.

But that has nothing whatsoever to do with reconciling with her - which in my book is a very, very bad idea. There's way too much there to have to get past to make work... even if she doesn't do it again (and she has all the red flags indicating she will to me).

Relationship-wise, she is your enemy. Remember that.


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## Redwine (Mar 31, 2020)

I love the honesty on here of the situation, so thank you for telling it as it is. Its amazing how taking all of the comments in actually puts perspective on things and makes you wake up and smell the roses. Talking about something and allowing it to not go rotten inside of my head has made me feel like a million dollars compared to yesterday. 

To anyone new on here like me... 
Getting things off your chest and talking about it helps massively!!! Do not bottle things up and try and deal with things on your own!! So thank you all. 

I can really see the situation im in and the strain it will put on me if I was to get back with her. I will be amicable and 'forgive' her but I cant ever see me forgetting anything and being walked over again, not only by her but anyone. I saw the signs and ignored them at the time as I wanted them to not be real. You cant f**k someones life up as much as she did to me and then pretend it didnt happen. 
Amazing how clear the water is now!!

Standing tall today and believing Im worth something to the right person. Havent been able to do that for such a long time. She isnt that person. She wont be that person again. Not in this lifetime anyway. 

A big thank you from me, Im a genuine guy who wears his heart on his sleeve. Im not afraid to admit that. *But I wont be walked over again. By anyone. Not me. Not anymore.*


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## Tdbo (Sep 8, 2019)

I'd say that you need to forgive so that you can separate the drama from your life and move on in yours.
You need to develop a veneer of indifference towards this person. You will always have to have contact with her for and because of the kids.* Never forget the conniving and treacherous person she is.*
You seen like a great guy and you deserve to find the person out there that truly wants to be with you. Find that person and move on with your life. Focus on being the best father you can. 
Never be a second choice. Find someone who will make you their first.


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## OutofRetirement (Nov 27, 2017)

> My ex has made it clear how shes thrown all of her life away with her actions and is deeply sorry and really does wish it was different. Basically without saying the words I think she wants to be back together. Ive never seen her like this before. Shes in such a state over everything.


Is she this from her live-in boyfriend?

Do you think you get one story, he gets another story? And maybe there is a third story that actually is the truth?


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## Tilted 1 (Jul 23, 2019)

Redwine said:


> I love the honesty on here of the situation, so thank you for telling it as it is. Its amazing how taking all of the comments in actually puts perspective on things and makes you wake up and smell the roses. Talking about something and allowing it to not go rotten inside of my head has made me feel like a million dollars compared to yesterday.
> 
> To anyone new on here like me...
> Getting things off your chest and talking about it helps massively!!! Do not bottle things up and try and deal with things on your own!! So thank you all.
> ...


Your on a great start to be a rockstar here on TAM, Congrats Redwine!!


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## JMarie (Aug 15, 2019)

Redwine!

I’m so glad your feeling better! Yes talking it out with folks that have been through it has helped me also. 

Sometimes in our minds we think we will never find another man,or in your case a woman, who we will be able to love. Yes the pickins seem slim. But if your a person of faith, know that God wants you to have all your heart desires. Those that hurt us like this are NOT in His plan for us. 

I’m using this time alone to get back to me... get back to my relationship with God, Family, and friends. 

Keep the faith! Prayers for your speedy recovery!


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## Marc878 (Aug 26, 2015)

Words which is all you’re getting don’t mean a thing. Her actions are deplorable. Good chance if you took her back, if she would which is doubtful she‘ll just do it again.

You have kids together. Got it. You can still cut off or limit contact. If not you’ll stay tied up in this.

You are the only one that can keep yourself in this.


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## No Longer Lonely Husband (Nov 3, 2015)

When considering R with this woman I have one word of wisdom..”Don’t “. from what you post she want you as her safety net plan b. Stay the course. You deserve better sir.


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## colingrant (Nov 6, 2017)

> Basically without saying the words I think she wants to be back together. Ive never seen her like this before. Shes in such a state over everything.


First, hinting at wanting to get back with you is no reason for you to even consider her at this time. Considering her unfaithfulness, if you think about it, she's providing you with overtures (crumbs) to feed on and you're actually doing it. If she was really interested in returning, she'd be very eager and borderline begging you for another chance. 

The fact that she's implying and hinting suggests to me that she's doing it because she "feels" that's all she has to do to get you back. All she has to do is "talk around" the subject and you'll ask HER if she wants to return. Think more highly of yourself. 

Second, If and when she directly asks you to consider her returning, you should ask her three questions. 

1) Why do you want to reconcile? If I understand her like I think I do, she'll be shocked you have the audacity and confidence to challenge/ask her this question. 

When or if you ask her, say nothing more, just listen. If her answer is done in ten seconds, (example: Because I lover you and we're meant to be together) just be quiet for another 20-30 seconds. If it looks like she's done, ask her (is that it?). You should learn quite a bit from her answer and explanation. If it's short, nothing's changed. Clue #1

2) Why should I take you back?

3) Why would *I* want to take you back? I recognize question 2 & 3 are somewhat close, but they're distinctly different. But, the reason to ask them is that it enables you to cut through her b.s and allow it her to listen to it herself, and for you to hear it straight from her mouth. If sincere, she would have thought of very solid reasons and would be prepared to convey them. If you applied for a job you really wanted, would you give thought to how your interview will transpire? Yes, you would. Similarly, she will have done the same mental preparation. 



> I just dont know if its a huge weakness taking her back


Weakness isn't defined in taking her back, but perhaps in reasons as to why. In other words, if you want to take her back because you're incomplete as a person and aren't the same without her..... not sure that's a good reason, as you are allowing another individual to complete you and make you happy, and possibly have chosen just one person on earth for being able to be that person. All of these are falsehoods. 



> I would need her to give up this career which is a big ask in my eyes but if she genuinely wants to be with me I think it would need to be done.The other is to change her mobile number and remove herself off social media. I would need this to reduce her interaction with other people and to see how committed she was to the relationship.





> This does sound to me like im being controlling and I dont like this sort of thing but for me to build any level of trust I would need to see that I (and the kids) am the main focus


I honestly don't think it'll get to this point, but the way to convey this is by saying, what I would expect of you (or anyone that has betrayed there spouse is)..........then list your conditions. You follow up by saying, ......

_"You should step back and ask yourself if you're willing to meet my conditions for CONSIDERING reconciliation. I'm not demanding or even asking you to adhere to them. I'm telling you what they are and you can decide if you're willing to meet them. If you choose to not meet them, I fully understand and respect your decision. ......and I'm sure you understand and accept me for choosing what I stand for. I'm not asking you to do these things, you are choosing to do them. 

It is *your choice and free* *will* to comply with my conditions or not comply. There's no pressure, no catches. Straight forward. You have 24 hours to determine if you're able and willing to meet them. If not, I'll proceed forward with my life, as you shall with yours. No hard feelings. _

End of hypothetical discussion on meeting your terms. It's her choice, not your demand. Seems like semantics, and perhaps it is, but it's meaningful differences within the semantics. 


> Its hard to turn off feelings for someone, despite their actions.


You shouldn't expect your feelings to be turned off. But you response to her actions are a different thing. Feels and actions are defined by your will to preserve and maintain self respect and dignity. 


> But when I look at the idea of us being together again, the restrictions on her life and the measures she will have to go to I just cant see it happening today.


I agree, but make them anyway and make HER choose if you feel or see value in having this exchange with her. If you don't then don't. You're in control of your actions, not her. 


> She decided she wanted to call the whole thing off and be able to start seeing other people.


Personally, this would be enough for me to confidently move forward. When a person prioritizes someone that considers them an option, it's a problem. Big problem. From what I can tell, you're an option........I'll go one step further and say, you're an option for her AT THE PRESENT TIME and when it's convenient for her which is worse. 


> Within days she had been out on a date with this mentor and 5 months later they are living together in rented accommodation with our children who I do see very regular.


She knows (or thinks) she can return to her "option" when she wishes to, so these adventurous where she calls the shots on where and when she goes is completed by knowing her safety net (Redwine) is ready for her return with open arms...........or just her return, even without open arms. 


> I think she wants to have her cake and eat it.


Yes 


> I think if she wants to come back to me, she definately needs to show actions speak more than words and do the things required, like splitting from her boyfriend and cutting ties with a few things


.
Should you decide to incomprehensible, I strongly advise you to be coached through it, otherwise, you'll be back here in a year or so, singing the same song. Remorseful spouses are easy to see. It's not crying, begging or none of that. It's day in day out, committed accountability and a complete transformation of themselves whereby they expect you do not trust them for years and that they have to earn your love and trust back..... and this is just the start 


> Its just so tough when she has been everything *Ive ever known and I lived for her for 16 years*.


Perhaps the bold is the root of the problem and not solely her. Redwine. You live for you, not other people, regardless of the length and deepness of love shared. Once you live for another, you reduce yourself and increase them to a point where you can't see life without them. 

You're at this point possibly, if not probably, hence your feeling that you can't turn off (understandable) has more to do with you not being able to live without her, which is called co-dependency.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

Forgive to your heart's content ~ but never ever be foolish enough to be a party to denying the hurt and the pain associated from having endured the wrong that was perpetrated against you!


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## michzz (Jun 6, 2008)

Treat her as if you were the frog and she the scorpion. But know your fate for trusting her.

A scorpion, which cannot swim, asks a frog to carry it across a river on the frog's back. The frog hesitates, afraid of being stung by the scorpion, but the scorpion argues that if it did that, they would both drown. The frog considers this argument sensible and agrees to transport the scorpion. Midway across the river, the scorpion stings the frog anyway, dooming them both. The dying frog asks the scorpion why it stung the frog despite knowing the consequence, to which the scorpion replies: "I couldn't help it. It's in my nature."


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## NorseViking (Apr 14, 2018)

180 her.
No kissing, cuddling, hugs or any physical contact for a while.
Women are more sense to this because they are more emotional.
Only reply regarding kids, divorce or finances else ignore her.
Throw her out of the bedroom, do not ask her, do it"!
Or you move to the guestroom, remember to lock the door at night, before you sleep.
Never ever do anything with her, just your kids.

And if she ask, say: You cheated on me, this is your future.
Or: You cheated on me, this is your fate.
Or: You cheated on me, this is your punishment.
Or: You cheated on me, this is your/my payback.
Or: You cheated on me, this is me not caring about you anymore.
And so on...

Cheaters can't stand _NOT_ being in control.


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