# Marriage is for fools. And I am one apparently.



## NewBride111 (Jan 13, 2011)

My relationship started with random roses, candlelight, lovemaking while music is playing, lovemaking in the middle of the night until dawn, poetry in text messages... 

Now.. 

I have reasoned, pleaded, begged, threatened, and beyond.. to try to get more romance from my husband just so I can receive a plethora of excuses in return. "I work too hard and don't have enough time for that" ... thats his lecture/ rant summed up into a single sentence. 

Yes, he is awesome. He works very hard to support our family while I am a stay at home mom with babies. And he will help with cooking sometimes, or dishes, or laundry on occasion. 

I KNOW he is an amazing man. But lets face it - the romance is gone. 

And I have spoken to him about things he can do that will take less than 2 minutes of his day that will mean SO MUCH to me and bring so much romance back into our lives. 

A random text message - saying "you're amazing, i can't stop thinking about you" 

I mean how hard is that? How time consuming? 

It makes me resent him. Why won't he do this for me? After years of it going on like this, and years of intermittently gaining courage to talk to him about it and ask for more (just to receive a rant)... I finally decided to take matters into my own hands the other night. I decided I would coach him. I showed him very specifically the little things we can do together, or separately, to ignite passion. 

Did he take it seriously? NO. Did it lead to fighting and tears? Yes. 

I feel like he cares about me but he is no longer in love with me. 

I dont understand why. I know I complain about things sometimes and explain that i need more from him... but on the whole, I am always saying "thank you" and telling him that he is amazing and smart, and a wonderful father, and brilliant businessman ... and I don't let his efforts go unnoticed. 

And I have NOT let myself go. I am in my late 20s and I'm prettier than average and I have a nice body and healthy BMI... Thats pretty good for having had 3 children. 

I make it a point to put on my makeup and do my hair and dress nicely when he is here on the weekends. 

I don't know what to do. I can't keep living like this but I don't believe in divorce. I watched my parents' divorce tear apart our whole family. I can't do that to my children. And my guilty conscience is such that I don't think I'd be able to have an affair and actually keep it a secret. I don't believe in affairs anyway. I believe in ROMANCE. One LOVE. One passionate love that BOTH partners work at to keep the fire burning. Why is this too much to ask? 

I don't know what to do. But my advice to anyone who is single or divorced.... DONT GET MARRIED. 

I long for those passion-filled nights, and text messages that create butterflies in my tummy and make me smile like a fool. Those days are no more and I fear that I am abandoned to be tragically wasted in this world full of passion. No more passion for me.


----------



## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

I feel for you. Unfortunately a lot of good people just do not get that marriage should not end the romance.

It might take you a while to get things on track, but my suggestion is that you do not give up on turning your marriage from a good one to a passionate one.

Start by reading the books listing below in the order that I'm listing them:

"Divorce Busters" - pay special attention to the chapter on changes and the 180. You need to do things to get his attention. This book will talk about that. (I'm not talking about the 180 linked to in my signature block below.)

"Love Busters" & "His Needs, Her Needs"

After you read the Divorce Busters book and start doing things to change your marriage, then read the other two books. The idea is to get things to the point where he will read them with you and will do the work with you that the books spell out.

Too many times, men think that working hard and supporting their family is all that they need do to be a good husband. they forget that the romance is a large part of want got their wife to fall in love with them. Without that romance, the feeling of 'in love' fades for both spouses. You have an opportunity to reach your husband this. But as you have learned, talking to him is not going to get him to pay attention. You need to start the changes by taking action.


----------



## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

23 Years together and 19 married and we are still blowing each others minds in the bedroom and dating with roses and romance.

My advice to you is that you are on the right track but your husband is not. Marriage takes work. Romance is supposed to really start at the alter, not end. How far are you willing to go to see if your H will start trying?

There are some good books to read together but he needs to understand that he is losing you. Whether you stay married or not you are getting ready to check out.

Be honest with yourself. Can you go the rest of your life like this? Should you? An affair will destroy everyone so good call on avoiding one.

How is your sexual satisfaction? Frequency? What does your H complain about?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

Going on 21 years of marriage for me and my W. It was not always romance. In fact, she could very much mirror what you have posted. I similarly reacted/acted like your H. Sadly, your H has not come to grips with what he has in YOU!(It took me some time to realize what a [email protected] I was to my wife for being less than affectionate. She asked and tried many times just like you have with your H) I guess being a room mate and always knowing you'll "be there" is good enough for H. Unfortunately, that is not the case with some folks when their marriage turns to being really good room mates and nothing more. Fortunately for me my W stayed the course, prayed and hoped one day I would get it. I got it in a big way and never looked back. 

So, approaching your H and advising your feelings is the first best step. As Ele Girl posted. Get the book His Need. Her Needs. Love Busters. These will give you ideas and answers to make you H wake the Hell up and respect you for what who you are.

You are his W and not live in nanny with benefits when he damn well pleases.

So you are probably wonder how I got it finally? It was not the books. It was not IC. It was this site as well as similar sites. The recurring theme. That theme is, "Lack of attention drove me to...." For me, after 20 years, my W held the steady course, had every right to say the "Lack of attention drove me to...", but she did not. She looked at my good points as you do with your H. Good dad. Great provider. Dependable. However, that was not her major need. It is affection. Much like you. It was like huge hammer hit me in the head. Once the light came on I did and still do make her my #1 priority and do everything I can to fulfill that desire of attention, felt loved and passion. I think I nailed it. 
Read this thread I started here:

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/long-term-success-marriage/217242-yes-im-going-brag.html

Your H can to once he wakes up and understands his W and mother of his 3 children has a very simple request. And I can guarantee him once he fulfills that request his life will be turned upside down. His relationship with you will go to a much higher level. He will see that something really special is missing from his life.


----------



## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

NewBride111 said:


> I long for those passion-filled nights, and text messages that create butterflies in my tummy and make me smile like a fool. Those days are no more and I fear that I am abandoned to be tragically wasted in this world full of passion. No more passion for me.


And one more thing. Dating or marriage...the passion filled nights turn to couch and the boob-tube. Over time, no matter the relationship if the work is not put into it the passion tends to fade into the distance. Each gets set in a routine. These routines are broken with date nights, etc. 

Time alone together at least 15 hours per week is needed. Not all in one day. Ten minutes here. Hour there. Go to the movies. Be each others priority. Yes, I know there are kids involved but I find happy couples have happy stable kids and they follow along without issue. When this happens finding alone time is much easier. Most time sought after. 

Let your H know that laughing at your concern or simple request is far from being the H he should be. He needs to simply step back and REALLY take a look at what he has in you. He will find it is gold. Why? Because you came looking for help. You did not go off the deep end! That my friend is priceless! 

You may direct him to my posts here if you like.


----------



## lonelyhusband321 (Feb 18, 2014)

Into each life some rain must fall....

People who have this "otherworldly" view of marriage just need to recognize that there is reality.

Reality that each others fart actually does stink; that all of life can't be the slow-motion, half-naked running into each other's arms on a wave-swept beach!

You are basically saying that you are married to an awesome guy, but that that's not good enough.

Not trying to criticize, but for every night that he's not being romantic, there's a night that you aren't being understanding and receptive.

Understanding each other and what you are BOTH going through is absolutely critical.

Unfortunately, there are LOTS of posts - on every thread - that are tantamount to "dump them at the FIRST sign of imperfection".

It sounds to me like you two have a pretty darned good marriage - albeit with flaws.

How many relationships are picture perfect? How many of us don't have any shortcomings at all?

COMMUNICATE with him! Try YOUR best (that's all you can do), and if all of those efforts fail - take measures to make your own individual life happy.

Best of luck to you - but don't just throw it all away without trying!!


----------



## Angelou (Oct 21, 2014)

I don't think it's being married that leads to this. I know ppl in long term relationships with the same problem. It just happens after being with someone for a long time. That's not an excuse but it's sometimes facts. I think the main thing is don't lose hope and start leading in the romance dept so he can follow suit. Plan a date night and spend it in a hotel, go for a bike ride or walk at the park then have a picnic, perhaps something out of the routine both of you have. I'm sure he still is in love with you, maybe he just feels in a "rut".


----------



## tryingtobebetter (Aug 6, 2012)

Another book worth reading is the Five Languages of Love.


----------



## John Lee (Mar 16, 2013)

I guess I'm more of a pessimist. I think it's always important to maintain some romance but I just don't think sustaining that "honeymoon period" feeling is possible for most couples. If I texted my wife who I have been with for 12 years "I can't stop thinking about you" I would be lying. And honestly I can't imagine wanting to feel like I couldn't stop thinking about someone for 12 years straight, sounds like torture.


----------



## CarlaRose (Jul 6, 2014)

All your life, you have either heard men call their wife a nag or you have heard ABOUT how men calling their wife a nag.

It's really something because men are the ones who turn us into nags. How can a person nag you about something that you have done? It isn't possible, is it? If a husband would only DO what his wife asked him to do, then she'd have no reason to nag him about anything. Right? So, you see how they turn us into nags?

There's even a website to help men get their wife back after she finally got fed up with him ignoring her requests and turning her into a nag. And would you believe there's even a name for it?

It's called Walk Away Wife Syndrome
You may not be thinking about walking away, but you have essentially given up, which is the same thing. I think it's pretty pathetic you have resigned yourself to living with this sadness for the rest of your life.

I cannot account for this phenomenon of men ignoring their wife's requests and her needs. It's like men get married to mommy or something. They treat their wife as if she's their mother and he's just an obstinate little boy disobeying mom's commands and getting away with being mischievous. I only know it happens very often and when she finally gives up, then all of a sudden he wants to start acting right. Almost invariably, they claim "I didn't know" or "I had no idea" and they are devastated because they ignored her expressions of unhappiness just like they'd spent their marriage ignoring her requests and her needs.

At any rate, I can't ignore the possibility that there may be reasons he continually refuses you. I don't want to put a damper on things any worse than they already are for you, but it would be wise to investigate and make sure there isn't someone else. Your husband's excuses are way too shallow and are commonly expressed when an affair is going on. Don't rule it out as "I trust my husband implicitly" and all that kind of nonsense. Thoroughly investigate to find out for real and not just for sure.


----------



## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

My philosophy: generally, men grow up having fun, playing with friends, playing army, playing sports, being competitive, getting fed, clothed, washed, taken care of. Never a care in the world. They LOVE being taken care of; that's what mommy is for. 

As they get older, they spend a LOT of time with their peers, learning how to pursue girls, how to get in their pants, how to be cool, sexy, whatever, ie how to get a girl. But almost never anything about what to do with her once you get her - some men will spend 'some' time with their sons talking about what the right thing is, but compared to the time spent learning how to get girls and have sex with them, it's a blip on the radar. When they do get ready to marry, they're thinking they'll have this sexy sex kitten they have when they're dating giving them as much sex as they want - great reason to get married, right? Plus the woman is treating them like a king, so they think she will KEEP treating him like a king, basically taking care of him like their mom did.

Girls, on the other hand, spend half their childhood being told to stay clean, not get dirty, being told how pretty they are, being taught how to 'play' house/marriage/babies, being taught HOW to take care of others. They daydream about this fairy tale life of a prince charming who's going to be this 'wonder boy' and make the rest of their lives amazing. 

Almost nobody spends time teaching boys and young men what it means to take care of someone, look after a girl's feelings, to man up and do what it takes to care for a family - all the grunge work like home repairs, wiping snotty noses, midnight feedings...the men may have thought they were ready for it, but they didn't grow up daydreaming about this stuff like the girls did. 

So the woman is expecting him to nest like she does, get excited to fix the house like she is, be ready to put the baby ahead of their own needs, not having time for sex when there's so much else to do...while the man is wondering why he's no longer getting as much sex as he expected and why his wife is ignoring him...and both of them have resentment levels rising through the roof...

As resentment grows, the woman 'nags' and the man withdraws out of being 'told' that he's a failure, does less for her and the house, she nags more, he withdraws more...after years of this, the woman just gives up after having to do 'everything' around the house, falls out of love...and is finally just done.

Nobody's fault, it's very common. Human nature. The best recourse against this is to educate yourself on what it takes to have a healthy marriage, and do it.


----------



## John Lee (Mar 16, 2013)

turnera said:


> My philosophy: generally, men grow up having fun, playing with friends, playing army, playing sports, being competitive, getting fed, clothed, washed, taken care of. Never a care in the world. They LOVE being taken care of; that's what mommy is for.
> 
> As they get older, they spend a LOT of time with their peers, learning how to pursue girls, how to get in their pants, how to be cool, sexy, whatever, ie how to get a girl. But almost never anything about what to do with her once you get her - some men will spend 'some' time with their sons talking about what the right thing is, but compared to the time spent learning how to get girls and have sex with them, it's a blip on the radar. When they do get ready to marry, they're thinking they'll have this sexy sex kitten they have when they're dating giving them as much sex as they want - great reason to get married, right? Plus the woman is treating them like a king, so they think she will KEEP treating him like a king, basically taking care of him like their mom did.
> 
> ...


I think you're describing one particular kind of marriage pattern, I don't think it describes marriages generally.


----------



## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Well, yeah. I'm talking about the ones we're discussing here.


----------



## cons (Aug 13, 2013)

That is a huge generalization...

Even if your description could describe the majority, how does that help the OP except by giving her a little commiseration and a post to say "see, I was right"...


----------



## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

John Lee said:


> I think you're describing one particular kind of marriage pattern, I don't think it describes marriages generally.


I have to agree. Some say some marry a woman who is like their mom. I can not say I know of anyone who fits the bill on Turnera's description of how it goes down. :scratchhead:


----------



## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

turnera said:


> My philosophy: generally, men grow up having fun, playing with friends, playing army, playing sports, being competitive, getting fed, clothed, washed, taken care of. Never a care in the world. They LOVE being taken care of; that's what mommy is for.


This only happens for Wally and Beaver.


----------



## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

meh, every kid I've watched grow up has lived it.


----------



## Plan 9 from OS (Jul 13, 2012)

Guess I'm a pretty big fool then... been doing it for over 18 years.


----------



## John Lee (Mar 16, 2013)

turnera said:


> meh, every kid I've watched grow up has lived it.


Maybe my experience with a mom who barely picked up after herself, let alone after others, was a rarity.


----------



## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Yeah, that's not really the norm...


----------



## John Lee (Mar 16, 2013)

Maybe OP's husband is working very long hours in a high stress job and doesn't have the energy to write poetic love texts with that plus family responsibilities, and meanwhile the OP is putting too much expectation on her husband, bored at home and waiting for something to lift her into the clouds.


----------



## Roselyn (Sep 19, 2010)

When I was 27 years old and my husband at 30, he had a very demanding job as a technical analyst for a major automobile corporation. My husband worked long hours and was on the phone most of the time, solving technical problems with auto mechanics. He had no time to talk via phone nor text of any kind. These types of jobs wear you down. What work does your husband do and does he have a stressful job? He might just be plain worn out when he gets home.

Fast forward, 35 years later, I'm in a stressful job and work long hours. My cell phone is in perpetual off position. I am in a lecture hall and I don't want my phone to ring as I forbid my students to use cell phones while I'm teaching. As for texts of love notes to me from my husband, I don't check until he tells me he sent a love note. Heck, just tell me in my face which he now does.

Tell your husband of your expectations and feelings of loneliness. He is a good husband to you and the world will wring the daylights of life from their employees. The more money you make, the more responsibilities you will carry. Don't silently expect actions from him. Tell him of your needs.


----------



## OnTheRocks (Sep 26, 2011)

Men can be dense when they are in a comfort zone. Make sure you are getting through to him on the specifics and gravity of this issue. Sit him down and tell him you've considered divorce and an affair because of it, and I guarantee you he will listen.


----------



## John Lee (Mar 16, 2013)

No do not threaten an affair or divorce. That's blackmail, not marriage.


----------



## OnTheRocks (Sep 26, 2011)

I'm not saying to 'threaten' a D or A, I'm saying to be brutally honest and let him know that it's gotten to that level in her mind.

Or leave that stuff out, but make sure you are getting thru to him. Women often think they are getting their point across to their H about issues like this with little comments, silent treatment, subtle cues, etc, but the H is not hearing them. Call it being comfortable, taking her for granted, whatever. Most men can't read minds, and generally we're not as in touch with the emotional side of things.


----------



## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

John Lee said:


> No do not threaten an affair or divorce. That's blackmail, not marriage.


If you're ready to walk out, by all means tell him so. After 32 years of marriage, the ONLY thing that EVER got my husband's attention was the night I told him I was finally ready to end the marriage. Thirty-two years of me asking him to be nicer, stop hurting me, just CARE, of him ignoring every single request or just plain blaming me. Years and years of crying, multiple near attempts to end my life out of desperation, NOTHING got through to him. Until I said I was leaving.


----------



## John Lee (Mar 16, 2013)

OnTheRocks said:


> I'm not saying to 'threaten' a D or A, I'm saying to be brutally honest and let him know that it's gotten to that level in her mind.
> 
> Or leave that stuff out, but make sure you are getting thru to him. Women often think they are getting their point across to their H about issues like this with little comments, silent treatment, subtle cues, etc, but the H is not hearing them. Call it being comfortable, taking her for granted, whatever. Most men can't read minds, and generally we're not as in touch with the emotional side of things.


I would call that a threat. In my experience, it does permanent damage even if it temporarily gets a point across. It's a break-glass-in-case-of-emergency kind of move, should not be used unless the person really feels on the verge of needing to leave.


----------



## John Lee (Mar 16, 2013)

turnera said:


> If you're ready to walk out, by all means tell him so. After 32 years of marriage, the ONLY thing that EVER got my husband's attention was the night I told him I was finally ready to end the marriage. Thirty-two years of me asking him to be nicer, stop hurting me, just CARE, of him ignoring every single request or just plain blaming me. Years and years of crying, multiple near attempts to end my life out of desperation, NOTHING got through to him. Until I said I was leaving.


If it's actually to that point, then yes, it's good to say so. That's not blackmail anymore in my opinion. Just using it when things aren't to your liking is. OP doesn't sound ready to walk out, she has an awesome guy who's just failing in this one area, by her telling. So I wouldn't drop the D-bomb. I'd also never EVER suggest threatening an affair, no matter how bad things are. That's never the right approach.


----------



## OnTheRocks (Sep 26, 2011)

Read the OP again. She *is* to the point of considering both.


----------



## hardcandy (Sep 16, 2014)

I get that we need romance to keep the fire going but asking your husband to revert back to honeymoon phase is a bit unrealistic, imho.

The example used was to send OP a random text during work to say "you're amazing, I can't stop thinking about you" -- that seems so crazy to me. That is the type of texts you get when you first dated and couldn't get enough of each other because both parties were on their best behavior.

Here's a question: Is OP being amazing to her husband so he could genuinely feel it to send her that text? 

Marriage evolves and the love also matures and the butterflies disappear to make space for real love (where he works to take care of family so OP can stay at home) which means you no longer need your spouse to send such a text to feel loved. 

Please look up the stages of a relationship. 

How about asking for more appropriate romantic gestures within marriage like roses for special occasions/holidays; dates/dinners; more time together; vacation; more affection (random kisses and I love you's), etc...

I feel there is an underlying issue here and it's deeper than OP's husband not being romantic.


----------



## batsociety (Jan 23, 2015)

Unfortunately this is super common. You pull out all the stops before marriage, and then it stops completely when you actually get married. It follows the "now I can get fat" principle (not that this is actually a thing, but the line of thinking). Marriage isn't the issue. The person is the issue, and it looks like your husband doesn't take your feelings on the matter seriously at all so it's unlikely he will change.

And just IMO, divorce is not the worst thing in the world. My husband's parents divorced when he was young, I work with a lot of kids in juvie from so-called "broken families". Trust me, the tension and constant fighting they have to witness has a much bigger affect on them. When their parents finally separate it is a relief.


----------



## OnTheRocks (Sep 26, 2011)

hardcandy said:


> I get that we need romance to keep the fire going but asking your husband to revert back to honeymoon phase is a bit unrealistic, imho.
> 
> The example used was to send OP a random text during work to say "you're amazing, I can't stop thinking about you" -- that seems so crazy to me. That is the type of texts you get when you first dated and couldn't get enough of each other because both parties were on their best behavior.
> 
> ...


Agreed. I feel a little bit of one-sided EPS at work here.


----------



## lonelyhusband321 (Feb 18, 2014)

hardcandy said:


> I get that we need romance to keep the fire going but asking your husband to revert back to honeymoon phase is a bit unrealistic, imho.
> 
> The example used was to send OP a random text during work to say "you're amazing, I can't stop thinking about you" -- that seems so crazy to me. That is the type of texts you get when you first dated and couldn't get enough of each other because both parties were on their best behavior.
> 
> ...


:iagree:

BINGO!!


----------



## BetrayedDad (Aug 8, 2013)

I'm glad you're honorable enough not to pursue an affair. At the same time what I read between the lines is a husband breaking his back to support his family because he's a good guy and a bored housewife whose looking to be in the "honeymoon" phase forever. Cheaters are honeymoon phase addicts and should the right POS guy come along, I fear the worse for your husband. Many a cheating wife story starts like yours and ends with the yoga instructor in the back seat of the family car.

I will bet my paycheck A) your husband loves you very much and B) he is completely ignorant of your needs. He is not intentionally trying to starve you for affection but you can't "imply" this or "assume" that or get into this stereotypical women mindset that, "oh he should have known". No, we usually don't know because our brains are wired differently and men are not mind readers. 

So, if you truely want to save your marriage you must SPELL out to him what it is you want. Seek counseling if you must but you need to be crystal clear about WHAT the problem is and HOW he can fix it. Is that romatic? Not at first but eventually he will get it and if he's half the guy you say he is, he will do whatever he can to fix it. 

Good Luck.


----------



## DoF (Mar 27, 2014)

How long was the relationship prior to marriage.

This is a repeating story, marriage "seems" like a begging of something new, when in reality it's the same thing over and over.

And to some, it's the begging of the end.


----------



## DoF (Mar 27, 2014)

hardcandy said:


> I get that we need romance to keep the fire going but asking your husband to revert back to honeymoon phase is a bit unrealistic, imho.
> 
> The example used was to send OP a random text during work to say "you're amazing, I can't stop thinking about you" -- that seems so crazy to me. That is the type of texts you get when you first dated and couldn't get enough of each other because both parties were on their best behavior.
> 
> ...


I agree with you BUT what OP is asking for is really not that big of a deal.

I don't see this being a hard thing to do for her husband.

ESPECIALLY if her primary love language is Words of Affirmation!!! In that case I would highly recommend that he does it....FAST.

Heck, wife and I do it on regular basis (almost daily)....we are 20 years in. But my wifes primary language is just that WOA). I like when she sends me things like this, and she surely likes it herself.

It takes ALL of 5 seconds a day to do......I'm pretty sure it takes him more time to wipe his ass each day. Come on now.


----------



## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

BetrayedDad said:


> I will bet my paycheck A) your husband loves you very much and B) he is completely ignorant of your needs. He is not intentionally trying to starve you for affection but you can't "imply" this or "assume" that or get into this stereotypical women mindset that, "oh he should known". No, we usually don't know because our brains are wired differently and men are not mind readers.


He didn't have to be a mind reader:



> I have reasoned, pleaded, begged, threatened, and beyond.. to try to get more romance from my husband just so I can receive a plethora of excuses in return. "I work too hard and don't have enough time for that" ... thats his lecture/ rant summed up into a single sentence.
> 
> Yes, he is awesome. He works very hard to support our family while I am a stay at home mom with babies. And he will help with cooking sometimes, or dishes, or laundry on occasion.
> 
> ...


If he's ignorant of her needs, it's because he has CHOSEN to be.

That said, she may just be describing a marriage in a rut after 3 kids. Lots of things BOTH of them can be doing to change that.


----------



## BetrayedDad (Aug 8, 2013)

turnera said:


> If he's ignorant of her needs, it's because he has CHOSEN to be.


I wonder if he would agree with you. Too bad we can't hear his side of the story. I seriously doubt it and I see no reason to not give the benefit of the doubt. You don't think OP using the words "amazing" and "awesome" to describe him warrants that consideration? No one choses ignorance, you either don't know or you know and you don't care. I'm going with the former in this situation.


----------



## alte Dame (Aug 7, 2012)

My H could be romance-challenged, especially when he was working hard. I work hard, too, however, and have never (never) slowed down on the sex. I thought early on that my focus on romance was like his focus on sex, which seems to be borne out by the experts.

In any event, I eventually figured out that my H simply didn't know what to do for me. Sure, he had wined and dined me when we were dating, but life had changed a lot. So, I asked him to do one thing that I thought would help my romance-starved life: I asked him to bring me flowers every once in a while. 

He started doing this and it made a huge, huge difference, even though I had essentially pointed him in the direction of the flower cart and pulled his credit card out of his pocket.

The point was that he made the effort after I asked. My reaction was so positive that he started to really like doing it and does it regularly. He has a 'relationship' with the flower guy now, who gives him an extra rose in each bouquet every week.

Just fwiw.


----------



## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

BetrayedDad said:


> I wonder if he would agree with you. Too bad we can't hear his side of the story. I seriously doubt it and I see no reason to not give the benefit of the doubt. You don't think OP using the words "amazing" and "awesome" to describe him warrants that consideration? No one choses ignorance, you either don't know or you know and you don't care. I'm going with the former in this situation.


So you just choose to dis-believe "I have reasoned, begged, pleaded and beyond" because she says it?


----------



## BetrayedDad (Aug 8, 2013)

turnera said:


> So you just choose to dis-believe "I have reasoned, begged, pleaded and beyond" because she says it?


Yes, because my ex told me the same EXACT thing almost verbatum when she was trying to justify her cheating to me and she was full of sh*t. Oh, I believe she was delusional enough to convince herself she did but it never happened. I guess I was supposed to be able to read her mind. She needed to OWN her issues and not project them onto me.

Look, I'm not saying the OP is a liar or delusional. I believe she is absolutely sincere and truely feels she has communicated her feelings. I'm just trying to tell her men can be incredibly STUPID and slow to catch on. The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result.

She needs to find ANOTHER way to express these feelings. Either through a counselor or even stick divorce papers in his face if necessary. When one person says they communicated an issue and the other doesn't get the message then the issue was NOT communicated. Unless he's flat out saying, "I understand this is what you need, I just refuse to do that".

I dont think that's this situation at all and most guys aren't heartless monsters. Just sometimes incredibly oblivious and he romanced her in the first place so he clearly capible of giving her what she needs. I really feel he just doesn't understand how important it is to her because it's not important to him. His needs are different and he doesn't get that.

He's busting his a$$ to provide, he seems like a good guy other than this issue, cut the man some slack. This relationship is completely fixable. He needs to be educated. OP, I'm sure some posters can recommend some literature that might open his eyes also. "His Needs, Her Needs" and "MMSLP" come to mind.


----------



## BetrayedDad (Aug 8, 2013)

alte Dame said:


> I asked him to bring me flowers every once in a while.
> 
> He started doing this and it made a huge, huge difference, *even though I had essentially pointed him in the direction of the flower cart and pulled his credit card out of his pocket.*
> 
> The point was that he made the effort after I asked. My reaction was so positive that he started to really like doing it and does it regularly.


Sometimes THIS is what you have to do. 

Once he "gets it" like alte Dame's husband finally did then he can hopefully start giving you what you need. 

Excellent example.


----------



## Shoto1984 (Apr 11, 2009)

Could be marriage fraud or could be mismatched expectation of marriage. In either case its not working and you have every right to desire some level of romance and attention. In my mind that is what makes a relationship different then a business partnership. If there are no issues that are keeping him from being some percentage of what he once was, then he needs to understand that he's not holding up his end. How he gets to that understanding is going to be a challenge. Some people are good with communication and constructive problem solving and others.....not so much.


----------



## Orange_Pekoe (Jan 5, 2015)

NewBride111 said:


> My relationship started with random roses, candlelight, lovemaking while music is playing, lovemaking in the middle of the night until dawn, poetry in text messages...
> 
> Now..
> 
> ...


You want "candy love". You want poetry, roses and butterflies, as you said. You want infatuation.

Real life is not like that. True love means loyalty, honesty, respect, affection. Is he affectionate towards you? A spouse can be affectionate but not necessarily romantic.

I don't want to make anything you wrote sound silly, but I have to admit that asking your husband to text you with the words "you're amazing, I can't stop thinking about you" is not realistic. Maybe at the very beginning of a relationship when you're both completely infatuated with each other, this kind of texting is normal, but later on it's not. Instead, what you should expect is for him to call you or text you every day, check up on you, maybe chat for a little bit. Spend time with you.

Just sounds like you're in love with being in love...a real every day down to earth relationship will not satisfy you.


----------



## Roselyn (Sep 19, 2010)

Well, New Bride what have you decided to do? You have not responded to any post at all.


----------



## John Lee (Mar 16, 2013)

BetrayedDad said:


> Yes, because my ex told me the same EXACT thing almost verbatum when she was trying to justify her cheating to me and she was full of sh*t. Oh, I believe she was delusional enough to convince herself she did but it never happened. I guess I was supposed to be able to read her mind. She needed to OWN her issues and not project them onto me.


The fact that the OP specifically mentioned the possibility of an affair was a yellow flag for me -- I wondered if she already had someone in mind.


----------



## NewBride111 (Jan 13, 2011)

BetrayedDad said:


> Yes, because my ex told me the same EXACT thing almost verbatum when she was trying to justify her cheating to me and she was full of sh*t. Oh, I believe she was delusional enough to convince herself she did but it never happened. I guess I was supposed to be able to read her mind. She needed to OWN her issues and not project them onto me.
> 
> Look, I'm not saying the OP is a liar or delusional. I believe she is absolutely sincere and truely feels she has communicated her feelings. I'm just trying to tell her men can be incredibly STUPID and slow to catch on. The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result.
> 
> ...



I know it has been a while and I am just now revisiting this post to read the comments. As today, I find myself back in the same predicament, with the same feelings. 

I just want to make clear, I have sat him down on more than one occasion and spelled out exactly what he can do to make me feel good and inspire positive reactions on my end (e.g. send 1-line text saying you miss me or can't wait to see me tonight or can't wait to make love to me (if any were true)) .. or heck, even if they aren't true. lol. 

I even put a reminder note on the fridge that on Sundays, sometime before noon, we french kiss. THIS IS TO ENSURE THAT WE FRENCH EACH OTHER AT LEAST ONCE A WEEK. And I was sweet about it and smiled. And I still need to remind him of it every week, despite the little note on the fridge. And he digs it when it happens, so I know he doesn't detest me. :smthumbup:


The UGLY TRUTH - 
I have asked him twice within the last 2 months what he loves about me, just to check that there is something... 

Last month when I asked, and he was stumped and could not answer, I cried. And he could tell I was really hurt... He said he would "work on it" 

This month (3 days ago) when I asked him, he was still stumped... literally speechless. He couldn't tell me one thing he loved about me. But he swears he loves me.

Again, I was hurt. But this time, I was able to laugh instead of cry, because I'm toughening up through all of this. And just accepting my life and marriage for what it is now. .. 

This is a man who used to write poems about me. Which was partly what I fell in love with - his ability to use romantic words to describe his feelings (not just about me, but about anything he was feeling), and I too am a poet and did (and still do) the same. 

My theory is that I've become a pet to him. Only better - because I do his laundry, clean his house, care for his children, and never complain anymore when he works past midnight... and he knows he can pet me whenever he'd like :ezpi_wink1:


----------



## NewBride111 (Jan 13, 2011)

John Lee said:


> The fact that the OP specifically mentioned the possibility of an affair was a yellow flag for me -- I wondered if she already had someone in mind.


No one in particular in mind... I am a SAHM. I don't get out much. I am drowning in puke, poop, pee, laundry, and toys on a daily basis. And I never use the computer other than to post my pictures of flowers (the one thing I do for myself, pictures of flowers) ... and this forum which Ive posted on - like 3 times, if that.

There are no men that I am speaking to other than my dad and brothers.. and on a rare occasion my spouse  And Im not into incest  just so thats clear...

But I do admittedly have a HUGE crush on Channing Tatum. If he wanted to have an affair with me, there'd be a problem! LOL shhhh... don't tell my husband


----------



## NewBride111 (Jan 13, 2011)

Orange_Pekoe said:


> You want "candy love". You want poetry, roses and butterflies, as you said. You want infatuation.
> 
> Real life is not like that. True love means loyalty, honesty, respect, affection. Is he affectionate towards you? A spouse can be affectionate but not necessarily romantic.
> 
> ...



I have a feeling you're right. Which is my own bad. But in part, is it his bad too? He doesn't ever call or text just to check in. And reminds me frequently that many people cannot call or text while at work AT ALL. Even though he has complete freedom to do so. So, fine. I have become content not to expect any unsolicited contact from him while he is working. But when we were dating, he sent me poems he wrote about me while I was in my college classes. And I had to try hard not to smile like an idiot in the middle of class. And I fell head-over-heels for this sensitive poetic creature who would take the time to make me feel special. 

He is still a sensitive man who I love and adore endlessly. But I believe he would be just as happy with me if we were not romantic together whatsoever (or okay, once weekly, lol). In one sense, this is sweet, right? In another sense, where's the fun in that? 

Butterflies and roses, candlelight and passion... It doesn't all need to end the day you take vows. And it shouldn't. It should continue on... but it should be an equal effort on both sides. Not just on my side. But hey, if it means asking the man to kiss me whenever I want a kiss, I guess thats not so bad. I've been coming around to this idea  We'll be fine. 

But would I have chosen to get married if I knew it would take spontaneity and passion out of my relationship? ... Well actually, I had already figured it would and I got married anyway. Cuz Im a damn fool for the man. My bad. LOL


----------



## NewBride111 (Jan 13, 2011)

Orange_Pekoe said:


> You want "candy love". You want poetry, roses and butterflies, as you said. You want infatuation.
> 
> Real life is not like that. True love means loyalty, honesty, respect, affection. Is he affectionate towards you? A spouse can be affectionate but not necessarily romantic.
> 
> ...



But hey - one more thing, in all sincerity - 

What would you do if you asked your husband "what it is that he loves about you"... and asked him twice, the other time phrasing it differently - "why he loves you"
and he couldn't answer you either time --- he couldn't give you a single word. 

What would you think? What would you do? 

I have decided, other than mentioning it here to get some feedback, to forget about it. And of course, not ask again, because that doesn't feel good... But what would you do?


----------



## Sammiee (Apr 15, 2015)

Maybe it's not the marriage that killed the romance maybe it was the children and all the inherent responsibilities of supporting a family.


----------



## PM1 (Aug 9, 2011)

NewBride111 said:


> But hey - one more thing, in all sincerity -
> 
> What would you do if you asked your husband "what it is that he loves about you"... and asked him twice, the other time phrasing it differently - "why he loves you"
> and he couldn't answer you either time --- he couldn't give you a single word.
> ...


I might think that person doesn't think that way? If you hadn't said he used to be poetic, I'd certainly say that was the issue, but since you did, it's less clear. Maybe he just isn't in that mindset anymore? Was he a student also when he had time to be more poetic and in touch with his feelings? If he works until midnight, his focus may just be so work oriented that his brain isn't giving him the words, but I don't think that means he doesn't actually love you, maybe just doesn't have the poetry you are looking for anymore. 

Also, how is he with being told what to do? I have a stubborn streak and resist being told what to do. It helped me in some ways, giving me the edge to push myself and succeed. But it can be contrary as well and less productive. I love my family, but as a kid when my mom would tell me to hug my sister, it would make me want to even less because it felt forced. Is it possible that the communication is backfiring slightly and he doesn't want you spelling out things like telling him to text you? I know, catch 22 then, if he isn't doing it spontaneously, how do you overcome that?

I would not say I have the most stressful job in the world, but as a project manager I have to keep a lot in my head at work. When I get here, I have to be "on" all day to get things done, and I try to let it go at home. But I don't find myself texting my wife to just say hi nearly as much as she is able to text me. It doesn't mean I don't have thoughts about her, but I am not in that mode often. 

Didn't read every post in this thread, but you two seem to need to get on the same wavelength. Any talk about friendly marriage counseling together?


----------



## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

What would I do?

Lots of things. I would get a volunteer job somewhere and pay a babysitter or join a babysitting co-op so I could go do the volunteering. I would line up a babysitter every other weekend and demand that my husband go out with me those two times a month and get to know me all over again. I would listen to NPR every day on the radio instead of having the TV on so that I'm learning new stuff every day and so I'll have interesting things to talk to my husband about. I would read at least one book a month so I'd have new stuff to talk to my husband about (and probably read it out loud to him at night in bed), which I'd get from the library that I visit at least once a month with my kids (since they need to be going to the library anyway). I would set up one 'play date' for me alone to go hang out with my girl friends at least once a month so that I continue to get stimulation from other adults. I would inform my husband that I expect to get time with him and start finding WAYS to spend time with him - whether it's using babysitters, family, or friends to take the kids off our hands - and start working up to at least 10 hours a week with him away from kids/chores/work. Do not accept 'no.' I would make sure that when hubby's home I'm dressed like I was when we were dating, so he remembers that you ARE a sexual creature to be cherished, and not just some sweatpants/t-shirt-covered 'person' who has replaced his mother; jewelry, perfume, makeup...the works.

And finally - and I don't know if this is a problem for you but it often is, I would NOT be doing everything for him, if he isn't participating. He has to see that you have VALUE and that you RESPECT yourself, and if he isn't going to be respecting you, he won't be getting all HIS needs filled either. Expect him to do chores, expect him to take the kids from you at least once a week when he gets home from work so that you can go for a walk or to meet up with a friend or go exercise. And if he outright refuses to do any chores, you face him squarely and say "I see. So you expect me to be your servant. Well, guess what? I'm not. If you won't mow/take out the trash/fix the leak/fill in, then I'm going to pull back on what I do for YOU so that I have time to get all those other things done. You'll have to start doing your own laundry, for example. It's your choice, but I deserve to be respected just as much as you do." The reason for this is that he has stopped looking up to you as something to be desired/won/kept. You have to regain that status in his mind - he has to be aware that he could lose you if he doesn't treat you as well as you treat him.


----------



## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

The OP is quite clearly communicating to her husband. Her husband is in the return-to-sender, address-unknown mode. He got her bagged and tagged so his work is done. 

Why is it the men on this thread understand the OP quite well but apparently her husband is excused because he doesn't speak Klingon?

Although fishing for compliments is never attractive, the OP sounds as though she is feeling frumpy, dumpy and overwhelmed with the demands of little ones. It sure wouldn't hurt her husband to lift her spirits by telling her she's beautiful every once in a while.

Since he isn't meeting your needs, pay less attention to his. What's good for the goose is good for the gander.


----------

