# Wifes online affair



## CMack (Jun 14, 2013)

Quick Rundown
Wife was having an online affair(thats what i call it) with guys she had met on MyFitnessPal.com. I am crushed. I love my wife and couldnt see my life without her. We talked and she says shes wants us to work. She deleted her account but then the next day created a new one, I talked to her about this and she says she just uses to help pass the time at work, and that her profile pics would just be a face only pic and no more flirting or anything else that would be disrespectful to our marriage. Everything seemes to be going ok, but i cant shake the feeling of being lied to. She says she did have feelings for 1 guy that was a "friend" type, the other 2 guys, 1 specifically she was sexting with was strictly physical attraction and says she would never have cheated. Which I feel she had already done. The friend one is married supposedly going through issues of his own but the 2 would talk about falling for one another. I know she is talking to both these guys now again. Everything seems to be clean, when sexting guy get dirty she doesnt respond until the subject is changed, and now has clothed body pics plus 1 bare belly picture posted. And i dont have the best access to her KiK messenging(which is the one that worries me). Is this going to turn into something bigger like i think it will? Should I wait and see or talk to her now about it? I believe she uses this for self-confidence and ill agree I am to blame for everything leading up to what happened. I wasnt treating her as she needed, very distant. How do I move on from this?


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## pollywog (May 30, 2013)

My fitness pal?...What?? I belong to that and never even thought about online affairs from there. Of course I would never cheat on my husband, but dag.

So sorry you are here for the same reason most of us are.


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## Myka (Apr 11, 2013)

If she was using the site to cheat she shouldn't be on it. Otherwise you're telling a crack addict "You can sit in the crack house, just don't smoke anything."


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## CMack (Jun 14, 2013)

I feel I can monitor her fitnesspal page closely enough to catch things if they were ever to pop up, but the KiK messenger on her phone is what bothers me soo much. Since I know she has re-added her flings to her fitnesspal I assume she may very well be talking to them with Kik. May or may not be anything. I also want to trust her again, she cried one day about it all and said she thought I didnt want to be with her anymore and thats how things escalated, I can see how she could feel that way. I was pretty cold to her for a long time. But I know she used MFP for a cpl months without any harmful flirting. Im just trying to do everything for her but I do feel it ALL must stop for me to be comfortable. I dont want her to feel like trying to keep her in a box. We dont really friends and I can see she has some friendships on that page with other girls and nice guys.


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## movin on (Jan 24, 2012)

Any of the guys she was flirting with should not be on her mfp. Expose to their wives.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Myka (Apr 11, 2013)

Put spyware on the phone. 

If you can't get the phone away from her long enough to do that then she is still cheating.


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## Myka (Apr 11, 2013)

movin on said:


> Any of the guys she was flirting with should not be on her mfp. Expose to their wives.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


:iagree:

No contact rule.


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## CMack (Jun 14, 2013)

Spyware for a phone? Galaxy S3 what do i need? and also what is a VAR? i thinking maybe video-audio-recorder?? She does keep her phone with her alot but since this blew up she isnt on it but may be in her pocket and such


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## Myka (Apr 11, 2013)

CMack said:


> Spyware for a phone? Galaxy S3 what do i need? and also what is a VAR? i thinking maybe video-audio-recorder?? She does keep her phone with her alot but since this blew up she isnt on it but may be in her pocket and such


Spybubble for the phone.

Voice Activated Recorder

She keeps it on her so you can't look at it. Pick it up and click around a bit. Watch her hover over you, or worse.


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## CMack (Jun 14, 2013)

would spybubble work with something like kik messenger??


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## BK23 (Apr 17, 2013)

Not to threadjack, but welcome back, Myka, how have you been?


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## walkonmars (Aug 21, 2012)

Do some sleuthing to discover who these dudes are. Then expose them to their wives. DO NOT contact these guys directly. 

Find their numbers used for texting and use one of the snooping services to find out their addresses and maybe email addys. 

She's gaslighting you about "just friends" krap. If you don't put a stop to this ... and soon, it's going to blow up into something that will be much more difficult to end. 

You may first want to insist she drops the site - f o r e v e r. That's a consequence. But I would still out these scum to their wives.

EDIT to add: Tell her that for the time being you want to have passwords and full access to all her communications until you are secure that she is fully vested in the marriage. Tell her that ATM you find it very difficult to trust her judgement. She needs to earn that trust - the first step is full transparency.


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## lenzi (Apr 10, 2012)

CMack said:


> she says she just uses to help pass the time at work, and that her profile pics would just be a face only pic and no more flirting or anything else that would be disrespectful to our marriage.


She won't do anything that SHE thinks is disrespectful to your marriage. Problem is that's very open-ended. she's already way over the line and doesn't think so.

This can't be about what she thinks is crossing the line, you need to be clear on your boundaries and what you will and will not tolerate and stick to your guns even if it means ending the marriage.


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## Myka (Apr 11, 2013)

BK23 said:


> Not to threadjack, but welcome back, Myka, how have you been?


Good my lawyers are so evil I'm uncomfortable being in the same room as them. 

H agreed to settle.

I'm still not comfortable using this site for support considering my H, but I felt good about the idea of posting advice. 

/End threadjack.


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## CMack (Jun 14, 2013)

will be looking into finding out more about these guys for sure, thanks. Also any advice on counseling or some marriage exercises that could be helpful.


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

"Not just friends" by Shirley glass

both of you read it


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## walkonmars (Aug 21, 2012)

Check with your insurance or HR at your work. They often provide counseling sessions free-of charge. 

Look for a marriage counselor who is experienced in infidelity - you are correct that she has cheated. 

By the way you should read this book:
The Married Man Sex Life Primer 2011: Athol Kay: 9781460981733: Amazon.com: Books


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## Myka (Apr 11, 2013)

CMack said:


> will be looking into finding out more about these guys for sure, thanks. Also any advice on counseling or some marriage exercises that could be helpful.


Marriage councseling is a waste of money until she stops cheating.

Your exercise right now should be in a gym.


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## FormerSelf (Apr 21, 2013)

Many here would suggest a VAR (starts and stops based on ambient noise...many micro recording products have a VOR feature) Some say best spot is beneath car seat...secured with velcro tape.

..her erasing profile and bringing it back may suggest she found herself unable to quit the emotional connection...it's like kicking a drug.

Read books on marital infidelity. Love Must Be Tough by James Dobsen is one I recommend. It's old, but I'd say the concepts are pretty solid. This is going to be a lot of work...'cos even though right know, her behavior has taken center stage...something created a weakness in your relationship that she began to tell herself that it was okay for her to do this.

Many others would also say to play dumb...act like you are trying your best to re-trust her and not be hovering over her shoulder...if you do, and if she is still doing her thing, then she will only be more smarter...such as getting a prepaid phone...being better at hiding her trail. So play dumb and don't show your insecurities...just be cool and use that to make her at ease...and if she starts taking risks, then hopefully you will have things in place to catch if she really did quit.

If she is actually on the straight and narrow...then you need to start regulating. Like switch off her site account where she acted out on. My wife acted out through gaming and meeting other pervs through that medium...after things were "resolved" she wriggled around me to get back to gaming...and I really didn't want to hold her past over her head, and I allowed it. Naw, she just went back to sex talk with greasy gaming nerds.


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## CMack (Jun 14, 2013)

read that spybubble will not retrieve info from KiK messenger. Any other software out there?


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## CMack (Jun 14, 2013)

Thanks for all the advice, I really appreciate it


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## awake1 (Jan 29, 2013)

So here's my opinion: 

She started up on this site because she started working out. Is she looking better? Hotter? Do guys oogle over her? 

Do women hit on you? Do you think she's a better looking woman than you are a man? 

You may well have caught this early, but then again you could be in for one heck of a ride. 

Have you checked phone records? Does she delete her texts? 

A woman (or man) sending pics to another man or woman is a way of advertisement. A married person should not be doing this. The online stuff can quickly escalate from emotional to physical. 

Regardless she's checking off all kinds of red flags. 

It's not your fault no matter what. Being emotionally distant is not an excuse to cheat. 

In any life long marriage there will be months, maybe years, where one person "isn't getting their needs met." But that's because life creeps in. Maybe someone has to work 14 hour days. Maybe schedules conflict or maybe one is sick. Maybe the newborn has been up every night. 

Whatever the case: If everyone cheated when their needs weren't being met, all couples would cheat. It's a crap excuse. 

Anyways: I'd check the phone records, get access to that messaging program no matter what. Take the phone while she's sleeping if you must. If she's deleting messages something is probably going on. 

Look in the gallery on her phone to check for nude pics. Check email too. 

I'd find out what you can, how extensive the cheating is and go from there. VARs are good too.


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## bryanp (Aug 25, 2011)

If the roles were reversed would she be putting up with such disrespect from you? This is totally unacceptable. She is flirting with other men and this will end up badly. 

No consequences to her actions equals no motivation to change. She continues to disrespect you and your marriage. If you do not respect yourself then who will?


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## Machiavelli (Feb 25, 2012)

cmack,
There are always exceptions, but in my experience it's a general rule that women start shaping up when they are getting ready to make a change. Men start shaping up after they get dumped. Come down hard on your wife and nip this in the bud. The longer you let her slide on this, the more she will lose attraction. She actually wants you to put her in her place.

The best marriage exercise I know of for men is bodybuilding 3X weekly. Get a six pack. Remember the Pareto Principal, 80% of the women are attracted to the same top 20% of men. You want to be in the top 10%, physically.


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## CMack (Jun 14, 2013)

I guess I was hoping that once I met all her needs she would stop on her own, wouldn't that be great to see out of nowhere just deleting her accounts, not keeping track of her phone. Kinda dumb i guess, But I was hoping anyways.

Oh and I have been workout out since this all came about. 1 issue is my eating habits, havent really been able to eat much since then, working out 6 days a week at home, lost 7lbs......151 to 144, not the way i needed to be going


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## badmemory (Jul 31, 2012)

CMack said:


> Quick Rundown
> Wife was having an online affair(thats what i call it) with guys she had met on MyFitnessPal.com. I am crushed. I love my wife and couldnt see my life without her. We talked and she says shes wants us to work. She deleted her account but then the next day created a new one, I talked to her about this and she says she just uses to help pass the time at work, and that her profile pics would just be a face only pic and no more flirting or anything else that would be disrespectful to our marriage. Everything seemes to be going ok, but i cant shake the feeling of being lied to. She says she did have feelings for 1 guy that was a "friend" type, the other 2 guys, 1 specifically she was sexting with was strictly physical attraction and says she would never have cheated. Which I feel she had already done. The friend one is married supposedly going through issues of his own but the 2 would talk about falling for one another. I know she is talking to both these guys now again. Everything seems to be clean, when sexting guy get dirty she doesnt respond until the subject is changed, and now has clothed body pics plus 1 bare belly picture posted. And i dont have the best access to her KiK messenging(which is the one that worries me). Is this going to turn into something bigger like i think it will? Should I wait and see or talk to her now about it? I believe she uses this for self-confidence and ill agree I am to blame for everything leading up to what happened. I wasnt treating her as she needed, very distant. How do I move on from this?


Cmack,

Like a lot of newly betrayed, you made mistakes. You rugswept her on-line EA's. She's received almost no consequences from this, even after she created a new account and you caught her.

Without meaningful consequences she's likely to do this again; or worse. You've sent her the signal that she can get away with the EA's, thus it makes them more likely to repeat. Except next time she will be more careful.

She should be sending a no contact communication to these losers that you review. Then the account has to go.

She needs to be completely transparent with all her communications. Passwords to everything. No GNO's, all time accounted for. No texting or messaging with other men.

If she is truly remorseful, she's not going to have a problem with this. If she's not, she'll balk. If she doesn't agree to everything you ask; time to do the 180 (find the link) and check back here for more advice. 

Monitor her covertly for a few weeks no matter what she does. Put a VAR in her car. Use a keylogger on her computer, spyware on her phone. Monitor her cell phone records.

A CHEATER MUST RECEIVE CONSEQUENCES. That is rule number one in the BS's playbook.


Edit to add: She is 100% responsible for this no matter what percent of the marital issues you were responsible for. There is no excuse for cheating. None.


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## Acoa (Sep 21, 2012)

Bottom line is you are not comfortable with her interactions with other men. She isn't respecting that fact. If she want's your respect, she needs to show you some. She isn't, so stop respecting her and start telling her how you feel. If she won't stop, tell her to move out. 

She will try to minimize what she is doing. She is probably even lying to herself about it. Nobody wants to be wrong, or the bad guy. But guess what, she is married and flirting. What she is doing is bad and wrong. You can't make her stop, but you don't have to live with it either. Make her choose, flirting with other men, or marriage to you. She is free to flirt with whoever she wants after the divorce goes through.

I was in this same place a year ago. Don't drag it out. It won't help.

I agree with the prior posters on good reading. "Not Just Friends" and The Married Man Sex Life Primer(MMSLP). You can download the MMSLP to a kindle or kindle app on your PC. I got "Not Just Friends" from our local public library.


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## mintypeas (Apr 17, 2013)

hello sorry you are going through all this. in relation to kik i had this issue with my fWH thats how he kept in contact with the ow so when i found out the app was deleted but that was not good enough so i changed all the details on it and then had the account deactivated even so it took 2 months and no help from kik at all this is an app that is impossible to get rid of. even after it is deactivated if you go on it it will start up again and they keep your details for a while they would not tell me how long. once the conversations are deleted you cant get them back at all it really is the perfect app for cheaters!! sorry if i have offended anyone but i really hate that app with a vengenance!! xxx


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## walkonmars (Aug 21, 2012)

You really need to out these dudes. From your initial post I assume she sent them risque pictures? Nudes perhaps. You don't want to be finding these on the internet --- they may be there already. Have her tell you who she sent what to. 

These could come back to haunt her (and you) - 
Do y'all have kids?


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## CMack (Jun 14, 2013)

whats this 180 thing? can i get a link

i didnt find any nudes and she said she didnt send any, but a few bikini and undies in some poses nothing real risque but was still gutwrenching seeing them


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## walkonmars (Aug 21, 2012)

the link for the 180 is at the bottom of this post. 

Check it out - but don't employ it all unless you want to detach from her. The 180 can work in having her re-commit to you but it's mostly for your benefit..


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## Myka (Apr 11, 2013)

CMack said:


> whats this 180 thing? can i get a link
> 
> i didnt find any nudes and she said she didnt send any, but a few bikini and undies in some poses nothing real risque but was still gutwrenching seeing them


Pictures in undies. Unless they're grandma panties it's an attempt at seduction.


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## thatbpguy (Dec 24, 2012)

CMack said:


> Quick Rundown
> Wife was having an online affair(thats what i call it) with guys she had met on MyFitnessPal.com. I am crushed. I love my wife and couldnt see my life without her. We talked and she says shes wants us to work. She deleted her account but then the next day created a new one, I talked to her about this and she says she just uses to help pass the time at work, and that her profile pics would just be a face only pic and no more flirting or anything else that would be disrespectful to our marriage. Everything seemes to be going ok, but i cant shake the feeling of being lied to. She says she did have feelings for 1 guy that was a "friend" type, the other 2 guys, 1 specifically she was sexting with was strictly physical attraction and says she would never have cheated. Which I feel she had already done. The friend one is married supposedly going through issues of his own but the 2 would talk about falling for one another. I know she is talking to both these guys now again. Everything seems to be clean, when sexting guy get dirty she doesnt respond until the subject is changed, and now has clothed body pics plus 1 bare belly picture posted. And i dont have the best access to her KiK messenging(which is the one that worries me). Is this going to turn into something bigger like i think it will? Should I wait and see or talk to her now about it? I believe she uses this for self-confidence and ill agree I am to blame for everything leading up to what happened. I wasnt treating her as she needed, very distant. How do I move on from this?


Your wife is an addict with classic addictive behavior. Sadly, this isn't going to stop. 

_AND, NO, YOU ARE NOT TO BLAME FOR ANY OF THIS!!!_

So now the question is- do you want to live with a serial betrayer, or not?

If the answer is yes I suggest she gets one chance and one only to show you, without and time to delete, every single email, text, sext... for all her accounts and phones. If she refuses, you have your answer from her that she doesn't love you and is going to continue to feed her addictions. If that's the case, time to go.

If she does, then possibly you can salvage the marriage but she will need intensive therapy for her addiction.

I wish you well.


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## Acabado (May 13, 2012)

Why the hell you let her to comunnicate with thoses men?
Its simply insane.
Expose them, detach (180), file for divorce, cut finances... damm. Do something!


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## LostCPA (Apr 15, 2011)

thatbpguy said:


> Your wife is an addict with classic addictive behavior. Sadly, this isn't going to stop.
> 
> _AND, NO, YOU ARE NOT TO BLAME FOR ANY OF THIS!!!_
> 
> ...


I would give her about 5 seconds to hand over the phone and give me the passwords. If she refuses, then you know her affairs are more important than your marriage. And, make no mistake, what she has been doing is cheating. 

Those with nothing to hide, hide NOTHING. There is no such thing as privacy in a marriage. In a marriage, the two become as one and therefore no need for privacy and secrets.


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

Sorry, but you've been played. She told you shed stop and she went right back to the affair.

I wouldn't ***** foot around it, I'd directly confront her duplicity, call her out and give her the choice them or you.


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## Dyokemm (Apr 24, 2013)

Shaggy is right.

Crackdown hard right now and give her a direct ultimatum.

And then stick to it if she does not immediately satisfy your demands.

If she doesn't comply, then do a hard 180 on her and serve her papers.

You have to make her understand how her life is going to be turned upside down and what she will be losing.


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## Machiavelli (Feb 25, 2012)

CMack said:


> I guess I was hoping that once I met all her needs she would stop on her own, wouldn't that be great to see out of nowhere just deleting her accounts, not keeping track of her phone. Kinda dumb i guess, But I was hoping anyways.


No, it doesn't work that way. This behavior is giving her a rush of dopamine. Once she does it IRL, the reward system will release tons of chemicals that put her on a crack-like high and then she'll really be hooked. Mother Nature, performing as intended to gather .... let's use the term "wild oats"...from the "fittest" available males, as determined by her unreasoning limbic reproductive selection system.



CMack said:


> Oh and I have been workout out since this all came about. 1 issue is my eating habits, havent really been able to eat much since then, working out 6 days a week at home, lost 7lbs......151 to 144, not the way i needed to be going


At least you aren't just sitting on your arse and expecting her to respond sexually "just because." You're losing weight because you're not eating well, not sleeping well, and not working out right. Six days a week on the weights is too much unless you're taking anabolics. All those six day splits assume you are on the juice. A natural man needs more recovery time.

Do this in the following order:
Squat
Chin Up (palms up or parallel grip)
Bent-over Barbell Row
Decline Bench Press
Overhead Press
Barbell Curl

Use a weight heavy enough that you can't get past 8-12 repetitions. Once you can lift it 12 times, add 10 pounds in the next session. Stop each set at failure. Drop 10 pounds off and repeat without rest. Go to failure and then move on to the next exercise and start it immediately. 

You will be destroyed in about 20 minutes. Chase the workout down with 40 grams of protein, meat or carb-free powder.

Give yourself 48 hours rest and repeat the same workout.

How tall are you?


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## Brokenshadow (May 3, 2013)

Machiavelli said:


> No, it doesn't work that way. This behavior is giving her a rush of dopamine. Once she does it IRL, the reward system will release tons of chemicals that put her on a crack-like high and then she'll really be hooked. Mother Nature, performing as intended to gather .... let's use the term "wild oats"...from the "fittest" available males, as determined by her unreasoning limbic reproductive selection system.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Weightlifter gives advice about intelligence gathering and verbal maneuvering, Machiavelli gives advice about strength training. Welcome to TAM.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## CMack (Jun 14, 2013)

5'10, 6 days of workouts different day diff muscle group. I'm not juicing although it had crossed my mine for quiker results. Have been told dhea, multivitamin, wheyprotein, and creating would help speed up results but haven't gotten any yet. 
Got home from work yesterday went in grabbed her phone and went through it. Nothing alarming just normal conversations about weight loss and 1 about her work with someone else who works in the same field. Nothing suspicious on her kik either. Didn't see any conversations with 2 of the 3 guys, and the one with the other was normal and did have a message from weeks ago when right after all this blew up about her stopping what was going on to save our marriage. Seems they connected because both me and his whatever were both being very distant and very unaffectionate. Which I know was true on my part.We talked and I told her she would have to stop for us to move on and she agreed. Also called my HR at work and got the number to a counseling service which the company will pay for. Will be buying some books but also saw this online and wanted to know if anyone had any experience with it or not. Thearrofmarriage.com Everything seems better for now. She hasn't touched her phone unless it was talking to her parents since then and said she did want to go out dancing tonight.....with me. While we move forward from here sound I continue to snoop or trust that she is in this as much as I am which I feel is absolutely the case.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Machiavelli (Feb 25, 2012)

Brokenshadow said:


> Weightlifter gives advice about intelligence gathering and verbal maneuvering, Machiavelli gives advice about strength training. Welcome to TAM.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Don't forget, he commanded the Florentine Militia and wrote "Dell'arte della guerra" and was a successful womanizer who knew all about why women prefer the Dark Triad.

_"I consider that it is better to be adventurous than cautious, because fortune is a woman, and if you wish to keep her under it is necessary to beat and ill-use her; and it is seen that she allows herself to be mastered by the adventurous rather than by those who go to work more coldly. She is, therefore, always, woman-like, a lover of young men, because they are less cautious, more violent, and with more audacity command her."_


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## Machiavelli (Feb 25, 2012)

CMack said:


> 5'10, 6 days of workouts different day diff muscle group. I'm not juicing although it had crossed my mine for quiker results.


Your masters may not approve of what you want to put in your own body, but I'll leave that up to you. I see validity in both approaches. If you're staying "natural" for a while, cut the split and do the 3X all body HIT routine with plenty of rest. Or do an HVT routine with plenty of rest. Days off are a must for the natural trainee. You want to do heavy leg work 3X because of it's impact on increasing T and HGH. You need more than you're getting on the split.




CMack said:


> Have been told dhea, multivitamin, wheyprotein, and creating would help speed up results but haven't gotten any yet.


Those are good. Make sure the whey has 1 or less grams of carbs per serving. The only thing I would add would be Cod Liver Oil. For many reasons, all good, but mostly because of the impact on T.



CMack said:


> Got home from work yesterday went in grabbed her phone and went through it. Nothing alarming just normal conversations about weight loss and 1 about her work with someone else who works in the same field. Nothing suspicious on her kik either. Didn't see any conversations with 2 of the 3 guys, and the one with the other was normal and did have a message from weeks ago when right after all this blew up about her stopping what was going on to save our marriage. Seems they connected because both me and his whatever were both being very distant and very unaffectionate. Which I know was true on my part.We talked and I told her she would have to stop for us to move on and she agreed. Also called my HR at work and got the number to a counseling service which the company will pay for. Will be buying some books but also saw this online and wanted to know if anyone had any experience with it or not. Thearrofmarriage.com Everything seems better for now. She hasn't touched her phone unless it was talking to her parents since then and said she did want to go out dancing tonight.....with me. While we move forward from here sound I continue to snoop or trust that she is in this as much as I am which I feel is absolutely the case.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Look for her burner phone.


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## weightlifter (Dec 14, 2012)

Weightlifter here. Resident VAR nerd and cheating wife buster.

Here is your plan of action. Please be the one guy this week who does as instructed. I am damn damn good at this.
1. Head to best buy. Sony VAR model icdpx312. Buy two. Do not buy 30 dollar ones. They are poo. Get the 50 dollar sony ones! Buy lithium batteries. We have examples of 25 hour recordings over 4 day business trips using these sonys.
2. Go to walmart. Buy heavy duty velcro. 
3. Use the menus to ***turn off the beep. Better yet get inside and cut the wires to the speaker***. Put it in voice activated mode. 
4. Attach the sticky side to the var and up inside her car seat. Attach it very very well. Velcro it in place. Up inside underneath so it does not show at all.
5. Put the other one wherever she talks inside the house.
6. The sound file will be an mp3. Use open source audacity to clean up recordings of things like engine noise to better hear her. I have used this program to clean up other mens recordings. It works well.
7. Look for a burner phone.
8. Look for games with chat features.

Odds and stuff.
EA 100%
PA 33%
I want a report you did this and have them in place by tomorrow night. Stop being a doormat. get a line on how deep this goes. Time is of the essence. Nudie pics are not long in the future. Hookup not long after that.

Look on the lower link on my sig at the bottom. Players are playing 

her. Player 101 is neither hard nor complicated.

Never ever reveal vars or other electronic evidence!!!!! Its none of her business how you know.

I gave you your plan. Execute it! I cant go to best buy for you. With roughly 15 cheating wives under my belt i know this game.


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## Brokenshadow (May 3, 2013)

Machiavelli said:


> Don't forget, he commanded the Florentine Militia and wrote "Dell'arte della guerra" and was a successful womanizer who knew all about why women prefer the Dark Triad.
> 
> _"I consider that it is better to be adventurous than cautious, because fortune is a woman, and if you wish to keep her under it is necessary to beat and ill-use her; and it is seen that she allows herself to be mastered by the adventurous rather than by those who go to work more coldly. She is, therefore, always, woman-like, a lover of young men, because they are less cautious, more violent, and with more audacity command her."_


My WW has never read my copy of "the prince". If she had, she might have taken to heart his warning that if you injure a man, it should be utterly mortal, so that don't need to worry about vengeance.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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