# My Seemingly Hopeless Situation



## NightTime (May 11, 2012)

I have been with my wife for ten years. In the beginning we had a good sex life, for the most part... meaning the first six months. After that we had quite a few mutual tragedies with our respective families that last years (illness, fights, financial issues)... through all of this we remained close friends.

There are some problems in the relationship to be absolutely sure. But also sex became a casualty of our problems. In the last ten years, I truly couldn't count how many times we had sex... lots of failed attempts where one or the other of us rejected the advances... after a while I lost my attraction. I still find her pretty, but I have for a long time just masturbated or thought about other women. This has, of course, created incredible sadness and guilt for me.

When we did have sex, usually I would stimulate her hand/orally and then she'd want penetration (only with a condom) and honestly much of the time I'd go until she was finished and then I'd just go into the bathroom and finish myself off or sometimes I wouldn't even bother to do that. 

So about five months ago we had blow up and slowly over the last five months we've fought and I've expressed a lot of anger towards her. For example never wanted sex without a condom... which in the context of a marriage I found humiliating. I tried to ask her about fantasies, that failed. I tried to engage her, that failed.

So finally she's said to me some very positive things. Things I wished that I'd heard years ago to be honest. She's explained that she felt badly about her body and herself and was afraid to be sexual. She now promises that she's changing and wants a healthy regular sex life... so I should be thrilled right?

Well I'm not. It really hurts me. In fact, it makes me feel that I tried alone for 10 years and only now when it's a problem for her (because divorce came up) that she's finally willing to deal with it and that makes me really hurt and angry. I also don't know if it's possible to be attracted to her again. 

I don't know what to expect. I don't know how to feel. I worry that it will just be another year of painful, terrible awful sex so that we can get to a place where basically the sex sucks and we have a "comfortable" friendship. I'm having a hard time investing and I feel humiliated and degraded by all of this. 

I guess I don't know what my question is really... I work out a lot and I'm going to be honest my sex drive is high. I mean I can handle it every day of the week or more... and to have gone for so long... I've tried to be faithful and patient and it's strange to me that now when there's some "hope" I just am loosing hope it seems.


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

I suspect if you just start doing it your desire for her will increase. As long as you try for the good stuff and she matches your effort. Also, she needs to stop with the condom bull****. If she's really trying to improve then you should be insisting on getting your bare **** in there right from the start.


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## Browncoat (Mar 25, 2012)

I can relate to your story. My wife and I are about to celebrate our 15th year of marriage this month, but for the first 12 or so years of marriage we had a sexless marriage (defined as <10x/year). Our reasons were different, as my wife's issue was pain during intercourse. Still the results are the same.

Like you two, we had our arguments... and I implored her to try and get some help so that we could change for the better. So I know what that feels like... I really do.

Over the past month and a half things have started to improve between my wife and I at a much faster rate than ever before. For the first time in I can't remember how long I've got hope that our marriage's sex life will get onto some semblance of reasonable (for both of us).

The main things that improved our sex lives were Sex Therapy (I would strongly encourage this for you two), reading books and communication.

I'd give all those things a try before divorce. I know I did, and I'm glad for it.

There are a lot of books we could recommend if you believe you and your wife are open to really reading through them.


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## NightTime (May 11, 2012)

Browncoat said:


> I can relate to your story. My wife and I are about to celebrate our 15th year of marriage this month, but for the first 12 or so years of marriage we had a sexless marriage (defined as <10x/year). Our reasons were different, as my wife's issue was pain during intercourse. Still the results are the same.
> 
> Like you two, we had our arguments... and I implored her to try and get some help so that we could change for the better. So I know what that feels like... I really do.
> 
> ...


Were you hurt and angry from the rejection? How did you get past that so you could try? 

I feel like it's not as much a matter of trying in some way... I think to some degree I feel like I can't stop feeling humiliated enough to want to try... I mean I think I actually let this woman deny sex for a decade? I actually believed that if I was patient and showed enough love that would be what I needed to do, and in a way I feel like my kindness was taken advantage of... I know intellectually that wasn't the case. I see the struggle she went through... but I just don't know how to stop feeling this way... 

I also feel like any other human being on earth who heard what I went through would laugh their ass off and think I was pathetic for tolerating this for so long. It makes me feel like a big joke... that's probably an barrier to me feeling aroused...


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## chillymorn (Aug 11, 2010)

i suspect she will try to do the lest amout possible and then you will get frustrated and things will slide back to her comfort zone.

If you want this to change you have to lose your pi$$y attitude about lost time sexually with her and bring out the vixon in her.

good luck


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## Browncoat (Mar 25, 2012)

NightTime said:


> Were you hurt and angry from the rejection? How did you get past that so you could try?


Yes!!! It's been truly agonizing. I felt unloved, unwanted... basically like the most insignificant thing in my wife's life. EVERYTHING felt like they were more important to my wife than me.

It still hurts at times, though things are really improving and that pain is lessening. The thing that's helped me most is that for the first time in forever, she's starting to show some actual desire for me time to time.

Before even when we had sex it was mechanical, like a procedure she performed to placate my desires when my deep heartwrenching pain was finally noticed by her.

That's the main thing that therapy and books have helped with... her recognizing my need for sex in the relationship. How it changes everything between us when that part of the relationship isn't starved. She also learned how to find/rediscover that long lost (if ever present) sexual desire for me.

The thing is low drive (LD) spouses often feel that their needs in the marriage are met... so they figured: why bother with that sex thing?



NightTime said:


> I feel like it's not as much a matter of trying in some way... I think to some degree I feel like I can't stop feeling humiliated enough to want to try... I mean I think I actually let this woman deny sex for a decade? I actually believed that if I was patient and showed enough love that would be what I needed to do, and in a way I feel like my kindness was taken advantage of... I know intellectually that wasn't the case. I see the struggle she went through... but I just don't know how to stop feeling this way...


I had/have a lot of built up resentment from all those sexless years in our marriage. That resentment is deep and will take time to go away completely (if ever... though I pray it does).

One thing I decided though, is that sex is a need I have in the marriage... and because it's a need I vowed to myself never to deny her advances. So even when I don't feel like it, because all that resentment and hurt feelings swell back up when she does make an advance... I make myself go through with it. Every time I do, I feel all the more blessed as a result, and I remind myself of that fact each and every time she comes back to me (which is something we are working on in and out of therapy).

I'd strongly encourage you to do the same. Just have sex with her, even with you don't feel like it... even when the pain is there. There is only one road to repairing your marriage, and part of that road goes through the bedroom.



NightTime said:


> I also feel like any other human being on earth who heard what I went through would laugh their ass off and think I was pathetic for tolerating this for so long. It makes me feel like a big joke... that's probably an barrier to me feeling aroused...


You aren't pathetic! You are an honorable husband! You don't need to let others around you know, it's none of their business and they likely wouldn't understand. No one around me knows of my wife's and my difficulty... except our therapist and as of last weekend our Pastor (though he knows only the minimum... and we only told him because he was a doctor once).


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## lamaga (May 8, 2012)

Browncoat, you seem like such a mensch. I admire your attitude a lot.


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## NightTime (May 11, 2012)

Browncoat said:


> Yes!!! It's been truly agonizing. I felt unloved, unwanted... basically like the most insignificant thing in my wife's life. EVERYTHING felt like they were more important to my wife than me.
> 
> It still hurts at times, though things are really improving and that pain is lessening. The thing that's helped me most is that for the first time in forever, she's starting to show some actual desire for me time to time.
> 
> ...


I can see what you're saying. But I don't know about the accepting her part when she's in the mood. That bothers me. It feels like I should sit up and beg too, maybe bark. Why don't i bring home other men for her to have sex with while i'm at it. 

I don't know this relationship has been all about her in many regards. She came from an abusive home and I get that because so did I. But I did everything. I ran the finances, cook, clean the house, try to coach her through tough times. I don't know. I'm starting to feel like marriages in general are pointless lies. Everything I read seems like people are either miserable and lying about it, or basically trying to have slightly more love than resentment.

I don't want to live with guilt and resentment for the rest of my life toward the person I'm supposed to be in love with... I don't know. I sometimes wish I'd never met her. 

I keep trying to find a way to let this go... I have turned down sex offers from other women... and honestly I'm starting to feel like I'm missing out. I don't feel like I can ever hope for anything more than mediocre sex. And you know that would have actually been 100% fine with me if I hadn't already gone through this. 

I don't know. It feels like she has all the control in this relationship to me. I always thought being kind and considerate to people was the way to go and it's not that I'm a push over, I talked about what I needed for years with her. 

I hear that I'm not supposed to take this personally, and btw she claims she masturbates every other day now (we live in separate rooms, I'm considering moving out altogether). I never wanted to be in this situation and I tried and I'm so angry with her for not trying... and then now when she gets around to it, I'm supposed to be thankful? I don't know.

I wouldn't mind a woman's perspective if any women are reading this.


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## Kathrynthegreat (Apr 23, 2012)

Woman's perspective:

My husband and I are in a similar place. I'm very LD, he's HD. We are very close friends and like and respect each other a lot. My LD issue was exacerbated in part by the fact that my only sexual experience prior to our marriage was a rape at 16. I tried for 10 years to meet him halfway, he tried to meet me, but there was too big of a gulf. We saw a counselor, I'd try to have it more often, but he recently revealed to me that even when I initiated sex or when we were having it more frequently, it still killed him because he knew I was doing it out of desire to make him happy, not out of desire for him. 

After a lot of thought and discussion, we've agreed to go our separate ways. He deserves a woman who can love *and* desire him for the awesome guy he is; I deserve to not have to have sex when I honestly don't want to. It's sad and painful, but I feel a lot of peace about our decision. Throughout this process we are being kind and respectful towards each other.


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## NightTime (May 11, 2012)

Kathrynthegreat said:


> Woman's perspective:
> 
> My husband and I are in a similar place. I'm very LD, he's HD. We are very close friends and like and respect each other a lot. My LD issue was exacerbated in part by the fact that my only sexual experience prior to our marriage was a rape at 16. I tried for 10 years to meet him halfway, he tried to meet me, but there was too big of a gulf. We saw a counselor, I'd try to have it more often, but he recently revealed to me that even when I initiated sex or when we were having it more frequently, it still killed him because he knew I was doing it out of desire to make him happy, not out of desire for him.
> 
> After a lot of thought and discussion, we've agreed to go our separate ways. He deserves a woman who can love *and* desire him for the awesome guy he is; I deserve to not have to have sex when I honestly don't want to. It's sad and painful, but I feel a lot of peace about our decision. Throughout this process we are being kind and respectful towards each other.


Thank you Kathryn. I am sorry it came to that, but I think it's good that you feel at peace and I admire you for staying friendly and respectful.

I don't know. Maybe that's what will happen to me too. I am friends with my wife and I do respect her and I'll never meet anyone like her again, I'm sure of that. But... I can't feel like this forever. Marriage is hard. 

You also deserve a good situation and one that fits for you and I hope you find it!


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## Browncoat (Mar 25, 2012)

NightTime said:


> Marriage is hard.


Yes it is... very hard.



NightTime said:


> I can see what you're saying. But I don't know about the accepting her part when she's in the mood. That bothers me. It feels like I should sit up and beg too, maybe bark. Why don't i bring home other men for her to have sex with while i'm at it.


She wants you, no other men... though I suspect that's the pain talking and that you already know that.

I understand why you feel like a dog that's only thrown a bone once in a while to placate you... or to shut you up. Still what's the alternative? You can reject her once in a while sure... but eventually if your marriage is going to have any hope of turning around sex has to reenter the marriage.

You both want sex, and need it. The only thing getting in the way now is resentment and pain. Yet if you continue to reject her advances, and she yours... well then all you will get is more resentment and pain. Work on getting past that pain because the alternative is certain divorce. Isn't she worth fighting for? Isn't your marriage worth fighting for? Is your resentment and pain that important to hold on to... to let it get in the way?

I don't mean to be mean or antagonistic by asking those questions. They are just the types of questions I wrestled with before I made my vow to not reject her advances.

You are blessed in that your wife actually wants to have sex, though I suspect you don't see it that way. Why?



NightTime said:


> I don't know this relationship has been all about her in many regards. She came from an abusive home and I get that because so did I. But I did everything. I ran the finances, cook, clean the house, try to coach her through tough times. I don't know. I'm starting to feel like marriages in general are pointless lies. Everything I read seems like people are either miserable and lying about it, or basically trying to have slightly more love than resentment.


This is why you need to focus on yourself for a while, doing a partial 180 (The Healing Heart: The 180). You need some space and time to focus on yourself so that you can heal.



NightTime said:


> I don't want to live with guilt and resentment for the rest of my life toward the person I'm supposed to be in love with... I don't know. I sometimes wish I'd never met her.


I had those same feelings at times. Still I would remember the good times, and our children. Our marriage wasn't without value, love and merit. I suspect if you consider the positives you would have to agree.




NightTime said:


> I keep trying to find a way to let this go... I have turned down sex offers from other women... and honestly I'm starting to feel like I'm missing out. I don't feel like I can ever hope for anything more than mediocre sex. And you know that would have actually been 100% fine with me if I hadn't already gone through this.


I know how you feel. Before we started sex therapy I pushed for it, but had no confidence that it would do anything to help what I saw as a hopeless situation. Still I pushed for it, because I figured that it was worth trying everything I could. Leaving no attempt to save our marriage untried.

The thing is sex therapy surprised me. Sex has actually improved a great deal over the past few weeks. I mean freaking amazingly improved! It's far too early to say that things are improved forever between us sexually, but I have hope now. I've not had that kind of hope for years, but now I do. It changed in just about a month. Your case may take more/less time, but isn't that worth trying?




NightTime said:


> I don't know. It feels like she has all the control in this relationship to me. I always thought being kind and considerate to people was the way to go and it's not that I'm a push over, I talked about what I needed for years with her.


This is why you need to consider doing a partial 180. So you can take control of your life more, while giving the marriage time to heal. Go out and work on something that's all about you: a hobby, class, sport, etc. Take that time for you... for your happiness.



NightTime said:


> I hear that I'm not supposed to take this personally, and btw she claims she masturbates every other day now (we live in separate rooms, I'm considering moving out altogether). I never wanted to be in this situation and I tried and I'm so angry with her for not trying... and then now when she gets around to it, I'm supposed to be thankful? I don't know.


You can continue to be upset, angry and resentful. You are justified to do so. Or you can try work with her and improve things. I chose the later, and for me despite feeling as hopeless as you feel now. Man I felt cursed, imprisoned and trapped! So much so it ached, and at times it still does. Still I'm glad I tried to work past it, I really am in a much better place now just one month later. It's because I chose to forgive her and tried to start over anew. Sure I've not forgotten the past 15 years of marriage, and I never will. I have chosen to forgive her, and to try and start things again for the better.


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## NightTime (May 11, 2012)

Browncoat said:


> Yes it is... very hard.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


You know. You're right. I mean I'm upset and very hurt. But the truth is, I do believe that she also wanted things to be different and was afraid and that must have hurt too. And I believe her. And we both came from bad backgrounds. We did. 

I thought about what you said and I think if this was who I thought she was as a person, then I guess there would be no hope really. But it's not. I think she is the person I saw when we met, but a lot of fear and trauma got in the way. And it did for me too to be honest. I have to be fair. 

This hurts so much. But part of it probably hurts because of how our families treated us. I don't know. Maybe I should try it. It's a lot to think about. I appreciate your genuine response. You're the first person who has given me a thoughtful answer. And not been like "oh no sex, well dump her ass" or criticized me for things I didn't actually do ha ha ha 

Isn't it amazing how so much of the time people give out marital advice based on things they saw in sitcoms or something. I appreciate it man. Thank you. It's a lot to think about. It was very kind of you to post this and to respond several times.


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## Browncoat (Mar 25, 2012)

It was my pleasure.

I really hope things work out for you two, keep us posted. Just remember sometimes there will be times when it's two step forwards and one step back (it's like that for us sometimes). When that step back happens, don't loose sight of the forward progress.


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