# Oh no - not this again..



## Turningacorner

My H had an affair with the mother of a kid who went to our daughter's play group. This was 3 years 8 months ago when he was not working for a period of time. He was a stay at home dad and ended up spending a lot of time with this married woman who didn't work either. So I guess they used all that 'free' time for more things than looking after the children. We reconciled after a very long ride getting us out of the darkness that it plunged us in. I suffered a bad bout of depression and couldn't take living where we were for obvious reasons, so we ended up moving away.

So we moved to a new town, continued marriage counseling, H started to work again and did really well with his job. He got promoted and our financial worries decreased and he was more attentive than before we were married - life was feeling good again. I got pregnant but sadly lost the baby to a miscarriage which was very upsetting for us both - I had a brief episode of being depressed again and H couldn't have been more supportive and caring. This was 2.5 years ago. 

So those have been our two major obstacles in our marriage so far - H's affair, the miscarriage and the period where he did not work. We managed to get through all of them and I actually went through a period of feeling quite blessed. Until last year. 

My H met a woman on facebook last year. He was the moderator for a facebook page that she used to comment on frequently. They ended up forming a friendship and she helped him find articles for his page. He would mention her quite a bit. One day when I went to use the computer we share at home, I noticed he had left his facebook page open and I decided to check it out. I saw there was tons of communication between my H and this woman. It was quite flirty and he had commented on her athletic legs and said she had a 'gorgeous smile'. When he got home I had printed out their endless conversations and shoved them under his nose. He looked terrified and immediately said he was sorry and that it was nothing. I don't even like to talk about that period as it was so terrifying to think he was starting to stray again. I triggered big time.

He immediately deleted his facebook page, showed me his phone and the texts between them - same kind of stuff. He removed her as a contact from his phone and deleted all the texts and shut down facebook page. He swore this would never happen again and that she was nothing and he would never speak to her again. Yada yada yada. 

Fast forward till now. H and I made a pitcher of margaritas Saturday and sat in the yard drinking and talking and enjoying the weather. H is not much of a drinker and ended up having to and lie down inside. He left his phone on the side table where he had been lying. I went to pick it up and ended up flicking through it and saw he had some apps that he has not mentioned to me before. So I check out one called Beejive IM which is an instant messenger for an iPhone. He has a list of friends who are contacts and who do I see on the list, but the woman from facebook and she was online and my H was set to dormant. So this is clearly something he uses. I immediately checked out the chat history and cannot find any. I ran inside and went and checked his laptop and our main computer for any emails or suspicious activity. I did not find anything, but I did find a photo of her that he had saved to his phone. It was saved during the time they were talking, but the point is he did not delete it. 

So I went to our room and packed him a bag and went down stairs, woke him up and kicked him out. He is literally swearing to me on the holy bible he has not been in touch with her and that he just forgot to delete her. I don't know what to do at this point. He is staying with a friend and my daughter and I are home. He is texting me non-stop saying he has not done anything wrong and he will do anything to come home. I don't know what to think or what to do at this point. We were reconciling from this SECOND affair, and now this. Has he broken no contact by having on this app? Should I believe him that it meant nothing?


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## noas55

Well it is obvious he did at least have an EA (emotional affair) with this lady. Maybe he is telling the truth, maybe not. 
The problem is that he did have an affair years ago and he allowed himself to get into an EA. This is a troubling sign.
I would like to know what his mindset is on what he is seeking from these other women. 
I would suggest he needs counseling for his affair issues at least, if not both of you to help you both get through the past problems and this current one


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## Turningacorner

noas55 said:


> Well it is obvious he did at least have an EA (emotional affair) with this lady. Maybe he is telling the truth, maybe not.
> The problem is that he did have an affair years ago and he allowed himself to get into an EA. This is a troubling sign.
> I would like to know what his mindset is on what he is seeking from these other women.
> I would suggest he needs counseling for his affair issues at least, if not both of you to help you both get through the past problems and this current one


Noas55, he definitely had an emotional affair with her. I tried to see it as being different from the sexual affair years beforehand as this woman from facebook lived in another state and they did not meet. But bottom line, he was talking about her body parts and they talked a lot so it definitely was cheating. Two strikes. I just can't believe that only a few months later I find a picture of her on his phone that he has not deleted and that she is a contact on this phone app. When I looked at the phone she was online so he definitely would have seen that too seeing he was ALSO online! So he doesn't deny that he saw her there, but he says he thought it didn't matter as he never talked to her. 

I don't know what to believe. I am starting to worry he has a problem. I always thought part of the reason he had that one affair was because his self-esteem was low due to not being able to find work and he felt funny about being a stay-at-home dad while I was working to bring home the proverbial bacon. I am now starting to wonder if he has problems. He has a good job now. No more financial worries. Our daughter is happy. I have kept myself in shape, look good and we have a great sex life. So there is no 'excuse'.


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## noas55

He does have a problem. The excuse of low self esteem is BS. I may be having issues in my 24 year marriage, but I never sought another woman and I have had all sorts of issues from ED, low self-esteem, numerous failures, and more.
I would say he is NEEDING something from you (some form of attention, affirmation, secret sex fantasy) and does not know how to ask? Many men are this way. I was too until I learned how to make the changes I needed to make in me these past 6 weeks.
There was no mistake on EA and he did not FORGET the girl. His lying is proof he is not ready to be with you. He must admit his guilt before he will ever begin to change.


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## Turningacorner

noas55 said:


> He does have a problem. The excuse of low self esteem is BS. I may be having issues in my 24 year marriage, but I never sought another woman and I have had all sorts of issues from ED, low self-esteem, numerous failures, and more.
> I would say he is NEEDING something from you (some form of attention, affirmation, secret sex fantasy) and does not know how to ask? Many men are this way. I was too until I learned how to make the changes I needed to make in me these past 6 weeks.
> There was no mistake on EA and he did not FORGET the girl. His lying is proof he is not ready to be with you. He must admit his guilt before he will ever begin to change.


Thanks for this Noas55. I always feel like I give him what he wants sexually. I never say no to him and have always tried to keep things fun and fresh. But maybe there is more I don't know that he needs. But that is still no excuse!!!!

He is saying he has not broken no contact. I think having her as a contact on an app that he could see her location and see when she was on line or not is still a betrayal. He said he had cut her out and we sent a joint letter to her saying he had closed his fb page and to not contact him ever again! And to keep a picture of her is BS. He said he forgot the picture was there.

We were talking recently about trying again for a second baby. I am beyond crushed to now discover this. I want so much to believe that this is nothing, but I know deep down this is bad. I am almost paralyzed what to do. I don't want to accept he could be the guy who would do this again! Especially because things are going so good for us.


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## noas55

Turningacorner said:


> Thanks for this Noas55. I always feel like I give him what he wants sexually. I never say no to him and have always tried to keep things fun and fresh. But maybe there is more I don't know that he needs. But that is still no excuse!!!!
> *You are correct. That is no excuse. He needs to tell you what is REALLY going on in his head. If he does not really know, he needs to get help if you are ever going to be able to trust him*
> He is saying he has not broken no contact. I think having her as a contact on an app that he could see her location and see when she was on line or not is still a betrayal. He said he had cut her out and we sent a joint letter to her saying he had closed his fb page and to not contact him ever again! And to keep a picture of her is BS. He said he forgot the picture was there.
> *Here again he may feel he did no wrong, but to you, he did. He should remove the apps and picture. This should have happened by him as soon as you confronted him. *
> We were talking recently about trying again for a second baby. I am beyond crushed to now discover this. I want so much to believe that this is nothing, but I know deep down this is bad. I am almost paralyzed what to do. I don't want to accept he could be the guy who would do this again! Especially because things are going so good for us.


DO NOT go for second child until you feel you can trust the man and want to live with him for decades. This may not be as bad as it sounds if he will seek counseling for his actions, past and present
Praying for both of you


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## norajane

Turningacorner said:


> Thanks for this Noas55. I always feel like I give him what he wants sexually. I never say no to him and have always tried to keep things fun and fresh. But maybe there is more I don't know that he needs. But that is still no excuse!!!!


Facebook woman was probably easy and fun for him to talk with, and he could feel good about himself in their conversations, because there is no baggage of betrayal between them. She sees him differently than you do, since he never cheated on her, so he probably feels better about himself when he's talking with her. 

He liked talking with someone who sees him as an interesting, fun guy rather than someone who is capable of deep betrayal and lies. With you, he probably feels some guilt and probably feels like a bad guy, even though you two might have been on the mend. With her, he can pretend to himself that he's not that guy.


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## moxy

I think you guys should see a marriage counselor. There are issues that you've both rug-swept, here.

I don't believe his story, entirely. He kept a photo on his phone. He could have easily deleted their chats. As far as you know, he never actually told her that he never wanted contact again, so this could be underground. And, he's cheated before, so you know it's possible.

I think you did the right thing. And, if there is a way for you two to get past this, he needs to be able to prove his innocence on this count, but you both also need to address what is causing a disconnect that would make this possible.


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## hibiscus

Give yourself as much space from him as you can. He was so wrong to be chatting up this woman on facebook, especially after breaking your trust like that three years ago.

If I caught my partner flirting with someone online or even having a general conversation with a woman on his phone etc, I would go nuts!


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## Turningacorner

moxy said:


> I think you guys should see a marriage counselor. There are issues that you've both rug-swept, here.
> 
> I don't believe his story, entirely. He kept a photo on his phone. He could have easily deleted their chats. As far as you know, he never actually told her that he never wanted contact again, so this could be underground. And, he's cheated before, so you know it's possible.
> 
> I think you did the right thing. And, if there is a way for you two to get past this, he needs to be able to prove his innocence on this count, but you both also need to address what is causing a disconnect that would make this possible.


THanks Moxy,

He did send the woman an email after I discovered the facebook chats. He said that the relationship was terminated and it was inappropriate and disrespectful of me. I was with him when he wrote it and had him BCC me a copy.

I don't think there has been any communication since, but he has not deleted her off this app. So its like they are in the same room every day when they are both logged on - but no one is talking. I checked out the chat history and there is none and there does not seem to be an option to delete old history, so I don't think there has been communication. But this was a total breach of our NC as the temptation was there. And in my mind, it means he could not let her go.

He is still out the house, I have not let him back. He comes home to see our child and to collect a change of clothes. He is very upset and swears it meant nothing.


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## Turningacorner

norajane said:


> Facebook woman was probably easy and fun for him to talk with, and he could feel good about himself in their conversations, because there is no baggage of betrayal between them. She sees him differently than you do, since he never cheated on her, so he probably feels better about himself when he's talking with her.
> 
> He liked talking with someone who sees him as an interesting, fun guy rather than someone who is capable of deep betrayal and lies. With you, he probably feels some guilt and probably feels like a bad guy, even though you two might have been on the mend. With her, he can pretend to himself that he's not that guy.


Unfortunately I think you are right. She made him feel great about himself, whereas when he is with me, although we have turned the corner from the past, he knows he always has to prove himself to be faithful. I hate that he can feel better about himself around another woman, when I am the one who is sticking by his side despite his deceit and the broken vows. So unfair.


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## Turningacorner

hibiscus said:


> Give yourself as much space from him as you can. He was so wrong to be chatting up this woman on facebook, especially after breaking your trust like that three years ago.
> 
> If I caught my partner flirting with someone online or even having a general conversation with a woman on his phone etc, I would go nuts!


It's the ultimate betrayal to do it again!!!! I know it wasn't a PA but it has hurt me just as much and in a way more, because now I feel I can never trust him again. I don't know what to do.


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## noas55

Turningacorner said:


> It's the ultimate betrayal to do it again!!!! I know it wasn't a PA but it has hurt me just as much and in a way more, because now I feel I can never trust him again. I don't know what to do.


You have a right to your feelings of betrayal. Trust is harder to rebuild the third time around. I know because I am currently trying to save my marriage due to breaking my wife's trust. Yes it is different than before, but still, I broke it.
Hang in there. Remember it is your decision. If you FEEL you love him enough and want to TRY to give him your trust, I recommend you to sit down with him, tell him politely this talk is about your wants, not his. You tell him how, why,what you want and expect, BUT MOST IMPORTANTLY this is the last time you will ever try. He screws up, he is gone.
his does not mean you let him come home. This is the beginning of rebuilding of trust, love, and marriage.
If he thinks you are asking too much, let him, but stand your ground.
It is up to you on how far you want to take the separation. Yes he make walk, but if he truly loves you, he will stay and fight for you. Of course you could lose him or the marriage fails due to too much time. This is the hard part. Your trust and happiness is what matters right now.

Prayers for you


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## cdbaker

From a strictly technology angle, it is possible that he had installed that app on there a long time ago and really never used it much, if at all. Apps have a tendency to ruin all the time in the background as they want to run the place, and if he isn't using it, it would likely have his status set to dormant or unavailable in some capacity.

Normally I don't find myself defending to many guys here, but in this case I do see cause to. His first affair was inexcusable of course, and his second EA seems to me like an enormous mistake. As you said, it is different consisting that she was thousands of miles away, there was really no chance of it going very far, and I can see how he might have accidentally fallen into that one without any negative intentions. In that scenario, I could see it being ready to assume that since a real affair isn't really possible, that there is nothing to be wary of, which of course isn't true at all, but I can see how someone could (initially) innocently fall into that trap.

As for this latest episode... my first thought is that you may have jumped to conclusions here with very little evidence, if any. I think you should have informed him of what you found, and immediately informed him that you are getting an appointment with a therapist, for both of you or just him. I think he is probably guilty of not doing everything he possibly could do to prevent any and all temptations by leaving that app and the picture on his phone, yes. But, and again this is just my impression based on what I have read here, I doubt he was actually engaging in any foul play here.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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