# Heading down this path?



## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

I posted an introduction in the "The Men's Clubhouse" forum, but my story is relevant here too, I guess...

I'm a 43 year old guy, been married for 18 years, have 2 kids in the 10 to 12 age range. Over the past 5 years or so, there's been a growing separation between my wife and myself. Things have been going downhill steeper over the past 2 years, and even steeper this summer. A good chunk of the degredation this summer is likely the result of my "checking out" of the relationship, and I can see that. I've made some other bad decisions as part of that, and will have to deal with the fall-out.

Right now, we're in counseling... I've done an individual session with our counselor, my wife did an individual one, and we've got a joint one scheduled for next Tuesday. I haven't written off the possibility of reconciling, but I don't see it as being probable. But I'd prefer to hold things together till after Christmas, if possible. And as others have said in my other thread, if I don't deal with the issues that have caused the problems in this relationship, I'm going to be bringing them along into whatever future relationships I have. 

C


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

So my wife came back from her session, and told me that "she knew what her problem is". We waited for the kids to go to bed, and sat down for another talk. And apparently the root of her problem is that she's "lonely", and a big chunk of it is my fault because I don't communicate with her. I figured that there wasn't any point in trying to defend myself and my behaviour at that point, so I just let her talk. I think it made her feel better to get it out, in any case. And I can tell my side of the story in our joint session (next Tuesday).

And yes, I acknowlege that I could do (much?) better in the communication area... 

C


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## heavenleigh (Sep 13, 2010)

Well, I am glad to hear you both are in couseling...who knows it just might work out. I can tell you from a woman who is very lonely that we need to talk and do things with our husbands. That gives us a sense of closeness. For some reason it does not seem to matter to men if they spend time with their wives, but I know it means a lot to me when me and my husband spend time together. It is when we stopped doing things together, everything fell apart. I really hope you can work it out. Good luck if that is what you really want.


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

So we had our first joint session. It didn't go as I expected, but it was all about communication, which was good. As the therapist said, the issue is communication. The rest is symptoms of the issue. So our homework from the session was to sit down over the next two weeks and work on our communication to talk about some of the other stuff.

Fast forward a couple days to Wednesday... After the kids were in bed, I went over to where the she was watching TV, closed the door, and suggested we try to talk about some stuff. Her response was "You want to do this now?". Yeah, that was the response I was looking for... Anyway, we gave it a whirl. 

Without going into a lot of details, she's taking the blame for almost everything. Her choice, not mine. I asked repeatedly what I can do to change, what I'm doing wrong, told her that a relationship doesn't fail because of one person... The only thing I got back was that I could spend more time with the family, doing family things. And yes, I can take that as a useful suggestion/comment. I only got that by prying, and she made it seem like a minor thing. With everything else though, she took the blame for a need to change herself.

From my perspective, this really isn't helping me much... I'm pretty sure I'm not that perfect, and she's either not looking at her feelings honestly enough, or isn't willing to be honest with me. I don't know how to drag it out of her, though. We've got another joint session in a week or so, and maybe that will help. But the end result of this is that I feel that she's telling me what she thinks I want to hear, and isn't being honest with me about what she really feels.

Oh, and when she was talking about being lonely, she was talking partially about me, and partially about how she's closed herself off from friends. She talks to her 2 sisters on a regular basis, her mom, and my mom. All on the phone. She has stopped communicating with her friends, and she hasn't built any new friend relationships. No reason given why this has happened... Just has happened over the last 5 years or so.

So... Any suggestions on how I can get her to open up fully to me?

C


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

So it's come out in the open that I want a separation... That things aren't going to work out. Merry Christmas to us!  

That came out on Monday, and her first response was "What about Christmas?", and a lot of tears, which was all understandable. We're in a holding pattern till after the holidays. Since then, we haven't talked about "it"... On Monday afternoon, she sent an apologetic text about some of the things that came up. Then on Monday evening, she just said that she doesn't want to say something that she doesn't mean, and doesn't want to talk right now. We briefly discussed family obligations and functions, and that was it. So I'm kind of waiting for her to bring things up, but I'll bring it up next week if she hasn't. Spending the weekend (starting tonight) about our family's places, so not really the appopriate time/space for any real discussions. Right now, we're back to talking about kids, Christmas plans, very light/surface stuff... But there's no fighting, and no animosity in the air, as far as I can tell.

I've got a place lined up for anytime in January; she doesn't know that yet (since we haven't talked about "it" since)... I'm looking forward to that; it's the basement floor of a friend's condo, in a nice location for me (15 minute walk from work, by the river valley and parks), and pretty cheap. Not a permanent solution by any means (what 43 year old wants to be a room-mate?), but a good interim place. Because it's with a friend, he's very flexible on when I move in or out, and it will be good to have someone to hang with, I think.

I suspect when a moving day is discussed, and that it's actually going to happen, the emotions will hit hard again. To be expected, but not something I'm looking forward to, obviously. We've got another counseling session in mid-January; not sure if that will be used to talk about ideas on explaining things to the kids or what... 

C


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## zsu234 (Oct 25, 2010)

Dude, why are you bailing on her when she is ready to do the work on your marriage. She sounds very cooperative and willing. Don't quit on your family. Think of your kids!


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

Gee, if it was that easy, I have no idea why this site exists!

No offense, and I appreciate the second comment of the thread besides my own...  But...

Just because a person is cooperative and willing doesn't mean that they'll actually change, or stick to the changes. And there's limits to the kind of changes that can be made. Personality transplants are not an option, as far as I know.

C


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## sbbs (Sep 21, 2009)

PBear--how are you doing? Are you holding up OK on the lead-up to Christmas?

It's so sad that you feel you have to move out. It seemed that the two of you were making progress. Maybe we all got the wrong impression. 

What made you decide to leave?


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

sbss, sorry for the lack of an update... 

First, no, it never seemed like we made any progress... We started communicating, which was an improvement in itself I guess. But the additional communication only re-inforced what I already felt. That I'm married to the wrong person, and my happiness would be dependent on her changing herself fundamentally. And given the track record of smaller changes that were still important to us, I have little to no faith that it's possible.

Christmas was tough. A number of our tensions were eased, at least because things were out in the open. We agreed to continue as "normal" as possible, but I took advantage of pretty much any opportunity to spend time outside the house (company Christmas gatherings, friends, etc). Things that I normally wouldn't do, but whatever. It kept things less tense (for me at least) at home.

It was also tough thinking throughout the holidays that this is likely our last "normal" Christmas, or even family function. But I truly do feel that this is the path for me to start to heal, so I need to stick with my plan. I didn't mention it in here, but about 14 years ago (when we had been married for 4 years) we briefly split up, like less than a week. That was my choice then, and it was my choice to try again. But being young and foolish, we didn't actually take any steps to fix the problems, or even talk them out. She didn't ask, and I didn't tell. If we had, we might have been able to tell then that we were on two diverging tracks. But we didn't, and now we've got kids and 14 years more history to deal with.

Sometime in the next week or so, I'm going to have to ignore her request to not talk about things, and have another sit down discussion. Tell her that I have a place, and work out a plan to get there. I've done some reading about some ideas to communicate the changes to the kids, and that's a big issue for us. We've got a counseling session in mid-January, and the option to use that session to talk about this issue is there. Then my daughter's 12th birthday is towards the end of January, so what to do about working around that? Move out before, so things have a chance to get "more normal" again? Move out shortly after? I dunno what the answer is yet, but standing still isn't it.

C


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