# Spouse says he has changed after 26 years



## breezycello (May 29, 2015)

New here. Separated for 1 month, in a separate home. I suspected my husband was having an affair around our 25th anniversary. He had become very distant, angry and nonresponsive. I tried for months to figure out what was happening and he would just trump it up to work stress. We were self employed and working together. I had finally seen a text message that came across his phone early in the morning (from her) when he left his phone next to me. My suspicions were correct and I confronted him. He was shocked and said it was an emotional affair and that it would end. It didn't. I had caught him two more times (I realize I should have walked away). The last time was a planned weekend away. Side note, she was one of our family friends for nearly 20 years and a huge part of my children's lives. We all worked together, in our office. That was the beginning of the end. I could not handle seeing her and him every day, left our business and went back to my career. That was 3 months ago. He never wants to discuss us as he doesn't like those discussions. We have not yet divorced, separated only, nothing on paper. I am paying my living expenses, while he is paying for our kids college, our marital home and my vehicle payment. The income is heavily weighted in his favor (the business); however, he is also paying for our kids. He doesn't give me any extra money or emotional support. I am working on my emotional issues (outbursts if I drink and great sadness and loss). Understandably, we are probably never going to be able to repair the hurt we have both given to each other; however, I cannot figure out how to quit obsessing over him or find a way to move forward. Any ideas?


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## ScrambledEggs (Jan 14, 2014)

breezycello said:


> New here. Separated for 1 month, in a separate home. I suspected my husband was having an affair around our 25th anniversary. He had become very distant, angry and nonresponsive. I tried for months to figure out what was happening and he would just trump it up to work stress. We were self employed and working together. I had finally seen a text message that came across his phone early in the morning (from her) when he left his phone next to me. My suspicions were correct and I confronted him. He was shocked and said it was an emotional affair and that it would end. It didn't. I had caught him two more times (I realize I should have walked away). The last time was a planned weekend away. Side note, she was one of our family friends for nearly 20 years and a huge part of my children's lives. We all worked together, in our office. That was the beginning of the end. I could not handle seeing her and him every day, left our business and went back to my career. That was 3 months ago. He never wants to discuss us as he doesn't like those discussions. We have not yet divorced, separated only, nothing on paper. I am paying my living expenses, while he is paying for our kids college, our marital home and my vehicle payment. The income is heavily weighted in his favor (the business); however, he is also paying for our kids. He doesn't give me any extra money or emotional support. I am working on my emotional issues (outbursts if I drink and great sadness and loss). Understandably, we are probably never going to be able to repair the hurt we have both given to each other; however, I cannot figure out how to quit obsessing over him or find a way to move forward. Any ideas?


There is a process called the 180 where you incrementally alter your feelings for him by small behaviors. It is extremely effective in getting your head together and looking forward. Until you do that, you won't get anywhere in life.

Doing a 180 is an act of self love and personal commitment to have a good life and you are overdue to start this process.

http://www.network54.com/Forum/233195/thread/1302875291/last-1302891381/The+180


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## ScrambledEggs (Jan 14, 2014)

Also, 180 is a "fake it until you make it philosophy" by doing the behaviors of moving on you eventually do. It really does work but you have to hit it hard. No cheating on the rules.

Another idea is to just set a date in the near future, days or a month, where you are willing to continue to reach out to your husband with reconciliation after which you just decide that you will move on. Tell your husband the date, decision, and consequence. He won't believe you or respond to it but this is symbolic of forcing his hand and is for you anyway. Oddly enough this can work also. it is a sort of mental trick on yourself. The very next day, get yourself a lawyer and assure your future. Have the kids tuition baked into the divorce agreement if they can't pay their own way.


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## jorgegene (May 26, 2012)

time is the only cure for just about anything emotional.

when i found my ex cheating i ruminated for months, even years.
churning over in my mind why, how, what did i do?

that's what it takes. being as busy with beneficial things that distract you from the hurt and pain.
staying away from destructive things such as drinking, drugs, rebound affairs, et.

time. time; that's the only thing. it will ease slowly but surely.


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## Nomorebeans (Mar 31, 2015)

I'm sorry you're here. Except for the OW being a known coworker and friend (and that is so very awful - I really feel for you on that one - my STBX met his while on a solo trip out of state), your story mimics mine, right down to discovering my STBX's affair via a text message she sent him when his phone was sitting next to me on a couch. 25 years of marriage down the tubes.

I found out in February of this year. Went down the rabbit hole for the first two months, and had to claw my way back out of it. Here's how I did it: 1. I stopped drinking. I found that when I drank after DDay to try to numb my hurt and anger, it was like putting out a fire with gasoline. I became "Mr. Hyde." The monster I became scared me. So I stopped. It wasn't as hard to as I thought, because my stomach was also a mess from the stress, and the alcohol was making that worse. 2. I started walking. Every day after work. At first, just for 10 or 15 minutes. Now, I walk for an hour every evening. 3-4 miles. I've lost 25 pounts - the first 15 unintentionally from the stress, but the last 10 from continuing this walking regimen, which I do really because it makes me feel good and clears my head. Sometimes I still cry a little on these walks, but the amount of time I do has become less and less every time. 3. I followed The 180. When I wasn't feeling it, which was often, I faked it. It didn't get my husband back, and that's fine, because now I don't want him back. Someone who values and respects me so little after 27 years together that he would lie repeatedly to my face is not worthy of my time or effort. (Sometimes I have to remind myself of that over and over, but it's becoming less and less often that I have to do that.) 

You're taking the right steps on The 180 path by getting away from him and your old job together. Very strong move - good job!

Let me help you with your struggle with "The Why." I've been struggling with that one, too - "Why/how could he do this to me and our son?" Actually, the answer is very simple (although it took me months to realize it): He is lacking in moral character. That's it. Really. There is never any excuse to cheat (when we're not talking about deeply, pathologically abusive spouses). It is not your fault, it is not because you drove him away. It is because he didn't have the moral character to tell you he was unhappy in the marriage and at least give it the old college try to try to save it before he made the choice to embark upon an affair. Tell yourself that over and over whenever you need to. It is the truth. I did not drive my husband to make the choice he made to have an affair, no more than had I chosen to keep drinking and drunk myself to death, it would be fair to say his affair drove me to make that choice.

Whenever you have a terrible, terrible day with this, read The 180. Read it again. And again. And implement it. It really does help. It helped me to find and love myself again. It can save a marriage, if the marriage is worth saving. Mine was not. Regardless of whether you can or want to save your marriage, it will save YOU.

Hugs to you - again, I'm so sorry you're here.


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## breezycello (May 29, 2015)

Thank you all so much for taking the time to post and give me insight. I did go read The 180. I have been implementing some of those items; however, not nearly enough of them. I have stopped drinking. Even 1 drink alters my thoughts and makes me feel "crazy". Our daughers are nearly done with schooling and what loans are out there for that are in his name and he has been paying. 

The hardest part of this for me right now is his lack of empathy, remorse or even acknowledgement. He feels that the the past 4 months have really pushed him away. He is not the man I grew up with, married, built businesses and had children with. Last time I saw him and we actually talked about where we were headed, his eyes were filled with anger that I had never seen. He says that I have pushed him further than anyone has and that his becoming physical is the only way to get me to "stop". And then he feels belittled, but no thought (out loud) about his role in this. I am sure I am really grieving the loss of my best friend, dreams, lover and spouse. 

I am, by nature, a homebody and happy by myself. I have been trying to get out more and be more social. It feels like I don't even know how to socialize or hold a conversation without bringing him into it. I do not like that and am working to stop. I do like my new place, my job, my little dog and my time with my friends...I just can't figure out how to let go of "the old" him in my head.

Things are much easier when we do not talk or text often. Our finances are very intermingled due to so many years together and having worked together in the business. I have met with an attorney once and she did tell me to gather as much information as possible. I have been doing that, but with not being in the office or part of the finances any longer, this is difficult. I am sure I didn't mention that her and his OW (my old friend) own rental properties together under another corporation but are part of our tax returns. Again, too much mingling...That part scares me and the attorney is so expensive. Right now, I pay all of my own expenses except my car payment. We do own a home that he is living in on his own and he is carrying the kids. Mind you, we do not have a lot of debt. The idea of digging into all of the financial stuff is overwhelming. Almost to a point it would just be easier to walk away from all of that.

I do realize that time will help all of us struggling with our marriage and emotions. I am afraid to file the divorce and dont know why as I really do not think anything can be saved for us. He refuses to do counseling or even talk about a future. Maybe I am just rushing....


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## breezycello (May 29, 2015)

I apologize for posting again. I wanted to mention one other thing. No More Beans, you are so right. He is truly lacking in moral character. I do see that and can't understand why I would even want to associate with someone of this standard. I don't believe he even wants to change. When I told him that I could not understand why he would just walk about from all that we have been through, all of our years together and many happy times, he said "Sorry, I am just not that person anymore". I was flabbergasted. 

This is not all one sided. I have made a mess of things because I could not move on and begged..in essence, pushing him further away. The more I say things out loud or put them here, the more I see that I need to really work on The180 and do my very best to put on a good front to make my brain see what is happening. Thank you all again for bringing that to light!


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## BlueWoman (Jan 8, 2015)

If you've only been seperated for a month...I would cut yourself some slack. Follow the 180 definitely...but also respect your grief. One month isn't a lot of time to process the loss of a 25 year marriage. 

If your husband had died, would anyone expect you to be over it in a month?

Well in away, your husband did die. And the man is in your husband murdered him. (I know it seems extreme, but that thought helped me at the worst.)

And finally, I am so sorry that happened to you. I feel your pain. Unfortunately, here, many of us do./


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## breezycello (May 29, 2015)

Blue Woman, Thank you. You are right..it technically has only been a month. Sleeping separate since January. Mess started June 2014. Just feels longer I suppose. 

We all here have and do feel this pain. It really is a blessing to share and receive feedback. I have enjoyed reading through this site. I am hoping to see some "aha" posts, that we can see after they had been posting for a while. 

I am sorry you are or have gone through this pain as well. If we are here, we have hurt.


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## breezycello (May 29, 2015)

Tonight has been hard. I have been working the 180, of course not for very long. Yesterday, husband came by to pick up our other dog. He was out of town and he has one and I have the other. Visited some and actually smiled a bit. He gave me a hug, as he always does when he leaves and told me "love ya" as he was walking out the door. Haven't heard anything near those words in a very long time.

So now confused...today was fine. Tonight I needed to ask him about our taxes as he has been working to get them done and filed. This has been my task every year until this year. Trying to be sure I am keeping up on some of our financial stuff. I called him and fell apart. He says he understands but doesn't say much. He tells me he does miss being around me "sometimes". But he really doesn't know where his feelings toward me are. I was reminiscing about the fun things we used to do in the summer that won't be happening and I think that set me up for the fall.

I text him after the call and said that I only wanted to know the answer to two questions. One being, does he want to be with me or not and does he want to work on our marriage or not. I know how this sounds. And I would tell anyone that if they don't know if they want those things or not, then the one asking should turn and run fast..but I cannot seem to do that. I feel like a total idiot by even waiting for him to make that choice. But can't bring myself to file. He has not responded but it is late here. 

He has buried himself in work and blames the fact that he is so busy on why he hasn't given the relationship thought of a future or not. I need to find a way to stop the pain and get out of limbo. Frankly, don't even know what life is supposed to be like now. Want to be happy but can't seem to really find any joy. 

Will this ever get easier?


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## breezycello (May 29, 2015)

Nomorebeans - I know that I don't deserve this disrespect from my husband. And nor did you. How did you find your place of being ok without him and not contacting or reaching out? I am working on the faking it til I make it, but ugh...just so sad.


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## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

BC, you were told to practice the 180, you are not doing that. You shouldn't even let him have the opportunity to make you feel down again. Do not run after him.
Only speak to him on official business. If there is any hope at all, you will not win him back with appearing weak and unsure of yourself and you do. 
Pretend you are moving on. Go back and read the 180, carry it around with you, read it over and over. He knows he has you in the palm of his hand and will eat cake while he can. 

Take action. Sort out your finances, get stuck into the nitty gritty of it, get a new lawyer, (not the one who is involved with the OW), hammer out what you would want in the divorce agreement, occupy your time with these things. 
Then think perhaps in another 6-12 months, you will not want back the man who has brought your world crashing down around your ears and betrayed you with a W who was a big part of your children's lives. Get angry, but don't let him see you moping, because that will just fuel his ego and do not believe for one minute that just because he hugged you and said 'luv ya' it means anything. He is manipulating you and sounds cruel too. 
As i said practice the 180 as if your life depended on it.


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## Nomorebeans (Mar 31, 2015)

breezycello said:


> Nomorebeans - I know that I don't deserve this disrespect from my husband. And nor did you. How did you find your place of being ok without him and not contacting or reaching out? I am working on the faking it til I make it, but ugh...just so sad.


BC, I've certainly had a couple of backsliding times in which I slipped and let him know how much I was still hurting. Both were early on before I found TAM and the 180, and I hated myself for both of them immediately afterwards.

Two things have brought me to that blessed place of being OK without him - time, and he himself, with his continually, consistently insensitive and selfish words and actions. The final nail in the coffin was when I recently learned that he lied to our longtime friends in his hometown where he met the OW in September when he went back there to see her unbeknownst to me in December - he told them that he and I were already separated and in the process of a divorce (not true - we were still living together and hadn't even discussed divorce), I knew about her (totally not true), and I was "OK with it." !!! He also told them that *I* was the one who asked for separation and divorce the year before that. (Absolutely not true.) I had asked him point blank not long after D-Day what he told these friends of ours that would make them feel OK about going out to dinner with the two of them, like they were some established couple and I didn't exist, and he said, and I quote, "Oh, they've known the marriage was already over for a long time." And that's what we call classic gas-lighting. He doubled down on the lie, and threw his own friends under the bus in the process.

The mask has been fully removed, and I see him clearly for what he really is and always has been. You will get there, too. But it will take more time - time for you to finish grieving privately (do NOT share any more of your grief with him, no matter how much you want to - literally bite your tongue if you have to). And time for him to fully reveal himself as the morally bereft, lying narcissist he is.

Most important, what you have to realize and truly believe is that you can't make him feel true remorse for what he's done because he has stopped caring about you. He did that at some point before he made the choice to start cheating on you. I knew that intellectually all along, but I needed to have it proven to me, apparently a couple dozen times.

Because I've come to this place, I was able to not say a word when he called me this past Sunday to tell me about his father, who had been placed on life support at a local hospital, and broke down apologizing to me for "everything he's done to me in the last year" when I "have done nothing wrong and didn't deserve any of it," and praised me for how "good" and "helpful" and "like an angel" I've been throughout this whole process. He said all this, and yet he has no intention of ending his relationship with the OW and wants to continue on with the divorce and move her down here as soon as possible after that happens. In the same conversation, he also asked if I was ready to sign the settlement and family plan papers, so he could call his lawyer and ask him to send me official copies. I can see now that he's not sorry for hurting me at all - he's sorry for how bad it makes him look.

I've gone from dreading the day when I sign those papers to almost looking forward to it. It will feel like letting go of a weight that's been pulling me under for a very long time. You will get to this place. I promise. In the meantime, take good and gentle care of yourself. As Aine said, live the 180 like your life depends on it, because in a way, it does. Become an actor when you're not feeling it. I have a few Academy Award-caliber performances under my belt. I'm quite proud of them, actually, and replay them in my mind whenever I need a pick-me-up.

Here're a few tips others have given me that have helped when I was still struggling:

1. Do not call him, unless it is a matter of urgency regarding your children or home.

2. As a matter of course, when he calls you, do not answer. Let him leave you a voice mail message or a text. If it's an emergency, he will. (And I've found, even if it isn't, he will, because narcissists can't stand going unheard and unresponded to.) Then, wait 1 hour before you get back to him (unless it is an emergency, of course). Do not apologize or make excuses for the delay when you do call or text him back. My STBX has ended up asking me if I was in a meeting when I didn't call back right away. I just said, "No, I wasn't" and provided no other reason.

3. When you do speak to him on the phone, be pleasant and business-like, but short on words. Basically, speak to him exactly the way he speaks to you. Once you get the hang of this, it is extremely satisfying, by the way.

4. When you fall into thinking that you still love him, ask yourself if he is really lovable right now. What you think you still love is the man you thought he was. He is not that man. He never was. That man was a construct you created in your mind based on what he had shown you up until that point. The man behind the curtain really is someone else, entirely. And you deserve a better man than that one.


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## Mr.Fisty (Nov 4, 2014)

You are learning to see him in a different way and that takes time. You have spent years building a construct of the idea of who your husband is, and you will slowly associate more and more of these new negative memories to him. Slowly the good you see in him will fade, and the more bad you recognize and focus on, the faster you start associating him with those negative qualities.

Until then, you should get some distance from him. Being around him, talking to him, will activate your attachment for him, wanting you to reinforce those bonds, wanting the past him as you knew him as to return to you. The past him is what you really want or the person who he showed you as himself.

So, when you think of him, think about the negative emotions that he brings out in you. Link those memories and emotions to him. Neurologically, you are creating a new path in the way you see him. The less you focus on the past and good times, the faster those good memories have power over you. Soon in the future, thoughts about him will be more associated with negative feelings and emotions. It is a process and is not instantaneous.


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## breezycello (May 29, 2015)

Two whole days with no tears!! I heard the word "pathetic" loud and clear! I have also printed out the 180 and keep it on my desk (i work from my new home)...

Yesterday, I did not reach out to him. He called me around 6:30. I did pick up the call. Strange for him to call and not text. I had asked him 2 days before to give me two answers: do you want to be with me or not and do you want to work on our marriage or not. I realize now that this is "cornering" and probably not the best of plans. I also not sure I want the answer, as I don't know that I can ever go back to the man that he is now...

Anyway, he talked for 30 minutes while I was walking my dog..I thought maybe he was calling with an answer to the questions. What he was calling to do was vent about his workday. We worked together for 2 yrs in the same office, after he pushed me to quit my career working to make others money and come work with him. I left our business and went back to my career 3 months or so ago. We are still in the same field, so I am sure it was a comfortable zone for him as I could understand the situation. However, I really dont want to know any of that anymore. He didnt want me there any longer and kept "her" there instead. So why bother?? I was as business like as I could be but did feel bad that he had a crappy, stressful day.

Now today, all was good. No contact until he text me at about 8:30 again to tell me that he had interviewed someone today and had a prospective new employee....Not once in the conversation did he ask anything about me or my day. All his work...his life... BUT I did NOT ask him anything about his stresses or offer anything personal in this conversation! PRogress!!

As noted, I am working to keep this negative person in my forethought so I don't slip back to thinking he is the old loving person. 

Next problem in this moment. There is an event tomorrow night that happens in our city (125,000 population) each week in the summer. It is an outdoor venue with live music. I love the band that is playing and had planned on going. I do believe that "she" will be there as well as him (together but "as friends") ... Again, I know this is not a strong point, but I do not want to be anywhere that I could bump into him or her...Too awkward and I know will tip me backward. Opinion???? Go and suck it up and try to enjoy or go and worry about running into them??


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## Mr.Fisty (Nov 4, 2014)

Great, now you should stop listening to him. He is using you like a partner, which you should avoid. He picked someone else for that role, and he only dumps his negativity on you and probably the OW gets him in a better state. Let her deal with his problems and issues.

If you do go, go with a lot of friends. You should not always operate your life around him, but you should also take your emotional and mental state into consideration.


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## breezycello (May 29, 2015)

Mr.Fisty said:


> Great, now you should stop listening to him. He is using you like a partner, which you should avoid. He picked someone else for that role, and he only dumps his negativity on you and probably the OW gets him in a better state. Let her deal with his problems and issues.
> 
> If you do go, go with a lot of friends. You should not always operate your life around him, but you should also take your emotional and mental state into consideration.


I will work on not listening, as it does not provide for anything healthy. You are right!!! I will say, even though I am not a person that ever gets mad or wishes for ill will (obviously I can't even stay mad at him), that it does make me smile just a wee bit to know he is struggling and stressed. The business failing would not nothing good for anyone, so don't want that. But glad he is having to actually deal with this stuff and can't see anything through that fog. She does get the better side of him, as she is with him all day, and then sometimes out having a beer to vent and just be friends. Ugh, whatever!!!

Can't decide whether or not to go. I love the musicians that are there and I do need to stop letting either of them have this power over me. It is so hard when our whole circle of friends has been the same for so long and extends to so many people here. Even one of the friends that wants to go along is sort of dating one of his friends (our friend)...so I am sure I will bump into him if he goes....seeing how I am toward the time of day to go...If I think I can be strong and a large enough group of us go, I am doing it!!! On the flip side, I do not want 24-48 hrs of pulling myself back out of that dark place. 

Thank you for your input and great advice. I do really appreciate you and everyone that has been so supportive here...even when you and they are hurting as well. 

And to whomever deleted the negative, hurtful post about being pathetic.....THANK YOU!


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## Mr.Fisty (Nov 4, 2014)

You will learn that dealing with this is about doing things that impact your life positively. In doing so, you will form new emotional memories that you can be happy without him. New, and other things will trigger those feelings and emotions of happiness and well-being.

And the less positive emotions or the less those emotions are reciprocated, the faster they fade away.

Over time, when thoughts about him are abound, they will produce less and less of any emotional reaction. There is no relationship to keep those attachments strong.

If you have ever lost someone, the pain of their loss fades over time. As you have new life experience and new memories, the power of the old ones fade. So focus more on your life. The less you interact with him, the faster those attachments to him will die.


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## breezycello (May 29, 2015)

So, I did end up going toth alive after 5 event.I went with 3 other women and had a great time. until I saw my husband and his OW. I do not know he saw me or not. I had met a younger fun guy that stayed with us the rest of the eveing. He wanted to come home with me and lavished all kinds of wonderful notions my way. As food as that made me feel, I did not feel like I could bring him home until I had the discussion with my spouse avoit our expectations. But believe me, I did not want to do thatl He made me feel very wanted and loved" and begged to just even sleep on the couch. 

nope, cant do it...ugh I know this is a good lesson in letting go and no tears here but seems so strange.


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## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

BC, good to see you handling yourself well in the last two days, good for you. However, he spoke to you for 30 minutes about his problems? Please don't let him have that opportunity again. She gets the non complaining happy guy and you get the miserable one. Just ask him if it is anything important re kids, dogs, etc, if not you are too busy to entertain him. No emotions, you are not there to be his encourager, remember he lost that privilege when he went off with her. Don't allow him to engage you like this at all, keep it strictly business like. Remember the 180, no emotions to be discussed, his or yours period. He is still trying to reel you in and have you there, stop it. 

About the event, it depends on how strong you feel about coping if you see them together. If you do go, surround yourself with lots of supportive friends and enjoy yourself. If you do not feel like you can cope, then don't put pressure on yourself to.


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## Satya (Jun 22, 2012)

Next time your H calls you to use you as an emotional tampon, tell him curtly to go whine to the OW since he fired you from that job, and to only call if it's concerning kids. Then hang up. 

Running to you to complain means the OW won't get it in the ear... Hence his image with her stays pure and strong. Don't allow this behavior. You're on the right path, but the 180 needs your refocus, away from him. Keep going.


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## FiveFortyEight (Jun 5, 2015)

jorgegene wrote: "time is the only cure for just about anything emotional."

This isn't the answer that anyone wants to hear, but it is correct. There was a time when I thought that she would never be out of my head. But she is, and I know now that I dodged a bullet. When it gets bad, remember that it isn't forever, that you will be in a different place a year from now.


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## breezycello (May 29, 2015)

Thank you everyone. As poor as my typing was last night, I had a great time being out. 

Today was pretty good as well. I would tell anyone, just as all of you would agree, the 180 is a great tool. It is not an easy one to enforce, and certainly cannot all be done at once. BUT saying that, I fully believe in the no contact piece is really helping me. If I am not talking to him, seeing a text from him or seeing him, I feel pretty ok. It is when there is contact that I let myself fall back. 

With that said, he showed up at my door after he left the office today...without calling or texting first. I am sure there was an agenda there, most likely "being nice" because he needs me to take our other dog while he is out of town Sunday - Tuesday morning. The best part, I was able to laugh and show happiness without expecting or requesting any input from him. I did not give him any part of me that he could use or manipulate. When he left, I didn't cry or even show any emotion that would be different from an acquaintance leaving. Wow, what a relief it is to not "feel" like I was going to cry, beg, be stressed etc....Maybe seeing them together last night was a good thing, bringing me closer to really dealing with who he is now and not who I thought he was.

I do not know if this is denial or truly the benefit of putting tools and advice to use....and living it! I know it will not be like this every day, but for today I am ok with that!


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## breezycello (May 29, 2015)

Slipped back a bit today. He is leaving town tomorrow, as I had said earlier, and needs to to keep the other dog. He invited me out to have dinner, which was quite casual. We then watched the ufc fights. All good there, strictly "friends" and no personal discussion.. 

When it was time for me to go, i asked him if he knew what he wanted yet. Do you want to work on our marriage or not?? Of course, made him angry because this always happens when we are together. I feel like if he could step up and admit to himself and to me what he is feeling, I could deal. Without that, I feel like I am giving up. I left feeling bad for even asking and allowing myself to fall back into the manipulation.

So now, back to the 180, which was working....like starting all over again. But still feel stronger than I did a week ago. 

I am not ready for file for D yet. A lot of comingled business and personal stuff that has to be sorted through. Is it ok to do the no contact 180 and not move toward the divorce yet? He did say he wanted me to wait for him and not walk away which is more than he has said in months. However, I really am waiting for him to decide if he want to be with me or work on our marriage??? I don't think that first decision should be so hard. I know that seeing other men during this time would be against our vows, but it also feels like he doesn't care one way or the other. 

I am not looking to date but what if the situation comes up, then what?? I want my old husband back, which i know will not and cannot happen...so to me it seems the outcome is inevitable, but not sure what to do with that yet.


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

It seems obvious that your husband's cheating and wants to keep you as a possible Plan B. That's why he gets angry when you push him whether he wants the marriage or not. He's not ready to make that decision yet. He's just fine the way things are but you're in limbo waiting for him to choose. Don't continue down that path. Get on with your life and don't focus at all on his.


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## breezycello (May 29, 2015)

I did say that I would try to wait for him. Still not sure what I am waiting on...him deciding if he wants me or want to work on our marriage? It should be a rocketscience type question. We either want to work on something or don't. That leads me to belilve that you are correct that I am the Plan B just in case. He doesn't want to make that decision. HOwever, I cannot see where he is working on anthing to improve himself or ouir marriage. 

He says he understands if I need to move on. I said that I wouldn't move on until I knew there was nothing of us left. 

With that said, the man that I met at the outdoor function we went to has now text me twice. I was thinking that he was younger than I am so he would just move on. I do not know what to do with this. I agreed to wait for my husband and now I have another guy interested. He does know that I am married. He says that really just want to have some fun over the summer befre he moves. 

If I text him back am I betraying my husband. We are separated in different home but only for about a month and a half. We have not agreed to see other people. I do want to have some fun and enjoy getting to know people. Think this guy is looking for more than that and that scares me. I feel that if I text him back, maybe I am encouraging him down a path that I may not be ready for. 

What do you guys think? Still doing the 180!


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## Mr.Fisty (Nov 4, 2014)

Right now, you are a doormat with a welcome home sign. He uses you in whatever way he can because you allow him to behave that way.

He knows he has options and as he is test driving the other relationship to see if he can be happier without you, you are waiting for those results. It could take years for him to figure that out, and he may seek other females as well and not just this other woman.

You are allowing him to seek better than you, and given enough chances, it is a matter of probability.

You are his safety net when he fails. Your hope is that he does not find better than you, so you are trying to please him and trying to fulfill his needs. You make him feel guilty and he punishes you for it. You are making it hard for him to not feel guilt for cheating on someone like you. So he lashes out at you because he does not like feeling bad about himself, yet he does not want to lose you so he hooks you along.

You get his scraps while the other woman gets the main course.

That is the reality of your situation. Until you are out of the denial stage of what your situation is, you will keep chasing after him like a puppy seeking love and affection from a neglectful owner. After a while though, you will eventually reach the anger phase and lash out.

Given enough hurt, you will learn eventually. And the sad part is when you are ready to move on, you may be resentful and carry a lot of emotional baggage into the next relationship because you are too afraid to let go earlier. You may lose the ability to trust in people because you are too hurt to allow otherwise. Odds are, you will build an emotional wall to keep the new hurt out, while keeping the old pain inside.


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## Pluto2 (Aug 17, 2011)

OP, I know its flattering to have another man interested in you, but I caution you to avoid it. First, anything that develops will likely be a rebound, which will hurt more. Second, you are clearly not finished with your marriage. One of the adages my grandmother used was don't start a second relationship until you've finished the first. So long as your H has hold of your heart, you aren't ready to date.

So I would suggest you stop the dinners together, make him find a pet sitting service and really do the 180.


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## Nomorebeans (Mar 31, 2015)

I agree with Mr. Fisty and Pluto.

Your husband is cake-eating.

You need to also look up the "Just Let Them Go" thread here and read the original post. Waiting for him and competing with the OW, basically, sends the message that you don't value yourself very much - that you value whatever the crap it is he wants more than yourself. You're saying "Pick me, not her" and "Love me, not her." Instead, say "I would PREFER that you stop seeing her and work on our marriage. But I know that's not possible. I know that. So, if you would like to file for divorce, I won't stand in your way. Or, better yet, I'll file." Then do that. You're in limbo now. It's a horrible place to be. Don't let him keep you there. If he loved you at all, he wouldn't have cheated with her in the first place, and he certainly wouldn't still be doing that - and taking her out in public where all your friends are. Just let him go. It's hard as nails, I know. But necessary.


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## thenub (Oct 3, 2014)

If he has his own place, tell him NOT to show up at your door unannounced. If he has to go out of town, OW should look after the dog unless you operate a boarding kennel and he is paying you. He is using/stringing you along as plan B. Don't accept that from him or anybody. 
You should file for divorce asap and stay no contact unless it's business or the kids, nothing else! No going out for dinner, no meeting for coffee, if he calls, you are too busy to talk right now. 
He chose life without you, give it to him in spades. He doesn't deserve your consideration one little bit. He blew it!!
Lawyer up and get the ball rolling. Show him you are not his or anyone else's doormat. 
Don't let him be a cake eater and constantly feed you the crumbs. Shove the cake if his face where it belongs.


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## breezycello (May 29, 2015)

Yikes. I just typed a long response and lost the whole thing...Long Monday 

You have all been so encouraging and I do really feel that all of you and this site have really helped me to realize that I have been in denial and settling for years. Sad that it has taken me this long to realize that. I don't want to hang so long in this relationship that I cannot ever trust or feel happy in a relationship again.

It has been interesting to step outside of my emotions and not reach out to him. He has been texting me and when I need to respond, for whatever reason, I have been waiting at least and hour and then have been to the point and ask no questions of him. That is out of character for me and I think he is starting to feel something is different. I have to say I kind of like that feeling of steering my own boat a bit.

I don't want to get the scraps and want to be strong. I do feel that I am much more aware of what is really happening and handling it much better than even a week ago. You are right, Mr Fisty in that I am a doormat with a welcome sign. That has become quite apparent. He is trying to decide if he can be happy with me or happy on his own, which I think scares him. But that is not my issue anymore. I do not want someone that has to decide if they want to work on things or not. I want to be happy and able to do things without always wondering what he will think or say. Being away from him does help that. 

I love my new place, my independence and the friends in my life, both old and new. I don't want another relationship in the dating arena as I know that is not what I need. We dated in high school, married at 20 and had our daughter at 22. Time for me to be me. I have always taken care of everyone else, so not even sure what I want or need. But being second or a "decision" is not it. 

Not ready to file for the D yet..visited with an attorney in January. She did help me to set a path so I knew that I would be ok on my own. I think my H will get very ugly and I am not yet ready to handle that. NOt sure what I am afraid of, but want to be in as stable emotionally as I can be before that. I am going to continue with the 180 and to find positive influences in each day. I am feeling very good and have finally stopped crying every day. And when I do start to feel low, have found ways (so far) that pull me back to the reality of my situation...Thank you all for being so supportive and honest. That is what I need!

If I have other questions or discussion items relating to this whole thing, but maybe with a different topic, do I start a new thread or continue here? For instance, what about the OW spouse??? Questions in how I deal with that???


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## breezycello (May 29, 2015)

Nomorebeans said:


> I agree with Mr. Fisty and Pluto.
> 
> Your husband is cake-eating.
> 
> You need to also look up the "Just Let Them Go" thread here and read the original post. Waiting for him and competing with the OW, basically, sends the message that you don't value yourself very much - that you value whatever the crap it is he wants more than yourself. You're saying "Pick me, not her" and "Love me, not her." Instead, say "I would PREFER that you stop seeing her and work on our marriage. But I know that's not possible. I know that. So, if you would like to file for divorce, I won't stand in your way. Or, better yet, I'll file." Then do that. You're in limbo now. It's a horrible place to be. Don't let him keep you there. If he loved you at all, he wouldn't have cheated with her in the first place, and he certainly wouldn't still be doing that - and taking her out in public where all your friends are. Just let him go. It's hard as nails, I know. But necessary.


Nomore - can you tell me how to find the thread "just let them go"? i tried to search, but think I must be doing it correctly...thank you


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## HeartbrokenW (Sep 26, 2012)

*Re: Re: Spouse says he has changed after 26 years*



Nomorebeans said:


> Let me help you with your struggle with "The Why." I've been struggling with that one, too - "Why/how could he do this to me and our son?" Actually, the answer is very simple (although it took me months to realize it): He is lacking in moral character. That's it. Really. There is never any excuse to cheat (when we're not talking about deeply, pathologically abusive spouses). It is not your fault, it is not because you drove him away. It is because he didn't have the moral character to tell you he was unhappy in the marriage and at least give it the old college try to try to save it before he made the choice to embark upon an affair. Tell yourself that over and over whenever you need to. It is the truth. I did not drive my husband to make the choice he made to have an affair, no more than had I chosen to keep drinking and drunk myself to death, it would be fair to say his affair drove me to make that choice.


Thank you for this. It really hit home. I don't mean to hijack someone else's thread.. but this is the first anything has made any sense to me. My story briefly.. married 13 yrs, divorced 2.5 yrs now. We have a 15 yr old. He walked away. ILYBNILWY. 4 weeks after asking for a divorce, they're living together, married a yr later. I was in shock.. what did I do? What could I have done differently? I've been reading this forum nightly for almost 3 yrs and i finally get it. 

It's not me.. it's him.


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## breezycello (May 29, 2015)

breezycello said:


> Nomore - can you tell me how to find the thread "just let them go"? i tried to search, but think I must be doing it correctly...thank you


I found the thread!! It is awesome, thank you!


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## breezycello (May 29, 2015)

He showed up after work today to pick up the dog. I had expected that he would, but it was later than I thought it would be.

I had plans to go over to a friends house for a get together of women, mostly in education, which is very different than my career. I was excited to go meet up with them and meet some new people. I answered the door, let him in. I was partially ready to go, pulled my purse out on the counter and he sat down. Didn't discuss much and nothing personal. I was not rude but didn't input much. When he left, I ran in and got changed and headed out. About 2 hrs later he text me a random text about chinese food smells outside of the gym. Strange for someone that feels I smother him. 

I did not ask about his trip or the class he took while gone. That is very out of the ordinary because I am always interested in the work and all that goes with it. so, I am wondering if he is feeling the 180 a bit and not sure what is going on. But of course, he will not ask. I am ok with that. 

Today was the first time I was not sad or hurt when he left. I did not feel the need to cling onto him in any fashion or drag out conversation to get him to stay. When I left to go to my friends house, I actually felt pretty good. Much more confident in who I am and that I can be happy without him in my life day in and day out. NOw tomorrow may be different, but I will take it for today.


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## Pluto2 (Aug 17, 2011)

breezycello said:


> He showed up after work today to pick up the dog. I had expected that he would, but it was later than I thought it would be.
> 
> I had plans to go over to a friends house for a get together of women, mostly in education, which is very different than my career. I was excited to go meet up with them and meet some new people. I answered the door, let him in. I was partially ready to go, pulled my purse out on the counter and he sat down. Didn't discuss much and nothing personal. I was not rude but didn't input much. When he left, I ran in and got changed and headed out. About 2 hrs later he text me a random text about chinese food smells outside of the gym. Strange for someone that feels I smother him.
> 
> ...


This sounds pretty good. Frankly, who cares if he is feeling the 180, YOU are! The next step for you is not permitting the drop-ins. He needs to respect you and your space and needs to call first and arrange a time, convenient for you to get the dog. But one step at a time. I hope you didn't respond to his text.

How was the get-together with your friends?


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## Nomorebeans (Mar 31, 2015)

Good for you, BC!

Heartbroken, I'm glad something I wrote helped you, and I'm sorry for what you've gone through. The hardest thing for me was The "Why?" Once I realized the answer, my broken heart started to heal. I still have some tough moments, because it wasn't exactly my dream to raise a teenager alone in my 50s after being married to his father for half my life. But that's just self-pity, and it passes quickly. I don't love him anymore and no longer want to be with him, because he's not a good enough person for me. I'll never settle again for anyone who isn't.


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## breezycello (May 29, 2015)

Pluto2 said:


> This sounds pretty good. Frankly, who cares if he is feeling the 180, YOU are! The next step for you is not permitting the drop-ins. He needs to respect you and your space and needs to call first and arrange a time, convenient for you to get the dog. But one step at a time. I hope you didn't respond to his text.
> 
> How was the get-together with your friends?


Pluto - I did not respond to his text and heard nothing from him until tonight and that was my fault. I waited until late before I text him. Our youngest, who lives out of state, is renewing her drivers license there instead of here. She waited until a week before her bday to do that and now finds out she needs her certified birth cert. Kids! 

She called me to see if I had it. Former home, I kept all of the paperwork etc for our entire personal and business lives. Since moving into my own place, I don't keep anything for the business nor have I kept that personal kind of stuff for the family. Only have my own stuff here. So I asked her to contact her dad to see if he could check our safe at home. That is where I thought it would be. He checked, not there. So now I have to go to the bank and go to safety deposit box, which is mine and my parents (no hubby). I text him to ask if he checked the safe physically or just assumed. He did check.

Anyway, out of that text was absolutely nothing that made me "feel good". I know I should not want anything of that sort from him as I desperately need to move on, without him. But still hurts. I did tell him that I have done a lot of thinking and would like to talk to him about it. NO response so tried to call. He ignored. Asked him to call, so we did not have to discuss on text...He said "cant it wait until tomorrow, I am going to bed"..OK, I know that I knew he would do that and I know that it is time to stop discussing. I don't even know what I hoped for. I want to tell him that I am ready to file and get on with my life. But not on text. 

It is strange, day time is usually good and I am in a place of strength. Evenings are tough, as you know, and not being busy is the devil's workshop which I believe was posted by Chuck71. True fact. 

It is time to file, he is no longer my joy and peace in the day. I do not want the expense (I know, whiney), nor the heartache that this is going to cause but I want to move on and I do not see another way to do it, as I just keep hanging onto something I don't want. Maybe too codependent with him. 

i have only been back to work for 3 mos. I do make a good wage and can support myself, however, I have been trying to save money and put into retirement again. The expense of the divorce scares me. His business is a s corp and he is 100% owner. When he wanted to sign part of business over, I was all too mushy and said, why ... we are one unit regardless of the paper. Then when I wanted it, he refused. So part of my fear is that the business has been operating for nearly 20 years and I left my job 2 yrs ago to help build it without drawing any type of wage or obviously, a k1. I was a doormat the whole time we were married and sacrificed my credit, my career and my life for him. Now, I am paying for it. He carries the mortgage on the houes and we are both vested, so that doesn't concern me as much. All of the money is tied in the business accounts and he transfers only enough into the joint personal to cover the house.

So if I pull money out of the business account (which my name is on) but I do not own a portion of the business on paper, would that be considered stealing? or am I entitled? Eek, sounds so petty.....Don't need it but afraid that he is going to get ugly and try to take everything. He would not leave me penniless but he will make it rough.

Sorry for rambling. yesterday was good, the night with the girls last night was very fun. I was glad that I went and met some new people. Enjoyed the crafts too, which was making cards. Not my strong suit. I work at a computer reviewing files all day. haha. Should have done something tonight, would have been better.

I loved the "why" post, by the way...I printed it and have it in my daytimer. it is a true fact and does help me remember who he is, not who he was. Helps to keep me grounded...With that said, why does it have to hurt so darn bad. He is not healthy for me, I am happier when he is not with me, and I don't need the financial support...

I will be talking to him (or texting i suppose) on the boundaries issue with the dog as well. He is leaving this weekend again, so interested to see what he is thinking with that. Of course, he hasn't asked and I am sure assuming I will keep her. I do love that dog, but she is difficult where I live. I need to stand strong and make boundaries for myself that are clear and healthy. I cannot keep falling backward to a place that is self pity. I don't like feeling this way. 

Tomorrow is a new day! And getting a pedicure with a friend! Now that will be good! PLease keep posting as it really is good to hear feedback, positive or "get your head out of your rear"!


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## breezycello (May 29, 2015)

Nomorebeans said:


> Good for you, BC!
> 
> Heartbroken, I'm glad something I wrote helped you, and I'm sorry for what you've gone through. The hardest thing for me was The "Why?" Once I realized the answer, my broken heart started to heal. I still have some tough moments, because it wasn't exactly my dream to raise a teenager alone in my 50s after being married to his father for half my life. But that's just self-pity, and it passes quickly. I don't love him anymore and no longer want to be with him, because he's not a good enough person for me. I'll never settle again for anyone who isn't.


NMB - I admire your strength and attitude of not settling and taking care of you. I have to get there...somehow. I know I am a good person and know that H is not who I want to be with anymore. His character, morals, self absorbed persona and constant negative attitude are not good for me. 

My heart is healing as well, in part from your "why" post. It sounds so simple to realize that is who they are, but seems so crazy I didn't see that on my own. Thank you again for sharing it. I cannot imagine raising a teenager alone but it does sound like you are doing well and are a great role model.


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## Pluto2 (Aug 17, 2011)

OP, the business sure sounds like marital property. The fact you are not listed as an owner on paper is pretty meaningless in a divorce. At the very least your efforts increased its value. So in any divorce you will likely get a portion of the value of the company. How much? Well, that's for the courts. That doesn't mean you get to take money out of the operating account. Only withdraw money from joint personal accounts until you're told otherwise.

I understand why you were attempting the contact with H, but stop. It will only cause you pain. There are benefits to getting communications only via text or email-you have a record. I know, I know, these are issues you *feel* are best addressed person-to-person. Now is not the time for feelings.

(And I agree about the kids. My 14yr DD couldn't find her calculator-and there it was-smack dab in the middle of her bed. Geesh.)


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## breezycello (May 29, 2015)

Pluto2 said:


> OP, the business sure sounds like marital property. The fact you are not listed as an owner on paper is pretty meaningless in a divorce. At the very least your efforts increased its value. So in any divorce you will likely get a portion of the value of the company. How much? Well, that's for the courts. That doesn't mean you get to take money out of the operating account. Only withdraw money from joint personal accounts until you're told otherwise.
> 
> I understand why you were attempting the contact with H, but stop. It will only cause you pain. There are benefits to getting communications only via text or email-you have a record. I know, I know, these are issues you *feel* are best addressed person-to-person. Now is not the time for feelings.
> 
> (And I agree about the kids. My 14yr DD couldn't find her calculator-and there it was-smack dab in the middle of her bed. Geesh.)


Thank you for the advice on info especially regarding the operating/business account. He only puts enough money in the joint account to cover the bills that are paid out of there. 

I do not expect him to just give me an "allowance" as I do not "need" it. I do make sufficient income to live pretty comfortable. What I struggle with is the question of "is that fair" to me when I gave my entire life and world for that business and our marriage. I really do not feel sorry for myself for that as that is what I wanted to do. I just do not want to be "stupid" and give up what is technically mine for all that I have given. I will just leave that up to the courts. Enough stressing over it. 

I am heading to see our girls in about a week and a half and am excited about that. HOwever, they do not know about the OW, who also was and is a huge part of their life. It will devastate them. I have not seen them face to face since this all began. I originally felt it was best to just not discuss those ugly details with them and/or make their dad out to be a bad person. I am not sure how that will play out. If they ask me, I will not lie to them. What are thoughts on having that discussion with them? They are almost 24 and 21. They love both of us and don't have grandiose plans for us reconciling but dont have all of the facts either. 

Yesterday was an awful day. Just could not get myself out of a pitiful state. Today is much better. Still working the 180 and looking forward to a happy future.


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## Pluto2 (Aug 17, 2011)

Breezycello, sorry if I wasn't clear-half the business is yours, assuming its marital property, which it likely is. You should not be losing it. But that doesn't mean you can take the money out of the account during your separation unless its in the separation agreement. There's a difference between a personal account (you automatically get half of what's there), and a one-half interest in an asset that includes a liquid account. Also, he will have to account for the cash he withdraws from that account, as well. He doesn't get to go out on a spending spree with no consequences.

I am a proponent of disclosing infidelity to kids, especially adult kids. They are certainly old enough to understand and mature enough (hopefully) decide for themselves how they want to process the information. Some folks believe that disclosure will unnecessarily harm the relationship between the parent and child. I do not share that opinion. My view is three-fold. 1) When my ex betrayed me and we divorced I quit owing him any loyalty of protection. His actions have consequences and I refused to block the world for him any longer. 2) Providing pertinent information is not the cause of any ill-will they may feel towards the wayward spouse, It's the betrayal of the other parent and of the family unit that would be any possible source of ill-will. Their father is free to form whatever relationship he likes with his children. I don't bad-mouth him to the kids, and I don't make excuses. 3) Finally, and most important in my own family, my kids desperately needed to know that they continued to have one parent who would not lie to them. (Both the kids and I dealt with a ton of lies from my ex). I will always tell them the truth.

Good luck and have a great trip.


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## breezycello (May 29, 2015)

Hubby came by to pick up the dog. He waited until late so I finally had to text him to find out if he was coming to get her or if I needed to take her in. It was almost 9 pm when he got here. I was a little on edge as it was late and I thought that was rude.

Conversation was fine, minimal until he left. Then I started to fall apart. WTH is that? I know he is not who he was, I will never trust him again and really dont want to live with him again but miss him..Ugh. I had so many things to say to him, but couldnt get the words out. So asked him to call when he got home. Basically the conversation boiled down to his not feeling passion with me anymore, and he says that is not just about sex. I can not give that back to him, if lost it's lost. He keeps trying to put it back on me and says for me to do what I need to do to be happy. He doesn't want to make me miserable. That is his just burying his head and not wanting to look like the bad guy. End of conversation, we basically decided that we are in different places in oiur relationship. "it is not like i don't want to be with your our around you anymore" is what he says...

So I text him and said that I feel he was able to fulfill what he needed with me and now I am used goods. I don't have the money to drop into the attorneys lap for the retainer and told him that as well. I think he should start the process. He said he was content with the way things are going. IN essence, living separate and talking when necessary...That is not a marriage. He isnt working on anything to help that as he doesn't want to.

I know, as I have said that this is not going to work, and that I needed to get out of limbo land. It is not healthy and certainly can create some long, sad days. KNowing that, why do I feel so sad and hurt now? I am just crying for what I knew what already gone. Ihad hoped for a miracle and did not get one. I hope for a good day tomorrow. I doubt I will hear from him which is best and I don' have his dog so that will help too. 

Sorry to dump again, was doing so well...now blah.


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## Pluto2 (Aug 17, 2011)

First of all, if this dog is his, make him take care of it, feed it, find a suitable place for the dog that does not involve you and your home. He wants the separation, so make him work out those details.

I completely understand why you are feeling the way you do. You are mourning the loss of the relationship. You are accepting the fact that it is over and it hurts. That is completely normal. Frankly, I'd be more worried if you weren't feeling like crap.

He is spineless. He's off with the OW who apparently isn't pressuring him for any commitment and has the nerve to even mention passion with you. I just want to smack him. Honestly, I would consider writing a check for the divorce out of the business account (you have check writing authority correct) for a retainer for the divorce and let that be worked out at the final settlement. He has no accountability and he's loving it.


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## breezycello (May 29, 2015)

Pluto2 said:


> First of all, if this dog is his, make him take care of it, feed it, find a suitable place for the dog that does not involve you and your home. He wants the separation, so make him work out those details.
> 
> I completely understand why you are feeling the way you do. You are mourning the loss of the relationship. You are accepting the fact that it is over and it hurts. That is completely normal. Frankly, I'd be more worried if you weren't feeling like crap.
> 
> He is spineless. He's off with the OW who apparently isn't pressuring him for any commitment and has the nerve to even mention passion with you. I just want to smack him. Honestly, I would consider writing a check for the divorce out of the business account (you have check writing authority correct) for a retainer for the divorce and let that be worked out at the final settlement. He has no accountability and he's loving it.


Pluto -
Yes, he is spineless and has been through this whole thing. For someone with such a strong personality, I am amazed that he has no backbone in this situation. Everything has had to be discussed at my bringing it up and then I get pushed back because it isn't the right time, as if there ever is a right time.
We have 2 dogs, one we brought in about 6 yrs ago (without my ok). She is a hunting dog and then we have a yorkie that we got in December that is really my dog. So when he travels for work, he has brought her here to stay. Similar to a child, I suppose. I like this dog, but it is hard here because I have no fence and she hates the leash. And yes on top of that, I have to see him which makes it hard. I feel bad for wanting him to take her to a kennel or stay with someone else while he is gone, because I do enjoy her but it is very hard on me. Need to change that, I agree.
He says the passion is not just about sex. It is everything. He just doesn't feel the way he used to. I realize relationships have ups and downs, but typically if the relationship is wanted, the two people try to figure out what it is together and work on it. That is where he stops. He is just too busy to work on it or give anything emotionally. He says he is not sleeping with the OW, but even if not, they work together and I know that trash talk is there as that is who she is and now who he is. Either way, no trust could ever be given with that in play. I am allowing him to make me feel like I have been used up and now that he is done with me, I am ready for the trash bin. NOt a pity party, that is just how it feels...However, I woke up this morning vowing to not let myself feel that way. I do love myself and know I am better than that. I simply cannot allow him to suck me under any longer.
I like the idea of writing the check for the attorney out of the business account. I had not thought of that, and yes I am a signer on the account. I will set it up as soon as I get back from Seattle next week. Thank you for that suggestion. 
I really appreciate you and your support. I hope you have a great Tuesday!


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## Pluto2 (Aug 17, 2011)

Nobody can hurt me without my permission--Gandhi


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

Cheaters lie. It makes them feel better about themselves. My ex-husband lied to the end. Only after the divorce did he say he wished he had been stronger (meaning, I assume, he wishes he had resisted the OW). But it no longer mattered. I had reached the point of indifference. And that's the best feeling of all. 
You'll get there too (and the process makes you stronger -- a bonus).:smile2:


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## HeartbrokenW (Sep 26, 2012)

You don't miss him.. you miss what you thought you had. My ex walked out on me when i didn't know we even had an issue.. and it ripped me apart. Someone said that to me and it made alot of sense. I was mourning the loss of what i thought i had.. growing old together, enjoying our grandchildren, etc. He totally ruined my dream life. That is what you are missing.


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## breezycello (May 29, 2015)

Pluto - I actually love that saying of nobody can hurt me unless I let them. I think of that often, when I am feeling self pity. I know that i allow him to have effect on my emotions and I despise that. But, I know that is something only I can change. Sometimes that will snap me out of it! Thank you for the reminder. We all need it!


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## breezycello (May 29, 2015)

Open Minded - Did you find it mindblowing that you couldn't tell when he was lying? or could you tell maybe? I honestly cannot tell anymore and we have been together (dating before marriage) for 31 years, married 26. When I found out about their "secret meet up" in NOvember, over his birthday I was frantic and ranted for nearly 8 hours before he finally said "fine, i was with her". That was all I got and prior to that he was very ambivilent toward me. So sad and now makes me angry. He was such a stand up guy, preached ethics and lying to our girls and now where is he....He is still lying, but I no longer "stalk" so have no proof. It no longer matters, because when I had proof, I didn't do anything with it. 

It only hurts to prove he is continuing his lifestyle to myself. Better to step back, do my best to be strong with the 180 and try to figure me out....I hope to get to a point of indifference. That has to give you some peace. I am not an angry person, by nature...obviously stuck with his lying a$$ for so long....and don't want to shoulder constant redness. I do think it can be useful when used objectively but I am not there yet either. 

Thank you for all of your support! You give great insight here and I appreciate that! Many blessings to you


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## breezycello (May 29, 2015)

Heartbroken -

I think Mr Fisty (maybe) had pointed that out to me early on, that I was mourning the husband and man I once had or thought he was. So very insightful. I had not thought of that before. And your pointing it out again has solified that for me. So sad that they can just change (if they change - not sure it wasn't there all along) and we have no idea it is even happening. Maybe I chose not to see it or was too busy, still not sure there. But man, so devastating. I am sorry you have had to deal with this as well. I am not sure how long you have been going through this time in your life, but do hope you have healed and are moving forward.

I was thinking of this today, last year we were talking about building a retirement home on the river. We looked at land and were working toward a plan. I am not a planner, so big deal to me. Was that all a lie? Did he just play along to keep me from "looking" at his life elsewhere?? Hmmmm, don't even want to know anymore. Everything hurts when I ask him or even try to understand. YOu are right, all of my dreams, plans for growing old together, companionship and security gone, poof....I was too dependent. I see that now. NOt sure if you were in that position. I can take care of myself, earn a good salary and know that I am a good person, a wonderful mother, and genuinely care about people. Just in the posts I have read, you are a good person and deserve happiness too. 

Such a slow process....thank you for posting to me. I would love to know your story too. I have not done too much reading of people's original posts if they have been on here for a while, but follow through newer posts. Need to do more of that. 

So many "friends" on here that give good insight and you are one of them. Thank you for that! Stay strong and build your dream life! I will work on that too


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## breezycello (May 29, 2015)

I need to vent and don't know where or how to even do it...So here goes....Please do not take this as whining or self pity...Trying to be angry and not cry.

Have had very minimal contact with H since he told me (last conversation) that he no longer feels passion for me, and not just sex...WTF! Anyway, have stopped reaching out and trying to get myself ready to go see girls next week. Did not make appt with atty yet to get the ball rolling. Still limbo, but had chosen to not deal before I left.

I got a text from him 30 min ago that said "out of respect, I wanted to let you know I am going to .....tonight for a concert. I have xyz appt and will go from there". I knew the OW had gone down. It is a 3 day event. He had hinted about going but had not said anything, nor is he required to since we live apart but are not "formally separated on paper". 

Even though I assumed, the smack of the text has thrown me into a tailspin. Have spent this time crying, shaking and head spinning with thoughts. I called and left a message for the atty that I spoke with in January to set an apt for when I get back on the 29th. Want to call and say "so are you staying with her too?" "why can't you just fing file" "why keep up the game" I want him to admit he is with her and want him to feel what I feel. I know that is not going to happen. He will never feel this pain, because he is an A$$. He can't even just divorce me before he goes out of town with her????? I want him to look like the bad guy and me not the victim!

I want to go out to our house and take everything!!!! I want to drain our business account! I want to go to the office and take my computer! I want to tell everyone including our kids that this is the REAL H! 
Question is, what will any of that gain me???

Heart racing, sick, pissed, sad, and don't know what to do with it!


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## Nomorebeans (Mar 31, 2015)

Honey, I really feel for you.

He is cake-eating, branch-swinging, blame-shifting, and gas-lighting. All the classics.

He is a coward. He is keeping you in limbo because he doesn't want to admit to himself, let alone to the rest of the world, what an awful person he is.

I know this feeling so well, wondering where the repercussions for him are - where is the justice? He knows what he's doing is wrong, otherwise, why hide it? As Pluto has said, the OW must not be pressuring him for a commitment. Otherwise he'd be driving your divorce proceedings along like my STBX has been ours - like a high-speed steamroller.

There's been a kindness in that cruelty for me, though, in that it's forced me out of limbo, and also helped me come to indifference much sooner than I would have, had I never discovered and he never admitted to the extent of their relationship. All that said, it hurt like hell to know he spent a week with her here in town in his new place a week after he moved out. He came by to spend time with our son every day she was here because it was his vacation and he felt guilty about not dedicating to his son instead of his pen!s. I tried to avoid running into him each time, but still did once or twice. It was like swallowing razor blades.

Pluto and others have given excellent advice I can only say ditto to. File yourself. Stick to The 180. You can't hurt or affect him by anything you say because he no longer cares. So just stop talking to him. If you haven't already responded to his toxic text, don't.

Beyond that, just know we're here for you. We understand how you feel. We know it will get better. Just hang in there and believe that. I promise it's true.


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## Pluto2 (Aug 17, 2011)

Keep breathing. Out of respect my a$$.

He may never admit a thing to you. He may not have the intestinal fortitude (for lack of a better phrase) to make that admission. And that's just the way it is sometimes. Faced with the fact that our then 14 yr DD saw his explicit messages with two OW, describing in excruciating detail various aspects of his last encounters, my ex looked me in the eye and said "By no stretch of the imagination am I having an affair." Now technically speaking he was correct-he was having several affairs. Grammar being everything, I suppose. He refused to file and refused to pay for half the costs per our agreement. And when he left and moved out of state he could tell people that I was the one who ended the marriage. Yep I did, You betcha I did. The thing is the one who files is not the bad guy, will have no advantage in the eyes of the court, and is not necessarily at fault for the demise of the marriage. You are just the one who is responsible.

Go get your property, your belongings and file. Lots of folks on here advise to expose affairs. It allows you to control the narrative of the divorce which can be beneficial in a small community. It also allows you to enlist the support of family members who may be willing to provide support for the sake of kids. He has fired you as his spouse and your obligation of loyalty to him has ended.


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## karole (Jun 30, 2010)

Have you contacted her husband about the affair (I think I read earlier where you said she is married?). If not, you need to ASAP. That should have been the first thing you did when you found out about the affair. Exposure is the best way to end an affair. I would also recommend that you read some of the threads in the Coping with infidelity section of this board. You may want to actually start a thread there to help you get guidance for dealing with an affair. 

Also, as to your business, you really need to see your attorney about that. An attorney can tell you what you are entitled to according to the laws of your state. My guess would be that the reason your husband hasn't filed is because he doesn't want to turn lose of any of the marital assets. You need to change that and see a very good attorney (make sure it's a good one) to help you navigate the divorce and division of assets. You've waited long enough. Take back control of your life and fight for what is legally yours according to the law.


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

breezycello said:


> Open Minded - Did you find it mindblowing that you couldn't tell when he was lying? or could you tell maybe? I honestly cannot tell anymore and we have been together (dating before marriage) for 31 years, married 26. When I found out about their "secret meet up" in NOvember, over his birthday I was frantic and ranted for nearly 8 hours before he finally said "fine, i was with her". That was all I got and prior to that he was very ambivilent toward me. So sad and now makes me angry. He was such a stand up guy, preached ethics and lying to our girls and now where is he....He is still lying, but I no longer "stalk" so have no proof. It no longer matters, because when I had proof, I didn't do anything with it.
> 
> It only hurts to prove he is continuing his lifestyle to myself. Better to step back, do my best to be strong with the 180 and try to figure me out....I hope to get to a point of indifference. That has to give you some peace. I am not an angry person, by nature...obviously stuck with his lying a$$ for so long....and don't want to shoulder constant redness. I do think it can be useful when used objectively but I am not there yet either.
> 
> Thank you for all of your support! You give great insight here and I appreciate that! Many blessings to you


Yes, I found it very difficult that I couldn't tell when he was lying. I stayed 30 years after DD1 for various reasons and wish I had not. DD2 a few years ago made it easier to leave because I had told him after DD1 it wasn't likely I would forgive a second time. Naturally, he assured me at the time there would never be a DD2. But there was. 

He was the absolute most upstanding person I had ever met and that's what made the shock 30 years ago so difficult to take. After that, I never against looked at him the same way but DD2 was still very difficult to deal with because I had believed him when he said he wouldn't cheat again. My mistake. 

I am very grateful to be divorced (not least of which is because it's not possible for him to hurt me ever again).


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## breezycello (May 29, 2015)

I told myself many times today that I need to stop allowing him to cause me this pain. Thank you for reminding me that he is doing this, not me. I don't blame myself other than for the lack of fortitude to work toward healing myself. 

I have been very conscious of my reactions to "feelings" in the past 2 days. His text yesterday of "out of respect" was really his way of telling me that he is giving me what I want, honesty. He felt that by telling me he was going to this concert (without saying with her), that I should be all happy with that. But in reality, how I am now seeing it, is that he was "working" me and being deceptive. He knew I would find out and this way he put it out there and I should just trust him now. Oh pleasee......He is patronizing me. During some of our past conversations, he has said things about not wanting to be the guy that cheats on his wife and then leaves her, he loves me and always will, he would never just toss me to the curb, etc etc. What he wants is to get out of this looking like a good guy even though he will never admit that he gives a rats a$$. So....in short, he dangled a carrot to look good, when really he is still living a lie.

This will sound silly after dealing with this for a year, but I do feel that I have been at a crossroad (denial) for a long time and am starting to go down a path, finally......His stupid text threw me in such a tailspin that I was unproductive at work, couldn't focus, cried off and on all day (rejection i think), and didn't want to talk to anyone. I text him around 8 or so and asked him not to call or text me. Imagine, I haven't heard a peep since. Don't know if he is there or back and actually don't want to know. I did pick up my phone many times today and wanted to reach out...but didn't do it! Yahoo! Silly again but I did it! 

One small ugh moment today was when I found out who was headlining the concert last night. It was someone we saw about 5 yrs ago in Colorado. It was a great time for us and he is one of my favorite musicians. This time he was there with her...I was sad and felt sorry for what I was missing...for about 10 minutes....then thought "hmmmmm, why .... I wouldn't want to be there with him, because it would make me feel like things were ok and all warm and fuzzy only to be brought back to reality later. Sick of that crap. So, shut my eyes for a bit, let the pity go on and then sucked it up and threw it away! Back to work! I am not going to just shrivel and die. I just need to figure out how to live without him. 

I have not told the OW spouse anything yet.. They have had a distant relationship for years. Totally surprised they are still married. I think it is convenience at the moment. His work is very stressful, and I do think he knows, but I am not sure. I have made the decision to talk to him, as I would want him to talk to me. I haven't made that step yet, but plan on doing it after I come back from my trip next week. Not sure how to start with that yet. He needs to hear it from me, and I need to say it to him. I do imagine that this is part of the reason my H hasn't pushed anything yet and I can't get him to file. She doesn't want to push a commitment with him, as their life is working for them. She is still with her H who totally supports her other than the money she earns working for my H...spending money, nails etc...blah.

Called attorney yesterday to set up appt but have not heard from her yet. Maybe that is a sign I need to find another. NOt sure how to find a "good" attorney. The friends that I could ask either have not been in this position or didn't use an attorney. My H will most likely get ugly when it gets to the business and marital assets, to I cannot have one that will be wishy washy. 

Thank you for letting me vent yesterday when I was so upset! I am so thankful for the support and input, albeit tough love or empathy. I have felt so crazy and lost so many times. I have not yet found a support group where I live and maybe that is not what I need. I have friends and family (even though family is scattered). I sometimes feel that I am burdening them with my "life". We are all here by choice and can respond or ignore by choice. Thank you for all of you!


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## Mr.Fisty (Nov 4, 2014)

Definitely get a lawyer and get your share. You worked for the business and helped in its success.

Depending on what you want, either expose after the divorce or before, could change many factors.

For instance, exposing early before the divorce may cause it drag on and suck in more finances because he may try and retaliate. Exposing after, may help the divorce be more amicable, and then expose.

Usually exposing to others may cause the ws on both sides a lot of anger, and they would want to take it out on the one who exposes the relationship because it is their fault for the stress the affair is in.

Anyways, the more you are living your new life, the less of a factor your husband plays a role in it. Love, and the emotions you have in response to him will have less power. It does get easier pushing him to the side as you are experiencing.


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## Absurdist (Oct 10, 2014)

Breezycello - I have read your threads. Please go see a lawyer immediately. You have some very complex business issues regarding your STBXH that could result in bad tax consequences as well as problems with the IRS. I should know, I am a stinking lawyer. You need a consultation as soon as possible to cover not only family law matters but business matters as well. Some of your interests appear to be held in limited liability companies. If not handled correctly you could be facing recapture rules, negative capital accounts and cancellation of indebtedness income. You need to do this poste haste. Take your sweet self to a competent lawyer ASAP. Send me a PM if you need more information.


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## breezycello (May 29, 2015)

Well, no contact with him today as he is out fishing. I did tell our girls of the OW while with them on vacation. DD23 was very hurt and sent a lashing message to him about her being disappointed and he should have divorced before sleeping with her...Of course, STBXH was angry and tried to throw me under the bus. Did not work, but makes me very hurt and angry that he would not just accept his mistake and say I am sorry. Instead try to mud sling it to me.

Tried to explain to him last night and he would not talk about it as "he is over it". Again, another sign that he is not what I want or need in my life, refusing to communicate. 

Worried over the cost of the attorney and having to go after what is fair and just for me. Don't want it to drag out forever, want to move on and forward. Trying to get out and meet people as well. 

I will definitely say that when I do not talk to him or see him, I feel better...even if I have a bit of a drop earlier on. Went out to the house today to get the dog and didn't even stay or take anything with me. No longer feels like home. That makes me very sad. Spent 13 years in that home that we built. Slow mourning process. 

Thank you for all helping to keep me strong!


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## Absurdist (Oct 10, 2014)

You're going to make this Breezy. You have too much going for you.


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## breezycello (May 29, 2015)

Absurdist said:


> You're going to make this Breezy. You have too much going for you.


You guys are all awesome. I just have to say that first. I have 4 pages of "notes" from many of the things you have all said. Mostly reminders for myself but many of them things that I had not even thought of. Thank you are for being here and posting.

Openminded, you are very right...Cheaters lie or find ways to twist the truth to keep them in the "good" light. He does not want to be the bad guy. That has become quite evident. He has said "why can't we be friends" and have a beer together! WTF....that must be his way of keeping his guilt at bay. I will not dump her in the street kind of thing. Ugh, that just makes me question anything he says.

Heartbroken, you are right as well. I am mourning the hopes and dreams of our future with grandkids and travel together...He took that from me and I had no control. I know we always have choices, but I did not plan for him to change my dreams (which were our dreams) midstream and at 46 years of age. I am staying forward focused and trying to stop wishing for what is already gone. no point.

No More Beans, I am calling my attorney back tomorrow. Have been pushing it away and I am not sure why. I know where we are heading as I don't see how anything in our relationship will ever be the same. I am scared of dealing with him on the D level, as I know he will get very ugly as money is sacred to him. He won't leave me in the street, but will not want to give up anything either. I am tired of even dealing with the whole thing, and just want it to be over. Is it wrong to just want to walk away and not take anything?

I am doing the 180 again and not reaching out to him and responding only when necessary with short answers. It is so hard...but I know that conversing with him will hurt me. He doesn't care obviously and I need to find a way to not care as well. So not my nature or personality. He is the coward and I need to stand up for myself and take some action forward. Maybe that is why I am tired. I have made all of the action steps. I moved out, I confronted him, I went back to work, I am supporting myself (other than car payment), I told the girls about separation and now the OW. He has done nothing....that I can see. Tired 

Thank you all for being here. YOu do truly help!


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## breezycello (May 29, 2015)

Did so well today until STBXH became angry and DD23 for her wanting to tell the OW daughter. They have been friends for years. Then he text me and lashed at me for telling the girls in the first place. 

So text messages back and forth. He wouldn't call me or come see me. Coward. Then said he would stop paying DD23 bills (she is in college) and mine too (which are car pmt, car ins and cell). I can handle those. I tried to get him to be rational about the situation and talk to DD23. He literally cut her off and is not going down for her graduation next month. I don't understand this anger. To not go to graduation? He will never be able to take that back. 

I realize he is full of guilt, shame and paranoid about who will find out. However, he made this bed, the rest of us did not. He refuses to accept that and keeps slinging his "stuff" back at us with whatever he can. All he has left is the threat of withholding money. Pretty dang low. Now that is not someone I want to try to reconcile with. And worse yet, this is NOT the man I married. 

Such a good day at work and then blasted with his texts. I had to quit working and just go walk with the dogs. 

Called my banker and left a message to set up an apt to get a car loan rolling, since he will now refuse to pay for what I drive. It is too big of a payment for me to carry so will need to trade it. Will call attorney back again tomorrow and start that process. Need to contact accountant and get the last years taxes too. 

this is just going to get ugly and I am just tired and want to walk away from it all. Don't want to fight, don't want to drag it out. So busy with work that it will overwhelm me...but maybe it will be what I need to keep moving forward! A little scared of the beginning of the end.


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## Pluto2 (Aug 17, 2011)

I feel your pain about graduation. 

I've been divorced almost two years. In my case, our then 15 DD discovered some of her father's infidelities ( he was very busy there for awhile) and came to me. I had already discovered some, but not what she had to see on his laptop (yes she had his permission to use the laptop and he was stupid enough to leave it all open). In typical cheater script he: 1) denied he was cheating, 2) tried to say it was my fault and that I "forced him" to cheat, and 3) blamed DD for finding it and disclosing it to me. On one particular painful night for her, he blamed our DD for the divorce telling her it was all her fault for sticking her nose in his business. She is an extremely strong young woman and would accept none of that. When he realized that she would not accept the guilt he was hurling at her, his response was to totally withdrew as a father. That night was about three years ago.

Last month she graduated from high school (with honors, thank you very much). He did not attend, or even acknowledge the event. In the last 18 months he's only seen our kids one day, for a few hours. I'm still furious. DD really is not. In her mind, she knows this is not how a well-adjusted, loving parent is supposed to behave towards his children. He is not that. Will it change someday-maybe, but I don't really think so. Not in our case.

So, know that he is not on your side, emotionally or financially. He is deep in the fog of his tryst and does not want to leave. Right now, the money he would spend for you or your children is money he no longer has for the OW. Maybe he and the OW will continue with their relationship and he will try to reconcile with your DD. Maybe their A will fizzle out. Who knows. But support your fabulous DD as I know you do.


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## Iver (Mar 8, 2013)

_He won't leave me in the street, but will not want to give up anything either._

First, you don't know if will try to leave you in the street and second what he wants to give up is irrelevant. That's up to the courts to decide.

Just make sure your lawyer has experience with divorces involving business assets.

Then take him to the cleaners.


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## karole (Jun 30, 2010)

Breezy: Get the best lawyer you can!! You need one that will fight for what is legally yours according to the laws of your state. I know you feel you just want it over and done, but please, please DO NOT LET HIM BULLY YOU into taking less than you deserve!! Get angry and put all that anger into fighting him for what you worked so hard for during your marriage. If he won't turn over the financial records of the company, you can hire a forensic accountant to go over his books, etc. If he wants a fight, then tell him he will get one!!


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## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

BC, I know this is very hard, the man who said he would love you through thick and then turns out to be something else. You have to stand up and fight back, not just for your own sake but for your daughters sake as well. Your WH is at the moment, self centred and being destructive. He will probably awake from this one day but the damage will have been done, his own fault. Why should you suffer going into your future, you have suffered enough. He is not the man you married, you are now in a contest with a man who does NOT have your or your children s best interests at heart, don't forget that. Forget about the past times, and engage in this as if he were the enemy.


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## TRy (Sep 14, 2011)

breezycello said:


> Called my banker and left a message to set up an apt to get a car loan rolling, since he will now refuse to pay for what I drive. It is too big of a payment for me to carry so will need to trade it. Will call attorney back again tomorrow and start that process. Need to contact accountant and get the last years taxes too.


 What you do not seem to understand is that as his wife of many years it is not his money to withhold. It is both of your money. Draft a letter (with your attorney's input) to your husband telling him that the courts will not look kindly to him withholding payments to either you or your children during the divorce process, and that such action will insure that the courts will treat him accordingly when they get involved. Tell him that any short term satisfaction he gets out of his withholding of money, will be paid for at a high price over the years to come. After sending this letter, your attorney needs to take immediately action with the court to secure all assets and payments. Do this today.

One more thing. Get your daughter off the hook by calling and telling the OW daughter and telling her about the affair today. Tell your husband that you did this because of his actions, and that you will no longer be a participant in the affair by being a part of the cover-up. That as a cheater he and his affair partner have a lot of nerve to expect you to sit back and take their betrayal in silence. That he needs to man up and take responsibility for his actions. Tell him that if he wants war in the divorce, you will give it to him, as you no longer have anything to lose.


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## breezycello (May 29, 2015)

Pluto2 said:


> I feel your pain about graduation.
> 
> I've been divorced almost two years. In my case, our then 15 DD discovered some of her father's infidelities ( he was very busy there for awhile) and came to me. I had already discovered some, but not what she had to see on his laptop (yes she had his permission to use the laptop and he was stupid enough to leave it all open). In typical cheater script he: 1) denied he was cheating, 2) tried to say it was my fault and that I "forced him" to cheat, and 3) blamed DD for finding it and disclosing it to me. On one particular painful night for her, he blamed our DD for the divorce telling her it was all her fault for sticking her nose in his business. She is an extremely strong young woman and would accept none of that. When he realized that she would not accept the guilt he was hurling at her, his response was to totally withdrew as a father. That night was about three years ago.
> 
> ...


Hi Pluto - I am so sorry that you deal with your Ex (or not deal) in this way. I am absolutely shocked that he would not attend DD graduation.. Who does that? She will never forget or understand his not being there. You have obviously done very well in taking care of your own. Great job! Who needs someone like him anyway!

You are right, he is not there for me financially and certainly not emotionally. It took me a very long time to realize that. The financial side wasn't so hard, but the emotional has been tough. I keep catching myself wanting to reach out for the little things....but not doing it.

Thank you for your post. You have shown all of us that we can be strong, raise our children strong, and find a way to get past the hurt and anger. You certainly have helped me


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## breezycello (May 29, 2015)

aine said:


> BC, I know this is very hard, the man who said he would love you through thick and then turns out to be something else. You have to stand up and fight back, not just for your own sake but for your daughters sake as well. Your WH is at the moment, self centred and being destructive. He will probably awake from this one day but the damage will have been done, his own fault. Why should you suffer going into your future, you have suffered enough. He is not the man you married, you are now in a contest with a man who does NOT have your or your children s best interests at heart, don't forget that. Forget about the past times, and engage in this as if he were the enemy.


Aine - The disappointment of the reality is very hard, you are right. I have allowed his behavior to affect me in too many negative ways. The positive is that I was able to get away from him and be on my own. This has been the best move and each day I see so much of his self centered ways that I was not seeing before. And we all know they were there. 

If he wakes up from his fog, he will have lost many of the people that have been important to him in the past, including some of his family. That makes me sad, but if I try to bring anything up to him so he can see his behavior, he just gets angry and walks off. Very passive agressive. This has led me to just look away when he starts complaining or being negative. With that said, I have not hardly seen him in the past couple of weeks. 

It is almost a bit strange to me in the way that I am feeling right now. I have not cried in quite some time. NOr have I been dwelling or obsessing on the past. I have been going out and being social more with friends as well. It is almost as if I have crossed a hurdle, not knowing what that hurdle is. 

Either way, hurdle or not, it certainly feels like I am going to get through this!


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## breezycello (May 29, 2015)

TRy said:


> What you do not seem to understand is that as his wife of many years it is not his money to withhold. It is both of your money. Draft a letter (with your attorney's input) to your husband telling him that the courts will not look kindly to him withholding payments to either you or your children during the divorce process, and that such action will insure that the courts will treat him accordingly when they get involved. Tell him that any short term satisfaction he gets out of his withholding of money, will be paid for at a high price over the years to come. After sending this letter, your attorney needs to take immediately action with the court to secure all assets and payments. Do this today.
> 
> One more thing. Get your daughter off the hook by calling and telling the OW daughter and telling her about the affair today. Tell your husband that you did this because of his actions, and that you will no longer be a participant in the affair by being a part of the cover-up. That as a cheater he and his affair partner have a lot of nerve to expect you to sit back and take their betrayal in silence. That he needs to man up and take responsibility for his actions. Tell him that if he wants war in the divorce, you will give it to him, as you no longer have anything to lose.


He has backed off the money thing. He says he didn't even remember that he said that to me, whatever....There are some serious anger issues there that he is not dealing with. He thinks it is ok to behave this way. Yes, the courts will show him otherwise. 

He does not put any money in our joint account. He is paying everything from the business account, of which I have access. The accountant will apply whatever portion for personal use at the end of the year. I have not used any funds from the business account, as I am not listed with ownership on the corporate paperwork. He is 100%. I don't want to give him ammunition against me. 

I am beginning to feel like I will be able to actually "fight" him with my attorney when we get to that point. I am much more a lover than a fighter and never, ever get angry. That has been a difficult emotion to put to use, but getting easier. I do not want to hate him or carry that negativity with me, but can see that I may have to use it for a while


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## Absurdist (Oct 10, 2014)

How are you doing Breezy? I'm worried about you.


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