# I don't even know where to start...



## ABiolarWife (8 mo ago)

I am a wayward wife. And my beautiful husband has decided I deserve a second chance. I am not going to let this issue derail the most precious gift I have ever received. So I am going to make a giant story short. I am bipolar 1 and its onset was late in life (was in my fifties). This is pertinent information. If you need more information I will be happy to answer any questions.

When I had my first manic episode (and this is NOT an excuse - I own the affair) I had a 6 month long affair with a coworker. And, of course, my husband caught me. Huge fight on DDay (I still cringe at that although I know a lot more about why now) and we ended up divorced. Then last year he reached out to me in January and after a lot of long, heart to heart talks? He is an such an amazing person that he wanted to try and reconcile. 

Since the divorce I have gotten on bipolar medications and go to therapy at least once a week(DBT). And have been relatively stable since. Had one worrisome episode late last year but he got me into the hospital and they adjusted my medications and I have been pretty good since.

But the problem I keep struggling with is just pure shame. My partner has forgiven me. He really has. And I have been working on this in therapy. But I am still struggling with it. The look on my husband's face when I started screaming at him on DDay? I see it in my dreams almost every night. We will be discussing the affair, I am dedicated to answering anything he asks, I will often get overwhelmed and just flood with guilt and shame.

Being the man he is, he puts his own pain aside in that moment, just to comfort me. And that is so unfair to him. And so selfish of me. I have to get better at handling these intense feelings and be able to carry on without spiraling down the drain. I need to be the one getting into his pain with him. Not the other way around.

So does anyone have any tips, books, websites, videos? Anything? I want this to stop


----------



## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

Keep up the good work, good works and well thought out....thoughts.

It is all on you.


----------



## Affaircare (Jan 11, 2010)

So @ABiolarWife 

I have a quick question for you. Are you overwhelmed with SHAME...or with GUILT? There is a difference!

Shame is feeling terrible about _who you are_--Guilt is feeling terrible about _what you did_.12

There’s a subtle distinction between guilt and shame that is important. Either can arise when you do something wrong. But guilt results if your attitude is, “I can fix this; this isn’t who I am,” whereas shame is the attitude that, “this is who I am; I can't change this."

So, which is it? Shame or Guilt?


----------



## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

Both shame and guilt are meaningful.
And both, necessary.

Shame, originates from your upbringing, those morals given to you and taken in, by you.
Shame, further comes from compromising those morals, and feeling very sad.

Guilt is admitting you acted wrong, under the circumstances.


----------



## ABHale (Jan 3, 2016)

You should do some reading on your condition. Don’t be so hard on yourself because a episode alters your brain completely. My uncle is bipolar and is a great person when he isn’t off his meds. Off meds he has disappeared for a few years at a time.


----------



## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

The two of you will both recover in your own ways, in your own time. You will probably never feel the same way about yourself you once did. You will always have those thoughts. But that's not a bad thing. It's what is possibly, probably needed to guide you. You have identified who you don't want to be anymore. Add the bipolar issues, and it takes an incredible amount of strength to be the person who want to be, for your relationship. That strength doesn't exist on its own. You're getting that strength from those memories, so much strength that it can keep you going in the right direction.

What you might not be realizing is how strong the pull is for the wrong direction. You are a very, very strong woman. You are doing what needs to be done. Just don't try to put a time limit on your own grief, guilt and shame. You are doing very well. I wish you the very best.


----------



## ABiolarWife (8 mo ago)

Affaircare said:


> So @ABiolarWife
> 
> I have a quick question for you. Are you overwhelmed with SHAME...or with GUILT? There is a difference!
> 
> ...


Good question. And I would have to answer this way. Shame because of who I had become back then. I was simply awful. And this is where bipolar comes into play the most. I was already being selfish and entitled. And the mania was like throwing gas on a fire. A LOT of gas. And guilt? You have no idea.

This is my first post and I am not sure how to hide text. And this is ugly and potentially triggering. Guess I will just do this.

*TRIGGER WARNING************SUICIDE and MENTAL ILLNESS*

When the process server handed me the divorce papers I went home early, came crashing down from the mania all the way back to my parent's house. Where calmly swallowed a bottle full of Percocet and laid down to die (no sympathy please - not wanted or needed). Thank God my parents found me and got me to the ER.

I was in the psychiatric ward 10 days. Where I was diagnosed with BP 1 and GAD. I lost everything. Home, husband, kids - everything. For what?

Guilt?? Just a little. But I got up, dusted myself off and got to work on myself. 

So shame and guilt?


----------



## 86857 (Sep 5, 2013)

ABiolarWife said:


> We will be discussing the affair, I am dedicated to answering anything he asks, I will often get overwhelmed and just flood with guilt and shame.
> Being the man he is, he puts his own pain aside in that moment, just to comfort me. And that is so unfair to him. And so selfish of me.


EDIT Wow @ABiolarWife, I read above post after I had written this. You sure have been put through the mill. Huge kudos to you. 
Do you ever look at it as if that person isn't who you are? Your mind was injured. 
It's like someone breaking a leg and not having it fixed. No way can they walk around like a normal person. Being promiscuous is actually a symptom of bipolar, dunno if that's generally known. 

I think couples therapy might be the way BUT with someone who's also familiar with bipolar. Your therapist might know someone. Thus you could both express your feelings and your husband wouldn't have to suppress his to comfort you which only makes you feel worse. It's a vicious circle in a way. 

Bipolar runs very strongly in my Mom's family. It's a savage illness and the depressions during lows are awful, way worse than unipolar depression. My auntie would sob for hours in my Mom's kitchen. So well done to you.

D-Day must be on your mind during the day, otherwise you wouldn't be dreaming about it every night. If H is there when you find yourself thinking about it (or when he gets home) give him a big hug and tell him the most precious gift you ever got was him taking you back . Good quality sleep is really important as you probably know. Those dreams ain't doing your sleep much good.

Cognitive Behavioural Therapy (CBT) is supposed to be very good for the racing thoughts symptom of bipolar. Sorry if you know about it, I think DBT is a type of CBT and is about awareness?
Years ago I had an issue and the therapist used CBT & taught me how to do it myself. It's simple. Negative thoughts need to be IMMEDIATELY replaced with positive ones, e.g. replace the D-Day thought with the thought that H took you back.
You have to do it every time they come. CBT sets up new neural pathways in the brain and the old ones get switched off cos they're not being used. It's actually a physical process in the brain, not just a mind thing iykwim. I've used it ever since anytime an issue comes my way. It takes a lot of discipline but is well worth it. 

In your case, there's one positive thought that can replace just about any negative thought.
That is, that although you are struggling now, it would be a heck of a lot worse if H hadn't taken you back.
Am I right? 

PS Yours is the only R thread I've ever commented on or read about that I think will be succesful


----------



## ABiolarWife (8 mo ago)

ABHale said:


> You should do some reading on your condition. Don’t be so hard on yourself because a episode alters your brain completely. My uncle is bipolar and is a great person when he isn’t off his meds. Off meds he has disappeared for a few years at a time.


Thank you - but I have read and continue to read everything about my disorder I can lay my hands on. And know what role it did and did not play in my affair. And the hypersexuality is super strong when I have an episode. I already have a super high libido and when manic it just explodes. 

But enough about that. But I do continue to learn about my disorder and better ways to manage it on a daily basis.

Thank you for the kindness.


----------



## ABiolarWife (8 mo ago)

********** said:


> I think couples therapy might be the way BUT with someone who's also familiar with bipolar. Your therapist might know someone. Thus you could both express your feelings and your husband wouldn't have to suppress his to comfort you which only makes you feel worse. It's a vicious circle in a way.
> 
> Bipolar runs very strongly in my Mom's family. It's a savage illness and the depressions during lows are awful, way worse than unipolar depression. My auntie would sob for hours in my Mon's kitchen. So well done to you.
> 
> ...


Thank you for the kind words and sensible advice. As far as CBT vs DBT question? I tried CBT and was just getting nowhere. Whereas DBT clicked immediately for me and I saw immediate benefits.



Casual Observer said:


> The two of you will both recover in your own ways, in your own time. You will probably never feel the same way about yourself you once did. You will always have those thoughts. But that's not a bad thing. It's what is possibly, probably needed to guide you. You have identified who you don't want to be anymore. Add the bipolar issues, and it takes an incredible amount of strength to be the person who want to be, for your relationship. That strength doesn't exist on its own. You're getting that strength from those memories, so much strength that it can keep you going in the right direction.
> 
> What you might not be realizing is how strong the pull is for the wrong direction. You are a very, very strong woman. You are doing what needs to be done. Just don't try to put a time limit on your own grief, guilt and shame. You are doing very well. I wish you the very best.


----------



## 86857 (Sep 5, 2013)

@ABiolarWife 
I edited my post after as I hadn't seen your 2nd post. I'm not a psychologist! so I'm sorry if I seemed to be preaching. 
I heard so much about bipolar growing up and witnessed it too, so I'm familiar with it in that sense. 
You're surely going in the right dorection. 
R is very difficult for anyone. 
Bipolar is very difficult for anyone. 
So you've got a double whammy coming at you. 
At the risk of preaching again LOL, it may be difficult not to, but try not to be too harsh on yourself.


----------



## ABiolarWife (8 mo ago)

Casual Observer said:


> The two of you will both recover in your own ways, in your own time. You will probably never feel the same way about yourself you once did. You will always have those thoughts. But that's not a bad thing. It's what is possibly, probably needed to guide you. You have identified who you don't want to be anymore. Add the bipolar issues, and it takes an incredible amount of strength to be the person who want to be, for your relationship. That strength doesn't exist on its own. You're getting that strength from those memories, so much strength that it can keep you going in the right direction.
> 
> What you might not be realizing is how strong the pull is for the wrong direction. You are a very, very strong woman. You are doing what needs to be done. Just don't try to put a time limit on your own grief, guilt and shame. You are doing very well. I wish you the very best.


Thank you very much. And I will tell you this. I am happy with who I am now. I have worked hard to change who I was. And I am the most authentic I have ever been. And, while I did that work for myself, my husband deserved nothing less than my best every day. And he get that. I will never take this for granted.

But the shame can be overwhelming to me at times. I look back at the affair now and cannot even believe I went down that road. With, basically, just a dude 20 years younger than me who was paying attention to me. Ugh. And I cannot even express my fear of having another bad manic episode and doing God knows what.

That is why I am fanatical about my medications and therapy. And we do go to marriage counseling as well once a week. He is also in therapy but has been for way before the affair. He suffers from CPTSD. Combination of being physically abused as a child and his last combat deployment went very, very badly.

And we have a Gottman trained MC and she has worked wonders for our communication and overall relationship.

Thank you again


----------



## ABiolarWife (8 mo ago)

********** said:


> @ABiolarWife
> I edited my post after as I hadn't seen your 2nd post. I'm not a psychologist! so I'm sorry if I seemed to be preaching.
> I heard so much about bipolar growing up and witnessed it too, so I'm familiar with it in that sense.
> You're surely going in the right dorection.
> ...


We are in a really good place right now beside this issue. We are about to celebrate our 34 wedding anniversary (or would have been without that 3 year gap I caused) and I have planned a surprise trip to San Francisco and have reservations at his absolute favorite restaurant.

And I am learning to grant myself grace. I have repaired the damage with my kids. My husband and I are retired and getting to spend so much time together makes me so very happy. And the best part? It is making him happy as well. And, while we do discuss the affair - quite often in fact, it never gets heated. Never gets accusatory. When he said he had forgiven me? He REALLY meant he had forgiven me. I, in no way, deserve him.


----------



## 86857 (Sep 5, 2013)

That's so great to hear. I guess like so many issues in life, there's no on-off switch, it's a process.
I keep having to remind myself of that with a difficult issue I have which breaks my heart at times. I'm too impatient I guess.
You both sound like very very authentic people.


----------



## colingrant (Nov 6, 2017)

ABiolarWife said:


> I am a wayward wife. And my beautiful husband has decided I deserve a second chance. I am not going to let this issue derail the most precious gift I have ever received. So I am going to make a giant story short. I am bipolar 1 and its onset was late in life (was in my fifties). This is pertinent information. If you need more information I will be happy to answer any questions.
> 
> When I had my first manic episode (and this is NOT an excuse - I own the affair) I had a 6 month long affair with a coworker. And, of course, my husband caught me. Huge fight on DDay (I still cringe at that although I know a lot more about why now) and we ended up divorced. Then last year he reached out to me in January and after a lot of long, heart to heart talks? He is an such an amazing person that he wanted to try and reconcile.
> 
> ...


The shame you feel can also be a motivational gift if you allow yourself to process the memory of the look on his face when being screamed at, in a different way. Shamefulness is disempowering, weakens you and can derail your recovery and his. 

You can leverage that shameful act by allowing it to be the strength by which you protect the man you disrespected and hurt. Pain can be a cure at times if used properly. I had no problems staying no contact and avoiding any form of reconciliation with my x-fiancés. 

All I had to do was remember their actions and words. I was hurt beyond what words can adequately describe and allowed that to fuel my resolve and conviction. By not forgetting his pain and anguish, you are subconsciously strengthening your resolve in a sense.


----------



## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

ABiolarWife said:


> Thank you - but I have read and continue to read everything about my disorder I can lay my hands on. And know what role it did and did not play in my affair. And the hypersexuality is super strong when I have an episode. I already have a super high libido and when manic it just explodes.
> 
> But enough about that. But I do continue to learn about my disorder and better ways to manage it on a daily basis.
> 
> Thank you for the kindness.


But you chose to continue it between manic phases. Did you continue with the AP after D-Day and divorce? Did you quit your job to remove yourself from the AP? Have you read "How to help your spouse heal from an affair" it may be helpful to you.


----------



## BigDaddyNY (May 19, 2021)

Divinely Favored said:


> But you chose to continue it between manic phases. Did you continue with the AP after D-Day and divorce? Did you quit your job to remove yourself from the AP? Have you read "How to help your spouse heal from an affair" it may be helpful to you.


@ABiolarWife These are all great questions/suggestions. Even though there is a medical issues complicating your situation that impacted your decision making ability, you did still cheat. I think your guilt and shame are a tool to help you and you marriage make a comeback, but try not to let it totally cripple you. And to the point Divinely is making here, don't forget about what is going on in your husband's head. 

I'm sure everyone here agrees that we are glad your suicide attempt was unsuccessful. Now make the most of the life you have.


----------



## bricks (Aug 14, 2017)

Lots of beautiful thoughts given by other responses. I will only add that I understand. For me, making choices and behaving in a way I can defend/be proud of over a series of years eased the struggle. Good luck.


----------



## ABiolarWife (8 mo ago)

********** said:


> That's so great to hear. I guess like so many issues in life, there's no on-off switch, it's a process.
> I keep having to remind myself of that with a difficult issue I have which breaks my heart at times. I'm too impatient I guess.
> You both sound like very very authentic people.


Thank you. It is the 
ONLY way forward for me know is to be 100% open, honest and vulnerable.


----------



## ABiolarWife (8 mo ago)

Divinely Favored said:


> But you chose to continue it between manic phases. Did you continue with the AP after D-Day and divorce? Did you quit your job to remove yourself from the AP? Have you read "How to help your spouse heal from an affair" it may be helpful to you.


No - I did not contact AP again after the divorce. Or the confrontation. My husband not only confronted me? He had been in touch with the OBS wife. And yes - I did change jobs. And you are mistaken - I did not choose to continue it between episodes. I was in a single manic episode for the entirety of the affair. So I do not know what you mean?


----------



## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

ABiolarWife said:


> No - I did not contact AP again after the divorce. Or the confrontation. My husband not only confronted me? He had been in touch with the OBS wife. And yes - I did change jobs. And you are mistaken - I did not choose to continue it between episodes. I was in a single manic episode for the entirety of the affair. So I do not know what you mean?


You are saying you were in manic phase for 6 months straight?! Yet you still had the mental ability to continue working and doing your job plus deceiving your husband.


----------



## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

I know a few bipolar people but they do not stay manic for months on end. One remembers folding clothes, then walking through a field at night and being cold, came to 3 days later in Dallas 150 miles away...but I have never heard of someone being manic for 6 months straight and still being able to function to keep working and maintain normal schedule in life.


----------



## ABiolarWife (8 mo ago)

Divinely Favored said:


> You are saying you were in manic phase for 6 months straight?! Yet you still had the mental ability to continue working and doing your job plus deceiving your husband.


Welcome to mania. I do not fast cycle - just the opposite. And manic episodes do not make you stupid. They DO make you delusional as hell.


----------



## ABiolarWife (8 mo ago)

Divinely Favored said:


> I know a few bipolar people but they do not stay manic for months on end. One remembers folding clothes, then walking through a field at night and being cold, came to 3 days later in Dallas 150 miles away...but I have never heard of someone being manic for 6 months straight and still being able to function to keep working and maintain normal schedule in life.


Out of all the bipolar people in the world, how many do you know personally? I do not swing into heavy depressive episode either. I mean - so what? And yes - a lot of BP1 people experience extended manic or mixed episodes. BP2 folks can have extended periods of hypomania. It is completely normal despite who you know with bipolar.

The disorder expresses itself differently in every patient. It is a spectrum disorder, not a black and white diagnosis. Which is why it is difficult to find and get on the right dose of the right medications. It can take years.


----------



## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

ABiolarWife said:


> Welcome to mania. I do not fast cycle - just the opposite. And manic episodes do not make you stupid. They DO make you delusional as hell.


So you knew what you were doing it just made it where you did not care about repercussions?


----------



## ABiolarWife (8 mo ago)

colingrant said:


> The shame you feel can also be a motivational gift if you allow yourself to process the memory of the look on his face when being screamed at, in a different way. Shamefulness is disempowering, weakens you and can derail your recovery and his.
> 
> You can leverage that shameful act by allowing it to be the strength by which you protect the man you disrespected and hurt. Pain can be a cure at times if used properly. I had no problems staying no contact and avoiding any form of reconciliation with my x-fiancés.
> 
> All I had to do was remember their actions and words. I was hurt beyond what words can adequately describe and allowed that to fuel my resolve and conviction. By not forgetting his pain and anguish, you are subconsciously strengthening your resolve in a sense.


See? That is what drives me every day. The pure agony I put him through. Listen to this. This will tell you just how strong and self confident my husband is. He told me had he know I was bipolar and in an episode? He would have stayed through it and tried again after I got help. He is 1 in a million. He would have been fine without me. He was doing just fine. Had dated several nice women. But, in the end, he loved and chose me. And I do the same with him every day.


----------



## BigDaddyNY (May 19, 2021)

Divinely Favored said:


> I know a few bipolar people but they do not stay manic for months on end. One remembers folding clothes, then walking through a field at night and being cold, came to 3 days later in Dallas 150 miles away...but I have never heard of someone being manic for 6 months straight and still being able to function to keep working and maintain normal schedule in life.


BP1, when untreated and have manic episodes that last for months. It is usually week to a few months, but 6 months is far from unheard of.


----------



## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

BigDaddyNY said:


> BP1, when untreated and have manic episodes that last for months. It is usually week to a few months, but 6 months is far from unheard of.


Yeah I googled it.


----------



## Affaircare (Jan 11, 2010)

Divinely Favored said:


> I know a few bipolar people but they do not stay manic for months on end. One remembers folding clothes, then walking through a field at night and being cold, came to 3 days later in Dallas 150 miles away...but I have never heard of someone being manic for 6 months straight and still being able to function to keep working and maintain normal schedule in life.


So there are two things to remember...three maybe:

1) 4 cycles per year = *rapid* cycling, so it stands to reason that 3 or fewer cycles PER YEAR is standard cycling. A cycle includes both the mania portion and the depressive portion...so some (not all) have one cycle per year.
2) Mania builds over time, so it's not as if you wake up insane one morning and continue to act insane for six months straight. So many people envision mental illness as if it were "incoherent and wildly crazy" where what it really looks like is a normal person who just is not thinking quite attached to reality. For example, my exH was diagnosed Bipolar and Borderline, and he was rapid cycling, so when he was manic, he would gradually stay awake longer and longer and begin to act unusual until he'd hit the peak of his mania and wake me up in the middle of the night to paint the kitchen red. No we hadn't discussed needing to paint or wanting a different color; no we hadn't prepared in any way to paint; no we didn't have the paint to do it with or the things you need in order to paint; no the paint stores weren't open in the middle of the night--and yet he was ENERGIZED and insistent on doing it RIGHT NOW! And my bringing up the items above--I didn't love him or support him or encourage him and I was evil incarnate. See...it's not that he couldn't function, but rather, he just was not thinking based on reality.
3) Each person is different. The end--hard stop. The bipolar person you know, is not the bipolar person I know, nor are either of them @ABiolarWife . 

My sister is diagnosed bipolar and about every couple years she has a thing called "Mixed episode" where she's manic and depressed at the same time. She tends to get this when a mania is building but she has to miss sleep for some reason (her hubby is a trucker who gets up weirdly early and arrives home super late). Mania tends to fill her with mood energy and lack of sleep sets off her depression, so she's both at the same time and has to go to the hospital. Her cycles are maybe 1 each year, and she is literally religious about her medications and counseling. My mom's is undiagnosed bipolar because she won't go to a psychiatrist, but her cycles are like dependable! We used to call them her "Cycles of the Moon" when we were kids because guess what affects her: hormones! So we could almost set our clock by her cycles--rapid cycles 12/year! She does no meds and no treatment because she thinks she's fine. My exH is rapid cycling with serious mania but not too low depressions...more like withdrawn or quiet. I'd say he has one per quarter maybe or every other month--it depends. He'll take a medication and "check in" with a psychiatrist, but refuses any kind of counseling.

So just the three bipolar people * I * know are all different. It makes common sense that the three I know aren't like the ones you know... and all of them aren't like @ABiolarWife . People are different.


----------



## ABiolarWife (8 mo ago)

BigDaddyNY said:


> BP1, when untreated and have manic episodes that last for months. It is usually week to a few months, but 6 months is far from unheard of.


No - not unheard of at all. And not everyone dissolves and becomes unable to function during a manic episode either. But please understand...I am not going to 'blame' bipolar for my affair. I knew it was wrong. Where the bipolar comes in is, though I knew what I was doing was wrong? I did not care. I was incapable of caring.

So let me ask you guys this...What do you think it is like to HAVE this disorder? Where, every day you wake up, may be the day you slip into another episode. Where your own brain betrays you. And you never really know when it is coming. It is like a time bomb...tick,tick,tick. Just waiting to blow your life into shambles. And your loved ones lives as well.

It is hard to live with that. And hard to live that way. But it is how I live every day. I hate this disorder.


----------



## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

Affaircare said:


> So there are two things to remember...three maybe:
> 
> 1) 4 cycles per year = *rapid* cycling, so it stands to reason that 3 or fewer cycles PER YEAR is standard cycling. A cycle includes both the mania portion and the depressive portion...so some (not all) have one cycle per year.
> 2) Mania builds over time, so it's not as if you wake up insane one morning and continue to act insane for six months straight. So many people envision mental illness as if it were "incoherent and wildly crazy" where what it really looks like is a normal person who just is not thinking quite attached to reality. For example, my exH was diagnosed Bipolar and Borderline, and he was rapid cycling, so when he was manic, he would gradually stay awake longer and longer and begin to act unusual until he'd hit the peak of his mania and wake me up in the middle of the night to paint the kitchen red. No we hadn't discussed needing to paint or wanting a different color; no we hadn't prepared in any way to paint; no we didn't have the paint to do it with or the things you need in order to paint; no the paint stores weren't open in the middle of the night--and yet he was ENERGIZED and insistent on doing it RIGHT NOW! And my bringing up the items above--I didn't love him or support him or encourage him and I was evil incarnate. See...it's not that he couldn't function, but rather, he just was not thinking based on reality.
> ...


A psych Dr once told my wife some people get aggitated during manic phase. So they are angry or depressed, not excited/depressed.

They said she was "mildly bipolar" and put her on a mood stabilizer. That crap messed her up for a while. Talking nothing...a black hole for emotion. Our child could have been in major car wreck, whatever. She felt nothing for no one.

Then found out she had cyst on ovary and sent to Chief Oncologist at Women's Cancer Center at Baylor Medical in Dallas. She said quit taking the mood stabilizer NOW!

She said it is crazy how many women are mis-diagnosed by psych Drs and put on unneeded psych drugs, when the issue is nothing more than hormones being out of whack.

She had a hysterectomy and takes HRT. It is like I am married to a different woman. One that looks just like my wife of 25 yrs, very loving, likes sex and is cool as a cucumber.

I think women need to get hormones checked before going to psych Dr. Especially after the specialist said about the misdiagnosis.

PS. Lamictal is of the devil. That crap ain't right.

I wonder how many marriages are destroyed by women being misdiagnosed and put on psych drugs that destroy relationship or cause suicide, when they had no mental illness to start with.


----------



## Affaircare (Jan 11, 2010)

ABiolarWife said:


> But the problem I keep struggling with is just pure shame. My partner has forgiven me. He really has. And I have been working on this in therapy. But I am still struggling with it. The look on my husband's face when I started screaming at him on DDay? I see it in my dreams almost every night. We will be discussing the affair, I am dedicated to answering anything he asks, I will often get overwhelmed and just flood with guilt and shame.
> 
> Being the man he is, he puts his own pain aside in that moment, just to comfort me. And that is so unfair to him. And so selfish of me. I have to get better at handling these intense feelings and be able to carry on without spiraling down the drain. I need to be the one getting into his pain with him. Not the other way around.
> 
> So does anyone have any tips, books, websites, videos? Anything? I want this to stop


Guilt or Shame? It sounds like a little of both, honestly. Guilt over what you did (the affair, the screaming on D-Day, how you acted) and shame over being THAT manic and having a mental illness. 

So before I continue further, I want to introduce myself. I have been here on TAM for more than a decade and I am a former WW (Wayward Wife). Like you, I'm proud of the work I've done and proud to be able to claim the "former"...but I can also identify with the feelings of both guilt and shame. I'm guilty of the way I acted and ashamed of who I became at that time. BUT (and it is a giant "but")... THAT IS NOT WHO I AM NOW. And I have put safeguards in place so that I protect my loved ones from my own weaknesses. Also worth noting, I have had three husbands: #1 is my exH with whom I had 2 lovely boys and he cheated on me. It was the catalyst of a lot of my personal growth. #2 was my dear hubby whom I married in my 40's and after a miscarriage, finding out we were infertile, and mid-life, I had an affair. We reconciled but we did NOT rugsweep--we worked our way back to recovering an entirely new marriage. He passed away when he was 59yo and I was 55yo. #3 was a miracle and is my current hubby. He is @EmergingBuddhist here on this forum.

So, you can tell, that at minimum I kind of have some empathy for where you're at. I haven't been perfect either. I've felt both guilt and shame. I get it. So I'd like to suggest that part of your DBT treatment is expressly helpful here. As I understand it, there are four skills you practice, right?

*Distress tolerance:* Feeling intense emotions like anger without reacting impulsively or using self-injury or substance abuse to dampen distress.
*Emotion regulation:* Recognizing, labeling, and adjusting emotions.
*Mindfulness:* Becoming more aware of self and others and attentive to the present moment.
*Interpersonal effectiveness: *Navigating conflict and interacting assertively.
Okay, you have an emotion: guilt or shame. Recognize it--"Oh I'm holding my breath! I must be holding back what I feel. I'm feeling something." Give it a name--I like to say the name of the thing right out, like "Oh I feel Shame." Adjust emotions--"Okay, it is what it is, but it is also the past. I'm not there now. I am HERE now. I can hug myself. I can ask for a hug. I can take deep breaths to calm down. I can feel the air enter as I inhale and exit as I exhale slowly. I can ask for a break if I need one. (Self-soothe)" 

You might even think of Opposite Actions (I find this helpful). For example, if in your shame you feel sadness and you want to act by isolating or crying or hiding, try the literal opposite action. What's the opposite of isolating? Yeah that would be opening up with somone/being with someone. What the opposite of crying? Laughing. Don't laugh to cover the pain, but rather try smiling maybe. What's the opposite of hiding? Getting out. Being "in the open." So maybe smile, self-soothe, and then share from your own heart that at the moment you're feeling a little ashamed and vulnerable and make a request for what you need ("Could we have 5 minutes so I can go make a cup of tea?")


----------



## ABiolarWife (8 mo ago)

Divinely Favored said:


> A psych Dr once told my wife some people get aggitated during manic phase. So they are angry or depressed, not excited/depressed.
> 
> They said she was "mildly bipolar" and put her on a mood stabilizer. That crap messed her up for a while. Talking nothing...a black hole for emotion. Our child could have been in major car wreck, whatever. She felt nothing for no one.
> 
> ...


I wish it was something as simple for me. But it is not. I take lithium and Vraylar and it has been the best medication combo I have taken. Works really well and has the fewest side effects. And I have a prolactinoma - basically a brain tumor that jack my pregnancy hormones out of whack. But that has been under control for ages.

Thank you.


----------



## ABiolarWife (8 mo ago)

Affaircare said:


> Guilt or Shame? It sounds like a little of both, honestly. Guilt over what you did (the affair, the screaming on D-Day, how you acted) and shame over being THAT manic and having a mental illness.
> 
> So before I continue further, I want to introduce myself. I have been here on TAM for more than a decade and I am a former WW (Wayward Wife). Like you, I'm proud of the work I've done and proud to be able to claim the "former"...but I can also identify with the feelings of both guilt and shame. I'm guilty of the way I acted and ashamed of who I became at that time. BUT (and it is a giant "but")... THAT IS NOT WHO I AM NOW. And I have put safeguards in place so that I protect my loved ones from my own weaknesses. Also worth noting, I have had three husbands: #1 is my exH with whom I had 2 lovely boys and he cheated on me. It was the catalyst of a lot of my personal growth. #2 was my dear hubby whom I married in my 40's and after a miscarriage, finding out we were infertile, and mid-life, I had an affair. We reconciled but we did NOT rugsweep--we worked our way back to recovering an entirely new marriage. He passed away when he was 59yo and I was 55yo. #3 was a miracle and is my current hubby. He is @EmergingBuddhist here on this forum.
> 
> ...


Thank you so very much. This has all become a million times more complicated due to dealing with bipolar. But yes - those are the cornerstones of DBT as I have learned it. And I like the thought of just centering myself and practicing Opposite Action. That sounds truly helpful in this situation.

And thank you for your kindness. I expected to be jumped on with both feet here. But that has not happened. And I am grateful for all the advice and encouragement.

I am proud of who I am now. I can hold my head high. Yes - I did an awful thing. But I am not an awful person anymore. My husband tells me he is proud to be married to me (we remarried last year). And I just melt when I hear that.

Thank you again.


----------



## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

ABiolarWife said:


> I wish it was something as simple for me. But it is not. I take lithium and Vraylar and it has been the best medication combo I have taken. Works really well and has the fewest side effects. And I have a prolactinoma - basically a brain tumor that jack my pregnancy hormones out of whack. But that has been under control for ages.
> 
> Thank you.


If you have not had a hysterectomy please be advised how badly fluctuations in hormones can schew with you mentally. Most people do not realize how bad it can be. Once my wife was driving from her office to mine for lunch, ~3.5 miles...in a town she grew up in. After 45 min she calls me from court house parking lot in town center and had no idea how to get to my office. She drives by it many times daily for YEARS. 

I went to her and she looked at me and for about 60 seconds had no clue who I was. 

Co worker had hysterectomy and she does not take HRT. She will be talking and 5 min later her speech is slurred and she can't think straight. You would think she was very intoxicated. She has even wrecked her vehicle and then became oriented where she was at while in ambulance, before then she was in a catatonic state. She could not even tell them who she was and someone found her State Parole jacket in vehicle and called the office


----------



## ABiolarWife (8 mo ago)

Divinely Favored said:


> If you have not had a hysterectomy please be advised how badly fluctuations in hormones can schew with you mentally. Most people do not realize how bad it can be. Once my wife was driving from her office to mine for lunch, ~3.5 miles...in a town she grew up in. After 45 min she calls me from court house parking lot in town center and had no idea how to get to my office. She drives by it many times daily for YEARS.
> 
> I went to her and she looked at me and for about 60 seconds had no clue who I was.
> 
> Co worker had hysterectomy and she does not take HRT. She will be talking and 5 min later her speech is slurred and she can't think straight. You would think she was very intoxicated. She has even wrecked her vehicle and then became oriented where she was at while in ambulance, before then she was in a catatonic state. She could not even tell them who she was and someone found her State Parole jacket in vehicle and called the office


That is scary. But I have been through menopause already and have no need for a hysterectomy. And I am on HRT as well. So - I am well aware of the power of hormones. But, if you ever saw me in full blown mania? You would have zero doubt concerning my diagnosis. And without those meds my life is completely unmanageable


----------



## *Deidre* (Feb 7, 2016)

It’s so very hard sometimes, to forgive ourselves when we hurt those we love. Your husband sounds like he has a big heart and loves you deeply. You realize what you did and are remorseful. It’s tough to probably be where you are in repairing your relationship because you probably wish you could get the time back you’ve wasted, but there’s no rewind in life, unfortunately. Since you’re both working to repair your marriage, what happened in the past doesn’t need to define you, unless you let it.

I hope things continue to get better for you and your marriage.


----------



## ABiolarWife (8 mo ago)

Affaircare said:


> So there are two things to remember...three maybe:
> 
> 1) 4 cycles per year = *rapid* cycling, so it stands to reason that 3 or fewer cycles PER YEAR is standard cycling. A cycle includes both the mania portion and the depressive portion...so some (not all) have one cycle per year.
> 2) Mania builds over time, so it's not as if you wake up insane one morning and continue to act insane for six months straight. So many people envision mental illness as if it were "incoherent and wildly crazy" where what it really looks like is a normal person who just is not thinking quite attached to reality. For example, my exH was diagnosed Bipolar and Borderline, and he was rapid cycling, so when he was manic, he would gradually stay awake longer and longer and begin to act unusual until he'd hit the peak of his mania and wake me up in the middle of the night to paint the kitchen red. No we hadn't discussed needing to paint or wanting a different color; no we hadn't prepared in any way to paint; no we didn't have the paint to do it with or the things you need in order to paint; no the paint stores weren't open in the middle of the night--and yet he was ENERGIZED and insistent on doing it RIGHT NOW! And my bringing up the items above--I didn't love him or support him or encourage him and I was evil incarnate. See...it's not that he couldn't function, but rather, he just was not thinking based on reality.
> ...


When you have seen one bipolar person? You have seen one bipolar person. You are very correct


*Deidre* said:


> It’s so very hard sometimes, to forgive ourselves when we hurt those we love. Your husband sounds like he has a big heart and loves you deeply. You realize what you did and are remorseful. It’s tough to probably be where you are in repairing your relationship because you probably wish you could get the time back you’ve wasted, but there’s no rewind in life, unfortunately. Since you’re both working to repair your marriage, what happened in the past doesn’t need to define you, unless you let it.
> 
> I hope things continue to get better for you and your marriage.


Thank you so much for the encouraging words. And yes. My husband has a GIANT heart. No one has ever loved me the way he does. Not even my own family. I came out as bisexual when I was 17 years old and it strained my relationship with my entire family with the exception of most my paternal first cousins. 

It was a lot more difficult in 1977 to come out of the closet. I dated girls exclusively until my junior year in college. Dated one guy there and it was a disaster. Then I met my husband and dear heavens. He swept me off my feet! I knew I was going to fall for him HARD by the end of the first date. And I did.

But the point of all that is this. He loved me for exactly who I was. Accepted me for who and what I was. And he has consistently loved me unconditionally until my stupidity ruined all that. People ask all the time how can you claim to love someone and cheat on them. I found out my why. If I told you all the circumstances at that time this would become a novella quickly.

I was an only child. And somewhat spoiled by my parents. Which led me to a lifelong sense of entitlement and selfishness in general. My husband was working q14-16 hours a day building his software company. I felt that lack of attention and , instead of doing the right thing and talking to him about it, I sought and found that attention elsewhere.

Not trying to brag here...please understand. But, according to multiple people I trust I am very attractive. I will say this. I have never had issues attracting people of both sexes. So it made it VERY easy to find a willing affair partner.

But I never stopped loving him. During the affair I continually justified it to myself. And the bipolar fed into that like crazy and made it extremely easy to do. For him? He tried the best he could to get over me and move on. He dated and even had one 7 month semi serious relationship. But he told me he could not get over me somehow. And I thank whatever gods are out there for that.

If you want to know more let me know - I am trying to be as transparent and open as possible. I cannot get good advice if I do not.

Wish you the very, very best. And thank you again.


----------



## 86857 (Sep 5, 2013)

Wow @ABiolarWife, your honesty, including about aspects outside the bipolar, and your lack of self-pity, despite having a particularly challenging type of bipolar, is humbling to read.
It's interesting when you said it could be a novella if you described everything. Your story would make an interesting book–you're an eloquent writer.


ABiolarWife said:


> I am proud of who I am now. I can hold my head high. Yes - I did an awful thing. But I am not an awful person anymore. My husband tells me he is proud to be married to me (we remarried last year). And I just melt when I hear that.




PS Dialogue about mental illness increases awareness. Thank you OP.
Bipolar is still very misunderstood because there are so many different types and it manifests so differently in different people, even in the same family like my relatives.
Most don't know much about it, even if they know someone who has it, and can't be expected to unless they've researched it. Unfortunately being rampant in my family (2 committed suicide), I've been hearing about/witnessing it all my life.



Divinely Favored said:


> PS. Lamictal is of the devil. That crap ain't right.


@Divinely Favored My cousin has taken Lamictal for decades & calls it her 'magic bullet'. . . 2 suicide attempts prior.
She's said 100s of bipolars on a forum she's on say the same.
Meds works differently for different people. It's a big challenge for psychiatrists to come up with an effective med/combo of meds and can take many months, even longer. Same with side effects, horrible side effects for someone & minimal for another on same med.
Lamictal has very few side effects. My cousin, like many, has none. Weight gain, a big problem with bipolar meds is almost zero.
Lamictal is used for epilepsy and was for many years before it was discovered that it can also be effective for bipolar.
I had to fly the flag for it given my cousin's experience and her bipolar friends on the forum .
Sorry for the hijack OP!


----------



## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

> @Divinely Favored[/USER] My cousin has taken Lamictal for decades & calls it her 'magic bullet'. . . 2 suicide attempts prior.
> She's on a bipolar site & said 100s of bipolars on there call it their 'magic bullet' too.
> Meds works differently for different people. It's a big challenge for psychiatrists to come up with an effective med or combo of meds and can take many months, even longer. Same with side effects, horrible side effects for someone & minimal for another on same med.
> Lamictal has very few side effects. My cousin, like many, has none. Weight gain, a big problem with bipolar meds is almost zero.
> ...


It is not good when given to someone who is not bipolar as Dr did to my wife. It made her like a sociopath, with bad thoughts with no emotion. Lights are on but no souls home.

Thank God the oncologist told her to get off it immediately, it was only a hormone fluctuation issue, as many, many women are mis-diagnosed as bipolar due to.


----------



## 86857 (Sep 5, 2013)

Yes @Divinely Favored you're quite right. I'm sure it's not the first time someone with mood issues, changes etc got a bipolar diagnosis when it wasn't bipolar. 
A horrible experience for your wife and you, I'm glad it wasn't bipolar!
For some bipolars if given anti-depressants (cos they very often are) it can cause the worst mood swing they ever had. So they have to get off them immediately.
The brain is so darn sensitive to meds.
I'd better stop hijacking OP's thread .


----------



## ABiolarWife (8 mo ago)

********** said:


> Wow @ABiolarWife, your honesty, including about aspects outside the bipolar, and your lack of self-pity, despite having a particularly challenging type of bipolar, is humbling to read.
> It's interesting when you said it could be a novella if you described everything. Your story would make an interesting book–you're an eloquent writer.
> 
> 
> ...


You're good - no worries. And thank you for the compliment. I have never considered myself eloquent. So, with all my eloquence, I sincerely thank you. That is humbling,

And yeah - BP is a spectrum disorder. And really manifests itself differently for everyone who suffers with this hot steaming pile of a disease. It also, over time, causes physical brain damage too. It is not easy to live with sometimes. And about med combos?? It took almost five years for me to get the right meds at the right dosage. But I am on lithium and Vraylar and they have made a HUGE difference in my. And such a positive impact on our marriage.

My husband says it is like living with a time bomb. That you do not know how much time is left before it goes BOOM. We are not easy to love but we are worth it if we are totally invested in staying with our treatment and actively managing our disorder on a daily basis.

Kind Regards


----------

