# Was This A **** Test?



## Celtic (Apr 7, 2017)

Earlier today the girlfriend and I are queuing in a store. It was fairly long and moving slowly which meant that a lot of people, especially mothers with young kids, were all stood in close proximity together. Two young guys (early-twenties) joined the end of the line and both are expressing their dislike for having to wait with a lot of bad language and vulgar terms. Not directed at anyone in particular but not the sort of language you want around young kids either so I turn to them and simply say:

"Keep the language down in front of all the kids please lads" 

And both immediately apologise, first to myself, then to the queue and begin talking in a more civilised manner. No harm done, no threats of violence and no fuss right? A couple of the mothers turn to thank me, as does the overworked cashier but my girlfriend? She then rolls her eyes and declares:

"Jesus you're like one of those old men who tell kids to watch their language!" 

To which I respond that I was doing it for the kids, not for her and she quiets down and mumbles that I probably think she's a bad mother for swearing in front of her own kids. I say nothing. Later I leave the house to walk the dogs and this time she shouts "don't go shouting at people to mind their language!" but again I say nothing in response. It's clear that its still on her mind but here is what I'm curious about:

Was that a **** test? 
How should I have responded?


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## Keke24 (Sep 2, 2016)

Was she upset with you for some reason before the grocery store incident? Or unhappy with herself for something she felt she failed at as a mother?

It sounds like she was a bit annoyed/jealous that the lads responded positively and the other mothers thanked you. I don't think it was a **** test. I think for whatever reason she's disappointed with herself as a mother and she's taking it out on you or she's mad at you for something that happened previously.


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## Celtic (Apr 7, 2017)

Keke24 said:


> Was she upset with you for some reason before the grocery store incident? Or unhappy with herself for something she felt she failed at as a mother?


That's an interesting take on things, thank you. We did have a massive argument last week so that could be what is making her upset (even though we worked through it I'm expecting the fallout to last for months). She also thinks that I look down on her parenting style, even though I've never said such a thing, but she has used this 'assumed disapproval' to overly defend herself at times. Whenever we disagree in the past I've told her that I don't need her to be like me (as in we don't need to have the exact same opinion about everything all of the time) but this doesn't seem to help.


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## Keke24 (Sep 2, 2016)

@Celtic it does seem like she has a chip on her shoulders regarding her own parenting style. The disapproval she thinks you have of her style must be stemming from somewhere. Perhaps an incident or series of incidents that were trivial to you had a bigger impact on her. Or perhaps the kids respond better to you than they do to her. Or perhaps she initially questioned her own parenting capabilities and something happened to bring her insecurities to the surface. 

I have no children but I imagine it must really hurt for a woman to feel, or be made to feel that her husband is a better parent than her. After all, mommies are supposed to know best.

Moving forward, you really need to continue to reassure her that she's an excellent mother because it's clear there's some underlying insecurity regarding her parenting style.


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## chillymorn69 (Jun 27, 2016)

Celtic said:


> Earlier today the girlfriend and I are queuing in a store. It was fairly long and moving slowly which meant that a lot of people, especially mothers with young kids, were all stood in close proximity together. Two young guys (early-twenties) joined the end of the line and both are expressing their dislike for having to wait with a lot of bad language and vulgar terms. Not directed at anyone in particular but not the sort of language you want around young kids either so I turn to them and simply say:
> 
> "Keep the language down in front of all the kids please lads"
> 
> ...


**** you! is how I would have responded.


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

Celtic said:


> "Jesus you're like one of those old men who tell kids to watch their language!"


Clearly a **** test. When the emotional reaction does not fit the situation, it is likely a **** test.

Your response was defensive when it should have been offensive (in both ways; on the offensive and offensive as in over-the-top).

"Yep! In the meantime, you need stay off my grass, too."

Surely there are more clever comebacks, but that is the gist; don't defend, but rather embrace and expand.


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## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

It appears our GF has a problem. You don't. Stand your ground with your boundaries concerning swearing around children.


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## *Deidre* (Feb 7, 2016)

Maybe just simply say ‘’we’ll have to agree to disagree.’’ If you have a gf who gives you crap about being a good man, you should a new find a new gf.


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## jb02157 (Apr 16, 2014)

Your GF responded much the same as my wife would have. Any deviation in my behavior to the norm is looked at as unacceptable behavior. Since nobody else did anything, speaking up would have been unacceptable. I'm not saying I agree with the way she acted, I'm just saying that I have seen it before. Personally I think it's awful behavior on her part, definitely not a **** test.


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## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

*Deidre* said:


> Maybe just simply say ‘’we’ll have to agree to disagree.’’ If you have a gf who gives you crap about being a good man, you should a new find a new gf.


^^^^yep

That is why I posted to keep your boundaries concerning swearing. No one will ever fault you for it...with exception of your GF.


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## Celtic (Apr 7, 2017)

@Keke24 Thank you again for that; I don't actually have kids of my own (she has two teens from her first marriage) and is usually very protective of them to the point of rushing to defend them if I ask them to help me with chores or worrying when I give them guidance as opposed to doing things for them. I'm still new to being a step-parent so I have much to learn, perhaps you're right in that I may have done something in the past that she feels has made her look bad, even though that was never my intention.
@chillymorn69 I like it but I know my back will be hurting from sleeping on the sofa! 
@farsidejunky Thank you for this; I wish something like that would have come to mind at the time but I like the idea of embrace and expand to show I'm not phased. That is a seriously good mindset to get into. She always tends to want to get the last word in so perhaps this approach would put a stop to that nonsense. 
@Yeswecan Thank you. My father was the same and its a trait I enjoy possessing myself but that also highlights a big difference between her and I. She is extremely passive and laid back while I like doing the right thing. Not to the point where I'm busting a vein with stress, but I'll stand up for my beliefs while she is more...relaxed. Not sure that's the best word but it should get my point across. Again though I've told her so many times that she doesn't need to be me, she still sees any difference as a blip on the radar.


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

Celtic, the idea is to get her to laugh at the absurdity of it all. That is the best way to handle a **** test.


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## Affaircare (Jan 11, 2010)

> > "Jesus you're like one of those old men who tell kids to watch their language!"
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I could not agree more with @farsidejunky. When someone makes an emotional reaction like this, the way to take the wind out of their sails is not to defend yourself but rather to agree with their ridiculousness and make it clear just how ridiculous it is!!

So when she says something like "Jesus you're like one of those old men who tell kids to watch their language!" you could say "You're right! And I expect men to act like gentlemen and women to be ladylike too!" Or "You're right, how ridiculous is it of me to expect adults to be able to control themselves in public." 

See what I mean? The first part is essentially saying 'You're right' (takes the wind out of their trying to start an argument) and the second part is turning their emotional response around on them and showing just how ludicrous it is. After all, some adult swear words really are inappropriate in front of a child,


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## Andy1001 (Jun 29, 2016)

There is something fundamentally wrong when you have a difference of opinion and You end up sleeping on the couch.Do you not see she is punishing you for daring to argue with her,in fact she is trying to emasculate you and you are letting her.If she can't bear you beside her then let her sleep on the couch.
Or else leave for the night,either is good.


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## Celtic (Apr 7, 2017)

@*Deidre* Thank you. I do like the idea of keeping it simple like that but I think what's irked me was her need to bring it up a second time today, like she wanted that extra dig before I forgot about the whole thing.

@jb02157 My man, you nailed it, the whole 'don't rock the boat' mentality can be freaking exhausting sometimes. I know not to embarrass her by causing a huge scene but when it comes to ignoring bad behaviour, I can't be a passive sheep either. How do you cope with it from your wife?

@Affaircare Thank you for that, it makes sense in what you say and I can see how it would work. I do like the response "You're right! And I expect men to act like gentlemen and women to be ladylike too!" but just to come up with something nearly as effective (at the time) would be a huge benefit. I think that I tend to defend myself without realising so I need to change this mindset pronto. Just to be clear; am I to show her how ludicrous her response to my normal behaviour is or how ludicrous it is for me to react in the first place? 

@Andy1001 I was just kidding with that one. She just wants us to be unnaturally alike while I don't fear us being different and sometimes I can sense that playing on her mind.


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## AtMyEnd (Feb 20, 2017)

Celtic said:


> Earlier today the girlfriend and I are queuing in a store. It was fairly long and moving slowly which meant that a lot of people, especially mothers with young kids, were all stood in close proximity together. Two young guys (early-twenties) joined the end of the line and both are expressing their dislike for having to wait with a lot of bad language and vulgar terms. Not directed at anyone in particular but not the sort of language you want around young kids either so I turn to them and simply say:
> 
> "Keep the language down in front of all the kids please lads"
> 
> ...


My wife does the same to me at times. She'll throw out little comments sometimes about something I said during a past argument or something she disagreed with for no reason. Personally I think she does it to try and get a rise out of me, and yes as a test. I have in the past had anger issues, nothing violent but I would get angry over little stupid things that would then cause a fight. Now when she does it I either ignore it or throw back a comment to her that just shuts it down leaving her no way to respond unless she wants to start an argument, and if that happens I just walk away.


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## Buddy400 (Aug 30, 2014)

Andy1001 said:


> There is something fundamentally wrong when you have a difference of opinion and You end up sleeping on the couch.Do you not see she is punishing you for daring to argue with her,in fact she is trying to emasculate you and you are letting her.If she can't bear you beside her then let her sleep on the couch.
> Or else leave for the night,either is good.


Bill Burr on sleeping on the couch

Bill Burr sleeping on the counch - Bing video


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## TheTruthHurts (Oct 1, 2015)

Ha my W says "oh look at the superior parent!" And of course I rub it in with my superiority. (Its become a phrase now )

It's just her expressing her insecurity - and maybe contrasting your willingness to voice your opinion to strangers to her fear of speaking out.

I'd make light of it. I see the world differently than many and, for example, enjoy responding literally when people say emotional things. That usually sounds absurd so it kind of derails the emo process.

It's also fun to match the tone - you could scream back "OK HONEY!" which would be equally effective. It makes yelling at a grown up sound childish, which of course it is.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

Celtic...you have a firm grip on reality..and on your wife. You know her better than most men know their wives.

The chip on her shoulder, yep!

You said she is very passive. This is a key insight. By being outspoken and aggressive, you made HER uncomfortable, when you chastised the lads. She enjoys her anonymity. You apparently get under her skin. She may find you judgemental and controlling. She is losing patience with your responses. She is wrong....maybe [long run] wrong for you. Not quite compatible with each other. 

I assume that you are not in the States. Had you done this here, you might have got your nose punched. 

Likely, you would have gotten some snarky remarks. Not so much in the country side, but in any big city this would have created a confrontation from the knuckle head teens here.


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## Affaircare (Jan 11, 2010)

@Celtic, 

I do realize that coming up with a response like that in the moment is very hard. This is why I recommend first just learning to recognize when it is one of those ludicrous moments. If you can think back to some of how you felt and how your body felt and look for clues that "this what a **** test moment" then the idea is to begin to recognize it at the time. 

For example, for myself when it is a **** test moment for me, I hold my breath, my jaw clenches (I literally keep my mouth closed), and somethings my chest feels heavy and my hands or arms stiffen up. When I notice those physical things occurring--I know that SOMETHING is happening that I have to speak up. Sometimes it's a moment where I need to say "This is not okay with me" and sometimes it's a moment where I have to be honest and I'm afraid. So I feel myself holding my breath I automatically think "I have to speak up. What do I have to speak up about?" 

THEN I recognize a **** test moment when I feel like defending myself. If I feel as though I must "explain" or justify or protect, that's the clue to me that likely a **** test is occurring. So just like "holding breath=I need to speak about something"... "defend=emotional response, probably to a **** test" See?

So in literally part of a moment I get that far, and my first response to feeling like I need to defend is 'It sounds like you're saying X? Is that really what you meant?" In your example it might sound like this: "It sounds to me like you're saying that protecting young children from hearing adult language is an old man thing. Is that really want you meant?" 

Now if this can go one of two ways: "Yep that's what I meant" or "No that's not what I meant at all." "Yep" usually turns into them defending the ridiculous and at that point I'm already clued in that this is a **** test, and I already know that you take the wind out of the sails by saying "YOU'RE RIGHT' and then pointing out how absurd they sound. So while I kind of think of the silly reply, I start with "Oh you are so right" and with a little time to take a breath I can usually figure out some way to work their silliness in the moment. Not perfectly, but enough to sound sarcastic but joking and also point out how inconsistent they sound!!

If they say "No that's not what I meant" then you have the opportunity to communicate and reach an understanding. In other words, maybe you just misheard and you can straighten that out and all is well!




Celtic said:


> Just to be clear; am I to show her how ludicrous her response to my normal behaviour is or how ludicrous it is for me to react in the first place?


You are somewhat making a joke by going OVER THE TOP to show that your response was reasonable. 

Again, in your example it is exceedingly reasonable to protect young children from hearing some of the words that teenagers use with ease such as the F-bomb. You saying "Please watch your language around the young kids" is a request--not a commandment--but also just pointing out to the teens that there are youngsters present and there's 'a time and a place.' Right? You're not their daddy! You're not bossing them around! In fact, it's appropriate for teens to try out swearing and be a little edgy.

But her response is entirely absurd. Her position is that only old men would speak up about foul-mouthed language. Well...that's silly! So by going over the top and also being a little funny, you point out that her response is ludicrous whilst also not being a "know-it-all" jerk. 

I think responding with "And I expect you to stay off my lawn too!" would have been hilarious! 

Likewise, though the idea of "Yes, and I expect guys to be gentlemen and women to be ladylike--aren't I an Old Fart?" is similar.


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## Wolf1974 (Feb 19, 2014)

So trying to understand. She mocks you for doing the right thing and yells at you because of her own insecurities as a mother? 

Gf right? no plans to marry I hope!


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## Bananapeel (May 4, 2015)

I don't personally think that was a **** test. The purpose of a **** test is to see how you handle the situation and whether you can keep your cool when she tests you. I don't think that was the purpose of her being crabby, rather I think she was genuinely crabby. But you did handle it appropriately, so points for that.


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## *Deidre* (Feb 7, 2016)

Andy1001 said:


> There is something fundamentally wrong when you have a difference of opinion and You end up sleeping on the couch.Do you not see she is punishing you for daring to argue with her,in fact she is trying to emasculate you and you are letting her.If she can't bear you beside her then let her sleep on the couch.
> Or else leave for the night,either is good.


This.

But, if you tolerate this crap OP, then it's not really a matter of your gf anymore, it's a matter of you not seeing your own self worth. She's only a gf...why would you ever tolerate being treated like this?


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

What was the argument about last week?

Has she ever mentioned she feels you are overbearing? Have her children?

I would bring this incident up if I were you. Be open to her perspective. Ask her what she would have liked you to do. 

You do not have to agree with her, of course. But being open to her feelings could give you two a chance to resolve any resentment she may be harboring.


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## She'sStillGotIt (Jul 30, 2016)

I'm getting the distinct impression you've let her know more than once - via words and/or blatant expression - that you obviously don't think too highly of her parenting skills. She may totally suck as a parent, I have no idea. But she's *clearly* in 'defensive' mode and feels that *you* think you're superior to her. And when you acted like the 'hero' and made a big deal about the guys in line and their swearing in front of the kids, she just saw that as you showing off your supposed superiority again, and ridiculed you. Again, that came from a place of self defense.

I don't see this as a **** test at *all*. I don't even know where that supposition came into play.


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## manwithnoname (Feb 3, 2017)

Celtic said:


> Earlier today the girlfriend and I are queuing in a store. It was fairly long and moving slowly which meant that a lot of people, especially mothers with young kids, were all stood in close proximity together. Two young guys (early-twenties) joined the end of the line and both are expressing their dislike for having to wait with a lot of bad language and vulgar terms. Not directed at anyone in particular but not the sort of language you want around young kids either so I turn to them and simply say:
> 
> "Keep the language down in front of all the kids please lads"
> 
> ...


"Speak only when spoken to, young lady"


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## Celtic (Apr 7, 2017)

Thank you for all of your responses; there are a few new things for me to think about and I appreciate the varying outlooks on a situation that I had previously only seen with my own eyes. 
@AtMyEnd I am very much the same as you there. In the past I would let anger grow, again like you not to the point of being violent but certainly leaving me irritated and it does feel like she's testing me sometimes so I really need to work on the shut down responses to prevent things going further.
@TheTruthHurts I agree with you about her expressing her insecurity. She is very much a wallflower (though will deny this to the end) and expects me to be the same but its just not in my nature. She also knows that my parents had high standards when it came to raising me and even though I've never ever criticised her own parenting skills for her own kids, she somehow feels like its something to compete with. 
@SunCMars That's very interesting you mention her thinking of me as being judgemental as this is an issue she's admitted in the past. Not that I feel I've been judgemental; I learned to drop that attitude long before meeting her but I think part of her overly defensive mechanism is to shift the blame to me by claiming that I am so that she feels justified in defending herself. Does that make sense? If I ask her for examples of when I have been judgemental (or any other negative trait) she can never give me one so it feels like she's accusing me out of her own perceived fears more than any genuine action on my part. 

This was in the States too although I'm from Britain (she's American) so perhaps that changes my outlook. I come from a place where aggression and attitude are seen as essential traits, back home I could see such an event easily turning into a small fight but I find it far more relaxed here and people co-operate far better when the aggression and attitude is dropped. 
@Affaircare Thank you so much for taking the time to explain that. Anytime I've read something about these tests, not one has mentioned the need to identify the triggers but it makes so much sense in what you're saying and I tend to react much the same physically. I really like the idea of confirming what she said in order to give time for a more suitable response, not only does that give us both time to compose thought but also prevents an immediate response that may escalate things further. That is fantastic, thank you. 
@Wolf1974 We're working on things. Slowly but progress is being made so I'm grateful for that.
@jld Not so much overbearing but I do sense an amount of rivalry beneath the surface. She's been a great single mom for the past few years though when I came along I introduced her kids to things like camping, bike rides, museums etc. and they really seem to enjoy it. I never use this against her, I've always made sure she's involved, she always comes with us and I make sure she and the kids have their own alone time too but for some reason she perhaps sees it as me 'winning' them even though that's never my intention. 
@She'sStillGotIt Not at all. I've never once criticised her parenting skills (quite the opposite, I always praise because she's done a damn good job) but a lot of the time she'll feel the need to defend herself when there is nothing to defend against. I'm new to being a step-parent. I've not had kids myself so I often seek out her guidance and advice if there is something I am unsure about. She knows I had a very strict upbringing so she could feel like she needs to compete with that but I've never once told her or suggested this the case.
@manwithnoname That's usually reserved for when I give her the 'bedroom, now' look!


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

She'sStillGotIt said:


> I'm getting the distinct impression you've let her know more than once - via words and/or blatant expression - that you obviously don't think too highly of her parenting skills. She may totally suck as a parent, I have no idea. But she's *clearly* in 'defensive' mode and feels that *you* think you're superior to her. And when you acted like the 'hero' and made a big deal about the guys in line and their swearing in front of the kids, she just saw that as you showing off your supposed superiority again, and ridiculed you. Again, that came from a place of self defense.
> 
> I don't see this as a **** test at *all*. I don't even know where that supposition came into play.


Your analysis may be right.

Conversely, she may be so insecure about her parenting, combined with her poor self perception, that she projects that on to him.

If you are right, it wasn't necessarily a **** test, but no less strange.

If I am right, it was a classic example of one.

You have been here long enough to see projection is alive and well in the insecure.


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## Andy1001 (Jun 29, 2016)

Buddy400 said:


> Bill Burr on sleeping on the couch
> 
> Bill Burr sleeping on the counch - Bing video


That was very funny and very true.


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

Celtic, address her insecurities head on. Listen to what she has to say, and then try to reassure her.


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## Andy1001 (Jun 29, 2016)

She may feel insecure,she may feel her parenting skills are being diminished or at least questioned by the op,she may even have been embarrassed by the op or even scared of confrontation with the teenagers.
On the other hand she may just have been in a bad mood and took it out on the op and when she was called out on it she couldn't let it go.I do think her calling after him when he took the dogs out may have been her way of breaking the deadlock.
Or she may be a *****.


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

She clearly trusts you, OP. Use that opening to help her address her issues in healthier ways. 

And be willing to address your own issues, too. That is setting a good example for her.


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## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

Celtic said:


> @
> 
> [MENTION=130657]jb02157 My man, you nailed it, the whole 'don't rock the boat' mentality can be freaking exhausting sometimes. I know not to embarrass her by causing a huge scene but when it comes to ignoring bad behaviour, I can't be a passive sheep either. How do you cope with it from your wife?


Don't look at it as rocking the boat. Look at it as "choosing your battles". Some things in life are just not worth the argument. In this case, Affaircare is right. Return with a funny answer such as "And stay off my grass" or "Hopefully you will not need to issue a silver alert for me" would be best. I used the silver alert once on my W. Got a laugh out of it later.


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## jb02157 (Apr 16, 2014)

Celtic said:


> @*Deidre* Thank you. I do like the idea of keeping it simple like that but I think what's irked me was her need to bring it up a second time today, like she wanted that extra dig before I forgot about the whole thing.
> 
> @jb02157 My man, you nailed it, the whole 'don't rock the boat' mentality can be freaking exhausting sometimes. I know not to embarrass her by causing a huge scene but when it comes to ignoring bad behaviour, I can't be a passive sheep either. How do you cope with it from your wife?
> 
> ...


I wait until we're alone and I tell her how much I disagree with her. My views are going to be different than everyone else's sometimes and I expect her not to call me out in front of others at those times until we can discuss it privately. I don't purposefully try to embarrass her in public and I expect the same from her. We've had this discussion several times and apparently she still doesn't get it. Not that it doesn't surprise me, she's really never learned how to behave like a respectable person in public.


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## GuyInColorado (Dec 26, 2015)

Only way to stop a bully is to stand up to them. 

My ex used to berate me in public. I didn't want to create a scene and would just hush her up the best I could. 

At the end of my marriage when I finally didn't give a crap and read No More Mr Nice Guy, I started sticking up for myself. That meant responding to her crazy off the wall comments immediately and so everyone could hear me. I'll never let someone treat me the way she did again. Ugh, makes me so mad thinking about it! I honestly don't know I didn't knock her teeth out looking back. I totally get how DV can happen.


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