# Staying Together For Our Daughter?



## Irishsoul (Feb 17, 2014)

*Staying Together For Our Kids?*

Hi Everyone. Took me a while to get here, but I am glad I found someplace that might get me started down the road to CHANGE. I have read over some of the other members' threads and I am not sure how cut and dried my situation is. Everyone else is able to capsulize their problems into a neat 1 or 2 sentence summary. Not so sure I will be able to do that, but I will try.

Been married for around 12 years, 2nd time around. Our daughter was a "surprise" as neither my wife or I thought she could get pregnant due to a condition she had. We were open to the idea since we had wanted kids, but we did not go to any extraordinary lengths to find a solution. Anyway, about 10 years in a doctor changed the meds she was taking and "blam", she got pregnant!!!:smthumbup:

We had been having some issues since early in our marriage, meaning my issues with her. Things that "mysteriously" did not surface until after our marriage and have become worse over time.

1. I suspect she is borderline OCD, best case scenario is that she is an overly-cautious, fearful, panicky person...neat freak, clean freak, control freak, everything has to be organic, washes her hands like 50 times a day, etc....but at the same time, slow, disorganized, too caught up in details with most of the areas in her life aside from her obsession with make up and glam....she is starting to pass the OCD traits along to our daughter because every time she get "dirty" or my wife perceives her to get "dirty", she washes her hands, scolds her, etc. She even did this the other day while our daughter was play painting! I mean, she's a 2 y.o. for pete's sake! My little daughter now gets distressed when she gets dirty, like something bad will happen if she doesn't get clean right away......I am doing my best to counter balance this, but I work all day, so I can't do much.

2. I make decent money, so we are in a situation where she can stay home and not work. Just focus on raising our daughter....she does some housework, but more often than not, the sink is full of dirty dishes, all the rooms look like a tornado has passed through the house and she rarely is able to make dinner for me. I am so busy helping her that I have no time to rest and it is also affecting how much time I spend at work which will eventually catch up with me.

3. Every time I try to approach her about trying to change or get help there is a major disagreement or a fight. Everytime I try to tell her that she shouldn't need THAT MUCH HELP (like it shouldn't take to people to change a diaper or blow dry our daughter's hair) it's a fight and a disruption in the household for an hour minimum.....

4. She is quite materialistic and selfish. This has gotten better since the birth or our daughter, but she is still quite focused on money, status and luxury things (even though we don't have a lot of any of these things). She can't keep a budget to the point where i am considering getting separate checking accounts......

Good grief, I guess I could go on and on, and in reality, many people are going through much, much worse difficulties than I am, but the bottom line is I am near the tipping point, but my daughter is the love of my life....she is just so beautiful and precious to me, my little treasure here on earth. I cannot leave her and if I divorce my wife....it would break both our hearts.

I have actually told my wife more than once during our battles, that I am done, I have had enough, that I don't want to be married to her, that she was the biggest mistake of my life....she tells me that I am an ugly person, terrible...a monster sometimes depending on how angry I get, if I use profanity, etc. (btw, never, ever, ever any violence).....she just ignores it until everything has blown over and acts like it was never said.....just a weird situation to be in. I love her, but I really don't like who she is as a person. In fact, most of the people in my family don't like her and can see her so clearly, clearly as me. But they tolerate her because of me and my daughter.

I really don't know what to do. I feel trapped and I feel like the relationship just drains every ounce of energy from me. My health has definitely suffer and I feel I have aged dramatically from the internal stress of being in a relationship with this woman. Been thinking about affairs. Not just for sex, but just want to know if there is someone out there who will appreciate a man like me and not take advantage. Help.


....also, no sex for more 2 years (since she was pregnant). Have attempted twice and she says it is painful. Saw the doctor, but did not follow his advice....she is also very fearful of doctors and hospitals...shocker.


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## Trickster (Nov 19, 2011)

Irish-

I think we married the same wife.. I remember after working all day I would come home and change diapers for the rest of the evening..it was my turn...Everything you talked about fits my wife perfectly... Even the dirty hands thing... Now our 10 year old has sensory issues...She thinks food is poison....that's a whole story itself..

I trained our daughter to not be afraid of dirt... I bought a sand table and everything and after several months, she was playing with sand. I started with pebbles and slowly used smaller rocks until fish tank gravel...

I potty trained our daughter...She was almost 4 years old.She kept telling me she will go on the potty when she is ready..I trained her in just one day..I think I made my wife leave for a few hours she was crying in front of our daughter .

Sex before our daughter was almost Nile..then for a couple years after our baby was born sex was nonexistent... 

I know where you are coming from.

All these years later it really hasn't changed.

I've read so many books and nothing helped...don't waste your time with books to change anything..

My wife wasn't ready to be a mom..now she uses it as an excuse to not go back to work... Does that sound like your wife.

Don't want to get in to the sex part yet... Just glance at some of my threads...Ive been here a while..

I still have no idea what I am doing...still lost, still confused.


I love my daughter... She is everything.... 

I've done and said some stupid stuff...things I wish I didn't ...things I can never take back...

Be carful what you say to your wife..words hurt...

.Don't speak when you are frustrated


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## Irishsoul (Feb 17, 2014)

@Trickster what if I am frustrated ALL THE TIME!!!! lol....eeeessssh, sounds like they are sisters....she doesn't want her eating sugar so she's tricked her into thinking waffles are cookies, crap like that. I have been working on "retraining" her to knowing what is what....there are also safety issues since we live in a rural area (horses, snakes, coyotes)....taking a long time to "educate" my wife that our daughter cannot stand behind a horse, cannot be let to run 30 yards in front you when the weather is warm (snakes + coyotes), unless you've scanned the area...etc. And because everything I say, no matter how much it is accepted as gospel to the known world, is shunned by her it takes several dozen reminders, talks, text messages, etc. to get it across.....unless she hears the same thing on The View or another lame show like that. Then it's a "revelation"!!! I will try and read some of your posts if I have time.


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## lenzi (Apr 10, 2012)

Irishsoul said:


> I have actually told my wife more than once during our battles.. that she was the biggest mistake of my life


What do you expect to gain by talking to her like this?


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## Trickster (Nov 19, 2011)

I get frustrated all the time as well..So often I think I have BPD..Bordering Personality Disorder...who knows...maybe I do...


Just remember you may never changer your wife...I don't remember when I first wanted to D...I know its been a long time though.... I focus on my Daughter...

I stay for our daughter... I don't want to go to sleep without her being near...


My daughter doesn't eat pizza, chicken nuggets, or even French fries...doesn't even want to try them.. I allowed that to happen...That's a good thing, right?


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## Irishsoul (Feb 17, 2014)

lenzi said:


> What do you expect to gain by talking to her like this?


I expect her to realize that what I am telling her is the truth. That the only true reason I am still in the relationship is our daughter. Maybe the slight hope that she will pull her head out. Not sure what your point of reference is lenzi. We are in a calm period right now, but only because I chose to ignore the craziness. Not sure you can relate to what I am going through at all.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Irishsoul (Feb 17, 2014)

Trickster said:


> I get frustrated all the time as well..So often I think I have BPD..Bordering Personality Disorder...who knows...maybe I do...
> 
> 
> Just remember you may never changer your wife...I don't remember when I first wanted to D...I know its been a long time though.... I focus on my Daughter...
> ...


Know it all to well my friend. The only way I can have peace of mind anymore. That diet doesn't sound to bad. Actually it's kind of a blessing she doesn't eat fast food/junk food..... 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Trickster (Nov 19, 2011)

Irishsoul said:


> Know it all to well my friend. The only way I can have peace of mind anymore. That diet doesn't sound to bad. Actually it's kind of a blessing she doesn't eat fast food/junk food.....
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I haven't told anybody on TAM yet this..but...This may be a good thing....I will admit that I am the one who started this when our daughter developed eating issues...being from California, you may like it..

Our daughter does a veggie drink 2 times a day...for her dinner smoothie, she gets spinach, squash, broccoli, a little bit of tomatoe, cooked oatmeal, chicken, ground flax seen and several supplements, stevia, extravirgin olive oil, and a little water...we blend it all up and she drinks it...It actually doesn't taste all that bad.

She doesn't eat any prepared food at all.. Not even Mac & cheese.

School lunch is bread and honey, cheez its , cheddar bunnies from whole foods, raisins, grapes, cereal bar, strawberry flavor milk, and a piece of chocolate.

She will eat most fruit..

I am worried about the social aspect of her eating...we can't even go to Disneyland until she can eat something besides her smoothie..I imagine she can live on fruit for a few days...

Overall, she has a healthy diet in my opinion.


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## Trickster (Nov 19, 2011)

Irishsoul said:


> I expect her to realize that what I am telling her is the truth. That the only true reason I am still in the relationship is our daughter. Maybe the slight hope that she will pull her head out. Not sure what your point of reference is lenzi. We are in a calm period right now, but only because I chose to ignore the craziness. Not sure you can relate to what I am going through at all.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_



I've said similar things as well, we both have so much resentments now.

You have a very long hard angry road ahead of you buddy...

IMO, it's honerable to stay for your daughter... Mine is 10 now and that is why I stay...That is why my wife stays with a man who nitpicks all the time...I have expectations for my wife she can never accomplish...After years of frustration...I just now am beginning to realize this...

If you want to stay married for your daughter..

Accept this will never change no matter what you do...You can't change her by your actions or words.

Do all you can do to be a part of your daughter life

Do things for yourself..hobbies, interests

Encourage your wife to find things for her to do away from home.

Encourage your wife to get a part time job...not for the money, but to empower her and she will feel better about herself.

Stop belittling your wife...I know that all to well.. I do that myself...I am getting better at it..

I am still staying for our daughter...things are so crazy now...We even agreed to an open marriage,...

Mostly, find a fun outlet to release your frustrations...


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## highwood (Jan 12, 2012)

Wow...that is sad that your children are so worried at a young age about food and getting dirty when they play. I commend you guys to realize that this is normal and try and take action to change things.

I would let my son run around get dirty, skinned knees, etc. as well he would occassionally eat fast food/junk food. He is now 23 and is healthy despite being allowed to play and get dirty and eat junk food.

To me that is how I grew up..I used to spend summers at my grandparents farm and played amongst the chickens, in the barn, etc. Thank god that I did not have a parent that was making me feel that was dirty and I better stay inside. If that had been the case I would have missed out on some of the greatest memories I have about my childhood. 

If your immune system is strong a little dirt will not kill you...plus using those antibacterial soaps is not good for the hormone system. We have probably all ingested dirt, etc. growing up and we are all fine.


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## wilderness (Jan 9, 2013)

Stop giving her money until she starts doing her part. Forget the separate checking accounts- get your own and cut off her access to it entirely.


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## C3156 (Jun 13, 2012)

What are you teaching your daughter about happy and healthly relationships by staying in this marriage?

What are you getting from this relationship? 

Think about the questions and write down some answers. Give them an idiot check after a day or two and evaluate what is a fact and what is just your emotions talking.

I say this after thinking about staying for my girls. Although the divorce sucked (and I don't wish that on anyone), I realized after it was all said and done that I am a much happier person not having all that negativity in my life. Who wants to be frustrated all the time?

Think about it from the aspect of would you like your daughter to see: a happy parent or a couple of grumps all the time? You will never get her mother out of her life but you can teach her that everything her mother says is not gospel. It is a tough choice but if you do choose divorce, it is not the end of the world. Those that have gone through it survived and some of us are much happier than we were before.


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## highwood (Jan 12, 2012)

They are probably worried about having less access to their children though. Women generally on average do get majority of custody and often the men are regulated to every second weekend. It might be worth it for them to go see a lawyer and see if they can at least get joint custody however that is still stressful for young kids to be shuffled between parents.


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## WolverineFan (Nov 26, 2013)

I can't imagine that your wife is any happier than you are in this situation. I understand what people say about divorce, I went through one, and it was a miserable experience. There probably are times when it is necessary. If your daughter is worth staying in the marriage for - then so is doing the work necessary to change the relationship. I would recommend a book called _Love Must Be Tough: New Hope For Marriages in Crisis_ which will give you some specific steps on how to move forward. This may not be a popular post - but it's reality from my own experience. Relationships are hard work at times, but I believe any marriage can be changed if both parties want it.


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## Irishsoul (Feb 17, 2014)

C3156 said:


> What are you teaching your daughter about happy and healthly relationships by staying in this marriage?
> 
> What are you getting from this relationship?
> 
> ...


See to me it is all about a selfish choice and an unselfish choice and* I want to preface this by saying I am not stating this judgmentally so please don't take offense.* Believe me I have thought about this everyday. But what else are you potentially teaching your kids if you get a divorce? Not just mentally, but their self-esteem and self-worth? Their confidence? How will they feel about themselves? About the world? I know we can argue all day that some kids are fine, kid's are resilient, etc. It's all bull#$%. I would argue that most kids like myself are scarred by divorce. It make take years for a child of divorce to realize the negative effect of it, on his or her mentality, habits, emotional patterns.

I can see where divorce definitely makes sense in cases where there is extreme and/or consistent abuse (physical, mental verbal, drugs, financial, etc.)....but at the end of the day it all subjective really. Everyone's situation is different.

If you have kids and you decide to divorce for simply being "incompatible" you are teaching kids that they are not important, that the parents feelings, thoughts and well-being are more important than the little ones. And you can talk to them over and over again, how this is not true, how mommy and daddy still love them and daddy will come visit every day (even though it may not happen). They may tell you they understand and that they are okay, but these little guys/girls WILL internalize all this and feel alone, insecure and lack confidence. It's just human nature to be affected this way by your parents splitting up.

*Again, I am not judging you or anyone else who makes the decision to separate or divorce. I still think about it everyday.* But at this point in my life and because of who I am, I have decided my daughter's life is more important than my own. My life's story has been written and she is just beginning on her path. Maybe if I was younger I might feel differently. Since I am in my mid-40s maybe I just don't see the benefits of starting over/reinventing my life and throwing everyone else's lives into chaos because that's what would happen. I think back about my childhood, all of my parents shortcomings, the insanity of how some parents raised their kids in the 1970's, my folks splitting up, etc. I try not to judge, they did the best they could at the time and they are different people now....bottomline is I don't want my daughter to ever have ANY of the experiences I had coming from a broken home.


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## Irishsoul (Feb 17, 2014)

WolverineFan said:


> I can't imagine that your wife is any happier than you are in this situation. I understand what people say about divorce, I went through one, and it was a miserable experience. There probably are times when it is necessary. If your daughter is worth staying in the marriage for - then so is doing the work necessary to change the relationship. I would recommend a book called _Love Must Be Tough: New Hope For Marriages in Crisis_ which will give you some specific steps on how to move forward. This may not be a popular post - but it's reality from my own experience. Relationships are hard work at times, but I believe any marriage can be changed if both parties want it.


She is quite content actually from what I see. She just wishes that I made more money so we could live in a better house near the ocean and that we could upgrade her car from an Accord to a Lexus. Dead serious. I mean, heck, I would love this too, but I think the fact that I have made this life possible for her, where she doesn't have to work has warped her mind a bit. She has worked full-time for several years in the past, but not at the level I have of course. She doesn't realize how hard it is in today's world to afford a lifestyle where only one parent is working. She does not APPRECIATE it because she has never had to bear the financial burden of supporting us.

Thanks for the book ref. I will check it out. Another problem is that, if she is content, what is the impetus for change?....things have actually improved somewhat in the last year, butwe have a long way to go. Don't get me wrong. I am not delusional. I don't hope for the "blissful" marriage, just a reasonably functional marriage with manageable distractions.....how ignorant are we as kids when we start believing that marriages should be as they are in movies and on television.


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## Irishsoul (Feb 17, 2014)

Trickster said:


> I haven't told anybody on TAM yet this..but...This may be a good thing....I will admit that I am the one who started this when our daughter developed eating issues...being from California, you may like it..
> 
> Our daughter does a veggie drink 2 times a day...for her dinner smoothie, she gets spinach, squash, broccoli, a little bit of tomatoe, cooked oatmeal, chicken, ground flax seen and several supplements, stevia, extravirgin olive oil, and a little water...we blend it all up and she drinks it...It actually doesn't taste all that bad.
> 
> ...


Nothing wrong with not fitting in for the right reasons. As a habit, fast food will make us fat and kill us....I love my In n Out burgers, but in moderation. Maybe once every 2-3 weeks. We are not as strict with her diet. We mix in some processed stuff, but everything is organic or natural 99% of the time....we try to avoid sugars, candies, cookies and cakes. She has never had a piece of candy or a real cookie. We have only given her fruit juice a couple times. Water, b-milk, milk, enhanced water.


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## SlowlyGettingWiser (Apr 7, 2012)

Irish,

Have you gone to Individualized Counseling?

Has your wife gone to IC?

Have you spoken to a divorce attorney just so you know what your rights are, what to expect, what the liklihood would be of YOU getting primary custody of your 2yo? Making your daughter OCD re: dirt and food is so abnormal, and you know it. Why don't you at least SEE what an attorney says about the courts requiring your wife to be evaluated for fitness as a parent and what your chances of being the (normal) full-time parent would be like. That seems like it would solve most of your daughter's problems!

Barring getting full-time custody, you could go for 50% custody. This would allow you to counteract a lot of the crazy-making that your wife is doing. Your wife should also be forced to get a job! Staying home full-time making your daughter fearful is a cr*ptastic use of her time (and not any good for your daughter, either).

Please don't just assume that because you're the father, you'll get screwed! There *ARE* fathers here at TAM that have 100% custody and some that have 50% custody. I think either of those options are MUCH BETTER than you all staying together and allowing your wife to RUIN your daughter 100% of the time for the next 3-4 years unabated.


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## highwood (Jan 12, 2012)

I think the same things as you Irishsoul...even though mine and H's son is a young adult I still think it is difficult for kids even adult ones when their parents split up.

I often think that in cases where there is extreme abuse such as what you stated then without a doubt it is in the best interest. HOwever if it is just because you are unhappy and wonder if you still feel the same toward your spouse is that reason enough? Not sure...I am struggling with that myself.

The things he does that I find annoying is that enough to leave a 25 year old relationship for? Sometimes I think yeah I can one day be with someone else and maybe it will be so much better but how do I know...maybe it will be maybe it won't be. If being single is so great why are so many people on these match.com sites, etc. looking for love?


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## Irishsoul (Feb 17, 2014)

highwood said:


> I think the same things as you Irishsoul...even though mine and H's son is a young adult I still think it is difficult for kids even adult ones when their parents split up.
> 
> I often think that in cases where there is extreme abuse such as what you stated then without a doubt it is in the best interest. HOwever if it is just because you are unhappy and wonder if you still feel the same toward your spouse is that reason enough? Not sure...I am struggling with that myself.
> 
> The things he does that I find annoying is that enough to leave a 25 year old relationship for? Sometimes I think yeah I can one day be with someone else and maybe it will be so much better but how do I know...maybe it will be maybe it won't be. If being single is so great why are so many people on these match.com sites, etc. looking for love?


Had to check your profile quickly. You are YOUNG lol. Doesn't look like you have children. See, that's the thing. A child changes EVERYTHING. _That's the way it works, if you are doing it right as parents....and any issues you have RIGHT NOW with your spouse will be magnified 10 fold if you have kids.

If you are sans children, completely different set of rules. Way easier to split up if you get the urge. I probably would not be with my wife if we did not have a daughter.

I guess, like you said, you have to decide if you've had enough. Will it be any better for you out there solo? Will it be better with someone new who is closer to you latest "list" for your dream guy? Or will it be just a different set of quirks that just drive you up the wall lol??? Marriage is a tough gig. Takes an open mind from both partners and a willingness to discuss and compromise._


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## Irishsoul (Feb 17, 2014)

highwood said:


> I think the same things as you Irishsoul...even though mine and H's son is a young adult I still think it is difficult for kids even adult ones when their parents split up.
> 
> I often think that in cases where there is extreme abuse such as what you stated then without a doubt it is in the best interest. HOwever if it is just because you are unhappy and wonder if you still feel the same toward your spouse is that reason enough? Not sure...I am struggling with that myself.
> 
> The things he does that I find annoying is that enough to leave a 25 year old relationship for? Sometimes I think yeah I can one day be with someone else and maybe it will be so much better but how do I know...maybe it will be maybe it won't be. If being single is so great why are so many people on these match.com sites, etc. looking for love?


Other questions: Would you miss him if he died and how much? Would you miss how you are together? (think about this obviously when you ARE NOT fighting lol) How easy is it to adjust your behavior to make living with his quirks less stressful? Think of reasons or write down if there are actually some benefits to his quirks or behaviors. I know with my wife, her conservative nature helps balance out my risk taking behavior. Just thinking from this perspective helps me relax sometimes....and all I am doing is working on myself, don't need her to change at all  ....something I can control. Weird stuff I know, but it helps.


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## highwood (Jan 12, 2012)

I know I gripe and natter at him for stupid things...some people int his world are dealing with serious life issues and I am griping about petty stuff.

He is a good provider has always been a hard worker and I think he feels that when he comes home after working 12 hour days for sometimes weeks on end that he is not appreciated. I do feel guilty that the poor guy I think feels like he is not wanted at home, that he is in the way.

It is true what you said...I think I am not happy with myself and I take it out on him...but who is stopping me from working on myself definently not him but myself. It is like I think well if he wasn't around I would do this and do that...but would I???


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## highwood (Jan 12, 2012)

Someone posted on another thread that just because you are in a not great marriage why does that mean you have to stop working on yourself it does not...why not work on yourself, get to the point where you feel great and then see what you want at that point.

SOmetimes too if we are honest with ourself we are not perfect either and I am sure I do thinks that annoy the heck out of him.


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## Irishsoul (Feb 17, 2014)

highwood said:


> I know I gripe and natter at him for stupid things...some people int his world are dealing with serious life issues and I am griping about petty stuff.
> 
> He is a good provider has always been a hard worker and I think he feels that when he comes home after working 12 hour days for sometimes weeks on end that he is not appreciated. I do feel guilty that the poor guy I think feels like he is not wanted at home, that he is in the way.
> 
> It is true what you said...I think I am not happy with myself and I take it out on him...but who is stopping me from working on myself definently not him but myself. It is like I think well if he wasn't around I would do this and do that...but would I???





highwood said:


> Someone posted on another thread that just because you are in a not great marriage why does that mean you have to stop working on yourself it does not...why not work on yourself, get to the point where you feel great and then see what you want at that point.
> 
> SOmetimes too if we are honest with ourself we are not perfect either and I am sure I do thinks that annoy the heck out of him.


You guys are like us in that way, like a lot of people. Falling into a rut or groove and it's hard to get out of it. Most of us would love to go out and change the world or have big life changing or inspiring adventures, but we are so damn tired from the work a day lives we have to live in order to survive. Do you work? Do you have time to do things to invigorate yourself? That's another thing that kids bring. Huge time commitment. Like I said, be careful if you don't have kids, because if you get preggers and have a child, well, the mundane can potentially turn to misery real quickly.


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## Irishsoul (Feb 17, 2014)

SlowlyGettingWiser said:


> Irish,
> 
> Have you gone to Individualized Counseling?
> 
> ...


Going to wait on this. I think I am a lot closer to this stage in my mind, but being in this forum, even for a short time has helped me immensely. Just getting everything out there and bouncing ideas around, doing introspection, etc. help me get things into perspective. I mean, when I think about it, there is only a very small window in my day when my wife can do things to annoy me (very brief time in the morning and then in the evening...and of course the weekends)....when I actually focus on "managing" how I choose to react to things when I am around her, I actually do quite well, it's just that, it's hard to constantly have "the eye of the tiger" you know what I mean??? When I am en garde against the arrows that my wife can shoot at me. You guys ever watch the "Dog Whisperer"? Silly, but I used to "model" his mind set when I got home to use against my wife's tactics....handle all situations like the pack leader....calm, assertive behavior. If the rest of the pack sense that you've lost control, then chaos ensues....I gotta set the tone and act the way I expect other people to behave....and I still have that kind of dynamic with my wife if I choose to live it...thanks guys, forgot about that. Got to keep that in my mind. I am the pack leader....I am also crazy :lol::smthumbup:....but seriously, it does work, especially if the Mrs. does not see it coming.:sleeping:

And SGW, it's probably not as bad as we make it out to be, that I make it out to be. Regardless of what I have said, for the most part, she is a good mother. She takes tremendous care in making sure she is physically healthy, getting enough physical, mental and social stimulation. We absolutely SMOTHER HER with hugs, kisses and play time. We read books and google for advice. This is all great.

A lot of it has to do with the way she does a lot of things. Our daughter, because of us and in spite of our behavior is a happy, bratty, fun-loving little beauty. I see her behaviors and quirks she imitates from both my wife and I. Her preschool years are beginning and we are still trying to figure it out. I will try to use my methods to slowly effect change for now. Not ready to go nuclear quite just yet. If things start regressing again then, well, I guess I will jump off that bridge when I get there.


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## lifeistooshort (Mar 17, 2013)

So she's a neat freak and control freak but the dishes are always dirty? Hard to reconcile these two.
Now what you're doing is in fact very selfish and cowardly. Let me elaborate: it's possible you two are a poor match and would be better off apart, and if that's how you feel get divorced and coparent. But to tell her she's the biggest mistake of your life to get her to understand you're only there for your daughter is a sh!tty thing to do, and how would you expect her to treat you with that attitude? If you're going to stay for the kids you have to make every effort to treat each other with love and respect; to do otherwise means you're avoiding the tough decisions and consequences of a divorce, you're not making any real effort, and then you get to be a martyr because poor you stayed for the kids. Stay and be decent or leave, but don't stay and be an a$$hole.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Trickster (Nov 19, 2011)

Irish-

My wife and I do most thing different...it drives me crazy...

Like the way she does dishes...she let's the water run the whole time she is washing each dish..drives me crazy...but ...she does the dishes...

We all have little quirks that drive each other crazy...

If you want your marriage to last...you gotta find happiness somewhere, somehow...I am working on that myself..l know without a doubt that I do things that irratate my wife...That's not a reason to get upset...we just do things differently.

Learn acceptance... Try not to be critical...you and I have a long road ahead of us...our wives have to up with us as well...

I have issues I need to fix first...

There is a chance my wife and I will make it as long as I don't put her down...


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## Irishsoul (Feb 17, 2014)

lifeistooshort said:


> So she's a neat freak and control freak but the dishes are always dirty? Hard to reconcile these two.
> Now what you're doing is in fact very selfish and cowardly. Let me elaborate: it's possible you two are a poor match and would be better off apart, and if that's how you feel get divorced and coparent. But to tell her she's the biggest mistake of your life to get her to understand you're only there for your daughter is a sh!tty thing to do, and how would you expect her to treat you with that attitude? If you're going to stay for the kids you have to make every effort to treat each other with love and respect; to do otherwise means you're avoiding the tough decisions and consequences of a divorce, you're not making any real effort, and then you get to be a martyr because poor you stayed for the kids. Stay and be decent or leave, but don't stay and be an a$$hole.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


No cowardly is hiding behind an avatar, dancing around from thread to thread, giving no personal information about yourself, making snarky, ignorant comments and giving crappy advice based on your own shortcomings and anger.....just moronic....Probably major intimacy issues since you don't seem to carry on any real conversations. You like to pretend you have no problems and tell everyone what to do. You know almost zero about me, what I've gone through and what the relationship dynamics are. Just another know-it-all twank who really knows jack and #$%^ and jack left. Either we can have pleasant conversations like grown ups or mind your own business.

*Also, one last thing: Likes received 1306, Likes Given 0 (zero lol)....tells us all we need to know about this knucklehead.*


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## Irishsoul (Feb 17, 2014)

Trickster said:


> Irish-
> 
> My wife and I do most thing different...it drives me crazy...
> 
> ...


Yea, just talking to you and everyone makes me realize that all this stuff going on, well, I invite in, I allow it to affect me, so I have to control all that. It's like that silly thing with vampires (or rogue troll posters), they can only come in if you invite them....same with bad behavior and bad reactions on my part. It's tough to keep my guard up constantly, but if I continue to be the "nice guy" or push over or even the rescuer or hero-type, the pattern will just continue. I have to slowly try and take back as much ground as I can.

Like I said, haven't had a major blow up in a while. I rarely put her down/condescend to her anymore. I know it's counterproductive and just not the right thing to do. Sometimes stuff happens, but, hopefully never again.

Anyway, good advice, thanks. I will try and maintain peace and be patient, work on myself, control what I can. Got to focus on the positive and keep thinking about the family and the long term.


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## Hicks (Jan 14, 2011)

Irish, you shouldnt fight with posters. It will not help you.

Your marriage is not functioning.

This is 50% your fault and 50% your wife's fault.

In order to address the 50% of problems that are her fault, you have to show her the good will of addressing the 50% that are your fault first.

#1, is Parenting. Your wife is who she is. She is the mother of this child. Your job as a father is not to right her wrongs. Look at it this way. What's worse for your child? Having an OCD mother who wants to wash her hands constantly, married to her father, or having an OCD mother who is divorced from the father. Either way, she has an OCD mother.

Every parent on earth disagrees with some aspect of what their wife/husband does regarding parenting.... So this is not unusual.

You have to build her up instead of tearing her down.... That's your starting point.


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## wilderness (Jan 9, 2013)

Hicks said:


> Irish, you shouldnt fight with posters. It will not help you.
> 
> Your marriage is not functioning.
> 
> ...


Not to be argumentative but I don't see a 50/50 breakdown as far as blame goes. I would say the blame is 80/20, the 80% being his wife.


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## Irishsoul (Feb 17, 2014)

Hicks said:


> Irish, you shouldnt fight with posters. It will not help you.
> 
> Your marriage is not functioning. The whole reason I came to this forum was to talk to people not therapists. Do you care to open up and make yourself vulnerable like the rest of us?
> 
> ...


Not fighting with anyone Hicks. Just putting a fool in her place. She lifetoosharts goal isn't to help anyone. She just wants to drop in on other people's conversations and make ignorant smarta$$ comments. She really serves no purpose here in the forum other than to annoy people. As for your comments I appreciate your opinion. Your tone is pretty condescending and you are regurgitating canned advice that sounds like it's right from a book, Not from any life experiences like Trickster. If you care to share personal experiences and discuss things on common ground I would be happy to listen. But if you want to try and preach and talk down to people... well, not really interested.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## lifeistooshort (Mar 17, 2013)

Wow, so my advice of treating each other with love and respect if you choose to stay for your daughter is just to annoy you huh? You're right, stay for your daughter and be an a$$, see how that works for you. I know how it'll go down because my parents did it. It's really easy to see why your marriage sucks, with your holier than thou attitude..... you're soooo incredibly superior to your wife, who should be on her knees thanking the stars you've lowered yourself to stick around. If you want to see a fool you needn't go any farther than your own mirror.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Hicks (Jan 14, 2011)

I think lifeistooshort gave you good advice.
And you are being senslessly foolish.
Calling your wife the biggest mistake of your life, that's hard to fix.


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## lifeistooshort (Mar 17, 2013)

Thanks Hicks, glad someone has their head on straight  

Only an arrogant jerk would not only not see the issue with calling his wife the biggest mistake of his life but would actually defend it. He must be a real peach to live with.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## lenzi (Apr 10, 2012)

Irishsoul said:


> I expect her to realize that what I am telling her is the truth. That the only true reason I am still in the relationship is our daughter. Maybe the slight hope that she will pull her head out. Not sure what your point of reference is lenzi.


Telling her she's the biggest mistake in your life will not cause her to "pull her head out".

It's instigatory and inflammatory. It will only escalate conflict, it is completely nonproductive.



Irishsoul said:


> Not fighting with anyone Hicks. Just putting a fool in her place.


No, you received good advice from this poster. It's contrary to what you want to believe, so you hit back with insults.

The problems in your relationship are clear. Your wife is not completely to blame here.


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## Irishsoul (Feb 17, 2014)

lifeistooshort said:


> Wow, so my advice of treating each other with love and respect if you choose to stay for your daughter is just to annoy you huh? You're right, stay for your daughter and be an a$$, see how that works for you. I know how it'll go down because my parents did it. It's really easy to see why your marriage sucks, with your holier than thou attitude..... you're soooo incredibly superior to your wife, who should be on her knees thanking the stars you've lowered yourself to stick around. If you want to see a fool you needn't go any farther than your own mirror.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Not going to spend too much time with you because you won't get it, but your so-called advice about "love and respect" is fine. Easier said than done. I would rather not take my advice from a rude, immature Trekkie who has probably had 1-2 semi-long term relationships. You give no information about yourself, you've been a member of the forum for about a year, posted a thread once, have over a thousand posts, 1300+ people have "liked" your comments (not sure why) and you have "liked" 0....zero responses. This fact combined with the tone and presentation of nearly all your posts just shows that you are here to almost strictly give "advice", like you are some sort of relationship guru. In short, you like to dish it out, but don't like to take it. No thanks.


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## lenzi (Apr 10, 2012)

Irishsoul said:


> 1300+ people have "liked" your comments (not sure why) and you have "liked" 0....zero responses. This fact combined with the tone and presentation of nearly all your posts just shows that you are here to almost strictly give "advice", like you are some sort of relationship guru. In short, you like to dish it out, but don't like to take it. No thanks.


With all those "likes" obviously the posts have been well received.

Just because a person doesn't post their own story doesn't make them any less qualified to offer their advice. 

If you check my back posts you won't see my story on here either. You could draw the incorrect conclusion that I too, am only here to dispense advice, and label me as a relationship guru of sorts. But that would be wrong. I've been through a messy divorce and everything that goes with it. I learn from every post that I read, whether I agree or disagree with what is written.

And I've got a ton of "likes" as well, and I don't give out all that many "likes". Not sure why that's even relevant?

You're very argumentative.

Why not take a deep breath and stop throwing out insults and assumptions about people who are taking their valuable time to post on your thread?


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## Hicks (Jan 14, 2011)

It's free advice. If you don't like it, ignore it... Don't demean the person giving it to you. That's rude.

I'm sure alot of qualified professionals will be on soon to confirm to you that telling your wife she's the biggest mistake of your life was a great way to fix your situation.


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## Irishsoul (Feb 17, 2014)

lenzi said:


> Telling her she's the biggest mistake in your life will not cause her to "pull her head out".
> 
> It's instigatory and inflammatory. It will only escalate conflict, it is completely nonproductive.
> 
> ...


Of course she isn't the only one at fault. But most posts start out that way and people tend to only tell their side of the story at first then the reality of the situation starts to reveal itself, that's the way it usually works.....

let's see, everyone gets angry, blows up, says things they regret....nothing new there......we are all human and imperfect

lenzi....so LTS's canned advice was good, but even though we are online, we are all people here right? I could have withheld information and tried to present myself in a better light, but falsely. I choose not to do that. So if I expose myself, my life, my experiences in an honest way the least any member here can do do in return is address people in a respectful and friendly manner. Open yourself up, be vulnerable, share experiences. If I wanted someone to dole out advice (which pretty much all of it is wrote and canned stuffed anyway) I would have employed a therapist. I am not here for that. I am here to talk to people like me who are having issues and want to share practical experiences.

*I know in a forum like this there will be a certain percentage of people who are of the "amateur therapist" variety and like to give out advice dryly and semi-anonymously. That's fine, I can deal with that. But when someone who has questionable qualifications, experience and motives pulls that crap and does it in a ridiculously cavalier and rude manner, well I don't have the time or patience for someone like that.*

I really do appreciate your advice, but I would take you or anyone else more seriously and more to heart if you would care to open up and exchange information and advice in a way that facilitates communication and exchange.

*I think most of the people are aware of the principals of maintain successful relationships *as most of them are simple pieces of common sense. But *I think most of us here get "lost" in our relationships at times* *and we go through periods where we can't see the forest through the trees. *But in talking with people like Trickster and wilderness, we can share common experiences and kind of help each other find the way out.

I think this is true with most anyone who posts in any forum like this, but the presentation of experiences and details tends to be exaggerated and biased towards the posters opinion. Since we tend to focus on the bad stuff (problems) it seems like our relationships are a "dumpster fire", when in reality 80-90 percent of the interaction is fine, there are just some problem areas that need to be addressed.

And as far as my wife's sensibilities and our "rough" arguments, she's fine and can handled herself. She gives it to me as much as I give it to her. Not to get into it too much right now, but we are from similar cultures. We blow up, we say outrageous things to one another, it blows over/we apologize to each other and move on/hit the reset button. Live and learn.

And it's in this, my dialogue and conversations with good souls like yourself, Trickster and wilderness that I realize that what I am making into a mountain and feeling overwhelmed by is just quite possibly a molehill that just needs a few tweaks here and there. More kind words and gestures, a more confident presence at home, giving myself more respect, focusing on the positives, etc. It's the little things that make a difference and it all adds up.

Also, I probably exaggerated about my wife's hand washing and potential OCD. Maybe she only washes her hands 15-20 times a day (the rest of the time it's hand wipes lol). She is a neat freak though. Maybe not the sink and dirty dishes, but most everything she cares about is military clean.


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## Irishsoul (Feb 17, 2014)

Hicks said:


> It's free advice. If you don't like it, ignore it... Don't demean the person giving it to you. That's rude.
> 
> I'm sure alot of qualified professionals will be on soon to confirm to you that telling your wife she's the biggest mistake of your life was a great way to fix your situation.


It's in the past. I am talking about things and incidents that happened over a year ago. Be rude, get treated rudely. If someone demeans me in the way they talk, it will get reflected back. If I choose to save time and cut out the innuendo, my choice. Treat people respectfully and you usually get treated with respect.


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## lenzi (Apr 10, 2012)

Irishsoul said:


> lenzi....so LTS's canned advice was good, but even though we are online, we are all people here right?


I don't view LTS's advice as "canned". Its specific for your situation and it's delivered in a very personal and emotional fashion.

I also happen to agree with it. 

Yes people say things in anger that they don't necessarily mean, but your comment that your wife was the biggest mistake you ever made was completely over the top, and furthermore you defend yourself by saying that it was done intentionally to get her head out of her a$$ (or words to that effect). You don't seem to realize that a comment like that will only drive her further away it won't suddenly make her see the light.

Is this a canned response too? Or insulting in any way?


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## Irishsoul (Feb 17, 2014)

lenzi said:


> With all those "likes" obviously the posts have been well received.
> 
> Just because a person doesn't post their own story doesn't make them any less qualified to offer their advice.
> 
> ...


Getting a post "liked" is not very hard, don't kid yourself. Read my other post to you, says everything. I'm fine though, but thanks for your concern. I didn't start this, please keep that in mind.


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## Irishsoul (Feb 17, 2014)

lenzi said:


> I don't view LTS's advice as "canned". Its specific for your situation and it's delivered in a very personal and emotional fashion.
> 
> I also happen to agree with it.
> 
> ...


I think I just said it was in the past....my wife and I have already discussed it. I was upset when I posted and made that statement, let's move on. Read the whole post, and as you say, take a deep breathe and wait about 10-15 minutes, then post. I 'm not going to go petty tit for tat with you.


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## Irishsoul (Feb 17, 2014)

lifeistooshort said:


> Thanks Hicks, glad someone has their head on straight
> 
> Only an arrogant jerk would not only not see the issue with calling his wife the biggest mistake of his life but would actually defend it. *He must be a real peach to live with.*
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


And only an ignorant person would think that an entire situation can be surmised by reading a thread and having no dialogue with that person and trying to solve their problems in a snarky one paragraph answer.

And no, unlike you and your marriage, I am not perfect and I have many issues to overcome, but I am not fake and shallow either.


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## lenzi (Apr 10, 2012)

Irishsoul said:


> Getting a post "liked" is not very hard, don't kid yourself. Read my other post to you, says everything. I'm fine though, but thanks for your concern. I didn't start this, please keep that in mind.


You received a post that was critical of you, based on what you posted about your situation. The poster suggested that your actions are cowardly and selfish and there was a suggestion that you're acting like an A$$hole to your wife. 

You responded to this poster with a virtual barrage of insults including the word "know it all twank" and suggesting they have intimacy issues because of the way they post, and that they are a knucklehead and a moron who gives crappy, ignorant and snarky advice. 

It's uncalled for. Especially given that they took their time to read your story, try to understand it, and give you heartfelt advice. You took it as some sort of an attack and responded in kind. I'd be tempted to say that you probably react this way to your wife and it results in unnecessary fighting but I won't say that because you'd probably just call me a whole bunch of names and say that my advice is canned or something.


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## Hicks (Jan 14, 2011)

Occasionally people come here and fight with the posters who are trying to help them. Why they do this, I really don't know.

The thing that you get with "unprofessional" adivce....... You are not going to have people telling you what you want to hear. 

That is very valuable, since most "face to face" advice is filtered down, said and done in such a way as the "giver" is seeking approval from the "receiver" or whatever....

If you allow people to advise you, you will get valuable advice. You will also probably get crappy advice. And, in the real world, you get to pick what advice to use. Shutting down anyone does not help you.


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## Irishsoul (Feb 17, 2014)

lenzi said:


> You received a post that was critical of you, based on what you posted about your situation. The poster suggested that your actions are cowardly and selfish and there was a suggestion that you're acting like an A$$hole to your wife.
> 
> You responded to this poster with a virtual barrage of insults including the word "know it all twank" and suggesting they have intimacy issues because of the way they post, and that they are a knucklehead and a moron who gives crappy, ignorant and snarky advice.
> 
> It's uncalled for. Especially given that they took their time to read your story, try to understand it, and give you heartfelt advice. You took it as some sort of an attack and responded in kind. I'd be tempted to say that you probably react this way to your wife and it results in unnecessary fighting but I won't say that because you'd probably just call me a whole bunch of names and say that my advice is canned or something.


This is what I mean by innuendo. It's obvious. If someone infers that: you are a liar, a coward, an a-hole, etc....isn't that essentially calling someone names, insulting them, borderline harassment? Abuse? It's rhetorical so you don't need to answer.

It would be like me saying "lenzi giving advice without knowing someone's full background is moronic and people who give advice without giving some of their back story is asinine....how is this different than if I just calling you a moron or an a$$???

The only problem you guys have with me is that I tend not to use innuendos. I tend to be more direct. This is typical passive aggressive behavior where someone subtly demeans or insults someone. People can hide behind these tactics and behaviors and you can call it "emotional and direct" or whatever you said. It's still insulting, demeaning and a form of harassment.


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## Irishsoul (Feb 17, 2014)

Hicks said:


> Occasionally people come here and fight with the posters who are trying to help them. Why they do this, I really don't know.
> 
> The thing that you get with "unprofessional" advice....... You are not going to have people telling you what you want to hear.
> 
> ...


Hicks, I right here, you don't have to talk about me in 3rd person lol...oohhh the poor misinformed new guy, again with this innuendo crap.

I can deal with good and bad advice, but it's pretty simple. *Just don't be rude and insulting and usually you will be treated the same way. It's the Golden Rule right? Treat others as you would want to be treated. At least that is what I was hoping when I signed up here. My only mistake is that I treated a rude person with rudeness an lowered myself.* Maybe I overreacted a bit, but I did not cast the first stone to be sure.

It doesn't matter that I am a new poster here. All of you have very little idea about me, my education, background, marriage, etc. Just because I am new doesn't mean I shouldn't be treated with respect, no matter what I said to my wife or what she said to me a long time ago. To do so is to be ill-informed to say the least.


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## lifeistooshort (Mar 17, 2013)

Ha ha, there was nothing passive aggressive about my post. I think it was quite direct; for someone that claims to be direct you don't take it very well but you have no problem dishing it out. Did poor baby get his feelings hurt? Don't solicit advice if you're going to throw a tantrum when you don't like what you hear. Or at least preface your post with "anyone that's critical of me will be the recipient of a two year old like tantrum". 
The irony is that through your responses to me you've given everyone a good idea of how you interact with your wife, but your as the victim don't want to hear it.
FYI: I'm quite happily married.....how's yours working for you? I'll give you a hint: you're on TAM throwing.a tantrum.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Irishsoul (Feb 17, 2014)

Also, my darkest, most embarrassing moments that I have been brave enough to share doesn't define me as a person, so it doesn't mean I am an a$$hole. And caring about my daughter enough to fight through some adversity doesn't mean I am a martyr. And trying to work things out, doesn't mean I am a coward....and as I type this, how is any of this constructive or helpful again?:scratchhead:.......Just more dark and negative feelings and thoughts. Really trying stay away from darkside and go towards the "light"


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## Irishsoul (Feb 17, 2014)

wilderness said:


> Not to be argumentative but I don't see a 50/50 breakdown as far as blame goes. I would say the blame is 80/20, the 80% being his wife.


wilderness, thanks for that, but in reality it is probably 50/50. I chose how I react to things. Just like with this situation I got baited into a confrontation with someone who is working through their own hostility issues in the guise of helping others. Should have just ignored it.


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## lifeistooshort (Mar 17, 2013)

Interesting that you are upset because I inferred something about you based on what you posted, but you've inferred that I must have hostility issues because I said something you didn't like. As I said, you can dish it out but can't take it. Given how off the deep end you went over one comment, I'd say it's you that has hostility issues, and probably some misogyny going on.
I'll bow out now, as it's clear you're invested in throwing a fit instead of listening and discussing. Believe it or not I hope you can work this out and I wish you luck. I wasn't trying you bait you, I was trying you help, and for someone that claims to be direct you get worked up very easily. Probably with your wife too.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Irishsoul (Feb 17, 2014)

lifeistooshort said:


> Interesting that you are upset because I inferred something about you based on what you posted, but you've inferred that I must have hostility issues because I said something you didn't like. As I said, you can dish it out but can't take it. Given how off the deep end you went over one comment, I'd say it's you that has hostility issues, and probably some misogyny going on.
> I'll bow out now, as it's clear you're invested in throwing a fit instead of listening and discussing. Believe it or not I hope you can work this out and I wish you luck. I wasn't trying you bait you, I was trying you help, and for someone that claims to be direct you get worked up very easily. Probably with your wife too.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


What are you talking about? You keep saying this dumb coment "dish it out, but can't take it" which a dumb thing to argue about anyway, but we are going back and forth, so obviously "dishing" and "taking" so...just...weird. And being direct and getting worked up are mutually exclusive. Not sure why you are trying to tie them together, but yea, okay whatever. Thank you for your well wishes, your "help" and that last, subtle PA dig. Just could not help yourself I guess.


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## Irishsoul (Feb 17, 2014)

lifeistooshort said:


> Geez, you're paranoid. I bet aliens are out to get you too.
> With every post you make it becomes clearer to everyone that you're a nutjob. Get back on your medication.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Guess you would know about that stuff Nex Gen. I will leave the misdiagnosis to you and yours.

It becomes clearer and clearer that someone with your temperament should be in the spay & neuter business rather than "helping" people with your terrific advice. Here's another "like" for you.:smthumbup:


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## Irishsoul (Feb 17, 2014)

Outta here guys. Trickster, wilderness, good luck. Watch out for the Wicked Queen B.


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## Irishsoul (Feb 17, 2014)

Just show me how to delete my account and we will all be happier I am sure.


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## lenzi (Apr 10, 2012)

Irishsoul said:


> This is what I mean by innuendo. It's obvious. If someone infers that: you are a liar, a coward, an a-hole, etc....isn't that essentially calling someone names, insulting them, borderline harassment? Abuse? It's rhetorical so you don't need to answer.


I do feel the need to answer. If nothing else it's a good subject for debate. I don't where it was inferred that you were a liar, but as far as the coward and a-hole comments go, see my response below. No, I do not think that it's abuse or harassment in the context of the thread, which was a subjective evaluation of your actions as you have described them.



Irishsoul said:


> It would be like me saying "lenzi giving advice without knowing someone's full background is moronic and people who give advice without giving some of their back story is asinine....how is this different than if I just calling you a moron or an a$$???


I think it's totally different. 

You posted a story looking for advice and feedback. As others have suggested, you are not going to receive professional advice from a qualified therapist. You don't know what you're going to get. Another poster stated that your actions were cowardly and you were "acting like an a-hole". 

They're not outright calling you an a-hole and a coward, they're evaluating your actions based on your own description of your situation.

That's not the same thing as a poster who has received such advice from a well meaning advice giver, and turning around and blasting the advice giver with several insults and assumptions about them based on nothing more than conjecture, who was not looking for feedback and who has taken their valuable time to read the story and construct a post that is meant as useful advice.



Irishsoul said:


> If I was as messed up as she claims I am, then would a person who truly cares about other people just lash out at me like that?...she's pretty good at it too.


She didn't just "lash out at you". She got mad at you because you insulted her numerous times and she was just trying to help. And yes, her initial post that got you mad was made with some emotion on her part, obviously she related to your wife and it triggered her to some extent and she reacted. But she was not being abusive or harassing you. Big difference. 

I could see where this may happen with your wife. She says something you feel is insulting, belittling, abusive, harassing, so you verbally hit back and tell her she's the biggest mistake of your life. The cycle perpetuates. Don't get so defensive. 

Break the cycle.


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## Irishsoul (Feb 17, 2014)

lenzi said:


> I do feel the need to answer. If nothing else it's a good subject for debate. I don't where it was inferred that you were a liar, but as far as the coward and a-hole comments go, see my response below. No, I do not think that it's abuse or harassment in the context of the thread, which was a subjective evaluation of your actions as you have described them.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


It's all good. I actually reported the initial post last night, still waiting for a reply....yep, still waiting. Also tells me a little bit about the forum. Inmates are kind of running things here. I just PMed an admin to help airlift me out. Will do so when I have the opportunity.

You don't know what you are talking about. For instance, if you are in a public setting, like work (or a forum) and someone hears part of a story you are telling someone else (but not the whole story) and publicly states in front everyone and says "you're an a-hole a coward for doing that." Whatever. Now if a supervisor hears that 2nd part, you don't think that person uttering the insults and abusive terms is in trouble???

We are just going round and round and just wasting each others time.

And please, she was giving back as much as I was giving it. To even suggest she was defending herself is just a joke. Enough of this nonsense.

And the "lashing out" thing was humor as was your feigned concern for LTS's behavior.

Liar part was, I think, when she pretty much said that my claims that my wife had OCD didn't jive because of a dirty sink??? Seems like it was said so long ago lol. Anyway, that was brilliant analysis as well on her part. Can't refute that.


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## Irishsoul (Feb 17, 2014)

Well, I can't delete my account so let's just let this thread sink to the bottom and we will all go on with our lives. Besides, however this forum works, it cured me! I am not sure how, but I think I realized that if I get a divorce and have to find someone new I could end up trapped with someone like LTS!!!:banghead: Yikes!

Scared straight!:rofl:


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## lenzi (Apr 10, 2012)

Irishsoul said:


> You don't know what you are talking about.


See that's an insult. And unnecessary. You could have just said, "I disagree with your opinion". But instead it's "you don't know what you're talking about". Do you see the difference? 



Irishsoul said:


> For instance, if you are in a public setting, like work (or a forum) and someone hears part of a story you are telling someone else (but not the whole story) and publicly states in front everyone and says "you're an a-hole a coward for doing that."


But it's not "part of a story overheard at work that others are discussing", it's in response to reading YOUR story, as YOU told it. Now if you left out parts that would give a different meaning, that's on you. People who respond can only base their responses on the information that is offered. Sure it's a flawed system but it's all we got. 



Irishsoul said:


> Whatever. Now if a supervisor hears that 2nd part, you don't think that person uttering the insults and abusive terms is in trouble???


Don't know what you mean about the person uttering insults and abusive terms being in trouble.



Irishsoul said:


> We are just going round and round and just wasting each others time.


I've found this to be one of the more interesting threads on here today. 



Irishsoul said:


> And please, she was giving back as much as I was giving it.


Before it deteriorated to insults flinging in both ways she was a well meaning advise giver and you were hitting back because you took her critical advise as an insult. Ultimately you pissed her off and the whole thing turned into a 3rd grade shouting match. 



Irishsoul said:


> To even suggest she was defending herself is just a joke. Enough of this nonsense.


Did I say she was defending herself? Don't recall that. Even if she WAS defending herself, so what? That's what people do when they get attacked. They get defensive. Sometimes they go on the offense and they start calling people names (that's what you did on this thread).



Irishsoul said:


> And the "lashing out" thing was humor as was your feigned concern for LTS's behavior.


No, that was not my intent at all. I was completely serious, no humor, and no feigned concern for her behavior. 



Irishsoul said:


> Liar part was, I think, when she pretty much said that my claims that my wife had OCD didn't jive because of a dirty sink???


She's not calling you a liar! She's saying that perhaps the diagnosis was incorrect based on one or more of your wife's behaviors. Notice that you immediately think you're being attacked when it doesn't appear to be anything of the sort.


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## lifeistooshort (Mar 17, 2013)

lenzi said:


> See that's an insult. And unnecessary. You could have just said, "I disagree with your opinion". But instead it's "you don't know what you're talking about". Do you see the difference?
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Lenzi, I tip my hat to your patience with this guy. He is a tantrum throwing two year old; geez, if me suggesting there might be a different take on things equates to me calling him a liar (which you're right, I did nothing of the sort- in fact that word doesn't appear in any of my posts) I can just imagine what it's like for his wife to try to deal with him.

It's true it did degenerate into name calling, that can happen around here. My posts pale in comparison to some of the posts around here, heck I've gotten way worse myself. I did give it right back, the difference is that I didn't report anything. I can fight like a woman and don't need to cry to mama (ahem, moderators) when my feelings get hurt.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Trickster (Nov 19, 2011)

"Like"

I wish there was a "thank you" icon...
So many times I hate ...oops... I may not like what a poster may say, but I appreciate their opinion and the time they took to post. ....just a simple way to say thanks as well as like...


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## Trickster (Nov 19, 2011)

Irishsoul said:


> Well, I can't delete my account so let's just let this thread sink to the bottom and we will all go on with our lives. Besides, however this forum works, it cured me! I am not sure how, but I think I realized that if I get a divorce and have to find someone new I could end up trapped with someone like LTS!!!:banghead: Yikes!
> 
> Scared straight!:rofl:


Your not going anywher....you are stuck here for a while.

Thanks Irish...I am happy that I was able to help...finally...

I called my wife an idiot...I know...not the smartest thing to do.

We celebrate Hanukkah and Christmas...It was almost Christmas and we didn't have any presents..So we discussed what we were going to get our daughter..Some of which were board games...So she comes back a couple hours later and said to our daughter.."hey sweety, come see what we have for you...". I was so mad...said some mean things that I don't remember and called her an idiot..

Yes I regret saying that....I am better than that. I know what I is like to say thinks in the heat of the moment.


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## Trickster (Nov 19, 2011)

Irish, I am trying to keep up here,

I know you say what's on your mind with honesty...there are many hurt people on this forum and I expect to get ambushed... I am OK with that. It opens my mind about where I may be wrong..

From your first posts, I know you really don't want to Divorce... Your just thinking out loud. It's normal to defend yourself when you feel you are being ambushed... The ones who have been here a while understand that..

I think about D all the time...D is the easy way out... Sometimes words get twisted on here...I know I may not articulate all what I want to say to get my point across...

You are here to fix the 10% of the marriage that is messed up...That should be the focus..to help with that 10%

Everybody wants to help...some want you to realize that you have to fix your part first...that's all you have controlled over...

I never got the impression that you thought you were perfect. I'll go back and read some more..I had a long work day...I just had to fix my daughter an ice cream cone for dessert...


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## Irishsoul (Feb 17, 2014)

lifeistooshort said:


> Lenzi, I tip my hat to your patience with this guy. He is a tantrum throwing two year old; geez, if me suggesting there might be a different take on things equates to me calling him a liar (which you're right, I did nothing of the sort- in fact that word doesn't appear in any of my posts) I can just imagine what it's like for his wife to try to deal with him.
> 
> It's true it did degenerate into name calling, that can happen around here. My posts pale in comparison to some of the posts around here, heck I've gotten way worse myself. I did give it right back, the difference is that I didn't report anything. I can fight like a woman and don't need to cry to mama (ahem, moderators) when my feelings get hurt.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Well at first I thought you were a guy or gay guy posing as a woman and it kind of freaked me out, and that is an honest to God truth, not meant to insult you. Then, by the time I realized you were probably really an angry woman (went and read your posts), well, it was too late. So it wasn't about getting feeling hurt, it was just that you are kind of weird and angry so I just wanted you to stop.

Oh, btw, in pming with some your buddies here, they let me know in a sense, that part of him (oops) agrees with me, but there is an obvious double standard where women can act nutso/rude/dumb and you just have to put up with it and I was like "oh yea, that's what's going on"...so you are right, proceed with your weak comebacks and insults and we will all nod our heads in awe.


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