# I think she doesn't even like me.



## Workingdad (Aug 21, 2009)

I've been married with my current wife for about 9 years. We met while I was still with my first wife and mother of my first 3 kids. My reason for straying at the time was that my wife (then) would spend all day playing video games and neglect our children while I worked 12-15 hr days to support us. She even put on my 2yr old son's bunny suit backwards so he couldn't take it off when his diaper was filled with poop while he and his twin were locked in a room behind a child barrier gate watching videos continuously while she played. So, in spite of my best efforts to stay in the marriage with her I strayed and found my current wife. My first wife was willing in the sex and general affection department but knowing how she was treating our kids I could barely stand to look at her. In addition to the above she would also drink beer daily.
So along comes my current wife. It was her dream to be a stay-at-home-wife, even with someone else’s kids and we hit it off well enough to get married after a year of living together while the divorce was processed. We had what she said was the “wedding of her dreams” but that night she was distant and seemed to just want to get the consummation over with. Once we were married the sex went from 2/week to 1/week and the level of involvement diminished on her face. I always enjoyed rubbing her feet while we watched tv and would rarely pass her by without a hand on her waist or a kiss. Problem was she would never reciprocate on the touching. We began to have arguments about it and she said she didn’t want to touch me because it “would lead to sex” and she wasn’t interested in that more than once weekly (Saturday night between 8:30 and 10:30). Then she said she’s just not a “touchy person”. I told her if she never touched me on her own I would eventually stop reaching out to her and it would end up being a problem for our marriage but she stuck to her actions. Now we never touch.
Our sex has diminished progressively both in frequency and quality. She always finishes within 5 or 10 minutes and says it becomes uncomfortable for her so I rush. Foreplay is lights off manual and she either stares at the ceiling or keeps her eyes closed until she’s ready. There is no kissing in my life except in the morning before I leave for work and at night just before we go to sleep. During the day there is never any physical contact of any kind.
Even though we have a child of our own together I can’t help but think she’s in it for the money since she’s most concerned with making it past 10 years so long term alimony is guaranteed in our state.
I know this is long but I don’t have any friends to talk with it about and would appreciate some banter.
I have plenty of other relevant info if it would help.


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## preso (May 1, 2009)

Sounds to me like she's in it for the money too and also is the fact, she met you while you were cheating, so chances are she is hoping you cheat again so she can divorce you.


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## preso (May 1, 2009)

Good women do not marry men who are cheating on their wives.


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## Heidiw (Jul 2, 2009)

I agree with Preso on this. Now you just have to figure out if it is worth staying in the marriage anymore.


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## preso (May 1, 2009)

When I met my husband, if he was still married
I don't care if he was stuffed with gold and spitting out gold 
nuggests, how hot he was...
I would have stopped seeing him.... MORE SO IF HE WAS CHEATING !!!

I would have had to have been crazy to do such a dis-service to myself than allow someone like that into my life. I don't care how much he cleaned, how many roses he bought me, what he said as actions speak louder than words and in the case of cheating, those actions say it all.
You will get what you deserve and it does not sound like you will 
pass any merit awards in the eyes of the lord or your old wife or new one. 
That you describe yourself as so perfect and seem to think that makes it ok that you met your now wife while you were cheating...
I can see though that
and so could any good woman worth marrying.
Guess your going to have to suffer as you made several bad choices and there will be no reward of love for those actions.

Not meaning to be harsh but thats just kinda how things are
with cheating and cheaters.


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## euphoria (May 31, 2009)

Not sure I agree. She could have her masters in half of that time and be earning decent money. In 8 she could have her m.d. and make even more. Why would she stay with a man she didn't love for 10? Are you a billionaire or something? I am guessing no.

Point is, I would imagine she cares about you tremendously. Just from a woman's perspective - she was willing to marry you and raise your 3 children, that must count. Sounds like you also have children as a result of this marriage. So just from a woman's perspective this is what I am seeing. A stay at home mom with 4 or more children who probably needs a break. Poor woman probably wants to get sex over with so she can rest, lol. No but really..have you tried spending some undivided attention with her? At least 2 hours per day? Yeah, sounds like a lot..but it works. It doesn't have to be out either. As long as it is undivided attention you could be home cooking, cleaning, watching a movie, anything. Just spending time together trying to meet each others needs. Find out what her needs are. Sounds as if she had the dream of being a perfect wife. Maybe she has burnt herself out trying and needs someone to think about her needs for a while. So I would suggest:1. Spending min. 2 hr per day together, 2. finding out what her top 3 needs are (sexual, emotional, domestic, recreational, financial) and trying your best to fulfill those needs. In the meantime cut back on any behavior that she doesn't like. Or else the needfilling will be like pouring water into a bucket with holes.

Worth a try right?

Stop making disrespectful judgements and try to rekindle your love.


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## euphoria (May 31, 2009)

Another thought. Considering how you met, she may be worried that you have begun to cheat on her. I would work on reassuring her on that as well. 

Its a bad way to start a marriage, but it is your marriage so you need to try to fix it.


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## NothingMan (Jul 16, 2009)

euphoria said:


> Not sure I agree. She could have her masters in half of that time and be earning decent money. In 8 she could have her m.d. and make even more. Why would she stay with a man she didn't love for 10? Are you a billionaire or something? I am guessing no.
> 
> Point is, I would imagine she cares about you tremendously. Just from a woman's perspective - she was willing to marry you and raise your 3 children, that must count. Sounds like you also have children as a result of this marriage. So just from a woman's perspective this is what I am seeing. A stay at home mom with 4 or more children who probably needs a break. Poor woman probably wants to get sex over with so she can rest, lol. No but really..have you tried spending some undivided attention with her? At least 2 hours per day? Yeah, sounds like a lot..but it works. It doesn't have to be out either. As long as it is undivided attention you could be home cooking, cleaning, watching a movie, anything. Just spending time together trying to meet each others needs. Find out what her needs are. Sounds as if she had the dream of being a perfect wife. Maybe she has burnt herself out trying and needs someone to think about her needs for a while. So I would suggest:1. Spending min. 2 hr per day together, 2. finding out what her top 3 needs are (sexual, emotional, domestic, recreational, financial) and trying your best to fulfill those needs. In the meantime cut back on any behavior that she doesn't like. Or else the needfilling will be like pouring water into a bucket with holes.
> 
> ...



You didnt just feed him the "she's tired" excuse did ya? I agree with preso..something sinister is afoot at the circle K.



John


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## Workingdad (Aug 21, 2009)

Thanks for the responses. I'll fill in a bit more.
I've always considered her to be an angel for saving my kids and myself from what I believed to be certain ruin. Having grown up in the ghetto and seen and experienced both neglect and mental/physical abuse I was pretty sure what my kids were in for with the first wife.
The time has always been and continues to be a problem for both of us.
I'm a very patient man. I can wait years for some things. I completed 9th grade and that's it. I worked my way into being the owner of a multi-million dollar a year corporation by dedication and sacrifice, not education. For at least 20 years while everyone my age was making friends and partying I was working. I figured if I logged more actual work I would gain knowledge faster than my co-workers so I worked all weekends and holidays possible on any shift and usually 12-18 hrs a day. This was who I became before I had children. I need for my children to have the security, in all ways, that I was denied as a child.
When we met I was working my way into a partnership via sweat equity and it was the hardest I'd worked in my life. It was essential that I create something solid and sustainable for my family. Something they would have when I was gone, something denied me by my family. As it turned out the partner I had was corrupt and stole from me. Business conditions indicated it would be impossible to recover what was taken so I ended up starting my own business closer to home. It's been unbelievably hard but we're now nearing the place when within a few years (if I don't screw up) I'll be able to take every weekend off and only work 8 hrs a day. In all of this she's had my back. She's cared for my children and our child better that I could have. My dad left when I was 1.5 years old and I spent my first 13 years of life living in the projects with a mom on welfare. My wife has never experienced this. Her mom was a stay-at-home and her dad had a nice secure job with a big corporation in the mid-west and she grew up in a safe environment and attended college so she doesn't exactly understand my fear. Her dad's job no longer exists, it's been outsourced to china and that kind of situation is becoming less common every day.
Our problems started early on with her demanding that I be home for dinner every night and never work weekends. I did my best and sometimes was successful. When I lost a manager that was allowing me to be home weekends I had to take over responsibility while I looked for his replacement which took over a year to find. During this time she had already accused me of cheating and sometimes with my ex (a person I find disgusting on every level for what she'd done to my children) if she couldn't reach me on my cell. Remember that I work in manufacturing and am frequently in very loud areas. She had a very strong paranoia that I'd kick her out and reconcile with the ex and nothing I could say would convince her otherwise. The cheating accusations have been the one constant in our communication and I can understand them to a degree because I cheated with her and as she said I "have a track record". Nevermind the fact that many times I can't get ahold of her because "it was loud and my phone was in my purse" or "I forgot my phone at home". She even took trips out of state yearly with her college girlfriends for 4 or 5 days and was never questioned or accused by me. I had already trusted her with the most important things (my kids) so why not trust her with our marriage.
I could probably have reasons to suspect. When we'd be fighting about my work schedule she'd sometimes reference her ex-boss. A married guy who spent every weekend home, was there for dinner every night, was always clean and wore a suit, lived in the best area of town and drove a nice car. The guy she said she never had a relationship with (because he was married) but who she's in pictures with at parties Him sitting on a couch and her laying in his arms, both of them drinking. When it was toughest for me (with the partner who’d stolen from me) she even suggested that I change careers to be in sales like him. My age, lack of education, looks and my current financial requirements made something like that improbable. As a back story he lost his job and was out of work nearly 3 years so his family went through their entire savings and he now makes less than before, works much more and has no savings to fall back on.
Thru all of this when the fights would get bad she’d say that she fears for her security and I’d respond that I would not contest her in the event of a divorce because I couldn’t even begin to put a price on her saving my kids from certain (or nearly certain) ruin.
One of our problems is that she’s always compared me to her friend’s husbands who work in jobs with holidays and weekends off. They don’t make as much as I and they’re always critical of what their wives spend (and frequently fight about it) but they’re home weekends. She spends at least 2 hrs on facebook and her blog every day and expects me to vacuum after my 12 hr day “like they do”. How reasonable is that? "Here's an apple, make me some orange juice". I never question or complain about what she spends, never have. I tell her that money is only good for freedom of choice and I want those around me to have not just what they need but what they want. I work so they can choose what to wear, drive, see, and experience. When her friends can’t afford to visit I suggest she send them a plane ticket. When a friend had a child with a health problem and was having trouble with paying for the necessary treatment I said she should offer to pay for it. I’m not a saint by any means but if you have the money and someone has the need (whatever it is) I feel you’re obligated to do what you can. I can always make more money but you can’t give a child a replacement spine.
It’s easy for some to judge on the cheating thing, especially if they haven’t found themselves in a similar situation. I’ll say that my first marriage was over long before I cheated and the only dishonesty from me was in waiting until I found someone else. She has no reason to feel anything less than an angel for entering our lives and to see it otherwise is to say the world is black and white, not the shades of gray it really is.
So why the constant accusations of cheating? If I’m doing my best what more can I do? It takes time to work yourself into a position of leisure. Once the kids were in school she had every day to do what she wants and no restrictions on spending or accusations of cheating. She certainly has the time to develop a relationship with someone else, is this what’s happened? On our last 2 vacation drives she spent at least 40% of every drive (we were towing a trailer and I did all the driving) doing things on her iphone, either typing or playing a game. Very little dialogue with me or the kids. Has she already tuned out and is she preparing for her next relationship? We have less than 1.5 years before we reach 10 years. Facebook seems to have become a compulsion for her. Personally, I think real life is more important.


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## preso (May 1, 2009)

Workingdad said:


> So why the constant accusations of cheating? .




Are you really asking that?

:rofl:


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## Workingdad (Aug 21, 2009)

In response to Euphoria, I certainly understand her needing a break but there's only so much I can do. I asked her to be patient and she would have plenty of free time when the kids are in school (something I could not have) but she wanted it now. I've always seen marriage as many things but above all a partnership where each does his/her best, whatever that is. If I'm already doing my best what more can I do? If she has time to facebook, blog, go to the gym and spend time hobbying and expects me to vacuum after my 12 hr day how should I respond?
In the times when we can sit and watch a movie she says nothing about us or our day and sometimes takes time to text or whatever on her iphone. I never ask her about that (respecting her privacy and never look at her messages but it sure makes me wonder just how interested she is.
The behavior she doesn't like most is my working but what can I do about it right now? Anyone noticed the economy lately? About 4 years ago (in response to my saying that I was under constant pressure to make sure there was money to pay the bills and not lose our house) she said "I never asked for any of this" then about a year ago, shortly after a 2 week trip to Hawaii for the whole family she said "you've never let the family down so I trust that you'll always do what's best for us financially". Off handed compliment? Would've been much better if she'd included "I know I've always doubted you and taken what you provide for granted and compared you to other men I find more to my liking at the moment and I'm sorry for that. It must have made it very hard for you to keep going, it won't happen again".
As far as she sais her sexual needs are met fully. When she and I talk she always has my undivided attention and I really do LISTEN. She has a house cleaner come in to clean as much as she likes.
Other than my best what can I do?
Sometimes it seems that she's giving me some emotional cruelty by demanding evermore and giving everless.


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## Workingdad (Aug 21, 2009)

Yes Preso, I am.
None of this is really rofl stuff. Real lives are involved.
I'm a very private person, usually preferring to internalize things and figure them out on my own with the information at hand but this situation has become something beyond my range of understanding so I seek counsel from others who may understand better than I.
And I haven't laughed in some time.


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## preso (May 1, 2009)

You cheated on your wife and met another, who you moved in with while your divorce was finalized, then married her
and you wonder why she thinks your cheating? Come on, I know since you have attained so much in life, you can figure that one out.


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## Workingdad (Aug 21, 2009)

Ok, I understand your point. My question is, what now?
The situation is as it was. Can't change the past but what about the future? Is this an unworkable situation? Will I always be suspect? Will the trust I give never be reciprocated?


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## preso (May 1, 2009)

Workingdad said:


> Ok, I understand your point. My question is, what now?
> The situation is as it was. Can't change the past but what about the future? Is this an unworkable situation? Will I always be suspect? Will the trust I give never be reciprocated?


Under the conditions you met and married, I suspect no good will come. I don't mean that in a mean way as I have nothing personal against you and don't even know you....
It's just how I find life works.

I don't think there is anything you can do about her feelings and I feel her feelings that you will cheat are justified.


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## Workingdad (Aug 21, 2009)

Have you ever been cheated on?


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## preso (May 1, 2009)

This is about you, not me

hahaha


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## Sandy55 (Jun 3, 2009)

preso said:


> Good women do not marry men who are cheating on their wives.


Neither do smart ones.


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## Workingdad (Aug 21, 2009)

Funny, you guys seem to think it's all about what's between your legs. Your ignorance must be bliss. I'm going to work it out with her and do whatever it takes for her to trust me and for us to both fall in love again. For the sake of ourselves and our children.
Eventually I'll see you in hell when the cheaters tour the small minds department


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## preso (May 1, 2009)

As for me, I would never trust a man who cheated on me.

Fool me once shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me.

How do you expect her to overlook that you are a cheater? Do you think it matters to her and she will forgive you because you had a rough childhood? 
I sure wouldn't, because lots of people have rough childhoods and lots of people work hard.... 
a cheater is something different.

Maybe your mind is the one thats small to not understand why she has concerns. Any one in her position would feel the same.


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## Workingdad (Aug 21, 2009)

She's not being asked to trust someone who cheated on her since I never have.
Since you don't know me I think it's funny that you can throw out your little judgements. You don't know what a "rough childhood" or "working hard" is. All things are relative. As you sit around your soft friends and family and think all worlds are just like yours there is someone living and experiencing and doing things you not only cannot imagine you cannot comprehend.
I never pass quick judgement on individuals outside myself. I understand that every situation is entirely different and I wait and gather enough information to make an informed decision.
And I never laugh at someone having trouble.


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## preso (May 1, 2009)

Far as I see you met her through cheating on your wife. This in short means you have cheated yourself of the trust normally given between spouses.


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## Workingdad (Aug 21, 2009)

Like you said, "far as I can see".
That's not very far. I think you reside in a narrow little world where you think your rules are applicable. You're probably fooling yourself into believing you would know if your so was cheating emotionally or physically or ever has. Like I said earlier you and people like you must be absolutely full of bliss.
You walk in a world in which you think the opinions you formed in junior high are still valid. Your mind probably closed a long time ago and it won't open until your world is turned upside-down by something you didn't see coming.


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## preso (May 1, 2009)

If you are trying to make your wife believe that, I can see why you write in concerns that she doesn't even like you.
Not to be harsh, only open your eyes that the nice guy routine and stories of a hard childhood have no bearing on the facts of how you met and maybe why she suspects your cheating as that is how she met you.


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## Workingdad (Aug 21, 2009)

I understand your point and appreciate you being clear in how you reached it. My point is to what end? Why marry me (saving my children and myself in the process) if only to suspect me?

A husband and wife meet and have kids. They remain married and loving for many years. In this scenario both parents work, the husband as a highly paid professional and the wife as a middle school teacher. They are confronted with the expense of one of their children having special needs and it takes all they have to keep the family in even the most modest of living conditions. they don't see much of eachother because they must work opposite schedules and cannot afford day-care. The husband, for reasons unknown (or unapparent) to the wife (or himself possibly) becomes emotionally abusive to the wife. He begins by dispariging her first in private and then in front of the children (calling her stupid or fat or anything else such people say). The wife does her part to address the abuse but the husband does not relent. His anger becomes pervasive, touching all parts of their lives and those around them. He refuses to admit any wrong on his part, instead blaming her and the children for his anger. At first the wife yields to him, as do the children and this satisfies his anger. Eventually he begins to push on and when he is yelling at one of their kids, telling him/her they'll never amount to anything because they're stupid and he's sorry he ever had the child. That night when they're alone the wife confronts the husband and the husband escalates to physical abuse.
The wife knows she shouldn't stand for this but is trapped by circumstance and her child's needs. She remains in this abusive (and always escalating) relationship until she becomes close friends with someone she met (a man) online. The two have shared intimate things with eachother. He's married or not and he knows a good deal about her situation. After a time they meet for coffee one day and find that, while not passionately attracted to eachother, their emotional relationship has grown to the point where they decide to be together sexually, each for their own reasons. In this scenario I'll say the wife's reasons are that her husband hasn't seen to her needs sexually for a long time (let's say two years). He's sure to satisfy himself on the rare occasions they are together but never her. The wife's deeper reasons are that this new man seems to actually care about her. She can't really have an affair because if her husband catches her he'll leave the family he's helped create, in turn leaving their special needs child without access to the necessary care. She doesn't have a physical affair but continues to be close emotional friends with the other man. Eventually, this other man (who cares for her a great deal), in response to a catalyst of especially bad treatment of the wife or children by the husband tells her she must leave him. The other man is unable to father his own children and will accept her two young kids as his own and pledges his absolute support. He asks the wife to leave the husband and marry him.

In the preceeding example there should be many questions regarding the ethics each character exhibits.
Who cheated first? Always an important question.
What should each do in their respective situations?
What is cheating?
You may believe cheating is being with someone else without your spouse's knowledge either emotionally and/ or physically and sexually. You may believe this because of the promises each made to the other on their wedding day "to have and to hold, forsaking all others until death do you part".
If this is true (and I suspect it is) I would ask "why such a narrow view? How can you be so selective in to which vow one remains true.
It may be your opinion that when one "cheats" the marriage is over. If this is the case didn't the husband in my example cheat when he hurt the wife? Is the term "married" valid until the courts approve a divorce? If so, are you ok with how many women have historically been forced to remain trapped in abusive relationships because the church would not allow the divorce? Do you know how many have died? How many children abused and/or killed in such situations?
You may think those days are over but they're not.
I suspect you have no idea of what real abuse or pain are.
I suspect you're quick to judge others because your life has been relatively safe and simple.
If you don't always first ask yourself "do I really understand the situation and do I have any real empathy for those on whom I pass judgement?" it means you're part of the problem.
If your view is so narrowed by your apparent inability to have an open mind I guess I can understand your choice of emoticons and laughter when real lives hang in the balance.


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## preso (May 1, 2009)

Workingdad said:


> I understand your point and appreciate you being clear in how you reached it. My point is to what end? Why marry me (saving my children and myself in the process) if only to suspect me?
> 
> .


Perhaps she was having financial problems and being you worked so much, and have all the money you claim, she saw it 
as a way to survive.

Then maybe... she realized it wasn't what it seemed.


I know those kinds of things happen. Also to consider is if you call her names and belittle her? Like call her small minded when she voices her opinions? That will drive most partners away from each other.


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## Workingdad (Aug 21, 2009)

More the other way around. She some negative words to describe some things about me. Because of my experiences in my younger days I'm always extremely careful with what I say and how I say it. I'm always conscious of the fact that you can't un-ring a bell.
You're right about the money initially. She couldn't afford to live out here and was preparing to move back home when we met. Things are vastly different now as they should be. I've always told her I owe her so big I wouldn't contest whatever amount of money she wanted if she left me.
I just can't understand the suspicion part. If I couldn't trust someone completely there's no way I'd marry them and certainly not count on them supporting me financially. She was 9 years younger than me when we met and I guess that might have something to do with it.


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## preso (May 1, 2009)

Maybe you have never been as desperate as she was.

It sounds like she was in that situation, as they say desperate people do desperate things.
I'm only guessing but could it be she doesn't leave because she wants the house and to live there... and for you to leave?


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## preso (May 1, 2009)

Workingdad said:


> Even though we have a child of our own together I can’t help but think she’s in it for the money since she’s most concerned with making it past 10 years so long term alimony is guaranteed in our state.
> 
> .



Not just that but child support.... and lets not forget about social security benefits...
which she will get an amount equal to yours, although it will not come from you, it will come from social security when she is 62 or is it 65?
10 years married required to get that benefit and also long term.

If your home is paid off, she could win that in the divorce too...
like my husband ex got the house, which was paid off during the marriage.
Guess when the 10 year mark hits you'll be more sure if she really doesn't like you.


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## Ingrid (Aug 12, 2009)

This thread has gotten awfully stuck on the "cheating" aspect. 

Cheating happens and there's a huge number of reasons why it happens but the basic reason usually, needs aren't being met in the marriage, not that the cheater is scum, and the person doesn't know better or how to get their needs met. It's more of a lack of maturity rather than some huge character deficiency/flaw. Which means that people CAN learn and I DON'T agree that "once a cheater, always a cheater." Probably some of the most honest, nicest, most generous people you know from church or school or work, who you would *never* suspect, have cheated. 

Now back to WorkingDad, I have a question for you. Do you really love your wife? I don't mean, "of course I must love her, I married her" type thing.


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## swedish (Mar 6, 2008)

Sounds to me as if she has just wanted you all along, your time...I think she has seen over the years that it's not gonna happen due to your work and has found other outlets (facebook, texting, etc.) to fill her social needs.

Why question whether you're cheating? Well, maybe she doesn't have the same understanding of work as you do and may be thinking 'who on Earth would work that much? there must be something that's making him want to be there all the time.' 

And for you, it's financial security in a big way (I have that in me too) and for her, if she does not think that way is wondering what it could be?!


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## preso (May 1, 2009)

Just think.... in one more year, you'll know exactly how she feels. Your kinda lucky in that way, that you'll know if she even likes you or not.
Could be resentment has built and she is just waiting to divorce and it could be something else. One year is not a very long time.


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## Workingdad (Aug 21, 2009)

You make a good point Swedish.
The most challenging manufacturing years were coincidentally the years I was first being accused of cheating. As a manufacturing gm at the time it was part of my job to see the future to the extent possible, plan for it and execute those plans to provide for the company's survival and the jobs of it's employees, and in doing so the future interests of my family. As conditions changed (dot com bust, 9-11, corrupt business partner) I had to react to protect my family's financial future. During many of the times I was struggling with these things the wife would say "I can't understand why it's so impossible for you to be home on time for dinner and have weekends off". Nevermind the fact that my job had me 60 miles away so just the drive was worth 2.5 hrs of my day and that I was dealing with constantly changing events and other individuals acting contrary to my family's benefit.

The wife comes from an area where the pace is very different than mine. She would say she couldn't understand because it was true. Her jobs and the jobs of everyone she knew were predictable affairs and based on the assumption that all would remain pretty much as it was. Her company was very successful in serving the automotive industry in the Chicago area. there was a pervasive attitude that they would always have the work and working conditions they had. In this area of California experience and history have taught a different lesson so I was working with that in mind. I'd try to explain the differences. That I had to work hard and sacrifice at certain times because it was my responsibility to provide for my family, whatever may come and that I always looked and acted for things I saw coming in years and months. She even stood in the great-room of our house, the one we both excitedly watched being built in the second year of our marriage, where she picked out the tiles and colors and appliances and told me she "never asked for any of this". She wanted to reset and said she was willing to downsize to have more time with me at home. In this area downsizing is no guarantee of future stability. To the contrary, it removes a major asset to borrow against, which is what I had to do in starting my business.
Her only concession to me was one night while we sat alone together at the dinner table saying that I'd never let the family down and at some point she had to trust that I'd always do what's best for everyone. There was no apology for what she'd put me through. She didn't address the complete lack of trust and repeated accusations. This fostered some bitterness in me to say the least.
I won't say that we live a lavish lifestyle but it can be pretty comfortable. Imagine that any time you go shopping you aren't concerned with the price of something, just whether or not it fits your needs. When you go to a restaurant it's the one you want and you order what you want and never even look at the prices on the menu. You fly the airline which best fits your schedule and stay at the hotel most convenient-nice-safe, drive the rental car most comfortable and attend the classes you are interested in, buying the supplies and tools you want and at no time is any question asked by your husband when you're away about what you're doing, who's around, why you didn't answer your phone when you were away, but instead upon your return "did you have fun?". Then you follow all of that by sending your friend an e-mail saying that your husband "didn't lift a finger when I was gone" and leave it open on the desktop of the computer you both use. Left out of the e-mail was the fact that you left 2 days of dishes in the sink and trash all over the livingroom floor mixed in with your hobby magazines or the fact that your husband still had to work his regular schedule while seeing to the needs of the kids.
On a daily basis you're never questioned for what you've done or where you've been.
I guess I feel taken for granted because the freedoms she experiences are never reciprocated. If she did decide to trust me she didn't apologize for having not trusted me, leading me to believe she felt she was correct in her distrust. On the other hand, it's possible it was an off-handed compliment or thank you. I'll never know because if I bring it up I'll be accused (accurately) of "bringing up the past" which she considers fighting dirty.
I think one of the main things in marriage is holding onto the belief that it's the two people against the world. There will always be challenges from outside which will test your resolve but as long as you're in it as a team they can never break you. It's when one stands with others (outside the marriage) against his/her spouse that causes the most damage.

And you could be right Preso, I just wish she'd tell me so she doesn't have to pretend to care.


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## Workingdad (Aug 21, 2009)

Points taken Lost. I have been described as being long-winded at times.
My question has always been the same, how?
She's never lived in poverty as I have so she probably doesn't understand my fears but should make an effort in any case. I've never been in her position and have made some pretty major adjustments along the way based on input from her.
The question of how to give someone patience and/or understanding is one I've found impossible to answer. They either have the capacity for it or not.
It's pretty easy (at least in romance novels) to say a family can live on a reduced income for the sake of the adult's relationship but this is real life and soon kids will need cars, college, etc. I feel one of the things parents do is sacrifice their instant needs for the needs of their children and when they do they don't do so with animosity for the other spouse. I don't blame anyone but myself for my situation, to the contrary I accept it without qualification. Even though my first marriage ended in misery and divorce I would do it all over again to have the exact kids I do. Same goes for my current. Even if she does throw me away eventually the existence of our daughter makes it all worth it to me. No regrets there.

I'll try but...


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## Loving Husband (Aug 3, 2009)

First marriage ended and second is on its way out. Chances are you didn't work on correcting what you did on the first marriage and its showing up on the second. Patterns will continue to repaet until you break the cycle. You can't change anybody but yourself. You need to make the improvements on your end and see what happens. Stop looking to find fault or blame a situation. Make the improvements you need..


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## Workingdad (Aug 21, 2009)

Pretty harsh but ultimately true.


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## Loving Husband (Aug 3, 2009)

Workingdad said:


> Pretty harsh but ultimately true.


Hey I'm going through the same thing. I am trying to work on myself.. Even though I feel my wife has a lot more to work on I can only improve myself. I am doing the love dare book to love her for her. Only then can I say I did everything on my part. Change is needed.. I am letting her do what she wants in hopes someday she sees the light and sees our family needs and wants her.. Have to hold faith..


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## ladyred8585 (Mar 2, 2010)

I can relate to you completely. My husband is a stay at home dad as of recent, and I dont feel like he likes me at all. Everything i do is wrong from sex, to doing the dishes, walking the dogs, groceryshopping, dicipline for our daughter. Its almost as if I am doing all of the at home mom duties for him and yet i am working. I really dont want to touch him my self because with the feeling that he does not like me, i am starting to feel used and like i can do better. When you get an answer or advise please pass it on.


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## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

If it was me I would divorce her and then if she wants to stay together for non financial reasons fine. But she clearly tricked you from day one. Why would you let long term alimony kick in? 

You need to talk to a lawyer. 

Clearly she just sees you as a human ATM



Workingdad said:


> I've been married with my current wife for about 9 years. We met while I was still with my first wife and mother of my first 3 kids. My reason for straying at the time was that my wife (then) would spend all day playing video games and neglect our children while I worked 12-15 hr days to support us. She even put on my 2yr old son's bunny suit backwards so he couldn't take it off when his diaper was filled with poop while he and his twin were locked in a room behind a child barrier gate watching videos continuously while she played. So, in spite of my best efforts to stay in the marriage with her I strayed and found my current wife. My first wife was willing in the sex and general affection department but knowing how she was treating our kids I could barely stand to look at her. In addition to the above she would also drink beer daily.
> So along comes my current wife. It was her dream to be a stay-at-home-wife, even with someone else’s kids and we hit it off well enough to get married after a year of living together while the divorce was processed. We had what she said was the “wedding of her dreams” but that night she was distant and seemed to just want to get the consummation over with. Once we were married the sex went from 2/week to 1/week and the level of involvement diminished on her face. I always enjoyed rubbing her feet while we watched tv and would rarely pass her by without a hand on her waist or a kiss. Problem was she would never reciprocate on the touching. We began to have arguments about it and she said she didn’t want to touch me because it “would lead to sex” and she wasn’t interested in that more than once weekly (Saturday night between 8:30 and 10:30). Then she said she’s just not a “touchy person”. I told her if she never touched me on her own I would eventually stop reaching out to her and it would end up being a problem for our marriage but she stuck to her actions. Now we never touch.
> Our sex has diminished progressively both in frequency and quality. She always finishes within 5 or 10 minutes and says it becomes uncomfortable for her so I rush. Foreplay is lights off manual and she either stares at the ceiling or keeps her eyes closed until she’s ready. There is no kissing in my life except in the morning before I leave for work and at night just before we go to sleep. During the day there is never any physical contact of any kind.
> Even though we have a child of our own together I can’t help but think she’s in it for the money since she’s most concerned with making it past 10 years so long term alimony is guaranteed in our state.
> ...


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