# I feel like I'm stuck...is "no contact" the answer?



## 52flower (Mar 4, 2011)

My exH had an affair 5 years ago. He moved out and moved her in but flew back and forth about every 2 weeks, convincing me he needed time to break it off. I made the mistake of trying to be patient, understanding, & loyal and put up with his getting the best of both worlds. After losing 15 lbs & lots of hair, I finally realized what he was doing & told him to stay with her. Of course, he became the remorseful & wanted to come back. I let him but told him if he did it again, I couldn't survive through another ordeal. He promised it wouldn't happen. 3 years later, I discovered he was spending our money visiting massage "plus" parlors. Again, he said he was done with our marriage & wanted to move out. He did indeed and moved his new masseuse girlfriend. 6 months later, he moved out of the state with her & opened a massage "plus extras" business with her. Money, things, and flaunt are important to both of them. I filed & we got divorced 4 months ago. They have been together for almost 2 years. Ever since he moved out, he has told me how we should be together & how he is trying to come back. He gave up his lucrative job to move & invest in this business. He says he wants to come back, regain my trust, and restore our relationship but needs money to pay for his relocation, get a place to live, and find a job. She has no idea of his communication with me. Throughout, he has not been forthright and obviously continues to be this way. His lies and dupings have been cruel, costly, and emotionally hurtful. Although he says he has changed & does not lie, I think he has the ability to continue with the same choices. Sometimes I wonder if his narcissistic personality leaves him without a conscience. He can justify any act as not wrong, even if directly offensive to others. I struggle with the hurt of the betrayals & still am working on regaining my pride back. I don't know if this is normal. To add to the betrayal is the shock of learning about the lewdness of this person. He and his new partner own a lucrative business that promotes "extras"for the almighty dollar. It is disgusting and I hate that other men are likely doing what he did. We communicate, mostly through email, mostly because we have a few financial obligations that still tie us. It "feels good" that he wants to dump her & come back but 1) the hurt he caused is tremendous & I don't trust him. I wonder if he is making a fool of me again, just to feel good about himself and 2) I don't know if I can get over his choice to get into such a degrading business. We have been best friends & a married couple for 16 years. I was hoping we could stay friends but I am wondering if I am enabling his warped idea of a relationship in which he uses people for his own personal gain without feeling badly for hurting them. I am beginning to see that basically, it's all about him. If so, is "no contact" the only way to get beyond the emotional affect he still has on me? I am ashamed to admit that while I get mad at his unfairness, it soon dissipates & I am very accepting of him & end up caring for him (still playing the role of his wife). I don't know if this is normal and will just take time to eventually disappear or if I am in a rut. It makes me feel bad that I still get affected by him. Some days I am strong & focused on making a life for me but it's not consistently every day. I am not where I would like to be and I get frustrated with myself. Any ideas on how to heal & move on?


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## Syrum (Feb 22, 2011)

If you take him back you are a huge fool. Do you have any self respect or self esteem? 

I would sever all ties to this unethical, selfish, revolting, leech of a man.

If you want more misery and heartbreak- sure take him back.


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## Xena (Feb 11, 2011)

Hey 52flower. I would not take him back. He's using her now like he used you. In fact he's using the both of you. He's clearly still OK with being dishonest because he's doing it to her. I wouldn't even be surprised if there's a 3rd or 4th woman as well. No you deserve much better than this. No contact sounds like a very good idea. Can you hire a soliciter to be the contact point for all financial things that need to be worked out? Then work out the finances (there shouldn't be too many hanging about after 2 years anyway) and cut him out of your life FOREVER. What a horible man. Oh it's up to you but I'd also be inclined to send copies of all those emails he's sent you to his current partner (ONCE you've sorted the finances out). Good luck to him explaining THAT!


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## Kcrat (Mar 18, 2011)

52flower- I am going through a lot of what you are going through in the respect of "I can't let go." He "supposedly" is not seeing anyone nor does he want to come back, but I am stuck and can't move forward. I obsess and find myself wanting to work it out even though he has cheated, hidden money, and lied, and lied, and lied! I understand EXACTLY what you are going through and I feel for you. I have not have one of those "strong, liberated, and confident days in a while. Think part of my problem may be that I can not stand that I am not in control of this, and can't "fix" it. I also quite frankly after having him "under my thumb" for 22 years, think it is a HUGE blow to my ego that he decided he wanted a divorce AND made the choices he made. Just can not believe it all. I also OBSESS about what he is doing all of the time. I will make a pact with you. Let's agree to NO CONTACT. I will still have to deal with him because of the kids, finances, divorce, etc., but let's agree to not have any contact unless WE HAVE TO! It will be oh so hard at first, but eventually we will feel empowered and in charge of our own lives, happiness, and destiny. We can't take them back as they have "shown their colors" and we will only be paranoid and doubt every single thing they say and do for the rest of our lives. Is that any way to live? Good luck to you


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## 827Aug (Apr 27, 2008)

I really do understand what you are going through. In many ways my own life parallels your story. Our ex's see us as shelters or a safe ports in the storm. And once the storms pass, they are back out chasing rainbows. It's a repeating pattern.

If you have children together, it's going to be hard to have no contact with the ex. My estranged husband still has contact with me, but it is very business like. However, if children aren't involved, no contact may be the way to go. 

I think I benefited from a couple of years of individual counseling. You may want to try that. You sound a little unsure as to whether you want the ex completely out of your life. If you do decide to try for a relationship with your ex again, make counseling a requirement for him as well.

Good luck!


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

You are divorced. Stay that way.
He is still playing you cause you let him.
What I would do is make copies of his texts/messages to you ad forward them to his new skank along with a letter saying, "Please stop contacting me. It's over and you are still cheating, like you always have been."

This guy is a major piece of work. Get tested for STDs. Get counselling. Find your dignity and self-respect. He is a LOSER with a capital L.


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## 52flower (Mar 4, 2011)

Thank you for your replies. I take all of your thoughts 
& words of experience seriouly. When I read about the struggles of others, my response is based on strength & clear values of right and wrong. Yet, when it comes to me, I have wavered and erred too many times on being his soft pillow. It's difficult to realize and admit that he continues to have an effect on my rational thinking. I did not learn of the 180 plan until recently. I wish I had read and applied the principles. 

I appreciate and value all of your candid thoughts and internalize them. Even tonight, he wanted to talk about finances. At the last minute, he said he couldn't talk because 'she' was coming soon. I am not sure he is capable of realizing what it feels like to be treated the way he treats others. I think he is only capable of protecting his own feelings. In that, I realize the real problem is me. I cannot understand what I think I am gaining from continuing contact with him. I wonder if I am afraid of being alone (although what can be worse than his disrespect) or if I am afraid of his anger if I were to take a stand and stop contact with him. Kcrat, I appreciate your offer to include me in a "pact" to avoid contact. I would like to take you up on it. It's comforting to know I am not the only one struggling. When I read the same story again and again....betrayal, deceit, disrespect, and acceptance of the situation, it's a no-brainer on what needs to happen. Yet, time and again, although less and less, I am the dysfunctional one who cannot get angry enough to tell him to go away once and for all. I think I am getting there but not as quickly as I would like. We do not have children together so that eliminates that complication. He convinced me to retire the year he left; thank goodness I didn't. He left me for a woman 14 years younger than me. I wonder if I am feeling unconfident that I will find others & that instead, I will be alone. The fear of being alone...does that go away? 

I believe he has some strong narcissistic tendencies that prompted him to develop ways to cover up selfish acts (which I am paying for financially and emotionally). I admit, I must have thought he would change if I tried harder to make him happy. I have thought about meeting her or sending her his emails. But I think she is similar in personality & would believe his "justification" (lie) to rationalize why it wasn't true. In many ways, they are similar in their values...he has been with her for nearly two years so he must see some value in her.

I don't believe he will change. I think he will always be selfish and lie to get his way. I don't know if he does so intentionally but it doesn't matter...he does it. I have put too much of myself into a person like that & I know I don't want to continue down that path anymore. Your responses have been so helpful in giving me the fortitude to think rationally and not slip back into the enabling ways that got me into trouble. If you have any more suggestions or insightful opinion, I would appreciate reading and rereading them.


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## 52flower (Mar 4, 2011)

I'm rather new to this discussion board but enjoying "listening & seeing", learning and reflecting from the variety of topics and comments that all of you share. I enjoy the teaming of candidness & support that is shown by all of you who respond. I see myself in the choices of action by many who seem "stuck". I see the same mistakes, same weaknesses, same torment and repeating cycle of heartbeak.

I wonder...how are people (in my case my exH) able to selfishly cause outright obvious pain, keep people dangling, watch them tormenting as they try to hang...all solely for their own gain? I read stories from others whose heart is being torn to shreds and the person who is doing it is cognizant but still continues. How can people hurt others so cruelly?

It took years of ridiculous abuse (obviously my fault for letting it continue) and hanging on by threads to the "just give me some time to let go". I put up with the OW living in our vacation home, them changing the locks on me, putting up the OW in hotels (using our points) close to our home while she came to visit, finding out after the fact that his"solo business trips" to Hawaii and Vegas were with the other women (2 different affairs). I realized too late that my "niceness and stick-to-it & support" are detrimental characteristics. 

I read "TwoTimeLoser"'s question about when is it too late. I was supposed to retire the year I found out about his 1st affair. After reconciling, he left me for this second woman. So after 16 years of loyal love, I am on my own and an "older" single woman. It's not the situation I hoped to be in. Yes, I feel permanently scarred, not able to trust, and wish that if he had it in his heart to leave, he would have done so earlier. But here I am, at least I am alive.

She is 10 years younger than him. I read the entry asking about boundaries with porn. He, also, claimed he was not interested in porn. I found out he was into it behind my back. I discovered he took a step further and began visiting erotic massage parlors. This lead to the affair, moving out with her, moving across the country & opening an erotic massage business with her. I believe his values have deteriorated because of who and what he is around. Looking at porn & patronizing those businesses have skewed his values of "normal". He sleeps with a woman who comes home after servicing other men. How can a person accept that?!

He says he wants to come back to me...that he thinks the business is disgusting and that he misses the family, values & integrity of being with me. Is this what a narcissistic person does to others? Do they ever hit the wall? Do they have feelings for hurting others? I know it won't make any difference to where I am and what happened to me but I spent time thinking about what happened and why and how he could do what he did. He said he never stopped loving me and still does but how is it possible for him and others to hurt others so outright and so cruelly?

I'm working on healing myself. I don't know how long or how far I will get but I look in the mirror and realize my fault in not having strong enough boundaries. I hope I can forgive and learn to trust again.


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## Lazarus (Jan 17, 2011)

It is terribly hard for you but consider life as being full of possibilities. 

If you like theatre or opera join a society where you can meet like minded people of similar interests to go on lunch, dinner dates and trips. Try take up a new interest, painting or crafts, something where you will meet people. Learn something challenging and new. 

Your ex seems to be going through some sort of crisis but he has betrayed you terribly and seems to see you as a soft touch where he can call on you to help fund him to return home. That's a telling situation - he is still disrespecting you! 

It is difficult facing the future in retirement and being on your own. The younger woman will get fed up after she's cleaned him out of money and he'll come crawling back. You need to be strong and in a different place. Then you are in control, not him. He seems to be so selfish and cruel. Look for someone who will cherish and appreciate you, and not treat you with no respect. 

Try something, even volunteering if helps you meet other people. It might be fun or disappointing but at least try something to gain an appreciation of your own worth. Value you!

Remind yourself that you are a good person and you need to wash him out of your hair, your life. Try to move forward, not backwards. Easier said than done, of course but, give anything a try...you might be pleasantly surprised with life's possibilities.


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