# First Lie



## Chillidog (Nov 5, 2020)

I’ve been married to my WW for over 33 years. I recently found out that she had friended an ex-boyfriend from 40 years ago on Facebook in 2017. 

Our marriage overall has been good but have not communicated well with each over the past 20 years since the birth of our child. I detest Facebook and other social media so I didn’t know much about it. 

We both have spent the past 6 years dealing with her parents and my mom moving to assistant living and her parent’s deaths. There has been a ton of stress to share between us. It seemed like we were just roommates living together little intimacy or sex. Like many males my age I am dealing with medical conditions that affect both of these issues. 

One evening I was online and came across her exes Facebook page in the search history. She hadn’t mentioned him to me in a few years. We both use different browsers so I searched the other browser and found a few more searches for him 6 months earlier on there as well. Red flag went up. She doesn’t use our home pc much because she uses a work laptop and work phone for everything. 

I confronted her about it and she said she was just looking to see if he was on Facebook. She had asked me to put together a list of important accounts with passwords so we would have on file in the event something happened to either of us. 

I created the list and her Facebook account was included. 

One evening we started talking about her ex. I asked if he had tried to call or text her since the reconnection. She said he called her after the death of her mother and other then commenting on a few pictures and post on Facebook that was it.

She said I could access her Facebook account if I needed to so I went and started looking around. 

There were a few comments about pictures and postings but he wasn’t listed in her friends section. 

I asked her why and she said that she unfriended him and had deleted the Facebook messenger messages after my concerns. So I looked at her wall of activity and found that she had searched his Facebook page over 400 times going back to 2017. 

No one else even came close to being searched that many times. She didn’t have a real reason as to why, just “I don’t know”. She said that he didn’t post much but she would go look at his postings and pictures sometimes several times a day. 

I again asked her if he had contacted her. This time she revealed that he had also called her a week prior to her mom’s death. I asked again if they had met in person. 

She said he had wanted to meet for lunch but she declined. Over the next week we kept talking about the ex and her story changed to she went to meet him for lunch but felt to guilty to go inside, told him and left. She said he told her he understood and wished her well. Then she mentioned that he had contacted her again after her mom died and wanted to take her to the cemetery and then have lunch. She said she declined that invitation. 

I felt this was odd since she had told him of the guilt she was feeling when they met for the first lunch why would he ask her again. Over the next week as we talked I kept pressing about the lunch meet and how thing weren’t adding up and I did not believe her story. 

She finally revealed that they did meet for lunch. Over the next week he messaged her twice on Facebook. The messages where found in a spam folder so she hadn’t seen them. I messaged him back that it was time to leave my wife alone. He did not respond back to me. I told her either she has no contact with him or I was done. 

She sent him a message through Facebook informing him that there would be no further communication. He acknowledged her message. This was the first time in 33 years that I had caught her lying to my face. She has denied anything physical happened. Her phone is a work phone and I have no access to phone or text records. I tried unsuccessfully to recover the deleted Facebook messages. She says she is truly sorry for the secrecy and lies and accepts full responsibility. I have a VAR of a conversation with her close friend that confirms most of what she told me but I don’t know if she was lying to her too. Not sure where to go from here.


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## manfromlamancha (Jul 4, 2013)

There may not be more than what she has trickle truthed you with (trickle truthing in itself is very suspicious and you are right to be concerned) but it is time to go into proper surveillance mode which means mouth shut but eyes and ears wide open. VARs, mobile phone & social media surveillance are all good things to deploy. Also keep checking every story she casually tells you and verify whenever you can. Do not let on that you are doing any of this (she already knows that you have done it in the past which is bad enough). Appear relaxed, calm and unconcerned to her and she will eventually slip up. The other option is to have her take a poly (it may be too early for this).

And this is the first lie that you know about.


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## TJW (Mar 20, 2012)

manfromlamancha said:


> And this is the first lie that you know about.


You will uncover more. There is more to the story than what you know now.

I'm sorry you have to endure the pain of this. I wouldn't wish it upon my worst enemy.


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## Robert22205 (Jun 6, 2018)

X boyfriends are very (very) high risk relationships because his attention makes your wife feel young again (and it's addictive). That's probably why she keeps searching his FB page. 

Trust but be cautious. She's had a taste of feeling young again and will be very tempted to reach out again.

I suggest you both read and discuss the book: Not Just Friends by Dr Shirley Glass.
It's based on research of couples that experienced infidelity and the type of behavior that exposes well intended people to the risk of an affair.

If the X is married, notify his wife. Nothing kills a secret relationship like exposure.


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## Rooster2015 (Jun 12, 2015)

So if was so innocent meeting for lunch why were you not invited? You are her husband. And her mate. That would be my question to her.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

The worrying thing is the way she kept lying and changing her story. How can you know the truth?


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

You are at risk.
By your own admission you are only roommates.

Because of your medical condition(s) you are not intimate.
Nature is cruel.

Improvise.

Your wife does not have the same sexual limitations, I suspect.
It sounds like she is looking for your replacement, even at her age, which I presume is at least 60.

Why do you think it is OK for her not experience intimacy, love making of some sort.
It does not have to be PIV. 

There are many ways a man can give his wife some sexual pleasure.

I suspect she misses this part of a relationship, even if she does not mention it.

You are not alone in this predicament.
With, the husband or the wife who cannot perform, _or chooses not to_.
They choose not to, and then expect the other spouse to remain celibate.
Not fair....

Wishful thinking, this is.

I am not excusing her fishing for another man.
At least, you now know she is.

Take her to bed, or take her to task.

She has fired a shot over your bow, and over her marital vows.

Time's awastin'

_Are Dee-_


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## Kaliber (Apr 10, 2020)

SunCMars said:


> Why do you think it is OK for her not experience intimacy, love making of some sort.
> It does not have to be PIV.


Nicely said @SunCMars!
You can be intimate without PIV intercourse. 
You can use toys, hands, tongue ..etc
I recommend starting doing things like this now, ASAP

However, for now, mouth shut and eyes open!


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## Gabriel (May 10, 2011)

Yes, I would go quiet now. Your mistake was confronting every time a tiny thing changed. Now just watch. If you stop talking about it, she will relax. Either it's done or she will start being sneaky, thinking she's placated you.

Clearly you can't trust her yet. Doesn't mean anything damaging has happened to this point, but she's clearly lying because she knows you wouldn't approve. That's not trustworthy behavior - so just quietly monitor her.


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

Now that you’ve been repeatedly lied to about this, you know she can’t be trusted 100% so don’t make that mistake again. You never know what someone is truly capable of so be very cautious going forward. Where you go from here is completely up to you. You could rebuild your marriage or you could divorce her. I assume she doesn’t want a divorce so she will try hard to convince you to stay and she might even mean the words she says, But now you know your marriage isn’t safe from harm so life will be different than it was before. I hope everything works out well for you.


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

And, btw, cheaters almost always deny it was physical so you’ll likely never know for sure if it was or not. A poly may or may not help with that but for sure don’t trust that the story you get from her is the complete truth.


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## Nailhead (Sep 21, 2020)

Your WW needs to do the work in building trust again. Keep digging. There is probably more.


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

One day she has her work phone just pick it up and if pass code protected tell her to open it. She if she balks. If she refuses to let you search for his # or texts tell her you will keep the phone and have a talk with her supv and give him the phone to view such as you believe there may be inappropriate texts between her and an ex. See if she will let you see text msgs then to proove she is not still lying.


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## Chillidog (Nov 5, 2020)

Thanks to everyone for your replies. I truely appreciate your help and guidance. I am digesting everything everyones interest so far. Many of your questions have been mine also. Over the past two months received some treatment for the sex issues and we are intimate again. I am still working on getting more info from her phone. After the initial Facebook search finding, I quickly educated myself on the flags and signs of EA and PA. The VAR is a great tool. Over the next few days we will see if anything arises.


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## Nailhead (Sep 21, 2020)

Chillidog said:


> Thanks to everyone for your replies. I truely appreciate your help and guidance. I am digesting everything everyones interest so far. Many of your questions have been mine also. Over the past two months received some treatment for the sex issues and we are intimate again. I am still working on getting more info from her phone. After the initial Facebook search finding, I quickly educated myself on the flags and signs of EA and PA. The VAR is a great tool. Over the next few days we will see if anything arises.


Please do not see this cheating as your fault. I recommend you ask your WW why she felt what she was doing was ok in her mind.


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## Chillidog (Nov 5, 2020)

I was able to look at phone. Nothing found in messages,email or contacts. Nothing found in her files. I still want to try to recover deletd messages and contacts when I can. I have now stopped all inquries about OM. I am going to lay low and keep eyes and ears wide open. Also ran background on OM and have most of the info I need going forward. Funny,WW said he never talked about his wife at the lunch. Even she thought that was odd. For the record, I'm more hurt over the lying to my face then the lunch itself.


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## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

Nailhead said:


> Please do not see this cheating as your fault. I recommend you ask your WW why she felt what she was doing was ok in her mind.


Cheating is not his fault, but this would be a very good time to become introspective and look at his own contribution to the relationship. He sounds like he's become a bit cold or tone-deaf to the things that might be troubling his wife. It also sounds like my favorite subject comes up yet again- the need for discussions of notions of boundaries and privacy. A relationship that kind of gradually seems to grow apart over the years is likely a relationship where the couple mistakenly believes there's not much to address in that regard. In fact, that may be how they got there. Each person replacing things they find lacking in their spouse with something from outside the marital relationship. 

Regarding finding the truth, a person of her age who hasn't been very "up" on hiding things in the past isn't going to suddenly learn how to do so now. It will feel foreign and clunky and her attempts to hide things will likely expose themselves. Sudden password changes, or opening up new communications channels without understanding that each channel still needs to have its tracks covered.


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## QuietRiot (Sep 10, 2020)

I would like to know what her idea of accepting responsibility for the lies means? What’s she willing to do for recompense? Also, did she talk to you about malcontent with your marriage before the lies and deceit began?

Maybe she won’t ever talk to this guy again. But it doesn’t change her deceit and her ability to do it. And she hasn’t told you the truth. Only bits a pieces. How does one forgive and move forward if they don’t even know the full truth of what they are forgiving? And it’s very apparent from reading your story, she isn’t telling you everything. Why on earth would she delete all the evidence of her conversations with him before you saw them? Because she has a lot to hide. That’s why. Because it’s damning. Because she knows if she saw that on your phone, she’d be crushed. I think you sense and feel this acutely, which is why you are here. And why you are continuing to dig even after her “confession”.

I think you have to treat this as though a very real affair in every sense of the word took place. I’d follow all the advice you’ve been given and especially the polygraph test. You make it a condition of her “remorse” and if she is actually sorry and has nothing to hide she will happily do this to put your mind at ease. I have a feeling the truth and the story you have are very different things. The question is, do you actually want those answers? Some people don’t... maybe you’d like to spend the next years of life policing her activity and scrutinizing her every action and wondering if she’s having lunchtime hookups.
Sorry you are here. It sucks, no matter what.


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## Miserable71 (Oct 3, 2020)

I'm currently going through a divorce from my wife of 15 years after finding out that she had been talking to an ex that she reconnected with on Facebook. I certainly can't speak for your wife or understand fully your situation, but in my case, my wife has somehow just got pulled into this guy. She just can't keep herself from talking to him. In the end she says she doesn't want the divorce and I don't either, but I will not be a stand-in or live under another man's shadow. Although I don't want the divorce either, I feel I have no choice.

My thoughts to you are that you are at a huge disadvantage due to her use of work items that you can't have access to. In my mind I would always be concerned that she just moved the conversation with the ex-boyfriend to the work equipment or to a different platform for communication. I think the real thing to work to is how if at all possible can she rebuild your trust. I would have a lot of questions to what all has been done as far as chats and meeting.


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## Chillidog (Nov 5, 2020)

I'm back. I have been laying low and acting like I believe her story. I have been going through some of WW Itunes phone back ups over the past 5 years. In one backup from last year found OM was listed in her Contacts but has been removed in following backups.. There were no text or call history's found in any of her backups. I wish she had a backup from 2018 but none were found. I know she could have deleted messages and calls as she went along but why would she have put him in her Contacts. She deleted him after I confronted her. I really would have like to seen something between fall of 2017 and all of 2018 in her backups. She definitely lied about the meeting for lunch. One prominent thing forgot to mention is that OM hugged and kissed her on the cheek when they left the lunch meeting.. I asked her why, after 40 years, did she think he deserved this affection. She had no real explanation. So since Dday I haven't found any further evidence of any recent phone calls, texting, or VAR recordings to shed more light on. Before I came here my WW seemed truely upset that she lied and hurt me and took full responsibility for her actions. I'm still dealing with forgiving and trusting her completely until I see more from her. This doesn't seem to be as bad as other's EA's but the hurt sure stings.


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

When life no longer stings, your life has passed, and you are in the ground, still, unflinching and cold.

Be alert, remain so.
She is still vulnerable.

As hard as it is, be attentive to her presence and her needs, as, the worst may have passed.
That is the hope.


_Are Dee-_


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

When old lovers meet, the old remembered meat stirs those recollections.

They have kissed and hugged in the past.

This is that, once-habit, not forgotten, likely forlorned, missed.

She hugged that old memory of him, him, doing the same.

EX lovers are fates broken by other fates.
Each fate leaves its mark in our memory, certainly, on the soul.

They each lost one another....back then.
No one likes to lose.

The past is but an intermission to the present.
We all return to the past in our minds, some do it physically.

No one can compete with a past love, one truly loved and lost.


_The Typist-_


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

Don’t ever trust her again as completely as you once did. That’s just asking for trouble.


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## bobert (Nov 22, 2018)

Chillidog said:


> I'm still dealing with forgiving and *trusting her completely* until I see more from her. This doesn't seem to be as bad as other's EA's but the hurt sure stings.


Your goal shouldn't be to trust her completely, and I don't think that would ever happen anyway after a betrayal. Do you trust yourself and your decisions 100% of the time? Nope, because no one does. So why would you trust someone else completely if you don't even trust yourself completely? 

I think you're letting your wife get off too easy. You said she had no explanation for why she allowed, at minimum, an EA. That's not good enough! She needs to get into therapy to figure out why she allowed that. She can't prevent it from happening again if she doesn't know what caused it. She may know damn well what the real answer is, but she doesn't want to tell you and that is just as problematic. 

Also, just don't invalidate your feelings with "well, it could have been worse" or "well, other people have it worse". Your experience is just as real to you as it is to someone who had it worse.


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## Chillidog (Nov 5, 2020)

So I now am dealingwith triggers. WW was looking through some photo's of my MIL. One particular photo was of my MIL at a Thanksgiving get together that we had at her assisted living home. This was her last Thanksgiving dinner before she passsed away. So I am looking at the photo seeing how happy she was that day when I realize that this was taken 2 months after my WW had reconnected with the OM. I got quiet and standoffish. After a while my WW asked what was bothering me. So I told her about the trigger and was now going to have to deal with another fuc*ing product of her EA. She again stated that it was all her fault and how sorry she was for causing this whole ordeal. How do you deal with the triggers when they occur. Part of me wants to talk about it but the other part of me wants to cause her to hurt.


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## re16 (Oct 9, 2012)

Chillidog said:


> So I now am dealingwith triggers. WW was looking through some photo's of my MIL. One particular photo was of my MIL at a Thanksgiving get together that we had at her assisted living home. This was her last Thanksgiving dinner before she passsed away. So I am looking at the photo seeing how happy she was that day when I realize that this was taken 2 months after my WW had reconnected with the OM. I got quiet and standoffish. After a while my WW asked what was bothering me. So I told her about the trigger and was now going to have to deal with another fuc*ing product of her EA. She again stated that it was all her fault and how sorry she was for causing this whole ordeal. How do you deal with the triggers when they occur. Part of me wants to talk about it but the other part of me wants to cause her to hurt.


It seems like it will be very hard to start working on getting over it when you don't fully know what you are getting over.

The way this works is, you:
1. find out everything
2. decide you want to reconcile
3. work on repairing the relationship

I don't think you are at step one yet.

Has she acknowledged that he was a contact in her phone and that she deleted him? Now might be a good time for a bluff that you've run recovery on her backups (make a copy of them first) and you know she has not told you the full story. Tell her she writes out everything that happened and if it doesn't match what you know from recovering deleted backup info, its over.


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## QuietRiot (Sep 10, 2020)

Chillidog said:


> So I now am dealingwith triggers. WW was looking through some photo's of my MIL. One particular photo was of my MIL at a Thanksgiving get together that we had at her assisted living home. This was her last Thanksgiving dinner before she passsed away. So I am looking at the photo seeing how happy she was that day when I realize that this was taken 2 months after my WW had reconnected with the OM. I got quiet and standoffish. After a while my WW asked what was bothering me. So I told her about the trigger and was now going to have to deal with another fuc*ing product of her EA. She again stated that it was all her fault and how sorry she was for causing this whole ordeal. How do you deal with the triggers when they occur. Part of me wants to talk about it but the other part of me wants to cause her to hurt.


One of the worst parts of an affair is you are constantly having to deal with a new history. This will not stop I don’t think, until the history is accurately rewritten in your mind in the context of the affair. (But I don’t actually know) 
You may come across pictures, momentos or memories that remind you... oh yeah I was being screwed over at this time. This was not an accurate memory. 
I have these triggers all.the.time. The mention of some random weekend where I remember thinking his behavior was strange, the one time he hid his phone really quick when I walked in the room, the time he came home and kissed me and I wonder now... was his dirty mouth on her the moment before. There are thousands of these I've already uncovered in my memory, and I’m sure there are thousands more. 
There is no happy skipping through fields after an affair. It’s sadness, anger, volatile emotions and trauma. And the cheater saying they are sorry doesn’t help any of it. I’m 6 months after 1st dday, and I have tons of triggers still. Sorry you have to feel it too.

I will say, it was a lot worse for me when I was trying to reconcile. Now that I know I’m getting out... it still sucks but I take comfort in the thought there is a finite point to the suffering.


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## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

Chillidog said:


> We both have spent the past 6 years dealing with her parents and my mom moving to assistant living and her parent’s deaths. There has been a ton of stress to share between us. *It seemed like we were just roommates living together little intimacy or sex. Like many males my age I am dealing with medical conditions that affect both of these issues. *


Could you elaborate on this part...how often were you having sex, and for how long has that gone on?
Did she ever talk about being unhappy with that?


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## bobert (Nov 22, 2018)

Chillidog said:


> How do you deal with the triggers when they occur. Part of me wants to talk about it but the other part of me wants to cause her to hurt.


Your triggers and your response to them is completely normal. Sometimes you need to just remind yourself "the way I'm feeling is normal and expected". Triggers are going to happen but they do lose their power over time. There are things that triggered me two years ago that no longer do or my reaction isn't nearly as strong. I'd recommend writing the triggers down so you can learn what your triggers are, how to avoid them if possible and if not, how to cope with them next time. You should also be discussing this with a therapist who can help you work through the triggers. You can also do things like EMDR. 

You can have all the tools in the world but it still takes time to heal. Now (2 years from D-Day for me) I look back at some things and think "why didn't I/couldn't I do that earlier?!". The answer is time and not being ready.

It's also normal to want the WS to hurt when you're hurting, afterall _she_ is the one who caused your pain so why shouldn't she suffer too? Right? Not really. I'm a _huge_ hypocrite for saying it but, try not to do that. It won't actually make you feel any better and it won't solve anything. No matter how much you hurt her, it won't take your pain away and it won't give her the same pain you're feeling.

Instead, _show_ her how badly she hurt you and how much pain you're in. That should cause her a ton of pain because she caused it and she can't just take it away. Don't hide your emotions from her and definitely do talk to her about it. 

You both need to learn _how_ to properly talk about them without causing more damage. It would be easy for your wife to try to comfort you with "it won't happen again, that's not happening now, etc" but that's not what you need to hear. She needs to own up to her side and understand how you're feeling, not try to take your pain away. Words won't do that. If you want to hurt her, tell her that. Show her and tell her how badly you're hurting. That will (or should) hurt her and you're not being malicious about it.

My wife has always taken tons of videos of the kids, and they each have a movie of their life. About 12-18 months ago I tried watching one for some reason and couldn't do it. ALL I could think about was that it was all a lie, who she was ****ing at the time, etc. I never wanted to see them again. And yeah, any time I was hurting I made damn sure she was hurting too.

Funny timing, I watched one of them today and I didn't think anything of it, besides how cute my kids are and how much I missed out on. If I hadn't read your post, I wouldn't have even thought about it. And if I did, I (probably) wouldn't trigger. It's more of a "well, that sucks" and moving on. Eventually you have to learn to accept that the past is what it is and it cannot be changed. It takes a long time to get there, but it does get better.


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## re16 (Oct 9, 2012)

bobert said:


> Your triggers and your response to them is completely normal. Sometimes you need to just remind yourself "the way I'm feeling is normal and expected". Triggers are going to happen but they do lose their power over time.



Good advice on how to deal with triggers and this will without a doubt be helpful for him down the road, but to me, this situation is a potential rugsweep currently. We shouldn't yet jump to helping him heal when there is potentially more pain / discovery to come.

He is setting himself up for continued pain as he thinks about this situation over the long haul and realizes that there are more un-answered questions. He got full blown trickle truth from her, and then believes that the last story is now truth? Doubtful.

It went from Facebook only, to searching him daily, to he asked to meet for lunch, to actually met for lunch, to he kissed her after lunch. We all know what kissed means in cheater-speak...

He needs to finish discovery to find out what he is really dealing with.


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## bobert (Nov 22, 2018)

re16 said:


> He needs to finish discovery to find out what he is really dealing with.


I agree he needs to get to the bottom of this, but regardless of where he is in the process the triggers still have to be dealt with.


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## Gabriel (May 10, 2011)

I think you should still just lay low and be in sleuth mode. Do this for a few months. If you continue to find nothing over and over the comfort slowly begins to come back and you feel more trusting in your wife. If you catch something? Well, that's a win as well, because then you got the information you needed.

It might drive you a little crazy but the end is worth it. I did this for a really long time. Once the coast is clear X times you feel not terrible, then 2X times you feel okay, then 3X you feel mildly good. Maybe by 5X you are back to normal.


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## cp3o (Jun 2, 2018)

Trust - but verify.

If the verification reveals nothing of concern the trust will grow - slowly, sometimes two steps forward and then one back - but grow it will. 

Will it ever reach the previous degree? - possibly not - but possibly it gets near enough. 

There's only one way to find out - do you want to spend the months, perhaps years, doing so?


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## PieceOfSky (Apr 7, 2013)

Keep a journal. Maybe on online and password encrypted (eg, Penzu.com, or “private” folders on OneDrive.com or the like).

You may find yourself years down the road wondering to what degree you rugswept things you can no longer remember completely. You may find yourself wishing you could revisit what you knew and when, and how she manipulated your view of the truth.

I remember my first discovery of her outright lying to me. It’s a bizarre feeling I never expected in my life. For me, the lying and continued deceit, and open questions 10+ later are worse and more destructive than anything else. To pretend at another’s expense (stealing days of a life) is an awful thing to do. Do not be afraid to see/accept the awfulness of her deceit. She did what she did.

Sorry you have to deal with this.


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