# Mama's Boy



## Forever His411 (Jun 15, 2015)

I need some advice. My husband is such a mama's boy. This is something that I've been dealing with our whole relationship. This time it was about my car. He always lets his mom use his, which leaves him to take mine, and me with no car. I wouldn't mind her using it every now and then, but this is constant. Many times, without my knowledge. She usually brings the car back on Sunday night. It was getting late and I asked "Is your mom bringing the car?" He said, "You don't need it this week do you?" I run a daycare from my home and have a total of 9 kids during the day. I said, "Well, I need my car in case of emergency." He got so mad and called me selfish. He said, "Okay, we can fix that. I will just let her use the car and you have to take me to work everyday, so you can have your car". How would this possibly be a better solution? Now you are messing with our 4 kids (under the age of 6) and my sleep to please her. He completely turned everything around and started talking about everything he does for me and how our upbringings are different. Sorry this is so long. Does anyone have any advice?


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## *LittleDeer* (Apr 19, 2012)

Why does she borrow the car? 

How long has it been going on? 

How is your marriage otherwise? 

Is your husband respectful to you? 

Do you make joint decisions? 

What else happens regarding his mother that you don't like?


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## LonelyinLove (Jul 11, 2013)

Granny needs to buy or rent a car of her own.

Mama's boy's......been there.....Ugh.


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## Forever His411 (Jun 15, 2015)

She borrows the car because she does not have her own. She uses it to get to work. But, today she is off and here I am with no car. This has been going on for about 9 months. Before this, we gave her our other car, but she ran it down by letting everyone else drive it. Other than issues with him catering to his family before our own, there are not many other issues. He is respectful towards me, but when it comes to her, he does not compromise. He will take her side no matter what. Last year, we were gracious enough to take her on vacation with is. We paid for everything. She kept me up all night, making noise until 3 or 4 in the morning. She woke me up at like 6 and I asked "Are you awake? " I said "no". Then she asked for some aspirin and I told her she could get it out of my purse. She was mad of me saying no in my half sleep! And I mean mad. However, she never came to me. She told him after he had to keep asking what's wrong. He took her side and said i was in the wrong and it completely ruined the rest of our vacation.


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## Forever His411 (Jun 15, 2015)

It has actually gotten better than it was in the beginning, that's why I'm still here. When we got our first place. A one bedroom apartment. He moved his brother, mom, and 2 sisters in. They had no respect for my home and it was filthy. If i said something about cleaning up, he would get mad at me. That was at our worst and he had improved by running things vy me and having respect for how I felt about people constantly in my house. However, it seems that he's going back to his old ways. Not running things by me. He said he is the man of the household, so he doesn't have to.


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## EnjoliWoman (Jul 2, 2012)

You mention your upbringings are different. Are you, or is he, from a patriarchal culture? That can be difficult to undo. You have four children - are they all yours or are some from the home daycare?

It sounds as if he is used to being 'king' because he is male and his mother treated him this way and reaffirms his position in the home and that is why he will take her side. 

I'm not sure that will be any changing him unless he is willing to go to marriage counseling where he will have to focus on you and the marital issues.


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## Forever His411 (Jun 15, 2015)

The difference in our upbringings is that his dad wasn't always there and his mom struggled, so he was forced to grow up fast and take care of her and 4 siblings. I never struggled and lived comfortably. I really don't know what that has to do with anything. We have 4 children to our own, which he is a great daddy to. That is a great explanation as to why it acts this way. I'm very relaxed and it takes a lot to make me say something, but when i do, it's the end of the world. I think that counseling would be great but he would never do it.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Your MIL borrows your car and then she loans it out to other people? Who does she loan it out to?


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## Melinda123 (May 1, 2015)

I married a mama's boy. I would say RUN AWAY but you have the kids. Any chance he and his siblings could chip in and buy Mom a car so she leaves yours alone? Especially since she loans it out. No way would I tolerate that. Mama tried to move her mother in here and I put a stop to that after the first night. I loved Grandma, but she was in dementia and spoke her native tongue, which I don't. She woke up screaming because she didn't know where she was. MAMA had suitcases in her trunk of Grandma's belongings she planned to leave with me, with Grandma. A counselor told me the husband needs to put his wife first and his mom/siblings second. Mine refused and has to this day (30 years). Try to make changes now or you will forever deal with this. Move far away from them if possible for a job change - the farther away the better if you want your own life. We only moved an hour away; we managed to stay married but it has been rocky. We should have moved farther. Good luck to you.


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## Forever His411 (Jun 15, 2015)

She is borrowing his car, so he has to use mine to get back and forth to work. I don't know if she lets anyone use his car now, but at one point we GAVE her our first car. She ran that one down by letting his brothers and sisters drive it. They will not chip in to buy her a car because they see that she can easily get back and forth by taking advantage of ours, so they don't believe it's necessary and don't have the money for it anyway. Mind you, we stay about 30 minutes away from them. All of his siblings stay on her street. His brother has 2 cars that he shares with his gf and his sister just got one...


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## Forever His411 (Jun 15, 2015)

We've been together for 7 years and at this point it seems like nothing will change. The only thing I see different right now is that he hasn't let anyone stay with us again. At least one of his family members has stayed with us in 5 out of the 7 years of being together. I really don't want to end things because of this, but if things don't get better it'll drive me crazy =(


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## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

Your H needs to cut the apron strings. You must demand it. The marriage makes you first in all instances. You will battle this until mama is passed on. In no uncertain terms you demand the car(which is yours) stays in the drive no matter what. 

If he does not cut the strings the resentment will build until you do throw in the towel. You are almost there. Your H has to choice. The obvious choice happened way back when at your wedding. Unfortunately mama is a third in your marriage.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Forever His411 said:


> He said he is the man of the household, so he doesn't have to.


Your husband do not see the two of you as equals, or partners. He sees himself as superior to you. 

Perhaps there is a way to get him to understand that you are his partner and you have equal say into things.

What percentage of your joint income do you earn with your daycare.

How essential is that income to your family's financial well being?


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## Forever His411 (Jun 15, 2015)

EleGirl said:


> Forever His411 said:
> 
> 
> > He said he is the man of the household, so he doesn't have to.
> ...


My income is about 40% of our household income, so I definitely pull me weight around our home. I don't understand what would make him think that he is superior to me, unless he has adapted the man over woman complex. I have a degree. He has a degree. We got this house together and technically both the cars are mine...none of us are more superior than the other, but this may not be his point of view.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Forever His411 said:


> My income is about 40% of our household income, so I definitely pull me weight around our home. I don't understand what would make him think that he is superior to me, unless he has adapted the man over woman complex. I have a degree. He has a degree. We got this house together and technically both the cars are mine...none of us are more superior than the other, but this may not be his point of view.


Most likely it's a combination of two things: 

1) a segment of our society does believe that. 

2) He is his mother's surrogate husband (he filled in when her husband was no around) so his mother is telling him these things. She is in a fight with you over him. You are the woman who stole her 'husband'. She has grown to believe that she needs him to survive. He believes it too. So it's easy for her to manipulate him. Have no doubt that behind your back she is filling his head with things like he does all for you and you do nothing. He supports you so you should be grateful and accept his decisions.

Put those two together and you have your marriage.

It is very common for a woman whose husband abandons her either emotionally and in fact, to co opt her son to fill in for a lot of the things that a husband would not (not sexual). The son becomes the one who fills her emotional needs and takes on the role of head of household. Mothers who do this often end up with a strong control over that son because he took on that role when he was not emotionally ready. This is a pretty well known dynamic. 


I was married to a mamma's boy. This is exactly what his mother did. She did fill his head with things about him being the head of the household. That I should be grateful, etc. I actually over heard her say some of those things when she thought I was out of range.

One time she was chewing me out for being an ungrateful wife (according to her). She was going on and on about how he supported me, how I was not keeping the house clean enough, etc.

I almost died laughing in her face. I supported him most of our marriage. He was in medical school and had no school debt. So you know how much I was supporting him financially. 

But in her mind he was the MAN and so he was in charge.

None of it has to make sense in the real world. She just has to spin a tail that makes your husband feel like the big man. Fill his head with complements and how she could not make it without him.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Is there any way that you can afford to go out and buy a car?


I had a counselor tell me once that one of my problems is that I acted like a girlfriend and not a wife. A wife is the queen of the castle. The queen does not put up with this nonsense.


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## Hicks (Jan 14, 2011)

Will he change, probably not. You married him and chose this. Not fair to expect him to change from what you picked in a man.
I would hide the car keys though.


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## Forever His411 (Jun 15, 2015)

EleGirl said:


> Forever His411 said:
> 
> 
> > My income is about 40% of our household income, so I definitely pull me weight around our home. I don't understand what would make him think that he is superior to me, unless he has adapted the man over woman complex. I have a degree. He has a degree. We got this house together and technically both the cars are mine...none of us are more superior than the other, but this may not be his point of view.
> ...


I don't know if she's filling his head with things. Her and I get along, but maybe that's only because I keep my feelings and thoughts to myself. But what you stated seems exactly what is going on. That's her man...not mine...it's like he has 2 wives and has to support 2 households, often at my expense. Unless some miracle happens, I don't think this will ever change.


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## Forever His411 (Jun 15, 2015)

EleGirl said:


> Is there any way that you can afford to go out and buy a car?
> 
> 
> I had a counselor tell me once that one of my problems is that I acted like a girlfriend and not a wife. A wife is the queen of the castle. The queen does not put up with this nonsense.


I think I let too many things just slide and let it go just to avoid any confrontation. This is something that I need to work on and stand up to things that are just wrong. Even if I could afford to buy a car, I would not buy one for her. I work too hard to give something to someone who makes no effort. She has a decent paying job. Her rent isn't high. I PAY her phone bill. She's received numerous income taxes with nothing to show. She is not making an effort because she is being taken care of at my expense.


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## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

Forever His411 said:


> I don't know if she's filling his head with things. Her and I get along, but maybe that's only because I keep my feelings and thoughts to myself. But what you stated seems exactly what is going on. That's her man...not mine...it's like he has 2 wives and has to support 2 households, often at my expense. Unless some miracle happens, *I don't think this will ever change.*


On the contrary, lay it out to your H. Everyone has their limit. You are here posting. That indicates you are getting close to your limit.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Forever His411 said:


> I think I let too many things just slide and let it go just to avoid any confrontation. This is something that I need to work on and stand up to things that are just wrong. Even if I could afford to buy a car, I would not buy one for her. I work too hard to give something to someone who makes no effort. She has a decent paying job. Her rent isn't high. I PAY her phone bill. She's received numerous income taxes with nothing to show. She is not making an effort because she is being taken care of at my expense.


You can set some boundaries here. You earn 40% of the income. Do not mix your income with his. That way he has to talk to you about things and get your agreement.

Then press on him to get her to buy her own darn car and pay her own phone bills.


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## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

Forever His411 said:


> I think I let too many things just slide and let it go just to avoid any confrontation. This is something that I need to work on and stand up to things that are just wrong. Even if I could afford to buy a car, I would not buy one for her. I work too hard to give something to someone who makes no effort. She has a decent paying job. Her rent isn't high. I PAY her phone bill. She's received numerous income taxes with nothing to show. She is not making an effort because she is being taken care of at my expense.


If your MIL has other children then ALL should pitch in for a car for her. 

Look, there is no shame in standing your ground. At the end of the day you do not require your MIL support. Looking at your previous post of 40% of household income you do not need much help from you H. So what is keeping you from standing your ground and make some rules?


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## Forever His411 (Jun 15, 2015)

EleGirl said:


> Forever His411 said:
> 
> 
> > I think I let too many things just slide and let it go just to avoid any confrontation. This is something that I need to work on and stand up to things that are just wrong. Even if I could afford to buy a car, I would not buy one for her. I work too hard to give something to someone who makes no effort. She has a decent paying job. Her rent isn't high. I PAY her phone bill. She's received numerous income taxes with nothing to show. She is not making an effort because she is being taken care of at my expense.
> ...


We don't mix our income already. Weird. I know. He chooses to give money to his mom and siblings. I let him do that with his money because it's definitely not going to be from ours. It works out better this way. I pay certain bills. He pays the others. He is oblivious in seeing that her money is not going where it's supposed to.


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## Forever His411 (Jun 15, 2015)

Yeswecan said:


> Forever His411 said:
> 
> 
> > I think I let too many things just slide and let it go just to avoid any confrontation. This is something that I need to work on and stand up to things that are just wrong. Even if I could afford to buy a car, I would not buy one for her. I work too hard to give something to someone who makes no effort. She has a decent paying job. Her rent isn't high. I PAY her phone bill. She's received numerous income taxes with nothing to show. She is not making an effort because she is being taken care of at my expense.
> ...


What is keeping me from standing my ground is I hate conflict. Whenever I do stand my ground, he turns everything around on me. That I'm selfish, etc..I don't care to argue, so I just go with the flow. However, now I'm getting tired of it.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

You stand your ground by telling him that you are sick of it and that you are thinking of ending the marriage due to his total disregard for you in certain things.

It's called destablizing the marriage. The purpose it to shake it up enough to make change necessary. But you have to be willing to follow through.


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## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

Forever His411 said:


> What is keeping me from standing my ground is I hate conflict. Whenever I do stand my ground, he turns everything around on me. That I'm selfish, etc..I don't care to argue, so I just go with the flow. However, now I'm getting tired of it.


Forever,

Sometimes you just got to face it dead on. Do not allow you H to turn a darn thing around on you. He is to simply sit and shut up while you gather your thoughts and express them in a calm manner. He is not to sigh, make phrumping noises or simply walk away. That is nothing but a show of disrespect. Your H is to respect you first and always. This includes over mama and anyone else. No if, and or but. 

Let me say this...I was a lout like your H and did my mom's bidding over my W. This went on for years. I was blind to it. It created a bunch of resentment in my W. I had to cut the strings. I had to stop considering my mother over my W in all things. Do you know how my W got through to me? Standing her ground and not putting up with it any longer. For me...I had to face up to my mom and let her know how it was going to be. You know what? My mother completely understood. She gained more respect for my W as a result.

If your H still road blocks and turns it around. Advise separation is imminent. And mean it. Sometimes you need to be on board with losing it to save it.

I have heard the D word a few times in my day. :surprise: But it helped me ship up and not ship out. :grin2:


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## Forever His411 (Jun 15, 2015)

Yeswecan said:


> Forever His411 said:
> 
> 
> > What is keeping me from standing my ground is I hate conflict. Whenever I do stand my ground, he turns everything around on me. That I'm selfish, etc..I don't care to argue, so I just go with the flow. However, now I'm getting tired of it.
> ...


Good to hear from an ex mama's boy point of view. May I ask, what made you be that way initially? It's really hard to think of the D word with 4 young kids. But if it is about my happiness, then it may be thrown out there to see if anything changes. I see that standing my ground is really the only way. Not just with the car, but with everything else that comes up and involves her.


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## thinsection (Jun 10, 2015)

Over the years I've seen few situations like this. You've got a couple of dynamics going on here. Hubby is not only a Mama's boy, he's also a contributing member of a micro-welfare state. In a micro-welfare state, there is an ongoing sharing of resources - a what's-mine-is-yours-and vice-versa attitude. Not a horrible situation if you see the world that way, but a little unsettling if you're a little more self-centered. In this world, a person with your viewpoint is perceived as being selfish.

A few thoughts:

1) This is the world you married into. You can't change it - it is bigger than you. You either need to accept it, or move on. Do NOT try to change it, or put pressure on your marriage. YOU will be seen as the bad guy, and you are terribly out-numbered. It will get you in the end, and be very hard on you before that happens.

2) If you accept the situation, treat Mama as one of your kids. That's right, make sure she's well looked after, gets to where she needs to be etc. More work for you, but at the end of the day, everybody will be happier (including you). Mama will probably end up living with you eventually. She'll get sick, or too old to work, and will need taking care of, and your husband will step up.

3) If you reject the situation, move on now. Like, today.

4) If you want to keep kicking the can down the road, so to speak, do what has to be done to get Mama a car. It sounds like she's returning yours long enough for you to put gas in, and then taking it again. In other words, you've given her your car AND you're putting gas in it. Getting her her own car may not cost as much as you think.

I could tell a lot of stories about similar situations, but the bottom line is that your happiness relies on acceptance, or starting over. Acceptance will be best for the kids, but starting over won't hurt them as badly as you think. Your hubby is generous, after all )


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## IamSomebody (Nov 21, 2014)

If you divorce, a good chunk of your husband's pay will go toward you in the way of child support. There will be very little in the way of funds for mommy dearest and his siblings. You could keep the house, with both of you paying toward it, until all your children are out of the house. Then the house is sold and the equity is split.

IamSomebody


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## poida (Jan 17, 2014)

You are here complaining so it is obviously becoming an unacceptable issue for you.

Regardless of what the issue is, it is your responsibility to communicate this to your husband.

It's all about communication.

I am going to go out on a limb and suggest that you have a hard time expressing exactly how you feel to your husband. 

Speaking from experience, it can also take a lot to get someone's attention, and may not even happen until you leave them or affair.

If you don't want it to go that far, you need to make a connection with your husband and tell him exactly how the events that have transpired have affected how you feel about him.

Forget the details of the issue. Just find a moment when you can make a calm emotional connection (perhaps after love making), and tell him that you feel distant from him and that you feel less attracted to him right now. Be totally open and honest. If you feel more, say so. The aim is to get his full attention and have him worried and listening.

Once you have his attention, I would suggest that you ask for marriage counselling. Tell him that there are things you need to work on together for the marriage to continue.

I can't stress how important it is to TELL HIM you feel distant and less romantically interested in him. I wish my wife had said this before she had an affair.

Good luck.


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## sisters359 (Apr 9, 2009)

You need to tell him you have entertained thoughts of divorce, and why. You need to mean it, though--throwing out the word just to get his attention is not fighting fair. But you HAVE had such thoughts, and he--as the husband and father of a family that might be on that road--both needs and deserves to know.

You don't like conflict, so perhaps you need to start some individual counseling (IC) to get yourself ready for it. There will be no change, no progress, without conflict. Here's the thing: conflict doesn't have to be ugly. "Conflict" means two or more things cannot co-exist (Think about telling a friend that you can't meet them at such-and-such a time, because you have a "conflict," something else that requires your attention). 

You might try to think of things that create conflict--obviously, right now the two things in direct conflict are your need for your car and your MIL's need for a car. Viewed that way, conflict resolution is possible. If he handles things for mom, then he needs to solve the problem--because the car is yours, you need it, so another means must be found. Tell him this is non-negotiable: you need your car. (Why doesn't he drive her to work or she drive him, by the way? Why does any of this need to involve you and your car?)

You said he said he was "the man of the house" so his decision was final. Wow, how did you take that? I know I would have laughed. He's man of the house--but you're woman of the house. Partners. Equals. 

Start the IC before you take your stand if you think you need to; otherwise, make this stand and see how it goes. Do not be intimidated by the financial aspect of divorce--you are clearly able to take care of your kids and earn an income. Of course it will be much easier if he is willing and able to work with you to address marital issues--but either way, you will be all right. Happily divorced is much better than unhappily married. 

Good luck.


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## AliceA (Jul 29, 2010)

You didn't agree to become his 2nd wife. You obviously married with the belief that you would be his one and only wife. By saying his mommy is of higher importance than you, he's basically saying she's wife no. 1.


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## poida (Jan 17, 2014)

Speaking from experience, your husband very likley has childhood experiences which are causing a rather extreme sense of responsibility for his mother. Only a counsellor will help with this.

Tell him how you feel deep down, how you REALLY feel about him. Use the D word ONLY if you mean it, otherwise just something true that will shock him into action.


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## *LittleDeer* (Apr 19, 2012)

To me it sounds like he's manipulative and emotional ally abusive, he dismisses you and if you confront him he twists things around. 
That's just not OK.
You need to start standing up to him and standing your ground. Decide what's acceptable and unacceptable in many areas of your life and don't kept people walk all over you. You need to do the 180. 

I would also insist on counselling, because this is unhealthy. 

Good luck.


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## Forever His411 (Jun 15, 2015)

thinsection said:


> Over the years I've seen few situations like this. You've got a couple of dynamics going on here. Hubby is not only a Mama's boy, he's also a contributing member of a micro-welfare state. In a micro-welfare state, there is an ongoing sharing of resources - a what's-mine-is-yours-and vice-versa attitude. Not a horrible situation if you see the world that way, but a little unsettling if you're a little more self-centered. In this world, a person with your viewpoint is perceived as being selfish.
> 
> A few thoughts:
> 
> ...


I definitely agree. He shares resources, such as the car and our home at one point. You could say that I am selfish towards the idea. However, I feel that they are very justifiable. I need my car for emergencies, appointments, etc. What if something happens to the car? We are responsible. We have to pay whatever damages occur. We'll be the ones missing a car if someone gets in an accident. Whenever I bring up these real life occurrences. He says I'm being negative. No, I'm being realistic. You have clearly stated my options and honestly I can't see my self continue to take care of a grown woman who is well and able to take care of herself. I've been doing that since I was 19! I'm 25 now and I'm so over it.


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## Forever His411 (Jun 15, 2015)

sisters359 said:


> You need to tell him you have entertained thoughts of divorce, and why. You need to mean it, though--throwing out the word just to get his attention is not fighting fair. But you HAVE had such thoughts, and he--as the husband and father of a family that might be on that road--both needs and deserves to know.
> 
> You don't like conflict, so perhaps you need to start some individual counseling (IC) to get yourself ready for it. There will be no change, no progress, without conflict. Here's the thing: conflict doesn't have to be ugly. "Conflict" means two or more things cannot co-exist (Think about telling a friend that you can't meet them at such-and-such a time, because you have a "conflict," something else that requires your attention).
> 
> ...


There ARE other options. He can easily drop her off to work. She works at 6am...he works at 7:30am. But know why he won't? It's an inconvenience to him and he would much rather inconvenience me than himself. He has a sibling with 2 cars that he shares with his gf, who stays on her street. However, she won't let anybody use her car. She's considered the "b" and no one likes her. His other sibling, who lives NEXT door, just got a car and yet my car is the only option. No, you're making it the only option.

I definitely laughed at the "man of the house" statement. Because of this, I must run everything by him and he doesn't have to run anything by me. Last time I checked, we were supposed to be making joint decisions.

Conflict may cause him to fling out the D word before me....because it involves mom. And when it involves mom, it's the end of the world. I know I am very able to take care of myself and the kids, but the finances are not everything that I'm worried about.


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## Forever His411 (Jun 15, 2015)

*LittleDeer* said:


> To me it sounds like he's manipulative and emotional ally abusive, he dismisses you and if you confront him he twists things around.
> That's just not OK.
> You need to start standing up to him and standing your ground. Decide what's acceptable and unacceptable in many areas of your life and don't kept people walk all over you. You need to do the 180.
> 
> ...


Are these signs of an emotionally abusive relationship? I see that I will need to be the one to make the changes. Not him.


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## Forever His411 (Jun 15, 2015)

Counseling will be something that I bring up. If this doesn't get resolved, I can at least say I tried.


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## lucy999 (Sep 28, 2014)

I'm not a parent, so obviously I'm not well-versed in the laws of in-home daycare, but if I had a child in your home and knew that you didn't have access to transportation, I'd yank my kid out immediately. And then I'd tell the other families that were in your employ the same thing. And well, that 40% of your income would be lost.

In my mind, it's not safe to take care of those kids and not have transportation. 

Tell that to your husband.


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## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

Forever His411 said:


> I definitely agree. He shares resources, such as the car and our home at one point. You could say that I am selfish towards the idea. However, I feel that they are very justifiable. I need my car for emergencies, appointments, etc. What if something happens to the car? We are responsible. We have to pay whatever damages occur. We'll be the ones missing a car if someone gets in an accident. Whenever I bring up these real life occurrences. He says I'm being negative. No, I'm being realistic. You have clearly stated my options and honestly I can't see my self continue to take care of a grown woman who is well and able to take care of herself. I've been doing that since I was 19! I'm 25 now and I'm so over it.


Ah...you think like me. My W transports our two nieces to school twice a week. When the car breaks down, needs gas, oil changed or a simple cleaning you can guess who flips the bill. When the these issues crop up I simply get, "Let me know when it's fixed." No help with anything on the vehicle. 

I agree in sharing the resources. I also agree in sharing the upkeep and maintenance. The latter never happens.


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## Forever His411 (Jun 15, 2015)

lucy999 said:


> I'm not a parent, so obviously I'm not well-versed in the laws of in-home daycare, but if I had a child in your home and knew that you didn't have access to transportation, I'd yank my kid out immediately. And then I'd tell the other families that were in your employ the same thing. And well, that 40% of your income would be lost.
> 
> In my mind, it's not safe to take care of those kids and not have transportation.
> 
> Tell that to your husband.


I did! He said "good job thinking ahead, but stop being negative." How am I being negative!? I'm being realistic! I watch 9 kids under the age of 6. Anything can happen! He says well if something happens I'll just drive from work. So I just sit here waiting for you for an hour or more?! He makes no sense. There is a firestation with emts about 30 seconds away from my home, but I still need my car for any other emergency and I know the parents may think the same thing. One said yesterday, I didn't see your car, so I thought you weren't here. They notice!


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## Forever His411 (Jun 15, 2015)

Yeswecan said:


> Forever His411 said:
> 
> 
> > I definitely agree. He shares resources, such as the car and our home at one point. You could say that I am selfish towards the idea. However, I feel that they are very justifiable. I need my car for emergencies, appointments, etc. What if something happens to the car? We are responsible. We have to pay whatever damages occur. We'll be the ones missing a car if someone gets in an accident. Whenever I bring up these real life occurrences. He says I'm being negative. No, I'm being realistic. You have clearly stated my options and honestly I can't see my self continue to take care of a grown woman who is well and able to take care of herself. I've been doing that since I was 19! I'm 25 now and I'm so over it.
> ...


Exactly! She never offers to fix anything on the car, nor do any maintenence. My H also doesn't keep up my car. I have to maintain it myself, although now I don't even have it.


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## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

Forever His411 said:


> Exactly! She never offers to fix anything on the car, nor do any maintenence. My H also doesn't keep up my car. I have to maintain it myself, although now I don't even have it.


In this statement I can only see that your H/his family view you(for lack of a better word)as a tool. You are something that provides cash, car and a clean place to live. Nothing more. 

My W never keeps the maintenance on our vehicles. She fills it with gas. If there is an issue I repair it. This goes with the appliances, home or any other mechanical object. I do not expect my W to maintain these items. That is just me. 

I can say though, that the use of the vehicle/driving my BIL kids to school does not go without notice. First, we get to spend time with the nieces. Second, our BIL shows his appreciation with purchasing dinner for me/w from time to time. You see, he is divorced and needs the help. We are ok with that. However, outright use of the vehicle without a thanks, help in maintenance or simply filling the friggin tank upon return is rude and uncaring.


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## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

Forever His411 said:


> I did! He said "good job thinking ahead, but stop being negative." How am I being negative!? I'm being realistic! I watch 9 kids under the age of 6. Anything can happen! He says well if something happens I'll just drive from work. So I just sit here waiting for you for an hour or more?! He makes no sense. There is a firestation with emts about 30 seconds away from my home, but I still need my car for any other emergency and I know the parents may think the same thing. One said yesterday, I didn't see your car, so I thought you weren't here. They notice!


You know what...what if you did not need the car but it being the driveway affords you a peace of mind? Does your H give one iota that simply having the means of transportation(even if you never use it) sitting in the drive makes you feel secure? Sometimes it ain't about if the car will be used. 

Kind of like a gun for home defense. You never want to use it...EVER. But, you feel better because it is there.


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## IamSomebody (Nov 21, 2014)

Forever His411 said:


> I definitely agree. He shares resources, such as the car and our home at one point. You could say that I am selfish towards the idea. However, I feel that they are very justifiable. I need my car for emergencies, appointments, etc. What if something happens to the car? We are responsible. We have to pay whatever damages occur. We'll be the ones missing a car if someone gets in an accident. Whenever I bring up these real life occurrences. He says I'm being negative. No, I'm being realistic. You have clearly stated my options and honestly I can't see my self continue to take care of a grown woman who is well and able to take care of herself. I've been doing that since I was 19! I'm 25 now and I'm so over it.


If MIL is not listed as a driver on your insurance, listing the real percentage of time she drives the car as well as the fact she drives the car to work, the insurance won't pay for any damages. You and your husband could then be sued for every penny you have, including your home. Also, you may end up charged (criminally) with insurance fraud.

IamSomebody


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## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

IamSomebody said:


> If MIL is not listed as a driver on your insurance, listing the real percentage of time she drives the car as well as the fact she drives the car to work, the insurance won't pay for any damages. You and your husband could then be sued for every penny you have, including your home. Also, you may end up charged (criminally) with insurance fraud.
> 
> IamSomebody


Not true. The insurance follows the vehicle. Comprehensive/full coverage will follow the car. At least in MD. I confirmed this as a result of an accident.

If that were the case no one would EVER loan a legal licensed driver their car.


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## Forever His411 (Jun 15, 2015)

Yeswecan said:


> IamSomebody said:
> 
> 
> > If MIL is not listed as a driver on your insurance, listing the real percentage of time she drives the car as well as the fact she drives the car to work, the insurance won't pay for any damages. You and your husband could then be sued for every penny you have, including your home. Also, you may end up charged (criminally) with insurance fraud.
> ...


She's not legally licensed. It's suspended/expired due to unpaid tickets...


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## EnjoliWoman (Jul 2, 2012)

Copied/pasted... I bolded the ones that have been demonstrated just in your posts. Only you can answer the others.

Psychological abuse can look like:

Humiliating or embarrassing you.
Constant put-downs.
* Hypercriticism.*
* Refusing to communicate.*
* Ignoring or excluding you.*
Extramarital affairs.
Provocative behavior with opposite sex.
* Use of sarcasm and unpleasant tone of voice.*
Unreasonable jealousy.
* Extreme moodiness.*
Mean jokes or constantly making fun of you.
Saying “I love you but…”
Saying things like “If you don’t _____, I will_____.”
* Domination and control.*
Withdrawal of affection.
* Guilt trips.*
* Making everything your fault.*
Isolating you from friends and family.
Using money to control.
Constant calling or texting when you are not with him/her.
Threatening to commit suicide if you leave.


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## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

Forever His411 said:


> She's not legally licensed. It's suspended/expired due to unpaid tickets...


Huge no no sister. You will be held liable as your MIL is not legally able to drive. This should be brought to your H attention.


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## Tivo (Jun 16, 2015)

Forever His411 said:


> She's not legally licensed. It's suspended/expired due to unpaid tickets...


You're letting an unlicensed driver operate your vehicle?

Wow that's just plain stupid.

If she causes injuries or damage there will be no insurance coverage, you could lose everything you own and then some.


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## Forever His411 (Jun 15, 2015)

intheory said:


> Forever,
> 
> This is ridiculous. Your mother-in-law is a selfish, old b|tch and that's all there is to it. She is employed, and you did not mention any health issues. She has other family members, who live nearer to her, who could also help.
> 
> ...


She is definitely someone who manipulates and take advantage of others. I am very kind hearted, but at some point enough is enough. When we went on vacation last year, I truly felt like I was the nanny or something and they were the couple. "Hey, get a pic of me and mama". "Mama said you yelled at her in your sleep"...like really?

And get this....she HAS a man. A younger one. They been together almost 10 years. I've heard that this is where all her money goes. Actually, I was on maternity leave not too long ago (so no income coming in). She had to stay with us a couple of days because her lights were off. While she is there, she asks me for $40. I said no, I don't have any money to handout. His sister then ser me aside and said, "don't give her any money. It's for her bfs phone bill". The nerve!


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## Forever His411 (Jun 15, 2015)

Yeswecan said:


> Forever His411 said:
> 
> 
> > She's not legally licensed. It's suspended/expired due to unpaid tickets...
> ...





Tivo said:


> Forever His411 said:
> 
> 
> > She's not legally licensed. It's suspended/expired due to unpaid tickets...
> ...


I know! I bring this up and he tells me his same old "Stop thinking negative." Both these cars are in MY name and I am not allowed an opinion about them. It's ridiculous and he's really risking a lot. However, he does not see this. At all.


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## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

Forever His411 said:


> She is definitely someone who manipulates and take advantage of others. I am very kind hearted, but at some point enough is enough. When we went on vacation last year, I truly felt like I was the nanny or something and they were the couple. "Hey, get a pic of me and mama". "Mama said you yelled at her in your sleep"...like really?
> 
> And get this....she HAS a man. A younger one. They been together almost 10 years. I've heard that this is where all her money goes. Actually, I was on maternity leave not too long ago (so no income coming in). She had to stay with us a couple of days because her lights were off. While she is there, she asks me for $40. I said no, I don't have any money to handout. His sister then ser me aside and said, "don't give her any money. It's for her bfs phone bill". The nerve!


I don't lone money for phone bills, credit cards and the like. If you need some dough for food or a utility like electricity will be cut off then I'm ok with that.


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## Forever His411 (Jun 15, 2015)

EnjoliWoman said:


> Copied/pasted... I bolded the ones that have been demonstrated just in your posts. Only you can answer the others.
> 
> Psychological abuse can look like:
> 
> ...


Thanks. I looked more into this and I think that I am in fact being emotional abused, which is NOT okay.


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## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

Forever His411 said:


> I know! I bring this up and he tells me his same old "Stop thinking negative." Both these cars are in MY name and I am not allowed an opinion about them. It's ridiculous and he's really risking a lot. However, he does not see this. At all.


here is the deal Forever...the cars are in your name. You are liable. You tell your H you are not sticking your neck out for his mothers poor choice of not paying parking tickets. 

BTW, the car in your name you get the choice on who does what with them. That simple.


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## Forever His411 (Jun 15, 2015)

Yeswecan said:


> Forever His411 said:
> 
> 
> > She is definitely someone who manipulates and take advantage of others. I am very kind hearted, but at some point enough is enough. When we went on vacation last year, I truly felt like I was the nanny or something and they were the couple. "Hey, get a pic of me and mama". "Mama said you yelled at her in your sleep"...like really?
> ...


I don't either. Her phone bill only gets paid because she's on my plan and if I don't, mine will get cut off. He was paying half of it at first, but suddenly that stopped.


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## EnjoliWoman (Jul 2, 2012)

I"m not a fan of passive-aggressive tactics, but I'd be SO tempted to call the police and tell them about an unlicensed driver, complete with make/model and tag#. Let her get taken to jail for driving while license is revoked. They'll never know it was you who reported it.


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## Forever His411 (Jun 15, 2015)

Yeswecan said:


> Forever His411 said:
> 
> 
> > I know! I bring this up and he tells me his same old "Stop thinking negative." Both these cars are in MY name and I am not allowed an opinion about them. It's ridiculous and he's really risking a lot. However, he does not see this. At all.
> ...


Since the car he is letting her use he pays for, he says it's his and that I have no say, which is un fair to say the least. I need to knock it into his head that what he is doing is dumb.


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## Forever His411 (Jun 15, 2015)

EnjoliWoman said:


> I"m not a fan of passive-aggressive tactics, but I'd be SO tempted to call the police and tell them about an unlicensed driver, complete with make/model and tag#. Let her get taken to jail for driving while license is revoked. They'll never know it was you who reported it.


Would anything happen to the car?


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## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

I'm going to offer one last thing.

Your H is afraid to approach his mother with your concerns. He is afraid to say no to his mother. He is afraid of the possible repercussions. It could be disowned by mama or the family. Could be not wanting to be cut out of a will. Could be he just wants to continually please his old mama cause he's a good little boy who does things for his mama. As for you, you give in to easy. You are easy street. He does not have worry about talking to mama about your concerns because Forever folds up like a pup tent when good old H turns the tables on her.

Again stand up for yourself. Stand your ground. Do not fold up. Do not be easy street. Be the person who will hand H repercussions for not being concerned with what you want/need concerning the car. Be the rock and hard place you put your H over this. If you don't it will never change until mama is pushing up daisies.


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## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

Forever His411 said:


> Would anything happen to the car?


Impound for you to pick up and pay for.


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## Forever His411 (Jun 15, 2015)

Yeswecan said:


> I'm going to offer one last thing.
> 
> Your H is afraid to approach his mother with your concerns. He is afraid to say no to his mother. He is afraid of the possible repercussions. It could be disowned by mama or the family. Could be not wanting to be cut out of a will. Could be he just wants to continually please his old mama cause he's a good little boy who does things for his mama. As for you, you give in to easy. You are easy street. He does not have worry about talking to mama about your concerns because Forever folds up like a pup tent when good old H turns the tables on her.
> 
> Again stand up for yourself. Stand your ground. Do not fold up. Do not be easy street. Be the person who will hand H repercussions for not being concerned with what you want/need concerning the car. Be the rock and hard place you put your H over this. If you don't it will never change until mama is pushing up daisies.


This is what I have gathered from everyone's advice. Stand up for myself and stop being doormat. I am being manipulated and taken advantage of and if that is ever going to stop, I HAVE to say something and be firm in what I say. Not just in this situation, but any other ones that come up with her.


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## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

Forever His411 said:


> This is what I have gathered from everyone's advice. Stand up for myself and stop being doormat. I am being manipulated and taken advantage of and if that is ever going to stop, I HAVE to say something and be firm in what I say. Not just in this situation, but any other ones that come up with her.


Or any situation period. Way back in the beginning of this thread I stated the W comes first before all. Your H needs to understand that and own it. And the same for you. H is first above all. (well if you are a spiritual type God comes first and that discussion is best left to another thread). Your H needs to see you as an equal. Ok, he pays for the cars BFD. So he gets to say what he wants about the cars and usage? Well then, what do you pay for that you can pull out from under him because you pay for it. Childishness at best. 

Time to take back your respect, your home and belongings. You did not marry into communal living singing Kumbaya. And who really cares if MIL does not like you as a result? She don't pay your way. If H does not like it...H can go live with mama then. Make sure he walks. The cars are in your name.


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## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

thinsection said:


> Anyway, the bottom line is that you can't fight it. Trying to drive a wedge in the relationship between your H and Mama will just end up turning the whole family against you - not fun, you don't want to go there.



Yes you can fight it and not put up with it. Drive a wedge...really...what difference does it make? Your are family. That is where it ends sometimes. You do not need to friends, spend time together and share your belongings.  Most families if not all put the FUN in dysfunctional. The Brady Bunch does not exist...but even they had their own problems. Marcia Marcia Marcia.


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## phillybeffandswiss (Jan 20, 2013)

Yeswecan said:


> If that were the case no one would EVER loan a legal licensed driver their car.


Her MIL is a habitual user and that is where the line can be drawn per insurance and states. Unlicensed makes it even worse.


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## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

phillybeffandswiss said:


> Her MIL is a habitual user and that is where the line can be drawn per insurance and states. Unlicensed makes it even worse.


 First, the insurance company will need to prove the MIL is a habitual/frequent user. Certainly the OP will not throw herself under the bus disclosing the MIL uses the car all the time. I don't see that happening. 

The unlicensed issue is MAJOR.


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## phillybeffandswiss (Jan 20, 2013)

Yeswecan said:


> First, the insurance company will need to prove the MIL is a habitual/frequent user.


I know.



Yeswecan said:


> Certainly the OP will not throw herself under the bus disclosing the MIL uses the car all the time. I don't see that happening.


See and I was thinking of MIL throwing herself "under the bus" not OP. Along the lines of, "but I thought it was okay they let me use it all of the time."



> The unlicensed issue is MAJOR.


Yes.


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## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

Forever His411 said:


> Good to hear from an ex mama's boy point of view. May I ask, what made you be that way initially? It's really hard to think of the D word with 4 young kids. But if it is about my happiness, then it may be thrown out there to see if anything changes. I see that standing my ground is really the only way. Not just with the car, but with everything else that comes up and involves her.


Over the years I did a lot for mama. It was kind of ingrained and expected. I never really cut the apron strings. Not until my W said she had enough did I face the music. It was time to be my own man. That meant cutting the strings. Did my mother drop me like a hot potato? Nope. She understood because she knew that potentially she could lose a son. I was married. My first concern, time spent and care go to my W. First and always.

It is funny, I had a lot to learn. I said to my Mon one day. My W thinks I should be taking her on dinner dates and long weekends. I do enough with working and being a dad. I thought my mom would agree with me. She did the total opposite. She said I should be doing those things. Date night and weekend away. I was flabbergasted. But, my mother was right. Marriage is something that is work and learned over time. It took me most of 20 years to figure it out. Thankfully my W stayed the course, prayed and kept the faith. It has come to pass. We are golden.


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## Forever His411 (Jun 15, 2015)

Yeswecan said:


> Forever His411 said:
> 
> 
> > Good to hear from an ex mama's boy point of view. May I ask, what made you be that way initially? It's really hard to think of the D word with 4 young kids. But if it is about my happiness, then it may be thrown out there to see if anything changes. I see that standing my ground is really the only way. Not just with the car, but with everything else that comes up and involves her.
> ...


I'm glad that you all were able to work through your issues. This is what I hopes happens with us. The D word is not something that I would easily throw around. I will focus on making it work first and hoping that he makes the necessary changes.


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## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

Forever His411 said:


> I'm glad that you all were able to work through your issues. This is what I hopes happens with us. The D word is not something that I would easily throw around. I will focus on making it work first and hoping that he makes the necessary changes.


Here is the thing. My W said to me over and over what was going on. The issues, etc. I was argumentative. Said the same crap. Uncaring, selfish. Not until my W got to the breaking point did the D come out and me get counseling. It was not like I was not aware. She was clear with every conversation we had(I would get angry about it. Another bad move). I needed to learn to listen and not react first. So, yes, talk to your H. Express to him the problem. Before you do, advise he must stay silent and listen. If he is starting to retort with everything you say and not allowing you to finish then he is not listening. At that point, walk away stating that you will continue when he is ready to listen in silence. It will be tough for him. He will start fuming with everything you are saying but shutting up and sitting still while you talk is something he will need to learn. It is called respect for you and concern for well being. Some H need to stop and listen to their W. For many, it is hard. But you know, once the H gets it...it is very easy to stop and give their W their undivided attention. In doing so, life become much less complicated, stress and argument free. Communicate. Listen. Easy formula.


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## ILoveSparkles (Oct 28, 2013)

Can you lock the car and keep the keys with you? 

If your mother gets pulled over or into an accident, she will be arrested. Does your H want his mommy to go to jail?


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## Sure that could work (Jun 9, 2015)

Forever His411 said:


> I don't either. Her phone bill only gets paid because she's on my plan and if I don't, mine will get cut off. He was paying half of it at first, but suddenly that stopped.


Right here is your first move. Take her phone off of your bill. That is ridiculous to pay for an adult's phone, she is not your child, let her pay her own phone bill. When your husband comes after you for taking her phone off your bill explain to him you signed up to be his wife not his mother's keeper. As long as she is working she can pay her own bills and you will use that money to take care of the 4 children you and the husband have to take care of. 

You should have started sticking up for yourself right away instead of being nice....sorry in this case being nice has gotten you nowhere. If you would have stuck up for yourself from the start the family would think of you as the b**** and you would be in charge of your life and home instead of the MIL being in charge. Now you have to keep after it and it will take a long time to reassert your rights because they are both used to you just going along.

I am sorry you are in this situation and you are going to have your work cut out to turn it around. Start wisely and pick your battles because there will be plenty of them along the way.


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## IamSomebody (Nov 21, 2014)

Yeswecan said:


> Not true. The insurance follows the vehicle. Comprehensive/full coverage will follow the car. At least in MD. I confirmed this as a result of an accident.
> 
> If that were the case no one would EVER loan a legal licensed driver their car.


*VERY* true, at least in the Northeast and on the West Coast. Most people don't bother to check before doing stupid things. My policy explicitly states the limit on drivers.

IamSomebody


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## IamSomebody (Nov 21, 2014)

Forever His411 said:


> Since the car he is letting her use he pays for, he says it's his and that I have no say, which is un fair to say the least. I need to knock it into his head that what he is doing is dumb.


Change the title to his name. Let him pay the registration fees and insurance.

IamSomebody


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