# How many chances is enough already?!!



## BabySteps (Nov 16, 2010)

Hello Everyone. Although I’ve read through many of the posts here, I’m just now registering to provide my own post. Here’s my attempt at making what may be a long story, short. I’ve been married for just over 20 years; a couple months ago, I asked my husband to move out. I’ve suspected for a while, but about 10 years ago, I found out he was cheating. I immediately asked him to leave but he refused to go, said he loved me and it was over with the other woman. He provided me with sketchy details after much badgering. For whatever reason, maybe because our kids were so young at that time, I agreed to let him stay. A few years later, he’s caught again with another (this one a married, now divorced) woman. I’m almost sure between those years, there may have been another one but I never found any evidence of that but my intuition (which was what gave me the first clues about the others) was going crazy with suspicions. After he was caught with the one who was married, about three years ago, we had a very serious talk. I spelled out that I would NEVER go through this again and if I ever found that he was cheating again, I would leave and his actions would prove he didn’t want to married either. This man promised me he wouldn’t do this to me and the family again. A few months ago, I started noticing suspicious behaviors again (cellphone always on lockdown, calls on the cell phone on the drive to and from work, mood swings, less intimacy). Sure enough, a couple months ago, I found out he’s at it again. Of course he denied it so I calmly said, if you’re serious about keeping and fighting for your family and you’re so adamant about not doing anything, give me your phone. He would not give up that phone for NOTHING! If I was pleading my case and was innocent, I would have handed that phone over with no hesitation, especially knowing he’d given me reason to be doubtful of his word. His excuse was, “I don’t want to see your phone, so I don’t see why I have to give you mine”. Uh huh. He is a good provider and a decent father but for whatever reason, he can’t seem to remain faithful. It’s almost like he feels he’s entitled to be with other women. He’s still saying he doesn’t want to lose me, his family, or end this marriage even though he did finally move out after much persistence from me. He thinks this separation is only temporary…until I “cool down and find myself”, as if this is only about ME and he has nothing to do with it! This is why I feel he thinks he’s entitled. I’m 99.5% sure I want out. My problem is the other .05%. I need to know I’ve given him enough chances (this is the 5th charge) and although after reading this, I should know I have, I need outside eyes to tell me this. If he continues to help with the kids, I can support myself and take care of the rest with a few sacrifices. What’s giving me that .05% doubt is because he is such a good provider and father. He may even be a decent friend but I know I deserve better in a husband. Part of my fear is, I know no one is perfect and am I giving up someone just to trade for someone else with a worse issue? As you can see, I’m quite confused even though I feel like I know the answers. I do still love him but I deserve someone who can love me the way I need to be love, someone who won’t bring a third person into what should be sacred and only between two. I don’t want to feel like some other woman (women) has had half of me. Any input would be greatly appreciated.


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## mrnice (Aug 11, 2009)

BabySteps said:


> Hello Everyone. Although I’ve read through many of the posts here, I’m just now registering to provide my own post. Here’s my attempt at making what may be a long story, short. I’ve been married for just over 20 years; a couple months ago, I asked my husband to move out. I’ve suspected for a while, but about 10 years ago, I found out he was cheating. I immediately asked him to leave but he refused to go, said he loved me and it was over with the other woman. He provided me with sketchy details after much badgering. For whatever reason, maybe because our kids were so young at that time, I agreed to let him stay. A few years later, he’s caught again with another (this one a married, now divorced) woman. I’m almost sure between those years, there may have been another one but I never found any evidence of that but my intuition (which was what gave me the first clues about the others) was going crazy with suspicions. After he was caught with the one who was married, about three years ago, we had a very serious talk. I spelled out that I would NEVER go through this again and if I ever found that he was cheating again, I would leave and his actions would prove he didn’t want to married either. This man promised me he wouldn’t do this to me and the family again. A few months ago, I started noticing suspicious behaviors again (cellphone always on lockdown, calls on the cell phone on the drive to and from work, mood swings, less intimacy). Sure enough, a couple months ago, I found out he’s at it again. Of course he denied it so I calmly said, if you’re serious about keeping and fighting for your family and you’re so adamant about not doing anything, give me your phone. He would not give up that phone for NOTHING! If I was pleading my case and was innocent, I would have handed that phone over with no hesitation, especially knowing he’d given me reason to be doubtful of his word. His excuse was, “I don’t want to see your phone, so I don’t see why I have to give you mine”. Uh huh. He is a good provider and a decent father but for whatever reason, he can’t seem to remain faithful. It’s almost like he feels he’s entitled to be with other women. He’s still saying he doesn’t want to lose me, his family, or end this marriage even though he did finally move out after much persistence from me. He thinks this separation is only temporary…until I “cool down and find myself”, as if this is only about ME and he has nothing to do with it! This is why I feel he thinks he’s entitled. I’m 99.5% sure I want out. My problem is the other .05%. I need to know I’ve given him enough chances (this is the 5th charge) and although after reading this, I should know I have, I need outside eyes to tell me this. If he continues to help with the kids, I can support myself and take care of the rest with a few sacrifices. What’s giving me that .05% doubt is because he is such a good provider and father. He may even be a decent friend but I know I deserve better in a husband. Part of my fear is, I know no one is perfect and am I giving up someone just to trade for someone else with a worse issue? As you can see, I’m quite confused even though I feel like I know the answers. I do still love him but I deserve someone who can love me the way I need to be love, someone who won’t bring a third person into what should be sacred and only between two. I don’t want to feel like some other woman (women) has had half of me. Any input would be greatly appreciated.


Once a cheater, ALWAYS a cheater, Lose him now so you can get on with your life.


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

+1 on the above... Being a good provider and father doesn't make him a good husband. Cheating more than once would be more than enough reason to cut things off, but that might just be me.

C


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## Help239 (Oct 20, 2009)

Drop him. You deserve better.


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## BabySteps (Nov 16, 2010)

Thank you all for your replies. PBear, it’s not just you, I agree. I shouldn’t have let this go on when I found out after the first time…if I hadn’t, I wouldn’t feel as If I’ve wasted the last ten+ years “hoping”. 
He's now asking me to go to counseling with him but I know he only wants to go because he thinks he can smooth talk the counselor into saying I should stay and that I am the blame. I admit I should have never tolerated his behavior but I was trying to be the good, understanding wife. I never did anything to hurt this man…I supported him, stood by him, communicated as honestly as I could with him and he’s still trying to blame this on everything except himself. 
He called me yesterday to say “I feel like you may be getting emotionally attached to someone and I’m not going to just stand for that!” I let him know I’m not emotionally or otherwise attached to anyone. This man can’t even stand the THOUGHT of me dealing with anyone else, but yet he thinks I’m being unfair because I won’t forget all of his bullsh!t!! 
I know he’s not going to be truthful with this counselor. I also know he’s going to do his eye-watering act so he’ll get sympathy. I know, in the end, he’s not going to accept anything the counselor says if it’s not what he wants to hear. But I will go if only to show I tried… but the truth is, emotionally, I’m already gone.


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## DanF (Sep 27, 2010)

> I know he’s not going to be truthful with this counselor. I also know he’s going to do his eye-watering act so he’ll get sympathy. I know, in the end, he’s not going to accept anything the counselor says if it’s not what he wants to hear. But I will go if only to show I tried… but the truth is, emotionally, I’m already gone.


Most counselors are pretty smart. Your H will likely NOT be the first one to try and BS a counselor.


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## BabySteps (Nov 16, 2010)

DanF, I’m pretty positive his act will be see-through and I really hate to waste my time going through with this process especially knowing my moving on is necessary for my sanity and he's not going to accept the outcome anyway. 
I think I'm trying to prolong the mess to follow once he realizes he’s not going to get his way this time…or hoping that something will click into place in his brain to just let this go.
I’m not trying to take anything away from this man. I’ve explained to him that me and the kids will always be there for him, that the kids relationship with him wouldn’t change..it would only be the status of his and my relationship that will be different. I do love him and wish the best for him…I can be his friend, but I just can’t be his wife. 
He’s refusing to let go. And his not letting go seems to be keeping the brakes on me moving forward. How do you open a new door when the one behind you hasn’t been closed yet?


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## DanF (Sep 27, 2010)

BabySteps said:


> He’s refusing to let go. And his not letting go seems to be keeping the brakes on me moving forward. How do you open a new door when the one behind you hasn’t been closed yet?


*You *close the door.
If he wants it open on his side, that's his issue.
You can't make him let go any more than you could change his ways in the past.


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## sisters359 (Apr 9, 2009)

Yes, you need to move on, for yourself and for your kids. They need to see that their mom will NOT be such a doormat. Yes, it will be difficult, but it does not have to be the nightmare that some will tell you it is. HE may be relieved once he realizes he is now free to have sex with as many women as he can get, while he still has access to the kids and, if lucky, your disinterested friendship. You don't love him any more, so you can leave without turning your kids against him (which is the one thing about divorce that damages kids badly, being split/forced to "choose sides" in their parents' battle).

You also sound like you are aware that the problem really is HIM, and not you. God bless you; you are smart. He probably has some deep, unseeable need to keep "proving" himself to himself, and there is not a darn thing you can do about that. Usually I'm quick to say that most problems have two sides, but a serial cheater has a serious problem--like an addict, really--and the other person has only made the mistake of loving them. 

Chalk up that .05% to the fact that nothing in life is ever "certain," b/c we are human! But give yourself time to learn to be happy on your own, so that you don't rush into something new that will make you unhappy in a different way than he has done. 

Good luck, and let us know how you are doing.


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## believer (Apr 22, 2008)

Babysteps - I can totally relate to your % of doubt holding you back, I did the same with my soon to be x. I kept thinking if I give him 1 more chance then he will realize what a good thing he has & stop cheating. I kept thinking maybe "this" time maybe he did change & if I end it now & he did change - I would be to blame for not giving him a 2nd chance. The truth of the matter is - that he didn't change & got conditioned to keep getting 2nd chances- kind of like your husband. We didn't give them a consequence - so them kept doing what they were doing because it was serving them well - they could remain married & have those perks but could also enjoy the company of another woman & enjoy those perks all in one package. 
When you said he moved out & assumed it would only be a temporary thing (went through this too) - they didn't think we would really go through with filing for divorce because they had been giving so many chances before. It hasn't sunk in that they are not cats & don't have 9 lives. 
You mention your husband is a good provider - he can still do that by paying child support ( & maybe alimony if you're lucky)) & a good father. I beg to differ - he can NOT be a good father is he is going to act like this. What kind of example is he setting for his kids - although hopefully they won't have to know the details of his infidelity until they are older & can understand. 

You are so very right - that you DESERVE better!! It is about time you let him know that this behavior is NOT acceptable & that you are not goin to tolerate it any longer. It is not fair to you nor your children. And as hard as it will be to break this cycle - you have to get out of this relationship - it is not healthy. 

My soon to be X also was a master at the blame game & turned everything around to blame it on me & he would take no responsibility for his actions. It was because I whatever etc,etc, that he had to have an affair. As if my actions forced him to have an affair- NO he made that choice & could have handled his unhappiness another way. But is much easier to blame me than to take a look at himself & accept any blame. 
So as someone mentioned earlier - the cheating is NOT about you, it is about him & somehow he thinks he is getting something from it. You are not to blame - and I think you have come to understand that 

What is about you, is YOU finally taking action & not allowing him to treat you this way. That is a huge step for you & it may be easier said than done to end this relationship but it will be better for you in the long run & your children. 

Regarding the marriage counseling, I too went to marriage counseling ( even though I do not feel that he was being truthful) but again, I felt I needed to give him a chance & exhaust my options before I ended our marriage. I felt like he was going to counseling, so in the end, he could say, I tried but it didn't work out. And again absolve himself from any blame - does that appear the route your husband is headed? If so, I wouldn't recommend you waste your time & $$ if you already know you want out. 

I used to encourage everyone to exhaust all their options & believe in the institution of marriage. I always felt that divorce should be the last resort. But in exhausting all my options, I gave my husband soooo many chances & he never stepped up to the plate. It only prolonged the inevitable but did give me the peace of mind to know without a doubt now that I have made the right decision to divorce. 
For me, if I hadn't gone through all those steps I would have always wondered if I should have given him another chance. If you need to do that to be at peace with your decision - then do that. 

Do what feels right for you but from what is sounds like - your husband is not going to change & is going to keep hoping he can get that 1 more chance. It is up to you to decide if you will give that to him. 

it is a tough decision but have confidence in what you feel is best for you & your kids.


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## BabySteps (Nov 16, 2010)

Thanks for your reply…looks like you’ve been where I am now. As suspected, all talk of counseling has ceased…I guess he was just saying what he thought I wanted to hear at the time. It’s been a month since he moved out and it’s kinda funny but I haven’t missed him being here at all...in fact, it feels much more peaceful. 

Usually we act like semi-friends, until he goes into the “I want to come back” speech. Then he starts accusing me of not caring, not giving a f$ck, etc… Every time he sees me, he’s checking to see if I’m wearing my ring. He doesn’t understand that wearing a ring doesn’t mean anything obviously because I’m sure he wore his while he was doing his thing. I just don’t know how to get through to him that I don’t want to do this anymore. I’ve already thought about it; thought about it for the last few months. I don’t want to give yet another chance and have to start this all over again a few months down the road.

Today he asked our daughters to ask me when he can come back to the house! He still thinks this is temporary and to be honest, I don’t know how I can keep him out of the house seeing it’s in both of our names if he did decide to come back. 

I’m just praying things work themselves out but I know drama will come with him.


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## BabySteps (Nov 16, 2010)

Oh! I wanted to add that my kids are already of age where they understand what's going on (15 years old and above); in fact, they seem to understand exactly what's going on; THEY are even encouraging me to get on with my life!! They love their dad but they do understand that wrong is wrong and sometimes you have to pay the consequences for your actions. I thank God for them every day.


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## sbbs (Sep 21, 2009)

If you really want him to know that it's over, file papers. That'll show him like nothing else that you mean business.


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## BabySteps (Nov 16, 2010)

sbbs...in my state, we have to be separated for 12 months before we can file unless I can prove infidelity, which, although I know is true, I don't have any physical proof. I could hire a private investigator but my financial situation doesn't allow that too easily at this time. (college tuition, mortgage, etc..) Maybe after the first of the year I can rethink that option. I've also thought about selling the house but because of the economic situation, the monthly payments on this house is actually lower than a two-bedroom apartment would be to rent.


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## Anonny123 (Aug 11, 2010)

BabySteps said:


> sbbs...in my state, we have to be separated for 12 months before we can file unless I can prove infidelity, which, although I know is true, I don't have any physical proof.


Babysteps - are you in NY as NY was the last state to have this type of divorce law until Oct 13th of this year. The law has now changed and NY is now "no fault" like all other states. 

That's the main reason why I waited b/c 1) could not go thru 1 yr sep and 2) could not go thru ugliness of proving infidelity, neglect, etc


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## mariem1967 (Dec 1, 2010)

yes you should stop this long time ago but it's never to late. Good thing is that your kids understand everything and you have their support. Even if they don't understand i don't think they would live happy in such a family.


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## BabySteps (Nov 16, 2010)

Anonny, I'm in Maryland and "under Maryland divorce laws, you can obtain a "no fault" divorce in one of two ways. One is where both spouses mutually agree to separate and have been living separate and apart for twelve (12) months. The other is where the two spouses live separate and apart for two (2) years without interruption, whether or not both spouses agree." *copied from state website. 

So....I have to wait it out unless/until I can prove infidelity.


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