# why so many BS here post their story, then never return?



## CantBelieveThis (Feb 25, 2014)

over the past few months I have glanced at threads all the way back to 2007 (not each one of course, just similar ones to mine), and am surprised to find a huge amount of BHs in particular that write their story and shorty after abandon their thread (or likely TAM altogether)
In the majority of cases it seems they are looking for help in reconciliation, but after they get some strong feedback (suggesting rug-sweeping) they just leave and never come back......

I think these people are so broken and in shock, and clinging to anything they can from the devastation of their marriage, that they cant tolerate the strong advice and urgent call for action. Many of them arent sure to take steps that would "anger" the WS and further decrease their changes of getting back together...

Its a tough one, they do need to hear the strong call for actions that its provided here to avoid humiliation and rug-sweeping, but at the same time I can understand, and I felt myself, how broken and desperate they are to try to save anything, often in disbelief about their spouse being able to do such a thing.....

just putting this out there, there has to be a way to get thru to them w/o scaring them away....or maybe not , who knows...I know I have learned 75% of what I know about infidelity from TAM....I didnt know a dam thing about it when dday came....


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Maybe a sticky about working on yourself. Infidelity is not the fault of anyone but the cheater but most BS need a lot of work on themselves. Usually the BS has a history of marital mistakes and also needs to change things about themselves to have a chance at reconciliation.

One common trait that usually needs work is having the self confidence to enforce boundaries and not be a doormat.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Wolfman1968 (Jun 9, 2011)

CantBelieveThis said:


> over the past few months I have glanced at threads all the way back to 2007 (not each one of course, just similar ones to mine), and am surprised to find a huge amount of BHs in particular that write their story and shorty after abandon their thread (or likely TAM altogether)
> In the majority of cases it seems they are looking for help in reconciliation, but after they get some strong feedback (suggesting rug-sweeping) they just leave and never come back......
> 
> I think these people are so broken and in shock, and clinging to anything they can from the devastation of their marriage, that they cant tolerate the strong advice and urgent call for action. Many of them arent sure to take steps that would "anger" the WS and further decrease their changes of getting back together...
> ...


Probably multiple causes, different for each person.

Some may, indeed, be turned off by the advice, as it isn't supporting their preconceived notions, so the leave.

Others may just be visiting many sites, in order to get a whole range of ideas/thoughts. They may not be significantly invested in TAM specifically, just getting ideas. Once they get some initial pointers, they leave.

Others may get too bogged down in the drama of the affair/break-up/reconciliation to spend much time in TAM.

There are probably even more potential reasons.


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## ThePheonix (Jan 3, 2013)

As a former tax/law professor, its like some classes. Students register and show up for the first couple of classes, only to discover it takes more than they are willing, or perhaps capable, of putting into it.


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## Q tip (Apr 15, 2014)

ThePheonix said:


> As a former tax/law professor, its like some classes. Students register and show up for the first couple of classes, only to discover it takes more than they are willing, or perhaps capable, of putting into it.


Yep.. and school is the easiest thing they'll go through in life. 

Where else do you get all the answers before the exam - then get a few questions on it at the end...


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## Rugs (Apr 12, 2013)

I didn't find TAM until loooong after D-Day. But my D-Day was so shocking I could have never stuck with coming here daily or even weekly. 

Full time job, NO sleep, young kids, head spinning. I'm the opposite, I'm amazed when people come back.


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## CantBelieveThis (Feb 25, 2014)

from my perspective there are things that now i wish I had done right after dday that I didnt know anything about (due to my complete lack of knowledge about infidelity), such as filing for D immediately upon discovery to wake up the WS from the affair hard and fast, which I see as a crucial step now for the BS if the WS isnt immediately and totally remorseful about it, or if they show any amvilance whatsoever

But looking back I was so scared and in shock then that taking such advice would have been very difficult, because I was in total disbelief about the depth of the situation and somehow still wanted to believe my W couldnt be as bad as she looked, how could this be the person I had known for so long?? something had to be wrong other than just her, this couldnt be happening....

There was also the fear of doing something as drastic as filing for D and ticking off my W even more and sending her off with the AP.....very irrational thinking I know, but yet lets not forget this fear is there and is not the BS fault, they are in shock...very few can simply undo all their feelings for their WS immediately upon dday.

I dont really know what am after here....all am saying is I feel sad for the BS's that leave TAM after all the solid and critical advice is given and the timely actions they must take....yet it seems they are so shocked and afraid that they turn their back on it instead.....most likely resulting in further humiliation and rug-sweeping.....they also must likely later end up regretting not taking action sooner....I know because I was there and I am here now....not regretting my decision to R, but regretting not taking more definitive action when it was needed.

I think, my opinion, very good and strong advice is given right away in CWI to new BS...but not enough is said about the implications of not following it....such as humiliation, regret and resent popping up later for the BS, regardless of their decision to R or D. It seems to me with a newly discovered affair, time is of essence?


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## alte Dame (Aug 7, 2012)

When I was in grad school, my advisor, who was in his mid-60's, told me that he regretted not having been more active in the raising of his children. I asked him if he would do it differently if he had it to do over again. He said, 'Oh, no. I was a young man doing what all ambitious young men do. We all have to go through it.'

So, I think many people come here and are simply on a different part of the trajectory than the posters. They are simply not ready to do what people advise because they have all the normal human impulses and 'have to go through it.' 

Some are scared off by what they think is the bitterness or dire quality of the advice & some think they are simply different and they know better. The irony for me is that we actually are very much the same as one another.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

If I'd have posted here back when my wife was having her affair and received "tough love" and "just dump the b***h!" comments I think I'd have never come back, to be honest.


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## Forest (Mar 29, 2014)

ThePheonix said:


> As a former tax/law professor, its like some classes. Students register and show up for the first couple of classes, only to discover it takes more than they are willing, or perhaps capable, of putting into it.


Add to that:

BS realize that WS is a total mess, not worth their effort, goodbye.

Really, if caught in the heat of the affair, how many WS are worth salvaging? Now, it is easier than ever to catch WS due to the data trail.

Had I caught mine at that point, things would likely be different. She'd be "in the fog", I'd be homicidal, so an abrupt end would be more likely.


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## honcho (Oct 5, 2013)

I didn't find TAM until several months after my mess started. I know had I come here right after I would not have been back if I had been overwhelmed like many new posters seem to get. Most including me are trying to get our old worlds back, they are still in shock. They just want the problems to go away. We read everything saying dump the spouse, file for d etc. It makes sense looking back but in that time I wasnt ready to hear it. 

My first lawyer told me to file for d and cut her off. Told me I couldn't nice her back. I thought he was nuts.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

I got extremely negative comments. I was so messed up, it was incredible. I didn't trust anyone. It was too late, but I love her so much, I thought I must have had some sort of chance,because I thought she loved me too. Infidelity is not proof of love. It's proof of the opposite. Not hate, that's not the opposite.

I just could not believe any of it. I was heartbroken and suicidal. What a mess. There was nothing to be done, but try to figure out why and who, what and where. Anything, just to try to get a handle on it all. No, there was no getting a handle on it. 

Reconciliation is accepting that someone did the worst thing that many have experienced in all their lives, believing, acting like, and telling them it's okay. No amount of counseling or personal work can make it better. It can only help to understand why you deserved it. Once you accept that you deserved it, you can change what you did and hope you don't ever do anything else to cause another instance of infidelity. 

Other than that, you just accept it and know you can't do a thing about it except divorce, if you never want to allow that person to hurt you again. I think for some, it depends on how badly they were hurt/harmed before they got here. 

You also have to make up with her relatives who she will not let go of since she needs them in her life, but who helped her hurt you even more than you were. That's a mountain of work for not guarantees. In my case, the one sibling she trusted the most helped her to cheat. Didn't help her to get me into counseling, but to cheat. That sibling isn't going to change. 

In fact, I just heard a neighbor talking about my ex2 with some other woman who said something to the affect, "what a shame". My neighbor told her, "the guy who lives next door is her ex-husband". She made no comment. That's sad. Apparently, ex2 is not doing well. Her business, which she worked so hard on, and I did too, was closed. She must not be well, from what I could gather. At least, she must not be happy. 

Infidelity destroys lives. It has destroyed my relationship with my siblings, helped to ruin the relationship I was trying to repair with my children, caused me to lose my job, is causing me to have a tough time finding a job I fit because of the emotional and mental damage, has caused me to not be able to trust enough to live my life, has apparently ruined ex2's life, her business, and likely her relationship with the wonderful women I met through her. 

But hey, the AP got what he wanted and so did ex2; sex and lots of it. I wonder if it was worth it? It's no wonder I don't care about much anymore. 

I've paid a very high price for her infidelity and for my own weakness. If I'd been stronger, I'd never have married her, or if I did, it would only have been a short marriage, cause I would never have rugswept all the redflags. That means the problems in the marriage were partly my fault, but the infidelity devastated me, and that's on her alone. 

In the end, I guess I think many BS' come here too late, like I did. They thought they could handle it, until they couldn't. That's when many get here. This place can't help everyone. They do try. Sometimes, it's best to divorce. At least you don't have to go back to the person who hurt you the most, and be reminded daily of the pain they put you through and the power they will once again wield over you, if you become vulnerable enough to make it work. And, they will hurt you again and again without even knowing it. You will have to fight that pain for the rest of your life.


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## CantBelieveThis (Feb 25, 2014)

2ntnuf, wow your reply makes me cringe!!!!


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

If you can do it, love is worth the struggle, if you were "made for each other". Hope that makes sense. It isn't sensible, but emotions are not.

Sorry, I didn't mean to scare you. Just know that, it is no where even close to as simple as many of the members here imply. Depends on the complexity of the problems, too. It is not something to go into without great consideration and help from a counselor, a good one.


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## altawa (Jan 4, 2015)

I tend to just be a lurker anyway. I would bet that eventually, I will turn into just a lurker here too.


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## RWB (Feb 6, 2010)

Forest said:


> Add to that:
> 
> BS realize that WS is a total mess, not worth their effort, goodbye.
> 
> ...


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## altawa (Jan 4, 2015)

RWB said:


> Forest said:
> 
> 
> > Add to that:
> ...


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## EI (Jun 12, 2012)

Forest said:


> Really, if caught in the heat of the affair, how many WS are worth salvaging?


I was! Jus' sayin'  And, my BS, he was worth ravaging, too! 

_Oooooohhhh, salvaging, you said salvaging??? Yeah, that, too! We salvaged each other, then we ravaged each other!  _

_Damn autocorrect!!! .... _


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## meson (May 19, 2011)

MattMatt said:


> If I'd have posted here back when my wife was having her affair and received "tough love" and "just dump the b***h!" comments I think I'd have never come back, to be honest.


This! There are too many posters that are just transferring the anger from their situation to every situation and WS. Why stick around and take advice from a group of angry people with an axe to grind?


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## meson (May 19, 2011)

> BS realize that WS is a total mess, not worth their effort, goodbye.
> 
> Really, if caught in the heat of the affair, how many WS are worth salvaging?


This is the kind of generalization that drives many away from TAM!


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

I think some (maybe many) posters who have been cheated on don't return because they don't hear what they wanted to hear. One poster in particular (whose husband was still cheating) comes to mind. 

She came back two or three times and heard the same advice every time. But she kept thinking she could just wait it out and he would eventually wake up and get rid of the OW. No one supported that and so she left again. 

She's not the first or the last to look for validation that her course of action (or inaction) was right and then leave when she didn't get it. You post on a forum and you risk hearing things you don't want to hear.


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## Juicer (May 2, 2012)

Likely because the advice from the forum, the good advice, is counter-intuitive. 
A BS on DDay will follow their WS like a lost puppy. And if it is a BH, their WW will just hate them more and more for how pathetic they become (generally speaking) 

And they can't do it. And as they get beat up for making all the mistakes we see BS make, they leave, tired of being beaten up in both the real world, and here. 

Or another reason could be, this site triggers them. 
I try to limit my exposure to TAM, simply because certain posts and topics can trigger me. I don't need more heart ache and problems from triggering. And the SO doesn't like it either.


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## Wolf1974 (Feb 19, 2014)

I think what happens is they read , make a decision to reconcile or move on then, and then do so. I know first hand embarrassment is a huge component of the BS so staying and posting about it over and over is difficult


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## Dogbert (Jan 10, 2015)

Not all newbie BS who come to TAM will find TAM CWI a good fit.


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## Remains (Jan 24, 2012)

altawa said:


> I want basic information like 'was it confined to the internet only, or were phone calls involved'.


If her standard answer is I can't remember, she is lying. And if so,this is why it still bugs you after all this time. Someone wishing to give you the truth would spend time trying to retrieve what information they can remember. Does she do this? Does she say 'I think so; yes probably we did; I don't know but I don't think we did. I don't remember doing that; I don't remember doing that but it seems likely'. Does she answer like this? In a helpful manner? Or do you just get the I don't know which essentially stone walls you and shuts down any conversation?


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## Mr. Dee (Jul 30, 2014)

Why do some leave? My wife never returned because when she went to forums for BS's some of them accused her of making up her story. Unfortunately the story was true. We had some real crazy sh** happen because of my horrible betrayal. It made my wife a bit crazy too. She went there in pain, they sent her away, she lost faith in forums like this. Too bad, because I think it would help her even today. 

I'm angry at myself for causing this, but I'm angry at those who could have helped her for refusing to. That's all.


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## SamuraiJack (May 30, 2014)

I think a lot of BS's are schooled in romance...people I now call the Walking Disney.

They have been brainwashed into thinking that candy, flowers and the "big gesture" are solutions to unhappiness in a partner.

Even my ex once made a comment about "how we never had that romantic fight and made up."

Horse hockey.


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## BetrayedDad (Aug 8, 2013)

CantBelieveThis said:


> I know I have learned 75% of what I know about infidelity from TAM....I didn't know a damn thing about it when dday came....


75% would be a very conservative estimate for myself. Don't beat yourself up too much. Many of us were just as clueless.


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## drifting on (Nov 22, 2013)

I found TAM roughly four months before I registered. I read thread after thread trying to bring myself up to speed on infidelity. This became one of my most challenging times in my life, along with the darkest of times. I was lost, confused, hurt, devastated, and wanting to end my life. Nothing mattered to me anymore as I stood alone surrounded by ruins and ash. Taking a step was excruciating, taking two steps became the impossible. I lost my faith in God, I lost my faith in humanity, all I could see was the atrocities humans inflict upon each other that I see firsthand every day. To call me a broken man would have been the understatement of a lifetime.

TAM has made me weep for some of the stories I have read here. Realizing the pain of both the BS and the WS, the suffering children endure as their parents split up, makes you wonder if their are any good people left in this world. On d-day I would have answered no, I would have told you nobody cares, sadly not even myself. I became my own worst enemy and inflicted pain on others, I hurt many members of my family because of the pain I felt. TAM helped me to realize I wasn't alone, others felt my pain, and they had survived. TAM began to give me life, and slowly I began to find myself learning the steps I needed to take. This wasn't easy for me, in fact it was very difficult, I felt for those who were given harsh comments. 

Some will argue harsh reality is what is needed, others will argue harsh reality is unnecessary. I know what I needed was for someone to understand my pain, to feel devastated and alone, to understand I thought death was the only answer. Reading threads I found people as broken as myself, people who understood my pain, and my suffering. Without ever realizing these people helped me. I am grateful to the members of TAM for helping someone they have never met. Opinions and advice vary and in my personal opinion that is what makes this site great. I took from threads what would help my situation. 

The harsh posters are the reason I have never posted my story, my life is full of conflict now, adding more would be foolish. Besides, the path I have found is slowly returning me to who I was before my WW affair. I know I will never recover fully but I believe I will find some peace and happiness. I post with pain in my heart, pain that will remain the rest of my life, as I will be in R the rest of my life. People who post here have shown you can reconcile but never forget what happened to you. My reminder at one year from d-day is pain, but the pain is less than it was a year ago. A year from now I hope to find its even less. 

I try to post with empathy and compassion, that your pain is understood by me, that you have support. Something I needed was support as I haven't told anyone what I'm going through. At times I post and anger comes through, not helping the OP at all and possibly even hurting them. I have apologized if I feel that my post is offensive or is derogatory towards the OP. I have given my opinion and been told twice I have put the worst post on TAM. I admit I thought of leaving TAM if my posts were so terrible, but I have remained, hopefully for the better. When your hurting and someone smacks you with the 2X4, it hurts even more, how you respond to that hit is what is important. Gain from the hit and become stronger, more confident and hopefully moving you forward to the person you want to be.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## bfree (Sep 30, 2012)

2ntnuf said:


> If you can do it, love is worth the struggle, if you were "made for each other". Hope that makes sense. It isn't sensible, but emotions are not.
> 
> Sorry, I didn't mean to scare you. Just know that, it is no where even close to as simple as many of the members here imply. Depends on the complexity of the problems, too. It is not something to go into without great consideration and help from a counselor, a good one.


These are the only two that were made for each other. Just sayin.


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## Racer (Sep 24, 2009)

I’m one who left and came back. Basically, I wanted to save my marriage and have someone tell it was all a bad dream. I didn’t like the harsh way I was being spoken to. Kind of the one liner stuff about being a doormat and less than a man. I wanted to save it… not many supported that notion. 

So I deleted my threads, stopped posting (just lurked) and found a couple other forums where they were a bit gentler and went out of their way to explain why you should do things like the 180, distance, lawyer up, etc. That tends to get lost here in the one liners. Eventually I got banned at one of those sites for pointing out the hypocracy, and the other I just sort of lost interest in their discussions and wasn’t adding much. And a couple stories here that I could relate too brought me back in to bounce ideas around.


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## bfree (Sep 30, 2012)

drifting on said:


> I found TAM roughly four months before I registered. I read thread after thread trying to bring myself up to speed on infidelity. This became one of my most challenging times in my life, along with the darkest of times. I was lost, confused, hurt, devastated, and wanting to end my life. Nothing mattered to me anymore as I stood alone surrounded by ruins and ash. Taking a step was excruciating, taking two steps became the impossible. I lost my faith in God, I lost my faith in humanity, all I could see was the atrocities humans inflict upon each other that I see firsthand every day. To call me a broken man would have been the understatement of a lifetime.
> 
> TAM has made me weep for some of the stories I have read here. Realizing the pain of both the BS and the WS, the suffering children endure as their parents split up, makes you wonder if their are any good people left in this world. On d-day I would have answered no, I would have told you nobody cares, sadly not even myself. I became my own worst enemy and inflicted pain on others, I hurt many members of my family because of the pain I felt. TAM helped me to realize I wasn't alone, others felt my pain, and they had survived. TAM began to give me life, and slowly I began to find myself learning the steps I needed to take. This wasn't easy for me, in fact it was very difficult, I felt for those who were given harsh comments.
> 
> ...


I've often said that there should be a place on TAM to post where you will only receive compassion and understanding. For a while it was the reconciliation thread but that has faded away. TAM used to be a much friendlier place. I miss the days when Beowulf, Morituri, Dig and others would emphasize common sense and sensitivity even when trying to open a poster's eyes to a harsher reality. Even Athol Kay of MMSLP would post here on occasion. Sadly those days are gone and just like reality tv we are poorer for the change.


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## drifting on (Nov 22, 2013)

bfree

I couldn't agree more with your post. Someday dig, regret214, Beowulf, devastateddad, changingme, mrmathias, mrsmathias, and so many others helped me beyond belief. Your posts as well have helped me. I'm hopeful that TAM can become the resource and wisdom it once was, and can be again.


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## vellocet (Oct 18, 2013)

CantBelieveThis said:


> I think these people are so broken and in shock, and clinging to anything they can from the devastation of their marriage, that they cant tolerate the strong advice and urgent call for action.



I certainly understand this, and have been guilty of strong reactions. I definitely know about the "desperation", and I even was desperate at the thought of not having my family intact.

I think most of us are telling it like we see it because we aren't in that desperation fog, and are out of it and can see things much clearer. I know everything wasn't clear for me when I first found out.


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## vellocet (Oct 18, 2013)

Forest said:


> Really, if caught in the heat of the affair, how many WS are worth salvaging?



Not many. There are some, no doubt about that. I believe R is possible and the WS may be worth keeping, but IMO its rare.

Those that are worth a 2nd chance are those that don't blow smoke up their BS's arse, blame them for the affair, or are wanting their BS back because they want them, and not because their AP dumped them, etc.


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

Can't blow smoke up their arse about how nice reconciliation is either. I think it can be more devastating if they believe they have a chance. They may easily try to nice their way back. There is really no easy way. I think most BS lean toward it being a passing phase. That's the reason I sometimes post harsh stuff. I don't want them believing in rainbows and unicorns any more. They have to be solidly committed with both feet on the ground. No more fairy tales, they can't afford them.

BS have to know it was a decision to cheat, no matter what else was going on. They can't take all the responsibility. They are coming from a painful place. The WS is coming from a place of relief, when found out, in many cases. They are stuck in justification mode. Both have to come out of that fog to be able to even make a smart decision about the possibility of reconciliation and believe it.


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## Racer (Sep 24, 2009)

2ntnuf said:


> Can't blow smoke up their arse about how nice reconciliation is either. .


Agreed. However there's a massive difference between the "pull your head out of your arse" one-liner and taking the time to explain how they are doing it, that it isn't uncommon, and the results it might make versus what a lot have found to be more successful even if it doesn't feel right right now to them.

There's also a ton of WS bashing and 'worst case scenario' sharing to someone who's just trying to wrap their head around whatever little they do know when they come here. The extremist feed that fear that is already wreaking havoc in their mind. Folks need to remember that the fresh are still deeply in love with this other person. So there is usually still a need to defend their spouse. Their minds are still at war trying to accept that this person they would defend with their life is cheating on them. So the harsh stuff will have a knee-jerk reaction of "What did you just call my wife!?" while also fearing it is accurate. Fresh after DD, BS's are all over the place in their thoughts, fears and emotional responses. 

Those past that phase need to try and remember how it was and be a bit more empathetic. I think we all probably at first still somewhat tried to defend our WS's honor and hold onto that idea that they really wouldn't do this and there must be some reasonable explanation or misunderstanding. Being confronted too directly usually has them thinking the advice is bad and more about your crappy marriage than their's (which is always somehow special)... so they leave.


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## Rookie4 (Nov 26, 2012)

Personally, I feel that a lot of BS's are driven away BECAUSE of the emphasis on reconciliation, and all of the work and hardship it entails. I don't think that this is a TAM problem, but just part and parcel of the whole infidelity process. True reconciliation, after an affair is just about the most difficult problem a married couple can face. I think that eventually, many BS's just go ahead and divorce, rather than attempt it. I know I did. I thought about it long and hard, and realized that I didn't want to go through several years of counseling, both IC and MC, trying to re-learn to love and trust my spouse, and basically living and breathing the affair, with no guarantees that anything useful could be accomplished. I have no evidence , but just my gut feeling is that very, very, few reconciled marriages are truly happy ones. Most are about settling for less. So, when a BS comes here as sees all of this, he or she may just think to themselves....why bother?


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

Yeah, Racer, I do understand that. I think the lesser of two evils is still divorce. The likelihood there will be no infidelity again, is low. I think it's higher when the wife enters menopause, after the peri part. It's still tough, though, because she has given all that energy to someone else and now will be less interested. It's like telling the husband straight out, you ARE the weakest link, but you're good enough to take me through retirement to the end. 

For those younger, there's a whole lot more going on there, and you have peri to look "forward" to "enjoying". Yes, the words in quotations are meant to be facetious. You got a lot of work to do. 

Few posts are balanced, very few. No one likes to sit on the fence. It's not who each of us is naturally.


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## Rookie4 (Nov 26, 2012)

I also think that a lot of the problems are with society, in general. Divorce is almost always looked upon as a bad thing, when, in fact , it can be very good for BOTH the WS and the BS.


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## Rookie4 (Nov 26, 2012)

Racer said:


> Agreed. However there's a massive difference between the "pull your head out of your arse" one-liner and taking the time to explain how they are doing it, that it isn't uncommon, and the results it might make versus what a lot have found to be more successful even if it doesn't feel right right now to them.
> 
> There's also a ton of WS bashing and 'worst case scenario' sharing to someone who's just trying to wrap their head around whatever little they do know when they come here. The extremist feed that fear that is already wreaking havoc in their mind. Folks need to remember that the fresh are still deeply in love with this other person. So there is usually still a need to defend their spouse. Their minds are still at war trying to accept that this person they would defend with their life is cheating on them. So the harsh stuff will have a knee-jerk reaction of "What did you just call my wife!?" while also fearing it is accurate. Fresh after DD, BS's are all over the place in their thoughts, fears and emotional responses.
> 
> Those past that phase need to try and remember how it was and be a bit more empathetic. I think we all probably at first still somewhat tried to defend our WS's honor and hold onto that idea that they really wouldn't do this and there must be some reasonable explanation or misunderstanding. Being confronted too directly usually has them thinking the advice is bad and more about your crappy marriage than their's (which is always somehow special)... so they leave.


There was a very good poster a couple of years back, who is a good example of this. Do you remember Dig? He eventually got perma-banned for defending his FWS.


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## Rookie4 (Nov 26, 2012)

BTW, Regret was one of the best FWS posters , ever.


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

I tend to think that reconciliation can be very unnatural "feeling", for many who thought they had the one. Let me explain. It's similar to how the WS feels before they quit loving their spouse. I've read many a WS say they felt like they were living alone, but it was worse because that person was there to remind them of what they once believed in. I think reconciliation can be much like that, until, once again, there is a shift in brain chemistry and the BS feels more like they did when they first met. This is the reason for some telling the BS to start initiating and hoping there is a period of extreme sexual bonding. It brings back those blinders. This is extremely dangerous and it is not something that can be controlled, since it is a biological process meant to strengthen bonds. I'm sure the impact of the chemical soup can be lessened with vigilance and determined effort, logical thinking, routine, and some other not so romantic things. Aren't those feelings why the WS left or cheated, in many cases, in the first place? It makes no logical sense, but then, there is little logic in feelings. 

Some can do it. It isn't all doom and gloom. And many want to do it again. It does feel good to be in love. It's healthy and natural.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

meson said:


> This! There are too many posters that are just transferring the anger from their situation to every situation and WS. Why stick around and take advice from a group of angry people with an axe to grind?


:iagree:


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## Dyokemm (Apr 24, 2013)

I think the over-riding issue for BSs that flounder is FEAR and its twin, self-doubt.

It is fear that stops them from examining red flags pre-discovery and from filing for D and making a strong stand that they will simply not tolerate having a traitor as a partner (even if their main desire is to eventually R).

And I think the main thing that many regret when looking back at the A, and what they are most ashamed about is how they let fear drive them.

It is a VERY common theme from many posters on this and other threads on TAM.

To me, it is proof that the Marine major who was one of my leadership instructors at the Naval Academy was dead right.

He told us, "Fear kills....it paralyzes you with self-doubt when decisive action is absolutely necessary. Sadly, in this way, it becomes a sort of self-fulfilling prophecy....By failing to take action, you eventually will make what you fear and dread most become a reality."

I truly wish more BS could grasp this truth quicker.


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

I tried R for 30 years before getting a divorce almost two years ago so I tend to be cynical about the long-term success of R. Definitely there are success stories on TAM but the reality is you don't really know until the natural end of the marriage whether your spouse will cheat again or not. You certainly hope they won't break your heart again but there's no guarantee. If anyone had told me my husband would cheat again in his 60's with the same OW he had an affair with 30 years before, I wouldn't have believed them. Especially since I had warned him there would not be another chance. Now he deeply regrets it but I no longer care. 

I try to stay from threads about R so my personal feelings about it don't discourage someone determined to try -- even when I feel they're making a huge mistake. It's their life to live after all.


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## loyallad (Aug 1, 2014)

I think some BS post then leave because they want to get their story off their chest so to speak. They may or may not want advise just a place to spill what's in their heart and mind. Maybe that's just the therapy they were looking for. I don't know. I think some want to hear something and if they don't hear that message they tune out and leave. Yes their mind is reeling and if they think they want R they don't see the rational behind the "hard core" advise of 180 and file for D. The "shock and awe" approach as I think about it.

Are there some on here that are so bitter they direct some of that at OP's WS? Maybe? I think there are a bunch of folks on here though who walked through the flames and came out the other side with a tremendous experience and insight few have.

After my Dday I landed on another website that tended to want to nice things out. All I remember from that was my anger grew and grew until I knew I was close to being out of control and had to get off that site.

Had I come here before my Dday when I had was starting to think something was going on with my wife I probably would have had enough "dirt" to nail her ass to the wall and probably beaten the hell out of POSOM (and probably gone to jail). Had I come here right after DDay I would be divorced and probably feel better about myself but some of the things that have happened after DDay would not have happened if I had immediately punted WW. I have a young lady that we took in post DDay that I now consider my "kid" and love her just like I do my other kids. She needed us at the time due to her home life and looking back I truly feel she came our way to help me through that dark time in my life. I also have a stronger relationship with my other kids. And I have strengthened my relationship with my mom, dad and sister. They are what's important to me.

Why do some come here for a brief period and leave we'll never know for sure. Offer them what ever we can. Hope what we do is helpful. At the end of the day they have to decide for themselves what they need to do.


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## RV9 (Sep 29, 2014)

Racer said:


> I’m one who left and came back. Basically, I wanted to save my marriage and have someone tell it was all a bad dream. I didn’t like the harsh way I was being spoken to. Kind of the one liner stuff about being a doormat and less than a man. I wanted to save it… not many supported that notion.
> 
> So I deleted my threads, stopped posting (just lurked) and found a couple other forums where they were a bit gentler and went out of their way to explain why you should do things like the 180, distance, lawyer up, etc. That tends to get lost here in the one liners. Eventually I got banned at one of those sites for pointing out the hypocracy, and the other I just sort of lost interest in their discussions and wasn’t adding much. And a couple stories here that I could relate too brought me back in to bounce ideas around.


Racer is one of the few guys who showed me compassion. 

I keep deleting my own threads. It's because there are posters with one solution - leave my daughter . I stick around Tam because there are others ' like me, Those I can relate to, pm them, take stock of their life, share mine. 

Saddest thing is those who had been there forget how painful it is. A bs already is down, feeling like a fool. Smart answers are like kicking him/her when they are down . Divorce is excruciating to say the least. Financial setback, someone else raising your children - icing on the cake. Along with that, shame. Everyone likes divorce, drama, revenge - as long as they aren't involved. 

Something I dislike is wayward bashing, especially of those who stick around. Ei, regret are common targets. Some would never get it into their heads that these aren't your spouses. In spite of everything, they stand with their families and that's what matters.


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## CantBelieveThis (Feb 25, 2014)

RV9 said:


> someone else raising your children - icing on the cake.


^^^this....one of the things I could not tolerate and a huge decision point in favor of R, but it was one thing I realized on my own, there is very little if anything said about some other ahole parenting your kids here on TAM...I wonder why is that...are others not as bothered by it in general?
I mean I figure if she cheats again, I will have to deal with it then, because there wont be second chances for her.....but one step at a time.....


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## Rookie4 (Nov 26, 2012)

CantBelieveThis said:


> ^^^this....one of the things I could not tolerate and a huge decision point in favor of R, but it was one thing I realized on my own, there is very little if anything said about some other ahole parenting your kids here on TAM...I wonder why is that...are others not as bothered by it in general?
> I mean I figure if she cheats again, I will have to deal with it then, because there wont be second chances for her.....but one step at a time.....


You are a parent, whether you are married or not. Divorce doesn't absolve you or anyone from their parental duties. I don't know where this idea came from.


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

That's a different kind of fear. It's the opposite end. Each way is hard. One way, you get a new chance. The other, you just get the AP's cast off. Believe me. She would have rather been with the AP or she never would have been with him in the first place. You'll do, now that she's had her fun and sated her lustful desires. You won't get what he got, either. She will never tell you all of it, cause she doesn't want to do that stuff with you. You don't turn her on like the AP did and you never will. That's the hard truth.


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## Rookie4 (Nov 26, 2012)

loyallad said:


> I think some BS post then leave because they want to get their story off their chest so to speak. They may or may not want advise just a place to spill what's in their heart and mind. Maybe that's just the therapy they were looking for. I don't know. I think some want to hear something and if they don't hear that message they tune out and leave. Yes their mind is reeling and if they think they want R they don't see the rational behind the "hard core" advise of 180 and file for D. The "shock and awe" approach as I think about it.
> 
> Are there some on here that are so bitter they direct some of that at OP's WS? Maybe? I think there are a bunch of folks on here though who walked through the flames and came out the other side with a tremendous experience and insight few have.
> 
> ...


It is perfectly all right to vent on TAM. The problem arises when you vent AT another poster, WS or BS. If a BS wants to R and is attempting to be conciliatory to his WS, then he is called a "doormat" and ridiculed. Even though the very persons who are doing the ridiculing, know very little about his situation. The same with WS's. They will get page after page, with no good advice at all, just venom and hate. Is it any wonder that these people leave?


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## honcho (Oct 5, 2013)

Rookie4 said:


> I also think that a lot of the problems are with society, in general. Divorce is almost always looked upon as a bad thing, when, in fact , it can be very good for BOTH the WS and the BS.


Long term divorce can be a good thing for both parties but I do not think in this day and age divorce is looked upon as a bad thing like it used to be. 

Its become too common place and its plastered all over the tabloids and gossip columns. Hollywood has given a picture to the world that divorce isn't a big deal just as Hollywood has made people thing every marriage should be like a romantic comedy. 

Its sad to say but of all the people I know, I don't know a single married couple that stayed together more than 20 years. Everyone is divorced.


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## poida (Jan 17, 2014)

For me it was simply trying to find some understanding of what the heck just happened!!!!!!!

Regardless of the advice given and how the BS receives such advice, I'm of the opinion that you end up in the same place at the end.

In fact, I think that the challenging of established ideas and advice gave me an avenue to test my own feelings and limits. In the end I think I am better for it.

Sometimes though, it is just hard to be here. To hear people's stories and to be reminder of your own when you are trying so hard to move on.


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## poida (Jan 17, 2014)

Rookie4 said:


> It is perfectly all right to vent on TAM. The problem arises when you vent AT another poster, WS or BS. If a BS wants to R and is attempting to be conciliatory to his WS, then he is called a "doormat" and ridiculed. Even though the very persons who are doing the ridiculing, know very little about his situation. The same with WS's. They will get page after page, with no good advice at all, just venom and hate. Is it any wonder that these people leave?


Some will get offended and leave and some will think "why are these people telling me this?". I'm not sure they would stay even if they were given "nice" advice. It's just all too difficult to deal with for some.


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## Mostlycontent (Apr 16, 2014)

Rookie4 said:


> It is perfectly all right to vent on TAM. The problem arises when you vent AT another poster, WS or BS. If a BS wants to R and is attempting to be conciliatory to his WS, then he is called a "doormat" and ridiculed. Even though the very persons who are doing the ridiculing, know very little about his situation. The same with WS's. They will get page after page, with no good advice at all, just venom and hate. Is it any wonder that these people leave?



Having never been a BS, I'm not qualified to answer but in perusing this thread, your post resonated with me. I can give an outsider perspective, if you will. As a general rule, people don't like being told what to do but they really don't like it when it appears as just spewed venom.

I think those that are stunned by what's happened need to hear some tough advice but it has to be delivered in love, so to speak. So many here are still smarting and bitter over what happened in their own marriage that they say such harsh things to someone genuinely in need of support.

Perhaps they are still trying to work things out for themselves in some way. They wish they had done things the way they are advising the current BS but it's typically filled with rage.

After lurking around here for almost a year, if this ever happens to me, I would never post my story but rather read through other threads for situations similar to mine. It's unfortunate that it has to be this way because some here are really trying to help and give wonderful advice but if you're raw on emotion, it would only take one poster to strike you wrong and you'd be outta here.


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## loyallad (Aug 1, 2014)

Rookie4 said:


> It is perfectly all right to vent on TAM. The problem arises when you vent AT another poster, WS or BS. If a BS wants to R and is attempting to be conciliatory to his WS, then he is called a "doormat" and ridiculed. Even though the very persons who are doing the ridiculing, know very little about his situation. The same with WS's. They will get page after page, with no good advice at all, just venom and hate. Is it any wonder that these people leave?


Maybe we all could stop and think before hitting the reply button. There are some on here that are so jaded by their own circumstances they hit the gas instead of pump the brakes. Advise on here is varied to say the least. I get sorta pissed at anyone who wants to blame a BS for their WS affair. Way out of line and I'll call someone on that. A BS certainly can reflect on past mistakes, learn from them and if R is the course they chose so be it. I think this website should be taken for what it is. A place where a lot of damaged people have come together, some offering support, some offering their experience and some blowing off steam. It's not the be all end all. It's not supposed to be. Just my opinion.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## poida (Jan 17, 2014)

Mostlycontent said:


> Having never been a BS, I'm not qualified to answer but in perusing this thread, your post resonated with me. I can give an outsider perspective, if you will. As a general rule, people don't like being told what to do but they really don't like it when it appears as just spewed venom.
> 
> I think those that are stunned by what's happened need to hear some tough advice but it has to be delivered in love, so to speak. So many here are still smarting and bitter over what happened in their own marriage that they say such harsh things to someone genuinely in need of support.
> 
> ...


I'm better off for the tough love so I don't regret reading it.


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## Rookie4 (Nov 26, 2012)

Mostlycontent said:


> Having never been a BS, I'm not qualified to answer but in perusing this thread, your post resonated with me. I can give an outsider perspective, if you will. As a general rule, people don't like being told what to do but they really don't like it when it appears as just spewed venom.
> 
> I think those that are stunned by what's happened need to hear some tough advice but it has to be delivered in love, so to speak. So many here are still smarting and bitter over what happened in their own marriage that they say such harsh things to someone genuinely in need of support.
> 
> ...


There are some very good posters , who really do try to help. Blunt, EI, Regret, Wazza, Bfree and a few others are among the best. Unfortunately , there are also those who would cheerfully burn a WS at the stake. Or those who get their jollies by spewing venom on an anonymous site. Hey, this is TAM and we get them all.


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## honcho (Oct 5, 2013)

poida said:


> I'm better off for the tough love so I don't regret reading it.


Its not as much the tough love as the delivery of said love. At least from a male perspective often what happens is he starts hearing man up or quit being beta. He is already having feelings of humiliation and embarrassment to begin with the person doesn't necessarily need more lumped on him. While may indeed need to "man up" telling him to grow a pair doesnt really convey the hows and why's.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## poida (Jan 17, 2014)

honcho said:


> Its not as much the tough love as the delivery of said love. At least from a male perspective often what happens is he starts hearing man up or quit being beta. He is already having feelings of humiliation and embarrassment to begin with the person doesn't necessarily need more lumped on him. While may indeed need to "man up" telling him to grow a pair doesnt really convey the hows and why's.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I think that some of the harsh advice given is ultimately right and needs working on with months/years of therapy. 

I would agree that sometimes it can be contra-productive, but in the whole, there are more good eggs than bad ones here and it all levels out.

If you want sounds, unbiased advice, go to counselling. if you want a cooking pot of opinion, this isn't a bad place.


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## jnj express (Mar 28, 2011)

It just may be that some of those that came, got advice, and left quickly, could not/can not/did not want to, stay involved with the whole package that TAM is all about.

This is a very tuff subject to stay involved with, specially for those going thru it/having been hit by it for the 1st time.

To some they needed the advice, and they didn't wanna stay and involve themselves with the problems of others.

Those who do stay, and involve themselves and give advice, have basically become experts, and you better believe you are every bit as good at giving advice on this subject, as any counselor that exists, and probably way better than counselors who have not lived thru infidelity, and who are giving standard pat advice based on classes they took and texts they have read.

Just my opinion, ------ some of those that come and leave quickly just can't handle the subject of other peoples infidelity, it just adds to the pain they already have in their own situation.


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## Daisy Etta (Aug 13, 2014)

I almost didn't come back because when I first was moved to post on cwi, I got threatened with banning. I didn't know how your community worked and at first I thought I had actually violated some obscure rule, but no. Apparently there'd been some member recently banned at that time and your 'friendly' cwi people thought I was him/her trying to fake a comeback. All this because I was familiar with message boards and didn't write like their idea of a newbie. Your people made snide comments and laughed at me when I didn't know what they were on about. 

I decided never to come here again. But my issues build up, and finally I thought I may as well dare to ask for more thoughts. I got some and am fully planning to get the heck out of here again asap, but since I have an answer to this thread's question I'm sharing it. FWIW.


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

Daisy Etta said:


> I almost didn't come back because when I first was moved to post on cwi, I got threatened with banning. I didn't know how your community worked and at first I thought I had actually violated some obscure rule, but no. Apparently there'd been some member recently banned at that time and your 'friendly' cwi people thought I was him/her trying to fake a comeback. All this because I was familiar with message boards and didn't write like their idea of a newbie. Your people made snide comments and laughed at me when I didn't know what they were on about.
> 
> I decided never to come here again. But my issues build up, and finally I thought I may as well dare to ask for more thoughts. I got some and am fully planning to get the heck out of here again asap, but since I have an answer to this thread's question I'm sharing it. FWIW.


The obvious question is, what made you come back after all of that, instead of seeking advice at other forums? This is not meant to be an attack, but a serious question which I think is very relevant to this thread.


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## Daisy Etta (Aug 13, 2014)

2ntnuf said:


> The obvious question is, what made you come back after all of that, instead of seeking advice at other forums? This is not meant to be an attack, but a serious question which I think is very relevant to this thread.


Is there a lot of other coping with infidelity forums? I didn't know of them. My issues are related to my betrayal so I wanted to ask my question of other betrayed. The only other similar forum I've heard of is apparently full of cheaters. I wouldn't be able to handle that.


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

Daisy Etta said:


> Is there a lot of other coping with infidelity forums? I didn't know of them. My issues are related to my betrayal so I wanted to ask my question of other betrayed. The only other similar forum I've heard of is apparently full of cheaters. I wouldn't be able to handle that.


There are religious and secular. It's a shame, really. I wish there were no need for them. Thanks.


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## meson (May 19, 2011)

One poster I interacted with told their story wanting advice on how to move forward from the bad situation they were in. They got some advice but mostly judgement and browbeating. This poster also didn't want a record of the situation that could be used to identify them. Here is a response as to why they deleted their thread and left:



> Thank you for your message and the good advice on the thread. I deleted it for two reasons, it appeared on a google search (which tam warns you about to be fair) and the continued replies of the exact same wise up move on mantra were just making me think about it more! *I think all that needed said on the subject had been said.*
> Just for the record I did find your replies helpful and encouraging. There was a strong message but I didn't feel like you we're beating me up, you know?


Many threads end up being an argument between older TAM members going on and on but not really adding anything new to the thread. These arguments detract from the advice provided. There are many here who enjoy the debates I think more that trying to help someone out. I think it helps a thread to realize when every view has been provided and to step back to avoid endless circular arguments.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

This is why:



meson said:


> One poster I interacted with told their story wanting advice on how to move forward from the bad situation they were in. They got some advice but mostly judgement and browbeating.


Most BS' who post their stories on TAM get raked over the coals hardcore. Hardly any real advice is given to them. It is mostly people telling them what a horrible person they are.


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

Jellybeans said:


> This is why:
> 
> 
> 
> Most BS' who post their stories on TAM get raked over the coals hardcore. Hardly any real advice is given to them. It is mostly people telling them what a horrible person they are.


Yeah. Why they are responsible for the pain they are going through and so forth, which causes more pain. The finding stuff in a search is a big deal, too for many, I think.


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## vellocet (Oct 18, 2013)

Jellybeans said:


> This is why:
> 
> 
> 
> Most BS' who post their stories on TAM get raked over the coals hardcore. Hardly any real advice is given to them. It is mostly people telling them what a horrible person they are.



I have read people telling someone they are a doormat, fool to stay with their cheater, etc. 

And I sure as hell hope it wasn't another BS telling them they are a horrible person(although I can think of one).

But I disagree with the "hardly any real advice given to them" I think BS's get a lot of good advice, and even on both sides of the fence (R vs divorce)


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## LongWalk (Apr 4, 2013)

2ntnuf said:


> Yeah, Racer, I do understand that. I think the lesser of two evils is still divorce. The likelihood there will be no infidelity again, is low. I think it's higher when the wife enters menopause, after the peri part. It's still tough, though, because she has given all that energy to someone else and now will be less interested. It's like telling the husband straight out, you ARE the weakest link, but you're good enough to take me through retirement to the end.
> 
> For those younger, there's a whole lot more going on there, and you have peri to look "forward" to "enjoying". Yes, the words in quotations are meant to be facetious. You got a lot of work to do.
> 
> Few posts are balanced, very few. No one likes to sit on the fence. It's not who each of us is naturally.


:iagree: People are at different times in their lives. The opportunities of the BS and WS vary. Machiavelli used to point out that the curve of sex ranking for men and women is very different. A young woman is inherently is at the top in terms of head turning power. A woman who has past menopause does not catch men's eyes.

This is why the old divorce scheme emphasized alimony to protect women from being replaced once their reproductive years were over (I know many men who divorce are not interested in having more children; we are only talking about sexual appeal).

The hardest test in R is that the BS has to want to become a better person and better spouse to his/herself and to the WS. Of course many reason why should I become better for that cheater?

Some of TAM's top posters of old did not have a radically different prescription than today's posters but they were more sophisticated and artistic in their presentation. Will Kane is another top observer IMO because he was able to relate generalities to the specific poster.

Conrad seemed like a sweeping generalist but he, too, had the ability to reach individuals.

Perhaps TAM should elect senior top posters so that visitors know that they are getting advice worth deep consideration.

Tears was a top poster. Shamwow of course.

We still have AlmostRecovered, HappyMan, Turnera and others.


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## vellocet (Oct 18, 2013)

meson said:


> One poster I interacted with told their story wanting advice on how to move forward from the bad situation they were in. *They got some advice but mostly judgement and browbeating*. This poster also didn't want a record of the situation that could be used to identify them. Here is a response as to why they deleted their thread and left:



But didn't the poster say: "There was a strong message but *I didn't feel like you we're beating me up*" ??

The poster must not have thought it was mostly judgement and browbeating.


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## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

Fear and denial, that's why. That's the beginning stage of the grieving process from being betrayed. Most BS's come here only a few days/weeks after DDay, and during that time, they are fearful of losing their marriage, they are desperate. Its quite a normal reaction to an extremely traumatic situation like this. When some BS's are desperate, they are looking for advice on how to win their WSs back, not actually how to deal with the infidelity. They desperately want to rug sweep it and move on.

However, as we all know, rugsweeping does nothing but prolong the agony and build up resentment. 

Some BSs simply cannot accept the hard facts, because its easier to rugsweep...its the less painful way. So they disappear. A lot of people just have to learn the hard way. Its very common. If they leave, then it's their loss. 

CWI normally has the most people viewing it at any given time. Sometimes as much as over a thousand people sometimes.










There might be less than a hundred active posters in CWI, but there are usually many times that number just reading the threads here. Some may post their story, some may not. Either way, people are reading and learning, even if the don't post. They may apply what they've learned here, or they may not. It's up to them.

In any case, infidelity is happening constantly, everyday. And everyday, the number of betrayed spouses grows. If some leave after posting their situation, so be it. There will *ALWAYS* be more signing up or just lurking. So I wouldn't lose any sleep over it or even be concerned.

There's usually a large influx of new members or lurkers after Valentine's Day, that's usually a big cheater day, and when affairs are discovered.


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## meson (May 19, 2011)

vellocet said:


> But didn't the poster say: "There was a strong message but *I didn't feel like you we're beating me up*" ??
> 
> The poster must not have thought it was mostly judgement and browbeating.


As a point of clarification, the you was referring directly to me and that my posts did not convey that feeling that was complained about in the deleted thread.


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## Racer (Sep 24, 2009)

meson said:


> Many threads end up being an argument between older TAM members going on and on but not really adding anything new to the thread. These arguments detract from the advice provided. There are many here who enjoy the debates I think more that trying to help someone out. I think it helps a thread to realize when every view has been provided and to step back to avoid endless circular arguments.


That's a newer trend I've been seeing. Instead of helping, the thread goes off on a theoretical debate about an element. A current example is the guy who thinks his wife might be cheating and the last couple pages is more about shaved snatches being a sign or not. I've seen that sort of thing stretch out to pages and pages of threadjack clutter. 

So even me, just STFU and stops following because I don't want to read 6 pages of discussion where even the original poster has walked away from their own thread. I know there have been some huge threads where the OP maybe responded a dozen times and the rest is everyone else debating.


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

Racer said:


> That's a newer trend I've been seeing. Instead of helping, the thread goes off on a theoretical debate about an element. A current example is the guy who thinks his wife might be cheating and the last couple pages is more about shaved snatches being a sign or not. I've seen that sort of thing stretch out to pages and pages of threadjack clutter.
> 
> So even me, just STFU and stops following because I don't want to read 6 pages of discussion where even the original poster has walked away from their own thread. I know there have been some huge threads where the OP maybe responded a dozen times and the rest is everyone else debating.


Here we go TJing again. 

You know how to stop this? The member who started the thread needs to shut it down if they want. They can do many things like reporting, asking it to stop, redirecting the topic back to the original, committing to a direction they want to take in their marriage by posting their choice, or a combination. 

This kind of stuff happens when there is no commitment to some direction, meaning divorce or reconciliation and the member is sitting on the fence for a long time. My guess is, they read the posts and learn something from the debate, or they would delete the thread when they leave.

And, I admit I'm guilty of this. I have understood a huge amount of the straight forward posts that just tell someone what to do without explanation this way. That understanding has helped me to accept what has happened to me.


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## whatslovegottodowithit? (Jan 6, 2013)

I got the advice I needed along with analysis of mine and my spouses decisions along the way. I read MMSL and NJF as advised multiple times. I implemented the changes I needed to make in order to save my M (I did!). Eventually, I began topics on sick children and employment matters, and it was at that time, I began to realize that focusing on matters other than my M, I didn't need to be here but could rather just lurk. To date, most, if any of my comments seem to fall in the financial advice and general forums. There is SO much advice for many different CWI subtopics, that a new user/poster could probably get the advice they need by searching and reading the past forums.

The harsh analysis of myself as a person from TAM peeps was never an issue as I generally prefer dark humor and compartmentalize things due to my job so it didn't matter to me if any comments directed towards me were harsh. I was able to decipher the applicable message. I did find myself commenting more harsh than most because of who I am and realized that most are less tolerant than I.

To summarize, I followed advice as I saw as applicable and saved my M. It will always be a work-in-progress for me, but the difference now is that I'm equipped with a knowledge of information because of TAM. Once my M got better and kept getting better, I stepped aside as I didn't want to just blog about my life if things were going well. I stopped commenting due to my harshness at times and focused more on the non-CWI forums where a lesser amount of people posted replies. I didn't go away, I used the knowledge gained and observed from the sidelines. I suspect I will solicit advice in the future if I feel it is needed, but for now, I'm happy lurking and commenting when I feel there is value to be gained from it.


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## bfree (Sep 30, 2012)

Daisy Etta said:


> Is there a lot of other coping with infidelity forums? I didn't know of them. My issues are related to my betrayal so I wanted to ask my question of other betrayed. The only other similar forum I've heard of is apparently full of cheaters. I wouldn't be able to handle that.


Daisy, I'm sorry that you were met with scorn and ridicule when you first came to TAM. I'd like to invite you to stay and seek solace with others here. Not all of us have a lumber yard in our homes. While I can't promise a 2x4-less experience this time around I can categorically state that I along with others will stand at your side whilst fending off the wolves.


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## CantBelieveThis (Feb 25, 2014)

as a BH I always understood all the advice given, even if it wasn't pleasant to hear or if I didn't agree with it, I still could see why it was being said and the position from which it was being said from....somehow even if it was harsh, I still "got it" and could relate to it, almost as if couldn't feel upset at the one saying it....the pain of infidelity is very distinguishable

But at the beginning, I will admit, some of it was very hard to hear....almost a sense of "how could these ugly things being said about my wife be true?", but they were


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## loyallad (Aug 1, 2014)

lordmayhem said:


> Fear and denial, that's why. That's the beginning stage of the grieving process from being betrayed. Most BS's come here only a few days/weeks after DDay, and during that time, they are fearful of losing their marriage, they are desperate. Its quite a normal reaction to an extremely traumatic situation like this. When some BS's are desperate, they are looking for advice on how to win their WSs back, not actually how to deal with the infidelity. They desperately want to rug sweep it and move on.
> *LM I think you are right on the mark. I think a lot of BS especially BH are blindsided by the WS betrayal. Their heads are spinning and so many thoughts flooding their minds. The "chicken with it's head cut off" syndrome. A lot can't focus on just one aspect of what to do and they are all over the place. How many have come on here and admitted if they only knew to do such and such instead they admit to doing the wrong thing or the very opposite of what they should do. It's tough, their emotions are raw.*
> However, as we all know, rugsweeping does nothing but prolong the agony and build up resentment.
> *More heartache and pain as a result.*
> ...


*That would be me. Valentine's Day is my DDay. No DDay is worse than any other but obviously a lot more triggers associated with that day than just about any other DDay. It's tough to see people enjoying that day when the thoughts of my WW selfish hurtful deceit constantly run through my mind on Valentine's.
I wish this site and others dealing with infidelity weren't necessary but, cheating isn't going away. Cheating may even be easier to do than ever before.*


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## KingwoodKev (Jan 15, 2015)

I can only speak from my own experience. The day I found this site I was a mental case. I was already 2 years past d-day as you know and was putting pressure on myself to fish or cut bait basically (D or R). I didn't know where to turn. I wasn't happy with the IC I had seen and we hadn't seen an MC yet. I was stuck. 

To be honest it was REALLY HARD reading a lot of these other stories because all it did was freshen up my own story in my mind/heart. Some emotions I had been able to suppress came roaring back.

I stuck it out and this site has helped. Some others might be in a state of desperation and just pop in for some quick advice or just to vent their story.

I realized today as I read all the updates on my own thread that I was a little selfish for not checking in. I've been off here for a few days because things are going well and I didn't feel like I needed to check in.

I'm thinking, however, that since some users here have helped me maybe I can pay it forward and tell someone in the future some things that have worked and not worked for me.


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## Racer (Sep 24, 2009)

2ntnuf said:


> Here we go TJing again.
> 
> You know how to stop this?


The easiest way is for the two or three folks who are going back and forth to recognize that they are doing it. Then just make their own thread to continue the discussion. Sometimes those discussions are enlightening, but take away from the original topic. That would help a lot. Just recognize what thread you are in; There are lots of threads where that banter is expected like gender roles or alpha-male stuff.

And lol at the OP just stating their intent. Often enough you'll see a OP flat out state disapproval or ignore the banter. Yet, there will piled on more and more post arguing some point. An example might be drinking and 20 or so pages about dissecting the habit hoping the OP will see they have an issue even if they state that they don't. Can't say whether that's good or bad... just a lot more than it needs to be with people trying to prove they are right based on what amounts to a few phrases the OP (or the one I'm thinking about is the spouse) typed. 

The other is just a basic understanding; You won't convince one mindset to accept another. So you should understand no matter how rational you think you are being, some folks won't change. It's sort of like trying to reason with crazy. Never works. Like the politics forum


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## vellocet (Oct 18, 2013)

KingwoodKev said:


> I realized today as I read all the updates on my own thread that I was a little selfish for not checking in.


Kev, don't think a thing of it. Although most of us were wanting an update, hoping you were ok, you are dealing with one of the worst situation a person has to deal with....a cheating spouse.

If you don't feel like checking in, its understandable.


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## Steve1000 (Nov 25, 2013)

CantBelieveThis said:


> over the past few months I have glanced at threads all the way back to 2007 (not each one of course, just similar ones to mine), and am surprised to find a huge amount of BHs in particular that write their story and shorty after abandon their thread (or likely TAM altogether)
> In the majority of cases it seems they are looking for help in reconciliation, but after they get some strong feedback (suggesting rug-sweeping) they just leave and never come back......


Thanks for posing this question. I first came in one year ago soon after I discovered very painful things about my fiance. I was very much in shock when posting. Most replies simply said to discard the relationship and my fiance. When I stated that I needed some time to make a good decision and pointed out my thinking process, most posters became frustrated after one day and exclaimed that I was sticking up for my fiance. 

I have recently noticed that almost all of those posters are no longer active on this site. Eventually I came back to read and learn because there are many very good members on this site, including you. 

I recommend that everyone still feels free to point out the ugly truths to all betrayed spouses. However, we should also remember that these people are often going through hell and that it is understandable that they may need weeks to process everything before they can make decisions.


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## vellocet (Oct 18, 2013)

Rookie4 said:


> Unfortunately , there are also those who would cheerfully burn a WS at the stake.


Oohh, now there's an idea!


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## toolforgrowth (Apr 24, 2012)

I was prolific on this site in 2012 during my divorce and my xWW's affair. After a while it just kind of tapered off...I became focused on moving my life forward, rather than the fact that **** hit the fan. I still occasionally visit, but it's usually brief. It serves as a reminder of how far I've come.

I think that life just goes on for a lot of people. Whether that life is good or bad is unknown if they stop posting.

I think that a lot of new people post, then just read the comments and don't post anymore. They keep lurking but are too afraid, are in too much pain, or are simply too embarrassed, to continue posting.

Sometimes I think I should return and post more often. I remember reading Shamwow's story years ago and feeling optimistic for my future for the first time in forever. Pretty epic stuff.

I also agree that general posters need to tone it down a notch. CWI can sometimes be populated with bitter people who lambaste WS's, even if they've successfully reconciled or realize their mistake and are genuinely looking for help. I think part of that responsibility falls on us to call out that bad behavior and hold them accountable.

I wish more people posted in Life After Divorce; people advocate divorce in so many cases of infidelity and yet there's no follow up on what to do after the divorce is completed. The divorce is just the beginning, and there's so much more after that, in both challenges and rewards.


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## maaz3231 (May 27, 2011)

I posted my story around 2.5 years ago. I still read this site, though not near as much as before. I think the reason I stopped posting on my story was the huge amount of negativity that came with many other posters. Sometimes it seems the posts are more demands than advice, and if the demand is not followed then the OP is just a fool. 2.5 years later, I am still married and I am happy. I still think about what happened every day, but I don't dwell on it like I used to. Anyways, I think that may be a big reason people abandon their stories.


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## IIJokerII (Apr 7, 2014)

CantBelieveThis said:


> over the past few months I have glanced at threads all the way back to 2007 (not each one of course, just similar ones to mine), and am surprised to find a huge amount of BHs in particular that write their story and shorty after abandon their thread (or likely TAM altogether)
> In the majority of cases it seems they are looking for help in reconciliation, but after they get some strong feedback (suggesting rug-sweeping) they just leave and never come back......
> 
> I think these people are so broken and in shock, and clinging to anything they can from the devastation of their marriage, that they cant tolerate the strong advice and urgent call for action. Many of them arent sure to take steps that would "anger" the WS and further decrease their changes of getting back together...
> ...


 Think of it like this. You walk into a Clinic or Hospital with a "Pain" and soon after you are diagnosed with something terrible, life threatening yet treatable. Here is you choices with kindness applied;

"Well Sir/Miss, First of all I am sorry for your condition and would like to give you my sincerest condolences to your condition. If you need some time to think about what you need to do please go ahead and do so. I do need to make you understand that the longer you wait the worse off you'll be so you better not wait too long. I know, you don't want to be rushed, and this is a big decision. But truth is we need to do something soon, no pressure. Oh, and by the way, you will be forever changed one way or another by this operation!! While I can't say you will make it through unscathed as well as possibly losing a part of yourself, that some one else will use to no end and it's full potential, it may also cost a lot of money. I am also sorry to say you will even have to pay the person your removed issue, if it need be removed, money to keep it healthy. But take it slow. If you want to we can run the test again, but you already did 3 times already, and the condition is worsening. But hey, I will keep feeding your redundant questions because, well, that's what I am here for. Ohh, you don't look so good, I am afraid this would happen!!! Nurse! NURSE!!!!"

Now the alternate version;

" Cut this thing off and see how bad it wants to reattach to you. IF it does then you know you will be healed, mostly, if not get a replacement you can depend on. This is what it will cost, this is what you will lose. Now, sh1t or get off the pot cause the situation is getting worse by the day, and doing nothing is exactly the same results you will get, nothing. Take a pamphlet on the way out"

The reason for the tough love is not to piss anyone off or otherwise, but it is to maximize the turnaround time frame while also stopping the bleeding. Many of us, including myself, would've or could've been way ahead of the game yet indecision or misplaced faith put us in a spot where we either had no choice but to take action or simply went with it till the end despite everyone telling them the dangers ahead due to their experiences dealing with this sh1t. 

The people that come here for help are in a desperate need of aid, and by page 5 or sooner they need to take some steps, any steps, to stop what's happening. Some stay and sustain the efforts other here try to bestow upon them while others, not finding the answers to suit their needs or more accurately wants, go elsewhere for advice that they perceive as better. If only we knew the end results to the ones who do not return.


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## jim123 (Sep 29, 2012)

To get something out of TAM, you need to put into TAM. No different than a marriage.


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## LongWalk (Apr 4, 2013)

Here's a poster who came back after a long absence.

Link to You Will Live Trust Me


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## barcodelabelhere (Mar 24, 2014)

I lurked for a while, then posted a fairly brief version of my story, got some great advice, then went off to deal with the aftermath of the affair/separation/etc. Didn't come back for quite some time because it was too painful. I was living every day with the hole in my life that the affair created, and, aside from that, really don't consider myself to be in a position to give advice.

I just recently wandered back to the Life After Divorce forum, because, well, there's a giant hole in my life and it still hurts. And then I decided to check in here on all of the people that knowingly and unknowingly helped me.


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## CantBelieveThis (Feb 25, 2014)

*Re: Re: why so many BS here post their story, then never return?*



barcodelabelhere said:


> really don't consider myself to be in a position to give advice.



I still feel like this too!!!....I have gotten to the point of writing advice responses in some threads and just cancel them out because I feel am in no place to advice anyone about infidelity. ....what do I know


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## PamJ (Mar 22, 2013)

loyallad said: "That would be me. Valentine's Day is my DDay. No DDay is worse than any other but obviously a lot more triggers associated with that day than just about any other DDay. It's tough to see people enjoying that day when the thoughts of my WW selfish hurtful deceit constantly run through my mind on Valentine's.
I wish this site and others dealing with infidelity weren't necessary but, cheating isn't going away. Cheating may even be easier to do than ever before."

Valentines Day was my DDay, or should I say first DDay in 2012. I thought it was done and didn't find out for over a year later that they had started up again about 8 months into our "R". We are not overly sentimental about Valentines Day so I don't get upset bout that date anymore.

We survived the second go-round of his online/phone/virtual affair. It wasn't just playing, it was sexting and I loves yous, but he cut it off, for good this time ,so far-see there's that kicker, that little bit of doubt left behind like some particle with a half-life slowly diminishing. 

Anyway, I do come visit here and read once in a while. I just don't have much to add to it now. No more drama happening, no more questions or anger. There is no evidence he has regressed and I don't check often, but still do once in a while.


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## KingwoodKev (Jan 15, 2015)

PamJ said:


> loyallad said: "That would be me. Valentine's Day is my DDay. No DDay is worse than any other but obviously a lot more triggers associated with that day than just about any other DDay. It's tough to see people enjoying that day when the thoughts of my WW selfish hurtful deceit constantly run through my mind on Valentine's.
> I wish this site and others dealing with infidelity weren't necessary but, cheating isn't going away. Cheating may even be easier to do than ever before."
> 
> Valentines Day was my DDay, or should I say first DDay in 2012. I thought it was done and didn't find out for over a year later that they had started up again about 8 months into our "R". We are not overly sentimental about Valentines Day so I don't get upset bout that date anymore.
> ...


Yeah that's the trouble for us BS's. Once our WS has crossed that line, they can never cross it back. They're cheaters. That's who they are.


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## loyallad (Aug 1, 2014)

PamJ said:


> loyallad said: "That would be me. Valentine's Day is my DDay. No DDay is worse than any other but obviously a lot more triggers associated with that day than just about any other DDay. It's tough to see people enjoying that day when the thoughts of my WW selfish hurtful deceit constantly run through my mind on Valentine's.
> I wish this site and others dealing with infidelity weren't necessary but, cheating isn't going away. Cheating may even be easier to do than ever before."
> 
> Valentines Day was my DDay, or should I say first DDay in 2012. I thought it was done and didn't find out for over a year later that they had started up again about 8 months into our "R". We are not overly sentimental about Valentines Day so I don't get upset bout that date anymore.
> ...


Funny thing Pam is my WW put up little valentine's decorations around the first of February. Glad she enjoys it. :scratchhead:


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## tryingtogetover (Feb 7, 2015)

I was here in 2009 and posted about my wife's EA with an old friend from HS. After a long, drawn out process and much pain, we have R'd and are doing well. 

I got some great advice and encouragement here...I should probably pay it forward and will be back here regularly to do so. I just got back on here on a whim to see if I could find my original post--I did--and saw your message. 

Thank you for the nudge!


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## bfree (Sep 30, 2012)

CantBelieveThis said:


> I still feel like this too!!!....I have gotten to the point of writing advice responses in some threads and just cancel them out because I feel am in no place to advice anyone about infidelity. ....what do I know


Sometimes just letting others know they aren't alone is as good as any advice you could give.


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## Dday (Mar 31, 2013)

I am one who posted my story, and kind of went away. I did post an update about a year ago, close to 1 year after dday. I am now approaching 2 years and am still with my WW. 

The advice I got here helped me through the most difficult time of my life. The reason I do not post or visit the site more is because it is definitely a trigger and brings back alot of thoughts and feelings I have tried to put in the past. 

On top of that, I don't feel in a position to give advice, I can't say I 100% made the right decision to stay, and I don't know if I would be happier if I left.


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## vellocet (Oct 18, 2013)

Dday said:


> On top of that, I don't feel in a position to give advice, I can't say I 100% made the right decision to stay, and I don't know if I would be happier if I left.


So what prompted you to log back on?


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## Dday (Mar 31, 2013)

I still visit the site occasionally, just not everyday as I did in the midst of the discovery process. 

My wife was out Friday night and as usual came home much later than expected. During that time and having a bad feeling about her being out I logged in and reread some of my posts and checked out some others as well.

I may have just stopped a EA/PA before it had a chance to happen. I will post my new story shortly to get some advice.


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## Panther66 (Sep 30, 2014)

I come back mostly to read through things. I don't necessarily feel as if I have enough strong knowledge to give advice. Hell, I'm still working through my own mess. 

I did take the advice of telling my wife I wanted a divorce (although, truly I did not). We fought. A lot. We are still together and from everything I can see we seem stronger and closer than ever. My eyes are much more open though and I continue to watch just incase she has found a new way to hide things. I am always open to advice on how to catch a cheater. I hate to feel that way, but honestly once you are burned it's hard to let that go.

We talk and message a lot. Sexual activity is more frequent and regular and we've actually gotten a little more adventurous. Hopefully those are all good signs. I know one thing for certain, if there ever is a next time, it will be the last time. Now that we have had those conversations and divorce was on the table, if she screws up again I can only assume it is because she just doesn't care enough to not screw up. The advice from here was hard to read but I always felt the advice was given in my best interest.


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## Brokenintwo48 (Jan 2, 2015)

I think as in my case,( I have been writing and rewriting what I want to say about my spouse's cheating over and over again to post here) that some times it is just nice to have people to spill your guts out too without fear of the others you know finding out. As with me, I can't talk to friends and family about this because they will form opinions or tell others what is going on. It is just the way people are, they can't keep their mouths shut. I also don't want them judging my spouse or me over the whole thing. It would be easy to take sides and that isn't what this is about. It is about fixing what went wrong, not making it worse with people reacting to it because of their own moral high horse. I just want place to go to even if it is just to read things so I don't feel so alone.


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## Brokenintwo48 (Jan 2, 2015)

Panther66 said:


> I come back mostly to read through things. I don't necessarily feel as if I have enough strong knowledge to give advice. Hell, I'm still working through my own mess.
> 
> I did take the advice of telling my wife I wanted a divorce (although, truly I did not). We fought. A lot. We are still together and from everything I can see we seem stronger and closer than ever. My eyes are much more open though and I continue to watch just incase she has found a new way to hide things. I am always open to advice on how to catch a cheater. I hate to feel that way, but honestly once you are burned it's hard to let that go.
> 
> We talk and message a lot. Sexual activity is more frequent and regular and we've actually gotten a little more adventurous. Hopefully those are all good signs. I know one thing for certain, if there ever is a next time, it will be the last time. Now that we have had those conversations and divorce was on the table, if she screws up again I can only assume it is because she just doesn't care enough to not screw up. The advice from here was hard to read but I always felt the advice was given in my best interest.


I agree with the next time is the last time. I also put divorce on the table and have been watching things closely. But there has to be a time to let that go. If it does happen again there is nothing you or I can do to stop it. It is best to work on yourself and your marriage and try to put the past behind you. In other words don't worry until you have to. Other wise it won't work out because you will spend more time second guessing things and not actually fixing the relationship.

I slip into the second guessing often and it really only makes me upset and irrational. I need to be clear headed. 

My Spouse claims it never got to sex. It went on for two years, they rarely saw each other, but there were lots of emails and some were dirty. I know unless he was taking off from work that more than likely they didn't see each other very often, it seemed more like once every few months. That person is a teacher and some what busy most of the time since I was able to find them online. I also saw their picture and I was rather disappointed in what I saw. But they are accomplished while I'm not, not in that way. So I can see what my spouse was attracted to, the life that person's lived. While I just didn't have the chances that they had. But my spouse latched on to that person's life because it was what my spouse wanted. Also I'm not in that corporate type of world and they seemed to have that in common. 

Do I believe the sex part, some how I do, not that other things didn't happen just not sex. I know my spouse was craving affection, and that is what I think that person gave out. But do I think it is over. In my heart I do, but sometimes that little ugly voice says beware. So just beware a bit but don't let the nagging about infidelity get to you. You have to think about you as well.


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## RS71 (Mar 20, 2014)

In my own situation I found TAM helpful, but I was spread too thin to stay on for long. In my own situation I was balancing the shock of my life, a WS having a hard time making commitments, a S3 and D6, I was (still am) sole earner in the house, have a very stressful and demanding professional job, and was immediately slammed with anxiety attacks. I was also on another board, which I found to be a bit more constructive. I continued to monitor, but not contribute. 

About 6 months after Dday my wife made the observation that re-visiting and rehashing, wasn't productive to moving forward. She didn't know about this site, but I did agree that on days that I reviewed emails between her and I, advice on this site, and so on, put me in a very very negative spot. My own personality allows me to be easily drawn to a worse case scenario, which is ultimately more debilitating. 

Cutting back did help.

Now I really wish I had not reacted so fast upon DDAy and spent time on TAM preparing to confront. That was a mistake I made on day one, so it limited the utility of TAM in my situation.

Nearly a year after Dday - we are still struggling, but still together. The best advice was a reminder that "this will be a marathon, not a sprint". I do mourn the time that seems to be wasted as my WS slowly comes around.


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## westegger (Jul 26, 2013)

I know that I was quite active on my thread after first posting my story. 

Mine was an interesting case though. I caught the very, very beginnings of an EA and so I was keeping the thread up to date on almost day by day developments. 

In the end, the conflict was over and my wife and I did MC. At least to my knowledge she has never contacted the guy again, nor him her. 

Things are great between my wife and I, now. 

You can read my thread here: 

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/102577-ea-closure-should-i-just-wait.html

Reading through it now is interesting. It really brings back the emotional state I was in at the time. 

For those of you who read the thread, just a couple of interesting notes: 

-My wife's sibling, to my knowledge, has never brought up my conversation about the situation to her.
-I never did contact the OMS. (This was a point of contention on the thread and I will say that it was a case where advice I was receiving in person from several people was almost 100% diametrically opposed to the advice I was getting on TAM.)


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## PamJ (Mar 22, 2013)

KingwoodKev said:


> Yeah that's the trouble for us BS's. Once our WS has crossed that line, they can never cross it back. They're cheaters. That's who they are.


Cheaters, and liars, that's the hard part. You can't cheat without lying, so, even after the cheating is done and you no longer feel that anything more has happened, you still live with a liar too.

My H lies too easily about little things. No big things have come up, it's mostly for avoiding an argument, getting in trouble or trying not to be proven wrong etc. 

My heart tells me he won't cheat again, but, my head tells me, 'don't be a fool again, be wary.'


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## KingwoodKev (Jan 15, 2015)

PamJ said:


> Cheaters, and liars, that's the hard part. You can't cheat without lying, so, even after the cheating is done and you no longer feel that anything more has happened, you still live with a liar too.
> 
> My H lies too easily about little things. No big things have come up, it's mostly for avoiding an argument, getting in trouble or trying not to be proven wrong etc.
> 
> My heart tells me he won't cheat again, but, my head tells me, 'don't be a fool again, be wary.'


Are you staying together? We're in the process of reconciling but I totally agree with you. Once you know the person you love most is a liar and cheater and didn't have the moral character to not betray you then it makes it very tough going forward.


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## vellocet (Oct 18, 2013)

meson said:


> This! There are too many posters that are just transferring the anger from their situation to every situation and WS. Why stick around and take advice from a group of angry people with an axe to grind?


Sorry, but I am never going to sit idle by and let someone's WS gaslight them.

I don't, however, condone someone being browbeat into thinking they are a doormat. Whether I think someone is or not, I'm sure as hell not going to tell them that or try to make them think that. I'm on their side.

But we are people just like them and have been in their situation. We are likely feeling most, if not all, of the emotions they are feeling.

If a BS wants to reconcile, that is all fine and dandy. At that point I will simply advise them to do it with caution and not take any of their WS's blameshifting and gaslighting, while yes, working on their part in the marriage(if there was a problem to begin with on their side).

Simple as that, and I'm not going to apologize for it.


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## PamJ (Mar 22, 2013)

KingwoodKev said:


> Are you staying together? We're in the process of reconciling but I totally agree with you. Once you know the person you love most is a liar and cheater and didn't have the moral character to not betray you then it makes it very tough going forward.


We are staying together. When the last DDay occurred, or should I say when I finally learned, and got him to admit to the extent of it, I really didn't care what happened with us. I gave up and said, 'You will do what you want, I can't stop you' I felt dead inside, not angry anymore. I wasn't going anywhere. I would never leave my home. 

We have run a business together a 50/50 SCorp, for 20 years so we would be tied that way anyway. We are older, he is 62 and I am almost 60, so my idea was HE could move out, or at least out of my bedroom. He freaked out and realized I was serious and then HE got serious, finally.

Most times we get along just fine. We have our days, mostly when we are tired from the business stuff, when we don't communicate well and get cranky, but it's evened out quite a bit. 

If he cheats again he knows he is gone from my personal life. I can do my end OF the biz at home but, of course, all the little other things I did to make his life/job easier he'd have to figure out on his own.


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