# Fathers Rights



## Hopefull363 (Feb 13, 2012)

I knew how horribly unfair courts were to fathers with visitation and in some cases child support. I did not know that a fathers rights could just be taken away from them totally at the whim of the birth mother though. This needs to change. Fathers are much more than just a pay check. This poor kid and this poor baby.
Bring Baby Wyatt Home by Jennifer Ann Bates King - GoFundMe


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## Fozzy (Jul 20, 2013)

I'd be interested in hearing the other side of the story.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

If I read the story correctly, (the only thing available to read was apparently written by the father's family), what happened is that a young girl gave her baby up for adoption, and the birth father had no say in this happening, even though he wanted to keep the baby.

I'm not positive but I think this is true that the birth mother can give the baby up for adoption even if the father doesn't want her to, if the father cannot show the full ability to raise the child himself, which in cases like this (a young boy in high school) they usually cannot.

I do agree this isn't really fair. But again I'm not clear on what this particular story is saying since all we have is the emotional plea of the father's family.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

Found this:

One of the biggest parental rights is the right to consent or object to the adoption of ones child. Generally, adoption requires the consent of both parents, provided they meet certain requirements. To gain parental rights, including the right to object to adoption, biological fathers unmarried to the mother must not only establish paternity, but also demonstrate a commitment to parenting the child.

Acknowledging Paternity

Proactively establishing paternity is an important step in committing to help raise a child. Paternity determinations typically take the form of civil lawsuits which utilize DNA testing to establish the identity of the childs father.

A biological father wanting a say in adoption decisions should establish paternity as soon as possible. Failure to establish paternity can prevent an unmarried father from gaining any parental rights at all. Waiting too long can demonstrate a lack of commitment to parent the child. This can even mean needing to establish paternity before the birth of the child in certain cases, such as when the mother indicates early on in pregnancy a desire to put the child up for adoption.

Timing and Unaware Fathers

Fathers who do not know of their children until after the fact can find themselves out of luck in regards to adoption decisions. In some states, the clock on when a father should acknowledge paternity and start providing for the child begins running when the child is born (or even during pregnancy), not when the father learns about the child. Courts have held that fathers unaware of their children may not later object to the childrens adoption, particularly when the fathers lack of knowledge was his own fault.

The facts of each case will differ, but to give himself the best chance of guaranteed input in adoption decisions, an unmarried father should not wait to learn about potential children. He should proactively seek out knowledge of any children he may have fathered and take all steps possible to establish a parental role.

Commitment to Parenting

Beyond acknowledging paternity, unmarried fathers must meet a larger requirement demonstrated commitment to parenting in order to gain constitutionally protected paternal rights. This means providing for the childs material and emotional needs, and attempting to form the fullest possible parental relationship with the child.

Establishing a committed parental role typically includes helping pay pregnancy expenses, birth expenses and child support expenses after delivery. Some courts consider the fitness of the father to parent when determining his commitment to parenting. Fathers who do not provide support during pregnancy and beyond, who cannot show the ability to provide support, or who have demonstrated drug or alcohol problems can be denied the right to object to adoption.

The degree to which an unmarried father has the opportunity to play a parental role in the childs life often varies. However, doing everything he can to form a parental relationship, making himself as available as possible, and seeking legal recognition parental rights as soon as possible helps a father best position himself to maintain a say in adoption and other parental decisions.

Objecting to Adoption

Depending on state law, fathers who do not consent to the adoption of their child should file an objection to the adoption in the appropriate court, or in some cases with the state health and human services department. Often, an objection to adoption must include an indication of intent to petition for custody of the child in a short period of time, 30 days, for example.


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

And yet, there are so many married that have no business raising a child, and no real qualifications except a marriage certificate. Seems like the other side of the coin would be the state stepping in and aborting the fetus or taking the child if those same qualifications are not met.


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## badsanta (Oct 13, 2014)

You'll have to excuse me here as I don't really care that some people might be offended, but I think it is a man's responsibility to insure that he is in a stable and nurturing relationship for raising a child BEFORE he goes and sticks his d!ck into something. 

That is how a Father's Rights should be administered.


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

It's both their responsibility. It's quite literally inequality when stated that way. It unintentionally places a woman as inferior in intellect in assuming she doesn't have the same ability of reasoning or responsibility. She knows as well as a man that she must take precautions. He does as well, so I totally agree when just looking at a man's side of things, but it is not just one participant's responsibility. I read that like telling women they aren't able to say no, I'm not ready. Women can and do say no for equally good reasons.


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## Sandie (Mar 31, 2015)

They've raised $100 towards a goal of $40,000 in the past 5 months.

It's not looking so good for Preston!


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## BrutalHonesty (Apr 5, 2015)

badsanta said:


> You'll have to excuse me here as I don't really care that some people might be offended, but I think it is a man's responsibility to insure that he is in a stable and nurturing relationship for raising a child BEFORE he goes and sticks his d!ck into something.
> 
> That is how a Father's Rights should be administered.


I also do not care if some people might be offended, but i think it's a woman's responsibility to insure she is in a stable and nurturing relationship for raising a child BEFORE she goes and spreads her legs for anything. 

Yet, they get abortion, they can put a guy on hook for child support for 18 years, she can give the baby up for adoption without even consulting the father (she doesn't even have to name the father in some situations). In fact, she can enslave any man she wants if she manages to name him as father and he is somehow not contacted in time to object. 

And in divorce? Men have absolutely no rights. they can be put in jail for failing to pay alimony, but i've never heard of a woman getting thrown in jail for failing to keep to "visitation rights" (i find that designation quite offensive for every seriously committed father). If you get a divorce you are at the woman's mercy. She will keep the kids, can poison them against you, can make up crap to avoid your access to them and it can come to the point where you will have to do something bordering illegal just to see your children.


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## Hopefull363 (Feb 13, 2012)

In this case the father Preston went to the court to establish paternity before the baby was born. When the baby was born there was a paternity test by the courts. He is the father. He lives at home with his parents and is in the Fire Fighters Academy. Very loving stable home. This is a friend of a friend that's how I have information about this.

The reason the go fund me page is 5 months old is because that's when they were going to originally file with the Supreme Court. They didn't have enough time to raise the funds though. There was a new finding in another case which changes the law. That's why they are reopening the go fund me to try to get the funds together for the Supreme Court.

I'm a bit stunned at the fact that a court can take away your child, even though you've done nothing wrong because you are male. The mother was given every decision and he had none. Not even the right to be a father to his own flesh and blood. How can he not even have that basic right. If she decided to keep the child though he would be on the hook for child support for a long time.

This really needs to change. Fathers should have the same rights to their children as mothers. I'm sure you could find more out there. Just google Bring Baby Wyatt Home. You'll probably find a lot of other stories similar. This is happening all over. There's a lot of legal baby trafficking going on right here in this country.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

I agree parents should have equal rights.

But wouldn't that necessitate them to also have equal burden and responsibility?

This is where the problem starts. And it is tricky. But not unsolvable. It can be solved, it will just take a lot of fathers going after their babies. A LOT of them. And when that happens, their cases will go their way more often.


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## Hopefull363 (Feb 13, 2012)

Faithful Wife said:


> Found this:
> 
> One of the biggest parental rights is the right to consent or object to the adoption of ones child. Generally, adoption requires the consent of both parents, provided they meet certain requirements. To gain parental rights, including the right to object to adoption, biological fathers unmarried to the mother must not only establish paternity, but also demonstrate a commitment to parenting the child.
> 
> ...


Preston did all of this and was still denied his right to parent his child.


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## Hopefull363 (Feb 13, 2012)

Fozzy said:


> I'd be interested in hearing the other side of the story.


The birth mother was paid for all expenses and then some for the adoption. She decided she didn't want to be a parent so she gave the baby up for adoption. Preston wasn't given a chose on whether he wanted to be a parent or not.


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## Hopefull363 (Feb 13, 2012)

Basically as men you have no choices but to be an ATM if the mother chooses. It's actually ridiculous. I went through it with my husband and his son. Paid his child support but she would play around with visitation and vacations all the time. Would go to court and nothing would happen. She'd be good for a couple of weeks then back to playing games again. Wait 3 months to go back to court then she would be good right before court. She gamed the system the whole time. He was never able to have a good father son relationship with his oldest son. It's a shame because he's been a great father to our sons.

This archaic system needs to change. The government shouldn't take away your right to parent unless there is a danger to the child. Fathers should have rights too!


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Faithful Wife said:


> If I read the story correctly, (the only thing available to read was apparently written by the father's family), what happened is that a young girl gave her baby up for adoption, and the birth father had no say in this happening, even though he wanted to keep the baby.
> 
> I'm not positive but I think this is true that the birth mother can give the baby up for adoption even if the father doesn't want her to, if the father cannot show the full ability to raise the child himself, which in cases like this (a young boy in high school) they usually cannot.
> 
> I do agree this isn't really fair. But again I'm not clear on what this particular story is saying since all we have is the emotional plea of the father's family.


I have an adopted son so I have some experience with this. If the birthfather of the child we adopted had protested at any time we would not have been able to adopt our son.

When we adopted, our son's birth-father refused to cooperate and denied being the father. He refused to take a DNA test and ran off to the Army to hide. He family refused to even talk to him about taking responsibly.

We had to publish in the local newspaper for 2 months so that he could come forward and establish paternity. It's the law. After the 2 months, the adoption was 'final' with caveat that it was at risk. At any time before my son turned 18, his birth father could have swooped in and asked for paternal rights. He would have gotten them. We would have had to turn our son over to him. Sure we could have fought a huge legal battle but we probably would have lost.

By the time the publishing was over, our son was 6 months old. There was no way we were going to give him up. So we continued with the adoption at risk. Today he is 26. So we had no problem.

I've seen pictures of his birth father. My son is his spitting image.

There is a registry that a man can put his name on as a legal notification that he has sex with the named woman and that if she tries to give the child up for adoption, he is going to sue for paternal rights. This has to be checked by adoption agencies and court systems.

Now sometimes a woman can claim that she does not know who the father is or how to find him. But if he’s signed up on the registry then he has made it pretty clear that he thinks he is the after and wants rights. In OP’s case, he has gone to court, there has been a DNA test, etc. So it’s not clear why things have gone down the way they have for him. 

I did see that he is now expecting a new baby, I think this month, with another woman. I’m not sure fi they are married or not but from what I read they are together.

There is not enough info on this case. There are only a few websites and a Facebook account. Some of the posts on the Facebook account make no sense, they read are odd.

I’m very leery of things on the fund me site. Who knows if they are real? We have no way of knowing what the real story is. Sure this is a heart jerking story. But what is the whole story. He’s putting out pictures of his son on the internet. He’s even put out the full name, first and last, of his son in the adopted family. I’m not sure that’s a wise thing to go.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Hopefull363 said:


> The birth mother was paid for all expenses and then some for the adoption. She decided she didn't want to be a parent so she gave the baby up for adoption. Preston wasn't given a chose on whether he wanted to be a parent or not.


Do you know Preston personally?

How do you know that she was paid some for the adoption, meaning that she profited .. so that means she sold her child.

How do you know this?


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

BrutalHonesty said:


> I also do not care if some people might be offended, but i think it's a woman's responsibility to insure she is in a stable and nurturing relationship for raising a child BEFORE she goes and spreads her legs for anything.
> 
> Yet, they get abortion, they can put a guy on hook for child support for 18 years, she can give the baby up for adoption without even consulting the father (she doesn't even have to name the father in some situations). In fact, she can enslave any man she wants if she manages to name him as father and he is somehow not contacted in time to object.
> 
> And in divorce? Men have absolutely no rights. they can be put in jail for failing to pay alimony, but i've never heard of a woman getting thrown in jail for failing to keep to "visitation rights" (i find that designation quite offensive for every seriously committed father). If you get a divorce you are at the woman's mercy. She will keep the kids, can poison them against you, can make up crap to avoid your access to them and it can come to the point where you will have to do something bordering illegal just to see your children.


If a man gets a woman pregnant... yes he should help to support and raise his child. Why you call raising one's own child slavery is beyond me. Any parent who refuses to support their children should go to jail or have other penalties put on them.

Your view of divorce laws are, well hyperbole. the fact is that both parents have rights to their children.. or more rightly, children have the right to both of their parents. The higher paid parent will most likely end up paying child support... child support is not based on gender, it's based on need and income.

More and more courts are doing for 50/50 custody. 

A man can poison the kids against the mother every bit as much and the reverse. I've seen it go both ways.


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## BrutalHonesty (Apr 5, 2015)

> If a man gets a woman pregnant... yes he should help to support and raise his child.


No argument there...



> Why you call raising one's own child slavery is beyond me. Any parent who refuses to support their children should go to jail or have other penalties put on them.


I call it slavery when he is not the child's father and can still be paying child support. 


Jailed for Nonpayment of Child Support; But its Not His Child

Should Men Who Aren’t Biological Fathers Be Forced to Pay Child Support? | www.independentsentinel.com

State Orders Man to Pay $30k in Child Support or Face Jail, Despite Proof He Is Not Father | Ben Swann Truth In Media


Basically, if you are a victim of paternity fraud, if you somehow don't get properly notified by the court, if you are deployed somewhere abroad and can't make it to the hearing, you are screwed. Yes, i call working 18 years to support a child that isn't even his or going to jail pretty much legal enslavement. 

Personally i would rather burn everything i've got and flee the country rather than be the legal slave of some byatch that did this to me. 



> Your view of divorce laws are, well hyperbole. the fact is that both parents have rights to their children.. or more rightly, children have the right to both of their parents. The higher paid parent will most likely end up paying child support... child support is not based on gender, it's based on need and income.
> 
> More and more courts are doing for 50/50 custody.


I keep hearing about this "change" but i don't see it. Everytime i see a guy talking or read about his divorce a clear pattern comes up. Men are treated like crap by the legal system. The reward of them working extra time to cover for the time their wives get to spend with the kids is to be de facto bereaved when it comes to divorce. And it is also clear that when a man doesn't comply with court orders about time with his kids he gets thrown in jail. When it is the opposite, nothing happens. 

The stats are in. In the USA for example, 83% of the kids end up with their mothers as the primary guardian. And i would dare to say that the remaining probably have demonstrably mothers with severe problems of behaviour. 

The 50/50 thing you talk about is when the parents so decide. If there is a legal battle all she has to do is claim he is a child molester and she gets an auto-win. 

Do you know what happens to a man that is accused to being a child molester? His life is destroyed. Do you know what happens to a woman that does false accusations? Absolutely nothing. In fact, people are more likely to pat her on the back and still not believe the guy. 



> A man can poison the kids against the mother every bit as much and the reverse. I've seen it go both ways.


Only, with primary legal custody being given to women 83% of the time, i really don't see how men's ability to do it can be even remotely similar. Furthermore, in the situations where the father gets the kids, most of the times there is no need to poison anything, because the mother is ostensibly unfit to be a parent. 

And i would even volunteer that this manipulation of opinion of little kids is much more likely to happen on the woman's side. Quite frankly, they are much better at it than men are. And that is because usually they will have a full support system while doing it. They will literally have their mothers and sisters working on the kid. 

Most men are quite hapless while trying to do something like this. 

This support ring is also visible in this case. A guy who wants to be the father is asking for money to fight a costly legal battle. His campaign in 5 months sits at 100$... If this was a scheme of some sort they would use a woman losing her child. That would in a couple of hours of facebook sharing gather more than this guy gets in 5 months. 

Let's face it. As soon as the page went to one of those feminist websites she would gather the 40k in a matter of days.


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## Hopefull363 (Feb 13, 2012)

Adoption is a beautiful thing Elegirl when done properly. I know of the family in real life. He did do everything he could to be presumed the father before birth. Even told the adoptive parents that he won't give up his rights that he wanted his son. The adoptive parents knew the whole time that this baby was wanted by his father. He's a good kid. No drugs, in the fire academy and lives at home. His parents would have given him all the support he needed. So my point is why does the government get to take your right to parent away just because you are male?


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## Shoto1984 (Apr 11, 2009)

From what I see here this appears to be an amazing miscarriage of justice. It makes me hope there is more to this story that makes this understandable. If there is a concern about the child's welfare in the father's home then monitor the situations for a year.


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## Hopefull363 (Feb 13, 2012)

Shoto1984 said:


> From what I see here this appears to be an amazing miscarriage of justice. It makes me hope there is more to this story that makes this understandable. If there is a concern about the child's welfare in the father's home then monitor the situations for a year.


No concern over the childs welfare. Very loving stable home. Prestons parents have been married for 25 years and support him 100%. The problem is money. Not enough of it to fight for something they shouldn't have to fight for. There's a lot more of this going around than we know of in the private adoption area. Not to say that all private adoptions are bad. But some are, especially through this adoption agency.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Hopefull363 said:


> Adoption is a beautiful thing Elegirl when done properly. I know of the family in real life. He did do everything he could to be presumed the father before birth. Even told the adoptive parents that he won't give up his rights that he wanted his son. The adoptive parents knew the whole time that this baby was wanted by his father. He's a good kid. No drugs, in the fire academy and lives at home. His parents would have given him all the support he needed. So my point is why does the government get to take your right to parent away just because you are male?


Are the adoptive parents very well off financially? I'm wondering if this is why they were able to get custody of the child? Did they just out spend him in court? Our court system is not fair, not by a long shot.

I agree that if what you say is true, it's wrong for the courts to take his child away from him.


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## WandaJ (Aug 5, 2014)

If one of the biological parents wants a child, and it provides suitable home, there should be no way to take that right from him. But it is not the first law in this country, that's just seem so out of touch wiht common sense and what's good for the involved party. Not mentioning what Ellegirls said - whoever had better lawyer and more money wins.


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## Hopefull363 (Feb 13, 2012)

That's exactly it. More money wins. I hope they can get the money together for this one last appeal. Win it and provide more fathers with hope. There's a lot of these cases all over the country.


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