# Can't Get Out Of My Head/Erectile Dysfunction



## Guerrilla16 (1 mo ago)

I'm trying to figure this out, so here's the background. I'll include each concern separately. 

I have been taking Clomid, which is a women's infertility drug, off label for low testosterone, for about 3 months. My sex drive was fine before I started taking Clomid, but my mood was rarely great. My recent labs show my testosterone went from 141 to 864, and my mood has improved a lot. My concern here is that the medicine, while raising testosterone, also raised my estrogen from about 26 to 63. I don't know if there is any correlation, because the way the medicine works is a little foggy. I think that it raises both test and estrogen, but is supposed to act as an estrogen blocker to some degree as well? I have an appointment this week and I'm going to discuss this issue.

Wife and I started taking Delta 8 to get high once a week, usually during the weekend, for sex. Only because I could last quite a bit longer, and we were both less inhibited. We had been doing that for months without issue. When we get high, sex is great. Or was, until a few weeks ago. Now, I get paranoid and in my head about my performance, and my mood drops. Statistically, when I have ED, it occurs on a weekend night, so I'm wondering if I'm putting too much pressure on myself to perform suddenly, and can't get an erection or keep one because of this.

I started asking my wife questions about sexual preferences to try to be as good as a lover as possible, even though I have never had a complaint from her, or any woman I've ever been with, and never questioned my own sexual ability. She has told me two things that were concerning to me. First is her favorite position, which is her prone and me on top, which is so stimulating to me that I can't really perform in that position for long at all. Definitely not long enough for her to orgasm. Secondly, she told me her favorite way to have sex is long, hard strokes, which is also difficult for me to do because of course, it's unbelievably stimulating and I can't do it for long (unless I'm high, which could correlate with the previous paragraph.) While I know it's silly to think that I have to be able to do these things to please her, and I shouldn't assume that I need to do these things every time we have sex, the negative thought persists.

While there may be a mix of things going on, I feel like the performance anxiety aspect is the real culprit. I start thinking that I can't provide the sex she enjoys the most, which spirals into a lack of erection, and the memory of that persists throughout the week. We've recently decided to take a break from the Delta 8 on the weekends because it seems like expected sexual encounter is becoming a problem. Also, I get a little paranoid while high, which doesn't help. We were still having sex during the week, but for shorter duration, which could also add to my negative thoughts about not being able to perform properly for her. 

I see a therapist, and this is going to be brought up during the next session. I read that I shouldn't try to push negative thoughts away because that makes them more prevalent, but to accept them, and I've done everything in my power to do so, but it doesn't help me stay hard. I'm also considering giving up the Clomid for a few months to see what happens, but I also wonder if this is just the regular ebb and flow of sexuality. I am in my late 30s and in shape, my health is good. I spent a month thinking about how much I love my wife, and expressing my feelings to her, and she did the same. Then suddenly, last week, that very strong emotion went away. I still love my wife and am attracted to her, but that very strong emotion disappeared suddenly. I just need some insight into what I could or should do to keep myself from having these negative thoughts and feelings.


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## mwise003 (1 mo ago)

You got a lot of new things going on here. Definitely talk to your dr about your estrogen levels, but I think they are in the range or mildly above average. I too am on trt, but I take injections.

Personally, based on everything you've written, I think you are your head quite a bit and it can be a REAL boner killer! I know, I've been there. When I get like this, I usually pop 1/2 a blue pill to get my confidence back. However, you need to talk to your doctor first.

I also find that remembering sex is an expression of love when you are married, not a goal or challenge if you will. I get your wife wants things that make you finish faster, but there are things you can do to mitigate that. 
1. You could save the best for last.
2. Some men have success with **** rings, they aren't just for increased blood flow.
3. Condoms
4. Rotate between hard thrust and oral
5. Use a clitoral vibe so the sex you can last long doing is more stimulating
6. Some people find that if they stop a few times, basically edging themselves, then it's harder to finish.

I'm sure there are more...


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## Guerrilla16 (1 mo ago)

mwise003 said:


> You got a lot of new things going on here. Definitely talk to your dr about your estrogen levels, but I think they are in the range or mildly above average. I too am on trt, but I take injections.
> 
> Personally, based on everything you've written, I think you are your head quite a bit and it can be a REAL boner killer! I know, I've been there. When I get like this, I usually pop 1/2 a blue pill to get my confidence back. However, you need to talk to your doctor first.


Do you feel like the trt injections have been an improvement? My doc recommended Clomid because it doesn't cause fertility issues in men, but I had a vasectomy a year ago and have no reason to worry about my fertility. I've thought about using another drug as an aid, but don't want to start if I don't need to. I also worry that my brain will overcome any drug I use and I'll still have trouble getting and maintaining an erection. I can't wait for therapy to start.


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## mwise003 (1 mo ago)

Hard to say. I've been on TRT since I was 35, so about 12yrs. My libido at first did recover, I was around 150 when I started. Now at almost 48, it ebbs and flows. I too had a vasectomy so wasn't worried about fertility. I don't know much about Clomid, but your testosterone number sounds good. You've also been on it long enough for your body to normalize. 
One way to tell is by your morning erections. Doctors have told me if your morning erections are good, then it's probably in your head so to speak. 
However, I've noticed my morning erections ebb and flow usually with libido. 
Do you take Clomid daily? 
I take injections once a week, so there is a peak and valley.


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## mwise003 (1 mo ago)

Hard to say with libido that is, as far as the gym, Hell yes I've noticed a difference. Also with everyday tasks!


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## Guerrilla16 (1 mo ago)

mwise003 said:


> Hard to say. I've been on TRT since I was 35, so about 12yrs. My libido at first did recover, I was around 150 when I started. Now at almost 48, it ebbs and flows. I too had a vasectomy so wasn't worried about fertility. I don't know much about Clomid, but your testosterone number sounds good. You've also been on it long enough for your body to normalize.
> One way to tell is by your morning erections. Doctors have told me if your morning erections are good, then it's probably in your head so to speak.
> However, I've noticed my morning erections ebb and flow usually with libido.
> Do you take Clomid daily?
> I take injections once a week, so there is a peak and valley.


I take Clomid daily, 25mg. I haven't been sleeping well, so I have no idea about the morning wood. I feel like it's been a minute though.


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## Guerrilla16 (1 mo ago)

mwise003 said:


> Hard to say with libido that is, as far as the gym, Hell yes I've noticed a difference. Also with everyday tasks!


I've noticed the biggest gain with muscle and strength, but my mood has been the biggest improvement, up until this setback.


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## mwise003 (1 mo ago)

I would think that a daily dose would be better and create less ebb/flow. 
You probably have too much energy and maybe your body does still need to normalize a little for good sleep to return.
Do you have trouble sleeping on days you work out?
Or are you having trouble sleeping because of your thoughts on what you posted?


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## Guerrilla16 (1 mo ago)

mwise003 said:


> I would think that a daily dose would be better and create less ebb/flow.
> You probably have too much energy and maybe your body does still need to normalize a little for good sleep to return.
> Do you have trouble sleeping on days you work out?
> Or are you having trouble sleeping because of your thoughts on what you posted?


I really don't know why I have trouble falling asleep. Initially the Clomid made me sleepy, so I started taking it at night to avoid grogginess during the day. But I still can't fall asleep when I get into bed. I could be almost asleep on the couch, but the second I get into bed I'm wide awake. I worked out this afternoon, so I'll see how I do tonight, but I don't expect I'll fall asleep easily.


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## mwise003 (1 mo ago)

Well for reference, I've never had that problem of feeling sleepy with injections. Just something to ponder. Also, I assume Clomid is a pill, which could elevate the liver. Injections bypass the liver. 
That being said, some doctors want you to come in weekly for your injection which can be tedious. I finally am able to take them at home. My wife gives them to me.


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## Deepsouthdude (Feb 12, 2020)

Why don’t you take a testosterone replacement instead of clomid? I don’t remember all the details but clomid isn’t as good.


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## Guerrilla16 (1 mo ago)

Deepsouthdude said:


> Why don’t you take a testosterone replacement instead of clomid? I don’t remember all the details but clomid isn’t as good.


The clomid was recommended as a way to raise testosterone, and it has. But I worry about what it's doing besides just raising test. I'm going to talk to my doctor about it tomorrow, and maybe I'll be able to get on the injections instead.


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## happyhusband0005 (May 4, 2018)

Guerrilla16 said:


> I'm trying to figure this out, so here's the background. I'll include each concern separately.
> 
> I have been taking Clomid, which is a women's infertility drug, off label for low testosterone, for about 3 months. My sex drive was fine before I started taking Clomid, but my mood was rarely great. My recent labs show my testosterone went from 141 to 864, and my mood has improved a lot. My concern here is that the medicine, while raising testosterone, also raised my estrogen from about 26 to 63. I don't know if there is any correlation, because the way the medicine works is a little foggy. I think that it raises both test and estrogen, but is supposed to act as an estrogen blocker to some degree as well? I have an appointment this week and I'm going to discuss this issue.
> 
> ...


OK I can help a little maybe. First ditch the half measures and go to the real stuff. Get some real test prescribed clomid does raise testosterone as you have found. It is used often and post cycle therapy by body builders to jumpstart their natural test after cycle usually along with HCG. I was in the bodybuilder world for a few years and most people I know who would take clomid for extended periods had ED problems. Second ditch the Delta 8 and just get some legit weed, if your in a legal state you can get edibles based on sativa, indica or hybrids. For sex sativa dominant hybrids are the best. Based on my extensive research though smoking or vaping is better for sex than edibles. Edibles can be tough to dial in the right dosage, you want to be good and high without being too high and getting the paranoia. Edibles have a stronger psychedelic effect than inhaled so if your prone to paranoia edibles are more likely to cause it. 

Extended use of clomid can be a problem and I'm guessing thats your problem, you want the testosterone effects without the estrogen effects. There are plenty of online clinics to easily get testosterone. Dollars to donuts you ditch the clomid, get real test, grab some ed meds, and get better, more specific THC you'll be good. If you can find the weed strain Sour Diesel you and your wife will thank me.


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## Deepsouthdude (Feb 12, 2020)

Guerrilla16 said:


> The clomid was recommended as a way to raise testosterone, and it has. But I worry about what it's doing besides just raising test. I'm going to talk to my doctor about it tomorrow, and maybe I'll be able to get on the injections instead.


It’s worth your time to find someone who really knows what they’re doing with testosterone. Good luck.


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## Guerrilla16 (1 mo ago)

happyhusband0005 said:


> OK I can help a little maybe. First ditch the half measures and go to the real stuff. Get some real test prescribed clomid does raise testosterone as you have found. It is used often and post cycle therapy by body builders to jumpstart their natural test after cycle usually along with HCG. I was in the bodybuilder world for a few years and most people I know who would take clomid for extended periods had ED problems. Second ditch the Delta 8 and just get some legit weed, if your in a legal state you can get edibles based on sativa, indica or hybrids. For sex sativa dominant hybrids are the best. Based on my extensive research though smoking or vaping is better for sex than edibles. Edibles can be tough to dial in the right dosage, you want to be good and high without being too high and getting the paranoia. Edibles have a stronger psychedelic effect than inhaled so if your prone to paranoia edibles are more likely to cause it.
> 
> Extended use of clomid can be a problem and I'm guessing thats your problem, you want the testosterone effects without the estrogen effects. There are plenty of online clinics to easily get testosterone. Dollars to donuts you ditch the clomid, get real test, grab some ed meds, and get better, more specific THC you'll be good. If you can find the weed strain Sour Diesel you and your wife will thank me.


 I've read the same thing about bodybuilders using Clomid between cycles. I have had a hard time finding any first person experience with Clomid causing erectile dysfunction, but it's definitely a possibility. I only use Delta 8 because I'm in a state where weed is illegal (until 2023, when it becomes medically available for purchase from other states) but I have a few contacts who might be able to get better stuff. I enjoy edibles, but you're right, a little too much can be way too much. The first thing I'm doing is stopping Delta 8 and getting high in general. I need a break anyway, and it will allow me to determine if it is causing any of my issues. If I still have the ED problems after a few weeks without Delta 8, I'm going to make sure to stop taking Clomid. 

I also thought about what you said with Clomid causing ED in long term users. I had to fill out paperwork for my upcoming doctor's visit, and I did a survey about erection health. Almost immediately I started getting texts and emails about ED meds from the company that supplies my Clomid (Hone) and it made me think that there is a possibility that they prescribe clomid on purpose in order to push other pills and make more money later on. It seemed a little sketchy.


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## AandM (Jan 30, 2019)

Deepsouthdude said:


> Why don’t you take a testosterone replacement instead of clomid? I don’t remember all the details but clomid isn’t as good.


Artificial test/steroids will destroy his sperm production.

Clomid interferes with the estrogen->testosterone->estrogen cycle. In men, it up-cycles testosterone, by preventing down-cycling into estrogen.

This doesn't interfere with sperm production.


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## Guerrilla16 (1 mo ago)

AandM said:


> Artificial test/steroids will destroy his sperm production.
> 
> Clomid interferes with the estrogen->testosterone->estrogen cycle. In men, it up-cycles testosterone, by preventing down-cycling into estrogen.
> 
> This doesn't interfere with sperm production.


That's a good point, but I had a vasectomy, so sperm production isn't an issue for me as much at the rest of the issues are.


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## SongoftheSouth (Apr 22, 2014)

I am confused Clomid is an estrogen receptor blocker. years past when I used body enhancing supplements ( steroids) we used clomid to reduce possibilities of estrogen conversion and binding to receptors then kick start the natural process of your own hormones to start producing test again. Even if estrogen levels are up clomid is a blocker. If you are using a testosterone enhancer which it seems cause your test levels are up these artificial steroids can induce elevated estrogen levels so clomid or nolvadex is used. Your test levels are now normal so you should be good to go physiologically. When someone is seriously juicing they are an order of magnitude higher. if you are using artificial test is is likely converting. people used to use ant-conversion drugs (aromotase inhibitor) like armidex (sp) to prevent increase in estrogen levels but I think there may be cardiovascular issues with it. Perhaps that is why you are only using clomid. Did you ask about this? Maybe a low dose of arimidex would help.


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## SongoftheSouth (Apr 22, 2014)

AandM said:


> Artificial test/steroids will destroy his sperm production.
> 
> Clomid interferes with the estrogen->testosterone->estrogen cycle. In men, it up-cycles testosterone, by preventing down-cycling into estrogen.
> 
> This doesn't interfere with sperm production.


Prretty much right - synthetic test reduces your bodies ability to produce its own testosterone because your test levels are above what they should be so the leutinizng hormone shuts off. His body is not producing enough test on its own thus the need for HRT. These substancs may aromarize to estrogen thus the need for clomid to block these receptors and prevent unwanted side effect like ***** tits.


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## Rus47 (Apr 1, 2021)

I guess all of this means maybe best to just let nature take it's course? When the T drops just take up fishing? Just like when the wife's E drops she takes up cats? Bring some fish home to the cats and everyone is happy.

Never even heard of Clomid. Or Delta 8. Testosterone cypionate is what I have been using, works fine for my purposes but suppose will need to take until end of life as imagine my own production has been suppressed. No depression or performance anxiety.


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## Guerrilla16 (1 mo ago)

SongoftheSouth said:


> I am confused Clomid is an estrogen receptor blocker. years past when I used body enhancing supplements ( steroids) we used clomid to reduce possibilities of estrogen conversion and binding to receptors then kick start the natural process of your own hormones to start producing test again. Even if estrogen levels are up clomid is a blocker. If you are using a testosterone enhancer which it seems cause your test levels are up these artificial steroids can induce elevated estrogen levels so clomid or nolvadex is used. Your test levels are now normal so you should be good to go physiologically. When someone is seriously juicing they are an order of magnitude higher. if you are using artificial test is is likely converting. people used to use ant-conversion drugs (aromotase inhibitor) like armidex (sp) to prevent increase in estrogen levels but I think there may be cardiovascular issues with it. Perhaps that is why you are only using clomid. Did you ask about this? Maybe a low dose of arimidex would help.


I had my appointment yesterday and the doc said that my estrogen levels were above normal. I guess he wanted them at between 35 and 45, and mine was in the 60s after the last blood test, so he prescribed Anastrozole to help bring it down. I don't know the dosage exactly, but it's small, a half a pill once a week. I've also been dealing with a very neutral mood, and have always been prone to mood swings, so I could just be having one of my downturns and the Clomid is making my attitude neutral instead of negative. I don't know, it's all speculation at this point. I also don't know how to find a reputable doctor, because I don't really like using an online doc for testosterone therapy, and my usual doctor wouldn't prescribe it because even though my test was low, it was just barely inside the normal range. I'm going to give it time, see if the Anastrozole makes a difference, and then re-evaluate if I want to continue this course of treatment.


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## Guerrilla16 (1 mo ago)

SongoftheSouth said:


> Prretty much right - synthetic test reduces your bodies ability to produce its own testosterone because your test levels are above what they should be so the leutinizng hormone shuts off. His body is not producing enough test on its own thus the need for HRT. These substancs may aromarize to estrogen thus the need for clomid to block these receptors and prevent unwanted side effect like *** tits.


I could be misunderstanding, but I've only ever been on Clomid. It was the first course of action, though the doc did seem to be pushing it because he was concerned about my sperm production and having children, but I've had a vasectomy. I have had very minimal side effects from Clomid, mostly being tired and some pretty wild mood swings during the initial period when I was adjusting. After the Anastrozole trial run I may discontinue use altogether and find another source of treatment. When my test was low I still had a great libido and zero erection trouble. So right now, I've given up getting high, and I started regular counseling with a mental health professional, so the only other explanations would be the Clomid and estrogen levels, or just a natural ebb and flow in my sexual desire.


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## Guerrilla16 (1 mo ago)

Rus47 said:


> I guess all of this means maybe best to just let nature take it's course? When the T drops just take up fishing? Just like when the wife's E drops she takes up cats? Bring some fish home to the cats and everyone is happy.
> 
> Never even heard of Clomid. Or Delta 8. Testosterone cypionate is what I have been using, works fine for my purposes but suppose will need to take until end of life as imagine my own production has been suppressed. No depression or performance anxiety.


There are only a few possibilities with my situation, which are Clomid (new medicine that I could still be adjusting too or having side effects from), Delta 8, which is like marijuana but synthesized from the hemp plant, and my own negative internal dialogue, which I am dealing with through therapy currently. 

You may be onto something with the fishing aspect though. I seem to have lost my lust for life in general and feel stuck. I used to love fishing (didn't go at all this year) woodworking (haven't done much in 6 months) hiking (barely went this year) and playing guitar. I feel like each of my possible causes of my situation could be valid, so I'm taking time to remove them individually to see if it makes a difference. While I'm doing that, I should probably add in some of the things that I used to enjoy, which would help my mood immensely.


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## Rus47 (Apr 1, 2021)

Guerrilla16 said:


> There are only a few possibilities with my situation, which are Clomid (new medicine that I could still be adjusting too or having side effects from), Delta 8, which is like marijuana but synthesized from the hemp plant, and my own negative internal dialogue, which I am dealing with through therapy currently.
> 
> You may be onto something with the fishing aspect though. I seem to have lost my lust for life in general and feel stuck. I used to love fishing (didn't go at all this year) woodworking (haven't done much in 6 months) hiking (barely went this year) and playing guitar. I feel like each of my possible causes of my situation could be valid, so I'm taking time to remove them individually to see if it makes a difference. While I'm doing that, I should probably add in some of the things that I used to enjoy, which would help my mood immensely.


So what I hear in your words is depression. Which is a boner killer. As are most medications to treat depression. My approach to a change in physical or mental has always been to remove each possible cause, starting with the most recent one just as you are doing. Any medications are always suspect, but of course they must be stopped under a doctor's supervision after explaining to him/her what the symptoms are. Personally would opt for quitting the both Delta 8 and the Clomid if the doctor agrees. 

Sorry you are in this spot. But I personally think a more conventional treatment for low T would serve you better. I know injecting made a world of difference to my mood and physical abilities, with no side effects.


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## Guerrilla16 (1 mo ago)

Rus47 said:


> So what I hear in your words is depression. Which is a boner killer. As are most medications to treat depression. My approach to a change in physical or mental has always been to remove each possible cause, starting with the most recent one just as you are doing. Any medications are always suspect, but of course they must be stopped under a doctor's supervision after explaining to him/her what the symptoms are. Personally would opt for quitting the both Delta 8 and the Clomid if the doctor agrees.
> 
> Sorry you are in this spot. But I personally think a more conventional treatment for low T would serve you better. I know injecting made a world of difference to my mood and physical abilities, with no side effects.


That's where I'm at. I don't know if the higher estrogen is causing a lower sex drive, but after I try the Anastrozole, if it doens't change, I'm quitting altogether. I might look into injections, or take a break from testosterone therapy and see what happens.


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## Guerrilla16 (1 mo ago)

I also want to say that my last blood test showed that my estrogen levels went from 28 pg/ml to almost 70 pg/ml, and the normal range for men is between 10 and 50. High estrogen levels can cause low libido and depression in men, and low libido can also cause depression, so I'm assuming at this point that the Clomid and raised estrogen levels are causing my issues. If the Anastrozole works, things should even out, but I don't know how long that will take.


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## BigDaddyNY (May 19, 2021)

I think the ED is mostly in your head.

Here is a quick run down of how Clomid works for increasing a man's testosterone levels. It is a big feedback loop. The way the cycle normally goes is the pituitary gland releases luteinizing hormone (LH). That hormone triggers the testes to produce testosterone (T). Some of your testosterone naturally converts into estrogen (E). The E signals the pituitary to stop producing LH which stops T production. Clomid blocks the E from signaling the pituitary so it never stops producing LH driving up your T level. The side effect is higher T also means more gets converted to E which can make that go high. Anastrozole is an Aromatase inhibitors (AI) which reduces how much T gets converted into E.

Your E being a little high shouldn't be that big of a deal. The ratio of E to T is probably more relevant. Think about that. You raised your T by more than 6x, but only raised your E by a little more than 2x. That number you gave isn't all that high, but no harm in in trying the AI to see if it makes a difference. I've had high E levels like that and no effect on erectile function. I've read that low libido is more common, but you are still interested in sex, so your libido seems fine.

What I don't understand is why your doc is worried about fertility in a man with a vasectomy. It is true that taking exogenous T will cause your body to stop producing its own T and lowering sperm production. But it is usually recoverable and what does it matter in someone that obviously isn't going to have any more children. 

I think it is a good idea to stop the Delta 8 and give the AI a chance to lower your E. However, I really think this is in your head, which doesn't make it any less real. You may want to consider something like Cialis for good measure. It can help with the psychological side of things by giving you a bit of a confidence boost.


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## Guerrilla16 (1 mo ago)

BigDaddyNY said:


> I think the ED is mostly in your head.
> 
> Here is a quick run down of how Clomid works for increasing a man's testosterone levels. It is a big feedback loop. The way the cycle normally goes is the pituitary gland releases luteinizing hormone (LH). That hormone triggers the testes to produce testosterone (T). Some of your testosterone naturally converts into estrogen (E). The E signals the pituitary to stop producing LH which stops T production. Clomid blocks the E from signaling the pituitary so it never stops producing LH driving up your T level. The side effect is higher T also means more gets converted to E which can make that go high. Anastrozole is an Aromatase inhibitors (AI) which reduces how much T gets converted into E.
> 
> ...


Thanks for all of that. I've been looking into possibly using Cialis as a stopgap measure, but I really don't want to add more meds if I can help it. I've stopped Delta 8, and I'm going to give the new med the 3 month period before bloodwork and see where I am. If I haven't felt better after the Anastrozole, I'll just stop taking it and the Clomid and give it another 3 months. My test was low initially, but the only problem I had at that time was with mood, and that could have been general depression, which I've dealt with for years. I could always go back to sertraline to improve my mood and not worry about test for a while. It's only been 3 or so months since I started Clomid, so there is a possibility I haven't fully adjusted to the hormone levels.


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## Deepsouthdude (Feb 12, 2020)

Where are you located?


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## Guerrilla16 (1 mo ago)

Deepsouthdude said:


> Where are you located?


Kentucky


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## Deepsouthdude (Feb 12, 2020)

Guerrilla16 said:


> Kentucky


I’m going to send you some stuff tomorrow.


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## Guerrilla16 (1 mo ago)

So I found this post on Reddit that describes basically what I am going through if anyone is interested


__
https://www.reddit.com/r/DeadBedrooms/comments/kp94bs


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