# Living with a Yeller...



## thirtywhacks (Sep 2, 2013)

I am here seeking advice from those of you who may be dealing with or have dealt with living life with a yeller. By nature, I am a shy and generally soft spoken person. I am 38 years old and have been with my partner for 4.5 years and noticed the yelling started pretty early on. As I have never had any experience with a yeller, never grew up in that environment, never dated someone who I would classify as a yeller, I didn't understand the weight of it nor the psychological toll it would eventually take on me. Now here I am, nearly 5 years in and I find that it has just shaken me to my core. It has changed me as a person. I've regressed. 

We have our issues and I'm not perfect by any means. I am not a very good communicator, though I want to be. She communicates her every feeling and I try to be a good listener. I think the potential for greatness is there, despite all the lows we've had. I just feel it's so far gone, this yelling, everything piggy backs on everything and there's very little restraint in going off on a yelling tangent.

Yelling renders me an emotional mute, this I know. I am more clammed up than I have ever been. I often times don't talk about what I'm feeling because when I say something that she finds offensive or is blaming, she completely fly's off the handle. I can't even understand it sometimes, that sort of anger, that need to react in that way... I mean, she literally foams at the mouth... How can that be normal? I've had her so close to my face on a number of occasions, I can feel the heat of her breath. She must know what it does to me. I stop dead in my tracks. The flight or fight response kicks in. I'm paralyzed. Sometimes I try to pacify her, respond in a way to bring her down, sometimes I say I'm going to leave until you calm down albeit not often enough, sometimes I make remarks that are like throwing kerosene on the fire and I regret them instantly and try to not do that anymore. I just feel there's no reasoning with her. I can't talk to her. We live in an apartment and I'm sure others can hear her. 

I am at this point now where I fear even bringing something up, I know it will set her off. 

I know people in relationships sometimes say they feel like they're walking on eggshells and I have to say, I feel that very unease in my bones. I feel I have lost my very identity. I find that the motivation behind just about all of my actions is, how will this cause the least conflict, the least anger, the least tension. My actions are based in fear. I fear this person that I say I love so much and in my logical mind, I don't know how those two feelings can co-exist. I've told her many times that she scares me, that I'm afraid. She says that she's afraid of me because she doesn't know what I'll do to her. 

I know she has full control over her outbursts, I don't excuse it, ever. She'll always say she needs to get away from people who take her from zero to sixty. Those people are me and her family because we're the only ones she ever yells at. 

I've never seen anyone in her family yell. I don't know if they have but I haven't seen it and I don't know where it comes from. She says other people drive her to yell but in my book, it's no excuse. I think I've allowed her to get away with it for nearly 5 years and that's why she does it. 

I'm completely ineffective at arguing with her. She's as sharp as a tack and able to keep her train of thought while shouting at the top of her lungs and aggressively pacing the room, meanwhile, the yelling takes me to a place of complete fear, I panic, I can't concentrate on anything but the fear and I feel the physical toll it takes on my body. In moments when I tell myself to pull it together, stand up for yourself, I try to hold my ground and I think it angers her more. Just today, I tried communicating with her while holding my hands behind my back and she started to mock me then she told me how tired she is of looking at my face. She'll call me names in these moments. These things throw me off, bring me to tears, deflate my defense. I cower to her.

She once called me a milquetoast. I didn't know what it meant when she said it, didn't get the reference... I looked it up and literally felt myself die a little inside. But I see why she said it and I've come to think that I am a milquetoast. I don't want to be and I try to give myself pep talks all the time but I feel myself sinking further and further into this depression. I want this relationship to work so bad that I feel I've compromised my own self worth and in becoming weak, I am sure she has no respect for me, I don't even respect myself when I don't stand up for myself.

When I was 10 years old, I woke up one morning and my mom was gone. I asked my dad where she was and he said "she didn't come home last night". I've seen my mom once in the last 28 years. I was close to her and I never felt close or comfortable with my dad, truth be told, I was afraid of him, he was cold and distant, he worked a lot and he was the disciplinarian. When my mom left, she may as well have left me with a complete stranger. I barely knew the man and I feared him. That fear never left me, I grew up in a household with little love, little attention and always remaining quiet because I didn't feel safe. Being in this relationship takes me back to that place and that's why I say I've regressed. I fear the person I am in a relationship with and that keeps me quiet. 


I am seeking advice from this forum because I do not have any family or friends in my life nor do I have the money to afford counseling. I am trepidatious about hitting submit on this post but must confess that just typing this out has helped me tremendously already. I know I need to grow a backbone and stand up for myself. I thought I was in a good place when I met her, I felt I had spent a lot of time working on myself, felt I could defend myself. Something in this relationship... somehow... made me regress. I don't want to be this weak person. 

Thanks for listening... It's literally been years since I've discussed my relationship with anyone. I keep these feelings to myself and have no one to bounce them off of, to gauge what's normal, to help in the process. Thank you.


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

I am so sorry to hear that your mom abandoned you. That is so sad. 

I think it would be best if you and your partner parted ways. You need to be with a loving, patient woman, as the right person can help you fill unmet needs from your childhood. I don't think your current companion can do that.
_Posted via Mobile Device_
_Posted via Mobile Device_
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## sixty-eight (Oct 2, 2015)

I also feel like need to remove yourself from your current living arrangement at the very least.


thirtywhacks said:


> I am not a very good communicator, though I want to be.


You say that you are not a good communicator. Maybe not verbally, but your post is articulate. 



thirtywhacks said:


> I've told her many times that she scares me, that I'm afraid. *She says that she's afraid of me because she doesn't know what I'll do to her. *


What is this about? She's afraid? Has there been any point in the relationship that gives her cause to be afraid? It's the one thing in your post that doesn't fit with the rest, and contradicts all of her other words and actions. People aren't generally afraid of milquetoasts.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

sixty-eight said:


> I also feel like need to remove yourself from your current living arrangement at the very least.
> 
> You say that you are not a good communicator. Maybe not verbally, but your post is articulate.
> 
> ...


 I was thinking the same thing.. confused...

I googled verbally abusive women & found this website.. could be a resource to you.. 

*>>* Welcome to Verbal Abuse of Men.com



> * Verbal abuse is not a side issue. It IS the issue in the relationship.
> 
> * Verbal abuse creates pain and trauma and can lead to physical illness.
> 
> ...


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

You need heavy duty counseling to work through this.


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## thebirdman (Apr 5, 2014)

There is a reason your wife yells. Most likely she doesn't feel heard. Key is there is a difference between feeling heard and being heard. For her it's a force of habit. You won't make her stop doing that. You do need to tell her how her behavior makes you feel and that you want to seek counseling, if you're interested in trying to make it work. Do not try to talk with her when she is raising her voice. Tell her calmly that you are willing to listen. If she refuses to stop, leave. Leave the room, leave the house, whatever you need to do.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## NotEasy (Apr 19, 2015)

I sympathise having come through a somewhat similar situation. My wife was a yeller too. I can offer my techniques, but am unsure if they are applicable. 

It sounds like your wife triggers faster than mine. I got warnings that she was getting emotional and the yelling might follow soon. This gave me time to get ready mentally.

I also repeated told her that these yelling outburst cause me to shutdown for maybe the next 24 hours. It was something I was working at reducing, but also something she didn't like. So she knew if I wasn't talking it because she yelled at me yesterday, so partly it was her fault. Gradually both of us improved ourselves.

My wife's family all 'discuss' things with what I consider yelling arguments. They once had a 1 hour tag-team yelling match about what take-away to order for lunch. My family never raised their voices. So she explained her yelling as what her family did. I countered that it was not what my family did, in my family such behaviour was unacceptable. Given you can't point to a source, this probably doesn't help you.

My martial arts included a training technique for very light contact close quarter 'sparring'. It was close enough for knees to touch. When she got 'in my face' I calmly stood my ground and sometimes got even closer. For me the sparing training was a relaxing game. When she realised I was playing it sometimes infuriated her, but after a while she tended to realise what I was doing and why and she would tone down. 

I also had a problem with shutting down and not responding. This was my problem and my behaviour did not help the situation. I needed to develop and follow a plan, which I called seige mode, I would stand my ground and calmly and quietly respond that I was not going to negotiate at this volume, that I would not agree to or apologize for anything while being yelled at, and in bad cases that she had x minutes to calm down or I was leaving. It took a while before I could reliably implement seige mode without shutting down entirely. Initially I sometimes needed to leave the room listening to "you're not a real man" etc. And I needed to negotiate as soon as the volume went down, rather than staying locked down for a day. And in calm times I repeated told my wife that yelling is unacceptable and I will not agree to anything while being yelled at.

Not sure what you can use out of all that, but the issue can be overcome.


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## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

We teach others how we will be treated. She yells because you have permitted her to for nearly five years. Explain to her that you will talk to her respectfully and you expect the same. If she starts with the temper tantrum, pick up your car keys and leave. Do it every time. It won't take long for her to figure out that if she wants to express herself that yelling isn't a path to success. She gets in your face, tell her to back out. If she doesn't, leave. Do it every time. Nobody changes bad behavior that gets rewarded. She yells, you melt, she wins, and the bad behavior is reinforced. She gets in your face, you feel intimidated, she wins, her crappy behavior gets reinforced. If you give a dog a treat for crapping on the floor you can't be surprised when it frequently craps on the floor. 
You don't need to become some domestic warrior. Most people don't like yelling and screaming and there's no reason an adult has to live that way. The problem isn't you. The problem is you married a loud, pushy, battle axe. Pushy, loud people need other people to intimidate and boss around. In her case, she's got you. Walk away. Unless she's clinically insane she won't yell without someone to yell at. It's not your job to calm her down or appease her. She's an adult and presumably had parents who should have taught her how civilized people behave. Your words or behavior aren't responsible for the words or volume she chooses to use. She is an adult, responsible for her actions. A woman would call me a milquetoast only once. Your choice is not one between living with hostility and disrespect or living forever alone. There are loads of reasonably functional human beings on earth. Is this woman adding something positive to your life? Does she make you a better, more complete man? Does she inspire you to greatness? Does she make you feel good about yourself and the world around you? If she left forever what would you be losing? The world is chock full of wonderful women who know how to behave in polite society. Why would you put up with this screaming narcissist? You might try my suggestions a couple times and if she doesn't pull her disrespectful, screaming head out of her buttocks, leave permanently and let her be the queen of nothing.


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## alphaomega (Nov 7, 2010)

The thing with yellers is that they only do it to people they know they can get away with it with. 

Does she yell at her boss? No. Why? Because her ass would get fired. 

Does she yell at her friends? No. Why? 
Because she would soon be friendless. 

I'm not sure what advice I can give you. Except some history. 

I hate yellers. My family also yelled all the time. It was as if everyone was trying to force thier opinion and also yell the loudest to be the only one in the room that was heard. 

It drove me nuts. I don't yell. I never did. So I didn't partake in speaking around my family. That didn't mean I didn't stand up for myself or have a spine. I just realized it was pointless to participate. 

Then I dated yellers. It drove me nuts too. And they were gone like yesterday's donuts. With about the same regret as I would have as throwing away stale donuts. 

It's easy to be labelled a milketoast by a yeller. Of course you are. What other display are you going to exhibit when you realize yelling back is pointless? Good for you in not getting sucked into that exchange. 

I do need to ask, though. Why are you still with her? What can you possibly be getting from this relationship? Other than stress and emotional breakdown. You do know there's 3 billion ladies on this planet, right? What makes you think she's so special that you need to take this abuse? 

Id be laughing at her milketoast comment than advising her not to let the door hit her in the ass on the way out. And then I'd throw her suitcases out right after her. 

And then!!! Then I'd just start dating again, maybe one of the 2,999,999,999 ladies left out there. Because I'd be damned sure there's a good chance I'd get one that wasn't such a royal, abusive, insulting beotch.


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## As'laDain (Nov 27, 2011)

my wife used to yell like that. would chase me around screaming. even escalated to physical violence, quite often at first.

what worked was consequences for her destructive behavior. my wife had abandonment issues, and the one thing that scared her the most was the thought that i was going to walk out and abandon her one day. her actions were like a self fulfilling prophecy. had it continued, i would have eventually left her. 

i also had to have a vision of what kind of person i wanted to be. remembering that vision kept me on track. 


eventually, i realized that it was never going to change unless i changed my own behaviors. basically, i did what unbelievable suggested to you. i provided consequences for her destructive behavior. i also avoided arguing anything that i could not know for certain, ie, her emotions, thoughts, and intentions. 

that last bit was kinda important. you have said that she has a sharper wit than you when you two are arguing. as you have already identified, it is because of the fight or flight hormones. when you start to feel anxious, your brain is flooded with chemicals that make it very difficult for you to think. so, instead of trying to bolster yourself and think while your brain is locked in fight or flight mode, crystalize your whole argument strategy to simple truths that you know for certain, and don't argue anything else. in other words, don't say anything about what she intends, thinks, or feels. only defend your own mind, ie, your own thoughts and feelings. 
instead of saying "when you do XYZ, it makes me feel like you want/feel/mean ABC", say "when you do XYZ, this is how i feel". 
its an incredibly simple thing to say, and truth be told, is the only thing you really need to communicate anyway. most importantly, it is something you should be able to hold onto even if you are all amped up. 


next, you need to provide consequences for her behavior. the number one consequence that you can provide for her is physical space. tell her upfront that if she gets in your face, you are going to leave for fifteen minutes(or however long you want) and will not speak to her until she calms down. check back in, if she yells at you again, leave again for another fifteen minutes. do this consistently until she learns that she simply will not be able to speak to you unless she is willing to be civil about it. if she suggests that you two resort to texting or writing notes to each other for a while, accept it. remember, its going to take a while for her to change her emotional responses to things as well. while you are away, practice things to get your body to produce more testosterone and less cortisol. things like exercise, pushups, meditation, or even laughing. practice then any time you feel anxious. here is a video to get you started with some ideas: https://www.ted.com/talks/amy_cuddy_your_body_language_shapes_who_you_are?language=en
some of them, like a power pose, can be done pretty much anywhere and can even be done in public without people noticing what you are doing. i know because i have done them a lot. nobody has ever noticed that i was doing it, but pretty much everybody has noticed the change in my personality. 

if she calls you a bad name, tell her that you will not tolerate such disrespect and will not talk to her for the rest of the day, or until she apologizes, whichever comes first. and then go out and buy a VAR and keep it on you the next time you speak to her. show it to her, let her know it is there, and tell her you want to be able to review your conversation with her to find out if you really deserve to be called the names that she calls you. after all, if she did not apologize, that means she must not have been in the wrong. maybe you said something you shouldn't have and she responded in kind. either way, with a VAR, you will have a record of her verbal abuse, and both of you will know it. the goal is not to catch her and gain dirt on her. the goal is to get her to practice moderating her own emotions and talking to you in a civilized manner. the more she forces herself to calm down, the better she will get at it. 

another thing you should try is active listening, but don't even bother with it if she refuses to apologize for insulting you. until she is willing to admit that her behavior is wrong, she will likely only use your attempts at active listening as more fuel for her anger. she will see it as patronizing. if she is willing to apologize and admit that she did wrong by her treatment of you, then listen intently to what she says about how she feels, and paraphrase it back to her so that she knows that you were listening. 


understand this, there is nothing wrong with you. the way you feel is not an indication of how strong or weak you are. think of it like this... i am a paratrooper. we jump out of perfectly good airplanes a lot. some of us are scared ****less when we jump, some of us are not bothered by it at all, but we all jump. everyone views us exactly the same so long as we all jump. we are not judged by our feelings at all, but rather by our actions. you are no different. you can be scared ****less and paralyzed, but if you can remember the action that you need to take, and then take that action, you are not weak. you are not spineless. if you state that you will walk away from her the next time she tries to intimidate you, and you actually manage to do it, you are not weak. you are not spineless. you are not Casper Milquetoast. you are a someone who has stated how they wish to be addressed, stated a consequence for refusing to address them in such a manner, and followed through with the consequence. 


don't ever say you are going to do something unless you are willing to do it. if your partner wanted to keep you around and you told her that you would immediately start separation proceedings the next time she insults you, she likely wouldn't believe you today. if, however, you plainly state each action you are going to make and follow through with all of them over the next couple months, she will likely believe it. after all, if you have meant absolutely everything that you have said, and proven that you meant it by actually doing it, why wouldn't she believe you? this goes back to that vision of who you want to be... do you want to be the kind of person who makes empty threats whenever they feel they are not in control, or do you want to be the kind of person who clearly and openly decides exactly how they will act? do you want to be someone who attempts to try and control that which cannot be controlled, or someone who exerts complete control over their own actions, regardless of their fleeting emotions?

personally, i like to be in control of myself. 


eventually, if you stand up for yourself enough in a consistent form, you will start to notice that you are feeling less and less anxious. you will know that even if your partner does blow up in your face, its not that big of a deal. you can put an end to it as easily as walking out the door. because, lets make something clear, you didn't really ask for advice about how to fix your relationship. you asked for advice on how to fix yourself.


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## AliceA (Jul 29, 2010)

Personally, I think you should leave her. Some people just aren't worth the effort and I don't see anything positive in what you've written about her, which indicates you have lost all respect and liking for her, you just haven't made the final decision to move on out of fear of change.

If you decide to stay, do yourself a favour and take up martial arts in order to work on controlling your fear response. You can't control her actions, but you can certainly work on your reaction to her.


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## NotEasy (Apr 19, 2015)

Allow me to play devil's advocate, in the voice of my then yelling wife ...



alphaomega said:


> The thing with yellers is that they only do it to people they know they can get away with it with.
> 
> Does she yell at her boss? No. Why? Because her ass would get fired.


Yes she might. And she might do it even knowing that she might get fired.

And as a boss she had fired people for yelling. But she kept other yellers too, they weren't all fired. She is able to separate the volume from the emotion or intent. 

I would have probably sacked anyone who yelled.



alphaomega said:


> Does she yell at her friends? No. Why?
> Because she would soon be friendless.


Yes, even to this day she still sometimes yells at friends. Many of them remain friends. There have been some casualties though.



alphaomega said:


> I'm not sure what advice I can give you. Except some history.
> 
> I hate yellers. My family also yelled all the time. It was as if everyone was trying to force thier opinion and also yell the loudest to be the only one in the room that was heard.
> 
> ...


Devil's advocate off...

I am impressed. It is difficult to break the mold of your own family upbringing while still in your family.


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## NotEasy (Apr 19, 2015)

Thinking back about my earlier post, maybe there is a suggestion within the martial arts sparring, even without you learning martial arts. I had taught her some of my training, so I knew her punches were softer than her yelling insults. So it was a simple decision to call her bluff by standing firm and calmly telling her to be quiet or I would leave. And if she ever did hit me it would have ended the yelling outburst with her apologising and me still OK. So it was a simple decision to face it.
This is a sexist assumption, but I guess you could safely take a punch from your wife. She is probably not trained. It is the yelling and insults that hurt most. So don't back down.
Of course the other side to this is you have to stand in the face of yelling and NEVER attack. If you cannot trust yourself to do that then leave.


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## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

Crap doesn't just happen. If you are living with someone who abuses or disrespects you, unless you are paralyzed, you are part of the problem. At some level you must agree with her that you deserve to be mistreated or you wouldn't tolerate it. You can walk away and you've always had the ability to walk away. What is there to fear? The crazy bat is going to hit you? Brings to mind those little yappy dogs who consider themselves quite vicious but, in reality, could be punted over the back fence with great ease if one were so inclined. This loud, obnoxious woman has no power unless you just give her some. Nobody promoted her to be your boss. Don't raise your voice, don't cuss, don't threaten. Calmly explain the terrain she sits on. She plays nicely or she plays alone. It's cool to have a discussion or a debate and it's ok to verbalize one's displeasure but wearing one's butt for a hat is not acceptable. Yelling, threatening, intimidating, and generally acting like trailer trash isn't acceptable. If she wants to live that way she needs to find some ******* in a wife beater in an Alabama trailer park. We can all enjoy watching her on "COPs".


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

Some great posts here.. if one of our sons was in this situation.. I'd be absolutely FURIOUS that he was taking some bi*ches crap left & right...and living miserably.. No sire 'ree.. get the hell away from her.. Don't be an enabler.. not many men is going to put up with a unruly volcanic witch like this..

I was in the store the other day.. and in the next aisle some Mother was swearing at her young child , really laying into him -not just swear words but words to belittle, demean... it was [email protected]#$... she didn't have any care how she came off - one can only imagine the abuse at home ... I was thinking..... this poor little boy -when I seen him.. he's going to grow up feeling this is OK behavior & likely verbally abuse others , given this is his "normal"...

Just so sad.. some people don't deserve children.. and some don't deserve to be married either.


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## alphaomega (Nov 7, 2010)

Lots of good advise here. 

So I guess It depends if you plan on staying and trying to fix things, or just getting out. 

I also like Asla's and NotEasys techniques for behavioural modification. I would like to try them. I just never had the patience in my past so I took the "boot" approach.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Mr.Fisty (Nov 4, 2014)

Until you decide to either work on things or leave, here is a technique i learned in Psyychology class. Do not respond to her outbursts! Walk away and disengage. She will probably escalate her yelling, but do not falter. Eventually she will learn that her yelling does nothing. This is known as extinction burst in behavioral psychology.


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## As'laDain (Nov 27, 2011)

Mr.Fisty said:


> Until you decide to either work on things or leave, here is a technique i learned in Psyychology class. Do not respond to her outbursts! Walk away and disengage. She will probably escalate her yelling, but do not falter. Eventually she will learn that her yelling does nothing. This is known as extinction burst in behavioral psychology.


they actually teach that in psychology classes? i didnt know that...

it just made sense to me.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

unbelievable said:


> We teach others how we will be treated. She yells because you have permitted her to for nearly five years. Explain to her that you will talk to her respectfully and you expect the same. If she starts with the temper tantrum, pick up your car keys and leave. Do it every time. It won't take long for her to figure out that if she wants to express herself that yelling isn't a path to success. She gets in your face, tell her to back out. If she doesn't, leave. Do it every time. Nobody changes bad behavior that gets rewarded. She yells, you melt, she wins, and the bad behavior is reinforced. She gets in your face, you feel intimidated, she wins, her crappy behavior gets reinforced. If you give a dog a treat for crapping on the floor you can't be surprised when it frequently craps on the floor.
> You don't need to become some domestic warrior. Most people don't like yelling and screaming and there's no reason an adult has to live that way. The problem isn't you. The problem is you married a loud, pushy, battle axe. Pushy, loud people need other people to intimidate and boss around. In her case, she's got you. Walk away. Unless she's clinically insane she won't yell without someone to yell at. It's not your job to calm her down or appease her. She's an adult and presumably had parents who should have taught her how civilized people behave. Your words or behavior aren't responsible for the words or volume she chooses to use. She is an adult, responsible for her actions. A woman would call me a milquetoast only once. Your choice is not one between living with hostility and disrespect or living forever alone. There are loads of reasonably functional human beings on earth. Is this woman adding something positive to your life? Does she make you a better, more complete man? Does she inspire you to greatness? Does she make you feel good about yourself and the world around you? If she left forever what would you be losing? The world is chock full of wonderful women who know how to behave in polite society. Why would you put up with this screaming narcissist? You might try my suggestions a couple times and if she doesn't pull her disrespectful, screaming head out of her buttocks, leave permanently and let her be the queen of nothing.


*Suffice it to say, @unbelievable is totally correct on this!

As a tenured football and basketball referee at both the collegiate and high school levels, it is a fairly common thing to work with men and women coaches who respect us as officials and will always let us do our jobs, even though they may occasionally disagree with some of our calls! But you always have those that think they can obtain " an edge" by yelling and screaming at us making a public spectacle out of the most minute things!

My  modus operandi has always been to quickly and politely embarrass the quarrelsome coach about their volatile behavior. My personal adage has always been that "a word to the wise is sufficient!" If I have quietly given a warning for them to "cease and desist," and they choose to continue, it is not uncommon for me to flag them for unsportsmanlike conduct, if it's football, or to light them up with a technical foul or to even eject them from the playing arena, if it's basketball!

I don't really buy the theory that their abhorrent behavior is predicated by psychology. Rather, it's predicated early in life by people who told them that it's OK to behave that way ~ that nobody will care.

But inasfar as your W is concerned, you need to politely read her the "riot act" in regard to this subject matter and tell her it will not be tolerated by you any longer! If they don't comply, then get yourself to a lawyers office to explore D options.

What she's putting you through is a rampant form of mental cruelty to which you should have never allowed yourself to become a party! She is preemptively doing it as a selfish form of control over you!

It's up to you to tell her you will not put up with it any longer, and that you do have options! If she fails to comply, leave her and let her try to make someone else's life a living hell, other than yours!

Just saying!*
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Mr.Fisty (Nov 4, 2014)

As'laDain said:


> they actually teach that in psychology classes? i didnt know that...
> 
> it just made sense to me.



Yes, it is a tool. But in psychology, there is a lot of things that are common sense and yet, people fail to implement in their daily lives.

For instance, the OP's response is flight, so he backs down. She learns that she can dominate him by battering him with verbal assaults.


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## Starstarfish (Apr 19, 2012)

I'd say you either need to insist on marriage counseling with the potential you both need IC as well, or just move one. 

But please, please if you leave this relationship before you enter the next one regardless of what happens here get some IC about the childhood abandonment. No matter how loving and caring a partner is, expecting them to make up for your Mom leaving you behind is a really big burden and subtle contract to place on someone else to have them spend the rest of their life trying to make up for that.

Love / = / therapy. 

You say you don't have money for counseling, but I would honestly really prioritize it. There are places with sliding scales and other lower cost options. I'd seriously look into some.


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## Spotthedeaddog (Sep 27, 2015)

Mr.Fisty said:


> Until you decide to either work on things or leave, here is a technique i learned in Psyychology class. Do not respond to her outbursts! Walk away and disengage. She will probably escalate her yelling, but do not falter. Eventually she will learn that her yelling does nothing. This is known as extinction burst in behavioral psychology.


wow they teach passive aggressiveness as a solution....


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## Spotthedeaddog (Sep 27, 2015)

I have to ask. What is she yelling about?

That you never clean up after yourself, sit on the couch all day, eat food, never cook, use more income than your budget allows? Then she has good reason to yell.
Keep plodding along in a job that is going backwards? Then yes, yelling is probably warranted if you won't do anything about it.
Do you bust stuff, spend household money on booze or drugs, not show up to pick up the kids or her, miss job appointments, spend too much at the pub, give away money to friends and family when you shouldn't? Then yes, yelling is probably appropriate.

Without knowing the cause it's too difficult to work out if it's abuse or earned. Can't just trot out the "or I'll leave" ultimatium everytime and violence is too far.


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## Adelais (Oct 23, 2013)

spotthedeaddog put into words what I was thinking as I read your post.

Without knowing what she is actually upset about, it is difficult to know if she is an unhappy person who just complains, or if her complaints are valid and you are a conflict avoider.

Your freezing up isn't healthy at all and that is not on her, but on you. You have to stand your ground and communicate your feelings with her, rather than shutting down.

When a person is unhappy with another, the healthy thing to do is to let them know how you feel and why. Your wife is doing that. You aren't. You'd rather run away, and then blame her for your running away, because she is a "yeller."

Was your family the type that openly discussed issues, or brushed them all under the rug in an effort to keep peace at all costs? As much much as you dislike the idea, your wife's upbringing might be healthier than yours. Did her family keep their yelling within their own walls, or did they take it out into the street? If they worked things out within their 4 walls, even with a higher volume than you were used to, and they did not do it for all the neighbors to see, they might have been fine. If she is not calling you vile names, belittling you, etc. and her voice is just more elevated than you are used to, there is no innate wrong in the volume.

If the issues are valid, and the spouse on the receiving end of the complaints fails to acknowledge the problem but clams up and leaves, it leaves the other even more frustrated, feeling unheard and unable to fix the problems alone because they involve both people.

Passive aggressive people are afraid of conflict. They freeze, go blank and just want to get away from the conflict. The issues can't ever be resolved, because the PA person can't go there.

This makes the non PA spouse even more frustrated. They want to resolve the issues, and bring them up again, only to be stonewalled again.

The spouse seeking solutions, by bringing them up, is made out to be crazy and aggressive.

Your wife could be exasperated beyond what she can tolerate because of your refusal/inability to work out problems WITH her. Someday, she might realize that the marriage is a lost cause, because she is the only one willing to bring up the issues while you continually run away and refuse to help fix things.

The advice to anyone who realizes they are involved in a relationship with a PA/conflict avoider is RUN. Did it ever occur to you that she might be the one who is suffering more than you are, and would be better off with someone who can handle communication, even when the subjects are uncomfortable? If you don't learn to handle her unhappy feelings, and your own, and learn to verbalize your feelings, while acknowledging hers, your wife will not get any happier, and neither will you.

If your wife is trailer trash, and just likes drama and attention, why did you marry her? You would have seen this behavior before between her and her family. If her yelling only developed after you were married, there might be a reason for her frustration, and you can help fix it by not running away from the problems. She could be handing you a gift, by letting you know what she is unhappy about. If you keep dismissing her, and just calling her a "yeller" you might be surprised someday when she decides to give up and just walk away from the marriage.


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## Kivlor (Oct 27, 2015)

I think, after reading, and re-reading your post, you need to take some serious time to focus on yourself. Make some friends, start building a support group around you. You said partner, so I take it you're not "married"? If you're not married, I'd just move on, no ultimatums. 

That aside, there's been some great advice on how to deal with your SO / W's verbal abuse. I know for some the "disengage" tactic works. I would handle things differently, but you seem very passive, so passive aggressive is probably easier for you. 

If you're going to try and work things out, you must let her know that you've _tolerated_ her behavior so far because you love her, but that your tolerance has reached it's limit. Tell her to shape up or ship out. 

If you go the ultimatum route, you have to keep your word. She breaks the rules 1 time, it's over. Right now, my guess is she doesn't respect you because you appear weak to her. No one respects a guy who lets people walk all over him. 

I do hope it is only verbal abuse, and nothing physical. Any advice may need to change if she's getting physical with you.


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## As'laDain (Nov 27, 2011)

spotthedeaddog said:


> wow they teach passive aggressiveness as a solution....


:scratchhead:
its not passive aggressive to refuse to sit there and get yelled at.


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## honcho (Oct 5, 2013)

spotthedeaddog said:


> I have to ask. What is she yelling about?
> 
> That you never clean up after yourself, sit on the couch all day, eat food, never cook, use more income than your budget allows? Then she has good reason to yell.
> Keep plodding along in a job that is going backwards? Then yes, yelling is probably warranted if you won't do anything about it.
> ...


He has explained how her yelling as hurt him, how he becomes withdrawn and "can't handle it" and her response is to fly off the handle at him. Hardly an effective means of communication other than to show dominance. 

My ex was a yeller and you quickly learn to chose your battles wisely because of it. I remember one time I forgot to turn the heat down in the house when I went to work one day. She drove 20 miles each way to my office and screamed in my office for a half hour because of that crime, obviously I deserved it.


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## As'laDain (Nov 27, 2011)

IMFarAboveRubies said:


> spotthedeaddog put into words what I was thinking as I read your post.
> 
> Without knowing what she is actually upset about, it is difficult to know if she is an unhappy person who just complains, or if her complaints are valid and you are a conflict avoider.
> 
> ...


just out of curiosity, would you say this to a woman who is afraid of her husband? my wife used to "let me know" how she was feeling by screaming at me. you know, when i did such terrible things like try to clean the house. let her sleep in. ask her how her day was. brush my teeth. come home... etc. 

cuz honestly, you didn't really give much advice on how to overcome the paralyzing fear that the OP describes. but, you did come across as pretty judgemental of him/her. 


OP, are you male or female?


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## Adelais (Oct 23, 2013)

As'laDain said:


> just out of curiosity, would you say this to a woman who is afraid of her husband? my wife used to "let me know" how she was feeling by screaming at me. you know, when i did such terrible things like try to clean the house. let her sleep in. ask her how her day was. brush my teeth. come home... etc.
> 
> cuz honestly, you didn't really give much advice on how to overcome the paralyzing fear that the OP describes. but, you did come across as pretty judgemental of him/her.
> 
> ...


LOL did you check my profile? I says my sex there.

I'm just giving OP another perspective.

Maybe his wife is just a mean person. Maybe she is not, and has reached her tipping point after years of his freezing up and checking out whenever there is conflict.

Counseling and figuring out why he becomes afraid when she is upset is the first step. The next step is learning tools to implement when he feels the fear and freezing up coming on, so he can stay engaged.


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## sixty-eight (Oct 2, 2015)

As'laDain said:


> OP, are you male or female?





IMFarAboveRubies said:


> LOL did you check my profile? I says my sex there.


I think As'laDain is asking if thirtywhacks is male or female. It's a valid question. The profile says undisclosed for orientation.

The "yeller" is a partner who is a woman. That's all we know until OP returns to the thread.


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## As'laDain (Nov 27, 2011)

sixty-eight said:


> I think As'laDain is asking if thirtywhacks is male or female. It's a valid question. The profile says undisclosed for orientation.
> 
> The "yeller" is a partner who is a woman. That's all we know until OP returns to the thread.


yep.


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## Adelais (Oct 23, 2013)

my bad.


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## thirtywhacks (Sep 2, 2013)

Yes, to clarify, I am a woman, as is my partner. We have no children and although we used to talk about marriage, that is no longer a thought in my head unless we're able to sort out our differences. We're completely enmeshed in that we share a residence, share a vehicle and share a business. Which is not to say these things would hold me back from separating from her but they factor into things when arguments arise.

To be perfectly honest, I don't want to separate, I just want things to change but I also know I can't beat my head on the wall for five more years. As one poster pointed out, I think I did come here Moreno to help myself in the hopes that my changes will effect changes in he and thus a better, healthier relationship.

What I feel I am also dealing with is that I feel my partner has a severe victim mentality. She, too, was abandoned by a parent at a young age and then when she came out as a teenager in high school, she was kicked out of her home and out on the streets for a while. I don't think she's ever really gotten the resolution she needs from these events, though she says she has and she spent five years in therapy, prior to us meeting. I say she has a victim mentality because she takes issue with most people in her life including just about every family member. Naturally, she took issue with just about every person in my life as well and slowly, one by one, I let friends and one family member go because of it... Either because I was too weak to fight the battle or some part of me felt they had all wronged her, I don't know but at this point, I am incredibly reluctant to meet new people because I just know it'll cause conflict in my relationship. She's not a bad person although I recognize she has some bad behaviors. I want to help her but I also don't want to be at the receiving end of the bad stuff. On top of all this, six months into our relationship, she was diagnosed with cancer and lost a lucrative job as a result of it. She felt that I wasn't supportive enough during that time, actually she says she didn't get support from anyone during that time and feels as though she has never been able to fully heal because of all the stress in our relationship as well as the financial stress. I really feel for her and I really want to be a better, more compassionate and empathetic partner. I just feel that this constant victimization is the source of a lot of tension because if someone says something to her that she does like but that I don't necessarily see in the same way, she feels as though I'm abusing her by not speaking up. In some instances, I can see this as the true and I'm more effective at recognizing her sensitivities these days I just feel that sooner or later, everyone is going to victimize her and the repeat button will go on. It's not natural when I hear the same stories, month after month, about things that people did to her 20-30 years ago, is it? Sometimes I think the therapy may have messed her up but I dare not say and as someone who has personally gone to a therapist, I'm not 
Brb


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## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

I meet all kinds of violent people who had lousy childhoods and decades of problematic relationships. They are furious at the world, violent by nature, and they just can't manage to master basic human civility. They get therapy, prescriptions, disability for their anger and have for years. A five second ride on my Taser cures almost every one of them. They will go from screaming and threatening to "yes, sir" in five seconds. If they see me 6 months later, it's still "yes, Sir", "Good Day, Sir".


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## Uptown (Mar 27, 2010)

thirtywhacks said:


> She completely fly's off the handle.... She literally foams at the mouth.


Thirty, the behaviors you describe -- i.e., irrational anger, controlling behavior, easily triggered temper tantrums and drama, lack of impulse control, low empathy, and always being "The Victim" -- are some of the classic warning signs for BPD (Borderline Personality Disorder). Importantly, I'm not suggesting your GF has full-blown BPD but, rather, that she may exhibit moderate to strong traits of it.

I caution that BPD is not something a person "has" or "doesn't have." Instead, it is a "spectrum" disorder, which means every adult on the planet occasionally exhibits all BPD traits to some degree (albeit at a low level if the person is healthy). At issue, then, is not whether your GF exhibits BPD traits. Of course she does. We all do. 

Rather, at issue is whether she exhibits those traits at a strong and persistent level (i.e., is on the upper end of the BPD spectrum). Not having met her, I cannot answer that question. I nonetheless believe you can spot any strong BPD warning signs that are present if you take a little time to learn which behaviors are on the list. They are not difficult to spot because there is nothing subtle about behaviors such as always being "The Victim," lack of impulse control, and temper tantrums.



> I am at this point now where I fear even bringing something up, I know it will set her off.... Like... walking on eggshells.


The feeling of _"walking on eggshells"_ -- as you say -- is a common complaint of abused partners living with a BPDer. This is why the best-selling BPD book (targeted to those partners) is called _Stop Walking on Eggshells._



> She says that she's afraid of me because she doesn't know what I'll do to her.


If she is a BPDer (i.e., has strong BPD traits), she almost certainly is afraid of what you will do. The repeating cycle of push-you-away (by creating rages) and pull-you-back (by love bombing) that you are seeing arises from those fears if she is a BPDer. That push-pull cycle is one of the hallmarks of a BPDer relationship. It occurs because a BPDer's two great fears (abandonment and engulfment) lie at the opposite ends of the very same spectrum. This means that it is impossible for you to back away from triggering one of her fears without starting to trigger the other fear.

As you draw close to assure her of your love, for example, you will trigger a BPDer's engulfment fear because, although BPDers crave intimacy, they cannot tolerate it for very long. Due to a BPDer's fragile, weak sense of self identity, she will quickly feel like you're trying to control her -- and she will get the scary feeling of being suffocated or engulfed. She therefore will create a fight -- over absolutely nothing -- to push you away.

Yet, as you back away to give her breathing space, you unavoidably will start triggering her abandonment fear. Hence, if your GF is a BPDer, you are always in a lose/lose situation. You lose no matter what you do.



> I know she has full control over her outbursts.... She'll always say she needs to get away from... me and her family because we're the only ones she ever yells at.


As to her having "full control," she likely does have control but not as much as you would imagine. If she actually is a BPDer, she has some control over her emotions in the same way a four year old has very limited control. Yet, with both children and BPDers, it still is important that you hold them fully accountable for their actions and bad decisions (within reasonable limits). Otherwise, they have no incentive to learn the emotional skills needed to better control their own emotions. 

As to her being able to control her outbursts outside the family, that likely is not due to her ability to exercise "full control" over herself. Rather, it likely is due to the complete absence of fear triggers when she is around casual friends, business associates, and complete strangers. 

None of those folks can trigger her _abandonment_ fear because there is no close relationship to be abandoned. Nor can they trigger her _engulfment _fear because there is no emotional intimacy to create the suffocating feeling of being controlled and losing one's self in the other person's strong personality. This is why the vast majority of BPDers can get along fine all day long with total strangers and then go home at night to emotionally abuse the very people who love them.



> I don't know where it comes from.... She, too, was *abandoned by a parent at a young age*


If she is a BPDer, nobody knows for certain where it comes from. The current view of the psychiatric community is that having strong and persistent BPD traits arises from a combination of genetics and early childhood environment (namely, childhood abuse or abandonment). Because most abused children do NOT develop BPD, it is believed that genetics also must play a significant role. 

Such abuse in early childhood greatly raises the risk for the child developing strong BPD traits. This was evident in a recent large-scale study which found that 70% of BPDers report that they were abandoned or abused in childhood. Childhood trauma is particularly damaging when it occurs before age five because it freezes emotional development and prevents the child from developing a strong sense of who she is. 

Moreover, the child will fail to integrate the good and bad aspects of her own personality, i.e., she will never mature to the stage of recognizing she is essentially a good girl who sometimes does bad things. Instead, she will continue to flip back and forth between thinking of herself as "all good" and "all bad," depending on whether she did a good or bad thing that day. 

Like young children, BPDers are too emotionally immature to handle ambiguities, strong mixed feelings, uncertainties, and other grey areas of interpersonal relationships. They therefore categorize themselves -- and everyone else -- at the polar extremes of white (all good) and black (all bad). And they can recategorize themselves and others in just ten seconds, based only on a minor comment or action.



> My partner has a severe victim mentality.


If she is a BPDer, the primary reason for this is the black-white thinking I described above. For a BPDer, recognizing that she made a mistake or has a flaw means that she must be "all bad." On top of that, a BPDer is filled with self-loathing carried from early childhood. Hence, the LAST thing she wants to find is one more mistake to add to the long list of things she hates about herself.

Another reason that BPDers have the false self image of being "The Victim" is that they never had an opportunity in early childhood to develop a strong sense of who they are. Consequently, to the extent a BPDer has even a thread of self image, it is the false self image of being "The Victim," always "The Victim." Because that is the strongest self image she has, she keeps a death grip on it.

This means, if she is a BPDer, that there are only two roles you are allowed to play: rescuer or perpetrator. As long as you're trying to "rescue" her -- as you did for 4-6 months during the courtship -- the clear implication is that she must be "The Victim" in need of being rescued. Indeed, you likely really believed you were rescuing her for a while -- until you noticed that, every time you pulled her from the raging waters, she jumped right back in as soon as you turned your head.

Likewise, as long as your willing to play the role of "perpetrator" (accepting blame for her every misfortune), you are "validating" her false self image of being "The Victim." Once you stop playing BOTH of those roles, she almost certainly will walk out and leave you if she is a BPDer.



> I hear the same stories, month after month, about things that people did to her 20-30 years ago.


If she is a BPDer, that behavior is to be expected. To "validate" her false self image of being "The Victim," a BPDer keeps a mental list of every infraction and mistake made by her partner. And she will pull out the ENTIRE LIST during every argument, no matter how small the issue. She is not doing this to be "right" (that is the goal of a narcissist). Instead, her objective is to be "The Victim" and being "right" is simply a means to that end.



> I really feel for her and I really want to be a better, more compassionate and empathetic partner.


No, if she is a BPDer, the reverse is true. You are so excessive in your care giving and are so overly empathetic that you have lowered your personal boundaries to the ground. The result is that you are so enmeshed with her personality that you have great difficulty telling where YOUR problems stop and HERS begin. Similarly, you find it nearly impossible to be happy unless she also is happy. 

If she is a BPDer, this enmeshment quickly becomes toxic to both of you. That is, it hurts her as well as you. You are hurting her with your enabling behavior that allows her to continue behaving like a spoiled brat and GET AWAY WITH IT for the past five years. As to yourself, you likely stopped "being yourself" about five years ago and have started to wonder who you used to be.



> I'm completely ineffective at arguing with her.


If she is a BPDer, EVERY ADULT is ineffective in that way. This is why adults don't try to argue with very young children. Significantly, an untreated BPDer likely has the emotional development of a three- or four-year old.



> I want this relationship to work so bad that I feel I've compromised my own self worth and in becoming weak.


If you're living with a BPDer, the effect on you likely is worse than that. Most likely, you've forgotten who the "real you" is. On the other hand, if you are only feeling "compromised" and "weak," consider yourself very lucky. Of the 157 mental disorders listed in the APA's diagnostic manual, BPD is the one most notorious -- by far -- for making a large share of the abused partners feel like they may be losing their minds. Indeed, therapists see far more of those folks coming in (to find out if they are going crazy) than they ever see of the BPDers themselves.



> She's not a bad person although I recognize she has some bad behaviors.


I agree. BPDers generally are not bad people. If your GF is a BPDer, her problem is not being "bad" but, rather, being "emotionally unstable." Moreover, as I noted above, most people will never see that instability because they won't trigger it. Instead, they likely will see her vulnerability and childlike warmth of expressions. This is why high functioning BPDers generally are very likable and fun to be around. Indeed, two of the world's most beloved women -- Marilyn Monroe and Princess Diana -- both had full-blown BPD if their biographers are correct.



> She spent five years in therapy, prior to us meeting.


If she really does have strong BPD traits -- indeed, even if she were to have full-blown BPD -- her therapist likely would not have told her. Generally, therapists are loath to share this information with a high functioning BPDer -- for her own protection. Hence, if BPD is involved in your situation, your best chance of obtaining a candid professional opinion on what you're likely dealing with is to see your own psychologist (i.e., one who has not treated or seen your GF).



> I am seeking advice from this forum because I do not have any family or friends in my life nor do I have the money to afford counseling.


My advice, Thirty, is to see your own psychologist -- as soon as you can afford one -- to obtain a candid professional opinion on what it is you are dealing with. I also suggest that, while you're looking for a good psych, you read about BPD warning signs to see if they seem to apply.

Significantly, learning to spot these warning signs will NOT enable you to diagnose your GF's issues. Only a professional can do that. The main reason for learning these red flags, then -- like learning warning signs for stroke and heart attack -- is to help you decide whether there is sufficient reason to spend money seeking a professional opinion. Another reason is to help you decide whether to leave your GF. And, if you decide to leave, a third reason for learning red flags is to avoid running right into the arms of another woman just like the one you left.

If you're interested, an easy place to start reading is my list of _*18 BPD Warning Signs*_. If most sound very familiar, I would suggest you read my more detailed description of them at my posts in _*Maybe's Thread*_. If that description rings many bells, I would be glad to join the other respondents in discussing them with you. Take care, Thirty.


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## AliceA (Jul 29, 2010)

My MIL is one of those people who plays the victim, in every situation. She takes absolutely no responsibility for anything that has happened in her life, it's always someone else's fault. As she has been getting older, she has actually become so deluded that she invents incidents with other people in her head in order to play the victim card, and convinces herself they really happened. Her last attacker was apparently me. She reinvented our entire history to make me into some evil and sinister person. In the process, she has completely alienated her son. She now has literally one family member left who can tolerate her, and that's her daughter, who is now displaying the same victim mentality.

Good luck in living with someone like that. It only gets worse from what I've seen. If they don't alienate you, they suck the life out of you.


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## As'laDain (Nov 27, 2011)

thirtywhacks said:


> Yes, to clarify, I am a woman, as is my partner. We have no children and although we used to talk about marriage, that is no longer a thought in my head unless we're able to sort out our differences. We're completely enmeshed in that we share a residence, share a vehicle and share a business. Which is not to say these things would hold me back from separating from her but they factor into things when arguments arise.
> 
> To be perfectly honest, I don't want to separate, I just want things to change but I also know I can't beat my head on the wall for five more years. As one poster pointed out, I think I did come here Moreno to help myself in the hopes that my changes will effect changes in he and thus a better, healthier relationship.
> 
> ...


ok...

first, watch that video i linked. it will help your body to produce testosterone in order to counteract cortisol, which will help with the paralyzing fear response. i know you cant think in those states. your brain produces chemicals during those times that literally stop you from being able to think. 

anyway, watch the video. ill post more on it later, but long story short, i have been there and there are a lot of tricks i used to get myself better at NOT going to the fight or flight response. today, i dont really get anxious about confrontation anymore. i have some work to do, but when i get back i will explain what i did. but you can start with the video:

https://www.ted.com/talks/amy_cuddy_your_body_language_shapes_who_you_are?language=en


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## alphaomega (Nov 7, 2010)

spotthedeaddog said:


> wow they teach passive aggressiveness as a solution....


This isn't passive aggressiveness. Lol. There's nothing wrong with not engaging in an exchange that was originally started to be one sided anyways. It's called choosing your battles. There's not much way to win with some yelling matches. 

If it was passive aggressive response he would get mad and silent and stop talking to her and try to find a way to punish her at a distance.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## alphaomega (Nov 7, 2010)

My statement still stands. There's 3 billion other women out there. 

Again. I'm not sure what your getting from this relationship. You can't fix her. And hoping she will change one day on a whim is the dream of unicorns and skittles. 

You need to take control of your own happiness. And find out what YOU need to do to get there. No one else can do that job for you.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## alphaomega (Nov 7, 2010)

honcho said:


> He has explained how her yelling as hurt him, how he becomes withdrawn and "can't handle it" and her response is to fly off the handle at him. Hardly an effective means of communication other than to show dominance.
> 
> My ex was a yeller and you quickly learn to chose your battles wisely because of it. I remember one time I forgot to turn the heat down in the house when I went to work one day. She drove 20 miles each way to my office and screamed in my office for a half hour because of that crime, obviously I deserved it.


Wow! That's borderline nutso. 

Going back to what works for me, it would have been "boot" time.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## alphaomega (Nov 7, 2010)

As an aside, I realize I can't live my life without people yelling, as much as I think it's not a good response to anything. 

People yell at work on several occasions. Sometimes directly at me. I'll just stare at them, let them finish, and then ask if they got that out of thier system yet, because I'd really like to discuss a valid and workable solution now that they feel more calm and in control. 

And on those rare occasions where my boss was a constant yeller, I usually just do the same, then in my most polite voice tell them to go fu(k themselves as I refuse to work for a company that employs such immature dock heads. And let them explain to the powers that be why I decided to leave. 

Fortunately I'm in a position in my career that I've never been unemployed more than two days as word will get out and I've been scooped up constantly.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## PieceOfSky (Apr 7, 2013)

Thirtywhacks,



I have only read the first few posts so far.



I suggest you look into Patricia Evans' books and website: http://www.verbalabuse.com/



This sort of thing can erode your self away over a long period of time. But you can rebuild yourself, and as you do so reach a point where you will never look at or be affected by this sort of treatment the same way again. You get to choose a better way forward, whether it feels like that is true right now or not.


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

I was married to an angry, defensive yeller. I divorced him. You should end this, no one should have to live with this. 

NEVER AGAIN.


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