# The FZ



## sisters359 (Apr 9, 2009)

Hey, on the dating forum we got talking about the FZ--the Friends Zone. I'm curious to get a broader perspective on this. Here's my take--and while I think a lot of other women are like me, I am aware this is my assumption and I have only my personal friends to consult about it. And, for the record: please note--I didn't make up these categories and start putting men in them; over the years I became aware of patterns and these seem to be my patterns in relation to members of the opposite sex. For me, this is really a discussion of the complex issue of "chemistry," and nothing else. It does not affect my ability to interact with people in a normal way, it does not affect my judgment of their abilities (if that is something i need to do), it does not lead me to jump to conclusions about someone. It's pretty much, do I feel chemistry or not? 

So, for me--If I put a guy in the FZ, he is never getting out. The FZ is exclusively for men toward whom I feel no chemistry--I would never consider having a sexual relationship with (remember, this is totally subjective and is not a reflection on the other person, because it is based solely on me and my needs, etc.) 

Men toward whom I feel some type of attraction will not be in the FZ because that is, by definition, for men toward whom I feel no attraction. These non-FZ men fall into what I think of as the "guy" category--guys I like and with whom I may have a friendship but whom I also see as sexual individuals, too. This does not mean anything more than that I am aware of feeling attracted, so to speak. They can be married, gay, whatever--I'm simply conscious that I respond to them as a woman, not just as another person. When a guy is unavailable--for any reason--I find it quite a simple matter to ignore the sexual attraction. Same for guys I consider inappropriate as a partner--I may be aware of the sexual attraction, but b/c of their lifestyle or attitude or whatever, I'm not interested in following up on that attraction. If I am strongly attracted to a guy who is unavailable or not an appropriate partner for me, well, that is the stuff dreams are made of, and I will keep my distance in real life--not necessarily physically, but in all other ways. 

I have never had a man go from my FZ to my guy zone, ever. It has happened that a man has gone from guy zone to FZ, however, b/c the man will say or do something that ends any sexual attraction I may have felt. I will say that the FZ is not based on looks--only morbid obesity would automatically put someone in the FZ based on appearance being a turn off. The criteria are not readily apparent to me--I know that a lot of little things go into it, but there must be some (like scent) I cannot consciously recognize, because sometimes I'm surprised when I feel attraction! And I do not generally find "gorgeous" men (like a lot of male models) attractive. 

So, ladies--do you have these or similar responses to men? Have you found men "getting out of the FZ" and if so, do you define the FZ differently? 

Guys, does this irritate, mystify, clarify, amuse, or just bore you? Do you think I've go some type of abnormal psychology going on, or do the patterns I've described seem "fairly standard" for women? How do YOU respond to women--are you aware that you have different responses to them, based on specific criteria you find attractive/unattractive? Have those criteria changed over time and, if so, how?


----------



## Susan2010 (Apr 19, 2010)

Over the years, I found it unnecessary and very limiting to pigeon-hole men into any categories. The best lover I ever had was a man I would have placed into your FZ category if I had any categories. I felt zero sexual attraction to him, even after I became attracted. He was not good looking by any standard, but had a great personality and several other admirable qualities. Not to mention he was able to get my attention by making love to my mind, being he was very intelligent and educated. I felt no sexual attraction to him but still gave him a chance. For me, he became as worthy a candidate for my time and affections as any of the much better-looking men I commonly attracted and was attracted to. He blew my mind in the bedroom and taught me (almost) everything I know. I never really fell in love with him but didn't fall in love with all the others either. I loved him deeply and will forever be grateful to him for the entire experience, not just in the bedroom. I'm so glad I dropped the "pretty girl" attitude I had. Relaxed my criteria and dropped the categories. After him, I kept an open mind to men and a lot of things about life in general.

On the other hand, I said no to the marriage proposal from the love of my life. I never really felt I could trust him, so we stayed in the friends w/ bennies zone. Despite his declarations, I guess I felt I wasn't getting enough from him. He's remains the love of my life, but please don't tell hubby LOL. 

No categories and no regrets at all.


----------



## WantsHappiness (Jun 17, 2009)

Interesting topic, sisters. Chemistry only. I definitely have male friends who I consider to be in the “FZ.” Well, now all male friends go into the FZ of course but I have retained several male friends from before marriage who have always and will always remain there. I am the same as you in that when I found a guy was attractive but unavailable I could very easily stuff him into the FZ. Not so easy for men from what I understand. Certainly a guy can go from “guy” zone to FZ. 

I’m with Susan on this one too though; never say never. A man’s personality can alter my feelings about him and I can’t know much about the personality until I get to know him a little. H and I were friends long before we were romantically involved and there was always a slight physical attraction but nothing I would have acted on unless I had gotten to know him so perhaps he was in the guy category and moved to full blown relationship from there. Before marriage I had one good friend who was strictly FZ initially and after a few years moved to guy zone. But I was young and didn’t know half of what I know now  I think I was responding to his interest in me and when all was said and done it didn’t even come close to working out so perhaps he should have stayed in the FZ. 

So while I do see the opportunity for a man to move from the FZ to guy zone, for me, it may not be advisable for this to occur.


----------



## michzz (Jun 6, 2008)

I have a friend who says she can tell in a moment if she could bed a guy just by smell. Not talking BO or lack of it.


----------



## sisters359 (Apr 9, 2009)

I am speaking of my experience, not intentions! I do not "put them into categories," the categories are simply a way to describe my reactions to men. I do not deny the *possibility* of someone moving out of the FZ, I've just never (in 51 plus years) had it happen. 

Susan, are you saying you had sex with someone you felt NO sexual attraction to? Or are you saying you developed an attraction after over coming your "pretty girl attitude" (and I know what you mean by that; I think a lot of us have it when we are young and stupid) b/c he intrigued you enough so that his looks didn't matter?


----------



## Susan2010 (Apr 19, 2010)

sisters359 said:


> Susan, are you saying you had sex with someone you felt NO sexual attraction to? Or are you saying you developed an attraction after over coming your "pretty girl attitude" (and I know what you mean by that; I think a lot of us have it when we are young and stupid) b/c he intrigued you enough so that his looks didn't matter?


We dated almost two months before sleeping together, which was roughly my usual time frame. By that time, I was well into him being my boyfriend, but no I still had no sexual attraction. I held a lot of respect and great affection for him and was even beyond the "intrigued" phase by then. I liked his confidence and how vigorously he pursued me. He was exciting and adventurous. He played piano and when he sang, I didn't want him to stop.

Unfortunately, he was very much overweight (probably more than 50 lbs) and although he had a great smile, he was the opposite of handsome. So yes, jumping his balls was the farthest thing from my mind. Sex came about as a natural part of the dating process because I did want to be with him as my guy. I just wasn't enthused about being with him in bed. Heck, I wasn't even curious. When it happened and he blew my mind, I was ashamed for having so little faith. He was cultured, sophisticated, and erudite in seemingly so many things far beyond just limited understanding. I should have expected he would naturally be a learned and skillful lover.

I cannot honestly say I ever developed a sexual attraction for him, but I obviously liked our love making very much and couldn't keep my hands off him. I guess the difference is the man did not drip sex. I didn't get turned on by looking at him or talking to him. I got turned on at the memory of how good it was. Needless to say I thought of it often. LOL


----------



## sailorgirl (Jun 9, 2010)

For me, there are men who can go from the "I'm not sexually attracted to you" to the "wow, I'm am sexually attracted to you" There are a handful of men who will most likely always be in the "Friend Zone" that you mentioned. These are guys who I grew up with who are more like brothers or cousins to me than friends. I've known them all my life. The idea of having sex with them is a turn off. 

I recently have had a guy who wasn't even in the friend zone, he was more like in the "acquaintance zone" go from there to the "Oh my gosh, I want to take you now" zone. It was so weird. He is our mechanic. I've "known" him for about 6 or 7 years now. He's worked on our cars and he's been a great mechainc and has never tried to sell us services or parts we didn't need. Has always done great work, we trust him with our cars and trust him to get us the best deal he can. But other than that, I never really thought of him that much. I didn't really know much about him; and he isn't one of these guys you look at and go "hubba, hubba."

He isn't ugly, just plain. He just that sort of guy who just sort of blends into the surroundings. I would never have thought of him as a sex partner until a few months ago I was having some problems with my car not going into gear and I sort of limped the car into his shop and he was able to fix it up in a jiffy--I thought it was going to be a huge cost--but it was a minor problem and he didn't even charge me anything. In fact he showed me how to fix it myself. It was then that he was showing me what to do, we were leaned in close and his arm and hand was touching mine and it was like an electric shock when through me. In a split second I was completely aware of him as a man--it was like I could of taken him home right then and there and shagged his brains out. That sort of instant attraction has rarely happened to me. And esp. with someone who I had known for so long without having any thoughts or feelings like that towards. Thankfully I do not think he was effected at all. 

The sad thing is that since then my car has needed a lot of work--and since I work a lot less than my hubby I'm the one who takes the car in for repairs. It's been a bit of agony to be there in the shop and seeing him. I was thinking that the attraction I felt for him that day was just a one time thing--maybe I was ovulating or something. But while I haven't felt anything as strong at that first instant attraction, I still feel a strong desire for him. It's crazy. I hope I hide it well. I don't know. My husband has always said that I have the furtherest thing from a "poker face' that he can always tell what I'm thinking or feeling just from looking at me. So that makes me even more nervous about being around him. But if the mechanic has noticed any change in me, he has had the good manners not to act on it. OR most likely, he is just not interested in me. Which of course makes me feel sad.


----------



## cb45 (Oct 2, 2009)

i'm curious gals....

what specifically do u mean when u say "sexually attracted" re: the guys or guy zone?

sailor was specific somewhat, but are there universal cues or feelings, or does it differ greatly by the gal/individual ?

i.e., do u get a warm feeling in yer heart/abdomen/vagina?
increased "wetness?" fantasize there n then or later on?
become assertive/aggressive or shy/playful/demure?
and how much control really do u have? do u feel the pain
of it all too, or does it quickly become ho-hum 2 u ?

as for me, her eyes usually have it first n foremost, followed 
closely by voice, chemistry, and yes scent.

and i'm w/ susan on this pt: if she can sing, i'm all butter
baby...do to me what u will.


----------



## sailorgirl (Jun 9, 2010)

cb45 said:


> i'm curious gals....
> 
> what specifically do u mean when u say "sexually attracted" re: the guys or guy zone?
> 
> ...


I don't think there is a universal cue or feeling. I would say it differs by the person. For this situation with the mechanic it was an instant animal like attraction. I really not sure why--maybe it's because I'm having trouble with my own marriage, and here was this guy taking time out of his day to show me how to fix a problem with the car. And this is his business, he could have charged me for this and didn't. And he thought this was something I could handle. Plus I have some sort of trust in his ability to fix the car and not rip us off. While that is not the sort of trust you build a relationship on, it is a form of trust. I can not have sex with a man I don't have some sort of trust with. 

As for physical feelings it was a wanting to touch him. To keep touching him. He has really nice arms, well muscled and I liked the feeling of his arm next to mine and I wanted to further explore other parts of him that I would like to feel next to me. I wanted to touch him all over, to kiss him, and just have sex--not love, but certainly lust.


----------



## WantsHappiness (Jun 17, 2009)

sisters359 said:


> I am speaking of my experience, not intentions! I do not "put them into categories," the categories are simply a way to describe my reactions to men. I do not deny the *possibility* of someone moving out of the FZ, I've just never (in 51 plus years) had it happen.


Heh, and here I thought I knew what you meant. In short I suppose I’m saying that for me the basic chemistry is not set in stone. If it can change in one direction surely it can change in the other. I’ve thought of one other instance where a guy went from FZ with no physical attraction to enough physical attraction to give it a try. Mind you it was not a huge shift, but enough.


----------



## Susan2010 (Apr 19, 2010)

sailorgirl said:


> I feel so starved and rejected. He makes me feel like a freak for wanting it more.


Sailorgirl, think about what you are feeling for this guy, then think about this quote. It is direct result of the problem in your marriage. And it's very superficial. It could be this guy or almost any other. I don't know what you are doing about the problem but if you don't take action toward satisfactory resolution, you are headed for trouble.


----------



## sailorgirl (Jun 9, 2010)

Susan2010 said:


> Sailorgirl, think about what you are feeling for this guy, then think about this quote. It is direct result of the problem in your marriage. And it's very superficial. It could be this guy or almost any other. I don't know what you are doing about the problem but if you don't take action toward satisfactory resolution, you are headed for trouble.


Oh I agree, I think a lot of what I felt/feel for the mechanic is just a desire to have a good sexual encounter. I know I'm not in love with this man at all. It was a purely physical thing. 

As for pursing the mechanic, don't worry. I'm not throwing myself at him. I would feel silly doing that esp. since he has shown no interest in me. At the moment I fear getting rejected by another man more than anything else.


----------



## Susan2010 (Apr 19, 2010)

Yeah, but if he (or someone else) makes advances, how will you be able to resist?


----------



## sisters359 (Apr 9, 2009)

Yes, touch can do it too. It is hard to describe and I'm sure it varies from person to person, but it is like an on/off switch--it's either on or it's not. "On" can be at varying intensities, but "off" (for me, anyway) cannot be confused with "on at low intensity." "Off" means I've had a negative reaction on the chemistry scale--without even thinking about it. Again, I think scent and sound have a lot to do with that, for me.

The comment about the mechanic makes me realize I have a "neutral zone," b/c there are definitely men I meet that I have no reaction, positive or negative, to. Possibly that is at times I'm really distracted, in a specific hormonal stage, or whatever. 

Sailor, I think you need to buy your husband a tool belt, and tell him either he wears it, or you will find someone who does ;0

And, if the time ever comes--be sure you "get" the mechanic in the settlement, and then do NOT blow it by having sex with him. A good mechanic is worth a lot more than even mind-blowing sex, in the long run (haha). Remember, a good mechanic is hard to find--although in your case, maybe it's "a hard mechanic is good to find." Sorry; my bad. Evil grin.


----------



## Susan2010 (Apr 19, 2010)

sisters359 said:


> Sailor, I think you need to buy your husband a tool belt, and tell him either he wears it, or you will find someone who does ;0


:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:




sisters359 said:


> And, if the time ever comes--be sure you "get" the mechanic in the settlement, and then do NOT blow it by having sex with him. A good mechanic is worth a lot more than even mind-blowing sex, in the long run (haha). Remember, a good mechanic is hard to find--although in your case, maybe it's "a hard mechanic is good to find." Sorry; my bad. Evil grin.



Oh, that is even more hilarious!


----------



## sailorgirl (Jun 9, 2010)

Susan2010 said:


> Yeah, but if he (or someone else) makes advances, how will you be able to resist?



Well I honestly doubt the mechanic is interested in me. I think after 6 years he would have said or done something if he wanted me in any way other than as a customer. 

As for someone else? I honestly don't know if I could resist. And I have told my husband of this. I have also told my husband what happened with the mechanic. The only thing he has to say is that he would rather divorce rather than an affair.


----------



## sailorgirl (Jun 9, 2010)

sisters359 said:


> Yes, touch can do it too. It is hard to describe and I'm sure it varies from person to person, but it is like an on/off switch--it's either on or it's not. "On" can be at varying intensities, but "off" (for me, anyway) cannot be confused with "on at low intensity." "Off" means I've had a negative reaction on the chemistry scale--without even thinking about it. Again, I think scent and sound have a lot to do with that, for me.
> 
> The comment about the mechanic makes me realize I have a "neutral zone," b/c there are definitely men I meet that I have no reaction, positive or negative, to. Possibly that is at times I'm really distracted, in a specific hormonal stage, or whatever.
> 
> ...


:rofl: :rofl:

Though I don't think the tool-belt does it for me. My father was a contractor and built homes. Most of his friends were in the constructions business--and none of them were all that good looking. I still associate tool belts with plumber butt crack....not a pretty picture. 


As for loosing the mechanic, maybe if I slept with him I could get some work done for free?


----------

