# She want's to try to reconcile!!



## brighterlight (Aug 13, 2009)

OK, so here I am after 3 months of misery and was almost on my feet to be on my own. This past weekend, she told me that her heart was heavy with sadness and missing me. She says that she has seen a lot of change in me but is fearful that I will fall back to my old ways - she still loves me deeply. So Saturday morning, I tell her that I have had bouts of depression because I still love her and I am torn. So we get very close to each other, closer than we have been in years and we open up ourselves. We actually have a candid open conversation and I can see how we are not able to let go of out care and affection for each other so here is the other major problem besides the obvious:

What the h**ll do we do about the rest of our family, our children, my parents, my sister who have had their hearts ripped out as well.

I think the kids would be angry - again. I know that my parents and my W will NEVER have a relationship again so I risk losing the total respect of my parents and probably the spite of my sister for hurting my parents.

So the thing is that I would rather put her number one in my life so that we do not go back to the same terrible place.

Now, I am not a complete doormat! I also put my foot down and set the same expectations on her. If she wants me to not go back to the old ways, she needs to step up to the plate herself and change the things that pushed me away from giving her affection in the first place. I told her that we feed off of each other. She has to change the way she treats me, put me first above all others in her life; work hard at us and we can make it.

So what do you guys think? Bail out! Work it out!


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

The real question and the only one that matters is what do you think? 

Do you want to bail out or do you want to work it out? What would you need in order for the latter to happen?


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## caughtdreaming (May 30, 2011)

Do what you want. It might hurt if you try to reconcile and it didn't work out, but at least you would know you tried.
If it was me, I would try to reconcile. 
But you only know what you want!

I am happy for you either way though. A bit jealous too.


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## Riverside MFT (Oct 5, 2009)

Brighterlight,
I read your post from a few months back when the marriage "ended". You are a good man to consider going back to the woman who tore your heart out. I would say to go back, but to do it slowly. Start dating each other again. While dating, both of you need to keep changing yourselves to be better. From your thread from a few months and today, it also seems like you rely a lot on other's opinions and feelings (especially your children and family) in order to form your thoghts, opinions, and feelings.


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## Rico (Jul 28, 2010)

do whats right for you man. Right now I find myself two and half weeks removed and all i want to do is reconcile. I also don't think I've given myself enough time to move on, so the feelings of loneliness are prevalent. If you feel it is worth it for your own sake and the sake of the family unit you have built then make it work. Forget whatever anyone else thinks, at the end of the day your family unit is what you leave and come home to everyday. Your family will have to learn to deal with your decision and it is up to both parties to make amends for your sake and your families. Do what is going to make you happy. I wish I had your problem right now.


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## staircase (May 16, 2011)

Whatever you decide, I hope you're happy and it works out. That's a huge decision!


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## brighterlight (Aug 13, 2009)

Jellybeans said:


> The real question and the only one that matters is what do you think?
> 
> Do you want to bail out or do you want to work it out? What would you need in order for the latter to happen?


JB, Thanks. I know what matters to me now is my health and happiness. And right now what would make me happy would be to have her back as my wife but only if she is willing to give the same in return that she asks of me. This won't be a one way street; I will continue the changes to be better that I started a few months back, if for anything, it makes me happy. Yes, what I want is for us to both to put each other first.



caughtdreaming said:


> Do what you want. It might hurt if you try to reconcile and it didn't work out, but at least you would know you tried.
> If it was me, I would try to reconcile.
> But you only know what you want!
> 
> I am happy for you either way though. A bit jealous too.


caught, I want to see if this can work. She is worth it me but please don't be jealous since we may not work out in the end. I had just started to get a feel for being on my own and having some sort of liberties to do things, date other people, etc. but deep down in my heart, I could not get over the good qualities that she possessed and the great times she brought to my life. So although you sound as if you wish you could reconcile, there is still something to be said for being free of a person that brings you grief. I wish you the best. And yes, at least we will be trying once again.



Riverside MFT said:


> Brighterlight,
> I read your post from a few months back when the marriage "ended". You are a good man to consider going back to the woman who tore your heart out. I would say to go back, but to do it slowly. Start dating each other again. While dating, both of you need to keep changing yourselves to be better. From your thread from a few months and today, it also seems like you rely a lot on other's opinions and feelings (especially your children and family) in order to form your thoghts, opinions, and feelings.


Riverside MFT, we are definitely planning on dating. As a matter of fact, no matter how the reconcile goes, we are selling the house to be able to start anew. In no way will I accept her treatment of me as she did in the past; and she realizes that we both contribulted to the demise of our marriage. So you are absolutely right, we had a very lengthy conversation about going very slow with this. She, as well as I, has mentioned that there is no gaurantee but the Hope is definitely there. She said she just cannot get me out of her heart. She told me the other day that when the alarm rang the other morning, she reached over to try to tap me on the back to turn off the alarm - and when she realized I was not there, her heart dropped and she felt empty and lonely. I know the love is still there between us but can we learn to keep the toxic part of our relationship away? That is crucial and will take a lot of work.

We are seriously considering Retrovaille. I have already called them and am working on the registration to attend an August session. Don't know if it will help but our communication has been sub par for years and I truly think that that is a major breakdown point between us. I already told her that I plan to remain as open to her as I right now because I do not have anyhting to lose by it and everything to gain. I need to keep my "me" time, my workout time, so I can be better for her. We are still going to eliminate our debt by selling our assets so we can have some breathing room and more time with each other. Dating is definitely in near future plans.

As far as rely on others opinions - not really. I always prefer and welcome opinions from friends, family, folks on here but I am the one the decides on what I think is best for me. At least at this point. Here is how bad this is going to be for me - My parents and my sister and my W have already put the X on each other. This means I am choosing to go back into my relationship at the expense of my mother and father - who does that! I am not even sure the my faith will back me on this. At this point, I have heard that my parents want me to get rid of her as soon as possible - they do not like her for reasons other than her wanting to abandon our marriage. It seems that they have had an on and off rocky relationship over the past several years. My W says no matter what we decide about our marriage that she will not ever have a relationship with my parents again. So this leaves my children in the middle, me having to choose between my happiness being with her and losing so much with my parents; family gatherings, new grand children births, holidays, etc. And what about me facing her side of the family agian without feeling ashamed? Although I am still in a friendly relationship with them, it won't ever be the same because I know that there will always be that stigma attached. It will be a major change in my life no matter what; our families have always been close. So, in the end, I will put her first, because I love her that much, but logistically it makes more sense to just divorce because there would be a whole lot less drama for everyone. Can you imagine how solid our new relationship would have to be to survive the tide and storm of what will come if we announce that we are staying together. We are actually "acting" in front of family and friends like we are still on course for divorce but when we are alone, we are being so loving to each other now. My W says that she does not want to set them up to be disappointed again if we see that we can not stay together. In the meantime, we are dating and going places together.This should have everyone scratching their heads for sure.



Rico said:


> do whats right for you man. Right now I find myself two and half weeks removed and all i want to do is reconcile. I also don't think I've given myself enough time to move on, so the feelings of loneliness are prevalent. If you feel it is worth it for your own sake and the sake of the family unit you have built then make it work. Forget whatever anyone else thinks, at the end of the day your family unit is what you leave and come home to everyday. Your family will have to learn to deal with your decision and it is up to both parties to make amends for your sake and your families. Do what is going to make you happy. I wish I had your problem right now.


Rico, I am going to do what I feel is right for me so we will date for a while but I know I want her back. We have been through too much. She has her oncologists tests and appointments coming up next week and I won't be there. Although I know we both want me there, we can't because it will lead others to think that she is using me to take her to her tests and be there for her when the doctor gives her the results. Talk about a really messed up deal. And as far as both parties making amends - I pray so hard for that and I try to have faith but I know that my sister will never forgive her. And my mom and dad, who really matter to me will maybe someday - if ever. I don't know on that one. One thing is for sure, all three of them will think I have gone insane and that I am being manipulated by her. It pains me and hurts me that my mother and father do not know me better than that and I feel like they have so little faith in me and how I feel. I have talked to them but they close up their listening to what I really need from them and they try to project on me what they are feeling so I get no help from them and God I wish I had their understanding and support.



staircase said:


> Whatever you decide, I hope you're happy and it works out. That's a huge decision!


Stair, it is a huge decision! Very huge! All the way around. At this point, I just want to take her away from our home, move away from everybody, start over just me and her. It seems that I am trying to heal all the relationships that have been tainted and have become bitterly opinionated and my heart can not handle a divorce, angry and bitter people, loose tongues, and shame all at the same time. I feel as if I might regress back 2 months.


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## 827Aug (Apr 27, 2008)

Wow, BL! It doesn't matter what any of us think OR what your children, your parents, friends, etc. think. None of those opinions factor into your decision. This one is all on you.

Good luck!


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## brighterlight (Aug 13, 2009)

nickiblue said:


> only you know what you want to do and you may be mad not to follow your heart but if it were me i would shield it a bit. did she say what changed her mind?


No. She just said that she is missing me too much. I think she also sees me looking good, being happy and acting calm about everything. I think she sees the new me (actually, it's the way I was for years while we dated and in our early marriage, and is regretful she dumped me. I was ready to start dating all over again. I am not at my ideal weight and body build yet but I am very very close. I am getting stares from women whereever I go (I am not trying to brag, I am not a narcissist nor am I an arrogant person. As a matter of fact, I am a very loving kind person, devoted man.) and it does wonders for my self esteem, that she trampled on, people tell me I don't look my age, so I don't know what she is thinking but what upsets me is that, I have been this same person for 36 years with her. I did let myself go a bit but frankly, she didn't gave me a reason to better myself for her over the last few years; in retrospect, I should have done it for myself at the sacrafice of other responsibilities (father, husband, brother, and son responsibilities). The affection she was waiting for from me, never came my way either. The thing is, that I am still in love with her, even more so when she shows me affection, tenderness and love. I never asked to be smothered by affection, I wouldn't want that, but at least once a frickn' week show me some sort of gentleness and care. She wouldn't come near me for weeks at a time.

OK, I didn't mean to start ranting on. I honestly believe that even with my faults, I am a unique person, I am a caring spouse, I have a huge heart, care about other people and treat them respectfully and as friends, provide for my family, love the outdoors, love sports, can be humble, have humility when called for and recognize the qualities and value of other people. Really, I don't think she would have stuck around 36 years if she didn't know those qualities were in me but all she could do the past few years is try to impose her feelings on me to change me to have even more than that - additionally she wanted me to look 28 years old, always be positive even in the light of some pretty bad stuff. So she was looking for perfection although she says she wasn't.


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## Sparkles422 (Jun 3, 2011)

brighter: What a great comeback for you. If it is meant to be it will be. But caution is correct and counselling.

Whatever you do, don't stop this healing (if it is meant to be) just because you broadcasted your separation. This is your one and only life and if this is going to make you and your wife happy, do it.

I told everyone and I could give a hoot if they disapproved if I chose to reconcile, they'll get over it. Just a bunch of thank yous for being there and I will reciprocate etc....

BE HAPPY! Yeah, I am happy for you.


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## Riverside MFT (Oct 5, 2009)

brighterlight said:


> At this point, I have heard that my parents want me to get rid of her as soon as possible - they do not like her for reasons other than her wanting to abandon our marriage. It seems that they have had an on and off rocky relationship over the past several years. My W says no matter what we decide about our marriage that she will not ever have a relationship with my parents again. So this leaves my children in the middle, me having to choose between my happiness being with her and losing so much with my parents; family gatherings, new grand children births, holidays, etc. And what about me facing her side of the family agian without feeling ashamed? Although I am still in a friendly relationship with them, it won't ever be the same because I know that there will always be that stigma attached. It will be a major change in my life no matter what; our families have always been close. So, in the end, I will put her first, because I love her that much, but logistically it makes more sense to just divorce because there would be a whole lot less drama for everyone. Can you imagine how solid our new relationship would have to be to survive the tide and storm of what will come if we announce that we are staying together. We are actually "acting" in front of family and friends like we are still on course for divorce but when we are alone, we are being so loving to each other now. My W says that she does not want to set them up to be disappointed again if we see that we can not stay together. In the meantime, we are dating and going places together.This should have everyone scratching their heads for sure.


It may not be good to completely sever the relationship between your wife and your parents (not really in your control) or between you and her parents. Would your wife resent you everytime the kids visited Grandpa and Grandma? What about holidays? birthdays? etc.? If you guys get back together, working on those in-law relationships will come later. You both need to work on changing yourselves (have you considered counseling?), as you continue to maintain the changes in yourselves and your relationship, you can slowly start rebuilding the relationship with in-laws. It will be a very long process for everyone. Getting back together with your wife has a lot of potential risks, but also has a lot of potential rewards. You'll never know about the rewards until you come face to face with the risks.


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## brighterlight (Aug 13, 2009)

Sparkles422 said:


> brighter: What a great comeback for you. If it is meant to be it will be. But caution is correct and counselling.
> 
> Whatever you do, don't stop this healing (if it is meant to be) just because you broadcasted your separation. This is your one and only life and if this is going to make you and your wife happy, do it.
> 
> ...


Sparkles and 827, thanks so much for your response. My inner self tells me that what you say is right on the mark. Do this for me and my wife. But I think you understand the bitterness that will happen now with my father, mother and sister. My sister, not so much, it's her life and although I would love for her to be in my life, I can live with the knowledge that she would choose to be a stranger to me. My father and mother, that's different. It isn't easy knowing that they want so badly to be rid of her that although at first they were mad at her for leaving me, lately they have been very happy at thinking that she was finally out of OUR lives. When they find out that we are seriously still in love with each other and will work towards reconciliation; the first thing they are going to think is that I have lost my mind, that she somehow coerced me back into her life, or that I do not have any self respect. As much as I would hate to say it, that is what I think. How in the world did I turn out so different from them. I know my father taught me honor and integrity, and how to love from my mother so I don't know where all this was lost. I really think that my W and them just never really got along going back many years.

I will not let that get in the way of me loving my wife and trying to rebuild a new and better relationship but think about this possible scenario for me:

We try to get back together.
My parents hate this option and become distant from me.
We don't work out or she decides she can't do it and we divorce anyway.
Now I am left with no marriage and parents that are resentful of my attempt at reconciliation.

The stakes are higher than before - I can lose it all.

But know what? I have learned to be on my own and I have a lot to offer someone else. I won't be alone forever, but it will be a completely different world from the one I was familiar with. I can handle it though.

As for counseling, we are going to try Retrovaille. If you don't know what that is, you can read up on it online. Really, it's a last ditch effort to learn communication; which by the way, I feel I have picked up on a LOT during the last few months.

Thanks so much for your comments.


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## brighterlight (Aug 13, 2009)

Riverside MFT said:


> It may not be good to completely sever the relationship between your wife and your parents (not really in your control) or between you and her parents. Would your wife resent you everytime the kids visited Grandpa and Grandma? What about holidays? birthdays? etc.? If you guys get back together, working on those in-law relationships will come later. You both need to work on changing yourselves (have you considered counseling?), as you continue to maintain the changes in yourselves and your relationship, you can slowly start rebuilding the relationship with in-laws. It will be a very long process for everyone. Getting back together with your wife has a lot of potential risks, but also has a lot of potential rewards. You'll never know about the rewards until you come face to face with the risks.


I can only pray for such a chance. I know it is risky to get back together but she is worth it. I also know that severing relationships is a BAD TERRIBLE idea and I have tried to talk some sense into my parents but they are stubborn as mules. My W tried to reach out twice to them in the last month and they turned their backs. When my mother started to open up a but, my father stepped in and shot it down saying he wasn't ready. Now my W says that they will have to come crawling back to her for her to even consider some sort of relationship with them. She told me again last night that their relationship will never be the same and that she will not have any sort of relationship with them whether we get back together or not. She loves me, but she is done with my family. I, on the other hand, have never stopped talking to her family. Even during the last two months I have had several pleasant exchanges with her family. Her brother told me he still considers me a brother to him - you can't just erase 36 years of a relationship.

So you see how sad this situation is for me. It isn't right that I should have to choose my parents over my wife. I hope you are right about letting time heal this but right now I will have to jump into this knowing that my W comes first with the potential risk of her and them just never establishing a relationship. And I have already thought about holidays and birthdays and such to the point where I have resolved to the fact that she won't attend any of those events on my side of the family. We will split up times with the children and great grandchildren when they come. And she will see her family during holidays and I will go see mine without each other - what else are we supposed to do.

I am the one in all these relationships seeing the bigger picture but my parents and W are closed off right now.

Truth be told, I have often thought about packing it up and just moving as far away from everyone, and I mean everyone, so I can start over; I am getting fed up with all the childishness. I don't see any rationale behind why I am the only one trying to mend bridges when I am trying to resolve my own issues at the same time. My heart can not handle all this at once. Pure childishness but with serious consequences as far as family is concerned.

If I have to chose to not reconcile with my wife because neither her nor them can stand each other, I will also sort of divorce my parents simply because I don't know if I could ever geniunely forgive them for sabatoging the possibility of having her back in my life. I am sure that my children, their grandchildren will probably become more distant - they have a very very close relationship so they are only letting their pride hurt themselves.

Lot's of serious stuff here! And I have done everything I could. I have talked to them, to my W about this and the issues this will have down the line to no avail. Yes, there is nothing I can do but just ride this one out point forward.


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## wemogirl (May 31, 2011)

brighterlight, I am so happy to hear about this newest development in your relationship. When I first came here you helped me by answering some questions about the male mindset and I truly appreciated the time you took to do so. I hope this is the beginning a beautiful new relationship with your wife.

I've heard great things about Retrouvaille. I hope it turns out to be a positive experience for the both of you.

One thing you mentioned upthread:



> Can you imagine how solid our new relationship would have to be to survive the tide and storm of what will come if we announce that we are staying together.


This is very true and I pray you can get to the point where your relationship is as strong as you say it is going to need to be. And I hope you enjoy the journey to get there, too.


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## brighterlight (Aug 13, 2009)

wemogirl said:


> brighterlight, I am so happy to hear about this newest development in your relationship. When I first came here you helped me by answering some questions about the male mindset and I truly appreciated the time you took to do so. I hope this is the beginning a beautiful new relationship with your wife.
> 
> I've heard great things about Retrouvaille. I hope it turns out to be a positive experience for the both of you.
> 
> ...


Ahh WMG, thank you so much! A very positive message from you. I really appreciate it. Yeah, it will take some serious LOVE from the both of us to get through what will come should we get back together. The evil one will surely rise to try to destroy us again, of that I am sure, and our relationship will have to be rock solid, or he will succeed. We have the man upstairs behind us, of that I have faith, but actually facing and fighting the demon in real life will take some serious battle. We both have to be enlightened and acutely aware of the way he works if we are to succeed. I will pray that my W will see and understand the same or we won't make it.

I am hoping that if some of you reading this are not believers then you can at least see the allegory in my comment above. At this point I am really starting to see how Satan works his magic and unfortunately for his sorry a$$, I see right through him; he has pushed too far and has made it so obvious he has his hand in this that he blew his cover. My concern is, will the others see his work. No matter what happens, my faith is strong and I will be fine!

Thank you again for your well wishes and prayers.


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## Amy G (Apr 26, 2011)

I am in a similar position, though only been living apart for 6 weeks. I also am not sure if it is worth getting back together and possibly going through all the s**t again and draging young kids along with me.

However, I think, after looking at all the heartache and expense lawyers cost to divide a household/ life and how messy and nasty it can get, I would try getting back together. (I haven't read your previous posts so don't know your background)

I would also suggest family counselling, just u 2 at first, then maybe your children as well if it would help the family unit. Also the idea of dates and slowly closing the gap that has been there for the break up to happen in the first place. (This is probably what I will do as well) 

I believe if you can both correctly work out what went wrong and make real steps to change/ stop those behaviours it could work out.

I wouldn't worry about other people's views. You 2 are the ones in the relationship and who will have to make the decisions.


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## wemogirl (May 31, 2011)

brighterlight said:


> Ahh WMG, thank you so much! A very positive message from you. I really appreciate it. Yeah, it will take some serious LOVE from the both of us to get through what will come should we get back together. The evil one will surely rise to try to destroy us again, of that I am sure, and our relationship will have to be rock solid, or he will succeed. We have the man upstairs behind us, of that I have faith, but actually facing and fighting the demon in real life will take some serious battle. We both have to be enlightened and acutely aware of the way he works if we are to succeed. I will pray that my W will see and understand the same or we won't make it.
> 
> I am hoping that if some of you reading this are not believers then you can at least see the allegory in my comment above. At this point I am really starting to see how Satan works his magic and unfortunately for his sorry a$$, I see right through him; he has pushed too far and has made it so obvious he has his hand in this that he blew his cover. My concern is, will the others see his work. No matter what happens, my faith is strong and I will be fine!
> 
> Thank you again for your well wishes and prayers.


You know, I post on another religious message board (although I haven't mentioned my marriage struggles there as I know some people from there IRL) and there is a lot of talk about Satan and his attack on marriages and families. I had never thought of it from that standpoint but I totally see it. Yes, my DH could behave better (as could I) but I don't *have* to wallow in my self pity and resentment. But the Devil knows how to exploit my weaknesses and I'm sure he has had a hand in my struggles over the last several months.

I'm glad your faith is so strong and you can rely on it to keep you going in the right direction.


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## Riverside MFT (Oct 5, 2009)

It is just one step at a time. Your priority is mending your relationship with your wife (and becoming a better, stronger husband as well). The next step might be just learning how to talk to each other, then defining boundaries/rules, etc. Of course, you are not going to ignore your parents, but just take everything one step at a time.


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## Lon (Jun 6, 2011)

BL, I'm glad that your W has been able to start recognizing the love you have offered her and want to continue to offer her. This is a good news story for you, because you've had some time to discover what it is about you that doesn't work for you and now you can know what you will and will not tolerate... I hope you are able to set your boundaries and make sure you stay strong enough to protect them, even if it means your marriage still doesn't end up working out after all of this. And if it does work, and you both are able to set boundaries and agree to each others needs then how wonderful is that?! Just don't let her remorse pull at your heartstrings and don't forget the hurt she has put you through and her ability to cut so deep again.


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## brighterlight (Aug 13, 2009)

Lon said:


> BL, I'm glad that your W has been able to start recognizing the love you have offered her and want to continue to offer her. This is a good news story for you, because you've had some time to discover what it is about you that doesn't work for you and now you can know what you will and will not tolerate... I hope you are able to set your boundaries and make sure you stay strong enough to protect them, even if it means your marriage still doesn't end up working out after all of this. And if it does work, and you both are able to set boundaries and agree to each others needs then how wonderful is that?! Just don't let her remorse pull at your heartstrings and don't forget the hurt she has put you through and her ability to cut so deep again.


Lon, thanks man. We actually had a nice discussion about that very thing last night. She has been working a lot and looked pretty tired but I also felt that she was a little distant so we had a good talk. I asked her what was the matter; her response was that she is scared about things going back to the way it was and what if we dont work out again. She is afraid of putting the kids thru this again. I told her that I loved her very much but that if get certain things from her, we will be alright. I proceeded to let her know that things will be different for me this time around and then I let her know what it is that must have from her in a new relationship. I laid it all out for her as well as my part in our relationship going forward. She cried because she was thinking that there is no way that I can put her first and love her if her and my parents dont get along. I told her that it is actually the opposite; that my love for her is above all others. We have to put each other first. We need to go slow in our reunion. So we are still separating but with dating each other in mind so we can try to rebuild ourselves and our relationship. There are no guarantees but at least there is hope. Also, the learning that I have had over the past three months (actually the last 3 years) has helped me grow as a person. I don't fear failure and I don't fear being on my own so no matter what, The man upstair's got my back.

You folks on here have been lifesavers, friends, and mentors for me. I can't thank everyone enough for reading all my rants.

I'll keep u posted.

So Lon, how are you doing? Seems like it has been steady as she goes for you for a week or so now.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Lon (Jun 6, 2011)

Hey BL, it sounds like you have a lot of confidence, as you should... I know that you cherish her, and I hope for your sake she can remember to realize that. I too would hate for it to go "back to the way it was before" with you, meaning you do more than your share of support and heavy lifting while she grows cold to you... and I'd hate for you to forget how to show her your love again. I am really happy for you that you have a chance.

As for me, I've been on vacation with my son at my parents since last weekend and was really busy leading up to it, so haven't chimed in much on TAM or posted much about me. It has been nice to be with my family and have the unwavering support from them... they realize I was wronged - it is hard to convince them that I had a part to play in the unhappiness in my marriage, they think I'm too perfect but I think they just love me and realize how deep this is all hurt me (and they are hurt really badly too).

My WW has been texting and phoning like crazy trying to talk to our child, much more than when he was with me at home - I think she is starting to miss her family badly. Strange thing, this morning she texted me out of the blue and announced she was quitting with the OM (the 2nd one?) and wanted to just be single and is ready to deal with her life now... but I know that there is someone else (a 3rd OM??) that has been pursuing her and they have been hanging out with mutual friends (but I'd be surprised if she went for him, doesn't seem close to what she is looking for, too much like me I think, except possibly wealthier and more succesful with his career due to not having a wife and child to have supported I suppose). So I'm not really sure what to make of her message, not sure why she is telling me its over with that guy (she never felt the compulsion to announce when it started now did she?!) I am hoping she's not steering herself toward R because I don't think I'm ready to be strong enough to stand up for myself. As soon as I get back I'm going to get legal affairs in order and get this divorce going. I love her, and have been so caught up trying to let go of that love, I am actually quite repulsed by her atm so it has been somewhat easy doing NC. I just need to do some more leg work and prepare myself better for if she wants to R - I would go there but it would mean big changes from both of us, more so from her and I honestly doubt she is mature or selfless enough to stick to it.


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## brighterlight (Aug 13, 2009)

Lon, it's great that you got some time with your son; do your best to enjoy every moment with him - they grow up way too fast. I know when my kids got married it was like, where did all the years go. Take as much time as can for him; you will be rewarded for that more than you can imagine.

As for you and the stbx texting you more; yeah, it looks like she has had some time to let what she did soak in and may now be realizing that the grass isn't greener on the other side and is beginning to experience remorse. I would be absolutely sure she has OM #3 before making any accusations though; it would be sad if an incorrect assumption on your part put the nail in the coffin for your marriage. And I would 100% agree with you that you can not surrender yet to reconciliation of you don't have yourself together. You need to be sober from the whole experience if you move towards a R agreement. There is no way I would do that if I wasn't clear about what it is that I would need from her in order to attempt to make your relationship work again. I told mine that our old marriage was dead as far as I am concerned; that we would be starting over and that things had to be different for me and her actions and behavior would have to be different in order for me to return the favor. I know we can make it work but there will always be risk and that fear of giong through this again. You are hurt right now so give yourself time to heal. If you can not forgive her for her infidelity, then you are not ready. I would have not been where I am in 3 months had my W been in an adultress affair. It would take me a VERY long time. In my situation, it would never have worked out for us because she did have and EA/PA 11 years ago as I had mentioned. So a second time around would never have worked. Thank God that that was not the reason for me/us. So I feel you and I know what you feel like, I have been there. Still though, you have to have faith. If you think that there is any little bit of hope for both of you, then it is worth a chance to save your marriage. But again, not until you are ready to communicate clearly your expectations of her, and her of you should you attempt the reconciliation. And if you want to move on to other things in your life, then do what will make you truly happy. I wish the best for you and will include you in my prayers this evening.


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## cisco7931 (May 2, 2011)

I wish I had your problem, but from the looks of it, we're far from that realization yet...

Go on with it, there is obviously some affection and love running through your veins despite all the hurt... Some friends told me that sometimes things need to be broken first before they become better... Such holds true I believe in marriage... After this ordeal, if both of you are 100% in it, whatever you get afterwards will be your best relationship yet...


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## Lon (Jun 6, 2011)

As for forgiveness and faith that my marriage could be restored again... at first I did forgive, quite willingly and genuinely I was shocked to life and I realized just how bad this relationship was for her (and to some extent me too). But then her foggy decisions just kept making things complicated - I'd love to forgive but I don't even really know the truth any more, how can you forgive what you don't even know what you are forgiving? And now she is just living this new lifestyle, how can I just accept that? I have no choice so what if she keeps this up for another week? What if its a year she is on her own then wants to R? Does the amount of time and amount of infidelity count towards or affect the reality of R? I know only I can answer these questions and I think one thing I'm afraid of is her asking to fix the marriage and me being made into the antagonist who says no there is no chance, even though it is completely within my rights.

I had faith at first and she just smashed whatever little bit I was hanging onto... I still have fragments but I'm not sure if I even want to hang on, life just seems better somehow right now despite the huge amounts of sadness, inadequacy, fear, anger and loneliness... Letting go entirely seems to me like the right thing to do, but it doesn't feel like the right time to do it. Not sure how long I should wait, I know I'm capable of living the rest of my life holding out hope for her, but I don't want to waste any more of the precious time I have on the earth dwelling on mistakes of my past.


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## brighterlight (Aug 13, 2009)

cisco7931 said:


> I wish I had your problem, but from the looks of it, we're far from that realization yet...
> 
> Go on with it, there is obviously some affection and love running through your veins despite all the hurt... Some friends told me that sometimes things need to be broken first before they become better... Such holds true I believe in marriage... After this ordeal, if both of you are 100% in it, whatever you get afterwards will be your best relationship yet...


I truly believe this comment. I know that what I need from my W has to be delivered the next time around; same the other way around. And because that is a requirement to keeping our marriage healthy, it can't help but be far better than before.


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## brighterlight (Aug 13, 2009)

Lon said:


> As for forgiveness and faith that my marriage could be restored again... at first I did forgive, quite willingly and genuinely I was shocked to life and I realized just how bad this relationship was for her (and to some extent me too). But then her foggy decisions just kept making things complicated - I'd love to forgive but I don't even really know the truth any more, how can you forgive what you don't even know what you are forgiving? And now she is just living this new lifestyle, how can I just accept that? I have no choice so what if she keeps this up for another week? What if its a year she is on her own then wants to R? Does the amount of time and amount of infidelity count towards or affect the reality of R? I know only I can answer these questions and I think one thing I'm afraid of is her asking to fix the marriage and me being made into the antagonist who says no there is no chance, even though it is completely within my rights.
> 
> I had faith at first and she just smashed whatever little bit I was hanging onto... I still have fragments but I'm not sure if I even want to hang on, life just seems better somehow right now despite the huge amounts of sadness, inadequacy, fear, anger and loneliness... Letting go entirely seems to me like the right thing to do, but it doesn't feel like the right time to do it. Not sure how long I should wait, I know I'm capable of living the rest of my life holding out hope for her, but I don't want to waste any more of the precious time I have on the earth dwelling on mistakes of my past.


Lon, I would set a time limit for myself. After you two have been able to sit and discuss this, and you do not feel that her answers are sincere, or you don't feel like it can be fixed, then decide from there. No, I would not expect anyone to put their lives on hold forever. If you have any bit of doubt that she does not want to change her new lifestyle - immediately, I would throw in the towel. I know how you are probably feeling right now; you are at the cusp of finding your freedom and finally beginning to feel some sense of relief that you are at a point to go on on your own. I was almost there when my W said she wanted to try to fix our marriage. I was torn because I was already having some feelings of independance from a life of servitude, but I just can not stop loving her. So I am giong to give us another chance but on many of my terms and some of hers. I wish you the best with whatever you decide.


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## Lon (Jun 6, 2011)

brighterlight said:


> ...No, I would not expect anyone to put their lives on hold forever. If you have any bit of doubt that she does not want to change her new lifestyle - *immediately*, I would throw in the towel...


And this is the point I seem to be stuck on... as of right now, this very moment she doesn't want to change "immediately" nor did she yesterday or the day before that etc. But tomorrow she may want it immediately and that's why I will feel like the bad one if I decide not to be in the marriage 100% and she does. It is not certain at all, but I think it is possibly an inevitability.

With most other R stories it seemed the WS atleast appeared to want forgiveness, in my case she has said I don't need to forgive her, she is done regardless (but she is entirely led by her emotions, and tomorrow her emotions just may be telling her the opposite). So I am not putting my life on hold but it is hard moving forward, and I feel like if I don't get on with my life soon enough I'm going to have to face an impossible decision - though perhaps I'm worrying about this too much, if she isn't willing to follow through I can still end it.

I guess one thing I need to make it work is time to heal, and I just don't think she'll understand that, if on the other hand I have enough time to heal and know what I want before she ever asks for R (assuming she does) it would work out, it always seems to be about timing for us, and my suspicions are that is an excuse she has always used to get what she wants in life...

Anyways, thanks for letting me try to work this out on here, I'm slowly getting a better grasp on how I need to approach this issue of R if it ever comes up with her.


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## KRinOnt (Oct 19, 2010)

caughtdreaming said:


> Do what you want. It might hurt if you try to reconcile and it didn't work out, but at least you would know you tried.
> If it was me, I would try to reconcile.
> But you only know what you want!
> 
> I am happy for you either way though. A bit jealous too.


I'd give my right arm for a chance to do what may be possible for you. That said, only you know what your heart wants.


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

I wish you a happy reconciliation.

Your story gives me hope.


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## brighterlight (Aug 13, 2009)

Lon, I think you are probably farther along the going on your path than I ever was and believe me, I was pretty far allong. It seems that in your case your W hasn't really asked to be forgiven nor does it seem she is anywhere nead being ready to repent for what she has done. I think you are taking the right road for what is best for you and I commend you on that. Heck, you never know, if my W and I end up not working out, I will be back on here asking you for some guidance since you will be so much farther along the path to recovery than I would be. Wo
Quite honestly, I am have some anxiety knowing that I am risking the respect and love of my parents if we don't work out since they resent her so much. They will be pissed at me for wanting to save my marriage with her so I have a lot at stake.

I am also feeling a little concerned that she is taking a one week trip out of state with her mother to visit her family. All these thoughts are going through my mind like what if her family tries to set her up with someone while she is there. I mean, will she remember that we are trying reconcile? Will she put herself first and do whatever (date, sex, ea) with someone because it's been so long. I don't know if I can trust her. As far as her family knows, she is a single, separated, soon to be divorced free woman. We never had any discussion about this and I don't know where I stand. It's all so complicated now. I mean, what do I do? I will also have a week to myself and I am subconsciencously thinking that I should go party myself. Man am I confused.

Do any of you on here think I should discuss this with her before she leaves? I am afraid that might make her feel upset that I am even thinking about this but I don't know because our feelings are all over the place.

BTW, we signed up for Retrouvaille starting the week of August 19th. One other thing, she will be out of state next week on what was supposed to be our 32nd anniversay on July 19. What does one do about that? I have no clue.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## brighterlight (Aug 13, 2009)

that_girl said:


> I wish you a happy reconciliation.
> 
> Your story gives me hope.


Hey TG, I hope that we can work it all out. At this point it does seem like we will. There are hust those times where I still feel lost. We have a ways to go and as I mentioned in my previous post to Lon, we will try Retrouvaille next month and all bets are off at that program. We will be having some candid difficult discussions I would suspect so we will either come out of there stronger than ever, OR we will come to the realization that we can no longer work together. It's all in Gods hands. Thank you for the positive post.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## marksaysay (Oct 15, 2010)

Best wishes to you, brighterlight. It's stories like yours that give many a BS hope. I'm praying that your story will have a happy ending.


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## Lon (Jun 6, 2011)

brighterlight said:


> ...Quite honestly, I am have some anxiety knowing that I am risking the respect and love of my parents if we don't work out since they resent her so much. They will be pissed at me for wanting to save my marriage with her so I have a lot at stake.


I too have flirted with that feeling after realizing the anger my parents have towards her, they view her in a much harsher light than even I, but they live half way across the country and really don't have intimate knowledge of my marriage. Though despite my concerns the other day about FXW telling me her fling was over, I really don't think she's even thought about possible R. And if that is something that we may end up choosing to work on I am not worried about offending anyone like I used to, all that matters is myself and my relationship with my W.



brighterlight said:


> ...I am also feeling a little concerned that she is taking a one week trip out of state with her mother to visit her family. All these thoughts are going through my mind like what if her family tries to set her up with someone while she is there. I mean, will she remember that we are trying reconcile? Will she put herself first and do whatever (date, sex, ea) with someone because it's been so long. I don't know if I can trust her. As far as her family knows, she is a single, separated, soon to be divorced free woman. We never had any discussion about this and I don't know where I stand. It's all so complicated now. I mean, what do I do? I will also have a week to myself and I am subconsciencously thinking that I should go party myself. Man am I confused.


It is a rational thought. Since that is something you are even considering I think your MIL has a right to know that your W has told you she wants to work towards R. They need to realize that she is not in a place where more options should be presented to her, I think it is a crucial part of your reconciliation that there is transparency among all the adult family members who spend any amount of time with you and your W.



brighterlight said:


> ...Do any of you on here think I should discuss this with her before she leaves? I am afraid that might make her feel upset that I am even thinking about this but I don't know because our feelings are all over the place.


It is your mandate to discuss this with her, and it is not her right to be upset, she has agreed to R and that means accepting your feelings and needs, whatever her feelings and needs may be. Transparency is the word of the day BL!

I also wouldn't worry too much the specific day of your anniversary if it is something she needs to take care of (you didn't mention her reason for being away). Lots has happened and you are working towards a relationship that you can begin to celebrate milestones again. And I hope your retrouvaille program is useful for you... Good luck!


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## marksaysay (Oct 15, 2010)

BL, go out and get the book "Surviving An Affair". It will give you a plan on how to repair your relationship and create one that is fulfilling for the both of you.


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## brighterlight (Aug 13, 2009)

sadand said:


> BL- I think it is important to talk a lot. Be sure what your concerns are and try not to overwhelm with negative thoughts. Send flowers to the hotel while she is away and greet here on her return with plans for a fabulous dinner


sadand, I had thought about doing that but the problem is that she is staying with family so sending flowers is not a good idea since the family will probably see them and that would appear as if: 1. I was trying to rub the fact that she left a great marriage in her face in front of her family. or 2. That I am asking for forgiveness and am displaying to her family that I am repenting. I don't want them to even consider the fact that I called of the marriage - it was her so I have nothing to apologize for as far as the divorce request is concerned. or 3. They will be aware that we are trying to reconcile and the news will spread through the family so quickly that my parents will have a chance to lecture me on making mistakes since they want her gone.

Keep in mind that no one in our families know about the reconciliation we want to do to save our marriage. Despite all that has happened, we still love each other.

So the flower suggestion was great and I would definitely have gone that route if I knew she was going to be on her own.

I am still going for the text message and a possible phone call.

I also have mixed feelings about the anniversary because I don't know how you would count an anniversary year that was not sincere in Love. I mean, we were headed for divorce, so I would feel a but like a hypocrite saying "Happy Anniversary." It's all so weird.

OK, maybe I can send flowers and write something on the card like, "this is still a blessed day for me. Please accept these flowers as a thank you for all of the great memories we made on this day."

I don't know, I just can not let the family on about us just yet. Not until we have had a chance to open up our hearts again.


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## marksaysay (Oct 15, 2010)

marksaysay said:


> BL, go out and get the book "Surviving An Affair". It will give you a plan on how to repair your relationship and create one that is fulfilling for the both of you.


Sorry for this. I've read so many threads with infidelity that I thought this was one of them. A better book suggestion would be "his needs, her needs". In it, you will gain an understanding of what happened that caused your relationship to get to this point. It also has a very good plan on how to reconnect. It's a great book.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Riverside MFT (Oct 5, 2009)

I am looking forward to hearing your story. Tell us about your experiences with Retrouville (however, don't feel obligated to come here).


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## wemogirl (May 31, 2011)

brighterlight said:


> I also have mixed feelings about the anniversary because I don't know how you would count an anniversary year that was not sincere in Love. I mean, we were headed for divorce, so I would feel a but like a hypocrite saying "Happy Anniversary." It's all so weird.
> 
> OK, maybe I can send flowers and write something on the card like, "this is still a blessed day for me. Please accept these flowers as a thank you for all of the great memories we made on this day."


I always think of our anniversary as the start of a new year instead of the end of an old one. Maybe you could celebrate it in that respect.


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## brighterlight (Aug 13, 2009)

You guys are all so great and understanding. RMFT, yeah, I might post some comments about how Retrouvaille went when I get back. Lon, thanks for your comments; I think you are right, I should be transparent with her. And the reason she is going on this trip is because she planned it a while back when we were still going our separate ways since she wanted some time to herself and time to go out and party, celebrate as a single woman, whatever. Well, that has changed now but she had already booked the flight. So you can see why I am a bit concerned, because her family over there are going by the assumption that she is going over there to have a great party time. Well, I don't mind her releasing some stress and having fun but it is the boundaries that we have NOT set that bother me.

I think I agree with you, since we agreed to be candid and straightforward with each others feelings from now on, I think she should know exactly what I am thinking and it should not bother her that I am asking. I need to be on a level playing field with her.

As far as letting the adults know in the family, hummmm, I am not sure my parents would take it in a positive way. I don't know how her mother will feel because who knows what she has told her about our marriage in the past even though my MIL still talks to me and says I am still her other son.

Also, it will add insult to injury if my parents find out we did not tell them but told her mother. I tell you this is all so f'ckd up. I have the same opinion as you though, we are working to keep and love each other so my number one priority is us.


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## brighterlight (Aug 13, 2009)

Oh, here's something I forgot to mention. Tomorrow she has her follow up appointment with her oncologist to review the results of her tests last week. She has to go every 3 months for a CT scan, lab work and other tests so they can monitor her.

Everytime this visit to the doctor comes up, she gets anxiety, can't sleep, is in fear. Of course, I would expect that to be normal when your doctor is giving you what could be life and death news. She asked me if I wouldn't mind going with her tomorrow to the visit. Of course I told her I would go, I have been there since day one for over 30 years; I was prepared two weeks ago to be out of her life as far as this was concerned since I thought that is what she would have wanted but I asked my oldest son, without her knowing, if he could please go with her. But now all that has changed and I am going with her.

The reason I bring this up is because she leaves for her out of state trip on the following day, Wednesday. Depending on the news at the doctor tomorrow, that will determine how she will fair on this trip. So I am back to all these emotions I am having - if it is good news, I feel more confident that she will keep our reconciliation at the front of her actions, if it is not good news (which I doubt it will be bad news), she might go back to a pattern of thinking about doing what she needs to do for herself only.

I don't know, I am all over the board on this one. Man, I think this is worse than just being by myself.


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## marksaysay (Oct 15, 2010)

All over the board, huh? I think many others who have been in your shoes will admit to having been there. I think it comes with the territory.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Lon (Jun 6, 2011)

BL it sounds to me as if you're still trying to do this all alone, and the fact is you can't. First she needs to be in it and from what you are writing you don't see that she is, so is she?? Or is she just playing along because she is lost? If she is lost than going to have party time is a bad idea, plus there is no obligation for her to use the plane ticket.

Also, you can't do it without support, the people here on TAM are an emotional lifeboat but the actual face to face people in your life that love you are the ones that will ultimately be your support which is why I think it is so important to just let go of all the secrecy and have faith in others (especially those whom have not wronged you in any of this). If you both want R then I think it needs to be public, just as your vows were - stop worrying about what your parents are saying, they are telling you what they think they need you to hear but it doesn't give them any authority - its YOUR marriage not theirs that you are working on here.


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## brighterlight (Aug 13, 2009)

Lon said:


> BL it sounds to me as if you're still trying to do this all alone, and the fact is you can't. First she needs to be in it and from what you are writing you don't see that she is, so is she?? Or is she just playing along because she is lost? If she is lost than going to have party time is a bad idea, plus there is no obligation for her to use the plane ticket.
> 
> Also, you can't do it without support, the people here on TAM are an emotional lifeboat but the actual face to face people in your life that love you are the ones that will ultimately be your support which is why I think it is so important to just let go of all the secrecy and have faith in others (especially those whom have not wronged you in any of this). If you both want R then I think it needs to be public, just as your vows were - stop worrying about what your parents are saying, they are telling you what they think they need you to hear but it doesn't give them any authority - its YOUR marriage not theirs that you are working on here.


I agree with you Lon but it is she that is reminding me on several occasions that we can't let anyone know about our plans until maybe after the Retrouvaille weekend. It's as if she is really putting a lot of weight on that program because it is all about learning communication. She sure is acting a lot like her heart is in it. I mean, she asked me to go with her to see the Dr., she went with me to the apartments I had selected to move to because they are close to my/our work and we even applied for a waiting list for the exact unit WE want to move to. So it seems to me that she is honestly committing to us, I don't think she would keep telling me she really likes the location and complex because it is a lot like a vacation resort if she wasn't thinking about reconciling. We made plans to seriously look into buying a beach house for getaways while we stay in a two bedroom apartment. We still have the house on the market and she even mentioned just lowering the asking price so we can move into the apartment once it becomes available - probably September. So that tells me that we have to let everyone know sooner or later - right. She has told me her reason for not letting the "secret" out is because she is absolutely terrified about huring our kids again should we decide that we won't work.

IMO, we can't just sit on the fence forever on this so I agree with you that we need to set an agreed upon date to start letting everyone know.

Oh, by the way, did I mention the trip she had already planned with her sister and friend to Las Vegas in January. Yeah, I forgot to mention that. I will see how I will manage that one. We better be tight by then or that can get out of hand.


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## Lon (Jun 6, 2011)

If she is afraid of miscommunications setting back the plans for R then I can understand the apprehension. Still, at this point it seems you've weathered the worst of it emotionally, so maybe come up with an agreement to set the boundaries of communication, if either of you feel it is breaking down have a safe word that allows you to stop the dialog, but still try to start working at things now, even before retreat. It seems like she's sat on the fence long enough, no??

As to her Vegas trip, why don't you just plan to go with? That's still half a year away enough time that you will either be back on track by then or not.


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## brighterlight (Aug 13, 2009)

Lon said:


> If she is afraid of miscommunications setting back the plans for R then I can understand the apprehension. Still, at this point it seems you've weathered the worst of it emotionally, so maybe come up with an agreement to set the boundaries of communication, if either of you feel it is breaking down have a safe word that allows you to stop the dialog, but still try to start working at things now, even before retreat. It seems like she's sat on the fence long enough, no??
> 
> As to her Vegas trip, why don't you just plan to go with? That's still half a year away enough time that you will either be back on track by then or not.


You know what, she may not like me mentioning going to Vegas with her since it was supposed to be a "Girls trip" and none of the husbands/guys will be going with them. I can't be a third wheel on that one so there is still a lot of discussion we need to have on that topic. See how things got all screwed up in a hurry. I agree with you though, I gotta figure something out, or maybe I will be stupid for thinking this, but maybe by then, she will be in a place where I can trust that she will go there for fun only with the girls and that won't include "male friend" relationships. OK, I am being ridiculous; whatever happens in Vegas, stays in Vegas - right. Well, she hasn't bought the airline tickets for that yet so hopefully that will fall through the cracks. I think that as long as we are, uhumm, "divorcing" as far as family is concerned, then they might feel compelled to continue making trip suggestions for her. You are right that we have to get our reconcilation in the open and yes, she is very apprehensive about miscommunications. At this point there is no clear definition on where we are; I mean, do you call it separation? Do you call it a holding pattern? Do you call it a last ditch effort to see if we can work together? Do you call it a test to see if we have in fact changed our negative behavior? I just can't seem to find the answer. I would think that if she want's to see how we do together that she would want the support of her family and our kids instead of them treating us like we were going our ways. That has to be difficult for them too.

I hope she is sincere about making up her mind after Retrovaille, but that is actually a six week program. Whew, I think I might be having to level with her soon and just bite the bullet as you say and let her know how I feel about her upcoming trip. I want a commitment from her if she expects the same from me.


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## Riverside MFT (Oct 5, 2009)

I think taking things slow is a good idea. Go to Retrouville together, and begin the healing of the relationship. Maybe not letting others know could be a good idea as they might discourage either of you from recommitting in this relationship. Retrouville will hopefully strengthen both of you and you can return from the trip, talk to other family members about recommitting to the relationship, and not be swayed by their feelings/opinions.


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## Lon (Jun 6, 2011)

What do you call it? Well, I'm not exactly in your shoes, but I'd call it time to start making some boundaries. Don't let it slip back to how it was, where neither of you were happy and her solution was to try leaving. It is just a trip to vegas, in the grand scheme of life it is sort of meaningless, and if it really is something that has greater meaning to her, wouldn't she want to share that experience with the one she loves most??

I'm talking tough, but I know its hard to make these changes in yourself, especially now that you have someone else's feelings to consider. I'm writing this because I know it is right for me to say so, and you too are on the path to standing up for yourself - as wonderful as a reconciliation would be you still need to put yourself first (as I am trying to do in my life). I truly don't want to write anything that could sway your chance, I just simply don't want to see you sacrifice more of yourself to a bottomless pit of a one-sided relationship.

I know that infidelity hasn't been the issue in your marriage but she still betrayed your trust when she walked out on it for selfish reasons. Maybe she lost trust in you too, I guess I'm not sure the best way to earn that trust back, but it seems to me leading separate lives and having separate vacations doesn't help.


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## brighterlight (Aug 13, 2009)

Riverside MFT said:


> I think taking things slow is a good idea. Go to Retrouville together, and begin the healing of the relationship. Maybe not letting others know could be a good idea as they might discourage either of you from recommitting in this relationship. Retrouville will hopefully strengthen both of you and you can return from the trip, talk to other family members about recommitting to the relationship, and not be swayed by their feelings/opinions.


Yes, her fear is that she doesn't want to let the kids down again. And my fear is exactly what you implied to here, I am pretty darn sure that my sister and possibly my parents will not hold back from showing me their INTENSE disappointment in our trying to reconcile. I am actually starting to get angry at their lack of support for me although I know it is because they think they are actually helping me by taking my side. I have to deal with that at some point but I agree that now is not the time. I want to focus on me and my W.



Lon said:


> What do you call it? Well, I'm not exactly in your shoes, but I'd call it time to start making some boundaries. Don't let it slip back to how it was, where neither of you were happy and her solution was to try leaving. It is just a trip to vegas, in the grand scheme of life it is sort of meaningless, and if it really is something that has greater meaning to her, wouldn't she want to share that experience with the one she loves most??
> 
> I'm talking tough, but I know its hard to make these changes in yourself, especially now that you have someone else's feelings to consider. I'm writing this because I know it is right for me to say so, and you too are on the path to standing up for yourself - as wonderful as a reconciliation would be you still need to put yourself first (as I am trying to do in my life). I truly don't want to write anything that could sway your chance, I just simply don't want to see you sacrifice more of yourself to a bottomless pit of a one-sided relationship.
> 
> I know that infidelity hasn't been the issue in your marriage but she still betrayed your trust when she walked out on it for selfish reasons. Maybe she lost trust in you too, I guess I'm not sure the best way to earn that trust back, but it seems to me leading separate lives and having separate vacations doesn't help.


Well Lon, actually for the way I have been towards her needs and mine, maybe I never got over her infidelity 11 years ago and I should have. I know that now and I have actually grown past it. As for her, yes, she lost trust for me and harbored a lot of resentment, that is what she needs to work on. I am still baffled by the trust thing though as I committed a VERY TRUSTING relationship for 36 years with her. I have been loyal and by her side and always kept my word to her so I do not know where the trust thing comes from; even I, as person who tries to see both sides of the issues, think she just pulled that one out of thin air. I guess I really need to get more input from her about the trust deal because I have no compass to guide myself by for that since I have been EXTREMELY trustworthy for our entire relationship so I have no way of knowing exactly what it is I am supposed to be gaining her trust back with. Hell, she even leaves her journal on top of the bed while she is out of the house and guess what? My stupid ass is so trustworthy that I have not even touched it. I think most people would have pried by now. So I can't stress enough how she will have to get over the trust issue on her own because I can not do anythinig about the respect and trust I have always exemplified towards her and others. I am old fashioned in that respect where word of mouth and a hand shake are as solid to keeping a promise as writing it on paper - just the way I was raised; I guess that's why I thought we were going to be together for the rest of our lives.

As for the resentment, well, I can see where she would get that from. Resent that I didn't give her enough affection, resent the she HAD to call our marriage quits, etc. etc. OK, I can work with her on that.


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## Lon (Jun 6, 2011)

BL, I think she just doesn't trust that you can make her happy. And you can't. In fact you never have. Only she has that power to find her own happiness and you have simply offered whatever you could to enable that for her. Not until she realizes this will she begin to see through this impossible task she's assigned to you, and realize that your trust was never the issue, and that you have provided all the things that used to enable her to find some peace, and 36 years proves it worked well enough.

As life has changed she has changed, and she sees your years of contributions as defining the person you are, and that it no longer fits, that she's somehow outgrown all that you can offer. She just needs to realize that you have changed too, and that the way she defined you in the past doesn't limit who you are now.


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## brighterlight (Aug 13, 2009)

Lon said:


> BL, I think she just doesn't trust that you can make her happy. And you can't. In fact you never have. Only she has that power to find her own happiness and you have simply offered whatever you could to enable that for her. Not until she realizes this will she begin to see through this impossible task she's assigned to you, and realize that your trust was never the issue, and that you have provided all the things that used to enable her to find some peace, and 36 years proves it worked well enough.
> 
> As life has changed she has changed, and she sees your years of contributions as defining the person you are, and that it no longer fits, that she's somehow outgrown all that you can offer. She just needs to realize that you have changed too, and that the way she defined you in the past doesn't limit who you are now.


Ok, you have definitely stunned me with this answer. I think this is exactly what she tried to explain to me but somehow couldn't get the words out right. I will ask her about this to see if this is exactly it. I guess I was trying to understand trust in the physical sense not the metaphysical. I always executed on promises and such which were action things, things you can quantify, it never occurred to me that trust could be something that was in the noun sense of the word - as in "reliance on something in the future; hope." I guess I could probably see that in certain things I could not deliver, not because I didn;t want to but because circumstances she didn't see didn't allow it. But in all other sense of the word, verb sense, I have delivered on all accounts. I wish I would have asked for more clarification from her, or maybe trust was not the best word for her to use; it made me feel small and unappreciated. It didn't help her cause by making me feel as if she was grossly misjudging me and have me think she was belittling 36 years worth of commitment. It actually infuriated me but I am over it know. I still need to know though what it is she meant.


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## ahhhmaaaan! (Mar 26, 2011)

I actually started reading about your situation from the "other" forum. Honestly, I feel like she's just settling again... especially because she needs somenone now, due to her medical conditions. My problem with this whole sordid affair is- What if she reverts to her volatile ways again because... say you gained another pound; or didn't give her the attention she feels she deserves. In my opinion, its a reconciliation done out of _convenience_(for her). I would hate for you to put in so much work, only to be in the same rut six months from now. She seems to be waffling a bit. She wants to find herself, but yet she wants some form of stability(you). I'm very suspicious on her motives, but then again... its _your_ call. I also don't think you should be angry with your family for not supporting your current desicion to R... after all, you were the one who involved them in the first place. They don't want to see you get hurt again, that's all. They're sticking-up for you, only to see _you_ betray _them_ now... see what I mean. Good Luck... you're gonna need it.


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## ilovemywife7 (Mar 6, 2011)

wow BL have been of this site for a while but really pleased for you and your wife...hope it all works out dude


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## brighterlight (Aug 13, 2009)

ahhhmaaaan! said:


> I actually started reading about your situation from the "other" forum. Honestly, I feel like she's just settling again... especially because she needs somenone now, due to her medical conditions. My problem with this whole sordid affair is- What if she reverts to her volatile ways again because... say you gained another pound; or didn't give her the attention she feels she deserves. In my opinion, its a reconciliation done out of _convenience_(for her). I would hate for you to put in so much work, only to be in the same rut six months from now. She seems to be waffling a bit. She wants to find herself, but yet she wants some form of stability(you). I'm very suspicious on her motives, but then again... its _your_ call. I also don't think you should be angry with your family for not supporting your current desicion to R... after all, you were the one who involved them in the first place. They don't want to see you get hurt again, that's all. They're sticking-up for you, only to see _you_ betray _them_ now... see what I mean. Good Luck... you're gonna need it.


AM, that is what I think also, but quite honestly not what I want down deep inside. I am hoping that another chance for us, if we can be different, will find us in a better happier place. Yes, I know there is always risk involved. There's risk involved in getting married from the get go; we just don't realise it until we start to get complacent with our SO. I know that my parents mean well and are showing their support for me and you are right, they will probably feel betrayed once they hear of the R, I am placing my marriage above all but God. I may very well lose and find myself back in the same situation a few months up the road and I will be all on my own since I doubt my parents and the kids will support me knowing that I changed last time but I just have to do what my heart is telling me to do right now. I am willing to risk everything except my health, integrity, and dignity for her love and support and for our marriage.

Also, we are not out of the woods yet. We still need to hash several things out and those could get ugly if we don't establish game rules and boundaries before we talk.

But I want to have hope. Hope that she, and I, can change our attitudes towards each others weakness.

We had a small incident yesterday that pissed her off a little. I was thinking - aww sh**t, here we go again, but no, she just stayed a little mad and went to sleep (not good, I know). This morning she seemed to be over it for the most part. It was really stupid what happened last night but I guess to her it was important in the fact that I sort of cut her off from her opinion. Anyway, she was watching a show on the OWN Oprah network (there's a history with me with respect to Oprah - I think she is the devil incarnate and I hold her accountable for contributing in a small way to our D, LOL!) with Dr. Phil (Another I don't care to watch - I would much rather read other experts). Anyway, my W likes to watch stuff on OWN and I have nothing but respect for her, I do not criticize her for that, it makes her happy and that is great, I just simply don't watch it and she knows how I feel about OWN. So, Dr. Phil has a couple talking about their intimacy issues, I am picking up bits and pieces because I am sitting on the bed taking care of some work emails. Well, during the show, my W turns to me and says, "you should watch this with me, maybe you/we can learn something. OK, I got that, she wants me to listen to this couple and how Dr. Phil suggests acting with each other for more intimate sex. But here's is the part that had me feeling a bit offended by the show - It was Dr. Phil telling the guy/husband on there what his wife needed from him, how she felt like she was just a housekeeper, how she needed intimacy, blah, blah, blah. So when my wife asked me to watch, my stupid response to her was, "well, how about for once on these primarily female channels having someone tell the wife/girlfriend what it is HE needs to make HIM feel loved and happy. He is talking to that guy like men don't like sex and are not into wanting to recieve intimacy as well and how we ignore our wives. We don't feel any more nor any less need for that than womem." Oh F did that start a **** storm in her mind. Maybe this isn't the best time for us to be discussing these issues.

As soon as I said that I realized, oh man, that is not where I want us to go right now nor how I meant it to come across. So, I reviewed my reaction in my mind and wrote down my feelings at that moment in my journal so I can revisit my thoughts and feelings at that moment to see if I can adjust to responding in a different manner next time - like I've said before, I am still working and learning how to become a better person. And that was but a brief and only instance in 3 months that I have responded that way. I felt so bad but at the same time, in my mind I am thinking that I am tired of us guys being sh**t on all the time with this I don't care about your feelings stigma that a lot of women have put on us. I wonder if they have any idea how strongly/deeply we men love, desire and care about them, AND how we need that in return - I don't think many of them do so it becomes offensive to me sometimes.

Anyway, the reason for the incident was really stupid but how she felt I treated her request at that time was genuine and I know I need to respect that. I apologized. I told her that we are both still on a learning curve and that what we are working towards will not come overnight. At least this morning she said to me that she realized that I was honestly sorry for my sudden spew last night. I just hope that she understands that I am truly sorry for the way I answered her wish and desire but that I am not sorry for feeling that most of those shows are geared toward woman and I think the spin is to help them through certain times. I wish she had some magic wand that would let her know that I need to know that she knows that this is 100% a two way street and not a one way street.

I took a lot of playing second fiddle for many many years, I won't do it again. If I am not shown that I matter, I won't stay.

Isn't this just ridiculous? I really don't want to sound petty but I wanted to get this out on here. I just want her to understand that it isn't just about how she feels. Yes, that is a top priority and at the top of the importance list, but I should there too or we won't work.

To be fair, I am noticing some changes in her that are positive and I like them, I've told her that. When I see her react differently from before on some things, I feel like she is really trying to work on us to be better and I feel a bit of joy because before I was not used to being important enough to her to get her change her opinion, demeanor, nor reactions towards me. She acted as if she was always right. Understanding and having empathy for the reasons for many things that did to keep our family safe was not part of her repitiore. I am hoping for a different and better future.


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## ahhhmaaaan! (Mar 26, 2011)

Sounds like you're going to be walking-on-eggshells for a while. I really hope it turns out for the both of you... just be aware that you have needs also, and she should'nt neglect them either.


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## brighterlight (Aug 13, 2009)

ahhhmaaaan! said:


> Sounds like you're going to be walking-on-eggshells for a while. I really hope it turns out for the both of you... just be aware that you have needs also, and she should'nt neglect them either.


Yeah, I think you are right about the eggshells. I am definitely going to have to get a balanced relationship. I am not giong through more years of misery. At least I have learned enough with this experience to know that I can be fine on my own if I have to. I would rather not, I still love her very much, but I won't give up my happiness this time around - it just won't work for me; and I don't think she would like me unhappy either so we will see.

Thanks for your input, I know it'll be careful stepping for now. Hopefully we can both help each other through that.


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