# Husband refuses to stay out of family's financial problems



## kittykatz

Ok, here is the story. 

Today, my husband got a called from his mom's sister, telling him that his mom got a notice in the mail saying that the bank is going to sell her house to pay for back taxes. Apparently, for the past 3 years, his mom hasn't been paying taxes on her house. She lives there with her 18 year old son, who is a senior in high school. Neither one of them have jobs. Their only source of income as a social security check, which she started receiving several years ago after her husband died. 

We've known shes been having trouble with her house for a while. A couple months ago when we were at her house, we saw a man outside taking pictures... he said he worked for the bank. When my husband asked her why theres a man from the bank taking pictures of her house she admitted that she "thought" she was a month late on her payment. 

Well since my husband's aunt lives on the same property as his mom's house, she decided that if his mom couldn't afford the payments, that she would take over payments for her.... Because if his mom loses her house, that means his aunt will lose her house too... and she didnt want this to happen. So she agreed to take over payments. I was hopeful that this would solve the problem and this would be the end of it. Unfortunately, I was wrong. 

My husband's mom failed to tell us that she hadn't been paying taxes for the past 3 years, and so, now she is about to have her house taken from her, and so will his aunt. The only way out of it is if they can come up with $5000 to give to the bank. Of course, his aunt doesn't have the money, neither does his mom, and apparently none of his other family members either. So my husband's aunt calls him, I guess hoping that we would have the money. Sadly we dont have $5000 laying around and even if we did, I wouldn't give it to them. 

Frankly, its starting to get on my nerves that everytime something is going on with that house, my aunt always calls my husband and tells him about it. We live in North Carolina, they live in Georgia.... we're 400 miles away. We don't live in that house, we don't live anywhere near there, we have our own problems. We aren't burdening them with them, so why is it fair that we should have to be burdened with theirs? We didnt get them into that situation so why should it be our responsibility to get them out of it?

My husband's mom has a drinking problem, and for the past several years my husband has been trying to get her to get a job. She says she wants one but yet it doesn't look like shes putting much effort into getting one. She missed a couple of her house payments a few years ago and owed the bank $1000... my husband was making more money at that time, and we had the money in the bank, so he gave it to her so she wouldnt lose her house, even though I told him I didnt approve. He said it was only a "one time thing" and that she just made a mistake... and that it wouldnt happen again. I knew right then that it wouldnt be the end of it.. and I was right. Here we are a few years later, and his moms in the same predicament, about to get her house taken away and wanting someone to bail her out. I wouldn't have had as much of a problem giving his mom money if it truly was a one time thing, but Im sure as hell not going to support someone who is fully capable of supporting themselves.

The thing is, my husband acknowledges that theres no help for his mom and that the only person that can change her is herself. As of right now, she doesnt realize that she has a problem... and as long as people keep handing her money, shes not going to realize it. I think maybe if she loses her house and hits rock bottom, maybe itll be her wake up call. The thing I dont understand is that my husband will say something like this... and then he will turn right around and talk about taking out a loan for $5000 so she wont lose her house. 

When he got off the phone with his aunt today, he told me that maybe his brother would could take out a loan for the money if he doesnt have it. He told me that his brother has no credit.... he pays everything with cash, he has no car loans, no credit cards, nothing... so how is someone with no credit going to get a $5000 loan!?? He mentioned that if he needed to, he could cosign with his brother. My first thought when he told me this was.... Are you kidding me????!!

He has had bad experiences before when it comes to cosigning with people so you'd think he would have learned his lesson. My husband and I have only been married for almost 3 years, we are currently living in my parent's rental house. My parent's do well financially, and since they dont necessarily need the money, they offered to let us stay here for rent free for the next few years so that we can save up money quicker and use it to put as a down payment on our own house. 

I feel like my parents are giving us this great opportunity that we SHOULD be taking advantage of but at times I feel like my husband is just completely wasting it.

I can't help but think to myself, how are we ever going to get our own house or get anywhere in life if my husband doesn't learn to separate himself from his family's financial situations? Correct me if Im wrong but when you get married, aren't you supposed to put your spouse first? If my husband gets a loan with his brother, and his brother ends up not being able to make payments (which wouldnt surprise me at all), then we're going to be responsible. Thats money that we could be saving to put towards a house, and instead its going toward his mom and aunt's house. And I just about guarantee you, in a few years from now, shes going to be in the same situation. Whats he going to do then? Take out another $5000 a loan? 

Not to mention, if for whatever reason we can't pay the payment, its going to screw up his credit. His logic is "Well we still have your credit. We should still be able to get a house with our combined income as long as yours is good". Its true that my credit is decent, and we'd still probably be able to get a loan on a house with my credit alone, but Im pretty sure we'd get a better deal and our chances would be increased if both of us had good credit. 

He just recently got his motorcycle paid off, and Im excited about that because it was costing us an extra $200 a month or somewhere around there. We even got our cable cut off which is saving us another $100.... but Im starting to wonder whats the point in trying to save money if everytime we get rid of a debt, hes just going to go out and add on another debt. He says he thinks that it would be fine and that his brother would be able to make the payment.... somehow I doubt that, and if he doesn't make the payments then we're screwed. Then we have two options... either we pay it, or let it mess up my husband's credit. Is it really worth the risk? It certainly isn't to me.

Im trying really hard to not spend money, in hopes that someday my husband and I can get out of here and get a place of our own... but it just doesnt seem like hes on the same page. I'm just worried that 10 years from now, we're still going to be here, and still not have any money because my husband is too busy trying to take care of his family's problems. He already went against my wishes the first time that he gave his mom money... but if he does this, despite knowing that I don't approve, thats really going to cause problems for us. He fails to realize that whenever he does things like this, it effects me just as much as it effects him. Ive talked to my parents about this and they've both agreed that they would never cosign with anyone without their spouse's consent. They said something like this isn't something to be taken lightly and that it should be a joint decision. If I wanted to do something like this and my husband disagreed, I absolutely would not do it... because my husband is the most important person to me and its not worth causing problems between us. 

Its getting to the point where I just dont see us being together much longer if he keeps disregarding my feelings, and putting his family before us. Ive been putting up with it for a while, but I can't put up with 10 or 20 more years of this. Something is going to have to change. I really have been trying to be tolerant of his family and Ive been trying my best to be as lenient as possible, but this is something I just can't ignore and keep quiet about. 

His mom hasnt been paying taxes for 3 years for crying out loud... she has known all this time, that this was going to happen.... yet over these 3 years, she has been doing absolutely nothing. She hasnt gotten a job, it doesnt even look like shes tried to save money... it looks like she blows every penny that she has on beer and cigarettes. Last time I visited her, she sent me and my husbands aunt out to the store to buy a 12 pack of beer.... it was maybe a day later and she was already sending his aunt out to get more. She could have cut back on the cigarettes and beer, and I am almost positive she could have saved up $5000 by now. I just think its completely unfair that my husband and I should be expected to help someone who isnt even doing anything to help themselves. I get the feeling that my husband almost thinks its greedy to save money. Its not greedy... if everyone in the world blew every cent they made and had no desire to save it, noone would have anything.... People who save their money and accomplish their goals should be PROUD of themselves... not feel guilty about it.. and certainly not feel obligated to give money to people who don't deserve it. I'm not trying to bash his mom... I'm just telling you how it is. Trust me, it doesn't give me pleasure in knowing that she has no self control or sense of how to manage her money... I'd love more than anything in the world to know that she is self sufficient and to never have to worry about her needing money from us ever again. 

My husband likes to make up excuses for her... and I don't blame him. Im sure its very embarrassing and probably painful to see your own mother drinking constantly and making such foolish decisions. But the fact is, my parents didnt have easy lives either. They grew up poor, my mom was physically and emotionally abused, my dad's father (stepfather or whatever you want to call him) was an alcoholic. When my dad was 13, his mom told him that the man who he called his dad, was actually not his biological father. My parents childhoods certainly weren't all sunshine and rainbows... but instead of feeling sorry for themselves they had the strength to rise above that. So just because his mom had a tough life, doesn't make her any different from anyone else, and it certainly does not excuse her behavior or her decisions. 

I think my husbands just trying to find a way to rescue his mom but I keep trying to tell him that its never going to end. There are some people that you just can't help. She hasnt changed since the last time my husband gave her money and she isn't going to change this time either. Like I said, I think the only thing that will possibly snap her into reality is if loses everything and she hits rock bottom. 

I dont know where his mom and aunt are going to live but its not my problem and I'm not going to stress about it. They should be able to figure something out between themselves. Theres no reason to drag us into it when we have nothing to do with the situation and we have our own problems. 

If my husband does this, all I can say is he better not be surprised when we start to have problems because of it later on down the road... theres only so much that one can put up with before they get fed up. If he wants to keep supporting his family and not have to consult anyone about it, he doesnt need to be married. He just needs to be single and go live with his family and take care of them... and let me be on my way so I can find someone who will put our marriage first, so that we can actually get somewhere in life.

What would you do if your spouse cosigned with someone despite your disapproval? Knowing what Ive told you about the situation, do you blame me for not wanting him to do this? Is there anything that I can possibly say to get through to him?!

Please, no rude comments. Be honest but please don't be rude. I'm just sincerely concerned about us and our future together and I want our marriage to last. Thank you for your time.


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## EleGirl

I get your frustration. 

My mom could not manage money at all. She did not drink or smoke. But she would spend every penny she had and then more. 

Finally we took control of it. Her SS and retirement checks were deposited into her bank account. We sort of made my mom add my sister to her accounts. Then my sister managed the money and paid the bills. Every month my sister would send me checks for each week's spending money. I'd cash it and give the cash to my mom.

once we did that my mom not only had no money problems but she had money saved up. Her life was much better for it. She fought us at first. But after a while the relented and appreciated that she lived with out the chaos that she created for herself.

Your husband has a problem.. he's a good guy who loves his family. And his family is imposing on him. If he is going to help, the best way would be if his mother let him take some control. 

He could pay her bills, even a loan for $5K. And she'd only get the cash that was left to spend on cigs and booz.

It's not a solution for every one. But it's one that is not as crazy making as just throwing cash at her... or watching her the brother be thrown out on the street.

You married a man with a questionable family. YOu basicaly want him to walk away from them or at least keep them at a distance. He did not agree to do that before you married. It's going to be very hard to get him to do it now.

One thing that I wonder about is that he left a higher paying job to live in NC near your parents. Then your parents give you a place with no rent so you could save.

but it seems you had more free cash with him working the higher paying job and paying rent.

So it seems this is not just about saving. Because if it was, it sounds like you both were better off financiall, and more able to save living in Georgia. But you were fine with ging that up to be near your family.


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## Maneo

Elegirl makes some excellent points. Is this issue really something that would cause you to end the relationship?


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## kittykatz

EleGirl said:


> I get your frustration.
> 
> My mom could not manage money at all. She did not drink or smoke. But she would spend every penny she had and then more.
> 
> Finally we took control of it. Her SS and retirement checks were deposited into her bank account. We sort of made my mom add my sister to her accounts. Then my sister managed the money and paid the bills. Every month my sister would send me checks for each week's spending money. I'd cash it and give the cash to my mom.
> 
> once we did that my mom not only had no money problems but she had money saved up. Her life was much better for it. She fought us at first. But after a while the relented and appreciated that she lived with out the chaos that she created for herself.
> 
> Your husband has a problem.. he's a good guy who loves his family. And his family is imposing on him. If he is going to help, the best way would be if his mother let him take some control.
> 
> He could pay her bills, even a loan for $5K. And she'd only get the cash that was left to spend on cigs and booz.
> 
> It's not a solution for every one. But it's one that is not as crazy making as just throwing cash at her... or watching her the brother be thrown out on the street.
> 
> You married a man with a questionable family. YOu basicaly want him to walk away from them or at least keep them at a distance. He did not agree to do that before you married. It's going to be very hard to get him to do it now.
> 
> One thing that I wonder about is that he left a higher paying job to live in NC near your parents. Then your parents give you a place with no rent so you could save.
> 
> but it seems you had more free cash with him working the higher paying job and paying rent.
> 
> So it seems this is not just about saving. Because if it was, it sounds like you both were better off financiall, and more able to save living in Georgia. But you were fine with ging that up to be near your family.


My husband was actually the one who said he wanted to move here. He said he always wanted to live in NC because he loves the mountains and the scenery. I always thought itd be nice to live here near my parents but I didnt push the issue. I was content living in Georgia. We didnt move until HE said that he wanted to... and the reason that we aren't saving as much money now as we were in Georgia is because my husband has a different job. He makes half of what he did at his other job. When we first moved, we didn't plan on him taking a pay cut. We have lived in NC for 2 years and he didnt take a paycut until about a year ago.

So its not that I "gave up" anything to be closer to my parents. In fact, for a while there we were making MORE money than we were in Georgia... because when we lived in Gerogia, my husband was the only one working... I didnt have a job.

When we moved up here, I started working at my dad's restaurant and my husband was driving for a trucking company, making almost as much as he was at his old job... so actually for the first year that we lived here, we WERE saving money and were doing even better than we were before.

We didn't start not saving as much money until about a year ago when my husband got fed up with driving a truck and HE decided to quit and start working for my dad. It was an over the road job, which meant he had to be gone 5 days a week, which wasnt something he was used to. He liked the money but eventually he just got sick of having to be away from the house and being away from me... so he decided to just quit and start working for my dad. So he was the one who "gave up" making more money in order to have more home time. I didn't think it would be a bad idea, and I was in fact looking forward to seeing him more... but I dont think neither one of us realized just how much of a paycut it really would be. 

However, here lately, my husband has been missing the money more and more... and hes decided that he wants to go back into trucking and to find something local so that he doesnt have to be gone all week. He found a company that was hiring so he put in an application, and they actually called him in for an interview last week. He said that the interview went great and that the guy seemed very interested in him, so we're thinking theres a good chance he will get the job. If by some chance he doesnt get this one, hes going to be persistent and keep trying until he finds something. Trucking jobs are not hard to find... my husband has his CDL, he has years of experience, no tickets and no accidents on his record. Theres no telling how many applications this company had in, but out of all the applications, his was one that stood out and he was one of the people that they called in for an interview... so its not like he cant get another good paying trucking job. Most trucking companies practically rip his arm off.

So in all likeliness, its not going to be long and my husband is going to be making plenty of money again... and Im excited about it because Im looking forward to saving up money again... but at the same time it worries me because Im afraid that the minute that we save up a few thousand dollars, hes going to be handing it over to his family. I have no doubt that if we had $5000 cash in the bank, he wouldnt hesitate to give it to his mom. I just dont know how many times he has to give her money to see that she is a lost cause. 

I think having someone take over her finances for her could possibly work... I never understood how someone could go out and buy beer before knowing if they have enough money for their house payment.... whats more important? Beer or a place to live? Any logical person would know the answer to that. She is stubborn and like I said, shes convinced she doesnt have a problem... so I doubt she'd let anyone do something like that. She wouldn't even tell anyone how much her SS check is... probably because if we knew how much income she gets, we'd be able to figure out how much she blows on ciggs and beer each month. She tries to keep it all private. What I dont understand is why my husband's aunt hasnt tried to do anything like this.... shes the one living there on the property with her... we have nothing to do with any of it. 

It doesnt give me satisfaction to think of his mom and his aunt living on the street, but I dont really see that happening. There are relatives they could live with... my husband's brother lives right next to them, he will still have his house... its a big house with plenty of room. They could live with him.... and hes not the only relative. My husband has plenty of aunts/ uncles/ cousins that they could stay with. Not to mention, theres homeless shelters... sure its not ideal. Theyre not going to WANT to live in a homeless shelter... but if it comes down to that and they dont have any other choice, its better than sleeping on the sidewalk... you do what you have to do. Maybe if she had to live in a homeless shelter for a while and see that its not fun, that might actually motivate her to do something with her life. 

I dont know why my husband thinks the way that he does and I dont get his logic sometimes... but he acts almost like he feels guilty whenever hes making good money... because he says there are so many people out there who dont have money... and that just makes no sense to me. If you have accomplished something and you are doing good for yourself, you should be proud... not feel guilty. He almost acts like he doesnt deserve the things that hes accomplished... and I think he feels that he owes it to his family to help them. Its weird. I dont know whats going on in his head anymore. 

I honestly just think the only thing he can do is back off and let her deal with this mess that shes gotten herself into. She needs to realize that she can't keep sitting around the house all day, squandering her money and getting herself into these predicaments and then counting on someone else to get her out of it. Thats not the way life works. She needs to take responsibility for her own actions. I think thats the best type of "help" he could give her. Throwing money at her might solve the situation temporarily, just like it has before, but in the end she will still wind up in the same spot because she knows that someone will always be there to bail her out.

I really hope he doesnt disregard my opinion on this and take out that loan... but I have to wonder, seeing as he has given money before knowing that I didnt want him to. All I can say is that if he does, I am going to be extremely pissed... and also hurt! Because if the situation were reversed, I would never do something like that without his consent... we're supposed to be a team. You just can't make such decisions and completely ignore your spouse's feelings. There are some things that aren't a big enough deal to require your spouse's approval, but this definitely is. I guess Ill just have to make it clear that if its worth causing problems between us, then he should go for it.... I guess it'll show just how important I am and our marriage is to him.


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## kittykatz

Maneo said:


> Elegirl makes some excellent points. Is this issue really something that would cause you to end the relationship?


Im not saying that if he does this, Im going to threaten to leave him... Im just saying that if he continues to help out his mom, and while she continues to do nothing for herself, and we end up not getting anywhere in life because of it, yes I will eventually reach my breaking point and say enough is enough.

I'm not going to be with someone who puts his family before me. Its as simple as that... and I honestly dont think Im being unreasonable. Its not like we've been married for half a century and we've already made our life together and bought the house that we want, etc.... 

My point is we havent even begun to build a life together... and how are we ever going to if he keeps letting his mom stand in the way? Thats not fair to me or to us.... and whenever we have kids, it isnt going to be fair to them either. How are we going to give our kids the best life possible if he wants to hand over money to his family anytime that they ask?


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## Wiltshireman

OP,

I would imagine that this issue is causing your husband just as much if not more worry than it is causing you. His mother, brother and aunt are at risk of having their home sold out from under them and he wants to help but he knows that by doing so he could delay buying a home for yourselves.

If possible get your husband to sit down with his mother’s accounts and see if there is enough money coming in that if properly controlled they could afford to pay their way and cope with the loan repayments. It maybe that his mother does not know how to run her finances and just needs the push to sort herself out. If their budget can cover the loan then co signing a loan with his brother could be an answer. Yes there are risks but the fact that he wants to help should reassure you as to the loyal / reliable man you have picked.

Please do not force your husband to pick between you and his mother as he loves you both.

After my parents’ divorce I paid a monthly allotment to my mum for 10 years whilst my younger brothers were still growing up and then once they had left home my sister and I moved my mum into a smaller place that she could afford on her own. Luckily for me I was single and serving in the military at that time so I did not have my own family to support.


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## Maneo

Be careful forcing you husband to decide between his family and you. Yes, his marriage and his family that is the two of you should come first. But a man only ever has one mother and those connections run deep. If he feels cornered with an ultimatum, it could get ugly. Look for compromise that keeps you and he first but allows some help for his family.


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## kittykatz

Wiltshireman said:


> OP,
> 
> I would imagine that this issue is causing your husband just as much if not more worry than it is causing you. His mother, brother and aunt are at risk of having their home sold out from under them and he wants to help but he knows that by doing so he could delay buying a home for yourselves.
> 
> If possible get your husband to sit down with his mother’s accounts and see if there is enough money coming in that if properly controlled they could afford to pay their way and cope with the loan repayments. It maybe that his mother does not know how to run her finances and just needs the push to sort herself out. If their budget can cover the loan then co signing a loan with his brother could be an answer. Yes there are risks but the fact that he wants to help should reassure you as to the loyal / reliable man you have picked.
> 
> Please do not force your husband to pick between you and his mother as he loves you both.
> 
> After my parents’ divorce I paid a monthly allotment to my mum for 10 years whilst my younger brothers were still growing up and then once they had left home my sister and I moved my mum into a smaller place that she could afford on her own. Luckily for me I was single and serving in the military at that time so I did not have my own family to support.


Just to be clear, its just my husband's mom and aunt/her husband that will be losing their homes.... the only reason my husband is bringing his brother into it is because his brother lives right next door, and because his brother supposedly owes his mom some money.... I dont know how much... but Im guessing he thinks that since his brother already owes his mom money, that he wouldnt mind helping her... but like I said, he has no credit so in order to take out a loan, my husband would have to cosign. 

Youre right... he is worried about it... hes worried about it because everytime something happens, his aunt is the first one to call him up and tell him all about it... how could he not worry about it? Its not even his problem but they make it his problem. I wouldn't want my parents living on the street or in a homeless shelter either... but at the same time, if I had my own husband and family to take care of, I'd have to put them first. 

You mentioned you were single when you were helping your mom out.... if you didn't have anyone else to take care of other than yourself, then I see no problem helping your mom out if thats what you choose to do... but when you have a spouse, you have to take their feelings into consideration. You cant just say screw them and do what you want to do. Its a partnership. Thats why I say Im starting to think that maybe my husband just isnt the kind of person that needs to be married. I think he needs to just go live with his mom and be single and then he can take care of her all he wants, without having to ask for anyone's approval. He was letting his dad live with him before he met me... and if it werent for my insistence that he moved out, he'd probably still be living with us. He seemed perfectly content living with his dad.... maybe he should have just kept living with him and not have gotten married. Im starting to think he'd be happier just living with family than living with me. 

He is very loyal.... and thats a good trait to have... but when it gets to the point where it causes problem in your marriage, I think that should tell you that maybe you're overdoing it a little.


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## PBear

There can be a fine line between helping and enabling... Does your husband exhibit the same kind of behaviour with other people, or just his family?

As others have suggested, maybe the solution is to try to help, but with conditions. Like taking over her finances. Or maybe, it's time for her to let the house go and move into a place she can afford...

C


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## kittykatz

Maneo said:


> Be careful forcing you husband to decide between his family and you. Yes, his marriage and his family that is the two of you should come first. But a man only ever has one mother and those connections run deep. If he feels cornered with an ultimatum, it could get ugly. Look for compromise that keeps you and he first but allows some help for his family.


Ive been trying my best to compromise.... I really have. I didn't make that big of a fuss about it when he let his mom borrow money a couple years ago... I told him I didnt like it.. but I didnt threaten to leave him for it or anything. 

I didnt like it but I knew he wanted to help her out, so I dealt with it and hoped that it would just be a one time thing like he said it would be... even though i had a feeling it wouldnt be. 

But now we're in the same situation except this time its even more money that she needs.... instead of $1000, its $5000.... It makes me wonder how much is it going to be next time? $10,000? $20,000?

Hell, why dont we just take out a loan for $100,000 and give it all to her? Then she can pay off her house, buy all the beer she wants and be set for life, and will never have ask us for money ever again! Forget the fact that we'll be paying the loan payment for the next 50 years, and will probably never be able to afford to buy a house of our own, but oh well, at least his mom will be taken care of.


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## kittykatz

PBear said:


> There can be a fine line between helping and enabling... Does your husband exhibit the same kind of behaviour with other people, or just his family?
> 
> As others have suggested, maybe the solution is to try to help, but with conditions. Like taking over her finances. Or maybe, it's time for her to let the house go and move into a place she can afford...
> 
> C


My husband is just naturally a kind hearted, compassionate person... hes the type that will lend a friend $10 or $15 here and there... or if he sees a homeless person sitting outside of mcdonalds, he will give them his food and go buy himself something else... but he doesnt give people ANYTHING compared to what he gives his family. When it comes to his family, there isnt anything he wouldnt do for them.

He even mentioned a few months ago that we could possibly take out a loan to buy a few acres of her land.. and then give the money to her so she could pay whats left on her house... (She still owes like $40,000 on it) but I didnt want any part of this and I certainly wasnt putting MY name on any of that mess and possibly ruining MY credit. Plus I think he found out that something like that wouldnt be possible anyway... the bank owns the land... so if you wanted to sell a part of it, Im pretty sure the bank would have to agree to that. 

Just for arguments sake, I entertained his little idea... and I asked him "So what happens if we can't get the land to sell? Then we're just stuck with the payments.... or what if we cant get as much out of it as we wanted.. then we end up losing money"... to me, there is just too much risk involved to get involved and its not worth it. 

Like I said, I doubt she'd let anyone into her finances because she likes to keep all that stuff private.... The reason why she hasnt sold the place yet is because when he husband died, he basically left the house to their son instead of her.... He left her a trust... and it said that she pretty much has to live there and keep paying the payments until her son is 20 something years old or something like that, and then the house goes to him. 

But at least if she loses the place, she can move into a cheap apartment or something more affordable and maybe then she wont have so much trouble.... although with someone like her, it might not matter how low her rent is... her rent could be $50 a month but it doesnt matter if you spend 90% of your income on garbage that you dont need. Youre still going to come up short at the end of the month. Its all about knowing how to manage money.


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## PBear

How much is the house worth? Is there equity that can be taken out to pay for the back taxes? Why can't she sell a few acres of her land to someone else? Who knows the details about the trust and the inheritance? It sounds bizarre to me... Does she own the house or not? At the rate she's going, she's going to lose the house one way or another anyway. Her keeping control of her finances may be a luxury she can no longer afford, if she wants help. 

What does the other son think about all this? The one that will "inherit" the house, assuming its not sold off.

It seems like your husband doesn't understand how big a deal this is for you... Have you two tried any form of counselling to get some help mediating the issue?

C


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## kittykatz

Im thinking the house and property is around $100,000... maybe 150,000 but nomore than that. I know for sure that she only owes 40,000. Not sure about the equity, ill have to ask my husband about that. The reason why we don't think she would be able to sell some of her land is because the bank still owns the land... its not paid off. I asked my parents about it and they said they didn't think she would be able to do that without getting the banks approval... I don't know. Even if they would do it, that's not something Id be interested in. She would need to try to sell it to someone other than us. The trust IS bizarre... she actually didn't find out about the trust until after he died. Im not sure whose name is on the house but its not hers.... its either her husbands name or her sons name. But basically the trust says she has to make sure that it gets paid off and when it does, it goes to her son. According to the trust she is not allowed to sell it. The only way she could get rid of it is to let the bank take it back. Part of me thinks maybe she is purposely trying to get the house taken away because she feels resentment toward him for not leaving her the house... maybe she just doesn't want to keep paying for a house that isn't hers and will never be hers. My husband and I have never been to counseling but if it came down to that I would do it.... I would never just give up on us without trying my best to work it out... and her son doesn't really have much to say about anything. He's only 18 and is still in high school. Doesn't have a car, a job or anything... I've told my husband that it would be a big help if he could go get a job.. but he said he wants to avoid pushing him into getting a job because he's afraid that this will just make his mom want a job even less... because then she will just use her sons money to pay for her bills, and whatever else she wants. 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## PBear

Personally, I think the whole family should get together and talk about options. 

If the house is worth that much, then it might be possible to borrow money against it. But only by the person who actually owns the house. The mother can't do it if it's not her name on the title.

The youngest son is 18. Old enough to start making decisions and giving input on his future. After all, if someone doesn't step in, he's going to lose the house. And if he gets a job, he could use the money to pay the taxes and spending money. There would be no need to give her any of it.

C


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## EleGirl

kittykatz said:


> Im thinking the house and property is around $100,000... maybe 150,000 but nomore than that. I know for sure that she only owes 40,000. Not sure about the equity, ill have to ask my husband about that. The reason why we don't think she would be able to sell some of her land is because the bank still owns the land... its not paid off. I asked my parents about it and they said they didn't think she would be able to do that without getting the banks approval... I don't know. Even if they would do it, that's not something Id be interested in. She would need to try to sell it to someone other than us. The trust IS bizarre... she actually didn't find out about the trust until after he died. Im not sure whose name is on the house but its not hers.... its either her husbands name or her sons name. But basically the trust says she has to make sure that it gets paid off and when it does, it goes to her son. According to the trust she is not allowed to sell it. The only way she could get rid of it is to let the bank take it back. Part of me thinks maybe she is purposely trying to get the house taken away because she feels resentment toward him for not leaving her the house... maybe she just doesn't want to keep paying for a house that isn't hers and will never be hers. My husband and I have never been to counseling but if it came down to that I would do it.... I would never just give up on us without trying my best to work it out... and her son doesn't really have much to say about anything. He's only 18 and is still in high school. Doesn't have a car, a job or anything... I've told my husband that it would be a big help if he could go get a job.. but he said he wants to avoid pushing him into getting a job because he's afraid that this will just make his mom want a job even less... because then she will just use her sons money to pay for her bills, and whatever else she wants.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Maybe she's upsest that her husband left the house to their young son.. saying that she has make the payments but the son gets it.

I wonder if that's part of the issue.


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## FryFish

I think kittykatz and her husband are a bad match... Her husband cares a great deal about family and has sacrificed a LOT for both his family AND kittykatz(you can claim it was your husbands idea to move next to your family until you are blue in the face but the fact is he moved there FOR you)... Kittykatz hasnt learned the burden of sacrifice yet and cannot appreciate what it means yet and therefore cannot appreciate the man that her husband is.


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## kittykatz

EleGirl said:


> Maybe she's upsest that her husband left the house to their young son.. saying that she has make the payments but the son gets it.
> 
> I wonder if that's part of the issue.


 im starting to think it could be... I know she was definitely hurt by the whole thing... maybe if she can't have the house she would rather just let the bank have it back.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## kittykatz

FryFish said:


> I think kittykatz and her husband are a bad match... Her husband cares a great deal about family and has sacrificed a LOT for both his family AND kittykatz(you can claim it was your husbands idea to move next to your family until you are blue in the face but the fact is he moved there FOR you)... Kittykatz hasnt learned the burden of sacrifice yet and cannot appreciate what it means yet and therefore cannot appreciate the man that her husband is.


 I never said he didn't move here for me... being close to my family was definitely a plus, but it wasn't the absolute only reason he came here. He came here MAINLY because he wanted to live in NC and because he always has... the fact that we would be near my parents was just a bonus. And if it weren't for him wanting to move, we would still be in georgia right now... like I said, I never pushed him into moving here or doing anything... I wasn't crazy about being away from my family but I did it anyway because I wanted to be with my husband and I put him first... if that meant living 400 miles away from family, so be it... that was MY sacrafice... so don't tell me I've never sacraficed anything for him. I lived in georgia for 2 years before he decided he wanted to move here...and we would have lived there for 10 years if thats how long he needed...You act like my husband is just the perfect husband and im some spoiled unappreciative wife who has never done anything for him.... its not the case. I've done plenty for him and I've sacraficed plenty for him. All I want in return is that he put us first so that we can actually get somewhere in life instead of letting his family drag us down. His mom got herself into this mess, she needs to get herself out of it instead of expecting us to always come along and save the day. If this makes me an awful, selfish wife then I think that's pretty screwed up.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## highwood

Honestly I can see why this can cause problems...I have lived it!

It can cause huge stress in a marriage. My H's dad was always after my H and his brother to either take a loan out for him or to give him money...because he did not want to work for anybody and wanted to try all these shady business ventures from these losers he would meet. This went on for years...finally started to peter out in the last 10 years..cause alot of problems for me. H and I would fight about it...he would get mad at me for even saying anything about it..I guess I was supposed to shut my mouth and keep a pleasant smile on my face..(gee your dad phoned again asking for money..how lovely)

I feel for you...it is a terrible situation to be in.


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## kittykatz

Id also like to add, my parents wanted me to go to college for another year... they wanted me to go for two years to get my assosicates degree, they were paying for it and everything... know what I did? I went for a year and said I was done... because I wanted to move to georgia and be with my husband... so there's another thing I sacraficed. As far as sacraficing anything for my parents, I don't think I've ever had to do that... my parents have always been the ones to sacrafice for me... they've never in my life asked me for money... and its not because they've just had everything handed to them. Its because they saved money and they set goals for themselves which they accomplished. My dads family members are similar to my husbands... most of them are moochers, always bumming my dad for money. Had he have given his family members money anytime they asked, my mom and him wouldn't be where they are today.
Fishfry, you don't seem to understand. This isn't just "hard times" that his mom is having... everyone has those. This has been going on for years. She has had more than plenty of time to get herself straightened out and instead she's done nothing. It would be one thing if she was actually putting for an effort... but she does nothing but sit on the couch all day and drink... not pay her taxes for 3 years, be late on her house payment and then expect others to get her out of her situation. All im asking is that she TRY. If I was in her situation I would have done something long ago... maybe if he hadn't have given her $1000 a few years ago, she wouldn't expect it out of him and maybe she would have done something by now. He thinks he's helping but all he's doing is making it worse.


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## kittykatz

highwood said:


> There is a difference between falling on hard times and being irresponsible and to keep expecting others to bail you out.


Thank you!!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## kittykatz

highwood said:


> Honestly I can see why this can cause problems...I have lived it!
> 
> It can cause huge stress in a marriage. My H's dad was always after my H and his brother to either take a loan out for him or to give him money...because he did not want to work for anybody and wanted to try all these shady business ventures from these losers he would meet. This went on for years...finally started to peter out in the last 10 years..cause alot of problems for me. H and I would fight about it...he would get mad at me for even saying anything about it..I guess I was supposed to shut my mouth and keep a pleasant smile on my face..(gee your dad phoned again asking for money..how lovely)
> 
> I feel for you...it is a terrible situation to be in.


Its nice to see someone who knows how I feel. Unless you've been in a marriage where you've experienced being constatnly dragged into your in laws financial problems, you really don't know what its like. My dad's father was the same way.. he was a drunk and he was always bumming off my dad. My dad started to see that it was causing problems between my mom and him.. and he realized there was nothing else he could do for him.. so finally he just had to break away from him and stop trying to help. Like I said, you can't help people who don't want to help themselves. My mom said if my dad hadn't have put his foot down, she would have left. That's how much stress it was causing.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## highwood

I do not blame you for being concerned...sometimes once you start giving out money then it becomes easier and easier for that person to keep asking. I agree with your feelings..I would be highly concerned as well. Like I said I have experienced it and know how stressful it can be. 

Sorry but maybe I am selfish for being frustrated and angry with a FIL who at the time our situation was that we had a baby and no money yet he thought nothing of phoning and trying to get H to take a loan out for him because he met some guy at the coffee shop that could turn $5,000.00 into $100,000.00..yeah right! Then when this keeps happening over and over..it does become annoying.

FIL even hit up his other son (my BIL) and his wife when she was 7 months pregnant to see if they could give him $3,000.00...so your son's wife is carrying your grandchild and all you care about is give me money because I met a guy who has a great business venture.


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## FryFish

Your situation is not even remotely close to "We live RENT FREE and if we dont help(like we are being helped) mother and aunt will be out on the street"... 

See the difference Highwood?


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## kittykatz

Ok fishfry you're so right. My parents are letting us live here rent free, so since we have no rent to pay, that just leaves us with tons of extra money... news flash! Even though we don't pay rent we still have power bill, internet bills, phone bills, car payments and on top of that we don't make much money. Why should we hand over the little money that we do have to someone like her? I guess you're insinuating that because my parents offered us free rent and we accepted, that we owe it to others to help them out. I don't mind as much to help someone who is TRYING to do better... but to just blindly keep tossing money at someone just so they can be in the same situation a year or two down the road, its just stupid. I would gladly help out my parents because i know that if they ever asked me for help, it would have to be an absolute emergency and I know that they wouldn't keep asking for it over and over. They would learn how to fix their own problems. Why would I help out someone like his mom? What has she done for me? She puts forth no effort at all, expects others to take care of her, and has been nothing but a moocher the whole time I've been married.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Wiltshireman

coffee4me said:


> If you love your husband (regardless of your feelings about his family). Help him to find a solution to help his mother instead of telling him to turn his back on her.


:iagree: Great advice for the OP.


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## highwood

Thinking about your situation is there a chance that you guys could put it in your names (only you and your H)...pay down the $40,000.00 and at the same time have the aunt and your MIL pay you guys a bit of rent whatever they can afford. This way you do own the property and as you are living rent free what you would have put into rent goes into paying down the 40,000.00 as well what the aunt and your MIL give you. So even though you are not living in the house you are still property/land owners and have control. Even put what money they can afford to pay you monthly into a separate bank account for taxes, repairs, etc. as well as for the future for yourselves.

Check into what the monthly payments would be on the loan over how many years you want....might not be too bad.

Then when the house gets sold one day you can get back your investment plus interest and if you choose give the 18 year old and your MIL a portion. This way you guys have control over the property/mortgage, etc.


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## highwood

I don't know what it is like in the states but in Canada here a 40,000 mortgage at about a 5% mortgage rate over 10 years would be about $500.00.


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## luv2luv

First time response on this forum, and it’s to your post kittykatz J

I have read your other thread where you talked about not wanting your husband’s family to visit, and that you didn’t understand why they couldn’t stay in a hotel (even though your husband said they couldn’t afford it) and your solution was they shouldn’t visit or be someone else’s problem when they do visit. You have also said in this thread that you don’t care if his family ends up in the street, or if they are helped by family as long as it not your husband it’s all good. I don’t understand how you think cousins/siblings should help her bur her own son shouldn’t.

I think that’s why it might be difficult for your husband or someone like me (who truly does care about being there for family in hard times) to come to an understanding. Some of us can’t comprehend the idea that our parents or siblings ending up in the street is not our problem or that we should just not give a damn. Loaning money for the purpose of business ventures as another poster described is something else (that is not survival money), but money that means his mother won’ t end up in a shelter is something else. That is why someone might have said you lack empathy because you seem to think that your husband because he loves you should just say “ah eff em” to everyone else.

It’s not about putting you behind someone else. An analogy I can think of (perhaps unfair) is that his mother needs to go to the hospital since she might die and since she didn’t make car payments, you would be ok with that and infact would be upset if he didn’t drive you to a pedicure appt because he put his mother first. It’s like that in this scenario. You think that even the possibly delay (it might not happen that way) of your house is worth more than his mother living in a shelter. You think your smallest wish should be a priority for him even over actual problems of his family.

I am not saying that you are a bad person, I am saying that you are a person who has no regard for his family if they fell off the face of the planet you wouldn’t care. But I would think you would understand a little more that he cares, because he loves them.

I know you said no rude responses so this was an attempt at a polite response disagreeing with you.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## EleGirl

Kittykatz,


I’ve been thinking about this situation and have an idea for you. Your approach to his mother/aunt asking for 5K as been that they are trying to get something out of you that they do not deserve because his mother, according to you, is a lazy undeserving person. And with that you have shut down. She is your husband’s mother. She will always be his mother. You chose to marry him so she is part of your family now as well. What you are missing is that there are always many ways to approach a situation. How about looking at one that will help his mother, his brother AND you? It’s also something of a tough love solution.


Here is something that you and your husband can do that would benefit you. Talk to his mother and his brother. His brother needs to know that the house becomes his in two years. Get the $5K however you can, even if it’s a loan. Pay off the taxes. Then they can refinance the home for 30 years. The deal is that when they refinance they will give back your $5K + “interest”. Let’s say they give you back a generous 50%, or $7,500. The refinance for $47,500 will be about $262.78 in payments. If they owe $5K for 3 years of unpaid taxes, their monthly tax bill is about $139. Have the taxes included as part of the monthly payment. So the monthly payment, Mortgage+ taxes, is $420. I doubt that the 5 people involved will be able to find apartments that cheap. Remember it’s aunt/uncle, mother, brother. That’s 3 apartments that would need to be rented.


http://www.mortgagecalculator.org/


Or they sell the house as soon as it’s transferred to his brother’s name and you get your $7.5K


Of course you and your husband get a written, notarized and signed agreement at the time that you pay the taxes that the house will be refinanced or sold in x number of months. You and your husband also talk to his younger brother about how to manage his money and make sure the house payments are made. Or if he sells the property, how to presser his profit so that it’s not just blown on new, fast cars.


Also, your husband can talk to his mother about him handling her finances to make sure the bills are paid. Once the bills are paid, all remaining $$ belongs to her to spend as she chooses.


If you do these things you have done a wonderful thing to help put his mother and brother on a much more financially secure footing. Yes his mother has problems. She may or may not get her act together. But you have to start from the reality of what is today. In all things come from love. Coming from love does not mean to let yourself be walked all over. But it does mean that when a problem is presented to you, you find a solution that makes things better for everyone. The solution I presented here does make it better for all of you. It takes advantage of no one.


Something to consider:


You say that his mother lives off of social security. Do you realize that social security is not much at all. If her husband was a very high earner, her SS payment might be $2,533 a month. It is probably a LOT less that. You are upset that she does not have a job. How many years was she a SAHM before her husband died? It’s VERY hard for a older woman with no recent job experience to get even a minimum wage job. You have no idea if she has or has not looked for a job. You have no idea what kind to obstacles this woman has run into. 


You talk about how your mother and father did so well, yada yada yada. Have you ever thought that maybe they are smarter than the average bear? Maybe most people are not so smart (I mean their brains do not work that well.) His mother, for some reason does not have the capacity to do what your parents did. She’s a very flawed person. But your husband still loves his mother. So find healthy ways to help when you can. Just do it in a way that does not drag you two down. There are ways to do this. I’ve and others have given you plenty of ideas.


Or, if you just don’t want to help her even if there are ways you can do it that would actually help YOU, then leave your husband. Let him find a life partner who is smart enough to come up with real and compassionate solutions like the ones I’ve suggested. Let him find a woman who share his level of love and compassion.


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## EleGirl

Kittykatz,
I’m posting this to you because you are so judgments and lacking in compassion for others. You seem to see yourself as being way more successful and superior than you are. It’s your parents who did well. You are not doing well at all. These high standards you hold others to, you are not even holding yourself to.


On another note. You keep talking about how your mother and father have done so well for themselves and made such good choices. And you keep putting your husband’s family own.


You really need to be very careful about putting people down for their bad choices. You see you will most likely never be a successful as your parents because you and your husband have been making very bad choices.


Your parents were willing to give you a paid for college education. So right there you chose to have a lower ability to earn and a more unstable life. The economy is getting more and more so that people without a college degree are finding it hard to find a job. The unemployment rate for people with no college degree, but high school diplomas is about 14%. For people with a bachelor’s degree, its 4.5%. So you have made the very kind of bad choice that you are critical of others for making.


Instead of getting a 4 year degree, you chose to drop out of school to move to another state to live with and marry some guy you met on the internet. This is a guy that you really did not know. And now that you are married to him, things just keep happening that are threatening both your marriage and your financial wellbeing. Your husband has stepped his earning ability down to 50% of what he made before. The two of you are living rent free and you cannot even save money. Now how is this a good choice?


You both are working for your father. So the only reason that you are doing half say ok is because your parents holding the two of you up financially. I can only imagine the kinds of talks they have between themselves about you and all the bad choices you have made in your life.


You are riding the ‘glory’ of your parent’s success. It’s not your success.. you have had not real successes of your own. You have put out very little effort to get ahead. Just as your brothers mooch off your parents, so are you. You just don’t live at home. You live in a home your parents own for free. This really makes you no different than your brothers.


You and your husband now work for your father. Again this is riding his coat tails. How would you be doing if you did not have your parents to take advantage of?


If you were my daughter I’d be kicking your hind end back to school or putting you out of my rent free home, I’d tell you to go find a job, get an education and find your own way in life. Your parents are not doing your brothers or you any favors by codling you. 


You and your husband could go to school full time right now on full financial aid, work at your parent’s restaurant and get degrees in fields that would lead to you both earning an income that would allow you to buy a house and have success that is not derived from mooching off your parents.


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## kittykatz

EleGirl said:


> Kittykatz,
> I’m posting this to you because you are so judgments and lacking in compassion for others. You seem to see yourself as being way more successful and superior than you are. It’s your parents who did well. You are not doing well at all. These high standards you hold others to, you are not even holding yourself to.
> 
> 
> On another note. You keep talking about how your mother and father have done so well for themselves and made such good choices. And you keep putting your husband’s family own.
> 
> 
> You really need to be very careful about putting people down for their bad choices. You see you will most likely never be a successful as your parents because you and your husband have been making very bad choices.
> 
> 
> Your parents were willing to give you a paid for college education. So right there you chose to have a lower ability to earn and a more unstable life. The economy is getting more and more so that people without a college degree are finding it hard to find a job. The unemployment rate for people with no college degree, but high school diplomas is about 14%. For people with a bachelor’s degree, its 4.5%. So you have made the very kind of bad choice that you are critical of others for making.
> 
> 
> Instead of getting a 4 year degree, you chose to drop out of school to move to another state to live with and marry some guy you met on the internet. This is a guy that you really did not know. And now that you are married to him, things just keep happening that are threatening both your marriage and your financial wellbeing. Your husband has stepped his earning ability down to 50% of what he made before. The two of you are living rent free and you cannot even save money. Now how is this a good choice?
> 
> 
> You both are working for your father. So the only reason that you are doing half say ok is because your parents holding the two of you up financially. I can only imagine the kinds of talks they have between themselves about you and all the bad choices you have made in your life.
> 
> 
> You are riding the ‘glory’ of your parent’s success. It’s not your success.. you have had not real successes of your own. You have put out very little effort to get ahead. Just as your brothers mooch off your parents, so are you. You just don’t live at home. You live in a home your parents own for free. This really makes you no different than your brothers.
> 
> 
> You and your husband now work for your father. Again this is riding his coat tails. How would you be doing if you did not have your parents to take advantage of?
> 
> 
> If you were my daughter I’d be kicking your hind end back to school or putting you out of my rent free home, I’d tell you to go find a job, get an education and find your own way in life. Your parents are not doing your brothers or you any favors by codling you.
> 
> 
> You and your husband could go to school full time right now on full financial aid, work at your parent’s restaurant and get degrees in fields that would lead to you both earning an income that would allow you to buy a house and have success that is not derived from mooching off your parents.


Firstly, I never said I was perfect and have never made mistakes... I realize that I should have gone to school... but guess what. Im still planning on going to school. I don't need my parents to put me through school. I could go back to school tomorrow if I wanted. I just havent decided yet if I want to go into something different or to continue on with my degree in what I was doing... but either way I AM going back... whether I have to take out student loans, pay for it through credit cards or do whatever I have to do. Ive already got one year out of the way, Ive only got one year left. Secondly, my husband makes $50,000 a year doing truck driving, which is more than most people who went to college for 4 years make.... so for him to go to school is not necessary. He already has a skill that he is good at and and makes good money in. I dont know if you missed the part about me saying he just went in for a job interview for a trucking company last week... but he did. He could go back to driving a truck anytime he wants and I wouldnt even HAVE to work for my parents... I could quit and we'd be taking care of ourselves just fine... just as we were while we lived in Georgia before we started working for my parents... so dont try to act like theres no way we can support ourselves without the help of my parents... we've done it before.

My parents would never "kick us out" because it was THEIR idea that we live here rent free in the first place....we didnt ask! and its not "mooching"... my brothers are in their 30s and arent even trying to get of the house... they spend any extra money they have on cars, motorcycles, etc... Im not doing that... Im actually trying to save money and get out. its an opprotunity for us to save money so that we can use it as a down payment on a house.... most kids dont get that kind of chance from their parents. Like I said we didnt realize it was going to be such a big paycut but it is... yes it was a mistake and i realize that... thats exactly why my husband is getting back into trucking.. and once he does, he will be making good money again and we will have enough saved up within the next couple of years to move out of here.

The difference between me and his mom is not that shes made mistakes and I havent... the difference is she is 50 years old and gotten nowhere in life.... Im 22.... Ive got my whole life ahead of me and Ive actually got a plan... by the time Im 50 years old, you better be damn sure Im going to be where I want to be. His mom quit work several years before her husband died and started living off his SS..... she didnt have to do that. She didnt have to just "settle" and live off SS.... she had the choice to do something with her life so that she would actually be somewhere by the time shes her age. Instead here she is.... shes only got a limited amount of time before her SS checks stop coming... and then shes going to be up the creek.... I do feel bad for her but Im sorry, she got herself into that mess.

Another thing that I failed to mention is that my husband still has a mortgage on our old house in georgia... for the time being, hes letting his cousin live in it and paying rent... the rent is 450 a month but his cousin can only afford 350.... so we are actually losing $100 a month on that house... and when his cousin moves out we are going to have to either pay the whole payment until it sells, or let it get foreclosed on. Thats another reason why we can't afford to tack on anymore payments at the expense of his mom.... If his cousin moves out of that house, and we dont want to let it screw up his credit, we've got to pay that $450 a month.... how are we going to be able to afford to pay that if we've taken out loans and all sorts of other things to try to help his mom? My point is we've already got plenty of responsibilities.

Anyway it doesnt matter.... the problem is fixed now. My husband's cousin, the same one who is living in our old house (he is also the aunt's son) is taking care of the situation.... and so is my brother in law.... apparently he got approved for a $5000 loan and isnt going to need a cosigner... although I dont know how because I was told he had no credit. The brother lives right next door, and supposedly he already owes his mom money anyway.... so to me, it makes more sense that he help instead of my husband. My husband has already helped her before.... its about time someone else does something and stop expecting him to do it all.


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## kittykatz

highwood said:


> Thinking about your situation is there a chance that you guys could put it in your names (only you and your H)...pay down the $40,000.00 and at the same time have the aunt and your MIL pay you guys a bit of rent whatever they can afford. This way you do own the property and as you are living rent free what you would have put into rent goes into paying down the 40,000.00 as well what the aunt and your MIL give you. So even though you are not living in the house you are still property/land owners and have control. Even put what money they can afford to pay you monthly into a separate bank account for taxes, repairs, etc. as well as for the future for yourselves.
> 
> Check into what the monthly payments would be on the loan over how many years you want....might not be too bad.
> 
> Then when the house gets sold one day you can get back your investment plus interest and if you choose give the 18 year old and your MIL a portion. This way you guys have control over the property/mortgage, etc.


Actually my husband mentioned doing something like this before but I didnt want to.... simply for the fact that I knew that if his mom and aunt couldnt afford to pay us in order to cover the loan payments, we'd be stuck with them.... and if we for whatever reason couldnt pay them, then our credit would be screwed. It was too big of a risk in my opinion... we're trying to eliminate our debts, not add more on.

My husband's cousin (the aunts son) apparently had the same idea about this though... just yesterday my husband called him and found out that the cousin is planning on trying to get my husbands mom to sign over the property to him... and then hes planning on taking out a $40,000 mortgage on it so that HE will be the owner.... and according to the aunt, she said she and her husband will pay for the loan payments since my husbands mom obviously cant. 

And my husbands brother got approved for a $5000 loan without needing a cosigner, so hes going to use that to cover the taxes that his mom hasnt been paying... hopefully if all goes well, his mom will sign over the property to the cousin... and as long as she does that, things should be fine. That way SHE isnt the one thats responsible for paying the payments anymore... which will be a good thing because shes obviously proven that she cant be trusted to pay the payments on time or pay the taxes.

Honestly, Im glad that some of my husbands other family members are helping out his mom.... up until this point, it seems like anytime something goes wrong, my husband is the one they call and hes the one that fixes their problems... and I dont think thats fair.


----------



## EleGirl

kittykatz said:


> Firstly, I never said I was perfect and have never made mistakes... I realize that I should have gone to school... but guess what. Im still planning on going to school. I don't need my parents to put me through school. I could go back to school tomorrow if I wanted. I just havent decided yet if I want to go into something different or to continue on with my degree in what I was doing... but either way I AM going back... whether I have to take out student loans, pay for it through credit cards or do whatever I have to do. Ive already got one year out of the way, Ive only got one year left.


You gave up a free education. So now it will be a further burden on your marital finances if you go back. That’s the point. My post was pointing out things you did that contributed to a drain on your finances now. Your response here proves my point.




kittykatz said:


> Secondly, my husband makes $50,000 a year doing truck driving, which is more than most people who went to college for 4 years make.... so for him to go to school is not necessary. He already has a skill that he is good at and and makes good money in. I dont know if you missed the part about me saying he just went in for a job interview for a trucking company last week... but he did. He could go back to driving a truck anytime he wants and I wouldnt even HAVE to work for my parents... I could quit and we'd be taking care of ourselves just fine... just as we were while we lived in Georgia before we started working for my parents... so dont try to act like theres no way we can support ourselves without the help of my parents... we've done it before.


You said that your husband NOW earns half of what he did before while driving a truck. He is not earning that now. The fact is that you depend on your parents to take care of you by living in one of their properties and both of you working at their restaurant. All the potential in the world does not change those facts.

As I recall your husband quit driving trucks because he hates it. So now he might go back to a job he hates because it’s the only choice he has?

Yes some people with college degrees (4 years not 2) earn $50,000 a year. But many chose career fields that pay a whole lot more than that. I have a degree and earn a few times that. What your degree is in matters greatly.



kittykatz said:


> My parents would never "kick us out" because it was THEIR idea that we live here rent free in the first place....we didnt ask! and its not "mooching"... my brothers are in their 30s and arent even trying to get of the house... they spend any extra money they have on cars, motorcycles, etc... Im not doing that... Im actually trying to save money and get out. its an opprotunity for us to save money so that we can use it as a down payment on a house.... most kids dont get that kind of chance from their parents. Like I said we didnt realize it was going to be such a big paycut but it is... yes it was a mistake and i realize that... thats exactly why my husband is getting back into trucking.. and once he does, he will be making good money again and we will have enough saved up within the next couple of years to move out of here.


So what if you did not ask. The fact is that you are doing it. Your parents are contributing to your financial life in a very serious manner. They can suggest anything. It’s your choice if you accept or not.

That’s right, most kids don’t get the kind of chance you are getting from your parents. Sometimes what looks like bad choices are that the person did not get the kind of help you are getting. You told us that you cannot save money now when you are not paying rent. So you are really not better than those in his family that you are putting down right so much.



kittykatz said:


> The difference between me and his mom is not that shes made mistakes and I havent... the difference is she is 50 years old and gotten nowhere in life.... Im 22.... Ive got my whole life ahead of me and Ive actually got a plan... by the time Im 50 years old, you better be damn sure Im going to be where I want to be. His mom quit work several years before her husband died and started living off his SS..... she didnt have to do that. She didnt have to just "settle" and live off SS.... she had the choice to do something with her life so that she would actually be somewhere by the time shes her age. Instead here she is.... shes only got a limited amount of time before her SS checks stop coming... and then shes going to be up the creek.... I do feel bad for her but Im sorry, she got herself into that mess.


Yes his mom got somewhere. She was a SAHM raising children when her husband died. That is considered a valid career for a woman. Or do you look down on SAHMs? It’s pretty hard to start over and get a career after being a SAHM for decades. How would you like to have to find a job at a late time in your life with no recent work experience? Yes she made some less than good decisions…. Just like you have. You are lucky that you are young and have time to repair what you have done. But don’t think that that the decisions are not going to affect you financially for years to come.

The lack of empathy is so overwhelming that it hurts to read. 




kittykatz said:


> Another thing that I failed to mention is that my husband still has a mortgage on our old house in georgia... for the time being, hes letting his cousin live in it and paying rent... the rent is 450 a month but his cousin can only afford 350.... so we are actually losing $100 a month on that house... and when his cousin moves out we are going to have to either pay the whole payment until it sells, or let it get foreclosed on. Thats another reason why we can't afford to tack on anymore payments at the expense of his mom.... If his cousin moves out of that house, and we dont want to let it screw up his credit, we've got to pay that $450 a month.... how are we going to be able to afford to pay that if we've taken out loans and all sorts of other things to try to help his mom? My point is we've already got plenty of responsibilities.


If you did the loan then refined on his mom’s property you would not be paying on the mother’s property for long and you would have some extra $$.

Surely your husband could rent his house out for more than $450. Letting the house go into foreclosure is a horrible idea. You see once he does that any credit he has to use will cost him more, for a very very long time. So if you buy a house, you will pay more for it. If he buys a car, he’d pay more for it.

Now with this new info, moving back to Georgia and living in the home until it sells makes a lot of sense. Doing something like letting the house go into foreclosure makes no sense at all.


kittykatz said:


> Anyway it doesnt matter.... the problem is fixed now. My husband's cousin, the same one who is living in our old house (he is also the aunt's son) is taking care of the situation.... and so is my brother in law.... apparently he got approved for a $5000 loan and isnt going to need a cosigner... although I dont know how because I was told he had no credit. The brother lives right next door, and supposedly he already owes his mom money anyway.... so to me, it makes more sense that he help instead of my husband. My husband has already helped her before.... its about time someone else does something and stop expecting him to do it all.


So the cousin who cannot even pay $450 in rent to your husband is now able to refinance a home and make those payments? By the way he’s getting quite a deal. For refinancing $40,000 he will be the proud owner of a $100,000 to $150,000 property. He’s a pretty smart guy. That’s a HUGE return on his money. Too bad you and your husband did not realize the potential return on that. Could you imagine having $100,000 equity in the property to start off with? 
And what about the 18 year old brother who is now losing his trust inheritance?

This gets worse by the minute. I feel very badly to the 18 year old who, if I understand things right, is losing out big time.


----------



## kittykatz

EleGirl said:


> You gave up a free education. So now it will be a further burden on your marital finances if you go back. That’s the point. My post was pointing out things you did that contributed to a drain on your finances now. Your response here proves my point.
> 
> 
> 
> You said that your husband NOW earns half of what he did before while driving a truck. He is not earning that now. The fact is that you depend on your parents to take care of you by living in one of their properties and both of you working at their restaurant. All the potential in the world does not change those facts.
> 
> As I recall your husband quit driving trucks because he hates it. So now he might go back to a job he hates because it’s the only choice he has?
> 
> Yes some people with college degrees (4 years not 2) earn $50,000 a year. But many chose career fields that pay a whole lot more than that. I have a degree and earn a few times that. What your degree is in matters greatly.
> 
> 
> So what if you did not ask. The fact is that you are doing it. Your parents are contributing to your financial life in a very serious manner. They can suggest anything. It’s your choice if you accept or not.
> 
> That’s right, most kids don’t get the kind of chance you are getting from your parents. Sometimes what looks like bad choices are that the person did not get the kind of help you are getting. You told us that you cannot save money now when you are not paying rent. So you are really not better than those in his family that you are putting down right so much.
> 
> 
> Yes his mom got somewhere. She was a SAHM raising children when her husband died. That is considered a valid career for a woman. Or do you look down on SAHMs? It’s pretty hard to start over and get a career after being a SAHM for decades. How would you like to have to find a job at a late time in your life with no recent work experience? Yes she made some less than good decisions…. Just like you have. You are lucky that you are young and have time to repair what you have done. But don’t think that that the decisions are not going to affect you financially for years to come.
> 
> The lack of empathy is so overwhelming that it hurts to read.
> 
> 
> 
> If you did the loan then refined on his mom’s property you would not be paying on the mother’s property for long and you would have some extra $$.
> 
> Surely your husband could rent his house out for more than $450. Letting the house go into foreclosure is a horrible idea. You see once he does that any credit he has to use will cost him more, for a very very long time. So if you buy a house, you will pay more for it. If he buys a car, he’d pay more for it.
> 
> Now with this new info, moving back to Georgia and living in the home until it sells makes a lot of sense. Doing something like letting the house go into foreclosure makes no sense at all.
> 
> So the cousin who cannot even pay $450 in rent to your husband is now able to refinance a home and make those payments? By the way he’s getting quite a deal. For refinancing $40,000 he will be the proud owner of a $100,000 to $150,000 property. He’s a pretty smart guy. That’s a HUGE return on his money. Too bad you and your husband did not realize the potential return on that. Could you imagine having $100,000 equity in the property to start off with?
> And what about the 18 year old brother who is now losing his trust inheritance?
> 
> This gets worse by the minute. I feel very badly to the 18 year old who, if I understand things right, is losing out big time.


So I gave up a free education... which in reality, I didnt because knowing my parents, they will probably offer to pay for my college when I go back... but Im not going to accept their offer if they do... but what youre saying is that it was a foolish decision of me to postpone finishing college (which I mostly actually agree with) but according to you, Im a "mooch" for taking my parents up on their offer to have free rent for a few years so that I can save up money to use on a down payment for my own house.... Explain that one to me, if you don't care, to. I just dont see the logic there. It sounds like youre just picking and choosing certain opportunities that my parents have presented to me, and you disagree when I take them up on certain offers, but then you insinuate that I'm stupid for NOT taking them up on certain offers. Giving us free rent for a few years so we can save money is just as beneficial to us as offering to pay for my college.... both things give us a better and brighter future.. So why is accepting college help from them acceptable, but free rent isnt?

Of course we could buy a house of our own without the help of my parents...nobody is saying that having free rent is necessary in order to buy a house. we could have stayed in Georgia and kept saving up money from my husband driving a truck, just like we were doing, and we could have eventually bought a bigger and nicer house down there... believe me, we were doing just fine without my parents help.. but my parents wanted us to move back to NC and this house was part of the deal that they offered. Its one thing for a parent to support their child through their whole adult life, its another thing for a parent to do a NICE THING for their child out of the generosity of their heart. Excuse me for taking my parents up on their generous offer.... shame on my parents for even offering it to me! I mean after all, if youre doing well for yourself, and youve got the means to give your child such an opportunity, you better just forget about it because thats just enabling your kid to be a mooch! I dont blame my parents for offering... I hope that when Im their age, Im doing as well as they are, and if I am, you better believe Im going to show my kid the same generosity. That doesnt mean Im going to let them live in my basement up into their 30s, pay all their bills for them, and never encourage them to move out or have a life... but if I see my 22 year old, newly married daughter trying to accomplish goals that she has set in her life, and Im at a point where Ive already accomplished all of mine, I absolutely will not hesitate to offer my help, whether she NEEDS it or not... because I feel that thats what any parent who wants the best for their kid would do.

Maybe youre thinking that Im going to be one of those people who takes advantage of my parents and that I will just SAY that I only want to stay here for a few years, but end up staying here, rent free for the rest of my life. I am not that type of person and its not going to happen. Ive had my parents try to do everything for me basically my entire life.... you have NO idea how bad I love the feeling of whenever I'm being independent from them... I feel like I was more independent from them living in Georgia than I feel now... and I will admit, I dont like that feeling. Thats why Im planning on going to school, getting a different job and getting out of this house, so that I can feel more independent again. What youre failing to realize that all of this is temporary.... me working for my dad is temporary, is living in this house is temporary, my husband working for my dad is temporary. I wouldnt be surprised if the company that interviewed him calls him in sometime next week... maybe even tomorrow! And if not, guess what, theres a million other trucking companies out there that would die to have someone like him. I already told my parents that I'm giving myself a 2 year time limit... if my husband and I don't have enough money saved up by then and are still not where we want to be financially, we're going to start paying them rent, whether its $100 or $200 a month... whatever we can afford. I told them that because I refuse to take advantage of their opportunity and because I am NOT a moocher. The deal was that we stay here for a few years to save money... not that we stay here for the rest of our lives and leach off them. If we arent where we want to be in 2 years, I'm paying them rent, whether they want to accept it or not. I'm not taking no for an answer... I dont see it coming to that though because like I said, we have a plan, and Im confident that we'll be where we want to be financially in 2 years. By that time, I see us having several thousand in the bank, and I see myself getting finished up with my degree. 

My husband isnt going back to trucking because he has no other choice.... he could go school for something different if he wanted. In fact, he is taking online classes for HVAC at the moment... but hes not anywhere near being finished, and he still won't come close to making as much money as truck driving... so since we are in a rush to save up money (seeing as how that IS why my parents are letting us stay here and we dont want to waste their time) he decided to just get back to truck driving because its something he already has experience in and knows that he makes good money doing... Its not his favorite thing to put in the long hours and to be away from home.. but he has decided to suck it up and deal with it at the moment only for the fact that the money is so good. Later on down the road, after we've gotten money saved and bought a house, he may go into HVAC or something else... but for the time being, trucking is quick, easy and pays good. Like I said, we just didnt realize what a drastic paycut it would be for him to quit... and after driving a truck for 8 years, he just got wore out with it and needed a break.... it wasnt the smartest decision and we see that now, which is why he is doing something about it. 

I never said I looked down on stay at home moms. I actually commend her for that and I think it takes a tough person to be able to be a single parent and keep a roof over your kids head and clothes on their back. Honestly, no sarcasm at all, I truly applaud her for that and have great respect for her for it. That is definitely an accomplishment and something to be proud of.

You're right, at the moment, we are not doing too well. I never said we arent saving ANY money at all... we are saving a little but its just not as much as we need...at this rate, until my husband gets back into driving, its going to take us a very long time to ever save up enough for a down payment... but even though we dont have much, we still know how to manage our money enough to the point where we can still pay all of our bills, and we don't need to ask for any help. You dont have to make a million dollars a year to do well for yourself... its not how much you make, its knowing how to mange your money properly and not go blow it on a bunch of crap that you dont need. Even if my parents were charging us rent right now, we'd still be able to pay all of our bills without any help. It would be a lot tighter... but we could do it. We would cut off our internet, get cheaper phones, do whatever we had to do... but believe me, we would get by without having to ask for help.

I realize that having a foreclosure is a bad idea... which is why its something that we are trying to avoid if at all possible. The only way we won't try to sell it or rent it out to someone is if we absolutely cannot afford the $450 a month... which is another reason why my husband is going back into trucking. He will have more money and in case something does happen with the house, we will absolutely have the money to pay for it until something happens with it... but for us to move back into it would be pointless. If his cousin moves out, we are going to have to pay the mortgage (if we can afford to) whether we are living in the house or not.... whats the difference whether we pay for it while living here or while living there? As long as its getting paid, the bank doesnt care whos living in it. Yea itll suck having to pay for a house that we arent living in, but it probably wont be for long. Thats what real estate agencies are for. All we'd have to do is contact one and they'd probably have someone in there to rent it out in no time... it might take a while to get someone to actually buy it but there are always people looking to rent. We could always put it up for rent with the option to buy.... which means while it was being rented out, people could still come look at the property if they were interested in buying it. Another option is renting it out to college students and turning it into a dorm like atmosphere... theres a university right down the road. We could contact the college about it and the house would be big enough to fit 4-5 people in it... we could charge them $250-300 a piece and makes tons of money. There are sorts of options but its not really necessary for us to move back there to follow through with any of them.

Here is the deal with the cousin. The cousin went over to my MIL's house today and discussed with her about how he would like for her to see if its possible to sign over the house to him. She would not agree to it... and I cant say Im surprised. She basically didnt trust him and didnt like the fact that her property is worth so much but that the cousin could own it all, only for $40,000. I guess she thought it seemed like he was just trying to scam her or something... which Im not going to lie, thats a hell of a deal to take out a $40,000 mortgage and own 30 acres of property with a pond and everything on it. The property is actually estimated to be worth more than I thought, according to my husband. He said its worth around $300,000 just for the land.... its kind of complicated but the land has belonged to the family for many years.. it used to belong to my MIL's deceased husband's father... and when his father died, he left the land to his grandkids (which was my MIL's husbands kids). Now dont ask me why he'd leave the land to his grandkids instead of his own son... but he did. The kids did something even more crooked... My MIL's husband told his kids that he wanted the land... keep in mind, the land was paid off at this point... well his kids told him "ok, we'll let you have the land... but its going to cost you". I forget how much an acre they charged him but it was something ridiculous.... but he wanted the land bad enough, so he went and took out a loan, so that he could own the land. 

So anyway, my MIL would not agree to sign anything over to the cousin... (if thats even possible. Im not sure if it would be, according to the trust that was left behind). Her plan is to get a job, something shes been saying shes going to do for years now, and take care of things herself. Shes still under the impression that she everything is fine and that shes going to be able to save the house herself. Instead of paying off all the taxes that she owes at once, her master plan now is to take $800 out of her 18 year old son's life insurance (I didnt even know he had life insurance) and to take $700 from the aunt (IF the aunt actually agrees to go through with this) and according to her, that will be enough money for her to cover the taxes from 2011 that she didnt pay. She was told that if she can come up with at least enough money to pay for one year of taxes that she owes, that the bank would give her one more year before they auction off her house. The problem is, just because that may take care of one year's worth of taxes, and it may give her an extra year to get things straightened out, she is still several months behind on her house payment. She doesnt even know how many months behind she is. So unless her other son, or some other family member can scrounge up enough money to take care of her late payments, shes going to still end up losing the house regardless of whether the taxes are paid or not.

Basically all shes doing is postponing things... IF she gets out of this situation and thats a BIG if... we are going to be in the same spot a year from now.. Because then shes going to have that year's taxes due, plus the other 2 years that she still owes... and chances are, she isnt going to have the money and shes going to be in another bad situation just like shes in now... But I doubt she will even make it through the year because I dont think she'll be able to keep up with the house payments. Even if she gets a job like she says she is going to, shes going to have to find a job making more money than shes getting now... My husband said he THINKS she gets around $1600 a month from SS.... If thats the case, thatd be like her making $400 a week and working 40 hrs a week.... thats not much less than what my husband and I make combined... and I make $8.00 an hour, my husband makes $10... if shes planning on getting a job at a convenience store or a restaurant or something, I dont know too many of them that pay more than what shes making already .... and she doesnt have a HS diploma, GED or any college so working somewhere like that most likely be her only option. Im not putting her down for not having much education, I dont have tons of education yet either, Im just stating facts. So if we can live off $400-500 a week, I know she could... she less bills than us. She doesnt even have a car payment. The problem isnt that she cant live off that amount of money.. the problem is she cant live off that amount of money AND support her drinking habit at the same time... if shes going to keep up the drinking, she would probably need to make more than $10 an hour, and no average place is going to pay that much. 

Thats why I think that before getting a job, she needs to get her drinking problem under control.... because even if she finds a job, theyre not going to keep her if she comes in drunk. Again, not trying to sound hurtful or anything, Im just being honest. The problem is, she doesnt have time for that right now... When her son graduates high school in June, Im pretty sure she will have zero income... I thought that maybe theyd continue to receive it for a few years as long as he goes to college but Im not sure about that... my husband said he thinks theyre cutting it off in June whether he goes to college or not. So as of right now, she doesnt have time to fix her drinking problem or get a job to try to save the house.... I think its too late for that. She can either sign it over to the cousin, continue living there while the aunt pays payments, and in the meanwhile try to get herself straightened out, or she can keep trying to save it herself, and end up losing everything. I think shes going to seriously regret it if she doesnt take the cousin up on his offer... but shes just a very stubborn person and unless someone does some serious talking to her, I dont see it happening.

The cousin is a pretty smart guy... he actually has a masters degree. He must be way smarter than I am because my husband actually mentioned doing something like what his cousin is trying to do.... but I didnt want any part of it. I guess that makes me an idiot, but personally Im glad that I chose not to. Sure it may be a great deal in the long run when its all paid off... to own all that land for $40,000... but in the meantime, if the aunt misses a payment, or if something happens to her, then guess who will be responsible? Whoevers name is on the loan... so if my name was on the loan, or my husbands name, that means we'd be responsible... so then any chance of trying to save money goes straight down the tubes... and its not worth possibly messing up our credit over, in my opinion. And what if something happens to the house in Georgia around the same time? then what are we supposed to do? Try to pay for both mortgage payments? It just wont work. Like I said, we're trying to buy a house in the very near future. Maybe for the cousin, its a good option but I dont feel that it is for my husband and I. We've got plenty of stuff on our plate already, and we already have plenty of investments that could possibly go bad... we don't need anymore potential risks added to the list.

I had a long talk with my husband and since it seems that so many of you think that I come across as uncaring/ unsympathetic, I approached this subject very carefully with him. I explained to him that if he wants to help his mom, thats fine, but that he needs to do it in ways that wont negatively effect us or stop us from having a better future. He assured me that he wouldnt do that... and he also agrees that just handing over money to his mom isnt going to solve the problem. I told him that first and foremost, someone needs to get her to go get help for her drinking before she can even think about getting a job or anything else... he explained to me that ever since he was a kid, hes been taught to never bring up his moms drinking because all she will do is get defensive about it and say she doesnt have a problem... I think he has just kind of given up on her and he feels that she will only have the desire to get help when SHE decides she needs it.... which is true... but I also believe that she'd be alot more likely to change if she had people constantly encouraging her to, instead of just avoiding the subject because it causes fights. I told him he needs to just sit her down and say look, everyone cares about you and we're worried about you, and we want you to do better.... youre going down a destructive path, and if you keep lying to yourself youre never going to get anywhere. I told him that if he'd just be persistent about it and be careful with how he words things so she doesnt go into attack mode, she'd probably eventually come around to wanting help.... but its probably never going to happen as long as people keep avoiding the topic for fear of making her angry. Let her get angry if she wants.... maybe she will make herself so angry that it will actually give her some passion and make her want to do something. 

By the way, I even mentioned bringing up the thing about having someone manage his mom's bank account and all of her finances to make sure that all her bills get paid... Just as I expected him to say, he said theres no way she'd let anyone do that. It seems as though she doesnt want any help from people when it comes to fixing her problems... unless it involves just giving her money, then she will take it. My husband and I seem to be on the same page about a lot of this stuff.... so Im going to try to learn to trust in him that he wont do anything foolish. We actually had a discussion about it without yelling at each other for once... I tried to be as sensitive on the subject as I could.

I know it may sound like Im just being judgmental and looking down on his mom.... but as I said before, my family and his family are very different. Before anyone jumps down my throat, yes I realize that his family is NOT beneath mine.... all im saying is that they are different. In my family, its just my parents and my brothers.... when my aunt/uncle/cousin has a financial problem, they dont call my parents and involve them in it... and my parents dont do that to them either. On the other hand, in my husbands family, when one person has a problem, they all get together and try to figure something out... which is fine... as long as they are truly ALL helping and its not just always one person thats expected to do it all. My husband and I are very different in this way... and if we came from similar backgrounds, it would be alot easier for me to understand these situations better... but since I dont, its just hard for me to grasp it when things like this happen. Its not something Im used to seeing... I didnt grow up the way that he did. 

I do say some stuff sometimes that is a little bit harsh.... but not because Im purposely trying to be hurtful... but because I just get so heated up about this subject, that I just let things fly out of my mouth out of anger. I guess when it comes down to it, the thing that really gets me going is to think that my husband and I have a plan for ourselves, and to see someone come in and try to mess up our plans and possibly hold us back from having a better future, it just really infuriates me... but I realize that my husband gets the picture now and that he will not help his mom if he thinks that it will pose any serious risk to our futures together.

A few years ago, when he gave her $1000, I dont think he saw it... she has always been a drinker but not to the point where it has interfered with her life... but now that its gotten to this point, he sees now that she has a serious problem and that just handing over money to an alcoholic isn't going to help in the long run. 

Im not blaming my judgemental views on my parents but they pretty much agree with me on my views on the in laws... especially his mom. They just see her as someone that is trying to bring my husband and I down... but you know, seeing the family ask each other for help when theres a crisis is something new for my parents too... like I said, in my family thats just not something that happens. I know most of you here think Im just some heartless person who doesnt give a rats behind about anyone else but if I didnt care about my husband, I would have left him way before this point. And Ive came to the conclusion that regardless of the stupid decisions that his mom makes, that will always be his mom and her decisions arent going to make him love her any less.... when I married him, his family was part of the deal so I might as well accept it... my only other option is to move on and find someone who has a similar family background as me.

And to the person who mentioned the whole thing about me not wanting his family to visit.... we've already came to a compromise on that. I was being selfish and I realize that. I dont know why this is even being brought up because its something that has been settled. No I dont like having company over, but again that has to do with how I was raised... in my parents house, it was a rarity to have guests sleeping over... and it was even more rare for my parents to sleep over at someone else's house. This is another area where my husband and I grew up very differently... Hes used to having company visit and sleepover... Im not. Its an uncomfortable thing for me and I feel my privacy is being invaded but I came to the conclusion that since he doesnt get to see his family much, its only fair of me to suck it up and just try to tolerate it... I wont lie. Its not fun for me to have his dad and brother over at my house for 2 weeks.... but thats the only time that theyve ever visited... If I have to let his family come stay over for a week or two at a time for once or twice a year, I should certainly be able to deal with it.


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## kittykatz

One more thing, Id also like to say... its obvious to me that most of you here are just trying to judge me because you probably feel like I judge his mom. I dont feel that you really believe theres anything wrong with my parents offering to give me a head start... plenty of parents do things like that for their kids all the time. Anyone should consider themselves lucky to have parents who can offer such generosity... I HATE being dependent on my parents, which is why I moved to georgia and got married at 19... But as much as I hate accepting help from them, Im no idiot... when I see a good opportunity, I take advantage of it. Theres no way that when Im 30 years old, Ill be living with my parents, having them pay all my bills and rent... my brothers and I are totally different people. Theyve never even made an effort to move out... but even though I dont agree with my brothers still living at home and not paying any bills, I'm still just going to say, you know what... live and let live. Its their life not mine. I dont agree with it and I think theyre wasting their time but if thats the way they choose to live, it doesnt make a difference to me, one way or the other. 

You can all keep judging me all you want to but it really doesnt matter to me either way because I know the truth and I know what kind of person I am... and I know that I will accomplish my goals and will get somewhere in life. 

Normally, I try to stay out of people's business.... I may not agree with what someone does but I try not to judge them or bash them about it unless its something that directly effects me... In his moms case, its not like Ive always had negative feelings toward her... Ive always wanted to like my MIL... I never started judging her or talking bad about her until she asked us for money and involved us in her finances. Personally, I dont really care whether she has a job or not, or what she buys or how much she spends.... as long as it doesnt effect me. 

Just like how my business effects absolutely NONE of you.... so I think the smart thing would be for everybody to just stop being judgmental about things that have nothing to do with them. Ill make a deal with all of you, Ill try not to judge my MIL as long as her problems dont interfere with my life, and you all can stop judging me since my situation has no effect over YOUR life and it never will.


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## SlowlyGettingWiser

Couldn't even get through the initial post!

I had to stop at the part where OP is living RENT FREE in a home her parents own, all the while BEMOANING the fact that your husband's family needs financial help...and that makes them SUCK! :scratchhead:

You need to learn to see things from OTHER PEOPLE'S perspectives...like your HUSBAND'S.


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## EleGirl

I cannot read your last two posts.. it's just too much. Makes my heart and head hurt for you.. and a lot for your husband.


No one here is trying to be mean to you. We are trying to convey to you that level of harsh judgementalism that you are putting out.

I doubt any of us think that "there is nothing wrong" with his mother. She is, from what you have said a very flawed person. The point is that we are all flawed in our own ways, some more than others. Your husband has an serious issue to which we have all offered some good solutions that would gain some control over the issue.

But you are too busy throwing out walls of text and self justification to hear any of it. 

I hope that life gives you lessons that soften your heart.


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## kittykatz

EleGirl said:


> I cannot read your last two posts.. it's just too much. Makes my heart and head hurt for you.. and a lot for your husband.
> 
> 
> No one here is trying to be mean to you. We are trying to convey to you that level of harsh judgementalism that you are putting out.
> 
> I doubt any of us think that "there is nothing wrong" with his mother. She is, from what you have said a very flawed person. The point is that we are all flawed in our own ways, some more than others. Your husband has an serious issue to which we have all offered some good solutions that would gain some control over the issue.
> 
> But you are too busy throwing out walls of text and self justification to hear any of it.
> 
> I hope that life gives you lessons that soften your heart.


 Actually if you had read my last two posts yoyud see that I was acknowledging being judgemental... and you'd see that my husband and I have already discussed the issue and have decided that there's nothing wrong with helping his mom as long as its done in a way that doesn't bring us down. I even mentioned to my husband some ways that he could help his mom, but the only problem is, he thinks she wont agree to any type of help like that. She will accept help if it involves someone giving her money, otherwise she wants everyone to stay out of it. So I don't know what's going to happen but my husband and I are on the same page about it now and that's what matters. Everyone here can think what they want to about me but I just want to say that I know I have flaws, and I've already adressed them. I have issues myself, which I never said I didn't, that im working on improving everyday.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## EleGirl

kittykatz said:


> Actually if you had read my last two posts yoyud see that I was acknowledging being judgemental... and you'd see that my husband and I have already discussed the issue and have decided that there's nothing wrong with helping his mom as long as its done in a way that doesn't bring us down. I even mentioned to my husband some ways that he could help his mom, but the only problem is, he thinks she wont agree to any type of help like that. She will accept help if it involves someone giving her money, otherwise she wants everyone to stay out of it. So I don't know what's going to happen but my husband and I are on the same page about it now and that's what matters. Everyone here can think what they want to about me but I just want to say that I know I have flaws, and I've already adressed them. I have issues myself, which I never said I didn't, that im working on improving everyday.


His mother has accepted the cousin taking over the house right? Then I guess she is open to other solutions.

Sometimes with someone like his mom you to push them to do what is the best solution for everyone. That's what we had to do with my mom. She was not happy when we took over her finances. But we told her she had two choices: 1) keep doing things the way she was and no one would help her any more or 2) do it our way and we'd make sure her bills were always paid and she had the money she needed. and when we did take over, it turned out that with good management she had enough money to live well.... not rich by a long shot but well know to have what she needs and a bit more. Then we children gave her presents, often of cash to do special things when we felt we had the money and when we wanted to. there was no more emergency bail outs at the turn of hundreds of dollars.


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## kittykatz

At first my MIL would not agree to sign anything over to the cousin. The cousin went to her house and talked to her about it yesterday but she refused to let him get involved and in fact, before he left her house, she even asked him to go to the store and pick up some beer. She had just got done telling him that needs to get a job and get out of the house but yet she wont even go down the road to get her own beer... my husbands cousin tried talking her into going to the store with him but she wouldn't so he ended up going by himself. Personally I think people just need to tell her no when she asks them to go get her beer. Maybe if she had to get the beer herself, she wouldn't buy it so much. But its like everyone in his family just avoids confronting her about her drinking because they don't want to get her upset... but they should be able to see that avoiding the subject isn't making her drink any less. Anyway my husband called her today and basically told her that if she doesn't take the cousin up on his offer,she's going to lose the house... and she eventually agreed to sign it over to him. I just hope everything goes well with it... like I said, im not sure of all the details of the trust so they might run into comlications but I hope not. I agree that sometimes you have to push family into doing what's best and that's what im trying to convince my husband of. I know I've came off as sounding judgemental before but honestly I end up regretting alot of things I say... I let mt anger get the best of me at times. Im working on it..id like to also say I've never said anything to his mom that would be hurtful, I've always been nothing but nice to her. I just have a fear of having someone screw me over or walk all over me but my husband has assured me that there are ways to help without doing that. Alot of what I said about his mom was not necessary, all I had to say was that she's made some bad decisions in life like all of us.... sorry if I offended you or anyone else.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## EleGirl

Did you say that your MIL told the cousin to get a job?

I'm not sure of the details of the cousin taking the house over, but from the way you describe it it sounds like the cousin is gettting $100,000 of equity for nothing. And your MIL is losing the house to him. And the 18 year old brother is losing his inheritance. 

You and your husband could have helped his mother and made a nice profit.. and the brother not be ripped off. But whatever.


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## Bobby5000

It seems like all you do is complain about his family and nag him about money. What kind of man would he be if he said, I don't give a crap about my mother. 

Certainly, you could have a reasonable discussion about money and budgets, and you could say I love your mother but we could a few hundred dollars but not five thousand.


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## kittykatz

EleGirl said:


> Did you say that your MIL told the cousin to get a job?
> 
> I'm not sure of the details of the cousin taking the house over, but from the way you describe it it sounds like the cousin is gettting $100,000 of equity for nothing. And your MIL is losing the house to him. And the 18 year old brother is losing his inheritance.
> 
> You and your husband could have helped his mother and made a nice profit.. and the brother not be ripped off. But whatever.


The property is actually worth more than 100k according to my husband... its 30 acres of land with a pond. 

No my MIL didnt tell the cousin to get a job... the cousin has a job... obviously or he wouldnt be able to take out a mortgage for $40,000 to buy the land. My MIL said that SHE needs a job... its not anything new though, shes been saying she needs to get a job for years. I dont know how many applications she has put in or how much of an effort she had made to get one, but she does acknowledge the fact that she needs one.

Youre right, the cousin is getting somewhere around $300,000 worth of land and is only going to pay $40,000 for it.... its an outrageous, crazy deal. Im not denying that. However, that doesnt mean there still arent risks involved.

As I said, the aunt says she will cover the loan payments so that the cousin won't have to... BUT if for whatever reason, if the aunt misses a payment or can't pay the payments any longer, the cousin will be responsible... which means that whenever HE decides to buy a house of his own, he probably isnt going to be able to afford it because he will already be paying for the mortgage that he took out to own that land... that is IF the aunt can't make the payments someday. So he is basically risking possibly not being able to buy his own house.... I guess he could possibly build a house on the property, that way he wouldnt have an extra house payment... but good luck trying to save up enough money to build a house if youre having to pay $600 a month or whatever its going to be... unless he puts that teaching degree to use and gets an amazing paying job.. He has a masters degree in English and is planning on being an english professor... so at least he has the potential to make tons of money... if he was making enough money, he could afford the payments and still be able to afford house payments of his own or save up enough money to build a house on the property... but that would be the only way. My husband and I simply do not make enough money to be able to afford multiple mortgage payments... even when hes driving a truck, I doubt it would be enough.

After the mortgage is payed off, it will be a good deal, theres no doubt about that... but what I'd be worried about is what will happen in the meantime... I don't know what type of loan hes planning on taking out but it will probably be at least 15-20 years or more before that $40,000 is paid off.... Id say its not that far fetched to say that the aunt might not be able to continue to make the payments someday. Her husband has bad health problems and if something ever happened to him, I imagine she wouldnt have as much income because as of right now, I believe her husband is receiving disability checks, and so is she. 

Like I said, we're planning on buying a house soon and we've already got one house in Georgia that we might eventually have to make the payments on for a while to avoid losing it, and we arent going to be able to afford any extra payments if the aunt does so happen to get into a situation where she cant make the payments anymore.

My husband must agree with me on this otherwise he would have put up more of a fight about the issue.... He just mentioned it to me once or twice and I wasnt interested, so he dropped it. he doesnt seem to really mind what his cousin is doing. He acts like he is just glad someone is doing something to help.


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## kittykatz

Bobby5000 said:


> It seems like all you do is complain about his family and nag him about money. What kind of man would he be if he said, I don't give a crap about my mother.
> 
> Certainly, you could have a reasonable discussion about money and budgets, and you could say I love your mother but we could a few hundred dollars but not five thousand.


I know now that just turning his back on his mom isnt something thats ever going to happen... and I started thinking to myself, if my mom was in that situation, regardless of how many times she screwed up or even if it was her own fault, I have a hard time seeing myself tell her to just screw off. 

So no, Its not fair for me to expect him to just not care about his mom. I refuse to ever allow someone to constantly sponge off me, but I realize now that we can help her in ways that wont enable her and that wont put us in a bad situation ourselves. The challenge is just being creative and figuring out what those ways are. I'm not going to lie, itd be nice if we didnt have to be bothered with it. It would be great if she could act like an adult and take care of her own finances, and learn how to stop drinking so much, but its obvious that isnt going to be the case... she has a serious problem with alcohol and its effecting her life in every way... and until she gets the drinking problem fixed, I expect the rest of her life to always be this way.


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## EleGirl

If the cousin wants to get another home loan, all he has to do is show that he has tenants living on the property and paying the mortgage.

I feel so badly for the 18 year old brother. He's being robbed. 

From an earlier post, you said that the trust does not allow for the sale of the house prior to the 18 yr old turning 20. So there is still some hope there that someone will come up with a solution that is not a HUGE rip off.

I think that you still do not see how help with this situation could really help you out financially. But I give up. I'm appalled at the idea that over a $5K problem, $300,000 is being let slip through the immediate family's fingers.

Not my family, not my problem I guess.


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## kittykatz

EleGirl said:


> If the cousin wants to get another home loan, all he has to do is show that he has tenants living on the property and paying the mortgage.
> 
> I feel so badly for the 18 year old brother. He's being robbed.
> 
> From an earlier post, you said that the trust does not allow for the sale of the house prior to the 18 yr old turning 20. So there is still some hope there that someone will come up with a solution that is not a HUGE rip off.
> 
> I think that you still do not see how help with this situation could really help you out financially. But I give up. I'm appalled at the idea that over a $5K problem, $300,000 is being let slip through the immediate family's fingers.
> 
> Not my family, not my problem I guess.


I think you misunderstood me a little... $300,000 is not slipping through the immediate family's fingers... the cousin is the aunt's son. So, the cousin is doing this to help out his MOM so that she won't lose her house.... so its not like the immediate family isn't doing anything and we're leaving it up to some distant cousin... the cousin is considered immediate family just as much as my husband is. And its not just over a $5000 problem... its the fact that I think there is too much risk involved and that its not worth it. If I could own all that land for $40,000 and there were no significant risks involved and all I had to do was come up with $5000 for the unpaid taxes, I might consider doing it.

I understand what youre saying... I really do... but what you seem to not want to acknowledge is that for whatever reason, if the aunt cannot make payments, the burden falls on the cousin's shoulders.... sure he could get another loan for a house of his own as long as the tenants living on his property are paying payments, but if they are not able to pay, then at this point in time, its probably going to put him in a bind if he has his own house payments/ rent that hes paying for.... As of right now, hes paying us $350 a month to live in OUR old house, and if something happens and he ends up having to make the payments on this other property, and he can't afford to pay us rent anymore, Im afraid we're going to have to tell him to go so that we can either rent the place to someone else or sell it... we're not going to keep paying the payments on it just to let it sit there and have someone else stay in it for free. Something needs to be done with the place. 

Maybe you don't think that its a real possibility that the aunt might not be able to make the payments at some point... but from what Ive seen of his family, (or at least most of them) they do not seem to be very financially stable... Just because the aunt says she can pay the payments right now, doesnt mean shes going to be able to for the next 10-15 years, or however long it'll be until its paid off. If I was the aunt's son, that is something Id be thinking about.... because if he thinks if he does end up having to make payments on that property, and hes just going to be able to stay in our old house rent free, thats not going to work... so for his sake, Im hoping he has some kind of plan, just in case he gets into that situation.

But since you think its such an amazing deal, despite the obvious risks involved, look at it this way.... we're doing my husband's cousin a favor. We are passing up this brilliant opportunity and letting it go straight to his cousin... so now nobody can say that I've never been generous or done anything nice for any of his family members. Right?


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## FryFish

> we're not going to keep paying the payments on it just to let it sit there and have someone else stay in it for free.


Oh dear lord!!! HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Please! The IRONY!!!


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## kittykatz

FryFish said:


> Oh dear lord!!! HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
> 
> Please! The IRONY!!!


You just dont get it do you? 

My parents rental house is paid off... our old house is not. My parents are letting us live in their rental house, rent free TEMPORARILY to help us out because they wanted us to move back to NC.... When we let his cousin move into our old house, we didnt do it to help him out... we did it because we were moving away and when people move, they either sell their house or rent it out. Would you move two states away and continue paying the mortgage for your old house that you werent even living in anymore?? No, I highly doubt it. That would be pointless. You would most likely sell it or rent it to someone. 

Or maybe you would just say hey screw it! How about we let Joe Schmo move into our old house, he can live there rent free for as long as he wants to, we'll just keep paying the payments, and in the meantime we can just forget about ever buying a house of our own. We will never be able to afford to because we're too busy paying $450 a month for some house we arent even living in! Sounds like a great plan.

My parents are not risking or losing anything by letting us stay in this house. They only have this rental house to make extra money... its not like they HAVE to have the rent money because if they dont they wont be able to afford their own house payment or anything like that. Their house is already paid for and so is this rental house. Unlike my parents, my husband and I are not in the position to give someone a house with free rent... most people arent! Like I said, someday if my husband and I are doing as well as my parents are, I would not hesitate to give my kid the kind of opportunity that they are giving me... but right now, we are not at a place in our lives where we can do that. Its that simple.

Like I said, My parents situation and MY situation are two completely different things. I'm done trying to explain it to you because its obvious you will just never understand. Frankly Im getting tired of having to explain it to you over and over. If youre going to put me on ignore, I wish you'd just do it because youre really very tiring.


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## EleGirl

kittykatz said:


> I think you misunderstood me a little... $300,000 is not slipping through the immediate family's fingers... the cousin is the aunt's son. So, the cousin is doing this to help out his MOM so that she won't lose her house.... so its not like the immediate family isn't doing anything and we're leaving it up to some distant cousin... the cousin is considered immediate family just as much as my husband is. And its not just over a $5000 problem... its the fact that I think there is too much risk involved and that its not worth it. If I could own all that land for $40,000 and there were no significant risks involved and all I had to do was come up with $5000 for the unpaid taxes, I might consider doing it.
> 
> I understand what youre saying... I really do... but what you seem to not want to acknowledge is that for whatever reason, if the aunt cannot make payments, the burden falls on the cousin's shoulders.... sure he could get another loan for a house of his own as long as the tenants living on his property are paying payments, but if they are not able to pay, then at this point in time, its probably going to put him in a bind if he has his own house payments/ rent that hes paying for.... As of right now, hes paying us $350 a month to live in OUR old house, and if something happens and he ends up having to make the payments on this other property, and he can't afford to pay us rent anymore, Im afraid we're going to have to tell him to go so that we can either rent the place to someone else or sell it... we're not going to keep paying the payments on it just to let it sit there and have someone else stay in it for free. Something needs to be done with the place.
> 
> Maybe you don't think that its a real possibility that the aunt might not be able to make the payments at some point... but from what Ive seen of his family, (or at least most of them) they do not seem to be very financially stable... Just because the aunt says she can pay the payments right now, doesnt mean shes going to be able to for the next 10-15 years, or however long it'll be until its paid off. If I was the aunt's son, that is something Id be thinking about.... because if he thinks if he does end up having to make payments on that property, and hes just going to be able to stay in our old house rent free, thats not going to work... so for his sake, Im hoping he has some kind of plan, just in case he gets into that situation.
> 
> But since you think its such an amazing deal, despite the obvious risks involved, look at it this way.... we're doing my husband's cousin a favor. We are passing up this brilliant opportunity and letting it go straight to his cousin... so now nobody can say that I've never been generous or done anything nice for any of his family members. Right?


As soon as the $5000 is paid for taxes the house could be put up for sale. Then the 18 year old would get what is his. With the current plan the cousin is the one who benefits. He could turn around the week after he refinances and sell the house out from everyone, walk away with hundreds of thousands in profit. Then his parents and your MIL, and BIL would not have a place ot live.

And no a cousin is not immediate family. Immediate family are parents and children.

And no you did nothing, so you did nothing for anyone... well except encourage your husband to participate in giving away his brother's inheritance.


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## kittykatz

EleGirl said:


> As soon as the $5000 is paid for taxes the house could be put up for sale. Then the 18 year old would get what is his. With the current plan the cousin is the one who benefits. He could turn around the week after he refinances and sell the house out from everyone, walk away with hundreds of thousands in profit. Then his parents and your MIL, and BIL would not have a place ot live.
> 
> And no a cousin is not immediate family. Immediate family are parents and children.
> 
> And no you did nothing, so you did nothing for anyone... well except encourage your husband to participate in giving away his brother's inheritance.


There is absolutely no way that the aunts son is going to sell the land out from underneath everyone. That would defeat the whole purpose. You don't seem to understand. He is doing this to help his mom out because he doesn't want to see her lose her house. He isn't doing this just because he is concerned with benefiting himself... if that was the case he would have tried to do this a long time ago. He didn't even mention the idea until he found out that his mom was about to lose her house... so if that's what you're worried about, I can assure you that's not going to happen. I've known him for quite a while now and he has never done anything to make me feel distrustful of him... and especially to see him do that to his own mom... it just isn't going to happen... and if my aunt or MIL had any question at all in their mind that he might, they wouldn't go along with any of this. The cousin IS immediate family to the aunt. He is her son. You can't get much more immediate than that. He is not immediate family to my MIL but he is to the aunt... and the aunt is in the same situation as my MIL... both of them are at risk for losing their house... so why should it have to be only my MIL's son who does something? Its not like he's never helped her before... and you see how much it helped her. She's in the same bad situation now that she was the first time she asked for help. 

She could sell the house IF she could do that according to the trust, I don't know for sure if she's even going to be able to let the cousin have it. She may run into complications with the trust and find out she can't do that. Up until this point, I was always under the impression that the trust did not allow her to sign it over to anyone else.. so who knows really. Even if she sells it to some stranger, the 18 yr old still wont get the house, so I don't see what good that would do anyway. If the house gets sold to a stranger, to a family member, to whoever, the 18 yr old still will end up losing the house. The only way he will get it is if his mom continues to live in it and makes sure that its being paid for... if it gets sold to anyone or gets foreclosed on, its gone. UNLESS she sales it to someone like the aunts son, who will buy the land but still continue to let everyone live there. And the way I see it, the 18 yr old will still get his inheritance if the cousin buys the property... even though it wont be the 18 yr olds name on the place, he and his mom get to continue to live there for probably as long as they want, and the best part is they wont even have to pay house payments anymore because the aunt is offering to take over payments. Sounds like a pretty sweet deal to me! I don't see the cousin ever kicking his mom or my MIL off the property to be honest... like I said, that would defeat the purpose. His main reasoning in doing this was to help them out. You can think whatever you want to think but my husband has helped before and its not fair that only one person in the family should be doing all the helping. I think its someone elses turn, which is why I have no problem letting him handle it and neither does my husband. I didn't have to "talk" my husband into doing much of anything. 

Go ahead and try to turn it all around on me if you want, but that's not the case. My husband mentioned the idea to me once, I said no and he dropped it. Once he heard his cousin was interested in doing it instead, he was more than willing to let him do it. If it was something he really wanted to do he'd be trying to talk the cousin out of it and still trying to persuade me into doing it.. trust me if he really wants something he persists about it and usually I end up just giving in. You're trying to create a problem and try to make us feel guilty for letting the cousin take care of it instead of us, as if he's just going to buy the place and snatch it out from under his own mom (yea right)... but there really is no problem and I don't feel guilty in the slighest and my husband doesn't seem to either. And I actually feel like we are being generous toward the cousin... we are passing up this great deal and letting him have it! Its an opprotunity of a lifetime, remember? we will just see what a great deal it is when the aunt can't make the payments anymore and the burden falls on her sons shoulders...but hey! If he's willing to risk that in order to help out his mom and her sister, more power to him! By the way I guess ill say it again since noone heard me the first time.. I was told by my husband that his brothers house will not be effected by any of this for some reason.. I don't know the details... but the only people at risking of losing their homes are my MIL, her 18 yr old son, and the aunt/her husband. I repeat, my other BIL will NOT be effected. Was that loud and clear?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## kittykatz

Just to give you all a little update on the situation, my MIL has decided that instead of selling the whole 30 acres for 40,000 to the aunts son, she's only going to give him 5 acres for 40,000. This means my MIL will not have a house payment anymore because 40,000 is all the she owes on it, and the aunts son will be covering that by the loan he's taking out. She told my husband that she just did not want to give away ALL of her land and that she still wanted some of it for herself... so she's giving the aunts son as little land as possible in exchange for the 40,000 loan that he's taking out so she can pay off the property. My husband explained to her that if she's only going to give the aunts son 5 acres of land, he could just as easily say forget it and instead of taking out a loan to help pay off her property, he could take out a loan to move his moms double wide (the aunt) off the property and then the aunt and her husband can just live somewhere else and not have to be involved in this mess anymore. In other words, the aunts son giving 40,000 to my MIL to pay off the land isn't the only way that he can help out his mom and make sure she didn't lose her home... since she lives in a double wide, he could always just take out a loan for 10,000 or so, (I hear that's how much it costs to get a double wide moved) and use that to help out his mom, and then my MIL would be all on her own in this situation and then the only one that'd be out of a place to live would be her. My MILs response was "they're not going to move that double wide. They've been living on this land for years and they're in their 50s.. they don't want to move. They'll do whatever they have to to be able to stay here." So in other words she's taken advantage of the fact that she knows they don't want to have to move, to give them as little land as possible, meanwhile she wont have a house payment and will still have 25 acres of land... and the aunts son will only have 5 acres, and the aunt will be having to pay her son every month to cover the loan payments for the 40,000 that he took out. So anyone who is so concerned about my MIL or her son...don't be. They're getting a great deal... if anything, its the aunt and the aunts son who are getting taken advantage of in this situation.. my husband even said himself that his mom is being greedy and he thinks its terrible... but hey, if it saves the mom and the aunt from losing both their homes, I guess it works... but personally if I was the aunt id just get my double wide moved and be done with it all, and let the MIL deal with it... especially since she wants to be greedy about it. Anyone who disagrees probably just does not understand the entire situation.. its very complicated and very hard for me to try to explain.
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## PBear

I thought your MIL didn't own the land? I'm not trying to be argumentative, just trying to understand.

C
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## kittykatz

She doesn't own it as of right now... but when the aunts son takes out a loan for $40,000 she will own it because that's how much she owes on it... once she gets that 40,000 she can sell some of it or sell all of it or do whatever she wants... and as of right now, her plan is to only give the aunts son 5 acres in exchange for the 40,000.
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## PBear

You either own the property or you don't. The bank may have a mortgage on the property, but you still own it. I thought the son living at home owned it, and it was being held in trust or something? 

C
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## kittykatz

Im not sure if the house is in the 18 yr old sons name yet or not... I think he has to be a certain age before it goes into his name.. obviously his name isn't on it yet because if it was, im guessing the MIL would have to get his approval on doing anything like this. Im not sure of some of the details myself... like I said its very complicated... but from my understanding, the house is not in the sons name yet.
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## EleGirl

Is 40K the normal price in that area for 5 acres of land? If so then the cousin is getting some land at the going rate. It's not a bad deal for him at all.

If she is selling him that land at the going rate, she is not being greedy at all. It's a lot smarter than her handing over 300K property for 40K.


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## highwood

Well if $40,000 is reasonable for 5 acres of land in the area..then that is not bad. At least he has an asset to show for his $40,000.00.


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## highwood

So to date who has paid for the bulk of the mortgage on the land? Your MIL?


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## EleGirl

How long was your MIL married to the man who left this house to their son? How many years ago did he die?


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## kittykatz

highwood said:


> So to date who has paid for the bulk of the mortgage on the land? Your MIL?


My MIL's husband paid it for the majority of the time... then when he died, she started paying it. The aunt and her husband having been living on my MIL's property for years and years, they live right behind her house in a double wide trailer... and they have never once paid my MIL any rent from my understanding, until just recently (like maybe over the past year or two) when my MIL came out and specifically asked them to, because she was having trouble paying the payments... so eventually the aunt did start paying her sister (my MIL) a little bit of money each month to help with the payments.The aunt acted like she was not thrilled in the least to have to pay anything, but she did eventually give in.


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## kittykatz

EleGirl said:


> How long was your MIL married to the man who left this house to their son? How many years ago did he die?


I believe they were married somewhere around 15 years before he died... give or take a year or two. Im not sure exactly. He died close to 10 years ago. 

This is what Im saying. Instead of the cousin investing $40,000 for 5 acres of land in order to help out his mom, he could just as easily say, "you know what mom? How about we just have your double wide moved? I know it costs about $10,000 to move a trailer, but I'd be more than happy to just take out a loan for $10,000 and get your trailer moved.. that'd be way cheaper than taking out $40,000 to buy 5 acres of land". See what Im saying? If he did this, then the aunt wouldnt be effected by any of this anymore, and it would all be just my MIL's problem. So I think she should be a little bit more generous and give them a little bit MORE land than what they'd typically get, just to show her gratitude that the cousin is taking out a 40,000 loan, which will allow her to pay off her house. Like I said, there are other ways that the cousin could help his mom... he could just as easily get her trailer moved, and wouldn't have to help out my MIL at all.... but hes doing this to help both of them out really... and hes only getting 5 acres out of it. But see, my MIL KNOWS that her sister (the aunt) isn't going to want her trailer moved... shes been there for too long, and shes already gotten settled in there. She doesnt want to have to go through the hassle.... so she will agree to pretty much whatever it takes, as long as she doesn't have to move... and my MIL knows this, and shes taking advantage of it, by offering the aunt and her son the least amount of land possible.

Think of it this way... My MIL is going to have 40,000 basically just handed over to her so that she can use it to pay off her house. After this, she won't have a house payment anymore. She wont have a house payment AND will still own 25 acres of land. All she will have to worry about is having enough money to pay for her utilities. Meanwhile, the aunt's son just took out a $40,000 loan to buy 5 acres of land for his mom to live on... and the aunt will be paying the payments on this for God knows how long... probably over the next 10 years. 

Am I making any sense? Maybe giving the cousin the entire 30 acres for $40,000 wouldn't be the best idea... but I do think that he should get more than 5 acres, and I do agree with my husband that my MIL is being greedy. The aun't son is going out of his way to try to help out his mom AND my MIL.... when he could just as easily say "screw you" to my MIL and just have his mom's trailer moved off the property. Either way, the situation is going to get taken care of, but I think my MIL should give the cousin MORE than just "the going rate" to show that she's gracious that he is even helping her. Personally I'd offer him at least 10 acres. She'd still have more than half of the land to herself. Like I said, he certainly does not have to help her, and he certainly has other options to help out his mom, without having to help my MIL at all. This was the exact point that my husband brought up, and I have to say I couldnt agree with him more. My husband even said to her "mom, what if he (the cousin) decides to just have his mom's trailer moved, if all hes getting out of it is 5 acres. Just having the trailer moved would be a lot cheaper." Her exact response was "Theyre not going to do that! They dont want to move. They've been here way too long and theyre already established here". I guarantee you if they started talking like they were just going to have the trailer moved and let my MIL worry about all this mess, she'd be a lot more generous and would show a lot more gratitude.


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## EleGirl

If the aunt's trailer is moved and her son did not buy the land, where would she have it moved to, a trailer park? Then she would have to pay $10,000 to move it and monthly rent to have her trailer there.

Is she moved it to some land that her son bought, she'd most likely have to pay the $10,000 for the move and then more to bring in utilities, water, etc. She might even have to pay for a well to be drilled.

The point is that just moving the trailer might not be a solution. The aunt lived on the land rent free for a very long time.

It's too back you and your husband could not help his mother and brother, and make a bit at the same time. But, well, you'all will do what you will do.


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## kittykatz

EleGirl said:


> If the aunt's trailer is moved and her son did not buy the land, where would she have it moved to, a trailer park? Then she would have to pay $10,000 to move it and monthly rent to have her trailer there.
> 
> Is she moved it to some land that her son bought, she'd most likely have to pay the $10,000 for the move and then more to bring in utilities, water, etc. She might even have to pay for a well to be drilled.
> 
> The point is that just moving the trailer might not be a solution. The aunt lived on the land rent free for a very long time.
> 
> It's too back you and your husband could not help his mother and brother, and make a bit at the same time. But, well, you'all will do what you will do.


The aunt wouldn't have to pay the $10,000 to get it moved... her son would pay it for her, I'm sure. If hes willing to pay $40,000 for 5 acres of land for her to live on, Im sure he'd be willing to take out a $10,000 loan to get her trailer moved. 

I'm pretty sure the aunt would be able to afford everything. She has been paying my MIL rent for the past year or two, to my knowledge... she wasn't paying rent before because she couldnt... it was obviously just because she didnt want to. In fact, when the aunt saw that my MIL was having trouble paying paying the house payments, she offered to pay the whole thing for her.... because she lives on my MIL's property and she didn't want to lose HER house... My MIL pays around $550 a month I believe. If the aunt is saying that she can afford $550 a month, Im sure she could afford living in a trailer park. I dont think she makes much, but she certainly makes more than my MIL. From my understanding, the aunt and her husband both receive disability checks... I'd say they probably make twice as much as my MIL, or close to it at least. The main expense would just be paying the 10,000 to get it moved in the first place, but like I said, Im sure her son would take care of that for her.

I'm almost positive moving the trailer would be an option, and to me, it seems like a much cheaper option. They just don't want to move because they don't want to go through the hassle.

You still seem to think it was a bad idea that my husband and I didnt get involved in any of this, but the fact is, my husband cousin is not getting some kind of once in a lifetime deal. Hes getting 5 acres of land for 40,000.... hes going 40,000 in debt just for the sake of helping out my MIL instead of just having his mom's trailer moved for a fraction of the cost. If I was him, Id just have it moved. 

Like I said before, my husband and I are trying to start a life together, trying to save money to buy a house of our own, and trying to eliminate all of our debts, not add more debts on just for the sake of helping someone else. We will never get our own house and will never get anywhere in life if we don't start putting ourselves first and stop going into debt. I have no desire to go 40,000 in debt for 5 acres of property that is 400 miles away. I fail to see how we would be gaining anything by doing this. If we were paying payments on a 40,000 loan, lets say for the next 10 years, that'd be around $250-300 a month... if we did that, we would literally have almost no extra money at the end of the month... and then not to mention our old house in Georgia is $450 a month, which my husband's cousin is currently paying most of that... but if he ever moves out of it, we'd have no choice but to let the bank take it back, because we wouldnt be able to afford $450 a month, because we'd already be spending every last dime we had on our $40,000 loan payments. Paying the $450 until we found a renter/buyer wouldnt be an option. Even if the aunt payed the payments for us like she SAYS shes going to do for her son, if she ever missed a payment or if something ever happens to her before the loan is paid off, guess whose credit is going to be screwed up because of it... not hers. Not my MIL's.... Noone but my husband's and mine.

I dont want to do anything to jeopardize us being able to buy a house in the future, and this is something that I feel would definitely risk that. If the aunt's son wants to help out, then by all means, we will gladly let him... and I dont see anything wrong with it. As I said before, there are ways to help his mom out without giving up OUR goals and wants in life... and this is something that I just feel is too much of a risk for US at this time. If there is any way we can help his mom without putting ourselves at risk, then we will be more than glad to... but this just isnt one of those situations.

The fact is, right now is not the right time in our lives to go take out a $40,000 loan especially when we've already got more than plenty debt that we're trying to get rid of. (Wayyy more debt than my husband's cousin, I can almost guarantee you that)

The aunts son is taking care of it, and I feel absolutely no guilt or remorse about it. My only problem is I just wish she'd offer him a little bit more land... after all, hes the one sticking his neck out here, to try to help her and his mom out... giving him a few more acres in exchange for him allowing her to be able to pay off her house and be debt free would be the least she could do, in my opinion. If I was my MIL I would just think about the next time she needs help... and Im sure there will be a next time. Does she think anyones going to help her out when she didnt even show the least bit of appreciation the LAST time they helped her out? I think not.


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## EleGirl

You apparently missed the solution that I suggested. Let me repeat it.

You and your husband get a $5K loan to pay the taxes. Then, once the tax burden in gone on the house the MIL and the 18 year old turn around and either sell the property or refinance. When that goes through they give you back $10,000. 

You see, this is family helping each other. MIL/18 yr old get to keep the vast majority of the equity in the proporty. But to thank you for saving her rear with the tax problem MIL/l18 yr old DOUBLE YOUR MONEY.


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