# When did you know



## Farmlady (Feb 17, 2020)

I have posted previously on other forums about some serious problems in my marriage that have come to light over the past year and many posters advised divorce. I have really struggled with that. We have been together over 20 years and married over 15, have 2 children (10/13), and a business together. The first issue was financial. I incurred a lot of debt I did not tell him about while trying to help him build the business. He's a "wanter." I'm not, but I wanted him to have his dream, even though it was never mine. I felt it was my place as his wife and partner to make it happen for him. I take care of those I love. I was wrong to go about it the way I did and there is a lot of resentment on both sides of that. We have been trying to deal with that. It seems once he knew we could no longer financially afford that, he switched to wanting to expand sexually. This was a huge shock because we have/had a great sex life and were pretty adventurous but had always been adamant about maintaining fidelity. He did not see us sleeping with other people as cheating as long as we told each other. In fact, he wanted explicit details about any encounter I had. It is a turn on for him. I don't want to get into all the details, but I let myself be convinced that it would be okay. A few things happened. I ended up having an EA with my best male friend that ultimately did become physical. I'm not proud of that and am not going to make an excuse for it. I knew where it was going. We originally decided not to have contact with each other while I was working on my marriage (he is single), but that didn't last for a variety of reasons. My husband knows I slept with him, but does not have any idea about the depth of that relationship. He was turned on that we did and wanted details. My husband travels a lot this time of year. During all of this, he has been sleeping with another woman. Tells me every time it happens, even to the point of complaining that she is not as good as me, but scratches the itch. Sex is a much more emotional experience for me, and I had always thought it was for him. He says he has an emotional connection to me but not to her or anyone else. I am a very intense, closed-up person by nature so I don't let many close to me and that is about as close as you can get in my estimation.

The more I reflect on what has gone on, the more I think he has an addictive personality. His father did. Now he does not drink excessively, gamble, or do any kind of drugs. It is entirely possibly I am overanalyzing the situation but it just seems to me that when the material wanting/obsession had to end we went straight to the sexual one. Both "phases" I could guess you could call them, have nearly destroyed me. My friend actually wants my husband and I to be able to work it out. Doesn't want me or my children, or even my husband to go through that pain. We have both agreed he can't be part of the equation any longer and that breaks my heart too. I honestly have incredibly intense feelings for this other man, but I have been with my husband literally half of my life. Irony is, I knew how I felt about my friend and that he felt for me, but I had pushed that down and had absolutely no intention of ever acting on it. I really don't think I would have, had my husband not brought up the swinging/swapping. I think at that point, something inside me finally broke. I felt like such an object, like I was no longer precious or something to be cherished. I just can't get over the fact that he was willing to share me like that and actually thought it would strengthen our marriage.

He says he will stop having sex with the other woman if I tell him to. He probably would, but I think the damage is done. What wife wants to actually have to speak those words? I should have put the hard brakes on it too but I wanted him to be happy. He is otherwise a great man. He is a good father, a good person. I love the extended family and we are well known and respected in the community. By all appearances, we are the perfect family. He just always seems to be seeking something and I don't know what it is. I even went as far as to try to talk to him about what look to me like compulsive behaviors. Told him I would help him any way I could, that I would be in his corner, go to counselling with him, whatever. There were a lot of tears, and I thought, maybe there was progress. The next morning, I get a phone call saying I should research swinging more and see how happy it makes people. So I guess that didn't work. My fear now is, if I stop the sexual behavior, what is the next thing? What will be the next obsession and will it be what finally breaks me for good?

Now I don't think I love him anymore. I can't seem to make myself feel anything for him. Even if I think of something horrible happening, I have no emotional response whatsoever. I get annoyed when he calls. I have to remind myself not to cringe when he touches me. Irony in that is, he is now the most romantic, loving, and attentive he has ever been, and it's all lost on me right now. He wants so much for us to be together and loves me hard, but I am so disconnected. I've thought about counselling for me and for both of us. I really don't see it helping. I don't think I have it in me. I think I'm finally done. He will be absolutely devastated and probably see it as out of left field. I have been trying really hard to just keep going and not let on anything is amiss thinking maybe I will fall back in. It's not happening. I just live for the next business trip so I can breathe. I don't even miss him when he's gone. He deserves someone who does. I am not afraid to be alone. He is terrified to be. That has always been a fundamental difference between us. So I guess my real question, how do you know that is it time to let it go. All the time invested, the life built. When did you know it was just done?


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## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

Everyone is different. Everyone has different levels of tolerance so you cannot compare.

Time for you to pull the plug, he did this, not you. He put a bomb in your marriage and used swinging/swapping as an excuse to be unfaithful when he was travelling that is all. He let the genie out of the bottle, he is self centred and should have cherished you the way you deserve to be cherished. This is not your fault, it is totally on him. I suggest that you leave him to his compulsive demons and start getting your ducks in a row, there is no helping someone who doesn't want to he helped.

You don't owe him nothing. You gave him the best years of your life, supported him financially, let him sleep with others, what else do you have to give, your blood? It is time to put yourself first. Get a good lawyer and file. You need to let him know what all his 'wanting' finally did to you, it broke you and eliminated your love for him. If he is adult enough to go wife swapping etc, he is adult enough to hear the truth and the consequences of his actions. It seems you acted more like his mother your whole life than as his wife, giving in to his every whim like some spoilt teenager, enough already!

And you shouldn't cover for him. Tell friends and family the truth. Why should you hide? you can still have a family, you just don't have to be married to him. You may well have the opportunity to meet someone who loves and cherishes you the way you want to be loved not used and abused by a so called man who says he loves you. He doesn't love you, he just doesn't want to be alone, there is a big difference there.


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## EveningThoughts (Jul 12, 2018)

It's hard for me to tell the timeline here. How long ago is it since he discovered your financial infidelity?
That must have come as a big shock to him.
You say there is resentment on both sides there. I can understand why your husband is resentful, but why are you also resentful?

Did you two get back your connection after this deceit? Or was it straight into the next phase of opening the marriage?
And, how long did you two discuss this idea for, before testing the waters?
Your husband seems to feel like he has grown closer to you since having this freedom, whereas you have grown further away.

You say that you are heartbroken because your friend can't be part of the equation anymore. That could be making you numb to your husband and possibly resentful too.

Why is it that your friend can't be part of the equation? Is it because you are going to tell your husband to close the marriage again? Or because he wants you exclusively?

It comes across in your writing as if you are not too bothered about the other woman that your husband is sleeping with, but is that the case? And it's the fact that this makes you feel less cherished that hurts so much.

You don't let many people close to you in, and for you to sleep with someone, you need a full connection, and the safety of that acceptance and connection to immerse yourself in the sexual experience.

So you wouldn't suit a casual open relationship, and poly would only work for you if you could love more than one man at the same time, maybe for different things.
Your husband probably wouldn't want you loving someone else though, as for him it's just sex with others.

There is a lot going on here in what might be a fairly short span of time.
I think you both need to close the marriage again for a decided amount of time, and actually see if you can reconnect. Assuming you want to try. That way, you know you have given it your best shot.

But if your mind is made up that you have no chance of reconnecting. Would you start a full blown relationship with your good friend?


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## Spicy (Jun 18, 2016)

It sounds like you and your OM have fallen in love with each other. Could that be true?


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

Sounds like you’ve been an enabler your entire marriage and now (understandably) you’re not happy. I once was one so I know what that’s like. I was married more than twice as long as you when I also decided to leave a cheater (because that’s what your husband is whether he wants to believe it or not). We were very young when we met and had been friends before dating. It never really worked well but I believed in marriage and didn’t want to break up my family. One day I realized I just could no longer go on the way things were. He wasn’t going to change and finally I knew it was time. He didn’t want a divorce and fought it in the beginning but I was done and no longer cared what he wanted. It was by far the best decision I ever made.


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## Farmlady (Feb 17, 2020)

EveningThoughts said:


> It's hard for me to tell the timeline here. How long ago is it since he discovered your financial infidelity?
> That must have come as a big shock to him.
> You say there is resentment on both sides there. I can understand why your husband is resentful, but why are you also resentful?
> 
> ...


Thank you for the response and questions. Timeline wise. The financial issues came out about 2 years ago. For a while after that, we did get closer for a while. I really thought we had climbed a mountain and come out the other side. I fully understand his resentment. My resentment comes from the fact that for many years (over 5), I did not ask he work a regular job outside our business. He did work but did not bring in enough to cover his expenses and I often supplemented that. During that time, we also have very small children. I hardly remember our youngest being a baby or toddler because I was working so much to keep us afloat, sometimes 12-14 hours a day for 2 weeks at a time without a day off. During all this, I told him everything was good, that I had it. I obviously didn't but did not want to let him down or take his dream away. Now I feel like he should have known. Had to know. I mean, who wants to work like that when they have a preschooler and toddler at home? I was also carrying the bulk of the childcare when I was home, making sure dinner was done, running errands in what time I had and all that. If not for the help of extended family with the kids, I don't know what I would have done. I believe he did not want his status quo upset so he turned a blind eye. None of that is to excuse my actions, only attempting to explain why I feel some resentment about that situation as well. 

The open marriage idea came about in January. There were multiple discussions surrounding it and his belief that it would help our communication and strengthen our marriage. It was early April before anything physical happened. I played along like I enjoyed the concept and that was wrong of me. I am a closed person and my husband full well knows this. It is not new information. I am insanely private. I am also angry that he would even think I could be okay with an open marriage. You are correct in that he feels he is now closer to me but I have never felt further apart. I guess that a testament to my acting skills, albeit a poor one. He was very adamant about no emotional connections. He doesn't care who I sleep with but does not want me to have any romantic connection to them. I cannot sleep with just anyone. I just do not operate that way, but I tried for him. Even in college, I was not one for casual flings. I do think he has some inkling that I am checked out, but like before, if he can ignore it, his status quo doesn't have to change. Honestly, I have told my husband I've had sex with the friend more than I have because it excites him.

It very much concerns me that I do not care about him sleeping with someone else. It's almost like part of me has just died. I have no reaction whatsoever other than maybe annoyance when he complains that she's not very good at it. Why keep doing it if it's not enjoyable other than a compulsion. Just a constant need to push the envelope. If you asked anyone who knows me at all, they would tell you I am the type of woman who would cut your *** off for stepping out on me. I feel nothing about this. Huge red flag to me. I am so tired. For the sake of all the years though, I feel like I owe it some kind of shot. I just can't guarantee I will give it my all. That is not fair to him.

As for the friend, we are unlikely friends. We get along great and, yes, there would probably be a future there if I let it after an appropriate amount of time and healing. He is not one for casual flings either, and certainly not when it comes to me. I can't factor that in though. This isn't a greener grass situation. That relationship would come with a while other set of baggage, like all do. I would have to be alone for a while first. 

I feel terrible about my disconnect and current apathy toward even trying more. I just cannot stand the thought of what might be next. I know if I pulled the plug, the biggest question for everyone would be why and I cannot stomach the thought of my children knowing what their father has asked of me and what I have done. I imagine most people in our community would assume I had an affair and he ended it. I can take the hit if it protects my children. I would probably even have to pay spousal support since I have been the primary earner all these years and even though he has relatively steady work now, I am still the primary income. The fact that I have even thought all that through and come to terms with with it, is honestly terrifying. It makes me think I'm a lot further down the road than even I want to admit.

I do apologize for the length. Brevity has never been my strong suit.


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## Farmlady (Feb 17, 2020)

Spicy said:


> It sounds like you and your OM have fallen in love with each other. Could that be true?


That has been the case for a while now though neither of us admitted it until recently. I would not even admit it to myself even after we had a close call a while back. After that, we were very careful to keep everything strictly platonic until recent events. I am not looking for a greener pasture though. He and I would definitely no be all sunshine and rainbows. I cannot allow those feelings to make this decision for me. I don't believe that once we are married we stop feeling for others or being attracted to them, but it is supposed to make us change how we respond to that. I never saw me with another man. I had written that part of my life off and I thought my husband had as well.


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## BluesPower (Mar 27, 2018)

Farmlady said:


> Thank you for the response and questions. Timeline wise. The financial issues came out about 2 years ago. For a while after that, we did get closer for a while. I really thought we had climbed a mountain and come out the other side. I fully understand his resentment. My resentment comes from the fact that for many years (over 5), I did not ask he work a regular job outside our business. He did work but did not bring in enough to cover his expenses and I often supplemented that. During that time, we also have very small children. I hardly remember our youngest being a baby or toddler because I was working so much to keep us afloat, sometimes 12-14 hours a day for 2 weeks at a time without a day off. During all this, I told him everything was good, that I had it. I obviously didn't but did not want to let him down or take his dream away. Now I feel like he should have known. Had to know. I mean, who wants to work like that when they have a preschooler and toddler at home? I was also carrying the bulk of the childcare when I was home, making sure dinner was done, running errands in what time I had and all that. If not for the help of extended family with the kids, I don't know what I would have done. I believe he did not want his status quo upset so he turned a blind eye. None of that is to excuse my actions, only attempting to explain why I feel some resentment about that situation as well.
> 
> The open marriage idea came about in January. There were multiple discussions surrounding it and his belief that it would help our communication and strengthen our marriage. It was early April before anything physical happened. I played along like I enjoyed the concept and that was wrong of me. I am a closed person and my husband full well knows this. It is not new information. I am insanely private. I am also angry that he would even think I could be okay with an open marriage. You are correct in that he feels he is now closer to me but I have never felt further apart. I guess that a testament to my acting skills, albeit a poor one. He was very adamant about no emotional connections. He doesn't care who I sleep with but does not want me to have any romantic connection to them. I cannot sleep with just anyone. I just do not operate that way, but I tried for him. Even in college, I was not one for casual flings. I do think he has some inkling that I am checked out, but like before, if he can ignore it, his status quo doesn't have to change. Honestly, I have told my husband I've had sex with the friend more than I have because it excites him.
> 
> ...


As long as this is, it does say a lot. 

I am not blaming you for anything, but I do want to say this. 

You really, really don't communicate very well, I think for a lot of reasons. 

Seriously, is you REALLY want to give him a chance, AND I MEAN REALLY, you are going to have to communicate with him. 

And I mean communicate about all of it, which I am willing to be that you have not.

Also, communicate with him about the truth, that you don't really have feeling for him, that you resent him for not earning any money, that you resent him for pushing you into swinging, that you resent him for a lot of stuff. 

And you need to say "Sorry" for not being honest. 

Otherwise, if you cannot do that above, just file for divorce. 

Whatever path you choose, you need to get some therapy about some of this. It is not good for anyone to bottle up all of the things that you have bottled up, it is really not...


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## Farmlady (Feb 17, 2020)

BluesPower said:


> As long as this is, it does say a lot.
> 
> I am not blaming you for anything, but I do want to say this.
> 
> ...





BluesPower said:


> As long as this is, it does say a lot.
> 
> I am not blaming you for anything, but I do want to say this.
> 
> ...


You are entirely correct that I have not communicated well in the past. I have been trying to make a better effort about that but it is difficult for me. The last time he was home, I brought that up. Told him how I resented that he never offered to chip in when I was working so much. Never looked at me and said, man, she really must be carrying a lot. There were many times I told him the spending needed to stop and I was told I was being overbearing or just didn't want to invest in the business. He says I should have showed him instead of just telling. He has a point. I have apologized multiple times. I truly hate that I hurt him that way. Good intentions don't really count when you end up inflicting pain like that. To his credit, he has pretty much forgiven me for that. I also told him that I felt pressured into the swapping stuff. He said he didn't think so, that I really enjoyed and didn't want to admit it. He did tell me in our discussions before anything physical happened that he wouldn't bring it up anymore and that I could let him know when I was ready. What didn't stop was side remarks or comments made "in jest" or about how he heard that XYZ had done it. He does not see how that was a source of pressure for me. I guess my instinct to make him happy is just stronger than is healthy. He is not at all an openly manipulative or secretive person. Honestly, that is usually me. I do however think he fixates on something and inadvertently manipulates. He does not see any pattern to his behavior though, only mine. He believes I am seeing one where there is not. I don't know. There are business problems too. We've had a couple bad years, and just like a lot of others, COVID may do us in. I am tired of dealing with that too.

I do appreciate the input. He is on the road a lot the next couple months and I don't feel it is fair to dump all this on him and send him out. It doesn't exactly make for good phone conversations. At this point, my plan is to see a counsellor on my own and figure out if I am even capable of moving past this. If I can ever see him as the man I need him to be. He tends to get down a rabbit hole and sex is the latest one (case in point, when I had to have surgery recently and was out of commission for 2 weeks, his first response when I told him when it was scheduled was well that just messes everything up doesn't it. He has since apologized and been very kind, but that kind of thing sticks in my head). I don't think I can handle another rabbit hole but I have to be sure before I end 20+ years of a life together. I think to do that, I have to fix me first.


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## Farmlady (Feb 17, 2020)

Openminded said:


> Sounds like you’ve been an enabler your entire marriage and now (understandably) you’re not happy. I once was one so I know what that’s like. I was married more than twice as long as you when I also decided to leave a cheater (because that’s what your husband is whether he wants to believe it or not). We were very young when we met and had been friends before dating. It never really worked well but I believed in marriage and didn’t want to break up my family. One day I realized I just could no longer go on the way things were. He wasn’t going to change and finally I knew it was time. He didn’t want a divorce and fought it in the beginning but I was done and no longer cared what he wanted. It was by far the best decision I ever made.


I very often feel like the only adult in the room. It gets so exhausting being the one who is always putting the brakes on, having to say no. Just wears on you all the time. He has been making efforts, but a large part of me thinks there's just too much damage. I don't know that I can go back. How long before the behavior reverts? Addiction manifests in many, many ways. I just keep feeling like I won't make it through whatever the next obsession is. If we did not have a good marriage otherwise, it would be easier to walk away. I almost think we would be better as business partners and maybe eventually friends, but I may not be able to be his wife anymore. He shows no sign of even admitting there is a pattern to the behavior much less changing it. He just tells me that he wanted all his life and always will but knows he sometimes has to wait to get it. I can fight any battle when I know the enemy. I can't fight one where we can't admit there even is one. I just know in my heart that there will be something else eventually. The sexual proclivities are the devil I know right now. None of if excuses what I have done. I certainly bear a lot of blame too. I have never been a believer in divorce but, now, I see it as a definite option, possibly unavoidable.


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## BluesPower (Mar 27, 2018)

Farmlady said:


> You are entirely correct that I have not communicated well in the past. I have been trying to make a better effort about that but it is difficult for me. The last time he was home, I brought that up. Told him how I resented that he never offered to chip in when I was working so much. Never looked at me and said, man, she really must be carrying a lot. There were many times I told him the spending needed to stop and I was told I was being overbearing or just didn't want to invest in the business. He says I should have showed him instead of just telling. He has a point. I have apologized multiple times. I truly hate that I hurt him that way. Good intentions don't really count when you end up inflicting pain like that. To his credit, he has pretty much forgiven me for that. I also told him that I felt pressured into the swapping stuff. He said he didn't think so, that I really enjoyed and didn't want to admit it. He did tell me in our discussions before anything physical happened that he wouldn't bring it up anymore and that I could let him know when I was ready. What didn't stop was side remarks or comments made "in jest" or about how he heard that XYZ had done it. He does not see how that was a source of pressure for me. I guess my instinct to make him happy is just stronger than is healthy. He is not at all an openly manipulative or secretive person. Honestly, that is usually me. I do however think he fixates on something and inadvertently manipulates. He does not see any pattern to his behavior though, only mine. He believes I am seeing one where there is not. I don't know. There are business problems too. We've had a couple bad years, and just like a lot of others, COVID may do us in. I am tired of dealing with that too.
> 
> I do appreciate the input. He is on the road a lot the next couple months and I don't feel it is fair to dump all this on him and send him out. It doesn't exactly make for good phone conversations. At this point, my plan is to see a counsellor on my own and figure out if I am even capable of moving past this. If I can ever see him as the man I need him to be. He tends to get down a rabbit hole and sex is the latest one (case in point, when I had to have surgery recently and was out of commission for 2 weeks, his first response when I told him when it was scheduled was well that just messes everything up doesn't it. He has since apologized and been very kind, but that kind of thing sticks in my head). I don't think I can handle another rabbit hole but I have to be sure before I end 20+ years of a life together. I think to do that, I have to fix me first.


I really think you sound like an overly nice person. 

But I really think that you are letting him off of the hook way, way way too easily. 

Just one example if his "Business". Business implies profit. His has none, it is not a business. It is a hobby or a hobby business. Not a real business. 

It would need to make a yearly salary equal to yours or what he could make after all the expenses are paid. 

He needs to let the "Business" go an get a job. That is honest communication. 

Have you looked into Co-dependency? Do you know what it is, because you seems to be completely co-dependent with or on your Husband. 

His needs, wants and desires mean more to you than yours do, right. Life is not meant to be that way...


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

No, people like him don’t like to admit their negative patterns of behavior. My husband never did —not even at the end could he admit it was all the things he did that put us there. The best he could manage to say the day the divorce was final was “some mistakes” had been made. That was a major understatement to say the least.

I was the ultimate enabler for decades and I paid a price for that. I hope you don’t wait another couple of decades, as I did, before you get out. I knew by the time that I had been married the length of time you’ve been that we just weren’t truly compatible but I didn’t believe in divorce then. Now is another story. Life is too short to stay in a marriage that doesn’t work.


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## WandaJ (Aug 5, 2014)

You are definitely done, at every level it seems. 
there is absolutely no reason for your children or family to know the details of your problems. You are allowed to keep them private, if that’s what feels right for you.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

@Farmlady what are you and your husband's backgrounds?

Are you from the same cultures, for example? The same backgrounds? Do either of you have a church you attend?

Counselling could be of benefit. A friend of mine wanted to save her marriage, she arranged a joint counselling session with her husband's agreement.

The husband didn't attend, she went by herself and the Relate counsellor was able to help her see what she already really knew on her heart, that by leaving her pregnant with twins for her supposedly lesbian best friend that their marriage was over.

She divorced him and moved on.


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## Laurentium (May 21, 2017)

Farmlady said:


> He did work but did not bring in enough to cover his expenses and I often supplemented that.


Oh, I hate people who do a hobby that (net) costs money, and call it "working".


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## Laurentium (May 21, 2017)

Farmlady said:


> Addiction manifests in many, many ways.


Yes. And with all addicts, YOU can't save them. What might help you is a support group for partners of addicts, if you can find one. NOT so you can manage him better. That's not for you to do. More so that you can avoid getting into another relationship with another addict later on.


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## Farmlady (Feb 17, 2020)

MattMatt said:


> @Farmlady what are you and your husband's backgrounds?
> 
> Are you from the same cultures, for example? The same backgrounds? Do either of you have a church you attend?
> 
> ...


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## Anastasia6 (May 28, 2017)

Ok so I'm reading and I feel like you are done. And that's ok.

He lets you pay all the bills you tell him you need to cut back on spending but that isn't good enough. He says he's in it with you but then complains he can't buy stuff. 
Oh goodie. He's had his own money for years but just now decides he'll contribute something.
Of course he has no problem with you having a higher earning potential, it's paying for his life style. He don't have to go down and get a job job like everybody else. He can play at being a business owner while not playing like an equal partner at home.
Then he is tired of his current toys so he makes you one. Constant remarks are bringing it back up and that is pressure. It is called passive aggressive. And how dare you have surgery.

Listen your communication is **** and you have to learn how to set healthy boundaries for yourself. Including physical, monetary and time. But you can learn to set those up outside of a marriage. 

I think it is great that you don't want to let 20 years go without being sure. But trust me reading just what you wrote you are sure. 

Divorce him for you. Not for anyone else but for you. Look at his actions. Do they scream partner? Do you want a true partner?


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## fencewalker (Apr 17, 2020)

Farmlady said:


> I almost think we would be better as business partners and maybe eventually friends,


This doesn't sound like such a bad idea, although I have to ask - do you think you would be happy as your ex's business partner?


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## Farmlady (Feb 17, 2020)

Just an update. After much thought and prayer, I made myself an appointment with a therapist. It is a big deal for me because I do not share. My friend and I have separated for a while for real so that I can make the decisions I need to make and get some clarity. He and I talked it out and we realize we are having an affair, straight and simple that neither one of us feels good about. He certainly deserves for respect than that as my long time friend, and frankly, I'm too good for it too. If there ever is to be a relationship between us farther down the road, this is not the way to start it. Plus, I just am not that person. I certainly cannot think that far down the road or allow it to color my decisions right now in any way. It is heart wrenching to me that I don't have my best friend to confide in through all of this, but that is just how it is.

I am having a very hard time reconciling my feelings that my marriage is over with the adoration my husband is currently heaping on me. Case in point, he surprised me by coming home a day early this week from his latest work trip. I was devastated. I was not at all emotionally or mentally prepared for him to be back and was all kinds of upset that my last night without him there was taken from me. I smiled and faked it, but inside, I was dying. I'm sure that says all kinds of things about me. Currently, my plan is to muddle through it until he comes off the road for the year and we get through the busy season of our business. I handle almost all of the logistics for it--hiring, accounting, advertising, managing staff, inventory, etc. I want to teach him how to do those things because I want out of it all. If he wants to continue with it, I feel he needs a fair shot at it, and I have to relinquish control and give him the tools to do it for all the time and money that I have already invested. I'm closing my end of the marriage. I don't care what he does. I'm not even going to tell him that. Then when that dust settles, sit him down and let him know what all this has really done to me. I honestly do not want to be mean or vindictive about any of it. I would like to part on the best terms possible but I understand that there will be a lot of hurt and anger involved, possibly on both sides. I am also going to be taking steps to have all my ducks in a row financially and mentally. All I really want is my home (which I have made all the payments on) and children and for them to have a healthy relationship with both sides. I just hope I can hold out to do all that. 

Maybe seeing the therapist will help me. I don't know that she will be able to change any of my thoughts, but maybe there is just a side I can't see. At the very least, maybe she can help me through the changes ahead and help me be a better person for my children. I appreciate everyone's input and time on here. The next 6 months are not going to be easy.


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## Hopeful Cynic (Apr 27, 2014)

It sounds to me like you two have never been a partnership. At the start, you were making a lot of sacrifices for his benefit, and he never reciprocated. Then, you started the financial infidelity instead of getting him involved in creating a solution to your unbalanced earning/spending. When that was exposed, he suggested sexual infidelity and wouldn't take your reluctance for an answer.

He has been incredibly selfish, with insatiable wants, throughout much of your marriage, if not all of it. You responded with making your own needs smaller and smaller just to satisfy his wants, eventually being dishonest about it.

I suspect he is being all affectionate and 'adoring' now because he senses your distance, and is trying to avoid having his life upended and his gravy train end. Not out of love for you. This man doesn't ever seemed to have loved you, based on your description of him being a taker who was oblivious to your suffering early on.

I wonder though, if he wants to end the marriage too. He may have been trying to find you a soft landing with another man before speaking up, or maybe he wanted you to look like the bad guy and be the one to end things. Or he may just be doing whatever it takes to manipulate you into staying because he's afraid of losing his housekeeper/accountant/HR/nanny/chef/sextoy/money.

I don't know if I would wait six months. Why can't you teach him the logistics he needs to learn after beginning the separation process? Sounds to me like you would just be making one more giant sacrifice of yourself to someone who will never reciprocate.

Get him to hire someone, and you can train that person instead.


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## Farmlady (Feb 17, 2020)

Hopeful Cynic said:


> I wonder though, if he wants to end the marriage too. He may have been trying to find you a soft landing with another man before speaking up, or maybe he wanted you to look like the bad guy and be the one to end things. Or he may just be doing whatever it takes to manipulate you into staying because he's afraid of losing his housekeeper/accountant/HR/nanny/chef/sextoy/money.


Honestly, I have had the same thoughts about me being the bad guy. He has begged me not to leave him. I really think he is terrified of being alone and does think he loves me that much. He was scared to death I had found another man when he found out about the finances. Thought I was supporting someone else. I even told my friend that I wish he had just had a straight up affair instead of coming to me with all that. Then I could have left with a clean conscience. Instead, I will have to be the evil one and bust up what looks to everyone else, including him, like a perfect union. In no way am I making excuses for what I have done. I have done a lot of wrong too. Like I told my friend, I left the day he told me I needed to sleep with his best friend (not mine), I just didn't walk away. The last time he knew I had sex with the other man, he got mad because I did not want to give him details and the whole point is for him to get something out of it too. Accused me of having an affair. True, even though he has no idea the extent, but laughable at the same time. I mean, seriously?? I'm supposed to care about your hurt feelings. Not so much anymore.


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## OnTheFly (Mar 12, 2015)

Farmlady said:


> .....have 2 children (10/13).....


If I was in a room with you two, I’d knock your heads together like a couple of empty coconuts. All this digital ink spilled and this is the only reference to your children. All these monumentally stupid decisions between the two of you and no thought to the impact of your children’s well being. I simply can’t understand the reasoning behind either of yours actions, except......(I better not say, as per forum rules).

When your dear hubby suggested an open marriage he was already banging, or had his honey already picked out. And I suspect, deep down, you also went along with it, knowing full well your best male friend was on your bang list too. Your children’s future was doomed by the YOLO and FOMO of their parents.

My advice....stay together, you’re a perfect match. At least give the kids a stable home before they’re thrust out into the ****ty world.


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## Beach123 (Dec 6, 2017)

So you worked your behind off while he wasn’t bringing in much money and HE is mad at YOU?

and you now work your job and take care of his business office stuff and he still doesn’t bring in much money? On top of that you approved him sleeping with other women? Man, he really has the cushy life eh?

and now if you leave him you will likey pay him spousal support since you are the main money earner.

well, he has disrespected you and used you... no wonder you don’t feel all happy about the marriage anymore.

stop helping him manipulate you! Say NO! He gets everything he wants at YOUR expense! Say NO!

and the other man who is single - that usually doesn’t work out long term... maybe yours will - but many times a single guy with a married woman - they like it because you don’t expect them to commit. That’s just my experience in being on forums like this since 2005.

see the counselor. But honestly, your gut knows the marriage is done. It’s hard to respect a man who really isn’t looking out for YOUR best interest! HE should have been doing everything possible to get a job that brought in steady money for the family! Instead he was asking to spend and spend. That’s not right! He’s financially irresponsible and not a good match for you. He also should have said being away from your kids that much while they were young was too much and he could have offered to work more so you could be home more often.

I’d resent the heck out of him! Add in the pressure to open the marriage and I would have been furious! He’s never going to be happy - and everything will always be your fault. He’s despicable.

get out while you can. You probably never opened up because he never allowed you to feel safe with him. I’ll never again be with a man that I don’t feel safe with - physically, emotionally or financially. You shouldn’t either.

see an attorney and see how much you’ll have to pay him in support money. He also needs to get a steady job with pay that’s stable! Traveling and seeing a girlfriend hardly counts as WORK when you’re not bringing home plenty of money. Sounds like he likes to play more than work hard.

be done. Life is happy after a long marriage ends, I promise! I have peace of mind and most days are super happy!


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## Beach123 (Dec 6, 2017)

And there isn’t any reason you have to wait six months. When you feel done - 6 months is an eternity.
Your husband is not wanting to lose his nice and easy life. That’s why he’s trying hard for you not to divorce him.

but why wait? He’s not bringing in much money now with his business... demand he get a job with steady money - that way you’ll pay less support money when you divorce.

the longer you stay the more he will use you. Keep an eye on where all the money is and where it goes. Don’t give him too much access or a bunch may suddenly disappear.


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