# Was society robbing me of my innocence?



## Watsenaam (Jun 2, 2020)

I want to know if there is something wrong with me or maybe something is wrong with society.

As I was growing up, like most other boys in modern society, I was often confronted with women in revealing clothes. On the beach, in the shops, on billboards, and even some of my parents’ friends. Women wearing form fitting pants, women wearing low blouses or bikini’s. From the age of about nine years old, I remember how extremely beautiful this was to me. It took my breath away. I can even recall some of the images till this day and I am 28 now. I usually felt guilty for looking at it, and never spent excessive time looking at such images or ladies, but just driving past or walking past I could not help noticing, looking and becoming exited and as I grew older sometimes becoming aroused. At the age of 14 I started masturbating, always with the image of a lady I saw somewhere in revealing clothes in my mind.

I became addicted to masturbation, and I could very often not help myself to look when I passed someone. I tried many times to break my addiction but was unsuccessful. I never watched porn and very seldom did I purposefully look at women in revealing clothes. Now that I am married, I do not find other women so tempting to look at anymore. But when we have sex and I need an ejaculation, thinking about those images sometimes arouse me more than my wife. I absolutely hate that, and try not to allow my thoughts to think of anyone else’s body but my wife’s but sometimes it is the only way I can get an ejaculation.

I think it would have been so wonderful, if the first time I saw the beautiful and arousing lines of a female body was on our wedding night. 100 years ago it was like that in our country. I feel like the way modern women are dressing was robbing me of my innocence and is now robbing me of a part of the beauty of sexual intimacy with my wife. Maybe I was just perverted or handling it in the wrong way? How should a nine year old respond when he is overwhelmed by the beauty of a lady in a bikini for the first time? Can I spare my son the pain I went through? Is there a way to remove all such images from my mind and only enjoy my wife’s body now? I so wish there is.


----------



## secretsheriff (May 6, 2020)

Well I do think that societee tends to objectify women, this is a self control issue. You cannot blame a society For your inability and unwillingness to control your lusts and behavior. It's a cop out.


----------



## Watsenaam (Jun 2, 2020)

So how do you think should a nine year old respond when overwhelmed by the beauty of a curvaceous lady walking past in a small bikini while he is building his little sand castle. Not expecting this excitement in his body, what should he think. The instant response in his mind is: Oh it is so beautiful and pleasant to look at! You naturally want more.


----------



## Watsenaam (Jun 2, 2020)

I honestly want to learn here. I am not here to fight with anyone. Is appreciating the beauty or being aroused by anyone except your wife wrong? Should a little boy simply not allow himself to process such images? Train his mind not to interpret what he is seeing, because as soon as he does, he enjoys it. And then after twenty years of training his mind not to enjoy this, then all of a sudden when he is married he should instantly enjoy the beauty of his wife. In an instant destroy all the years of training not to appreciate it.

We all know men are aroused visually and women by touch. So imagine a culture where it is common practice for a man to stroke any women that comes into his presence all over her body, just avoiding to much contact with the private parts. Yet there is some. If a woman or little girl enjoys it or is aroused by it, they tell them its wrong and: "you cannot blame society for your lack of self control". Then all of a sudden when she is married she is expected to be aroused by that same stimulation, just maybe more focused on the private parts than what any other man out there have been doing to her since she was a young girl. Is this any different from what our society is doing to boys?

What am I missing here?


----------



## secretsheriff (May 6, 2020)

Give me a break.

Keep on blaming others for your lack of adult self-control and respect for your wife.


----------



## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

Watsenaam said:


> We all know men are aroused visually and women by touch.


No, we don't all know this because it isn't necessarily true. Women are visual, too. Many men will tell you that touch is their love language.

I find it a little difficult to believe that 9 year old boys are getting turned on by women. If you want to protect little boys from the evils of the female form, simply don't take your little boys around scantily clad women. You can also teach your little boys to respect women and to regard them as human beings and not as sex objects.

I'm pretty sure I'm going to regret replying to this thread.


----------



## WandaJ (Aug 5, 2014)

Well, if you lived in the area of long dresses, and covered bossoms, you would have that problem too. You would get horny just be the sights of the women's ankle. 
Most men are somehow able to handle it without getting addicted. Maybe you have higher than normal libido, I don't know.


----------



## jlg07 (Feb 24, 2017)

So, here is the thing. YES we all as human animals have biological reactions to something we find sexy. AS human BEINGS, we are supposed to be self-aware and able to govern our animal instincts. This of course isn't the case for some (many?).

If you are having an issue with this, you may want to talk to a sex therapist to help you get past this.
There are therapies that may help you -- EMDR -- look into that.


----------



## Mr. Nail (Apr 26, 2011)

To wish to live in a vacuum is pointless. How would anyone have a successful marriage if they never met a woman before. How would they live a life if they never met another woman. The innocence you are seeking is imaginary. It is the goal of a society ruled by shame.


----------



## Watsenaam (Jun 2, 2020)

Thank you all for your inputs. I have my answer now, you all think I am somewhat perverted and the issues is with me, not society.

So can you help me out here. You clearly do not have the same issue as me. What is the correct way to think, what thoughts go through your mind when you suddenly find yourself talking to or looking at curvaceous lady in a bikini?

1. Not notice it at all? Is that even possible?
2. Not allow your mind to enjoy it at all/somehow not process the visual stimulus.
3. Something else?
4. So if a lady in a bikini is nothing to you, does your wife arouse you when she is wearing a bikini/normal underclothes? Or does she have to be completely naked?

Sorry for the questions, but I will appreciate your help here.


----------



## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

This is kind of an odd post but I’ll add my two cents.

I’m an American female and I am bisexual. I felt sort of similarly to the OP as a young person in, that I felt an overwhelming lust towards women in my youth. They are so beautiful that it’s literally impossible to not feel lust about them. I did feel the same about young men, but they were not showing quite as much skin as women and not as many of them exposed themselves in the same ways or had the same curves. If I had been born in another country where more men showed off more of their curves I undoubtedly would have felt more draw to men at an earlier age.

As it was here in my country, I eventually saw young hot men with amazing curves right here also. But when I was very young as the OP described, that was not normal. I wanted to see men’s bodies more closely but men at that time didn’t usually show as much. So because I was attracted to both sexes, and since men’s bodies weren’t celebrated like women’s were, the main focus of my visual attraction was on women.

So yeah, I was also a 9 year old kid with an insatiable desire to see more and more beautiful women. And even more than the OP, I had access to women’s locker rooms at the pool, gym, and at my high school. Not only did I see them in bikinis, I also saw them totally naked and showering, etc. Sometimes with me naked in the shower nearby.

It did used to confuse me and make me feel out of control. Because lust and hormones of a teen or pre teen can be quite overwhelming. I was so overwhelmed by lust that I sometimes felt insane.

Later as a young adult, I realized that this is simply part of the human experience. I learned that others also had a hard time figuring out how to respect individual humans, even while they/we were so overcome by lust for some other people that I/we couldn’t seem to think straight.

Eventually I learned that just because another person can incite lust in me, it doesn’t mean that person meant to do so nor that they had any idea it had happened. In other words, a hot dude or chick was just hot, and they were just being themselves and not deliberately trying to make me feel anything.

Once I got a handle on the fact that any lust incited in me had nothing to do with the intentions of the object of my lust, I also realized it was up to me to control my lust and not project anything upon the object of my lust. In other words, I had to learn that lots of people in the world could incite lust in me, but it was up to me to act appropriately in all circumstances AND that I had to take responsibility for all of my own reactions to others.

Eventually this translated into things like, although I’m totally turned on by this person, does it make any sense at all that this person is actually trying to make me feel dominated by their beauty or sexuality? Since most women are straight, it was eventually clear to me that all they were doing was being themselves. They were in no way trying to turn me on, even though they did. They were not trying to “corrupt” me. Their beauty and sexyness had that effect on me, but that was not their fault nor their intent. I was simply responding to something in MYSELF that noticed their sexyness.

Now about your dilemma. You have trained yourself through masturbation and focus on the idea or image of beautiful women to the extent that you can’t get off without it. But most likely this has occurred because you never had lots of great experiences with actual women before you got married. Most men who have had a fair amount of sexual experience with real women don’t stay hung up on the image or idea of some rando woman. Most men are more than able and happy to be present with a real woman and appreciate the beauty and sexuality she personally brings to the sexual experience with a man.

Maybe you should spend some time imagining your woman as a random woman on the beach in a bikini. She is just as lovely as all the others, why not put her in your mind as one of them? You have spent too much time focusing on random women and somehow made the randomness the thing you are excited for. Your own woman is the “random woman” to some other man. If you can see this yourself in your own woman, maybe you can see her as enticing as the random woman.


----------



## Watsenaam (Jun 2, 2020)

Thanks Faithful Wife for taking the time to share your experiences and wisdom with me. It really helped. I feel so sorry for what you went through. I am so glad you found answers and are now free. That is where I am trying to get to.

I think this is it, I came to believe that I had almost no control over the lusts I was feeling, but I now learn that this is wrong. There is another thing: I felt like I HAD to feel those lusts. I felt like if I did not appreciate the beauty of any women out there I would also not be able to appreciate my wife one day. If I was feeling nothing for a women dressed in a bikini, I would also feel nothing for my wife dressed like that one day. Somehow loose my appreciation for the female body altogether and I did not want that. I still struggle to understand this. Can you talk to me about it.


----------



## Watsenaam (Jun 2, 2020)

WandaJ said:


> Well, if you lived in the area of long dresses, and covered bossoms, you would have that problem too. You would get horny just be the sights of the women's ankle.
> Most men are somehow able to handle it without getting addicted. Maybe you have higher than normal libido, I don't know.


This is really not my experience, properly dressed women never had that effect on me and its not like I was not used to women in revealing clothes. They were everywhere. I would sometimes think well dressed women are beautiful or fall in love with them, but I did not lust after them. Women in revealing clothes, had a very different effect on me and I very rarely fell in love with a girl that dressed in revealing clothes.


----------



## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

When you are on a diet you look at the cakes but you don't eat them, it is called self-control. Actions begin with thoughts, you can control your thoughts. Make it a habit.


----------



## Watsenaam (Jun 2, 2020)

aine said:


> When you are on a diet you look at the cakes but you don't eat them, it is called self-control. Actions begin with thoughts, you can control your thoughts. Make it a habit.


I read your comment again: So I can and should control my thoughts on this, that is what I was never clear on. If you are controlling your thoughts about it all the time. If you remain on a diet for ten years, but is constantly tempted by cake, and then after ten years you have cake, wouldn't you have such a complex about cake by that time that it would rob you of the enjoyment? By that time you are so trained not to allow yourself to think of the delight of enjoying cake that when you have it all sorts of guilt feelings and confusion arise in your mind. This is more or less what I am feeling.

This whole thing has become a big complex in my mind, can you help to think straight about it again?


----------



## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

Watsenaam said:


> I read your comment again: So I can and should control my thoughts on this, that is what I was never clear on. If you are controlling your thoughts about it all the time. If you remain on a diet for ten years, but is constantly tempted by cake, and then after ten years you have cake, wouldn't you have such a complex about cake by that time that it would rob you of the enjoyment? By that time you are so trained not to allow yourself to think of the delight of enjoying cake that when you have it all sorts of guilt feelings and confusion arise in your mind. This is more or less what I am feeling.
> 
> This whole thing has become a big complex in my mind, can you help to think straight about it again?


It takes around 66 days to form a new habit. Practice mindfulness and self control. Why don't you start reading up on these practices.


----------



## Watsenaam (Jun 2, 2020)

aine said:


> It takes around 66 days to form a new habit. Practice mindfulness and self control. Why don't you start reading up on these practices.


What would be the new habit I am trying to form? Not to ever enjoy the beauty of a woman except that of my wife, is that not somehow confusing to the mind. Now it sees beauty and can enjoy it the next moment it sees the same beauty but this time it is not allowed to even think about it.


----------



## secretsheriff (May 6, 2020)

Watsenaam said:


> Thank you all for your inputs. I have my answer now, you all think I am somewhat perverted and the issues is with me, not society.
> 
> So can you help me out here. You clearly do not have the same issue as me. What is the correct way to think, what thoughts go through your mind when you suddenly find yourself talking to or looking at curvaceous lady in a bikini?
> 
> ...


I know several men who have struggled with lust and porn addiction. They defeated the problem by ADMITTING it was THEIR responsibility to deal with.

You still don't get that. You're still blaming everything else for YOUR behavior.

Nothing will change until YOU take responsibility.

And yes, bounce your eyes, control your thoughts, and focus on your wife and family.


----------



## secretsheriff (May 6, 2020)

Watsenaam said:


> This is really not my experience, properly dressed women never had that effect on me and its not like I was not used to women in revealing clothes. They were everywhere. I would sometimes think well dressed women are beautiful or fall in love with them, but I did not lust after them. Women in revealing clothes, had a very different effect on me and I very rarely fell in love with a girl that dressed in revealing clothes.


Again, here, you are blaming women

STOP


----------



## Watsenaam (Jun 2, 2020)

Thank you Secretsherif, your input is good. After being defeated by this for so long, I did feel like this thing was stronger than me. Like I was trying to fight a big bully and no matter what I tried, he just beat me every time. I can honestly say I really really tried over and over and over again without success. I gave this battle all I had but was defeated. But deep down I know it is my responsibility and it must be possible. If Jesus were in my shoes as a man he would not have sinned even one bit and would be as pure as the day he was born. So I do feel guilty and all the inputs gave me hope that it is possible to beat this. So today I tried. (its evening here now)

And it was wonderful, and things you all said were helping me. This morning I decided, as from that moment, my wife's body will be the only female body that I will allow to even exist in my mind. The body of any other woman will be to me like it is does not exist, because the option to lust after them no longer exists for me. That's my choice. So I made up a song with the lyrics: "to me the only feminine beauty is you, the only female body that exist in my world is yours, (wife's name)." I was singing it all day long as I was driving around. What a lunatic, I know. Suddenly I did not even notice the bodies of other women! It felt so WONDERFUL! How was this even possible after so long? But oh its so good! Thank you everyone that helped me reach this point!

I think that all the years prior to this day I had been defeated by my belief that if I conquered my desire for any woman's body I would also loose my desire for all female bodies including the body of my wife (or future wife back then). So instead of trying to conquer it I was just trying to somehow manage it. That is were I failed. Maybe it can be compared to trying to manage a relationship with another woman in stead of stopping it all together. You are playing with fire. By trying to manage my desire for other female bodies I was playing with fire and defeated.

Secretsherif, you will probably say I am just finding excuses again. This is not an excuse, I truly believed that. I am just trying to understand why all the things I have tried before never worked, but this seems to be working. Its not like I am just trying harder this time than before, I have given this battle all I had countless times but I had never reached a point before where I was even remotely winning the battle in my mind. Today I did.


----------



## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

Watsenaam said:


> We are not on the same page at all, you are clearly not living according to the Christian principles I try to build my life on, even though I was failing, I was still trying.


Jesus may have walked on water; but, he was still a mortal man. He had urges just like every other man on earth. It's how he handled them that you want to emulate. Pretending you are deaf, dumb and blind will not serve you well.


----------



## Watsenaam (Jun 2, 2020)

Blondilocks said:


> Jesus may have walked on water; but, he was still a mortal man. He had urges just like every other man on earth. It's how he handled them that you want to emulate. Pretending you are deaf, dumb and blind will not serve you well.


And if your eye causes you to stumble, gouge it out and throw it away. It is better for you to enter life with one eye than to have two eyes and be thrown into the fire of hell.

If God said it, it is true for me.

If its the best way I can get this sin out of my life I will do it. Walking around like I am blind. I am asking you as well, what benefit could it possibly bring my wife if I were enjoying the beauty of other women? No after today I am convinced she should be the only female body that exist in my universe.


----------



## Watsenaam (Jun 2, 2020)

I am going to bed now. Feel free to comment in the meantime, but I will only be answering tomorrow. Thanks for what you all contributed so far, I have definitely learned a lot.


----------



## fencewalker (Apr 17, 2020)

I don't think you should feel so guilty about thinking of other women when you are with your wife. Everyone does it. It's not as if you're going out and raping people. I think the problem here is that you believe that feeling attracted to people other than your wife is immoral. It isn't. It's natural. There's no sense in trying to train yourself not to be attracted to others. That's just biology. As long as you're treating your wife well and she is happy than there's nothing for you to feel ashamed of.


----------



## badsanta (Oct 13, 2014)

Watsenaam said:


> Hi Erlegirl,
> 
> I think for me there is no need to appreciate the beauty of another woman. Why would I want to do that? It is simpler, let my wife be the only one I appreciate. Then there is definitely no competition whatsoever she can feel perfectly safe, cherished and loved.
> 
> I do not think I am obsessed with anything else in my life. This is the only thing I know of.


The notion of what you describe sound valiant as an effort to make your marriage safe and secure. Unfortunately human sexuality does not play by a set of rules that we assign to it. Instead human sexuality tends to teach everyone a lesson of vulnerability. It is not until you learn to be humble and accept vulnerability that you will be able to be valiant and protect your marriage. 

Imagine an ancient warrior with an extreme allergy to flowers. In order to make everyone around him safe, he wishes his allergies away and tells no one about it. As a reward for helping keep everyone safe people bring him flowers as a way of showing thanks. ...that is an exaggeration of how life works. Now imagine if this warrior was brave enough to share with everyone the idea that flowers made him vulnerable, well then everyone would certainly want to help and keep flowers away. THEN after having embraced this vulnerability and sharing it this warrior will now be able to help keep everyone safe.

That is a silly story, but I am trying to make a point that you have to share your vulnerabilities with the one's you love so that they can help you be the best person you can be. 

Regards, 
Badsanta


----------



## secretsheriff (May 6, 2020)

Watsenaam said:


> We are not on the same page at all, you are clearly not living according to the Christian principles I try to build my life on, even though I was failing, I was still trying.


I am a Christian. I Corinthians 10:13, Galatians 5:22,23 and countless other verses give us guidance on temptation and self control.

I suspect you were brought up in a Duggar family style church where all the blame for men's lust was placed on women. Jesus' own words tell us that is simply not true.

One thing I would recommend is to find these verses, memorize them, and meditate on them. That's what Jesus did to resist Satan after 40 days in the desert.


----------



## Rob_1 (Sep 8, 2017)

Blondilocks said:


> No, we don't all know this because it isn't necessarily true. Women are visual, too. Many men will tell you that touch is their love language.
> 
> I find it a little difficult to believe that 9 year old boys are getting turned on by women. If you want to protect little boys from the evils of the female form, simply don't take your little boys around scantily clad women. You can also teach your little boys to respect women and to regard them as human beings and not as sex objects.
> 
> I'm pretty sure I'm going to regret replying to this thread.


what do you mean by you finding difficult to believe that 9 years old boys can get aroused /turn on by women? how sheltered have you lived your life? I clearly remember having sex by 7 years of age with a 7 years old girl. I clearly remember having a girlfriend when I was 9, and so were other of my male/female friends. although biologically not everyone start to develop sexually at the same time there are children all over the world the by age 6-7 they are already experiencing/feeling sexual desires even if on a cognitive basis. 

As for the OP. Cut the BS. You are responsible for yourself. society has nothing to do with your inability to control yourself, that's all on you.


----------



## secretsheriff (May 6, 2020)

Rob_1 said:


> what do you mean by you finding difficult to believe that 9 years old boys can get aroused /turn on by women? how sheltered have you lived your life? I clearly remember having sex by 7 years of age with a 7 years old girl. I clearly remember having a girlfriend when I was 9, and so were other of my male/female friends. although biologically not everyone start to develop sexually at the same time there are children all over the world the by age 6-7 they are already experiencing/feeling sexual desires even if on a cognitive basis.
> 
> As for the OP. Cut the BS. You are responsible for yourself. society has nothing to do with your inability to control yourself, that's all on you.


Honestly, the only children of 6 or 7 I have known who experience this are those who have been sexually abused.


----------



## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

secretsheriff said:


> Honestly, the only children of 6 or 7 I have known who experience this are those who have been sexually abused.


Do you think every person you know has told you about all of their sexual feelings and how far back in their life they had them? Why would they?


----------



## Mr. Nail (Apr 26, 2011)

I would never have guessed that christian would have been the claim here.
I'm going to foolishly stick my foot in one more time. In order to learn to resist the temptations of the flesh you need to experience those temptations. God has never offered to take away your temptations. He has offered to strengthen you. He has promised not to tempt you beyond what you can bear.


----------



## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Watsenaam said:


> I am not attacking you personally, I just said our value systems are incompatible. I hold to my point.
> 
> You only have sex with men because that's what you prefer, and basically everything you said is not what I believe God is saying in the Bible.
> 
> ...


No, my point was that you need to remove the lust from your heart. Once you do, you will be able to look at a beautiful woman and see that she is beautiful but not lust after her, not have sexual desires.



Watsenaam said:


> “But I tell you that anyone who *looks at a woman* lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart.” That is not something to play around with. I would want to stay as far away from that as I possibly can.
> 
> It does not say looking at a women with sexual lust, it said lustfully. Just because it is not sexual does not mean it is not lust.



The definition of "lust" is "very strong sexual desire."
the definition of "lustfully" is - "full of or motivated by lust, greed, or the like; having strong sexual desires; lecherous; libidinous.
If you do not look at a woman with sextual desire, then you will not be looking at her lustfully.

I find it odd that in many ways Faithful Wife told you the same thing and you praised her.

I'm done talking to you. Go find a professional or clergy to help you because you are way too confused.


----------



## secretsheriff (May 6, 2020)

EleGirl said:


> No, my point was that you need to remove the lust from your heart. Once you do, you will be able to look at a beautiful woman and see that she is beautiful but not lust after her, not have sexual desires.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Like I said, I suspect some extensive fundamentalist legalism at play.


----------



## Rob_1 (Sep 8, 2017)

secretsheriff said:


> Honestly, the only children of 6 or 7 I have known who experience this are those who have been sexually abused.


Just because that's your experience doesn't mean that is not true. Sexual experimentation by children among themselves around the world has been happening since the beginning for mankind. In sexually repressed societies like many communities across the US and other parts of the world is more difficult for children to express/repress this behavior because they are being watch more. Although, it is true that for those children that unfortunately had been sexually molested would exhibit this behavior. So sad because it's not the natural normal child"s curiosity that it's driving the behavior but a profoundly sick, life/mind altering experience.
O.K., I don't want to hijack the tread.


----------



## secretsheriff (May 6, 2020)

Rob_1 said:


> Just because that's your experience doesn't mean that is not true. Sexual experimentation by children among themselves around the world has been happening since the beginning for mankind. In sexually repressed societies like many communities across the US and other parts of the world is more difficult for children to express/repress this behavior because they are being watch more. Although, it is true that for those children that unfortunately had been sexually molested would exhibit this behavior. So sad because it's not the natural normal child"s curiosity that it's driving the behavior but a profoundly sick, life/mind altering experience.
> O.K., I don't want to hijack the tread.


Ah, you're talking about normal childhood curiosity. Understood.


----------



## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

Watsenaam said:


> We are not on the same page at all, you are clearly not living according to the Christian principles I try to build my life on, even though I was failing, I was still trying.


I think you are being very rude to @EleGirl and to say she is not living according to Christian principles is not yours to judge. In fact the bible very clearly says, 'take the log out of your own eye before you take the speck out of your brother's eye' and 'judge not and ye shall not be judged' all very standard Christian principles which you don't seem to apply here on this forum. So please tone it down
You will also know that the bible says in 2 Corinthians 10:5 _We demolish arguments and every pretension that sets itself up against the knowledge of God, and we take captive every thought to make it obedient to Christ. _Taking every thought captive is talking about self-control which many have mentioned here including myself. It is about starting with your though life. If such a though arises then you have to stop it and not ruminate and go exploring and wandering down that road. Men are visual and enjoy the beauty of women but that does not mean they have to feast on those thoughts because that is wandering into the area of lust. Only you can do this, no-one can do it for you. If you are a christian as you say, then you know that prayer can help you with this and I am sure there are brothers in your church who would be more than willing to be your accountability partners on this issue.


----------



## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

Watsenaam said:


> Hi Erlegirl,
> 
> I think for me there is no need to appreciate the beauty of another woman. Why would I want to do that? It is simpler, let my wife be the only one I appreciate. Then there is definitely no competition whatsoever she can feel perfectly safe, cherished and loved.
> 
> I do not think I am obsessed with anything else in my life. This is the only thing I know of.


Appreciation of beauty and acting lustfully are two different things altogether. This is why in some countries men insist that women are covered in head to toe because they associate women's beauty with lust. You have been this way for so long, you now have to retrain yourself and your thoughts, by getting some spiritual help.


----------



## Watsenaam (Jun 2, 2020)

badsanta said:


> The notion of what you describe sound valiant as an effort to make your marriage safe and secure. Unfortunately human sexuality does not play by a set of rules that we assign to it. Instead human sexuality tends to teach everyone a lesson of vulnerability. It is not until you learn to be humble and accept vulnerability that you will be able to be valiant and protect your marriage.
> 
> Imagine an ancient warrior with an extreme allergy to flowers. In order to make everyone around him safe, he wishes his allergies away and tells no one about it. As a reward for helping keep everyone safe people bring him flowers as a way of showing thanks. ...that is an exaggeration of how life works. Now imagine if this warrior was brave enough to share with everyone the idea that flowers made him vulnerable, well then everyone would certainly want to help and keep flowers away. THEN after having embraced this vulnerability and sharing it this warrior will now be able to help keep everyone safe.
> 
> ...


Thanks for that Badsanta, it is a good illustration. The reason I am not appreciating the beauty of any other women is because I am so totally aware of my vulnerability. I did not mention it before, but I told my wife all about my struggles even before we got married. She knows, she says she forgives me. I really do not want to hurt her, so I did not mention the fact that I sometimes think of other women while having sex. I would rather remove it from my life than causing her the pain. It is really my problem, not hers, she is doing nothing wrong. It may just cause her to think she is not beautiful enough or something. I hope it makes sense to you? If you think there is benefit in telling her about this part, let me know why and I will consider it. Thanks for message.


----------



## Watsenaam (Jun 2, 2020)

aine said:


> I think you are being very rude to @EleGirl and to say she is not living according to Christian principles is not yours to judge. In fact the bible very clearly says, 'take the log out of your own eye before you take the speck out of your brother's eye' and 'judge not and ye shall not be judged' all very standard Christian principles which you don't seem to apply here on this forum. So please tone it down
> You will also know that the bible says in 2 Corinthians 10:5 _We demolish arguments and every pretension that sets itself up against the knowledge of God, and we take captive every thought to make it obedient to Christ. _Taking every thought captive is talking about self-control which many have mentioned here including myself. It is about starting with your though life. If such a though arises then you have to stop it and not ruminate and go exploring and wandering down that road. Men are visual and enjoy the beauty of women but that does not mean they have to feast on those thoughts because that is wandering into the area of lust. Only you can do this, no-one can do it for you. If you are a christian as you say, then you know that prayer can help you with this and I am sure there are brothers in your church who would be more than willing to be your accountability partners on this issue.


Hi Aine, I was not trying to be rude to EleGirl at all. I just read her post and it was immediately clear to me that we are on very different pages. I never meant to judge her. I just said she is not living to the same Christian principles I try to build my life on. That is clear from her own words. I am not judging her at all. She is free to believe and do whatever she thinks is right. I never said she is living in sin, or any of that. I just think there are such fundamental differences between our beliefs that most of what she said is not helping me at all. She probably mean well and I thanked her for her time, but I did not want her to waste her time here.

Aine, I have prayed about this, I have pleaded with God, I even became suicidal because of this sin in my life and all the guilt feeling I had. I hated myself for it. This has been a very big thing to me. I would have killed myself at one point, but then I realized it would be adding sin to sin. Killing myself is a sin too, and it will not help. So I had to learn to accept God's forgiveness for what I did. I asked my father to help me with this at one point, he simply said I am being too hard on myself, its okay. To me this was not an acceptable answer. I had no-one else I could trust for help.


----------



## Watsenaam (Jun 2, 2020)

secretsheriff said:


> I am a Christian. I Corinthians 10:13, Galatians 5:22,23 and countless other verses give us guidance on temptation and self control.
> 
> I suspect you were brought up in a Duggar family style church where all the blame for men's lust was placed on women. Jesus' own words tell us that is simply not true.
> 
> One thing I would recommend is to find these verses, memorize them, and meditate on them. That's what Jesus did to resist Satan after 40 days in the desert.


I could see you were Christian and adhering to more or less the same principles than me. Even though you were hard on me, you helped me secretsheriff. You are totally wrong on this point though, I live in a community where people think a woman can dress however she likes, it is all on men not to lust.

Because I was so defeated by this from such an early age, I just felt that being exposed to the bodies of women at an early age could be like being exposed to drugs, alcohol or any other big temptation that society usually protect kids from. If you are a drug addict, it does not help you blame the drugs, but if you became a drug addict at the age of nine, surely you can feel that it was not good being exposed to it at such an early age. That is the reason for the title of this thread. I am not saying its not my responsibility I just though it may be a bit unfair to expose innocent boys to this. Also, at that point I have not received any guidance on this from my parents, they thought I was just too young. They only gave me some guidance when I was about thirteen I just wanted to explain this so there is no misunderstanding.


----------



## Young at Heart (Jan 6, 2015)

Watsenaam said:


> I want to know if there is something wrong with me or maybe something is wrong with society.
> 
> As I was growing up, like most other boys in modern society, I was often confronted with women in revealing clothes. ........ I never watched porn and very seldom did I purposefully look at women in revealing clothes. Now that I am married, I do not find other women so tempting to look at anymore. But when we have sex and I need an ejaculation, thinking about those images sometimes arouse me more than my wife. I absolutely hate that, and try not to allow my thoughts to think of anyone else’s body but my wife’s but sometimes it is the only way I can get an ejaculation.
> 
> ...


First of all beauty and sexual lust have been around for a long time. Rubenesque beauties are very full figured women and once the rage, as were corsets, hoop skirts, bustles, etc. Once upon a time an ankle was a sexual turn on. I came of age during the late 60's, the era of no bras, miniskirts and free love. I have a 70 year old wife that I have been married to for almost 48 years, who I think is absolutely beautiful. Just think about that for a moment.

You can't change the past. Live with it and enjoy the present.

Now as to your question of what can you do about the present. Try some affirmations or self hypnosis about how beautiful you find your wife's body. Maybe if you are brave enough you can ask her to help you with the affirmations by posing for you. She might even enjoy it. Then start fantasizing about your wife. Even better yet, open your eyes when you make love to your wife and tell her how beautiful she is.

Good luck and leave the past behind.


----------



## VladDracul (Jun 17, 2016)

Watsenaam said:


> Because I was so defeated by this from such an early age, I just felt that being exposed to the bodies of women at an early age could be like being exposed to drugs, alcohol or any other big temptation that society usually protect kids from. If you are a drug addict, it does not help you blame the drugs, but if you became a drug addict at the age of nine, surely you can feel that it was not good being exposed to it at such an early age. That is the reason for the title of this thread. I am not saying its not my responsibility I just though it may be a bit unfair to expose innocent boys to this. Also, at that point I have not received any guidance on this from my parents, they thought I was just too young. They only gave me some guidance when I was about thirteen I just wanted to explain this so there is no misunderstanding.



Watsenaam, you don't have a lot of "experience" with women, do you. Sounds like you've spent far too much time in your room with widow thumb and her four daughters and too little time out trapping beaver. Get over your horse shyt an whining about "I'm so upset thinking about the beauty of other woman " and service that filly you have in your bed. Hell dawg, she's probably thought about that buff, shirtless neighbor out cutting his lawn a time or two while youre in the saddle.


----------



## Watsenaam (Jun 2, 2020)

Hi All, Thank you so much for your time, advice and input! As I have written you helped me a lot. I apologize for not responding to all comments but I assure you I read them all and some helped even if I did not reply. I just don't have time to respond everyone now.

Okay so this is my last post! What?!? Let me explain:

So my wife is becoming upset about how much time this is taking and I understand her point. It also makes her feel uncomfortable. She is hearing impaired (deaf) and has a very limited understanding of English, so she cannot really understand what I am saying even though she is reading it. I want to honor her and quit talking on this thread so this is the reason for me leaving at this point. secretsheriff, you will probably say I am using it as an excuse again. There is no way I can prove this to you but you can take my word I am not lying to you. I will come back to read further comments, but I will probably not post again for my wife's sake.

Let me just post my final thoughts. I learned a lot, you completely convinced me again that I and I alone are responsible for my lusts. You also gave me hope again that it is possible to defeat this, I admit I was loosing hope and fearing that my son would have to go through the same struggle I did. You helped me reach a point where I decided my wife's body will be the only female body that I will allow to exist in my mind. Other bodies will be like their not even there. This helped me far more than I expected. Even last night, my wife and I had some of the best intimacy ever and if any thought about any other women came to mind, I nipped it in the but by immediately thinking, to me they no longer exist, the only female body in my world in the one right in front of me now. And it worked, thoughts were gone. It worked so much better than what I was previously thinking: "you should not be thinking this, why are you doing this while your wife's body is right in front of you? What is wrong with you, you are messed up, stop it now" That did not work. I am not willing to go back to a place where I allow any other woman in my thoughts, I just feels too good having only my wife there.

I love my wife and I just want the best for her. If something is not beneficial to her, why would I want to do it? I also believe in God and His Word have final authority in my life.

You are welcome to continue this discussion, speak your mind to me again or speak to each other, I will come back to read. Thanks for everything and blessings to you all.


----------



## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

Rob_1 said:


> what do you mean by you finding difficult to believe that 9 years old boys can get aroused /turn on by women? how sheltered have you lived your life? I clearly remember having sex by 7 years of age with a 7 years old girl. I clearly remember having a girlfriend when I was 9, and so were other of my male/female friends. although biologically not everyone start to develop sexually at the same time there are children all over the world the by age 6-7 they are already experiencing/feeling sexual desires even if on a cognitive basis.
> 
> As for the OP. Cut the BS. You are responsible for yourself. society has nothing to do with your inability to control yourself, that's all on you.


Yep, I knew I was going to regret replying to this thread. Now, I get to picture 7 year old children having sex. WTF????? Don't bother replying as I won't be back to the thread.


----------



## badsanta (Oct 13, 2014)

Watsenaam said:


> Thanks for that Badsanta, it is a good illustration. The reason I am not appreciating the beauty of any other women is because I am so totally aware of my vulnerability. I did not mention it before, but I told my wife all about my struggles even before we got married. She knows, she says she forgives me. I really do not want to hurt her, so I did not mention the fact that I sometimes think of other women while having sex. I would rather remove it from my life than causing her the pain. It is really my problem, not hers, she is doing nothing wrong. It may just cause her to think she is not beautiful enough or something. I hope it makes sense to you? If you think there is benefit in telling her about this part, let me know why and I will consider it. Thanks for message.


That is a tough one. Have you ever heard the saying, "don't think of pink elephants!" Of course the first thing that might happen is for everyone to think about pink elephants. 

I think you could tell your wife in general that you still struggle with things in your mind and that it bothers you. Perhaps leave out the part of it occurring during marital relations. Since this is your problem and she has done nothing wrong, you may want to consider talking to a therapist about it. 

Also please be kind to everyone here as they are all trying to help you. The nature in which you reply to some of the administrators is an indication you may have some serious struggles. It is never easy to try and help others. And no good deed goes unpunished.

Regards, 
Badsanta


----------



## secretsheriff (May 6, 2020)

This is personal so you don't have to answer

Were you molested in any way at a very young age? Natural body curiosity is normal in kids, but actual sexual fixation is NOT.


----------



## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

@Watsenaam It is normal for men to be attracted to women. Stop worrying and just love your wife.


----------



## CatholicDad (Oct 30, 2017)

I think it a fantastic virtue when women dress modestly... it is a very charitable thing to do.

The sacrament of confession could have kept you on track as a boy and young man. Lusting after women’s bodies and masturbation are pretty serious sins. All of our eyes wander.. a glance at a curvy woman unintentionally is a small sin versus running your eyes all over someone purposefully and then reliving it via masturbation.

I believe we aren’t meant to just give into every carnal desire that pops into our heads... or eye “grope” every woman that crosses our path. This is beneath our dignity and theirs.

I also think dads need to have serious talks with sons while they are still young... get them pointed in the right direction. All this lust is healthy and normal... I just think men need to learn to deal with in healthy ways.


----------

