# Need sex advice



## hurting guy (Oct 8, 2012)

I have a previous thread, but have a specific question here. My wife cut off all sex about 10 months ago, but in the last couple months she has given me some signs of hope for our marraige. She had sex with me once about two weeks ago. The problem is I keep getting all these mixed signals. On one hand, she will show a sign of affection toward me, maybe a handhold or a side hug, but then it is followed by signs of "do not touch me" and "keep your distance." The sex was pretty forced on her part, I don't think she was that into it, but I give her credit for even trying. I have read various resources, and I think some would say I should continue to show physical affection (that is not overtly sexual) even if she does not seem to want the affection and does not return the affection. But I think other people would say that unwanted touching, unwanted kisses, will make her resentment increase. So, looking to see what people on the forum think? Should I back off, or press on?

By the way, trying to talk to her is like mind-reading. She thinks she is this open book and able to discuss all things, but it is only that way with her girlfriends. With me, I have to be clairvoyant to know what she is really thinking about sex and about me. In a discussion, I thnk she would say something like "of course, I want your affection" but then in daily living she sends the non-verbal message that my affection is not wanted and is not missed.

My goal remains to stay married and have an exicting sex life with her.


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## KathyBatesel (Apr 26, 2012)

I believe when you get mixed messages, you should always believe the message you'd rather not believe. In your case, it's that she doesn't want affection and touch from you. 

Did her sexual cutoff correlate to her girl friend's arrival on the scene (or with a sudden increase in the time they spend together or the things they do together?)

As far your stated goal to remain married and have an exciting sex life with her, it may be time to recognize that you simply do not have control of that and never will. In fact, I'd venture to say you will never have even an adequate sexual relationship with her again.


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## hurting guy (Oct 8, 2012)

Perhaps you are right about the future, but I hope not. It is very confusing because she says she wants the marriage to work, but then she also says maybe we can redefine what that looks like. I ask what she means by "redefine" and she won't tell me, she says she is not sure yet, but I think she is thinking we could have a marraige where we live together, I work and pay for everything, we are civil toward each other, but we don't have sex anymore. I don't want to live that way. I think life offers more than that. The girlfriend has been around for a couple years, but the sex cutoff occurred when they started spending more time together, especially after they spent a weekend together. She had last Friday night with the girlfriend too because it was her birthday; she called it a slumber party, but it was just the two of them. Of course, they could have celebrated a nice birthday without spending the night. Despite how it sounds, I really do not believe it is a PA, but it is an EA. I think the GF is like the sister she never had. If I am wrong about that, I will be stunned.


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## southern wife (Jul 22, 2011)

I think the GF is like the GF, and your wife is either bi or all out Lez.

That being the case, OF COURSE she wants to still be married to you, *have you pay her way*, and NOT have sex with you. Dude, open your eyes!!!!

Wives do not, that I know of, have "slumber parties".....just the 2 of us.  I have not had a "slumber party" since HS. :wtf:


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## Trying2figureitout (Feb 3, 2011)

OP...what happened around 10 months ago... any triggering event?


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## wiigirl (Jun 14, 2012)

southern wife said:


> I think the GF is like the GF, and your wife is either bi or all out Lez.
> 
> That being the case, OF COURSE she wants to still be married to you, *have you pay her way*, and NOT have sex with you. Dude, open your eyes!!!!
> 
> Wives do not, that I know of, have "slumber parties".....just the 2 of us.  I have not had a "slumber party" since HS. :wtf:


:iagree:








_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## lovetopleasewife (Oct 7, 2012)

Well her girlfriend does not seem to be a friend of the relationship. If I had a friend that did not benefit the relationship with my Spouse or at least be neutural to the relationship, than that would not be my friend. IMO, she needs to lose this GF. I agree with Southern Wife, I think it is a PA going on.


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## jenny8675309 (Oct 20, 2012)

I totally agree...I'm 35 and haven't had a "sleepover" since I was a young teenager. Maybe you should talk to her about her relationship with her "friend"? It sounds like there's a strong possibility that she is having a sexual relationship with her...


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## Emerald (Aug 2, 2012)

jenny8675309 said:


> I totally agree...I'm 35 and haven't had a "sleepover" since I was a young teenager. Maybe you should talk to her about her relationship with her "friend"? It sounds like there's a strong possibility that she is having a sexual relationship with her...


Another wife here who doesn't have "sleepovers" with my girlfriends....

You said she wants to "redefine the marriage" .........WTH does THAT mean?

Man & Wife & Girlfriend?

Do you have children together?

I do feel really bad for you OP.


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## EnjoliWoman (Jul 2, 2012)

Yeah... the closest thing I've had to a "sleepover" is when I've been out with a friend and didn't want to drink and drive after barhopping after work one Friday. It was poor judgement on our part that SHE drove but her house was only a couple miles and mine was another 15. 

That has happened ONCE in my adult life and I was in my early 30s and my husband didn't want to wake a toddler to come and get me (nor did I want him to) and I slept in her guest room - it wasn't a "slumber party", it was sleeping it off. Husband got me the next day and took me to where I left my car.


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## hurting guy (Oct 8, 2012)

Regarding 10 months ago, we had been struggling in our marriage, we had a fight where she said something to me (don't even know what) and I responded by saying that in our marraige sex had been routine, boring, no variety (she always had to have the exact same position). She was very mad. Then, a couple days later, we started having the best sex of our marraige. Positions that she used to say were painful, she now initiated and seemed to enjoy. She even engaged in oral sex on me which she very rarely did before. Then, after about three weeks, the hot sex was suddenly cut off. She said it wasn't working for her and that she had been faking it. Now, 10 months later, she is seemingly opening the door, but then the mixed messages are all over the place. Come here, come here, come here, then get away, get away, get away. Meanwhile, a lot of time continues to be spent with the GF.

If you all are right and there is a lesbian PA, all I can do is shake my head in amazement. Should I just flat out ask her? I am sure she would deny it and probably get very angry for my even asking the question, and say that I should know her better than that.

I would like to believe that she is truthful when she says she wants to heal the marraige, and there are some positive signs, but all these mixed messages keep throwing me off.


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## southern wife (Jul 22, 2011)

No do not flat out ask her - she will lie.

Get a VAR - put one in the house where she talks on the phone and put one under the seat in her car.

Check her emails and texts. 

Get your evidence before you say anything to her.


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## hurting guy (Oct 8, 2012)

Emerald, we do have children (three boys) but they are all grown. The youngest just started college. So, we are becoming empty nesters which seems to be all wrapped up in our marital problems too. I think the only reason she didn't file for divorce was because it would really hurt our kids. Emerald, you previously mentioned the "walk away wife" situation, and I think that is on target in many ways. So, I am trying to deal with that while getting all these confusing and inconsistent signals.


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## lovetopleasewife (Oct 7, 2012)

:iagree:


southern wife said:


> No do not flat out ask her - she will lie.
> 
> Get a VAR - put one in the house where she talks on the phone and put one under the seat in her car.
> 
> ...


:iagree:


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## Trying2figureitout (Feb 3, 2011)

hurting guy said:


> Regarding 10 months ago, we had been struggling in our marriage, we had a fight where she said something to me (don't even know what) and I responded by saying that in our marraige sex had been routine, boring, no variety (she always had to have the exact same position). She was very mad. Then, a couple days later, we started having the best sex of our marraige. Positions that she used to say were painful, she now initiated and seemed to enjoy. She even engaged in oral sex on me which she very rarely did before. Then, after about three weeks, the hot sex was suddenly cut off. She said it wasn't working for her and that she had been faking it. Now, 10 months later, she is seemingly opening the door, but then the mixed messages are all over the place. Come here, come here, come here, then get away, get away, get away. Meanwhile, a lot of time continues to be spent with the GF.
> 
> If you all are right and there is a lesbian PA, all I can do is shake my head in amazement. Should I just flat out ask her? I am sure she would deny it and probably get very angry for my even asking the question, and say that I should know her better than that.
> 
> I would like to believe that she is truthful when she says she wants to heal the marraige, and there are some positive signs, but all these mixed messages keep throwing me off.


Women are very sensitive to "sex isn't that good" I learned that the hard way... I'm in a sexless marriage. My wife misunderstood my comment was about frequency more than quality. Still waiting for her to come around.

Think she will eventually. It takes time.

Sounds like your wife felt used and just figured enough's enough.
Sorry to say its a long road ahead. Certainly spy and see if there's a third party.


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## hurting guy (Oct 8, 2012)

Yes, some others have told me to do some snooping too. I don't like the idea of doing that, but I understand that it would help if I could learn the truth. Ultimately, that is all I really want. Just give me the truth. I can handle the truth. It is all these mixed messages, yanked one way and then another, that is messing with my ability to cope, or respond.


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## Trying2figureitout (Feb 3, 2011)

hurting guy said:


> Yes, some others have told me to do some snooping too. I don't like the idea of doing that, but I understand that it would help if I could learn the truth. Ultimately, that is all I really want. Just give me the truth. I can handle the truth. It is all these mixed messages, yanked one way and then another, that is messing with my ability to cope, or respond.


Try doing it for almost three years! Still don't have THE TRUTH.
Understand you are in this for the long haul. I don't know when my ordeal will end but it will eventually. Just ride it out as long as you can... snoop but try not to be a basket case. Its hard.
More normal the better.


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## anchorwatch (Mar 5, 2012)

I could not live in a marriage like that. That wasn't the agreement when you gave each other your vows, was it?. She changed the rules. Now she want's to be roommates instead of lovers? From what she say's and is doing, I do not see you getting what you're looking for. You want what is normal in a marriage, intimacy with someone you love. She wants to live like sister and brother or worse, live her life disconnected emotionally from you on your meal ticket. 

I think you're losing because you've been giving her to much power in this relationship too. So far as you have described, she has made every decision independently without regards to your feelings or thoughts. It should have been you telling her you won't live in a marriage where there is no emotional intimacy, from the beginning. She is not allowing you to fill her EN's is she? Am I wrong to think you have tried everything except telling her that you won't stay in a sexless relationship? 

I'm sorry but I think she is leaving you no option except to destabilize her grip on this issue by telling her you will divorce and find someone who can love you more that a roommate. Then she can decide to either work on the marriage and intimacy issues together or find another roommate. 

If she is preparing to be a WAW there may not be an AP. Yet as the others have said, discretely verify her relationship with the GF


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## thunderstruck (May 9, 2012)

hurting guy said:


> I think the only reason she didn't file for divorce was because it would really hurt our kids.


I bet the main reason she won't divorce is b/c her needs are being met by one or more people outside of the marriage. 

Your needs...she could give a F**K, and she has no incentive to change things.


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

It's time to show her some consequences and start divorce proceedings you can always change your mind if you shock her out of it but 10 months no sex screw that!


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## hurting guy (Oct 8, 2012)

Trying2 : Wow, three years of similar stuff for you, that has got to be rough. I don't think I could handle it that long. 

Anchorwatch: Yep, she is blocking me from meeting her EN. I could tell her that I will not stay in a marraige without emotional and sexual intimacy. I think she knows that risk, but I think she is banking on my love for our boys. So I have two problems with thinking about or threatening divorce. One, I still love her. Second, a divorce would be devastating for the kids, even though they are young adults. Deep down, I would rather sacrifice my own happiness than ruin theirs. So, I am not giving up, but I don't know how to deal with the mixed messages. I guess the advice is that I need to believe the message that I don't want to hear; that is, she really doesn't want intimacy with me right now. Believe those messages, but not the others. But I am running out of patience.

Btw, she refuses marraige counseling (she says she already knows what they will say) and she agreed to IC, and I told her great and said to make an appointment, but she has not followed through, and I don't think she will.


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## Trying2figureitout (Feb 3, 2011)

hurting guy said:


> Trying2 : Wow, three years of similar stuff for you, that has got to be rough. I don't think I could handle it that long.
> 
> Anchorwatch: Yep, she is blocking me from meeting her EN. I could tell her that I will not stay in a marraige without emotional and sexual intimacy. I think she knows that risk, but I think she is banking on my love for our boys. So I have two problems with thinking about or threatening divorce. One, I still love her. Second, a divorce would be devastating for the kids, even though they are young adults. Deep down, I would rather sacrifice my own happiness than ruin theirs. So, I am not giving up, but I don't know how to deal with the mixed messages. I guess the advice is that I need to believe the message that I don't want to hear; that is, she really doesn't want intimacy with me right now. Believe those messages, but not the others. But I am running out of patience.
> 
> Btw, she refuses marraige counseling (she says she already knows what they will say) and she agreed to IC, and I told her great and said to make an appointment, but she has not followed through, and I don't think she will.


The issue is she needs to want to fix herself. She may get there eventually. Think my wife will because its getting old. We both know we want less stress and to move on just a question of when.


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## hurting guy (Oct 8, 2012)

Hmmm. Sounds like your approach is to just give it time, and eventually she will come around. You mentioned you are in a sexless marraige -- do you show her physical affection (non-sexual)and does she accept it?


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## VictoriaWinters (Oct 22, 2012)

hurting guy, my suggestion, and I think we are in a similar age group - but I am female, is for you to make your presence in your wife's life much more interesting and desireable than her hanging out with this friend. I think that you have raised your kids and maybe lost touch with each other and what you had in the begining of your marriage. I think you remember that and want that back. You CAN rekindle your relationship and get back to that. It's tough because you are going through a transition with the kids out of the house now. So, what I propose is that you "date" your wife where you setup, for example a weekend in another town where you go do fun stuff together, for example, spa day, play sports together if you do that, go to wineries, shopping and have a romantic dinner - just like if you were dating. Send her flowers, tell her she is beautiful and sexy, reminisce about when you first met and tell her all the things about her that attracted you to her. Tell her what a great mother and wife she is. Write love notes to her, give her small gifts - anything you used to do when you were first dating.

Also, apologize for your remarks regarding your sex life - tell her you didn't meant that and that you take responsibility for what you said and want to make things better and promise never to say anything like that again. Women really appreciate when men apologize - much more than you will ever know. Even if you think you were right, apologize.


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## VictoriaWinters (Oct 22, 2012)

I also want to mention that your wife may be in menopause and this brings with it several physical and emotional changes that may be affecting her. Some of these issues can be managed with the help of estrogen pills. For another thing, the walls of the vagina go from being pliable and expandable to being dry kind of like tissue paper and sex without considerable lubrication can be downright painful. You don't mention if she has had a hysterectomy, but that can also cause additional issues, both physical and psychological.


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## anchorwatch (Mar 5, 2012)

She is not going to change, she has decided she can live without intimacy and has no reason to change. She likes it this way, withholding intimacy is her form of control. The longer she lives like this the harder it will be to turn around. You are being passive aggressive about this. The longer you take to lose your patience the harder it will be on your entire family. You may have waited too long already, but you won't know until you take control of your marriage back. Do not let your fear of disturbing the delicate balance relationship stop you. It's not the relationship you had, you deserve better. I wish you well. 

BTW, What type of example will you set for your boys by staying in an emotionally void marriage? At their age, they know the difference.


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## Emerald (Aug 2, 2012)

Hurting - 

I'm afraid she has already "walked-away." A physical move will be next. Your boys will be devastated but not destroyed. If she is refusing MC, there is really not much else you can do. I think you should start working on yourself in preparation of becoming a single man, just in case.

This way *if* she walks away, you will not fall apart. 

All hope is not lost until a divorce is final. 

Your future is in YOUR hands, not hers.


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## hurting guy (Oct 8, 2012)

Victoria, thanks for your input. I am 53, she is 51. I have been doing much of what you suggest. Asking her on dates, weekend away, etc. Lots of compliments, notes, etc. I also apologized about the sex comment way back when I first said it. She accepted my apology and she said she actually agreed with it. I also took my share of the blame for a lackluster sex life. Of course, the suddenly hot sex was weird because where was this for the last 28 years. 

You are right, we always had the kids in common. I think we need to develop some mutual recreation interests, and I have talked about this with her. Her main recreation time is hanging out with her girlfriends to smoke and talk. In the last year, she started smoking again (she quit when we got married 28 years ago). She has been very resistant to developing mutual recreation interests. In the summer it is easier because we both enjoy day hikes and kayaking. Of course, she goes on those outings with girlfriends during the week while I am working. On the weekend, she has a list of projects for me to do. So, when we do go kayaking on the weekend, I pay the price because I didn't get her list done.

Nevertheless, your advice is correct, and I will keep it up. The problem is that it is very difficult to keep positive and loving when the nonverbal communication is so discouraging. When it is all one-sided, and no sex, a guy gets worn down. It seems that when she sees I am giving up, then she does something to encourage me (like sex two weeks ago for the first time in 10 months) only to then go back to the "get away from me" thing. The inconsistencies make it all so hard to figure out if I am doing the right thing, the wrong thing, or what.


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## hurting guy (Oct 8, 2012)

To answer Victoria, the problem with pain in intercourse was only in certain positions. She was always fine with a sideways position, but never her on top, or any other positions. The pain was both before and after having kids, all 28 years of marraige. The only real exception was the three weeks I mentioned right before cutting off all sex. No hysterectomy, and she has not started menopause.


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## Emerald (Aug 2, 2012)

hurting guy said:


> Victoria, thanks for your input. I am 53, she is 51. I have been doing much of what you suggest. Asking her on dates, weekend away, etc. Lots of compliments, notes, etc. I also apologized about the sex comment way back when I first said it. She accepted my apology and she said she actually agreed with it. I also took my share of the blame for a lackluster sex life. Of course, the suddenly hot sex was weird because where was this for the last 28 years.
> 
> You are right, we always had the kids in common. I think we need to develop some mutual recreation interests, and I have talked about this with her. Her main recreation time is hanging out with her girlfriends to smoke and talk. In the last year, she started smoking again (she quit when we got married 28 years ago). She has been very resistant to developing mutual recreation interests. In the summer it is easier because we both enjoy day hikes and kayaking. Of course, she goes on those outings with girlfriends during the week while I am working. On the weekend, she has a list of projects for me to do. So, when we do go kayaking on the weekend, I pay the price because I didn't get her list done.
> 
> Nevertheless, your advice is correct, and I will keep it up. The problem is that it is very difficult to keep positive and loving when the nonverbal communication is so discouraging. When it is all one-sided, and no sex, a guy gets worn down. It seems that when she sees I am giving up, then she does something to encourage me (like sex two weeks ago for the first time in 10 months) only to then go back to the "get away from me" thing. The inconsistencies make it all so hard to figure out if I am doing the right thing, the wrong thing, or what.


Wait! she doesn't work? then gives you lists of things to do on the weekend?

What are on these "lists?" chores?

So why is this SAHM not working now that the children are grown & off to college?

What is her contribution to the marriage & household NOW?

No sex with husband
Hangs out with g/f smoking
Gives husbands lists of chores
Resistant to doing activities with husband

She's living the "Life of Riley" - no wonder she hasn't walked yet & you poor thing if you divorce will have to pay her so damn much alimony.......uggggg


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## Emerald (Aug 2, 2012)

I've said this before - a 53 yr. old working man with grown children is very attractive to single women. Get yourself in shape if you have let yourself go.


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## anchorwatch (Mar 5, 2012)

Hurting, don't be offended but it seems you're a real candidate for Dr. Glover's Book. Here's a link. It can be a great resource. Take the quiz, see where you stand. No More Mr. Nice Guy


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## Enginerd (May 24, 2011)

Its time to wake up and stop doing everything she asks. She's completely manipulating you and your so nice you can't see it. Start spying and figure out what's she's really up to. Her friend may not be a lesbian, but she might just be her cover so she can go out and meet new men. You need to read the CWI threads so you see the pattern that your wife is following. You will need the truth to use in the divorce. Right now you are just a meal ticket to her.

Peace


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## hurting guy (Oct 8, 2012)

Emerald, I keep coming back to the WAW which you mentioned in the thread last week. Yes, emotionally I think you may be right, she has already walked away. 

I think I am at that point where if she served me with divorce papers tomorrow, or she separated, I would be okay. I have thought about life as a single man, and I know I will be fine. At least as a single man, I would have plenty of sex. There are several women hitting on me who are aware of our marital issues and are making it clear they are ready to pounce. I deflect them because I still love my wife, and hope that she comes out of this thing she is in. If she would just stop focusing on negatives and rehashing and re-writing our history, I think she would see that we could have a great rest of our lives together. If we divorce, I think she will eventually realize that she really blew it. To me, I think we could fix this so easily if she wanted to try at all. She says she is trying, but none of her actions have changed. That is where I give credit to "Trying2Figure" since he has hung in there for three years. 

I take one thing back. She has changed in one big way. Throughout our marraige, she has always been very critical toward me. Whatever I did, whether in my profession, around the home, in my volunteer work, anything, she was always criticizing that I could have done it better, or it should have been this way or that way, and all the household projects I did were never done as professionally as she wanted. All that criticism stopped 10 months ago when the sex stopped. That part has at least been nice.


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

Maybe you should get a pack of stickum note pads, and when you leave for work you can put a stickum on her that says "I would kiss you good by if you let me".........When you get home you could do the same thing "I would kiss you hellow if you let me". maybe as you pass each other you just stick to her shoulder or something.

You can pre write them out and as you pass in the hallway you can put a stickum on her back as she walks by saying "i would hug you right now if you let me". While you guys are sitting in the living room you could put a stickum note on her that says "I would cuddle with you if you let me".

If you could write backwards you could stick a note to her forehead that says " i would have made love to you last night if you let me" ...Again you would have to be able to write backwards to get the effect across when she wakes up.

Sorry man life is to short to have a sexless marriage. Its the glue that helps keep it together.

Hell were human beings ...she has to be getting "it" some were.


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

I feel sorry for the girlfriend, the poor thing is getting criticized left and right for the last 10 months.LOL


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## Emerald (Aug 2, 2012)

hurting guy said:


> Emerald, I keep coming back to the WAW which you mentioned in the thread last week. Yes, emotionally I think you may be right, she has already walked away.
> 
> I think I am at that point where if she served me with divorce papers tomorrow, or she separated, I would be okay. I have thought about life as a single man, and I know I will be fine. At least as a single man, I would have plenty of sex. There are several women hitting on me who are aware of our marital issues and are making it clear they are ready to pounce. I deflect them because I still love my wife, and hope that she comes out of this thing she is in. If she would just stop focusing on negatives and rehashing and re-writing our history, I think she would see that we could have a great rest of our lives together. If we divorce, I think she will eventually realize that she really blew it. To me, I think we could fix this so easily if she wanted to try at all. She says she is trying, but none of her actions have changed. That is where I give credit to "Trying2Figure" since he has hung in there for three years.
> 
> I take one thing back. She has changed in one big way. Throughout our marraige, she has always been very critical toward me. Whatever I did, whether in my profession, around the home, in my volunteer work, anything, she was always criticizing that I could have done it better, or it should have been this way or that way, and all the household projects I did were never done as professionally as she wanted. All that criticism stopped 10 months ago when the sex stopped. That part has at least been nice.


Good plan. Expect the best but plan for the worst.

Many times walk-aways who file for divorce, in time, realize that they had it good. Sometimes it takes being completely away for awhile to realize it. I do have friends that regretted it but the urge to get away was too strong at the time. The husbands move on fast - they like being married LOL.

I hope your wife has a change of heart because that is what you want.


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## VictoriaWinters (Oct 22, 2012)

hurting guy, 
Smoking, drinking and hanging out gossiping with the girls - kind of like when your wife was a teen? So, she's doing this because she is finally free of mothering responsibilities and doesn't know what else to do with the free time. Meanwhile, she is treating you like she is your mom, demanding you do a weekly list of projects (homework) and then punishing you for not getting projects done at home when you "play hooky" and go kayaking or hiking. 

It sounds like your wife doesn't recognize that you are an adult and can figure out what needs to be done around the house and will fix things in a timely manner. Do you ever notice problems and just fix them yourself or do problems always wait until she tells you to fix them?

EDITED: So I read the part about your wife always criticizing you on whatever you do. So, basically, that's control freak behavior. She has to be in control or she is unhappy. She is withholding sex to control you to get whatever it is she wants - I'm not sure what that is and I'm not sure she knows.

One thing - if these girlfriends are divorced, unfortunately sometimes there will be a woman who paints this rosy picture of life after divorce - I was friends with this one woman who was telling the others how great things were. In fact, she was in financial ruin and she wound up married to a guy who was a bit younger who had 3 young kids and a whole lot of baggage. She made it all seem glamorous and fabulous and so incredibly romantic. Of course, the reality was that she was starting over with little kids that weren't hers and neither she nor the man were in a good financial situation since they had both just divorced and he has to pay child support for the next 16 years or so and she's going to have to take care of these kids and they both will have to work to make ends meet. But she influenced other women in the group to divorce and of course, none of them have found divorced life the rosy picture that was painted for them by her. Which is what concerns me with your wife and her female pals. I hope that she's not being unduly influenced by someone.


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## hurting guy (Oct 8, 2012)

I am almost starting to feel embarassed. Yes, she is an at home mom, with a college degree and lots of skills. She does a lot of volunteer work, which of course the GF does with her. Her main contribution to the household is cooking, cleaning, laundry, and taking care of garden flowers. I do the dishes most nights, all the outdoor stuff (big yard), and all maintenance/repair type of stuff. And of course, I work.

So, yes, she has a pretty good life. The weekend chores thing happened again this week. I had to pull a pipe out of the ground and re-route it. I got the pipe out and filled in the trench, but didn't get it rerouted yet. Why did I not finish? Because I spent all Saturday afternoon taking care of her new puppy (had it home only a couple days). It went to the vet on Thursday, got a call on Saturday mornig that puppy was better, so I went and got puppy because she was not yet back from the "slumber party." She came home as soon as I texted her that the puppy was home, but then went shopping in the afternoon with son who was home from college for weekend. So, I was trying to watch puppy while doing the trench work. Hence, only finished the main part of the job. Well, not finishing the pipe project led to a fight when I came home from work today to make some lunch for myself. It was really stupid, and I think she realized how foolish she looked and then got even more emotional and upset. I left and came back to the office.

This is one of the big WAW issues. Throughout our marraige she seems to think that I should spend my evenings and weekends doing house chores, but when other stuff gets in the way, or if I just want to recreate for a while, she greatly resents it. But it is a double standard because she has tons of discretionary time to spend doing all kinds of fun things. I get a ton of stuff done around the house, and she knows it, but I also make sure I relax and do some recreation too. That is her biggest frustration and the main source of the walk away wife thing for us.

It is interesting that the criticism stopped when sex stopped, but today some criticism came back about the stupid trench project.

Emerald, what are your thoughts about the "No More Mr. Nice Guy" book. Are you familiar with that one?


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## hurting guy (Oct 8, 2012)

To answer Victoria, yes I do a lot of jobs around the house without being asked. I initiate many things because I do enjoy it; Home Depot runs and construction is kind of fun. But the fun is removed when she is being a taskmaster or tracking the time, or criticizing the final product. She does not see how we have a huge double standard going on with her use of time, and my use of time.


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## Emerald (Aug 2, 2012)

hurting guy said:


> I am almost starting to feel embarassed. Yes, she is an at home mom, with a college degree and lots of skills. She does a lot of volunteer work, which of course the GF does with her. Her main contribution to the household is cooking, cleaning, laundry, and taking care of garden flowers. I do the dishes most nights, all the outdoor stuff (big yard), and all maintenance/repair type of stuff. And of course, I work.
> 
> So, yes, she has a pretty good life. The weekend chores thing happened again this week. I had to pull a pipe out of the ground and re-route it. I got the pipe out and filled in the trench, but didn't get it rerouted yet. Why did I not finish? Because I spent all Saturday afternoon taking care of her new puppy (had it home only a couple days). It went to the vet on Thursday, got a call on Saturday mornig that puppy was better, so I went and got puppy because she was not yet back from the "slumber party." She came home as soon as I texted her that the puppy was home, but then went shopping in the afternoon with son who was home from college for weekend. So, I was trying to watch puppy while doing the trench work. Hence, only finished the main part of the job. Well, not finishing the pipe project led to a fight when I came home from work today to make some lunch for myself. It was really stupid, and I think she realized how foolish she looked and then got even more emotional and upset. I left and came back to the office.
> 
> ...


Don't be embarrassed - I see lots of posts here of SAHM's with nice lives financed by nice husbands with laundry lists of complaints about the husbands.

I have not read NMMNG but many men here swear by it. I think you should read it. You need to figure out if you are a nice guy or a doormat. Women don't respect doormats.

Your wife is controlling. Now this may have worked well with your boys managing their lives to become productive adults. But I think she carried it over to you. My exHusband did as well. My girls turned out fantastic & I left LOL!


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## VictoriaWinters (Oct 22, 2012)

hurting guy said:


> To answer Victoria, the problem with pain in intercourse was only in certain positions. She was always fine with a sideways position, but never her on top, or any other positions. The pain was both before and after having kids, all 28 years of marraige. The only real exception was the three weeks I mentioned right before cutting off all sex. No hysterectomy, and she has not started menopause.


That's abnormal to have pain when on top since you can control the depth of penetration. It makes me wonder if she has a prolapsed bladder or alternatively fibroid tumors (non-cancerous). I am also wondering if she experienced a hormonal change (flush of hormones) that brought on the wild three weeks of sex. Although menses may have not ceased yet, your wife is likely in at least peri-menopause if not full on menopause due to her age. One of the common symptoms of menopause is insomnia and hot flashes at night - which I thought you mentioned your wife is real picky about the bedroom temperature? Or was that someone else?

Nowadays, menopause can be detected through a blood test.


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## hurting guy (Oct 8, 2012)

Just took the "No More Mr. Nice Guy" test. Scored 60, so a typical Nice Guy it seems. Nire that way at home, than at work.


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## VictoriaWinters (Oct 22, 2012)

Wow, I just read your description of your homelife. You sound like a great husband to me! 

I'm not sure what kind of pipe you are rerouting, but next time your wife gets unreasonable, try to stay calm and ask her this:

"If this isn't done today, is anyone going to die? Yes or no?"

and let her answer the question. Obviously, the answer is no. LOL! So then you say as calmly as possible, 

"Then why is this such an emergency to you that you are angry at me that I didn't get it done?"

Let her explain.

You could always reasonably offer to hire to someone to finish the work on Monday or Tuesday. 

But seriously, you are dealing with a major control freak. I think a lot of this is about the kids now being gone so she doesn't have anyone to manage except for you but it could also be hormonal changes that are causing her to act out. You don't really need to be managed, but she doesn't know what to do with herself if she is not managing someone, so she's being completely unreasonable with you. This is something that marriage counseling could help you both with. But if she is not willing to go to marriage counseling, then either you have to develop coping strategies for this irrational behavior and ride this out or you need to do some soul searching as to if you want to remain in this relationship.

About the puppy - get a crate for it! Very important to crate train your dog as this will prevent the dog from getting hurt or damaging stuff when you can't watch it - such as at night or if you are out of the house - and the dogs LOVE their crates - the crate is their safe haven!


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## hurting guy (Oct 8, 2012)

Emerald, just to clarify, I am not a doormat. But at home, I am a Nice Guy according to the test. In my career, if I was a doormat, I would be finished.

You are right, my wife is controlling. Of course, she says I am controlling. That is another one of her issues. When I answer that she makes her own schedule, she chooses to do what she wants, when she wants. But if I point this out, then I am being "defensive." That is another affront.


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## VictoriaWinters (Oct 22, 2012)

hurting guy said:


> You are right, my wife is controlling. Of course, she says I am controlling. That is another one of her issues. When I answer that she makes her own schedule, she chooses to do what she wants, when she wants. But if I point this out, then I am being "defensive." That is another affront.


So what does your wife say you are controlling about? Are you one of those men who won't let anyone come fix anything at his house? So basically, whatever needs to be done could be done by a repairman, which your wife could call, but you won't let her call in a repairman?


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## hurting guy (Oct 8, 2012)

Victoria, yeah I stayed really calm. I asked her why she was upset that the pipe project didn't get finished. I pointed out that it was all safe, trench filled in, and the next phase could be done anytime. When I stayed calm and asked her reasonable questions, she lost it. Emotions went crazy. Like she was trying to pick a fight. I tried talking to her some more, then left back for work.


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## VictoriaWinters (Oct 22, 2012)

hurting guy, that does sound like menopause to a great extent. Just because she still has her period doesn't mean she doesn't have menopause and menopause and per-menopause can definitely cause women's emotions to get off track. At times I have found myself crying about...NOTHING. Fortunately, I have a background in psychology/biology, so I recognize what is really going on and try very hard not to take it out on my husband.

Perhaps a visit with her gynecologist might be in order. You could write a note to the doctor ahead of time and mention the pain during intercourse issues and also the emotional issues and withholding sex issues and that you love your wife dearly and are concerned for her.


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## hurting guy (Oct 8, 2012)

I do a lot of it myself, but am happy to hire people too. Depends on the job. For example, I could have put the sprinkler system in myself, but we hired it out. 

The examples of me being controlling seem foolish to me. I asked "how am I controlling" and she said one way is that I don't like tomatoes and so that affects how everyone else eats. I told her that she can cook whatever dish she wants and I can just eat around the tomotoes. I have told her that all our married life. But she says that no one wants to cook something just to have part of it left on the plate. So, I am controlling because I don't like tomatoes. Seems ridiculous to me.


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## hurting guy (Oct 8, 2012)

Thanks for all your help everyone. I am heading home. See what happens tonight.


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## VictoriaWinters (Oct 22, 2012)

hurting guy said:


> I do a lot of it myself, but am happy to hire people too. Depends on the job. For example, I could have put the sprinkler system in myself, but we hired it out.
> 
> The examples of me being controlling seem foolish to me. I asked "how am I controlling" and she said one way is that I don't like tomatoes and so that affects how everyone else eats. I told her that she can cook whatever dish she wants and I can just eat around the tomotoes. I have told her that all our married life. But she says that no one wants to cook something just to have part of it left on the plate. So, I am controlling because I don't like tomatoes. Seems ridiculous to me.


So basically she's trying to force you to eat tomatoes by saying she won't cook anything with tomatoes because you would leave them on the plate, so everyone has to "suffer" and not have tomatoes because of you. I wonder how she would deal if you had a food allergy? Really she is being rather ridiculous and again, she is being controlling by having the "Everyone has to suffer if you won't do as I say" attitude. Guess what? She can make spaghetti with marinara sauce for herself and give you spaghetti with alfredo sauce or bechamel or pesto - and all those sauces come pre-made, so there is no extra effort on her part - she can even have you spoon the sauce out of the container onto your own spaghetti if it is such a problem for her. 

The crazy thing is that she is blaming you for a problem that only exists in her head. You not liking tomatoes is not a real problem.


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## 67flh (Sep 26, 2011)

hurt guy, lets see how much of a controling guy you are once you QUIT financing all her free time! your might as well be still living with you parents for all the respect your getting.


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## SlowlyGettingWiser (Apr 7, 2012)

OP, why haven't you done a 180 on her yet?

Look it up, get started on it TODAY, and see where it takes you. If she doesn't come around, at least you're preparing yourself for singlehood!


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## Trying2figureitout (Feb 3, 2011)

SlowlyGettingWiser said:


> OP, why haven't you done a 180 on her yet?
> 
> Look it up, get started on it TODAY, and see where it takes you. If she doesn't come around, at least you're preparing yourself for singlehood!


180 is only when you've made the decision to detach to go single... If he is still on the fence 180 is not advised. Hard to do a 180 and get great results in reconciling a temporary issue.

180 is to prep for being on own.

I say ultimatum... then at least you are being honest.
My wife has an ultimatum to fix our issue by year 4... as it gets close to that date I'll do a 180 leading up to filing.


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## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

Make a schedule that shows how much time you have and how much time she has. Write it down on a sheet of paper/or type it. Neat and concise. 

The next time she is critical about you having down time, hand it to her, email it to her as well. 

At the top lay our your schedule and her schedule and the estimated free time for each of you. 

Below that just put: "This is unfair and unacceptable. You should thank me for all my hard work but I cannot force you to. I am however going on strike effective immediately. I am going to use the time I spent doing nice things for you and our house to work out and begin to build my own life and spend more time with MY friends. 

This topic of how I spend my time is no longer open for discussion between us. And frankly I am fine with taking a break spending time together in general as I am tired of your sense of entitlement, your hot and cold - chase me - get away from me - non verbal communication and your general lack of respect. 

Perhaps you should consider getting a job to minimize the impact on your standard of living if our current marital trajectory continues. 





hurting guy said:


> I am almost starting to feel embarassed. Yes, she is an at home mom, with a college degree and lots of skills. She does a lot of volunteer work, which of course the GF does with her. Her main contribution to the household is cooking, cleaning, laundry, and taking care of garden flowers. I do the dishes most nights, all the outdoor stuff (big yard), and all maintenance/repair type of stuff. And of course, I work.
> 
> So, yes, she has a pretty good life. The weekend chores thing happened again this week. I had to pull a pipe out of the ground and re-route it. I got the pipe out and filled in the trench, but didn't get it rerouted yet. Why did I not finish? Because I spent all Saturday afternoon taking care of her new puppy (had it home only a couple days). It went to the vet on Thursday, got a call on Saturday mornig that puppy was better, so I went and got puppy because she was not yet back from the "slumber party." She came home as soon as I texted her that the puppy was home, but then went shopping in the afternoon with son who was home from college for weekend. So, I was trying to watch puppy while doing the trench work. Hence, only finished the main part of the job. Well, not finishing the pipe project led to a fight when I came home from work today to make some lunch for myself. It was really stupid, and I think she realized how foolish she looked and then got even more emotional and upset. I left and came back to the office.
> 
> ...


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## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

T2,
You really ought not give advice to others. Boasting about a plan that no one can understand and claiming victory repeatedly before anything happens does not constitute being "qualified".

You have failed to repair your marriage in that your W is carrying on an EA/PA in front of you and you are now just shy of 3 years sexless and keep arbitrarily moving the date back because you refuse to insist on closure. As a quick reminder:
- 2 year 'deadline'
- 3 year 'deadline'
- 4 year 'deadline'

Getting your W to be less unfriendly to you might feel like repair, but it is mere tolerance driven by her financial dependence on you. 




Trying2figureitout said:


> 180 is only when you've made the decision to detach to go single... If he is still on the fence 180 is not advised. Hard to do a 180 and get great results in reconciling a temporary issue.
> 
> 180 is to prep for being on own.
> 
> ...


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## Paulination (Feb 6, 2012)

hurting guy said:


> It is very confusing because she says she wants the marriage to work, but then she also says maybe we can redefine what that looks like. I ask what she means by "redefine" and she won't tell me,


Well let me translate for you...you meet all of her needs while she has the luxury to ignore all of yours. She will meet your need to stay married but only on her terms which means no sex.

You have to suck up the pain and lay down the law. There will be no redifing of marriage here. It is defined the same as it ever was otherwise you walk to find a women who respects and desires you.

I can't even believe I'm writing this except for the fact that I went through something similar about 9 months ago excpet my wife was not as brazen as yours. Short term pain is better than long term unfullfilled misery. Wrap your mind around that and do what you know is right.


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## Trying2figureitout (Feb 3, 2011)

MEM11363 said:


> T2,
> You really ought not give advice to others. Boasting about a plan that no one can understand and claiming victory repeatedly before anything happens does not constitute being "qualified".
> 
> You have failed to repair your marriage in that your W is carrying on an EA/PA in front of you and you are now just shy of 3 years sexless and keep arbitrarily moving the date back because you refuse to insist on closure. As a quick reminder:
> ...


Is my 180 summary wrong?

I have not failed. If we divorce I failed.


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## Toffer (Jan 31, 2012)

While I haven't read all the replies (actually, none of them) yet, I had to jump in and probably repeat what's been said a dozen or more times I'm willing to bet.

You said "My goal remains to stay married and have an exicting sex life with her"

The fact of the matter is that if in the last 10 months you've only had sex once, tou DO NOT have a marriage.

You need to tell your wife point blank that she needs to tell you what's going on you're done.


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## southern wife (Jul 22, 2011)

hurting guy,

You need to STOP playing the role of "son" in your marriage. STOP doing "the lists" your wife hands you. If you continue to do so, then make up your own *list for her*:

GET A JOB!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Stop going to GF house
Stop spending all free time with GF
Have sex *with your husband*
Do the dishes
GET A JOB!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Have sex with your husband
Stop complaining and criticizing
Appreciate what you have; rather than take advantage of it
GET A JOB!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## In_The_Wind (Feb 17, 2012)

southern wife said:


> I think the GF is like the GF, and your wife is either bi or all out Lez.
> 
> That being the case, OF COURSE she wants to still be married to you, *have you pay her way*, and NOT have sex with you. Dude, open your eyes!!!!
> 
> Wives do not, that I know of, have "slumber parties".....just the 2 of us.  I have not had a "slumber party" since HS. :wtf:


How about pillow fights in panties ??? Dude it sounds like she has checked out why be married to her if you cant have sex ??


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## southern wife (Jul 22, 2011)

Trying2figureitout said:


> Is my 180 summary wrong?
> 
> I have not failed. If we divorce I failed.


I'm sorry, but only a loser stays in a sexless marriage for 2 years..............no wait....3 years.................NO WAIT................FOUR YEARS! 

Are you a loser?

Divorce does NOT equal failure. It means you respect YOURSELF and want a better LIFE for yourself. Wake UP from this fantasy and live your life!!!!!


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

southern wife said:


> I'm sorry, but only a loser stays in a sexless marriage for 2 years..............no wait....3 years.................NO WAIT................FOUR YEARS!
> 
> Are you a loser?
> 
> Divorce does NOT equal failure. It means you respect YOURSELF and want a better LIFE for yourself. Wake UP from this fantasy and live your life!!!!!


Find those 2 little body parts that fell off please and move on.


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## In_The_Wind (Feb 17, 2012)

hurting guy said:


> Trying2 : Wow, three years of similar stuff for you, that has got to be rough. I don't think I could handle it that long.
> 
> Anchorwatch: Yep, she is blocking me from meeting her EN. I could tell her that I will not stay in a marraige without emotional and sexual intimacy. I think she knows that risk, but I think she is banking on my love for our boys. So I have two problems with thinking about or threatening divorce. One, I still love her. Second, a divorce would be devastating for the kids, even though they are young adults. Deep down, I would rather sacrifice my own happiness than ruin theirs. So, I am not giving up, but I don't know how to deal with the mixed messages. I guess the advice is that I need to believe the message that I don't want to hear; that is, she really doesn't want intimacy with me right now. Believe those messages, but not the others. But I am running out of patience.
> 
> Btw, she refuses marraige counseling (she says she already knows what they will say) and she agreed to IC, and I told her great and said to make an appointment, but she has not followed through, and I don't think she will.


maybe you should call her on it If she is refusing MC then you should offer her the chance to move out and in with her GF I feel you should start the 180 and work on your self start exercising working out etc


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## In_The_Wind (Feb 17, 2012)

HG i feel you should get a gf as well your wife has one why not ??? she wouldnt care


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## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

How do you do with conflict?

How would others describe you? Strong? Respectable? Pleasant? Accommodating?

My first suggestion is that you no longer make this about sex ... because it isn't.
Your wife doesn't respect you, at all. It's not even clear if she likes you. But she needs you, and she knows she can count on you to do the right thing.

So what you need to focus on right now, is you. Not her.
Focus on what you want, what you need, what you will tolerate, and what you are willing to fight for ... for yourself.

This is your life. If you count on others to determine whether or not you get what you want, or if you are happy with what they give you ... you aren't really living your life.

Be selfish, constructively selfish. If that word makes you wince, take that as evidence you need to work on meeting your own needs, and insisting that others respect that choice. 

It's important. And it makes all the difference in the world. Trust me.


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## CanadianGuy (Jun 17, 2012)

Hurting Guy. You are being totally played. 

Do not sacrifice your happiness for the happiness of your boys in this case. Would you like either of your boys to be in your situation? Kids are not stupid they can tell when mom and dad are not getting along and if you watch carefully you will see some of your behaviors coming out in them. Short tempers etc. 
Your happiness will improve the relationship you have with your boys. 

You have suggested MC she has refused because she already knows what they are going to say. What is it exactly that the MC is going to say? Did you ask her? She committed to IC but has gone back on her word. Make an appointment for her, see what happens. 

Otherwise next time she starts arguing with you and your fed up put your hands together and start making fart sounds. ( jk )


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## hurting guy (Oct 8, 2012)

Well, the update from last night. She was obviously remorseful about her response to the trench project. She said she realized it was all irrational emotion, but then did not want to talk about it further. No answer to the question, why does this bother you? Otherwise, all quiet on the home front.

Victoria, the tomotoes thing is even more stupid than you realize. I will eat tomatoe sauces, soup, juice, all kinds of tomatoe stuff; I just don't like the raw ones or big chunks. Yet, I am controlling. Seems silly to me.

Thanks to all of you for your comments.

I checked out No More Mr. Nice Guy. I will get the book today and see if it helps.

To answer Deejo, my tendency at home is to avoid conflict. I am a peacemaker at heart. I am not afraid of conflict, and deal with it every day in my job (litigator, founding partner of law firm), but at home and in personal relationships I definitely try to avoid conflict and mitigate issues.

People, and my wife, describe me as a strong personality, natural leader, outgoing and easy going, highly respected in my community. Nevertheless, you are correct that my wife no longer respects me and you are right, she doesn't like me. I have gotten the "I love you but am not in love with you" line. She has said she is "repulsed" by me, not physically but emotionally, and that is why she won't have sex. But then, she sends these other messages that she is not repulsed, only to be followed by the negative message again. Other posters have referred me to MMSL and have suggested I have been beta-ized, I think similar to the No More Mr. Nice Guy approach. These are all new things to me, but I am learning more about relationships and reading a lot of other sources too.

Your advice to be selfish is not natural to me, but I understand what you mean.


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## Emerald (Aug 2, 2012)

"Repulsed" is a strong word. Why do you emotionally repulse her?

What exactly is keeping you in this marriage? What are your fears if the marriage ends?


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## hurting guy (Oct 8, 2012)

Emerald, yes "repulsed" is a strong word. The best I can gather is that she is emotionally repulsed because for years she says she was unhappy and I didn't recognize it and do anything about it. She says she therefore "stuffed it" deep inside (so I remained in the dark about how unhappy she was), and then it all came bursting out in the last year. I always thought she was happy and we had a great life, raising some great kids. Now that we are empty nesters, it turns out she has long held resentments. That is why the walkaway wife syndrome seems to fit in many ways.

She told me that several times last winter she almost walked out. I had no clue. Then instead of walking out, she stopped all sex and withdrew. 

Why am I staying in the marriage? First, despite all of this, I still love her. Second, I still think we could have a great second half of our marraige. I really think the resentments and issues can be dealt with. It will take some adjustment by both of us, and better communication, but we still have a foundation that I think we can build on. The problem is I am not sure she really wants to try. I am afraid it may be too late, and we are just doing a dance until she tells me she is gone. The discussions I have tried to have, and the effort to get us to counseling have been rejected. Books for self counseling by couples that I have bought and invited her to work through with me have been rejected by her and tossed aside. I am working through those anyway, but by myself. She offers little bits of hope to me, then dashes those again with some negative comment or action.

Third reason I don't want to give up is for the kids. As long as there is a ray of hope, I want to try for the kids' sake. I think a divorce would really hurt them, and I don't want to do that unless there is no other choice. My parents were divorced, and my mom was married 4 times before passing away at far too young an age (only 52). I have seen divorce, and it is very hard on kids, even young adults like mine.

As far as fears if the marraige ends, I guess a degree of shame in my circle of friends. Most people who know us would be shocked by a divorce. Our friends have held us up as a "model" marraige and think that everything is great. Also, my wife is sugar sweet to everyone around us. They all love her. They see the external, but have no idea what it is like in the home right now. They would also be shocked to learn that my wife has refused sex for the last 10 months. So, yes some shame and ego/pride humilation is a fear.

What I don't fear is being alone. Part of me relishes the idea of being a single man.


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## anchorwatch (Mar 5, 2012)

Hurting, 

So you're in Plan A. Have you given thought how long you can or will keep this up?


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## hurting guy (Oct 8, 2012)

Not much longer. I have told her that IMO we cannot heal the marraige as long as there is sexual rejection. To me, emotional and sexual intimacy go together. So, I am considering telling her that if we do not resume sexual relations, and move into a healing phase, then she should move out until she is ready to do that. I am sure she will not move out because she knows our kids will blame her. They already blame her and the GF for what they have seen. They are really puzzled by the way she has been acting. The only reason I see for not giving the ultimatim is that it will create more resentment by "forcing" her before she is "ready." The hope is that the resentment will be temporary. The fear is that she will be so irrationally angry that she will just file for divorce instead.


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## oneMOreguy (Aug 22, 2012)

hurting guy said:


> Not much longer. I have told her that IMO we cannot heal the marraige as long as there is sexual rejection. To me, emotional and sexual intimacy go together. So, I am considering telling her that if we do not resume sexual relations, and move into a healing phase, then she should move out until she is ready to do that. I am sure she will not move out because she knows our kids will blame her. They already blame her and the GF for what they have seen. They are really puzzled by the way she has been acting. The only reason I see for not giving the ultimatim is that it will create more resentment by "forcing" her before she is "ready." The hope is that the resentment will be temporary. The fear is that she will be so irrationally angry that she will just file for divorce instead.


...everything you write here reeks of fear, and of letting her be fully in charge. Your kids are puzzled...yes....by you not taking charge and actually BEING a leader. All you seems to be doing is reacting to her actions and decisions, and not in a way that will change anything for the good. It is not enough for you to love and respect your wife, she has to do it back or there is no marriage. You do not get love and respect from a spouse by doing more for them, especially when the issue is that you are being taken advantage of.......get a piece of paper....now write down the reasons you wife currently is a good spouse......and not because of how you feel, but what does she do as her part of the marriage and what kind of person is she really...and be honest. Can you honestly recommend her as a wife to anyone you know? Food for thought.


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## Emerald (Aug 2, 2012)

hurting guy said:


> Emerald, yes "repulsed" is a strong word. The best I can gather is that she is emotionally repulsed because for years she says she was unhappy and I didn't recognize it and do anything about it. She says she therefore "stuffed it" deep inside (so I remained in the dark about how unhappy she was), and then it all came bursting out in the last year. I always thought she was happy and we had a great life, raising some great kids. Now that we are empty nesters, it turns out she has long held resentments. That is why the walkaway wife syndrome seems to fit in many ways.
> 
> She told me that several times last winter she almost walked out. I had no clue. Then instead of walking out, she stopped all sex and withdrew.
> 
> ...


I understand all of this. My children were college-age when I left my husband & it is very upsetting to them. Then factor in new spouses or SO's, holidays, birthdays not to mention the "circle of friends" who try not to, but end up "choosing sides." Then the financial division is another mess. Divorce is messy, no doubt.

I don't see you as a doormat at all. I see a strong man who is fighting to save a long-term marriage. A man who wants to share the next phase of his life (childrens' marriages, grandchildren) with the woman he loves.

But the fact is you both are not happy with the status quo.

My exH was not as unhappy as I was but was still unhappy (married 22 yrs.). One of the reasons he didn't file for divorce is similar to yours. He didn't want to be the "bad guy" to family & friends. I finally found the courage to file.

We are both happier now 4 yrs. later. Me remarried; him having fun dating like a teenager LOL.

Maybe you can float the idea of a trial separation to your wife. That way nobody is the bad guy if you both agree.


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## hurting guy (Oct 8, 2012)

Emerald, I have one other concern about a separation. Only anecdotal, but everyone I know who has had a separation ends up in divorce. I don't know a single person where this was not the case.


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## Trying2figureitout (Feb 3, 2011)

southern wife said:


> I'm sorry, but only a loser stays in a sexless marriage for 2 years..............no wait....3 years.................NO WAIT................FOUR YEARS!
> 
> Are you a loser?
> 
> Divorce does NOT equal failure. It means you respect YOURSELF and want a better LIFE for yourself. Wake UP from this fantasy and live your life!!!!!


I don't consider myself a loser. Sure I learned a lot form this and am pretty well grounded. I respect my vows and see sexlessness as a temporary situation. Many people jump ship too soon... not me I'll ride it out. That makes me a winner in the end. Its been < 3 so far. We have had sex just not a lot in that period.


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## Enginerd (May 24, 2011)

Trying2figureitout said:


> I don't consider myself a loser. Sure I learned a lot form this and am pretty well grounded. I respect my vows and see sexlessness as a temporary situation. Many people jump ship too soon... not me I'll ride it out. That makes me a winner in the end. Its been < 3 so far. We have had sex just not a lot in that period.



You'll ride what out? 5 more years of no intimacy? How does that make you a winner? Because you didn't jump ship and ended up divorced anyway? Winners don't sit around waiting for a miracle to achieve their goals. Winners take positive actions toward their stated goals. Taking action always involves an element of risk. You're unwilling to risk upsettng your marriage when in fact you already have no marriage. I absolutely agree that a divorce will upset your children but in this case they are older and it will not affect their development. It will hurt them but they will adjust and move on because they're adults. Your logic is failing you and I suspect you don't think you have better options. Everyone here is trying to snap you out of your deep denial but it appears you don't believe you deserve to be happy.


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## lovetopleasewife (Oct 7, 2012)

Trying2figureitout said:


> I don't consider myself a loser. Sure I learned a lot form this and am pretty well grounded. I respect my vows and see sexlessness as a temporary situation. Many people jump ship too soon... not me I'll ride it out. That makes me a winner in the end. Its been < 3 so far. We have had sex just not a lot in that period.


I agree people jump ship to soon. That is not the situation for you. You ship sunk more than a few years ago. Why do you want to drown!!! Wake up! Grow a pair and move on with your life. She does not deserve you.


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