# How to guide husband to be a more relaxed father...



## Piecukonis (Apr 3, 2010)

I am trying to figure out how to help my husband be a better and more patient, relaxed father. He is their biological dad. We have been together 12 years and married 10. We have a 4 year old son and a 5 year old daughter. Both are very bright and well behaved kids....well...as well behaved as can be expected for their age. They can be loud, messy, fight with eachother, etc...all the joys of preschoolers. I homeschool them while hubby works FT and goes to college FT online. So here's the deal: I am more of an attached parent. I am very affectionate with the kids with lots of hugs, kissing, saying I love you while the hubby can go whole days without kissing, hugging, or telling the kids he loves them.I respond to them calmly and with respect, keep my tone down but stern if needed, and make a point to always listen to them with interest and my discipline tends to be more like 1 warning then you lose a privelege or go to time out. I don't yell, spank, and when the kids have a time out we then talk about making better choices. The kids are FABULOUS for me ALL day when we work together like that. Of course we have bad days where the kids seem to be having issues and overstimulated but they are few for me when its just us. Something happens when hubby gets home from work though. I think the kids get excited and always greet him with a huge smile and screams that he's home but not long after they will resume their loud and messy ways...wrestling with each other, chasing our cats, sometimes talking back or whining over something stupid like not wanting to eat their vegetables and while I see this as a normal 4 or 5 year old issue my husband gets ANGRY and demands that they act like adults. He expects them to know not to interrupt, not to ever talk back and he yells in a mean not stern voice, threatens spankings (though never actually does), takes toys or cartoons away for a longer period of time than I would, and he will be sarcastic and mimic them or call them big babies and I can't stand that....the making fun of them, sarcasm, and name calling. He can be very mean and I think he has too much expectations for them at their age. I know I am doing something right because everywhere we go strangers constantly say I have very polite and well behaved children. Hubby sees them as bad kids though and sadly treats them that way. The worst part is when he yells at them he curses too which as soon as I tell him not to curse at them he gets mad at me with a nice F you (in front of them) and walks away. Even on a good day it is like he is annoyed with them. If they talk a lot (which they do with endless stories) and they want to tell him all about their day he will respond like WHAT? all irritated. He yells at them if they interrupt him but if I am listening to one of them telling me something, he will interrupt them and if I call him out on it he says he is an adult. I try so hard to set some kind of contract between us on how I want the kids to be responded to, disciplined, talked to, etc but it goes in one ear and out the other. He basically raised himself with a single mom who worked ALL the time, he was home alone ALL the time in the country with few friends and he has NO relationship with his mother or family at all. He says he had to be more grown up and responsible at their age so they can be that way too. I say no and that it was wrong he had to grow up too fast and I think kids at 4 and 5 should have innocent, fun, magical lives and not be forced to grow up too soon because childhood does not last long. Not only that but he has NO family spirit or holiday spirit at all....no religion...I just don't know how to reach him. He would love for the 4 of us to live in some cave in the middle of no where with no one around to bother us. I try so hard to make holidays super special for the kids and make them happy and fun but here comes grumpy old mean dad who sulks and complains ALLLLL day long that my mom and siblings are coming over for a holiday meal. The kids hear all of that and it puts a damper on things. He refuses to take part in holiday party planning, cooking, etc and has no humor or fun side to him at all. He is totally unable to be "silly" with the kids and if they want him to sing or dance or make silly faces or stuff like that he gets mad because he feels like people are looking at hiim funny. I say people love and appreciate a dad who can get down and dirty with his kids, especially girls. Maybe he is too old fashioned, I don't know. Our daughter wants to serve him fake tea and paint his nails because she thinks its funny but he has a FIT because he is a MAN and men don't do that....it then hurts her feelings. Why not just play along? When he comes home, they are so ready to get some daddy time but he looks past them and zones out with the tv. He just can't seem to be bothered with them although if I ask him, he says he loves them very much. I am just lost on how to handle this. He is an excellent provider but not able to handle any emotions but anger and sarcasm and it is starting to get to where I spend the afternoon prepping my kids for his return home from work....time to start walking on eggshells, reminding them to use indoor voices, not talk back, listen to mom and dad, etc. What do I do?


----------



## Piecukonis (Apr 3, 2010)

One example on how he handles things and thinks is that it is Christmas time and while I am teaching the kids about Jesus, Santa Claus, Frosty, and being happy and excited with them about the festivities, hubby spends his whole time using Christmas as an opportunity to tell the kids constantly that they are on the naughty list, and Santa will not bring them gifts, threatens to take presents back if they misbehave, etc. It is constant negativity and pessimism. His family did not ever celebrate holidays at all due to his mom always working. I try to make everyday festive with Christmas music, fun snacks, and hubby comes home and refuses to sing holiday songs or participate in any holiday festivities. He just uses every holiday as a way to manipulate and threaten the kids into good behavior which he apparently thinks needs to be 100% of the time. UGGH!


----------



## Waking up to life (Nov 29, 2012)

He sounds very egocentric. He can only focus on what he needs, how he feels, what he wants...so any distraction from those things sets him off. My husband is that way to some extent, though he never curses at or in front of our son. He does have unrealistic expectations for our son's behavior (who is very bright and very well behaved). He used to get angry if our son chewed food with his mouth open, even when he was 4 years old he learned to eat more politely than some adults I know! I can relate to the pain of walking on eggshells, reminding my son to play extra quietly b/c my H was irritable, etc. It's very wearing to always have to buffer your kids from your husband.

Your H's behavior is very immature. He clearly has issues stemming from his childhood. He appears to be of the mindset that since his childhood was miserable and lacking, his kids should also be made to suffer too. It's a very self-centered way of thinking...he feels like if he had to suffer, why should his kids have it any better?

This WILL NOT, and I repeat WILL NOT get better on its own, no matter how hard you try to be the peacekeeper. Your kids' self esteem will suffer, and they will likely develop anxiety issues if they aren't already. If you want this to improve, you MUST insist on marital counseling. Or at least he needs to get counseling. If he won't go, get yourself and the kids out of that toxic environment before too much damage is done.


----------



## Piecukonis (Apr 3, 2010)

I think you are right when you say he has issues stemming from his childhood. His anger towards his mother and family is very apparent and any time I try to tell him to give our kids a break and lighten up his come back is always "when I was a kid I...." fill in any excuse as to why the kids should be just like him. It is very frustrating. I have mulled the idea of a counselor. I know of a good one who will even come to our house but I am worried about him getting defensive and walking out but I need to at least try. When I talk to him about counseling he responds like it is a big joke and we don't need it. At this point I am happy when he gets overtime almost everynight to narrow the gap between him being home with the kids and them going to bed. Weekends with him all day are usually hell. I love him and the kids love him but his actions are getting ridiculous. He was never an angry person before kids although I will admit he never was a sharer about his feelings...the whole thing about his family never appeared until after we had kids. He claims that kids these days are troublemakers, lazy, etc and he blames it on parents who don't rule with an iron fist. He seems to think that he is acting like this for the kids own good. He loves them but has a skewed idea of how he thinks they receive love. I am going to talk to him tomorrow in depth about a plan and try a counseling session.


----------



## Piecukonis (Apr 3, 2010)

I have even resorted to telling him not to even speak to the kids if he feels angry at all and to let me handle all parenting and discipline. It does not work...I will punish them or talk to them my way and it will be successful but he HAS to have the last word...even if they listened to me and apologized he is right behind me double punishing them.


----------



## A++ (May 21, 2012)

Instead of trying to change your husband into someone else (like your father), it would be easier to just change husbands.

btw, I read your other threads...


----------



## Piecukonis (Apr 3, 2010)

LOL...I went back and read my other threads too and I thought...well, he does have a pattern of immature behavior doesn't he? Although we have made huge leaps in improvement over the last 2 years between us, I am not at the point of considering divorce...yet. I am going to sit him down and insist on counseling and I want him in anger management. I am just going to have to be prepared for a plan if he refuses or it does not work. I don't want to leave him but if this could damage the kids...and I believe it can in the long term then I have to do what is right for them. I just hate that because my husband working is what allows me to stay home and homeschool my kids. If I leave, I have to go back to work and put them in school which for my own reasons I am extremely and passionately against. I have to find a way to make this work. At this point my kids are not hating him...they say he is mean but they also love him very much and want to be around him. They recover from his moods quickly but it can't be an ongoing thing anymore.


----------



## Waking up to life (Nov 29, 2012)

You say you have to find a way to make it work. Definitely you should insist on counseling. Don't back down, and don't buy his attempts to sweet talk you out of it by saying he's sorry, he's just been really stressed, he'll try harder, etc. The problems go way deeper than that. But...please, please realize that it's NOT 100% your responsibility to fix this problem. You will lose yourself in the process of trying to be supermom, superwife, superteacher, etc. You will pour every ounce of your blood, sweat, tears into trying to fix this yourself, and in the end, you'll slam head-on into the fact that you have sacrificed yourself as an individual, wonderful woman for very little gain and there's nothing left of you or for you. I speak from personal experience. I've lived 19 years this way. I'm now realizing I have put so much into being the peacekeeper and cheerleader and helper, I am now at the brink of feeling like I don't know who I am apart from meeting my husband's needs. It's the most awful, punch-in-the-gut feeling I've ever felt in my life.

The first step is to get the two of you to counseling. If he agrees, your decision just got a little easier, at least for the time being. If he refuses, you must decide which is more important: your ability to provide your kids with home schooling at the sacrifice of their mental well-being, or your ability to provide for them an emotionally safe home at the sacrifice of their method of education.


----------



## Piecukonis (Apr 3, 2010)

*sigh* Your post really hit home with me. There are definitely times that I wonder who I am anymore. There have been times that I have actually thought to myself that who I was pre-marriage is completely gone. So much of me has changed and in a lot of ways I don't like the changes or who I have become. 

Regarding this issue. I can't just spring anything on him when it comes to working on issues...I actually have to prepare him or he will get insanely defensive and mad so I just told him tonight....very casually "tomorrow can we set some time aside to talk about parenting issues and some ideas I have"...very nicely and tried not to make anything more out of it. The response I got was a roll of the eyes and a very sarcastic and hostile "SURE" and now he is mocking me because I am on a marriage forum. *sigh* He does not think that marriages should have to be worked on. He thinks they just exist or don't. Anything that has to do with my feelings or the kids feelings really seem to be something that he has no interest in whatsoever. :-(


----------



## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Your husband is working full time and going to school full time? This is probably why he cannot relax as a father. The guy is probably worn out.

Where does he do his studying? Can a seperate room be setup for him..or even a corner in a quiet room? That way the kids do not disturbe his study. But when he comes out he has to put on the happy daddy face.


----------



## Waking up to life (Nov 29, 2012)

Piecukonis said:


> Anything that has to do with my feelings or the kids feelings really seem to be something that he has no interest in whatsoever. :-(


Oh, sweetheart, everything you posted could've been written by me. This last part is PRECISELY why I have had to resort to getting counseling on my own. I'm hiding it from him for now, because he got angry when I said I wanted to see a counselor about some "depression" feelings I've been having. (It's really about my unhappiness in marriage, but I didn't tell him that...I couldn't.) 

How long have you been married? I'm sure you know the longer this goes on, the more ingrained it will be. And if you're like me, you get into the habit of just putting on a smiling face and shoving away your own feelings and needs, because you've been made to feel like your needs aren't important or don't even exist. The longer you allow your needs to be stomped on, the more you are telling your H it's ok for him to treat you that way. So...your endless self-sacrifice is ultimately perpetuating the problem. I'm not criticizing you. I'm guilty as charged myself. 

I completely understand the idea of having to ease him into a conversation like this. And it sounds like what you said was a very good start. When you dive in to the "big discussion", be prepared for him to guilt you, minimize your feelings, make you the bad guy, etc. When he does, think of him like you would think of a little child throwing a tantrum in a store. The easy way to shut him up is to give him what he wants (in your H's case, he'll want you to drop the subject and apologize for ever bringing it up), but as with a tantrum throwing child in a store, you calmly say "I'm sorry if this upsets you, but this is what I need..." 

I'm gearing up for the big conversation after the holidays, trying to keep the peace for Christmas for my son's sake. Good luck and keep telling yourself that it's OK for you to have your needs met too.


----------



## Piecukonis (Apr 3, 2010)

He attends University of North Dakota online for Electrical Engineering. He handles his work/school stuff pretty well. When he goes to sleep no matter how early, we leave him alone. But I cannot expect that just because he is a FT student and employee that me and the kids need to disappear. I do 100% taking care of the kids needs, cooking, cleaning, shopping, budgeting and bill paying, homeschooling the kids, and online classes myself. He is still a dad and a husband but the only time he responds to us at all is in anger lately or not at all. We need more of a balance somewhere but I don't know where to start.


----------



## SpinDaddy (Nov 12, 2012)

Piecukonis said:


> I am trying to figure out how to help my husband be a better and more patient, relaxed father. . . . .What do I do?


Work with him to become better parents together realizing that parents, their styles and expectations are different because that is, how it is, in the world.

Parenting isn’t a “me v. him v. them” thing but rather an “us” thing – I see a lot of “me v. him” in what you’ve written.


----------



## Hicks (Jan 14, 2011)

He is stressed. He is not wrong and you are not right. You are two different people with different attitudes, priorities and parenting style.

You have to make adjustments in your life so that all people are collectively happier. You are a family, not strictly parents.


----------



## Piecukonis (Apr 3, 2010)

That's what I want too...for us to work as a team. I tend to be extreme in my ways with the kids while he is extreme in the other way. I just see his way as more verbally abusive and I worry about the kids emotional health. Maybe that is just because I am a mom and woman and don't like to see their feelings hurt. We had a LONG 3 hour talk late last night about all our concerns and have come up with a temporary new plan on parenting to see how it goes when we are both on the same page. We talked about what behaviors will illicit what reaction and who will be doing the reacting. I think it was a good talk. He did try to shut it down in the beginning and got defensive but we worked through it. That's why it took 3 hours. Haha...we are both so hard headed. I also got him to agree to try an anger management therapy session or even a workbook because he agreed that he has a hair trigger and feels bad once he calms down. Hopefully this new plan works..we will see. Thanks for all your comments and advice.


----------



## Hicks (Jan 14, 2011)

What you see as doing the right thing and preventing them for having their feelings hurt he undoubtedly sees as your children not being prepared for the real world.

You will not be on the same page. A father provides one type of parenting. A mother provides a different type of parenting. Both types are essential for children. Until you respect what your husband brings to the table in terms of parenting he will feel the stress and have trouble relaxing.


----------



## diwali123 (Feb 17, 2012)

He sounds overly stressed to me. He is in the adult world all day and then has to quickly get online and be under more pressure. 
I would be very upset if I were you. My ex did some of the same things. One counselor told me people usually want to give their kids what they never had or they want to keep their children from having what they didn't have. How sad for him. 
It sounds like you are the opposite of his mom and it might be hard to see what a good involved mom looks like. He didn't have a child hood so he doesn't know how to relate to children. 
I feel for both of you. I hope that he will work with you. 
What is your sex life like? 
Do you think he resents that you stay at home and that he has to be the sole bread winner?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Piecukonis (Apr 3, 2010)

To the above poster...our sex life takes a dive when he is overly moody and negative but on good days we are really good. I am not concerned with our sex life really. He actually wants me to be the homemaker and prefers that I stay home with the kids while he makes the money. He is constantly putting me on a pedestal with others talking about what a great mom, wife, house cleaner, budgeter, etc that I am. So I am not worried about that. I am definitely different than his mom in everyway and he tells me that he wants nothing to do with her. I know he wants more for our kids than he had but he has a hard time figuring out how to do that and to let go of his childhood issues and his problems with his mom. I think that is where the therapy and anger management can come into play. He has a lot of stress in him but does not know how to release it until he snaps and he snaps at EVERY little thing. 

The last few days since our talk have been WONDERFUL. He has stepped back and allowed me to do most of the discipline and guess what...he is shocked that the kids are acting happier, listening better, and overall the mood in the house is lighter. I still have that feeling of how long can this last but me and him kind of talked a bit about how this was going and he told me that yes, he feels the want and need sometimes to yell but has just taken a deep breath and walked away to let me handle it. He is happy that the kids are not feeling hurt and thinking he is the monster however he does like to point out that the kids cry when I discipline them too. Ha ha but it is not because they were scared from being yelled at....it was because they were not getting their way. There's a difference. I still think that while he is handling his anger and words and tone with the kids better, he still needs to figure out why he is having these knee-jerk angry reactions to things that would normally not anger a parent to that degree.


----------



## Piecukonis (Apr 3, 2010)

Hicks said:


> What you see as doing the right thing and preventing them for having their feelings hurt he undoubtedly sees as your children not being prepared for the real world.
> 
> You will not be on the same page. A father provides one type of parenting. A mother provides a different type of parenting. Both types are essential for children. Until you respect what your husband brings to the table in terms of parenting he will feel the stress and have trouble relaxing.


An example of the way my husband would talk to my 4 and 5 year old:

If the 4 year old comes out of his room at bedtime after I have calmly guided him back to his room to put him to bed at least 5 times....then hubby will snap and dramatically jump up off the couch and YELL LOUDLY "Get the F**K back into bed and DON'T F**KING come back out or I am going to spank you!"

or

If my 5 year old little girl falls off her bike and scraped her knee...I will hug her, bandage her knee, and just tell her I know it hurts but you will be ok. But he will very mockingly and sarcastically with a disgusted look on his face look at her and go "Wahhh Wahhh you big baby, get over it" and not hug her or ask if she is ok or anything. 

These are not what I consider a healthy way for a man to parent children. I don't think anything can prepare my children for the real world when their father talks to them this way. This is what I mean when I say I worry about their emotional health and what I want to put a stop to. He goes overboard thinking that a 4 year old boy needs to "man up" and never cry or hug his mommy. We are working on it though and I see him trying really hard over these last couple days.


----------



## Waking up to life (Nov 29, 2012)

Piecukonis said:


> An example of the way my husband would talk to my 4 and 5 year old:
> 
> If the 4 year old comes out of his room at bedtime after I have calmly guided him back to his room to put him to bed at least 5 times....then hubby will snap and dramatically jump up off the couch and YELL LOUDLY "Get the F**K back into bed and DON'T F**KING come back out or I am going to spank you!"
> 
> ...


That is obtusely verbally abusive. What do you say when he speaks to them that way? Do you keep quiet and apologize to your kids for him later? Or do you intervene immediately and tell him it is absolutely unacceptable for him to talk that way? It matters to the kids how YOU behave in this situation too. Do you enable it or do you defend them?


----------



## diwali123 (Feb 17, 2012)

That would bother me so much. That's the type of father I had except he also added physical abuse to the mix. All he's doing is telling his kid's that they are in the way, they are wrong, they shouldn't have feelings or be children. 
I'm glad that your sex life is good and everything. It does sound like he needs to go to IC for issues relating to his childhood. I can't imagine what a basket case mom I would have been without years of therapy. I hope you continue on this new road!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Piecukonis (Apr 3, 2010)

Waking up to life said:


> That is obtusely verbally abusive. What do you say when he speaks to them that way? Do you keep quiet and apologize to your kids for him later? Or do you intervene immediately and tell him it is absolutely unacceptable for him to talk that way? It matters to the kids how YOU behave in this situation too. Do you enable it or do you defend them?


I absolutely defend them. Then he gets mad at me and storms off. I also apologize to them for him and after a while he goes in and apologizes. The yelling and cursing he feels bad about but he does not think the mocking and making fun of is bad. He thinks I am making them weak by attending to them when they cry over something. We talk a lot about how I dissaprove and tell him that if it comes down to him not being able to change this behavior and see someone about it then I am taking the kids and leaving rather than them be subjected to that. That is why I was on here asking for how to help guide him to understand that he is being too overly aggressive with how he talks to them. He never lays a hand on them although he threatens it a lot but I think the verbal stings worse. He has been great these last few days but he is generally a pessimistic and moody person in regards to just about everything so I am hoping that anger management or something will help. This is not something that has been going on since they were babies...just recently as they have gotten older and of course the energetic preschooler mentality sets in. They color on walls sometimes, insist on pouring their own milk only to spill it all, the normal things kids that age do but it infuriates him. I try to explain that they are acting their age but he thinks they should know better. I have gotten books on child development and explained that their brains physically cannot understand what he wants them to understand. He thinks our 5 year old is "lying" when she starts talking about imaginative things and he does not understand that a 5 year old does not even understand the concept of a manipulitive lie. It's things like that...I don't know how to get him to understand that he needs to relax because he thinks the kids do things just to intentionally drive him nuts.


----------



## Piecukonis (Apr 3, 2010)

diwali123 said:


> That would bother me so much. That's the type of father I had except he also added physical abuse to the mix. All he's doing is telling his kid's that they are in the way, they are wrong, they shouldn't have feelings or be children.
> I'm glad that your sex life is good and everything. It does sound like he needs to go to IC for issues relating to his childhood. I can't imagine what a basket case mom I would have been without years of therapy. I hope you continue on this new road!
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


That is something that I have pointed out to him....that the way he acts and talks is like he does not care what the kids have to say or that they are just in his way...and the kids can feel that. His responses to the kids are more negative than positive and I told him that it will have an affect on how they feel about him the rest of their lives as well as an affect on their future relationships and how they treat their spouses, kids, etc. I have started pointing out to him...would you like a man to act around your daughter when she is older the way you act and talk? And of course he says no way. His intentions are misguided and he has no clue how to relate to a 4 and 5 year old. I have been through years of therapy myself for my childhood experiences and I feel like anyone would benefit from it but my husband comes from a family that thinks the whole psychology field is a total joke. No wonder he has no relationship with them at all. He really is a good man, hard worker, will do anything for anyone, but just has this thing where he can't seem to relate to the kids properly. He never talks to me like that unless I yell at him for talking to the kids then he will say "F you" then walk off but other than that the only time he comes unglued is when it has to do with the kids being naughty. I say pick your battles...he has no idea how to do that.


----------



## Hicks (Jan 14, 2011)

I would take him aside privately and tell him if he ever talks to the kids like that again, you are going to take the kids and move back in with your parents. And then follow through.

I was wrong in my previous advice, since you posted that detail.


----------



## Waking up to life (Nov 29, 2012)

Hicks said:


> I would take him aside privately and tell him if he ever talks to the kids like that again, you are going to take the kids and move back in with your parents. And then follow through.
> 
> I was wrong in my previous advice, since you posted that detail.


Agreed. Tell him that he is being abusive to the children by treating them that way. Verbal and emotional abuse is still abuse. Tell him you will not tolerate it any more than you'd tolerate him hitting them. Since you've put up with it for this long, you'll have to give him one warning before you take further action. Tell him the next time he abuses the children, you will have no choice but to take them out of the home. Then he can relish all the quiet time he could possibly dream of. 

He won't see your viewpoint on it...he can't. He's egocentric and emotionally infantile. He needs intense therapy. Is there any way you can separate for an agreed upon time so he can work on his issues away from the "distraction" of the kids?


----------



## Piecukonis (Apr 3, 2010)

So far so good. Since my original post and the long discussion me and him had late that night...he still has not raised his voice or threatened the kids. I am pleased with how well everything is going. I have told him before about it being abuse. He sees it as the accepted father discipline of the old days. We will continue to work it out.


----------

