# Opinions?



## QuestioningMyMarriage (Apr 3, 2013)

This is my first post and I feel like it's a new low for me. I don't know where to go or what to do so I'd appreciate some advice.

I've been married for 6+ years and my husband doesn't want sex. Over the years I've brought it up and said it's a problem and he says sure we'll have more and we'll have sex a few more times and then we don't.

Since January I think we've had sex once. I've stopped initiating last year, which I know is petty but I feel like if he initiates he wants me. If I initiate then he just goes along with me.

I've been reading some posts here and I think it's possible he has low testosterone or he might have a porn addiction. Late last year I told him we need to see a counsellor and he agreed but neither one of us followed through.

We've had two date nights in the last few months (kid sleeping at grandparents for the night) and both times it's turned into a fight and no sex. The second date night was this past weekend and this is what made me so frustrated.

So I've told him there's a problem in our marriage and we need help, otherwise I'm done. I said that I suspect that there is something going on and I think it could be one of the following:

- porn addiction...I looked at YourBrainOnPorn that someone psoted here...I've never said he couldn't look at porn and it's possible he could be addicted. He has become very anti-social over the years, plus he has a smart phone and I know he looks at porn on it.

- there is someone else...I am pretty sure he goes straight to work and comes home. He does not go to bars or out with friends. If friends call him to go out, he never returns their calls.

- low testosterone...I asked him to see the doctor to get checked.

- he's not turned on by me...I don't know, I'm not in the best shape and I'm a bit bigger than when we met and I've started exercising. Problem is that he still didn't want sex even when I was thinner and fitter than I am now, so I don't think that makes a difference.

I've told him this is what needs to happen:

- get his testosterone tested
- we need counselling

His response was "well can we schedule sex instead of seeing a counsellor?" My reply was "NO we cannot. This has been going on for years and you keep telling me you're going to change but nothing ever does. We need a counsellor so we can figure out this problem or I'm done."

Last night he went on his computer and looked at shoes for himself on sale. No mention of a counsellor, no mention of a doctor appointment, nothing. It's like he's happy to keep the status quo. I have always felt like he's been holding back on me, like he has some weird fettish or something that he's too embarrassed to talk about. I feel like we are missing an emotional connection. Not long ago we had some friends over (another couple). I remember him sitting there and not saying three words all night. It's like he has nothing to say to anyone. I briefly mentioned to a friend that he's had a lower sex drive and she suggested he might be depressed. But is it possible to be depressed for years? Sex has always been vanilla. I remember one time having sex in another room of the house and he wanted to go to our bed.

It feels like I'm living with a room mate. I'm thinking of going to counselling for myself, my self esteem is hitting the floor. In my fantasy world he'd want to have sex with me every day. I've told him that if he were to initiate every day I would never turn him down, ever. Nothing has chagned. He never initiates.

Any other suggestions? I'm in tears thinking about my marriage.


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

I hear you, loud and clear I know the feeling! he is a conflict avoider so going to the doctor is something he will duck. Make the appointment for him and GO with him! make the appointment for MC and tell him no excuses. He may need you to get the ball rolling but if he refuses to take the steps required, you are going to have to draw a line somewhere because he could take a step or two, then sink again. You will spend your life fixing someone who doesn't want to be fixed, trying to save something that was never really there. Could be depression, could be testosterone, could be porn addiction, who gives a crap what it is. Because what it ISN'T is a happy marriage.


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## QuestioningMyMarriage (Apr 3, 2013)

Yes, he is a conflict avoider. If I could describe him in two words, that would be it.

You're right it's not a happy marriage. I'm very unhappy and he avoids talking about anything. I'm trying to think if he was always this way or if he changed. If he was always this way then I can mentally beat myself up some more, like why didn't I see this sooner. But at the end of the day, it doesn't matter.

I just want him to care.


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## Happyquest (Apr 21, 2009)

One thing that has helped my marriage and we have had a ton of issues over the year is listening to some videos called love and respect by Emerson Eggerich. The best thing is you can find them free on You tube. Listen to a few and see if it doesn't give you some ideas on how to stop the crazy cycle. Your not alone trust me!


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## Leasel (Mar 30, 2013)

You need to set the appointment for MC yourself, he's obviously not interested and won't give you any help on that. Tell him in advance when the day/time is, and make sure it's at a time you know he's got nothing else planned. Don't let him make any excuses about why he can't make it or anything like that, make sure he goes with you. Even if he doesn't say anything the first time, make sure he keeps going with you, maybe with a little bit of time he will open up. If he still won't make the effort after that, he probably never will.


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## stevehowefan (Apr 3, 2013)

I thought about the cheating aspect of my marriage, as it pertained to my wife's lack of desire. I would imagine it's possible, but if you dwell on it for too long, the affect from it may dampen the mood even more (if that's possible). I never believed my wife cheated on me, but because she didn't want to have sex much, it crossed my mind.


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## Woodchuck (Nov 1, 2012)

I suspect your husband is just LD...Low sex drive. And no it cannot be fixed. Have you ever had what you would consider a good sex life with him?....Many people, men and women marry hoping the sex will improve...I never does...Some say sex was ok during dating but stops on the wedding day...Bait and switch....Either way I don't see it geting better.

good luck
the woodchuck.


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## QuestioningMyMarriage (Apr 3, 2013)

Thanks, everyone. I appreciate the replies.

Woodchuck, we did have more sex before marriage and it was okay; not amazing but at least we had it a few times a month or more. I remember going on a holiday about 1 or 2 years into our marriage and I expected sex (hahaha) and I called him on it when he didn't initiate. It was such a great holiday but all I can think about is that we never had sex. On that holiday, I said that sex was really important, blah blah blah. He said something to the effect that bringing up the lack of sex was a "threat" to our marriage. I think it's possible there was a bait and switch.

I feel like we've kind of hit rock bottom, like I almost don't want to bother getting counselling because what's the point. If we didn't have a kid I'm pretty sure I'd have one foot out the door. I also feel mad at myself for not seeing things more clearly. I was following his lead of ignoring things (the lack of sex, poor communication) so I feel like I'm to blame here, too.

He used my computer today so it's possible he looked at my browser history and saw this message. I'm not a passive agressive person, but in a passive agressive way, I kind of wish he'd see the thread.


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## Mavash. (Jan 26, 2012)

QuestioningMyMarriage said:


> we did have more sex before marriage and it was okay; not amazing but at least we had it a few times a month or more.


Here's the way it works. The BEST sex you get is BEFORE marriage. It's largely downhill from there.

Therefore you've married a ND man. He's isn't just low he's just nonexistent.

I don't think you can fix this. 

Sorry.


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## QuestioningMyMarriage (Apr 3, 2013)

Okay really stupid question here. I've never used porn, and I'm not trying to blame porn for anything, but if he's looking at porn and not having sex with me, would he still be LD/ND? I know he looks at it but I don't know the frequency. There's also large chunks of time where I'm at work and he's at home, so he would probably be accessing it then. I also used his smartphone for something (mine wasn't available) and in the browser I typed something and a porn site came up with the same start letters as what I was typing. I "found" it completely by accident and I teased him a bit, but as usual he clammed up. So does anyone think he'd be still accessing porn AND not having sex with his wife?


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## Chris Taylor (Jul 22, 2010)

Yes, he could be looking at a lot of porn, even masturbating to it. Tat would lower his drive.

Make an appointment with a marriage counselor yourself. Tell him when it is. If he doesn't go, go alone and let him know you are going to show how serious you are about this.

In the meantime, initiate, initiate, initiate. Make him say no. You don't want to get to counseling and hear "well, you never tell me when you want to have sex."

And a physical may be in order, too. If you have to, make the appointment for him.


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## QuestioningMyMarriage (Apr 3, 2013)

Last night I asked him about booking a doctor's appointment yet. He said, "For what?" I told him for testosterone test, etc. I said he agreed to get tested and to go to MC with me. I was thinking come on buddy, this conversation was 48 hours ago and you don't remember? As an aside, I agree that a physical is definitely in order for him; I don't remember that he's ever had one.

Today as I was looking for MCs in our area to book an appointment, he sent me an email with a list of three in our area! He asked me if I had a preference and if not, then he would choose one and book an appointment. So proof that he listens if I repeat myself. :yay:


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

:woohoo:
:smthumbup:

Well done!


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## Kermitty (Dec 27, 2012)

Stay on him about going to the doctor. Make sure he doesn't "forget" to go to the appt. if his health is fine, mc is the next step. He may get annoyed and mad but so what. It isn't like he will stop having sex with you. If he watches porn but isn't interested in sex with you, I would guess the issue isn't about his LD. There is something more going on. It could be a fetish thing like you mentioned or it could be his own views on sex and thinking it is wrong to treat the woman he loves and respects "that way". 
To answer your earlier question, it is possible to be depressed for years. I suffered with depression for 8 years before I got help. 
I hope you find the answer soon.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## JustSomeGuyWho (Dec 16, 2012)

I'm not sure he has a LD. He might have a low drive relative to you but a LD person doesn't really care a whole lot about sex ... could just as happily live without it. If it turns out he does look at porn then he's thinking about it. It matters. I'm sure he isn't looking at it to satisfy his intellectual curiosity. That doesn't mean his T-Level isn't lower than normal.


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## *LittleDeer* (Apr 19, 2012)

You need to insist on no more porn.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## QuestioningMyMarriage (Apr 3, 2013)

Ha, I had to laugh at the comment, 'what's he going to do, stop having sex with you?' Definitely not a consequence if it's already in place.

I'm 100% sure he uses porn and masturbates to it. Since we used to have sex and we both initiated (at least before marriage) in my mind there was never an issue with porn. He would use it if I was at work and for me it was 'out of sight out of mind' and it didn't affect me. The last couple of days I've browsed a bit on YourBrainOnPorn and I think it's possible that he has an addiction, although I've skimmed a few threads here where some people think porn addiction isn't real.

I thought about sending him a link to YourBrainOnPorn and asking him to stop using porn right now, but I think the best thing is to let this unfold in MC. If he is addicted to porn, then it will be better to hear that from a neutral third party. I have to say that being married has made me a much more patient person that I ever thought possible, haha.

I can't believe how supportive everyone is here. Thanks for all the thoughtful replies. Sad that a forum like this exists, but I'm grateful for the support.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

Since you do have an MC appointment scheduled soon, I would say, wait and address the entire sex issue in your session. Don't bring up porn until then, but do bring it up in your session, as it is at least one component in your overall story.

It may or may not be related to the porn. I have known a lot of LD people who still look at porn. People who do not have the inner thrust to go after sex in real time, sometimes still do want to look at naked people. Porn may or may not be a sexual outlet for him, it might just be something he does when he is bored.

You said in an earlier post you have a feeling he might be into a weird fetish or something. Do you have any kind of evidence of this, or is it something your gut is telling you?


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## QuestioningMyMarriage (Apr 3, 2013)

Faithful Wife said:


> You said in an earlier post you have a feeling he might be into a weird fetish or something. Do you have any kind of evidence of this, or is it something your gut is telling you?


I have no evidence of this, just my gut. If I think about it I think it feels like he's holding something back. I remember at least once saying something like, "Hey is there something you really like or want to try in the bedroom? Cuz I'm pretty open-minded."

I feel relieved that we're going to MC but scared of what I might find out.


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## See_Listen_Love (Jun 28, 2012)

Mavash. said:


> Here's the way it works. _The BEST sex you get is BEFORE marriage. It's largely downhill from there_.
> 
> Therefore you've married a ND man. He's isn't just low he's just nonexistent.
> 
> ...


Not in my experience. If you grow into eachother, also sexually you can have the best sex life you can imagine. It stays fresh and new territory can be explored. Even after 30 years of good sex.

It is said about one in ten couples happen to stay in love with eachother. I think much more people can achieve that if they just knew how to do it, wanted to do it, and did it.


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## See_Listen_Love (Jun 28, 2012)

I don't think porn is part of the problem. I am aware of how people judge porn in relation to a healty 'real life' sex life. But I think porn is nothing different from mental images or stories one makes himself.

It can be a stimulant to have sex, or a surrogate instead of sex.

The real problem in society is that where the female sexuality is displayed openly in magazines, tv, movies, commercials etc. etc. the female reality for a lot of men is that of an overweight, untoned, unhappy, uninteresting wife.

Now that is reason to find something better elsewhere, even if it is virtual.

But this mechanic is a taboo in society, it is not political correct to adress this issue, so the men are attacked, porn is attacked, anybody and everthing but the real issue.

So while in his case there can be multiple possible causes, porn addiction is just one of them, and seen his exceptional low drive, as shown by him, the last _cause_ to consider.


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## See_Listen_Love (Jun 28, 2012)

And the same in reversed roles:

from another thread


> Classic Nice guy I am hasn’t had sex with my wife but once in 3 mths. Its been dying off for the last 2 yrs of a 10 year marriage. She ignores me, shows me very little attention. She is never mean, but shows no emotion, doesn’t touch me at all and ignores me on her Ipad, playing games. Computer surfing the net. Texting on her phone. I have been very angry!! We talk about it she says she doesn’t understand that she don't even masturbate much. I woke up a couple times and found her in the living room doing it to porn. I got pissed and said crap like "WTH wake me up!" I told you too! I am in resentment and am so anger at her.


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## Stuckinrut (Feb 24, 2013)

DEPRESSION! Your story sounds alot like my life. My wife has been very depressed for 10+yrs and we have not made much progress. She never wants to do anything, people call and want to do something she will not answer, ZERO sex drive etc...... I also feel like I have a roommate. I wish you the best of luck its a very frustrating road!


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## deejov (Sep 24, 2011)

So sorry you find yourself here, but glad to hear you are going to try MC.

Haven't seen this asked yet, but once you rule out physical issues, there is the big elephant left in the room.

Issues outside the bedroom.
How is your relationship overall?
6 years of frustration can lead to a big disconnect, overall. Without the connection, the sex dies off. Without the sex, the connection dies off. 

MC would be a good place to start with this.

My H was similar. He even angrily told me once that all he needed was his hand and the internet. He got all his needs met through hugs, kisses, cuddles, BJ's. Didn't need more. So stop asking. (Yes, he isn't capable of having sex because he's not capable of being emotional). He has his reasons, he is working on them, but he's had this baggage for most of his life. 

Before marriage, you are in love and willing to be vulnerable. 
After you live with someone for a long time, there is a fear they will get to know you deep down and see your flaws. Your defences go up. If there is a problem there, it will come out in the bedroom. Insecurities, self esteem, abuse, physical problems. 

The bedroom is the barometer of the heart. How well it functions.


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## QuestioningMyMarriage (Apr 3, 2013)

See_Listen_Love said:


> I don't think porn is part of the problem. I am aware of how people judge porn in relation to a healty 'real life' sex life. But I think porn is nothing different from mental images or stories one makes himself.
> 
> It can be a stimulant to have sex, or a surrogate instead of sex.
> 
> ...


Are you saying that because womens' bodies are sexualized (in the media, etc) that men aren't able to be turned on by their wives? That's like saying I see so many hot mens' bodies every day (in media) that I'm not turned on by my husband because he's balding and overweight.:scratchhead::scratchhead:


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## QuestioningMyMarriage (Apr 3, 2013)

deejov said:


> Issues outside the bedroom.
> How is your relationship overall?
> 6 years of frustration can lead to a big disconnect, overall. Without the connection, the sex dies off. Without the sex, the connection dies off.


Overall we need to work on our communication. It's gotten worse over the years.


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

I've been married 28 years and our sex life is awesome! Better than it ever was. Of course, it was pretty crappy for a long time... But I never imagined it could be this yummmmmm! Keep at it and don't stop. You get what you work for!


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## See_Listen_Love (Jun 28, 2012)

QuestioningMyMarriage said:


> Are you saying that because womens' bodies are sexualized (in the media, etc) that men aren't able to be turned on by their wives? That's like saying I see so many hot mens' bodies every day (in media) that I'm not turned on by my husband because he's balding and overweight.:scratchhead::scratchhead:


No, that is taken too far,



> The real problem in society is that where the female sexuality is displayed openly in magazines, tv, movies, commercials etc. etc. the female reality for a lot of men is that of an overweight, untoned, unhappy, uninteresting wife.


means that the real wife in his bed and house is different from the image of 'what could be' that is all around him.

There is a real problem, a it is a taboo.


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## QuestioningMyMarriage (Apr 3, 2013)

Still not getting your point. Because womens' bodies are "displayed openly" in the media, a husband will then compare his wife to these women?


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## QuestioningMyMarriage (Apr 3, 2013)

In other news, if we can get a sitter, we have a MC appt for Friday. I'm a bit nervous about what to expect. I think we get a free 15 minutes session with the MC and if we click, then we go from there.


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## Kermitty (Dec 27, 2012)

QuestioningMyMarriage said:


> In other news, if we can get a sitter, we have a MC appt for Friday. I'm a bit nervous about what to expect. I think we get a free 15 minutes session with the MC and if we click, then we go from there.


That's great news. Good luck!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## See_Listen_Love (Jun 28, 2012)

QuestioningMyMarriage said:


> Still not getting your point. Because womens' bodies are "displayed openly" in the media, a husband will then compare his wife to these women?


Basicly that's what I say, and the comparison is mostly not in favor of the wife.

(But you reduced what I try to say to rather stiff wording, and then it's not really what I say. Things are not black and white.)


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## Kermitty (Dec 27, 2012)

See_Listen_Love said:


> The real problem in society is that where the female sexuality is displayed openly in magazines, tv, movies, commercials etc. etc. the female reality for a lot of men is that of an overweight, untoned, unhappy, uninteresting wife.
> 
> Now that is reason to find something better elsewhere, even if it is virtual.
> 
> ...


Did you say this doesn't affect how woman view their husbands? The men in films and tv, even commercials are better looking than the average male.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## See_Listen_Love (Jun 28, 2012)

No I don't say it's different for how women look at men, I gave an example of the same thing with roles reversed.

But men are more inclined to visual stimulation, therefore porn and looks will be more the issue for them. I think women look more at the power, status, sensitivity and communication of men in movies etc. 

('more' means that women also look at the 'looks', but not as much as the men)


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## Kermitty (Dec 27, 2012)

See_Listen_Love said:


> No I don't say it's different for how women look at men, I gave an example of the same thing with roles reversed.
> 
> But men are more inclined to visual stimulation, therefore porn and looks will be more the issue for them. I think women look more at the power, status, sensitivity and communication of men in movies etc.
> 
> ('more' means that women also look at the 'looks', but not as much as the men)


Ah, I missed that example.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## QuestioningMyMarriage (Apr 3, 2013)

We went to counselling last week and we have another appointment booked. She did an assessment by asking us questions and she told him that he's passive-aggressive and withdraws. As a result I get angry. She wants to bring him from PA to assertive, and me from angry to assertive, so that we're both assertive.

On the way home not a single word did he say. His brother (and his wife) was at our house watching our child (who was sleeping) and when we got home, H put on a movie to watch with them. Again, avoiding any discussion.

I started googling passive-aggressive people this week. I've been crying off and on ever since. It's all making sense now - having conversations over and over and over about the exact same thing and he refuses to speak or gets up and leaves the room. Completely avoids an emotional connection by withdrawing from sex. There is only two rooms in our house that are "finished" and we've been here for 7 years. One is our child's room that he finished when I was pregnant. None of the other rooms have baseboards and I've repeatedly asked him to install and paint them. They're in the garage, collecting dirt and bugs. His mother is passive aggressive but it's more obvious since I don't live with her. He has told me for years that I have anger issues. One quote I read that really resonated with me is this "...he blames her for creating the problem and keeps her focused on her anger rather than his own ineptitude..." and "...a master in getting his partner to doubt herself and feel guilty for questioning or confronting him." LIGHTBULBS, or rather ALARM BELLS, went off for me.

I'm stunned that this has been happening for years and I didn't know what was going on. I've read passive-aggressive behaviour referred as "crazy-making" and wow, that sure sums things up. He's very passive but never makes outright comments to me.

I'm going to go find the general relationship section to post in. This really sucks. I appreciate all the advice I've received in this thread.


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## MaritimeGuy (Jul 28, 2012)

QuestioningMyMarriage said:


> This really sucks. I appreciate all the advice I've received in this thread.


It sucks that it's happening but hopefully at least understanding the dynamics of whats going on will help lead to a solution.

Best of luck!


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