# Watching Porn Worsens ED, Less Enjoyment of Real Sex



## CraigBesuden (Jun 20, 2019)

Researchers suggest porn may be killing the thrill of real sex for many men suffering problems in the bedroom.

The study finds 90 percent of respondents fast-forward to the most arousing moments of their porn selections. De Win says he has no doubt the pornography that men watch affects the way they view sex.

“Twenty percent felt that they needed to watch more extreme porn to get the same level of arousal as previously. We believe that the erectile dysfunction problems associated with porn stem from this lack of arousal,” the head researcher adds.









Watching more porn leads to worse erectile dysfunction in men, less enjoyment of 'real' sex


Can a fantasy really affect how people deal with reality? When it comes to pornography, a new study says yes and the news isn't good for men.




www.studyfinds.org


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## OnTheFly (Mar 12, 2015)

CraigBesuden said:


> Researchers suggest porn may be killing the thrill of real sex for many men suffering problems in the bedroom.
> 
> The study finds 90 percent of respondents fast-forward to the most arousing moments of their porn selections. De Win says he has no doubt the pornography that men watch affects the way they view sex.
> 
> ...


I would not be surprised if this was true. Our society has had high speed internet porn for approx, 15yrs now, the damage has to be piling up.


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## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

Not all the way on topic but my ex husband admitted to me he didn't "try as hard" to keep a good relationship with me because he had porn to fall back on.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

A couple of years ago I read in Psychology today that p*** addiction messing up real life sex lives has become one of the main reasons for new patients. they get to where they can't have sex in real life because they're so used to doing it to their favorite scenarios which can't be recreated. Many of these people have social anxiety to begin with or simply aren't socialized like past generations were. So it's the perfect storm, along with video game addiction. Solitary non-social pursuits that are messing them up in real life and rewarding them in a guaranteed way that they won't find in real life.


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## OnTheFly (Mar 12, 2015)

Livvie said:


> Not all the way on topic but my ex husband admitted to me he didn't "try as hard" to keep a good relationship with me because he had porn to fall back on.


Totally related and probably more common than known.


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## Cletus (Apr 27, 2012)




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## jlg07 (Feb 24, 2017)

Livvie said:


> Not all the way on topic but my ex husband admitted to me he didn't "try as hard" to keep a good relationship with me because he had porn to fall back on.


Wow how sad. As if sex is the only thing required for a relationship. Considering how much of our life is ACTUALLY spent having sex vs actually living life outside of sex, this is really a sad viewpoint on relationships. (and understand why he is an ex)


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## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

CraigBesuden said:


> “Twenty percent felt that they needed to watch more extreme porn to get the same level of arousal as previously. We believe that the erectile dysfunction problems associated with porn stem from this lack of arousal,” the head researcher adds.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yawn.

Another attempt to blame pornography instead of looking at depression, anxiety, a lack of attraction/desire for whoever they are with, medication side effects and or other medical problems like prostate issues etc.

For a better understanding of this, you would do well to read all of the linked references as posted below.



> Grubbs, J. B., & Gola, M. (2019). *Is pornography use related to erectile functioning?* Results from cross-sectional and latent growth curve analyses. The journal of sexual medicine, 16(1), 111-125.
> 
> *Design:* Longitudinal, within-subject
> *Population:* Sexually active US men
> ...





> Prause, N., & Pfaus, J. (2015). *Viewing sexual stimuli associated with greater sexual responsiveness, not erectile dysfunction.* Sexual medicine, 3(2), 90-98.
> 
> *Design:* Experiment
> *Population:* Adult males
> ...





> Landripet, I., & Štulhofer, A. (2015). *Is pornography use associated with sexual difficulties and dysfunctions among younger heterosexual men?.* The journal of sexual medicine, 12(5), 1136-1139.
> 
> *Design:* Online survey
> *Population:* Croatian, Norwegian, and Portuguese men
> ...





> De Graaf, H., & Wijsen, C. (2017). Seksuele gezondheid in Nederland 2017. *Sexual health in the Netherlands 2017*.
> 
> *Design:* Nationally -representative survey
> *Population:* Age 18-80
> ...





> Prause, N., Steele, V. R., Staley, C., Sabatinelli, D., & Hajcak, G. (2016). Prause et al.(2015) *the latest falsification of addiction predictions*. Biological psychology, 120, 159-161.
> 
> *Design:* Letter to the editor/Review
> *Population:* Not applicable
> ...





> Droubay, B. A., & Butters, R. P. (2019). *Pornography, religiosity, and social work.* Journal of Social Work, 1468017319852599.
> *Population:* Social work students
> *Sample Size:* 136
> 
> *Summary:* Highly religious students rated pornography more addictive on average. Of particular concern is that practitioners’ values might lead to over-pathologizing behavior & labeling it as addictive. This is significant in that addiction is a heavy label that may harm clients.





> Prause, N., Steele, V. R., Staley, C., Sabatinelli, D., & Hajcak, G. (2015). *Modulation of late positive potentials by sexual images in problem users and controls inconsistent with “porn addiction”*. Biological psychology, 109, 192-199.
> 
> *Design:* Experiment
> *Population:* Men and women with/out problem use
> ...





> Ley, D. J. (2018). *The pseudoscience behind public health crisis legislation.* Porn Studies, 5(2), 208-212.
> 
> *Design:* Commentary
> *Population:* Not applicable
> ...


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## Mr. Nail (Apr 26, 2011)

jlg07 said:


> Wow how sad. As if sex is the only thing required for a relationship. Considering how much of our life is ACTUALLY spent having sex vs actually living life outside of sex, this is really a sad viewpoint on relationships. (and understand why he is an ex)





Livvie said:


> Not all the way on topic but my ex husband admitted to me he didn't "try as hard" to keep a good relationship with me because he had porn to fall back on.


OK, I agree wholeheartedly. My spouse doesn't even talk to me most days. She has outsourced not only sex, but the entirety of the relationship to the "it's not really porn" world of romance fiction.


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## Cletus (Apr 27, 2012)

CraigBesuden said:


> Researchers suggest porn may be killing the thrill of real sex for many men suffering problems in the bedroom.
> 
> The study finds 90 percent of respondents fast-forward to the most arousing moments of their porn selections. De Win says he has no doubt the pornography that men watch affects the way they view sex.
> 
> ...


Another observational study that comes up WAY short in showing any kind of causal link. 

That doesn't mean it's wrong, only that it doesn't prove a damned thing other than a correlational relationship. Do men with erectile dysfunction problems turn to porn or is the other way around? Perhaps other unknown factors? 

Good clickbait. Less than persuasive science.


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## Andy1001 (Jun 29, 2016)

It’s not just the porn, it’s what goes hand in hand with porn that has destroyed many men’s ability to have sex with their partner. 
Masturbation is one of the main reasons some men can’t or won’t have sex with a willing partner. 
Look up “Death grip”.


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## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

I think this is similar to people who drink - there are plenty of people (men) who indulge in porn who have NO problem with it, who it can actually even benefit (relieving stress and frustration, helping with a LD spouse)...but for men who tend towards becoming COMPULSIVE with it, it's going to become a big negative for them in their lives.

I think YOUNG men have a higher risk of struggling with it than my generation of men...but I could be wrong.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Just keep the hands from the pants.

Nothing wrong with working up the appetite *as long as you eat at home*.


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## badsanta (Oct 13, 2014)

My wife looks at porn on Zillow all the time. A lot of things there are just completely unrealistic and I will not be able to provide that for her. Every time I work with her to have more realistic expectations, she will expand her search criteria into something even more unrealistic which makes it almost impossible for her to just enjoy what we have. 

I tell you, I feel for couples out there dealing with porn. Especially husbands that can no longer please their wives due to what she has seen while looking at porn on sites like Zillow.


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## RebuildingMe (Aug 18, 2019)

Shocked this thread was stated by a male. You know, some men have to look at porn because their “wives” stopped being wives. Where’s the thread on that?


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## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

RebuildingMe said:


> Shocked this thread was stated by a male. You know, some men have to look at porn because their “wives” stopped being wives. Where’s the thread on that?


Oooh...I think there's like, 1000 of them!!! Lol!


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## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

RebuildingMe said:


> Shocked this thread was stated by a male. You know, some men have to look at porn because their “wives” stopped being wives. Where’s the thread on that?


No one _has to_ watch porn.


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## Cletus (Apr 27, 2012)

Livvie said:


> No one _has to_ watch porn.


Ok, but the list of things that we choose to do which are not required is endless.


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## lifeistooshort (Mar 17, 2013)

jlg07 said:


> Wow how sad. As if sex is the only thing required for a relationship. Considering how much of our life is ACTUALLY spent having sex vs actually living life outside of sex, this is really a sad viewpoint on relationships. (and understand why he is an ex)


Not only that....sex itself is about so much more then getting off. It's a chance to share real intimacy with someone, and I feel bad for people who don't experience that.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

Cletus said:


> Another observational study that comes up WAY short in showing any kind of causal link.
> 
> That doesn't mean it's wrong, only that it doesn't prove a damned thing other than a correlational relationship. Do men with erectile dysfunction problems turn to porn or is the other way around? Perhaps other unknown factors?
> 
> Good clickbait. Less than persuasive science.


Think it goes both ways. Porn doesn't universally ruin everyone, obviously. But there's a couple generations now who live more in virtual life than real life and it's both a cause and a result, I think. 

There's all kinds of problems from it for some. It gives them unrealistic expectations, for one thing, and this is detrimental to the women they interact with, assuming they interact with some real women. On another forum, it was very common to come across younger 20-ish guys who fully expected some woman to just beam themselves in to have sex with them while they just kept playing video games. There are some outliers like that who really have no concept of socializing and all they know is what they see in porn scenarios. And in any of the porn scenarios, women are just suddenly there on their knees, you know. 

I saw a lot of guys like that who expected the women to make all the moves because in porn, they did that. At least the porn they watched. They would be like, I've never had a woman approach and try to have sex with me. 

Most people aren't going to be that far out on the edge, but certainly there are some problems that have become pretty widespread. I feel sorry for the young women who manage to get involved.


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## RebuildingMe (Aug 18, 2019)

Livvie said:


> No one _has to_ watch porn.


LOL, I see trouble brewing....I’m not getting sucked into another porn thread. I’m surprised this was started, tbh. Nothing will ever get resolved.


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## RebuildingMe (Aug 18, 2019)

It’s the chicken and egg thing. Women will claim porn ruins marriages. Men will claim rejection creates the need for porn. Round and round we go...


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## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

RebuildingMe said:


> It’s the chicken and egg thing. Women will claim porn ruins marriages. Men will claim rejection creates the need for porn. Round and round we go...


If the caveat of "some" women and men is used then it can certainly be the case.

Yet there are lots of women who think pornography is perfectly fine, just as there are lots of men who also think pornography is fine and don't use the excuse of rejection to account for their interest in it.

*Women Flock to Pornography* - Psychology Today
Female interest in pornography greater than evolutionary psychology expects

So the divide on this certainly isn't a gender one.


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## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

DownByTheRiver said:


> A couple of years ago I read in Psychology today that p*** addiction messing up real life sex lives has become one of the main reasons for new patients.


Which is funny since Psychology Today also has lots of articles, that say pornography addiction isn't a real thing and it doesn't cause erectile disfunction either.

*Does Pornography Cause Erectile Dysfunction?* - Psychology Today
Critics say watching porn destroys men’s erections. They are mistaken.

*Your Brain on Porn: It's Not Addictive* - Psychology Today
What neurological research actually shows about the people who use porn.

*Science Stopped Believing in Porn Addiction. You Should, Too* - Psychology Today
What does it mean that religion, not porn use, predicts porn-related problems?

*An Erectile Dysfunction Myth* - Psychology Today
Pornography is not the problem.

*“Pornography Addiction:” Science or Naked Rhetoric?* - Psychology Today
Debate growing over pornography's role in life problems

*New Brain Study Questions Existence of “Sexual Addiction"* - Psychology Today
A new study showed the brain's response to pornography is different than drugs

*"Pornography Addiction" in 2017* - PsychologyToday
You can diagnose yourself, but professionals can’t. 

*Sex Addiction: Fact or Fiction? Part 1 of 3* - Psychology Today
Popular culture embraces “sex addiction,” but most psychologists reject it.

*“Pornography Addiction:” Science or Naked Rhetoric?* - Psychology Today
Debate growing over pornography's role in life problems

*No, Dopamine Is Not Addictive* - Psychology Today
Please stop calling dopamine an addictive rewarding neurochemical.

*The Truth About Men and Pornography* - Psychology Today
Assessing the positive and negative effects of viewing porn.

*Pornography: Beneficial or Detrimental?* - Psychology Today
It turns out that pornography may be good for you.

On and on etc...


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## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

RebuildingMe said:


> Shocked this thread was stated by a male. You know, some men have to look at porn because their “wives” stopped being wives. Where’s the thread on that?


If those men find themselves in nominally monogamous sexual relationships with partners (regardless of their gender) who seldom have sex with them if at all. Then the withholding partner forfeit any moral obligation from their husbands, to marital sexual fidelity at all.

So those men who find themselves with sexual partners who don't want to have sex with them often or at all, they should feel free to have sex with other people who do want to share sex with them.

Of which all of the above also applies equally to women, who find themselves in monogamous sexual relationships with sexual partners (regardless of their gender) who don't share sex with them often or at all.

In other words if ones sexual partner stops having sex with you often or at all, one ought to feel free to share lots of sex with other people who want to share sex with you.


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## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

Livvie said:


> No one _has to_ watch porn.


Yep!

I think people should only view pornography because they want to view it, not because they are forced to view it.


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## Mr.Married (Feb 21, 2018)

The amateur stuff is where it’s at. I usually will stick with something around a wife theme.....as in a married/ bf-gf (presumably) couple. I guess because that is my preference it would be reasonable to speculate that Is why I’m not affected by it because relationship sex is what I like. I think it is interesting to see what other couples are up to.
I could understand though how if someone was tied up in some weird stuff that their partner would never entertain then it could be an issue. The bondage thing seems to get a lot of people though I don’t think it’s weird really, just not something I even think about.

The real big FU is when a dude (let’s get real...it’s always a guy) thinks some of that stuff is real life or is convinced his wife should act in some certain manner


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## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

Again, I feel the most-overlooked potential for damage through viewing porn is using it as a substitute for sex (OK, that makes it sound bad) because you don't want to face the problems in your sex life with our partner (that's where my spin is a bit different than most). Porn allows you to avoid the painful stuff. Allows you to kind of just keep going on, allows a bad relationship to not have a chance to reach a sort of critical mass where the problems either have to get dealt with or you go separate ways.

That, I think, is the biggest danger to porn for relatively well-adjusted people. It might never become an addiction but it allows you to avoid confronting relationship issues.


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## Mr.Married (Feb 21, 2018)

Casual Observer said:


> Again, I feel the most-overlooked potential for damage through viewing porn is using it as a substitute for sex (OK, that makes it sound bad) because you don't want to face the problems in your sex life with our partner (that's where my spin is a bit different than most). Porn allows you to avoid the painful stuff. Allows you to kind of just keep going on, allows a bad relationship to not have a chance to reach a sort of critical mass where the problems either have to get dealt with or you go separate ways.
> 
> That, I think, is the biggest danger to porn for relatively well-adjusted people. It might never become an addiction but it allows you to avoid confronting relationship issues.


Well put !


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## Mr. Nail (Apr 26, 2011)

So porn prevents divorce?


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## aaarghdub (Jul 15, 2017)

badsanta said:


> My wife looks at porn on Zillow all the time. A lot of things there are just completely unrealistic and I will not be able to provide that for her. Every time I work with her to have more realistic expectations, she will expand her search criteria into something even more unrealistic which makes it almost impossible for her to just enjoy what we have.
> 
> I tell you, I feel for couples out there dealing with porn. Especially husbands that can no longer please their wives due to what she has seen while looking at porn on sites like Zillow.


^^^^THIS

@badsanta for the win!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## aaarghdub (Jul 15, 2017)

Honestly I think it comes down to “hey, I wish my wife felt that about me.” If she “loves me so
much why can’t she express it that way?”

Because women don’t see sex in that way.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

Nonetheless, there has been a big increase in people coming to psychologists about it problems associated with it. It's not just about Ed, but mainly about not being able to do it with a real woman.


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## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

Mr. Nail said:


> So porn prevents divorce?


Maybe it does! But if so, it's not in a healthy way... (I don't think)


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## RebuildingMe (Aug 18, 2019)

DownByTheRiver said:


> Nonetheless, there has been a big increase in people coming to psychologists about it problems associated with it. It's not just about Ed, but mainly about not being able to do it with a real woman.


If there is no woman available, what’s the harm? Generally, men who view porn don’t have ED issues. Generally, men that have wives as gatekeepers for all things sex, can have ED issues. I’m just taking a wild guess you are or were one of those gatekeepers? I don’t know your story, but the amount of posts you have made in two weeks leads me to believe you have one....


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## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

Mr. Nail said:


> So porn prevents divorce?


Maybe it does.

...

My wife and I are 21+ years into still being happily married.

And we have a bookshelf full of erotic and pornographic books in our bedroom. Plus we make our own homemade porn (still pictures, movies and paintings), view other peoples porn both professional and homemade stuff in motion and still picture form as well. Yet we have also always shared a splendidly rich and frequent sex life together as well.

Likewise at 49, having masturbated frequently (usually 1-2x a day) ever since I became a teenager, and having viewed pornography often for decades now. I can relate that to date I haven't suffered from erectile disfunction, premature ejaculation or any other sexual problems* while getting to share lots of sexual intercourse as a regular thing.

At the end of the day pornography works just fine for my wife and I. Just as it was fine with my ex-wife and all of my other sexual relationship partners that I've been with as well.

If it wasn't for this forum, I would have had no idea that so many people thought pornography was a bad thing.

That said I still don't get why people would want to use porn to substitute sharing sex with someone as an ongoing thing. Seriously if I ever found myself in a sexless, sexual relationship, I wouldn't hesitate to seek sex with other people.

* Except for one instance when a girlfriend snapped my penis the wrong way, during one of our many sex sessions (after washing the blood off and giving it a rest for a couple of days it healed just fine).


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## Andy1001 (Jun 29, 2016)

It’s very true that porn gives people unrealistic expectations. 
Especially about how soon a plumber will call to your house.


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## Mr.Married (Feb 21, 2018)

Andy1001 said:


> unrealistic expectations.


Bullseye !!


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## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

Andy1001 said:


> It’s very true that porn gives people unrealistic expectations.
> Especially about how soon a plumber will call to your house.





Mr.Married said:


> Bullseye !!


This is interesting to read. I've never really found the women in porn to be all that enticing. Frankly, too many tattoos. Rather, porn provides a much-needed sense of anticipation. Anticipation, I think, is what rejected men feel most in need of. You know you can count on it. It's there for you when you need it, and it doesn't turn you down. And, as I've said before, it reduces the feeling you need to confront your partner regarding what you're not getting. But worst of all, it avoids your partner knowing just how awful rejection feels.


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## CatholicDad (Oct 30, 2017)

I’ve read articles written by shrinks where they have worked with young children that are so addicted they literally steal devices to access it or attempt to access it at school or anywhere, etc. Porn certainly sounds addictive in cases like this... really sad. Sounds like the laundry list of “porn is healthy” studies didn’t bother to look at the damage done to kids.

Also sex trafficking is on the rise and one motivation behind it is to produce porn- where are the studies about that? Kids are literally being taken from homes.. the pedophilia epidemic seems to mirror that of porn... where’s the studies or articles on that?

Finally, we’ve all read countless threads on here about marriages being eroded away by porn- I know people personally who have said that it contributed to the demise of their marriage. It’s almost laughable that the psycho babble studies say “not addictive and no loss of interest or ED will result“ when you can read about hundreds of such stories here on TAM where one person is literally crying for intimacy and their spouse ignores them but is routinely accessing porn.


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## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

Just saying... Men can masturbate without porn. From the very first masturbater ever on this Earth until just a few decades ago there was no access to porn for the average person and they still managed to masturbate. They didn't die.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

I can remember back in the early '80s when porn was transitioning from the seedy back-alley XXX theaters in the bad part of town to the VHS tape market, the feminist and religious communities started picketing and sounding the alarms that access to porn would lead to rape gangs roaming the streets and child molesters in every playground because porn would drive men into sex-crazed mutants that would be unable to control their urges and that rape and child molestation would rocket out of control. 

When the internet started to come into being there was similar concern but nowhere to picket or hold rallies or protests and now porn could be piped into the home without restriction. 

The Porn Wars were lost. 

But were are the rape gangs and sex-crazed mutants roaming the streets in search of hapless victims? 

What we seem to be having instead are InCels and MGTOWs never leaving their mom's basement and guys with ED that can't perform with flesh and blood women in real life. 

I do think there is something to it. It makes sense that if guys are draining their own tanks all the time to Brazilian midget orgy porn in a big vat of spaghetti noodles, then they are probably not going to have much vigor for the average flesh and blood woman that just wants some love'n at the end of regular day.


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## CatholicDad (Oct 30, 2017)

oldshirt said:


> But were are the rape gangs and sex-crazed mutants roaming the streets in search of hapless victims?



They’re stealing/luring kids from homes and keeping them prisoners in basements or on private islands so they can be raped and abused thousands of times over. Heard of Epstein? Do you actually think he’s the only one?


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

Personal said:


> If the caveat of "some" women and men is used then it can certainly be the case.
> 
> Yet there are lots of women who think pornography is perfectly fine, just as there are lots of men who also think pornography is fine and don't use the excuse of rejection to account for their interest in it.
> 
> ...


And an additional 60%, per Psychology Today:
"evolutionary psychologists who claim that women choose relationship-based romance literature" ie reading porn, seems like there are always Brutish Scottsmen, lusty Vikings, or lusty pirates involved.

This was an interesting post by someone.


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## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

oldshirt said:


> ...Brazilian midget orgy porn in a big vat of spaghetti noodles...


Lolol!!!!!! THIS is hysterical!!!!!


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

CatholicDad said:


> They’re stealing/luring kids from homes and keeping them prisoners in basements or on private islands so they can be raped and abused thousands of times over. Heard of Epstein? Do you actually think he’s the only one?


Catholic preists have been molesting kids for centuries and the pope and church have looked the other way. Long before porn even was a thing.


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## ah_sorandy (Jul 19, 2018)

If real sex was made more available between partners, PORN would die out!

Couples should be making their own PORN and use it to have some fun times WITH and WITHOUT one another, as needed.

I guess I'm stuck in a sexless marriage because my wife is watching too much PORN and masturbating on her own. NOT!

Maybe, I'm just a naive old man stuck in LaLa land?


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## Anastasia6 (May 28, 2017)

Personal said:


> If those men find themselves in nominally monogamous sexual relationships with partners (regardless of their gender) who seldom have sex with them if at all. Then the withholding partner forfeit any moral obligation from their husbands, to marital sexual fidelity at all.
> 
> So those men who find themselves with sexual partners who don't want to have sex with them often or at all, they should feel free to have sex with other people who do want to share sex with them.
> 
> ...


What a bunch of rubbish. If you aren't satisfied with your martial sex life work to improve it. If it doesn't improve divorce. You sexual frequency desire doesn't entitle ANYONE to cheat. Cheaters are just that cheaters. Its a character issue. Those who think cheating is ok have low moral standards.


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## aaronj (Oct 20, 2011)

CatholicDad said:


> I’ve read articles written by shrinks where they have worked with young children that are so addicted they literally steal devices to access it or attempt to access it at school or anywhere, etc. Porn certainly sounds addictive in cases like this... really sad. Sounds like the laundry list of “porn is healthy” studies didn’t bother to look at the damage done to kids.
> 
> Also sex trafficking is on the rise and one motivation behind it is to produce porn- where are the studies about that? Kids are literally being taken from homes.. the pedophilia epidemic seems to mirror that of porn... where’s the studies or articles on that?
> 
> Finally, we’ve all read countless threads on here about marriages being eroded away by porn- I know people personally who have said that it contributed to the demise of their marriage. It’s almost laughable that the psycho babble studies say “not addictive and no loss of interest or ED will result“ when you can read about hundreds of such stories here on TAM where one person is literally crying for intimacy and their spouse ignores them but is routinely accessing porn.


 Please define "young children" and please cite your source(s).


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## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

Anastasia6 said:


> What a bunch of rubbish. If you aren't satisfied with your martial sex life work to improve it. If it doesn't improve divorce. You sexual frequency desire doesn't entitle ANYONE to cheat. Cheaters are just that cheaters. Its a character issue. Those who think cheating is ok have low moral standards.


Perhaps you should reread what I wrote, since you seemed to miss the fact that at no point did I mention cheating at all.



Personal said:


> If those men find themselves in nominally monogamous sexual relationships with partners (regardless of their gender) who seldom have sex with them if at all. Then the withholding partner forfeit any moral obligation from their husbands, to marital sexual fidelity at all.
> 
> So those men who find themselves with sexual partners who don't want to have sex with them often or at all, they should feel free to have sex with other people who do want to share sex with them.
> 
> ...


To elaborate further, the conversation with ones withholding spouse doesn't have to be long to get the point across. "Unless you change this, since you don't want to share sex with me often or at at all, I will have sex with other people since you have no right to impose celibacy on me." Then in the absence of a timely and substantial change from the withholder, the other partner should feel free to quickly start having sex with other people.

My recommendation is one should divorce the withholder.

That said following telling a withholder that they will not accept unilateral withdrawal of sexual relations, they should feel in good conscience when having sex with others that they are not cheating since they have informed their withholding spouse. Sure they will be participating in adultery, yet technically adultery isn't cheating if ones spouse is informed. So it's all perfectly perfectly dandy, to have sex with others in the face of such egregious withholding behaviour.

At the end of the day if a husband or wife doesn't want to behave like a husband or wife and that means sexually servicing their spouse whatever their gender may be. Then they would be a fool to presume that they are owed any sexual fidelity in the face of their sexual withholding.

If ones spouse decides they're going to play platonic flatmate/housemate instead of husband or wife, then being moral they ought to only be treated like a platonic flatmate/housemate. Which means one should feel free to have sex with others, and even bring their active sexual partners home for a meal and some overnight fun as well.

Oh and on the divorce thing, many sex withholding spouses, don't choose to divorce their husbands or wives when they decide to cut the sex off. And of them many cut that sex off for weeks, months, years and even decades at a time, all without trying to divorce their spouses. Which is a pretty sick thing to do. So morally such people are owed absolutely no sexual fidelity in the face of their monstrous conduct.

If my wife ever unilaterally decides to end our shared sex life or limit it substantially and I still desire sex, I will morally feel free to have sex with others to fill any sexual void she creates. Likewise if I ever decide to unilaterally end our shared sex life or limit it substantially, I expect my wife to also go out and have her sexual wants and desires filled (pun intended) by others.

For me at least it's a simple proposition, if someone is going to be my sexual partner then they have to act accordingly as do I for them. However in the absence of acting accordingly, then others will take their place as my sexual partners. That said to date I have never been in a sexual relationship that didn't live up to it's name with bells on and more++.

One thing for sure, I certainly wouldn't choose masturbating to pornography (even though I think pornography is nice), as a substitute for shared sex with a partner who is nominally considered to be a sexual partner.

Also worthy of note is that spouses who accept celibacy or near celibacy in a marriage, by staying together and not seeking sex elsewhere. They are also completely responsible for their own celibacy or near celibacy in the face of sexual withdrawal, if they accept that status quo and choose not to have sex with others instead.


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## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

CatholicDad said:


> I’ve read articles written by shrinks where they have worked with young children that are so addicted they literally steal devices to access it or attempt to access it at school or anywhere, etc. Porn certainly sounds addictive in cases like this... really sad. Sounds like the laundry list of “porn is healthy” studies didn’t bother to look at the damage done to kids.
> 
> Also sex trafficking is on the rise and one motivation behind it is to produce porn- where are the studies about that? Kids are literally being taken from homes.. the pedophilia epidemic seems to mirror that of porn... where’s the studies or articles on that?
> 
> Finally, we’ve all read countless threads on here about marriages being eroded away by porn- *I know people personally who have said that it contributed to the demise of their marriage.* It’s almost laughable that the psycho babble studies say “not addictive and no loss of interest or ED will result“ when you can read about hundreds of such stories here on TAM where one person is literally crying for intimacy and their spouse ignores them but is routinely accessing porn.


I think in many cases people want to try to blame something other than their own weaknesses for their failures. I'm not suggesting porn isn't a problem for some, and certainly not where it exploits children. But I do think we sometimes use the "evils of porn" as a way to shirk personal responsibility.


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## CatholicDad (Oct 30, 2017)

aaronj said:


> Please define "young children" and please cite your source(s).


Search “porn addiction in children” and you can read all about it.


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## CatholicDad (Oct 30, 2017)

oldshirt said:


> Catholic preists have been molesting kids for centuries and the pope and church have looked the other way. Long before porn even was a thing.


Sadly, there’s always been evil people and there always will be (some masquerade as pastors or priests). I think we can all come together on the fact that porn is hurting children and marriage and we need to speak up and throw it out.


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