# New...11 years ... looking to make things better



## Hope4us55123

I’m new to TAM. Been married 11 years and things are going well, I’m trying to make it better. I believe in continuous improvement in every thing I do. I don’t always achieve it but it’s something I strive for.

One area I’d like to improve is my sex life. I can’t say it’s non-existent but... ok it’s non-existent. We have sex maybe 1 / month at best. We are both in our early 40s so age and physical inability is not the reason. Part of it is lack of intimacy. Part of it is lack of time. She’s also quite exhausted after taking care of the kids from dawn to dusk. She puts a lot of pressure on herself to make things perfect for them and so that eats up a lot of her energy.

I don’t know how to start the conversation with her. Frankly we have a pretty easy life and so haven’t had to have many difficult conversations. I know that’s a rather trivial matter for most people on this site who are dealing with much more complex and involved issues. My biggest fear about not starting the discussion is the unknown. Hard to admit that I don’t know what her reaction will be even after 11 years. 

What advise do those that have had a successful, long-term marriage have for someone in my place? Have you ever had difficulty broaching a topic and how did you approach it? 

In the end, I’m sure it’s not even half as bad as I’m imaging it but I just can’t make it over the hump.


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## Torninhalf

Hope4us55123 said:


> I’m new to TAM. Been married 11 years and things are going well, I’m trying to make it better. I believe in continuous improvement in every thing I do. I don’t always achieve it but it’s something I strive for.
> 
> One area I’d like to improve is my sex life. I can’t say it’s non-existent but... ok it’s non-existent. We have sex maybe 1 / month at best. We are both in our early 40s so age and physical inability is not the reason. Part of it is lack of intimacy. Part of it is lack of time. She’s also quite exhausted after taking care of the kids from dawn to dusk. She puts a lot of pressure on herself to make things perfect for them and so that eats up a lot of her energy.
> 
> I don’t know how to start the conversation with her. Frankly we have a pretty easy life and so haven’t had to have many difficult conversations. I know that’s a rather trivial matter for most people on this site who are dealing with much more complex and involved issues. My biggest fear about not starting the discussion is the unknown. Hard to admit that I don’t know what her reaction will be even after 11 years.
> 
> What advise do those that have had a successful, long-term marriage have for someone in my place? Have you ever had difficulty broaching a topic and how did you approach it?
> 
> In the end, I’m sure it’s not even half as bad as I’m imaging it but I just can’t make it over the hump.


One time a month is only 12 times a year. 😳
You have to be honest and ask her if anything is wrong.
Have you spoken to her at all? How was your sex life in the beginning of your relationship?


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## Hope4us55123

Torninhalf said:


> One time a month is only 12 times a year. 😳
> You have to be honest and ask her if anything is wrong.
> Have you spoken to her at all? How was your sex life in the beginning of your relationship?


It was quite a bit better. I think it really started to drop off after the third kid. It was a bit unplanned and I suspect that she has a negative association with it.

No I haven’t spoken with her about it. I guess part of it is that I don’t know how to have the conversation without making it feel like it’s her problem. Maybe it’s me.


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## Torninhalf

Hope4us55123 said:


> It was quite a bit better. I think it really started to drop off after the third kid. It was a bit unplanned and I suspect that she has a negative association with it.
> 
> No I haven’t spoken with her about it. I guess part of it is that I don’t know how to have the conversation without making it feel like it’s her problem. Maybe it’s me.


Do you initiate sex regularly?


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## Hope4us55123

Torninhalf said:


> Do you initiate sex regularly?


Not regularly. Maybe once every 2 weeks. So my proposals are rejected about 1/2 the time. My real concern is there are probably bigger issues that this is just a symptom of that (i.e. lack of real intimacy, lacks of deeper emotional connections). My wife and I are great partners in life... we deal with everything external to our relationship really well. We just can’t seem to deal with the gaps in our relationship. Perhaps it makes us feel incompetent because we won’t know what to do if we really looked deeper into the issues.


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## Torninhalf

Hope4us55123 said:


> Not regularly. Maybe once every 2 weeks. So my proposals are rejected about 1/2 the time. My real concern is there are probably bigger issues that this is just a symptom of that (i.e. lack of real intimacy, lacks of deeper emotional connections). My wife and I are great partners in life... we deal with everything external to our relationship really well. We just can’t seem to deal with the gaps in our relationship. Perhaps it makes us feel incompetent because we won’t know what to do if we really looked deeper into the issues.


11 years isn’t that long on the scheme of things. What are the bigger issues in your estimation?


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## Hope4us55123

Torninhalf said:


> 11 years isn’t that long on the scheme of things. What are the bigger issues in your estimation?


Well, you can strike out the major issues like infidelity, financial issues, career stresses, etc. I think the biggest thing is that we lack that ability to tell each other what we need emotionally. She probably has done that in the past and when I failed to deliver, just given up. Maybe it’s the same on my end. I’m not the best at being emotionally available in the way that she needs me to be there. It’s like two puzzle pieces that fit perfectly but the picture looks a bit off. All the boxes are checked but it’s not clicking. 

For me sex has become a wish that gets granted every once in a while. The rest of the time I just end up dealing with the tension on my own and move on. I don’t feel good about that solution but it’s the easier path.


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## Torninhalf

Hope4us55123 said:


> Well, you can strike out the major issues like infidelity, financial issues, career stresses, etc. I think the biggest thing is that we lack that ability to tell each other what we need emotionally. She probably has done that in the past and when I failed to deliver, just given up. Maybe it’s the same on my end. I’m not the best at being emotionally available in the way that she needs me to be there. It’s like two puzzle pieces that fit perfectly but the picture looks a bit off. All the boxes are checked but it’s not clicking.
> 
> For me sex has become a wish that gets granted every once in a while. The rest of the time I just end up dealing with the tension on my own and move on. I don’t feel good about that solution but it’s the easier path.


How about trying to be more emotionally available?


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## Al_Bundy

Hope4us55123 said:


> It was quite a bit better. I think it really started to drop off after the third kid. It was a bit unplanned and I suspect that she has a negative association with it.


How was it unplanned? Was she on BC?


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## Hope4us55123

Al_Bundy said:


> How was it unplanned? Was she on BC?


It was unplanned. We weren’t on BC. 

I can say that I was not a very invested father for the baby during pregnancy relative to the first two. But it was a completely different world as soon as she was born. She’s my little princess and I can’t imagine our family w/o her.


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## Hope4us55123

Torninhalf said:


> How about trying to be more emotionally available?


I can do that. Do you have any concrete suggestions as to how?


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## Torninhalf

Hope4us55123 said:


> I can do that. Do you have any concrete suggestions as to how?


What does your wife ask you to do in that area?


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## coquille

Do you devote time regularly to go on dates with your wife? Do you spend time just the two of you to do activities or go on a romantic trip, even for a weekend? 
My XH was financially responsible and hard working, but he was not invested emotionally with me. We would spend a lot of family time and had a lot of family trips, but zero romantic time or dates. I started investing all my energy and time in our three kids to compensate for the lack of emotional fulfillment in my marriage. 
Rather than bluntly asking your wife why she doesn't want to be intimate, plan a romantic date or a romantic getaway with her and arrange babysitting for the kids. 
For women (or at least for me), emotional fulfillment is the condition for sexual fulfillment. It might be very well your wife's case and you admit that you neglected this department. Revive the romance and intimacy will follow.


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## ccpowerslave

You’re just starting out on all the research you need to do if you want to try and fix your sexual relationship.

First off, it’s not a trivial matter or a small problem as it can lead to resentment for one or both partners and ultimately divorce just like any of the problems you think are more serious.

With that said, if you’re both happy with your once a month then there is no problem. It seems unlikely though as you’re posting here.

My recommendation to you is based on where you’re at is to try some of the gentle solutions here like getting her away from the kids on a date; but also be reading up on resources like “The Dead Bedroom Fix” by @dadstartingover which will probably provide a lot of insight and ideas for you to think about if and when you work for a few months on the gentle stuff and it fails.


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## Hope4us55123

coquille said:


> Do you devote time regularly to go on dates with your wife? Do you spend time just the two of you to do activities or go on a romantic trip, even for a weekend?
> My XH was financially responsible and hard working, but he was not invested emotionally with me. We would spend a lot of family time and had a lot of family trips, but zero romantic time or dates. I started investing all my energy and time in our three kids to compensate for the lack of emotional fulfillment in my marriage.
> Rather than bluntly asking your wife why she doesn't want to be intimate, plan a romantic date or a romantic getaway with her and arrange babysitting for the kids.
> For women (or at least for me), emotional fulfillment is the condition for sexual fulfillment. It might be very well your wife's case and you admit that you neglected this department. Revive the romance and intimacy will follow.


Thanks for the advice. I can see some similarities to your situation and mine at the level that you have described. I would bet that my wife would also feel that I am not invested in her emotionally other than to make sure there is nothing wrong ... which is a pretty low and insufficient bar for a happy marriage.

I think starting with the dates maybe a good first step. She’s still not quite there with taking a trip on our own.

May I ask what lead you to finally get to the stage where you felt like separation was the best way forward for you?


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## Hope4us55123

ccpowerslave said:


> You’re just starting out on all the research you need to do if you want to try and fix your sexual relationship.
> 
> First off, it’s not a trivial matter or a small problem as it can lead to resentment for one or both partners and ultimately divorce just like any of the problems you think are more serious.
> 
> With that said, if you’re both happy with your once a month then there is no problem. It seems unlikely though as you’re posting here.
> 
> My recommendation to you is based on where you’re at is to try some of the gentle solutions here like getting her away from the kids on a date; but also be reading up on resources like “The Dead Bedroom Fix” by @dadstartingover which will probably provide a lot of insight and ideas for you to think about if and when you work for a few months on the gentle stuff and it fails.



I like the approach and recommendation. Will give the website a try too. Thanks.


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## Hope4us55123

Torninhalf said:


> What does your wife ask you to do in that area?


Honestly, I don’t know. I haven’t even asked her that.


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## DallasCowboyFan

You need to have a talk. Would you want to know if your wife were occassionally masturbating to take care of herself? She deserves to know that you are doing that. You have an unmet need. It could be out of balance hormones. It could be due to a lack of emotional intimacy. It could be that she doesn't view you in a sexual way anymore. I don't know, but you need to start with a conversation.


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## coquille

Hope4us55123 said:


> Thanks for the advice. I can see some similarities to your situation and mine at the level that you have described. I would bet that my wife would also feel that I am not invested in her emotionally other than to make sure there is nothing wrong ... which is a pretty low and insufficient bar for a happy marriage.
> 
> I think starting with the dates maybe a good first step. She’s still not quite there with taking a trip on our own.
> 
> May I ask what lead you to finally get to the stage where you felt like separation was the best way forward for you?


I commend you for coming to this forum asking for advice, because unlike you, my XH did not want to hear my concerns. I actually voiced to him many times that I was emotionally unfulfilled, but he wouldn't acknowledge or validate my needs. I tried to make him go on dates just the two of us, and he was not interested.

Early in our marriage ( 22 years), we went on one romantic trip and during that trip I felt even more lonely and neglected. I prepared for the trip, took care of myself. I was turning heads, other men in the resort were checking me out, and all he did was checking himself out in every mirror in the resort. I did not get a single compliment from him. At that point I realized that he has narcissistic traits.
As for the intimacy, whenever I declined he would throw tantrums, start being passive agressive to voice his frustration with verbal abuse in front of the children. I would have sex to keep the peace (I have to say that sometimes it was also to fulfill my own needs).
Long story short, he was verbally and emotionally abusive, and this is the first reason behind our divorce.


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## CatholicDad

Quit bandaids like porn/masturbation... these wreck men over the long haul.

Instead, invest your time in being an engaged hubby. Talk to her every chance you get and ask “how are you”? Tell her you miss her. Hug her often (not just to initiate sex) and kiss her goodnight... tell her you love her and spoon her often in bed at night. Hold hands with her and treat her nice and get her out of the house (with you) as often as possible. Heck, initiate more than once every two weeks but just be cool and kind about it if she’s busy or unavailable.

I’d strongly recommend Natural Family Planning as a pregnancy “spacing” method.. very effective. Maybe she’s not too interested in romance as she’s stressed about having another baby.


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## CatOnAHotTinRoof

Hope4us55123 said:


> I’m new to TAM. Been married 11 years and things are going well, I’m trying to make it better. I believe in continuous improvement in every thing I do. I don’t always achieve it but it’s something I strive for.
> 
> One area I’d like to improve is my sex life. I can’t say it’s non-existent but... ok it’s non-existent. We have sex maybe 1 / month at best. We are both in our early 40s so age and physical inability is not the reason. Part of it is lack of intimacy. Part of it is lack of time. She’s also quite exhausted after taking care of the kids from dawn to dusk. She puts a lot of pressure on herself to make things perfect for them and so that eats up a lot of her energy.
> 
> I don’t know how to start the conversation with her. Frankly we have a pretty easy life and so haven’t had to have many difficult conversations. I know that’s a rather trivial matter for most people on this site who are dealing with much more complex and involved issues. My biggest fear about not starting the discussion is the unknown. Hard to admit that I don’t know what her reaction will be even after 11 years.
> 
> What advise do those that have had a successful, long-term marriage have for someone in my place? Have you ever had difficulty broaching a topic and how did you approach it?
> 
> In the end, I’m sure it’s not even half as bad as I’m imaging it but I just can’t make it over the hump.


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## CatOnAHotTinRoof

Our was almost non-existent until my husband had an emotional affair that woke us up. Something like that doesn’t have to be that drastic to make a change but it is what it is. Looking back it’s super easy to understand how it came about. Our sex life was practically non-existent- always an excuse. Funny enough what seemed excuses about being to tired and kids, suddenly disappeared when a few things happened. 
This is just from my experience:
He always initiated sex but it was HOW he did it. It was only when he wanted it. My engine needs to be warmed up first so taking more time to admire, compliment, hug and gestures of your love outside of the bedroom can go a long way. 
Do the language of love quiz together. That was interesting. What we each thought we were, we weren’t and it really made us talk. 
Our friend whose a marriage counselor recommended - “How to save your marriage before it starts.” It’s a book, then you buy the his and her workbook. This one has learning so much of one another neither of us realized. We love this book and we sometimes have open and honest conversations now because of it. Or we laugh and make small jokes about giving each other more or less points (you’ll know what I mean). Sometimes conversation has been heated but afterwards we always cuddle and let one another know we love each other. 
He helps more around the house and we do more things together. All those things have created us to fall IN love again. We loved each other but our chemistry, along with ten years of just crap, didn’t really make us be in love. Now we have sex about every 2-3 days. We probably have more fun now then 10 years ago and yes, we have three girls. So it can be done with kids. Don’t let her make excuses, that’s what I did. Yes, it’s tough but once real effort is made, you may be surprised with the outcome. Hope it helps.


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## DudeInProgress

You seem like a decent fellow, I hope we can help. 
With what I’ve read here and given your other thread, it seems you’re focusing in on the “be more romantic, plan thoughtful dates etc.” approach.
Note of caution - while ramping up the romance a bit is a good thing, just make sure you don’t overdo it and come off as trying too hard and chasing her too much. That often has the exact opposite effect and can lower your value in her eyes and turn her off to you. 

So sure, be more romantic and give her attention, but one of the best things you can do is to just be more flirty, fun and sexual with her outside of the bedroom. Make sure you’re carrying yourself with confidence and masculinity so she can relax and be feminine. 

Women need to respect you in order to be attracted to you. And women respect strength and leadership in men. 
So if you want to improve your sex life, the most effective thing you can do is make sure you are continually improving yourself. 
Make sure you’re leading in your marriage. Be a strong, attractive man that she can respect and desire. Flirt with her, grab her butt, be fun. Be useful around the house but do not become her servant. No woman wants to have sex with her servant. Don’t do unattractive things like be needy, whiny, overly emotionally reactive, etc.


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## DudeInProgress

Also, you can’t negotiate desire. So don’t try. 
Just tell her clearly and matter-of-factly that you love her and want her and you intend to have a fulfilling intimate sexual marriage. Then act accordingly. Don’t try to negotiate it, don’t argue about it and don’t be upset or angry about where it is now. Just move forward with your expectations of how it’s going to be going forward. And lead.


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## Divinely Favored

Hope4us55123 said:


> I can do that. Do you have any concrete suggestions as to how?


Talk! Communicate about everything. At one tine i was confluct avoidant and would not voice my issues. Sex was 2-3x month more around her period time. I was starting to check out as i was not happy at all. Read NMMNG and MMSLP. I started working out and lost about 50+ pounds in 5.5 weeks. I was thinking if she does not come around i will at least be looking really sharp when i hit the ground running. I was no longer whining about lack of intimacy and quit initiating much. She started to push back as she thought i was already gone. She opened her eyes and we both started making changes. Started truely communicating. If she does something i do not like, i dont hold it in and start building resentment against her. I bring it up and we deal with it. She might be upset, but she at least knows something is wrong. Our marriage is soo much better. 24 yrs and sexually intimate 5x week usually. Rarely a disagreement.


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