# Is it common for her to not push for divorce yet?



## kendonim (Apr 3, 2017)

My wife and I went through a previous separation in 2014; I moved out to an apartment to give us space to heal. We seemed close to divorce then, but we weren't seeing other people and we missed each other so much I came back. I took some courses, read some books, and over the next year evolved into what I believe to be a great husband. By the second half of 2015 I thought we were doing great. We planned a trip to Italy for summer 2016 as a second honeymoon. But around this time of the year last year, she started talking about splitting again. Her mother calmed her down, and we went on the trip as planned and had a fabulous time. The second half of 2016 was honestly like a dream. So many trips & events, spending time together all the time (we watched all of LOST), talking about what we'd do when the kids moved out, etc. Come December, her mom had a heart transplant and was at the hospital for a month. During this time I was very supportive, and visited her mother often. I felt the model husband, and very much part of the family. But my wife says seeing her mother go through that heart transplant convinced her that life was short and she needed a fresh start. In January of this year she got a promotion, so for the first time she has a viable enough salary to be on her own. So you guessed it - I got the "I love you but I'm not in love with you" speech. She refused to touch me. Trying to keep the marriage and family together, we agreed upon an open marriage. At first, things were good. She was getting lots of attention from guys but hadn't met any of them yet, and was taking out all that tension on me. Our sex life was never better than it was in February. But you guessed it ... once she started having physical contact, she withdrew from me completely and moved into the guest room. I told her to cut it all out; she wouldn't. She moved out and got an apartment.

So she's still seeing this guy or guys - and now she hosts at her new place - but yet this past weekend, I went on a date while she watched our daughter, and she got extremely jealous. Is that normal? She refuses to go to counseling. She refuses to stop seeing her man/men. But yet when I asked to get the divorce over with, she came up with all sorts of excuses - work is busy, she was still buying furniture for the place, etc. Is it normal for a woman to separate but not actually push for divorce? Maybe she's just worried about actual financial independence - I've always taken care of the bills?

Thoughts? Comments?


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## Andy1001 (Jun 29, 2016)

The cheek of you to move on with your life,you are supposed to pine for her and when she has enough strange she will probably come back.Seriously buddy you are doing exactly what you should be doing.Have her served,preferably at work and get on with your life.
If you want to try reconciliation then she has to do the heavy lifting,do not be the sap she wants you to be.
You are doing fine,keep it up.


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## kendonim (Apr 3, 2017)

Andy1001 said:


> The cheek of you to move on with your life,you are supposed to pine for her and when she has enough strange she will probably come back.Seriously buddy you are doing exactly what you should be doing.Have her served,preferably at work and get on with your life.
> If you want to try reconciliation then she has to do the heavy lifting,do not be the sap she wants you to be.
> You are doing fine,keep it up.


Thanks Andy!


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## Keke24 (Sep 2, 2016)

Do not fall for the bs OP. Take this from a woman: she'll only respect you less if you respond the way she seems to want you to respond. You've been super nice and accommodating in the past since she first started talking about splitting, which is why she's expecting you to still go along with what she's doing now. 

Pretend you do not give a crap about what she's doing, pretend that you deserve a much more respectable/respectful woman (that should be easy because you don't even need to pretend) and start the process of moving on with your life. She needs to realize that you're not one of the idiots she's been getting attention from since she started advertising herself as a married woman who was open to sex with strangers.

You deserve better. You know this.


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## NoChoice (Feb 12, 2012)

OP,
Plan B. Some do not like performing without a net.


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## kendonim (Apr 3, 2017)

Keke24 said:


> Do not fall for the bs OP. Take this from a woman: she'll only respect you less if you respond the way she seems to want you to respond. You've been super nice and accommodating in the past since she first started talking about splitting, which is why she's expecting you to still go along with what she's doing now.
> 
> Pretend you do not give a crap about what she's doing, pretend that you deserve a much more respectable/respectful woman (that should be easy because you don't even need to pretend) and start the process of moving on with your life. She needs to realize that you're not one of the idiots she's been getting attention from since she started advertising herself as a married woman who was open to sex with strangers.
> 
> You deserve better. You know this.


It's hard to believe that my wife of 14 years just dumped me for these other married guys, but here we are. You're absolutely right; I don't want her continuing to be hitched to my wagon in any form. I just keep thinking I'll wake up and it's all a bad dream.


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## Taxman (Dec 21, 2016)

She is a piece of fecal matter. Isn't that funny, she's getting boned by the new guy and you have a date and she goes ballistic? I would send her a sheaf of divorce papers that will make her head swim. Afterward, I'd be the most vindictive SOB on the planet. You blow up the marriage because "Life's too short" and then get pissed because he is moving on?

Best line from an acquaintance, he looked his soon to be ex straight in the face and said, "I do not want to be divorced, I want to be widowed." His ex stopped acting like a shytte right at that moment. He said it as a joke, but it scared her into thinking straight. She dumped the AP. Stopped being vindictive and straightened up. Six months later she was asking for another try.


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

kendonim said:


> but yet this past weekend, I went on a date while she watched our daughter, and she got extremely jealous. Is that normal? She refuses to go to counseling. She refuses to stop seeing her man/men. But yet when I asked to get the divorce over with, she came up with all sorts of excuses - work is busy, she was still buying furniture for the place, etc. Is it normal for a woman to separate but not actually push for divorce? Maybe she's just worried about actual financial independence - I've always taken care of the bills?
> 
> Thoughts? Comments?


Why are you wasting your time with this drama? Through your whole marriage she has no idea. This will be her life, she is not a good candidate to have a long lasting relationship. Don't feel bad she gave you the best she had. It's just that she doesn't have much.


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## will0810 (Mar 28, 2017)

Thoughts and prayers for you, your children, and for your new divorce lawyer. May his sword swing true.

Just making reasonable assumptions here.


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## GuyInColorado (Dec 26, 2015)

Why aren't you filing for divorce? You are holding on to she picks you in the end? Why would you settle for that? You need to get some confidence. Time to focus on YOU. Gym, eating/drinking healthy 99% of the time. Go see a therapist. It's time to thrive and have fun again.


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## jb02157 (Apr 16, 2014)

Andy1001 said:


> The cheek of you to move on with your life,you are supposed to pine for her and when she has enough strange she will probably come back.Seriously buddy you are doing exactly what you should be doing.Have her served,preferably at work and get on with your life.
> If you want to try reconciliation then she has to do the heavy lifting,do not be the sap she wants you to be.
> You are doing fine,keep it up.


This!

Definitely have her served, she expects you to be fine with seeing other guys but when you want to see others see has a problem...double standard!! Another example of an open marriage not working.


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

Your wife has no love for you whatsoever, and is so entitled and self-centered that she thinks somehow YOU should remain loyal to HER in spite of the way she treats you.
There's no way you should delay divorcing this pathetic excuse for a wife.
Stop worrying about what she thinks, who and what she does; put her in your rear-view like you should have done a long time ago. Stop letting her call all the shots.
Open Marriage?
That's not a marriage at all. 
JMO,
Good luck


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## Vinnydee (Jan 4, 2016)

You my friend, have become her safety net in case it does not work out with her boyfriend. You will remain so until she is certain that her boyfriend will support her and is the right man to marry. Separation is just another way of saying that I want to be able to see my boyfriend without having to lie to you each time. One of the main components of love is to want to stay with your lover as much as possible. Once that is not desirable, the love is gone and love cannot be willed into or out of existence. She is playing you. She wants a boyfriend but does not want you to have one. Some may even call this cuckolding since cuckolding is when the wife has sex with others but the husband does not. Her jealousy is not out of love. Jealousy is made of insecurity and fear of loss. She fears that her safety net will be removed if he falls in love with another girl. Don't be one of those men who grasp as straws to avoid what he knows is the truth.


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## Satya (Jun 22, 2012)

What's stopping you from having her served with divorce papers?

It's not like you have a marriage to salvage. You're living like roommates.... Less than since she has her own place. Agreeing to open the marriage was like giving a giant middle finger to the relationship as a whole. You may as well drop the other shoe.


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## stixx (Mar 20, 2017)

The reason she isn't pushing for divorce has nothing to do with you, it's time to wake up and realize this cold hard fact. She's not coming back, well not to you.

She comes home to her comfortable home, her established lifestyle, she doesn't want the inconvenience, the stigma, the sharing of children (if you have any) that happens with divorce. If she's making more than you are, perhaps she's worried about having to pay you support. 

It's understandable, she gets to do whatever she wants with whomever she wants, without giving up the creature comforts established during the marriage; but this is probably not how you want to be living your life. 

She's living a fantasy just like you are. Yours is that this is all a bad dream and she'll suddenly drop all of her external affairs and come running into your arms and you'll live happily ever after, she sounds like the type that won't leave until her affair partner agrees to share their lives together- but that usually doesn't happen even if that's her particular fantasy.

If a decision is going to be made any time soon it needs to come from you.


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## kendonim (Apr 3, 2017)

I really needed to hear all of this. Honestly I haven't gotten a lawyer yet because it all happened so damn fast. Tomorrow friends I will make the call!

The part I'm really struggling with is all the love and affection she gave me during the good times, does what's happening now taint those memories? Are women sometimes this fickle?


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## Primrose (Mar 4, 2015)

kendonim said:


> It's hard to believe that *my wife of 14 years just dumped me for these other married guys*, but here we are. You're absolutely right; I don't want her continuing to be hitched to my wagon in any form. I just keep thinking I'll wake up and it's all a bad dream.


She's dating married men? 



kendonim said:


> The part I'm really struggling with is all the love and affection she gave me during the good times, does what's happening now taint those memories? Are women sometimes this fickle?


She was giving you love and affection because she wasn't getting it from other men. Once she did, she slung you to the back burner without a second thought to your well-being. That speaks volumes to her character (and the fact that she is hooking up with other married men). The other men's wives deserve to know!

Kick her to the curb. Refuse to be her Plan B. You are no one's back up plan.


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## Satya (Jun 22, 2012)

kendonim said:


> The part I'm really struggling with is all the love and affection she gave me during the good times, does what's happening now taint those memories? Are women sometimes this fickle?


Don't confuse love with getting ones "rocks off." 

Yes, women can do this, too.

Can you give some concrete examples of how she made you feel loved, that doesn't have anything to do with sex and intimacy?


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## Marc878 (Aug 26, 2015)

It's called cake eating. You are a babysitter, safety net, Plan B, enabler. 

youve done nothing but talk so you are where you are. 

You apparently gave her an open marriage to try and pacify and nice her back.

In order for you to have a life you have to fix yourself and end this if you want one.

It's totally up to you. No one else is going to do it for you.


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## Bibi1031 (Sep 14, 2015)

You need to implement the 180 and detach. You need to see a lawyer and get advised on how and when to end this sham of a marriage.

You need to go out and date too. Just so that you don't get depressed. She doesn't want her security blanket to belong to someone else. She is like a child that won't play with her old toy, but doesn't want anyone else to play with it either. 

You are NOT a security blanket nor her toy!

Entitled, nasty piece of woman, and a sad excuse for a wife too.


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## Marc878 (Aug 26, 2015)

IMO id have her served without warning and do a hard 180 or you'll just wallow in limbo for a few more years.


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## Bibi1031 (Sep 14, 2015)

*Re: Is it common for her to not push for divorce yet?*

Of course it is! Classic cake eater mentality. Classic cheater speak and behavior. This does NOT mean she loves you and will eventually love and respect you. It's quite the contrary. So get out of her spiraling down ways, or you are in for more hurt and loss of precious time.


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

kendonim said:


> I really needed to hear all of this. Honestly I haven't gotten a lawyer yet because it all happened so damn fast. Tomorrow friends I will make the call!
> 
> The part I'm really struggling with is all the love and affection she gave me during the good times, does what's happening now taint those memories? Are women sometimes this fickle?


No, they are oftentimes this fickle.
And once they see they have a man pining for them, they'll treat a mangy dog better than they will you.get out now. Really. Screw the pain. Yeah it's gonna hurt. DO IT. Once you've I accept she's gone, you can heal and fall in love with another woman. Trade up.


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## Betrayedone (Jan 1, 2014)

This situation is like a band-aid, dude......best if ripped off quickly to hasten the healing process. The other part of the equation is to have and develop self respect. The sun shines brightly on the other side.....it is waiting your arrival!


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## kendonim (Apr 3, 2017)

Hi all,

A few updates:
1) I have some closure now about how the good times seemed so good yet here we are. I believe she suffers from depression, and has highs & lows. Her mother's heart transplant triggered her low.
2) She gave me a little more detail about who she is seeing. One married guy and one very unmarried guy. The unmarried guy works on the same street she does. He apparently, "makes her laugh".
3) She claims she is breaking off with both of them and just wants to be alone. Apparently the unmarried guy is very upset.
4) I met with a lawyer. Divorce would be absolute financial ruin for me. It turns out my best option, financially, is just to stay separated. She hasn't indicated that she will push for divorce any time soon.
5) We're getting along civilly.


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

She is lying about 3.

But it doesn't matter; you aren't going anywhere.


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

Ask the lawyer if financial ruin is better or worse in 4 years if you divorce later. Your thinking will only make it worse in the end. Remember, you don't have the best track record for decision making. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## stixx (Mar 20, 2017)

People don't get divorced because it's good for finances. 

You might lose a ton of money, you might be broke or in the negative, but you'll make it back over time.

That's the cost of freedom and happiness. If you can't have that, what's the point of life?


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

kendonim said:


> Are women sometimes this fickle?


After reading these thread the answer is emphatically yes. Some men too. It's in these people's nature. They "love" they show you seems to be more about the emotions and less about true love which is much deeper then, love songs and poems.

You are making a bad decision. Eventually she will meet a guy she wants to be with and she will ruin you financially and you will have no control over the fallout. Or you will meet someone and have no options, or worse she wouldn't want to be with a guy stuck in limbo.


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## kendonim (Apr 3, 2017)

WorkingOnMe said:


> Ask the lawyer if financial ruin is better or worse in 4 years if you divorce later. Your thinking will only make it worse in the end. Remember, you don't have the best track record for decision making.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I did. Right now, assuming she insists on a 50/50 split, I lose the marital home, and with $2000 a month additionally going to her in child support, I might have to move in with my parents. The child support may not end for another 12 years. I discovered why the child support equation sucks so bad. It is calculated with before-tax numbers, not actual take-home pay. Also, I received some stock options the past few years that I cashed in recently, inflating my salary far beyond what it actually is. If I wait a few years, those cash-ins won't be held against me and the child support figure will be much lower.


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## stixx (Mar 20, 2017)

Given those numbers it may make sense to wait, during which time perhaps you can make some changes in your finances so you get a more favorable settlement. Some people make "gifts" to trusted family members.. you know a few thousand here, a few thousand there. Cash in a few investment accounts. If anyone asks, you went on a gambling spree and lost it all. The "lookback" period during a divorce is usually about 3 years, longer than that no one will ask you where the money went, it won't be subject to equitable distribution. 

Meanwhile, you just need to disconnect. Go live your own life. She's just a roommate/business partner, nothing more. 

One problem is you're still responsible for any of her debts obtained during the marriage. So don't pay it off, hopefully she'll be limited by her available credit.

The other problem is the longer you're married, the more you may have to pay in spousal support in terms of amount and duration. Might want to check your state laws on how that works.


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## JohnA (Jun 24, 2015)

What is the custody split? What is the current custody? Your in the home your daughter home, how much time does she get to spend in her (meaning your daughter) home? Or is the apartment now her home. 

So separated with a do not tell, do not ask for both of you? 

A civil and polite 180 with discussions limited to your daughter and joint finances is needed. Also work on keeping your finances separated.


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## kendonim (Apr 3, 2017)

stixx said:


> Given those numbers it may make sense to wait, during which time perhaps you can make some changes in your finances so you get a more favorable settlement.


Oh yeah, forgot the other piece. She only went back into the work force a year and a half ago. Her salary is still on the climb. Mine has stabilized. Every year she's going to gain on me, making the child support distribution more equitable.



stixx said:


> One problem is you're still responsible for any of her debts obtained during the marriage. So don't pay it off, hopefully she'll be limited by her available credit.


All of those are long paid off. My only debt is my mortgage.



stixx said:


> The other problem is the longer you're married, the more you may have to pay in spousal support in terms of amount and duration. Might want to check your state laws on how that works.


Yes the lawyer went over that with me. My daughter is young enough that child support is the only issue I need to be concerned about for many years to come. She is in 4th grade. If she doesn't go to college, that's 8 years of child support. Community college, 10 years. 4 year school, 12 years, which is the max because you can stop paying when the child reaches 23 anyway. If we divorce in 12 years, I may have to pay 5-10 years of alimony instead. However, like I said her salary may be much higher at that point, plus I can argue to the judge that she's been living apart from me for 12 years and is used to her standard of living from her own salary.

The math to decide to divorce now would be the expectation of huge earnings up ahead that I don't want to split with her. But since my child support would be $24k a year of after-tax dollars ... I doubt it. I'll review the numbers anyway, maybe I don't need to move in with my parents.


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## Marc878 (Aug 26, 2015)

Look like you've made enough excuse to justify staying in this. 

Better get s good supply of condoms so do you don't catch anything off your wayward wife. If she'll let you have sex with her.


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## kendonim (Apr 3, 2017)

JohnA said:


> What is the custody split? What is the current custody? Your in the home your daughter home, how much time does she get to spend in her (meaning your daughter) home? Or is the apartment now her home.


Right now it's 50/50. If I can convince my wife to have custody 5 days a week, the child support goes down dramatically.



JohnA said:


> So separated with a do not tell, do not ask for both of you?


On her side. She's been quite curious so far about my dates. And my ideal is to have a new woman move into the house.



JohnA said:


> A civil and polite 180 with discussions limited to your daughter and joint finances is needed. Also work on keeping your finances separated.


We still have joint credit cards, but we're communicating very well about upcoming purchases. Otherwise the money (& cars) are all in my name.

I think I'm doing the 180 pretty well so far. If she's not lying, she's actually broken off contact with her cadre of men, which is a start. It gave me real chuckles to see her get so jealous when I started dating again. Also, her "inner storyboard" is feeding her all this stuff about how she wasn't happy in the marriage, and tainting all the good memories. Yet I'm being my usual jocular self with her, keeping things tension free, and basically making it harder and harder to tell herself that she didn't enjoy spending time with me. I mean, she called me at 6:53 AM today, ostensibly to ask about our daughter, but she's starting to find excuses to call all the time now. I never ask about our future, I never indicate I'm going to stop going on dates, she sees I'm losing weight. We'll see where this all goes.


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## kendonim (Apr 3, 2017)

Marc878 said:


> Look like you've made enough excuse to justify staying in this.


Right now it's really more about taking every day as it comes, and not planning ahead too far.



Marc878 said:


> Better get s good supply of confoms do you don't catch anything off your wayward wife. If she'll let you have sex with her.


I will certainly not push for that. I'm curious if at some point she'll try something. I need to be strong. No reconciliation without counseling! And a massive apology. And ... gosh, I don't know how you really repair this. But I do look back on the good times fondly.


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## stixx (Mar 20, 2017)

Marc878 said:


> Look like you've made enough excuse to justify staying in this.


Doesn't sound like excuses to me, sounds like he's done his homework.


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## C3156 (Jun 13, 2012)

$2K a month in CS? There must be a huge disparity in income if you all are planning 50/50. I would highly recommend checking with another attorney to get a second or even third opinion. Research also suggests that Mass still has at-fault divorce that could be used to ease your financial situation with regards to divorce.

I'm sorry, I not sure how you find it okay that your wife is banging other men. If she is that unhappy in your marriage, let her go find her happiness...without you.

It sounds as though you have made up your mind to stay in this weird relationship, so I'm not going to waste a bunch of words. I can only imagine what you tell your daughter about what is going on. Just remember, kids learn by watching what their parents do. What are you teaching your daughter about a healthy relationship?


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## phillybeffandswiss (Jan 20, 2013)

Yes, I'd take another consult. You lived in Limbo once, why do it again?


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## kendonim (Apr 3, 2017)

phillybeffandswiss said:


> Yes, I'd take another consult. You lived in Limbo once, why do it again?


She's gone, she's not coming back. I get that. So from that sense, it isn't limbo. I'm moving on with my life and actively dating to find the new love of my life. I just need to plan this just right to not get financially crushed. I admit one thing occurring to me is that if I push for divorce, she is more likely to push for every last penny than if she starts the proceedings. Especially when it comes to not wanting her kids to lose the family home. 

It's only been a month. When dealing with an issue of this magnitude, I need to take my time and get it right. An unknown factor, of course, is losing out on the new love of my life because she won't date a separated guy. I'm keenly aware of that problem.

Mass has at-fault divorce but it doesn't affect the financial split. Yes I make 4x as much as her right now on years with stock grants.


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## stixx (Mar 20, 2017)

kendonim said:


> I admit one thing occurring to me is that if I push for divorce, she is more likely to push for every last penny than if she starts the proceedings.


Even if she starts the divorce it will be the same. Once she gets in front of an attorney and hears about how much money she can get from you, and the attorney plays to her fears about how she won't have enough money for her and the kids to live on unless she goes after you for every dime, she certainly will.



kendonim said:


> An unknown factor, of course, is losing out on the new love of my life because she won't date a separated guy. I'm keenly aware of that problem.


It's not an unknown factor. A quality woman won't get involved with a guy who is living with his wife. You aren't separated if you're living together no matter how you try to rationalize it. You're married, living together, with no plans to divorce, if "only for financial reasons".


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## kendonim (Apr 3, 2017)

stixx said:


> Even if she starts the divorce it will be the same. Once she gets in front of an attorney and hears about how much money she can get from you, and the attorney plays to her fears about how she won't have enough money for her and the kids to live on unless she goes after you for every dime, she certainly will.


gulp.



stixx said:


> It's not an unknown factor. A quality woman won't get involved with a guy who is living with his wife. You aren't separated if you're living together no matter how you try to rationalize it. You're married, living together, with no plans to divorce, if "only for financial reasons".


She has her own apartment. But I see your point. Honestly what I need to do is:
(1) Figure out how to get custody of our daughter Sunday evening through Friday evening - all school nights. If I have custody 2/3 of the time, the child support goes way down.
(2) Figure out a way to deal with her share of the equity in the house. Perhaps she would be amenable to avoiding selling/refinancing it until such a time as the children no longer need it.


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## stixx (Mar 20, 2017)

kendonim said:


> She has her own apartment.


Oh, well that certainly helps, but still you're going to need to find a quality woman that is ok with you staying married for the indefinite future even if you're physically separated.

Difficult but not impossible.

Especially if you've got something to offer, starting with a great personality and a reasonable amount of discretionary income.


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## honcho (Oct 5, 2013)

WS are notorious for not filing or working to get divorce final. They want to keep all options open. 

Have the two of you actually sat down and discussed the nuts and bolts of a divorce at all? In general terms your best off divorcing while she is having fun in affairland. They are more concerned about having fun and being "happy" than the real world. After a few months and she blows thru a few guys and she starts feeling broke financially your going to be in for a much tougher situation. 

Divorce sucks financially speaking, the longer it looms the worse the financial doom becomes. She can lose her job, you could lose yours. She may never advance in her current career, yours could take off. 

A buddy of mine did the let's just stay separated game, 3 years later the spouse drunk has a car accident and kills someone. The spouse having too much fun being "happy" and independent didn't pay insurance. Guess who got financially ruined because they are still married. 

You also now have the luxury of time to rebuild what you may lose in a divorce. It's much harder to rebuild retirement accounts etc when your older. The wait game rarely works and for all the planning and scheming she can just file one day and screw it all up. It could be next month, 6 months or 2 years from now. 

Have the hard conversation with her and see what she wants instead of the guessing game. It's a new world for her right now, in a few months when she realizes it's not nearly as great as she thought she's gonna want more.


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## stixx (Mar 20, 2017)

honcho said:


> After a few months and she blows a few guys and she starts feeling broke financially your going to be in for a much tougher situation.


There fixed that for you. 

All good points in @honcho's post above that need to be weighed against postponing divorce that you may not have considered.


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## kendonim (Apr 3, 2017)

stixx said:


> There fixed that for you.
> 
> All good points in @honcho's post above that need to be weighed against postponing divorce that you may not have considered.


Thanks. Wow, where were you all to give me advice _before_ I got married, eh? :wink2:

I'm seriously wondering if I'll ever legally tie the knot again.


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## phillybeffandswiss (Jan 20, 2013)

You are in limbo when you are waiting or pondering the next move. You will be in limbo if you wait a couple of years and something changes. I'm not saying you want her back, I'm talking about wondering and stressing over the next few years of happiness or financial ruin.

Pretty much Honcho's post sums up anything else I would have clarified.


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## stixx (Mar 20, 2017)

kendonim said:


> Thanks. Wow, where were you all to give me advice _before_ I got married, eh? :wink2.


You wouldn't have listened, no one does.


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

Consult another attorney, ASAP. She works full time? She should not be entitled to ANY alimony. Why do YOU have to lose the house? You should be able to sell it then split the equity. CS should be based on your current, verifiable salary. You have no other debt besides your mortgage? Then this should not ruin you! This attorney you consulted SUCKS. Try another one!


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## Bibi1031 (Sep 14, 2015)

Don't leave your divorce in the hands of this woman! Don't leave your future with a great, loyal partner in the hands of this woman!

You can recover financially, you can't recover lost time and an opportunity of a much better partner on this woman! 

You can't afford that mistake, so don't pay for it with tons of regret for not cutting the cord sooner!


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## kendonim (Apr 3, 2017)

3Xnocharm said:


> Consult another attorney, ASAP. She works full time? She should not be entitled to ANY alimony.


It's child support, not alimony, but the calculation is the same.



3Xnocharm said:


> Why do YOU have to lose the house? You should be able to sell it then split the equity.


That's what I meant by losing the house. I will approach her about a deal to keep the house as long as the kids need it though.



3Xnocharm said:


> CS should be based on your current, verifiable salary.


If it is done upon my BASE salary it won't be as bad. My cashing in options the past few years should not have to hurt me, I totally agree, and my receiving a bonus is not a given.



3Xnocharm said:


> You have no other debt besides your mortgage? Then this should not ruin you!


Depends on your definition of ruin I guess. I was on track to retiring in my mid 50s. Sigh.


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## kendonim (Apr 3, 2017)

Ok so legal status aside, she still calls and talks on the phone with me a lot. She's really hoping she gets along with my next wife too. This is a weird, weird breakup because at this point we are very friendly with one another. She still calls and tells me about her day, stuff like that.


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

Why do you answer?


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## kendonim (Apr 3, 2017)

farsidejunky said:


> Why do you answer?


Fair question. It's not in my nature to stay angry with anyone. I can't keep up a wall artificially. I'm a loving person and I don't want to change into a bitter one. Also, my mantra is "You are where you are, you can't go back," so I make the best of the situation I'm in, which in this case still involves a lot of child hand-offs and occasional dinners for the 4 of us.


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

I disagree with the premise of your statement that continuing to listen to her means that you're not angry, or that conversely refusing to listen to her means that you are angry.

"This is the type of conversation that is for intimate partners. I'm not okay with talking this way."

You say this in a calm but firm tone of voice. No anger; all business like.

You are allowing her to use you to meet your emotional needs. Think for just a moment about the type of signal this sends.


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

kendonim said:


> Fair question. It's not in my nature to stay angry with anyone. I can't keep up a wall artificially. I'm a loving person and I don't want to change into a bitter one. Also, my mantra is "You are where you are, you can't go back," so I make the best of the situation I'm in, which in this case still involves a lot of child hand-offs and occasional dinners for the 4 of us.


This is not in your best interest. You need to detach. Only talk with her regarding the children, and STOP spending time with her. You doing this is not going to allow you to move on, and will eventually blow up in your face.


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## honcho (Oct 5, 2013)

kendonim said:


> Fair question. It's not in my nature to stay angry with anyone. I can't keep up a wall artificially. I'm a loving person and I don't want to change into a bitter one. Also, my mantra is "You are where you are, you can't go back," so I make the best of the situation I'm in, which in this case still involves a lot of child hand-offs and occasional dinners for the 4 of us.


It's not about being angry or bitter. It's about you moving on from her. Right now she is using you as an emotional crutch and eventually she will eventually do less and less of but it keeps you attached to her and only delays your healing. 

Being civil and cordial and a good co-parent doesn't mean your going to be or have to be buddies with her.


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

You are definitely causing yourself pain by conversing with your wife.
I'm just giving my ditto for what others have wisely told you. 
Nothing but kids and then nothing.
Talk to her only if you are required to for parenting. Nothing.
Zero would be best.

The best place to put your wife is behind you. Only then will you accept she is gone and heal properly.


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

kendonim said:


> Ok so legal status aside, she still calls and talks on the phone with me a lot. *She's really hoping she gets along with my next wife too*. This is a weird, weird breakup because at this point we are very friendly with one another. She still calls and tells me about her day, stuff like that.


She does this for a couple of reasons.

1) She still feels some guilt. She knows she and infertile dirt became one.

2) Many waywards want you to like them. They do not want you to remind others of their cheating. Their ranking in Marital 101. They flunked the course.

3) She wants to meet, greet the new women? Like "NO WAY" Jose. She will poison this new women with lies. She wants to open the womens chest and remove the fuse that connects to the bomb that this new women will likely launch at her. 

4) She is a manipulator, Par Excellence. Like a Puppet Master, she wants you and everyone around her to be march to her tune. She pulls the string....you salute.

Tonight, in your bathroom.....*.rearrange the strings*. 
When she pulls the strings that are connected to your heart strings and your saluting hand. She will get the BIRD and THE BOOT! The size-12 Boot.


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## Rick Blaine (Mar 27, 2017)

I recommend that you not enable your wayward wife. She is cake-eating and trying to set up a fantasy with an "amicable" separation. Even if you are a loving person, does that mean you should suffer the slings and arrows of her infidelity? No one should have to endure that kind of abuse. Your inaction allows your wayward wife to coast unscathed in her bad decisions and extremely harmful behavior. If I were you I would be seeking full custody of the child in light of the lifestyle she is choosing. Moreover, you have a responsibility to your personal dignity and well being to stop this abuse by ending the marriage. Stalling the divorce only hurts you as you risk losing months or even years of your life to quiet desperation. So sad is it to see betrayed spouses waffle and wallow in the filthy pit of their wayward spouse's adultery. Your mental well being is on life support. Why not seek to thrive? Life is too short. 

While she is still in the fog and not concerned with property matters as much as getting her thrills, I would set up a meeting and negotiate a divorce on your own without attorneys. Your court house will probably have a do it yourself divorce process you can take part in. You can always have an attorney review your documents and if she lawyers up, you can too. But if she agrees to do this without lawyers and without a trial, you might be able to get out of this with minimal financial damage. I took this route and it worked out very well. But my wayward wife was cooperative and we split everything 50/50. No alimony, and we use a spreadsheet to divide the child expenses so no child support either. 

Now that the divorce is final, I NEVER speak with her. I have gone dark, and it has saved me a world of hurt and anger. I've cut the cord clean and I am on my way to a much better place. It's a process, but the only way you can get through hell is to keep going. 

Finally, though I recommend divorce, I don't like it. Marriage is for life, and couples should work out their differences and take the actions required to have a happy marriage. But when one bails out and isn't willing to take steps for the recovery of the marriage, then the other spouse must take action and not become a victim of abuse.


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## ReturntoZero (Aug 31, 2015)

kendonim said:


> Thanks. Wow, where were you all to give me advice _before_ I got married, eh? :wink2:
> 
> I'm seriously wondering if I'll ever legally tie the knot again.


I would never do it again.

Never


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## ReturntoZero (Aug 31, 2015)

Rick Blaine said:


> I recommend that you not enable your wayward wife. She is cake-eating and trying to set up a fantasy with an "amicable" separation. Even if you are a loving person, does that mean you should suffer the slings and arrows of her infidelity? No one should have to endure that kind of abuse. Your inaction allows your wayward wife to coast unscathed in her bad decisions and extremely harmful behavior. If I were you I would be seeking full custody of the child in light of the lifestyle she is choosing. Moreover, you have a responsibility to your personal dignity and well being to stop this abuse by ending the marriage. Stalling the divorce only hurts you as you risk losing months or even years of your life to quiet desperation. So sad is it to see betrayed spouses waffle and wallow in the filthy pit of their wayward spouse's adultery. Your mental well being is on life support. Why not seek to thrive? Life is too short.
> 
> While she is still in the fog and not concerned with property matters as much as getting her thrills, I would set up a meeting and negotiate a divorce on your own without attorneys. Your court house will probably have a do it yourself divorce process you can take part in. You can always have an attorney review your documents and if she lawyers up, you can too. But if she agrees to do this without lawyers and without a trial, you might be able to get out of this with minimal financial damage. I took this route and it worked out very well. But my wayward wife was cooperative and we split everything 50/50. No alimony, and we use a spreadsheet to divide the child expenses so no child support either.
> 
> ...


In a word, this is brilliant advice.

And, it wouldn't hurt for you to pretend to be buddies if this is your plan.

The day she signs, you turn on the ice machine.

"Hey, let's go celebrate the divorce! I'm so glad we're such great friends through this!"

"Me too..., but no thanks, I have plans"


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## kendonim (Apr 3, 2017)

Update: After I went on a date on Tuesday, she completely freaked out, and started talking reconciliation. I told her if she sets up a couples therapy appointment for us, I will attend and in good faith, suspend dating others during the duration. My therapist also told me it would be good to be completely over this relationship before I start another, and I admit a big part of the thrill of starting to date again was to not feel the pain of my marriage ending. Come Thursday morning, I asked about the therapy appointment, and she was in one of her dark moods and said, "Oh, we're talking about that now? I suppose we should go, just to get closure." So yeah, she's either manic depressive or bipolar, but either way she's in a dark place. It's a holiday week, so next week is the big week. We either go into therapy or we hammer out the Separation Agreement.



Rick Blaine said:


> While she is still in the fog and not concerned with property matters as much as getting her thrills, I would set up a meeting and negotiate a divorce on your own without attorneys. Your court house will probably have a do it yourself divorce process you can take part in. You can always have an attorney review your documents and if she lawyers up, you can too. But if she agrees to do this without lawyers and without a trial, you might be able to get out of this with minimal financial damage. I took this route and it worked out very well. But my wayward wife was cooperative and we split everything 50/50. No alimony, and we use a spreadsheet to divide the child expenses so no child support either.


That's exactly what I'll do next week with her if she doesn't make the therapy appointment. It probably makes sense to discuss asset division and child support anyway, even with the therapy. I drew up a list of all of our assets, so I'm ready.



Rick Blaine said:


> Now that the divorce is final, I NEVER speak with her. I have gone dark, and it has saved me a world of hurt and anger. I've cut the cord clean and I am on my way to a much better place. It's a process, but the only way you can get through hell is to keep going.


I don't think I need to do that. I'm not in a world of hurt and anger. Disappointed, for sure, but the way I see it, she just couldn't fight her depression and mood swings forever. The infidelity was her way of admitting defeat. She really did break up with all the men she'd been seeing, and intends to be alone for a while. She just has to get over seeing me move on.


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## kendonim (Apr 3, 2017)

I think the other thing is that I have a lot of happy memories from this 14 year marriage, and if I cut her off completely, I'll have no one to share those memories with except the ones the kids remember. By keeping her as a friend, I can still cherish the good times. I think


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## honcho (Oct 5, 2013)

kendonim said:


> I think the other thing is that I have a lot of happy memories from this 14 year marriage, and if I cut her off completely, I'll have no one to share those memories with except the ones the kids remember. By keeping her as a friend, I can still cherish the good times. I think


Your kidding right? She isn't your friend and the more you view her and try to keep her as a friend the more she will take advantage of you right now. The more nice you act the less respect she will have for you. This isn't to say be mean, angry or bitter. 

She only agreed to therapy to reel you back in, she doesn't want you to detach. She isn't genuine about the therapy and even if you get her to eventually go she will probably go for a few times, find issues and problems with the therapist, say it isn't working and quit going. 

Your excusing her behavior under depression/mental issues yet she isn't seeking any help for those and apparently unwilling to even acknowledge they may be a problem for her. She won't have some magic awakening. Your playing her game and your not going to win.


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## kendonim (Apr 3, 2017)

honcho said:


> Your kidding right? She isn't your friend and the more you view her and try to keep her as a friend the more she will take advantage of you right now. The more nice you act the less respect she will have for you. This isn't to say be mean, angry or bitter.
> 
> She only agreed to therapy to reel you back in, she doesn't want you to detach. She isn't genuine about the therapy and even if you get her to eventually go she will probably go for a few times, find issues and problems with the therapist, say it isn't working and quit going.
> 
> Your excusing her behavior under depression/mental issues yet she isn't seeking any help for those and apparently unwilling to even acknowledge they may be a problem for her. She won't have some magic awakening. Your playing her game and your not going to win.


Hey you're totally right; what I really meant was 'keep things friendly', not have her as an actual friend. I'm not going to schedule outings with her, but we see each other a lot due to kid handoffs and spending time with our autistic son is easiest done together. But as for her going to therapy, you are 100% right, if she does go at all, it will only be for a few sessions. I'm really looking forward to getting divorced now. I told her tomorrow we are going to start preliminary work on the separation agreement.


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

What bothers me is:
You've decided to stop dating--- you shouldn't.

You think your memories won't be poisoned--- they will be. You'll see.

You are actually considering going to therapy--- you don't need it, and she doesn't want it.

If she straightens up for a few weeks, you'd take her back.

I've been through this. No contact other than kids is best. The fact that you haves an autistic child is going to make getting over her far more difficult.

My suggestion: keep dating.


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## kendonim (Apr 3, 2017)

Evinrude58 said:


> What bothers me is:
> You've decided to stop dating--- you shouldn't.
> 
> You think your memories won't be poisoned--- they will be. You'll see.
> ...


Yeah that's bothering me too. It's also true though that a lot of the women on dating sites that I'd hoped would write back didn't, and I think it is because my status is Separated and not Divorced. So I'm going to push hard to resolve my situation, rather than content myself with just the women who accept my current status. But you're right, I will resume dating again, since she made it clear that therapy isn't really going to happen or if it does, change anything. I still have a date lined up for Tuesday night


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## kendonim (Apr 3, 2017)

ReturntoZero said:


> I would never do it again.
> 
> Never


I hear ya. The romantic in me thinks I can get it right next time, but the pragmatist sees your point.


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## Bibi1031 (Sep 14, 2015)

kendonim said:


> I think the other thing is that I have a lot of happy memories from this 14 year marriage, and if I cut her off completely, I'll have no one to share those memories with except the ones the kids remember. By keeping her as a friend, I can still cherish the good times. I think


Oh wow, so do you accept demotions at work and say OK because I don't want to lose the good memories of when I earned so much more and was respected in this company?

That probably wouldn't be an option for you. You would start setting up interviews and sending off resumes. 

Why do you accept the crumbs she Offers? Who owns your backbone?


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## Betrayedone (Jan 1, 2014)

kendonim said:


> I think the other thing is that I have a lot of happy memories from this 14 year marriage, and if I cut her off completely, I'll have no one to share those memories with except the ones the kids remember. By keeping her as a friend, I can still cherish the good times. I think


This is really flawed thinking.....You are going to screw yourself good if you don't get your head on straight and get away from this crazy woman.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

kendonim said:


> I think the other thing is that I have a lot of happy memories from this 14 year marriage, and if I cut her off completely, I'll have no one to share those memories with except the ones the kids remember. By keeping her as a friend, I can still cherish the good times. I think


*OK, let's do the math!

Lots of happy memories minus the memories of her deception when she unconscionably cheated on you by sharing with other strange, lacivious men what she had solemnly vowed before God, clergy, you and community to honor only you with!

The emotional sum ought to have greatly surpassed "negative numbers" by this point in time! 

If you have just a single drop of red oxygenated blood left within the hollow confines of your body, you ought to be totally disgusted by just the sheer sight of her by now!*


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## chillymorn69 (Jun 27, 2016)

Pull you head out of your ass wipe the **** out of your eyes and realise its over! This woman is bat **** crazy! Keep pushing for divorce. Or be stuck wrapped in in her bull **** wasting days weeks months years stuck in limbo!

Thats all i got for you!

Good luck


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## phillybeffandswiss (Jan 20, 2013)

What state do live in where you have 2/3 custody and the support goes way down? 



> Figure out how to get custody of our daughter Sunday evening through Friday evening - all school nights. If I have custody 2/3 of the time, the child support goes way down.


 That's primary custody, in my state she'd be paying you. Yes, I had my daughter 2.5 days and my ex had her 4.5, she didn't pay anything.

If she EVER agrees to this, RUN to the court house and get the papers submitted before she changes her mind.


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## kendonim (Apr 3, 2017)

Bibi1031 said:


> Oh wow, so do you accept demotions at work and say OK because I don't want to lose the good memories of when I earned so much more and was respected in this company?
> 
> That probably wouldn't be an option for you. You would start setting up interviews and sending off resumes.
> 
> Why do you accept the crumbs she Offers? Who owns your backbone?


I've really taken this to heart. I keep reciting the phrase 'demoted' in my mind. She's definitely trying to remain close, but as long as she's living in a separate apartment and can't say the L-word ... it's a demotion.


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## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

Betrayedone said:


> This is really flawed thinking.....You are going to screw yourself good if you don't get your head on straight and get away from this crazy woman.


Kendomin, she is keeping you on a hook so you can be her Plan B. Get off that hook and run as fast as your legs can take you.


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## kendonim (Apr 3, 2017)

honcho said:


> Your kidding right? She isn't your friend and the more you view her and try to keep her as a friend the more she will take advantage of you right now. The more nice you act the less respect she will have for you. This isn't to say be mean, angry or bitter.
> 
> She only agreed to therapy to reel you back in, she doesn't want you to detach. She isn't genuine about the therapy and even if you get her to eventually go she will probably go for a few times, find issues and problems with the therapist, say it isn't working and quit going.
> 
> Your excusing her behavior under depression/mental issues yet she isn't seeking any help for those and apparently unwilling to even acknowledge they may be a problem for her. She won't have some magic awakening. Your playing her game and your not going to win.


I'm also re-reading this carefully, this is good insight too. She doesn't want me to detach because otherwise she'd be utterly lonely in this world, but frankly every night she makes a choice to stay separated in her apartment. If she really wanted to patch things up, she'd start apologizing and asking to move back in. Plain and simple. She's definitely NOT interested in therapy and has said many times she hates therapy. And right, while she indeed may suffer from mental issues, there's no point in entertaining reconciliation if she's not seeking help for them.

You guys are toughening me up, which is good! Not in a defiant way, because I can't keep up negative energy for long, but in a sobering, realistic way. Hopefully tonight we can sit down and talk money.


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## kendonim (Apr 3, 2017)

phillybeffandswiss said:


> What state do live in where you have 2/3 custody and the support goes way down?


I'm going to try to convince my wife to simply allow me to take on most of our daughter's expenses (after-care, camp, college, computers) rather than pay formal child support.


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## Bibi1031 (Sep 14, 2015)

kendonim said:


> I'm also re-reading this carefully, this is good insight too. She doesn't want me to detach because otherwise she'd be utterly lonely in this world, but frankly every night she makes a choice to stay separated in her apartment. If she really wanted to patch things up, she'd start apologizing and asking to move back in. Plain and simple. She's definitely NOT interested in therapy and has said many times she hates therapy. And right, while she indeed may suffer from mental issues, there's no point in entertaining reconciliation if she's not seeking help for them.
> 
> You guys are toughening me up, which is good! Not in a defiant way, because I can't keep up negative energy for long, but in a sobering, realistic way. Hopefully tonight we can sit down and talk money.


Whew, now you may be getting somewhere where you won't get royally screwed. It`needs to be all business from here on out with her. The marriage contract needs to end because she broke the vows/clauses of that contract. Get the best possible deal you can get from her now. She is not you friend, that is not what YOU signed up for. You will end what she started amicably because you have a child with her, but that is it.

Stay focused when you talk to her and don't deviate. She is very cunning and will try to reel you back in to string you along. Don't believe words. Actions speak louder than words in these type of situations.


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## kendonim (Apr 3, 2017)

Bibi1031 said:


> She is very cunning and will try to reel you back in to string you along. Don't believe words. Actions speak louder than words in these type of situations.


I will keep repeating to myself, "Actions speak louder than words."


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## ReturntoZero (Aug 31, 2015)

kendonim said:


> I hear ya. The romantic in me thinks I can get it right next time, but the pragmatist sees your point.


I can testify....

The minute you realize the "next one" is going bad, the feeling of helplessness is like no other.

I fought through it and got to the other side.

Talk about a test of wills.

I would wish that on no one.


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## ReturntoZero (Aug 31, 2015)

kendonim said:


> I'm also re-reading this carefully, this is good insight too. She doesn't want me to detach because otherwise she'd be utterly lonely in this world, but frankly every night she makes a choice to stay separated in her apartment. If she really wanted to patch things up, she'd start apologizing and asking to move back in. Plain and simple. She's definitely NOT interested in therapy and has said many times she hates therapy. And right, while she indeed may suffer from mental issues, there's no point in entertaining reconciliation if she's not seeking help for them.
> 
> You guys are toughening me up, which is good! Not in a defiant way, because I can't keep up negative energy for long, but in a sobering, realistic way. Hopefully tonight we can sit down and talk money.


You only defeat the dynamic of the drama triangle as the prosecutor.

In other words, you let HER experience the consequences of her choices.

Let her manage her life.

You may be surprised at her reaction. If you try to put a smile on her face, no enlightenment is possible.


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

kendonim said:


> I've really taken this to heart. I keep reciting the phrase 'demoted' in my mind. She's definitely trying to remain close, but as long as she's living in a separate apartment and can't say the L-word ... it's a demotion.


Dont kid yourself, this is not a demotion, you have been FIRED. Time to start treating it as such.


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## kendonim (Apr 3, 2017)

Hi all, an update.

My wife and I met to discuss splitting the finances. I'd say it went well; she agrees to let me keep assets I came into the marriage with. This means the entire downpayment for the house I keep  She also is being very reasonable about what she needs for the child support payments. 

Is it possible to split the 401k in such a way that her share can go directly into her own 403b account?


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

IF you can successfully negotiate this, you are beyond lucky.
GET OUT>


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## Marc878 (Aug 26, 2015)

Definition of friend = loyal, honest, trustworthy. 

She fired you for two other guys. It wasn't just a demotion. 

If you were fired from your job would you go back and help out just because?????

I doubt she's cut off the others. Cheaters in case you haven't noticed are notorious liars.

Your best bet is once you get this over cut off the unnecessary contact. Other women and there are better ones out there will not stay in a relationship where an X is actively involved. How would you like it?

You're figuring it out. Keep going until you are fully awakened and then your path forward will be much easier.


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

kendonim said:


> Update: After I went on a date on Tuesday, she completely freaked out, and started talking reconciliation. I told her if she sets up a couples therapy appointment for us, I will attend and in good faith, suspend dating others during the duration. My therapist also told me it would be good to be completely over this relationship before I start another, and I admit a big part of the thrill of starting to date again was to not feel the pain of my marriage ending. Come Thursday morning, I asked about the therapy appointment, and she was in one of her dark moods and said, "Oh, we're talking about that now? I suppose we should go, just to get closure." So yeah, she's either manic depressive or bipolar, but either way she's in a dark place. It's a holiday week, so next week is the big week. We either go into therapy or we hammer out the Separation Agreement.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Dude... you are not listening. 

She's a cheater. A lowdown, good for nothing, selfish, lying cheater who has blown up her life and is scrambling to maintain control of you while juggling her boyfriends. 

You are dealing with an self-obsessed, disturbed person. She doesn't have bi-polar disorder. She's not crazy. She s a cheater trying to keep you on the hook while waiting for her married boyfriend to dump his wife and move in with her. That's a hard juggling act for anyone to perform. Those periods when she is nice to you are when she is fighting with her OM. 

She is playing you. Playing you like a cheap fiddle. Get your head out of your butt. 

Lose the house. I'd rather live in a cardboard box under a bridge than live one more day with a woman who has no respect for me.


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

kendonim said:


> Hi all, an update.
> 
> My wife and I met to discuss splitting the finances. I'd say it went well; she agrees to let me keep assets I came into the marriage with. This means the entire downpayment for the house I keep  She also is being very reasonable about what she needs for the child support payments.
> 
> Is it possible to split the 401k in such a way that her share can go directly into her own 403b account?


Quit meeting with her. Why do you do that? Communicate by text only.


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## 225985 (Dec 29, 2015)

.


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## kendonim (Apr 3, 2017)

bandit.45 said:


> Quit meeting with her. Why do you do that? Communicate by text only.


We have 2 kids, one of which is autistic. We are going to continue to be good parents.

I have resumed dating, the biggest obstacle is not my separated spouse but my daughter, who still wants to be able to see me every night, even on the nights she's supposed to be at mom's place. It's hard on her.


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## kendonim (Apr 3, 2017)

Hi all, tomorrow my estranged wife and I meet with a mediator to work on the Separation Agreement. I am starting to think that lawyer I got advised from really wasn't very good after all, because I've been reading up on the internet about child support payments and custodial parent vs. non-custodial parent.

I think I'm the custodial parent. I stayed in the town that my daughter goes to school to and that is paying for my son's residential placement. I stayed in the family home. I have the family insurance plan. My daughter stays over 4 nights a week; the minimum for being able to attend the school system. So ... according to the calculator, she will end up paying ME child support. That actually makes sense; she's the one that just left.

I'll let you all know how tomorrow goes!


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## kendonim (Apr 3, 2017)

Well, our next mediation session will more fully cover child support, but here's the gist.

We did a worksheet and it looks like between our 2 kids we spend $24000 a year. Hard to believe the number is that high, but there it is. It includes all camps, health insurance, all classes/memberships/lessons, afterschool care, clothes, electronics, saving up for our daughter's bat mitzvah, etc. Therefore the most "fair" model would have us each contributing $1000 a month to a joint account to pay for these expenses. So if I end up having to pay her say $1700 a month in child care, then I would imagine it will be her full responsibility to cover every possible child related expense. Because essentially of the $2000 a month needed for expenses, she'd be paying only $300 out of her own pocket.

I'll report back after our next session. I'm so worried!!! Child care, unlike alimony, is not tax deductible.


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## kendonim (Apr 3, 2017)

$329/week, 11.6% of all future bonuses, dividends, and interest, and I still have to contribute 50% towards extracurriculars. Basically I'll be broke for the next 7-11 years unless she gets some pay raises to equal our salaries out better.

Asset division is next.

So she bails on the marriage because she wants new flesh, and gets to do the happy dance with regards to the financial windfall. Divorce sucks.


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## MovingForward (Jan 19, 2017)

kendonim said:


> $329/week, 11.6% of all future bonuses, dividends, and interest, and I still have to contribute 50% towards extracurriculars. Basically I'll be broke for the next 7-11 years unless she gets some pay raises to equal our salaries out better.
> 
> Asset division is next.
> 
> So she bails on the marriage because she wants new flesh, and gets to do the happy dance with regards to the financial windfall. Divorce sucks.


Yes it sure does suck I am paying slightly more than you and my earnings are commission based, based of last years i will have 4 months of the year where I will actually have to use savings(if i have any at the time) to survive. I never wanted the divorce and have 50/50 but still pay healthcare, 75% out of pocket medical expenses, 50% clothes and 50% extra curriculum, my STBXW is basically receiving straight income.


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

Why is she getting a percentage of future bonuses??


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## kendonim (Apr 3, 2017)

3Xnocharm said:


> Why is she getting a percentage of future bonuses??


The lawyer who is mediating said by Massachusetts law ALL income is included in the child support calculation. Even bank interest!


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## kendonim (Apr 3, 2017)

MovingForward said:


> Yes it sure does suck I am paying slightly more than you and my earnings are commission based, based of last years i will have 4 months of the year where I will actually have to use savings(if i have any at the time) to survive. I never wanted the divorce and have 50/50 but still pay healthcare, 75% out of pocket medical expenses, 50% clothes and 50% extra curriculum, my STBXW is basically receiving straight income.


4 months of the year; good Lord! That's really unfair. I haven't done my budget calculations yet; kind of dreading it.


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## MovingForward (Jan 19, 2017)

kendonim said:


> 4 months of the year; good Lord! That's really unfair. I haven't done my budget calculations yet; kind of dreading it.


Yes my commissions swing heavily and are not guaranteed so going to have to start building 2 emergency funds one for CS and Alimony and one for my other finances, worst part for me is commission could go down significantly and could take me months to adjust.


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## kendonim (Apr 3, 2017)

MovingForward said:


> Yes my commissions swing heavily and are not guaranteed so going to have to start building 2 emergency funds one for CS and Alimony and one for my other finances, worst part for me is commission could go down significantly and could take me months to adjust.


I think in an ideal world you'd pay an extremely low weekly rate, but make an annual lump sum payment based on your actual earnings.


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## kendonim (Apr 3, 2017)

Update: I've been texting with a new lady and we match up pretty incredibly. Fingers crossed that when we actually meet, there's real chemistry.


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## ReturntoZero (Aug 31, 2015)

kendonim said:


> $329/week, 11.6% of all future bonuses, dividends, and interest, and I still have to contribute 50% towards extracurriculars. Basically I'll be broke for the next 7-11 years unless she gets some pay raises to equal our salaries out better.
> 
> Asset division is next.
> 
> So she bails on the marriage because she wants new flesh, and gets to do the happy dance with regards to the financial windfall. Divorce sucks.


If I didn't realize how codependence works, I'd never consider getting married again if this one eventually failed.

Because I DO know how codependence works, it's very likely this one won't fail.

There is no substitute for working on yourself.


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## Chuck71 (Nov 5, 2012)

kendonim said:


> Update: I've been texting with a new lady and we match up pretty incredibly. Fingers crossed that when we actually meet, there's real chemistry.


Any updates on the D proceedings? I usually give a very detailed first post on a thread

but I will wait for an update.


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## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

Yes, keen to know what is happening with you K. Hope things are progressing smoothly?


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