# Great relationship, get married, everything falls apart



## cbw83 (Oct 13, 2008)

Hello,

I am posting here, because unfortunately it seems my situation may be fairly unique, at least unique enough that googling around hasn't found anyone with a similar story to mine.

My wife have been married for 2 months, and before then were together for 6 years. We literally have never had a fight that whole time. We got along great together. We are both fairly open minded people and knew whenever we had disagreements it was better to be civil about things. We had lived together for the past 4 years, and everything was going great and so on. We finally decided mutually we should get married, because the time just seemed right. So got engaged a year ago, set the date, and started planning. 

Everything went smoothing, including the wedding and honeymoon.

However, shortly after the honeymoon, about a week after we got back, she was out with some friends, then all of the sudden I get a call at 6am of her completely sobbing, so much so she could barely talk enough just to tell me where she is. I go pick her up, and she is just too shaken to even talk. I get her home, and details finally start creeping out, like she had called her mom and she was flying to be here in the afternoon. Then finally, she admitted that she wasn't sure she wanted to be married to me anymore. She said it had nothing to do with me, just that she felt she was too young, and haven't been to live on her own to see what independent life was like.

We talked through things, and recently she has found some nice friends, before, most of her friends were not the greatest, so she was finally going out more and enjoying herself, and she said it made her realize that she had a big hole in her from not being able to just live on her own and do what she wants. I tried to convince her that she could still be her own person and we could still be married, I would put no pressure on her, and let her live as she pleased. That seemed to hold her over for a bit, but then a few days later, the sadness came back.

She went to a psychiatrist who gave her some depression/anxiety medicine an recommended a therapist. Shortly after, she said she didn't want to sleep in the same bed anymore, and didn't want to do anything outside of the house with me. She said it would the only way she could try to experience independence. 

So for the past 4 weeks, she has been going out almost every night with friends until 2-4am, avoiding me as much as possible. She started to see a therapist too, who seemed to agree with her on what she needs to do. 

All of this is just a huge shock to me. It literally went from everything was great, to one night, everything just fell apart. I am nice guy, never been mean, always try to help her and support her in all her activities that she pursues. 

So here I am now 4 weeks into this. I didn't really complain much throughout the 4 weeks, I was just trying to let her be, but it seems to be come apparent that this just isn't the way live. 

I told her I was thinking about moving out, because it was just too hard to be around someone who is trying to always avoid you all the time. She basically just keeps sending mixed signals. She things like she does love me, and that she thinks I am the person she wants to be with for the rest of her life, but she just wishes she could of had a year on her own before getting married.

So anyways, after some back and forth like that, I have finally given her the choice. She can choose for me to stay with her, and we work together to find her peace in every way possible. I only ask that she sleeps in the same bed as me, and would go out with me one night a week. Or I move out, say good bye and good luck to her, and of course be there for her in emergencies, but besides that make no promises about the future and coming back to her.

I gave her a couple of days to think about, and the decision will be coming soon. I honestly have no idea what it will be.

My question is, has anyone had a situation like this? Everything totally being great, our families get along, no drama at all to speak of for 6 years, then getting married, and everything falls apart?

I've found a few things on post marital depression, but it just doesn't seem to be what she has, it seems to be something else, I am not sure.

Anyways, anyone dealt with anything like this before, and/or does anyone have advice?

Thanks for listening.


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## draconis (Oct 3, 2007)

Why do you think so many people cop out right before marriage. She is right she had not lived on her own but chances are that her friends showed her a different world that made her special. She may have been flirted with or just had fun without worry about you. The point is if you are going to get back together you will need to really learn to communicate with each other. Listen to her. 

draconis


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## Blanca (Jul 25, 2008)

The only thing i can think is she's been thinking about this for a long time and something has triggered the feeling. maybe her actually making the decision to commit caused her to feel a sudden loss of her freedom.

which then leads me to think, what is she doing that she feels she cant be married while she's doing it??

I'll be real honest with you, I think she has a guilty conscience.


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## cbw83 (Oct 13, 2008)

draconis said:


> The point is if you are going to get back together you will need to really learn to communicate with each other. Listen to her.
> 
> draconis


We still communicate very much. I listen to her as much as she is willing to talk to me, but it seems like she holds back on some things because either she feels guilty to say them, or is just unsure of them. It is a very weird situation. We are still totally on speaking terms still give each other hugs hello and hugs good bye, it is just very hard to explain. It isn't like a fight or anything. It is just like something is gone, and left away without any signs.


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## cbw83 (Oct 13, 2008)

ljtseng said:


> The only thing i can think is she's been thinking about this for a long time and something has triggered the feeling. maybe her actually making the decision to commit caused her to feel a sudden loss of her freedom.
> 
> which then leads me to think, what is she doing that she feels she cant be married while she's doing it??
> 
> I'll be real honest with you, I think she has a guilty conscience.


I think you are right in many ways. She did admit that she has been kind of having the feeling of need of independence for about a year and a half. I told her I wish she would have said something sooner, but she said it didn't really bother her much and she thought it would go away. 

I am not completely sure what triggered it, because our wedding was great, and so was the honeymoon. It seemed the trigger was(as best as we both can guess), was that she was out, and just started thinking about things, and just got scared she had made a mistake and she would live with regret the rest of her life for not living independently.

I agree she has a guilty conscience. But she also has a "I hope I am not being stupid and making the biggest mistake of my life" conscience.

In the end, I have done what I can, and have left the decision in her hands. If she really wants independence, then I think she needs to make a choice with real consequences.


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## Blanca (Jul 25, 2008)

Ya, i think you handled the situation really well. you listened to her, didnt judge her, but also stood up for your own needs. the only problem with ultimatums is if she does agree to stay with you, which she might not, but if she does, its hard to say that she's really agreeing. sometimes what happens is she wont want to lose you, so she'll think she can just push this feeling down (like she already did). then she'll just start hiding things from you. 

Of course i dont know if that's what she will do, and there really isnt anything you can do but take her at her word if she decides to stay. 

when i said she has a guilty conscience, i meant she is hiding something from you. do you think she has done anything while she's out all night long?


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## cbw83 (Oct 13, 2008)

ljtseng said:


> Of course i dont know if that's what she will do, and there really isnt anything you can do but take her at her word if she decides to stay.
> 
> when i said she has a guilty conscience, i meant she is hiding something from you. do you think she has done anything while she's out all night long?


Well if she does decide she wants me to stay and help her, then that is exactly what I am going to do. I have made it clear that I will help her in any way, but she has to be willing to work with me. I don't want to simply be strung along forever, so if she does want me to stay, I will expect progress, even if is slow, I am willing to put in the time as long as she is willing to also do so.

I really don't think she has done anything that would be a marriage breaker or anything. I know her very well, and I would be able to tell something like that. She has been drinking more though, to the point she is coming home and puking a few times. So that is not good. The people she is friends with are good people though, it is just sometimes I think she gets to caught up things.

She definitely knows what is right and what is wrong. But it just seems she won't let herself listen to logic, and that she thinks emotional drives of some kind of freedom are more important. That may not be the best way to word it, but is about as close as I can come.


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## draconis (Oct 3, 2007)

I think you gave her many benefits of the doubt, but whatever triggered her to feel this way should be explained to you. She has been very vague from what I can tell.

You seem like a nice guy. Stay with it and see what happens.

We are here for you.

draconis


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## draconis (Oct 3, 2007)

Have you thought of couples therapy/counciling?

draconis


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## cbw83 (Oct 13, 2008)

draconis said:


> I think you gave her many benefits of the doubt, but whatever triggered her to feel this way should be explained to you. She has been very vague from what I can tell.
> 
> You seem like a nice guy. Stay with it and see what happens.
> 
> ...


Thank you for the kind words. I just try to do what is right. I really want things to work, and as hard as it is for me, I just feel I shouldn't be giving in completely anymore. I feel bad for forcing her to make a choice, just in case there was a chance for us, but now this blows it, but I think overall with the advice of my friends and family it seems like a necessary one. The other hard part is I don't really know if she is in the right state of mind to make a life changing decision like this. She really has few good people in her life that could talk to her straight about things. I mean, even with her counselor, I don't really know what they talk about, but the counselor seems to endorse her current lifestyle. 

My biggest fear is, if she does choose to have me leave, her life will spiral out of control without anyone to keep a good eye on her.

Just so many things to think about, there is really no great solution at this point. I just hope my decision to have her make a choice was as close to the right solution as possible.


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## cbw83 (Oct 13, 2008)

draconis said:


> Have you thought of couples therapy/counciling?
> 
> draconis


I have suggested it. She doesn't seem to be into that idea, at least not at this point. Again, I don't know what goes on between her and her therapist, but it seems my wife thinks it is best that she just have individual counseling for now. She at least has not ruled out couples counseling for the future, if there is a future.

I think either way, once this phase passes, I will want to do couples counseling. I just feel like I am owed at least a few answers, so that I know what is going on, and what we can do to make sure things stay on a correct path. 

But that is thinking to the future too much, right now, just got to get through this somehow.


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## draconis (Oct 3, 2007)

It does seem that she is with holding something from you, either because she doesn't want you to know. Doesn't know how to tell you, or is trying to deal with it all herself. But it seems to be a little more then freedom I would think.

Are her new friends friends of yours?

draconis


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## Blanca (Jul 25, 2008)

cbw83 said:


> Well if she does decide she wants me to stay and help her, then that is exactly what I am going to do. I have made it clear that I will help her in any way, but she has to be willing to work with me. I don't want to simply be strung along forever, so if she does want me to stay, I will expect progress, even if is slow, I am willing to put in the time as long as she is willing to also do so.


i think you have done right by her and yourself so far. I think you have a rough road ahead of you, though. I guess i can be completely blunt with you since its a message board, but she sounds like a mess. If you stay, you will certainly have your work cut out for you. 

Not that im trying to discourage you. i decided to stay and work it out with my H. it has been hard and progress has been slow in coming, but im starting to see the light at the end of the tunnel. 

so, not to dissuade you, but you definitely have a tough road ahead of you. make sure you take care of yourself and your needs. Remember your responsible for your own happiness, and she is responsible for hers.


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## cbw83 (Oct 13, 2008)

draconis said:


> It does seem that she is with holding something from you, either because she doesn't want you to know. Doesn't know how to tell you, or is trying to deal with it all herself. But it seems to be a little more then freedom I would think.
> 
> Are her new friends friends of yours?
> 
> draconis


Well I guess one quick question I have is, her therapist says she doesn't have say anything about the therapy. I wonder if that is normal? I can understand it to a point, but at the same time, if you are having issues, you would think the husband should be involved at least a little to help and/or fix them. It is really hard to get a good read on her and to be quite honest I don't even know of if she is sure what she wants. I mean, she says she loves me, I am a great person, always been there for her, and she does see being with me in the future, but just now needs independence. I am just not sure what kind of independence this is that it can't also work within a relationship. 

I am very, very non-controlling, and always encouraging of her whenever she goes out with friends, or goes and tries new activities or what not. I mean, I am simply a person who would never tell someone else they can't do this or that. The problem is, I have just as much right to point out that when your wife thinks the only way she can progress in her life is too completely ignore you until this "hole or regret" about independence is gone, that is not make sense to me why can't still do some things together at least sometimes. She keeps saying that if were to sleep again, or were to go on a data, she would just fall backwards, and start having panic attacks about the independence issue again.

My probably biggest problem is this. If she really wants to be with me while having independence, then why aren't we working directly forwards that. Why must we completely abandon our relation, have her find independence, then restart the relationship. To me that just doesn't seem to be the way a couple should operate through problems. You can't just turn off and turn on a relationship.

As for the question about her friends. I guess I wouldn't say they are really "my" friends, but I have hung out with them several times, and they have all so far been decent people. I really am not too worried about them, only other than the fact I think sometimes they drink too much. I mean, I have my fair share of beer as well on occasion, but I have just never been the one to see a need to get so drunk you are puking and so on. 

My wife used to hate those type of people, who over drank and had no control. Now, she seems to be becoming one of them.


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## cbw83 (Oct 13, 2008)

ljtseng said:


> i think you have done right by her and yourself so far. I think you have a rough road ahead of you, though. I guess i can be completely blunt with you since its a message board, but she sounds like a mess. If you stay, you will certainly have your work cut out for you.
> 
> Not that im trying to discourage you. i decided to stay and work it out with my H. it has been hard and progress has been slow in coming, but im starting to see the light at the end of the tunnel.
> 
> so, not to dissuade you, but you definitely have a tough road ahead of you. make sure you take care of yourself and your needs. Remember your responsible for your own happiness, and she is responsible for hers.


Yeah, I have realized, it won't be easy at all. But as long as I still feel that both have hope for better days, like we used to live, then it is at least worth a shot. 

I just wonder what could be so great about finding this "independence" that is really worth throwing a huge part of her life away.


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## Blanca (Jul 25, 2008)

cbw83 said:


> Well I guess one quick question I have is, her therapist says she doesn't have say anything about the therapy. I wonder if that is normal? I can understand it to a point, but at the same time, if you are having issues, you would think the husband should be involved at least a little to help and/or fix them.


Ya, that is normal actually. Since its individual counseling the focus is on her. 

If she wanted you involved she'd go to couples counseling. I think she's making it very clear she is not interested in having you in her life right now.


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## cbw83 (Oct 13, 2008)

ljtseng said:


> Ya, that is normal actually. Since its individual counseling the focus is on her.
> 
> If she wanted you involved she'd go to couples counseling. I think she's making it very clear she is not interested in having you in her life right now.


I think you are right. If it is her choice to keep pursuing that on her own, then I hope she is prepared to deal with a life where I am not around to take care of when she is feeling down, or make food for when she comes home tired, or rubbing her back when she is feeling anxiety, and so many other things. 

In the end, as any decent man should be, I will truly be happy for her if she does choose to be away from me and it does make her happier and more fulfilled, even if that means realizing she doesn't want to be with me.


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## Blanca (Jul 25, 2008)

cbw83 said:


> In the end, as any decent man should be, I will truly be happy for her if she does choose to be away from me and it does make her happier and more fulfilled, even if that means realizing she doesn't want to be with me.


That is good. You sound pretty stable about it all. Let us know what she says.


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## cbw83 (Oct 13, 2008)

Again, thanks everyone for your help. It was really nice to get useful feedback so quickly. I will definitely update later once I know more.


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## oceanbreeze (Oct 8, 2007)

Maybe her terms of "independence" is the need to be self-sufficient apart from her husband while being in the marital relationship. 

Does she have tools under her belt? such as a degree, a job, certificate of any kind that she is able to not fully rely on you thus feeling "trapped" and possibly mistaking her "freedom" by hanging out all night rather than discussing this in one setting with you, the husband. Maybe this could be what she is trying to say, but does not know how. 

If she hasnt anything, perhaps a training or A.A./A.S. degree at a community college to work along side you to not feel so dependent. 

Has this been discussed? Her definition of "independence?"


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## draconis (Oct 3, 2007)

I lost my first marriage because I wanted to establish a future and forgot about what I had in the here and now. Sometimes people don't want what they have or think some other life is greener. Either way it will effect your relationship. I hope it is for the good, that she is just getting this out of her system, but I have seen these things go good and I have seen them go bad.

A therapist is obligated to her, not you. But ask yourself if your communication is so good why didn't you know about this for the last year and a half. Why don't you know what she is doing out late at night or why. Why isn't she running to you instead of the therapist.

Don't get me wrong. You seem like one of the nicest guys in a bad situation. But you can never communicate in enough ways or perfect it.

That isn't to say that sometimes people are generally confused and need time alone.

draconis


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## cbw83 (Oct 13, 2008)

oceanbreeze said:


> Maybe her terms of "independence" is the need to be self-sufficient apart from her husband while being in the marital relationship.
> 
> Does she have tools under her belt? such as a degree, a job, certificate of any kind that she is able to not fully rely on you thus feeling "trapped" and possibly mistaking her "freedom" by hanging out all night rather than discussing this in one setting with you, the husband. Maybe this could be what she is trying to say, but does not know how.
> 
> ...


Well she just graduated from College with a Bachelor of Fine Arts, I am still in school pursuing my PhD. She has a job right, which pays well, but is only to last for a couple of months, since it is short term for a specific project. Beyond that, she has some other options that will probably be available to her. I don't work at this point is really too much of issue. She has been saying she wants to get a night job waitressing to be able to stay out of the house more though.

She just seems to think for her to get over her independence, she just needs to be out of the house without me as much as possible.


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## cbw83 (Oct 13, 2008)

draconis said:


> A therapist is obligated to her, not you. But ask yourself if your communication is so good why didn't you know about this for the last year and a half. Why don't you know what she is doing out late at night or why. Why isn't she running to you instead of the therapist.
> 
> Don't get me wrong. You seem like one of the nicest guys in a bad situation. But you can never communicate in enough ways or perfect it.
> 
> ...


You raise a good point about me not knowing it. I don't think she was really trying to hide it but more just didn't think it was a big deal and thought bringing up just wasn't worth it. I do remember now though, about a week before our wedding date, she was with a friend, and said she broke down for about 15-30 minutes wondering if she was making the right choice or not. She told me about it, but just said she was being stupid and really wanted to be married and not be worried that she didn't want to marry or anything, so things seemed ok. I guess on reflection, maybe I should have read more into it, but I am sure lots of wives have pre-wedding jitters, so I didn't think too much into it.

Also, to clarify, when she goes out, I do know where she is going, and still text throughout the night if needed. It isn't like she is going out try to hide, but rather just going out to get away.

Believe me, I have tried to communicate in every way possible. But she can only say that she "doesn't the reason why" so many times. To try to communicate beyond that starts showing the signs of frustration and little progress.

I am basically trying to let her have her space as much as possible while still trying to keep a channel open between us and using it to try to gather as much information as I can over time.


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## Blanca (Jul 25, 2008)

cbw83 said:


> You raise a good point about me not knowing it. I don't think she was really trying to hide it but more just didn't think it was a big deal and thought bringing up just wasn't worth it.


You do sound like a really nice guy. But you also sound very oblivious to her emotional needs. Just from reading this, from a female point of view, I would say she doesnt feel very emotionally connected to you. i bet she feels pretty lonely in the relationship.


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## cbw83 (Oct 13, 2008)

ljtseng said:


> You do sound like a really nice guy. But you also sound very oblivious to her emotional needs. Just from reading this, from a female point of view, I would say she doesnt feel very emotionally connected to you. i bet she feels pretty lonely in the relationship.


What have I said that makes you think I am oblivious to her emotional needs? I am just curious, because I am missing something obvious that I am not seeing. I have done everything I can to help her emotionally as she will let me, but like I said, alot of times she is trying to intentionally block her emotional attachment to me, because she thinks that is how it will make her better.

I think you are right that she does feel lonely in the relationship. But again, it is because she thinks she needs to force herself to be this way in order to grow some kind of independence. She seems to think that before she was too dependent on me, and wants to know she can just handle not having me with her.


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## draconis (Oct 3, 2007)

Sometimes when someone talks they just want to vent they don't want or need you to fix their problems.

draconis


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## cbw83 (Oct 13, 2008)

draconis said:


> Sometimes when someone talks they just want to vent they don't want or need you to fix their problems.
> 
> draconis


all, 

I agree. Well the problem it seems that I am the problem. Not that she thinks I am a bad person, but that I am in the way of her independence. So its against logic for her to look to me for support, when she is looking for independence from me.


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## cbw83 (Oct 13, 2008)

Just an update. She has made her decision and I am moving out.

Thanks again to everyone for their support and advice.


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## draconis (Oct 3, 2007)

Sorry to hear that. Atleast you have an answer and you to can move on with your life. I wish you the best and we will always be here for you.

draconis


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## in denial (May 15, 2009)

First of all i'm very sorry for all you are going through. i have somewhat of a similar situation, but different. i've been with my husband for six years, married 2 and a half. Everything within our relationship has been pretty ideal: we were very much in love, didn't argue often, things seemed to be going along happily. three months ago i found out he cheated on with a coworker and have been blindsided and devastated since. This has been the hardest thing I've ever dealth with, i moved out shortly after i found out and am struggling.

i think an important piece to our situations is: what is it that we want out of our relationships and can this be repaired? I'm sure its going to take a lot of soul searching for both of us to come up with an answer that we are comfortable with.


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