# Looking for advice



## Kaboom (Feb 6, 2013)

So, my wife has always had issue with "lashing out". I used to tolerate it, and at times, it was really bad. She would get mad at me and say things that were just outright nasty, call me an a-hole, or just fly off the handle and start throwing crap everywhere. Once she got mad at how I folded the laundry and emptied an entire full walk in closets worth of clothes onto the bedroom floor. Actually, she's done that more than once. Things get broken, too.

More recently, in light of medications, and my lack of tolerance to that type of behavior, she has been good about it for the most part, but still has occasional flare-ups.

I really don't get it.. why women get mad and "make you pay" or punish men for things that are really quite silly (to us, not them).. but I see it as disrespect, and made it clear a couple of years ago that I will not tolerate it. But anyways.. last night she got mad at me. She didn't trash anything (that I noticed), but she did text me that I was a F-ing idiot. I texted back a simple cold reminder about not tolerating it. I get home, she's calmed down.. we both were tired and cranky and agreed not to fight, and let it go.

Well, today, I go onto facebook and what do I see? That last night she got on there and posted about what an a#$hole I am.

Well, argh. I already made up with her, but I didn't realize she had spouted off to the world about it.. and to me that is a severe marital offense! It's disrespectful in the worst way.

I don't want to fight with her.. I'm tired of that.  But I already warned her the last time (first time) she posted something like that- I warned her that it wouldn't be tolerated, and I explained how disrespectful I saw it, and told her it could be a deal-breaker in the marriage.

So.. do I stand by my threats? Go get a lawyer and file? I really am sick of the constant disrespect. Of course she turns it all back onto me.. how my forgetting to do something menial, or folding a sock improperly is disrespectful to her... but I'm sorry.. not remembering to follow her crazy 10,000 rules of the house 100% of the time isn't exactly the same kind of disrespect as calling someone an ahole on FB, being mean to them and stuff.

If not serving her papers, how can I stop this behavior outside of leaving? Threats of non-tolerance apparently don't work.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

She probably learned it growing up.

Why don't you suggest anger management for her?


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## Kaboom (Feb 6, 2013)

I wanted mens advice. no offense. You are correct, she has abusive parents, and this is learned behavior, but that's not the point anymore. She's done countless hours of counseling and is on medications.. she knows what she is doing is wrong, and she knows where I stand about it. Anger management is her problem. Wife management is mine. I don't mean to sound rude, but I really don't want a womans perspective on this.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

Kaboom said:


> I wanted mens advice. no offense. You are correct, she has abusive parents, and this is learned behavior, but that's not the point anymore. She's done countless hours of counseling and is on medications.. she knows what she is doing is wrong, and she knows where I stand about it. Anger management is her problem. Wife management is mine. I don't mean to sound rude, but I really don't want a womans perspective on this.


Well then you shouldn't be posting on TAM. No offense.


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## bailingout (Jan 25, 2013)

Kaboom said:


> Anger management is her problem. _Wife management is mine_.


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## FormerSelf (Apr 21, 2013)

Yeah, it's important to make threats that you really don't want to follow through with...unless deep inside, you really feel that desperate to get out of the marriage. I think you need to steel yourself and confront her behavior each and every time she blows her top. My STBXW is like that...always venting anger at dumb things. 1) She doesn't respect you, or else she would be more mindful about her antagonistic talk. You don't need to blow up or get whiny defensive, cos that acts like someone who has lost and has no value. Just don't say anything until you are calm, letting her know that her nehavior is unacceptabel and you will not be talk to that way. If she refuses to apologize or mocks you, just walk out and do your own thing. When you come back and again try to enlighten her, just be calm and firm...and if she still is uncooperative, then basically set the boundary that there is nothing more to discuss until she is ready to appraoch you with a greater respect. She may try to bait you to fight, so if she does that then go away again. Leaping to a divorce may be a little drastic at this stage, but a separation can be a real healthy thing if you are trying to change the dynamic of your relationship. So I would say that after a period of you trying to correct her behavior (with you not nagging, pleading, teaching, preaching, whining, crying, threatening, no hissy fits, tantrums, moping) I would then rely on the guidance of a counselor to figure out the best way to enact a trial separation. 2) Women can often generate lots of negativity..and it builds if they aren't able to connect with their spouse..we think we are being successful in coming up with solutions...but they don't feel heard, understood, that someone really empathizes with her. Read Man are From Mars, Women are From Venus. 3) Anger can be in her personality. My wife, because of her PTSD, gets scared frequently (and expresses it through anger), ...but usually it is a culmination of a lot of things and a sock could just be the last straw. BOOM! Or if she is more of a dominate personality, that sort of personality expresses anger at challenges. Regardless, her taking it out on you is not cool. 4)Wive's often blame their spouses. It just is what it is...I have grown to recognize it as the princess disorder...when women get down on life because of a degree of disillusionment...they fall victim to fear and hopelessness...and get scared...show lots of anger to stay in control...and their anger increases when they feel their spouse doesn't have the same sort of paradigm. Women are intuitive and see things down the road, but it is at an emotional level, not in an explicable way. Like the story Princess and the Pea...she just couldn't sleep with the tiny pea under the mattresses...making her uncomfortable...and sometime women are sensitive and react to things long before they know what it is. Understanding her on this level may help you to better understand...to reach out hear her out...cos this may diffuse much of your situation if you can just be a sounding board...and not always the fixer. And doing stuff for her to placate her...will never work...that isn't what she wants.


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## Nucking Futs (Apr 8, 2013)

Hope1964 said:


> Well then you shouldn't be posting on TAM. No offense.


He can't post in the Mens Clubhouse looking for mens advice?


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

Nucking Futs said:


> He can't post in the Mens Clubhouse looking for mens advice?


Of course he can. But if he gets advice from women, there's no need to tell them to get lost. Tam, unlike other boards, doesn't restrict people from posting wherever they like to.


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## lifeistooshort (Mar 17, 2013)

Don't bother considering a woman's perspective, that'll help you deal with your wife. Geez no wonder your wife is acting crazy, you care nothing for how she views anything. Next time my hb acts crazy I won't bother asking men what his perspective could be, I'll only consider advice from other women. Good luck finding out how to keep your woman in check, since that's clearly what you want to do. No offense.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## bailingout (Jan 25, 2013)

lifeistooshort said:


> Good luck finding out how to keep your woman in check, since that's clearly what you want to do. No offense.


:iagree:



Kaboom said:


> Anger management is her problem. Wife management is mine.


Hence my  and adding :slap:


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## Nucking Futs (Apr 8, 2013)

This



Hope1964 said:


> Of course he can. But if he gets advice from women, there's no need to tell them to get lost. Tam, unlike other boards, doesn't restrict people from posting wherever they like to.


doesn't seem to match up with this.



Hope1964 said:


> Well then you shouldn't be posting on TAM. No offense.


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## Viseral (Feb 25, 2011)

Kaboom said:


> So, my wife has always had issue with "lashing out". I used to tolerate it, and at times, it was really bad. She would get mad at me and say things that were just outright nasty, call me an a-hole, or just fly off the handle and start throwing crap everywhere. Once she got mad at how I folded the laundry and emptied an entire full walk in closets worth of clothes onto the bedroom floor. Actually, she's done that more than once. Things get broken, too.
> 
> More recently, in light of medications, and my lack of tolerance to that type of behavior, she has been good about it for the most part, but still has occasional flare-ups.
> 
> ...


Well, in the time before laws you coulda just biatch slapped her and that woulda put her in her place, but nowadays that wouldn't be too wise.

To solve this problem you have to be ready and willing to go nuclear if that's what it takes. It's been my observation that some women just aren't happy until they get a rise out of you. So if that's what she wants then give it to her. 

Don't let her verbally and physically abuse you. The more she gets away with it the less she respects you and the more she'll continue to walk all over you. 

Don't be nice, separate your finances, get ready to file her with papers. Next time it happens stand up to her and let her know in no uncertain terms that you're willing to burn the house down (metaphorically speaking) to stop being abused.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

Nucking Futs said:


> This
> 
> 
> 
> doesn't seem to match up with this.


Allrighty then. Seems self explanatory to me. *shrug*


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## anotherguy (Dec 14, 2011)

I feel like it would be helpful to get some info on what happened?
What rule(s) is it that is being broken? 

===

Of course firing your mouth off in 'public' (facebook) is a pretty childish thing to do, but I know that when people feel like they have no recourse or have no control over a situation - that can happen.

Sounds like you both have things you are 'not going to tolerate'. You mention respect on your side, but you also mention '10,000 rules of the house'. Are you discarding all that as inconsequential?

I am NOT trying to put words in your mouth or blame you. Im not. Having a wife that has OCPD tendancies myself - trust me - I know what you mean - but what is going on?

Devils advocate:

I suspect that by the time things blow up - it isnt because you left your socks on the floor. It builds up over time until she blows a gasket and tells you you are a fvcking inconsiderate idiot because of built up resentment. Then you calmly tell her she is being disrespectful and overreacting (for leaving socks on the floor) as usual and that you wont stand for it. Then she comes down off her 'mad', as do you, and a truce is reached for a few weeks until......lather...rinse...repeat. 

I am totally daydreaming here - is this similar to what is happening? Cant offer anythng without a better undestanding of what is happening besides her flying of the handle for no reason. How would _she_ describe what is happening?


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## Wiserforit (Dec 27, 2012)

Kaboom said:


> So.. do I stand by my threats? Go get a lawyer and file? I really am sick of the constant disrespect. Of course she turns it all back onto me.. how my forgetting to do something menial, or folding a sock improperly is disrespectful to her... but I'm sorry.. not remembering to follow her crazy 10,000 rules of the house 100% of the time isn't exactly the same kind of disrespect as calling someone an ahole on FB, being mean to them and stuff.
> 
> If not serving her papers, how can I stop this behavior outside of leaving? Threats of non-tolerance apparently don't work.


If I understand correctly, you issued an ultimatum that you are not prepared to follow through with?

Or was it a little less clearly stated than that? Because there are intermediary steps prior to divorce like trial separation or something similar. There are also ways people can compensate for stupid acts - a public offense requires a public apology for example. 

Hard to put this into context not knowing a lot of the history and what the ultimatum was exactly.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

Wiserforit said:


> If I understand correctly, you issued an ultimatum that you are not prepared to follow through with?
> 
> Or was it a little less clearly stated than that? Because there are intermediary steps prior to divorce like trial separation or something similar. There are also ways people can compensate for stupid acts - a public offense requires a public apology for example.
> 
> Hard to put this into context not knowing a lot of the history and what the ultimatum was exactly.


Hence my suggestion for anger management classes.

I once told my hubby he either went to anger management or I was filing for D. It really was that bad. He went.


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## TCSRedhead (Oct 17, 2012)

It's not really a man/woman issue.

Your wife's behavior seems be abusive (we don't have full context) and unacceptable.

Typically, issuing repeated ultimatums doesn't work for either gender.

At some point, it's either she address and correct the problem and you move on 

OR 

She doesn't correct the problem and you either live with or or leave.


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## anotherguy (Dec 14, 2011)

TCSRedhead said:


> ...At some point, it's either she address and correct the problem and you move on
> 
> OR
> 
> She doesn't correct the problem and you either live with or or leave.


OR, the third option, both of them make changes that contribute to changing the current dynamic.

Unless of course - her outbursts are totally without cause, right?

- but yeah - 'simple' (or complicated) as that. Fix it or live with it.


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## romantic_guy (Nov 8, 2011)

Yes, she may need anger management but you both need counseling. After all, we have only heard your side. Rarely is only one person responsible for relationship difficulties. 

So, I think the ultimatum needs to be, "Either we get counseling or I will be moving out." Notice I did not say divorce yet. That may come, but not yet. Go to the website marriedmansexlife.com, spend some time there, and read the book. "No More Mr Nice Guy" may also be a great need for you. All of these could be sh*t tests...look at the site and you will get what I mean.

Oh, and by the way, women can give really good insight into their own gender.


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## Tall Average Guy (Jul 26, 2011)

anotherguy said:


> OR, the third option, both of them make changes that contribute to changing the current dynamic.
> 
> Unless of course - her outbursts are totally without cause, right?
> 
> - but yeah - 'simple' (or complicated) as that. Fix it or live with it.


I don't see how violent outbursts (and throwing everything out of a closet is violent) is ever acceptable. Yes, they may both have issues, but she needs to stop that behavior before they can be addressed.


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## Kaboom (Feb 6, 2013)

/sigh ...

I guess I should have seen it coming..

First off, I thought it would have been obvious that since I posted this in mens clubhouse and not one of the other community forums that it would be obvious that I was asking for an opinion from men, not women.

That a woman took it upon herself to be the first to respond and interject her point of view- I admit, it irritated me, and yes, I was rude, but at least grant me that right to be irritated, regardless of how PC my response was.

Second, yeah, there's a huge backstory, she grew up in an abusive environment, she's most likely bi-polar, and we've been together for 12 years, longer actually, but married for 12.

We've done the counseling, and she sees both a psychaitrist and a psychologist / counselor(s). She's on medications.

We've been through it all together, and divorce seemed imminent at times. Through all of it I've been a pretty damn supportive man, far beyond what most men would have put up with. I dare to say that 9/10 men would have been long ****ing gone by now. But not me. I've been nothing but a gentleman to her. And while I'm not perfect, what you have read in my former posts in this thread are really what I'm going to call my "final straw".

Of all the mental abuse and anguish I've tolerated from her, the one time in the past she posted a really nasty attack on me on facebook, I warned her that was disrespectful to the point that if she ever did it again, that I would be gone. My friends and family see that. It's beyond embarassing. I can't help but think "you just don't disrespect someone you are supposed to love, like that. How can she possibly love me and do things like that?".

So that was like 2 years ago. I realize that she thinks somehow things in the past are just water under the bridge, but I don't.

So GUYS, when you deliver an ultimatum like that, would you two years later follow thru?


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## Kaboom (Feb 6, 2013)

anotherguy said:


> I feel like it would be helpful to get some info on what happened?
> What rule(s) is it that is being broken?
> 
> ===
> ...


You are hitting the nail close to the head brother.. 

Yes, she builds resentment, another issue that has slowly ground away at my nerves for years. when i speak of 10000 rules, socks on floor, etc.. it's more or less just me venting all my pent up frustrations at once. I know I didn't come off well yesterday, but I was (still am) very angry about it.

The backstory you want is pretty much as you might expect. I walk on eggshells 24/7. She sends very mixed signals as to what she wants (expects), and I'm somehow expected to guess all the time. She's (intentionally?) vague about almost everything, with few exceptions. I don't want to get into too much detail here because I know she browses this site, but one days she wants blue, but the next day she wants green, and when I give her blue, thinking that's what she wants, she will freak out. I feel like I'm being set up all the time. If I try to specify day to day what color she wants, she gets all pissed off that I don't know her well enough to read her moods. 

And that makes the bedroom so frustrating for me that I just don't even initiate anymore, and avoid sex with her, as it always ends in anger and frustration. I'm supposed to read her mind and guess exactly how she wants it, with only the vaguest of clues or none at all. If I guess wrong, she starts a fight. Like I said- I feel like I'm just being set up all the time. I know a large part of it is her mental health, but at the same time, she's not an idiot, she knows what behaviors are right and wrong, and she seemingly has no problem embracing wrong behaviors at her whimsy.

I know of the "nice guy" thing- and yes, I used to be guilty of that, but I rid myself of those pesky behaviors long ago, for the most part. There will always be a part of me that doesn't have the heart to be mean to someone, even her, no matter how much I want to at times.

BUT.. Over the last couple of years, I've found my tolerance lessening with each incident. Every time she goes off and does something mean towards me, I feel another sliver of me just whittling away. I tend to immediately "put her in place" the moment she starts. I feel like I love her a little less every time it happens too. I'm starting to feel like I hate her more than I love her anymore. I feel like it's reached the tipping point. And this FB thing has me wondering if this is the point where I just cannot deal with her anymore. We're getting along right now, but I'm having a really hard time shaking it, and I'm cold towards her right now.. I can't seem to let it go. I feel like that may have been the final straw, and this is on top of the fact that I told her what would happen if she did that again. 

I don't know how much I want advice, to vent, or even if I'm fishing for someone to talk me off the ledge.. but I'm here talking about it.

The reason I didn't want a female perspective, is that I'm kinda sick of that- sure, there's always going to be the other side of the coin / story, but I've examined that aspect of my life, and I just don't need to go over it again- At this point, my concerns are entirely on the man side.. How a man should look at this, how he should perceive it, and how he should react.


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## anotherguy (Dec 14, 2011)

If I got to the point you are at... I suppose I would be asking myself about which path I wanted to follow. Fix it, or get out.

But you have been there before. Done the counselling thing (did it help?) and she is on bipolar meds which is...another personaliy changing topic entirely - I know you know what I mean there. 

I dont know what I would do. I watched my older brothers life get destroyed when his wife - for lack of better words - went down the tubes psychologically pretty suddenly in her 30s - after years of deteriorating family life and near total destruction of their finances etc from medical bills etc. It was horrible. In the end - his divorcing her was total self preservation. Im not trying to cast you in that situation - but just so you know where Im coming from.

obviously you try and get her the care that she needs. Sounds like you both are doing that - and that she is a willing participant in that - which is good.

This sounds like something only you are going to be able to decide. When enough is enough? What you both are doing simply isnt working and if, in the end - you would both actually be happier apart?

Have you tried throwing the topic open on the Mental Health forum? You might get some more insightful suggestions there?

Physical & Mental Health Issues


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## Kaboom (Feb 6, 2013)

well I thought about putting it in a few different forums lol.. but I ultimately decided on the mens clubhouse for the specific reason of asking (and I think I finally figured out what I'm trying to ask)-

At what point do men just get tired of "her ****"?. I do entirely feel like a visual scale is in front of me, and at one time my love for her tipped the scale 100% to one side. Each time she disrespects me, a small feather gets placed on the opposing side. I think that scale right now is hanging by a mere thread, or feather.. in a dangerous middle-balance.

I would love to say it takes two, but I honestly cannot. I've done everything, and I do mean everything. I take care of everything. The laundry, the house, the kid, the cars, all she does is eat, sleep, go to work (which took 9+ years! to get her off her ass after childbirth). I work a salaried job, including nights and weekends when needed, on top of the 40 during the week. 

She has alienated all of her family and most of mine. She is outright ****ty to everyone she meets. She had 6 different jobs last year because she can't get along with anyone. The doctors and drugs aren't working.. Even most of my friends no longer associate with me because even if she isn't ****ty to them directly, she places so much demand on me that I'm just an absentee friend at best. I'm lucky I got a great job, and I keep her as distanced as possible from work and work functions / social outings because I'm worried she will (and did once) get crappy with the wrong person here and end my job. 

Ugg. Now it's just turning into a *****fest .. I'm really just frustrated with the whole thing. The problem at this point is that scale.. I feel like it's been past the tipping point and I can't even find a reason to want to stay anymore, although for the most part, she's been better this last year or so, the "better" just isn't good enough. I don't even know if perfect is good enough.. too much pain and PTSD for me.. I am finding that I can't seem to get past it, so each time she has a "flare up".. I just get overwhelmed by it and want out, instantly.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

Kaboom said:


> /sigh ...
> 
> I guess I should have seen it coming..
> 
> First off, I thought it would have been obvious that since I posted this in mens clubhouse and not one of the other community forums that it would be obvious that I was asking for an opinion from men, not women.


If you've done any reading around here at all, you will notice that women and men respond to posts in both the Mens Clubhouse and the Ladies Lounge. In fact, the description of the General Discussion forum says 'anyone can post anywhere on Talk About Marriage". You may have been on other forums where there are rules about who can post where, but not here. So no, it was NOT obvious that you were only looking for answers from men.



Kaboom said:


> That a woman took it upon herself to be the first to respond and interject her point of view- I admit, it irritated me, and yes, I was rude, but at least grant me that right to be irritated, regardless of how PC my response was.


The fact that this irritated you says to me that you may want to do some self-reflection as well. TAM is all about helping people. Why you would immediately assume that my reply was in any way hostile is beyond me. Perhaps you are projecting your feelings toward your wife a bit here?? And the simple fact that you automatically discount a woman's perspective simply because she doesn't have a penis is insulting. If you treat your wife this way, it won't help your situation.


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## anotherguy (Dec 14, 2011)

You didnt say if you thought counselling helped the last time. When was this and how long did it last? Did you both go or just her? Did she have a positive view of it? Did you?

After re-reading some of this - I'm am thinking it is the only hope for both of you. You have already dismissed doctors and medications as not working - so you really have little choice - right?


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## ecotime47 (Apr 3, 2013)

Hey bro. Sorry you are going through all this with your wife. Posting it for the world on facebook was completely out of line. If you want to save your marriage I would suggest that both of you see a marriage counselor. 

One of the important things most counselors will hit on is expectations you have for one another and whether or not they are rational and good for your marriage relationship. From what I hear you saying, this conversation needs to happen between you two. And there needs to be a mediator to keep it on track and stay results oriented so that it doesn't turn into a blowout.

I can't imagine divorcing my wife because she posted something about me on facebook, but you better believe it would be enough to push me to make some serious changes in our marriage. The bottom line is, I promised to love her through it all. Sometimes love is tough and requires strong action but leaving her is never an option.

Hang in there Kaboom. I'm praying for you today.


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## Kaboom (Feb 6, 2013)

anotherguy said:


> You didnt say if you thought counselling helped the last time. When was this and how long did it last? Did you both go or just her? Did she have a positive view of it? Did you?
> 
> After re-reading some of this - I'm am thinking it is the only hope for both of you. You have already dismissed doctors and medications as not working - so you really have little choice - right?



She has been in and out of counselling most of her life. Her opinion of it is that it never helps and is a waste of time. We've done it together as well, and I would have to agree with her- The counselors seem more interested in dragging things out to keep you coming to sessions and paying that co-pay and getting their insurance money, than actually helping. I held onto hope that we just needed to find the "right" counselor, but that door has pretty much closed. 

She does embrace the meds though- although refuses to consider changing them, even though (to me) they no longer seem to work. Even when they did work, they never really solved any issues, they only partially made the horrible monster a little less horrible. I'm starting to suspect a dependence issue on one of her meds, which gets her pretty high, and explains why she isn't willing to give them up. But that's a whole other problem piled on top.


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## Kaboom (Feb 6, 2013)

Hope1964 said:


> If you've done any reading around here at all, you will notice that women and men respond to posts in both the Mens Clubhouse and the Ladies Lounge. In fact, the description of the General Discussion forum says 'anyone can post anywhere on Talk About Marriage". You may have been on other forums where there are rules about who can post where, but not here. So no, it was NOT obvious that you were only looking for answers from men.


I never implied your response was against the rules. I did imply (several times) that I just wanted men's advice, and while maybe I wasn't the kindest person in asking you to "butt out", your insistence on injecting yourself and your "forum rights" sheds an equally poor light on you.




Hope1964 said:


> The fact that this irritated you says to me that you may want to do some self-reflection as well. TAM is all about helping people.


I was irritated because I was fresh out of an argument, posted here in frustration, and posted in the mens clubhouse to get a mans perspective on my issues. I didn't berate you and call you a bunch of names or anything, I only, in my frustration, asked you to butt out. Now, I get it, you got all butt-hurt about it, and that's really not a problem. But you have since been trying to inject your (unwanted) opinions and determinations throughout this discussion. 

If you asked me to but out, I would have and I would have let you have your discussion without me. If you don't feel my opinion is relevant to a discussion, you might actually be right.



Hope1964 said:


> Why you would immediately assume that my reply was in any way hostile is beyond me.


I never once assumed your opinion was hostile, nor did I make any such assertion. You really need to stop creating this drama out of thin air.



Hope1964 said:


> Perhaps you are projecting your feelings toward your wife a bit here??


Perhaps I'm not the one with the bigger problem here?



Hope1964 said:


> And the simple fact that you automatically discount a woman's perspective simply because she doesn't have a penis is insulting.


OMFG are you kidding me? Do you expect men to consult with you when we have a question about plumbing, fixing cars, and men's underwear too? Maybe in your world men and women discuss everything like we are all some universal sex, *but sometimes people just want input from a specific point of view. Is that too much to ask? Apparently, from you, it is.*



Hope1964 said:


> If you treat your wife this way, it won't help your situation.


And if you are this needy and invasive with your husband, I can fully understand why you are here as well.

See, I can fling passive-aggressive backhanded remarks too. Do us both a favor and butt out already.


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## scione (Jul 11, 2011)

Kaboom, my wife does the same thing as yours. Post on Facebook about our problem. This is what I did so she would stop. This is not saying that what I did is correct or the right thing to do.

When we have problem and she's at fault and I know everyone of her friend will agree, I post on her Facebook and let everyone see it. When she comes to me about it, I told her, "I saw you did it, I thought it was ok."


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## TCSRedhead (Oct 17, 2012)

Ahh, misogyny and sexism abound!

Come on Hope - we'll go paint our nails and giggle and have pillow fights as that's all we're clearly capable of handling. 

Cuz, clearly unless one was born with a penis and testicles, our poor widdle girly brains can't possibly understand his complex problems.


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## Maricha75 (May 8, 2012)

TCSRedhead said:


> Ahh, misogyny and sexism abound!
> 
> Come on Hope - we'll go paint our nails and giggle and have pillow fights as that's all we're clearly capable of handling.
> 
> Cuz, clearly unless one was born with a penis and testicles, our poor widdle girly brains can't possibly understand his complex problems.


Never mind the fact that there were a couple men who made the SAME suggestion Hope did... and Kaboom agreed with them... yet got irritated with Hope's suggestion. Fascinating, to say the VERY least.


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## SomedayDig (Jul 17, 2012)

Maricha75 said:


> Never mind the fact that there were a couple men who made the SAME suggestion Hope did... and Kaboom agreed with them... yet got irritated with Hope's suggestion. Fascinating, to say the VERY least.


This part made me giggle cuz of how f'ng true it is.

"I don't wanna listen unless you have a penis...even if what you're saying is good advice...you _must_ have a penis to give it."


OP - 2 years later and you're thinking about acting on your "demand"? It seems a bit shallow hearted.


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## eyuop (Apr 7, 2013)

Guy here.

I can see a whole bunch of issues here just from reading your posts. They do not all stem from your wife, either -- though some of them do.

What are you actually asking? Do you want a "good marriage"? What would that look like to you? What would it look like to your wife?

There is a book that is called "The DNA of Relationships for Couples" By Gary Smalley:
The DNA of Relationships for Couples (Smalley Franchise Products): Greg Smalley, Robert S. Paul, Donna K. Wallace: 9780842383226: Amazon.com: Books

I would make a suggestion that you take charge and go through this book with your wife. You talk about walking on eggshells and doing all sorts of things (housework, etc.) to make everything happen. Well, that is called being *****-whipped. She can't respect you for doing all of that. She can't respect you for doing all of that stuff - especially stuff that is her responsibility. 

I have a hunch that you wife may have Borderline Personality Disorder, but obviously on a random internet forum there is no way to diagnose such a thing. If she is borderline, she will continue to see you as the enemy, and everyone who is "toxic" to her (by her own definition) as an enemy. Very difficult to deal with since she will purposefully try to get you to sever all of the relationships you have with people who feel threatening to her.

If she grew up in an abusive situation, she may have the feeling that she needs to create drama because when things were quiet it meant there was (like a volcano building up) an explosion getting ready to happen. By creating some drama it relieves the pressures in small bursts, rather than great big ones. Let me guess: She gets super angry, calls you horrible names, goes bananas and then (after it all), she feels a lot better and might even try to initiate intimacy and sex after the whole event. Does that sound familiar?

You sound like a guy who is assertive and self-assured. But your wife holds a power over you that is unlike anything you've ever experienced. If it were a guy pulling this, you would just take care of business. But she drives you nuts because no matter what you do it doesn't seem to work. You are both working from your core fears (which is explained in the book I suggested above). To get past those fears and start doing life together will mean that some changes have to happen. But for your information, you can only change you. So you have to be the man and make the changes first.

If you posting on here is a last-ditch effort and just a place to vent, your marriage is ****ing doomed. How is that for speaking your language. But if you are truly wanting to see your marriage become what you want it to become, then obviously you have changes to make in yourself -- and if your wife responds to those changes, great. If she doesn't, then you can't make her respond and you have to decide the best course of action after that (divorce, etc.). But if I were you, I would work on your communication with her through the book I suggested. You two do not communicate in a healthy way, and she needs you to quit acting like a *****-whipped man and start truly taking the lead. Not by trying to do the housework or other sh** like that. Not by playing her weekend warrior games. She needs you to stand up and be the man you need to be by being responsible enough to take the lead in making the relationship the best it can be. She needs you to listen to her -- truly listen. She needs you to get past all of the external stuff (drama) she creates and the stuff she tries to do to control you. You need to get above that stuff and not let it get drag you into her emotional traps. 

She needs you to listen to her heart. She might be screaming swear words, but that isn't her heart. You are not listening. She has fears, and she is trying to scream them, but all you can hear is the screams. You need to know what her fears are. Are you man enough to truly listen?


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## scione (Jul 11, 2011)

It seems women in this thread seems to only read what they want to hear. OP is okay with women's opinions, but he just want *men's perspective*. How can you give a man's perspective without being a man?


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## Maricha75 (May 8, 2012)

scione said:


> It seems women in this thread seems to only read what they want to hear. OP is okay with women's opinions, but he just want *men's perspective*. How can you give a man's perspective without being a man?


And apparently you missed where some of the men gave the same *perspective* as that of the women. So, I guess that means you only read what you wanted, huh?


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## scione (Jul 11, 2011)

Maricha75 said:


> And apparently you missed where some of the men gave the same *perspective* as that of the women. So, I guess that means you only read what you wanted, huh?


The answers can be the same from both male and female, but he just wants to know what men would say about this situation.

Please stay on topic


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

are the men the sharks or the jets?


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## richie33 (Jul 20, 2012)

The Ducky Boys.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Maricha75 (May 8, 2012)

scione said:


> The answers can be the same from both male and female, but he just wants to know what men would say about this situation.
> 
> Please stay on topic


I would stay on topic... if my comments were welcomed. Unfortunately, the fact that the only penis in my possession is that of my husband precludes the advice I could give from being accepted as viable.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

Good lord, this thread has degraded to the point where it's actually quite hilarious. Since I do NOT have a penis and am apparently only allowed to speak when spoken to, I shall take my barefoot and formerly pregnant self back into the kitchen where I surely belong!!! :rofl: :rofl:


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## Kaboom (Feb 6, 2013)

scione said:


> The answers can be the same from both male and female, but he just wants to know what men would say about this situation.
> 
> Please stay on topic


^^ This.


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## Kaboom (Feb 6, 2013)

Hope1964 said:


> Good lord, this thread has degraded to the point where it's actually quite hilarious. Since I do NOT have a penis and am apparently only allowed to speak when spoken to, I shall take my barefoot and formerly pregnant self back into the kitchen where I surely belong!!! :rofl: :rofl:


And your response really exposes exactly why I wanted to get opinions from other guys. Maybe guys who have been where I'm at. If you are a lesbian, and had a life-partner for several years, then perhaps I might seek a value in your opinion.

But, as it stands, you are far more concerned with my implied sexism because "you don't have a penis" when it really boils down to "you haven't had a long, committed, romantic, and sexual relationship with a woman". 

I think you just have an agenda, and picked the wrong place to assert it. I cannot count how many times I have tried to explain that my feelings about your interjections were not personal, but that I just wanted the perspective of other guys. I explained it in a rational way, a negative way, and a positive way, and still you just don't get it, *which is exactly why I didn't want your opinion in the first place*, regardless of whether or not it happens to support other opinions or not. I just didn't want it in the balance. 

Sorry you feel your lack of a penis excludes you, but that's not my problem. My lack of a vagina excludes me from pillow fights and getting pregnant, do you hear me whining about it?


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## TCSRedhead (Oct 17, 2012)

Kaboom - you're assuming the women posting here have NOT had a long term relationship in their lives with another woman. 

And, you keep proving my point about misogyny over and over with your responses. 

Like the item about discussing plumbing/cars with women (which my H does rather frequently) or the jab about pillow fights and getting pregnant.

I can tell you that the advice I offered up would be the same to a man or a woman. It's even been mirrored in others as well. 

If you discount your wife's perspective and views as you do the women here, it's drawing a clearer picture of what may be driving her to lash out at you.


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## Kaboom (Feb 6, 2013)

eyuop said:


> Guy here.
> 
> I can see a whole bunch of issues here just from reading your posts. They do not all stem from your wife, either -- though some of them do.
> 
> ...


Thanks for taking the time to type all that out-

In part, yes, it was a bit of venting, but I guess in hindsight, the huge point I was trying to make or ask was really this- bullet points to make it easy.

-got married
-she changed, became mental
-realized it was really mental, went to doc, got meds
-things never really got fixed, just a little better.
-some good days, some bad days, not nearly as bad as it was, every day was once a bad day.
-regardless, over the years, it started wearing away at me
-I start putting my foot down, but at the same time, over the years, I learned to do almost everything for her to avoid fighting and drama
-about 2 years ago, it started really getting to me, my tolerance started waning.
-when we fought, I started laying down ultimatums- drawing a line in the sand as to what behaviors will no longer be tolerated
-prior to this month, even though I promised I would leave under certain conditions, warnings were issued instead, which seemed to snap her back into reality
- this month.. realized warnings are now obsolete, behaviors are getting more frequent
- start to think: warnings don't work, only one thing left is to actually adhere to my own words and end it
-come here to ask other guys:

Did you ever go down that warning path? 
Did it fix the problem(s)?
At what point do you make good on your promises?


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## Nucking Futs (Apr 8, 2013)

TCSRedhead said:


> Kaboom - you're assuming the women posting here have NOT had a long term relationship in their lives with another woman.
> 
> And, you keep proving my point about misogyny over and over with your responses.
> 
> ...


You seem pretty quick to accuse the op of misogyny. I think I detect some misandry there. 




And no I don't think you hate men any more than I think Kaboom hates women. Do you really think Kaboom hates women, or is that just typical female emotional hysteria?


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## TCSRedhead (Oct 17, 2012)

Nucking Futs said:


> You seem pretty quick to accuse the op of misogyny. I think I detect some misandry there.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I don't throw that label out lightly. I truly meant it.

And no, I genuinely appreciate men and their opinions, perspective and advice. In fact, when it comes to understanding my H, advice from men has been infinitely useful.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

Kaboom said:


> My lack of a vagina excludes me from pillow fights


No it doesn't.

Look, I am sorry that I rub you the wrong way. I have NO idea why. I also have no idea why it is you think my opinions are less valid than a mans opinion, hence my comment about lack of a penis. Because that's the only reason I can figure. If there is something inherently lacking in my intelligence because I am a woman, please enlighten me. If it is simply that I have never been married to a woman, then I say that the fact I AM a woman should make my opinions even MORE valid, no? If I want to understand my husband, who better to ask than other men? 

Either way, the vehemence with which you address me really isn't necessary. 

Anyway, I will no longer give you my opinion about your situation. But I shall continue to give you my opinion about the misogyny you display.


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## SomedayDig (Jul 17, 2012)

Hey Hope...can ya grab me a sammich while you're in the kitchen?

Thanks!


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## Kaboom (Feb 6, 2013)

TCSRedhead said:


> Kaboom - you're assuming the women posting here have NOT had a long term relationship in their lives with another woman.
> 
> And, you keep proving my point about misogyny over and over with your responses.
> 
> ...


Well that's just unfair. I only gave back the same she was giving me.

But let's dive in, shall we?

Do you deny women are different than men? Do you honestly think you understand what it's like to be married to a woman? Do you think all stereotypes about genders are false? 

For the record, I wholly admit the sexes are different. Women are typically one way and men are typically the other. You can argue exceptions all you want, but this discussion wasn't ever about that, was it?

So what if I got crappy with hope? I think her consistent interjections when she was asked not to, warranted my responses, especially when she chose to lace her remarks with sarcasm and the same misogyny you accuse me of, yet when I push back with the same poison, I'm the jerk?

I think not.

Regarding your clever little jabs at me, I pretty much feel that if you are going to act stereotypical, then I will not feel bad treating you as such. 

Can you even help yourself from interjecting your opinions in this topic? (yes, that was an intentional clever sarcastic stereotype designed to inflame you while at the same time, sparking your all too expected response, which I could probably recite word-for-word before you even type it out). 

I didn't appreciate Hope's interjections, or her attitude, nor do I appreciate yours, so if you believe my hostility is simply because I'm a jerk or have a penis, you are sadly mistaken and a victim of your own drama. Look into a mirror if you want someone to blame for your being upset at my words.


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## Kaboom (Feb 6, 2013)

for the record, if a woman came into the discussion and talked about her long term relationship with another woman, I wouldn't have discounted it. Jeez you people are a tough crowd


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## Kaboom (Feb 6, 2013)

Hope1964 said:


> No it doesn't.
> 
> Look, I am sorry that I rub you the wrong way. I have NO idea why. I also have no idea why it is you think my opinions are less valid than a mans opinion, hence my comment about lack of a penis. Because that's the only reason I can figure. If there is something inherently lacking in my intelligence because I am a woman, please enlighten me. If it is simply that I have never been married to a woman, then I say that the fact I AM a woman should make my opinions even MORE valid, no? If I want to understand my husband, who better to ask than other men?
> 
> ...



Hope, It was never personal. I have two problems with you, and they only extend to the extent of this thread. First is that I didn't want your advice simply because I wanted advice from the perspective of someone who has been in a long term, romantic, legal, sexual relationship with a woman. Naturally, you should understand that in other words, I wanted input from other men, from that perspective of the marriage. Nothing more and nothing less. I don't know how else to explain it to you.

Second, is that you have made it all about you. Your lack of penis, your lack of common sense or good advice. It has absolutely nothing to do with any of it. If I recall correctly, we had a decent enough discourse in other threads months ago. Just understand, that this was never about you. Your feelings of being belittled or categorized have nothing to do with your intelligence, but your experience. You do need to let that side of it go, it's not serving you well.

I do apologize for being crappy with you when you first responded, but you need to realize I had just posted that and was at my wits end with my wife, and the last thing I wanted was a womans perspective. My wife already makes everything about her and it's always my fault. Everything. Forgive me for not wanting this discussion to go in that direction. I did post this in the mens section for that reason. I'm sorry you walked into my frustrations, and I appreciate you understanding why I dismissed your post the way I did.


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## Nucking Futs (Apr 8, 2013)

TCSRedhead said:


> I don't throw that label out lightly. I truly meant it.
> 
> And no, I genuinely appreciate men and their opinions, perspective and advice. In fact, when it comes to understanding my H, advice from men has been infinitely useful.


Well, that's a shame. I don't think Kaboom hates all women, I even doubt that he hates you or hope. I think he's annoyed that you can't respect his wishes and just wants you to leave him alone, but I'd be really surprised if he hates you.

I've found that when a woman plays the misogyny card it's usually because she is in an untenable situation in a debate and wants to shut debate down rather than defend her position. I firmly believe that is what you were doing in this case. I don't think it's unreasonable for a man or woman to request only men to respond to a question posted in the Mens Clubhouse any more than I think it's unreasonable for someone to ask that only women respond to a question in the Ladies Lounge. I would have no trouble honoring that request and the fact that you think that making that request repeatedly and reacting negatively when that request is not only blatantly disrespected but attacked indicates hatred for an entire gender reflects negatively on you.

Your reaction is so over the top that I really thought you were kidding. You might want to consider a little introspection on this.

Or you can just call me a misogynist.


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## TCSRedhead (Oct 17, 2012)

Nucking Futs said:


> Well, that's a shame. I don't think Kaboom hates all women, I even doubt that he hates you or hope. I think he's annoyed that you can't respect his wishes and just wants you to leave him alone, but I'd be really surprised if he hates you.
> 
> I've found that when a woman plays the misogyny card it's usually because she is in an untenable situation in a debate and wants to shut debate down rather than defend her position. I firmly believe that is what you were doing in this case. I don't think it's unreasonable for a man or woman to request only men to respond to a question posted in the Mens Clubhouse any more than I think it's unreasonable for someone to ask that only women respond to a question in the Ladies Lounge. I would have no trouble honoring that request and the fact that you think that making that request repeatedly and reacting negatively when that request is not only blatantly disrespected but attacked indicates hatred for an entire gender reflects negatively on you.
> 
> ...


Clearly we disagree and that's ok. It's not the first time here if I recall correctly. 

I don't see anything where I was over the top or where my position was untenable. If you read his reaction to a woman's posting on his thread, it really gives a lot of insight into his views about women as does his most recent response to me. 

I stated misogyny because nearly the same advice offered up by a man was touted as good. Indicating clear disdain for the same offered by a woman.

I don't view either gender as 'stereotypical' since I've been fortunate enough to know too wide a variety of people to do so which makes misandry pretty difficult.


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## talin (Apr 25, 2012)

Things I've learned from this thread.

If you want a woman's opinion ask women to please not offer their opinion.

Women are incapable of offering useful advice as to how to deal with other women.

Never make an ultimatum that you are not prepared to back up otherwise any residual respect your verbally abusive partner may still have for you will be completely obliterated.

Dude you wanted a man's advice, even though you aren't acting like a man and obviously don't know how to treat a woman?

Here ya go- learn how to deal with a woman with courtesy and respect, don't be so chauvanistic as to blindly believe that women aren't as capable as men in many different areas including home repairs, plumbing and cars- and don't put up with abusive behavior on the part of your spouse.

You've warned her repeatedly about the "severe marital infractions" or however you put it, and she continues the behavior to the point of disrespecting you to the entire Facebook world.

You can either continue to take it, you can continue to ask for advice which will mostly be useless because it's obvious your wife doesn't give a damn about how you feel about it, or you can leave her. But you won't do that because you're fearful of what live would be without your abusive partner so you'll stick with the devil you know.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

I just reread my posts, and cannot understand where it is that I made it 'all about me". I offered advice and was immediately told to shut up because I was a woman. I also was not the first person to mention the lack of a penis as having anything to do with it. I was trying to be genuinely helpful and was told that my opinion was invalid, for no other reason than that I am a woman. I still don't know why that makes my opinion invalid. Others, who happened to be guys, said the same thing I did. Like I said, if I want to learn about my husband, I would welcome the opinions of other men.

If you were feeling angry towards women and didn't feel able to handle replies from women, perhaps posting that fact in your OP would have avoided all of this? Because, like has been pointed out, simply posting in the mens clubhouse doesn't ensure that only men will reply.

I do appreciate the apology and I hope you can go back and see where I was coming from.


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## talin (Apr 25, 2012)

Hope1964 said:


> I just reread my posts, and cannot understand where it is that I made it 'all about me". I offered advice and was immediately told to shut up because I was a woman. I also was not the first person to mention the lack of a penis as having anything to do with it. I was trying to be genuinely helpful


Hope as an impartial observer on this thread I offer the following:

- It's not you
- I think I see why the OPs wife keeps exploding and calling him all sorts of names
- He's not an innocent victim in all of this


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## TiggyBlue (Jul 29, 2012)

Totally hate too and don't want to butt into a thread I'm not wanted (but I'm still going to post this lol), it's unwise to exclude the advise and perspective of someone who may have been in your wife's position and had anger management themselves. Ok out now.


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## talin (Apr 25, 2012)

Gotta admit I'm still scratching my head over this thread.

Why in the world would someone think they'd get better advice about how their wife is thinking- from a GUY??

Not only is it rude and insulting to exclude women, it lacks common sense.


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## Nucking Futs (Apr 8, 2013)

TCSRedhead said:


> I don't view either gender as 'stereotypical' since I've been fortunate enough to know too wide a variety of people to do so which makes misandry pretty difficult.


I was teasing you with that stereotypical hysteria crack because I didn't believe that you really thought Kaboom was a misogynist. Thus the emoticon.

You don't understand men. That comes through loud and clear, and it shackles you in discourse. Your view seems to be distorted by a feminist prism and you don't seem inclined to apply any critical thought to your own reactions. It's a pity but there's nothing I can do to make you think.


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## TCSRedhead (Oct 17, 2012)

Nucking Futs said:


> I was teasing you with that stereotypical hysteria crack because I didn't believe that you really thought Kaboom was a misogynist. Thus the emoticon.
> 
> You don't understand men. That comes through loud and clear, and it shackles you in discourse. Your view seems to be distorted by a feminist prism and you don't seem inclined to apply any critical thought to your own reactions. It's a pity but there's nothing I can do to make you think.


Again, we disagree. Feel free to keep up with the critical jabs if it continues to make you feel superior though.


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## lifeistooshort (Mar 17, 2013)

Well Kaboom, since we women can't offer advice because we've not had long term romantic relationships with women, why don't you narrow down your pool of acceptable advice givers to men that have actually had successful long term relationships? Seems to me that you could get bad advice from men with failed marriages. Then at least your logic would be consistent.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## talin (Apr 25, 2012)

Nucking Futs said:


> You don't understand men. That comes through loud and clear, and it shackles you in discourse. Your view seems to be distorted by a feminist prism and you don't seem inclined to apply any critical thought to your own reactions. It's a pity but there's nothing I can do to make you think.


You don't understand women.

How do your relationships go in general? Happy, satisfied, fulfilling, you both go to bed feeling good about one another- or is there a lot of conflict- with you constantly trying to set her straight because her thinking is so distorted and without critical thought and anything else you seem to think is so important to proper communication?

I think I already know the answer but I'm working a hunch.


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## Nucking Futs (Apr 8, 2013)

TCSRedhead said:


> Again, we disagree. Feel free to keep up with the critical jabs if it continues to make you feel superior though.


THATS not what makes me feel superior.

Seriously though, if you read through my posts on this thread I never said I agreed with Kaboom wanting to restrict it. I think it's pretty silly myself. I just don't think it's something he should be attacked for.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

Nucking Futs said:


> I just don't think it's something he should be attacked for.


Who was attacked?!?


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## TCSRedhead (Oct 17, 2012)

Hope1964 said:


> Who was attacked?!?


Well, to be honest, the poster you're responding to clearly has a username indicating his cheese may have slipped his cracker. 

So, his perception is skewed as is his opinions on many of us.


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## Kaboom (Feb 6, 2013)

TCSRedhead said:


> Well, to be honest, the poster you're responding to clearly has a username indicating his cheese may have slipped his cracker.
> 
> So, his perception is skewed as is his opinions on many of us.


and you accuse me of being assumptive? pot meet kettle.


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## SomedayDig (Jul 17, 2012)




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## TCSRedhead (Oct 17, 2012)

Kaboom said:


> and you accuse me of being assumptive? pot meet kettle.


Who's being assumptive? His username is pretty darned self explanatory, no?

Or were you assuming I spoke of you?


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## Kaboom (Feb 6, 2013)

Ok people.. this is seriously getting stupid.

I have no idea why all the women, and a few men, are making such a big deal out of this. 

If I was asking "how does it feel when your husband leaves you for a 18 year old cheerleader".. do you think a man would have any inclination as to exactly how it feels? Sure, he might understand losing his wife to an 18 year old high school football star. But the dynamic is different.

I was merely trying to ask the guys at which point do they just give up on trying to fix it and walk away. I don't understand how so many of you felt that my looking for a mans opinion somehow discounted the opinions of all women on all topics. I never said any woman's opinion wasn't valid, as nearly all of you have suggested. I only said that I didn't want to entertain a womans opinion on this particular subject.

I really don't understand whats so ****ing hard to understand about it. Seriously, get over yourselves. Nucking Futs took the time to explain it rather eloquently, and now you are taking him to task.. 

Stop nailing yourselves to the cross trying to condemn me. Like I said- look in the mirror, there's your problem.

Hope - you are not a target in this response- although you disagreed with my wish, you eventually agreed to honor it, and for that I thank you.


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## Kaboom (Feb 6, 2013)

TCSRedhead said:


> Who's being assumptive? His username is pretty darned self explanatory, no?
> 
> Or were you assuming I spoke of you?


His name is a play on words made popular by a movie about 5 years ago. It's called humor. The fact that you didn't know or can't comprehend that kind of explains things.


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## TCSRedhead (Oct 17, 2012)

Kaboom said:


> His name is a play on words made popular by a movie about 5 years ago. It's called humor. The fact that you didn't know or can't comprehend that kind of explains things.


I'll use small words and emoticons to respond to ensure you understand meaning AND tone. 

If I were to use the username 'The Shrew', people would figure it may indicate things about my personality and character, no? :scratchhead:

So, if someone adopts a username indicating they're mentally unwell, it's indicative of their perception of themselves. :smthumbup:

Now, my response to Hope should have included one of these so that you would have picked up on the humorous tone: :rofl:


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## Kaboom (Feb 6, 2013)

TCSRedhead said:


> I'll use small words and emoticons to respond to ensure you understand meaning AND tone.
> 
> If I were to use the username 'The Shrew', people would figure it may indicate things about my personality and character, no? :scratchhead:
> 
> ...


putting in smiley faces and claiming at the end that you are being humorous doesn't automatically make your insults and superiority complex any less notable. But I see you are all about the last word, so have at it.. 
:allhail:


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## Maricha75 (May 8, 2012)

Alright, Kaboom. All kidding aside, the original post did not state, specifically "I only want men's advice". It actually pointed toward something that ANY gender could relate to. Hope had been responding to that, specifically, when she asked about anger management because... she has dealt with similar things in her own marriage. You cut her down in the first sentence saying "I wanted mens advice"... tempering it with "no offense" doesn't make it any less offensive. And that's what got ladies worked up. She wasn't giving a woman's perspective on it. Not in the way you took it. She is a woman, it's true. But her perspective is one of "been there, done that". And you DID dismiss her post as invalid... because she is a woman. 

Anyway, hope you get things figured out with your wife. I really do.


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## Kaboom (Feb 6, 2013)

Maricha75 said:


> Alright, Kaboom. All kidding aside, the original post did not state, specifically "I only want men's advice". It actually pointed toward something that ANY gender could relate to. Hope had been responding to that, specifically, when she asked about anger management because... she has dealt with similar things in her own marriage. You cut her down in the first sentence saying "I wanted mens advice"... tempering it with "no offense" doesn't make it any less offensive. And that's what got ladies worked up. She wasn't giving a woman's perspective on it. Not in the way you took it. She is a woman, it's true. But her perspective is one of "been there, done that". And you DID dismiss her post as invalid... because she is a woman.
> 
> Anyway, hope you get things figured out with your wife. I really do.


And I did apologize to hope for that, and further clarified my original questions and what kind of input I was looking for.

With my wife, I think my decision is made. Keeping it simple- I don't deserve what I'm getting. I've treated her very well and all I get in return is resentment and disrespect. It will never stop, I know that now. It will only get worse, and damned if I'm going to live like this another 12 years. She crossed the line for the last time, and now she must learn the lesson that you reap what you sew. Sounds harsh, but I've been hardened for years by her. I'm a victim, not the opposite.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

Kaboom said:


> you reap what you sew


Sow. Not sew. Just sayin.

*ducking back out*


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## talin (Apr 25, 2012)

Kaboom said:


> I've treated her very well and all I get in return is resentment and disrespect. It will never stop, I know that now. It will only get worse, and damned if I'm going to live like this another 12 years


Nice guys finish last.

Get tough.

Or the next guy will.


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## Maricha75 (May 8, 2012)

FWIW, K, I wouldn't put up with that attitude either...


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## Mr Blunt (Jul 18, 2012)

> If not serving her papers, how can I stop this behavior outside of leaving? Threats of non-tolerance apparently don't work.



*Make a plan to leave*. I am not saying divorce but I would suggest that you leave for a period of time with no contact at all. According to your posts this woman has had all kinds of help for a long period and still does the things that you hate.

*No more therapy, no more talks, no more mediations, etc. ACTIONS ONLY!*

Just make your plan and pack up and leave and do not let her know where you are. *This time may give you both time to realize what you want, what is important, and what you are willing to do to change the situation*. You can contact her when you are ready with your decision.

You may what to leave her a note without condemning her; just tell her why you are gone and what ACTIONS (not words) will have to occur before you make a final decision.


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## Kaboom (Feb 6, 2013)

Well mr blunt, I do appreciate the ideal of just disappearing, but we have a kid, which complicates everything. If I disappeared with the kid, I'm pretty sure there would be an amber alert in the news that evening lol. I gotta take this one head-on and face the ugliest parts. And yes, I'm taking our child- I firmly believe my wife is incapable of taking care of the child, and may actually harm the kid because of me (in her eyes). This is a large reason I've staved off leaving for so long. In fact, it's the whole reason.


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## ecotime47 (Apr 3, 2013)

Yeah dude. Having a kid in the picture definitely changes perspective. Its been several days since your original post. What has interaction been like between the two of you? Did you bring up the facebook post?


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## Kaboom (Feb 6, 2013)

ecotime47 said:


> Yeah dude. Having a kid in the picture definitely changes perspective. Its been several days since your original post. What has interaction been like between the two of you? Did you bring up the facebook post?


well originally I had made up with her before realizing the FB post was there, so since then, things have been in limbo. She's been on really good behavior since the fight, but that's the sop for her, things will go ok for a week or two, them bam, it starts all over. A bit of a revolving door. Oh, and I did bring it up and she removed it immediately, but didn't apologize for it.

For the record, most threats I ever made, for lack of a better word, have been followed up on.. this is one of a very select few that I didn't deliver as promised, but the enormity of it certainly makes it a worthy of pause. I can always act tomorrow.


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## Mr Blunt (Jul 18, 2012)

[


> COLOR="Green"]Make a plan to leave. I am not saying divorce but I would suggest that you leave for a period of time with no contact at all. According to your posts this woman has had all kinds of help for a long period and still does the things that you hate.
> 
> *No more therapy, no more talks, no more mediations, etc. ACTIONS ONLY!*
> Just make your plan and pack up and leave and do not let her know where you are. This time may give you both time to realize what you want, what is important, and what you are willing to do to change the situation. You can contact her when you are ready with your decision.
> ...



Are you not the child’s father? They do not put out an Amber Alert when a father takes their child to a different residence do they?

IF you feel that your wife will harm the child then get as much evidence as you can about that during your planning period. *If this woman is what you say she is then you should be able to get good court evidence that would give you plenty of legal grounds to protect the child and separate with the child from her.*

You have years of trying the counseling, medications, etc; now is the time for actions on your part to show her that she has a choice; she can change or suffer the consequences. You are going to have to have the backbone to take a strong stance.

From what you have written you will not be able to stand up to this abuse fro much longer. The marriage relationship is deteriorating and you may have to take drastic actions in order to break the cycle.


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