# Should I trust him?



## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

I'll try to make this short. My husband of 15 years works in the hospital and a nurse, X, had been texting him for several months.


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

Last night my H said nurse X rarely calls the office, maybe once in two months. This morning the staff told me otherwise,


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

You need this book

Dr. Shirley Glass - NOT "Just Friends"

Your husband is lying to you about his relationship with this woman. Whether it's gone farther than just talking to her only they know, but it needs to stop now. She is NOT a friend of the marriage.


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## Flygirl (Apr 9, 2013)

Look back a few months into his cell phone records to see how much they were really texting and talking before you caught on. I'm having a similar situation in my marriage. It went on for 8 mths right under my nose because he had her listed under a different contact name. I downloaded a program and hooked his phone up to it so I could get his deleted texts. Trust your instinct.


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## EnjoliWoman (Jul 2, 2012)

But the more you confront him, the more he's going to hide it whether there is more to it or not. So chill. Trust him but check the phone records. It may just be friendly workplace banter.


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## Goldmember357 (Jan 31, 2012)

Yeah this is not good, she is clearly into him hence her peristance at talking to him. Not only that but he is lying to you, he has no right to get angry at HIS WIFE over this especially when you are concerned. Him getting defensive and angry just proves he cares way too much about her and has something to hide. 

Hopefully its nothing serious, but from how it sounds this woman definitely seems into your husband and he allowing this to happen. You should investigate more and try and talk with people at his work and ask them about how they act.


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

Call it woman's intuition but I felt him slipping away. He made comments about her thin body. When someone mentioned her name he lit up like a Christmas tree.


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

Goldmember357 said:


> Yeah this is not good, she is clearly into him hence her peristance at talking to him. Not only that but he is lying to you, he has no right to get angry at HIS WIFE over this especially when you are concerned. Him getting defensive and angry just proves he cares way too much about her and has something to hide.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

sosotired said:


> Goldmember357 said:
> 
> 
> > Yeah this is not good, she is clearly into him hence her peristance at talking to him. Not only that but he is lying to you, he has no right to get angry at HIS WIFE over this especially when you are concerned. Him getting defensive and angry just proves he cares way too much about her and has something to hide.
> ...


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## A Bit Much (Sep 14, 2011)

sosotired said:


> Goldmember357 said:
> 
> 
> > Yeah this is not good, she is clearly into him hence her peristance at talking to him. Not only that but he is lying to you, he has no right to get angry at HIS WIFE over this especially when you are concerned. Him getting defensive and angry just proves he cares way too much about her and has something to hide.
> ...


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

sosotired said:


> Everytime I think about how sneaky she is and what she is trying to do I become furious. Feel like telling her to stay away from our family and get out of our lives.
> 
> Should I?


 You're targeting the wrong person. Your HUSBAND is the problem here. In my experience, you have a slim window of opportunity to stop this before it becomes a PA. Tell him if you find one more instance of contact, he'll be getting legal separation papers and you'll be getting 75% of his money.


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## Trying2figureitout (Feb 3, 2011)

turnera said:


> You're targeting the wrong person. Your HUSBAND is the problem here. In my experience, you have a slim window of opportunity to stop this before it becomes a PA. Tell him if you find one more instance of contact, he'll be getting legal separation papers and you'll be getting 75% of his money.


Not if she lives in certain states. No fault divorce.


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## justonelife (Jul 29, 2010)

Maybe I'm misreading something but it sounds like the only contact in the last 5-6 months was 2 phone calls in which a nurse was calling a doctor about a patient. Did I miss something? 

I don't want to discount your feelings. I believe in women's intuition and I think you know your spouse best. But I'm just wondering what else you are asking of your H? It doesn't sound like he has any contact with her outside of work and you can't just demand that he never speak to a co-worker.

Now if she texts or calls for personal reasons, that definitely needs to stop. But it doesn't sound like that is happening anymore, is it?


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Trying2figureitout said:


> Not if she lives in certain states. No fault divorce.


 By the time she gets through with child custody and possibly spousal support, she will.


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

Hope1964 said:


> sosotired said:
> 
> 
> > Why don't you do some snooping to find out whether it's more than chatter first?? And if it is, the person to tell to get the eff out is your husband, not her.
> ...


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

justonelife said:


> Maybe I'm misreading something but it sounds like the only contact in the last 5-6 months was 2 phone calls in which a nurse was calling a doctor about a patient. Did I miss something?
> 
> I don't want to discount your feelings. I believe in women's intuition and I think you know your spouse best. But I'm just wondering what else you are asking of your H? It doesn't sound like he has any contact with her outside of work and you can't just demand that he never speak to a co-worker.
> 
> Now if she texts or calls for personal reasons, that definitely needs to stop. But it doesn't sound like that is happening anymore, is it?


Based on older texts, they used to meet up and talk most every day on the nurse's floor, call and text each other. He was into her, inviting her to his kids games, etc. After I confronted him, he stopped contact for several months. I honestly believe he was trying to work at our marriage. However, when she started giving him the cold shoulder, he began flirting with her. I confronted him again, but had no way to know what was happening next
because they stopped texting. 

Although H is better, more attention to our marriage, I got the feeling some days he was really excited to leave for work. It was one of those days when I listened in to their call (at start of thread) and she said, " I know you said you were coming up later today but..." He must have told her the day before he'd be there.

Just found out she calls office 2-3 times a week but the other nurses never call. One of his staff said she feels bad because she sees what this woman is doing.. trying everything to get closer to him. Why doesn't she care that we are a family? She has her own family.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Why aren't you focusing on the REAL problem? Your HUSBAND.


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

turnera said:


> Why aren't you focusing on the REAL problem? Your HUSBAND.


A bit more history. She has given him gifts before and once said one gift to him would be herself. It seems they were close to an EA. If it's true what they say, then to break the cycle of an affair the two should be separated. That can't happen if she is always after him.

Not sure how I can work on my husband. He stays away for a while when I am mad, but with time, they seem to get chummy again.

I've tried discussing with him and he says, he does not care who flirts with me at work. Not sure what he means?? I explained I care about protecting our relationship. He just repeated it again and we did not speak for the rest of the night.

I've told him to just be honest and I would rather know the truth. He doesn't say anything. Other times he says we can be so happy together.

I get the feeling he wants to stay married but be able to flirt and have close friends of the opposite sex as he pleases.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

You don't 'work' on your husband. 

You make it clear if he has ANY contact with her again, he will be living out on the street.

How can you expect him to respect you if you won't respect yourself?


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## justonelife (Jul 29, 2010)

> I've tried discussing with him and he says, he does not care who flirts with me at work.


This is either a lie or he has no respect for your marriage. OF COURSE it would bother him if some guy from work was texting you all the time. If it really doesn't bother him, you guys have big problems.

You have to set up boundaries for your marriage and expect that both of you will stick to those boundaries. Just make it clear that this is the type of marriage you want and expect and anything else is not acceptable to you.


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

turnera said:


> You don't 'work' on your husband.
> 
> You make it clear if he has ANY contact with her again, he will be living out on the street.
> 
> How can you expect him to respect you if you won't respect yourself?


Thanks. I did it. Told him cant take it anymore. If he talks to her again that's it


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

Just make sure it's not an idle threat. You will lose all credibility otherwise.


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

Openminded said:


> Just make sure it's not an idle threat. You will lose all credibility otherwise.


I will do my best to stick to it. But their relationship is now harder to track. I think she stopped texting because I caught on. Now she calls him directly at the office and when they hang out on the nurse's floor, I'd never know. The other problem is that she has a way of being assigned to all of his patients. 

Should I involve HR? I wouldn't think administration promotes employees texting at work nor having time spent away from patient's for a personal pursuit. The prior call logs and personal texts were often during working hours. A conscientious nurse once told me, 'the good ones do not like the 'texters' .. there is so much work and we appreciate each other's help if someone is available.'

If I involve HR will she have a personal vendetta and make things difficult for my husband?.... I guess the question is, is it better or worse for patient care to inform HR?


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

I think your best thing right now is to ask the other nurses who've helped you to help you keep an eye out. If they like you, they'll be better than any monitor.


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## mablenc (Feb 26, 2013)

sosotired said:


> I will do my best to stick to it. But their relationship is now harder to track. I think she stopped texting because I caught on. Now she calls him directly at the office and when they hang out on the nurse's floor, I'd never know. The other problem is that she has a way of being assigned to all of his patients.
> 
> Should I involve HR? I wouldn't think administration promotes employees texting at work nor having time spent away from patient's for a personal pursuit. The prior call logs and personal texts were often during working hours. A conscientious nurse once told me, 'the good ones do not like the 'texters' .. there is so much work and we appreciate each other's help if someone is available.'
> 
> If I involve HR will she have a personal vendetta and make things difficult for my husband?.... I guess the question is, is it better or worse for patient care to inform HR?


As an HR person myself. I can say they will nip the inappropriate behavior that can mean terminating one or both of them. But it's better for your husband to get back on track before he is caught by someone in the company. He can get terminated and have a hard time finding another job .
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## RClawson (Sep 19, 2011)

You have set a boundary. Stick to it and that means FILE. You have to launch the first mortar to get his attention and then you will truly know where you stand. Get a consultation and find out where you would stand. Knowledge it still power you know.


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

turnera said:


> I think your best thing right now is to ask the other nurses who've helped you to help you keep an eye out. If they like you, they'll be better than any monitor.




This part is confusing. When nurse X called his office, anyone of five people could have answered the phone, and *A* answers less frequently.


. Think now if *A* answers the phone, nurse X will not leave any messages. 

So I like your advice but now feel I've ruined that monitoring channel.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Hon, cheaters LIE. And lie WELL.


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

mablenc said:


> As an HR person myself. I can say they will nip the inappropriate behavior that can mean terminating one or both of them.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Thanks for your expertise. My H is not employed by the hospital so don't know if that might change your recommendation. She has been employed there 15-20 years. 

I would just say texting has been going on frequently during work hours and it is not fair to the patients. Told him HR is confidential but he said it never is. ..'word gets out and its just the two of us who get a bad name.. we would have a lot to lose.' If fact he would be so upset that the two of us may no longer be together.


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

RClawson said:


> You have set a boundary. Stick to it and that means FILE. You have to launch the first mortar to get his attention and then you will truly know where you stand. Get a consultation and find out where you would stand. Knowledge it still power you know.


By FILE do you mean for divorce or to HR?


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

sosotired said:


> Also just found out my H is adamently opposed to my talking to HR. He says I will look like the jealous wife and things will be hard on him.. his reputation may be ruined.


Gee, color me surprised.

sosotired, you are being GASLIGHTED. Look it up. Your husband is a CHEATER and he is manipulating you so he can continue to EAT CAKE.

Wake up! Get furious! Call the damn hospital and put a stop to this. 

Things will be hard on him? Guess he should have thought of that before he stuck his wick where it doesn't belong, huh?


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

sosotired said:


> we would have a lot to lose.' If fact he would be so upset that the two of us may no longer be together.


 More gaslighting. Oh, no, he may LEAVE you if you dare call HR! Not THAT!

Why do you think he is pushing you SO HARD about this?

Because it's the ONE thing he doesn't want, the ONE thing that will make him stop screwing two women.

Why aren't you mad as hell at YOUR HUSBAND? Show some fire, ok? The ONLY way you are going to KEEP him is for you to stop all this - NOW. He has to be SCARED of YOU.


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

turnera said:


> Hon, cheaters LIE. And lie WELL.


Then what do you recommend? I love my husband. I love our family. But I have no way of knowing what is going on anymore. 

After I mentioned going to HR, now H, who stopped MC .. too busy, not at fault, his wife, "is the one who has the problem" wants to go back for one time advice on this HR issue. 

Only thing is our MC is not what I expected. For example I told MC a second incident. Someone told me she thought a technician and my husband were having an affair. I questioned and he denied it. H says he is friends with her husband too. Then H told me a conversation where he joked with this couple - saying, "if you are not careful, someone is going to sweep her off her feet." Seemed to me he rather liked her. ..I asked if we all go out together. I'd like to meet them too. He said no.

Our MC agreed with him saying these are not the type of people your H wants to hang out with on the weekend. I said why can't we all go out just once? MC said he has friendly (but same sex) colleagues at work, but doesn't want to go out with them. 

Maybe the MC is right but I can't get the issues resolved w/ him. He asked me if my husband treated me better.. more special, would my H's other relationships not bother me anymore??? 

Just found a recommended pastor for MC. I'll ask my H if we can go there instead to discuss the HR issue.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Don't use a pastor for MC. Search for one who is experienced in infidelity. But NONE of that will matter as long as you ALLOW him to cheat. You are being naive. If you don't believe me, read up in Surviving Infidelity to find all the women like you who 'trusted' their cheating husband when he denied cheating.

What do I recommend? I recommend you FIGHT for your marriage instead of NEGOTIATING for your marriage. KNOW that he is cheating on you with at LEAST one woman and likely more. DEMAND that he give you access to all his phone/computer access so you can prove he no longer contacts any other woman - or else you are kicking him out.

I'm sorry, but you are married to a man who believes it's his right and duty to get women on the side. As long as you keep pretending you know who he is, you will continue to be his woman on the side while he pursues the 'fun' ones at work.


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

turnera said:


> More gaslighting. Oh, no, he may LEAVE you if you dare call HR! Not THAT!
> 
> Why do you think he is pushing you SO HARD about this?
> 
> ...


Based on the texts it was an EA. Don't believe it was Physical but certainly had the potential. He honestly did pull away , but somehow they are back as friends ..although he denies they are. I do believe nurse X may make this hard on him if I reveal. Based on what I've heard, they'd blame a doctor over a nurse even if the doctor is in the right. 

I trust your opinion Turnera, but this could be a huge mess.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Is living with a full-time cheater for the rest of your life less of a mess?

tired, this is your ONE CHANCE to get it right. If you don't stop this now, you are GIVING HIM PERMISSION TO CHEAT. You are telling him you want to stay married to him so badly that you will overlook everything. Are you really that desperate?

I have no agenda. But I've been advising people for more than 10 years. I know human nature. I know men. I know doctors. He will not stop cheating on you if you don't stand firm and stop acting like the doubting, desperate housewife.

He needs to KNOW that you WILL leave him if he doesn't stop. Period.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

A thousand times, everything turnera has said.

Have you looked up the term gaslighting? Read the newbie link? Have you internalized yet the your husband is playing with your head?


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

turnera said:


> Don't use a pastor for MC. Search for one who is experienced in infidelity. But NONE of that will matter as long as you ALLOW him to cheat. You are being naive. If you don't believe me, read up in Surviving Infidelity to find all the women like you who 'trusted' their cheating husband when he denied cheating.
> 
> What do I recommend? I recommend you FIGHT for your marriage instead of NEGOTIATING for your marriage. KNOW that he is cheating on you with at LEAST one woman and likely more. DEMAND that he give you access to all his phone/computer access so you can prove he no longer contacts any other woman - or else you are kicking him out.


I can ask for all his info but who is to say a cheater will give all the pertinent ones? 

The pastor is highly recommended by someone whose husband had a PA 18 yrs. ago. They now communicate with each other at work 3x a day and no other events occurred. Hope he works...

H agreed to see him tonight. But H is so mad at me he will not answer my call.. only texts.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Good. LET him be mad. That is him trying to gaslight you SOME MORE. He's trying to cow you back into submission. 

DON'T LET HIM.


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## mablenc (Feb 26, 2013)

sosotired said:


> Thanks for your expertise. My H is not employed by the hospital so don't know if that might change your recommendation. She has been employed there 15-20 years.
> 
> Also just found out my H is adamently opposed to my talking to HR. He says I will look like the jealous wife and things will be hard on him.. his reputation may be ruined.
> 
> I would just say texting has been going on frequently during work hours and it is not fair to the patients. Told him HR is confidential but he said it never is. ..'word gets out and its just the two of us who get a bad name.. we would have a lot to lose.' If fact he would be so upset that the two of us may no longer be together.




We are confidential unless we have something to report to the police or on case of a law suit. The interesting thing is why is he so worried about her? You can also anonymously send a letter to HR stating that Nurse flirt is using company time to flirt with customer or whomever or acts unprofessional. If the other nurses are gossiping it could have been them. If your husband is so conserned about his reputation then he needs to act professionally. He can also draft a letter to nurse flirt asking her to stop contacting him for non related issues and give a copy to HR or tell HR she is crossing the professional boundaries. There are many solutions but I don't think he wants to solve this "problem"
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

Hope1964 said:


> A thousand times, everything turnera has said.
> 
> Have you looked up the term gaslighting? Read the newbie link? Have you internalized yet the your husband is playing with your head?


Just looked up gas-lighting. It is True. I see he does it. 

Problem is...

1. Since I first brought to his attention sev. months back, he is trying. Every night wants to sit with me, take walks etc.

2. Because of #1 , I know he is trying. He may just be having difficulty that he is afraid to reveal to me. 

3. H can be very vindictive when it comes to his children. I've experienced some of this when I felt him slipping away from me - at the peak of the EA. If the teenager talked back to me, instead of H supporting wife, H would laugh as if to encourage teen's behavior. 

Maybe I'll wait one more day and see what the pastor has to say.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

"Do, or do not. There is no try"

You're just making excuses for him. Stop.


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## anotherguy (Dec 14, 2011)

Problem with this site... is that it is a hospital ward. Its a collection of relationship trainwecks and people here are very, very good at pointing out the potential pitfalls and problems. This is not good or bad - but I believe that on the whole there is a certain prism through which this sort of post is viewed and you need to recognize it. I bet you would be totally unsurprised by who in this thread has been cheated on.

But - to undermine my own comment - looks like there is something going on based on what you are saying. I know that working long hours with a close knit team such as exists in a hospital setting can create the conditions for unexpected closeness between people. Getting 'HR' involved opens up all sorts of questions about what people are going to think and turning it into a 'big deal' even if there is nothing there and yes people will assume the worst and yes... also you might expose something that IS there. It is sort of no win situation if you are wrong right? 

You dont trust him - so you need to do whatever you need to get that trust back. He should see that too.

If I ever had to do counseling - and I never have... I would seriously look for a male/female team. Also - unless the pastor came very highly recommended - I personally would avoid the priest/pastor unless you feel they have very good marriage conseling credentials, proper training and solid experience. You may feel very differently.

random, perhaps unhelpful thoughts...


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## mablenc (Feb 26, 2013)

" Getting 'HR' involved opens up all sorts of questions about what people are going to think and turning it into a 'big deal' even if there is nothing there and yes people will assume the worst and yes... also you might expose something that IS there. It is sort of no win situation if you are wrong rght?"


I'm my experience if its not a big deal its not, and if it is you handle it discreetly, make a big deal and it can cost the company millions in law suits. But, this is my experience not saying all HR practice is the same but, if they had some good trainig they will be discreet and not aplify the problem.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

But - to undermine my own comment - looks like there is something going on based on what you are saying. I know that working long hours with a close knit team such as exists in a hospital setting can create the conditions for unexpected closeness between people. Getting 'HR' involved opens up all sorts of questions about what people are going to think and turning it into a 'big deal' even if there is nothing there and yes people will assume the worst and yes... also you might expose something that IS there. It is sort of no win situation if you are wrong right? 

You dont trust him - so you need to do whatever you need to get that trust back. He should see that too.

If I ever had to do counseling - and I never have... I would seriously look for a male/female team. Also - unless the pastor came very highly recommended - I personally would avoid the priest/pastor unless you feel they have very good marriage conseling credentials, proper training and solid experience. You may feel very differently.

random, perhaps unhelpful thoughts...[/QUOTE]

Pastor said if I go alone, he invites his wife. Maybe I should ask she attend even if H comes.

Have tried two other MCs and their level is not where website MCs are based on forum contents... seems like advice columns are based on much more experience. I've tried to contact a few for skype counseling but they don't practice out of their state.


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

mablenc said:


> " Getting 'HR' involved opens up all sorts of questions about what people are going to think and turning it into a 'big deal' even if there is nothing there and yes people will assume the worst and yes... also you might expose something that IS there. It is sort of no win situation if you are wrong rght?"
> 
> 
> I'm my experience if its not a big deal its not, and if it is you handle it discreetly, make a big deal and it can cost the company millions in law suits. But, this is my experience not saying all HR practice is the same but, if they had some good trainig they will be discreet and not aplify the problem.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Spoke anonymously to HR. Said it would be confidential and if the involved party started blabbing about it , she would be fired...*Don't know if they would follow through though..* Maybe nurse X will assume complete innocence, blame it all on H, or say she was only joking. Either way, read some of the texts to HR person and HR felt - nurse X was throwing herself at H, but H did not stop it either.

What I have read though is that the WS should eliminate all contact with the AP. I gave him the chance to do on his own. He didn't always stick to it - said he was only human. He is not leaving. Neither is she. Unless the pastor comes up with something helping him see the light, seems HR is all that is left.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

If NC is broken, that should be a dealbreaker. He can get another job if that's what it takes. He's either committed to the marriage or he isn't - he doesn't get to choose both.


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## mablenc (Feb 26, 2013)

sosotired said:


> Spoke anonymously to HR. Said it would be confidential and if the involved party started blabbing about it , she would be fired...*Don't know if they would follow through though..* Maybe nurse X will assume complete innocence, blame it all on H, or say she was only joking. Either way, read some of the texts to HR person and HR felt - nurse X was throwing herself at H, but H did not stop it either.
> 
> What I have read though is that the WS should eliminate all contact with the AP. I gave him the chance to do on his own. He didn't always stick to it - said he was only human. He is not leaving. Neither is she. Unless the pastor comes up with something helping him see the light, seems HR is all that is left.


Good for you, she cant fake innocence if she corresponded to text and returned calls, trust me Im sure he's not the first guy she's been into at work. Trust me if the HR person has been around the block, you seen and heard all the excuses. In the field you have to become a good people reader.


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

mablenc said:


> We are confidential unless we have something to report to the police or on case of a law suit. The interesting thing is why is he so worried about her? You can also anonymously send a letter to HR stating that Nurse flirt is using company time to flirt with customer or whomever or acts unprofessional. If the other nurses are gossiping it could have been them. If your husband is so conserned about his reputation then he needs to act professionally. He can also draft a letter to nurse flirt asking her to stop contacting him for non related issues and give a copy to HR or tell HR she is crossing the professional boundaries. There are many solutions but I don't think he wants to solve this "problem"
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Why don't you think he wants to solve?

Is it because of nurse X or referrals. H has said being nice to others /nurses/staff rather than nasty helps referrals. I don't disagree but feel there still need boundaries. Also told H our marriage is more important.

Of your recommendations above, which would you choose based on what you know?


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

He's a cheater, with a wife at home who won't leave him. Why WOULD he want to stop doing the one thing he gets off on? He has no consequences. All he has to do is gaslight and bully you, and you shut up and let him hit on as many women as he wants.

Until you don't.

Good for you, for going to HR. 

If he gets called in by them, expect him to be mad. Just listen, then shrug and say 'I am your wife. I expected you to act like a married man. You didn't. So I acted to protect my marriage. If you don't like it, you're free to leave.' That will scare the crap out of him, like nothing else.


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## mablenc (Feb 26, 2013)

sosotired said:


> Why don't you think he wants to solve?
> 
> Is it because of nurse X or referrals. H has said being nice to others /nurses/staff rather than nasty helps referrals. I don't disagree but feel there still need boundaries. Also told H our marriage is more important.
> 
> Of your recommendations above, which would you choose based on what you know?


I say he doesn't want to solve it because a person who is remorseful will do anything and everything his spouse asks of him to save the marriage. including the referrals, he can advertise and give his patients prizes for referrals, and if he is a good dr he doesn't need them because his patients will rave about him. All he seems to do is give you reasons why he shouldn't go to HR or stop contact with her. Ideally he would quit and change jobs. 

I would personally go the route of contacting HR with your concerns, thats part of our job. I know its scary and I suggested to do it anonymous for your sake so that you didn't have to worry about the "what ifs".


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## mablenc (Feb 26, 2013)

By the way I have worked in the hospital environment, and DR and nurse drama is very common.

Also, she represents the company not him, they will be going after her as she is a liability.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

sosotired said:


> H has said being nice to others /nurses/staff rather than nasty helps referrals.


More gaslighting.


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

turnera said:


> He's a cheater, with a wife at home who won't leave him. Why WOULD he want to stop doing the one thing he gets off on? He has no consequences. All he has to do is gaslight and bully you, and you shut up and let him hit on as many women as he wants.
> 
> Until you don't.
> 
> ...


Yes. I contacted HR but for now it is 'anonymous. She will monitor staff in general. Wants me to get back to her after I talk w/H to see if this will be a written complaint.


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

mablenc said:


> I say he doesn't want to solve it because a person who is remorseful will do anything and everything his spouse asks of him to save the marriage. including the referrals, he can advertise and give his patients prizes for referrals, and if he is a good dr he doesn't need them because his patients will rave about him. All he seems to do is give you reasons why he shouldn't go to HR or stop contact with her. Ideally he would quit and change jobs.
> 
> I would personally go the route of contacting HR with your concerns, thats part of our job. I know its scary and I suggested to do it anonymous for your sake so that you didn't have to worry about the "what ifs".


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## mablenc (Feb 26, 2013)

So they know its her and not " a nurse" did they say he need to file the compliant? Also, if they know its her as soon as they hanged up the phone with you, they started looking at her file and are working on it. We don't wait, it's better to have paperwork but not a necessity. As of now I'm sure they have her file and if then phone is company provided they are looking at the the text and call details.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## mablenc (Feb 26, 2013)

But again, she is not your main problem, your husband crossing boundaries with her is. You both need to seek MC.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

mablenc said:


> But again, she is not your main problem, your husband crossing boundaries with her is.


:iagree: :iagree: :iagree: 

Quit letting him get away with this.


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

mablenc said:


> So they know its her and not " a nurse" did they say he need to file the compliant? Also, if they know its her as soon as they hanged up the phone with you, they started looking at her file and are working on it. We don't wait, it's better to have paperwork but not a necessity. As of now I'm sure they have her file and if then phone is company provided they are looking at the the text and call details.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


It was her personal phone. Since then I believe she has a new number. They can access the texts through me if needed.


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

mablenc said:


> But again, she is not your main problem, your husband crossing boundaries with her is. You both need to seek MC.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Met with MC. I am religious so his wanting us to live as H and W like the Bible says is ok with me... 'If a man even looks at a woman lustfully it is committing adultery in his heart ..." Of course this goes both ways... I hope my H and I can grow with this.

BTW, seems to match what most of the faithful spouses already believe on TAM.


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

Hope1964 said:


> :iagree: :iagree: :iagree:
> 
> Quit letting him get away with this.


Discussed this at great length at MC today... It was a horrible yelling match. Next time MC says he is making us listen more. He's having us read a marriage book. I'll let you know if its like NOT JUST FRIENDS.... I could never get my H to read it...hope he will listen to the MC though and read this book.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

I'm proud of you for standing up to him in MC. It just might save your marriage.


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## Sussieq (Apr 6, 2013)

sosotired said:


> Last night my H said nurse X rarely calls the office, maybe once in two months. This morning the staff told me otherwise, she is the only nurse from the hospital that calls and does so about two times a week. The one receptionist said hardly knows nurse X but feels she is strange, always trying to get chummy with her...example saying the two of them should get together and go out to dinner.


What made you get his coworkers involved in your personal affairs? Do you work at the same facility? These people could potentially lose their jobs, in particular the people who were foolish enough to give you information.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Ignore. People are generally good and want to help good people overcome those who aren't. Let them.


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

Sussieq said:


> What made you get his coworkers involved in your personal affairs? Do you work at the same facility? These people could potentially lose their jobs, in particular the people who were foolish enough to give you information.


We had a little history, I've helped her previously...Could tell she wanted to tell me something. 

She is not foolish, she just understands boundaries... rather like to think she has respect for her own and other people's marriages ... I'm not as religious as I 'd like but one quote sticks in my mind as a child attending a wedding, *"Let no man undo what God has joined."*


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

turnera said:


> Ignore. People are generally good and want to help good people overcome those who aren't. Let them.


Agree.


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## Busy Accountant (Mar 15, 2013)

If your H is so committed to your marriage, why isn't he willing to read one little book? Would you read a book if it was important to him?


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## Thebes (Apr 10, 2013)

sosotired said:


> Call it woman's intuition but I felt him slipping away. He made comments about her thin body. When someone mentioned her name he lit up like a Christmas tree.


You had better be snooping, trust your feelings on this.


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

Busy Accountant said:


> If your H is so committed to your marriage, why isn't he willing to read one little book? Would you read a book if it was important to him?


Right. I think he knows this is the last straw. Last night told Pastor he would read the book and follow the guidelines. P told him he needs to change his behavior and we will work on that

H told the Pastor yesterday he will call nurse flirt, tell her the texts were inappropriate and they can no longer be friendly.

Believe there are recommendations for that talk here on TAM. I want to listen in when he talks to her.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Most definitely you have to listen. And if he tells you 'sorry, I already called her,' (and he will), you just say 'oh really? Too bad, you should have waited - now call her again.'


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

Thebes said:


> You had better be snooping, trust your feelings on this.


Yes. That was at the peak of his EA a little over a year ago.

Since then we had a lot of late night discussions.. he said I was controlling .. didn't want him to have friends ..everything I've read on TAM ... and I've exhausted myself with crying... I can't take it anymore. If I have proof of anything new, it is over.

Took a long time to get here but H seems to understand better. H did not argue when P explained H can't flirt like he has been.. it's not professional for either of them. 

You are all right though. If he stops wanting to go to this MC/Pastor I'll know it was just a front.


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

turnera said:


> Most definitely you have to listen. And if he tells you 'sorry, I already called her,' (and he will), you just say 'oh really? Too bad, you should have waited - now call her again.'


O.K.

Maybe should wait til next MC meeting and have him call in front of me and the P.


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

Thebes said:


> You had better be snooping, trust your feelings on this.


Any recommendations? 

If someone goes undercover it must be harder to tract?


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Well, you should have already demanded the passwords to all his electronics by now, and you should be randomly taking them and checking them, whether he wants you to, or not. If he's going to cheat, do NOT make it easy to do so. 

If he drives, buy a good voice-activated recorder and velcro it under his seat in the car; pull it out occasionally and listen to it.

If he has a smart phone, see if you can track where it is online - check it to see if he is always where he says he is. 

If he uses his computer a lot, install a keylogger on it that will email you all his keystrokes.


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## VeryHurt (Mar 11, 2011)

So So Tired:

My advice to you is to listen to Tunera's advice. 

She helped me with a similar problem between my husband and his sec'y a few years ago. Same scenario as yours.

If they know they can walk on you. they will. Trust me.

BTW, I am a RN who spent most of my career in a "hospital setting" and I can tell you that the Doctor-Nurse "relationship" is very real. It's also occurs in an "office setting."

I wonder what type of floor she works on? I was too damn busy and concerned with caring for my patients to carry on with a Doctor.

I wish you the best. VH


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

VeryHurt said:


> So So Tired:
> 
> My advice to you is to listen to Tunera's advice.
> 
> ...


Just have to say, he complains to the MC if I ask too many questions. Somedays I'll ask if he saw nurse flirt. Who was on the floor when rounding? etc. Other times I try not to ask for a 1-2 weeks.

BTW, you are the nurse we hope to have if ever a patient. 

What happened with your marriage?


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

turnera said:


> Well, you should have already demanded the passwords to all his electronics by now, and you should be randomly taking them and checking them, whether he wants you to, or not. If he's going to cheat, do NOT make it easy to do so.
> 
> If he drives, buy a good voice-activated recorder and velcro it under his seat in the car; pull it out occasionally and listen to it.
> 
> ...


We share an online acct. He denies having others.

I'd like to track an android; *does anyone know how?*

Keylogger is against the law in my state.


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## VeryHurt (Mar 11, 2011)

sosotired said:


> Just have to say, he complains to the MC if I ask too many questions. Somedays I'll ask if he saw nurse flirt. Who was on the floor when rounding? etc. Other times I try not to ask for a 1-2 weeks.
> 
> BTW, you are the nurse we hope to have if ever a patient.
> 
> What happened with your marriage?


Good Morning SST ~

I know what you mean. All cheaters go crazy when they are questioned and I have discovered it is because they are still lying/feel guilty OR they know that they make a mistake and don't want to be reminded.

Thank you for the compliment. I was an extremely dedicated, compassionate and empathic nurse and those characterics are the way I am with my husband, son and friends. 

My husband and I are still together. We have been marrried for 30 years. He had two affairs with the same sec'y. One EA four years ago and a PA for months ago. 

Our soon to be 28 year old son gave his father an ultimatum, you pick me or the sec'y. I DID NOT have anything to do with this.

As you know, everyone has their own story and you can ask 20 people for advice and you will get 20 different answers. Only YOU know your story, your husband, your emotiional history, your husband's emotional history etc...

Some people have told me I'm a fool and a doormat, others have said that they are proud that I have tried to keep my family together. My husband had a lousy start with a dysfunctional and unloving Mom and this is a factor to many of his behaviors. He now sees a Psychiatrist once a week, I see a Psychologist once a week and we both see a MC (Pyschologist) once a week.

This overkill of counseling has helped us know ourselves and each other on a whole different level and I believe that after 30 years we are "finally getting it right."

Take Care and Be Strong. 
Follow your heart but also listen to your emotions.
VH


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

SST, do you see the COMMON STRAND in all the advice you are getting? It's called an ultimatum. Telling him you will NOT share him and if he's not ok with that, he's free to leave, and you will help him out the door.

He has NO reason to change unless HE KNOWS HE WILL LOSE YOU.


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

turnera said:


> SST, do you see the COMMON STRAND in all the advice you are getting? It's called an ultimatum. Telling him you will NOT share him and if he's not ok with that, he's free to leave, and you will help him out the door.
> 
> He has NO reason to change unless HE KNOWS HE WILL LOSE YOU.


I believe I am not firm enough... In the beginning, I've told him - I am different than flirt. She is pushy and won't stop til she has what she wants, no matter who she hurts along the way. Told him if he wants her, I can't stop him, he should be happy and don't worry that the truth might hurt me because I'd rather know.

Now I'll be more firm with the ultimatum. 

..But then I ask myself why? Is it worth it? I'd like to be with someone who loves me alone and not two or more at once. 

Why would someone want a spouse and a parmour? ... pick one. It must be confusing. Why promise a lifetime? 

Guess have always expected marriage to be special. Think everyone out there who has a committed partner should consider themselves truly blessed!


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## VeryHurt (Mar 11, 2011)

Dear SST ~

No one expects to have infidelity in their marriage and it seems that any type of affair is not unusual these days. 

I personally don't get it. Maybe it was the way I was raised? Maybe it's my personality? Who knows? But don't beat yourself up over it.

VH


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

To me, it's a simple idea: I'll stay with you forever - as long as I'm the only woman in your life.

If you decide that's not enough, I decide I don't want you.

I told my H when we married 33 years ago, if I ever catch you with another woman, you'll never see me again. I asked him recently why he never cheated, and he cited that one statement.


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## VeryHurt (Mar 11, 2011)

Tunera ~

I wish I knew you 30 years ago !!!!

VH


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

Things seem to go great over the weekend. Monday morning as he was leaving for work I asked him to call me later. ( I previously mentioned it was a good way for us to keep in touch). He said,"call you late for dinner.....didn't you hear that phrase before?" 

Said no and was confused. He left. Don't know why he would joke as he is heading out the door...Maybe I am paranoid.


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## Bluecollar (May 23, 2013)

Being married to a Dr. must suck. Your H is a man, making good money, surrounded by an entire hospital of mostly women nurses.....
Infidelity is common there.


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

Bluecollar said:


> Being married to a Dr. must suck. Your H is a man, making good money, surrounded by an entire hospital of mostly women nurses.....
> 
> Infidelity is common there.


 - Have to agree

There are a lot of things I love about him... His seemingly need for other's attention is not one of them. 

H feels he needs to flirt to grow business. I've told him I'd rather he was less busy. If nurse x only knew the other side...heard she is a gambler... but that doesn't bother him. 

BTW, do know some docs who are faithful and use boundaries.


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

Just can't figure out why sometimes he is so nice and other times it 's the opposite.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Because everything he does, every word, every action, every manipulation, every lie, is done TO BENEFIT HIM. If he's an ass some times, it's to keep you on your toes and apologizing to him.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Or else he just doesn't care about you.


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

turnera said:


> Or else he just doesn't care about you.


Maybe that's it..
He's trying to make it work but having difficulty because his heart is elsewhere or hardened.

Sometimes I wonder if he is waiting , putting things in order first. Have seen him do this in business/work. Though he can't stand working with someone, he's friendly to get what he needs from them.


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## VeryHurt (Mar 11, 2011)

SST ~

You just described a clever manipulator.

Be Careful ~

VH


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

Last night. Took Turnera's advice. It was basically verbatim what T said. Told H, 'I love you and want to be with you forever. If you need other women, this includes going out of your way to meet women 'friends' at work, then I don't want you anymore.'

believe it or not, I think it took me saying that for hIm to understand. Also told him he needs to tell me anytime the interactions if any w nurse thanks Turnera and VH
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Great. But now comes the hard part. The INSTANT you find out he's been flirting again, he needs to come home to HIS SUITCASES PACKED AND ON THE FRONT PORCH.

You can always let him come home later - after a LOT of penance.


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## VeryHurt (Mar 11, 2011)

Good Morning SST and Tunera ~

I agree. 

I had to play hardball, come out of my comfort zone and just tell him that I was no longer a doormat before he realized what he would lose if his continued to contact his ex-sec'y.

In addition, Mike son flipped out and approached him with an ultimatum and that was the icing on the cake: 

I'm going to lose my Wife of 30 years + our Son/only child = My Entire Family.

Sometimes reality hurts.

Be Strong !!!! VH


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## whowouldhavethought (Jun 15, 2013)

sosotired said:


> I will do my best to stick to it. But their relationship is now harder to track. I think she stopped texting because I caught on. Now she calls him directly at the office and when they hang out on the nurse's floor, I'd never know. The other problem is that she has a way of being assigned to all of his patients.
> 
> Should I involve HR? I wouldn't think administration promotes employees texting at work nor having time spent away from patient's for a personal pursuit. The prior call logs and personal texts were often during working hours. A conscientious nurse once told me, 'the good ones do not like the 'texters' .. there is so much work and we appreciate each other's help if someone is available.'
> 
> If I involve HR will she have a personal vendetta and make things difficult for my husband?.... I guess the question is, is it better or worse for patient care to inform HR?


Here is what HR will do in most large companies.

1. Open a file
2. Do some investigation.
3. Bring them in individually.
4. Ask them what is going on.
5. Read them the riot act.
6. Put a warning in their employment file
7. If at all possible, separate them so nurse will have no business reason to talk to husband. That is she will *NO* longer be assigned to his patients.

Now if the investigation show inappropriate conduct, someone may get fired.

There will be no vendetta as the HR will be watching them.

*The beauty of a complaining is that a file has to be opened. Once the file gets opened it has to be closed.*

WWHT


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## Blonde (Jan 7, 2013)

sosotired said:


> Call it woman's intuition but I felt him slipping away. He made comments about her thin body.


Surprised no one has mentioned the 180 yet... (here's the list)

If I was you, I'd get busy with self improvement and self development:


Work out and get fit
New hot wardrobe
New hobbies- I went to nursing school and got an RN, that would be awesome in your situation 
New job
New friends

Make a life so awesome and enjoyable for yourself that you'll thrive with or without him (plus I think it is really hard for a man to trade a wife who is attractive, confident, successful, well loved by many, etc for a crap shoot OW)


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

Blonde said:


> Surprised no one has mentioned the 180 yet... (here's the list)
> 
> If I was you, I'd get busy with self improvement and self development:
> 
> ...


 Unfortunately that is how nurse x and he became friends - she is very outgoing and flirty with everyone. She worked at it and has gotten to be well liked by his friends at the hospital. She's no dummy.

Thanks. Have lost weight because of stress and continued exercise. Job is very good-- only wish I could find a way to visit her nursing floor for an occasional presence... 

I can certainly work on new friends and develop outside hobbies. Thanks for your help!


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Buy some flowers and just visit random patients for a delivery. Let her SEE that you WILL become a presence there. Who is she to stop you? Would send a strong message.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

If you've lost weight, you NEED to go out and get some new, hot clothes.


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## Blonde (Jan 7, 2013)

sosotired said:


> Thanks. Have lost weight because of stress and continued exercise. Job is very good-- only wish I could find a way to visit her nursing floor for an occasional presence...


SST, my husband had affairs.

I will NOT "babysit" him nor will I spend my time obsessing about what he is doing day in and day out. He works at hospitals with mainly women too and he's a nice looking man.

What I did was put him out of my mind and approach my life with gusto to make it fun, interesting, and active for me. (started in earnest @2008)

Then (2010) I drew some lines in the sand over certain behaviors he had that I was not willing to live with and we separated amicably for awhile over that because he refused to give up those habits. That lasted a month till he got his head out of his butt and and decided it's too much to lose. 

Obsessing over him, stressing yourself out over him- it pushes him away IMO. Get on with your own life. Hold him accountable (call HR, put surveillance in place, call the cops if he drives drunk or engages in any other criminal activity that you are aware of). But put those things in place and then put him out of your mind. *Don't *let him rob YOUR peace and joy in life! Carpe Diem.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Blonde said:


> That lasted a month till he got his head out of his butt and and decided it's too much to lose.


THIS is the key to stopping the cheating.


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## Blonde (Jan 7, 2013)

Just wanted to add that H and I always had sexual chemistry so trading me for crap shoot OW, he stands to lose there if the stories on this forum are any indication.

While you are investing in self improvement you don't want to be neglectful in the bedroom. Carpe diem there too. 

ditto Turnera- shopping trip for hot wardrobe *today!*


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## whowouldhavethought (Jun 15, 2013)

I'm telling you. The best way to break them up to go to HR and complain. HR will take care of separating them at the hospital.

WWHT


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

turnera said:


> Buy some flowers and just visit random patients for a delivery. Let her SEE that you WILL become a presence there. Who is she to stop you? Would send a strong message.


OK Thanks. I'll find a way to stop by.


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

whowouldhavethought said:


> I'm telling you. The best way to break them up to go to HR and complain. HR will take care of separating them at the hospital.
> 
> WWHT


I did speak with HR. First anonymously, then when I felt a comfort zone told her the players. HR knows her as nurse x w/o other complaints but noted "she is throwing herself at H."

At this point HR will keep an eye out and inquire about her marriage. If I give ok to reveal, HR will strip some of her duties - like assigning patients - to minimize contact. H does not want to get a bad name for possible fire of a hospital employee. He said he will have his office take messages from her instead of answering himself. Has seen her in the Hospital, says hi no talking and goes about his work on the other side of the floor.


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## VeryHurt (Mar 11, 2011)

Hi SST ~

I see that you are getting stronger. As you know, I am an RN who worked in a hospital many years ago. I don't think you will be able to walk into a hospital with flowers and randomly bring them to someone. 
Was this the advice you received? 
It may seem suspicious and the hallways, lobby and elevators are filled with security cameras.

Take Care ~

VH


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

So he says.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

VH, I suggested that. My bad.


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## VeryHurt (Mar 11, 2011)

turnera said:


> VH, I suggested that. My bad.


Tunera, 

Good idea on your part but it would not fly:

SST would have to get a "pass" at the Reception Desk. 

To get the pass she would need the patient's name and Room #.

If she randomly gave a patient flowers, they would probably say to their Nurse, "Look what a stanger gave me!" 

Nurse thinks it's suspicious and contacts Hospital Security who will view the security tapes.

SST MAY be able to see what shift she works and watch her/him in the Employee Cafeteria during Lunch or Dinner. 

Perhaps her husband makes his patient rounds around OW's shift and they go to the Cafeteria or Coffee Shoppe?

Visitors are generally allowed in the Employee Cafe.

VH


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

That's a shame. My mom used to be a hospital nurse and things were so different then. And then she went to work at a prison!


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## VeryHurt (Mar 11, 2011)

turnera said:


> That's a shame. My mom used to be a hospital nurse and things were so different then. And then she went to work at a prison!


Tunera ~
After 9/11 everything changed. 

Also, there are a lot of nut jobs out there looking to swap a newborn.

Please send me your advice on my new thread.

VH


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

We had a lady here walk up to another lady coming out of the obgyn's office and shoot her, and take her baby! :0

I hear you on the 9/11. I used to work at NASA and we'd have an Open House every year, where we'd volunteer to show people around the place - opened doors in nearly every building. After 9/11, stopped it completely. So sad.

Where is your new thread?


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## VeryHurt (Mar 11, 2011)

turnera said:


> We had a lady here walk up to another lady coming out of the obgyn's office and shoot her, and take her baby! :0
> 
> I hear you on the 9/11. I used to work at NASA and we'd have an Open House every year, where we'd volunteer to show people around the place - opened doors in nearly every building. After 9/11, stopped it completely. So sad.
> 
> Where is your new thread?


I have to retype it. It did not post.


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## Blonde (Jan 7, 2013)

Let me back up to your thread title and answer "Should I trust him?"

OF COURSE you shouldn't trust him!

OTH, you cannot FORCE him to be faithful. That's his choice. And I think you may be sidetracked too much by the surveillance and accountability suggestions. Nothing against surveillance and accountability BTW but put them in place and then put your husband and his activities out of your mind and GET A LIFE- an exciting, fun, rewarding life which does not revolve around him.

Honestly, attempting to FORCE him to behave himself, I'm afraid it will backfire. If he's anything like my H, he'll be like a bucking stallion against anything which feels to him as if you are trying to control/tame him. And he'll do whatever the hell he pleases and everything and everyone in his path will be trampled.

My H goes to church too. Means nothing. Based on my experience I think the churchy ones may be the best pretenders and the most untrustworthy. Church, pastor, wife, vows, NOTHING will bring them under control except their own choice to exercise SELF control.

You are powerless over him. You have power over yourself. New wardrobe time.


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

Blonde said:


> Let me back up to your thread title and answer "Should I trust him?"
> 
> OF COURSE you shouldn't trust him!
> 
> ...


Thanks. H has been better since gave him the lines Turnera recommended... but understand they WS tends to revert to old ways over time. Have to stay on him about being transparent.

Need power over myself.. understand now.

H does not want to meet w/pastor a second time..I'll have to force it. Kind of like this pastor as he gave example of parishioner hitting on him, batting her eyes.... he called his wife over to sit by his side. Pastor is against flirty behavior explains how boundaries are important for his and H's positions.


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

VeryHurt said:


> Tunera,
> 
> Good idea on your part but it would not fly:
> 
> ...


I have worked in that hospital before and some staff know me. I can round w/ H if he lets me on occasion. 

*Big Question. * If I see her I want to tell her to get out of our life but probably not the best choice. *What do I say to her*? Try to talk about her family? How about I Tell her my summer is going well.. our family is having fun spending time together then ask if she has any vacation plans with her husband? Give her the hint that way?


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Women KNOW. Especially if they've been hitting on your husband. I'd just walk up and say 'stay away from us.'


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## Blonde (Jan 7, 2013)

sosotired said:


> Thanks. H has been better since gave him the lines Turnera recommended... but understand they WS tends to revert to old ways over time. Have to stay on him about being transparent.
> 
> Need power over myself.. understand now.
> 
> H does not want to meet w/pastor a second time..I'll have to force it. Kind of like this pastor as he gave example of parishioner hitting on him, batting her eyes.... he called his wife over to sit by his side. Pastor is against flirty behavior explains how boundaries are important for his and H's positions.


My point is that external control of his behavior only goes so far, AND that I don't think my H is the exception but the rule in his inclination to "rebel" against external control- whether it comes from the church, vows, the wife, the pastor, etc....

Forcing him in to see the pastor, you going and telling OW to buzz off, etc--> external control, requires no self control from your H

Your husband needs to grow up and stand on his own two feet when it comes to telling OW to buzz off. I think its a mistake for you to do that for him, creates a mommy dynamic.

As long as you are forcing him externally to behave, it keeps him emotionally arrested, immature, inexperienced in reining in his base impulses and exercising SELF control.


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## Blonde (Jan 7, 2013)

^^That's not to say there's no accountability for your H or role for the pastor. I think you need a witness of your husband telling OW to buzz off and the pastor is the ideal witness.

If your H digs in his heels and fights you on this^^, then you just have to keep giving him rope until he hangs himself. BTDT and it gets really ugly and messy before things turn around. 

When he cheats, its ultimatum time. "H, You WILL tell OW to buzz off with the pastor as witness or this marriage is over."

Meanwhile, get going on your 180. Get strong, be confident, attractive, enjoy life and be prepared to move on with your happy full life with OR without your H. You go girl! 

ETA: I'd go ahead report him to HR (guilt free), call the police if he breaks any laws (guilt free), and otherwise make sure he has full consequences and doesn't get away with anything as far as it depends on you. At the point where my H was driving and drinking, I gave the children a cell phone and instructed them on how to call the police and report him should he ever again take them to a bar with him (which he did ONCE).


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## Blonde (Jan 7, 2013)

I think you need to stop blaming OW that your H has wayward tendencies. 

Get mad at your H and file with HR. 

I felt sorry for the poor dysfunctional naive OW who was half his age and not a Christian that this DOM was using her. 

You and your H have apparently been married before? What is the history there? How did your and his first marriages end?


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

Blonde said:


> I think you need to stop blaming OW that your H has wayward tendencies.
> 
> Get mad at your H and file with HR.
> 
> ...


Sorry. Don't know how I gave you that impression. Neither of us were married before. 

BTW nurse x had been chasing H for years acting but acting as a friend... I was busy with the kids, work and he eventually folded to her, EA.


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

Blonde said:


> My point is that external control of his behavior only goes so far, AND that I don't think my H is the exception but the rule in his inclination to "rebel" against external control- whether it comes from the church, vows, the wife, the pastor, etc....
> 
> Forcing him in to see the pastor, you going and telling OW to buzz off, etc--> external control, requires no self control from your H
> 
> ...


So if I see the OW what do you recommend I say?


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## Blonde (Jan 7, 2013)

sosotired said:


> So if I see the OW what do you recommend I say?


I was never personally acquainted with H's AP's but as a general policy, I think transparency is the best option (and biblical Eph 5:11-13; John 3:19)

If she has a husband or SO, they should know too.


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## Blonde (Jan 7, 2013)

sosotired said:


> Sorry. Don't know how I gave you that impression. Neither of us were married before.
> 
> BTW nurse x had been chasing H for years acting but acting as a friend... I was busy with the kids, work and he eventually folded to her, EA.


My bad. Must have mixed you up with another poster.


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## Blonde (Jan 7, 2013)

I might say something like,

"Your constant texting/calling ________[name specific behavior] sure comes across as you flirting with my husband. I don't like it and I want it to stop."

Tell her husband the same thing.

Tell YOUR husband "Your constant texting/calling ________[name specific behavior] sure comes across as you flirting with nurse X. I don't like it and I want it to stop."

If your H persists, denies, blameshifts, etc you then take a witness with you to confront the behavior (the pastor) and if he still persists or denies you expose widely (per Matt 18:15ff)


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## Blonde (Jan 7, 2013)

LOL Look how the Message renders John 3:19ff

This is the crisis we’re in: God-light streamed into the world, but men and women everywhere ran for the darkness. They went for the darkness because they were not really interested in pleasing God.* Everyone who makes a practice of doing evil, addicted to denial and illusion, hates God-light and won’t come near it, fearing a painful exposure*. But anyone working and living in truth and reality welcomes God-light so the work can be seen for the God-work it is​
(Q Mission Impossible music) Your mission, should you choose to accept it, is to shine the light/expose. You will find out what kind of character your husband has by how he responds to exposure.


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## Blonde (Jan 7, 2013)

SST, exposing him should be from a position of strength and for his welfare not out of revenge nor insecurity. 

Is nurse X really flirting with him? Or are you insecure and paranoid about a strictly professional relationship? 

This is why the 180 is so important for you. You need to build up your own strength, self confidence, and independence.


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

Blonde said:


> SST, exposing him should be from a position of strength and for his welfare not out of revenge nor insecurity.
> 
> *Is nurse X really flirting with him?* Or are you insecure and paranoid about a strictly professional relationship?
> 
> This is why the 180 is so important for you. You need to build up your own strength, self confidence, and independence.


As I've pointed out in previous messages, when one didn't stop by the floor the other asks where they were, " you said you'd stop by, why didn't I see you today? " Guess they spent a lot of time chatting on the nurse's floor.

She texted him, " how about I bring myself back and that be your gift" . 
"you are such a wonderful person.. a wonderful father (how would she know ?)" Multiple other texts... all in secret. 

Now that she knows I caught on to her texts, she finds excuses to call his office so she can speak to him. Most of the visits, texts and calls were on hospital time. I don't think this is professional, rather it is infringing on patient care. Spoke to a another nurse in diff hospital who said - "we hate the texters..we have a lot of patient work and if someone happens to be free, we need help."


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

turnera said:


> Women KNOW. Especially if they've been hitting on your husband. I'd just walk up and say 'stay away from us.'


OK.

VH what do you recommend I say? Keep in mind this is someone who is outwardly very friendly, pushy and sneaky. Get the feeling she will not care how I feel, but not sure what to say should I run into her again.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

That's why I said to be bold and upfront about it. If you continue to be a milquetoast, she'll continue to grab for your man. If you get in her face and let her know you're about to make her life miserable, she'll likely turn around and look for an easier catch. One who doesn't come with sticky problems.


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## Blonde (Jan 7, 2013)

sosotired said:


> As I've pointed out in previous messages, when one didn't stop by the floor the other asks where they were, " you said you'd stop by, why didn't I see you today? " Guess they spent a lot of time chatting on the nurse's floor.
> 
> She texted him, " how about I bring myself back and that be your gift" .
> "you are such a wonderful person.. a wonderful father (how would she know ?)" Multiple other texts... all in secret.
> ...


Distill it down to a sentence or two describing the behavior (I gave examples here) and separately tell nurse X and tell your husband to knock it off. If you can get printouts of inappropriate texts, give them copies- and give HR copies. That may be helpful for them if the texts were on hospital time. 

And call up nurse X's husband if she's married.



> Spoke to a another nurse in diff hospital who said - "we hate the texters..we have a lot of patient work and if someone happens to be free, we need help."


^^not necessary. Confront the guilty parties and follow through with appropriate consequences as far as it depends on you- reports filed with HR and etc.

Meanwhile, are you doing anything on the 180?


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

turnera said:


> That's why I said to be bold and upfront about it. If you continue to be a milquetoast, she'll continue to grab for your man. If you get in her face and let her know you're about to make her life miserable, she'll likely turn around and look for an easier catch. One who doesn't come with sticky problems.



OK.

No Hi, just ' We are married and you need to respect that. Stay out of our lives. No more texting , or finding excuses to call my H. Leave us alone' 

or "Heard you were still chasing after my H? It has been 4 years now. Why not spend some quality time w/yours?"

Would prefer to give her a big hint, I'll let her know our family is enjoying the summer together... ask her if she and *her H* have any vacation plans and hopes she enjoys spending the summer together w/her H" That approach gives her less attention.


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## Blonde (Jan 7, 2013)

"Your texting and calling my husband comes across as flirting and I want it to stop. I'll be reporting any unprofessional behavior to HR and letting your husband know how I feel."

Name the specific behaviors, use I statements, tell them what *you *will be doing. Would be more powerful if you have the texts printed out from the phone co.

You need to tell your H too.


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

Blonde said:


> "Your texting and calling my husband comes across as flirting and I want it to stop. I'll be reporting any unprofessional behavior to HR and letting your husband know how I feel."
> 
> Name the specific behaviors, use I statements, tell them what *you *will be doing. Would be more powerful if you have the texts printed out from the phone co.
> 
> You need to tell your H too.


After I saw texts, Told H ^^. Recap
He says he does not go near her anymore.. few months passed, caught him flirting w/her... told him again to stay away.. several months passed ... no more texts but, now his office staff told me she calls there too frequently, and is too personal, chummy with his staff and colleagues. H says nurse x has changed.. she is all business now. I told H she is still after him. He rolled his eyes and said, "I know . I know you think she is sneaky."

Showed the texts , but anonymously , to HR because H was against me filing a specific complaint against her. Followed Turnera's recommendation (previous message) and it has helped. 

Understand what you are recommending and will say if I see her. Tx


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## Blonde (Jan 7, 2013)

sosotired said:


> Showed the texts , but anonymously , to HR *because H was against me filing a specific complaint against her. *


 Naturally John 3:19 NKJV - And this is the condemnation, that the - Bible Gateway

Funny (NOT!) how some H's want to protect and defend OW :scratchhead: 

How's about that 180, SST?


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## Blonde (Jan 7, 2013)

sosotired said:


> After I saw texts, Told H ^^. Recap
> He says he does not go near her anymore.. few months passed, caught him flirting w/her... told him again to stay away.. several months passed ... no more texts but, now his office staff told me she calls there too frequently, and is too personal, chummy with his staff and colleagues. H says nurse x has changed.. she is all business now. I told H she is still after him. He rolled his eyes and said, "I know . I know you think she is sneaky."


You said in your OP that you want to be brief. But you seem to circle round and round the heart of the matter.

I think brief and to the point it the right approach. No rehashing the evidence. No circling round and round. No blaming OW (your H is the problem here. Slvtty OW are a dime a dozen) 

"I don't like it. It's got to stop (Your H should be NC with OW IMO). And here are the steps I'm going to take if it doesn't"

SST, what steps have you taken on the 180?


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## whowouldhavethought (Jun 15, 2013)

sosotired said:


> After I saw texts, Told H ^^. Recap
> 
> 
> Showed the texts , but anonymously , to HR because H was against me filing a specific complaint against her. Followed Turnera's recommendation (previous message) and it has helped.


Of course he does not want to file a specific complaint. If you do she gets warned and reassigned. 

WWHT


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

sosotired said:


> No Hi, just ' We are married and you need to respect that. Stay out of our lives. No more texting , or finding excuses to call my H. Leave us alone'
> 
> Would prefer to give her a big hint, I'll let her know our family is enjoying the summer together... ask her if she and *her H* have any vacation plans and hopes she enjoys spending the summer together w/her H" That approach gives her less attention.


WTH?

This woman STOLE YOUR HUSBAND.

And you want to talk nice to her? what's wrong with you? Are you so scared that your husband will move out that you will move heaven and earth to punish HER while ignoring that YOUR HUSBAND IS CHEATING ON YOU?


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

turnera said:


> WTH?
> 
> This woman STOLE YOUR HUSBAND.
> 
> And you want to talk nice to her? what's wrong with you? Are you so scared that your husband will move out that you will move heaven and earth to punish HER while ignoring that YOUR HUSBAND IS CHEATING ON YOU?


Saw her once a while ago, during the suspicion but not confirmed stage. She walked away, because I was ignoring her small talk w/me. The next morning she was back to sending him texts. 

Seems to fuels her fire that am not nice. Maybe it makes her believe that I am a jerk wife and more reason for her to be w/ my H?


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

She is going to protect herself, sst. Ignoring her is NOT 'being not nice.' All you did was act scared of her and not knowing what to do. That emboldened her, cos you basically ran away.

Getting in her face and saying 'leave him alone' is not being nice. Can you not do this? If you can't, you can't. But if so, ask someone ELSE to do it for you. She needs to be told to stay the hell away.


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## Blonde (Jan 7, 2013)

I'm going to be blunt. Please forgive me if this hurts your feelings. That isn't my intention. (Prov 27:6)

All we have to go on is what you posted SST and reading between the lines:



> Would prefer to give her a big hint, I'll let her know our family is enjoying the summer together... ask her if she and her H have any vacation plans and hopes she enjoys spending the summer together w/her H" That approach gives her less attention.


plus your thread title... makes me wonder if you are really that sure that your husband has an unfaithful heart or if you are insecure and paranoid?

My husband talks/communicates to other women in a friendly manner. As long as he remains sober, I am not bothered by it. (And he has a history of cheating)



sosotired said:


> Call it woman's intuition but I felt him slipping away. He made comments about her thin body. When someone mentioned her name he lit up like a Christmas tree.


Depending on how he mentioned it, I might be really angry with my H about sizing up another woman's body... However just commenting that she is thin would not be threatening to me at all because I feel very good and very confident about my own looks.

You mentioned that you lost wt d/t stress and exercise. Are you close to your bridal weight? Do you feel GOOD about how you look?

Again, I'm going to suggest the 180. You need to feel good and confident about yourself so that you can speak firmly to your husband and he snaps to attention because he knows that he is going to be a *BIG LOSER* if he messes @ with someone else.

^^I f your H is in an affair fog and doesn't know this^^ YOU should know it!

Just like I hear mixed messages, so your H and nurseX are hearing mixed messages from you. You sound so unsure that anything is really going on and easy to trample all over... 

Unsubscribing for now because I feel frustrated and unheard @ 180.


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## Blonde (Jan 7, 2013)

BTW When I am angry the $hit hits the fan in a *BIG WAY*. I don't pu$$y foot @ telling some OW to have a nice vacation.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Assuming he IS cheating, and you have proof, I wanted to add that you can talk to HER all day and it won't stop YOUR HUSBAND from cheating. 

He needs to know you will KICK HIM OUT if you catch him cheating again because you value yourself too much to put up with it.

So, what exact proof DO you have?


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## fooledtwice (Jul 6, 2013)

confront her and keep confronting her. If she is married call her husband. Don't stop getting in her face about it.
when I caught My first husband cheating. I confronted him and her they lasted all of three weeks after I threw him out. 
To this day 20 something years later he still regrets it. He said he always will. 
He still cheats on his current wife now. 
Once a cheater always a cheater.


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

Blonde said:


> I'm going to be blunt. Please forgive me if this hurts your feelings. That isn't my intention. (Prov 27:6)
> 
> All we have to go on is what you posted SST and reading between the lines:
> 
> ...


Don't know what else I can teel you. Texts also included -- what time they should give each wake up calls. She told him she would bring herself back as one of his presents. During all the texts, phone calls and meetings, I had no idea she existed. He never shared any of their relationship with me. 
*HR person read nurse x's texts and said, "she is throwing yourself at you husband and he is allowing it."*

*Can't help it if you disagree. *The more I read the messages in TAM, the more I see the light. Most of the cheaters use denial, coverup and try to turn the tables on their spouse...everything my H has done to cover up has been used by the cheaters here.

The thread title is because he never apologized or showed me remorse. He promised never to talk to her and a few months later hid in another room so I wouldn't hear him flirting with her on the phone. His response, "I'm only human." I was Angry and again he said he would cut it off . Few more months go by, find out she has been calling his office and if he is not there she wants him to call her back personally. etc. .....He wants me to trust him.

You said you trust your H. I am happy for you. 

For me, I wanted some other's perspectives and am grateful they helped me see the light. 

I agree w/ 180 and said in earlier message I am now working on it.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

180 does nothing, if you continue to allow him to live in YOUR home and still cheat.


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

fooledtwice said:


> confront her and keep confronting her. If she is married call her husband. Don't stop getting in her face about it.
> when I caught My first husband cheating. I confronted him and her they lasted all of three weeks after I threw him out.
> To this day 20 something years later he still regrets it. He said he always will.
> He still cheats on his current wife now.
> Once a cheater always a cheater.


Thanks for the info.


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

turnera said:


> 180 does nothing, if you continue to allow him to live in YOUR home and still cheat.


OK.

Weekend was great.

He came home from work today seems so distant. Maybe I am paranoid but he would not look me in the eye.
Tried to cuddle up since we were busy over weekend and no sex for the past 2 days but HE wanted to sleep! Don't get it. He is sleeping like a baby now.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

That means renewed contact.


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

Blondie quoted
"... makes me wonder if you are really that sure that your husband has an unfaithful heart or if you are insecure and paranoid?"

-----------------
Never said he had a PA. 

It was an EA. 

I was at a school function one night with the kids. He stayed home during which time he texted to ask her what weekend she was working next. 

She shows up at out kid's school game, why? because he invited her. 

Some other examples in above messages and there are many others. I only have the texts to go by. Don't know what was discussed at their near daily get together on the floor. Only know if one didn't show up the other was texting.

You tell me if I am way off base.. but don't think that is normal behavior for a faithful spouse?


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

turnera said:


> That means renewed contact.


I asked why he was so distant. He immediately blamed me.. said I acted funny when I spoke to him at work today. 

I am getting tougher. Said, 'I wasn't , but even if it were the case, you want to turn it around on me.' 'I was hugging you on the bed from behind and you ignored me.' 
H: "I was tired" 
Me: "You were petting the cat and wouldn't even touch me."
H: 'I don't know why. things fluctuate day to day.'

Asked if he spoke with or saw nurse x today or someone else. H denied. 

I was so angry. 10 min later H asked a couple times to come exercise with him. Told him to go because I'd slow him down. (BTW did mine earlier).


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Next time, be a little more direct. "I can't trust you right now because you're flirting as much as nurse x and I'm not sure I can stay in this relationship as it is." Then just walk away. Leave him wondering.


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

turnera said:


> Next time, be a little more direct. "I can't trust you right now because you're flirting as much as nurse x and I'm not sure I can stay in this relationship as it is." Then just walk away. Leave him wondering.


Ok thanks. Will do next time he is flirting.

This past time however he was just distant. Don't understand as this 5 day long weekend he would have jumped at
The chance for sex and was so affectionate. I get the feeling he had contact with her as you say but he denied it..anyway after I became angry we is trying to be nice. This morning he we said we should go out for dinner tonight. I'm so confused?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

He's back in contact and he's nicing you back into submission and being quiet. Throwing you some bones.

Do you have access to his phone?


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## mablenc (Feb 26, 2013)

Stop being nice and trying to cuddle with him! He's hurting you! Every nice thing you do will only draw him away. Have you read up on the 180? Also the book why men marry b!tches would be good for you to read.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Honestly, he has NO FEAR that you will ever leave him. Why should he put you first if he isn't afraid of that?


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## VeryHurt (Mar 11, 2011)

sosotired said:


> OK.
> 
> VH what do you recommend I say? Keep in mind this is someone who is outwardly very friendly, pushy and sneaky. Get the feeling she will not care how I feel, but not sure what to say should I run into her again.


Hi SST ~
Sorry I haven't been around for a few day. I agree with Tunera. Keep it short and simple: 
"Stay away from my husband and our family."
VH


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## mablenc (Feb 26, 2013)

VeryHurt said:


> Hi SST ~
> Sorry I haven't been around for a few day. I agree with Tunera. Keep it short and simple:
> "Stay away from my husband and our family."
> VH


I agree with the message but, she's not the problem he is. He's the one who is married and made promises to her.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## A Bit Much (Sep 14, 2011)

Bags would be packed.

Yeah, it's going to be ugly and uncomfortable and all the negative stuff that comes with rocking the boat, but it needs to be done. He doesn't believe you mean business SST.


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## VeryHurt (Mar 11, 2011)

Mablenc & Tunera : 

I stand corrected, SST's H is to blame. He has the power to stop NurseX in her tracks but what is stopping him? If we knew, we would all be considered geniuses. 

I am in the same boat as SST, husband flip-flopping on a daily basis. H can be loving and caring one day and be cool and distant for the following 3-4 days. Makes no sense.

SST, I just told my H last night and perhaps this is a suggestion for you as well: If you want to go, go. I cannot and will not beg. I don't want you if you don't want me. 

We cannot make our spouses love us, want us or need us AND we definitely cannot make them be faithful.

Be Strong. Very Hurt


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## A Bit Much (Sep 14, 2011)

VeryHurt, I'm sorry you're going through this too. It really is rather cruel of your husband to carry on like he does... but I will say this.

They will continue to treat you the way they have as long as you sit there and take it. Telling him he can go if he wants to is brave and a very hard thing to do, but these kind of people will not go. That's not how they roll. They don't want to be the so called bad guy. They reserve that for you. You have to get to a point where you don't care how it looks to them or anyone else and take control of the situation and your life and future. You have to be the one to walk away. They won't do it.

Stop leaving what happens to you up to these uncaring selfish SOB's.


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## A Bit Much (Sep 14, 2011)

Look at it this way. If your husband were an upstanding honest guy, he wouldn't do this to you. He would have the integrity and fortitude to sit you down and say... this isn't working. I'm not happy, and I'm sorry for hurting you. I want us both to be happy so, the best thing for us to do is end it.

SST and VeryHurt, neither of your husbands are capable of this kind of honesty. So to run around expecting them to suddenly have some epiphany and either leave you or fly straight is a waste of time. They would have to respect you in order to be straight with you. Not to mention... a level of maturity.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

In all my years of doing this, I've only seen ONE way to stop a cheater - to swiftly and forcefully DUMP the cheater. And then to say, 'I will not be your backup plan. If you want to get to keep me, you will immediately stop ALL THIS NONSENSE and follow my requirements (transparency, change jobs, etc.). If you're not willing to do that, then we have nothing more to discuss.'

I know it seems harsh to you, but he is a CHEATER. By its very definition, it means he wants YOU to stay at home pining for him while he strokes his ego with other women. YOU are the key player in this, not him. YOU can set the rules - stop or lose me. And if he won't stop, do you really want him? Is that all you're worth?


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

turnera said:


> He's back in contact and he's nicing you back into submission and being quiet. Throwing you some bones.
> 
> Do you have access to his phone?


Yes. He likes to keep it near him.
If I look at it can tell he does not like it.
He has told other women not to text him because I do not like it.
Hif he communicates with anyone he shouldn t he probably hides it.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

A Bit Much said:


> Look at it this way. If your husband were an upstanding honest guy, he wouldn't do this to you. He would have the integrity and fortitude to sit you down and say... this isn't working. I'm not happy, and I'm sorry for hurting you. I want us both to be happy so, the They would have to respect you in order to be straight with you. Not to mention... a level of maturity.


True.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

mablenc said:


> Stop being nice and trying to cuddle with him! He's hurting you! Every nice thing you do will only draw him away. Have you read up on the 180? Also the book why men marry b!tches would be good for you to read.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Just want to catch him in the act.
Right now I have no proof.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

turnera said:


> In all my years of doing this, I've only seen ONE way to stop a cheater - to swiftly and forcefully DUMP the cheater. And then to say, 'I will not be your backup plan. If you want to get to keep me, you will immediately stop ALL THIS NONSENSE and follow my requirements (transparency, change jobs, etc.). If you're not willing to do that, then we have nothing more to discuss.'
> 
> I know it seems harsh to you, but he is a CHEATER. By its very definition, it means he wants YOU to stay at home pining for him while he strokes his ego with other women. YOU are the key player in this, not him. YOU can set the rules - stop or lose me. And if he won't stop, do you really want him? Is that all you're worth?


Agree. I am getting so upset as soon as he does one more thing Ill be after him. problem is he may be going under. Hard to catch.
Ill hsve to followup with his staff that helped before.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## mablenc (Feb 26, 2013)

Have you see this thread:

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping...-interested-evidence-gathering-thread-16.html

You can look at all deleted message on his iPhone its in the thread.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## A Bit Much (Sep 14, 2011)

sosotired said:


> Just want to catch him in the act.
> Right now I have no proof.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_



You have enough evidence and hurt feelings due to his past behavior to act. The above is just you stalling.


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## Blonde (Jan 7, 2013)

sosotired said:


> You said you trust your H. I am happy for you.


I trust my H *when he's not drinking.*

But the reality is he does drink and he's on the road 4 days/week so no, I don't trust him.

My H hasn't cheated for 5 years now and I still don't trust him. 

Maybe the CWI section would be more appropriate for you? You just do not seem that sure that your husband is cheating and if you aren't sure then *I'm not sure either.* Thread title is "Should I trust him?" and you mentioned his "thin" comments about nursex as if maybe you feel insecure about your weight?

BTDT with a cheating husband and I feel for ya SST. May the truth come to light!!!! When my H was cheating he was abusive to me and the kids and neglectful (gone 6 days/week overnights and blew off committments such as son's wrestling which he had promised to do) AND accused me of "having a BF on the side" rolleyes: projecting, much)

I knew that something was seriously wrong. But I didn't know he was cheating. I do remember those days of pain and confusion and I feel for you. May the truth come to light!!!


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## Blonde (Jan 7, 2013)

At that time when the marriage was absolutely miserable and my husband was cruel and neglectful, I

-got a new job
-planned a new career path for me (had been mainly SAHM of 8 for 20 yrs)
-exercised every day
-prayed every day
-spent time with my friends
-took care of my children and had fun with them
-accepted my adult daughters' standing offer to clean out my closet and shop with me for an "extreme mom makeover", trendy and HOT

It was a 180 and I never even heard of it.

H broke it off with OW somewhere @ Dec 2008 and I found out about the affair in May 2009 when she was still contacting him inviting him for overnights at the casino and he was still enmeshed with her, worried she might be preggo and feeling protective of what her live-in BF would do blah blah blah...

The pastor and my adult son (age 21 at the time) were in the room when he phoned her and told her to stop contact with him.


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## Blonde (Jan 7, 2013)

Maybe TMI but here is how my H's cheating came to light

In April/May 2009 I had these vague feelings of intense emotional pain which I could not identify. 

At a ladies retreat May 3, I asked the ladies for prayer. The ladies prayed over me and one of them prophesied that she saw me in a very dark whirlwind. Do not be afraid. Cling to God. He will keep you. He will hide you in the cleft of the rock. She said that the whirlwind was coming from the north and the army of the Lord was going before me. We were outside, and right at that moment 2 US army planes flew very low over our heads going north.

I was upset. I wanted healing, but I’m getting a whirlwind? 

When I was home I asked God what this pain is.

God said "betrayal".

Do YOU mean old stuff, God? (H was unfaithful in 1990)

"No, its not old stuff."

So, I pressed my husband as to what else he is hiding from me besides a year long smoking habit. Did he use prostitutes in Turkey (3 month long business trip)? No, he didn’t use prostitutes in Turkey. He had a girlfriend at work and he was screwing her for months. “Its over now” said H.

Not really. H was still enmeshed w/her, protective, defensive, worried about her... 

kinda like your H with nurse X and HR


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

Blonde said:


> Maybe TMI but here is how my H's cheating came to light
> 
> In April/May 2009 I had these vague feelings of intense emotional pain which I could not identify.
> 
> ...


thank you for your help. I'm really depressed now.because I really wanted to believe husband did not want to report for fear of making himself look bad to the rest of the staff.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

Blonde said:


> Maybe the CWI section would be more appropriate for you? You just do not seem that sure that your husband is cheating and if you aren't sure then *I'm not sure either.* Thread title is "Should I trust him?" and you mentioned his "thin" comments about nursex as if maybe you feel insecure about your weight!


I am not insecure about my weight. At a size 0, I am smaller than x.

I am insecure that my H does not love me anymore.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

mablenc said:


> Have you see this thread:
> 
> http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping...-interested-evidence-gathering-thread-16.html
> 
> ...


Thank you I will.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Remind me: Did you read HNHN?


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## Blonde (Jan 7, 2013)

sosotired said:


> I am not insecure about my weight. At a size 0, I am smaller than x.
> 
> I am insecure that my H does not love me anymore.


Part of my process was getting over the Cinderella, Prince Charming, Happily Ever After fantasies...

Your H might be in an infatuation fog with someone else but it's not "love" and it's pretty sleazy and self centered when there are two spouses and multiple children involved.

Put some surveillance and accountability in place (if you want to go that way, I just prayed for the truth to come to light and it did- see above) and then put your husband OUT of your mind. Don't let stewing about him and his crapola rob you of your joy.

Work on loving yourself and taking care of yourself SST. Expect nothing from him. "Expectations are premeditated resentments" and neediness is unattractive.

What do you enjoy? Make a list and do something you enjoy daily. Smile, laugh, have fun. 

How old are your children?


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

turnera said:


> Remind me: Did you read HNHN?


Did not read specific book.

Read an article by ? Dr. HURLEY? (May have misspelled name) ON A SIMiLAR topic.
Agree with it. 

Told H what you previously recommended .. no other women including no visiting with them and added ' if needs of yours are not being met, I need to know so I can address them.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Blonde (Jan 7, 2013)

I suggest IC for you too. One of the best things I ever did for myself. It will help you grow up, develop some healthy independence, a backbone, and boundaries with teeth. :smthumbup:

H *hated* the loss of his doormat


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

sosotired said:


> Did not read specific book.
> 
> Read an article by ? Dr. HURLEY? (May have misspelled name) ON A SIMiLAR topic.
> Agree with it.
> ...


 Yes, it's Dr Harley. Get the book asap. It's the best thing I know for affair-proofing your marriage. You should be doing it all anyway. BUT once you DO that, you must also hold him accountable - no more flirting, period. Any whiff of another woman and you're out on your ear and I take half your income and more. Got that?

Every time you talk about how you talk to your husband, it's just one more example of ... whining (no disrespect). Maybe it's just coming across wrong in the writing, but it sounds like you're soundling like a SAHM who's desperate to cling onto her husband but is powerless, so all she can do is keep harping on him to please, pretty please not cheat on me. 

Until you get mad as hell at what HE is putting you through (HIM, not HER), and SHOW him how ticked off you are at him, he has no reason to change. Until he fears losing you, he will continue to give you lip service and carry on in his merry way - cos he knows you won't leave.

That's all this really boils down to. Until you are willing to lose him if he won't stop, you have no power, and he knows it.


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## Blonde (Jan 7, 2013)

sosotired said:


> ' if needs of yours are not being met, I need to know so I can address them.


This has the potential for laying the responsibility for sleazy decisions of WS at the feet of BS.

My H used porn, used strip clubs, and had an affair. He told me that the appeal was that it was illicit. The "dirtiness", the sneaking was exciting and addictive. He got a rush from feeling like he was getting away with something.

That's not about "unmet needs". That's about being carnal (as the Bible would put it)

1 Follow God’s example, therefore, as dearly loved children 2 and walk in the way of love, just as Christ loved us and gave himself up for us as a fragrant offering and sacrifice to God.

3 But among you there must not be even a hint of sexual immorality, or of any kind of impurity, or of greed, because these are improper for God’s holy people. 4 Nor should there be obscenity, foolish talk or coarse joking, which are out of place, but rather thanksgiving. 5 For of this you can be sure: No immoral, impure or greedy person—such a person is an idolater—has any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God. 6 Let no one deceive you with empty words, for because of such things God’s wrath comes on those who are disobedient. 7 *Therefore do not be partners with them*.​
As a Christian woman married to a professing Christian man, we are One Flesh in a very deep and mysterious way which goes way beyond sex. His immoral choices will deeply wound you unless you detach from him. You can *detach *emotionally without separating. It's hard but you can do it. A counselor can help.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Good point. Saying that is VERY weak and unattractive. Saying it BEFORE he ever cheated would have been ok. NOW, it's just 'oh please tell me how I can become more attractive to you so you don't leave me.'


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## Woodchuck (Nov 1, 2012)

sosotired said:


> I am not insecure about my weight. At a size 0, I am smaller than x.
> 
> I am insecure that my H does not love me anymore.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


When we married my wife weighed 92 pounds...She was 5'4" and would buy a size 2 and take them up....I was crazy in love with her then, and am still crazy in love with her 47 years later....

I really think poor body image may be one of the most destructive forces in a relationship.....Work on fixing your head, not your body, it is fine.....

Check out the evidence gathering thread on coping with infidelity, and make sure you know the facts.....

good luck
the woodchuck


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## Blonde (Jan 7, 2013)

turnera said:


> Good point. Saying that is VERY weak and unattractive. Saying it BEFORE he ever cheated would have been ok. NOW, it's just 'oh please tell me how I can become more attractive to you so you don't leave me.'


:iagree:

Like, "let me turn myself into a pretzel attempting to please you when you're a ****bag "

You get more of what you reward and I certainly don't want to provide even a hint of positive reinforcement for douche

This doesn't mean you become cruel and punishing either. You be polite- like you would to a stranger. Polite, distant, detached, having a full and fun life while he examines his bowels


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

Woodchuck said:


> When we married my wife weighed 92 pounds...She was 5'4" and would buy a size 2 and take them up....I was crazy in love with her then, and am still crazy in love with her 47 years later....
> 
> ..Work on fixing your head, not your body, it is fine.
> 
> the woodchuck


....Agree with you. just included size to put an end to the inquiries about my weight.. asking if I fit in my wedding dress etc.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

So what do you think about the rest of the stuff we said?


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

Thank you for all your help!

I have distanced myself and he in turn has done the same.

You are right. If he can't even read a little marriage book for me then he really does not care. I've tried my speaking with him, MC and pastor. He is hot and cold - the cold although less frequent is when he has been back at work. His wanting to hold hands in public is just a front to protect his "image" he and his mother are so concerned about. Living day to day with this tearing me up inside is just not right.

He left abruptly this morning and I had to stop myself from calling him on his way to work. I realize if I can't stop this bahavior with all I have done so far, nothing will. If he feels happier with someone else then I need to let him go. I just have to not be jealous, instead be happy for him and move on.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Be happy that you will be able to look for a partner (much later) who will honor you.


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## bobbieb65 (Jan 24, 2013)

@SST, now that the muck has settled to the bottom of the pond again you can clearly see things for what they really are. This might be the right time to ask your H for a trial S, have him move out. His A is far from over and no amount of MC will change that. 

You have to ask yourself if being 2nd to everyone else in his eyes is enough for you...you mentioned that he flirts and seeks attention from many other women beside just this one. This is such total disrespect from the person you promised to spend your life with and had children for that I really question why would you want to stay with him, even if the A ends.

Have him move out and give you the space to take a true look at what YOU WANT AND NEED and if he could ever provide that. This would also prove to him that you will no longer allow him to have his cake and eat it too while he's M to you! This will work itself out one way or another but at least there will be an ending to all of this.


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## Blonde (Jan 7, 2013)

sosotired said:


> If he feels happier with someone else then I need to let him go. I just have to not be jealous, instead be happy for him and move on.


No, you have to feel sorry for him that he is going to get what he deserves. Poor boy! Might be this Tsk tsk...

And happy for yourself that you are going to have a richly blessed and abundant life because you are a Christian woman walking in an upright manner.


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## Blonde (Jan 7, 2013)

He's the loser, SST.

Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. Whoever sows to please their flesh, from the flesh will reap destruction; Gal 6:7-8​
Sow well, SST, and pity your poor poor husband for the destruction he is going to reap.


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

turnera said:


> Be happy that you will be able to look for a partner (much later) who will honor you.


Guess I am not that positive about that.

Funny. He has been very polite while distant. Seems he is protecting himself too.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

bobbieb65 said:


> @SST, now that the muck has settled to the bottom of the pond again you can clearly see things for what they really are. This might be the right time to ask your H for a trial S, have him move out. His A is far from over and no amount of MC will change that.
> 
> You have to ask yourself if being 2nd to everyone else in his eyes is enough for you...you mentioned that he flirts and seeks attention from many other women beside just this one. This is such total disrespect from the person you promised to spend your life with and had children for that I really question why would you want to stay with him, even if the A ends.
> 
> Have him move out and give you the space to take a true look at what YOU WANT AND NEED and if he could ever provide that. This would also prove to him that you will no longer allow him to have his cake and eat it too while he's M to you! This will work itself out one way or another but at least there will be an ending to all of this.


Yes. It is going to be very hard.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

sosotired said:


> Guess I am not that positive about that.
> 
> Funny. He has been very polite while distant. Seems he is protecting himself too.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


 Read some other threads of people who've moved on. In more than 10 years of doing this, I can't name a single one who has come back and said their life on their own after their spouses's infidelity is worse than it was before. In fact, most of them come back and say "How was I so STUPID to fight so hard for such a toxic, unloving, harmful relatioship when I've been so happy now that I'm moved on?"


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

turnera said:


> Read some other threads of people who've moved on. In more than 10 years of doing this, I can't name a single one who has come back and said their life on their own after their spouses's infidelity is worse than it was before. In fact, most of them come back and say "How was I so STUPID to fight so hard for such a toxic, unloving, harmful relatioship when I've been so happy now that I'm moved on?"


OK Thanks


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## shaung (Mar 18, 2011)

I just read this thread. You mentioned a couple times that she already has a family. Is she married?


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

shaung said:


> I just read this thread. You mentioned a couple times that she already has a family. Is she married?


Yes. Why does that matter?


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Because you should have contacted her husband by now.


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## sosotired (Jun 8, 2013)

turnera said:


> Because you should have contacted her husband by now.


Correction. Found out she was divorced earlier this year and has a significant other.

Don't know who the significant other is.


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