# Hello Everyone - An Introduction



## djl (Mar 29, 2009)

I am brand new to this forum and am here because I've discovered something about myself that I'm uncomfortable with.
I've spent the better part of the last 20 years in a 12-step program in an effort to recover from growing up in an alcoholic family. 
I am in my second marriage and am in danger of losing it because of intimacy issues I have. My wife has discovered that I have been patronizing a sexually oriented web site and made comments on threads using sexual language in reply to them. She has known for all the time she's known me that I view pornography and has never been happy with it. However this discovery has pretty much broken her heart and has left me with great sadness over the situation. 
I hope to learn more about how to handle and deal with my issues around intimacy and will be posting in whatever sections I find here on topics that apply to mine and my wife's situation in order to become closer to her and hopefully save my marriage.
I've posted on many forums and this has been the most difficult one for me. We are both in much pain currently and I hope that this type of forum as well as counseling will act to help us and bring us closer together.
Thanks for listening and any feedback/support would be gratefully accepted.

djl


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## djl (Mar 29, 2009)

Anybody?


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## Blanca (Jul 25, 2008)

hey djl, 

im sorry for what you and your wife are going through. my H has an addiction to porn. its been hard for him to quit, too. its been a long journey for us both. 

i hope you find a good counselor. ive been through a few, and so has my H. he has one right now that i think is pretty good. she's trying to teach him to let go of his past. i gather you also had a rough childhood. do you mind if i ask how old you are? 

What kind of help were you looking for on here exactly?


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## djl (Mar 29, 2009)

Blanca said:


> hey djl,
> 
> im sorry for what you and your wife are going through. my H has an addiction to porn. its been hard for him to quit, too. its been a long journey for us both.
> 
> ...


Thank you Blanca for your kind reply. 
We are working at following some guidelines we've read from our counselor and also reading as much on the subject as possible to keep mindful of it and work through it. 
I guess basically I wanted to get some feedback on my feelings and also to read about what others have gone through in order to not feel so isolated. I tend to isolate because I have difficulty with self-disclosure. I think the computer, in general is a way for me to do this, and porn has been a part of that. I've learned a great deal already and hope to learn more as I get further into it. 
I am 64 years old and in my second marriage. We are great friends but for some time have been lacking in the sexual/emotional area. Thanks again for your reply. It is appreciated.

Regards
djl


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## Blanca (Jul 25, 2008)

My H is very much like you; he isolates himself emotionally. Its really hard for him to express how he's feeling, and a lot of times he honestly doesnt even know. 

one thing that has helped my H and i is I have a chart of emotions, and i can ask my H to point to the ones he is feeling. I remember the first time he showed me, i was so shocked. he was so depressed. not one positive feeling on there. He jokes around so much, and is so stoic most of the time that i just had no idea. he said that really helps him too. it might sound silly to take that approach, but when one was never taught how to understand and show one's emotions, the basics are where one has to start. 

Also, I dont know how your wife is but i read somewhere that men with porn problems tend to marry women that are emotionally unavailable. which i discovered to be true in my case. which can compound the problem. your isolating might not just be all you. your wife probably has some relating issues, too.


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## matt (Apr 2, 2009)

I would say get help now before this goes to far. I have been married for fourteen years and my marriage is currently done in the words of my wife. I to started using porn to compensate for other issues and have been to counseling twice before. I am currently in counseling again and have found a counselor who is dealing with my issues and not my symptoms. Talk to your wife and be honest ask her to help if she is willing or at least to allow you to work through this. I am trying to save my marriage because of this and believe me after dealing with this for ten years I should have nipped it in the bud years ago. Find a counselor who deals with addictions and ask them specifically if they work with porn addictions. Be open with your wife and she may suprise you. But if you want to save your marriage take care of this before it goes to far.


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## djl (Mar 29, 2009)

Blanca

I can only speak for myself and in my case not only did I never really learn to express myself appropriately, but I my feelings had to be suppressed in order to keep peace. My parents didn't want to hear my problems or feelings. When I did express it came out all sideways and angry. 
Let me say this from the start. I don't blame my parents for my actions now. I am an adult with free will and make my own conscious choices. I'm responsible for what I do. I also know that growing up in an alcoholic environment contributes to my issues. I've been in ACOA for many years dealing with self esteem issues. I think that my self esteem plays a major part in my difficulty with self disclosure.
I'm really having a tough time trying to figure out why, at times, I push her away. I have not trouble crying when sad or with great joy, but sometimes I just 'need' to be away from her, even though I love her very much. You'd have to know her to know what a wonderful person she is, and non-threatening as well, but I find fear where sometimes it should not exist.
She does, in my opinion, have difficulty showins emotions at times. In my first marriage my wife was totally unavailable to me and I (subconsciously) loved it. Very non-threatening but also no reward within the marriage. 
I agree that it's not all me and we will explore that with our counselor over time and work with him to overcome our mutual issues. 
My wife is also a member here. Has you husband joined and if so does he post?
You've been very open-minded with me on this issue and the feeling of support is nice especially considering what you've been through.......thank you Blanca.

Matt - We now have everything out on the table and in the open and will pursue solutions now rather than later with our counselor. We are both totally aware of the urgency to turn things around. Fortunately we both love one another still, and don't want to lose the good parts of the marriage because of this.
I have already question him with regard to his ability to help with addictions and he assured both of us that he is capable in this area. We both like him and he's already pointed out some things we were not aware of. 
Thanks for you reply as well Matt.

Regards
djl


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## Blanca (Jul 25, 2008)

Thanks djl, i appreciate your kind words. 

I am sorry about your past. i can see you dont blame your parents, but you are still affected by it. i think that's a very healthy perspective. i think childhood is something one spends the rest of his/her life trying to get over. 

i dont know if your counselor has talked about boundaries, or if you are interested in it, but its something that really helped me. My H and i now discuss when an emotional, or physical distance would be appropriate. We do have a lot of pain in our past so sometimes we need distance. i think with our issues it can be easy to interpret emotional and physical distance as threatening (maybe for anyone), but ive found that it doesnt have to be threatening at all. In fact, it usually proves to be very helpful. i remember the first time i backed off (out of spite of course because i was ticked off). I told him, "i dont want to talk about 'us' for a week." i was pissed off of course, but oddly i realized we were starting to get along. That was so counterintuitive to me. I thought, 'how in the world can it be that now that i have emotionally backed off we are getting along better then we ever have.' I thought if i backed off it meant he was a bad person and that id be lonely and he'd never know real love. well, that wasnt true.

I guess its just a process and you have to start where it feels good, and where you get along. then slowly, gradually build from there. Remember your life is a process of healing, and as long as you keep trying, it will work out in the end.


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## triedtotrust (Apr 8, 2009)

See, this I just do not understand! My husband has been into porn and interactive websites for awhile now and he knows how I feel about it...it is unacceptable and I simply can't relate to what you are saying, djl...you both have "great sadness" over this, yet go ahead and do it anyway??? My husband shows no emotion to speak of and doesn't like to talk about what has happened to our marriage and I would LOVE to think he is hurt over all this, but with no communication, I find it hard to believe...in fact, I find it hard to believe anyone that engages in addictive and hurtful behaviors really DOES care about who they hurt. I don't understand addiction anyway and that's half or 3/4 my problem I guess. I guess I will never know the "why?" - hope things work our for you and your wife. Glad you're working on it together - it gives me some, if little, hope...good luck!


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## djl (Mar 29, 2009)

Hi Blanca
I know that the way I was brought up is a strong contributing factor in my mindset and may always be. I also know that as and adult I am responsible for how I conduct myself.
I need to work to become closer to my wife from an emotional point of view and that is not easy for someone who has self esteem issues. Looking at images on the computer and replying to threads on a sexually oriented web site is a "safe" way to "interact" but has no spiritual value. Learning to open up to someone I love and thereby get closer to her will add to my spiritual growth and also to hers. I've spent so much time in 12-step program that I know what I want for myself and what it takes to accomplish it. I just need to have the courage and mindfulness to work at it. 

The counselor has not mentioned boundaries as yet. We are still in the early stages of marriage counseling and I'm sure we will get to that, but we both have a strong sense of where our boundaries should be. This will not be a difficult thing for us.
In program there is a term....'let go and let God' which simply defined means that we have no control over another person and we need to give them the information about how we feel and then let them find their own way to healing. I think that when you let go of him you gave him the space to work on his stuff and it sounds like he did. I think some guys have a resistance to being pushed and would prefer to work through some things by themselves. If they really want to change they will. Knowing how important it is to the woman they are with and given the space can be very effective, IMO. By the same token I strongly believe that if left to my own devices (what I call staying in my own head) I can get way off track. So I ask for time and space to heal and will use hers and the counselor's feed back to gage my progress. We will be doing a lot of talking......a lot!!! We need to re-develop that emotional bond that we once had in order to move together rather than apart.

One thing you mention is that 'you have to start where it feels good', and I agree with this from a couple standpoint, but also I must work on my areas that don't necessarily 'feel good' in order to correct mistakes and stay out of denial. I call this stretching myself....stretching my ego in order to grow. It's a difficult but do-able thing for a person with low self esteem like I have. I'm working on the self esteem as well.

I hope that this makes sense.:scratchhead:
Thanks again. I hope you will keep posting. This is the kind of give and take that keeps the thought process going for me...lol.

Regards
djl


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## djl (Mar 29, 2009)

triedtotrust -
The following replies are my opinion and should be taken as such. They may not be true for everyone.

When you first meet your SO the chemistry is very strong and the attraction is as well. Over time little ****** and hurts form and act to create a wedge between lovers. Rather than work at dealing with these issues many of us take the easy way and move apart. Over time this becomes very painful and hard to deal with and confronting it is a very fearful thing. We don't want the marriage to deteriorate but look the other way as it does. People have many ways of hiding from each other. We think it's for 'comfort'. And initially it is but over time it becomes excruciatingly painful. I hid in my computer and in pornography and denied to myself that it was hurting us. It was.



triedtotrust said:


> See, this I just do not understand! My husband has been into porn and interactive websites for awhile now and he knows how I feel about it...it is unacceptable and I simply can't relate to what you are saying, djl...you both have "great sadness" over this, yet go ahead and do it anyway???


We do it for the immediate gratification while the consequences accumulate within the marriage. When my wife came to me and told me we needed to change and also how hurt she was and also that the marriage was badly broken I came out of denial and let myself feel her pain.....and also my own. 




triedtotrust said:


> My husband shows no emotion to speak of and doesn't like to talk about what has happened to our marriage and I would LOVE to think he is hurt over all this, but with no communication, I find it hard to believe...in fact, I find it hard to believe anyone that engages in addictive and hurtful behaviors really DOES care about who they hurt. I don't understand addiction anyway and that's half or 3/4 my problem I guess. I guess I will never know the "why?" - hope things work our for you and your wife. Glad you're working on it together - it gives me some, if little, hope...good luck!


Again my own opinion and definitions:
Addiction is defined as doing something (or things) to the extent that they interfere with your life and cause you to act 
in a dysfunctional manner. One can use food, drugs, gambling, sex, etc. 
Addiction is an illness and a way of satisfying an emptiness inside yourself. It's like a big hole exists between your heart and your stomach and you constantly feel the need to fill it with something. It (one's spirit) can be filled through closeness with others and learning to nurture and be nurtured. I have great capacity to nurture but little capacity to be nurtured.
It scares me to feel loved because inside I don't feel lovable.
So I don't believe what the significant other is telling me. Again, it all revolves around self esteem. 
Your hubby may be so uncomfortable with closeness that he can't confide his inner feelings to you. Also, he may not know what he's feeling. Some people 'shut down' emotionally when they are confronted because at some previous time they had trauma and learned to shut out their feelings to survive.
I would suggest to you that he needs to know see someone(a professional) who can help him with his issues or at least make him aware that he has issues. He may be in a deep denial stage. Most people, when they hit a 'bottom', a low point emotionally will break down and do the work that is necessary to become better. Hopefully it is not the loss of their spouse that does it.
These are just possibilities and food for thought. I hope you will make him aware of your feelings and their possible consequences. He may need a push and hopefully he loves you enough to see someone with you or independently. 

Regards
djl


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## mecoa (Apr 7, 2009)

Hi All, I am djl's wife. We've been married for 9 1/2 yrs. Ours is a 2nd marriage for both of us. We each have grown children.
I did not become aware of the large role porn played in his life until we got a computer in our 1st yr. of marriage. Prior to that I had seen a few pin-up pix behind closet doors at his apt. but I just chalked it up to "single guy stuff". One night after we were living together I got up because I heard odd sounds and peeked into the living rm. and saw he was watching a porn movie. I was upst but he blew it off and eventually so did I until the computer. I was shocked at how much of this stuff he was accumulating and the amount of time needed to do so. Not too long after that our sex life began to decline. We had numerous discussions and fights over these issues but nothing was resolved. He was adamant that what he was doing was OK and if I objected it was only my issue, not his. Then for the past 6 or so mo. he seemed to be especially devoted to the computer and to make a long story short I discovered that he was talking to women(?) on a sex site and confronted him, after denials he admitted what he was doing. I absolutely knew I could not be married to someone like that and I thought we would be separating. But he seems to have a real desire to turn things around, which he never did before, so I am encouraged. He took the initiative to set up counselling and is participating fully.
I respect the effort he is making and hope the marriage will improve and become satisfying for both of us.
Hope to wiite more later; no more time right now.


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## Amplexor (Feb 13, 2008)

Since you are both in agreement the porn must stop, try installing a content filtering package on the PC to block his access. You keep the password. It may make the temptation a little easier for him to deal with. CyberSitter works well. Good luck.


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## revitalizedhusband (Feb 9, 2009)

I agree with Amp.

Get an internet filter program put on your PC and make sure you (the wife) is the only one with the password to "get through" to sites that the filter normally won't allow.

I highly recommend this.


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## Blanca (Jul 25, 2008)

mecoa said:


> I was shocked at how much of this stuff he was accumulating and the amount of time needed to do so.


Ya i never realized how much of a problem it was in my relationship until i put a file recovery program on the computer because i accidently deleted some pix i wanted. I uncovered so much porn i about threw up. After that I put spyware on the computer to see what he was up to. 

After years of fighting he decided he really wanted to stop. And he asked me to put a program called K9 Web Protection. Its free and very effective. Plus it puts my mind at rest, at least a little.


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## Blanca (Jul 25, 2008)

djl said:


> In program there is a term....'let go and let God' which simply defined means that we have no control over another person and we need to give them the information about how we feel and then let them find their own way to healing.


Yes i know this saying well. i go, or used to go, to Alanon. I just moved and havent been able to find a group i can go to but i learned so much there. Im guessing your program is the same as the one in alanon. I have some of the books by my bedside and its amazing how calming they are. 



djl said:


> One thing you mention is that 'you have to start where it feels good', and I agree with this from a couple standpoint, but also I must work on my areas that don't necessarily 'feel good' in order to correct mistakes and stay out of denial. I call this stretching myself....stretching my ego in order to grow. It's a difficult but do-able thing for a person with low self esteem like I have. I'm working on the self esteem as well.


ya, i agree with you. I can understand that you will have to not feel good, maybe, so you can have a better relationship with your wife. im really glad you've decided to change. already things for my h and are getting better. We're starting to connect and im so glad. Its such a good feeling, you'll love it and the porn and loneliness will be just a memory.


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## triedtotrust (Apr 8, 2009)

djl and mecoa - both your remarks were very helpful to me and I thank you...it gives me some insight to why my husband doesn't talk to me except once a week (if I initiate it)...we are separated and have been for 6 months...I hope that he comes around, but at this point, I don't feel it's possible...the longer he doesn't talk to me, the more it hurts and I can't take it. He says he "want's to move on and not talk about the past, but I'm not allowed to talk about my boundaries and what I will accept...he just says, "I know all this." But I don't think anything has changed. I feel since our separation he has the freedom to do all he wants and since he doesn't seem to want to contact me, he has probably 'hooked up' with someone already...and I don't mean in person. Oh well, I am giving up and moving on. Thank you again for your comments. They are so encouraging and I am happy for you guys!


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## mecoa (Apr 7, 2009)

Triedtotrust, I have not read your entire story but it sounds like your decision to move on may be correct. After a while a person just gets tired. But only you can be the judge of that.
To those who suggested computer blocking stuff,I think this is an option worthy of discussion in therapy; we'll see how it goes.
As far as my own situation goes, I know we're not out of the woods yet. I am going thru cycles of internal turmoil that include physical reactions, my stomach feels all churned up and sometimes I just want to throw up and sometimes just scream. Also these emotions are draining a lot of energy. I know it won't be fixed immediately, but I know I don't have the desire or stamina to feel like this as a way of life. I am choosing to believe my hubby is coming out of denial; I know that is a process rather than an event, but I really need my marriage to consist of complete honesty between 2 people who genuinely care about and respect each other. I haven't felt that in quite a while; I don't know exactly when it went away but I believe it eroded slowly over time beginning from the first time I felt "blown off" by my hubby while trying to communicate my concerns. I have gone through my own periods of denial when it was just easier to ignore the deterioration of the marriage than to risk being in conflict over it. I am starting to wonder if part of my life's journey is to just speak my truth,even if it rocks the boat. My family and my culture taught me all the usual crap of the 50's and early 60's:sacrifice yourself for others, keep the peace, the man is the head of the house, defer to authority; these values,among others, landed me in 20 yrs. of a mostly unhappy 1st marriage,as did poor self-esteem. But I do believe my SE has improved some over the yrs.
Thanks to all who have wished us well.


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## Blanca (Jul 25, 2008)

mecoa said:


> I am going thru cycles of internal turmoil that include physical reactions, my stomach feels all churned up and sometimes I just want to throw up and sometimes just scream. Also these emotions are draining a lot of energy.


Ya i went through this, too. It is extremely draining. one thing that seemed to help was meditation. sometimes all the feelings get so jumbled up, and then they all come out at your H over something little, and you dont even know whats going on. but meditation helps one become more aware of all the feelings, and to ask for help. It also helps one become aware of how tense the body is.


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## djl (Mar 29, 2009)

Hi Blanca - 

We are doing a lot of talking and I do a lot of listening with an idea toward empathy. I have my regrets over what I've done but realize that I cannot get into her mind and fully understand the feelings that she's going through. So I've just decided to be there and listen and accept what she is feeling. 
We remain best friends and I want to give her the opportunity to vent and talk through her feelings. I know she needs to know that I totally 'get' how this affects her and I guess we'll need to talk about it until she releases all of it and I understand all of it.
We continue with counseling and that has been a major help for us to vent in a 'safe' environment. He has had some eye-opening things to tell us and some literature on the subject that has helped as well.
Thank you so much for your kind feedback.

Regards
djl


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## keelie0216 (Apr 16, 2009)

how do you post a new thread? am I just that distracted by my relationship issues that I can't even see how to post?


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## keelie0216 (Apr 16, 2009)

how do you post a thread?


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## djl (Mar 29, 2009)

keelie0216-
If you go to the 'General Relationship Discussion' and look just below where it says General Relationship Discussion, on the left side you will see a button that says "New Thread". Click on that.
If you want to reply on a thread click on "Post Reply" and a window will appear for you to write your message.
I hope this helps.

Regards
djl


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## Fritz (Apr 3, 2009)

If both of you think you want to married to each other, then keep talking and find help and get rid of the computer and I would say be your husbands's porn sight.


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