# Finding it hard to forgive my daughter



## lou40 (Nov 8, 2011)

I had been with Tom my then-boyfriend for 3 years, i thought we were madly deeply in love, he has a very well paid job. When my daughter Stephanie found out she did great in her school exams she then wanted to goto university and live there with friends but i didnt have any money to help her, so Tom offered to pay for some of her expenses. She started uni over two years ago.

Seven months ago i found out i was pregnant right away as we stopped using condoms because we really wanted to have a baby together. This is my 3rd as i have two daughters aged 19 and 14, and will be his 4th as he has three from his previous marriage.

Four months ago on my facebook a friend of Stephanie at uni told me Stephanie was sleeping with Tom and for proof she told me when they were together next. So i arrived at her uni apartment, hiding myself from the doors peep hole, knocked on the door it took a while for the door to open, she opened the door i let myself in she was dressed in her nightgown and stockings so i knew she had male company somewhere, i found Tom in her bedroom naked in her bed, at one point i was checking to see if there was open condom packets anywhere, but nothing they never used condoms as it was one of his conditions so she had to get the contraceptive implant when they started seeing each other.

We had a big fall out. I found out he's been seeing her on a weekly basis since just before she moved out to goto uni, its the only reason he pays for her uni fee's. Ive also found out he pays for her iPhone 4 contract and bought her two large drawers full of lingerie. Everything ive been finding out has been devestating me more and more.

They have stopped seeing each other since i found them together, he has been pleading to get back with me and she has been in tears at my door being all deeply sorry, my neighbours found out when yelled at own daughter as being a prostitute and a dirty **** of the highest kind.

I have no time for him, i totally ignore everything he tells me like he doesnt exist and wont ever let him see our baby (scan shows its a girl by the way).

I want to forgive her i really do, but i just cant. She says she wouldnt have slept with him in a million years but she felt she couldnt refuse his financial offer even as she first found it repulsive. When she found out i was pregnant she stopped seeing him for a week but he immediately threatened to cancel all her funds so she continued seeing him.

Her sister now hates her.
But shes my daughter, i realise she was in a difficult situation, i just dont know how to figure this out?


----------



## golfergirl (Dec 8, 2010)

lou40 said:


> I had been with Tom my then-boyfriend for 3 years, i thought we were madly deeply in love, he has a very well paid job. When my daughter Stephanie found out she did great in her school exams she then wanted to goto university and live there with friends but i didnt have any money to help her, so Tom offered to pay for some of her expenses. She started uni over two years ago.
> 
> Seven months ago i found out i was pregnant right away as we stopped using condoms because we really wanted to have a baby together. This is my 3rd as i have two daughters aged 19 and 14, and will be his 4th as he has three from his previous marriage.
> 
> ...


Wow. I don't know what to say. How old was she when he started molesting her? I would go to counseling with your daughter, she is a victim too. Even if she was 18, he was in a parental role with her. Tom needs to stay away from all your children and supervised visits only with female baby.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Lon (Jun 6, 2011)

Reserve your anger for this sexual predator that was sleeping with both you and your daughter... he was supposedly assuming a fatherly role, and so was committing an act of incestuous child sexual abuse (even if it wasn't stautory due to her age). Yes your daughter had a choice and went along, but like GG says, she is a victim and needs guidance from a responsible adult, preferably a professional at this point however you as her mother must find a way to reconcile this with her.


----------



## lou40 (Nov 8, 2011)

golfergirl said:


> Wow. I don't know what to say. How old was she when he started molesting her? I would go to counseling with your daughter, she is a victim too. Even if she was 18, he was in a parental role with her. Tom needs to stay away from all your children and supervised visits only with female baby.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


She was 17 when they first started.
I never sensed a thing, nothing at all. All the wonderful things of a relationship were present, sex was often amazing... but has now really messed with my head knowing where his... 'it' has been all those times.

Counsilling is probably best for me and my daughter.
Tom will NOT have any access to our baby daughter, i hope.


----------



## golfergirl (Dec 8, 2010)

lou40 said:


> She was 17 when they first started.
> I never sensed a thing, nothing at all. All the wonderful things of a relationship were present, sex was often amazing... but has now really messed with my head knowing where his... 'it' has been all those times.
> 
> Counsilling is probably best for me and my daughter.
> Tom will NOT have any access to our baby daughter, i hope.


I do understand your being upset with you daughter as an initial gut reaction, but even though they look 25 - she still was (and is) a kid. I do hope you help her through with a professional and recognize she is a victim as well - even more than you. What a horrible creep, I'm sorry this happened to your family.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

This is why my daughter never met my boyfriends. 

I am so sorry you are going through this, emotionally for the molestation of your child and the TOTAL betrayal from your bf.

*Drop this turd*, but first, call the police. Your daughter and you will patch this up, but that man must be held responsible.


----------



## Laurae1967 (May 10, 2011)

golfergirl said:


> Wow. I don't know what to say. How old was she when he started molesting her? I would go to counseling with your daughter, she is a victim too. Even if she was 18, he was in a parental role with her. Tom needs to stay away from all your children and supervised visits only with female baby.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


:iagree:

You are blaming the victim. You need therapy and so does your daughter. I hope you will get it.


----------



## chattycathy (Aug 19, 2011)

Tell him to bug off (get child support for the baby if you can though) and tell your daughter that you are very hurt, that she must be very hurt and that hopefully you two can find peace with each other with time.
Offer to get her a therapist to work through what happened.
Get one for yourself too.


----------



## Tall Average Guy (Jul 26, 2011)

chattycathy said:


> Tell him to bug off (get child support for the baby if you can though) and tell your daughter that you are very hurt, that she must be very hurt and that hopefully you two can find peace with each other with time.
> Offer to get her a therapist to work through what happened.
> Get one for yourself too.


Also consult a lawyer to get your options. I some states, 17 is over the age of consent, so you may not have much you can do. Also, by seeking child support, you may be tieing this guy to your family. I am not advocating keeping your child away from his/her father. I am saying find out your options so that you can best protect yourself, your daughter, and your soon to be born.


----------



## ClipClop (Apr 28, 2011)

who is the facebook friend who told you about the affair 
I'm remarried and y I'm crazy about my husband . if I found out that my college aged daughter having affair with him I'm not sure I could ever forgive her at least not for years in years . and of course I'd kill him . maybe even literally .

your ex is an opportunistic scumball . But your daughter had options. the first 1 should of been loyalty to you . and unless he had some reason to believe you would never believe her , she should have gone to you as soon as he propositioned her that is if he was the 1 who did came on to her first .

amazes me that horrible creature who call himself a man would want back into your life . delusional . 

I'm sorry for all of your pain . being betrayed by your own child just gotta be the worst .
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## DanF (Sep 27, 2010)

I think that this would cause me to lose my mind. This is soap opera stuff!

But lou, this poor excuse for a man took advantage of your daughter. While she is old enough to know better, she was still suckered in by a predator. She and you need to get counseling and he needs to be gone NOW.


----------



## chattycathy (Aug 19, 2011)

ClipClop said:


> who is the facebook friend who told you about the affair
> I'm remarried and y I'm crazy about my husband . if I found out that my college aged daughter having affair with him I'm not sure I could ever forgive her at least not for years in years . and of course I'd kill him . maybe even literally .
> 
> your ex is an opportunistic scumball . But your daughter had options. the first 1 should of been loyalty to you . and unless he had some reason to believe you would never believe her , she should have gone to you as soon as he propositioned her that is if he was the 1 who did came on to her first .
> ...


ClipClop, the daughter is still a child. No matter how sophisticated or willing seeming in the relationship. The man was a father figure to her for years (since she was a 15 year old). 

He had a more than usual power over her (more than a man his age with a girl that age who he hadn't been part of the family to).

It is different than if the daughter were in her twenties or older......horrible then too but different.


----------



## golfergirl (Dec 8, 2010)

chattycathy said:


> ClipClop, the daughter is still a child. No matter how sophisticated or willing seeming in the relationship. The man was a father figure to her for years (since she was a 15 year old).
> 
> He had a more than usual power over her (more than a man his age with a girl that age who he hadn't been part of the family to).
> 
> It is different than if the daughter were in her twenties or older......horrible then too but different.


I agree the daughter is a victim too.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Trenton (Aug 25, 2010)

michzz said:


> Put this sociapath up on charges of at least statutory rape.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


^Yes!^

Forgive your daughter and move past this sociopath, become stronger. I can't imagine all the hurt you are feeling right now but your daughter needs you. Easier said than done for you, I'm sure. Give yourself a chance to feel all the pain and confusion and then forgive.


----------



## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

Maybe he bribed her for college money or said he'd stop helping if she didn't sleep with him.


----------



## tacoma (May 1, 2011)

You all are letting this daughter off too easily.

17 is not a child and 17 is old enough to know you don`t **** your mothers man.

It`s really that simple.


----------



## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

tacoma said:


> You all are letting this daughter off too easily.
> 
> 17 is not a child and 17 is old enough to know you don`t **** your mothers man.
> 
> It`s really that simple.


But we don't know how long it's been going on or the circumstances around it.

Someone in my family was abused by her own father until 19. It started when she was 12. I hardly blame her, even though she knew it was wrong.


----------



## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

Yeah the daughter is not completely blameless. Yes, she is young and lacking life experience, but she also is old enough to kne how wrong what he suggested was.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## lou40 (Nov 8, 2011)

He hasnt been a father to either of my girls, he was my boyfriend and nothing else other than friends with my family. He always made it clear he doesnt want to be their father like its not his place.

Legal age of conscent here in England is 16, she wasnt a virgin when they first started seeing each other. She previously had a few boyfriends who she might have slept with, i know she had with one boy as i found them in the act one time.

I dont think he has done anything legally wrong, it was her choice to sleep with him, she wasnt threatened or forced into it. He made her a financial offer to which she had no problem opening her legs for, thats payment in kind which is a form of prostitution. Shes an adult now so what she wants to do is up to her, but not this, i mean he is 48, 29 years older than her - i would've never had sex with anyone that old when i was her age not for anything.

She is now 19 so i doubt the police would pursue anything as she is fully legal to do anything she likes.

She visited me this evening, i let her in. I couldnt make conversation. I know i shouldnt be like this and i should be supportive for her especially as shes supposed to be studying.


----------



## zpac (Nov 9, 2011)

michzz said:


> Put this sociapath up on charges of at least statutory rape.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


But it wasn't rape. She was over the age of consent and she went along with it out of free will.

Some people really need to get over themselves. She has not been a victim of any crime here. And that guy is not a rapist, a scumbag but not a rapist. Not per defenition.

Her on the other hand exchanged sex for money. She's far from a saint, and neither is he offcourse.


----------



## zpac (Nov 9, 2011)

that_girl said:


> But we don't know how long it's been going on or the circumstances around it.


No we can only go by what lou40 has written. I see nothing that suggests that he is a rapist or a molester. And saying that he is would just be making stuff up.

He sure is a scumbag but I hate how people throw around the words rape and molesting for nothing. Lets reserve those words for women who *actually* have been raped or molested.


----------



## ladybird (Jun 16, 2010)

lou40 said:


> I had been with Tom my then-boyfriend for 3 years, i thought we were madly deeply in love, he has a very well paid job. When my daughter Stephanie found out she did great in her school exams she then wanted to goto university and live there with friends but i didnt have any money to help her, so Tom offered to pay for some of her expenses. She started uni over two years ago.
> 
> Seven months ago i found out i was pregnant right away as we stopped using condoms because we really wanted to have a baby together. This is my 3rd as i have two daughters aged 19 and 14, and will be his 4th as he has three from his previous marriage.
> 
> ...


Wow.. I don't really know what to say.. Only that I am sorry.

I think that maybe in time you will forgive your daughter. 

And a man that sleeps with a girlfriends daughter, has he no shame. That is worse then sleeping with a sister. 

She should have came to you and told you what was going on and not sleep with the guy for paying her fees.. I mean really. 

He used both of you.


----------



## greenpearl (Sep 3, 2010)

When we are teenagers, when we are about to become adults and be responsible for ourselves, we are scared, we are lost, we are also vain. 

We are scared because we don't have the ability and experience to be responsible for ourselves. 

We are lost because we don't know anything about life, we don't know what route to take. 

We are vain because we think having those material things can make us look good, and attract other people's attention. 

Since we don't have the ability to get what we want, we seek an easy way out. Little do we know that that easy way is going to be the most difficult way and it is going to cause us a lot of sorrow and regret in our adult life. Later on we need a lot of help to become sane again. 

What your daughter did is going to affect her life tremendously. If she feels bad for what she did, she is going to be eaten up by her sorrow and her regret. If she has no shame about what she did, then she is having big moral issues. 

Being betrayed is the hardest thing to forgive, especially by someone we trust and love. 

You need help! Professional and spiritual help!


----------



## Trenton (Aug 25, 2010)

greenpearl...have missed you.


----------



## greenpearl (Sep 3, 2010)

Trenton said:


> greenpearl...have missed you.


  

I have always been reading here!

TAM is the only forum I visit!


----------



## Trenton (Aug 25, 2010)

greenpearl said:


> I have always been reading here!
> 
> TAM is the only forum I visit!


----------



## chattycathy (Aug 19, 2011)

Okay then.
He is a slimey, dirty old man. Dump him if you haven't already and she is a stupid, immoral, very troubled daughter who needs therapy since she is void of proper direction.
You can't dump her though. You made her, she is part of you.
Just tell her to get professional help. Maybe you both can see someone together to get somewhere where it will never happen again and be examined to see what happened to start with....


----------



## chattycathy (Aug 19, 2011)

Okay then.
He is a slimey, dirty old man. Dump him if you haven't already and she is a stupid, immoral, very troubled daughter who needs therapy since she is void of proper direction.
You can't dump her though. You made her, she is part of you.
Just tell her to get professional help. Maybe you both can see someone together to get somewhere where it will never happen again and be examined to see what happened to start with....


----------



## Cookie crumbs (Nov 10, 2011)

You have a right to your anger and your pain. However, as many have expressed, you are chanelling it towards your daughter, the one you can hurt the most and the one who hurt you the most.
As you know, relationships will come and go... and yes...most without such a traumatic turn of events!
As much as you are hurting right now, try to not make decisions that you will regret for a lifetime.
Forgiveness is a choice, a difficult one and the journey there will be a long one. She made a horrendous error in judgement and this has been a huge learning experience for her.
Harbouring all this anger and hatred will do harm to all your relationships. You girls can all pull together to walk this painful walk and support each other in your own individual journey to healing. 
Good luck (((HUGS)))


----------



## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

zpac said:


> No we can only go by what lou40 has written. I see nothing that suggests that he is a rapist or a molester. And saying that he is would just be making stuff up.
> 
> He sure is a scumbag but I hate how people throw around the words rape and molesting for nothing. Lets reserve those words for women who *actually* have been raped or molested.


I was molested, so I don't throw that word around.

She's 17. Last time I checked the age of consent is 18. Maybe that's just CA. He is well above 3 years her senior.



> For the purposes of this section, a "minor" is a person
> under the age of 18 years and an "adult" is a person
> who is at least 18 years of age.
> 
> ...


http://www.ageofconsent.com/california.htm


----------



## lou40 (Nov 8, 2011)

I havnt heard from him for about a week now, im glad. 

She told me yesterday she has to keep on seeing him while shes at uni. So today i went to the police to see what they could do, they basically said they cant do anything as he is not forcing or blackmailing her and further adding its a legal method of prostitution.

I simply cant afford to help her financially not even a loan, and a student loan isnt enough alone, without him my finances leveled out with the bills and two teenage daughters to support, now i have a baby to support soon by myself. If it wasnt for the baby i could have probably helped her.

She has almost three years left of uni. The strange thing is she doesnt seem bothered with having to sleep with him other than the guilt of... he was my boyfriend and is her baby sisters father. I hate saying this but he was good in bed infact he was amazing so maybe thats why she seems ok with sleeping with him, i just dont know - obviously im not going to talk with my own daughter about the details of her sex life.

Its one of the reasons im not looking forward to going with her to see a therapist, incase she starts talking about the reasons why she doesnt mind sleeping with him, i dont want to hear her say things like how she enjoys it with him (if thats how it is with them), it would completely break my heart.


----------



## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

Well, your daughter has horrible morals and is, sadly, a prostitute.

She knows it's wrong, that it's hurting you, and yet she's still doing it.

Time for tough love. I would cut all ties. But I'm a b1tch like that.


----------



## Laurae1967 (May 10, 2011)

For those who are blaming the daughter - do you have a teenager who is 16 or 17? I do. He's emotionally immature, as are most teens of that age. At 17, a child's brain is not fully matured (not until 26). This girl WAS victimized. It may not have been rape legally, but this scumbag took advantage of a girl who is screwed up and misguided. 

To the OP - are you at all worried for your daughter's well-being?Doesn't it concern you that she would in essence prostitute herself for college tuition? This behavior doesn't happen in a vacuum. Hasn't it occured to you that a healthy daughter would not have done what she did? If your daughter is vulnerable to this type of manipulation, there is obviously something wrong with the whole picture. As her mother, I'd like to think that you would focus on getting your daughter counseling.


----------



## CandieGirl (Apr 27, 2011)

lou40 said:


> I havnt heard from him for about a week now, im glad.
> 
> She told me yesterday she has to keep on seeing him while shes at uni. So today i went to the police to see what they could do, they basically said they cant do anything as he is not forcing or blackmailing her and further adding its a legal method of prostitution.
> 
> ...


Am I the only one who is of the opinion that this seems all just a little bit far fetched??? :scratchhead:

Sounds like a story line on Coronation Street, sadly.

If it's TRUE, then even sadder. Whoever said that the daughter is a prozzie, that's exactly what I was thinking...rape, schmape! Indeed save that for actual victims.


----------



## lou40 (Nov 8, 2011)

Laurae1967 said:


> To the OP - are you at all worried for your daughter's well-being?Doesn't it concern you that she would in essence prostitute herself for college tuition? This behavior doesn't happen in a vacuum. Hasn't it occured to you that a healthy daughter would not have done what she did? If your daughter is vulnerable to this type of manipulation, there is obviously something wrong with the whole picture. As her mother, I'd like to think that you would focus on getting your daughter counseling.


I dont know what to say, i thought we were all a very happy and loving family. Maybe she is the way she is because she hasnt had any male guidance of a father most of her life?

Me and her father split up a year after i had my 2nd daughter. It just slowly became a loveless relationship, we agreed to have a 2nd child as hope to bring me and him closer together, which it did for a while. He found someone else and moved away with her, last i heard they have three children together.

I dont know what went wrong with her. Shes always been a happy girl everyone loved her, shes very attractive shes always had boys asking her out, shes bright and mostly shy, we rarely argue about anything we got on really well.

The only thing i can think of, when me and Tom made love he'd end up going at it quite hard with me for a prolonged amount of time causing the bed to make loud noises, we tried not to. I never heard anything from her bedroom when she had boyfriends with her. So maybe it did something to her having to hear the constant banging coming from my bedroom.

I cant think of anything else that would cause her to be the way she is. And yes as a mother im concerned about her prostituting herself out, but shes at university shes trying hard to secure a good career for the rest of her life. I cant help her with that, she is an adult now she has her own independant life to pursue. As long as shes happy and not taking drugs and shes doing well for herself then im happy for her. She can have sex with who shes likes but not with my boyfriend now ex.


----------



## lou40 (Nov 8, 2011)

CandieGirl said:


> Am I the only one who is of the opinion that this seems all just a little bit far fetched??? :scratchhead:


Well hopefully it wont happen to you, and then having to read responses like that.


----------



## zpac (Nov 9, 2011)

that_girl said:


> I was molested, so I don't throw that word around.
> 
> She's 17. Last time I checked the age of consent is 18. Maybe that's just CA. He is well above 3 years her senior.
> 
> ...


She has stated she lives in England where the age of consent is 16.

Her daughter did it out of her own free will. She wasn't forced to do it(not from what the OP has written and that's all we have to go on). She was neither raped or molested, not per the defeniton of those things.


----------



## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

Well, too bad it's 16.


----------



## CandieGirl (Apr 27, 2011)

zpac said:


> She has stated she lives in England where the age of consent is 16.
> 
> *Her daughter did it out of her own free will.* She wasn't forced to do it(not from what the OP has written and that's all we have to go on). She was neither raped or molested, not per the defeniton of those things.


Not only that, but according to Mom, Tom is just that great in bed, maybe THAT'S why she's doing it.

Just sayin'....


----------



## Halien (Feb 20, 2011)

zpac said:


> She has stated she lives in England where the age of consent is 16.
> 
> Her daughter did it out of her own free will. She wasn't forced to do it(not from what the OP has written and that's all we have to go on). She was neither raped or molested, not per the defeniton of those things.


I'm not sure where people started getting this idea that legal age somehow implied that a person is ready and mature enough to make decisions. Spend time in the system as a kid, and you know exactly what it is. It is nothing more than the date where the system tells a kid that they are no longer its responsibility. 

This happens every day here in America. Sure, this particular girl might have wanted a college education, but she is still mentally unprepared for the big decisions in life.

I'm sorry, but my mom kicked me out of the house as a kid whenever I was too much of a hassle, but even she understood that there was no such thing as a free meal. As a 17 year old boy, if some woman said that she was paying for my college education, even my mom would've showed her the working end of a shotgun.


----------



## Lon (Jun 6, 2011)

lou40 said:


> I dont know what to say, i thought we were all a very happy and loving family. Maybe she is the way she is because she hasnt had any male guidance of a father most of her life?
> 
> ...And yes as a mother im concerned about her prostituting herself out, but shes at university shes trying hard to secure a good career for the rest of her life. I cant help her with that, she is an adult now she has her own independant life to pursue. As long as shes happy and not taking drugs and shes doing well for herself then im happy for her. She can have sex with who shes likes but not with my boyfriend now ex.


ok first part is exactly what I was presuming in my mind when I suggested your ex BF was assuming a fatherly role to her. He not only has been the man of the house, he is also the one supporting her through uni as a parent should. Since you have obviously washed your hands of parental duties by the sounds of it you really don't have a say who she sees I guess. You have enabled this to a certain degree, and I suspect your relationship as a parent was pretty much over, your daughter obviously didn't have a role model and had to figure out how to get things herself.

I'm sorry if this sounds mean, but I just can't pretend like I can read your words and watch as you try to blame your child for all this. Sure she is now responsible for her choices, and has made some seriously unethical ones, but has obviously made the ones she thinks are best and if you don't like it that's entirely your problem. If you don't like my answer than you should be doing something proactive about this, make this man's relationship with your daughter as impossible as you can, blow it up publicly, go to the university and inform her the administration, make this guy seriously uncomfortable with screwing your daugter and paying her to do so, tell all his friends and family, coworkers, colleagues etc.


----------



## tacoma (May 1, 2011)

Laurae1967 said:


> For those who are blaming the daughter - do you have a teenager who is 16 or 17? I do. He's emotionally immature, as are most teens of that age. At 17, a child's brain is not fully matured (not until 26). This girl WAS victimized. It may not have been rape legally, but this scumbag took advantage of a girl who is screwed up and misguided.



I`m going to repeat.

17 is plenty old enough to know ****ing your mom`s man is wrong on so many levels it`s not funny.
This isn`t a complex decision.

If my son did this to me he`d be cut out of my life.


----------



## zpac (Nov 9, 2011)

Halien said:


> I'm not sure where people started getting this idea that legal age somehow implied that a person is ready and mature enough to make decisions. Spend time in the system as a kid, and you know exactly what it is. It is nothing more than the date where the system tells a kid that they are no longer its responsibility.
> 
> This happens every day here in America. Sure, this particular girl might have wanted a college education, but she is still mentally unprepared for the big decisions in life.
> 
> I'm sorry, but my mom kicked me out of the house as a kid whenever I was too much of a hassle, but even she understood that there was no such thing as a free meal. As a 17 year old boy, if some woman said that she was paying for my college education, even my mom would've showed her the working end of a shotgun.


You know what you are doing when you are 17. But I'm not defending what he did at all.

I'm just pointing out that he didn't rape or molest her. She had a choice.


----------



## zpac (Nov 9, 2011)

that_girl said:


> Well, too bad it's 16.


If the guy was lets say 20(and she then 17) and the age of consent was 18. Would you think that guy was a rapist even though she did it out of her own free will? I doubt it.

*In this case* the age have nothing to do whetever it's rape or not. He didn't rape her, not even close and anybody who says he did is crazy.

He is a grade a jerk though, thats not debatable.


----------



## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

But he wasn't 20. Holy crap.

Here in CA, there's a 3 year gap. 

They were both wrong. I don't see why you're arguing with me. I got more of the story so that's that.


----------



## zpac (Nov 9, 2011)

that_girl said:


> But he wasn't 20. Holy crap.
> 
> Here in CA, there's a 3 year gap.
> 
> They were both wrong. I don't see why you're arguing with me. I got more of the story so that's that.



You are just making up your own defentions of what rape and molesting is to fit your agenda.

His age does *not* have any affect on whetever its rape or not. It just doesn't. 

Her age does have an affect on it but in this case she was over the legal age and did it out of her own free will. Case closed.


----------



## DanF (Sep 27, 2010)

Wow, Lou. Just wow.
When I read this updated thread earlier today, I had to walk away from it to think.
First off, I am by no means a therapist or counselor, so the following is all opinion, but I believe that I do know a thing or two about kids and young adults.
I have over a dozen nieces, nephews, great nieces and nephews and am pretty involved with all of them. I also worked with middle to high school aged kids in after school sports for a number of years.
I was a Guardian Ad Litem for the county for a period of time as well.
When I get to know these kids, I realize how impressionable and vulnerable they really are. It is scary.
It has crossed my mind just how easily a man my age(late 40s) could manipulate a young girl into bed. That thought really disturbs me, but I do believe that probably close to half of the hundreds of kids that I have been around could have been mine sexually if I was willing to be patient and pursue such a horrible crime against a child.
Your daughter was a victim of a sexual predator. There is no doubt in my mind.

However, continuing the affair once it was exposed and talking to you signifies something much deeper and darker. This kid needs counseling and help right now. Please find someone to help her or she will likely lead a continued life of prostitution. That is exactly what she's doing and it is so sad that she thinks that it is her only option.
My prayers are with you and her.

For the rest of you, get off the rape and and how she was raised. Lou needs help and this isn't helping.

Lou, pm me if you want and I would even be willing to talk to you via email or phone if I could possibly be of any help.
I am in the U.S. and I think you are in England, right?


----------



## Halien (Feb 20, 2011)

zpac said:


> You know what you are doing when you are 17. But I'm not defending what he did at all.
> 
> I'm just pointing out that he didn't rape or molest her. She had a choice.


I do understand your point. Most people who have their futures mapped out for them at 17 know what they are doing at 17. But to someone who is scared that their future might be a pipe dream, 17 is not the age to be facing a smooth talking man, a 'really good lover' with a wad of cash in his hand. The options instinctively available to a 25 year old are not even understood at this age. 

From experience, I can tell you that a middle aged person can really know how to manipulate the mind of a teenager to justify what they want. There is a muture, middle aged adult before you, smokin' hot, telling you how its really just no big deal. And once intitial boundaries of a 17 year old are crossed, maybe just letting them touch you, the 17 year old feels dirty, a betrayer. 17 is too young to consistently be able to back your way out of this conundrum. I did it before it really got started, but I wouldn't cast stones at someone who didn't.

I'm not excusing their choices. But we certainly shouldn't cast stones at both victims here, the mother and daughter.


----------



## ClipClop (Apr 28, 2011)

She made a choice. Give him sex for money. She wants to continue.

I guess she has no respect for anyone but herself. 

Can't her father kick the **** out of him at least? Uncles? Cousins? 

The person who told you must think your daughter is a *****. The whole school probably knows. Is she also having sex for grades? Maybe jobs later? Sex is a means to an end. Very sad. But I wouldn't trust her with any man who has something she wants. 

How is the op suppose to trust her with any future boyfriends?

I have girls. But I am not so naive as to believe that all 17 YOs are innocent babies. This girl is far from innocent.

I had thought maybe the person who told was put up to it by the girl because she wanted it to stop. Not so. 


_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## golfergirl (Dec 8, 2010)

Halien said:


> I do understand your point. Most people who have their futures mapped out for them at 17 know what they are doing at 17. But to someone who is scared that their future might be a pipe dream, 17 is not the age to be facing a smooth talking man, a 'really good lover' with a wad of cash in his hand. The options instinctively available to a 25 year old are not even understood at this age.
> 
> From experience, I can tell you that a middle aged person can really know how to manipulate the mind of a teenager to justify what they want. There is a muture, middle aged adult before you, smokin' hot, telling you how its really just no big deal. And once intitial boundaries of a 17 year old are crossed, maybe just letting them touch you, the 17 year old feels dirty, a betrayer. 17 is too young to consistently be able to back your way out of this conundrum. I did it before it really got started, but I wouldn't cast stones at someone who didn't.
> 
> I'm not excusing their choices. But we certainly shouldn't cast stones at both victims here, the mother and daughter.


I agree.

Mom I know you can't crap money but are there other options like living at home, part-time job, anything that one could explore? You're almost advocating your daughter continue for few more years just to finish education. On going on about Tom's prowess as a lover? Your attitude leaves bad taste in my mouth.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

I question if she was sexually abused as a child...


----------



## Lon (Jun 6, 2011)

golfergirl said:


> I agree.
> 
> Mom I know you can't crap money but are there other options like living at home, part-time job, anything that one could explore? You're almost advocating your daughter continue for few more years just to finish education. On going on about Tom's prowess as a lover? Your attitude leaves bad taste in my mouth.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


:iagree:

the reason for my harsh post earlier is because it seems as if you are jealous of your daughter, that she stole your man that you had to compete with her. The reality is this whole thing is a massive breach of ethics of which you are a victim, but your daughter is not a peer, is not your equal and is not the competition here. Your feelings toward your daughter should not be of betrayal but of concern for her welfare and disappointment for her choice and concern for her future.

I realize emotionally this will scar you too but almost all of your anger should be for this "tom" sicko who was disgusting enough to carry on a sexual relationship with both a mother and her daughter. This is not about the age of consent, nor about your daughter this is about you being sad about losing this man... your words demonstrate that you view your daughter only as a best friend and how could a best friend betray you like that... you need to find a way to step back and look at the big picture, this isn't primarily about your daughter this is about a sick man who has come into your lives and destroyed your entire family for his own sexual pleasure.


----------



## SlowlyGettingWiser (Apr 7, 2012)

1.) This thread ended over a year ago.

2.) Lou40 hasn't posted ANYTHING since then, but DID sign on to TAM in Sept 2012.

3.) I think this thread is total cr*p because Lou40's profile says she's been MARRIED for 16-20yrs. So this is either 2+ decade worth of OLD DRAMA...OR, she's a TROLL!


----------



## Dollystanford (Mar 14, 2012)

I'm intrigued as to why your daughter appears to have no loyalty to you...I accept that she's been manipulated by a sexual predator and doesn't have the emotional maturity to understand what he's doing

But I have a 16 year old and I can't imagine her treating me with such disrespect. What was your relationship like when she was growing up?


----------



## Dollystanford (Mar 14, 2012)

oh ha ha my bad


----------



## Goldmember357 (Jan 31, 2012)

i'm curious why only the boyfriend is being attacked?

why is the daughter the "victim"

isn't she in college and 19?

??:scratchhead:


do we no longer have control over some of our actions


----------



## OhGeesh (Jan 5, 2010)

Counseling for you definitely!!!!! As far as your daughter well I don't she will think she needs it.

There are websites that cater to this type of behavior it's not pedi or sociopathic. It's just being a sugar daddy and the the girl a willing sugar baby.

If she was 17 press charges if not LOTS OF COUNSELING.


----------



## BjornFree (Aug 16, 2012)

Dead Thread............


----------

