# Does it bother you?



## Enchanted

I'm in my forties now and still considered attractive. But being 44 isn't the same as being 24. Our youth obsessed culture doesn't see a 44 year old woman as being as desirable as those in their 20's and 30's. This bother's me. Does it bother you?


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## Wazza

My 52 year old wife is the most beautiful woman I have ever met. If you and I ever meet, you might be the second most beautiful. Hard for a 20-something to have the same depth.

So, no, it doesn't bother me and it shouldn't bother you.


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## Enchanted

Wazza said:


> My 52 year old wife is the most beautiful woman I have ever met. If you and I ever meet, you might be the second most beautiful. Hard for a 20-something to have the same depth.
> 
> So, no, it doesn't bother me and it shouldn't bother you.


LOL. That's very sweet. I probably should stay off the internet on sites that talk about your "desirability" index. It so freaking depressing!


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## Mavash.

I will admit when I hit 45 this did bother me because suddenly I was closer to 50 than I was to 40. I started noticing my age and yes it upset me. 

Then I began to make changes in my life for the better. I began to grow into my age and cherish it. I started working out, dressing better, lost weight, downsized my life, made some changes I'd wanted to do, etc. Like wazza said I began to realize I had depth that the 20 somethings can't begin to compete with.

There is a line in the movie Fried Green Tomato's that sums up how I feel these days. These young girls took the middle aged woman's parking spot giggling "face it lady we're younger and faster". The middle aged woman rams her car into the back of their's saying "face it girls I'm older and I have more insurance". LOL

Yeah that's totally me. You couldn't pay me to be 20 again. I LOVE being 46. It's an awesome age. I've been happily married for 21 years, I have 3 great kids, my husband thinks I'm beautiful, and yes I have plenty of insurance. LOL


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## Dollystanford

hell no, it takes a good 20 years to develop a sparkling wit and personality like this you know


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## Wazza

If a 20-something wrote the index it will be shallow.

And my first post was the truth, not just an attempt to be nice. I genuinely could not imagine trading my wife in for a younger model. Could think of nothing worse.


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## Enchanted

Mavash. said:


> I will admit when I hit 45 this did bother me because suddenly I was closer to 50 than I was to 40. I started noticing my age and yes it bothered me.
> 
> Then I began to make changes in my life for the better. I began to grow into my age and cherish it. I started working out, dressing better, lost weight, downsized my life, made some changes I'd wanted to do, etc. Like wazza said I began to realize I had depth that the 20 somethings can't begin to compete with.
> 
> There is a line in the movie Fried Green Tomato's that sums up how I feel these days. These young girls took the middle aged woman's parking spot giggling "face it lady we're younger and faster". The middle aged woman rams her car into the back of their's saying "face it girls I'm older and I have more insurance". LOL
> 
> Yeah that's totally me. You couldn't pay me to be 20 again. I LOVE being 46. It's an awesome age.


I love that movie! I need to come to terms with being 44. When I was in my 20's I felt like I had a certain power in this world. I never made a lot of money or had a fabulous personality so I could sort of get by on my looks. But I can't do that anymore because no matter how much time I spend getting ready I don't look like I did and it hurts. The funny thing is I'm still battling pimples and trying to figure out how to tame frizz. I guess some things never change.


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## Mavash.

Coming to terms with being 44 is a good way to put it. I had to do the same thing. At 44 I was contemplating having a little work done on my face (what was I thinking?) LOL 

Now I look in the mirror and think I look damn good for a middle aged mother of 3. I wouldn't change a thing.


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## norajane

I think I feel better about myself at 45 than I did at 25. I don't care so much about pleasing others now, so I have less anxiety about myself. I wear less make-up now and look great anyway, hah!

Our youth culture is silly. I don't need every man out there to think I'm attractive or to fantasize about being with me (sex), just the one man in my life.


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## Enchanted

Wazza said:


> If a 20-something wrote the index it will be shallow.
> 
> And my first post was the truth, not just an attempt to be nice. I genuinely could not imagine trading my wife in for a younger model. Could think of nothing worse.


It was a test on blog that was probably written by a guy in his 20's. But honestly, I've read soooo many posts here that point out how women in their 40's aren't so desirable anymore and how their going to have a hard time meeting people. Granted this stuff is posted in the cheating section of the forum but there is truth in that train of thought. My marriage is good but I have this fear that something will happen to my husband and I'll be single.


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## Enchanted

norajane said:


> I think I feel better about myself at 45 than I did at 25. I don't care so much about pleasing others now, so I have less anxiety about myself. I wear less make-up now and look great anyway, hah!
> 
> Our youth culture is silly. I don't need every man out there to think I'm attractive or to fantasize about being with me (sex), just the one man in my life.


I feel just as insecure at 44 as I did at 24. I'm just older not better. LOL. I don't wear makeup either because I actually look younger without it. I need to develop a sense of self.


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## Mavash.

Enchanted said:


> My marriage is good but I have this fear that something will happen to my husband and I'll be single.


Your fears are completely unfounded. I've got over 40 friends now who are divorced and ALL OF THEM have found someone new. No exceptions.

I used to have this fear too but I realize how silly it is. Do you think ALL men over 40 can get 20 or even 30 something year old women? Really? Like somehow we're now excluded from the dating pool because of our age? If that's true then a lot of men are going to be single too. LOL


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## Wazza

Enchanted said:


> It was a test on blog that was probably written by a guy in his 20's. But honestly, I've read soooo many posts here that point out how women in their 40's aren't so desirable anymore and how their going to have a hard time meeting people. Granted this stuff is posted in the cheating section of the forum but there is truth in that train of thought. My marriage is good but I have this fear that something will happen to my husband and I'll be single.


If you just want wild, promiscuous sex, maybe it is an issue, though even there a lot of that stuff is written by betrayed spouses trying to point out how their ex wives made bad decisions choosing to be cougars and will end up lonely.

I can assure you, as a male I check out older women as well as younger when walking down the street. 

And if one thing ever appends to your husband, heaven forbid, there will be other guys who want you.


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## Enchanted

Mavash. said:


> Your fears are completely unfounded. I've got over 40 friends now who are divorced and ALL OF THEM have found someone new. No exceptions.
> 
> I used to have this fear too but I realize how silly it is. Do you think ALL men over 40 can get 20 or even 30 something year old women? Really? Like somehow we're now excluded from the dating pool because of our age? If that's true then a lot of men are going to be single too. LOL


That's true. But I have a friend my age and she's never been married and cannot find a boyfriend. I do think her standards are somewhat impossible but still she really can't get a date. But even when we were in our 20's she didn't date much so I shouldn't go by her.

I hope my husband lives forever and nothing takes him away from me.


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## Zig

Aging certainly has a way of humbling women.

Not only do looks begin to fade, but men become a smaller fraction of the population as you look at increasing ages (men are generally less healthy and don't live as long as women). This is why divorced men remarry so quickly: it's not because men want marriage more, there simply aren't enough men to go around.

I've noticed that women become a lot nicer to you once they turn 30 and are not in a relationship. They have to be. However, it's little consolation to know that a woman has only become interested in you because her looks are fading and demographics are turning against her.


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## Enchanted

Wazza said:


> If you just want wild, promiscuous sex, maybe it is an issue, though even there a lot of that stuff is written by betrayed spouses trying to point out how their ex wives made bad decisions choosing to be cougars and will end up lonely.
> 
> I can assure you, as a male I check out older women as well as younger when walking down the street.
> 
> And if one thing ever appends to your husband, heaven forbid, there will be other guys who want you.


I don't understand the whole cougar concept. When I look at men in their 20's they look like children to me. If they flirted with me I'd find it funny but sort of...perverted. I'm not sure I'd even be flattered because I'd probably be too suspicious. 

I'm glad to know that grown men like you do look at women their age and find them attractive.


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## Wazza

Mavash. said:


> Do you think ALL men over 40 can get 20 or even 30 something year old women?


Do you think we even want a relationship with those younger women?

Seriously, beyond a booty call and an ego boost, what's the point? Give me someone I can make love to and then really talk to any day.

Not theory, I have had younger women show interest, and apart from being happily married, I just don't want shallowness.


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## Cosmos

Enchanted said:


> I'm in my forties now and still considered attractive. But being 44 isn't the same as being 24. Our youth obsessed culture doesn't see a 44 year old woman as being as desirable as those in their 20's and 30's. This bother's me. Does it bother you?


No, not at all. 

I had my years in the sun and no longer define myself by my desirability. Having said that, apparently I can still turn heads, but these days it amuses me more than anything 

OP, a mature woman has her own unique charm. Don't sell yourself short by comparing yourself to younger women... It's futile and ultimately unattractive.


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## Enchanted

Cosmos said:


> No, not at all.
> 
> I had my years in the sun and no longer define myself by my desirability. Having said that, apparently I can still turn heads, but these days it amuses me more than anything
> 
> OP, a mature woman has her own unique charm. Don't sell yourself short by comparing yourself to younger women... It's futile and ultimately unattractive.


What I'm doing is comparing myself to my younger self and losing. It's so weird to see the actresses I grew up with no longer in the spotlight. I remember when Demi More was considered really hot, now she's a joke. 

My life is the best it's ever been so that should make me happy. I want to be OK with growing older.


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## Coffee Amore

No, it doesn't bother me. I'm not 44 years old yet. There are still some more years before I reach my mid-40s, but I'm honestly happy in my skin at the age I'm now. It took me this long to reach acceptance. I don't want to be in my 20s. I read this once on a sign "Don't regret getting old for it's a privilege denied to many."


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## Dollystanford

yeah but Demi is a joke because of her behaviour (and actually trying to act like a teenager), she still looks pretty good

anyone find Dame Helen Mirren a joke? Certainly not!


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## Enchanted

Dollystanford said:


> yeah but Demi is a joke because of her behaviour (and actually trying to act like a teenager), she still looks pretty good
> 
> anyone find Dame Helen Mirren a joke? Certainly not!


You're right. It's her behavior. Picking a man so much younger than herself was stupid.


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## norajane

Enchanted said:


> What I'm doing is comparing myself to my younger self and losing. It's so weird to see the actresses I grew up with no longer in the spotlight. I remember when Demi More was considered really hot, now she's a joke.
> 
> *My life is the best it's ever been so that should make me happy.* I want to be OK with growing older.


THIS is all that matters! All any of us have is today. Embrace it, live it, revel in it, get the most out of it, savor it.


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## Cosmos

Enchanted said:


> What I'm doing is comparing myself to my younger self and losing. It's so weird to see the actresses I grew up with no longer in the spotlight. I remember when Demi More was considered really hot, now she's a joke.
> 
> My life is the best it's ever been so that should make me happy. I want to be OK with growing older.



OP, when we compare ourselves with physical perfection (be it our younger selves or others) we're comparing ourselves with something that is, at best, fleeting. True beauty, however, is another bag of tricks and you can hang on to that for the rest of your life.

Knowing yourself, accepting yourself and making the best of yourself will help you feel at ease with growing older.


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## Enchanted

Cosmos said:


> OP, when we compare ourselves with physical perfection (be it our younger selves or others) we're comparing ourselves with something that is, at best, fleeting. True beauty, however, is another bag of tricks and you can hang on to that for the rest of your life.
> 
> Knowing yourself, accepting yourself and making the best of yourself will help you feel at ease with growing older.


How does one begin to do that?


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## CharlieParker

I think it started bothering Mrs P at 50. Anything I can do to help her?


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## Cosmos

Enchanted said:


> How does one begin to do that?


Here's a start:-

Self-Exploration: Getting To Know Thyself | World of Psychology


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## SimplyAmorous

I'm 46, but unlike many here, If I had a chance... I'd go back in time.. I'd like to do some things over again. 

I also understand the







thing... But no matter how good those hotties look... It still would be shallow & empty - without the whole package of Love & commitment...

I could never do a "Demi Moore" because what happened to her - what was she thinking!#$% That could only last a season. Why set yourself up for pain. 

I too worry (sometimes) if something would happen to my husband... Life is but a breath... each day a gift...it could all go up in flames in a moment. 

I don't like getting older...still not sure I have embraced it yet.. I still feel young ...for now. Just want to hold on to that as long as I can.


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## Enchanted

Cosmos said:


> Here's a start:-
> 
> Self-Exploration: Getting To Know Thyself | World of Psychology


Thank you.


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## MaritimeGuy

I don't understand why you ladies are down on Demi Moore because she had a relationship with a younger man. If she had the energy to be with a much younger guy...why not? I'm sure she enjoyed every bit of it while the relationship was good. I would suggest she simply hooked up with the wrong younger man. Should she be with a pot bellied, ED suffering, balding man just because society thinks she should? Life is too short...go for what turns you on...not what society tells you you should go for. 

In my mind the only thing sad about her is the plastic surgery. She was a beautiful, sexy woman who now looks kinda like a cartoon character. Beauty is something that emanates from inside a woman. Its your spirit more than your outer shell that will attract people.


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## Mavash.

Enchanted said:


> That's true. But I have a friend my age and she's never been married and cannot find a boyfriend. I do think her standards are somewhat impossible but still she really can't get a date. But even when we were in our 20's she didn't date much so I shouldn't go by her.
> 
> I hope my husband lives forever and nothing takes him away from me.


You said it yourself....look at who you are comparing yourself to. LOL 

And please please please stop hoping your husband lives forever. Here's the thing what happens many times is the very thing we fear is the very thing we have to face.

Do I hope my husband I grow old together? Yes. 

Do I fear what would happen to me if heaven forbid he died or left me? No.


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## Mavash.

Demi Moore isn't a good example of growing old with finesse and fabulousness. She's struggled with insecurity all her life as shown by her behavior.

I'd find someone else to look up to not her. Sure she looks good but she's not happy. For example I'm 46 and I have ZERO desire to party or drink. Like someone else said I had my day in the sun and these days I need my beauty sleep. LOL


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## SimplyAmorous

MaritimeGuy said:


> I don't understand why you ladies are down on Demi Moore because she had a relationship with a younger man. If she had the energy to be with a much younger guy...why not? I'm sure she enjoyed every bit of it while the relationship was good. I would suggest she simply hooked up with the wrong younger man. Should she be with a pot bellied, ED suffering, balding man just because society thinks she should? Life is too short...go for what turns you on...not what society tells you you should go for.


 You say "*go for what you want ...if it turns you on"*... well..to this I say... the majority do just that.... and to their detriment...it takes alot more than LUST to pull you through when age starts to take its toll. 

I would never entangle myself with a younger man ....because I would fully expect him to leave me as I aged... I also wouldn't be with an Older man...if I was young & in my 20's... cause I'd want to leave him as he aged - me personally could never do either extreme...it's a total turn off to me...always has been, no amount of $$ could tempt me.

I've always felt the older one is getting played or will get hurt. (Usually it's an older man with big bucks with some young hottie on his arm -who is not there with him cause she is attracted, she just wants the lifestyle- she might even be getting something on the side as well)..... I think it's kinda sick really. 

I guess everyone is different. I'll stick with my own age, even if I wish I was younger (with him)... I speak out of my own feelings on this....as we all do....including yourself MaritimeGuy ...and that's your right. Everyone feels differently.

I am just looking at the destruction that Demi is facing due to her being with someone that much younger.....isn't he having a baby with some new beauty - (In the tabloids, I could be wrong??)

I think it's very very very  that she even felt that would last. I just wouldn't have believed that, never in a day...not with all the temptation he has going on...then expected to never have his own kids to boot... 

If you want to ride it out a season, and only expect a season... I could see it. 



> In my mind the only thing sad about her is the plastic surgery. She was a beautiful, sexy woman who now looks kinda like a cartoon character. *Beauty is something that emanates from inside a woman. Its your spirit more than your outer shell that will attract people*.


Although I agree with this..and I really DO by the way......Rarely in Hollywood I [email protected]#$%^&* 

Show me such a couple.


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## ScarletBegonias

Enchanted said:


> I'm in my forties now and still considered attractive. But being 44 isn't the same as being 24. Our youth obsessed culture doesn't see a 44 year old woman as being as desirable as those in their 20's and 30's. This bother's me. Does it bother you?


granted I'm still 30 so I don't know how much this will mean but here goes with my 2 cents.

Being in your twenties today is more a representation of being a vapid,superficial little twit. There are exceptions and many of them of course but when I think of a twenty something I think "empty headed stick figured flake". I even felt that way when I was in my twenties.Can't explain why.

I think mid 30's and on is when women get truly sexy and beautiful.To me,those ages represent confidence,wisdom,courage,and many other incredibly sexy qualities and traits.Everyone glorifies youth as though it's the end all be all of life.But it isn't. Young women are awkward and still have no idea what their lives are about. The real meat of what is sexy doesn't even begin to start til you're around 34-35.

Just my opinion,of course.


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## Holland

I'm in my mid 40's and hot as hell (well that's what SO tells me). But more importantly I don't give a hoot what anyone else thinks of me or how I look.


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## Anonymous07

Coffee Amore said:


> I read this once on a sign "Don't regret getting old for it's a privilege denied to many."


I'm still in my 20's, so I can't say much about this, but I *love* the above quote. My cousin passed away when she was 31 and she had so much ahead of her. Life is beautiful, no matter what the age.


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## Enchanted

Anonymous07 said:


> I'm still in my 20's, so I can't say much about this, but I *love* the above quote. My cousin passed away when she was 31 and she had so much ahead of her. Life is beautiful, no matter what the age.


When I hear about people who are younger than me dying I feel guilty for being so vain.


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## SlowlyGettingWiser

> But honestly, I've read soooo many posts here that point out how women in their 40's aren't so desirable anymore and how their going to have a hard time meeting people.


I'm 56yo and haven't dated since I was 33yo! The idea of dating again doesn't bother me now. Aging has NEVER bothered me, but then I was never 'the hot girl'. I was the smart, funny, 'pretty' one, but never THE ONE! I ALWAYS had girlfriends who were hotter, so I never considered my looks as something I could count on to get guys.

Now that I'm single again, I am getting ALL KINDS OF INTEREST from men (which is bizarre to me). They are guys in their 40s & 50s, which is FINE with me because, like Wazza, I want someone I can HAVE A CONVERSATION with when the sex is done! My older sister said to me TODAY that she couldn't imagine dating again in her 50s. I said, "But I don't care! That's the difference! I never want to get married again, ever. I just want to find someone to hang out with, have fun with, enjoy talking with for as long as it lasts. if it's 3-4mos, okay; if it's 8-9 mos, okay; if it's 2-3yrs, okay. I'm NOT looking for 'forever'! I don't even want to co-habitate."

If I find someone who can live with what I want, GREAT! If I can't, I'm sure I can find someone to knock boots with occasionally!

BTW: I ALWAYS tried to achieve some special goal for my 'milestone' birthdays. I got my Bachelor's Degree finished the day before my 30th birthday. I was extremely pregnant with my only child for my 40th birthday. 

Setting an important (yet achievable) goal for a milestone birthday may help you accept it (and remember it) better!

Good luck, women, we're ALL getting BETTER! XoXoXo


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## Enchanted

You're inspirational SGW. 

(Right now my husband is making me a sandwich for dinner. I must be doing something right.)


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## SimplyAmorous

> Originally Posted by Coffee Amore
> I read this once on a sign "Don't regret getting old for it's a privilege denied to many."


 As a young child, I remember this very saying hanging on my Grandma's wall near the steps, on a little brown plague....her's said ...."Never regret growing old, it is a privilege denied to many"..

I pondered that - even then....it's one saying I've never forgotten .... I HATE seeing younger people die, it is like the greatest tragedy, the height of injustice... parents are not suppose to bury their children. 

Yes, truly a privilege...


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## SlowlyGettingWiser

When *I* grow up, I want to be Dame Judith Dench! That woman kicks azz (and looks elegant doing it!) ...all that AND Bond works under her (wink, wink, nudge, nudge)


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## Lon

While older women may sometimes have lost there youthful good looks, I find some get even better with age - there is probably a ceiling in this regard, most likely because women as old as my grandma, are as old as my grandma. When I was 15 I wasn't really attracted at all to women past their mid 20's, but now I see many women in their late 40's that I find very sexually attractive (atleast the ones who've taken care of their looks).

But just like many men have either let themselves go, or perhaps just never had the genetic predisposition to aging nicely, there are certainly a higher number of older women (vs younger) that just physically don't appeal to this 30 something guy. I do however find myself a lot more comfortable around older women, I feel more respected by older women - I appreciate their maturity more.

If a smoking hot woman (of which I know for a fact there are), up to about 15 years my senior, came onto me I'd be all over her.

There is nothing inherently detestable at all about aging, in fact just the opposite, women that age nicely are very desirable.


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## heartsbeating

SlowlyGettingWiser said:


> BTW: I ALWAYS tried to achieve some special goal for my 'milestone' birthdays. I got my Bachelor's Degree finished the day before my 30th birthday. I was extremely pregnant with my only child for my 40th birthday.
> 
> Setting an important (yet achievable) goal for a milestone birthday may help you accept it (and remember it) better!


I like this idea. It's a slightly different take but I celebrated my 30th doing something that was both special and a personal challenge for me, because I wanted it to represent that and be memorable as a milestone.

I've started thinking ahead of how I'd like to see my life at 40. The steps I'll take towards that will be enjoyed in my daily life and hopefully it keeps me aware of how I'd like to live my life, rather than it passing by on auto-pilot.

Age doesn't determine wisdom, emotional maturity, or self-confidence. Life experience can have an influence, but it comes down to how we perceive and interact with the world.

As for appearance and ageing, it's inevitable. I think joy shines through regardless of age and superficial beauty.


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## SlowlyGettingWiser

Why, Lon, is *THAT* an invitation?


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## Lon

SlowlyGettingWiser said:


> I'm 56yo and haven't dated since I was 33yo!


you are 56 SGW?!?!?! I've seen your pics, you look atleast 10-15 years younger than that. You are hot!


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## heartsbeating

Enchanted said:


> What I'm doing is comparing myself to my younger self and losing. It's so weird to see the actresses I grew up with no longer in the spotlight. I remember when Demi More was considered really hot, now she's a joke.
> 
> My life is the best it's ever been so that should make me happy. I want to be OK with growing older.


Before you know it, and all being well, you'll be another 5-10 years older and looking back to the age you are now.


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## Lon

SlowlyGettingWiser said:


> Why, Lon, is *THAT* an invitation?


are you going to bring the soap or should I?


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## SlowlyGettingWiser

> are you going to bring the soap or should I?


You bring the soap, baby, and I'll bring the shower puff! I don't want you to feel like a 'wallet'...we'll go Dutch, even though it *IS* our first date! 

...then you can feel free to 'break my nose' with a shoe, or your knee, whatever works for you! :rofl:


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## Lon

SlowlyGettingWiser said:


> You bring the soap, baby, and I'll bring the shower puff! I don't want you to feel like a 'wallet'...we'll go Dutch, even though it *IS* our first date!
> 
> ...then you can feel free to 'break my nose' with a shoe, or your knee, whatever works for you! :rofl:


lol, I try NOT breaking noses babe, but doesn't always work out that way - just no playing volleyball with me (unless you take that as some sort of euphemism) 

oh, and YOU are the shower puff.


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## SlowlyGettingWiser

> oh, and YOU are the shower puff.


You ARE a sweet-talker, Lon! :awink:


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## Dollystanford

and photoshopped


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## Ikaika

I think it bothers my wife a little to be 50, although she does not dwell on it. I think she looks pretty damn good for her age. And, her age has never slowed her down. She will definitely out live me. Her mom is 82 and going strong and her grandmother lived to 108.


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## WyshIknew

Dollystanford said:


> yeah but Demi is a joke because of her behaviour (and actually trying to act like a teenager), she still looks pretty good
> 
> anyone find Dame Helen Mirren a joke? Certainly not!


From what I've read, Helen Mirren is appreciative of a well turned out young man.


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## WyshIknew

TTIWWP

(aimed at all you ladies)


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## WyshIknew

Lon said:


> you are 56 SGW?!?!?! I've seen your pics, you look atleast 10-15 years younger than that. You are hot!



:iagree:

(hubba hubba)


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## Enchanted

Dollystanford said:


> and photoshopped


It's true. The real life women in magazines can't compete with their own photos. All of this fantasy women images isn't helping our culture develop it's crushing egos and limiting intelligence.


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## heartsbeating

Louis.C.K. - The difference between women and girls - YouTube


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## SimplyAmorous

drerio said:


> I think it bothers my wife a little to be 50, although she does not dwell on it. I think she looks pretty damn good for her age. And, her age has never slowed her down. She will definitely out live me. Her mom is 82 and going strong *and her grandmother lived to 108*.










... that's amazing!! 

Did her Grandmother exercise every day & eat grains & veggies all her life? 

I'm always curious to hear the secrets of those who live nearing the century mark. My grandfather is still alive at 95....a sister is 99.....He still gets around decent, jams his guitar & banjo... still talks about his youth every time we visit... He lived out of his garden, got milk from a nearby farm...and swears by molasses, Bee pollen...and hmmm I forget the other. 

I don't eat THAT good, never have...so I hardly expect to live that long. Other Grandparents made it to their 80's. My dad is falling apart with R Arthritis in his 60's...I worry this may come upon me in the future.

Your wife has some fantastic genes Drerio ! I bet you're right, she'll live a very long time ....and also be there to take fine care of you too.


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## SlowlyGettingWiser

Thank you, Lon & Wysh, you guys are great!



> Originally posted by Wysh:
> TTIWWP
> 
> (aimed at all you ladies)


56yo, but BLESSED with AWESOME genetics (haven't even had to start dyeing my hair YET...). THIS is ALL I'm posting, no shower pix....don't want to be BANNED like the 'rooster' dude! :rofl:

[picture removed]


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## Ikaika

SimplyAmorous said:


> ... that's amazing!!
> 
> Did her Grandmother exercise every day & eat grains & veggies all her life?
> 
> I'm always curious to hear the secrets of those who live nearing the century mark. My grandfather is still alive at 95....a sister is 99.....He still gets around decent, jams his guitar & banjo... still talks about his youth every time we visit... He lived out of his garden, got milk from a nearby farm...and swears by molasses, Bee pollen...and hmmm I forget the other.
> 
> I don't eat THAT good, never have...so I hardly expect to live that long. Other Grandparents made it to their 80's. My dad is falling apart with R Arthritis in his 60's...I worry this may come upon me in the future.
> 
> Your wife has some fantastic genes Drerio ! I bet you're right, she'll live a very long time ....and also be there to take fine care of you too.


No doubt genetics plays the bigger role in my wife's family; oba (Japanese for grandmother) ate a healthy diet (fish being the primary protein and lots of sweet potato). 

Okinawans (Uchinanchu) are known to have more centenarians per 100,000 than any where else in the world.


----------



## stritle

Lon said:


> While older women may sometimes have lost there youthful good looks, I find some get even better with age - there is probably a ceiling in this regard, most likely because women as old as my grandma, are as old as my grandma. When I was 15 I wasn't really attracted at all to women past their mid 20's, but now I see many women in their late 40's that I find very sexually attractive (atleast the ones who've taken care of their looks).
> 
> But just like many men have either let themselves go, or perhaps just never had the genetic predisposition to aging nicely, there are certainly a higher number of older women (vs younger) that just physically don't appeal to this 30 something guy. I do however find myself a lot more comfortable around older women, I feel more respected by older women - I appreciate their maturity more.
> 
> If a smoking hot woman (of which I know for a fact there are), up to about 15 years my senior, came onto me I'd be all over her.
> 
> There is nothing inherently detestable at all about aging, in fact just the opposite, women that age nicely are very desirable.


couldn't agree more.
if put in the position, i doubt i'd even look at anyone more than a couple years younger. more likely i'd look for someone my age or older. 
depends on personality, but 10yr older would probably be a limit, just because of life experience differences really.
hmm, had to check what yr Marisa Tomei was born. make that a 12 year limit .


----------



## Faithful Wife

Enchanted said: "When I was in my 20's I felt like I had a certain power in this world. I never made a lot of money or had a fabulous personality so I could sort of get by on my looks."

If you did not spend time when you were younger developing other parts of your self than just your looks, then no wonder you don't feel good about yourself now.

Get to work on yourself, sister. LEARN what is valuable about you. Hint: it isn't your looks, and it wasn't when you were 20, either.


----------



## Dulciean

There is some fantastic insight and wisdom in this thread- love it! I am going to be the big four- oh this year and have felt myself struggling with this for the last few years. Came to the understanding I can't be hot like a 22 year old, but I can certainly be a very hot 40 something! So trying to get more healthful and lose a bit of weight and dress in a sexy mumma way. 
And just quietly afew years ago whilst single I was shall we say a bit on the wild side and was never turned down by any of the 20 something's I found in my ' presence ' : )


----------



## itsmesteveb72

Enchanted said:


> I'm in my forties now and still considered attractive. But being 44 isn't the same as being 24. Our youth obsessed culture doesn't see a 44 year old woman as being as desirable as those in their 20's and 30's. This bother's me. Does it bother you?


Being attractive is not based on looks alone. Persoanlity helps too. There are different stages of beauty the older you get too. We are always changing and as long as you take care of one's self. Age isn't so much the factor. In my 20's and 30's it is more about physical attraction then personality attraction. Learning to fall for the person and not the looks alone. At least that is in my case. I look within first the older I get.


----------



## Anonymous07

SimplyAmorous said:


> ... that's amazing!!
> 
> Did her Grandmother exercise every day & eat grains & veggies all her life?
> 
> I'm always curious to hear the secrets of those who live nearing the century mark. My grandfather is still alive at 95....a sister is 99.....He still gets around decent, jams his guitar & banjo... still talks about his youth every time we visit... He lived out of his garden, got milk from a nearby farm...and swears by molasses, Bee pollen...and hmmm I forget the other.
> 
> I don't eat THAT good, never have...so I hardly expect to live that long. Other Grandparents made it to their 80's. My dad is falling apart with R Arthritis in his 60's...I worry this may come upon me in the future.


My great-grandma lived to 101 and was very active up until she was 96, when she fell one evening. She loved to dance and did ballroom dancing a few times a week. My grandpa is 85 and is not slowing down at all. People in my family seem to live long, but not so much for my husband's side of the family.


----------



## Enchanted

Faithful Wife said:


> Enchanted said: "When I was in my 20's I felt like I had a certain power in this world. I never made a lot of money or had a fabulous personality so I could sort of get by on my looks."
> 
> If you did not spend time when you were younger developing other parts of your self than just your looks, then no wonder you don't feel good about yourself now.
> 
> Get to work on yourself, sister. LEARN what is valuable about you. Hint: it isn't your looks, and it wasn't when you were 20, either.


It's not like I didn't try developing other parts of myself, I did. I do suffer from depression and anxiety and have a hard time connecting to people in real life.


----------



## Enchanted

itsmesteveb72 said:


> Being attractive is not based on looks alone. Persoanlity helps too. There are different stages of beauty the older you get too. We are always changing and as long as you take care of one's self. Age isn't so much the factor. In my 20's and 30's it is more about physical attraction then personality attraction. Learning to fall for the person and not the looks alone. At least that is in my case. I look within first the older I get.


That's true. However, I work at a real estate office as a receptionist and the agents talk in front of me. Many times I've heard references to women no longer being desirable once they leave their 20's. I pretend like I don't hear what their saying. 

I'm married and my husband loves me and finds me beautiful. I work hard to try to maintain myself but there are certain things I cannot control. Hopefully, I'll learn to grow older gracefully.


----------



## MaritimeGuy

Enchanted said:


> That's true. However, I work at a real estate office as a receptionist and the agents talk in front of me. Many times I've heard references to women no longer being desirable once they leave their 20's. I pretend like I don't hear what their saying.


It could be these men are extremely superficial. There are men out there who are critical of any women less than a super model...as if they could ever get a woman like that to give them the time of day. 

Or it could be they are referring to women who have let themselves go as they age. Some women (and men) do. 

I believe if you keep fit, exude confidence, vitality and positive energy you will be beating the men off with a stick until the day you die.


----------



## Mavash.

Enchanted said:


> Hopefully, I'll learn to grow older gracefully.


Um NO! I plan on fighting this with everything I've got. For all my talk I'm not going to grow old 'gracefully'. I work my ass off, stay thin, do my hair, dress well, etc. I may not be 20 but by gosh I'm going to be the most fabulous 46 year old I can possibly be. If I showed you a picture of me you'd see what I mean. I look damn good for a 46 year old mother of 3. 



> It's not like I didn't try developing other parts of myself, I did. I do suffer from depression and anxiety and have a hard time connecting to people in real life.


Same here. It took therapy to fix this in me. I still don't connect well to people in real life but I no longer care. I figure they either like me AS IS or they don't. What does it matter? I like me, my kids like me and my husband likes me. I don't give a flip what others think of me.


----------



## Enchanted

MaritimeGuy said:


> It could be these men are extremely superficial. There are men out there who are critical of any women less than a super model...as if they could ever get a woman like that to give them the time of day.
> 
> Or it could be they are referring to women who have let themselves go as they age. Some women (and men) do.
> 
> I believe if you keep fit, exude confidence, vitality and positive energy you will be beating the men off with a stick until the day you die.



The men are pretty superficial and sometimes can act very chauvinistic. It's hard for me to hear things they say and still feel OK, but I'm working on improving my sense of self so the opinions of others don't matter.


----------



## Enchanted

Mavash. said:


> Um NO! I plan on fighting this with everything I've got. For all my talk I'm not going to grow old 'gracefully'. I work my ass off, stay thin, do my hair, dress well, etc. I may not be 20 but by gosh I'm going to be the most fabulous 46 year old I can possibly be. If I showed you a picture of me you'd see what I mean. I look damn good for a 46 year old mother of 3.
> 
> 
> 
> Same here. It took therapy to fix this in me. I still don't connect well to people in real life but I no longer care. I figure they either like me AS IS or they don't. What does it matter? I like me, my kids like me and my husband likes me. I don't give a flip what others think of me.


I'm referring to gracefully as accepting certain things that I simply don't have control over. Right now, I'm looking back at pictures of when I was 20 and being really hard on myself. I don't look all that different but there are differences that I can see. I need to accept those differences instead of hating myself for them. I intent to still workout, dress nice and eat healthy for as long as I breathe.

I do need to get into therapy so I can work on issues of depression and anxiety. Meds can only do so much. You sound like you did great work in treatment!


----------



## Mavash.

Enchanted said:


> I'm referring to gracefully as accepting certain things that I simply don't have control over. Right now, I'm looking back at pictures of when I was 20 and being really hard on myself.
> 
> I do need to get into therapy so I can work on issues of depression and anxiety. Meds can only do so much. You sound like you did great work in treatment!


First off stop looking at pictures of you when you were 20. You aren't and you're only torturing yourself unnecessarily. What you should do is look at pictures of OTHER women the same age as you. I'm surrounded by frumpy over 40 moms so by comparison I think I'm hot. Sure there are hot over 40 women out there but where I live there aren't that many.

Meds didn't work for me. I did this the hard way. Took me about 3.5 years of therapy but my issues were deep. I had childhood abuse to overcome. PTSD, depression, anxiety, BPD, codependency, aspergers, I was a mess. LOL These days I'm just adorably neurotic.


----------



## MaritimeGuy

Enchanted said:


> The men are pretty superficial and sometimes can act very chauvinistic. It's hard for me to hear things they say and still feel OK, but I'm working on improving my sense of self so the opinions of others don't matter.


It's a funny thing about men and their talk. I remember a survey asking men if they would rather be able to sleep with the sex symbol of their choice and not tell anyone...or not sleep with her and be able to tell everyone they did. The majority chose the latter. Many men are just talk.


----------



## Enchanted

Mavash. said:


> First off stop looking at pictures of you when you were 20. You aren't and you're only torturing yourself unnecessarily. What you should do is look at pictures of OTHER women the same age as you. I'm surrounded by frumpy over 40 moms so by comparison I think I'm hot. Sure there are hot over 40 women out there but where I live there aren't that many.
> 
> Meds didn't work for me. I did this the hard way. Took me about 3.5 years of therapy but my issues were deep. I had childhood abuse to overcome. PTSD, depression, anxiety, BPD, codependency, aspergers, I was a mess. LOL These days I'm just adorably neurotic.


I do well when I compare myself to other women my age (LOL) but for some reason that really doesn't make me feel better. 

I come from two parents with mental health issues. They divorced when I was six. The divorce was and still is messy. 

Sometimes I feel like I'm 44 going on four. I never had any healthy role models. I'd watch TV and try to figure out how "healthy" people acted. I want to be a good wife to my husband.


----------



## Mavash.

Enchanted said:


> I come from two parents with mental health issues. They divorced when I was six. The divorce was and still is messy.
> 
> Sometimes I feel like I'm 44 going on four. I never had any healthy role models. I'd watch TV and try to figure out how "healthy" people acted. I want to be a good wife to my husband.


I come from a whole family of mental health issues. 

Another tip...TV is fake. LOL 

I want to be a good wife too but the thing is I couldn't do that until I could be a good Mavash FIRST. Make sense?


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## Gaia

To be honest. I dont get this , in my opinion, idiotic obssession to look young. In fact I see it as pathetic. The most beautiful men or women in my eyes are those that embrace thier age not those that go around dying thier hair pink at age fifty and attempt to wear teenage clothes.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Mavash.

Gaia said:


> To be honest. I dont get this , in my opinion, idiotic obssession to look young


Easy for you to say cause you're young. 

You know I love ya girl right?

Come back and talk to us when you're 44-45 and you'll see what we're talking about. Growing old isn't so easy and it takes some getting used to that's for sure.


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## SlowlyGettingWiser

Enchanted:

Maybe it will make it easier if you think of PEOPLE in general ageing instead of yourself.

Think of ALL of mankind's greatest achievers: poets, scientists, sculptors, choreographers, businessmen, inventors, philanthropists, mathematicians, etc.

NONE OF THESE PEOPLE were doing their best work in their 20s. They weren't doing DIDDLY...they were STILL LEARNING. It wasn't until they hit their mid-to late-30s AND OLDER that they were capable of giving their best to humanity!

You, too, have been in a 'learning' mode. Now that you are older and more experienced, YOU have more valuable insights to offer for family, friends, mankind in general.

You, GO, sister Enchanted!!!


----------



## Ikaika

It may just be cultural, but for me the most respected people I look up to are my Kapunas... These are women who are elderly (60+), but revered and loved. They are the most beautiful women I know for just being who they are.


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## curlysue321

Yes it bothers me very much. I am 44 too. When I was younger I was constantly pursued. All the attention has stopped. I am still attractive, but let's be honest not as attractive as I was when I was younger. Being pretty in life has given me an advantage. People are nicer, more opportunities arise. However, now that I am older I envy people who have been homely throughout their lives. They do not have as much to lose when they age. My husband has a friend with a very homely obese wife. I'll bet she doesn't spend time wondering if her husband will feel the same way about her if she ever gets fat or old.


----------



## always_alone

Enchanted said:


> I'm in my forties now and still considered attractive. But being 44 isn't the same as being 24. Our youth obsessed culture doesn't see a 44 year old woman as being as desirable as those in their 20's and 30's. This bother's me. Does it bother you?


It doesn't bother me that society in general, or rather mass media, is youth obsessed. I expect it, given how silly and superficial it has always been. 

What bothers me is that I am now invisible to my SO, who spends his time drooling over vids of 19 year olds. He's not stupid enough to think they would ever give him the time of day in real life, but I had thought/hoped that he might be deeper than all of that.


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## SlowlyGettingWiser

> However, now that I am older I envy people who have been homely throughout their lives. They do not have as much to lose when they age.


Respectfully, I have NEVER understood this kind of thinking!?!

You've had benefits your ENTIRE LIFE that you ENJOYED and you wonder if people who never GOT A BENEFIT are better off?

Sounds like a woman I used to know; at 19yo she was engaged to the son of a wealthy/well-known family. When I knew her (in her 30s), she was still bemoaning her broken engagement to this guy, the LOSS of her privileged life with him, the loss of what COULD HAVE BEEN her wealthy life as his wife. She said it was SO MUCH EASIER for us regular never-been-engaged-to-a-multi-millionaire girls, because WE couldn't miss what we never had. I said, "Maybe so, but YOU have memories, experiences, opportunities the REST OF US will NEVER have."

Sorry, CurlySue, if I just can't seem to summon up any sympathy for someone who USED to have the looks but now feels homely obese people have it better because they never had to 'give up the spotlight' like you did.

Instead of thinking about what YOU gave up, try thinking about how cr*ppy people like HER have had it ALL THEIR LIVES.

Not trying to be HARSH, just trying to give you a dose of reality.


----------



## honeysuckle rose

Part of me is sad about it in a personal way. I think I look great & I wouldn't want to be in my 20s ever again -- even though I was thinner and 'more desirable.' Now I look hotter than ever IMO & a few others ;-)

I read the book "Marry Him: The Case for Settling for Mr Good Enough." Even though a lot of women don't want to hear it and perhaps a lot of men don't want to admit it, younger women are "more desirable" (in general) for a lot of reasons, especially to older men.

It's always a trade off -- ability to have children w/o assistance or complications (perhaps), wit, intelligence, wisdom, experience for looks, a hot, non-stop body, etc.

When you are w/ someone who has a 'type' and you are the exact opposite of that type and he is a regular porn viewer, seeking out porn of women that look like his type (read: his most significant relationship before me) and other women who ARE younger, what are you supposed to do w/ that? At the end of the day, yeah, he loves you, he chose you, but he still wants to look at other women who aren't you, fantasizing about them in sexual ways. At what point do you just feel like the wet place he put his penis?

Life is what it is...


----------



## Enchanted

Mavash. said:


> I come from a whole family of mental health issues.
> 
> Another tip...TV is fake. LOL
> 
> I want to be a good wife too but the thing is I couldn't do that until I could be a good Mavash FIRST. Make sense?


I have a list of therapist sitting on my desk. I was hoping I'd get better just looking at the list.


----------



## Enchanted

curlysue321 said:


> Yes it bothers me very much. I am 44 too. When I was younger I was constantly pursued. All the attention has stopped. I am still attractive, but let's be honest not as attractive as I was when I was younger. Being pretty in life has given me an advantage. People are nicer, more opportunities arise. However, now that I am older I envy people who have been homely throughout their lives. They do not have as much to lose when they age. My husband has a friend with a very homely obese wife. I'll bet she doesn't spend time wondering if her husband will feel the same way about her if she ever gets fat or old.


Well...I can't say that I wish I was ugly because that isn't true. And I still do get _some_ attention but it's not like it was. Of course, I use to dress in mini skirts and pumps and now I'm pretty conservative.


----------



## Enchanted

honeysuckle rose said:


> Part of me is sad about it in a personal way. I think I look great & I wouldn't want to be in my 20s ever again -- even though I was thinner and 'more desirable.' Now I look hotter than ever IMO & a few others ;-)
> 
> I read the book "Marry Him: The Case for Settling for Mr Good Enough." Even though a lot of women don't want to hear it and perhaps a lot of men don't want to admit it, younger women are "more desirable" (in general) for a lot of reasons, especially to older men.
> 
> It's always a trade off -- ability to have children w/o assistance or complications (perhaps), wit, intelligence, wisdom, experience for looks, a hot, non-stop body, etc.
> 
> When you are w/ someone who has a 'type' and you are the exact opposite of that type and he is a regular porn viewer, seeking out porn of women that look like his type (read: his most significant relationship before me) and other women who ARE younger, what are you supposed to do w/ that? At the end of the day, yeah, he loves you, he chose you, but he still wants to look at other women who aren't you, fantasizing about them in sexual ways. At what point do you just feel like the wet place he put his penis?
> 
> Life is what it is...


The truth is when you're in your 20's there is a bigger pool of men out there that want you then when you're in your 40's. That idea alone is stressful. However I'm happier now @ 44 then @ 24. 

IDK. It would be nice if everyone stopped aging at 22.


----------



## honeysuckle rose

Enchanted said:


> The truth is when you're in your 20's there is a bigger pool of men out there that want you then when you're in your 40's. That idea alone is stressful. However I'm happier now @ 44 then @ 24.
> 
> IDK. It would be nice if everyone stopped aging at 22.


Yup.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Mavash.

Enchanted said:


> The truth is when you're in your 20's there is a bigger pool of men out there that want you then when you're in your 40's.


Can you prove this? Lotta divorced men out there.

And why does your happiness have to be tied to some man? 

Shhhhh don't tell my husband but at 46 I think who cares? I like being alone and if he were gone I'm sure I could find somebody to have sex with. LOL


----------



## Mavash.

Enchanted said:


> I have a list of therapist sitting on my desk. I was hoping I'd get better just looking at the list.


Is this like hoping to get skinny by joining a gym but never going?


----------



## Gaia

Mavash. said:


> Easy for you to say cause you're young.
> 
> You know I love ya girl right?
> 
> Come back and talk to us when you're 44-45 and you'll see what we're talking about. Growing old isn't so easy and it takes some getting used to that's for sure.


Dangit mavash! Stop reminding me im young! Your raining on my parade! Lol
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Gaia

I must be the only nut who looks foreward to aging....
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Lon

Gaia said:


> I must be the only nut who looks foreward to aging....
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I'm looking forward to getting younger again, but still no beginning in site to that one.


----------



## Gaia

Lol lon.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Enchanted

Mavash. said:


> Can you prove this? Lotta divorced men out there.
> 
> And why does your happiness have to be tied to some man?
> 
> Shhhhh don't tell my husband but at 46 I think who cares? I like being alone and if he were gone I'm sure I could find somebody to have sex with. LOL


I'm sure you could too. I'm not talking about sex. Divorced men in their 40's are looking at women in their 20's. I'm not saying those women want them but what 40 something divorced man would refuse a 20 year old?


----------



## Enchanted

Mavash. said:


> Is this like hoping to get skinny by joining a gym but never going?


EXACTLY

(BTW - my goal is to hit the gym at least four times a week and get into bathing suit shape.)


----------



## Enchanted

Gaia said:


> Dangit mavash! Stop reminding me im young! Your raining on my parade! Lol
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


You don't want to be young?

I'm so confused


----------



## Enchanted

Lon said:


> I'm looking forward to getting younger again, but still no beginning in site to that one.


Currently I'm working on a youth serum. 

In the meantime, you can use the Oral B electric toothbrush to wash your face. I'm not kidding - it leaves your skin SMOOTH.


----------



## Ikaika

Enchanted said:


> I'm sure you could too. I'm not talking about sex. Divorced men in their 40's are looking at women in their 20's. I'm not saying those women want them but what 40 something divorced man would refuse a 20 year old?


I am not divorced, happily married so this may disqualify me from making this comment. However, if I found myself single again at my age (52), I would have no interest in a woman who is 20 or even 30. At some point in a relationship there has to be more than sex. You have to have some commonality (growing up during the same era, etc) with the other person. I would have very little in common with someone 20 or 30 years my junior. To that same end, I am also smart enough to recognize that she (being that young) would be in place in her life that is would lend a level of boredom with me. This is from a male perspective.


----------



## Enchanted

drerio said:


> I am not divorced, happily married so this may disqualify me from making this comment. However, if I found myself single again at my age (52), I would have no interest in a woman who is 20 or even 30. At some point in a relationship there has to be more than sex. You have to have some commonality (growing up during the same era, etc) with the other person. I would have very little in common with someone 20 or 30 years my junior. To that same end, I am also smart enough to recognize that she (being that young) would be in place in her life that is would lend a level of boredom with me. This is from a male perspective.


I'm happily married too. I have a neurotic fear that something will happen to my husband and I'll be single. Every time he says his stomach is bothering him or he has a pain I get worried. 

When he comes home from work I feel relieved when I hear the door open I run to greet him. 

(My father abandoned me repeatedly throughout my life so I have some serious issues.)


----------



## Malaise

Anonymous07 said:


> I'm still in my 20's, so I can't say much about this, but I *love* the above quote. My cousin passed away when she was 31 and she had so much ahead of her. Life is beautiful, no matter what the age.


You older ladies shouldn't complain, at least you attained your current age. Be thankful for that.

My wife died at age 34 and I'd give anything to hear her complain about her 50's.


----------



## Enchanted

Malaise said:


> You older ladies shouldn't complain, at least you attained your current age. Be thankful for that.
> 
> My wife died at age 34 and I'd give anything to hear her complain about her 50's.


I'm so sorry about your wife Malaise.


----------



## Malaise

Sorry to be snarky.

Just depressed this time of year.


----------



## Enchanted

Malaise said:


> Sorry to be snarky.
> 
> Just depressed this time of year.


I understand. I hope you have a good support system.


----------



## Malaise

I have family and friends IRL and some good people here...


----------



## Ikaika

Malaise said:


> I have family and friends IRL and some good people here...


You know I'm here, brother. I like what you had to say.


----------



## Shaggy

Enchanted said:


> Well...I can't say that I wish I was ugly because that isn't true. And I still do get _some_ attention but it's not like it was. Of course, I use to dress in mini skirts and pumps and now I'm pretty conservative.


This is I think one of the biggest changes that women do to themselves as they age that makes them age and become older.

They stop dressing nice. I don't mean cheap and slvtty, I mean they stop dressing nice. A lot of women stop shopping for nice clothes that fit well and switch to baggy polyester because it's easy to clean. The switch from fashionable footwear, to conservative reliable comfort shows. And these are the women who look older than they really are, much older.

Same goes for guys BTW. When a man stops wearing nice and fitted clothes, and switches to old badly fitting things it also ages him.

Honestly, a well dressed woman in here 40 and 50s and 60s can turn heads just as well as a woman in her 20s, if she has put the effort in, and if she has avoided the middle age weight gain nasty. This goes for guys too. A guy in his 50s can get a lot of attention, but if he's 40lbs over weight , it's not going to happen.


----------



## CharlieParker

I don't mean to sound like a jerk, but rather in the spirit of Shaggy's comment I was pleased (more so for her) when Mrs P bought some make up earlier this week.


----------



## Enchanted

Shaggy said:


> This is I think one of the biggest changes that women do to themselves as they age that makes them age and become older.
> 
> They stop dressing nice. I don't mean cheap and slvtty, I mean they stop dressing nice. A lot of women stop shopping for nice clothes that fit well and switch to baggy polyester because it's easy to clean. The switch from fashionable footwear, to conservative reliable comfort shows. And these are the women who look older than they really are, much older.
> 
> Same goes for guys BTW. When a man stops wearing nice and fitted clothes, and switches to old badly fitting things it also ages him.
> 
> Honestly, a well dressed woman in here 40 and 50s and 60s can turn heads just as well as a woman in her 20s, if she has put the effort in, and if she has avoided the middle age weight gain nasty. This goes for guys too. A guy in his 50s can get a lot of attention, but if he's 40lbs over weight , it's not going to happen.


I said I dress conservative not badly, there's a big difference. I'm the same weight as I was in my 20's. I take yoga and Pilates and my hair is long and wavy. Most people think I'm much younger than 44 which is nice. That wasn't my point. My point was that although I'm still attractive I don't have that 20 something look as I once did and I feel bad about it. I'm being honest. I miss the type of attention I did get when I was younger.

Also, the age itself is a stigma. If someone saw me they'd think younger but as soon as I told them my age they would immediately change their mind to my "desirability" level.


----------



## Enchanted

CharlieParker said:


> I don't mean to sound like a jerk, but rather in the spirit of Shaggy's comment I was pleased (more so for her) when Mrs P bought some make up earlier this week.


LOL


----------



## Lon

Enchanted said:


> I said I dress conservative not badly, there's a big difference. I'm the same weight as I was in my 20's. I take yoga and Pilates and my hair is long and wavy. *Most people think I'm much younger than 44 which is nice*. That wasn't my point. My point was that although I'm still attractive I don't have that 20 something look as I once did and I feel bad about it. I'm being honest. I miss the type of attention I did get when I was younger.
> 
> Also, the age itself is a stigma. If someone saw me they'd think younger but as soon as I told them my age they would immediately change their mind to my "desirability" level.


What?? 44? I thought you were nearing 60, by the tone of your comments. For me, most days I feel older than my actual age, when I was young that was good because it earned me a little more repsect, people (older people) were pleasantly surprised by my maturity when they got to know me. I was the perfect child...

now as I'm entering mid-life I feel like I've missed out on SOOOO much life, feel like I'm emotionally underdeveloped somehow, and people don't perceive my maturity as a virtue anymore, it is just expected and so I'm probably regressing in that way.

I'm not sure this explains you at all, but I'm wondering if it's the attitude that you and I both have, that we are older than our years, is totally biasing our perspective the aging process, and how people view us?


----------



## greenfern

My biggest issue with aging is clothes..I love clothes & always have, but I find it very difficult to know what is 'age appropriate'. I don't want to dress too conservative and I love a lot of younger styles, but I just have this paranoia of dressing "too young for my age".


----------



## Cosmos

Enchanted said:


> I'm sure you could too. I'm not talking about sex. Divorced men in their 40's are looking at women in their 20's. I'm not saying those women want them but what 40 something divorced man would refuse a 20 year old?


Not all of them OP. My partner is in his 40s and has been in hot pursuit of me for over 2.5 years, now. I'm 15 years older than him...


----------



## Enchanted

Lon said:


> What?? 44? I thought you were nearing 60, by the tone of your comments. For me, most days I feel older than my actual age, when I was young that was good because it earned me a little more repsect, people (older people) were pleasantly surprised by my maturity when they got to know me. I was the perfect child...
> 
> now as I'm entering mid-life I feel like I've missed out on SOOOO much life, feel like I'm emotionally underdeveloped somehow, and people don't perceive my maturity as a virtue anymore, it is just expected and so I'm probably regressing in that way.
> 
> I'm not sure this explains you at all, but I'm wondering if it's the attitude that you and I both have, that we are older than our years, is totally biasing our perspective the aging process, and how people view us?


I'm emotionally stunted as well. When my parents divorced I was six and had to live with so much emotional turmoil. I was put in "adult" situations that my brain couldn't handle. So maybe that's why I come across as jaded? 

I must point out that you are a man. A middle-aged man is viewed differently than a middle-aged woman.


----------



## Enchanted

greenfern said:


> My biggest issue with aging is clothes..I love clothes & always have, but I find it very difficult to know what is 'age appropriate'. I don't want to dress too conservative and I love a lot of younger styles, but I just have this paranoia of dressing "too young for my age".


I know what you mean. I'll shop in the Juniors section at Macy's but I'm careful to what I pick out. It's hard to dress nice in the winter because I'm always cold and will wear whatever keeps me warm. The spring and summer is fun because I can wear dresses.


----------



## Enchanted

Cosmos said:


> Not all of them OP. My partner is in his 40s and has been in hot pursuit of me for over 2.5 years, now. I'm 15 years older than him...


Whoohoo! I LOVE to hear these types of stories


----------



## Cosmos

Seriously, Enchanted - you sound as though you've got a lot going for you but need to work on your self-esteem. There are lots of courses out there that will help with this, as well as some online courses. You mention childhood issues, and perhaps it's time for them to be addressed and put to bed...

There's absolutely no reason why a woman who is in her prime of life, as you are, should be worrying about her age this way

Find out who you are, love yourself and your present insecurities will become history.

Here's a link for you:- http://www.mayland.edu/aca111/SelfEsteem.pdf


----------



## greenfern

What do you think is inappropriate for age 40-ish? skinny jeans with ankle boots? shorter skirts? I'm kind of on the petite (short!) side which I think is hard as you get older - you look young because you are short, but the face is a dead giveaway . 

My partner loves a sexier look but that is the hardest for me to pull off. Shorter skirts with heels feels like a 20 or 30 something look.


----------



## Enchanted

Cosmos said:


> Seriously, Enchanted - you sound as though you've got a lot going for you but need to work on your self-esteem. There are lots of courses out there that will help with this, as well as ome online courses. You mention childhood issues, and perhaps it's time for them to be addressed and put to bed...
> 
> There's absolutely no reason why a woman who is in her prime of life, as you are, should be worrying about her age this way
> 
> Find out who you are, love yourself and your present insecurities will become history.
> 
> Here's a link for you:- http://www.mayland.edu/aca111/SelfEsteem.pdf


Thank you for the support. I've never had any self-esteem and when I get really depressed or anxious I can't even think. I'm going to check out that link now. 

Hugs!!!!


----------



## Cosmos

Enchanted said:


> Thank you for the support. I've never had any self-esteem and when I get really depressed or anxious I can't even think. I'm going to check out that link now.
> 
> Hugs!!!!


Which makes sense, really, because you probably can't self-nurture? At a guess I'd say you're probably a perfectionist, and this is a sure way of setting ourselves up for never feeling quite 'good enough.'

That really is a good link, and I hope it helps 

Hugs right back at you!


----------



## Enchanted

greenfern said:


> What do you think is inappropriate for age 40-ish? skinny jeans with ankle boots? shorter skirts? I'm kind of on the petite (short!) side which I think is hard as you get older - you look young because you are short, but the face is a dead giveaway .
> 
> My partner loves a sexier look but that is the hardest for me to pull off. Shorter skirts with heels feels like a 20 or 30 something look.


It's hard to say what is inappropriate in a post. I try clothes on and instinctively I'll know if it's too young.


----------



## Zig

It's interesting how many women are admitting that they've become a lot nicer as their looks have faded.


----------



## Lon

Enchanted said:


> I'm emotionally stunted as well. When my parents divorced I was six and had to live with so much emotional turmoil. I was put in "adult" situations that my brain couldn't handle. So maybe that's why I come across as jaded?
> 
> I must point out that you are a man. A middle-aged man is viewed differently than a middle-aged woman.


You don't come across as jaded, to me. In fact I think I relate more to most women than guys with certain obvious exceptions, but aging not being one of them. I think to a large degree I did get by on my looks, not that they ever made me sexually attractive, just that I was approachable by people for most any reason.

So now I find myself so very much average that it makes me plain, other guys my age competing for attractive women all seem to have an edge over me, so by their 30's they have built up wealth, our they've made a very valuable social network, our they hold high positions in their job, or else even if they are balding or a little overweight they are still tall and most have honed a certain level of charm.

Being nice, and a good father, isn't what it takes to make a woman's panties wet, but those are all I'm really good at, and as I age even those become less and less helpful at making me stand apart because so too are the reformed bad boys.


----------



## Enchanted

Lon said:


> You don't come across as jaded, to me. In fact I think I relate more to most women than guys with certain obvious exceptions, but aging not being one of them. I think to a large degree I did get by on my looks, not that they ever made me sexually attractive, just that I was approachable by people for most any reason.
> 
> So now I find myself so very much average that it makes me plain, other guys my age competing for attractive women all seem to have an edge over me, so by their 30's they have built up wealth, our they've made a very valuable social network, our they hold high positions in their job, or else even if they are balding or a little overweight they are still tall and most have honed a certain level of charm.
> 
> Being nice, and a good father, isn't what it takes to make a woman's panties wet, but those are all I'm really good at, and as I age even those become less and less helpful at making me stand apart because so too are the reformed bad boys.


I think people have a much easier time picking out their perceived faults instead of looking at their positive attributes.


----------



## jaquen

I'm all for embracing, and celebrating, whatever age you are. On a personal note I have, ever since pre-teen years, been drawn to older women. I am very surprised the love of my life ended up being a woman my age, because I always assumed I'd be one of those 20/30 somethings who was in a serious relationship with a hot, intelligent middle aged woman.

Having said that, I do think it's a little absurd that human beings feel the need to stigmatize, and put others down, just to celebrate something good about themselves. I see younger adults being casually referred to as shallow and depthless, and vapid, throughout this thread. You don't need to knock youth just to praise maturity. There are plenty of intelligent, considered young adults with depth, and focus. 

Some of this thread reeks of the "skinny b*tches" mentality you see among a lot of overweight and obese women. Reading this thread you'd seriously walk away thinking being a younger adult is somehow an inferior state of existence. 

I guess it's no different than the "breast thread" making it seem like large breasted women are inferior, or all the pot shots taken at well endowed men in the "penis thread".

Except all it does it make the one doling out insults just look incredibly insecure.


----------



## Wazza

jaquen said:


> I'm all for embracing, and celebrating, whatever age you are. On a personal note I have, ever since pre-teen years, been drawn to older women. I am very surprised the love of my life ended up being a woman my age, because I always assumed I'd be one of those 20/30 somethings who was in a serious relationship with a hot, intelligent middle aged woman.
> 
> Having said that, I do think it's a little absurd that human beings feel the need to stigmatize, and put others down, just to celebrate something good about themselves. I see younger adults being casually referred to as shallow and depthless, and vapid, throughout this thread. You don't need to knock youth just to praise maturity. There are plenty of intelligent, considered young adults with depth, and focus.
> 
> Some of this thread reeks of the "skinny b*tches" mentality you see among a lot of overweight and obese women. Reading this thread you'd seriously walk away thinking being a younger adult is somehow an inferior state of existence.
> 
> I guess it's no different than the "breast thread" making it seem like large breasted women are inferior, or all the pot shots taken at well endowed men in the "penis thread".
> 
> Except all it does it make the one doling out insults just look incredibly insecure.


I see your point, but how do you convey a preference?

A twenty year old, in general, does not have the life experience of a forty or fifty year old. Not a put down, a statement of fact. I know plenty of intelligent twenty-somethings but I can't talk to them like I can my wife.


----------



## jaquen

SimplyAmorous said:


> ... that's amazing!!
> 
> Did her Grandmother exercise every day & eat grains & veggies all her life?
> 
> I'm always curious to hear the secrets of those who live nearing the century mark. My grandfather is still alive at 95....a sister is 99.....He still gets around decent, jams his guitar & banjo... still talks about his youth every time we visit... He lived out of his garden, got milk from a nearby farm...and swears by molasses, Bee pollen...and hmmm I forget the other.
> 
> I don't eat THAT good, never have...so I hardly expect to live that long. Other Grandparents made it to their 80's. My dad is falling apart with R Arthritis in his 60's...I worry this may come upon me in the future.
> 
> Your wife has some fantastic genes Drerio ! I bet you're right, she'll live a very long time ....and also be there to take fine care of you too.


When your ticket is up, it's up. But I am a firm believer in taking incredible care of yourself, and learning from your elders' mistakes.

Longevity runs in both sides of my family. My paternal great grandmother died just a couple months shy of 100. My maternal grandmother is 87 this year, and she was the baby. Her last sister just passed away last year at 95, and her last brother the year before at 92. She looks amazing, and is in great shape. She also though is an avid walker, eats very little processed foods, drinks lots of water, and grew up on a fruit farm. 

Yet both of my parents were dead by the time I was 30. My dad passed at 69, my mother five years later at 63. They took horrible care of their physical health. Both were obese, and he had chronic high blood pressure, and she had type 2 diabetes that could have easily been reversed if she took care of herself. He was a healthier eater than she was, but never worked out past his youth. She had a huge taste for sweets, white bread, and all things processed.

I have seen the potential future, and I chose to avoid it. I've been almost an exclusive water drinker since my early 20's, I speed walk between 30-50 miles a week now, and the majority of my diet is low carb, with lots of green veggies. I haven't had so much as a cold in nearly a decade. I was on the phone with my grandmother the other day and it hit me that I took more after her than my parents. We were just chatting away about the joys of water, clean eating, and exercise. I don't know how I failed to realize it before, but I got the healthy living from her.

Now I could die tomorrow in a bizarre lawnmower accident, but I'm doing the best I can to learn from my parent's mistakes, and embrace my grandparents triumphs, at least when it comes to the health front.


----------



## jaquen

Wazza said:


> I see your point, but how do you convey a preference?
> 
> A twenty year old, in general, does not have the life experience of a forty or fifty year old. Not a put down, a statement of fact. I know plenty of intelligent twenty-somethings but I can't talk to them like I can my wife.


I believe there is a difference between noting the obvious, that older people have more life experience than younger, and then likely more maturity, and wisdom.

But stating that notion is a far cry from the outright bashing that is littering this thread. Personally I was never a shallow 20 something; I had friends of all ages, and was often, often told I was an "old soul". None of my friends, which were plentiful, were ever the stereotypical shallow, vapid wastes that are being described here. I'm in my early 30's now, and still that's the case for my friends, some of who are still in their 20's. All young adults aren't cut from the same mold. I could start spouting a ton of ill stereotypes about older women off, in a bid to make younger women come off better, but why would I? 

Some of the comments are just coming off as rooting from insecurity to me. Because somebody who is truly comfortable in their own skin doesn't take the time to lobby pot shots at others just to look better in comparison.

Mind you I think this thread is, overall, chock full of good stuff. Just think all those bitter betty moments bring down an otherwise excellent topic.


----------



## Wazza

jaquen said:


> I believe there is a difference between noting the obvious, that older people have more life experience than younger, and then likely more maturity, and wisdom.
> 
> But stating that notion is a far cry from the outright bashing that is littering this thread. Personally I was never a shallow 20 something; I had friends of all ages, and was often, often told I was an "old soul". None of my friends, which were plentiful, were ever the stereotypical shallow, vapid wastes that are being described here. I'm in my early 30's now, and still that's the case for my friends, some of who are still in their 20's. All young adults aren't cut from the same mold. I could start spouting a ton of ill stereotypes about older women off, in a bid to make younger women come off better, but why would I?
> 
> Some of the comments are just coming off as rooting from insecurity to me. Because somebody who is truly comfortable in their own skin doesn't take the time to lobby pot shots at others just to look better in comparison.
> 
> Mind you I think this thread is, overall, chock full of good stuff. Just think all those bitter betty moments bring down an otherwise excellent topic.


I'd have to go back and reread the thread I guess.

I make the statement of the bleeding obvious. I have looked at the world as a twenty-something and as a fifty-something. You have not. Therefore it is hard for you to know how a fifty-something you will see the world.

Conversely, maybe my senility is distorting my memory.

I have good friends over a wide range of ages, and I can certainly have a deep and intelligent conversation with someone your age about some things, but it has nowhere near the depth of relationships with people my own age. My wife is a year older than me and my next closest relationship is eight years older. All of my closest relationships are with people within about ten years either side of my age. I can imagine hot sex with a twenty something but I cannot imagine love. It wolud be like you dating a fourteen year old.

Hope ths makes sense.

My reason for posting is not to put down twenty-something's, but reassure OP and others that they have value too.


----------



## pidge70

While I would much rather be 24 as opposed to almost 43, I feel I look better now than when I was younger. Much rather weigh what I did when I was 22......lol


----------



## amanda1959

I am a 53 year old woman and I try to look my best everyday I try to eat right, work out (doing P90x now hard!!!), have good relationships with friends and my family and children. I live in Toronto and there is a mayor of a municipality of our city that is 91!!! The other day I saw her on TV skating at a local rink! Skating at 91!!! Now that is beautiful to me. She has wrinkles all over ...my she is so accomplished thats what we are here for....to do our best and give to others. Beauty is much deeper than your skin!
44 is HOT!!! ask men!!!


----------



## curlysue321

I just try to live in the present. I am sure when I'm in my 70s or 80s I am going to wonder why I felt so old at 44.


----------



## jaquen

Lon said:


> What?? 44? I thought you were nearing 60, by the tone of your comments. For me, most days I feel older than my actual age, when I was young that was good because it earned me a little more repsect, people (older people) were pleasantly surprised by my maturity when they got to know me. I was the perfect child...
> 
> now as I'm entering mid-life I feel like I've missed out on SOOOO much life, feel like I'm emotionally underdeveloped somehow, and people don't perceive my maturity as a virtue anymore, it is just expected and so I'm probably regressing in that way.
> 
> I'm not sure this explains you at all, but I'm wondering if it's the attitude that you and I both have, that we are older than our years, is totally biasing our perspective the aging process, and how people view us?


Yup, the down side to being an old soul. I am obviously not an old man, but when 30 arrived it didn't feel jarring because I felt older than my age ever since I was a child. It is often said that your 20's fly by, but that wasn't the case for me. People use to call me "sir" in my 20's. I didn't spend my 20's running after tail, but instead madly in love with, and completely devoted to, one woman.

Now? I find myself craving some of the younger elements I passed over. And I intend to enjoy most of them. Something tells me that my 30's will end up feeling younger than my 20's. Already I've made superficial changes. I wore a beard for most of my 20's, which lent a much more mature look to me, which I didn't realize then. I've always had good skin, but I take better care of it now than ever. So when I started shaving last year I was floored to see how young my face looks. Everyone in my life I encountered were floored at my face, making comment that I looked absurdly young. My wife, who has a very youthful face herself, comments after I shave that she feels like she's being a little naughty sometimes, messing with this young kid LOL. She makes lots of comments about me de-aging.

I will admit that it's a strange feeling, having people comment on your youthful looks AFTER your 20's. I just felt so damn aged for so long. But it does help me feel better about reworking some of the younger moments I missed early on. 

Any regrets I have about aging stem from feelings that I might have missed something. I don't believe it's about actually physically aging, so much as it is about how you feel in your life.

Also somebody earlier mentioned how tough aging is for them, even though they look younger than their biological age. That I do not get. If you look young, what does it matter? I think people who stay well preserved do have a much easier time buying the "age is nothing but a number" mantra than those who are looking at a rapidly falling face. If you're aging very well, enjoy that for as long as you can, I say. I know I get a real kick out of the fact that some of my aunts and uncles look far younger than their age. They're attractive middle aged people who have maintained a youthful spark, and look, and I LOVE that. There is something very attractive to me about people who just defy age.

Tina Turner, I'm looking at you.


----------



## Enchanted

jaquen said:


> I'm all for embracing, and celebrating, whatever age you are. On a personal note I have, ever since pre-teen years, been drawn to older women. I am very surprised the love of my life ended up being a woman my age, because I always assumed I'd be one of those 20/30 somethings who was in a serious relationship with a hot, intelligent middle aged woman.
> 
> Having said that, I do think it's a little absurd that human beings feel the need to stigmatize, and put others down, just to celebrate something good about themselves. I see younger adults being casually referred to as shallow and depthless, and vapid, throughout this thread. You don't need to knock youth just to praise maturity. There are plenty of intelligent, considered young adults with depth, and focus.
> 
> Some of this thread reeks of the "skinny b*tches" mentality you see among a lot of overweight and obese women. Reading this thread you'd seriously walk away thinking being a younger adult is somehow an inferior state of existence.
> 
> I guess it's no different than the "breast thread" making it seem like large breasted women are inferior, or all the pot shots taken at well endowed men in the "penis thread".
> 
> Except all it does it make the one doling out insults just look incredibly insecure.


I haven't once put down anyone who is in the age range of 20-30. I think others have pointed out with youth comes a certain way of looking at the world that tends to change as you age.


----------



## Enchanted

amanda1959 said:


> I am a 53 year old woman and I try to look my best everyday I try to eat right, work out (doing P90x now hard!!!), have good relationships with friends and my family and children. I live in Toronto and there is a mayor of a municipality of our city that is 91!!! The other day I saw her on TV skating at a local rink! Skating at 91!!! Now that is beautiful to me. She has wrinkles all over ...my she is so accomplished thats what we are here for....to do our best and give to others. Beauty is much deeper than your skin!
> 44 is HOT!!! ask men!!!


I LOVE to hear that: 44 is HOT!!!! YAY


----------



## Emerald

Enchanted said:


> Well...I can't say that I wish I was ugly because that isn't true. And I still do get _some_ attention but it's not like it was. Of course, I use to dress in mini skirts and pumps and now I'm pretty conservative.


...and what's wrong with wearing those minis & pumps NOW?

It's all about the gams Sister!....and attitude 

You know what's HOT? An attractive 24 yr. old with a rockin. bod.

You know what's AWESOME? An attractive 44 yr. old with a rockin' bod.

OP, the 40's were hard on me also. I wasn't turning heads like I used to because I let myself go a bit (the dreaded frumpy) due to the stress of working & raising children. I didn't let myself completely go LOL but the sassy attitude & confidence took a backseat to everything else.

I decided do to something about the "frump factor" & the nicest surprise was my change in attitude about getting older.


----------



## Lon

jaquen said:


> ...Something tells me that my 30's will end up feeling younger than my 20's.


This is how I felt too, IIRC... except it hasn't really kicked in, and suddenly I find myself turning 37 this year realizing that I'll probably be saying the same thing at the start of my 40's only to end up my forties feeling like I do now that I've been losing all my youth with little to show for it. My son is turning six next month, like WTH? When did that happen how am I a father of a school aged child, it's like constantly waking from a coma to find everything so shocking that you slide back into the coma again, repeat ad nauseum.


----------



## Phenix70

I had the "pleasure" of spending time with my friend's 19 yo niece this wknd & thought to myself "she's pretty, but my God, she can't hold a conversation to save her life. Did she just ask me what the big deal about H. Clinton is? OMG, someone shoot me now."
It dawned on me, that I wouldn't trade places with her if I could, that I've earned every sign that I'm 42 with the life I've lived.
Of course, if I could be younger, with the wisdom & experience I have now, I would do it, because life is so awesome & I wish I could live forever.
To me, the ONLY downside to aging it you're that much closer to dying from old age.

I will admit I still get hit on just like I did when I was 20 years younger & the age of the men run the gamut from their 20's to their 50's, hahahaha.
BUT, the only person whose flirting matters to me is from my husband, he's the only one whose attention I want.


----------



## Emerald

Enchanted said:


> I'm sure you could too. I'm not talking about sex. Divorced men in their 40's are looking at women in their 20's. I'm not saying those women want them but what 40 something divorced man would refuse a 20 year old?


Oh dear....I didn't want to have to do this but if it will help you......you are very naive, like I was at 44.

After my long marriage ended, I wanted to date again. I expected at age 48 that no man under 60 would be interested. I am not into the bar scene, so tried online dating.

I was shocked that men my age, younger & older were interested. I dated men between 40-55.

I met & married my husband who is 33 days older than me.

I asked him why he wasn't interested in younger women because they were interested in him! LOL

He said that he was looking for a divorced woman with grown children. Under 40 didn't fit that profile.

So you see, not all men want a hot younger chick....for a wife


----------



## Emerald

Shaggy said:


> This is I think one of the biggest changes that women do to themselves as they age that makes them age and become older.
> 
> They stop dressing nice. I don't mean cheap and slvtty, I mean they stop dressing nice. A lot of women stop shopping for nice clothes that fit well and switch to baggy polyester because it's easy to clean. The switch from fashionable footwear, to conservative reliable comfort shows. And these are the women who look older than they really are, much older.
> 
> Same goes for guys BTW. When a man stops wearing nice and fitted clothes, and switches to old badly fitting things it also ages him.
> 
> Honestly, a well dressed woman in here 40 and 50s and 60s can turn heads just as well as a woman in her 20s, if she has put the effort in, and if she has avoided the middle age weight gain nasty. This goes for guys too. A guy in his 50s can get a lot of attention, but if he's 40lbs over weight , it's not going to happen.


Agree.

I have 2 daughters in their early 20's. They don't dress slvtty at all (grew out of that phase lol) & we share (most) clothes. My skirts may not be as short & my skinny jeans are not quite as tight, but I assure you I look fashionable (I'm addicted to fashion blogs) & do not look like a mutton dressed like a lamb

Now the above is a personal choice. I don't judge others as to how they dress. People can do what they want.


----------



## Emerald

greenfern said:


> My biggest issue with aging is clothes..I love clothes & always have, but I find it very difficult to know what is 'age appropriate'. I don't want to dress too conservative and I love a lot of younger styles, but I just have this paranoia of dressing "too young for my age".


There is no such thing as too young unless you are shopping in the Junior's Department..and what is "age appropriate" really? Age is a number. Dressing appropriately applies to any age even 8 yr. olds. It means dressing for your body shape, the weather, playing up your assets, comfort, the occasion, etc.

Forget fashion magazines. All airbrushed & photoshopped. There are TONS of fashion blogs by real women wearing real clothes. You will be amazed what you can wear at any age.


----------



## Enchanted

Emerald said:


> Oh dear....I didn't want to have to do this but if it will help you......you are very naive, like I was at 44.
> 
> After my long marriage ended, I wanted to date again. I expected at age 48 that no man under 60 would be interested. I am not into the bar scene, so tried online dating.
> 
> I was shocked that men my age, younger & older were interested. I dated men between 40-55.
> 
> I met & married my husband who is 33 days older than me.
> 
> I asked him why he wasn't interested in younger women because they were interested in him! LOL
> 
> He said that he was looking for a divorced woman with grown children. Under 40 didn't fit that profile.
> 
> So you see, not all man want a hot younger chick....for a wife


That is fantastic to hear and it really makes me feel better about being 44.

Thank you Emerald.


----------



## Mavash.

Emerald said:


> There is no such thing as too young unless you are shopping in the Junior's Department..and what is "age appropriate" really?


I'm 46 and I shop the juniors dept. Not because I'm trying to look young but because I'm small. I've shrunk out of the misses department and I can't afford to shop the stores that sell smaller sizes.

The juniors dept is cheaper. I stick to basics there not the teeny bopper stuff. You know t-shirts, yoga pants, that kinda thing. 

I have friends tell me to forget 'age appropriate' that it's better for me to wear what fits vs what's more for my age. I'm always getting fussed at for wearing clothes that are too big. LOL


----------



## jaquen

Emerald said:


> ...and what's wrong with wearing those minis & pumps NOW?
> 
> It's all about the gams Sister!....and attitude
> 
> You know what's HOT? An attractive 24 yr. old with a rockin. bod.
> 
> You know what's AWESOME? An attractive 44 yr. old with a rockin' bod.


Yes! Yes!

You know who looks hot in a pair of pumps and a mini? A hot woman.

Note I did not say a hot young woman. The criteria, IMO, if a woman can pull off any given look is if she looks good in any given look. That's the end of the story. 

Maybe I'm just spoiled, living NYC? Women here of all ages rock body conscious, sexy clothes. Some look a fool, some look ****ty, and some look damn fine. It just depends on the woman, and far less on the age. I think so much more goes into what is hot, and sexy, than being the smoothest, youngest, most nubile female around. I am one who believes true beauty, and sex appeal, for most women does come with age to a degree.

This thread needs pictures!

This is sexy to me:

Angela Bassett - 48 as pictured









Susan Lucci - 62 as pictured









Katey Sagal - 55 as pictured









Halle Berry - 46 as pictured









Helen Mirren - 64 as pictured









Christie Brinkley - 57 as pictured









Iman - 53 as pictured









Demi Moore - 49 as pictured









Jamie Lee Curtis - 53 as pictured









Lynda Carter - 60 as pictured









Tina Turner - 71 as pictured










I guarantee you these women are sexy to plenty of other men, regardless of age. Wearing your own skin well is the key. For some that's more natural than others, so that is of course a factor.


----------



## Lyris

I want to be Helen Mirren when I grow up.


----------



## Enchanted

Mavash. said:


> I'm 46 and I shop the juniors dept. Not because I'm trying to look young but because I'm small. I've shrunk out of the misses department and I can't afford to shop the stores that sell smaller sizes.
> 
> The juniors dept is cheaper. I stick to basics there not the teeny bopper stuff. You know t-shirts, yoga pants, that kinda thing.
> 
> I have friends tell me to forget 'age appropriate' that it's better for me to wear what fits vs what's more for my age. I'm always getting fussed at for wearing clothes that are too big. LOL


I shop at the junior department too. There's plenty of stuff that's appropriate.


----------



## Emerald

Enchanted said:


> I shop at the junior department too. There's plenty of stuff that's appropriate.


Okay ladies...sorry if I offended with the shopping at the Junior's Department.

I guess I contradicted myself lol. My daughter's shop there & we swap clothes


----------



## Emerald

» Women over 40 who are still smoking hot, a gallery


----------



## EnjoliWoman

It's so funny - the saying "youth is wasted on the youth" is true. When I was young and hot I was so insecure, uncertain, immature, seeking something without knowing what...

At 45 I am not as thin, perky or perfect but not as hung up on every little imperfection. I look in the mirror and still really like who looks back. 

I know what she's been through and how I've come through it. I know my strengths and my weaknesses and I've pushed my limits. I've overcome fears and hardships and embraced who I am. I have come to like who I am on the inside and I put less stock on what's on the outside. 

I take better care of myself - nutritionally, exercise, sunblock, etc. but I also take better care of my insides. I know when I need camaraderie or time for introspection. I listen to my gut now because I've learned to trust my inner voice.

I would not go back for anything.


----------



## Mavash.

Emerald said:


> Okay ladies...sorry if I offended with the shopping at the Junior's Department.
> 
> I guess I contradicted myself lol. My daughter's shop there & we swap clothes


You didn't offend me at all. Honestly I'll be glad when my finances are better and I can afford to buy extra small ADULT looking clothes. At the moment there is ONE bricks and morter store that sells clothes my size and 2-3 catalog places. All of which are much more expensive than the juniors dept.

I usually end up wearing a mix of a bit too big clothes, a few pieces from the more pricey places and then I fill in with the juniors.


----------



## always_alone

jaquen said:


> Yes! Yes!
> 
> You know who looks hot in a pair of pumps and a mini? A hot woman.
> 
> Note I did not say a hot young woman. The criteria, IMO, if a woman can pull off any given look is if she looks good in any given look. That's the end of the story.
> 
> 
> This thread needs pictures!
> 
> This is sexy to me:
> 
> Angela Bassett - 48 as pictured
> Susan Lucci - 62 as pictured
> Katey Sagal - 55 as pictured
> Halle Berry - 46 as pictured
> Helen Mirren - 64 as pictured
> Christie Brinkley - 57 as pictured
> Iman - 53 as pictured
> Demi Moore - 49 as pictured
> Jamie Lee Curtis - 53 as pictured
> Lynda Carter - 60 as pictured
> Tina Turner - 71 as pictured
> 
> I guarantee you these women are sexy to plenty of other men, regardless of age. Wearing your own skin well is the key. For some that's more natural than others, so that is of course a factor.


*sigh*. Really? In a marriage forum filled with people struggling to make their relationships work, is it entirely necessary to post endless pics of sexy women? Aren't there a zillion other places for this?

I think my biggest fantasy is just to go one day without having some guy's fantasy girl being shoved in my face.


----------



## Emerald

EnjoliWoman said:


> It's so funny - the saying "youth is wasted on the youth" is true. When I was young and hot I was so insecure, uncertain, immature, seeking something without knowing what...
> 
> At 45 I am not as thin, perky or perfect but not as hung up on every little imperfection. I look in the mirror and still really like who looks back.
> 
> I know what she's been through and how I've come through it. I know my strengths and my weaknesses and I've pushed my limits. I've overcome fears and hardships and embraced who I am. I have come to like who I am on the inside and I put less stock on what's on the outside.
> 
> I take better care of myself - nutritionally, exercise, sunblock, etc. but I also take better care of my insides. I know when I need camaraderie or time for introspection. I listen to my gut now because I've learned to trust my inner voice.
> 
> I would not go back for anything.


Your post got me thinking. When I was in my 20's working in the corporate world of banking, I was very stressed out about my appearance, clothing & looking "perfect." Competition was fierce amongs us women on who was hotter, etc. We didn't work on our personalities & inner beauty as much as our outer selves.

Of course back then we were all looking for "husbands" LOL.

Now over 50, I dress for myself & husband only. I am not stressed out in the least about my outer self/beauty. I guess I am happier now about my looks.


----------



## Mavash.

Emerald said:


> Now over 50, I dress for myself & husband only.


:iagree:

I find I take this way more seriously than he does. He however is easy to please.


----------



## always_alone

amanda1959 said:


> 44 is HOT!!! ask men!!!


I did ask men, and they told me in no uncertain terms that some 44 is hot: genetically gifted 44 is hot, plastic surgery 44 can be hot, and having enough money for a personal trainer and several hours a day to spend on your looks 44 is hot.

The rest of us are just invisible -- sometimes even to our SOs. 

But nevermind, it can all just be solved if you buy the right lingerie or "haven't let yourself go".


----------



## Enchanted

always_alone said:


> *sigh*. Really? In a marriage forum filled with people struggling to make their relationships work, is it entirely necessary to post endless pics of sexy women? Aren't there a zillion other places for this?
> 
> I think my biggest fantasy is just to go one day without having some guy's fantasy girl being shoved in my face.


It's appropriate for this thread.


----------



## Mavash.

always_alone said:


> having enough money for a personal trainer and several hours a day to spend on your looks 44 is hot.


This is a total excuse. I'm TINY and I work out about 45 minutes five days a week. I do not have a personal trainer I have a set of workout dvds $25 off ebay and a set of hand weights $20.

AND it only takes me 30 minutes to get ready and look good.


----------



## Emerald

always_alone said:


> I did ask men, and they told me in no uncertain terms that some 44 is hot: genetically gifted 44 is hot, plastic surgery 44 can be hot, and having enough money for a personal trainer and several hours a day to spend on your looks 44 is hot.
> 
> The rest of us are just invisible -- sometimes even to our SOs.
> 
> But nevermind, it can all just be solved if you buy the right lingerie or "haven't let yourself go".


You didn't ask my 53 yr. old husband who thinks his 53 yr. old wife is hot


----------



## Mavash.

Oh and the ap myfitnesspal is free. That's how I diet too....the hard way by <gasp> counting calories. I measure EVERYTHING and I eat a lot of vegetables. LOL


----------



## Emerald

Mavash. said:


> This is a total excuse. I'm TINY and I work out about 45 minutes five days a week. I do not have a personal trainer I have a set of workout dvds $25 off ebay and a set of hand weights $20.
> 
> AND it only takes me 30 minutes to get ready and look good.


I lift weights while watching TV & roaming on TAM!

I also have a Jazzercise membership for only $44 a month. There are 20 classes per week available. That's 80 possible one-hour classes for a very low monthly cost. Gym memberships can be as low as $30 per month.


----------



## COguy

Came in late, just wanted to let all you mature women out there that older women can be incredibly sexy.

Part of what makes them so hot is that they often don't have all the insecurity, they're more mature, they know what they want, they are self-sufficient, and I don't find they play as many games.

To be honest if I see a smoking hot 40 or 50 year old go by I'm more turned on then a hot 20 year old.

Best way to raise your attraction level: act confident no matter how you look.


----------



## EnjoliWoman

always_alone said:


> I did ask men, and they told me in no uncertain terms that some 44 is hot: genetically gifted 44 is hot, plastic surgery 44 can be hot, and having enough money for a personal trainer and several hours a day to spend on your looks 44 is hot.
> 
> The rest of us are just invisible -- sometimes even to our SOs.
> 
> But nevermind, it can all just be solved if you buy the right lingerie or "haven't let yourself go".


I'm 45. I'm hot in my head.  When I catch a glimpse of my reflection sometimes I'm surprised I'm not as hot as I think I am, LOL I learned after my divorce, men like women who are confident. So I faked it. I will dress as flattering as I can for my figure and hold my chin level and walk with confidence. 

In the bedroom I push aside thoughts about imperfections and let me get lost in the moment. I reassure myself he is in bed with me because he wants to be there. 

I am a member of Planet Fitness which costs me $10 a month. I figured out how to get it into my schedule. Walking is free. I take care to keep my dress and hair current - I do not have the same wardrobe or hair style that I did 20 years ago. Nor have I fallen into frumpy - being 'old' before my time. Classy women never get frumpy. Ever. I will not be a frumpy woman.

So make the best of what you have and present that to the world know you are at your best! That's all there is to it. If you are invisible then you are not commanding in your presence. Don't be a wall flower.


----------



## always_alone

Emerald said:


> You didn't ask my 53 yr. old husband who thinks his 53 yr. old wife is hot


I'm sure all of you who have responded to my comment are beautiful, and it's great that your H's think so too.

For what it's worth, I too work out, dress nice, yada, yada, yada. But guess what? It's still not enough to make someone hot -- even to their SO. And before y'all tell me I just need more confidence -- well I have plenty of that too and I still don't rate as hot -- 

Who woulda thunk?


----------



## COguy

EnjoliWoman said:


> So make the best of what you have and present that to the world know you are at your best! That's all there is to it. If you are invisible then you are not commanding in your presence. Don't be a wall flower.


Preach it sista! Release the inner-cougar.


----------



## Mavash.

always_alone said:


> For what it's worth, I too work out, dress nice, yada, yada, yada. But guess what? It's still not enough to make someone hot -- even to their SO.


Means you're with the wrong person. I think my husband is hot and he's just your average looking middle aged man. Nothing special about his looks to anyone BUT me and that's all that matters.


----------



## ScarletBegonias

I'd rather my SO think of me as a beautiful and lovely sexy person rather than being labeled as "hot". 

hot is a bit too shallow for me to consider it flattering.


----------



## daffodilly

Mavash. said:


> Means you're with the wrong person. I think my husband is hot and he's just your average looking middle aged man. Nothing special about his looks to anyone BUT me and that's all that matters.


This this this! Pretty sure many would see my H as average looking, though he's in good shape....but if he stood beside Brad Pitt in front of me I'd STILL salivate over H and want to jump him immediately!


----------



## always_alone

EnjoliWoman said:


> So make the best of what you have and present that to the world know you are at your best! That's all there is to it. If you are invisible then you are not commanding in your presence. Don't be a wall flower.


Thanks. I do make the best of what I have, and am not a wallflower. But men are still turned off by me because they find me intimidating (and have often told me such). Believe me, one can definitely have a presence without being considered sexy in the slightest.


----------



## always_alone

ScarletBegonias said:


> I'd rather my SO think of me as a beautiful and lovely sexy person rather than being labeled as "hot".
> 
> hot is a bit too shallow for me to consider it flattering.


Agreed!!! But then you need to be beautiful, lovely or sexy ...

What if you're a cynic or curmudgeon? Men can wear that well, but women are supposed to be beautiful, nurturing and positive.


----------



## ScarletBegonias

always_alone said:


> Agreed!!! But then you need to be beautiful, lovely or sexy ...
> 
> What if you're a cynic or curmudgeon? Men can wear that well, but women are supposed to be beautiful, nurturing and positive.


We aren't SUPPOSED to be anything but good people who do what we can to make the best of this life.

Anything more than that is just a ridiculous "rule" started by goodness knows who and for some reason no one wants to say "NO.I don't HAVE to be this way just because someone says I do."

I need my SO to think I'm a beautiful,lovely,sexy person inside and out...I will buck at the notion that I'm supposed to be nurturing,positive,and whatever else just because someone says I should be that way. 

Be what makes you happiest with yourself


----------



## Mavash.

always_alone said:


> I do make the best of what I have, and am not a wallflower. *But men are still turned off by me because they find me intimidating* (and have often told me such).


Ah got it. This makes perfect sense. Being intimidating isn't all that attractive.

I should know I used to be that way too. I've learned to dial it down....just a little. Being 'hot' means having a good personality not a ball buster.


----------



## always_alone

ScarletBegonias said:


> Be what makes you happiest with yourself


Yes, absolutely! All I'm trying to suggest (poorly perhaps) is that what makes you happy with yourself or me with myself isn't necessarily going to result in anyone else liking, loving, or wanting to have sex with us. Sure it may --but it also may not. And easy answers like "be confident", "stay fit", "believe you're hot" sometimes make no difference at all.

And no, there just isn't someone "right" (or sort of "right") for everyone.


----------



## ScarletBegonias

always_alone said:


> Yes, absolutely! All I'm trying to suggest (poorly perhaps) is that what makes you happy with yourself or me with myself isn't necessarily going to result in anyone else liking, loving, or wanting to have sex with us. Sure it may --but it also may not. And easy answers like "be confident", "stay fit", "believe you're hot" sometimes make no difference at all.
> 
> And no, there just isn't someone "right" (or sort of "right") for everyone.


Being the you that you love and the you that makes you happy may result in being alone but being alone is a small sacrifice to make for loving who you are and being content with yourself. (just in my opinion...this is obviously not how every one feels and that's ok)


----------



## EnjoliWoman

always_alone said:


> Thanks. I do make the best of what I have, and am not a wallflower. But men are still turned off by me because they find me intimidating (and have often told me such). Believe me, one can definitely have a presence without being considered sexy in the slightest.


I have been told I'm intimidating as well.  What that tells me is those guys aren't man enough for me.  So it's fine if I have to wait for one who thinks he can handle me. :smthumbup:


----------



## Lon

always_alone said:


> Agreed!!! But then you need to be beautiful, lovely or sexy ...
> 
> What if you're a cynic or curmudgeon? Men can wear that well, but women are supposed to be beautiful, nurturing and positive.


please don't play what others tell you you are supposed to be, because there are too many women ignoring good men because they are trying to play games, likewise there are too many good men ladies won't go for because we too may not be playing what we are supposed to be either.

I like to be intimidated by a woman, so don't presume that your disposition is scaring all guys away. Also, I'm not all about the whole "confidence" baloney, you don't need to strut around to win this guy, just merely be visible and when you see someone you like don't be so subtle that you are playing hard to get... FLIRT! because if you are not flirty those around you won't be either.


----------



## EnjoliWoman

COguy said:


> Preach it sista! Release the inner-cougar.


LOL I've never been a cougar unless you know a younger man!


----------



## jaquen

always_alone said:


> *sigh*. Really? In a marriage forum filled with people struggling to make their relationships work, is it entirely necessary to post endless pics of sexy women? Aren't there a zillion other places for this?
> 
> I think my biggest fantasy is just to go one day without having some guy's fantasy girl being shoved in my face.


Since those pictures were appropriate to the line of discussion at hand, yes I do find it entirely necessary.

If you have a problem with it, you're absolutely free to scroll on.


----------



## always_alone

Mavash. said:


> Ah got it. This makes perfect sense. Being intimidating isn't all that attractive.
> 
> I should know I used to be that way too. I've learned to dial it down....just a little. Being 'hot' means having a good personality not a ball buster.


Except that I'm not a ball buster -- most of the time I'm relatively nice. But it isn't always easy to keep up with me, and yes most men I've met are quite threatened by that. So it goes.

I thought my SO was different (he said he was!), but turns out not so much.


----------



## jaquen

Uh, there are plenty of ball busting, "intimidating", curmudgeon women who are dating, in long term relationships, and married.

Half the men running to TAM seem to be with such women, and they're desperate to stay with them.

No offense intended, but all I see from you are excuses, projections, and diversions. First it was porn that was the problem. Then it was other women, who only get attention because they have endless time for working out, endless money for plastic surgery and trainers, or are naturally gifted. Now it's no men on planet Earth will sleep with an "intimidating" woman.

You have a problem with the woman in the mirror. That's your enemy.


----------



## always_alone

jaquen said:


> Uh, there are plenty of ball busting, "intimidating", curmudgeon women who are dating, in long term relationships, and married.


And amazingly enough I am one of them. Except that I've lately been wondering/worrying whether ths relationship is working all that well. Hence my presence here.

And I know you think you have me pegged, and you can call me whatever names you like, but it is actually possible that i have one or two opinions that have at least a partial basis in reality and not just in my own neuroses.

For one, I never said that no man will sleep with an intimidating woman. Many will. Guys like sex, right?

And I never said other women are a problem. I was only suggesting that the parameters of what counts as sexy are not anywhere near as broad as people were saying. I have heard ever so many men judge ever so many women purely on their looks, dismissing them as unattractive for this or that aesthetic infraction, including and especially old. 

And I have been told ever so many times just to bat my eyelashes more, dress nicer, undress more, act more like a porn star, be more positive and ladylike, etc. Yes it's true, if I was a completely different person, I would be ...completely different.


----------



## Coffee Amore

I KNEW as soon as Jaquen posted those pictures someone would say "oh those women have money, personal trainers, personal chefs, all the time on their hands.." It's the type of comment I've come to expect from some. But here's the thing, I know colleagues, friends, neighbors who look really good in their 40s and 50s. A little hair color, a bit of makeup, age appropriate, contemporary, figure flattering clothing and a normal body weight can go a long way. The other thing to have is a upbeat fun attitude, keep up with current technology and know what's going on in music and films. 



always_alone said:


> I did ask men, and they told me in no uncertain terms that some 44 is hot: genetically gifted 44 is hot, plastic surgery 44 can be hot, and having enough money for a personal trainer and several hours a day to spend on your looks 44 is hot.
> 
> The rest of us are just invisible -- sometimes even to our SOs.
> 
> But nevermind, it can all just be solved if you buy the right lingerie or "haven't let yourself go".


You're not talking to the men in my area! My best friend who is a professionally accomplished 53 year old is dating a very fit, professionally accomplished 34 year old man. They've been together now for over a year. She works out regularly at home, not at a gym. She is at a normal BMI. She watches what she eats, but isn't stick thin either. She's fun to be around, with a youthful interest in the world, she's not intimidated by technology or new things in the world. The way she carries herself attracts men to her. Oh and talk about intimdating. She's an attorney who attended a very prestigious university. Men don't seem put off by any of her professional accomplishments. 

I still get attention from men. Is it as much as when I was a 20 year old? No. But I'm not invisible to men either. I work out. I do it at home or I jog. I don't have a personal trainer. I haven't had plastic surgery on my face. I'm still within 15 pounds of my weight at university. My mother who is in her 70s still weighs only 110 pounds. She works out several times a week too. She does have a personal trainer but that's only because at her age she needs extra help with some of the machines at the gym. One does not have to have plastic surgery, a personal trainer, or lots of money to look good and age appropriate for one's age.


----------



## always_alone

Coffee Amore said:


> But here's the thing, I know colleagues, friends, neighbors who look really good in their 40s and 50s. A little hair color, a bit of makeup, age appropriate, contemporary, figure flattering clothing and a normal body weight can go a long way. The other thing to have is a upbeat fun attitude, keep up with current technology and know what's going on in music and films.


I'm sorry I spoke now --but really the only thing I'm trying to say is this:

Yes there is no shortage of fit, well-dressed, gorgeous, smart, wonderful and beautiful women out there. No doubt they turn heads and are admired wherever they go, and at whatever age they happen to be. 

But notice as well all the parameters that are added --hair colour, proper clothes, make-up, fit, healthy, positive, etc. The pool of gorgeous women may not be small, but there are quite a lot of criteria to make it there. Not all of us can.

I didn't realize this would be such a controversial comment. Think I'll just crawl back in my hole now.

Edit to add: I just re-read my post and I see what you are all objecting to now. I didn't mean to say that there were only three ways to be attractive and the rest are invisible. That's not right. Just that the parameters for beauty aren't as wide as people seem to be suggesting on this board.


----------



## Wazza

Coffee Amore said:


> with a youthful interest in the world, she's not intimidated by technology or new things in the world.


I think those things describe me. However, as I age nostalgia for things of my youth is also there.

I want a partner who shares that tension, not someone who is trying a desperately be 20 again.


----------



## Wazza

jaquen said:


> Since those pictures were appropriate to the line of discussion at hand, yes I do find it entirely necessary.
> 
> If you have a problem with it, you're absolutely free to scroll on.


The photos reinforced a certain stereotype of beauty that not everyone subscribes to. I can see why you do, you are a youngster 


But then, I don't equate "hot" and "attractive". I'll take a warm smile and expressive eyes over a CFM miniskirt any day.


----------



## jaquen

Wazza said:


> The photos reinforced a certain stereotype of beauty that not everyone subscribes to.


Which "stereotype" would that be? Attractive? Sexy? Because color me naive, but I never realized Hellen Mirren, Jamie Lee Curtis, and Tina Turner were all the same "stereotype".




Wazza said:


> I can see why you do, you are a youngster


Yes, I'm sure only men my age would find the women I posted to be sexy. That sounds about right.


----------



## Emerald

always_alone said:


> I'm sorry I spoke now --but really the only thing I'm trying to say is this:
> 
> Yes there is no shortage of fit, well-dressed, gorgeous, smart, wonderful and beautiful women out there. No doubt they turn heads and are admired wherever they go, and at whatever age they happen to be.
> 
> But notice as well all the parameters that are added --hair colour, proper clothes, make-up, fit, healthy, positive, etc. The pool of gorgeous women may not be small, but there are quite a lot of criteria to make it there. Not all of us can.
> 
> I didn't realize this would be such a controversial comment. Think I'll just crawl back in my hole now.
> 
> Edit to add: I just re-read my post and I see what you are all objecting to now. I didn't mean to say that there were only three ways to be attractive and the rest are invisible. That's not right. Just that the parameters for beauty aren't as wide as people seem to be suggesting on this board.


Don't feel bad. You contributed respectfully to this post. Of course many men don't think older women are hot, sexy & attractive. You are right. Also, many women don't find older men sexy & attractive. 

The OP is feeling bad about her age (44). I understand because I use to be like her. I wanted to help her feel better & become more secure with her age.


----------



## Lon

jaquen said:


> Which "stereotype" would that be? Attractive? Sexy? Because color me naive, but I never realized Hellen Mirren, Jamie Lee Curtis, and Tina Turner were all the same "stereotype".
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, I'm sure only men my age would find the women I posted to be sexy. That sounds about right.


You are using pics of celebrities, specifically ones renowned for looking incredible for their age. To me Susan Lucci looks ridiculously hot, even with the implants, her botox doesn't even appear to be overdone.

But 1) those are just pictures, looks account for maybe half of a woman.s attractiveness (to me) but you are only considering looks. 2) 99% of women will not look that good (as Lucci, or Brinkley) not probably will have even been able to look like supermodels.

Next time if you want to make a more effective point that women ARE beatiful as they age, maybe don't use examples of such impossibly high physical standards.


----------



## Lyris

jaquen said:


> Which "stereotype" would that be? Attractive? Sexy? Because color me naive, but I never realized Hellen Mirren, Jamie Lee Curtis, and Tina Turner were all the same "stereotype".
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, I'm sure only men my age would find the women I posted to be sexy. That sounds about right.


I don't know if stereotype is the right word, and I loved those pics, but they're not really relatable to most of us in our 40s.

I mean, Helen Mirren, Halle Berry et al were all amazingly beautiful 20 year olds, far more beautiful than I have ever been. And with hard work and good genetics, possibly a bit of surgical intervention, they still look great. But less great than in their 20s.

So take a normal, attractive woman like me and I know that I'm not falling from as high a place, if you see what I mean. So it means more that I am not as attractive as I was, because I don't have as big a beauty buffer. Halle Berry goes from a 12 out of 10 to an 8. I go from a solid 7.5 to a 5. See what I mean?

This is true generally I think. I actually do look better now than when I was in my mid-20s, because I'm in better shape, but I look worse than I did at 30, because then I was in great shape *and* had fewer lines and grey hairs. 

For a 40 year old mother of two I look good. My husband thinks I'm smokin'. If I didn't have him though, it would worry me a lot more.


----------



## Lon

Lyris dear, to a good man the grey and the lines don't matter a bit, even if he is not the one that caused them.

And for a woman who's personality isn't aging nicely, smooth skin and colored hair is merely a trick to perpetuate her self esteem problems. The cosmetics industry loves those ones (so long as they don't give up all hope and go hippie-recluse).


----------



## jaquen

Lon said:


> You are using pics of celebrities, specifically ones renowned for looking incredible for their age. To me Susan Lucci looks ridiculously hot, even with the implants, her botox doesn't even appear to be overdone.
> 
> But 1) those are just pictures, looks account for maybe half of a woman.s attractiveness (to me) but you are only considering looks. 2) 99% of women will not look that good (as Lucci, or Brinkley) not probably will have even been able to look like supermodels.
> 
> Next time if you want to make a more effective point that women ARE beatiful as they age, maybe don't use examples of such impossibly high physical standards.


Let me refresh you guys on the trajectory of the conversation, which led to the posting of those pics:

Enchanted said:

*Well...I can't say that I wish I was ugly because that isn't true. And I still do get some attention but it's not like it was. Of course, I use to dress in mini skirts and pumps and now I'm pretty conservative.*

Emerald responded:

*...and what's wrong with wearing those minis & pumps NOW?

It's all about the gams Sister!....and attitude 

You know what's HOT? An attractive 24 yr. old with a rockin. bod.

You know what's AWESOME? An attractive 44 yr. old with a rockin' bod.*

And I posted pictures of older, in shape women with, to quote Emerald, "rockin' bods", to prove the point that "age appropriate" attire totally comes down to the woman. Whether a woman can get away with "minis & pumps" is less an issue of age, as it is how a woman looks in said attire.

The conversation tangent we went off on wasn't about how attainable the beauty was, but as an attempt to show that a decent body could still get away with sexy, body conscious clothes.

And I prefaced this by saying that a lot of women where I live are in great shape, and can pull off body conscious, sexy clothing. The way the women in those pics wear their clothes is just not an uncommon reality here.

I did not post those pictures in an attempt to suggest all, or even most, women can look like those women. The tangent was focused on mainly attire, and sex appeal. You don't need to look like Halle Berry, or Lynda Carter, in the face to still be able to have a tight, fit body that allows you to wear clothing that some think is only for younger women.


----------



## jaquen

Lyris said:


> This is true generally I think. *I actually do look better now than when I was in my mid-20s, because I'm in better shape*, but I look worse than I did at 30, because then I was in great shape *and* had fewer lines and grey hairs.



But you perfectly illustrate my point.

The pictures were posted to prove that over 40 women could look hot in what Emerald called "minis & pumps". You'd probably look better in a great fitted dress, or some other traditionally hot attire, now than you did in your mid 20's. 

That was the only point. I posted pictures of older women I personally find sexy, who I think look great in more risque, or body hugging clothes, still. A nice, healthy, fit body isn't unattainable. The fact that you are in better shape now than you were as a very young woman proves that.


----------



## Lyris

jaquen said:


> But you perfectly illustrate my point.
> 
> The pictures were posted to prove that over 40 women could look hot in what Emerald called "minis & pumps". You'd probably look better in a great fitted dress, or some other traditionally hot attire, now than you did in your mid 20's.
> 
> That was the only point. I posted pictures of older women I personally find sexy, who I think look great in more risque, or body hugging clothes, still. A nice, healthy, fit body isn't unattainable. The fact that you are in better shape now than you were as a very young woman proves that.


Yes, i was misremembering the context of your post. Now, if only i could think of an occasion that i could wear that dress Helen Mirren is wearing...


----------



## Emerald

jaquen said:


> Let me refresh you guys on the trajectory of the conversation, which led to the posting of those pics:
> 
> Enchanted said:
> 
> *Well...I can't say that I wish I was ugly because that isn't true. And I still do get some attention but it's not like it was. Of course, I use to dress in mini skirts and pumps and now I'm pretty conservative.*
> 
> Emerald responded:
> 
> *...and what's wrong with wearing those minis & pumps NOW?
> 
> It's all about the gams Sister!....and attitude
> 
> You know what's HOT? An attractive 24 yr. old with a rockin. bod.
> 
> You know what's AWESOME? An attractive 44 yr. old with a rockin' bod.*
> 
> And I posted pictures of older, in shape women with, to quote Emerald, "rockin' bods", to prove the point that "age appropriate" attire totally comes down to the woman. Whether a woman can get away with "minis & pumps" is less an issue of age, as it is how a woman looks in said attire.
> 
> The conversation tangent we went off on wasn't about how attainable the beauty was, but as an attempt to show that a decent body could still get away with sexy, body conscious clothes.
> 
> And I prefaced this by saying that a lot of women where I live are in great shape, and can pull off body conscious, sexy clothing. The way the women in those pics wear their clothes is just not an uncommon reality here.
> 
> I did not post those pictures in an attempt to suggest all, or even most, women can look like those women. The tangent was focused on mainly attire, and sex appeal. You don't need to look like Halle Berry, or Lynda Carter, in the face to still be able to have a tight, fit body that allows you to wear clothing that some think is only for younger women.


Right & you can't post pics of the women you know IRL LOL.

I live near SF, CA. All you have to do is go spend the day in a big city to see gorgeous older fashionable (not rich) women walking around. 

Some of us are on TAM:lol:


----------



## jaquen

Lyris said:


> Yes, i was misremembering the context of your post. Now, if only i could think of an occasion that i could wear that dress Helen Mirren is wearing...


Make everyday such an occasion. You could buy that dress and wear it to the supermarket LOL! 

Which totally take me back to my wedding day, and my wife and I walking around in the middle of this grocery store, situated in a small Tuscan town, in full, fancy wedding attire. Oh the looks we got that day! :smthumbup:

I'd kill to see you walk into a Walmart in full "Helen Mirren" wear! :rofl:


----------



## Lon

Jaquen, sorry to incorrectly put you on the defensive there... You are absolutely correct, older (not necessarily "old") women can pull off sexy attire too!


----------



## EnjoliWoman

How long have you been looking? Do you not see all of the average men looking at you because you are only looking at the 'hottest' ones?

Just curious if those were some roadblocks - I've been out there 9 years and haven't found the right one but I assume I eventually will.


----------



## jaquen

No problem Lon.

To further illustrate my point, anybody ever seen the movie _Heartbreakers_? It came out in the late 90's, or early 00s, and was about a con artist, mother and daughter duo, played by Sigourney Weaver and Jennifer Love Hewitt (it was also one of Gene Hackman's last movies before his retirement). Now JLH is in my age group, and was definitely one of the major sex symbols of my generation. She looked damn fine in that movie. But you know who totally stole the show with her looks, sex appeal, and still in shape body? Over 50 Sigourney Weaver. I just remember that they put her in some of the sexiest clothes I'd seen on a woman, and she managed to just absolutely kick ass, and take names, standing next to a very young JLH. 

I later found out, years after the film was released, that Weaver had a special wardrobe designer brought in just to make clothes tailored for her body, with her input. She knew she was going to be sharing lots of screentime with one of the hottest young stars around at the time, and she was expected to still hold a lot of sex appeal while doing it. Boy did she ever pull it off.

Now mind you, I know I have a bias, having always loved older women, but still Weaver looked sexy as hell to me.


----------



## Wazza

jaquen said:


> Which "stereotype" would that be? Attractive? Sexy? Because color me naive, but I never realized Hellen Mirren, Jamie Lee Curtis, and Tina Turner were all the same "stereotype".
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, I'm sure only men my age would find the women I posted to be sexy. That sounds about right.


All really done up. All in skirts. All dressed in a figure hugging way. Most showing a lot of cleavage. All made up. Suspect all with dyed hair (except Tina Turner who will be in a wig).

Where is the fresh faced thing in jeans and a tee shirt' or a casual summer dress?


----------



## Wazza

jaquen said:


> Let me refresh you guys on the trajectory of the conversation, which led to the posting of those pics:
> 
> Enchanted said:
> 
> *Well...I can't say that I wish I was ugly because that isn't true. And I still do get some attention but it's not like it was. Of course, I use to dress in mini skirts and pumps and now I'm pretty conservative.*
> 
> Emerald responded:
> 
> *...and what's wrong with wearing those minis & pumps NOW?
> 
> It's all about the gams Sister!....and attitude
> 
> You know what's HOT? An attractive 24 yr. old with a rockin. bod.
> 
> You know what's AWESOME? An attractive 44 yr. old with a rockin' bod.*
> 
> And I posted pictures of older, in shape women with, to quote Emerald, "rockin' bods", to prove the point that "age appropriate" attire totally comes down to the woman. Whether a woman can get away with "minis & pumps" is less an issue of age, as it is how a woman looks in said attire.
> 
> The conversation tangent we went off on wasn't about how attainable the beauty was, but as an attempt to show that a decent body could still get away with sexy, body conscious clothes.
> 
> And I prefaced this by saying that a lot of women where I live are in great shape, and can pull off body conscious, sexy clothing. The way the women in those pics wear their clothes is just not an uncommon reality here.
> 
> I did not post those pictures in an attempt to suggest all, or even most, women can look like those women. The tangent was focused on mainly attire, and sex appeal. You don't need to look like Halle Berry, or Lynda Carter, in the face to still be able to have a tight, fit body that allows you to wear clothing that some think is only for younger women.


But if I think some of those women are not attractive?


----------



## Enchanted

Emerald said:


> Don't feel bad. You contributed respectfully to this post. Of course many men don't think older women are hot, sexy & attractive. You are right. Also, many women don't find older men sexy & attractive.
> 
> The OP is feeling bad about her age (44). I understand because I use to be like her. I wanted to help her feel better & become more secure with her age.


Yes. Please everyone keep in mind that I created this post because I'm 44 and feel bad that I don't get the attention and feelings of "specialness" that I did when I was in my 20's. Most of the people who are posting are offering me their opinions and support. 

I still believe our culture prefers younger women when it comes to beauty. It's also biological. Women who look as if they can produce healthy offspring give off biological sexual cues. 

Of course I could wear a T-shirt that says: "I Get my Period Regularly" but I doubt that would get me wolf whistles.


----------



## Enchanted

jaquen said:


> Let me refresh you guys on the trajectory of the conversation, which led to the posting of those pics:
> 
> Enchanted said:
> 
> *Well...I can't say that I wish I was ugly because that isn't true. And I still do get some attention but it's not like it was. Of course, I use to dress in mini skirts and pumps and now I'm pretty conservative.*
> 
> Emerald responded:
> 
> *...and what's wrong with wearing those minis & pumps NOW?
> 
> It's all about the gams Sister!....and attitude
> 
> You know what's HOT? An attractive 24 yr. old with a rockin. bod.
> 
> You know what's AWESOME? An attractive 44 yr. old with a rockin' bod.*
> 
> And I posted pictures of older, in shape women with, to quote Emerald, "rockin' bods", to prove the point that "age appropriate" attire totally comes down to the woman. Whether a woman can get away with "minis & pumps" is less an issue of age, as it is how a woman looks in said attire.
> 
> The conversation tangent we went off on wasn't about how attainable the beauty was, but as an attempt to show that a decent body could still get away with sexy, body conscious clothes.
> 
> And I prefaced this by saying that a lot of women where I live are in great shape, and can pull off body conscious, sexy clothing. The way the women in those pics wear their clothes is just not an uncommon reality here.
> 
> I did not post those pictures in an attempt to suggest all, or even most, women can look like those women. The tangent was focused on mainly attire, and sex appeal. You don't need to look like Halle Berry, or Lynda Carter, in the face to still be able to have a tight, fit body that allows you to wear clothing that some think is only for younger women.


I like the pictures Jaquen and they did make me feel better. The fact that those women are older than me was a bonus.


----------



## Emerald

Wazza said:


> All really done up. All in skirts. All dressed in a figure hugging way. Most showing a lot of cleavage. All made up. Suspect all with dyed hair (except Tina Turner who will be in a wig).
> 
> Where is the fresh faced thing in jeans and a tee shirt' or a casual summer dress?


She's everywhere around you. Yes, the celebrity pics were "all dressed up" but you can Google most of them (Name) "casual" or "no make-up" to see a mostly unmade face with jeans & tee.

You will still see good, toned figures on these over-40 women. Don't forget it is their business to look as good as possible. They get paid for it.

Personally, I could care less what people wear and/or how they look. It's not my business.

Enchanted - the media in America is obsessed with youth but I do see it changing a bit. Older women are now holding powerful positions in government & are CEO's running Fortune 500 corporations.

I was also wondering how long you have been married & do you think your husband no longer finds you attractive? Does he say things that hurt you?


----------



## Wazza

Emerald said:


> She's everywhere around you. Yes, the celebrity pics were "all dressed up" but you can Google most of them (Name) "casual" or "no make-up" to see a mostly unmade face with jeans & tee.
> 
> You will still see good, toned figures on these over-40 women. Don't forget it is their business to look as good as possible. They get paid for it.
> 
> Personally, I could care less what people wear and/or how they look. It's not my business.
> 
> Enchanted - the media in America is obsessed with youth but I do see it changing a bit. Older women are now holding powerful positions in government & are CEO's running Fortune 500 corporations.
> 
> I was also wondering how long you have been married & do you think your husband no longer finds you attractive? Does he say things that hurt you?


Well, I am a man, so some of your questions don't apply. 

My post was a response to Jaquen. He asked what stereotypes his photos conveyed and I answered.

Married thirty years, and find my wife VERY attractive. To be honest she coud not carry off one of those tight miniskirts, but she is gorgeous. The last thing I want is for her to ruin her perfection with Botox and plastic surgery.

And who cares about the miniskirt when I can admire her naked beauty?

Sorry if that last bit is too racey


----------



## Enchanted

Emerald said:


> She's everywhere around you. Yes, the celebrity pics were "all dressed up" but you can Google most of them (Name) "casual" or "no make-up" to see a mostly unmade face with jeans & tee.
> 
> You will still see good, toned figures on these over-40 women. Don't forget it is their business to look as good as possible. They get paid for it.
> 
> Personally, I could care less what people wear and/or how they look. It's not my business.
> 
> Enchanted - the media in America is obsessed with youth but I do see it changing a bit. Older women are now holding powerful positions in government & are CEO's running Fortune 500 corporations.
> 
> I was also wondering how long you have been married & do you think your husband no longer finds you attractive? Does he say things that hurt you?


We've been married 11 years. My husband is very kind and tells me I'm beautiful. He hates that I stare in the mirror picking out every flaw; he's threatened to throw the mirror away.


----------



## Emerald

Enchanted said:


> We've been married 11 years. My husband is very kind and tells me I'm beautiful. He hates that I stare in the mirror picking out every flaw; he's threatened to throw the mirror away.


Good.

Now you start believing it!


----------



## jaquen

Wazza said:


> All really done up. All in skirts. All dressed in a figure hugging way. Most showing a lot of cleavage. All made up. Suspect all with dyed hair (except Tina Turner who will be in a wig).


And yet again, the conversation at the point those pictures were posted was specifically about this kind of attire.

So I have no idea what you're continuing to debate.



Wazza said:


> But if I think some of those women are not attractive?


Why would I care? I posted pictures of older women who I believe can pull off the kind of attire that was under discussion. Whether you find them attractive, or not, is of no consequence to me.

If you would like to post pictures of older women you find attractive, in t-shirts and jeans, have at it.


----------



## Mavash.

Enchanted said:


> He hates that I stare in the mirror picking out every flaw; he's threatened to throw the mirror away.


You know this isn't an attractive trait right? Self confidence is more beautiful than anything. Flaw picking makes you appear uglier than you truly are.

If you insist on continuing this habit do it alone.


----------



## jaquen

Wazza said:


> Married thirty years, and find my wife VERY attractive. To be honest she coud not carry off one of those tight miniskirts, but she is gorgeous. The last thing I want is for her to ruin her perfection with Botox and plastic surgery.


What does botox and plastic surgery have to do with having a body fit enough to look good in some closer fitting attire? Are you suggesting that over 40 women need surgery in order to have nice, toned bodies?


----------



## Mavash.

jaquen said:


> What does botox and plastic surgery have to do with having a body fit enough to look good in some closer fitting attire? Are you suggesting that over 40 women need surgery in order to have nice, toned bodies?


I think I get what he's saying. He's simply saying those type women don't appeal to him. He's more for the natural look, the jeans/t-shirt, the who cares if she's carrying a few extra pounds gal, etc. 

Having a wife that's toned, fit and able to wear tight clothes isn't high on his priority list. He thinks it's not worth what those women had to do to look like that citing botox and plastic surgery as extreme examples.

But you are correct it does not take that to get that look. I've done it on a budget and doctors were not part of my plan. Yes I'm married to a man who DOES want all that so I give it to him.


----------



## Lon

Mavash. said:


> You know this isn't an attractive trait right? Self confidence is more beautiful than anything. Flaw picking makes you appear uglier than you truly are.
> 
> If you insist on continuing this habit do it alone.


To me, "self confidence" is kind of meaningless, and different people wear it differently. Personally I am not repulsed at all by a woman with low "self confidence" because it is really not that easy to distinguish. I could care less if she nitpicks herself in front of the mirror as long as she stops once in awhile to pay some attention to me once in awhile.

It is eternal discontent that I would find repelling.


----------



## Mavash.

Lon said:


> It is eternal discontent that I would find repelling.


This sentence is what I was getting at. 

You said it way better than me.


----------



## Enchanted

Zanne said:


> I think being toned and fit says you value your health and well being and that shows confidence. And, you don't have to wear close fitting attire; maybe you ARE a jeans and t-shirts kind of gal and maybe your man doesn't care about mini skirts. Furthermore, even if you are over 40 and toned and fit, you are still not going to look 20, nor should anyone expect you to.


I think Zanne said it best "if you are over 40 and toned and fit, you are still not going to look 20, nor should anyone expect you to." 

Zanne, I think there is a part of me that expects to look 20. I'm having a hard time coping with the fact that there are differences now that I'm 44. If I posted my picture I'm sure everyone would be kind and give me some nice compliments because that's how the people are on this forum (which makes posting here fun.) 

I don't walk around in deep despair that I can't pass for 20 anymore, but it bothers me. Hopefully, one day I'll be confident, happy and comfortable in my own skin even if that skin isn't perfect. 

It's going to take time for me to grow emotionally. Not just accepting of my age but other issues that come with maturity.


----------



## Mavash.

Enchanted said:


> Zanne, I think there is a part of me that expects to look 20. I'm having a hard time coping with the fact that there are differences now that I'm 44.


I have faith that you will adjust - most women do. I've already said I felt the EXACT same way at the age of 44. What is it with that age? It hit me right before I turned 45.

I don't think I expected to look 20 but it sure was sad to think I no longer looked 30. I do get carded at walmart for looking younger than 40 so that's a happy right? LOL


----------



## Enchanted

Mavash. said:


> I have faith that you will adjust - most women do. I've already said I felt the EXACT same way at the age of 44. What is it with that age? It hit me right before I turned 45.
> 
> I don't think I expected to look 20 but it sure was sad to think I no longer looked 30. I do get carded at walmart for looking younger than 40 so that's a happy right? LOL


Maybe 44 is the ultimate MLC age? LOL  

Getting carded at Walmart sounds like a pretty awesome day!


----------



## Enchanted

Zanne said:


> I am right there with you, Enchanted. Some of my fears when I look in the mirror relate to my own mortality. It's like I woke up one day and realized that I was middle-aged! I don't feel middle aged, but there it is.


That is how I feel. I never had kids and people always assume I'm much younger so I didn't see this coming. I figured somehow I got away with not aging. I know that sounds insane but I was in denial. Now I have to stop denying and start accepting.


----------



## Coffee Amore

Mavash. said:


> You know this isn't an attractive trait right? Self confidence is more beautiful than anything. Flaw picking makes you appear uglier than you truly are.
> 
> If you insist on continuing this habit do it alone.


I agree with this and with Lon's statement that "eternal discontent is repelling." I know some women in my life who can't even accept a sincerely given compliment graciously. If you give a compliment, they won't take it gracefully. Instead they put themselves down or make some joke about how you need to get glasses. Part of the downplay might be self-depracating humor, but I think some of it is lack of body acceptance.


----------



## Mavash.

Coffee Amore said:


> I agree with this and with Lon's statement that "eternal discontent is repelling." I know some women in my life who can't even accept a sincerely given compliment graciously. If you give a compliment, they won't take it gracefully. Instead they put themselves down or make some joke about how you need to get glasses. Part of the downplay might be self-depracating humor, but I think some of it is lack of body acceptance.


My husband does this. I think he's hot and tell him so often. What does he do? He puts himself down. I don't like it and so I call him on it. He's doing better about accepting compliments gracefully which in turn makes me happy.


----------



## Mavash.

Enchanted said:


> Getting carded at Walmart sounds like a pretty awesome day!


And you know I'm kidding on the walmart thing right? I only get carded on occasion and it's usually when my hair is up in a pony tail and I'm not wearing makeup. It doesn't happen ALL the time. I wish. 

I'm 46 and they can see I'm obviously over 40. Their policy dictates they card anyone appearing to be under 40 not 21.


----------



## jaquen

Enchanted said:


> I think Zanne said it best "if you are over 40 and toned and fit, you are still not going to look 20, nor should anyone expect you to."
> 
> Zanne, I think there is a part of me that expects to look 20. I'm having a hard time coping with the fact that there are differences now that I'm 44. If I posted my picture I'm sure everyone would be kind and give me some nice compliments because that's how the people are on this forum (which makes posting here fun.)
> 
> I don't walk around in deep despair that I can't pass for 20 anymore, but it bothers me. Hopefully, one day I'll be confident, happy and comfortable in my own skin even if that skin isn't perfect.
> 
> It's going to take time for me to grow emotionally. Not just accepting of my age but other issues that come with maturity.


I really think this is such rich, honest insight.

We have gotten really good at fighting the look of aging because, lets face it, plenty of people think aging sucks.

It can not be easy for the person who really did love how they looked at 20, or 30, or even 40, to be forced to embrace these natural, biological changes. 

I get that. Many people just are upset about the changes happening to them, the changes that are sometimes because they didn't take the best care, but sometimes because that's just life.

Not everybody is able to look back at their 20 year old face and be perfectly fine that he/she no longer exists.

I know a woman who is in her early 40's. She is absolutely gorgeous. But she, like many people here where I live, does not lead a "typical" life. She is unmarried, has a kind of bohemian, non-traditional artist's life, she is still searching for purpose, and her boyfriend of the last few years is only 24 years old, and they started dating when he was 19. He's moving on now, and she can't let go.

She is such a lovely looking woman, but you can tell that she is really jarred by growing older. She feels, sounds, and behaves like a really young woman, who time is just sort of forcing to move ahead. She's talented, and beautiful, but there is a sadness there. She really just seems to be assaulted, and insulted by, aging. 

No matter how great she looks, she does not look 20, or even 30. And that just is not something that seems to sit well with her at all. I think part of her thinks it's unfair.


----------



## Mavash.

You know what made it hard for me? I got cheated out of my 20's and most of my 30's. I had such low self esteem that I hid in baggy clothes. My parents gave me a horrible body image. One parent thought I was too thin, the other lectured me daily about not getting fat. So I stayed thin for dad but looked fat for mom. Talk about messed up.

So all those years I couldn't embrace who I was but with therapy I see it's never too late. I might not could have rocked a bikini or miniskirt when I was 20 but I can now. 

I've had to let go of the part that I didn't get to enjoy my 'youth'. It is what it is and there isn't any amount of pouting that will change that for me so I'm over it.


----------



## Enchanted

Mavash. said:


> And you know I'm kidding on the walmart thing right? I only get carded on occasion and it's usually when my hair is up in a pony tail and I'm not wearing makeup. It doesn't happen ALL the time. I wish.
> 
> I'm 46 and they can see I'm obviously over 40. Their policy dictates they card anyone appearing to be under 40 not 21.


I thought you were buying cigarettes or alcohol. LOL


----------



## Enchanted

jaquen said:


> I really think this is such rich, honest insight.
> 
> We have gotten really good at fighting the look of aging because, lets face it, plenty of people think aging sucks.
> 
> It can not be easy for the person who really did love how they looked at 20, or 30, or even 40, to be forced to embrace these natural, biological changes.
> 
> I get that. Many people just are upset about the changes happening to them, the changes that are sometimes because they didn't take the best care, but sometimes because that's just life.
> 
> Not everybody is able to look back at their 20 year old face and be perfectly fine that he/she no longer exists.
> 
> I know a woman who is in her early 40's. She is absolutely gorgeous. But she, like many people here where I live, does not lead a "typical" life. She is unmarried, has a kind of bohemian, non-traditional artist's life, she is still searching for purpose, and her boyfriend of the last few years is only 24 years old, and they started dating when he was 19. He's moving on now, and she can't let go.
> 
> She is such a lovely looking woman, but you can tell that she is really jarred by growing older. She feels, sounds, and behaves like a really young woman, who time is just sort of forcing to move ahead. She's talented, and beautiful, but there is a sadness there. She really just seems to be assaulted, and insulted by, aging.
> 
> No matter how great she looks, she does not look 20, or even 30. And that just is not something that seems to sit well with her at all. I think part of her thinks it's unfair.


I can really connect with this woman. I'm not at all bohemian - but I sort of understand being insulted by aging. For me, being pretty seemed to be the one thing I was good at and now I'm struggling desperately to keep it. 

(I swear I feel like Blanche in Streetcar.)


----------



## Mavash.

Enchanted said:


> I thought you were buying cigarettes or alcohol. LOL


As a general rule I don't drink. It ages you and it makes my depression worse. But occasionally my husband wants beer so I pick some up at my local walmart and once in a while I get carded because I look under 40 to them.

Mostly though they don't even blink as they hand me the beer. Sigh. It does make me happy when it happens though. LOL


----------



## Gaia

Enchanted said:


> You don't want to be young?
> 
> I'm so confused


Are you kidding me? People my age are labeled as inexperienced, immature, children who supposedly dont know right from wrong because thier brains arent fully developed. Hardly anyone takes someone my age seriously
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## CharlieParker

Haven't followed this thread for a bit but I think this fits.

A Hollywood gossip show came on the TV and the talk was of the Alabama's QB's model girlfriend (23) and the perhaps inappropriate comments made by the announcer (Brent Musburger has always been creepy). 

I told Mrs P I saw and heard it live during the game last night. And that I found the QB's mom to be way more attractive than the much younger girlfriend. It made her smile and she something like "you get it, we rule". A comment about how she likes what she sees in the mirror followed.


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## Phenix70

jaquen said:


> I really think this is such rich, honest insight.
> 
> We have gotten really good at fighting the look of aging because, lets face it, plenty of people think aging sucks.
> 
> It can not be easy for the person who really did love how they looked at 20, or 30, or even 40, to be forced to embrace these natural, biological changes.
> 
> I get that. Many people just are upset about the changes happening to them, the changes that are sometimes because they didn't take the best care, but sometimes because that's just life.
> 
> Not everybody is able to look back at their 20 year old face and be perfectly fine that he/she no longer exists.
> 
> I know a woman who is in her early 40's. She is absolutely gorgeous. But she, like many people here where I live, does not lead a "typical" life. She is unmarried, has a kind of bohemian, non-traditional artist's life, she is still searching for purpose, and her boyfriend of the last few years is only 24 years old, and they started dating when he was 19. He's moving on now, and she can't let go.
> 
> She is such a lovely looking woman, but you can tell that she is really jarred by growing older. She feels, sounds, and behaves like a really young woman, who time is just sort of forcing to move ahead. She's talented, and beautiful, but there is a sadness there. She really just seems to be assaulted, and insulted by, aging.
> 
> No matter how great she looks, she does not look 20, or even 30. And that just is not something that seems to sit well with her at all. I think part of her thinks it's unfair.


I can relate to the sadness part, not because of the way I look but the fact that getting older is inevitable.
Everyday we live, we get closer to dying, there is no way around that.
It is sad to me that my life is basically half over & there is nothing I can do about it.
When the truth hit me & I finally accepted it, it took everything I had not to get depressed.
Instead I decided to embrace the life I have & to go out to live my life to the fullest. 
There are days I do feel sad, especially when I look around & realize that what is truly unfair about life is how short it can be.


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## Enchanted

BTW I'm making a big effort to spend more time at the gym and it's helping my self esteem. My body is getting more toned and my husband notices.


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## I Notice The Details

COguy said:


> Came in late, just wanted to let all you mature women out there that older women can be incredibly sexy.
> 
> Part of what makes them so hot is that they often don't have all the insecurity, they're more mature, they know what they want, they are self-sufficient, and I don't find they play as many games.
> 
> To be honest if I see a smoking hot 40 or 50 year old go by I'm more turned on then a hot 20 year old.
> 
> Best way to raise your attraction level: act confident no matter how you look.


BINGO....that above is very well said and exactly how I feel as well. :iagree::iagree:

The question then is....how does a women become more confident in her own body and exude that thru their personality? My experience has been that the "prettiest" women are definately not the the most confident. The "girl next door" type is usually the most well adjusted and confident with themselves. 

I also knew 3 women in college that were very much overweight. Their personalities were SO attractive, sexy, and confident. They were the most relaxed and fun to be around....I always wondered how they developed that "extra" amount of self confidence...it must not all be about how they look, or exercise, or eat...but how they feel inside, their own self worth. Where does that come from? How can we develop that in our children????


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## Enchanted

I Notice The Details said:


> BINGO....that above is very well said and exactly how I feel as well. :iagree::iagree:
> 
> The question then is....how does a women become more confident in her own body and exude that thru their personality? My experience has been that the "prettiest" women are definately not the the most confident. The "girl next door" type is usually the most well adjusted and confident with themselves.
> 
> I also knew 3 women in college that were very much overweight. Their personalities were SO attractive, sexy, and confident. They were the most relaxed and fun to be around....I always wondered how they developed that "extra" amount of self confidence...it must not all be about how they look, or exercise, or eat...but how they feel inside, their own self worth. Where does that come from? How can we develop that in our children????


I'm trying to figure out how to develop that type of confidence in myself.


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## I Notice The Details

Enchanted said:


> I'm trying to figure out how to develop that type of confidence in myself.


I know that for myself, when I look better as a result of exercise and diet, I feel better about myself. That is what pushes me to workout. It still amazes me when I see others who have tremendous self confidence...I want more of that...and I REALLY want more of that for my wife and son.


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## I Notice The Details

Mavash. said:


> ..it's never too late. I might not could have rocked a bikini or miniskirt when I was 20 but I can now.


That is an awesome attitude to have! Good for you!


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## Emerald

I Notice The Details said:


> BINGO....that above is very well said and exactly how I feel as well. :iagree::iagree:
> 
> The question then is....how does a women become more confident in her own body and exude that thru their personality? My experience has been that the "prettiest" women are definately not the the most confident. The "girl next door" type is usually the most well adjusted and confident with themselves.
> 
> I also knew 3 women in college that were very much overweight. Their personalities were SO attractive, sexy, and confident. They were the most relaxed and fun to be around....I always wondered how they developed that "extra" amount of self confidence...it must not all be about how they look, or exercise, or eat...but how they feel inside, their own self worth. Where does that come from? How can we develop that in our children????


I know plenty of overweight single women with sparkling personalities that always have boyfriends. 

Looks will get you the first date; personality will get you the second.

The way children develop confidence is through accomplishments not by telling them how pretty/handsome they are.

My 2 daughters are both gorgeous. People telling them that did not give them good self-esteem but boy did they light up when they won a swimming race, got an A on their report card or played a round of golf in the 80's.


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## Emerald

Zanne said:


> Good point, Emerald.
> 
> I'm curious if girls who play sports in high school or college have fewer issues with self-esteem.


Probably.

Girls who do well in school, sports, anything extra-curricular that doesn't focus on how they look probably have better self-esteem.

We raised 2 daughters & kept them very busy - less time for them to ruminate about their looks & weight.

One daughter was very "popular" & the other not so much. The less popular one has better self-esteem as a young adult. Interesting.


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## Coffee Amore

CharlieParker said:


> Haven't followed this thread for a bit but I think this fits.
> 
> A Hollywood gossip show came on the TV and the talk was of the Alabama's QB's model girlfriend (23) and the perhaps inappropriate comments made by the announcer (Brent Musburger has always been creepy).
> 
> I told Mrs P I saw and heard it live during the game last night. And that I found the QB's mom to be way more attractive than the much younger girlfriend. It made her smile and she something like "you get it, we rule". A comment about how she likes what she sees in the mirror followed.


Was it really that inappropriate? I saw a clip of it on MSN, but unless it was edited to remove something really offensive, I didn't hear anything shocking.


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## CharlieParker

Coffee Amore said:


> Was it really that inappropriate? I saw a clip of it on MSN, but unless it was edited to remove something really offensive, I didn't hear anything shocking.


Inappropriate or shocking, probably not, I think he ment well. Strange and a creepy, yes.

At times (like now, I turned a semi-round number, 45, since that post), even as guy, I can relate to the OP. Aging weighs heavily on me, Mrs P is 6 years older than I am. But then again she was 20% older than me when we got married, that's down to 10%, that and over the weekend she rocked my world like I don't think she ever has before.


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## Mavash.

Emerald said:


> The way children develop confidence is through accomplishments not by telling them how pretty/handsome they are.
> 
> My 2 daughters are both gorgeous. People telling them that did not give them good self-esteem but boy did they light up when they won a swimming race, got an A on their report card or played a round of golf in the 80's.


Same here. I have two gorgeous girls. My youngest is always being told she should be a model. Doesn't phase her self esteem one bit but by gosh she held her head high for WEEKS recently because she was able to read chapter books on her own (she's 7).

My 10 year old thinks she's just IT and it has nothing to do with her looks. She talks about how smart she is, how funny she is or how good she is at making friends. Those are things she values in herself not looks.


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## Emerald

Mavash. said:


> Same here. I have two gorgeous girls. My youngest is always being told she should be a model. Doesn't phase her self esteem one bit but by gosh she held her head high for WEEKS recently because she was able to read chapter books on her own (she's 7).
> 
> My 10 year old thinks she's just IT and it has nothing to do with her looks. She talks about how smart she is, how funny she is or how good she is at making friends. Those are things she values in herself not looks.


You are a wonderful Mother Mavash. 

I am saddened by all the reality shows about girls & women that focus on looks. The Toddler & Tiara Moms are ridiculous! I have watched it & feel so bad for those babies all made up to look like hookers.


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## Mavash.

Emerald said:


> You are a wonderful Mother Mavash.
> 
> I am saddened by all the reality shows about girls & women that focus on looks. The Toddler & Tiara Moms are ridiculous! I have watched it & feel so bad for those babies all made up to look like hookers.


Thanks and I totally agree that capitalizing on your child's looks is wrong. I would never do that. Yes I think they are beautiful but as we've read in this thread I believe it's important for them to find value in other things besides looks. Their looks are just a bonus not the main event. KWIM?


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## Enchanted

Emerald said:


> You are a wonderful Mother Mavash.
> 
> I am saddened by all the reality shows about girls & women that focus on looks. The Toddler & Tiara Moms are ridiculous! I have watched it & feel so bad for those babies all made up to look like hookers.


That show borders on child pornography.


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