# A guy friend on Snapchat...



## lessthennone

Yesterday, I was doing something in the kitchen and I heard my wife's phone ping. It was a different sound then her normal text, so I looked. It was from a guy she knows. I had met him at a concert and thought it seemed like my wife was flirting with him. I didn't think much of it after that. Yesterday I saw this message. The message didn't have much context, so I asked my wife and she said she asked him if he was going to the bar. He wasn't so they dropped it. Normally, my wife goes to the bar with her friends who are friendly with him. So I know she sees him there. I asked her if she went with him to the bar last week, and she said no. But then she said he was at the bar, but with his (probably)girlfriend. 

So I asked how long she was snapchatting with him. She said she got the first message on Halloween. A few days after seeing her at the bar where they apparently didn't interact much. She said she had a couple message back and forth. Basically about going to the bar. Also, it's usually our friend who she goes to the bar with. This time, she asked this other guy. 

So a few questions... 
Is it odd that this guy randomly added her to send her a Halloween picture considering my wife claimed she didn't tell him she was on snapchat or anything. 

Is Snapchat inappropriate in general?

I asked my wife if she went to the bar with him the other night. She said no. But after prodding, she said he was there with his girlfriend. She said she thought I was asking if they went together. Is this being evasive?

I mostly trust my wife, but when I sawe my wife flirting with this guy at the concert, I literally asked myself "Should I worry about this guy?".


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## Girl_power

I don’t like that your wife isn’t being completely honest with you. And why does she even want him as a friend in Snapchat? If it were me, I would be afraid that I was sending the wrong signal to him which can potentially open up a can of worms . However she clearly doesn’t care About send wrong signals or “flirting” with the positivity of something. To me, she doesn’t have good boundaries.


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## minimalME

Personally, I would have no tolerance for this sort of behavior. Either be married or be single.

Your discomfort is legitimate, and to me, you're well within your rights to put a stop to it.

When people get married, they sacrifice/forfeit certain freedoms. Defining those boundaries greatly depends on one's worldview, so voicing and enforcing what you believe and value is completely on you.


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## lessthennone

There was one other odd thing... I asked how he contacted her on Snapchat. She said he sent a group snap. After thinking about it a bit, I asked how group snaps worked. Then she said he sent it to all of them individually. So the story changed slightly. I don't know if she was being evasive, or just thinking about it. It just felt odd. 

But, I don't know how Snapchat works. Would he have to seek her out? Would she be suggested as a friend for snapchatting with his friends? 

Do it seem odd that after not mentioning snapchat with this guy, he found her and sent her a random Halloween message?


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## Andy1001

lessthennone said:


> There was one other odd thing... I asked how he contacted her on Snapchat. She said he sent a group snap. After thinking about it a bit, I asked how group snaps worked. Then she said he sent it to all of them individually. So the story changed slightly. I don't know if she was being evasive, or just thinking about it. It just felt odd.
> 
> But, I don't know how Snapchat works. Would he have to seek her out? Would she be suggested as a friend for snapchatting with his friends?
> 
> Do it seem odd that after not mentioning snapchat with this guy, he found her and sent her a random Halloween message?


Your wife is lying by omission and you need to stop *****footing around and make it clear you won’t tolerate her going on “dates” with other men.


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## minimalME

lessthennone said:


> Do it seem odd that after not mentioning snapchat with this guy, he found her and sent her a random Halloween message?


I think you're getting caught up in a lot of irrelevant details that waste mental energy - and are contributing to the deterioration of your marriage.

Do you mind if your wife has male friends? That's the bottom line.


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## lessthennone

minimalME said:


> I think you're getting caught up in a lot of irrelevant details that waste mental energy - and are contributing to the deterioration of your marriage.
> 
> Do you mind if your wife has male friends? That's the bottom line.


Well, I didn't mind her going to the bar with our married friends. I kind of knew this guy could be at the bar. But after seeing the snapchat and the slightly changing story, I'm not comfortable with it. The fact that he sent her a friend request is suspect to me. I wouldn't snapchat a woman I met at a bar. It doen't seem appropriate.


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## minimalME

lessthennone said:


> Well, I didn't mind her going to the bar with our married friends. I kind of knew this guy could be at the bar. But after seeing the snapchat and the slightly changing story,* I'm not comfortable with it.* The fact that he sent her a friend request is suspect to me. I wouldn't snapchat a woman I met at a bar. *It doen't seem appropriate*.


Then that's all that matters.


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## happyhusband0005

lessthennone said:


> There was one other odd thing... I asked how he contacted her on Snapchat. She said he sent a group snap. After thinking about it a bit, I asked how group snaps worked. Then she said he sent it to all of them individually. So the story changed slightly. I don't know if she was being evasive, or just thinking about it. It just felt odd.
> 
> But, I don't know how Snapchat works. Would he have to seek her out? Would she be suggested as a friend for snapchatting with his friends?
> 
> Do it seem odd that after not mentioning snapchat with this guy, he found her and sent her a random Halloween message?


Yes he could be friends with someone else on snap and he could have found her that way. 
@lessthennone Sounds like you don't know this guy well so best to be cautious with him. 

There is a new guy in our town, he's a good guy, the teaching pro at our country club. He started coming to the Friday night drinks and snacks at the local spot and the ladies all jumped all over him because he's single and they're trying to set him up with some girls they all know. It's pretty funny to watch because he doesn't want to be setup, he's just looking to hookup with as many girls as possible, so if they set any friends up with him it won't end well. The guys all realize this but the women seem total oblivious to this fact. For us the husbands we just get advice on our swings and live vicariously through his tales of late night hookups with college girls. He's much younger than all of us. 

If I were you I would probably get to know the guy and gauge his intentions. He might be a good guy who wouldn't hook up with a married woman or he might be trying to stack the bar with possible targets. 

The one thing that worries people about snap chat is the messages self destruct after they've been read I believe.


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## personofinterest

I don't really understand why anyone who has completely finished puberty or is of legal drinking age would even want snapshot. The only people I know who have Snapchat are teenagers or parents who like to monitor their teenagers on Snapchat lol.

At any rate, something about your wife seems very fishy to me. I just don't buy all of this that she is sagging.


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## Girl_power

happyhusband0005 said:


> The one thing that worries people about snap chat is the messages self destruct after they've been read I believe.




Exactly!!!! It’s the perfect platform to do naughty things and not get caught because no evidence is left. 
The fact that it’s Snapchat and not Facebook or instagram is what worries me.


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## Andy1001

lessthennone said:


> Well, I didn't mind her going to the bar with our married friends. I kind of knew this guy could be at the bar. But after seeing the snapchat and the slightly changing story, I'm not comfortable with it. The fact that he sent her a friend request is suspect to me. I wouldn't snapchat a woman I met at a bar. It doen't seem appropriate.


Why can’t you accompany your wife on her nights out?


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## lessthennone

If it was on Facebook or via text, I'd have a lot less of an issue with it. I'm still wondering what caused him to friend request her on Snapchat. Snapchat itself has a reputation. 

All I know about this guy is he likes to party hardcore and has been arrested frequently. I don't normally distrust my wife, but when she goes out and gets very drunk and comes home very late, I'm concerned that she's too drunk to make good decisions.


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## lessthennone

Andy1001 said:


> Why can’t you accompany your wife on her nights out?


I'm usually watching the kids. These were girls nights out. It wasn't until I saw this message that I realized my wife was asking him if he was going to the bar. Now, it's possible my wife really wanted to go out, and just needed anyone to go with. But normally, she'd ask our mutual male friend, who's wife goes on the girls nights out.

After this, though,. I'm gonna try and be with her whenever she's around him. It jsut tough because my wife will stay out late and I always have to work.


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## jorgegene

I'm joining the chorus here.

I think your wife is secretly flirting with this guy.


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## Rubix Cubed

@lessthennone

Tip of the iceberg, brutha. She's being sketchy for a reason. If you look into it I'd bet there is no "girlfriend,probably" that's why she added the probably. He was there with her, that's why the evasiveness of answering your questions about it. This is textbook cheater stuff. You need to do some investigating and afterward you will also need her to stop communicating and hanging out with this guy, he's bad news. Why is the mother of your children going out and getting plastered with guys who get arrested often for partying? That's not what married women or mothers do.

e.t.a.


> But normally, she'd ask our mutual male friend, whose wife goes on the girls nights out.


 Girls night out doesn't usually include guys going WITH them. The guys are usually for after they get to the bar. Yours apparently includes multiple guys.


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## EunuchMonk

Considering all the details you have posted so far, OP, this does not look good from any angle. It seems like an affair is either going on or it is brewing. I, personally, think it is still at the brewing stage. You have to put your foot down and stop it. But ask yourself, if she will not listen to you, what are you willing to do? If she continues down a road you know will most likely lead to an affair, are you willing to walk or not? I think people should think ahead in these situations. I know it sounds too calculating and heartless but people get heartless in affairs. No matter what you have done for them, they rewrite history and make you out to be the devil on earth. You don't want to be caught unprepared. I hate divorce but when some people make up their minds to stray there is nothing you can do (except be a doormat while they "discover" themselves).


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## lessthennone

I don't believe anything has happened, but I also thin I may have caught something in the early brewing stages. Can I ask the question this way...

If my wife received a random snapchat from a guy she sees at a bar on occasion, should she suspicious of his intentions? 

The fact that she didn't seem to this it's suspicious is odd to me. I reverse the situation, and I'd think that if a girl I met at a bar snapchat friend requested me, it would be suspicious. That said, I'm not very social.


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## Andy1001

lessthennone said:


> I don't believe anything has happened, but I also thin I may have caught something in the early brewing stages. Can I ask the question this way...
> 
> If my wife received a random snapchat from a guy she sees at a bar on occasion, should she suspicious of his intentions?
> 
> The fact that she didn't seem to this it's suspicious is odd to me. I reverse the situation, and I'd think that if a girl I met at a bar snapchat friend requested me, it would be suspicious. That said, I'm not very social.


In my younger,single days I got loads of texts from women asking was I around and did I feel like going for a drink.
EVERY TIME I went I had sex with the woman in question.
Does she see this bad boy as someone she can tame?


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## Rubix Cubed

lessthennone said:


> Can I ask the question this way...
> 
> If my wife received a random snapchat from a guy she sees at a bar on occasion, should she suspicious of his intentions?
> 
> The fact that she didn't seem to this it's suspicious is odd to me. I reverse the situation, and I'd think that if a girl I met at a bar snapchat friend requested me, it would be suspicious. That said, I'm not very social.


 YES she should.


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## SunCMars

personofinterest said:


> I don't really understand why anyone who has completely finished puberty or is of legal drinking age would even want snapshot. The only people I know who have Snapchat are teenagers or parents who like to monitor their teenagers on Snapchat lol.
> 
> At any rate, something about your wife seems very fishy to me. I just don't buy all of this that she is sagging.


Sagging?

I wouldn't know, none of my business.


Her words are sagging, dragging along lower boundaries.
Not quite reaching pay dirt, but approaching it.

She is definitely evasive. She knows better.
She should be avoiding this guy at every turn.

Why?

Because you are questioning her actions and behavior. 
It is obvious you are concerned and worried.

A good mate would put your mind at ease, not add, stir in doubt into your morning coffee.

She is not doing this.
Nope.

Keep quiet, put your detective hat on.

I would start by using a VAR, a voice activated recorder in her car and in any place where she makes calls from home.

Check your phone bills, see who she is calling.

Sounds like she has not gotten to calling him yet.

She is likely calling her girlfriends, telling them things worth knowing about.


It seem like this situation is in the early stages, some here may tell you to get tough with her and tell her to cease and desist.

Not bad advice.

I suggest let this kite fly. See how far and high she lets it go.

See if she is truly trustworthy. Presently, she is not.

Let her stretch her neck. I did not say hang.

I hope she does not stick her neck in the noose.
If she does, she does so willingly.

A good thing to know, this, these facts.

You likely have many years left on Earth, may they be spent with a worthy soul.




[THRD]-


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## SunCMars

I went to the TAM library, went to the sewing Thread section.

I found your's, many of your older Threads.

Most point to the same problem. She has no interest in sex, she is LD.

..........................................................................................................

This present one points to a place. 
And at this time it is reaping, she likely is getting ready to sow oats.

She has overcome her depression some, enough to reach some manic shelf.

She is getting horny.

You have two children, a girl six, a boy seven.

They are now 'more' out of her hair.
She can breathe a bit more.

She is a SAHM.

Going to bars and drinking is loosening depressions grip on her passions and on her fury fold.

I believe she is taking a turn from being willingly, mostly sexless to dreaming, being with another man.
As others have pounded in your head, you have been too passive, you should have long ago taken her to task, taken her to ground.

Just flat out made love to her, no questions asked just taken and enjoyed.
*Not by using force*, rather by using your wedding ring, its ringing chime, its tone to claim what is yours.

Done so to silence your critics on TAM. 
Done so to pin her to her rare willing words, to pin her to your marital bed.

Ach! If she resisted your actions, then stop by all means. 

This I suspect, her being a SAHM, she is very much enjoying getting out on her own, going to bars, enjoying the camaraderie, enjoying the attention of strange men.
Enjoy looking at other men when you are not around, saying to herself, 'what if".

"I wonder how it would feel with that guy". "I like his smile", "I like that guys buns", I like that guys legs.

"That bearded guys face, I bet it would tickle, it would feel strangely good rubbing intimately on me".

Alcohol releases inhibitions, puts depression asleep for a little bit, for a delicious moment. Yes.

She is awakening from her sexless slumber. 
I believe she is.

Oh, my. :|

Yes.




[THRD]


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## Faithful Wife

lessthennone said:


> I don't believe anything has happened, but I also thin I may have caught something in the early brewing stages. Can I ask the question this way...
> 
> If my wife received a random snapchat from a guy she sees at a bar on occasion, should she suspicious of his intentions?
> 
> The fact that she didn't seem to this it's suspicious is odd to me. I reverse the situation, and I'd think that if a girl I met at a bar snapchat friend requested me, it would be suspicious. That said, I'm not very social.


I think your gut is telling you this guy is an imminent threat and you need to quickly follow your intuition. I also think you are circumventing something that hasn’t happened yet but will soon if it goes unchallenged.

Forget all the philosophical questions about whether this was right or wrong and just know that your gut is right, and this is an imminent threat. Her actions along the way don’t need any further scrutiny.

Also, if she is regularly going to the bar, then it will either be this guy or some other guy who comes along soon.

I recommend that you get very real with her about all of it. You saw her flirting, you realize now that hanging out in bars is not something conducive to healthy marriages, and set new boundaries for both of you. Of course she needs to agree to this and maybe she won’t at first. But if you are strong about your position, she will at least know that she can’t steam roll you.

My tendency to flirt and have fun girls nights out is something that my husband had to reign in at one time. He made it very clear in the beginning of our relationship that he wouldn’t tolerate me acting like I was single. He also made clear in a very sexy way that I was his and his alone, and he wouldn’t tolerate any other wolves sniffing around me (mate guarding). So I knew immediately that if I were getting strange texts from randos, it wouldn’t fly. 

Far from feeling stifled, I felt cherished and wanted. I felt like his treasure. It all made me want to be supremely monogamous to him, and I never ever flirted or did anything that would trigger his gut. I wanted to be good, and I was. Even though my nature as a single person is definitely not to be all locked down like that. I’m the opposite - a free spirit. 

He also is a free spirit and a reformed bad boy. But during our relationship he never exhibited behavior like going to bars or single lifestyle things or texts from randos coming to his phone. He looked only at me for his fun time girl, and I was happily right there.

Our sex life was fantastic, and I had all the fun, flirty bad girl times I wanted, with my husband, alone at home. 

So my motivation to be a free spirit was also free within our relationship. I could expand into those fun, partying good times right along with him. We learned that you don’t have to hang out in public drinking houses to have a blast on a Friday night. Therefore I never missed it.

How is your sex life at home? In order to make the bar seem uninteresting, you’re going to have to make your married life more interesting. If it’s not worth it to her though....you should truly recognize she is putting your marriage at risk and evaluate your options.


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## Blondilocks

lessthennone said:


> I'm usually watching the kids. These were girls nights out. It wasn't until I saw this message that I realized my wife was asking him if he was going to the bar. Now, it's possible my wife really wanted to go out, and just needed anyone to go with. But normally, she'd ask our mutual male friend, who's wife goes on the girls nights out.
> 
> After this, though,. I'm gonna try and be with her whenever she's around him. It jsut tough because my wife will stay out late and I always have to work.


Geez, you need to set some ground rules for your marriage. One, if you go to the bar with her, she leaves when you leave. If you have to get up and go to work in the morning, the least she can do is go home with you. Two, she doesn't get to ask other men to meet her at a bar - WTH? Three, she doesn't get to party while you stay home with the kids. GNOs are for girls and not husbands and random guys or else they wouldn't be called GNOs.

She needs a job.


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## jlg07

You need to confront this straight on. NO MORE SNAPCHAT (I don't care what her excuses are for this - "everybody else has it", "that's how the group communicates", etc.) -- she is not single and the "disappearing" aspect of the chats is really not appropriate for a married person.

NO more asking guys to bars on GNO (seriously , WTF). If 'there's nobody else to ask", then WHY DOESN'T SHE ASK YOU!!!! You are married for God's sake.

I really think you need to enforce some boundaries. She may call you controlling, she may say that you can't tell her who to be friends with, etc.. She is correct about the latter -- BUT YOU can control what your reactions are to her friends and her pulling this crap. You need to make sure she understands the consequences of pulling this -- and let her know she has used up the one-time warning about this. YOU have to be very resolute in you defining what would happen if this continues (and back it up).

Tell her that because of this, you don't trust "GNO's" because they aren't and if she goes out, it needs to be WITH you when you can go (and she leaves when you do...).
Married folks SHOULD NOT be acting like this.


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## Not

Faithful Wife said:


> I think your gut is telling you this guy is an imminent threat and you need to quickly follow your intuition. I also think you are circumventing something that hasn’t happened yet but will soon if it goes unchallenged.
> 
> Forget all the philosophical questions about whether this was right or wrong and just know that your gut is right, and this is an imminent threat. Her actions along the way don’t need any further scrutiny.
> 
> Also, if she is regularly going to the bar, then it will either be this guy or some other guy who comes along soon.
> 
> I recommend that you get very real with her about all of it. You saw her flirting, you realize now that hanging out in bars is not something conducive to healthy marriages, and set new boundaries for both of you. Of course she needs to agree to this and maybe she won’t at first. But if you are strong about your position, she will at least know that she can’t steam roll you.
> 
> My tendency to flirt and have fun girls nights out is something that my husband had to reign in at one time. He made it very clear in the beginning of our relationship that he wouldn’t tolerate me acting like I was single. He also made clear in a very sexy way that I was his and his alone, and he wouldn’t tolerate any other wolves sniffing around me (mate guarding). So I knew immediately that if I were getting strange texts from randos, it wouldn’t fly.
> 
> Far from feeling stifled, I felt cherished and wanted. I felt like his treasure. It all made me want to be supremely monogamous to him, and I never ever flirted or did anything that would trigger his gut. I wanted to be good, and I was. Even though my nature as a single person is definitely not to be all locked down like that. I’m the opposite - a free spirit.
> 
> He also is a free spirit and a reformed bad boy. But during our relationship he never exhibited behavior like going to bars or single lifestyle things or texts from randos coming to his phone. He looked only at me for his fun time girl, and I was happily right there.
> 
> Our sex life was fantastic, and I had all the fun, flirty bad girl times I wanted, with my husband, alone at home.
> 
> So my motivation to be a free spirit was also free within our relationship. I could expand into those fun, partying good times right along with him. We learned that you don’t have to hang out in public drinking houses to have a blast on a Friday night. Therefore I never missed it.
> 
> How is your sex life at home? In order to make the bar seem uninteresting, you’re going to have to make your married life more interesting. If it’s not worth it to her though....you should truly recognize she is putting your marriage at risk and evaluate your options.


This! I wanted to say the same thing but Faithful Wife beat me to it and did so much more eloquently than I could have. Listen to your gut Lessthan, your internal alarm system is firing off for a reason.


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## happy as a clam

Why the heck are you stuck at home babysitting while she’s running around to bars for these “girls nights”?

How often does this occur?

Do you get to go out to bars with your buddies and young single women while she stays home and babysits?


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## Adelais

.

(double post)


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## Adelais

If it is really a girls night out, why is a guy invited, or a part of it? It is a Girls Night Out!

I am sorry to say that I think you are being lied to. She is at least flirting with him, at most _________(fill in the blank.)

Either way, it spells danger for your marriage.

When you establish boundries with her, she is going to say you are trying to "control" her. Tell her that you are not trying to control her, you are protecting yourself and the marriage. If she doesn't care about you or the marriage, she can do whatever she wishes, and then she can face the consequences....which you establish. You live your life, you make your own rules.


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## BluesPower

Brother, let me ask you some questions? 

How long have you been married? 

What is your sex life like? Has it changed in ANY way over the last year?

Why do you not GO OUT WITH YOUR WIFE and her friends? Are you anti social? Are you a home body? 

How often does she go out with her "friends"?

Are they Her friends, your friends, and friends you have made since you were married? 

Is she protective of her phone? Is it locked and do you know the password? 

Take the time to answer these questions and I will tell you what is going on....


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## She'sStillGotIt

Her little bar forays don't sound like "Girls Night Out" trips at all.

They sound more like, "Going out to the bar to hang out with guys while my clueless husband sits at home with the kids and is none the wiser" nights.


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## Oldtimer

You trust your wife, but when you saw her flirting at the concert, you start to wonder, then the Snapchat comes up. Really? She still goes on the GNO’s?

I have to agree with she’s still got it’s last post. You are being played well. 

Wake up! And I mean that as I give you a gentle shove in the direction of getting out of infidelity.

You may be at a point where you are able to nip it in the bud so to speak.

Question, what time does she get home from her forays? And what shape is she in, does she wear party clothes? How does she act the next day? Do these nights out happen just on weekends or is it also during the work week?

Others bring excellent points to ponder . I do hope your actions are quick and decisive regardless of your wish to R or D.


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## lessthennone

BluesPower said:


> Brother, let me ask you some questions?
> 
> How long have you been married?
> 
> What is your sex life like? Has it changed in ANY way over the last year?
> 
> Why do you not GO OUT WITH YOUR WIFE and her friends? Are you anti social? Are you a home body?
> 
> How often does she go out with her "friends"?
> 
> Are they Her friends, your friends, and friends you have made since you were married?
> 
> Is she protective of her phone? Is it locked and do you know the password?
> 
> Take the time to answer these questions and I will tell you what is going on....


Married 12 years.

Sex life has always been lacking. We’ve discussed it. Shes just not very sexual. Nothing really changed.

I am antisocial and a homebody. Thays why I never really had an issue with these girls nights. Shes very social and feels like shes always home.

Goes out with friends about once a week. Her girlfriend, who is parent of kids classmate. I’ve hung out with them, but never spoke to them individually, texted, etc...so basically her friends.

This guy she met about 2 months ago. Sees him at this bar when she goes.

She’s not protective of her phone, but last week she went to the bar with her friend. We carpool, so in the morning she got texts from her about the carpool. I responded. On my way. Last night I looked and the whole exchange is missing. No texts from her. I asked my wife, and she said she needed to delete stuff for space to take haloween pocs. She may not know that mms dont take up a lot of space. But I do. 

I trust my wife. I want to trust my wife. I dont think anything happened. But there are a whole bunch of coincidences.


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## BluesPower

lessthennone said:


> Married 12 years.
> 
> Sex life has always been lacking. We’ve discussed it. Shes just not very sexual. Nothing really changed.
> 
> I am antisocial and a homebody. Thays why I never really had an issue with these girls nights. Shes very social and feels like shes always home.
> 
> Goes out with friends about once a week. Her girlfriend, who is parent of kids classmate. I’ve hung out with them, but never spoke to them individually, texted, etc...so basically her friends.
> 
> This guy she met about 2 months ago. Sees him at this bar when she goes.
> 
> She’s not protective of her phone, but last week she went to the bar with her friend. We carpool, so in the morning she got texts from her about the carpool. I responded. On my way. Last night I looked and the whole exchange is missing. No texts from her. I asked my wife, and she said she needed to delete stuff for space to take haloween pocs. She may not know that mms dont take up a lot of space. But I do.
> 
> I trust my wife. I want to trust my wife. I dont think anything happened. But there are a whole bunch of coincidences.


Ok, done deal. You wife is cheating on you, has been cheating on you, for a while.

Your antisocial, homebody behavior, you accepting low sex\ no sex marriage like some type of weak puppy. You working to support everyone. 

You are toast. Don't you wonder why the messages were deleted? Ever think about that. 

Honestly, how can you be so stupid? 

Do you care that your wife is sexual with other men, and not you. Or is that once an month Piece enough to keep you fat and happy? 

You are the typical clueless weak husband whose wife is out banging everyone but him. Hell, she even flirts with her dates in front of you....

Does that bother you?


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## sokillme

Dude what you describe is a recipe for a cheating wife. It's the same story over and over. Her energy is spent acting like she is single. Also and I hate to say this because I know it will be painful to you but not wanting to have sex sometimes means not wanting to have sex with you. She may be one of these people who only find sex exciting when it's new. Maybe she married you because you are safe. It happens particularly with women who like to go out with friends to bars like they are single. What better way to have a ready made babysitter and someone who will financially support that lifestyle. Honestly solitary bar hopping spouses are not good marriage material. 

Your wife is at least in the beginning of an affair, it's time to change your strategy because you are not protecting yourself at all. Everyone wants to trust their spouse but not all spouses are worthy of that trust. 

You have two choices bury your head which will prolong the pain or be forceful about the situation which is going to hurt a lot in the short term. Thing is this stuff is like cancer there is a very good chance it will kill your marriage. If you do nothing you will slowly suffer as it get worse and worse and eventually die. If you take action you will feel a ton of pain at first but you may save your marriage and you will almost certainly save yourself. 

Your choice.


----------



## Nucking Futs

Spend the money on a PI to watch her at the next GNO. Have them get video of any inappropriate behavior. If they come back with a clean report, drop this whole thing for a couple of months then have the PI watch her again. Make sure you don't change your behavior until you either get the dirt or get the second clean report.

When the PI gives you the dirt, don't confront immediately, come here for advice first. There are ways to handle a confrontation that are more likely to get you what you want, whether it's reconciliation or a good divorce.


----------



## lessthennone

OK. I understand the consensus. I still do trust my wife and despite the coincidences, I'm inclined to believe her. She does deny it, and didn't blow up at me when I prodded. I think she's getting frustrated with me asking the questions. But, she seems willing to answer. IDK what to believe, but I do think I'd find more evidence if something was happening. I know where and how to look. 

I do think this will be a wake up call for me. Maybe I should be accompanying her to the bar and putting down ground rules. She did unfriend him on snapchat. She acknowledges that he might not have had the best intentions.


----------



## BluesPower

lessthennone said:


> OK. I understand the consensus. I still do trust my wife and despite the coincidences, I'm inclined to believe her. She does deny it, and didn't blow up at me when I prodded. I think she's getting frustrated with me asking the questions. But, she seems willing to answer. IDK what to believe, but I do think I'd find more evidence if something was happening. I know where and how to look.
> 
> I do think this will be a wake up call for me. Maybe I should be accompanying her to the bar and putting down ground rules. She did unfriend him on snapchat. She acknowledges that he might not have had the best intentions.


I am sorry to be so blunt and harsh. But you are being a fool. 

Are you going to all of a sudden become an attractive, sexy, alpha male that will knock her socks off. Really? 

Are you content with a cheating wife and no sex. At least if you were doing the hot wife thing you might get some sex, but not like this. 

Does it bother you that you are being completely taken advantage of? That you are the baby sitter while she is out getting laid? 

I mean really man, is that all you have got?????


----------



## lessthennone

BluesPower said:


> I am sorry to be so blunt and harsh. But you are being a fool.
> 
> Are you going to all of a sudden become an attractive, sexy, alpha male that will knock her socks off. Really?
> 
> Are you content with a cheating wife and no sex. At least if you were doing the hot wife thing you might get some sex, but not like this.
> 
> Does it bother you that you are being completely taken advantage of? That you are the baby sitter while she is out getting laid?
> 
> I mean really man, is that all you have got?????


For the last 18 months, I've been pretty much addicted to MMO gaming. If I was too lazy to go out with her, or watching the kids was a convenient way to be able to stay home and relax; then I'd prefer to do that. I still take care of the kids, but I'm certain that my gaming has made the situation worse. 

That concert... The one where I thought she was flirting with him... Even though I saw signs that I thought were worrying, I still decided to go home afterwards when the group went to the bar. I dropped my wife off at the bar, and they all met up. So maybe I deserve some of the blame. I was invited, but I was tired. 

Now, our relationship issues didn't start with my mmo gaming. She has never been overly sexual. I started hanging out with her on the last day of high school. We spent the next 10 years together as friends. Despite me having a crush on her that whole time, we didn't begin dating for 7 years. We did spend every day of those 7 years together as friends. Spending 7 years together (age 18-25) and never kissed. Until we did. This makes me think there is some veracity to the idea that she doesn't see/prioritize sexuality in relationships. She's LD I'm extreme HD. She may have some issues with sexual abuse. I think as the time passed, this aspect became a bigger issue in our relationship. 

For me, I think the fact that I cannot fulfill her social needs makes me feel inadequate. Maybe I'm just suspicious due to those inadequacies. Going to the bar for me is pretty boring. You just wait for drinks to be put in front of you while sitting in an uncomfortable chair. But, she enjoys it. We used to go to the bar a lot when we were younger. When we got a house, I was basically done with the bar. She wasn't. 

I've had a bunch of people tell me I'm being ignorant, and I can appreciate that. I've known my wife for a while and I'm still inclined to believe her.


----------



## Rubix Cubed

lessthennone said:


> I've had a bunch of people tell me I'm being ignorant, and I can appreciate that. I've known my wife for a while and I'm still inclined to believe her.


 Every BS initially believed their cheating wife. You're the rule, not the exception. 
Even if she's not cheating her boundaries suck in a huge way. It's a slippery slope, and you doing nothing will only make that slide faster.
I think 7 years w/o even a kiss pretty much solidifies the fact you are co-dependent, and she knows she can do whatever she wants and you'll never leave. If that's your choice you need to come up with coping mechanisms to deal with sharing your wife with other men. I have no idea what they would be, because I can't even fathom living like that, but someone else may be able to help you with that.


----------



## dadstartingover

This is so textbook...

*READ: "My Wife Wouldn't Do That"*


----------



## sokillme

lessthennone said:


> For the last 18 months, I've been pretty much addicted to MMO gaming. If I was too lazy to go out with her, or watching the kids was a convenient way to be able to stay home and relax; then I'd prefer to do that. I still take care of the kids, but I'm certain that my gaming has made the situation worse.
> 
> That concert... The one where I thought she was flirting with him... Even though I saw signs that I thought were worrying, I still decided to go home afterwards when the group went to the bar. I dropped my wife off at the bar, and they all met up. So maybe I deserve some of the blame. I was invited, but I was tired.
> 
> Now, our relationship issues didn't start with my mmo gaming. She has never been overly sexual. I started hanging out with her on the last day of high school. We spent the next 10 years together as friends. Despite me having a crush on her that whole time, we didn't begin dating for 7 years. We did spend every day of those 7 years together as friends. Spending 7 years together (age 18-25) and never kissed. Until we did. This makes me think there is some veracity to the idea that she doesn't see/prioritize sexuality in relationships. She's LD I'm extreme HD. She may have some issues with sexual abuse. I think as the time passed, this aspect became a bigger issue in our relationship.
> 
> For me, I think the fact that I cannot fulfill her social needs makes me feel inadequate. Maybe I'm just suspicious due to those inadequacies. Going to the bar for me is pretty boring. You just wait for drinks to be put in front of you while sitting in an uncomfortable chair. But, she enjoys it. We used to go to the bar a lot when we were younger. When we got a house, I was basically done with the bar. She wasn't.
> 
> I've had a bunch of people tell me I'm being ignorant, and I can appreciate that. I've known my wife for a while and I'm still inclined to believe her.


I don't even know were to start with this. For the last 18 months, I've been pretty much addicted to MMO gaming. Sigh... You're not helping yourself.


----------



## cashcratebob

lessthennone said:


> Yesterday, I was doing something in the kitchen and I heard my wife's phone ping. It was a different sound then her normal text, so I looked. It was from a guy she knows. I had met him at a concert and thought it seemed like my wife was flirting with him. I didn't think much of it after that. Yesterday I saw this message. The message didn't have much context, so I asked my wife and she said she asked him if he was going to the bar. He wasn't so they dropped it. Normally, my wife goes to the bar with her friends who are friendly with him. So I know she sees him there. I asked her if she went with him to the bar last week, and she said no. But then she said he was at the bar, but with his (probably)girlfriend.
> 
> So I asked how long she was snapchatting with him. She said she got the first message on Halloween. A few days after seeing her at the bar where they apparently didn't interact much. She said she had a couple message back and forth. Basically about going to the bar. Also, it's usually our friend who she goes to the bar with. This time, she asked this other guy.
> 
> So a few questions...
> Is it odd that this guy randomly added her to send her a Halloween picture considering my wife claimed she didn't tell him she was on snapchat or anything.
> *
> Is Snapchat inappropriate in general?*
> 
> I asked my wife if she went to the bar with him the other night. She said no. But after prodding, she said he was there with his girlfriend. She said she thought I was asking if they went together. Is this being evasive?
> 
> I mostly trust my wife, but when I sawe my wife flirting with this guy at the concert, I literally asked myself "Should I worry about this guy?".


Snapchat is not appropriate for married couples. It facilitates hiding. This guy is fishing, your wife is biting.


----------



## DjDjani

No married wife should be going to the bars,staying realy late and being realy drunk. That is just wrong. Set the new rules.


----------



## Chaparral

Snapchat is known as the cheaters website. He knows that, your wife knows that and now you know it.

Married women don’t go out drinking without their husbands. ALL the couples I’ s know where the wife goes out on girls night are divorced except for one couple.

How does your wife get around when drunk?


----------



## personofinterest

DjDjani said:


> No married wife should be going to the bars,staying realy late and being realy drunk. That is just wrong. Set the new rules.


Absolutely. No wife OR husband needs to do this.


----------



## 3Xnocharm

lessthennone said:


> Married 12 years.
> 
> Sex life has always been lacking. We’ve discussed it. Shes just not very sexual. Nothing really changed.
> 
> *I am antisocial and a homebody. Thays why I never really had an issue with these girls nights. Shes very social and feels like shes always home.
> 
> Goes out with friends about once a week. Her girlfriend, who is parent of kids classmate. I’ve hung out with them, but never spoke to them individually, texted, etc...so basically her friends.
> 
> This guy she met about 2 months ago. Sees him at this bar when she goes. *
> 
> She’s not protective of her phone, but last week she went to the bar with her friend. We carpool, so in the morning she got texts from her about the carpool. I responded. On my way. Last night I looked and the whole exchange is missing. No texts from her. I asked my wife, and she said she needed to delete stuff for space to take haloween pocs. She may not know that mms dont take up a lot of space. But I do.
> 
> I trust my wife. I want to trust my wife. I dont think anything happened. But there are a whole bunch of coincidences.


I think the fact that you realize your own less than social behavior and haven't had an issue with your wife going out is positive. It wouldn't be fair for her to be forced to stay home just because you don't like being social. 

*However. *

Her going out once a week for a GNO is really excessive for a married woman. I am going under the assumption that they always go to the same bar every week. When you go that often, you get to know the other "regulars" at the bar, which can be fun and increases the appeal to continue going. (my bf is a musician, so I have spent way more time at bars than most people) Its almost inevitable that there will be some guy come along like this one. He sees her there every week WITHOUT her other half, so really in his mind you dont even exist, so he starts to escalate the friendship starting with adding her on Snapchat. It seems you have caught this at the early stage, and suggest you take an immediate, strong stance on this, because she isn't shutting him down. Even if she doesn't have intentions of actually being with this guy, she is walking a slippery edge that could eventually take her down that way. 

Snapchat is very much a cheater's app, sad to say.


----------



## BluesPower

Guys, did everyone read the post from OP a while back? 

He knows she is cheating, she has cheated on him before, he just does not want to make it stop. 

Hell, she left him for another man, and he still took her back... 

I am not sure that we can help him, I am not sure what to try and get him to wake up...


----------



## Steelman

I wouldn't worry- yet. But I'd keep an eye out. I think the guy might be getting mixed signals. And it probably wouldn't take too much more for me to be pissed off if my wife was texting a single guy to meet up at a bar.


----------



## EllisRedding

personofinterest said:


> I don't really understand why anyone who has completely finished puberty or is of legal drinking age would even want snapshot. The only people I know who have Snapchat are teenagers or parents who like to monitor their teenagers on Snapchat lol.
> 
> At any rate, something about your wife seems very fishy to me. I just don't buy all of this that she is sagging.


This ^ . One of the main selling points of Snapchat was that conversations / snaps disappear after a certain time. This appealed to the younger generation, but as you can see, it would also be appealing to adults who are taking part in "questionable" practices. Maybe she is using the filters on Snapchat to help with her sagging lol

Anyway, based on what @BluesPower just posted, if this is the same W that cheated on the OP, left him for another man, and then came back (and the OP is still letting her have ladies night out at the bars), then this is just a lost cause not worth anyone expending more energy over... 

Also, the OP said he "mostly" trusted his W. You either trust your SO or you don't. If you "mostly" trust, let's be honest, it is the same as saying you don't trust them


----------



## BigDigg

BluesPower said:


> Guys, did everyone read the post from OP a while back?
> 
> He knows she is cheating, she has cheated on him before, he just does not want to make it stop.
> 
> Hell, she left him for another man, and he still took her back...
> 
> I am not sure that we can help him, I am not sure what to try and get him to wake up...


Wow. Nice catch. I didn't check and was about to respond. Not trying to pile on the OP but his marriage just seems to have a ton of issues (for years) and he very much seems to be in a powerless position where his wife gives zero respect. Not at all surprised she's acting blatantly single. She knows there's literally no risk here. 

Side rant - there have been a few threads like this lately - men in really bad spots that seem completely blind to it all and focusing on all the wrong things looking for quick fix ideas or people here to reassure them and tell them everything is OK. Men unwilling to respect themselves and accept their reality. It's really sad but I'm tired of being the cranky ******* screaming that their house is on fire.


----------



## 3Xnocharm

BluesPower said:


> Guys, did everyone read the post from OP a while back?
> 
> He knows she is cheating, she has cheated on him before, he just does not want to make it stop.
> 
> Hell, she left him for another man, and he still took her back...
> 
> I am not sure that we can help him, I am not sure what to try and get him to wake up...


This made me go back through his thread history. (I didn't see this described above, but I stay out of the SIM subforum when I am at work, so maybe it was in those posts) I have commented on his posts in the past. His wife is an entitled, lazy, spoiled princess, and he would do very well to divorce her ass.


----------



## BluesPower

3Xnocharm said:


> This made me go back through his thread history. (I didn't see this described above, but I stay out of the SIM subforum when I am at work, so maybe it was in those posts) I have commented on his posts in the past. His wife is an entitled, lazy, spoiled princess, and he would do very well to divorce her ass.


Listen, what everyone does not seem to get, or missed, is that this guy is a typical weak man that does not mind if his wife is screwing other guys. 

Whatever his issues are, he does not have the self worth, to believe that 1) his wife is cheating on him 2) admit to himself that he does not care, and 3) just live with the fact that he will never have a happy marriage, and 4) he will not improve himself. 

While it is sad, who are we to say that this is not best for him. He wants his pretend family, he wants to pretend that he has a marriage, and he wants to pretend that she loves him. 

While I cannot understand, it would seem that he is at least content with what is going on. 

He cannot understand that if he changed his thinking and started to understand what being a man is all about, he could do better and actually be happy. 

Who are we to argue?????


----------



## lessthennone

BluesPower said:


> Guys, did everyone read the post from OP a while back?
> 
> He knows she is cheating, she has cheated on him before, he just does not want to make it stop.
> 
> Hell, she left him for another man, and he still took her back...
> 
> I am not sure that we can help him, I am not sure what to try and get him to wake up...


I dont think that was me. You must have me confused with someone else. As far as I know she has never cheated. She has never left me.


----------



## MAJDEATH

I have also heard from younger coworkers that snapchat is used by folks that are looking to hookup without evidence of their planning.


----------



## BruceBanner

I'd DNA test the children if I were you @lessthennone


----------



## BluesPower

lessthennone said:


> I dont think that was me. You must have me confused with someone else. As far as I know she has never cheated. She has never left me.


OK, my bad. She is cheating now though, sorry but she is. 

I am sure you don't believe it, the odds are like 99.99% that she is...


----------



## re16

Simple solution here, hire a PI for the evening when she goes out to the bar. Should be real easy to find out if its appropriate or not.

If you don't have the cash, find a friend that she doesn't know that can do the recon for you.

My opinion, this is way over the line and OP is in of a major wake up call.

I would assume she's hooked up with this guy and all the bar regulars know it.


----------



## TRy

lessthennone said:


> Last night I looked and the whole exchange is missing. No texts from her. I asked my wife, and she said she needed to delete stuff for space to take haloween pocs. She may not know that mms dont take up a lot of space. But I do.


 You know that her claim that she deleted the texts because "she said she needed to delete stuff for space to take" halloween pictures is total bull and so does she. One photo takes up as much room as many thousands of texts. To confirm this lie check to see how much space sht has on her phone. If she still has a lot, then you have proof right there that she is deleting texts to hide them from you.

What you know for a fact is that you have a wife that does not want sex with you, that flirts (they are attracted to each other) with a single guy that she met at a concert, that she has become Snapchat friends with, and that she Snapchats to let him know when she will be going to a bar without you to see if he wants to meet up with her there. That is at least early dating. Dating is spending time with a member of the opposite sex that gives each the opportunity to see if they are compatible, look forward to spending time together, and allows them to see if they develop feelings for each other. She can try to spin it all that she wants, but married women do not do this with other men, only single women or cheaters do this. 

Put your foot down now and put a stop to her bar trolling girls night out. Married women's girls night out are suppose to include zero men. That is the deal when you are married. To prepare you for what she will say when you bring this up, in one form or another she will tell you that you are "jealous" and "controlling", and that you must trust her. This is a standard cheater response, that is right out of the mythical cheaters script. Warning, time is not on your side. Every day your ability to put a stop this gets weaker, as her bond to him gets stronger. You must take strong action now and be willing to back it up. Tell her that if she want to continue to see other men, she cannot do this as your wife. Tell her that you love her, but that you are willing to a divorce attorney right now if this does not stop. You must say this and mean it. Have a place to stay at on her girls night out nights so that she cannot have you babysit while seeing setting up seeing other men at bars. Remember: How does a cheater say “screw you? They say “trust me”.


----------



## MAJDEATH

TRy said:


> You know that her claim that she deleted the texts because "she said she needed to delete stuff for space to take" halloween pictures is total bull and so does she. One photo takes up as much room as many thousands of texts. To confirm this lie check to see how much space sht has on her phone. If she still has a lot, then you have proof right there that she is deleting texts to hide them from you.
> 
> What you know for a fact is that you have a wife that does not want sex with you, that flirts (they are attracted to each other) with a single guy that she met at a concert, that she has become Snapchat friends with, and that she Snapchats to let him know when she will be going to a bar without you to see if he wants to meet up with her there. That is at least early dating. Dating is spending time with a member of the opposite sex that gives each the opportunity to see if they are compatible, look forward to spending time together, and allows them to see if they develop feelings for each other. She can try to spin it all that she wants, but married women do not do this with other men, only single women or cheaters do this.
> 
> Put your foot down now and put a stop to her bar trolling girls night out. Married women's girls night out are suppose to include zero men. That is the deal when you are married. To prepare you for what she will say when you bring this up, in one form or another she will tell you that you are "jealous" and "controlling", and that you must trust her. This is a standard cheater response, that is right out of the mythical cheaters script. Warning, time is not on your side. Every day your ability to put a stop this gets weaker, as her bond to him gets stronger. You must take strong action now and be willing to back it up. Tell her that if she want to continue to see other men, she cannot do this as your wife. Tell her that you love her, but that you are willing to a divorce attorney right now if this does not stop. You must say this and mean it. Have a place to stay at on her girls night out nights so that she cannot have you babysit while seeing setting up seeing other men at bars. Remember: How does a cheater say “screw you? They say “trust me”.


Agreed. I have seen this first hand. First she was staying at work a little later each night, you know, doing prep work for the next day with a co-worker. Then leaving and going to "other locations" (bars, restaurants, movies) to do more show prep. Finally it was going back to his place "to get something to eat", lol. Cut it off early, even if it causes a scene or makes you look like an ass.


----------



## skerzoid

lessthennone said:


> I'm usually watching the kids. These were girls nights out. It wasn't until I saw this message that I realized my wife was asking him if he was going to the bar. Now, it's possible my wife really wanted to go out, and just needed anyone to go with. But normally, she'd ask our mutual male friend, who's wife goes on the girls nights out.
> 
> After this, though,. I'm gonna try and be with her whenever she's around him. It jsut tough because my wife will stay out late and I always have to work.


Babysitters are cheaper than lawyers. 

You let your wife go out and get drunk regularly? Do you how many times we have seen that turn into an affair on this site and destroy a marriage? Hundreds if not thousands of times. Put your foot down and say it's time to go home. 

Don't be a doormat.


----------



## lessthennone

This morning, for about the 10th time, I reviewed all of her social media accts. I looked for deleted messages. I looked for timelines. Likes, etc.. found nothing suspicious.

I reviewd all the apps downloaded on her phone. Nothing suspicious.

I used a data recover app to recover her deleted messages. I was not able to recover the rest of the msg thread with her friend, but I can say that I had seen it previously. If there was anything suspicous in there, i probably would’ve noticed it. 

I also saw the message sugggesting to free up mms space. Even though her phone had space. It looks like she did delete mms’s for space. 

A few months ago, when i noticed snapchat on her phone, i had looked at it. There were no unknown people on there. This guy appears to have been added when she said. 

Her story is adding up. Yes. Deleting her friends mag was a coincidence. But she deleted it after i read it. ****, I even used her phone to txt this friend about picking up the kids. 

My wife likes to drink. She likes bars. Her family was the same way. Theyre Irish. Odd to me, but i guess normal to her.

Oh... and before she asked this guy if he was going to the bar, she asked her girl friend (who said no) and my best friend (who id trust with my life). I think she just wanted to go out with anyone. But not alone.


----------



## 3Xnocharm

lessthennone said:


> .
> 
> Oh... and before she asked this guy if he was going to the bar, she asked her girl friend (who said no) and my best friend (who id trust with my life). I think she just wanted to go out with anyone. But not alone.


And not with her husband.


----------



## sa58

Sounds like she has you fooled really good.
Do you honestly believe her stories. She wants to
cheat or all ready is. Flirting with another guy,
why does she need to do this ? She wants to !!

Deleting messages to free up space !! Sure !!
I believe her, noway. 3Xnocharm is 100 % correct.
" And not with her husband " Can't go out with you
but can go with other men? The only question
that remains to be answered is how long are you 
going to tolerate her lies and stuff ? I would not,
but sounds like you are swallowing it all. 

Tell her to stay home or keep going !! 
Away from you that is !!


----------



## Chaparral

Regular girls night out is invariably a disaster sooner or later. Drinking guys have no problem seducing drunk married women. We’ve see many instances here. Your number one job in life is protecting your wife and family. You’re failing miserably. How do you think you compare to all the cool, handsome guys she sees through alcohol inspired horney eyes every time she gets a buzz? 

I’m afraid your common sense has taken a hike. 

Look, read MARRIED MAN SEX LIFE PRIMER! Download at amazon. You don’t get this thing between a man and a woman.


----------



## TRy

lessthennone said:


> A few months ago, when i noticed snapchat on her phone, i had looked at it. There were no unknown people on there. This guy appears to have been added when she said.


 Why does it matter when she became Snapchat friends with the single other man (OM) that she was flirting with at the concert? The fact is she is using the top auto delete cheaters texting app to communicate with this OM. Heck you do not even use Snapchat, so she did not get it to communicate with you. 



lessthennone said:


> Oh... and before she asked this guy if he was going to the bar, she asked her girl friend (who said no) and my best friend (who id trust with my life). I think she just wanted to go out with anyone. But not alone.


 What you just said is the she was inviting this single OM that she has flirted with to meet up with her alone at a bar when she knew that none of her other friends would be there. This is called a date. She might as well have just swiped right on the OM's Tinder profile, as it would lead to the same result of getting together for a date at a bar.

"A fool and his wife are soon parted".


----------



## MovingForward

Even if it is 'innocent' currently they may both want this to develop, I personally if in a relationship would not put myself in a position which if the shoe was on the other foot i would be uncomfortable with or take part in behavior where i could end up in a compromising position with someone. Random messaging and meetings at a bar will lead to both of these.


----------



## BluesPower

MovingForward said:


> Even if it is 'innocent' currently they may both want this to develop, I personally if in a relationship would not put myself in a position which if the shoe was on the other foot i would be uncomfortable with or take part in behavior where i could end up in a compromising position with someone. Random messaging and meetings at a bar will lead to both of these.


Actually, if you were honest @MovingForward, you would not stand for any of this, nor would any other strong man. 

I think you have learned enough from your last experience to know that the papers would be filed ASAP when this behavior was exhibited.... As would I...


----------



## MovingForward

BluesPower said:


> Actually, if you were honest @MovingForward, you would not stand for any of this, nor would any other strong man.
> 
> I think you have learned enough from your last experience to know that the papers would be filed ASAP when this behavior was exhibited.... As would I...


Yes correct. Clear boundaries need to be in place and if you let people abuse your boundaries you lose respect and eventually your wife LOL


----------



## AliceA

lessthennone said:


> This morning, for about the 10th time, I reviewed all of her social media accts. I looked for deleted messages. I looked for timelines. Likes, etc.. found nothing suspicious.
> 
> I reviewd all the apps downloaded on her phone. Nothing suspicious.
> 
> I used a data recover app to recover her deleted messages. I was not able to recover the rest of the msg thread with her friend, but I can say that I had seen it previously. If there was anything suspicous in there, i probably would’ve noticed it.
> 
> I also saw the message sugggesting to free up mms space. Even though her phone had space. It looks like she did delete mms’s for space.
> 
> A few months ago, when i noticed snapchat on her phone, i had looked at it. There were no unknown people on there. This guy appears to have been added when she said.
> 
> Her story is adding up. Yes. Deleting her friends mag was a coincidence. But she deleted it after i read it. ****, I even used her phone to txt this friend about picking up the kids.
> 
> My wife likes to drink. She likes bars. Her family was the same way. Theyre Irish. Odd to me, but i guess normal to her.
> 
> Oh... and before she asked this guy if he was going to the bar, she asked her girl friend (who said no) and my best friend (who id trust with my life). I think she just wanted to go out with anyone. But not alone.


I'd be curious to know if she would be fine with this if the situation were reversed. You were asking a woman you'd met once or twice at a bar if she were going to the bar because no one else would go out with you that night, while she stayed home looking after the kids.


----------



## [email protected]

Oh boy, I wish I had $100 for every not-very-sexual W who has had a really highly charged affair. Anyway, a drinking wife (Irish or not) can loose her inhibitions in a hurry, especially when she's getting kudos from some guy. Does W have a burner phone?


----------



## lessthennone

Ok. Over the last few days, I’ve been driving her crazy with all my questions. But, I also have been watching her social media. I would’ve found evidence of something. I looked at everything. “Ask questions you know the answer to, and see her response”

If I didnt post this on here and get all the responses, I’d be a lot more trusting. You are all a cynical bunch. Probably for a reason. 

Needless to say, I was waiting for her to ask to go out with her friend last night. She didn’t. 

Amidst all my worrying, I also told her that our bad boundries are a product of our social mismatch. She likes bars and people and staying out late. I hate it, and just keep thinkinng about having to wake up for work. Plus, bars are never fun for the driver. But I’m going to make an effort to go out woth her more. 

I will say this... this should be in bold...
I trust her. I’m not really concerned about her cheating. I am concerned about her getting drunk, not being able to drive, and then having a guy take advantage.


----------



## personofinterest

Bless your heart. I wish you well.


----------



## lucy999

Sir, you married a party girl. When you are married, a GNO should equate to having dinner at Olive Garden and having a glass of wine then home by 9 to tuck the kids in bed and kiss them goodnight.

Good luck.


----------



## Yeswecan

lessthennone said:


> Ok. Over the last few days, I’ve been driving her crazy with all my questions. But, I also have been watching her social media. I would’ve found evidence of something. I looked at everything. “Ask questions you know the answer to, and see her response”
> 
> If I didnt post this on here and get all the responses, I’d be a lot more trusting. You are all a cynical bunch. Probably for a reason.
> 
> Needless to say, I was waiting for her to ask to go out with her friend last night. She didn’t.
> 
> Amidst all my worrying, I also told her that our bad boundries are a product of our social mismatch. She likes bars and people and staying out late. I hate it, and just keep thinkinng about having to wake up for work. Plus, bars are never fun for the driver. But I’m going to make an effort to go out woth her more.
> 
> I will say this... this should be in bold...
> I trust her. I’m not really concerned about her cheating. I am concerned about her getting drunk, not being able to drive,* and then having a guy take advantage.*


Well sir, if this is something to worry about....the boundary of getting drunk to the point of not know what is going on, there is more to your problems. You are now playing dad/chaperone to your wife. Does that make sense to you?


----------



## Yeswecan

lucy999 said:


> Sir, you married a party girl. When you are married, a GNO should equate to having dinner at Olive Garden and having a glass of wine then home by 9 to tuck the kids in bed and kiss them goodnight.
> 
> Good luck.


Pretty much.....


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## VermiciousKnid

Do you guys have an open marriage? I ask because this guy is working on dating your wife and she doesn't seem to be opposed to it.


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## MAJDEATH

Before my W and I separated (and she was spending a lot of time away from home at night), I decided to get a baby sitter and follow her a couple of times. 

The first place (and relevant to this thread) was at a bar. I was lucky in that it was a multilevel bldg, so I found a dark corner in the upper level where I could observe her and the group of guys/girls she was with down below at a big table by the dance floor. There was lots of laughing, drinking, shouting, high-fives and dancing. She kept pulling reluctant guys from the group out on the dance floor and grinding on their midsection. She would run to the dj booth (he was also a friend of hers) and get a certain song played so she could grind on the guys - she was bent over at the waist with her hands almost on the floor, backing into the front of them. Other guys not in their group noticed this behavior and asked her to dance with them also. She obliged every one of them and had a table full of free drinks. Based on her behavior, she definitely looked like a single woman out to have fun. It was very enlightening to see her behavior when she thought I wasn't around. She had no problem with acting single around hundreds of other people.

I observed her at 2 other locations but this sealed the deal. I filed 2 days later and we were legally separated pending D.


----------



## MAJDEATH

OP one thing you could do is call this guy and "ask" him to stay away from your W. While the true issue needs to be addressed with you and your W, at least he won't be sniffing around. And if it gets back to her that you threatened him off and she is angry, that also tells you where you stand.


----------



## Rubix Cubed

MAJDEATH said:


> OP one thing you could do is call this guy and "ask" him to stay away from your W. While the true issue needs to be addressed with you and your W, at least he won't be sniffing around. And if it gets back to her that you threatened him off and she is angry, that also tells you where you stand.


 Only do this if you plan on doing NOTHING else, which seems to be the case. Also only do this if you can put the fear of God into the OM. It's best purpose is to gauge your wife's reaction. See where her loyalties lie.


slight t/j @MAJDEATH What happened to this? Aren't you still with her? 


> I observed her at 2 other locations but this sealed the deal. I filed 2 days later and we were legally separated pending D.


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## lessthennone

We don't have an open marriage. 

I'm sure a lot of you think I'm sticking my head in the sand in regards to this guy. I honestly believe my wife. I'm not saying our relationship is perfect. I've pushed her to go out without me, of course assuming we were both going to be monogamous. The other thing that was lost in this thread was that she asked this guy if he and our mutual friend were going to the bar. But, she did acknowledge that if the situation was reversed, she would be suspicious. If I'm wrong, I'll find out at some point and I'll come right back to this forum and type in bold caps that you all were right. For now, I have to trust her.

That said, as I'm talking with her, I'm bringing up some issues. My social anxiety, past resentments, etc... As I was telling her that my concern wasn't so much with trusting her, as it was trusting whoever may be around her when she's drunk. Here's my nightmare... "She's at the bar. She has a bit too much to drink. Some nice guy offers to drive her home, but maybe he's not so nice. Or maybe he's too nice. She's too trusting. 

So, my wife's response is that she usually goes out with friends and wouldn't let herself get into a situation where that could happen. So I mentioned a concert she went to this summer. She went solo, but arranged to sell some tickets to a couple she met online. They met up and hung out during the concert, and they offered her a ride home; but she decided to stay longer. Fortunately, she saw with some other friends of ours and wasn't truly solo. But, to me this is about as vulnerable a situation I could imaging her in. She ended up getting an uber to come home. 

OK. In a vacuum, I'm just paranoid. But, my wife was sexually abused in high school by a boyfriend. Basically, he tried to rape her in his bedroom. Here's where its slightly odd. She had lost her virginity to him a few weeks earlier. So, she went into his bedroom innocently, and wasn't expecting anything, but he was aggressive and she ended up screaming until someone came and broke it up. Now, this was long before we were dating. But, it came up a lot when were had been discussing intimacy issues. She also believes she was sexually abused as a child, but doesn't quite remember the details. Was a family member or confidant. 

Listen, I'm here for help and advice. I may ignore some of it. But, I'll read it all. I appreciate all of the help.


----------



## red oak

lessthennone;19720859
That concert... The one where I thought she was flirting with him... Even though I saw signs that I thought were worrying said:


> Seriously?!?!?
> Really man. Wake up!


----------



## MAJDEATH

Rubix Cubed said:


> MAJDEATH said:
> 
> 
> 
> OP one thing you could do is call this guy and "ask" him to stay away from your W. While the true issue needs to be addressed with you and your W, at least he won't be sniffing around. And if it gets back to her that you threatened him off and she is angry, that also tells you where you stand.
> 
> 
> 
> Only do this if you plan on doing NOTHING else, which seems to be the case. Also only do this if you can put the fear of God into the OM. It's best purpose is to gauge your wife's reaction. See where her loyalties lie.
> 
> 
> slight t/j @MAJDEATH What happened to this? Aren't you still with her?
> 
> 
> 
> I observed her at 2 other locations but this sealed the deal. I filed 2 days later and we were legally separated pending D.
> 
> Click to expand...
Click to expand...

It's a long and complicated story, but after some significant changes and a life altering event, we are now together. But her behavior at that time told me all I needed to know about what her intent was (to not be married), contrary to what she told me. That is the relevant part to OPs thread. Something is driving his wife's behavior - be it attention, tired of being at home with the kids, substance abuse, etc. My W is also Irish and her nature is very social. But she understands that reasonable boundaries are necessary, and she has learned from me not to be so trusting of others men's intentions.


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## BarbedFenceRider

Okay....I read "confirmation bias". I also read "beta male" homebody. 

Addicted to MMO gaming? Really? You need to grow up. Sure, I'm older and I play madden from time to time but THAT?! Your a father and a husband. Man up.

Your wife is cheating, I agree with everyone here. You can say you trust her, but it means nothing. She despises you. She wouldn't go to GNO's with large libidoed males present if she "cherished" you. You are simping. Big time.

Worse case, she realized you are inadequate and she leaves you for one of her "bulls". Sorry but this thread is soooo weak. Best case, she keeps you around for paying the bills and auto babysitter. But love life....Forget about it!

WAKE UP!


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## Rubix Cubed

personofinterest said:


> Bless your heart. I wish you well.


 Said in a deep southern accent and a pitiful shake of the head. :smthumbup:


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## Ragnar Ragnasson

OP,

I saw where you stated she was LD, you are HD.

Based on that; if you're HD, why isn't your sex life with W more important to you? 

If W is LD, is she working on that with you? 

And pls heed all the advice. There's no normalcy in the lack of boundaries being displayed. 

Best,


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## red oak

Question for you; do any of the friends she hangs with on the GNO dislike you?
Have any recently divorced or became single?


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## Rubix Cubed

So as a recap I underlined the blatant red flags for you and answered your questions. You seemed to have started off right with your gut instinct and now have convinced yourself to ignore it. Bad move.



lessthennone said:


> Yesterday, I was doing something in the kitchen and I heard my wife's phone ping. It was a different sound then her normal text, so I looked. It was from a guy she knows. I had met him at a concert and thought it seemed like my wife was flirting with him. I didn't think much of it after that. Yesterday I saw this message. The message didn't have much context, so I asked my wife and she said she asked him if he was going to the bar. He wasn't so they dropped it. Normally, my wife goes to the bar with her friends who are friendly with him. So I know she sees him there. I asked her if she went with him to the bar last week, and she said no. But then she said he was at the bar, but with his (probably)girlfriend.
> 
> So I asked how long she was snapchatting with him. She said she got the first message on Halloween. A few days after seeing her at the bar where they apparently didn't interact much. She said she had a couple message back and forth. Basically about going to the bar. Also, it's usually our friend who she goes to the bar with. This time, she asked this other guy.
> 
> So a few questions...
> Is it odd that this guy randomly added her to send her a Halloween picture considering my wife claimed she didn't tell him she was on snapchat or anything.  *Yes, absolutely. How could he know if she didn't tell him and how would he know her user name? *
> 
> Is Snapchat inappropriate in general?* YES*
> 
> I asked my wife if she went to the bar with him the other night. She said no. But after prodding, she said he was there with his girlfriend. She said she thought I was asking if they went together. Is this being evasive? *YES, Very evasive wordplay.*
> 
> I mostly trust my wife, but when I saw my wife flirting with this guy at the concert, I literally asked myself "Should I worry about this guy?".*YES and you know it.*




Fixed it for you, and I would call realistic what you call cynical.


> If I didn't post this on here and get all the responses, I’d be a lot more ̶t̶r̶u̶s̶t̶i̶n̶g̶ *clueless *. You are all a cynical bunch. Probably for a reason.


----------



## lessthennone

Can I just laugh about all of this! Lol. Spent 2 hours on the phone with family. My mom and her sister. Think I’m having a nervous breakdown, but its probably withdrawl from gaming. 

Lol. Still trusting the wife as she deletes her messages with her friend. Of course she sent me a select screenshot when I ran out of the house after seeing the deleted mms messages. 

Theyre probably ridiculing me because I suggested my wife’s having an affair. But **** it. Im asocial. I dont care what they think. 

I’m gonna go to therapy to get it all sorted out. I think the fact that I’m not gaming had some negative effect on my brain. Like it messed up my dopamine or something. Gaming was a huge rush and escape from an imperfect relationship. 

Ok. Now I’m gonna do something i dont do often. Drink till im drunk.

And no, I found no additional evidence of her cheating. The deleted messages are circumstantial. I’m looking for something I dont belive exists. Lots of people went crazy trying to turn lead into gold. Should’ve huffed mercury. Would go faster.


----------



## lessthennone

Because I drank... and i never drink. I sent this to her girlfriend...

Hi Donna, 

(Please enjoy a few drinks and laugh about this for me)

It’s Adam. I’m sorry for all of this. You probably think I’m crazy. Maybe I am. I trust Kerry. I’ve always trusted her. But there were a confluence of coincidences that made me suspicious. 

She said the snap was sent in a group. Ok. That seems innoccuous. But it turned out to be a misstatement, and that made me suspicious. So I asked her if she was at the bar with him in the days before. She said no. I asked her 10 different ways. Eventually she said he was there with his “probably” girlfriend. 

Worse then all that, i posted this stuff on an internet forum. And they proceeded to tell me that my wife is absolutely 100% cheating. Not only that, they made predictions as to what she would say. And told me to look and see if she took a selfie that morning. She did. In snapchat. First selfie shes taken in snapchat in a year.

-Please toast to my mental health or the newly elected Democratic congress. Whatever makes you feel better. 

Response was you cant trust internet forums. 

Only one thing to do now. Drink a lot more.


----------



## Tasorundo

Where is your wife while you are drinking yourself into a stupor?


----------



## BruceBanner

lessthennone said:


> Because I drank... and i never drink. I sent this to her girlfriend...
> 
> Hi Donna,
> 
> (Please enjoy a few drinks and laugh about this for me)
> 
> It’s Adam. I’m sorry for all of this. You probably think I’m crazy. Maybe I am. I trust Kerry. I’ve always trusted her. But there were a confluence of coincidences that made me suspicious.
> 
> She said the snap was sent in a group. Ok. That seems innoccuous. But it turned out to be a misstatement, and that made me suspicious. So I asked her if she was at the bar with him in the days before. She said no. I asked her 10 different ways. Eventually she said he was there with his “probably” girlfriend.
> 
> Worse then all that, i posted this stuff on an internet forum. And they proceeded to tell me that my wife is absolutely 100% cheating. Not only that, they made predictions as to what she would say. And told me to look and see if she took a selfie that morning. She did. In snapchat. First selfie shes taken in snapchat in a year.
> 
> -Please toast to my mental health or the newly elected Democratic congress. Whatever makes you feel better.
> 
> Response was you cant trust internet forums.
> 
> Only one thing to do now. Drink a lot more.


Why are you revealing your playing cards? Keep them in the dark and unaware. You're giving them a chance to cover their own asses.



> Response was you cant trust internet forums.


You can't trust a wife or husband that uses Snapchat either, now can you? How much do you guys wanna bet that this other guy doesn't actually have a girlfriend and that's something @lessthennone's wife made up to keep him from being suspicious?


----------



## lessthennone

BruceBanner said:


> lessthennone said:
> 
> 
> 
> Because I drank... and i never drink. I sent this to her girlfriend...
> 
> Hi Donna,
> 
> (Please enjoy a few drinks and laugh about this for me)
> 
> It’s Adam. I’m sorry for all of this. You probably think I’m crazy. Maybe I am. I trust Kerry. I’ve always trusted her. But there were a confluence of coincidences that made me suspicious.
> 
> She said the snap was sent in a group. Ok. That seems innoccuous. But it turned out to be a misstatement, and that made me suspicious. So I asked her if she was at the bar with him in the days before. She said no. I asked her 10 different ways. Eventually she said he was there with his “probably” girlfriend.
> 
> Worse then all that, i posted this stuff on an internet forum. And they proceeded to tell me that my wife is absolutely 100% cheating. Not only that, they made predictions as to what she would say. And told me to look and see if she took a selfie that morning. She did. In snapchat. First selfie shes taken in snapchat in a year.
> 
> -Please toast to my mental health or the newly elected Democratic congress. Whatever makes you feel better.
> 
> Response was you cant trust internet forums.
> 
> Only one thing to do now. Drink a lot more.
> 
> 
> 
> Why are you revealing your playing cards? Keep them in the dark and unaware. You're giving them a chance to cover their own asses.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Response was you cant trust internet forums.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You can't trust a wife or husband that uses Snapchat either, now can you? How much do you guys wanna bet that this other guy doesn't actually have a girlfriend and that's something @lessthennone's wife made up to keep him from being suspicious?
Click to expand...

We gonna gamble and drink all on the same night? Nice! Feels like the rush id get from gaming again! 

My wife is here in the house. I’m being a disrespectful *******. Better then being a whiny *****. Or is it? Hmmmm.

Do we have odds on that bet, or is it even numbers?


----------



## lessthennone

Tasorundo said:


> Where is your wife while you are drinking yourself into a stupor?


Shes in the other room, prob best she stays away. Im a bit salty atm.


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## Marc878

Whelp that episide sure didn't get you much. You seem to be losing control here pal.

Better wake up. You just spilled your guts to all her friends.

Not gonna work out well no matter what.

Better wake and sober up.


----------



## lessthennone

Marc878 said:


> Whelp that episide sure didn't get you much. You seem to be losing control here pal.
> 
> Better wake up. You just spilled your guts to all her friends.
> 
> Not gonna work out well no matter what.
> 
> Better wake and sober up.


Does it really matter? If she cheated, she cheated, if her friends are willing to falsify messages to cover for her ass, and she’s somehow able to cover up her cell phone metadata so I cant see anything suspicious, then I’m ****ed anyways. I know what to look for and where to look. Theres nothing there.

At this point, i literally hope they’re laughing at my expense. Was gonna call the bar to send them drinks as the text arrived. But thought it would be a little wierd. 

Lol. Get this... Nov 2nd. The day she got the snapchat from this dude, she took a selfie of herself on snapchat. Circumstantial, right?


----------



## lessthennone

Oh. BTW... Told her my screenname and this forum. Told her to log on and defend herself. Can you guys take care of it for me? Lol.

Jk. Hopefully she’ll read it. She got through one thread and went to sleep. Maybe its not that important to her. 

Or maybe I’m giving her an impossible mission.

It’s quite possible I’m having some sort of psychotic episode troggered by quitting gaming. Occums razor. Is that a simpler explanation.


----------



## Marc878

lessthennone said:


> Oh. BTW... Told her my screenname and this forum. Told her to log on and defend herself. Can you guys take care of it for me? Lol.
> 
> Jk. Hopefully she’ll read it. She got through one thread and went to sleep. Maybe its not that important to her.
> 
> Or maybe I’m giving her an impossible mission.
> 
> It’s quite possible I’m having some sort of psychotic episode troggered by *quitting gaming*. Occums razor. Is that a simpler explanation.


that's a good start.


----------



## AliceA

I feel for you. I told my ex (before we separated) that I was on here as well, and I really regretted it. A safe space to get advice was no longer safe for me. It still isn't, and I'll never be able to open up here again. It sucks.

As for the whole line, "I trust you but I don't trust everyone around you"... I've always felt that was how a person tries to enforce the boundaries they want within their relationship without admitting to the fact that they know those boundaries are required, for a reason that has everything to do with the person they know, not all the people they don't know.

The thing I disagree with everyone about is the fact that you can control your partner and stop them from cheating. If you have a strong relationship, a strong connection, things you do together and have in common, that is how you guard against cheating. Telling your partner not to do this or that and forcing them to assert themselves, looking at their phone, spying on their activities is NOT how you guard against cheating, it's how you find out they're cheating. If they're not, well, you've just acted controlling and paranoid for no current reason (not to say there wouldn't be a reason in the near future).

If you're both escaping your relationship with gaming, drinking and going out to bars, you're not going to fix it by getting drunk and being nasty, or spying and making accusations and drunk texting other people. You might self destruct the relationship though, but maybe that's secretly what you want.


----------



## syhoybenden

lessthennone said:


> -Please toast to my mental health or the newly elected Democratic congress. Whatever makes you feel better.



Well all I can say is .... you really deserve what's coming to you.


----------



## jsmart

lucy999 said:


> Sir, you married a party girl. When you are married, a GNO should equate to having dinner at Olive Garden and having a glass of wine then home by 9 to tuck the kids in bed and kiss them goodnight.
> 
> Good luck.


I totally agree. GNO to go to bars/clubs nearly always eventually ends in adultery. Seen it here, similar boards, and real life. A wife and mother shouldn't be going out drinking and mixing it up with men. 

I would say the same for a husband too but most men who hang with the guys are going fishing/hunting, playing golf, poker night at friends man cave, watching a game/fight at sports bar. All things that usually have no women around. 

OP, I think your wife has most likely hooked up with this guy or they practically playing footsie on their path there but with the amount of time that's gone by, I'd bet this douche has already had your wife several times. 

You're not going to find it on social media because it's probably a FWB situation. They hang, she services him, and then she's back to her boring babysitter husband to play respectable wife and mother.


----------



## Blondilocks

@breeze, petition Elegirl for a new username. She'll be happy to oblige.


----------



## Nucking Futs

lessthennone said:


> Because I drank... and i never drink. I sent this to her girlfriend...
> 
> Hi Donna,
> 
> (Please enjoy a few drinks and laugh about this for me)
> 
> It’s Adam. I’m sorry for all of this. You probably think I’m crazy. Maybe I am. I trust Kerry. I’ve always trusted her. But there were a confluence of coincidences that made me suspicious.
> 
> She said the snap was sent in a group. Ok. That seems innoccuous. But it turned out to be a misstatement, and that made me suspicious. So I asked her if she was at the bar with him in the days before. She said no. I asked her 10 different ways. Eventually she said he was there with his “probably” girlfriend.
> 
> Worse then all that, i posted this stuff on an internet forum. And they proceeded to tell me that my wife is absolutely 100% cheating. Not only that,* they made predictions as to what she would say. And told me to look and see if she took a selfie that morning. She did. In snapchat. First selfie shes taken in snapchat in a year.
> *
> -Please toast to my mental health or the newly elected Democratic congress. Whatever makes you feel better.
> 
> *Response was you cant trust internet forums.
> *
> Only one thing to do now. Drink a lot more.


This wasn't an accurate prediction of what your wife would do. This was experience telling you what a cheating wife would do. In general I would agree that you can't trust internet forums, you always need to verify what you're told. Which you did when you found she did what we told you a cheater would do.

Your wife is cheating. You need to reach down, give your balls a tug, and man the **** up.


----------



## Nucking Futs

Also, STOP DRINKING! You do stupid **** when you're drinking, and you can't afford to be doing stupid **** right now.


----------



## syhoybenden

Stupid is as stupid does.


----------



## Rubix Cubed

Nucking Futs said:


> Also, STOP DRINKING! You do stupid **** when you're drinking, and you can't afford to be doing stupid **** right now.


 And you're proving that in spades.
I really hope you were smarter than to tell your wife about your thread here, where you are laying out all of your suspicions and plans.


----------



## Rubix Cubed

BruceBanner said:


> You can't trust a wife or husband that uses Snapchat either, now can you? *How much do you guys wanna bet that this other guy doesn't actually have a girlfriend and that's something lessthennone's wife made up to keep him from being suspicious?*


 Called that back on post #16. It's an odds-on favorite.


----------



## 3Xnocharm

Even if wifey isnt currently cheating, she is STILL a crappy ass wife, and a pretty crappy mother as well. Has everyone gone through his past threads? Evidently he LIKES having a wife who is lazy, entitled, and doesnt give a damn about him, because he comes here when he is having issues with her, then proceeds to make excuses for her and tell us all how off base we are. I dont get it.


----------



## lucy999

I might've missed it. Does OP's wife have a job?


----------



## 3Xnocharm

lucy999 said:


> I might've missed it. Does OP's wife have a job?


No, unless there has been a new development in that department since he first started posting in 2014.


----------

