# I did bad things and now my marriage is in trouble



## finebyme72 (Jul 12, 2011)

My wife and I have been married for about 9 years and our sex life has never been out of this world good - for either of us. She has body and esteem issues and I have slight anxiety issues (it takes me a little longer than the average guy to climax). She's never been in to much variation or anything out of the ordinary. I'm not into anything crazy either but would like some variation. We never really had a honeymoon phase per se - a few times a week was our max (I think we did have sex almost every day on our honeymoon but that would have been it). The last few years its been pretty slow - a couple times a week max (and over the last few months its been a couple times a month). To some guys that may seem like a lot and two or three times a week is good for me or would be. 

So like many guys I took to masturbating to porn on the computer. Unfortunately I didn't just stick to that and ended up contacting some of the girls I was masturbating to online. I didn't end up meeting any of them or having sex with them but came pretty close on more than one occasion. I know it was wrong and I feel awful for how I've hurt my wife. She is just devastated and I understand that. She originally asked me to leave but capitulated and said I could stay (we have two young boys). Of any sex will be out for a while (even the hurry up and get it over with kind that I've been getting for the last few years) but in addition she wants me to get rid of all the old porn that I had from before (totally fine as I don't look at it and don't want my boys to find it as they get older) and she wants me to stop masturbating to porn at all - essentially she wants me to stop taking care of business all together. Because of how I've hurt her - I'm not the least bit interested in that right now but I'm sure I will eventually and I'm sure that I'll be able to live up to that in time. I just know that if we get back to where she wants to have sex with me, I'm confident she won't be able to keep up and I'll need to take care of it by myself sometimes. 

I am going to counseling (by myself for now as she won't go and refused to go before when we were first married - she has daddy issues she's refused to deal with which have affected our marriage adversely) but would love some advise from the folks here.


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## Cherry (Sep 23, 2009)

If your asking when you can masturbate to online porn again, I would say given the situation you brought on because of it directly, I would say never. If your talking about masturbation in general, I'll let others address that.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## I'mInLoveWithMyHubby (Nov 7, 2011)

If your wife asks you to give up porn, you will do so if you respect her. Especially if your contacting these women. To me, that's cheating. 

Giving up masturbating is a whole another issue. Think about your wife when you masturbate, not other women.

Just giving my opinion. My husband does not look at porn and he would NEVER contact another woman in a sexual way. You need to stop making excuses and justifying your bad behavior. Focus on making your marriage better instead of yourself.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## accept (Dec 1, 2011)

What exactly does your wife want. She wont fill your needs and wont let others fill them. She wants it both ways. I dont mean to say youre right in going to 'others' but she has to take the blame.


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## PHTlump (Jun 2, 2010)

Your wife doesn't want to go to marital counseling because she is afraid to face her role in your marital problems. That's unfortunate, but common.

I suggest you continue to bring up marriage counseling. If she balks, maybe play the role of counselor yourself. Ask her why she thinks the two of you have had these problems. Don't accept an answer of, "We never had any problems until you went online with other people."

As for masturbation, when you feel the need for release, tell your wife. Offer to do it while she watches. If she's up for it, it may be fun. But I suspect she will quickly suggest you go back to doing it in private.


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## finebyme72 (Jul 12, 2011)

Cherry said:


> If your asking when you can masturbate to online porn again, I would say given the situation you brought on because of it directly, I would say never. If your talking about masturbation in general, I'll let others address that.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


You're probably right but I am a visual person. I am going to do my very best because inspite of my actions, I value my marriage and family very much (especially my boys).



accept said:


> What exactly does your wife want. She wont fill your needs and wont let others fill them. She wants it both ways. I dont mean to say youre right in going to 'others' but she has to take the blame.


I did this, not her. In my mind of course I wasn't going to "others" as it stayed to online and a few conversations - nothing emotional - just sexual - but still I understand how that is viewed as cheating by some. I just hope she is willing to fix what she needs to fix so that we can make it work. I can't be told to be a caged dog with no outlet whatsoever - that just won't work long term.



PHTlump said:


> Your wife doesn't want to go to marital counseling because she is afraid to face her role in your marital problems. That's unfortunate, but common.
> 
> I suggest you continue to bring up marriage counseling. If she balks, maybe play the role of counselor yourself. Ask her why she thinks the two of you have had these problems. Don't accept an answer of, "We never had any problems until you went online with other people."
> 
> As for masturbation, when you feel the need for release, tell your wife. Offer to do it while she watches. If she's up for it, it may be fun. But I suspect she will quickly suggest you go back to doing it in private.


Thank you for that - I really like your response. Unfortunately I have a feeling it will be a while before she is the least bit interested in having anything to do with me sexually. She is very hurt by this. And when I made the suggestion one other time about her "inspiring me" while I masturbate, I could tell she wanted nothing to do with it and she told me later that it makes her feel used when I did that. So of course that put an end to that.


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## GreenEyes (Jan 27, 2011)

accept said:


> What exactly does your wife want. She wont fill your needs and wont let others fill them. She wants it both ways. I dont mean to say youre right in going to 'others' but she has to take the blame.


I _know_ you're not saying that it's her fault that he contacted these women sexually over the internet!!??? I don't care what the issue at home is, work it out with your SO or hit the road and find what you're looking for...Speaking as someone whose H was talking with some girl sexually over the internet and the phone, that is pretty offensive of you to say. Of course when he was "found out" he blamed it on this or that, my fault of course(!!), but really who is the one that went outside the marriage???


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## Catherine602 (Oct 14, 2010)

I am going to say it is unreasonable for her to expect you not to masturbate. Can you do that when you are not having any sex? It shows a lack of understanding of male sexuality. I think it is also invasion of your privacy. 

It is your body. You don't own her body or you would be having sex with it.

I am not suggesting that you go against your word but I suggest that you broach this reality with her. How you do that I don't know. I will let wiser people handle that.


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## golfergirl (Dec 8, 2010)

finebyme72 said:


> - but still I understand how that is viewed as cheating by some.


Just curious question. If roles were reversed and your wife did what you did with another man, would you feel cheated on?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## square1 (Oct 31, 2011)

My H had a porn problem that replaced our sex life, it never got to the point where he contacted anyone online but I think if it continued it might have. Unlike your wife I actually wanted more sex and wasn't getting it cause porn was his first choice. I can understand her stance on the porn but not the no masturbating part.

I told my H that I wanted more sex and we started working on that but porn had to go all together. If he still felt the need to masturbate (if I wasn't available for sex or he needed a quick release or whatever) I told him masturbating was fine I didnt have a problem with that as long as he wasnt doing it more times than we were having sex (he was masturbating to porn 4+x a day whereas we were having sex maybe once a week). If he needed visual aids for masturbating i offered to make some videos and take pics for him.

You going outside the marriage to meet those needs was wrong but I also think it is unreasonable to expect you (or any man really) to not masturbate especially if his SO isn't going to help meet his needs.


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## finebyme72 (Jul 12, 2011)

golfergirl said:


> Just curious question. If roles were reversed and your wife did what you did with another man, would you feel cheated on?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Good question - I'm pretty sure that I would feel very cheated on. I would also wonder where I went wrong and why I wasn't good enough. I certainly don't want to make my wife more insecure than she already is (and I know she struggles with insecurity issues as well).



square1 said:


> My H had a porn problem that replaced our sex life, it never got to the point where he contacted anyone online but I think if it continued it might have. Unlike your wife I actually wanted more sex and wasn't getting it cause porn was his first choice. I can understand her stance on the porn but not the no masturbating part.
> 
> I told my H that I wanted more sex and we started working on that but porn had to go all together. If he still felt the need to masturbate (if I wasn't available for sex or he needed a quick release or whatever) I told him masturbating was fine I didnt have a problem with that as long as he wasnt doing it more times than we were having sex (he was masturbating to porn 4+x a day whereas we were having sex maybe once a week). If he needed visual aids for masturbating i offered to make some videos and take pics for him.
> 
> You going outside the marriage to meet those needs was wrong but I also think it is unreasonable to expect you (or any man really) to not masturbate especially if his SO isn't going to help meet his needs.


That's not my situation at all - I wish my wife was as accommodating as you (although it sounds like you don't want him pleasuring himself more than once a week - not sure about that). I never once used porn / masturbation in lieu of a willing wife. It was always, rejection then masturbation. And we were just having sex once a week or so in the end and I was taking care of business by myself no more than 4-5 times a week (when we were having sex a couple times a week I wasn't masturbating as much as that). Unfortunately I didn't just stick to the one-sidedness of just porn. Contacting these women was really wrong and I'm still heartbroken over how I've hurt my wife.


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## finebyme72 (Jul 12, 2011)

GreenEyes said:


> I _know_ you're not saying that it's her fault that he contacted these women sexually over the internet!!??? I don't care what the issue at home is, work it out with your SO or hit the road and find what you're looking for...Speaking as someone whose H was talking with some girl sexually over the internet and the phone, that is pretty offensive of you to say. Of course when he was "found out" he blamed it on this or that, my fault of course(!!), but really who is the one that went outside the marriage???


. . . Missed one. You're right. She didn't do it - I did it. I contacted these other women, not her. I tried several times to get her to go to marital counseling with me and she refused. I probably should have issued an ultimatum but didn't. I just didn't want to leave my wife and kids. She was so not into having sex with me that I almost felt worse after we were done. It was so empty. The anger I felt from her during and after was just too much for me to take. And I felt very humiliated by her telling me to hurry up and get it over with already and don't kiss her during sex. It just didn't feel good.


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## deejov (Sep 24, 2011)

It sounds like your wife doesn't want the sex aspect of it. Meaning she may even think "sex" is dirty, and she doesn't want to be associated with porn or masturbation, etc. Everyone has their own level of sexuality. What is hers? I would bet she views sex with you as "making love" and that's it. Ever been kinky, at all? 

*Keep in mind you have now shown her, and told her, that you are capable of just "using" women to get off:*
Your comment:
"And when I made the suggestion one other time about her "inspiring me" while I masturbate, I could tell she wanted nothing to do with it and she told me later that it makes her feel used when I did that. So of course that put an end to that. "

My advice to you would be to do some work at making it clear that you are not using her for sex. That is a fear for a lot of women. And they don't respond to "all I want is sex everyday".
You can go get SEX anywhere! Online for free. Go use someone else. They want to know that you desire HER, that you love her.

Somehow, you have to SHOW her that you think more highly of her than the online girls you have been using. 

I think that is the hardest part of porn for women to accept. That their loving husband is capable of just using women for sex. Not a very attractive trait.


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## PHTlump (Jun 2, 2010)

GreenEyes said:


> I _know_ you're not saying that it's her fault that he contacted these women sexually over the internet!!??? I don't care what the issue at home is, work it out with your SO or hit the road and find what you're looking for...Speaking as someone whose H was talking with some girl sexually over the internet and the phone, that is pretty offensive of you to say. Of course when he was "found out" he blamed it on this or that, my fault of course(!!), but really who is the one that went outside the marriage???


You are correct, that the OP should not have cheated. And one of the reasons why is that now his wife gets to be the victim rather than face her faults in the marriage.

The OP cheated because his marriage was in a bad state. And his wife shares blame for the state of his marriage.


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## square1 (Oct 31, 2011)

finebyme72 said:


> Good question - I'm pretty sure that I would feel very cheated on. I would also wonder where I went wrong and why I wasn't good enough. I certainly don't want to make my wife more insecure than she already is (and I know she struggles with insecurity issues as well).
> 
> 
> 
> That's not my situation at all - I wish my wife was as accommodating as you (although it sounds like you don't want him pleasuring himself more than once a week - not sure about that). I never once used porn / masturbation in lieu of a willing wife. It was always, rejection then masturbation. And we were just having sex once a week or so in the end and I was taking care of business by myself no more than 4-5 times a week (when we were having sex a couple times a week I wasn't masturbating as much as that). Unfortunately I didn't just stick to the one-sidedness of just porn. Contacting these women was really wrong and I'm still heartbroken over how I've hurt my wife.



My only problem with him masturbating is when he chooses it over sex with me. I never put a number on how much he can do it. I just told him I would prefer we have more sex versus him masturbating more. Since he stopped viewing porn and started coming to me to fill his needs we have been having sex 2x a day and I'm perfectly happy with that he seems to be happy as well. if he still feels the need to masturbate then so be it we have been having a lot of sex but he has told me he prefers sex now or having me involved somehow. He has invited me to watch him masturbate, honestly though this just leads to sex. So it has been awhile since he has masturbated to completion.


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## finebyme72 (Jul 12, 2011)

square1 said:


> My only problem with him masturbating is when he chooses it over sex with me. I never put a number on how much he can do it. I just told him I would prefer we have more sex versus him masturbating more. Since he stopped viewing porn and started coming to me to fill his needs we have been having sex 2x a day and I'm perfectly happy with that he seems to be happy as well. if he still feels the need to masturbate then so be it we have been having a lot of sex but he has told me he prefers sex now or having me involved somehow. He has invited me to watch him masturbate, honestly though this just leads to sex. So it has been awhile since he has masturbated to completion.


Sounds great! I have a feeling it will be a long time if ever that we have sex again. She is really devastated by what I've done. I am not overly horny now because of how devastated I am by how I made her feel but I will be soon and I need some visual stimulation. I have a feeling things could get worse before it gets better unfortunately.


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## GreenEyes (Jan 27, 2011)

PHTlump said:


> You are correct, that the OP should not have cheated. And one of the reasons why is that now his wife gets to be the victim rather than face her faults in the marriage.
> 
> The OP cheated because his marriage was in a bad state. And his wife shares blame for the state of his marriage.


Share blame, yes, take blame, no. So maybe the post that I responded to was just badly worded, and after reading OP's response to my post, she almost certainly should take part of the blame; however, going outside of the marriage to other people is _never the correct solution, it just complicates an already existing problem, hurts feelings and breaks trust so you end up with an even bigger mess than when you started. Yes, it has to be absolutly the most frustrating thing to feel like your SO wants nothing to do with you sexually, that would drive me insane and hurt my feelings so much, but thats when you have to decide to push on and try to get to the bottom of it or move on...._


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## GreenEyes (Jan 27, 2011)

finebyme72 said:


> . . . Missed one. You're right. She didn't do it - I did it. I contacted these other women, not her. I tried several times to get her to go to marital counseling with me and she refused. I probably should have issued an ultimatum but didn't. I just didn't want to leave my wife and kids. She was so not into having sex with me that I almost felt worse after we were done. It was so empty. The anger I felt from her during and after was just too much for me to take. And I felt very humiliated by her telling me to hurry up and get it over with already and don't kiss her during sex. It just didn't feel good.



Apparently she has some pretty deep rooted problems, and the fact that she won't admit it and get help makes it a lot harder to deal with...I'm sorry that things are like that for you. I guess I see things from my point of view that I was not depriving my husband in any way in that department and I made good faith attempts to make our life together happy and more interesting, not that I'm the most interesting person on this planet haha, but I can't imagine being in your shoes and not understanding why my SO doesn't want me, that would be very frustrating, I wouldn't say that I would try to find it elsewhere over the net, but we are all different and deal with things in our own way....I hope things work out for you guys.


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## NotLikeYou (Aug 30, 2011)

Finebyme72- You asked for advice about your situation.

1) Honor and respect your wife and marriage enough that you don't talk to other women about having sex with them physically, online, or otherwise.

2) Try to talk to your wife about your needs and get her to honor and respect your marriage enough to want to have sex with you, her husband.

3) If your wife, say, ignores your efforts to point out that you're a man and you want to have sex with her, your wife, get her to go to marriage counseling.

4) If your wife refuses to go to marriage counseling to address the lack of sex in the relationship, recognize that she doesn't love you. She probably likes you, and she very much appreciates you paying her bills and providing stability in her life, but she doesn't love you. She may not even love herself.

5) If she doubles down and says that you not only cannot have sex with her, but you cannot have sex with yourself, recognize that whether or not she loves you is right out the window, and the real question has become "why does she hate you?"

6) Many men, faced with this awkward situation, will try to abide by their wife's dictate, in the hopes that if they just deny their sexuality, their wife will magically come to love them again, and they will start getting sex from her again. What actually happens is, if they manage not to jerk off, their wife doesn't respect them for their devotion. If they manage not to jerk off until they explode from resentment, their wife doesn't respect them for their lack of control. If they end up jerking off and the wife finds out, she doesn't respect them for their dirty behavior. 

7) Note that in point 6, no matter what the outcome, the wife sidesteps any responsibility for her part of the problem.

8) Understand that you have a really serious problem here. You have needs in your marriage that are not being met. Your wife may have needs that aren't being met, also, but you're the one posting on TAM, so you get teh hawt advice. 

9) Not only are your needs not being met, your wife has no interest in even trying to meet them. That is an even more serious problem, and that is what you have to solve.


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## sinnister (Dec 5, 2010)

Sorry but i too see it as someone saying not only am I not going to fulfill your basic sexual needs, I'm not allowing you to fulfill them yourself.

That is selfish and unfair. And nobody here will ever condone cheating, but I'll be the jerk who says...what did she expect? Sexual needs have to be met...end of story.


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## Laurae1967 (May 10, 2011)

Okay, here is the deal (and I've been on both sides of this exact issue)

1) Your marriage had sexual issues prior to your betrayal that were the result, in part, of your anxiety issues. You said you contributed to the lousy sex just as much as your wife did. Just keep that in mind.
2) Infidelity takes a good 2-5 years to overcome. What you did by having online sex with other women (and almost meeting up with them) is INFIDELITY. Sugarcoat it all you want, but you have to call a spade a spade. It is going to take your wife a LONG time to learn how to trust you, to rebuild her self-esteem that you damaged, and to grieve and then heal from what you did. It is a long process. You need to take 100% responsibility for this.
3) You can no longer use porn or sex chats to masturbate. It will destroy your wife's trust in you and frankly, you have shown that you can't handle porn. You let it take over your life....and that is a big problem. Thinking you can use porn again shows that you don't fully understand the damage you caused to yourself and your marriage, but hopefully you have a good therapist who will help you become aware of it.
3) Thanks to your infidelity, you will not be able to address the general problems in the marriage UNTIL you have dealt with your betrayal. That will take some time. Eventually it can be addressed, but probably not for a year or longer, because your wife will still be processing your infidelity and rebuilding her life. You see, when your spouse cheats on you, everything about your relationship is called into question. All the lies and secrets that were kept cause the betrayed spouse to question what was really real in the marriage. Your wife will wonder if you continue to lie to her and will have a hard time figuring out when you are being truthful. This is the legacy of infidelity. But in time, if you own up to what you did 100%, things will get better.

And please do not buy into the bullsh!t some men are posting on this thread, implying that your wife was witholding sex from you and so that gives you a right on some level to cheat. First of all, that is factually not true, as you were f ucking 2 times a week, and even if you weren't having sex often, the way to deal with it is not to go outside the marriage. Those types of comments show a lack of understanding of the situation. Your wife was meeting your needs just as well as you were meeting hers before you cheated.....but she did not deal with her disappointment in the marriage and in you by cheating. Only you did that, and you are going to have to suck it up until your wife can emotionally handle a sexual relationship with you again. Just how long that takes depends on how well you work on earning her forgiveness and how willing you are to fully own up to your role in dropping a bomb on your marriage and family.


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## Laurae1967 (May 10, 2011)

And forgive me if I am incorrect, but I did not read that your wife told you not to masturbate. You said she did not want you to masturbate USING PORN. She has every right to ask this.

This posting should really be in the infidelity section. A lot of the responses are from men who are sexually frustrated themselves, but the infidelity issue takes highest priority right now (sorry, horny fellas) and I think you would get better advice in the infidelity forum that in the sex forum. Sex is the last thing you should be thinking about right now. Saving your marriage and getting your act together should be priority #1....but again, I think this shows your lack of total awareness of what you did and where your marriage is right now.


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## NotLikeYou (Aug 30, 2011)

"Essentially she wants me to stop taking care of business all together." 

Well, yeah, who could read that and draw the conclusion that your wife told you not to masturbate at all? Laurae1967, take a bow. Then take a reading comprehension class!

Yes. The infidelity takes highest priority now. That's why I listed it first, genius.

It also happens to be the easiest to fix. "DON'T TALK WITH OTHER WOMEN ABOUT HAVING SEX. ONLY TALK ABOUT IT WITH YOUR WIFE."

So, while you're digesting Laurae's point 3 (both of them, math is HARD!) consider that her point 3 #2 is accidentally correct. You won't be having sex with your wife for awhile, until she feels like she can trust you again. And the process of learning to trust you again will take a long time and involve a lot of effort on your part, as it should.

And assuming that you put in all that effort, refrain from any sexual activity at all for however long it takes to regain your wife's trust, well, there you'll be. In the mean time, what will your wife have been doing to fix the part of the problems that are hers?

Not the infidelity- that's all yours. But the other problems, the sex ones that she and Laurae dismiss as unimportant?


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## Scannerguard (Jan 26, 2010)

Hmmm. Tough one. I beleive you are contrite about what you did and your wife probably understands your contrition.

I would prescribe this:

A. Tell your wife you will "fast" from sex. No masturbation for 40 days (giving you something "biblical" here). Some religions recommend this as a way of ritualistically honoring your wife.

B. Then, after 40 days, engage in sex again at a healthy dietary level (3-5X/week). Ritualistically schedule your sex with her on the 40th day when you break your fast. Make is special. Meditate on the Deadly Sins of Gluttony and Lust during your fast.

Unfortunately, I do disagree with the level of psychobabble out there that seems to think the woman "needs time." While it is certainly unreasonable for her to jump in bed with you the next day perhaps, "elapsed time" is not a friend when it comes to this subject.

It's like my patients after they hurt their back and don't get back to work. The longer time elapses, the worse the prognosis.

You can and should work it out while having sex.

She's not just withholding it from you; she's withholding it from herself and she should not be denied that pleasure.

Unless it ISN'T a pleasure, right?

Sex isn't some commodity to withhold from a spouse.


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## sunnybeach (Dec 25, 2011)

True- the wife is a good person, I am sure, but she needs to own up to her part in the marriage troubles. The op is not a bad person, the wife is not a bad person. The marriage has a problem with sex and it needs to be addressed and sorted out. It is the op's right as a human being to masterbate. I am a woman and I also thing that porn is ok if kept at a healthy level (like alchohol and food, etc). Look- we are all sexual beings. Sex is a part of what humans are. The op took the porn to the next step, but I feel that he was simply grasping. We have all been there in one way or another. Being in a sexually unfulfilling marriage is a big deal. Some cope with antidepressants, alcohol, presription drugs, anger, porn.... The point is that it has been brought to the surface. This is good! Now the homework is to see if both parties can open up, let the guard down, and communicate with heart. If both people will not open up I do not feel that is is healthy for either. If both open up and find a resolution or path of healing, then great. If both open up and find that they do not match sexually (this happens), they will hopefully both realize that fact and then decide what to do.


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## sunnybeach (Dec 25, 2011)

btw, I said 'true' to a previous post that I was reading- 

Infidelity is tricky. There is a big difference, imo, between a guy who has girlfriend on the side for months or years, and a guy who is so frustrated that he act out. OP didn't meet up with anyone and I assume the internet communication was not long drawn out? He shows us that he has a moral compass. People sometimes make mistakes while going through stuff! If it is recognized, stopped, and learned from it is a gift, really. This is totally different from the guy who keeps an apt for himself and his mistress. Totally different. These situations can = the gift of a great learning experience. And healing in a marriage if both parties will embrace it and eachother.


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## Laurae1967 (May 10, 2011)

Notlikeyou - Thanks for correcting my numbered points. Very kind of you. Clearly a typo is a sign of my lack of intelligence and you are so nice to point out that I can't read. I was trying to hide my lack of intelligence, but you found me out....dang!

Your response to my post was unusually angry for some reason. I was speaking from my experience. Were you speaking from experience? 

I totally disagree with you about a cheating husband's right to have sex with his wife and your outrageous statement that his wife has "no interest" in meeting his needs. You have absolutely no basis to say that and are just pulling it out of your butt. She could have tossed him on his a$$ justifiably for what he's done, but she's giving him another shot. That takes courage and commitment.

I have to surmise that you have absolutely zero experience dealing with infidelity or else the second half of your perfectly numbered post would have been more insightful. You get an A+ for numbering and a C- for content.

Sex can be a part of a reconciliation, but for a cheating spouse to decry a lack of a sex life so soon after being caught cheating shows how little he understands how deeply he hurt his wife and what he needs to do to reconcile. Same goes for you, dude.


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## finebyme72 (Jul 12, 2011)

sunnybeach said:


> btw, I said 'true' to a previous post that I was reading-
> 
> Infidelity is tricky. There is a big difference, imo, between a guy who has girlfriend on the side for months or years, and a guy who is so frustrated that he act out. OP didn't meet up with anyone and I assume the internet communication was not long drawn out? He shows us that he has a moral compass. People sometimes make mistakes while going through stuff! If it is recognized, stopped, and learned from it is a gift, really. This is totally different from the guy who keeps an apt for himself and his mistress. Totally different. These situations can = the gift of a great learning experience. And healing in a marriage if both parties will embrace it and eachother.


Thanks - I appreciate the kind words. She's pretty hurt by this. I'm sleeping on the couch for a while I suppose. I haven't been happy with the amount or the type of sex we've been having before this so I'm not sure if it will get better or not. I hope so - she's the only one I want to spend my life with. Before it was always "hurry up and get it over with" (she literally says that phrase) sex and she told me not to kiss her, no cuddling afterwards, etc. I don't know that I will be able to tolerate that - that's what lead me down the road with that behavior to begin with.


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## Cherry (Sep 23, 2009)

finebyme72 said:


> Before it was always "hurry up and get it over with" (she literally says that phrase) sex and she told me not to kiss her, no cuddling afterwards, etc. I don't know that I will be able to tolerate that - that's what lead me down the road with that behavior to begin with.


Has your wife always been like that sexually? You will repeat your behavior with that attitude.... You are blaming her for you essentially cheating. 

As for frequency, you are getting it regularly. At the least a few times a month? Is that right? I'm always reading about hubby's here getting it way less than that. And the frequency in your marriage has only dropped slightly.... I'm not sure why I'm reading on this thread how any of this is the wife's fault other than what I quoted above and that does need to change because it's quite obvious from the OP that if it doesn't, he will cheat again. Just my thoughts.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## deejov (Sep 24, 2011)

So, do you know what you would be happy with?

Do you have an idea of what is wrong, and how you would prefer things to be? Do you know why she isn't into sex? (or is it important at this point?)

I don't want to put words in your mouth, but I am getting a vibe that it's always been bad, it's not likely to get better, you've never been happy, so you don't see how you can avoid the behavior that pissed her off in the future. (in other words, there isn't really any hope that things will turn around).

There is... but it will take hard work. I also get the feeling you are more concerned about what to do about the daily boner in the meantime, and that is a valid concern.

I like what Scannerguard had to say. Please consider the 40 day thing or your version of it. That might put a different perspective on things for you. Take your mind off of it for awhile. 

Good luck,


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## COguy (Dec 1, 2011)

I didn't read all the replies but I'll give my 2 cents.

I won't comment on whose fault it is. It should be clear to you that regardless of how your spouse reacts, you still choose how to respond. Your response was a poor one, like my wife's when she was unhappy in our marriage (she chose to get involved with an EA and PA).

You will now have to deal with the consequences (no masturbating to porn or online chatting).

HOWEVER, it is completely unrealistic, and you already know it, to expect you to not get sex, and not masturbate. How long could you keep this up? Truth be told, it's unrealistic for you to continue with your dissatisfied sex life. That doesn't mean you can look at porn, it means you need to ADDRESS THE ISSUE.

The fact that you brought up counseling and she said no shows that she either doesn't understand how this affects you, or doesn't care. You can't have a healthy marriage where one person is harboring resentment and not able to get any resolution on it. It's no wonder she isn't into the sex, there's a wedge driven between you two.

What I would suggest is, give this some time....lots of time. She's going to feel hurt that you went out of your marriage for satisfaction. That could take months to get to the point where she's willing to talk about it without getting upset. Build her trust in this manner. When and only when you feel she's receptive to discussion, tell her how and why sex is important to you.

Don't mention how it makes your dingaling feel, talk about how you desire to be intimate with her, share a closeness, how it makes you feel connected. Let her know that you want to connect on a deeper level, and that you want her to try counseling to resolve your issues. Let her know that it is really important to you.

If she still says no, then you'll have to look at another tactic. Something like "The MAP" from Married Men's Sex Primer. You can't have a healthy marriage with someone who doesn't want to work on issues that affect you, the MAP is kind of a responsible way to initiate that change. It puts you in a frame of mind to say, "I love you, and want to be with you, but it's not out of desperation, I can move on if needed."


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## COguy (Dec 1, 2011)

deejov said:


> I don't want to put words in your mouth, but I am getting a vibe that it's always been bad, it's not likely to get better, you've never been happy, so you don't see how you can avoid the behavior that pissed her off in the future. (in other words, there isn't really any hope that things will turn around).


To add more to this, if you're holding back feelings from your wife, that means you aren't as emotionally connected. Women sense this and is what fuels their sexual desire. If your wife isn't connected to you, she won't want to or enjoy sex.

Something that I had to learn, or unlearn, is bottling up my feelings to "protect" my wife. I would refrain from saying things that I knew would hurt her even though they were bothering me. The end result was that she felt like I didn't care about her. We do it much more frequently now and the sex is better since I started bringing up issues. We are extremely close now, there is nothing between us (no hidden resentment or unresolved issues).

You aren't doing your wife or marriage any favors by not sharing your true feelings.


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## mr.miketastic (Aug 5, 2010)

PHTlump said:


> You are correct, that the OP should not have cheated. And one of the reasons why is that now his wife gets to be the victim rather than face her faults in the marriage.
> 
> The OP cheated because his marriage was in a bad state. And his wife shares blame for the state of his marriage.


:iagree:


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## finebyme72 (Jul 12, 2011)

Cherry said:


> Has your wife always been like that sexually? You will repeat your behavior with that attitude.... You are blaming her for you essentially cheating.
> 
> As for frequency, you are getting it regularly. At the least a few times a month? Is that right? I'm always reading about hubby's here getting it way less than that. And the frequency in your marriage has only dropped slightly.... I'm not sure why I'm reading on this thread how any of this is the wife's fault other than what I quoted above and that does need to change because it's quite obvious from the OP that if it doesn't, he will cheat again. Just my thoughts.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Cherry - I was afraid my comment might be taken that way. I am definitely not blaming her for looking for that online. And even though the frequency is lower than I'd like, its not the worst thing. Its the attitude. Plus I'm not going to be comparing how much I get to someone else - if I need to feel that connection 4x's a week why would it matter if another guy would be happy with 2x's a month. I'd like 2-3x's a week but would be happy with 1.5-2x's if it was a little more quality - is it right that I get "hurry up and get it over with" sex?

It hasn't always been like this - since we've been done with kids its been like this (actually since she was pregnant with our second child).

I definitely don't want to cheat and will do everything I can to keep that from happening (again).


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## finebyme72 (Jul 12, 2011)

deejov said:


> So, do you know what you would be happy with?
> 
> Do you have an idea of what is wrong, and how you would prefer things to be? Do you know why she isn't into sex? (or is it important at this point?)
> 
> ...


Thanks deejov - I have a feeling that it will be a lot more than 40 days before we have sex again - I hope not but it probably will. I guess the "daily boner" is a concern but not as big as getting my marriage right. Although to answer your question - I would be happy with a 2-3x's per week - right now it's none but was 1-1.5x's per week. But the frequency isn't as important as her connecting with me and not showing hostility during sex and telling me to hurry up and get it over with or telling me not to kiss her. I'm not sure why she isn't into it.


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## Cherry (Sep 23, 2009)

finebyme72 said:


> Cherry - I was afraid my comment might be taken that way. I am definitely not blaming her for looking for that online. And even though the frequency is lower than I'd like, its not the worst thing. Its the attitude. Plus I'm not going to be comparing how much I get to someone else - if I need to feel that connection 4x's a week why would it matter if another guy would be happy with 2x's a month. I'd like 2-3x's a week but would be happy with 1.5-2x's if it was a little more quality - is it right that I get "hurry up and get it over with" sex?
> 
> It hasn't always been like this - since we've been done with kids its been like this (actually since she was pregnant with our second child).
> 
> I definitely don't want to cheat and will do everything I can to keep that from happening (again).



You are correct in that you shouldn't have to put up with that kind of sex. And you are correct in that comparing the schedule of another's sex frequency is irrelevant. However, what is important is whether or not your wife agrees with the frequency, which seems to be a mute point until she can heel from your betrayal. 

You mention kids. How old is your youngest? My H did what you did when our twins were under a year. It was a turning point in our marriage... I felt like nothing more than a nut for my H and if I wouldn't have sex with him, he proved to me that I'm pretty replaceable in that department. 

You may have already answered this, but when did the hurry up sex start? 

Your wife needs to address her hang up with sex, but you need to let her know and show her that you are wanting and needing that connection with her... Your actions are showing her that you just need a connection with anyone, not just her. Pretty low blow for a wife.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## finebyme72 (Jul 12, 2011)

Cherry said:


> You are correct in that you shouldn't have to put up with that kind of sex. And you are correct in that comparing the schedule of another's sex frequency is irrelevant. However, what is important is whether or not your wife agrees with the frequency, which seems to be a mute point until she can heel from your betrayal.
> 
> You mention kids. How old is your youngest? My H did what you did when our twins were under a year. It was a turning point in our marriage... I felt like nothing more than a nut for my H and if I wouldn't have sex with him, he proved to me that I'm pretty replaceable in that department.
> 
> ...


Really good comments and questions, Cherry - thank you for that. She agreed with the frequency of a 2-3x's per week but backed off that. I did as well thinking that if she really only needs it 1-2x's a month (which she said she did) it might be pushing it for more than a couple times a week. Our youngest in 2 1/2 years old. The sex stopped altogether during her pregnancy with him (which was frustrating because she was so horny during our first child and the sex was never better). The hurry up and get it over with started after my younger son was born and then has progressed to where she doesn't want me to kiss her, cuddle with her, and I get a lot of animosity during and right after. It definitely didn't feel like a connection.

Of course you're right that it is probably a moot point for now as we've got to get the other stuff fixed first. I should not have gone online like I did.

Are you and your husband still together? If so, has the change ultimately been for the better? 

Incidentally, my wife wasn't "just a nut" for me. I do want that connection with my wife and not just anyone.


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## mr.miketastic (Aug 5, 2010)

finebyme72 said:


> Really good comments and questions, Cherry - thank you for that. She agreed with the frequency of a 2-3x's per week but backed off that. I did as well thinking that if she really only needs it 1-2x's a month (which she said she did) it might be pushing it for more than a couple times a week. Our youngest in 2 1/2 years old. The sex stopped altogether during her pregnancy with him (which was frustrating because she was so horny during our first child and the sex was never better). The hurry up and get it over with started after my younger son was born and then has progressed to where she doesn't want me to kiss her, cuddle with her, and I get a lot of animosity during and right after. It definitely didn't feel like a connection.
> 
> Of course you're right that it is probably a moot point for now as we've got to get the other stuff fixed first. I should not have gone online like I did.
> 
> ...


She is being passive-aggressive. Lump called it. Your wife sounds like she really loves being a victim. You, on the other hand, are acting like a beta. Sit with her, discuss expectations from the relationship, set boundaries and keep them. It's also up to you what you are willing to live with. Remember as well, all the opinions here are just opinions, so don't take too much of the harsh/agenda-driven people's opinions personally. You are not a bad person, nor is your wife. You two have just hit a bump in the road, and it's up to you _both_ to fix it.


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## SunnyT (Jun 22, 2011)

*
Somehow, you have to SHOW her that you think more highly of her than the online girls you have been using. *

This I think, is the key. I say "woo" her. Non-sexually at first. Treat her with the respect and love that you probably had at the beginning of the marriage. I'm not saying that you slacked off, how would I know? I'm saying reinforce that. I think THAT is what she would want for now. Words don't mean much after betrayal, its actions that count. 

If I were you, I'd figure out a way to spoil her... without being a doormat. A woman wants to feel loved, admired, and desired... Maybe it will lead her to WANT you. 

You can't "fix" her... you can't make her change. You CAN change how you treat her, how you approach her, how you communicate with her, how you express your love to her. 

You can masturbate, no one can make you stop... you will just have to use your imagination. If she doesn't want to hear about it, stop talking about it with her. I wouldn't lie to her, I just wouldn't bring it up. If she does, I'd be honest.


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## Cherry (Sep 23, 2009)

finebyme72 said:


> Are you and your husband still together? If so, has the change ultimately been for the better?


We've had other problems since then that has further diminished my drive. We are together and that particular issue was addressed in counseling. It was brought to my attention that it wasn't about the sex, it was the attention he needed and wasn't getting from me. We continue to address that aspect of it, and only time will tell, but he is no longer seeking out online attention. But I am also addressing my issues. Good luck to you and if you can address your issues and not continue to "mess up", forgiveness on your wifes end could be easier than it has been for me.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## finebyme72 (Jul 12, 2011)

SunnyT said:


> *
> Somehow, you have to SHOW her that you think more highly of her than the online girls you have been using. *
> 
> This I think, is the key. I say "woo" her. Non-sexually at first. Treat her with the respect and love that you probably had at the beginning of the marriage. I'm not saying that you slacked off, how would I know? I'm saying reinforce that. I think THAT is what she would want for now. Words don't mean much after betrayal, its actions that count.
> ...


Good advice - thanks. I am already taking some of it. I don't want to be a beta / dishrag but I definitely want her to know that I appreciate her more than just as a "receptacle." 

I love my wife and I don't don't think of her like these other women at all . . . I mean not at all! I've been so distraught by all this that I haven't really masturbated since this happened a couple weeks ago.



Cherry said:


> We've had other problems since then that has further diminished my drive. We are together and that particular issue was addressed in counseling. It was brought to my attention that it wasn't about the sex, it was the attention he needed and wasn't getting from me. We continue to address that aspect of it, and only time will tell, but he is no longer seeking out online attention. But I am also addressing my issues. Good luck to you and if you can address your issues and not continue to "mess up", forgiveness on your wifes end could be easier than it has been for me.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I hope our counselor gets us to that point as well - thanks and good luck to you as well.


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## DawnD (Sep 23, 2009)

I am going to ask this and its going to sound soo very weird hahaha. Is it possible that your wife might be like me, and feel a bit smothered by the kids? When mine were under 4 years old, they constantly had to be ON me. Sitting on my, laying on me, etc, etc. So by the time night rolled around and the hubby was home, I just wanted everyone to NOT touch me. Granted, I was okay with sex, but outside of that I just wanted to be left alone. I got lucky and figured this out quick, but I don't think everyone can be as lucky. Just a thought, I could be WAAAYYY off base,but it might be worth asking her about. 

Just FYI, that got fixed by my going to the gym for about an hour or so three times a week when he got home.


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## finebyme72 (Jul 12, 2011)

DawnD said:


> I am going to ask this and its going to sound soo very weird hahaha. Is it possible that your wife might be like me, and feel a bit smothered by the kids? When mine were under 4 years old, they constantly had to be ON me. Sitting on my, laying on me, etc, etc. So by the time night rolled around and the hubby was home, I just wanted everyone to NOT touch me. Granted, I was okay with sex, but outside of that I just wanted to be left alone. I got lucky and figured this out quick, but I don't think everyone can be as lucky. Just a thought, I could be WAAAYYY off base,but it might be worth asking her about.
> 
> Just FYI, that got fixed by my going to the gym for about an hour or so three times a week when he got home.


Dawn, I think you're spot on. She has mentioned as much to me and I know the kids are very "smothering" - just last night the older one crawled into bed on my side and was all over me at 5:30 this morning. I'd love for her to go to the gym 4-5 days a week.


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## ouixch (Jan 4, 2012)

If your wife won't deal with the issue, the nails are already in the coffin. You will keep repeating the same problem over and over again, just lay it on the table with her and then if she isn't willing to go, decide if you are willing to live without sex for the rest of your life or not.


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