# dont know what to do...



## davedenlow (Nov 1, 2011)

been married for 8 years, 2 have two kids...thought i had the life. I recently found out my wife was having an affair with someone she worked with. I always knew something was up between them, but never had proof. She told me she had to work late on a project for work, but i thought she said she was done with it. So i followed her, she did go to work..but didnt stay there. She left with this guy back to his place and was there for some time. I was going to wait and confront them both at the time but i was afraid i would do something i regret. I did confront her, she denied it but after about 7 hours of fighting she admitted it. It was going on for about 5 months, started off innocent and progressed into something more. This was 3 weeks ago, since then i have been staying with a friend and visit my kids. We talk but just about bills and the kids. Even though i feel so disgusted with her i cant help but be in love with her. I thought about going out and having random one night stands, but i dont think i can handle it. Cant help but to feel that i will forgive her and that scares me the most, because what if i give her this second chance and she does it again....im just so lost right now and dont know what to do...


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## tacoma (May 1, 2011)

You need to go home first thing.

Then you need to figure out what you want.

Someone will be along with a link to the 180 so it`ll be easier to deal with being in the house with her.

What has her attitude been since D-Day?
Is she remorseful?
Does she want to salvage the marriage?
Has she come clean with the whole story?
Have you checked her phone records,email accounts, Facebook?


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## Mindful Coach (Sep 15, 2011)

Affairs are usually warning signs that somethings really wrong in the marriage, not always, but usually. My guess is if you are both completely committed to working through it together that it isn't going to happen again because you'll have learned how it got to the point that she went outside the marriage to begin with. It's hard work, painful and something you both need to stay persistent about to fully recover from. If the willingness is there though, it will work.

I guess it's really up to what you and her both feel about trying to work it out. Can you stay at your friends house and start slowly to see if you are both truly willing to reconcile?


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## Arnold (Oct 25, 2011)

I disagree with the above. While it may be true there was dissatisfaction on her part in the marriage, happy marriages also experience affairs. And, even if there are problems, the wayto resolve them does not include having an affair. Only a very damaged, unevolved person goes that route. So, if your wife did this,it had way more to do with her own deficincies than marital problems.
In any case, it always seems to be the the most determinative factor in whether there can be reconciliation, is the attitude of the cheater. A few of us would divorce regardless of the presence of genuine remorse and cceptance by the cheater of responsibility. But, I think most betrayeds would at least take a look at reconciling if the cheater would nly take responsibility, acknowledge the betrayed's pain, and stop blaming the betrayed. And, of course, the cheater has a ton of work to do re looking at herself and helping the BS heal. Most of the time, cheaters do not do this, i have found.
In any case, take a look at how your wife is acting, now. Is she remorseful? Does she acknowledge that you did not cause this in anyway? Does she see it as the huge g deal it is , or does she trivialize and and minimize your pain?
If she is doing these things, she may be a person capable of empathy and capable of growing. If not, (and her window for showing this is narrow, as sometimes they figure it out too late and the betrayed has closed the door), you have your answer. You cannot live under threat of this again and with someone whose moral comapss is so screwed up that she has no remorse and dos not think it is a big deal.


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## davedenlow (Nov 1, 2011)

She doesnt have facebook, and her emails and phone is clean. She said that it just happened and it was new and fun and got out of hand. She said she loves me and wants to be with me and will stop seeing him, i think i believe her. But i dont think things will ever be the same. Like how can i ever trust her again? 

My friends owes me big time, and said i can stay as long as i want. I dont know what i want...i love her and we do have a family, but sometimes i just feel like i dont care if she is still with him and just want to divorce her. Other times i dont think i can live without her. She suggested to go get help, but i dont know. She tried to wear something sexy a few days ago...and it shocked me but i wanted nothing to do with her.

If i do work things out with her, how will things be. Will we ever love eachother again. Can our love grow from this, or get worse. Will i be in love with her and then hate her forever? Im really just in a weird place right not, and have no idea what i want


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## Kobo (May 13, 2010)

Mindful Coach said:


> Affairs are usually warning signs that somethings really wrong in the marriage, not always, but usually.



No. A warning sign is distance, fighting, lack of affection. An affair is the end of the marriage you had. Its up to you to choose to start a new one with your unfaithful spouse but all the vows you took have been broken, redering your current marriage null and void.


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## davedenlow (Nov 1, 2011)

so to start a new marriage means i have to forgive her and forget this?


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## Arnold (Oct 25, 2011)

It is very rare for a betrayed to recover to the extent that the marriage can survivie. it happens, but nowhere near thefrequency the "pay for reconciliation" sitesand programs claim.
I think , for most of the nonGhandi types, the resentment generated is just too much to ever get past. Take lots of time before making a decision. her trying to entice you with a sexy outfit may mean she does not understand the seriousness of this breach of trust. It seems very insensitive to expect a man will be attracted and able to perform with this type of trauma recently inflicted, especially since sexual intimacy requires a willingness to be vulnerable. Not easy with someone who has recently injured you.


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## Arnold (Oct 25, 2011)

Forgiveness takes a long, long time and a ton of work from the cheater. As far as forgetting, forget it. You would need to be lobotomized.


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## PHTlump (Jun 2, 2010)

davedenlow said:


> She said she loves me and wants to be with me and will stop seeing him, i think i believe her.


That's good. If she's willing to do most of the heavy lifting, it's possible you can move past the affair.



davedenlow said:


> But i dont think things will ever be the same. Like how can i ever trust her again?


Things won't ever be the same. And you won't trust her again like you trusted her before. In a few years, you probably won't feel the sense of panic when she unexpectedly has to work late or run an errand. However, you will never again believe that your wife would never betray you.



davedenlow said:


> If i do work things out with her, how will things be. Will we ever love eachother again. Can our love grow from this, or get worse. Will i be in love with her and then hate her forever? Im really just in a weird place right not, and have no idea what i want


Most marriages don't survive an affair. But a large number (I think I've seen 30% claimed) do. If you try reconciliation, you will be on this emotional roller coaster of loving your wife, followed by hating her, for several months. The good news is that the feelings of hate will fade with time, even if you divorce.

I suggest you move back home and go to marriage counseling. Be upfront that you aren't committed to reconciling, you're just remaining open to the possibility. Then, in a few months, make the ultimate decision. If things are looking better, stay for good. If not, you can divorce at that time.

In the meantime, work on yourself. Go out with friends. Work on a hobby. Take your kids on outings for just the three of you. That can help you feel a little better about yourself and help you be confident enough to move past the affair (either with your wife, or without her).

Good luck.


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## Halien (Feb 20, 2011)

davedenlow said:


> so to start a new marriage means i have to forgive her and forget this?


There is no one-size-fits-all answer. In my opinion, time is the only answer that works until you know for sure. Give it time, and try to avoid responding out of anger in a way that makes reconciliation impossible. You may want to tell her to give you space, even if you do live together for a while. In fact, keeping close tabs on her might be very revealing. Remember, the burden of reconciliation is on her for now. It is a shared burden if you decide to reconcile.


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

If you are to recover she must quit her job there. She would be in contact with him, which is not ok.

You need to see if he has a SO and expose it to them.

She needs to be fully transparent forever. Never having a locked phone, never bring unaccounted for.

Yes you will be controlling. She lost her freedom by cheating.

Get tested for stds.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## RadicallyAccepting (Oct 19, 2011)

davedenlow said:


> so to start a new marriage means i have to forgive her and forget this?


NO!

First, GO HOME. In my state, if you are out of the home for 30 days that's abandonment, even if you are paying the bills.

If she truly wants to Reconcile, and you are willing to do it, you need to come up with a new understanding and have a new way of living. She has a lot of work to do to earn your trust. 

Marriage Counseling for both of you. Individual counseling, at least for her, although I'd suggest you get it too. 

Both of you checked for STDs.

You will not sweep this under the rug. You have to deal with it head-on, and together. Otherwise, just get a divorce.


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## davedenlow (Nov 1, 2011)

well the people who do decide to work on their marriages, does it work. Do things get better? What if i stay with her for the kids, they are young 5 and 2, and if i cant get over it just say screw it im gonna do me...i dont know

She really is trying though. The sex thing i cant blame her, cause we did have some AMAZING sex. She goes to church now, dont really know if that makes a difference. She said she only wants me, and i told her i dont know if thats what i want. She did start counseling too...i think. 

What if i go out and just have sex with someone. Not sayin i'll go out and look for it, but if it happens then it happens. Just for the time that im figuring out what i want. Why do i have to be faithful right?


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## RadicallyAccepting (Oct 19, 2011)

davedenlow said:


> What if i go out and just have sex with someone. Not sayin i'll go out and look for it, but if it happens then it happens. Just for the time that im figuring out what i want. Why do i have to be faithful right?


Are you serious? Because if you are, then don't even bother with reconciliation. Just go ahead and start planning your divorce.


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

You can click the my story link in my signature for how I had a successful R


Do know that the key is that both of you have to be 100% committed to making it work and it requires a lot of heavy lifting in your wife's end (and no revenge cheating on your end)
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Kobo (May 13, 2010)

davedenlow said:


> well the people who do decide to work on their marriages, does it work. Do things get better? What if i stay with her for the kids, they are young 5 and 2, and if i cant get over it just say screw it im gonna do me...i dont know
> 
> She really is trying though. The sex thing i cant blame her, cause we did have some AMAZING sex. She goes to church now, dont really know if that makes a difference. She said she only wants me, and i told her i dont know if thats what i want. She did start counseling too...i think.
> 
> What if i go out and just have sex with someone. Not sayin i'll go out and look for it, but if it happens then it happens. Just for the time that im figuring out what i want. Why do i have to be faithful right?



Revenge cheating would just be another obstacle for you if you decide to stay. For me, I probably wouldn't be able to forgive my wife to the extent of us staying together. Some can and have. 

* She goes to church now, dont really know if that makes a difference. She said she only wants me, and i told her i dont know if thats what i want. She did start counseling too...i think. 
*


You see, that would just piss me off more. So now that you've had your cake you want to do all possible to try to keep me but had no concern for me for the 5 months some other dude had your face buried in a pillow. Na, it just wouldn't work for me.


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## aug (Aug 21, 2011)

If you want at least 50/50 custody of the kids, move back home. Why should you leave the house? Ask her to leave while you think things through.

Also, realize that once she cheated, it's easier for her the next time around. You'll need to make it very costly for her to have cheated should you decided to reconcile.

But know this. Your marriage is never going to be the same again. Any innocence that might have been in the relationship is now gone. Church analogy: once she ate the apple, no more garden of eden.


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## Mindful Coach (Sep 15, 2011)

I've seen amazing things happen when both people want to reconcile and both do the work that it takes. The reason the stats seem so high with organizations that specialize in overcoming fidelity is most couples will not seek help unless they are both pretty certain they are going to give it their best shot. Where there is willingness, anything can happen. 

Will that happen for you? Who knows. As everyone is saying, she has to accept full and complete responsibility for the affair. She had choices and that was the worse one she could make. In no way, shape or form should you take any responsibility for the affair. But you do have a part in your marriage and part of recovering from an affair is to look at what was going on with each individual and in the marriage.

Is it really true you had amazing sex, were completely happy and it just happened because she had an integrity problem? Could be, but you won't know that until there is some form of counseling. Even if it was 100% completely on her and you are the world's most perfect husband, you will still need to look at doing some things differently because this situation has changed you, your marriage, and your family.

You have to be faithful because you are saying it's not right that she wasn't faithful. Just because she made a really bad mistake doesn't mean it's okay for you to move out, threaten divorce over it and then think it's okay for you to do the same thing. That's like a child becoming violent with another child "They did it first" is at best, an immature view of the situation.


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## davedenlow (Nov 1, 2011)

yea i dont know fully what i want. What are some signs she has changed for real. Like what should i look for to know she is really trying?


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

She has to agree to the following


1- no contact whatsoever with om, she should get a new job and handwrite a no contact letter. If he contacts her then she must ignore it and tell you right away

2- she must be completely transparent, her privacy is null and void, you get all passwords, know she is and have access to get phone, etc. Also you should verify her actions thru spy tech ( don't tell her that part)

3- she must show true remorse and admit 100% of fault for the affair and always help your pain
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

Also is OM married? Expose to his wife if so without warning your wife
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Arnold (Oct 25, 2011)

Mindful Coach said:


> I've seen amazing things happen when both people want to reconcile and both do the work that it takes. The reason the stats seem so high with organizations that specialize in overcoming fidelity is most couples will not seek help unless they are both pretty certain they are going to give it their best shot. Where there is willingness, anything can happen.
> 
> Will that happen for you? Who knows. As everyone is saying, she has to accept full and complete responsibility for the affair. She had choices and that was the worse one she could make. In no way, shape or form should you take any responsibility for the affair. But you do have a part in your marriage and part of recovering from an affair is to look at what was going on with each individual and in the marriage.
> 
> ...


I agree with a lot of what you say, mindful coach. But, from a legalistic standpoint, and perhaps a fundamental fairness standpoint, his wife unilaterally breached the contract containing tie agreement on fidelity. As such, the contract has been voided and he is under no obligation to continue to abide by its terms, absent a reaffirmance of the committment with new consideration upon which the K is based.
A revenge affair may complicate things. But, it is by no means a breach of his marriage contract. That no longer exists,IMO.


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## davedenlow (Nov 1, 2011)

Almostrecovered said:


> She has to agree to the following
> 
> 
> 1- no contact whatsoever with om, she should get a new job and handwrite a no contact letter. If he contacts her then she must ignore it and tell you right away
> ...


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## davedenlow (Nov 1, 2011)

and no he isnt married


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## Arnold (Oct 25, 2011)

It's very common. Most do not get past it.
Here is one reason why: Assuming your wife does this 180 and becomes perfect and devoted, etc. there is still the issue of her motivation for doing so.
See, we want to be loved for who we are, not because our spouse fears consequences or is tied by an enforced committment. When you reconcile, it is very difficult to discern whether your wife is acting lovingly because she really loves you or just because there are no better options.


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

well then it appears you have someone willing to do what it takes for you to R, heal and get past this and even have a better marriage than before

but the real question isn't her now, it's you- some people just can't get past infidelity. That's your call. Personally, I wouldn't make promises and say that you could possibly give it a shot. Be clear with your intentions.


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## davedenlow (Nov 1, 2011)

she admits she is messed up, the way she acts and not just with this situation. She said she knows i may never forgive her and we might get divorced, but she is going to church and counseling for herself. I said i found it hard to believe that now she does...what a coincident that she wants to now. She said this was an eye opener and she doesnt like what she has become. If i do believe all of this, its just hard to believe she wont do this agian


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

davedenlow said:


> If i do believe all of this, its just hard to believe she wont do this agian


it will take actions on her behalf and verification on your end

do know that it takes 2-5 years to completely get over an affair if done properly (the whole time isn't hell tho, if you read my story you can get an idea of how the healing process works)


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## Arnold (Oct 25, 2011)

I'd just like to add that a lot of very good, kind, forgiving, generous poeple do not get past this. It is in no way a deficiency or flaw that you do not let this go.
I spoke to a LCP who deals with infidelity. She told me that in her practice, the healthiest, most fully revovered folks she saw were those for whom this was an absolute dealbreaker. She felt they moved on fast, healed more completely, and,in most case, formed better relationships with some other person in the future.
I asked her why this was, as on many of the sites i visited, reconciliation was held up as the gold standard of recovery. She said that in folks who saw this as a dealbreaker, she found they had more developed boundaries, in general, and they did not struggle too much with doubt. Also, they seemed amenable to being educated about red flags in potential prtners down the road.


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

Arnold said:


> I'd just like to add that a lot of very good, kind, forgiving, generous poeple do not get past this. It is in no way a deficiency or flaw that you do not let this go.
> I spoke to a LCP who deals with infidelity. She told me that in her practice, the healthiest, most fully revovered folks she saw were those for whom this was an absolute dealbreaker. She felt they moved on fast, healed more completely, and,in most case, formed better relationships with some other person in the future.
> I asked her why this was, as on many of the sites i visited, reconciliation was held up as the gold standard of recovery. She said that in folks who saw this as a dealbreaker, she found they had more developed boundaries, in general, and they did not struggle too much with doubt. Also, they seemed amenable to being educated about red flags in potential prtners down the road.



IOW- there's no flaw in either direction you choose, but it is time that you make a choice, otherwise you're creating an awful limbo for yourself


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

davedenlow said:


> yea i dont know fully what i want. What are some signs she has changed for real. Like what should i look for to know she is really trying?


She has to end all contoact with him, the affair has to end. Has she done that?

Some couples do work through infidelity, most don't. The couples who do stay together do it because there is total honesty, transparency, and zero contact with the affair partner. (well, the healthy recovered couples). Unfortunately, you will never forget.


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## davedenlow (Nov 1, 2011)

well i called her, said i was gonna stop by....dont know why, but i figured its the right thing to do


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

davedenlow said:


> well i called her, said i was gonna stop by....dont know why, but i figured its the right thing to do



a lot of people regret getting divorced- doesnt mean that regret is anything more than buyer's remorse but there's no shame in giving it a shot. Just don't make promises and always be clear in what you want and need. Maybe it will work, maybe it won't.


Hysterical bonding is always fun tho (copious amounts of sex in order to rebond)


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

LOL Almost.


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## Arnold (Oct 25, 2011)

Almostrecovered said:


> IOW- there's no flaw in either direction you choose, but it is time that you make a choice, otherwise you're creating an awful limbo for yourself


Not sure I agree with this. If the discovery was recent, I think it is veryhealthy and natural to weigh options for a decent lenght of time before committing to either divorce or reconciliation.
And, sex while still undecided could cause confusion due to the bonding chemicals released.


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

Arnold said:


> Not sure I agree with this. If the discovery was recent, I think it is veryhealthy and natural to weigh options for a decent lenght of time before committing to either divorce or reconciliation.
> And, sex while still undecided could cause confusion due to the bonding chemicals released.


was not saying to have sex unless he was attempting R

and he's been out of the house for some time now, this just didn't happen in the last day or so


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

davedenlow said:


> This was 3 weeks ago, since then i have been staying with a friend and visit my kids.



to back up my last post


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## Arnold (Oct 25, 2011)

Almostrecovered said:


> to back up my last post


Actually, I think the post establishing it has been three weeks, supports my position, that it is very recent. Guess one person's "recent" is another person's "remote".


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

Arnold said:


> Actually, I think the post establishing it has been three weeks, supports my position, that it is very recent. Guess one person's "recent" is another person's "remote".



wow, you don't think 3 weeks is time to make a decision?

look, if he were to file for D (which we tell BS's all the time) he could always stop the proceedings if he has a change of heart

and if he attempts R he can always still file for D if it isn't working out

but taking a clear path and having a goal does wonders for the psyche as opposed to being in limbo


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## Arnold (Oct 25, 2011)

Nope, I don't. Not that i am a huge devotee of all the sites concerning this. But, almost across the board , they seem to advocate at least 6 months before making a decison, reconciliation or divorce. Or, many of them do, anyway.
For me, i was pretty much non functioning for the first few months(of course, I did not have far to go to be considered non-functional ) I was not competent to make such a decison until some of the shock subsided.


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

precious time is lost for that scenario imo


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## Arnold (Oct 25, 2011)

I'd lose of few months in exchange for clarity. Just me.


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## davedenlow (Nov 1, 2011)

well i think it went well. I told her i wanted to work things out, mostly for the kids. Not sure if i still love her, but we'll see...


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Get tested for STDs--both of you.

What did she say to you? She has to end the affair with him before you even consider reconciliation. Has she done that already?


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## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

Almostrecovered said:


> a lot of people regret getting divorced- doesnt mean that regret is anything more than buyer's remorse but there's no shame in giving it a shot. Just don't make promises and always be clear in what you want and need. Maybe it will work, maybe it won't.


And this is where I think that statistics don't tell the full story. Who are the ones regretting the divorce, the BS, or the WS? Because of what we know about the affair fog, and the success rate of relationships borne of affairs (3%), many WSs' come out of the fog and end up regretting that they destroyed their marriage and family for their AP. By then, its far too late for their BS', who have moved on. So logically, the reason that 70% of people regret divorcing is so high, are the WS' coming out of the fog and realizing that their AP isn't Mr/Miss Wonderful after all.


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## davedenlow (Nov 1, 2011)

yes she has....i even talked to some people she works with so see if they talk. They said she avoids him. She said all she wants is a second chance....said i dont know if it will work out. but im gonna try for the kids, and i told her we wont be that happy family...mostly so she doesnt get her feelings up


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## davedenlow (Nov 1, 2011)

and i dont understand all the wp bs ap stuff


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## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

davedenlow said:


> and i dont understand all the wp bs ap stuff


Learn the acronyms at this link. Infidelity has a lingo all its own. We put these links in our signatures to help out newbies like you.

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/32002-welcome-tam-cwi-newbies-please-read-2.html


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## bryanp (Aug 25, 2011)

Sorry what you are going through Dave. She loves you so much now but clearly she had no problem having sex with another man for 5 months betraying her husband and family. My question is what was she thinking? How would she have felt if the roles were reversed and you had put her health at risk for STD's?

Do you think she would have engaged in this sexual affair if she knew that you automatically would have divorced her when it came out? I doubt it. I have a hunch that you are a really good guy and she thought she could screw this guy as long as she wanted, but if it was found out you would eventually forgive her because of the children. I am sorry but her great love for you sounds hollow. What was she thinking while she was making love to him? Was she thinking about how much she loved you then? Do you ever make love to her immediately after she had been with the OM.

I am sorry Dave but I guess I am just cynical about spouse sexually cheating on their spouse and then after they are caught they say how much they really really love you. I think they are just sorry that they were caught and it will threaten their standard of living.

The problem is that your wife clearly had no problem lying to your face and then going over to the OM to screw him. I believe you judge a person by their actions and not by their words and her actions clearly has shown how much she disrespected you and your family. This was not a drunken one night stand. This was a very well calculated planned sexual affair for 5 months. Now that she was caught she says she really loves you......Oh please. Good luck anyway.


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## CH (May 18, 2010)

davedenlow said:


> but im gonna try for the kids, and i told her we wont be that happy family


And the marriage is over already. You do it because you want to still be with her and give her a chance. If you're just gonna do it for the kids, in a couple of years you'll hate her guts so badly that you can't even stand to be in the same room or even see her face at all.

You either go all in to make a happy marriage or you cut your losses now and move on. BTW, her being all head over heals for you, it's a reactionary feeling on her part for now to cover her ass and minimize the damage as much as possible.

Most couples don't make it or they stay in a pathetic marriage just for the kids. And when the kids are out of the house, they realize it's too late to start over at that point and just wait it out until you're buried six feet under. That's not the way to live IMO.

I think you should ask her to leave the house for a week or so if she has a friend or family in the area. Think things through and when she's gone you'll be able to really know if you want her back or not. If in that time you miss her like crazy and can't stand to be away from her then you know you have a chance at reconciling. But if you start to feel numb and could give a *bleep* if she's there or not then you know you're headed for divorce.


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## davedenlow (Nov 1, 2011)

wow bryan you really made me hate her...and cheating hubby i spent 3 weeks away, i do miss her but hate her at the same time. it changes every few days sometimes five days or so when i cant live without her and then i want nothign to do with her, like i couldnt care is she got gangbanged....and its been lke that roller coaster since..


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## aug (Aug 21, 2011)

And dont do it strictly "for the kids". Because when the kids find out, and they will eventually, and they see you unhappy, they will feel responsible even though they had no part of it.

Maybe you should do a paternity test on your kids?


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## Arnold (Oct 25, 2011)

She has behaved in a manner worthy of hate. The question is, are you one of the rare betrayed spouses that can forgive her and extend mercy/grace.
Guess ther is another question, too. Is she one of the rare cheaters that has true remorse and is willing to do all the work she needs to do?
And, on the love/hate deal-very normal.


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## davedenlow (Nov 1, 2011)

i think so, she did seem sincere. I told her i was gonna come back tonight, we'll see how it goes. You all will hear from me soon. Thanks for all the advise


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