# Question for all the BS out there about trust



## Ostera (Nov 1, 2012)

Almost all threads have the same answer when it comes to attempting to stop an EA/PA and recover the marriage.

The responses are always: VAR, GPS, Key logger, passwords and many other things.

Here is my question for any BS who would like to reply. I am trying to understand what kind of stress it puts on you in addition to the stress you already are, or have, encountered.

Is it really worth it to 'monitor' every movement of the other party? Obvously there is no trust already.. the additional monitoring to me just seems to add to the anxiety of everyday life since the affair was discovered.

NO trust = no relationship... 

What is/ was it like when you had to do all of this?


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## SomedayDig (Jul 17, 2012)

Immediately following Dday March 6, 2012 my wife installed a gps on her phone without me prompting her (and way before we were on TAM). She also gave me all of her passwords as well.

For me, it wasn't so much about monitoring her on a daily basis but when I got a twinge of fear I was able to look at the gps and verify she was at work. I could check the cell phone records to see what texts had been made and I could check her email to verify work times/situations that arose through the day where I might not hear from her.

It was about RE-establishing trust and Re-establishing the relationship.


EDIT TO ADD: I stopped checking things around mid-June and haven't looked at anything since. If she has an odd work thing going on, she will offer to turn her gps on which I usually say she doesn't need to.


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## asia (Dec 3, 2012)

I already had all of the passwords, GPS, etc and he still found a way to cheat. There are so many other ways to communicate with someone without getting caught in these days of smartphones, blackberry's, etc. It's not worth the effort. It helps to have that stuff but in the end if they want to cheat, they will.


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## badmemory (Jul 31, 2012)

In my case I can assure you that my stress would have been greater had I not continued to monitor her after I found out. I continued to do it for months afterwards and every time I found nothing, I felt a little better about things.

I still do it, but not to the extent I did at first. It's not stressful really, just a way of life at this point.


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## Ostera (Nov 1, 2012)

SomedayDig said:


> Immediately following Dday March 6, 2012 my wife installed a gps on her phone without me prompting her (and way before we were on TAM). She also gave me all of her passwords as well.
> 
> For me, it wasn't so much about monitoring her on a daily basis but when I got a twinge of fear I was able to look at the gps and verify she was at work. I could check the cell phone records to see what texts had been made and I could check her email to verify work times/situations that arose through the day where I might not hear from her.
> 
> ...



Thank you for your reply. I can see attempting to re-establishing the trust.. but during that time it must be gut wrenching when you are checking the logs, GPS etc.. the anxiety of what you 'might' find each time you checked must have been terrifying.

Is the monitoring still going on? How long do you think it takes before the trust is there again and is it ever 100% like it was before the EA/PA was discovered?


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## cj9947 (Jul 9, 2011)

It will NEVER be the same again. I will ALWAYS keep one eye on my relationship partner(s) for ever. Human's are simply undeserving of that much trust to begin with.

I actually like not getting caught up in the "fantasy" aspects of relationships anymore. I like keeping it "real"...much better way to live.


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## SomedayDig (Jul 17, 2012)

Ostera said:


> Thank you for your reply. I can see attempting to re-establishing the trust.. but during that time it must be gut wrenching when you are checking the logs, GPS etc.. the anxiety of what you 'might' find each time you checked must have been terrifying.
> 
> Is the monitoring still going on? How long do you think it takes before the trust is there again and is it ever 100% like it was before the EA/PA was discovered?


Yes, checking the logs was bothersome precisely because I was afraid I might "catch" her doing something wrong, however with each time I looked and verified all was on the up and up, I steadily felt more secure. She's a school teacher, so it's not like she can check out for periods of time...but she did use "meetings" after school as a chance to go see the xOM.

She will offer to turn on the gps when she has those after school meetings now. I tell her not to worry that I know she's where she says. Admittedly, I did check the cell records last month because of her birthday time coming up and I just needed to see that there were no calls/texts from anywhere that I didn't know.

She had a 5 year long PA. I don't think I'm fully trusting at the moment, but I'm a lot further than I was last summer. It takes time AND it takes a wayward spouse's efforts to prove to the betrayed that they are sincere in working on reconciliation. I know there are several stories about faking reconciliation or false reconciliation, but you'll never know until you try. If crap falls apart, I know in my heart that I truly did the best that I could to keep the marriage together. I believe she has changed.


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## Ostera (Nov 1, 2012)

badmemory said:


> I still do it, but not to the extent I did at first. It's not stressful really, just a way of life at this point.


This is what I am trying to understand.. how do you feel that 'this' is a constant in your life now?

Knowing that there may be another affair seems like a lot of stress to me.


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## SaltInWound (Jan 2, 2013)

Ostera said:


> This is what I am trying to understand.. how do you feel that 'this' is a constant in your life now?
> 
> Knowing that there may be another affair seems like a lot of stress to me.


For me, it would not matter who I was with, present or future, my attitude toward trust would be the same. I do what I have to to feel comfortable with the relationship. It is now a part of my life as anything else.


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## doc_martin (Oct 19, 2012)

this is a tough one for me because of how things turned out. I am NOT a jealous or mistrusting person. I have always had the position of "if you don't want to be with me, move the fvck on!" 

After my Ddays with WW I would eventually stopped checking and then would get the "itch" to do a little sleuthing. For me unfortunately, it resulted in me finding out my worst fears (every fvcking time!). In the end, it made me content to know I can at least trust my "gut".

They are going to do what they are going to do. I am convinced of that, now. BUT if you are going to do it, do it for a purpose. Don't just aimlessly monitor. You are looking for something in particular, then if you find it or don't, let it go or deal with it. Don't just shotgun the whole process hoping to shake something free. That WILL drive you crazy, IMHO. 

Having said that, I feel much better knowing I will NEVER have to give a sh!t where she is or who she is with. I wonder if our marriage would have ever gotten to anywhere near that.


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## hookares (Dec 7, 2011)

After you've been burned, the best way to avoid the stress that accompanies distrust is to eliminate the relationship with the one who can't be trusted and make sure you don't get into another relationship where you will even care.


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## Shadow_Nirvana (Jan 1, 2013)

Actually blind trust is the kind of trust that destroys a relationship. "He/she wouldn't do it" etc. That kind of trust makes people lazy and it makes people take their spouse for granted. Although I definitely cannot be sure about it, there seems to be more BSs who had blind trust towards their spouse than not. I for one, if/when I get married will acknowledge the fact that my wife may cheat or may leave for the attraction towards anoher man. This knowledge emphasizes the need to work on the relationship and it makes working on the relationship easier. It's so much easier to actually live when you are awake.

Trust can be built by consistent action from the WS. Yes, even from "No Trust", you can get to the levels of "Healthy Trust". It's tough but what can you do sometimes, you know?


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## doc_martin (Oct 19, 2012)

Shadow_Nirvana said:


> I for one, if/when I get married will acknowledge the fact that my wife may cheat or may leave for the attraction towards anoher man. This knowledge emphasizes the need to work on the relationship and it makes working on the relationship easier. It's so much easier to actually live when you are awake.


If you can manage this every minute of every day for 20+ years, I'd like to read your book. Every relationship will have ups and downs. It's inevitable. Is the person you are with able to recognize this as well and deal with it? Or will they take the easy out... 

Think about how many BS never saw it coming. Hind sight is surely 20/20. Can you spot it looking forward?


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## Ostera (Nov 1, 2012)

Shadow_Nirvana said:


> Actually blind trust is the kind of trust that destroys a relationship. "He/she wouldn't do it" etc. *That kind of trust makes people lazy and it makes people take their spouse for granted*. Although I definitely cannot be sure about it, there seems to be more BSs who had blind trust towards their spouse than not. I for one, if/when I get married will acknowledge the fact that my wife may cheat or may leave for the attraction towards anoher man. *This knowledge emphasizes the need to work on the relationship and it makes working on the relationship easier*. It's so much easier to actually live when you are awake.
> 
> Trust can be built by consistent action from the WS. Yes, even from "No Trust", you can get to the levels of "Healthy Trust". It's tough but what can you do sometimes, you know?



I think the bolded above are conflicting ideas... I want to be able to 'blindly' trust *AND*. Being lazy toward ensuring your relationship is strong are not one in the same.


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## badmemory (Jul 31, 2012)

Ostera said:


> This is what I am trying to understand.. how do you feel that 'this' is a constant in your life now?
> 
> Knowing that there may be another affair seems like a lot of stress to me.


Everybody is different in regards to trust I suppose. All I can tell you is I don't foresee a day where I'll blindly believe everything she tells me. Perhaps that day will come, but I doubt it. 

Too me, that's part of the price you pay for reconciling with a cheating spouse. The greater the depth of betrayal, the greater the loss of trust, and the longer - if ever- it takes for trust to be restored.

But it's not stressful to me. I don't worry about her cheating on me. I've long since resigned myself to that possibility.

If anything, I worry about being deceived again. If she cheats in the future, I just want to make reasonable efforts to make sure I find out about it. I don't worry about losing her as much as I worry about being made a fool (again).

But I'm sure I'm not alone in that regard. I read a lot of threads where other BS's feel the same way.


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## Shadow_Nirvana (Jan 1, 2013)

doc_martin said:


> If you can manage this every minute of every day for 20+ years, I'd like to read your book. Every relationship will have ups and downs. It's inevitable. Is the person you are with able to recognize this as well and deal with it? Or will they take the easy out...
> 
> Think about how many BS never saw it coming. Hind sight is surely 20/20. Can you spot it looking forward?


I dunno, I've always been a skeptic. When I gave a person full, blind trust , I've found that they never were able to dissapoint me by not shoving that trust back up my ass. 

I agree that I may never see it coming either (but I think chances of that will actually be less than those who are just so ready to give the benefit of doubt. Maybe I want to believe this to assuage my dread.) But even a little dose of healthy distrust will make sure I won't be able to overlook blatant red flags. But tbh, there are lots of potential cheaters out there who are discreet enough to not alarm the BS. 

So I accept there is a good chance I will be screwed any way. At least by doing things the way I like them, I can sing "I did it my way" in the end.:smthumbup:


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## Racer (Sep 24, 2009)

Ostera said:


> This is what I am trying to understand.. how do you feel that 'this' is a constant in your life now?
> 
> Knowing that there may be another affair seems like a lot of stress to me.


I went through a false R. It is a constant now. Sort of a resolve. I’ve found I just can not emotionally invest a whole lot into the marriage anymore... I’m always prepared emotionally now to leave my WW. She is simply a liar; It is her “normal”. As such, I’ve just accepted those terms and limited myself from ever believing she is going to have my back when her skin is on the line. The “two souls joined as one” fantasy is dead. It’s her, and it’s me. Free to make our own choices as individuals. The belief that she’d always consider me as part of how she makes choices is eradicated. 

Since I can’t control her, I control myself; I have boundaries and if she crosses them, I will terminate the relationship without a lot of regret. The constant is the emotional distance to be able to do so.


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## C-man (Oct 23, 2012)

The first time I snooped on my wife (after over a year of having a gut feeling) - I felt guilty for doing it. BUT, I discovered that my wife was having an affair (what I thought was an EA). In other words, my gut feeling was correct and I SHOULD have snooped earlier.

Once a spouse betrays the marriage - all bets are off with regard to privacy. My stbxw was talking about our marriage, about me, about her, about her desires, about her dislikes - all with the POSOM. SHE violated the privacy of our marriage by establishing this relationship with the POSOM. 

She actually got angry at me for snooping, believe it or not. And I DID feel guilty for a few moments - but that passed. 

So there was a LOT of stress as I debated whether I should or should not snoop. Once I did it, there was a momentary stress where I felt guilty for crossing a line. But the stress of the unknown (what was causing my "gut feeling") was far greater than the temporary stress of feeling guilty for snooping.

While we were trying to reconcile, my stbxw gave me her Blackberry password and I never checked (thinking just having the power to check was enough). This was ok for a while, but was a big mistake later on in our false R. Trust and verify. 

Once your spouse violates your trust by cheating, it is up to THEM to re-establish and re-earn your trust to a point where you no longer have to monitor or stress about what they're really doing.


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## doc_martin (Oct 19, 2012)

Shadow_Nirvana said:


> I dunno, I've always been a skeptic.
> 
> So I accept there is a good chance I will be screwed any way. At least by doing things the way I like them, I can sing "I did it my way" in the end.:smthumbup:


Me too. And even the events leading up to her affairs, I was confronting the bad behavior. I have cheated and been cheated on enough before I was married to know how this game can be played. We would even talk about how ANYONE is capable of cheating. It really just takes the right set of circumstances. In the end, those happened. Looking back, I can certainly say there were things I did wrong once the affair was discovered. But I don't see how I could have been better at preventing it. Maybe I'm kidding myself (probably am). I see how I could have, if I had known...but it all looked the same to me standing on the front side of it.

In the end, I have accepted that anyone you are with has the capacity. It is up to them. Once you find out, it's up to you.


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## Dad&Hubby (Aug 14, 2012)

Ostera said:


> Almost all threads have the same answer when it comes to attempting to stop an EA/PA and recover the marriage.
> 
> The responses are always: VAR, GPS, Key logger, passwords and many other things.
> 
> ...


It depends on the couple. My ex wife and myself had a terrible marriage. It wasn't worth it to try and save, so I didn't bother with monitoring etc. I also live in a no fault state so proof didn't help my situation either. 

If you HAD a good/great marriage prior to the affair, than the steps laid out are critical if you're looking to save the marriage. Also if you don't live in a no fault state, proof is also important to get the best results from your divorce.


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## Biscuits (Aug 2, 2012)

As far as tracking and monitoring goes...I'll say this.

Post DDay I demanded all of that stuff, but it only went as far her giving me access to the sites she knew I knew about. It didn't matter much because she changed them about 2 weeks later anyway after the first time I logged on and she was notified in e-mail. So, I'm not worried about it. If/when (I believe she will) she cheats again, I might not find out that day, or the next, or the next. I have something better, her pattern of emotions, anger, creation of meaningless arguements, reverse blame for no reason...those are the passwords to the social sites. She can say and do whatever she wants....let me share this with you. I recently got home after a business trip, she was on her FB and I know she is part of some girlie pages or whatever. "How are your FB things going?" i said, she twiddled with her phone for a bit and then tried to give me her phone "look what I wrote" she says, "I want nothing to do with your FB, if you wanted me to see you wouldn't have changed your password"...anyway, I take the phone and read a post about me...and I ask "so what is the left hand doing"? "what do u mean"? "you have NEVER offered to show me your FB, and you've cherry picked what you wanted me to see....what do you NOT want me to see".....she took her phone and walked out of the room.

So, now I know the signs of an affair, I know the signals, I know the patterns. IF i see them again, that is the evidence I need. I am mentally prepared to just walk away. No arguement, no discussion, no "but I've been faithful to you", none of it. I will slowly pack my things over a period of time so she doesnt realize them missing, and I'll just vanish. No goodbyes, no long winded love letters of reprimand. Just...a...ghost.

Dont waste your time if you're a BS. Life your life and be smart enough to see it in your heart before you need to prove it with your eyes.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

I don't see what's so difficult about checking up on stuff. Most of it is done on a computer where I spend most of my time anyway. My fiance has told tme hat he wants me in his life and he has since been transparent. I have access to his FB and e-mail accounts. I can see his phone whenever I ask. 

We have keep tabs on our bank accounts; if we have children we have tabs on them and so on........

why would anyone think keeping tabs on our partner is unpleasant. If you love your partner, you will want to know everything about him/her anyway.


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## Paladin (Oct 15, 2011)

For me, monitoring my fWS was necessary in the early stages of her A. Once I confirmed the A was going on, and she was lying when she said she stopped communicating with the OM, I stopped monitoring her and began to detach. After she came out of he fog, actually committed to NC and rebuilding the marriage and helping me recover, the monitoring was done as a relationship building exercise. She openly gave me all her passwords and accounts, but we would always look through them together. We are a year and a few months into R, and she still offers to sit with me and go over everything, I decline 99% of the time as there have been no red flags and her actions are consistent with her words.


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