# ? for Husbands (esp with LD wives)



## 1tired (Jun 23, 2012)

I have about zero interest in sex and don't enjoy it when we do do it, which is about once a month or every other month when he gets really whiny and insistent. It's just a chore, and one that I despise. I go to great lengths to avoid it, including picking fights, and when that fails I just say no. I've been this way for about 8 years (16 year marriage), since I had to have a hysterectomy due to cancer (they got it all, I'm fine). I don't have orgasms, it hurts, and I resent being pressured to do it. It all adds up to a joyless experience. I've tried every lube in existence, they don't work for me. And I do NOT do oral, never have. I don't like receiving it either, fwiw.

However, I do love my husband and I do feel bad about this. It isn't my fault that I had to have my ovaries removed and thus have no hormones. There are other problems that predate the hysterectomy, mostly I don't like the things that turn my husband on and never have. Some of them are really a big turn off, but I tolerate it for his sake. But 75% of it is that I just have no interest. I don't look at other men, don't think about sex other than ways to avoid it, and don't masturbate. The other 25% of it is that I am the breadwinner and he stays home with the kids. I work 12 hour days 5 days a week, take call on weekends and am always writing several journal articles related to my profession. I'm exhausted. 

We also keep very opposite hours. I am up late, very late, every night. He is in bed and asleep at 8:30-9pm the latest. I usually go to bed about 1am (because when I get home form the office about 7pm I hang with the kids (we have 4) and then I have to work on my research obligations. He gets up at 4am to meditate and exercise. I get up at 6 and am rushing out the door at 7. We have no time for any intimacy that isn't sex, kwim?

He has volunteer weekend obligations every weekend that by their very nature exclude me. We have no friends in common (in fact, I don't have a social life at all, I just work, he's got a lot of friends) and no real interests in common. 

PLUS- and this is new, my income has been hurt by changes in the industry and while our expenses stayed the same. Income has gone down by about 1/3 over the past few years. It has come to the point that we either need to drastically change our standard of living, or he needs to go to work. He is unwilling to do either, and actually suggested to me that I pick up some moonlighting opportunities on the weekends. His reasoning is that my earning potential is so much greater than his, and I can earn more in one weekend than he can in a month. 

I see the logic, but I am already not enjoying the fruits of my own labor b/c basically I'm working a 20 hour day to pay for it, while he and the kids enjoy it, and now he wants me to work weekends to maintain it for them. It was about a week ago he made that suggestion. 

It has been over a month now since we have had sex, and he is getting very irritable about it. Let's just say the suggestion that I increase my work hours from 60 to 75+ weekly, while he stays home and watches TV most of the time (housekeeper does all the "wife" jobs because H would never do them) does not put me in the mood for my "monthly obligation."

We've been to counseling in the past, it didn't help. At this point I don't know what to do. It seems like a shame to get divorced from someone I really care about just over this, but for the first time in 16 years I'm feeling like I'd rather just have the monkey off my back. It's really breaking my heart.

Any suggestions for me to save my marriage?


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

Wow, why on earth are you still married? Do you get off on torturing people you supposedly love?


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## tacoma (May 1, 2011)

1tired said:


> Any suggestions for me to save my marriage?


I don`t think you should.


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

Hormones are an awful thing to lose. Do you do replacement therapy? If not, why not?

His sexual needs are/were very real and it was your honor to see that they were met. Knowing you had a hysterectomy and the health scares is one thing. That's scary crap. I've had one ovary removed and hopefully I don't need the other one taken out any time soon or at all.

Why does sex hurt? What turns him on that you don't like? Why no oral? 

Men and women don't get married to be celibate. Sexual needs should be met in a marriage. While I understand your health situation, I also see his side.
Did you do ANYTHING to help your libido? Or did you just let it slide, thinking he'd "be ok" and could "take care of himself"? I find that selfish.

OF COURSE he's getting irritated about lack of sex. Eesh...do you not know that people LIKE sex? He wants sex with his wife...which is a good thing.

I don't buy the "i was too busy" crap. Marriage and sex should be 1st priority. Sorry...don't buy those excuses. If you work too hard and too much and don't have time for your marriage, then your husband saw that you were choosing your life over your live together. You have to MAKE intimacy a priority.

If you don't nurture your relationship, it will die...and it seems like it did. 

I don't know what to tell you on how to bring him back around....besides getting your hormones checked and regulated AND making time for the two of you DAILY.


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## 1tired (Jun 23, 2012)

WorkingOnMe said:


> Wow, why on earth are you still married? Do you get off on torturing people you supposedly love?


Actually, I don't get off at all, which is a big part of the problem.


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## 1tired (Jun 23, 2012)

tacoma said:


> I don`t think you should.


You may be right, but it is sad just the same


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

1tired said:


> Actually, I don't get off at all, which is a big part of the problem.


So, because you can't get off, you can't get your husband off? 



I don't understand.


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## 1tired (Jun 23, 2012)

Well that was just a tongue in cheek response, lol. Probably misplaced in this thread.


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

Did you try to fix your issues?


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## 1tired (Jun 23, 2012)

No, I don't take HRT because it is unsafe. It is no longer recommended as risks far outweigh the benefits, especially in someone predisposed to any hormonally driven cancer, as I am. I did try bioidentical hormones for a while and they didn’t do a thing. Also tried DHEA, which was equally worthless.

Sex hurts because I have atrophic vaginitis secondary to surgical onset menopause. We have tried every lube on the market, nothing makes it tolerable.
I do think that discussing my husband’s sexual proclivities would be disrespectful, so I will refrain there. Suffice it to say, while not immoral or illegal, they run to the atypical.

No oral because, in all honestly, I think it is revolting. I am simply not putting that in my mouth. That is not at all new, he was aware from the beginning that that would never be a part of our relationship.

Yes, I know most people enjoy sex. I did, too, at one time. I wish things were different, but they are what they are. I’ve been trying to make the best of it and do it once in a while for him, because I do love him. Unfortunately, it is really hard for me to even fake it anymore; he just gets upset when it is clear I’m not interested and performing out of a sense of obligation only. He wants me to want him. Well I don’t, and I can’t really help that. ☹ I don’t want anyone. It isn’t personal. 

And you may be right about the rest. I guess we might just both have to accept that there is nowhere to go from here. Thanks for your feedback


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

"That" is your man's penis. Something amazing and beautiful and part of your husband.

I'd be horrified if my husband referred to my vagina as "that". How sad your husband must feel to know you think his body is repulsive. 

Wow.

Well, good luck to you. I think your marriage is over. Your husband seems to have turned off because of the resentment and rejection over the years.


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## 1tired (Jun 23, 2012)

I appreciate you objective thoughts. I am sad to admit you are more than likely right.

Thanks for your time.


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

I assure you it 'is' personal.


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## tacoma (May 1, 2011)

1tired said:


> I do think that discussing my husband’s sexual proclivities would be disrespectful, so I will refrain there. Suffice it to say, while not immoral or illegal, they run to the atypical.


You don`t need to discuss them but I believe most here will have a hard time believing your husbands "proclivities" are really all that "Atypical" coming from a woman who finds oral sex repulsive.

That "proclivity" is quite "atypical" in itself.

I am truly sorry for your health troubles, I`m more sorry for your husbands trouble however.


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## tacoma (May 1, 2011)

WorkingOnMe said:


> I assure you it 'is' personal.


It`s about as personal as it gets.


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## 1tired (Jun 23, 2012)

I don't want pity about having had cancer 8 years ago. It's gone, I'm not dying, lol. I have some residual problems that have profoundly affected our sex life, but that is the only reason it matters. Perhaps you are correct and my husbands interests are not as unusual as I think them to be, but again out of respect, I will not detail them here. I don't think it really matters anyway. He's no Jerry Sandusky. The only point is that I have never shared them, but tolerated them. He knows, has always known, this. Just as he has always known that oral sex will never be part of our relationship. He chose to get married knowing this, and doesn't ask for it. I only brought it up because it does seem significant in light of the fact that vaginal intercourse is painful, and I anticipated that someone would offer it as an alternative. I wanted to provide a snapshot of the whole situation in the original post to provide the context and get the most helpful and targeted responses.


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## 1tired (Jun 23, 2012)

_coming from a woman who finds oral sex repulsive...

...That "proclivity" is quite "atypical" in itself._


Really? It seems most women I know hate oral sex. Although admittedly, they are not a good sample size! I am very aware that my aversion to sex itself is abnormal. It is the thing I most wish I could change about myself. I have tried. The therapist kept saying "fake it till you make it." Well all "faking it" has done it make me resentful (unfairly so). 

_ I`m more sorry for your husbands trouble however._


yes, so am I, for the kids as well, obviously. They all have a good life now that will be shattered if I leave. It is hard to know that if leaving for my husband's sake is in the best interest of my children.  Very, very hard to know what is the right thing.

Sorry for the cut and pasting, I don't know how to multi or selectively quote.


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## 1tired (Jun 23, 2012)

that_girl said:


> I don't buy the "i was too busy" crap. Marriage and sex should be 1st priority. Sorry...don't buy those excuses. If you work too hard and too much and don't have time for your marriage, then your husband saw that you were choosing your life over your live together. You have to MAKE intimacy a priority.
> 
> If you don't nurture your relationship, it will die...and it seems like it did.
> 
> I don't know what to tell you on how to bring him back around....besides getting your hormones checked and regulated AND making time for the two of you DAILY.


I do bear 100% of the responsibility with regard to our sex life. I own that. I'd like to point out, in case you missed it, that my husband would prefer that I take on extra work responsibilities so that he does not have to work or change his lifestyle. He _wants_ me to work 2 weekends a month. These would be 12 hour shifts, probably overnight. He is not willing to be a partner in that sense anymore than I have been in the sexual sense. Also, since he is home alone most all day every day, he could meditate or exercise at any time, so why he has to get up at 4am is beyond me. If he didn't get up so early, we might be able to spend time together in the evenings. He is very inflexible about some things. Honestly, how many adults do you know that go to bed at 8:30pm that don't have to? 

Anyway, the nurturing the relationship part is a two way street IMO. Leaving out the sex part, I do my very best in that regard. I don't see him trying at all.


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## 1tired (Jun 23, 2012)

Thanks for your thoughtful reply. We have talked about getting divorced in the past, and a big part of me would really prefer just to be "best friends." He would be free to pursue the kinds of sexual relationships he wants and we could raise our kids together still, but he says I can't have that, it's all or nothing. If we are to divorce, it is his intention to take our kids back to his hometown and I lose them all. It doesn't seem fair that I lose my whole family because of something I cannot help.


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

Well of course he wants you to work more. If you're not putting out you might as well be making money.


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## 1tired (Jun 23, 2012)

I suppose in the meantime I'll take that weekend position and it will have the added bonus of getting me off the hook the only two nights we are together anyway, lol. He will have his toys and the kids and I will hang out week nights. I guess when he gets fed up enough with that he'll leave me. Either that or he will stay because he doesn't want to have to give up the lifestyle my income provides him, but I hope we don't keep fighting all the time, I suppose there is no way for it to be a non-issue.  

A big part of me thinks we had a lousy therapist. I was hoping someone here might have some insight or a suggestion that he did not. I am desperate for something that could be helpful to resolve this conflict. I'll keep checking in, but I admit I'm feeling a little attacked and probably won't keep trying to defend a situation I cannot fully explain.


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

Here's some insight. When he stops being mad about it you'll know he finally found a mistress


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## 1tired (Jun 23, 2012)

I'd be OK with that, honestly, if I knew it was just for sex. I'd be stricken, obviously, by an emotional affair. He is very interested in threesomes and "swinging." I've told him to "go on without me" more than once. He got very angry, so now I just don't say anything.


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## momtwo4 (May 23, 2012)

Wow. She has had a hysterectomy! I really don't think that some of you understand what it is like to NEVER climax and to have no physical desire for sex. 

I think I understand a little of how you feel and it stinks. I have trouble with my drive as it is (and I have not had a hysterectomy). 

Is sex so painful that you can hardly tolerate it? I wouldn't give up on finding a solution to make it less painful for you. There has to be some way that you can make sex work for both of you. Maybe you could pleasure him by hand and then with lots of lubrication let him go partly inside you? (sorry if tmi) Or if it gets too painful, finish him by hand. 

I realize that it is literally no fun not to climax during sex (I haven't yet), but I believe that it is "worth it" to pleasure my husband. Even though I don't climax, I still get a lot out of it because it makes him SO happy. It is amazing how only twenty minutes can transform a man. My husband is so much easier to be around when he gets regular sex from me. 

Don't give up on your marriage. Get creative and find a way to make it work for you and for him. Best wishes to you!


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

You're the husband. How's that feel?


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

I'm just full of compassion.


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## momtwo4 (May 23, 2012)

WorkingOnMe said:


> I'm just full of compassion.


I deleted my post, Working. I was out of line, I think. I realize you have reason to feel strongly about this particular issue.


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

It's cool. She triggered me a little so you were actually right to call me on it.


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

I suppose the issue is that if you're throwing in the towel, sex is only a part of it, probably a small part. There's not much of a 'couple' here. But if you feel guilty about throwing in the towel, you should examine that, apart from sex as perhaps a broader set of problems and issues.


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## 1tired (Jun 23, 2012)

momtwo4 said:


> Wow. She has had a hysterectomy! I really don't think that some of you understand what it is like to NEVER climax and to have no physical desire for sex.
> 
> I think I understand a little of how you feel and it stinks. I have trouble with my drive as it is (and I have not had a hysterectomy).
> 
> ...


The best way I can describe it is that it feels like rubbing sandpaper on a canker sore or open ulcer. It hurts like hell. It brings tears to my eyes, which upsets him. I usually bleed anywhere from a little to quite a bit, which also upsets him He thinks I am exaggerating. As if I could bleed on purpose. If he were satisfied with a hand job from me, I could handle that but his feeling is "I could do that myself." In his perfect scenario, he wants intercourse at least once a week, which seems unfathomable to me. It takes me at least 10 days to recover and not have excruciating burning every time I urinate. Weekly is out of the question. In therapy, we settled on intercourse once a month, which I did for a long time without complaint. As time has gone on, it just gets more unbearable and I just don't want to do it anymore and I can't make him understand.

He is very happy after we have sex. For two weeks following he is the perfect husband in every respect and I am constantly falling in love with him all over again. Then he starts getting increasingly hostile until we go through it all over again. 

16 years is a lot to throw away over sex!


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

16 years is a long time. But 16 years with no sex is even longer. 

I'm sorry it's painful and you don't desire sex, but your husband does. Who is right here? No one and both of you.


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## 1tired (Jun 23, 2012)

WorkingOnMe said:


> It's cool. She triggered me a little so you were actually right to call me on it.


I don't know your background, but I am sorry if I have upset you. Why does sex have to be such a big deal? I wish you and I, and my husband, we all more content with our respective situations.

Good luck.


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## 1tired (Jun 23, 2012)

that_girl said:


> 16 years is a long time. But 16 years with no sex is even longer.
> 
> I'm sorry it's painful and you don't desire sex, but your husband does. Who is right here? No one and both of you.


I agree with all of the above. Just want to point out that for the first 8 years it was the other way around and I wanted sex more often than he did! :smthumbup: If he had complaints back then, it was that I was waking him up for sex, lol.


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

They do have testosterone cream that is not synthetic. My doc recommended it to me when I got this ovary taken out...because we weren't sure what my hormones would do. For the time being, they seem ok...all over the map actually  

Does the doctor know WHY it's painful during sex? Is there a physical issue or just a mental one?


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

I guess you had a double ovary removal and they told you your CA was hormonally driven? And you figured that surviving ovarian CA is lucky enough what with the maybe 5% long run survival rate they gave you and you beat anyway so why tempt the fates with hormonal replacement. Can't say I blame you with that. 

But having said that, 8 years or 16 isn't the total picture. You're really talking about forever. So now what?


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## 1tired (Jun 23, 2012)

I have dyspareunia and atrophic vaginitis. I did not respond to treatment.



(in response to that_girl)


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## 1tired (Jun 23, 2012)

Runs like Dog said:


> I guess you had a double ovary removal and they told you your CA was hormonally driven? And you figured that surviving ovarian CA is lucky enough what with the maybe 5% long run survival rate they gave you and you beat anyway so why tempt the fates with hormonal replacement. Can't say I blame you with that.
> 
> But having said that, 8 years or 16 isn't the total picture. You're really talking about forever. So now what?


yes, exactly for the first part

and I just don't know about "now what?" He has been asking me for sex for a few days and I am just dreading it. I deliberately picked a fight with him (about something unrelated) because I knew we'd be alone in the house this afternoon and I didn't want to. He left to cool off and I started googling support boards and found this one because we cannot go on like this.


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## momtwo4 (May 23, 2012)

1tired said:


> The best way I can describe it is that it feels like rubbing sandpaper on a canker sore or open ulcer. It hurts like hell. It brings tears to my eyes, which upsets him. I usually bleed anywhere from a little to quite a bit, which also upsets him He thinks I am exaggerating. As if I could bleed on purpose. If he were satisfied with a hand job from me, I could handle that but his feeling is "I could do that myself." In his perfect scenario, he wants intercourse at least once a week, which seems unfathomable to me. It takes me at least 10 days to recover and not have excruciating burning every time I urinate. Weekly is out of the question. In therapy, we settled on intercourse once a month, which I did for a long time without complaint. As time has gone on, it just gets more unbearable and I just don't want to do it anymore and I can't make him understand.
> 
> He is very happy after we have sex. For two weeks following he is the perfect husband in every respect and I am constantly falling in love with him all over again. Then he starts getting increasingly hostile until we go through it all over again.
> 
> 16 years is a lot to throw away over sex!


Yikes!! Well, in my opinion, it is pretty close to physically impossible for you to have vaginal intercourse right now. That sounds pretty torturous to me, and I think I'd be avoiding sex as well (who wouldn't???)

Could you find a different gynecologist?


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

Is anal painful as well? Have you tried it?


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## 1tired (Jun 23, 2012)

um, no, haven't tried it working. I could never bring myself to do that.

to tell the truth, the physical discomfort is not the major problem. I simply don't want to have sex, I have no desire for sex at all. I was willing to do it occasionally, for him, but now the physical problems are making even occasional sex even more miserable. Here it is. I don't like sex and I don't really ever want to do it, any of it, again. I'm happy with a hug and a peck on the cheek. That is really I all I need. I don't think there is much middle ground there, and I don't blame him one bit for being dissatisfied with that. I would have been very disappointed with that back in the day when I still loved sex. I stopped loving sex, but I never stopped loving him. I wish there was an answer.

I do deeply appreciate all the responses.


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

and you've tried massive amounts of water based lubricants. what about intercourse in the water, literally in the tub or jacuzzi at warm but not uncomfortable temperature.


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

If its that you simply don't want it, perhaps you could hire him a pro. Maybe even be in the room with him when she comes. Help out a bit, but without doing it yourself. I know, sounds crazy. But stop and think for a sec. It solves a lot and it's not like it's important to you anyway. 200 bucks and he's happy with you for another month.


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## Paulination (Feb 6, 2012)

You should probably divorce him. Plenty of women out there who would appreciate your husband sexually and plenty of LD men who might find your attitude a relief.

You just don't have any tools in your tool box. No oral, no anal, no HJ, sex hurts etc...


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## WillK (May 16, 2012)

I dunno. I think a lot of the other posters are being a bit hard on this woman. Hormones drive the libido and she is physiologically disabled. Would you criticize a blind man for not reading?

The husband has tolerated the situation for years. The OP has put forth effort.

I do think that the OP should be more honest with her husband. Starting fights to avoid sex sounds like the kind of thing that is harmful to the relationship, and denies the husband the opportunity to understand the real issue.

Often with an LD wife the problem typically is that she says she doesn't want sex, but in reality she just doesn't want sex with her husband and doesn't want to hurt his feelings... In this case, the wife really doesn't want sex.

For people like me who have (or had) an LD spouse who has lost the physical attraction, we have things we can do to become more attractive. These things won't help the OP.

I really think that it would be much better to be direct, open and honest about the problem. If your husband is believing the act you're putting on, he's trying to solve a problem that doesn't exist and is getting frustrated. 

Once you do that, have you considered perhaps something like a fleshlight for him to have sex with, you could maybe hold it between your legs, he can use whatever lube he wants?


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## 1tired (Jun 23, 2012)

Paulination said:


> You should probably divorce him. Plenty of women out there who would appreciate your husband sexually and plenty of LD men who might find your attitude a relief.
> 
> You just don't have any tools in your tool box. No oral, no anal, no HJ, sex hurts etc...


I do wonder about this. I wish we were on the same page. We are perfect for each other in all other respects, and we have a beautiful family. But you are right, I really don't have anything else to offer him.


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## 1tired (Jun 23, 2012)

WorkingOnMe said:


> If its that you simply don't want it, perhaps you could hire him a pro. Maybe even be in the room with him when she comes. Help out a bit, but without doing it yourself. I know, sounds crazy. But stop and think for a sec. It solves a lot and it's not like it's important to you anyway. 200 bucks and he's happy with you for another month.


I can't read your tone and I don't know if this is a serious response or if you are poking fun at me. I would not object at all if he used prostitutes. I don't want any part of it, but I could not object. He spends a lot more money than that on fly fishing stuff, lol!


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

What an empty life for him, though.

A wife who finds him repulsive sexually and picks fights so she doesn't have to touch him, wouldn't mind him seeing hooker... Sex is such a bonding time between husband and wife...it's more than just sex that he craves.


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## 1tired (Jun 23, 2012)

I didn't mean to imply that I find him repulsive. There are some sex acts I find repulsive, but that fact had never been a source of conflict-I'm prudish I guess, lol. There are some things I am just not going to do. We were having sex (great sex) before we were married. He still asked me. I guess he thought it was ok to go without those acts. I do find sex uninteresting, unfulfilling and uncomfortable.

But I agree with the rest of your post and I think what I'm really doing here today is just processing what I know is likely the end of my marriage. Picking fights without about the sprinkler system and airline luggage policies (yes really) is clearly indicative of a much bigger problem than my nonexistent sex drive. He's a very good man, a great husband and an outstanding father. He deserves better, and I think it is tie to let him go find it.

Thanks again. Best wishes to you all.


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

Please stop picking fights with him though  That's sad. Does he know how much pain intercourse causes you?

Will you do hand jobs?!


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## RClawson (Sep 19, 2011)

I have seen some pretty harsh responses on this site but to me this is over the top. I think the OP has not talked this out enough with her spouse to help him understand just where she stands at this point. I think her husband, who the OP evidently believes to be a great guy, is a azz hat at best.

For that guy to suggest that his wife go out and find more work is beyond belief. What a slug. Hey dude man up. I presently work 4 jobs. I once had a respectable corporate career and never envisioned this all those years ago but it is reality these days. 

I see no alternative at this point but a split because I doubt the OP is going to change. Sometimes things really are for worse.


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## Machiavelli (Feb 25, 2012)

RClawson said:


> For that guy to suggest that his wife go out and find more work is beyond belief. What a slug.


Correct, the husband is a slug. However, human life is about sex. Accordingly, the wife has appropriately offered the husband a permanent hall pass that he refuses to use. Most likely he suspects treachery, as this would give the wife the upper hand in the impending divorce if adultery can be used by her as grounds.


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## stoney1215 (Jun 18, 2012)

im glad to hear that they got all of your cancer with the hysterectomy . this is an issue with the women in my family also and it is terrible on relationships . 
as far as the financial aspect , your role is reversed compared to the typical relationship . it is unfair for a husband to hold against his homemaker wife that she stays home while he works his ass off and it is also unfair for you to hold it against him . that being said , get rid of the maid . if he is a stay at home dad then his job is taking care of the home and kids . if he isnt doing that then there is no reason for him to stay home . 

as for the sexual issues . it is a very hard thing to admit that sex is a major issue in a relationship . you say you do not have any interest in sex , which is completely understandable . it is in no way your fault that you have had the issues that you have had . it is also not his fault either . if you do not have any interest in ending your marriage over this then it is up to you to come up with a compromise to satisfy his sexual needs . if you can not have sex with him , and you will not give him oral , then you need to come up with something . as of right now the only option you are leaving him is to go outside of the marriage . 

maybe this could be an option . doing this behind your back without your knowledge is unacceptable . doing this with you , or with your knowledge and consent is not cheating . this may be something that is outside the box , but obviously outside the box is needed in this circumstance . if you are unwilling to compromise you are leaving him no choice but to cheat and this will eventually end your marriage .


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## Janpieter (Mar 3, 2012)

tacoma said:


> It`s about as personal as it gets.


I wonder how her husband has managed to put up with all of this for so long...No greater love, etc.


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## Drover (Jun 11, 2012)

My take, and I'll hit it point by point.

1) It's ridiculous for him to stay home an watch TV while you work. He needs to either get a job or keep house. Just tell him you're not going to support him any more.

2) Asking you to work more is idiotic if you're really working 60 hrs a week. You make the money. Deposit it in your bank account, not a joint account. Tell him the standard of living IS coming down. If he doesn't like it, get a job.

3) Sex is painful. We get it. But you're just going through every single helpful response and making excuses. Do you also have hemorrhoids, TMJ and arthritis in your hands? If he loves you and wants to be with you, he'll probably be happy with you showing him that you want him with those alternatives and a little affection and dirty talk thrown in.


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

Again though this is not strictly a marriage problem. OP has a permanent medical state which precludes addressing her biochemistry in the usual ways. With or without this husband her problems will persist. So the challenge becomes, 'What now?' What does the rest of my life look like? What if I am single - should I more or less expect that I will be alone for the rest of my life? How do I adapt to life which will most likely never involve sex or physical intimacy of any kind, forever. Is it possible to find a mate of any kind with that limitation, just as if I were, for the purposes of this discussion, a quadriplegic? What quality of life do I want and can it or should it involve anyone else?


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## lamaga (May 8, 2012)

1tired said:


> I don't know your background, but I am sorry if I have upset you. Why does sex have to be such a big deal? I wish you and I, and my husband, we all more content with our respective situations.
> 
> Good luck.


That is kind of like saying "why do you people insist on eating food every day?"

I'm very sorry for your situation, but you are the outlier here. I think you should let your husband go to find a more suitable mate.


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

The medical condition is understandable.

But the OP doesn't even want to find a compromise. 

Sex IS a big deal,OP, especially when you want it and your spouse won't give it or try something else to take away the need. That would suck.


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## COGypsy (Aug 12, 2010)

that_girl said:


> What an empty life for him, though.
> 
> A wife who finds him repulsive sexually and picks fights so she doesn't have to touch him, wouldn't mind him seeing hooker... Sex is such a bonding time between husband and wife...it's more than just sex that he craves.


Somehow I think he's consoled by his demanding days of meditation and TV watching while tired1 takes care of the money and the housekeeper takes care of the house and kids...

I'm typically HD and I'd find it hard to have sex with a winner like that....


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## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

Tired,
This is an increasingly common story. 
- H never fully develops himself as a "provider" 
- W never fully develops herself as a "sexual partner"

Honestly, I think you are getting the worst of this deal. 

Seems like a race to the bottom. 
- You are being emotionally abusive by starting fights to avoid sex - instead of just being straight with him 
- And he is being super manipulative keeping 100 percent of the financial responsibility on you




1tired said:


> I have about zero interest in sex and don't enjoy it when we do do it, which is about once a month or every other month when he gets really whiny and insistent. It's just a chore, and one that I despise. I go to great lengths to avoid it, including picking fights, and when that fails I just say no. I've been this way for about 8 years (16 year marriage), since I had to have a hysterectomy due to cancer (they got it all, I'm fine). I don't have orgasms, it hurts, and I resent being pressured to do it. It all adds up to a joyless experience. I've tried every lube in existence, they don't work for me. And I do NOT do oral, never have. I don't like receiving it either, fwiw.
> 
> However, I do love my husband and I do feel bad about this. It isn't my fault that I had to have my ovaries removed and thus have no hormones. There are other problems that predate the hysterectomy, mostly I don't like the things that turn my husband on and never have. Some of them are really a big turn off, but I tolerate it for his sake. But 75% of it is that I just have no interest. I don't look at other men, don't think about sex other than ways to avoid it, and don't masturbate. The other 25% of it is that I am the breadwinner and he stays home with the kids. I work 12 hour days 5 days a week, take call on weekends and am always writing several journal articles related to my profession. I'm exhausted.
> 
> ...


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## RClawson (Sep 19, 2011)

Machiavelli said:


> human life is about sex.


One of the top 5 most ignorant statements ever to be made on this site.


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## stoney1215 (Jun 18, 2012)

you said that oral is out of the question . why is that ? i know you stated that he knew this going in and accepted it . the circumstances of your sexual relationship have changed since you were married . 

seems to me that you have come to the decision that because of the sexual issues you no longer want to be married to him . 
it is a terrible thing to lose your your sexuality and your marriage .


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## lamaga (May 8, 2012)

RClawson said:


> One of the top 5 most ignorant statements ever to be made on this site.


Well, actually, all life is essentially about reproduction, so I'm not sure what your objection is.


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## RClawson (Sep 19, 2011)

lamaga said:


> Well, actually, all life is essentially about reproduction, so I'm not sure what your objection is.


And I am sure that is exactly what he was thinking right? This is not a semantics game. Maybe his life is about sex and although sex is an incredible thing it ain't what my life is about.


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## DTO (Dec 18, 2011)

1tired said:


> I don't want pity about having had cancer 8 years ago. It's gone, I'm not dying, lol. I have some residual problems that have profoundly affected our sex life, but that is the only reason it matters. Perhaps you are correct and my husbands interests are not as unusual as I think them to be, but again out of respect, I will not detail them here. I don't think it really matters anyway. He's no Jerry Sandusky. The only point is that I have never shared them, but tolerated them. He knows, has always known, this. Just as he has always known that oral sex will never be part of our relationship. He chose to get married knowing this, and doesn't ask for it. I only brought it up because it does seem significant in light of the fact that vaginal intercourse is painful, and I anticipated that someone would offer it as an alternative. I wanted to provide a snapshot of the whole situation in the original post to provide the context and get the most helpful and targeted responses.


Well I hear your point on not liking oral sex, and that you made it clear upfront that you would not engage in it.

BUT, his agreement that there would be no oral came at a time when you were able to have intercourse. That has changed now. From his point of view, you are able to do something for his drive but are rejecting his real needs in favor of your narrow moral views.

As far as you being the sole breadwinner, that's something that guys have been doing for generations.

As far as you being tired, that seems like a cop-out. I maintained a brutal schedule throughout the vast majority of my child's cancer fight (3 years). I worked full-time (and even earned a promotion), made all the doctors appointments, most of the housework, daily trips to the hospital when he was inpatient, oversaw his home teacher visits, etc. and still had time to cater to my ex and young child. And, I was not the one turning down sex.

I guess, at the end of day, I agree it is not your fault you have low drive and health issues. But, neither is it your husband's fault. You should be doing what you can to meet his need and not make him a co-victim of your medical issues. As far as the kids and money go, there is nothing wrong with cutting back the lifestyle - it is so commonplace that it is now stylish to consume less and conserve more. But (assuming that he is a good dad that treasures his kids) any change you make in this regard has the potential to seriously adversely impact the kids.


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## DTO (Dec 18, 2011)

COGypsy said:


> I'm typically HD and I'd find it hard to have sex with a winner like that....


I hear what you are saying and noticed he does not have a job. But, the OP talks about coming home and researchiing & writing. My take is that she probably has some sort of terminal degree (a doctorate) or a Master's degree at the very least.

Let's say she is simply much more talented than he in earning money. Is your argument that she should have married someone with more earnings potential? Maybe, but that does not help. If he's just a regular guy with regular earning potential, should he really work a ton of hours when she can make 3x the money? What would the impact to the kids be if he started working a F/T job to help out. Would it even help if the kids now have to be in daycare, etc.?

I think these two should scale back and face economic reality. I also think that the housekeeper can go and the guy can get some housework done with the kids are napping or after bedtime (SAHD = SAHM = housework along with child rearing). Then at least he will provide more value to not make it seem like she is so burdened with the prospect of being even more so.

I feel that the OP's husband could be taking the approach of "I'm not going to bust my a$$ for someone too lazy / stubborn to give a BJ". But I would encourage him nonetheless to take the high road and at least try to be more understanding of the economic situation (which is beyond both their ability to fix) and find another way to emphasize his sexual need.


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## DTO (Dec 18, 2011)

1tired said:


> I have dyspareunia and atrophic vaginitis. I did not respond to treatment.


How many different doctors or treatments did you seek? Did you get any second opinions?

I know that sometimes our bodies malfunction and there is a limit to what medicine can do. Yet, I have seen doctors simply not current on their field (even specialists) and sometimes you have to be proactive about getting the results you want.

I know a prostate cancer survivor who was seeking relief from the usual side effects of the surgery. He did his own research, questioned doctors, and challenged his medical insurance until he found the procedure he wanted and a doctor to do it (a two year process, ultimately).

If you have not done so, get online and see what else might be out there. You might consider going to a research hospital and seeing specialists who are probably the most current in the field.


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## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

1T,
This is genuinely upsetting to read. He is ok with causing you intense pain/distress to have intercourse. THAT is not ok. 

My W has pain from intercourse - menopause related stuff. Actually she has no pain - we don't have intercourse. Mostly haven't in a year or so. 

You say that other than sex and money your relationship is just great. You don't seem to get that he is every bit as determined to refuse your needs, as you are to refuse his. 

Because you find THAT part of him "repulsive", ironically you have zero chance of getting the rest of him to engage. 

I love my W - she is really fun. Thing is - she is ALSO awesomely fun in bed. And that thing you say "most" women hate/dislike/don't do - LOL. Most of the women I dated seemed to like giving and receiving. We have no tension over the lack of intercourse, the other stuff we do is really fun. 




1tired said:


> The best way I can describe it is that it feels like rubbing sandpaper on a canker sore or open ulcer. It hurts like hell. It brings tears to my eyes, which upsets him. I usually bleed anywhere from a little to quite a bit, which also upsets him He thinks I am exaggerating. As if I could bleed on purpose. If he were satisfied with a hand job from me, I could handle that but his feeling is "I could do that myself." In his perfect scenario, he wants intercourse at least once a week, which seems unfathomable to me. It takes me at least 10 days to recover and not have excruciating burning every time I urinate. Weekly is out of the question. In therapy, we settled on intercourse once a month, which I did for a long time without complaint. As time has gone on, it just gets more unbearable and I just don't want to do it anymore and I can't make him understand.
> 
> He is very happy after we have sex. For two weeks following he is the perfect husband in every respect and I am constantly falling in love with him all over again. Then he starts getting increasingly hostile until we go through it all over again.
> 
> 16 years is a lot to throw away over sex!


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## dallasapple (Jun 20, 2012)

I think what she meant by "its not personal" is that it wouldnt matter who she was married to she would have no interest in sex..its not "against" him "or any man that she is not, not interested in him its the sex..thats not the same as saying it doesnt AFFECT his personal life or affect his personal feelings that she feels that way about SEX..there is a clear difference..

He wants to be WANTED sexually and I bet my bottom $ he wants her to desire sex just for her own needs too..and so therefore wants her to want HIM to want her ..(tongue twister)..and she just doesnt but its not "becasue of him" its because of her body malfunctioning and her distaste for putting a penis in her mouth..

Maybe you should try a sex therapist?Its possible you coudl even get over the pshycoligcal hump of your aversion to oral sex?And since they are "specialist" they may have ideas on how to improve your other physical problems?

Dallas


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## 1tired (Jun 23, 2012)

I just wanted to thank everyone that gave thoughtful suggestions in effort to help. My husband and I have talked, and are unfortunately at an impasse for now. He doesn't want a divorce and doesn't want to go outside the marriage for sex. I don't want to have sex, probably ever, lol, so I don't know what will become of us. I did get him to agree to stop asking me, which is a relief. At least now I don't have to keep trying to play keep away.

I called the colleague offering me the locum tenens position, and I'm going to give it a try two weekends a month, so we will only be in the same bed at the same time 4 mights a month anyway. I don't know how he's going to deal with it, but it is what he wants for now. I don't think it's going to lead us to a happily ever after, but it is his choice, so I am going to stop feeling guilty about it.

Thanks for everything, you did help me process a lot of important things I hadn't thought through. Best of luck and love to all of you!


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## SoxFan (Jun 9, 2012)

1Tired, I know I'm late to the party here and your situation is truly tough to read but have you exhausted every medical remedy that might help you? I don't know where you live but perhaps a referral to a large teaching hospital with a top notch GYN department might offer you some new solutions. Only a suggestion as you might have already explored all the medical options available but I'd hate to see you not go down any potential road that might be able to treat your issues. All the best to you.......


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## donny64 (Apr 21, 2012)

I'm not going to berate you here. But I'll say this....I see a woman's willingness to give oral as a litmus test to what the sexual relationship will be like. If she thinks it's disgusting, does not want to do it, then "that", at least in my experience, is a pretty darned good indicator of what the sex life will be like once the honeymoon phase goes by the wayside.

Now, I see you have some physical problems. Have you tried to work through them to where some sort of sexual interaction is satisfying for you? As a man, at least for me, it is the ability to please my woman that makes sex so important. That look on her face as she has an earth shattering orgasm. The way she holds me so tight I think she's gonna crush me. The marks she leaves on my back and the bruises she leaves on my arms from hitting me becaus she's lost all control during her orgasm. THAT kind of thing CANNOT be replicated in any other way than fantastic sex with the one you love. It is very powerful and satisfying for a man to give that to a woman, and feel desired by her.

If you simply cannot enjoy sex with him, but otherwise love and adore him, are you willing to let him fulfill these "needs" with someone else? If so, maybe you can save this in some strange way. But if you want to deny him something you simply don't want, when it is something he craves, then that's being selfish. If you can't give that to him, someone else can. And maybe, you being okay with that, could save an otherwise great relationship? If you love him in all other ways but can't love him that way, then give him the ability to have those needs met elsewhere...if that works for him (and it may very well not...he may need, as I do, to only have that with someone I love), then you should let that part of this relationship go for his sake. Don't make the poor guy suffer. If that's not okay with you....again, don't make the poor guy suffer. Just let him go.


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## Mr.Stinger (Jun 27, 2012)

Hello, OP!
I have been in similar situation and may offer a radical but effective solution - get a medication which kills his sex drive. It will reduce his suffering and will save your marriage and kids.
Just do not forget that where are many ways to show love and admiration. Use them!
Sex is not the only way to show love and affection.


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## xena74 (May 5, 2012)

As the bread winner in my house I feel your pain. I work very long days (13 hr shift), with a 1 1/2 drive each way. By the time I get home, eat dinner, and catch up with my son, I am tired. I too had The big C, and had sugery. My drive was almost nothing a few years ago. 

That being said, I still make love to my husband. You say you don't matsurbate, why? Masturbation actually will get you in the mood. I do it every morning before work now. It keeps me in a "sexy" state of mind all day. That way when I finally get home at night it may still be there.

Sex hurts, then try something differant. Anal, HJ, mutual masturbation. What ever, just get the mojo back in your marriage.

PS, sounds like you've never had a real orgasim to me. If you had, you'd want to try to get it again!


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## chillymorn (Aug 11, 2010)

hes has it pretty damn good. he is trading a satisfying sex life for a life of not having to work. he gets to buy toys (fly fishing stuff) and have piles of ME time.

you would be better to divorce him before you have to pay him alimony for a long time if you wait to long. 

I would bet he is getting something on the side he has all the ingredients to do it. money(hey babe can you pick up some extra work to cover the expences) disposible time. and desire for sex.

end it as nice as you can and try to stay friendly as you raise your kids.

you might even find a man who you desire and your drive might come back once you get rid of this freeloader who thinks money that he dosn't make is more important than marraige.


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## sinnister (Dec 5, 2010)

Divorce him. He is a man and deserves sex. You are a woman who refuses to give it. Why torture him? You say you love him...let him have a happy life with someone who will enjoy him sexually.


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## t_hopper_2012 (Apr 17, 2012)

1tired,

Your thread brings up a lot of questions. 

Q: You say that your spouse is a "great husband". How would you know? It seems that the two of you never spend anytime together. He's up before you (meditating, exercising), in bed shortly after you get home and away on weekends doing his volunteer gigs (that *must* exclude you ... huh? Does he volunteer with the "He Man Woman-haters Club"?) Also, what "great husband" doesn't believe his wife when she says that sex HURTS? That tells her she's faking when she bleeds from sex? O. M. G.

Q: You say that "in all other respects, he is a perfect husband." Really? Take a closer look. You're working your tail off. He's mediating and exercising. You're busting your a$$ bringing home the cash, he's watching Judge Judy. You've got absolutely no life outside work, he's got hobbies, he's got buddies, he's got his volunteer duties. Then, when things get tight due to the economy, he says "Hey, honey, put in a few more hours why don't ya?" Those seem like pretty big lapses in perfect husband.

Q: You say that your MC didn't do you much good. Based on your comments, I agree. Why didn't you try looking for another MC? In my experience, some are great, some are just ok and some stink. If you don't like one, you've got to keep looking.

Q: How old are your kids? Are they so young that they require your husband to be at home? (Which might be one good reason for not working)

Q: What's up with this volunteer crap? Saving the world is nice, but family time is much, much more important. Or, if the kids are older, spending time alone with you. (Ok, fine, only as long as he's not chasing you around in an aroused state).

Q: Last one (and this is important). Cast your mind back to when you weren't so overburdened with work and you and your husband (coincidentally) had a fun sex life. How did it feel back then? Did it feel like you were more of a team (rather than roommates)? Do you want to get back to that feeling - like you were both in it together (rather than him riding the sled while you do all the pulling)? If so, what steps do you think it would take to get back to that state? Would it be worth one HJ, one TJ and maybe one BJ (gasp) a month on your part to get back there? Would it be worth it if he a) quit the volunteer stuff so you could spend time as a family/couple, b) worked a part-time job to help with the cash flow and c) didn't bug you for sex outside the monthly HJ/TJ/BJ?

I'd love to hear the answers to these questions 1tired. I'd love to hear them before your family breaks up any more than it already has.

Good luck.


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## Gert B Frobe (May 6, 2011)

If I were your husband, there is no speed fast enough for me to leave you. There is ZERO love on your part, despite what you say.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## TX-SC (Aug 25, 2015)

Why not just let him have a mistress for sex?


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

Gert B Frobe said:


> If I were your husband, there is no speed fast enough for me to leave you. There is ZERO love on your part, despite what you say.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Thanks for bumping a 4 year old thread.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

1tired said:


> I have about zero interest in sex and don't enjoy it when we do do it, which is about once a month or every other month when he gets really whiny and insistent. It's just a chore, and one that I despise. I go to great lengths to avoid it, including picking fights, and when that fails I just say no. I've been this way for about 8 years (16 year marriage), since I had to have a hysterectomy due to cancer (they got it all, I'm fine). I don't have orgasms, it hurts, and I resent being pressured to do it. It all adds up to a joyless experience. I've tried every lube in existence, they don't work for me. And I do NOT do oral, never have. I don't like receiving it either, fwiw.
> 
> However, I do love my husband and I do feel bad about this. It isn't my fault that I had to have my ovaries removed and thus have no hormones. There are other problems that predate the hysterectomy, mostly I don't like the things that turn my husband on and never have. Some of them are really a big turn off, but I tolerate it for his sake. But 75% of it is that I just have no interest. I don't look at other men, don't think about sex other than ways to avoid it, and don't masturbate. The other 25% of it is that I am the breadwinner and he stays home with the kids. I work 12 hour days 5 days a week, take call on weekends and am always writing several journal articles related to my profession. I'm exhausted.
> 
> ...


I wouldn't believe any woman would want to have sex with such a pathetic little boy.

He is just another one of your kids.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

WorkingOnMe said:


> Thanks for bumping a 4 year old thread.


He is targeting a lot of zombie threads.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## ThePheonix (Jan 3, 2013)

And hopeful the heroine in this short story has, by now, ditched this slug forcing him live on the street and panhandle for his next meal.


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## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

1tired,
What's interesting about this thread is the missing theme. And indeed there is a theme that is absent here. 

Compassion. On both sides of the fence. Him for you, and you for him. 

I really miss having intercourse. It's been about 5 years now. We stopped when I realized that often - it was painful for M2. And worse than that, painful at a point where I was close and she didn't want to 'ruin it' for me. She has a medical condition - a type of intermittent chronic inflammation. 

Thing is - I have no interest in contributing to such a condition. 

So I said 'that part of life is over', and that was that. M2 asks me about it now and then. Am I unhappy? Resentful? Restless?

No no and no. 

Funny thing about compassion. The real kind - not the surface type. It's somewhat contagious. Because we still have a decent sex life. 

She's excellent at other things - always has been. So we do other things. 

By the way - a skilled hand job with lube - is an exceptionally pleasant experience. 

Neither of you has shown much compassion to the other. Kind of sad. 







1tired said:


> I don't want pity about having had cancer 8 years ago. It's gone, I'm not dying, lol. I have some residual problems that have profoundly affected our sex life, but that is the only reason it matters. Perhaps you are correct and my husbands interests are not as unusual as I think them to be, but again out of respect, I will not detail them here. I don't think it really matters anyway. He's no Jerry Sandusky. The only point is that I have never shared them, but tolerated them. He knows, has always known, this. Just as he has always known that oral sex will never be part of our relationship. He chose to get married knowing this, and doesn't ask for it. I only brought it up because it does seem significant in light of the fact that vaginal intercourse is painful, and I anticipated that someone would offer it as an alternative. I wanted to provide a snapshot of the whole situation in the original post to provide the context and get the most helpful and targeted responses.


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