# !!! Help !!! Newbie family Problems. From "Kumbaya" to Devastated



## bobsofi (Jul 27, 2013)

Hi all,

We need your advice.

My family not accepting divorce... horrible

BACKGROUND

5 sisters in their 50’s, parents in their 80’s. Great family, very close, never any interaction problems.

2 years ago, a sister (we will call her Suzy) leaves her seemingly terrific husband (we will call him Fred) of 30 years, for a gay women (we will call her Mary). Suzy has been having an affair with Mary for 6 months. Suzy leaves Fred (Fred has a terrific personality and makes over $50k a month), Suzy moves in with her lover Mary. Suzy has several adult children, the youngest away at college.

None of us had any idea that Suzy and Fred were not happy. 

Suzy tells the family she is divorcing Fred, to live with Mary. The family is shocked, reacts angrily, and quickly figures out that Suzy will collect a large lump sum divorce settlement, and lengthy and large spousal support; and from my point of view, the disapproving family members envision Suzy as abandoning her children, and frolicking off into an undeserved life of sinful leisure. 

The family immediately rallies around Fred, and invites Fred to holidays (Fred was never very involved before). Suzy is told… Mary is not welcome at family events. Future family events are organized to minimize the involvement of Suzy. Suzy’s children and Fred are invited, and attend, without Suzy’s knowledge.

I am the husband of the only sister that is supportive of Suzy. I am also very supportive of Suzy. My feelings are, Suzy has always been level headed, an intelligent kind soul, that was an integral part of the prior family “Kumbaya” success. We all make mistakes and divorce can be ugly. Suzy would not make the decision to leave Fred for Mary without careful consideration. Suzy, by far and away, deserves to be accepted, unconditionally. 

The 3 sisters and the mom whom object, say it is not a gay issue, they say it is an infidelity issue, and how horrible the home wrecker Mary is. They will talk on and on about how great a guy Fred is, and how wrong Suzy was to leave him. What a horrible thing she is doing to the children. They will say things like “I just can't seem to get over this”. “ I am not comfortable supporting this wrong”.

This has gone along now for nearly 2 years. It is tiresome for me and my wife, to interact with the other members of her family, that so strongly disapprove of Suzy decisions.

Anyway, my life experience mental play book tells me. Be patient. Set the example. They will come around.

Now my wife and I are thinking. Distance ourselves from these people. Experiencing their point of view, actions and statements is painful. 

This family was so “kumbaya” great, and now, sadly, is catastrophically broken.

??? What do you all suggest ???




I have seen many angry problem family's. This family that was so Kumbaya. It was amazing. It is hard to watch it whither.

!!! Thanks in Advance !!!


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## CEL (May 7, 2013)

She cheated while married yes people have issues and I don't know thae marriage but look at it this way.

1. She betrayed her vows

2. She betrayed his trust

3. She betrayed his love

4. She betrayed her kids

5. She betrayed his friendship

So I am not saying she should not if gotten divorced but cheating for 6 months is a hell if a character flaw. In addition the family is having to deal with the fact she betrayed their friend. If you betray my friend in that way you are dead to me otherwise what is friendship? How do you think Fred would feel to see them together at these events? How do you think the kids would feel?

You are upset because the family had not forgiven her. Well has she ever even really fessed up to how much pain she has caused her family and children? Not to mention the huge wrong she did to her husband? Go to the infidelity section and read some if the longer threads having a spouse cheat on you causes irreparable harm to a person for life. He will never have a relationship that is not tainted by her cheating. As he will never trust the same way again. His relationship's with women will forever be clouded with distrust. He now knows intimately that even your best friend is capable and willing to torture him.


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## bobsofi (Jul 27, 2013)

CEL said:


> She cheated while married yes people have issues


Thanks for your response CEL. You seem to have a similar passion and point of view that the other family members hold.

Suzy is humble and has apologized.

So, Suzy, Mary and we should, distance ourselves? It is hopeless?

We should treat this as... Over? Done? Finished? Forget It? Move On?

???

Do you think you could ever have a close relationship with Suzy? (if you were a family member)?

What do you think we should do?


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## CEL (May 7, 2013)

What she did is pretty bad, is it unforgivable that is each persons decision what she has to do is make it up to Frank. When he has become okay with it and able to move on his friends "the family" will be more willing to forgive. 

What has she done on that front? The truth is her girlfriend may never be welcome when Frank is there that may be the price she has to pay.

Questions

Q
1. What has she done to make amends? Yes she is divorced but she still engaged in behavior that completely betrayed a friend now his friends can't forgive her. She has to realize that just because they are divorced does not suddenly take that wrong away.

2. How are the kids?

3. How did the affair happen? Was she a mutual friend? Did she do it in the marital home? Was there a lot of lying? These are important as the severity of the betrayal is going to dictate the to take to get her accepted again.


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## bobsofi (Jul 27, 2013)

CEL said:


> what she has to do is make it up to Frank.


Interesting, we did not think of that resolution path; suggesting to Suzy that she become as friendly as possible, as quickly as possible, with Frank.

We have talked about her becoming friendlier with Frank over the long term, but that was in respect to having her children feeling optimally at peace.

We are actually proud of Suzy. Our point of view, is that no one should have to live in a relationship unhappy and suffering, and it must even be horrible for a gay person to also have to live a strait life in the closet. Over the prior years, Frank stubbornly refused to go to counselling, and when he did, he was reluctant and un-involved. 

The relationship with her children has been rough also. Frank makes huge $, and Frank & Suzy's kids enjoy a piece of that every month, being in their 20's (cars, vacations, credit cards, cell phones, etc). Frank has a big cash advantage, and to mid 20's kids accustomed to a cash lifestyle, cash is king. Also, the gay issue has likely been shocking and hard on their kids. 

Mary is an openly gay gal that was a team mate of Suzy's in a social group sport (like a softball team). Suzy tells me that Mary did not home wreck anything. Suzy made the choice to approach Mary. Mary is a nice person, worthy of acceptance; and because Suzy wants that, then absolutely!

As I understand it, Frank is not so happy right now, he has to write a very large support check every month to Suzy, and, as I understand it, Frank is not dating yet, after 2 years, and he has a terrific personality, a genius mind, and fantastic sense of humor.

Suzy's long term history is as one of the kindest, most deserving persons that I have ever met. Sure, everyone rants and rants about... the should'a... the could'a... the would'a; but the past is history, the future is all that matters, and the future is a choice, the choice to condemn and disassociate Suzy, or to forgive and accept Suzy

Thanks for the keen insight, a great suggestion!

Any other words of wisdom?


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## ThreeStrikes (Aug 11, 2012)

How would you react if your wife does to you what Suzy did to Frank?

And then you had to continue to financially support your cheating ex-wife?

It's not hard to understand why Frank, and friends/family of his, have hard feelings towards Suzy.

Being on the receiving end of a betrayal of that magnitude sucks.

Nobody likes a cheater. 

If you prefer to take sides with Suzy and Mary, then by all means do so.

I prefer to associate with people of integrity. Most people do not like to be associated with cheaters and liars.


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

I think its high time the family gets over it. She cheated on her husband, not them, and while what she did was wrong, I think she has been punished more than enough. Bottom line, they are family.


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## CEL (May 7, 2013)

Ummm you say it is time for them to get over it because life goes on right and everyone makes mistakes. Yeah you are not getting how much of a betrayal this is for Frank. Until you understand that you are not going to get anywhere.

When you go to an addiction program you learn about making amends. That means not just saying you are sorry but taking someone's pain as your own. For understanding that you have caused those scars on them. Until she and by extension you get this and start understanding the depth of the damage she did to him you will always be at step one.

Reread my first post this time without your conceived perception. You have a best friend? Now imagine that they had a wife who betrayed him for 6 months. Would you tell him to just get over it and move on? How about if your kids had a spouse that betrayed them like that?

Frank spent days crying his heart out. Frank felt that he was worthless I mean if your wife won't even be true to you then you must be worthless. Frank now when he thinks about a women thinks that she will betray him he flashes back to that every time. I encourage you to go to the infidelity section and read some of the threads.

Suzy betrayed a person who was at least a close friend she could of divorced before it went sexual. She could of divorced when she was unhappy. She decided that instead of that she was going to betray her husband, kids, honor and integrity. This is the worst choice she could make.

So I am going to say that she has never really owned up to the magnitude of what she did. It sounds like she is sorry about it but I would bet she follows up with how unhappy she was and other reasons. Here is the problem she had other choices and chose the worst. If you want we can talk actions she can do to make real amends BUT if she only wants something out of it then it will not work.

I think she can get this on the right track but not until she has remorse.


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## ThreeStrikes (Aug 11, 2012)

3Xnocharm said:


> Bottom line, they are family.


Never a reason to rationalize or tolerate abusive behavior. You can't choose your family.


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## greenfern (Oct 20, 2012)

I also think its not really any of the family's business. 

If a member of my family did something which I considered immoral or unethical would I cut them out of my lives? I would [possibly] express my disapproval but ultimately it was their choice not mine and I would probably keep them in my life. 

I agree with the other posters if Suzy & Frank can get along (maybe once Frank meets someone else?) it will probably make the other family members more accepting of her decision. Unfortunately Mary may be left out of the equation for good I doubt they would ever accept her. 

I feel sorry for Suzy if she has lived her whole life denying her sexuality and then when she gets the courage to leave (not withstanding obviously the 6 months cheating) she is rejected by her family (other than the OP!)


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## CEL (May 7, 2013)

They where married for what looks like over 20 years. The family in that circumstance looks at Frank as family.

I have a sister who cheats all the time married 4 time cheated on all of the with multiple guys. When you meet her you would never know she seems nice and has a great personality. I don't have anything to do with her because I know who she really is. A lier. A cheater. A user. I have no time in my life for that.


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## Thor (Oct 31, 2011)

You and all the other members of the family are entitled to your opinions and feelings about what Suzy did. None of you are wrong, and none of you are right. You just have your views about the situation.

I think you have 2 choices. You can disengage from the rest of your family if they irritate you with their behaviors such as discussing Suzy and voicing their feelings and opinions. Or, you can tell them that this whole topic is toxic to the rest of the family and you would like to have the topic avoided when possible.

Think of it as a boundary you set. You will not tolerate being in a situation where Mary is too much of a discussion topic. They can abide by your boundary or not. If the don't, you remove yourself from them.

You cannot control whether they talk about Mary. You can tell them how you feel about the discussions, and you can tell them you find it unpleasant enough that you will remove yourself from being with them if the topic remains too much in conversation.


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## Thor (Oct 31, 2011)

You and all the other members of the family are entitled to your opinions and feelings about what Suzy did. None of you are wrong, and none of you are right. You just have your views about the situation.

I think you have 2 choices. You can disengage from the rest of your family if they irritate you with their behaviors such as discussing Suzy and voicing their feelings and opinions. Or, you can tell them that this whole topic is toxic to the rest of the family and you would like to have the topic avoided when possible.

Think of it as a boundary you set. You will not tolerate being in a situation where Mary is too much of a discussion topic. They can abide by your boundary or not. If the don't, you remove yourself from them.

You cannot control whether they talk about Mary. You can tell them how you feel about the discussions, and you can tell them you find it unpleasant enough that you will remove yourself from being with them if the topic remains too much in conversation.


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