# Last ditch attempt to fix this



## scottdadoftwins (Apr 15, 2014)

Ok - it's a long story - here goes. I don't want to hurt her, but I cannot image staying married anymore. I have contacted an attorney and he wants me to file, get a restraining order and an order of temporary support. I just can't imagine doing this to someone. We're making one last ditch effort in couples therapy. Am I crazy?

Married 15 years this May. First 5 were very good. We had it all (except kids). Her mom and dad divorced. The primary reason was that he had 2 affairs. After the second affair, he confided in my wife and she told her mom. The divorce was not messy but I was shocked that she outed him after she confided in her. I don't think she intended for her mom to cut it off like that. I think she was trying to help them. Her dad died a year after the divorce and she was devastated. 
From day one I was the romantic, supportive, thinking optimistically, looking to help kind of guy. People often told me I was that guy that rarely comes along and that my wife was very lucky to have me. I believed in spending a lot of time together, sharing everything. I developed interests in line with hers, abandoned some of my own because she had no interest in them, and life was pretty good most of the time. That said, I was NOT perfect. I was a bit of a hot head but I never raised anything other than my voice. Like that old song, treat her like a lady. Always writing extra poetic stuff in card for every occasion. Thinking of her at every turn. Always giving 100%. Frequently changing my mind (giving in) when we were at odds on what to do, where to go, what movie to see, etc...
Then there was the 6 years of infertility which took a huge emotional and financial toll. Ultimately we had twins who are now in grade school. During the infertility phase she was in a very dark place. The MD said her uterus was not working properly and could not carry children. She ended up on Prozac which barely helped. Her breakdowns were frequent but I did all I could to support her. But not enough and I would occasionally lose my cool because she refused to stay focused and positive. Instead she was sullen, self-critical, and very very depressed. It culminated in 4 events which probably defined our future. 
1) She had what I believe to be an emotional affair with a guy at work (she denies, but the evidence points to the contrary). 2) She totally lost it after the second miscarriage and ate a handful of Advil. I called the cops and she went to the ER. 3) after the 3rd or 4th miscarriage she lost it again and "wanted to die" and ran outside. I gave chase, got angry, said some stupid stuff and the neighbor overheard and called the cops and 4) she got a DUI, lied and said she was alone when she was in fact with that guy from item #1.
Before the kids she was occasionally critical of me but nothing I could not handle, I'm in sales (thick skin). The criticism grew through the infertility period and leveled off when the kids were born. Then things started to escalate again. More and more I felt irrelevant, that my opinions did not really count, and I could not do enough to keep myself out of the dog house. I got a therapist (which she thought was "stupid") and started working on ways to improve myself and hopefully the relationship. She refused to see a shrink except for the Prozac doc who was required after the suicide attempt (once a month). By the time the kids were 3 I felt like I could not get anything right. She grew more and more intolerant. It felt like she was taking advantage to my willingness to give in. Frequently she would not back down until she got what she wanted. One night I forgot my therapist appt until the last minute, called her and told her and she forced me to cancel it so she could meet a friend for dinner. I begged her not to make me cancel it because I had overlooked the last appt too and I felt badly about doing that. I was pretty upset. Moreover, she never admitted guilt to stuff she was obviously guilty of. When she backed into my car and I proved it showing dent height and paint marks she said "well if I did hit your car I didn't know I did that”. 
I started travelling extensively for work and got involved with someone else for a short time. This other person thought i was the BEST (everything) in the whole world... I bought into it for a while but ultimately we parted. Deep down I knew I was fooling myself in a very bad way and it had to end. I ended it and she begged me back a few times. Before it was completely over, as you might expect I got caught. I cut all ties, and I never did it again but the damage was done. The level of devastation cannot be described. She was wrecked. And I was guilty but I was also firmly committed to fixing what I broke. So for the past 4 years I have done everything in my power to restore trust. But no matter how open my book was, it was not enough. She read into everything, and everything was a sure sign I was cheating. It was frustrating to keep up with that. I went back into therapy and we saw a couple’s counselor. She saw a counselor too. But the couple’s thing stopped quickly because she "could not believe" I would tell the therapist such and such. She also stopped seeing her therapist because that therapist was telling her a divorce was the best option. I kept on seeing mine for about 3 years and only stopped after we had some couples sessions with my therapist. Things improved a little, but the trust was still totally gone and did not seem like it was going to ever come back. I remain faithful to this day.
My therapist also told me privately that I could not make her happy or make her trust me. She needed to find her happy place on her own and she needed to trust me, or the relationship was likely doomed. 
In the last 4 years she has devolved into a more miserable and very unhappy person. She gained 40 pounds, eats unhealthy, sits on the couch, shops like crazy, threatens suicide, leaving me, and other horrible thoughts (including saying this crazy stuff in front of the kids). SHe wanted a $12K tummy tuck and I agreed. She has since gained back all the weight and more. She spent all our money and racked up more than $100K in debt. When she did that I put my foot down (3 years ago) and told her to never touch the home equity line of credit again. When she wanted to move to Florida and I agreed; provided we could save the entire down payment and get some of this crazy debt retired. Instead, and without my knowledge, she quietly racked up an additional $100K+ in debt in 18 months. She even dug into the home equity line again without telling me. The spending is crazy. Vacations, decoration for the house, $13K in her clothes, etc. All the while, I’m asking her, can we really afford this kind of spending? 
When I took over paying the bills she went ballistic and told me I would not be able to do it. Basically she inferred I was not smart enough to handle paying the bills. So I agreed to let her help me with them and the weekly bill paying meetings are filled with her anger. She threw a Starbucks cup across the room in a screaming fit when I made it a requirement that we follow the new budget to the letter. No "want" spending… only "need" spending until we are well above water. I created a 16 month budget that mapped out a plan to get us completely debt free. I used the prior year expenses to figure the budget. Nothing in it is unrealistic.
She is using sadness, anger, threats, and relentless arguing to get what she wants. She refuses any kind of therapy, she blames me (or anyone but herself) for all the problems in her world, she has zero empathy, she fears another affair by me (and I practically never leave the house except to go and from work). 
I'm ready to leave. A week ago she basically told me all her threats of suicide and leaving were manipulations to get me to give in to her. Example: I wanted to sell a timeshare to retire some of the debt and she went crazy screaming you have me, I hate you, I want a divorce, maybe I will just kill myself, - all with the kids in the next room.
When I told her I was contemplating divorce she said she would do couples counseling. But before that, she thought therapy was stupid and a waste of time and money... and she did not want me to see a therapist either because I “always pick an out of network provider”.
I'm concerned that my wife's approach to adversity or conflict with me is to go supernova until I back down. I'm concerned about bipolar disorder underlying all of this since it runs in her family and there have been some crazy spending that put us in a deep hole. I'm concerned about co-dependence since there are a lot of signs of that going on. I'm concerned about depression driving some scary behavior in my spouse. I'm concerned about suicide attempts since we've already been through one. I'm concerned for the safety of our children given my wife's past threats and gestures. Finally, I'm concerned that my wife has only agreed to therapy at this time to help me with “my” problems.


----------



## Uptown (Mar 27, 2010)

scottdadoftwins said:


> I'm concerned that my wife's approach to adversity or conflict with me is to go supernova until I back down. I'm concerned about *bipolar disorder *underlying all of this since it runs in her family....


Perhaps she does have bipolar, Scott. The deep anger and event-triggered rages, however, are more of a warning sign for BPD (Borderline Personality Disorder). Or she could have both. I say this because a 2008 study (funded by NIMH) found that 36% of bipolar-1 sufferers also have full-blown, co-occurring BPD. I therefore suggest you speak with your therapist about her behavior issues.

I also suggest you take a look at my description of the differences I've seen between the behaviors of bipolar sufferers (e.g., my foster son) and BPDers (e.g., my exW). That description appears in my post at 12 Bipolar/BPD Differences. If the BPD traits sound very familiar, I also would suggest you see my list of BPD warning signs at 18 Warning Signs. If those descriptions ring many bells, I would be glad to discuss them with you. 

I caution, however, that if your W actually has a lifetime pattern of strong BPD traits, you almost certainly would have seen some of them periodically during the first 5 years of your marriage -- a period for which you report no difficulties. Hence, if her unstable behavior, lack of trust, hostility, and reckless spending have only occurred since your affair took place three years ago, a more logical explanation is that you are simply seeing the vengeful behavior of an angry, betrayed woman. Another possibility -- indeed the most common cause of emotional instability -- is a hormone change, as occurs in women her age who are going through perimenopause. Take care, Scott.


----------



## scottdadoftwins (Apr 15, 2014)

Thank you for your thoughts. I hope she will consider therapy a way to make herself well. I looked at the list and I am worried. I see your point about the affair as a trigger for vengeance. For me, bad memories fade in reflection, and during the first 5 years some of these were present, although seemingly not as pronounced as they are today. 

Also see your point about hormonal changes. 

She saw the couple’s therapist today. When I asked her how it went she said it was tough. I go on Monday. I feel like a horrible person for not being able to love and adore her. She was my soul mate and I looked up to her in so many ways. But the "give me" attitude permeates so much of her thinking that I now feel totally empty. I feel like I have run out of gas. I realize it is looking more like a decision based my ability to tolerate her behavior. 

•	Often: Black-white thinking, wherein she categorizes everyone as "all good" or "all bad" and will recategorize someone -- in just a few seconds -- from one polar extreme to the other based on a minor infraction; 
•	Often: Frequent use of all-or-nothing expressions like "you always" and "you never;" 
•	Often: Controlling behavior that tries to isolate you away not only from close friends (as you mention) but also from close family members; 
•	Often (with cause): Irrational jealousy and inability to trust you for extended periods; 
•	Often (devalues first): Flipping, on a dime, between adoring you and devaluing you; 
•	Often: Frequently creating drama over issues so minor that neither of you can recall what the fight was about the next day; 
•	Very Often: Low self esteem; 
•	Often: Verbal abuse and anger that is easily triggered, in seconds, by a minor thing you say or do (real or imagined); 
•	Often (follows arguments): Fear of abandonment or being alone; 
•	Often: Always being "The Victim," a false self image she validates by blaming you for every misfortune; 
•	Often (spending): Lack of impulse control, wherein she does reckless things without considering the consequences (e.g., binge eating or spending); 
•	Rare: Complaining that all her previous BFs were abusive and claiming that you are the only one that has treated her well; 
•	Possibly: Mirroring your personality and preferences so perfectly (e.g., enjoying everything and everyone you like) -- for the first six months of your relationship -- that you were convinced you had met your "soul mate;" 
•	Possibly: Relying on you to center and ground her, giving her a sense of direction because her goals otherwise keep changing every few months; 
•	Often (indirectly): Relying on you to sooth and calm her down, when she is stressed, because she has so little ability to do self-soothing; 
•	True (has 1 close friend here and 3 in another state); Having many casual friends but not any close long-term friends (unless they live a long distance away); 
•	True: Taking on the personality of whatever person she is talking to, thereby acting quite differently around different types of people; and 
•	Absolutely True: Always convinced that her intense feelings accurately reflect reality -- to the point that she regards her feelings as self-evident facts, despite her inability to support them with any hard evidence (e.g., her conviction that you had been stalking her).


----------



## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

No matter what, she needs mental help. Start documenting everything she does and take it to a lawyer. Let the lawyer tell you what rights you have in regard to forcing her to get treatment or you contacting her doctor, etc.

Do it for your kids.


----------



## Hicks (Jan 14, 2011)

Agree with the above.

Lawyer is your best bet. You can't diagonse and cure someone. But you sure can try to protect yourself and your children.


----------



## Uptown (Mar 27, 2010)

scottdadoftwins said:


> She saw the couple’s therapist today.


Scott, if your W is exhibiting most of the BPD warning signs -- as you seem to suspect -- her seeing a MC likely will be a waste of time because her issues go far beyond a simple lack of communication skills (which MCs are so good at teaching). I therefore offer the following suggestions:

*As an initial matter,* I recommend that you NOT tell her that you are worried about her possibly having strong BPD traits. If she is a BPDer, she almost certainly will project the accusation right back onto you, believing YOU to be the BPDer. Instead, simply encourage her to see a good psychologist (not a MC) and let the psych decide what to tell her.

*Second,* if you think you may stay with her a while, I suggest you get _Stop Walking on Eggshells_, the best-selling BPD book targeted to spouses like you. Or, if you decide to get a divorce instead, get _Splitting: Protecting Yourself while Divorcing Someone with Borderline or Narcissistic Personality Disorder._ Both books are written by the same author.

*Third,* I suggest you start participating (or at least lurking) at BPDfamily.com -- the largest and most active BPD forum I've found that is devoted fully to the spouses and family members of BPDers. This issue is such an enormous problem that that website is growing by 20 new members every day. The result is that it offers eight separate message boards on various BPD issues. The ones that likely will be most helpful to you are the "Staying" board, "Leaving" board, and "Parenting after the Split" board.

*Fourth,* while you are at BPDfamily.com, I suggest you read the excellent articles in their resources section. My favorite is #9 at *BPDfamily Articles*. I also recommend you read my more detailed description of BPD warning signs at my post in *Maybe's Thread*.

*Fifth,* I suggest you see a clinical psychologist -- for a visit or two by yourself -- to obtain a candid professional opinion on what it is you and the kids are dealing with -- and how likely it is she may pass it on to them. As I've explained in other threads, your best chance of getting a candid opinion regarding a possible BPD diagnosis is to NOT have the BPDer along. Therapists generally are loath to tell high functioning BPDers the name of the disorder. Hence, when BPD is a strong possibility, it is important to obtain an opinion from a professional who is ethically bound to protect YOUR best interests, not hers.

*Finally*, Scott, please don't forget those of us on this TAM forum. We want to keep trying to answer your questions and providing emotional support as long as you find our shared experiences helpful. Moreover, by sharing your own experiences here, you likely are helping many other members and lurkers.


----------



## scottdadoftwins (Apr 15, 2014)

Uptown, It's hard to accept this will be passed down to the kids but I already see some things that I really don't like in that regard. They are at the age where personalities are emerging and the emotional baselines are hardening after years of input from us. Part of what has kept me in the marriage for the last year has been to "watch over" them. I still debate myself wildly over this. 

Leaving them unattended with her for days or weeks could escalate their emulation of her behavior. I'd want a minimum 50/50 - and that still has me very concerned. 

What's in the best interest of the children is paramount. And they need a mom and a dad. I know that. 

Deep down I believe she knows she had a very big problem. She would never affirm it directly, but during discussions around a divorce she invariably states "I don't want you to take my babies away". Starkly contrast that with the fact I NEVER said anything about doing that... ever. She conjures up some pretty scary outcomes when arguing and sometimes out of the blue. 

So really my 2 chief concerns are the kids social development an her "wanting" help. I hope I can do more good having them 50% of the time until they reach age 14 (at that time they can choose a parent). It just seems like a total crap-shoot and that's what's got me posting here. I'm still on the fence but one foot is now firmly touching the ground outside the marriage.

I appreciate your help way more than I could ever express... thank you.


----------

