# Long Term Success In Marriage...



## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

...Is it even remotely possible , or even desirable?

Every day the news from the marriage front seems to get bleaker and bleaker. Not only on TAM, but generally , the statistics tell us that everywhere, people are giving up on their marriages , and those who aren't married as yet, seem to be pursuing other options.

So my question is, 
Is the idea of a long term fulfilling marriage still possible?
What keeps a person still attracted to their spouse after 15 , 20 , or even 30 years and onward?

Are there specific rules , or does it depend on the personality types involved?
What makes a couple able to overcome everything life and their marriage throws at them and stick together?
Why do some couples last and some don't?

My wife and I would be celebrating 20 years married later this month, and by all means , we are still as happy as day one.
But if anyone should ask me how, I would tell them I don't have much answers. I just know that we are always happy with each other and enjoy each other's company.
We love and respect each other, like the saying goes, we have _clean fights and dirty sex_.

Maybe we were just lucky.

But I know that there are lots of other long term couples right here on TAM that could teach me a thing or two, so I'll love to have your take on long term marriage, the highs , the lows and why you think your marriage survived, despite the struggles.

One thing I know for sure, we are all unique...

I'm all ears!


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## Amplexor (Feb 13, 2008)

While our marriage nearly tanked a few years ago, there are a few the points that hold us strong at 30+ years together.

*Age at marriage* We were both older at the time we wed. Me, 29. Her 26. We had no further seeds to sew and were fully ready to commit for life.

*Conflict* While we were poor as a couple in handling this initially we've learned to deal with it and get it out of the way. We don't let things fester and grow.

*Communication* She is better at expressing her thoughts and feelings than I am, but we constantly work on this.

*Money* Both professionals, we have been blessed that it has never been a major issue for us. However our conservative nature in spending and saving is nearly identical. We've only argued about money once in our entire relationship.

*Empathy* It's critical to understand how the other feels even when we disagree on something.

*Sex* While up and down over the course of our marriage, for the most part it's been often and intense.

*Child Rearing* While our parenting style are opposites, (Me laid back, her hands on and strict) we have a knack for knowing when the other has the inside track on dealing an issue. 

*Kids* We are blessed to have great ones that have given us very little to worry about so far.

*Loyalty* I've got your back. Period!

*In-Laws* Very little interference from either side.

*Quality Time* Huge amounts of time for us. 50 - 60 hours a week. Easier now then it was when the kids were younger.

*The Five Live Languages* This came late for us and during our tribulations. Ours are different, but we recognize what's important to the other and give them what they need.

*Political, moral and spiritual beliefs* All similar in nature

*Music* It is always on in our house.

*Humor* If we can't make each other laugh at least once a day, something's off.


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## meson (May 19, 2011)

Yes, it is possible and for many it is not work at all (Hambone being one where this is true). I keep attracted to my spouse by being engaged with her in many different ways from practical stuff to kids to fun hobbies and playing games. I think it really depends upon the personality types involved as to whether the marriage is something they will both commit to. I learned about it because I almost lost it. Last year nearing our 24th anniverary I did a lot of thinking about it and summarized what I did wrong via a annology of a bridge. I helped to build a bridge that spanned between my wife and myself. I then let the bridge decay and it took many years to figure out that I needed to put work into keeping it in shape and extending it as we changed and the paths between us became a bit different. Here is what I posted last year about this:





> I failed at my marriage after a few years. It was several years after we were married before I realized I was failing at my marriage. I didn’t realize that my marriage was like a bridge. I did all of the work to build it, marveled at it and then left it alone too long. A bridge needs constant maintenance or it decays and will collapse. I let my marriage stagnate and was content to let it be on autopilot while I attended to other things. I didn’t know that I needed to keep planning the bridge and replacing different spans that were aging, adding width to accommodate a family etc.
> This is meson’s story of learning how to have a successful marriage. We’ve been married 23 years and in not too long it will be a quarter of a century. I think we have a successful marriage right now. A few years ago, I couldn’t have said that. We talked about divorce. I might think I have a successful marriage now but one can never be sure. Considering the numbers of marriages that still break up after 25+ years, I think a marriage can only be called a success until the death do us part is met. And even then the spouse that’s left may cover up for a bad marriage anyway and waiting it out.
> 
> The point I want to make is that communication is not always good and people change and that change may not be communicated well if at all. From now on I want to maintain vigilance on the state of our marriage to keep it healthy.


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## meson (May 19, 2011)

Amplexor said:


> While our marriage nearly tanked a few years ago, there are a few the points that hold us strong at 30+ years together.
> 
> 
> *Communication* She is better at expressing her thoughts and feelings than I am, but we constantly work on this.
> ...


Communication, child rearing and quality time were big issues in our marriage as well. After addressing each one of these my marriage started improving. 

The problem was to identify these as issues to begin with and to do something about them.


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

Amplexor said:


> While our marriage nearly tanked a few years ago, there are a few the points that hold us strong at 30+ years together.
> 
> *Age at marriage* We were both older at the time we wed. Me, 29. Her 26. We had no further seeds to sew and were fully ready to commit for life.
> 
> ...


I like your list Amp.

I especially like what you said about Empathy.I agree 1000%!

However some of the others , my wife and I are different to you and your wife.
For example , in laws.
Our inlaws afe very close to us, and although they aren't meddlesome , they have helped us tremendously in the past, and still do. Maybe it's a cultural thing.

I like most of your list though, and its encouraging to see that you all have made 30 years together.

So lemme ask you this. I'm glad that you responded first.

Being a moderator on this marriage forum and a veteran both here and in marriage, what do you see as the most common impediment to solving marital problems and having a happy marriage?


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## Amplexor (Feb 13, 2008)

Caribbean Man said:


> So lemme ask you this. I'm glad that you responded first.
> 
> Being a moderator on this marriage forum and a veteran both here and in marriage, what do you see as the most common impediment to solving marital problems and having a happy marriage?


IRL: People give up too easily. We have a toss away mentality in today's day and age. Divorce has become easier, legally, socially and emotionally. The more common it becomes, the easier it becomes. Some couples should not stay married, that's a fact. But as I have advised hundreds here over the years, if the marriage is in trouble give it everything you've got to right it. Leave nothing in the tank.

TAM: After years here I've seen a pattern that I believe exists in life. Meson stated if beautifully. We (Men) go into autopilot. Think of all the threads we see with a common theme from men here. "I didn't see it coming." That was me seven years ago, I had no idea how unhappy my wife was. We weren't yelling at each other so I thought things were OK. Problem was she'd quit trying and was on her way to a WAW.

Far too many of us fall into it. We pound out our 40 - 60 hours of work, mow the yard and get in a round of golf on the weekends, get laid on a semi regular basis and talk about the kids. We are pretty simple in our basic needs. We tend to settle into a monotonous routine that we are comfortable with and forget that our wives may not be. We stop pursuing them unless we have a boner. We stop romancing them because we think we already have them. Can you believe a couple of years before our melt down, I went to a conference in Hawaii and didn't even think to ask if my wife would like to come along. How ****ed up is that??? My guess is that a majority of TAM men that came here with a screwed up marriage got here, just like that. Just like I did.


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## hambone (Mar 30, 2013)

We've been married 22+ years and I can honestly say it has been easy.. We do not have to work at our marriage every day... In fact, I don't feel like we have to work at it at all.

Several keys starting with my 1st marriage... which was an absolutely miserable failure... When I got out of it, I was pretty bound and determined that I would never marry again. Towards that goal, I never dated anyone more than twice in a row. What that did for me... was keep me from marrying miss OK. I dated several girls that I thought would have made very good wives.

Then, I met someone who just knocked my socks off. Someone who made me feel like no on had ever made me feel. I had been through those lust phases with other girls... this was far beyond anything I'd ever felt. IMO, far too many people settle. 

My wife and I just don't have a lot to fuss about. We agree on politics, religion, money, child raising, fashion, etc. etc. etc. There are just no areas of incompatibility. Opposites might attract but opposites are also sources of friction.

We were older when we married. We were 35. Neither one of us was out to impress someone in order to get them to marry us. What you saw as what you got. Too many people try to morph themselves into what they think their prospect want's them to be. Be yourself and let someone fall in love with the real you.

The foundation of our marriage is mutual respect. My wife has never once embarrassed me. When we do have a an issue, we are able to focus on the issue. It never get's personal. We kick things back and forth until we are in agreement about how to proceed. 

I absolutely respect my wife... I respect her opinion, decisions just aren't made without us both in agreement. I respect what she does as a SAHM... She is so good at it... she makes it look easy. 

A key factor in making our marriage a happy marriage is that my wife was a stay at home mom and wife. So much less stressful when mom doesn't work. I asked my wife early on, what she wanted to be when she was little and she said, "a mommy"... I pressed her and she always wanted to be a mommy. Our marriage is a very 50's marriage... It works for us.

We live a rather simple life style. Rather than buy stuff, we've created memories. We have focused on creating a happy family.

And finally, the best thing you can do for your children is keep your marriage strong. Spend time with each other... And, IMO, having an active love life keeps you connected better than anything. We have always taken 3 day vacations where we focus on each other.

And finally, we go to church regularly. Meet a lot of nice people in church.


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## CharlieParker (Aug 15, 2012)

When our 20th rolled around I gave it some thought. We like to laugh and have fun, if we're not we talk. We like to have sex, if there's a problem we talk. We want to be happy in general, if we're not we talk. And when we talk we listen and understand. 

But ultimately I think it boils to the fact we both care deeply about each other and want make the other happy (meet their needs) and/or at least not make them unhappy. Crudely put we both give a shït about one another. 

It takes trust, respect and a pinch of luck.


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## meson (May 19, 2011)

Amplexor said:


> IRL: People give up too easily. We have a toss away mentality in today's day and age. Divorce has become easier, legally, socially and emotionally. The more common it becomes, the easier it becomes. Some couples should not stay married, that's a fact. But as I have advised hundreds here over the years, if the marriage is in trouble give it everything you've got to right it. Leave nothing in the tank.


Absolutely agree!!! Just because you don't feel it anymore doesn't mean you won't feel love again with your spouse. Not feeling it is not enough of a reason to give up. Identifying and solving the issues will set the stage so that you can work on feeling love again. I have said this to several posters and Amplexors situation and mine show it is possible. 



Amplexor said:


> I I went to a conference in Hawaii and didn't even think to ask if my wife would like to come along. How ****ed up is that??? My guess is that a majority of TAM men that came here with a screwed up marriage got here, just like that. Just like I did.


Ironically at our worst Mrs. meson went on a business trip to Hawaii without me. But with kids and all there was no way I could go. However in our improved marriage and the fact that the kids have grown up, I have been invited to her trip to Belgium this year.


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## Anonymous07 (Aug 4, 2012)

Caribbean Man said:


> Is the idea of a long term fulfilling marriage still possible?


Is it still possible? Yes. 

I don't know this from experience, as I don't even know if my marriage will survive, but I have seen a lot of great marriages and like to learn from them. I have relatives and family friends who have been married for 30+ years. My parents have been married for over 30 years, as is the same with other aunts and uncles. One family friend just celebrated their 50th wedding anniversary! They are still very happy and in love. I really love seeing them interact after all of those years. 

I would love to have a marriage like many of the ones I see, but I also know it will take more than just me putting in the effort to get there.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

> *Caribbean man said:* So my question is,
> Is the idea of a long term fulfilling marriage still possible?
> What keeps a person still attracted to their spouse after 15 , 20 , or even 30 years and onward?
> 
> ...


This year will be 33 yrs for us since we started "going together" (basically a week after we met)....and married 25 yrs this coming Sept.. the TIME Flew..I wish we could live it all over again...

Maybe this won't come off as so Romantic and gushing ...

But the reality is...I really OWE our success and Happiness to our amazing *compatibility* with each other.. and my Husband's steadfast love, care and honorability...his very example TO ME and our children ...He is just a really GOOD man... always willing to go that extra mile for those he loves & cares about.

He is affectionate, he listens to me...if he speaks something, you can count on his word...he is committed, kind and doesn't hold any of this back.. he is always pleasant to be around ....he can take my days of seemingly RAIN..and turn them into sunshine.. He gets me to laugh at myself ... we like to make fun of each other..he doesn't mind all my questions/ picking his brain... he doesn't even need a Cave !

I was surely the more difficult of the 2 of us when we met.. I am more selfish, more demanding, harder to please, I am not a narcissist or anything.. but I really don't believe I would have survived being with a man I knocked heads with, I am too strong willed and minded. .. I wanted certain things in my life and would have fought tooth & nail to see them come to pass.. but ya know.. I laid that all out there... 

Amazingly...we had the same goals, dreams, we're traditionally minded, our moral compass -its on the same dial... our love languages flow in the same order...we both LOVE country living, ... we are homebodies...we love movies / walks in the woods...both frugal in how we spend money, planning, saving for the future....

Our personalities greatly compliment each other... I go for introverted "deep thinking" romantic men....he likes feisty women.. He is passive..tame.. and calm.... whereas I am assertive, don't mind conflict, a mover / shaker...... I like to know what is going on...and he loves to get my input!

We talk EVERYTHING over before we go forth with any major projects... or anything that has the power to affect our family...our lives.. 

I wanted a bunch of babies, he loves being a Dad!







We're both very "safety" minded.. both thrive on a willing transparency.. sexually ...we both are affection hounds....physical touch keeps us alive and ticking for each other..







.... 

If I complain about my husband, I am an impossible monster..... there is just so much to be thankful for. We FIT.. our dynamics are something that even I am not sure how to describe.. ... after all of these years.. he is still the one I run to... I want to share my everything with, I still get giddy just being with my Husband ...there is a comfort and fulfillment that transcends words... it's like this old classic..

You're Still The One - the Orleans 

Sure we still fight now & then.. he tells me I like to fight for Make up sex.. It's a running joke in our house.... but at the end of the day ...we can't even stay away from each other when we are pi$$ed and march right back to each other, talk it out...and we're back in the saddle again. 

Communication.. communication.. communication.. has been our greatest asset...

I put this as a successful tidbit on another thread.. 

Never Keep Secrets ~~~~ Never let the Sun go down on your anger. A little conflict is healthy, do not fear it ~~~Know your spouses Love Languages & live to give what they crave. ~~~~ If you have sexual inhibitions, destroy them! Read books on Sex , Intimacy & Spicing like mad, never let the passion fade.~~~ Continue to date after kids, Laugh with each other, Flirt always, be playful, bring each other up when the other is having a bad day .~~~ May your Lover forever & always be your Best Friend.


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## Thundarr (Jul 4, 2012)

Very good question CMan.

My first marriage was a disaster and short lived but my current marriage has been and is wonderful. Maybe I'm not all that qualified to answer.

Long term success needs both partners to believe that they are a better person because of the other one. Of course agreed expectations and boundaries are important too.


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## sidney2718 (Nov 2, 2013)

What makes for long term success in marriage? I still have no idea. Seriously.

My wife and I will have been married for 55 years later this year. We met when she was a college freshman and I was a graduate student. I am six years older than she is.

In temperament she's rather calm. She tended to store up resentment and then let it out in one gush. I was non-confrontational and very afraid of conflict. Why? My parents set global records for the number and intensity of their shouting matches. But they never divorced.

We were lucky because I'd chosen an academic career. Academia can be a very stressful place, especially at a big university. And the pay is not spectacular, but it is adequate. And once one had tenure, one did have job security.

We were living hand to mouth for the first few years. We complemented each other. I was not good at reading her needs and she wasn't good at reading mine, but we muddled through. We did (and do) share a large number of activities, mainly things like reading, theater, movies both serious and junky, and family. My family (excluding my parents) was large, warm, and friendly and loved my wife from the start -- even to the point of taking her side if we had a "public" dispute.

And there is no question that I was self-centered and overbearing at times.

But we grew up in a different era. By the time the "free love" movement swept the country in the late 60's and early 70's, we'd been married long enough to have acquired two wonderful children and had zero interest in wife swapping. Divorce was not really done in our day. So from the start we knew that we had to work our way through problems.

And as is usual when young, most of our problems were financial. I still remember the pain I experienced when I had to cash in my life insurance policy so that we could get through another month's bills -- but it left my family unprotected. All I knew was that my extended family would not let them starve.

We've lived through rough times, friends and family have passed on, the nation went through several wars, I learned somehow to be less of a type A personality and to relax a bit more. We had different levels of sexual desire, all the usual stuff, and I know that I thought of divorce on several occasions, but never acted on it.

I would not be surprised to learn that she did the same.

Over time we built up some savings. The Carter inflation was kind to us and we built up a good retirement fund. My wife went back to work after the kids were old enough. She landed a good job at a non-profit organization and for a number of years earned slightly more than I did.

And here we are. I have no idea why we did not break up. I have no idea why we've always stuck together. Perhaps it was our commitment to our children? I remember my wife telling me that one thing she never worried about in the event of a divorce (yes, we talked about such a thing in the abstract) was that I would be as good at taking care of them as she was.

And I recall promising her that if we ever divorced, we'd split what we had 50/50, except that she could keep all the Sinatra records.

Long story. No simple explanation. But there it is.


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## Kria (Aug 4, 2013)

Caribbean Man said:


> My wife and I would be celebrating 20 years married later this month, and by all means , we are still as happy as day one.
> But if anyone should ask me how, I would tell them I don't have much answers. I just know that we are always happy with each other and enjoy each other's company.
> We love and respect each other, like the saying goes, we have _clean fights and dirty sex_.
> 
> Maybe we were just lucky.


I don't believe you or anyone else on this site that says or makes statements like this. They are overstatements. Trying to come off better than you actually are. If your marriage has been good and consistent from the beginning, then you wouldn't be on a site like this and constantly. You wouldn't even be thinking to be on a site like this. People look up sites like this that are having or at least had problems in their marriages.


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## Kria (Aug 4, 2013)

Mrs. John Adams said:


> What reason would he have to lie about it? I believe him.
> 
> We have been to hell and back and are happier than we have ever been. TRUTH...no need to fabricate an anonymous on line relationship...no reason at all.


People lie and stretch the truth all the time to make themselves feel better especially online because the chances of being caught lying are slim to none . People who really feel secure and happy in their lives don't feel the need to constantly broadcast about it especially to other people that are having a hard time.


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## Kria (Aug 4, 2013)

Mrs. John Adams said:


> I see..and you needed to taint this thread... that is a very positive thread because?


Not tainted. Just giving my perspective.


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## hambone (Mar 30, 2013)

Kria said:


> I don't believe you or anyone else on this site that says or makes statements like this. They are overstatements. Trying to come off better than you actually are. If your marriage has been good and consistent from the beginning, then you wouldn't be on a site like this and constantly. You wouldn't even be thinking to be on a site like this. People look up sites like this that are having or at least had problems in their marriages.


Well, you're wrong about me..

I found this sight because of the politics and religion forums.

Later, I discovered the other forums...


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

Kria said:


> *If your marriage has been good and consistent from the beginning, then you wouldn't be on a site like this and constantly. You wouldn't even be thinking to be on a site like this. People look up sites like this that are having or at least had problems in their marriages.*


Well not quite true.

There are at least two other people on this thread who I know didn't come here seeking answers for a troubled marriage, just like I didn't come looking for answers to a troubled marriage.

Their marriages were good and like me,they stumbled across here via external links ,that's how the internet works.
We looked and saw ideas on how to make our marriage_ better._
And for he time I've been here , my marriage has benefited tremendously from it.

Basically that is what this thread is about.

People who have been married , had their problems and made their marriage better. I believe that myself and others can _still _learn a lot from them.

Being married for 30 plus or 40 plus years is no small achievement.
I respect people who have achieved that.
That is how I would like my marriage to be.

What about you?


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## Kria (Aug 4, 2013)

hambone said:


> Well, you're wrong about me..
> 
> I found this sight because of the politics and religion forums.
> 
> Later, I discovered the other forums...


It's possible since you say that you were in a miserable first marriage and learned some lessons from it but you still don't need to keep going on about your "perfect" current marriage. It doesn't serve much purpose because most people won't get that experience.


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

Kria said:


> People lie and stretch the truth all the time to make themselves feel better especially online because the chances of being caught lying are slim to none . People who really feel secure and happy in their lives don't feel the need to constantly broadcast about it especially to other people that are having a hard time.



Well coming to a HELP forum and pretending everything is a ok wouldn't make much sense, would it?

Basically, here is where one can actually get the answers, and if they pretend there isn't a problem, then how can they get help?

If you search through my older posts, you would see that my first post was in a debate in the Social Section on a thread entitled 
" Marijuana usage."
I came across this site via external link on my favorite psychology website and I basically looked at the forums, gravitated to the social section and saw a heated debate on marijuana.

I registered to join the debate and just decided to stick around a bit. I made some friends , got good information about making my marriage better , and so I'm still here!


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

Kria said:


> It's possible since you say that you were in a miserable first marriage and learned some lessons from it but you still don't need to keep going on about your "perfect" current marriage. It doesn't serve much purpose because most people won't get that experience.


But his experience might be able to help someone?

At least_ I_ have learned from his experience!
And I'm sure many others have gained insights from it.

Will you like to ask him or anyone else a question?


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## Kria (Aug 4, 2013)

Caribbean Man said:


> Well coming to a HELP forum and pretending everything is a ok wouldn't make much sense, would it?
> 
> Basically, here is where one can actually get the answers, and if they pretend there isn't a problem, then how can they get help?


If you came on here and said that you had problems in certain areas in your marriage and how you resolved them then that would be understandable. Instead you come on here like you are trying to low key brag under the guise of trying to make your already good marriage better. Many people on here need much more than that.


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

Kria said:


> If you came on here and said that you had problems in certain areas in your marriage and how you resolved them then that would be understandable. Instead you come on here like you are trying to low key brag under the guise of trying to make your already good marriage better. Many people on here need much more than that.



But I HAVE said that numerous times in other threads.

During teh early years of our marriage we had lots of problem.
We took each other for granted ,and things began to fall apart.

We headed to Marriage Counselling and got things back on track and since that we've constantly been working on it.


Would you have preferred if I came and said that my wife was no longer attracted to me and I didn't know what to do?


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

Kria said:


> People lie and stretch the truth all the time to make themselves feel better especially online because the chances of being caught lying are slim to none . People who really feel secure and happy in their lives don't feel the need to constantly broadcast about it especially to other people that are having a hard time.


It is possible that some truly enjoy *Talking about Marriage*.. I would classify myself as one of these people..I feel Marriage is dying today...and I find it very sad.. 

I've always loved Psychology...likely missed my calling in life -as I am just a SAHM.. me and H did miss it in some areas that I regret ..in our past...but this is not what was asked on this thread....

I know Caribbean man and his wife has worked through some issues also.....everyone on this thread has SOMETHING they have worked through.. therefore something to contribute ...I do not see anyone as broadcasting as "Hey look at me over here"...by sharing how they feel -if there is enthusiasm behind their words.. 

Talk about Marriage has a whopping 68,419 members... 5,371 it says are active.. I think there is enough room for a variety of posters....from those who are newly married, to thinking about marriage, to struggling with infidelity, to parenting issues, to addiction issues to those who enjoy playing Dear Abby ... (it's a strange pasttime I suppose but some of us are weird!)... to those who like to share about their marriages.. the good, the bad , the ugly and what they've learned along the way... 

There is a "Successful marriage section" here...maybe you feel this thread should be moved there ??


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## CharlieParker (Aug 15, 2012)

Caribbean Man said:


> Well not quite true.
> 
> There are at least two other people on this thread who I know didn't come here seeking answers for a troubled marriage, just like I didn't come looking for answers to a troubled marriage.


* raises hand *

I came shortly before our 20th, reflecting and curious what other people's marriages were like, oh boy was I naive. 

I have learned quite a bit but also have a problem with seeing others' problems in my own marriage when we don't have those problems. Glad I found TAM.


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## Kria (Aug 4, 2013)

SimplyAmorous said:


> It is possible that some truly enjoy *Talking about Marriage*.. I would classify myself as one of these people..I feel Marriage is dying today...and I find it very sad..
> 
> I've always loved Psychology...likely missed my calling in life -as I am just a SAHM.. me and H did miss it in some areas that I regret ..in our past...but this is not what was asked on this thread....
> 
> ...


SimplyAmorous, you are a whole other type. You talk like you are trying to throw fairy dust at everyone on here reading your unusual outlined presentation posts like you're getting paid for them.


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

Kria said:


> SimplyAmorous, you are a whole other type. You talk like you are trying to throw fairy dust at everyone on here reading your unusual outlined presentation posts like you're getting paid for them.



Do you have a particular question or something to contribute about how to make your marriage better or last longer Kria?

If you have problems, here is the place, ask your questions,and I'm sure you will get some suggestions on how you can move forward in your marriage.


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## committed4ever (Nov 13, 2012)

Kria said:


> If you came on here and said that you had problems in certain areas in your marriage and how you resolved them then that would be understandable. Instead you come on here like you are trying to low key brag under the guise of trying to make your already good marriage better. *Many people on here need much more than that.*


And they can find it on here, Kria. People are at all different levels here. There have been lots and lots of people who didn't come here because of a "bad" marriage. But they stuck around and thank God they did! How can anyone improve their marriages if there is no standard to aspire too? Engaged people have found their way here. Don't you think they need examples of people who have had a good marriage all their married lives?

I for one am inspired by people who have made it through having one partner, never cheated, and haved loved each other. We have only been married 9 years and we intend to be married to each other only, have kids with each other only, and love each other only. If there were no people who have done that, if every one here had to have a big blot on their marriage it would be discouraging.

Converesely there are plenty of people who did not have a good marriage and feel hopeless that their dream for marriage and a family life is over. These TAMers need to know that you CAN, indeed have a 2nd (or even 3rd) marriage with someone that is PERFECT for them, and that they can overcome the breakup of a marriage and get another chance at it. Finally there are those who are divorced and have found that life as a single person is satisfying and content and they can move on after divorce. 

I wish I could have 3 or 4 children but probably can't, but I'm not made angry by someone like SA who has 6 and is loving it. And I never tire of hearing what a wonderful family life they have. So I for one hope those who have great marriages keep on posting about what works! I have only been married 9 yeas, and I want to get where they are !


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## committed4ever (Nov 13, 2012)

Kria said:


> SimplyAmorous, you are a whole other type. You talk like you are trying to throw fairy dust at everyone on here reading your unusual outlined presentation posts like you're getting paid for them.


So you are angry at everyone who is positive, encouraging and uplifting? Why?


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## committed4ever (Nov 13, 2012)

Amplexor said:


> While our marriage nearly tanked a few years ago, there are a few the points that hold us strong at 30+ years together.
> 
> *Age at marriage* We were both older at the time we wed. Me, 29. Her 26. We had no further seeds to sew and were fully ready to commit for life.
> 
> ...


Great post! Your points could be a progress report for marriage!


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

committed4ever said:


> Converesely there are plenty of people who did not have a good marriage and feel hopeless that their dream for marriage and a family life is over. These TAMers need to know that you CAN, indeed have a 2nd (or even 3rd) marriage with someone that is PERFECT for them, and that they can overcome the breakup of a marriage and get another chance at it. Finally there are those who are divorced and have found that life as a single person is satisfying and content and they can move on after divorce.


And then there are those whose marriages have survived infidelity, forgiven each other , recommitted to their marriages and has even grown stronger, lasting many, many years.


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## Kria (Aug 4, 2013)

committed4ever said:


> So you are angry at everyone who is positive, encouraging and uplifting? Why?


It's not about positivity being expressed but more like how it is expressed. Some people here come off more like bragging than helping knowing good and well that what they claim to have is a needle in a haystack and that many people will never get to experience that because life is unfair and short.


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## committed4ever (Nov 13, 2012)

Caribbean Man said:


> And then there are those whose marriages have survived infidelity, forgiven each other , recommitted to their marriages and has even grown stronger, lasting many, many years.


Yes indeed! How could I forget that! See Adams, Mr. and Mrs. J.A.. So it CAN be done.


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

Kria said:


> It's not about positivity being expressed but more like how it is expressed. Some people here come off more like bragging than helping knowing good and well that what they claim to have is a needle in a haystack and that many people will never get to experience that because life is unfair and short.


Well sorry if it comes across like that to you, the intention was the exact opposite.

That is, to show that there are couples that stuck together right here on TAM, and their lives are happier for it.

Happiness in marriage isn't like a needle in a haystack.


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

committed4ever said:


> Yes indeed! How could I forget that! See Adams, Mr. and Mrs. J.A.. So it CAN be done.


Yup.

My thoughts exactly.
They opted to find happiness in each other when they could have gone their separate ways.

I think there is quite a lot that can be learnt there about forgiveness.

How to _really_ forgive.


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## Kria (Aug 4, 2013)

Caribbean Man said:


> Happiness in marriage isn't like a needle in a haystack.


Yes it is otherwise sites like this wouldn't exist. There wouldn't be long term unhappy marriages, divorces and loads of people that co-habit without getting married.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

Kria said:


> SimplyAmorous, you are a whole other type. You talk like you are trying to throw fairy dust at everyone on here reading your unusual outlined presentation posts like you're getting paid for them.


Kria.. I am all for free speech, your right to speak it how you see it , feel it and the disdain you feel for some of us/ our way of writing , and the fairy dust we spill.... It is good to learn who thinks we are unusual and feels we shouldn't be here...

I invite this information.. that way I will be sure to not try to interact with you in the future... 

Please consider the ignore feature on your profile page ...I've never personally used it but I hear it's pretty easy and many do use it....if we have the power...we should limit the annoyances in our lives as best we can... 



> *Caribbean Man said *: My thoughts exactly.
> They opted to find happiness in each other when they could have gone their separate ways.
> 
> I think there is quite a lot that can be learnt there about forgiveness.
> ...


 Isn't this the darn truth...so much can be learned...We need more Forgiveness and understanding.. but many can't get past the story without breathing FIRE down their backs.. with insults.... if they even try to talk about it, they get their a$$es reamed out ... so you know what.. you share your vulnerability and your mistakes, you get chewed on , and if you are happy you get chewed on...... Oh gotta love life ..you can't win either way.. I guess even to post on a marriage form, you have to walk a delicate line...


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

Kria said:


> Yes it is otherwise sites like this wouldn't exist. There wouldn't be long term unhappy marriages, divorces and loads of people that co-habit without getting married.


Well we'll have to agree to disagree.

Sites like this exist for many different purposes and not because happiness in marriage is impossible.

If happiness in marriage was impossible then sites like this wouldn't make any sense.
Because happiness in marriage _is_ possible , sites like this are here to offer help and direction.


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## Kria (Aug 4, 2013)

Caribbean Man said:


> Well we'll have to agree to disagree.
> 
> Sites like this exist for many different purposes and not because happiness in marriage is impossible.
> 
> ...


Never said impossible. Going to outer space is possible but it doesn't mean everyone will achieve it. That goes for much smaller things in life as well such as co-existing with a mate.


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## sidney2718 (Nov 2, 2013)

Kria said:


> It's not about positivity being expressed but more like how it is expressed. Some people here come off more like bragging than helping knowing good and well that what they claim to have is a needle in a haystack and that many people will never get to experience that because life is unfair and short.


Why are you so negative? Are you saying that only folks in marriages that are RIGHT NOW coming apart are qualified to help others?

I find this very sad.


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## mablenc (Feb 26, 2013)

Kria said:


> I don't believe you or anyone else on this site that says or makes statements like this. They are overstatements. Trying to come off better than you actually are. If your marriage has been good and consistent from the beginning, then you wouldn't be on a site like this and constantly. You wouldn't even be thinking to be on a site like this. People look up sites like this that are having or at least had problems in their marriages.


With all due respect you are new to the site. Many of us know CM for a while now. I've known him for over a year. He is nothing but humble, and respectful. If you don't think someone is being honest, maybe you should not post in a thread started by them.


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## Kria (Aug 4, 2013)

SimplyAmorous said:


> Kria.. I am all for free speech, your right to speak it how you see it , feel it and the disdain you feel for some of us/ our way of writing , and the fairy dust we spill.... It is good to learn who thinks we are unusual and feels we shouldn't be here...
> 
> I invite this information.. that way I will be sure to not try to interact with you in the future...
> 
> Please consider the ignore feature on your profile page ...I've never personally used it but I hear it's pretty easy and many do use it....if we have the power...we should limit the annoyances in our lives as best we can...


Never said that you didn't give some good advice but some of it has just been over the top in my view. Also, it really isn't necessary for you to keep repeating about your insatiable sex drive. You never know what triggers you are causing.


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## hambone (Mar 30, 2013)

Kria said:


> It's possible since you say that you were in a miserable first marriage and learned some lessons from it but you still don't need to keep going on about your "perfect" current marriage. It doesn't serve much purpose because most people won't get that experience.


Well, I was hoping I could share some things that have made my marriage so good. such as..

1. don't settle...
2. Marry someone you have a lot in common with, someone who has similar goals and attitudes to yourself. One big mistake a lot of people make is, they don't actually discuss basic issues like, how they will handle money, how they intend to discipline the child, how the chores will be divided, etc. etc. etc. Those things need to be discussed before you're married.
3. Be yourself... Let them fall in love with who you really are.
4. Mutual respect..
5. Stay connected... have an active sex life.

You can learn from others mistakes..... or you can learn from your own mistakes.


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

Kria said:


> Never said impossible. Going to outer space is possible but it doesn't mean everyone will achieve it. That goes for much smaller things in life as well such as co-existing with a mate.


And why would you want to get married if the chance of being happy was soo small?

Maybe the solution is the two partners should first be happy persons , _before_ they get married so they actually bring happiness into their union.

I think that should increase their chances.

But for sure, happiness in marriage is something both partners should work on and it is quite achievable.
If two people were dating and happy before marriage, then why should their happiness suddenly disappear after they say " I do?"


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## mablenc (Feb 26, 2013)

Oh can we just stick to the thread? 

Kria whoever you are, why don't you do something more productve and stop highjacking this thread. You might get banned (again).


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## Kria (Aug 4, 2013)

mablenc said:


> With all due respect you are new to the site. Many of us know CM for a while now. I've known him for over a year. He is nothing but humble, and respectful. If you don't think someone is being honest, maybe you should not post in a thread started by them.


My join date and amount of posts does not indicate how long I have been viewing threads on this website. I can also have an opposing point of view. Also, knowing someone on a website is not quite the same as knowing them live in person.


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## sandc (Dec 15, 2011)

My wife and I have been married 27 years. The foundation of our marriage was built on our common faith in Christ. Now, that doesn't mean we were perfect nor did we have a perfect marriage. But it gave us common grounds to build a marriage on. 

I'm not sure what I can add to Amp's excellent posting. We have had our troubles, most of you here know what they were and what we went through. We overcame them because we didn't want to give up on each other. We almost did. After the low point in our marriage we finally got back on track but found ourselves on auto-pilot. I googled "ideas for dating your wife" and found TAM. I've been here since. We talk a lot. We go out a lot. We spend a lot of time together. We have a lot of sex. We worship together. We laugh at ourselves and the other. All of it helps keep us in a committed, strong relationship.


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## CharlieParker (Aug 15, 2012)

Forgiveness was mentioned, it is really important. We both forgive readily and quickly, granted there's been no infidelity. There is no grudge holding. We have a rule, you can go to bed mad, and you can wake up mad but you can't go to bed mad again, we need to talk, now or least agree on a rain check.


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## mablenc (Feb 26, 2013)

Kria said:


> SimplyAmorous, you are a whole other type. You talk like you are trying to throw fairy dust at everyone on here reading your unusual outlined presentation posts like you're getting paid for them.


:rofl::rofl:









SA, it would be a sad day of you ever stop posting in your fabulous style! We need your fairy dust


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

Kria said:


> My join date and amount of posts does not indicate how long I have been viewing threads on this website. I can also have an opposing point of view. Also, knowing someone on a website is not quite the same as knowing them live in person.


Ok.

Agreed.

Can you tell us something about your marriage, and how you make it better?


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## Kria (Aug 4, 2013)

mablenc said:


> Oh can we just stick to the thread?
> 
> Kria whoever you are, why don't you do something more productve and stop highjacking this thread. You might get banned (again).


I've never been banned here and I am being no more or less productive wasting time on a message board just like everyone else with a different opinion.


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## mablenc (Feb 26, 2013)

CM, I think that finding someone that shares similar values as you is important as well as having someone that believes in you, helps you grow as a person. Most importantly someone who makes you laugh and really gets you.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

Kria said:


> Never said that you didn't give some good advice but some of it has just been over the top in my view. Also, it really isn't necessary for you to keep repeating about your insatiable sex drive. You never know what triggers you are causing.


Well you see Kria.. this was WHY I LANDED HERE and one of my struggles so everything wasn't so P E R F E C T ... I was on a Sex addcition forum before I found TAM..(a little amusing isn't it!)... but it was too slow .. and I got bored.. plus they didn't feel I was addicted.. 

I will agree with you. I am "over the top"... it's part of my temperamental make up and enthusiasm with life... it comes in handy at times but like anything else, turn it on it's head.. it might not be so wonderful to deal with.... as my husband would say.... I can be INTENSE... good thing I am not married to one would would despise that! 

Again.. Ignore me.. if I could do it for you....I would.


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## CharlieParker (Aug 15, 2012)

mablenc said:


> CM, I think that finding someone that shares similar values as you is important as well as having someone that believes in you, helps you grow as a person. Most importantly someone who makes you laugh and really gets you.


As I told 2 younger about to married couples, if you're not having fun you're doing something wrong and you need to talk. (If ever asked again I'd add if you're not having sex, weekly at a bare minimum, you're doing something wrong and need to talk.)


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## calvin (Jan 7, 2012)

Kria,Kria.....Christ,who rattled your cage?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Kria (Aug 4, 2013)

sidney2718 said:


> Why are you so negative? Are you saying that only folks in marriages that are RIGHT NOW coming apart are qualified to help others?
> 
> I find this very sad.


Someone who has never been fat does not understand the struggle of someone who is or was fat. The same goes for marriage advice. Someone that has not gone through rough patches or hard times in their marriage is just not going to get it.


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## Trickster (Nov 19, 2011)

SimplyAmorous said:


> It
> There is a "Successful marriage section" here...maybe you feel this thread should be moved there ??



The problem with that is that there is no activity in long teem success i. Marriage section. The most active threads is infidelity as well as Sex in marriage.


Do we stay in an unloving marriage in hopes that it gets better or do we bail?

When to we give up? When do we throw in the towel?

With all the ups and downs, how bad does it have to get?

What if we give up before the miracle?


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## mablenc (Feb 26, 2013)

CharlieParker said:


> As I told 2 younger about to married couples, if you're not having fun you're doing something wrong and you need to talk. (If ever asked again I'd add if you're not having sex, weekly at a bare minimum, you're doing something wrong and need to talk.)


You and I have had this conversation too, it's a matter of communication and willingness to listen to your spouse.


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## CharlieParker (Aug 15, 2012)

calvin said:


> Kria,Kria.....Christ,who rattled your cage?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Are you asking what OW's name is?


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

Kria said:


> Someone who has never been fat does not understand the struggle of someone who is or was fat. The same goes for marriage advice. Someone that has not gone through rough patches or hard times in their marriage is just not going to get it.


Every single marriage goes through rough patches Kria!

That's what I've said and basically everyone else on this thread.

That's the purpose of this thread, to discuss how marriages can survive rough patches, and still be successful in the long run.


But if you don't believe that's possible, then why are you here?


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## mablenc (Feb 26, 2013)

Another thing that is important, showering each other.... With affection


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

Trickster said:


> The problem with that is that there is no activity in long teem success i. Marriage section. The most active threads is infidelity as well as Sex in marriage.
> 
> 
> *Do we stay in an unloving marriage in hopes that it gets better or do we bail?
> ...


Yup.

I was asking someone here on TAM those exact questions earlier today.

Those are very relevant questions.


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## calvin (Jan 7, 2012)

Kria said:


> Someone who has never been fat does not understand the struggle of someone who is or was fat. The same goes for marriage advice. Someone that has not gone through rough patches or hard times in their marriage is just not going to get it.


 I used to be fat long ago,I lost it and kept it off,marriage problems?
I'm a BS but going through 2 1/2 years of R and things are looking good.
Life throws curvballs and sometimes sh!t in your face.
Its how you react to it,how you pull yourself up and shake the crap off and move on.
There will be more down the road but fvck it,I give a sh!t.
I'm enjoying this messed up ride.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## calvin (Jan 7, 2012)

CharlieParker said:


> Are you asking what OW's name is?


No,just in generalshe seems mad at everything in life.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

calvin said:


> * Life throws curvballs and sometimes sh!t in your face.
> Its how you react to it,how you pull yourself up and shake the crap off and move on.*


Calvin,
We hardly ever agree...





But I definitely agree with you here!:smthumbup:


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## calvin (Jan 7, 2012)

She's mad,don't blame her but I've never seen this much venting.
Hell with it,vent away Kria.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## mablenc (Feb 26, 2013)

My husband called me the other day. He said " remember when we were looking for coins to put gas in our car? Even then we were still happy, even when we struggled while getting through school. We felt unstoppable, we knew we had to work hard to reach our goals."

And it's true, we had that hunger and there was a strong feeling of union between us. I remember he packed my school bag on my first day, I was so nervous. He walked me to the car and waved as I drove by. I had never felt so much support and had someone that beleived in me the way he did.


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

calvin said:


> She's mad,don't blame her but I've never seen this much venting.
> Hell with it,vent away Kria.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Yes.,

Maybe she's just venting. 
No problem.

I don't mind if she attacks me, but I don't think she should attack someone like SA.

That's kinda mean, and not nice.


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## calvin (Jan 7, 2012)

Caribbean Man said:


> Yes.,
> 
> Maybe she's just venting.
> No problem.
> ...


 Yeah it was but when you're hurting sometimes you lash out,it happens.
Then you cool down apologize and seek a little peace,help and maybe some advice.
Being hurt can make you do some dumb things you regret later.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Kria (Aug 4, 2013)

SimplyAmorous said:


> Again.. Ignore me.. if I could do it for you....I would.


All I need to do is take the general advice that you post that I agree with and discard the rest. I don't need to ignore you in order to do that. If ignoring is how you roll then so be it. Also, notice how I didn't need to write any words in big letters.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

Caribbean Man said:


> I don't mind if she attacks me, but I don't think she should attack someone like SA.
> 
> That's kinda mean, and not nice.


Oh CB....ya know it's sweet - 2 of you Pmed me not wanting my feathers ruffled.. can I be honest.. I downplay my aggressive "put you in your place" side on TAM.. I have no interest in getting banned.. ..

I think I have you all snowed.... Ask JLD..(she met me in person we spent a whole day together)....my feathers do not ruffle easy.. we had a great laugh about some of the mud slinging we come up against on TAM...I was trying to help her get a tougher skin....

I was telling husband about this thread, the fairy dust... . he's been calling me "Tinker Bell" all night ... we're having some fun with it ! Thank you Mablenc.... you guys are great !...Carry on...


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## calvin (Jan 7, 2012)

Kria said:


> I don't believe you or anyone else on this site that says or makes statements like this. They are overstatements. Trying to come off better than you actually are. If your marriage has been good and consistent from the beginning, then you wouldn't be on a site like this and constantly. You wouldn't even be thinking to be on a site like this. People look up sites like this that are having or at least had problems in their marriages.


 Sometimes they are here to see if they can make a good marriage even better,yes they hurt sometimes and
have problems they want to fix,that's good.
Some need comfort,help,advice or whatever but they all are hear trying to better their situation.
Nothing wrong with that.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## heartsbeating (May 2, 2011)

I love Amp's contribution... particularly communication, having each others back, and music! What a great call to include music 

_"The finger of blame has turned upon itself 
and I'm more than willing to offer myself, 
do you want my presence or need my help? 
Who knows where that may lead."_

From my experience, I needed to recognize my own sh*t, see it for what it is, realize how it impacted our relationship and decide whether I was willing to let go of certain behaviors. There was so much I couldn't see about myself until I allowed myself to. And then, bit by bit, I made changes. He did similarly for himself. It was actually observing him on his journey that influenced me to take mine. This was almost separate to our marriage but we knew it was needed for our own growth. And then, we could see if we were willing and able and still compatible to stay together. What a difference. It's hard to sum up these changes and what we are learning. It would have been a disservice to ourselves if we hadn't learned these lessons, still married or not. 

It pains me to recognize that I took him for granted, along with the strong foundation we had built together over the years, but I actually think it was that foundation of care that helped us to continue and want to try - along with the love we shared. Sometimes that doesn't mean the relationship ought to last but I'm grateful that we are still here. He's an amazing kind of guy.

Own your sh*t even if it's hard face. Be open. Trust and be vulnerable. Be aware not to take one another for granted. Treat each other with respect. Make decisions that treat your marriage with respect. Consider your intent and motivation. Intimacy is paramount. Communicate..! Still something we are working on but we're much better than we were. 

But above all, remember you're on each others team - particularly when playing Lego Marvel Superheroes.


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## over20 (Nov 15, 2013)

SimplyAmorous said:


> Oh CB....ya know it's sweet - 2 of you Pmed me not wanting my feathers ruffled.. can I be honest.. I downplay my aggressive "put you in your place" side on TAM.. I have no interest in getting banned.. ..
> 
> I think I have you all snowed.... Ask JLD..(she met me in person we spent a whole day together)....my feathers do not ruffle easy.. we had a great laugh about some of the mud slinging we come up against on TAM...I was trying to help her get a tougher skin....
> 
> I was telling husband about this thread, the fairy dust... . he's been calling me "Tinker Bell" all night ... we're having some fun with it ! Thank you Mablenc.... you guys are great !...Carry on...




That's why we all love you here on TAM, SA! Your everyone's favorite!


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## Kria (Aug 4, 2013)

Caribbean Man said:


> Yes.,
> 
> Maybe she's just venting.
> No problem.
> ...


I didn't attack you or SA. Our view on attacks must be different. I just gave my list of grievances.


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## hambone (Mar 30, 2013)

Caribbean Man said:


> Every single marriage goes through rough patches Kria!
> 
> That's what I've said and basically everyone else on this thread.
> 
> ...


The closest thing we've had to a rough patch was when we first got married. I was thrown in parenthood because my wife had a 12 year old daughter.

She was NOT happy that I married her mother. It blew any hopes of her mother and father getting back together... even though, her dad had been remarried for over a year.

She was used to getting her mother's undivided attention... and all the sudden she wasn't. She was having to share and she didnt' like it.

Her father put her in a bad spot by telling her that if she had any sort of relationship with me... it was a direct stab to his heart. He didn't want a relationship with his daughter and he blamed her affections towards me as the reason he pulled away from her. It was a complete BS excuse... but as a 12 year old kid, she absolutely craved her dads attention and wasn't taking any chances by being nice to me..

She told me a couple thousand times.. "YOU are NOT my father!!!"

Along about this time, she was really mean to her mother.. and very disrespectful to both of us.

That said, as uncomfortable as it was to have this little ball of anger in our home, it never once threatened her marriage.

I tried my best to have a relationship with my step. I extended my hand of friendship and had my hand slapped thousands of times. I kept trying. I tried to incorporate her into our family and she was having none of it. 

It was actually sad. We'd invite the step to go out with us to eat, a movie etc. etc. And she'd turn us down saying, "my DADDY is coming to pick me up!!!" We'd go out... we'd come back and she wold still be sitting where she was when we left. Out of those thousands and thousands of times he promised to pick her up and taking her out... I bet he didn't actually follow through more than 2 or 3 times. She would be crushed... she'd be angry and she'd take it out on me.

We got pregnant right after we got married... like 6 weeks. Once we got kids of our own... and I had such a close relationship with my own kids... That created even more jealousy.. 

I left all of the discipline up to my wife.

The step was never able to drive a wedge between me and my wife.

And now days, her complaint is that I never treated her like I treated my own kids. Well hell... the only reason I didn't was because she never let me!

I have done far more her than her father ever did... I've bought tires for her car, taken her to Disneyland, snow skiing, allowed her to live rent free in a house for 3+ years... etc. She got herself into a bind taking like 25 college hours in order to graduate a semester early and I ended up passing a correspondence class for her. Yet, her dad is getting his 1,000,000th chance and I never got my 1st chance.

Only in the last 6 months or so, she seems to have softened up on me a little bit.. Like, acknowledging my presence at family get together. At least I'm not getting the dirty looks like I used to.

But all through that... her mom and I never had cross words...

It ended when she was in the middle of her Junior of HS... she went to live with her father... He promised her a brand new red sports car convertible, a brand new bedroom suite and to pay for her college.

She had a 3.95GPA when she was living with us. 18 months later, she was driving a 1972 Toyota pick up with no air or radio that she had to carry a jug of antifreeze with her to keep it filled up. Her clothes were still in card board boxes and she was sleeping on a mattress on the floor and she had to make a D in Senior English to graduate and she had an F...

The day she turned 18, her father turned on her with a vengeance. He started cursing her, calling her vulgar and profane names that I wouldn't call my worst enemy... See, since she was 18, he was no longer obligated to pay child support.. He made it impossible for her to continue to live with him.


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## CharlieParker (Aug 15, 2012)

heartsbeating said:


> I made changes. He did similarly for himself. It was actually observing him on his journey that influenced me to take mine.


I loved the whole post, but this happened to me too. She said f it and basically unilaterally for herself "let go of the little things". That change changed me for the better, and very, very quickly.


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## mablenc (Feb 26, 2013)

over20 said:


> That's why we all love you here on TAM, SA! Your everyone's favorite!


Did you see her post with all the kids and pregnant?


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## heartsbeating (May 2, 2011)

CharlieParker said:


> I loved the whole post, but this happened to me too. She said f it and basically unilaterally for herself "let go of the little things". That change changed me for the better, and very, very quickly.


Thank you 

Well, he delved into his past and as a result, started behaving differently. I knew that wasn't an easy path for him to take but I really admired that he did. He knew that was playing a part in our relationship. And then *light-bulb* ...oh I need to take responsibility too and deal with my own stuff. whodda thunk it?!


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## Miss Taken (Aug 18, 2012)

*Re: Re: Long Term Success In Marriage...*



Kria said:


> I didn't attack you or SA. Our view on attacks must be different. I just gave my list of grievances.


Nobody asked for your “list of grievances“. I find it ironic how you feel entitled to be heard by anyone on this thread all the while putting down a well respected member. You want her to stop talking about her sex life? I‘d like you to stop threadjacking what would‘ve been a positive thread with your put downs and negative vibes.

Seriously, is it something in the water? In the last two days or so, I‘ve seen what could have, and should have been positive threads turn ugly.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

Kria said:


> I didn't attack you or SA. Our view on attacks must be different. I just gave my list of grievances.


Ok Kria.. fair enough...what do you want to gain from this thread.. why did you click on it? We are all imperfect people struggling to make a life of happiness.. to enjoy our days on this earth... .none of us have it all together. Sometimes we even gain strength by having a partner by our side.. I know I feel that way. 

May I ask what your struggles are, do you feel there is hope.. or do you feel it is hopeless but you are just trying to make the best of it...find peace ??

Maybe you have kids, or a financial situation where you can't leave... or you are torn between leaving and staying ?? You mentioned sex being a Trigger .... are you the high driver.. I would have great compassion for you.. I pretty much have little for low drivers -which isn't nice to say and won't give me any brownie points on this forum .. but I look back over my past and hate myself for not being there enough for my husband.. which would have been so easy.. I was never tired.. I was just upset over not being able to conceive....years of trying... I had my sad times too...many tears... which caused him to not be as happy as well....but we didn't give up.. and well.. things worked out.. 

I know this is not always true for everyone, but we all need some *hope* to hang on to.. something to work towards.. to give us incentive to get through the day and believe for a better tomorrow..


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## mablenc (Feb 26, 2013)

SA, please don't stop being yourself, we love you and how you post.


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## the2ofus (Jan 28, 2014)

This site is called _talk about marriage_ not_ every marriage sucks and misery loves company_.


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## Kria (Aug 4, 2013)

Miss Taken said:


> Nobody asked for your “list of grievances“. I find it ironic how you feel entitled to be heard by anyone on this thread all the while putting down a well respected member. You want her to stop talking about her sex life? I‘d like you to stop threadjacking what would‘ve been a positive thread with your put downs and negative vibes.
> 
> Seriously, is it something in the water? In the last two days or so, I‘ve seen what could have, and should have been positive threads turn ugly.


Yep. There's something in the water that you just took a sip of. LOL! Also, I don't hold anyone to a hierarchy on a message board.


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## the2ofus (Jan 28, 2014)

We have been married 18 yrs and the specifics of what worked for us may not work for everyone. You have to discover from your own spouse what it is they need. You can't go ask someone else what your spouse needs.

The pieces of advice that we have gotten for keeping a marriage strong that seem to be universal were

1. When faced with a problem and your first “answer” fails, try again but don't beat yourself over the head saying the first “answer” is the only answer.
The pastor who performed our wedding told us the story of the curling iron. His wife had a curling iron that she always forgot to unplug. At first he kept getting mad at her for forgetting to unplug it. Finally she said if it's so easy to remember, you do it. So he took the challenge and soon learned it wasn't as easy as he thought. They kept trying different things until finally they found the curling iron that would shut itself off. He told us, he could have kept insisting on his way but what would that solve.

2. I will do it for you!
This same pastor gave the little sermonette at our wedding. He used the phrase from Robin Hood, where Maid Marion says I will do it for you. He just said I will do it for you should be our attitude, doing for the other not what we could get for ourselves. Whenever my husband says I will do it for you, I know what is really being said is, it would not be my idea of fun but I would love to do it for you because I love you and like putting a smile on your face.

3. Remember your spouses intentions towards you are not evil.
This was said by the pastor at my midwives wedding 5 yrs ago. Very timely message as the next few years would bring us thru really tough times and my husbands low T. Many, many times I held onto those words. I expressed my hurts to him and when he expressed his love I made an effort to remember that when he got really, really irritated with life.

4. Talk and Listen
Like Charlie said above talk. When something's wrong talk about it, really strive to listen and understand the other person.

5. Empathy
Never fail to remember they may be struggling too.

We've had rough times but we've always turned towards each other not turned on each other.


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## Thundarr (Jul 4, 2012)

Kria said:


> I don't believe you or anyone else on this site that says or makes statements like this. They are overstatements. Trying to come off better than you actually are. If your marriage has been good and consistent from the beginning, then you wouldn't be on a site like this and constantly. You wouldn't even be thinking to be on a site like this. People look up sites like this that are having or at least had problems in their marriages.


A seemingly unrelated google search can land people in many places including TAM. Just a little bit of navigation would take some to topics they feel compelled to comment on. I think you're putting everyone at TAM in the same bread basket.


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## Kria (Aug 4, 2013)

SimplyAmorous said:


> Ok Kria.. fair enough...what do you want to gain from this thread.. why did you click on it? We are all imperfect people struggling to make a life of happiness.. to enjoy our days on this earth... .none of us have it all together. Sometimes we even gain strength by having a partner by our side.. I know I feel that way.
> 
> May I ask what your struggles are, do you feel there is hope.. or do you feel it is hopeless but you are just trying to make the best of it...find peace ??
> 
> ...


When I clicked on this thread I was expecting just advice on the topic. Not someone saying that they were lucky that they had a good marriage from the beginning. That statement can be a trigger for those that haven't been so lucky especially right now.


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## the2ofus (Jan 28, 2014)

The things that make a marriage great is looking to see where the other person is coming from instead of just jumping to conclusions and "yelling" at others. It is no wonder that those who come on and put everyone down have never found a good relationship. 

There have been plenty of tools given here for those who might want to work towards a happy ever after.


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## Kria (Aug 4, 2013)

Thundarr said:


> I seemingly unrelated google search can land people in many place. Just a little bit of navigation would some topics they felt compelled to comment on. I think you're putting everyone at TAM in the same bread basket.


The original poster started this thread after being on this site a long time and knowing that many people here are having hardships.


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## the2ofus (Jan 28, 2014)

Kria I'm sorry your life has sucked but really if you want no triggers you will have to hide yourself away in a cave. We all have things in our lives that suck, dealing with the triggers is part of life.


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## the2ofus (Jan 28, 2014)

Kria said:


> The original poster started this thread after being on this site a long time and knowing that many people here are having hardships.


But he also knows quite a few of us that aren't!

We had an issue with my husbands T, that's how google led me here. I stay to help others see that their husband may not be an a$$. And now I've met friends that I enjoy hanging out with


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## mablenc (Feb 26, 2013)

Kria said:


> When I clicked on this thread I was expecting just advice on the topic. Not someone saying that they were lucky that they had a good marriage from the beginning. That statement can be a trigger for those that haven't been so lucky especially right now.


You can't live life being mad at others because you are unhappy. Only you have the power to change your situation. There is lots of support if you ask for help. Otherwise you are only going to be miserable being mad at the world, while everyone moves on with their life.


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## over20 (Nov 15, 2013)

mablenc said:


> Did you see her post with all the kids and pregnant?


Yes, soooooo cute!


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## heartsbeating (May 2, 2011)

the2ofus said:


> 5. Empathy
> Never fail to remember they may be struggling too.
> 
> We've had rough times but we've always turned towards each other not turned on each other.


Lovely! 

I love that empathy has been mentioned a few times in this thread.


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## Kria (Aug 4, 2013)

the2ofus said:


> Kria I'm sorry your life has sucked but really if you want no triggers you will have to hide yourself away in a cave. We all have things in our lives that suck, dealing with the triggers is part of life.


You know my whole life? I don't think so. Thanks for the condescending sorry.


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## Kria (Aug 4, 2013)

mablenc said:


> You can't live life being mad at others because you are unhappy. Only you have the power to change your situation. There is lots of support if you ask for help. Otherwise you are only going to be miserable being mad at the world, while everyone moves on with their life.


You were pretty mad and mean with your earlier comments to me on this thread when my points weren't even about or directed to you originally. You can take some of your own advice too.


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## Kria (Aug 4, 2013)

Mrs. John Adams said:


> Caribbean man started this thread to be a POSITIVE thread amid so many sad threads.
> 
> Why can't we have a thread that concentrates on the good instead of the bad?
> 
> ...


Says the woman that has to use a name putting more importance on her husband which makes you come off like a stepford wife.


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## Thundarr (Jul 4, 2012)

Kria said:


> The original poster started this thread after being on this site a long time and knowing that many people here are having hardships.


ehh it sucks you quoted me before I fixed my quote . Ehh that's my fault. So I've read more of your post and empathize more with your point.

More usable advice/guidelines would be helpful. So for my part, it takes two responsible partners proud of who they're with and each being a person their partner can be proud of. That means being responsible, defending their partner and defending themselves (sometimes from their partner). It means acting in ways that make you proud of yourself. That sometimes mean calling out the person you love. After all how can they love you if you don't love yourself.


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## Miss Taken (Aug 18, 2012)

*Re: Re: Long Term Success In Marriage...*



Kria said:


> When I clicked on this thread I was expecting just advice on the topic. Not someone saying that they were lucky that they had a good marriage from the beginning. That statement can be a trigger for those that haven't been so lucky especially right now.


And as soon as you realized this thread did not live up to your expectations, you could have left. Instead you‘re trying to rain on everyone else‘s parade because you‘re not “lucky“ or happy.

My relationship isn‘t perfect and you know what? I LOVED every single positive post in this thread. You can be happy for other people‘s happiness or be bitter and spew venom or you can just ignore it. What you can‘t do is change the world and stifle others so that you‘ll be more comfortable.

It is really hard to feel sorry for your circumstances when you are spreading so much hate. (“I hate you all. Now feel compassion for me and give me your best advice.“) Yeah, no.

FYI, I don‘t have a hierarchy for posters but I do prefer people who are kind.


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## over20 (Nov 15, 2013)

Kria said:


> Says the woman that has to use a name putting more importance on her husband which makes you come off like a stepford wife.


That was not nice to say of Mrs. Ja. She is a very respected woman here with wise advice.


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## Kria (Aug 4, 2013)

over20 said:


> That was not nice to say of Mrs. Ja. She is a very respected woman here with wise advice.


Her comments to me weren't very respectful so I gave it right back to her.


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## Kria (Aug 4, 2013)

Miss Taken said:


> And as soon as you realized this thread did not live up to your expectations, you could have left. Instead you‘re trying to rain on everyone else‘s parade because you‘re not “lucky“ or happy.
> 
> My relationship isn‘t perfect and you know what? I LOVED every single positive post in this thread. You can be happy for other people‘s happiness or be bitter and spew venom or you can just ignore it. What you can‘t do is change the world and stifle others so that you‘ll be more comfortable.
> 
> ...


I agreed with some of the posts just not all. I don't have to leave a thread because of that and I can post a response just like everyone else if I choose to. Also, I never said anything about hate. Just dislike. There's a difference.


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## Miss Taken (Aug 18, 2012)

*Re: Re: Long Term Success In Marriage...*



Kria said:


> Her comments to me weren't very respectful so I gave it right back to her.


Pot meet kettle. Your posts are full of disrespect.


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## the2ofus (Jan 28, 2014)

Kria said:


> You know my whole life? I don't think so. Thanks for the condescending sorry.


So if there's good in your life why don't you share it with us. 

And that sorry was not condescending.


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## over20 (Nov 15, 2013)

Caribbean Man said:


> ...Is it even remotely possible , or even desirable?
> 
> Every day the news from the marriage front seems to get bleaker and bleaker. Not only on TAM, but generally , the statistics tell us that everywhere, people are giving up on their marriages , and those who aren't married as yet, seem to be pursuing other options.
> 
> ...




Let's get back to the OP's question. CM I feel a couple has to learn to forgive a lot....A LOT. Forgiveness covers a multitude of sins. Humor would be a close second.

Can you share CM if you the two of you are doing something special for you 20th?


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## calvin (Jan 7, 2012)

Mrs. John Adams said:


> oh ..have you ever read the story of Mr and Mrs john Adams? quite a love story those two share...i am quite proud to share their name...and quite proud to share my husbands name....step ford wife? ok by me...i am happy
> 
> you obviously ..are not



_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Kria (Aug 4, 2013)

the2ofus said:


> So if there's good in your life why don't you share it with us.
> 
> And that sorry was not condescending.


Saying someone's whole life sucks that you don't know and saying sorry in the same sentence is condescending to me. 

Also, after all of the crazy comments said to me by many people that I wasn't even originally addressing, why would I want to give further ammunition for personal attacks?


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## Miss Taken (Aug 18, 2012)

*Re: Re: Long Term Success In Marriage...*



Kria said:


> I agreed with some of the posts just not all. I don't have to leave a thread because of that and I can post a response just like everyone else if I choose to. Also, I never said anything about hate. Just dislike. There's a difference.


Fair enough. And anyone who dissents with your responses is free to respond to you just as MJA did.


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## Kria (Aug 4, 2013)

Mrs. John Adams said:


> oh ..have you ever read the story of Mr and Mrs john Adams? quite a love story those two share...i am quite proud to share their name...and quite proud to share my husbands name....step ford wife? ok by me...i am happy
> 
> you obviously ..are not


Your life is not completely obvious here. You give out only the parts that you want people to know.


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## Kria (Aug 4, 2013)

Miss Taken said:


> Fair enough. And anyone who dissents with your responses is free to respond to you just as MJA did.


Of course. Nothing new. They give it, I give and vice versa.


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## Kria (Aug 4, 2013)

Mrs. John Adams said:


> lol...seriously?
> 
> ok


Laughing is good. Breaks up all the too serious vibes going back and forth here.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

A little of my Husband's thoughts... I asked him once what HE feels is the biggest problem in Marriages today.. he answers Stubbornness... when a couple has conflict... they put up a wall...or give attitude, which leads to defenses....each wants the other to cave 1st and say they are sorry.. humbling themselves admitting where they went wrong or could have done better.. 

It is something he has always given ME.. which has been a good example to me.. we are both quick to admit our faults, and flaws to each other ...(when I say quick, I mean within an hour or so, not allowing the sun to go down on our anger )... which brings us closer together ...Walking in Forgiveness, not expecting perfection...and forbearing with each other is a very big part of this...


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## over20 (Nov 15, 2013)

SimplyAmorous said:


> A little of my Husband's thoughts... I asked him once what HE feels is the biggest problem in Marriages today.. he answers Stubbornness... when a couple has conflict... they put up a wall...or give attitude, which leads to defenses....each wants the other to cave 1st and say they are sorry.. humbling themselves admitting where they went wrong or could have done better..
> 
> It is something he has always given ME.. which has been a good example to me.. we are both quick to admit our faults, and flaws to each other ...(when I say quick, I mean within an hour or so, not allowing the sun to go down on our anger )... which brings us closer together ...Walking in Forgiveness, not expecting perfection...and forbearing with each other is a very big part of this...




Very good point. Stubbornness halts growth. Growth is dependent on both partners humbling themselves. To be humble is to be able to see one's faults.


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## meson (May 19, 2011)

over20 said:


> Let's get back to the OP's question. CM I feel a couple has to learn to forgive a lot....A LOT. Forgiveness covers a multitude of sins. Humor would be a close second.
> 
> Can you share CM if you the two of you are doing something special for you 20th?


Yes, let's concentrate on CMan's questions! Forgiveness, letting go of hurt and anger and moving forward with a resolution to address the transgression has helped our marriage. 

We fixed the majority of our marital issues without it before I came to TAM. But my wife's faith in my commitment to our marriage and her forgiveness for my EA were essential.


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## Miss Taken (Aug 18, 2012)

Kria said:


> Of course. Nothing new. They give it, I give and vice versa.


Okay then. But do you see how the below is totally hypocritical thing to say?



Kria said:


> *Also, after all of the crazy comments said to me by many people that I wasn't even originally addressing, why would I want to give further ammunition for personal attacks?*


You feel you have a right to a voice on this open thread, (which unless you're banned, you do) but seem to take issue when other people comment on the things you say because you "weren't originally addressing" them personally? 

Sorry, if you want to have a private chat, send a PM. Otherwise, be prepared that if you address one person publicly, on an open thread that others will have something to say about it.

This thread was not put up FOR you so it's not going to be tailored to your specific wants and needs. Why do you seem to feel like your comments are okay and others are not? Also, why do you completely ignore the vitriol in your posts on this thread, when confronted, deny being attacking and then you yourself feel attacked?

When you point the finger at anyone, don't forget there are usually three pointing back at yourself. I don't know if it's intentional but your posts do 1) come across as attacking, condescending and rude. and 2) you seem to be unaware of that at all. 

You're not a victim in this conflict Kria and you started it and continue to perpetuate it by being rude and condescending.


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## over20 (Nov 15, 2013)

meson said:


> Yes, let's concentrate on CMan's questions! Forgiveness, letting go of hurt and anger and moving forward with a resolution to address the transgression has helped our marriage.
> 
> We fixed the majority of our marital issues without it before I came to TAM. But my wife's faith in my commitment to our marriage and her forgiveness for my EA were essential.


Thank you for sharing, great story. She must have seen a great change in you.


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## Kria (Aug 4, 2013)

Miss Taken said:


> Okay then. But do you see how the below is totally hypocritical thing to say?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


We're all not going to like each other's comments. It's to be expected and sometimes not so nicely done. PM's are a good idea. Wonder why you didn't use it with these messages? hmm.


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## Miss Taken (Aug 18, 2012)

Quoting you here is easier. Do you take issue with being addressed personally within an open thread?


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## mablenc (Feb 26, 2013)

meson said:


> Yes, let's concentrate on CMan's questions! Forgiveness, letting go of hurt and anger and moving forward with a resolution to address the transgression has helped our marriage.
> 
> We fixed the majority of our marital issues without it before I came to TAM. But my wife's faith in my commitment to our marriage and her forgiveness for my EA were essential.


I feel that when we have enough deposits in the love bank, you can or are able to forgive and reconcile as you have something to hold on. It gives you more perspective in seeing a situation as a mistake rather than a deliberate action against your spouse. I'm not saying it is easy or that there is no harm caused.

Maybe like a good insurance policy to rebuild after a tornado. There is high damage, and things are broken, lost and won't be the same. But there's a foundation to build on and sometimes the house is even bigger, nicer and stronger.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

Kria said:


> I don't believe you or anyone else on this site that says or makes statements like this. They are overstatements. Trying to come off better than you actually are. If your marriage has been good and consistent from the beginning, then you wouldn't be on a site like this and constantly. You wouldn't even be thinking to be on a site like this. People look up sites like this that are having or at least had problems in their marriages.


I actually stumbled across this site when I was looking to read more about a fetish I have. That fetish isn't a problem since my wife is okay with my thing. So I didn't come here because I had a problem with my marriage.


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## ReformedHubby (Jan 9, 2013)

As long as both parties understand that a successful marriage isn't the same as the "perfect" marriage they are half way there. There will be conflict and difficult times. Its how you handle it that is the biggest difference between successful and unsuccessful marriages in my opinion.

I think the reason that my wife and I are so happy together is that we have really short memories when it comes to the bad times. Don't get me wrong, the bad times we've experienced were downright awful (infidelity, financial issues, etc. etc.). But when we are going through difficult times we are always respectful of one another, and when the storm passes we generally don't look back or hold grudges. Usually during difficult times we often talk about the good times and what it will take to get back there.

Regarding the secret to maintaining attraction. Chemistry is really important on this one. One thing I do know is that we are always touching. Even if we are just sitting on the couch my arm is around her, or her legs are on me. We also hug and kiss all the time. Other couples sometimes mock us for this but we don't care. I don't think I have one single photograph of us not touching or embracing each other in some way. We've been together almost twenty years and I still feel electricity when we embrace.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Mrs. Conan and I will celebrate 19 years married in August, 23 years together total.

I have sometimes been at a loss to explain success in relationships to others. Part of me coming to TAM has been to improve my ability to express concepts to others.

I think sometimes success might be based on personalities. Might be the case with us.

When I met my wife, I was not looking for a relationship at all.

My plans were to go into a very dangerous career, live single, and probably be dead before 30.
When I first saw my wife it was like magic, divine inspiration, being struck by lightning?

She was the only woman that I had to have a date with, the attraction was mutual.
What immediately worked for us was that I was the only man who had ever fought, literally, for her. We were in Montana and to this day there are a lot of men who will "test" boundaries in a very physical way.

There was a man who laid hands on her when he was drunk. Didn't get too far as my wife is fierce and quite physically powerful. When I heard of the transgression, in my mind, he was a dead man. I looked for him the following day but he kept out of sight. So I found his friends and let them know simply that their friend was dead.
Didn't see him but my wife came home from work with a grin on her face the next day and told me how the offender had come to her groveling and begging for forgiveness. He had actually got down on his knees. I let him live.

On her part, she , to this day, makes me laugh so hard that I cry. 
She is also tenacious and has held on to me through rough times sometimes brought on by myself. I don't believe there could be many women who would be married to me. There are many who would sleep with me but couldn't endure my personality.

She has never let go or given up and neither of us has ever "settled" for mediocrity. We have both helped each other grow into stronger and more developed individuals.

To this day, my heart stops sometimes when I look at her, and she still blushes like a shy school girl.
Even when we fail, we treat each other like winners and expect each other to act like winners.


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## meson (May 19, 2011)

over20 said:


> Thank you for sharing, great story. She must have seen a great change in you.


It took a long time for her to notice the change but she did eventually. I had to overcome the conditioning for years of toxic communication. Then when she felt comfortable to approach me with she expressed a desire for change.

So many here say I've been better for weeks or months and my spouse isn't responding. The longer you are in a bad way the longer it will take to establish the new pattern. For me it was well over a year. But once the new pattern is established you get the benefit of the doubt instead of the negative assumption. 

I think that if the EA had happened during our bad times, it would have ended the marriage. The positive and nurturing relationship was in the end the best thing to keep the EA from getting worse.


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## meson (May 19, 2011)

mablenc said:


> I feel that when we have enough deposits in the love bank, you can or are able to forgive and reconcile as you have something to hold on. It gives you more perspective in seeing a situation as a mistake rather than a deliberate action against your spouse. I'm not saying it is easy or that there is no harm caused.
> 
> Maybe like a good insurance policy to rebuild after a tornado. There is high damage, and things are broken, lost and won't be the same. But there's a foundation to build on and sometimes the house is even bigger, nicer and stronger.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


:iagree::iagree::iagree:

Most definitely! Mrs. meson trusted me precisely because our relationship was strong. She talked to me about my girlfriend and because of our strong relationship and mutual respect, I listened to what she had to say without being dismissive. Because of my respect for her and her commitment to the marriage it made it possible for me to finally come to grips with what I was doing.

The best way to protect a marriage is to keep it strong and alive.


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

Amplexor said:


> *Quality Time* Huge amounts of time for us. 50 - 60 hours a week. Easier now then it was when the kids were younger.



Unless you won Powerball or inherited a large sum or two, I don't see how two working people would find this time even if they only work 40 hrs a week each.

Also regardless of physical work of your work is demanding mentally at the end of the day all I want is a bicycle ride and some time alone to decompress....


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## committed4ever (Nov 13, 2012)

john117 said:


> Unless you won Powerball or inherited a large sum or two, I don't see how two working people would find this time even if they only work 40 hrs a week each.
> 
> Also regardless of physical work of your work is demanding mentally at the end of the day all I want is a bicycle ride and some time alone to decompress....


LOL John I'm sure two working people would not be able to do this unless they worked together. 

Have you ever posted ANY thing positive about marriage? ANY marriage??? LOL! Just joking. Kinda.


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## Amplexor (Feb 13, 2008)

john117 said:


> Unless you won Powerball or inherited a large sum or two, I don't see how two working people would find this time even if they only work 40 hrs a week each.
> 
> Also regardless of physical work of your work is demanding mentally at the end of the day all I want is a bicycle ride and some time alone to decompress....


No inheritance, no Power Ball. I work 40 - 45 hours, she is closer to 50. We decompress together.

We just make sure we have time together. It's easier now then it was in the past. We have one left at home, he has a car, a girlfriend and is very active in school activities. So we are together a lot. We also have common interests in music, sports & hobbies during our evenings. We always have dinner together as a family and make plenty of time for each other on the weekends. A few years ago, we probably didn't spend 20 hours a week together.


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## the2ofus (Jan 28, 2014)

John117~Hopefully your spouse gets that time to do what she wants as well.

I believe it is important to know yourself before getting married. For example if like john 117 you need time to decompress alone, don't marry someone whose love language is time. If you are already married to someone whose love language is time then you have to compromise. And for me sometimes that means looking at my husband and realizing his needs and seeing if mine are really needs or just wants. Sometimes I give up my wants to meet his needs.

My husband likes to relax by reading, I like to visit but I have found him reading to me, while we cuddle, works for both of us. Sometimes he likes to stay up reading, him reading in bed while he holds my hand and I fall asleep works for both of us.

I think the big thing is both of us desiring the others happiness. Wanting to meet their needs goes a long way.


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

40 hours a week together is nearly 6 hours a day 7 days a week. 

Unless you count time being physically in the house together but not interacting... Or watching TV 2-3 hours a day...

We have very few things in common, granted, but I do not see marriage as two people being constantly together. 

If I'm mowing the lawn and she's picking up leaves that's time charged to together? Grocery shopping? Commuting together?

Yikes 

I would take an hour of meaningful interaction over a week of doing chores together any time. 

To answer the original question, to succeed in long term it's mostly expectations and living the simple life.

Crank up life's complexity and unless you and your spouse were just canonized it ain't happening. If you take the more blissful approach to life it also helps.


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## meson (May 19, 2011)

Amplexor said:


> No inheritance, no Power Ball. I work 40 - 45 hours, she is closer to 50. We decompress together.
> 
> We just make sure we have time together. It's easier now then it was in the past. We have one left at home, he has a car, a girlfriend and is very active in school activities. So we are together a lot. We also have common interests in music, sports & hobbies during our evenings. We always have dinner together as a family and make plenty of time for each other on the weekends. A few years ago, we probably didn't spend 20 hours a week together.


Wow compared to CMan and Amp, we don't put in nearly as much time per week, 10-20 hours. But to me the operative word is quality time which is when we are engaged with each other in a reciprocal fashion. Sometimes we can watch a movie or TV for hours but if there is no interaction between is it is not quality time. But if we watch TV and share our speculations on the plot, the quality of the show etc., then it is quality time. 

Dinner is a big one at our house also. We have family dinner nearly every night. Sometimes chores can be quality time. Last night we had to rescue a snake caught in some netting used to keep deer from eating plants. We struggled for an hour controlling the snake and carefully snipping the mesh coils from it. We really had to work together to make progress. In the end we rescued the snake and reinforced a team spirit and felt better for not being responsible for it dying. Now I understand what those cheesy team building company exercises are trying to achieve. 

All of that being said we also need individual time away doing other things. It is what keeps us growing as individuals. We then bring that experience to our relationship during our quality time together. This has been essential in our continuing to grow as a couple. A little over a year ago we took something that overlapped a couple of our individual pursuits and started backpacking. Since then we have explored new territories (for us) nearby, hiked a good portion of the Appalachian trail in our State and a neighboring State. It will culminate in an 84mile trek out west in a month. It is all the result of trying to merge our differing interests into a new shared activity by continuing to grow. It's hard for complacency to set in now that we are injecting new experiences into our relationship.


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

The corollary here is to find the female version of good ole' Dr. John here... Highly educated, pretty intelligent, way laid back, enjoys video games, photography, travel, Game of Thrones and similar TV and literature, obscure progressive music....

Mean while good ole' Dr. Mrs. John is also highly educated, reasonably intelligent (except math where she's extremely intelligent), dislikes travel, likes Lifetime Movie Network movies and assorted chick flicks, and only listens to her birth country's music. 

Back then we had more things in common like college, our research, our kids... But again, do you count the endless hours studying together as together time?


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## the2ofus (Jan 28, 2014)

john117 said:


> Back then we had more things in common like college, our research, our kids... But again, do you count the endless hours studying together as together time?


Each couple has to decide that for themselves. Does it fill their love tank or drain it. 

By the way I don't think there are an magic number of hours that make it work. I don't think having a date night will save your marriage. I don't think there are any formulas to make a marriage work. Love and respect are the key components. And what that looks like will differ between couples. What one couple thinks is fun teasing may destroy anothers marriage. 

It's just like raising kids. We have 6 kids and the relationship with each kid needs something different. If I use the same methods with #3 and #6, one of them is not gonna get what they need.


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

Amplexor said:


> No inheritance, no Power Ball. I work 40 - 45 hours, she is closer to 50. We decompress together.
> 
> *We just make sure we have time together.*
> 
> * We always have dinner together as a family and make plenty of time for each other on the weekends.*


Same with my wife and I. We have no kids and we both work together so the hours are basically covered.

However , regarding quality time, we ALWAYS have our meals together. We usually talk about anything and everything during meal time.


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

The biggest item is motivation to keep the marriage running - ie not checking out... Anything else is largely gravy. 

My parents kept the marriage running for 45 plus years, no quality time or common interests. They were even further apart than me and my wife in terms of interests... My in laws were reasonably similar for all the good it did them


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

john117 said:


> The corollary here is to find the female version of good ole' Dr. John here... Highly educated, pretty intelligent, way laid back, enjoys video games, photography, travel, Game of Thrones and similar TV and literature, obscure progressive music....
> 
> Mean while good ole' Dr. Mrs. John is also highly educated, reasonably intelligent (except math where she's extremely intelligent), dislikes travel, likes Lifetime Movie Network movies and assorted chick flicks, and only listens to her birth country's music.
> 
> *Back then we had more things in common like college, our research, our kids... But again, do you count the endless hours studying together as together time?*


I think I understand what you're saying , and yes , I would count the time you spent back then doing research and studying together as quality time together, because you were both pursuing your dreams_ together._

My hobbies and TV shows are the extreme polar opposite of my wife's.
She loves chic flicks and lifetime , I like discovery and history channels. I had to go see thew Godzilla movie by myself.:rofl:

But there are common grounds of interests, [ that's wht we got married in the first place] and we try to exploit them.

She loves water, the beach , river ,waterfall, and so do I.
She loves to travel and so do I.
We like the same type of foods. we have the same sense of humor ,we appreciate art , drama, musicals and so on.
So I am constantly on the lookout for opportunities we can enjoy doing together.

That works for us.


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

ReformedHubby said:


> As long as both parties understand that a successful marriage isn't the same as the "perfect" marriage they are half way there. There will be conflict and difficult times. Its how you handle it that is the biggest difference between successful and unsuccessful marriages in my opinion.
> 
> I think the reason that my wife and I are so happy together is that we have really short memories when it comes to the bad times. Don't get me wrong, the bad times we've experienced were downright awful (infidelity, financial issues, etc. etc.). But when we are going through difficult times we are always respectful of one another, and when the storm passes we generally don't look back or hold grudges. Usually during difficult times we often talk about the good times and what it will take to get back there.
> 
> Regarding the secret to maintaining attraction. Chemistry is really important on this one.* One thing I do know is that we are always touching. Even if we are just sitting on the couch my arm is around her, or her legs are on me. We also hug and kiss all the time. Other couples sometimes mock us for this but we don't care. I don't think I have one single photograph of us not touching or embracing each other in some way. We've been together almost twenty years and I still feel electricity when we embrace.*


When I saw your family portrait you posted, I noticed that your hands were around your wife's waist and she was smiling a full smile.
Your kids too were smiling but her smile was _different.._.


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## CharlieParker (Aug 15, 2012)

I've said it before and recently, she is a quality time person. When we get home we hang around the kitchen island and gab. Eventually dinner will be prepared. A "30 minute" meal can take up to 90 minutes to make. In nice weather we'll stay on the patio for while longer with some wine (winter is usually TV time). 

Cooking and stuff associated with it are a close second behind sex (ok not that close).


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

john117 said:


> I would take an hour of meaningful interaction over a week of doing chores together any time.
> 
> To answer the original question, to succeed in long term *it's mostly expectations and living the simple life.*
> 
> Crank up life's complexity and unless you and your spouse were just canonized it ain't happening. If you take the more blissful approach to life it also helps.


:iagree:

I have been thinking a lot about this the last few days. I went to visit SA and her family, and enjoyed it so much. Such nice people, working together to make a good life for themselves and their children. So heart-warming. 

Sometimes I get sidetracked by stupid stuff, unreasonable expectations, or just letting my feelings get hurt by things that really don't matter. And then I run to dh, and if he doesn't say exactly what I want to hear, or do things exactly the way I want them done, I snap and pout. It is so silly. And he forgives me anyway. Always extending grace.

I think we make marriage so much harder than it needs to be. There needs to be commitment. And then, as john says, low expectations. I don't mean letting each other sleep around and break the bank and stuff like that. I mean overlooking the little things, talking about the things that do matter, extending grace, and always offering compassion and understanding, even if belatedly. 

For a long, successful marriage, he doesn't have to be a millionaire, and she doesn't have to be a cover girl. They just have to feel good together, and commit to both doing whatever it takes for them to always feel good together.


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## CharlieParker (Aug 15, 2012)

jld said:


> I mean overlooking the little things, talking about the things that do matter, extending grace, and always offering compassion and understanding, even if belatedly.
> 
> For a long, successful marriage, he doesn't have to be a millionaire, and she doesn't have to be a cover girl. They just have to feel good together, and commit to both doing whatever it takes for them to always feel good together.


Well put.


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

Your emphasis on commitment reminds me of what john117 said about his parents, JA. Did you know that john's mother was in the Resistance in his country? She could have been stopped and tortured by the Gestapo at any time. But she continued with her work, risking her life, just because she knew it was the right and necessary thing to do.

I wonder what would happen to our divorce rate if people just committed to doing the right and necessary thing, no matter the cost to themselves. Could it go down to 20%, or even less?


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## Anonymous07 (Aug 4, 2012)

SimplyAmorous said:


> A little of my Husband's thoughts... I asked him once what HE feels is the biggest problem in Marriages today.. he answers Stubbornness... when a couple has conflict... they put up a wall...or give attitude, which leads to defenses....each wants the other to cave 1st and say they are sorry.. humbling themselves admitting where they went wrong or could have done better..
> 
> It is something he has always given ME.. which has been a good example to me.. we are both quick to admit our faults, and flaws to each other ...(when I say quick, I mean within an hour or so, not allowing the sun to go down on our anger )... which brings us closer together ...Walking in Forgiveness, not expecting perfection...and forbearing with each other is a very big part of this...


:iagree:

I see this as a problem in my own marriage. My husband can be very stubborn and it only makes things worse. Last night for example, as he stubbornly held his side instead of supporting me, we argued for hours. I was trying to show him just how much he hurt me, but he wouldn't see it until past midnight. Hopefully, it's all a work in progress as we agreed to different things last night, but we'll see.


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

My folks showed me that staggering differences can be overcome. My brother showed me that even joined at the hip one could be in a lousy marriage...

I asked my Mom why she did all these crazy things in her youth, Resistance to working a high profile job to blowing a whistle to getting fired to suing the government and winning and being reinstated... Interestingly enough she used the word "commitment" as well 

My Dad the Army guy simply said "duty"...


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## Amplexor (Feb 13, 2008)

Mrs. John Adams said:


> oh baby...i so flippin adore you! That was so spot on!


Somebody throw a bucket of water on these two!!


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## the2ofus (Jan 28, 2014)

Amplexor~ you must be of my middle sons opinion. He always says "ew gross", when we kiss, while our 3rd born says "oooh do it again" 

Affection is important in whatever way you show it as long as they feel loved.


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## mablenc (Feb 26, 2013)

Amplexor said:


> Somebody throw a bucket of water on these two!!


:rofl::rofl::rofl:


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Caribbean Man said:


> I think I understand what you're saying , and yes , I would count the time you spent back then doing research and studying together as quality time together, because you were both pursuing your dreams_ together._
> 
> My hobbies and TV shows are the extreme polar opposite of my wife's.
> She loves chic flicks and lifetime , I like discovery and history channels. I had to go see thew Godzilla movie by myself.:rofl:
> ...


Love this post.

I got Mrs. Conan to go to Godzilla with me by taking her to Moms night out.
But she is a good balance for me to see the softer side of things.

We otherwise love many of the same things and have learned from each other to appreciate new things.

She couldn't stand mixed martial arts when we met but now begs to go to live fights!:smthumbup:


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## ReformedHubby (Jan 9, 2013)

Caribbean Man said:


> When I saw your family portrait you posted, I noticed that your hands were around your wife's waist and she was smiling a full smile.
> Your kids too were smiling but her smile was _different.._.


Funny you should say that. There have been many times in my life after introducing someone to my wife, the very next time they see me they comment that they can tell how much she loves me by the way she looks at me and acts around me. Sometimes they say they wish they had the same thing which makes me sad for them.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

ReformedHubby said:


> Funny you should say that. There have been many times in my life after introducing someone to my wife, the very next time they see me they comment that they can tell how much she loves me by the way she looks at me and acts around me. Sometimes they say they wish they had the same thing which makes me sad for them.


I think it is kinda weird that more couples don't show affection wherever they are.

Mrs. Conan and I have been scolded for being affectionate, nothing more than a hug or "nice" kiss, in church.

A couple of days ago she was squeezing my bicep at the gym and a man half jokingly told us "enough of that", I responded to him same as the church people, I held up my left hand and said "It's okay, we have a license." Makes them laugh and puts my position on the matter on solid ground.


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## sidney2718 (Nov 2, 2013)

Trickster said:


> The problem with that is that there is no activity in long teem success i. Marriage section. The most active threads is infidelity as well as Sex in marriage.
> 
> 
> Do we stay in an unloving marriage in hopes that it gets better or do we bail?
> ...


Well, that's an interesting question. Some might try to improve things (for them at least) by going outside the marriage. Others say that should never be done -- it is, they say, better to divorce than to cheat in any way.

And yet the evidence seems to be that many do seek comfort outside the marriage. That doesn't mean a PA. It could be a mild EA, for example, or even (as many women do) a friend in whom one can confide.

Indeed, I would say that a marriage of any decent length that has not experienced stress should be caught, quick frozen, and sent off to the nearest university for detailed study.


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## sidney2718 (Nov 2, 2013)

mablenc said:


> You and I have had this conversation too, it's a matter of communication and willingness to listen to your spouse.


I think that's fundamental. Without communication, which for me includes a willingness to listen, the marriage will fail. And sooner rather than later.


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## mablenc (Feb 26, 2013)

sidney2718 said:


> I think that's fundamental. Without communication, which for me includes a willingness to listen, the marriage will fail. And sooner rather than later.


If all else fails, I throw myself off one step! :rofl:


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## sidney2718 (Nov 2, 2013)

Referring to Mrs. John Adams, Kria wrote:



Kria said:


> Says the woman that has to use a name putting more importance on her husband which makes you come off like a stepford wife.


The history of the marriage between Mr. and Mrs. John Adams is very interesting. It seems to be a model of how to have a loving marriage. We have their letters and other things from them, but we do not, of course, know all the details.

But it is probably a good assumption that they successfully fought their way through a number of problems. I can't envision a marriage without them.

Times change. The change I've seen in my lifetime alone is amazing. It took a long, hard, and still unfinished fight to get women the rights and respect they have today. So Mr. and Mrs. John Adams may appear to bury the wife in the husband's name, it would be disrespectful to history to refer to them any other way.


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## sidney2718 (Nov 2, 2013)

Amplexor said:


> No inheritance, no Power Ball. I work 40 - 45 hours, she is closer to 50. We decompress together.
> 
> We just make sure we have time together. It's easier now then it was in the past. We have one left at home, he has a car, a girlfriend and is very active in school activities. So we are together a lot. We also have common interests in music, sports & hobbies during our evenings. We always have dinner together as a family and make plenty of time for each other on the weekends. A few years ago, we probably didn't spend 20 hours a week together.


I'd like to stress what Amp said above about having dinner together. My wife and I did that, before kids, during kids, and still today with the nest empty. It was a time where we all talked about our day's activities, what happened, and how we felt.

And it was a great parenting opportunity. I recall one day when one of my children, then still relatively young, had nothing but complaints day after day. My wife looked at her one day and said we have a new rule: nobody can complain unless they first tell about something good that happened. The penalty was loss of dessert.

As it happened, the very next day I vented about something straight away. My young child looked at mom and said, "Does daddy lose his dessert?"

This was actually a crisis point. A bad lesson might occur. Were we going to insist that rules are only for children? Or were fathers immune from rules? My wife looked at me and said, "no dessert for you."

I knew she was right and apologized. I had no dessert that night.


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

sidney2718 said:


> I think that's fundamental. Without communication, *which for me includes a willingness to listen*, the marriage will fail. And sooner rather than later.


Sometimes we forget that effective communication involves listening.
Some people only want _their_ point of view to be heard, and aren't willing to listen.

What adds fuel to the fire is when a partner feels they are entitled to thak kind of biased, preferential treatment and the other partner isn't, because of their gender.


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

ConanHub said:


> Mrs. Conan and I will celebrate 19 years married in August, 23 years together total.
> 
> I have sometimes been at a loss to explain success in relationships to others. Part of me coming to TAM has been to improve my ability to express concepts to others.
> 
> ...



Loved your post Conan!

I could have written it myself.

I remember when we were just married my wife used to work for my cousin at her business.
She complained to me that there was this guy at work who used to harass her, and tell her all sorts of sexual stuff that she wasn't interested in hearing from him.

She asked me to com pick her up from work one evening and 
" pay him a visit."

So I showed up at her workplace next afternoon and I never saw him.
Apparently he used the rear exit.

My wife told me he called in two days after and quit the job.


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## sidney2718 (Nov 2, 2013)

jld said:


> Your emphasis on commitment reminds me of what john117 said about his parents, JA. Did you know that john's mother was in the Resistance in his country? She could have been stopped and tortured by the Gestapo at any time. But she continued with her work, risking her life, just because she knew it was the right and necessary thing to do.
> 
> I wonder what would happen to our divorce rate if people just committed to doing the right and necessary thing, no matter the cost to themselves. Could it go down to 20%, or even less?


I agree. But it isn't just too little commitment. It is also too much entitlement. Many seem to feel that if they cannot have most of what they want, they will be unhappy.


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

johnAdams said:


> It is interesting, that when my wife came to TAM several months after me she chose the name Mrs. John Adams. I remember asking her why not be Priscilla or some other name.* She said because she is Mrs. John Adams and wanted that to be clear on her posts.*


Based on some of the pics I've seen with both of you in it, DEFINITELY she's yours!!


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## Fozzy (Jul 20, 2013)

Choosing a spouse is like choosing a tattoo. You're going to be staring at it a long time, so choose wisely.

I'm talking to you, dude with Ren and Stimpy on his arm.


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## doubletrouble (Apr 23, 2013)

To answer your OP, CM, I had a long term marriage -- 19 years. It was held together the last 8 or 9 by her cancer, not because the marriage was good. 

My first marriage was 10 years; she cheated on me with her married professor. 

I hope my picker is tuned better now.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Caribbean Man said:


> Loved your post Conan!
> 
> I could have written it myself.
> 
> ...


Ha Ha!!!:lol:

Not so much fun being pushy with a woman when her husband shows up is it?

In our case, the jerk ended up becoming a better man. He has outdone all his siblings in success in life and while we aren't friends, we are on good terms.

Looks like yours lacked enough character to face himself and change, or, you scared him so bad that he crapped his brains out and kept running.:smthumbup:


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## heartsbeating (May 2, 2011)

Fozzy said:


> Choosing a spouse is like choosing a tattoo. You're going to be staring at it a long time, so choose wisely.
> 
> I'm talking to you, dude with Ren and Stimpy on his arm.


Choose wisely... and preferably when you're not high.


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## the2ofus (Jan 28, 2014)

Mrs. John Adams said:


> CM...I have never been ashamed of taking my husbands name...i have never hyphenated my name...and you are very right...i am HIS..and so glad


Your such a stepford wife :rofl:

Funny thing is I have an aquaintance who has chosen to keep her maiden name but as my husband points out she's still taking a man's name, it's just her father not her husband. I'd much rather take my husband's name.

So to end taking a man's name I would have to take my maternal grandmother's, mother's maiden name. Luckily she changed it when her and her sister came into the US over 100 yrs ago, otherwise I'd have to find out Eve's last name.


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## sidney2718 (Nov 2, 2013)

the2ofus said:


> Your such a stepford wife :rofl:
> 
> Funny thing is I have an aquaintance who has chosen to keep her maiden name but as my husband points out she's still taking a man's name, it's just her father not her husband. I'd much rather take my husband's name.
> 
> So to end taking a man's name I would have to take my maternal grandmother's, mother's maiden name. Luckily she changed it when her and her sister came into the US over 100 yrs ago, otherwise I'd have to find out Eve's last name.


There are lots of reasons for keeping a name. If you are a woman in a profession and have made a name for yourself under your maiden name, taking your husband's name can make you vanish.

What I've seen happen is that Ms. Smith marries Mr. Jones. They keep their names. Children are either Smith-Jones or just Jones, as the parents wish.

Yes, it gets complicated. All one has to do is spend time on a high school reunion committee trying to figure out whatever happened to half the women in your graduating class.


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## CharlieParker (Aug 15, 2012)

My wife didn't take my last name. She and my unmarried at the time sister work together with me. They both have compound first names with the order reversed. Other people assumed she took my name, that caused a lot confusion between those two. 

I also think it doesn't really matter. I equate it to weddings rings. We do always wear ours. I know many don't, it doesn't really matter.


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## the2ofus (Jan 28, 2014)

Oh I see the reasoning for it in many cases! I know a few doctors I worked with kept their maiden name for that very reason but some of them went by the husbands name in social situations. 

The cases that crack us up are women who protest "I will not take any MAN'S name" and yet they have, their dad's. I just think it's funny, I really don't care what name they go by. 

Funny thing is my grandma called my husband Crissi's man. All the grandaughters boyfriends or husbands were labeled this way cause she couldn't remember names as well but she always learned the grandsons wife's names.


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## sandc (Dec 15, 2011)

CharlieParker said:


> My wife didn't take my last name. She and my unmarried at the time sister work together with me. They both have compound first names with the order reversed. Other people assumed she took my name, that caused a lot confusion between those two.
> 
> I also think it doesn't really matter. I equate it to weddings rings. We do always wear ours. I know many don't, it doesn't really matter.


My wife took her maiden name as her middle name. Our last names are the same. No hyphens. She asked about it... my first instinct was to say, no, you take my last name. But I just asked her if she really wanted to hyphenate her last name with mine? Written out it would be 33 characters long! Now add her first and middle names. She changed her mind. She's glad we all (the family) have the same last name now.


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## CharlieParker (Aug 15, 2012)

Mrs. John Adams said:


> but if mr adams sees a hyphenated name...he passes immediate judgement on the poor woman...


Like I do to the man who flipped a coin with his wife and lost. She kept her last name and he added her's via hyphen


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

My colleagues in Sweden often combine their names - no hyphen - and this creates hilarious email moments when Sven Svensson gets married to Johanna Somethingsson and they both change their name to Sventhingsonn or what not.


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## Thundarr (Jul 4, 2012)

Personal said:


> My wife kept her name, and our kids have my name. I have hardly ever worn my wedding ring, While my wife most often wears hers. Yet we are still going strong so far after 15 years of marriage.


People get stuck on symbolic gestures. It's principals that actually matter IMO. Sounds like you and your wife believe that too.


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## the2ofus (Jan 28, 2014)

Mrs. John Adams said:


> anyway...I dont really give a shlt what people think about me...if i am a stepford wife...oh well.....I am a happy one.






sandc said:


> My wife took her maiden name as her middle name. Our last names are the same. No hyphens. She asked about it... my first instinct was to say, no, you take my last name. But I just asked her if she really wanted to hyphenate her last name with mine? Written out it would be 33 characters long! Now add her first and middle names. She changed her mind. She's glad we all (the family) have the same last name now.


A lot of my filipino friends took their maiden name as their middle name when they got married. I have a hard enough time fitting my name on the line when I sign. I can't imagine if I had hyphenated my name. Myy last name would have had 15 letters, a hyphen, and a space, add to that my full first name with 9 letters, yikes!


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

Thundarr said:


> People get stuck on symbolic gestures. It's principals that actually matter IMO. Sounds like you and your wife believe that too.


I agree. The main thing is unity and harmony in the marriage.


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

Unity and harmony - I feel I'm in a meeting with Jony Ive 

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jonathan_Ive

Truth be told there is an incredible amount of parallels between a happy user of a product and a happy marriage... And a lot of it is really unity and harmony.


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

Lol, a happy user of a product and a happy marriage . . . I bet we can think of some:

I know how it works.
I know how to get it to do what I want.
I am comfortable with it.
I like the look and feel of it.
I am not intimidated by it.
It fits into my space.
The price is right. 
I may even know how to fix it when it is not working right.
I hope it will last a long time and bring me much satisfaction.
I will have happy memories of it when it doesn't work anymore.

J/k on that last one!


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

That's the idea!!!

Consider for example the thrill you get when you open a new box - some mystery, some discovery... Same as with a new spouse or partner...

The initial euphoria or fog...

The slow and steady discovery of flaws or issues...

The frantic efforts early on to read the manual talk to other users of the same product (ie TAM) or call tech support (IC or MC)

Or return the product... 

Or get tangled in a legal battle over warranties, liability...


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

Lol. Yes, that sounds about right.

But even when it frustrates you, when you discover a new glitch, at the most inopportune time . . . it has grown on you, and you can't imagine your life without it. It is _yours_, and you know you will make it work, somehow. 

Fortunately for _it._ 

Again, just kidding on that last one!


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## doubletrouble (Apr 23, 2013)

First wife hyphenated her name and mine. Totally her mother's feminist thing. The only time it upset me was when the mail would come and sometimes they left off my name, so it looked like I was her brother or something. 

Second wife eventually took my name. She used both for a long time, and used mine only when it benefited her somehow. 

If I marry again (legally), I'll insist on one last name. Mine.


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## sandc (Dec 15, 2011)

Unk... You can hang out in my cave any time.


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## Ikaika (Apr 23, 2012)

My wife took my last name kept both her maiden and middle name. Thus she has two middle names. We don't have separate bank accounts, CC (the two we have), mortgage or anything separate. In other words we did not set ourselves up for failure at any point in the process. Our marriage is far from perfect and not sure I would characterize perfect as successful, since perfect is a boring prospect. 

Staying attracted to one spouse is a matter of each individuals responsibility. I never assumed I had arrived or reached some zenith of personal achievement in life. So I typically think of my marriage as a journey rather than a destination. Thus I still have much to learn and be excited about along the way. And, so, counting the years or decades as accomplishments are meaningless if it causes me close off what I can seek and strive for tomorrow. It has to be one where I can learn from my history to use or prune as needed to grow a healthier more fruitful relationship. 

I don't cherish hardships in our relationships, but I certainly don't scorn or hold onto the bitterness of things we have both worked toward fixing along the path. Long term success in marriage is possible, but it is only something you can do together as a couple and something that should not be dictated by statistics or the larger society. It truly is something you get to define and no one else can for you. 

Yet my concern for such a question always begs toward my own personal quest for constant happiness. In my opinion, this is an overrated obsession. While it is for me to take the journey to build success, it cannot be completely based on my own personal desires to fill some happiness cup to over flowing all the time. The ideas of sacrifice, responsibility and honor at times needs to trump these constant ephemeral desires to leap from one happiness moment to another. Real success is built around the normal oscillations of life, one where I can truly appreciate the hills but also temper my will to quit in the valleys. 

We celebrate 20 years this December, and if I'm lucky enough to live another 30 years, I will let you know with more thoughts as I sojourn along the path whether long term success in marriage is possible. But for now I will simply take the hajj toward my own marriage Mecca.


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## Zatol Ugot? (Mar 5, 2012)

Amplexor said:


> IRL: People give up too easily. We have a toss away mentality in today's day and age. Divorce has become easier, legally, socially and emotionally. The more common it becomes, the easier it becomes. Some couples should not stay married, that's a fact. But as I have advised hundreds here over the years, if the marriage is in trouble give it everything you've got to right it. Leave nothing in the tank.


:iagree::smthumbup::iagree::thumbup:


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

drerio said:


> My wife took my last name kept both her maiden and middle name. Thus she has two middle names. We don't have separate bank accounts, CC (the two we have), mortgage or anything separate. In other words we did not set ourselves up for failure at any point in the process. Our marriage is far from perfect and not sure I would characterize perfect as successful, since perfect is a boring prospect.
> 
> *Staying attracted to one spouse is a matter of each individuals responsibility.  I never assumed I had arrived or reached some zenith of personal achievement in life. So I typically think of my marriage as a journey rather than a destination. Thus I still have much to learn and be excited about along the way. And, so, counting the years or decades as accomplishments are meaningless if it causes me close off what I can seek and strive for tomorrow. It has to be one where I can learn from my history to use or prune as needed to grow a healthier more fruitful relationship.
> *
> ...


I really like your piece drerio, especially the paragraph I highlighted and the sentence I underlined.

I was on another website recently [ _Psychology Today_] and one a few marriage counselors were discussing marriage.

One of them said that too many times couples focus on fixing the problems in the marriages as they pop up ,when the focus should be on creating and celebrating the good times, which is more beneficial to building the marriage.

That way, the journey is made more enjoyable and good lasting memories are created.


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## doubletrouble (Apr 23, 2013)

That was a very thoughtful and wise post, drerio. Thank you.


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