# Another frustrated husband



## Frustrated Man (Apr 2, 2012)

A little background before I rant. Have been married over 30 years now. And we have never had a very good sex life. I do not want to cheat on my wife.( I admit to thinking about it a lot these days) I do not want a divorce.
I am in very good physical condition. Workout a lot and it shows.
I am willing to do or try anything that would stimulate my wife. And she knows this.
BUT............ wife refuses to have any physical relationship with me. I know she has a low sex drive. And I can understand her not WANTING to have sex. But, darnit, I don't like washing dishes. But they have to be washed. And I wash them and don't complain.
Thought I was going to "get lucky" tonight. Not.
It has been several months.
Feel like crying, kicking a wall down, hollering and pulling my hair out, all at the same time!!!!!!!!!


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## Frustrated Man (Apr 2, 2012)

Looking thru some of the posts here and looks like I have a lot of company.


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## sandc (Dec 15, 2011)

I can't stand seeing folks divorce but if she is unwilling to have sex with you and you have exhausted every avenue, then you are within your rights to ask for a divorce.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

All I want to say is ...I sympathize . I have a hard time reading these types of posts... when a husband does fall into cheating after this kind of ongoing rejection... I have more sympathy on the one who was starving in the desert for months before the fall. I consider sex an emotional NEED....that neither spouse should EVER withhold and if they do, they shouldn't be surprised when their marraige falls to the ground. Why is divorce out? 

Good men shouldn't have to suffer like this..when you are at the mercy, confined to only her being there for you. What a shame. 

It is so very very wrong and mean spirited what your wife is doing, motherload selfish, unloving, passionless, degrading, downright evil to me. 

But of course this is assuming you are a good loving man... . Does she have resentment built up towards you? This would further destroy her wanting to please you...... is she on meds to further inhibit her drive.... she is likely past menopause, but you are right.. touching you, taking care of you, giving her husband sexually affectionate touch, what a difference it could make in your world, your spirit. These things speak love to our spouse, the very least we can do. 

What would be her side of the story?


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## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

I've been exactly where you are. Stayed there over 8 years and it's no fun. My situation improved around the same time I just quit focusing on what I wasn't getting. Sex is the easiest thing in the world to get and I'm sure opportunities surround you daily. For 30 years, you have decided every day that you choose your wife over "great" sex. Apparently, she's bringing something to the table that you value more. She can't prevent you from having sex, so if you're not having sex as you wish, it is not her fault but a joint agreement. Lots of folks are getting laid daily but would kill to have a 30 year relationship. All depends on what one values the most, I suppose. It's not her against you. It's the both of you facing a common problem. She's not getting any more than you are and she's probably not happy about it, either. Nobody likes to feel like a failure or a disappointment and I believe women handle that sort of thing even worse than men. Complain about the lack of sex and you'll make her feel like a failure. This is very hard to do but it has worked well for me. I suggest you give up trying to "fix" the sex frequency/quality. Your job is not to attend to your own sexual satisfaction. That's what she signed up to do. Your job is to be the best husband you can be and to attend to your wife's needs. I'll catch heat for saying this, but I firmly believe the transaction between men and women has always been an exchange of security for sex/nurturing. If she feels insecure, you won't be getting very much sex. Figure out what makes her feel secure with you and pour it on. You can train your brain to think of her as your enemy or you can train it to think of her as God's blessing to you. Each of us has to justify our every action to ourselves. If she withholds sex, she must justify to herself that this is her right or that your expectations are unreasonable. If you quit expecting sex, she can't use that justification and her withholding will become unreasonable in her own mind. Likewise, every time you attend to her needs, you must justify to yourself that she deserves your kindness. The more you do, the more it feels "right". You will not only feel more loving, but also feel more loved. I didn't use this approach because I expected more sex; but just because I got sick and tired of feeling bitter and arguing with my wife about sex. Anyway, I tried it and life is more peaceful and sex has increased dramatically. They still aren't going to write any porno books about us but life is world's better than it used to be (for both of us).


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## Frustrated Man (Apr 2, 2012)

SimplyAmorous said:


> All I want to say is ...I sympathize . I have a hard time reading these types of posts... when a husband does fall into cheating after this kind of ongoing rejection... I have more sympathy on the one who was starving in the desert for months before the fall. I consider sex an emotional NEED....that neither spouse should EVER withhold and if they do, they shouldn't be surprised when their marraige falls to the ground. *Why is divorce out? *Good men shouldn't have to suffer like this..when you are at the mercy, confined to only her being there for you. What a shame.
> 
> It is so very very wrong and mean spirited what your wife is doing, motherload selfish, unloving, passionless, degrading, downright evil to me.
> 
> ...


Divorce is not an option right now. Youngest daughter is still in school. A divorce would devastate her.
I am a good husband. And a good father to our children.
I do get the feeling (quite often) that she does resent me.
Her side of the story? Dunno. Would certainly like to hear it. Anytime I approach this subject she shuts up, blows up or simply makes statements that blame me for everything. I certainly have my faults. But she can not say in any form or fashion that overall I am not a good husband or father.
I accept my share of the blame for present situation. I put up with this for years. Should not have.
I think what hurts most is the stark reality, that even though she knows how important sex is to me, she intentionally denies me. Which tells me that she really does not give a damn about me. And THAT does hurt.
Maybe I should cheat on her.


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## Browncoat (Mar 25, 2012)

Frustrated Man said:


> Divorce is not an option right now. Youngest daughter is still in school. A divorce would devastate her.
> I am a good husband. And a good father to our children.
> I do get the feeling (quite often) that she does resent me.
> Her side of the story? Dunno. Would certainly like to hear it. Anytime I approach this subject she shuts up, blows up or simply makes statements that blame me for everything. I certainly have my faults. But she can not say in any form or fashion that overall I am not a good husband or father.
> ...


I've not been married as long, but our marriage has been largely sexless for the entirety of it's ~15 year duration. I have 4 kids, and like you divorce isn't an option.

I'm starting sex therapy with my wife this week. Not sure if it will help, but I feel like I don't have any other options. You may want to try the same. If you want I'll let you know how it goes.


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## Hicks (Jan 14, 2011)

The first thing you have to do is realize that sexual fulfillment is not important to her, so she truly does not feel the pain she is causing you.

The second thing you have to do is realize that there are a set of emotional needs that she has, that are not important to you, so you do not see the pain you are causing her by denying her needs.

The third thing you have to do is figure out what her emotional needs are, meaning what makes her feel loved the way sex makes you feel loved? 

The fourth thing you have to do is start meeting these emotional needs as much as possible.


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## Frustrated Man (Apr 2, 2012)

Browncoat said:


> I've not been married as long, but our marriage has been largely sexless for the entirety of it's ~15 year duration. I have 4 kids, and like you divorce isn't an option.
> 
> I'm starting sex therapy with my wife this week. Not sure if it will help, but I feel like I don't have any other options. You may want to try the same. *If you want I'll let you know how it goes*.


Please do. Wife would fight me on this, but if it helps I would sure try.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Has she told you WHY she doesn't want to? Have you told her you WANT to have a se xual relationship with her and how the lack of intimacy is making you feel?


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## Frustrated Man (Apr 2, 2012)

Jellybeans said:


> Has she told you WHY she doesn't want to? Have you told her you WANT to have a se xual relationship with her and how the lack of intimacy is making you feel?


 She says she does not like sex. But, on those very rare occasions when we do, she not only likes it, she is a completely different person for a few days after. Actually becomes affectionate. She sometimes can not achieve an orgasm making love. But, she ALWAYS has a strong orgasm when she allows me to perform oral sex on her. And I will GLADLY do so.
We have had many discussions on how important sex is to me. And it is not just the sex. I miss kissing, hugging holding hands,etc.. That said, sometimes I am so horny, I have dreams about making love to other women. Never anyone I know. ( Is this normal?)
I do not want to cheat on my wife. But I am to the point that I realize this could happen. And from many years of observation, this is usually a marriage killer.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

How often do you have s ex? You're going to have to buck down and tell her how you are feeling. And tell her :I do not want to cheat on you but I really am at a loss here on waht to do. You are my wife, not my friend (well, she's your friend, but you know what I mean). Be VERY open and honest with her.

I think your dreams are normal.


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## eagleclaw (Sep 20, 2010)

The problem I see hear is that she does not realize how big an issue this is, or how much it hurts you. To her, this situation is pretty minor, and does not endanger the relationship in any way. She really doesn't have to give it much attention for one very important reason.

You have demonstrated that neglecting you and ingnoring your needs is ok. You have done this for over 30 years. You can have this discussion over and over and she will internally roll her eyes... and wait out your bad mood... knowing that things will go back to how they are.

Your best option is to read some man up threads here. To upset the applecart so to speak and make this issue real for her. You have to convey to her that this ISN"T OK. And the relationship, and her life as she knows it isn't immune to your unhappiness. 

If you really aren't ok with just a roommate, and your not content with just meeting her needs while ignorning yours.. then you have to be willing to look at other options and consider moving on and make sure she realizes that is an option. Because it's pretty obvious after 30 yrs that making you happy and your needs are not enough motivation for her. Possibly her own security, and quality of life are....

Marriage should be a mutual beneficial relationship where BOTH of your needs and priotories are important to the other. She can't continue to get her Yin while continuing to ignore your Yang.


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## Frustrated Man (Apr 2, 2012)

Jellybeans said:


> How often do you have s ex? You're going to have to buck down and tell her how you are feeling. And tell her :I do not want to cheat on you but I really am at a loss here on waht to do. You are my wife, not my friend (well, she's your friend, but you know what I mean). Be VERY open and honest with her.
> 
> I think your dreams are normal.


How often? I am too embarrassed to tell you.(hint; I don't remember last time)
Pretty reassuring about the dreams. I mean, sometimes they are SO realistic. Almost to the point of the wet dreams of my teenage years. (I am 54)


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## Tall Average Guy (Jul 26, 2011)

Frustrated Man said:


> Divorce is not an option right now. Youngest daughter is still in school. A divorce would devastate her.
> I am a good husband. And a good father to our children.
> I do get the feeling (quite often) that she does resent me.
> Her side of the story? Dunno. Would certainly like to hear it. Anytime I approach this subject she shuts up, blows up or simply makes statements that blame me for everything. I certainly have my faults. But she can not say in any form or fashion that overall I am not a good husband or father.
> ...


Divorce will devestate your children rgeardless. And don't cheat, if only for yourself. You deserve better than to do that to yourself and lose your integrity.

Look at the Married Man's Sex Life. There is some useful information that has helped many (not fool proof, but may give you some insights). Also, His Needs Her Needs worksheets (Goolge it) can be useful in figuring out how to best meet each other's needs.

Finally, look for the thread on the Thermostat. You need to align your actions with your words. If you keep saying that not having sex is an issue, but continue to do the same actions you always have, you are effectively communicating that it is not a big issue.


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## Hicks (Jan 14, 2011)

Frustrated Man said:


> She says she does not like sex. But, on those very rare occasions when we do, she not only likes it, she is a completely different person for a few days after. Actually becomes affectionate. She sometimes can not achieve an orgasm making love. But, she ALWAYS has a strong orgasm when she allows me to perform oral sex on her. And I will GLADLY do so.
> We have had many discussions on how important sex is to me. And it is not just the sex. I miss kissing, hugging holding hands,etc.. That said, sometimes I am so horny, I have dreams about making love to other women. Never anyone I know. ( Is this normal?)
> I do not want to cheat on my wife. But I am to the point that I realize this could happen. And from many years of observation, this is usually a marriage killer.


Please, you are barking up the wrong tree. This has nothing to do with whether she likes sex, orgasms etc. You are making a big mistake by asking her if she likes sex, why she does not want to have sex etc.

A woman will not be sexual with a man unless she feels loved by the man. Does your wife FEEL loved by you?


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## phantomfan (Mar 7, 2012)

Frustrated Man said:


> A little background before I rant. Have been married over 30 years now. And we have never had a very good sex life. I do not want to cheat on my wife.( I admit to thinking about it a lot these days) I do not want a divorce.
> I am in very good physical condition. Workout a lot and it shows.
> I am willing to do or try anything that would stimulate my wife. And she knows this.
> BUT............ wife refuses to have any physical relationship with me. I know she has a low sex drive. And I can understand her not WANTING to have sex. But, darnit, I don't like washing dishes. But they have to be washed. And I wash them and don't complain.
> ...


Welcome to the club. There isn't an easy solution to the problem which you're probably aware already. Was there ever a time when your sex life with her was regular/normal? Has she been checked by a MD for hormone issues? On any anti-depressants? Gone through menopause? Does she exercise regularly? 

There are so many variables but I'm with you that sex *should* be no different than any other duty in a marriage. If there are dishes in the sink, do the dishes. It's getting that concept through to someone who has a mental/physical/hormonal, etc issue preventing them from being the partner that you need them to be. There is a saying that nothing breeds success like success. I think its the same thing with sex. The more you have, the more likely its going to be good and satisfying. 

If you run one time a year and try to run a mile, you're not going to enjoy it. If you run regularly, you're going to enjoy it, be good at it, etc. The hormones you give your wife when you have sex through kissing/bodily fluids and hormones her body releases during orgasm probably explain the increase in affection. It's probably part of the puzzle. The other part is between the ears that has nothing to do with hormones. That's the tricky part. Definitely pick up MMSLP 2012 when it comes out. 

I've had many conversations with my spouse about the issue. She doesn't get it and I'm the "maniac", she's normal. I'm still struggling how to bridge the understanding gap. Just when I think she gets it, I find out that she doesn't and things didn't change. When we have sex, its good and everything seems better both her mood and our relationship. Unfortunately what happens in mine is I get the pushback or she starts doing things that intentionally push me away. It's like she goes into sabotage mode so there will never be any momentum from a good day or two of sex between us. It may take talking about the "D" word to make red lights go on. I would definitely look into every other option first including MC. I've had regular dreams (both good and bad) of being with someone else too. It's not what I want. I just want the one I'm with.


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## Frustrated Man (Apr 2, 2012)

Hicks said:


> Please, you are barking up the wrong tree. This has nothing to do with whether she likes sex, orgasms etc. You are making a big mistake by asking her if she likes sex, why she does not want to have sex etc.
> 
> A woman will not be sexual with a man unless she feels loved by the man. *Does your wife FEEL loved by you?*




Right now, no. But until recently, yes. And it made no difference.


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## Frustrated Man (Apr 2, 2012)

phantomfan said:


> Welcome to the club. There isn't an easy solution to the problem which you're probably aware already. Was there ever a time when your sex life with her was regular/normal? Has she been checked by a MD for hormone issues? On any anti-depressants? Gone through menopause? Does she exercise regularly?
> 
> There are so many variables but I'm with you that sex *should* be no different than any other duty in a marriage. If there are dishes in the sink, do the dishes. It's getting that concept through to someone who has a mental/physical/hormonal, etc issue preventing them from being the partner that you need them to be. There is a saying that nothing breeds success like success. I think its the same thing with sex. The more you have, the more likely its going to be good and satisfying.
> 
> ...


 Well, sounds as if you are in the same kind of relationship as I. Yes, she did go thru a bout of depression a year ago. And I did not bother her one bit about sex until she was better. But, it was not like we had a normal sex life before the depression.
When you get down to the brass tacks, all it takes on her part is a little bit of time with me a couple of times a week and she would have me eating out of the palm of her hand. And she knows that. And as I stated earlier, on those rare occasions when we have sex, she actually does enjoy it.
It seems to me that she feels compelled to punish me. I could understand this if I was a poor husband and father, but I am not. I could understand this if I let myself go physically. I do not. When I get compliments from other women on my physical shape and none from my wife, something is wrong. And I do not think it is me.
Yes, I am frustrated!


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## ocotillo (Oct 17, 2011)

Blunt question:

Your wife is treating you somewhere to the right of callous indifference and somewhere to the left of deliberate meanness. Apparently this has been going on for some time. 

Why should she change?


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## Frustrated Man (Apr 2, 2012)

ocotillo said:


> Blunt question:
> 
> Your wife is treating you somewhere to the right of callous indifference and somewhere to the left of deliberate meanness. Apparently this has been going on for some time.
> 
> Why should she change?


 Good point. I do not have a answer.
Maybe because I am her husband?????????


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## sandc (Dec 15, 2011)

Frustrated Man said:


> Good point. I do not have a answer.
> Maybe because I am her husband?????????


She knows you're her husband and that isn't good enough. I'd demand that she go to marriage and or sex counseling. If she says no, tell her you are considering divorce. It seems mean but it may be the only thing that she'll respond to.


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## Mavash. (Jan 26, 2012)

Stop being such a good father and husband. She's taking you for granted.


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## Frustrated Man (Apr 2, 2012)

sandc said:


> She knows you're her husband and that isn't good enough. I'd demand that she go to marriage and or sex counseling. If she says no, tell her you are considering divorce. It seems mean but it may be the only thing that she'll respond to.


Thanks. I know this is what I need to do. Just can't seem to bring myself to do it. I think I know what the answer will be. And as frustrated as I am, I still don't want a divorce.
Screwed up, ain't I?


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## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

There are a host of reasons she may not be interested in sex and almost all of them can be classified as medical or psychiactric. Either way, most of these reasons would be beyond her control and she wouldn't be able to even explain why she feels the way she does. Having sex with you because you are her husband might get you begrudging duty or pity sex, likely to leave you even emptier and more frustrated than no sex. Increase intimacy in other ways, taking walks, long talks, holding hands, brushing her hair, etc might be helpful. If she feels she can cuddle or touch you without you having an expectation of sex, she might be more willing to engage in these activities. Doing so, often naturally ends up with sex. Even when it doesn't, it's still nicer than arguing. Whether in marriage or in business, the best way to get what you want is to make sure others involved get what they want.


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## Mavash. (Jan 26, 2012)

Did ya'll read his post? The sex hasn't been great for THIRTY YEARS? This is a lost cause unless he gets her attention by threatening to leave or doing a hardcore 180.

This has gone on so long that it will take a wrecking ball to fix it.


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## Frustrated Man (Apr 2, 2012)

unbelievable said:


> There are a host of reasons she may not be interested in sex and almost all of them can be classified as medical or psychiactric. Either way, most of these reasons would be beyond her control and she wouldn't be able to even explain why she feels the way she does. Having sex with you because you are her husband might get you begrudging duty or pity sex, likely to leave you even emptier and more frustrated than no sex. Increase intimacy in other ways, taking walks, long talks, holding hands, brushing her hair, etc might be helpful. If she feels she can cuddle or touch you without you having an expectation of sex, she might be more willing to engage in these activities. Doing so, often naturally ends up with sex. Even when it doesn't, it's still nicer than arguing. Whether in marriage or in business, the best way to get what you want is to make sure others involved get what they want.


Thanks. Have been thru all this. Made no difference.


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## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

sandc said:


> She knows you're her husband and that isn't good enough. I'd demand that she go to marriage and or sex counseling. If she says no, tell her you are considering divorce. It seems mean but it may be the only thing that she'll respond to.


I would resist this piece of advise. Chances are, she has been justifying her withholding to herself by saying that's all you care about. I bet you've even heard her say that to you. Threaten divorce for sex and you'll validate the lie she's been telling herself. Obviously, you do care an awful lot about whatever else she's bringing to the marriage. I told mine that with or without sex, I wasn't going anywhere but It would be a terrible loss to us both and neither would be as happy without a sexual relationship as with one.


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## ladybug3912 (Apr 3, 2012)

Frustrated Man said:


> A little background before I rant. Have been married over 30 years now. And we have never had a very good sex life. I do not want to cheat on my wife.( I admit to thinking about it a lot these days) I do not want a divorce.
> I am in very good physical condition. Workout a lot and it shows.
> I am willing to do or try anything that would stimulate my wife. And she knows this.
> BUT............ wife refuses to have any physical relationship with me. I know she has a low sex drive. And I can understand her not WANTING to have sex. But, darnit, I don't like washing dishes. But they have to be washed. And I wash them and don't complain.
> ...


First, may I just applaud you for not taking any action yet, and really truly laying your feelings out on the table.
I was in a sexless relatonship for a year or so, so I cant even imagine 30 years of sporadic (and at times dissatisfying) sexual contact. 
Im not a professional (just yet) but what I will say is that typically there are some underlying reasons that may be the cause of her disinterest in sex. My husband and I are reading the newest book by Harriet Lerner, and in it she speaks about "foreplay" being different for a woman, than it is a man, helping around the house, and with the children and every day duties can lighten the load on your spouse and give her more time to be sexy, and intimacy focused. 
Before you race to the finish line, try just holding her if she will allow that, and then maybe a week later a backrub, and the week after that maybe a ful body massage. Yes I know that it will be torture for you, but it will certainly make her take notice, and see that something in you has changed. 
Often times it takes both partners making improvements within themselves to create what it is that they are seeking. 

30 years means children, and a home and careers, and plenty of responsibilities and stressors of life. 
Just ask yourself if it's worth the work.  

Good luck to you


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## anchorwatch (Mar 5, 2012)

Hicks said:


> The first thing you have to do is realize that sexual fulfillment is not important to her, so she truly does not feel the pain she is causing you.
> 
> The second thing you have to do is realize that there are a set of emotional needs that she has, that are not important to you, so you do not see the pain you are causing her by denying her needs.
> 
> ...



Hicks is giving you some good advice.

I'm in a 37 year marriage and intimacy had been very lacking at times to none existent. We were roommates. I was as bad as you. I demanded it. I begged for it. And thank god I didn't go looking outside for it.

I couldn't change the way my wife felt but I could change the way I treated her. I followed the simple advice in a relationship book mentioned on this site. Our sex life is better now then it was in our twenties. And were closer now than we ever dreamed. What we were missing, wow. Can't keep our hands off each other. Give it a try..engage her. You don't get any now, so what do you have to lose? 

"His Needs, Her Needs" By W Harley


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## Frustrated Man (Apr 2, 2012)

ladybug3912 said:


> First, may I just applaud you for not taking any action yet, and really truly laying your feelings out on the table.
> I was in a sexless relatonship for a year or so, so I cant even imagine 30 years of sporadic (and at times dissatisfying) sexual contact.
> Im not a professional (just yet) but what I will say is that typically there are some underlying reasons that may be the cause of her disinterest in sex. My husband and I are reading the newest book by Harriet Lerner, and in it she speaks about "foreplay" being different for a woman, than it is a man, helping around the house, and with the children and every day duties can lighten the load on your spouse and give her more time to be sexy, and intimacy focused.
> Before you race to the finish line, try just holding her if she will allow that, and then maybe a week later a backrub, and the week after that maybe a ful body massage. Yes I know that it will be torture for you, but it will certainly make her take notice, and see that something in you has changed.
> ...


 Thank you for your thoughts. Very kind words. But, I have tried all that you speak of.
I am at the point of not sure if I need to plant or plow. If I could see a future in our marraige, I would keep trying. Just don't think it is there .


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## morituri (Apr 1, 2011)

When you show her attention and affection, is it as a prelude to sex or is it to show her how much she means to you? I ask because if its the former, she may look at your displays of attention and affection as suspect and only fueling her resentment when you approach her for sex. Think of if as if you had a fair weather friend who comes to visit you only when he needs something from you but never because he wants to see you and how you are doing. Perhaps this is how she views you as well.


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## chaos (Mar 9, 2012)

morituri said:


> When you show her attention and affection, is it as a prelude to sex or is it to show her how much she means to you? I ask because if its the former, she may look at your displays of attention and affection as suspect and only fueling her resentment when you approach her for sex. Think of if as if you had a fair weather friend who comes to visit you only when he needs something from you but never because he wants to see you and how you are doing. Perhaps this is how she views you as well.


I tried this but to no avail, that is why I finally made the choice to divorce her. Her reaction to my serving her with divorce papers was met with apathy which only killed any lingering doubts that I might have had that I was doing the right thing. Still, I did learn a lot from my becoming a better partner for I am now in a relationship that is by far much better than the marriage I ended.


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## deejov (Sep 24, 2011)

chaos said:


> I tried this but to no avail, that is why I finally made the choice to divorce her. Her reaction to my serving her with divorce papers was met with apathy which only killed any lingering doubts that I might have had that I was doing the right thing. Still, I did learn a lot from my becoming a better partner for I am now in a relationship that is by far much better than the marriage I ended.


Sorry to hear that... but I was thinking that sometimes after such a long time that is the unspoken 'reason'. Apathy. No longer in love. But getting divorced is a costly messy business. 

OP, if you aren't jumping up to get divorced, I would imagine neither is she. I'm not saying that is what you should do.. but rather do you think if your children were gone she would leave?


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## LadyFrog (Feb 27, 2012)

SimplyAmorous said:


> All I want to say is ...I sympathize . I have a hard time reading these types of posts... when a husband does fall into cheating after this kind of ongoing rejection... I have more sympathy on the one who was starving in the desert for months before the fall. I consider sex an emotional NEED....that neither spouse should EVER withhold and if they do, they shouldn't be surprised when their marraige falls to the ground. Why is divorce out?
> 
> Good men shouldn't have to suffer like this..when you are at the mercy, confined to only her being there for you. What a shame.
> 
> ...




I always agree with SA's answers on these types of situations. The above pretty much sums it up.


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## Frustrated Man (Apr 2, 2012)

LadyFrogFlyAway said:


> I always agree with SA's answers on these types of situations. The above pretty much sums it up.


Her side of the story? I am boring.(I'm not) I am not a "fun and exciting" guy. (I'm not) Her idea of a good man is someone who is full of BS. He is funny. He is witty. ( I'm not)
Her "boyfriend" (golfing partner) is all these things. And she thinks he hung the moon. He has been married three times and has cheated on all his former wives. She knows this, but still thinks he is a hot item. 
I am not " Mr. Fun and Excitement", but I am a dependable, good man and husband. Not to mention a good father to our children.
Am I missing something?


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## Enchantment (May 11, 2011)

Frustrated Man said:


> Her side of the story? I am boring.(I'm not) I am not a "fun and exciting" guy. (I'm not) Her idea of a good man is someone who is full of BS. He is funny. He is witty. ( I'm not)
> Her "boyfriend" (golfing partner) is all these things. And she thinks he hung the moon. He has been married three times and has cheated on all his former wives. She knows this, but still thinks he is a hot item.
> I am not " Mr. Fun and Excitement", but I am a dependable, good man and husband. Not to mention a good father to our children.
> Am I missing something?


Well, what exactly is her relationship with this "boyfriend"? Could she be in an EA/PA with him?


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## longtimemarried (Apr 4, 2012)

This is my first post but I had to reply to your message. Your situation resonates with me. I'm female but in a similar situation. 

I also have several female friends who deny their husband's sex. Some do not enjoy sex but others have lost their desire for their husbands. The reason for the loss of desire is most commonly due to resentments over non-sexual marital issues. 

What struck me the most about your message is the effort you have put into resolving the issue or at least understanding it. I have done the same things. However your last post regarding your wife's attraction to one of her friends is most alarming to me. When a woman has lost her desire, she typically doesn't desire any man. I can't help but think that in your case, your wife has a desire for her friend. I really think you should explore whether she is having an affair. 

I know several women who are cheating on their husbands. I work in a profession of mostly women and women talk. Most of these women report they are no longer sexually interested in their husbands but very sexual with their affair partners. 

I'm not saying this to scare you. I'm saying it because I too have lived a 30 year marriage without sex. We have gone as long as five years at a time with absolutely no sex. Currently it has been over a year. I know how frustrating it is to wonder what you are doing that is sexually unappealing to your spouse. I imagine it would be even worse to find out that after all these years, it wasn't something you were doing but rather someone else is attracting her. Some women are comfortable with multiple sex partners, but I find that most of us in our age range are not. If your wife is sexual with her friend, it is even more likely she is not going to welcome sex with you. 

I sincerely hope you view this post as supportive of you. I truly understand the pain you are going through. I too am going through it. I too struggle with whether to leave the relationship. It is a hard decision. I too love my husband and would be satisfied with our marriage if we just had sex on a semi-regular basis. Or at least if we could understand why our spouses are not interested, we might be able to accept the loss of a sexual relationship. Mine says he doesn't know why he isn't interested.


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## Browncoat (Mar 25, 2012)

Enchantment said:


> Well, what exactly is her relationship with this "boyfriend"? Could she be in an EA/PA with him?


I think you should ask her about it. IMO it's up to each spouse to go out of their way to assure the other that there isn't an affair going on.

After asking, if you have your suspicions you should consider hiring a PI (they are quite good at that sort of thing from what I understand).


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## Toffer (Jan 31, 2012)

Time to re-think the divorce issue.

Tell your wife that she knows you're position on martial sex. It is part of the marital contract. If she isn't willing to at least try and meet your needs, you will need to cancel the contract and move on. Your daughter will survive


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## anchorwatch (Mar 5, 2012)

Frustrated Man said:


> Her side of the story? I am boring.(I'm not) I am not a "fun and exciting" guy. (I'm not) Her idea of a good man is someone who is full of BS. He is funny. He is witty. ( I'm not)
> Her "boyfriend" (golfing partner) is all these things. And she thinks he hung the moon. He has been married three times and has cheated on all his former wives. She knows this, but still thinks he is a hot item.
> I am not " Mr. Fun and Excitement", but I am a dependable, good man and husband. Not to mention a good father to our children.
> Am I missing something?



I didn't get that there was an OM in your relationship. Its all different now. Your not competing for her affections on a fair field. This is not just a case of lack of sex and intimacy, its infidelity. 
I'm sorry I gave my advice base on the issue of how do you reconnect after the kids leave. But my original advice still stands. Even more. I be damned if I'd let her go after 30 years, with out a fight. You do have the advantage. Don't fool yourself.* " I am a dependable, good man and husband. Not to mention a good father to our children."* He has none of that. 
Be a little Alpha about this. 
Don't treat this as a lack of intimacy, its adultery.


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## Jeff/BC (Apr 1, 2012)

*I am not " Mr. Fun and Excitement", but I am a dependable, good man and husband. Not to mention a good father to our children.
Am I missing something?*
I'd say so. I'd say you are missing a lot.

Look, women are wired for various reasons to be attracted to the bad boy. Bad boys, of course, have their down sides. Some women grow out of it, others do not. There's a reason I never wanted to date a woman below 30... even when I was.

The bottom line is that your wife is attracted by something shiny. Even worse, the "shiny" thing is a bad boy who has a track record she knows of about being bad. In my experience, women who want this just want it and you're not it. Let her go play with the bad boy while you set about a divorce.

That being said, there's another angle here. Even sensible women retain that desire for the bad boy. It's not unlike sensible men still retaining a desire for the bad girl. In a perfect world, I get a girl who's "bad with me" and "good otherwise" ~chuckles~. Are you REALLY doing all you can to push her bad boy buttons? Think of it like her putting on lingerie for you. It takes effort to apply clothes, makeup, etc. It's a hassle to walk around the house in heels rather than slippers. It's probably more "natural" for a woman to wear slippers around the house. But be honest, wouldn't you like the stiletto's and baby doll now and again? Well, she probably would like the bad boy now and again. Why aren't you stepping up?


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## DTO (Dec 18, 2011)

unbelievable said:


> Having sex with you because you are her husband might get you begrudging duty or pity sex, likely to leave you even emptier and more frustrated than no sex.


It might be pity or begrudging sex, but it does not have to be that way. She might not be able to control her basic drive level (assuming low drive / libido is the issue here). But she certainly can control her attitude.

How so? She can respect the relationship and his committment. She can adopt an attitude of "I do not value sex, but you have done much that I do value. From this point, I will happily meet your needs in a manner reflecting your long-term loyalty to me".

Some guys would reject this and say that they only want sex if their wives are hot and horny for them (which I think is asking too much of someone with low drive). But this guy does not feel that way. He would be happy with someone who simply is cheerful about it - his wife could do that if she wanted.

His wife is either seriously lazy, seriously self-centered, and / or seriously disrespectful of him.


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## DTO (Dec 18, 2011)

Hicks said:


> Please, you are barking up the wrong tree. This has nothing to do with whether she likes sex, orgasms etc. You are making a big mistake by asking her if she likes sex, why she does not want to have sex etc.
> 
> A woman will not be sexual with a man unless she feels loved by the man. Does your wife FEEL loved by you?


I don't think this is the problem. It sounds like he has been a reliable and faithful partner for these 30 years.

I don't like this attitude that she has to feel LOVED by him. While in concept it sounds good, the reality is that some women set the bar way too high. Marrying her, remaining faithful to her, and being diligent in every day life should be enough. What tends to happen is one person blames his or her spouse for not feeling in the mood.

So, you have issues like "if he loved me he would not bug me for sex" (forgetting that this is a marriage, not dating), "if he loved me he would do XYZ / not ask for XYZ", or "it must be his fault, because if he was a good husband I would inevitably be in the mood".

ETA: you can sum up my position by noting that duty is a neutral word, not a dirty word.


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## waiwera (Sep 8, 2009)

OP - you say the sex has NEVER been good...so what are you hoping for...30 years later?

For your wife to become someone else... someone she hasn't been for the past 3 decades:scratchhead:


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