# Just don't know anymore...



## nikonova (Mar 13, 2017)

I'm tired, miserable, depressed, but trying my damnedest to keep a good face and fight the fight. I've been with my wife for nearly 5 years, married for the last two. This is my second marriage. She was two girls (the oldest just moved out at 23), I have three children - two boys who lived with us (my oldest is in the military now and my younger son is graduating high school this June). My daughter lives with her mom a couple hours away. 

Man, I just don't know where it all went wrong. She's a toxic person, but outwardly decries that she's not the problem, it's me. When we first met, she was just amazing - easy going, fun-loving, full of energy, etc. After dating about 3 months, my lease was up at my apartment, so I moved in with her as she had just bought her own house. For the next several months, things seemed to go really well, but then my boys moved in with us just before the new school year. From that point on, it just seemed to go downhill -more like a rollercoaster where you couldn't get off. Our first big argument was that my youngest son was smoking weed in the house and she flipped her lid. Of course, I spoke to him and implored him to stop....and of course, he didn't. He just kept hiding it. Although I was not happy about him smoking it, I honestly couldn't fight it that hard because I did the exact thing at his age (his mom did too). And, to boot, his stepmother had smoked with me a few times over the year, so there you have it. Anyway, it was a huge blowout fight and after she searched his room and found more "stuff", she blew her lid again and told me she was just going to call the police next time. That put the first big tear in our relationship.

After all of this, the relationship continued to become even more toxic. She's always got a way of making everything my fault. She's got all of these idiosyncrasies that make me fell I have to walk on eggshells with every thing I do (or don't do), to a point where I really think I'm the crazy one. Things like the bathroom floor mat being a bit wet after someone gets out of the shower. She uses it when she's doing her hair, because she doesn't want to stand on the cold tile -so when it's wet, she has a fit! That's just ONE of many, many little issues...

The other night, we were at the bar having dinner and drinks, and I said to her that I'd choose her over anyone else here -and she just laughed and said she doubted that. I was FLOORED! First off, I've never cheated on her, never even wanted to. So this has nothing to do with that. Of course, I was a bit pissed off, and after telling her that, she just said that it was what she believed. Wow....so basically, she just invalidated our marriage right then and there. So we get home, she goes to the basement to check the laundry. My son comes up from his room in the basement and tells me he's going to meet up with some friends. A moment later, she comes up *****ing and stating the my son who NEVER turns the basement light out, did turn it out and he was a prick for doing so. I was lost at that moment....First off, yes, he fails to turn the light off many times, but not ALL the time. And second, I HIGHLY doubt he did it on purpose. It's obvious that he didn't hear her go down there, period. So now, I'm doubly pissed off. She had to go to bed early, so guess what I did? I went back out to the bar. Yes, not the best thing to do, but I need conversation with people, and I can't sit in the house (her house) and stare at the four walls doing absolutely nothing but living inside my own head.

Honestly, I can't even begin to explain every. single. instance of insanity I have gone through in this relationship. I haven't even begun to explain the issues with her girls, that she seems to just sluff off as non-issues. And every time she goes after my son (kids), guess what, I throw her kids crap right back in her face. It's just getting uglier and uglier with each passing month...

We've been to counseling together and separately -no more of that is going to work, and I have stories about all of that as well. I could seriously write a 600 page book on this.

I don't even know what I'm doing at this time. I'm going to be the bad guy no matter what I do, good or bad. She's real good at turning everything around so she shines and everyone else burns.....

Ugh, help please.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

So why are you still with her if she is so abusive?


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## nikonova (Mar 13, 2017)

Ha, fair question. First, I didn't get married a second time, just to go through a divorce again. I also have my son who still lives with us and I don't want to put him through this again -at least not while he is still living with me and going to high school. Yes, I continue to allow this to occur and I keep myself in this toxic relationship. In the past, I had the hope that it would someday get better...but I know now in my heart that it just won't -and that just breaks my heart. I've tried stepping up even more (which basically means trying my best to abide by her "rules"), but that has shown no better results...


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

It sounds like the two of you got together mostly out of convenience, your convenience. You hardly knew her. But you moved yourself and your children into her home. 

She does sound like a hard person to deal with and maybe even verbally abusive. But I also see things in your behavior that are not cool too.

Some of this is so easy to fix. For example, the bathroom mat. So get another bathroom mat so that there is one that is always dry for her to use when she does her hair. And one that you can get a bit wet when you shower. Problem solved.

The issue with your son smoking post in the house. With any family, it's paramount that parents agree on parenting. Apparently neither of you are willing to come to a compromise and work together to jointly parent.

With the pot issue, I think she's the one in the right here. It does not matter if she smoked pot a few times. What matters is that pot is illegal and it was in your home. She could have lost custody of her daughters if anything ever happened and some authorities found the pot in your son's room. By you allowing your son to keep pot in your home, you basically told your son to your to ignore your wife's position as his step mother.



nikonova said:


> The other night, we were at the bar having dinner and drinks, and I said to her that I'd choose her over anyone else here -and she just laughed and said she doubted that. I was FLOORED! First off, I've never cheated on her, never even wanted to. So this has nothing to do with that. Of course, I was a bit pissed off, and after telling her that, she just said that it was what she believed. Wow....so basically, she just invalidated our marriage right then and there.


Why are you so off put by what she said? I read your post. Do you really think that she does not know how little you think of her? I would love to have your wife come here and tell things from her side. My guess is that she feels about as good about you as you feel about her. She knows this, right? 



nikonova said:


> she goes to the basement to check the laundry. My son comes up from his room in the basement and tells me he's going to meet up with some friends. A moment later, she comes up *****ing and stating the my son who NEVER turns the basement light out, did turn it out and he was a prick for doing so. I was lost at that moment....First off, yes, he fails to turn the light off many times, but not ALL the time. And second, I HIGHLY doubt he did it on purpose. It's obvious that he didn't hear her go down there, period. So now, I'm doubly pissed off. She had to go to bed early, so guess what I did? I went back out to the bar. Yes, not the best thing to do, but I need conversation with people, and I can't sit in the house (her house) and stare at the four walls doing absolutely nothing but living inside my own head.


So I guess counseling is not helping?

You may not want to go through divorce again, but unless the two of you are willing to calm down and work together, divorce is the only thing that makes sense.


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## Vinnydee (Jan 4, 2016)

I am constantly amazed at how spouses stay together after so much toxic stuff. I have to think that toxic couples stay together for lots of reasons, with love not being one of them. Stories like yours make me appreciate my marriage more. I can count on one hand the number of big fights we had over the last 44 years. 

I am also amazed at how adults change after they are married when they were the nicest person alive prior to that. Adults rarely change their nature. One of the ways love affects you is that it blinds you to your partner's faults. After a few years, that initial love fades and you see each other for what you truly are. The initial love is gone and a decision has to be made whether to cultivate a more mature love or say goodbye. Many couples who post seem to be at that crossroad and struggle to find out why someone that loved them, does not love them anymore. Love does not come from the heart. It comes from various feel good chemicals in your brain. It is a chemical reaction that you cannot will into or out of existence. It is either there or not. I feel for you and can understand that you have someone to take care of the kids and a place to live which may be keeping you there much longer than you should. Things will never get better so might as well jump ship now rather than later. Take a look at this.

How long does passion last? The four stages of love - TODAY.com


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## Spicy (Jun 18, 2016)

I know you could only give a few examples on here, but those don't sound like she is toxic, they sound like maybe you have unruly kids. Blended families are very difficult, and parents tend to take their own kids side against the spouse, and then things snowball into some really hard situations. 

It sounds like you want out, and if that is where you are already, you will probably end up divorced again by summer when your son graduates. I'm sorry it didn't work out better. Maybe your next one will since your kids will be grown.


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## ZedZ (Feb 6, 2017)

Sounds toxic but your son needs to respect her wishes of no pot in the house...Pretty basic...


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

@Uptown


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

Hmm, victim or volunteer. So much to ponder. At what point do you take responsibility for your choices?


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## Hope Shimmers (Jul 10, 2015)

farsidejunky said:


> @Uptown


I'll be interested to read if he thinks there is BPD going on here. This just sounds to me like a situation of problems blending the families. 

I have to agree with previous posters that the OP seems to minimize his son's drug use in the house. It's her house (maybe that's one of the major problems) and her rules, and I would definitely feel the same as her.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Hope Shimmers said:


> I'll be interested to read if he thinks there is BPD going on here. This just sounds to me like a situation of problems blending the families.
> 
> I have to agree with previous posters that the OP seems to minimize his son's drug use in the house. *It's her house* (maybe that's one of the major problems) and her rules, and I would definitely feel the same as her.


This is part of the problem with a situation where he and his kids moved into 'her house'. It's not 'their house'. A very unhealthy dynamic for a marriage.


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## WorkingWife (May 15, 2015)

If you are decided you want a divorce - I'd do it now before more damage is done. But if you really don't want a divorce, I think you can turn this around if you start treating her with respect and consideration for her feelings. Please read this: How to Deal with a Quarrelsome and Nagging Wife by Willard F. Harley, Jr. They also have some good stuff on blended families on the same site. Blended Families #1

Blended families are extremely hard. It's very telling how she is losing it in regards to your son (freaking out over the basement light) and you're saying there is "stuff with her daughters." As someone else said, each parent tends to minimize how frustrating their kid can be to the other person, then they end up siding with their kid over their spouse, so the spouse is never first.

I would get and read the book "Love Busters" by Dr. Harley (from the above linked website) and start identifying, and eliminating, the love busters coming from your side. I know you're frustrated with her and she does sound like she's gotten extremely uptight, but it also sounds like you do not respect her and she surely feels that, which puts her more on guard.

If you respected her, you would take her seriously when she doesn't want illegal drugs in the house. I smoked my share of herb when I was a teen too, but if someone living in my house had it in my home, I'd freak out too. And if my husband's kid was the source and my husband's attitude was "nothing I can do about it" I would be seething with hurt and resentment.

Things like the wet mat - in my mind, good grief, what is the big deal with a wet floor mat? But that's me - and apparently you and your son. The point is, she doesn't like it - maybe it gives her the heebie jeebies to step on a wet mat. Instead of treating her with disrespect for the fact that she's bothered by something you judge so trivial, why not do something about it? Someone suggested two mats. That's a great idea. I wonder, is there only one bathroom in the house? If not, can you make the one she uses to shower and dry her hair off limits to your son (and yourself if you can't remember the stupid mat).

Your wife may be a psycho, but she might also be just sick of being disrespected and treated like her wishes and preferences are an inconvenience to everyone else in her own home. (Are you paying half the mortgage, BTW?) Anyhow - once someone starts to feel disrespected, they become hyper-vigilant to being slighted, and every little thing (like the basement light) becomes a purposeful act of indifference to them.

Best of luck!


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## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

nikonova said:


> I'm tired, miserable, depressed, but trying my damnedest to keep a good face and fight the fight. I've been with my wife for nearly 5 years, married for the last two. This is my second marriage. She was two girls (the oldest just moved out at 23), I have three children - two boys who lived with us (my oldest is in the military now and my younger son is graduating high school this June). My daughter lives with her mom a couple hours away.
> 
> Man, I just don't know where it all went wrong. She's a toxic person, but outwardly decries that she's not the problem, it's me. When we first met, she was just amazing - easy going, fun-loving, full of energy, etc. After dating about 3 months, my lease was up at my apartment, so I moved in with her as she had just bought her own house. For the next several months, things seemed to go really well, but then my boys moved in with us just before the new school year. From that point on, it just seemed to go downhill -more like a rollercoaster where you couldn't get off. Our first big argument was that my youngest son was smoking weed in the house and she flipped her lid. Of course, I spoke to him and implored him to stop....and of course, he didn't. He just kept hiding it. Although I was not happy about him smoking it, I honestly couldn't fight it that hard because I did the exact thing at his age (his mom did too). And, to boot, his stepmother had smoked with me a few times over the year, so there you have it. Anyway, it was a huge blowout fight and after she searched his room and found more "stuff", she blew her lid again and told me she was just going to call the police next time. That put the first big tear in our relationship.
> 
> ...



I can see a few problems with your story

1. Your son is in her house, he should RESPECT her rules. If you don't have the cajones to ensure he does, then shame on you. I wouldn't want my H's relatives or any sort coming into my home and even simply smoking. Further, adults smoking weed is very different from a school going kid smoking weed.

She was damn right to threaten to call the police, I would have done the same thing. You are not teaching your kids manners, and the lack of boundaries is appalling. She should kick you both out.

2. You lied when you said you would choose her over anyone else. You have just shown her that you choose your son and his bad behavior over her. Yet you are whinging about it! You are either totally obtuse or choose not to see. 
It is not enough for a man not to cheat, he also has to have his wife's back. She has to know that she can count on him when the chips are down, whether it is with his kids, ex wife or even parents. You have shown her that you are not to be counted on and you see her boundaries as something irrelevant and to be walked over to keep the peace with your son, because you do not have the backbone to discipline him.

3. Yes all of the above is your fault and know that she knows you don't give a **** how she feels about how things should be in her home (she probably feels invaded by your kids with no concern about her) everything will now be a problem, even the so called minor issues. She is already pissed off and probably hurt.

4. You invalidated the marriage because you showed her who you really where. A man who would not stand up for her. She probably does not like your son, he sounds spoiled and you haven't helped in their relationship putting him first all the time. So small things will set her off.

5. You sound immature and not marriage material to be honest. The self pity is overwhelming, poor you how could you tolerate this and then must have a drink, blah blah blah. Grow up, you married the second time, you have to try and blend families it requires hard work, it will not just work out. Sounds like you think that all should be honky dory and your new wife should get with the programme. 

6. You throw stuff at her about her kids which she sees as non issues, yet your underaged son is smoking weed in the home and you see it as a non issue? Wtf, talk about the kettle calling the pot black. YOu cannot see anything that you do wrong at all?

7. I guess your wife is no angel but to be honest neither are you. Perhaps you married to quickly and never thought about blending the families, which is never easy. It appears it is Divorce No 2. I would suggest you work on yourself before getting married again.


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## Satya (Jun 22, 2012)

A woman like your wife is used to getting her way and needs a man at least 2x as strong and stubborn. That's honestly not you and she clearly has no respect for you. 

Yes, she sweats small things, which is not healthy, but your reactions/inaction just reinforces to her that you're weak and can't depend on you. 

Why were you afraid of your son? Why could you not crack down on him? Why should she be strict with her girls when you weren't strict with your son? These are the sorts of childish, high school games adults play when they're growing resentful. 

So, if you can't be the kind of man your wife needs (because I'm guessing you must have been while dating) then let her go. Blending families is a huge challenge. It requires a new standard on parenting to be adopted across the board and adhered to. 

You're both at fault, but she's not here, you are, so the next action must come from you.


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## Uptown (Mar 27, 2010)

@farsidejunky, thanks for the callout.



nikonova said:


> She's a toxic person.


Nik, Farside gave me a callout because I was married for 15 years to a woman exhibiting strong traits of BPD (Borderline Personality Disorder). I agree with Farside that the behaviors you describe -- i.e., irrational anger (e.g., the bathmat), controlling behavior, easily triggered temper tantrums, lack of impulse control, and always being "The Victim" -- are classic warning signs for BPD. Importantly, I'm not suggesting your W has full-blown BPD but, rather, that she may exhibit moderate to strong traits of it.



Hope Shimmers said:


> I'll be interested to read if he thinks there is BPD going on here.


Very good question, Hope. Wish I knew the answer. As you know, BPD is not something -- like chickenpox -- that a person either "has" or "doesn't have." Instead, it is a spectrum disorder, which means every adult on the planet occasionally exhibits all BPD traits to some degree (albeit at a low level if the person is healthy). At issue, then, is not whether Nik's W exhibits BPD traits. Of course she does. We all do. 

Rather, at issue is whether his W exhibits those traits at a strong and persistent level (i.e., is on the upper end of the BPD spectrum). Not having met her, I cannot answer that question. You thus may be correct that this is only _"a situation of problems blending the families."_

I nonetheless believe that Nik can spot any strong BPD warning signs that are present if he takes a little time to learn which behaviors are on the list. They should be easy to spot -- particularly for a man who has been with her for five years -- because there is nothing subtle about behaviors such as verbal abuse, lack of impulse control, and temper tantrums.



nikonova said:


> She's got all of these idiosyncrasies that make me feel I have to *walk on eggshells* with every thing I do (or don't do).


Nik, if your W is a BPDer (i.e., exhibits strong and persistent BPD traits), "walking on eggshells" is exactly how you should be feeling. This is why the #1 best-selling BPD book (targeted to the abused partners) is titled, _Stop Walking on Eggshells_.



nikonova said:


> ...to a point where I really think I'm the crazy one.


Again, if your W is a BPDer, feeling like you may be going "crazy" is exactly how you should be feeling. Of the 157 mental disorders listed in the APA's diagnostic manual, BPD is the _one most notorious _for making the abused partners feel like they may be losing their minds. Therapists typically see far more of those abused partners -- coming in to find out if they are going insane -- than they ever see of the BPDers themselves.

Nothing will drive you crazier sooner than being repeatedly abused by a partner whom you know, to a certainty, must really love you. The reason is that you will be mistakenly convinced that, if only you can figure out what YOU are doing wrong, you can restore your partner to that wonderful human being you saw at the very beginning. Moreover, because BPDers usually are convinced that the absurd allegations coming out of their mouths are absolutely true -- they generally have a greater "crazy-making" effect than can ever be achieved by narcissists or sociopaths. 



> The other night, we were at the bar having dinner and drinks, and I said to her that I'd choose her over anyone else here -and she just laughed and said she doubted that.


If she is a BPDer, she has a great fear of abandonment and very low self esteem. It therefore is impossible to convince her that you truly love her and will remain loyal to her. A BPDer is filled with so much self loathing that, even when she is convinced that you love her AT THIS VERY MOMENT, she lives in fear that you will abandon her as soon as you realize how empty she is on the inside.

With BPDers, the only exception to this statement occurs during the courtship period, a time of infatuation that typically lasts 4 to 6 months. During that brief period, her infatuation convinces her that you are the nearly perfect man who has come to rescue her from her unhappiness. In this way, the infatuation holds her two fears (abandonment and engulfment) at bay. She therefore is briefly convinced you will never walk out on her. 

As soon as the infatuation starts evaporating, however, those two fears return and you will start triggering the anger she's been carrying since early childhood. At that point, it will be impossible to prove to her that you will never leave her and that you dearly love her.



> After dating about 3 months, ...I moved in with her.... For the next several months, things seemed to go really well.


As I noted above, if your W is a BPDer, her fears and anger likely will not be triggered until you are at least 4 to 6 months into the relationship. Until then, her infatuation holds her two fears at bay.



> When we first met, she was just amazing - easy going, fun-loving, full of energy, etc.


If she were a narcissist or sociopath, you likely were being manipulated and deliberately deceived during the courtship period. If she is a BPDer, however, she likely was sincere and not trying to deceive you. What you saw was how she behaves when her two fears (abandonment and engulfment) are held at bay by her infatuation.



> She's always got a way of making everything my fault.


If she really is a BPDer, she is filled with so much self loathing that the last thing she wants to find is one more flaw or mistake to add to the long list of things she hates about herself. This is why it is rare for a BPDer to take responsibility for her own bad choices and bad behavior. And this is why a BPDer is constantly looking for validation that she is "The Victim," always "The Victim." The easiest way to obtain that validation is to perceive of her husband as "The Perpetrator" -- the cause of her unhappiness and every misfortune.



> She comes up *****ing and stating the my son who NEVER turns the basement light out, did turn it out and he was a prick for doing so. I was lost at that moment....First off, yes, he fails to turn the light off many times, but not ALL the time.


Another warning sign for having BPD traits is the frequent use of all-or-nothing expressions like "You NEVER..." and "You ALWAYS...." This childish behavior arises from _"black-white thinking."_ If your W is a BPDer, she is too immature to be able to handle strong conflicting feelings, ambiguities, uncertainties, and other gray areas of interpersonal relationships. 

Hence, like a young child, she will categorize everyone close to her as "all good" (i.e., "white" or "with me") or "all bad" (i.e., "black" or "against me"). And she will recategorize someone from one polar extreme to the other -- in just ten seconds -- based solely on a minor comment or action. 



> We've been to counseling together and separately -no more of that is going to work.


If your W actually is a BPDer, MC likely will be a total waste of time. Although marriage counselors can be very good at teaching communication skills, a BPDer's issues are far more serious than a simple lack of communication skills. Hence, MC is unlikely to be productive until a BPDer has worked hard in individual therapy for several years (a very unlikely situation). My experience is that, until that individual therapy has been done, MC likely will just make things worse. The BPDer will use couples counseling as a stage on which to beat you up in front of an audience (i.e., the MC).



> I don't even know what I'm doing at this time. I'm going to be the bad guy no matter what I do, good or bad.


If your W is a BPDer, you are "the bad guy" no matter what you do. The main reason this predicament occurs is that the BPDer's two great fears -- abandonment and engulfment -- lie at opposite ends of the _very same_ spectrum. This means you are always in a lose/lose situation because, as you back away from one fear to avoid triggering it, you will start triggering the fear at the other end of that same spectrum.

Hence, as you move close to a BPDer to comfort her and assure her of your love, you will start triggering her engulfment fear, making her feel like she's being suffocated and controlled by you. Yet, as you back away to give her breathing space, you will find that you've started triggering her abandonment fear. And, sadly, there is no midpoints solution (between "too close" and "too far away") where you can safely stand to avoid triggering the two fears. I know because I foolishly spent 15 years searching for that Goldilocks position, which simply does not exist. 



> Ugh, help please.


Nik, I suggest that you see a psychologist -- for a visit or two all by yourself -- to obtain a candid professional opinion on what it is that you and the kids are dealing with. I also suggest that, while you're looking for a good psych, you read about BPD warning signs to see if most seem to apply.

Significantly, learning to spot these warning signs will not enable you to diagnose your W's issues. Although you can easily spot any strong BPD symptoms that occur, only a professional can determine whether they are so severe as to constitute full-blown BPD. 

Yet, for purposes of deciding whether to stay married, it really does not matter whether your W's BPD traits are full-blown or not. A woman whose symptoms satisfy only 70% or 80% of the diagnostic guidelines (thus "not having BPD") can be nearly as impossible to live with as a woman satisfying 100% (thus "having BPD").

Moreover, like learning warning signs for stroke and heart attack, learning those for BPD may help you avoid a very painful situation -- e.g., avoid remaining in a toxic marriage or avoid running into the arms of another woman who is just like her. Further, learning to spot the warning signs likely will help you decide whether your situation is serious enough to warrant spending money on consulting with a psychologist.

An easy place to start reading is my list of red flags at _*18 BPD Warning Signs*_. If most sound very familiar, I would suggest you read my more detailed description of them at my posts in _*Maybe's Thread*_. If that description rings any bells, I would be glad to join *Farside*, *Hope*, *Elegirl*, and the other respondents in discussing them with you. Take care, Nik.


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## Haiku (Apr 9, 2014)

Kids add an interesting and challenging dynamic to a relationship. 

As progressive and open minded as I think I am I'd have a problem with your son smoking weed in the house and possibly over "the other stuff" I found in his room all in proximity of my daughter. And I'd take note if someone shined it on. I'm not saying that's what you did nor am I onboard thinking she has some BPD any more than you might. 

You both seem to be facing a challenge in problem solving and not on the same page. Perhaps you aren't a good match. Good luck.


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## browser (Oct 26, 2016)

She's not being all that unreasonable, especially with the pot smoking in the house issue which has become "I'm not going to respect her wishes because I did it when I was young so she's just going to have to live with it.

Dude for whatever reasons your second marriage has gone south only 2 years in. Your given reason for staying together is "you didn't get married just to get divorced again", and you take zero responsibility for the problems. It's all "her" fault that she wants a dry bath mat and lights turned off because that's the way she's always done it before you and your son's moved into HER house. 

Well the truth is, you entered a marriage with prior children on both sides, and before you even exchanged vows you were looking at a failure rate of abougt 67% based on current statistics. 

So the first thing you need to do is be realistic and say "I screwed up and this isn't going to work" and the second thing you do is sit down with her and say "sorry this isn't working lets figure out how to cut our losses here". 

Then move on with your life and stop getting married because with an enabled pot smoking son and your inability to dry yourself in the shower before stepping into the mat coupled with your inability to understand and acknowledge the feelings of the person who is supposed to be number one in your life, you don't have a chance at a long term relationship with anyone else either.


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## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

I just have to share this about the mat. I know tons of people who consider it inconsiderate to leave the shower in such a way that the mat gets soaked. First off, step on it in socks and then you have to change your socks. Also, a daily soaked shower mat will get stinky, moldy, mildewed.

I have teenaged sons. Neither are terribly clean and orderly. However!! One got pissed at the other over this very issue. Mat was soaked after younger one took a shower. Older one went in there, stepped on soaked mat, and yelled: what the hell, what did your water break or something?

Pretty amusing.


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## browser (Oct 26, 2016)

Livvie said:


> I just have to share this about the mat. I know tons of people who consider it inconsiderate to leave the shower in such a way that the mat gets soaked. First off, step on it in socks and then you have to change your socks. Also, a daily soaked shower mat will get stinky, moldy, mildewed.


It's so easy for him to accommodate her concerns about the shower mat, and probably a boatload of other small, reasonable requests but he'd rather complain about how toxic she is because *gasp* she has an issue with his son's continued illegal drug use in HER house. 

Some people are just not designed to be parents or relationship partners.


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## Spicy (Jun 18, 2016)

browser said:


> She's not being all that unreasonable, especially with the pot smoking in the house issue which has become "I'm not going to respect her wishes because I did it when I was young so she's just going to have to live with it.
> 
> Dude for whatever reasons your second marriage has gone south only 2 years in. Your given reason for staying together is "you didn't get married just to get divorced again", and you take zero responsibility for the problems. It's all "her" fault that she wants a dry bath mat and lights turned off because that's the way she's always done it before you and your son's moved into HER house.
> 
> ...


:iagree:
THIS...1,000%


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## nikonova (Mar 13, 2017)

Thanks to *most* of you who are offering help. My post was just a tiny snapshot, without a lot of back story, and there's so much more. For those of you who just took this as me whining and that I'm not a good husband, blah, blah, blah...well that's your opinion based on pretty much nothing. 

Listen, she's a great person when everything is going her way. That's why I still love her, and keep trying. With regards to the whole pot smoking thing. Each time he was caught, I had a discussion with him, and each time I became more stern about it (I'm not afraid of my son, as some mentioned lol). The last time he got caught, I actually went off on him. Why? because he was just not getting it, and I wanted him to stop doing it in the house! A little back story on the pot thing with him. He was bitten by a tick in the summer between 8th and 9th grade and contracted Lyme disease. As a result, he now has refactory Lyme induced arthritis in his knee. He played football from the age of 5, all the way to 9th grade when this disease took a hold on him and he could no longer play football. The kid went through several rounds of oral antibiotics, a 30-day round of IV antibiotics, a knee surgery, several fluid drains, and now he is on a medication which, in higher doses, is for cancer patients. He is 18 and has lived with this for four years. His knee hurts like hell, and it's twice the size of a normal knee. He was taking Advil like it was candy, causing all sorts of stomach problems. His use of pot has been to calm down the pain in his knee. Honestly, I'd rather him do that than take all of these medications which are worse for him. You can have whatever opinion you want on this particular matter, but when you feel powerful enough to deride me, based on what little knowledge you have? lol.

Back to the issue at hand. Yes, I believe she is BPD. No, I don't have a clinical diagnosis. In my last discussion with a therapist, she (a woman), had actually brought that up. Since then, I've done a lot of reading about it (yes, I read it on the internet...so it must be true lol). Back when we first started counseling, I went first, by myself. Then, she wanted to go to the counselor together, with which I replied, Sure! Over the next two sessions, I did most of the talking, she did most of the crying, and in the end, nothing was solved. She began going to a counselor on her own because she said she had things to work on. However, one day, she came home after a session and came up to my office (I work from home), stood in the doorway with a huge chip on her shoulder and just started to rattle things off at me about how right she was and how wrong I was. Well, isn't that dandy. See, the problem I have counseling (and it goes both ways), is that when you are one-on-one with a counselor, you can say anything about the other person -whether it be true or not, and that other person isn't there to defend him or herself. So, what the counselor gets is a one-way story, and that's just not the truth. Looking back at our counseling sessions together, it's interesting to see this pattern...we go together, I explain my issues, she cries, counselor feels bad, gives us some games to play with each other, things get a little better, a few weeks later...back to where we were. At any time in those sessions, she *could* have stood up and discussed what was going on in her perspective, but she didn't. Who is the victim here? And mind you, I wasn't being mean at all, just stating facts from my perspective. I wasn't trying to bash her in any way...I'm not like that. I prefer discussion over arguing. I prefer logic over emotion...her? Completely opposite (and I'm not saying that to be mean. It's just the difference between us, but at some point, you need to actually have a dialog, not just one-sided yelling and then not talking at all). 

Here's another prime example of what I go through on a regular basis. A couple years ago, we were both in the kitchen. I had a runny nose from my allergies. So, I took a piece of paper from the paper towel roll (it's the half sheet kind, which I only took a half), and used it to blow my nose. She got mad that I did that. Of course, I was floored. How does a grown person get mad at another grown person for using a piece of paper towel to blow their nose? 

Here's another thing that just bugs the crap out of me. Social media. She is constantly posting things on FB, Instagram, Snapchat without actually tagging or mentioning me, but I (and all of our friends) know exactly who she is directing this at. Like seriously? You can't discuss your issues about me with me so we can figure things out? Noooo...post it on social media for everyone else to wonder. That, in my opinion, is just childish.

You want to hear more of the things that have happened? I can keep going....One morning about 7am, I was awoken to very loud music outside the house. When I came downstairs, she asked me why I was up so early (I'm not a morning person..I work from home, and I am not a good sleeper). I said your car radio sounds like a band playing next door, that's what woke me up. Her response...."Well, it's been louder than that before". No apology, nothing but that comment. Now, if the roles were reversed, I would have said, "Oh, I'm sorry!"...but that's just me. 

If I say it's cold in the house, she says it isn't. If I say I'm hot, she says it's not. Basically, if it doesn't affect her..it doesn't exist. If someone says they're cold (just a bit of conversation...nobody has to do anything about it...sweaters do exist) then they must be spoiled. If I say I'm not feeling well, I'll get a "hmm". Huh? 

Basically, any "feeling" that I have is completely ignored and invalidated by her. My music is bad, hers is the best. The movies I like are awful...but she will watch the same 4 or 5 movies all the time. There was a week or so where Devil Wears Prada was on several times...and she would watch it each time. I can't do that...if I've seen a move a couple times, it's enough for me. Watching the same things over and over just drives me crazy (I'm not a big TV watcher anyways). 

I could go on and on and on. Many of you will have your opinions, and that's all well and good. Yes, I've allowed a lot of this to continue, and that's on me. But none of you are in my shoes, so before you become judgmental, step back and look at your perfect life. For those of you who have words of wisdom, empathy, understanding, and constructive criticism - thank you.


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## browser (Oct 26, 2016)

nikonova said:


> Thanks to *most* of you who are offering help. My post was just a tiny snapshot, without a lot of back story, and there's so much more. For those of you who just took this as me whining and that I'm not a good husband, blah, blah, blah...well that's your opinion based on pretty much nothing.
> 
> You can have whatever opinion you want on this particular matter, but when you feel powerful enough to deride me, based on what little knowledge you have? lol.


All we have to work with is what you told us in your post, it was your choice to include particular examples and backstory, and from those examples I have the opinion that you are insensitive, inconsiderate to her feelings and quick to make a big deal out of minor issues that you could simple agree to- such as drying yourself off in the shower and preventing your son from smoking pot in her house- but once again you rationalize and justify it (he's got a medical issue that is helped by the weed) rather than accepting the fact that you are being unreasonable.



nikonova said:


> Basically, any "feeling" that I have is completely ignored and invalidated by her..


Which is exactly how she thinks of you.


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

If he has a legitimate medical issue, then get him some edibles. No need to smoke it.


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## nikonova (Mar 13, 2017)

browser said:


> All we have to work with is what you told us in your post, it was your choice to include particular examples and backstory, and from those examples I have the opinion that you are insensitive, inconsiderate to her feelings and quick to make a big deal out of minor issues that you could simple agree to- such as drying yourself off in the shower and preventing your son from smoking pot in her house- but once again you rationalize and justify it (he's got a medical issue that is helped by the weed) rather than accepting the fact that you are being unreasonable.
> 
> 
> 
> Which is exactly how she thinks of you.


Actually, I'm very sensitive and considerate...but there's a limit to it. When you continually bend over backwards to meet another person's expectations (however unreal they seem to be at times), and still get **** for it....there's a point where you take a step back. As far as the bath mat thing goes...let's continue on this, for the sake of being petty. A bath mat, is first and foremost, a bath mat, and only a bath mat. It's intended use is to soak up excess water so the water isn't all over the floor. Pretty basic item, use and purpose. Now, I dry myself off as best as I can before I exit the shower. With one exception - I don't dry the bottom of my feet off. Why? Well the tub is constantly getting plugged up, so it's completely pointless to dry the bottoms of my feet off, as they will just get wet again. I'm not going to move the shower curtain all the way over, sit on the edge of the tub, dry one foot off, place it outside of the shower, dry the other foot off, and then proceed to stand on the bath mat. The mat doesn't get so wet that you could wring it out...I never knew that a bath mat could create so much drama! 

I'm actually a very reasonable person. When a reasonable person tries to work with a unreasonable person, that's where the problems begin. I am flexible and reasonable, she is stiff and unwavering -not wanting discussion, just do as I want, do as I say, when I say it. I don't do well in a totalitarian environment. I do well in a equal partnership, where each individual has as much say as the other. That is just not the case here. It's her way or the highway -and believe me you, I've given in to her way more often than not, just to satisfy her so there isn't an argument.....


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## browser (Oct 26, 2016)

nikonova said:


> As far as the bath mat thing goes...let's continue on this, for the sake of being petty. A bath mat, is first and foremost, a bath mat, and only a bath mat. It's intended use is to soak up excess water so the water isn't all over the floor. Pretty basic item, use and purpose. Now, I dry myself off as best as I can before I exit the shower. With one exception - I don't dry the bottom of my feet off. Why? Well the tub is constantly getting plugged up, so it's completely pointless to dry the bottoms of my feet off, as they will just get wet again


Did it ever occur to you that you can unplug the drain?

That's what guys do, they take care of the home and fix stuff like that. You remove the little drain cover with the holes in it, take a pair of pliars, and insert the handle ends into the crisscross drain and turn it counterclockwise until you remove the drain plug along with a ton of hair. Then, you apply plumbers putty around the inside of the drain flange that you just removed, (roll it up like a worm then wrap it around the flange) and screw it back on again. Total time less than 5 minutes. Total points earned with your happy wife? More than you lose by not fixing the problem and soaking her bath mat despite her repeated requests to the contrary. 

I'll bet if you said to her "does it bother you that I don't fix little things around the house like clogged shower drains" she'd nod emphatically in the affirmative, especially since it probably was not an issue when there were less people living there-before you and your two sons moved in and added to the need for home maintenance. 

Instead, you ignore her request to dry off in the tub, because the drain is clogged which is something that you should naturally fix rather than use as a justification for a habit that she finds objectionable.

Sorry man I'm just trying to help but the more you write the more I just shake my head and think "he just doesn't get it".


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## GuyInColorado (Dec 26, 2015)

Grow some balls and tell your son to stop smoking or go back to his mom's house. Sounds like she has no respect for you. 

You're raising a future loser. Do you consider yourself successful? Do you want your son to be just like you?

Let me ask you this. Do you see things improving once your son graduates HS and moves out? At the very least, once he graduates HS, he's out of the house. If not, you two should go move into your own place and get back to happier times.


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## WorkingWife (May 15, 2015)

Uptown said:


> Yet, for purposes of deciding whether to stay married, it really does not matter whether your W's BPD traits are full-blown or not. A woman whose symptoms satisfy only 70% or 80% of the diagnostic guidelines (thus "not having BPD") can be nearly as impossible to live with as a woman satisfying 100% (thus "having BPD").


Wow, Uptown, your posts on this subject are always so fascinating. Do you have an opinion on whether or not a woman whose symptoms are less than full on BPD can/will get better with treatment more readily than one with full on BPD? Or if someone's spouse is 70 - 80% is it pretty unlikely they'll ever be a good partner?


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## nikonova (Mar 13, 2017)

browser said:


> Did it ever occur to you that you can unplug the drain?
> 
> That's what guys do, they take care of the home and fix stuff like that. You remove the little drain cover with the holes in it, take a pair of pliars, and insert the handle ends into the crisscross drain and turn it counterclockwise until you remove the drain plug along with a ton of hair. Then, you apply plumbers putty around the inside of the drain flange that you just removed, (roll it up like a worm then wrap it around the flange) and screw it back on again. Total time less than 5 minutes. Total points earned with your happy wife? More than you lose by not fixing the problem and soaking her bath mat despite her repeated requests to the contrary.
> 
> ...


Dude. Ok, a little more back story for you. The drain gets clogged all the time, it's old plumbing. We've used all of the strong liquid drain cleaners we can find to unclog it...but it just continues to clog. We don't have the $ to hire a plumber to basically replace the pipes all the way down to the main drain. You are making assumptions without asking further questions to base your responses on my friend. I think you really just want me to be wrong or the bad guy, not quite sure. When I first moved in, of course, if I saw something that need fixing, I would take it upon myself to fix it. However, walking past her sitting on the couch with a screwdriver in my hand, she would ask me "What are you doing with that?", which my reply would be that "XYZ is loose, so I'm going to fix it". She would say, "No, I'll get it". This happened several times where I was not just questioned what I was doing, I felt interrogated. That's irritating. I can fix just about anything and everything -and not half-assed in case you were going to say something there. This type of behavior has decreased over time....but it still rears it's ugly head. Actually, the more I read your comments, the more I think "(S/He) just doesn't get it", so touche. See...there really is no "happy wife" as you mention -maybe YOURS is happy when you do stuff, mine...just critical or condescending, or something other than ok and thankful (not that she needs to thank me, adults do a lot of thankless stuff...it's just the way it is). Yea, I'm done with discussing the bath mat thing. I appreciate your willingness to provide me with instructions on how to fix a drain, I had no idea. :wink2:.


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## lifeistooshort (Mar 17, 2013)

So you basically look the other way while your son smokes weed in her house that you moved in to, but she's toxic and you're the victim. 

Ok then. 

If you think you're such a good deal and you can do better then divorce her and give it a shot.

Good luck....you are going to need a lot of it.

On a side note it never ceases to amaze me how many psychiatrists we have here on TAM that are capable of diagnosing mental disorders based on one side of the story (and the diagnosed person isn't even present). Licensed psychiatrists would be troubled to know that their education was a complete waste because it seems to takes so little to do their job.


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## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

Face it. You only knew the woman 3 months before you moved in with her. Now, you feel as though you have to make it work or you'll have another failure on your hands. You two are not compatible and it doesn't necessarily mean it's because she has BPD (which gets thrown around a lot here when the guy thinks the woman is unreasonable).

Cut your losses and move on. It can't be any harder than breaking down and buying an extra bath mat or telling your son to drive down the street and smoke pot in his car.


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## nikonova (Mar 13, 2017)

You apparent haven't read everything in this post. Didn't look the other way, as you suggest. Just didn't beat my kid into submission. He was scolded for his actions. But, hey, who am I to parent my son in a way that I believe in. Oh, and did you go to college for anything? I'm curious what you do for a living. You seem to know a lot about psychology.


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## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

Is marijuana even legal in your state?


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## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

FYI re the mat. White standing in the shower, you can lift one foot up a few inches, dry it off, set it outside the shower on the mat, all dry, then lift the other and dry that one, set it down.


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## WorkingWife (May 15, 2015)

OK, you've turned me some. Now she's starting to get on my nerves, LOL

Are you able to have a conversation with her about your relationship? Does she have a common theme to what is at the root of her unhappiness? If she is BPD, there may not be a solution other than divorce. But if she's just a typical woman who has become increasingly hysterical because she feels her complaints/concerns aren't taken seriously I still think you can turn things around following the stuff I linked to you previously on the marriagebuilders.com website.

The bathmat issue I can see, getting mad at you for blowing your nose on a paper towel? WTF? That definitely sounds hyper-critical.

BTW - Smoking _anything _is not healthy for your son either. I'd look into real medical marijuana. They have some now where it has less of the THC and more of the other compound so it doesn't mess with the brain as much. Studies are coming out linking pot with schizophrenia and other issues. It's not necessarily harmless, especially if your son is using it regularly. Also, marijuana aside - many people don't allow smoking inside their homes, period. The smell gets in the paint and carpeting and irritates other's allergies. So smokers step outside. If that's the issue with your son, I know teens are by nature selfish, inconsiderate and usually forgetful, but if he can't pull it together enough to remember to smoke outside (or maybe in the garage for privacy?) then maybe he doesn't need any more marijuana...

One last question - you didn't say if you're paying half the mortgage. What is the financial situation between the two of you? I'm wondering if she is the main breadwinner and feels frustrated by that and that's why she blew a gasket over your use of a paper towel?





nikonova said:


> Thanks to *most* of you who are offering help. My post was just a tiny snapshot, without a lot of back story, and there's so much more. For those of you who just took this as me whining and that I'm not a good husband, blah, blah, blah...well that's your opinion based on pretty much nothing.
> 
> Listen, she's a great person when everything is going her way. That's why I still love her, and keep trying. With regards to the whole pot smoking thing. Each time he was caught, I had a discussion with him, and each time I became more stern about it (I'm not afraid of my son, as some mentioned lol). The last time he got caught, I actually went off on him. Why? because he was just not getting it, and I wanted him to stop doing it in the house! A little back story on the pot thing with him. He was bitten by a tick in the summer between 8th and 9th grade and contracted Lyme disease. As a result, he now has refactory Lyme induced arthritis in his knee. He played football from the age of 5, all the way to 9th grade when this disease took a hold on him and he could no longer play football. The kid went through several rounds of oral antibiotics, a 30-day round of IV antibiotics, a knee surgery, several fluid drains, and now he is on a medication which, in higher doses, is for cancer patients. He is 18 and has lived with this for four years. His knee hurts like hell, and it's twice the size of a normal knee. He was taking Advil like it was candy, causing all sorts of stomach problems. His use of pot has been to calm down the pain in his knee. Honestly, I'd rather him do that than take all of these medications which are worse for him. You can have whatever opinion you want on this particular matter, but when you feel powerful enough to deride me, based on what little knowledge you have? lol.
> 
> ...


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## nikonova (Mar 13, 2017)

Blondilocks, well, you may be right there. I did move in fairly soon, but we lived together for 2 years before getting married. You'd think that would be enough time to get to know someone. I did see the signs, but I ignored them, shrugged them off. My bad. Ugh with the bath mat. I'm sorry I ever even brought it up. Who knew it could cause so much grief, and people would have very strong opinions about it lol.


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## WorkingWife (May 15, 2015)

browser said:


> Did it ever occur to you that you can unplug the drain? ...
> 
> That's what guys do, they take care of the home and fix stuff like that. You remove the little drain cover with the holes in it, take a pair of pliars, and insert the handle ends into the crisscross drain and turn it counterclockwise until you remove the drain plug along with a ton of hair. Then, you apply plumbers putty around the inside of the drain flange that you just removed, (roll it up like a worm then wrap it around the flange) and screw it back on again. Total time less than 5 minutes. Total points earned with your happy wife? More than you lose by not fixing the problem and soaking her bath mat despite her repeated requests to the contrary.


That is very valuable information, thank you!


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## nikonova (Mar 13, 2017)

Medical is, casual is not.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

nikonova,

What state do you live in? Is post for medical use legal in your state?

So, if you cannot dry your feet off completely after a shower, get to mats. Or get a bathroom rug for her to stand on when she does her hair. Does she get the bath mat wet when she gets out of the shower?

The bottom line here is that you two cannot seem to work together to create a good relationship. You cannot change her. The only person you can change is yourself. So that's where your effort needs to be.. on yourself.

It seems to me that the only solution here is for you to divorce her. Get your own place with your son.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

nikonova said:


> Medical is, casual is not.


Does your son of a prescription for medical pot?


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## browser (Oct 26, 2016)

nikonova said:


> Medical is, casual is not.


If your son has not been prescribed marijuana by a licensed physician then it's illegal and of course he's using it illegally and of course you know this, but you're ok with it.

Before I drop off this thread completely I'll leave you with the thought that allowing your son to smoke marijuana in your wife's home is a CRIME.

Even though "you did it yourself so it's ok".

As others have said, good luck, you sir are going to need a big dose of it because it's all you have going for you at the moment.


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## nikonova (Mar 13, 2017)

WorkingWife said:


> OK, you've turned me some. Now she's starting to get on my nerves, LOL
> 
> Are you able to have a conversation with her about your relationship? Does she have a common theme to what is at the root of her unhappiness? If she is BPD, there may not be a solution other than divorce. But if she's just a typical woman who has become increasingly hysterical because she feels her complaints/concerns aren't taken seriously I still think you can turn things around following the stuff I linked to you previously on the marriagebuilders.com website.
> 
> ...


We used to have conversations, but they never really went anywhere. She listened, I listened, we both took what we took out of it, but nothing was really done. Of course, I tried to see things her way, and sometimes I could...and tried to go about it differently. But, in her mind, she is never wrong, at all. BWT - She's a perfectionist in everything she does, so if she didn't do it, then it's wrong. 

Yes, smoking anything is bad for you. Walking across the street can be bad for you too. I have curtailed his pot smoking in the house and that hasn't been an issue. Of course, he will argue with me until the cow comes home..."pot has never killed anyone"...and those sorts of things. He must have read it on the internet...so it must be true. I'm sure he hasn't read any "real" studies -which I have pointed out to him as informative for evaluating his use of it. 

Financial situation - I pay half of everything and then some. We keep our finances separate. We both have our own checking accounts, and a joint account where we both put money into to pay the bills. I know she doesn't like the separate finances thing, but that's a whole other story that I won't get into here from my past where I had only a joint account and the money just kept going missing.....In the end, I pay my bills every single paycheck. 

Listen, I'm not perfect -no one is. I don't pretend to be perfect by any means. I own up to my mistakes (and I've made them many times), and try to learn from them. I love the anonymity of the internet lol. It gives people power beyond their reach to say any damn thing they want, at any time, with no recourse. For those of you that are perfect, I salute you! You win the internet.:smthumbup:


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

nikonova said:


> Blondilocks, well, you may be right there. I did move in fairly soon, but we lived together for 2 years before getting married. You'd think that would be enough time to get to know someone. I did see the signs, but I ignored them, shrugged them off. My bad. Ugh with the bath mat. I'm sorry I ever even brought it up. Who knew it could cause so much grief, and people would have very strong opinions about it lol.


The bit about the bath mat was actually a very good thing for you to bring up. It's very telling.

There is an old joke about marriage... A couple goes to marriage counseling. After several appointments it seems that the couple is getting nowhere. Then in one session the wife blurts out "But you all ways leave the top off the toothpaste!" To this the counselor replied: "Oh, I did not it was this serious."

The point is that when the little things get turned into big things that a couple cannot resolve, it's a symptom that the relationship is so seriously broken that probably cannot be fixed.

The solution to the bath mat thing is so easy that it's ridiculous that it's even an issue. You are both being hard headed about it. It is reasonable that she does not want to step on a wet mat. I gave you an easy solution... 2 mats/rugs. Instead of coming up with an easy solution, you want to stick to your argument that the mat is there to step on with wet feet. She wants to stick to the argument that she wants a dry mat to stand on. And there the two of you stand, horns locked.... completely ignoring the many simple solutions that could put an immediate end to the argument. So clearly, you two want to argue.


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## nikonova (Mar 13, 2017)

browser said:


> If your son has not been prescribed marijuana by a licensed physician then it's illegal and of course he's using it illegally and of course you know this, but you're ok with it.
> 
> Before I drop off this thread completely I'll leave you with the thought that allowing your son to smoke marijuana in your wife's home is a CRIME.
> 
> ...


Do you always drive the speed limit -I mean to the tee and always? If so, kudos to you. I didn't say I was "ok" with it...I've told him that I do not like the fact that he's doing it (and doing it in her house), and that it's harmful. Thank you for the criminal law information. I'm sure you'll see him on America's Most Wanted sometime soon for your enjoyment.


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## nikonova (Mar 13, 2017)

EleGirl said:


> The bit about the bath mat was actually a very good thing for you to bring up. It's very telling.
> 
> There is an old joke about marriage... A couple goes to marriage counseling. After several appointments it seems that the couple is getting nowhere. Then in one session the wife blurts out "But you all ways leave the top off the toothpaste!" To this the counselor replied: "Oh, I did not it was this serious."
> 
> ...


Well, I really don't want to argue about it. Oddly enough, if I just ignore her outbursts about the mat, guess what...I won't hear anything about it until the next time. What we need is a his & hers bathroom lol. We have one shower in the house (at one time we had 6 people living here - 4 kids and two adults). Not everyone has the same bath mat etiquette, especially when it comes to kids/young adults. I don't want a soaking wet bath mat just much as the other person, and if it was completely soaking wet all the time, I'd ask who was doing it and ask them to please dry off in the shower a little better. If there's a couple of lightly wet footprints on the bath mat, THAT'S WHAT IT'S THERE FOR! I'm 47 years old and as far as I can remember back, the bath mat was there to catch any drips of water and for no other reason other (well, except for keeping your feet a bit warmer and keeping you from slipping on the floor). I'm just trying to imagine what others are picturing in their minds here to keep this bath mat issue going...picture me standing on the bath mat while I douse myself with a bucket of water lol. I'm actually beginning to laugh at this issue that people are so willing to attach to. #notmybathmat haha.:grin2:


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

nikonova said:


> Well, I really don't want to argue about it. Oddly enough, if I just ignore her outbursts about the mat, guess what...I won't hear anything about it until the next time. What we need is a his & hers bathroom lol. We have one shower in the house (at one time we had 6 people living here - 4 kids and two adults). Not everyone has the same bath mat etiquette, especially when it comes to kids/young adults. I don't want a soaking wet bath mat just much as the other person, and if it was completely soaking wet all the time, I'd ask who was doing it and ask them to please dry off in the shower a little better. If there's a couple of lightly wet footprints on the bath mat, THAT'S WHAT IT'S THERE FOR! I'm 47 years old and as far as I can remember back, the bath mat was there to catch any drips of water and for no other reason other (well, except for keeping your feet a bit warmer and keeping you from slipping on the floor). I'm just trying to imagine what others are picturing in their minds here to keep this bath mat issue going...picture me standing on the bath mat while I douse myself with a bucket of water lol. I'm actually beginning to laugh at this issue that people are so willing to attach to. #notmybathmat haha.:grin2:


It's not the flipping bath mat. It's that there is simple solution and you have no interest in the solution.

Why is she standing on a bath mat when she does her hair? Is the bathroom so small that there is only enough room for one small bath matt on the floor? Is there room for a small bathroom rug that is always dry?

The issue is that you want to argue about the purpose of a bath mat instead of implementing a simple solution. You want to argue.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Does your son have a prescription for medical pot?


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## browser (Oct 26, 2016)

nikonova said:


> Do you always drive the speed limit -I mean to the tee and always? If so, kudos to you.


I speed all the time.

But when my girlfriend asks me to slow down, I do it. rather an argue about why it's ok to keep right on speeding.



nikonova said:


> Well, I really don't want to argue about it. Oddly enough, if I just ignore her outbursts about the mat, guess what...I won't hear anything about it until the next time.:


That is not the way to solve the problem. Just because she stops complaining doesn't mean she's satisfied with your response, which is to do nothing but ignore her.



nikonova said:


> I didn't say I was "ok" with it...I've told him that I do not like the fact that he's doing it (and doing it in her house), and that it's harmful.


You didn't try hard enough to stop him. And your wife knows this. Did you not say to her "I did it when I was younger and I don't think it's such a terrible thing?". Of course you did. And that my friend is why you are depressed, miserable, and in a rapidly failing marriage.



nikonova said:


> Yes, smoking anything is bad for you. Walking across the street can be bad for you too.


With this sort of response, you wonder why your wife has become increasingly frustrated with you?



nikonova said:


> Listen, I'm not perfect -no one is. I don't pretend to be perfect by any means. I own up to my mistakes (and I've made them many times), and try to learn from them.


You're not doing such a good job of it.


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## WorkingWife (May 15, 2015)

nikonova said:


> We used to have conversations, but they never really went anywhere. She listened, I listened, we both took what we took out of it, but nothing was really done. Of course, I tried to see things her way, and sometimes I could...and tried to go about it differently. But, in her mind, she is never wrong, at all. BWT - She's a perfectionist in everything she does, so if she didn't do it, then it's wrong.


It is very hard to live with a "perfectionist" especially one who is always right. If she's that bad I really think you should consider cutting your losses and getting out. Whether she is toxic or not, you obviously find the environment toxic and I wonder how it affects your sons. You don't want to disrupt their lives again, but how is their experience living with her?

If you do want to try something to save this though, I really hope you will look at the marriagebuilders.com site I told you about and their stuff. They take a different approach than marriage counselors and may be able to help you turn things around by changing how you interact, and since she's obviously not happy either, if you could get her on board and you could do it together it might really work. Worst case scenario you'll learn a lot for future relationships to go much better.



nikonova said:


> Yes, smoking anything is bad for you. Walking across the street can be bad for you too. I have curtailed his pot smoking in the house and that hasn't been an issue. Of course, he will argue with me until the cow comes home..."pot has never killed anyone"...and those sorts of things. He must have read it on the internet...so it must be true. I'm sure he hasn't read any "real" studies -which I have pointed out to him as informative for evaluating his use of it.


I understand. I have a nephew like this. Total health and fitness nut in other ways, but apparently marijuana is some panacea from mother nature that the govt. is trying to keep from us so big pharma and evil doctors can make money with things that don't work and he thinks nothing of smoking it daily.



nikonova said:


> Financial situation - I pay half of everything and then some. We keep our finances separate. We both have our own checking accounts, and a joint account where we both put money into to pay the bills. I know she doesn't like the separate finances thing, but that's a whole other story that I won't get into here from my past where I had only a joint account and the money just kept going missing.....In the end, I pay my bills every single paycheck.


Thanks for answering, I was thinking she may feel resentful/financially insecure if you're just living in the house she's buying, but it sounds like that should not be the case. I understand her not liking separate finances, but I also understand your doing them. My H and I have everything combined and I'm the 90% bread winner right now and I'm in a very bad/vulnerable position because of it.



nikonova said:


> Listen, I'm not perfect -no one is. I don't pretend to be perfect by any means. I own up to my mistakes (and I've made them many times), and try to learn from them. I love the anonymity of the internet lol. It gives people power beyond their reach to say any damn thing they want, at any time, with no recourse. For those of you that are perfect, I salute you! You win the internet.:smthumbup:


[/QUOTE]

You're right, no one is perfect. Especially not people who get off on slapping down total strangers on the Internet. But there is also the good side of the anonymity of the internet - you can put your story up here and people who aren't emotionally tied to you can give you feedback. All you can do is comb through that and take what you can from it. Your wife may very well be an unreasonable person, it sounds like a therapist already wondered if she has BPD. But the way you tell the story, it might also be much simpler where she has become unreasonable in reaction to feeling not heard. The "laid back guy" and the "hyper critical" wife is a story as old as time. There is a dynamic that causes it. If that is your problem and you can shift that dynamic you may be able to have a wonderful marriage. But you are the one coming here for help, so you are the only one in your marriage people recommend change to. I really hope you'll check out the information on this website: Dr. Harley's Basic Concepts


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## WorkingWife (May 15, 2015)

browser said:


> I speed all the time.
> 
> But when my girlfriend asks me to slow down, I do it. rather an argue about why it's ok to keep right on speeding.


OMG, could you talk to my husband, please? He's getting a tiny bit better with his attitude about this, but he's an excellent but, lets say "assertive" driver. I've been in multiple bad accidents as a passenger and I'm a very nervous passenger. (Others have said he takes chances they would never take so it's not just my nerves.) When his driving makes me panic instead of slowing down he usually gets irritated at me and goes faster, if anything, and tells me to "just close your eyes" or "read your kindle." I feel actual HATRED for him when I am stuck in the passenger seat with no control over the situation and he disregards my fear, reasonable or not.


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## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

The bath mat example (they're supposed to get wet!) and son smoking pot in the house (pot never killed anyone) are both examples of disrespect. The responses divert attention away from the real issue which is showing respect.

When your son has his own home, then he can smoke whatever he wants, whenever he wants and for how long he wants. But, until then, he needs to show respect to others.

You can laugh about the silly bath mat 'til the cows come home but it won't stop her feeling disrespected. So, get your ass down to Bed Bath & Beyond and buy another damn bath mat and let her see that you do consider her wishes. And, if you're too proud to bend in this area then get out.


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## jb02157 (Apr 16, 2014)

I would have to agree with your wife on the pot use of your son. Just because you used to do it doesn't make it right or acceptable for anyone else. I would have flipped out about that to. It would be my guess that all the rest of this stuff has it's roots in this to. If you want harmony in this marriage, you're going to have to fix this problem or nothing it going to improve


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## nikonova (Mar 13, 2017)

Ha, well this is a bit of a segue from the main topic, but my wife is a VERY aggressive driver. I usually like to drive when we're together. She's had several accidents in the past (and again, we each have our own insurance plans, because I have a perfect driving record and low insurance and want to keep it that way!). She says most of the accidents weren't her fault, and at least 2-3 times a month she tells me how she almost got hit driving to work or back. Now, I do work from home, but believe me, I can put miles on my car...about as much as she does! I'm not a slow driver either...I typically do about 10 mph over the speed limit (it it allows). But she will ask me where I'm going when we drive somewhere together, or to park in that spot, or do this, or do that. It might that I like to take a different way, that's all. I have my way, you have yours. She's lived here her whole life, I'm a transplant. I don't know every single "back way", and I tend to go the same routes I'm used to. Nothing wrong with that. Woops, here I go complaining again. It's very easy to read something and think that it's a complaint, when in reality, it's expressing yourself and your position in a matter. I mean, how can you tell anyone anything without stating it? Enter my anonymous comments now: As for mr. web browser extraordinaire is concerned, I think he doesn't really wear any pants at all. Sure honey, I'll do as you please, each and every time you ask it of me. I don't have thoughts and opinions of my own, just yours baby cakes. And no, I'm not being chauvinistic here, I'm not an ******* guy, unless I get pushed there. And, as a few have latched on to, I don't ignore my wife's requests. There are some that are just over the top crazy. And guess what, I have a brain that I actually know how to use, and I have an opinion to boot! So what many of you are saying is, ahh, just do what she asks of you every time without question and we will live happily ever after. Hmm, that sounds very one-sided to me. I'll just assume that you always do as your told, like a good little girl or boy, or you're single for a variety of reasons which are of none of my concern.


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## browser (Oct 26, 2016)

nikonova said:


> I'll just assume that you always do as your told, like a good little girl or boy, or you're single for a variety of reasons which are of none of my concern.


You can do all that assuming with the extra time you have while you're drying yourself off in the tub.


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## Satya (Jun 22, 2012)

I think what some posters are trying to point out is that the bath mat incident, the driving, the pot incident, the things that EITHER you or your wife does that annoys the other, are symptoms of a much larger issue, which is the lack of respect and willingness for one to compromise and then the other to reciprocate. 

No one is asking you to lie down and take it, but by your initial post, it sounded like she opened her home to you and your son, and her rules were disrespected. That could have set things off. That was the start.

Doing things like setting actual consequences, not just yelling at or "having a go" at your son would have demonstrated you respected her house rules and would punish accordingly when they were broken. It would have shown your son that she has some authority in the relationship and he should respect it, too. You chose not to do this because rather than respect her rules, you applied your own version and called it acceptable. 

None of us are perfect, but respect is the foundation of any type of close relationship, IME. When you encourage cracks in that respect, even secondarily through your children, it's hard to fix. It's much easier to just carry on being annoyed by the little things than step back and focus on the big ones.


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## nikonova (Mar 13, 2017)

Blondilocks said:


> The bath mat example (they're supposed to get wet!) and son smoking pot in the house (pot never killed anyone) are both examples of disrespect. The responses divert attention away from the real issue which is showing respect.
> 
> When your son has his own home, then he can smoke whatever he wants, whenever he wants and for how long he wants. But, until then, he needs to show respect to others.
> 
> You can laugh about the silly bath mat 'til the cows come home but it won't stop her feeling disrespected. So, get your ass down to Bed Bath & Beyond and buy another damn bath mat and let her see that you do consider her wishes. And, if you're too proud to bend in this area then get out.


Hey, the pot smoking thing...yea, when he has his own place, he can do what he wants. I've told him that (in addition to telling him I don't like him doing it in the first place). Some have suggested that I just toss him to his mom lol. Yea, that's really nice. The kid would feel great that his dad doesn't want him around. Easy peasy. If that's what you'd do, then by all means, do it. Not my thing. And I would just like to add something about my son. He may be a bit hard to handle at times at home, but when he is outside of the house, he is highly liked and respected by others, and I hear about it. Even a local police officer who knows him thinks he is a great kid, and that says a lot, especially with the teens you have these days. So, am I ok with a little back-and-forth with him at home? Yup. Do I get mad at him and ask him to do things, yup. Does he get mad at me, yup. Sounds pretty normal to me. In fact, I know lots of families that go bat **** crazy at each other, police coming to the house all the time, things being thrown, fights getting physical, etc. And here I am, having discussions with my son, in an intelligent and caring way, listening to his story, and adding my two cents on the matter -so that he sees that I respect him and his opinions and issues at hand and not just treating him like a toddler. IMHO, this will teach him to be that way to others, and maybe even a future wife and children. Believe me, I could just put my fist up and tell him that if he does X he will get Y. Nah, I'm all good with that.

No, I will actually go and buy a bath mat. I actually am interested in what kind of drama THAT will bring! Ugh, now she has to wash TWO bathmats...(she doesn't let me do our laundry for some damn reason) why do we need TWO bath mats!? It's a vicious cycle of do good, not good enough, whelp so much for that. If someone feels that they are being "disrespected" because the bath mat gets wet, then their priorities are all messed up. Anyways, since I've had this conversation about the mat, I've heard some of you say I just need to be respectful and buy another one for everyone else's use -that's what I'm going to do. I guarantee, if I do this without her knowledge, and carefully place the mat over the edge of the tub in a nice and neat manner, I'll be asked why I purchased another bath mat. That will itself become disrespectful...her: "was there something wrong with the one we had?" me: "nope, just trying to keep yours from getting wet". her: "well that's just stupid." ahh, I can see the convo now.


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## browser (Oct 26, 2016)

nikonova said:


> IMHO, this will teach him to be that way to others, and maybe even a future wife and children.


We can only hope your son does NOT follow your lead when it comes to how to treat his future wife.


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## nikonova (Mar 13, 2017)

browser said:


> We can only hope your son does NOT follow your lead when it comes to how to treat his future wife.


Interesting comment. My eldest son, who lived with us as well, graduated and is now in the military in Afghanistan. He's also just married to a great girl. Guess what? I raised him, along with his mother, and for a time with his step-mother and he's turned into quite the man and gentleman. He's hard-headed, like myself and has his own opinions. I couldn't be more proud of him and I am quite sure that I will be as proud of my younger son when he decides what he's going to do with his life. I had the same experiences with my older son as I am having with my younger son now...so there you have it. See, the thing with treating someone with respect, is that it has to go both ways. Apparently, I'm not able to highlight the disrespect to me in this conversation. Respect, in my book, is also earned, not demanded. I have no respect for someone who demands it. Sure, I give anyone a certain level of respect right off the bat, but to give more than that, it requires that person earning it. You got any kids?


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## jb02157 (Apr 16, 2014)

browser said:


> We can only hope your son does NOT follow your lead when it comes to how to treat his future wife.


That's for sure. He got smoking pot from you and probably a good deal else. He's certainly off to a good start.


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## browser (Oct 26, 2016)

nikonova said:


> See, the thing with treating someone with respect, is that it has to go both ways.


No, respect does not have to go both ways. Respect is earned, it's not an entitlement or given right. You don't "get it" simply because you "give it".

Try respecting your wife's wishes, without expecting her to respect you for it. Whether it's a dry bath mat, or turning lights off when you leave a room, or completely stopping the illegal drug use in her home. See how that works for you. 



nikonova said:


> You got any kids?


I have 2 daughters. They both smoke a lot of pot, but not in my house.


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## nikonova (Mar 13, 2017)

jb02157 said:


> That's for sure. He got smoking pot from you and probably a good deal else. He's certainly off to a good start.


Ahh, 1929 posts and counting. Have you attained your degree in psychology yet? I sure hope so, man. I sure hope so.:x


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## nikonova (Mar 13, 2017)

browser said:


> No, respect does not have to go both ways. Respect is earned, it's not an entitlement or given right. You don't "get it" simply because you "give it".
> 
> Try respecting your wife's wishes, without expecting her to respect you for it. Whether it's a dry bath mat, or turning lights off when you leave a room, or completely stopping the illegal drug use in her home. See how that works for you.
> 
> ...


Yes, it IS earned. However, I can give anyone a minimal amount of respect for free....If I don't know you, then I will give you that. But, if you then decide not to treat me the same way, with a minimal level of respect, then you don't get it -it's not being earned. I actually don't require respect -what I require is to be treated in the same manner (yea, you'll probably pick up on that and tell me I don't respect her, so why should I expect it back). Maybe we're confusing respect with, ahem, common decency. 

Hmm, both smoke "a lot of pot". Was this prescribed by a doctor? Do you live in a "recreational use" state? If so, then that makes it completely and justifiably ok (because it's not in your house). Oh, the contradiction is borderline hilarious.:grin2:


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## WorkingWife (May 15, 2015)

Sigh...

Some people have been uncharacteristically hard on you in here. But your defensiveness makes it look like maybe they had good reason.

All your posts are filled with disrespectful judgments about your wife. OK, maybe she IS an irredeemably mad cow in which case all you can do is leave. But what if she is actually a normal human being who feels hurt and resentful because of your, and your son(s) continual dismissive and disrespectful attitudes?

It's actually VERY common to be disrespectful of your spouse when you are frustrated (as you are). But when people point out specific examples of your disrespect and try to explain to you how those things might be perceived by someone else, instead of asking more questions about what you might do, or saying "I read that, it gave me some ideas" you seem to just get defensive and double down on what a reasonable person you are and what an irrational psycho she is.

Look, if things used to be wonderful, and now they're not, there is a reason. Assuming she's not mentally ill, a happy spouse does not "magically" become bitter, critical, and resentful and start berating their beloved for no reason. We are trying to help you discover what the reason might be so you can do something about it. 

Taking your spouse into consideration given the fact that all your actions and inaction affect them is called being a mature adult, not "not wearing any pants." There are ways to handle situations where you are NOT caving into unreasonable demands but you are also NOT exacerbating the situation with your own disrespect, judgments, etc.

PS. *Telling *someone what to do is rude and annoying. If she is barking orders and criticisms at you while you're driving, I recommend calmly informing her that you don't like her telling you what to do in the middle of driving and asking her if she has any special requests about what route you will be taking before you embark on the drive. Then if she barks orders at you regardless, say "Please don't talk to me that way" and just keep driving your way. 





nikonova said:


> Ha, well this is a bit of a segue from the main topic, but my wife is a VERY aggressive driver. I usually like to drive when we're together. She's had several accidents in the past (and again, we each have our own insurance plans, because I have a perfect driving record and low insurance and want to keep it that way!). She says most of the accidents weren't her fault, and at least 2-3 times a month she tells me how she almost got hit driving to work or back. Now, I do work from home, but believe me, I can put miles on my car...about as much as she does! I'm not a slow driver either...I typically do about 10 mph over the speed limit (it it allows). But she will ask me where I'm going when we drive somewhere together, or to park in that spot, or do this, or do that. It might that I like to take a different way, that's all. I have my way, you have yours. She's lived here her whole life, I'm a transplant. I don't know every single "back way", and I tend to go the same routes I'm used to. Nothing wrong with that. Woops, here I go complaining again. It's very easy to read something and think that it's a complaint, when in reality, it's expressing yourself and your position in a matter. I mean, how can you tell anyone anything without stating it? Enter my anonymous comments now: As for mr. web browser extraordinaire is concerned, I think he doesn't really wear any pants at all. Sure honey, I'll do as you please, each and every time you ask it of me. I don't have thoughts and opinions of my own, just yours baby cakes. And no, I'm not being chauvinistic here, I'm not an ******* guy, unless I get pushed there. And, as a few have latched on to, I don't ignore my wife's requests. There are some that are just over the top crazy. And guess what, I have a brain that I actually know how to use, and I have an opinion to boot! So what many of you are saying is, ahh, just do what she asks of you every time without question and we will live happily ever after. Hmm, that sounds very one-sided to me. I'll just assume that you always do as your told, like a good little girl or boy, or you're single for a variety of reasons which are of none of my concern.


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## browser (Oct 26, 2016)

nikonova said:


> Hmm, both smoke "a lot of pot". Was this prescribed by a doctor? Do you live in a "recreational use" state? If so, then that makes it completely and justifiably ok (because it's not in your house). Oh, the contradiction is borderline hilarious.:grin2:


 @nikonova

The pot my daughters smoke is not prescribed by a doctor, they do not live in a recreational use state and as far as I am concerned, it's not ok. They are not minors and they don't live with me.

What's the contradiction?


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## Uptown (Mar 27, 2010)

WorkingWife said:


> Uptown... Do you have an opinion on whether or not a woman whose symptoms are less than full on BPD can/will get better with treatment more readily than one with full on BPD?


WW, yes, IMO the lower a person is on the BPD spectrum the greater the chance he/she will benefit from treatment. The stronger the BPD traits are, the greater the likelihood that the person lacks the self awareness and ego strength needed to do well in therapy. 

Please keep in mind, however, that full-blown BPDers can be either high- or low-functioning. That is, a person can satisfy 100% of the diagnostic criteria and still be high functioning -- or low functioning. In that regard, I suspect that the LF BPDers likely benefit more from therapy than the HF BPDers. Because the LF BPDers are suffering from far greater emotional pain, they have a much stronger incentive to become self aware and to work hard in therapy.



> Or if someone's spouse is 70 - 80% is it pretty unlikely they'll ever be a good partner?


Yes, that is my view. The current diagnostic methodology for BPD makes no sense because it is a binary (yes or no) approach in which people meeting 100% of the diagnostic criteria "have BPD" and people meeting 95% "don't have BPD." The American Psychiatric Assoc. is now in the process of replacing this binary approach with a graduated methodology (e.g., low, normal, moderate, strong, and severe).


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## Uptown (Mar 27, 2010)

lifeistooshort said:


> On a side note it never ceases to amaze me how many psychiatrists we have here on TAM that are capable of diagnosing mental disorders based on one side of the story (and the diagnosed person isn't even present).


LITS, I haven't seen any respondent on this thread attempt to diagnose any mental disorder -- much less claim to do so without meeting the person being diagnosed. If I am mistaken and have overlooked such a claim, please quote the statement so we can see what you're talking about.


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## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

browser said:


> nikonova said:
> 
> 
> > I'll just assume that you always do as your told, like a good little girl or boy, or you're single for a variety of reasons which are of none of my concern.
> ...


This!


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## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

Upon reflection, I think the main purpose of a bath mat is so you have somewhere warm and fluffy to step out of the shower onto, rather than cold floor! It's not meant to get soaking wet.


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## WorkingWife (May 15, 2015)

Brilliant. This is exactly what I was trying to say.



Satya said:


> I think what some posters are trying to point out is that the bath mat incident, the driving, the pot incident, the things that EITHER you or your wife does that annoys the other, are symptoms of a much larger issue, which is the lack of respect and willingness for one to compromise and then the other to reciprocate.
> 
> No one is asking you to lie down and take it, but by your initial post, it sounded like she opened her home to you and your son, and her rules were disrespected. That could have set things off. That was the start.
> 
> ...


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## browser (Oct 26, 2016)

I've got the sneaking suspicion that the Op, after hearing tons of great advice he is not willing to accept or follow, has permanently left the building and is sitting somewhere and laughing about how clueless everyone else is, including his "toxic" wife (while his second marriage continues to rapidly deteriorate). I don't know anything about his first wife but I'm thinking she wasn't all that bad.


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## nikonova (Mar 13, 2017)

Haven't left, thanks for your concern. My priorities are family, work and this snow storm right now. I don't live in this forum.


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## browser (Oct 26, 2016)

nikonova said:


> Haven't left, thanks for your concern. My priorities are family, work and this snow storm right now. I don't live in this forum.


Great. Welcome back. I just finished shoveling the driveway and none of my staff wants to chance the roads even though the storm wasn't nearly as bad as forecast so I've got the day off even though I'd rather be making money. My kids are grown and happily getting stoned in their homes somewhere, so here I am. 

So what's the hilarious contradiction?


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## jb02157 (Apr 16, 2014)

nikonova said:


> Ahh, 1929 posts and counting. Have you attained your degree in psychology yet? I sure hope so, man. I sure hope so.:x


TAM is a forum, a place to go for peoples opinions. I offer opinions and suggestions, not necessarily valid as far as the science of psychology goes.


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## She'sStillGotIt (Jul 30, 2016)

nikonova said:


> Hey, the pot smoking thing...yea, when he has his own place, he can do what he wants. I've told him that (in addition to telling him I don't like him doing it in the first place). Some have suggested that I just toss him to his mom lol. Yea, that's really nice. The kid would feel great that his dad doesn't want him around. Easy peasy. If that's what you'd do, then by all means, do it. Not my thing. And I would just like to add something about my son. He may be a bit hard to handle at times at home, but when he is outside of the house, he is highly liked and respected by others, and I hear about it. Even a local police officer who knows him thinks he is a great kid, and that says a lot, especially with the teens you have these days. So, am I ok with a little back-and-forth with him at home? Yup.


Are you being DELIBERATELY obtuse??????

It's like trying to talk to the learning challenged.

How many posters have told you it's a *RESPECT* thing about your kid smoking pot in your girlfriend's house????? 

How many people have told you that it's *DISRESPECTFUL* for your son to smoke pot in your girlfriend's house against her wishes and CONTINUE doing it even after your oh-so-awesome top notch parenting of 'going off on him' how many times - which he *still *ignored? Yeah, that's some 'great' kid. LOL.

Instead, you just make _*excuse after excuse after excuse*_ for his arrogant and disrespectful behavior because the truth is, you're a completely INEFFECTUAL parent and allow him to control YOU. Way to parent.

Make all the excuses you want. The situation is pretty transparent. You and your obnoxious kid disrespected her RIGHT from the get go with the pot thing and instead of booting your asses out her house which she SHOULD have done, she stupidly stayed with you and now everything is an issue for her. Every small thing is now an issue. It ain't rocket science.

As far as that ridiculous concept that she has BPD. As another poster said, how wonderful that complete strangers can 'diagnose' someone over the internet with a mental or personality disorder - based SOLELY on never meeting them but believing some guy's story that he wrote in a thread. Good Christ. :lol:


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## browser (Oct 26, 2016)

She'sStillGotIt said:


> Are you being DELIBERATELY obtuse??????
> 
> It's like trying to talk to the learning challenged.:lol:


I don't think it's intentional. Some people are just ignorant, and they pay the price for it. 

It brings to mind one of my favorite expression that goes something like, "If it seems to be everyone ELSE, then maybe it just isn't everyone else".


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## Middle of Everything (Feb 19, 2012)

This thread sums up why TAM is dying a slow death. People being *******s to each other. Neither side listening. People acting like children.

I commend WorkingWife, Satya and a few others for being adults and trying to help. But the OP and others could use a vacation in my opinion.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Middle of Everything said:


> This thread sums up why TAM is dying a slow death. People being *******s to each other. Neither side listening. People acting like children.


Actually the reason that the user count on TAM is way down is a technical issue. The admins are well aware of it and working on it. 



Middle of Everything said:


> I commend WorkingWife, Satya and a few others for being adults and trying to help. But the OP and others could use a vacation in my opinion.


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## browser (Oct 26, 2016)

Middle of Everything said:


> This thread sums up why TAM is dying a slow death. People being *******s to each other. Neither side listening. People acting like children.
> 
> I commend WorkingWife, Satya and a few others for being adults and trying to help. But the OP and others could use a vacation in my opinion.


 @Middle of Everything

If everyone you think should stop posting did so, there would probably be no one else around except you and a couple of other "special" people. I bet it's the same way in your real world too isn't it? 

It's lonely at the top.


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## Betrayedone (Jan 1, 2014)

You need to stop marrying people......it's just not your skill set.


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

EleGirl said:


> Actually the reason that the user count on TAM is way down is a technical issue. The admins are well aware of it and working on it.




New owners, new mods, new rules/policies, new tone.


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## browser (Oct 26, 2016)

WorkingOnMe said:


> New owners, new mods, new rules/policies, new tone.


I didn't get that particular memo.


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