# Should a guy just “go after” what he wants?



## Married4life123 (Apr 14, 2019)

I realize this probably will vary from woman to woman but I thought I would try and get a general consensus from here anyway.. 

Married for 20 years and sex happens occasionally, usually when she wants it. 

As a woman, would you want your man to try and take what he wants when he wants it? (And just shoot him down when you dont). Or.. Should he look for subtle cues and/or wait to see if you initiate it?

Example: Today, wife came home from work and took a shower. Came out in just a towel... Kids were not home (doesnt seem to happen much lately).

I was going crazy just seeing her in a towel but she seemed to want to just get dressed. Should I have asserted my manliness and went for it? 

What would you ladies want in general? Try and fail or not try at all


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

I'm not a woman, but ask yourself this:

Do you see it is relevant that you even need to ask this question?

I'm not being snarky by asking this, but I am very curious as to your take on it. 

Furthermore, from the outside looking in, how would you see it if somebody felt like they needed to ask permission to go for something they wanted in or from life?

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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

She probably wouldn't have made it to the shower unmolested and definitely not after coming out.

I have my hands on my wife several times a day, every day so she is pretty use to it and her motor is usually primed.

I have found being straight forward with who I am and my desires serves us best.

I'm also not easily offended by just about any mood she has or action she takes.

I also exert my will on her bodily by tickling, teasing and turning her on even when she is grumpy but that is our dynamic.

You don't sound all that confident or decisive?


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## Married4life123 (Apr 14, 2019)

ConanHub said:


> She probably wouldn't have made it to the shower unmolested and definitely not after coming out.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




No, I really am not as confident or decisive as I would like to be.. 

But.. I really wanted a womans perspective on the subject. I expected what many confident, assertive men would do but thats really not me. 

I just wanted to know what (in general) women would prefer.




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## notmyjamie (Feb 5, 2019)

I think you'll get different answers from different women. Me, personally, I'd prefer it if a man just went after what he wants. That's hot. Don't ask me if you can have sex with me. Ugh. Show me you want me. Big difference.

But it's not really important what I'd want. It's important what your wife wants. How is your sex life? Is she receptive when you initiate? Start noticing her response to the different ways you try to initiate. I bet some work better than others. Or, be brave and just ask her if she'd have liked it if you jumped her bones when she was standing there in that towel. That's the best way to find out.


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## AandM (Jan 30, 2019)

notmyjamie said:


> I think you'll get different answers from different women. Me, personally, I'd prefer it if a man just went after what he wants. That's hot. Don't ask me if you can have sex with me. Ugh. Show me you want me. Big difference.
> 
> But it's not really important what I'd want. It's important what your wife wants. How is your sex life? Is she receptive when you initiate? Start noticing her response to the different ways you try to initiate. I bet some work better than others. Or, be brave and just ask her if she'd have liked it if you jumped her bones when she was standing there in that towel. That's the best way to find out.


And Bingo was his Namo.

Seriously, like Yoda says, "Do,or do not. There is no try." Ok, so seriously, I'm a ****ing dorkling (I saw the OG movies in the theater), but *unfortunately**, it is what comes to mind

Rule 1: Women want to be wanted.
Sub Rule 1: Unless they they are not in the mood.

Rule 2: Approach them in lustful, sexfull ways. Especially in the early-to-late AM Before waking. Light touches all over, combined with your best, most skillful kissing. Light, then escalating to her level of reciprocated enjoyment( if you don't have this skill, work on it mightily; its far more important than penis size/alignment). Light scrapes from the back of the fingers all over the skin.

Rule 3: You should now lightly go for her vagin...

You know what? Just pay attention to Rule and sub-Rule 1.

**Not the word I wanted to use. Really.*


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## GettingIt_2 (Apr 12, 2013)

Married4life123 said:


> Married for 20 years and sex happens occasionally, usually when she wants it.
> 
> As a woman, would you want your man to try and take what he wants when he wants it? (And just shoot him down when you dont). Or.. Should he look for subtle cues and/or wait to see if you initiate it?
> 
> ...


Speaking for myself, I want my husband to take what he wants, when he wants it, and not take no for an answer. For me, there is no bigger turn off than being "assessed" for likelihood of success. Either do it or don't, but if you don't do it, don't blame it on me.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

Has the sex only happened for the entire 20 years when she wanted it?

Have you never just gone for it without her cue first?

If you ever did just go for it, how did it go?

Have you ever actually just talked to her about sex, your sex life together, your solo sex life habits, your inhibitions or desires to get rid of them, curiosity about kinks? Anything?


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## badsanta (Oct 13, 2014)

Married4life123 said:


> What would you ladies want in general? Try and fail or not try at all


In my opinion (which fits into a scenario in which the husband has more desire than the wife) is that your wife will respond well to you being very confident about what you want while at the same time being patient enough to listen to her when the urge to argue or becoming resentful arises. 

In my opinion a women will shít test you ever which way possible to see how you will respond as if to bring on her self fulfilling prophecy that your love for her is somehow flawed. Some men have zero tolerance for having to "jump through hoops" with these respective mind games, but in reality it requires zero effort if you can just be confident enough in yourself to let her know that undoubtedly you want to be with her. 

Regards, 
Badsanta


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## NobodySpecial (Nov 22, 2013)

ConanHub said:


> She probably wouldn't have made it to the shower unmolested and definitely not after coming out.
> 
> I have my hands on my wife several times a day, every day so she is pretty use to it and her motor is usually primed.
> 
> ...


Caution - not everyone likes tickling. Triggers my fight or flight. And I fight. with teeth.


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## NobodySpecial (Nov 22, 2013)

Faithful Wife said:


> Has the sex only happened for the entire 20 years when she wanted it?
> 
> Have you never just gone for it without her cue first?
> 
> ...


FW hits a point here. Whatever other women reply to the specific question asked -- OP you have a history/set of base expectations. YMMV


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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

Married4life123 said:


> No, I really am not as confident or decisive as I would like to be..
> 
> But.. I really wanted a womans perspective on the subject. I expected what many confident, assertive men would do but thats really not me.
> 
> ...




Well you (probably) are not going to be having sex with the women here after they come out of the shower so I’m not sure how their response will help you...
I think it will boil down to whether she wants you to **** her more often than not.
Generally, assertiveness and confidence is good. She needs to sense you want her.

But if she is never turned on by you or shoots you down more often than not, then probably not...But then you probably have bigger worries/problems than that in your marriage. I’m speculating here but since you are asking an (obvious) question, I thought I’d check on that first.

I prefer for the ‘assault’ to take place before shower though...Don’t like smell of soap and she smells much better ‘natural’. Plus it’s inconsiderate (stuff will get messy again and she’ll have to take another shower..).


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

NobodySpecial said:


> Caution - not everyone likes tickling. Triggers my fight or flight. And I fight. with teeth.


I usually have a disclaimer about it being our dynamic.


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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

badsanta said:


> In my opinion a women will shít test you ever which way possible to see how you will respond as if to bring on her self fulfilling prophecy that your love for her is somehow flawed. Some men have zero tolerance for having to "jump through hoops" with these respective mind games, but in reality it requires zero effort if you can just be confident enough in yourself to let her know that undoubtedly you want to be with her.



Yes so apparently her resisting was always 95% of the time part of it...Who would have thunk it 
I wish somebody told me this about wimminz....
Just not sure I feel easy about the 5% and whether calling the cops and explaining yourself to the judge is also supposed to be part of the game or not....



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## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

My W tells me that sometimes I just need to go for it. Shower, towel, no kids at home...going for it.


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## lifeistooshort (Mar 17, 2013)

I like it when my guy is direct about wanting me.....knowing your partner wants you is the ultimate aphrodisiac.

Of course if I say no, which I seldom do, that needs to be respected. And if we have a good relationship I will very likely respond. 

And no tickling.....can't guarantee you won't get something bruised or broken if you start with that :rofl:


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## Steve2.0 (Dec 11, 2017)

Married4life123 said:


> Example: Today, wife came home from work and took a shower. Came out in just a towel... Kids were not home (doesnt seem to happen much latelyk


Tell me more; What did you do?
Did you verbalize to your wife that she looks so hot and tempting (while walking towards her for some physical touch)

*Or *did you send telepathic thoughts to her that you were turned on while continuing to lay on the bed hoping she was scanning the right channels and picked up your non-verbal and non-physical queues?


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## Steve2.0 (Dec 11, 2017)

Married4life123 said:


> No, I really am not as confident or decisive as I would like to be..
> 
> But.. I really wanted a womans perspective on the subject. I expected what many confident, assertive men would do but thats really not me.
> 
> I just wanted to know what (in general) women would prefer.


I think this post is your problem. Confidence and decisiveness are male traits that are attractive. Stop suppressing them or thinking you dont have them. You do have them, you just pushed them so far away. You need to rediscover it... its there

If you want a womens opinion, go look at the literature they read (novel covers) or 50 shades of grey that almost every women loved.... Do you see a man that isnt confident or decisive?


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

Steve2.0 said:


> I think this post is your problem. Confidence and decisiveness are male traits that are attractive. Stop suppressing them or thinking you dont have them. You do have them, you just pushed them so far away. You need to rediscover it... its there
> 
> If you want a womens opinion, go look at the literature they read (novel covers) or 50 shades of grey that almost every women loved.... Do you see a man that isnt confident or decisive?


I agree in the general, but not on the specific.

His wife may just be asexual or so LD that nothing is going to make a difference. If she doesn’t read 50 shades, is never going to, and is offended by it (which everyone should be, but only because it’s such a bad book and horrible intro to BDSM), then knowing what other women read will only make the OP frustrated.

I am totally behind manning up, getting confiden, going for it, etc. But not all women are and we don’t know anything about her so far.

We have a lovely contributor here @uhtred whose wife is never going to respond to any of the man up advice because she is essentially asexual. 

On the other hand the OP’s wife may be silently waiting for him to show some mojo and just take her.

Until we have an idea of what she has commmunitcated so far, I don’t think there’s anything we can tell the OP yet. 

Not that you shouldn’t respond.... just mean that your response only works in some cases. Not sure about the OP.


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## Steve2.0 (Dec 11, 2017)

Faithful Wife said:


> Not that you shouldn’t respond.... just mean that your response only works in some cases. Not sure about the OP.


I gotta respond with what would work 95+% of the time.
If we had to take every kink, disorder, disease, ailment or neurological problem into account when responding then every response would have 40 different sub-answers and who the hell has time for that.

The standard, healthy, female wants a confident and decisive man (among other things for sure) and not another child spilling milk


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## StillSearching (Feb 8, 2013)

Never ask or beg for sex.
Go after it respectfully and confidently.


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## NobodySpecial (Nov 22, 2013)

Steve2.0 said:


> I gotta respond with what would work 95+% of the time.
> If we had to take every kink, disorder, disease, ailment or neurological problem into account when responding then every response would have 40 different sub-answers and who the hell has time for that.
> 
> The standard, healthy, female wants a confident and decisive man (among other things for sure) and not another child spilling milk


We are saying here than having a different - lower - drive is a neurological problem, ailment or disease?


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

Steve2.0 said:


> I gotta respond with what would work 95+% of the time.
> If we had to take every kink, disorder, disease, ailment or neurological problem into account when responding then every response would have 40 different sub-answers and who the hell has time for that.
> 
> The standard, healthy, female wants a confident and decisive man (among other things for sure) and not another child spilling milk


 But what we know so far is only that for 20 Years he apparently has always only had sex when his wife gives him a cue. That’s not really very normal or healthy, so I’m going to assume one or both of them have issues beyond just him needing to man up.

Also...we were discussing in another thread how there is a difference between a guy who just wishes he could have a bit more sex, and a guy who is highly sexual. I’m guessing you are the latter and the OP is the former. 

A guy who isn’t highly sexual can’t actually pull that off, and it’s not pretty when he tries (ie: Wife isn’t going to be turned on by it at all).

Still you are possibly right and therefore if you are, I do hope it’s that easy for the OP.


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## uhtred (Jun 22, 2016)

Couples comprising normal health sexual men and women are not going to be posting here about problems with their sex life. We are down selecting to couples where there is a problem. 

From this and other boards, its clear that lack of desire or asexuality are pretty common. It seems strange to sexual people, but there are a substantial number of people who just don't want sex, with anyone. There are lots more for whom occasional limited sex is OK, but where they could happily do without. 


Its easy to imagine that there is something "wrong" with a man if he wife doesn't desire him. Something that needs to be fixed. Often though these men are attractive to other women. 




Steve2.0 said:


> I gotta respond with what would work 95+% of the time.
> If we had to take every kink, disorder, disease, ailment or neurological problem into account when responding then every response would have 40 different sub-answers and who the hell has time for that.
> 
> The standard, healthy, female wants a confident and decisive man (among other things for sure) and not another child spilling milk


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## uhtred (Jun 22, 2016)

It varies. Some women want to be taken. Some will give clear hints when they do or do not want that. Others (like my wife) NEVER want spontaneous sex, never. She may be walking around in a towel, or nothing or a slip - but it never means that she just wants me to initiate sex. It is only when she initiates. (and I counting a wide range of ways I've tried initiating). 

I'm sure there are women who would love being grabbed for sex most of the time. 




Married4life123 said:


> I realize this probably will vary from woman to woman but I thought I would try and get a general consensus from here anyway..
> 
> Married for 20 years and sex happens occasionally, usually when she wants it.
> 
> ...


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

uhtred said:


> Couples comprising normal health sexual men and women are not going to be posting here about problems with their sex life. We are down selecting to couples where there is a problem.
> 
> From this and other boards, its clear that lack of desire or asexuality are pretty common. It seems strange to sexual people, but there are a substantial number of people who just don't want sex, with anyone. There are lots more for whom occasional limited sex is OK, but where they could happily do without.
> 
> ...


As it relates to the OP, I believe @Steve2.0 has a fairly accurate take on this.


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## Mr. Nail (Apr 26, 2011)

Should a guy just go after what he wants.
I'm tossed up between two replies to this question.

Many women say that men should learn to *accept* rejection. They have made a spelling error, the word is spelled e-x-p-e-c-t.

or

Four guys spend weeks planning the perfect backwoods camping and fishing trip. Two days before the group is to leave Frank's wife puts her foot down and tells him he isn't going. Frank's friends are very upset that he can't go, but what can they do.Two days later the three get to the camping site only to find Frank sitting there with a tent set up, firewood gathered, and fish cooking on the fire. "Damn man, how long you been here and how did you talk your wife into letting you go?"Well, I've been here since yesterday. Yesterday evening I was sitting in my chair and my wife came up behind me and put her hands over my eyes and said 'guess who'?" I pulled her hands off and she was wearing a brand new see through nightie. She took my hand and took me to our bedroom. The room had two dozen candles and rose pedals all over. On the bed she had handcuffs and ropes! She told me to tie and cuff her to the bed and I did. And then she said "Do what ever you want." So here I am.


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## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

Guy here.

I think you need to understand what looks like a softball question, really isn't.

As already pointed out, you have a self-selected audience.

Yes. A guy should 'go after' what he wants.

But. Start with going after what you want outside of the bedroom first.

And decide ... is the basis for your question about making a change to yourself, or just getting your wife to have sex with you more?

Don't get me wrong, you can certainly try and solicit your wife, based on what you think she wants which may come across as inauthentic for you ... or you can find a way to recognize, acknowledge, pursue and act upon your own needs which means you are being you, and your wife will dig and respect that ... or she won't. 

You win either way.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

ConanHub said:


> As it relates to the OP, I believe @Steve2.0 has a fairly accurate take on this.


Except we have no way of knowing what the OP's wife is like.

We do have an idea of what Steve's wife is like, based on his story.

I do think we should wait until we get more information from the OP about what has transpired so far. Has he ever even talked to his wife about sex?

If not, what kind of good will telling him to man up do? He more than likely does not have the temperament to be like Conan or Steve.

And we have no indication that his woman would like it at all if he did.....YET.

I did say earlier, that it is also possible she has been waiting for him to take her for years.

If that's the case, with more info from OP, this will come out.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Faithful Wife said:


> Except we have no way of knowing what the OP's wife is like.
> 
> We do have an idea of what Steve's wife is like, based on his story.
> 
> ...


Steve quoted OP about having confidence and being more decisive. I agree with that part and Deejo expounded on it.

OP needs to get more comfortable with his desires, needs to be open about them and that will at least give his wife something real to work with.

Wishy fishy won't swim upstream to mate.


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## badsanta (Oct 13, 2014)

Married4life123 said:


> Married for 20 years and sex happens occasionally, usually when she wants it.
> 
> As a woman, would you want your man to try and take what he wants when he wants it? (And just shoot him down when you dont). Or.. Should he look for subtle cues and/or wait to see if you initiate it?


 @Married4life123 I would also advocate that you talk to your wife about this, OUTSIDE of the context of you actively trying to put the moves on her. Generally speaking many lower desire spouses can get confrontational if you ask them how to improve sexual communication and opportunities for more physical intimacy when she is aware you are in the mood but she is not. Perhaps the BEST time to talk about these things would be right after having great sex within the context of you both being fully satisfied. 

My wife and I often have many meaningful conversations just after great intimacy where she is open and willing to tell me things that she needs in order to be open and enjoy moments together. At that time, I can also share the things I need as well and we have an enjoyable conversation on the topic.

In contrast if I tried having this conversation when she knows I might be frustrated with her for our imbalanced drives, she has a natural tendency to be very defensive and shut down as if just bringing up the topic just ruined my chances. 

You might discover that your wife is very willing to be sexually intimate with you when she is not in the mood as long as you are OK with it being a one-sided experience. Then if she responds to that with her own arousal that is great, and if not make sure you don't get your feelings hurt but instead appreciate her efforts to please you. 

Long story short, talk to her about it! Just be careful about your timing to start the discussion so it can be enjoyable and meaningful. 

Regards, 
Badsanta


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

ConanHub said:


> Steve quoted OP about having confidence and being more decisive. I agree with that part and Deejo expounded on it.
> 
> OP needs to get more comfortable with his desires, needs to be open about them and that will at least give his wife something real to work with.
> 
> Wishy fishy won't swim upstream to mate.


And what if the OP has a temperament like the guy you are coaching you told us about recently? Where he wants a bit more sex, but he really doesn’t have the energy to act like a Conan or a Steve.

It’s been my observation that when a guy is this passive to begin with, telling him to man up makes no difference, even if SHE wants him to. Because he can’t. Even if he can for a minute, he can’t keep it up, and if it’s going to require him manning up consistently for her to want him consistently, it’s not going to happen.

On the other hand OP may provide more info that makes what I’m saying irrelevant.

I’d take a bet that I am correct however. 

My sexdar tells me more than who is highly sexual, it also notices the patterns of behavior of less sexual persons. OP pings me as LD.


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## NobodySpecial (Nov 22, 2013)

Faithful Wife said:


> And what if the OP has a temperament like the guy you are coaching you told us about recently? Where he wants a bit more sex, but he really doesn’t have the energy to act like a Conan or a Steve.
> 
> It’s been my observation that when a guy is this passive to begin with, telling him to man up makes no difference, even if SHE wants him to. Because he can’t. Even if he can for a minute, he can’t keep it up, and if it’s going to require him manning up consistently for her to want him consistently, it’s not going to happen.
> 
> ...


There is so much not in evidence here.

I don't believe for one red second that your sexdar as near magical as you claim. That you can get pinged by a few words on an internet board. You may be right. But ... I would not be one to take that to the bank.

The best thing you said on here, there is not enough info to go on.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

NobodySpecial said:


> There is so much not in evidence here.
> 
> I don't believe for one red second that your sexdar as near magical as you claim. That you can get pinged by a few words on an internet board. You may be right. But ... I would not be one to take that to the bank.
> 
> The best thing you said on here, there is not enough info to go on.


I’m still placing my bets. 

And it’s ok if no one believes me.

We may or may not get more info, and may or may not know.


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## NobodySpecial (Nov 22, 2013)

Faithful Wife said:


> I’m still placing my bets.
> 
> And it’s ok if no one believes me.
> 
> We may or may not get more info, and may or may not know.


The defense of your magical sexdar winds up being a distraction for the OP. He is not going tohave the first idea what you are even talking about.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

NobodySpecial said:


> The defense of your magical sexdar winds up being a distraction for the OP. He is not going tohave the first idea what you are even talking about.


He hasn’t been around lately so we have no choice other than to talk amongst ourselves and bicker about it :x


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## Andy1001 (Jun 29, 2016)

NobodySpecial said:


> The defense of your magical sexdar winds up being a distraction for the OP. He is not going tohave the first idea what you are even talking about.


I have a highly developed sexdar.
I always know when I want sex. 
Oh,that’s not what you meant?


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

Andy1001 said:


> I have a highly developed sexdar.
> I always know when I want sex.
> Oh,that’s not what you meant?


No, that’s called “sex? Da!”


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

I like FW's comment, to move "slo to ho" from a recent post. 

I chuckled at that and thought it was dead on for LD to HD movement 0 to 60mph overnight not being likely. I agreed, but don't remember which post.

😍😍


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## NobodySpecial (Nov 22, 2013)

Andy1001 said:


> I have a highly developed sexdar.
> I always know when I want sex.
> Oh,that’s not what you meant?


It's rare that I LOL. This did it.


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## CatholicDad (Oct 30, 2017)

Absolutely, yes. You should go in and watch her intently and seriously anytime she is undressing (rare when kids are around). If she notices and grins you proceed to verbal compliments on how unbelievable she looks (sincerity in my case) and move in for physical touching and a hug and kiss. You should never pass on an opportunity unless the vibe is extreme grumpiness, exhaustion or the like. There is absolutely nothing wrong with kindly expressing your extreme desire for your wife... And you should do this verbally and with actions every chance you get... Presuming you have extreme desire for her.

I discovered a few years ago that my wife really melts when I grab her around the rear and lift her up forcefully and squeeze and hug her when above and it always results in a sexy kiss from there and on the way as she slides down. Point is, all guys need to figure out the signature moves to take her out of the doldrums and remind her how beautiful she is and how interested you are. You'll never find your moves if you don't experiment, daily! Best of luck!


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## SecondWind (May 10, 2019)

Married4life123 said:


> Example: Today, wife came home from work and took a shower. Came out in just a towel... Kids were not home (doesnt seem to happen much lately).
> 
> I was going crazy just seeing her in a towel but she seemed to want to just get dressed. Should I have asserted my manliness and went for it?
> 
> What would you ladies want in general? Try and fail or not try at all


 i want my husband to make his thoughts and needs known. I can go along with his wishes or not, and he need not be afraid or offended. Timidity and passivness are unattractive in a male.


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## uhtred (Jun 22, 2016)

Agreed - but it takes both to make that work. If someone gets the "take your hands off me you perv" sort of reaction from their partner sometimes when they initiate, they will soon stop initiating. The rejections need to be a "no now", as oppose to "never do that again". The second will get what was asked for. 

No idea what the case was here. 






SecondWind said:


> i want my husband to make his thoughts and needs known. I can go along with his wishes or not, and he need not be afraid or offended. Timidity and passivness are unattractive in a male.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

uhtred said:


> Agreed - but it takes both to make that work. If someone gets the "take your hands off me you perv" sort of reaction from their partner sometimes when they initiate, they will soon stop initiating. The rejections need to be a "no now", as oppose to "never do that again". The second will get what was asked for.
> 
> No idea what the case was here.


And also...if a guys nature is passive and he’s just not the type to be more aggressive, then I don’t see what good it does to tell him to be less passive. 

People don’t change who they are. He could fake it for a bit. But he will not want to feel pressure to be someone he is not. He wants to be wanted as he is, not as someone else.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Faithful Wife said:


> And what if the OP has a temperament like the guy you are coaching you told us about recently? Where he wants a bit more sex, but he really doesn’t have the energy to act like a Conan or a Steve.
> 
> It’s been my observation that when a guy is this passive to begin with, telling him to man up makes no difference, even if SHE wants him to. Because he can’t. Even if he can for a minute, he can’t keep it up, and if it’s going to require him manning up consistently for her to want him consistently, it’s not going to happen.
> 
> ...


I am almost positive that he is very close in temperament to ITman. That is what I will call my buddy.

ITman will probably never be able to get as muscular as me, he needs to do the same exercises to develop what he can however. When I started coaching him, he was absolutely terrible at sex, had very small muscles, was very wishy washy and a momma's boy as well as not being able to fight his way out of a paper bag.

He now gives his wife orgasms, has some shoulder development and bigger biceps, he is far more confident and decisive and very much NOT a momma's boy and he also has a great jab and counterpunch.

He will never be Conan. Unfortunately, I didn't realize that, as stupid as it sounds, until dear @Lila pointed it out gently to me.

He did improve who he was and became a better as well as more attractive husband for his wife.

She definitely loved his improvements even though his basic nature will never be quite as barbaric as hers or mine.

She actually calls herself my sister because we are so much alike.

So I am learning to take who I am into account when giving advice.

I will still relate what I do, what I have experienced and what I've learned but I am learning to include caveats about Mrs. Conan and my dynamic as well as trying to figure out how to let folks know that, while generally my advice will work, it will get varying mileage depending on someone's nature.

I am almost certain that barring a life altering event, OP will never be that similar to me.

He can, and needs to, improve his comfort level with his desires, improve his confidence and decisiveness as well as being able to communicate about these things in a positive way with his wife.

I'm not expecting him to pick her up with one arm and play barbarian and the princess like I do.

He could stand a little more starch in his boxers though.:wink2:


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## uhtred (Jun 22, 2016)

I think it depends on the person. Some people are comfortable adjusting their behavior to be more compatible with the people that they are interacting with. Most people do this to some extent - behavior at work is often very different from behavior with friends for example.

Some parts of personality are pretty fixed, but I think which parts are fixed may vary from person to person. 






Faithful Wife said:


> And also...if a guys nature is passive and he’s just not the type to be more aggressive, then I don’t see what good it does to tell him to be less passive.
> 
> People don’t change who they are. He could fake it for a bit. But he will not want to feel pressure to be someone he is not. He wants to be wanted as he is, not as someone else.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

uhtred said:


> I think it depends on the person. Some people are comfortable adjusting their behavior to be more compatible with the people that they are interacting with. Most people do this to some extent - behavior at work is often very different from behavior with friends for example.
> 
> Some parts of personality are pretty fixed, but I think which parts are fixed may vary from person to person.


I can't think of any examples in the thousands I've read, here and elsewhere, of a person who made a substantial change to their core nature.

Even when guys man up, join gyms, change their diet, etc...these men had it in them to even get that far.

Some men do not want to jump through any hoops. They want to be themselves, passive and all.

And yes, some will step it up in order to get more of what they want and less of what they don't. However, these do not make a long lasting core change. 

They may "find" their mojo. But if they don't, it is usually that they are not that type of person.

My first husband was like this. He is a lovely person who wants to be loved and desired for who he is. That includes that his hobbies are reading and fishing, not chasing anyone for sex (ever). He wants a woman who wants to have sex with him - - as he is. And there are women who would, because she may be super attracted to him and they have great chemistry, and she's fairly passive too and has passive hobbies.

Back in our time, any suggestion that he manned up, he would laugh in my face. And for awhile I didn't get it. I thought he was telling me I was stupid for wanting what I want. But I was wrong. All he was telling me was "that's not who I am". He could once in awhile do the throw me over his shoulder bit, but that's as far as it went. And in retrospect, one of the manliest things he ever did was laugh in my face, because he stood up for himself and said "no, I'm not going to change just to have sex with you" by doing so.

This is not the only case I know of which played out essentially the same way with an LD guy.

LD people (and HD people) have things in common in the form of patterns of behavior.

One of those patterns is that LD's tend to not initiate, and when they are expected to, they don't really like being in that position without a clear sign. This pattern seems to be there for both LD men and women.


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## notmyjamie (Feb 5, 2019)

Faithful Wife said:


> If she doesn’t read 50 shades, is never going to, and is offended by it (which everyone should be, but only because it’s such a bad book and horrible intro to BDSM)


The site of my coworker sliding her hands up and down her body while telling me how hot and sexy the book makes her feel put me off it for a lifetime. Haven't read it, never will, never seen the movies, and never will. :laugh:


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## Cletus (Apr 27, 2012)

notmyjamie said:


> The site of my coworker sliding her hands up and down her body while telling me how hot and sexy the book makes her feel put me off it for a lifetime. Haven't read it, never will, never seen the movies, and never will. :laugh:


Sounds like you need to get some better looking co-workers.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

notmyjamie said:


> The site of my coworker sliding her hands up and down her body while telling me how hot and sexy the book makes her feel put me off it for a lifetime. Haven't read it, never will, never seen the movies, and never will. :laugh:


Hahaha! At least she didn't try sliding her hands up and down your body!:grin2:

I wasn't interested because I could tell it was all hype.

There has to be better stories about rich, good looking men who seduce and spank innocent little village girls.


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## uhtred (Jun 22, 2016)

Must be some variation. My wife is the LD and she absolutely must be the one to initiate or sex doesn't happen. 



Faithful Wife said:


> snip
> One of those patterns is that LD's tend to not initiate, and when they are expected to, they don't really like being in that position without a clear sign. This pattern seems to be there for both LD men and women.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

ConanHub said:


> There has to be better stories about rich, good looking men who seduce and spank innocent little village girls.


Yes, Beauty and the Beast was my fave.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

uhtred said:


> Must be some variation. My wife is the LD and she absolutely must be the one to initiate or sex doesn't happen.


That honestly just sounds controlling and selfish.


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## notmyjamie (Feb 5, 2019)

Cletus said:


> Sounds like you need to get some better looking co-workers.


Her looks really have nothing to do with why it grossed me out. It was almost like she was imagining having sex at the moment. She was feeling herself up, head back, moaning a bit...ugh. Just ugh. There are times and places for that. I can talk and joke about sex as much as the next person but I'm not going to simulate it at the nurses' station. That's just taking it too far. :nono:

Plus, I had heard about this damn book from SO many people and it just sounded awful to me. I hate bad writing. I equate it with the Twilight series. Dear God...so awful. And I had a bunch of coworkers telling me what a wonderful love story it was and I had to read it. When I said I hated it they accused me of being a man in a woman's body.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

uhtred said:


> Must be some variation. My wife is the LD and she absolutely must be the one to initiate or sex doesn't happen.


I would actually classify you as LD too, Uhtred. Higher D than your wife, but lower D than some men.

Part of why I say so is that you don't want to challenge her or rock the boat. You'd rather just go with her initiation. (I know you have rocked the boat in the past but...)

This is in no way an insult, just an observation. Also, I have never been one telling you to man up and suddenly your W would be a sexual person. In fact, I think I was the first person to say your wife sounds asexual to me. But also I never said "man up" because that's not you.

I have the idea from your posts, that you would love her to simply initiate more, or give you the green light to initiate more. This does fit the pattern of LD (for you), also.

Remember that LD and HD both have a huge range within them.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

notmyjamie said:


> Her looks really have nothing to do with why it grossed me out. It was almost like she was imagining having sex at the moment. She was feeling herself up, head back, moaning a bit...ugh. Just ugh. There are times and places for that. I can talk and joke about sex as much as the next person but I'm not going to simulate it at the nurses' station. That's just taking it too far. :nono:
> 
> Plus, I had heard about this damn book from SO many people and it just sounded awful to me. I hate bad writing. I equate it with the Twilight series. Dear God...so awful. And I had a bunch of coworkers telling me what a wonderful love story it was and I had to read it. When I said I hated it they accused me of being a man in a woman's body.


It actually started as fan fiction of the twilight series.


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## Andy1001 (Jun 29, 2016)

Faithful Wife said:


> Yes, Beauty and the Beast was my fave.


I would have thought that little red riding hood would have been more up your street. 
She really wanted to be eaten by that wolf.........


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## notmyjamie (Feb 5, 2019)

Faithful Wife said:


> It actually started as fan fiction of the twilight series.


:surprise::surprise::surprise::surprise::surprise::surprise:


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

Andy1001 said:


> I would have thought that little red riding hood would have been more up your street.
> She really wanted to be eaten by that wolf.........


Beast is taller.


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## Affaircare (Jan 11, 2010)

Married4life123 said:


> I realize this probably will vary from woman to woman but I thought I would try and get a general consensus from here anyway..
> 
> Married for 20 years and sex happens occasionally, usually when she wants it.
> 
> ...


Welp...you asked for ladies opinions. Here it comes!

I don't think of myself as HD or LD, but I am 57yo--so I'm not a youngster--and I think of myself more like "natural drive" or "go with the flow" drive. Sometimes it's every day and twice on Tuesdays--other times it's just Saturday morning cuz the rest of the week we're so busy! So it seems to me as if my desire is always about 50% but ebbs and flows...

This is a precursor because I think it's relevant that I'm not in my 30's and that I don't have sex-aversion. 

I like it when my guy "just goes for it" because I know he's in the mood and because I feel like he's after me a little bit. I like that feeling of being chased a little. I like when he makes it clear that he has a desire. So if I'm half in the mood and have not, and he gets a bit insistent (and persistent), I go into the headspace of "Alrighty then...you go right on ahead and put me in the mood buddy!" 

BUT...if I was rushing around getting ready for work, got out of the shower, and he decided he was in the mood right then, I might be feeling pressured that I was late, and not be in much of a mood. Now, my rule to my own self is to never say 'no' unless I'm willing to back it up and I mean it. So if he kept going after I said 'no' I'd feel disrespected, and that is not conducive to great sex. 
@Married4life123, I have no idea what YOUR wife is like. I have no idea if she is sex-aversive or if she is LD or if she is controlling. But if she's not, and just is maybe on the passive side, then by all means, dominate that situation! To someone who's passive, a strong lead is super attractive. BUT if she's not passive or if she's just "meh" about sex, then pushing and pressuring after she said "no" may push her right into being pissed that you disrespected her.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

uhtred said:


> Must be some variation. My wife is the LD and she absolutely must be the one to initiate or sex doesn't happen.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I think this is because she is both controlling and asexual. Being asexual, she actually doesn’t have much sexual desire ever, but she does have the belief that a marriage “should have” some amount of sex. Again, being asexual, she takes her best guess at what sex should be like. You know what those results are.

She is not operating on an actual D spectrum like you and I are. In that community, we are sexuals and they are asexuals. I know you know this stuff.

I will make a revised estimate of your sexual proclivity. I would say you are not LD, you’re actually a repressed LD (or would that be a repressed HD?)

Meaning, I think your natural D is much higher than what is allowed to be expressed, and you are being repressed by both your FOO stuff (which I don’t recall exactly but I remember it left you feeling sex was shameful and evil or sinful), and also by your marriage/wife.

And lots of us have perfectly good reasons to repress ourselves. One of those is to honor your commitments.

Does that maybe sound more accurate?


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## aaarghdub (Jul 15, 2017)

My W had complained that she has to initiate a lot and told me during a MC session that I should just take it.

I told her what I saw from my perspective...
1) She keeps sex in a box meaning it comes out when she wants. She won’t talk about it, won’t joke about it, there’s no come on, no teasing just she’s either naked or says she can use some lovin’. We do it and she moves on with our day. Rinse and repeat every two weeks. No really fulfilling on an emotional level TBH
2) She has no problem receiving but does being on the giving end. Once had a panic attack after I said “it’d be nice if you focused on me for awhile” while she was straddling me.
3) gets hostile when I try to give suggestions like “hey if you adjusted your hand job technique like so you would hit that spot perfectly”
4) she says talking about sex turns her off quickly

Between hyper-focus on kids, anxiety, migraines, emotions all over the place it’s hard to initiate with a personality/moods that changes hourly. And there’s unaddressed sexual abuse it’s a minefield.

A few women here have said they just want to taken and feel desired that way. Well it works both ways. You can’t Dad-zone your husband 28 out 30 days a month and expect him to want to initiate.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

aaarghdub said:


> My W had complained that she has to initiate a lot and told me during a MC session that I should just take it.
> 
> I told her what I saw from my perspective...
> 1) She keeps sex in a box meaning it comes out when she wants. She won’t talk about it, won’t joke about it, there’s no come on, no teasing just she’s either naked or says she can use some lovin’. We do it and she moves on with our day. Rinse and repeat every two weeks. No really fulfilling on an emotional level TBH
> ...


Great post.

What was the outcome of that counseling session?


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## uhtred (Jun 22, 2016)

Its consistent with that, but also with a deep seated discomfort with sex and a sense of needing to be in control. 



ConanHub said:


> That honestly just sounds controlling and selfish.


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## uhtred (Jun 22, 2016)

Its all relative of course. 

Yes, I would like her to initiate more, or to be able to initiate more myself. I don't initiate because I have been turned down every single time for years. ( I have tried in a wide variety of ways over the years). There is simply no point. Many LD people are responsive desire, but she is the opposite. When she want sex, she wants it, almost no matter what else is going on, but when she doesn't want it, no external thing will change that. 

I've been thinking of doing an experiment where I would initiate just before I"m pretty sure she is going to, just to see if that would make her turn me down. 

If I want more sex I need to find it somewhere else. I guess I'll take a LD label if that means that I'm willing to trade my sex life to stay with my wife. Normally though I think of LD an HD as referring to how much sex someone would want 

If I "manned up" in the traditional sense, I'd divorce my wife immediately and find someone else. There are certainly options....

I think there are people who want and enjoy sex, but who are willing to trade that for things that are more important to them. I could argue that its sort of like cheating. I have plenty of opportunity to have an affair and get lots of sex. Is it LD not to do so?







Faithful Wife said:


> I would actually classify you as LD too, Uhtred. Higher D than your wife, but lower D than some men.
> 
> Part of why I say so is that you don't want to challenge her or rock the boat. You'd rather just go with her initiation. (I know you have rocked the boat in the past but...)
> 
> ...


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## uhtred (Jun 22, 2016)

I do repress my sexual interests, because my only outlet would be to divorce or cheat, neither of which I'm willing to do. No real other choice. 

With a willing partner, I would probably have a fairly typical level of sexual activity, with possibly a bit more variation that is typical. 

You are right that she has clearly decide what is the "right" amount of sex, and "acceptable" actions. Its not that she dislikes sex, she enjoys it when it happens, but she has no desire for it. 

After recent discussions she seems to have decided on a new "reasonable" that is quite a bit better. 

Anyway this is drifting off topic. I was just trying to say that situations vary and that whether or not someone should "go after" what they want varies by situation. 




Faithful Wife said:


> I think this is because she is both controlling and asexual. Being asexual, she actually doesn’t have much sexual desire ever, but she does have the belief that a marriage “should have” some amount of sex. Again, being asexual, she takes her best guess at what sex should be like. You know what those results are.
> 
> She is not operating on an actual D spectrum like you and I are. In that community, we are sexuals and they are asexuals. I know you know this stuff.
> 
> ...


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## snerg (Apr 10, 2013)

uhtred said:


> I do repress my sexual interests, because my only outlet would be to divorce or cheat, neither of which I'm willing to do. No real other choice.
> 
> With a willing partner, I would probably have a fairly typical level of sexual activity, with possibly a bit more variation that is typical.
> 
> ...


Question to your statement.
is it she has no desire for it or is the statement supposed to be she has no desire for it with you?


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## Mr.Married (Feb 21, 2018)

Married4life123 said:


> I realize this probably will vary from woman to woman but I thought I would try and get a general consensus from here anyway..
> 
> Married for 20 years and sex happens occasionally, usually when she wants it.
> 
> ...


My wife does not turn down my advances.

If I were to "ask" my wife for sex ..... I have no doubt she would say NO.

I don't ask permission ...... and that's the way she prefers it.

ASKING for sex changes the dynamic of dominance and submission ..... woman in general don't want to be in charge of sex ..... they just want it done to them.

You just as well ask her if you can go F yourself.

90% of sex happens outside the bedroom in how your interacting with your spouse and getting in her head. Don't expect to have just the 10% of doing it.


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## Cynthia (Jan 31, 2014)

Steve2.0 said:


> Tell me more; What did you do?
> Did you verbalize to your wife that she looks so hot and tempting (while walking towards her for some physical touch)
> 
> *Or *did you send telepathic thoughts to her that you were turned on while continuing to lay on the bed hoping she was scanning the right channels and picked up your non-verbal and non-physical queues?


Exactly.

Your wife cannot read your mind. The dynamic between the two of you sounds lame and I'll bet your wife doesn't like it. Your wife needs to feel sexy and attractive to you. She doesn't need to feel like she's giving you something or doing you a favor. That is extremely unsexy; a major turn off. What you are doing is turning your wife off rather than turning her on.

Stop trying to get something from her and start giving. You are supposed to be giving her your love and affection in various ways, including sexually. Be open with her about what you like and love about her. Tell her what you find sexy about her. Kiss her. Hold her hand. Rub her back. Touch her often, but not in a way that says you need it. In a way that says you are giving love to her.

It sounds like you are timid in your relationship with your wife. That isn't going to get you anywhere. @ConanHub was talking about his relationship with his wife. Some of what he does isn't going to work for every couple, but the principle behind it should. That principle is to be confident and playful with your wife. Show her that you want her and that you having something to give, but it's got to be mutual. When you find that mindset and live it in your marriage, things should improve in every aspect of the marriage, not only with your sex life.


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## MaiChi (Jun 20, 2018)

Married4life123 said:


> I realize this probably will vary from woman to woman but I thought I would try and get a general consensus from here anyway..
> 
> Married for 20 years and sex happens occasionally, usually when she wants it.
> 
> ...


How did this situation arise? Do you two not communicate?


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## aaarghdub (Jul 15, 2017)

Faithful Wife said:


> Great post.
> 
> What was the outcome of that counseling session?



Hard to say. After sharing my points, the MC validated me and she didn’t really say anything. He stressed to her I don’t feel desired and she needs to make her cues more obvious but to her she looked like she wanted to leave.

Ladies you can’t send mixed or anti-sex signals and expect us to read your mind. You can’t act asexually and expect us to “take it.” My wife would get more initiation if she didn’t see making herself available another thing on the to do list.

Analogy - a restaurant owner who doesn’t think advertising or having an open sign posted is worth the effort then complains that nobody is coming to eat. The regulars should just show up and order even though it looks closed.


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## notmyjamie (Feb 5, 2019)

aaarghdub said:


> Hard to say. After sharing my points, the MC validated me and she didn’t really say anything. He stressed to her I don’t feel desired and she needs to make her cues more obvious but to her she looked like she wanted to leave.
> 
> Ladies you can’t send mixed or anti-sex signals and expect us to read your mind. You can’t act asexually and expect us to “take it.” My wife would get more initiation if she didn’t see making herself available another thing on the to do list.
> 
> Analogy - a restaurant owner who doesn’t think advertising or having an open sign posted is worth the effort then complains that nobody is coming to eat. The regulars should just show up and order even though it looks closed.


You're assuming all women are like your wife. We aren't. I'm not going to say I've never turned down my partner, but none of the men I've ever been with can complain that I reject them all the time. I am usually very receptive to advances and I initiate quite a lot as well. Well, until I learned my husband had no interest in me, then I stopped. If I'm ever lucky enough to find another partner, I will be the same. So when I say I want a guy to take what he wants, that's with the understanding that sometimes, I'm gonna take what I want.


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## aaarghdub (Jul 15, 2017)

I think another facet on both sides is the degree to which needs are being met by the other partner. If my wife treats me like I’m just a dad and the help around the house and my emotional needs aren’t being met I don’t feel like initiating. Respect, admiration and significance are huge parts of what makes a man happy. If she is doing this to grow,those then he feels like taking his wife. Do the opposite and your wondering why he’s not into you.

From the woman’s point of view, same thing, if you’re being an ass, she’s not going to initiate. I can see that not initiating could be a sign of something is up (porn, affair, etc) and for some, this may feed insecurities for both sexes. 


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## uhtred (Jun 22, 2016)

I'm not aware of her having desired sex with any one ever.

A hint is that she does enjoy some romances - but they are all romances aimed at teens, and are entirely sex free. (I haven't discussed this pattern with her, but its pretty clear). She isn't offended by sex scenes on TV, but just sort of rolls her eyes and comments that they are trying to get the ratings up again.






snerg said:


> Question to your statement.
> is it she has no desire for it or is the statement supposed to be she has no desire for it with you?


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## notmyjamie (Feb 5, 2019)

uhtred said:


> I'm not aware of her having desired sex with any one ever.
> 
> A hint is that she does enjoy some romances - but they are all romances aimed at teens, and are entirely sex free. (I haven't discussed this pattern with her, but its pretty clear). She isn't offended by sex scenes on TV, but just sort of rolls her eyes and comments that they are trying to get the ratings up again.


I'd say she likes the idea of having a romance and a partner but she doesn't want sex which are two different things. The fact that she watches teen romance shows is because those are safe...very little sex involved...except that as the mother of three teenage girls, I can tell that they all include sex now so she might have to go to the preteen shows to see romance without sex. 

My husband is the same way, he wants a romance with me, but not sex. Except in his case he wants sex, just with men.


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## NobodySpecial (Nov 22, 2013)

aaarghdub said:


> I think another facet on both sides is the degree to which needs are being met by the other partner. If my wife treats me like I’m just a dad and the help around the house and my emotional needs aren’t being met I don’t feel like initiating. Respect, *admiration and significance* are huge parts of what makes a man happy. If she is doing this to grow,those then he feels like taking his wife. Do the opposite and your wondering why he’s not into you.
> 
> From the woman’s point of view, same thing, if you’re being an ass, she’s not going to initiate. I can see that not initiating could be a sign of something is up (porn, affair, etc) and for some, this may feed insecurities for both sexes.
> 
> ...


Every time someone lays out that specific emotional need being met by their wife I want to puke. 

I remember when meeting emotional needs became a central conversation topic on marriage boards. I have been at this a long time. Long before TAM existed. It's a good idea, very worth consideration. With this thought came a lot of really good changes in my own marriage. For instance, my husband's love language is touch. Very much not mine. But it was very worth my consideration of him truly craving something I was not giving him well. 

But the idea can, and often is, used as a bludgeon to prioritize ones partner's action to "meet a need" where only the individual can. The thing about being admired, there is only one real way to meet that need. Be admirable. I would go further and say that having someone act as if they "admire" you is an empty accomplishment. What to feel significant? How does one's partner MAKE one feel significant? It's a fool's errand.

Interesting you bring up the topic of feeding someone's insecurity. Or really, the requirement that we not do that. If I am insecure, I have 2 choices, hope that others in my life will dance the right dance to not ping my insecurity, or tackle the roots of my insecurity. The former is, again, a fool's errand.


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## NobodySpecial (Nov 22, 2013)

aaarghdub said:


> Hard to say. After sharing my points, the MC validated me and she didn’t really say anything. He stressed to her I don’t feel desired and she needs to make her cues more obvious but to her she looked like she wanted to leave.
> 
> Ladies you can’t send mixed or anti-sex signals and expect us to read your mind. You can’t act asexually and expect us to “take it.” My wife would get more initiation if she didn’t see making herself available another thing on the to do list.


What if she DOES think making herself available is another thing on her to do list? We don't know this is the OP's situation. But you bring yours as example. There are many true and real things that thought about with a wrong twist are obstacles to genuine understanding. We know we SHOULD have good, giving and game sexuality in our marriage. We know we SHOULD. But when that is not happening, the linear approach to its achievement is often the enemy of actually achieving it.

What would happen if the resistant spouse -- whether due to drive differences (would be lovely if people did not automatically assume that a lower drive partner is bad, broken and needs fixing) - resentment - unfulfilled emotional needs of their own -- were not guilty and ashamed that they are not doing what they SHOULD be doing and were able to learn and grow themselves within their marriage, to understand their feelings on the topic.

I know it is frustrating to ask simple questions like Don't you want me anymore? And here well yes I still want you? Don't you love me anymore? Well yes I love you. Well what then? Well I don't know. They may know only somewhere inside where are conscience does not allow our feelings to be invalid but on the outside accept that they SHOULD just want to have copious sex and that they don't means they are bad, broken and requiring of fixing.


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## uhtred (Jun 22, 2016)

I'm sorry your husband is attracted to men, not women. That is very difficult to deal with. 

I've considered the idea that my wife is interested in women, but if so, she hides it very well. (I'm not bothered by the concept, it wouldn't matter to me, it would just help explain things) 




notmyjamie said:


> I'd say she likes the idea of having a romance and a partner but she doesn't want sex which are two different things. The fact that she watches teen romance shows is because those are safe...very little sex involved...except that as the mother of three teenage girls, I can tell that they all include sex now so she might have to go to the preteen shows to see romance without sex.
> 
> My husband is the same way, he wants a romance with me, but not sex. Except in his case he wants sex, just with men.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

notmyjamie said:


> I'd say she likes the idea of having a romance and a partner but she doesn't want sex which are two different things. The fact that she watches teen romance shows is because those are safe...very little sex involved...except that as the mother of three teenage girls, I can tell that they all include sex now so she might have to go to the preteen shows to see romance without sex.
> 
> My husband is the same way, he wants a romance with me, but not sex. Except in his case he wants sex, just with men.


URK?!?!:surprise:


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## notmyjamie (Feb 5, 2019)

uhtred said:


> I'm sorry your husband is attracted to men, not women. That is very difficult to deal with.
> 
> I've considered the idea that my wife is interested in women, but if so, she hides it very well. (I'm not bothered by the concept, it wouldn't matter to me, it would just help explain things)


It's very interesting that it wouldn't bother you. It sure bothers me. I feel like our entire life together 25 years, was a big, fat, giant lie.


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## Holdingontoit (Mar 7, 2012)

notmyjamie said:


> It's very interesting that it wouldn't bother you. It sure bothers me. I feel like our entire life together 25 years, was a big, fat, giant lie.


Because it was.


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## notmyjamie (Feb 5, 2019)

Holdingontoit said:


> Because it was.


Not sure if you meant this to be a "duh" comment or to be supportive. I'm going with supportive. Because I've had other people tell me I shouldn't feel this way. Um yes, actually I should, because it was and it's nice to have someone else agree with me. Thanks :smile2:


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## KLT11 (May 14, 2019)

Yes, go after her! Even if she isn’t in the mood you are showing her your desires and that you’re still attracted to her. That can’t hurt... it can actually put her in the mood- I know it would for me!


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## UpsideDownWorld11 (Feb 14, 2018)

Since you are married, you take it. Only caveat being if you are married to a militant feminist then you may wake in a Siberian Prison without your pecker. 

Now if you were single I'd tell you to ask her to sign a consenuality form and have it notarized.


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## Jus260 (Mar 24, 2016)

If you are a man who is less than assertive, you are better off if you marry a woman who has a weaker personality than you. You won't have this problem of no sex. Some people are just wired to trust others and be obedient. 

My brother in law is engaged to a woman (I almost typed "married"), to a woman who has this type of personality. They just had their first baby yesterday. I'm curious to see if they are married before the second one is born.

I work with women who have this type of personality at work. I assume they are the same with their husbands at home.


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## uhtred (Jun 22, 2016)

I assume "take it" stops when she says no. For some of us that is the immediate reaction.



UpsideDownWorld11 said:


> Since you are married, you take it. Only caveat being if you are married to a militant feminist then you may wake in a Siberian Prison without your pecker.
> 
> Now if you were single I'd tell you to ask her to sign a consenuality form and have it notarized.


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## aaarghdub (Jul 15, 2017)

uhtred said:


> I assume "take it" stops when she says no. For some of us that is the immediate reaction.




I would add that a good percentage of women will say you “just take it” just like they would tell a girlfriend “you ever need help with *fill in the blank* call me.” You’re signaling you are an awesome friend right? Nobody can accuse you of not offering help. I think for some women it’s easier to virtue signal that they won’t turn down. Nobody wants to be that person.

Back to the friend analogy. Let’s be honest, it ebbs and flows with your mood and situation. One day you’re excited they call, one day you wonder why they haven’t called in weeks and if you’re even still friends, and one day you roll your eyes and sigh because you just wanted to zone out on your iPad.

In MC, my wife told our MC I should take it and I said that’s like saying telling your partner if they want something for their birthday man up and just go buy it. Not a good sentiment.

You can “take” intercourse from your partner but you can’t take intimacy or affection from a partner.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## Mr.Married (Feb 21, 2018)

aaarghdub said:


> In MC, my wife told our MC I should take it and I said that’s like saying telling your partner if they want something for their birthday man up and just go buy it. Not a good sentiment.
> 
> You can “take” intercourse from your partner but you can’t take intimacy or affection from a partner.
> 
> ...


I think you missed the whole point of "taking it" and why (in my experience) it is the best coarse of action. Taking it instead of asking for it .... gets the intimacy and affection.

It's what fuels and drives it.


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## uhtred (Jun 22, 2016)

I guess for me, I already know she is not attracted to me. If she were lesbian (which I'm pretty sure she isn't), I would know for sure that it wasn't something *wrong* with me, just the way she was. In our case, she loves me - just isn't physically attracted. 



notmyjamie said:


> It's very interesting that it wouldn't bother you. It sure bothers me. I feel like our entire life together 25 years, was a big, fat, giant lie.


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## Mr.Married (Feb 21, 2018)

uhtred said:


> I guess for me, I already know she is not attracted to me. If she were lesbian (which I'm pretty sure she isn't), I would know for sure that it wasn't something *wrong* with me, just the way she was. In our case, she loves me - just isn't physically attracted.



Take her up in your plane and throw her out over the lake ........ just kidding :surprise:


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## aaarghdub (Jul 15, 2017)

Mr.Married said:


> I think you missed the whole point of "taking it" and why (in my experience) it is the best coarse of action. Taking it instead of asking for it .... gets the intimacy and affection.
> 
> 
> 
> It's what fuels and drives it.




Nope... 110% appreciate your point for most relationships. My wife has admitted emotional intimacy and love avoidance issues and sex is not about being close it seems to be getting off every two weeks coinciding with her cycle. Likely due to suppressed trauma in childhood based on past conversations. Also, she has anxiety and became emotionally enmeshed with our kids probably from her childhood as well.

Talk is where real intimacy starts. I cannot bring up the topic of sex as it makes her very uncomfortable. In fact, he gets enraged if I insinuate our sex life needs to be improved. If you can’t talk about it, you’re facing an emotional wall. That being said, it should affection and desire SHOULD flow naturally but if your partner refuses to or can’t give it, you aren’t gonna get that intimacy no matter what. I really wish what you experience was the case for me but it isn’t. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## UpsideDownWorld11 (Feb 14, 2018)

uhtred said:


> I assume "take it" stops when she says no. For some of us that is the immediate reaction.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


'Not in the mood' means 'get me in the mood' from my experience.


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## badsanta (Oct 13, 2014)

Married4life123 said:


> What would you ladies want in general? Try and fail or not try at all



OK @Married4life123 here is what women want... listen closely. They DO NOT want a guy that goes after what he wants. Instead they want a man that is really bad at playing hard to get!


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## UpsideDownWorld11 (Feb 14, 2018)

uhtred said:


> I guess for me, I already know she is not attracted to me. If she were lesbian (which I'm pretty sure she isn't), I would know for sure that it wasn't something *wrong* with me, just the way she was. In our case, she loves me - just isn't physically attracted.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Hmmmm...well what have you done about that? Is she outranking you in the looks department? If so, hit the gym.


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## uhtred (Jun 22, 2016)

Other women find me attractive. As far as I can tell she doesn’t find anyone attractive 



UpsideDownWorld11 said:


> uhtred said:
> 
> 
> > I guess for me, I already know she is not attracted to me. If she were lesbian (which I'm pretty sure she isn't), I would know for sure that it wasn't something *wrong* with me, just the way she was. In our case, she loves me - just isn't physically attracted.
> ...


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## She'sStillGotIt (Jul 30, 2016)

Married4life123 said:


> Should I have asserted my manliness and went for it?


WTF?

Does 'asserting your manliness' mean you should have humped her leg like a stray dog in heat? Yeah, I can't see why that wouldn't have worked. :nerd:


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

She'sStillGotIt said:


> WTF?
> 
> Does 'asserting your manliness' mean you should have humped her leg like a stray dog in heat? Yeah, I can't see why that wouldn't have worked. :nerd:


I thought you were supposed to "insert" your manliness.:scratchhead:


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## Cat Lady (May 7, 2019)

I would love it if my husband "****ed" me once in a while and didn't always want to "make love". I would love it if he even ASKED me which I wanted.


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## Cletus (Apr 27, 2012)

Now here's a guy who just goes after what he wants...

Mississippi Lawmaker Punched Wife For Not Undressing Quickly Enough For Sex

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/mississippi-lawmaker-punched-wife-in-face-for-not-
undressing-quickly-enough-for-sex_n_5ce53e05e4b0547bd130004a


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## Rocky Mountain Yeti (Apr 23, 2017)

Cletus said:


> Now here's a guy who just goes after what he wants...
> 
> Mississippi Lawmaker Punched Wife For Not Undressing Quickly Enough For Sex
> 
> ...


Unbefreakinglievable.


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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

Cletus said:


> Now here's a guy who just goes after what he wants...
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Nothing asserts your manliness more than kissing your loved one with a fist...Also good practice for bending over and ass-erting yourself in prison later!


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## notmyjamie (Feb 5, 2019)

Um...wow, just wow. And he'll come out with a statement later talking about how he's an alcoholic and he's getting help now and we should all feel sorry for him and his wife will be standing next to him during the whole press conference. Sigh.

I weep for the future.


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## Cletus (Apr 27, 2012)

Rocky Mountain Yeti said:


> Unbefreakinglievable.


I know, right? That's at most a Good Spanking offense.


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## BioFury (Jul 9, 2015)

notmyjamie said:


> Um...wow, just wow. And he'll come out with a statement later talking about how he's an alcoholic and he's getting help now and we should all feel sorry for him and his wife will be standing next to him during the whole press conference. Sigh.
> 
> I weep for the future.


Nah, his wife is only allowed to wear onesies from now on. Complete with the integrated quick crotch access system.


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## MJJEAN (Jun 26, 2015)

notmyjamie said:


> Not sure if you meant this to be a "duh" comment or to be supportive. I'm going with supportive. Because I've had other people tell me I shouldn't feel this way. Um yes, actually I should, because it was and it's nice to have someone else agree with me. Thanks :smile2:


Let me throw in my support. Those years were a lie. A particularly cruel lie, at that. He presented himself as a heterosexual man who was in love with and, presumably, sexually attracted to you. His presence in your life as husband prevented you from finding and spending those years with a man who actually was in love with you and sexually attracted to you. You could have spent those years being wholly loved making memories to share into old age with a true life partner. He took the past and the future you could have had from you.

I'd be crushed and I'd also be freakin LIVID.




uhtred said:


> I guess for me, I already know she is not attracted to me. If she were lesbian (which I'm pretty sure she isn't), I would know for sure that it wasn't something *wrong* with me, just the way she was. In our case, she loves me - just isn't physically attracted.


I've met men who were handsome, intelligent, witty, kind, awesome sense of humor, confident, full of life, and a whole host of great qualities that I felt absolutely zero sexual attraction toward. There were definitely a few men over the years that I deeply liked and very much wished I could feel sexual attraction toward because they were so wonderful that they would have been life partner contenders if it wasn't for the fact that there was no sexual attraction on my part. There was nothing wrong with those men at all! We just simply didn't have chemistry.

There isn't anything "wrong" with you.



badsanta said:


> OK @Married4life123 here is what women want... listen closely. They DO NOT want a guy that goes after what he wants. Instead they want a man that is really bad at playing hard to get!


I totally want a man that goes after what he wants. Otherwise, how am I supposed to know he _really_ wants it?

Also, I'm pretty sure there is something about being a good kisser and a good cook that makes men completely forget how to play hard to get at all.



Cat Lady said:


> I would love it if my husband "****ed" me once in a while and didn't always want to "make love". I would love it if he even ASKED me which I wanted.


Have you explicitly told him this? A lot of guys suppress their urge to "****" believing their women want them to "make love".


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## notmyjamie (Feb 5, 2019)

MJJEAN said:


> Let me throw in my support. Those years were a lie. A particularly cruel lie, at that. He presented himself as a heterosexual man who was in love with and, presumably, sexually attracted to you. His presence in your life as husband prevented you from finding and spending those years with a man who actually was in love with you and sexually attracted to you. You could have spent those years being wholly loved making memories to share into old age with a true life partner. He took the past and the future you could have had from you.
> 
> I'd be crushed and I'd also be freakin LIVID.
> 
> ...


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## Rocky Mountain Yeti (Apr 23, 2017)

Cletus said:


> I know, right? That's at most a Good Spanking offense.


Yep.

Speaking personally, even if I set aside the abhorrent violence aside but still think in purely selfish terms, there can be great joy and tension buildup in properly undressing your woman. Dude is a moron... has no idea what he's missing. The type who will spend his whole life as a one pump chump. Even if he didn't hit her, I'd still feel sorry for his wife.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Rocky Mountain Yeti said:


> Yep.
> 
> Speaking personally, even if I set aside the abhorrent violence aside but still think in purely selfish terms, there can be great joy and tension buildup in properly undressing your woman. Dude is a moron... has no idea what he's missing. The type who will spend his whole life as a one pump chump. Even if he didn't hit her, I'd still feel sorry for his wife.


I don't think punching women is really what this thread is about but he just needs an old fashioned ass whipping to straighten his dumb ass out.


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## Cat Lady (May 7, 2019)

MJJEAN said:


> Have you explicitly told him this? A lot of guys suppress their urge to "****" believing their women want them to "make love".


OMG a thousand times. Ten thousand. In a hundred thousand different ways. It's a problem.


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## UpsideDownWorld11 (Feb 14, 2018)

Cat Lady said:


> MJJEAN said:
> 
> 
> > Have you explicitly told him this? A lot of guys suppress their urge to "****" believing their women want them to "make love".
> ...


Most men should have figured this out when hundreds of millions of women, many who were wives lined up for the Shades of Grey movies. I have to say conditioning leads men to believe something totally different.


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## MJJEAN (Jun 26, 2015)

Cat Lady said:


> OMG a thousand times. Ten thousand. In a hundred thousand different ways. It's a problem.


Maybe he's just not wired that way.



UpsideDownWorld11 said:


> Most men should have figured this out when hundreds of millions of women, many who were wives lined up for the Shades of Grey movies. I have to say conditioning leads men to believe something totally different.


I think the success of that series has a lot to do with many women being starved for an assertive confident man, in general, not just the bedroom.


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## aaarghdub (Jul 15, 2017)

Someone made an earlier comment about the messaging men and women are getting. Assertive and confident manhood is being maligned everywhere and its starting in elementary school where boys can’t be boys.

Show me where assertive and confident manhood is being affirmed and validated? We’re being emasculated everywhere. Women are getting the message that they are no different from men and are being oppressed by the patriarchy. They’re being told they don’t need a man and they’re just big kids anyway. Men are takers and have been oppressing women over sex for eons. There are plenty of responses from women here that they just wanna be f**** by their man. Well after going thru sexual assault prevention training and sexual harassment training we are being told we are all sexual predators. We’re also getting the message that women are giving so much to kids, friends, family, jobs, school and volunteering they have nothing left. So we’re being told your wife wants a break not sex... so why take something else? 

Now while all those are external influences what really matters is you and your partner. But that being said the problem lies where two people just assume the other’s intentions and interpretation of body language. 

My wife could be sitting on the couch in her PJs with iPad complaining about a migraine and kids yet inside her head wondering why I haven’t initiated sex in a week after telling me that she and her friends are on an every 2-3 week sex schedule and rolled her eyes at a sexual joke. Hello? You’re all complaining we never listen!

Just recently, we had a fight about this very issue of being assertive. I said she can be frustrated all she wants about me being assertive but i flat out told her she just doesn’t want to give up leadership because she loses control. She doesn’t accept opinions, criticism or suggestions very well. Never has. And she has a minefield of triggers, traumas and phobias. I’ve tried to be assertive but it makes her uncomfortable, be it sex or kids or picking vacations, to cede control or support what I want to do. Not doing it her way makes her uncomfortable. I said nobody’s taking charge from someone who doesn’t know how to not be in charge. Applies at work same as at home. I can be assertive all I want but when she puts up walls or usurps it, there’s nothing else I can do besides wait it out. Bottom line - I told her and our MC you can’t lead someone who doesn’t want to be led. 

WRT to sex, I said I am an open book and have a “sex positive” mindset and if you intentionally squash sex discussions and set all the rules (spoken and unspoken)... you’re in charge. If you squash any attempt to discuss changes, needs, likes, dislikes, feelings, expectations then you aren’t ready to have your man take ownership of your sex life. 

Luckily, the next day she said she heard me and she’d work on it.


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## uhtred (Jun 22, 2016)

Fantasies like "shades of grey" and reality can be very different. Some (note *some*) want their partners to be assertive - in exactly the right way, and at exactly the right time - but at no other time. 

Others *really* want their partners to be assertive, or at least telegraph when they do want it. 



UpsideDownWorld11 said:


> Most men should have figured this out when hundreds of millions of women, many who were wives lined up for the Shades of Grey movies. I have to say conditioning leads men to believe something totally different.


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## Mr.Married (Feb 21, 2018)

aaarghdub said:


> Show me where assertive and confident manhood is being affirmed and validated? We’re being emasculated everywhere. Well after going thru sexual assault prevention training and sexual harassment training we are being told we are all sexual predators. We’re also getting the message that women are giving so much to kids, friends, family, jobs, school and volunteering they have nothing left. So we’re being told your wife wants a break not sex... so why take something else?
> 
> .



Show me where assertive and confident manhood is being affirmed and validated?

It is being validated in the bedroom and in your own home..... by your woman ..... the only affirmation and validation that matters. Forget public agenda and programming.

We’re being emasculated everywhere.

Only if your one of the ones that is buying into it.


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## Somearebiased (Aug 21, 2019)

I’m of the notion that my wife loves when I am assertive and dominant. Confidence is sexy. You are a full blooded man, you have to be willing to risk rejection or her turning you down to get what you want or need. Asking women what they want and like is bound to get you many many different answers. I can just speak from my own personal experience and if I were you when I saw that towel on her when she comes out of the shower next time, romance her and ravish her. Compliment her or use some dirty talk. Use your brain man and be honest tell her how sexy you find her and rip that towel off and make sweet passionate love right there on the floor! 
In all seriousness, my wife isn’t always in the mood but if I am into her and she sees me getting all hot and bothered and tell her how much she turns me on, she gets in the mood real damn quick lol


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## CraigBesuden (Jun 20, 2019)

It’s not just about being assertive and dominant. When you ravage her, you show through your actions how beautiful and sexy she is. So much that you can’t go sliw and “make love.”


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## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

CraigBesuden said:


> It’s not just about being assertive and dominant. When you ravage her, you show through your actions how beautiful and sexy she is. So much that you can’t go sliw and “make love.”


So I'm thinking there are three different terms/ways to do PIV sex?

- Having sex
- Making love
- F'ing

It's interesting because, growing up, I never considered "having sex" an option. I mean sure, you laughed at Woody Allen's description of sex without love is a meaningless experience, but as meaningless experiences go, it's one of the best. But I'm really torn at trying to figure out just exactly what I enjoy with my wife in bed. If it's simple physicality, a release, it's having sex? If I feel especially connected to her it's making love? And if I just want to tear her clothes off and f then it's f? Different things at different times. 

What's interesting is that I think "having sex" conveys the least commitment, and for the virgin, is probably the "time to get this over with" type of thinking. It might happen not as an act of love, but wouldn't have happened (most times) if there hadn't been a feeling of love beforehand.

Most "nice" people are brought up thinking that f'ing is that risque, somewhat dark side that you might fantasize about but mostly it's from the movies and not real life. Usually the guy is throwing the woman up against a wall and they're going at it in a position I've never quite figured out how it could be practical, unless she weighs 80 pounds.

Making love is either a con, something said to get someone in bed with you, or a very special moment of bonding. I doubt that it's practical, for most, as an every-time thing. 

And so we come back to "having sex." Enjoyable, preferably for both parties, and a benefit to the relationship. I don't want to think of it as transactional, but there's some element of that.


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## Young at Heart (Jan 6, 2015)

lifeistooshort said:


> I like it when my guy is direct about wanting me.....knowing your partner wants you is the ultimate aphrodisiac.
> 
> Of course if I say no, which I seldom do, that needs to be respected. And if we have a good relationship I will very likely respond.
> 
> And no tickling.....can't guarantee you won't get something bruised or broken if you start with that :rofl:


:iagree:

My wife has told me that it is incredibly hot to feel my lust and passion, as that can easily turn her on sexually. However, if she is not in the mood for sex, it is don't touch me and leave me alone.

So the concept of going for what you want is a good one, but tempered by you might not get what you want every time. I learned a hard lesson that pressuring my wife for sex, whining when I don't get sex are both big turn offs to her. So now we try to schedule sex more and agree to general frequency goals, but allow some flexibility.

And yes, tickling is something we use to do, but is kind of off limits now.


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## NYTrailblazer32 (Feb 4, 2019)

This is a really good post and I'm learning quite a bit from everyone!

Isn't there a balance to the assertiveness? My wife has a physical issues that keeps her in quite a bit of pain for days on end. She's ask me why I haven't initiated in the last few days and I tell her because she's been in so much pain. It doesn't come across as me being sensitive and understanding if I try to have sex with you. She tells me that she wouldn't deny me sex as a result of her pain and that I should get it if I want it. We've had sex before when she's been in pain (she initiated) and that time was uncomfortable for her and I felt bad afterwards. 

How can she expect me to initiate sex while she's in pain? Or should I just take her at her word and go for it?


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## notmyjamie (Feb 5, 2019)

NYTrailblazer32 said:


> This is a really good post and I'm learning quite a bit from everyone!
> 
> Isn't there a balance to the assertiveness? My wife has a physical issues that keeps her in quite a bit of pain for days on end. She's ask me why I haven't initiated in the last few days and I tell her because she's been in so much pain. It doesn't come across as me being sensitive and understanding if I try to have sex with you. She tells me that she wouldn't deny me sex as a result of her pain and that I should get it if I want it. We've had sex before when she's been in pain (she initiated) and that time was uncomfortable for her and I felt bad afterwards.
> 
> How can she expect me to initiate sex while she's in pain? Or should I just take her at her word and go for it?


I'd revisit the conversation with her again and ask if there is something you can do or a way you can change things up so as to decrease how much pain it causes her. I spent almost a year paralyzed and in horrific nerve pain. Dealing with all that might have been a bit easier for me if I'd had someone who wanted me, who I wanted, and who I could escape from my problems with for a while by having sex and not feel so totally alone. I'd imagine that's what your wife wants...to know that all this pain has taken a lot from her, but not you and what you have together. She needs to still feel desirable and loved. So yes, take her word for it, but ask what you can do to make it not as painful, ie. different positions, etc.


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## CraigBesuden (Jun 20, 2019)

You could let her know that you will initiate but it’s totally okay to say no (or stop midway) if the pain is too much. That way she gets your validation without feeling guilt.


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## NYTrailblazer32 (Feb 4, 2019)

@notmyjamie - I really appreciate your advice. I can pick up what you've gone through with your response and I'm taking your words to heart. I will definitely re-focus my self and approach this differently. Thanks!


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## NYTrailblazer32 (Feb 4, 2019)

@CraigBesuden - Thanks for the advice! That makes sense and I will remember to give her a way out if it gets to be too painful for her.


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