# At some point, I have to stop throwing stones



## toolforgrowth

Interesting developments happening lately. 

My girlfriend and I broke up last week. I thought I'd be sadder about it, but in honesty it's something of a relief. We just aren't compatible, even though we had good chemistry and we care for each other very deeply. Why, you ask? In short, every obstacle in our way was placed there by her. We literally went nowhere in the 13 months we were dating. I wanted more than she was willing to provide (or could provide, depending on which side of the story you choose to believe). We had a relationship on paper only. 

I was perfectly okay with being single for a while, but fate had other ideas. Last Friday, 3 days after the break up, a cute blonde lady I work with chatted me up. I'd noticed her before and thought she was attractive, and so I eagerly chatted right back. Later that day a mutual friend at work told me she thought I was cute and wanted to get to know me better, so I waited for her after work and we exchanged phone numbers. We texted all weekend long and made plans. Yesterday after work I got Japanese take out and took it to her place. We sat on her deck, ate sushi and udon noodles, drank wine, admired the view of the river, and got to know each other. Her roommate is also a neat lady and we hit it off nicely.

As the sun started to go down we got closer, snuggled, and discovered we had AMAZING chemistry. This woman seriously made me feel things I haven't felt since...I'm not sure when. We didn't have sex (we wanted to be good for our first date), but the desire and passion was there big time. It was all I could to tear myself away and go home, and she didn't want to let me go.

There is a point to all of this. If you read my story last year, you'll know my ex wife left me last year and had a months long affair with a co worker. Last night, as Cute Blonde Girl and I started to get closer, she told me she really liked me and saw potential here, but that she had to tell me something. She asked me to sit down, and then proceeded to tell me that the reason her and her ex husband got a divorce is because she cheated on him with a co worker. She said "I cheated. It shouldn't have happened, but it did." She started crying, and said that wasn't who she is or who she wanted to be. She lost her house, her friends, everything, because of her bad choice. She said she became depressed, tried to commit suicide, and had to be hospitalized. She said that she wasn't trying to get pity or play the victim; she was the one who messed up and so she paid the price. She said clearly her marriage wasn't good but that that wasn't an excuse for her behavior. She said she had to be honest with me, because she cared for me and didn't want to hide anything from me. She wanted me to know that she would never ever do anything like that again and that she wanted to be better.

I told her my story. I told her exactly what I went through and what my ex wife did, and that I divorced her and never looked back. And it dawned on me: in the past I had wished it was my ex wife who would have given me this speech, but seeing this woman before me that I'm only starting to get to know tell me all of this, without holding anything back...was more special than anything my ex wife could have done. A woman I had met 4 days before told me her deepest and darkest secret, hoping I wouldn't judge her, hoping I would give her a chance, and respected me enough to come clean about her mistake so I could make an informed decision as to whether or not I wanted to continue seeing her. She said she really liked me and didn't want me to have find out about it later, ruining any chance she may have of pursuing a real relationship with me. 

It was very touching. In my pain and bitterness over being betrayed by my ex wife, I had never considered the opposite side of the coin...that it could hurt just as much as being betrayed. I had assumed that most people who cheat feel no remorse about it. Cute Blond Girl showed me otherwise; she has been carrying around the burden of her actions for a while now, and it has drastically altered her life. It's a stigma that is with her now forever, like the scarlet letter. She has to live with it the rest of her life. 

I told her I appreciated her telling me and that I can't judge her because I've made my share of bad choices in my life. I also told her that she deserves a chance just like everyone else, and that trust is built by positive actions over time. I said her coming clean with me and being up front and honest goes a long way towards building that trust. I finished by saying I wanted to continue seeing her and seeing where this goes.

I never thought this is a decision I would have ever made. But I thought about it this way: we all know someone who got hooked on drugs or alcohol and who turned to crime to support their habit. After hitting rock bottom, they got clean and turned their life around. They rose above their past actions to be better. Do we turn these people away because they made poor decisions in the past? Or do we celebrate their ability to overcome them and to aspire to be better, and put in the effort to make it happen? My brother was like that, he was hooked on drugs and stole to support his habit. But many years ago he got clean and is now a retired vet who owns a duplex, is going to school full time, AND works almost full time. I celebrate the fact he overcame his poor decisions to be better. And I celebrate Cute Blonde Girl's desire to overcome her past bad decision and be better too. 

I'm going into it with eyes wide open. I want to give her a chance. She has done everything right so far and has given me no reason not to trust her. On the contrary, she has done everything I could have ever asked her to do to build that trust, in spite of everything I went through. 

I felt no anxiety. I didn't even trigger...not at all. I felt at peace with everything. And I felt oddly comfortable with her, even when she was telling me all this. I don't want to let my past rule me, and neither does she. I have to overcome my pain and bitterness, and she has to overcome her bad decision. 

At some point, I have to put the stones down. Healing must begin with forgiveness.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## angelpixie

I'm happy for you ,TfG. I hope things work out for you. 

I'm curious about something -- do you think the fact that you don't have a history with Cute Blonde Girl makes it a little easier to believe her remorse? Or is it that she started owning up to things on her own before you ever even knew there was anything to own up to?


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## MSC71

Dude you are headed for trouble. She did the same thing to her husband that yours did to you. Maybe you like her, but it sounds like trouble.


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## COguy

I was already telling you this was headed for trouble when on your first date she had you hook, line, and sinker.

After her sob story, she is setting you up hardcore.

RUN AWAY.

Past behavior is the best indicator of future behavior. And it is neither normal or healthy to have such intense feelings after one date.

That's a play from the Cluster B handbook.


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## Dedicated2Her

Run. Don't walk. RUN. Please dear Lord. RUN.


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## samyeagar

I'm a bit concerned that you didn't trigger at all. That may indicate that you have blinders on and are ignoring red flags. You really have to tune your spidy sense for any and all red flags. You don't necessarily have to make every red flag a deal breaker, but you have to recognize them, and this is a HUGE one. I am concerned that while you are effectivly ignoring it now, that it will in the future, if you continue growing this relationship, start to rear its ugly head and cause issues. That is not fair to you, and really, it is not fair to her. She told you this, you accepted it, and she is going to move on thinking everything is fine, and when you trigger, and I really think you will, and possibly in a big way, it is going to hit her hard.


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## vi_bride04

So let me get this straight. She cheated on her husband with a co-worker, hit rock bottom (supposedly), feels remorse, learned her lessons...all of that.

So why is she trying to date another co-worker? Seems like if she really learned anything she would keep her dating life out of the workplace. 

And "caring" for someone that you only met 4 days ago? I can see maybe thinking there could be potential but how can there be any real feelings after that short amount of time? 

Be careful. You just got out of a 13 month relationship with your gf - don't jump into anything too soon.


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## toolforgrowth

The fact that she owned up to things without me even knowing there were things to own up to. 

I understand and appreicate the concern guys, I really do.  don't get me wrong, I wasn't thrilled to hear what she said. It's not like I'm pledging my undying love to this woman. Hardly at all. But I'm looking at her actions. She didnt have to tell me, she could have kept it hidden from me as long as possible, but she didn't. 

I don't view my lack of triggers as me ignoring something. It just simply didnt affect me like that. It was information that I calmly took in, processed, and made a decision...all without a gut wrenching trigger. If I triggered and ignored it, that would be a different story. And keep in mind, I looked her square in the eyes and told her I divorced my ex wife for cheating and never looked back. She knows what the consequences will be. 

I wouldn't say I'm in a double rebound. I wasn't even looking for a woman. It just happened, and I certainly wasn't going to say no to getting to know a pretty lady. 

I used to be a big pot smoker. I was for years. I didn't quit until my ex wife left me. Does that mean that I'm going to relapse? If past behavior is in an indicator of future behavior, should any woman I date be worried that I'm going to start using again? Or can they trust me that I want to be better?

I get all of your concerns. But me being cheated on is a part of my past, not a part of my present. She hasn't done me any wrong. If she does, then we'll both face the consequences.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## COguy

Obviously subconsciously you think something is up and you were looking for validation. You saw a dozen posts from people that have no vested interest in your relationship that it looks and smells like trouble.

If everything is so normal, why are you here posting about it?


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## Dedicated2Her

I understand what you are saying. However, sometimes you have to look at yourself, and say "where are my boundries?" You have already been to her place. Wow. How long did that take? Think about it. You have no boundries, and neither does she. 

While I most certainly believe that people deserve opporortunities to prove themselves, they need to do it without wrapping you into the physical. You cuddled, snuggled, etc the first time you were together---- at her place. Put the pieces together, dude. Don't listen to what people say, watch what they do. She is telling you a ton about her with her actions so far, even in this "relationship".


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## minimalME

toolforgrowth said:


> I never thought this is a decision I would have ever made. But I thought about it this way: we all know someone who got hooked on drugs or alcohol and who turned to crime to support their habit. After hitting rock bottom, they got clean and turned their life around. They rose above their past actions to be better. Do we turn these people away because they made poor decisions in the past? Or do we celebrate their ability to overcome them and to aspire to be better, and put in the effort to make it happen? My brother was like that, he was hooked on drugs and stole to support his habit. But many years ago he got clean and is now a retired vet who owns a duplex, is going to school full time, AND works almost full time. I celebrate the fact he overcame his poor decisions to be better. And I celebrate Cute Blonde Girl's desire to overcome her past bad decision and be better too.
> 
> I'm going into it with eyes wide open. I want to give her a chance. She has done everything right so far and has given me no reason not to trust her. On the contrary, she has done everything I could have ever asked her to do to build that trust, in spite of everything I went through.


Going slow is such good advice.

Speaking as one who committed adultery, I don't think that my past choice is an accurate indicator of future behavior. I think each person is an individual and needs to be treated as such.

When I'm heading into relationship territory, I also tell men about my affair. I do this so that they can make a decision based on who I really am and not who they think/want me to be.

I value openness, and in a committed relationship, I would have no problem handing over my phone or having my significant other look through my computer, etc.

I also attend CODA meetings regularly and read tons of books and articles about relationships. My point in sharing these things is that I see myself as moving forward, as opposed to being stuck.

Throughout my dating experiences, I've found that I take guarding a relationships much more seriously than the men I've encountered. Just because someone hasn't cheated on a partner doesn't mean they have great standards of behavior or healthy boundaries.

To me, I think the biggest thing is just not to ignore problems. If she behaves in a way that gives you pause or makes you uncomfortable, be willing to talk about it. Ask questions as you go along and try to see her in a realistic, grounded way.


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## angelpixie

I understand what everyone is saying, and I want to add a few things. This woman admits that she did something that violated her personal values, and that she sees and knows and feels remorse for the consequences. How many of our exes do not even admit to what they've done -- and therefore do NOT tell their future partners that they cheated and broke up a marriage/family? There has to be a certain point at which we allow redemption, or else, what is the point of telling cheaters that they need to change? 

Also, I'm personally not in a relationship, and haven't been in one since my divorce. But I've been really reexamining my ideas about relationships, and in doing so, have been seeing a lot of people writing about being comfortable doing things differently from the way we were always taught about the progression of relationships. Many of us did it the 'normal' or 'right' way, and yet we're here. Is it _always_ bad to be physical with someone on a first date? Is it _always_ bad to go to someone's place that soon? I don't know. Maybe it is. Or maybe we are still repeating cultural things that have been drummed into our heads, and the resulting problems we see had nothing really to do with those things I mentioned. The problems might have still come up if the two people were 'chaste' and 'modest' and didn't have sex til their wedding night. Certainly, those things didn't protect our parents and grandparents from some pretty crappy relationships. 

Just putting a little food for thought out there. These are things I'm working through myself.


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## samyeagar

toolforgrowth said:


> The fact that she owned up to things without me even knowing there were things to own up to.
> 
> I understand and appreicate the concern guys, I really do.  don't get me wrong, I wasn't thrilled to hear what she said. It's not like I'm pledging my undying love to this woman. Hardly at all. But I'm looking at her actions. She didnt have to tell me, she could have kept it hidden from me as long as possible, but she didn't.
> 
> I don't view my lack of triggers as me ignoring something. It just simply didnt affect me like that. It was information that I calmly took in, processed, and made a decision...all without a gut wrenching trigger. If I triggered and ignored it, that would be a different story. And keep in mind, I looked her square in the eyes and told her I divorced my ex wife for cheating and never looked back. She knows what the consequences will be.
> 
> I wouldn't say I'm in a double rebound. I wasn't even looking for a woman. It just happened, and I certainly wasn't going to say no to getting to know a pretty lady.
> 
> I used to be a big pot smoker. I was for years. I didn't quit until my ex wife left me. Does that mean that I'm going to relapse? If past behavior is in an indicator of future behavior, *should any woman I date be worried that I'm going to start using again*? Or can they trust me that I want to be better?
> 
> I get all of your concerns. But me being cheated on is a part of my past, not a part of my present. She hasn't done me any wrong. If she does, then we'll both face the consequences.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Yes.


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## minimalME

> ...should any woman I date be worried that I'm going to start using again?


Worried? No. Aware? Yes.


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## Dedicated2Her

> Is it always bad to be physical with someone on a first date? Is it always bad to go to someone's place that soon? I don't know. Maybe it is. Or maybe we are still repeating cultural things that have been drummed into our heads, and the resulting problems we see had nothing really to do with those things I mentioned.


I'm not saying it is bad. What I am saying is that, based upon the OP's situation (past and present), there is a habit of unhealthy relationships based upon no boundries. It is about placing value on your self worth, not only for protection, but also for finding out someone's true intentions. The truth always comes out over time. Placing yourself in a situaiton of physical emotional connection so quickly is a recipe for being stupid especially considering the past.


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## muskrat

I had a similar experience last week with a lady I went out with. As we talked about the demise of our marriages, she said omg, I am just like your ex wife and you are just like my ex H. She did the same things my ex did. She cried and expressed a ton of remorse. We then both agreed that neither of us is ready for a relationship and we would just stay friends.
To my surprise, I tried to comfort her as she confessed her sins. She said she would not blame me if I never wanted to talk to her again. I shocked myself at how forgiving I was.
My point is, I can see how complete honesty and openness and showing remorse would be grounds for giving someone a chance. We have all made mistakes in life. The hope is that we learn and grow from these mistakes and become a better person.
As to the point AP makes. As she told me of her regrets with ending her marriage and the things she had done, she also said she would never admit them to her ex and if she sees him she would try to appear happy.


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## angelpixie

muskrat said:


> I had a similar experience last week with a lady I went out with. As we talked about the demise of our marriages, she said omg, I am just like your ex wife and you are just like my ex H. She did the same things my ex did. She cried and expressed a ton of remorse. We then both agreed that neither of us is ready for a relationship and we would just stay friends.
> To my surprise, I tried to comfort her as she confessed her sins. She said she would not blame me if I never wanted to talk to her again. I shocked myself at how forgiving I was.
> My point is, I can see how complete honesty and openness and showing remorse would be grounds for giving someone a chance. We have all made mistakes in life. The hope is that we learn and grow from these mistakes and become a better person.
> As to the point AP makes. As she told me of her regrets with ending her marriage and the things she had done,* she also said she would never admit them to her ex and if she sees him she would try to appear happy.*


And that is a big red flag that she has not _really_ owned up to what she's done. The hardest thing to do is admit and apologize to the one you've wronged, but it's the thing that counts the most. I can see in reading this and TfG's posts again, that it would be very easy for a fWS to use their remorse for their sins as a way to get a twisted form of validation, and yet get someone to feel sorry for them because they are perceived to be in pain. I still believe that redemption is possible, but I'd want to make sure that they weren't using their confession as a way to become a victim. Have they really grown enough that they could admit these same things to the person they betrayed?


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## Dedicated2Her

> And that is a big red flag that she has not really owned up to what she's done. The hardest thing to do is admit and apologize to the one you've wronged, but it's the thing that counts the most. I can see in reading this and TfG's posts again, that it would be very easy for a fWS to use their remorse for their sins as a way to get a twisted form of validation, and yet get someone to feel sorry for them because they are perceived to be in pain. I still believe that redemption is possible, but I'd want to make sure that they weren't using their confession as a way to become a victim. Have they really grown enough that they could admit these same things to the person they betrayed?


Exactly. True redemption is formed through humbleness. This shows pride.


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## muskrat

First, I should say she is locked into the friend zone now.
Second, I did tell her she should tell her ex what she told me. She asked if I really thought that would be good from him. I told maybe not at this point. They have been divorced for a few years and he has remarried and has a new family now. I figured maybe it would be harmful to him to have old pains drug up. They also have no children together and do not see each other. I figured it was probably in his best interest to just let the past in the past.


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## toolforgrowth

Quite the opposite. I spent a LOT of time in CWI last year, and even more time carrying around the pain and bitterness of being cheated on. It's been very hard for me to consider forgiveness because I've been carrying it around for so long, playing the victim card and being scared to trust and open up again. 

That's not the way I want to live my life. 

I remembered the people here at TAM. I know a lot of other people were cheated on here too. I wanted to share that it is possible to let go of that pain and trust again.

If she had kept it from me, I would have bailed. Said nope, can't do it. See you later. But she didn't. She did for me what most spouses who supposedly love us can't do. To me, that's worth a chance. 

I'm not suggesting that what is right for me is right for you, or vice versa. I'm not looking for any validation whatsoever. My whole point was to share that is possible to let go of the pain, and that honesty and transparency really do exist. I don't carry around the weight of being cheated on. Yes, it's a part of me, and it always will be. But it doesn't define me and I don't let it rule my decisions. And it's possible for any one of us to reach that state. 

As long as she continues to be honest and transparent, I'll give her the benefit of the doubt. If I feel anything is shady, she'll hear about it.

All I'm saying is letting it define you isn't healthy. Sure, let it guide your actions. But don't let it rule you. Life's too short.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## toolforgrowth

I spent a LOT of time in CWI last year, and even more time carrying around the pain and bitterness of being cheated on. It's been very hard for me to consider forgiveness because I've been carrying it around for so long, playing the victim card and being scared to trust and open up again. 

That's not the way I want to live my life. 

I remembered the people here at TAM. I know a lot of other people were cheated on here too. I wanted to share that it is possible to let go of that pain and trust again.

If she had kept it from me, I would have bailed. Said nope, can't do it. See you later. But she didn't. She did for me what most spouses who supposedly love us can't do. To me, that's worth a chance. 

I'm not suggesting that what is right for me is right for you, or vice versa. I'm not looking for any validation whatsoever. My whole point was to share that is possible to let go of the pain, and that honesty and transparency really do exist. I don't carry around the weight of being cheated on. Yes, it's a part of me, and it always will be. But it doesn't define me and I don't let it rule my decisions. And it's possible for any one of us to reach that state. 

As long as she continues to be honest and transparent, I'll give her the benefit of the doubt. If I feel anything is shady, she'll hear about it.

All I'm saying is letting it define you isn't healthy. Sure, let it guide your actions. But don't let it rule you. Life's too short.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## EnjoliWoman

I don't know anyone who had a huge problem with drugs or alcohol and turned their life around. I know a nice average guy who tried crack, stole from friends and businesses, went to jail numerous times and is dead. I know an alcoholic who has been to AA, on medications to help with his problems and is barely functioning, sleeping in his van (ex of someone I know) and a pothead girl with zero motivation (she admitted all she wanted to do was smoke pot all day) living in a 2 bedroom cinderblock house with 6 other people and sharing one basket of clothes and a twin bed with her girlfriend. 

I see a lot less of people changing vs. those who do not. No way in hell I'd date an ex alcoholic or hard drug user. Even with cigarettes you'd better have quit about 10 years ago with zero relapse (because it's a stinky habit not 'cause I'm a purist or health nut). 

On one hand I'm happy that you are willing to give people a chance; on the other hand I think you are being a bit ostrich-like with your head in the sand. 

Regardless I hope I'm wrong.


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## minimalME

angelpixie said:


> I can see in reading this and TfG's posts again, that it would be very easy for a fWS to use their remorse for their sins as a way to get a twisted form of validation, and yet get someone to feel sorry for them because they are perceived to be in pain. I still believe that redemption is possible, but I'd want to make sure that they weren't using their confession as a way to become a victim.


Perhaps someone's interpretation of a confession is more about the hearer than the speaker?

When I talked to my ex-husband and to the men I've chosen to share with, I didn't cry. They (or you) could very well have interpreted that as cold-hearted and unrepentant. But is that true? I would tell you no, but you may believe the opposite.

If I keep on and on about how I really mean it, then, to me, that becomes more self-serving and manipulative.

I can only give you the information. What you do with it is up to you.


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## angelpixie

Sorry, MMe, I was more responding to Muskrat and TfG's posts. I was married to a manipulative man who could turn the tears on and off like a faucet, so I know better than to judge sincerity by whether or not there are tears, lol. I'm not in any way saying that all people who confess to someone are using that confession as manipulation. Remember -- I was the one posting about believing in redemption! I was saying I could see where it would be possible that it could happen. And that someone saying they would never tell those things to their spouse would be a red flag to me (barring obvious issues like the other spouse being dangerous, dead, etc.) And you did talk to your ex -- that took a lot of guts, and shows your integrity, IMO.


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## Dedicated2Her

> If she had kept it from me, I would have bailed. Said nope, can't do it. See you later. But she didn't. She did for me what most spouses who supposedly love us can't do. To me, that's worth a chance.


The problem with this is that it is easy to be honest with someone you just met.....because you don't have anything invested. In 12 months, different story. People can change, no doubt. However, the pattern she has is still there for her previous problems. What specifically has she done to make sure it doesn't happen again? Therapy? How much work has she done? It's one thing to be remorseful or guilty. It's another to be able to articulate and show how you purposed yourself to change.


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## toolforgrowth

I guess for me it's somewhat easier because I too have made my share of mistakes. I'm not perfect. I was a pot head for over 10 years, but now I've been clean for a year and a half. I quit cigarettes four years ago. If CBG said "Sorry, I can't date you even though you're clean now and have been for a long time now" I'd be sad and hurt. I wouldn't understand. That's who I was, not who I am. I was depressed, in a very bad marriage, and I made a very bad choice and turned to pot as a coping mechanism. My fault. My error. But I don't believe that that bad decision is my defining characteristic, or that I can never be better than that.

I disagree with the assertion that it's easier to tell someone you don't know about something really bad you did. I don't share with people I barely met that I abused pot. I don't say "Hi, I'm TfG, I think you're cute, by the way I abused pot for over 10 years." It's something that I'm ashamed of and I don't share it lightly.

CBG didn't try to defend her actions. She told me she owns it. Her fault. The fact she was in a bad marriage was no excuse. Yes, she sought professional help.

If you have ever read the list of "What does a WS need to do in order to save the marriage" then you'll know. She has NC with the guy. She switched jobs. She got professional help. She came clean with me and told me to my face what she did. No excuses. No blameshifting.

If she had said "I cheated, but he drove me to do it." Or "I cheated, but here's why..." BAM. That would have been it. Done. Would have said goodbye and walked out. She said none of that. And since god knows I have my share of dirty laundry and since I'm not perfect, I can't judge her for wanting to be better. I want to be better too. I don't want to be defined or written off as a pot head the rest of my life, even after I got clean. If I'm to continue to be judged because of it, then what was the point of getting clean in the first place?

I'm not going to cast stones because god knows I'm just as full of sin. And I believe she wants to be better than her bad choices, just like I do. If she proves me wrong, then I'll face the consequences like an adult.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Dedicated2Her

> I disagree with the assertion that it's easier to tell someone you don't know about something really bad you did. I don't share with people I barely met that I abused pot. I don't say "Hi, I'm TfG, I think you're cute, by the way I abused pot for over 10 years." It's something that I'm ashamed of and I don't share it lightly


That's you. Depends on the personality, and depends on a lot of factors. What you have shared about this girl, I suspect she has her ways of doing things...... I could be wrong, though. Good luck. I think you are going to need it.

It's just a fire that I wouldn't want to play with. And you don't get clean because of what others think, you get clean for you.


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## toolforgrowth

Dedicated2Her said:


> That's you. Depends on the personality, and depends on a lot of factors. What you have shared about this girl, I suspect she has her ways of doing things...... I could be wrong, though. Good luck. I think you are going to need it.
> 
> It's just a fire that I wouldn't want to play with. And you don't get clean because of what others think, you get clean for you.


I certainly don't blame you. The point of this thread wasn't to seek validation... I've already made my choice. It was to express that it's possible to not let being betrayed define your existence in relationships. That it's possible to let go of the pain. 

I don't feel I have boundary issues...not anymore. In my marriage? You betcha I did. But when my ex wife cheated, I bailed. And with my last relationship, my ex GF was a control freak and ran the relationship, no matter how hard I tried to establish boundaries and clearly express my needs and wishes. So I bailed. 

I don't stay in a bad relationship if its not working. I deserve better than that.

You're right, I got clean for myself. But that doesn't mean I want to be a pariah because I USED to be a stoner, or that I should accept people treating me that way. If people choose to treat me that way, fine...but they don't have to be a part of my life and I don't have to acknowledge them.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## doubletrouble

Son, you make smoking pot sound like it's an opiate or meth addiction. How bad did it make your life??? 

Thirty years ago, I stopped after I'd smoked it for 10 years. Didn't make me an animal, I never robbed anyone, etc etc. You use the term "clean" as if you went to rehab for it. Please elaborate....??


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## minimalME

angelpixie said:


> Sorry, MMe, I was more responding to Muskrat and TfG's posts. I was married to a manipulative man who could turn the tears on and off like a faucet, so I know better than to judge sincerity by whether or not there are tears, lol. I'm not in any way saying that all people who confess to someone are using that confession as manipulation. Remember -- I was the one posting about believing in redemption! I was saying I could see where it would be possible that it could happen. And that someone saying they would never tell those things to their spouse would be a red flag to me (barring obvious issues like the other spouse being dangerous, dead, etc.) And you did talk to your ex -- that took a lot of guts, and shows your integrity, IMO.


No problem at all! I was just presenting a different side.


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