# Am lost as to what to do with my suspiscions :(



## irishjoe (May 20, 2012)

I need some help on where to go with my suspscions, they are eating away at my relationship and each day i become more volatile toward my girlfriend.

We've been together for 7 years, we are both 25 and have been together exclusively since we were 18. 

She started a job about a year ago where she works in a fairly large office with an even spread of men and women. I vaguely remember some of her early comments about this guy and off handedly registered them as her letting me know about the various people she was working with.

Some of the things she has started doing have me raising concerns that i have never had. She is taking alot more interest in how she looks in the morning before she goes to work, when i say this she has gradually become almost compulsive in getting all the minor things done right. This is definitely a new behaviour.

She will leave for work in the morning sometimes 2 hours earlier than she needs to but she dosen't finnish work earlier.

She recieves phone messages when shes at home from this guy.

After becomming suspiscious of this i decided to breach her privacy and do some reading on her phone, e-mail and facebook.

What i saw was a routine of communication that extended from a work relationship into close friends who worked together. They regularly met for coffe, went to lunch together and were well versed in eachothers personal problems. The main issue i have is from the communication i saw she was the one initiating alot of the activites between the 2 of them. I saw one quite hurtful exchange of messages in which she had a problem at work that had upset her quite a bit, what i read was her need to lean on this guy and seek his comfort & only to have this guy tell her that she should raise the issue with me, her reply to that was she couldn't talk to me about it and she needed someone to support her.

She has recently left that workplace but she still remains in contact with this guy. She recently got a new mobile and gave me her old one, the other guy accidentally messaged me a few days ago with a message asking what she would like to do, after i further investigated later that night i found out that because she was going to be in the city she asked if he would like to meet up with her since she was going to be near her old workplace.

Am i reading too much into this? I know no-one can tell me for sure there is anything going on but in my stomach i feel as though i have been betrayed on an emotional level, i don't have any reason to believe anything physical happened but i have basically convinced myself that my partner found something emotionally attractive and arousing about this guy. Given more time and under the right circumstances it may have become phyiscal. 

I feel that unless i confront her i will continue to hate her and this will fester into something dangerous. If i do confront her and she flat out denies it as anything more than a friendship than theres been irreparable damage caused. 

Anyones thoughts or advice are very much appreciated.


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## keko (Mar 21, 2012)

*DO NOT* confront her until you have a hard evidence, otherwise she'll just gaslight you.

Which phone is using?

Do you know where she actually is when she leaves early?



irishjoe said:


> She will leave for work in the morning sometimes 2 hours earlier than she needs to but she dosen't finnish work earlier.


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

You might be able to retrieve deleted messages on the phone you now have.


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## irishjoe (May 20, 2012)

keko said:


> *DO NOT* confront her until you have a hard evidence, otherwise she'll just gaslight you.
> 
> Which phone is using?
> 
> Do you know where she actually is when she leaves early?


Well i'm not sure what counts as hard evidence? i saw the messages and communication with my own eyes and can almost recount them verbatim, the only way she can deny what i've read is if she is trying to insult both of our intelligences. 

Which phone is she using? not sure what you meant by that.

She says she is going to work early, i ask her why and she says that she may as well, i have no reason not to believe that she's not going straight to work but i do think she's doing it to socialise before work.


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## Eli-Zor (Nov 14, 2010)

If its not already its an affair waiting to happen.
Have a conversation with your wife, choose your words carefully and say you are the one she should be talking to not him . Talk , discuss , memtion you are incomfortable with her contacing him and she should be talking to you, do not reveal that you are snooping or to what extent you have gone. Text him and tell him to back off.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## keko (Mar 21, 2012)

Which brand phone?


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## irishjoe (May 20, 2012)

Eli-Zor said:


> If its not already its an affair waiting to happen.
> Have a conversation with your wife, choose your words carefully and say you are the one she should be talking to not him . Talk , discuss , memtion you are incomfortable with her contacing him and she should be talking to you, do not reveal that you are snooping or to what extent you have gone. Text him and tell him to back off.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I have considered both of those but decided to sit back and see if it eventuates further. The way my brain works is that if she is guilty of what i think she is than what am i trying to save? I'm angry at her not him so i don't imagine that i would ever need to contact this other guy. I guess i feel that the moment i think it's reached the point i need to raise it with her than it's already destroyed whatever we had. I just couldn't continue on and regain trust after that. That's why im so apprehensive about what i should be doing with the knowledge i have now because keeping it to myself has become corrosive to our relationship.


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## irishjoe (May 20, 2012)

keko said:


> Which brand phone?


She has a Samsung Galaxy, one of the more redeeming points in her favor is that she dosen't really hide her phone or try to password protect it from me so i was and am still able to keep tabs of her conversations. She has however acknowledged that i have been on her phone and she has recently started deleting her messages with everyone on a daily basis.


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## keko (Mar 21, 2012)

irishjoe said:


> and she has recently started deleting her messages with everyone on a daily basis.


Joe, sorry to say but there are plenty of red flags of an affair, at the very least an emotional one.

If there are any bestbuy/radioshack/walmart buy a VAR(voice activated recorder) and place it in her car(under the drivers seat, firmly).

How is her work schedule? Is she coming late, working on weekends? Can you check her pay stubs if she is taking off any work days?


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## Count of Monte Cristo (Mar 21, 2012)

The two of you have been together since you were both eighteen. The statistics for a lifetime relationship isn't very promising for a relationship that started so young. Is this the woman that you want to grow old with? If so, you need to agree on boundaries in the relationship. One such boundary is no male confidant. You might also want to find out what she expects out of the relationship. The good thing about all this is that you're not married to her. Still hurts. But a lot less than if you were legally bound to her.


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## tacoma (May 1, 2011)

Shaggy said:


> You might be able to retrieve deleted messages on the phone you now have.


Download the phone logs from her old phone onto a PC so you can find any deleted texts
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## jh52 (Apr 29, 2012)

irishjoe said:


> I need some help on where to go with my suspscions, they are eating away at my relationship and each day i become more volatile toward my girlfriend.
> 
> We've been together for 7 years, we are both 25 and have been together exclusively since we were 18.
> 
> ...


Read this paragraph again: 

"What i saw was a routine of communication that extended from a work relationship into close friends who worked together. They regularly met for coffe, went to lunch together and were well versed in eachothers personal problems. The main issue i have is from the communication i saw she was the one initiating alot of the activites between the 2 of them. I saw one quite hurtful exchange of messages in which she had a problem at work that had upset her quite a bit, what i read was her need to lean on this guy and seek his comfort & only to have this guy tell her that she should raise the issue with me, her reply to that was she couldn't talk to me about it and she needed someone to support her."

It appears for whatever reason she cannot talk to you and share what is on her mind -- because you don't support her.

Look to yourself and be honest -- and ask yourself if she is right. If she is correct -- you can be open more and supportive and work on this.

Like others have said -- she is not getting what is needed from you -- so this guy has taken your place as least for support.

If she hasn't started an EA with this guy -- and things don't change between you to (talking, doing things together, going on dates, etc) she will find someone to start another EA and possibly a PA.

I am not putting this all on you -- it takes two to make a marriage work -- but right now her perception is her reality and the perception is that you don't support her.


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## aug (Aug 21, 2011)

You've been together for 7 years since you were 18. You're not married.

If she's not interested in continuing the relationship, maybe she has outgrown it? Maybe it's time to move on. You cant spend your life with someone you dont trust.


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## irishjoe (May 20, 2012)

keko said:


> Joe, sorry to say but there are plenty of red flags of an affair, at the very least an emotional one.
> 
> If there are any bestbuy/radioshack/walmart buy a VAR(voice activated recorder) and place it in her car(under the drivers seat, firmly).
> 
> How is her work schedule? Is she coming late, working on weekends? Can you check her pay stubs if she is taking off any work days?


The emotional affair is something i never knew existed until i felt that she was connected to another man. I could tell the way she communicated with him and the environment in which she did it that she had a certain specific interest in this guy. This is something i basically resigned myself into accepting, that was hard.

Like i said in my original post, she no longer (as far as i know) see's him on a daily basis as she moved jobs 3 months ago. It wasn't until a few days ago that i recieved the message via my phone by accident that all of this resurfaced and i knew that while she may no longer work with him there was a lengthy perioid that she was doing something wrong.

Checking her work times would be almost an impossibility, she had a very flexible job and didnt really need to account for her whereabouts for the day, apart from her starting work outrageously early (which was unnecessary) and her fixation on her appearance (which has also now stopped that she no longer works there) and her sudden interest in losing some weight (didnt have much to lose) i never would have known what was going on. Theres either nothing going on or she dosen't think i'm perceptive enough to notice. Hard to know which.


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## Peachy Cat (Apr 15, 2012)

RED FLAGS all over the place.

TRUST YOUR GUT.

She's asking for emotional support from him and basically tells him you aren't there for her.

I have to give the OM one "good mark" for deflecting her need to "lean" back to you. But, I just wonder 'if' there's an EA or PA going on, he's only in it for one thing... doesn't want to be bothered with the emotional stuff.


She's deleting messages. After she knows you've read her past messages, she hasn't offered one word of explanation, conversation, etc. about the messages she knows you read. But now she erases them. Not a good sign.

Good luck... keep us posted


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

tacoma said:


> Download the phone logs from her old phone onto a PC so you can find any deleted texts
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


This is what I was thinking. Since you have her old phone right in your hand, and on it might be the deleted texts you most want to read.


Google the phone model you have and recovering deleted texts.


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## keko (Mar 21, 2012)

irishjoe said:


> The emotional affair is something i never knew existed until i felt that she was connected to another man. I could tell the way she communicated with him and the environment in which she did it that she had a certain specific interest in this guy. This is something i basically resigned myself into accepting, that was hard.
> 
> Like i said in my original post, she no longer (as far as i know) see's him on a daily basis as she moved jobs 3 months ago. It wasn't until a few days ago that i recieved the message via my phone by accident that all of this resurfaced and i knew that while she may no longer work with him there was a lengthy perioid that she was doing something wrong.
> 
> Checking her work times would be almost an impossibility, she had a very flexible job and didnt really need to account for her whereabouts for the day, apart from her starting work outrageously early (which was unnecessary) and her fixation on her appearance (which has also now stopped that she no longer works there) and her sudden interest in losing some weight (didnt have much to lose) i never would have known what was going on. Theres either nothing going on or she dosen't think i'm perceptive enough to notice. Hard to know which.


Friend get to work ASAP. We read the same script just about everyday in infidelity site's. Everything you've described show's she's checked out of the marriage and looking for fulfillment somewhere else.

Im not too familiar with the galaxy's but when she's not around can you download an app to store text messages and track where the phone is?

How is your sex life? From her last job until now?


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## Peachy Cat (Apr 15, 2012)

Oh, and my first ex husband would regularly leave for work 2 hours before he had to be there "to avoid traffic". 

What made me think "wth" one day was when he didn't go in early for a whole week... I asked him if his schedule had changed---innocent question (I was completely oblivious to anything at this point). He went OFF on me! Accused me of being "paranoid", you name it. 

He was having an affair with a coworker. (I guess she was on vacation that week, I never did find out....).


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## Acabado (May 13, 2012)

> the only way she can deny what i've read is if she is trying to insult both of our intelligences


She wioll do it. This and more. You doesn't have any idea how far cheaters can go to lie, gaslight and let you off the hook. You an catch her red handed, in the act and still deny deny deny any wrongdoing right in your face. From now on you doesn't know her, she's not your wife but a random wayward wife. They follow a script. You need to know how the ''game'' plays. Please hear the vets. Educate yourself.

Best wishes


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## irishjoe (May 20, 2012)

Count of Monte Cristo said:


> The two of you have been together since you were both eighteen. The statistics for a lifetime relationship isn't very promising for a relationship that started so young. Is this the woman that you want to grow old with? If so, you need to agree on boundaries in the relationship. One such boundary is no male confidant. You might also want to find out what she expects out of the relationship. The good thing about all this is that you're not married to her. Still hurts. But a lot less than if you were legally bound to her.


This is probably the best post to raise this. My first post didn't give a full indication of the circumstances. When she was 18 her mother through her out of the house due to some major disagreements that spun out of control. 

At the time we had only been seeing eachother for 6 months but we became so close within those 6 months i invited her to move in with my family (her only other option was that she move interstate with grandparents). 

Not long after that we moved into our own place and we did it very tough to work and study at the same time. We struggled hard and overcame alot to get to where we are now. We became closer and got a true sense of who we are as a couple and we now are seeing the benefits of those very tough 4 years. 

When we were 23 she became pregnant, we are now the parents of a 2 year old girl which we both adore. I'll also add we are not married (besides her repeated requests of me to hurry up and propose).

The timing of her suspected EA coincided with a time in which she would work during the day and i would work during the Afternnon from the hours of 3-11pm, this is how i know she would leave early as i had to watch our daughter from a very early start to the day, this resulted in us not spending a whole lot of time together but still in contact (just not much personal contact) and working towards an agreed goal. My work commitments meant i had to work these hours and she was happy for me to do them.

Now i know that at trying times people can do uncharacteristic things but to do what i believe she's done i cannot fathom or move on from. So you will understand that we aren't married but we are certaintly bound financially, parentally and i certantly believe we are deeply involved in a defacto relationship.


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## irishjoe (May 20, 2012)

Peachy Cat said:


> RED FLAGS all over the place.
> 
> TRUST YOUR GUT.
> 
> ...


Yeah i must admit from reading the 'transcripts' she certaintly was the instigator to alot of the meetings and catchups. He may well have seen her as an easy mark to start a casual sexual relationship (lets face it, alot of men would willingly enter into that) but my gut tells me she sought him out and he felt that she was comming on a bit strong and didn't want to start anything physical. I think its worse that she was not persued but in fact the persuer :/


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## keko (Mar 21, 2012)

You should have proposed to her much earlier(might be the reason she distanced herself from you), but at this moment try to find the truth and stop this "affair".


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## Shiksa (Mar 2, 2012)

you have a child together, she wants a commitment and you don't. Now she's seeking support elsewhere. No surprise. If you don't want to marry then don't, let her go. She is seeking what you are not giving her and meeting a need of her's, commitment. You need to read His Needs, Her Needs.


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## irishjoe (May 20, 2012)

aug said:


> You've been together for 7 years since you were 18. You're not married.
> 
> If she's not interested in continuing the relationship, maybe she has outgrown it? Maybe it's time to move on. You cant spend your life with someone you dont trust.


It's very troubling that i agree wholeheartedly with this. While i don't think shes outgrown me i think she was excited by the prospect of having a connection with someone else. Even if she has moved on from it than it would be naive of me to think she wouldn't willingly enter into something like this again.


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

irishjoe said:


> Well i'm not sure what counts as hard evidence? i saw the messages and communication with my own eyes and can almost recount them verbatim, the only way she can deny what i've read is if she is trying to insult both of our intelligences.
> 
> Which phone is she using? not sure what you meant by that.
> 
> She says she is going to work early, i ask her why and she says that she may as well, i have no reason not to believe that she's not going straight to work but i do think she's doing it to socialise before work.


The problem with those wanting hard evidence is that EAs have to be dealt with early on. BEFORE inappropirate behavior becomes unfaithful. So waiting for the unfaithfulness seems less than smart. 

So I fall into the camp of discussing opposite sex friends. Do His Needs Her Needs together and with the boundary setting. Why you waited this long who really knows. 

You have to decide where your boundaries are. She has developed a close male friend. Do they still meet? If so this would be crossing a bundary for me. I would not wait intul the relationship grows more.

Also, you have been together seven years. You guys just do not want to be married? Maybe she is tired of waiting.


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## irishjoe (May 20, 2012)

Shiksa said:


> you have a child together, she wants a commitment and you don't. Now she's seeking support elsewhere. No surprise. If you don't want to marry then don't, let her go. She is seeking what you are not giving her and meeting a need of her's, commitment. You need to read His Needs, Her Needs.


I'm not ready to get married, we've had that discussion and while she dosen't like it she accepted it. At this point of our relationship marriage i feel is only a technicality as everything else we have is connected. Just because we haven't gotten married does not give her the right to open herself up to other offers? if she was that serious she should come to me and say she's leaving me for the sole purpose that we are not married.


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## Peachy Cat (Apr 15, 2012)

irishjoe said:


> Yeah i must admit from reading the 'transcripts' she certaintly was the instigator to alot of the meetings and catchups. He may well have seen her as an easy mark to start a casual sexual relationship (lets face it, alot of men would willingly enter into that) but my gut tells me she sought him out and he felt that she was comming on a bit strong and didn't want to start anything physical. I think its worse that she was not persued but in fact the persuer :/



I was thinking this (about her being the one pursuing), but I didn't want to kick you when you're down. 

I'm hoping you're catching this early enough to fix it--perhaps your refusal to propose has prompted her to think you aren't really committed to her? That can be a huge emotional thing for a woman. NO, I don't think you should run and propose, but think about your reasons for not having done it; perhaps therein lies your problem.


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## irishjoe (May 20, 2012)

keko said:


> Friend get to work ASAP. We read the same script just about everyday in infidelity site's. Everything you've described show's she's checked out of the marriage and looking for fulfillment somewhere else.
> 
> Im not too familiar with the galaxy's but when she's not around can you download an app to store text messages and track where the phone is?
> 
> How is your sex life? From her last job until now?


I have to say our sex life has remained consistent before during and after my suspiscions. I honestly don't believe there was a phyiscal relationship, i do believe she wanted to be phyiscally attractive for him and she was excited by his attention however.

It may sound odd to continue being intimate when you have feelings of betrayal but i dind't (and i guess still don't) want to believe i have anything to worry about and that i was being jealous that she was spending so much one on one time with another man. But when i rationalise it, there was just too much contact and far too much intimate communication for me to feel safe.


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

irishjoe said:


> *I'm not ready to get married,* we've had that discussion and while she dosen't like it she accepted it. At this point of our relationship marriage i feel is only a technicality as everything else we have is connected. Just because we haven't gotten married does not give her the right to open herself up to other offers? if she was that serious she should come to me and say she's leaving me for the sole purpose that we are not married.


I don't think she has accepted it. You were ready to bring a child into the world but not ready to be married? So you really are not comitted to her.

I think she is looking for the things she is not getting in the relationship AND you are not married. Technically she is not even your fiance yet. You are GF and BF in an LTR. The big deal is that you have a child. Just my opinion but that should have been when you comitted if not before.


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## Eli-Zor (Nov 14, 2010)

irishjoe said:


> I'm not ready to get married, we've had that discussion and while she dosen't like it she accepted it. At this point of our relationship marriage i feel is only a technicality as everything else we have is connected. Just because we haven't gotten married does not give her the right to open herself up to other offers? if she was that serious she should come to me and say she's leaving me for the sole purpose that we are not married.


I guess if your not ready to be married she is free to find a man who is . Either make a commitment and show her you intend to grow old with her or let someone else who is more willing fill that need.

I don't agree with her relationship with the other guy but hey , if your not prepared to go the whole way and have her by your side as your wife then her meeting other men should not affect you.


Edit: wrote this before I read Entropy3000's post , agree with the post
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## irishjoe (May 20, 2012)

Entropy3000 said:


> The problem with those wanting hard evidence is that EAs have to be dealt with early on. BEFORE innappropirate behavior becomes unfaithful. So waiting for the unfaithfulness seems less than smart.
> 
> So I fall into the camp of discussing opposite sex friends. Do His Needs Her Needs together and with the boundary setting. Why you waited this long who really knows.
> 
> ...


After your partner has connected emotionally and would rather spend time with them then you i can't help but feel that the damage is already done? I feel that if i acknowledge that she has in fact had an affair that has not physically escelated (is consummation really important?) than she has certaintly crossed a boundary that i could not forgive. If i approach her and she denies it was anything more the an innocent friendship im left with the burden of deciding the fate of not only our relationship but the stability of my daughter.


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## irishjoe (May 20, 2012)

Entropy3000 said:


> I don't think she has accepted it. You were ready to bring a child into the world but not ready to be married? So you really are not comitted to her.
> 
> I think she is looking for the things she is not getting in the relationship AND you are not married. Technically she is not even your fiance yet. You are GF and BF in an LTR. The big deal is that you have a child. Just my opinion but that should have been when you comitted if not before.


Well my response to this is that i have superficial reasons for not getting married, they have nothing to do with me not loving her or not committing to her. I've explained that i feel im too young to be married, it's not the right time for a marriage due to our work commitments and financially i would like to provide her with a great wedding day.

Our child was NOT planned, she changed her birth control and we found out she was pregant 3 months later, abortion is not something either of us agree with.


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## Eli-Zor (Nov 14, 2010)

irishjoe said:


> Well my response to this is that i have superficial reasons for not getting married, they have nothing to do with me not loving her or not committing to her. I've explained that i feel im too young to be married, it's not the right time for a marriage due to our work commitments and financially i would like to provide her with a great wedding day.
> 
> Our child was NOT planned, she changed her birth control and we found out she was pregant 3 months later, abortion is not something either of us agree with.



Your words say little to a woman who seeks commitment from a man who is willing to have sex with her and father her child . Action is what she seeks, marriage means a lot to some woman , if your not prepared to go the whole route and marry her then let her go. Making babies is easy , making a long term commitment is harder. 

You have two issues, your girl wants to be a wife - you don't want her to be yours and there is another man who is starting to connect with her.

Tough choice , let her go or change your views on marrying her.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## BigLiam (May 2, 2012)

keko said:


> You should have proposed to her much earlier(might be the reason she distanced herself from you), but at this moment try to find the truth and stop this "affair".


No. He is extremely fortunate not to have married this type of person.


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## Heheals (May 20, 2012)

She should be able to come to you if something is bothering her at work. If she can't do this that means there is a stumbling block within the relationship that needs to be addressed.

Another sign that there is a problem was the fact that she would leave two hours early to go to work, instead of desiring to spend her time with you. If it's only every once in a while I can understand. My husband occasionally likes to go on a motorcycle ride before going to work and he'll leave 30 minutes earlier than normal.

I know it's not easy, but you may wish to sit down and find out why she feels that you don't support her, or why she feels she can't talk to you. Being suspicious and searching her phone, while I can understand why you do it, will add stress to the relationship and if she hasn't told you that it bothers her and is remaining silence about it, she may have already checked out emotionally which is why she's turning to the other guy for support.

Talk with her...it sounds like there may be something that has shaken the foundation of your relationship, and everything that is happening is a symptom of it. It takes two to create a solid foundation.


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## BigLiam (May 2, 2012)

Peachy Cat said:


> I was thinking this (about her being the one pursuing), but I didn't want to kick you when you're down.
> 
> I'm hoping you're catching this early enough to fix it--perhaps your refusal to propose has prompted her to think you aren't really committed to her? That can be a huge emotional thing for a woman. NO, I don't think you should run and propose, but think about your reasons for not having done it; perhaps therein lies your problem.


Proposing would have been a huge mistake. This is a woman who cannot be trusted. Imagine how much harder it would be to disentangle if they were married.


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

irishjoe said:


> Well my response to this is that i have superficial reasons for not getting married, they have nothing to do with me not loving her or not committing to her. I've explained that i feel im too young to be married, it's not the right time for a marriage due to our work commitments and financially i would like to provide her with a great wedding day.
> 
> Our child was NOT planned, she changed her birth control and we found out she was pregant 3 months later, abortion is not something either of us agree with.


Choices. We have to live with them. Planned or not you fathered a child. You have been with a woman for seven years, have a child with her. You feel you are too young t marry and I believe you. She is not too young to be married. So she must make a choice herself. If you are too young to be married you by definition are not comitted to her at that level. You are saying this yourself.

Wedding day? Really? Seriously? 

Not trying to beat you up but these are the thinest reasons one could imagine. This seems all about you, so I agree you are too young. What would be best for her and her child?


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## Count of Monte Cristo (Mar 21, 2012)

irishjoe said:


> Well my response to this is that i have superficial reasons for not getting married, they have nothing to do with me not loving her or not committing to her. I've explained that i feel im too young to be married, it's not the right time for a marriage due to our work commitments and financially i would like to provide her with a great wedding day.
> 
> *Our child was NOT planned, she changed her birth control and we found out she was pregant 3 months later,* abortion is not something either of us agree with.


Not planned by you, maybe?


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## lovelygirl (Apr 15, 2012)

Entropy3000 said:


> Also, you have been together seven years. You guys just do not want to be married? Maybe she is tired of waiting.


If she's tired of waiting she should give him an ultimatum and not go and start an EA behind his back.


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## bryanp (Aug 25, 2011)

If the roles were reversed would she be as accepting as you have been?


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

irishjoe said:


> *After your partner has connected emotionally and would rather spend time with them then you i can't help but feel that the damage is already done?* I feel that if i acknowledge that she has in fact had an affair that has not physically escelated (is consummation really important?) than she has certaintly crossed a boundary that i could not forgive. If i approach her and she denies it was anything more the an innocent friendship im left with the burden of deciding the fate of not only our relationship but the stability of my daughter.


No. If this is caught early the damage is not already done. BUT, it does depend on your boudnaries.

If she has crossed a boundary for you that is a deal breaker then let her go and move on.

*Tell her this friendship with him is unacceptable.* You have left yourself with IMO false choices. You need no evidence. You have enough. Stop this before it grows further. We live in a shades of gray world. If she says it is innocent tell her you donlt care is has to stop. make her choose ... NOW. If she protests much and calls you jealous, insecure and controlling you know she is in an affair. if she accepts easilly then monitor it for going underground. Realize she will have to go through withdrawal.

BTW, most affairs start out as innocent friendships. The longer you wait the worse it gets. This stuff can change in a day or less. You should have stopped this when they worked together, but that is water under the bridge. Tell her she needs to go NC with this guy and then monitor it.


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

Talk to your chick and tell her you have seen some red flags and you are very concerned and want to protect your relationship. Let her talk and she will go on about this and that and might even blame you for some things.

So, after 1st statement, and you let her talk, bring up the concern about OM, Let her talk again and let her tell you all about the good friend..blah blah blah. Then put the shoe on the other foot and explain to her what she is doing as if she was you ie...all the texting, emails, and contact/meeting another women. Get it?

Once she's done try to convinence you it just friends then your last statment is all about your boundries and the consequences for crossing them.

She most likely will get defensive so rinse and repeat in what I mean is this;

Restate red flags, concerns, and protecting the relationship( do not accuse)

Restate concern for any OM without accusing her of specific OM, then switch it around as if your were behaving this way and how she would feel. 

Restate boundries and consequences


My thinking her is you have three key point to get a cross to her, stick to these points and do not get side track. If she tries to side track you about anything else, acknowledge her point and let her know that you want to stay on these three points and will adress her other issues after the two of you come to some aggreement with your boundries regarding to oppisite sex confidonts/ friends. Again do not be specif about her "friend" do not accuse. The Om is not the point, it her behavior that is the point.


Wow that was long....


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

lovelygirl said:


> If she's tired of waiting she should give him an ultimatum and not go and start an EA behind his back.


I agree. If she had posted I would have told her as much.

The difficulty with this is they truly are just GF and BF. He is not ready to marry.

But he should tell her this is unacceptable. But really they seem to be more FWBs than anything else.


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## irishjoe (May 20, 2012)

Quite a depressive thread to read, hard for me to imagine but these are probably just the initial steps of what is likely a relationship on death row.

I don't quite understand your take on the marriage part Entropy3000, I definitley see both sides to the argument and maybe i have given what she believes to be a license to accept interest from others, but my take on it is that i don't really think being married would have prevented this from happening.

Thankyou for everyones replies, nice to bounce some of my concerns of others, even more to think about now.


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## BigLiam (May 2, 2012)

Don't ever accept that your not proposing justified this.


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## Eli-Zor (Nov 14, 2010)

BigLiam said:


> Don't ever accept that your not proposing justified this.


I do agree she should not be conversing with his guy and there a re a lot of red flags. For the posters sake he must understand his view of not marrying his girl is a big part of why she must move on and find a man who loves her and commits to her . The poster is happy to have sex with her, co-habit , has a child though her yet he finds excuses not to commit in a way that gives her security in the relationship. Sounds to me like he is enjoying himself and is waiting for someone better to come along .
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

Eli-Zor said:


> I do agree she should not be conversing with his guy and there a re a lot of red flags. For the posters sake he must understand his view of not marrying his girl is a big part of why she must move on and find a man who loves her and commits to her . The poster is happy to have sex with her, co-habit , has a child though her yet he finds excuses not to commit in a way that gives her security in the relationship. Sounds to me like he is enjoying himself and is waiting for someone better to come along .
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


If she was my daughter I would be advising her to move on. 

Again they are not married and are not engaged. Yes they have a child together and that is what makes the situation so awkward.

That said, I am also saying he should insist she go NC with this friend.

This is Talk About Marriage. It makes sense to deal with LTRs here that are serious and headed towards marriage but this on a gray edge here. They are not married and such a decision is not forthcoming so this is a BF / GF situation of seven years.

OP, all this said I do hope you can cut this off with her friend and you guys can work things out.


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## Remains (Jan 24, 2012)

When u find someone you truly love and want, you absolutely want to marry. And you wouldn't care what kind of wedding day it was. Is it her that wants the 'big wedding' day, or is that just your excuse to postpone? It sounds to me that you are not sure this woman is for you. And so, if you don't want to marry her, it seems to me that you don't love her on that true deep off the scale level. And if so, maybe it is time to take a long hard look at the relationship.

You want her to be honest and up front with you about this level of friendship, EA, PA, whatever, come to you with problems in the relationship, and yet you don't seem to be being up front with her, with how you feel, with your worries about this other relationship. But also, you don't seem to want to find hard evidence either. You seem to be just sitting on the fence waiting for the inevitable. And you are ready to ditch her even if it was just a 'friendship' just because she obviously wanted more. But you're not ditching her. Or talking to her. Or anything. What do you want out of this relationship? 

And I disagree with an earlier poster about the fact that if you request her to cut off this other 'relationship' and she calls you jealous or controlling she is having an affair and if she happily does it then she is not. People who have not been affected by infidelity work in a whole different way to those that have. And those on this site are completely in the 'know' about all the steps that must be done etc. Usually after long marriages and so on. Here is the place of experience. But most people do not operate this way and are not this clued up. Even those who have been cheated on and come hear for the 1st time, you can hear the naivete in their 1st post. Their guilt at wanting to snoop, never mind snooping itself. As you said yourself, you didn't know of an EA til you came here. Neither did I. I used to have many male friends, still have a few, one of them a very good drinking and pool mate, I used to stay over at his house after a night out. I never cheated on my partner whom I had been with for 11 years, and deeply unhappy for the last 6 years. This mate was extremely handsome, I could have cheated easily, but I didn't. Yes it was probably an EA. I would have happily done all I did with him with a girl too. Pool, drinks, staying over. And yet that would not have been an EA. I have strong boundaries though. But I don't think many people do. I have always had male friends. And I would chat with them about my problems too, just like my female friends. And if my partner had told me to rid myself of them all, considering there was absolutely no history of cheating, I would have called him controlling. I would have been very unhappy. I was unhappy anyway. And I would have sacrificed the relationship for someone who was asking such a lot of me for no good reason. He would be being a total arse and I would not tolerate that. Do I think your Mrs is in this same situation? Absolutely not! No way. She is getting dressed up for him, going into work 2 hours early for no good reason. Sounds like she is trying to avoid u at the very least with the work thing. And definitely trying to entice him. Should you see this as a dealbreaker? Up to you, but you cannot say you have never been attracted to another woman since you have been with her. And yet you don't want to talk with her and put the brakes on what she is doing. Don't want to bring her back to reality. Sounds like you are as removed from this relationship as she is. Except you haven't found another person to distract you (...yet? Would you do that if you found someone 'worth' it? and if not, doesn't matter really because you don't seem to be doing much to improve the relationship either. Sorry.) 

Do I think man woman friendships are innocent? Not really. But then I have since been hit by terrible betrayal (a different man to the 11 yr one) and I see things very differently now. I am also now in a relationship with the first man in my life that I ever wanted to marry and spend every bit of the rest of my life with. No question. No lack of surety. Absolutely definitely. I think you know when you have found the one you want to keep.


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