# Taken me years to finally get <<<thisclose>>> - financial questions



## LilMissSunshine (Apr 10, 2015)

Hello -

I really would like some input from a financial standpoint on whether or not I need to just suck it up given my age, OR if I am looking at this all wrong. I won't go into my backstory, but anyone can search if you want to read more. Essentially married for 25 years, me 53 him 55. Very unhappy over the last 6 years (me) - anger management and LD/HD issues. I have been to counseling now off an on for six years. He went once and refuses to go back. Too many things to say about the anger management. LD issue is very likely low-T but he wants no part of getting it checked (he did and started treatment for it about 10 years ago and life was GREAT - HE didn't see it making a difference so QUIT taking the shots, even though I saw a definite difference). He is "content" with the way things are now (have been roommates since September of last year, per my recollections - not so much as a "real" kiss, though he will give me a peck along with the kids every morning and night. So AFFECTION is there, but no 'real' relationship or desire, and that has soooooo left me broken inside - too much to get into with that, but leave it to say I am broken inside and feel neglected, unwanted, and unloved).

So - I have mentally and emotionally accepted that things are NOT going to change with either of the two issues. This is HUGE for me. For YEARS - documented by postings on this board - I have went back and forth with indecision about these two issues. No more. I'm mentally and emotionally "there" knowing nothing is going to change. I'm at the point now of considering FINANCES.

What should I consider? Up until the last year I had been working PT over the years on a contractual basis, so no benefits. I changed that earlier this year and now have a non-contract job with insurance and other benefits. I make 60% of what he makes in salary, but probably enough to live on. While I didn't get benefits, I did manage to save a reasonable chunk in an IRA over 25 years time.

My questions and "facts" so I can get some thoughts on my situation.

1. I keep reading 'horror stories' of women going into poverty once they are divorced. I feel like i have worked so hard over the years and now I will have to give up so much of that all because there is no sexual interest in my marriage. Is it really WORTH IT? How many women (or men, for that matter) really have a drastically-reduced lifestyle after divorce? And what exactly is the direct cause of that poverty in most cases? And is "roommate status" really enough of a reason to mess with financial security???

2. We have a lot of equity in our home thanks for skyrocketing home costs here in the last 5 years (bought the home 15 years ago). I could take half of any proceeds and buy a small condo outright and have no mortgage, so no issue there. And actually, would not mind having NO outside maintenance and a smaller home with kids soon to leave the nest, living in big home for years and all that comes with that (costly repairs, etc.).

3. We did well funding both kids college accounts and one has a scholarship so we will have no issues taking care of this regardless of what happens. TG for that. One is in college, second year, and the other is 16 and at home. I keep thinking I can hold out 2 more years 'til the youngest is gone, but I am LONELY. Sometimes I get SOO sad and upset. FYI, I am not overweight, get compliments routinely from everybody EXCEPT my H, it seems - there is no issue with me not being attractive to an average, every day person.

4. Retirement - I have been told I need $1 million to ever retire. I am already 53. I have less than $250,000 in retirement saved up, so only a quarter. He has about the same. So we wouldn't have to "split" anything, but we don't have anything near what we will need. And what we can contribute these last ten years (or 12, or 15, depending on how you look at it) would be even LESS given that we are over 50. How much of a show-stopper is this issue alone??

5. I do have two degrees and presently am gainfully employed, so there isn't an issue of being a housewife for a long time that would need some retraining, BUT, the workforce is always a gamble with layoffs, economic crises, etc. I am in a specialized field that doesn't pay a huge amount and also isn't plentiful with opportunities, so there is some concern.

What are my financial prospects making such a big decision at age 53? Do any of the things I outline above make it less likely I will wind up destitute and on the streets one day? My H is in a job where he can stay the remainder of his career and make good money doing it. And my income just pads our accounts more for retirement, which would be awesome for BOTH of us. We would pretty much be "set" barring any unforeseen disasters. But yet I cannot get past this "roommate" thing and feeling like I am wasting my life away. Not to mention the anger. Which seems to be better when I'm not asking "why can't we be more than roommates" - which I have quit asking about for quite some time.

Thoughts? I finally have gotten past the emotional issues of thinking things are going to change and thinking practically now. I sooo wish it had not come to this, but it has and now I am STUCK. And now am worried about finances. I have never been on my own. EVER.


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## Thor (Oct 31, 2011)

*Re: Taken me years to finally get <<<thisclose>>> - financial questions*

Your happiness is worth it.

You can live on a lot less than you think.

I divorced at 55, lost half my retirement, and enough from the house to put a downpayment on a small low cost townhome. Stiil it was worth it! My retirement savings are not a whole lot more than yours. I’ll never have 1 million or even very close to it.

Women tend to do poorly in divorce when they try to keep the house for the kids but can’t really afford it. It doesn’t sound like you are at risk of being irresponsible. My advice is don’t put off D because of the finances. The longer you wait the older you’ll be and the harder it will be to recover financially.


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

*Re: Taken me years to finally get <<<thisclose>>> - financial questions*

You are already committed to divorce. You are now fifty percent on your way.

Your way out.

It is 'very' good that you watch your money, that you are aware of all the costs associated with life and living.

Living with a man you do not love makes you a bought woman.

During this two year period before your youngest leaves the home, get a better paying job, one with benefits.

Network, talk to friends and family. One of them may find a position for you.

When you are in a better position, file for divorce, move out.

At that time you are officially paid up. Heck, you were paid up years ago.

Good Luck!




[THRD]


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

*Re: Taken me years to finally get <<<thisclose>>> - financial questions*

Did you figure in your Social Security payments in what you will need for retirement?


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## LilMissSunshine (Apr 10, 2015)

*Re: Taken me years to finally get <<<thisclose>>> - financial questions*

No, Elegirl, I did not. I have read so many articles in the past that say not to count on SS. Maybe it's "sky is falling" thinking, but I just didn't factor that in. Do you think I am wrong in excluding that? I get an annual statement from them. It would be a reasonable check if it is actually there and available to me. 

I also thought that in another 10 years, the $250'ish I have should grow to $496,000 in 10 years if I do nothing and it averages 8% (of course cost of living/inflation is in effect and that $496 won't go as far as it would today. Of course I would plan on adding to it as much as I could in the next 10-12 years.

Am I being too gloom and doom here? I would have a paid for condo, MAYBE SS, and the $496,000 nest egg (unless the market crashes). Is that do-able for a single person???




EleGirl said:


> Did you figure in your Social Security payments in what you will need for retirement?


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## LilMissSunshine (Apr 10, 2015)

*Re: Taken me years to finally get <<<thisclose>>> - financial questions*

Yes, I did get a job with insurance, so that is one less thing to have to worry about. I am just sad that it has come to this. NOt what I wanted or expected at all. And of course now am worried about being able to make it work financially. I WOULD love him if he would love me back.



SunCMars said:


> You are already committed to divorce. You are now fifty percent on your way.
> 
> Your way out.
> 
> ...


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## LilMissSunshine (Apr 10, 2015)

*Re: Taken me years to finally get <<<thisclose>>> - financial questions*

Sounds like we have some similarities, Thor. I thought about waiting 'til the youngest turned 18, but then that's just kicking the can down the road and I'll be another few years older. I Googled "average retirement savings" and for my age, I am above where most people are, but it just seems so inadequate. The two of us could live quite comfortably and have a nice retirement with NO worries - if I could get past the loneliness. We have differences in affection levels and always have. It's just more pronounced with one kid gone and the other never home with activities. It's a shame THAT is what keeps us from being able to work this out. If I could get past that need of "more than a roommate" I wouldn't have to worry about all of this.

So what has been the most challenging thing for you so far financially? Did you buy the condo outright or still have to get a loan?

Also, the whole reason for the falling apart was affection. I sure won't resolve THAT by being alone. Yet I don't want to get into another relationship that is likely to have all kinds of other baggage and worse than what I was already dealing with. It just seems like a catch-22. What was the reason for your split, if I might ask?



Thor said:


> Your happiness is worth it.
> 
> You can live on a lot less than you think.
> 
> ...


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

*Re: Taken me years to finally get <<<thisclose>>> - financial questions*



LilMissSunshine said:


> I WOULD love him if he would love me back.


Isn't that often the case...:frown2:

It takes two to make a marriage. 


Right now you only have a marriage license.
It will not keep you warm at night.
A paper kiss is paper thin and not enough to sustain you.


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## Married but Happy (Aug 13, 2013)

*Re: Taken me years to finally get <<<thisclose>>> - financial questions*

I think you are actually in good shape, financially. I could retire very comfortably now with about $1M for TWO people, but of course life style will determine what you need - or want. We expect to travel a lot.

Your current retirement savings will probably grow, if kept in stocks (and the market doesn't crash). Several types of index fund might be your best choice to provide some diversification. I would also suggest looking into high yield stocks (paying dividends), or ETFs (Exchange Traded Funds) that do the work for you and invest in a variety of high dividend stocks and/or exchange traded notes. There are many that yield from 4% to 11% that also have some growth potential (REITs are one example), but the dividend provides some protection from downward price moves. Reinvest those dividends automatically now, and when you retire, take them in cash for income.

If you can afford to add to your retirement funds, you can add up to $24,500 per year to a 401k with the age 50+ catch-up contribution allowance. You can also add $6,500 to an IRA - I suggest Roth versions for both 401k and IRA, if you can afford to pay taxes now, rather than defer them. Over 10 years, that's over $300,000 more, and that will grow, too.

Your main concern might be affordable health insurance until you qualify for Medicare, if your job does not provide coverage. That is our key constraint in planning.


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## wilson (Nov 5, 2012)

*Re: Taken me years to finally get <<<thisclose>>> - financial questions*

A lot of times the reason women do poorly financially after a divorce is because they haven't been working. If you had been out of the workforce for decades, it's understandable it would be very difficult to get a well paying job. It sounds like you don't have anything to worry about on that front. There's no reason to think you'll have a financial meltdown just because you get divorced. However, it does seem like your employment situation is a little precarious. You should expand your skills, network with people in the industry, be on the lookout for better opportunities, etc. so that you can better handle any downturn. Also, keep a good amount in savings to carry you through a few months of job searching.

What are the laws for spousal support in your state? Since your income is so different, you might qualify for support payments for some period of time.

You mention buying a condo of your own. I might recommend renting for a year after the divorce. Although it doesn't make as much financial sense, it can be a much simpler lifestyle. So rent for a year so you have time to look around and find what you want. You may end up finding a great opportunity in another city, for example.


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## Thor (Oct 31, 2011)

*Re: Taken me years to finally get <<<thisclose>>> - financial questions*



LilMissSunshine said:


> Sounds like we have some similarities, Thor. I thought about waiting 'til the youngest turned 18, but then that's just kicking the can down the road and I'll be another few years older. I Googled "average retirement savings" and for my age, I am above where most people are, but it just seems so inadequate. The two of us could live quite comfortably and have a nice retirement with NO worries - if I could get past the loneliness. We have differences in affection levels and always have. It's just more pronounced with one kid gone and the other never home with activities. It's a shame THAT is what keeps us from being able to work this out. If I could get past that need of "more than a roommate" I wouldn't have to worry about all of this.
> 
> So what has been the most challenging thing for you so far financially? Did you buy the condo outright or still have to get a loan?
> 
> Also, the whole reason for the falling apart was affection. I sure won't resolve THAT by being alone. Yet I don't want to get into another relationship that is likely to have all kinds of other baggage and worse than what I was already dealing with. It just seems like a catch-22. What was the reason for your split, if I might ask?


Sooner = better. And the less you can afford to get divorced the better timing it is for you. I know that seems counter-intuitive, but imagine you had $2million in your retirement account and a high paying job. You’d stand to lose tons in the divorce as well as pay him alimony for life!

My plan had she demanded alimony and the judge awarded it was to buy a trailer. You can live on a lot less than you are now. I had to sell my beautiful German automobile. But the replacement gets me places safely and is quite ok from a social acceptability standpoint. Adapt and overcome!

I got about $100k out of the house and lost half my 401k/IRA savings. The house equity did not pay outeight for my townhome, so I have a mortgage. I am making extra payments so there will be no debt hen I retire. I bought the lowest cost home I could find which wouldn’t embarass me to have people visit.

While things aren’t as financially good as they were before, I am Captain of this ship! There is always the possibility of remarrying or living with someone and thus having a good combined retirement. Also, getting rid of all the emotional baggage of your bad marriage will enable you to find and take advantage of new opportunities.

Don’t let your finances keep you in a bad marriage.

And to be a bit indelicate perhaps, your market value on the singles scene goes down every yewr you get older (as does mine).


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## LilMissSunshine (Apr 10, 2015)

*Re: Taken me years to finally get <<<thisclose>>> - financial questions*

I surely hope so. I don't want to do international travel, but some local travel would be nice. I've already BTDT with the international travel and really not much left I would want to see. There is no way I can add $24,500 per year. I think I'll be lucky to add $10,000. But I'll do what I can. It's all so scary. Just not having anyone to fall back on. But not a good reason to stay in a R where there are fights every other week and lack of affection. I'm really struggling making a decision that in my heart probably is the right one to make. I hate to make it all about $$, but it is an important consideration. Thanks, MBH.



Married but Happy said:


> I think you are actually in good shape, financially. I could retire very comfortably now with about $1M for TWO people, but of course life style will determine what you need - or want. We expect to travel a lot.
> 
> Your current retirement savings will probably grow, if kept in stocks (and the market doesn't crash). Several types of index fund might be your best choice to provide some diversification. I would also suggest looking into high yield stocks (paying dividends), or ETFs (Exchange Traded Funds) that do the work for you and invest in a variety of high dividend stocks and/or exchange traded notes. There are many that yield from 4% to 11% that also have some growth potential (REITs are one example), but the dividend provides some protection from downward price moves. Reinvest those dividends automatically now, and when you retire, take them in cash for income.
> 
> ...


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## LilMissSunshine (Apr 10, 2015)

*Re: Taken me years to finally get <<<thisclose>>> - financial questions*

YES - that makes sense (sooner = better). And I am "lucky" in that I have been told I look at least 15 years younger than I really am thanks to being a health nut, I'm sure. I think I could get a very small mortgage and pay it off in 15 years.........and like you said, would be my own captain. My H makes significantly more than I do. He will not want to pay A. and we had discussed this before about not wanting to drag through court so WE would present something to a mediator that outlined everything. Which means I would need to agree to his terms (zero A. or else we would be dragging through court), so I won't have that as a buffer. I certainly won't be paying him, as I make significantly less. Fortunately our 401ks are about even so we do have that. I don't wish him anything bad. I don't. But i am really struggling knowing what to do. The loneliness and "roommate" status is about to kill me. I'm a very touchy-feely kind of person. He says he just can't become that and not to try and 'change' him. I get that, but I also wonder if I was important enough to him if he wouldn't try to accomodate just a little. I think I have my answer. 




Thor said:


> Sooner = better. And the less you can afford to get divorced the better timing it is for you. I know that seems counter-intuitive, but imagine you had $2million in your retirement account and a high paying job. You’d stand to lose tons in the divorce as well as pay him alimony for life!
> 
> My plan had she demanded alimony and the judge awarded it was to buy a trailer. You can live on a lot less than you are now. I had to sell my beautiful German automobile. But the replacement gets me places safely and is quite ok from a social acceptability standpoint. Adapt and overcome!
> 
> ...


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## FeministInPink (Sep 13, 2012)

*Re: Taken me years to finally get <<<thisclose>>> - financial questions*



LilMissSunshine said:


> YES - that makes sense (sooner = better). And I am "lucky" in that I have been told I look at least 15 years younger than I really am thanks to being a health nut, I'm sure. I think I could get a very small mortgage and pay it off in 15 years.........and like you said, would be my own captain. My H makes significantly more than I do. He will not want to pay A. and we had discussed this before about not wanting to drag through court so WE would present something to a mediator that outlined everything. Which means I would need to agree to his terms (zero A. or else we would be dragging through court), so I won't have that as a buffer. I certainly won't be paying him, as I make significantly less. Fortunately our 401ks are about even so we do have that. I don't wish him anything bad. I don't. But i am really struggling knowing what to do. The loneliness and "roommate" status is about to kill me. I'm a very touchy-feely kind of person. He says he just can't become that and not to try and 'change' him. I get that, but I also wonder if I was important enough to him if he wouldn't try to accomodate just a little. I think I have my answer.


In lieu of alimony, you could justifiably ask for a settlement beyond 50% of assets.

Don't sell yourself short because he's threatening to drag it out.

Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk


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## wilson (Nov 5, 2012)

*Re: Taken me years to finally get <<<thisclose>>> - financial questions*

Yeah, definitely talk to a lawyer to know your rights. The first consultation is often free or at reduced cost. 

I know alimony often gets a bad rap, but often I feel it's justified when kids are involved. In most cases, one spouse (usually the wife), has to put her career on the hold to take more parenting responsibilities. The other spouse (usually the husband), gets to stay in their career at full speed. So then decades later when they divorce, the H's income far eclipses whatever income the W has from part-time and low-paying jobs that gave her the flexibility to be the caregiver. I think it's fair to compensate the W in cases like that for the time she was out of the workforce.


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## Thor (Oct 31, 2011)

*Re: Taken me years to finally get <<<thisclose>>> - financial questions*

Definitely don’t give away the farm. It seems to be a common first reaction when accepting the reality of being ready to divorce. Perhaps a bit of feeling guilty or not wanting to hurt your stbx. There was a time I would have walked away with nothing.

Seek an outcome fair to you. If some form of alimony would be fair then it is fair. Trading off for more cash out of the house is also a good option. He would have no recurring payments to make, you’d have more cash to buy a new home, and once signed off the divorce would be finished with nothing hanging over either one of you.


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## Thor (Oct 31, 2011)

*Re: Taken me years to finally get <<<thisclose>>> - financial questions*

You’d asked eqrlier what was most challenging financially and also the reason for the split.

Financially the toughest was the logistics of buying a new home. The banks here don’t loan while a divorce is in process because they don’t know what the divorce outcome will be. My now xw agreed to wait to file papers until I was approved, but since I already was on 1 mortgage the new home had to be an investment property mortgage which was a higher interest rate. I refinanced it a year after the divorce back to a lower rate. The cost was equivalent to renting for a couple of years, which was the other option, to move into a rental first and then buy (and move into) something else.

The reason for the split was her ongoing lack of loyalty. Emotional and financial infidelity, probable multiple PAs, as well as other crap involving lies, deceptions, and medical stuff with the kids.


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## Bananapeel (May 4, 2015)

*Re: Taken me years to finally get <<<thisclose>>> - financial questions*

The rules for alimony vary based on your state of residence so you may or may not be able to get any. I personally think you are in bad shape for retirement. However, we're lucky we have choices in how we live and you can compensate for the low funds by having a cheaper lifestyle. So let's say you only have $500,000 and SS when you're ready to retire. Well, you might have to settle for a studio apartment, or buy a condo in a worse neighborhood, or move to a different state with a lower cost of living, or work beyond turning 65. You have plenty of choices on ways to finance your retirement so instead of focusing on whether you'll have enough for your imagined future lifestyle focus on what you will actually have and figure out a plan to live within that budget. Remember there are people way worse off than you that still manage, but they do that by having a different lifestyle than you do.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

*Re: Taken me years to finally get <<<thisclose>>> - financial questions*



LilMissSunshine said:


> Am I being too gloom and doom here? I would have a paid for condo, MAYBE SS, and the $496,000 nest egg (unless the market crashes). Is that do-able for a single person???


That should be totally doable. The only expenses you'll have are taxes, insurance, utilities, maybe one more car in your future, and daily necessities. The only thing I would add is to invest in excellent long-term disability insurance (not one that's dependent on you being employed) so that if you have an accident or illness, your bills are still covered. 

And who knows? You may end up newly married in a couple years so it's all moot.


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

*Re: Taken me years to finally get <<<thisclose>>> - financial questions*

Is it worth it??

YES
YES
YES
YES
YES
YES
YES
YES
YES

You sound much better off financially than probably the majority of us who are reading and/or going through it. You'll be fine! Better than fine, you'll be HAPPY!


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## LilMissSunshine (Apr 10, 2015)

*Re: Taken me years to finally get <<<thisclose>>> - financial questions*

Yes, that sounds about right. And I WILL be adding to that nest egg, just will vary each year as to how much. I am using for THIS example the assumption that I will ADD NO MORE to it, but that is not going to be the case. I just see these online stats about how far behind others are that have so much less, but then another article/stats say that I am wayyy under-funded. It can be very confusing! Good thought on the disability! I need to investigate that!

Oh - NEVER getting married again, I guess I'm a cynic. I believe in love, just also know what all of the legalities entail. Wonder why I didn't realize that in my 20's, lol? Sooo naive.



turnera said:


> That should be totally doable. The only expenses you'll have are taxes, insurance, utilities, maybe one more car in your future, and daily necessities. The only thing I would add is to invest in excellent long-term disability insurance (not one that's dependent on you being employed) so that if you have an accident or illness, your bills are still covered.
> 
> And who knows? You may end up newly married in a couple years so it's all moot.


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## LilMissSunshine (Apr 10, 2015)

*Re: Taken me years to finally get <<<thisclose>>> - financial questions*

Thanks, Bananapeel - I should have stated that this is what I would likely have if I added NOTHING to it from this point forward. I do NOT intent to do that. So this would truly be 'worse case" scenario. But I get the whole lifestyle point. And that makes perfect sense. I think what you are saying is there is some creativity as to how one might fund their retirement - i.e., choose a different neighborhood (or even state), different dwelling, etc. Makes perfect sense! I definitely will be adding to that figure, just using it as a 'worse case".



Bananapeel said:


> The rules for alimony vary based on your state of residence so you may or may not be able to get any. I personally think you are in bad shape for retirement. However, we're lucky we have choices in how we live and you can compensate for the low funds by having a cheaper lifestyle. So let's say you only have $500,000 and SS when you're ready to retire. Well, you might have to settle for a studio apartment, or buy a condo in a worse neighborhood, or move to a different state with a lower cost of living, or work beyond turning 65. You have plenty of choices on ways to finance your retirement so instead of focusing on whether you'll have enough for your imagined future lifestyle focus on what you will actually have and figure out a plan to live within that budget. Remember there are people way worse off than you that still manage, but they do that by having a different lifestyle than you do.


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## LilMissSunshine (Apr 10, 2015)

*Re: Taken me years to finally get <<<thisclose>>> - financial questions*

I didn't think about that with a mortgage. What would they do with a re-finance/ buy-out if you decided to stay where you were and buy-out the spouse to keep the current residence? And maybe BEFORE one officially filed? Wonder if that would make a difference. I guess not filing like what you stated below would work? Wonder if the rate would be higher in my case? 

Sounds like for those reasons you needed to get out. That sounds awful.



Thor said:


> You’d asked eqrlier what was most challenging financially and also the reason for the split.
> 
> Financially the toughest was the logistics of buying a new home. The banks here don’t loan while a divorce is in process because they don’t know what the divorce outcome will be. My now xw agreed to wait to file papers until I was approved, but since I already was on 1 mortgage the new home had to be an investment property mortgage which was a higher interest rate. I refinanced it a year after the divorce back to a lower rate. The cost was equivalent to renting for a couple of years, which was the other option, to move into a rental first and then buy (and move into) something else.
> 
> The reason for the split was her ongoing lack of loyalty. Emotional and financial infidelity, probable multiple PAs, as well as other crap involving lies, deceptions, and medical stuff with the kids.


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## LilMissSunshine (Apr 10, 2015)

*Re: Taken me years to finally get <<<thisclose>>> - financial questions*

3X, not so sure I am any better off, but it is scary now matter how one looks at it. It can be very overwhelming, for sure. I don't know why I have such a hard time making decisions in general. Every day random decisions not so much, big ones (big purchases, schools for kids, employment, THIS) I do horrible going back and forth.



3Xnocharm said:


> Is it worth it??
> 
> YES
> YES
> ...


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

*Re: Taken me years to finally get <<<thisclose>>> - financial questions*

Fear will keep you in place if you let it. 

It's easier for many to fear acting and that includes many decisions -- not only divorce. Many stay married because they can't handle the stress of divorce and it certainly IS stressful. No doubt about that. It's also worth every moment of that stress.


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## Thor (Oct 31, 2011)

*Re: Taken me years to finally get <<<thisclose>>> - financial questions*



LilMissSunshine said:


> I didn't think about that with a mortgage. What would they do with a re-finance/ buy-out if you decided to stay where you were and buy-out the spouse to keep the current residence? And maybe BEFORE one officially filed? Wonder if that would make a difference. I guess not filing like what you stated below would work? Wonder if the rate would be higher in my case?
> 
> Sounds like for those reasons you needed to get out. That sounds awful.


Idk about a buyout before the divorce is filed. It may be difficult to explain that to a loan officer. Usually the divorce decree instructs one spouse to sign the house over, and the other to pay some amount over, which happens after the divorce is signed. (Because it is a court order there are no real risks). There would be some time span involved to allow a normal opportunity to refinance, whatever that would be where you live. If it were me keeping the house and if the divorce were uncontested, I would start talks early with your bank. Though they may not give final approval before the divorce is signed by the judge, if you have all the financial details of the settlment and your income/debts they should be able to tell you what kind of chance you have to get approval etc. Then when the judge signs the final papers you pull the trigger with the bank to finalize the refinance in your name.

If you’re looking to stay in the home be sure you really can afford it. That’s the #1 way divorced women end up bankrupt when they keep the house, usually for the kids, but cannot really afford it.

Btw, use a lawyer at least for advice in the background even if you have an amicable mediation. I used a lawyer to do the paperwork on transferring the house to my x just to be sure it was done right. No need to have problems crop up years later if she defaults on the mortgage, gets sued by someone hurt on the property, or some other future legal technicality.


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## Not (Jun 12, 2017)

*Re: Taken me years to finally get <<<thisclose>>> - financial questions*

Staying for the financial stability crossed my mind as well but my unhappiness had become such a constant weight that I couldn’t take it anymore. I had planned on staying until my D16 graduated but things were just to bad and I think he was beginning to see that it was over and I knew that meant things might get even worse. 

You are far ahead of where I was with my divorce. I was able to outright buy a condo and pay off my car which allows me to live mostly worry free on my income but that left me with very little for retirement. No alimony. 12k only to start off my retirement fund. I had to chose one scenario or the other. I decided to save myself 120k in mortgage interest and then do the best I can to save and invest with what I can afford each month. I will also have a state funded retirement when I retire but my account is brand new. I have 20 years for it to grow though. 

You sound like you would be starting out on your own on pretty solid ground. Numbers wise you won’t have as much as you would if you stayed married but staying for that reason is not fair to you or your H, for a number of reasons. 

You mentioned that you would still be alone if you divorced. I moved out about 10 weeks ago and it is lonely but I know that part of that loneliness is me missing having my family together, it’s very quiet now. Its foreign. It’s taking some getting used to. Another things that plays a part in the loneliness is that I haven’t yet put myself “out there” to meet new people and start building a new life. My D16 is not ready for that and for her I will gladly wait but it’s still lonely. Also, it’s a different kind of lonely. It’s so different than the loneliness of living in the same house with a spouse who no longer cares, no sex for 8 years and constant stress. This loneliness doesn’t feel so heavy, it’s just quiet instead and feels like a sort of yearning to get moving. It’s not like the kind of loneliness that drags you down like a one ton weight. Also, you will know (after D) that you can make changes at any time, whenever you’re ready, to put yourself out there. You would be the only thing stopping yourself but give yourself as much time as you feel you need. You can do anything you want in any way you want according to whatever timeline you choose.


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## Herschel (Mar 27, 2016)

*Re: Taken me years to finally get <<<thisclose>>> - financial questions*

Regarding sticking it out for a few more years to save up versus leaving now. This will sound slightly dark, but at 53 years old, the next 2-3 years of your life are WAY more important than the last 2-3 years where you may not even know your name or get cancer or something else terrible. Maybe you don’t even make it to 65, you have a heart attack. 

My point is, live for today. Today is the day you will feel the best for the rest of your life. Don’t waste it in a deadend marriage. There is something new and exciting out there for you and you can wallow for a few more years wasting more of your precious life, hoping to get it one day or you can start living today and live for the moment. I guess the dark part is that if you run out of money, just bite a bullet. Or go live with your kids. I don’t know your kids, so, you choose which is more palatable.


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## cma62 (Jul 31, 2010)

*Re: Taken me years to finally get <<<thisclose>>> - financial questions*

You are much better off than a lot of women that have left their marriages.
You can survive and thrive on that
Your sanity and well being is much more important than money
Granted , you need it to live, but I’m sure you are willing to make sacrifices in your lifestyle to be free from a marriage that is making your well being suffer and your self esteem down the toilet.


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## LilMissSunshine (Apr 10, 2015)

*Re: Taken me years to finally get <<<thisclose>>> - financial questions*

Thanks, Thor - based on the last time we had this discussion about splitting up (January), we both agreed if we went through with it, it would be uncontested. In my area, believe it or not, it is cheaper for me to re-finance 1/2 the value of the house than it is to pay rent. We are in a high-rent area. I can actually live here for about $500 less per month and have a large home as opposed to a small, 2 bedroom apartment. I did a pre-approval thing with a lender and was approved for twice what I would be taking out, and found out I had a great credit score - woohoo!! Hallelujah for all of that. Having said that, taking out a 15 year loan at my age, I will be 70 when it is paid off - which I am not thrilled about. I may do the buy-out, stay here for a few years (would be great to not have yet ANOTHER change to deal with after everything else changing), then buy a low-maintenance condo with NO YARD to deal with or other costly repairs that this house seems to always need.



Thor said:


> Idk about a buyout before the divorce is filed. It may be difficult to explain that to a loan officer. Usually the divorce decree instructs one spouse to sign the house over, and the other to pay some amount over, which happens after the divorce is signed. (Because it is a court order there are no real risks). There would be some time span involved to allow a normal opportunity to refinance, whatever that would be where you live. If it were me keeping the house and if the divorce were uncontested, I would start talks early with your bank. Though they may not give final approval before the divorce is signed by the judge, if you have all the financial details of the settlment and your income/debts they should be able to tell you what kind of chance you have to get approval etc. Then when the judge signs the final papers you pull the trigger with the bank to finalize the refinance in your name.
> 
> If you’re looking to stay in the home be sure you really can afford it. That’s the #1 way divorced women end up bankrupt when they keep the house, usually for the kids, but cannot really afford it.
> 
> Btw, use a lawyer at least for advice in the background even if you have an amicable mediation. I used a lawyer to do the paperwork on transferring the house to my x just to be sure it was done right. No need to have problems crop up years later if she defaults on the mortgage, gets sued by someone hurt on the property, or some other future legal technicality.


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## LilMissSunshine (Apr 10, 2015)

*Re: Taken me years to finally get <<<thisclose>>> - financial questions*

That's great, NOT, if you were able to get your condo outright. I also am considering getting a condo with any proceeds from the house, BUT, as I shared with Thor, might also just keep the house for a while and 'work my way into' yet another change - so much changing already. It truly is cheaper to buy in my area than it is to rent. Rent is OUTRAGEOUS. I was shocked when i started researching. Did you not ask for alimony? My H makes a lot more than I do, but I honestly wonder if it is worth it to just be done with it to ask for no alimony. Seriously. What was your reason for not receiving alimony?

Also, wondering about the 8 years of no affection or intimacy. How did that happen if you don't mind me asking? It's not nearly that long here and there is some affection, but he has for a long time been very LD, and we are very, very incompatible in that area. After a while, not having him interested in me 'in that way' it really started bothering me and really making me feel so unattractive, unwanted, unloved - doesn't matter what else he does, I just need that connection to feel like it is a marriage. Otherwise, it's just a very friendly roommate kind of thing - which I HATE. Do people really go on like that in marriage?? I can't think that is the norm.

Yes, at some point I would put myself out there, but who knows when. I will need time to get past all of the changes I know will be very DIFFERENT to me.



Not said:


> Staying for the financial stability crossed my mind as well but my unhappiness had become such a constant weight that I couldn’t take it anymore. I had planned on staying until my D16 graduated but things were just to bad and I think he was beginning to see that it was over and I knew that meant things might get even worse.
> 
> You are far ahead of where I was with my divorce. I was able to outright buy a condo and pay off my car which allows me to live mostly worry free on my income but that left me with very little for retirement. No alimony. 12k only to start off my retirement fund. I had to chose one scenario or the other. I decided to save myself 120k in mortgage interest and then do the best I can to save and invest with what I can afford each month. I will also have a state funded retirement when I retire but my account is brand new. I have 20 years for it to grow though.
> 
> ...


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## LilMissSunshine (Apr 10, 2015)

*Re: Taken me years to finally get <<<thisclose>>> - financial questions*

Great words of wisdom, Herschel. None of us are getting any younger. I have given it SIX years to improve. I see what you are saying, the next 2-3 are definitely more important than the last 2-3. I could go on thinking this is the year things change, and that could happen for YEARS. At some point, one has to just realize it simply is NOT going to change. The intellectual side of me knows it, but the heart just keeps hoping.



Herschel said:


> Regarding sticking it out for a few more years to save up versus leaving now. This will sound slightly dark, but at 53 years old, the next 2-3 years of your life are WAY more important than the last 2-3 years where you may not even know your name or get cancer or something else terrible. Maybe you don’t even make it to 65, you have a heart attack.
> 
> My point is, live for today. Today is the day you will feel the best for the rest of your life. Don’t waste it in a deadend marriage. There is something new and exciting out there for you and you can wallow for a few more years wasting more of your precious life, hoping to get it one day or you can start living today and live for the moment. I guess the dark part is that if you run out of money, just bite a bullet. Or go live with your kids. I don’t know your kids, so, you choose which is more palatable.


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## LilMissSunshine (Apr 10, 2015)

*Re: Taken me years to finally get <<<thisclose>>> - financial questions*

It's scary, cma62............but I truly COULD be worse off and I know that. I feel like I am giving up so much. But maybe my focus needs to be on what I am GAINING - peace, no fighting, better environment for the kids, and possibility of finding a more compatible relationship in the coming years. And yes, my self-esteem has taken a blow from feeling so unwanted, unheard, and like something is "wrong" with me.



cma62 said:


> You are much better off than a lot of women that have left their marriages.
> You can survive and thrive on that
> Your sanity and well being is much more important than money
> Granted , you need it to live, but I’m sure you are willing to make sacrifices in your lifestyle to be free from a marriage that is making your well being suffer and your self esteem down the toilet.


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## Not (Jun 12, 2017)

*Re: Taken me years to finally get <<<thisclose>>> - financial questions*



LilMissSunshine said:


> That's great, NOT, if you were able to get your condo outright. I also am considering getting a condo with any proceeds from the house, BUT, as I shared with Thor, might also just keep the house for a while and 'work my way into' yet another change - so much changing already. It truly is cheaper to buy in my area than it is to rent. Rent is OUTRAGEOUS. I was shocked when i started researching. Did you not ask for alimony? My H makes a lot more than I do, but I honestly wonder if it is worth it to just be done with it to ask for no alimony. Seriously. What was your reason for not receiving alimony?


There is no alimony in my state but even if there had been I’m not sure I would have gone for it with circumstances as they were with my xH. Didn’t you say your H threatened you not to go for alimony? That’s a tough call to make. He could make life hell by dragging things through the court system which would then burn through some serious cash and you’d end up with huge attorneys fees but if alimony is allowed in your state and you ask for something reasonable for a reasonable time period he may not have a leg to stand on in court. If he makes that much more than you do and he knows alimony is allowed, that was him telling you he’s afraid of that and using a threat to intimidate you. He’s trying to bully you so you need to talk with an attorney, soon. 



> Also, wondering about the 8 years of no affection or intimacy. How did that happen if you don't mind me asking? It's not nearly that long here and there is some affection, but he has for a long time been very LD, and we are very, very incompatible in that area. After a while, not having him interested in me 'in that way' it really started bothering me and really making me feel so unattractive, unwanted, unloved - doesn't matter what else he does, I just need that connection to feel like it is a marriage. Otherwise, it's just a very friendly roommate kind of thing - which I HATE. Do people really go on like that in marriage?? I can't think that is the norm.


Our situation involved years and years of premature ejaculation that never resolved. Sex never lasted more than about 30 seconds and he would never try for a second round or offer to make me happy in another way. At first I looked past it because I thought I loved him that much but the more time passed the less I wanted to have sex. His behavior toward me wasn’t the best either so between that and the sexual incompatibility our relationship completely eroded to the point of no return. I think it was a self feeding cycle where the less intimacy there was the angrier he got and the more I withdrew and the more I withdrew the meaner he got until there was absolutely no respect or affection left at all. 

But like you there were some serious personality issues with my xH too, things that took me years and years to see. The way his mind worked and the way he reacted to things was not “normal”. 



> Yes, at some point I would put myself out there, but who knows when. I will need time to get past all of the changes I know will be very DIFFERENT to me.


For me, I’m completely ready to move on to a new relationship and you may find that you feel the same way very soon. It’s a bit different for relationships like ours where there was no cheating or blindsiding. We’ve had years and years to accept the reality of our situations and deal with the inner turmoil so by the time the end officially arrives you’ve done all your mourning and self introspection and are ready to fully walk away. I’m going to wait till the one year mark for my kids but no longer, I have a life to live. You may be surprised by how you feel once the divorce is final.


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## Bananapeel (May 4, 2015)

*Re: Taken me years to finally get <<<thisclose>>> - financial questions*



LilMissSunshine said:


> That's great, NOT, if you were able to get your condo outright. I also am considering getting a condo with any proceeds from the house, BUT, as I shared with Thor, might also just keep the house for a while and 'work my way into' yet another change - so much changing already. It truly is cheaper to buy in my area than it is to rent. Rent is OUTRAGEOUS. I was shocked when i started researching. Did you not ask for alimony? My H makes a lot more than I do, but I honestly wonder if it is worth it to just be done with it to ask for no alimony. Seriously. What was your reason for not receiving alimony?
> 
> Also, wondering about the 8 years of no affection or intimacy. How did that happen if you don't mind me asking? It's not nearly that long here and there is some affection, but he has for a long time been very LD, and we are very, very incompatible in that area. After a while, not having him interested in me 'in that way' it really started bothering me and really making me feel so unattractive, unwanted, unloved - doesn't matter what else he does, I just need that connection to feel like it is a marriage. Otherwise, it's just a very friendly roommate kind of thing - which I HATE. Do people really go on like that in marriage?? I can't think that is the norm.
> 
> Yes, at some point I would put myself out there, but who knows when. I will need time to get past all of the changes I know will be very DIFFERENT to me.


You have to talk to a lawyer about alimony. Each state has their own laws and specific conditions required to be able to ask for it. One thing to be careful of is if your H makes that much more than you he can afford a better lawyer than you can and recover from the D faster than you can. So if he blows through a ton of marital assets fighting you over a small amount of alimony you could end up much worse off in the long run. So choose your battles. Often the person with the deeper pockets (your H) will end up better in a legal battle if it goes that way, so keep that in mind as you do your negotiations.


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## LilMissSunshine (Apr 10, 2015)

*Re: Taken me years to finally get <<<thisclose>>> - financial questions*



Not said:


> T
> 
> I think it was a self feeding cycle where the less intimacy there was the angrier he got and the more I withdrew and the more I withdrew the meaner he got until there was absolutely no respect or affection left at all.
> 
> But like you there were some serious personality issues with my xH too, things that took me years and years to see. The way his mind worked and the way he reacted to things was not “normal”.


YES. This!


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