# Confronting the OM



## reallyover? (Jun 21, 2011)

My entire story is in the dealing with divorce section.

I want to start a new thread here to get opinions on confronting the guy my wife had/is having an emotional affair with. She supposedly cut it off in Jan but recently told me she sent him a text on his birthday. He's still in her head. She will not end it because she has not arrived at the point where she understands it is. My only reasons for confronting him is to make him nervous and to have him end it in the hopes that any rosy ideas she has in her head about a potential future with this guy will be wiped out. I know this will not solve out issues...dealing with that on the other thread. Just looking for opinions on this note. FYI..my wife told me she wants a divorce but has not yet filed.

here's what I'm thinking....

"Not knowing you, I mistakenly assumed that my prior note would have prompted you to do the smart thing and tell my wife that you did not want any further contact of any kind from her. Apparently I need to more blunt. Your communications with my wife have not been appropriate. Sending my wife pictures of a guy getting felatio is not appropriate. You had an emotional affair with my wife. Since you have not stepped up and told her not to contact you anymore, you are still having an emotional affair with my wife. We are working through marital issues and our family does not need outside distractions. You are an outside distraction. I am aware of your “lay in the weeds” strategy. As a man I can appreciate that strategy. It makes you look like you are not aggressively pursuing her. It may even allow you to not feel too bad about yourself. The problem is that you are using it on a married woman. The really big problem is that you are using it on my wife. I’m sure that if you do decide to finally do the right thing, you will not give any indication that it was in any way provoked by her husband and father of her 2 boys. To be honest with you, the std’s that we are forced to deal with on a daily basis really make this a very poor investment of your time anyway. I didn’t see that disclosure in any of her communications to you."

That last part is a fabrication but I thought it was a nice touch. Any suggestions out there??????


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## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

reallyover? said:


> My entire story is in the dealing with divorce section.
> 
> I want to start a new thread here to get opinions on confronting the guy my wife had/is having an emotional affair with. She supposedly cut it off in Jan but recently told me she sent him a text on his birthday. He's still in her head.


I've read your thread and wondered why you posted there instead of here in the infidelity forum. From what I read, your WW is still DEEP in the fog of her EA. OM is her high school boyfriend that she reconnected with (common story nowadays), she refuses to admit to the EA, and says you are controlling her for wanting her to go NC with this OM. Furthermore, due to her being in the fog, she says she is done with the marriage and wants a divorce. When you said you would give it to her, she backed down. You have also appeared weak and needy in her eyes, which makes you unattractive to her and OM all the more attractive.

And now she is the one breaking NC and fishing for contact with the OM. Is this correct?



reallyover? said:


> She will not end it because she has not arrived at the point where she understands it is.


No, she understands deep down that what she is doing is wrong. She just won't admit it to you, because as you said, you are always wrong and she is always right. This is already not a good situation, but you contributed to this by not standing up for yourself over the years. You will need to correct this by doing the 180.



reallyover? said:


> My only reasons for confronting him is to make him nervous and to have him end it in the hopes that any rosy ideas she has in her head about a potential future with this guy will be wiped out.


So basically what you are saying is that you want him to end it with her so she can move one. This is backwards. She is the one who WANTS the EA, she is the one breaking NC and fishing. She is the one deep in the fog. So she is the one who has to end it from her end.

You can send the letter, but why would it make him nervous? Because you lied about STDs? Do you seriously think he will believe that coming from you? If they are in an EA, you can bet they have talked about everything, including your sex life, the history of the marriage (demonizing you in the process), and their deepest secrets. No, he wouldn't believe you anyway.

You really have nothing to make him nervous with. You said he is already divorced, so there is now BW to expose the A to. They don't work together, so there is no employer to expose the A to. In short, you really have no way of making suffer any consequences, and that is a very tough situation.



reallyover? said:


> I know this will not solve out issues...dealing with that on the other thread. Just looking for opinions on this note. FYI..my wife told me she wants a divorce but has not yet filed.


And when you told her you would give it, she backed down. What does this tell you? She is sitting on the fence. She is cake eating. Deep down she really doesn't want divorce. You are the steady man while she wants to play around with the OM. You need to knock her off that fence and take away her fork. You need to let her know that you are no one's 2nd option. In sounds counterintuitive, but you have to be prepared to lose your marriage in order to save it. You have already been getting great advice on the other thread, but you have listened very little.



reallyover? said:


> here's what I'm thinking....
> 
> "Not knowing you, I mistakenly assumed that my prior note would have prompted you to do the smart thing and tell my wife that you did not want any further contact of any kind from her. Apparently I need to more blunt. Your communications with my wife have not been appropriate. Sending my wife pictures of a guy getting felatio is not appropriate. You had an emotional affair with my wife. Since you have not stepped up and told her not to contact you anymore, you are still having an emotional affair with my wife. We are working through marital issues and our family does not need outside distractions. You are an outside distraction. I am aware of your “lay in the weeds” strategy. As a man I can appreciate that strategy. It makes you look like you are not aggressively pursuing her. It may even allow you to not feel too bad about yourself. The problem is that you are using it on a married woman. The really big problem is that you are using it on my wife. I’m sure that if you do decide to finally do the right thing, you will not give any indication that it was in any way provoked by her husband and father of her 2 boys. To be honest with you, the std’s that we are forced to deal with on a daily basis really make this a very poor investment of your time anyway. I didn’t see that disclosure in any of her communications to you."
> 
> That last part is a fabrication but I thought it was a nice touch. Any suggestions out there??????


If you want to send an email that's fine, but he didn't heed your first note, why should he heed this one? If you are going to lie about STDs, which he wouldn't believe coming from you anyway, then you are just sinking to their level. 

If you insist on sending this letter, then you need to make it a little shorter and to the point. It's too wordy IMHO. You can do without the superflous words, just go straight to the points. Don't worry about trying to impress him, he's not going to be impressed anyway. 

You're going about this the wrong way, concentrating too much on the OM when you should be concentrating more on your WW. At this point, you cannot even hope to R while she's in the fog. You are operating out of fear, fear that by letting her go, she is going to run straight to the OM. You need to get rid of this irrational fear. Her mind and heart are already with the OM. What you need to do is make her feel what she is about to lose, to make her feel loss. You already saw how she quickly backed down when you said you would agree to the divorce. 

Go ahead and lawyer up and see what your options are. Show her that you are ready to move on with your life without her. You need to strengthen yourself and rid yourself of any codependency issues that you have. You need to be firm and show her that you will divorce HER, not her divorcing you, if she will not stop this EA, choose you, and recommit 100%. You are not unique. Read the stories here. See that all the people who are making it to R, are the ones who stood firm, and did not allow their WS to run over them. 

You were being given some good advice there by people like Jellybeans, but it seems you aren't following through. You should be the one to file for D, and you can cancel or hold the process at any time. It's not final until its final. You need to knock her off that fence and shock her out of this damn fog.

If you don't, then you will continue to live in limbo, where you are not heading to R, but not headed toward D. Living in limbo is living in hell. Then you can also look forward to OM continually fishing, or your WW continually fishing and threatening you with divorce. Do you seriously want to live this way? I'll copy and paste the 180 for you.


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## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

The purpose of the 180 is NOT to manipulate your WW. It is to strenghten yourself and help yourself DETACH. Now, a possible side effect is that it makes you look more attractive and shows to your WW that you are ready to move on without her, but that's not the primary purpose. So don't use it to manipulate her. It's for YOU not her.

Take a look at these too:

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/26360-betrayed-spouse-script.html

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/26439-bill-rights-betrayed.html


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## reallyover? (Jun 21, 2011)

Lord, let me start by saying thank you very much. I think you are 100% correct. I started the 180 yesterday and plan to follow it to a t as much as possible. It makes all the sense in the world to me. My wife is in the fog. She denies what she has done is wrong. The OM has been very passive throughout this entire situation. My wife has felt starved for emotional intimacy and she initiated the vast majority of the contacts. It sounds stupid to say but I give the OM some credit because their EA could have become much more involved if he pursued it. I guess my main reason for wanting to send him the note is the hope that he would tell her that he thought what they have done is wrong. Maybe that will get her to step back and look at it with a new set of eyes. I actually re-drafted the note a little and led him to believe that I see all communications she receives. Basically told him that a note stating that "looking back on it, what we have done is wrong. Please don't contact me again". 

This guy wasn't a boyfriend in high school just a friend. She has never had any type of physical relations with him...not even a kiss. This was not a real deep EA. I don't think she really got into a lot of intimate relationship issues. I would bet my life that she did not talk about our sex life with him. That's a very strange and rare thing for us....throughout this entire ordeal, our sex life has been very good....up until Sunday when she said she wanted a divorce. I really think that at the time it started, my wife was so starved for emotional affection that she clung to the first guy that showed her any.

The first note I sent him in Jan was very short and not real specific....basically said I love my wife and kids and expect that he will respect that fact. That was it. He literally has sent her 2 letters in a text since that time. On his birthday, my wife sent "happy birthday" and his response was "ty" for thank you. I guess the way I see it is that if I received a note like this from some woman's upset husband and I knew he knew who I was, I would be very nervous for my safety. We live in a somewhat rural area where the men are men and so are half the women. No plans on my end but he doesn't know that.

I completely understand that this should start from her end. She is so screwed in the head right now that I don't know when that would be. She doesn't think she was wrong. Maybe if he told her it was she would realize it??? Try to fight the war on two fronts? I don't know. I am a guy that likes to leave no stones unturned when trying to solve an issue. The STD thing was put in there just to make her less attractive to him.....

I don't know.....I have had a lot of time to think and if there's any possibility to get her to snap out of her fog I am considering it. I am working the 180, but would like to see this BS stop soon if at all possible. It is impacting our kids and that is what causes me the most pain. I am a survivor and I will be fine, but they don't deserve this. This site has put a lot of things into perspective for me. Thanks again and I certainly appreciate any further feedback.


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

lordmayhem said:


> *The 180*​


Wow. This is how I've always been. Pretty much point by point. Is there some kind of time and space warping super 180 that actually works?


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## reallyover? (Jun 21, 2011)

One other thing....I think sending it would really make me feel better....like I'm getting a little mojo back.


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## reallyover? (Jun 21, 2011)

Lord, you nailed it on the BS script...


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

You are still reaching. 

The OM telling her it's wrong isn't the answer. The thing is you appear to think he is behind all of this when in fact, your wife reaches out to him. If she was truly done, she wouldn't be wishing him a happy birthday after ending No Contact. Your wife is pursuing him. Your wife wants a divorce. 

You say it wasn't a deep EA but it was definitely SOMETHING because why i she still contacting him? And it was sexual in nature because he sent her pics of a man getting a bl-w job. That was meant to entice her sexually. 



reallyover? said:


> She will not end it because she has not arrived at the point where she understands it is.


No. She won't end it because she doesn't WANT to. Yes, it really is that simple. She knows it's wrong because she hides her messages to him from you. If she felt it was ok, she wouldn't have to conceal it. You are just believing her lying words because you prefer that story to the reality of your situation. It's wildly inappropriate for a man to be sending oral sex pics to another man's wife and her accepting it and still talking to him after the fact. She knows how wrong it is. 

And the thing is, you have no chance at reconciliation as long as she is denying her affair and how wrong it is and how she is responsible.

She wants a divorce. She told you. So agree with what she wants. The more you fight her on what she wants, the worse for you. Do not do not do not at all chase her.


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## 2xloser (May 8, 2011)

Don't send it. You're wasting your time focusing o nhim, instead of on her -- and on you & the 180 you desperately need to employ.

What happens if he sends you a note back saying "No way dude. Not gonna happen; I will do as I like as long as she is receptive." ...or simply says nothing and does not change any behavior, essentially continuing to ignore you? What then? 

Man up with your wife, focus there. 

fwiw, I created a similar thread some time ago more along the lines of "how do I keep from beating the OM half to death?" The advice there was to let it go... my beef is with my wife, not the OM. he didn't make vows to me; she did. Might have kept me out of jail... and by not sending a note to him, it also prevents any future harassment or charges of worse when something DOES happen to him. Which it will.


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## morituri (Apr 1, 2011)

Runs like Dog said:


> Wow. This is how I've always been. Pretty much point by point. Is there some kind of time and space warping super 180 that actually works?


Yes, when you can make a final decision between staying married or divorcing and be at peace with it.

As stated before, the 180 degrees protocols is NOT a tool for manipulating the cheating spouse to end his/her affair and seek reconciliation with his/her betrayed spouse - if it happens great but it is simply a side effect nothing more. The 180 is an empowering tool to give the betrayed spouse enough emotional strength where he/she can move on with his/her life with or without his/her cheating spouse.

The 180 aids in opening a betrayed spouse's eyes that his/her happiness is not centered on his/her cheating spouse's actions but on his/her own.


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## reallyover? (Jun 21, 2011)

Incidentally, we lost a young friend a year ago. My wife says it opened her eyes and she realized she was unhappy in our marriage. In her mind it was over. Within a couple of weeks is when she met up with this OM. She is exceptionally emotional and at the time she was emotionally empty. She was very vulnerable at the time and I can empathize with that....doesn't excuse how she handled it.

Sent this before I read all the responses. I get what you all are saying. I am focusing on her and the 180. It just grinds my a** that this guy goes on his merry way with no downside. The BJ pic he sent her was in the form of a joke and it was the last contact they had before I found her emails. The emails were actually sent about 3 weeks before I found them. I think he did respect my first note for the most part but it sure is hell would be nice if just blew her off completely, or at least she thinks he did. I won't send it. I'll stick to the 180.


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## Shooboomafoo (Mar 30, 2011)

I deal with a woman, my stbxw, that wants out completely, period. 
IF there was ever a chance for reconciliation it was turned to dust with her affair, which severed the last ties between us, both on my side, and within her own mind and heart. Instead of guilt, she clung to some sense of freedom as the ONLY thing she could, because otherwise, she would be what she hated most, and she is completely unwilling to admit, she is human, and capable of mistakes of such gravity. She suddenly found herself doing exactly what she has preached against for her entire life, and honestly does not possess the skills to deal with that. Like your situation, the weakness she had at the time she became involved with the OM, was what sent her off the deep end, and NOTHING of any doing can bring her back except by her own hand. To attempt to, would have no merit or weight, because it was not "her" fixing things herself. In order to know a fix is required, she would have to fully acknowledge within herself that she has committed such a devestating act against her husband and children. They actually believe within their own minds, and have used their own self-imposed lies of their history with us, to fuel their current goals in life, instead. Oh how wonderful a life away from this miserable man will be!!! We didnt have a miserable life. In my case, I think the OM actually found someone else, so my wife is now clinging to her own idea that "I must have done this, BECAUSE my marriage wasnt really meant to be.." Just twisted,,, and that depth of insanity is not able to be accepted or understood very easily by us betrayed spouses.
But I think this also serves to turn "guilt" that should be evident to them, into a legitimate "reason" to end things. IF not simply to get away from the hint of the guilt that they havent found a way to get away from, they break the neighbors window with a baseball and haul ass away from the scene.

I personally have never seen my stbxw so incredibly deeply twisted in all her logic. There was a time when I could rely on at least some sense of rationale, but there is none to be found at this time.
To me, it appears to be an illness. Every day the depth of it, the lies compounding upon lies, like they always must do, to support each other, are unimaginable. 
But it also serves another purpose for me. It is brick by brick building a wall between us, that I am allowing to be built, for my own sake. For the sake of my own sanity.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Really, 

I totally understand you wanting to lay this guy out. He's a jerk. He is def to blame for participating in the betrayal but if your wife wasn't allowing it to happen, this wouldn't be occuring at all.

Is he married or partnered? If he is, I would tell his wife/girlf about the affair.



reallyover? said:


> She was very vulnerable *at the time *


Exactly. AT THE TIME. That is in the past so why is she still doing it? Cause she wants to!




reallyover? said:


> Sent this before I read all the responses..


Sent what?



reallyover? said:


> The BJ pic he sent her was in the form of a joke .


If it was so funny, why aren't you laughing about it? 

See, you ar ein a fog yourself. You are still trying to rationalize away her behavior.

Get some self-respect. Man up. Stand up for yourself. Stop waiting for her to come around. She wants to be gone so open the door for her. Say "Goodbye."


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## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

Shooboomafoo said:


> I personally have never seen my stbxw so incredibly deeply twisted in all her logic. There was a time when I could rely on at least some sense of rationale, but there is none to be found at this time.
> To me, it appears to be an illness. Every day the depth of it, the lies compounding upon lies, like they always must do, to support each other, are unimaginable.
> But it also serves another purpose for me. It is brick by brick building a wall between us, that I am allowing to be built, for my own sake. For the sake of my own sanity.


The reality is that some WSs NEVER come out of the fog. They leave and never look back. My first wife was like that, and I divorced her. You have to be able to accept this.


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## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

Jellybeans is giving you great advice reallyover. Stop rationalizing her behavior. Get on the 180 and start detaching.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Mayhem. I DO think the WS comes out of the fog at some point. I think the WS comes out of "the fog" eventually. It may not be in a day or month or even a year, but SOME day the reality hits them about what they did. The gravity of their actions--they will realize it at some point in time. They may never apologize or acknowledge it to the wronged party or the one they left, but I do believe there is a clarity at some point. If the fog is due to an affair then when the honeymoon wears off, they can see more clearly how the high feelings they experienced compounded their issues for them. Even if they stay with the person they cheated wtih. Eventually the honeymoon period does wear off and it becomes a "normal" relationship. Ya know, the real relationship, with laundry and fights and problems and BS.

And I think the BS/left behind spouse comes out of their own fog eventually. They get through the heartache (though they are always a littel sad at how it ended) but one day they DO see how silly they were for chasing after someone who had clearly checked out. And they think, "Why would I want to be wit him/her? Gosh I wasted so much time chasing a dream."

I loved my first boyfriend so much. Teenager sh-t. Adored him and thought we would get married because OMGHE'SMYFIRSTLOVEANDWE'REGOINGTOGETMARRIEDFOREVER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I see him every blue moon. He's a good person but there is no way in hell I would ever want a relationship with him now.


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## reallyover? (Jun 21, 2011)

Shoo and Jelly...once again, spot on. You guys have been a big help over the last couple of days. I am 100% commited to the 180 and open door on the wife's side of things. The thoughts of the OM were not a sign of lack of resolve on my part but more an attempt to flip every rock. Jelly, FYI, the OM is divorced.

Thanks again guys. I'm off to the counselor!!!!


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## reallyover? (Jun 21, 2011)

Jelly, I also know my wife will come out of the fog and how she has acted will absolutely destroy her if this family is split up. I can no longer worry about that as I have done all I can. Time to 180.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

reallyover? said:


> Shoo and Jelly...once again, spot on. You guys have been a big help over the last couple of days.


Why thank you. We accept cash, checks, and money orders. 

Thing is, when someone wants out, the most loving thing you can do is let them go.


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