# Hopeful about new doctor



## phoenix_ (Dec 20, 2013)

I've been struggling with health problems for the last 8 years, ever since I was around 22 years old. I went to at least 5 doctors in that time and none of them ever gave honest consideration to my symptoms. One of them tried to call me a hypochondriac because I kept coming to him to test me for different things because he wouldn't think of it himself. He even tried to tell me that my symptoms were just me getting older… I was 22.

2 of them tried telling me that I had depression even though we went over the main symptoms and I said no to more than half of them. I was tired all the time and my body was extremely weak. I couldn't exercise properly and I had terrible sleep. It was so frustrating to constantly get tested for irrelevant illnesses and it was demoralizing to think that there might be a chance that one of those doctors would finally see something, yet I would always get rejected for any type of treatment.

Anyway, my wife helped me finally find a doctor that listened to me and actually sent me for relevant tests, some of which aren't covered by OHIP. It turns out that my cortisol is too high and low at different points of the day, my free testosterone and vitamin D are very low and my TSH is high, meaning my thyroid is out of whack. He gave me a few supplements along with pregenolone and iodine. 

I just started the medication a few days ago and I'm already feeling a little better. I don't know if it will make me completely healthy but I have high hopes. I used to be 175lbs and very athletic and now I'm 230lbs and very weak. I love sports and I used to spend all my free time playing them but since I got sick I've barley played at all, especially in the last few years. 

My poor health has caused so many problems for me in my life in every way. Its been especially difficult whenever I get a new job because I'm tired all the time and getting used to a new schedule makes it much worse. At work I end up looking like a zombie because of my fatigue and I've had people try to get me in trouble because sometimes I look like I'm falling asleep when I'm trying my best to stay alert. 

I don't really know why I wrote this, maybe some of you have gone through the same thing as well? I'm just happy I finally have a route to follow and hopefully it can lead to good things.


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## Thor (Oct 31, 2011)

phoenix, I'm glad you are feeling better.

I had a surgical mis-adventure in my late 20's. A surgeon did additional work which wasn't needed. I'd torn an abdominal muscle and he also did a hernia repair because he said he saw that eventually I would need to have it repaired. My insurance was quite good at the time, so he obviously was just looking for more $$. Docs get paid by the incision and stitch, so he did a lot of messing around.

Anyhow it left me with nerve damage which would give me random pain like a lightning strike from my nuts to my diaphragm. I went to many docs and got similar responses as you did. This went on for ten years! Several said that "some pain" is normal after a surgery. One obviously thought I was crazy. Several just said "dunno, you'll just have to live with it". Some didn't even physically examine me!

Finally a female doc with little fingers examined me and said it didn't feel right (hernia repair), and sent me to a different surgeon. That surgeon, also a woman, had to do a lot of rework. She drew diagrams of what she found in there, and literally she shook my hand and thanked me for letting her be my doc because she had "never seen anything like that before". 

The first surgeon did some really nutso stuff in that first unnecessary repair. He is no longer in practice, btw, so I gave up the idea of suing him. I should have been far more aggressive in tracking down his malpractice insurance, because I had a slam dunk case.

Anyhow, what I've learned is that docs have very narrow focus. They are experts in what they do, but it is very very narrow. If you fall outside of their expertise, they either don't have a clue what is going on with you or they mistakenly see you as having something you do not. You have to advocate for yourself big time, and don't take it personally when a doc doesn't get it. Docs are super pressured for productivity and so they can't spend much time at all with each patient. They make snap decisions based on a minute or two with you. Don't expect deep investigations into your malady.

Your thyroid sounds like a very likely candidate for your problems. Or some other inter-related hormonal issue. If you aren't seeing an endocrinologist you might want to consult with one if your current treatment plan doesn't work well.

Finally, I encourage you to seek out non-MD and non-pharmaceutical solutions. Your nutrition may be a big player. Be sure you are on a super healthy diet with lots of organics, very little sugar, little to no caffeine, little alcohol, and very good vitamins and supplements. Avoid medications as much as possible. If there is a non-pharma option, try it before going on the Rx med.

If you think you might tend towards depression there are many very good natural remedies with as good or better a success rate than Rx meds. I highly recommend a book called "The Mood Cure". It covers not only depression but all kinds of things such as anxiety, lethargy, caffeine addiction, etc., using cheap natural supplements such as vitamins and amino acids. It works!

In centuries past, humans didn't have the kinds of problems we do today. Your symptoms of severe lack of energy and weight gain just isn't described in literature from the past. I think modern lifestyles have a tremendous amount to do with many health problems.


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## Anonymous07 (Aug 4, 2012)

I'm honestly surprised it took so long for you to get treatment, when what you describe is so very common of a thyroid issue. 

If you can, keep a journal each day of what you eat, how you feel, how much sleep you got, and so on, just to see if you can see anything from that(any patterns or triggers that may be causing some of your symptoms). There are things you can do beyond medication that can help to alleviate some symptoms, by some lifestyle changes(but do stay on any medication you're prescribed). 

I've had health issues all of my life and many doctors don't even know what my condition is(rare congenital malformation). I get a blank stare from many doctors and I have to explain to them what it is. There are doctors who think I made things up, but you have to trust your gut feeling. Over the years, I've learned to always trust my gut. If I don't feel like that specialist is right, I move on and get a second opinion. Luckily I am followed by a world-class surgeon, but it took a long time to find him.


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## Homemaker_Numero_Uno (Jan 18, 2011)

phoenix_ said:


> I've been struggling with health problems for the last 8 years, ever since I was around 22 years old. I went to at least 5 doctors in that time and none of them ever gave honest consideration to my symptoms. One of them tried to call me a hypochondriac because I kept coming to him to test me for different things because he wouldn't think of it himself. He even tried to tell me that my symptoms were just me getting older… I was 22.
> 
> 2 of them tried telling me that I had depression even though we went over the main symptoms and I said no to more than half of them. I was tired all the time and my body was extremely weak. I couldn't exercise properly and I had terrible sleep. It was so frustrating to constantly get tested for irrelevant illnesses and it was demoralizing to think that there might be a chance that one of those doctors would finally see something, yet I would always get rejected for any type of treatment.
> 
> ...


I had a similar issue a few months ago - was fatigued and out of breath and exhausted and trouble focusing, thyroid was low, was anemic...a thorough check of vitamin and other blood levels revealed a zinc deficiency. Easy fix but the symptoms and the results of the deficiency are far from simple. Instead of taking thyroid meds and iron to make up thyroid deficiency and anemia, I took zinc. Zinc is needed by the bone marrow, where all sorts of things are made for your blood. No zinc or low zinc, you end up suffering. It takes 7 days for new blood cells to be made. So after a week of supplements things should improve more.


I hope you'll continue to feel better on the supplements, etc.


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## Thor (Oct 31, 2011)

And, though this is something mocked in many quarters, try a totally gluten free diet for at least 30 days. 60 days is even better. If you don't notice any difference, no problem and you can go back to eating gluten. (But pay attention if you start gluten again to see if any negative symptoms appear).


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## phoenix_ (Dec 20, 2013)

Thor said:


> phoenix, I'm glad you are feeling better.
> 
> I had a surgical mis-adventure in my late 20's. A surgeon did additional work which wasn't needed. I'd torn an abdominal muscle and he also did a hernia repair because he said he saw that eventually I would need to have it repaired. My insurance was quite good at the time, so he obviously was just looking for more $$. Docs get paid by the incision and stitch, so he did a lot of messing around.
> 
> ...


I've been to a few homeopaths and a TCM doctor as well. Both helped quite a bit but couldn't completely "cure" me. The doctor I'm going to now actually works with a naturopath/homeopath and he's also given me vitamin D and 3 other natural supplements and natural remedies. I've been taking them for around 2 months and they've helped.
He's also told me to go gluten free because my stomach is having a lot of problems right now and I'm trying my best to stick to it, but it's difficult. 

The prescriptions he's given me are pregenolone for hormones and iodine for my thyroid. So far the pregenolone seems to be going ok, nothing major. I haven't started iodine yet but I will in around a week. I'm not sure what to expect...

Over the years I've tried so many alternate approaches and nothing seemed to work completely. They all helped but no major improvements. If there was a way to solve this without prescription meds I would definitely do it. I've only seen this doc twice but he seems good and he's rated as one of the highest doctor's in Toronto especially for thyroid related problems.

I definitely don't have depression or anything close to it, which is why I couldn't stand those other doctors who tried to shove that diagnosis down my throat with 0 evidence. I even mentioned it to my current doctor and he laughed at the idea. Recently I've found out how much it actually benefits doctors to prescribe anti depressants and even just by claiming that you're depressed they can profit more from your visits. I actually want to report my first doctor but I'm not sure how to go about it yet.


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## phoenix_ (Dec 20, 2013)

Anonymous07 said:


> I'm honestly surprised it took so long for you to get treatment, when what you describe is so very common of a thyroid issue.


I was pretty surprised how bad some doctors are. My cortisol was consistently in the low 100s for my am test where the normal range is between 130-~560. They said since it's barley hitting the minimum I'm fine, which didn't make sense to me. They also said that my symptoms match up with high cortisol levels more than lower ones, so they basically ignored my results.

My new doctor made me do a saliva test that I have to take home and do throughout the day and it showed that my cortisol is too low at certain points and too high and others. So, he actually did more analysis and found better results to go by. 

My original doc also saw that my tsh was low but since my free t3 and t4 were normal he ignored those results too. He ignored my symptoms as well and they are not minor. 
I even saw a specialist through a walk in clinic and told her that I wanted to try allopathic medicine now because the natural stuff isn't working for me. She just made a few excuses of why I should just stick with it so she wouldn't have to treat me. 
There are some garbage doctors and it's so dumb that I had to go through so many hoops to finally get treatment but at least I'm getting somewhere now.


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## phoenix_ (Dec 20, 2013)

Never underestimate the stupidity and lack of sympathy from random doctors. The vast majority are in it for the money and prestige and don't give a crap about you or doing a good job.


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## Anonymous07 (Aug 4, 2012)

phoenix_ said:


> Never underestimate the stupidity and lack of sympathy from random doctors. The vast majority are in it for the money and prestige and don't give a crap about you or doing a good job.


I know it's frustrating, trust me I've been to many doctors, but I wouldn't say most are just in it for the money and prestige. There are many doctors out there who will go the extra mile to make sure you are taken care of. Some are afraid and will brush you off because they don't know what else to do(I've seen that often). I had a specialist panic before because my case is rare and it made him nervous(at a consultation). I know it's tough for many doctors and burn out can happen easily, so I try not to fault too much. They're human(they don't know everything) and it's a tough job. 

At my last surgery, I had 3 specialist who worked together on my case. All of them were amazing. I have 2 of their cell phone numbers and the 3rd always asked the other 2 for updates on how I was doing. Before I found that group, I remember sitting in a doctor's office crying because I had been going through so much severe pain without any relief and the dr sat there teary eyed with me, going over what he thought could help. 

For every bad doctor, there is also a good one. 

Don't give up.


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## Thor (Oct 31, 2011)

I think one of the biggest problems is that docs now frequently are not self employed in their own practice, rather they are employees of a mega-corp. They are pushed for productivity and only have a very short time allotted to see a patient.

When I first went to the pain clinic (after my second surgery), the doc and a nurse sat down with me for 20 minutes to just talk about the history, my symptoms, and what I was hoping as an outcome. That is the way it should work! (But then they said about all they could do was prescribe narcotics. That was a no-go for me.)

The next surgeon was in private practice and he spent some time doing experiments. He gave me several injections over the course of a month to try to locate the damage which was causing the pain. That is a crazy and funny story for another time. The upshot was that he then knew where to cut and he found a neuroma (scar growth) on the nerve which he removed. If he were limited by an employer to one short consult before cutting, it would have been a much less positive outcome for me.


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## DoF (Mar 27, 2014)

Finding a good doctor is no different than finding a good mechanic, VERY hard.

What you have dealt with is no different than what me and my wife have dealt with and MILLIONS of Americans as well. 

Being put thru the loops etc is part of the game and doctors have VERY little incentive to even get you healthy, as they get paid when you are not and more you come > more money they make.

That's why I have a HUGE problem with Health system being PRIVATE and a business. 

If I can get a dollar for every worthless doctor my wife and I have seen/been to, we would be rich right now.

BTW, my wife's issues still have not been identified and she continues to struggle and live in pain. Doctors have simply shot in the dark and keep guessing. LOTS of their guesses (if they were to be followed by her/me) would have HUGE effects on my wife and her health.......

At this point, I would say finding a great doctor is HARDER than finding a good mechanic.



On my end, I've been diagnosed with Chronic Disease few years back and even someone that's considered a "great doctor" in the industry has been somewhat disappointing from my perspective. I mean from keeping up and taking the disease seriously is all good, but the doctor really doesn't seem to take any proactive approach when it comes to reviewing my diet/weight and recommending stuff. Matter a fact, he hasn't even told me to lose weight AT ALL, and he should've.

Mind you, all that is on me and I have been doing my best, but it would be nice for a "highly educated doctor that gets paid premium" to take initiative or even care about things like that.


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## Vision_ (Aug 8, 2014)

DoF said:


> Finding a good doctor is no different than finding a good mechanic, VERY hard.
> 
> What you have dealt with is no different than what me and my wife have dealt with and MILLIONS of Americans as well.
> 
> ...


I live in Canada so my experience is a little different, but I agree. I find the problem with coverage for everyone is that crappy doctors stay in business because people come in for the smallest reasons since it doesn't cost them any money. And again, there is more incentive to keep people sick rather than make them healthy, or at least to keep them on medication permanently. 

Also I've noticed a huge spike in the number of people diagnosed with depression. I also found out recently that doctor's in Canada charge and extra counciller fee to OHIP just by claiming that you're depressed. And it's insanely easy to get anti depressants, all you have to say is that you're upset sometimes or that you're tired and they'll whip their pad out.
Anti depressants are one of the strongest and hardest to kick medications so it's no surprise that doctor throw the stuff out like candy, it's good for their industry and keeps them rich. 

There are very few doctors who actually care about their patients and there are lots that deserve to be in jail.


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## DoF (Mar 27, 2014)

Vision_ said:


> I live in Canada so my experience is a little different, but I agree. I find the problem with coverage for everyone is that crappy doctors stay in business because people come in for the smallest reasons since it doesn't cost them any money. And again, there is more incentive to keep people sick rather than make them healthy, or at least to keep them on medication permanently.
> 
> Also I've noticed a huge spike in the number of people diagnosed with depression. I also found out recently that doctor's in Canada charge and extra counciller fee to OHIP just by claiming that you're depressed. And it's insanely easy to get anti depressants, all you have to say is that you're upset sometimes or that you're tired and they'll whip their pad out.
> Anti depressants are one of the strongest and hardest to kick medications so it's no surprise that doctor throw the stuff out like candy, it's good for their industry and keeps them rich.
> ...


Yeep

Look up what American Pharma did to Japan. Made that entire nation into BILLION dollar depression pill industry.

I'm not saying depression is not an issue, it is and SOME suffer from it and need help. But you will never EVER convince me that THIS many people need it.

I've also seen # of people that started with these pills (and shouldn't have as they were simply at the bottom of the rollercoaster in life....) and their health went downhill SO fast after that. 

Depression pills = domino effect on your health.

Also, most "good" doctors would ask you about your diet/weight etc LONG LONG LONG before giving you pills. 

Unfortunately, that doesn't make them any money. So they do what they do.


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## Thor (Oct 31, 2011)

DoF said:


> Look up what American Pharma did to Japan. Made that entire nation into BILLION dollar depression pill industry.


Maybe that explains why sex and marriage are dying in Japan. The young have very low interest.


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## Anonymous07 (Aug 4, 2012)

Thor said:


> I think one of the biggest problems is that docs now frequently are not self employed in their own practice, rather they are employees of a mega-corp. They are pushed for productivity and only have a very short time allotted to see a patient.


:iagree:

They are very restricted with how they do things by the medical group they work for and the insurance companies. I have friends who are doctors in different specialties and all of them complain about this. Although with that said, I much prefer our medical system over universal health care in other countries, especially as someone who is followed by a specialist. I know quite a few others in the UK and Canada with my same medical condition as myself who struggle a lot worse with trying to get treatment in a timely manner. I can get surgery scheduled and done in a matter of a couple weeks, where as it takes them well over a month if not longer. A friend from the UK is on the wait list for surgery in 6 months from now! In the mean time, she is in a lot of pain.


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## DoF (Mar 27, 2014)

Anonymous07 said:


> :iagree:
> 
> They are very restricted with how they do things by the medical group they work for and the insurance companies. I have friends who are doctors in different specialties and all of them complain about this. Although with that said, I much prefer our medical system over universal health care in other countries, especially as someone who is followed by a specialist. I know quite a few others in the UK and Canada with my same medical condition as myself who struggle a lot worse with trying to get treatment in a timely manner. I can get surgery scheduled and done in a matter of a couple weeks, where as it takes them well over a month if not longer. A friend from the UK is on the wait list for surgery in 6 months from now! In the mean time, she is in a lot of pain.


Pros and Cons to each.

I think a hybrid of both would work well. Private + Universal. It works well in plenty of countries.

Problem is, it will NEVER happen in US. Way too much money on the line from Doctors, health professionals, Pharma, Insurance etc.

NOT going to happen

Also, don't even think for a second that there isn't MILLIONS of Americans living with pain and unable to get proper treatment. At least those people in UK waiting for surgery know what's wrong, here they would get a bunch of run around and go thru pain just testing crap.....and still don't know as our healthcare sucks their insurance/wallet dry.


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## Anonymous07 (Aug 4, 2012)

DoF said:


> Pros and Cons to each.
> 
> I think a hybrid of both would work well. Private + Universal. It works well in plenty of countries.
> 
> ...


I agree that a hybrid system would probably work well.

However, I disagree with the rest of your post. Most(not all) Americans live with health issues because they don't take care of themselves. We have a huge problem with obesity, which in turn leads to multiple illnesses that are associated with it. That is not the problem of the doctors/medical system, but a problem with individuals who are not taking care of their own health. On the other hand, many people who have rare conditions come to the US for treatment. I worked with a non-profit for a few years, helping people come here to get treatment in a timely manner. We also have some of the top specialists in the world. I know my own specialist has people come from all over the world to see him. He's been on the news and the discovery health channel for surgeries he has done, but he is the most humble man(I like to tease him a little about it). I feel very blessed that he is my specialist.


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## CantePe (Oct 5, 2011)

OHIP tells me you are an Ontarian. There isn't any testing isn't covered by OHIP unless you want to by pass wait lists and go private (yeah we do have that here, privatized pay for, skip the waiting line clinics).

I'm just a little hung up on the OHIP part as a fellow Ontarian resident.

However, it is great you are feeling better. Hope that continues for you.


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## Finder (Aug 12, 2014)

CantePe said:


> OHIP tells me you are an Ontarian. There isn't any testing isn't covered by OHIP unless you want to by pass wait lists and go private (yeah we do have that here, privatized pay for, skip the waiting line clinics).
> 
> I'm just a little hung up on the OHIP part as a fellow Ontarian resident.
> 
> However, it is great you are feeling better. Hope that continues for you.


There are some tests not covered by OHIP. One is the cortisol saliva test and vitamin D is another one.


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## CantePe (Oct 5, 2011)

Huh I didn't know that, learn something new every day.


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## mablenc (Feb 26, 2013)

OP,

I'm glad you found a doctor. Low vitamin D levels was ruining my life and I didn't imagine it was that. I developed osteoporosis at the age of 27. My bones started to hurt gradually, I developed fatigue, my body was in pain. I got diagnosed with fibromyalgia, I was depressed, skin problems.

No one would give me a bone density test becuae of my age, five years later I found a doctor that listened to me and did one. By then I was in so much pain that I would cry at nights because when the pain flared up.

I thought it was a bone cancer, once I started to really focus on getting my vitamin D up, it has been so much better. Not back to 100% but I'll get there. 

But I'm still left with the osteoporosis.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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