# Wife about to bail on our marriage



## rkyfat (Feb 13, 2012)

Hi,

I have been married for 13 years, 2 kids, 1 older and going to University this year.

History (I will keep this as brief as I can) - Last xmas my Wife told me she needed to think about things. That she felt differently and wanted time to think things through. She was very amicable saying she did not want to move out but was just not sure of her own feelings - not just about me, but generally about herself.

I give her the space and try and talk to her but not much solved although we had communicated better than we had done for years.

2 months on (Feb this year) it comes to a head and my Wife admits she is doubting her feelings about me and dished up the love but not in love with you line. She was just not really sure how she felt and wanted to get away to think.

I agreed to her going away to think and she went away for 3 nights with a mutual girlfriend. I checked she was with her friend etc and she was. I checked mobile phone records and found a number of calls/texts to a mutual male friend who had also recently seperated from his Wife. He has known my Wife since college. I reflected on my part in all of this and did acknowledge this via text to my Wife whilst she was away. In particular my lack of emotional support over the years etc (and yes I have had the lightbulb moment and could kick myself) She said she admired me for that and we would talk when she got back. I also text the friend she was away with who said she was fine and thought she just needed a bit of time and space.

She returned full of tears saying how she did love me, spent the whole break talking about me and that she wanted things to work. I challenged her about the OM and she admitted texting him but to provide him with support during his seperation. She has known him such a long time that she thinks of him as a brother and nothing more - she also acknowldged that it may seem weird that she has another male as a close friend. We left it at that.

Trouble is things settled into the old routines too easily. I did make some changes but not everything at once. In about April time the doubts started again and she needed more time to think. At this point I did the checks re affairs (mobile phone records, key logger etc) but found no evidence of anything. 

Things went on until June when I checked her mobile again and still nothing. She was still in touch with the OM but purely sharing jokes and nothing suspicious - she had also shared the same jokes with numerous other people. I feel I have satisfied myself re affair. 

So d-day came this week when I wanted an answer. She says it would be better if we seperate, refuses to go to Marriage counselling and her mind is made up. She says she loves me and could live with me forever - but does not feel the attraction any more and if anything feels uneasy about being intimate.

She admitted that she has put blockers up to avoid giving in re being intimacy and changing her mind.

So we have agreed to seperate but to leave it a month until our eldest son starts University.

On another note we have always had a good sex life. It stopped around December last year, started again when she returned from her break and then has stopped since April except 1 time in Juen I booked us a short break in Spain in an effort to try and save things. Whilst we had sex on holiday nothing changed re her feelings when we returned.

Issue is that I still don't want her to go and lover her dearly. I have probably about 2 months to change her mind before our son goes to Uni and she finds a suitable place and we sort out practicalities etc. She is having to move out as she has not worked for years to raise family, still needs to be at home for our youngest son who has learning difficulties and I cannot afford to keep the family home going and another place. Her plan is to get a council place and live on benefits with Financial support from me.

Can anyone give me advice on how to save this or do I call it quits, accept the worst and get on with my life. I keep reading re the 180 but not sure if this fits my circumstances. I am trying not to be weak although I have had the odd angry outburst re breaking the home up and a weep. 

Just gutted and need some advice and need to man up a bit. But is there any hope.

Sorry for the long post and any help would be well recieved. 

Thanks

Rkyfat


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## anchorwatch (Mar 5, 2012)

Am I wrong that it seems your sexual relations stopped while she was communicating with the OM?


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

If I were you I would stop trying to make her feel the way you want her to, and start making yourself feel the way you want to. What I mean is, do things that make you feel happy and feel good, and don't pine after her. Take up a new hobby, work out, join a club, spend time with your kids, whatever YOU want and like to do. Focus on making yourself happy. You never know, she just might find the new you more attractive than the puppy dog you.

I would also get STD tested because she sounds very much like someone who is cheating, despite the lack of evidence.


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## rkyfat (Feb 13, 2012)

Anchorwatch - Not entirely - she was communicating with him from about last September. We stopped having sex initially in December. So I suppose it was during the communication but not when it started - if that makes sense 

Hope 1964 - I have confronted her about the OM on numerous occasions and she is still adamant there is nothing going on. I did take an STD test in January and was clear. Should I take another?


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

Well, according to your timeline she's been acting strangely all the while since January.

You do know that ALL cheaters are adamant that nothing is going on, right?

What do you think of my advice to start doing some stuff for YOU?


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## rkyfat (Feb 13, 2012)

Hope1964 - you are right re making myself feel better doing things for myself that make me feel good - finding it difficult to move on as all my thoughts are on my marriage


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## anchorwatch (Mar 5, 2012)

rkyfat, 

She won't give up her friendship with the OM and she won't work on the marriage. Not good news. As long as she has contact with him she won't give you a chance. Right or wrong, in her mind, she sees him as a better partner. 

It's time for you to up the ante. Have you kept up your health and shape? How about your appearance and swagger? You need to work on you whether she comes along or not. Bring up your sex rank. Read Married Man Sex Life, you need to do the MAP. If it works or not, you'll be better for it, and she'll either share in it or see what she's missing.


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## rkyfat (Feb 13, 2012)

Thanks Anchorman - will check it out


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## JustJenn (Aug 29, 2012)

A lot of times folks are aware of phone records and key loggers, so they do take measures to not be caught. The fact that you have a key logger, points to the fact she has given you reason to believe she is cheating, no?
If she is giving up on the marriage, are you sure you want to continue to fight for it? Unfortunately, it takes both parties wanting it to work.
I suppose you could try to "win" her back by reminding her of why you fell in love in the first place, trying to refresh her memory of what she loved about you. 
She has to want to reconcile things though. It doesn't sound like she does though.
I agree with Hope, do something for you. Whether it helps things with her or not, it will help you handle whatever happens in the next couple months.


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## peterwilli (Aug 29, 2012)

She won't give up her friendship with the OM and she won't work on the marriage


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## Jonesey (Jul 11, 2011)

Look. No other way of saying it in a nice way.. But your wife
Is having an affair...


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## rkyfat (Feb 13, 2012)

Thanks for the wake up all call. With that in mind is there any tracing software that would work for PC and IPAD. My son has an ipad which she also uses and I have not checked that.

Thanks all


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## Jonesey (Jul 11, 2011)

Here is a link for key loggers ,some are free some you have to pay for.. all of the key logger are ranked and described what,and how it performs.

Monitoring Software - CNET Download.com


For IPAD 
Monitoring Software - CNET Download.com

same site but it dosent offer very much.But worth anyway to have look at it..

Also a site for iPad, looks promising iKeyMonitor - Keylogger for iPad and Keylogger for iPhone that logs Keystrokes, Websites and Screenshots
and one more for iPad iPad Keylogger – iPad Spy Software

Brows around in iTunes and Appstore.. You will find all sort´s of thing´s

Does your wife own a iPhone??


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## Toffer (Jan 31, 2012)

rky,

While no one here can be sure, I also think an affair is possible but then again maybe not.

What I am suspicious about is that weekend with the girlfriend. I think it's possible she hooked up with the OM then had a moment of "oh sh!t! What have I done to my family!" (or the OM told her he did didn't see himself with her after he boinked her).

She than ran back to you and the kids and then the Spain trip happened. I think it's more than a fair chance she hooked up with someone on that trip too and decided that there are a lot of offereinggs out there and she still "has it" so why does she need to be tied down to you and the kids?

Again, some wives just walk away because they are not in love with their hubbies anymore. Hard one to call right now. Do the monitoring others have suggested


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## rkyfat (Feb 13, 2012)

Thanks for all the stuff. 

Jonesey - many thanks. I will take a look at these. She does not have an iphone but HTC one.

Toffer - re the trip with mate I don't think that was with the OM. I texted her mate while they were away who said she was fine and needed time. There are also a couple of photos from the trip with her mate there.

Re the Spain trip we were with each other the whole time.

But you make a good point re doing something with OM at some other point but then regretting it hence may have been catalyst for the whole not sure how I feel scenario.

I will keep you posted on progress re the key loggers.

Thanks again


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## MaritimeGuy (Jul 28, 2012)

rkyfat

Let me start by extending my sympathies. I went through something similar almost a decade ago and it was the most difficult thing I've gone through in my life to this point. I wouldn't wish it on my worst enemy. 

I'm not a fan of the tracking software..unless perhaps you're trying to build a legal case. The way I look at it is you distrust your partner enough that you feel you need to do that than your marriage is over. I think it's a basic law of science that you can't prove a negative. So all the monitoring in the world can only find evidence your wife is cheating. It can never prove she's not. 

To me at this point you steel yourself for the possibility your marriage is over. You start making plans to live a fulfilling life without her. There is a possibility she will see this strength in you and find it attractive. There's probably a greater possibility she won't so don't count on it...but at least you'll be positioning yourself to find happiness again.

Best of luck


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## sinnister (Dec 5, 2010)

Sorry you're going through this. If there's no affair she sounds done. For whatever reason she tried to make it work after the first time and you admitted you didnt make the changes fast enough (for her liking I suppose?)

She sounds done. Changing a womans mind when she's not attracted to you is damn near impossible.


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## rkyfat (Feb 13, 2012)

Sinnister - thanks v much. I think I know this already but am clutching at straws. Re the changes I had started to make them and she has acknowledged that. It only made her angrier that I had not done this years ago with the ' If I can do it now, why could'nt I have done it then'. I have no real answer to that other than the wake up call she gave me I suppose! too little too late seems an appropriate phrase!

Maritime Guy - thanks v much too. I like the advice re trust and to be honest that probably went when I first started snooping! Although the fact I didnt find anything helped it is the little devil that keeps appearing in my mind! Re moving on though I just need to now for myself if there is an OM with proof. If she is being honest and truthful with me re how she feels (she still wants to stay friends etc etc and remain in contact for the kids sakes) then I love her enough to support her in what she does and wish her the best of luck. If I know she has been seeing someone else that just changes things, although I will not make the kids suffer for that.

V good advice again - thank you.

It would be good to hear from anyone that has managed to turn it around from such a situation. Appreciate I am still searching for a life line here but hagging on to any positives I can get.


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## MaritimeGuy (Jul 28, 2012)

I damn near drove myself crazy trying to find evidence my ex was cheating on me. It got to the point I was going through cell phone bills, computer histories, *67 (or something like that to figure out last number dialed on the landline) the whole bit. My stress level was through the roof as I crept around trying to piece things together. 

In hindsight, I wish I'd just stood tall and walked away.


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## Feelingdown (Aug 13, 2012)

I think one of the main problems is that, instead of trying to address the issues and working on trying to make her happy, you've decided to check up on her to see if she's cheating, over and over despite finding nothing.

If you really want a life line you need to take a leap of faith and try to show her you can be what she needs and stop digging for something deeper with no success. At least with the former, you'll know you did the best you could to save your marriage. 

Though from the sounds of it, I think it's most likely too late.


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

I find it interesting that folks not understanding emotional affairs actully see the evidence and the impact of an affair but they do not recognize it as such. So they keep looking for other evidence.

I am not saying she is having sex with the other guy. But their relationship is causing a spirally down of the marriage. Her advising this other guy about his separation is her bonding intimately with the OM and is considered by most a huge mistake. A lack of boundaries.

Also it is unclear but were they ever lovers in the past? If so contact at all with an ex lover or love interest is a huge mistake.

So this does not seem like a pure walk away wife syndrome. It looks more like the ratcheting downward cycle. 

Her relationship with this OM has destroyed the marriage. I am not saying that there were not other issues. But she could not work onn the issues because of her ongoing affair.

So IMHO you allowed this relationship to continue as it tore your marriage apart. You can certainly look for more evidence and eventually you will find it because she has spearated from you and is into the OM. Whether it is a PA or not who knows. But the damage is done and getting worse.

Thet started in September and you stopped sex in December. This tells me that the relationship that she had has contributed to your marriage going away. She hooked up with a guy from her past and then disconnected from the marriage.

IF you had stopped having sex in September and she connected with him in December this would say she disconnected from the marriage and then hooked up with a guy.

In reality these things are not so black and white. Hence the sprirally / ratcheting downoward.

There is history re-writing and rationalization levels that countunue to take effect. There is the increase in oxytocin and eventually dopamine. But to be sure the damage is done during the oxytocin increase. 

Remember women connect to have sex. Men havd sex to connect. This is a generalization but certainly food for thought. The thing is the damage for your marriage is during the connecting to this OM and not just when they get around to having sex.

So if it were I, I would have engaged this sooner and insisted on NC as soon as I knoew about the relationship. She may have refused but I would have made my stand there. Early is important for EAs. Later is too late. 

No way I would have agreed to a separation. That to me anyways is just enabling an affair to go to a PA.

So this may be over. But now you need to work on the new you. Stop being such a nice understanding guy and do not blame yourself for her affair.


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## QuestionsNoAnswers (Aug 24, 2012)

It does sound to me like and EA, not a PA. But to echo other posters, does it matter at this point? If you're monitoring her phone and computer, you don't trust her anymore. And she came right out and said she didn't love you anymore. 

The thing about the "I love you but I'm not in love with you anymore" line is that it's inaccurate. What they want to say is, "You're a pretty decent person who hasn't done anything seriously wrong to me to make me fall out of love with you. Because of that, I still have some fondness for you, based on our history, and I don't want to hurt you. But I'm not in love with you anymore." 

You have two choices, as far as I can tell. You can start from scratch and make her fall in love with you again, or you can let her go. The problem with that is that your history together makes the first option very difficult. I also totally agree with the above poster that a separation is a bad idea. Make her choose between committing fully to the marriage or not having it it all - go straight for the divorce and no contact if she wants to leave.


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## Toffer (Jan 31, 2012)

rkyfat said:


> Toffer - re the trip with mate I don't think that was with the OM. I texted her mate while they were away who said she was fine and needed time. There are also a couple of photos from the trip with her mate there.
> 
> rky,
> 
> Keep in mind her friend may be covering for her! If there's pictures of the two of them, who took it?


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## rkyfat (Feb 13, 2012)

All thanks for some great advice. After my last post I realised that with no trust it is all but dead and buried anyway and to be honest she has lost my respect through the EA and in hindsight yes I should have been stronger dealing with it. But the fact she has done it in the first place makes me think why fight for a woman that treats you like that anyway - I do love her but as I say my respect for her is also starting to dwindle. Re the snooping I think it might be time to stop.

Whilst I love her I am starting to come to terms with the thought of moving on and possibility of a new life without all this stress. Being able to go back the Gym, having more me time etc etc from a selfish perspective - watch what I want on TV etc etc - some of the positives that might come out of this. The impact on the kids is tearing me up as they don't deserve this but I guess only time will tell. My Sister is a lawyer so already looking into financial side of things for me on the QT and getting stuff sorted from the side.

Thanks all again. I will keep you posted and it has helped my analyse where I went wrong. But it is not my fault as if she truly loved me would she have ever sought emotional support (or physical) elsewhere.


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## anchorwatch (Mar 5, 2012)

Good luck.


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## MaritimeGuy (Jul 28, 2012)

If you and your wife can be mature about it the kids don't have to suffer. Make sure you both continue to play an active role in their lives and never put them in the middle. i.e. no bad mouthing the other or burdening them with concerns about child support etc.

When I split from my ex I bought a house five minutes away. My kids have spent the past 9 years spending two days a week midweek and every second weekend at my house and the other days at their mothers. We both attend all their concerts, sports, school functions etc. 

When I think about it probably one of the main reasons many of us stay in less than fulfilling marriages is we grew up watching our parents endure one. Staying together in a dysfunctional marriage 'for the sake of the kids' may in fact do them more harm then good. They deserve to grow up with role models that demonstrate how to be happy and live life to the fullest. If that means sharing their time between two households so be it.


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## wxman3441 (Aug 30, 2012)

rkyfat,

Very sorry to hear you are going through this. This sounds SOOO familiar to what I went through. Our relationship had some normal issues pop up in the first year and she bailed not before giving me the "I may not love you and need space" crap. I am very sorry to say but it looks like your marriage is ending and it may be time to focus on you. Be the best father you can be right now and makes sure she doesnt take too much from you in the settlement.


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## RDL (Feb 10, 2012)

Go check out Infidelity, Cheating Wives - Women's Infidelity your situation fits very well with that book. 

It will provide you with some eye opening answers.


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## rkyfat (Feb 13, 2012)

Thanks Freedom Corp. I do have an update that is playing on my mind.

Today I confronted Wife re OM again!) and it felt like she confessed all - or at least a lot more than she had done previously. She admitted the EA in December (she is not really clued up on what an EA was) but is adamant that that is all it was. She does not find the OM attractive, does not think of him in that way. She said she wishes he was a Woman then it would seem more "normal". He is a good friend she has know years looking for advice etc and when we started having difficulties confided in him. She said she realised at the time that it was not quite right and has held back on messages on an emotional nature with him since. My checking out has not found out anything un toward other than jokes and friend type messages though. She will not cut off contact as he is a mate - but nothing else.

We discussed our relationship (again) she is still angry and says things in the past have chipped away slowly to make her feel like this. i.e. not feeling like she was no 1, not supporitng her enough etc. I had also sulked a small no of times when she did not want sex (childish I know and I had forgottenr about it till she said) She says she has not even started looking for another place or made any plans yet.

She says she can see the difference but she is now angrier because she feels like she does about me (i.e. not feeling like she loves me anymore), that why could I have not realised this myself and done all these things earlier yet she still says she could happily live with me forever - but wants more and wants the attraction which has completely gone - i.e. just living together is not enough.

She is still confinced break up is right for her and I have not pushed that. 

So what do I do now? I had started to adjust mentally re thinking about a single life etc etc and now I am thinking is all not lost or am I yet again kidding myself?

Anyone any thoughts.


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## RDL (Feb 10, 2012)

Yes, I strongly encourage you to get her to read the women's infidelity book. 

Start with the bullet points on the site. That will help you both approach the situation from an informed point of view. 

Otherwise chances are very high that you will split. If you chase after her that will make her more angry. If you start to move on that will make her temporarily clingy. 

She must understand what is happening to her. Sincere understanding will diffuse the anger and make room for loving feelings.

What she is going through is much more normal than both of you think and it's not your fault. Your perceived defects are a minor cause compared with the main issue which is the repressed expression of her sexual instincts. More details in the book.


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## rkyfat (Feb 13, 2012)

UPDATE. Thanks Freedom Corp. 

I got my wife to read the site you mentioned. She is still insistent that her sexual feelings wanting for someone else or nothing to do with how she feels (but then she would). 

She is at the point now where she is really angry at the pressure. However, some of the things she has said in the last day have made me think.

She has started talking about her childhood. Her dad died when she was young and she has always felt the need to have a man in her life. Her mum also pushed her and her brother and sisters away during this time. She says she has spent so long trying to please her mum over the years and getting knocked back. She also says this is relevant in past relationships where she feels she has been walked over. Her last marriage failed because she had a husband who did treat her badly, walked all over her etc and he ended up having an affair. She also says that she does feel like that about our relationship (not the affair bit) but that I am a decent husbanc and good father and nothing like her ex. She needs to do this for herself. It is like she is trying to prove she can be on her own. I don't think our relationship has been anything like that and I certainly would not walk on her. But again I have acknowledged in the past the lack of support I have given her personnally. But again it is not like I have been down the pub. I work long hours and weekends have been about the kids and in particular our youngest who has special needs. She then says it is more about the appreciation I have shown her. I can understand this but again have changed in the last few months and demonstrated this. She says it makes her angry that I could not have recognised and done this years ago.

She talks constantly about getting her life back before we were married etc etc and how she blames her mum for how she is. She is adapting this when viewing our own marriage. 

I mentioned she gets counselling in the past and recently and she refuses. She has been under tremendous pressure the last 12 months. We changed my sons school due to allegations of abuse, this led to an extended summer holiday with out special needs youngest which was difficult. The transport that was previously provided to take him to and from school was withdrawn and now she she has to take him to and from school again. This has meant the small life and friends she had built up for herself outside the home (a dogwalking crew in the mornings, going to the gym etc) has been taken away. The battles re trying to move school with the local authority and getting transport provided back are also taking their toll. We also have an ongoing legal dispute with a special needs adaptation to our house which was not not completed properly. Again this has all happened in the last 12 months. Again, she took the lead with these given she has more time at home to make phone calls etc. I have been supportive and taken a role in it but not as much as my Wife. Again, she says she has not felt supported enough over the last 12 months. I can see this but again I am doing the work re legal issues on extension etc and have taken my son to school/picked him up when I can. 

But she says this lack of support has also contributed to how she feels, how she sees me in terms of losing respect and with this the attractiveness she felt for me.

I suppose as well some of the passion/spark had gone out of our relationship. But again I put this down to pressure, stress on both parts.

The more I research and the more I think about things I am starting to feel that it is a cross between mid life crisis, depression, stress and walk away wife. I am not discounting the relationship with the OM and am still not satisfied but I still have no firm evidence and the more she opens up the more I wonder if I am barking down the wrong tree.

However, the more I talk to her now the more she thinks I am trying to put her into pressure and she is defensive that I am accusing her that her mind is warped. 

However, she still says she cannot imagine a life without me but she must do this and will not be talked out of it.

So where do I stand - I continue to change myself for the better, I continue to appreciate her, dates etc are out of the question, I give her space but make sure I am there if she wants to talk. I have even started at the Gym. Again, it is not physical attractiveness she has a problem with - it is the respect and emtional side. She says this feeling differently about me has made her think about if you took the kids away what sort of relationship would we have if she feels like she does.

A big part of me feels now she is making a decision whilst not thinking clearly and that she will regret it when she finally gets her head cleared. But I am so stuck now on what to do other than let her go and carry some hope that once she has left in time she may start to feel differently. 

Sorry for the long post. Could we put the affair accusations on hold. I will continue with key logger but am tired of all this now and just want to move on myself, be a better person and enjoy my life.

Thanks again for the sipport and I would be interested in your thoughts re the additional stuff I have said.

thanks and sorry again for the long post


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## rkyfat (Feb 13, 2012)

forgot to mention in my last post that she got married young first time around and had her first child at 23 with her ex - she is 43 now. She was with her ex for approx 5 years.


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## rkyfat (Feb 13, 2012)

sorry - another bit - she says re sex she says it is the last thing on her mind with anyone, she has zero sex drive, the stress of all this and the past 12 months have caused this and she has not even thought about it for ages. again not sure if that makes a different.


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## RDL (Feb 10, 2012)

Right,

Her reaction to viewing the site was emotional and defensive, not ideal. She did not rationally analyze the information she simply deflected it.

There are indeed a series of factors contributing to her state of mind. Do not be confused, she is downplaying her emotional attraction to someone else likely because of guilt, however it is one of the major catalysts of her walk away tendencies. 

Sex with you is the last thing on her mind but should an affair go physical she will be likely very active. Please be advised that her susceptibility to cheating is general and not linked to this one man, it is due to the powerful mix of emotions she is on. 

You will find that now she is oscillating between anger and guilt. At one point she may accuse you of lack of support (by the way that is a factor but not as large as she plays it) and at another she will say you are a good husband and do not deserve this.

Regarding what to do:

Firstly you need to read the whole book for your peace of mind and understanding. Right now you're in limbo and being torn apart. 

Parents issues are very common in women who exhibit her behavior and so is a sense of "loosing out" on experiences when growing up.

Secondly the best chance moving forward is a strict 180 on your part. That will trigger in her the fear of loosing the powerful comfort connection she built with you over the years. This may override the other impulses and bring her back to you. Even if it does not, the 180 is for you and it's one of the few ways of positively going forward.

I strongly advise not to grovel or beg. Your attempts to get close explained quite well in the book trigger anger. She is not open for emotional support from you at this time.

Here is a link to the 180 post: http://talkaboutmarriage.com/609945-post77.html

Please come back with feedback after having read the book and comment on what you understood from it as it pertains to your situation.

Thirdly and very importantly you as a first step in the 180 you need to psychologically accept the possibility that she will not come back. Imagine that as a real possible outcome, imagine what you will do in that case and realize it's not the end of the world. Realize that whatever happens it will be for the best and the fear that's tearing you apart will subside.


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## rkyfat (Feb 13, 2012)

Thanks for the good advice. I am spending too long trying to rationalise/reason her behaviour instead of just accepting (which is the hardest part). I will read the book thanks


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Ah, an emotional affair!
No evidence from texting/keylogging? Doesn't mean it ain't happening - not everything is done electronically you know... Here's a little story that might wake you up a bit.

My wife and I's relationship began as friends sure, but it became an emotional affair. My gf at that time got jealous and threatened, but she had ZERO evidence to back up her claims. She of course, checked my messages/told me to cut contact/etc etc. I couldn't, the more she tried to restrain me the more time I spent with my wife (friend at the time)

Emotional affairs don't always show signs of cheating. My wife (friend at the time) and I had a strong connection and huge sexual tension... and we flirted yes, but never did we cross the boundaries because I was already with someone else. Yet I've always prefered time with her then with my ex-gf. To any onlookers - and even to each other, we were just friends. But pay a little more attention to detail, the secret messages and signs, the looks, the flutters, subtle expressions of attraction -> and it's a different story. We were flirting/teasing/seducing each other while we continued being friends.

Now what could my ex have done in this situation? She could have focused on her own happiness, proved to me that she was no longer clingy, respected my space, and showed me that she's confident and no longer a pushover -> by showing me that she can move on.

Instead, she emotionally blackmailed me to never leave her, and made the OW much more attractive to me then her. There was simply nothing there that I could have gone back to. Instead, I fell deeply in love with my wife. So there you have it, sounds familiar?


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## rkyfat (Feb 13, 2012)

Wow randomdude. Extremely familiar and thanks.

I have never been clingy but I think the advice re showing her I am no pushover and something to move back to is is valuable.

I am in the same position re I don't think anything physical has happened but the more I go on like this the more I have this dread that they will end up together.


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## rkyfat (Feb 13, 2012)

Thought I would update on my situation. A mutual girlfriend got in touch with me last week. She had met my Wife for Coffee. Said Wife was shaking, rhymed off her issues with me and said there is fefinately no OM. She ended the conversation with I want a strong man and not a boy!

Well hit a few nerves obviously - I would not go as far as being a boy but I can see that the last few years of marriage have made me lose myself and who I was. 

Basically my Wife has run the household for the last few years since I was working ever longer hours. Mutual friend said she is basically knackered, has no life outside the home and wants someone to takeover.

I get this. I have been doing a 180 to these last 2 weeks to try and get myself back to who I was. I have also taken the household back within grasp. Trouble is she wanted to do all this stuff (bills, money, organising etc etc) as she felt bad about not going to work. Whenever I tried to intervene she used to take over. 

Anymore advice on how to take this forward please. We are seperated but living together. She is looking for a place but it is difficult for her given she is relying on benefits which reduces her options considerably. I don't want to trap her because of that and she is still adamant she wants to leave.

However, she has been different this last week, she suggested a takeaway and film when youngest son had gone to bed and is generally starting a lot more conversation. Realise it is very early days. I have not mentioned our relationship for 2 weeks now, got to the gym, met up with old friends etc. She still has not changed her plan to 'find herself' and the exercise and taking control of the home back is making me feel great. But the underlying marriage issue is the cloud waiting break!


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## Toffer (Jan 31, 2012)

rkyfat,

Just keep doing down the 180 path and going out enjoying yourself and let time be on your side.

Try to do some Alphs things around the house like electrical work or servicing the car (oil change) or general, sweaty man stuff


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## rkyfat (Feb 13, 2012)

Thanks Toffer - the 180 is starting to work in that I am feeling better myself - am already doing some 'man' jobs -fixed the shed the other day, repaired the doors on kitchen cupboards and will continue. 

I am knackered but this is doing wonders for my self esteem!


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## anchorwatch (Mar 5, 2012)

rkyfat, Did you read Married Man Sex Life


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## jfv (May 29, 2012)

rkyfat said:


> Thought I would update on my situation. A mutual girlfriend got in touch with me last week. She had met my Wife for Coffee. Said Wife was shaking, rhymed off her issues with me and said there is fefinately no OM. She ended the conversation with I want a strong man and not a boy!
> 
> Well hit a few nerves obviously - I would not go as far as being a boy but I can see that the last few years of marriage have made me lose myself and who I was.
> 
> ...


 In case you guys reconcile, maybe she wants some version of this?

Taken In Hand


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## AFEH (May 18, 2010)

Why not go and have a casual chat with the OM? No aggression, nothing like that. Not in a pub but in a cafe. Just say to him you’d like a chat with him. If he’s up for it when you meet say something like “I imagine you know the problems within my marriage. What do you think is happening?”. Leave it totally open and just observe his response.


Basically what you are trying to do is to see what he’s about. For example if there’s truly nothing but friendship between him and your wife he will meet with you to help you out. If he does meet with you and he's edgy, anxious or fearful then he is hiding something.


You really do need to get to know what’s going on if you can. If he calls your wife and tells her you’ve asked to get together with him, just say something like “Look. You’ve given up on our marriage. You’ve given me your reasons which I to some extent understand and accept. But something is truly bugging me and I’m hoping your friend can help me out.”.


Maybe if you know where he lives and where he hangs out just be there, kind of bump into him and ask if he has time for a chat, so your wife doesn't get to know about it until after the event.


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## rkyfat (Feb 13, 2012)

JFV - thanks I will try it. Way too early though to even consider reconciliation. At the moment it is about changing me to the person I used to be. The one that W fell in love with yeas ago but a new and improved version. But this is more for me than W - I understand my W better now through all this, what she needs, how I have neglected her. 

If I ultimately lose her for good I want to look back and think I have become a better person, respected her decision and did what was right at the time. 

It is tough and I do have time on my side. 

AFEH - thanks but I have put all thoughts of OM out of my mind. I am not interested, if there is an OM then I can take the higher ground in that W was not worth it if her solution to problems is to turn to someone else. Per my earlier post I do think that an EA has happened. But I am not wasting anymore time/energy pursuing it. All it does is drives me crazy, makes me ill and stops me moving on.

I do know where he lives as he was a mutual friend - just my wife knew him first. I have not had contact with him for a few months now.

Anchorwatch - no I have not read but again will add it to my reading list. 

Thanks all again - these forums/your advice is a big help


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## rkyfat (Feb 13, 2012)

okay another quick update. Spoke to W about sleeping arrangements because I felt it weird we are seperated but still sharing a bed. 

She does not want to change sleeping arrangements and said we are both adult enough.

GF who she met with for coffee in touch again for an update. I asked what did she think re hope. She said that there is love there but it is buried deep under 13 years build up of anger and resentment. That if I wanted it to work the lifeline is that W has said what she wants - a stong man not a boy - i.e. give her what she wants/needs if you want any chance of saving things.

Wife complained that she is putting on weight today after I got back from Gym. She also wants us to give up smoking together - we have been wanting to do this for ages but keep putting it off.

W is initiating all the conversation - mainly about kids but some other light hearted stuff as well. e.g. she asked me if I had read an article in the paper she was reading, made a few jokes etc.

Basically the whole situation has diffused and we are more comfortable around each other. But this is whats worrying as she is seeing me as her friend and not H. I fear the longer this continues the more normal it will feel.

Should I set a date by which I want her to move out? but that would mean ending up somewhere not suitable for my son.

Should I insist on seperate sleeping arrangements?

Should I not engage in conversations that she starts?

When she does my washing/ironing/cooking should I just take it off her when I have told her not to do it.

Thought I was getting on top of things but am questioning myself since the last post earlier this morning!!


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## forumman83 (Aug 12, 2012)

This may sound extreme but I would suggest that the best thing to do right now is to END the relationship. Tell her hat you need time to yourself. That should get her thinking. 

If you keep hanging around her, she will know that she owns you. Even if ou try really hard to hide it. 

Would you consider staying with a friend for 30 days. Get your mind right?


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## rkyfat (Feb 13, 2012)

Thanks for the advice again. I spoke to W re ending things properly and the big D. She broke down, says not sure what she wants and not thought that far ahead. Gave me the speeach re needing to find herself, get sel-esteem back etc and that she needed to leave as she thinks this is the solution to all her problems. i.e. all her issues with herself seem to have been deflected onto me and our marriage which is the one thing she thinks she can change in her life. Then started criticising herself about putting weight on and that she feels a failure etc etc and that she cannot even find a place herself. 

I ask her if it could be depression. She says she thinks it could be and that she has felt down for a long time, but will not see doctor or get help. She says doctor will only prescribe mediation and she does not want anti-depressants. I think she feels that gettign help is a sign of weakness that she is not coping (may be wrong of course!)

Okay I am really confused now - I have a wife who wants to leave, says she is not in love with me. Yet, has no idea where to go, how she will afford it, has put no long term thought into this at all, has not thought as far as divorce, yet day to day is trying to carry on like everything is okay and now feels she is depressed and has been for a long time. 

When I mentioned divorce she had a look of horror in her face.

So confused right now - I really need to stop trying to diagnose W and focus on myself but everytime I start doing that something rears its head to spin me off course! Trouble is I am starting to just get angry re the whole situation and strarting to have thoughts about wanting out myself now even though I love her.

Thanks for the great advice and please keep it coming.


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## anchorwatch (Mar 5, 2012)

Rkyfat, I think you need to take reins here. She is not giving any clear direction to where she's headed. If you follow her you're going to live in limbo. How long can you do that? She is basically asking you to let her live single and decide if she wants something else in life, while you wait as a back up plan if that fails. This after she told you she is no longer in love with you. 

The fear you saw in her, when you wanted to D, was her losing control. She isn't prepared to take it to that step yet. You rushed her plans, if she had any. I would put it to her, get counseling for herself and marriage counseling for both of you or you'll file for divorce. This will force her to get off the pot. You can always cancel D anytime during the process.


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## forumman83 (Aug 12, 2012)

rosebanks123 said:


> It really feel sad that your partner whom you loved so much just fell out of love. The only thing I can say is do to her the things you did to her before that made her fell in love with you.
> 
> 
> 15 Things You Should Give Up To Be Happy
> Join me on Facebook now!


Strongly disagree...this tends to push the woman away further. It is best to make the changes apart from her...IMHO


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