# Vaginal orgasms or PIVO 2



## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

@Mybabysgotit posted on another thread that he has never been with a woman that hasn't orgasmed from penetration alone?

I would really like to ask some questions if he wouldn't mind answering.

Mrs. Conan has never had one with anyone though she has come close with me.

One of my goals is to accomplish this with her and I've been researching for a long time.
@StarFires gave some great advice that got me going in a more accurate direction with her but having the male perspective could help me as well. Many other TAMmers have helped over the years as well so don't anyone feel left out.

She just had my wife's number and @Mybabysgotit has a 100% success rate with giving women orgasms through intercourse.


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## minimalME (Jan 3, 2012)

Wow. :surprise:



ConanHub said:


> @...and [MENTION=338779]Mybabysgotit has a 100% success rate with giving women orgasms through intercourse.


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## Somearebiased (Aug 21, 2019)

My wife has vaginal orgasms every single time we made love or **** each other’s brains out. Maybe I’m just blessed w an easy to get off woman but I seem to be made for her physically I’m in the Goldilocks zone for penis size and girth for her particular vagina. Try hitting the a spot and rubbing her clit not to orgasm but getting her real excited. I talk lots of smut and say dirty things and she gets so horny. Make her cum after she gets hot enough and commands you too! My wife loves having some dominance and control maybe 2 out of 10 encounters. Good luck, good lick and god bless.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Somearebiased said:


> My wife has vaginal orgasms every single time we made love or **** each other’s brains out. Maybe I’m just blessed w an easy to get off woman but I seem to be made for her physically I’m in the Goldilocks zone for penis size and girth for her particular vagina. Try hitting the a spot and rubbing her clit not to orgasm but getting her real excited. I talk lots of smut and say dirty things and she gets so horny. Make her cum after she gets hot enough and commands you too! My wife loves having some dominance and control maybe 2 out of 10 encounters. Good luck, good lick and god bless.


I appreciate it but Mrs. C and I have had our share of partners and many of my previous partners had vaginal orgasms while no one has been able to pull it off with my Mrs.


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## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

Is this going to be another thread that makes me feel totally inadequate because I can't get my wife to orgasm via PIV, like, ever? There were maybe two times in the 40 years we've been married? 

Or for that matter, making me feel inadequate because I cannot get her to orgasm every single time via oral.

Why isn't it possible that it's not the guy's fault? Why isn't it possible that the stars just have to line up a certain way for some women? My wife will some days do the multiple O thing (typically three) but then has no desire whatsoever for a number of days to even think about trying again. I brought up elsewhere my idea that some people have a complete disconnect with anticipating pleasure, and if they don't look forward to something, it's much less likely to happen pleasantly.

Or I'm just making excuses for apparently being bad in bed.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Casual Observer said:


> Is this going to be another thread that makes me feel totally inadequate because I can't get my wife to orgasm via PIV, like, ever? There were maybe two times in the 40 years we've been married?
> 
> Or for that matter, making me feel inadequate because I cannot get her to orgasm every single time via oral.
> 
> ...


No offense but I'm trying to get help here. I'm not really worried about your feelings about my thread to help me with sex with my wife.

You are up on me anyway because my wife has never had an O through intercourse.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Casual Observer said:


> Is this going to be another thread that makes me feel totally inadequate because I can't get my wife to orgasm via PIV, like, ever? There were maybe two times in the 40 years we've been married?
> 
> Or for that matter, making me feel inadequate because I cannot get her to orgasm every single time via oral.
> 
> ...


You should not worry about this. Keep in mind that 75% - 80% of women can NOT orgasm from PIV. 

It has to do with the way the woman is built down there.


"Research indicates that up to 80 percent of women cannot reach orgasm through intercourse (or do so only occasionally). That means fewer than a quarter of women climax through thrusting alone, no matter how big his penis is, no matter how long he lasts, and no matter how you feel about him.

The clitoris, not the vagina, is the female sex organ. It’s where the majority of nerve endings that lead to orgasm are found. When you touch yourself, you know how hard or soft, and how slow or fast, to do it to reach orgasm. In most sexual positions, however, the penis doesn’t provide enough direct or indirect stimulation on the clitoris to lead to orgasm."

https://www.besthealthmag.ca/best-you/relationships/is-it-normal-not-to-orgasm-from-intercourse/​
Women who can orgasm from PIV alone generally have their clitoris positioned closer to their vaginal opening so during PIV, their clitoris is more directly stimulated.


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## CraigBesuden (Jun 20, 2019)

75% to 80% of women never have a vaginal orgasm. The experts conclude from this that the remaining women are unable to orgasm from PIV. I don’t believe that conclusions follows.

I think Starfires is of the opinion that nearly all women CAN, they just haven’t had the right partner. I tend to agree.

There are many men who claim to have had countless partners and every one has PIV orgasms with them. I tend to largely believe these men.

I think it’s a combination of penis size and technique. Women who have PIV orgasms prefer larger penises.

I don’t see why anybody should care about whether this makes them feel bad, only whether it is true.


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## Plan 9 from OS (Jul 13, 2012)

Wow @ConanHub, I was just going to start a thread about this but you beat me to the punch. My thread was going to be a success story - so even better if this helps!

Wife and I had sex tonight. Aside from giving her a back rub with some petroleum jelly for about 10 minutes, there wasn't really much foreplay at all. On top of that, she's been on an antibiotic due to a sinus infection and pressure on her ear (though she was finally able to pop it twice today and get some relief). And finally...we had a nice little run of daily sex from last Friday thru Sunday where she got her orgasms on the last 2 days. The point I''m trying to make was that she wasn't expecting much and even cautioned me to not get my hopes up that I would give her an orgasm tonight.

Earlier in the day, I took a few moments and was rereading some articles and various sex position guides - paying particular attention to those positions (along with variations of positions) that would aid in stimulating the G spot and/or the A spot. Right before I started to give her a back rub, I suggested that we should peruse some of the sex position guides and pick something new we haven't done or something we haven't done in a long time. She was not up for that and gave me the "maybe next time...". I responded with something along the lines of "okay, sounds good" - and she said let's just do missionary because sometimes you take forever if you're standing up (we do a fair number of different positions at the edge of the bed where I'm always standing). I said "okay" - but inside my head I told myself "**** it, I'm going for A-spot and if I hit the G-spot on the way then that's cool too". I then told her I want you to put a pillow under your butt if we're doing missionary. She asks "why do you want me to do that?" and I respond with "I want to try something different - just do it" (not in a mean tone though!). 

We started have sex but it took a short while of gentle pushing and extremely shallow pushing to get enough lubrication started, and once there was enough lubrication - I CONCENTRATED and NOTED my OBSERVATIONS throughout the entire time we had sex. I did all sorts of stroke variations - shallow, deep, short and quick shallow, short and quick deep, long and slow, long and fast, grinding and even a little straight up and down - all varied and trying to be as random as possible until I sensed that she was getting really into a particular stroke pattern. And I also FOCUSED and did my absolute best to try to have my shaft in contact with the top wall of her vaginal canal the entire time we had sex. If it felt like I was angling downward, I'd try my best to reorient myself so that I went back to riding along the whole top wall. It was interesting, because I focused on the sensations i felt and tried my absolute hardest to read her movements. I normally try to do this every time - but this time I was on a mission. Whenever it felt like she was trying to guide me a certain way - I followed. LOL, early in the act I was trying to get her angled a little higher by trying to get her ankles onto my shoulders (note, there was a pillow under her ass already to get some tilt to begin with). She asked me "what are you doing"? I responded with "just trying something a little different". And her response to that...."shut up and let me enjoy this"! LOL, okay - she's in complete control on this one I thought to myself! Throughout the whole time, I concentrated and tried particularly hard to read her as best as I could - like I said earlier. She's almost never very vocal during sex - even when we have the house to ourselves - which is probably due to having years of kids under the roof. But it was great to hear positive feedback from her - rapid breathing, deep breathing and several soft and sustainable moans through a good portion of the encounter.

To cut to the chase - she got her PIV orgasm. No external clit stimulation by hands or external devices, no nipple stimulation for her (which normally drives her wild). So nice little feather in my cap that I got her a legit PIVO orgasm tonight. At the end, she actually told me the following "Well, I found my spot. After 23 years, I finally found my spot. That's what you always ask me, so just to let you know I found it". I felt pretty awesome - and quite surprised actually! One of our issues with sex is that she is not big on talking about sex - at all. So trying to figure out what really works can be a challenge sometimes. Now, I'm highly confident that over the years I have hit "her spot" before - probably numerous times - but being carried away while in the act she probably never really concentrated on it. Surprisingly, I think she did the same thing I was trying and she tried to concentrate more and focus more on what she was feeling - dare I say she was doing her own exploring too!

Here is where it gets interesting. After she said that I found her spot, I asked her where exactly was I hitting - more shallow or was it deeper in. She said "I felt it everywhere". I'll admit, I'm kinda confused by that but I know that she won't talk about this much longer and my working assumption for this is that maybe concentrating so much on the top of the vaginal wall that I might have hit both spots??? IDK. I did ask her if she had a really powerful orgasm. She said it wasn't very powerful but it did feel really good. That also confuses me as well because I KNOW that I wasn't directly stimulating her clit and my observations plus her verbal feedback told me that I gave her a legit PIVO orgasm. But I'm surprised that it wasn't as intense as I thought it would be. My thoughts are that 1) we didn't do a whole lot of foreplay, 2) there's A LOT of stuff going on in our lives with the middle child starting college and the oldest moving out in little more than a month from now and 3) she started back at work since school started this week. So perhaps her orgasm wasn't so powerful because there are a number of headwinds IRL that may be playing a role. IDK.

I don't know if this helps much, but distilling this down into a real short one liner - we tried missionary with a pillow under her ass, and it was the extra elevation that resulted in the PIVO orgasm that she had tonight. For those curious, I too had an orgasm... LOL.


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## lifeistooshort (Mar 17, 2013)

I experienced this for the first time with my current guy.....I really didn't think I could do it.

When it first happened all I could think was "what the hell just happened?". It was great but quite different then a clitoral orgasm.

It's now happened a number of times with him and I think it has to do with the angle that results from him being so much bigger then me, but I'm still trying to figure it out.

So don't give up.....it can still happen.


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## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

ConanHub said:


> No offense but I'm trying to get help here. I'm not really worried about your feelings about my thread to help me with sex with my wife.
> 
> You are up on me anyway because my wife has never had an O through intercourse.


actually I think you and I are on the same page as this one. I could have started the exact same thread, same text, and I think a part of you might have had a similar reaction to mine. 

What I left out might have been the most-important part though. 

Time to study what’s coming (so to speak) and put words into action!


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## BioFury (Jul 9, 2015)

Maybe try this? I obviously don't have any first hand experience, but some posters elsewhere spoke very highly of it.

https://talkaboutmarriage.com/sex-marriage/435277-taoist-nine-step-anyone-tried.html


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Thank you @Plan 9 from OS

Good data and it goes well with what I have found so far.

Great milestone BTW and congrats!:smile2:

Thanks for that info as well @lifeistooshort I'm sure it can happen with Mrs. C as well. She has been really close a couple of times.


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## Tasorundo (Apr 1, 2012)

This thread cracks me up with it's anecdotal nature. Let's just assume that Mybaby is telling the truth, and then lets assume that he has had sex with 1000 women (both of those are exaggerations) then he would have encountered 0.0000003% of the women on earth. Hardly a representative sample.


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## minimalME (Jan 3, 2012)

And assuming that none of the women lied to him. 



Tasorundo said:


> This thread cracks me up with it's anecdotal nature. *Let's just assume that Mybaby is telling the truth*, and then lets assume that he has had sex with 1000 women (both of those are exaggerations) then he would have encountered 0.0000003% of the women on earth. Hardly a representative sample.


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## Lila (May 30, 2014)

minimalME said:


> And assuming that none of the women lied to him. <a href="http://talkaboutmarriage.com/images/smilies/smile.gif" border="0" alt="" title="Smile" ></a>
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I'm not trying to take the wind out of anyone's sails but that's exactly what I was thinking when I read his claims. When Harry Met Sally is coming to mind.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Lila said:


> I'm not trying to take the wind out of anyone's sails but that's exactly what I was thinking when I read his claims. When Harry Met Sally is coming to mind.


I have no pride when it comes to the possibility of getting it on better with Mrs. C.:grin2::wink2:


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## Lila (May 30, 2014)

ConanHub said:


> Lila said:
> 
> 
> > I'm not trying to take the wind out of anyone's sails but that's exactly what I was thinking when I read his claims. When Harry Met Sally is coming to mind.
> ...


Oh I'm not referring to your thread. I'm referring to babysgotto 's claims that he got every woman he's slept with to have a PIV orgasm. Maybe he did, maybe he didn't. I just want to know how he KNEW this is what happened.


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## minimalME (Jan 3, 2012)

Because I've always been able to give myself amazing orgasms, the technicality of not having them with men hasn't bothered me. But the lack of caring on their part has. 

As a woman, I find it deeply touching that you (and so many of the men here) show interest and put forth the effort in a way that strengthens your marriage.




ConanHub said:


> I have no pride when it comes to the possibility of getting it on better with Mrs. C.:grin2::wink2:


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Lila said:


> Oh I'm not referring to your thread. I'm referring to babysgotto 's claims that he got every woman he's slept with to have a PIV orgasm. Maybe he did, maybe he didn't. I just want to know how he KNEW this is what happened.


That is why some narrowing questions were in order.

Regardless, I am interested in his experience.


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## Tasorundo (Apr 1, 2012)

I am with you Conan, there is nothing I would not do to improve the experience for my wife. Reading, searching, buying, trying, whatever it might be I am down for it.

My issue was more with the original claim, and really the Starfires mentality that their miniscule sample is representative of the whole. They just do not have the capacity, tools, or time to make such claims.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Tasorundo said:


> I am with you Conan, there is nothing I would not do to improve the experience for my wife. Reading, searching, buying, trying, whatever it might be I am down for it.
> 
> My issue was more with the original claim, and really the Starfires mentality that their miniscule sample is representative of the whole. They just do not have the capacity, tools, or time to make such claims.


Starfires knocked a door open concerning Mrs. Conan that I didn't even know was there.

I'm not the only man that thinks she is accurate about possibly a lot of women.

The dude might have some insight as well. I don't discount someone's experience. Some folks have certain results.

A lot of people had difficulty believing I never encountered a woman who was low drive or wasn't into sex but it is what it is for me.


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## Plan 9 from OS (Jul 13, 2012)

ConanHub said:


> Starfires knocked a door open concerning Mrs. Conan that I didn't even know was there.
> 
> I'm not the only man that thinks she is accurate about possibly a lot of women.
> 
> ...


I too think there is something to increasing the odds of PIV orgasms if you can figure out if there are sensitive areas inside that are distinct from the clitoris. Based on the experiences with my wife - especially last night - I think there is something to the G spot and A spot that could unlock PIV orgasm to more women. I fully understand that for a percentage of women PIV is never attainable; however instead of 75% of women not being able to have them maybe it's closer to 50%.

ETA, I believe I have hit these spots over the years with my wife. However, last night was the first time we consciously tried to key on these areas. Otherwise, during the normal course of having sex my wife will have a PIV orgasm only 20 - 30% of the time. The balance is normally where I can only get her so far and then I bring her orgasm via clitoral stimulation after PIV is done. And you can definitely get a PIV orgasm by "cheating" - either thru clitoral stimulation with a vibe, fingers, etc or clitoral stimulation thru contact with the pubic bone or via the coital alignment technique.


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## Mybabysgotit (Jul 1, 2019)

ConanHub said:


> @Mybabysgotit posted on another thread that he has never been with a woman that hasn't orgasmed from penetration alone?
> 
> I would really like to ask some questions if he wouldn't mind answering.
> 
> ...


Let me first preface my statement with this. First: the girls that I have been with in my life weren't exactly virgins. Even from a young age, I can't think of a single girl i've been with that hasn't had multiple partners, and thinking back, all were kind of cut from the same cloth: tattoos, smokers, partyers. . Second: Now that I think about it, I would like to qualify the statement I made from when I met my first real LTR at age of 19, the ones before that, I really don't know if they did or not as most were one night stands and that kind of thing.

So I truly believe men don't give women orgasms. A woman must know her body well and know how to give herself an orgasm (from statement above). Also, a big part of it is in her mind. If she isn't present, it won't happen so I think the woman has to trust her guy enough to follow his lead. That trust won't happen if she doesn't respect him (I found that out with my first LTR towards the demise of the relationship) He has to be confident to lead her and turn her on enough where all those little thoughts about everything else that's going on in her head disappear. 

In women i've been with, there's some spots in her that when you hit it, you'll know cause she will move/buck a little and moan differently (every single girl i've been with pretty much does the same thing when those spots are hit). When you hit that spot (it's weird cause the feel good spots can move sometimes, well maybe not move but one time you'll go deep right, then next it'll be angle up on top wall and slide it, etc).
move with her as she moves (it's not in and out like we like it, but it's in and out a very little maybe an inch or two coupled with grinding and pushing (just grind with her and move with her as she moves, you'll know). Sometimes it will take a while, which is bad cause then you have to ride it out with her and i'm older so I get all kinds of aches and pains now. But if you stop moving with her cause your tired or to achy, then she can get upset and she'll let you know you suck....lol. That's okay sometimes, but you can't do it all the time. 

About 50% of the time (those times when she totally with you) then you only have to ride with her for a few minutes and life is good. For me, I'd rather have sex my way, in and out and various positions but the girls i've been with don't really like that. I have never made a woman orgasm as they do on porn just with the in and out motion, i haven't even had one come close doing it that way

So to recap, I don't think i'm doing anything different than any other guy, but maybe it's the type of women i've been with.


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## Mybabysgotit (Jul 1, 2019)

Tasorundo said:


> This thread cracks me up with it's anecdotal nature. Let's just assume that Mybaby is telling the truth, and then lets assume that he has had sex with 1000 women (both of those are exaggerations) then he would have encountered 0.0000003% of the women on earth. Hardly a representative sample.


statistics don't really work like that, or actually they don't work like that at all. And no, I have not been with a 1000 woman, it's not a high count, I would guess maybe 30 or so throughout my life, with maybe 10 of those being when I was 14-19 and I don't count those.


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## Tasorundo (Apr 1, 2012)

Of course they work like that, your sample is not representative of the world. Furthermore, your elaboration of your sample makes it even less like the rest of the world as most women would fall outside of your description.

I do agree with you, that women that have PIVO are more likely to know how it happens and be able to assist, if not cause it to happen repeatedly. They are more likely to have experienced it either alone, or with a partner and understand what was happening and how to build towards it.

However, your experiences are to be viewed in light of your sampling technique which I would bet eliminates almost all of the wives that these husbands talk about.


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## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

Plan 9 from OS said:


> And you can definitely get a PIV orgasm by "cheating" - either thru clitoral stimulation with a vibe, fingers, etc or clitoral stimulation thru contact with the pubic bone or via the coital alignment technique.


I wish. My wife will not go for that (vibrator, fingers, etc) and coiltal alignment technique has not yet worked. I think it possible that bringing her close to the edge orally then cat might do the trick, but if she gets close and doesn't, she's very, very frustrated. So risking a lot it if doesn't work out. And so far refuses to consider stimulating herself.


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## Somearebiased (Aug 21, 2019)

Sorry Conan didn’t mean anything bad by my comments just tried to share what’s worked for me. God bless


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## jorgegene (May 26, 2012)

Mybabysgotit said:


> Let me first preface my statement with this. First: the girls that I have been with in my life weren't exactly virgins. Even from a young age, I can't think of a single girl i've been with that hasn't had multiple partners, and thinking back, all were kind of cut from the same cloth: tattoos, smokers, partyers. . Second: Now that I think about it, I would like to qualify the statement I made from when I met my first real LTR at age of 19, the ones before that, I really don't know if they did or not as most were one night stands and that kind of thing.
> 
> So I truly believe men don't give women orgasms. A woman must know her body well and know how to give herself an orgasm (from statement above). Also, a big part of it is in her mind. If she isn't present, it won't happen so I think the woman has to trust her guy enough to follow his lead. That trust won't happen if she doesn't respect him (I found that out with my first LTR towards the demise of the relationship) He has to be confident to lead her and turn her on enough where all those little thoughts about everything else that's going on in her head disappear.
> 
> ...


i think this makes your experience much more clear and personal. 
correct me if i'm wrong, but i didn't think you were implying that just because of your experiences that all guys should be able to do this with every gal.


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## CraigBesuden (Jun 20, 2019)

Mybabysgotit said:


> In women i've been with, there's some spots in her that *when you hit it, you'll know cause she will move/buck a little and moan differently* (every single girl i've been with pretty much does the same thing when those spots are hit). When you hit that spot (it's weird cause *the feel good spots can move sometimes, well maybe not move but one time you'll go deep right, then next it'll be angle up on top wall and slide it, etc).*
> 
> *move with her as she moves * (it's not in and out like we like it, but it's in and out a very little maybe an inch or two coupled with grinding and pushing (just grind with her and move with her as she moves, you'll know). *Sometimes it will take a while*, which is bad cause then you have to ride it out with her and i'm older so I get all kinds of aches and pains now. But *if you stop moving with her cause your tired or to achy, then she can get upset and she'll let you know you suck....lol.* That's okay sometimes, but you can't do it all the time.


Makes sense. That’s how it is with my W and cunnilingus. Except if she’s jerking her clit away from your tongue, you don’t want to move with her. If she’s moving away involuntarily because she’s orgasming, then by all means move with her to keep the pressure/angle/speed consistent on her clit.

If your neck hurts from being craned (or you hear “that’s it, don’t stop” when her pooch is blocking your nostrils and you’re about to gasp for air), move her to the end of the bed and kneel down. It sucks when she’s so close but you need to stop.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Tasorundo said:


> Of course they work like that, your sample is not representative of the world. Furthermore, your elaboration of your sample makes it even less like the rest of the world as most women would fall outside of your description.
> 
> I do agree with you, that women that have PIVO are more likely to know how it happens and be able to assist, if not cause it to happen repeatedly. They are more likely to have experienced it either alone, or with a partner and understand what was happening and how to build towards it.
> 
> However, your experiences are to be viewed in light of your sampling technique which I would bet eliminates almost all of the wives that these husbands talk about.


This thread actually isn't about this and I invited him to share here. If you want to argue statistics, please open a different thread.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Somearebiased said:


> Sorry Conan didn’t mean anything bad by my comments just tried to share what’s worked for me. God bless


You're fine partner. I appreciate your willingness to help.:smile2:


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## Tasorundo (Apr 1, 2012)

ConanHub said:


> This thread actually isn't about this and I invited him to share here. If you want to argue statistics, please open a different thread.


While there was an opening about his comment on statistics, I felt that the post was in line with what this thread is discussing.

This thread is about PIVO, right? How his experiences might influence others and what about his experiences that make his success rate seem high? That seems to be what my post is about.


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## Tasorundo (Apr 1, 2012)

I would also add to this, that in my very limited exposure to women (married young and still married), she is not a fan of G-spot or A-Spot stimulation, in fact we have to avoid certain positions because the deep penetration is uncomfortable for her. Not that I am some huge guy, I am just a larger person than she is so things fall that way.

I have tried multiple times to stimulate those areas with other things, toys, fingers, etc, and they don't really produce any results. At one time we had a rabbit, and that would get her off, but through experimenting it was more the rabbit ears than anything else. Just using that part produced the same results, and actually was faster than the whole thing.

I am always open to working on things and there are always more things to try, but I do think it is very possible that some women can just not PIVO without clitoral stimulation.

The only time she has finished from just penetration was when she was on top, and situated in a way that put a lot more pressure and friction on her clitoris than anything inside. In fact, she has finished without me actually being inside in that position.


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## Affaircare (Jan 11, 2010)

Speaking as a lady of a certain age, and as someone who does have PIVO and who knows where her own G-spot and A-spot are, let me see if I can share without being too immodest. 

Now, one thing that is extremely important for the fella is that the lady in the couple HAS TO know her own body. As much as most ladies usually get the pleasure from the top wall being stroked, on me it's reversed...I totally roll my eyes in the back of my head from the bottom being stroked. So just because you hear "top wall" don't think that means it's that way for your lady. You will likely have to try and try again until SHE figures out what does it for her. As for me, the typical missionary doesn't work for me nearly as well as something like doggy because honestly I believe I'm upside down! LOL So that's point #1. 

Point #2, in my head, I have long thought of it as having 3 areas that I find very pleasureable: clitty, inner wall, and deep/belly-button spot. Each one has it's own thing. Clitty is like small bits of electricity, and I think we all sort of get that O. Inner wall for me is partway in, and what happens is that spot is found and stroked (with finger, penis head, etc.) and WOOHOO. Then it feels like an intense muscle grip and it's waves of O all up and down the vajayjay. Finally the deep belly button spot is the one that is as deep as you can and grind on it a bit and that kind of movement is what gets wetness going, and eventually makes my eyes roll in the back of my head...BUT it's not as intense as the inner wall one. It's just different. It has its own style of O.

Finally, point #3...if you find a good spot, and you do the exact same stroke, the exact same pace, the exact same everything in the good spot...there are different Os. One O is like I said waves and waves of pleasure. Another is like a clamp down. Another is like a train hit you and WTF mind-blowing. Another is like one good minute of O followed by shocks. Another is shocks that never end. My point here is that you aren't going to get the train O every time, even if you do it perfect and hit all the same stuff as the last train. BUT there will be an O! So don't always strive for "the train"...because by trying for that one every time you might miss out on a really great "shocks that never end" one...and trust me that one is awesome because it's so long. Also sometimes it takes 5 minutes to relax and concentrate enough to "get there" and other times exact same pace and strokes but it takes 15 minutes to relax and concentrate enough to "get there"--there is all kinds of stuff that feeds into the mix that results in what kind of O your lady has. 

So find the spots--keep practicing to find where HER spots are, even if it seems "wrong" to you or like "that can't be the place." Next, when you do find a spot and a stroke or grind that really feels good, keep doing that...don't change it up. Changing it up actually stops the forward progress  Lastly, don't aim for a certain "kind" of O...just let her have the O she has.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Tasorundo said:


> While there was an opening about his comment on statistics, I felt that the post was in line with what this thread is discussing.
> 
> This thread is about PIVO, right? How his experiences might influence others and what about his experiences that make his success rate seem high? That seems to be what my post is about.


This thread was all about me.:grin2:

Me asking another man about sex to possibly help improve my sexual relationship with my wife.

Anyone else that wants to help me possibly improve my sex life with my wife is more than welcome.

I invited him, he graciously accepted and others have both contributed and possibly benefitted themselves.

I don't want the man I asked to this thread to help me being grilled and challenged about statistics.

If he has advice that helps, and he does, that is all that is pertaining to this thread.

I opened this in the sex in marriage forum because I have an issue I would like to be helped with.

Social spot would have been a little more open for statistics vs. anecdotal stuff.:wink2:


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Tasorundo said:


> I would also add to this, that in my very limited exposure to women (married young and still married), she is not a fan of G-spot or A-Spot stimulation, in fact we have to avoid certain positions because the deep penetration is uncomfortable for her. Not that I am some huge guy, I am just a larger person than she is so things fall that way.
> 
> I have tried multiple times to stimulate those areas with other things, toys, fingers, etc, and they don't really produce any results. At one time we had a rabbit, and that would get her off, but through experimenting it was more the rabbit ears than anything else. Just using that part produced the same results, and actually was faster than the whole thing.
> 
> ...


This is good stuff. Mrs. C is stimulated nicely in her G and A spot but I didn't find them until @StarFires opened my eyes on the subject.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Thank you @Affaircare

That is useful. Mrs. C seems to start responding in missionary but she absolutely loves doggy so I will experiment in that position too!:smile2:


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

The clitoral shaft and clitoral sheath that runs to the very top is very sensitive and in DW preferences her most pleasurable.

Pubic bone to pubic bone is one good method for us. And I can say it's the left side of the shaft just above the clitoris that is the most sensitive for her.

This is tmi but it's only after years of getting to know her body that I know this, and during oral sex I've often tested and proved this.

With many of the pre marriage women the bone to bone was always a good method. And making the effort of being in tune with her body language, gotta be observant. 

Many women liked to be on top and would rest her hands on my chest and rock forward and back while sitting up, and orgasm many times.

I changed positions during sex to anything I wanted to do or try, that was one of my things, and during different positions made a point to realize which was her favorite, and would change back to that when she was getting ready.

Another good clit area stimulation position is for woman to be on top, laying flat head on chest, and her legs together. She can't move on her own so the man is responsible to move her body up and down, and can cup her butt, stimulating more down there for her.

Sometimes I'd put both hands on her ass and grind her up and down, and when the woman moans just so, you've got the right rhythm and speed. 

Sometimes her on her back, laying on top of you, her legs spread so you can reach her clit, move her body up and down, while gently, or harder (her call) your fingers spread each one on either side of her clit shaft/area, and move her as fast as she shows you she wants. Other hand playing with her breasts.

Same thing, her legs together.

Her laying flat on you gives full body to body contact while same time stimulates her clit area, and many of my partners would explode in this position. In this position some will start playing with their clit while you have both arms on her body all the way down, and your hands one on either side of her vajajay, fingers running down gripping each side between her legs firmly, and all this contact plus the piv is just great.

The woman sitting up rocking was so popular I'd get that old rubbed red area at the base of my Johnson, and had to keep lotion in it during the day. 

And having an encounter on a firm mattress, or floor is great, that hard support keeps the grinding productive and hard if she wants it. A firm base is critical.


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## Mybabysgotit (Jul 1, 2019)

ConanHub said:


> This thread was all about me.:grin2:
> 
> Me asking another man about sex to possibly help improve my sexual relationship with my wife.
> 
> ...


So Conan, you say that your wife is almost there. That tells me that a couple of things. One, she is not relaxed enough to allow her body to fully accept it. If that's the case, try and massage her first and tease her for a long time before anything. candles, colored lights, soft music, coconut oil does wonders. Maybe even lick all around the area but don't touch her there, more just palm above her thing upwards and kiss around.

Or two, you might have to do a couple other things that aren't a lot of fun for you:

If my wife is almost there, I can usually get here there by either grabbing her ass very firmly, lifting and squeezing it and firmly squeezing down her legs. Forcibly, but not painfully. Not saying this will work for your wife, but it does mine. Another thing is her tits are completely off limits until she's really horny, then if she's almost there, she needs hard stimulation on them. So soft bitting and licking works as well. Both of those things make me lose my erection if I don't concentrate really well (again, i'm older) and I'd rather not do them, but I do cause I know after I can do what I want and she's cool with it. But you have to remember to keep rocking with her, like dancing i guess just move in rythym with her body the whole time and like someone else said, keep the pace steady.

somebody mentioned something about me implying all women can orgasm with me. I didn't want to imply that, all I said was that I don't believe the 80% statistic. And yes, my population is probably very different than the next guy HERE, but not in my old circle of friends.

Conan mentioned he never been with a women who didn't like sex. That has been my experience also, however, many men on here say their wives don't like sex. So if someone said, statistically 80% of married women don't like sex, I would have called BS on that too.

I think affaircare said it well. I don't know the different zones and spots, I just know how to read a woman and that's not hard cause they tell you one way or another. I have never had a women actually achieve an orgasm through the so called G spot. I know it feels really good for them and I do it, but in my experience, it never itself led to an orgasm.


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## MJJEAN (Jun 26, 2015)

lifeistooshort said:


> I experienced this for the first time with my current guy.....I really didn't think I could do it.


I think this is the issue for a LOT of the women that cannot orgasm from PIV. Many of them haven't and don't believe they can. 

So, @ConanHub what's your wife's take on this? Does she truly believe it will happen and it's merely a matter of figuring out how or does she think deep down that it's just not ever going to happen? Her mindset might be a barrier to progress if she doesn't believe.

Also, how you have sex can make a big difference. 

I have vaginal orgasms from PIV and clitoral orgasms from manual and oral. I have had my share of partners, including ONS and FWB, and can report that I have had very few orgasmless sexual experiences. Not because my partners were all great lovers, though some were mindblowing, but because I know how to make myself orgasm from PIV. I know what angles and positions work and in what situations.

For example, I orgasm 100% of the time if I'm on top. I orgasm about 45-60% of the time if in doggy style position. The variation is penis size and exact angle. I do not orgasm as reliably in missionary position. Maybe 25% of the time. It seems height, exact angle, and just all around style play a role there. Not gonna go through the whole Kama Sutra, you guys get the point.

I suggest trying different positions and angles within those positions. Get Wife aroused and let her use you as a living sex toy. Let her take the lead on top, not with any particular goal in mind, just playing around with what feels good, see how close she can bring herself. Do the same in other positions. Hopefully, she'll figure out what works and then you two can expand on it.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

MJJEAN said:


> I think this is the issue for a LOT of the women that cannot orgasm from PIV. Many of them haven't and don't believe they can.
> 
> So, @ConanHub what's your wife's take on this? Does she truly believe it will happen and it's merely a matter of figuring out how or does she think deep down that it's just not ever going to happen? Her mindset might be a barrier to progress if she doesn't believe.
> 
> ...


She will not take lead or try. When something works, she definitely lets us both know she likes it and will even comment afterwards.

She certainly has some mental barriers but if she starts feeling it, she doesn't think at all. The problem has been absolutely no communication from her about it. This is something like a puzzle that I almost have figured out.

She has come close on top but only with me grabbing her hips while I am all the way up,(I am literally pushing her wall out) and moving her back and forth rapidly. This is usually more stimulation than I can take for very long because my stuff is being squeezed and squished very tightly.


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## Rooster2015 (Jun 12, 2015)

Somearebiased said:


> My wife has vaginal orgasms every single time we made love or **** each other’s brains out. Maybe I’m just blessed w an easy to get off woman but I seem to be made for her physically I’m in the Goldilocks zone for penis size and girth for her particular vagina. Try hitting the a spot and rubbing her clit not to orgasm but getting her real excited. I talk lots of smut and say dirty things and she gets so horny. Make her cum after she gets hot enough and commands you too! My wife loves having some dominance and control maybe 2 out of 10 encounters. Good luck, good lick and god bless.


I’m the same as you.


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## CraigBesuden (Jun 20, 2019)

Somearebiased said:


> Try hitting the a spot and rubbing her clit not to orgasm but getting her real excited. I talk lots of smut and say dirty things and she gets so horny.


That’s one downside of my old approach (cunnilingus for her, then PIV for me). She wants me to talk dirty to her but it makes it hard to concentrate. I’m going to try the dirty talk, hitting the A spot, and not focus on myself at all.


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## ShatteredKat (Mar 23, 2016)

A thought

there are sex toys "for men to wear" that are intended to stimulate the clitoris during coitus

lots of choices - and I have one that works on the Boss.


the other thing is "sex starts way before the bedroom" - women generally take some time to get in the mood and joking with them earlier in the PM that her cooking timer is the smoke alarm isn't exactly likely to push here in that direction (not saying you aren't or are doing)


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## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

MJJEAN said:


> I think this is the issue for a LOT of the women that cannot orgasm from PIV. Many of them haven't and don't believe they can.


I think it's the "don't believe they can" that may be key. Particularly when the person hoping they will, and doing his best to try, is her husband or LTR partner. If it's been going on for years like this, why should anything change now? Given that so much of sexuality is in the mind, not just the physical bits & sparks, some may need a complete rethink to get things going. And that may require someone other than their partner advising them.

Maybe?


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## badsanta (Oct 13, 2014)

ConanHub said:


> @StarFires gave some great advice that got me going in a more accurate direction with her but having the male perspective could help me as well. Many other TAMmers have helped over the years as well so don't anyone feel left out.


 @ConanHub if you already have a great deal of female advice on this topic, I doubt a male perspective that is 100% successful will help. Generally speaking people learn more through failure than they do success. 

In my opinion if PIVO is going to be achieved, I'll offer you this advice. It is 90% the woman's efforts and awareness of her own body that will make it happen. The 10% effort from the male partner is to NOT do anything distracting, vary stimulation, or accidentally climax too soon.

When you make an attempt and get close a few times but not all the way, it is possible to gradually add alternate forms of stimulation. But this is a catch-22 because the resulting orgasm may not exactly be PIVO. If by chance your wife enjoys breast stimulation, this may be your best bet as that is a very natural form of stimulation. You will want to avoid breast stimulation almost totally during foreplay and initially during sex. Since varying stimulation can be very distracting to a woman, you do NOT want to start doing this just moments before. The best strategy is once it may happen go ahead and add breast stimulation but still avoid the nipples. As she gets closer you gradually get closer to her nipples. Then as she needs just a little extra push to get over the edge THEN go for the nipples since you are already right there. Too soon and it might overstimulate them and start to annoy her. Too late and she may just not have enough energy remaining to get there.

If it still will not happen and you need to cheat just a little. Try finding a vibrator that you can wedge and hold with your bodies (meaning hands free) into just the right spot as the two of you are grinding. Generally speaking a vibrator overcomes the laws of "don't do anything distracting" so it should work at anytime as long as you have one hidden somewhere within hand's reach. However the wife may get frustrated if she was set on trying to PIVO without one. Depending on how powerful the vibrator is, it may be able to ALSO overcome her disappointment of not getting to finish trying to PIVO without one. But heaven forbid the thing is not fully charged and only lasts 3-4 minutes before shutting off automatically. If that happens do not pass go and do not collect $200. Don't fool yourself by thinking that a vibrator is fully charged because you did that yourself the day before, as the battery could be empty by the time you get to it. If that happens, it also explains why a wife might get upset when you try to use one, cause she already knows you are about to fail, but it is still totally your fault for doing something that "distracted" her. 

Regards, 
Badsanta


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## Plan 9 from OS (Jul 13, 2012)

ConanHub said:


> She will not take lead or try. When something works, she definitely lets us both know she likes it and will even comment afterwards.
> 
> She certainly has some mental barriers but if she starts feeling it, she doesn't think at all. The problem has been absolutely no communication from her about it. This is something like a puzzle that I almost have figured out.
> 
> She has come close on top but only with me grabbing her hips while I am all the way up,(I am literally pushing her wall out) and moving her back and forth rapidly. This is usually more stimulation than I can take for very long because my stuff is being squeezed and squished very tightly.


My wife is similar in that she doesn't like talking about sex, so it's very hard to get verbal feedback regarding what feels good. Sometimes she'll give it and sometimes we can talk about our intimacy (though only a very short period of time!) but it's rare. So like you, I'm in a similar boat.


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## Plan 9 from OS (Jul 13, 2012)

An important question to consider for yourself is "what will success look like to you"? Is the goal you want to achieve based on what I would consider a "purist" view of PIVO where any stimulation beyond PIV is a "failure", or are you more open to getting her to orgasm by whatever means necessary so long as you are having PIV? If it's the former, then I believe your research and efforts will be pretty much restricted to G-spot, A-spot and P-spot (not sure if this is a real thing) stimulation alone. If it's the latter, then IMHO the easiest key will be to figure out ways to get clitoral stimulation into the mix. In a number of cases, your approach will be diametrically opposed. For example, take the missionary position. If you're trying to give MC a PIVO orgasm that avoids using clitoral stimulation as a "crutch", then you're looking to tilt her pelvis up and you'll need to do a similar approach where you're possibly putting pillows under her ass, resting her feet on your chest, shoulders, etc. You can still have PIV sex, give MC her orgasm while you are doing missionary but you'll take the exact opposite approach to G spot hunting. That would put you in the realm of the CAT (coital alignment technique). If this sounds appealing to you, then consider switching gears for a moment and try the CAT.


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## Lurkster (Feb 8, 2016)

MJJEAN said:


> Many of them haven't and don't believe they can.



This was true for my wife. 
For a long time, she didn't have O's from PIV....until she did! (We were having an exceptional rousing afternoon!) 
And after she did have one....she learned that she _could!_ After that first one, they were common for her. 
It was just a matter of the right things and sequences of things that work for her.


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## badsanta (Oct 13, 2014)

Plan 9 from OS said:


> An important question to consider for yourself is "what will success look like to you"? Is the goal you want to achieve based on what I would consider a "purist" view of PIVO where any stimulation beyond PIV is a "failure", or are you more open to getting her to orgasm by whatever means necessary so long as you are having PIV? If it's the former, then I believe your research and efforts will be pretty much restricted to G-spot, A-spot and P-spot (not sure if this is a real thing) stimulation alone. If it's the latter, then IMHO the easiest key will be to figure out ways to get clitoral stimulation into the mix. In a number of cases, your approach will be diametrically opposed. For example, take the missionary position. If you're trying to give MC a PIVO orgasm that avoids using clitoral stimulation as a "crutch", then you're looking to tilt her pelvis up and you'll need to do a similar approach where you're possibly putting pillows under her ass, resting her feet on your chest, shoulders, etc. You can still have PIV sex, give MC her orgasm while you are doing missionary but you'll take the exact opposite approach to G spot hunting. That would put you in the realm of the CAT (coital alignment technique). If this sounds appealing to you, then consider switching gears for a moment and try the CAT.



I'll add to this that many women may be able to reach climax hands free via mental stimulation alone. If coincidentally PIV happens to be occurring at this time, would that be considered a success?


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

So some can have Os by us sitting across the room and thinking at a woman "yes, you, and now you're having an O"...

I've gotten them interested from across a room, but alas I've failed at remote O generation without her using fingers.

🙄🙄😁😁

(Humor) (maybe)


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## CraigBesuden (Jun 20, 2019)

> If you're trying to give MC a PIVO orgasm that avoids using clitoral stimulation as a "crutch", then you're looking to tilt her pelvis up and you'll need to do a similar approach where you're possibly putting pillows under her ass, resting her feet on your chest, shoulders, etc. You can still have PIV sex, give MC her orgasm while you are doing missionary but you'll take the exact opposite approach to G spot hunting. That would put you in the realm of the CAT (coital alignment technique). If this sounds appealing to you, then consider switching gears for a moment and try the CAT.


I believe the G spot and A spot are both on the top wall. The O spot is on the bottom, so you could hit the O spot by angling down with CAT (or just switch to doggy and angle upward).


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## badsanta (Oct 13, 2014)

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> So some can have Os by us sitting across the room and thinking at a woman "yes, you, and now you're having an O"...
> 
> I've gotten them interested from across a room, but alas I've failed at remote O generation without her using fingers.
> 
> ...


Humor aside, a good way to know if someone has this capability would be a discussion about how often one incurs orgasmic dreams during sleep. 

Call it the proverbial wet dream if you will, but it is a clear demonstration the someone can orgasm via stimulation exclusively from within the mind. In the event someone does not have wet dreams, then it may not be possible to attempt while conscious. 

I have a theory that women that can naturally PIVO easily are also the ones that often have some very exciting dreams at night. 

Regards, 
Badsanta


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

@badsanta 

That's a good point. I wasn't remembering to consider dreaming.


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## Plan 9 from OS (Jul 13, 2012)

CraigBesuden said:


> I believe the G spot and A spot are both on the top wall. The O spot is on the bottom, so you could hit the O spot by angling down with CAT (or just switch to doggy and angle upward).


I've seen that 3rd spot called the P, D and maybe O - not sure on that one. For those wondering, it's the Posterior Fornix which is even deeper than the A spot (Anterior Fornix) and you're supposed to go along the bottom of the vaginal canal to go for that spot. I short (LOL) if you are of average length you have a realistic shot of hitting the A-spot and should have zero problems hitting the G spot. However, the P (D or O) spot is supposedly only for those with a min of 7" of length or more. These assumptions are for typical anatomy since every woman is different and things can be shallower or deeper. 

It's the journey, not the destination (yeah, right!) so happy hunting!


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## Plan 9 from OS (Jul 13, 2012)

badsanta said:


> I'll add to this that many women may be able to reach climax hands free via mental stimulation alone. If coincidentally PIV happens to be occurring at this time, would that be considered a success?


Depends. Are you an idealist, realist or pragmatist?


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## Plan 9 from OS (Jul 13, 2012)

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> So some can have Os by us sitting across the room and thinking at a woman "yes, you, and now you're having an O"...
> 
> I've gotten them interested from across a room, but alas I've failed at remote O generation without her using fingers.
> 
> ...


Get her some remote controlled vibrating panties. And if you want to be really accomplished and not use your fingers...operate the remote with your feet. #sexgod


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## Plan 9 from OS (Jul 13, 2012)

Tonight the wife and I tried to replicate the success we had on Wed with the pillow under her butt for easier access to the top wall of the vagina for the g and a spot stimulation. Of course...it failed. I guess it's going to be a little different every time. Still hit the spot and she got "really close" (not sure how to quantify it?) but she didn't go.


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## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

Lurkster said:


> This was true for my wife.
> For a long time, she didn't have O's from PIV....until she did! (We were having an exceptional rousing afternoon!)
> And after she did have one....she learned that she _could!_ After that first one, they were common for her.
> It was just a matter of the right things and sequences of things that work for her.


That's what I was getting at earlier. The important of believing it possible. Having one, more will likely follow. The tough part is having to unlearn decades of knowing it's not possible.


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## Middle of Everything (Feb 19, 2012)

Conan havent read most of the thread but, Ill throw in a thought and a question.

My wife RARELY has O from PiV through doggy or missionary. Early on though we tried her on top and one time I told her the movement and pace were all up to her. O pretty much every time this way. Sometimes slow to get there but for me at least added benefit of not overly stimulating so easy to last.

Tried this? Or maybe looking for something different?


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## Lurkster (Feb 8, 2016)

Plan 9 from OS said:


> Tonight the wife and I tried to replicate the success we had on Wed with the pillow under her butt for easier access to the top wall of the vagina for the g and a spot stimulation. Of course...it failed. I guess it's going to be a little different every time. Still hit the spot and she got "really close" (not sure how to quantify it?) but she didn't go.


Oh darn. You two will have to try again!


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## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

@ConanHub does your wife do Kegel's?

The following questions apply equally to missionary positions, doggy style positions and her on top.

Likewise when penetrating her do, you use a rhythmic rolling and circular upward motion from the hips that rolls your penis up towards your belly while inside her?

It's kind of hard to describe, yet it's like doing an upward rolling motion and it generally isn't about doing any significant in and out thrusts.

If you do that motion, do you maintain it at a steady pace without release. Likewise using that motion when inside her do you, feel like you are locked between rollers that grip you above your penis and below with one roller more forward than the other?

If doing that motion, does your wife then roll with you as well in synch. So that it reaches a point where you are both so matched, that instead of it being about thrusting. That it becomes about matching and maintaining pressure to meet her tilting inside as she matches your rolling?

Does your wife like kissing while nearing orgasm and if she does have you noticed changes in how she kisses as she nears orgasm?

Not knowing what you have experienced as above, it's hard to take you where I am going so please bear with me.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Personal said:


> @ConanHub does your wife do Kegel's?
> 
> The following questions apply equally to missionary positions, doggy style positions and her on top.
> 
> ...


I'm taking in the technique you are describing.

She doesn't do kegels that I'm aware of andI haven't tried kissing her when she is getting close.

When she is getting close, she starts breathing heavier of course and moaning and sometimes gets a little frantic and aggressive.

I've done that technique before but only for a short period of time and I can't recall if she rolls back. Going to attempt it next time and pay attention.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

I can say that that this is a regular success for DW and I. 

And DW will match the rythm at a point when I'm finding her "rythm window" for that particular encounter, and her desired rhythms do vary.

Maintaining said rythm for a good bit is key for us, a steady period is what's required once she's building and enjoying knowing she'll get that ongoing stimulation that she'll be able to work it till she "gets there".

Now, I do enjoy starting it up then put the brakes on a couple of times. That can't be all the time, about half. Eventually she'll say now I'm just being mean and smack my chest. 

And once she's done if I've held off we give her now too sensitive parts time to "cool off" and I've carte blanche for anything I want.

When I'm doing oral on her it's also a steady rhythm once I'm in the right window and stopping at the wrong time is hazardous to my health. 

I prefer to have a good blues track going during this oral because that rythm helps me focus, and intro-verse-chorus repeat as needed helps me with duration. 

Who knew playing drums and guitar would be such a great help. This I learned early on. Go figure.


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## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

Still got lots more questions before I have suggestions that may help.

Have you had your penis inside your wife while she orgasms with other aids, plus if you have what does it feel like through the build up, peak, carry on and drop off?

Likewise have you had your finger/s inside your wife's vagina while she orgasms via whatever means, plus if you have what does it feel like through the build up, peak, carry on and drop off?

Also for a bonus have you had a finger, fingers or thumb in your wife's anus while she orgasms via whatever means, plus if you have what does it feel like through the build up, peak, carry on and drop off?

The reason I ask is womens orgasms feel different, when felt vaginally or anally.

Since the amplitude is greater and more easily felt via the anus than the vagina. Although it can certainly be felt through the vagina. Yet it's can be much more difficult to identify the exact moment, when or if the the peak occurs when the woman tips over into orgasm. While transitioning from the build up, when feeling it through the vagina. Which is why scientist who study such things, use probes in the backdoor to measure orgasms.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

Casual Observer said:


> Is this going to be another thread that makes me feel totally inadequate because I can't get my wife to orgasm via PIV, like, ever? There were maybe two times in the 40 years we've been married?
> 
> Or for that matter, making me feel inadequate because I cannot get her to orgasm every single time via oral.
> 
> ...


Please don't ever feel bad over this. Every couple is different. We are all different sizes and shapes and ages and we all like different things with our spouses. Your wife not having an orgasm while you have sex does not make you a worse lover or a bad lover or anything else, its one of those things that some women can and some can't. In fact stats say that the majority can't no matter what. Doesn't mean you are doing anything wrong AT ALL. 

Just carry on enjoying what you do enjoy and don't compare yourself to others, that's a bad idea.

I am fortunate that I have got to the age now were I am not bothered either way about what others do, say or think. Its very freeing. :smile2:


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## RideofmyLife (Dec 18, 2015)

"She will not take lead or try. When something works, she definitely lets us both know she likes it and will even comment afterwards.

She certainly has some mental barriers but if she starts feeling it, she doesn't think at all. The problem has been absolutely no communication from her about it. This is something like a puzzle that I almost have figured out.

She has come close on top but only with me grabbing her hips while I am all the way up,(I am literally pushing her wall out) and moving her back and forth rapidly. This is usually more stimulation than I can take for very long because my stuff is being squeezed and squished very tightly."

One thing you could try here if you would like to explore this a little bit more is to use a couple of condoms, double up on them to reduce sensation. Or you can get those silicone sleeves to wear over yourself. In addition to making you a little bit more girthy, it should also reduce your sensitivity and let you go longer. That might be enough to help her achieve PIVO in this position.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Personal said:


> Still got lots more questions before I have suggestions that may help.
> 
> Have you had your penis inside your wife while she orgasms with other aids, plus if you have what does it feel like through the build up, peak, carry on and drop off?
> 
> ...


Never had it inside while she climaxes. I have tried to help her get off while inside but my unit is too distracting for her to get off that way.

I have had a finger inside when it happens and she gets warmer and wetter building up and tightens up a little when it happens. She remains wet, warm and maybe a little tighter after the drop off.

Her anus is off limits.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

RideofmyLife said:


> "She will not take lead or try. When something works, she definitely lets us both know she likes it and will even comment afterwards.
> 
> She certainly has some mental barriers but if she starts feeling it, she doesn't think at all. The problem has been absolutely no communication from her about it. This is something like a puzzle that I almost have figured out.
> 
> ...


I might just sneak this in. She doesn't want anything besides me so I would have to pull a fast one on her.:grin2:


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## Plan 9 from OS (Jul 13, 2012)

Have you tried having her lay on her side at the edge of the bed and you enter her from behind while standing? I got my wife to orgasm this way vaginally last night. Our bed is pretty high (we have a memory foam style mattress) so at the edge of the bed may not work for you without some props. When my wife is on her side - ass slightly over the edge of the bed - I have A LOT of flexibility in how I angle myself. Also last month she had a pretty powerful orgasm when she was on top. Her torso was upright so I was in pretty deep and could definitely tell that I was hitting the top (front?) wall of the canal. PIVO has gotten easier with the info in your PIVO threads plus starfire's comments from an even earlier thread. 

My wife has a hard time talking about sex, so any conversations afterwards are very short and normally ends up with me having to do this stuff on my own. Fortunately, it appears that she's involuntarily learning from the extra adjustments I'm trying because it seems like she's making more adjustments herself...though I may be reading into it too much...

Funny story about the wife. After we were done last night, I asked her if she was building for a 2nd orgasm after she had one. To me, it seemed like she was getting into it even after her orgasm. She says "no, I'm not young anymore" (we're 45 and 46 btw so....???). I asked what did she mean by that comment? She told me that when we were younger, she was able to have 2 orgasms when we had sex. This whole time we've been married - never knew she had 2 O's regularly. I couldn't get more info out of her about this because our discussion window closed... Full disclosure, not sure if I was giving her 2 PIVO's sometimes during sex or if it was one PIVO and 1 thru clitoral stimulation afterwards. 

Hope this helps, because I've been getting more insight with these threads!


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Plan 9 from OS said:


> Have you tried having her lay on her side at the edge of the bed and you enter her from behind while standing? I got my wife to orgasm this way vaginally last night. Our bed is pretty high (we have a memory foam style mattress) so at the edge of the bed may not work for you without some props. When my wife is on her side - ass slightly over the edge of the bed - I have A LOT of flexibility in how I angle myself. Also last month she had a pretty powerful orgasm when she was on top. Her torso was upright so I was in pretty deep and could definitely tell that I was hitting the top (front?) wall of the canal. PIVO has gotten easier with the info in your PIVO threads plus starfire's comments from an even earlier thread.
> 
> My wife has a hard time talking about sex, so any conversations afterwards are very short and normally ends up with me having to do this stuff on my own. Fortunately, it appears that she's involuntarily learning from the extra adjustments I'm trying because it seems like she's making more adjustments herself...though I may be reading into it too much...
> 
> ...


Man I'm envious!!!! Glad it's happening and getting easier as well!


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## BioFury (Jul 9, 2015)

ConanHub said:


> Her anus is off limits.


Would make for a good signature >

Were you able to try the 9 step thingy I posted about some time back? Another way I've heard recommended, it getting her really close to orgasm orally, digitally, or both, and right when she's on the edge, you stop and quickly move to vigorous PIV. 

Part of the idea being that once you get that first orgasm that way, her body "learns" to orgasm from penetration. And it gets progressively easier to send her over the edge switching your tongue/fingers, for your joystick.


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## badsanta (Oct 13, 2014)

ConanHub said:


> Never had it inside while she climaxes. I have tried to help her get off while inside but my unit is too distracting for her to get off that way.


What about her helping herself while you are inside?

I know that is borderline asking her to masturbate in front of you, but my question is more about better understanding her comfort zone. If for some reason she would feel uncomfortable trying that, then that is a discussion topic you would want to explore. 

If you and your wife do not feel comfortable enough to masturbate in front of each other (aka mutual masturbation) then find out what it is that makes that uncomfortable. Of course she may try to say that she much rather you do things if you are together or what is the point, and you can agree with that. But at the same time being together is about feeling comfortable in front of your spouse. If something is interfering with that, it may help to talk it out. The idea of mutual masturbation would then just be a tool to help her better understand her feelings and for you to be aware of them.

Generally speaking once a couple overcomes any shame about self pleasure, it then becomes much easier to _share_ pleasure when you are together versus feeling anxiety about it. 

Regards, 
Badsanta


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## leftfield (Mar 29, 2016)

BioFury said:


> Would make for a good signature >
> 
> Were you able to try the 9 step thingy I posted about some time back? Another way I've heard recommended, it getting her really close to orgasm orally, digitally, or both, and right when she's on the edge, you stop and quickly move to vigorous PIV.
> 
> Part of the idea being that once you get that first orgasm that way, her body "learns" to orgasm from penetration. And it gets progressively easier to send her over the edge switching your tongue/fingers, for your joystick.


I have heard something similar; that women have to learn how to orgasm. So the more orgasms she is having and the more varied they are; allows the women to achieve it easier in the future. I think there is truth in this idea, based on my experience with my wife.


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## Plan 9 from OS (Jul 13, 2012)

Hey @ConanHub, had another PIVO success tonight. The sex was pretty intense, but not so sure the orgasm was the "eyes roll in the back of the head powerful" though - but it was a confirmed O via PIV only sex w/no external stimulus of the clitoris. We did 2 positions where she had her orgasm during the 2nd position - only 1 orgasm though. We had sex in the family room in a house to ourselves, so first off my wife was more vocal than I recall her being in awhile. 

Position 1 involved her getting into cowgirl while we were sitting on the couch. We modified that by her putting her feet onto the couch - like a supported squat so that I was in deep. She leaned back slightly and putting her hands on my knees. Instead of an up down movement she was thrusting forwards and backwards. It was pretty intense for her and I think she was feeling stimulation both inside the vaginal canal as well as some clit stimulation via grinding with the forwards and backwards movements. She was enjoying it a lot due to all the OMG's and the "this feels really f'king good" gasps from her numerous times while in that position. Also was able to play with her breasts a lot during the movement. What we were doing was similar to both of these positions https://sexinfo101.com/positions/lap-dance/squatting-lap-dance-180?set=woman-on-top and https://sexinfo101.com/positions/cowgirl/squatting-cowgirl. I wished we would have stayed that way but I got tired trying to keep us from toppling and we switched to her bent over one arm of our couch - supported by pillows - and her torso laying on the couch itself. That provided similar stimulation to doggy style with the face down while and ass up. Good for hitting the g and a spots and when she put her forearms under her for some support good access to the breasts. She got her orgasm in that position. I think she had a good orgasm but not as strong as direct clitoral stimulation. 

IMHO, position 1 above would have been the real winner for the PIVO if we had the endurance to stay in the position long enough - I think we only did 7 or 8 min. 

Hope this helps, Conan. I'm still newer to this world myself, so YMMV.


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## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

ConanHub said:


> No offense but I'm trying to get help here. I'm not really worried about your feelings about my thread to help me with sex with my wife.
> 
> You are up on me anyway because my wife has never had an O through intercourse.


Just to be clear, I was being a bit tongue in cheek with my reply. It’s a fact of life here on TAM that there will be times we’re envious of an aspect of someone else’s relationship. Sorry if I came across as in any way unsympathetic to your situation. Not intended! You’ve been nothing less than a very helpful and friendly poster here whom I’ve always looked forward to reading.


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## Plan 9 from OS (Jul 13, 2012)

One thing I will say since I tried to concentrate more on trying to hit the G and A spots is that it gets easier. We're close to the point where she'll orgasm thru PIV sex almost every time we sex. She's not always having giant orgasms via PIV sex though so for us the stimulation is not a magical elixer to more intense sex. However, I think a fair amount of this is related to some stress with one of our kids at the moment so that may be playing a role. 

Another thing I noticed is that my wife seems to be changing some after I made a bigger effort to give her PIVO's via G/A spot stimulation is she consciously positions herself more frequently for me to hit those spots better. She's not one that likes talking about sex, so you can see we're "talking" thru action. Though she actually did vocalize more to tell me what she wanted - like how to position myself. Only happened once, but that's different than what we've had in the past.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

Plan 9 from OS said:


> Hey @ConanHub, had another PIVO success tonight. The sex was pretty intense, but not so sure the orgasm was the "eyes roll in the back of the head powerful" though - but it was a confirmed O via PIV only sex w/no external stimulus of the clitoris. We did 2 positions where she had her orgasm during the 2nd position - only 1 orgasm though. We had sex in the family room in a house to ourselves, so first off my wife was more vocal than I recall her being in awhile.
> 
> Position 1 involved her getting into cowgirl while we were sitting on the couch. We modified that by her putting her feet onto the couch - like a supported squat so that I was in deep. She leaned back slightly and putting her hands on my knees. Instead of an up down movement she was thrusting forwards and backwards. It was pretty intense for her and I think she was feeling stimulation both inside the vaginal canal as well as some clit stimulation via grinding with the forwards and backwards movements. She was enjoying it a lot due to all the OMG's and the "this feels really f'king good" gasps from her numerous times while in that position. Also was able to play with her breasts a lot during the movement. What we were doing was similar to both of these positions https://sexinfo101.com/positions/lap-dance/squatting-lap-dance-180?set=woman-on-top and https://sexinfo101.com/positions/cowgirl/squatting-cowgirl. I wished we would have stayed that way but I got tired trying to keep us from toppling and we switched to her bent over one arm of our couch - supported by pillows - and her torso laying on the couch itself. That provided similar stimulation to doggy style with the face down while and ass up. Good for hitting the g and a spots and when she put her forearms under her for some support good access to the breasts. She got her orgasm in that position. I think she had a good orgasm but not as strong as direct clitoral stimulation.
> 
> ...


A great way to do it!

Yay team !!


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## leftfield (Mar 29, 2016)

Plan, 

I am glad you are sharing your success. While my wife and I can do a PIVO, it is caused by clitoris stimulation. It is clear that you and your wife are experiencing different things and its great that you two get to enjoy each other.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Plan 9 from OS said:


> One thing I will say since I tried to concentrate more on trying to hit the G and A spots is that it gets easier. We're close to the point where she'll orgasm thru PIV sex almost every time we sex. She's not always having giant orgasms via PIV sex though so for us the stimulation is not a magical elixer to more intense sex. However, I think a fair amount of this is related to some stress with one of our kids at the moment so that may be playing a role.
> 
> Another thing I noticed is that my wife seems to be changing some after I made a bigger effort to give her PIVO's via G/A spot stimulation is she consciously positions herself more frequently for me to hit those spots better. She's not one that likes talking about sex, so you can see we're "talking" thru action. Though she actually did vocalize more to tell me what she wanted - like how to position myself. Only happened once, but that's different than what we've had in the past.


This is good stuff.


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## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

Plan 9 from OS said:


> Hey @ConanHub"this feels really f'king good"


You can't imagine how much I'd pay, or be willing to do, to hear my wife to say that during sex. 

Thanks for that link on the position. When things settle down, it's on my list of things to try! The toughest part is that she's got to believe it's possible. I don't think it can happen if you don't think it can happen (for women who aren't easily stimulated via PIV).


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## Plan 9 from OS (Jul 13, 2012)

Casual Observer said:


> You can't imagine how much I'd pay, or be willing to do, to hear my wife to say that during sex.
> 
> Thanks for that link on the position. When things settle down, it's on my list of things to try! The toughest part is that she's got to believe it's possible. I don't think it can happen if you don't think it can happen (for women who aren't easily stimulated via PIV).


Don't forget to go to the home page. Lot's of interesting positions, but keep in mind a fair number of them are not that different from one another. https://sexinfo101.com/


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## Plan 9 from OS (Jul 13, 2012)

Casual Observer said:


> You can't imagine how much I'd pay, or be willing to do, to hear my wife to say that during sex.
> 
> Thanks for that link on the position. When things settle down, it's on my list of things to try! The toughest part is that she's got to believe it's possible. *I don't think it can happen if you don't think it can happen* (for women who aren't easily stimulated via PIV).


Right now I'm riding the wave. We may hit a dry spell where PIVO's will become scarce for awhile. I'm cautiously optimistic that it can be sustainable. We're also transitioning with the kid situation. We have 3 kids: oldest was recently moved out of the house, the middle child is in her freshman year of collage and the youngest one is in her last year of middle school. In many ways, the kids don't need us as much as they used to - or more accurately they need us in different ways than before. That is also playing a role in this too IMHO.


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## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

Plan 9 from OS said:


> Don't forget to go to the home page. Lot's of interesting positions, but keep in mind a fair number of them are not that different from one another. https://sexinfo101.com/


My wife is quite overweight so that places some limitations on what's practical and what's not. Thinking about looking into a ramp. Thanks for the encouragement!


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## badsanta (Oct 13, 2014)

Casual Observer said:


> My wife is quite overweight so that places some limitations on what's practical and what's not. Thinking about looking into a ramp. Thanks for the encouragement!


When I was in college I took some elective courses on sports fitness. Later in life when I encountered some back problems I found a certain philosophy helped me a lot. And that is that stretching is just as important if not more important than exercise. Essentially you want your body to feel as comfortable and as flexible as possible during moments you are exercising. If you bend a certain way and it causes discomfort, it is not so much about being out of shape but more so about not having stretched. 

So even if you are overweight and out of shape, you will be surprised at how just stretching will make you feel better and able to enjoy a lot more types of activity as opposed to just trying to exercise or diet. Therefor the benefits of stretching can sometimes outweigh diet and exercise in terms of improving your quality of life and make being active more enjoyable/comfortable. Best of all stretching is easy and often feels good.

So encourage your wife to stretch and help her do it. Don't make it about sex, but instead just helping her feel better and have a better quality of life. Easier said than done though if you have a partner that hates stretching.

Regards, 
Badsanta


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## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

badsanta said:


> When I was in college I took some elective courses on sports fitness. Later in life when I encountered some back problems I found a certain philosophy helped me a lot. And that is that stretching is just as important if not more important than exercise. Essentially you want your body to feel as comfortable and as flexible as possible during moments you are exercising. If you bend a certain way and it causes discomfort, it is not so much about being out of shape but more so about not having stretched.
> 
> So even if you are overweight and out of shape, you will be surprised at how just stretching will make you feel better and able to enjoy a lot more types of activity as opposed to just trying to exercise or diet. Therefor the benefits of stretching can sometimes outweigh diet and exercise in terms of improving your quality of life and make being active more enjoyable/comfortable. Best of all stretching is easy and often feels good.
> 
> ...


Boy, am I the wrong person to try and convince someone to stretch!!! I have zero flexibility. And yet I can ride a bicycle in an aggressive position for 6 hours without a problem. I was always told to stretch when I raced competitively, but never did (never did shave my legs like I was supposed to, either). I basically work my kinks out as I ride. 

But I get you. And I can help her with the stretching, as I massage her.


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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

EleGirl said:


> You should not worry about this. Keep in mind that 75% - 80% of women can NOT orgasm from PIV.
> 
> It has to do with the way the woman is built down there.
> 
> ...




I don’t think the last bit is true. I have been told G spot orgasms feel distinctly very different from clit orgasms. And she can have both in a row, or simultaneously but multiple ones from the same area are rare/almost never happen.
Also from her reactions, I can tell the g spot orgasms are more intense, longer and involve all of her body. 
But from reading, it seems there is a lot more variation among women in how they are built...
Or maybe my....vehicle size and shape seems to be just right for her particular garage...I don’t think it’s possible to know.

Also this: “That means fewer than a quarter of women climax through thrusting alone, no matter how big his penis is, no matter how long he lasts, and no matter how you feel about him.”

How ON EARTH can they test for this...have a bunch of men lined up and having a go in a row? It’s clearly non-sense...Yes some women (possibly majority) find it more difficult to orgasm from PIV alone however they cannot possibly make the above claim as some kind of scientific fact! 

All it can say is that “75% of women DO NOT orgasm from PIV”. It’s very different from saying that “75% of women CAN NOT orgasm from PIV”. As many women said (including on this thread): they couldn’t orgasm with one partner and had no problem achieving it with another. How would these studies account for this? 



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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

Plan 9 from OS said:


> Wow @ConanHub, I was just going to start a thread about this but you beat me to the punch. My thread was going to be a success story - so even better if this helps!
> 
> Wife and I had sex tonight. Aside from giving her a back rub with some petroleum jelly for about 10 minutes, there wasn't really much foreplay at all. On top of that, she's been on an antibiotic due to a sinus infection and pressure on her ear (though she was finally able to pop it twice today and get some relief). And finally...we had a nice little run of daily sex from last Friday thru Sunday where she got her orgasms on the last 2 days. The point I''m trying to make was that she wasn't expecting much and even cautioned me to not get my hopes up that I would give her an orgasm tonight.
> 
> ...




Well done. I would try and focus more to get the right angle...and once you find it, be very consistent.
Not to put other penises down or anything but in our case, my shape and size seems to really help. Certain positions felt too intense for her but over the years, she got used to the feeling more and more and can now take ‘direct impact’ that blow other types of orgasms out of the water and seem like child’s play by comparison (mild)...It’s not just the orgasm itself but the feeling throughout PIV is nothing like oral (which is nice too for her. But just nice...). All according to her...
I just don’t see how a guy with smaller equipment (and a different shape) could produce same sensations for her...(But I guess we won’t know until she tries a few )
It doesn’t mean you need a humongous member but I do think there’s a ‘minimum requirement’ to achieve some results...
A bit like: you need 6 inches or longer to run this software in your marriage....




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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

Mybabysgotit said:


> I have never had a women actually achieve an orgasm through the so called G spot. I know it feels really good for them and I do it, but in my experience, it never itself led to an orgasm.



I thought that’s what we were talking about? How to achieve o through PIV alone (isn’t that supposed to be the g spot orgasm?)



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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

MJJEAN said:


> The variation is penis size and exact angle.



Yes! Exactly that...
I think the best course of action is for men to concentrate what they can do best and know works for their wife...Especially if it’s not a new partner...If they know wife orgasms from oral, then that’s the part to focus on and do PIV as an extra bonus, not necessarily with orgasms in mind. Otherwise it could end leaving both frustrated. IMO. Good lick 



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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

CraigBesuden said:


> I believe the G spot and A spot are both on the top wall. The O spot is on the bottom, so you could hit the O spot by angling down with CAT (or just switch to doggy and angle upward).



From a quick glance (at what A spot is supposed to be), I don’t believe it is a thing...They keep coming up with all these alphabetic spots ‘cos they themselves don’t know how it works (and there is clearly some variation). What is true (for most women) is that PIV and clit stimulations are two different, independent sensations.


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## badsanta (Oct 13, 2014)

Casual Observer said:


> Boy, am I the wrong person to try and convince someone to stretch!!! I have zero flexibility. And yet *I can ride a bicycle in an aggressive position for 6 hours without a problem.* I was always told to stretch when I raced competitively, but never did (never did shave my legs like I was supposed to, either). I basically work my kinks out as I ride.
> 
> But I get you. And I can help her with the stretching, as I massage her.


Is that position kind of like the fetal position?  If so there would be no need to stretch for that. But if you wanted to ride backwards and upside down in the upward dog position, you might feel some discomfort. 

Joking aside when it comes to a woman's flexibility to get her legs out of the way, sometimes that can be uncomfortable and very distracting for her. Just like you trying to do a split for the first time in forever. My wife and I were joking around in different positions one day and she pinned me down with my legs apart and I complained that doing that felt really uncomfortable and asked her to stop. She said, "see how that feels! My legs feel the same when you try that!" 

So getting back to the OP, if certain positions that allow for PIVO also happen to cause discomfort due to lack of flexibility. That is something that can be helped just by working on stretching together. 

*All the stretches associated with having a lower healthy back and hips for preventing sciatica are awesome.* 

Cheers, 
Badsanta


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## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

MJJEAN said:


> The variation is penis size and exact angle.


Elsewhere we read shape is important. So now we're coming up with an MEL (minimum equipment list) for PIVO? Is "average" good enough? Or do "average" guys account for the 75%? I take solace not from a measuring tape but from my only past partner who had no issues with PIVO whatsoever. But the past 42 years have been PIVO-less and a source of frustration. She wants to blame her own equipment, but I remain convinced this is something going on upstairs, not downstairs, since, if in the mood, oral can produce wildly-successful results.


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## Plan 9 from OS (Jul 13, 2012)

Casual Observer said:


> Elsewhere we read shape is important. So now we're coming up with an MEL (minimum equipment list) for PIVO? Is "average" good enough? Or do "average" guys account for the 75%? I take solace not from a measuring tape but from my only past partner who had no issues with PIVO whatsoever. But the past 42 years have been PIVO-less and a source of frustration. She wants to blame her own equipment, but I remain convinced this is something going on upstairs, not downstairs, since, if in the mood, oral can produce wildly-successful results.


Since average penis size is around 7.6" by 6.03" for length and girth, the average guy can give most girls PIVO's...


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## Lila (May 30, 2014)

Plan 9 from OS said:


> Casual Observer said:
> 
> 
> > Elsewhere we read shape is important. So now we're coming up with an MEL (minimum equipment list) for PIVO? Is "average" good enough? Or do "average" guys account for the 75%? I take solace not from a measuring tape but from my only past partner who had no issues with PIVO whatsoever. But the past 42 years have been PIVO-less and a source of frustration. She wants to blame her own equipment, but I remain convinced this is something going on upstairs, not downstairs, since, if in the mood, oral can produce wildly-successful results.
> ...


Where are you getting those numbers? I've read several studies that indicate average erect length is 5-6 inches and girth is about 4.5"


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## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

Plan 9 from OS said:


> Since average penis size is around 7.6" by 6.03" for length and girth, the average guy can give most girls PIVO's...


*And this is where I just* slink away and crawl into a hole...



Lila said:


> Where are you getting those numbers? I've read several studies that indicate average erect length is 5-6 inches and girth is about 4.5"


Now I feel much better. At 18cm x 13.5cm I feel a bit more OK now.


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## Plan 9 from OS (Jul 13, 2012)

Lila said:


> Where are you getting those numbers? I've read several studies that indicate average erect length is 5-6 inches and girth is about 4.5"


From the TAM penis threads from over the years.


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## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

Plan 9 from OS said:


> From the TAM penis threads from over the years.


So the TAM crowd apparently comes from Lake Wobegon, where all the women are strong, all the men are good-looking, and all the children are above average?

I think there may be some fudging in those numbers. Quite a bit of fudging, when compared to scientific averages. Maybe the WIKI was written by men of little means wanting to feel better about themselves? I doubt it. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_penis_size


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## badsanta (Oct 13, 2014)

Lila said:


> Where are you getting those numbers? I've read several studies that indicate average erect length is 5-6 inches and girth is about 4.5"


Have you not seen the South Park episode where the school posted everyone's penis size in the hallway? Once Randy Marsh got involved and demonstrated the correct way to measure, you get a chart for the "Adjusted Penis Size" which on average is much larger than historical measurements and standards!

Here is the formula:










L = Length
d = diameter
w = width
g = girth

And you get:


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## Lila (May 30, 2014)

Plan 9 from OS said:


> From the TAM penis threads from over the years.


:laugh::laugh: Then you got it wrong. According to TAM the average length is 10" x 7.5" . Everyone is sporting an anaconda.:surprise:


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## notmyjamie (Feb 5, 2019)

Lila said:


> :laugh::laugh: Then you got it wrong. According to TAM the average length is 10" x 7.5" . Everyone is sporting an anaconda.:surprise:




***makes mental note not to hook up with any of the men on TAM*** >


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## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

Lila said:


> :laugh::laugh: Then you got it wrong. According to TAM the average length is 10" x 7.5" . Everyone is sporting an anaconda.:surprise:





notmyjamie said:


> ***makes mental note not to hook up with any of the men on TAM*** >


The male equivalent of Vagina Dentata?


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## notmyjamie (Feb 5, 2019)

Casual Observer said:


> The male equivalent of Vagina Dentata?


LOL...maybe not that bad.


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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

Lila said:


> :laugh::laugh: Then you got it wrong. According to TAM the average length is 10" x 7.5" . Everyone is sporting an anaconda.:surprise:



Ha. I don’t think it’s just the size (though you probably need a ‘minimum’ size for it to have any effect at all). It’s also about the shape and angle.
I often feel the place that I am hitting (and the moaning immediately changes) and that only happens under certain angles and certain positions. And if my anaconda (just a python, let’s be modest here) was smaller/different shape, there is no way I could reach or hit it with such directness.


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## Plan 9 from OS (Jul 13, 2012)

I've been keeping this concept in mind since this thread started. I feel it's made me a better lover overall just by becoming more aware of how my wife reacts to the various things we do in the bedroom (and elsewhere). Since this thread was started by @ConanHub, here is what I've discovered as of late. Hope it helps.

Without counting the minutia of variations that people will use to define sex positions - there are only 2 positions that seem to work well. If my wife rides me in cowgirl where she's upright - she'll orgasm from PIV as close to 100% of the time as we can get. Surprisingly though, it's far from her favorite position. The 2nd position that works around 50% of the time is missionary. In missionary, I have to try to angle myself so that I am stimulating the top (front?) of the vaginal canal. But I have to vary it - A LOT - and it feels like all the variation seems to be like edging for her and then at the end she has one big orgasm. The edging (at least it what it seems like to me) can go on for 20 minutes even 30 minutes sometimes. Stamina is important. As you probably already figured out - these 2 positions and the angles are best at hitting the G spot and the A spot. We can debate if these are distinct spots, the other side of the clitoris or even if a collections of nerves that connect with the clitoris - but at the end of the day the outcomes appear to be the same regardless. 

Depending on what PIVO stands for - "Penis in Vagina ONLY orgasms" or "Penis in Vagina Orgasms" - I may or may not be "cheating" on occasion. The 2nd to last lovemaking session I had with my wife was crazy. She was lying on her back at the edge of the bed with her knees practically on her chest and her feet flat on my chest so that her pelvis was pretty well tilted up. In order for me to give her a massive orgasm, I had to 1) piston in and out like a jackhammer, 2) take 1 of my hands and rub her clit and 3) use the other hand to stimulate one of her nipples. Let's just say that I was FREAKING EXHAUSTED after that. She could barely move after as well but that was more likely to the stretch in her legs due to pulling them in so far and back. 

Apologies for the TMI - I'm just trying to provide as much detail as I can think of in order to help the OP and anyone else trying the same. Good luck guys and gals. Remember, YMMV.


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## moon7 (May 5, 2013)

Somearebiased said:


> Try hitting the a spot and rubbing her clit not to orgasm but getting her real excited. I talk lots of smut and say dirty things and she gets so horny.


1) ^^^this

2) be an AMAZING kisser to get her in the mood helps a lot

3) be in a position where your pubic bone (or fat over that bone, idk how to explain) is pressing her clit during the deed!!!!!!!!!!!!! (I only know 2 positions: she on top, because she will know learn the better pressure for the moment, or missionary, but you will take longer to learn the right pressing for each moment, i guess??? Both real close, pressing those areas, maybe even hugging each other)


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## moon7 (May 5, 2013)

There may have other positions, but my repertoire is small. Im sorry if it doesnt help.


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## moon7 (May 5, 2013)

I think i can answer this thread even better now that I though about it. 

Hold my beer!

1) Circuncision:
There is a reason why women see female circuncision as such a cruel thing when done in females and reallt dont when blink when its done on males (we dont do it around here, but you get my point) and its because in a female circuncision they cut the girls clit out, taking away any chance of she ever having an O, while male circuncision dont usually do it to the man, on the contrary, without the foreskin I bet men can "feel" sex better thhan with it (correct me if I'm wrong, because I'm not a man).

2) G-spot:
For me its a myth, because even though stupid magazines talk about it non-stop i never personally heard any woman say they found their G-spot (but it may be true that thing that 10% of women have it, or they mistake it with clit-O, idk, i just never met one), so you can continue to put all the kama-sutra moves and never ever get her off if you dont press your pubic bone (or pillow) there in her magic button (see explanation in both my posts above).

3) Lesbians!
Yes, lesbians. Ask any lesbian you know how high is her and her partner(s) O's rate per "vaginal" sex (excluding fingers and oral) and I bet she will tell you around 100%, no kidding. Now you ask me why, if they dont have Ds, only hollow parts, and now it comes: they rub their pubic bones in one another, directly against the clit. 

4) Dry-hump: its possible to make a woman come just doing that even fully clothed during a making out session. Try it!

5) "the magic button":
A) Lets consider it as a mini penis, and like a penis it get swollen when the woman is excited (there are other clues like the lips down there getting swollen too and she getting wet, but it can dry in the middle of "stuff"), and its "normal" when she isnt excited. 
B) Lets say a man get a itch in his private parts, he may scratch it and it wont get him excited or hard (I'm presuming), but if he get the right mental/emotional/sexual trigger he will get hard/excited. Thats exactly the same thing for a woman, so if you are in the mood she will probably not be in the mood at the same time and vice-versa, so you will have to press one of her emotional-mental-sexual triggers to get her started, otherwise you may manipulate her "magic button" with your fingers or tongue or pubic bone and it will only feel like scratching an itch, not sexual at all.
C) And thats why FOREPLAY IS SO IMPORTANT TO WOMEN to achieve an O, you have to know some of her triggers (not even all of them) like lots of good kissing, whispering sweet things, kissing/sucking specific places, manhandle her, talk dirty, roleplay, risky places, risky sex, idk what she likes, but there are many triggers for all women, its never "one", it may be the mix of some, maybe you only need to use one, maybe two, or today you use one and tomorrow another, just like a man who triggers can vary so vastly deppending on the man. This is the area where things can go wrong too, not because of the husband or wife, but for multiple reasons like traumas or repressed stuff, but most cases the problem is "mismatched foreplay" where the man and woman have completely different "triggers" and dont notice to at least be able (if the have the courage) to explain to their partners. No kidding.

She-needs-your-help. But if she doesnt achieve dont put pressure on both of you, because she will sense it and it will get worse, and because women get a "high" from making her man O using her so even without an O hersels she may enjoy it too (just not ALWAYS, because its good to have an O too).

I'm sorry if I was too direct, and I dont think you will ever read such an explanation in a female magazine (they are terrible). 

Following this I'm pretty sure you will increase your wifes O's rate from zero to at leadt 1%, haha. Good luck!!!!!!!


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## moon7 (May 5, 2013)

@ConanHub


Thats the code all cracked. It is simple, but if it doesnt help I'm sorry, I cant think of anything that will.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Thanks @moon7 :smile2:

I'm actually a master at rendering Mrs. C senseless via orgasms.

She has just never been able to have a PIVO with anyone ever.

She is getting closer and closer with me. Since I have been trying to improve in that area and given her a g-spot O, she has been loving sex even more and is straight up telling me how much she likes my penis! LoL!


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## moon7 (May 5, 2013)

ConanHub said:


> Thanks @moon7 <a href="http://talkaboutmarriage.com/images/TAMarriage_2015/smilies/tango_face_smile.png" border="0" alt="" title="Smile" ></a>
> 
> I'm actually a master at rendering Mrs. C senseless via orgasms.
> 
> ...


Then I'm glad for you both 🙂


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## Mybabysgotit (Jul 1, 2019)

@ConanHub - I was mistaken on the PIV orgasm. It's the way @moon talked about it. When it's close to the time, my wife will grind and ride with me until it happens so i guess it's more clitoral based. Hope that makes sense. And yes, only two positions work, missionary and her on top.


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## moon7 (May 5, 2013)

Mybabysgotit said:


> @ConanHub - I was mistaken on the PIV orgasm. It's the way @moon talked about it. When it's close to the time, my wife will grind and ride with me until it happens so i guess it's more clitoral based. Hope that makes sense. And yes, only two positions work, missionary and her on top.


This ^^^


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## moon7 (May 5, 2013)

1) The sad part is the A LOT (!!!!!!!!!) of women fake orgasms so their partners wont pressure them and wont feel like losers if she doesnt reach there (One way of knowing if she is having an O is her vaginal walls lightly contract and relax some times, ive read about it but im not sure if it happens to everybody).

2) Those are the only positions that I know of where PIV works. In other positions I guess she will need direct stimulation with a hand???


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

moon7 said:


> 1) The sad part is the A LOT (!!!!!!!!!) of women fake orgasms so their partners wont pressure them and wont feel like losers if she doesnt reach there (One way of knowing if she is having an O is her vaginal walls lightly contract and relax some times, ive read about it but im not sure if it happens to everybody).
> 
> 2) Those are the only positions that I know of where PIV works. In other positions I guess she will need direct stimulation with a hand???


We're good on successful O's.:grin2:

Mrs. Conan is usually drooling after making incoherent noises and her entire body having seizure level spasms by the time she taps out.:wink2:

A lot of different women are able to have O's in quite a variety of positions and acts.

Some things work for some ladies and not for others.


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## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

ConanHub said:


> Thanks @moon7 :smile2:
> 
> I'm actually a master at rendering Mrs. C senseless via orgasms.
> 
> ...


Dumb question. You have incredible success at giving Mrs. C senseless orgasms. What happens if you get her REALLY close, then go for the PIVO action? I'm sure you've attempted this. Or... is it something that you worry might really frustrate her, if she's on the edge and you kill the moment that way?

Asking for a friend.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Casual Observer said:


> Dumb question. You have incredible success at giving Mrs. C senseless orgasms. What happens if you get her REALLY close, then go for the PIVO action? I'm sure you've attempted this. Or... is it something that you worry might really frustrate her, if she's on the edge and you kill the moment that way?
> 
> Asking for a friend.


She has lost her O before if I change things up and she LOVES her O! She gets frustrated and I don't want to risk it.


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## badsanta (Oct 13, 2014)

ConanHub said:


> *She has lost her O before if I change things up* and she LOVES her O! She gets frustrated and I don't want to risk it.


Have you tried nonstop changing things up? Little of this then a little of that, so on and so on. I realize that violates the female pleasure paradox, but then doesn't everything:

1) NEVER do one thing for too long or it becomes annoying.

2) If something feels good do NOT change what you are doing.


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## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

*Progress report. Close!*

So, it was not PIVO, but a close variant. At least a significant milepost. Don't know why it was almost allowed to happen, but digitally stimulating my wife was going very very well (normally at some point she says it's time to get start speaking in tongues), and at her suggestion, we moved to PIV while digital stimulation continued. And she came sooooooo close. Really close. During, she was telling me she was "conflicted." An odd thing to say, an odd thing to have to ask about during. Basically the conflict that was screwing her up was knowing that she'd come if I went full oral vs the possibility she might come during PIV. Like I said, it was REALLY close. I wasn't quite prepared for this to happen; I think with a bit of actual lube instead of "natural" (saliva plus her own, which she was generating) she might have gotten there. 

Now I realize, had it happened, it really wouldn't be the kind of PIVO that we generally regard as PIVO but trust me, for each of us, when it happens (I'm actually not thinking if anymore) it's going to be a big thing. 

Odd thing is that she was holding my p during all this, not totally sure why. I was hoping that she was trying to manipulate me in a way that did something for her, but she said no, it was for me. I'm fine with that but didn't need any help and in fact would have preferred firing a bit later. Something to work on in the future. Of course, I have no idea when that timing might be because I'm never really sure which version of my wife is going to be with me, one day to the next. I cannot predict when she feels comfortable enough to let go.


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## Dread Pirate Roberts (May 22, 2012)

These are posts I follow quite a bit. My girlfriend and I have been together for 5 years now. Our sex life is good, but PIVOs just don't happen. She will orgasm with manual after or before. She's not into positions other than cowgirl or missionary. We've tried CAT. She isn't into a lot of foreplay. She just wants to get it on. So what am I really complaining about really. She says it's happened just once with her ex many years ago. So it is possible. She doesn't like manual stimulation during sex. So I'm really not sure what to do other than just keep on keeping on.


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## CatholicDad (Oct 30, 2017)

Conan, is this woman literally your wife or just a girlfriend? Do you love her or is this something you’re doing just to prove you’re the biggest stud she’s ever had?

It took me a couple decades before this worked routinely with my wife... not sure I want to share just to get some guy to score his girlfriend.

I’ll say this though... the porn industry is all lies. I don’t think there is a technique that has to be learned... rather 10% technique and 90% mindset/attitude/philosophy.


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## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

CatholicDad said:


> I’ll say this though... the porn industry is all lies. I don’t think there is a technique that has to be learned... rather 10% technique and 90% mindset/attitude/philosophy.


The porn industry is not all lies... they are promoting a fantasy. It's not any more deceptive than a TV show or Hollywood movie. Most of what we consume isn't real. We're bored by real. The problem is only 10% the medium, 90% how we deal with it. Drugs, porn, alcohol, they're all things that some people can handle in moderation, and some absolutely cannot. 

So... why does fantasy exist? Is fantasy be nature a bad thing? Is there nothing at all that can be learned from porn? For the purpose of this thread, I am in fact highly doubtful anyone's going to learn something relevant to in-home PIVO, since in porn it's a given and in reality far from it.


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## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

*What would happen if...*



Dread Pirate Roberts said:


> These are posts I follow quite a bit. My girlfriend and I have been together for 5 years now. Our sex life is good, but PIVOs just don't happen. She will orgasm with manual after or before. She's not into positions other than cowgirl or missionary. We've tried CAT. She isn't into a lot of foreplay. She just wants to get it on. So what am I really complaining about really. She says it's happened just once with her ex many years ago. So it is possible. She doesn't like manual stimulation during sex. So I'm really not sure what to do other than just keep on keeping on.


So, what happens if... while she's being stimulated manually (digitally or oral) and really, really close... I mean, right there... and you suddenly stop and go PIV? Is there a chance she can ride the wave and still O?

I've thought about this... a lot... and just don't know if it's worth the risk. I mean, what is more frustrating than being right on the edge of a sure thing and having your partner shut it down? You've really got to have an awesome & unstoppable relationship to risk that, and it's something that you would likely have to do a number of times before success. What does that do to trust going forward? "So, is he going to let me finish this time, or is he going to stupidly stop right as I'm about to O so he can stick his P in and get his rocks off while I'm left frustrated... again..."

Has anyone else tried this? Specifically, bringing your wife right to the very very very edge, O being a sure thing, and then stop and go PIV?


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## Plan 9 from OS (Jul 13, 2012)

*Re: What would happen if...*



Casual Observer said:


> So, what happens if... while she's being stimulated manually (digitally or oral) and really, really close... I mean, right there... and you suddenly stop and go PIV? Is there a chance she can ride the wave and still O?
> 
> I've thought about this... a lot... and just don't know if it's worth the risk. I mean, what is more frustrating than being right on the edge of a sure thing and having your partner shut it down? You've really got to have an awesome & unstoppable relationship to risk that, and it's something that you would likely have to do a number of times before success. What does that do to trust going forward? "So, is he going to let me finish this time, or is he going to stupidly stop right as I'm about to O so he can stick his P in and get his rocks off while I'm left frustrated... again..."
> 
> Has anyone else tried this? Specifically, bringing your wife right to the very very very edge, O being a sure thing, and then stop and go PIV?


If your wife enjoys having her breasts touched during sex, you may be able to use that in order to later get access to rubbing her clit while engaged in PIV sex. Tonite we had an intense session where she had a big orgasm while I was inside her. What did the trick for me on this day was that we were in a modified form of missionary - she was on her back pulling her legs back and pretty close to the spread eagle position. I'm on my knees in front of her and fairly upright while penetrating her (trying to angle so I'm hitting the top part of her vaginal canal) and I was using both hands to play with her nipples and breasts. She took one of my hands and guided it down to rub her clit while we were in the act. Basically, I'm doing the in/out varying stroke lengths plus grinding periodically while one hand is playing with one breast while the other was rubbing the clit. I know it was pretty intense because she whispered 'OMG' and she was making that "O-face" where her mouth is opening but no sound was coming out (had to keep quiet with 2 kids in the house). 

The position we were in was close to this, except I was positioned like the male in this first link
https://sexinfo101.com/positions/guard/folded-guard

She was positioned like the lady in this link
https://sexinfo101.com/positions/missionary/open-missionary

We were also on our bed. We have a memory foam so we can sink into the bed some which makes life interesting in the sex department after you get used to that type of surface.

Hope all of this helps.


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## cashcratebob (Jan 10, 2018)

I read the initial post as being a non-clitoral stimulated O, a G-Spot O. If it includes clitoral but during PIV, wife on top rubbing against me or rubbing herself, gets that done. 

I believe only one time has she had a G-Spot orgasm, but I don't remember what we were doing.

She came close before. I started with her on the couch on her back, I had my knees on the floor, This was the first deviation, normally after making out/passionate kissing/heavy petting, I move to going down on her. She orgasmed. We then moved into her on all fours, me behind (is this called something other than doggie style by now?  ). This is where it almost happened. The problem was, I wasn't expecting it and she wasn't giving any different indication that something great (different than how she normally is) was about to happen. So I finished and she kept pushing and I tried to stay with her...but my man decided to bow out. 

She turned around and told me she almost had an internal one. I tried to bring it back with fingers but it was gone.

I am pretty sure that she was in her ovulation/"heightened sexual awareness" window during this session. IMO, that is probably the only advice I have is take the ideas that sound good, but go for it during that peak time of the month, if that time is apparent. Just seems to be a reasonable idea that if a vaginal O is difficult, or near impossible, that the most likely possibility is during that high libido time, when you've also stoked the fires mentally, before hand.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

CatholicDad said:


> Conan, is this woman literally your wife or just a girlfriend? Do you love her or is this something you’re doing just to prove you’re the biggest stud she’s ever had?
> 
> It took me a couple decades before this worked routinely with my wife... not sure I want to share just to get some guy to score his girlfriend.
> 
> I’ll say this though... the porn industry is all lies. I don’t think there is a technique that has to be learned... rather 10% technique and 90% mindset/attitude/philosophy.


Sir, I kindly but strongly disagree, and firsthand knowledge is the source plus conversations with women when I was single.

Added to it, 35 yrs of M, and explorations that only come with freedom to explore with a loving partner.

Sex is like painting a masterpiece or a simple watercolor, or cooking a fine meal, or even creating a one of a kind resto-mod fine vehicle. 

The more one does these things, the better one gets if there is any natural aptitude at all.

Mentally and physically one acquires the right tools. 

Not every tool is needed on every creation phase of creation but the more tools one acquires and the more experienced one is using those tools the better the art, the more kinds of art one can create. And the artist is always improving.


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## CatholicDad (Oct 30, 2017)

Hey Ragnar, sure everyone can improve but I don’t think a new technique can turn a non-PIVO woman into a PIVO machine. For women it’s much more tied to their emotions, security, attraction, etc.

For example, do you think a (thoughtful) woman will PIVO if she is worrying during the act “I hope I don’t conceive a baby with this idiot”!

Yeah, a new technique won’t fix that or help said woman relax enough for PIVO.


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## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> Sir, I kindly but strongly disagree, and firsthand knowledge is the source plus conversations with women when I was single.
> 
> Added to it, 35 yrs of M, and explorations that only come with freedom to explore with a loving partner.
> 
> ...


But the quality of the canvas is important as well. It's not entirely the painter. We don't want to get into the thing about a poor carpenter blames the quality of his tools, but there may be some partners for whom the most-respected "painter" in the world cannot bring their "subject" to... life. A metaphor for orgasm, as if it need be said.

Fred Astaire and Ginger Rogers could dance like few others. But if Ginger Rogers were to dance with me, it would be a disaster. I'm just not a dance partner. No amount of talent from my partner would change that. All the practice in the world might allow me to follow the steps but there would be no magic.

Our wives and husbands are not "subjects" for us to paint on. They are our partners and bring with them physical and mental history that might take a lot more than physical talent to unlock.


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