# Thoughts of another woman



## confused123456789 (Jul 17, 2012)

I have been happily married to my wife for the past 2 years, and we’ve known each other and been together for almost 6. By all accounts our marriage is great. We get along really well, sex is good and regular, and we are financially stable with good jobs. No kids yet, but it’s something that is on or radar for the next couple years. We are happy. 

I recently was introduced to a new member of a club I belong to. My first impression of this woman was that she was beautiful, but in no way did I have the desire to be anything more than friends. It was not until a night out with friends from this club (including her) that I really started to feel a connection. I could not help from flirting with her and trying to make her laugh and smile. It felt like sparks when our bodies would accidentally touch in the crowded bar or when I put my hand on her waist for a photo. Since that night, and a couple similar events since then, I can’t get this girl off my mind. We will text or email back and forth and I can’t help from being playful and flirting. Although I have no intention of being unfaithful to my wife and I don’t think this single girl wants to get involved with a married guy, I can’t help but fantasizing what it would be like to have this girl in bed. She makes me nervous, excited, and gives me butterflies in my stomach all at the same time. It’s a great feeling – literally a “high”. 

Some background: I’ve always been the kind of guy that notices an attractive woman (what man doesn’t?!) but most of my life I was usually too shy to pursue. It’s not that I never had girls, per say, but I was never getting as much as I wanted. It was not until my senior year of college that my attitude started to change. I made a conscious decision that I was going to be more aggressive, ****y, flirty around girls. It certainly worked, as I had many “friends with benefits” that year. At the end of that year, I met my wife and fell head over heels in love with her. It was fun and exciting. I was actually involved in another relationship at the time, which made our romance all the more fun for me (sound familiar? haha) This excitement has obviously subsided over the years, which I think is normal, but I still love my wife.

For what it’s worth, since I’ve met this other women I have been more aware of having a fun flirtatious side with my wife that I think our relationship has been missing. Also, All those naughty horny thoughts I’ve been having about the other woman have also translated to some really good sex with my wife lately as well. 

Although this post was more about me sharing my feelings with “on one in particular”, I would appreciate hearing your comments, advice, and feedback about similar experiences, etc.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

Is your wife aware of your feelings, your flirting, your texts and emails with this woman? If she isn't, you are CHEATING on your wife.

Get and read the book Not Just Friends.

There's nothing wrong with you being attracted to other women, but you are taking this too far by allowing yourself to text and email and flirt. You are in lust.


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## MadeInMichigan (May 8, 2012)

My advice. Find another club.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Racer (Sep 24, 2009)

Its what I call a 'redflag woman'... she is simply irresistable to you. First mistake was exchanging contact info. Why did you do that?

Now you are in a pickle. Only way is to go dark. Send an no contact letter out. Just be blunt, you are married, you know chatting with her threatens your marriage, you can no longer talk or see her. Then avoid her for the rest of your life. 

Resist that urge. Don't dwell at all on this other woman; tell you mind to stop. Focus on your wife and how great she is. Stayed focused on her, have a lot of fun with her. After a few weeks, that urge will subside with this other redflag woman...


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## thunderstruck (May 9, 2012)

confused123456789 said:


> Although I have no intention of being unfaithful to my wife and I don’t think this single girl wants to get involved with a married guy, I can’t help but fantasizing what it would be like to have this girl in bed.


You're cheating on your wife now. It doesn't matter what you THINK your and this girl's intentions are. Stop it now. 

I'm sure you're covering your tracks, but if your wife finds one of those flirty texts, you may come home to find your clothes thrown all over the lawn, and changed locks.


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## alton (Jul 18, 2012)

I think from time to time a lot of guys have 'another woman' that have this sort of effect. The mistake you've made it getting close to her as by doing this you're risking making it more than just about lust or a schoolboy crush. Get away from her.


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## confused123456789 (Jul 17, 2012)

Thanks everyone who has posted... I get the sense from your responses that my actions have been way off base. I appreciate you trying to talk some sense into me. Nothing inappropriate has happened with this woman in my opinion. We traded contact info because we are on the same committee and needed to work certain projects together (it's a professional organization). Leaving the club is not an option either, as I am an officer and in a responsible position so I can't just leave everyone hanging. If I'm not going to be able to avoid her, I guess the best solution is to try my best to go "cold" in our relationship, so to speak. No smiley face texts, playful conversations, or flirting in general. Things have not progressed to the point where our feelings would be hurt, either. I don't think my wife needs to know anything, either.


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## DayDream (May 25, 2011)

Why are you taking pictures with her let alone with your hand on her waist? None of this is right. You ain't right.


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## confused123456789 (Jul 17, 2012)

You're right, DayDream... I ain't right!


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## thunderstruck (May 9, 2012)

confused123456789 said:


> Nothing inappropriate has happened with this woman in my opinion.


I call BS. Would you allow your wife to see all of the flirty texts between you and this single woman?

Would you like to find flirty texts between your wife and a single guy?


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## Toffer (Jan 31, 2012)

confused123456789 said:


> If I'm not going to be able to avoid her, I guess the best solution is to try my best to go "cold" in our relationship, so to speak. No smiley face texts, playful conversations, or flirting in general. Things have not progressed to the point where our feelings would be hurt, either. I don't think my wife needs to know anything, either.


:iagree:

Keep it completely business like from this point on.

If you can't, you need to step away from your officer role but do it in an orderly fashion. Tell the club that you have professional issues that will prevent you from continuing in that role.

Either that or just give your wife 1/2 your sh!t now


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## DayDream (May 25, 2011)

confused123456789 said:


> You're right, DayDream... I ain't right!


Just to let you know, I purposely used bad grammar.


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## Smoke (Jul 17, 2012)

^^^ Agreed. You HAVE to exchange contact info? You are trying to justify your actions to yourself. By doing this, you know it's wrong. The fact that you know it's wrong also means you know what your intentions are.

I would expect someone in such a responsible position in any club I was a member of to conduct themselves much more professionally with colleagues. That's all she is after all right?

Start by being honest with yourself.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

Of course you don't think you need to let your wife know. She'd freak.

And yeah, saying you haven't done anything inappropriate is bull****y. 

*READ THIS BOOK*

Dr. Shirley Glass - NOT "Just Friends"

You are also coming up with excuses about why you have to stay in contact with her. BE HONEST. If you really value your marriage, you need to get away from this woman.


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## confused123456789 (Jul 17, 2012)

thunderstuck, you're right on that point. I would not, and if she found them somehow then I would probably make up an excuse, "we're just friends", etc... When I said nothing inappropriate has happened, I meant physically. 

If I still have to be around this woman on a professional level....I just need to keep my mind occupied with me wife. That's all there is to it. I am a strong person. I can do this.

Thanks to everyone for making me feel like s***....  I know I deserve it and will think about your comments the next time I am around the 'redflag' woman.


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## confused123456789 (Jul 17, 2012)

Hope1964, are you Dr. Shirley Glass?  Damn, I thought I was good at sales...


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## trey69 (Dec 29, 2010)

confused123456789 said:


> Thanks everyone who has posted... I get the sense from your responses that my actions have been way off base. I appreciate you trying to talk some sense into me. Nothing inappropriate has happened with this woman in my opinion. We traded contact info because we are on the same committee and needed to work certain projects together (it's a professional organization). Leaving the club is not an option either, as I am an officer and in a responsible position so I can't just leave everyone hanging. If I'm not going to be able to avoid her, I guess the best solution is to try my best to go "cold" in our relationship, so to speak. No smiley face texts, playful conversations, or flirting in general. Things have not progressed to the point where our feelings would be hurt, either. I don't think my wife needs to know anything, either.



If going "cold turkey" doesn't work, which I doubt it will, then the best thing to do is leave your club. I know, I know you feel you can't because you're an officer and in a responsible position. Well, sometimes if it comes to down to trying to save the marriage if its what you want to do, then you have to actually make that sacrifice and if it means you leaving the club regardless of your position, then you just do.


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## cjpa (Jul 17, 2012)

If I had a dollar for every man I felt a "connection" with...

Feeling excited about this other woman is perfectly normal, even thinking about her when you are with your wife, normal. You just have to turn it off and let it go or accept the fact that you are going to end up in the sack with this woman if you don't. It's all about prioritizing.

Leaving the club IS an option, you are just choosing not to. If that works, fine. If not, well once again it's all about priorizing, find another hobby or lose your wife. Not a complicated decision if your priorities are in check.

good luck!


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## CallaLily (Jan 13, 2011)

I say stay where you are in your club. WHY? Because you are going to anyway and its where you want to be, also because if your feelings for this woman grow your wife will eventually find out anyway. Any time someone has something to hide it will come out. Your excuse of "Were just friends" probably wont fly, not for long anyway. People there at the club will also be able to pick up on vibes between you and this women at some point too.


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## thunderstruck (May 9, 2012)

confused123456789 said:


> thunderstuck, you're right on that point. I would not, and if she found them somehow then I would probably make up an excuse, "we're just friends", etc... When I said nothing inappropriate has happened, I meant physically.


Good. Sounds like you're heading down the right path.

But, if you decide to keep up with the woman on the side, here are a few more you can use. My wife tried it on me after I found some messages between her and an ex-bf. Didn't work too well on me. 

Along with your "just friends", go with "She's like a sister." and "Eewww. No, I'm not attracted at all." You could also take the offensive by calling your wife a bully and telling her she's being controlling, and that's not attractive.

Yes, I'm being a total smartazz here, but hopefully you getting blasted on this thread will help you to avoid a big mistake.


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## DayDream (May 25, 2011)

thunderstruck said:


> Good. Sounds like you're heading down the right path.
> 
> But, if you decide to keep up with the woman on the side, here are a few more you can use. My wife tried it on me after I found some messages between her and an ex-bf. Didn't work too well on me.
> 
> ...


Wow...hon, is that you?


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

confused123456789 said:


> Hope1964, are you Dr. Shirley Glass?  Damn, I thought I was good at sales...


No, she's dead actually, but if every married person read her book there'd be a ton less BS's out there. Hubby and I are reading it right now too 

I also tell people over and over to use coconut oil for their lube


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## CallaLily (Jan 13, 2011)

DayDream said:


> Wow...hon, is that you?


:smthumbup:


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## confused123456789 (Jul 17, 2012)

What does everyone think about talking to the other woman? Or is it just better to go dark/go cold? She'll get the point?


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## thunderstruck (May 9, 2012)

DayDream said:


> Wow...hon, is that you?


Um, no, uh...oh shyte, I guess I need to delete this account and pick a new username.


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## mc1234 (Jun 9, 2012)

My H got friendly with a girl, flirty texting messages and did not realise he was an in an EA until I pointed it out to him. H got addicted to the texting etc. You will begin to look at your wife more negatively once you start down this road. How would you feel if the roles were reversed? Please stop going down this dangerous road it is easy to stop now rather than weeks/ months later. H got addicted and into an EA within weeks of messaging. It is as bad as a betrayal as a PA, for me the emotional connection was devastating.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## confused123456789 (Jul 17, 2012)

mc1234, I think the situation you're describing is very similar to mine. I have literally only known this girl for a couple months. I am addicited to that "high" of meeting someone new, flirting via text...the EA, but I know it would obviously not feel very good to know my wife was doing the same.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

confused123456789 said:


> What does everyone think about talking to the other woman? Or is it just better to go dark/go cold? She'll get the point?


Talking to her about WHAT, exactly?!?!?! Other than telling her goodbye, there is NOTHING to say.

Seriously, dude, get away from her. And read the damned book. Everything's in there.


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## sinnister (Dec 5, 2010)

I can't relate because I've never really had those feelings while married. But I guess if I ever was in your spot I'd just avoid it. If she felt the same way as you and made it known you'd probably already have gone physical with it.


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## thunderstruck (May 9, 2012)

sinnister said:


> I can't relate because I've never really had those feelings while married. But I guess if I ever was in your spot I'd just avoid it.


I can relate b/c I've somewhat been in a situation like this. We never texted or really flirted, but an attractive/single/younger coworker was spending more and more time in my office. I didn't really realize it at first, but she was giving me a nice ego boost. I started to sense that I was enjoying our chats a bit too much, so I stopped it. 

These things start out slow and easy, and I can see where they get out of control. Still, no excuse, and I won't let it happen again.


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## FRANC (Mar 2, 2012)

Just spend ten minutes imagining some young sexy guy texting your wife, flirting with her, having 'professional meetings' with her...and she was loving the attention, and used those feelings to fuel great sex with you...

Doesn't feel too great does it?


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## Ten_year_hubby (Jun 24, 2010)

confused123456789 said:


> I could not help from flirting with her and trying to make her laugh and smile. It felt like sparks when our bodies would accidentally touch in the crowded bar or when I put my hand on her waist for a photo. Since that night, and a couple similar events since then, I can’t get this girl off my mind. We will text or email back and forth and I can’t help from being playful and flirting. Although I have no intention of being unfaithful to my wife and I don’t think this single girl wants to get involved with a married guy, I can’t help but fantasizing what it would be like to have this girl in bed. She makes me nervous, excited, and gives me butterflies in my stomach all at the same time. It’s a great feeling – literally a “high”.


Sadly, I know these feelings from personal experience. They are a curse and a great example of what the great Dr Freud means when he says that every man has within himself a death wish.

Sometimes it is not feasible to completely sever all contact with the object of your obsession/infatuation especially if you live in a small town or have deep personal investment in a small group.

I read an interesting study about fallen men and one characteristic they all shared was the belief that it couldn't happen to them. I wake up every morning and see myself as "at risk". And when I am at risk, so are my wife and kids, our plans and everything I hold dear. A sobering thought but it gets me through the day.


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## confused123456789 (Jul 17, 2012)

Even though she is flirting with me (as I am with her), I think that OW probably feels just as uncomfortable as I do about the whole situation. I know I would even if the roles were reversed and she were married and I was the single one.

I was also just thinking that if anything ever did happen btw us and went beyond where we are now, others in the club would certainly know and not only would my marriage be ruined, but also my reputation in the community. 

There is a lot more on the line here than my marriage. I understand that it's not worth it to keep pursuing a fantasy. Even if I still have to be around this OW, I am going to make sure our contact will be at a minimum and always "professional".

I also need to take this opportunity to try to re-kindle that "spark" and high that came from meeting this woman with my wife. 

Thanks again, everyone!

PS-Hope1964, just purchased your book on Kindle.


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## Enginerd (May 24, 2011)

Ah ha you are officially married now.  It happens to most of us and its natural IMO. Looks like your approaching the 7 year mark of your relationship? You need to take yourself out of this situation immediately if you value your marriage. Its the only way to protect your marriage.


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## This is me (May 4, 2011)

I can tell you an EA can be as devastating than an PA and you have been on the path to one or both. Nothing good comes from it in the end.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

confused123456789 said:


> PS-Hope1964, just purchased your book on Kindle.


This makes me happy  I hope you (and your wife) get as much out of it as my hubby and I have.


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## confused123456789 (Jul 17, 2012)

Hope1964 said:


> This makes me happy  I hope you (and your wife) get as much out of it as my hubby and I have.


I'm not sure I'll share with my wife until after I've read it. Otherwise, I think she might be curious & a little suspicious to know why I'm reading a book about infedility...I don't want to go there if I don't have to.


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## mrandmrs247 (Jul 17, 2012)

I know what the poster has done is more than just flirting and you guys have come down on him and, imo, rightly so, however is any flirting with the opposite sex acceptable? 

I do it, my wife does it and both have no problem with knowing we flirt. We both find it fun tbh and when being flirted with makes us feel attractive and does wonders for or self esteem.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

mrandmrs247 said:


> I know what the poster has done is more than just flirting and you guys have come down on him and, imo, rightly so, however is any flirting with the opposite sex acceptable?
> 
> I do it, my wife does it and both have no problem with knowing we flirt. We both find it fun tbh and when being flirted with makes us feel attractive and does wonders for or self esteem.


The difference here is, his wife has no idea what he's been up to. And he thinks it's ok to keep it secret from her.

Confused, you're still keeping things from your wife if you don't share the book with her. Hopefully once you've read it, you'll realize it's important to share it with her, and to tell her exactly WHY you got it in the first place. The unabashed truth.


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## confused123456789 (Jul 17, 2012)

mrandmrs247 said:


> I know what the poster has done is more than just flirting and you guys have come down on him and, imo, rightly so, however is any flirting with the opposite sex acceptable?
> 
> I do it, my wife does it and both have no problem with knowing we flirt. We both find it fun tbh and when being flirted with makes us feel attractive and does wonders for or self esteem.


That's part of the issue for me. I've harmlessly flirted with other woman before this one, but those interactions meant nothing to me and didn't think twice about what was said afterwords. 

There has been something about my communication and connection with this girl that somehow sparked something in me that did not make her easy to forget or get off my mind. Maybe it was that I perceived her mutual interest in me? Maybe it was being as physically close as we were that first night in the crowded bar? Maybe it was the intimacy and isolation of our text conversations? I don't know why this girl is different...

Obviously it can start off as harmless fun, but it's difficult when emotions (and hormones) get in the way!


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## mrandmrs247 (Jul 17, 2012)

So he tells his wife everything and let's say she goes mental, accuses him of having an affair etc, kicks him out the house and good knows what else. Or he stays quiet distances himself from this woman, realises what he has to lose and has dodged a bullet then puts all his time and energy in to his marriage to the benefit of his wifes happiness?


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## thunderstruck (May 9, 2012)

mrandmrs247 said:


> I know what the poster has done is more than just flirting and you guys have come down on him and, imo, rightly so, however is any flirting with the opposite sx acceptable?
> 
> I do it, my wife does it and both have no problem with knowing we flirt. We both find it fun tbh and when being flirted with makes us feel attractive and does wonders for or self esteem.


That's for each person to decide. For me, the simple test is, would I do this if my W was standing next to me? I wouldn't send flirty texts to a single woman with my W looking over my shoulder.


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## mrandmrs247 (Jul 17, 2012)

I agree texting, emailing etc is not ok imo, but if a guy pays my wife a compliment or flirts with her when I'm present I've no problem what so ever. Its just harmless fun, but bim I'm not at all the jealous type, some people I'm sure would react differently!
I think what the poster is experiencing is a very strong connection/attraction with this woman. He needs to get as far away from her as possible before things get out of hand as you can't fight biology.


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## sisters359 (Apr 9, 2009)

Your post and your responses to others' posts are full of "I can't. . ." Total and complete BS. You WON'T. 

Leave the club--really. You have already crossed a line with this woman and you are assuming you will be strong enough to control yourself. With all of your "I can'ts," however, you are greatly overestimating your own self-control and your own motivation. 

Do not try to teach yourself better self-control and gain more dignity (the kind where an adult does not excuse unexcusable behavior by saying "I can't. . .") in such a situation. You will be fooling yourself and taking too much risk. You need to start at a place with much less temptation and work on taking responsibility for yourself in that situation. 

I encourage you to tell your wife b/c it seems you need her to know so you have some help in developing some self-control and a better sense of responsibility. Obviously, that's a choice you need to make. Most people justify not telling the spouse on the grounds that it would just hurt her "for no reason." You have a good reason: you need her help to develop a more mature outlook on your responsibilities as a married man.

I suspect this will come across as harsh, but it is not intended that way. Good luck.


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## confused123456789 (Jul 17, 2012)

sisters, I'd at least like to give it a honest shot at ending this by toning down my interactions with the OW while not sacrificing something as important in my life as stepping down from the club. IMO, I think I CAN do it.


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## sculley (Jun 6, 2012)

There is one question.... Would you do all of those things with that girl in front of your wife?? If not then yes you are CHEATING and in too deep and I agree with the others. END IT NOW or else you might find yourself in too deep. You are in denial you are trying to justify your relationship with this woman saying it makes your marriage better...IT DOESN'T


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

confused123456789 said:


> . I don't think my wife needs to know anything, either.



Thats because you know what you're doing is wrong and if your wife was out with a man several times in a "club" and touching on him and fantasizing about him and texting him and "smiley facing" him and finding him irresistable and being flirty with him, you would feel cheated. 

And you know why, right?

Because it is, in fact, wrong. 

So stop it. 

If you value your marriage and wife--cut it out.

The slope is a slippery one and you're going down fast. 

Which is more important? Your wife? Or some hottie you just met? 

New always turns old.


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## amillionpieces85 (Jul 23, 2011)

Confused,
Your situation mirrors mine exactly. Let me tell you, I'm a woman and it is HARD, so I cannot imagine how difficult it must be for you, especially since she's single!
That being said, I think you should try as much as possible, to keep things professional between you two, no contact what so ever. No texts, no emails, nothing. Because no matter how much you try to convince us or yourself that you'll remain faithful, if contact continues, you won't. 
A year before I got married to my husband, I met an extremely attractive guy at my work. He left me breathless. Butterflies, sparks, everything that you are going through. When I was introduced to him my initial reaction was "god damn, he's hot" and he really was. But I thought he's wayyyy out of my league. Apparently that attraction was mutual. He was in a long term relationship, as was I, and let's just say that made things even more tempting and exciting. To cut the story short, after 10 long, and strong willed months, we both cheated on our partners. The last thing on my mind was my fiancé. The sex was so intense the first time. We went for seconds and thirds that same night. 
I later got married, couldn't live with myself for what I'd done to my husband and came out with the truth. It's killing us till now. Our relationship just won't go back the same and god knows if it'll even last. It's been a year since I confessed and he still wakes up in sweat from nightmares. It's killing me more than its killing him and it's just not worth it. In my opinion, if this guy I cheated with was that worth it, and if we both really wanted each other that much, we should have been mature enough to atleast break off what we had with our partners and then be together. But we chose the easy way and in the long run ... It's just not so easy. 
Good luck!


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

mrandmrs247 said:


> So he tells his wife everything and let's say she goes mental, accuses him of having an affair etc, kicks him out the house and good knows what else. Or he stays quiet distances himself from this woman, realises what he has to lose and has dodged a bullet then puts all his time and energy in to his marriage to the benefit of his wifes happiness?


Most people will do the second thing, but what those people don't realize is that, by being able to discuss these things with their spouse, they are affair proofing their marriage far better than if they do it by themselves. It sounds counterintuitive, but it works. Shirley Glass explains it far better than I can.


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

You are on the slippery slope of small steps right across the boundaries of your marriage.

Honestly, you shouldn't be flirting. No with any woman on the earth other than your wife. 

You shouldn't be exchanging non project related texts with this woman

And you know it. You' are living with the results of the lines you have crossed so far and you are seeking out rationalizations on why it's ok and not to worry about it. Yet, you know it's wrong.

Keep on the current path an soon you'll be hugging hello and good bye, then your heads will linger too long once and youll have a kiss. It won't be an accident in reality though because each step of the way you rationalized away the reasons why each step was ok and unavoidable.

Maybe if you work hard enough you deep down will even begin to actually believe your rationalizatins are true.

Or you can admit the lines you are crossing and scramble like hell to change direction.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## sculley (Jun 6, 2012)

Shaggy said:


> You are on the slippery slope of small steps right across the boundaries of your marriage.
> 
> Honestly, you shouldn't be flirting. No with any woman on the earth other than your wife.
> 
> ...


I agree my ex husband did what you did and basically ended up cheating on me...Numerous times.. (ex as in we have been divorced now for 5 years because of it)


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## confused123456789 (Jul 17, 2012)

amillionpieces, looking back is there anything you wish you could have done differently to control you actions with this OM at work?


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

confused123456789 said:


> amillionpieces, looking back is there anything you wish you could have done differently to control you actions with this OM at work?


Stop it. You're still looking for ways to stay in contact with her. Have you started that book yet???


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## Paulination (Feb 6, 2012)

confused123456789 said:


> *I could not help from flirting *with her and trying to make her laugh and smile. It felt like sparks when our bodies would accidentally touch in the crowded bar or when I put my hand on her waist for a photo. Since that night, and a couple similar events since then, *I can’t get this girl off my mind*. We will text or email back and forth and *I can’t help from being playful and flirting*. Although I have no intention of being unfaithful to my wife and I don’t think this single girl wants to get involved with a married guy, *I can’t help but fantasizing *what it would be like to have this girl in bed. She makes me nervous, excited, and gives me butterflies in my stomach all at the same time. It’s a great feeling – literally a “high”.


Do you really have no control over yourself? You are the most likely kind of person to cheat because you don't take ownership over your actions and look at yourself as a victim of your environment (IMO).

The truth is YOU CAN HELP it, you choose not to because it feels good. Crossing this boundary is dangerous and feels good. Soon flirting won't be enough and then you'll cross another boundary until there are none left and you will be in a PA. But, it won't be your fault because you can't help it.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Paulination--excellent job on the bolded parts.

They really tell the story...........


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

confused123456789 said:


> amillionpieces, looking back is there anything you wish you could have done differently to *control *you actions with this OM at work?


You are in control of what you do. Nobody else. Nothing else.

The ball is always in your court with your behavior.

Accountability is a helluva thing.

....................


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

Jellybeans said:


> Paulination--excellent job on the bolded parts.
> 
> They really tell the story...........


I agree.


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## meson (May 19, 2011)

I have gone through what you are going through. I fell in love with someone other than my wife and we were entangled in an organization that forced us to spend time together so that going cold turkey was not an option. Here is what I recommend:
1. Tell your wife. The fact that she knows how you feel will help keep you on the road to faithfulness. She might understand and she might not. It will hurt her but your doing so is a commitment to your marriage. I told my wife and it helped in my case.
2.	Do not say anything about your feelings to the OW. This would be the biggest mistake you can make. It may likely cause her feelings to change towards you. So don’t say anything!
3.	Stop escalating contact. Keep all exchanges to a minimum. You are addicted to the neurochemicals and contact keeps you addicted. 
4.	Become transparent with your communications with your wife. She should know your passwords for your accounts, phone etc. This will demonstrate to her that you are being faithful to your reconciliation.
5.	Discuss boundaries with your wife. You got into this by having some loose boundaries. You need to learn that people you work or do regular activities with require stiffer boundaries than others. With people like that I never touch them (avoid social hugs etc), don’t flirt ever and be more emotionally guarded.
6.	Don’t think about her sexually. NO private happy time with her as the subject. This helps release oxytocin which actually will contribute to the bonding you already feel for her.
7.	Up the game with your wife. Your wife should be the ones producing the chemicals in your brain. Start dating and doing things like you did when you courted her in the first place. You can fall in love again.
You have a long hard road ahead. You will be sorely tempted and you must resist. With your wife’s help you can get through it. You can look into my threads and posts to find more detailed info on what you might want to do or not do. Good Luck!


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## A Bit Much (Sep 14, 2011)

OP, part of the thrill and energy given to these thoughts and actions is the secrecy of it.

If your wife knew about it, maybe it would take the wind out of your sail? If guilt and shame were associated with every inappropriate thought and action with this OW, you'd be less inclined to engage in it. Not hurting your wife would be priority, not your fleeting feelings and impulses.

Maybe you should clue your wife in. Help keep you on the straight and narrow?


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## A Bit Much (Sep 14, 2011)

Great ideas Meson. :smthumbup:


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

meson said:


> I have gone through what you are going through. I fell in love with someone other than my wife and we were entangled in an organization that forced us to spend time together so that going cold turkey was not an option. Here is what I recommend:
> 1. Tell your wife. The fact that she knows how you feel will help keep you on the road to faithfulness. She might understand and she might not. It will hurt her but your doing so is a commitment to your marriage. I told my wife and it helped in my case.
> 2.	Do not say anything about your feelings to the OW. This would be the biggest mistake you can make. It may likely cause her feelings to change towards you. So don’t say anything!
> 3.	Stop escalating contact. Keep all exchanges to a minimum. You are addicted to the neurochemicals and contact keeps you addicted.
> ...


:iagree: :iagree: :iagree: 

meson read the book :smthumbup: :smthumbup:


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## moxy (Apr 2, 2012)

You're already being unfaithful. If you love your wife and want a marriage with her, then quit talking to the bimbo immediately and patch things up with your wife. If you want to continue to see other women that catch your eye when you just happen to "put your hand on their waists for photos", then man up and divorce your wife so that she can find someone who deserves her because you certainly don't.


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## Racer (Sep 24, 2009)

confused123456789 said:


> amillionpieces, looking back is there anything you wish you could have done differently to control you actions with this OM at work?


I’ll take a shot at it. I’m not going to get into my situation, however, it is a threat to my marriage. I don’t ever forget this.

What it takes is boundaries. An absolute ton of them. I’m talking twice the amount of boundaries that’d I have with any other woman on the planet. First step is defining the relationship in your head; Professional affiliation. Every single action and word spoken after that supports that definition. You do not redefine, you do not want, you do not explore, and you never ever under any circumstances think, ask or wonder ‘about us’ (the potential of you and the OW). You do not even snoop or skirt around it with playful banter. You need to stay completely aware of yourself and your immediate feelings. I literally will not get any closer than a few feet from this woman. It doesn’t matter if her dog died and you know she just wants a hug. You can not. You are not going to be that person for her. If she has a deep trauma, you will comfort from a very safe distance and not do it any other way than you would for any other loose acquaintance. “I’m so sorry” is fine... “do you want to get a drink and talk about it” is not. You do not flirt; You may be social, but just assume someone is videotaping it and will give it to your wife. You will be paranoid and you should listen to that voice.. You will not hide this person from your spouse. You will tell your spouse about your evening and any conversations. You will remind yourself over and over that breaking any boundaries will probably end your marriage.

And you will never ever forget you are attracted to her, and that stupid kind of crush can and will lead to stupid thoughts and actions. That is the tingle in your belly and why your thoughts go there sometimes. So you will be ever mindful of yourself. It is a choice... and often a series of very little choices that lead you astray. You don’t have to follow that path. And you understand how very risky it is. I strongly believe those that have affairs never quite thought on terms of that risk; They thought it couldn’t happen to them and ‘blow off’ the threat. Don’t be that guy; It could happen to you... recognize and take actions to make sure it doesn’t.

And for the record, I have worked with my redflag woman and interacted on a daily basis now with her for over five years. It has never progressed (even when dealing with the trauma of behing a BH when my mind started slipping) and now I just am not all that much into her. But the boundaries are still enforced regardless.


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## 1writer (Jul 11, 2012)

confused123456789 said:


> I have been happily married to my wife for the past 2 years, and we’ve known each other and been together for almost 6. By all accounts our marriage is great. We get along really well, sex is good and regular, and we are financially stable with good jobs. No kids yet, but it’s something that is on or radar for the next couple years. We are happy.
> 
> I recently was introduced to a new member of a club I belong to. My first impression of this woman was that she was beautiful, but in no way did I have the desire to be anything more than friends. It was not until a night out with friends from this club (including her) that I really started to feel a connection. I could not help from flirting with her and trying to make her laugh and smile. It felt like sparks when our bodies would accidentally touch in the crowded bar or when I put my hand on her waist for a photo. Since that night, and a couple similar events since then, I can’t get this girl off my mind. We will text or email back and forth and I can’t help from being playful and flirting. Although I have no intention of being unfaithful to my wife and I don’t think this single girl wants to get involved with a married guy, I can’t help but fantasizing what it would be like to have this girl in bed. She makes me nervous, excited, and gives me butterflies in my stomach all at the same time. It’s a great feeling – literally a “high”.
> 
> ...


I would second the other posters. It's wrong. Period. Your wife would be shattered if she knew you were thinking of the other woman, and not her. You can rationalize it, thinking she benefits from it, but no she doesn't. You're making her think she matters to you, when in reality, she's just a substitute, a vessel for your pleasure. 

Get away from the club. Having "fun" isn't worth destroying your marriage and, that's where it's going. So far, it's okay to text and email often. Then, it will be touching and kissing, that will be okay. I've seen too many marriages destroyed by, "fun."


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## amillionpieces85 (Jul 23, 2011)

Racer said:


> I’ll take a shot at it. I’m not going to get into my situation, however, it is a threat to my marriage. I don’t ever forget this.
> 
> What it takes is boundaries. An absolute ton of them. I’m talking twice the amount of boundaries that’d I have with any other woman on the planet. First step is defining the relationship in your head; Professional affiliation. Every single action and word spoken after that supports that definition. You do not redefine, you do not want, you do not explore, and you never ever under any circumstances think, ask or wonder ‘about us’ (the potential of you and the OW). You do not even snoop or skirt around it with playful banter. You need to stay completely aware of yourself and your immediate feelings. I literally will not get any closer than a few feet from this woman. It doesn’t matter if her dog died and you know she just wants a hug. You can not. You are not going to be that person for her. If she has a deep trauma, you will comfort from a very safe distance and not do it any other way than you would for any other loose acquaintance. “I’m so sorry” is fine... “do you want to get a drink and talk about it” is not. You do not flirt; You may be social, but just assume someone is videotaping it and will give it to your wife. You will be paranoid and you should listen to that voice.. You will not hide this person from your spouse. You will tell your spouse about your evening and any conversations. You will remind yourself over and over that breaking any boundaries will probably end your marriage.
> 
> ...



:iagree:

Confused,
I've always said life is too short for regrets, but the one thing I wish I could return time back on and do all over again is that one day that I met my coworker. The minute I developed any sort of "butterflies, sparks ... etc" for him, If I wasnt strong enough to have withheld from my fantasies, I should have quit that job. Everything with the OM was amazing. I will not deny that. But it was WRONG. And its the one thing I will regret until I die.


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## meson (May 19, 2011)

Racer said:


> I’ll take a shot at it. I’m not going to get into my situation, however, it is a threat to my marriage. I don’t ever forget this.
> 
> What it takes is boundaries. An absolute ton of them. I’m talking twice the amount of boundaries that’d I have with any other woman on the planet. First step is defining the relationship in your head; Professional affiliation. Every single action and word spoken after that supports that definition. You do not redefine, you do not want, you do not explore, and you never ever under any circumstances think, ask or wonder ‘about us’ (the potential of you and the OW). You do not even snoop or skirt around it with playful banter. You need to stay completely aware of yourself and your immediate feelings. I literally will not get any closer than a few feet from this woman. It doesn’t matter if her dog died and you know she just wants a hug. You can not. You are not going to be that person for her. If she has a deep trauma, you will comfort from a very safe distance and not do it any other way than you would for any other loose acquaintance. “I’m so sorry” is fine... “do you want to get a drink and talk about it” is not. You do not flirt; You may be social, but just assume someone is videotaping it and will give it to your wife. You will be paranoid and you should listen to that voice.. You will not hide this person from your spouse. You will tell your spouse about your evening and any conversations. You will remind yourself over and over that breaking any boundaries will probably end your marriage.
> 
> ...


:iagree::iagree::iagree:

These are great examples of boundaries to set and abide by. It has been said that the Thanksgiving meal is all about the butter. Fidelity is all about boundaries. 
Confused, you are in an EA and it needs to be controlled ASAP with boundaries. It will hurt, you will go through withdrawal. You will have urges to get close to the OW again but you can’t. And if you are tempted too much then the advice to leave the club needs to be considered.


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## Inside_Looking_Out (Apr 8, 2012)

Racer said:


> *What it takes is boundaries. * An absolute ton of them. I’m talking twice the amount of boundaries that’d I have with any other woman on the planet. First step is defining the relationship in your head; Professional affiliation. Every single action and word spoken after that supports that definition. You do not redefine, you do not want, you do not explore, and you never ever under any circumstances think, ask or wonder ‘about us’ (the potential of you and the OW). You do not even snoop or skirt around it with playful banter. You need to stay completely aware of yourself and your immediate feelings. I literally will not get any closer than a few feet from this woman. * It doesn’t matter if her dog died and you know she just wants a hug. You can not. You are not going to be that person for her.* If she has a deep trauma, you will comfort from a very safe distance and not do it any other way than you would for any other loose acquaintance. “I’m so sorry” is fine... “do you want to get a drink and talk about it” is not. You do not flirt; You may be social, but just assume someone is videotaping it and will give it to your wife. You will be paranoid and you should listen to that voice.. You will not hide this person from your spouse. You will tell your spouse about your evening and any conversations. You will remind yourself over and over that breaking any boundaries will probably end your marriage.
> .


My husband had a professional work relationship for quite some time with his OW. At first, they only spoke over the phone...she represented a company they ordered from. Then he met her once because of a company demo. Then their emails became 'professionally friendly'. Then they became more like email friends. Then they both happened to be in the same city/same country at the same time. "Let's met up for lunch...on the up and up, you know?" Then it was for dinner and drinks...she was sad over boyfriend problems and he was sad over problems in our marriage. She flirted a little, it made him feel good about himself. She laughed at his jokes. Then she shared a sad story with him, so he hugged her, then he kissed her... and then I found out.  He was in a whole other country...but one phone conversation after that kiss, and I KNEW something had happened, even though I didn't know a thing about this woman or their lunch and dinner plans. I had never even heard of her until I found all the emails that he thought he had deleted, but didn't completely get rid of. It came close to ending a 17 year marriage.

I know you have already decided to work on this, and you are sufficiently concerned and pro-active. Please be careful though. My husband also thought he was immune to cheating on me. No one, not him, not me, no one, ever pegged my husband as someone that would ever do that. He himself didn't realize the gravity of what he had done...until he had been caught. Although...right after he was caught...you know what, he argued with me over being able to stay 'friends' with her. That whole fog thing...read up on it. It can make you do some dumb things!

Once you are caught...everything changes. My husband went from being my hero, to being something else. It's serious...it's a ticking time bomb.


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## confused123456789 (Jul 17, 2012)

Racer, after reading your post that really hit home to me. I identify completely with that situation and I am going to try my hardest to set and enforce those boundaries with this woman. THANK YOU!

In regards to everyone saying that I should talk to my wife about it... I'm torn on that. On the one hand, my wife is my best friend that I want to share everything with. On the other hand, the last thing I want to do is hurt her. I understand by engaging in this whole situation I was going down that road toward pain anyway, however, I feel like I've recognized this at an early point in the process. I don't want to admit something to my wife that will only cause her concern and seem worse than it actually is. 

I've accepted the fact that what I've done is absolutely wrong, however initial or innocent. I also know that more of the guilt I'm feeling has less to do with the conversations, texts, etc. I've had for the OW, then it does with the internal feelings of attraction (and my body wanting more). I feel worse about what I've thought & felt than what I've done....if that makes any sense. Fortunately that is only a problem in my mind and with some courage and will power, believe it is something I can overcome.

Writing all of this down has been very helpful in understanding how I feel. Thanks everyone for your help, no matter how hard I've been getting crushed by some of you . This message board is amazing.


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## meson (May 19, 2011)

Confused,

In my case my wife knew I was in an EA before i did. My wife noticed that I acted differently around the OW. If your wife sees the difference in the way you act around the OW and finds out in some way that you felt that about another woman, she may consider that the fact that you didn't tell her makes it worse. Things have a way of coming out. What if she finds your TAM account? What if the OW mentions her feelings to some BFF which then gets back to your wife? If you don't tell your wife you are not being fully transparent.


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## Jamison (Feb 10, 2011)

meson said:


> Confused,
> 
> In my case my wife knew I was in an EA before i did. My wife noticed that I acted differently around the OW.


Most of the times wives do notice. Some just choose to look the other way for various reasons. Or some are waiting for the right time to bring it up. Either way, anytime someone starts having feelings for someone other than their spouse it will carry over into the marital relationship, and it wont be for the best.


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## Racer (Sep 24, 2009)

confused123456789 said:


> In regards to everyone saying that I should talk to my wife about it... I'm torn on that. On the one hand, my wife is my best friend that I want to share everything with. On the other hand, the last thing I want to do is hurt her..


Listen, you are early in your marriage and young. You are human I assume. Your wife is too. Just broach it carefully. More along the lines of ‘Hey, I don’t want you to panic, but _(name)__ joined the board at the club. It bugs me, but I’m worried I could develop a puppy love crush on her. Nothing is happening, but I’ll admit there’s a draw toward her. So, just sort of keep me honest about it. Ask me about it and keep on top and challenge me... “ Then let her ask you any questions. Be sure to reinforce you are nervous about it and what you are doing on your end; The boundary talk. 

Couple things. One, it takes balls o’steel to tell your wife (and it doesn’t hurt to show her vulnerability). Two, it ups your value because she’ll subconsciously understand you might be attractive to other women that spouses start to take for granted. And three, it hopefully sets an example of working as a team to solve personal issues and that hopefully she’ll find a comfort level that when she runs across it (and she will), she can come to you for support as well. You aren’t making her responsible for you to be faithful, you are asking for help so you can stay true to yourself and hold strong on these boundaries. Be re-assuring that your wife is the one you want and you’d hate to screw it up... And no, she isn’t going to be happy about it. Don’t be defensive or ‘justify’. Just speak from your heart and what its telling you, including your fear of telling her (your wife) about this and the reaction. Just deal with it and be supportive of her. Open book policy, even when it stings, is best for the long term..


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## Nigel (Mar 14, 2012)

I'd hazard a guess that the other woman knows exactly what she's doing as well. Slowly, slowly, catchy monkey! Emotional vampire or spider woman. I have a similar story to you, although my circumstances were different (depression at time). You need to be very careful, this woman may get off on the fact an unavailable man pays her attention and is attracted to her. Does she have self esteem issues? You may find she just wants to hook you in and then cut you loose when things get too real for her. She will then blame you for making all the running, when in fact you have unwittingly wandered into a carefully laid trap. Be careful, be very very careful, because you are not special , different or immune from the bite of a spider woman!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## mrandmrs247 (Jul 17, 2012)

I believe that because you appear to have little self control you should disclose all to your wife. 
Listen to the advice you've been given by all these intelligent wise people, that's why you posted in the first place!


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## sculley (Jun 6, 2012)

enoughisenough said:


> You can't leave the club because you have an office holder position and can't leave people hanging? What about your wife? Is the club or your wife more important? Is it ok to leave your wife hanging? If you left, someone else would step into your place in no time. No-one is irreplaceable in professional contexts. Just some things to think about.


I put a status on my FB the other day here it is...

"Oh your successful at work and everyone there likes you? How does your family feel about you? *life isn't how successful you are at a temporary status in life, but the person you are at the end of the day with your spouse and kids* REALTALK!"

You might want to take this to heart


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## sculley (Jun 6, 2012)

Jamison said:


> Most of the times wives do notice. Some just choose to look the other way for various reasons. Or some are waiting for the right time to bring it up. Either way, anytime someone starts having feelings for someone other than their spouse it will carry over into the marital relationship, and it wont be for the best.


I agree don't have the wool over your eyes. Women when they are emotionally attached to their husbands can feel the slightest change in them. They do tend to wait to bring it up because they want to make sure it's legit. You might cause some resentment in your wife and not even know it. Especially if your being more playful with her etc for no real reason and out of the blue. You mentioned earlier how you were crushed by some of us....Well I love this board because its honesty...If your the one being dumb someone here will tell you lol


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## confused123456789 (Jul 17, 2012)

OK, after hearing everyone's opinion and knowing in my heart that it is the right thing to do, I've decided that I am going ahead and talk to my wife about the OW. I am going to be completely honest with her about everything. As Racer said, I will also to keep things light and assure her that she is my true love...that's really my style anyway as I don't want things to get overly emotional if I can help it. I'm telling her because I love her and want her to know my failures and that I value our marriage more than anything and I need her help. To everyone who said "wives know" I think that is also probably true so hopefully our conversation won't feel to her like it's coming out of left field. 

I decided it would be best for me to wait until the weekend to bring it up. That way we'll have plenty of time to talk things through and just be together without having to leave each other for work, etc.

Keep your fingers crossed that she does not come down on me as hard as PinkBeret did! Dang!


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## nirvana (Jul 2, 2012)

I think you should not tell the wife but just stop cOntact wih OW. Your wife will never let you forget about this and brIng it up for the rest of your life. I still hear how I dissed her relatives after 10 yrs. women never forget.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## I'mInLoveWithMyHubby (Nov 7, 2011)

Your being unfaithful now. Stop before it goes any further. Tell your wife you are having an emotional affair on her.


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## alton (Jul 18, 2012)

I wouldn't tell the wife either. Will just make her feel insecure forever. There is literally nothing either of you will gain from this. 

Just stop seeing the other woman, make sure you don't do it in future and move on.


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## I'mInLoveWithMyHubby (Nov 7, 2011)

Well, I've always been upfront and honest with my husband. I've never held any feelings back and we do communicate well. I also have the upmost respect for my husband as well.


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## alton (Jul 18, 2012)

I'mInLoveWithMyHubby said:


> Well, I've always been upfront and honest with my husband. I've never held any feelings back and we do communicate well. I also have the upmost respect for my husband as well.


Well so have I with my wife, but then I've never done anything to betray her. 

Even if you did something that would break his trust in you? It will most likely just make her insecure and untrusting and have damaging consequences on the relationship and then there is no going back. 

It's not a full on affiar so I think it's one of those things that she's probably rather not know, as long as it's a one off.


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## I'mInLoveWithMyHubby (Nov 7, 2011)

alton said:


> Well so have I with my wife, but then I've never done anything to betray her.
> 
> Even if you did something that would break his trust in you? It will most likely just make her insecure and untrusting and have damaging consequences on the relationship and then there is no going back.
> 
> It's not a full on affiar so I think it's one of those things that she's probably rather not know, as long as it's a one off.


Absolutely, I guess it might be a fault of mine. I like to have things resolved and I'm very upfront about it, but I also compromise well when needed.

I would never betray my husband either, but if I had any issues of any sorts I'd be bringing them up ASAP to be delt with.


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## confused123456789 (Jul 17, 2012)

It's interesting that there are so many different opinions on this issue of telling your spouse about something like my situation - not a full blown EA per say IMO, but certainly heading that way if don't quickly define boundaries and get the OW out of my life. I will only have to see her once or twice a month at club functions...all of which there are many other people there that I can talk to and completely avoid even making eye-contact with her, much less having a conversation.


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## nirvana (Jul 2, 2012)

I really think you should not tell your wife. You may move past, but she might not. You did not have sex with the OM, your mind went astray for some time. Happens to all of us, does not mean you run and confide everything. She will lose respect for you and worse, bring it up when you have arguments. If you have a fight and decide to go out for a drive, you will hear "So you are going back to your little wh0re???". It's not worth it. She might ASSUME that you banged her even if you did not. Can of worms. If your little EA is done, just let it rest. I think your wife also would not want to know about this since it's not major cheating that you did.

I think most men will say "move on and don't tell", while the women posters might want you to confide.


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## CallaLily (Jan 13, 2011)

You have people telling you, you should tell your wife, you have people telling you that you shouldn't. Bottom line, you need to do what you feel is right in your heart. Whether you choose to tell her or not, the main thing is you need to stop contact with this OW. Going "cold" while still attending your club meetings with her there might work for awhile, but if you truly have emotional feelings for her, that wont last but so long IMO.


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## Jason439 (Jul 16, 2012)

I have to agree not to tell your wife. Move on, cut contact with the other woman. 

My wife has never forgotten anything that has upset her either minor or major. She does tend to bring past mistakes up during arguments/disagreements and uses them as ammunition to make her point. 

I thinks it's best to leave the past in the past and move on. 

Jason


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## A Bit Much (Sep 14, 2011)

So the reasoning behind not telling is that she'll never forget it? Interesting. 

I take that as you only trying to save your ass. Another selfish move on top of the one you already pulled getting so deep in with the other woman to begin with. If the tables were turned, I bet you would want to know your wife was having an EA. Oh yes indeed.


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## Jason439 (Jul 16, 2012)

Personally, if my wife had started an EA, then withdrew before it turned physical, I wouldn't want to know. 

As long as she moved on, forgot about the person an perhaps learned something about herself in the process. 

If it was something she kept doing over and over, that's a different story.


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## Ten_year_hubby (Jun 24, 2010)

confused123456789 said:


> It's interesting that there are so many different opinions on this issue of telling your spouse about something like my situation - not a full blown EA per say IMO, but certainly heading that way if don't quickly define boundaries and get the OW out of my life. I will only have to see her once or twice a month at club functions...all of which there are many other people there that I can talk to and completely avoid even making eye-contact with her, much less having a conversation.


confused,

When I tried to bring the subject up, sort of testing the waters, my wife reacted very badly. I never mentioned it again and she seems happier for it. The woman I was obsessed with is too intertwined for me to completely disengage. When I have to interact with her, face to face, I make is short and businesslike and get myself out of there.


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## Racer (Sep 24, 2009)

alton said:


> Even if you did something that would break his trust in you? It will most likely just make her insecure and untrusting and have damaging consequences on the relationship and then there is no going back. .


And I'm still different yet; More food for thought. This is totally dependant on your spouse’s coping skills and character AND what you want to gain. My story isn’t like the OP’s. My wayward wife is looney. She goes off the deep end with jealousy. Screaming, demeaning words, etc. And on the flip side, during the worst of her foggy adultery, she got it in her head that I was a horrible person and no woman would want or tolerate me. 

So why I tell is specifically to make her feel insecure and have targeted specific ‘ideas’ she has. My redflag woman is half her age, extremely attractive and smart; My assistant I interact with on a daily basis... She is also a support person as I recover from being betrayed. She is a massive threat to my wife because my wife see’s herself as those things and relied on them for years to get what she wants (entitled ex-cheerleader sort). She hasn’t adjusted well to getting older (part of her lashing out with adultery I think). The insecurity I prey on is her reliance on looks to attract and find self-worth AND her notions that she is my only choice. Those are dangerous thoughts. I kill two birds with one stone. She can’t compete on beauty or intelligence with the assistant and knows it. She is reassured by me that she (my wife of coarse) is my choice, and my actions support this. So, I’m adjusting her perception of who she is and her value. If her ideas about who I am and her value to me are true, then there’d be no way I could resist the temptations of this young hottie... So she has to conclude that maybe she’s wrong (gasp) and do some soul searching to understand her true worth isn’t her looks and that isn’t the kind of guy I am either. 

And I’m not doing it in a nice rational way; I’m using her weaknesses and thoughts against her. I do also look at the side effects of my methodology though. It has brought us closer together and opened up communication. It has allowed us to talk about natural, albeit taboo things, like attraction to others. It has opened up her perception of who I am and how I tick. It has upped my value and respect from my wife. It has resulted in more intimacy and kind words as she evaluates her value. And I didn’t have to have an affair to wake her up to the idea that I am a catch. That’s why I’ve made the suggestions to confused.... And on the flip side, she demands full transparency, snoops, and is a bit ‘clingy’ and paranoid when I’m not in sight... so I handle it just like we’d suggest to any wayward since I’ve got nothing to hide. I’m not mad about it at all. 

But, the disclaimer is that our marriage was screwed already and had zero trust... so there wasn’t much to break or lose.


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## Smoke (Jul 17, 2012)

I think you need to tell your wife. You ARE having an EA. The OW may not be, but you are. Sure you can shut the door on it, but doors can be reopened. Why not put a brick wall in front of the door so you cannot open it later? Your wife, I am guessing, will be more than happy to stand guard. She will fight for her husband. Are you willing to let her?
You have to be honest with yourself by being honest with her. And I think I remember something about honesty being important in a relationship.

It will be difficult, but you need to Man Up.


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## descarado (Mar 13, 2012)

I agree with Jason.

This doesn't sound like a fullblown EA; moreover, this sounds like the first time you've done this. Get your head out of your @$$, and start drawing boundaries with the other woman...and with all women, except your wife, from now on. 

If you can't draw those boundaries, or you can't leave the club-- yes, then talk to your wife. 

Otherwise you cause trust problems in the name of restoring trust.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

Have you started reading THE BOOK????????

Please, do before you talk to your wife. it will help tremendously.

It takes a WHOLE lot of guts to talk to your spouse about something like this. I think you have them.


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## amillionpieces85 (Jul 23, 2011)

I really do not think you should tell your wife. I know it's confusing the hell out of you to have people telling you yes tell, and others saying dont. Honestly though, nothing happened, thankfully, and you'll be sparing her alot of hurt feelings. Some things are better left unsaid, and this is one of them.
I'm a wife, I've been through the pain of having my husband cheat (EA) and honestly, if I could rewind time, I would have opted to not have known. The trust was broken, my feelings were hurt, and I'm constantly paranoid. I dont sleep well, I dont eat well, I'm not happy, and he's not happy. Hes continuously assuring me nothing is going on now and I have a hard time believing it. Who knows, maybe he is telling the truth. But my paranoia has gotten the best of me and I would hate for any woman to go through what I am going through now.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

amillionpieces85 said:


> I really do not think you should tell your wife. I know it's confusing the hell out of you to have people telling you yes tell, and others saying dont. Honestly though, nothing happened, thankfully, and you'll be sparing her alot of hurt feelings. Some things are better left unsaid, and this is one of them.
> I'm a wife, I've been through the pain of having my husband cheat (EA) and honestly, if I could rewind time, I would have opted to not have known. The trust was broken, my feelings were hurt, and I'm constantly paranoid. I dont sleep well, I dont eat well, I'm not happy, and he's not happy. Hes continuously assuring me nothing is going on now and I have a hard time believing it. Who knows, maybe he is telling the truth. But my paranoia has gotten the best of me and I would hate for any woman to go through what I am going through now.


This is typical rug sweeping talk. To just ignore bad things and hope they go away on their own. Well, they DON'T. I'll hazard a guess that your husband isn't being very forthcoming with you about things either, and wants you to just 'get over it'. And that it hasn't been very long since D day.

You can either use these instances as ways to strengthen your relationship, or you can pretend they've never happened and let them eat away at the foundations.


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## amillionpieces85 (Jul 23, 2011)

Hope1964 said:


> This is typical rug sweeping talk. To just ignore bad things and hope they go away on their own. Well, they DON'T. I'll hazard a guess that your husband isn't being very forthcoming with you about things either, and wants you to just 'get over it'. And that it hasn't been very long since D day.
> 
> You can either use these instances as ways to strengthen your relationship, or you can pretend they've never happened and let them eat away at the foundations.


It might be "rug sweeping talk" for you, but I wouldnt call it that. Tell me, what's the point of him telling her? If he's SO sure that he can maintain a professional relationship with the OW then why tell his wife? If he was afraid of the temptation, if he was afraid of cheating, if he had gone out on a date/s with the OW, I would def understand him coming out with the truth. But this is a crush. A fantasy. It'll die. And he has the willpower to not let it go any further than it already has, so why make his poor wife suffer? 

And FYI, my husband would like to be alot more open about his EA, but I refuse to hear the details of it. I did want to know everything in the beginning but it became obsessive, I couldn't sleep (still cant), their swap of words was constantly replaying in my head (still is) and eventually I just wanted to get over it and didn't want any details. It happened, it was an EA, I know that it wasn't PA so what use are the details going to do for my getting over his affair?

Also, it's been 2 years since D day. Maybe a short while for you, but a long time since my happiness, since a good nights sleep, and since I havent had an innocent unparanoid day.


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## Jason439 (Jul 16, 2012)

Amillionpeices makes some very valid points. Especially coming from a woman who's husband had an EA. I still say don't tell her if you are certain you can refrain from any further activities with the OW.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

amillionpieces85, the fact you're two years out and still feel that way speaks volumes. You haven't dealt with anything, you've ignored it to try and make it go away. Tell me, what exactly HAVE you done? Not only to get over what your husband did, but what you did? You cheated on him, did you not? Was that before or after he cheated?

And obviously the OP is NOT sure he can maintain a professional relationship with this woman and only go that far. Anyone who is SURE of that is deluding themselves. By telling your spouse, you're eliciting their help in affair proofing your marriage. He's telling her he loves her, he trusts her, and he wants to make what they have together stronger.


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## Jason439 (Jul 16, 2012)

I honestly believe that most women ( in my experience) have a very difficult time forgiving and leaving past events behind. 

I'm saying forgive, but not forget.


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## amillionpieces85 (Jul 23, 2011)

Hope1964 said:


> amillionpieces85, the fact you're two years out and still feel that way speaks volumes. You haven't dealt with anything, you've ignored it to try and make it go away. Tell me, what exactly HAVE you done? Not only to get over what your husband did, but what you did? You cheated on him, did you not? Was that before or after he cheated?
> 
> And obviously the OP is NOT sure he can maintain a professional relationship with this woman and only go that far. Anyone who is SURE of that is deluding themselves. By telling your spouse, you're eliciting their help in affair proofing your marriage. He's telling her he loves her, he trusts her, and he wants to make what they have together stronger.


I cheated before. Before we got married. He cheated after our marriage. Before or after, it doesn't justify what either of us did. This isn't a game of I'll get you back. We're not in kindergarten. We were both wrong. 

I've tried many things, nothing works. Nothing brings back the trust. Like a broken glass, you try fixing it, you'll get cut along the way, it'll never go back the same. Never. No matter what you or anyone on here tells me. And obviously, it's why I am here. Because I'm hopeless.

Also, I DID say IF he's certain that he can maintain hisself not to tell. IF. It's his call and he knows, more than you and I, what he's capable of. When I met my coworker, I instantly knew something would happen between us, I chose to stay in that environment, and it took a long while before we acted upon our fantasies (10 mths) but it happened. And I knew it would happen. Because I wanted it to happen and I disregarded anyone and everyone in this world. I acted selfishly. However, the fact that OP has come on here wayy before anything happened between them, is a sign that he might not be selfish and he might have willpower and self control.


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## amillionpieces85 (Jul 23, 2011)

Jason439 said:


> I honestly believe that most women ( in my experience) have a very difficult time forgiving and leaving past events behind.
> 
> I'm saying forgive, but not forget.



:iagree:


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## confused123456789 (Jul 17, 2012)

To address several points that have been made:

1. No, I have not started THE BOOK. I will, it's just been tough to find the time during the week....

2. I want to provide some perspective on the scope of my EA. First of all, I've known the OW for approximately 2 months and have had only a handful of encounters with her which had always been with other people in the club. The texting only recently started (and has subsequently ended btw - I deleted her number from my phone and she has not contacted me now in several days). Most recently, her and I met for lunch to discuss business this week. Although it was my idea, by the time lunch was over I realized that this woman is occupying an abnormal amount of my time. Flirting at the bar and texting were fun and helped "fueled the fantasy", but it was abstract - meeting one on one made me ask my self realistically, "what am I doing here?". Still she was on my mind and I didn't know what to do next. I tried reading some stuff online about my situation, including some stuff on this board, but could not really find anything to satisfy me so I posted this message. 

3. Looking over what I wrote (which was just yesterday), it seems like it was written by a totally different person. Fantasy dominated reality. I think I was in a daze or something, completely confused. I sound like a guy who has no control over himself, which in a way is a way of rationalizing the whole situation. Sort of like saying, "I can't be held responsible, it's my emotions! I'm only human!" Thanks to everyone here for bringing me back to planet earth! 

4. I thought this morning I would talk to my wife this weekend. Now I'm not completely sure. I think it might be best for me to see how I do the next time I'm around the OW first. Test the waters of my own resolve, so to speak. If I'm successful and keep myself and my mind in check by defining boundaries and the like, then it's a small step in the direction of "problem solved" and I won't feed the need to involve my wife. The minute that changes or I feel like I am falling back toward fantasy-land, then I need to tell me wife. That in and of itself is almost like my own ultimatum.... "If you can behave yourself from now on, you don't have to tell her..." Otherwise, "you're screwed, man"


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## Jason439 (Jul 16, 2012)

If I was in your position, point #4 would be what I would do. As I mentioned, my wife has troubles forgiving and moving on. I wouldn't want to add any more fuel to the fire so to speak.


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## A Bit Much (Sep 14, 2011)

My husband and I are really in sync. We can't hide things from each other because of this. I sincerely hope for your sake that your wife never reads the inappropriate conversations or gets to sense the flirtatious vibe you give off when around one another.

If ever she does...... oh the explaining you will have to do. I agree with Hope1964 about affairprooofing your marriage. That takes both spouses working together. Can't do that when one spouse isn't aware the other is weak.


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## meson (May 19, 2011)

To tell or not to tell that is the question. The answer probably depends upon a couple’s view of marriage. 

To those that view marriage as some perfect state of being, then telling breaks that perfect state and all is changed forever for the worse. But every marriage has problems so the perfect state doesn’t really exist. 

To others marriage is the place to find happiness in life with another. These people build up a Castleville of protection from the outside world to create their zone of happiness. Telling a spouse about feelings for another penetrates the zone of happiness with disturbing facts. Those disturbing facts are best avoided because the illusion of happiness is more important.

Another view of marriage is that it is a couple deciding to emotionally invest in each other (over all others) in partnership for the benefit of the couple. Life is punctuated with happiness, tragedy, enthusiasm and depression. For those that view marriage as a benefit for the both of them, each partner looks out for the other and telling is part of the looking out for each other.

I’m a climber and when I am climbing with my partner it can be thought of like a marriage. We are a team going up a rock face trying to live and enjoy life. We watch out for each other, help each other over hard terrain. We provide support when one of us is terrified and revel in victories. The commitment is to the partnership. If my partner has issues with how I tie a knot or build an anchor, I want and need to know. Likewise if we are exposed terrain I want my partner to let me know they are a bit freaked out and need extra watching. A common call in climbing is “watch me here”. This alerts the partner to potential problems.

The difference with the last philosophy is that trials and tribulations are expected and there is a mutual goal to work through them. Marriage is the path and the experience. The previous philosophies entwine marriage with conditionals. To protect the conditionals participants resort to hiding truths and ignoring issues. As time goes on these turn into telling lies and acting in self interest. To me this is not a good foundation for a marriage.

What is the underlying philosophy of your marriage? Do you and your spouse view it the same? The answer will then become more clear.


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## confused123456789 (Jul 17, 2012)

Hey everyone - I thought it would post an update on how things were going for me just in case anyone was curious. First of all, I decided not to mention anything to my wife, which I think was for the best. I've completely cut off all contact with the OW - there have been no emails or texts. Fortunately club functions where I might have seen her have been infrequent during the summer, so that has been helpful as well. Honestly, I feel like that EA "fog" has been lifted. I'm not sure if things will be different once I do actually come in contact with the OW again, but at this point I know I will be able to better control my actions and keep the necessary boundaries in place. What felt like such overwhelming emotion and excitement toward the OW a few weeks ago now seems so silly to me. I hope that I can look back at this whole experience in the future and see it as a learning experience and never again "play with fire" of another woman in my marriage. Thanks again everyone for your help and straightforward advice.


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## Gaia (Apr 27, 2012)

Grats on your progress! 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## DayDream (May 25, 2011)

Awesome! That's great to hear.


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## curlysue321 (Jul 30, 2012)

It's normal to notice someone who is attractive. Even as a straight female I notice other women that are attractive. Maybe a little bit of a flirt when you went out was okay, but it crosses the line when you gave this woman your phone number and started texting her. I would be very upset if my husband were doing this.


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