# None of the above



## lastinline (Jul 21, 2009)

Please Lord tell me that I am not the only one this happens to. Is there anyone else out there who gets repeatedly "slammed" by their spouse no matter what they do? Today for instance, I went to clinic to see the husband of one of my wife's closest friends. He very recently sustained an injury while riding his motorcycle. My wife has just had knee surgery, so I suggested she come along and "we'd get a little treatment in on that as well." She agreed. Well, in walks her friend's husband with his daughter in toe, fresh from a soccer match. Unfortunately, she had sprained her ankle during the game, so he asked if I could look at that as well. I said sure. Grade I anterior talofibular ligament (ATF) sprain, no big deal. He asked about crutches, and I said they weren't necessary, but I showed him what was exercise wise. As I knew he was a coach, I showed him how to properly tape her ankle, and gave him some cover roll and linen tape. After all, he is the husband of one of my wife's best friends, and it's his kid. Whole process, maybe 30 minutes. Then I took a look at him. He had a nastier injury, a Grade II shoulder separation, i.e. the acromiocalvicular (AC) ligament was sprung/disrupted, but the coracoclavicular (CA) ligament appeared intact. I walked him through the X-rays, and we had a long and fascinating discussion on the AC and CA ligaments. I consulted with him about his precautions and limitations, as well as his choices between a sling in GH ADD and IR or a figure-8 brace, and personally opted for the latter. Whole process, maybe 45 minutes. Well when we got to my car, what did I get? Was it a "thank you" for working pro bono on her friends family members on a Saturday? No, but I wasn't expecting that. What I got was "b*tched at" because I "took too long." I guess I wasn't expecting that either come to think of it. I didn't take her "input" well, and she wonders why I hit things for a hobby. In short, I got a reluctant apology where I would have preferred either thanks or silence. My point in closing is that this illustrates one of the more frustrating aspects of our marriage, that being what I like to call "the none of the above phenomena". I am convinced that 2/3's of the time a right answer does not exist for this woman, and I get crucified for trying to do what I think she friggin wants me to do. I could think of a thousand places I would have rather been than in clinic on a Saturday after noon for 2 hours, but I did it primarily as a favor to my wife. Her friends were at least grateful, but am I stupid for continuing to look for that allusive 1/3 when it may not even exist?


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## lastinline (Jul 21, 2009)

I read other people's posts and they say "my spouse doesn't like me and is considering divorce because" they are: overweight, messy, unmotivated, depressed, needy etc. I am proposing the radical notion that it may be that if your spouse doesn't like you it doesn't matter "how good you look on paper". I suspect that in my case. So it doesn't really matter what you are or aren't because the majority of the problem likely lies with them and their allusive quest for "happiness". My crime of the day...I didn't want to go to "Linens and Things." I checked the bed this morning and we have linen, and fortunately when I was at the store yesterday I bought a bunch of things. Please, I opted to stay home with our 4 1/2 year old and we are playing Batman. It's a much better use of my time if you ask me.


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## Corpuswife (Apr 24, 2009)

lastinline: You hit the nail on the head...."it doesn't really matter what your are or aren't because the majority of the problem likely lies with them and their allusive quest for "happiness." 

They are truly NOT happy. They aren't willing to turn inward toward some sort of self discovery. They focus on what they don't have. They focus on others fault. You get complaints instead of compliments. 

There was a story regarding some famous painter (forgot name). When he was 4 years of age his mother went to the store. His older sister was supposed to be watching him. He was left to paint pictures during this time. What really happened was he painted the picture, the floor and the walls. When he got home, his mother opened the door and said to him "oh my what wonderful work you've done!" He was so proud. She never mentioned the mess or at least he didn't remember it. She focused on the compliment. She could have done the opposite (which many do). He might have been detoured from every painting again. That is a powerful story for me...as with kids and spouses it's easy to look around the positives. 

I'm sorry you life is this way...it must make you feel like crap. Like you never can do right, no matter what. Maybe tell her what you feel like...let her know how it hurts.


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## dobo (Jun 30, 2009)

Have you ever asked your wife why she's so unhappy and ask her to leave you out of it because it is impossible that you are responsible for 100% of the unhappiness in her life.

However, if she refuses to leave you out of it, you could ask her why she elects such ongoing unhappiness -- why doesn't she leave? Does she like being unhappy or just having someone to blame for it? Because I'm thinking that if you were really the cause, she'd move on. Instead, she's using you as a scapegoat to avoid having to deal with her real problem : herself.

You could always offer to help her out by giving her a giant dose of forever aloneness in the form of a big fat divorce if that'd push her in the right direction. Or she could elect to see someone about what's truly bothering her, whatever that might be. And maybe she could become a little happier and maybe she could stop using you as her excuse for all that's bad in the world, and just maybe then the marriage could survive.

If she doesn't have a clue, you might want to clue her in -- people who live with spouses like this eventually put an end to the relationship one way or another. Some choose destructive things like cheating. Others choose more honorable things like divorcing. Some even choose extremely harmful things like murder or suicide. But they do eventually put an end to the relationship.


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## recent_cloud (Apr 18, 2009)

lastinline said:


> My crime of the day...I didn't want to go to "Linens and Things." I checked the bed this morning and we have linen, and fortunately when I was at the store yesterday I bought a bunch of things. Please, I opted to stay home with our 4 1/2 year old and we are playing Batman. It's a much better use of my time if you ask me.


the trip to linens n things wasnt about procurement.

and you know that

andand you shouldn't use your son as an excuse to not spend time with your wife. that's just manipulative.

andandand your original post is rich in doctorspeak.

i have many friends who are docs and i always notice that the more shall i say self absorbed docs wax on about specific treatments

while the more generous of spirit leave the specifics of their work to history and instead concentrate on friends and family.

you post here as a victim

and i just don't buy it.


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## lastinline (Jul 21, 2009)

First off the trip to linen and things was about being "busy". Yes, I am referring simply to the process of doing something, so one has something to do. She came back with an iron, which perhaps is "iron"ic because as far as I can tell there is nothing wrong with the one we had. Yes, I know this for a fact, as I do iron my own clothes. I guess it's the sad residue of six years of military service. As for "manipulative", there are many adjectives that describe me well. Some of them are positive and some of them negative, but manipulative did not make the list. If you had said stubborn, I would have agreed. I didn't go, because I didn't want to go. Our little one was sick, so she didn't want to take him, and in my humble opinion, she honestly knew how I would react when she "asked" me to go. So who really was manipulating who? However, maybe manipulation is too strong of a word, because I believe manipulation implies an unawareness, so really what we have is consent. The part that "confuses" me is the "quiet upset" thing when I tell her, "no I really don't care to go to Linen's and Things." What friggin guy wants to go to that particular store? I would have went to Costco or Smart & Final with her, Sports Authority in a heart beat, or even Target, but even love has boundaries recent_cloud. As for all of the doc speak, all of my occupations have been heavily "jargon" laden. If you ever knew me, I also sound and act a lot like a soldier. This doesn't make me "evil" or "self-absorbed", it makes me "career driven". I still haven't decided it this one is a positive or negative adjective. I suspect it is a little of both. I am not a "victim". I have chosen for specific reasons to stay in my relationship. I am aware that I could leave if I chose to do so, but I don't want to "loose" my kids. With my schedule, I could only have custody of the older ones at best, and that isn't acceptable. Also, I do love my wife. It is just that she can be God awful difficult to deal with, and she lacks anything that remotely resembles direction in her life at the moment. This frustrates me very much, as I am sure it does her as well. It is just that this "frustration" seems directed primarily towards me, and I am tired of being down wind on her shooting range. If I f**k up, fine I'll own up and take the bullet, but don't b*tch at me because you wanted to be a stay at home mom, and suprize "the little kids constantly hang on you", or "every day is pretty much the same." I am not always fond of my job. I know many people who in my lowly opinion: do less, know less, stress less, and make a hell of a lot more money than I do, but it all goes with the territory, and money is not my primary motivator. I thought family was hers, after all we have a litter of kids and she always said she wanted to be a stay at home mom, but perhaps in retrospect family is not her primary motivator. I honestly don't know, which is why I write these threads. I am trying to put a voice to the confusion of our relationship in hopes of being able to glean a solution or two. What I do know, is that I am one of her bigger advocates. I am an advocate, as I do more to better her situation, and ask for less in return than anyone who is or has been on her "life roster" with perhaps the exception of her mother. Interestingly enough, I spent Saturday morning with her mom helping her run some errands, and while she certainly doesn't know all of the specifics of my relationship with her daughter, she does frequently ask "what's wrong with "K". Why, is it because we are scheming? No, it's because she cares about her too, and senses something is wrong with her as well. It just "sucks" when it is your job to "help people", and the person you have cared about the most, you can "help" the least. So, recent_cloud, feel free to add "frustrated" to my list of adjectives as well. I think people have got the "gist" of this thread completely wrong. It's not that my wife thinks that I am a "bad person", it is that no matter what I do for her she is never "happy" with what I have done, i.e. I have chosen the wrong answer out of the list, because the right one is never listed, thus the heading "none of the above". It is the notion that there can be problems in a relationship because one partner is aware that they in fact lack something, but that they are unfairly looking to the other person in the relationship to friggin Jerry McGuire "complete them". Do you "get it" now?


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## Sandy55 (Jun 3, 2009)

lastinline:

I've posted with you on here many times.

Agree with Recent Cloud. 

Linens and Things was about her wanting you to spend time with HER. I have a feeling she is trying to save her marriage harder than *you* may realize. You just can't see the forest for the trees. 

I work with docs. There are several types, and you appear to be one who craves recognition big time and one who things you deserve something just because you are Mr. Doc.

Well, son, we all put our pants on the same way: one leg at a time. Your arrogance oozes from all your posts.

You need to do a serious inventory of you, not your wife.


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## Sandy55 (Jun 3, 2009)

Oh, and BTW, your wife needs a friend, not some enemy with such anger and hurtfulness.

Being a SAHM myself for 25 some odd years, AND trying to keep some semblance of "who am I' is the hardest thing a person could do, but you won't EVER be in her position, Dude, because YOU get to have kids raised for you while YOU have an awesome career with someone doing it all at home for you....while you never seemed to have noticed the years go by.

AND she has ALSO given you her entire youth, and now at what is she 40+? SHE has to deal with that tiger - which is a much bigger tiger for a woman with five kids than an DOCTOR who has laid himself a pretty nice groundwork with HER in the background.

Oh, your arrogance just is unbelievable. 

I am NOT for a wife like yours taking her DH to the divorce "cleaners", but with you - I am seriously understanding WHY some women would. 

SHE has given you CHILDREN, man. And has ALLOWED you PERSONAL success in the process. 

AND now you want her to find direction...you are BLAMING her for not having direction....OMG...

Your poor wife.


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## lastinline (Jul 21, 2009)

Well Sandy, if she wanted to spend time with me why didn't she choose a more neutral destination, or for that matter just stay home with me and offer to put together a puzzle, or play Yahtzee? We have always liked board games. Oh, now I remember, she wanted to "get out" because I have her chained to the stove Monday through Friday providing food for all of our brood, while I enjoy the "good life." Gosh, not only am I arrogant, I'm a real bastard as well Sandy. Thanks for pointing that out to me. Now that I realize that my concerns have absolutely no validity because she is 40 and has "had my kids", I will just shut up and eat my gruel. It doesn't matter what my needs or thoughts are because as everyone knows, "birth trumps all." How friggin convenient. I have also "given her children", and allowed her the opportunity to raise them. It is what she said she always "wanted to do." I only get upset, because she friggin complains that it's hard. Well, of course it is. That doesn't mean it's not noble or worthwhile. I have changed the whole course of my life for my wife, and have made just as many sacrifices as she has. I have worked my a$$ off, missed sleep, missed vacations, missed life so I could become someone who was "respectable" in her eyes, but I get b*tched at because I "come home late". Well, of course I do, because my case load is packed. It seems people like arrogant a-holes to provide their medical care, my "extreme busyness" in no way reflects that I actually care about these people, and that I am extraordinarily competent at what I do. I guess though, I deserve to be taken to "the cleaners" because I actually have the audacity to have wants and needs. Everyone else on the planet though is entitled to their needs, unless of course their education exceeds a certain level then they are just a "prick" if they complain. Now that I clearly understand my marching orders Sandy, I will just deposit my check and get in line with the rest of the drones. I think you should examine your own heart Sandy, and you as well recent_cloud. The Dr. is ordering an echocardiogram because he suspects your "hearts are sick". I also suspect anger, dare I say almost hate "oozing" from both your general directions, and sadly neither of you even know me. I have sacrificially loved her the best that I can. I have never cheated, always tried to provide for her and our family, never hit her, avoided habit forming chemicals including OH, and maintained myself very fit and healthy. I have helped out around the house, and the list goes on, but none of that matters. I sense I can't possibly be right in your eyes, because I am a guy. I should be overwhelmed with "joy and gratitude" even though the paradigm of our relationship has completely shifted, and my needs aren't being close to met. Here is a clue for you two, being a good mother is one thing, and it's quite admirable. Being a good wife is another, and it is not only admirable it's essential, because that is the primary role she fulfills in my life. I am not either of your husbands, so please spare me the displaced aggression. You don't know me. I would venture to say you don't even know anyone like me. I reckon that I just may know a few more Drs. that you do Sandy, and I never realized that we only come in 3 or 4 general shapes an sizes. I've seen personality traits based on area of specialization, and I display mine, but aside from that as far as I can tell we're all pretty unique. No, you've only read a few words that I have written, and dammed me based on that, as if you could somehow "psychically" see the true color of my heart. Now that's arrogance.


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## Corpuswife (Apr 24, 2009)

I think that sometimes the message gets garbled. 

It would be nice to come to a place where we focus more on compliments and not complaints. Simple.

It would also be nice to come from a place of gratitude. I've been grateful to have healthy children and the opportunity to be a SAHM. My H supported me when I went back to graduate school. I in turn..ran the household....fully. 

We are now divorcing-sadly. He feels the grass is greener. We don't argue really. We still love each other. He is just no longer "in love." It's been a year of turmoil. I've tried everything to keep our family together-everything. 

Last week, we met to discuss our uncontested divorce after almost 25 years of marriage. I thanked him for giving me the oppotunity to stay home with our kids. He said "I couldn't have built my business without you." We worked our azzes off to build the best business and family. We left ourselves/marriage out of the equation. Big mistake!

You and you wife have a similiar story it seems. There seems to be a big wall between you. I'm not sure if it's the lack of appreciation or what? Who is doing more for whom? 

Rethink what I said about gratefulness. I know it's hard to give when you don't receive. Someone has to be first....


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## 20yrs (Sep 18, 2009)

this is better than watching a soap opera... 

Thanks for sharing that simple story, Corpuswife... I needed to hear that today.:smthumbup:

And I agree with recentcloud. Very well said.

Oh, and why do you have to write your whole story in one paragraph? It is much easier to read if you split it up a little.


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## lastinline (Jul 21, 2009)

Awesome advice 20 yrs. I will use paragraphs. Notice, I even indented for you dear. However, since we are now talking about grammar and not relationships, how about not starting your sentences with a conjunction. It leads your readers to believe your thoughts are not complete. We all hate sentence fragments, right? I'm sure nearly half as much as we hate assertive men. 

I appreciate your advice Corpuswife. I too see the similarities between our respective situations. I will try to "be first". Well, I'm done posting here. Consider this thread dead.


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## angryandfrustrated (Sep 12, 2009)

Once again I am skipping through to posting without reading the entire thread, but I have a quick question. Have you been more affectionate lately? I know that at some point you were going to try. There is so much unspoken anger in your marriage. Someone has to at least pretend to be in love again to get the ball rolling.


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## swedish (Mar 6, 2008)

Sorry you killed the thread. You've shared some hopeful progress recently. Do you think that you harbor resentment for your wife's 'man friend' or whatever he was that might be holding you back?

If so, figuring out how to or if you can get past that may make your decisions going forward a little easier.


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## Sandy55 (Jun 3, 2009)

Lastinline:

Sorry I came across to aggressively. I apologize if it came across that way.

Look. My dh and I have been together more than 28 years now. 

When I read your posts I see so much of him and I in your situation: powerful career spouse and SAHM.

You and your spouse BOTH have energy built into what each of you are doing. Your profession is intense, HER profession is intense. 

You make an assumption SHE can just run off and start a career and "be" someone while she has five kids hanging on the line. I had four and had to dump my career and it was by choice because the kids were more important to me.

I find it very arrogant and insenstive of you - (perhaps is is the OVERWHELMING anger) from your posts - to state things about your wife such as you have. 

I think in order for you to get a grip on your anger and resentment you need to step back and take a break. What concerns me is that if you do that, you may find being a part time Dad and your freedom an easier place to be than sticking out your marriage. Another issue that may pop up is that you find some woman and she latches on to you because of what you are rather than who you are. 

Sometimes it seems like you already have someone in the sidelines waiting, are not telling us, and trying to FIND a reason to dump your marriage. Could that be the case? Do you have your eye on someone else? 

If you do not, please don't be offended that I suggest such, but BTDT, dear. When one is in a tenuous situation in a marriage having someone on the outside adoring you makes it easier to find fault with what you have at home. Don't fall into that quagmire.


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## Sandy55 (Jun 3, 2009)

Also, Last

Being a stay at home mom has a seriously DELAYED reward. Just because you make the money to have her living in a fine home, drive fine cars, take fine vacations, and give her freedom to come and go, well that is not the same feeling of success a you get on a daily or weekly basis.

Sure, your job has its ups and downs, but unlike you, she cannot close the shop door, go home, and be surrounded by her loving family. She lives and breathes those kids and quite frankly, doing that 24/7 is far harder than any career outside of my home.

I'd rather be a military general than take on the responsibility of raising four or five kids again. *At least there is a nice retirement plan at the end of a military career and a nice FAT paycheck.* As a SAHM, she had neither; and on top of that SHE has to look to YOU for her security. If her domestic "job" fails with YOU she has only a retirement and income she will need to fight for...she won't have a twenty year resume of experience where SHE can walk into a job and make money to put food on HER table, dear. And DON'T tell me that if you got divorced you would be "nice" to her or that she would do well...that is a roll of the dice for her and at least you STILL have your money making ability left in tact.

Try living like that, worrying that some other woman will yank your security away...at a whim, or worse, that your DH is gonna see some younger, cuter, funnier, happier professional woman and dump your butt. 

You need to put yourself into your woman's shoes and SEE her world view. You lack empathy. And I don't know how to tell you to find it other than to OPEN your heart and mind. That is what will make you a happy man, happy with your marriage.


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## dobo (Jun 30, 2009)

Sandy got that right.


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## lastinline (Jul 21, 2009)

I have "no one on the side", Sandy. I have never cheated emotionally, or otherwise on my wife. It's not built into my system. When I examine my life, and take inventory on myself, I realize that my greatest assets are also my greatest weaknesses. I will pursue something to the end because, "I never quit." That's what a good fighter does. That's what a good soldier does. They never quit. I am not a Dr., I am a fighter/soldier who has just changed his uniform, or has been temporarily reassigned. I am good at what I do medically, but I would have seen to it that I would have been just as "good" at whatever place life deposited me in. It's just what I am. 

I know it is time to "cut bait". Morally though I can't wrap myself around this revelation, because it represents "quitting" on the grandest scale imaginable. I find the thought of divorce repugnant.
However Sandy, competing equally for my attention is the notion that my wife doesn't love me. This kills me inside, because nothing I can do, or have done changes this. My instincts tell me she is basically waiting for her mom to pass, and then with that sizable estate plus what she'll get from me, she will be set for life.

The fact that I could even write that last passage tells you volumes about where I currently am "with my wife." Sadly though, it's true, and I can see all of the pieces moving neatly into position... checkmate. So, if your position is clearly lost Sandy, is there shame in conceding before the game ends?

In closing my dear Sandy, you need to see the world from a man's point of view. You need to taste from the bitter cup of frustration that men hold, and realize that the contents taste exactly the same as what's in the cup that you poor women hold. 

You decribe a scenario in which my wife was "damaged" even though she did everything right in our relationship, but on a whim I "dumped" her anyway. A very scary story Sandy, and it's not even Halloween yet. Well done. However, your tale is completely fictitious. The actual story reads just the opposite, and it's not scary, it's heartbreaking.


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