# Possible affair with Boss



## unsurefuture (Dec 27, 2012)

My wife and I have been together for 10 years and have 3 children together. We have our ups and downs and in all honesty I have not payed enough attention to her over the years. Blamed her for the kids and haven't been there enough for them. In may of this year we were both out having a good time and we both got pretty drunk. I went to bed and she stayed up. She cheated on me that night with one of my (was) good friends. She admitted it the next day and felt horrible. I handled it like a crying baby and asked for all sorts of reassurances that didn't last very long from her. She seemed remorseful but not as much as I thought she should be. She is very prideful and has a big problem telling the truth, small or big. This occurrence however was a wake up call for me that I needed to spend more time with my family and making sure my wife's needs were met. I think I did a fairly good job at this but she often didn't think so. So 5 months go by and I am looking at cell phone bills considering switching carriers and notice like 600 texts back and forth between a certain number. So I go get her phone and look thru the texts and there are none there. Deleted. Look in the contacts and its her boss. Go back 6 months there maybe 8 a month. Then 2-4 weeks after her cheating on me in may they sky rocket. So I confront her. She says she deleted them so I wouldn't be jealous that she texted her boss so much. Then later she said it was due to patient confidentiality(medical field). I called bs and that if there was nothing to hide it shouldn't be hidden. So I let it lie low and just watch. Now I am thinking, around that time frame is when she started to run, new habit, started caring more about her clothes, sexier underwear, hair, make up, stuff she never paid as much mind to before. She is fairly new to this job and it is a secretarial type so appearance can matter. We go on vacation and get back and I look at her text right before we left. She deleted one from her boss again. Not all but just one. I confront her and she freaks out about me going through her phone, treating her like a child and then tells me she is done. I ask her to keep trying to make it work between us and she agrees. Then her christmas part comes around and she basically tells me she doesn't want me to go because she wont have fun because I won't have fun because the OM will be there. Even though there "isn't" anything going on I think there is. Im pissed but agree to watch the kids. She is late coming home but I don't believe anything happen as the OMW and kids were there as well. So I keep wondering what is really going on. Tearing me apart, Cant eat, cant sleep well, totally unproductive at work, Ruining christmas for me. Well the other day I confessed to my boss what was going on.Told him why I was not doing well. Turns out his wife is best friends with the OMW. Small town, sorta. Anyways she talked to the OMW who confronted the OM ad he claims that they did talk about personal things beyond work but that he will stop that now because he do not want it to be construed to him having and affair. I also found out she has been bad mouthing me for some time at work and that she considered the marriage over. The OM also said that nothing has nor will happen. He is a married doc with 3 kids. What he and his wife don't know is that I have a lot of texts and e-mails between them that are not flat out saying they are having an affair but infer things, and talk about when eachother will be at work (odd hours). And my wife is always SO nice to him in the messages. Its driving me nuts. And to think everyone else is thinking I'm nuts is making it worse. She is planning on moving out in a few weeks and tells me that I am trying to fix our marriage to little to late. And this is besides the possible affair issue. I think. I am so sure that they are having an affair and they both deny deny deny. I don't know what to do. She doesn't know I can see her texts and emails I don't think but there isn't anything solid. They have places at work that this affair could take place. I'm afraid if I confront her with all the evidence I have she will just leave. I have thought about the exposure part but I don't have rock solid evidence. I don't know how to take that to her parents, which is where she will have to be moving as I told her I wouldn't be leaving our house. I don't want to make it easy for her to leave. A huge part of me believe there is something going on but I am not 100%. We have been together our entire adult life. I'm not sure what to do without her. She is a great mother and hard worker. I think she is slipping aways and Im not sure how to stop it. I feel like she gave up on our marriage because of her infatuation for this OM. Like I said earlier we have had issues, usually the same ones, but I believe we can work past them. More so now that I have been trying so much more. Please tell me I'm not crazy and what I should do. Thank You


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## AlphaHalf (Aug 5, 2012)

> I'm afraid if I confront her with all the evidence I have she will just leave.


Not exposing the affair is protecting and enabling there affair. Send the messages to the OMW. Let her decide whats good for her marriage by knowing the truth. If she had the info you would want her to give it to you. Your wife is telling you she will leave anyways regardless about the affair. She has been bad mouthing you behind your back and making you out to be crazy. Expose her for her actions. I'm sure those emails have enough proof that they are more then "friends" without the direct word texted. Explain to everyone that she was also buying new clothes and sexy underwear and it wasn't for you. 600 texts a month is a hell of alot to justify, nobody will believe that "friends" BS.

Your wife didn't want you to go to the party because she was scared about what you might say. You should not have fallen for that Bu!!sh$%t and went anyways. Now you see how manipulative she can be. 
In short: Do nothing and rugsweep, you WILL lose your wife. Expose and confront, you May lose your wife anyways OR You may snap her out of the Fog and reconcile.


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## bigtone128 (May 1, 2012)

You are not crazy - buckle your seatbelt - you are in for a very painful rocky road..you will meet someone new - as affairs change people. Your old relationship is dead. It had been 9 months for me and I am better now (with some rocky points) - but everything I was instructed by members of this came true. She is gaslighting you.....do this ASAP ...get evidence and expose to relatives, friends, coworkers etc.....you will understand why later. Sorry you are here. You will get through this.....but expose expose expose.....


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

What phone does she have ? You can recover the texts..

Also, have direct contact with the OMW and check if she will help you. 

Your wife is lying her way out of the marriage saying you could never do enough..She will never say what you did was enough because she she is doing the carrot and the stick










You will never reach her expectations because she will change them as soon as you reach them. She is the one that cheated and you are the one working to fix the marriage..You are fixing a tire when it is the engine that has a major fault.

How are you keeping tabs on her ?


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## life101 (Nov 18, 2012)

Happiness comes from within, we then project it on our surroundings. If you have to look for happiness outside of what you already have, there must be something wrong inside of you.

Start respecting yourself. If you don't, no one else will. Decide what you can, and can't live with. Let her know. If she loves and respects you enough, she will listen. If not, tough luck. We all get conned. Better luck next time. Whatever you do, don't be a doormat. There are more than 3 billion women on this planet itself. We all deserve better than cheaters and liars.

Other more experienced users will give you valuable instructions. Follow those even if that pains you like never before.

Good luck. This is going to make you a better person.


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## Will_Kane (Feb 26, 2012)

unsurefuture said:


> My wife and I have been *together for 10 years and have 3 children together*. We have our ups and downs and in all honesty I have not payed enough attention to her over the years. Blamed her for the kids and haven't been there enough for them. *In may of this year* we were both out having a good time and we both got pretty drunk. I went to bed and she stayed up. *She cheated on me that night with one of my (was) good friends*. She admitted it the next day and felt horrible. I handled it like a crying baby and asked for all sorts of reassurances that didn't last very long from her. She seemed remorseful but not as much as I thought she should be. She is very prideful and has a big problem telling the truth, small or big. This occurrence however was a wake up call for me that I needed to spend more time with my family and making sure my wife's needs were met. I think I did a fairly good job at this but she often didn't think so. So 5 months go by and I am looking at cell phone bills considering switching carriers and notice like *600 texts back and forth* between a certain number. So I go get her phone and look thru the texts and there are none there. Deleted. Look in the contacts and its her boss. Go back 6 months there maybe 8 a month. Then *2-4 weeks after her cheating on me in may *they sky rocket. So I confront her. She says she deleted them so I wouldn't be jealous that she texted her boss so much. Then later she said it was due to patient confidentiality(medical field). I called bs and that if there was nothing to hide it shouldn't be hidden. So I let it lie low and just watch. Now I am thinking, around that time frame is when she started to run, new habit, started caring more about her clothes, *sexier underwear*, hair, make up, stuff *she never paid as much mind to before*. She is fairly new to this job and it is a secretarial type so appearance can matter. We go on vacation and get back and I look at her text right before we left. She deleted one from her boss again. Not all but just one. I confront her and she freaks out about me going through her phone, treating her like a child and then tells me she is done. I ask her to keep trying to make it work between us and she agrees. Then her christmas part comes around and she basically tells me she doesn't want me to go because she wont have fun because I won't have fun because the OM will be there. Even though there "isn't" anything going on I think there is. Im pissed but agree to watch the kids. She is late coming home but I don't believe anything happen as the OMW and kids were there as well. So I keep wondering what is really going on. Tearing me apart, Cant eat, cant sleep well, totally unproductive at work, Ruining christmas for me. Well the other day I confessed to my boss what was going on.Told him why I was not doing well. Turns out his wife is best friends with the OMW. Small town, sorta. Anyways she talked to the OMW who confronted the OM ad he claims that they did talk about personal things beyond work but that he will stop that now because he do not want it to be construed to him having and affair. I also found out *she has been bad mouthing me for some time at work and that she considered the marriage over*. The OM also said that nothing has nor will happen. He is a married doc with 3 kids. What he and his wife don't know is that I have a lot of texts and e-mails between them that are not flat out saying they are having an affair but infer things, and *talk about when eachother will be at work (odd hours). *And my wife is always SO nice to him in the messages. Its driving me nuts. And to think everyone else is thinking I'm nuts is making it worse. She is planning on moving out in a few weeks and tells me that I am trying to fix our marriage to little to late. And this is besides the possible affair issue. I think. I am so sure that they are having an affair and they both deny deny deny. I don't know what to do. She doesn't know I can see her texts and emails I don't think but there isn't anything solid. They have places at work that this affair could take place. *I'm afraid *if I confront her with all the evidence I have she will just leave. I have thought about the exposure part but I don't have rock solid evidence. I don't know how to take that to her parents, which is where she will have to be moving as I told her I wouldn't be leaving our house. I don't want to make it easy for her to leave. A huge part of me believe there is something going on but I am not 100%. We have been together our entire adult life. I'm not sure what to do without her. She is a great mother and hard worker. I think she is slipping aways and Im not sure how to stop it. I feel like she gave up on our marriage because of her *infatuation for this OM*. Like I said earlier we have had issues, usually the same ones, but I believe we can work past them. More so now that I have been trying so much more. Please tell me I'm not crazy and what I should do. Thank You


You are not crazy. Of course she has been having an affair with him. She has been having sex with him. It has been going on a while now.

Stop being afraid. Speak your mind and do not be afraid of losing her. She probably is wondering what is wrong with you and thinks you are pathetic for putting up with her antics. And she is leaving you anyway.

Don't tell her any of your sources of information. Also, buy a voice-activated recorder and some heavy-duty velcro and put it under the seat of her car. My guess is that you will have hard evidence of her affair within a week. If you come up with hard evidence, you should expose the affair far and wide. Tell all of your family and friends and all of her family and friends and of course all of her coworkers and the doctor's wife.

There's a good chance your marriage may be over no matter what you do. If so, you might as well conduct yourself with a little pride and self-respect and end it with your dignity intact.

She cheated on you in your own home with your best friend in May. When she started wearing sexier underwear is when she started having sex with the doctor. Your unintended exposure to the doctor's wife through your boss's wife only made your wife and the doctor more cafeful.

A member named carmen ohio posted this in another thread. This situation applies to you, too. 

_While I greatly respect the other posters on this thread, I believe many of them, like you, are missing the big picture here -- namely, what should you do to regain your happiness.

From reading your notes, it is clear that you were absent from class the day they handed out the "how to be happy" instructions. So let me fill you in on The 10 Rules for Happiness:

Rule No. 1: You only get one life; never forget that. Corollary: You don't know how long you will live, you could live another 50 years or you might die tomorrow; never forget that either.

Rule No. 2: Deal with things as they really are, not as you would like them to be. Face up to your problems rather than pretending they don't exist or hoping they will simply go away.

Rule No. 3: You are solely responsible for your own happiness: don't expect or look to others to make you happy.

Rule No. 4: Your decisions and actions will have the greatest impact on your happiness. If you do the right things, your life will be better and vice versa. Corollary: Be honest with yourself about your failings and genuinely seek to improve yourself.

Rule No. 5: There is no guarantee that you will always be happy: some people win life's lottery, most don't and some people get the shaft. Corollary 1: Don't complain about the cards you are dealt or wallow in self-pity. Instead, *focus on what you can control and learn not to worry about the rest*. Corollary 2: Understand that it sometimes takes time and effort to regain your happiness.

Rule No. 6: Understand what makes you happy and what doesn't. Corollary 1: Since you will change over time, reconsider from time to time what will make you happy now and adjust your decisions and actions accordingly. Corollary 2: When something happens that makes you very unhappy, consider the totality of the situation: sometimes cutting down a few trees is the answer, other times you need to look for a new forest in which to live.

Rule No. 7: Do what makes you happy. Don't do what others (parents, friends, bosses, spouses, even children) want you to do unless it is what makes you happy. This might sound selfish but it's not. Some people are happiest when they are serving others (e.g., firemen, Mother Teresa). 

Rule No. 8: *If you are unhappy about something, eliminate it from your life or, if that is not possible, minimize the degree of unhappiness it can cause you*. If it's a situation (like a bad job), change it. If it's a thing (like a poorly operating car), get rid of it. *If it's a person (like a wayward spouse), stop interacting or least minimize contact with the person.* Corollary: *When something or someone starts to cause you unhappiness, take action immediately; don't wait around hoping things will get better*.

Rule No. 9: You don't apologize to anyone for doing what makes you happy. Corollary: You have no obligation to explain yourself or justify your decisions or actions. If you choose to do so, it should only be because it is to your advantage to do so.

Rule No. 10: Be the best person you can be, as you measure things. For most men, this means being fit and attractive to members of the opposite sex, being financially successfully and *being emotionally strong and independent*. But if you measure life success differently (e.g., displaying Christian virtues, gaining notoriety, acquiring power), then make these the main focus of you efforts.

If we apply these rules to your situation, it become readily apparent that you are breaking all the rules. For example:

☻ You are focused in the moment rather than thinking about how you want to live the rest of your life (violation of Rule No. 1). 

☻ You are more concerned about what your W may or may not have done rather than dealing with what you know she has done (violation of Rule No. 2).

☻ You seek affirmation from your W of your self-worth and the guidance of strangers as to what you should do, rather than taking responsibility for yourself (violation of Rule Nos. 3, 4 and 9).

☻ You are reluctant to take steps to improve your situation and instead are wallowing in self-pity and shame (violation of Rule Nos. 5, 7, 8 and 10).

☻ You seem not to have thought deeply about what you really want out of life (violation of Rule No. 6). 

☻ You reject the notion that your life may have to radically change in order for you to (eventually) be happy (another violation of Rule No. 6).

Based on the facts as you have recited them, I believe you have ample reason to be unhappy in your current circumstances and sufficient justification for taking action. So let me offer you an alternative approach to your problem that is consistent with the Rules of Happiness:

1. *Sit your W down and tell her that you are so unhappy with your marriage that you are prepared to end it. Explain that, given what you know (OM's note, her hiding her phone messages, etc.), you can only conclude that either she is having an affair or that she doesn't care about you (as these are the only two reasons why she would not have taken steps to address your concerns when you first raised them). Say that, in either case, you would rather end your marriage than continue it since you deserve and are confident that you can have better than what you have right now*.

2. *Tell her that, out of love for her and your children, you are willing to give her one last chance to save her marriage and prove to you that she is a worthy wife. This requires her telling you everything that has happened between her and her boss, showing you all of her e-mails and text messages, giving you access to all of her communications in the future, immediately terminating all contact with her boss, demonstrating by word and deed on a daily basis that she loves and respects you and doing whatever else you require for her to prove her worth.*

3. *Tell her that it is her choice whether to do these things or not but, if she chooses not to, you plan to hire an attorney and file for divorce.*

4. *Stay calm and collected and don't argue with her. If she questions or challenges anything you say, calmly reply that she now knows what you expect of her and it is up to her to decide what she wants to do. Repeat your message as many times as necessary until she realizes that you mean what you say*.

5. *Give her a very short period of time to consider this. For example, tell her that you plan to speak to an attorney the next day so, if she wants to save her marriage, she has but a few hours to accept your offer*.

6. *If she refuses, immediately speak to an attorney and commence divorce proceedings*.

7. *If she agrees, continue to monitor her closely to make sure she does not go underground. Don't tolerate her complaining or pouting for more than a couple of days. If you get any indication that she is not serious about following through with her promise, start divorce proceedings*.

8. *For the foreseeable future, be cordial toward your W but nothing more. Don't initiate conversations, compliment her, argue with her or do anything else that would lead her to believe that she is anything special to you. Act at all times like a man who knows what he wants and knows that he can get what he wants, if not from her, then somewhere else*.

9. *Begin to take steps to improve yourself (exercise, work, activities). Make this -- along with your kids -- the focus of your life for now*.

10. *Start to educate yourself on what it takes to be a man in the 21st century. A good place to start is to read "The Married Man Sex Life Primer" by Athol Kay*.

If you take these steps, I can't guarantee that you will end up in a happy marriage with your current W but I can promise that, eventually, you will give yourself the greatest chance of finding true happiness. The key point is that *you can't control your W but you can control you. Hence, you should be doing the things that will eventually make you happy, whether your W wants to be with you or not.*

I'm not saying any of this will be easy; it may be the hardest thing you will ever have to do. But unless you do it, your life will likely only get worse.

Wishing the best for you._​


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

If your wife is going to end the marriage then avoiding the issue won't stop her.

Confront her, do not stand for any of this nonsense. If you want to stay married, star demanding she honour her vows.

What is happening to you is normal. Some marriages recover from it, but sadly some don't. I don't know how to guess which way it will go for you.

It sucks. Hang in there and be strong.


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## ThreeStrikes (Aug 11, 2012)

Most of us who have been in your shoes can instantly spot a cheater, because they follow a script.

Your wife follows the cheater's script to a tee.

You are in the denial fog right now, so it would be helpful if you get more evidence. VAR in the CAR. Today.

You already caught her cheating once. You know she is capable of it. Also, realize that cheaters are exceptional liars and she will never admit to it if you don't have proof.

Get the hard evidence you need, then expose it to everyone. Most likely,that will end the affair. After that, you can either divorce or reconcile. Your choice. You have to decide what you want to live with.

There are tons of posts here similar to yours. Read them to see how you should act, what you can expect, etc.

Sorry you are here.


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## unsurefuture (Dec 27, 2012)

I don't feel like I can expose to the degree that this will need exposing with out at least one piece of concrete evidence. I thi k that they will just explain it always. I think the the OMW will minimize it other wards. She is a doc as well at a different location. But I know they pull big numbers between them and I doubt she is willing to risk that for circumstantial evidence. And I know I am being weak by not wanting to loose her here. We have been together 10 years and we are 25. So all of our adult life was formed together. I understand that codependency is playing a factor here. I'm not sure what to tell her parents if I don't have anything concrete. I already talked to her dad and too him we are having problems and that I suspected an affair but not the details. I love my wife very much. Probably to much. I also love my kids and think that us staying together is the best thing for them. Butmy wife doesn't seem to be snapping out of it. In not sure how to get mor evidence. There is a logger on both the cell and laptop however she can alway use a work phone or have another acct. although I don't think so. I discovered the other day that she started using iMessage on her ipad which would be a first for her as she never did this before. I am guessing because she suspects her phone and everything else is being watched. I didn't even think to check the ipad. Happened to look and there was a message on there from the OM. Nothing bad I think just work stuff. I am wondering if she is tryi g to make me look crazy with this twisted little game so that she doesn't look so bad when she leaves. I'm lost. Thank you everyone.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## mahike (Aug 16, 2011)

She is still in the fog. She knows you love her and at some level she is controling you. Her A has not been exposed to the daylight so it is still fun and exciting.

If she thought she could lose you and if she had to deal with pain from exposure she would stop. 

But none of those things are happening. She needs to know that you and the kids are on the line. You cannot just say it you have to live it.


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## wiigirl (Jun 14, 2012)

Wazza said:


> If your wife is going to end the marriage then avoiding the issue won't stop her.
> 
> Confront her, do not stand for any of this nonsense. If you want to stay married, star demanding she honour her vows.
> 
> ...


:iagree:








_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## CleanJerkSnatch (Jul 18, 2012)

Expose this to the dr.'s wife. Show her all the evidence you have and tell her you have even have MORE but thats all you will show her, so that she wont tell her hubby "this is all he has" etc That is a good way to put additional pressure on BOTH sides.

She will get mad, who cares, she finds it innocent but she does not know what she is doing. She will not know until she feels it for herself because she is too selfish to understand your feelings.


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## ArmyofJuan (Dec 29, 2010)

The first time you caught her cheating you rewarded her by being a better husband (or so you thought). She had no real incentive not to cheat again. She lost respect for you because you basically allowed her to get away with it.

The WORSE thing you can do now is try to save the M. She will see it as you being weak and besides, she doesn’t want to R anyway. Give them what they want and 9 times out of 10 they'll stop wanting it.

You’ve been too nice all this time, you have to go scorched earth now. Turn the tables of her and file. She can only walk all over you if you let her.


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

CleanJerkSnatch said:


> Expose this to the dr.'s wife. Show her all the evidence you have and tell her you have even have MORE but thats all you will show her, so that she wont tell her hubby "this is all he has" etc That is a good way to put additional pressure on BOTH sides.
> 
> She will get mad, who cares, she finds it innocent but she does not know what she is doing. She will not know until she feels it for herself because she is too selfish to understand your feelings.


Way too many texts you should show omw now.


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## badbane (Jun 9, 2012)

Show the OMW what you have. But you have to stop the crying and begging. Right now your wife is basically keeping you around as a meal ticket. You are more like her roomate than her husband. You know what is going on and that is enough. The reason we encourage waiting for the smoking gun is because a lot of BS tend to stay in denial. If you are willing to accept what is going on and not be swayed, strung along, and you realize you can no longer trust your wife's word, then confront. If this were me I'd have told her to leave and served her with papers. You need to stop begging her to come back. You need to yank the rug out from under her feet. 

"I know that you are your boss are having an inappropriate relationship. Regardless of whether or not you have had sex I know that you could care less about me. I have heard you consider our marriage over. I don't care to hear excuses or to just trust you since you have made a career of lying to me. You have two options quit your job and commit to our marriage or sign these.(have divorce papers in hand.) A divorce can always be stopped and the hardest part is getting started. So start the process and make sure that your response to everything she says is you're lying. 
If she says " my husband is supposed to trust me."
respond with " I don't have a wife right now, she's gone and you've stepped in and I don't want you in my life anymore. "
If she says she wants to work on the marriage you tell her nothing in happening until she leaves her job. A marriage is worth more than a paycheck.

If she signs the papers then you know she was just using you and you deserve better. You need to understand once in the fog of an affair your partner will be living a double-triple life. She will rewrite history to make it seem like she is the bad guy not you. Instead of man my BS was home twice a week doing the best he can. IT's My Bs was never home and my needs weren't met. 

Your Original Post follows the self blaming BS script. You need to determine when the affair started. That will probably tell you alot. I mean every marriage has problems. As soon as your wife started going outside of your marriage it became compromised. Therefore the problems in the marriage become excuses for the affair, and not the actual problem.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Do you recognise your situation in this?

Infidelity, Cheating Wives - Women's Infidelity


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## TRy (Sep 14, 2011)

unsurefuture said:


> I don't feel like I can expose to the degree that this will need exposing with out at least one piece of concrete evidence. I thi k that they will just explain it always. I think the the OMW will minimize it other wards.


 What you just said here is that what other people think is all that matters, and that what you think is not important enough on its own for you to take action. Read Will_Kane's post above and follow it to a T. While you should still gather more evidence if you can, more evidence is not needed for you to act. Act now without delay. Stop faking that you need more evidence in order to act. Doing nothing and being weak is why you are here. 

Your wife is already doing this by the way. She is taking actions based on her happiness. She does not care what you think. Not having you come to the company party, when everyone else including the other man brought their spouses, speaks volumes about how little she cares about what you think. She is publicly disrespecting you at work and did not want you there because of it. 

Your marraige may be too far gone to save, but what little chance that you have to save it requires that you stop being a sucker and act. Time is not on your side. What you are doing (or not doing) is not working. *"Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results" - Albert Einstein. *


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## Rookie4 (Nov 26, 2012)

OP, what do you think will happen, if you don't expose? Your wife has already told you she wants out of the marriage and that nothing you can do will make it any better. So why be so submissive? What does it gain you? If you don't get tough on your wife, you will lose your marriage. If you DO get tough, you MIGHT save it or at least your self-respect. Do you want your kids to think you are weak?


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

Rookie4 said:


> OP, what do you think will happen, if you don't expose? Your wife has already told you she wants out of the marriage and that nothing you can do will make it any better. So why be so submissive? What does it gain you? If you don't get tough on your wife, you will lose your marriage. If you DO get tough, you MIGHT save it or at least your self-respect. Do you want your kids to think you are weak?


Yep time to go scorched earth on this one you can't nice her out of this.


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## KanDo (Jun 15, 2011)

My dear fellow. If I understand your previous post, you are 25. Yet you are acting like a scared little boy. You have trained your wife how to treat you by requiring no consequences from her first betrayal and by being spineless in the face of an avalanche of information telling you she is having an affair. You say you love this woman and want to work on the marriage. Why you would want that is beyond me. However, if you do the only path that leads to recovery is to find your balls and demand an end to this affair. You have already been told what to do, but I will reiterate for effect.

1) Send the emails/texts you have to the OMW NOW. Let her make up her own mind what they mean. If she choses to ignore it, your conscios is clear.

2) Confront your wife with an ultimatum. You or the OM. It is as simple as that.

3) I personally would expose to her family if you think they would be allies in anyway.

The most difficult part here is standing up for yourself. Your wife sees you as weak because you are. Why should she want you? You have devalued yourself by being willing to accept this crap. No matter what happens you will be better off than living in this limbo.
Good luck


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

If you show her you are a man you might just save this. The question is why would you want to since she has already been with another man?


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

All these ultimatums are very nice but wife has already stated her intention to move out. 

Maybe say to her " it isn't what I want but you have made your decision". Maybe start divorce proceedings. Maybe demand that she do her fair share of child minding so you cn have a social life. Certainly do not seek to prop her up in any way.

IE, give her a taste of what she is gunning for. Nothing to lose if she has already made the decision, and a lot to gain if it makes her think.


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## theroad (Feb 20, 2012)

You want to divorce call a lawyer today instruct him to file ASAP.

You want to say your marriage then expose, get the book Surviving An Affair by Dr Harley.

Posting here for you is not getting anything done.


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## Acabado (May 13, 2012)

Talk to a lawyer. Yesterday. Don't ask her back again.
She's gone, she's having an affair ongoing full blown affair with the married boss for a while. Besides him likely your friend is not the only one she's been banging.
The Healing Heart: The 180
Just Let Them Go
If you want to have a npother chance the only why is to kill the affair first. So snoop better (VAR in the car). Get solid evidence and then expose her and serve her the papers at a time.

Sorry man.


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## weightlifter (Dec 14, 2012)

VAR her car. this one you can do from walmart. keylog her comp etcetc. see the evidence gathering thread. do not reveal your evidence or sources until you have you proof of the affair.
dude you are 25. that is way too effing young to be miserable for another 60 years. go find a loyal woman.


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## committedwife (Dec 12, 2011)

life101 said:


> Happiness comes from within, we then project it on our surroundings. If you have to look for happiness outside of what you already have, there must be something wrong inside of you.
> 
> Start respecting yourself. If you don't, no one else will. Decide what you can, and can't live with. Let her know. If she loves and respects you enough, she will listen. If not, tough luck. We all get conned. Better luck next time. Whatever you do, don't be a doormat. There are more than 3 billion women on this planet itself. We all deserve better than cheaters and liars.
> 
> ...


Are you kidding me?? What kind of crap is this post?? Do you really think you're helping this poster recover his marriage?? 

What, do you want to sing Kumbaya, now?? "Start respecting yourself" my arse. His wife is screwing around on him, and you want him to 'start respecting himself'??? How about she needs to start respecting her marriage vows????

OMG. This kind of post just annoys the hell out of me. Sorry, everyone.


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## Will_Kane (Feb 26, 2012)

weightlifter said:


> VAR her car. this one you can do from walmart. keylog her comp etcetc. see the evidence gathering thread. do not reveal your evidence or sources until you have you proof of the affair.
> dude you are 25. that is way too effing young to be miserable for another 60 years. go find a loyal woman.


The voice-activated recorder secured under the front seat of her car with heavy-duty velcro is the best tool at catching cheaters that I see on this forum. The cheaters are looking for higher-tech stuff like keyloggers and they are guarding their phones and changing their passwords. They never suspect the VAR. Use it.


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## jim123 (Sep 29, 2012)

Just file and be done. Do not waste time with anything else. You need to get control. You made a mistake by forgiving and she now thinks it is ok and you will forgive again. Stop the madness.


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

Going back to the way you handled it when she cheated. You didn't give her consequences, you didn't require transparency.

in fact you did everything you could to show her it was all your fault that she cheated on you. (which it wasn't btw. It was her choice to cheat).

Instead of having her earn a second chance to be with you. You became super nice and attentive and basically rewarded her for cheating, and taught her she could cheat and get away with it.

The boss might have picked up on her and began "talking" with her about the affair - what he likely fed her was a bunch of attention, and a bunch of marriage advice which ALWAYS ended with her being right and you being a clueless idiot. Then he moved in for the kill - he and she started their own affair.

Basically he told her what she wanted to hear. He also told her that there must be something wrong in the marriage that made her cheat - and it was you. Meanwhile you're basically being mr. nice guy as you know, basically confirming this.

You want proof - check out her panties when she comes home, especially when she's working weird hours. Get them tested for semen - you can send them to a lab, you can also get a home test kit.

You should talk to a lawyer ASAP about what your options maybe for suing the Doc. He is you wife's boss and you may have some ways of going after him legally for messing with his employee.


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## unsurefuture (Dec 27, 2012)

She told me today that she is moving out and taking the kids. I said I don't want to move the kids and that we should take turns staying at the house with them for a while and try and establish a plan. She seems against this. I also demanded 50/50 custody and she she is saying not a chance. She said that is something I have to earn and deserve. I haven't been there for them in the past why should I get them now. I was always to busy working or trying to make things better for the family. I am guilty of not spending enough time with them though. I still want this to work. I am lost and don't know how to gather the strength to let her go. I am hoping she will come back around in the next year but I honestly don't know how to manage waiting that long. Yet I don't want to move on. Don't know how. Can't stand the idea of her finding another man. I don't want another man raising my children. We were suppose to live out or lives together, fulfill our dreams and raise our children together.


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

Using kids to manipulate you..


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

Lawyer up asap and tell the omw already expose to family and friends now!


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## bigtone128 (May 1, 2012)

I understand where you ae coming from - but once you see ho she betrayed you - you will move from this position vary rapidly...she threw the family under the bus - which BTW why does she get ot make the choices about the children? She cheated - she's out with no kids...sorry fo her.


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## unsurefuture (Dec 27, 2012)

I have tried exposing it. There are only a few people that believe me. I do not have rock solid evidince and I am sure that if it is continuing it has or will go underground. She is making me out ot be the bad guys and only my friends and family know that I am not. She lies to her friends about who I am and thing I have said. She is twsting and manipulating words and her friends to serve what she believes is best. I know all the stuff she has done and said yet I still want to reconcile. I know I shouldn't but this is the women I pledge my life to and created life with. I feel like I don't know her right now. I have already seen a lawyer and she is going to see one today. I am hoping that her lawyer will explain that if this goes to court it will not be up to us anymore, but the court. I don't know what to do. I'm lost and feel like an idiot for allowing this to happen. And for trusting her so much. I also feel weak for not being able to just walk away. But my kids are to important. I have to stay and fight for them.


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## walkonmars (Aug 21, 2012)

Ask your lawyer to see if there's a way to prevent the kids from leaving their childhood home. You can also contact the OMW and tell her the number of texts and emails between her H and your wife. 

Tell her like you told us. That there were very few in the beginning, but once she started getting sexy underwear and working late, the texts shot up to the hundreds. They occur at all times of night. That there are signs of affection and not work related. That she deletes the texts. 

Ask her if at the christmas party her husband disappeared or stayed late - because your wife talked you out of going and she came back very late. You need to see if she can get your wife fired by putting a fire under his asss.


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## unsurefuture (Dec 27, 2012)

I texted the OM and told him we needed to go havce a chat in a public place. Im not entirely sure of what I'm going to say yet. But I do want him to know that I love my wife and have been trying for quite some time to fix our marriage, maybe incorrectly but trying.


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

Talk to his wife not him.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## walkonmars (Aug 21, 2012)

unsurefuture said:


> I texted the OM and told him we needed to go havce a chat in a public place. Im not entirely sure of what I'm going to say yet. But I do want him to know that I love my wife and have been trying for quite some time to fix our marriage, maybe incorrectly but trying.


oh Jeeezzzzusss NO!
What do you expect him to say: "Yes I'll stop banging your wife, so sorry - my bad" 

NO he's going to say: "You're crazy!, we're just friends! She's a great worker!"

*You need to talk to his wife. 
*


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## bigtone128 (May 1, 2012)

unsurefuture said:


> I texted the OM and told him we needed to go havce a chat in a public place. Im not entirely sure of what I'm going to say yet. But I do want him to know that I love my wife and have been trying for quite some time to fix our marriage, maybe incorrectly but trying.


The only conversation you should have with him is.....itroduce your mr. fist to his face...numerous times...he is a POS dont waste your time...


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## Thoreau (Nov 12, 2012)

Why do these threads always start with......"its mostly my fault I have not been a good husband blahblahblah....."

Go live deliberately for awhile.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## walkonmars (Aug 21, 2012)

Your future is not "unsure" it's "very sure" with the actions you've taken. I know it sounds harsh but gaaddammit! You need to be harsh. 

As long as you insist on talking to him see if this will work: 
Tell him you have all the texts and you are going to talk to his wife and discuss them all. (DO NOT tell him what's in the texts!)

Tell him that if your wife is still working for him next week you are going to see a lawyer to see if you can bring a civil suit against him for damaging your family. You're going to show the lawyer the texts and will press as hard as you can for a large settlement for the financial and emotional damages his actions have caused. 

*Discuss nothing else! *Not one more word that what is above. 

If you can postpone this meeting you should. Go to the wife first. If that doesn't work then try the above. But your best chance is with the OMW. Be Smart!


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## bigtone128 (May 1, 2012)

walkonmars said:


> oh Jeeezzzzusss NO!
> What do you expect him to say: "Yes I'll stop banging your wife, so sorry - my bad"
> 
> NO he's going to say: "You're crazy!, we're just friends! She's a great worker!"


or worse yet say - I did not do a thing - she told me she was single or separated and came on to me....then what are you going to do....trust me, your wife was looking, she not some innocent bystander...an active participant.

I know it hurts you to hear that but this crap does not happen to women not looking for it.


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

walkonmars said:


> oh Jeeezzzzusss NO!
> What do you expect him to say: "Yes I'll stop banging your wife, so sorry - my bad"
> 
> NO he's going to say: "You're crazy!, we're just friends! She's a great worker!"
> ...


:iagree::banghead:


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## 3putt (Dec 3, 2012)

walkonmars said:


> *You need to talk to his wife.
> *


You can also give his BW your WW's phone number and encourage her to call your wife.


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## 3putt (Dec 3, 2012)

You can go after POSOM after you do what you've been instructed if you are so inclined. Dr. Harley actually recommends this, and I like confronting because OMs are notoriously wimpy and only after one thing, and trouble ain't it. But you need to do things in their proper order.

In fact, don't do a damned thing until you've run it by the board. You seem to have made enough mistakes already. Let's not complicate an uncomplicated process any further. Not being mean, just real.


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## TDSC60 (Dec 8, 2011)

Talking to OM is such a total waste of time.

So you "want him to know that you love your wife"? What makes you think he gives two hoots in hell as to what you want or what you say?

He is a married man cheating with a married woman. He is a POS. Don't waste your time.

Stop wishing, hoping, wanting this and that. Stop being a doormat and letting a cheating spouse and another man control you.

Man up. DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT.

Get a couple of VARs. One for her car and one to keep on you anytime you are around her. She seems to be setting you up.


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## unsurefuture (Dec 27, 2012)

I am worried about the legality of the texts messages I have gotten through spyware. And the keylogger. I pay the cell phone bill but both of our names are on the acct. She was the one that originally opened the acct tho.


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

Give the omw your wife's cell# and have her check her phone records then. See fixed it for you now go tell her!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

BHs are always afraid if they step up, man up, their wife will leave them. Oh no! Not that! You'll DIE without her!

Truth is, you never controlled whether she chose you or not. Accept that, and then lay out under what circumstances you would ALLOW her to stay married to you. You'll see a change.


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## 3putt (Dec 3, 2012)

unsurefuture said:


> I am worried about the legality of the texts messages I have gotten through spyware. And the keylogger. I pay the cell phone bill but both of our names are on the acct. She was the one that originally opened the acct tho.


You're MARRIED! You have done nothing wrong. Your name is on the acct, you pay the bill, what's the hang up? Every minute you waste making excuses for not doing something instead of doing something is another minute of entrenchment of the affair. You are doing nothing but stalling and wasting valuable time. Why?

CALL HIS WIFE!!


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## unsurefuture (Dec 27, 2012)

What about the legality of how I obtained the messages?


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## 3putt (Dec 3, 2012)

unsurefuture said:


> What about the legality of how I obtained the messages?


Do you actually read anything that is posted to you?


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## TDSC60 (Dec 8, 2011)

unsurefuture said:


> What about the legality of how I obtained the messages?


If you are worried then talk to a lawyer about it. You should be talking to one anyway since she has made custody of the children an issue.


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## unsurefuture (Dec 27, 2012)

I read everything that is written and deeply appriciate that there are people willing to help me through this. I just don't want to do something she can use against me regarding the kids.


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## alte Dame (Aug 7, 2012)

You are my son's age, so I will talk to you the way I would talk to my grown son:

- Sit down and try to clear your head.

- Acknowledge that you love your wife and children, but you have reached a critical point with your wife.

- You have come to this site for help. The people on your thread have a lot of experience with your type of situation.

--- Take a leap of faith & put yourself in the hands of the people here for your next steps.

Everybody is telling you to 1) tell the OMW in no uncertain terms that your W is having an affair with her H. 2) talk to a lawyer ASAP about esp. custody of your children.

Do these things. Then come back and report. People will advise on your next steps.

Please listen.


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## weightlifter (Dec 14, 2012)

Introducing his face to your fist is a felony in many states. Not recommended. Violence gives her the upper hand.


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## kenmoore14217 (Apr 8, 2010)

What if he shows up with his friends???? Make sure you don't go alone!


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

If you do meet OM record the conversation with a var in your pocket. He will lie. Waywards always do!

Take Alte Dame's advice.

Decide what you want.Go see an attorney for advice.

Then come back here.


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## walkonmars (Aug 21, 2012)

CALL HIS W I F E

CALL HIS WIFE NOW

stiffen your spine! 

You don't HAVE to show the texts or email. Just have a CALM conversation with her. 

Call her.


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## sharkeey (Apr 27, 2012)

unsurefuture said:


> She told me today that she is moving out and taking the kids. I said I don't want to move the kids and that we should take turns staying at the house with them for a while and try and establish a plan. She seems against this. I also demanded 50/50 custody and she she is saying not a chance. She said that is something I have to earn and deserve.


Wow it's a good thing she didn't tell you to move out you'd already be gone and probably living out of a suitcase in a cheap motel begging her to let you come home again.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Call his wife.

Your wife can't take your kids from you unless she makes a claim that you are abusive. As long as you record EVERY SINGLE CONVERSATION, she has no way to prove you are abusive.


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## walkonmars (Aug 21, 2012)

Keep saying in your mind: "I'm very scared, but I WILL do this for my kids, they're depending on me." 

Say it over and over in your head. Act as if you have courage. Courage will come.


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## DailyGrind (Jun 27, 2010)

unsurefuture said:


> What about the legality of how I obtained the messages?


You don't have to tell anyone HOW you got the texts.


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## 3putt (Dec 3, 2012)

walkonmars said:


> Keep saying in your mind: "I'm very scared, but I WILL do this for my kids, they're depending on me."
> 
> Say it over and over in your head. Act as if you have courage. Courage will come.


To add to this, expect fury and rage when you do launch this. It will happen. But listen to this and listen good: _Do not apologize for what you are doing._ When she starts her raving lunetic rage, tell her you are doing everything you can to protect your marriage and your family. Never apologize. When you make the calls you will be positioning yourself to be in control of the situation. Apologizing just hands that control back over to her. We don't want this.

Oh, BTW, this is the one time in your life you _want_ her raging as much as she can possibly can. The madder she is, the more damage you have done to the affair. Think about that while her head is spinning 360 degrees and she's spewing verbal vomit (think Exorcist). 

You _want_ rage from her, as it means you've hit the mark. The madder, the better. That's your gauge for success.


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## sharkeey (Apr 27, 2012)

You don't have to prove anything to anyone, you already know the truth and that's what matters. unless you're going to try to save your marriage by "breaking her out of the affair fog" by exposing the affair, in which case you need to immediately implement fact finding measures including everything from VARs to PIs and then use the evidence you find to blow the whole thing wide open and hope she'll suddenly come to her sense and come running back into your arms and you'll live happily ever after. 

But that's not very likely and you need to face that. Even in best case scenarios, the reconciliation rate following infidelity is something like 3 in 100 and your scenario is rather dire. She's moving out and divorce appears imminent. 

You've been so weak in all of this that you've given her no real reason to return, if anything you've pushed her even further away by being so pathetic and putting up with all her BS.

Start by getting tough. Stop listening to her and allowing her to dictate your actions going forward. Just because she says something is going to be a certain way does not make it so.

If nothing else you'll be better prepared for whatever the future may bring.


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## frozen (Mar 5, 2012)

sharkeey said:


> Even in best case scenarios, the reconciliation rate following infidelity is something like 3 in 100


Can you cite a source for this statistic? I know many throw in the towel and move on but 97% That number seems absurd to me.


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## 3putt (Dec 3, 2012)

frozen said:


> Can you cite a source for this statistic? I know many throw in the towel and move on but 97% That number seems absurd to me.


Yeah, that's the rate of success for an affair lasting, not a marriage suffering from an affair. The recovery percentage rate is pretty high when both parties are fully on board.


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## committedwife (Dec 12, 2011)

unsurefuture said:


> Please tell me I'm not crazy and what I should do. Thank You


She's screwing around with her boss? I would suggest that you immediately find out his wife's contact info and let her know what your wife and her husband are doing. I would also direct you to contact their employer to let them know what is going one. Next, contact their Facebook friends - let them know that your WW and OM are indulging in a physical relationship. Ask them for their help in encouraging the infidels to leave their adulterous relationship and return to their marriages. 

Your WW will blow her top after this exposure, because the affair requires secrecy to keep it alive. Stand your ground. Let her know that you will do whatever it takes to save your marriage - exposure of the affair is your first strike.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

frozen said:


> Can you cite a source for this statistic? I know many throw in the towel and move on but 97% That number seems absurd to me.


The reconciliation rate for the US is around 35 percent. 50 percent for England

3 out of a hundred is the chances two cheaters can have long term relationship.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

Oddly, to me anyway, 80% percent of couples that divorce over infidelity wish they had reconciled and worked it out.

As women get older their chances to remarry drop like a rock, add in infidelity and it must be much worse.


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## committedwife (Dec 12, 2011)

unsurefuture said:


> I'm afraid if I confront her with all the evidence I have she will just leave..


 Where do you think she's going to go? To her married lover's house? I'm thinking his wife might have a little problem with that.

BUST HER ASS. Expose her completely- at her job, to her friends on Facebook, and to her family. You will be yanking her into reality. 

She'll be totally pissed that you exposed her. That's normal. Let her know that you will do whatever it takes to save your marriage. Also let her know that you intend to file for divorce and go for complete custody of your kids unless she is willing to dump OM and return to your marriage. 

And you're not done there. Get Surviving an Affair by Dr. Willard Harley. It helped my H and me recover our marriage. Get it. Follow what it says. Don't waste your money on a MC.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

From you posts, it's hard to believe you treated her badly.. please explain. You''re sounding more like someone who let his wife walk on him.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

unsurefuture said:


> I texted the OM and told him we needed to go havce a chat in a public place. Im not entirely sure of what I'm going to say yet. But I do want him to know that I love my wife and have been trying for quite some time to fix our marriage, maybe incorrectly but trying.


Don't. If he is a predator it will only spur him on.

Plus how will you feel knowing they discussed it? Cos I made the same mistake and it hurts.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

unsurefuture said:


> She told me today that she is moving out and taking the kids. I said I don't want to move the kids and that we should take turns staying at the house with them for a while and try and establish a plan. She seems against this. I also demanded 50/50 custody and she she is saying not a chance. She said that is something I have to earn and deserve. I haven't been there for them in the past why should I get them now. I was always to busy working or trying to make things better for the family. I am guilty of not spending enough time with them though. I still want this to work. I am lost and don't know how to gather the strength to let her go. I am hoping she will come back around in the next year but I honestly don't know how to manage waiting that long. Yet I don't want to move on. Don't know how. Can't stand the idea of her finding another man. I don't want another man raising my children. We were suppose to live out or lives together, fulfill our dreams and raise our children together.


Get legal advice. She doesn't get it all her way.


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

committedwife said:


> Where do you think she's going to go? To her married lover's house? I'm thinking his wife might have a little problem with that.
> 
> BUST HER ASS. Expose her completely- at her job, to her friends on Facebook, and to her family. You will be yanking her into reality.
> 
> ...


He has been told this over and over, I'm done see ya!


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## JCD (Sep 2, 2012)

unsurefuture said:


> I don't feel like I can expose to the degree that this will need exposing with out at least one piece of concrete evidence. I thi k that they will just explain it always. I think the the OMW will minimize it other wards. She is a doc as well at a different location. But I know they pull big numbers between them and I doubt she is willing to risk that for circumstantial evidence. And I know I am being weak by not wanting to loose her here. We have been together 10 years and we are 25. So all of our adult life was formed together. I understand that codependency is playing a factor here. I'm not sure what to tell her parents if I don't have anything concrete. I already talked to her dad and too him we are having problems and that I suspected an affair but not the details. I love my wife very much. Probably to much. I also love my kids and think that us staying together is the best thing for them. Butmy wife doesn't seem to be snapping out of it. In not sure how to get mor evidence. There is a logger on both the cell and laptop however she can alway use a work phone or have another acct. although I don't think so. I discovered the other day that she started using iMessage on her ipad which would be a first for her as she never did this before. I am guessing because she suspects her phone and everything else is being watched. I didn't even think to check the ipad. Happened to look and there was a message on there from the OM. Nothing bad I think just work stuff. I am wondering if she is tryi g to make me look crazy with this twisted little game so that she doesn't look so bad when she leaves. I'm lost. Thank you everyone.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_



Okay...let's start with the basics.

If you look to the right side of the keyboard, there is a button that says 'enter'. It is one of the bigger buttons.

It installs paragraph breaks in your wall of text so it's easier to read. They do not charge you for this feature. Having 6 inches of prose without any white space is hard to read. It also helps to organize your thoughts.

That is a nitpick because I hate to read run on sentences. Your eyes keep getting lost in the prose.

Okay...you sir, are in a GREAT position! YES YOU ARE!

Your wife has told you you have NOTHING to lose! She's still leaving!

So expose far and wide. Tell the OMW. Maybe she won't divorce his butt, but I bet you $20 that she insists that he 'clean house' as far as his work force goes. Little Mrs. Round Heels will have to hit the bricks.

Now she has no lover, no job and is going to live with mom...

Oh...mom.

"Hi Mom. Here is a copy of texts, emails and messages between my WIFE and her boss. I have to ask you...would you be comfortable if your husband was saying these things about you and sharing these private lovey dovey correspondence with his secretary? I am not asking you to turn against your daughter. I am asking your help for me to fight for my marriage. I love my marriage. I love my kids. I do not love my wife right now, but she isn't exactly being lovable...Oh, by the way, she slept with my friend this May when I was sleeping upstairs. So when you hear her version of how terrible I am...i didn't cheat."

Leave her no safe haven.

THEN you decide if you want her back. Because she sounds like a real b*tch to me.

You don't need her to be happy. Or I should say, you SHOULDN'T need her to be happy. She needs to do some soul searching.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

JCD said:


> Okay...let's start with the basics.
> 
> If you look to the right side of the keyboard, there is a button that says 'enter'. It is one of the bigger buttons.
> 
> ...


My in laws are very pro marriage, but when they knew about my wife's affair they didn't put all that much pressure to stop. Guess their dislike of me might have overridden their dislike of infidelity.


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## JCD (Sep 2, 2012)

Wazza said:


> My in laws are very pro marriage, but when they knew about my wife's affair they didn't put all that much pressure to stop. Guess their dislike of me might have overridden their dislike of infidelity.


Well, that goes to the whole 'information asymmetry' thing we have going on. 

If I said 'I know I wasn't always there for her. But she had no right to cheat." you might think that I'm a bit distant but available.

If you later find out I see her every three months because of my job, suddenly her 'temptation' seems a lot more reasonable.

So when the in-laws side wholeheartedly with their cheating daughter...one has to wonder exactly how much of a prize the hubby actually was...

This isn't to disparage the OP. Just an observation. And yes, personal animosity also goes a long way to explaining the inexplicable.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

Wazza said:


> My in laws are very pro marriage, but when they knew about my wife's affair they didn't put all that much pressure to stop. Guess their dislike of me might have overridden their dislike of infidelity.


Exactly how is this supposed to help in this situation? Op is waffling his family away as it is.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

chapparal said:


> Exactly how is this supposed to help in this situation? Op is waffling his family away as it is.


It was an attempt to say, gently, that thoughtless and untargetted exposure is not necessarily a good strategy.


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

Unsure

You need to act. Get legal advice.

Expose your wife's nonsense.

And do not let her take the kids.

Her unhappiness does not have to be their unhappiness.

Act now.


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## theroad (Feb 20, 2012)

JCD said:


> Okay...let's start with the basics.
> 
> If you look to the right side of the keyboard, there is a button that says 'enter'. It is one of the bigger buttons.
> 
> ...




Yeah, what he said.


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## theroad (Feb 20, 2012)

Wazza said:


> My in laws are very pro marriage, but when they knew about my wife's affair they didn't put all that much pressure to stop. Guess their dislike of me might have overridden their dislike of infidelity.


Not all in laws do the right thing.

That does not mean you do not leave any stone unturned.

This BH is in a war. There is no guarantee that he will win. What is guaranteed that if he does hold back any of his arsenal he reduces his chance of wining his war.

It does no good to have anything left over in the armory if he loses. And, if he wins, there is no benefit having any ammo left over.

So BH, throw in everthing you have to fight with. Including the kitchen sink. Might as well as throw in the bathroom sink, bowl, and tub also. This is total war.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

theroad said:


> Not all in laws do the right thing.
> 
> That does not mean you do not leave any stone unturned.
> 
> ...


Exposing sometimes just makes the exposer look crazy. More is not necessarily better.

Personally I would definitely talk to OMW with no warning to wife or OM. Not necessarily to the parents.


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## JCD (Sep 2, 2012)

Considering her parents are getting an unanticipated roomer in their golden years, I think they might like a rational explanation for this turn of events.

I also note that the OP, who was waffling like a Beligan, hasn't been back for a while.


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## walkonmars (Aug 21, 2012)

JCD said:


> Considering her parents are getting an unanticipated roomer in their golden years, I think they might like a rational explanation for this turn of events.
> 
> *I also note that the OP, who was waffling like a Beligan, hasn't been back for a while*.


I suddenly remembered one of my bosses saying to me (when faced with a crisis): "xxx, will you handle this? I'll be under my desk sucking my thumb." 

I wonder why I remembered that upon reading your post.


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## unsurefuture (Dec 27, 2012)

OMW doesn't believe or isn't willing to act on it at the moment. I have seen more convincing information and I am tired of dealing with it. Every time a new turn of events happens it brings back all the pain. Wife still denies everything and she moved out. She said she needs a month to try and figure out what she wants in life. I don't know if I want her back. She continues to lie and cheat. How could I ever get passed that. Why would I want to risk it for the future. I don't think she even feels bad about it yet. She is still lying to me about trival things. So silly. I deserve to be happy and have trust in respect from a significant other. Why would I want to settle for anything less? I have given her countless opportunities to come clean or at the bare minimum stop lying about stupid little things. And she won't. So why should I keep trying. Keep caring. I deserve someone better. My biggest fear is that she is taking out children along for this wild ride. Hmmmf. I'm not sure. Any ideas.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

unsurefuture said:


> Wife still denies everything and she moved out. She said she needs a month to try and figure out what it feels like to screw OM in peace, without her pesky husband around.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Ideas? Research the best bulldog lawyer IN YOUR STATE and take out a loan to hire him.


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## Machiavelli (Feb 25, 2012)

You already got a lot of good advice and I'm not sure you paid much attention. Did you put a VAR in her car? How about a PI?


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## unsurefuture (Dec 27, 2012)

I don't know that I want her back. I listened to it all of the advice. It doesn't occur anywhere but at the work place. He is not stupid and neither is she. And I starting not to care. Why continue to revisit the pain. Why would I want to ever trust her again.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

You still need to get her attention. Talk to a great attorney. How are you separating finances?


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Ii you are deciding on divorce, you should act now. Start seeking legal advice. Make it happen.


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## unsurefuture (Dec 27, 2012)

Am I wrong to not want to revisit this stuff. She doesn't deserve it. And I deserve better. What could she possibly say or do that is going to fix this. Every time I look at her I see her as a dirty person. I don't know how or why I would ever want to trust her again.


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## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

unsurefuture said:


> Am I wrong to not want to revisit this stuff. She doesn't deserve it. And I deserve better. What could she possibly say or do that is going to fix this. Every time I look at her I see her as a dirty person. I don't know how or why I would ever want to trust her again.


Only you can answer that.

I trust my wife again, 99%, which is as much as I trust anyone, but it took a long time. You have to want reconciliation enough to fight for it.


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## walkonmars (Aug 21, 2012)

If you're going to act on it then ACT on it. 

If you are unsure then go dark and apply principles of 180 to come to terms with your own feelings. 

You will waffle back-and-forth with your thougths but don't do this in front of her. Don't demand a divorce on Monday and beg for her to come back on Wednesday. It just tells her she can continue to do as she pleases becuase you don't know what to do.

If you go for divorce - find the best - get a good idea of what you face both legally and financially. Before you go to the lawyerl, have an idea of what you want to see as an outcome: 50/50 shared custody, Child support/etc. Know how much you make annualy and how much she makes. 

If you are unsure. Then don't (DO NOT) talk to here about anything except the kids' health or welfare. Not about what cute things the kids are doing, not about the news, nuthin, nuthin at all.


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## unsurefuture (Dec 27, 2012)

This is being applied. And I feel better. Thank you everyone. We will see what the future hold for me and my kids. I am on the fence still but I think it is leaning toward divorce. Don't know why I would want to continue to subject myself to this type of behavior. Keep everyone updated. 180 is in motion.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

If you have alread got a copy of this let me know and I will delete this.

* Originally Posted by marduk 
I happened to be thinking today about the past year of my marriage. Everyone on these forums were so instrumental in my being in the great place I am today I thought I would post a note about where I was, where I am, and what I’ve learned.

A year ago my marriage was a mess. After 3 kids my stay at home wife spontaneously decided to start going out with her girlfriends again, including a “girls trip” to Vegas. She started a crazy fitness routine, including marathon running and triathalons. She started leaving me at home with the kids 2-3 evenings a week. A rough summer. I was insecure, controlling, alone, and afraid.

Thanks in part to the folks on this forum, life is much better now. My wife only goes out with her friends maybe once a month, and the last time she did, she came home early, threw her arms around me, and told me she’s so happy she gets to come home to me. She goes to the gym maybe once or twice a week for an hour or so in the early evening. When she does leave on races out of town the whole family will go on a camping trip together so we can be there for her at the finish line. The stress level in the house is much lower, and our happiness and respect for each other is much higher. Are things perfect? No – we still fight, have conflict, and disagree. But they’re shorter-lived, not has hostile, and just plain don’t seem to hurt so much. What’s changed? Me. Here’s what I learned:

1. Let her go. You can fight, hold her back, be controlling… and you’ll just look petty, insecure, and weak. Be cool, act secure, give her a kiss and say “have fun.” If she’s going to cheat or leave, she’s going to cheat or leave. It’s better if it happens sooner rather than later in my book. A marriage is a choice, a decision that’s made one day at a time. You’re in or out. This was really, really hard. But I've learned that nothing lasts forever, life is change. We can grow together or apart. I can't force her to decide to want to be with me.

2. Set boundaries, and then stick to them. I found in my marriage that it wasn’t ok to say “I don’t want you to do that” but it was ok to say “would you be ok with me doing that?” And then hold her to it. 9 times out of 10 the behaviour would go away on its own if I stuck to it. For example: if it was ok for her to be gone 2-3 nights a week so would I. After a couple of weeks she was dying to sit on the couch and watch a movie after we spent the evening with the kids together. Conversely, if it's within your boundaries, be cool with it. I started to let her off the hook for minor annoyances a lot more which cooled the stress levels.

3. Be ok with losing her. Seriously. After one of our last bad fights before things got better, I reconciled myself to thinking this might be it. The end of our marriage and little family. I thought out how things would be living on my own, sharing custody of the kids, etc. And as tough as it would be, made peace with it. It wouldn’t kill me, it wouldn’t kill my kids. Very negative experience and one I’d like to avoid at all costs, but we would survive. This changed my attitude and clinginess significantly… and to be blunt scared the hell out of my wife. Just last month she told me “I think you’d be more ok without me than I’d be without you.” And for our marriage, that balance of neediness works. I think it’s an alpha male thing, not sure but it seems to work.

4. Do my own thing. I’m out at least once or twice a week doing martial arts, yoga, weights, cross-fit, trail running, hanging with buddies… you name it. Gives me perspective and gives my wife time to miss me. And I’m in kick ass shape compared to last year, and now instead of me worrying about my wife getting hit on I’m having to deal with having her be upset because other women check me out when we go out. I’m going on a weekend martial arts training camp… and my wife couldn’t say a word after going to Vegas last year. Another thing: I make sure I either do something fun with the kids when she goes out (she’ll have to decide if it’s more important to miss out on family fun or friend fun) or I have fun while she’s out. Even something stupid like a scotch and cigar in the back yard when the kids go to bed so I can kick back and listen to the complete lack of complaining about the cigar stink. Ahh…

5. Be a father to our children. Not just “quality” time but real time. Conversations, walks in the park, helping with homework, taking them to soccer, etc. all seemed to help big time. Not just with my wife, but with all of us. And I also found my “father voice,” the voice of discipline and reason in the family. My kids listen to me a lot more, not in fear, but they know they have to listen. Now my wife comes to me when the kids don’t listen to her, not the other way around.

6. Get some buddies. Guys need close guy friends to do guy stuff. Complain about their wives. Be stupid and macho. Whatever that means to you, it worked wonders for me.

7. Fight different. Walk away rather than blow up. Mean what you say and stand up to it. For example, if I threaten that if she keeps doing x that means I'll do y, then I bloody well do y if she does x. This had two effects: I thought about what I said more, and so did my wife. I think my wife has a need to be able to hold me at my word, even if that’s a bad thing. Not sure why. Using few words in a fight, slowly and quietly while looking her directly in the eye seems to also work. Once it’s said, don’t repeat it. It is what it is.

8. Act from a place of strength. I don’t think my wife wants a weakling. She may say that she’ll want me to be more intimate, vulnerable, etc… I think that’s actually BS. Or at least that she doesn’t mean weak or actually vulnerable. If you have flaws or weaknesses either accept it and move on or fix it. I don’t let my wife try to fix my flaws any more. If she brings something up and tries to fix it I’ll ask her to mind her own business (gently). Not a behaviour that impacts her, those I’ll always try to listen to her on. But I don't let her judge me or try to live up to her expectations any more. I define myself, I don't let her do that for me.

9. Be decisive. Again I think this is an alpha male thing. Make plans. I planned a few date nights, and didn’t ask what she wanted to do. Instead I planned stuff I thought might be fun for us, and asked if she was having a good time. She was, especially if it was stuff she didn’t normally like to do (one time we went to a tattoo expo – I have one small tattoo and she has none – but got us out of our element and we had a blast!) Now if she asks me “what do you want to do” I answer with what I want. Works in bed too – I just made sure she felt comfortable in saying “no.” Don’t bully, be decisive and adaptable.

10. Know what I want from life. This is hard in today’s world. I had to pull my head out of my ass and figure out that I don’t want to sit on the couch every night and watch TV. So now I don’t. At least not every night.

11. Do more macho stuff. Fix something around the house. Dig a big hole in the back yard and plant a tree. Fixing her car, for example, seemed to turn a light bulb on in my wife’s head that reminded me that I’m a man and not one of her girlfriends.

So that’s my list. Hope it helps some of the guys out there. Your mileage may vary, and my marriage may still fail, but I’m in a much better spot in the past year than I have been in a long, long time.

Thanks for everything! 

*


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

Here is also a link to a page you might want to read

Steps to Recover from an affair/infidelity in marriage


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