# When is a good time to call it quits



## needymom (Sep 4, 2009)

Five years ago I was in bad shape. I had a very stressful job and reached my breaking point. I decided to go back to school. My husband and family were very supportive. It was hard going down to one income but we did it. Last year I worked contract jobs and made good money so far this year I have had no job offers. I will admit I am struggling right now with my own depression and I try to keep my self busy. 
After the birth of our first son 17 years ago my husband started to become distant. I would go through periods of saying that he should go to councelling but he never did. He had a hard childhood which I think is the root of the problem. When he is home he stays in his own little room and drinks. He doesn't really spend any time with us. It has been two years since we physcially slept together. His snoring is out of this world but he refuses to get help. 
This year my oldest son is going through some mental problems. It hasn't been great living with him. Even though it has been rough I take it as a blessing that I haven't been working. With all his appointments he has during the week there is no way he would have gotten better if I was working. I tried to get help with my husband but it never happened. 
My children know they can't count on their Dad. When he is home he is drunk they can't ask for a drive to go see their friends and they never have friends home since they are so embarassed by his drinking. 
My husband will go days without talking to any of us. He comes home from work and goes downstairs to his little room to drink. He never informs me on our finaces etc. Last conversation I had with him he said he knows our marriage isn't good and he will do his thing and for me to do my thing. 
He has a family history of heart disease and I know he is showing symptoms but still refuses to go to the doctor. He doesn't have any friends and I have talked to his brothers and sisters about his problems but no one will talk to him. He never goes out except to go to work. 
Last night he was talking to one of our sons saying that we need to go on a family vacation. My son's reply was why so we can sit and watch you drink and then hear you snoring all night. 
My sons are getting older and there will be a time when they move out. Then what do I have? Do I love my husband? Can't say I do, I feel nothing. It is like living with the invisible room mate. I am generally happy person and life is so short. I want to live and be happy. But when is there a good time to leave? I am not working right now I can't support our family. But am I harming my kids staying? I am sure part of my son's mental problem is caused by his Dad.


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## A Bit Much (Sep 14, 2011)

needymom said:


> Five years ago I was in bad shape. I had a very stressful job and reached my breaking point. I decided to go back to school. My husband and family were very supportive. It was hard going down to one income but we did it. Last year I worked contract jobs and made good money so far this year I have had no job offers. I will admit I am struggling right now with my own depression and I try to keep my self busy.
> After the birth of our first son 17 years ago my husband started to become distant. I would go through periods of saying that he should go to councelling but he never did. He had a hard childhood which I think is the root of the problem. When he is home he stays in his own little room and drinks. He doesn't really spend any time with us. It has been two years since we physcially slept together. His snoring is out of this world but he refuses to get help.
> This year my oldest son is going through some mental problems. It hasn't been great living with him. Even though it has been rough I take it as a blessing that I haven't been working. With all his appointments he has during the week there is no way he would have gotten better if I was working. I tried to get help with my husband but it never happened.
> My children know they can't count on their Dad. When he is home he is drunk they can't ask for a drive to go see their friends and they never have friends home since they are so embarassed by his drinking.
> ...


Where would you go if you left?

And to answer your questions... 

1) A good time to leave? Sounds like it was years ago.

2) Yes you're harming your children, though after all these years a lot of damage has already been done.


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## Mavash. (Jan 26, 2012)

A good time to leave would have been years ago but it's never too late. But first you must take care of practical matters like yes where would you go and how would you support yourself.

I bet if you focused on THAT and less on your husband's problems you'd find the courage to leave.


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## needymom (Sep 4, 2009)

Unfortunately I have no family that would take me and the kids in. If I go I will have to do it all on my own. I have been applying for jobs all over the country and did have one job offer on the other side of the country. The company offered me the job over the phone and deep down inside it just didn't seem right. I probably should have left years ago when I had a job but my income was low and I know I couldn't support the kids. Guess that is why I went back to school to get the job that I would be able to do it on my own. But I didn't expect the recession. Finding a new job at 45 years old is difficult. I know I can't change my husband. He doesn't know how to be a husband or a father and never will. All he knows is to go to work and then get drunk and be left alone. I have been hinting I want to paint the house and put it on the market. I certainly have the time but he doesn't want me to do that. I think he is aware when the house sells that is when I will ask for a divorce.


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## A Bit Much (Sep 14, 2011)

> I have no family that would take me and the kids in


What about friends? Do you have any?


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## Mavash. (Jan 26, 2012)

needymom said:


> I have been hinting I want to paint the house and put it on the market. I certainly have the time but he doesn't want me to do that. I think he is aware when the house sells that is when I will ask for a divorce.


Your house isn't going to sell if you don't get it on the market. And hints never work. If you want this done YOU will have to do it.


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## Acorn (Dec 16, 2010)

Needymom - You can do this if you want to. Don't get hung up on the obstacles, but rather the path around them.

This board is a great place for support.

Between self-inspection, this board, and some individual therapy, I am almost a completely different person than I was a few years ago. If I can do it, I know you can too.

And try to think of the house this way: You want to be away from him, which means you'll be on your own. Getting the house market-ready is a great place to start doing something on your own while still in the relative comfort of familiar surroundings.

You CAN do it.


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## needymom (Sep 4, 2009)

My closets friends were my friends that I worked with in my previous career but over the years we have drifted somewhat apart. I am reconnecting with old friends through facebook but I couldn't ask them to take us in. My current friends are my classmates but none of them could take us in either. The only friends that know of my family life are my x coworkers no else knows about my private life. Parents of my kids friends know something is wrong with our relationship because we never see us together. Recently one of my son's friends father just broke up with his second wife. We have shared coffee etc when the kids have been off playing. I enjoy his company but that is it. I am certainly not looking into getting into a relationship with someone but I do enjoy the company. Adult conversation with anyone would do.


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## A Bit Much (Sep 14, 2011)

You sound like you've spent years isolating yourself as much as your husband has. No man is an island.

Call a listing agent and get your house listed. If you truly need to paint, go pick some up and grab your son and his friends to help you get it done. Order some pizza and get some Pepsi's or whatever and ask for their assistance.

Talking about it isn't making anything happen. You have to take action to get it done.


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## needymom (Sep 4, 2009)

Your right Acorn!! I am always afraid I will upset my husband. Not sure why I think that. I need to get this house painted and on the market. I need a home that my kids can have their friends over and not be ashamed of their father. I need a job too!!


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## marriedat19 (Mar 28, 2012)

needymom said:


> My husband will go days without talking to any of us.
> 
> He comes home from work and goes downstairs to his little room
> 
> ...


First off read all of that together... your kids are definitely having problems because they have a drunk for a father. If the only time he is ever sober is at work, you need to meet him for lunch and talk while he is sober.. And go over everything listed above.. and let him know you are debating on leaving and will do it if he doesn't help himself...


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## needymom (Sep 4, 2009)

There hasn't been a time where he has been totally sober at home in years. Vary rarely he gets so drunk he can't walk, but in my opinion he isn't sober. He works 12 hours shifts and when he is home he is downstairs drinking, or doing something in his "man den" or he is sleeping. I can't go to his work to talk to him. We can't even sit down to watch a movie he slips away to his "man den". In the past I have pleaded for him to get help but he never has. He calls me a "cold fish" and maybe I am. I honestly can't see himself ever helping himself especially for his family. Our son was suicidal a couple months ago. Did he help? No. I cashed in some of my RRSP's for treatment and all I get is complaints the treatment is too expensive. I feel like a complete idiot that I haven't left him years ago. If he was out of the picture what would our lives me like today?


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## A Bit Much (Sep 14, 2011)

needymom said:


> There hasn't been a time where he has been totally sober at home in years. Vary rarely he gets so drunk he can't walk, but in my opinion he isn't sober. He works 12 hours shifts and when he is home he is downstairs drinking, or doing something in his "man den" or he is sleeping. I can't go to his work to talk to him. We can't even sit down to watch a movie he slips away to his "man den". In the past I have pleaded for him to get help but he never has. He calls me a "cold fish" and maybe I am. I honestly can't see himself ever helping himself especially for his family. Our son was suicidal a couple months ago. Did he help? No. I cashed in some of my RRSP's for treatment and all I get is complaints the treatment is too expensive. I feel like a complete idiot that I haven't left him years ago. If he was out of the picture what would our lives me like today?


You can't do anything about the past. It's done. Your present is what you need to work on, so you can move into the future without any of this baggage holding you back from what you really want.

When you know better you do better. Now you know what you have to do so get to it.


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## needymom (Sep 4, 2009)

I am so glad I posted. You guys are really helping me. I know this marriage is done. There is no helping him, I can't help him and his family doesn't want to help him. I have to really get serious and think how I can get myself and my sons out of this. I have no idea what our finances are like, he keeps me out of that. I have no idea how much he makes. I doubt he will pay child support without a fight. So I have to do this on my own. I can't see making a clean split without a job and what marital financial disaster is lerking. My unemployment insurance is going to run out at the end of April. Any advice?


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## A Bit Much (Sep 14, 2011)

> I have no idea what our finances are like, he keeps me out of that. I have no idea how much he makes. I doubt he will pay child support without a fight. So I have to do this on my own. I can't see making a clean split without a job and what marital financial disaster is lerking. My unemployment insurance is going to run out at the end of April. Any advice?


Do you have access to your accounts? How are your unemployment checks distributed? If it's coming to you don't cash another check in any account he's associated with. Open your own. Can you get an extension?

Go apply everywhere you can for a job. Check your local paper, fast food, restaurants, retail... get out there before the rush of college students come home. After April you are less likely to find anything because they'll be hiring students for those types of jobs.

I'm sure your state has a website to visit re:child support/aid. You may have to consider this as an option... going on welfare has a stigma attached to it, but it's there really for people just like you. Take advantage of it. Find an agency near you and make an appointment. All they can tell you is NO. That's no worse than where you are right now.

It's very empowering to finally take control when you feel you've been out of control of anything for so long. Use that feeling to keep you focused on your goal... GETTING OUT. Spend your days in active pursuit of that goal. You'll be less and less focused on him if you're doing that.


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## Prodigal (Feb 5, 2011)

You are married to an alcoholic. Most likely you are codependent. Your husband's alcoholism has destroyed your marriage and had an obvious impact on the children.

I suggest you give Al-Anon a try. We have a ridiculously simple saying in the program: "Nothing changes if nothing changes." Looks like the person who has to change is you.

There are jobs out there, even in this rotten economy. Put all your energy into getting the house ready for sale and getting a job. If you can't support your kids, get your husband to pay child support; make it part of the divorce settlement.

"Codies" tend to isolate when the alcoholic in their lives isolates. It's part of being codependent. Get busy living. Life is very short. Don't bother trying to talk to your husband. There is no reasoning with a drunk.

Forget about having the "big talk." All you will get is him turning the tables and blaming you for anything and everything.

I understand your circumstances. I've been married to an alcoholic for years. Fortunately, I put 2,700 miles between us. I may be poor, but I don't have to live with the insanity of the disease any longer.

You don't have to either.


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## needymom (Sep 4, 2009)

I have gone to Al-Anon in the past. The first group I didn't fit in. Most of the ladies in the group were going through hell and my problems didn't seem that bad. I tried another group then one of my old clients joined and I just couldn't open up. But maybe I should try again. 
This is the first time in my life I have been unemployed and it isn't fun. I have two degrees and now taking more courses. I have had a lot of interviews but no job offers in my area. I have been told I am too qualified, that I would be bored with the job. I have heard from other people that heard I didn't get the job because the interviewer was terrified that I had more knowledge than them. There is a good chance I will get a job in August and I can't wait. I did the job on a short contract and I loved it. I have started applying at grocery stores etc but no calls from them. 
I guess I could open my own account and put my refund from my income taxes in there. Years ago I had my own personal account that I saved money in for our down payment for our house. It might not alarm my husband too much. 
I have a lot of work ahead of me.


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## Love Song (Jan 16, 2012)

needymom said:


> Five years ago I was in bad shape. I had a very stressful job and reached my breaking point. I decided to go back to school. My husband and family were very supportive. It was hard going down to one income but we did it. Last year I worked contract jobs and made good money so far this year I have had no job offers. I will admit I am struggling right now with my own depression and I try to keep my self busy.
> After the birth of our first son 17 years ago my husband started to become distant. I would go through periods of saying that he should go to councelling but he never did. He had a hard childhood which I think is the root of the problem. When he is home he stays in his own little room and drinks. He doesn't really spend any time with us. It has been two years since we physcially slept together. His snoring is out of this world but he refuses to get help.
> This year my oldest son is going through some mental problems. It hasn't been great living with him. Even though it has been rough I take it as a blessing that I haven't been working. With all his appointments he has during the week there is no way he would have gotten better if I was working. I tried to get help with my husband but it never happened.
> My children know they can't count on their Dad. When he is home he is drunk they can't ask for a drive to go see their friends and they never have friends home since they are so embarassed by his drinking.
> ...



I personally believe that a couple shouldn't stay together just for the kids. If you two are setting a good example for the kids than that's what it's about. But when that isn't the case your just doing more harm than good. 

As far as leaving, he has given up. THere's nothing you can do about it. A marriage takes two. Do you really want him to drag you along while he continues this for god knows how long? I'm not saying you should get a divorce, only you can decide that. But I am saying that in a mental sense you are already divorced 

- After the birth of our first son *17 years ago* my husband started to become distant.
- I would go through periods of saying that he should go to councelling but he never did.
- My husband will go days without talking to any of us.
- Do I love my husband? Can't say I do, I feel nothing. It is like living with the invisible room mate.

What you have described is not what a marriage is all about. It may be acceptable for someone to go through this in there life sporadically (like when times get hard) but it sounds like this has been going on for years and wont change. 

As far as his childhood. That is only an excuse if you allow it to be. I will spare you the graphic details of my horrible childhood. I went through a lot of abuse in different forms. It has damaged me in a lot of ways. But (literally) everyday I work to make myself a better person. I put one step in front of the other and try to overcome it. I'm still suffering but I haven't given up and I've made a lot of improvements. I refuse to let that part of my life continue to destroy whatever years I have left. Letting your childhood issues overcome you is a choice.


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## Prodigal (Feb 5, 2011)

needymom said:


> I have gone to Al-Anon in the past. The first group I didn't fit in. Most of the ladies in the group were going through hell and my problems didn't seem that bad. I tried another group then one of my old clients joined and I just couldn't open up.


Try other groups. And your perspective that the other ladies in your first group had problems worse than your's ... it's called denial. The alcoholic is in denial. The codependent is in denial. And, meanwhile, there's a huge un-housebroken elephant sitting in the middle of the living room stinkin' the place to he!!. 

So learn to open up. Or just listen until you feel moved to speak. Your kids have a drunk for a father. Not exactly a role model one wants for their kids, is it? Start un-doing the damage. Go to an open A.A. meeting. Go to Al-Anon. Go to Codependents Anonymous. Get counseling. Start going somewhere that is constructive; where people will know where you're coming from. 



needymom said:


> It might not alarm my husband too much.
> 
> I have a lot of work ahead of me.


Yep ... get busy livin' or get busy dyin'. And as far as hubs goes, he won't give a flying fig as long as you don't come between him and his booze. He may not like losing his enabler, but he may just booze himself into oblivion. Your very presence is all he needs to have an enabler. Alcoholics detach. The problem is, they need people around they can detach from.

I was going to get my master's about three years ago. Glad I didn't. I got the over-qualified line too. But I spent THREE YEARS pounding away at finding a job. I found one. Not the same pay I made before, nor are the benefits nearly as good. But I'm employed doing research again.

So, when is it a good time to call it quits? When the pain of staying exceeds the pain of leaving.


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## needymom (Sep 4, 2009)

Last night my husband watched a movie with us and for the first time was sober. Strange. I am sure he isn't going to go to do that today. 
I do have some work to do on myself. I will try going to Al-Anon again. I would love to go to counselling but right now I am paying $300/week for my son's counselling. It is going to be so hard for me to open up. Far easier opening up on this chat than opening up to other people. 
Today at the grocery store I was looking around and couldn't believe how many couples were there shopping together. Another slap in my face. 
Picked up some paint samples and went downstairs a place I avoid because of the "man den". I looked in the man den full of cigarette butts and booze/beer bottles. The rest of the basement full of his junk. He is a bit of a hoarder . I have a lot of work to do to get this place ready for the market. 
Tonight I am going to a wedding of course alone. Hope I can get a more positive attitude before going. 
Thanks everyone for your honesty.


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## strange_bound (Feb 27, 2012)

@needymom, I am sorry to hear about your situation. 

Right now if you leave without ensuring your financial security, who is going to pay for your son's counseling? Do you think your husband will once you leave? 

I understand it's hard, but maybe you have to put that first. You also have to calmly approach your husband about your son and seek his support.

Tell him, for instance, how happy it made you guys to enjoy a movie together. Try to get him back in the family.

In the meanwhile, keep job hunting.


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## Unhappy2011 (Dec 28, 2011)

You show signs of co-dependency. And you live with an addict.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Unhappy2011 (Dec 28, 2011)

Your son is seventeen. He will be fine. And 300 a week for conseling? It's ok to make yourself happy.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Toby (Jan 13, 2011)

Needymom, your story is sad and I'm so sorry for all the pain I hear in you post. I am going through almost the same as you I wont hijack your thread but will start one later. If I can be blunt with you [not trying to hurt you]. I hear so much excuse making about why you cant leave. I realize that it is terrifing to be alone and lonely. Last night I made a mental list of what my husband brings to the marriage, and it's not alot. I am on my third marriage second one was killed. My first husband was a drunk, refussed to get help. I left and had a crummy job and he never paid support. But we made it. I was never so happy about my choice. My son was 9 he is now 35 and well adapted and a wonderful person,father and husband. We can make it if we want, you sound educated and still young. Kids adapt. I now have a 22 year old son who lives with me and told me months ago to not stay with dad for him because he saw the abuse. Kids draw their own conclusion we dont need to bad mouth or explain our partners behavior the kids take it all in. 

Be strong read co dependent no more. They change when they want to not because of us. My ex is still a drunk and has a missreble life jobs on top of jobs moving all over the country. I will post my story so read if you care it's a heart breaker, but I am working on me. Toby


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## needymom (Sep 4, 2009)

Two hours before leaving for wedding my husband decided to come to the wedding. If was strange, very strange. I felt uncomfortable in my own skin. He stayed sober, we even had a dance. On the way home he says he thinks he needs councelling but it might be too late. I told him it is never too late. I am sure the damage is too far gone to save our marriage but maybe he can save his life. 
I do need a job first before we call it splits.


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## strange_bound (Feb 27, 2012)

@needymom glad to hear you had a dance with your husband  You told him "it's never too late"; and yet you say "you're sure the damage is too far gone to save your marriage" (did you tell him this part, or you simply felt it?). Anyway, signs of progress for sure. You're right on the job part. Good luck with everything.


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## needymom (Sep 4, 2009)

No I never said directly to him that I think it is to late to change our marriage I simply felt it. Now he is out with the kids, I can't remember the last time he spent time with the kids. This is strange. Maybe he is reading my posts!!


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## sixteen miles (Jan 5, 2011)

Wow, but hold on here! This is a sad and rough story, but I may throw a wrench in all of these replies. I try always to see the positive side of folks. At one time you were attracted to him for something. You loved him and saw some good in your husband. 
I think everyone needs a chance. He is an alcoholic, but he deserves a chance at recovering; everyone does! You said yourself, that he supported you when you went to school and he works 12 hours shifts! That is a hard worker in my opinion. Sometimes folks do not realize how much pressure a single income and financial pressure can weigh upon a man. He needs help, he needs counseling, he needs to have support, but he does have some positive attributes. You and your son rely on him for income and he provides it. Does he enjoy his job, or is he just working in misery to keep the money coming in? I feel the need for more info: Does your son work even a little part time job, or cut the grass, or wash the car etc. etc. or help out with any chores to take some pressure off and to try to help out during hard times? Did you consider part time work or anything to bring in some money until your main work takes off? Perhaps the poor chap is just plain worn out. If you still care for him in the least, then remember what he did (does) and see if he can be assisted in some way before tearing it all down. I maybe all wet, but he sounds like a man who just deserves a little more of chance than what he is getting right now. 12 hours days can wear you down.


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## needymom (Sep 4, 2009)

My husband hasn't taken any time off work in 4 years. He hates his job and yes needs a vacation. My previous career I use to work years at a time without vacation, it does bring you down. Going back to school I was hoping to bring in the money so he could change careers or leave him. He has isolated himself since the birth of our first son. I do believe this is all issues he has from his childhood. Horrible things happened to his parents from other family members and his father died when he was 8 years old. His mom neglected him and his sisters tortured him physically and mentally. There is more to the story but I think this is part of his problem. 
My son did have a job till his mental state changed. He has sent out a few resumes. My son's mental problems drained both my husband and myself. I take most of the grief from my son why my husband remained hidden. 
My kids do not do enough chores. My oldest son thinks I should be there to do as he wishes when he wishes. If I don't he totally freaks out. I am the one that has inabled this behaviour. But because I am home all the time they think I should be their slave. I am really trying to teach my boys that they have to start taking care of themselves but I am not sure if listen to me. 
I am at a point that I would take any job offered to me. I even told one employee that I would volunteer first but he declined. I most likely will have a job in August but it feels so far away. 
My husband does have positive attributes. He has encouraged me through my schooling when I wanted to give up. I think my son's situation he blames himself. Maybe he is to blame or it would have happened anyway. Social anxiety/depression seems to be commen with teenagers. 
My husband has never physcially abuse me or the kids. He has some health issues that he has to take care but refuses to make an appointment. I do feel drinking comes first in his life. Both of us have to learn how to deal with our oldesnt son.
But there has been an improvement the last few days. I have told him I am lonely and he must be lonely too. 
Going to take some steps to improve me. I will go back to Al-anon and give it another try. I will try and not be such a "cold fish" to my husband. I am going to push my kids more to start taking care of themselves. Still can't share the same bed because of his snoring.


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