# Why the double standard???



## tryingtoenjoylife (Mar 30, 2012)

This probably could go in a non-marriage room because I have seen it brought up by bf/gf. Regardless, it is more a question of long term relationships.

Here is the question. If a guy is masturbating to the point that he doesn't have sex with his wife, then he has a porn addiction, is a pervert, something is wrong with him. I have seen thread after thread in various rooms about this. I even saw one thread where a wife was upset because her husband was masturbating in the shower when she walked in (most people asked why she didn't just join him). Some threads have been about men who pretend to orgasm and then later jack off. Ultimately the tone of the thread is that it is the mans fault.

The double standard is that when I see men post questions about women with the same behavior it is because the man doesn't satisfy her. If she turns him down but later masturbates, it is because she can't get off with him because of his scent, look, whatever. If she pretends to orgasm (or not) but later goes and masturbates, it is because the guy failed in bed. 

My question again? Why the double standard in general tone?

My theory is guilt. Not sure why and maybe this is changing, but there seems to be a guilt complex that is brought up with women when it comes to masturbating. "Girls don't touch themselves there." With guys (most) there isn't a guilt thing with masturbation. So later on when guys masturbate and it affects the marriage, it is because they are sex addicts, porn addicts, perverts, inconsiderate, whatever. But when a woman masturbates and it affects the marriage, it is the guys fault. Almost as if "good girls wouldn't need to do this if the guy was doing his job."

Any other input???


----------



## MissScarlett (May 22, 2013)

I wonder if perhaps its also because the female orgasm is much harder to come by (so to speak.) Men are generally guaranteed an orgasm from sex and women not so much.


----------



## AnnieAsh (Aug 22, 2012)

If a man came here and said his wife was masturbating to the degree that my husband did, I'd give him the advice that I needed to hear. I wouldn't call him a prude or a porn hater or a frigid b!tch. 

There is such a thing as an unhealthy amount of masturbation. If you're developing scabs, doing it at work, locking your children out for hours, or unable to perform with your spouse it is too much. Sadly, I've lived that.


----------



## Catherine602 (Oct 14, 2010)

The situations you describe are different. For example, coming in on husband maturating in shower and being upset. That is an ovation of privacy. She should have apologised and closed the door. 

The way I look at it - masturbation is normal provided it does not interfere with sex with another. Men get upset when they find out their wife is M even if they are having sex.

I've read post where the man wants his wife to ask him to watch her M or to have sex with him instead of M. . Another invasion of privacy. 

She may have a hard time getting an O with a partner but is garenteed one when she M. It is simply satisfying a need for an O.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## BruisedGirl (Apr 4, 2013)

I only masturbate when I'm ridiculously horny and my guy isn't interested or home or both. I masturbate because I want to have an orgasm. 

He watches porn. I watch porn. 

My only issue with porn, ever, is if he can wank to porn, he can fvck me. If he'd rather wank to porn, and not give a sh!t if I'm satisfied and I don't get sex, then there's an issue. 

Currently going through this scenario, actually. He's got time and energy for porn. He knows I'm HD. But he's not really giving a damn about my sexual needs because he's taking care of himself and leaving me to take care of myself. 

So, if we reverse this, am I not satisfying for him?


----------



## Thunder7 (Jan 2, 2013)

AnnieAsh said:


> If a man came here and said his wife was masturbating to the degree that my husband did, I'd give him the advice that I needed to hear. I wouldn't call him a prude or a porn hater or a frigid b!tch.
> 
> There is such a thing as an unhealthy amount of masturbation. If you're developing scabs, doing it at work, locking your children out for hours, or unable to perform with your spouse it is too much. Sadly, I've lived that.


"Developing scabs". Ouch!! That suggests a whole new world of problems, other than chronic masturbation.


----------



## AnnieAsh (Aug 22, 2012)

Thunder7 said:


> "Developing scabs". Ouch!! That suggests a whole new world of problems, other than chronic masturbation.


Nope. The Iron Grip of Death caused it. Especially since he doesn't use lube and can masturbate for hours on end. Literally. Hours. It is actually fascinating until you realize he's completely desensitized his penis and couldn't even feel a bj until the last 2 to 4 months.


----------



## Thunder7 (Jan 2, 2013)

What I was eluding to was the serious compulsion issues he apparently has. It doesn't seem as though he's doing it for the pleasure. With scabs, I'm sure there is no pleasure. Sounds like he's doing it because he 'has to', not because he wants to. It screams of OCD.


----------



## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

tryingtoenjoylife said:


> This probably could go in a non-marriage room because I have seen it brought up by bf/gf. Regardless, it is more a question of long term relationships.





tryingtoenjoylife said:


> Here is the question. If a guy is masturbating to the point that he doesn't have sex with his wife, then he has a porn addiction, is a pervert, something is wrong with him. I have seen thread after thread in various rooms about this.


If a man or woman is masturbating a lot and refusing to have sex with their, then there is a problem. If this person has not been talking to their spouse about why they are avoiding sex and working together to fix the marriage then there is a problem. A spouse who refuses to address the problems of the marriage and instead avoids their spouse and masturbates is at fault. IT the same for men and women.



tryingtoenjoylife said:


> I even saw one thread where a wife was upset because her husband was masturbating in the shower when she walked in (most people asked why she didn't just join him).


I think I recall this thread. She was upset because he had been avoiding sex with her for some time. It’s reasonable for anyone to be upset when their spouse choses to masturbate and refuses to engage in a healthy sexual relationship in the marriage. How is that hard to understand?


tryingtoenjoylife said:


> Some threads have been about men who pretend to orgasm and then later jack off. Ultimately the tone of the thread is that it is the mans fault.


I’d have to see that thread. Why did not do this? Sounds like an odd thing to do.


tryingtoenjoylife said:


> The double standard is that when I see men post questions about women with the same behavior it is because the man doesn't satisfy her. If she turns him down but later masturbates, it is because she can't get off with him because of his scent, look, whatever. If she pretends to orgasm (or not) but later goes and masturbates, it is because the guy failed in bed.


I’ve never seen this here. I think you are seeing what you want to see


tryingtoenjoylife said:


> My question again? Why the double standard in general tone?


It’s not. 


tryingtoenjoylife said:


> My theory is guilt. Not sure why and maybe this is changing, but there seems to be a guilt complex that is brought up with women when it comes to masturbating. "Girls don't touch themselves there." With guys (most) there isn't a guilt thing with masturbation. So later on when guys masturbate and it affects the marriage, it is because they are sex addicts, porn addicts, perverts, inconsiderate, whatever. But when a woman masturbates and it affects the marriage, it is the guys fault. Almost as if "good girls wouldn't need to do this if the guy was doing his job."


A lot of men get very upset if their wife masturbates. There have been threads here on the topic.


----------



## AnnieAsh (Aug 22, 2012)

Thunder7 said:


> What I was eluding to was the serious compulsion issues he apparently has. It doesn't seem as though he's doing it for the pleasure. With scabs, I'm sure there is no pleasure. Sounds like he's doing it because he 'has to', not because he wants to. It screams of OCD.


 Yes he has a compulsive porn and masturbation problem. That's what I was saying. Any spouse doing it to that level has an issue, male or female.


----------



## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Thunder7 said:


> What I was eluding to was the serious compulsion issues he apparently has. It doesn't seem as though he's doing it for the pleasure. With scabs, I'm sure there is no pleasure. Sounds like he's doing it because he 'has to', not because he wants to. It screams of OCD.


He's seeking the brain chemicals that are caused by even lower level stimulation, consistent for a prolonged period of time. Some people find that it's a way to self medicate when they are having problems with things like depression.


----------



## Fozzy (Jul 20, 2013)

AnnieAsh said:


> Nope. The Iron Grip of Death caused it. Especially since he doesn't use lube and can masturbate for hours on end. Literally. Hours. It is actually fascinating until you realize he's completely desensitized his penis and couldn't even feel a bj until the last 2 to 4 months.


This gives me chills. I'm hoping he got some professional help.


----------



## AnnieAsh (Aug 22, 2012)

EleGirl said:


> He's seeking the brain chemicals that are caused by even lower level stimulation, consistent for a prolonged period of time. Some people find that it's a way to self medicate when they are having problems with things like depression.


He said he had to keep finding more and more extreme stuff, sitting there longer and longer, taking risks to get his fix. Then when he tried to stop (to teach me that he is NOT addicted) he was irritable, angry, on edge...then he had an incident at work. It was a really scary thing. 

Pretty messed up. We had a long conversation about how this has completely screwed up his perceptions of our sexual relationship.


----------



## hookares (Dec 7, 2011)

If a couple feels the need to exclude each other when sex is desired, they both are contributing to the problem.


----------



## AnnieAsh (Aug 22, 2012)

Fozzy said:


> This gives me chills. I'm hoping he got some professional help.


Thanks. It is really overwhelming, especially when we discussed this stuff before marriage and I got snookered. 

He's kind of white knuckling it. But I'm not his mom and I'm going to have sex. If he wants to be the recipient then he needs to shape up. 

Can you tell I've sort of reached my limit?


----------



## always_alone (Dec 11, 2012)

tryingtoenjoylife said:


> My question again? Why the double standard in general tone?


I don't think there is a double standard blaming only men. When I first stormed into TAM ranting about porn, plenty of people suggested that it must be because I am fat, ugly, boring in bed, smelled bad, and my h was just a normal healthy guy who like all men needs some variety to spice up his life -- and I should just STFU and be grateful he isn't cheating.


----------



## tryingtoenjoylife (Mar 30, 2012)

OK,

I am going to try to get back on task. I am not talking about chronic masturbation or porn addiction. I am talking about being horny, needing relief, but excluding the spouse.

One double standard that does exist is biological. Men have a refractory period. To a lesser extent women do to, but as men age the likelihood of going again in 30 minutes, an hour, whatever decreases. As a kid I could orgasm 5 or 6 times a day. As an adult, that just isn't going to happen. 

When I mentioned on boards and threads, it wasn't entirely this board. I have seen others.

First, I understand that there is an ease to masturbation. A quick fix, a by yourself non-emotional act. 

Second, in general I encourage women to masturbate. For some it was taboo. I think if a woman masturbates she can find out what can help her orgasm or get her over the top. Be it PIV or clitoral stimulation or both. 

What I am talking about is this exclusion thing. If the husband desires sex and is turned down and later finds out that the woman masturbated before or after the initiation, the general tone seems to be that there is something wrong with him. He smells, he can't please her, ect.

When a woman does the same thing, more often than not, it is because the man doesn't please her. 

I realize that there are some jerks on all sites that immediately go on the attack, but the general tone seems to be what I am saying. 

Skipping the masturbation thing, the double standard exists on all aspects of being turned down for sex. If the guy initiates sex repeatedly and is turned down all the time (I am not talking about once in awhile here, we all have physical issues from time to time), the tone is that he is not meeting her emotional needs. He isn't doing enough around the house, with the kids, for her.

If a guy turns down a woman for sex, he has a porn problem, a masturbation problem - it is his problem.

That is the double standard.


----------



## Aldrin (Aug 25, 2013)

Nah, I don't see that has a pervasive theme, maybe amongst certain populations or communities sure, online or otherwise... but I've found this site to be really straight down the middle. Others yes I have noticed a swing of bias towards male or female... but generally about the same prevalence there to.


----------



## Vanguard (Jul 27, 2011)

EleGirl said:


> He's seeking the brain chemicals that are caused by even lower level stimulation, consistent for a prolonged period of time. Some people find that it's a way to self medicate when they are having problems with things like depression.


He probably is depressed because if memory serves Annie cheated on him. 

I'd be looking at a lot of porn too.


----------



## AnnieAsh (Aug 22, 2012)

Vanguard said:


> He probably is depressed because if memory serves Annie cheated on him.
> 
> I'd be looking at a lot of porn too.


Yawn. He has readily admitted to a heavy habit before we even got together. Try again.


----------



## Vanguard (Jul 27, 2011)

AnnieAsh said:


> Yawn. He has readily admitted to a heavy habit before we even got together. Try again.


I'm not saying he never had his problems beforehand. I'm saying whatever issues he had were amplified heavily when you did what you did. You can redistribute blame and pain all you want but it doesn't really help you or him, does it? 

Silly people thinking that perception has one ounce of impact on reality.


----------



## AnnieAsh (Aug 22, 2012)

Vanguard said:


> I'm not saying he never had his problems beforehand. I'm saying whatever issues he had were amplified heavily when you did what you did. You can redistribute blame and pain all you want but it doesn't really help you or him, does it?
> 
> Silly people thinking that perception has one ounce of impact on reality.


I TOTALLY agree. Which is why I have been patient, loving and nonjudgemental. It doesn't negate the fact that he has an absolutely scary problem. I'm not going to pretend like he doesn't. Period.


----------



## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

I feel my husband has an awesome attitude in this, but most here would not agree.... When we started to touch each other some 30 yrs ago, he felt it was then *MY PLACE* to get him off, it then became *"OUR THING"*....he would still enjoy Playboy magazines, crack them upon, when we got the net.. download naked women... but he looked upon masturbating TO THEM *as cheating*... (his words, not mine)...

How he managed to have this much self control boggles my mind... When I learned this 4 yrs ago, I was SHOCKED .... I asked him how in the hell he did that - cause sometimes we only had sex once a week ! I looked at him with a straight face and told him I was a cheater then! All during our marriage and before too (in this respect).... 

Let me tell you something... this should have NEVER NEVER NEVER been....we BOTH missed each other something terrible.. because he was actually suffering ... and I was ...well.. .just freaking... FINE! 

If every spouse cared THAT MUCH, thought that highly about being with one another and attending to their physical and pleasurable needs... ..carrying some of his attitude here...they would surely be having more sex...I know we would have ! 

Here I was sneaking getting myself off in the middle of the night sometimes - feeling he wouldn't want woke up (he always seemed more tired over me-would complain I kept him up too late sometimes)....it should have never been... some of our biggest mistakes in marriage - were right here...

We weren't talking about  ! Masturbation was a "too taboo/ embarrassing subject, it seemed for both of us... 

*He* *assumed* I was kinda Low drive... (not really)...* I assumed *he was too tired when I wanted it ....when he learned this...Love this comment... he said "That would be like waking me up to tell me the house was on fire, that's [email protected]#" ..... Who the hell knew !

Women's orgasms are more elusive for sure, but this is where communication comes in... unless the man doesn't want to be with her and he has his own Porn addiction/ obsessive masturbation habits going on...if she knows he'd move heaven & earth to get her there...shame on her for going it alone....(and if they have other issues, piling resentment, he is missing her love languages, open that conversation up too!).... there is no point in even being together if both are getting themselves off, might as well be room mates... with her rabbit in the bedroom drawer...and his "fleshlight" on the other side in his... 

Can anything be more counterproductive to intimacy!

I feel spouses should save all there sexual energies for each other.. this builds emotional connection...a great appreciation for one another, and damn it, it's always more fun to be with a man! Maybe me & mine are weird, but we both find masturbating a "Hollow" experience - we want each other...and I very much regret our "assuming" days.


----------



## Goldmember357 (Jan 31, 2012)

The double standards generally exist for good reason. Typically speaking id say relationships only last if the woman does not have to be "won". By that I mean the woman wants it, in my experience relationships only last when the woman puts in a lot of work and the man's interests eventually die down, but IF he stays faithful and involved in the relationship its because of her. I say this primarily because of how men are hardwired, while both sexes are not hardwired for monogamy, I feel relationships are bound to fail if the two are not compatible and IF the male is the one trying to keep her interest. Now do not get me wrong ,the man should "take" his wife, and seek to keep her interest but generally speaking it seems the women will put up with more and for that reason I feel the double standard exists. That combined with the fact that men are so horny, it sounds absurd that a man would turn down sex with his wife, especially if she makes it sound like she is interested. While on the other hand it does not sound absurd that a woman would not be interested in sex ESPECIALLY if her man is making no attempt to "connect" with her on an emotional level let alone seduce her. 

These double standards exist because of the differences between the sexes.


----------



## MyHappyPlace (Aug 11, 2013)

Well said SA!


----------



## Thepoet (Sep 8, 2013)

BruisedGirl said:


> My only issue with porn, ever, is if he can wank to porn, he can fvck me. If he'd rather wank to porn, and not give a sh!t if I'm satisfied and I don't get sex, then there's an issue.
> 
> Currently going through this scenario, actually. He's got time and energy for porn. He knows I'm HD. But he's not really giving a damn about my sexual needs because he's taking care of himself and leaving me to take care of myself.


I have to agree with this, If 1 partner regardless of gender is not satisfied sexually and the other partner is masturbating that is a big no.

Also just a tip, and maybe he won't agree but see if you guys can cut the porn out completely, it does strange things to the brain. If he stopped watching porn his drive for you would probably increase significantly.


----------



## moco82 (Jul 16, 2012)

People put too much faith into the idealized vision of cohabitation with the principal purpose of raising offspring. If one partner doesn't want sex with the other, I don't see how this, with 100% certainty, in all cases, necessitates a two-item menu of either therapy to "fix" their brains or the termination of the living arrangement, division of assets and custody.


----------



## tryingtoenjoylife (Mar 30, 2012)

moco82 said:


> People put too much faith into the idealized vision of cohabitation with the principal purpose of raising offspring. If one partner doesn't want sex with the other, I don't see how this, with 100% certainty, in all cases, necessitates a two-item menu of either therapy to "fix" their brains or the termination of the living arrangement, division of assets and custody.


So what you are saying is that if one person doesn't want sex and they have kids and a living arrangement then the other person should just deal with it???

I for one am not willing to just deal with it. However, if you are saying other options should be out there (seeing other people, masturbating, etc) then I agree.


----------



## moco82 (Jul 16, 2012)

tryingtoenjoylife said:


> I for one am not willing to just deal with it. However, if you are saying other options should be out there (seeing other people, masturbating, etc) then I agree.


Yes, what I was saying was basically a defense of masturbation. Consider me a Joycelyn Elders for married people.


----------



## Paulination (Feb 6, 2012)

It may seem like a double standard but actually the circumstances are quite different because the sexuality between men and women is quite different.

If a guy masterbates, then he has pretty much taken himself out of commission for awhile depending on his age. If a women masterbates, she is still sexually available afterwards at least physically.

My wife has a second or third orgasm much quicker then her first.


----------

