# The ugly thoughts ...



## jinba (Apr 26, 2012)

Thought I was making great progress, but today - just out of the blue - the "ugly" thoughts came back. No real triggers that I can pinpoint, it just kind of happened.

Keep wondering if my subconscious is trying to tell me something or if this is just something that's going to happen from time to time.

Or - have I just been lied to so much that I'm now adept at lying to myself???

Hate days like this!


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Unfortunately, that is going to happen and prob for the rest of your life.  Sorry. It does get better with time but you will find something tiny will set you off or you may awake from a bad dream or hear a name or song or see something that reminds you.

Just know tat the worst part is over...and it DOES get better...and you WILL survive!


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## jinba (Apr 26, 2012)

Thanks Jellybeans - I just desparately want to put this all in the past, and it keeps creeping into the present. Got a couple of books on taking control of your life - need to start reading them! I feel wounded and need to find a way to heal.

I appreciate your support.


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## BigLiam (May 2, 2012)

I think it may happen less if you are not around the cheater much.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

BigLiam said:


> I think it may happen less if you are not around the cheater much.


For the couples that decide to reconcile, that is not an option since they will be around them.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

jinba said:


> I appreciate your support.


No problem


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## canttrustu (Feb 22, 2012)

BigLiam said:


> I think it may happen less if you are not around the cheater much.


Not productive. If she's chosing R thats a trigger she cant avoid. And honestly, there is always something to trigger you even if you arent with them. Like Jelly said- A name, a song...Hell I cant watch TV w/o the Name of the OW at least 3-4 times. So theres always something. Is my H a trigger? Sometimes, yes. But if he were gone, I'd still be triggering.


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## mahike (Aug 16, 2011)

I understand the bad days they seem to come out of the blue and hit you between the eyes. I think it is important to take the times try to figure out what cause you to spin up and then try to look at in the bright light of the day.

Today was also a bad one for me and it was a dream that woke me up at 3:30 AM Good luck


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## highwood (Jan 12, 2012)

canttrustu said:


> Not productive. If she's chosing R thats a trigger she cant avoid. And honestly, there is always something to trigger you even if you arent with them. Like Jelly said- A name, a song...Hell I cant watch TV w/o the Name of the OW at least 3-4 times. So theres always something. Is my H a trigger? Sometimes, yes. But if he were gone, I'd still be triggering.


Yes as Cantrustu states...it can be something big or small. Sometimes out of the blue my mind will think of something..i.e. something I saw in an email. Or like was stated a name/place on the radio, tv, etc. Not fun...but perfectly normal!!


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## Maricha75 (May 8, 2012)

canttrustu said:


> Not productive. If she's chosing R thats a trigger she cant avoid. And honestly, there is always something to trigger you even if you arent with them. Like Jelly said- A name, a song...*Hell I cant watch TV w/o the Name of the OW at least 3-4 times.* So theres always something. Is my H a trigger? Sometimes, yes. But if he were gone, I'd still be triggering.


Try having your kindergartener daughter ask to spell the name of a classmate...who also happens to have the same name as the OW. You can't explain to your 5 year old that the name is a trigger, etc. Fortunately, the name is spelled differently. Still a punch to the gut when you hear the name tho.


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## canttrustu (Feb 22, 2012)

mahike said:


> I understand the bad days they seem to come out of the blue and hit you between the eyes. I think it is important to take the times try to figure out what cause you to spin up and then try to look at in the bright light of the day.
> 
> Today was also a bad one for me and it was a dream that woke me up at 3:30 AM Good luck


STill having nightmares-EVERY night. Im hoping those end soon. I feel for ya. Good luck.


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## canttrustu (Feb 22, 2012)

Maricha75 said:


> Try having your kindergartener daughter ask to spell the name of a classmate...who also happens to have the same name as the OW. You can't explain to your 5 year old that the name is a trigger, etc. Fortunately, the name is spelled differently. Still a punch to the gut when you hear the name tho.


Oh. NO. Yeah. My 2nd graders teachers name is the same and every email she signs with her first name. And I have 3-4 friends with that name. Its EVERYWHERE. But actually spelling it out-NO THANKS. Sorry you had that experience.


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## highwood (Jan 12, 2012)

I know for me it is asian woman...anytime there is an attractive asian women on tv or if we are out somewhere immediately I feel that rush of insecurity and anxiousness. Even if H isn't with me I still can feel it....

It is my own insecurity in that I find myself thinking..is he thinking of her/does he have a thing for asian women now...crazy thoughts that I hate thinking but they happen. The worse is when it is a caucasian guy and an asian female...shudder just thinking about it.

I suppose if she had been a blond/red head, etc. the same type of triggers would be occuring.


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## JustMe321 (May 9, 2012)

Those triggers just come out from nowhere. I think I'm fine, we are almost 18 months out and in R...but then bam, there it is.

Was watching one of those real life crime TV shows where they interview those invovled and the woman accused of the crime (who they kept coming back to and interviewing) looked a lot like the OW. The show was about how she was accused of being involved in the death of her husband...after having an affair. The funny part? The affair aspect didn't trigger me at all. In fact, it didn't even phase me - but when I saw her face, I recoiled.

My WH was sitting there and saw my reaction and assumed it was because of the subject matter. I just shook my head. How could he not see what I saw? When I finally told him, hours later, he was shocked and confused. He didn't see it. He is so much further along than I am. He doesn't think about this at all anymore.

Anyway - yes, those ugly thoughts don't seem to ever completely go away. And if you want R, all we can do is push past those moments in time and keep going.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

canttrustu said:


> STill having nightmares-EVERY night. Im hoping those end soon. I feel for ya. Good luck.


We divorced and I still wake up from nightmares about it. Not trying to make you feel worse but, just know that you aren't alone and that it still happens even if the marriage wasn't reconciled/restored. I can relate.


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## jinba (Apr 26, 2012)

Thanks to all of you for your posts - at least I know I'm not losing it when the "uglies" come - even though it feels that way when they hit.


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## cantthinkstraight (May 6, 2012)

Triggers are the worst.

When I fold the laundry, I wonder if those were the panties she wore for him.

When I hear her phone buzz, I wonder if it's him texting her.

When I see other happy families in the neighborhood, I think "I bet she didn't cheat on her husband".

When my wife works out, I stare and wonder how he had his paws all over her.


Yes, those are just a few off the top of my head.

Day to day is all you can do. Find something productive to do
when this happens. Lift weights, go for a walk or jog, play some
video games and shoot zombies in the face... Anything to get
your mind from f*cking with itself.

It's hard - I know. I'm living it too....


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## cantthinkstraight (May 6, 2012)

Case in point. 

I had a great day at work today.

I feel perfect on my way in. Stay productive and
have a good relationship with my co-workers.

Some know of my wife's affair and try a little harder
to keep a smile on my face. I do appreciate it.

However, on the way home, traffic slowed down and
I started thinking of the OM. The closer I got to home,
the more I thought about how I would interact with my wife.

I got bummed out a little bit. No reason. Just stray thoughts.

Every day is different.


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## jinba (Apr 26, 2012)

"Stray thoughts" ... exactly! I expect triggers to happen when I see the OW somewhere or hear her name, but the random ones that take me by surprise are hard to deal with. It's like someone just opens up the flood gates and everything rushes into my head.

The sad thing is that I don't cry anymore. All of those flashbacks used to upset me and I'd cry ... and now I don't. Keep wondering if I really want to continue R or if I really give a damn one way or the other. Or is this just a self protection thing in case R fails? A lot of self doubting when the "ugly thoughts" hit - is this all part of it? Or subconsciously do I want out?

Maybe it's just normal to doubt the future when you've been hurt so badly in the past - guess I'm learning as I go, but I sure can confuse myself sometimes.


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## cpacan (Jan 2, 2012)

jinba said:


> "Stray thoughts" ... exactly! I expect triggers to happen when I see the OW somewhere or hear her name, but the random ones that take me by surprise are hard to deal with. It's like someone just opens up the flood gates and everything rushes into my head.
> 
> The sad thing is that I don't cry anymore. All of those flashbacks used to upset me and I'd cry ... and now I don't. Keep wondering if I really want to continue R or if I really give a damn one way or the other. Or is this just a self protection thing in case R fails? A lot of self doubting when the "ugly thoughts" hit - is this all part of it? Or subconsciously do I want out?
> 
> Maybe it's just normal to doubt the future when you've been hurt so badly in the past - guess I'm learning as I go, but I sure can confuse myself sometimes.


These are the exact same thoughts that I have. I really really try to focus just on me, and one day at a time.


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## Ben Connedfussed (May 4, 2012)

cantthinkstraight said:


> Triggers are the worst.
> 
> When I fold the laundry, I wonder if those were the panties she wore for him.
> 
> ...


Jinba, these are the very same triggers I experience. The stay thinking, the mind movies, and yes, the plight of rebuilding trust. It is difficult, but can be achieved. It takes time, but giving yourself that time is important. I hope your struggles lessen and you feel better. Take up that new hobby today, and by all means do something nice for yourself everyday. You deserve it!


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## jinba (Apr 26, 2012)

Thanks for the encouragement and advice - it does help some. I think H's A left me lost - everything I ever believed in was flushed down the toilet. Everything I valued collapsed around me and I was powerless. I used to have my sh*t together and my head screwed on straight. But this has changed me and I sometimes don't even recognize myself anymore. 

I miss "me" and the woman in my body right now is a bit of a stranger. Hard to put the pieces of a shattered life back together I guess. Taking care of myself is good advice ... a goal I think I need to focus on more.

Thanks guys/gals for your input.


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## cpacan (Jan 2, 2012)

I fully understand you. To comment on your OP, I had a bliss when i started to see things exactly as they are, it is what it is. I started to see my wife and her actions, not her words, but actions for what they are.

And suddenly I realized that SHE is the one with personal problems, and that I may have been blind before. I am on my way finding my self, and I am not blind, I am not naive, and I am not lying to myself - that was BEFORE.

Focus, focus, focus... and I know damn well it is not that easy - good luck to you


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## blinky (Feb 13, 2012)

deleted


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## jinba (Apr 26, 2012)

Too funny Blinky - wonder what the h*ll he does see??? My WH's OW is also very vain. She's nothing like me, (which used to make me feel inferior somehow) she's very high maintenance and kind of prissy. My H wouldn't last a month if they lived together (plus, he can't afford the material things she gets from her H).

I'm just a good ole country girl at heart - no glitz here. I love working outside, helping with remodeling projects, fishing and catching toads with my grandsons, gardening, playing with our pets ... I have no problem getting my hands dirty. (That's not to say I'm a grub - I clean up quite nicely - but I'd rather not worry about my hair and makeup when I've got better things to do.)

Always wondered why WH was attracted to my complete opposite, but then, maybe he thought he wanted that kind of woman at the time. 

Who knows - sometimes nothing cheaters do makes sense.


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## BigLiam (May 2, 2012)

Jellybeans said:


> For the couples that decide to reconcile, that is not an option since they will be around them.


True. That is one argument for divorcing, I guess.


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## BigLiam (May 2, 2012)

canttrustu said:


> Not productive. If she's chosing R thats a trigger she cant avoid. And honestly, there is always something to trigger you even if you arent with them. Like Jelly said- A name, a song...Hell I cant watch TV w/o the Name of the OW at least 3-4 times. So theres always something. Is my H a trigger? Sometimes, yes. But if he were gone, I'd still be triggering.


I did not realize she had chosen R.


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## BigLiam (May 2, 2012)

jinba said:


> Too funny Blinky - wonder what the h*ll he does see??? My WH's OW is also very vain. She's nothing like me, (which used to make me feel inferior somehow) she's very high maintenance and kind of prissy. My H wouldn't last a month if they lived together (plus, he can't afford the material things she gets from her H).
> 
> I'm just a good ole country girl at heart - no glitz here. I love working outside, helping with remodeling projects, fishing and catching toads with my grandsons, gardening, playing with our pets ... I have no problem getting my hands dirty. (That's not to say I'm a grub - I clean up quite nicely - but I'd rather not worry about my hair and makeup when I've got better things to do.)
> 
> ...


Has he tried explaining what drew him to such a woman?


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## highwood (Jan 12, 2012)

jinba said:


> "Stray thoughts" ... exactly! I expect triggers to happen when I see the OW somewhere or hear her name, but the random ones that take me by surprise are hard to deal with. It's like someone just opens up the flood gates and everything rushes into my head.
> 
> The sad thing is that I don't cry anymore. All of those flashbacks used to upset me and I'd cry ... and now I don't. Keep wondering if I really want to continue R or if I really give a damn one way or the other. Or is this just a self protection thing in case R fails? A lot of self doubting when the "ugly thoughts" hit - is this all part of it? Or subconsciously do I want out?
> 
> Maybe it's just normal to doubt the future when you've been hurt so badly in the past - guess I'm learning as I go, but I sure can confuse myself sometimes.


I can so relate...

I often think why am I "putting up" with what H did. Sometimes I look at this person that I have been with for 24 years, who I trusted 100% and still can't believe that he did this. It is painful to what it did to me as well, the insecurity I know have about my marriage, the doubt, the paranoia, reading into everything, making a big deal out of stuff that I wouldn't have given a second thought to previously, etc. etc.

The worst is wondering if he truly wants to be with me or is just staying with me because it is the "right" thing to do. 

I hear you about the conflicting emotions..it is tough!


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## jinba (Apr 26, 2012)

BigLiam said:


> Has he tried explaining what drew him to such a woman?


Not really - but initially he said he felt sorry for her. We had a group of friends (that she and her H were part of) at the time and almost everyone had gotten a belly full of her attitude and behavior and she was kind of pushed out of the group. I too felt sorry for her at the time, but knew her troubles were of her own making. None the less, I stood by her and tried to encourage her to get some counseling and change her ways.

Every time she complained to me that no one liked her, I'd tell her the same thing - "get some counseling" - I'm sure I started sounding like a broken record, but she was a mess. I hung in there until I found a receipt for a hotel room she'd booked (in her name) in my H's wallet. That's when all hell broke loose.

I disowned her quicker and more completely than the rest of our friends did - and exposed her to everyone in the group. H kept claiming they were just friends and she needed someone to talk to. Yup ... right - and someone to manipulate and get sympathy from. But he fell for it hook, line and sinker.

Other than that, I have no idea what he saw in her. Like I said, she's vain and very high maintenance. When push came to shove (after fighting the "friendship" between them for nearly 3 years), I basically told him he had to make a choice. She was ruining his life (even at work) and I wasn't going down with him.

Something I said in that conversation must have clicked because he ended it with her - but he's faultered along the way - hiding phone calls and texts - claiming he didn't want to tell me because he knew I'd be upset, didn't want to hurt me any more, didn't want to dredge up the past ... blah, blah, blah.

Since then he has made comments that she's psycho, unstable, selfish, etc. and he seems to understand why people don't like her - but he's never really said why he liked her when they were involved.

Maybe I should ask???


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## jinba (Apr 26, 2012)

highwood said:


> I can so relate...
> 
> I often think why am I "putting up" with what H did. Sometimes I look at this person that I have been with for 24 years, who I trusted 100% and still can't believe that he did this. It is painful to what it did to me as well, the insecurity I know have about my marriage, the doubt, the paranoia, reading into everything, making a big deal out of stuff that I wouldn't have given a second thought to previously, etc. etc.
> 
> ...


Been with my H for 38 years (married 34) and like you, I am in disbelief. How could he? Why did he? - then the reality - it doesn't matter how or why, he did it and I can't change it.

What bothers me most about the "ugly thoughts" I've been having lately is that the hurt is less and the anger is stronger. I'm trying to figure out what this means - if anything - or if it's just part of the R process.


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## highwood (Jan 12, 2012)

In your case were there issues in the marriage prior? Because if there was sometimes these situations, as painful as they are, can bring out the best in a marriage and rekindle lost feelings as well.

I know I have to think that sometimes in order to move past the pain...I hear you about the anger though. I find that sometimes the anger I feel towards H and his OW overwhelms me. 

On Dr. Phil they said the thing about forgiveness is that it is more for you than for the person you are forgiving..because the anger affects other aspects of your life as well. Which I think is so true.


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## highwood (Jan 12, 2012)

Sometimes too I think how would I feel if I kicked him out? Would I be happy..no I wouldn't be. So what choice do I have..if I still love him and want it to work then I have to learn to deal with those negative dark thoughts. I know I have been told to start to Journal instead..this way you are writing it out instead of verbally venting it.

From what I gather from this board..is that eventually those thoughts will happen less and less as time moves on.


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## jinba (Apr 26, 2012)

highwood said:


> In your case were there issues in the marriage prior? Because if there was sometimes these situations, as painful as they are, can bring out the best in a marriage and rekindle lost feelings as well.
> 
> I know I have to think that sometimes in order to move past the pain...I hear you about the anger though. I find that sometimes the anger I feel towards H and his OW overwhelms me.
> 
> On Dr. Phil they said the thing about forgiveness is that it is more for you than for the person you are forgiving..because the anger affects other aspects of your life as well. Which I think is so true.


Yes, I believe there were - though I didn't realize it at the time. He resented the fact that I always put our kids first and didn't pay enough one on one attention to him.

Hell of it is, he didn't start the affair until after our oldest had graduated from high school - and our second graduated a year after the affair started. So, we were "empty nested" for two years during the affair - during which, I did my best to make up for lost time (the fighting the "friendship" I mentioned). 

I guess what irks me the most is that he never told me how he was feeling - rather than talk to me, he chose to talk to her - which led us to where we are now.


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## jinba (Apr 26, 2012)

highwood said:


> Sometimes too I think how would I feel if I kicked him out? Would I be happy..no I wouldn't be. So what choice do I have..if I still love him and want it to work then I have to learn to deal with those negative dark thoughts. I know I have been told to start to Journal instead..this way you are writing it out instead of verbally venting it.
> 
> From what I gather from this board..is that eventually those thoughts will happen less and less as time moves on.


Ditto ... and I hope you're right about time easing the burdening thoughts.


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## Sara8 (May 2, 2012)

jinba said:


> Thanks for the encouragement and advice - it does help some. I think H's A left me lost - everything I ever believed in was flushed down the toilet. Everything I valued collapsed around me and I was powerless. I used to have my sh*t together and my head screwed on straight. But this has changed me and I sometimes don't even recognize myself anymore.
> 
> I miss "me" and the woman in my body right now is a bit of a stranger. Hard to put the pieces of a shattered life back together I guess. Taking care of myself is good advice ... a goal I think I need to focus on more.
> 
> Thanks guys/gals for your input.


I agree, I hated me while trying recovery. I hated the suspicious person I had become, and my spouse didn't help buy sighing heavily every time I checked his whereabouts. And, given he was a cheater, I really did not check that often. 

In fact, he texted her almost constantly and met her in a flash for lunch, if she asked. Also he talked on the phone for at least an hour each day. 

The triggers are why I finally filed for divorce. I finally realized that my cheater husband was the trigger. Just looking at the eyes that had gazed into mine and lied so convincingly about where he was going was a trigger


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## Sara8 (May 2, 2012)

blinky said:


> Ha! My WH's OW is unbelievably like his MOM. They both are short, overweight, have similar hairstyle and bad dye jobs of the same color (usually dark red), have fake teeth, and love to talk gossip about anyone you've never heard of till your socks are bored off ya. They're both also very vain and spend a lot of their time on superficial appearances stuff. Both even have alcoholic husbands. They could be twin sisters 25 years apart! Yecchhh!!!!! Where is Freud when you need him! But of course my WH doesn't see THAT at all. At least they don't have the same name!


Good points. My cheater husbands OW was not very attractive. She did however have the exact same voice quality of his mother. 

His mother had a rough sounding voice, not cultured in any way and not even feminine. It was just gruff and sort of low class sounding. 

He doesn't hear it though.

She is also extremely high maintenance, spoiled, prissy and well disloyal to her very sweet husband who pampers her.


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## jinba (Apr 26, 2012)

Sara8 said:


> I agree, I hated me while trying recovery. I hated the suspicious person I had become, and my spouse didn't help buy sighing heavily every time I checked his whereabouts. And, given he was a cheater, I really did not check that often.
> 
> In fact, he texted her almost constantly and met her in a flash for lunch, if she asked. Also he talked on the phone for at least an hour each day.
> 
> The triggers are why I finally filed for divorce. I finally realized that my cheater husband was the trigger. Just looking at the eyes that had gazed into mine and lied so convincingly about where he was going was a trigger


You sound like I feel on those days that the triggers hit me out of nowhere. I wonder if I can keep doing this - or am I wasting more time?

I truly believe H is remorseful and he's working hard to show me that he is ... but now it's me I doubt. Maybe I'll end up making the same decision you did - I don't know - I just know I've gotta get a grip somehow and sort this all out in my head.


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## jinba (Apr 26, 2012)

Sara8 said:


> Good points. My cheater husbands OW was not very attractive. She did however have the exact same voice quality of his mother.
> 
> His mother had a rough sounding voice, not cultured in any way and not even feminine. It was just gruff and sort of low class sounding.
> 
> ...


Geez girls ... what are we doing? We should be going after the OW husbands! LOL - kidding of course, but they all seem to be the gems in our situations.


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## Sara8 (May 2, 2012)

jinba said:


> You sound like I feel on those days that the triggers hit me out of nowhere. I wonder if I can keep doing this - or am I wasting more time?
> 
> I truly believe H is remorseful and he's working hard to show me that he is ... but now it's me I doubt. Maybe I'll end up making the same decision you did - I don't know - I just know I've gotta get a grip somehow and sort this all out in my head.


As others have often mentioned here. A divorce takes time. So, filing does not necessarily mean it's over. 

You can still date, if you wish and try to work things out before the divorce is actually finalized. 

Filing for divorce, though, gave me back some of my sense of self esteem. 

Prior I felt like a loser. 

I mean I kept asking myself why am I still here. This SOB cheated on me, bought gifts for a pampered prissy spoiled woman, spent our money on her, took long weekends away from me to be with her.

Worst of all in the emails that outed him he was complaining bitterly about me and she her sweet nice guy husband. 

I never complained to anyone outside the marriage about my husband's faults, and like most humans he has many faults.


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## jinba (Apr 26, 2012)

Sara8 said:


> As others have often mentioned here. A divorce takes time. So, filing does not necessarily mean it's over.
> 
> You can still date, if you wish and try to work things out before the divorce is actually finalized.
> 
> ...


I'm sorry Sara8 - I don't recall - did you R or go through with D?

I know if I filed at this point H would be devastated - he's come so far. I just don't think I'm where he is yet - and I worry that I might never be. 

Some days I don't want to be with him, but then can't imagine myself without him. It's like a game of tug of war is going on in my head.


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## Sara8 (May 2, 2012)

jinba said:


> I'm sorry Sara8 - I don't recall - did you R or go through with D?
> 
> I know if I filed at this point H would be devastated - he's come so far. I just don't think I'm where he is yet - and I worry that I might never be.
> 
> Some days I don't want to be with him, but then can't imagine myself without him. It's like a game of tug of war is going on in my head.


He was outed by someone who sent me anonymous emails. 

He cut off relationship and tried to minimize it. Lots of rug sweeping, blaming, etc. 

I did lots of research and suspect based on signs that he has likely cheated prior. He denies this, but he's the same guy who looked me in the eye and swore he was going away with the guys and would never cheat on me.

We went to MC. He said the right things, we seemed to be in a great recovery. Than I receive another anonymous email with a photo of him getting a lap dance right in the middle of what I thought was a good R. 

When confronted, he tried to lie. I asked him to move out, he did. I have since filed for divorce. 

He does not want a divorce, but i am thinking he just thinks it's cheaper to keep her. 

He does do a lot of things right, but does seem to be resentful about it, still. 

Keeps telling me I need to get past this. Does not understand why I can't. 

I love him, too. But I am so devastated by the lies lies lies the deception is as bad as the mind movies of them both having sex. 

Each time we had sex, I kept thinking he is thinking of her. 

I get triggered by woman that look like her, I hate that, I was never jealous or possessive. 

I want to be married to someone I can trust again and let them have their freedom, free of mind movies and fears of his cheating again. I can't. 

I still feel like it's a nightmare I will wake up from. 

I thought my husband was a great and loyal guy. 

Now, that I am educated about the signs of affairs, I see signs that existed all through our 20 year marriage.


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## jinba (Apr 26, 2012)

Maybe being here and getting "educated" is what's made me realize that I still have options. I'm so sorry that you're going through this and can't find a way back - but if all hope of regaining trust is gone, the marriage may as well be over.

But someone else posted something that kind of hit a nerve for me. They said the mind movies and "ugly thoughts" will stay with you whether you R or D. If this is true, you're not going to instantly be rid of them or have the freedom you describe.

I do hope that as time goes on you start to feel good again and can move on to a loving, trusting relationship with another man. I wish I were strong enough sometimes to take that path - but then, I think of myself as damaged goods and wonder who would ever want me even IF I could love and trust someone again.

Time will tell - for both of us - I guess.


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## Sara8 (May 2, 2012)

jinba said:


> Maybe being here and getting "educated" is what's made me realize that I still have options. I'm so sorry that you're going through this and can't find a way back - but if all hope of regaining trust is gone, the marriage may as well be over.
> 
> But someone else posted something that kind of hit a nerve for me. They said the mind movies and "ugly thoughts" will stay with you whether you R or D. If this is true, you're not going to instantly be rid of them or have the freedom you describe.
> 
> ...


Yes. Sorry you are here too. 

Don't think of yourself as damaged goods. The cheater is the damaged goods.

I do think the mind movies pertaining to my husband will continue even after divorce. 

Still, I belong to an in person support group and there are so many devastated men whose wives have cheated. 

If I were to remarry, and I prefer not to, I would at least have the illusion of being able to trust the new person until they proved otherwise.

Right now another relationship is the last thing on my mind.


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## highwood (Jan 12, 2012)

Sara8 said:


> Yes. Sorry you are here too.
> 
> Don't think of yourself as damaged goods. The cheater is the damaged goods.
> 
> ...


Sara, you will find love again! There are many many good guys who are just as disgusted by cheating and would never do it to another person. Just be incredibly picky and really observe their character/family, etc.

I know in my case there is a part of me that lost respect for my H...that fact that he could do this by lying, buying a second cheap ass laptop and hiding it in his truck so he could communicate with the OW and so many times looking at me in the eyes and saying nothing is going on, I am not keeping in contact with her...those are the times when I think of telling him where to go...that he belongs with the piece of ****.

It is hard too when I look at other guys who I know are good decent guys and I know from their character that they would never do that to their spouse...


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## jinba (Apr 26, 2012)

I know you're probably right - both Sara and Highwood - and maybe "damaged goods" wasn't the best way to phrase it. I guess I just don't feel whole anymore. I went from being the caregiver for my family and anyone else who needed help, to being the needy one who suffers in silence because I have no one I trust enough to talk to. 

I think I really resent my H for that - he's stripped me of so much, and at times I feel very lonely. Glad I have all of you here to help!


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## Sara8 (May 2, 2012)

jinba said:


> I know you're probably right - both Sara and Highwood - and maybe "damaged goods" wasn't the best way to phrase it. I guess I just don't feel whole anymore. I went from being the caregiver for my family and anyone else who needed help, to being the needy one who suffers in silence because I have no one I trust enough to talk to.
> 
> I think I really resent my H for that - he's stripped me of so much, and at times I feel very lonely. Glad I have all of you here to help!


I hear ya. I really do. 

I don't have anyone in the family or friends circle I can comfortably confide in, either. 

I resent my H, too. The main thing is being stripped of my trust in him.

But I recently read somewhere that it is a good lesson to learn. 

No one should be trusted implicitly. We made that mistake once, but we won't again,

So we are growing. Yay! for that, right?


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## jinba (Apr 26, 2012)

Sara8 said:


> I hear ya. I really do.
> 
> I don't have anyone in the family or friends circle I can comfortably confide in, either.
> 
> ...


:smthumbup: Yes - we are growing! I've learned the only person I can truly trust is me ... but these days, I even let myself down sometimes! 

What's the old saying, "what doesn't kill us makes us stronger", or something like that ... well, I hope it's true!


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## Ingalls (Mar 7, 2012)

jinba said:


> Thanks for the encouragement and advice - it does help some. I think H's A left me lost - everything I ever believed in was flushed down the toilet. Everything I valued collapsed around me and I was powerless. I used to have my sh*t together and my head screwed on straight. But this has changed me and I sometimes don't even recognize myself anymore.
> 
> I miss "me" and the woman in my body right now is a bit of a stranger. Hard to put the pieces of a shattered life back together I guess. Taking care of myself is good advice ... a goal I think I need to focus on more.
> 
> Thanks guys/gals for your input.


That's me! Urgh it pi*ses me off when I think of it too...I really didn't ask for this nor do I WANT to go through this at this stage in my life. I ready for my next "stage" and can't even decide now which direction is up????

Good Luck to you!


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## Rainey Okay (May 9, 2012)

blinky said:


> Ha! My WH's OW is unbelievably like his MOM. They both are short, overweight, have similar hairstyle and bad dye jobs of the same color (usually dark red), have fake teeth, and love to talk gossip about anyone you've never heard of till your socks are bored off ya. They're both also very vain and spend a lot of their time on superficial appearances stuff. Both even have alcoholic husbands. They could be twin sisters 25 years apart! Yecchhh!!!!! Where is Freud when you need him! But of course my WH doesn't see THAT at all. At least they don't have the same name!


You have no idea the nerve you hit with this one. Holy Crap. When I found out who my H was having an affair with I was shocked. This is a woman who he used to tell me reminded him of his mother and she irritated the crap out of him. The whole thing makes me sick to my stomach. We discussed at length recently the "why" it happened. Not enough attention as a child, no loving gestures, weak personality, blah blah blah. Yecchhhh!!! is right. Therapy here he comes...
Peace


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## Ben Connedfussed (May 4, 2012)

jinba said:


> Thanks for the encouragement and advice - it does help some. I think H's A left me lost - everything I ever believed in was flushed down the toilet. Everything I valued collapsed around me and I was powerless. I used to have my sh*t together and my head screwed on straight. But this has changed me and I sometimes don't even recognize myself anymore.
> 
> I miss "me" and the woman in my body right now is a bit of a stranger. Hard to put the pieces of a shattered life back together I guess. Taking care of myself is good advice ... a goal I think I need to focus on more.
> 
> Thanks guys/gals for your input.


Just hoping that you can get 'help' in some form or other. I am new here but am sure there are links that people know of here to get one on one counseling. 'Do this' and hope the good folks here are reading and give their support. Please... take up a new hobby and distract your present train of thought. It helps! Been hoping for you... Ben.


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## Rainey Okay (May 9, 2012)

The ugly thoughts are always there. My H and the OW shattered my reality. I see her face in my thoughts, every car that goes by our home I think is her, the phone rings I think it is her. Right now my whole existence is a trigger. Forget the fact that I dream about the OW. I have gotten used to that. My nights are filled with terror filled dreams of people being murdered and I don't know who the good guys are. 
The good moments are starting to edge out the bad ones. For that I am grateful. My H and I are trying to rebuild our marriage. Baby Steps...
Trust in yourself and be kind to yourself.
Peace


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## cpacan (Jan 2, 2012)

jinba said:


> Thanks for the encouragement and advice - it does help some. I think H's A left me lost - everything I ever believed in was flushed down the toilet. Everything I valued collapsed around me and I was powerless. I used to have my sh*t together and my head screwed on straight. But this has changed me and I sometimes don't even recognize myself anymore.
> 
> I miss "me" and the woman in my body right now is a bit of a stranger. Hard to put the pieces of a shattered life back together I guess. Taking care of myself is good advice ... a goal I think I need to focus on more.
> 
> Thanks guys/gals for your input.


Came to think of this... make sure you don't put the pieces together exactly like they were before. You have to put them together differently in order to change your life for the better. Remember; the old you (the one you miss) was the one who got cheated on.

You will never be the same person again, and that is hard to accept. You need to build a person that is strong enough to kick him to the curb and won't hesitate doing it by the slightest sign of relaps. Being strong this way also means you will attract different types of men should that happen.

Otherwise you will end up doing the same thing over and over again, expecting a different result each time... (Einstins definition of insanity).

Take care of you.


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## slater (Feb 3, 2012)

Do you get a weird feeling when things are going well? I feel like I am betraying myself and sometimes I do things to inflict more pain on myself to remind me like read old email etc. Maybe I am crazy. Thanks honey!

slater


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## jinba (Apr 26, 2012)

cpacan said:


> Came to think of this... make sure you don't put the pieces together exactly like they were before. You have to put them together differently in order to change your life for the better. Remember; the old you (the one you miss) was the one who got cheated on.
> 
> You will never be the same person again, and that is hard to accept. You need to build a person that is strong enough to kick him to the curb and won't hesitate doing it by the slightest sign of relaps. Being strong this way also means you will attract different types of men should that happen.
> 
> ...


Eye opening, thoughtful post - thank you! I've been trying to find the old me and your post made me realize that that person is gone. Instead of putting so much energy into that useless search or mourning that loss, I need to focus on the "me" of today, embrace the differences, build strength and grow to be a better person.

The Einstein quote is perfect ... thanks again!


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## jinba (Apr 26, 2012)

slater said:


> Do you get a weird feeling when things are going well? I feel like I am betraying myself and sometimes I do things to inflict more pain on myself to remind me like read old email etc. Maybe I am crazy. Thanks honey!
> 
> slater


Yes - but I don't think I'd call it self betrayal - it's more like self sabotage. If things start going too well, I recall the hurtful things so that my guard stays up - for me it's kind of a protection mechanism. I know that may sound strange, and it's really self-defeating, but after being hurt so badly I swore I'd never let myself be vulnerable again.

Probably not healthy ... but not crazy either. I think we do what we do to survive as best we can. And having control over something does give us some peace of mind - because what our WS did was out of our control.


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## RWB (Feb 6, 2010)

What you said Slater...

"Do you get a weird feeling when things are going well? I feel like I am betraying myself and sometimes I do things to inflict more pain on myself to remind me like read old email etc. Maybe I am crazy."

Yep, slater that is very common for the betrayed to do. I do the same thing. I have a file titled Horrible.doc that has a couple of weeks email between my WW and the OM. It's possibly the most hurtful words I have ever read in my entire life. The way she talks about me and our marriage as well as the sexual content with the OM was more shocking to me than the affair itself. Why I keep it is complex to me. I re-read it every couple of months for some reason of validation for the way I feel. 

My counselor refers to this behavior as a "Wrapping up in a Warm Blanket of Pain". Very common with the betrayed. I too wonder sometimes if I'm the crazy one in this marriage.


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## highwood (Jan 12, 2012)

I find too for me it is almost like I want to reread the emails..it is like I somehow enjoy (not sure if that is the right word) the anger that comes over me...very strange. THe MC told me that is self hurting and not good but yet I feel compelled to do it. Maybe it is a thing of not wanting to let it go, to ensure that he never forgets what he did.


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## cpacan (Jan 2, 2012)

highwood said:


> I find too for me it is almost like I want to reread the emails..it is like I somehow enjoy (not sure if that is the right word) the anger that comes over me...very strange. THe MC told me that is self hurting and not good but yet I feel compelled to do it. Maybe it is a thing of not wanting to let it go, to ensure that he never forgets what he did.


I find my self doing this from time to time, but I am fully aware of the harm it does. It is not beneficial to my progress.

I think the reason for doing it, is that it reminds you of the possible danger ahead - a defence mechanism to avoid being hurt. But it is counter intuitive since performing this task will hurt you anyway.

I am quite sure that the healthiest solution is to let the sources of pain go, they have served their purpose to prove the cheating. Now you must focus on the things that are going to happen in the future - I am quite certain that none of us will ever forget about the deceit - even without these documents.

Think about it - work on your new self, forget about the physical proofs of your not-so-perfect-as-you-thought spouse. Focus on the future for the NEW YOU. I think this may not apply to BS less than 6 months past D-Day though.


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## Ingalls (Mar 7, 2012)

slater said:


> Do you get a weird feeling when things are going well? I feel like I am betraying myself and sometimes I do things to inflict more pain on myself to remind me like read old email etc. Maybe I am crazy. Thanks honey!
> 
> slater


I do this...often! MC said it's a defense mechanism that I'm guarding my heart bc if anything were to happen again I wouldn't be as hurt. It's normal. BUT it's not how we/you should live so try to work on faith and trusting your spouse and when this defense mechanism starts setting in AVOID re-reading his old emails and think of a positive thing. Easier said than done, but each time you give it an effort it will get more natural and soon take over.


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## RWB (Feb 6, 2010)

"MC said it's a defense mechanism"

They must teach this verbatim in MC school. Mine said those exact words to me.

However, those words... as hurtful as they are... did provide insight into my wife's screwed up perspective of our marriage. Her casual attitude towards cheating was just plain sick. She says it was addictive to her, new, exciting, and dangerous. She was never going to confess or stop.

I actually found emails dating back to years cheating with OM 1, 2, and 3. Way to go IT boys with your regular archive backups. Yep, she was a 3 time serial cheater when I discovered the truth (or whatever you call it).


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## highwood (Jan 12, 2012)

I know another thing I do as well..and my H said it is like I am trying to find evidence against him because I am checking and rechecking things. It is not that I want to find evidence it is in my opinion that I don't want to be made a fool of behind my back.

That is what he made me feel with DD#2 in that for the six months prior while I was checking his in house laptop and finding nothing (he knew I was checking it) the whole time he had a cheap one that he kept hidden under the seat in his truck. So I felt like a fool that he was thinking.."gee wife check my laptop all you want little does she know I have an extra one". I had an image of him and his OW online laughing about how he was pulling one over on his wife.....


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## slater (Feb 3, 2012)

My MC said I should ask 2 questions about it 1- did I learn anything new or come to any new conclusions and 2- did I get any benefit from it. If the answer to both is no then it probably was not helpful and I should try to stop in the future. I have the recording from d-day minus one and there is a lot on it. But I have listened to it like 5 times. I probably should erase the file as there is nothing new. Maybe I think I will use it to catch her in a lie. But like others I use it to remind myself of her state of mind just a few months ago. F- I hate just thinking about it. We have a date night lined up tonight. I need to clear my mind and think good thoughts.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## slater (Feb 3, 2012)

And FWIW. THanks everyone for helping me realize I am not alone in this. This site rocks. Thanks for listening!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

RWB said:


> What you said Slater...
> 
> "Do you get a weird feeling when things are going well? I feel like I am betraying myself and sometimes I do things to inflict more pain on myself to remind me like read old email etc. Maybe I am crazy."
> 
> ...


I did this too, off and on, after DD#1. Maybe once a month, or once every three months? It was like a rubber band I snapped on my wrist to remind me.

I was in pretty deep denial after DD#1 about the condition of our marriage. My husband was still distant and irritable. I just couldn't fathom that he was still in his affair.

I look back now and think that somehow subconsciously I must have known he was still unfaithful. But I really don't believe that; what I really think is that all I knew was that something wasn't right.

I typed up all the hurtful stuff and read it to our MC in front of my husband at the 2nd MC session. Tremendously cathartic. Haven't looked at it since


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## cantthinkstraight (May 6, 2012)

Sara8 said:


> *The triggers are why I finally filed for divorce. I finally realized that my cheater husband was the trigger. Just looking at the eyes that had gazed into mine and lied so convincingly about where he was going was a trigger*


Is this true?

Wow.

It's what I'm trying to get over right now.

It's unbearable at times....


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## Sara8 (May 2, 2012)

cantthinkstraight said:


> Is this true?
> 
> Wow.
> 
> ...


Yes. Sadly for me it's true. 

I used to love his eyes and I always thought they were so kind and sincere. 

Now, when I look at his eyes, I see a deceptive liar who could care less about hurting me and only cared about his own selfish pleasures.

I don't think I can move past it because there were so many trickle lies afterward. 

I can't trust this person and why should I waste time trying.

I do not have children, so no need to stay for them.


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## cantthinkstraight (May 6, 2012)

Sara8 said:


> Yes. Sadly for me it's true.
> 
> I used to love his eyes and I always thought they were so kind and sincere.
> 
> ...


The scenario you describe is my life right now.

I still love my wife, but feel I've fallen out of love with her.
When I cry, she tries to comfort me and I feel nothing.

She haunts me like a ghost. Roaming around the house...
I wonder what she's thinking.... if she's even remorseful...
if she's happy with the cheating... and with lying to me.

Some days we have good talks, others I lift weights and
get as far away as I can. I just feel like I was tricked into
living a lifestyle that SHE wanted more than anything, then
once she became unhappy, she pulled the plug on everything.

We have a 4 and 8 yr old. 

I can't believe she did this to US.

We're both in individual counseling, but it's almost like it's 
taking too long to get to the heart of the matter.
She's ready to move forward and complain about how I was
before the affair and i can't get over the fact that she HAD the affair.

I'm still crushed. Have no idea if we'll make it.


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## Sara8 (May 2, 2012)

cantthinkstraight said:


> TI just feel like I was tricked into
> living a lifestyle that SHE wanted more than anything, then
> once she became unhappy, she pulled the plug on everything.
> 
> ...


I am so sorry you are here. 

I feel the same as you. In my marriage we lived in the area he wanted to live in, we started businesses he wanted to start, with no thought to what I wanted. 

I was okay with that because I wanted to put him first and the type of businesses we chose seemed like a small issue. 

I can't believe he did this to us either. 

He used to say we were a team. I believed him and pulled my weight equally and in retrospect more than he did.

Now I feel like such a fool. I feel used and stupid and blind.

I wonder if he ever really loved me or only saw me as an easy mark


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