# blindsided



## russ101 (Jan 8, 2010)

I caught my wife kissing a neighbor about 3 weeks ago. I talked about it in another thread. The short lived affair is now completely over. During some of our talks I admitted to her that I was turned on by the sight of her kissing the other man (I have always had a fantasy of watching my wife have sex with another man, but never shared it with her because I thought there was no way it would every happen). Well to make a long story short, I finally admitted my fantasy to my wife and she couldn't believe it. She then asked my why I would want to watch such a thing and why all men seem to be like this. I didn't have an answer for her. I also asked her why she thought all men were like this. She then blindsided my with a revelation. She told me that when she was married to her first husband (25 years ago, when she was barely 20 years old). He convinced her to have sex with one of their friends in front of him. I couldn't believe she actually did this.  I asked her if she enjoyed it and she hesitated and said yes I did but it utimately was a major factor in our getting divorced. She told me she did it 2 times with the friend and it ended up ruining her relationship with the friend and the husband. I said would she ever consider doing this with me now that she is older and hopefully able to handle a situation like this. I said it could be her birthday gift to me. She said absolutely not. I could never do that again. I feel very hurt that she would do this with her first husband (who she was only married to for a year), but not with me who she has been married to for 18 years. How can I get her to change her mind. Is it even possible? I know the dangers of doing this, but I really want to experience it at least once in my life!


----------



## Happyquest (Apr 21, 2009)

This may sound harsh but stop thinking about yourself and start thinking about how this request make your wife feel. I cant believe you would ask your wife that question after knowing her history. Your asking her to experience the hurt she felt when her first marriage again for you?


----------



## okeydokie (Sep 10, 2008)

ok, so this went from you posting about being concerned because your wife was walking with a male neighbor and it appeared to be getting too friendly, now you want to see them ****?

jeez


----------



## Amplexor (Feb 13, 2008)

Her first failed marriage was a direct result of her husband pimping her out and you want to follow suite. Be careful what you wish for, she's already thrown the flag. Respect your wife's wishes. Just bringing this memory up has probably brought back a lot of emotional baggage for her. Leave it be.


----------



## artieb (Nov 11, 2009)

So, your wife says "I did that, and it led to our divorce", and you said "Hey, why don't you do it again"? Do you really not see that she's going to hear that as "You need to go through the pain of divorce a second time"?


----------



## 63Vino (Dec 23, 2009)

Hey russ.. I was reading your other thread a few weeks ago. I suspected in the way you wrote that the thrill of seeing your wife "get it" was kinda powerful but here's the deal.

I just say some things in random order.

You really dont have any right to use your wife's past against her. You should be smaked and smacked hard for that.
You asked she answered, its a boundary, respect it.

She said she liked it. SO maybe you guys can play with this without taking risk. Ask her to describe an imaginary sex scene with another man while you're boinking her. If she likes the idea but knows (better than you obviously) the risks. 
Your not putting her first which is rightfully why she thinks this will end badly for her...as it did before.

Sometimes we're influenced by what has happened... we learn lessons. She learned,, you have not been able to yet.
I still think you can work with her to have fun and not ask her to actually go therre.


----------



## 63Vino (Dec 23, 2009)

This is of course being completely ignorant of the fact that she's doing something behind your back and for sure your marriage is not strong enough to deal with the extra person thing.
You should (in my opinion) work on getting close to your wife, making her feel secure and cared for. From there (that better place) maybe she may be willing to go there with you.
But to me seems you're *jojo the idiot circus boy" excited about the dirtiness of the whole idea and you dont focus on your wife much if at all as a "partner"


----------



## Tanelornpete (Feb 2, 2010)

Russ, you have GOT to be kidding! 

This reveals a profound lack of respect for your wife. It reveals how very little you value her. It pretty much tells your wife that your opinion of her is as a sex toy. I'd hazard a guess that the only reason you are upset about her affair at all is because she didn't let you in on it.

She does not want it. Pure and simple. DO not ever ask her again. At best, follow Vino's advice above. Once. And if she says no, do not approach that topic again.

It is absolutely no surprise that your wife fell for another man. In all of your posts, you have revealed that you place your values, and wishes far above respect of your wife - you expect her to sacrifice her values for your benefit. 

You left her for a camping trip the day after her affair was revealed - showing her 'the guys' are more important than your marriage. You ask her to do things that she clearly states destroyed her first marriage.

You are heading for a fall, Russ. Your self-indulgent self-obsession is going to end this marriage - and most likely any other relationship in which you find yourself.

The way out is to start focusing on your wife, not yourself. That is, if your marriage means anything to you. That is, if your WIFE means anything more to you than a means to get off. She is NOT a tool!!!


----------



## Dancing Nancie (Jul 1, 2008)

I followed your other thread, as I was very curious to see if you were going to go this way. I had a feeling you were going to. I will say this to you. I have the same thoughts about that you do. I have discussed them with my wife, and we have agreed that it is not something that would end well. We have chosen to keep this as just a fantasy. We have a toy that we use and we will role play now and then. I think you would be best served keeping this thought as just a fantasy.

I know you feel slighted that she did this for her ex. The bottom line is that you have to understand that it was the root of the downfall of her first marriage. It's not that she loved her ex more than you, it's just that she learned her lesson. 

I know you are having a tough time. Keep trying to work out your complex emotions in a healthy way so you don't fall into a self destructive pattern.


----------



## artieb (Nov 11, 2009)

russ101 said:


> She said absolutely not. I could never do that again. I feel very hurt that she would do this with her first husband (who she was only married to for a year), but not with me who she has been married to for 18 years.


I don't know why I didn't think of this earlier, but your comment reminds me of the movie "Chasing Amy".

Before you wreck your marriage over jealousy about your wife's past, you should see that movie. Go rent it.


----------



## Tanelornpete (Feb 2, 2010)

> I don't know why I didn't think of this earlier, but your comment reminds me of the movie "Chasing Amy".


I was going to recommend he watch that one - it has the best answer to this situation I've ever heard someone give! 

I agree - see the film!


----------



## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

Install hidden security cams in your house and encourage her to pick up where she left off with the neighbor. You'll have your screw footage soon enough. Win/win. You deserve each other.


----------



## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

Russ,
So if I am understanding your question correctly, you want to know how to change your wife's mind of being coerced into a sexual situation she didn't want to be in, something that caused the destruction of her former marriage, something that she never wants to do again and something that clearly causes her pain to think about and you want to know how you can "convince her" as a birthday gift for you? Did you ever THINK that there was reason she was only married to this person for 1 year?


----------



## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

And I will echo what Tanelornpete says but take it a step further. Google NPD or sociopath. Then take a long hard look at yourself. Your posts are simply breathtaking in their depravity to your wife.


----------



## russ101 (Jan 8, 2010)

I agree that there is a high degree of danger in pursuing this any further (mainly because of what happened with my wife and our neighbor, who is now not even living on our street anymore. He rented and just skipped town after I caught them kissing). My wife said that having sex with the friend was one of the many factors in the demise of their marriage, not the major factor. I am just upset that she would do this for her first husband and not me. We are currently in counseling and doing much better. We talk alot now and are trying to work out our problems. I do not want her to have an affair! What she was doing was behind my back, and it almost got to a PA. What I wanted was just for her to one time only- have sex with someone while I watched her, then dismiss the guy and have sex with her myself. I am not going to push the issue. She has given me her answer and I respect it, but it doesn't change the fact that I still am hurt that she won't do it. I am going to rent the movie Chasing Amy and watch it, and I do like Vino63's advice and will try it.


----------



## 63Vino (Dec 23, 2009)

russ101 said:


> I agree that there is a high degree of danger in pursuing this any further (mainly because of what happened with my wife and our neighbor, who is now not even living on our street anymore. He rented and just skipped town after I caught them kissing). My wife said that having sex with the friend was one of the many factors in the demise of their marriage, not the major factor. I am just upset that she would do this for her first husband and not me. We are currently in counseling and doing much better. We talk alot now and are trying to work out our problems. I do not want her to have an affair! What she was doing was behind my back, and it almost got to a PA. What I wanted was just for her to one time only- have sex with someone while I watched her, then dismiss the guy and have sex with her myself. I am not going to push the issue. She has given me her answer and I respect it, but it doesn't change the fact that I still am hurt that she won't do it. I am going to rent the movie Chasing Amy and watch it, and I do like Vino63's advice and will try it.


K russ... Sounds better. I should add that at this point, you need to take care of her.
If anything is said at this point regarding this is that its a topic for future discussion but you respect her boundary of not wanting to actually go there.
Put it all aside and take care of her.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Tanelornpete (Feb 2, 2010)

> My wife said that having sex with the friend was one of the many factors in the demise of their marriage, not the major factor. I am just upset that she would do this for her first husband and not me.


I would hazard a guess that the reason she tried what she did was in order to fix some trouble in her marriage - trying to add some missing excitement, etc. 

And I can give you a specific reason why she did what she did with her first husband - and not you. It sounded like a good idea at the time. And afterward, hindsight showed her that it was not such a great plan. 

Even if it felt good, or was fun - at the time - she has shown clearly that it is not something that she chooses to do again. 

Now for the 64,000$ question - 

I could understand you being disappointed that she is not willing to repeat that particular adventure with you. Disappointed yes. But HURT? Why on earth would that HURT you?


----------



## russ101 (Jan 8, 2010)

Tanelornpete, I don't know if hurt is the word I was looking for but I do feel disappointed and somewhat angry that she would do this for her first husband and not me. My wife also revealed a lot more to me last night (I did not bring up the subject, but she felt like she needed to come clean about the whole ordeal). She originally told me that she only had sex with her husband's friend twice while her husband watched. She now admitted to me that the 2nd time she did it, her husband joined in turning it into a threesome (something she told me years ago that she never did, nor would she ever do). She also admitted to having sex with the friend about 6 times after that without her husband behind his back (she said she started developing feelings for him, and the friend wanted to have sex with her without her husband). So she had an affair also. I knew my wife was looser when she was younger but I feel like I did not even know my wife. To sum it up I have found out in the last couple of days 1. My wife had sex with her husband's friend in front of her husband 2. She participated in a threesome
3. She had an affair with him 
I did not know any of this, and we have been married for 18 years. I told her I would not ever pressure her to do any of this again, and I meant it, but I also said I would like you to do this once for me, but I won't ever bring it up unless you do. She hugged me and said ok thanks. We are doing much better since we started attending counseling, but I still feel the way I do and cannot change it. I know all the dangers of having her repeat this, but I still want to try it once, but will never pressure her to do this, so I guess I'll just have to be happy with what I got.


----------



## VeryShyGirl (Feb 18, 2010)

I would be offended and hurt if my husband ever asked me to do such a thing! Not bringing it up ever again is the right thing to do.


----------



## Affaircare (Jan 11, 2010)

:iagree: niceguy777 said it! :allhail:


----------



## russ101 (Jan 8, 2010)

A quick update. I have not brought up anything about my fantasy with my wife since my last post. However, last night, my wife brought it up while we were in bed. She asked me what was it exactly about me seeing her with another man that aroused me, and I couldn't give her a specific answer. All I said was that seeing her turned on and aroused really got me going. I then asked her out of the blue (really, I didn't think about it I just blurted it out) would you at least consider kissing another man in front of me for a while? Now before you go and rag on me for saying this, I know I shouldn't have said it but I gave it one last try and she hesitated and then said maybe, thats something I'll have to think about for a while. Should I wait a specific amount of time, then bring it up again, or should I just wait and see if she is really serious? How can she be so against this one day, then say maybe just a few weeks later? I know I didn't ask her to sleep with him, but I thought she would consider kissing just like it.


----------



## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

Russ,
I want to play chess with you for money. Large stakes. Because buddy - you don't look more than one move ahead. The GUY she kisses is not going to want to STOP at kissing. And if she kisses him and he is good at it she is going to want to fuuk him. And even that - if you are ok with it - is ok - except what happens if she falls for him? You ok with THAT? 

Any guy tells me I can kiss his wife - I take that as code for you can do what you can convince her to do....



russ101 said:


> A quick update. I have not brought up anything about my fantasy with my wife since my last post. However, last night, my wife brought it up while we were in bed. She asked me what was it exactly about me seeing her with another man that aroused me, and I couldn't give her a specific answer. All I said was that seeing her turned on and aroused really got me going. I then asked her out of the blue (really, I didn't think about it I just blurted it out) would you at least consider kissing another man in front of me for a while? Now before you go and rag on me for saying this, I know I shouldn't have said it but I gave it one last try and she hesitated and then said maybe, thats something I'll have to think about for a while. Should I wait a specific amount of time, then bring it up again, or should I just wait and see if she is really serious? How can she be so against this one day, then say maybe just a few weeks later? I know I didn't ask her to sleep with him, but I thought she would consider kissing just like it.


----------



## Happyquest (Apr 21, 2009)

It alot like playing Russian Rulet with a fully loaded pistol. One pull of the triger and you going to get what you have comming to you.


----------



## 63Vino (Dec 23, 2009)

Invite her to TAM...

Let's get her side...
And if you dont like that. Sign up for marriage counseling. Its totally ok if you TWO want to visit that. Its just based on the history we all see here... you're focused on this fantasy and it's overriding the respect for your wife and yourself.. Slow your ass down and pay attention. I understand you didnt initiate the conversation but you ran with it.. That was GOLDEN opportunity for you to say... 
"hun? we already discussed this. You already explained its uncomfortable for you based on your past. I know now that based on you being interested in the neighbor, there are things we need to improve. 
You also now know that this is a fantasy or turn on for me but i would never want to push you into something you dont want or risk "us". So lets work on our relationship a bit and see where that leads. Of course you know im open to discuss this topic whenever you like,,.. but you're goign to be the leader.... for now, i love you so much hun"!

but no... you took the bait.


----------



## Amplexor (Feb 13, 2008)




----------



## Dancing Nancie (Jul 1, 2008)

Amplexor said:


>


:rofl:


----------



## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

Amplexor owes me a new laptop and a Coke.


----------



## 63Vino (Dec 23, 2009)

Deejo said:


> Amplexor owes me a new laptop and a Coke.


witty!! hahaha ME TOO


----------



## russ101 (Jan 8, 2010)

vino63,

Maybe you didn't see in my prior posts, but we are currently in marriage counseling (and doing quite better that before). I also said that I did not bring this up (she did) and we really haven't talked about it since (she said she would have to think about it). You do know that this is a fantasy of mine (as one of your fantasies if I remember right), so of course if she brings it up, I am going to respond. I will not talk about it again unless she brings it up. No pressure. I know alot of you are telling me that her kissing another man could lead to much more. I am aware of that. Part of me wants it to lead to more. I do know that there is danger in having her do this. She could fall for the guy. I do not want her to have an affair behind my back. There is risk in this. I realize that. I am simply stating that this is something that I have wanted for a long time, and would like to see it become a reality. I do agree however, that I should probably wait until the marriage is stronger before we actually do this (that is providing that she wants to do it also, remember I am not going to bring this up again). I realize this is not want most men want from their wives, but I do think that there are other men like me (as well as women) who would like to see their partner with another, most however, don't ever talk about it with them because they realize that their partner does not feel the same way as they do.


----------



## nice777guy (Nov 23, 2009)

At least this is entertaining!

Something tells me you'll get what you are asking for.

Most of the "other men" with this fantasy weren't recently sneaking in the back door to pull some guy off of their wife.


----------



## 63Vino (Dec 23, 2009)

russ101 said:


> vino63,
> 
> Maybe you didn't see in my prior posts, but we are currently in marriage counseling (and doing quite better that before). I also said that I did not bring this up (she did) and we really haven't talked about it since (she said she would have to think about it). You do know that this is a fantasy of mine (as one of your fantasies if I remember right), so of course if she brings it up, I am going to respond. I will not talk about it again unless she brings it up. No pressure. I know alot of you are telling me that her kissing another man could lead to much more. I am aware of that. Part of me wants it to lead to more. I do know that there is danger in having her do this. She could fall for the guy. I do not want her to have an affair behind my back. There is risk in this. I realize that. I am simply stating that this is something that I have wanted for a long time, and would like to see it become a reality. I do agree however, that I should probably wait until the marriage is stronger before we actually do this (that is providing that she wants to do it also, remember I am not going to bring this up again). I realize this is not want most men want from their wives, but I do think that there are other men like me (as well as women) who would like to see their partner with another, most however, don't ever talk about it with them because they realize that their partner does not feel the same way as they do.


All good russ! That sounds great.. Yea of course i love the idea!!! and would go ther myself and will when the right scernario is at hand.
All im ever saying is that you need to be on super strong foundation with wifey (in my opinion)... Seems as though you are refocusing on "that", so.... not that it really matters to you,,,,, but im happy for you both (truely) and i do hope in the end you get what you want of COURSE!!!


----------

