# Various views about sexual past and lies



## Mr.k

I want to know how others feel about finding out there partners lied about there sexual past and hurt there partners?? Ive tried so hard to heal but everyday is hard I ask the question will I ever be able to feel connected as I once did or trust her words after finding out and will I ever get the disgusting images out of my mind ?*

In the early part of our relationship, 2 things mattered to me about my wife's past...her number (because I knew I wouldn't match up with some who slept around) and her general attitude towards sex (cheating, sex in relationships vs. ONS, etc). Everyone has a different attitude and a different value system and a big mistake in relationships is to think that the people's attitude and values about sex doesn't affect a relationship. If you have someone who puts a HUGE premium on sex, only having with people they deeply care for, generally waiting month(s) in a relationship to have sex to make sure the person is "worth it" trying to have a long term relationship with someone who has had tons of ONS and drunk sex, who's a "free spirit"...you're going to end up with issues in a relationship. They can easily be worked through (or not easily based on the people) but it'll still be something to deal with.


there is a third option: find a girl with values and morals towards intimacy that are the same as yours. They are rare, but to me, they are worth looking for.


I would not be interested in anyone who does not keep count of how many people they have had sex with. If they did not know them names even less so.

I am not talking about the number of times they had sex with a given person per se. But indeed if it is was a ONS or just fling week then that is about the same thing.

This is just part of knowing the person you would marry. But a very important part.*

This is about choosing a life long partner.

I would also want to know about drug use and arrests and infidelity and education along with all sorts of other ways to determine the persons potential for compatibility.

Choosing a partner for many is an important thing. Many want someone who takes having sex as more than "its just sex".

That sex I do not think you should have to ask. The information should be volunteered.
I hate people that lie


huh? Why would anyone not ask.
- I'd like to know how risky it is. STDs for one. Patterns of ONS, or drunk party screws, etc.
- Compatibility. I wouldn't want to marry a prostitute.
- Wanting to know more about your SO. Those are part of her past too. This is just a part of knowing personal stuff.
- If we're going to be around people she's slept with then I'd like to know who they are.

What does bother me is wondering what "acts" she did with others that she refuses to do with me. As I get older I wonder what she felt about the others that made her so willing and what that says about how she feels about me.


I've certainly heard from men with RJ who have used it as an excuse to be unfaithful. The 'logic' goes something like: 'since she was a ****, then I am justified in being one too', or something along those lines."
I've been suffering from RJ for over two years now. I've ended up with a severe depression, *my job, havn't heard a friend in 4 months and being a loon prompted my entire family to turn it's back on me ...
I've given the idea of having sex with random people although *a lot of thought and I believe that currently,*
Option 1 is to never have sex again, in order to avoid the emotional implications of being the umpteenth partner, hoping to never be comfronted with the (emotional) emptiness of sex with a partner who's had a huge number of one night stands again.
My second option is to "cheat" on her. Not because she did things that I don't approve of but merely because it looks as if the only way to SURVIVE this is to strip sex of all emotional meaning too. Not that I really want to achieve this, but at the moment it looks as if I'll never be able to enjoy sex in the emotional manner again. It's lost all meaning to me, I don't think there exists anything besides a meaningless ****. I can only speak for myself, but from my perspective, cheating seems like the lesser evil ...
What do you think is the most terrible thing? To achieve this banality by sleeping with a few random people or turning my back on her?

The same "sl#tty" women get used up a lot and rack up a very high number. The "sl#ty woman" has a very very high number and she will get around with a lot of other men. The "sl#tty" woman will be in a small % of the overall population of female. It may appear that men who are players get with all the girls but of course this is not true they go for women who are the easiest to get and the easiest to bag that is how they get high numbers. The average male and female does not have a really high number at all the average male has a higher number because he happens to fall into a situation to get with a "high Number" female who just happens to want him for the night.most people do care!!so they don't end up with one of these types


the higher the number of sexual partners the more likely you are to divorce. The way a person treats sex and their sex life is a huge reflection on the individual overall and nobody of sane mind could argue otherwise.*

As it stands the higher number of sexual partners when not married leads to a higher chance of divorce.*

I have some stats on this i can dig up somewhere its really shocking to see that on average the likelihood for divorce increases rapidly the higher the number. As a divorce lawyer i do know a lot of this but of course individuals divorcing dont disclose their sexual past or life but i feel i get a good feeling on how they treat sex based on how they act and by observing their behavior among other things that get disclosed. For instance who was cheating, someone else knocked up, affairs, drama etc.


At the extreme some guys want a party girl and some guys do not. Primarily it is about compatibility. Many men do not want a woman with low self respect. It is one thing to mature over time and gain that respect and it is another to treat having sex like going to starbucks. To each their own but that is just it. Folks have a right to care.

Me personally if you are in your early 20s and do not know your number or cannot name their names then you are probably not someone I would have been interested in marrying. This would have been evident likely through other ways as well. Value system. That said, even now I would not be interested in a woman who did not have some reasonably finite number of serious partners through her lifetime since those early years.

I have a right to feel about it any way I want. So do others.*

I wonder how the number tracks or does not track with those people who insist on having a large number of opposite sex friends while married. How would a spouse know how many of these people were ex lovers?


That's fine. I personally would like to know if she or I are around anyone she's slept with. I'm not much for opposite sex friends during marriage but I'm 100% against past lover friends. So yea it makes a difference.

I already said it's risky and what IT is? But I'll explain it this time. STD: Many have herpes for example or HIV and don't know it them selves. You get that from unprotected sex so you odds go up with more partners. "Patterns of ONS". A person who has participated in multiple ONS has a different view on sex than I do or it could be lack of impulse control or vulnerability when drunk or something. That's risky to assume we are compatible.


But I refuse to accept that any young " lady " under the age of let's say 25 yrs should have a list of former sexual partners resembling a grocery bill. Of course,in this matter,society is hypocritical,because the same doesn't apply for men. But women and men place different values on sex.
Basically,the more value a woman places on her body / self respect ,the harder it is for the" entire football team " or any random guy to get any body part /appendage of theirs into any one of her body orifices.
So if it does not matter to a man,then that's his choice and should be respected.He will have to live with the consequence of that.
If a guy says it matters,then that is also his choice,and should also be respected. He can be sure the consequence of which is more palatable to live with.


I would not be interested in any woman who would continually be able to compartmentalize sex from an emotional relationship. So the it is just sex attitude would be a deal breaker for me. I would allow for the maturing process. There was a time in my younger years "any woman in the world could have know me better -- Mr. Soul". But I outgrew that prior to the age when a man is supposed to reach maturity. This is supposed to be well beyond in years from a woman. But I digress.

Choosing a wife is not like hiring someone at the local mall. It is not even like having a friend or respect for a colleague.*

If women wish to choose this way then all fine and good for them. I. But I would be wary of a woman who continually seeks out strange as a life's quest.


I suggest whatever the number how one hooks up might be of interest. A person who hooks up via craigslist may be desirable for some but definitely not for many others. A partier who goes clubbing year after year and hooks up often racking up the numbers is certainly someone who is pursuing happiness and has every right to do so. One might surmise however that they would be most compatible with someone who has been doing the same and not a good partner for some Beta guy who will be watching the kids while his wife is out clubbing. This is about probabilities though.

Sure it also matters whether a person has the ability to just flat change their life style when they marry.*

More important than sheer number is the persons propensity to bend boundaries in a relationship. Are they a cheater or someone who lies about thier past?

There is something to be said for marrying someone who has proved they can stay in a long term relationship and remain faithful. There are no garantees in life for sure. But we can only make judegments on what we know about a person. We are very much blinded though by our brain chemicals. Meaning if we are in love we may decide to roll the dice.

A smaller number though may be compatible with hypergamy. Just to show another viewpoint. A woman could have a number of say 5 and have been married twice before each time climbing the economic and social ladder. This woman may after a while at social gatherings become more interested in the son of the owner of the company you work for as an example.

Also how often do we see high school sweethearts marry and both being each others first and then one of the spouses claim they never had a chance to date other people?

Ultimately this is something one absolutely needs to deal with BEFORE marriage. Now if the information upfront was less than truthful then you flat married someone willing to lie about it. That is a whole other discussion.



*Re: does your wife's number bother you??
yes my wife's number bothers me greatly . i guess it is because i dated her when she was 16, and 17 she was a virgin.
we broke up for 18 months . we got back together but while we was apart she had sex with 8 different guys. we have been married 29 years now, but it still hurts.


Don't you guys care about the saying: you sleep with everyone else your partner has slept with"? Hmm, please tell me


I believe a person has the right to know the sexual history of thier partners.*
Just as such a person has the right to refuse to tell.However, he or she does so at their own risk of rejection.
So if we are promoting openess and transparency,then it is only fair that a person know what he or she is dealing with in a potential life partner.
I believe that people when dating should be very circumspect in their choice of sexual partners.

I'm 24 and my number is 1 until now.
I wouldn't be interested to know the number of my partner/husband as long as he didn't bang all the girls in the neighborhood/town. You wonder how would I know the number if he didn't tell me? Well..if I've heard that he is/was one of the most known playboys in town then probably I wouldn't think high of him and would call him a man*****.*
If a guy is 30 and his number is 20+ then for me this is a high number and I don't think I'd consider being with him.*

Generally though, the past should remain like that and should never be mentioned, unless there was something that could possibly change my view on him.


*Re: does your wife's number bother you??
I forgot to add that you don't have to have a high number to be called "experienced" or to show off.*
You can stay with one person for 5 years and still be more experienced than someone who has had 10 meaningless ONS.

My wife admits to 2 before me. I believed it when we married, but not anymore. Too many inconsistencies between what she told me in the beginning and things she's said since. Plus, I now know that when a woman gives you a number, multiply by 3 and go from there.

Compatibility matters and that's why I wanted to know my wife's history. I was no saint and neither was she.*

If she was a virgin or if her number was way up there then that would be a red flag about our similarities. Kinky stuff like swinging, orgies, etc would have been deal breakers because I know they would haunt me. Someone I could trust was very important so a history of serial cheating would have been a deal breaker. The number is really just a variable in the equation. Larger number of relationships over period of time would be better than a few ONS to me.

I think everyone chooses if they want to know or not. I would never move from semi serious to serious without she and I knowing each other's past. Now when it's not serious though, it's not so important.

I do have a big problem with being asked and then lying about it though. If you're going to lie about it then don't bother even answering.

we've been together for 18 years, and never once have i felt i have reason to worry, but i do wonder.
communication isn't our strong point, so on things like this i'm left to my thoughts.
I'm the odd one in my group of friends - having met my husband at a young age and him being my only lover. I can't say I was "saving" myself for my husband though. I'm not religious; I just knew it'd crush me if I wasn't cherished in some way by a lover, and I do need to feel connection, so I was cautious. I wasn't seeking a relationship when we met, or even to be dating really, but I met my guy and it felt natural for us to be together. I couldn't get enough of being around him. And we continued being together..... going on 18 years.

A friend asked me the other night how old we were when we met. She asked if I'd wondered about being with others. I told her that honestly, no, not really. The only time was last year when it was make or break - but it wasn't just sexually - it was everything. And I realized in those thoughts, knowing where I would have lived and how my life would have looked, my attitude would still be very much as it was all those years ago.*

My husband has asked me if I ever felt I missed out. Missed out on what exactly? I cherish that I've had all these years and experiences and growth with him. He's said that he's never felt that he has; but he has wondered if I've felt this way.


So I guess one does not have to be some religious fanatic or queer, to decide that her sexuality is indeed precious to her and that she should be very discriminating with who she allows to penetrate both her mind and body.

I respect and admire that.

I am my wife's first and only. I asked her long ago about her missing out on others.


----------



## Faiora

This is a VERY long post and I will admit I did not read the whole thing, because it jumps all over the place and isn't entirely coherent. With that said, here are my thoughts:

I would be FAR more concerned about someone lying to me than about the number of sexual partners they've had. If someone has had multiple sexual partners, that does not mean they will cheat, or still want multiple partners after marriage. 

STD's are no longer much of a concern once it has been ~6 months since the last sexual partner, and tests have been done. Also, if people are responsible and use condoms, the risk is lowered to almost none. 

It is perfectly okay for you to look for the kind of person you want to be with. But it sounds like you have some strong prejudices against people who live different lifestyles than you do. You might want to rethink that, because there are some really good people out there who think differently than you do.


----------



## salamander

I saw your thread in SIM, so I only read to the point where you started to sling the s l u t word around. That is a pet issue of mine, having been sl u tshamed mercilessly meanwhile being sexually abused. What a mind f u c k. Shame is the issue here, and envy. You want the all and the only. And that is a little boy who has denied and delayed his gratification for a treat, and now he wants his dam n treat!!! Life is not fair. S l u t just means a woman who enjoys sex, whispered or shouted by someone intimidated by that "wanton" use of her sexual power. "Isn't a man supposed to own that????"
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## SimplyAmorous

Without reading this entire opening post... and going by the 2 replies given... it sounds the OP has slammed, shamed and is using an offending judgement rod... in relation to others sexual choices...

Lies will never be excusable...under any circumstance... though some do not ask... do not care.. To each their own in this matter.....and if it does matter to a partner .... there is nothing wrong with this as well. 

I am not for sl** shaming by any means... my own Mother messed her life up with sleeping with many men (after the divorce from my Father)... she wanted 1 & he started bringing others around... she had to be the most naive woman...it's painful.... it took an emotional toll on her she never seen coming....it ripped her from my life ....my father taking me off of her....I remember living with her and those men coming over... there was no playfulness, no love & connection..... it was my young experience to frown on this sort of lifestyle... some may judge *me* for that... but we all have our own personal stories...and how what we've experienced has affected US ... some in deep ways we carry with us.....I watched my own Mother self destruct in front of me.... we learn how to live ....and in some cases.... how NOT to live...

We, as individuals... all have a right to seek out and find a partner who is like minded in the sexual- which is a huge part of who we are .. .never to be downplayed... I would not judge a man for having high standards... nor would I a woman... some look upon sex as near "sacred".. I personally feel this is a beautiful view, one I share as well. 

True in this world today.... less and less see any value in waiting till marriage....(seen as no longer necessary with birth control, pleasure is to be pursued in it's own right)....

And many in the church struggle to live up to the "Purity restraints" taught....the reality is...the majority fail miserably...... then sets in the guilt & shame...over this gift God has given to us as men & women.... setting themselves up for sexual repression.. (been there, done some of that).... the pendulum swings both ways...extremes that has the potential to harm on each end.... can we find the balance that is BEST for our personal lives/ our happiness...that our future husbands or wives will embrace....it all depends. 

Because of so many posts /threads where others judge / mis understand the sexual views of others ....(this drives me a little batty).... I devoted a thread to this *CLICK HERE* ...can read of the 6 various lenses we view sexuality.....always best to marry one who shares & holds a similar mindset/ lens as yourself.... and in all things... honesty before each other. 



> 1. *Covenant View* - Best to wait until marriage
> 2. *Procreative View* - Be fruitful & multiply
> 3. *Romantic View* - Save yourself for your soul mate
> 4. *"Plain Sex" view* - just enjoy it for what it is
> 5. *Power View* - Sex wields Power
> 6. *Expressive View* - A form of Self expression/ empowerment


----------



## Starstarfish

> The average male and female does not have a really high number at all the average male has a higher number because he happens to fall into a situation to get with a "high Number" female who just happens to want him for the night


So - men who have a "higher number" only have higher numbers because some "s1u77y" "party girl" woman just happens to want him for the night, and they just can't stop themselves eh? Why do the women always get labels but the men don't? Why are these men who are plowing through women looked down on in same way? I mean - how many women really want a "party guy"? 



> Plus, I now know that when a woman gives you a number, multiply by 3 and go from there.


Again - why marry a spouse you can't trust, if you believe truly that they are lying about something that fundamental? I've never lied to my husband about my number, which is low - and the implication that -all- women are lying about their number is kind of offensive. Not all women are liars. 

Yeah, I agree with the basic under thought - being compatible about sex is very important if not critical to a relationships long term survival. But part of a really good sex conversation will also include the thought about sex -in the future- not just in the past. People's sexual desires, frequency, types, etc. I think all of the focus glossing over the future is in the end going to lead to more potential problems, honestly.


----------



## ILoveMyWife!

dont EVER ask of someones past unless you want to be hurt or lied to. No one is ever fully thruthful for the most part. We dont want to hurt people by what we think they might be offended by. It is a tough question to ask and even tougher to hear the answer.


----------



## Cosmos

I would be interested in a partner's previous types of relationships (marriage/engagements) and the number of previous sexual partners, but I wouldn't want to hear any of the details. Although a higher number of sexual partners wouldn't be unacceptable (my numbers are low), I prefer to be with people who have similar values to my own.


----------



## Starstarfish

Unless Big Brother is now officially -way- -way- too up in our business, I don't think background checks are going to confirm/deny someone's stated "number."


----------



## Married but Happy

My take is I have no right to know my wife's sexual past, and she has no right to know mine. We can choose to share it if we like and the other is sure they're okay knowing, and over time we've probably talked about all the things we care to.

Now, if she insists on knowing, and won't take no for an answer despite it not being her business, I will lie if I feel like it. She has no right to know so has no right to the truth if I don't want to reveal it. What's past is over and done, IMO - what's here and now is all that matters. If you have an obsessive or unhealthy need to know, that's not my problem nor will I let it be. However, I'd probably dump you if you persisted despite my objections to discuss it, or if married would simply lie. If you try to find out other ways, then what you find is on you, not me. I don't care what rationalization you delude yourself with to justify your invasion of my privacy. You've been warned off the subject, IMO.


----------



## Married but Happy

2ntnuf said:


> Still doesn't seem right to me. Lying cannot be good for a relationship. Maybe it isn't someone else's business who you slept with. Maybe it isn't someone else's business what you did or how many people you did it with. Do you think it has a bearing on compatibility? I do. I think it has a huge significant bearing on the ability of folks to understand and empathize with their partner. Therefore, I am of the opinion that it is best to know before the commitment. I found out in a bar that my x2 was quite promiscuous. That doesn't make her evil, just incompatible.


I disagree. Knowing someone's past does not necessarily provide the information you seek. Knowing the person now tells you this. People change, so how they were in the past may not mean anything. Their past is contained in their present, so looking at how they are NOW and over time as you know them is all you really need.

There may be some exceptions, but I think they are few. I wouldn't trust someone who insists on knowing details of my sexual past - I would think there is something wrong with them. But that's me. YMMV.


----------



## MissFroggie

Both my mother and father sexually abuse me as a child. I was passed around and exploited. Some of those involved now have free accommodation curtest of HRH, and will be there for quite some time. Not all of them were prosecuted. You want to know my 'number'? 

I went through a lot, very low self-worth, very confused about sex. My parents further complicated my views of self-worth by ramming the Bible down my throat and calling me degrading names for not being a virgin ... even though it was them raping me! When I left home I was angry, hurting, confused. I had never been shown any real love. I was so utterly broken and did not understand the rules of life. I didn't know how to respect or look after myself. What I did know was that just the thought of sex scared the life out of me. But I wanted a partner and wanted to have children, so I knew I needed to deal with this over-whelming fear.

I tried counseling - lots of it! It didn't help and I was just as afraid. So, I chose facing my fear as I had with other fears I had needed to get over to function in this world. If I had had better support, kindness, encouragement, good advice, I wouldn't have had to fumble through life working things out for myself, but I didn't. I slept about a bit to try to understand, try to learn that sex isn't always violent and abusive, try to be able to heal.

I would never advise anyone else to do this, but it was all I could think of, having exhausted all other sources of help I could find. It did work for me. Maybe it hurt me more too in some way but I don't look back and feel repulsed at myself any more. I haven't slept about for 15 years and don't feel that time of confusion should be held against me or used to judge me and who I am today. I was passed around from the age of 4 or 5 years old. I have no idea of my 'number'. Or do these not count? If they don't count why should the ones as a teen count? I wouldn't have done that if I had been protected from violence as a child and had been taught self-respect. When your thought of sex immediately equates with violence, fear and the possibility of being murdered, well I would have thought a man would be glad I have got over that and he doesn't have to work through that with me in order to have a sexual relationship with me - maybe you'd be cool with discovering that on your marriage night, but I think I did my future husband a favour by dealing with the negativity and knowing that now I would be in an emotional position to be able to give him a fulfilling marriage and children.

Anyone so caught up on my past that they want to judge me on it would make a lousy husband as far as I can see. Anyone who calls a woman names for what she does in private is not someone I have any respect for. I am a good woman, honest and kind. I have never cheated and I am loyal to a fault. I am protective of others and an advocate for child protection. I am respected in my community - and yes they do know my past...all of it...because I speak out about it to protect others, support others and help people to understand. I was broken and now I am not. I have excellent morals and care about others. I will make an excellent wife when I meet a man who deserves me. Yes, I have self-worth now! If you would disregard me because of 'numbers' and call me names because of my past, well you do not deserve me. When I see people sleeping around I wonder what they need to help them feel worth more, to have more self-worth. I do not judge them, I talk to them and encourage them to love themselves more. And as for your whole thing about STIs etc. you are more likely to catch something from someone who has had 1 partner without using a condom than someone who has had 6 but used condoms! You should be getting tested anyway before you have unprotected sex.


----------



## Starstarfish

> I think being honest is the best way to have a stable enriching marriage. I think deception is a poor way to start a serious relationship. I think it all comes out at some point and it's better to be open and honest from the start.


But how is having to do a background check on someone to get the "real story" them being open and honest? If you feel the need to be a PI and interview someone's bartenders and waitresses to get an idea of the "real them" I think that speaks volumes that you already have a feeling you aren't getting the truth. 

-That- should be a sign something is wrong. 

But again, this whole thing hinges on the idea that people can't change, that people are their past. And ... just because someone has a clean criminal record doesn't mean they are 100% on the up and up, it means they were never caught, or charges weren't officially filed.


----------



## Starstarfish

> I think I even stated above that people are shaped by their past or something alluding to that. It is true. They will lean in that direction, always.


No, your ex leaned in that direction always. But there are plenty of posters here who admit that they were "party people" before they got married, and are now happily settled into monogamy. 

Maybe they are all lying though.


----------



## Married but Happy

2ntnuf said:


> If something is important to the one I love, it's important to me. See, it's just a little different perspective. Thanks for not arguing, just stating your preferences. I don't think it's something to argue about. I think it's preferences and we are all different.


I can agree with that. If a potential partner has a very different view on this or any other important subject (important meaning that it's important to me, at least), then we aren't compatible. Sometimes, we may be able to agree to disagree and not discuss something if in all other ways we'd be a great match. Some people can't discuss politics, for example, because it would harm their relationship due to fundamental disagreements.


----------



## EleGirl

Mr.k said:


> I would not be interested in anyone who does not keep count of how many people they have had sex with. If they did not know them names even less so.


It’s been 30 years since I had sex with a man I was not married to. I do not remember the names of every guy. Shoot I would have to take some time thinking about it to recall them all. IT’s not that the number is all that high. It’s just that I was so long ago and I never think of any of them.

So I guess I’m screwed. I ‘ll just claim oldheimer’s when an if I start dating again


----------



## MissFroggie

I think it is fine to have standards but I think it is sad to dismiss someone based on their distant past. I mean, fair enough, if someone was screwing around just last week I wouldn't be interested either, but to drag up every detail of their past and judge them on it is a bit immature. It is their past that made them who they are now and if they are decent and honest and loyal then their past is only relevant if they want to talk about it. I didn't appreciate the way the OP used derogatory names about women and I found the post difficult to follow as it just seemed to disintegrate into a witch hunt. You could easily throw away a good woman by bullying her into telling you everything in her past and then throwing it back at her. Be careful judging others on their past, because that is likely to be the thing you are judged on in your present.


----------



## 2ntnuf

I think it's a matter of integrity. 

Also, I don't think anyone is screwed if they don't know their numbers. Exact numbers aren't important, but I know mine because they are low. The number is not hard to remember. I think it is important to find similarity in our long-term relationship partner. Those folks would have the best chance of understanding each other and a real good chance of lasting. 

There are plenty of folks out there who have higher numbers. I don't see the issue. It's much harder to find folks with low numbers from what I have read here. If TAM is not representative of society, this is a telling fact in itself. Don't you think?

*Edit*: If this is not such a big issue, why is it that a person with high numbers gives a crap about someone with low numbers not wanting them? It has to be that they believe folks with lower numbers are some sort of prize. I don't believe that. Lower numbers just mean a different way of viewing sex. Lower numbers relate to a pattern of commitment to one person at a time. It means that the person with lower numbers likes the frequency, closeness and ability to have sex without using condoms. This is provided that the person they are with is clean and committed to monogamy and they are also. It means the person in a committed relationship likes to explore their sexuality. I guess I could be off with this previous one. I was thinking that it is much easier to talk with someone I know and am committed to about trying something new than someone I've just met. The longer the relationship, the more comfortable I am with talking and exploring. I don't think I am unusual in that.

Lies provide a means of manipulation. They are used to control the actions of another person. That's my definition of abuse. Something done to control another person I am in a relationship with. 

I think honesty is the best policy. I think I need to own my past and accept myself for who I am. I think I need to be confident in myself and know what my boundaries are. I think I need to do the best I can to stick to those boundaries. 

They can change over time with knowledge and understanding. I think as one person moves into the category of having higher numbers, they do change. Things that were important are just memories. They have a bearing on who we have become and are important to who we are. It is necessary to understand this when thinking about a potential life-partner.


----------



## MissFroggie

2ntnuf said:


> Yeah, the more distant the less important, I agree with that. "Every detail", oh God no. Who wants that? Just a general idea is good I think. I asked. She reeeeeealllyyy low-balled her answer. No, I didn't ask for a number. I just asked in general if she was a party girl. She got a little defensive. I offered up my number as I have on this site. Not proud of it. Not ashamed of it. It just is. She "led" me to believe hers was higher, but not too much higher. It was important criteria for me to understand and make a decision.
> 
> She knew that and basically lied.


I absolutely do not condone lying - I don't think judging on distant past is very fair but if someone lies to you that is in the present and anyone who lies doesn't respect you enough to deserve you. I totally agree that lying is a sign to run!!



2ntnuf said:


> Yes the past makes us who we are. That's why it was important to me.  It's a look from the other side of the chasm. Do you see with all of this that it is so important that one really should not lie about this stuff?


As I said, lying is not acceptable and I accept that it is important to you to know how many people someone has slept with so you can decide if they are good enough to be with you. I was just putting another point of view because I think that unless something is recent the number of people someone has slept with is not that important to me. Their journey is theirs to share when they want to and not mine to quiz them on. If I respect and trust them how they are now I wouldn't want to damage that by dragging details of their past out of them to determine whether I still respect and care about them. This is just my opinion.



2ntnuf said:


> So what you are saying at the end is if I don't accept a woman who wants to marry me because she doesn't meet the criteria that is important to me, I may miss out on something. I may also be punished for turning her down because of my personal preferences.
> 
> That reads like a threat. o^O I don't like that.


It's not a threat and I apologise if it read like that. What I said meant was that holding on to one set rule regarding someone's past can result in focus being on something that is long ago instead of who they are now. I accept that if someone has a criminal past or has done heinous things in the past it doesn't matter how long ago it was they would not be someone you would want to build a life with, but when we are talking about something like how many people they have slept with, I think it CAN be irrelevant to the quality of the person and the relationship you could have with them in the present. It's fine for you to disagree of course, anyone who would hold my past against me would not be a suitable partner for me either so it would be right to end it after that conversation - and I still don't agree with lying EVER!! No point!



2ntnuf said:


> Listen, if I don't want a person who is not similar to me, I think that is a good thing. I think we should be similar in all things. Not exact, but similar. Something is wrong when I read this forced opinion that, "you Have to accept me and marry me if I want to marry you" attitude or there will be consequences. That is a problem and a judgement of it's own.


I'm not sure where you get "you Have to accept me and marry me if I want to marry you" from. It sounds like you have women falling over each other trying to force you to marry them. Maybe you are such an amazing catch that you have this problem and have to whittle down the throngs of women fighting their way to your door by judging them on every detail of their past and not just who they are now. I guess it is a real burden for you having so many amazing women to choose from. Perhaps you should easy the burden by handing out questionnaires, running credit checks, gathering references and hiring a PI to check out their pasts. You could even interview them with the help of a polygraph expert and body-language specialist. I'm sure with the right panel of judges you'd be able to short-list them until you find a couple who are not too inferior.


----------



## 2ntnuf

MissFroggie said:


> *I absolutely do not condone lying* - I don't think judging on distant past is very fair but if someone lies to you that is in the present and anyone who lies doesn't respect you enough to deserve you. I totally agree that lying is a sign to run!!


You do if you are not honest about your past. I saw lots of posts here that said the person would lie about their past or be evasive with the answers. I consider that lying. There is also lying by omission. It seems there is a double standard going on in the world. If two are married and these things happen, it's a reason for divorce. If done within any other context, it's okay. I don't agree with that. 



MissFroggie said:


> As I said, lying is not acceptable and *I accept that it is important to you to know how many people someone has slept with so you can decide if they are good enough to be with you.*


Okay, now we are getting to the meat of it. You don't feel "good enough" if you have had a bunch of partners. I didn't say that at all. I said it meant that a person has less interest in a committed relationship. It is an important factor in deciding on committing to that particular person. 

Why would a person with high promiscuity want to be with someone with low promiscuity? It makes no logical sense unless there is something other than compatibility and a desire to have the best possible chance of a successful long-term relationship.

I'd love to hear a hearfelt, down to earth, honest answer to this.



MissFroggie said:


> I was just putting another point of view because I think that unless something is recent the *number* of people someone has slept with is not that important to me.


The exact number is not important. It is important for a couple to be similar in all things if they want to have the best shot at making a long-term relationship work. That's my point. This one point of "numbers" is so sickening. There is so much defensive posturing about it on one hand and on the other there is a kind of bragging and high fiving. It makes me sick. Either accept who you are or don't do what makes you feel guilty and less worhty. That is inside you. I do not place that on you. You place that guilt on yourself. 



MissFroggie said:


> Their journey is theirs to share when they want to and not mine to quiz them on. If I respect and trust them how they are now I wouldn't want to damage that by dragging details of their past out of them to determine whether I still respect and care about them. This is just my opinion.


Yes, their journey is theirs to share when they decide to share. I don't want to hear about it in detail unless I am committed to them. Even then, I probably will not talk about it in detail, if at all. Never have before. I just want general information that is truthful. ie.: Is this woman promiscuous or not? Compare in my mind with, "Am I promiscuous or not?" It's one of many many factors and it is just as important as all the others. It may even be more so. 

I will not commit until I know I want to. Is that somehow different or strange to you? I will only know I want to if certain criteria are met. Those criteria are called personal boundaries. We all have them. 

I do not and have never asked an exact number or what a woman did as a sex act. I posted that previously. I don't ever need that information for any reason I can think of at the moment. That does not mean I want to just not consider that someone who jumps from partner to partner is compatible with me who has not. That is a recipe for disaster. 

As I posted above, it's a different way of thinking. It has nothing to do with acts performed. It has everything to do with the type of opposite thinking in terms of commitment. It is completely opposite and a person with low promiscuity will not be able to understand the thinking process of someone with high promiscuity. That is a game changer. 



MissFroggie said:


> It's not a threat and I apologise if it read like that. What I said meant was that holding on to one set rule regarding someone's past can result in focus being on something that is long ago instead of who they are now. I accept that if someone has a criminal past or has done heinous things in the past it doesn't matter how long ago it was they would not be someone you would want to build a life with, but when we are talking about something like how many people they have slept with, I think it CAN be irrelevant to the quality of the person and the relationship you could have with them in the present. It's fine for you to disagree of course, anyone who would hold my past against me would not be a suitable partner for me either so it would be right to end it after that conversation - and I still don't agree with lying EVER!! No point!


Totally disagree with this. Everything in a person's past is relevant to who they are presently. Some things are of little importance. I believe that a sign of commitment in the past is valid in the present. I believe high incidence of promiscuity is an indication of a lack of concern for commitment. Knowing exactly what went on in another person's life is irrelevant and not my business. A general truth about things important to me is relevant. Most folks who don't want to know those generalities or have highly emotional responses are the ones who have had incidences of high promiscuity in their lives. They tend to be ashamed and don't want to talk at all about this subject. That's understandable for me. It still makes them have differing thoughts surrounding commitment from someone with low incidence of promiscuity. That has no bearing on how much I respect them in every day life. It has no bearing on how intelligent I think they are or how bad they are. It only relates to compatibility issues with others seeking a committed relationship. 



MissFroggie said:


> I'm not sure where you get "you Have to accept me and marry me if I want to marry you" from.


That's the attitude I read in your post. It is how I read your angry, entitled post. 



MissFroggie said:


> It sounds like you have women falling over each other trying to force you to marry them. Maybe you are such an amazing catch that you have this problem and have to whittle down the throngs of women fighting their way to your door by judging them on every detail of their past and not just who they are now. I guess it is a real burden for you having so many amazing women to choose from. Perhaps you should easy the burden by handing out questionnaires, running credit checks, gathering references and hiring a PI to check out their pasts. You could even interview them with the help of a polygraph expert and body-language specialist. I'm sure with the right panel of judges you'd be able to short-list them until you find a couple who are not too inferior.


Another angry comment. 

It's boundaries. They are okay to have and they are not exactly the same for everyone. There is nothing "holier than thou" about them. It's preference. * Please understand that you are taking this personally and it is not meant to be personal to anyone. I only relate how I think because it is what I know and understand. Everyone is different.* 

I have no interest in you other than to learn something. If you do not want to learn with me, then just let it be. Attacking me because you have guilt feelings and want to feel superior is not going to help anyone. Please refrain from the attacks and try to keep an open mind. Maybe you will learn something about those opinions that are different from your own and frustrate you.


----------



## MissFroggie

2ntnuf said:


> You do if you are not honest about your past. I saw lots of posts here that said the person would lie about their past or be evasive with the answers. I consider that lying. There is also lying by omission. It seems there is a double standard going on in the world. If two are married and these things happen, it's a reason for divorce. If done within any other context, it's okay. I don't agree with that.
> 
> 
> 
> Okay, now we are getting to the meat of it. You don't feel "good enough" if you have had a bunch of partners. I didn't say that at all. I said it meant that a person has less interest in a committed relationship. It is an important factor in deciding on committing to that particular person.
> 
> Why would a person with high promiscuity want to be with someone with low promiscuity? It makes no logical sense unless there is something other than compatibility and a desire to have the best possible chance of a successful long-term relationship.
> 
> I'd love to hear a hearfelt, down to earth, honest answer to this.
> 
> 
> 
> The exact number is not important. It is important for a couple to be similar in all things if they want to have the best shot at making a long-term relationship work. That's my point. This one point of "numbers" is so sickening. There is so much defensive posturing about it on one hand and on the other there is a kind of bragging and high fiving. It makes me sick. Either accept who you are or don't do what makes you feel guilty and less worhty. That is inside you. I do not place that on you. You place that guilt on yourself.
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, their journey is theirs to share when they decide to share. I don't want to hear about it in detail unless I am committed to them. Even then, I probably will not talk about it in detail, if at all. Never have before. I just want general information that is truthful. ie.: Is this woman promiscuous or not? Compare in my mind with, "Am I promiscuous or not?" It's one of many many factors and it is just as important as all the others. It may even be more so.
> 
> I will not commit until I know I want to. Is that somehow different or strange to you? I will only know I want to if certain criteria are met. Those criteria are called personal boundaries. We all have them.
> 
> I do not and have never asked an exact number or what a woman did as a sex act. I posted that previously. I don't ever need that information for any reason I can think of at the moment. That does not mean I want to just not consider that someone who jumps from partner to partner is compatible with me who has not. That is a recipe for disaster.
> 
> As I posted above, it's a different way of thinking. It has nothing to do with acts performed. It has everything to do with the type of opposite thinking in terms of commitment. It is completely opposite and a person with low promiscuity will not be able to understand the thinking process of someone with high promiscuity. That is a game changer.
> 
> 
> 
> Totally disagree with this. Everything in a person's past is relevant to who they are presently. Some things are of little importance. I believe that a sign of commitment in the past is valid in the present. I believe high incidence of promiscuity is an indication of a lack of concern for commitment. Knowing exactly what went on in another person's life is irrelevant and not my business. A general truth about things important to me is relevant. Most folks who don't want to know those generalities or have highly emotional responses are the ones who have had incidences of high promiscuity in their lives. They tend to be ashamed and don't want to talk at all about this subject. That's understandable for me. It still makes them have differing thoughts surrounding commitment from someone with low incidence of promiscuity. That has no bearing on how much I respect them in every day life. It has no bearing on how intelligent I think they are or how bad they are. It only relates to compatibility issues with others seeking a committed relationship.
> 
> 
> 
> That's the attitude I read in your post. It is how I read your angry, entitled post.
> 
> 
> 
> Another angry comment.
> 
> It's boundaries. They are okay to have and they are not exactly the same for everyone. There is nothing "holier than thou" about them. It's preference. * Please understand that you are taking this personally and it is not meant to be personal to anyone. I only relate how I think because it is what I know and understand. Everyone is different.*
> 
> I have no interest in you other than to learn something. If you do not want to learn with me, then just let it be. Attacking me because you have guilt feelings and want to feel superior is not going to help anyone. Please refrain from the attacks and try to keep an open mind. Maybe you will learn something about those opinions that are different from your own and frustrate you.


You either haven't read my previous post or are so busy hearing what you want to hear that you haven't looked at what my posts actual say! You keep putting words into my mouth and quoting me on your interpretation of what I was saying, not what I actually said. I've met people like you before and I say it how it is.

Oh and just to clarify (again) I am not ashamed of my past and actually use the lessons I have learned through being abused as a child to make positive changes that help to protect children more effectively every day.


----------



## 2ntnuf

MissFroggie said:


> You either haven't read my previous post or are so busy hearing what you want to hear that you haven't looked at what my posts actual say! You keep putting words into my mouth and quoting me on your interpretation of what I was saying, not what I actually said. I've met people like you before and I say it how it is.
> 
> Oh and just to clarify (again) I am not ashamed of my past and actually use the lessons I have learned through being abused as a child to make positive changes that help to protect children more effectively every day.


I've read what you have posted and interpreted it the way I've read it. Yes that is true. How would I know what you are thinking unless you explain it in the manner you are thinking. 

What does having been abused as a child have to do with this? I can read quite a bit from that. Will you clarify or would you like me to guess?


----------



## MissFroggie

2ntnuf said:


> I've read what you have posted and interpreted it the way I've read it. Yes that is true. How would I know what you are thinking unless you explain it in the manner you are thinking.
> 
> What does having been abused as a child have to do with this? I can read quite a bit from that. Will you clarify or would you like me to guess?


I think my first post is very clear. Due to your response I still doubt you have read it.


----------



## 2ntnuf

MissFroggie said:


> Both my mother and father sexually abuse me as a child. I was passed around and exploited. Some of those involved now have free accommodation curtest of HRH, and will be there for quite some time. Not all of them were prosecuted. You want to know my 'number'?
> 
> I went through a lot, very low self-worth, very confused about sex. My parents further complicated my views of self-worth by ramming the Bible down my throat and calling me degrading names for not being a virgin ... even though it was them raping me! When I left home I was angry, hurting, confused. I had never been shown any real love. I was so utterly broken and did not understand the rules of life. I didn't know how to respect or look after myself. What I did know was that just the thought of sex scared the life out of me. But I wanted a partner and wanted to have children, so I knew I needed to deal with this over-whelming fear.
> 
> I tried counseling - lots of it! It didn't help and I was just as afraid. So, I chose facing my fear as I had with other fears I had needed to get over to function in this world. If I had had better support, kindness, encouragement, good advice, I wouldn't have had to fumble through life working things out for myself, but I didn't. I slept about a bit to try to understand, try to learn that sex isn't always violent and abusive, try to be able to heal.
> 
> I would never advise anyone else to do this, but it was all I could think of, having exhausted all other sources of help I could find. It did work for me. Maybe it hurt me more too in some way but I don't look back and feel repulsed at myself any more. I haven't slept about for 15 years and don't feel that time of confusion should be held against me or used to judge me and who I am today. I was passed around from the age of 4 or 5 years old. I have no idea of my 'number'. Or do these not count? If they don't count why should the ones as a teen count? I wouldn't have done that if I had been protected from violence as a child and had been taught self-respect. When your thought of sex immediately equates with violence, fear and the possibility of being murdered, well I would have thought a man would be glad I have got over that and he doesn't have to work through that with me in order to have a sexual relationship with me - maybe you'd be cool with discovering that on your marriage night, but I think I did my future husband a favour by dealing with the negativity and knowing that now I would be in an emotional position to be able to give him a fulfilling marriage and children.
> 
> Anyone so caught up on my past that they want to judge me on it would make a lousy husband as far as I can see. Anyone who calls a woman names for what she does in private is not someone I have any respect for. I am a good woman, honest and kind. I have never cheated and I am loyal to a fault. I am protective of others and an advocate for child protection. I am respected in my community - and yes they do know my past...all of it...because I speak out about it to protect others, support others and help people to understand. I was broken and now I am not. I have excellent morals and care about others. I will make an excellent wife when I meet a man who deserves me. Yes, I have self-worth now! If you would disregard me because of 'numbers' and call me names because of my past, well you do not deserve me. When I see people sleeping around I wonder what they need to help them feel worth more, to have more self-worth. I do not judge them, I talk to them and encourage them to love themselves more. And as for your whole thing about STIs etc. you are more likely to catch something from someone who has had 1 partner without using a condom than someone who has had 6 but used condoms! You should be getting tested anyway before you have unprotected sex.


Wow. This is terrible. You are correct. Apparently I missed this post. I'm sorry you had to go through this stuff. 

This is something totally different from what I was trying to discuss. You had no choice as a child and were raped. That is in no way your fault. It is understandable that a person treated this way may decide to seek out their sexuality in what some might call unhealthy ways. That is terrible that you needed to do that. 

While I do not judge a person on the number of partners they had, I do believe in normal cases, where the person has a choice, it is a significant factor in compatibility. I do not suggest that a person is "............" fill in the blank. I suggest that two people are less compatible when they have differing views on sexuality and it's expression. I think you can find plenty of evidence to back my suggestion in the SIM forum, if you care to look. 

My thoughts surrounding this compatibility are based on these threads of incompatiblity in sex and also incompatiblity in many other areas. They are all based upon boundaries and values. What happened with you is something totally different and not in any way what I was trying to discuss. 

As I stated before, I do not look at those who are more promiscuous with disrespect. I look at them as more incompatible with those who have not been promiscuous. That's something totally different to what you have been through. I equate what happened to you after the abuse as an extension of it. I don't blame you for any of it. I don't think less of you either. I applaud you for living and pushing forward to become a better adult and a respected member of society. You have accomplished the near impossible. Kudos to you.

At the same time, I do not shy from my position on believing disparate amounts of sexual partners has a great impact on compatibility and is a sign that folks with vastly different sexual pasts will not have the best chance of long-term success in marriage.


----------



## MissFroggie

Thank you! I appreciate your post and what you have said. I agree that where there are very different views on intimacy (same as other moral and religious values) it is likely to cause friction in a marriage. I was pointing out what appeared to be a strong feeling that 'numbers' mattered (from your original post) and simply wanted to open it up to the possibility that asking for a 'number' may not determine whether someone is a suitable and decent partner, so not to simplify it to that alone. I appreciate that you missed that post and i hope you realise the essence in which I meant the things I said. I don't have any issue with people having their own boundaries and using various ways to try to work out if someone is or is not compatible - we all need that! I just didn't like the suggestion that 'your number' was ALWAYS a valid reason to discard someone x


----------



## Thor

2ntnuf said:


> Why would a person with high promiscuity want to be with someone with low promiscuity? It makes no logical sense unless there is something other than compatibility and a desire to have the best possible chance of a successful long-term relationship.


Fascinating question!




2ntnuf said:


> As I posted above, it's a different way of thinking. It has nothing to do with acts performed. It has everything to do with the type of opposite thinking in terms of commitment. It is completely opposite and a person with low promiscuity will not be able to understand the thinking process of someone with high promiscuity. That is a game changer.


And vice versa. The promiscuous person will not understand the non-promiscuous.


----------



## bunny23

If I was you I would only focus on # 2 not 1

For the most part no one will tell you their real #, and if you ask they will feel judged. (and it's really none of your business, you should realize that if you are old enough to have sex)

It is perfectly okay to have conversations if someone cheated before or has an incurable STD, and see how they treated previous partners.


----------



## bunny23

Thor said:


> Fascinating question!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And vice versa. The promiscuous person will not understand the non-promiscuous.



Because someone could have had a year or 2 where they were "sleeping around" and then decided it was time to slow down and have quality relationships.

I would also caution that some people do not consider anal or oral sex to be um sex.. a new special phenomenon in our society due to the virgin pure syndrome. 

WTH would be a high number? It is subjective on how old the person is, how they lived their life etc. Personally I don't have a high one, but I wouldn't judge people based on it. This isn't high school.

Focus on the quality of relationships people had and how they acted when they ended, vs how many partners.

I don't believe that "in general the promiscuous person will not understand the non"


----------



## 2ntnuf

bunny23 said:


> If I was you I would only focus on # 2 not 1
> 
> For the most part no one will tell you their real #, and if you ask they will feel judged. (and it's really none of your business, you should realize that if you are old enough to have sex)
> 
> It is perfectly okay to have conversations if someone cheated before or has an incurable STD, and see how they treated previous partners.


Why is it no one understands that I DON'T ASK for an ACTUAL NUMBER?? NEVER HAVE!! There is no reason to. Do you understand why? Go through this thread and read, no actually open your mind and read. You will see in this thread and any other thread similar what I am trying to convey. It is not hard to know. Believe me. I don't have to ask a number. 

Did you read? Get it now? Okay.

Why is it that folks think this is about numbers instead of COMPATIBLITY?

Is it so difficult to comprehend that a person who has been in only promiscuous relationships and a person that has been in only committed monogamous relationships will not have the same thoughts surrounding commitment? That's the extreme, probably unrealistic, but it makes a good baseline for comparison purposes. Okay?

Who cares about your number?? It isn't important!!

What IS important is the TYPE of relationship, EITHER MEN OR WOMEN were involved in. Do you get it now?? IT IS NOT GENDER SPECIFIC. 

Please quit trying to make this a gender issue. It is not gender specific!!

It has nothing to do with KNOWING OR ASKING exactly how many folks a person has slept with, NOTHING. Get it?? It has everything to do with COMPATIBILITY. If two people don't think alike, they have little chance of a successful long-term relationship. That's it.


----------



## Starstarfish

> If two people don't think alike, they have little chance of a successful long-term relationship. That's it.


But isn't the basic question here whether or not someone can change their mind about something? Can someone truly never overcome their past? 

I mean what's the standard of whether or not the relationship in question was a "committed monogamous relationship" when at the same time in other threads other posters, are arguing if you are dating, you better have sex by a certain point, or the relationship isn't worth having. 

At what point does something officially become a "committed monogamous relationship" for purposes of future consideration? I think -that- would be the conversation to have. What both of you consider to be the boundaries of a committed sexually exclusive relationship.


----------



## 2ntnuf

Starstarfish said:


> But isn't the basic question here whether or not someone can change their mind about something? Can someone truly never overcome their past?


I'm so sorry. I just don't understand these questions. 



Starstarfish said:


> I mean what's the standard of whether or not the relationship in question was a "committed monogamous relationship" when at the same time in other threads other posters, are arguing if you are dating, you better have sex by a certain point, or the relationship isn't worth having.


AHH, VERY GOOD young lady, very good. So, what do you think the answer is if we are supposed to be best matched with someone who thinks like us? It's a sliding scale for each individual. Isn't it?



Starstarfish said:


> At what point does something officially become a "committed monogamous relationship" for purposes of future consideration? I think -that- would be the conversation to have. What both of you consider to be the boundaries of a committed sexually exclusive relationship.


I think you are correct. I really do. 

"So, how many committed sexually exclusive relationships have you been in?" Doesn't roll off the tongue. Does it? It's a tough one. No one wants to offend, but they want to find the most suitable partner. 

The other conundrum is, how do you find a person that is physically compatible? That is an issue. Don't try to deny it. hahaha Thanks. I liked your thoughts.  They made me think more.


----------



## Faiora

ILoveMyWife! said:


> dont EVER ask of someones past unless you want to be hurt or lied to. No one is ever fully thruthful for the most part. We dont want to hurt people by what we think they might be offended by. It is a tough question to ask and even tougher to hear the answer.


So much cynicism flying around... 

Sure, I'll agree that everyone lies. I've lied. But I would absolutely not lie to a potential partner about my sexual history. Know why?

Because it would be counterproductive. I need to be with someone who can accept my history, my insecurities, and my failures - someone who can understand what I really want out of life, and work towards the same goals as me. And I need to know as well that I can accept the history, insecurities, and failures of the person I'm with.

If I lie to a potential partner, not only am I starting the relationship out on the wrong foot, I'm putting myself in a position to feel guilty for as long as the relationship lasts. 

Not worth it.




2ntnuf said:


> No one wants to tell secrets that may harm them later. It kind of goes against the idea of being "true" to your spouse. It's weird to me because I know that what is in the past will at the very least slant a person's future that direction. I understand his point. I think much more is undisclosed here than is being said. So, if you need to know if a partner is compatible, and you can't ask because you know they will lie to you, why bother trusting them at all? I don't see this as a good relationship dynamic. I don't care what gender you are. It works both ways. I've seen so many women who were near virgins who got married to some man who was a male s lut and were cheated on, it's not even funny. It's disgusting. So, it seems as though we have to trust? In what?
> 
> ...
> 
> How then does one go about being as certain as possible that they have chosen their partner wisely? I think folks need to date for a long time and do all the necessary background checks as is done when experiencing a cheating spouse. That's sick isn't it? Can't trust them before marriage? How can you marry them? Well, if it is true that you can't trust them to be honest about numbers and it's no big deal, then I think that merits the background checks. That may only be with the prospective partner's family and friends. That may be a more in depth look at their life through internet background checks as employers do. It may be that a person will hire a private investigator. It's up to the individual.
> 
> While it sickens me to think that way, I know that it has been done by many here. They won't tell you that, but it has. That might hurt their partners feelings. So, go do what you want till you have satisfied all curiosity and then make the big decision. This is my conclusion with sex and relationships.
> 
> I won't be checking up on any of my dates in the future like this. I do understand why someone would. It doesn't matter what gender the person doing the checking is, either. I think a minimum should be appropriate for anyone. If you have to check that much, I think you should move on.


When I first read this, I thought you were joking. By the time I got to the end, I was confused when I realized you're not. Trust is a really key issue, and while I see where you're coming from, I can't imagine doing all that research behind someone's back. It would be proof that I myself can't be trusted. 

I think the main problem with relationships in general is that people don't really get to know each other before they get married, or they get married too young, before they've fully discovered their own values and needs. I myself didn't go through a promiscuous period in high school or university, but I find it difficult to discriminate against anyone who did, because everything is in such a state of flux during that time. I later discovered I'm much more sexual than I ever would have thought - and I know that many people have discovered they are ultimately much less sexual than they thought they were. Hormones play a huge part in that, as well. 

When you spend a lot of time - years - with someone, really talking to them as opposed to just having sex and going to dinner, you get to know them in a way that you can't know someone by hanging out in groups or in public. Those candid and personal conversations add up to something much more valuable than intel regarding their sexual history. You learn how they _feel_ about their past and their future, and what that means to you. 

To be fair, I'm happily married... so it's hard for me to be that cynical about relationships...

But I don't think I just "got lucky" - I spent the time to find the right person for me, and he did the same.


----------



## SimplyAmorous

Married but Happy said:


> My take is I have* no right* to know my wife's sexual past, and she has* no right* to know mine. We can choose to share it if we like and the other is sure they're okay knowing, and over time we've probably talked about all the things we care to.
> 
> *Now, if she insists on knowing, and won't take no for an answer despite it not being her business, I will lie if I feel like it. She has no right to know so has no right to the truth if I don't want to reveal it. What's past is over and done,* IMO - what's here and now is all that matters.
> 
> If you have an obsessive or unhealthy need to know, that's not my problem nor will I let it be. However, I'd probably dump you if you persisted despite my objections to discuss it, or if married would simply lie. If you try to find out other ways, then what you find is on you, not me. I don't care what rationalization you delude yourself with to justify your* invasion of my privacy.* You've been warned off the subject, IMO.


WOW  ! I will agree that those with *THIS ABOVE mindset* should hook up, date and marry those *with this same above mindset.*...as truly , individuals view this differently....

Me and my husband could not be further from this.. landed on it's head...We both have a willing and giving attitude of sharing our ALL with each other....this is not forced, it is not about being insecure, it IS because WE LOVE...we highly enjoy the sharing of our lives ..and this includes our past....

There is no secret place in my heart -while he has been with me, or before we met...that I would guard his access...or withhold from him.... and he feels the same in return...I can't even express what THAT means to me...priceless... for me and he...the other would be a deal breaker.


----------

